# Converting .tivo to .mp4



## narbertb

Hi all,

My brother has a tivo 2 series and just learned to use tivo to go to move the files to his windows system. The whole point is to be able to remove commercials and make complitation dvds of his favorite wrestlers.

So i had him take his files and dump them to a usb hard drive to give to me because he said he didn't know how to convert .mp2 to .mp4 which is what his pinnacle software likes.

I was gonna just throw em thru quicktime but the files are .tivo. Is there a simple way to convert a .tivo file to .mp4. tivodecode manager looks like a great product but i'm not at my bro's house often and he won't unplug it and bring it over so i can pull the files directly. I have a mac and he has windows and i haven't found a program like tivodecode for windows.

So back to the question what app can i use to convert .tivo to .mp4.

Thanks


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## Dan203

If all he wants to do is burn TiVo shows to DVDs then tell him to get a copy of VideoReDo TVSuite.* With it he can open the TiVo files directly (no need to decrypt them first), quickly edit out the commercials and then save them to a DVD all from one program.

Using the process you're describing you'll be converting the TiVo files from MPEG-2 to MPEG-4 then back to MPEG-2. This will not only take a significant amount of time but it will reduce the quality of the video. VideoReDo opens and edits the files in their native MPEG-2 format, so the video on the DVD is exactly the same quality as the original TiVo file. Also you can tell your brother that if he has any questions or problems using VRD to contact me directly and I will help him out. 

Dan

* Disclaimer: I am one of the developers for VideoReDo. However I've been a user of the product longer then I've been a developer for the company, so that says something. Plus if you look around the forums and you'll see that VRD comes highly recommended by many other TiVo users as well.


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## narbertb

Lets say he recorded 2 weeks of his wrestling...

Now he wants to take all the footage of wrestler A (don't know names of any of them) from the last 2 weeks and just cut him out.

Then make a compilation dvd of just that wrestler. Will the program you're talking about do that?

I'm new to video editing myself. But mine is easy... i have an elgato eyeTV.


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## Dan203

Absolutely! You can cut up the programs however you want.

Dan


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## kas25

Is there no easy way to edit Mpeg4 files. I only need the ability to cut off a portion in the beginning and/or end of the files.


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## pkscout

kas25 said:


> Is there no easy way to edit Mpeg4 files. I only need the ability to cut off a portion in the beginning and/or end of the files.


MPEG Streamclip.


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## jkalnin

Here is another vote for VideoRedo. It also clips out commercials as well.


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## TimothyGraham

Does anyone know of a Mac option to convert a .tivo file to mp4?


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## Davelnlr_

I have Video ReDo H.264, and all I get are errors it cant open the files mpeg4 part 2, or the audio codec is unsupported. Is there a version that will open these different files? Apparently I bought the wrong version, as it only opens the files I create with Hauppauge capture box.


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## Dan203

We don't support MPEG-4 part 2, we only support H.264 and MPEG-2. MPEG-4 part 2 is the old code that DivX and Xvid are based on. Nobody really uses it any more. H.264 is the newer MPEG-4 part 10. Where did you get these files?


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## Davelnlr_

Dan203 said:


> We don't support MPEG-4 part 2, we only support H.264 and MPEG-2. MPEG-4 part 2 is the old code that DivX and Xvid are based on. Nobody really uses it any more. H.264 is the newer MPEG-4 part 10. Where did you get these files?


Torrents of some old 60's TV shows


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## unitron

Dan, the link

http://www.videoredo.com/en/Download.htm

in your comment #2 above leads to a page offering 3 products.

How about a simple explanation of how they differ from each other for those of us who don't know much more than the fact that video *can* be in some digital form?

I need to turn some .tivo files into DVDs, but not sure how much surgery I want to perform on them before putting them on the disc, and also when it comes to burning DVDs, I've only done .iso to cd so far, although I do have PCs with DVD burners.


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## Davelnlr_

http://www.videoredo.com/en/Compare.htm

That link compares the three products


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## unitron

Davelnlr_ said:


> http://www.videoredo.com/en/Compare.htm
> 
> That link compares the three products


And does so in terms with which I am unfamiliar.


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## dlfl

unitron said:


> Dan, the link
> 
> http://www.videoredo.com/en/Download.htm
> 
> in your comment #2 above leads to a page offering 3 products.
> 
> How about a simple explanation of how they differ from each other for those of us who don't know much more than the fact that video *can* be in some digital form?
> 
> I need to turn some .tivo files into DVDs, but not sure how much surgery I want to perform on them before putting them on the disc, and also when it comes to burning DVDs, I've only done .iso to cd so far, although I do have PCs with DVD burners.


Let's call the 3 VRD versions V1 ("plus", $50), V2 ("TV Suite, $75) and V3 (TV 
Suite H.264, $96).

V1 will edit only MPEG2 files (including TiVo files) and will NOT create DVD's.

V2 will edit only MPEG2 files and WILL create DVD's. This is probably what you need, although I can't guarantee some of the additional features of V3 might not be important or essential to your process.

V3 will edit both MPEG2 and MPEG4 H.264 files (but not the older MPEG4 Part 2, e.g. divx and xvid) files. And will make DVD's. It doesn't appear you need the H.264 capability.

V2 and V3 can make the DVD in the form of an ISO file if you prefer, which can be burned to the DVD using separate (free) software (e.g., imgburn or dvddecrypter). Or they can burn their DVD output directly to the DVD (all of which requires you to have a DVD burner drive, of course).

DVD by definition is a SD format (usually 704x480 or 720x480) that does not encompass HD. For HD formats you need to make Blu-Ray or AVCHD files, which no version of VRD will do. V2 or V3 can create a DVD from HD input files but it will automatically recode them down to DVD (SD) resolution in the process. Whether this is acceptable is your decision.

You can free-trial VRD uncrippled for 15 days if you perform the free trial registration provided in the menu system. Since you will probably eventually want to process H.264 files, I would recommend spending the extra $21 for V3.

Hope that helps and may I say it's refreshing to see an area of knowledge on this forum in which you are not an expert.


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## unitron

dlfl said:


> Let's call the 3 VRD versions V1 ("plus", $50), V2 ("TV Suite, $75) and V3 (TV
> Suite H.264, $96).
> 
> V1 will edit only MPEG2 files (including TiVo files) and will NOT create DVD's.
> 
> V2 will edit only MPEG2 files and WILL create DVD's. This is probably what you need, although I can't guarantee some of the additional features of V3 might not be important or essential to your process.
> 
> V3 will edit both MPEG2 and MPEG4 H.264 files (but not the older MPEG4 Part 2, e.g. divx and xvid) files. And will make DVD's. It doesn't appear you need the H.264 capability.
> 
> V2 and V3 can make the DVD in the form of an ISO file if you prefer, which can be burned to the DVD using separate (free) software (e.g., imgburn or dvddecrypter). Or they can burn their DVD output directly to the DVD (all of which requires you to have a DVD burner drive, of course).
> 
> DVD by definition is a SD format (usually 704x480 or 720x480) that does not encompass HD. For HD formats you need to make Blu-Ray or AVCHD files, which no version of VRD will do. V2 or V3 can create a DVD from HD input files but it will automatically recode them down to DVD (SD) resolution in the process. Whether this is acceptable is your decision.
> 
> You can free-trial VRD uncrippled for 15 days if you perform the free trial registration provided in the menu system. Since you will probably eventually want to process H.264 files, I would recommend spending the extra $21 for V3.
> 
> Hope that helps and may I say it's refreshing to see an area of knowledge on this forum in which you are not an expert.


Dan probably couldn't have done much better!

Many thanks.


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## Dan203

TVSuite v4 w/H.264 also has recoding capabilities, so you can convert your .tivo files to H.264 for playback on a portable device, or just to save some space before uploading it back to your TiVo. (Premiere units support H.264 .tivo files)


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## ShayL

TimothyGraham said:


> Does anyone know of a Mac option to convert a .tivo file to mp4?


You can use kmttg.


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## slimjim867

ShayL said:


> You can use kmttg.


I just tried using kmttg. It produced a .mpg file. My kindle does not recognize it. Is there a way to change the output of kmttg to mp4?

Thank you


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## unitron

dlfl said:


> Let's call the 3 VRD versions V1 ("plus", $50), V2 ("TV Suite, $75) and V3 (TV
> Suite H.264, $96).
> 
> V1 will edit only MPEG2 files (including TiVo files) and will NOT create DVD's.
> 
> V2 will edit only MPEG2 files and WILL create DVD's. This is probably what you need, although I can't guarantee some of the additional features of V3 might not be important or essential to your process.
> 
> V3 will edit both MPEG2 and MPEG4 H.264 files (but not the older MPEG4 Part 2, e.g. divx and xvid) files. And will make DVD's. It doesn't appear you need the H.264 capability.
> 
> V2 and V3 can make the DVD in the form of an ISO file if you prefer, which can be burned to the DVD using separate (free) software (e.g., imgburn or dvddecrypter). Or they can burn their DVD output directly to the DVD (all of which requires you to have a DVD burner drive, of course).
> 
> DVD by definition is a SD format (usually 704x480 or 720x480) that does not encompass HD. For HD formats you need to make Blu-Ray or AVCHD files, which no version of VRD will do. V2 or V3 can create a DVD from HD input files but it will automatically recode them down to DVD (SD) resolution in the process. Whether this is acceptable is your decision.
> 
> You can free-trial VRD uncrippled for 15 days if you perform the free trial registration provided in the menu system. Since you will probably eventually want to process H.264 files, I would recommend spending the extra $21 for V3.
> 
> Hope that helps and may I say it's refreshing to see an area of knowledge on this forum in which you are not an expert.


When you say

"V1 will edit only MPEG2 files (including TiVo files) and will NOT create DVD's."

does that mean that if I took out the commercials and left the show, or took out the show and left the commercials, it would still be a .tivo file, only smaller?

Or does it turn it into something that some other software, like the bundled verison of Nero, can burn to DVD and produce something playable on the average DVD player?

And when you say

"V2 will edit only MPEG2 files and WILL create DVD's. This is probably what you need, although I can't guarantee some of the additional features of V3 might not be important or essential to your process."

does that mean that it's basically V1 with added software that talks directly to my DVD burner drive so that Nero or whatever doesn't have to get involved?

And if I have, for example, 2 .tivo files, each a one hour show, and want to put both on one DVD playable in average DVD players, is a compilation like that possible?

When it comes to optical disks (cd and DVD and the various file formats and Red Books and Yellow Books and .iso files and such), I know a lot about vinyl phonograph records, turntables, magnetic cartridges, stylii, and VHS tape machines.


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## ggieseke

You can save files as .TiVo or straight MPEG-2, but that still won't make a DVD that will work in most players. You need DVD "authoring" software to create the menus, VOB files, etc. NeroVision Express can handle that part of the job but I don't think it comes with the version of Nero that's usually bundled with some PCs.

VRD TVSuite includes its own authoring package and you can burn the image directly or save it to disk and burn with something else.

In my experience, 90 minutes is just about the limit for a single layer (4.7GB) DVD. Two average 1 hour shows with the commercials removed is just right.


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## dlfl

dlfl said:


> Let's call the 3 VRD versions V1 ("plus", $50), V2 ("TV Suite, $75) and V3 (TV
> Suite H.264, $96).
> 
> V1 will edit only MPEG2 files (including TiVo files) and will NOT create DVD's.
> 
> V2 will edit only MPEG2 files and WILL create DVD's. This is probably what you need, although I can't guarantee some of the additional features of V3 might not be important or essential to your process.
> 
> V3 will edit both MPEG2 and MPEG4 H.264 files (but not the older MPEG4 Part 2, e.g. divx and xvid) files. And will make DVD's. It doesn't appear you need the H.264 capability.
> 
> V2 and V3 can make the DVD in the form of an ISO file if you prefer, which can be burned to the DVD using separate (free) software (e.g., imgburn or dvddecrypter). Or they can burn their DVD output directly to the DVD (all of which requires you to have a DVD burner drive, of course).
> 
> DVD by definition is a SD format (usually 704x480 or 720x480) that does not encompass HD. For HD formats you need to make Blu-Ray or AVCHD files, which no version of VRD will do. V2 or V3 can create a DVD from HD input files but it will automatically recode them down to DVD (SD) resolution in the process. Whether this is acceptable is your decision.
> 
> You can free-trial VRD uncrippled for 15 days if you perform the free trial registration provided in the menu system. Since you will probably eventually want to process H.264 files, I would recommend spending the extra $21 for V3.
> 
> Hope that helps and may I say it's refreshing to see an area of knowledge on this forum in which you are not an expert.





unitron said:


> When you say
> 
> "V1 will edit only MPEG2 files (including TiVo files) and will NOT create DVD's."
> 
> does that mean that if I took out the commercials and left the show, or took out the show and left the commercials, it would still be a .tivo file, only smaller?
> 
> Or does it turn it into something that some other software, like the bundled verison of Nero, can burn to DVD and produce something playable on the average DVD player?
> 
> And when you say
> 
> "V2 will edit only MPEG2 files and WILL create DVD's. This is probably what you need, although I can't guarantee some of the additional features of V3 might not be important or essential to your process."
> 
> does that mean that it's basically V1 with added software that talks directly to my DVD burner drive so that Nero or whatever doesn't have to get involved?
> 
> And if I have, for example, 2 .tivo files, each a one hour show, and want to put both on one DVD playable in average DVD players, is a compilation like that possible?
> 
> When it comes to optical disks (cd and DVD and the various file formats and Red Books and Yellow Books and .iso files and such), I know a lot about vinyl phonograph records, turntables, magnetic cartridges, stylii, and VHS tape machines.


V1 and V2 process several formats of MPEG2 PS (Program Stream) video, including .mpg, .tivo, .vob and .dvr-ms. Thus specifically, you can input and/or edit .tivo and output any of those formats.

When you set up a DVD in V2 or V3 it will tell you whether your video content fits on a single- or dual-layer DVD. DVD output can be files (ISO or Video_TS) that can be burned to DVD using separate burner software (e.g., imgburn) or VRD will burn directly to the DVD.


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## unitron

ggieseke said:


> You can save files as .TiVo or straight MPEG-2, but that still won't make a DVD that will work in most players. You need DVD "authoring" software to create the menus, VOB files, etc. NeroVision Express can handle that part of the job but I don't think it comes with the version of Nero that's usually bundled with some PCs.
> 
> VRD TVSuite includes its own authoring package and you can burn the image directly or save it to disk and burn with something else.
> 
> In my experience, 90 minutes is just about the limit for a single layer (4.7GB) DVD. Two average 1 hour shows with the commercials removed is just right.


I'm unfamiliar with the experience of buying or owning a new PC.

Whatever versions of Nero I have came with new DVD decks I bought and installed in old PCs I've cobbled together.

So a single layer DVD, which I assume is the first version released, wasn't big enough for a single 2 hour movie?


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## dlfl

unitron said:


> ........
> So a single layer DVD, which I assume is the first version released, wasn't big enough for a single 2 hour movie?


SL DVD holds 4.7GB which, for a 2 hr video, computes to an average bitrate of about 5.2Mbps, which must include audio and other overhead. This can provide decent PQ but you probably have to recode the video to this bitrate (and to DVD resolution, if not already there). V2 or V3 automatically recode for resolution when making a DVD image. It's been a while since I used it to make a DVD but I think you can adjust parameters on the recode that is implicit to making the DVD to fit 2 hrs into a SL DVD. If not you might have to do a separate recode in VRD to get a .mpg of the proper size (i.e., reduced bitrate) and dimensions.


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## Soapm

unitron said:


> I'm unfamiliar with the experience of buying or owning a new PC.
> 
> Whatever versions of Nero I have came with new DVD decks I bought and installed in old PCs I've cobbled together.
> 
> So a single layer DVD, which I assume is the first version released, wasn't big enough for a single 2 hour movie?


Do a search for DVD shrink and you can put a 4 hour movie on a single layer. You can go down in quality until there's not enough beer to make the show viewable.


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## dlfl

Soapm said:


> Do a search for DVD shrink and you can put a 4 hour movie on a single layer. You can go down in quality until there's not enough beer to make the show viewable.


Now that's what I call a practical metric for PQ!


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## ggieseke

dlfl said:


> Now that's what I call a practical metric for PQ!


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## unitron

Before there were recordable DVD blanks, as I dimly recall, there were commercially available manufactured DVDs with stuff that had aged out of movie theaters and off of HBO.

Could a single one of those not accommodate a 120 minute movie?


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## ggieseke

All of the commercial DVDs that I've seen are dual-layer, so they can hold about 3 hours.


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## wmcbrine

Back when I used to rip a lot of DVDs, I found that the majority of them were encoded to just fit on a single-layer disc. This was true even when the disc itself was dual-layer -- the main title was kept under 4.7 GB, while the remaining space was given over to extras. I assume this was done to allow mastering a single-layer version without extras.

And when I used to make DVDs from DirecTiVo Series 2 recordings, I could typically get about three movies onto a single-layer disc.


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## lrhorer

MPEG compression is a "lossy" data compression method. Algorithms such as Lempel-Ziv-Welch closely examine a data stream looking for ways to perfectly represent the stream using different symbols from the original in order to reduce the volume of data required to reproduce the information. Depending greatly on the actual symbols used to represent the original stream, LZW-based and similar compression utilities can generally be expected to reduce the size of a file by about a factor of two, and the original data stream can be recovered from the new, smaller file perfectly without the loss of a single bit. That is a major reason why zip, arj, gzip, etc. are ubiquitously used to transfer programs and data around the internet. These algorithms could be applied as well to photos, music, and video, but doing so would only reduce a 3 Gbps HD video stream to about 1.5 Gbps. That is not anywhere nearly good enough to make storing and transferring digital music, photos, and video on the internet or over the air, for that matter, practical.

Fortunately, if we analyze things like photos and video in a different way, there tend to be large areas that are approximately repetitive. In addition, significant amounts of both visual and audible data can be discarded without the human brain being able to tell the difference, or at least not very much or very often. Because of this, we can employ "lossy" compression algorithms to translate the music, photos, or video into much lower bandwidth bitstreams or much smaller files. The recovered output is not at all identical to the original data, but it is close enough for our purposes.

The question is, "How much data do we throw away?" The answer to that depends on several variables. The first is the nature of the original data. Video (sans the audio) tends to lend itself to greater compression than any other data of which I am aware. Large areas of the screen may be approximately duplicated from one page of video to the next. One relies on the fact the video only changes a little bit from one frame to the next, so the data stream reproduces the picture in full, but then subsequent frames are only represented in the data stream by the changes from the previous page, not the entire page itself. By choosing prudently what we consider enough of a difference how much of a change needs to be represented in the picture at all, we can reduce the data needed to reproduce the next page. Where the line between "prudent" and "imprudent" lies depends upon how much degradation of picture quality we are willing to accept. If one has lower standards, the compression can be greater. As Soapm mentioned, this may depend on the quantity of alcohol one has consumed. 

Another variable is the amount of processing power and time available. Analyzing the data more extensively can produce a much tighter bitstream for qualitatively virtually the same results. If one has a monster CPU array with unlimited time, comparatively rather small bitstreams can be created that produce very pleasing results. If one must compress the data in real time with a reasonably economical processor, the stream is going to require rather more bandwidth.

Of course, the actual content itself has much to do with it. Some video lends itself to greater compression and other video to less without unpleasant artifacts in the output. Other than changing the resolution, the individual doing the authoring doesn't really have much control over the content, but the other factors are much more within his control. That said, most people are gong to want (or absolutely need) to "set it and forget it" when it comes to the compression parameters, and may have rather limited patience in terms of the amount of time required to get things done. (Some compression utilities also have very limited amounts of control offered to the user.) That being the case, rather than recode every movie or at least part of it, observe the PQ, and adjust the compression parameters, one usually just quickly finds a set of compression parameters that almost always produced good results and then sticks with those parameters. That is fine for most of us, but if space is a major concern, one may wish to fiddle with the compression on an individual basis to produce the tightest practical bitstream.

So yes, 2 hours or even significantly more can fit on a DVD, but one must make compromises in one or more areas to achieve it.


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## Dan203

lrhorer said:


> doing so would only reduce a 3 Gbps HD video stream to about 1.5 Gbps.


Your calculation is a little off. 1920*1088*24*29.97 = 1.5Gbps and that's before chorma sub-sampling* is taken into account. In reality video is transmitted at 4:2:0, which means it's really 1920*1088*12*29.97 = 751Mbps. Throw in your 2:1 compression from LZW and you're down to 375Mbps. Still not practical to transmit, but significantly smaller then 1.5Gbps.

* Instead of RGB, where each pixel has 8 bits of Red/Green/Blue video uses YUV where the image is separated into one brightness value (luma) and two color values (chroma). In standard broadcast the luma is full resolution, but both of the chroma signals are only 1/4 resolution. So basically each block of 4 pixels is the same color but each individual pixel varies in brightness based on the luma signal.


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## lrhorer

Dan203 said:


> Your calculation is a little off. 1920*1088*24*29.97 = 1.5Gbps and that's before chorma sub-sampling* is taken into account. In reality video is transmitted at 4:2:0, which means it's really 1920*1088*12*29.97 = 751Mbps. Throw in your 2:1 compression from LZW and you're down to 375Mbps. Still not practical to transmit, but significantly smaller then 1.5Gbps.


That assumes 1920*1088*24*30. Transmitting 1920*1088*24*60 = 3 Gbps, although of course you are correct about employing YUV coding rather than RGB - but that is just another means of compression. Unless I am much mistaken, 3 Gbps is the maximum bit rate specification for HDMI 1.0. HDMI 2.0 I vaguely seem to recall may even be more. In any case, however, even 100 Mbps would be rather impractical to store and transmit, and it would most definitely have been so when the specs for Blu-Ray and HD QAM were created. In another 5 years, 100Mbps video bitstreams might be very practical, although I suspect unnecessary. 1080p x 60 video is getting to be close to the limit where any visual artifacts (other than compression artifacts, of course) are no longer discernable. Quadrupling the resolution to around 2160p should take the bandwidth of a "perfect" compressed video to about 60 - 80 Mbps, and at that point I don't think further improvement will be of significant value, regardless of picture size. Not, mind you, that I even believe 1080p video will be abandoned for 2160p in the next 5 or even 10 years.


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## Dan203

No one transmits [email protected] [email protected] is the max for broadcast. Most broadcasters store the "masters" as I frame only MPEG-2 at ~50Mbps with 4:2:2 YUV. I,m sure the production companies save their shows as film, tapes, or lossless digital, but the broadcasters and sindicators have too much stuff and just can't store files that big. One of our biggest business clients is a sindicator and they still get a lot of stuff on tape and have to digitize it themselves. The broadcast sector tends to be pretty far behind technologically compared to even what we can do with our desktop PCs. You'd also be amazed how many times a show is recoded before it hits your TV just to accommodate old equipment. I always get a little chuckle when someone says they don't want to recode to H.264 because they want to preserve the "pristine original". That video has already been recoded like a half dozen, or more, times before it even reaches their DVR.


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## gonzotek

Dan203 said:


> I always get a little chuckle when someone says they don't want to recode to H.264 because they want to preserve the "pristine original". That video has already been recoded like a half dozen, or more, times before it even reaches their DVR.


Yeah, but why add one more, if you have the space available to store the mpeg2? Recoding to H.264 is still computationally expensive. I do it - for device compatibility reasons, but not on videos I expect to only send back to the tivo. And I treat the resultant output as disposable, keeping the 'original' copy, since that's the best I have access to and it's just easier not to bother. At the rate I personally transfer and store content, disk space/cost simply isn't an issue.


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## Dan203

Yeah but we get people who complain about the one GOP we have to recode around an edit point. They'll actually do I frame edits just to avoid a dozen frames from being recoded.


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## moyekj

Dan203 said:


> Yeah but we get people who complain about the one GOP we have to recode around an edit point. They'll actually do I frame edits just to avoid a dozen frames from being recoded.


 Guilty as charged! I love how easy it is to set cut points on I-Frames in VRD.


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