# Do you use the ''Keep Until I Delete'' option?



## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

Poll coming... stemmed from the update thread. 

Some comments in the update thread got me to wondering how widespread the use of KUID is.

I think KUID use is in the minority, but I'm willing to concede if I am wrong, hence the poll.


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## MikeMar (Jan 7, 2005)

Well I don't have a tivo, but can I vote?

Why WOULDN'T you use KUID on a bunch of stuff? Why would you want a new show getting bumped if you let it build up.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

I've never filled my hard drive. So effectively, everything is KUID.


MikeMar said:


> Why WOULDN'T you use KUID on a bunch of stuff? Why would you want a new show getting bumped if you let it build up.


I'm not sure what you mean. Isn't it old shows that would get bumped?


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

The poll question is kind of vague. I never use KUID when setting up recordings, season passes or wish lists, but I do manually change recording to KUID from time to time after they've been recorded. Usually to remind me I want to save them to my PC.


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I've never filled my hard drive. So effectively, everything is KUID.


Yeah, this is why I think the use of KUID will be in the minority among users here.

Since upgrading the hard drive for more space is so easy, I suspect more people are doing that so they can avoid using KUID.


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## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

I used to use it allot for the TV shows/series I was saving to watch latter (like in the summer). Now I just auto off load them to my computers instead as I decided not to upgrade the drive in my Roamio. Now I only use it for a few pod cast I want to keep around for awhile. The reality is I have way to many shows saved across all my TiVos & computer and will never end up watching many (most?) of them - I think at this point with what is on my computers and 4 TiVos it is at least 8 TBs of unwatched shows.


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## Sixto (Sep 16, 2005)

I use it rarely by manually adding it to a recording that I might want to keep forever.

If I had a season pass that I wasn't expecting to watch soon then I might manually just make that season pass KUID, but I would never use it as a default for all season passes, for obvious reasons.


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

I use this on shows I want to make sure I watch when setting up the season pass. It's much less of an issue now with the Roamio Pro.


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## BiloxiGeek (Nov 18, 2001)

I have used it, but only very rarely so I voted no. If there's something I really want to keep I prefer to pull it off the TiVo to my media server where I can serve it up later over pyTivo.


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## midas (Jun 1, 2000)

The issue in the other thread was the complaint that the new default recording options didn't include KUID. For that option to make any sense it would require someone to setup more than 50% of their season passes or manual recordings as KUID. 

The issue is not if you use it, the issue is if you use it the majority of the time.


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## BiloxiGeek (Nov 18, 2001)

Well the poll is whether or not you use it, I just read the release notes thread talking about KUID. So if the author of the poll wanted to qualify the poll isn't obvious immediately.


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## NorthAlabama (Apr 19, 2012)

it depends on the recording - if i'm recording a movie from hbo or sho, i always use kuid, because i might watch it again. same with any weekly serial show, i want it to stay until it's watched. if it's a daily news or a game show, no way. 

bottom line, if tivo didn't behave wierdly (with a filling hard disk when using kuid on a majority of sp's), i'd probably use kuid a lot more.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

The post in the update thread implied KUID is the default setting used by everyone - i.e. All or most season passes. An option not given in this poll. Though I don't need a poll to know that plain just cannot be the case.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

I have in the past on one off recordings, but not in a long time. With 3TB I've never even got close to 100%, so there is no chance of losing anything.


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## GmanTiVo (Mar 9, 2003)

steve614 said:


> Yeah, this is why I think the use of KUID will be in the minority among users here.
> 
> Since upgrading the hard drive for more space is so easy, I suspect more people are doing that so they can avoid using KUID.


I take it you don't have teenagers in the house.... my 2 week old Roamio Pro is at 92% and my 2TB S3 was always maxed out..... hence all "my" recordings (SP & WL) were set to KUID, a must for the King of the house (ok, the serf, but i like to humor myself)


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## 59er (Mar 27, 2008)

I use KUID for one of two purposes: to insure something won't get bumped someday if I fill the drive, or to make a show I have watched but am saving for my husband to watch later.


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## djev (Jan 12, 2014)

I use KUID for almost everything. Exceptions would be GMA, old repeats of Criminal Minds and NCIS. I always have the last two because I fall asleep and STAY asleep better to something I already know inside and out but they creep up into the 100's before you know it!


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## ADG (Aug 20, 2003)

Whenever the option is offered I select Keep Until I Delete. As is the case with most others, I don't have a space issue.


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## midas (Jun 1, 2000)

ADG said:


> Whenever the option is offered I select Keep Until I Delete. As is the case with most others, I don't have a space issue.


See, this is what I don't understand. If you don't have any space issues, why set that? The only reason to set it is if you're short on space and are worried about it getting deleted to make room for new recordings.


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## MHunter1 (Oct 11, 2007)

I take a different approach to this topic by setting the SP of all of my favorite shows to KUID then each Sunday I adjust the keep-until date of the current episode I'm watching to Thursday next week so the green dot changes to no dot and prevents it from turning yellow until next Monday.

This way, by starting at the bottom of the My Shows list sorted chronologically with Groups off, I can see at a glance which episodes I've already begun watching (no dot), those that are ready to watch (green dot), and those that are low-priority KUSN shows (yellow dot). By the time I get around to watching newly recorded low-priority shows that appear at the top of the list with no dot, they have already changed to a yellow dot.

This method has worked for me since my first Series2 TiVo in 2004. Yes, TiVo is a religious experience for me.


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## ADG (Aug 20, 2003)

midas said:


> See, this is what I don't understand. If you don't have any space issues, why set that? The only reason to set it is if you're short on space and are worried about it getting deleted to make room for new recordings.


Because there's no downside to doing so.


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## midas (Jun 1, 2000)

ADG said:


> Because there's no downside to doing so.


Sure there is. You have to take extra steps to enable it every time.

And more importantly, there's no upside.


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## ADG (Aug 20, 2003)

Okay, tell you what. You do as you wish and I'll do as I wish. Work for you?


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## midas (Jun 1, 2000)

ADG said:


> Okay, tell you what. You do as you wish and I'll do as I wish. Work for you?


That's fine, but not really the point of this discourse. I'm just trying to understand why someone would do that. Your answer basically says, "Because I want to." That's OK, I guess. But I'm looking for a logical reason. MHunter1 provided one that works for him. It's way more work than I want to put into managing my stuff, but at least it's logical.


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

midas said:


> Sure there is. You have to take extra steps to enable it every time.
> 
> And more importantly, there's no upside.


I tend to hoard some shows for bulk watching. So I might have 20 episodes of something I want to watch. If I don't use KUID, I might lose some of the early episodes.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

waynomo said:


> I tend to hoard some shows for bulk watching. So I might have 20 episodes of something I want to watch. If I don't use KUID, I might lose some of the early episodes.


I off load those shows to my TiVo Desktop PC. I've been doing that with NCIS this season . I have yet to watch an episode this season. If I continue watching the show I won't end up watching it until sometime this Summer.


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## bareyb (Dec 1, 2000)

I downloaded a couple of Home Movies of my kids to my TiVo and I set those to KUID just so they wouldn't roll off the bottom and get deleted eventually. I want those to stay on the bottom of my NPL so I can use them to embarrass my kids whenever the opportunity arises. They were SOOOO cute when they were little! 

Otherwise, I never use it for my recordings because if something hangs around long enough to get deleted on MY TiVo (upgraded HDD) it means I was never going to watch it anyway and why waste the space?


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

aaronwt said:


> I off load those shows to my TiVo Desktop PC. I've been doing that with NCIS this season . I have yet to watch an episode this season. If I continue watching the show I won't end up watching it until sometime this Summer.


I do that too. It depends on the site and when I think I'll get around to watching it. Sometimes it's just easier to mark the show KUID


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## chrispitude (Apr 23, 2005)

I use KUID sparingly.


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## GmanTiVo (Mar 9, 2003)

I reiterate, TiVo should give it's consumers and DVR owners the *"choice" *to enable or disable as many functionalities as possible and not impose on us what is logical, right (in their mind) or what marketing says, especially if the various functions are already there and do not interfere with the DVR's basic operations.

*Let the end user decide what to do and tailor the TiVo to their likes and dislikes.*

I for one really like KUID and really dislike the Discovery Bar, and don't give a rats @ss what others think and certainly don't have to justify my tastes (illogical or unpopular).... it is "MY" Tivo DVR and not yours!


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## MikeMar (Jan 7, 2005)

We use KUID for any primetime/new show as we generally let a LOT of them accumulate and watch when the season is over. But stuff like Friends and BBT repeats obviously we don't.


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## gweempose (Mar 23, 2003)

I use KUID for every SP that I set up. It's an old habit that probably stems from my ReplayTV days. When I first switched to TiVo, I just didn't feel comfortable with the idea that something could be automatically deleted without my consent.


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## gweempose (Mar 23, 2003)

GmanTiVo said:


> I take it you don't have teenagers in the house.... my 2 week old Roamio Pro is at 92% and my 2TB S3 was always maxed out.....


This is precisely why I dedicated one of my TiVos to my kids.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Has the behavior changed so it no longer stops recording new shows when it fills up with KUID shows?


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

If it fills up with KUID shows then it shouldn't be recording anything else. Since it can't delete anything to make room.


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

Also prevents you from scheduling new recordings. (Or at least it used to.)


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## saronian (Aug 22, 2004)

midas said:


> ...I'm just trying to understand why someone would do that. Your answer basically says, "Because I want to."...


For me, I got in the habit of enabling KUID for almost everything when first using my Roamio Basic (500GB), but eventually upgraded to 3TB. Now I'm trying to wean myself from the habit even though there is little possibility of filling the drive.

Even chose the new default to always KUID. I'm sure I'll switch it off once I have some time to reorient to the additional storage.


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## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Has the behavior changed so it no longer stops recording new shows when it fills up with KUID shows?





aaronwt said:


> If it fills up with KUID shows then it shouldn't be recording anything else. Since it can't delete anything to make room.





waynomo said:


> Also prevents you from scheduling new recordings. (Or at least it used to.)


Actually the problems start when you are getting close to a full hard drive and/or when the shows schedule for the next 2 weeks will fill the hard drive up. I remember having issues with shows not recording because of a lack of room when I had deleted enough before it should have recorded a few years back before I upgraded my Premiere to a 2TB drive. Because of those issues I stopped using KUID and just move shows to my computers that I want to keep.


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## midas (Jun 1, 2000)

gweempose said:


> I use KUID for every SP that I set up. It's an old habit that probably stems from my ReplayTV days. When I first switched to TiVo, I just didn't feel comfortable with the idea that something could be automatically deleted without my consent.


But you were comfortable with new things not getting recorded because there was no space?

Yea, I guess I'm never going to understand.


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## CuriousMark (Jan 13, 2005)

morac said:


> ... but I do manually change recording to KUID from time to time after they've been recorded. Usually to remind me I want to save them to my PC.


For people with Netgear boxes that have ReadyDLNA they can set those devices to copy anything marked KUID to the NAS. The user still has to check that those recordings got there and then manually delete the KUID shows, but at least it is a way to get the shows archived. The upside is that it can all be done from the TiVo UI.

(ReadyDLNA does HME, but disguises it so it looks like DLNA settings on the NAS)


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## dbenrosen (Sep 20, 2003)

I manually set it after something is recorded that I don't want to lose, such as a movie or special event. I NEVER set my season passes this way, and never even set a recording this way. I only change it after the show has already been recorded.

But from the update thread, I think it should be an option on the default options pages and the initial default should be Save until space needed, which the user can change to KUID.


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## Headford (Aug 28, 2013)

I use KUID on practically everything other than sports programs (after learning who won - hardly ever go back and watch the game I missed live). After watching an episode of a show (or after losing interest in watching), I manually delete at the end of the program (plus it's also easy from program list -- by hitting the clear button on remote -- to go through and delete a bunch of shows at one time).

All Season Passes KUID. Will occasionally not use KUID on a program that I want to just sample.

Use the TiVo Desktop software to offload older programs (most never to be seen again).

Every single one of the several cable system DVRs I have used in the past also contained the ability to flag programs (and the equivalent of season passes) as KUID.

Anyone who reads/posts on this board is probably far more sophisticated than most casual users and can manage the hard disk space capacity issues to their personal preferences.

Choice is a good thing.


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## allan (Oct 14, 2002)

I never used KUID on SPs, but I often made existing recordings KUID, especially when my sig was still accurate. Sometimes I got warning messages that something else would be deleted early because of my KUID shows, so I had to decide which was more important to me.

My current DVR has much more storage than my early Tivos, or even the later ones, so I haven't felt the need to KUID anything yet.


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## dukenilnil (May 15, 2009)

Use KUID frequently (about 50%) but not by default. We go in TV watching ebbs and flows and sometimes run into space issues (and have not upgraded the HD to save costs). The newer episodes are easy to find on channel sites, Hulu, etc., so if those get dropped, we don't mind as much. The older ones are sometimes harder to find legitimately so we preserve those. We never know when a TV watching drought will occur so we preemptively use KUID if things start to fill 1/2 way up.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I've never filled my hard drive. So effectively, everything is KUID...


Same here (except not "effectively" but "in reality")...I've NEVER approached filling my hard drive. And I don't have the humungous capacity HDs that others might have either....750 GB on my S3 and 2TB XL4. The only thing I don't use KUID for is sporting events (with the exception of Stanley Cup playoff finals).


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## aadam101 (Jul 15, 2002)

I use it but only because I like to keep a library of old sitcoms constantly recording. I keep 10 episodes of each at all times. I don't watch them often but I just want them to be there if I feel like turning on an old episode of Seinfeld. My "important" shows are all KUID while the "not important" content is shuffled out.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Bierboy said:


> Same here (except not "effectively" but "in reality")...I've NEVER approached filling my hard drive. And I don't have the humungous capacity HDs that others might have either....750 GB on my S3 and 2TB XL4. The only thing I don't use KUID for is sporting events (with the exception of Stanley Cup playoff finals).


So why does it matter so much to you that KUID even exists, much less must be a default option?


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

Not for absolutely everything, but I use it a fair amount. Since I know of the downsides to it (Tivo "pre-claiming" space so you get lots of alerts when you get close to full), I live on the edge and have many recordings NOT KUID.

I just download shows to a computer drive a lot instead of dealing with KUID. (Though I just finished up watching the first season of The Americans on Amazon Prime [via PS3, sigh], and nuked my downloaded versions.)


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

Like a couple of others here, I use KUID on _*my*_ stuff. For reasons beyond my control, my 1TB THD is pretty full and moving stuff permanently to another TiVo is not a good option.

As far as the tradeoff between not recording something and losing something you had not yet watched - I have multiple TiVos and it is far easier to monitor the situation and make other recording arrangements than it is to re-acquire something that got deleted, especially if you really want the closed captions to be there.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> So why does it matter so much to you that KUID even exists, much less must be a default option?


Because I like the pretty green balls and not the ugly yellow ones with !s...

But seriously....my hard drive on the Premiere is getting filled tho still not near capacity. And the list of shows is quite long so I don't want to forget to save any should the time come when it does approach full.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Yes but very rarely usually for one off specials. I have FiOS so mostly everything is copy freely so I archive a show if I really want to save it.


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## randian (Jan 15, 2014)

midas said:


> Sure there is. You have to take extra steps to enable it every time.


Which wouldn't be a problem if TiVo had "set KUID" on its Recording Defaults screen.


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## TEG (Apr 8, 2014)

I used KUID for series that I don't watch regularly, like "Elementary" or "Cooks Country", and I power load them on my days off, when the weather's bad. Most of my other shows I watch either the same night they air, or the day after, so it isn't a big deal.

Then again, things like the Seahawks victory parade, are KUID until I can transfer them to my computer, and keep them permanently.


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## rad1701 (Aug 17, 2003)

I use KUID for everything. I like to be the one to decide to delete something or not. I've had a few shows/movies on my TIVO for years. I see no reason to remove TIVO features. The more control the better - in my opinion.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Well, it's clear (so far, according this poll) that the majority DO use KUID...contrary to many of the naysayers floating around these fora...


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Bierboy said:


> Well, it's clear (so far, according this poll) that the majority DO use KUID...contrary to many of the naysayers floating around these fora...


The majority of people here.

Who are a very small minority of TiVo users, and I suspect not at all representative.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> The majority of people here.
> 
> Who are a very small minority of TiVo users, and I suspect not at all representative.


And that's exactly what I said, Rob..."according to this poll"....I agree it's FAR from representative of all TiVo users.


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

Bierboy said:


> And that's exactly what I said, Rob..."according to this poll"....I agree it's FAR from representative of all TiVo users.


Also the poll isn't specific. There's no differentiating between occasional use of KUID and using it all the time. I say I mark less than one 1% of my recordings as KUID, but that's enough to say I use it on the poll.

Also the poll doesn't differentiate between scheduled recordings and programs that have already been recorded.


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> The majority of people here.
> 
> Who are a very small minority of TiVo users, and I suspect not at all representative.


That's right. We're all smarter and better looking.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

waynomo said:


> That's right. We're all smarter and better looking.


Here at Lake TiVoBegone.


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

I have to admit, there is a lot more people *here* using KUID than I thought there would be. I should have suspected since most of us here are power users.

At the same time, _because we are power users_, I figured most people would not need KUID because they upgraded their hard drives, and/or are just OCD (like me) and meticulously manage their recordings manually.

To the question as to whether or not TiVo should make KUID a default option for setting up season passes, etc., I think they should not.
#1 because a new user will not fully understand the consequences of using KUID and #2 because I don't think us power users really need it. So what that we have to take a couple of extra steps to set KUID on a recording/season pass? It's not the end of the world and it ensures that one does not "accidentally" activate it.


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## midas (Jun 1, 2000)

Let me make the point again, whether you use KUID not isn't really the point. I'm actually shocked that some people never use it. But how many people use it on everything, or even most things? Just because you mark something KUID a few times a year doesn't mean you need it as a default option. I understand that some do make extensive use of the option. But I don't think that's reflected in the numbers seen here.


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

steve614 said:


> At the same time, _because we are power users_, I figured most people would not need KUID because they upgraded their hard drives, and/or are just OCD (like me) and meticulously manage their recordings manually.


Interesting. So now I've seen both people who use KUID and those who don't labeled OCD.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

We live in an OCD world.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

Most of this post was originally made in the 20.4.1. I don't really want to cross post but I actually thought I was posting it here. It's feel too late to remove it from the other thread as it has been out there for days and has been quoted. So:

You can't have it both ways.

Just as the participants in this poll are not typical TiVo users, neither are those that install larger hard drives.

If the larger hard drives make it so your drive never fills up, then setting a show to KUID isn't going to cause you to miss recording something, now is it?

Finally, I am really tired of people thinking that the way they use a TiVo and its features is the "right" way to use it. And/Or insist that TiVo limit the capabilities to the lowest common denominator.


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

lpwcomp said:


> Finally, I am really tired of people thinking that the way they use a TiVo and its features is the "right" way to use it. And/Or insist that TiVo limit the capabilities to the lowest common denominator.


Or feel that you're a complete idiot for using it any other way then they're using it.


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## Philmatic (Sep 17, 2003)

I KUID things I want to, wait for it, Keep Until I Delete!

For me, that's pretty much every single season pass I have. However I do have some things that I record that I have automatically delete if space is needed, Friends, political shows and other things that are time sensitive (News, sports etc).

I never, ever want my TiVo to delete a serial TV show. I use KUID for that purpose.


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## 1283 (Sep 8, 2000)

KUID is primarily my "not watched" indicator. That's how I have used it since Series1.


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

waynomo said:


> Interesting. So now I've seen both people who use KUID and those who don't labeled OCD.


Hmm, doeth one protest too much? 

Sorry if I offended you. I admit to being OCD with my recordings, and I know I can't be the only one. Grow some skin.


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

steve614 said:


> Hmm, doeth one protest too much?
> 
> Sorry if I offended you. I admit to being OCD with my recordings, and I know I can't be the only one. Grow some skin.


Lol. No, not offended at all. 

I was amused by the arguments in general and thought it was funny. You were only talking about yourself, but others were talking about people who use KUID and called them OCD in what was sort of an insult. (And wasn't offended by those either.)

It was one of those can't win situations. Most of the OCD comments were about people who use KUID. You however don't use and claim that you are OCD about your recordings so don't need KUID. Damned if you do. Damned if you don't.


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## TonyBlunt (Jan 28, 2014)

I use KUID on all my season passes, since Tivo was deleting recordings after 3 days although I had less than 10% of the disk used. I expect KUID to do just that, keep until I delete. I expect if I fill my disk there will be no further recordings made. This seems the most logical approach, and certainly should be a default option with the new default screen. Leaving the decision of what to delete and when to a poorly programmed machine is not logical....

I suspect the reason some people dislike KUID is because Tivo uses faulty logic in determining when not to record - it appears that Tivo looks at current disk usage PLUS all recordings in the To-Do list, which is another two weeks of recordings. To assume I will not watch and delete any shows for two weeks is rather illogical. Instead, it should look at available space just before initiating a recording. (Or daily scan available space and recordings scheduled for the next 24 hours, cancelling recordings that would exceed available space.)


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## JWhites (May 15, 2013)

I use KUID for all my recordings by default and I love it. I just wish that when I hit the "record" button on the remote that it automatically sets my recording as that.


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## bareyb (Dec 1, 2000)

It used to be a bigger issue when the hard drives were much smaller and people would start getting warnings about recordings being deleted early etc. I'm still kind of stuck in that mentality even though I have a huge Hard Drive now. I do keep some home videos on KUID but they are pretty small. For the rest of my shows, my feeling is if they hung around long enough to get deleted I probably wasn't all that interested in them anyway.


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## ustavio (Oct 19, 2013)

For all the programs I want to "Keep Until I Delete" them, I use KUID. For those that I don't want to keep, I don't use KUID. For those shows I REALLY don't want to keep, I don't even bother recording them. However, I don't delete non-KUID shows until after I've watched them, then I delete them. After I watch the KUID shows, I may or may not delete them until I scroll through the list one day and ask my self "why am I keeping this?"....If I don't have a well reasoned and logical reason for keeping them, I delete them. But, then again, a few days later, I may scroll through my shows and ask myself "where the heck is that show I saved?" Then, I go into the deleted file and recover it. Sometimes I recover it and reinstate it to KUID status (just because I can). Sometimes I recover it just so I know it's there and then delete it again a few days later because I never intended to watch it anyway.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

JWhites said:


> I use KUID for all my recordings by default and I love it. I just wish that when I hit the "record" button on the remote that it automatically sets my recording as that.


What's the benefit? How would it behave differently if you didn't?

Sorry, but this really baffles me...


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