# Channel Buffer and Tuner Use Question



## leepoffaith (Apr 21, 2014)

Could someone explain to me how the channel buffer and tuner selection work on Tivo Roamio? For some reason I'm just realizing this issue now, but say for instance I'm watching Channel A and a commercial comes on. I go to the guide and tune to channel B. After 10 minutes channel B has a commercial and I change back to channel A. I want to rewind channel A because I've missed part of the show, but there is no channel buffer!! I have 6 tuners, shouldn't they all be buffering for at least 30 minutes on the most recently watched channels? I've tried searching about this, but all I find is "hit the record button." Well, sometimes I don't realize I want to return to that channel if I'm just channel surfing. Not only that, but why should I have to hit record? Why don't the most recent tuned channels stay buffering for 30 minutes? 

Along these same lines, how/why does Roamio choose to keep certain channels on each tuner? I would think it would keep the most recently watched 6 channels on the tuners and buffer each for 30 minutes. I'm hoping there may be an easy fix to this because it's becoming very frustrating. Is there a secret menu or programming that I can do to change this?


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## randrake (Jan 19, 2015)

It sounds like you're just changing the channel on one tuner. What you would want to do is use different tuners for each channel and switch between tuners to have buffers on channels A and B.

So on tuner 1, put it on channel A. Tuner 2 to channel B. Then switch between tuners by either pressing the Live TV button which cycles through each tuner or use the right arrow then down arrow to see the tuner list then select from there.


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## leepoffaith (Apr 21, 2014)

randrake said:


> It sounds like you're just changing the channel on one tuner. What you would want to do is use different tuners for each channel and switch between tuners to have buffers on channels A and B.


That's EXACTLY what I want to do. Could you tell me why it's only using one tuner and how do I get it to use multiple tuners instead?


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## randrake (Jan 19, 2015)

Reread the last post I put. I edited it but I think you posted your follow up at the same time. But I think my edit which is the next line from what you quoted will help.


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## randrake (Jan 19, 2015)

Oh and the arrow method can only be done when there is nothing TiVo on the screen. Like no buffer status bar, show information, etc. Just the actual show or movie. If anything TiVo is on the screen at the moment, the arrow method from the remote won't work until it falls off the screen.


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## leepoffaith (Apr 21, 2014)

Ok, this may sound dumb, but how do I control tuner 2? I just switch channels through the guide normally. I'm not aware I could control the tuners separately.


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## L David Matheny (Jan 29, 2011)

leepoffaith said:


> Ok, this may sound dumb, but how do I control tuner 2? I just switch channels through the guide normally. I'm not aware I could control the tuners separately.


You cycle through the tuners with the Live TV button, and when you get to one tuned to a program you're not watching (so you don't mind clearing the buffer), then you use the Guide button (or channel up/down) to select a different channel for that tuner. When you pause something, you cycle back to the other show you're watching by using the Live TV button.


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

Just hit record, and avoid the buffer game. Much easier that way, you KNOW it is there, and in fact can go watch something from your NPL and then not have to flip content. 

Feel free to play with the buffers, lots of folks do, this is just an alternative that lets you watch what you want without interruption or risk of a bad button push messing with your experience.


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## leepoffaith (Apr 21, 2014)

L David Matheny said:


> You cycle through the tuners with the Live TV button, and when you get to one tuned to a program you're not watching (so you don't mind clearing the buffer), then you use the Guide button (or channel up/down) to select a different channel for that tuner. When you pause something, you cycle back to the other show you're watching by using the Live TV button.


Thank you!! I never knew what the live tv button did. On my old Fios boxes it would fast forward a tv show to live, but that was it. I wonder why Tivo doesn't automatically just switch tuners when you change channels. To me that seems like the logical thing to do. Either way, this is great


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

I think once you understand the dynamic tuner allocation you will grow to like it. There is a thread of that on the Mini forum. The arrow right then down is a good tool. Also, the DVR diagnostics can show you what each tuner is doing but it's a bit more than you need. If you do look at that diag, the cable card is shown at the end. Try different ways to select a channel: direct input, guide and up/down. You will learn the tricks and the restrictions. It's fun for a cold winter night.


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## humbb (Jan 27, 2014)

randrake said:


> Oh and the arrow method can only be done when there is nothing TiVo on the screen. Like no buffer status bar, show information, etc. Just the actual show or movie. If anything TiVo is on the screen at the moment, the arrow method from the remote won't work until it falls off the screen.


If you can't wait for the screen to clear (like me), you can immediately press "Info" which will bring up the multi-function screen (including tuner select option) even if there is still something Tivo on the screen.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

He does make a good point though. It would certainly be better if while you happened to be watching live tv if you changed channels using the guide, digits or or channel up that it automatically switched to another tuner that wasn't recording anything or being used by a mini, so you could preserve the buffer and start a new one on the new channel. If there are no available tuners at that point, so be it then you lose the buffer. Still better than the way it is now and the workarounds suggested.


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## randrake (Jan 19, 2015)

HarperVision said:


> He does make a good point though. It would certainly be better if while you happened to be watching live tv if you changed channels using the guide, digits or or channel up that it automatically switched to another tuner that wasn't recording anything or being used by a mini, so you could preserve the buffer and start a new one on the new channel. If there are no available tuners at that point, so be it then you lose the buffer. Still better than the way it is now and the workarounds suggested.


Actually I should test it but since the new update, my Mini does that. If I turn it to Live TV then change the channel to something another tuner the Roamio has on, it switches to that tuner. So as long as I know what channels are being used by the Roamio's tuners I can bounce between them on the Mini. I posted in the release notes thread about it. I rather switch tuners than to waste space doing the record method especially when just looking at TV through the Roamio.


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## randrake (Jan 19, 2015)

humbb said:


> If you can't wait for the screen to clear (like me), you can immediately press "Info" which will bring up the multi-function screen (including tuner select option) even if there is still something Tivo on the screen.


Right there is that too. I vaguely remembered how to do that since I don't do that often or barely at all so I didn't mention it. lol But yes that works.


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## worachj (Oct 14, 2006)

Once you have the two tuners setup correctly, you can just hit the Enter/Last button and toggle between the two tuners. You have to first manually select the two tuners using methods explained above.


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## Bytez (Sep 11, 2004)

I wish Tivo would let us change the buffer limit.


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## h2oskierc (Dec 16, 2010)

Bytez said:


> I wish Tivo would let us change the buffer limit.


:up: +1 With how easy it is to upgrade the hard drive, I would love a 1 hour buffer.


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

h2oskierc said:


> :up: +1 With how easy it is to upgrade the hard drive, I would love a 1 hour buffer.


If we're going to drift, how about variable size, variable skip and variable queing? Like Sony DHG? It doesn't have a disable either.


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## Diana Collins (Aug 21, 2002)

HarperVision said:


> He does make a good point though. It would certainly be better if while you happened to be watching live tv if you changed channels using the guide, digits or or channel up that it automatically switched to another tuner that wasn't recording anything or being used by a mini, so you could preserve the buffer and start a new one on the new channel. If there are no available tuners at that point, so be it then you lose the buffer. Still better than the way it is now and the workarounds suggested.


Suppose you want to do this with 3 channels? How would the TiVo know which background tuner was available for the new channel? Then you have the issue of Minis...if someone on a Mini chooses one of the channels you are buffering the TiVo will give that tuner to the Mini, making it unavailable for viewing at the DVR.

The Mini issue is why using record is the better option.


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## leepoffaith (Apr 21, 2014)

It seems to me that it's a pretty easy fix. 

No Mini's In Use: Sequentially use all 6 tuners and once all six are used you start loosing the buffer on the tuner that hasn't been use the longest.

Mini's In Use: The buffer of the tuner that hasn't been used the longest is dropped and that tuner is used for the mini. Then if more minis are used the tuners are taken in the same order. 

If FiOS can accomplish this I'm SURE Tivo can figure it out. It's not a deal breaker to me, but just a feature I'd like. If nothing else, the absolute minimum Tivo could do is switch between 2 tuners when switching channels.


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

leepoffaith said:


> It seems to me that it's a pretty easy fix.
> 
> No Mini's In Use: Sequentially use all 6 tuners and once all six are used you start loosing the buffer on the tuner that hasn't been use the longest.
> 
> ...


When switching channels the TiVo will switch tuners if there is a free tuner on the selected channel. This is why you can't manually set all channels to the same number without a reset.


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## Diana Collins (Aug 21, 2002)

leepoffaith said:


> It seems to me that it's a pretty easy fix.
> 
> No Mini's In Use: Sequentially use all 6 tuners and once all six are used you start loosing the buffer on the tuner that hasn't been use the longest.
> 
> ...


You still have the problem of Mini use of background buffers. For example, if I have ESPN buffering on background tuner while I watch a baseball game on TBS, and someone on a Mini selects ESPN, the TiVo will give that tuner to the Mini, with buffer intact. Some people LIKE that behavior.

So to use your strategy, even if I already had a tuner on ESPN, the Mini would have to get the "least recently used" tuner, and so would have no ESPN buffer. BTW: "least recently used" by who? The viewer at the TiVo (least recently in the foreground), a least recently used for recording, or the least recently used by a Mini?


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## leepoffaith (Apr 21, 2014)

Diana Collins said:


> You still have the problem of Mini use of background buffers. For example, if I have ESPN buffering on background tuner while I watch a baseball game on TBS, and someone on a Mini selects ESPN, the TiVo will give that tuner to the Mini, with buffer intact. Some people LIKE that behavior.
> 
> So to use your strategy, even if I already had a tuner on ESPN, the Mini would have to get the "least recently used" tuner, and so would have no ESPN buffer. BTW: "least recently used" by who? The viewer at the TiVo (least recently in the foreground), a least recently used for recording, or the least recently used by a Mini?


I see your point with the Mini tuning to the same channel and losing the buffer. This isn't a big deal for me since I don't "pause in one room and watch it in another." Least recently used by the Roamio for live viewing. I'm starting to see why you may not want to give all 6 tuners for channel surfing, but how about 2 of the 6? It's just silly to me that if I change the channel, but then go back to the previous channel I lose the buffer. I'd much rather keep that buffer and allow the mini to lose any buffer when tuning to the same channel.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

Diana Collins said:


> You still have the problem of Mini use of background buffers. For example, if I have ESPN buffering on background tuner while I watch a baseball game on TBS, and someone on a Mini selects ESPN, the TiVo will give that tuner to the Mini, with buffer intact. Some people LIKE that behavior. So to use your strategy, even if I already had a tuner on ESPN, the Mini would have to get the "least recently used" tuner, and so would have no ESPN buffer. BTW: "least recently used" by who? The viewer at the TiVo (least recently in the foreground), a least recently used for recording, or the least recently used by a Mini?


How about a logic tree that says if a mini asks for a channel that's already tuned on DVR, then it gives it that, if not then it gives the least used? As soon as the mini that tuned the same channel asks for a different one, then it hops off that tuner, sees if the DVR happens to have that new particular channel, if so, tune, if not , next least used tuner.


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## SRAINESS (Jan 14, 2008)

Looking to do kind of the same thing, but really would like to keep all the tuners on separate channels. Lets just say i record prime broadcast channels... abc, cbs, ... I would not necessarily like to 'record' all, but keep a tuner on each. I can go through manually via info and set the tuners to the channels i want, but the next day they have all changed, even though there were no recordings. I like to bounce back and forth especially during the late evening news hour, but all the channels have changed.

Any thoughts ?


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

SRAINESS said:


> Looking to do kind of the same thing, but really would like to keep all the tuners on separate channels. Lets just say i record prime broadcast channels... abc, cbs, ... I would not necessarily like to 'record' all, but keep a tuner on each. I can go through manually via info and set the tuners to the channels i want, but the next day they have all changed, even though there were no recordings. I like to bounce back and forth especially during the late evening news hour, but all the channels have changed.
> 
> Any thoughts ?


Standby mode? I never see a tuner move to a different channel unless there is a reason. Does the History show anything unexpected? It has a tendency to remember actions for a long time. In fact, I don't know how to make it stop logging events that are no longer needed.


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## samccfl99 (Sep 7, 2013)

SRAINESS said:


> Looking to do kind of the same thing, but really would like to keep all the tuners on separate channels. Lets just say i record prime broadcast channels... abc, cbs, ... I would not necessarily like to 'record' all, but keep a tuner on each. I can go through manually via info and set the tuners to the channels i want, but the next day they have all changed, even though there were no recordings. I like to bounce back and forth especially during the late evening news hour, but all the channels have changed.
> 
> Any thoughts ?


This is actually the best feature of the tivo in my opinion. on boot, i set up all six tuners on the channels i want. by the end of the nite, i return them to what i like them to be on in the morning. i NEVER use the LAST button because that was really made for 2 tuner boxes. it really does not have a good function anymore, it just destroys your current buffer. when i am on live tv i always just punch in the channel i want or live tv button thru all of them. it would be nice if they would allow 60 min buffers on tivos with bigger hard drives. i never knew about the right/down arrow display.


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

Why not record all of the news you may watch, with the keep one option. They stay fresh and you don't have to worry about an errant button push. Not sure if you can do that with manual repeated recordings as I never use that function...


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## SRAINESS (Jan 14, 2008)

If i actually record all the 'tuners', i would undoubtedly forget and run out of space. I would just like the tuners to stay on the channels i leave them, and not change for whatever reason. It especially makes no sense when i go back and look at the tuners the next day and I see 3 on the same channel.


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

If recording the news, and you set the 1P to keep only one, it will not fill up your drive. When the next day comes it will delete yesterdays broadcast. Many folks here do that. 

Do what you want, but this seems to help address at least part of your concern.


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

SRAINESS said:


> If i actually record all the 'tuners', i would undoubtedly forget and run out of space. I would just like the tuners to stay on the channels i leave them, and not change for whatever reason. It especially makes no sense when i go back and look at the tuners the next day and I see 3 on the same channel.


I would be very interested how you get 3 tuners on the same channel without a power cycle.


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

Interestingly, that's what I found last evening on my Roamio standard. It's possible that I had done that inadvertently the day before in selecting what to watch, but I wonder--2 channels, maybe, but 3?


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## humbb (Jan 27, 2014)

SRAINESS said:


> Looking to do kind of the same thing, but really would like to keep all the tuners on separate channels. Lets just say i record prime broadcast channels... abc, cbs, ... I would not necessarily like to 'record' all, but keep a tuner on each. *I can go through manually via info and set the tuners to the channels i want, but the next day they have all changed, even though there were no recordings.* I like to bounce back and forth especially during the late evening news hour, but all the channels have changed.
> 
> Any thoughts ?


Do you have suggestions turned on? You may not be aware of these recordings occurring overnight which will also scramble your tuners.


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## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

JoeKustra said:


> I would be very interested how you get 3 tuners on the same channel without a power cycle.


If you have multiple recordings on the same channel back to back to back, with overlap padding, each one can take a tuner. You can have three recordings going at once on a single channel, but three tuners, doing that.


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

astrohip said:


> If you have multiple recordings on the same channel back to back to back, with overlap padding, each one can take a tuner. You can have three recordings going at once on a single channel, but three tuners, doing that.


That works. However it takes a manual adjustment. The OP can't explain why there are changes to the tuners without manual intervention. I can't either.


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## SRAINESS (Jan 14, 2008)

humbb said:


> Do you have suggestions turned on? You may not be aware of these recordings occurring overnight which will also scramble your tuners.


Suggestions not turned on. Going with recording those stations with a 2 day retention. Works well, but last weekend multiple tuners again on same channel (only recording during week so not sure why they changed). Only other thing that i was recording were web downloads from Download Manager. That is broken now, so cant be that.


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## SRAINESS (Jan 14, 2008)

Well now this is something. It seems unlike my FiOS dvr it looks like you cant specify what 'time' Tivo will only record on OnePass ? Unless i missed it..
It seems that local ABC news at 11:00MM rebroadcasts again at 2:00AM the next day and considers this show a 1st Run. So it looks like i will have to raise the 2 show limit to 4 if i want to keep two nights.

Any thoughts ?


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

SRAINESS said:


> Well now this is something. It seems unlike my FiOS dvr it looks like you cant specify what 'time' Tivo will only record on OnePass ? Unless i missed it..
> It seems that local ABC news at 11:00MM rebroadcasts again at 2:00AM the next day and considers this show a 1st Run. So it looks like i will have to raise the 2 show limit to 4 if i want to keep two nights.
> 
> *Any thoughts *?


None that I can post or I will get banned from the forum.

However, last night my cable went out due to a truck hitting a pole. So The Daily Show did not record. I just noticed it is recording now as "new" even though it was shown last night. This is on a Roamio. But it is The Daily Show. Not a TiVo guide favorite.


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## SRAINESS (Jan 14, 2008)

would be nice if i could specify 'only record' on this channel at this time.
Did the old Tivo's use to do that ?


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

SRAINESS said:


> would be nice if i could specify 'only record' on this channel at this time.
> Did the old Tivo's use to do that ?


On this channel? Yes. At "this" time? Not so much. My experience only goes back to Premiere. A specified channel works on the Roamio too.


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## Diana Collins (Aug 21, 2002)

SRAINESS said:


> Well now this is something. It seems unlike my FiOS dvr it looks like you cant specify what 'time' Tivo will only record on OnePass ? Unless i missed it..
> It seems that local ABC news at 11:00MM rebroadcasts again at 2:00AM the next day and considers this show a 1st Run. So it looks like i will have to raise the 2 show limit to 4 if i want to keep two nights.
> 
> Any thoughts ?


That sounds like more of a guide data problem. The TiVo will not record two identical broadcasts as long as they have the same program ID. If your TiVo records the news at 11, and then records the SAME news broadcast at 2, it is because, in the data, the 2 AM program is not listed as a rebroadcast, but rather as a completely new broadcast.

The easiest solution is to do a manual recording for the channel and time. While this isn't perfect (won't catch a schedule change, like the news being scheduled for 11:30 one night because of an extra long primetime program) those issues will be less common that a duplicate recording every night.


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## SRAINESS (Jan 14, 2008)

That may work. Will give it a shot.


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