# Check out this deal!



## GreggC (Nov 10, 2001)

OK, Verizon is knocking on my door with FIOS and FIOS TV, which my brother just got... I've been a DTV member since 1998, and spend a lot of $$ every month with them (along with my 3 HR10's)... So I called Retention and fussed about NFL Sunday Ticket prices, SF prices, and prices in general.... Also fussed about needing OTA for my HD local channels... 

Here's what they offered me for no addl charge:

1. Replace my 3 HR10's with HR20's.
2. Replace my 3-LNB dish with the 5-LNB dish.
3. Replace my multiswitches with 5-LNB-capable multiswitches.

They also offered:

1. $40 off NFL ticket.
2. 50% off of Superfan.
3. $20 off bill for 6 months.
3. Free HD for 6 months. 
4. Reduce price of Protection Plan from 7.99 to 5.99/month.

FYI, they did confirm that I can get the HD locals in my area (DC) over sat.

Seemed good to me, so I pulled the trigger. Preliminary research on HR20's done on another forum is that they seem pretty good so far. Reluctant to give up my TiVos, but all in the name of progress.

What do u all think?

Gregg


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## ebonovic (Jul 24, 2001)

Considering you are getting
-) $900 in Receivers
-) $100 dish
-) $35 multiswitch
-) $40 + $50 off sunday ticket
-) $120 credit over the next 6 monts
-) $60 credit for HD
-) Saving $2 on the protection plan...

You did pretty good there.


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## tazzmission (Oct 15, 2002)

You did good, but I am not sure you will like the HR20 over the HR10. And you had to up for 2 more years I am sure. One thing that is preventing me from upgrading to 2 new HR20's is they are not TiVo's. I only have DirecTV for TiVo.

But as far as a deal goes, you did awesome.

I know DTV would not give me that deal nor do I think I would take it.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

From what I've read, the HR20 is a big downgrade, especially with its OTA tuners disabled as they are now. Aside from MPEG4, the only thing it seems to have going for it is performance; but that's in comparison to an HR10-250 with 3.x -- with 6.3, the HR10-250 performs just fine, though reportedly it has bugs that affect some setups (not mine).

Admittedly, MPEG4 will be a big deal in the future if you intend to stay with DirecTV. However, right now you'll lose (OTA) more channels than you'll gain (MPEG4) -- particularly in the D.C. area, where you can also get Baltimore locals OTA, but not from DirecTV. And DirecTV offers only a subset of the D.C. digital locals. The only gain would be CSN-HD (if that's on now; I dunno, I don't have MPEG4).

Edit: I have to retract the bit about the bugs -- I'm now seeing the audio dropouts others have reported.


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## Seminole (Oct 27, 2003)

Great deal but I would not sign up for 2 more years and when FIOS knocks on my door I will serve them lobster and champaign. I have had enough of D* they are just not what they used to be.


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## Sir_winealot (Nov 18, 2000)

tazzmission said:


> You did good, but I am not sure you will like the HR20 over the HR10. And you had to up for 2 more years I am sure. One thing that is preventing me from upgrading to 2 new HR20's is they are not TiVo's. I only have DirecTV for TiVo.
> 
> But as far as a deal goes, you did awesome.
> 
> I know DTV would not give me that deal nor do I think I would take it.


+1

(No dual buffers!  )


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## AbMagFab (Feb 5, 2001)

Seminole said:


> Great deal but I would not sign up for 2 more years and when FIOS knocks on my door I will serve them lobster and champaign. I have had enough of D* they are just not what they used to be.


LOL... I need to go get Lobster and Champaign ready for sometime in Q1 2007 (already have FiOS internet, and TV was just approved by my county).


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## TroyM (Mar 11, 2003)

Great deal you got there. Like they said above, if you plan to stay with DTV, the commitment should be no big deal. Leaving Tivo for a box that does less would be hard too, but, you really did get a great deal. Congrats!


I'm so jealous of you guys that can get FIOS. I don't think I'll ever see it here. However, DTV should seriously take note of this situation. People are rejoicing at the opportunity to give Verizon money. Yet, lots of people are dissatisfied with DTV and looking for new options. 

The FIOS service has an overall positive perception and DTV seems to be getting more and more negative. Seems like a pretty polar opposite business standing. 

*I don't mean to imply that all people are looking to leave DTV. Just that DTV's image is very tarnished as of late and FIOS is like a shining star to save everyone.


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## tazzmission (Oct 15, 2002)

I am really thinking about dropping DTV and selling my (2) HR10-250's on eBay. Then buying one S3 and going back to Adelphia. But Adelphia is now Comcast. And I don't want to pay more for TV service than I am paying now.

Anyone know where to check when FIOS is going to be available in your area?


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## bidger (Mar 30, 2001)

GreggC said:


> 4. Reduce price of Protection Plan from 7.99 to 5.99/month.


Umm...wouldn't your new equipment be considered leased? Why would you need a protection plan?


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## fastep (May 22, 2004)

Why not try FiOS tv FIRST since there is no obligation? Then if you don't like the extra 11 HD channels in perfect HD resolution you can cancel and take D* up on their offer and lock in for 2 more years and wait for more channels and hope they get their act together in terms of PQ. Just a thought..................


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## yaddayaddayadda (Apr 8, 2003)

tazzmission said:


> You did good, but I am not sure you will like the HR20 over the HR10. And you had to up for 2 more years I am sure. One thing that is preventing me from upgrading to 2 new HR20's is they are not TiVo's. I only have DirecTV for TiVo.
> 
> But as far as a deal goes, you did awesome.
> 
> I know DTV would not give me that deal nor do I think I would take it.


Unless I'm mistaken, what do you have to lose? He gets to keep his HR10-250's, right? If he hates the HR20's, all he does is deactivate those and reactivate the HR10s. All he loses is HD locals if they're not available OTA......or am I missing something?


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## Markman07 (Jul 18, 2001)

so you complained you couldn't get your OTA local channels and now have DVRs that can't record it even if you did have antenna.


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## mikeny (Dec 22, 2004)

Markman07 said:


> so you complained you couldn't get your OTA local channels and now have DVRs that can't record it even if you did have antenna.


The ATSC tuners are supposed to be activated some time in October.


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## Citivas (Oct 12, 2000)

Seminole said:


> Great deal but I would not sign up for 2 more years and when FIOS knocks on my door I will serve them lobster and champaign. I have had enough of D* they are just not what they used to be.


Like others, I have been disappointed with D* in recent years and would hope FiOS TV turns out to be great. Tried Comcast but their DVR sucked. Perhaps they will be worth it with the TiVo Series 3, though I don't like that all of the non-digital content still doesn't record the native signal...

My issue with FiOS is, do any of us have any idea if the DVR will be any good? I have not seen a hands-on review of it yet, but am skeptical:

1. Most of the OS is from Microsoft and we all know that they have years of screwing up settop box and DVR OS's.

2. Microsoft was delivering late and buggy code, so Verizon took the unusual step of hiring their own developers to customize and tweak the MS code, even as it was still coming in during development. Sounds like a coordination nightmare to me and "code by committee." Odds that it results in a great product seems like a long shot.

3. The Telco's have a long established and earned reputation of getting everything to do with user interaction and interfaces wrong. It has been a joke for 20 years. Why would now be any different? If they had done something cool like hire TiVo to do their box or even Apple, perhaps there would be reason to hope. But as it is, I will be shocked if the box is great.

4. I met a senior Verizon exec recent who is in charge of a good chunk of the FiOS TV roll-out. What worried me was when I started asking questions about the DVR box, they were extremely vague about the features -- not because they were keeping it close to the vest but because this person literally didn't know. It makes me believe they are not prioritizing the box interface in their plans, which would be typical of a telco, and would doom the whole venture in my opinion. I even gently suggested this to them and they were very quick to say it was all going to be about distribution and channel line up and packages. They didn't seem to think the UI was a big concern...


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## bidger (Mar 30, 2001)

Citivas said:


> 1. Most of the OS is from Micorsoft and we all know that they have years of screwing up settop box and DVR OS's.


You'll find a bunch of UltimateTV fans who'll dispute you on that.


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## Citivas (Oct 12, 2000)

bidger said:


> You'll find a bunch of UltimateTV fans who'll dispute you on that.


It had some good ideas but didn't come together as a consistent whole package. If it was so widely loved, it wouldn't be a memory at this point. And even its sequal, Media Center, has gotten little traction despite tons of big companies behind it...


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## MarcusInMD (Jan 7, 2005)

Good grief. FIOS is leaps and bounds above anything DTV is or will offer. Take the FIOS!!!


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## marky_mark (Sep 16, 2006)

Sounds like the key selling point for you was NFL Ticket and SuperFan. In that respect I think it's a good deal. Too bad you couldn't get that and keep your HR10-250 units.

Mark


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## ShiningBengal (Mar 19, 2001)

bidger said:


> Umm...wouldn't your new equipment be considered leased? Why would you need a protection plan?


If you lease a car, once your warranty has expired, you have to pay for your own repairs. There is nothing inherent in leasing that requires the owner of a property to maintain it. It all depends on what's in the lease agreement.


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## jaobrien6 (Oct 24, 2002)

ShiningBengal said:


> If you lease a car, once your warranty has expired, you have to pay for your own repairs. There is nothing inherent in leasing that requires the owner of a property to maintain it. It all depends on what's in the lease agreement.


Well in this situation, anyone know what's in the lease agreement? Do you need the protection plan with leased receivers?


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## Citivas (Oct 12, 2000)

MarcusInMD said:


> Good grief. FIOS is leaps and bounds above anything DTV is or will offer. Take the FIOS!!!


Based on what, specifically? It doesn't have more channels announced in the line-up or anything specifically better that I have seen content-wise, and have you put your hands on the set top box yet? The distribution method should be a non-isue to users, only the end result... Again, I want FiOS to be great, but do you have something specific that proves it is?


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## Terry K (Jul 11, 2006)

I've been told as long as you lease from DirecTV, they take care of your receivers.


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## kbohip (Dec 30, 2003)

fastep said:


> Why not try FiOS tv FIRST since there is no obligation? Then if you don't like the extra 11 HD channels in perfect HD resolution you can cancel and take D* up on their offer and lock in for 2 more years and wait for more channels and hope they get their act together in terms of PQ. Just a thought..................


+1. If I had FIOS as an option I'd at least try it first. At least they don't try and lock you into stupid 2 year "contracts" like Directv does. I really wonder how hard it is to get out of these contracts with Directv though. I got out of a contract with Dish Network without too much of a problem. They didn't charge me any fees, I just had to send the equipment back.

Heck, I even tried Adelphia's pathetic analog cable for a month before I got Directv. The real reason I did that though was so they'd waive the mandatory $100 install on my cable modem. Yea, that was a LONG month!


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## Todd (Oct 7, 1999)

Are they making you return all 3 HR10's to them?


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## generalpatton71 (Oct 30, 2002)

If FIOS came to my area I'd buy S3's and move in a heart beat.


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## 5thcrewman (Sep 23, 2003)

I went with D* when I moved to HD because I looked at the FiOS TV $$ (And its not avail. in my area yet)

From Verizon website  my current D* package I get would price out like this:

Premier: $39.95
Locals: $12.95
HBO: $14.95
DVR(each) Dual Tuner SD/HD capable $12.95 (I need 3x)
=$106.70

D*= $86.95
Total Choice Plus: $48.99
HBO: $12.00
HD: $9.99
DVR fee: $5.99
2x Add. Rcvr: $4.99


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## GreggC (Nov 10, 2001)

No, I can keep my HR10s... So if the HR20s suck, I can send back the receivers and hook my HR10s back up... I also will have the new 5LNB switch and new multiswitches... I plan on holding on to them for a while just until I'm sure I'll like the HR20s... Then sell them on eBay.

As far as OTA, I only watch 4.5.7 and 9 (local DC channels), so I don't really care about any other channels. And sometime next month the OTA feature will be turned on anyway, so it's really not that big a deal...

FYI, I don't have FIOS as of yet, they dug up the neighborhood and put in the cable, but do not offer it here... Probably will be a few months... 

Also, my brother has FIOS TV, and he was coming out of a HR10... He says the interface sucks and wouldn't hesitate to get a S3 if it was 200 (not 800!) or so and hook it up with a cablecard (which is apparently supported)...He also says it has frequent freezes and reboots... Doesn't sound too good... 

In checking out other forums, it seems that the HR20 is generally liked, with a few gripes, such as dual buffers (this should be enabled soon as well) and the FF thing that TiVo has a patent on. Most agree PQ is better than the HR10, and the interface is a ton faster. For example, recording a show is a matter of a few seconds, where it takes close to a minute on the HR10. 

As far as D* in general. I have not had any of the customer support issues others have had... I've used retention several times in the past few years, and have always come out of it better... I did have some installation nightmares, but I learned to pay someone to do it so it doesn't get screwed up (i.e. you get what you paid for). D* will send someone out here to install the new stuff, but I will have my paid installer "supervise" the installation. The cabling infrastructure is in place, so hopefully it will be relatively painless.


So I'm going for it, crossing my fingers that it will work out... 

Gregg


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## Sir_winealot (Nov 18, 2000)

GreggC said:


> In checking out other forums, it seems that the HR20 is generally liked, with a few gripes,* such as dual buffers (this should be enabled soon as well)* and the FF thing that TiVo has a patent on.


I hope you're correct but, are you sure about this?


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## Todd (Oct 7, 1999)

GreggC said:


> No, I can keep my HR10s... So if the HR20s suck, I can send back the receivers and hook my HR10s back up... I also will have the new 5LNB switch and new multiswitches... I plan on holding on to them for a while just until I'm sure I'll like the HR20s... Then sell them on eBay.


Are you allowed to keep them hooked up?


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## AbMagFab (Feb 5, 2001)

GreggC said:


> In checking out other forums, it seems that the HR20 is generally liked, with a few gripes, such as dual buffers (this should be enabled soon as well) and the FF thing that TiVo has a patent on.


What are you reading, and who are you talking to? Everyone I know in this area hates the HR20, but is stuck with it if they want to stay with DirecTV (admittedly a small sample size, but telling nonetheless).

And the boards seem flooded with hatred for them, but that's to be expected during any transition.

I just haven't seen much praise for the HR20, either on the boards or from people (except from the obvious DirecTV shills).


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## willardcpa (Feb 23, 2001)

AbMagFab said:


> .....(except from the obvious DirecTV shills).


Would by be so kind to let me know who these are when you get a chance?


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

AbMagFab said:


> What are you reading, and who are you talking to? Everyone I know in this area hates the HR20, but is stuck with it if they want to stay with DirecTV (admittedly a small sample size, but telling nonetheless).
> 
> And the boards seem flooded with hatred for them, but that's to be expected during any transition.
> 
> I just haven't seen much praise for the HR20, either on the boards or from people (except from the obvious DirecTV shills).


I don't know anybody with an HR20 or anybody who wants one; I know several peolpe who have HR10's (usually more than one) and love them. That's excluding "knowing" people from online only, of course.

The only real "praise" I've seen of the HR20 is that people expected it to be worse than it is as a first generation release of a product.

If it didn't offer the Ka-band/MPEG-4 support, I don't think it'd be the first choice for most HD viewers if the HR10 were sold side by side.


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## GreggC (Nov 10, 2001)

Well, we'll see how it goes... Like I said, I'm going to hold on to my HR10's for a while and see how I like the HR20's.... Of course, family feedback is paramount... I was watching my son working the HR10 the other day, and noticed that he flips back and forth between tuners... The dual-buffer thing has me the most worried; I think that's the one feature that's truly "missing" for my family's usage.... One thing is that for us, HD locals over sat will actually be better... We have a lot of dropouts on the HD signals from the OTA, and it annoys the crap out of my wife. She complains that "HD sucks" and refuses to watch the HD locals but she doesn't realize it's not "HD" but rather the OTA... The new HR20s will "force" her to watch HD locals.

We'll see... If nothing else, I'll have a 5-LNB dish out of it.

Gregg


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## GreggC (Nov 10, 2001)

*UPDATE: *

I decided to only get one of the HR20's and keep the other 2 HR10's on other TVs... That way, I get the new dish, 6x12 multiswitch, and a HR20 for free (along with the other goodies and discounts)... That way, I can "evaluate" it and if it sucks I can send it back and re-hookup the HR10.

After doing a bunch of thinking on the subject, I don't think I can do NFL Ticket without "dual buffers"... That to me is the best thing about HR10's, watching NFL and switching back and forth... Also, my wife likes to FF thru the commercials and stop "on a dime" to the show starting... HR20 has issues with that too.

So I wil put it on one of my "lesser-used" TVs and evaluate it.

As it turned out, I had a commitment until Feb 2008, so committing thru Sep 2008 didn't seem like a big deal.

I will keep you all posted.

Gregg


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## ryan oc (Sep 29, 2006)

5thcrewman said:


> I went with D* when I moved to HD because I looked at the FiOS TV $$ (And its not avail. in my area yet)
> 
> From Verizon my current D* package I get would price out like this:
> 
> ...


Verizon does not charge extra for local channels. Also, you can get a multi-room dvr and save a little more.


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## K_bueno (Aug 19, 2005)

Seminole said:


> Great deal but I would not sign up for 2 more years and when FIOS knocks on my door I will serve them lobster and champaign. I have had enough of D* they are just not what they used to be.


Ditto!

I remember when Direct was the best for HD! FIOSTV with an S3 is th best thing out right now! I want Fios so bad I can taste it.


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