# upgrading to HD. Questions on HR20/21/22/23 models



## marklyn (Jan 21, 2002)

I am getting a HD television soon so I will need to upgrade my HDVR2 box to a HD capable box. Most of the research I've done on the board points me to the subject line models to match some of the features I'm enjoying with my current series 2 boxes but I'm still not clear on some things and help is appreciated.

1. It appears that the lower number (ie: HR20) indicates smaller drives; less room for HD video. Being that I've upgraded my current series 2 boxes (zippered, larger drives, etc), I'd prefer to get a HD box and just upgrade the HD to something like 1.5Tb. Can I basically pop out the drive and put in a new drive? (I know I can get an eSata external drive and plug in but prefer to not have another device running)

2. Will all of the HR20-23 units have MRV and can they 'talk' to my series 2 boxes (share videos)?

3. I'd like to set up a media center pc to store video, photos, etc. Will the HR20-23 boxes be able to access that?

4. I currently have a multiswitch in my attic (for up to 4 series 2 boxes). Is it likely that I will have to get a new one and which multiswitch considerations are there?

5. I'll obviously need a new dish. What are my options there?

6. Lastly I'm still confused that the different 'series' (ie: HR20-100, etc.) Why are there different series within the various HD models?

Thanks


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## litzdog911 (Oct 18, 2002)

1. Not really. The HR20 and HR21 have 320GB internal drives, while the HR22/23 have 500GB drives. All models support external eSATA drives, too. Swapping the internal drive will violate your lease agreement.

2. No. DirecTV is currently testing MRV across their own DVRs and HD Receivers, but it won't work with Tivo's MRV.

3. Yes. It's called Media Sharing. 

4. Yes. When you add new HD equipment to your account DirecTV will provide a new satellite dish and HD-compatible multiswitch (Zinwell WB68). 

5. You'll get a SlimLine HD dish. It's free with installation when you upgrade to HD. 

6. The "-xxx" refers to the manufacturer code.


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## TyroneShoes (Sep 6, 2004)

marklyn said:


> ...Can I basically pop out the drive and put in a new drive?...


According to DBSTalk.com, it really is just that simple.


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## Adam1115 (Dec 15, 2003)

TyroneShoes said:


> According to DBSTalk.com, it really is just that simple.


It's even simpler to install an eSATA drive. Enclosures are very cheap.

All new receivers are leased, you don't own them. Opening the cover breaks your lease and could mean a hefty fee. The DVR has warranty stickers and it has been reported also has case intrusion detection.

There's just no reason to do it when the esata is so easy.


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## HiDefGator (Oct 12, 2004)

Adam1115 said:


> ... Opening the cover breaks your lease and could mean a hefty fee. The DVR has warranty stickers and it has been reported also has case intrusion detection.


A hefty fee for opeing your cover? Are you one of those people that don't tear off mattress tags either? I have trouble seeing a scenario where they would actually come after you for opening the cover. And just what would the fee be for opejning it?

Just the ability to have a single box with the drive inside it and no separate power supply and wires is reason enough for me to not want an eSata hanging off the back.


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

There has not been any security sticker on either of the HR2x boxes I have. I too prefer the single box solution, without the waste of the internal drive spinning unused. I did try an external drive for a while, but did not find it reliable.

Perhaps the most difficult thing is locating a Security Torx bit to remove the cover.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

And with the problems being reported on the other sites concerning the eSata external, I've decided to stay away from them. So I added an HR23 to my HR20. This way I have four tuners to play with. Also, the HR20 has an internal ATSC OTA tuner.


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## Adam1115 (Dec 15, 2003)

HiDefGator said:


> A hefty fee for opeing your cover? Are you one of those people that don't tear off mattress tags either? I have trouble seeing a scenario where they would actually come after you for opening the cover. And just what would the fee be for opejning it?


I wouldn't tear off mattress tags on a mattress that ISN'T MINE.

The fee for opening the receiver is the same for not returning it. You agree not to open it as part of the lease. When you cancel and return it, they may not accept it and you may get billed. I think it's $470.

Or, you might have it fail and they choose not to replace it, charge you $470, then charge you $199 to lease another one.



HiDefGator said:


> Just the ability to have a single box with the drive inside it and no separate power supply and wires is reason enough for me to not want an eSata hanging off the back.


Then go with a provider that allows you to purchase your own equipment so you can do with it what you choose, or pay the $ to purchase an HR2x. Why sign an agreement you intend not to keep..? It's not *your* box to modify. You don't own it.



stevel said:


> There has not been any security sticker on either of the HR2x boxes I have. I too prefer the single box solution, without the waste of the internal drive spinning unused. I did try an external drive for a while, but did not find it reliable.


Mine has a sticker. My esata drive works fine.

But besides that, these boxes have intrusion detection. DirecTV can tell that you opened to box regardless of the stupid sticker.


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## HiDefGator (Oct 12, 2004)

Adam1115 said:


> I wouldn't tear off mattress tags on a mattress that ISN'T MINE.
> 
> The fee for opening the receiver is the same for not returning it. You agree not to open it as part of the lease. When you cancel and return it, they may not accept it and you may get billed. I think it's $470.
> 
> ...


And they can prove the sticker didn't just fall off? No.

Have they ever charged a single customer for opening a box? Unlikely


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## Adam1115 (Dec 15, 2003)

HiDefGator said:


> And they can prove the sticker didn't just fall off? No.
> 
> Have they ever charged a single customer for opening a box? Unlikely


No. They can prove you opened the box because it has intrusion detection.

I don't know if they have, but they only switched over to 'lease only' a few years ago. I doubt a lot of people who replaced hard drives in HR20's have canceled DirecTV yet.

Risk it if you want, violate your contract if you want, I don't care, just pointing out that you take a chance on opening a box you don't own. The OP should consider it, that's all. No sense in arguing about it. It couldn't be easier to add an esata drive, most of the reported problems are from the original models.


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## HiDefGator (Oct 12, 2004)

Adam1115 said:


> No. They can prove you opened the box because it has intrusion detection.
> 
> I don't know if they have, but they only switched over to 'lease only' a few years ago. I doubt a lot of people who replaced hard drives in HR20's have canceled DirecTV yet.


all of mine are leased. i've returned two of them that have been opened for problems. never once did anyone complain or mention that I had opened them.

i just can't see the returns dept going through each box to see if it had been opened. and then what? shipping a perfectly good box back to the user and saying they now own it because it had been opened? way too much time and effort involved. it just isn't a realistic concern in my opinion.


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## phox_mulder (Feb 23, 2006)

Adam1115 said:


> No. They can prove you opened the box because it has intrusion detection.


Don't they have to open the box to see if it's been opened, thus tripping the intrusion detection?

phox


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

There's no intrusion detection in the boxes.


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## HiDefGator (Oct 12, 2004)

stevel said:


> There's no intrusion detection in the boxes.


I knew I had never seen it but I thought maybe in newer boxes.


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## Adam1115 (Dec 15, 2003)

phox_mulder said:


> Don't they have to open the box to see if it's been opened, thus tripping the intrusion detection?
> 
> phox


No.


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## TyroneShoes (Sep 6, 2004)

Adam1115 said:


> No. They can prove you opened the box because it has intrusion detection.
> 
> I don't know if they have, but they only switched over to 'lease only' a few years ago. I doubt a lot of people who replaced hard drives in HR20's have canceled DirecTV yet.
> 
> Risk it if you want, violate your contract if you want, I don't care, just pointing out that you take a chance on opening a box you don't own. The OP should consider it, that's all. No sense in arguing about it. It couldn't be easier to add an esata drive, most of the reported problems are from the original models.


All good arguments, other than the "intrusion detection" myth. If you wear a tinfoil hat it foils the "intrusion detection" anyway.

But it is not a one-sided debate, meaning there is _indeed_ sense in presenting the other side:

1) Having an eSATA is not as green (not to mention not as quiet) as using the internal drive (unless you open it up and remove the drive's power cable--oh yeah, by doing that you just ruined the sticker and voided the warranty and DTV will garnish your wages until a Republican sits in the white house again. Oooooo! Scary! ).

2) There are just that many more things that can go wrong, including a flimsy connection (eSATA connections really blow, as do some of the cables I've seen) and vulnerability to the environment. Folks have posted right here that they lost hundreds of hours of content when their cat brushed up against their eSATA enclosure forcing it to bump power and reformat.

3) Antecs don't grow on trees. A good enclosure is typically around $50, even when on sale at Fry's. But go ahead, spend $20 worth of your time scouring the net to find one for $29.95, and then spend the nickel you saved wisely.

And most damning of all, where is the logic to the argument that if DTV receives a failed DVR from a customer and the label is missing, that they would be in any way motivated to piss that customer off? It's just not there (the logic AND the label). Unless you are all thumbs and return multiple DVRs because you spilled your energy drink in it or kept it powered up and dropped a screwdriver in it, DTV couldn't give a rat's hat as long as they get that hundred a month from you for the privilege of watching _True Blood_ and _Dexter_.

Replacing the HDD is so easy, even you could do it blindfolded after 3 Jaeger shots in under 5 minutes. Remove 8 screws, unplug two cables, remove the old drive from the plastic housing, and reverse the process. Rinse, then repeat.

I have seen 5 HR2x DVRs come through my house since 2006, and every one of them had the label stuck to the lid, overlapped to the frame, _but not stuck to the frame at all!_ If you simply put the stock drive back in (label or no label) when you return it, you should be golden. Take an Ambien, sleep like a baby (actually, don't; that stuff is really dangerous compared to swapping a HDD).


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