# Did TiVo get serious upgrades since release?



## Tennispro3782 (Jan 30, 2011)

I have a series 2 TiVo and have had it for years. Of course I've loved it and now I just ordered a Premire XL. Afterwards I went review hunting and became a little concerned. It seems at the release it was plagued with problems which are dominant in many reviews. So being (almost) February I was wondering if they fixed all the major problems or if I should lower my expectations. Thanks!


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

Tennispro3782 said:


> I have a series 2 TiVo and have had it for years. Of course I've loved it and now I just ordered a Premire XL. Afterwards I went review hunting and became a little concerned. It seems at the release it was plagued with problems which are dominant in many reviews. So being (almost) February I was wondering if they fixed all the major problems or if I should lower my expectations. Thanks!


I love my Premier and I think it works great! I am sure you will get a number of other opinions... I use the HDUI menues and have never experienced a problem.


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## smbaker (May 24, 2003)

Tennispro3782 said:


> So being (almost) February I was wondering if they fixed all the major problems or if I should lower my expectations. Thanks!


Nope, they've addressed almost nothing. One wonders if you stopped by Tivo HQ, if they even employ any software people.

Admittedly, I've had only a few problems with my Premiere -- a couple of lockups (one under the latest release), some green circle delays, a couple of times I needed to switch off the HDUI because the my shows list was empty, etc. All fairly minor stuff, but at the same time minor stuff that shouldn't have been happening at release let alone 10 months later.

It's annoying that obvious flaws in this product are not being corrected. The HDUI is still incomplete. People with bad Internet connections are still having difficulties. As far as I know, the second core is still not enabled. HDUI is still slow (not "unbearably" slow, but far slower than a "premium" device should be).


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

Tennispro3782 said:


> I have a series 2 TiVo and have had it for years. Of course I've loved it and now I just ordered a Premire XL. Afterwards I went review hunting and became a little concerned. It seems at the release it was plagued with problems which are dominant in many reviews. So being (almost) February I was wondering if they fixed all the major problems or if I should lower my expectations. Thanks!


If you were reading the forums, then you would have already answered your question.

No, they have absolutely not fixed all the major problems. There have been some improvements in speed in the HDUI, On a 10 point scale where 10 is where I would want to be and 1 is where it was at release, it is now about a 3. People still have problems with stability, lockups, tuning, rebooting, etc. Some people seem much luckier than others, however. Peoples' experiences and opinions are all over the map.

After a year, I would have hoped the problems were solved, performance were increased an order of magnitude, and they were moving forward with more useful features and maybe even finishing the HDUI. Nope.


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 28, 2002)

crxssi said:


> If you were reading the forums, then you would have already answered your question.
> 
> No, they have absolutely not fixed all the major problems. There have been some improvements in speed in the HDUI, On a 10 point scale where 10 is where I would want to be and 1 is where it was at release, it is now about a 3. People still have problems with stability, lockups, tuning, rebooting, etc. Some people seem much luckier than others, however. Peoples' experiences and opinions are all over the map.
> 
> After a year, I would have hoped the problems were solved, performance were increased an order of magnitude, and they were moving forward with more useful features and maybe even finishing the HDUI. Nope.


I think 3 is being extremely generous. If they started at 1 last April and 10 is complete, it's more like a 1.5 or so. They've barely moved the ball. It's completely depressing that after almost a YEAR they've done almost nothing to finish the box and address the problems (like the COMPLETELY MISSING Parental Controls in the HDUI).

But they are really great about advertising, adjusting pricing, and adding new features to their broken Premiere platform. Just not the core of having a finished product. It's clear whoever is in charge is in over their head and can't deliver what marketing promised - and continues to promise.


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

Tennispro3782 said:


> I have a series 2 TiVo and have had it for years. Of course I've loved it and now I just ordered a Premire XL. Afterwards I went review hunting and became a little concerned. It seems at the release it was plagued with problems which are dominant in many reviews. So being (almost) February I was wondering if they fixed all the major problems or if I should lower my expectations. Thanks!


Like you I had series 2 (3 of them) and they never gave me a bit of trouble and performed well. The one I still have works beautifully. Based on that experience the Premiere (2 of them) is a huge disappointment. Other than recording shows in HD (except the ones it misses) it's a hard product to like. Biggest problems are laggy menus, sloppy interface, unresponsive HDUI, occasional lockups and random reboots. The solution to that is to use the SDUI. However, with SDUI you loose some of the features of the HDUI which I kinda liked and SDUI has a few bugs of its own. Results may vary. Unfortunately I don't know that there is much choice as I believe most alternatives are worse unless you DIY. If I had it all to do over again I would probably DIY, get an S3, or better yet not get hooked on HD and keep using my S2.


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## Tennispro3782 (Jan 30, 2011)

Argh so does anyone on this forum like there premire? I mean I figured "how badly could they possibly mess it up" and bought one. Hopefully my box is good and I won't be forced onto forums to release my TiVo anger! Thanks for the responses so far.


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## mec1991 (Nov 5, 2004)

If you use it just as a DVR (forget using internet activities) and keep it in the SD menus you will probably be happy with it. I no longer have spontaneous reboots, spinning green circles, etc. since doing so.

I have no idea why some people have no problem with their Premieres and others (like me) do, but the general consensus is that it depends on how good your network connection is. Ours (Time Warner) is a joke and that is most likely the reason we cannot do things online with it.


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## Torgo (Dec 31, 2001)

Tennispro3782 said:


> Argh so does anyone on this forum like there premire? I mean I figured "how badly could they possibly mess it up" and bought one. Hopefully my box is good and I won't be forced onto forums to release my TiVo anger! Thanks for the responses so far.


It's fine, it's got some minor issues but it's perfectly acceptable. I have an HD and a Premiere, I much prefer the Premier in daily usage.

Keep in mind there are a few characters around that will never stop bashing the Premiere and Tivo, and your usual contingency of nit-pickers. But for most of us (and most people that use them and probably never even post here) it's a great DVR, that beats the sh*tboxes from the Cable companies hands down.

Gentlemen, skewer away


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## Tennispro3782 (Jan 30, 2011)

Yeah I figured most of the people on here were the ones who had problems with there TiVo otherwise why bother using a forum in the first place? I got Cox Cummunications and it's pretty fast. My worries are melting away. On YouTube the lag doesn't seem much different then on my series 2.

Thanks again guys.


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## caddyroger (Mar 15, 2005)

Tennispro3782 said:


> Yeah I figured most of the people on here were the ones who had problems with there TiVo otherwise why bother using a forum in the first place? I got Cox Cummunications and it's pretty fast. My worries are melting away. On YouTube the lag doesn't seem much different then on my series 2.
> 
> Thanks again guys.


Some of the polls taken shows that 30% does have problems with the premiere. Some are ok with ordering a 400 hp v8 but instead instead gets a 120 hp 4 cylinder engine.


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## mec1991 (Nov 5, 2004)

@ Tennispro

Is your ISP *reliable*? I don't think speed is the real issue but honestly have no clue. TW drops out throughout the day here and those dropouts seem to be linked to our Premiere's problems with HD menus, Netflix, etc. Hopefully they are more reliable. 

I look at it this way; I got a really good price on the product and service last November and can wait it out till TiVo fixes the software.


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## mec1991 (Nov 5, 2004)

@ Torgo

Love your user name! 

I miss the SOL guys a lot.


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## aadam101 (Jul 15, 2002)

mec1991 said:


> If you use it just as a DVR (forget using internet activities) and keep it in the SD menus you will probably be happy with it. I no longer have spontaneous reboots, spinning green circles, etc. since doing so.
> 
> I have no idea why some people have no problem with their Premieres and others (like me) do, but the general consensus is that it depends on how good your network connection is. Ours (Time Warner) is a joke and that is most likely the reason we cannot do things online with it.


If you are going to do that you might as well just buy a Series 3.


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 28, 2002)

aadam101 said:


> If you are going to do that you might as well just buy a Series 3.


Except then you'd be missing the only REAL benefit of the Premiere so far - 4-5x faster MRV transfers for shows. No way you can dream of transferring an hour of HD in less than 10 minutes on a S3 or THD, and you can do that or a little better on Premiere to Premiere transfers.


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

Read the threads about all existing customers that were jumping all over the Woot deal last week. Consider that before you listen to a couple of guys that have dedicated every waking moment of their lives to bashing TiVo...


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

Tennispro3782 said:


> Yeah I figured most of the people on here were the ones who had problems with their TiVo otherwise why bother using a forum in the first place?


Having a problem is not the only motivation to use the forums. I was here way before I even bought a Premier. But yes, people with problems will likely be more vocal (and rightfully so), and also likely seek out the forums more than those who are happy.

Since you have already ordered a Premiere, asking what others think is probably a waste of time. You will know soon enough and form your own opinion. Keep in mind that people, like you, coming from a series 2 or a cable DVR will likely be much happier than those (like me) coming from a series 3/HD. You will see a big improvement in features and speed. We, on the other hand, have not (other than network transfer speed). People have different expectations, and part of their satisfaction or dissatisfaction will be based on those expectations. Welcome to the human condition!


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

I keep the S3 in the bedroom, the HD in the media room and the Premier in the family room. The premier is used daily and we keep it on the HDUI menus. All of my TiVo's are hardwired to the network.

We really like the Premier and yes I would recommend it to my friends.


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## Tennispro3782 (Jan 30, 2011)

So I have a spare wireless G adapter, would getting an N significantly increase performance?I do have a pretty solid Internet connection at home. Part of the reason I'm on here asking even though I already got one is just to see what to expect. I mean either way I probably would of gotten a premier anyway because my series 2 is preparing it's own death bed.


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## smbaker (May 24, 2003)

mec1991 said:


> If you use it just as a DVR (forget using internet activities) and keep it in the SD menus you will probably be happy with it. I no longer have spontaneous reboots, spinning green circles, etc. since doing so.


So true... As long as you pretend it's a 3 year old THD, it works fine...

Back to the OP, the problems I've experienced are minor, so I'm sure you'll enjoy your new Preimere when it arrives. It seems a rarity for someone to experience a problem that is a deal-breaker, usually those people have another contributing factor such as unstable internet service.

However, that doesn't make it right that we've been sold an incomplete unfinished product with obvious flaws. Tivo needs to finish what they started. Many people seem to believe they should just put up with this level of product; I'm not sure why.


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## aadam101 (Jul 15, 2002)

curiousgeorge said:


> Except then you'd be missing the only REAL benefit of the Premiere so far - 4-5x faster MRV transfers for shows. No way you can dream of transferring an hour of HD in less than 10 minutes on a S3 or THD, and you can do that or a little better on Premiere to Premiere transfers.


I didn't have a Series 3 (I had a series 1 and 2) but I don't notice any difference from Series 2. I think if anything MRV is slower on the Premiere. I am in a bigger house now so that could be part of the reason since I am using Wifi only.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

aadam101 said:


> I didn't have a Series 3 (I had a series 1 and 2) but I don't notice any difference from Series 2. I think if anything MRV is slower on the Premiere. I am in a bigger house now so that could be part of the reason since I am using Wifi only.


Um, HD files are much, much, much larger than SD files....


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 28, 2002)

aadam101 said:


> I didn't have a Series 3 (I had a series 1 and 2) but I don't notice any difference from Series 2. I think if anything MRV is slower on the Premiere. I am in a bigger house now so that could be part of the reason since I am using Wifi only.


Just check out your network transfer speeds under Network & Phone -> View Network Diagnostics -> Transfer History.

Items 3 and 4 will tell you how fast you're transferring and receiving shows between Premieres. What are those numbers? Maybe you have a wireless problem you didn't know about.


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## aadam101 (Jul 15, 2002)

crxssi said:


> Um, HD files are much, much, much larger than SD files....


Who said anything about HD files? Tivo to Tivo transfers are ok. PC to Tivo transfers are painfully slow at times.


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 28, 2002)

aadam101 said:


> Who said anything about HD files? Tivo to Tivo transfers are ok. PC to Tivo transfers are painfully slow at times.


Still, post your diagnostic numbers. My Premiere to PC is still acceptably fast. It sounds like you have a problem.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Yeah I transfer shows to my PC in around 5-6 minutes according to KMTTG.


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## plazman30 (Jan 23, 2005)

I have 2 Premieres and no issues with them. But I have FIOS and don't need to deal with crap like tuning adapters. Have had no reboots, one green circle, and that's about it.


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## Tennispro3782 (Jan 30, 2011)

Tennispro3782 said:


> So I have a spare wireless G adapter, would getting an N significantly increase performance?I do have a pretty solid Internet connection at home. Part of the reason I'm on here asking even though I already got one is just to see what to expect. I mean either way I probably would of gotten a premier anyway because my series 2 is preparing it's own death bed.


Could somebody please answer my question? Thanks


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Yes. N speed should increase performance tremendously over wireless G.


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## JimboG (May 27, 2007)

aaronwt said:


> Yes. N speed should increase performance tremendously over wireless G.


That said, it would be better to run Ethernet cable, or get a powerline network adapter, or a Moca adapter with your existing coax.

WiFi connections are pretty convenient for laptops but just not reliable enough for streaming HD video to your primary TV viewing screen. Besides, the Tivo Premiere doesn't handle a flaky internet connection very gracefully.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

aaronwt said:


> Yes. N speed should increase performance tremendously over wireless G.


But which "performance?" Assuming the G isn't taxed by other people, and it is within full speed range, it probably won't make any noticeable difference except when transferring programs from one TiVo to another (MRV) or to/from a computer; and maybe a high-bitrate HD stream from Netflix. Of course, if you do a lot of the above, then it would certainly be worth it... but....

I wouldn't use wireless at all if there were ANY way to pull a cable to the unit (which I did) simply because wireless is not as stable- it can be interfered with, and thus has more potential for lost data or interruptions.


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## TWinbrook46636 (Feb 9, 2008)

I started out with 14.5 and there were some very small but welcome improvements that came with 14.6 but when 14.7 came out all that was undone. Mine is worse now than when I first got it. Everything is slow. Painfully slow. It freezes every day with the spinning green circle. My network is fine. More than fine. No other device I have has any connectivity issues whatsoever. I want to use the HDUI but find myself constantly switching back to the old SDUI. It's just too slow and buggy.

It really is ridiculous how little things have improved since then but even more so to see that tiny bit of progress thrown away with the latest update. A classic case of one step forward two steps back. I have lifetime on mine and was going to wait it out but I'm thinking of dumping it now. I don't know how much faith I have left in TiVo. I'm certainly running out of patience.


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## audioscience (Feb 10, 2005)

I've had my Premiere for about 4 days and am still evaluating it. I am a bit disappointed with the incompleteness of it but it still works like a Tivo. The HDUI is not as fast as I'd expect it but it isn't unbearably slow for me. I wonder if the more recordings I have if it will get worse. Right now it's at about 50% and it's not too bad.

Improvements I'd like to see:


Quicker HD interface
Complete HD interface
A TV guide that put the video in a corner box like it does when you hit the Tivo button. I hate that it just covers up the screen.
A bit larger screen in the corner when in the Tivo menu system
Return to Live TV when you hit Exit or Clear on the remote (have to hit Live TV or Zoom now?)
Something that I know won't ever happen because it's a hardware thing, but I'd love it if the Tivo had a clock LCD option on the front. I miss that from my Motorola DVR.
I also get audio dropouts when I go from full screen video to the Tivo menu, for about 1-2 seconds. I haven't tested if it's solely through my receiver or if it is from the Tivo. Nonetheless, the Tivo is interrupting the HDMI stream which causes it. I'd like that to be fixed as well.

Everything else works as promised. One nice thing about Tivo is that they are always adding features (Netflix, Hulu is forthcoming). I liked that about my Series 2 Tivo is that they kept adding value even though you didn't expect it. I'm sure the HDUI will be completed eventually; when exactly though, who knows?

ETA: I just wanted to add that I really do like the way the HDUI looks and feels, despite a little lag. It's pretty cool, almost like Boxee although not quite that slick. Anyhow, I just wanted to throw that out there for anyone considering the Premiere so it doesn't sound like all negatives.


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## HellFish (Jan 28, 2007)

crxssi said:


> Tennispro3782 said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah I figured most of the people on here were the ones who had problems with there TiVo otherwise why bother using a forum in the first place?
> ...


Err, not to pick on you, but do you have a different handle? Your post brought to my attention that you signed up in Apr '10, the month the premiere was released. And as far as I can tell, your first post was stating how disappointed you are in the specs of Premiere. It looks like you're a prime example of what Tennispro was talking about, a potentially long time lurker, that decided to join in order to complain. If you have a different handle, I apologize. But surely you see the irony here?


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## HellFish (Jan 28, 2007)

And more on topic, I haven't had many problems with my premiere. I had a few hanging green circles in the most recent 14.7RC, but the official version seems to have cleared them up. I have a few pet peeves, but I think my requests are protected by copyright from other companies.

I use the HDUI without issue. I do notice some response issues, but I may give it some slack due to my setup. My Tivo is in a different room from my TV, and I use an RF Remote and, because of this, there is a delay. I experienced this with my DTV DVR, my Comcast cable box & the Tivo in both SD & HD menus.

Also, I hope I'm not jinxing myself, but I haven't had to unplug my Premiere once after the cable card was successfully installed. I had to reboot it recently to clear an indexing issue, but I have yet to pull the power cord.


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## ThomasAlexHD (Jan 31, 2011)

crxssi said:


> But which "performance?" Assuming the G isn't taxed by other people, and it is within full speed range, it probably won't make any noticeable difference except when transferring programs from one TiVo to another (MRV) or to/from a computer; and maybe a high-bitrate HD stream from Netflix. Of course, if you do a lot of the above, then it would certainly be worth it... but....
> 
> I wouldn't use wireless at all if there were ANY way to pull a cable to the unit (which I did) simply because wireless is not as stable- it can be interfered with, and thus has more potential for lost data or interruptions.


I wonder if N vs G would speed up transfers of recordings? Two things I read make me think maybe not. First, someone wrote that the contents of a Tivo drive are encrypted. Second, Tivo documentation somewhere notes that a transfer can take up to the length of the show to occur. This makes me think the transfer is being done by decrypting the show in real time or very close to it, streaming that, and then re-encrypting on the target box. This is obviously going to be much slower than just physically transferring the bytes without processing them in any way. But it shouldn't take an hour to transfer an hour of video between two boxes on a network unless something in the chain of events is slow.

This is kind of like the difference between mini-DV tapes and today's HDD or flash memory camcorders. With mini-DV, you had to actually play the tape back at normal speed to transfer the data to the camcorder. With flash drives with standard file structures, this turned into much faster transfers where the bytes were being moved as is with no need to manipulate them.

I don't know if this really describes the technical details of transferring something from one box to another, but it would kind of explain why it's so slow - certainly not up to normal transfer standards in today's digital world.

If this is the technique being used, then bumping up your network performance probably wouldn't help much or at all - the limiting factor is the technique, not the network.


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## ThomasAlexHD (Jan 31, 2011)

Tennispro3782 said:


> Could somebody please answer my question? Thanks


Not a networking expert, but a few things I've read. First, I guess we're assuming you have an N router currently transmitting on N and G bands both.
If not, then getting an N adaptor for use with a G router won't increase performance.

When trying to determine whether or not to get an N router two years ago, I read some performance test reviews. One think to watch for if it's still true is that using an N router transmitting only on N to N receivers is supposedly a lot faster than running a mixed N/G network. Again, this may be something that has been "fixed" or improved since so you might want to browse to see if it's a factor today.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

HellFish said:


> Err, not to pick on you, but do you have a different handle? Your post brought to my attention that you signed up in Apr '10, the month the premiere was released. And as far as I can tell, your first post was stating how disappointed you are in the specs of Premiere. It looks like you're a prime example of what Tennispro was talking about, a potentially long time lurker, that decided to join in order to complain. If you have a different handle, I apologize. But surely you see the irony here?


No prob- and I was wondering if someone would catch that. I was on the forum years ago and somehow lost my handle. I came back when there were rumors of the Premiere. I then monitored the list for a considerable while (can't remember how long) without posting or signing up again. And yes, my first new post was a complaint about the weak specifications. But I didn't HAVE a Premiere, and didn't get one for several months after that either. And, thus, I didn't post any about any problems. I also didn't know what the specs were when I first started lurking (I don't think they were even out).

If you then follow all my posts (I am sure you have something better to do), I was posting that I was NOT having any problems (because I was not) for several months, other than the HDUI being slow (or wishing for some additional features). Over and over I posted that I never had any reboots, never had any freezing, never had any crashes. Then that all ended and now the box is not reliable anymore. So saying I would be a prime example of someone who joined just to post about problems would be incorrect.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

ThomasAlexHD said:


> I wonder if N vs G would speed up transfers of recordings? Two things I read make me think maybe not. First, someone wrote that the contents of a Tivo drive are encrypted. Second, Tivo documentation somewhere notes that a transfer can take up to the length of the show to occur. This makes me think the transfer is being done by decrypting the show in real time or very close to it, streaming that, and then re-encrypting on the target box. This is obviously going to be much slower than just physically transferring the bytes without processing them in any way. But it shouldn't take an hour to transfer an hour of video between two boxes on a network unless something in the chain of events is slow.


You are correct that there is an upper limit to the transfer speed of programs and that speed is not quite to the level of the physical network port on the TiVo. It also depends on the TYPE of transfer- MRV, or to/from computer.

But, the speeds many users are getting with transfers (8.7MB/s) are WAY above the maximum transfer speed of a perfect G connection which is only capable of 3.38MB/s. The best possible "N" performance is around 37MB/s (ten times faster than G; even twice as fast as the Premiere's 100base Ethernet port) . So yes, in most cases, using N will greatly boost transfer speeds over G.

But users probably won't notice any difference when not transferring programs.

See also: http://tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=456586&highlight=network+benchmark


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## TitanTiger (May 5, 2009)

I've had my Premiere for about a month, but only got my HD tv's and service a couple of days ago. The HD menus lag for me. Enough that I just switched back to SD menus. I'm happy enough with them. I was upgrading from a Series 2, so the main benefit for me was being able to use it with HD service via a CableCARD. The rest is just gravy. 

I wouldn't mind using the HD menus if they could figure out how to speed things up.


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

My wife just had to try the HDUI again. I said ooooook lets try it. We watched ONE show and I didn't have to say a word to convince her that SDUI is the way to go because the HDUI is still borked. This is what happened after watching that one show and trying to delete it and as a note to the OP this is a problem since DAY1 with Premiere:


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 28, 2002)

rahnbo said:


> My wife just had to try the HDUI again. I said ooooook lets try it. We watched ONE show and I didn't have to say a word to convince her that SDUI is the way to go because the HDUI is still borked. This is what happened after watching that one show and trying to delete it and as a note to the OP this is a problem since DAY1 with Premiere:


Thanks for reminding me about Restaurant Impossible. I forgot to add that to season pass until I saw your video.


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

curiousgeorge said:


> Thanks for reminding me about Restaurant Impossible. I forgot to add that to season pass until I saw your video.


Nice.  She's in to anything that involves cooking and watching cooks getting yelled at. I don't dare critique her PB&J but I'm getting tired of hearing that my dinner is "being plated" or "at the pass." Hint, "at the pass" means get it now or never.


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## smbaker (May 24, 2003)

rahnbo said:


> This is what happened after watching that one show and trying to delete it and as a note to the OP this is a problem since DAY1 with Premiere:


I've had other problems with the Premiere but never this one. Perhaps it has to do with the way I delete programs -- I always open up the detail windows and click down to 'delete'. I've been doing this since my S1 and didn't even realize there was another way to do it until recently. The most delay I've seen on a delete is a few seconds.

What we probably have here is a good ol' fashioned race between the delete code and the display code in the 'my playing' list. Why it hasn't been fixed yet is a mystery. Someone needs to force the CEO to sit down in front of a Premiere and delete 5 programs each day before getting his paycheck, his bonuses, and his stock options.


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

smbaker said:


> I've had other problems with the Premiere but never this one. Perhaps it has to do with the way I delete programs -- I always open up the detail windows and click down to 'delete'. I've been doing this since my S1 and didn't even realize there was another way to do it until recently. The most delay I've seen on a delete is a few seconds.
> 
> What we probably have here is a good ol' fashioned race between the delete code and the display code in the 'my playing' list. Why it hasn't been fixed yet is a mystery. Someone needs to force the CEO to sit down in front of a Premiere and delete 5 programs each day before getting his paycheck, his bonuses, and his stock options.


Haha, this would be a great script for a new SAW movie. Jigsaw: "If the program doesn't delete in 30 seconds, you will explode from the bomb I implanted in your brain."

This was a simple delete, or so one would think. We watched Piers Morgan (well we listened to it and talked about other stuff but that's another subject). At the end when Tivo Premiere offered to delete it I said yes and got the green ring of wait forever. I had enough time to go hunt down the video recorder (about 2 minutes), record the YouTube video, then about another 2 minutes passed and it deleted. Like I said I was just going in to the HDUI to show my wife how bad it still sucks. She does have a point because the SDUI has that occasional 10 minute remote lockout bug. Certainly there were little tricks I could have done to delete it faster but who needs that bull? So after an hour with the SDUI we're back on the SDUI realizing that Tivo probably isn't going to fix anything in a reasonable amount of time.


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## pigonthewing (May 6, 2002)

rahnbo said:


> My wife just had to try the HDUI again. I said ooooook lets try it. We watched ONE show and I didn't have to say a word to convince her that SDUI is the way to go because the HDUI is still borked. This is what happened after watching that one show and trying to delete it and as a note to the OP this is a problem since DAY1 with Premiere:


OMG, how _dare_ you complain?!

STARE AT YOUR GREEN CIRCLE AND LIKE IT!

(...just trying to get into the heads of posters who call those of us that complain "characters", because we have the audacity to be upset about stuff like this.)


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

pigonthewing said:


> OMG, how _dare_ you complain?!
> 
> STARE AT YOUR GREEN CIRCLE AND LIKE IT!
> 
> (...just trying to get into the heads of posters who call those of us that complain "characters", because we have the audacity to be upset about stuff like this.)


LOL! Check out :55. It was mesmerizing!


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

rahnbo said:


> My wife just had to try the HDUI again. I said ooooook lets try it. We watched ONE show and I didn't have to say a word to convince her that SDUI is the way to go because the HDUI is still borked. This is what happened after watching that one show and trying to delete it and as a note to the OP this is a problem since DAY1 with Premiere:




wow!!

Even on my Premiere with a 2TB hard drive 100% full of shows, this doesn't happen on mine.

i would be pisssed if this happened with any of my Premieres, but I hit the clear button and it's quickly deleted.


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## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

Unlike during the S2 years, TiVo appears to be concentrating on joint ventures designed to bring money into the company rather than features and fixes that make the DVR easier, or better to use. For example, the S2 got HME apps, TiVo to Go, Multiroom Viewing, and internet scheduling. By comparison, since the S3 TiVo has gotten nothing game changing and IMO has struggled to provide bug fixes taking over a year at times to address them, when they bothered to address them at all.

PS: It took TiVo four generations of products to add one simple item, a Free Space Indicator. Really TiVo? It was only the most requested feature you had and one that the competition had for years, useless as it may be on a TiVo.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

smbaker said:


> What we probably have here is a good ol' fashioned race between the delete code and the display code in the 'my playing' list. Why it hasn't been fixed yet is a mystery. Someone needs to force the CEO to sit down in front of a Premiere and delete 5 programs each day before getting his paycheck, his bonuses, and his stock options.


I use the SDUI and it *STILL* has the bug from years ago on the HD where if you are in a folder and rapidly start deleting programs, it will occasionally throw up a message saying "There are no more recordings in this group" and throw you back to the parent folder. Of course there ARE more recordings, you go back into the folder, it does not place you where you were (you have to scroll back to the top) and then you can start deleting or playing again.

That has been annoying me for something like 3+ years now? Of course now with the Premiere, I can add the new slide remote stutter bugs from 14.7, and the "no response to commands" bug from before that, to the mix. Oh hum...


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

Stormspace said:


> PS: It took TiVo four generations of products to add one simple item, a Free Space Indicator. Really TiVo?


And even then, they added it ONLY to the Premiere and only the HDUI. Still not present in the Premiere SDUI nor updates for the older TiVoes.


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

crxssi said:


> I use the SDUI and it *STILL* has the bug from years ago on the HD where if you are in a folder and rapidly start deleting programs, it will occasionally throw up a message saying "There are no more recordings in this group" and throw you back to the parent folder.


I get this just deleting a single show sometimes. "This folder is empty" or something like that. Been that way since S2.


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

crxssi said:


> And even then, they added it ONLY to the Premiere and only the HDUI. Still not present in the Premiere SDUI nor updates for the older TiVoes.


And it still brings absolutely zero value!


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

bradleys said:


> And it still brings absolutely zero value!


I still find the deleted items count folder in the SDUI more reliable. Another ding against HDUI is they took away the count of deleted items from the folder.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

rahnbo said:


> I still find the deleted items count folder in the SDUI more reliable. Another ding against HDUI is they took away the count of deleted items from the folder.


Agreed. That is what I look at- how much is deleted- that is my gauge of how much space is available, or how close I am before old stuff might be auto-deleted.


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## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

bradleys said:


> And it still brings absolutely zero value!


Fortunately that isn't the point. It brought perceived value to those unfamiliar with the product and served as a deterrent to adopters when it was missing. TiVo was either stupid or arrogant to not add that in before the series 4.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

rahnbo said:


> I still find the deleted items count folder in the SDUI more reliable. Another ding against HDUI is they took away the count of deleted items from the folder.


What does a count of items get you?
An item could be 30 minutes, 60 minutes, 120 minutes etc.

It served no purpose.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

aaronwt said:


> What does a count of items get you?
> An item could be 30 minutes, 60 minutes, 120 minutes etc.
> 
> It served no purpose.


What does a count of gigabytes free get you?
At item could be HD 1080i, HD 720p, SD, 0.5Mb/s, 7Mb/s, etc.

It served no purpose.


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

crxssi said:


> What does a count of gigabytes free get you?
> At item could be HD 1080i, HD 720p, SD, 0.5Mb/s, 7Mb/s, etc.
> 
> It served no purpose.


Agreed. Any FSI, whether number of shows in Suggestions, Recently Deleted, or measured in percent free is and was a waste of TiVo's resources. It seems to be a carryover from users that had an FSI on a limited space cable company DVR that was missing on TiVo DVRs. TiVo does very well managing space on it's own, pruning Suggestions and Recently Deleted items when a new recording needs space. I can only remember one "show" that I set to KUID, which was the 15 minute HDNet Test patterns used to set the overscan on my TV. Everything else is and was expendable.


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## Mike_Wolf (Sep 27, 2010)

Tennispro3782 said:


> Argh so does anyone on this forum like there premire? I mean I figured "how badly could they possibly mess it up" and bought one. Hopefully my box is good and I won't be forced onto forums to release my TiVo anger! Thanks for the responses so far.


I do. I'm happy with the premiere. Sure I'd like to have full HD menus but *shrugs* as long as it gets done at some point I can wait. I just wish we could have prior knowledge of what they want to do to it so we can give veto to what we don't like and props for what we do.


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