# Launch Fail: Best Buy hasn't heard of the TiVo Roamio OTA



## SeattleGuy206 (Sep 14, 2014)

Knowing Best Buy's tendency toward bad service and terrible inventory control I decided to call my local store to see if they had it. I waited on the phone for 15 minutes, finally got someone who had no idea what I was talking about. She said without the number she couldn't look it up on the website. Clearly she had better things to do, when I said I was looking at the TiVo website where it clearly states it is launching at Best Buy today, she sighed heavily and threw me back on hold. 

If I had known that all they were going to do was look it up on their consumer facing website I would have saved the call. She had never heard anything about the Best Buy exclusive and clearly had no idea what the OTA was about.

I called TiVo. He said they should have it in the stores listed on the website, but couldn't answer why Best Buy had no idea. The store I called was listed. 

Thinking it was a local issue I called the Best Buy 800 number. Got someone on the line. Not only did she not know about OTA, but she didn't know how to spell TiVo. I'm not sure she knew what a TiVo was. She tried calling the store, I waited for nearly 10 minutes. She comes back on and says the store hung up on her. We'll at least they are consistently bad.

TiVo - very bad idea to launch with Best Buy. Can you make it available on amazon.com so we can actually buy it? You have someone here ready to buy, who isn't complaining about the $15 a month. Simple.TV is starting to look good.


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## manhole (Apr 15, 2005)

It's very disappointing that tivo went this direction with the OTA. I was hoping they would add a 4-tuner OTA to the Roamio Plus and release it as a new product.


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## timchi29 (Feb 26, 2005)

This is the norm for best buy. They are horrible!


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## ncted (May 13, 2007)

Assuming you are in Seattle by your forum ID, here are the Best Buys in your state who will get the Roamio OTA:

Bellevue (Store 498)
457 120th Avenue NE
Bellevue , WA 98005

Bellingham (Store 359)
4281 Meridan St
Bellingham , WA 98226

E Spokane (Store 355)
15223 East Indiana Avenue
E Spokane , WA 99216

Everett (Store 566)
1402 SE Everett Mall Way
Everett , WA 98208

Federal Way (Store 372)
31601 Pacific Hwy South
Federal Way , WA 98003

Lynnwood (Store 477)
19225 Alderwood Mall Pkwy
Lynnwood , WA 98036

Seattle-Northgate (Store 470)
330 NE Northgate Way
Seattle-Northgate , WA 98125

Spokane North (Store 362)
9970 N Newport Hwy
Spokane North , WA 99218

Tacoma (Store 830)
2214 South 48th Street
Tacoma , WA 98409

Tukwila (Store 447)
17304 Southcenter Parkway
Tukwila , WA 98188


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

Tivo didnt ship them yet. I posted this in the other thread



> my best buy (Minnesota) they said the 28th for in store but you can order it and have it shipped to your home or the store
> 
> I ordered one and it will come the 17th


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=520939

also has the sku listed. I posted a copy of my order


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

timchi29 said:


> This is the norm for best buy. They are horrible!


Tivo hasn't shipped the products to them yet. You can't sell what you don't have.


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## timchi29 (Feb 26, 2005)

Captainbob said:


> Tivo hasn't shipped the products to them yet. You can't sell what you don't have.


You can at least have a clue what you committed on selling.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

timchi29 said:


> You can at least have a clue what you committed on selling.


THis is BestBuy. They typically don't have a clue about most of the products they sell.


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## joetekcor (Sep 15, 2014)

My Best Buy, which was on the list, didn't have the Tivo OTA either. Luckily the first employee who didn't know anything about it led me to their home theater guru. He was able to search the system and find the SKU. They had stock in the warehouse just nothing in the stores. He was able to order one for me and I'll pick it up Thursday.
He said there was a similar situation when the Roku stick came out. Roku had announced a date but they hadn't actually made it to the stores by then.
Don't know who's to blame here. Best Buy for not having stock in the stores or TiVo for announcing a date and not getting the boxes to BB in time to make it through their inventory system.


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

Check out this page, because now the Best Buy stores that are listed by each state, also have the day they will have some in stock. Some stores won't have any until the middle of November. https://www.tivo.com/discover/antenna


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## dcline414 (May 1, 2014)

Captainbob said:


> Check out this page, because now the Best Buy stores that are listed by each state, also have the day they will have some in stock. Some stores won't have any until the middle of November. https://www.tivo.com/discover/antenna


Guessing you could still special order it with the SKU... but why would you want a DVR that can't ever be expanded to use with minis on other TVs?


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

dcline414 said:


> Guessing you could still special order it with the SKU... but why would you want a DVR that can't ever be expanded to use with minis on other TVs?


I already have Roamio Basic, which gets used on one TV. I , and probably many other people, don't have TV's all over the house, but in one room. I need a mini as much as a fish needs bicycle.


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## drew68 (Mar 2, 2010)

dcline414 said:


> Guessing you could still special order it with the SKU... but why would you want a DVR that can't ever be expanded to use with minis on other TVs?


Speaking for myself only, I have no interest in MRV or anything Mini related. The fact that the OTA does not support the mini is of no concern to me. i will be happy for the upgrade from my series 3 Tivo HD. I certainly get why others would be disappointed, but in this household it's a non issue.


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## dcline414 (May 1, 2014)

Captainbob said:


> I need a mini as much as a fish needs bicycle.


Who are we to say what fish need?

A 10-Year-Old Goldfish Had Surgery To Remove A Tumor, Expected To Live Another 20 Years


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

drew68 said:


> The fact that the OTA does not support the mini is of no concern to me. i will be happy for the upgrade from my series 3 Tivo HD. I certainly get why others would be disappointed, but in this household it's a non issue.


same here
upgrading from a Tivo HD that still has the stock 21hr drive in it


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## turbobuick86 (May 3, 2002)

At $14.99/mo the Roamio OTA most expensive dvr tivo has ever produced if you take it out 4-5 yrs. More than lifetime with their best product.

I was told 3 days ago, I couldn't swap in an OTA Roamio for $99/year. Today I get an email saying that $14.99 is good for all tivos in the home. Very odd how this all came to be. Is the OTA included in that deal? Just poor marketing. https://us-mg5.mail.yahoo.com/neo/launch?.rand=b1ue7vma235ed

That deal does nothing for me anyway, as one unit is on lifetime and one unit is annual $99.

Tivo makes it so difficult to stay loyal. I do their surveys and for the longest time I did beta. Tivo is the best dvr out there, but it's not a great bargain and there are other alternatives.


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

turbobuick86 said:


> At $14.99/mo the Roamio OTA most expensive dvr tivo has ever produced if you take it out 4-5 yrs. More than lifetime with their best product.
> 
> I was told 3 days ago, I couldn't swap in an OTA Roamio for $99/year. Today I get an email saying that $14.99 is good for all tivos in the home. Very odd how this all came to be. Is the OTA included in that deal? Just poor marketing. https://us-mg5.mail.yahoo.com/neo/launch?.rand=b1ue7vma235ed
> 
> ...


I'm one of the people that lifetime doesn't appeal to at all. I know all the arguments about cost after 4 years, yada yada, but I would much rather pay $15 a month for three years, and then being at the break even point, decide if I want to keep paying the $15 a month, or throw my Tivo out and get a brand new model to match my brand new 2018 model 8K TV that I bought for $800......

Seriously, I have mentioned to more than a few people, about the $500 lifetime option, after I purchased my Roamio, and nobody I have discussed this with so far ( and these are people that are financially well off) , thought that spending $500 on a DVR subscription in advance, was something they were anxious to do. So I think there are quite a few people that would go in the direction I chose and just pay the monthly fee for the Guide, software updates, emails, tech support, and the other advantages that they get from the Tivo.

By the way, lots of luck with the "other alternatives". I have researched this for awhile and haven't come up with any yet, that are satisfactory.


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## socrplyr (Jul 19, 2006)

turbobuick86 said:


> At $14.99/mo the Roamio OTA most expensive dvr tivo has ever produced if you take it out 4-5 yrs. More than lifetime with their best product.


Nice try but Roamio Pro is $600 + $500 = $1100. OTA is $950 for 5 years. Pricing is not great, but not crazy either. If you estimate the subsidy on the box vs the Basic Roamio ($200) to be about $100 (it is $50 cheaper to produce), plus the cost of lifetime ($500), you get $600. $600/15 = 40 months. So really, the break even difference is about 3.5 years (giving a little bit in for inflation). That isn't terrible.

Now if you figure for discounted lifetime ($400), it is closer to 3 years, still not crazy bad.

Personally, I would pay the extra money and get the basic Roamio and lifetime (due to mini support, lifetime option, and cable support), but I don't think the OTA is a terrible option.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

$14.99 is the cost of service for all TiVos if you go monthly. It's not more expensive for the OTA. So if you bought any TiVo and paid monthly for 4-5 years the only difference would be the hardware cost, in which case the OTA is the cheapest TiVo ever offered.

There are a few catches though...

1) They require a 2 year commitment, where all others are just 1

2) They do not offer lifetime, which is a better deal then monthly long term

3) They do not offer a multi-service discount so even if you have multiple OTA units they're all $14.99/mo. (with other TiVos you get a discounted rate of $12.99/mo for additional units)

4) They do not support the Mini.

The only one of those that is a real deal breaker in my eyes is the lack of Mini support. I'm not sure why they chose to limit that.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Well it looks like initial reports were wrong and the OTA does in fact support the Mini. So in that case it's really not a bad deal if you were going to pay monthly anyway. If I were in the market for an OTA only DVR I might get one.


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## dcline414 (May 1, 2014)

Dan203 said:


> Well it looks like initial reports were wrong and the OTA does in fact support the Mini.


Would be nice to have this officially confirmed once and for all from Margaret or someone high ranking that has knowledge and authority to speak on the matter.

It was initially advertised as mini and stream compatible, then officially confirmed to not support the mini, and now rumored to actually work. It makes more sense that it WOULD support the mini than that it wouldn't, but I'm not going to jump in the middle of all this confusion and misinformation.

If the mini is confirmed to be supported, I'm in for a Roamio OTA, a mini, and a stream. If not then I'm done buying Tivo hardware and will stick with my premiere.


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

dcline414 said:


> Would be nice to have this officially confirmed once and for all from Margaret or someone high ranking that has knowledge and authority to speak on the matter.
> 
> It was initially advertised as mini and stream compatible, then officially confirmed to not support the mini, and now rumored to actually work. It makes more sense that it WOULD support the mini than that it wouldn't, but I'm not going to jump in the middle of all this confusion and misinformation.
> 
> If the mini is confirmed to be supported, I'm in for a Roamio OTA, a mini, and a stream. If not then I'm done buying Tivo hardware and will stick with my premiere.


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10242632#post10242632


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Captainbob said:


> I'm one of the people that lifetime doesn't appeal to at all. I know all the arguments about cost after 4 years, yada yada, but I would much rather pay $15 a month for three years, and then being at the break even point, decide if I want to keep paying the $15 a month, or throw my Tivo out and get a brand new model to match my brand new 2018 model 8K TV that I bought for $800......
> 
> Seriously, I have mentioned to more than a few people, about the $500 lifetime option, after I purchased my Roamio, and nobody I have discussed this with so far ( and these are people that are financially well off) , thought that spending $500 on a DVR subscription in advance, was something they were anxious to do. So I think there are quite a few people that would go in the direction I chose and just pay the monthly fee for the Guide, software updates, emails, tech support, and the other advantages that they get from the Tivo.
> 
> By the way, lots of luck with the "other alternatives". I have researched this for awhile and haven't come up with any yet, that are satisfactory.


There are many people like that. Those are the same people that have no problem paying hundreds to thousands extra over every couple of years for a subsidized phone too. But everyone can choose what they want. For instance, I don't my paying the $6.95 a month for my OTA Roamio Basic indefinitely. I've been paying it since I got a TiVoHD monthly six or seven years ago. It is the only TiVo I've ever had on monthly. But TiVo keeps letting me move it to newer boxes. The worst thing about the monthly option though is that there isn't much residual value left in the TiVo. With a lifetime TiVo you can sell it for several hundred when you are finished with it. Which further reduces your cost.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Captainbob said:


> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10242632#post10242632





Dan203 said:


> Well it looks like initial reports were wrong and the OTA does in fact support the Mini. So in that case it's really not a bad deal if you were going to pay monthly anyway. If I were in the market for an OTA only DVR I might get one.


 WTF!! Now did they actually plan for it to work with the Mini all along or did they just change their minds recently? Because it was very clear with what they said before that it would not work as a host for the Mini.


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## dcline414 (May 1, 2014)

aaronwt said:


> WTF!! Now did they actually plan for it to work with the Mini all along or did they just change their minds recently? Because it was very clear with what they said before that it would not work as a host for the Mini.


Exactly.

A secondhand forum posting that quotes a social media communication does not constitute an official announcement. Especially when the OPPOSITE information was "confirmed" the same way last week.

The product page should be updated along with a press release correcting the original announcement (and perhaps apologizing for their stupidity confirming false information as true) would be a good start.


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

aaronwt said:


> There are many people like that. Those are the same people that have no problem paying hundreds to thousands extra over every couple of years for a subsidized phone too. But everyone can choose what they want. For instance, I don't my paying the $6.95 a month for my OTA Roamio Basic indefinitely. I've been paying it since I got a TiVoHD monthly six or seven years ago. It is the only TiVo I've ever had on monthly. But TiVo keeps letting me move it to newer boxes. The worst thing about the monthly option though is that there isn't much residual value left in the TiVo. With a lifetime TiVo you can sell it for several hundred when you are finished with it. Which further reduces your cost.


Well you cannot count me in the group you are describing. I have a Nexus 4 phone that I bought outright and I paid $350 for, a year and a half ago, and I now pay $30 a month for my smartphone service which includes 5 gigs of data a month and unlimited text. The idea of dropping $500 today, so that I don't have to worry about paying $15 a month 4 years from now, if my Tivo is still working then, or doesn't need to be replaced my a model with newer features, just doesn't make any sense to me. This is compounded by the new selling price of the OTA, so for $50 I could get a brand new Tivo. Don't have to worry about power supplies , hard drives failing, power surges damaging inputs and tuners, 4K capability in the future, new features that I may not have, Tivo dropping the monthly subscription fee in the future to attract more Tivo owners which devalues my lifetime investment, etc.. etc..

Since I made my living in repairing and maintaining electronics of all sorts, the idea of buying a 4 year old used piece of electronic gear from some stranger on Ebay, banking on the possibility that after I own it for a month, it won't blow up makes zero sense. So if I wouldn't even consider such a purchase, the idea of trying to talk someone else into a deal like that so I could recoup some money and get a more up to date product to replace the 4 year old one, would make me feel like a used car salesman. For $15 a month, it just isn't worth the aggravation.


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## Diana Collins (Aug 21, 2002)

Dan203 said:


> ...There are a few catches though...
> 
> 1) They require a 2 year commitment, where all others are just 1...


According to the TiVo website it is a one year requirement, not two. The "fine print" from the website:



> *Taxes may apply to DVR purchase and/or monthly service fee. $75 early termination fee applies if service cancelled prior to fulfillment of 1-year commitment. Recurring $14.99/mo service fee continues on month-to-month base after fulfillment of 1-year commitment. Product Lifetime service subscription option and multi-service discount not available with TiVo Roamio OTA offer.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

dcline414 said:


> Exactly.
> 
> A secondhand forum posting that quotes a social media communication does not constitute an official announcement. Especially when the OPPOSITE information was "confirmed" the same way last week.
> 
> The product page should be updated along with a press release correcting the original announcement (and perhaps apologizing for their stupidity confirming false information as true) would be a good start.




__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/512001033057210370
A twitter post by Margret is where we got the info it wouldn't work, so this should be just as good for confirming it does.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Diana Collins said:


> According to the TiVo website it is a one year requirement, not two. The "fine print" from the website:


Hmmm... they must of changed that as well. So the negatives are becoming less and less.

I wonder if you can get lifetime after the commitment period?


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## Diana Collins (Aug 21, 2002)

It DOES still say no lifetime service and no MSD (although I'm sure some will construe the wording of the fine print to mean no LT or MSD during the commitment period).


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

Dan203 said:


> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/512001033057210370
> A twitter post by Margret is where we got the info it wouldn't work, so this should be just as good for confirming it does.


There is a picture of the side of the box on another thread, and it says right on the box that it will work with the Mini.......


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Diana Collins said:


> It DOES still say no lifetime service and no MSD (although I'm sure some will construe the wording of the fine print to mean no LT or MSD during the commitment period).


At that point you might as well buy a Basic though. After a year of monthly you will have paid $180 in service. Maybe if you could get one and immediately pay the ETF then it would be an OK deal since that would be $125. But we've seen the Roamio Basic for sale as low as $150 on Amazon so it's not a huge saving.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

Its a 1 year commitment and its 14.99. There is no other options for pricing (no lifetime, no yearly)


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## dcline414 (May 1, 2014)

unclehonkey said:


> Its a 1 year commitment and its 14.99. There is no other options for pricing (no lifetime, no yearly)


Our premiere was $20 per month for the first year, then we had the option of staying month-to-month for $20 or sign for another year to lower the price to $15 per month. We just finished another 1 year commitment, and I am hoping we can get $99 lifetime now that we've paid $15-$20 per month for 3 years.

I wonder what the Roamio OTA options will be after the first year. I'm guessing at some point there will be a lifetime conversion option for it too. $15 for 3 years is only $540, so with $50 equipment cost and $99 lifetime service conversion, the 3 year cost totals $689. A Roamio basic with lifetime service costs $700, and it all must be paid up front.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

dcline414 said:


> Our premiere was $20 per month for the first year, then we had the option of staying month-to-month for $20 or sign for another year to lower the price to $15 per month. We just finished another 1 year commitment, and I am hoping we can get $99 lifetime now that we've paid $15-$20 per month for 3 years.
> 
> I wonder what the Roamio OTA options will be after the first year. I'm guessing at some point there will be a lifetime conversion option for it too. $15 for 3 years is only $540, so with $50 equipment cost and $99 lifetime service conversion, the 3 year cost totals $689. A Roamio basic with lifetime service costs $700, and it all must be paid up front.


That is the retail cost. You can get the Roamio Basic for $170 from Amazon. And Lifetime service is only $400 with the PLSR code. So $570 is the total cost at most. Not $700.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Yeah but it's still not a bad deal if your finances are limited. $50 and $15/mo is a lot easier to swallow for some then $570 right now.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

Dan203 said:


> Yeah but it's still not a bad deal if your finances are limited. $50 and $15/mo is a lot easier to swallow for some then $570 right now.


agreed. And thats why I upgraded
I can spring for $15 a month...


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## trailmix (May 18, 2009)

Has anyone been able to buy this yet? There was an earlier mention of the Best Buy location finder including specific dates as to when each store would receive the OTA, but they must have scrubbed those because I don't see them. Maybe they are further delayed? Strange that they don't show up on bestbuy.com either.


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