# Apple+TiVo relationship



## TiVoCanada (Sep 18, 2005)

Hello.
"Apple will be licensing TiVo patented technology for iTV." also the name iTV has been changed to "Mac Media Capsule"

can someone confirm this news?


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## shady (May 31, 2002)

TiVoCanada said:


> Hello.
> "Apple will be licensing TiVo patented technology for iTV." also the name iTV has been changed to "Mac Media Capsule"
> 
> can someone confirm this news?


Seeing as you're the one who brought it up - why don't YOU confirm your quote - sources please


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## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

It is running on PVR Blog.


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## TydalForce (Feb 9, 2006)

I vote no. I follow the Apple rumour sites pretty closely, and haven't seen ANYTHING about a partnership with TiVo. 

And given the way Apple tends to work, they don't often use another company's product when its realistic for them to design/build their own.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

This could make some sense though. I have said all along that Apple has no desire to be in the DVR business as they would rather open up more business for the iTunes download business model with the iTV. But like PVR blog says, most people will want more than downloads if they are putting a device in their entertainment cabinet. So why not just contract to someone with obvious expertise in DVRs to add that function and let the Apple developers stick to their core competence as well, which includes making and selling the hardware.

I for one would welcome the new iTV overlord if it did DVR functions with an interface licensed from TiVo. :up:


*disclaimer - I only heard about this in this thread so it may well just be a wild rumor but Apple would hold such a pernership pretty tight to the vest, I would think.


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## Justin Thyme (Mar 29, 2005)

An amazing number of things are discussed within companies such as Apple. Some of my university buddies worked there, and it seems to me, they had at least 2X the number of cool ideas floating around. 

A lot of that talk can slip out. You mention something about where you are going on a business trip to your wife, the gals get chatty and another denmother repeats it to her hubbie...

And a lot of them turn into projects that never see the light of day. It seems to be a popular pastime to murder infants in their cradles at high tech companies. 

So I would guess that a lot of these rumors you see on these gossip sites actually have been talked about. The question is, which ones actually made it to a project, which will the leadership murder, and which ones will they launch? Even people internally don't know for sure. 

Predict what stevie will do. Just try.


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## TydalForce (Feb 9, 2006)

I'll be at the keynote this year, so I'll be among the first to know ;-}

I'd LOVE to see a partnership between Apple and TiVo - and it would be a great thing for TiVo. But I somehow don't see Apple doing it.

Given Apple's history, they'd either buy TiVo (I don't think that's likely) or build their own solution (like the iTV). But anything's posssible


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

TiVoCanada said:


> can someone confirm this news?


Not going to happen.



TydalForce said:


> I'll be at the keynote this year, so I'll be among the first to know ;-}


You and everyone reading Engadet.


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## peteypete (Feb 3, 2004)

davezatz said:


> Not going to happen.
> 
> You and everyone reading Engadet.


What makes you so confident Dave?


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## mportuesi (Nov 11, 2002)

peteypete said:


> What makes you so confident Dave?


Dave's confident because that's just not Apple's MO.

Quick - name the last product Apple introduced that was developed in partnership with another well-known tech company. (No, the Nike+iPod doesn't count).

If Apple _were_ to include DVR functionality in their iTV product, they'd probably buy up ElGato, the company who already builds a DVR solution that runs on the Mac OS, and integrate those features into their OS and home media applications such as Front Row.


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## shady (May 31, 2002)

ZeoTiVo said:


> <snip> Apple has no desire to be in the DVR business as they would rather open up more business for the iTunes download business model with the iTV. <snip>


I agree fully with this statement. They have a proven business model, people will pay for downloads.



ZeoTiVo said:


> <Snip>So why not just contract to someone with obvious expertise in DVRs to add that function and let the Apple developers stick to their core competence as well, which includes making and selling the hardware. <Snip>


It doesn't matter who actually writes the code, if Apple pushed this feature, it would hurt their download business. Downloads work because it's convenient, but if you make it more convenient to get the content for free then that's a problem.

In the end, the quality and quantity of what is available for download should surpass what is available from broadcast. The question is, what happens in the meantime.


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## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

davezatz said:


> Not going to happen.


No, he was looking for someone to _confirm _ the rumor.

TiVo has to hook up with someone. They put out a Press Release  about MSFT a year ago. That's died as far as anyone can tell. So no Apple rumor  is going to get my blood up.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

HDTiVo said:


> No, he was looking for someone to _confirm _ the rumor.


He called it 'news.' 



> TiVo has to hook up with someone.


TiVo may have to hook up with someone... Apple doesn't.


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## TiVoCanada (Sep 18, 2005)

its now on digg front page i hope more details come out soon


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

TiVoCanada said:


> its now on digg front page i hope more details come out soon


There are no more details. That story was written by my buddy Davis Freeberg and is based on the email PVRBlog received. Sure TiVo could license it's patents, but you will never see a TiVo GUI/OS on an Apple product. I'll buy you a case of beer if I'm wrong.


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## TiVoCanada (Sep 18, 2005)

Free Beer! cant wait thanks DAVE


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## TydalForce (Feb 9, 2006)

TiVo and Apple have a lot in common, if you look at the design of their products and strong community following, etc. When I was unboxing my Series3, i couldn't help but think how similar it was to unboxing an Apple product. 

Apple wants the living room. They're going after it, first with the Airport Express and now with the iTV. If they wanted a DVR solution, they would have just bought up TiVo and been done with it. But Apple's focusing on the iTunes Store, and pushing TiVos won't help (and would possibly hurt). 

If a partnership *does* happen, it'll be well after the iTV's release. It would be awesome to be able to buy a video from the iTunes Store and stream it over-network to the TiVo. But since that woudl compete with the iTV, ... 

Still, I'm hopeful we'll see something fun happen between then!


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## Johncv (Jun 11, 2002)

This came from Yahoo

http://biz.yahoo.com/seekingalpha/061206/21872_id.html?.v=1&quicken=2


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## TydalForce (Feb 9, 2006)

and the rumour continues! 

Maybe if we spread the rumour enough, it'll HAVE to become true! Hell, someone at TiVo and someone at Apple will think there really is a partnership, and they'll start doing it just because of the rumours!

CUPERTINO, CA - Apple Computer today announced a new network streaming and DVR device, introducing a partnership with TiVo, Inc. Surprisingly, nobody knows where it came from. "We weren't planning this" commented Steve Jobs, CEO of Apple. "Just one day, there it was rolling out the door. Apple's come out with some insanely great products lately, but I'm extremely proud of everybody for coming out with such an amazing product without any planning." 

"What the hell are you talking about?" responded Tom Rogers, CEO of TiVo. "I've heard the rumors same as anyone else, but nobody here has really heard anything about it. Regardless, I'm glad to now be working with Apple on developing a product that we've already released."


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

Johncv said:


> This came from Yahoo
> 
> http://biz.yahoo.com/seekingalpha/061206/21872_id.html?.v=1&quicken=2


Same story. Davis saw PVRBlog article and wrote up his thoughts. Seeking Alpha syndicates his stuff, which in turn is syndicated by Yahoo Finance. It all started with the email Matt got. No new or additional information from other sources has surfaced yet.


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## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

TydalForce said:


> Apple wants the living room. They're going after it, first with the Airport Express and now with the iTV. If they wanted a DVR solution, they would have just bought up TiVo and been done with it. But Apple's focusing on the iTunes Store, and pushing TiVos won't help (and would possibly hurt).


A lot of people express the opinion that DVR technology competes with iTunes downloads, and therefore Apple won't have anything to do with it. I think that is an unnecessarily narrow view of what is an undefined emerging market. Limiting your product and services to a single mode of consumption is a recipe for becoming irrelevant. Microsoft is offering DVR, movie downloads, internet downloads, etc. TiVo is working on these things as well, as are any number of companies. If Apple limits themselves to a box that can only play things from the iTunes store, they are going to be left behind. iTunes and iPods are so popular because they work with music from any source, not just iTunes. If Apple wants to be in the living room media biz, they'd better come up with an insanely great media box before everyone else does.


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## peteypete (Feb 3, 2004)

davezatz said:


> There are no more details. That story was written by my buddy Davis Freeberg and is based on the email PVRBlog received. Sure TiVo could license it's patents, but you will never see a TiVo GUI/OS on an Apple product. I'll buy you a case of beer if I'm wrong.


oooh.. can I get a case of free beer too if it's true? Might as well try!

Someone should partner with Tivo because the TivoCast thing is pretty damn close to being right for movie downloads. Just add a way to "buy" individual downloads and were there. Season pass can be used to integrate a nefliquesqe queue.

I'd also add, that although aapl has proven that song downloads is profitable, it has yet to do so with video due to the fact that the studios have a stronger hand in that arena.


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## TydalForce (Feb 9, 2006)

I definitely see the iTV playing any video that QuickTime can play. I don't think it'll be restricted to iTunes-purchased video at all.

And therefore, perfectly capable of playing anything downloaded from BitTorrent, recorded with a TV Tuner, recorded by your own camcorder, etc.

What I'm doubting is that it'll partner with TiVo, and even that it'll have its own TV tuner.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

So Apple might pay some licensing fees to use some TiVo patents? And all of this based on an anonymous email. Wow, I'm so excited.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

That writer needs to learn the difference between compliment and complement. I discount writers who can't even use grammar properly.


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## frommage (Jan 27, 2005)

Does anyone think this might have something to do with it?

The guys at DigitalDroplet.net, developers of the beautiful, Front-Row-like, AudioFaucet HME app (which lets you use your TiVo to control and play music via iTunes) say they're working on "another major HME related project", but won't reveal what it is. Nondisclosure agreement, maybe?

I dunno - could it be the missing link between TiVo and Apple?

See: 
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=321611


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

peteypete said:


> oooh.. can I get a case of free beer too if it's true? Might as well try!


Sure! Let's make the time frame 2007. The bet is Apple will not have a TiVo GUI/OS. They may license patents for their own stuff, but that's not very interesting by itself.

I did have a brief exchange with Davis and he made an interesting point in response to my comment that there is 0% chance of this happening. He said we probably would have guessed there was 0% chance of Apple supporting Microsoft Windows prior to Bootcamp. Very good point, so I guess anything is possible. But I doubt it.



mattack said:


> That writer needs to learn the difference between compliment and complement. I discount writers who can't even use grammar properly.


I'm sure my grammar and spelling are poor. Hopefully the content helps overcome my shortcomings as a writer. I was actually thinking I should take a journalism class at the local community college, though someone told me I probably wouldn't learn anything. Not that I have any free time, anyway.  Maybe there should be a community editorial group who helps us bloggers -- it's hard to proof your own stuff and there's generally only time/interest for one draft. I was amazed at the PC Mag editing process, they way the tore everything apart, reassembled differently, and generally made us sound better in just a few hours.



frommage said:


> Does anyone think this might have something to do with it?
> 
> The guys at DigitalDroplet.net, developers of the beautiful, Front-Row-like, AudioFaucet HME app (which lets you use your TiVo to control and play music via iTunes) say they're working on "another major HME related project", but won't reveal what it is. Nondisclosure agreement, maybe?
> 
> I dunno - could it be the missing link between TiVo and Apple?


Kyle and partner have made themselves experts in HME and the inner-workings of iTunes. It would be nice to see them profit from their knowledge and hard work. (Say if TiVo and/or Apple have contracted them on a project.)



Johncv said:


> This came from Yahoo
> 
> http://biz.yahoo.com/seekingalpha/061206/21872_id.html?.v=1&quicken=2


And this came from Reuters! Though they need to do a little formatting of the text and hyperlink where appropriate. Oh well, I'm glad I can contribute to the rumor mill. 

http://today.reuters.com/News/Artic...osCc5gQ5BzJASogoqhN9CzCpIlNnPKhwdB92UWmUKM6RT


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## classicX (May 10, 2006)

ZeoTiVo said:


> I for one would welcome the new iTV overlord if it did DVR functions with an interface licensed from TiVo. :up:


As many of you know, I have been pretty outspoken about the lack of features vs. the high price on the S3.

Let me be the first to say: If there were an Apple-written module in the Tivo software that would allow me to access my entire iTunes music library (watch videos, play music, purchase from the iTunes store, etc.), I would GLADLY have forked over $800 on day 1.

Even without MRV for DVR stuff.


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## lombard (Dec 6, 2001)

Seems to me that the iTV would make a perfect TiVo media extender thing. Just a box to plug in to a second TV that plays content from your existing TiVo via MRV protocols.

I'd love to have access to all my TiVo shows on a second TV, but I don't want a second TiVo or a second TiVo subscription.

Also wouldn't hurt if TiVo stream iTunes protected content from my computer.


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## TydalForce (Feb 9, 2006)

lombard said:


> I'd love to have access to all my TiVo shows on a second TV, but I don't want a second TiVo or a second TiVo subscription.


Which is why it won't happen; TiVo needs the subscription revenue

Any kind of partnership is more likely to be TiVo boxes playing content from iTunes (or something similar)


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

lombard said:


> Seems to me that the iTV would make a perfect TiVo media extender thing. Just a box to plug in to a second TV that plays content from your existing TiVo via MRV protocols.
> 
> I'd love to have access to all my TiVo shows on a second TV, but I don't want a second TiVo or a second TiVo subscription.
> 
> Also wouldn't hurt if TiVo stream iTunes protected content from my computer.


What would be in it for TiVo to do such a thing? They make money off of multiple TiVo househoulds (especially w/ the new price plans). Streaming video to a Apple device doesn't seem very profitable to them.

Plus, the market for TiVo owners who want to stream to an Applie iTV device would be pretty small.


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## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

davezatz said:


> I was actually thinking I should take a journalism class at the local community college, though someone told me I probably wouldn't learn anything.


You'd learn how to make what you right worthless, for what that's worth.


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## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

rainwater said:


> What would be in it for TiVo to do such a thing? They make money off of multiple TiVo househoulds (especially w/ the new price plans). Streaming video to a Apple device doesn't seem very profitable to them.
> 
> Plus, the market for TiVo owners who want to stream to an Applie iTV device would be pretty small.


They sell lots more TiVoes because they have far more utility. Then they raise the service fee to $22.95. 

But, yes, much better if they go with streaming to MSFT based media extenders.


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## TiVoCanada (Sep 18, 2005)

macmediacapsule.com is registered but whois dosnt say to whom...


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## edc (Mar 24, 2002)

www.macmediacapsule.com goes to godaddy.


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## chedzo (Aug 28, 2005)

do a whois, it was registered yesterday, obviously as a result of the rumor. geez, one little email to a blogger sure is getting a lot of mileage. it shows how starved we all are for some positive 'news'.


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## TiVoCanada (Sep 18, 2005)

why dosnt tivo just confirm this on there blog?


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

TiVoCanada said:


> why dosnt tivo just confirm this on there blog?


You're starting to sound like a Yahoo stock pumper.



edc said:


> www.macmediacapsule.com goes to godaddy.


I heard Apple and TiVo are buying GoDaddy.


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## TiVoCanada (Sep 18, 2005)

I sound like a person who wants a S3 but wont buy one if Apple makes the same thing...I had plans to buy a S3 for christmas but now im holding off till jan9


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

TiVoCanada said:


> I sound like a person who wants a S3 but wont buy one if Apple makes the same thing...I had plans to buy a S3 for christmas but now im holding off till jan9


If it helps your decision making process, getting CableLabs certifications (to offer CableCARDs) is a many month process. No one's heard a peep out of Apple. So even if they do offer some sort of DVR, it won't dual tune digital cable and would require a cable box. (Obviously OTA ATSC is free for the taking.)


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## TiVoCanada (Sep 18, 2005)

TiVo should confirm this its gonna hurt there christmas sales...


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## mportuesi (Nov 11, 2002)

I think if you are expecting the Apple iTV to be a DVR, or to integrate with someone else's DVR, you're going to be disappointed.


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## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

TiVoCanada said:


> TiVo should confirm this its gonna hurt there christmas sales...


It isn't going to hurt sales because of the few people who know about it, extremely few believe it, and even fewer care. It's a vague rumor from an unknown source that has absolutely no credibility at this point. A person would have to be a complete idiot to alter his Christmas plans based on an anonymous email sent to a blogger.

Neither TiVo nor Apple comment on rumors so, even if there were some truth to the story, you wouldn't hear about if from the companies until they make an announcement.

Give it a rest already.


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## TydalForce (Feb 9, 2006)

ChuckyBox said:


> Give it a rest already.


It's much more fun to speculate wildly, and tell everyone else they're wrong! Don't spoil the fun! TiVo + Apple will do that for us just fine... lol


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## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

davezatz said:


> If it helps your decision making process, getting CableLabs certifications (to offer CableCARDs) is a many month process. No one's heard a peep out of Apple. So even if they do offer some sort of DVR, it won't dual tune digital cable and would require a cable box. (Obviously OTA ATSC is free for the taking.)


I suspect that Apple would more likely go the same route as MSFT - have the computer integrate CC slots and QAM tuners.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

HDTiVo said:


> I suspect that Apple would more likely go the same route as MSFT - have the computer integrate CC slots


Which would require CableLabs approval, btw.


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## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

rainwater said:


> Which would require CableLabs approval, btw.


of course.


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