# Survivor 4/13 *spoilers*



## ireland967 (Feb 27, 2003)

Great reward challenge, I like seeing something new. Outside of the one group that kept knocking one out of position, both teams seemed to get it fast. Curious why we didnt see much of the reward, maybe 5 seconds worth.

Will be interesting next week and following.


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## bc0312 (Dec 25, 2002)

Every week they advertise the Survivor buff for sale. I wonder if they have ever sold a single one.


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## aus1ander (Sep 17, 2004)

I'm glad Terry didn't do something stupid and give Sally the immunity idol. I think there is a good chance he could sweep the challenges if he had one loss to work with.

The preview for next week was certainly interesting:


Spoiler



Looks like Bruce has a "medical emergency" and has to be transported off the island (for good?) I wonder if he got stung by something or its just a freak ailment...


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## Chapper1 (Jan 2, 2004)

I love how Jeff called Casaya out for their cockiness when Danielle was going on about Terry. If they didn't always have one of those immunity challenges where other people get to eliminate others, I think Terry could run the table. In most cases, the others aren't even in his league...


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

Spoiler



It looked to me like he was having some really severe intestinal cramps, but it was hard to tell


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## chronatog7 (Aug 26, 2004)

Shane mentioned that nobody could win all the individual immunity challenges and that it hasn't been done. I thought Colbe won all the Individual challenges only to lose to the blonde lady by the jury votes.


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## Chapper1 (Jan 2, 2004)

I don't think Colby won all of them, but it was the last 4 or something like that...


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

It looks like its going to get really intersting now. Either way, Terry can basically tell them where to shove it. If he wins immunity, he's all set and can still keep the idol. However, if he loses and has to fall back on the idol, that's where it becomes REALLY interesting. 

If everyone votes for him, then he plays it and handpicks who he wants to eliminate. His best bet might be not to focus on a specific person (like Aras), because then the other 5 know they are pretty much safe (we use up his idol, Aras goes home). 

However, if he can create the fear that someone at random might go home, you end up with him recreating the purple stone situation. After that one season where the purple stone eliminated a random player, everyone has ALWAYS been paranoid about going into a tie. "I don't want it to be me purely by bad luck". At that point, I think people will be falling all over themselves to make sure they are on terry's side...to secure themselves a good spot so they don't risk random elimination.

The other thing he has going for him is that in their numbers, they can still nullify terry's vote. If 2 of the 6 decide NOT to vote for terry but don't tell the other 4, they can choose who they want to eliminate...the 4 vote for terry, the other 2 vote for one of their 6, and terry's vote doesn't matter. There will be plenty of parania that maybe 2 of the 6 are trying to save themselves by selling out one of their own. That could further drive people to want to align with terry to secure themselves from that risk.

Finally, the third option for terry is, what if more than 1 group of 2 decide to secretly split off from the 6? Then they are plotting against each other. Once again, it would be wise for them to try to join terry to secure themselves a spot and eliminate this possibility.

It's very conceivable that, due to pure paranoia and a sense of self-preservation, terry could lose the immunity challenge and still not have to use up the immunity idol. It's incredibly intersting seeing 1 person in such a position of power over the other 6. It's also excellent that he happens to be a player I think is deserving of winning, and not scummy like some of the other players (ex: Mr. Diaper Rash).


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

Chapper1 said:


> I don't think Colby won all of them, but it was the last 4 or something like that...


Actually it was the last 5 he won (including the final 3 challenge)

http://www.cbs.com/primetime/survivor2/show/episode14/challenges.html


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## tivotvaddict (Aug 11, 2005)

bc0312 said:


> Every week they advertise the Survivor buff for sale. I wonder if they have ever sold a single one.


The year my daughter won the pool we bought her the buff as a prize.


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## tivotvaddict (Aug 11, 2005)

Chapper1 said:


> I don't think Colby won all of them, but it was the last 4 or something like that...


And didn't Brian, the former porn star, my most hated Survivor player ever, win just a kajillion of 'em too? I've tried to black that out of my memory......


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## JPA2825 (May 15, 2000)

Anybody see the commercial for next week's Survivor during CSI? Looks like more footage of the "medical emergency" alluded to before the NCAA? Speculation? Make sure you "spoilerize" if you do.


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

tivotvaddict said:


> And didn't Brian, the former porn star, my most hated Survivor player ever, win just a kajillion of 'em too?


Other than colby, all the big immunity winners have been the last 3 seasons:

All-Stars: Rob M won 5, but no more than 2 in a row
Vanuatu: Chris won the last 4 challenges in a row
Palau: Tom won 5, but only 3 in a row.


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

About the CSI commercial previews:



Spoiler



"Someone will be forced from the game in a life or death situation"

Sound like a bit more than the intestinal cramps I thought it looked like. But then again, I really don't expect they would show us Bruce rolling around on the ground and then try to make it a mystery as to who was going home. I expect Bruce gets some cramps that leave him in pain and someone else has a real emergency. Unless they are trying to use double reverse psychology on us. 

Also, if someone else has to be removed from the game, that saves terry from risking his idol.

Not so serious thought: 
The preview shows everyone talking about Shane being a loose canon, and he's quoted as "I'm gonna do whatever it takes", then they jump to the life or death situation where someone is force from the game....what if Shane does something stupid to try to ensure someone is eliminated, ends up getting them injured, and gets himself disqualified? Not very likely...just a thought.


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## sushikitten (Jan 28, 2005)

I really can't believe no one flipped. I think I would flip if I was with those freaks!


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## Fl_Gulfer (May 27, 2005)

I thought Sally was the only one worth getting the Million.


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## TeeSee (Jan 16, 2003)

jenhudson said:


> I really can't believe no one flipped. I think I would flip if I was with those freaks!


I can't recall a voting alliance staying together as well as they have. Usually _someone_ flips and screws things up.


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## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

I hadn't been a real big Terry fan now, but I am pulling for him 100% to pull off the impossible. With the exception of Aras the rest of them are complete wastes. I have no respect for any of them. I hope they all end up going home.

At this point at least one or two of them are leaving before Terry goes, and none of them except Aras seems to understand that. They just sit in their supposed position of power chowing on burgers without a care in the world.

They collectively suck.

The fortunate thing is none of them are terribly adept physically or mentally, so Terry could win most of the remaining challenges. I just don't get how none of those grapefruit heads understand that all 6 of them are not going to make it to the final 3? They have to realize some of them are on the outside and need to make a move. I understand the huge threat Terry is and wanting to get him off, but idiot Danielle thinks he would lose in the final tribal council anyways, so that makes him a zero threat to all of them. That means you want Terry to stick around, let him win immunity, and get rid of your real opponents would be the right thing to do.

I find the current status frustrating because it is very likely someone who did not play a very good game is going to end up winning.


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

marksman said:


> The fortunate thing is none of them are terribly adept physically or mentally, so Terry could win most of the remaining challenges. I just don't get how none of those grapefruit heads understand that all 6 of them are not going to make it to the final 3? They have to realize some of them are on the outside and need to make a move. I understand the huge threat Terry is and wanting to get him off, but idiot Danielle thinks he would lose in the final tribal council anyways, so that makes him a zero threat to all of them. That means you want Terry to stick around, let him win immunity, and get rid of your real opponents would be the right thing to do.
> 
> I find the current status frustrating because it is very likely someone who did not play a very good game is going to end up winning.


The girls (Cirie, Danielle, and Courtney) think that they have the superior plan because they'll get to the final 6, then when it's time to vote out Bruce in the 6th position, they'll "change the game forever" and vote with each other to get Shane out (not their biggest challenge to immunity, but the guy that they dislike) - clearly demonstrating that those three are sharing only 2 functioning brain cells.

If I was Aras, I would have chewed my team up one side and down the other because EVERY single one of them hung him out to dry by sitting out that challenge. Why not all play, each memorize a couple of symbols, and work together to ensure that Terry is unable to get the immunity.

When I saw it was a memorization of a select few symbols, I knew Terry was going to win due to his previous profession and his mind's training to memorize things...


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

I'm totally rooting for Terry as being without doubt the most deserving player.

What's up with the lingering uncertainty around if Terry has the hidden idol or not? He's shown it to Danielle and Bruce and they're still not sure? It would never cross my mind that Terry would lie about that.


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

marksman said:


> but idiot Danielle thinks [Terry] would lose in the final tribal council anyways, so that makes him a zero threat to all of them.


Well her thinking there is that they have a pretty tight group of 6, so when it gets down to the final 2 it would be Terry would have his 2 team members rooting for him, and whoever of the 6 he goes up against would have their 5 team members rooting for them.

Someone needs to brush up on their Survivor history. She seems to forget that getting to the end with such a tight team is actually a detriment. It helps you get closer to the end, but then at the very end each and every one of them is much more likely to feel betrayed when they get the boot. She's a fool to believe that the final vote will split along tribal lines.


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## LifeIsABeach (Feb 28, 2001)

LordKronos said:


> Other than colby, all the big immunity winners have been the last 3 seasons:
> 
> All-Stars: Rob M won 5, but no more than 2 in a row
> Vanuatu: Chris won the last 4 challenges in a row
> Palau: Tom won 5, but only 3 in a row.


In the first season the alliance kept trying to get rid of Kelly, but she won the last 4 or so immunity challenges.


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

macquariumguy said:


> It would never cross my mind that Terry would lie about that.


It did cross my mind a few weeks ago. When we saw that Terry was going to offer the immunity idol to someone if they would join him, I thought it would be hillarious if he found some feathers and crap in the woods, put them together into a fake-but-believable idol, and gave that to someone. Even if that person showed it to everyone at tribal council before the vote, I don't think Jeff Probst would say anything, since that would be interfering with someone's strategy. So then a week or 2 or whatever later, the person who THINKS they have an immunity idol gets voted out, they stand up and say "Jeff...I've got the idol", and Jeff looks kind of puzzle and says "I'm not sure what that is, but it's not the idol".


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

LifeIsABeach said:


> In the first season the alliance kept trying to get rid of Kelly, but she won the last 4 or so immunity challenges.


She only won the last 3. I wasn't including the threes, because there have been a number of people that won 3. I was focusing on the 4s and 5s (sequentially or not).


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

LordKronos said:


> It did cross my mind a few weeks ago.


I understand that whole line of thought but Terry wouldn't do that. That whole military academy duty/honor/country thing is quite real and (I believe) alive in Terry. I'm not saying he wouldn't lie at all but I think he would consider offering a fake idol to a potential switcher waaaaaay over the line.


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## cancermatt (May 21, 2002)

Finally catching up on the previous 3 eps before watching this one, I enjoyed it, but was on the edge of my seat until the end of the ep. wondering if Sally would actually go home, or get the idol, or send out other dude. I don't know if anyone's mentioned it, but this is almost like last season (or 2 seasons ago?) when the majority of the alliance sat out an event for food, let one person compete against the other two remaining members of the opposing tribe, but I can't remember if the outcome was the same or not.

I was hoping Cirie would compete in the water challenge 

I'm cheering for Aras and Bruce, against all the rest. Sally woulda been a close third in my cheering squad.


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

TeeSee said:


> I can't recall a voting alliance staying together as well as they have. Usually _someone_ flips and screws things up.


That's usually because it becomes obvious to the person(s) at the bottom of the pecking order, that they are at the bottom. I guess they all feel pretty secure. I have a feeling that what's going to break it this time is going to be the counter-strategizing against Terry's perceived ability to single-handedly vote one of them off by virtue of using the immunity idol (if he ever loses a challenge) if they vote 6-0 for him.


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## Chunky (Feb 10, 2006)

laughed my butt off when shane showed his 'willy' - the chicks just cracked me up!

So what's the deal with the immunity idol? Can they steal it from the other person? If Terry shows it and Bruce steals it - is that legal? Afterall, Rupert stole and sold stuff


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

Chunky said:


> So what's the deal with the immunity idol? Can they steal it from the other person? If Terry shows it and Bruce steals it - is that legal? Afterall, Rupert stole and sold stuff


it looked like Bruce was wanting to steal it, that's for sure...


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

It will be very difficult for the others in how they deal with Terry. What you are going to see is smaller internal alliances within the big alliance. For instance, if they tried to vote out Terry, not sure if he has the hidden Idol, they have to plan for who in their group they want to out. So they need to have little alliances of 2, so that they can vote for someone other than Terry, still have him voted out, and if he does play the idol, he cannot direct who goes out with his 1 vote. 

It will be fun here on out. Terry's run is reminding me of Tom's run/win. Go Terry!


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## Jebberwocky! (Apr 16, 2005)

Mikkel_Knight said:


> If I was Aras, I would have chewed my team up one side and down the other because EVERY single one of them hung him out to dry by sitting out that challenge.


Ripping on your team isn't the best way to go although it would have been hard to bite the ole tounge and not chewed them a new one.


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

Shane has diaper rash and needs a nurse to tell him what it is, what causes it, and how to get rid of it? WTF, I've never had kids but even I know what diaper rash is and what to do about it.

And speaking of kids, I sure feel sorry for young Boston Powers. His dad is a Froot Loop in the worst sense of the word.


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

macquariumguy said:


> I understand that whole line of thought but Terry wouldn't do that. That whole military academy duty/honor/country thing is quite real and (I believe) alive in Terry. I'm not saying he wouldn't lie at all but I think he would consider offering a fake idol to a potential switcher waaaaaay over the line.


I agree completely. That's why I didn't mention it when I thought of it a few weeks ago. I knew it wouldn't happen. But it did cross my mind, and I did think it would be pretty funny to see it played out. It would be almost as funny as a dead grandma (which I found pretty distasteful at the time, but now it gives me a chuckle when I think about it).


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

cancermatt said:


> but was on the edge of my seat until the end of the ep. wondering if Sally would actually go home, or get the idol, or send out other dude.


As soon as she got her first or second vote, I knew what was happening. She had a look of worry on her face that made it VERY CLEAR terry had not given her the idol.

*WARNING: the message below this (by Joeg180) contains info from the preview that is not in spoiler tags.*

.


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## Joeg180 (Jun 1, 2003)

The only way Terry would have given her the idol is if there were more than two votes for Aras or one of the other tribe members.

I would have been really pissed if my team sat out an alliance.

As for next week you see someone trying to start an IV into an Arm and it quickly looked like either mouth to mouth or checking an airway.

Why did we get to see the winners viewing their tapes and eating sandwiches and getting their comfort items. 

Courtney is off the charts now that she can practice her fire dancing


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## Anubys (Jul 16, 2004)

I think all Terry needs to do is win the next immunity...he can then coast to the final 4 as the pecking order is revealed and all hell breaks loose...

Sorry to see Sally go...what was up with her mom and sister (and Sally, for that matter) wearing hats?


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

For somebody as dim-witted and macho as Shane, having a woman laugh at his privates had to be psychologically scarring...


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

Joeg180 said:


> As for next week ...


You should spoiler tag things from the 'Next Week' bits. We have some people here who don't watch what's coming next week so as to maintain the surprise element.


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## JFriday (Mar 20, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> For somebody as dim-witted and macho as Shane, having a woman laugh at his privates had to be psychologically scarring...


Or him crying like a baby when he saw his video.


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## Jebberwocky! (Apr 16, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> For somebody as dim-witted and macho as Shane, having a woman laugh at his privates had to be psychologically scarring...


Probably not the first time that happened


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## Anubys (Jul 16, 2004)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> For somebody as dim-witted and macho as Shane, having a woman laugh at his privates had to be psychologically scarring...


the blur seemed to be rather small


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

LordKronos said:


> It looks like its going to get really intersting now. Either way, Terry can basically tell them where to shove it. If he wins immunity, he's all set and can still keep the idol. However, if he loses and has to fall back on the idol, that's where it becomes REALLY interesting.
> 
> If everyone votes for him, then he plays it and handpicks who he wants to eliminate. His best bet might be not to focus on a specific person (like Aras), because then the other 5 know they are pretty much safe (we use up his idol, Aras goes home).
> 
> ...


Wow...That is some great deduction!

Some random thoughts:

I LOVE when they have these types of Immunity challanges where they can choose not to play. They totally screwed themselves 

I sure thought whats-her-name was going to light herself on fire with that dancing.

I loved hearing about the "fake idol". I (along with others) suggested what a fake idol could do from the very beginning.

Why does everybody seem to be so sure that they could beat Terry in the final 2? He's made ZERO enemies.

Could that challange have been any better for a Fighter Pilot?

THANK YOU for not making us sit through all those tapes from home!

I think it will be Aras to flip first because he knows that he's the one going home When/If the immunity Idol ever gets used. He also knows that Terry will want to compete against Aras to the end.


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## Oldandslow (Nov 8, 2002)

Fl_Gulfer said:


> I thought Sally was the only one worth getting the Million.


Agree! Maybe Terry, but the rest are just awful. Worst over-all Survivor group.

:down:


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## sushikitten (Jan 28, 2005)

I was thinking LaMina should have tried to get Aras on their side for voting. Could Aras have pulled one person?


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

Jebberwocky! said:


> Ripping on your team isn't the best way to go although it would have been hard to bite the ole tounge and not chewed them a new one.


you're right...

However, it would have immediately gotten me to examine my options since their (my team's) actions were VERY clear that they are VERY willing to see me go.


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

jenhudson said:


> I was thinking LaMina should have tried to get Aras on their side for voting. Could Aras have pulled one person?


He better figure out a way to do so this coming week else he's toast...


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## Anubys (Jul 16, 2004)

jenhudson said:


> I was thinking LaMina should have tried to get Aras on their side for voting. Could Aras have pulled one person?


Since LaMina had voted for Aras at the last tribal council (or two, I don't remember), Aras would know that LaMina would turn on him as soon as they have the numbers...so Aras' only chance is to stick with his tribe...


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## getreal (Sep 29, 2003)

I don't know why, but I am constantly disappointed in Bruce for sticking with an alliance with Shane et.al. I would expect that Bruce would be smart enough to align with Terry.

And I suppose someone has made the observation a long time ago that LaMina is "Animal" spelled backwards. 

Another observation -- for any video game fans of Tom Clancy's "Splinter Cell" series, Terry totally reminds me of the hero character "Sam Fisher" in the video games.

I was a bit disappointed that Terry has not shared the secret idol with his former tribemates for the past couple of episodes as they've been picked off, but last night after Sally bit the dust, I had an "AHA!" moment when it dawned on me that Terry is playing for HIMSELF to WIN. Saving a former tribemate doesn't guarantee that he will last to the final four and eventually to the final two.

Sounds like the medical emergency that was hinted at in a preview several weeks ago is finally about to be broadcast.

Go Terry Go!


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## ducker (Feb 21, 2006)

lovin' seeing Terry tear it up... was a little saddened LAST week when he didn't drop the idol when Austin was still there. But I can see why he didn't use it this week. Even if he did, he would just be prolonging the inevetable, and giving himself less of a chance of going further.

Now that he still has it... at least one of them is going home next week, and most likely the week after. As I don't see Terry losing back to back immunity challenges.

All that being said, I wonder if their stupid alliance (of idiots) would hold true through the voting... they have held tight this far and that alone has been quite suprising. I totally thought that Shane was going to head out the week the women let him go from his promise that he would go to the final with them.


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## lew313 (Jul 2, 2002)

The one person I would like to see in the final 2 with Terry or anyone else is Shane. I don't think he has a fan anywhere- Voting him off would most certainly be self defeating.


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## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

LordKronos said:


> Someone needs to brush up on their Survivor history. She seems to forget that getting to the end with such a tight team is actually a detriment. It helps you get closer to the end, but then at the very end each and every one of them is much more likely to feel betrayed when they get the boot. She's a fool to believe that the final vote will split along tribal lines.


Yeah that is my thinking too. Nobody is going to hate Terry for playing hard and winning every challenge. He never screwed any of them. For any of the rest of them they will have to have stabbed multiple people in the back.

If Terry won out and Danielle some how ended up in the final, I can't envision a scenario for her winning, because even if she lucked into it and did nothing wrong, nobody would feel she did anything to deserve it, and at the worst others would be bitter.

Their alliance has been the most tenous in Survivor history. A lot of dumb luck has allowed it to stay in force, in my opinion. Not to take away from their amazing challenge victories.  I just think their strategy since the merge is akin to running the 4 corners in basketball and just hoping they can run the clock out before they other team catches up.

If Terry does go, then we know Mr. Miyagi is next, if not Aras... Basically we have the Shane and the 3 ladies who seem to be running the show right now. I don't want to see any of them win. So I just hope something happens.

As much as I get burnt up with contestants I do not like, I realize it piques my interest in the show hoping their demise even moreso than a win for a contestant I like.


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## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

JFriday said:


> Or him crying like a baby when he saw his video.


Yeah I thought about that too. I don't mind a little misty eyed nostolgia. He was blubbering like a newborn baby though. It was really unbecoming.... Part of my problem with all the hysterics and emotions is they have not been apart for a year, it is a couple of months at worst. Secondly, it is not like he is in a foreign prison camp, he is on a game show competing for a million dollars, and his son probably thinks that is cool.

Crying like that makes no sense.... I don't care how close you are to your son. But, I always find these moments very interesting in survivor. I am extremely close to my family and friends, but I know being away competiting on a game show without them for a few months would not drop me into dispair or rolled up in the fetal position.

Again, if your family were in some kind of danger or you were in a POW camp, I could understand this kind of response, but given the circumstances, it seems extremely overblown. Perhaps Shane was trying to gain some sympathy from others, but if so, I think he went too far.


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## ParadiseDave (Jun 8, 2000)

Ann asked me the question: "Where else in the world can grown men show off their *ahem* assets to women they have only known a month or less without being arrested and labeled a sex offender?" Not just inShane, but on several of the prior seasons.

I then remembered one of the women (Sue?) from a previous season screaming about a lawsuit because naked Richard brushed against her. Whatever happened with that?

CBS must have them sign some type of nudity waiver...


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

LordKronos said:


> As soon as she got her first or second vote, I knew what was happening. She had a look of worry on her face that made it VERY CLEAR terry had not given her the idol.


I don't think it's a matter of him outright giving her the idol before TC. I think it's more of an arrangement like this: "Here is the idol in my bag. I'll place it on the ground by my feet within easy reach. If it appears that a couple of people have flopped and we will have numbers by playing the idol and ousting one of them, then you can go ahead and reach back and grab it. However, if the vote goes as usual and saving yourself will not give us a numbers advantage, you'll have to stand up and leave. Sorry, but the only way I'm allowing someone else to use MY idol is if it helps me."

I'd be totally OK with Terry having a selfish arrangement like that since ultimately it is an individual game. In fact, I think the only time it might have been beneficial for him to give the idol away was the first vote after the merge when it would have only taken one defector to cause a power shift. Ever since then it's been foolish for him to show it and offer to give it away since they've needed to convince too many people.

If giving away the idol puts Terry in a position where he can make it through a TC or two without winning immunity, they it's a good move. Otherwise, it's not and he should keep it for himself. None of the previos opportunities met those requirements so he has been smart to keep it.


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## Tivortex (Feb 29, 2004)

marksman said:


> Crying like that makes no sense....


Emotional outpourings never do..."make sense"


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

getreal said:


> I don't know why, but I am constantly disappointed in Bruce for sticking with an alliance with Shane et.al. I would expect that Bruce would be smart enough to align with Terry.


I gave up on Bruce a long time ago....I've been disappointed in him since the beginning.


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## DRobbins (Dec 23, 2001)

Was I the only one surprised by the "Daddy, we miss you. Please come home right away!" pleadings from Terry's daughter on his videotape? I mean, he's in the navy, and long stints away from home are a way of life for military families. If she can't handle him being away for 3 weeks on a game show, how does she survive when he's away for two years on an aircraft carrier somewhere on the Pacific?


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

devdogaz said:


> I don't think it's a matter of him outright giving her the idol before TC. I think it's more of an arrangement like this


Somehow, I suspect that has been specifically forbidden. Otherwise it could just end up as a case where you can hand it off to whoever got voted out, without having to strategize.


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

pmyers said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I sure thought whats-her-name was going to light herself on fire with that dancing.





Spoiler



You know, I was just thinking that could be next weeks emergency


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## hearth (Aug 10, 2002)

Everybody on the show talks about how Terry must "sweep" the immunity challenges to win, but if he wins JUST next week's challenge, he is golden. Here's why:

Assume he wins next week, and the alliance turns on one of their own (let's say Aras, for the sake of the discussion). Now, the alliance is down to 5 against 1, but Terry still has the idol.

Let's say he loses the very next immunity challenge. All he has to do is go up to the group, produce the immunity idol, explain how the clues pointed to how to find the idol (so that the group is firmly convinced that it IS the REAL immunity idol), and say "OK, I assume that you will be voting for me tonight. In that case, I will be exercising the idol's power AND one of you will be going home instead. And I will have a vote as to who that person will be." 

Let suppose that Shane's (hot-headed) response to that is: "Wrong again! We will have 3 people vote for you, and 2 people vote for who WE (the alliance) wants to go home tonight. Your one vote is meaningless!!"

Then, Terry's response would be, "Hmmm, so one of you will be voting for me, not knowing that you alliance members are going to be voting YOU out instead. So, here is some advice from me to the 5 of you: If one of your alliance members ask you to vote for me tonight, be VERY careful, because that could mean that you are the one THEY are voting for."

Now, Terry has just placed a seed of doubt, where 1 of the 3 people asked to vote for Terry is going to be going home instead. For people on the bubble of the alliance, like Bruce, they would have to insist on NOT being the one to vote for Terry. Chaos insues and likely Terry does not even have to use the idol, as the alliance has split.

So, the only solution from the alliance's perspective is to say "OK. We are going public with the fact that Bruce (or whoever) is the next from the alliance to go". Now, if the alliance still wants to get rid of Terry's idol, they have to split their votes for Terry and Bruce. However, now Terry tells Bruce "Vote with me". The 4 people left from the alliance can't case 3 votes for Terry and 1 for Bruce, because Terry and Bruce would now control who goes home. Casting 2 votes for Terry and 2 for Bruce does nothing either, as now it is a 3 way tie with 2 votes for 3 different people, and any tie breacker is going to put one of the 4-person alliance at risk. The only way that all 4 members of the new alliance are safe is to cast 4 votes for Bruce, which allows Terry to keep the idol.

Repeat the same process the next week, and whether Terry wins another immunity challenge or not, he is in the final four, likely still with the idol.

So, in my mind, if Terry wins next week, he SHOULD be a lock for the final 2. I say "should" because we all know that people do not play this game like they should. If somebody is stupid enough to vote for Terry in the "alliance of 5", and get's sent home instead, then Terry is back to needing to win challenges again to make the final four.


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## latrobe7 (May 1, 2005)

pmyers said:


> Could that challange have been any better for a Fighter Pilot?


I don't think so - in fact my first thought was the physical tests from "The Right Stuff" and "An Officer and a Gentleman". More evidence, IMO, that Terry has been the producers pick all along.



Spoiler



I think it's highly unlikely that Courtney will set herself on fire, considering that 'firedance' is what she does for a living.


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

DRobbins said:


> Was I the only one surprised by the "Daddy, we miss you. Please come home right away!" pleadings from Terry's daughter on his videotape? I mean, he's in the navy, and long stints away from home are a way of life for military families. If she can't handle him being away for 3 weeks on a game show, how does she survive when he's away for two years on an aircraft carrier somewhere on the Pacific?


I'm figured Terry must be retired (someone said he was 47 years old). Certainly he's way past prime fighter jock age. If he's still active, he's got to be desk bound by now and there's the not so little matter of getting that much time off duty.


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

I was impressed with Courtney's grace and agility. She looked pretty good with her dance tools. Very smooth.


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

latrobe7 said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> I think it's highly unlikely that Courtney will set herself on fire, considering that 'firedance' is what she does for a living.





Spoiler



Do you suppose no soldier has ever shot himself with a gun? No trapeze acrobat has ever missed his swing? No race car driver has evercrashed his car on the expressway? Even professionals have accidents. It could happen.


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## latrobe7 (May 1, 2005)

LordKronos said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Do you suppose no soldier has ever shot himself with a gun? No trapeze acrobat has ever missed his swing? No race car driver has evercrashed his car on the expressway? Even professionals have accidents. It could happen.





Spoiler



No, I suppose that professionals are far less likely to make a mistake in their skill area, than say, 6 strangers in a foreign environment who have to do all kinds of things they are not used to. Call me crazy, but I think it's far more likely that someone will hack themselves with the machete - oh, wait did that happen already? - or eat something bad, than that the fire-dancing-performance-artist burns herself. Your examples only support my point, IMO. When a professional does make a mistake in his field its unusual, it certainly would not be my first thought. I dont get nervous that someone will get hurt when I see jugglers with swords.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

macquariumguy said:


> I'm figured Terry must be retired (someone said he was 47 years old). Certainly he's way past prime fighter jock age. If he's still active, he's got to be desk bound by now and there's the not so little matter of getting that much time off duty.


I wouldn't be surprised if he hasn't been on active duty in her lifetime...


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## LordKronos (Dec 28, 2003)

Spoiler



On the other hand, even though she is a pro, she's also a bit malnourished, and probably a bit sleep deprived.

That said, I don't think that's what going to happen, but I don't see any reason to believe it's unlikely.


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## jtfresh (Nov 14, 2005)

Terry will lose at least one immunity challenge because they will at some point have the obligatory challenge where you shoot or throw something at someone else's target and the last one standing gets immunity. No doubt Terry will be the first one out, thus having to use the immunity idol.


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## latrobe7 (May 1, 2005)

LordKronos said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> On the other hand, even though she is a pro, she's also a bit malnourished, and probably a bit sleep deprived.





Spoiler



as is everyone else, except unlike Courtney in the case of her fire-sticks, the rest of the camp are not doing things they have done a thousand times before.





LordKronos said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> That said, I don't think that's what going to happen, but I don't see any reason to believe it's unlikely.





Spoiler



Er, OK - it is a subjective world, if you chose not to see it, more power to you.


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## hearth (Aug 10, 2002)

jtfresh said:


> Terry will lose at least one immunity challenge because they will at some point have the obligatory challenge where you shoot or throw something at someone else's target and the last one standing gets immunity. No doubt Terry will be the first one out, thus having to use the immunity idol.


And, as I point out above, as long as it is not the next immunity challenge, then it is irrelevant if he wins any of the other challenges. He only NEEDS to win the next one. One the alliance gets down to 4-5 people, it should be easy for him to starting using the "threat" of the idol to get people to vote for anyone else but him.


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## wmm_16 (Jul 10, 2003)

Isn't the hidden imunity idol only good until the final four. I don't think it's any good after that.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

wmm_16 said:


> Isn't the hidden imunity idol only good until the final four. I don't think it's any good after that.


The only time it's not good, I'm pretty sure, is the last immunity challenge.


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## Idearat (Nov 26, 2000)

wmm_16 said:


> Isn't the hidden imunity idol only good until the final four. I don't think it's any good after that.


It's good _through_ the final four. So if it's down to four and you have it, you're golden. If it's four, you have it AND you have immunity you've got ammo to pick who goes. Just keep the regular immunity idol and offer the special one to someone but only if they vote your way.

I can see Shane being dragged to the end, if he lives, since he's probably the best person to be standing next to at the end.


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## jhausmann (Aug 21, 2002)

I'm thinking Terry has an advantage over the other idiots that they just don't understand. He's in better physical shape and mentally sharp, I think partly due to his training. Naval Line officers undergo survival training at least once during their career, more often if they've been assigned combat duty where there's a possibility of being captured. I'd imagine a pilot would be no different.

I gotta believe he's been trained to survive harsher conditions...


That's not to take anthing away from how he's played thus far. Extremely well, except for not making a play when it was 6 vs. 4...


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

jtfresh said:


> Terry will lose at least one immunity challenge because they will at some point have the obligatory challenge where you shoot or throw something at someone else's target and the last one standing gets immunity. No doubt Terry will be the first one out, thus having to use the immunity idol.


I said that in last week's thread and someone else pointed out that those are usually in reward challenges and not immunity challenges. Can someone remember (or do some research) and tell us if it's normal to have the "pecking order" challenges as IC or mostly as RC?


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## betts4 (Dec 27, 2005)

I am soooo rooting for Terry! 

I wondered though, if Terry does make it to the final 2, is having a jury of all the group that was his competition (except for sally and austin) a good move? Wouldn't he risk having them all vote for the other person (whoever that is) just because he had beat them so many times? 
Also, doesn't there always seem to be at least one person that by this time in the game is really out with everyone because they show how good they are at the immunitys and the strategies and such? I ask it this way because I am a new survivor fan. I started watching with Boston Rob and enjoyed that game. I also really like a past seasons game with Tom. It seems the underdogs are not really the underdogs in terms of strength and ability but are the ones that everyone on the island is jealous of because they are winning. 
I still can't figure out how Bruce has gotten as far as he has. I like him, but he is not encouraging. And some of the gals. Geesh. 
Sally is an awesome player and she was very close on some of the physical challenges - I was sorry to see her go.


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## getreal (Sep 29, 2003)

devdogaz said:


> Can someone remember (or do some research) and tell us if it's normal to have the "pecking order" challenges as IC or mostly as RC?


I didn't do any research, but I seem to recall that endurance challenges and puzzles are typical immunity challenges, and skills challenges are typically for reward.


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## brianric (Aug 29, 2002)

DRobbins said:


> Was I the only one surprised by the "Daddy, we miss you. Please come home right away!" pleadings from Terry's daughter on his videotape? I mean, he's in the navy, and long stints away from home are a way of life for military families. If she can't handle him being away for 3 weeks on a game show, how does she survive when he's away for two years on an aircraft carrier somewhere on the Pacific?


What war are you talking about two years away on an aircraft carrier? Not since World War II has that happened, and I served pn three bird farms (Eisenhower, Vinson, Nimitz).


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

betts4 said:


> I am soooo rooting for Terry!
> 
> I wondered though, if Terry does make it to the final 2, is having a jury of all the group that was his competition (except for sally and austin) a good move? Wouldn't he risk having them all vote for the other person (whoever that is) just because he had beat them so many times?
> Also, doesn't there always seem to be at least one person that by this time in the game is really out with everyone because they show how good they are at the immunitys and the strategies and such? I ask it this way because I am a new survivor fan. I started watching with Boston Rob and enjoyed that game. I also really like a past seasons game with Tom. It seems the underdogs are not really the underdogs in terms of strength and ability but are the ones that everyone on the island is jealous of because they are winning.
> ...


Sure, Terry isn't in a great position if he makes it to the final two but there's nothing he can do about that.

Bruce and the girls are still in it because they have a strong alliance. You don't usually get to pick your tribemates, and you don't have a chance to form an alliance with the other tribe, so you form it with what you have.

As for the other stuff, if you go back and watch every version after S1, you'll find that it's pretty common for girls who do nothing (fly under the radar) and therefore pose no threat to make it to the end. In fact, we've had a few of them win the whole thing because the person they go up against has had to stab a few people in the back to get there, while the girl basically got there because nobody thought they were worth voting against.


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## Ruth (Jul 31, 2001)

Right now, people are irritated with Terry because they think he is arrogant and cocky and he is obviously so much of a threat. So they think they could beat him in the final 2. But I'm not sure that's true. By that time, usually the jury starts thinking about who deserves to win, based on how they've played the game. If Terry makes it that far, he's going to get a lot of (well-deserved) credit for being so dominant in challenges, and making it so far on his own without an alliance to protect him. I think it's a long road for him to get there though.


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## AccidenT (Oct 25, 2004)

Am I the only one confused why both teams in the reward challenge chose the lightest person to be the one on the wooden platform? The person's weight worked with them to stretch the bungee, so why not put the heaviest (or at least not the lightest) person on the platform so you don't need as much force? Cirie's weight-to-strength ratio is particularly high, so her team would have had a great chance at winning if they had put her on it


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## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

jtfresh said:


> Terry will lose at least one immunity challenge because they will at some point have the obligatory challenge where you shoot or throw something at someone else's target and the last one standing gets immunity. No doubt Terry will be the first one out, thus having to use the immunity idol.


Do they ever use those for immunity challenges though? Seems like they are normally for reward challenges, although my memory could be fuzzy. I just don't recall some front-runner being ganged up on in the past. I think they purposefully set it up so that does not happen.

For reward challenges I don't think they care, but I would be suprised if an immunity challenge was tied to an event like that.


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## bobsbizzy (Jun 20, 2002)

LordKronos said:


> It did cross my mind a few weeks ago. When we saw that Terry was going to offer the immunity idol to someone if they would join him, I thought it would be hillarious if he found some feathers and crap in the woods, put them together into a fake-but-believable idol, and gave that to someone. Even if that person showed it to everyone at tribal council before the vote, I don't think Jeff Probst would say anything, since that would be interfering with someone's strategy. So then a week or 2 or whatever later, the person who THINKS they have an immunity idol gets voted out, they stand up and say "Jeff...I've got the idol", and Jeff looks kind of puzzle and says "I'm not sure what that is, but it's not the idol".


Whats your name - Johnny Fairplay?


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## dumbunny (May 14, 2002)

marksman said:


> Do they ever use those for immunity challenges though? Seems like they are normally for reward challenges, although my memory could be fuzzy. I just don't recall some front-runner being ganged up on in the past. I think they purposefully set it up so that does not happen.
> 
> For reward challenges I don't think they care, but I would be suprised if an immunity challenge was tied to an event like that.


At about this stage in Survivor Australia, they had a slingshot immunity challenge. Colby was the obvious physical threat, but won immunity when the others failed to gang up on him.


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## sketcher (Mar 3, 2005)

DRobbins said:


> Was I the only one surprised by the "Daddy, we miss you. Please come home right away!" pleadings from Terry's daughter on his videotape? I mean, he's in the navy, and long stints away from home are a way of life for military families. If she can't handle him being away for 3 weeks on a game show, how does she survive when he's away for two years on an aircraft carrier somewhere on the Pacific?


He USED to be in the Navy. He's an airline pilot now. As someone else posted, I'm sure she wasn't born until after he left the Navy.


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## brianric (Aug 29, 2002)

sketcher said:


> He USED to be in the Navy. He's an airline pilot now. As someone else posted, I'm sure she wasn't born until after he left the Navy.


Carriers have not deployed for two years at a time since WW II, that is what I was referring to.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

there has to be rules against stealing the idol/looking in people's bags/faking the idol. I dont recall if i ever did see bags before this year. Did they always have them? maybe i'm just aware of them because i can't figure out where else they would hide the idol. As far as faking it, I really dont see how they couldn't have a rule against it. heck everyone could say they had one. I also think there must be a rule against looking in bags because all anyone would have to do is look thru each bag. Of course there are other places to hide it but then you risk someone running across it in theory. Hiding it up in the tent like that just didn't seem right but i guess no one looked up there yet 

I think cbs needs to post rules so we know them. usage of idol seems to not be something everyone agrees on. I had thought you could give it to anyone after they were voted off. If you have to give it to them before the vote, it doesn't have as much power because you have to basically guess who is going off. And the rules do state you have to give the 'won' idol up before the vote so what would be the point of having a 2nd one like that? Not as exciting.


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## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

bc0312 said:


> Every week they advertise the Survivor buff for sale. I wonder if they have ever sold a single one.


hahaha, you know I say that about 2 or 3 times a season. I live in the NYC area, and you'd think out of 15 million people in the metro area, I'd have seen ONE person ONCE where one. Maybe people are just buying and collecting, to be sold one day on E-Bay.


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## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

So, Terry continues his dominance. I loved how deliberate he was in the memory challenge. No panicking, no freaking out, just look, memorize and recreate.

I di think he has missed his only real chance to shake things up by trading or using the idol (getting shane out a couple of weeks back would have been the best thing he could have done IMO). Now, he is basically trying to win every challenge and use it defensively if he does not or possibly keep it until the final 5 so he can take one person of his choosing to teh final 4.

As far as the preview, from my wife and I freeze framing it:



Spoiler



It looked like a woman and it appeared to us that the person bending over the stretcher was Shane and he kissed their forehead (again, can't see him doing this to a guy).

We both thought it looked like Courtney, but might not have been because there are only a couple of frames and it is shot with low/no-light cameras that have crappy resolution (and I do not have access to the super duper crime show resolution enhancers so I can't see what is on the eyeball of the person on the stretcher.  ).

It does look like fire might be in one of the challenges, is it possible that she gets burned by that and not by her fire dancing stuff. Kind of ironic I think if so.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Is Terry really being cocky or is he just firing back at La Mina for being so open about their power and how he is next to go if he doesn't win? I think it's La Mina that is being cocky.


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## sushikitten (Jan 28, 2005)

I don't think Terry is being cocky at all--I agree LaMina is WAAAAAAAAAY more cocky.


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## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

Terry is certainly confident. BUT, if you can walk the walk, you can talk the talk.

So my vote for cocky goes to cheeseburger munchers  who have not yet demonstrated they can walk the walk - just that they can stuff the face.


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## Anubys (Jul 16, 2004)

pmyers said:


> Is Terry really being cocky or is he just firing back at La Mina for being so open about their power and how he is next to go if he doesn't win? I think it's La Mina that is being cocky.


I think he's trying to unnerve them...


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

newsposter said:


> I think cbs needs to post rules so we know them.


1. No hitting or assaulting of another contestant.
2. No conspiring to share the money.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

devdogaz said:


> 1. No hitting or assaulting of another contestant.
> 2. No conspiring to share the money.


And that's what I like: Very limited rules.


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## lander215 (Jan 10, 2003)

pmyers said:


> And that's what I like: Very limited rules.


There are other rules...oddly enough only available up through season 8, but I'm sure they all still apply:

- Try to conspire to share the prize. The million dollars may be won by one and only one individual. Survivors are prohibited from sharing or making any agreement to share all or any portion of the prize.

- Enter the production area. The area designated for the production crew is strictly off-limits to the Survivors.

- Break the law. Even though they are stranded on a remote island in Panama, the Survivors will still be held to U.S. law and local law. Any breach of those laws is against the contest rules.

- Miss a Tribal Council or a Challenge. Tribal Council meetings are mandatory for all Survivors, and everyone is required to vote. In addition, sitting out of a Challenge that requires the participation of all Survivors is not allowed.

- Damage the Panama environment. Only designated fruits, vegetables, and animals may be harvested as food. In addition, the Survivors may not leave litter or any other debris on the site, and they will be obliged to give full consideration to the ecological impact of everything they do in Panama.

- Act up. Any misconduct is against the rules, including but not limited to stealing or misappropriating food, harming other Survivors or crew members, and acts of violence.

I'm sure they'd put anything under the umbrella of the "Act up" rule if they so choose, like NASCAR does with their "Actions detrimental to the sport".


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

seems like stealing a idol from someone's bag is illegal for sure. However making up a fake one appears to be legit.


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## Joeg180 (Jun 1, 2003)

Terry is the only LaMina tribe member left. The other tribe was Casaya.

I think Terry is playing it Smart if he can win three more challenges he is in the final four.

I would like to see them offer food for not competing again. I thought that was very telling for the Casaya tribe.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

those burgers were waaay too big...ditch the roll and you could eat more


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## Idearat (Nov 26, 2000)

lander215 said:


> There are other rules...oddly enough only available up through season 8, but I'm sure they all still apply:
> 
> - Try to conspire to share the prize. The million dollars may be won by one and only one individual. Survivors are prohibited from sharing or making any agreement to share all or any portion of the prize.
> - Act up. Any misconduct is against the rules, including but not limited to stealing or misappropriating food, harming other Survivors or crew members, and acts of violence.


I'd say all of these are "at the discretion of the producers". I'm still part of the minority opinion that these rules have been broken, but deemed by the producers to be not bad enough to toss someone out.


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## ILoveCats&Tivo (Feb 14, 2006)

Count me in also as hoping Terri wins this thing.

That challenge was tailor-made for Terri, and you know those producers wanted him to win it by offering that food to the other survivors. It made it that much easier for him to win, but it doesn't matter because I believe he would have wooped everyones butt anyway.

Poor Sally is reminiscent of Stephanie (sort of) I mean she wasn't as strong probably, but she was doomed just because of her tribe status.


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## Anubys (Jul 16, 2004)

I think the challenges and all the twists and turns are determined long before the show starts...so there is no way to make a challenge to fit one person over another...there's no way for them to know in advance who would still be there... 

Many of the challenges would fit perfectly with military training anyway...but I don't think they are made to give Terri an edge...


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## Philosofy (Feb 21, 2000)

Terry is going great, but my money is on one of the three women left. When Danielle wouldn't flip to be guaranteed final four, it dawned on me why that would be. I also wondered how Cirie's position went from being the next Casaya to go to very confident (not cocky.) Here's how it will work. If Terry doesn't lose an immunity challenge, its Bruce, Aras, and Shane on the block. When Terry loses a challenge, he uses the idol, and one of the other men go. Then Terry goes if he loses a second challenge. That leaves Courtney, Danielle, and Cirie for the final three, or at least two of the women plus Terry. If Terry wins the endurance challenge, its Terry plus the woman he picks. If the women haven't pissed off the rest of Casaya, its 5 Casaya votes to 2 La Mina. I think Terry will make final two, but not win it overall.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Anubys said:


> I think the challenges and all the twists and turns are determined long before the show starts...so there is no way to make a challenge to fit one person over another...there's no way for them to know in advance who would still be there...
> 
> Many of the challenges would fit perfectly with military training anyway...but I don't think they are made to give Terri an edge...


I believe...that I remember reading an article where they said that the challanges are all pre-determined but that the order in which they do them is not. If that is the case, I can totally see the producers picking a certain challange to help a particular outcome.


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## drjlb (Feb 2, 2004)

pmyers said:


> I believe...that I remember reading an article where they said that the challanges are all pre-determined but that the order in which they do them is not. If that is the case, I can totally see the producers picking a certain challange to help a particular outcome.


And if the producers don't influence the outcome, Jeff certainly does. For example in the recent coconuts in a boat challenge, Jeff conveniently reminded the winning team that they needed to get their flag up on the beach in order to win. Had he waited another minute to remind them or not reminded them at all, they would have lost, it was that close.

There is no doubt in my mind that the producers go into each challenge knowing which people they want to win. Any way they can engineer that outcome, they will.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

drjlb said:


> And if the producers don't influence the outcome, Jeff certainly does. For example in the recent coconuts in a boat challenge, Jeff conveniently reminded the winning team that they needed to get their flag up on the beach in order to win. Had he waited another minute to remind them or not reminded them at all, they would have lost, it was that close...


I totally remember that and remember wondering why he would mention that to the team.


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

drjlb said:


> And if the producers don't influence the outcome, Jeff certainly does. For example in the recent coconuts in a boat challenge, Jeff conveniently reminded the winning team that they needed to get their flag up on the beach in order to win. Had he waited another minute to remind them or not reminded them at all, they would have lost, it was that close.
> 
> There is no doubt in my mind that the producers go into each challenge knowing which people they want to win. Any way they can engineer that outcome, they will.


Maybe the producers do try to influence the games, I don't know, but I do know Jeff does stuff like that frequently as part of his running commentary during the challenge. This was hardly a unique occurence.


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## Jotas (Mar 19, 2005)

My vote is for Terry. I don't think he is cocky, I think he playing the game as best he can. I was upset that Bruce of all people didn't flip, and especially Danielle after being offered the idol.


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## drjlb (Feb 2, 2004)

macquariumguy said:


> Maybe the producers do try to influence the games, I don't know, but I do know Jeff does stuff like that frequently as part of his running commentary during the challenge. This was hardly a unique occurence.


I know Jeff does his running commentary every challenge. What struck me was when he said it this time. He said it, the woman immeadiately ran down the beach and back and they won by less time than it would have taken her to make the trip again. If Jeff had waited until they thought they were done (loaded the coconuts into the box) and then told them the flag was part of the requirement, they would have lost.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

and dont forget jeff stirring it up at tribal...anyone that doesn't think he influences people doesnt have a grasp of the game. All the reminders to do stuff during the challenges and jabs at certain people during tribal are definitely interference. 

whether or not it's fair is up for debate


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## Anubys (Jul 16, 2004)

pmyers said:


> I totally remember that and remember wondering why he would mention that to the team.


In that challenge, Terry's team lost, right? another counter-point is that the teams are chosen randomly, so the producers can't control much of the outcome...

Yes, Jeff interferes and brings out the truth...that's part of what he does and why he's the best at what he does...it's part of the game...


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Anubys said:


> In that challenge, Terry's team lost, right? another counter-point is that the teams are chosen randomly, so the producers can't control much of the outcome...
> 
> Yes, Jeff interferes and brings out the truth...that's part of what he does and why he's the best at what he does...it's part of the game...


Amen! Jeff does an excellent job and I love the way he slyly interjects his opinions into Tribal Council and the questions he asks before challenges begin. Jeff is definitely the best at what he does and I'm really happy that he has signed on for a few more seasons.


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## ILoveCats&Tivo (Feb 14, 2006)

Philosofy said:


> . If Terry wins the endurance challenge, its Terry plus the woman he picks. .


You are kidding right? I can't see ANY of those women beating Terry at anything, especially an endurance challenge............


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

ILoveCats&Tivo said:


> You are kidding right? I can't see ANY of those women beating Terry at anything, especially an endurance challenge............


The endurance challenge usually happens when there are only three people left. As Philosofy said (and you quoted), if Terry wins that challenge, the final two will be Terry and whoever he picks to sit next to him.


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## ILoveCats&Tivo (Feb 14, 2006)

devdogaz said:


> The endurance challenge usually happens when there are only three people left. As Philosofy said (and you quoted), if Terry wins that challenge, the final two will be Terry and whoever he picks to sit next to him.


Yes, with the operative word in his quote being "IF"


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

drjlb said:


> I know Jeff does his running commentary every challenge. What struck me was when he said it this time. He said it, the woman immeadiately ran down the beach and back and they won by less time than it would have taken her to make the trip again. If Jeff had waited until they thought they were done (loaded the coconuts into the box) and then told them the flag was part of the requirement, they would have lost.


also remember that what you see on the screen does not always equate to what Jeff says at the time either... editing can be a fickle thing y'all...


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

pmyers said:


> I believe...that I remember reading an article where they said that the challanges are all pre-determined but that the order in which they do them is not. If that is the case, I can totally see the producers picking a certain challange to help a particular outcome.


meh - part of the reason is logistics with weather and lighting... some challenges are better than others during a specific time of day which would involve lighting and weather... I doubt that the producers are specifically setting out to create the full story arc during filming.

Case and point - Johnny Fairplay. They didn't have a whole lot planned for that guy at all, but the minute he played the dead grandma card, they started developing his character as the heel long before he actually became one...


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

Gambling sites have removed Survivor from their options due to a large number of votes to win for a specific person...


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## Anubys (Jul 16, 2004)

Mikkel_Knight said:


> Gambling sites have removed Survivor from their options due to a large number of votes to win for a specific person...


I'm assuming you meant "bets", not "votes"


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

There is NO doubt in my mind that the producers of Survivor, Big Brother, Amazing Race (although logistics might prevent this), and most other compitition reality shows use their challanges to help steer the game into a direction that THEY want to see it go. It might not always work out, but they will at least try.


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## ILoveCats&Tivo (Feb 14, 2006)

pmyers said:


> There is NO doubt in my mind that the producers of Survivor, Big Brother, Amazing Race (although logistics might prevent this), and most other compitition reality shows use their challanges to help steer the game into a direction that THEY want to see it go. It might not always work out, but they will at least try.


I bet so too, just as I am sure that they are feeding lines to Jeff for (or maybe even during) those Tribal Counsels.........


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## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

jenhudson said:


> I don't think Terry is being cocky at all--I agree LaMina is WAAAAAAAAAY more cocky.


Yeah I don't think he is cocky. I think he is extremely confident, and that is why most of the other men admire him. Apparently except for lame-brain shane and his son Boston Powers.

Even Aras seems to have a bit of a man crush on him, but nowhere near as bad as Austin and Nick.

I can't think of a single shown instance where Terry was shown as being disrespectful to another player. I also think the underwater challenge was well suited for him because even if he is not the smartest person there, he has extensive training in thinking under pressure and that will serve him well through any of the remaining mental challenges, I suspect.

I think at this point I would like to see Terry, Bruce and Aras team up and try to get the other 4 out of the game. Unfortunately, that is a tough proposition.


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## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

drjlb said:


> I know Jeff does his running commentary every challenge. What struck me was when he said it this time. He said it, the woman immeadiately ran down the beach and back and they won by less time than it would have taken her to make the trip again. If Jeff had waited until they thought they were done (loaded the coconuts into the box) and then told them the flag was part of the requirement, they would have lost.


The impression I get of Jeff, though, is he would have said it regardless of which team it was. If it was another team he would have said the exact same thing. He is part of the field, basically.

I suspect there have been instances where players have missed something Jeff said or ignored it to their own detriment as well. I just don't get the vibe that he is trying to steer the contest for any particular constestant. He already sleeps with the hottest Survivor ever, and she did not even win.


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

ILoveCats&Tivo said:


> I bet so too, just as I am sure that they are feeding lines to Jeff for (or maybe even during) those Tribal Counsels.........


Jeff doesn't talk with the production camp specifically because he wants to needle the Survivors based strictly on his observations. He has said so on TV interviews... lends him more credibility with the cast...


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Mikkel_Knight said:


> Jeff doesn't talk with the production camp specifically because he wants to needle the Survivors based strictly on his observations. He has said so on TV interviews... lends him more credibility with the cast...


but he does watch what is going on in both camps and is clued-in on somethings before Tribal Council.


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

pmyers said:


> but he does watch what is going on in both camps and is clued-in on somethings before Tribal Council.


I don't think so...

I know that he's been asked "do you want to know what happened the past 3 days" by Burnett and Co. and he has said (in the past) "No - I want to find out for myself and see if I can get things out of the contestants"...

He has stated that outside the initial few days at camp, he remains away from and aloof towards the castaways...


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Mikkel_Knight said:


> I don't think so...
> 
> I know that he's been asked "do you want to know what happened the past 3 days" by Burnett and Co. and he has said (in the past) "No - I want to find out for myself and see if I can get things out of the contestants"...
> 
> He has stated that outside the initial few days at camp, he remains away from and aloof towards the castaways...


hmm....I thought I remember him saying that he does watch footage of what's been going on back at the camps so that he knows what to ask and who to pry for information. Wouldn't make a lot of sense that he wouldn't know what's going on before going to TC. In fact, I know that he's brought up stuff before that he could only know about from finding out from either video or a producer (when they ate that sacrificial chicken last year, for example).


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

Jeff gets right to the point at TC sometimes to the extent he must have inside knowledge. I figured he was watching highlights from the video taken the previous few days.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

We only see a very small sliver of the actual Tribal Council. I've read reports that they often last 1-2 hours. It wouldn't surprise me if the Survivors reveal all kinds of stuff at TC and they edit things out and only show the very most provocative questions and responses.


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## drjlb (Feb 2, 2004)

marksman said:


> The impression I get of Jeff, though, is he would have said it regardless of which team it was. If it was another team he would have said the exact same thing. He is part of the field, basically.
> 
> I suspect there have been instances where players have missed something Jeff said or ignored it to their own detriment as well. I just don't get the vibe that he is trying to steer the contest for any particular constestant. He already sleeps with the hottest Survivor ever, and she did not even win.


I'm not suggesting that Jeff is steering the game where he personally wants it to go. I am suggesting that just as you do at home on your couch, the production team says, "hmmm, wouldn't it be great if this outcome were to occur for these reasons." And I'm sure Jeff hears that stuff even if he consciously tries to avoid acting on it. And, as someone else stated, editing is the unknown factor here. Sure the teams were chosen at random, but how much time elapsed between picking and the challenge beginning? I'm sure enough for the crew to discuss things among themselves.

The reason I picked the coconut challenge as an example is, IIRC, you could see the loosing team in the final shot of the winning team and see just how close it actually was. Sure, he could have just held off on mentioning the flag requirement until the very last minute in order to make the finish as close as possible, but in the end, he gave a team a chance that they never would have had without his not so subtle reminder. I'm sure both teams spent several minutes on the beach unloading their boats and loading their boxes. He could have reminded them about the flag at any point during that time. He didn't. When it was obvious that one team would lose due to their oversight, he brought it up.


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## David Platt (Dec 13, 2001)

I saw a recent interview with Jeff, and he said that while he tries to steer clear of knowing anything about the daily goings-on in the tribes, he usually does come into Tribal Council knowing about big stuff-- for instance if a player wants to leave the game or if someone gets seriously hurt.


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## jhausmann (Aug 21, 2002)

If your suppostion is true, there's gotta be lawyers frothing at the mouth to seek compensation for the losers. I'm no lawyer but I imagine the amendment to the 1960 Communications act that made it against the law to fix television game shows is still in effect. I've said it before, I gotta believe what you're seeing/hearing is post-editing and not part of the actual event.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

can't someone sign away their right to a certain law's provisions? or once a law like that is made, is there no circumstance where it doesnt apply?


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

jhausmann said:


> If your suppostion is true, there's gotta be lawyers frothing at the mouth to seek compensation for the losers. I'm no lawyer but I imagine the amendment to the 1960 Communications act that made it against the law to fix television game shows is still in effect. I've said it before, I gotta believe what you're seeing/hearing is post-editing and not part of the actual event.


This doesn't apply as this is not considered a game show. Mark Burnett actually describes it as unscripted drama.


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## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

If you want a reality show that is completely orchestrated and convuluted by the producers watch unanimous.


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## Anubys (Jul 16, 2004)

jhausmann said:


> If your suppostion is true, there's gotta be lawyers frothing at the mouth to seek compensation for the losers. I'm no lawyer but I imagine the amendment to the 1960 Communications act that made it against the law to fix television game shows is still in effect. I've said it before, I gotta believe what you're seeing/hearing is post-editing and not part of the actual event.


First, let me say that I'm in the camp that believes Jeff's comment on the coconut challenge was "normal"...this is what he does all the time...and that this is part of the show...I don't think he makes the comments in order to steer a specific outcome...

However, this was not post-editing...as soon as he reminded them of the flag, Sally bolted like a bat out of hell to go get it...

as for the game show/unscripted drama...it doesn't matter what the producer wants to call it, it's what the government calls it that matters...people competing for money is a game show...


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

devdogaz said:


> This doesn't apply as this is not considered a game show. Mark Burnett actually describes it as unscripted drama.


Your exaxtly right. This is not a game show and does not fall under the same scrutiny. I believe they made that change after season 1 when somebody accused the producers of fixing the game.


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

pmyers said:


> Your exaxtly right. This is not a game show and does not fall under the same scrutiny. I believe they made that change after season 1 when somebody accused the producers of fixing the game.


and that's when Burnett and Probst stopped interacting with the Survivors on a routine regular basis.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Mikkel_Knight said:


> and that's when Burnett and Probst stopped interacting with the Survivors on a routine regular basis.


Interacting and knowing what's going on at camp are two different things? Do you really think they don't know what's going on? Do you really think Jeff finds out all the dirt at the TCs and Reward Challanges? That's a bit naive IMHO.


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

pmyers said:


> Interacting and knowing what's going on at camp are two different things? Do you really think they don't know what's going on? Do you really think Jeff finds out all the dirt at the TCs and Reward Challanges? That's a bit naive IMHO.


The only times Probst sees the Survivors is during challenges and tribal. I would capitulate that he knows major events (camp devastation and injuries and such), but he has said in the past during interviews that he remains standoffish from the players in order to maintain his integrity with them...

Also remember... the shooting is over halfway completed before the 1st episode is in the can...


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Mikkel_Knight said:


> Also remember... the shooting is over halfway completed before the 1st episode is in the can...


Do you know this for sure? I would bet that shooting is 100% completed before the first episode is in the can. Knowing who will stick around and what personalities will emerge plays a big factor in how they edit the first several episodes. I'd be totally surprised if they complete the editing of any of the eps before the final TC and the contestants have returned home.


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

Jeff may not be interacting with the players, but I'd bet anything he sees video from the camps and/or talks to the cameramen before the TC. There have just been too many times when he's asked a question at TC that could only have come from inside knowledge of private (or what passes for private when you've got cameras all around you) conversations. He always seems to know who's in, who's out, what alliances are firm or not, etc.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

macquariumguy said:


> Jeff may not be interacting with the players, but I'd bet anything he sees video from the camps and/or talks to the cameramen before the TC. There have just been too many times when he's asked a question at TC that could only have come from inside knowledge of private (or what passes for private when you've got cameras all around you) conversations. He always seems to know who's in, who's out, what alliances are firm or not, etc.


EXACTLY :up: :up: :up: he doesn't have to interact with them to know exactly what's going on.


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

macquariumguy said:


> Jeff may not be interacting with the players, but I'd bet anything he sees video from the camps and/or talks to the cameramen before the TC. There have just been too many times when he's asked a question at TC that could only have come from inside knowledge of private (or what passes for private when you've got cameras all around you) conversations. He always seems to know who's in, who's out, what alliances are firm or not, etc.


doubtful

TC's are sometimes in excess of 2 hours. One reportedly went for almost 3 last season (or two) when the castaways weren't being forward or giving any real answers... It's Jeff's job to do so. Not through getting inside information from dailies or by talking with the camera crew from the day before...

editing editing editing


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

devdogaz said:


> Do you know this for sure? I would bet that shooting is 100% completed before the first episode is in the can. Knowing who will stick around and what personalities will emerge plays a big factor in how they edit the first several episodes. I'd be totally surprised if they complete the editing of any of the eps before the final TC and the contestants have returned home.


according to the 1st Survivor book, yes - the season isn't completed when the 1st episode is put together.

The only person(s) to know who the winner is include Burnett until a week/week and a half before the season finale.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Mikkel_Knight said:


> doubtful
> 
> TC's are sometimes in excess of 2 hours. One reportedly went for almost 3 last season (or two) when the castaways weren't being forward or giving any real answers... It's Jeff's job to do so. Not through getting inside information from dailies or by talking with the camera crew from the day before...
> 
> editing editing editing


No offense, but I think your being really naive and hard-headed about this. I would need to see/read an interview where Jeff says he had no clue what's going on at the camps before I'd believe one second of it.

In fact, it just makes zero sense why he wouldn't look at the footage and be informed on what's going on. As a viewer, you'd want him to know so he can stir the pot.

Out of curiosity, do you think Julie Chen of Big Brother or Phil from Amazing Race see footage or updates about what is going on in the game?


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

pmyers said:


> No offense, but I think your being really naive and hard-headed about this. I would need to see/read an interview where Jeff says he had no clue what's going on at the camps before I'd believe one second of it.
> 
> In fact, it just makes zero sense why he wouldn't look at the footage and be informed on what's going on. As a viewer, you'd want him to know so he can stir the pot.
> 
> Out of curiosity, do you think Julie Chen of Big Brother or Phil from Amazing Race see footage or updates about what is going on in the game?


I've followed Survivor religiously since the beginning of Season 1, episode 1. I've applied to the show 6 times.

I'm not going to dig for articles from the past, but I do know that I've read them. Anything Survivor I can get my hands on, I do. I know quite a lot about the show in general and yeah, I haven't been there, but I have gotten every piece of information about it that I possibly can.

No offense, but to me, it just appears as if you are being argumentative simply to be so. Since you're gonna believe that Probst sees everything that's going on so he can ask the "right" questions as TC, do so. I'll politely tell you that's incorrect, but you go ahead and believe what you want to believe and let's call it at that. Yeah - I believe what Probst has to say because there's been times during the Reunion show(s) that he's said flat out that he was unaware of "x" at the time (specifically, the original 4 alliance during season 1. Calling them out was just something he went fishing for, and not that he was informed by the production crew or by himself viewing dailies to provide you with a specific example).

As for BB and AR - BB is so something completely different you can't even begin to compare the two. For one, BB is 100% live all the time. Survivor isn't. I don't believe for a minute that Julie pays the least bit of attention to the show other than what PA's and the editors tell her to say/ask. She has got to be one of the worst hosts in the history of television... As for Phil, I'm sure he sees/gets told what is going on, but what does he do? The only interaction that he has with the racers is telling them that they are in position "x" when they come to the mat and telling them that they've been eliminated or not. There's no interaction with him and the racers (like there is between the host of Survivor and the contestants) that he would need to know about other than rules violations when someone forgets a specific task or completes it incorrectly (get off the train at "x" station last week to provide a specific example).

There's hours and hours of footage from Tribal that we never see. He (Probst) has talked about how it goes on and on sometimes while he digs and digs for information.

But, go ahead and believe what you want to believe I guess - you're more than entitled to...


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Mikkel_Knight said:


> according to the 1st Survivor book, yes - the season isn't completed when the 1st episode is put together.
> 
> The only person(s) to know who the winner is include Burnett until a week/week and a half before the season finale.


Do you think that's standard practice or does it depend on the shooting schedule? Haven't there been some seasons where the Survivors are still out there when the season begins airing and others where they've already been home for a bit when the first ep airs?

Although I guess it doesn't really matter what happens in the last several eps when they cut the first one. They know who goes home the first few times to TC and what the initial story will be without necessarily knowing who will make the merge/jury.


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

devdogaz said:


> Do you think that's standard practice or does it depend on the shooting schedule? Haven't there been some seasons where the Survivors are still out there when the season begins airing and others where they've already been home for a bit when the first ep airs?
> 
> Although I guess it doesn't really matter what happens in the last several eps when they cut the first one. They know who goes home the first few times to TC and what the initial story will be without necessarily knowing who will make the merge/jury.


Yeah - there have been some of both (still out there when the season begins and all home and done before the 1st episode airs)

It all is dependant on shooting schedule. 39 days is the actual game. The contestants are sequested for a week before going on location, then will spend 2-3 days getting a crash course in what's good, what's bad, what to avoid and what is safe. They'll do the initial promo shots during this time (cast photos etc.) before they even start the game.


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

I bow to your experience here MK. I would love to be on the show myself but never enough to try. I hope you make it someday!


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Mikkel_Knight said:


> ...No offense, but to me, it just appears as if you are being argumentative simply to be so...


We are both long time members here, so let me say the last thing I'm trying to do is argue just to argue. We just have different opinions.

This is just so "out in left field" to me that I had to call it into question. I just don't see the advantage for Probst NOT to know what's going on. Surely I can't be the only one that thinks that.

Obviously you have a lot of knowledge of the show, and I respect that, but we can still disagree about this


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## jhausmann (Aug 21, 2002)

pmyers said:


> Your exaxtly right. This is not a game show and does not fall under the same scrutiny. I believe they made that change after season 1 when somebody accused the producers of fixing the game.


Again, I'm not a lawyer but it seems to me it would be a violation of US code 47, Section 509 part A3/4

http://uscode.house.gov/uscode-cgi/... USC):CITE AND (USC w/10 (509)):CITE 

What's defined is not the type of show but the contests on a show...

But like I say, I'm not a lawyer and certainly could be wrong.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

While looking for articles on this subject, I came across this article which had a lot of stuff I didn't know, or at least confirmed some stuff:

http://www.realitytvworld.com/news/survivor-host-jeff-probst-dishes-about-survivor-panama-3924.php

This especiall:


> However unlike Guatemala's one-time idol, Panama's Exile Island idol will be re-hidden after every use and rather than having to announce their intention to use it before the tribe members cast their Tribal Council votes, the holder of Panama's idol will be able to withhold their announcement that they plan to use the idol until after the tribe has already voted. Should the person possessing the hidden idol receive the most votes, the person receiving the second most votes will instead be ousted. The hidden idol will be good through the game's Final Four, after which it will no longer hold any power.


As well as this:


> Probst also believes that enthusiasm for the game will translate into popularity with Survivor viewers, predicting that at least two of Survivor: Panama's castaways will emerge as all-time fan favorites and the season itself will be considered one of the long-running reality show's top editions. "You are going to like a lot of people this season," said Probst. "I think we'll see two of the most popular characters we've ever had." "I am saying right now that [Survivor: Panama] will be one of the top five seasons. We will see if the audience agrees."


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## lander215 (Jan 10, 2003)

On the discussion whether Jeff knows what's said on camera without him being there...I happened to be flipping through the channels last night and caught Season 1 on OLN...they were down to the final five and Jeff was on camera talking just to the camera. Lo and behold...what does he talk about? Events that occured the previous day, in camp, without him around. They then moved to reward challenge and Jeff discussed what had happened the previous day (while he wasn't around) with them.

Now, granted, that was season 1 (back when, IMO, it was really a whole lot more interesting to watch the relationships develop), but it's a case where Jeff clearly was privy to what was going on in camp while he wasn't there to see it, so one could surmise that he still is privy to this information even today.

Or not.


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

http://www.realitynewsonline.com/cgi-bin/ae.pl?mode=1&article=article4060.art&page=2

RNO: How much information do you have about tribal dynamics before
Tribal Council starts?

Jeff: I know the basics - if they're eating, if they have fire, etc. But
I don't know the details of personal dynamics. I prefer to not know so I
am not worried about what I ask or what I uncover. I prefer to treat it
like an investigation or group therapy and just go exploring. It's
amazing what you can discover by asking very broad, general questions.
Tribal Council lasts anywhere from 45 minutes to an hour and a half. You
only end up seeing the stuff that applies to the episode, so it feels
like I must have known everything, but that's not the case.

RNO: So, as one example, did you know before Tribal Council that Osten
was going to quit?

Jeff: The topic had come up many times at Tribal Council. He wanted to
quite every single day he was out there. That night when he showed up,
he was shivering. We knew he wanted to go home, we decided to give him a
chance. Our job was to make it as dramatic as possible. I think we
achieved that.

(just to show that I'm not just talking out my ...)


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

lander215 said:


> Now, granted, that was season 1 (back when, IMO, it was really a whole lot more interesting to watch the relationships develop), but it's a case where Jeff clearly was privy to what was going on in camp while he wasn't there to see it, so one could surmise that he still is privy to this information even today.
> 
> Or not.


yeah - he (and more likely Burnett) made changes after S1. There was a near-mutiny from the cast and Jeff was caught in the middle. He now remains separate and aloof, with the only contact/interaction with the Survivors being during challenges and Tribals.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Mikkel_Knight said:


> http://www.realitynewsonline.com/cgi-bin/ae.pl?mode=1&article=article4060.art&page=2


<---eats a little crow

so it looks like he does know some stuff but nothing to the point that I thought he did. I still say that I'd prefer he know everything so he can stir the pot even more and not miss things


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## Mikkel_Knight (Aug 6, 2002)

pmyers said:


> <---eats a little crow
> 
> so it looks like he does know some stuff but nothing to the point that I thought he did. I still say that I'd prefer he know everything so he can stir the pot even more and not miss things


yeah but that isn't part of the game...

It's "Outwit, Outlast, Outplay (each other)" - not "Outwit, Outlast, Outplay (each other AND our camera crew).

What would happen to the individual interviews with people? They need to know that nobody but them is seeing/hearing it. If stuff like that was revealed by Probst during challenges or Tribal, people would clam up and it'd be difficult for producers to write the story lines...


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## Anubys (Jul 16, 2004)

if you ever make it on Survivor, you have to promise to spill the beans on EVERYTHING (not who won, of course)...

the little bits of behind the scenes that were posted from people who talked to Stephanie were fantastic!


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