# TiVo and captioning



## infael (Sep 27, 2007)

I switched from Comcast to a smaller provider. Falcon Broadband's DVR machines are decidedly inferior, especially with captioning. I used to be able to change caption color and size as well as make the background transparent. 

Can anyone tell me about Tivo's captioning capabilities?

TIA

infael


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## mick66 (Oct 15, 2004)

S1 and S2 Tivos don't have any caption capabilities. Your Tivo just passes the captioning data to your TV so that your TV's captioning can use it. I Don't know about the HD Tivos.


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## phox_mulder (Feb 23, 2006)

Unless you are speaking of a TiVoHD or TiVoS3, they both have caption decode ability, along with the options of changing size and font.
Not sure on color or transparency though.

They can decode both traditional closed captioning and Digital Closed Captioning found in HD programs among others.


phox


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

The digital captions' fonts, colors and backgrounds can be changed.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

phox_mulder said:


> Not sure on color or transparency though.


Color: Yes. Transparency: No.


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

That is one of the advantages of our Motorola DVR over our TiVo... background transparency on the Closed Captions. (We also like that we can change font, too, with the Motorola DVR.)


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## bmgoodman (Dec 20, 2000)

Let me tell you of my negative experiences with closed captioning on my S3. If you search for my posts for this year, I'm sure you can find all the details. Let me just summarize by saying that my S3 seems to miss the closed captioning data about half the time, while my Series 2 and my Series 1 probably miss the captioning close to never. And let me be clear, I've recorded the exact same program from the exact same channel on my S3 and my S2 where my S3 has no captions and my S2 does! This is on regular analog cable channels (no HD, no cable box, same source coaxial cable with splitter), and it has been true on broadcast channels as well as cable-only channels like USA and TNT. So far, it has been the most frustrating thing about the S3.


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

You experience sounds a little like mine. This is a problem that TiVo does know about (confirmed by a TiVo rep, via PMs here on TCF), but so far they have provided no indication that they plan to do anything to remedy it.

It only affects SD channels where the cable company inserts commercials (so generally broadcast channels are NOT affected). Whenever the program returns from a cable company inserted commercial break, the Closed Captions are gone. This is very consistent. However, since so few people complain about it, apparently TiVo doesn't have much rationale for researching and addressing the problem.

If you're experiencing this, keep very close tabs on it and make a log for a few weeks, noting each instance, what channel, and how long into the program the Closed Captions vanished. Then submit the complaint through various channels. If enough people express disappointment, TiVo may take action.

*See update on this, below (#14).*


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## infael (Sep 27, 2007)

bicker said:


> That is one of the advantages of our Motorola DVR over our TiVo... background transparency on the Closed Captions. (We also like that we can change font, too, with the Motorola DVR.)


Falcon Broadband doesn't use those Motorola DVRs. They said it's incompatible with their system. I'm stuck with FBB til Jan 09, after which I'll most likely go back to Comcast and their Motorola DVRs.

After reading the above posts re Tivo captions, I think I will pass on getting a Tivo.


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## bmgoodman (Dec 20, 2000)

bicker said:


> You experience sounds a little like mine. This is a problem that TiVo does know about (confirmed by a TiVo rep, via PMs here on TCF), but so far they have provided no indication that they plan to do anything to remedy it.
> 
> It only affects SD channels where the cable company inserts commercials (so generally broadcast channels are NOT affected). Whenever the program returns from a cable company inserted commercial break, the Closed Captions are gone.


I am having the captions problems even on regular broadcast channels (CBS, NBC, ABC, etc.), and my captions are missing from the beginning. I'm wondering if I just have a problem with MY particular S3, because I've not seen others reporting this issue. (Or maybe few folks use captions? Or maybe few have an S2 and S3 to be able to compare?)


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

I can assure that we have great Closed Captions service from our TiVo S3 on HD programs, from ABC, CBS, and NBC, so it isn't the case that the S3 is incapable.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

Is there anyone here who can confirm or refute my speculation that 9.1 brings Tivo-side caption rendering to the S2?


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## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

infael said:


> After reading the above posts re Tivo captions, I think I will pass on getting a Tivo.


Don't make a decision based on a few incidents. I am a 100% of the time caption user, and have no problems. Believe me, if I did, I would know. I have used captions for years on my S2, my S3 and the cableco SA8300HD. (On the S2, it's merely passed thru to the TV.) I have no problems with either the S2 or S3; the SA8300HD routinely messes up. Almost every screen of captions has a word or two missing letters. The S3 rarely misses any.

This is no different than the pixellation problem. I have it on a couple channels, but most people don't. It seems there are some people who have caption problems, but most don't.

I would get one and try it, rather than pass up the best DVR, and the best caption-handling DVR, on the market.

YMMV.


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

bicker said:


> You experience sounds a little like mine. This is a problem that TiVo does know about (confirmed by a TiVo rep, via PMs here on TCF), but so far they have provided no indication that they plan to do anything to remedy it.
> 
> It only affects SD channels where the cable company inserts commercials (so generally broadcast channels are NOT affected). Whenever the program returns from a cable company inserted commercial break, the Closed Captions are gone. This is very consistent. However, since so few people complain about it, apparently TiVo doesn't have much rationale for researching and addressing the problem.
> 
> If you're experiencing this, keep very close tabs on it and make a log for a few weeks, noting each instance, what channel, and how long into the program the Closed Captions vanished. Then submit the complaint through various channels. If enough people express disappointment, TiVo may take action.


I just got a PM confirming that this problem is resolved in 9.1. Yeah!

Ain't TiVo great?


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## ToddNeedsTiVo (Sep 2, 2003)

When a Tivo HD is rendering captions (as opposed to the television doing the rendering) for output over component or HDMI, does it normally position the text at the bottom of the screen? Does it also temporarily move the text higher up on the screen if the program itself has text at the bottom of the screen (such as opening credits)? 

My television's decoder does that when captioning from my Series 2. A lot of shows seem to keep showing credits over a few minutes' worth of dialog, and the text being bumped upward annoys my wife but I like it because it lets you see both text items. 

Am I to understand that the caption data is not present when sent from the TiVo HD via component or HDMI and thus can only be captioned in the TiVo (and not the television)?


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

I was under the impression that the captioner has control over where captions will display; that it is not something that the decoder has much to do with. I've noted that when watching programs on my TiVo versus my Motorola 3416, the captions are positioned in the same way.

Regarding HDMI: With digital outputs, captions are supposed to be decoded in the box, not at the display device. The TiVo supports caption decoding, so with a TiVo you've got no problem. The captions are merged into the digital video stream, and are essentially open captions from that point forward. With analog outputs, the encoded captions are passed-along, so you can decode them at the display device is you wish.


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## trainman (Jan 29, 2001)

bicker said:


> I was under the impression that the captioner has control over where captions will display; that it is not something that the decoder has much to do with. I've noted that when watching programs on my TiVo versus my Motorola 3416, the captions are positioned in the same way.


You are absolutely correct -- the position of the captions is controlled by the captioner.

If you ever see captions covering on-screen text, it's usually because the captioner was working from a not-quite-finished copy of the tape of the show -- although if it's on live programming, it's usually a sign that there's too much on-screen text (hey, you gotta put the captions _somewhere_).


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## Mordred (Oct 6, 2003)

ToddNeedsTiVo said:


> Am I to understand that the caption data is not present when sent from the TiVo HD via component or HDMI and thus can only be captioned in the TiVo (and not the television)?


This appears to be what I'm seeing and it's extremely annoying. I would rather have my TV doing the CCs than the Tivo. At least they should just pass them through for me. There doesn't appear to be any direct way to turn on the captions on the Tivo without going into the menu first which is extremely annoying.


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

Closed Caption control is on the info panel. Right arrow once while watching something, and the down arrow twice.


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## ToddNeedsTiVo (Sep 2, 2003)

After nearly a month with my TiVo HD, I'm mostly satisfied with the operation of its captions. Mine's going through HDMI. 

It drops a few characters every now and then, but so did my LG HDTV when I was using it directly for OTA stuff.

Did we decide if captions are rendered TiVo-side for component connections, too? Haven't had a need to use component yet.


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

Yes. Digital CC decoded in the TiVo.


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## jmemmott (Jul 12, 2003)

Hopefully this is not too far off topic - if it is, forgive me but this thread seemed to be a good place to try to reach the right people.

Since T2G for the series 3 came out and I purchased a TivoHD, I have been able to start testing T2Sami against HD recordings from a Series 3. So far it seems that T2Sami will process all TivoHD recordings (SD,HD) as well as it handles Series 2 recordings. I would like to jump to the conclusion that it can extract CC on a PC from all Series 2 and Series 3 recordings but I do not have an original Series 3 machine to test against. Although I believe it is a a good assumption that this will work, I hate using assumptions. If some one gets around to trying to extract captions from an original Series 3 HD recording, I would like to hear how it goes...

Thanks


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## JustAllie (Jan 5, 2002)

trainman said:


> You are absolutely correct -- the position of the captions is controlled by the captioner.
> 
> If you ever see captions covering on-screen text, it's usually because the captioner was working from a not-quite-finished copy of the tape of the show -- although if it's on live programming, it's usually a sign that there's too much on-screen text (hey, you gotta put the captions _somewhere_).


It's a pity that you can't buy a separate device that would sit just above or below the TV to display the captions. But maybe that would draw the eye too far away from the screen.


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## barbeedoll (Sep 26, 2005)

bicker said:


> Closed Caption control is on the info panel. Right arrow once while watching something, and the down arrow twice.


Stupid question, but how do you turn it off?

Barbeedoll


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

Same strokes, just switch them Off instead of On.


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## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

ToddNeedsTiVo said:


> Did we decide if captions are rendered TiVo-side for component connections, too? Haven't had a need to use component yet.


Absolutely yes. I have one S3 on HDMI, and the other on component. Both are identical in the way captions are rendered.



jmemmott said:


> If some one gets around to trying to extract captions from an original Series 3 HD recording, I would like to hear how it goes...
> 
> Thanks


I will try it tonight. I haven't used TTG in a while, although I do use MRV all the time (since they opened it up a couple weeks ago). I will TTG an HD recording from my S3, and run T2Sami on it. I loved T2Sami back when I was TTG'ing from my S2.


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## Mordred (Oct 6, 2003)

bicker said:


> Closed Caption control is on the info panel. Right arrow once while watching something, and the down arrow twice.


Still, if the TiVoHD just passed the captions on, I could hit the CC button on my TVs remote and they would instantly appear. Doesn't that seem better? I don't understand what the drawback to passing them on at all is. Sure, don't pass them if the tivo is decoding them, but if it isn't, just leave them in the signal!

My TV does much prettier CCs than my TiVo HD


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## E94Allen (Oct 16, 2005)

Mordred said:


> Still, if the TiVoHD just passed the captions on, I could hit the CC button on my TVs remote and they would instantly appear. Doesn't that seem better? I don't understand what the drawback to passing them on at all is. Sure, don't pass them if the tivo is decoding them, but if it isn't, just leave them in the signal!
> 
> My TV does much prettier CCs than my TiVo HD


I second it. I own TiVo HD and I am not happy about how it works with CC signals either I much perfer HDTV's CC.


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## jmemmott (Jul 12, 2003)

Mordred said:


> Still, if the TiVoHD just passed the captions on, I could hit the CC button on my TVs remote and they would instantly appear. Doesn't that seem better? I don't understand what the drawback to passing them on at all is. Sure, don't pass them if the tivo is decoding them, but if it isn't, just leave them in the signal!(


My (perhaps limited) understanding is that there is no mechanism for passing the captions on to a TV using the component or HDMI jacks. These are video input channels not TV signal channels so TVs do not contain CC decoders for signals that enter that way. In fact, no standard has even been established for such a decoder (although some of the disability lobby groups are pushing for the FCC to create one).

Therefore, for a TivoHD to pass the information on with out decoding it and injecting it into the video signal as image data, you would have to use the composite jack which is not capable of transferring HD. You then have the following choices : CC in the signal without HD, HD over component or HDMI without CC, or Tivo decoded CC added to the HD video.


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

Mordred said:


> Still, if the TiVoHD just passed the captions on, I could hit the CC button on my TVs remote and they would instantly appear.


The specifications aren't written that way. You'll need to appeal that to the the standards organization.


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## Mordred (Oct 6, 2003)

jmemmott said:


> My (perhaps limited) understanding is that there is no mechanism for passing the captions on to a TV using the component or HDMI jacks. These are video input channels not TV signal channels so TVs do not contain CC decoders for signals that enter that way. In fact, no standard has even been established for such a decoder (although some of the disability lobby groups are pushing for the FCC to create one).
> 
> Therefore, for a TivoHD to pass the information on with out decoding it and injecting it into the video signal as image data, you would have to use the composite jack which is not capable of transferring HD. You then have the following choices : CC in the signal without HD, HD over component or HDMI without CC, or Tivo decoded CC added to the HD video.


I thought that some of the scanline data that you can sometimes see in Full-Pixel mode on some HD Channels (usually blocked by any overscan) contained the CCs as well, but apparently I'm wrong on that.


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

Indeed. Digital CC are *not* encoded in "Line 21" or somesuch.


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## jmemmott (Jul 12, 2003)

Mordred said:


> I thought that some of the scanline data that you can sometimes see in Full-Pixel mode on some HD Channels (usually blocked by any overscan) contained the CCs as well, but apparently I'm wrong on that.


No TVs contain CC decoder circuitry on the HDMI input.

A few TVs can process CC from component inputs *if* the incoming signal is 480i by routing a recombined signal through the composite decoder. Many TVs do not implement this path because it isn't required or in high demand.

If you are using anything other than 480i, none of the TVs can not process the CC data - in part because there is no standard to define how the information would be found/extracted/decoded by the CC decoder in a component or composite signal at the other resolutions. The digital CC stream is in an separate sub-channel of the digital television signal. Line-21 and overscan vanish along with the rest of the mixed analog signal in the digital world. So, without a new standard for encoding it, it would require a seperate set of jacks/cables to pass it on to a TV. So for HD viewing, the video source, Tivo or STB, has to do the work.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

BTW, when using the closed captioning on my S3, I fairly frequently see some *spanish* words or partial words after the English text.

I admit I haven't tried turning on my TV's closed captioning (at least not in a long time) to see if it showed up there too... but I also record a lot of stuff on my S1s and my Toshiba XS32, and I have *never* seen this phenomena on any of their recordings when using the TV's CC.. only when using the Tivo's built in CC.

The strangest thing is that I haven't heard of any way to have multilingual CC.. and no, it's not just garbage characters... or if so, it's VERY coincidental. (That is, it's recognizably spanish words/partial words, and often matches the spanish version of something in the English text.)


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## jmemmott (Jul 12, 2003)

mattack said:


> The strangest thing is that I haven't heard of any way to have multilingual CC.. and no, it's not just garbage characters... or if so, it's VERY coincidental. (That is, it's recognizably spanish words/partial words, and often matches the spanish version of something in the English text.)


I have not encountered this on the Tivo but I did encounter it when I was setting up T2Sami on the PC. There are two sets of two sub-channels in a standard CC signal. These are typically mapped to CC1, CC2, CC3 and CC4 in a TV set. CC3 and CC4 are not often used. CC1 normally contains English and CC2 often contains a second language - frequently Spanish. CC1 and CC2 are "mixed" together and have to be separated by control codes in the data stream itself. If this is not being done correctly by the Tivo decoder, the effect you describe is what I would expect to see.


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## Mordred (Oct 6, 2003)

bicker said:


> Closed Caption control is on the info panel. Right arrow once while watching something, and the down arrow twice.


Unless I'm missing something, this is not the case with the TiVo HD. You have to Right arrow once, down arrow 4 times, hit select, wait a couple seconds for the caption menu to be displayed, arrow down once, right arrow once, and arrow down again to turn on caption... then you have to either hit Live TV to go back to the show or the Tivo button to go to the now playing list. How convenient!

Why can't I just turn on the captions without leaving the actual program?


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## timckelley (Oct 15, 2002)

I was very pleasantly surprised and astonished when I discovered my new TiVo HD has captioning built in. My TV has no captions, and I've always wanted them, because I often watch when my family is asleep, so I don't want the volume too loud.

I had no idea when I bought the TiVo HD that it came with captions. Not only that, but you can customize the font and size. Furthermore, when you change the TV volume, the captions don't suddenly disappear, like they do on our other TV that my wife's TiVo is hooked to. So this is quite nice.


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## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

mattack said:


> BTW, when using the closed captioning on my S3, I fairly frequently see some *spanish* words or partial words after the English text.


I've been seeing this too! It just started within the last month or two (I've had an S3 for a year). The normal (English) captions are ok, but at the end will be a few characters from the Spanish captioning. I speak a little Spanish, so I know what the words are, and it is definitely the Spanish captioning. The words are always the Spanish translation of whatever is being said at that time. It is usually in lower case (while most captions are upper case). It's not a big deal, only happens on occasion, but it is defintely there!


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

Mordred said:


> Why can't I just turn on the captions without leaving the actual program?


Because it isn't designed that way.


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## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

Mordred said:


> Why can't I just turn on the captions without leaving the actual program?


This is a highly requested feature by caption users.

It could be better, but it could be worse. I also have an SA DVR with the SARA software, and it's pretty easy to turn on & off, without leaving the program. My dad has a Moto box in Colorado (I'm in Houston) with Passport software, and you actually have to turn the unit off and reboot to switch captions on & off. Yes, *reboot!* Which of course means if you are recording something, and want to watch something already recorded w/captions, you have to wait until the recording is finished.


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

Yes, good point. Among DVRs, TiVo is among the best in this regard.


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## Mordred (Oct 6, 2003)

bicker said:


> Yes, good point. Among DVRs, TiVo is among the best in this regard.


In my opinion, they are just not as bad as they could possibly be, but I guess I'll stop complaining about it as their poor initial implementation leaves little room for improving the situation now.


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## phox_mulder (Feb 23, 2006)

astrohip said:


> I've been seeing this too! It just started within the last month or two (I've had an S3 for a year). The normal (English) captions are ok, but at the end will be a few characters from the Spanish captioning.


Some shows have started dual captioning, English on CC1, Spanish on CC2, 
I'll throw Cane out as an example.

CBS sent a memo telling us to check and make sure we were passing CC2 before Cane premiered, as this was the first show they had aired with dual captions.

Both CC1 and CC2 are on the same line, so it would be easy for them to get mixed in with each other.

(or maybe spanish was on CC3)

phox


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## trainman (Jan 29, 2001)

astrohip said:


> The normal (English) captions are ok, but at the end will be a few characters from the Spanish captioning. I speak a little Spanish, so I know what the words are, and it is definitely the Spanish captioning. The words are always the Spanish translation of whatever is being said at that time. It is usually in lower case (while most captions are upper case). It's not a big deal, only happens on occasion, but it is defintely there!


Spanish captioning is done in mixed case because, in the standard analog captioning character set, most of the accented characters are only available in their lower-case form.

English captioning is usually done in upper case because that's the way it's always been done.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

jmemmott said:


> I have not encountered this on the Tivo but I did encounter it when I was setting up T2Sami on the PC. There are two sets of two sub-channels in a standard CC signal. These are typically mapped to CC1, CC2, CC3 and CC4 in a TV set. CC3 and CC4 are not often used. CC1 normally contains English and CC2 often contains a second language - frequently Spanish. CC1 and CC2 are "mixed" together and have to be separated by control codes in the data stream itself. If this is not being done correctly by the Tivo decoder, the effect you describe is what I would expect to see.


tangential question:
Doesn't this mean that there is less bandwidth for each CC language?
or is it split up into 4 sections and even if only the main one is used, that's all the bandwidth it gets?

In other words, I would expect that line 21 with only one 'channel' of captions could fit a lot more text than one that needed 4 channels. CC is slow enough that they sometimes miss words anyway. Part of this is to keep up with the speakers, but I thought it was sometimes due to the slow CPS speed of the captions..


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## jmemmott (Jul 12, 2003)

mattack said:


> tangential question:
> Doesn't this mean that there is less bandwidth for each CC language?
> or is it split up into 4 sections and even if only the main one is used, that's all the bandwidth it gets?


In traditional Line 21 captions, CC1 and CC2 share bandwidth as do CC3 and CC4. This lies behind the FCC recommendation that when dual language broadcasts are made, CC1 be used for English and CC3 be used for the second language. However many of the early decoders only handled CC1 and CC2 so broadcasters got in the habit of using those channels and they do step on each others bandwidth. The text speed is usually not the problem. It is all the control codes for screen positioning, rollup vs popup, etc. that actually consume a lot of resources.

In the case of HD and digital broadcasting, all of this data is carried as binary data in a separate data channel with more than enough bandwidth to allow CC1-CC4, XDS, T1-T4 and other data streams to consume what ever they need without steping on each other. This is one of the pluses for moving to digital broadcasting.


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## barbeedoll (Sep 26, 2005)

bicker said:


> Same strokes, just switch them Off instead of On.


Duh! I was skipping over the "on the info panel" part and thinking this was a quick trick with the remote.

Gotchanow.

Barbeedoll


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## Big Rick (Aug 12, 2004)

I was annoyed about the captioning, also, until I found out that you can get to captioning by pressing the right-arrow while watching video. True, you have to leave the show for a brief second or two when you toggle it, but at least Tivo backs you up to the spot you were at when you left. I love Tivo.


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## hastypete (Oct 2, 2007)

bicker said:


> Because it isn't designed that way.


NSS.

I think what he means is why don't they re-design it that way. and I think you knew that.


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

Read the earlier part of the thread, and you'll understand my reply.


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## Mars Rocket (Mar 24, 2000)

Nevertheless, TiVo has a method for turning the captions on and off, and if they so chose they could make it a single-button action. The problem is that the TiVo remote doesn't have any way of selecting such an action, so if they *did* make it available it wouldn't work for most people.

It's possible that there is a function like that and that it is simply unavailable via the TiVo remote but could be used by those who can program their remotes to send out a custom code. There are 256 code possibilities, right? How many are in use by the TiVo remote? 40 or so?

Think about the "Jump to Now Playing" function (List) that was available on the Sony Series-1 remote - the software supported it, but the standard TiVo remote just couldn't send the proper signal to make it happen.


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

Big Rick said:


> I was annoyed about the captioning, also, until I found out that you can get to captioning by pressing the right-arrow while watching video. True, you have to leave the show for a brief second or two when you toggle it, but at least Tivo backs you up to the spot you were at when you left. I love Tivo.


My main problem with this is that is that I run the TiVo in native mode and by going into the menus, unless I'm watching a 720p program, my TV needs to switch to 720p which blanks the screen for a few seconds. Once I turn CC on and go back to what I'm watching it blanks the screen again for a few seconds. So even though I've memorized the remote steps (info, down, down, down, select, down, right, up, select) it still takes at least 5 seconds to turn CC on and off and I have to instant replay to see the few seconds I missed when coming out of the CC menus while my TV was switching resolutions.

Most of the time I turn it on because I can't understand a single phrase and then immediately turn it off again. A one button solution would be much more user friendly. TiVo could use the down or up arrow since neither is used during playback.


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## markboy008 (Oct 6, 2007)

morac said:


> My main problem with this is that is that I run the TiVo in native mode and by going into the menus, unless I'm watching a 720p program, my TV needs to switch to 720p which blanks the screen for a few seconds. Once I turn CC on and go back to what I'm watching it blanks the screen again for a few seconds. So even though I've memorized the remote steps (info, down, down, down, select, down, right, up, select) it still takes at least 5 seconds to turn CC on and off and I have to instant replay to see the few seconds I missed when coming out of the CC menus while my TV was switching resolutions.
> 
> Most of the time I turn it on because I can't understand a single phrase and then immediately turn it off again. A one button solution would be much more user friendly. TiVo could use the down or up arrow since neither is used during playback.


I totally agree - that is the exact reason I use CC, and most televisions support this with one button (either a with dedicated CC button, or a "CC on mute" setting). Comments like "there are worse solutions than Tivo's" or "it wasn't designed that way" don't make an 9 key sequence and leaving the program anywhere near user-friendly, and falls well below the usability standards that I think we all love in Tivo. Seems it would be pretty easy for Tivo to develop a reasonable remote sequence to toggle this.

In the meantime, I've been using a kludgy back-door workaround that you might try that *is only 5 key presses instead of 9, and doesn't leave the show or cause screen-blanking while switching video*. I enable the lower-right hand on-screen clock via the backdoor key sequence "select-play-select-9-select". It turns out when the clock is on, it blocks CC. So I set CC to be on all the time. Normally it is blocked by the clock and doesn't show, so to turn it on I press S-P-S-9-S to turn off the clock and unblock CC, then I press S-P-S-9-S to turn the clock back on and block CC.


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## Bradc314 (Dec 4, 2001)

I tried the SPS9S trick last night, and added it to my dad's Harmony remote. This self-made toggle only worked about 50&#37; of the time. Most of the time it changed to channel 9...


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## omni555 (Oct 4, 2006)

If you are watching live TV, SPS9S will change your channel to 9. On the other hand, if you are viewing a recording, it will not.


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