# HR10-250 Drive upgrade help issues



## nlayton (Sep 16, 2003)

I need a little help. I have 4, yes four HR10-250's that I want to put 750 gig drives in. But I am having issues with them. Please read carefully. 

First know that I have successfully upgraded approximately 30 series2 TiVo units in the past year with larger hard drives and/or dual drives etc. Both Stand alone and DTV units. No issues. 

These are my first attempts at an HR10-250. I have 4 units to upgrade. No problem right? ..........Wrong! 

1st unit is brand new not even activated, I use the newly purchased PTVUpgrade Instant cake and put a new install on the drive. Reinstall the drive, run Clear & Delete Everything and all is well. That one is just fine. 97 hours HD and like 688 SD! Just about what you would expect from a 750 GB drive.

Units 2-4 I want to preserve recordings on so I use this command 

mfsbackup -Tao - /dev/hdxxx | mfsrestore -s 127 -xzpi - /dev/hdxxx 

I have 3 separate PC's so I am basically doing all 3 units at the same time, starting one while that one runs start the 2nd, etc. 

The first two, I startup yesterday (wed) at 9am they are still running at only 50% done almost 24 hours later. Everything appears fine, no errors reported on screen, but thy are taking FOREVER? Why? (P4, 3ghz systems) WTF?? 

The 3rd unit Screams thru the process in about 4 hours, No errors. That system is P4 1.8ghz system!! WTF??? Not sure what the deal is with the slowest system going 10 times faster but whatever. 

When I reinstall the upgraded drive, I get the GSOD, attach phone, please leave alone for 3 hours, etc. etc. 

However it is in a continual reboot cycle, meaning it boots, I get GSOD for about 5 seconds then it reboots again, over and over and over and over. 

SO I figure the backup is pooched something wasn't quite right. SO this time I try the DD copy command: dd if=/dev/hdxxx of=/dev/hdxxx bs=1024 

About 5 hours later it's finished and works perfectly! Recordings all play etc. But obviously it still thinks it is a 250 gig drive since it hasn't been expanded. 

SO I pull it out of the TiVo to run mfsadd (mfsadd -x /dev/hdxxx) All is well until I place it back in the TiVo. I then get exactly the same scenario above with the GSOD and continual reboots WTF?? 

Meanwhile the other two P4-3Ghz systems are chugging along supposedly still copying. 

I then decide that I don't need the recordings and I will make a backup of the original drive to restore to the new drive. This will at least save me the time of doing a C&D Everything. As stated earlier I have done this about 30 times before. 
On other Series 2 Tivo's 

Guess what? Even that image has the same continual reboot issues as my previous 2 attempts. 

The only thing that seems to work for these upgrades is instant cake with a C&D everything afterwards. Which is a major pain if I want to save the recordings. I have never tried saving any recordings before and know I know why. What a pain! Not too mention I am 24 hours into a 5 hour project and Still only have 1 unit upgraded out of 4!!! 

So what am I missing? 
Why the GSOD every time? 
Why the continual rebooting 
Why can't the GSOD fix itself like it is supposed to? 
Why does my 1.6Ghz P4 complete the tasks 10 times faster than my 3Ghz P4? 

How do I avoid this in the future? For now the owner of the TiVo's is going to just watch everything and then return them when they have no shows. 
But even then They will have to redo the setup, season passes, etc. 

My best success was with the DD copy, the issue seems to come when the drive is expanded to use the updated space. Which is the purpose of the whole upgrade. 

Thanks in advance to anyone taking the time to read the whole post

Please let me know what I did wrong and why it has only happened with the HR10-250's and not any of the others?

Thanks again


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## nlayton (Sep 16, 2003)

Maybe this post should be moved to the Undergroud Playgrond Upgrade section?
Moderators?


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## wscannell (Dec 7, 2003)

You need a -r 4 switch in the mfsrestore. This is needed for larger drives (approx 300GB and up).

You might also consider increasing the swap space for this size drive. (-s 325) This will require that you get and download tpip to initialize the swap space.


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## nlayton (Sep 16, 2003)

wscannell said:


> You need a -r 4 switch in the mfsrestore. This is needed for larger drives (approx 300GB and up).
> 
> You might also consider increasing the swap space for this size drive. (-s 325) This will require that you get and download tpip to initialize the swap space.


I assume that would look something like this:

mfsbackup -Tao - /dev/hdxxx | mfsrestore -s 127 -r 4 -xzpi - /dev/hdxxx

What is the -r 4 switch or what does it do?

The swap file increase (-s 325) command I understand, but what is tpip?
I will do a search.


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## nlayton (Sep 16, 2003)

It seems the -r 4 switch isn't need if I am not using such a larger drive.

I went from a 250gb up to a 400gb with just the standard command:

"mfsbackup -Tao - /dev/hdxxx | mfsrestore -s 127 -xzpi - /dev/hdxxx"

And the new 400gb drive comes up just fine. Plays all the recordings, recognizes the expanded space etc.

I am now in the process of retrying with a 750GB drive and the -r 4 switch. 

I found quite a bit of info on tpip, expanded swap sizes and peoples opinion on wether or not they are really needed above 127mb

wscannell, Thanks for pointing me in the right direction
Thanks for all your help.

I'll keep you posted on wether or not the 750gb drive worked out with the -r 4 switch


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## nlayton (Sep 16, 2003)

Problem solved!

To succesfully upgrade and go from 250gb up to a 750gb drive, you definately need the -r 4 switch.

Thanks again for pointing me in to the right direction!!

Now if anyone has an idea why the p4 1.8 ghz machine does the chore in about 4.5 hours vs. the p4 3ghz machine taking over 24 (closer to 30 hours!!)

Both units are set the same. Original Tivo drive on /dev/hda. The new drive on /dev/hdc. Boot CD-Rom on /dev/hdd.

Same brand/model of CD-ROM on both, 80 pin cables all the way around.
Very strange. The only difference is the Mobo and the cpu. Well that and the 3ghz system has double the ram. 

????


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## DaveF (Aug 23, 2001)

How well has this been working for you? Any issues? I'm about to do the same.

Thanks,
Dave


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## nlayton (Sep 16, 2003)

DaveF said:


> How well has this been working for you? Any issues? I'm about to do the same.


Well it has only been about 24 hours, but so far it has been just like factory new.

I also added an additional fan inside, so it is actually running about 10 degrees cooler than it used too  That shoudl help in the long run.


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## DaveF (Aug 23, 2001)

What fan did you add and how did you do it? 

Mine just finished the reboot and all looks good. 97HD hours and some ludicrous SD. 

Thanks,, 
Dave


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## nlayton (Sep 16, 2003)

DaveF said:


> What fan did you add and how did you do it?


Since I had invested so much in the 750Gb HD's, I was woried about the heat. I went all out and I added the Weaknees Twinbreeze bracket and fan. Only instead of using the slow turning fan they supplied I subbed it for a one that was about double the RPM. It is a bit noisier, but you can't even hear it over the normal household noise.

I only have one drive on my 2 drive brackets leaving room for air flow and/or expansion at a later date. Just imagine.......... dual 750 gig drives!! Insane! 

I think that would be about 200 HD and 1300 SD hours! Probably a little over kill.

Every 2 drive system I have ever build has only lasted about 1 year before one of the drives dies. Then I have to start over, the wife complains, etc. etc.

However the one drive systems seem to be fine........any one see this as a general rule or is it just me?


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## wscannell (Dec 7, 2003)

You about double your chance of failure when you use two drives. It is really no longer necessary with the large drives that are now available.


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## Anametrix (Nov 20, 2005)

nlayton - did you end up increasing the swap size?


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## nlayton (Sep 16, 2003)

Anametrix said:


> nlayton - did you end up increasing the swap size?


No, I did not end up increasing the swap size. After many hours of reading various peoples posts and technical opinions, I decided to stick with 127.

It has been over 2 months going on 3 now with no issues.


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## Anametrix (Nov 20, 2005)

Excellent, it sounds like the bottom line on the swap size is to leave well alone at 127.

I should also ask, were you just using the standard command:

mfsrestore -s 127 -r 4 -zxpi /mnt/backupimage.bak /dev/hda

Thanks for the update.


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## nlayton (Sep 16, 2003)

Anametrix said:


> I should also ask, were you just using the standard command:
> 
> mfsrestore -s 127 -r 4 -zxpi /mnt/backupimage.bak /dev/hda


Well, my main issue was, the customer I was working for just had to save all the recordings. <@#$%!><grrr>

So if I remember correctly is was somthing like this.......from the post above.

mfsbackup -Tao - /dev/hdxxx | mfsrestore -s 127 -r 4 -xzpi - /dev/hdxxx

The one thing I never figured out is why the HP VL420 motherboard was so much faster than all the others. In all of my testing/upgrades, This HP system about 50% faster than any other system. So I started running tests on some DOS systems I support and the hard drive r/w speeds are again about 50% faster than a system running twice as fast a processor. Still seems strange to me, but I like to go with what works best (and fastest) So I swapped out my 3ghz test bench machine for a 1.6ghz HP VL420........just for the IDE channel speed increases.


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## HDVRFAN (Sep 21, 2006)

I've upgraded, rebuilt, replaced hardrives on my Sony T-60 before so I'm not a total newbie to this but this my first try with my HD box. Ok to get to the questions.

From reading these posts I think I realize why I am getting the GSOD after adding a 300GB second drive to my HR10-250. The Hinsdale upgrade giude didn't mention the need to use the "-r 4" switch when running the mfsadd command. At least hopefully this is my problem. My question is if I re-run the mfsadd command with the "-r 4" parameter should that fix it or do I need to restore the backuped base image to the original drive and start all over again? Also when you are just adding a large second drive do you need to worry about changing the swap size?

Thanks for your help


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## Deezul (Mar 9, 2003)

I too think am having a GSOD because of a larger drive size. While doing a restore to two 320 GB drives, or even to one 320 GB drive, the restore gets to 10% in about 5 seconds, then starts to hiccup, doing 5% more, then stopping, over and over. When the two drive one finished, I got the GSOD & reboot loop. I don't care about saving my recordings, just the Season Passes and other settings. So should just the following:

mfsrestore -s 127 -r 4 -xzpi /mnt/tivo.bak /dev/hda /dev/hdb

fix my problems? Just looking for someone to say "yes" since I've been at this since Tuesday. finally giving up on a restore after the drive took about 24 hours, and having to record 3 days worth of premieres on an SD Tivo.

Deezul


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## HDVRFAN (Sep 21, 2006)

I tried running the mfsadd again with the new "-r 4" switch and it didn't fix the problem. I then did a restore to a blank 300gb drive and Tivo booted up fine. Tried restore to original drive which restored fine but got a message expanding the swap failed. Tried the mfsadd again with original 250 gb drive (A) and 300 gb (B) with all the switches. The results said that I had increased my hours the appropiate amount but when when I put everything back in the tivo and booted up the system info screen still only shows the 30hours HD 300hours SD?!? I've been at this for several days and I'm close to giving up. Not to mention that the weakness bracket I bough includes this fan that makes the tivo hum and vibrate at a level that I don't think I can live with. A single 500gb drive upgrade is probably a smarter choice. The double drive setup has not gone as smoothly as advertised. Anyone...anyone...Buhler?


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## Freightdog (Aug 24, 2005)

I can't opine on a 2 drive system, but I did upgrade my HR10-250 3 days ago with a single 750gb (removed the existing 250gb). 

Used:

mfsbackup -Tao - /dev/hdxxx | mfsrestore -s 127 -r 4 -xzpi - /dev/hdxxx 

Took about 5 hours, saved all recordings, settings, etc... booted up fine. Temp shows as 45c, about same as before.
I may add a fan, kinda fanatic on cooling....

now... should I force a 6.3 update??? Thats the question...


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## HDVRFAN (Sep 21, 2006)

Just bought a Seagate 750 gb drive online at CompUsa for $279 after rebates. Scrapping dual drive idea. Restore of image to single drive has worked on 300 gb drive so I know it's reliable. Recordings already gone due to previous attempts to restore factory drive. Two drives with extra fan way too noisy. Too much vibration on glass component rack.

Thankfully the fall season is just begining.


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## Deezul (Mar 9, 2003)

HDVRFAN said:


> Just bought a Seagate 750 gb drive online at CompUsa for $279 after rebates. Scrapping dual drive idea. Restore of image to single drive has worked on 300 gb drive so I know it's reliable. Recordings already gone due to previous attempts to restore factory drive. Two drives with extra fan way too noisy. Too much vibration on glass component rack.
> 
> Thankfully the fall season is just begining.


Quite a deal there. I bought my two 320s at Circuit City for $180 after rebate because I didn't want to wait for an online drive to arrive. I think I got a pretty good price, but I'll just have to deal with two drives. Not a big problem, as I have anther HR10-250 that hasn't been modded, so if I ever have to put the original 250 back in, I can used a back from that one.

Deezul


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## kroddy (Oct 31, 2001)

nlayton said:


> The one thing I never figured out is why the HP VL420 motherboard was so much faster than all the others. In all of my testing/upgrades, This HP system about 50% faster than any other system. So I started running tests on some DOS systems I support and the hard drive r/w speeds are again about 50% faster than a system running twice as fast a processor. Still seems strange to me, but I like to go with what works best (and fastest) So I swapped out my 3ghz test bench machine for a 1.6ghz HP VL420........just for the IDE channel speed increases.


The two keys to fast copying are

(a) having DMA enabled - a search for hdparm will tell you more, and

(b) having the source and destination drives on seperate IDE channels -

a few weeks ago I took my RCA up to 80GB, had both drives on the same cable and did not enable DMA - took more almost eight hours to copy 40GB... when I did my HR10-250 a little later started it up with the two drives on seperate channels and after about an hour it was less than 5% complete... did a little research, found out about hdparm, stopped it, restarted, set DMA active and it completed in about 2.5 hours.


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## Deezul (Mar 9, 2003)

Well, after finally getting both 320s in and getting the TiVo to boot, I decided to try just the original 250. I have another HR10-250, so my original reason to upgrade drives was because I had 410 GB on my first, had a bad drive, decided to replace with two 320s. But it was even SLOWER, even without any recordings. Since I've got the second HR10-250, space isn't much of an issue anymore, so I'm scrapping the upgrade plans and going back to just the 250GB. 

But now I have another issue after getting it back on just the 250. I go try to set a show to record, and after about a minute or so on the "Please wait" the TiVo reboots. :-( So I copied down what my season passes were and I'm going to try a clear and delete all with the 250. Hopefully this will fix it.

Deezul


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