# Roomie Remote with TiVo Premiere



## elprice7345 (Sep 28, 2009)

I've started using the Roomie Remote on my iPad as my universal remote to control my media center including my TiVo Premiere.

Almost all of the controls work correctly and I'm very happy with the overall experience, but I've noticed two bugs.

*Bug 1:
*When youre viewing the show detail screen on a TiVo Premiere, you should be able to press the Info button and see more info about the show if its available. This function doesnt work on the Roomie Remote iPad app or iPhone app.

*Bug 2:
*When you get to the end of the show, a box pops up asking if you want to delete or keep the show. If the show was recorded on the TiVo or transferred from another TiVo, the control works properly.

If the show had been uploaded to the TiVo from a PC, the remote only accepts one command and then freezes. For example, to delete a show, once the box pops up, you have to cursor up once and then select the delete menu item. If a show has been uploaded from a PC, you can cursor up, but it won't allow me to select the delete item.

I opened support tickets with Roomie support, but they claim they are using the commands published in the public TiVo API and there is nothing they can do.

Is there anyway TiVo can affix this?

Any other thoughts?


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## telemark (Nov 12, 2013)

Does Tivo's iPad, iPhone, Android, or other 3rd party IP remote have the same 2 problems?

http://wmcbrine.com/tivo/ is one you can try from a PC.

Make note of your Tivo OS version and Remote app version also...

Update:
I ran my own test on Bug 1: Tivo iPad, the Slide Pro, IR peanut work correctly.
Tivo Android's App and network-remote-0.28.zip does like you described.

Very Interesting Indeed.


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## elprice7345 (Sep 28, 2009)

Yes, sorry, I should have mentioned that the TiVo brand iPad and iPhone remotes function correctly.

That was why I thought it was a Roomie bug, but their tech support says they are issuing the commands from the TiVo API.

I just heard from TiVo support:


> Currently we do not support the Roomie Remote and are not able to resolve the issue.


It looks like once again, I'm stuck between two companies pointing their tech support fingers at each other and negatively impacting the consumer!


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## telemark (Nov 12, 2013)

I have the tools to track down bug #1. My understanding is there is no official published Tivo API, so Roomie is misrepresenting the issue.

Tivo is responsible for the Android App still, so they can't skirt the issue completely. And the author of Network Remote is on this forum, I imagine he would be interested in this too.

Though it could be there' two api's now. The old TCP one and some new one the official iOS apps are using. If true, it'll be difficult to fix, I'll let you know what I find out.

Edit:
I stand corrected. I've never seen this document before, but that's pretty official:
http://www.tivo.com/assets/images/a.../TiVo_TCP_Network_Remote_Control_Protocol.pdf


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## telemark (Nov 12, 2013)

I ran a network capture and none of the official Tivo apps are using the TCP port 31339 commands.

I also tried the "INFO" button by hand over that port to confirm the non-official apps were doing it correctly, and the bug is still there. There are two "INFO" buttons in that API btw:
IRCODE INFO
KEYBOARD INFO

Neither work.

It's strange the Android app is affected. In either case, this is something only Tivo can fix. 

Maybe if you tell them the Android app and the TCP apps are broken at the same time, maybe they'll fix it together. Otherwise, idk how to make them interested, maybe others have suggestions.

I tested against: Android Tivo App P1.9.2-711474 and Tivo Premiere running 20.3.8-01-1-746.


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## elprice7345 (Sep 28, 2009)

@telemark Thanks for all of your help!

Here's the most recent response from TiVo support:


> Thank you for contacting TiVo Customer Support. I would be glad to help you with your remote API feedback.
> 
> Per your request I have passed along the bugs you describe. Thank you for the feedback and be sure to keep an eye on your app for updates.


I'm going to provide TiVo support the link to this thread.


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## telemark (Nov 12, 2013)

Oh. Someone better confirm Bug #2 in the mean time then.

How did you get the files from a PC to the Tivo?


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## elprice7345 (Sep 28, 2009)

Files are uploaded via PyTivo.

As a reminder - files uploaded via PyTivo delete properly with the iPhone and Ipad TiVo brand apps. I've only noticed the bug when using the Roomie app.

The latest response from Tivo support:


> I have documented this information to be relayed to the investigation of this issue as well. Thank you for continuing to report this information as it is beneficial to us. Definitely contact us again if you have any additional questions regarding this issue. Thank you for contacting TiVo and have a great day!


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## telemark (Nov 12, 2013)

I have Bug #2 as well.

1) I uploaded 2 files via PyTivo.
2) FF to the end of either file. 
3) Tried to send some remote commands during the Keep/Delete selection box. Using NetworkRemote and telnet to 31339.

It looks like the TCP API takes 1 command, and then freezes. I normally get a COMMAND_TIMEOUT for example, but during this sequence I don't.

One work around then, is instead of hitting UP, you can hit SELECT which returns to the Episode Menu, and then delete from that menu.


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## elprice7345 (Sep 28, 2009)

@telemark - thanks again for help and confirming the bugs!

I found the same workaround after some trial and error. I'll update my TiVo support case.


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## telemark (Nov 12, 2013)

On Bug #2, I gave it some thought and figured the bug on the Tivo is being triggered by the transferred file's metadata. (or lack of, more often)

I was able to "fix" my pyTivo uploads by creating default metadata settings in
default.txt

```
displayMajorNumber : 0
callsign : PYTV
```
See if that fixes the problem completely, and if so, we maybe should patch pyTivo as well.

I have to wonder if Tivo Desktop Plus triggers this same upload bug or not. (I don't have that software to test).


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## elprice7345 (Sep 28, 2009)

Wow! @telemark how did you figure that out?

I've changed my default.txt files to now contain those data elements and tested one partial show and the show deleted correctly. Let me test a few more shows before we claim victory.

As far as TiVo Desktop Plus, I don't have the SW either so I don't know if it has the same problems.

I think this is still primarily an issue with the TiVo API, but the workaround will save me a lot of grief until TiVo ever gets around to fixing it.

I cross posted this in the pyTivo boards to see what @wmcbrine and company think at: http://pytivo.sourceforge.net/forum/pytivo-with-roomie-remote-and-tivo-api-t2564.html

I've also updated my support case.


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## philhu (Apr 11, 2001)

telemark said:


> I have the tools to track down bug #1. My understanding is there is no official published Tivo API, so Roomie is misrepresenting the issue.
> 
> ut.
> 
> ...


Yes, I was going to say, there is an api manual, you pointed at.

I do know that Roomie has been asking Tivo for a few details for items in the manual, like 2-way communications for show being watched etc for over a year now. (Since 3/13).

Saying that I do not think I see either bug described using roomie on an ipod, ipad and iphone, connecting to series4 and series 3 units. I do not have a Series 5 Roamio though.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

I'm able to reproduce this weird little bug on Premiere and Roamio, as well as the fix. Pushed recordings remain affected (since very little metadata can be passed that way), along with all TiVoCasts. Non-.TiVo transfers from TiVo Desktop are also affected (since TD basically sends no metadata). So, feel free to report the bug to TiVo on that basis.

There are two completely separate network remote control interfaces for the TiVo. The first -- the one described in that PDF -- we call the "Crestron" interface, after the company whose systems it was apparently first intended for. The document only came out after we'd reverse-engineered it.  See more here.

The second, much more sophisticated interface is the one I inexplicably dubbed the "iPad" interface. This is the one used by TiVo's iOS and Android apps, and they haven't released the spec. But it too has been reverse-engineered, particularly by moyekj -- you can find his implementation of a network remote based on this protocol included in KMTTG. Unfortunately it looks like TiVo really doesn't want third parties using this interface.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

Confirmed that this bug is still present in 20.4.1.


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## ppeewang (Aug 27, 2012)

wmcbrine,

Thanks for pointing me to this link. 

Regarding the workaround for bug #2, can this information be put into Metagenerator so that anything I upload will always have it ?

displayMajorNumber : 0
callsign : PYTV


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

Would this also affect Crestron and Crontrol4?


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

Bigg said:


> Would this also affect Crestron and Crontrol4?


It's a TiVo-side bug; it would affect anything that uses the older, so-called "Crestron" interface. So yeah, that includes Crestron.  I think it includes any third-party remote, except KMTTG -- i.e., anything other than the TiVo-branded apps for iOS and Android, which use the newer remote interface. But I'm not sure.

Hmm, I see that telemark says the Android app is also affected? I'll have to test that later.

BTW, I realized today that the quickest way past this screen is to hit the "TiVo" button rather than any arrow key. Of course, you have to know ahead of time that it's going to be one of the "problem" recordings.


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## dinom (Apr 15, 2013)

Yes, both would be affected. I have confirmed this is also a problem with any recorded show that is watched on a TiVo Mini. The Mini freezes for 2-3 minutes after deleting the show when using RTI control systems via IP control (again following TiVo's API protocol). The same RTI control over a Premier 4 works perfectly fine.



Bigg said:


> Would this also affect Crestron and Crontrol4?


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

Interesting. What a weird bug.


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## hotmachiato (Sep 26, 2008)

Hi,

I am responsible for the Control4 telnet based driver and I can confirm #2 bug is there. Once you get to the end of a recording and the "Delete this recording" dialog pops up, the unit will become unresponsive to any commands. I have not found a workaround yet.

Carl


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## philhu (Apr 11, 2001)

Well. It does still respond to ir commands


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## telemark (Nov 12, 2013)

I'm not seeing the freeze bug tonight, and I'm on 20.4.1 still.

Has this gone away for anyone, or still there for anyone?

I tried my htmlRemote, rproxy, and some version of Network Remote.



elprice7345 said:


> Wow! @telemark how did you figure that out?


Cause you did the testing and documented precisely, I was able to think it through. Thanks.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

telemark said:


> I'm not seeing the freeze bug tonight, and I'm on 20.4.1 still.


No change here.


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## telemark (Nov 12, 2013)

Sorry, I mixed up the two bugs in my head.

(My last tests were flawed so please ignore.)


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

Surprisingly enough, or perhaps not, this bug has survived the Haxe rewrite, and remains present in 20.4.2.


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## elprice7345 (Sep 28, 2009)

Confirmed


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## elprice7345 (Sep 28, 2009)

> Bug 1:
> When youre viewing the show detail screen on a TiVo Premiere, you should be able to press the Info button and see more info about the show if its available. This function doesnt work on the Roomie Remote iPad app or iPhone app.


Confirmed last night that bug 1 has been fixed, but bug 2 still exists.

TiVo Premiere 20.4.5
Roomie Remote 3.0.3


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## Tcoble33 (Nov 23, 2014)

I've got what appears to be issue #2. It manifests itself when I'm using Roomie Remote to control a TiVo Mini that's linked to a Premier. All other commands are fine, but when I get to the end of a recorded program and try to select the delete command, the interface locks up for a few minutes. It happens with all shows, and if I wait a few minutes it appears to time out/unfreeze and everything returns to normal. The physical/IR remote works fine.

I haven't gotten much of a response from Roomie support, so it's good to see the issue getting some attention here. Looking forward to seeing it get resolved eventually!


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## elprice7345 (Sep 28, 2009)

I found another bug with Roomie Remote and TiVo.

After the most recent Roomie and Tivo SW updates (not sure which update is the culprit), the keyboard in the Roomie Remote won't type in Tivo. You can type letters, but they don't show up. 

After opening a support ticket with Roomie, they gave me a workaround - type everything with CAPS Lock on.

Hopefully Roomie will fix this bug in a future release and hopefully posting this workaround will help someone else.

I have asked Roomie to document the solution on their FAQs or Support forums.


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## elprice7345 (Sep 28, 2009)

I started a thread related to TiVo Premiere, Roomie Remote, TiVo Remote, & kmttg here: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10497404#post10497404

I started a different thread so as not to hijack this thread, but wanted to post the link to the thread for those who might want to read it.


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## elprice7345 (Sep 28, 2009)

elprice7345 said:


> I found another bug with Roomie Remote and TiVo.
> 
> After the most recent Roomie and Tivo SW updates (not sure which update is the culprit), the keyboard in the Roomie Remote won't type in Tivo. You can type letters, but they don't show up.
> 
> ...


This bug was fixed by Roomie by forcing all search typing to automatically be entered in all CAPS.


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