# Netflix "Watch Instantly" coming to TivoHD & Series3



## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

Press release and discussion thread here:

Netflix "Watch Instantly" coming to TivoHD & Series3


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

Before users complain, I would note that Netflix uses a video format that is not compatible with the CPUs in the Series2 boxes.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Wow, awesome! I'm going to re-up my Netflix subscription as soon as this becomes available. (I canceled because I could keep up with the disks well enough to make it worthwhile)

Dan


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

According this Cnet article, Netflix HD will be coming to all Netflix streaming devices by the end of November.


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## crowfan (Dec 27, 2003)

I am stoked about this announcement. I'd love to be in the beta for this.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

I am excited too, but only to a degree. I think this is an excellent move forward. But for us, we don't rent a ton of movies. And you only get unlimited streaming if you are on the $8.99 1 at a time/unlimited plan. On the $4.99 1 at a time/2 per month plan, you only get 2 hours of streaming.

And right now, we are only on a 3mb download connection so I don't know if we could handle HD.

But, again, I am very excited by this. Good move!!!


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

This is almost enough for me to get a TiVo HD. Unfortunately we build the stand for our TV and only gave it room for two regular size components. Right now we have a Tivo/DVD-RW and an Xbox 360. To get an HD I'd either have to give up the Tivo DVD or the 360...neither is appealing. Wish they would build an S3 generation TiVo with a built in DVD/Blu-Ray


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

dylanemcgregor said:


> This is almost enough for me to get a TiVo HD. Unfortunately we build the stand for our TV and only gave it room for two regular size components. Right now we have a Tivo/DVD-RW and an Xbox 360. To get an HD I'd either have to give up the Tivo DVD or the 360...neither is appealing. Wish they would build an S3 generation TiVo with a built in DVD/Blu-Ray


netflix streaming is comng for the xbox 360 as well. Glad this is happening, figured there would be lots of happy people


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

ZeoTiVo said:


> netflix streaming is comng for the xbox 360 as well. Glad this is happening, figured there would be lots of happy people


Yeah I know, but for that I need to hook up the Xbox to the internet ($99 if I want to buy their wireless adapter) and then also be a Gold Live member, which costs $50 a year. Cheaper than a TiVo HD for a fair number of years, but then again I don't get a TiVo HD.

Oh, and I'm still really excited that this is coming to TiVo. Just trying to figure out how I can justify getting one.


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## PirateKatz (Nov 13, 2007)

I have a Series 2 (dual tuner) TiVo and Roku Netflix box. This might just be the excuse we were looking for to finally upgrade to a new TiVo.


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## mohanman (Dec 18, 2007)

What is netflix streaming? Do you get to watch unlimited movies? How much does it cost?
Thanks
Mo


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

mohanman said:


> What is netflix streaming? Do you get to watch unlimited movies? How much does it cost?
> Thanks
> Mo


Netflix streaming comes with any of the "unlimited" Netflix plans. In addition to the discs you get in the mail you get free, unlimited streaming over the internet. It has mostly been directly to PCs up until the last couple of months, but they have started adding in new devices like TiVo, Xbox, and DVD players that the service can stream to.


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## jcthorne (Jan 28, 2002)

The trouble with adding HD Netflix streaming to the Tivo is folks are really going to start USING the streaming. Then they are going to learn just how limited thier 'unlimited' cable internet connection is. Comcast caps at 250GB per month. Sounds like a lot until you have 3 computer users in the household and add netflix at 10+ GB per movie. Not so hard to hit that limit anymore.


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## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

jcthorne said:


> The trouble with adding HD Netflix streaming to the Tivo is folks are really going to start USING the streaming. Then they are going to learn just how limited thier 'unlimited' cable internet connection is. Comcast caps at 250GB per month. Sounds like a lot until you have 3 computer users in the household and add netflix at 10+ GB per movie. Not so hard to hit that limit anymore.


This isn't "trouble", this is great. Maybe even the US can start to get real high-speed connections to more homes if there is demand.


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## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

This is fine news on both fronts. I have a Roku (and hopefully that will go HD as well) but I can move that to another TV so I can use the Tivo for Netflix and free up some physical space (not much, the Roku is very small), a connection into my AVR and a set of remote buttons.

Before I make that move, though, I want to see if the whole thing works as well as the Roku does. That has been pretty much perfect (if simple).


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## TheLongshot (Jun 16, 2008)

Good news for me, because I can't watch NetFlix's streaming on my PC because of the stupid DRM they use. I basically would have to "upgrade" my monitor to get it to work.

Now at least I'll have another way to do it that won't cost me additional money.


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## c293716 (May 16, 2004)

bkdtv said:


> Before users complain, I would note that Netflix uses a video format that is not compatible with the CPUs in the Series2 boxes.


No, I am going to complain...what if you bought your tivo box 4 years ago after the initial announcment when all there was were series 2 players?


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

c293716 said:


> No, I am going to complain...what if you bought your tivo box 4 years ago after the initial announcment when all there was were series 2 players?


umm, the "initial" anouncements were all about looking into this type stuff. at no time was it announced that Netflix movies would be available on series 2.
So complain all you want, but it will just seem silly


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## zentex (Feb 3, 2004)

c293716 said:


> No, I am going to complain...what if you bought your tivo box 4 years ago after the initial announcement when all there was were series 2 players?


AND you have Satellite and can't use a Series3? 4 years...and now this? I call BS.


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## c293716 (May 16, 2004)

ZeoTiVo said:


> umm, the "initial" anouncements were all about looking into this type stuff. at no time was it announced that Netflix movies would be available on series 2.
> So complain all you want, but it will just seem silly


I think it's realistic to expect, when a company makes an announcement like this, that it will be compatible with what is currently available. At the time, we're talking S1 and S2.


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## bigpatky (Apr 23, 2008)

sorry, but you can't complain about technology that is 4 years old being incompatible with today's current technology. maybe 1-2 years, but 4 is really pushing it.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

c293716 said:


> I think it's realistic to expect, when a company makes an announcement like this, that it will be compatible with what is currently available. At the time, we're talking S1 and S2.


Technology does not stand still. No one's attempting to screw you, the hardware you have just happens to be incompatible with the way Netflix delivers content. I assume you've used your TiVo for other things over the last 4 years? By the way, that initial 'agreement' was unwound in 2005. Poof. Along with your argument?

Edit: I totally get being disappointed, it's the rationale I have a problem with.


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## segaily (Aug 3, 2003)

This is great!!! I hope it works well.

It may force me to buy a new router however. For some reason my downloads take way longer then the times I see most people report and I have never been able to figure out why. Speed tests from my computer report good numbers, but my TiVo which is wired right to the router takes about 12 hours to download an Amazon movie.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

c293716 said:


> At the time, we're talking S1 and S2.


at that time they never got beyond private discussions with Netflix - never once was anything anounced to actually happen on series 1 or 2. There was no take backs - so your rationale for complaining is just simply wrong.


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

This is fantastic... I have been waiting for this a long time.

As for the series 2 users - I have one in my bedroom. I have no expectation that new features being developed will work on the series 2, it is an older technology.

Frankly, I would be quite upset if TIVO limited new features to only things that could work on all platforms. I have much more robust hardware on my S3 and HD - they are simply more powerful.

Should I get mad at Microsoft because Windows VISTA will not work on that old P100 I have sitting around?


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## c293716 (May 16, 2004)

bradleys said:


> This is fantastic... I have been waiting for this a long time.
> 
> As for the series 2 users - I have one in my bedroom. I have no expectation that new features being developed will work on the series 2, it is an older technology.
> 
> Frankly, I would be quite upset if TIVO limited new features to only things that could work on all platforms. I have much more robust hardware on my S3 and HD - they are simply more powerful.


If the tivo service were free, i'd have zero beef with this, but since series 2 folks are paying the same monthly fee as series 3 folks, this is crap. S1, S2, and S3 folks should NOT be paying the same monthly fees since we're not getting the same service capabilities from TiVo. Tell me how that is equitable.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

c293716 said:


> If the tivo service were free, i'd have zero beef with this, but since series 2 folks are paying the same monthly fee as series 3 folks, this is crap. S1, S2, and S3 folks should NOT be paying the same monthly fees since we're not getting the same service capabilities from TiVo. Tell me how that is equitable.


now you are just trolling up a thread looking for nay excuse. How about starting a new thread with poll to see how many are upset at streaming on S3 models only


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

c293716 said:


> If the tivo service were free, i'd have zero beef with this, but since series 2 folks are paying the same monthly fee as series 3 folks, this is crap. S1, S2, and S3 folks should NOT be paying the same monthly fees since we're not getting the same service capabilities from TiVo. Tell me how that is equitable.


As a business model - I think it makes perfect sense.... TIVO wants you to upgrade to a new model. They are saying, "hey upgrade to a new model and you will get all these new services and your fee will stay the same!" If they didn't do that, you would never upgrade...

I had lifetime service on my S2 - I purchased an S3 and transferred my lifetime service to it. I moved my S2 to a monthly fee and placed it on the old tube TV in my bedroom. I then purchased an HD for the media room and put a multi-year service agreement on it.

My S2 does not get new fetures and my S3 cannont use an M card. This is the way computer hardware works. The upside is, faster more powerful machines do more things. The downside is - you have to upgrade.

Perfectly fair and a very resonable business model.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

S1 and S2 TiVos can't play the videos because of the type of encoding Netflix uses. What do people want TiVo to do? Perform some type of magic?


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

dylanemcgregor said:


> Yeah I know, but for that I need to hook up the Xbox to the internet ($99 if I want to buy their wireless adapter) and then also be a Gold Live member, which costs $50 a year. Cheaper than a TiVo HD for a fair number of years, but then again I don't get a TiVo HD.
> 
> Oh, and I'm still really excited that this is coming to TiVo. Just trying to figure out how I can justify getting one.


Just swap the TiVo/DVD for the TiVoHD and then use the XBox to play DVDs. Or you could move the TiVo/DVD to another room and use a video distribution system to broadcast it back to the living room.

Dan


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## c293716 (May 16, 2004)

rainwater said:


> S1 and S2 TiVos can't play the videos because of the type of encoding Netflix uses. What do people want TiVo to do? Perform some type of magic?


No, I'm saying the monthly fees should not be the same. Why should I pay the same price to TiVo for less functionality?


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## Langree (Apr 29, 2004)

c293716 said:


> No, I'm saying the monthly fees should not be the same. Why should I pay the same price to TiVo for less functionality?


Or you as the end user needs to upgrade your equipment to get that functionality. Such is the way with tech.


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## segaily (Aug 3, 2003)

c293716 said:


> No, I'm saying the monthly fees should not be the same. Why should I pay the same price to TiVo for less functionality?


It makes sense to me that the cost is the same because most of the costs to TiVo are probably the same. All the boxes probably have similar support costs.

I would guess that brand new boxes generate the most calls to support. After that initial time however I would guess that the older the box gets the more likely people are to call support with an issue.

All boxes have the cost of needing guide data.

S2 and S3 boxes both probably have developers working on new features. It is possible the S3 has more people because they now have more features, but it is also probably harder to do anything on the more limited hardware of an S2 so its might have more people. I suppose you might argue the S1 should get a discount because it no longer has developers, but again I would guess as the hardware gets older they get more calls to support so who knows.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

c293716 said:


> No, I'm saying the monthly fees should not be the same. Why should I pay the same price to TiVo for less functionality?


I pay the same for my satellite radio subscription as someone who gets recording, colorful graphics, stock quotes, etc. They have newer, more capable hardware. Such is life. I could upgrade my hardware and receive all that without increasing my monthly fee - a bargain!


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## zentex (Feb 3, 2004)

rainwater said:


> What do people want TiVo to do? Perform some type of magic?


No, I'd simply like a S3 that works with Satellite. I refuse to get Dish Networks POS DVR, and I am not going to move to DirecTV and pray the Tivo/reciver is an S3.

I don't think that I'm asking for too much. I'd even settle for a hardware update to the S2 line so it can do all the fun stuff that S3's can do but S2's can't.

I would be more than happy to spend the few dollars to get the latest TiVo...but it won't work for me. So, I think I have a legitimate beef with TiVo.

I have an XBOX so I'm not really concerned with the Tivo in the 'game room'; What about the other 2 TiVo's? I'm no fan of Amazon's service, and I certainly don't want another piece of equipment next to the TV's (ie: Roku).


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

c293716 said:


> No, I'm saying the monthly fees should not be the same. Why should I pay the same price to TiVo for less functionality?


Actually, the S3s and TiVo HDs should be cheaper monthly since they will be the ones bringing in more revenue. So I guess I agree with you. They should either raise the price of the S2s/S1s and give me a discount on my TiVO HDs. 

Btw, it isn't going to happen.


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## TriBruin (Dec 10, 2003)

zentex said:


> No, I'd simply like a S3 that works with Satellite. I refuse to get Dish Networks POS DVR, and I am not going to move to DirecTV and pray the Tivo/reciver is an S3.
> 
> I don't think that I'm asking for too much. I'd even settle for a hardware update to the S2 line so it can do all the fun stuff that S3's can do but S2's can't.
> 
> ...


No, you have no gripe with Tivo as Tivo can not provide the service you are asking for. The Satellite companies have refused provide a standard to allow 3rd party boxes (like a Tivo) connect to their service. Cable companies have been forced to provide Cable Card support that allows Tivos to access their encrypted channels. Unfortunately Satellite has no such requirement.

What to blame someone, blame the Satellite companies for refusing to work wiht Tivo. Blade the FCC/Government for allow Satellite companies to have a waiver to the Satellite companies. But don't blame Tivo for not producing what they can not do.


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## TriBruin (Dec 10, 2003)

c293716 said:


> No, I'm saying the monthly fees should not be the same. Why should I pay the same price to TiVo for less functionality?


Because you are still receiving the same service at the same price you have been paying for.


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## magnus (Nov 12, 2004)

Now, that's funny. 



c293716 said:


> No, I'm saying the monthly fees should not be the same. Why should I pay the same price to TiVo for less functionality?


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## jayfest (Mar 25, 2003)

mohanman said:


> What is netflix streaming? Do you get to watch unlimited movies?


I thought I'd mention that the Netflix "streaming" library is quite a bit smaller than that of the DVDs, but it's still sizable and it includes a lot of television series. I personally like DVDs better because of the commentaries, extras, etc., but for older stuff which doesn't come with a lot of extras it can be useful or for watching entire seasons of some TV series in order it can be easier than waiting for them to be broadcast (and storing them and skipping through commercials) or having to use regular Netflix selections if you want to watch them at your own pace. And of course, if you don't care about DVD features, it can be much more useful than that.


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

This was just reported on one of the morning news broadcasts here.

So it must be true. 

Woo-Hoo! :up:


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

Dan203 said:


> Just swap the TiVo/DVD for the TiVoHD and then use the XBox to play DVDs.


I thought about this, and am kind of leaning towards it, but we really love 1)not having to change inputs to watch a DVD 2)having TiVo trickplay features with DVDs.



> Or you could move the TiVo/DVD to another room and use a video distribution system to broadcast it back to the living room.


We're in NYC, there's only one room.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

dylanemcgregor said:


> I thought about this, and am kind of leaning towards it, but we really love 1)not having to change inputs to watch a DVD 2)having TiVo trickplay features with DVDs.


I have a ToshiVo downstairs as well and *love* the TiVo interface to watch movies.

If it is ToshiVo you have then you can get a Tivo HD - move the sub to that and use the ToShiVo in basic mode for 3 days of guided data, manual record and full function of the DVD player.
two DVRs to have but just a thought.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

zentex said:


> AND you have Satellite and can't use a Series3? 4 years...and now this? I call BS.


I suggest you call DISH and cancel if you want more features. Calling BS is just stupid.


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## SpiritualPoet (Jan 14, 2007)

Two questions:

1. Will the service be available to other TiVo owners (particularly to the Series 2 machine connected to the Web via a wireless router?)

2. Is the entire library of Netflix videodiscs available through the service?


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

SpiritualPoet said:


> Two questions:
> 
> 1. Will the service be available to other TiVo owners (particularly to the Series 2 machine connected to the Web via a wireless router?)
> 
> 2. Is the entire library of Netflix videodiscs available through the service?


The answer to both questions is "No". It's only available to Series3 owners (TiVo S3, TiVo HD and TiVo HD XL--see this list of compatible players at the Netflix site). They're using Microsoft's VC-1 format which older TiVos don't have the hardware to decode.

Currently, only about 12,000 titles are available for streaming; Netflix has over 100,000 titles on disc.


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## csell (Apr 16, 2007)

mikeyts said:


> Currently, only about 12,000 titles are available for streaming; Netflix has over 100,000 titles on disc.


Is there anywhere on their site (I can't find it) that actually allows you to search those 12,000 before signing up? Having only ~10% of their titles being downloadable kind of is a bummer, but if they are quality videos then it wouldn't be too bad. But it would be nice to have an idea of the library before signing up (yes, I know they have a free trial)...


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## KwikSilvr (Mar 26, 2002)

csell said:


> Is there anywhere on their site (I can't find it) that actually allows you to search those 12,000 before signing up? Having only ~10% of their titles being downloadable kind of is a bummer, but if they are quality videos then it wouldn't be too bad. But it would be nice to have an idea of the library before signing up (yes, I know they have a free trial)...


Go to the "browse selection" section of the site. At the bottom of the menu on the right hand side is a link that says "Browse our watching instantly choices".


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

ZeoTiVo said:


> I have a ToshiVo downstairs as well and *love* the TiVo interface to watch movies.
> 
> If it is ToshiVo you have then you can get a Tivo HD - move the sub to that and use the ToShiVo in basic mode for 3 days of guided data, manual record and full function of the DVD player.
> two DVRs to have but just a thought.


I've got a Humax, but it has lifetime, so TiVo basic is irrelevant for me. The other thing is I don't have any television source besides the internet, so getting any kind of TiVo really doesn't make practical sense for me right now. I know I should really just go through the Xbox, get a Roku, or keep hooking up the laptop to the TV. It is a testament to how much I really like the TiVo interface that the TiVo still holds any appeal.

Anyway, didn't mean to derail the thread. Super cool that this is finally going to be available on TiVo. Now Stephen, how about getting some Hulu too?


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## tgibbs (Sep 22, 2002)

> If the tivo service were free, i'd have zero beef with this, but since series 2 folks are paying the same monthly fee as series 3 folks, this is crap. S1, S2, and S3 folks should NOT be paying the same monthly fees since we're not getting the same service capabilities from TiVo. Tell me how that is equitable.


This is like complaining, "Why do owners of HD TiVos pay the same monthly subscription price as I do when they get HD and I don't?"

Answer: You pay a subscription for program information, not for the features of your box. No current TiVo owner is entitled to any features that weren't advertised for their box at the time that they bought it. Anything else is gravy.


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## bgc (Jan 13, 2008)

Does this streaming service allow you to watch new releases? I had a Netflix trial a while back and the online viewing basically had old tv shows and nothing close to a new release movie.

BGC


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

bgc said:


> Does this streaming service allow you to watch new releases? I had a Netflix trial a while back and the online viewing basically had old tv shows and nothing close to a new release movie.


It is still a small percentage of the overall DVDs they offer. However, they do now have more content with the Starz deal they struck. So they offer some of the newer content.


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## tgibbs (Sep 22, 2002)

bgc said:


> Does this streaming service allow you to watch new releases? I had a Netflix trial a while back and the online viewing basically had old tv shows and nothing close to a new release movie.
> 
> BGC


A few, but not the hits. Most of the newer stuff is Independent and Foreign films.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

tgibbs said:


> A few, but not the hits. Most of the newer stuff is Independent and Foreign films.


The Starz stuff includes a good bit of hits. The last movie I watched on my PC through Netflix was No Country for Old Men. However, it's still a small library to choose from.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

dylanemcgregor said:


> Anyway, didn't mean to derail the thread. Super cool that this is finally going to be available on TiVo. Now Stephen, how about getting some Hulu too?


keep an eye on the ROKU box - I expect announcing support for HULU any day now.

Hey TiVo Stephen not that anything holds a candle to a TiVo DVR but I do hope you are keeping an eye on what the competition is doing and happily talking to Hulu* about adding their service to TiVo 

I personally would be fine with Hulu's unskippable 30 sec ads even in the specific Hulu TiVo interface. I find Hulu well woth those ad spots.


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

ZeoTiVo said:


> I personally would be fine with Hulu's unskippable 30 sec ads even in the specific Hulu TiVo interface. I find Hulu well woth those ad spots.


Me too.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

ZeoTiVo said:


> I personally would be fine with Hulu's unskippable 30 sec ads even in the specific Hulu TiVo interface. I find Hulu well woth those ad spots.


Hulu's library is good, but their typical video quality is crap. Not even standard broadcast quality. So if and when they experience lands on hardware, I hope we also see a bump in resolution. In streaming both to my TV via services like PlayOn or D-Link DivX hardware, Netflix's SD is much more watchable than Hulu's.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

davezatz said:


> Netflix's SD is much more watchable than Hulu's.


That's because Netflix spent a lot more money on the infrastructure than Hulu has. I just don't know if Hulu is going to be able to provide the quality that Netflix does with their current system in place. Netflix had streaming to all different kinds of hardware in mind when they started the streaming investments. I wonder if Hulu is going to be able to provide quality streaming to lots of devices.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

davezatz said:


> Hulu's library is good, but their typical video quality is crap. Not even standard broadcast quality. So if and when they experience lands on hardware, I hope we also see a bump in resolution. In streaming both to my TV via services like PlayOn or D-Link DivX hardware, Netflix's SD is much more watchable than Hulu's.


good point, I typically watch Hulu to catch the funny parts of SNL or a show I would not otherwise get (like some earlier HBO stuff) on my home office PC monitor and do not think about resolution so much.
If I was going to watch the whole season of office or Heroes from Hulu on a larger TV then resolution indeed becomes an issue again. 
of course teh saying applies "You get what you pay for "


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

jcthorne said:


> The trouble with adding HD Netflix streaming to the Tivo is folks are really going to start USING the streaming. Then they are going to learn just how limited thier 'unlimited' cable internet connection is. Comcast caps at 250GB per month. Sounds like a lot until you have 3 computer users in the household and add netflix at 10+ GB per movie. Not so hard to hit that limit anymore.


My "Unlimited" connection is unlimited. I use between 800GB and 1.3 TB each month with no problems with my 50mbs/20mbs connection.


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

aaronwt said:


> My "Unlimited" connection is unlimited. I use between 800GB and 1.3 TB each month with no problems with my 50mbs/20mbs connection.


I wish I could say the same about my internet wow! What service do you have?

Currently where I live, the only broadband available is hughes net, and they limit my bandwidth too 200MB per day, 2000MB per month. Which wont even handle a single netflix movie let alone a few.

I'm hoping when I land a job in my field (Just graduated from college this past may), that I can get a place of my own, and have FIOS.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

LoREvanescence said:


> Currently where I live, the only broadband available is hughes net, and they limit my bandwidth too 200MB per day, 2000MB per month. Which wont even handle a single netflix movie let alone a few.


they should not be allowed to call that broadband. The ritght name would be "BrowseBand" maybe


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

ZeoTiVo said:


> they should not be allowed to call that broadband. The ritght name would be "BrowseBand" maybe


haha, I hear ya!!!!

and the scary part is, they actually have a term for their broadband, and it is "Broadband Unbound!"

Unbound, yeah, right!!!!!

But yeah, it is only good for checking email and casual browsing. We put the thing over the limit all to often and it will turn us off for 24 hours until we can use it again. It sucks. And they claim that their Fair Access Policy will not be reached by the average user, and only a small percentage of users would ever reach it. We reach it everyday, and windows updates on our 3 computers can reach it in a single day before we even use the internet!!!

It is good for maybe 20 minutes of youtube pleasure, browsing the internet for an hour and a half with no multimedia and email, that's it!


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

LoREvanescence said:


> I wish I could say the same about my internet wow! What service do you have?


I have FIOS


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## peteypete (Feb 3, 2004)

Any bets this is going to be online before TG?


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

peteypete said:


> Any bets this is going to be online before TG?


Probably not. Some have said this will be part of the fall service update for Series 3/THD. If that is the case we would see the service update appear first few a few random people. Then it would be rolled out two all two weeks later if it did not create a large increase of calls to the calling center. We may not even see Netflix for a few days after the roll out is complete. Very much so like youtube.

But that is my best guess. Who knows, it could run on 9.4 with an updated HME app that get's pushed.


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## MadGreek (Sep 27, 2003)

People here keep mentioning "streaming" of NetFlix movies to TiVo. Does this mean the movies can't be stored on the TiVo itself? I ask because sometimes I only can watch half a movie one day, then wait a day or so before I finish the movie.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

MadGreek said:


> People here keep mentioning "streaming" of NetFlix movies to TiVo. Does this mean the movies can't be stored on the TiVo itself? I ask because sometimes I only can watch half a movie one day, then wait a day or so before I finish the movie.


 For Netflix streaming you can stop at any point you want and it will remember where you left off even if you resume viewing on a different device - at least that's the behavior with PC playback.


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## MadGreek (Sep 27, 2003)

moyekj said:


> For Netflix streaming you can stop at any point you want and it will remember where you left off even if you resume viewing on a different device - at least that's the behavior with PC playback.


Ahh that would work, Thanks.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

peteypete said:


> Any bets this is going to be online before TG?





LoREvanescence said:


> Probably not. Some have said this will be part of the fall service update for Series 3/THD. If that is the case we would see the service update appear first few a few random people. Then it would be rolled out two all two weeks later if it did not create a large increase of calls to the calling center. We may not even see Netflix for a few days after the roll out is complete. Very much so like youtube.
> 
> But that is my best guess. Who knows, it could run on 9.4 with an updated HME app that get's pushed.


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=409783

We're approaching the 2 week mark with the preliminary roll out. There is a good chance the software will be out to most (all?) customers prior to 12/1. That said I'm not sure Netflix/Tivo will flip the switch prior to December 1.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

lew said:


> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=409783
> 
> We're approaching the 2 week mark with the preliminary roll out. There is a good chance the software will be out to most (all?) customers prior to 12/1. That said I'm not sure Netflix/Tivo will flip the switch prior to December 1.


 That update is for Series 2 Tivos only.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

moyekj said:


> That update is for Series 2 Tivos only.


I didn't think it was clear if the update was just for the S2.


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

lew said:


> I didn't think it was clear if the update was just for the S2.


Yeah, it did get buried later on in the thread.

That update is a 9.3.x update. S3/THD has been a 9.4 since July. So that is the confirmation that this update is not coming too HD unites, not to mention it hasn't showed up on any HD unites yet.

But your two week is almost upon us could be close the the truth in a different way. That being is we are almost two weeks away December 1st. Not that that has any significance, but there was a rumor posted that that could be the date we see Netflix go live.

Not to mention, Usually between Thanksgivings and the Supper bowl tivo does not role out any service updates. So we will have to wait and see. If something new is going to come out this fall, we should know for sure within the next two weeks if history holds true.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

Since both TiVo and Netflix have announced that Netflix "Watch Instantly" will be available on TiVo in December, either they snuck the functionality in with the 9.4 upgrade or there will be an upgrade for Series3, HD and HD XL units sometime between now and whatever date in December the service becomes available on.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

The functionality for streaming MPEG-4/VC-1 video exists in 9.4 and is used for YouTube streaming. Which means that all TiVo has to do is write the server side code which deploys the HME app and links the Netflix and TiVo accounts. It should not require a software update on the TiVo itself.

Dan


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

Dan203 said:


> The functionality for streaming MPEG-4/VC-1 video exists in 9.4 and is used for YouTube streaming. Which means that all TiVo has to do is write the server side code which deploys the HME app and links the Netflix and TiVo accounts. It should not require a software update on the TiVo itself.


There's no evidence that TiVo streams YouTube--it might know enough of whatever streaming protocol YouTube is using to start the stream coming, but it doesn't implement any random access. Once you start the stream, you can't skip to the end or back to the beginning. They did have to implement playback of VC-1 encodings for YouTube, which is why they can't support it on the Series2 (the chipsets in the Series3 and HD models support VC-1 and H.264 decoding in hardware).

We'll soon see what they end up doing. Hopefully, they've created a true streaming player. Netflix is switching to Microsoft's Silverlight technology for their web player app--I opted into the beta and tried it and it seems pretty good. It has an interesting navigation mechanism--it displays a string of stills forward and back and let's you choose one to start playback from.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

mikeyts said:


> There's no evidence that TiVo streams YouTube


Yes there is. There is an HMO app in the Home Media Features forum that someone wrote which exploits the streaming capabilities added in 9.4 (for YouTube) and allows you to stream MPEG2/MPEG4 video from your PC to the TiVo. (stream, not transfer) The trick play and bookmarking features it provides are all done on the "server". (i.e. PC) Basically it skips to the relevant I frame in the video on the PC and just starts feeding the TiVo the stream from there. I don't know how much functionality TiVo plans to provide, but as long as they use the HMO protocol, like they do with all their other apps, then the vast majority of the functionality will be handled server side. The only thing that the TiVo itself will need to do is be capable of receiving a VC-1 stream, which is something it can already do.

Now I guess there is the possibility that TiVo will integrate this feature directly into the TiVo software instead of using HMO, but I seriously doubt it given their history and the short time frame given to release the feature.

Edit: here is a link to the app I referenced above...

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=403066

Dan


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

My point was that, for whatever reason, they're not implementing random access in the TiVo YouTube player--it seemingly does playback-while-downloading, nearly indistinguishable in function from TiVoCast, MRV and TTCB (the difference from those being that you don't get any replayable file in the Now Playing List). To see the end, you have to wait for the entire thing to download. If they'd implemented full streaming capabilities, why wouldn't they have put it into the YouTube interface? Random access is part of the YouTube web app, just as it's part of the "Watch Instantly" app (and all true streaming video players); TiVo didn't make it part of their app for YouTube and there's no way that we can be certain that they'll make it part of their app for Netflix "Watch Instantly" either.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

Dan203 said:


> There is an HMO app in the Home Media Features forum that someone wrote which exploits the streaming capabilities added in 9.4


HME, not HMO. But, yeah. However, we haven't been able to stream VC-1, only h.264; so a software update may indeed be (probably is) needed.

The "streaming protocol" is just http, nothing special about it. This is all that the TiVo seems to support currently, so far as we can tell.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

I think people assume TiVo doesn't stream YouTube because it saves the entire buffer and trickplay doesn't rerequest the stream data so you have to wait until it saves that part to the buffer. However, like Dan said, the technology behind it allows streaming. And it was the first HME app to allow video playback within the app.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

I don't really care one way or another. I have a PC connected to the same panel as my TiVo, so I pretty much never use any of the network stuff. To this point, every bit of it (playing music, downloaded videos, photos, etc) takes a lot more effort than doing the same thing with my PC. There's some potential for the Watch Instantly player to be useful, since, to this point, the web application doesn't support surround sound output and I'd hope that TiVo would (there's a coax S/PDIF connector on my PC that some DVD playback software can use for DD 5.1 but the Watch Instantly player--at least to this point--cannot).

Also, it seems unlikely that they'll ever support streaming of HD content to PCs. If the TiVo player's a bust, I've got the Xbox .


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## LynnL999 (Oct 7, 2002)

Just a note -- I've had this service with my Samsung blu-ray player for a few weeks now, and I love it. For me, the most useful is TV shows, including the current season of some shows.

It isn't HD quality, but it is 16x9 (as long as the source is) and it looks and sounds just fine -- akin to standard def DVD. It doesn't actually "stream" for me, it downloads to the Samsung's flash memory -- it takes less than 2 minutes to download a TV episode.

I don't know if it will be the same for TiVo, but the Samsung interface is simple -- you set up a queue of Watch Instantly shows on your computer, and then those are available on the Samsung.

I really love it. It's a great value-added feature.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

Well, the "New Xbox Experience" dashboard make-over became available today and I set up Netflix "Watch Instantly". It works pretty well, though not quite like some of the demos I've seen--I was expecting the forward and advance mechanism from Silverlight.

I tried one of the HD selections, and though I know I'm not getting better than 4 Mbps from my current network set-up, I did get one "presented in HD" message. (I moved a few weeks ago and I'm stuck using a wireless G bridge with poor reception until a guy comes to run a cable on Friday morning.). That was watching _Mister Foe_--later, I tried with Monday's episode of _Heroes_ and only got "Best Quality" standard def, which only requires 1.5 Mbps.

The HD PQ was decent--definitely much superior to the the "Best Quality" standard def, but certainly nowhere near Blu-ray PQ. Still, it's pretty cool to have . Most of the TV series that have current season episodes available (_Heroes_, all three _CSI_ series, _NCIS_, _NUMB3RS_ and _The Office_), have them available in HD. (Strangely, some Disney channel stuff is listed as available in HD, including some seasons on _Lilo and Stich_ and _Kim Possible_).

EDIT: _Heroes_ Season 3 is not listed among the HD selections, though Seasons 1 and 2 are. I just started watching an episode of _CSI: Miami_ and it started in HD and then dynamically reduced quality when bandwidth through my wireless link dropped.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

mikeyts said:


> Well, the "New Xbox Experience" dashboard make-over became available today and I set up Netflix "Watch Instantly". It works pretty well, though not quite like some of the demos I've seen--*I was expecting the forward and advance mechanism from Silverlight.*


 So how does FF/REW behave in Xbox and Silverlight? Is it occasional frame snapshots displayed in a smaller centered video window?


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

moyekj said:


> So how does FF/REW behave in Xbox and Silverlight? Is it occasional frame snapshots displayed in a smaller centered video window?


That's what I was expecting from stuff posted in online articles, but I'm seeing the old Xbox video playback UI. Disappointing, since I kind of like the Silverlight gimmick. Maybe it's something they'll add later. The used to only update the Xbox dashboard twice a year (skipping the Spring update this year), but they say that one of the improvement they've made will make it easier to publish several incremental updates a year (ala Sony and the PS3).


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

mikeyts,

Fast forward and rewind (using a smaller video window) aren't specific to Silverlight. I'm not sure why today's release of the Xbox360 software doesn't have that.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

bkdtv said:


> mikeyts,
> 
> Fast forward and rewind (using a smaller video window) aren't specific to Silverlight. I'm not sure why today's release of the Xbox360 software doesn't have that.


It doesn't actually use video, but a series of stills. On the PC, there's one little still frame on either side of a big still frame, each 10 seconds apart. If you drag the slider to the right or left, it scrolls through them; if you let go, it restarts playback from the one that was in the center. It might not be a new idea, but its the first I've seen it. The upcoming Playstation 3 update (which may already be out) was supposed to implement something similar for Blu-ray navigation.

Experimentation indicates that Silverlight doesn't implement this with every title. I've tried TV episodes and _Mr. Foe_ with no success. The first thing I saw it with was _Resident Evil: Extinction_, a Starz Play selection--the function shows up when I play that and hit either fast-forward or rewind. I just tried _Dan In Real Life_, another Starz Play selection, on the Xbox and the still-frame GUI shows up when I press FF or REW (if you press them while playing other Watch Instantly selections, it says " It will automatically march through the still frames at 32X, 16X, 8X, 4X, 2X or one at a time, as you press the skip forward or back button. On the Xbox, there are two frames before the big one in the center and two frames after. (You'd think that it'd be easy to find a picture of this online, but I'm not turning any up ).

Further experimentation shows that the still frame navigation device is there for _most_ things--_Mr. Foe_ is the only one I've tried so far where it doesn't work (you can skip forward and back in 10 minute increments, but FF and REW just bring up a message saying "function not available here").

In short, I'm wrong--the feature is there.

EDIT: Dave Zatz' blog has a demonstration of the Xbox Watch Instantly player in a YouTube video shown on this page--the thumbnail FF/REW thing is shown at about 2:14. Note that use of the little on screen control panel is unnecessary if you have an Xbox multi-media remote--or a Logitech Harmony Universal remote (in my case, the "for Xbox 360" model, though any model will do, as probably will many other manufacturers' universal remotes ). Various playback commands are mapped to the triggers and shoulder buttons of the standard Xbox 360 pad.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

LynnL999 said:


> Just a note -- I've had this service with my Samsung blu-ray player for a few weeks now, and I love it. For me, the most useful is TV shows, including the current season of some shows.


What shows have the current season?


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

mattack said:


> What shows have the current season?


As I mentioned in a post a few back, those include _Heroes_, all three _CSI_ series, _NCIS_, _NUMB3RS_ and _The Office_. (There may be more--it's hard to be certain since their list mechanism is a bit buggy. For instance, if you list all CBS series and sort them by release year, _CSI: CSI_ Season 9 doesn't show up in the list at all, though they have it). Of those, all have HD available for the current season except _Heroes_, though it has HD available for seasons 1 and 2.


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## kosherbacon (Sep 12, 2005)

LynnL999 said:


> Just a note -- I've had this service with my Samsung blu-ray player for a few weeks now, and I love it. For me, the most useful is TV shows, including the current season of some shows.
> 
> It isn't HD quality, but it is 16x9 (as long as the source is) and it looks and sounds just fine -- akin to standard def DVD. It doesn't actually "stream" for me, it downloads to the Samsung's flash memory -- it takes less than 2 minutes to download a TV episode.
> 
> ...


Are you sorry that you got the Samsung player now? I presume that you have an HD-capable TiVo since you were on this message board. I also assume that if you buy a blu-ray player without Netflix streaming, you end up getting more for your $$.

I was justa bout to pull the trigger on one of the LG or Samsung or Blu-Ray/Netflix players, but now I'll probably get a dedicated device.


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## Langree (Apr 29, 2004)

mikeyts said:


> Correction--the current season of _The Office_ is not available for streaming (all the previous seasons are).


Thank you! I was going nuts looking for it!


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

mikeyts said:


> As I mentioned in a post a few back, those include _Heroes_, all three _CSI_ series, _NCIS_, _NUMB3RS_ and _The Office_.


Correction--the current season of _The Office_ is not available for streaming (all the previous seasons are). I'm also wrong about the current season of _Heroes_--it is available for HD streaming. They have a filter that's set to exclude "seen and rated titles" from lists by default , so it wasn't listing seasons of shows that I'd watched episodes of.


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