# Which tuning adapter is best to use with Tivo Premiere?



## az1097 (Apr 3, 2013)

I have service with Time Warner Cable and used a Cisco brand tuning adapter with my old Tivo HD and after complaining to TWC they sent a Motorola brand replacement. Now I have a Tivo Premiere and want to know about any known issues with either brand of tuning adapter and which would be best used with the Premier. Thanks.


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## ajwees41 (May 7, 2006)

you have to use what ever your area uses. who makes the cable boxes used in your area?


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## az1097 (Apr 3, 2013)

Time Warner cable provided both tuning adapters.


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## ajwees41 (May 7, 2006)

az1097 said:


> Time Warner cable provided both tuning adapters.


maybe they are switching to all Motorola equipment.


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## malverde (Mar 13, 2007)

ajwees41 said:


> maybe they are switching to all Motorola equipment.


The tuning adapter has to be compatible with the cable card. It's highly dependent on whichever cable card your provider is using.


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## SNJpage1 (May 25, 2006)

Why do you need a tuning adapter if you have a cable card?


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## malverde (Mar 13, 2007)

SNJpage1 said:


> Why do you need a tuning adapter if you have a cable card?


The tuning adapter handles a technology called "Switched Digital Video". Basically, the cable company (in order to save bandwidth) will only send the channels to you that you are actually watching (or recording). The tuning adapter handles the request on behalf of the cable card.


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## tatergator1 (Mar 27, 2008)

SNJpage1 said:


> Why do you need a tuning adapter if you have a cable card?


The devices serve two distinct purposes, and it is very common for both to be required. CC for decryption, etc; TA to act as an intermediary between the Tivo and the cable company head-end to make request for SDV channels.


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

az1097 said:


> I have service with Time Warner Cable and used a Cisco brand tuning adapter with my old Tivo HD and after complaining to TWC they sent a Motorola brand replacement. Now I have a Tivo Premiere and want to know about any known issues with either brand of tuning adapter and which would be best used with the Premier. Thanks.


Brand for brand they are, neither better or worse.
Time Warner issues Cisco brand here in Torrance. Don't like it; but got to have it... if I want to receive all channels.

The real answer is for the cable co to step up and improve their infrastructure, i.e., install a bigger pipe.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Teeps said:


> Brand for brand they are, neither better or worse.
> Time Warner issues Cisco brand here in Torrance. Don't like it; but got to have it... if I want to receive all channels.
> 
> The real answer is for the cable co to step up and improve their infrastructure, i.e., install a bigger pipe.


Or switch to a more efficient encoding algorithm, like H.264. Which makes better use of the existing bandwidth since H.264 uses less bandwidth than MPEG2 to achieve the same video quality.


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## ajwees41 (May 7, 2006)

aaronwt said:


> Or switch to a more efficient encoding algorithm, like H.264. Which makes better use of the existing bandwidth since H.264 uses less bandwidth than MPEG2 to achieve the same video quality.


and have to switch out all current customer boxes that would be expensive.


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## ajwees41 (May 7, 2006)

malverde said:


> The tuning adapter handles a technology called "Switched Digital Video". Basically, the cable company (in order to save bandwidth) will only send the channels to you that you are actually watching (or recording). The tuning adapter handles the request on behalf of the cable card.


the tuning adapter handles 2 way communication for the Tivo not cable card which is 2 way already it's the Tivo which is only one way.


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## SNJpage1 (May 25, 2006)

So with the tuning adapter you can only record on one turner and the other doesn't work?


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## stevewjackson (Nov 2, 2007)

SNJpage1 said:


> So with the tuning adapter you can only record on one turner and the other doesn't work?


No. When your provider uses SDV, they don't simply shove all channels down the pipe and instead withhold some until requested. Since (contrary to an earlier post) CableCARD devices can not communicate up-channel to request a specific channel from the headend, the TA makes that request for the TiVo box. But all your tuners are still able to simultaneously receive channels.


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

stevewjackson said:


> No. When your provider uses SDV, they don't simply shove all channels down the pipe and instead withhold some until requested. Since (contrary to an earlier post) CableCARD devices can not communicate up-channel to request a specific channel from the headend, the TA makes that request for the TiVo box. But all your tuners are still able to simultaneously receive channels.


Well said.


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## SNJpage1 (May 25, 2006)

I am not familiar with the tuning adapters so that's the reason for all the questions. Does the tuneing adapter act as a tuner and you change the channels using that? Or does the Tivo some how let the tuning adapter know that is needs a certain channel?


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

SNJpage1 said:


> I am not familiar with the tuning adapters so that's the reason for all the questions.
> 
> * Does the tuneing adapter act as a tuner and you change the channels using that?
> 
> ** Or does the Tivo some how let the tuning adapter know that is needs a certain channel?


* No.

** Yes.


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## PCurry57 (Feb 27, 2012)

ajwees41 said:


> the tuning adapter handles 2 way communication for the Tivo not cable card which is 2 way already it's the Tivo which is only one way.


TiVo is two way; via the usb connection to the tuning adapter. To build in all currently known communication variants for the uplink to cable companies would add greatly to the front end cost of TiVo. It would lack the future proof protection that a tuning adapter / usb connection offers. The tuning adapter is the limiting factor that cable companies are using to punish TiVo and other cable card users for not leasing their over priced equipment,


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## L David Matheny (Jan 29, 2011)

SNJpage1 said:


> I am not familiar with the tuning adapters so that's the reason for all the questions. Does the tuneing adapter act as a tuner and you change the channels using that? Or does the Tivo some how let the tuning adapter know that is needs a certain channel?


Cable company DVRs have traditionally sucked, but at least they can be designed to work with cable head-end equipment. To tune digital cable channels, a TiVo requires a cable card, about which the cable company drones are completely clueless. But the cable companies wanted to make TiVos suck even worse than their equipment, so they invented the tuning adapter to provide extra pain to people who insist on using TiVos. That insures that TiVo users will get to experience the most extreme circle of cable Hell possible, which is quite an accomplishment. If anybody can insure the ultimate success of OTA broadcasting, it's the cable companies (unless they can pay off enough people to get OTA shut down).


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

L David Matheny said:


> To tune digital cable channels, a TiVo requires a cable card, about which the cable company drones are completely clueless.


Ironically the cable co DVR has the same cable card inside.
I remember reading that the FCC specifications for encryption required that said device be non permanent i.e., the cable card.


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## ajwees41 (May 7, 2006)

Teeps said:


> Ironically the cable co DVR has the same cable card inside.
> I remember reading that the FCC specifications for encryption required that said device be non permanent i.e., the cable card.


I believe those come with the cards already paired to the box hence less problems.


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## ajwees41 (May 7, 2006)

L David Matheny said:


> Cable company DVRs have traditionally sucked, but at least they can be designed to work with cable head-end equipment. To tune digital cable channels, a TiVo requires a cable card, about which the cable company drones are completely clueless. But the cable companies wanted to make TiVos suck even worse than their equipment, so they invented the tuning adapter to provide extra pain to people who insist on using TiVos. That insures that TiVo users will get to experience the most extreme circle of cable Hell possible, which is quite an accomplishment. If anybody can insure the ultimate success of OTA broadcasting, it's the cable companies (unless they can pay off enough people to get OTA shut down).


no the Tivo's don't have a way to send requests via a 2way cable system to allow more channels via SDV that's why the tuning adapters.


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## ajwees41 (May 7, 2006)

PCurry57 said:


> TiVo is two way; via the usb connection to the tuning adapter. To build in all currently known communication variants for the uplink to cable companies would add greatly to the front end cost of TiVo. It would lack the future proof protection that a tuning adapter / usb connection offers. The tuning adapter is the limiting factor that cable companies are using to punish TiVo and other cable card users for not leasing their over priced equipment,


wouldn't Tivo only need to add support Motorola/Arris ,Cisco standards.


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## Loach (Jan 11, 2013)

Cox just implemented SDV in Omaha and, sure enough, I'm missing about a third of the SDV channels. Restarted the Tivo and the Motorola tuning adapter to no effect. Cox tech support said everything looked fine on their end. Scheduled a truck roll. Here we go....


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

ajwees41 said:


> I believe those come with the cards already paired to the box hence less problems.


They may be paired to the box, but since cable companies have to "hit" the cable box with a signal to reset them all the time (I say this mostly only from hearing it from others as I have only ever had a non-Tivo "cable box" for a VERY short time when it was free, and I didn't even have it plugged in most of the time since it sucked so bad), I think they have just as many problems.

Also, paired to the *box* and paired to your *account* are different but related issues. Sometimes the cable card isn't set up properly in your account.


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

ajwees41 said:


> wouldn't Tivo only need to add support Motorola/Arris ,Cisco standards.


No, Cisco has at least two different protocols of their own:

Legacy *DAVIC OOB Mode* - used by most every major Cable Co
and *DSG (DOCSIS Set-Top Gateway) Mode* - Used by Cablevision, maybe others?
As for Motorola, not sure if there is more than one protocol.

Besides the Cable Cos and CableLabs decided on the current Tuning Adapter and would never allow a 3rd party device to communicate upstream using DAVIC OOB. They might allow a DOCSIS type of communication or other IP solution, but TiVo already tried to lobby for that and it failed.


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

Loach said:


> Cox just implemented SDV in Omaha and, sure enough, I'm missing about a third of the SDV channels. Restarted the Tivo and the Motorola tuning adapter to no effect. Cox tech support said everything looked fine on their end. Scheduled a truck roll. Here we go....


Had similar problems with my S3 when Time Warner started the with SDV and tuning adapter.
Short story; the cable drop from the pole to my house was compromised.

Check signal strength (meter function is within tivo) and see what the values are; my experience, even currently, signal strength should be 80% or more.


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## Loach (Jan 11, 2013)

Teeps said:


> Had similar problems with my S3 when Time Warner started the with SDV and tuning adapter.
> Short story; the cable drop from the pole to my house was compromised.
> 
> Check signal strength (meter function is within tivo) and see what the values are; my experience, even currently, signal strength should be 80% or more.


Signal strength appears OK - ranges from 90-92. If signal strength was the issue, I would think I'd be getting no SDV channels (aren't they all essentially sharing the same "channel"?), but it looks like about 2/3 of the ones Cox says are now on SDV are coming in fine.

My cable drop from the Cox junction box to my house is underground and is actually new as of Oct 2011 (had it moved at that time due to a landscaping project).

We'll see if Cox has any clue at all how to troubleshoot this. Maybe it will be as simple as swapping the TA, but I kind of doubt it. Seems to me like something on the headend since I'm missing certain ranges of channels (101-105, 246-258, etc.) I suppose it's possible too that I truly am getting no SDV channels and that Cox only turned SDV on for a portion of the channels they said they were going to. I suppose I could test that by disconnecting the TA and seeing if I'm still getting some of those channels that were supposed to be SDV.


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## jsmeeker (Apr 2, 2001)

In the Dallas area, Time Warner is using Motorolla tuning adapters. You don't get a choice. You get what they use. Hard to say if it's "better" or not. It's really a matter of it simply working. Which it does.


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## HDNewbie1028 (Jun 2, 2012)

I'm in Omaha. Truck rolled this morning. Over an hour and they can't get the Bonus pak (regular digital) to work on five channels. Two adapters, two cards, and three technicians haven't been able to get it working. 

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

ajwees41 said:


> and have to switch out all current customer boxes that would be expensive.


Only the ones that don't handle H.264. Any modern cable box handles H.264. It's the older ones that have issues.

Besides you do it slowly. Like on the least used channels first and then gradually work up to the channels used by more people.


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## Loach (Jan 11, 2013)

HDNewbie1028 said:


> I'm in Omaha. Truck rolled this morning. Over an hour and they can't get the Bonus pak (regular digital) to work on five channels. Two adapters, two cards, and three technicians haven't been able to get it working.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


I wish I could say I was surprised. The Bonus Pak includes SDV channels 101-105, which aren't working for me. I've also got a larger group of channels in the Variety Pak that aren't working.


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

HDNewbie1028 said:


> I'm in Omaha. Truck rolled this morning. Over an hour and they can't get the Bonus pak (regular digital) to work on five channels. Two adapters, two cards, and three technicians haven't been able to get it working.
> 
> Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


Here is a Tip, the Bonus Pak may be grandfathered into your account and may require a different account code than a normal/newer customer.

The Bonus Pak used to be free with Expanded Digital Service (now Cox TV Essential), but now it is part of an Advanced TV Package, but any one with Expanded Digital Service should have been grandfathered in to still receive the Bonus Pak channels, after the change was made.


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## Loach (Jan 11, 2013)

CoxInPHX said:


> Here is a Tip, the Bonus Pak may be grandfathered into your account and may require a different account code than a normal/newer customer.
> 
> The Bonus Pak used to be free with Expanded Digital Service (now Cox TV Essential), but now it is part of an Advanced TV Package, but any one with Expanded Digital Service should have been grandfathered in to still receive the Bonus Pak channels, after the change was made.


I have Advanced TV Package, but I'm not getting the Bonus Pak channels either.


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

Loach said:


> I have Advanced TV Package, but I'm not getting the Bonus Pak channels either.


The Bonus Pak now requires at least one Digital Pak (Variety, Sports & Info, Movie, etc) or the grandfathered account code is needed.

All "Advanced TV" means now is Digital service.


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## Loach (Jan 11, 2013)

CoxInPHX said:


> The Bonus Pak now requires at least one Digital Pak (Variety, Sports & Info, Movie, etc) or the grandfathered account code is needed.
> 
> All "Advanced TV" means now is Digital service.


I've got Variety and Sports & Info as well.


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## HDNewbie1028 (Jun 2, 2012)

Well, after 2 cards, 2 tuners and 5 calls from my rolled truck tech to other techs the last phone tech admits there's a problem on their end with the switching. They unplugged the use from the Tivo and the missing channels came back. So the Ta is on, solid yellow light, but not connected to Tivo. And I have my channels back. Told me to leave it unplugged for 24 hrs and try again. Rinse and repeat and if issue still persists after two weeks I'm supposed to call back to see if they resolved it on their end. They know they have the problem and my tech said he had two calls just like mine on his list for today. Sigh 

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


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## HDNewbie1028 (Jun 2, 2012)

*usb not use... 

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2


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## Loach (Jan 11, 2013)

HDNewbie1028 said:


> Well, after 2 cards, 2 tuners and 5 calls from my rolled truck tech to other techs the last phone tech admits there's a problem on their end with the switching. They unplugged the use from the Tivo and the missing channels came back. So the Ta is on, solid yellow light, but not connected to Tivo. And I have my channels back. Told me to leave it unplugged for 24 hrs and try again. Rinse and repeat and if issue still persists after two weeks I'm supposed to call back to see if they resolved it on their end. They know they have the problem and my tech said he had two calls just like mine on his list for today. Sigh


After I got home last night I checked again. Lo and behold, my missing channels were back. My TA is still connected, solid yellow light, and I did nothing on my end since Wednesday night. So perhaps Cox fixed the switching problem on their end. I'm going to cancel my truck roll scheduled for tomorrow morning.


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