# Lost OAD 2/4/2009 - "The Little Prince" *spoilers*



## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Jin LIVES!!!

for continuity purposes, I don't remember if Russo ever showed any recognition of Jin, but I doubt it.

Anyhow, may the discussion begin.


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

As soon as I saw the boat out in the ocean in the rain, I was like "We're gonna see Montand! Before he loses his arm!!!"..

So glad Jin's alive.. Too cool.

Now that Locke told someone (Sawyer) about his evening pounding on the hatch (where unbeknownst to him he kept Desmond from committing suicide), maybe Sawyer will eventually tell Desmond that (just like he told Jack about what Christian said in the bar).


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

I was looking specifically for a music box


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## brermike (Jun 1, 2006)

Another great episode. Seeing Rousseau and Jin was double great. And I guess we will get to see what happened to Rousseau's science team. She did speak of Montang losing his arm 

The scene of Sawyer seeing Kate deliver Claire's baby was really well done and tied together the scenes of Kate and Aaron off the island.

Now, I'm trying to figure out if Sun is there to kill Ben or Jack (whom she blame for Jin's "death").

Yet again, I can't wait until next Wednesday!!


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

From the surveillance report:

Random names? Lee Chin..

Nope, not random.. next page says that someone said "Lee Chin is dead."

Who lives at 183 Pinecrest?

(said that?) I was Melissa f***ing with her

Who's Melissa?

Yellow volkswagon beetle. Who has one of those?

Who lives on Gundigue Drive?

Black, green, and red spraypaint?

What another tragedy that Sun is so consumed and Jin in fact hadn't died.


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

I was wondering when Jin would reappear. I've been expecting him to show up, but when I saw they guy floating on the raft I didn't suspect it was Jin.

So, is "the sickness" that will eventually afflict Rousseau's crew the same as what's happening to Charlotte and her people? The symptoms aren't the same. I wonder if will see Rousseau kill her people. And will Jin be one of those she kills?

And how is Jin time traveling? He was way out on the boat when the boat blew up. Somehow he ended up inside the radius of the island. Pretty big radius.


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

I'm wondering if any of the times we've jumped to (like where we're out in the green field) where nothing happened (then we jumped again) will someday somehow turn out to be incredibly interesting periods of time.

Glad to see a hint that Miles has been on the island before (but doesn't know it!). Aha! There'll be a good explanation for that ability yet!

I wonder what Ben said to Kate after "he's not yours", when we went into the car w/Sun. Did he say that Claire was alive/fine?

I'm glad Locke thought to go to the Orchid. I figured that this episode they'd get there and Miles would go down into a being-constructed-Orchid-station and see a melted drill. I also thought they'd see the 4-toed statue in the boat.

The guy who shot Sayid with the darts.. I take it he was paid by either Widmore directly or via Sun? Or maybe for some reason we misunderstood and he was working for Kate? (that makes no sense, but it needs to be at least mentioned)

Has Kate always had those green eyes?


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## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Yeah you would think that if the boat disapeared (ie didn't time travel) that Jin would not have either.


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## zync (Feb 22, 2003)

Fool Me Twice said:


> And how is Jin time traveling? He was way out on the boat when the boat blew up. Somehow he ended up inside the radius of the island. Pretty big radius.


Hang on - wasn't the helicopter on its way back to the island? So the boat was within the radius, but the helicopter that was between the boat and island wasn't.

What am I missing?


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## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

We were given a nudge in the direction of Miles having been on the island before. That reinforces a theory mentioned in previous threads that Miles is Dr. Chang's son.


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## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Oh yeah, about Miles, are they trying to make us think that he's Dr. Chang's baby?


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

jkeegan said:


> Has Kate always had those green eyes?


Yes. And I must say, she was sporting my favorite Kate look tonight.


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## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

zync said:


> Hang on - wasn't the helicopter on its way back to the island? So the boat was within the radius, but the helicopter that was between the boat and island wasn't.
> 
> What am I missing?


The boat wasn't within the radius, because it "disapeared" to those who were on the island, ie it didn't travel with them.


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## SoBelle0 (Jun 25, 2002)

Daniel says (paraphrased) - if it didn't happen, it can't happen... 
Then, Jin meeting Danielle all those many years ago - have we ever seen the two of them interact previously? I can't recall.


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## gossamer88 (Jul 27, 2005)

Fool Me Twice said:


> Yes. And I must say, she was sporting my favorite Kate look tonight.


Funnny 'cause I told my wife I prefer the "unpolished" Kate.


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

Maybe the helicopter's altitude had something to do with it not traveling with the island?


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

Fool Me Twice said:


> And will Jin be one of those she kills?


I wondered the same thing out loud, and my wife reminded me that at the next flash, he'll disappear to them.

I do want to go back to earlier seasons now to see if we see when Danielle and Jin met (post-815 crash).

Great comment by Locke.. "No.. I needed that pain.. 'to get to where I am now!"

Glad that Miles is concerned enough about the others to not want to freak them out.

It was a very interesting look on Miles's face when he said he'd never been there before two weeks ago and Faraday said "are you SURE about that?".. How could someone not be sure about that? Miles must have some time he doesn't remember..

All of the beer is gone, and there's a water bottle from another airline..

Hey.. has Vincent been jumping around through time with them?

Ajira Airways.. Does ANOTHER plane crash on the island?

Where'd the pontoon boat come from?


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## betts4 (Dec 27, 2005)

I was thinking that Jin was on debris that might have been within the islands 'radius' before it flashed the first time. He's been out at sea, floating and flashing and may not be aware of it.


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## betts4 (Dec 27, 2005)

Who was shooting at them?


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

jkeegan said:


> Hey.. has Vincent been jumping around through time with them?


Wouldn't his rope go with him? The other jumpers don't jump without their clothes. And what rules determine which objects jump with you? I thought for a moment while they were in the middle of the jump on the pontoon boat, that they'd find themselves swimming.


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

betts4 said:


> Who was shooting at them?


They hate those paddles! Stay away from the paddles!


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

Ok...........

When they're on the pontoon boat, and Sawyer tells Juliette that he saw Kate.. he says that time travel is a *****..

Then they get shot at.. They paddle like crazy, and we see another pontoon boat chasing them, shooting at them. Sawyer says "little help?", and Juliette grabs a gun and starts shooting at the other boat.

I'll bet the other boat was them. They're being shot at by themselves, and they reacted by shooting at themselves. One is just ahead of the other.

They don't even need a flash in the sky, because they're out in the water, not on any particular bearing..

(or, later they get back in the boat to try again, and jump to then and shoot at themselves).


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## betts4 (Dec 27, 2005)

betts4 said:


> Who was shooting at them?


Then I thought - the guys with the four toes! They could shift back in time and go back far enough to see the statue be complete.


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## SoBelle0 (Jun 25, 2002)

Fool Me Twice said:


> They hate those paddles! Stay away from the paddles!


LOL!! Nice one!


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

Ok what's an anagram of Canton-Rainier (carpet cleaning)?


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## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

SoBelle0 said:


> Daniel says (paraphrased) - if it didn't happen, it can't happen... *unless you are Desmond*
> Then, Jin meeting Danielle all those many years ago - have we ever seen the two of them interact previously? I can't recall.


Fixed your post


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

random data: lawyer's name is Dan Norton


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

fwiw, it's not a pontoon boat, its an outrigger canoe.


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

jkeegan said:


> Ok what's an anagram of Canton-Rainier (carpet cleaning)?


Reincarnation


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

Daniel version: What happened, happened.

Sawyer version: What's done is done.


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## Philosofy (Feb 21, 2000)

Why did the outrigger jump in time with our heroes? And refresh my memory: who is Montand?

As for Jin, if the boat exploded, the helicoptor flew out of the radius, and Jin was thrown inside the radius. Remember, Sawyer had enough time to swim to the island, where Juliette was watching the smoke from the blown up boat.


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## betts4 (Dec 27, 2005)

betts4 said:


> I was thinking that Jin was on debris that might have been within the islands 'radius' before it flashed the first time. He's been out at sea, floating and flashing and may not be aware of it.





Philosofy said:


> As for Jin, if the boat exploded, the helicoptor flew out of the radius, and Jin was thrown inside the radius. Remember, Sawyer had enough time to swim to the island, where Juliette was watching the smoke from the blown up boat.


smeek!


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## mostman (Jul 16, 2000)

Where is Sun's baby?


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## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Philosofy said:


> Why did the outrigger jump in time with our heroes? And refresh my memory: who is Montand?
> 
> As for Jin, if the boat exploded, the helicoptor flew out of the radius, and Jin was thrown inside the radius. Remember, Sawyer had enough time to swim to the island, where Juliette was watching the smoke from the blown up boat.


The same reason the compass jumped with Locke, I guess because they were touching it.


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## tewcewl (Dec 18, 2004)

mostman said:


> Where is Sun's baby?


Her mom's taking care of it.

Jin's alive! I agree that he was within the radius (just look at how much time he had to float close to the island while Sawyer was swimming to the island plus that time conversing with Juliet, drinking). I think this is how they'll convince Sun to come with them. Locke or someone else must have told Ben that Jin's alive -- that is if Locke finds out before he leaves the island. This episode was hinting on how Locke leaves. He's definitely on a goal to get out and warn the O6.

Great episode with a lot of new revelations! It'll definitely be interesting to see how we get a history of Rousseau's group.


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

Philosofy said:


> And refresh my memory: who is Montand?


http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Montand


> Montand was mentioned briefly by Danielle when they were entering the Dark Territory on the way to the Black Rock: "This is where Montand lost his arm." ("Exodus, Part 1")


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

zync said:


> Hang on - wasn't the helicopter on its way back to the island? So the boat was within the radius, but the helicopter that was between the boat and island wasn't.
> 
> What am I missing?


I'm sure there's a way to get him there even if he wasn't in the radius for the first jump. There's always a way on Lost. 



SoBelle0 said:


> Daniel says (paraphrased) - if it didn't happen, it can't happen...


I'm still not sure that Daniel knows that for sure. It was a good way to back Sawyer off, but he may not really know the "rules."


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

Maybe Miles is dead.. Maybe he died, but doesn't know it, similar to what people were guessing happened to Claire when the house she was in was hit with a rocket launcher. Maybe that's why he hears other dead people.. As to why we're hearing him, well that's another problem.

It was almost poetic how we watch Ben say "because he's not your son, Kate..." in the scene immediately before we see Danielle on the island with Jin. Kate has someone else's baby and calls it her own, just like Ben will take someone else's baby and call it his own.

Poor Jin, waking up to another language he doesn't speak.

At least this time on the beach with people he's never met, he didn't have an oar tied behind his head.

Jin certainly remembered who Danielle was.


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## betts4 (Dec 27, 2005)

jkeegan said:


> It was almost poetic how we watch Ben say "because he's not your son, Kate..." in the scene immediately before we see Danielle on the island with Jin. Kate has someone else's baby and calls it her own, just like Ben will take someone else's baby and call it his own.


That's a good one. I knew there was some reason why it was creepy, but couldn't put my finger on it.


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

Locke kicked over a can with the words "Besix Douze" on it.



> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/46610_Bésixdouze
> 46610 Besixdouze (1993 TQ1) is an asteroid belonging to the asteroid belt. It was discovered by Kin Endate and Kazuo Watanabe on October 15, 1993.
> The name of the asteroid is a reference to The Little Prince, who lived on an asteroid named B612. The name Bésixdouze is the concatenation of B, six and douze, French for "B six twelve". Also, 46610 is the decimal equivalent of the hexadecimal number B612.


And The Little Prince, of course, is a well known children's book.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Little_Prince


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

Fool Me Twice said:


> And The Little Prince, of course, is a well known children's book.


... that was originally written in French.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

jkeegan said:


> The guy who shot Sayid with the darts.. I take it he was paid by either Widmore directly or via Sun? Or maybe for some reason we misunderstood and he was working for Kate? (that makes no sense, but it needs to be at least mentioned)


I think it's all being orchestrated by Ben to make them all feel like their world is crashing down around them and they need to go back to the island. Jack reached that conclusion on his own, but the rest of them need a little shove. Making Sayid think he's being targeted, making Kate think someone's going to steal her kid. I'm just interested to see what angle Ben has on Sun, because you know he's going to be one step ahead of her too.


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

For the curious:
http://losteastereggs.blogspot.com/2009/02/episode-5x04-little-prince-suns-package.html


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## aadam101 (Jul 15, 2002)

As a gay man, I have to say Kate looked smoking tonight. I never found her attractive on the island but she looks great when she is off it.


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## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

Seeing the French group immediately made me think, "Rousseau's with them". Although that girl sounds nothing like Mira Furlan! 

But it also made me think about something else, something Damon Lindelof said to Jeff Jensen of Entertainment Weekly. I know that because I did a search for what popped into my head:

"When is a flashback not a flashback?"

http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20011756,00.html

February 13, 2007, in response to "Flashes Before Your Eyes".



> This week, the focus is on Desmond - lovelorn Scotsman, disgraced soldier, ex-Dharma sadsack, and now, precognitive super-freak. Your 10-word tease from Damon Lindelof is:
> 
> ''Riddle me this - When is a flashback not a flashback?''


I'm also starting to think that a lot of the weird things we saw happen in S1 and S2 were somehow created by the main characters, as we see them now. Remember when people were speculating about another group? As Sawyer put it tonight, "other others". Maybe those other others, as someone posited earlier about shooting at each other on the raft, just our characters interacting with themselves.

This season kicks butt.

Greg


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## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

aadam101 said:


> As a gay man, I have to say Kate looked smoking tonight. I never found her attractive on the island but she looks great when she is off it.


As a straight man, I have to say Kate looked smoking tonight. 

Greg


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Fool Me Twice said:


> I was wondering when Jin would reappear. I've been expecting him to show up, but when I saw they guy floating on the raft I didn't suspect it was Jin.
> 
> So, is "the sickness" that will eventually afflict Rousseau's crew the same as what's happening to Charlotte and her people? The symptoms aren't the same. I wonder if will see Rousseau kill her people. And will Jin be one of those she kills?
> 
> And how is Jin time traveling? He was way out on the boat when the boat blew up. Somehow he ended up inside the radius of the island. Pretty big radius.





zync said:


> Hang on - wasn't the helicopter on its way back to the island? So the boat was within the radius, but the helicopter that was between the boat and island wasn't.
> 
> What am I missing?





vertigo235 said:


> The boat wasn't within the radius, because it "disapeared" to those who were on the island, ie it didn't travel with them.





Fool Me Twice said:


> Maybe the helicopter's altitude had something to do with it not traveling with the island?





Philosofy said:


> Why did the outrigger jump in time with our heroes? And refresh my memory: who is Montand?
> 
> As for Jin, if the boat exploded, the helicoptor flew out of the radius, and Jin was thrown inside the radius. Remember, Sawyer had enough time to swim to the island, where Juliette was watching the smoke from the blown up boat.


I would also think that Jin was not drifting on the "correct" bearing and that also factors into why he's jumping in time.

I also had a strange sense of Deja Vu when seeing the group in the raft.


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## getbak (Oct 8, 2004)

gchance said:


> I'm also starting to think that a lot of the weird things we saw happen in S1 and S2 were somehow created by the main characters, as we see them now. Remember when people were speculating about another group? As Sawyer put it tonight, "other others". Maybe those other others, as someone posited earlier about shooting at each other on the raft, just our characters interacting with themselves.


Hmm, maybe the whispers we've heard over the years are the voices of the jumping Losties.

Nice to see Jin alive, too bad after he finally got a grasp of English, he gets saved by a life raft full of French people.

Re: The outrigger with the bottle of water from the Indian airline...It appears to be in the "future" (from the crash's perspective). Am I the only one who thought the boat was brought there by the Oceanic 6?


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## spikedavis (Nov 23, 2003)

I think it's pretty safe to assume we've seen Miles on the island already. I'm Assuming in a future episode we'll see them sneaking around The Orchid-like we saw Daniel doing-and Miles will meet dear old dad.


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

Apparently, the prop guy just copied a couple of pages from the internet to use as Sun's PI report. Lazy bastard. 
http://www.crimescene.com/beauty.archive/evidence.pi.report.html
http://forum.thefuselage.com/showthread.php?t=106831


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## betts4 (Dec 27, 2005)

gchance said:


> I'm also starting to think that a lot of the weird things we saw happen in S1 and S2 were somehow created by the main characters, as we see them now. Remember when people were speculating about another group? As Sawyer put it tonight, "other others". Maybe those other others, as someone posited earlier about shooting at each other on the raft, just our characters interacting with themselves.
> 
> This season kicks butt.


I was thinking the same thing when sawyer was watching the birth scene. I was trying to think of where he was in season one when that was happening.

Maybe Jack's father in season one, is really Jack seeing himself.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

jkeegan said:


> Ok what's an anagram of Canton-Rainier (carpet cleaning)?





Fool Me Twice said:


> Reincarnation


ooooooooooooh..... Maybe Aaron is Locke. Locke dies, or appears to (heck he _is_ in a coffin. Maybe the only way he can get "back" to the Island, is for the body (which still might have his soul) and Aaron. Perhaps Aaron is a reincarnated Locke. I know, not likely, but the reincarnation thing is pretty cool. Last time I remember such a blatant anagram that held a Lost Truism, was the Funeral Home name being "Flash Forward". Maybe they did all die and are being reincarnated. Again, not likely, but you never know.



DevdogAZ said:


> I think it's all being orchestrated by Ben to make them all feel like their world is crashing down around them and they need to go back to the island. Jack reached that conclusion on his own, but the rest of them need a little shove. Making Sayid think he's being targeted, making Kate think someone's going to steal her kid. I'm just interested to see what angle Ben has on Sun, because you know he's going to be one step ahead of her too.


Well, I think it's clear, after tonight's ep that Ben will tell Sun Jin is alive. she won't believe him at first and will wnat to fire that gun, but Jack will convince her, at least that is my idea.



gchance said:


> As a straight man, I have to say Kate looked smoking tonight.
> 
> Greg


+100,000,000


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## speedcouch (Oct 23, 2003)

getbak said:


> Hmm, maybe the whispers we've heard over the years are the voices of the jumping Losties.


I thought the same thing last night as well. :up:

Also, I knew it was Rouseau as soon as I heard them speaking french and saw the long hair. The coat revealing her pregnant belly was pretty much unnecessary for me.

Cheryl


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Some interesting tidbits about the The Little Prince that I read on Wiki (makes you wonder how much they think out ahead of time or not):

Interestingly, or is it obviously, Saint-Exupéry was an aviator



> Saint-Exupéry tells of meeting a young prince in the middle of the Sahara


 -- Ben ends up in the desert after moving the Island



> He tries a few sheep drawings, which the Prince rejects. Finally he draws a box, which he explains has the sheep inside


 -- sort of like a "magic box".



> His asteroid (planet) is house-sized and named, B612, which has three volcanoes (two active, and one dormant) and a rose among various other objects


 -- a "Rose"



> The prince falls in love with the rose


 -- Des and Penny?



> The King who can "control" the stars by ordering them to do what they would anyway. He then relates this to human subjects; it is the citizen's duty to obey, but only if the king's demands are reasonable. He orders the Prince to leave as his ambassador.


 -- Ben as King and Locke as Prince/Ambassador?



> The Conceited Man who wants to be admired by everyone, but lives alone on his planet. He cannot hear anything that is not a compliment.


 -- Sawyer?



> On the Earth, he starts out in the desert and meets a snake that claims to have the power to return him to his home planet (A clever way to say that he can kill people, thus "Sending anyone he wishes back to the land from whence he came.")


-- sending back to planet....Island?

And on and on......I guess you could fit Lostisms into anything you want, but I always just love when they use well known literature.....


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## Cindy1230 (Oct 31, 2003)

Anyone find translations of all the french? 
When they made it to the beach, it was the numbers being repeated on the radio. 

And wouldn't Claire's mother know who Aaron is just because of all the media coverage and being one of the Oceanic 6? That seemed weird.


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## tewcewl (Dec 18, 2004)

jkeegan said:


> Maybe Miles is dead.. Maybe he died, but doesn't know it, similar to what people were guessing happened to Claire when the house she was in was hit with a rocket launcher. Maybe that's why he hears other dead people.. As to why we're hearing him, well that's another problem.


I don't think we're watching the walking dead here. I think these people are very much alive. That's why they (nose)bleed.

I also don't think Claire's dead. I think she got some major revelations that we're not subject to yet, hence her eerie peace about everything. Maybe she knows that Aaron will return to her and things will fall into place.


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## tewcewl (Dec 18, 2004)

Cindy1230 said:


> And wouldn't Claire's mother know who Aaron is just because of all the media coverage and being one of the Oceanic 6? That seemed weird.


I think she DID know who Aaron was, but was just confused to why Jack showed up talking about Aaron with her. She thinks Aaron is Kate's son, hence heightening her confusion.


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## BitbyBlit (Aug 25, 2001)

jkeegan said:


> I'll bet the other boat was them. They're being shot at by themselves, and they reacted by shooting at themselves. One is just ahead of the other.


But they were being shot at from behind the whole time. If the boat behind them was their past selves, they would have been shot at from the front. And given that they could see the past boat behind them, I would think they could have seen the future boat in front of them.


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## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

DevdogAZ said:


> I think it's all being orchestrated by Ben to make them all feel like their world is crashing down around them and they need to go back to the island. Jack reached that conclusion on his own, but the rest of them need a little shove. Making Sayid think he's being targeted, making Kate think someone's going to steal her kid. I'm just interested to see what angle Ben has on Sun, because you know he's going to be one step ahead of her too.


This is probably a smeek, but I don't have time to read the whole thread now and wanted to say my piece.

I think exactly as you, that Ben created all of this to push the O6 to go back to the island. As for what Ben is going to use to leverage Sun, it's pretty obvious. He's going to us the fact that Jin is still alive and on the Island!!


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## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

Taking Faraday's hypothesis about nose bleeds as truth, it seems Charlotte has been on the island more than anyone else in that group? There's another mystery to solve!

Also assuming he's right, it seems more and more obvious that the scene with Faraday at the orchid in the premiere is something that will come to pass due to time travel in a future episode and not an indication he's been on the island for a ludicrously long time.


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## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

BitbyBlit said:


> But they were being shot at from behind the whole time. If the boat behind them was their past selves, they would have been shot at from the front. And given that they could see the past boat behind them, I would think they could have seen the future boat in front of them.


Unless it was them at a different point in time, wherein they return to this moment and get in a different boat and follow themselves. It all seems rather unlikely, but apparently some of us entertain any possibility of anything on the show.


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## BitbyBlit (Aug 25, 2001)

TAsunder said:


> Unless it was them at a different point in time, wherein they return to this moment and get in a different boat and follow themselves.  It all seems rather unlikely, but apparently some of us entertain any possibility of anything on the show.


It is unlikely, not because of any scientific reason, but because of a logical one. As far as we know, they would have no reason to chase after themselves and shoot. The idea jkeegan was proposing was that the shooting was part of a time loop, where shooting at themselves is what caused them to shoot in the first place. That doesn't require any external motivation, but coming back later does.


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## Cindy1230 (Oct 31, 2003)

getbak said:


> Re: The outrigger with the bottle of water from the Indian airline...It appears to be in the "future" (from the crash's perspective). Am I the only one who thought the boat was brought there by the Oceanic 6?


If it was the O6, wouldn't the island be saved and the flashes would stop?


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## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

BitbyBlit said:


> It is unlikely, not because of any scientific reason, but because of a logical one. As far as we know, they would have no reason to chase after themselves and shoot. The idea jkeegan was proposing was that the shooting was part of a time loop, where shooting at themselves is what caused them to shoot in the first place. That doesn't require any external motivation, but coming back later does.


He also addressed another possibility in parentheses similar to what I wrote.


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## jehma (Jan 22, 2003)

getbak said:


> Hmm, maybe the whispers we've heard over the years are the voices of the jumping Losties.


Spoiled for reference to a movie:



Spoiler



Now I'm getting a "Butterfly Effect" vibe from this all. We're going to get to the end and have to watch it all from the beginning again to catch it all.


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## flyers088 (Apr 19, 2005)

Steveknj said:


> This is probably a smeek, but I don't have time to read the whole thread now and wanted to say my piece.
> 
> I think exactly as you, that Ben created all of this to push the O6 to go back to the island. As for what Ben is going to use to leverage Sun, it's pretty obvious. He's going to us the fact that Jin is still alive and on the Island!!


I agree with the whole Ben being the mastermind behind the whole thing. What would Whidmore have to gain from hurting the O6?

Wonder how Des/Penny will fit into Ben's plan since he has vowed to kill Penny?

How much time has passed since the 70 hour deadline has been given?


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## latrobe7 (May 1, 2005)

The French dialog (from lostpedia):



> ROBERT: Je t'ai bien dit! On n'aurait jamais du suivre ces maudits chiffres! (I told you so! We never should have followed those damn numbers!)
> 
> MONTAND: C'est pas ma faute, Robert. Brennan devait tenir le sonar! (It's not my fault, Robert. Brennan was in charge of the sonar!)
> 
> ...


----------



## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

OOh..

Maybe when Widmore set up the team w/Faraday/Charlotte,Miles/Lawnmowerman-pilot-guy, he was trying to get them back to the island similar to how Ben is now trying to get them back to the island..

Naomi didn't believe it was a good pick of team members, yet maybe that's because they were only included because Widmore wanted THEM there.

I'd like to see some Desmond-ish-related "change" actually stop Lapitus(see? I remembered his name before finishing the post) from flying the plane.. (that would mean the universe/island/whatever was trying to "fix" that, by including him in the plan to go to the island).


----------



## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

Cindy1230 said:


> Anyone find translations of all the french?
> When they made it to the beach, it was the numbers being repeated on the radio.


Really? How'd I miss that? Sad and happy at the same time. Awesome! Can't wait to go back and hear it.


----------



## martylamb (Sep 29, 2005)

Fool Me Twice said:


> jkeegan said:
> 
> 
> > Ok what's an anagram of Canton-Rainier (carpet cleaning)?
> ...


An Incinerator.


----------



## spikedavis (Nov 23, 2003)

TAsunder said:


> Taking Faraday's hypothesis about nose bleeds as truth, it seems Charlotte has been on the island more than anyone else in that group? There's another mystery to solve!
> 
> Also assuming he's right, it seems more and more obvious that the scene with Faraday at the orchid in the premiere is something that will come to pass due to time travel in a future episode and not an indication he's been on the island for a ludicrously long time.


At the end of last season Miles revealed that he knew Charlotte was born on he island.


----------



## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

Steveknj said:


> This is probably a smeek, but I don't have time to read the whole thread now and wanted to say my piece.


You must be new to Lost threads. 2 pages aren't that many, believe me. 



jehma said:


> Spoiled for reference to a movie:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I totally agree, I've thought this since Charlie asked, "Where are we?" in the first episode. jkeegan likely wouldn't agree, but I'll add, just like Babylon 5. 



jkeegan said:


> Really? How'd I miss that? Sad and happy at the same time. Awesome! Can't wait to go back and hear it.


Don't feel bad about it. There was a LOT going on. I'm going to rewatch it tonight with my wife.

On the way to work this morning I was thinking about the "incident" that happened on the island. I do think we're building up to whatever the incident was being caused by Faraday and the rest of our group. That's probably obvious. 

Greg


----------



## NoThru22 (May 6, 2005)

I made the connection that Miles was Dr. ChangCandleWick's baby before I got to the point in this thread. I was so happy that I was going to post new information.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

NoThru22 said:


> I made the connection that Miles was Dr. ChangCandleWick's baby before I got to the point in this thread. I was so happy that I was going to post new information.


I think it was suggested in last week's thread too, possibly before that.


----------



## xuxa (Oct 8, 2001)

jkeegan said:


> .......Ajira Airways.. Does ANOTHER plane crash on the island?


I would say the chances are good

Ajira Airways


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

Anyone have a pic of Dr. Candlewick's baby? I thought I had read (here?) it was not Asian, and had red hair and blue eyes like Charlotte (but I don't remember what I saw).


----------



## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

tewcewl said:


> ......I also don't think Claire's dead. I think she got some major revelations that we're not subject to yet, hence her eerie peace about everything. Maybe she knows that Aaron will return to her and things will fall into place.


Well, now that I think about it....in all the promo photos, you see the backdrop of a city. Perhaps, on occasion, when the Island has jumped, it has jumped close to a seaside city like NY and picked up some other people along the way, such as Christian Shepard.


----------



## unicorngoddess (Nov 20, 2005)

xuxa said:


> I would say the chances are good
> 
> Ajira Airways


Hmm...interesting.

Great episode. I'm thinking Ben has to know Jin is alive and that's going to be the key to getting Sun back to the island. So once they get Sun on board, they just have to wait for Hurley to get out of jail...and Ben's lawyer is on it.

I'm wondering if they might be planning to go back via Ajira Airways...


----------



## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

TAsunder said:


> I think it was suggested in last week's thread too, possibly before that.


heh, I think that it's possible that someone has suggested that anyone could be Dr. Chang's baby.


----------



## BrandonRe (Jul 15, 2006)

Fool Me Twice said:


> Maybe the helicopter's altitude had something to do with it not traveling with the island?


At the risk of smeeking, I would say that it has more to do with being on the exact path. Remember how to get off of the island you have to go to an exact coordinate and path? I think what happens is if you aren't precisely on that path, you will move within the radius. If you are on that path, then you are in the one place within the radius that doesn't "move" with the island. Hope I explained that clearly.


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

BrandonRe said:


> At the risk of smeeking, I would say that it has more to do with being on the exact path. Remember how to get off of the island you have to go to an exact coordinate and path? I think what happens is if you aren't precisely on that path, you will move within the radius. If you are on that path, then you are in the one place within the radius that doesn't "move" with the island. Hope I explained that clearly.


Right. I thought we heard last year that the helicopter would only be able to leave if it followed Farraday's path.


----------



## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Yeah Jin and Sawyer proved that if you do not go the right path you stay within when they left on the raft, they kept coming back to the island.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

aindik said:


> Anyone have a pic of Dr. Candlewick's baby? I thought I had read (here?) it was not Asian, and had red hair and blue eyes like Charlotte (but I don't remember what I saw).


Yes, that was written somewhere, but I don't think it was in one of these threads. I think it was in a link posted in one of these threads. In any case, I remember reading that and thinking "huh?" I didn't see a redheaded baby. Unfortunately, that episode got deleted off my TiVo already so I can't go back and check.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

aindik said:


> Anyone have a pic of Dr. Candlewick's baby? I thought I had read (here?) it was not Asian, and had red hair and blue eyes like Charlotte (but I don't remember what I saw).


I don't know what that person was smoking as the baby looked pretty Asian to me.


----------



## scsiguy72 (Nov 25, 2003)

xuxa said:


> I would say the chances are good
> 
> Ajira Airways


In reading the website, I could find dozens of Lost references.

Get *lost* in the world with groundbreaking promotions like
*Destination: Destiny that keeps your flight destination a mystery until you get there*. Were changing the way people think about travel - this isnt vacation, this is your life... escaped. Let us deliver your destination by revealing your destiny.

The skies have no limit with our new destinations beginning *January 21st*. So go on an adventure anywhere on the globe and re-imagine your world to be as big as ours. No Borders, Now Boarding - Ajira Airways.


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Cindy1230 said:


> If it was the O6, wouldn't the island be saved and the flashes would stop?


I'm not convinced that their mere presence or absence is the cause of the flashes. We certainly don't have enough information to provide a full explanation. It clearly has a lot to do with the whole donkey wheel thing, and from what we know, there isn't any logical explanation why the effect would have been any different had the O-6 remained on the island.

Speaking of the donkey wheel, Ben said that whoever moves the island can never return. So I imagine that if we see the group head back to the island any time soon, that Ben will have to part ways with them at some point. Although we don't really know whether he meant "can't" in the sense of being forbidden, or would be prevented from returning somehow.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

xuxa said:


> I would say the chances are good
> 
> Ajira Airways


The "weather report" section the front page seems to cycle through locations that have been featured in the story so far, including Tustin, CA, where Locke is from, and Ames, IA which I think is where Kate is from. However, it's interesting that London is not on there, and I'm not yet sure what Mexico City, Rome and Tokyo have to do with the story.


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

brermike said:


> Another great episode. Seeing Rousseau and Jin was double great. And I guess we will get to see what happened to Rousseau's science team. She did speak of Montang losing his arm
> 
> The scene of Sawyer seeing Kate deliver Claire's baby was really well done and tied together the scenes of Kate and Aaron off the island.
> 
> ...


Why would she blame Jack, especially considering she didn't blame Kate. It could be Ben, but I thought that when she told her father that she blames two people, I thought that the other one was Charles Widmore. Didn't she say something to him to that effect when she accosted him in London?

I was wondering if the Claire birth scenes were from the original episode or re-shot for this one.


----------



## scsiguy72 (Nov 25, 2003)

DevdogAZ said:


> The "weather report" section the front page seems to cycle through locations that have been featured in the story so far, including Tustin, CA, where Locke is from, and Ames, IA which I think is where Kate is from. However, it's interesting that London is not on there, and I'm not yet sure what Mexico City, Rome and Tokyo have to do with the story.


Also the local time displayed for the cities is off from 30 to 33 minutes


----------



## Cindy1230 (Oct 31, 2003)

jeff125va said:


> I was wondering if the Claire birth scenes were from the original episode or re-shot for this one.


From lostpedia:


> Scenes from "Do No Harm", specifically Aaron's birth, are reused in this episode. Emilie de Ravin as Claire Littleton makes her Season 5 debut, but only via archive footage and additional material uses a stand-in. Dominic Monaghan and Daniel Dae Kim, also present in the original scene, are not seen.


----------



## Eptiger (Jan 16, 2009)

tewcewl said:


> I also don't think Claire's dead. I think she got some major revelations that we're not subject to yet, hence her eerie peace about everything. Maybe she knows that Aaron will return to her and things will fall into place.


I'm not the only person who thinks so?! :up:

Except for that I don't think she wants Aaron to return to her given the vision that Kate saw. Of course, if she's alive, how did she appear in Kate's dream? Unless it was purely a dream, which is unlikely but could've been done to throw us off.

To whoever suggested the whispers could be these time jumpers: awesome.

I don't think the reason that Sun wants to kill Ben is because they left him on the freighter, I think that something else has happened in the past 3 years that we don't know about and would need to know to make sense of it. I do think she's there to kill Ben though and not Jack. Jack liked Jin and she knows it.

Can someone explain to me Jin's timeline with regard to when we last saw him? He was rushing with stuffed animals to a baby's delivery, but that was no notation that it was a flashback. Was that all a flashback? I had thought he got off the island and it was present day. Or is it present day and what we're seeing with him meeting Rousseau happened (in his mind) before that?

Also: was the raft that Sawyer and friends encountered the one from like 3 seasons ago that they had made? Were none of them involved in making it?

I totally missed that Miles knew Charlotte was born there: nice catch (whoever made that catch)!

Elton


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

Jin's stuffed animal ordeal was in the past. He was working for Sun's father at that time.

We noticed that Rousseau and her cohorts all had pretty modern clothing. This has led to some speculation that they are from a time period later than they indicated. I don't know what wet clothes from that period should have looked like personally, but I thought it was an interesting idea.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

gchance said:


> You must be new to Lost threads. 2 pages aren't that many, believe me.
> 
> Greg


Oh, not new at all, but have been smacked down for smeeking before and was just trying to prevent it


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Cindy1230 said:


> From lostpedia:


That's right. I remember that they kept some distance, but I thought they were close enough that Sawyer should have seen them, too.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Eptiger said:


> Can someone explain to me Jin's timeline with regard to when we last saw him? He was rushing with stuffed animals to a baby's delivery, but that was no notation that it was a flashback. Was that all a flashback? I had thought he got off the island and it was present day. Or is it present day and what we're seeing with him meeting Rousseau happened (in his mind) before that?


Jin's previous flashback episode was just that, a flashback. Happened long before he ever boarded Flight 815. As for this episode, we can only assume he's been floating in the ocean for a couple of days, jumping in time every time that Daniel/Charlotte/Miles etc. are jumping. Since their timeline is totally messed up because they often jump from day to night or night to day, we have no way to know exactly how long it's been since the freighter blew up and the Island moved, but it's probably been at least 48 hours.


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Eptiger said:


> ...Can someone explain to me Jin's timeline with regard to when we last saw him? He was rushing with stuffed animals to a baby's delivery, but that was no notation that it was a flashback. Was that all a flashback? I had thought he got off the island and it was present day. Or is it present day and what we're seeing with him meeting Rousseau happened (in his mind) before that?
> ...
> Elton


He said that he had only been married for a few weeks, or months, or whatever it was. Plus the cell phones were old looking, and several other clues and confirmations.


----------



## wprager (Feb 19, 2006)

aindik said:


> Anyone have a pic of Dr. Candlewick's baby? I thought I had read (here?) it was not Asian, and had red hair and blue eyes like Charlotte (but I don't remember what I saw).


No, I had read a review that said the baby was not asian, and I wondered if it had red hair and blue eyes. However checking back, the baby was very likely asian. That said, how old is Miles? He looks like he's in his late 20s, early 30s, so not old enough to be Chang's baby.


----------



## wprager (Feb 19, 2006)

JYoung said:


> I don't know what that person was smoking as the baby looked pretty Asian to me.


It was the TeleVisonary:
http://www.televisionaryblog.com/2009/01/what-comes-around-goes-around-season.html



> Here, we see Candle with both arms working, a beautiful wife, and a child... who is noticeably not Asian.


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

JYoung said:


> I don't know what that person was smoking as the baby looked pretty Asian to me.


http://lostpedia.wikia.com/wiki/Image:5x01_Pierre%27sBaby.jpg


----------



## 3D (Oct 9, 2001)

unicorngoddess said:


> I'm wondering if they might be planning to go back via Ajira Airways...


I was thinking the same thing. The Oceanic 6 take Ajira Airways, which crashes. They make a camp and have a couple of boats. They return to camp one day to find that one of their boats is missing, but they can still see it off in the distance. They give chase and Ben pulls out a gun and starts shooting. A shot is returned by the boat in front, killing or seriously wounding someone. Almost immediately thereafter, the boat in front disappears before their eyes.


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

Your image link is broken:









That baby does not have red hair or blue eyes. Is it Asian? I can't tell.

Miles' hair is starting to go grey, which might just be the actor or might be an attempt to make him look older to fit the timeline.


----------



## Cindy1230 (Oct 31, 2003)

This is the first season that I've read Televisionary's blog.

I really like his interpretations...



> Even more significant: in the novel, after the Prince arrives on Earth, he is dying of thirst in the desert. Approaching death, he bids farewell to the narrator and tells him that, while it may look as though he has died, he's not dead but his body was too heavy to carry back to his planet. If that's not a *direct reference to the dead John Locke/Jeremy Bentham*, I don't know what is. We know that Locke had to die in order to bring the Oceanic Six back to the island but Ben knows that Locke isn't truly dead. In fact, *it's likely that he'll come back to life once his body is returned to the island. Hmmm, rather like Christian Shephard, in fact.*


I know these ideas have been touched on before in previous threads, so I don't think I'm smeeking, but just wanted to share since he explains it so well and makes total sense to me.


----------



## Cindy1230 (Oct 31, 2003)

3D said:


> I was thinking the same thing. The Oceanic 6 take Ajira Airways, which crashes. They make a camp and have a couple of boats.


and a couple of beers.


----------



## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

Guys, look at this opening. The baby doesn't look Asian to me.






NOTE: in the time it took me to find the video, someone else had posted a screenshot. 

Greg


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

gchance said:


> Guys, look at this opening. The baby doesn't look Asian to me.


But it doesn't look like Charlotte, either.


----------



## tewcewl (Dec 18, 2004)

stevieleej said:


> How does Ben know that Jin is still alive?


My bet is we'll see a scene where Locke tells Ben Jin's alive.



stevieleej said:


> What will Ben gain by getting the O6 back to the island? Especially if he is not allowed to return.


That's the million dollar question for this season or the next.



stevieleej said:


> If Jin is alive, could blown to pieces Michael be alive?


Doubtful since he was inside the room when the bomb went off.



stevieleej said:


> As stated already in this thread, why do some items jump time (an outrigger) and others don't? I'd be temped to start carrying everything I could so it would be with me after the jump.


I think you have to be physically holding the items. We've seen the Losties take guns with them through their time flashes.



stevieleej said:


> Is everyone else who was on the island when the time shifting began, also jumping time?


Not sure who you're referring to. If you mean everyone else, like the Others, I doubt it. I think it is only the Oceanic 815 people, but we'll find out.

Additionally, I'm very curious to who owns Ajira Airlines. Could it be Paik Industries?


----------



## GDG76 (Oct 2, 2000)

stevieleej said:


> How does Ben know that Jin is still alive?


I'm betting he doesn't.. but, this is the ONLY thing that could ever get her back to the island...


----------



## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

Quick question: It's been mentioned several times that Charlotte was born on the island. What episode revealed that, and do we know her back-history (who her parents are, why she's no longer on the island, etc)?

My LOSTmembory is flaking out on this . . .


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

astrohip said:


> Quick question: It's been mentioned several times that Charlotte was born on the island. What episode revealed that, and do we know her back-history (who her parents are, why she's no longer on the island, etc)?
> 
> My LOSTmembory is flaking out on this . . .


We don't know she was, but we know she thinks she might have been.

According to lostpedia, she said to Daniel in last season's finale: "Would it make any sense if I told you I'm still looking for where I was born?" about why she wanted to stay on the island.


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

GDG76 said:


> I'm betting [Ben] doesn't [know that Jin is still alive].. but, this is the ONLY thing that could ever get her back to the island...


Especially considering she's already left the baby at home with her mom and probably isn't convinced that she'd be able to get back from the island again if she goes.

Which brings me back to my earlier point... if the mere presence or absence on the island of the O-6 is the cause of the time-flashing, wouldn't it follow that once they go back, they can never leave? In fact, didn't someone say something to that effect already? Ben to Jack perhaps? I may be confused on that detail. But I definitely think there's more to it than the mere fact that they left. As in, something has to happen that can't happen unless all of them are there.


----------



## Cindy1230 (Oct 31, 2003)

I find it very curious that only Juliet knew about Ajira (which is Hindi for island or isle, thanks again lostpedia!)....Wasn't there something about the others building a runway, or was that on the other island nearby?


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Cindy1230 said:


> I find it very curious that only Juliet knew about Ajira (which is Hindi for island or isle, thanks again lostpedia!)....Wasn't there something about the others building a runway, or was that on the other island nearby?


Yeah, I think that's what Sawyer and Kate were supposedly breaking rocks for. Definitely on the "Other" island.


----------



## supham (Jan 15, 2003)

On the Ajira Airways video there is a split second view of a guy holding up a sign that has 316 on it.. hmmmmm


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

It was interesting seeing things unfold in light of the scene they showed us in the "Previously On Lost" segment with Claire's mom. I kept thinking that either they were giving away the fact that she was the client, or they showed us that scene only to deceive us. I guess it turned out that they only partially deceived us. I was thinking that either of the two possibilities seemed unlikely, but I hadn't quite pieced everything together until she answered the motel door for Jack.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

wprager said:


> No, I had read a review that said the baby was not asian, and I wondered if it had red hair and blue eyes. However checking back, the baby was very likely asian. That said, how old is Miles? He looks like he's in his late 20s, early 30s, so not old enough to be Chang's baby.


Do we know when the orientation videos were shot and when the hatches were constructed? Weren't we thinking mid 70s? Let's not forget that in Lost time, it's January 2005, so if Miles is 30, he was born in 1974/5. Seems to fit just fine to me.


jeff125va said:


> Which brings me back to my earlier point... if the mere presence or absence on the island of the O-6 is the cause of the time-flashing, wouldn't it follow that once they go back, they can never leave? In fact, didn't someone say something to that effect already? Ben to Jack perhaps? I may be confused on that detail. But I definitely think there's more to it than the mere fact that they left. As in, something has to happen that can't happen unless all of them are there.


Yes, Ben told Jack to pack anything he would like to have with him, otherwise he's never going to see it again, or something like that.


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

DevdogAZ said:


> Do we know when the orientation videos were shot and when the hatches were constructed? Weren't we thinking mid 70s? Let's not forget that in Lost time, it's January 2005, so if Miles is 30, he was born in 1974/5. Seems to fit just fine to me.
> 
> Yes, Ben told Jack to pack anything he would like to have with him, otherwise he's never going to see it again, or something like that.


I remember the copyright date on the first orientation film we ever saw was 1980. For the station that we all call "the hatch."

Yeah, I thought so. If that implies what it seems to, does that mean Sun will have to choose between Jin and their baby? (rhetorical question really, we don't know for sure that Ben intends to take them there with no chance of ever coming back again)


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

aindik said:


> Your image link is broken:
> 
> 
> 
> ...





gchance said:


> Guys, look at this opening. The baby doesn't look Asian to me.


Actually, the baby looks mixed (Dr. Chang's wife might also be mixed).
The producers probably cast a local baby who is Hawaiian.
The baby looks similar to my nieces and nephew at that age and they are one quarter Chinese.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

I have a hard time discerning the actual hair color with the lighting there, but that and the eye color are not particularly conclusive of anything. Many (most?) babies are born with blue eyes. The melanin doesn't get in there right away. Maybe after 6 months or so they would darken.


----------



## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Guys I think the only thing that we can gather from that photo or that scene even is that Dr. Chang had a baby on the island.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

vertigo235 said:


> Guys I think the only thing that we can gather from that photo or that scene even is that Dr. Chang had a baby on the island.


Well, he also has very _Western_ tastes in music.


----------



## DVDerek (Sep 30, 2002)

xuxa said:


> I would say the chances are good
> 
> Ajira Airways


Ok folks. I've done some digging. I noticed there was a "sample boarding pass" you could print. I thought that was odd. Later, when poking around the site I found under the Island Adventures heading on the Adventures page that they provide origami instructions to keep kids entertained on the plane. They suggest using your boarding pass.

I spent 20 minutes doing this, of course. The result? It highlights GUM as the destination airport. So now I'm thinking I can get more details by actually BOOKING a flight. So I went to the book a flight page.

Destination Destiny must be the flight type I want, don't you think? LAX is my from, Guam is my destination. It says it's booking flights through 1/21/09, so I'm thinking that should be the date. So the question is - how many people? 5 Adults and 1 Kid (just the O6)? Do they book a ticket for the dead body? Does ben go? Do I need a promotion code? What flight number?

I feel like there's more easter eggs here. How do I get to them!?!?!


----------



## Paperboy2003 (Mar 30, 2004)

Wow...you have a lot of free time!


----------



## stellie93 (Feb 25, 2006)

flyers088 said:


> I agree with the whole Ben being the mastermind behind the whole thing. What would Whidmore have to gain from hurting the O6?


I assumed that Widmore was following the 6 and watching them so that he could follow them when they go back--that he thinks Ben and the Others can find the island and he can't. Since Sayid has killed a bunch of guys who may be working for Widmore, that could be why they would attack him. I think the trick with Kate was the only one Ben was behind. (Probably wrong)

I keep expecting Aaron to DO something. Like Walt when he was young. There has to be something weird about him.

Sun could blame Ben because he caused the boat to be blown up by killing Keamy. But how would she know that? Only Locke knew.

It looked to me like more than 16 years difference in age between the 2 Rouseau's. I wish they'd used the same actress and just "youthened" her a little. I assumed she was in her 30's when she came to the island.

Can we deduce that, since Daniel says bloody noses depend on how long you've been on the island, that Charlotte has been there wayyyyy longer than Miles, and Miles longer than Juliet? We know Juliet's been there 3 years. And 3 years wasn't enough for "otherness" to rub off and keep her from being affected.


----------



## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

martylamb said:


> An Incinerator.





DVDerek said:


> .......I feel like there's more easter eggs here. How do I get to them!?!?!


From Lostpedia:



> Flight type: One Way
> From: Los Angeles, CA
> To: Guam
> Departing: 1/21/2009
> ...


Note, I had trouble getting it to work. But the key was selecting 1/21 from the calendar and not directly typing it in. This then gives you the flights to choose from.


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

hefe said:


> I have a hard time discerning the actual hair color with the lighting there, but that and the eye color are not particularly conclusive of anything. Many (most?) babies are born with blue eyes. The melanin doesn't get in there right away. Maybe after 6 months or so they would darken.


This baby, it appears, already has eyes that are not blue. Charlotte's eyes are blue. Doesn't that, plus your statement that babies' eyes usually change from blue to not blue, counsel against the baby being Charlotte?


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

vertigo235 said:


> Guys I think the only thing that we can gather from that photo or that scene even is that Dr. Chang had a baby on the island.


That depends on your definition of "had a baby."


----------



## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

JYoung said:


> Well, he also has very _Western_ tastes in music.


Indeed, we see him putting the album "Shotgun Willie" by Willie Nelson on the turntable. This album was released in 1973. Since "The Orchid" was under construction in this scene, it's reasonable to assume it was taking place not long after 1973, say 1975 at the latest.

Even though Willie Nelson was active as a session musician and songwriter since the 50's (scoring a huge hit as a writer with "Crazy" in the early 60's, for example), his solo career had not yet taken off when this album was released. In short, "Shotgun Willie" bombed in 1973, enjoying some popularity as a re-release later when Willie Nelson's career got its footing. (Nelson's first critical and sales success was "Red Headed Stranger" released in 1975).

So, Dr. Chang was apparently a fan of someone who was, at the time, a somewhat *obscure* artist, even in America.

This suggests to me that Chang is intended to be Asian-American, as opposed to Asian-Asian.

Does this have any profound meaning to our story?

Probably not.


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## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

aindik said:


> That depends on your definition of "had a baby."


He "had a baby" in his hands


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Ok, there are little images that pop up when trying to select seats. I'll link rather than post in case it is considered spoilerish:

http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/lostpedia/images/7/7d/Ajira_argclues.jpg

Based on this, I would think that there is a Dharma station somewhere offisland and that will help the losties get back........


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

aindik said:


> This baby, it appears, already has eyes that are not blue. Charlotte's eyes are blue. Doesn't that, plus your statement that babies' eyes usually change from blue to not blue, counsel against the baby being Charlotte?


I didn't remember whether the eyes were blue in the episode. I can't tell what color they are from the picture I looked at on this monitor. I was going off the statement that somebody had read that the baby had blue eyes and that was a clue of who it might be. My only point was that blue eyes in a baby are inconclusive to say that it is a blue-eyed adult.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

hefe said:


> I didn't remember whether the eyes were blue in the episode. I can't tell what color they are from the picture I looked at on this monitor. I was going off the statement that somebody had read that the baby had blue eyes and that was a clue of who it might be. My only point was that blue eyes in a baby are inconclusive to say that it is a blue-eyed adult.


The eyes in the screenshot look brown to me. But what do I know. I'm red-green colorblind.


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

Ok first of all, I'm even more stunned I missed the numbers on the radio, they're very clear now..

Second, there ate six people in Danielle's team, based on the scene at the beach. Montand is the blond guy with a blue denim vest. Robert has black hair and is standing next to him. In front, next to Robert, is Brennan (according to their conversation in the rain), who also has black hair. Danielle is in the front on the right.

That leaves two other people - another girl (reddish hair), and a guy with a goatee.

Now I want to dig out the DVDs and go watch the first Danielle episode again.


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## Cindy1230 (Oct 31, 2003)

Jeff Keegan.... don't look if you don't want to be spoiled... 
or maybe someone else can...i already deleted the episode.

but i'm wondering those other two you mentioned...



jkeegan said:


> That leaves two other people - another girl (reddish hair), and a guy with a goatee.


Are they in these pictures?



jlb said:


> Ok, there are little images that pop up when trying to select seats. I'll link rather than post in case it is considered spoilerish:
> 
> http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/lostpedia/images/7/7d/Ajira_argclues.jpg
> 
> Based on this, I would think that there is a Dharma station somewhere offisland and that will help the losties get back........


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## latrobe7 (May 1, 2005)

Cindy1230 said:


> Are they in these pictures?


No.


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

Cindy1230 said:


> Jeff Keegan.... don't look if you don't want to be spoiled...
> or maybe someone else can...i already deleted the episode.
> 
> but i'm wondering those other two you mentioned...
> ...


Thanks for the concern!

I'd actually looked at that picture link earlier so nothing was spoiled.. Back then I thought the guy might be one of them..


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## DVDerek (Sep 30, 2002)

jlb said:


> From Lostpedia:
> 
> Note, I had trouble getting it to work. But the key was selecting 1/21 from the calendar and not directly typing it in. This then gives you the flights to choose from.


I eventually got there by just viewing the source of the site and finding the flash file it was redirecting to if you got it "right". Some interesting data in there including (spoilerized for folks who don't want the results of this easter egg hunt the producers clearly want people to go on):



Spoiler



two new faces a new darma station. So the two new people are probably 2 of the 10 ticketed passengers. Now how are the other 2? And why isn't Aaron booked as a child?


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## Delta13 (Jan 25, 2003)

So, the original Losties took Oceanic Air to get to the island, the O6 may take Ajira Air to get back, and Jin apparently went Korean Air when the freighter exploded to get back into the radius.  I think Devdogaz thought 48 hours had passed? His face seemed to look like it.

How long till they flash to the day of the Oceanic plane crash? You know they HAVE to. 

10 people on Ajira - the O6, plus Ben, Locke, Desmond and Penny? Or instead of Penny, maybe Lapidus instead. What a ride this season has been so far.


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## latrobe7 (May 1, 2005)

Delta13 said:


> 10 people on Ajira - the O6, plus Ben, Locke, Desmond and Penny? Or instead of Penny, maybe Lapidus instead. What a ride this season has been so far.


I think that...


Spoiler



the 10 passenger on the Ajira plane will be the O6, plus Ben, Desmond, plus two people in the spoilerish pictures mentioned a few posts above, and Frank Lapidus will be the pilot.


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## Hunter Green (Feb 22, 2002)

gchance said:


> Seeing the French group immediately made me think, "Rousseau's with them".


Me too. I thought the "reveals" after that seemed unnecessary, save, at most, as confirmation.



> I'm also starting to think that a lot of the weird things we saw happen in S1 and S2 were somehow created by the main characters, as we see them now.


I've been trying to figure out if they can be responsible for the appearance of smoke monsters, polar bears, and unnecessarily-tall Walts. (Why don't Michael and Waaaaaaaaaalt need to come back to reset things, by the way?)


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

Hunter Green said:


> Me too. I thought the "reveals" after that seemed unnecessary, save, at most, as confirmation.


+1. I knew it was going to be her from "anybody speak French?"



Hunter Green said:


> (Why don't Michael and Waaaaaaaaaalt need to come back to reset things, by the way?)


Walt should be included in this, I agree. Michael, OTOH, was blown to smithereens in last season's finale (after he did come back to play his role in resetting things).


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## DVDerek (Sep 30, 2002)

Hunter Green said:


> Me too. I thought the "reveals" after that seemed unnecessary, save, at most, as confirmation.
> 
> I've been trying to figure out if they can be responsible for the appearance of smoke monsters, polar bears, and unnecessarily-tall Walts. (Why don't Michael and Waaaaaaaaaalt need to come back to reset things, by the way?)


Michael was "released" from his duty to the island before he was blown to smithereens. The O6 were not supposed to leave.


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## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

Fool Me Twice said:


> fwiw, it's not a pontoon boat, its an outrigger canoe.




Though a pontoon boat would make for an interesting show, right?


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Based on some reading I had done related to the possible spoilerish pictures in the link I posted, I have read a theory that:



Spoiler



There may be a Dharma station at/nearby the airport which may then be used to help them get back to the Island. What state of development/completion that station is in and is still up in the air.


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

Hunter Green said:


> Me too. I thought the "reveals" after that seemed unnecessary, save, at most, as confirmation.
> 
> I've been trying to figure out if they can be responsible for the appearance of smoke monsters, polar bears, and unnecessarily-tall Walts. (Why don't Michael and Waaaaaaaaaalt need to come back to reset things, by the way?)


Oh, too bad they weren't on the other island! If Sawyer came up to that cage and saw a polar bear trapped inside, he'd probably let it out!


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## BitbyBlit (Aug 25, 2001)

stellie93 said:


> Sun could blame Ben because he caused the boat to be blown up by killing Keamy. But how would she know that? Only Locke knew.


Locke might have told Sun what happened when trying to convince her to come back to the island. Either that, or Locke told someone else, and that information eventually made it back to Sun somehow. Although, my impression is that when she told her father that she blamed two people, she hadn't seen Locke yet. But maybe she originally blamed Kate or Jack, then redirected that blame once she found out more details about why the boat blew up. I'm not sure why she doesn't blame Widmore, however, since he was the one who sent the boat with the explosives in the first place.


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## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

jkeegan said:


> Oh, too bad they weren't on the other island! If Sawyer came up to that cage and saw a polar bear trapped inside, he'd probably let it out!


This brings up a good point though.

Back in the first episode, when Sawyer was charged by the polar bear, which he shot?

That was on this island. There ARE polar bears on this island. There might even be one caged up, which Sawyer could let out...

...so it could charge Sawyer. 

Greg


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

gchance said:


> This brings up a good point though.
> 
> Back in the first episode, when Sawyer was charged by the polar bear, which he shot?
> 
> ...


LOL!


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## UTV2TiVo (Feb 2, 2005)

Polar Bears are good swimmers so it is conceivable that if one was let out of the cage on the small island that it swam to the bigger island.


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## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

UTV2TiVo said:


> Polar Bears are good swimmers so it is conceivable that if one was let out of the cage on the small island that it swam to the bigger island.


Oh forget swimming, he could ride the Dharma shark.

Greg


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## Fleegle (Jan 15, 2002)

gchance said:


> Oh forget swimming, he could ride the Dharma shark.
> 
> Greg


I was wondering what happened to the Dharma Shark when Sayid was floating on the wreckage


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## getreal (Sep 29, 2003)

hefe said:


> Many (most?) babies are born with blue eyes. The melanin doesn't get in there right away. Maybe after 6 months or so they would darken.


With a claim like that, I'd like to see some references to back it up, please. You are claiming that of all the nationalities born with black hair (and various skin colors) and have brown eyes -- started out with blue eyes??!


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## getreal (Sep 29, 2003)

Fleegle said:


> I was wondering what happened to the Dharma Shark when Sayid was floating on the wreckage


Did you mean Jin? Remember, Jin is now 16 years in the past. The shark may not have been created yet.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

getreal said:


> With a claim like that, I'd like to see some references to back it up, please. You are claiming that of all the nationalities born with black hair (and various skin colors) and have brown eyes -- started out with blue eyes??!


Perhaps you missed the word "many" that I used. Strange that you inserted the word "all." To be more clear...many babies that end up with darker eyes start with blue eyes.

In any case, Google is your friend.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

getreal said:


> Did you mean Jin? Remember, Jin is now 16 years in the past. The shark may not have been created yet.


If it's a Dharma shark, I'm pretty sure it's been created, because I'm pretty sure Dharma had been purged by 1989.


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## ct1 (Jun 27, 2003)

hefe said:


> Perhaps you missed the word "many" that I used. Strange that you inserted the word "all." To be more clear...many babies that end up with darker eyes start with blue eyes.
> 
> In any case, Google is your friend.


http://www.letmegooglethatforyou.co...blue+and+then+change+color+as+the+baby+grows?


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## Fleegle (Jan 15, 2002)

aindik said:


> If it's a Dharma shark, I'm pretty sure it's been created, because I'm pretty sure Dharma had been purged by 1989.


regardless, since they found Jin in the same time-space that our known time jumpers were occupying, I assumed that he had been jumping around in that wreckage, unconscious, just like the rest had. The shark had ample opportunity to have a Korean dinner and never did.


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## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

Fleegle said:


> regardless, since they found Jin in the same time-space that our known time jumpers were occupying, I assumed that he had been jumping around in that wreckage, unconscious, just like the rest had. The shark had ample opportunity to have a Korean dinner and never did.


Don't you watch Kenny the Shark, Fleegle? Sharks prefer sushi!!!

Greg


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## TiVotion (Dec 6, 2002)

Alright, at the risk of being beaten senseless for asking this, and potentially smeeking all over the place...

Am I missing something in the timelines now?

We have the O6 running around LA, 3 years in the future - correct? That is their "now" - and, in their "now", they are talking about having to go back to the island.

Back on the island, however - their "now" is NOT 3 years into the future. Technically they've just been wandering around a short time since the O6 left. I know they are jumping around in time now, BUT...wouldn't the O6 have to go back in time 3 years into the past to get "back to the island"?

Wait, I just confused myself even more. I'm sorry.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

TiVotion said:


> Alright, at the risk of being beaten senseless for asking this, and potentially smeeking all over the place...
> 
> Am I missing something in the timelines now?
> 
> ...


Yes, you are right that the what we've been seeing of the O6 on the mainland is three years in the future when compared with what we've been seeing on the island. Admittedly, those on the island are jumping all over the place, but in real time since the freighter blew up and Ben turned the wheel, it's only been a couple of days.

However, as to your other question, we have not seen any indication that would tell us how the O6 will get back, or when they'll have to go back to, if at all. But it's a pretty good bet that either the island crew is going to jump three years into the future, or the O6 is somehow going to jump back three years. Otherwise, they wouldn't be showing us these apparently concurrent storylines.


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## Fleegle (Jan 15, 2002)

gchance said:


> Don't you watch Kenny the Shark, Fleegle? Sharks prefer sushi!!!
> 
> Greg


Kenny the Shark? Never heard of it...

Googling.....

Oh, a Discovery Kids show. No kids here.


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## Fleegle (Jan 15, 2002)

DevdogAZ said:


> Yes, you are right that the what we've been seeing of the O6 on the mainland is three years in the future when compared with what we've been seeing on the island. Admittedly, those on the island are jumping all over the place, but in real time since the freighter blew up and Ben turned the wheel, it's only been a couple of days.
> 
> However, as to your other question, we have not seen any indication that would tell us how the O6 will get back, or when they'll have to go back to, if at all. But it's a pretty good bet that either the island crew is going to jump three years into the future, or the O6 is somehow going to jump back three years. Otherwise, they wouldn't be showing us these apparently concurrent storylines.


Yea, time travel makes relative time references like 3 year *later* weird to pin down. I take it as 3 years in real-world time since the O6 left the island. To Ben, it's not been nearly that long. I'm sure that he moved forward in time when he turned the wheel, but I was never too clear on HOW far he moved ahead. me may have been off the island for up to 18 months or so relative to when time he turned the wheel...


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## rondotcom (Feb 13, 2005)

DevdogAZ said:


> Yes, you are right that the what we've been seeing of the O6 on the mainland is three years in the future when compared with what we've been seeing on the island. Admittedly, those on the island are jumping all over the place, but in real time since the freighter blew up and Ben turned the wheel, it's only been a couple of days.
> 
> However, as to your other question, we have not seen any indication that would tell us how the O6 will get back, or when they'll have to go back to, if at all. But it's a pretty good bet that either the island crew is going to jump three years into the future, or the O6 is somehow going to jump back three years. Otherwise, they wouldn't be showing us these apparently concurrent storylines.


Potential smeek... didn't we discover that time on the island is doifferent relative to time off the island. (The device Daniel had fired to the island arrived at a time different than it should have)


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## ebf (Mar 21, 2005)

Where are Rose and Benard??? They were there after the first flash. Where are they now?


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

ebf said:


> Where are Rose and Benard??? They were there after the first flash. Where are they now?


They're still there. They just don't have as much to do, plot-wise, so they don't get the screen time.

Maybe later we'll see what happened when the groups split up.


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## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

ebf said:


> Where are Rose and Benard??? They were there after the first flash. Where are they now?


They're wherever they always are, just sort of wandering around until they happen to stumble on Hurley doing laundry or Jin building a raft.

Seriously though, the producers said last week that they're fine, that we're just not seeing them right now.

Greg


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## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

I found WAAAAAAAAALT!

He's chillin' in 2009, telling his friend, "Dude, I'm HUNGRY!" in a Tyson Anytizers commercial.

I couldn't find the commercial online, but I did find a post someone made on a Lost forum that made me chuckle:



> Oh my God - Tall Ghost Walt is now Prepackaged Frozen Chicken Wing Walt! Seriously, I just saw Malcolm David Kelley in a commercial for Tyson "Anytizers" boneless chicken wings.
> 
> I thought it was a little sad that he was doing a commercial. Then it occurred to me: maybe Anytizers are Walt's constant.
> 
> Yeah, let's go with that.


Greg


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## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

DevdogAZ said:


> The "weather report" section the front page seems to cycle through locations that have been featured in the story so far, including Tustin, CA, where Locke is from, and Ames, IA which I think is where Kate is from. However, it's interesting that London is not on there, and I'm not yet sure what Mexico City, Rome and Tokyo have to do with the story.


Was one of Sayid's hits in Italy? The one on the golf course?


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## Delta13 (Jan 25, 2003)

mqpickles said:


> Was one of Sayid's hits in Italy? The one on the golf course?


That was in the Seychelles, in the Indian Ocean.


Mexico City - why not how Kate smuggles herself out of the country? Mexico.
Rome - maybe Ben knows the Pope, gets Hugo a Papal Sin Pass.
Tokyo - after the Smoke Monster encounters the H-Bomb, it takes off to go destroy the city. Hey, it's tradition.


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## brermike (Jun 1, 2006)

rondotcom said:


> Potential smeek... didn't we discover that time on the island is doifferent relative to time off the island. (The device Daniel had fired to the island arrived at a time different than it should have)


No, actually time transpires the same on and off the island. The Oceanic 6 were rescuef 108 days after the crash of 815 and they had experienced all 108 days of that time. There is a time discrepancy coming from and going to the island on the wrong bearing (eg Daniel's experiment, the helicopter with Sayid and Desmond, and the doctor from the freighter washing ashore).


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## betts4 (Dec 27, 2005)

gchance said:


> I found WAAAAAAAAALT!
> 
> He's chillin' in 2009, telling his friend, "Dude, I'm HUNGRY!" in a Tyson Anytizers commercial.
> 
> ...


http://www.tyson.com/Consumer/Products/Promotions/Anytizers.aspx


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

TiVotion said:


> .......That is their "now" .......


Excuse me.....this is a Lost thread not an American Idol thread......


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## BeanMeScot (Apr 17, 2002)

Fool Me Twice said:


> Wouldn't his rope go with him? The other jumpers don't jump without their clothes. And what rules determine which objects jump with you? I thought for a moment while they were in the middle of the jump on the pontoon boat, that they'd find themselves swimming.


I was waiting for the boat to disappear, too.



xuxa said:


> I would say the chances are good
> 
> Ajira Airways





UTV2TiVo said:


> Polar Bears are good swimmers so it is conceivable that if one was let out of the cage on the small island that it swam to the bigger island.





gchance said:


> Oh forget swimming, he could ride the Dharma shark.
> 
> Greg


Speaking of Sharks and Polar Bears, how about this page from Ajira.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

jkeegan said:


> Hey.. has Vincent been jumping around through time with them?





Fool Me Twice said:


> Wouldn't his rope go with him? The other jumpers don't jump without their clothes. And what rules determine which objects jump with you? I thought for a moment while they were in the middle of the jump on the pontoon boat, that they'd find themselves swimming.


I see some folks are thinking the reason the rope was there was because it didn't flash with Vincent..
I was thinking it wasn't with him because something bad has happened to him.

Same end result, completely different cause.

Diane


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

http://www.ajiraairways.com/adventures

OK. I get it all now. It's all some big Total Recall-esque thing. They all had they're backstories and all, and their inner demons. But they boarded a plane, all were drugged, and are living an implanted memory now.

Pretty soon Hurley will probably yell "Get your ahhhhhhs to Maaaaaaaaahrs!"


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## Delta13 (Jan 25, 2003)

BeanMeScot said:


> I was waiting for the boat to disappear, too.
> 
> Speaking of Sharks and Polar Bears, how about this page from Ajira.


My favorite part is about the "bleached beasts that are native to the southern hemisphere". Too bad normal polar bears are only found in the Arctic. And they rarely use bleach.


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## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

jlb said:


> Pretty soon Hurley will probably yell "Get your ahhhhhhs to Maaaaaaaaahrs!"


Dude. Get your ahhhhhhhs to Maaaaaaaahrs, dude.

Greg


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Fleegle said:


> Yea, time travel makes relative time references like 3 year *later* weird to pin down. I take it as 3 years in real-world time since the O6 left the island. To Ben, it's not been nearly that long. I'm sure that he moved forward in time when he turned the wheel, but I was never too clear on HOW far he moved ahead. me may have been off the island for up to 18 months or so relative to when time he turned the wheel...


It's been discussed a couple of times, but Ben turned the wheel in Jan. 2005 and ended up in Tunisia in Oct. 2005. As far as we know, the O6 stuff happening this season is roughly Jan. 2008.


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## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

DevdogAZ said:


> It's been discussed a couple of times, but Ben turned the wheel in Jan. 2005 and ended up in Tunisia in Oct. 2005. As far as we know, the O6 stuff happening this season is roughly Jan. 2008.


And while it may be 3 years later in the real world, there's nothing to say that when they go back onto the island they don't end up about 3 years in the past.


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## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

< 16 hours left! (at least for us East coast people)


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

DevdogAZ said:


> Yes, you are right that the what we've been seeing of the O6 on the mainland is three years in the future when compared with what we've been seeing on the island. Admittedly, those on the island are jumping all over the place, but in real time since the freighter blew up and Ben turned the wheel, it's only been a couple of days.
> 
> However, as to your other question, we have not seen any indication that would tell us how the O6 will get back, or when they'll have to go back to, if at all. But it's a pretty good bet that either the island crew is going to jump three years into the future, or the O6 is somehow going to jump back three years. Otherwise, they wouldn't be showing us these apparently concurrent storylines.


I think you have ot factor Ben's lines like "the window is closing" or whatever he said. My guess is Ben knows damn well how often the jumps will be and how far forward. My guess is he has to time the effort to get back at a specific window when the Island has jumped into the timeline of the O6.

I am not a physicist, but if we take one classic view of the space/time line/continuum, to travel in time is not doing a linear action but instead is a folding of space/time. If that were the case, then I am sure Farraday, Ben, and those inovlved known exactly how the Donkey Wheel, Failsafe Key, etc will effect the continuum and thus allow him to known when the Island will move and to when in time.

I may be off my rocker, but we're allowed to be this way with the Lost threads.


----------

