# TiVo Father's Day Offer - $0 down with 2-year-committment



## sbiller (May 10, 2002)

http://www.tivo.com/promo/fathersday11.html?WT.ac=tivohome_fathersday11


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## SoxFan1520 (Dec 1, 2010)

Just did it. Gonna replace an HD with a Premiere for $7 more a month.


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## ltxi (Feb 14, 2010)

I really don't see this as much of a deal. Commit to two years at $20 instead of one plus $99 for the small, entry level hard drive version.


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## DavidTigerFan (Aug 18, 2001)

Can we just get lifetime on this and pay no money for the box?


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## Series3Sub (Mar 14, 2010)

It is a deal for people who don't have or wish to put out money up front. At the end of the 2 years, those folks may very well not continue as TiVo may either have a better model to upgrade or be out of business. It is a good deal for some people, not for the affluent and rich. It is one way that people can get a TiVo in the house and free themselves of the cable co headache DVR's.


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## DavidTigerFan (Aug 18, 2001)

I understand, but my current "upgrade" offer is $99 + $14.99 a month or $399 lifetime.

I'd just like to get a free box and $399 lifetime.


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## Joe01880 (Feb 8, 2009)

Series3Sub said:


> It is a deal for people who don't have or wish to put out money up front. At the end of the 2 years, those folks may very well not continue as TiVo may either have a better model to upgrade or be out of business. It is a good deal for some people, not for the affluent and rich. It is one way that people can get a TiVo in the house and free themselves of the cable co headache DVR's.


Further expoitation of the lower and middle class.


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## Ed_Hunt (Jan 2, 2004)

Joe01880 said:


> Further expoitation of the lower and middle class.


Just the opposite, gives everyone one more choice. :up:


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## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

Series3Sub said:


> It is a deal for people who don't have or wish to put out money up front. At the end of the 2 years, those folks may very well not continue as TiVo may either have a better model to upgrade or be out of business. It is a good deal for some people, not for the affluent and rich. It is one way that people can get a TiVo in the house and free themselves of the cable co headache DVR's.


Well paying $20/mo for 24 months is $480, which is about the same amount a unit with lifetime will cost. I don't think spending $480 (or $580 without MSD) requires someone to be affluent and rich, heck I paid $500 (cash) for a VCR in 1985 and I was making under $18,000/yr. at the time. If someone can't even save $500 they really should worry about their finances not buying a TiVo.

That said from a Marketing point of view some people will just like the zero down offer and for a new customer (no MSD) who wants to pay monthly it is cheaper over 24 months than the current $99 plus $20/mo for min. of 1 year deal.


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## adamwsh (Oct 22, 2002)

As sort of mentioned above, this is a lame deal... you'll have paid $480 over 2 years. You can buy a new one for $83 (from Amazon) then pay the $399 lifetime service fee (w/MSD) and have paid only $2 more. Plus after 2 years, if you do the $0, you'll have to continue to pay a monthly fee or then pay a lifetime fee (we'll assume $399). But if go the purchase and lifetime subscription route, you'll never have to pay another monthly fee.

Basically, what sounds like a good deal at $0 down, if people don't do their homework, they're gonna get screwed.


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## vurbano (Apr 20, 2004)

adamwsh said:


> As sort of mentioned above, this is a lame deal... you'll have paid $480 over 2 years. You can buy a new one for $83 (from Amazon) then pay the $399 lifetime service fee (w/MSD) and have paid only $2 more. Plus after 2 years, if you do the $0, you'll have to continue to pay a monthly fee or then pay a lifetime fee (we'll assume $399). But if go the purchase and lifetime subscription route, you'll never have to pay another monthly fee.
> 
> Basically, what sounds like a good deal at $0 down, if people don't do their homework, they're gonna get screwed.


:up:


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## scandia101 (Oct 20, 2007)

Joe01880 said:


> Further expoitation of the lower and middle class.


It's $130 cheaper than paying the former regular retail price of $299 for the tivo and nearly $311 ($12.95 x 24) for two yeas of service. Hardly exploitation. Being able to get a better deal also doesn't make it any sort of exploitation.


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## ltxi (Feb 14, 2010)

Still don't see it with the 360GB or whatever drive. I'd at least invest the extra $150 up front to upgrade it to a 2TB preconfigured replacement so I wouldn't don't run out of space in a few months.


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## robaustin (Nov 14, 2004)

Well.....

For those of us still on monthly, who will continue to be on monthly, it works out better. Keep in mind lots of folks like me still have Series 2 Tivos (yes, I do still have SD TVs as well). So.....

$480 over 24 months - minus $100 for the unit is $380 - divided by 24 months is about $15 a month. Only $2 more per month for Tivo service.

I pay $7 a month for my cable box, which I use with the IR blaster. That goes down to $3 a month, for cable card, leaving $4 a month deficit - take away the $2 a month extra I pay in Tivo service, I still come out $2 a month ahead.

No - I never did lifetime on either of my Tivos. Why? Because quite honestly I didn't know I would have them in service as long as I did. And - I'm committing to two years, and putting myself in a position where I can use my Tivos on HDtvs when I eventually upgrade.

So honestly - not everyone thinks it is such a horrible deal.

All in perspective.....

--*Rob


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## ltxi (Feb 14, 2010)

Yeah, I guess if you're into extra cost monthly with no up front cost....

-- Series 1 Sony with lifetime since Dec 2000 still running in the basement serves as my base for MSD
-- Bedroom HDXL on annual at $99
-- Workout room HDXL 2 TB at $6.95 monthly
-- Living Room PXL on $299 lifetime

All except the S1 because I had to ditch my two perfectly good, upgraded S2s that were costing me 6.95/mo when Comcast rendered them mostly useless last year in our digital upgrade.


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## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

Seems like a horrible deal to me. Go lifetime.

Save some money first if you have to. These types of deals just dig a hole for yourself. You never have enough money so you're always taking the worst terms.


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## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

robaustin said:


> Well.....
> 
> For those of us still on monthly, who will continue to be on monthly, it works out better. Keep in mind lots of folks like me still have Series 2 Tivos (yes, I do still have SD TVs as well). So.....
> 
> ...


That's just bad math.

Here's the better math.

$600 for a lifetime PRemiere or $480 for 2 years of monthly Premiere payments.

AFter 2 years the monthly Premiere is worth pretty much $0.

After 2 years the lifetime Premiere will be worth at least $300 conservatively.

Total outlay after 2 years for the lifetime PRemiere is $600-$300=$300

Total outlay after 3 years for monthly FAther's Day Premiere is $480.

And the $600 is worst case lifetime Premiere price. You can save a few bucks on Amazon and get a PRemiere for $83. And you might be able to finagle lifetime from Tivo for $400 instead of $500 especially if you've been a long time customer.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

trip1eX said:


> That's just bad math.
> 
> Here's the better math.
> 
> ...


You have it nailed* !!! *but some people think the world going to end soon so they think they will make out with monthly, has not happened in the last 11 years and may not happen in the next 10 years.


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## burjim (May 22, 2009)

I paid $99 for the premier and $99 annual prepaid(99/12 = 8.25/mo) under msd.
and also pay $129 yearly(129/12 = 10.75?mo) for tivo hd. Thats $19 monthly for 2 boxes. This is the cheapest rate per month for tivo. If any of the box breaks which you can never tell, I dont loose that much money compared to lifetime subs plus its easier to upgrade if a new models come in.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

lessd said:


> You have it nailed* !!! *but some people think the world going to end soon so they think they will make out with monthly, has not happened in the last 11 years and may not happen in the next 10 years.


I'm not nearly as worried about the end of the world as I am about sinking a bunch of money into a unit and having it die beyond repairableness 3 minutes later.

Or TiVo pulling a UK, and coming up with yet another re-definition of "lifetime".


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

unitron said:


> I'm not nearly as worried about the end of the world as I am about sinking a bunch of money into a unit and having it die beyond repairableness 3 minutes later.
> 
> Or TiVo pulling a UK, and coming up with yet another re-definition of "lifetime".


In the UK situation the last TiVos sold were at least 4 or 5 years ago, so Lifetime people got their moneys worth, I guess there is a small risk that TiVo could belly up and not sell the guide data updates to anyone, but that risk is small as is having a non repairable TiVo (other that the hard drive)
Do you have full warranty coverage on all your appliances in you home at all times ? I built my home new about 15 years ago and have spent about $4000 on appliance repair over that time inc AC, that $22/month, I could not get any full warranty service to cover all my high end appliances for anything close to that price, so i take the risk.


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## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

unitron said:


> I'm not nearly as worried about the end of the world as I am about sinking a bunch of money into a unit and having it die beyond repairableness 3 minutes later.
> 
> Or TiVo pulling a UK, and coming up with yet another re-definition of "lifetime".


Actually I like people who pay monthly and think more people should do it. It helps us life-timers out by providing TiVo an on going incentive to continue to provide guide data and software updates. Not to mention that the extra money people who pay monthly will end up paying might help out TiVo's bottom line, which again is good for us people with lifetime units.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

atmuscarella said:


> Actually I like people who pay monthly and think more people should do it. It helps us life-timers out by providing TiVo an on going incentive to continue to provide guide data and software updates. Not to mention that the extra money people who pay monthly will end up paying might help out TiVo's bottom line, which again is good for us people with lifetime units.


Good way to put it :up:


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

atmuscarella said:


> Actually I like people who pay monthly and think more people should do it. It helps us life-timers out by providing TiVo an on going incentive to continue to provide guide data and software updates. Not to mention that the extra money people who pay monthly will end up paying might help out TiVo's bottom line, which again is good for us people with lifetime units.





lessd said:


> Good way to put it :up:


Also this may push TiVo to release new hardware faster, because at the end of the two years I know I would be asking about a newer model just like we do now with cell phones.


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## Rkkeller (May 13, 2004)

Deals like this are what gets more people into owning TiVo's as very few, a tiny tiny percentage actually, purchase lifetime. I saw something before and monthly users greatly outnumber lifetime, way more.

Many are happy with normal Moto cable DVR's so to switch to TiVo like TiVo wants, they are not going to pay $300-$400 for something they have never used or don't know a lot about. Also the monthly cost is not much different as Comcast and others charge $16-$20 for their DVR and now for the same cost they can have a TiVo instead.

Get over yourselves already. You want to pay $300-$400 upfront but many don't and this deal is perfect for them. Now for only $20 upfront EVERYONE can get a TiVo Premier.


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## adamwsh (Oct 22, 2002)

Rkkeller said:


> Deals like this are what gets more people into owning TiVo's as very few, a tiny tiny percentage actually, purchase lifetime. I saw something before and monthly users greatly outnumber lifetime, way more.
> 
> Many are happy with normal Moto cable DVR's so to switch to TiVo like TiVo wants, they are not going to pay $300-$400 for something they have never used or don't know a lot about. Also the monthly cost is not much different as Comcast and others charge $16-$20 for their DVR and now for the same cost they can have a TiVo instead.


This is actually a good point. I know I look at these numbers as someone who already knows and loves Tivo vs. cable DVRs. But you're right. People that don't know Tivo aren't going to shell out the big money when they can get a DVR from their cable provider.

One of the biggest problems I have is that I have to pay Tivo a monthly fee, but then I also have to pay my provider a monthly fee for a cable card or STB. It's a shame that having a Tivo doesn't negate the need for a fee from the cable co, like before digital required a CC or STB. I guess it is the price I pay for liking Tivo so much.

If FIOS ever offers Tivo on their own DVRs (like Comcast is starting to do), I'll have a hard time buying a Tivo branded box again.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Rkkeller said:


> Get over yourselves already. You want to pay $300-$400 upfront but many don't and this deal is perfect for them. Now for only $20 upfront EVERYONE can get a TiVo Premier.


We already agreed it is better that people don't do the math since it potentially makes TiVo more money.


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## ltxi (Feb 14, 2010)

innocentfreak said:


> We already agreed it is better that people don't do the math since it potentially makes TiVo more money.


$199/127 months works out to $1.67 per month..so far..as the service cost for our original TiVo. And it established a legacy MSD base of $6.95 for what's now a 2tb HDXL add on.

So, yeah, you're definitely right. We should highly encourage no money down, high monthly subscription fee customers. Really need to keep TiVo in business.


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## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

I think Tivo would have more incentive to put out new Tivos if everyone was lifetime.


Monthly subscribers will still be paying the $20/month after their hardware subsidy runs out. Not much incentive for Tivo to release new models.

Not when cable dvrs are improving at a snail's pace.

Cellphone market is different. You have more choice in cellphones and cellphone service than in pay tv service and dvrs. If your cellphone provider doesn't offer the lastest model after 2 years then you'll switch providers. Or if a manfucter doesn't improve their cellphone they will be left behind by the the other manufacturers.

If you pay for lifetime though Tivo isn't collecting any more money from you and therefore has incentive to put out a new better model in order to get you to purchase and transfer your lifetime for a fee.


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## TheWGP (Oct 26, 2007)

Eh, I see what you're saying - but I don't think it's a large enough factor for Tivo to consider. Recall that the lifetime is amortized over I believe a 4-year period for accounting purposes - once the 4th year is up, those subs are essentially dead weight on Tivo. If they could ensure that all boxes self-destructed after 4 years, I'm sure they would. 

The $20/mo, on the other hand, is recognized immediately as an ongoing revenue stream. The contracts do lead to some writeoffs for bad debt, but even that can return some money from a collections outfit. Gotta remember that 2-3-4 years from now is generally 100% irrelevant for any publicly traded company - the only thing they care about is quarterly results, their stock price at that point, and annual results and the stock price at that point.

This shortsighted drive for short-term results is one reason American businesses have a difficult time competing with cheaper labor from abroad, even at lower quality. Tivo is no different: they have no incentive to create long-term customers - past 4 years, even lifetime is worthless dead weight to them.

The real factor at play with the standalone boxes for Tivo now is using it as a platform to demonstrate software and test rollouts for proposed MSO partners. Tivo has said as much - the standalone boxes exist only to serve the needs and purposes of the cable companies, at this point. I wouldn't be surprised at all to hear that they plan to cease production of any new models after the 'series 5' or the extenders or whatever that ends up being - if they have enough of a toehold with the MSO's they don't need standalone boxes anymore, and they can get out of that business, which they see as unprofitable.

It's a far cry from the business strategies and technological innovation, and attitude to take on the industry found in the Tivo of 1999-2000, that's for sure! These days, it's essentially a whole different company. 

That said, I still love my Premieres... when everything works correctly it's pretty sweet.


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## L David Matheny (Jan 29, 2011)

TheWGP said:


> Recall that the lifetime is amortized over I believe a 4-year period for accounting purposes - once the 4th year is up, those subs are essentially dead weight on Tivo. If they could ensure that all boxes self-destructed after 4 years, I'm sure they would.


OTOH, lifetime users aren't really much dead weight. My lifetime Premiere adds a bit of load to TiVo's servers, but that's about it. And lifetime almost guarantees that I will remain a loyal TiVo user until they release their next generation of hardware, at which point I might upgrade. Of course, I'm OTA only, so I don't have a lot of other options.


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## scandia101 (Oct 20, 2007)

Paying one bill and using the service forever does not make one a loyal customer.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

scandia101 said:


> Paying one bill and using the service forever does not make one a loyal customer.


He didn't say "loyal customer", he said "loyal TiVo user".


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## scandia101 (Oct 20, 2007)

unitron said:


> He didn't say "loyal customer", he said "loyal TiVo user".


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