# What Now?



## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

Just got off the phone with TiVo support for the third time in as many months. 

My Premier XL keeps locking up when you press the Tivo button or come out of a file folder. I must cold start the box to get the beast working again.

My wife's temper has grown short with several crashes each evening. Our old series two box never crashed. Period.

The first to calls to TiVo resulted in "we are updating the software please wait a month or so". We did this and some software changes were made but in the latest 14.4 thing got a lot worse. Too bad we can't roll these things back a version.

I made a third call tonight and was told that my problem was a weak wireless signal. I informed the CSR that I was using Ethernet, not wireless. Humm...might not be that...sounds of pages turning in the background.

After being put on hold I was told to turn on the standard menus and wait for an update. I asked when I might get the update and the CSR told me that it might be some time. Maybe as little as 2-3 days or it might be a month or more.

So now were back to a low def display, one CPU running and perhaps a software update that might come, sometime. Why did I spend the cash for this box? 

Just for fun I have built a PC with four tuners and a blu ray player. It costs much less than the TiVo premier XL and it does not require constant rebooting. I'm working on the software to integrate the system and expect to go to a 0.9 release soon. My Premier may end up on ebay. 

In the mean time, what is TiVo going to do to make my new XL work as advertised. It would be very nice to use the HD menus. I paid for a two core CPU, it would be nice to be able to use it. Where is Pandora? 

I have always loved my TiVo's in the past but now things are not so good. 

TiVo what can we do to make this right?


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 28, 2002)

You can get 14.5 by emailing Margaret (Margret's Twitter account @tivodesign) supposedly. But HAVING 14.5, I will say it won't help you much. You need to leave it on the SD menus for it not to lock up and work sluggishly. Don't plan on using the HD interface for 6-12 months, if then. It will take them at least that long to get it to acceptable usability for the HD interface.

I really am surprised there hasn't been a class action suit for this device yet. It's functionally broken and has been since its release four months ago.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

But why should I have to wait something like 6 to 10 months? They advertised it as a working product. I have used TiVo's products in the past and they have been solid right out of the box.

With my Premier XL I must wait nearly a YEAR so that someone, somewhere, writes some software that will actually make this box work? REALLY?

We converted over to SD a few hours ago and It's only crashed once, I guess that's better than the HD setup:down:?

So what to do? I love the internet as one can express their option freely and inform like minded people of problems with a product.

Has anyone received a decent response from TiVo on this matter?


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## TrueTurbo (Feb 19, 2008)

curiousgeorge said:


> You can get 14.5 by emailing Margaret (Margret's Twitter account @tivodesign) supposedly. But HAVING 14.5, I will say it won't help you much. You need to leave it on the SD menus for it not to lock up and work sluggishly. Don't plan on using the HD interface for 6-12 months, if then. It will take them at least that long to get it to acceptable usability for the HD interface.
> 
> I really am surprised there hasn't been a class action suit for this device yet. It's functionally broken and has been since its release four months ago.


Sigh, here we go again. 

Your TiVo may actually be 'functionally broken', or that may just be your critical opinion, but the Premiere works fine for many, many other people. If you seriously believe the Premiere is so bad, put your money where your mouth is, engage a lawyer and start the class action suit you are so eager to join.

The TiVo Premiere is most certainly a little rough around the edges. I wish it wasn't, but it is absolutely not functionally broken! It works. It does what it's supposed to. I haven't noticed anything that is actually broken. If you don't like it or it doesn't work properly in your house, get rid of the damned thing.


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## TrueTurbo (Feb 19, 2008)

Daniel Skeen said:


> But why should I have to wait something like 6 to 10 months? They advertised it as a working product. I have used TiVo's products in the past and they have been solid right out of the box.
> 
> With my Premier XL I must wait nearly a YEAR so that someone, somewhere, writes some software that will actually make this box work? REALLY?
> 
> ...


If your TiVo XL keeps crashing, it probably is damaged in some way. If TiVo support can't fix the problem over the phone, insist that they replace the unit. Why struggle with a broken unit that is pissing you off!?


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

TrueTurbo said:


> If your TiVo XL keeps crashing, it probably is damaged in some way. If TiVo support can't fix the problem over the phone, insist that they replace the unit. Why struggle with a broken unit that is pissing you off!?


Why, well, the nice people at TiVo have promised me several times that a fix to my problem is just around the corner. The way the thing acts it's very clear that's this is a software bug. In fact IMHO it's a UI bug that's causing our hang ups and crashes. I doubt that changing out the hardware would effect such easy to reproduce problem.

The slowness (no, it is s l o w , even for such a low powered processor) is a more septicemic problem likely related to poor development at the kernel level. OK, I must admit this can be a huge problem to fix but one would expect that a form would have the foundation of their system in place before even going beta (*sigh*).

As to placing my mouth on my credit card I must admit that I have already been contacted by several people already contemplating other action. I shall rake in what they say but in the mean time might consider replacing the XL with my home brew HTPC or picking up a refurb series 3.

For all those people that have good, solid, fully functional Premier's I'm glad that its working for you. For myself and many, many others we would like what we paid for.


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## TrueTurbo (Feb 19, 2008)

Daniel Skeen said:


> Why, well, the nice people at TiVo have promised me several times that a fix to my problem is just around the corner. The way the thing acts it's very clear that's this is a software bug. In fact IMHO it's a UI bug that's causing our hang ups and crashes. I doubt that changing out the hardware would effect such easy to reproduce problem.


If it was a software bug, don't you think all of us running the same software version would suffer the same problems you do? We don't! My XL doesn't hang, it doesn't reboot and the speed of the HD menus is tolerable (but not fast!).

You either have a hardware problem or the software on your machine is corrupted in some way. If you don't have any recordings on the drive that you can't afford to lose and you are OK recreating any Season Passes you've set up, you should clear the TiVo completely and reload the latest software. I think there's a menu option to do so. Otherwise, there's a 'kickstart code' that does a wipe and reload (check here - 'http://www.weaknees.com/tivo-kickstart-codes.php' - for details about TiVo kickstart codes.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

TrueTurbo said:


> If it was a software bug, don't you think all of us running the same software version would suffer the same problems you do? We don't! My XL doesn't hang, it doesn't reboot and the speed of the HD menus is tolerable (but not fast!).
> 
> You either have a hardware problem or the software on your machine is corrupted in some way. If you don't have any recordings on the drive that you can't afford to lose and you are OK recreating any Season Passes you've set up, you should clear the TiVo completely and reload the latest software. I think there's a menu option to do so. Otherwise, there's a 'kickstart code' that does a wipe and reload (check here - 'http://www.weaknees.com/tivo-kickstart-codes.php' - for details about TiVo kickstart codes.


Good idea. Been there, done that.

It seems that on my unit that when ever we enter the HD screen we either stall out for several seconds or it just hangs ( by this I mean that the UI stops drawing or the screen goes black for one minute or more).

The unit was slow out of thew box, but it did not hang. When it updated we started to get the lockups big time. The easiest way to reproduce this problem is to have to programs recording and attempt to open or close the HD user interface. It will hang about 30% of the time.

The fact that the hangups did not take place with the older software and that a heavy recording load seems to make the problem worse points to a software problem. I am looking forward to the next update (14.15k ??) to see if this problem stays in place. I hope it's gone for good but it's possible that it may resurface as another symptom.

The reason that everyone does not see this is likely a software deployment problem. Although we may all have the same updates the means and order of the installs plus the influence of the user can give a machine what some would call a personality.

I would site the following example to demonstrate this point: I crash the XL about once a week at most. My good wife has a knack at electronic mayhem and blasts that pup at least once every evening.

My daughter crashes it quite often as well.

As far as I know it as seldom if ever reset on it's own. It requires input from the user in the HD menu's.

On the other hand our series 2 trucks on. It's never crashed. Ever.


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## caddyroger (Mar 15, 2005)

If you have the Tivo in the SDUI and it it still locking up. You may have a bad Tivo. Do not let the Tivo cs tell you it a software problem. About 30% of the premiere can not use the HDUI because of it being slow, locks up reboots. I have mine in the SDUI and have not had any problems. 
If tivo works on any thing esle beside the slowness and reboots I might be seeing a lawyer.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

TrueTurbo said:


> If your TiVo XL keeps crashing, it probably is damaged in some way. If TiVo support can't fix the problem over the phone, insist that they replace the unit. Why struggle with a broken unit that is pissing you off!?


this. With the third phone call and answers provided I would be politely but firmly staying on the line until I received an RMA

PS - it is known the HD UI looks to the internet as it draws things like the discovery bar. Do not discount some Internet issue like latency or upload speed etc..

PPS - the fact that you have to reboot so often leads me to think you now have some corrupt files. If you had a PC that crashed like that you certainly would have reinstalled the OS by now


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## Geophory (May 8, 2010)

What remote control are you using? Certain codes on the Harmony remotes can cause crashes.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

Daniel Skeen said:


> After being put on hold I was told to turn on the standard menus and wait for an update. I asked when I might get the update and the CSR told me that it might be some time. Maybe as little as 2-3 days or it might be a month or more.
> 
> So now were back to a low def display, one CPU running and perhaps a software update that might come, sometime. Why did I spend the cash for this box?


1) It is not a low def display, it is just a low def menu system (and is much faster)
2) You were not running two cores before, just one. And if TiVo ever enables the other core, there is no reason (yet) to believe it will make any difference in UI performance
3) Not sure on that last one... I am still waiting.... and hoping.....



> Just for fun I have built a PC with four tuners and a blu ray player. It costs much less than the TiVo premier XL and it does not require constant rebooting.


And probably doesn't support cable card nor SDV, thus no cable channels, right? And it certainly doesn't cost less than a non-XL. If I had no access to the History Channel, SciFy, Science Channel, etc, then I would have almost no use for a DVR at all.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

crxssi said:


> 1) It is not a low def display, it is just a low def menu system (and is much faster)
> 2) You were not running two cores before, just one. And if TiVo ever enables the other core, there is no reason (yet) to believe it will make any difference in UI performance
> 3) Not sure on that last one... I am still waiting.... and hoping.....
> 
> And probably doesn't support cable card nor SDV, thus no cable channels, right? And it certainly doesn't cost less than a non-XL. If I had no access to the History Channel, SciFy, Science Channel, etc, then I would have almost no use for a DVR at all.


In fact it has four (count them four) HD/SD tuners with cable card. It gets all the channels that the XL gets plus I can play/record blu ray / DVDs and CDs. It can also play several formats including VOB, ISO and H.264.

Cost wise I unloaded most of the work on the adapter cards so a simple low end quad runs it all. Storage is on my NAS farm.

My point on the cores is that I_* bought*_ a twin core system that is now running on a single core. Kind of like buying a V8 where only four cylinders work pending a dealer up grade some time in the future (maybe????).

As far as speed? A twin core CPU with good software will run about 1.5 times as fast as a single core of the same speed. Where you see the real boost is running multi thread apps (like a UI and an OS) or two apps running in separate threads.

I just want to know when I'm going to get what I paid for?


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

ZeoTiVo said:


> this. With the third phone call and answers provided I would be politely but firmly staying on the line until I received an RMA
> 
> In fact I called again today and they hung up on me just like they did at the end of my call last nigh. No, it's not a problem with my phone, I have made many calls this week without any problems. No, I was VERY nice to the young man with a southern drawl.
> 
> I am saddened that it's beginning to look like that TiVo just does not care any more about their customers.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

Geophory said:


> What remote control are you using? Certain codes on the Harmony remotes can cause crashes.


Box stock Tivo glow in the dark clicker.


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## Duke (May 6, 2000)

Geophory said:


> What remote control are you using? Certain codes on the Harmony remotes can cause crashes.


Can you provide some more details about this please?


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Daniel Skeen said:


> ZeoTiVo said:
> 
> 
> > this. With the third phone call and answers provided I would be politely but firmly staying on the line until I received an RMA
> ...


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

please change your post below - Daniel Skeen screwed up quoting me and now you have it looking like what he said in reply to me is actually my words - which is not the case



Daniel Skeen said:


> ZeoTiVo said:
> 
> 
> > this. With the third phone call and answers provided I would be politely but firmly staying on the line until I received an RMA
> ...


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

Daniel Skeen said:


> In fact it has four (count them four) HD/SD tuners with cable card.


OK, then that is impressive (although you didn't address SDV). Most people blah blah blah about homemade DVR's and they have no cable cards nor SDV compatibility, so they can get only over the air in areas that require both.



> As far as speed? A twin core CPU with good software will run about 1.5 times as fast as a single core of the same speed.


That is FAR too generalized. It can run anywhere from almost 2 times as fast down to no difference in speed at all. It depends on exactly what is running and how those apps are programmed (and also CPU architecture and some other factors).



> Where you see the real boost is running multi thread apps (like a UI and an OS) or two apps running in separate threads.


That is correct. However, there is no reason AT ALL to believe that the TiVo's "Flash" based HDUI is multithreaded. I suspect it is not. And if the CPU is otherwise unloaded (which it probably is), and if the HDUI is not threaded, then having a second active core will do absolutely nothing for a TiVo Premiere. Only time will tell at this point...

It is rather odd that TiVo chose to disable the second core, even if there is not that much use for it at the moment. It should otherwise be idle and not use much power.... but power is about the only thing I can think of.


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## turbobozz (Sep 21, 2006)

crxssi said:


> OK, then that is impressive (although you didn't address SDV). Most people blah blah blah about homemade DVR's and they have no cable cards nor SDV compatibility, so they can get only over the air in areas that require both.


SDV adapters work with MediaCenter DVRs fine.
Some adapters only handle 2 streams, so you'd need to have multiple SDV adapters attached.


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## turbobozz (Sep 21, 2006)

ferrumpneuma said:


> That is not the Ceton InfiniTV 4 is it? I thought they are pre-order only still.
> 
> What quad tuner cablecard tuner are you using?


Ceton InfiniTV 4 is shipping sparingly now, but that is not the only way to get 4 tuners w/ cable card.
You can use 2 of the existing 2 tuner cablecard devices.


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## bobfrank (Mar 17, 2005)

Daniel Skeen said:


> The easiest way to reproduce this problem is to have to (sic) programs recording and attempt to open or close the HD user interface. It will hang about 30% of the time.


Tivo is ALWAYS recording two programs, if only for the buffer. So the "heavy recording load" you refer to is a constant and would have no effect on the hang ups.


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## Goldwing2001 (Sep 30, 2006)

[I really am surprised there hasn't been a class action suit for this device yet. It's functionally broken and has been since its release four months ago.[/QUOTE]

Are you serious...a class action suit?

Most people who purchase a product that they deem "Unusable" or "Unsatisfactory" return it and get a full refund.

As someone else here on this forum stated....most people who goto a forum are folks having issues or questions with a product. I beleive most people are satisfied with their TiVo Premier. I for one feel my Premier XL is the best model so far that TiVo has produced. Not to mention a promise of more HD funtionality and services to come on this model.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

turbobozz said:


> Ceton InfiniTV 4 is shipping sparingly now, but that is not the only way to get 4 tuners w/ cable card.
> You can use 2 of the existing 2 tuner cablecard devices.


Except for the fact ATI only made a single tuner. The InfiniTV 4 is the first card with more than one tuner. The other cable card tuner which originally was two tuners will now be three and still hasn't entered beta yet.


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## caddyroger (Mar 15, 2005)

Goldwing2001 said:


> [I really am surprised there hasn't been a class action suit for this device yet. It's functionally broken and has been since its release four months ago.


Are you serious...a class action suit?

Most people who purchase a product that they deem "Unusable" or "Unsatisfactory" return it and get a full refund.

As someone else here on this forum stated....most people who goto a forum are folks having issues or questions with a product. I beleive most people are satisfied with their TiVo Premier. I for one feel my Premier XL is the best model so far that TiVo has produced. Not to mention a promise of more HD funtionality and services to come on this model.[/QUOTE]

If Tivo would give my full purchase price back after 4 months I would return it. They will not now refund my money. The only recourse I have is a lawsuit to get tivo to get the Tivo to do what is advertised.


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## turbobozz (Sep 21, 2006)

innocentfreak said:


> Except for the fact ATI only made a single tuner. The InfiniTV 4 is the first card with more than one tuner. The other cable card tuner which originally was two tuners will now be three and still hasn't entered beta yet.


Touche on the DCT... I'm just used to seeing people using dual DCTs.
SiliconDust was collecting names for beta testing their cablecard tuner in April. I had assumed that meant they were actually starting their beta trials.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

turbobozz said:


> Ceton InfiniTV 4 is shipping sparingly now, but that is not the only way to get 4 tuners w/ cable card. You can use 2 of the existing 2 tuner cablecard devices.


InfiniTV 4 = $400! That is $100 more (25% more) than an undiscounted Premiere, and without a computer, drives, OS, remote.... Still kewl tech, though.


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## Rastven (Aug 4, 2010)

100 more and still not actually for sale.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

crxssi said:


> InfiniTV 4 = $400! That is $100 more (25% more) than an undiscounted Premiere, and without a computer, drives, OS, remote.... Still kewl tech, though.


Right, but the requirements to run it aren't that high and if you already have a Win 7 PC you don't need to buy the rest. On top of that if you already own a 360 you already have an extender so you don't even need the PC connected to the TV.

The PC in my sig is at my desk and I have 360s at each TV.

Also if you truly want to compare the InfiniTV 4 to a Premiere with lifetime, you would need 2 Premieres with Lifetime since the InfiniTV 4 has 4 tuners and no monthly subscription fees.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

innocentfreak said:


> Also if you truly want to compare the InfiniTV 4 to a Premiere with lifetime, you would need 2 Premieres


Well, only if you ever have a need to record more than 2 shows at once. I think that has happened to me only once in 10 years


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

innocentfreak said:


> Right, but the requirements to run it aren't that high and if you already have a Win 7 PC you don't need to buy the rest. On top of that if you already own a 360 you already have an extender so you don't even need the PC connected to the TV.
> 
> The PC in my sig is at my desk and I have 360s at each TV.
> 
> Also if you truly want to compare the InfiniTV 4 to a Premiere with lifetime, you would need 2 Premieres with Lifetime since the InfiniTV 4 has 4 tuners and no monthly subscription fees.


But no TiVo interface.

Multiple HD tuners in a PC is nothing new. With cable cards yes. But even when I used multiple HD tuners years ago with a PC, it was not as good as the TiVo because it was not running TiVo software.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

aaronwt said:


> But no TiVo interface.
> 
> Multiple HD tuners in a PC is nothing new. With cable cards yes. But even when I used multiple HD tuners years ago with a PC, it was not as good as the TiVo because it was not running TiVo software.


True but 4 tuners in one device coupled with a pretty good ui and some nice features starts to trump just the Tivo ui. Make that 8 tuners and I may switch 100%.

Dont get me wrong I am satisfied with the premieres and may even be happy once the ui is finished and features like Pandora are implemented, but I am still looking for a better option. It is clear what I want and what TiVo offers may never match up so the UI begins to be something that is not as important since I dont see it when I am watching a recording anyway. Now if media center had a UI I didnt like similar to the directv ui it wouldnt be an option.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

innocentfreak said:


> True but 4 tuners in one device coupled with a pretty good ui and some nice features starts to trump just the Tivo ui. Make that 8 tuners and I may switch 100%.


Why would anyone need 8 tuners? Much less 6 or even 4? Like I said in a previous post- I think I have needed more than 2 maybe once in a decade.... and I do record a LOT of stuff. Even in rare cases when one might need more than 2, most shows on many stations will replay the shows later that night, or the next day or something.

I mean, if I had the option for more tuners I suppose it could be considered a plus, but to me, a good AND FAST user interface, accurate guide data, reliable operation, suggestions recording, or other factors are far, far, far more important. Even TiVo HD has all that already (although the UI could stand to be faster).


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

crxssi said:


> Why would anyone need 8 tuners? Much less 6 or even 4? Like I said in a previous post- I think I have needed more than 2 maybe once in a decade.... and I do record a LOT of stuff. Even in rare cases when one might need more than 2, most shows on many stations will replay the shows later that night, or the next day or something.
> 
> I mean, if I had the option for more tuners I suppose it could be considered a plus, but to me, a good AND FAST user interface, accurate guide data, reliable operation, suggestions recording, or other factors are far, far, far more important. Even TiVo HD has all that already (although the UI could stand to be faster).


The more people in the house the more tuners you need unless everyone is going to watch the same show at the same time every night. Also the more tuners on a machine the less you have to think about what show is going to record when. After juggling season pass managers for over 9 years I am ready for enough tuners and space just to add any show without worrying does it need to go before show C but after A or is it fine where it is.

If you have 8 tuners with Media Center for example, you could have 4 rooms watching live tv while still recording 4 shows. The other thing to consider is padding. If you want to pad every show you can't because either you tie up that tuner for those few extra minutes or cut off a few minutes or so depending on padding of another show. The more tuners the more you can pad without conflicting. With 8 tuners even if you only record 4 shows at a time you could still pad all 4 shows without missing anything from other shows.

If you can't think of why you would need more than 2 tuners, you probably don't record as much as you think you do.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

innocentfreak said:


> The more people in the house the more tuners you need [...] watching live tv while still recording 4 shows. The other thing to consider is padding. I[...] If you can't think of why you would need more than 2 tuners, you probably don't record as much as you think you do.


Good points. I am alone, also never watch live TV. For me, it really records more than I could possibly need, though.


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## turbobozz (Sep 21, 2006)

My household is similar to innocentfreak's.
There were 4 active TiVo's owned by various members of the household... until a lightning strike near my house recently.
My S3 was the main recording/viewing box, and with only 2 tuners it is very common for there to be conflicts with oddball schedules (7pm to 8:03pm in guide).

We have xbox 360's on every TV (5) and I have Win7 on capable desktop PCs... thus an MC PC was a low cost option to try out.
We've been using OTA (Silicondust) on MC for several months now, and we are happy with it in general. (Yes, there are advantages and disadvantages to both TiVo and MC.)
My personal Ceton 4 tuner card is shipping out this week or the next.
Given the recent lightning strike and our test runs with MC/xboxen, it is looking like TiVo will be limited to a single Premiere in my house.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

GoldWing 2001: Does your bike over heat in parade mode? Do you have frame cracks? Is your (if installed) ABS divider in the front leaking?

Did your Honda dealer come to your home to fix them or did you have to go to the shop? Did you have to hound Honda to get it done right? Was it fixed right the first time at no charge?

Just wondering as a Goldwing is an another example where the company insisted that everything was OK with the bike until enough owners got together and complained to the government to get things fixed. 

Perhaps that's what we should be thinking about with the XL?


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## Goldwing2001 (Sep 30, 2006)

Daniel Skeen said:


> GoldWing 2001: Does your bike over heat in parade mode? Do you have frame cracks? Is your (if installed) ABS divider in the front leaking?
> 
> Did your Honda dealer come to your home to fix them or did you have to go to the shop? Did you have to hound Honda to get it done right? Was it fixed right the first time at no charge?
> 
> ...


I see your new forum member....but you have to be kidding.  Good luck with that government complaint.

Most people who purchase a product that they deem "Unusable" or "Unsatisfactory" return it.

Signed,
A Satisfied Customer


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

Goldwing2001 said:


> I see your new forum member....but you have to be kidding.  Good luck with that government complaint.
> 
> Most people who purchase a product that they deem "Unusable" or "Unsatisfactory" return it.
> 
> ...


Have tried, been refused, told I will have to wait for the update, which, by the way, I was told may be 4-5 months out. They will not provide a replacement unit either. So I'm stick with this device that does not work.

Tivo will not provide me with a working unit which I had paid them for in full. I might get one down the road, maybe.

Hope the frame does not crack or the engine overheat on your wing. Hope you enjoy those little air vents too.


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

Daniel Skeen said:


> Have tried, been refused, told I will have to wait for the update, which, by the way, I was told may be 4-5 months out. They will not provide a replacement unit either. So I'm stick with this device that does not work.
> 
> Tivo will not provide me with a working unit which I had paid them for in full. I might get one down the road, maybe...


Are you past 90 days since date of purchase?


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

Got an update last night!!!!!

Squeaky wheel, grease, all of that.

A quick run of the old test suite shows that most of the old bugs are gone!!!!

Also speed of interaction is good as to say acceptable!

Up and running for 12 hours and no crashes or freezes! 

VERY KEWL! 

For the ultimate test I'm going to let my wife use the beast for a day or two and I'll report back!


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## caddyroger (Mar 15, 2005)

Daniel Skeen said:


> Got an update last night!!!!!
> 
> Squeaky wheel, grease, all of that.
> 
> ...


Guess what the Squeaky wheel did not get the grease Tivo turned it on for all about 4:30 pm pdt yesterday. I probably had 14.5 installed hours before you even started.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

caddyroger said:


> Guess what the Squeaky wheel did not get the grease Tivo turned it on for all about 4:30 pm pdt yesterday. I probably had 14.5 installed hours before you even started.


Well good for you. God bless you and your wonderful friends and family.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

crxssi said:


> Why would anyone need 8 tuners? Much less 6 or even 4? Like I said in a previous post- I think I have needed more than 2 maybe once in a decade.... and I do record a LOT of stuff. Even in rare cases when one might need more than 2, most shows on many stations will replay the shows later that night, or the next day or something.
> 
> I mean, if I had the option for more tuners I suppose it could be considered a plus, but to me, a good AND FAST user interface, accurate guide data, reliable operation, suggestions recording, or other factors are far, far, far more important. Even TiVo HD has all that already (although the UI could stand to be faster).


Even back in 2002 three tuners was not enough. I had two HD tuners for recording my HD shows and I had one HD STB for watching in realtime. Even back then it was not enough when I was only watching 15 hours of HD a week.

Now with over 95% of what I watch in HD, Many times I have eight to ten tuners recording concurrently.


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## mooneb75 (Aug 5, 2008)

Daniel Skeen said:


> Good idea. Been there, done that....
> 
> ...The reason that everyone does not see this is likely a software deployment problem. Although we may all have the same updates the means and order of the installs plus the influence of the user can give a machine what some would call a personality.
> 
> ...


You seem to have some computer knowledge due to the glorious machine you built but are not using. That said, I have a few questions about your plight with the Premiere.

First off, what makes you think that a SW deployment problem would be the cause of your issues and the lack of mine?

More importantly, if the crashes happen more with your wife than with your daughter and more with your daughter than with you, what are they doing differently? What are you doing when the unit crashes. How on earth could you have not locked that down by now - with all the time you have spent posting about it, I would think you would have done some troubleshooting and attempted to lock down where the problem is and what the problem is. I would think you would be logging everything right now and doing what you can to recreate the crashes so at teh bare minimum you know what is actually causing them. it boggles my mind that you continue to so publicly site your home-grown PVR and all the theories behind TiVo's flaws, yet you have not worked out what causes your very own unit's issues.

You sound intelligent, but you do not act it.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

mooneb75 said:


> You seem to have some computer knowledge due to the glorious machine you built but are not using. That said, I have a few questions about your plight with the Premiere.
> 
> First off, what makes you think that a SW deployment problem would be the cause of your issues and the lack of mine?
> 
> ...


Good news - last nights software upgrade fixed most of the problems that I found with the HDUI!

..and yes I did track down how the women folk's were'zs blowing up the Tivo box. That why I was so sure it was a software problem. Plus I have been writing code for over 35 year giving me a little experience in tracking down this kind of thing. I even have programmed scripts that will crash the box. I did try sharing this information with Tivo but they (literarily) hung up on me.

I paid good money for this toaster and I expect it to work. No one would give me the time of day at Tivo even when I offered assistance.

As for the box I'm playing around with, it just happens to work as a DVR, it does a LOT more. It's a sideline, a hobby, something to tinker with when I feel like it. If I get the software right will I set it free...maybe in GNU. Right now I'm more interested in adding a SSD to my iPad


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

Daniel Skeen said:


> ...I even have programmed scripts that will crash the box...


Um, wait. What? How do you execute scripts on the Premiere?


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

orangeboy said:


> Um, wait. What? How do you execute scripts on the Premiere?


Well think of an IR LED that is under control of a PC.


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

Daniel Skeen said:


> Well think of an IR LED that is under control of a PC.


OK, I'm thinking about that. Now what?


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

orangeboy said:


> OK, I'm thinking about that. Now what?


Think a little harder.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Daniel Skeen said:


> I even have programmed scripts that will crash the box. I did try sharing this information with Tivo but they (literarily) hung up on me.
> 
> I paid good money for this toaster and I expect it to work. No one would give me the time of day at Tivo even when I offered assistance.
> 
> As for the box I'm playing around with, it just happens to work as a DVR, it does a LOT more. It's a sideline, a hobby, something to tinker with when I feel like it. If I get the software right will I set it free...maybe in GNU. Right now I'm more interested in adding a SSD to my iPad


I guess my question would be why are you calling customer service instead of forwarding your finds to Margret or one of the few remaining TiVo employees that post here.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

innocentfreak said:


> I guess my question would be why are you calling customer service instead of forwarding your finds to Margret or one of the few remaining TiVo employees that post here.


Once again. One last time. Been there, done that. So I stood up and started to shout out here, did you hear me, did you see me?


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

Daniel Skeen said:


> Think a little harder.


So you execute scripts on your Premiere by sending IR commands.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

orangeboy said:


> So you execute scripts on your Premiere by sending IR commands.


Keep thinking, how would this work on a main frame? What time is it in flordia?


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## mooneb75 (Aug 5, 2008)

Daniel Skeen said:


> Keep thinking, how would this work on a main frame? What time is it in flordia?


Why so cryptic? Why not just share your info?

And I have to ask, if you knew what was causing the issue, why were you on here shouting from the mountain tops (all of them) instead of e-mailing Margret and getting the update sooner.

I have to call shenanigans. You knew all along what was causing it...


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## rocko (Oct 29, 2002)

Daniel Skeen said:


> Keep thinking, how would this work on a main frame? What time is it in flordia?


Don't you have a working TiVo to go play with ? Thanks.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

Dear Trolls,

With the new release the problems have been fixed. 
On to other things. If you are bored please read a book.


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

Daniel Skeen said:


> orangeboy said:
> 
> 
> > So you execute scripts on your Premiere by sending IR commands.
> ...


Butterfly.



Daniel Skeen said:


> What time is it in flordia?


Rocks.

There. My replies make about as much sense as yours do.


Daniel Skeen said:


> Dear Trolls...


I believe you need to reassess the definition of [internet] troll so you can use it properly. 
At this point, there has only been one relative newcomer to the Community whose posts have been dubious at best with claims of TiVo corp. not honoring warranties:


Daniel Skeen said:


> ...They will not provide a replacement unit either. So I'm stick with this device that does not work...


claims of manipulating the TiVo software to make it ABEND:


Daniel Skeen said:


> ...I even have programmed scripts that will crash the box...


and then failed to provide details to back such claims. There are other posts that I could reference, but I believe the troll has already been exposed.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

orangeboy said:


> Butterfly.
> 
> Rocks.
> 
> ...


To much time on your hands Mr. Troll. Meh.


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## rocko (Oct 29, 2002)

Daniel Skeen said:


> To much time on your hands Mr. Troll. Meh.


Pot. Kettle. Black.

*plonk*


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## mooneb75 (Aug 5, 2008)

Daniel Skeen said:


> To much time on your hands Mr. Troll. Meh.


You do not know what a troll is man. Here:

Troll (Internet) - "What is a troll?".
In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into a desired emotional response[1] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[2] In addition to the offending poster, the noun troll can also refer to the provocative message itself, as in "that was an excellent troll you posted". While the term troll and its associated action trolling are primarily associated with Internet discourse, media attention in recent years has made such labels highly subjective, with trolling being used to describe intentionally provocative actions outside of an online context. For example, recent media accounts have used the term troll to describe "a person who defaces internet tribute sites with the aim of causing grief to families."[3][4]

from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troll_(Internet)

And dare I say it, your continued bragging/bashing/bragging has lead me to believe that you are absolutely full of isht. I'll go so far as to say that I think you are actually lying about a lot of your projects as you have been able to provide no tangible details whatsoever.

Oddly, as soon as you are asked for details, the subject changes...

With that, I am done with you Mr. Skeen.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

Daniel Skeen said:


> To much time on your hands Mr. Troll. Meh.


:down:

Sorry Mr. Skeen, I agree with Mooneb75, Orangeboy, and Roko. If anyone has been improperly posting, it is YOU, not them. First the duplicate complaints on a dozen threads. Then the whole cryptic stuff about your "programming" the TiVo through the IR. Then calling people Trolls when they rightly point out you are being cryptic...


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

Never said a thing about _programming_ a TiVo unit with an IR blaster. Controlling, yes, programing beyond the user level, no.

You you little ones were just a little nicer I might share but I'm not so inclined at this time.

Happy to report that most of the bugs seem to have gone away and stayed away with the current upgrade. I have found a few _new_ ones how ever. I'll have to start a new thread, hopefully without under bridge dwellers.

Last Word??


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

mooneb75 said:


> You do not know what a troll is man. Here:
> 
> Troll (Internet) - "What is a troll?".
> In Internet slang, a troll is someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community, such as an online discussion forum, chat room, or blog, with the primary intent of provoking other users into a desired emotional response[1] or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion.[2] In addition to the offending poster, the noun troll can also refer to the provocative message itself, as in "that was an excellent troll you posted". While the term troll and its associated action trolling are primarily associated with Internet discourse, media attention in recent years has made such labels highly subjective, with trolling being used to describe intentionally provocative actions outside of an online context. For example, recent media accounts have used the term troll to describe "a person who defaces internet tribute sites with the aim of causing grief to families."[3][4]
> ...


Proof? Well, why do I need to prove anything to you. Like who the Hlle do you think you are anyway? Perhaps the Tivo Cops? Done with me, then good, go away, stay away.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

orangeboy said:


> Butterfly.
> 
> Rocks.
> 
> ...


First, who the heck are you and why should anyone care about your rants.
Second, you have too much time on your little hands. Read a book. Get a Job. Meet a real human to have something like a relationship with.

We all feel sorry for you.


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## Daniel Skeen (Aug 5, 2010)

rocko said:


> Pot. Kettle. Black.
> 
> *plonk*


So now your stalking me.

You found out I'm Black.

You found out that my family's slave was Kettle.

You have been calling and emailing my work.

Very Sad.


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