# Record DVDs from HD Tivo??



## johnnycake23 (Sep 14, 2005)

Hello,

I have a HD DirectTivo and was wondering if there is a way to record saved programs to a DVD. As you know there is an option to save to VHS but what about DVDs? I was hoping there is a relatively easy way to do this. I did not see an FAQ on this subject but if there is one I apologize for the oversight.

Thank you for your input.


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## rlj5242 (Dec 20, 2000)

If you replace the letters VHS with DVD, the instructions are exactly the same. I off-load shows to my iLo DVD recorder all the time. I'm currently working on Sleeper Cell from Showtime HD.

-Robert


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

The only additional thing you have to do is to set the HDTiVo to output 480i.


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## tazzmission (Oct 15, 2002)

Can anyone recommend a DVD Recorder for this purpose? I am interested in buying one myself.


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## Starrbuck (Sep 29, 2003)

I use a Panasonic DMR-ES10S. Works great and under $200.


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## videojanitor (Dec 21, 2001)

I use both the Panasonic DMR-EH50 and Pioneer DVR-533H with excellent results. Both of these are hard-drive models though, which is handy if you want to record TV programs and edit out the commercials before dubbing to a DVD. If that's overkill, something like the Panasonic DMR-ES10 is a good choice (no hard drive), and can be found for $160 or so.

One thing that's cool about dubbing from the HD TiVo to DVD is that if you set the TiVo's output to "Full" while dubbing, you'll end up with an anamorphic DVD that you can then stretch back to 16:9 on playback. So, you retain the 16:9 aspect ratio of the original program, though at DVD (not HD) resolution.


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## rlj5242 (Dec 20, 2000)

JimSpence said:


> The only additional thing you have to do is to set the HDTiVo to output 480i.


If you use the Save to VCR option, it reminds you to do this.

-Robert


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

I didn't know that, as I haven't done a Save To with my HDTiVo. 

The hint about using "full" mode is also interesting.


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## Beckzilla (Jan 27, 2005)

videojanitor said:


> I use both the Panasonic DMR-EH50 and Pioneer DVR-533H with excellent results. Both of these are hard-drive models though, which is handy if you want to record TV programs and edit out the commercials before dubbing to a DVD. If that's overkill, something like the Panasonic DMR-ES10 is a good choice (no hard drive), and can be found for $160 or so.
> 
> One thing that's cool about dubbing from the HD TiVo to DVD is that if you set the TiVo's output to "Full" while dubbing, you'll end up with an anamorphic DVD that you can then stretch back to 16:9 on playback. So, you retain the 16:9 aspect ratio of the original program, though at DVD (not HD) resolution.


 When you say "full" am I to assume you mean 1080i? I thought you could not record at this resolution.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

The HDTiVo has what they call a Ratio button with two modes, full and panel. In 1080i it doesn't do anything, but with 480i the Full mode stretches the 4:3 to 16:9.


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## codespy (Jan 7, 2006)

Stay away from the Sony DVD recorders. I have the VX515 and struggle with the macrovision nags on many channels, even the Jerry Springer specials (they make me feel good about myself). Unless you have a video filter, stay away from Sony.


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## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

videojanitor said:


> One thing that's cool about dubbing from the HD TiVo to DVD is that if you set the TiVo's output to "Full" while dubbing, you'll end up with an anamorphic DVD that you can then stretch back to 16:9 on playback. So, you retain the 16:9 aspect ratio of the original program, though at DVD (not HD) resolution.


This is true, and cool.

Caveat about it though:

A DVD recorded this way will only look "right" when played back on a 16x9 TV set. It will look "squished" if played on a 4x3.

This is because while this technique produces an anamorphic DVD, the anamorphic flags are not set in the TOC of the disk, so a DVD player will not know that it needs to letterbox it on a 4x3 TV.


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## monkeyboy1010 (Nov 17, 2000)

> A DVD recorded this way will only look "right" when played back on a 16x9 TV set. It will look "squished" if played on a 4x3.
> 
> This is because while this technique produces an anamorphic DVD, the anamorphic flags are not set in the TOC of the disk, so a DVD player will not know that it needs to letterbox it on a 4x3 TV.


That will depend on the DVD Recorder actually, my Sony DVD recorder allows for you to set the flags for 4:3 or 16:9, not all recorders have this function. When they are played on a 4:3 TV they will be letterboxed or Pan&Scan, depending on the settings of the DVD player.

mb1010


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## FlugPoP (Jan 7, 2004)

codespy said:


> Stay away from the Sony DVD recorders. I have the VX515 and struggle with the macrovision nags on many channels, even the Jerry Springer specials (they make me feel good about myself). Unless you have a video filter, stay away from Sony.


Only Sony has this problem? Darn I wanted a Sony


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## Lije Baley (May 12, 2004)

I've been using a Panasonic E95h for the past year, making very nice DVDs from the Tivo. I'm not sure about the "full/panel" comments. My tivo is set for "panel" because I prefer the sidebars on SD material, rather than a stretched picture. For widescreen programming, I set the Tivo for a 16:9 display if the DVDs will be viewed on an HD set. If I'm making a recording that will be viewed on a 4:3 display, I set the Tivo for that output. It would be nice to encode the anamorphic flags, but neither the Panny nor the Tivo record those flags.

Am I missing something with the use of the "full" v. "panel" setting?


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## videojanitor (Dec 21, 2001)

It's true that the HD TiVo doesn't output the widescreen flag, nor does the Panasonic recorder support them. My comments were based solely on making discs for ones own use. That is, I always make anamorphic DVDs for MYSELF, because I know what I am going to use to watch them -- I don't ever plan on viewing them on a 4:3 set.

I'm not saying that everyone should do this -- just pointing out that it can be done if desired.


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## videojanitor (Dec 21, 2001)

Fish Man said:


> This is true, and cool.
> 
> Caveat about it though:
> 
> A DVD recorded this way will only look "right" when played back on a 16x9 TV set. It will look "squished" if played on a 4x3.


Very true, which is why I only do this for discs that are for my own use. If it's something that I need to give to someone else, and they have a 4:3 set, I'll either letterbox it right out of the TiVo, or if I'm feeling REALLY generous, I'll do it anamorphic and then author it on a PC, using IFOEdit to change the file header to indicate that it's 16:9.


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## Lije Baley (May 12, 2004)

What I'm not getting is what difference the full/panel setting makes in the recording process. Using the panel setting, with the tivo set for a 16:9 display, the finished DVD is an SD copy of the HD program, with the 16:9 ratio retained. (I think of "anamorphic" DVDs as those that can be read as either 4:3 or 16:9, depending on how the DVD player is set.)

P.S. Thanks for all the guidance a year ago when I was first exploring DVD recording. The Panasonic HDD has been a great machine for editing.


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## Magnet (Oct 13, 2002)

Hi all - I don't post here often, but I noticed this thread and thought I might have something helpful to contribute. I record from a HD-DTivo to a Panasonic DMR-ES20 dvd recorder.

The ability to record native wide-screen (16x9) programming to DVD, and have it play back correctly on either a wide-screen or standard (4x3) TV, was my goal, but I found that getting that result was not straight forward.

There are likely multiple ways to accomplish this goal. Thanks to the generosity of others who've described how they've done it at this an other web sites, I've picked out what I like to use. I'd like to pass the favor along to anyone who's interested.

*A quick level set of terms: *

*aspect-ratio * is the height/width relationship of the picture. The two most common aspect ratios for video are 16x9 (wide-screen TV) or 4x3 (the aspect ratio of older TVs - this was once referred to as the Academy Standard).

To display the picture correctly, all DVD players, and the HD-DTivo, need for you to configure them for playback on either a 16x9 or 4x3 TV. Setting this value incorrectly will result in a distorted (stretched or squeezed) image.

Regardless of your TV's aspect-ratio, wide-screen TV and movie programming is presented in two basic formats: *anamorphic* & *letter-boxed*. *Anamorphic* 16x9 programming uses the entire video frame to record the wide screen image - to view anamorphic 16x9 images correctly, your DVD/HD-DTivo must be configured for playback on a wide-screen TV or else the image will be distorted. *Letter-boxed* programming does not use the entire video frame, but places the wide-screen image inside the middle of the frame, and uses black borders (the letter-box) to blank-out the unused portions of the frame. Letter-boxed programming is most useful to those who only have a 4x3 TV, but don't want the sides cut off of wide-screen sources. Those of us who wish to view the highest quality wide-screen image possible, when viewed on a wide-screen TV, prefer anamorphic wide-screen​
*Resolution* is both the number of lines that make up the picture, and how those lines are displayed (*i*nterlaced or *p*rogressive: such as 480*i*, 720*p* & 1080*i*). All standard definition video is 480i. Anything higher (480p, 720i, 720p, 1080i, 1080p) is a variation of high-definition. Until the next generation of DVDs arrives, all current commercial DVDs are recorded at 480i. Electronics manufacturers have pushed up against the limit of standard-definition by electronically enhancing the DVD's 480i content, and feeding to your TV at a higher resolution, but the source is still plain old 480i. Also, all of today's consumer grade DVD recorders record only at 480i.​
It's easy to confuse the characteristics of aspect-ratio with resolution, thinking that one necessarily implies the other. This is not true, but understanding how these characteristics work together can be difficult to grasp.

I was a 35mm film projectionist in another life, so the concept of aspect-ratios was not new to me. Understanding how it worked in the digital-video world was not intuitive.

The most difficult obstacle was to learn and understand the fact that many DVD recorders (including my Panasonic DMR-ES20) do not allow you to control the aspect-ratio of what's being recorded - with these recorders, everything recorded is "marked"as 4x3 aspect ratio, and you can't change it on the recorder.

I found that in order to record to the HD-DTivo's hi-def anamorphic 16x9 programing correctly to DVD, the HD-DTivo had to be set at 480i resolution, and also set to display on a 16x9 TV. Using those two settings, the recorded picture, although no longer hi-def, was still beautiful, filling the wide-screen TV just as it did when viewed as the original hi-def signal.

The problem was when I tried to view the same recording on a 4x3 TV. The picture was distorted (stretched tall)); I couldn't correct the distortion by setting the DVD player for either a 16x9 or 4x3 TV. I wanted to make recordings that would play back correctly on both 16x9 and 4x3 TVs. How do I do that?

I learned that there is a setting (sometimes called a "flag") embedded in DVD video signals that tells your DVD player if the recorded content is anamorphic (native 16x9) or 4x3. That's about the time I began to understand that my DVD recorder did not give me any way to control that setting - it flagged everything it recorded as 4x3.

The most direct solution would be to use a DVD recorder that allowed control of the 16x9 flag at the time of recording. But I'd already purchased a recorder that didn't allow this control - I was otherwise quite pleased with the overall quality of the recordings, and I didn't want to buy another recorder.

I found a solution that provides exactly the result I wanted, but it requires using a computer to modify the recordings that were originally made on the DVD recorder.

All standard DVDs (including the most popular writable DVD formats such as -R & +R) identify the recording's aspect-ratio in one or more files on the DVD that use ".IFO" as part of the file name. There is a free utility available (download from the web) called IFOEdit. IFOEdit allows you to easily change the aspect-ratio setting.

The catch is that you cannot change the setting on the recorded DVD itself (unless someone's figured out how to do that). You first have to copy the recorded DVD's files to the computer's hard-drive, use the IFOEdit tool to modify the aspect-ratio setting, then reburn the modified files to a new DVD.

Now when I know I'm going to want to record an anmorphic 16x9 program from the HD-DTivo, I record it to DVD on RW media (to reuse later), using the two HD-DTivo output settings described above, then transfer that recording to the PC hard drive. A quick edit of the IFO file, then the final version is burned on a -R (or +R, if you prefer).

Quite a hassle I admit, but the result is exactly what I wanted. I hope someone finds this helpful.

Looks like I've made less than 5 posts on this board, and I'm not allowed to include URLs - I tried to modify them to get past the rule but they're still blocked. So, do the following to see what I was trying to include here:

Do a web search on ifoedit. You'll be able to download the tool from there. Next go to the avsforum (web search again). Find the topic of DVD recorders, do a search on the word ifoedit - in the thread "16:9 recording and DVD recorders" find post #24 contributed by "Tom Roper". He's kindly placed screen-shots and simple instructions for using ifoedit.​
Thanks to everyone who's helped me. Enjoy


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## videojanitor (Dec 21, 2001)

Lije Baley said:


> What I'm not getting is what difference the full/panel setting makes in the recording process.


Oops, sorry for the confusion. With the TiVo set to output 480i, and the screen aspect set to 16:9, indeed switching between "full" and "panel" has no effect. I guess I was figuring that some folks would switch the screen aspect to 4:3 when dubbing to DVD, and in that mode, "full" gives you an anamorphic image, while "panel" gives you letterbox. At least that's the way I remember it -- I probably just goofed that up too!


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

You can record it to a DVD? Mine only says VCR.


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## Lije Baley (May 12, 2004)

Magnet,

Thanks for the confirmation that the Panny flags all material as 4:3. It's the only weak point I've found in the recorder and one I can live with. If I was making lots of discs without an idea of where they'd be displayed, I'd add a dvd burner to the computer and use ifoedit. Your explanation was very clear, and there are probably folks reading this thread who will now start flagging their discs as you described. For me, it's easier for the few discs that will be viewed on 4:3 displays to continue recording them onto the Panny with the tivo set for a 4:3 display.


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## Magnet (Oct 13, 2002)

Lije Baley said:


> Magnet,
> 
> For me, it's easier for the few discs that will be viewed on 4:3 displays to continue recording them onto the Panny with the tivo set for a 4:3 display.


Thanks Lije - if I didn't still use both display formats in my own home, I'd probably skip the extra "compatability" steps too.


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## RMSko (Sep 4, 2001)

If I record something in HD on a wide screen set and at the time of recording the TiVo is set at 16x9 and then later change my TiVo to 4x3 and then save that to a DVD, will the picture look "normal" on a 4x3 set?


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## videojanitor (Dec 21, 2001)

RMSko said:


> If I record something in HD on a wide screen set and at the time of recording the TiVo is set at 16x9 and then later change my TiVo to 4x3 and then save that to a DVD, will the picture look "normal" on a 4x3 set?


None of the TiVo settings have any affect on what it (the TiVo) records -- they only change the output (playback) picture. So, it doesn't matter how you have it set when it records -- you can change it later when you dub to DVD.


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## rkester (Jan 10, 2005)

I have used my CyberHome DVR1600 to record anamorphic content off my HDTivo thru its S-Video outputs and it works nicely.

It's not as good quality as a commercial anamorphic disc but its a nice optoin to have.


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## chris_h (Dec 17, 2003)

I have a phillips DVDR-77, and I do not recommend it.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

It works great with both my Philips DVDR75 units.


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## srt (Jan 27, 2006)

slightly off topic: Will the Blue Ray technology allow recording off a 250 for true hd playback, with 5.1?


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## lmk911 (Dec 17, 2000)

codespy said:


> Stay away from the Sony DVD recorders. I have the VX515 and struggle with the macrovision nags on many channels, even the Jerry Springer specials (they make me feel good about myself). Unless you have a video filter, stay away from Sony.





FlugPoP said:


> Only Sony has this problem? Darn I wanted a Sony


The Sony VX515 is a VCR/DVD combo recorder and the GX315 is the non-HDD recorder. I have not had any problems with my Sony HX900 Hard Drive recorder.

Check out AVS Forum's DVD Recorder forurm for more information about the various recorders and copy protection issues.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=106


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## rlj5242 (Dec 20, 2000)

srt said:


> slightly off topic: Will the Blue Ray technology allow recording off a 250 for true hd playback, with 5.1?


 It would have to have a MPEG encoder that was fast enough to compress HD. Someone posted about a video capture card that would accept HD via a component connection. It was around $5,000.

-Robert


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## srt (Jan 27, 2006)

Yikes!  Scratch that idea. I have a std def d* in the guest bedroom that I want to eliminate. Maybe I'll have to get recording to dvd or maybe get a stand alone recorder and jump it off the 250 for use there.


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## JohnDG (Oct 28, 2004)

srt said:


> I have a std def d* in the guest bedroom that I want to eliminate. Maybe I'll have to get recording to dvd or maybe get a stand alone recorder and jump it off the 250 for use there.


IMHO not the best option, as you'll be missing out on the ability to record anamorphic DVDs for HD programming. This is one of the real benefits of owning a HD receiver.

Best is S-Video (or component if your recorder supports it) 480i anamorphic output from the HDTiVo to the DVD recorder. Doing this, you'll get DVDs close to off-the-shelf DVD quality for normal length films.

Check the AVS Forum thread on recording 16:9 to DVD.

jdg


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## srt (Jan 27, 2006)

jdg,
thank you! I will check the thread. I may have more questions as I am not sure of the hardware req's.
Plus a new word..anamorphic,...off to study more!


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## cstelter (Mar 18, 2002)

Hi All,
This thread at least seems quite on-topic for what I want to ask. I've been searching about and it looks like Magnet's advice on ifoedit should solve my problem. But I just wanted to pose my *exact* question to see if anyone has an alternative that doesn't involve ifoedit and a 2-stage DVD burn.

My routine has been to archive some frequently watched recordings from my HR10-250 to DVD. I hook up my Sony GX300 via SVideo, flip the bit to 16:9 and if I use DVD-R's and better than SP mode, I get a DVD that plays back on 4:3 sets properly (i.e. letterboxed or pan/scan however the DVD player is configured)

But my recorder only lets me edit out the commercials if I use DVD+RW or DVD-RW + VR mode. I found that my Roxio Creator 7 allows me to easily copy my edited DVD+RW's to DVD-R's, but only recently discovered that in doing so I had lost the 16:9 bit. (DVD+RW disks on my recorder are always flagged 4:3)

So I have no problem if the show is commercial free, I just burn straight to DVD-R and all is well. But I'm trying to figure out the best way to be able to edit out commercials and still end up with a DVD-R.

This thread indicates that if I take my DVD+RW and copy to my PC and use ifoedit and then burn it to DVD-R that is probably the best solution. I found in my DVD recorder's manual that the 16:9 bit is preserved on all DVD-RW(VR) recordings so I made one of those. However, It seems that Roxio isn't up to the task of copying this recording to DVD-R (or else I'm doing something wrong).

Does anyone know of a software package that can take a DVD-RW recording (formatted VR, not Video), and copy it to a DVD-R such that the recording is easily viewable on most standard DVD players? The DVD-R's I've created from DVD+RW with roxio are great except that they won't play right on 4:3 sets. Does a later version of Roxio work better for DVD-RW/VR discs?

Alternatively, can anyone recommend a good PC based DVD editing package that will allow me to upload a raw recording from my sony and edit out the commercials before burning it to DVD-R?


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## chris_h (Dec 17, 2003)

Craig,

Short answer: I don't know. Better answer: maybe you should check www.dvdrhelp.com

Chris


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## cstelter (Mar 18, 2002)

chris_h said:


> Craig,
> 
> Short answer: I don't know. Better answer: maybe you should check www.dvdrhelp.com
> 
> Chris


Thanks for the pointer Chris. I've been successful using ifoedit since last week, but the site you pointed me to looks promising. Useful information I hope.


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## deli99 (Nov 12, 2003)

Hi all. I need a bit of advice on the setup of my DVD recorder with my DirecTivo box. I have a Panasonic DMR-ES25S recorder, and an HR10-250 D*Tivo. 

Presently, I connect my D*Tivo to my TV with an HDMI cable. Should the recorder be placed "in line" between the Tivo and TV? In other words, should I connect the output from the Tivo to the DVD recorder, and the output from the recorder to the TV?

The recorder has an HDMI output, but not an HDMI input, and I'm concerned I will lose picture quality with an "in line" set up if I use component cables or S-video.

Any suggestions will be greatly appreciated. :up:


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## rlj5242 (Dec 20, 2000)

deli99 said:


> Presently, I connect my D*Tivo to my TV with an HDMI cable. Should the recorder be placed "in line" between the Tivo and TV? .....The recorder has an HDMI output, but not an HDMI input,


 Well that leaves out connecting it inline via HDMI.



deli99 said:


> I'm concerned I will lose picture quality with an "in line" set up if I use component cables or S-video.


 I don't think there are very many DVD recorders with component video inputs so you are left with s-video. And yes, you will lose picture quality when recording an HD since it has to be down-converted to 480i and then redigitalized to be recorded on the disc. If you are concerned about losing picture quality on day to day viewing, there's no reason to disconnect the HDMI between the HR10-250 and the TV. The DVD recorder will be connected to another input on the TV.

-Robert


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## onin24eagle (Feb 17, 2006)

FYI, here is a link to show you how to record from the Tivo and make your own HD-DVD's on any standard DVD-/+R.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=705146


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## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

I just picked up a new Toshiba HD-A2 HD-DVD player a couple of weeks ago and have tried the process outlined at the AVS Forums using HD content recorded on my HDTivos and it works great. It does require that you extract the videos to your PC instead of feeding the analog output to an outboard DVD recorder. Since extraction is not a permitted topic for discussion in these forums I'll leave it to you to look for it elsewhere at the "other" forum.


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