# The Good Wife Season 7 Spoilers



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

Not many threads on this show, so thought I'd start a season thread. If episode threads are desired, please feel free to start them and we can let this thread die out.


11/8/2015 "Lies"

I love scheming Eli. He is just so entertaining! Did he back off on exposing the voting scandal, or did it just not happen yet?

I'm really not into anything to do with Lockhart, Agos, and whoever. But maybe the Loyola grad is going to hire Alicia and Lucca to sue them? That could be fun.

Did I say how much I love Eli?


----------



## Timbeau (May 31, 2002)

I thought that when he found out that Peter had a hand in the voting scandal that he decided not to expose it. Even though he said in an earlier episode that he wanted to destroy both Ruth and Peter, it looks like he really wants to destroy just Ruth so that Peter comes back to Eli to run his campaign.

Eli's good, but I like his daughter Marissa better. She's constantly throwing out zingers that are insightfully true.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

I love Marissa, too! They should make her and Grace besties.


----------



## NorthAlabama (Apr 19, 2012)

great episode, the pace moved nicely throughout (little filler).

the nsa surveillance office has expanded a bit since season five (love the arabic flovered pop song played during the scenes!). no series i've watched handles call backs better.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

hummingbird_206 said:


> I love Marissa, too! They should make her and Grace besties.


Me too!

The whole Grace thing as Alicia's Admin. How is she qualified to be her admin and where did she all of a sudden get those secretarial skills? And isn't she going to school?


----------



## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

Steveknj said:


> Me too!
> 
> The whole Grace thing as Alicia's Admin. How is she qualified to be her admin and where did she all of a sudden get those secretarial skills? And isn't she going to school?


She's a student, so presumably she has Word and Excel, plus some level of organizational skill. She went to a private school so we can expect her to have good English grammar and research skills. She's also loyal and motivated. The other most complicated things an admin needs to learn are the procedures specific to an office and those everyone needs to learn on the job. The only major lack she has as an admin is mature judgement and possibly discretion. She may have learned that last from experiences we've seen on the show.

She's probably a way better at the job than half the admins at Alicia's old shop. I see her only major problem as fitting her job into school, as you say.


----------



## stellie93 (Feb 25, 2006)

I loved a few episodes ago when Eli stood on a chair at the air duct and was listening to Peter and Ruth. They just showed his expressions for a minute or two--he can say so much with no words. 

Also love Ruth, of course, and the daughters. Shows like this add so many good characters and keep from getting stale and missing people who left. :up:


----------



## Nickljo (Sep 15, 2013)

I find it strange that just about anyone can go to Alicia's house and she will just answer the door without even looking.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

stellie93 said:


> I loved a few episodes ago when Eli stood on a chair at the air duct and was listening to Peter and Ruth. They just showed his expressions for a minute or two--he can say so much with no words.
> 
> Also love Ruth, of course, and the daughters. Shows like this add so many good characters and keep from getting stale and missing people who left. :up:


It's almost criminal that Alan Cumming has not won an Emmy for his portrayal of Eli Gold.


----------



## jeepair (Apr 22, 2004)

Nickljo said:


> I find it strange that just about anyone can go to Alicia's house and she will just answer the door without even looking.


Must be fun where you live, I don't think I've ever looked.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

jeepair said:


> Must be fun where you live, I don't think I've ever looked.


Live in a small town? Growing up in a city and now living in the burbs we always look. When I was growing up in a building we also always asked "Who is it?" Not really uncommon considering she lives in a big city. Plus her home now doubles as a place of business, so that's even more reason to see who's at the door before they enter.


----------



## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

Nickljo said:


> I find it strange that just about anyone can go to Alicia's house and she will just answer the door without even looking.


Well, she probably has a doorman for the building.



jeepair said:


> Must be fun where you live, I don't think I've ever looked.


I live in Los Angeles, at times in somewhat sketchy areas. Every door I've ever had here has a peephole. I can't remember ever looking through it when someone is at the door. But most women I know do check before opening the door.

IMO the reason she doesn't check before opening the door is dramatic; if she were to check it would become Chekov's peephole. As it is, every time she opens the door there's a little tension because we know she doesn't know who's there.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

ej42137 said:


> Chekov's peephole.


Chekov's peephole? Please elaborate. What is that? I never heard that term before.


----------



## Family (Jul 23, 2001)

I've previously been a fan of the show, but seriously this season has been horribly cartoonish. Alicia, wife of the governor/presidential front runner, former States Attorney elect, and former big name partner at huge prestigious firm, having to make ends meet for $150 jobs in bond court because no one will hire her. Eli, experienced political operative and person responsible for reinventing Peter to the governor's seat from jail, involved in middle school petty vendettas. And I won't even get into how ridiculous the story line of Howard VS Kerry has evolved.

I understand the show has always pushed reality, but please. Fonzie anyone?


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

I really like The Good Wife, but I can't say that I disagree with you.


----------



## Family (Jul 23, 2001)

Cainebj said:


> I really like The Good Wife, but I can't say that I disagree with you.


And I still look forward to watching it so I can't say I disagree with you.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

Timbeau said:


> I thought that when he found out that Peter had a hand in the voting scandal that he decided not to expose it. Even though he said in an earlier episode that he wanted to destroy both Ruth and Peter, it looks like he really wants to destroy just Ruth so that Peter comes back to Eli to run his campaign.


I think that's partly true, but I think he's also having some thoughts about Alicia and the voting booth scandal may affect her. He gave the tv a look while they were showing her looking on as Peter announced his candidacy that made me wonder if he's thinking that maybe Alicia would be a better candidate eventually than Peter.


----------



## Nickljo (Sep 15, 2013)

jeepair said:


> Must be fun where you live, I don't think I've ever looked.


No, I dont look but I'm not the wife of the governor. Just seems like anybody can go to her house and she will just open the door for them. But, like someone else says she probably has a doorman for that.


----------



## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

Cainebj said:


> Chekov's peephole? Please elaborate. What is that? I never heard that term before.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chekhov's_gun


----------



## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

pdhenry said:


> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chekhov's_gun


Thanks!


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

pdhenry said:


> https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chekhov's_gun


Sorry - is Chekhov's Gun the same thing as Chekhov's Peephole?
(I googled Chekhov's Peephole before I asked LOL)


----------



## Flop (Dec 2, 2005)

Cainebj said:


> Sorry - is Chekhov's Gun the same thing as Chekhov's Peephole?
> (I googled Chekhov's Peephole before I asked LOL)


The principle is the same. If they make a point of having a peephole, it needs to be used or there is no need to ever have the peephole. If you have a gun introduced in the story, it needs to be used in the story or there is no need for the gun ever to have been introduced. In a continuing TV series, guns can come and go per episode as the story demands, but a fixed object like a peephole can't just appear and disappear as needed, and it would be odd to have her use it only occasionally just to fit a particular story line. Thus, if her door had a peephole, they would have to show her quickly check it each time before opening the door.


----------



## tcorning (Nov 14, 2001)

Not everyone with a peephole uses it.

For some reason when reading the discussion, I thought instead of Schrödinger's Peephole. Until she opens the door, it could be anyone. Hopefully alive though! 

Still enjoying the show this season, though it seems more disconnected than I'd expect from this show. Almost no connection between Alicia and her old firm.

Ted


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

I liked the old Lockhart Gardner firm stuff better. I have never really liked this new law firm, not when it was just Cary and Alicia, not when Diane joined, and definitely not whatever this is this year.


----------



## efilippi (Jul 24, 2001)

Alicia jumped at taking the new case, interesting and all that, but how did she expect to get paid? Or how will she get paid? The guy can't have a lot of money and I don't see who he could sue. 

This was a good episode, though. Lots going on, even nelkkid women!


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

Yes, it's getting old, but I still laugh every time the door to Eli's office bangs into his desk.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

laria said:


> I liked the old Lockhart Gardner firm stuff better. I have never really liked this new law firm, not when it was just Cary and Alicia, not when Diane joined, and definitely not whatever this is this year.


Yeah, I think it was a mistake for the long run to basically break the connection of Alicia to Cary, Diane, et all.

I realize that the producers want to show Alicia being empowered but they still have Matt Czuchry and Christine Baranski under contract and they don't want to get rid of the Lockhart/Gardner sets.

They're trying to have their cake and eat it too and as a result, I don't think the show is as good as it used to be.


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

hummingbird_206 said:


> Yes, it's getting old, but I still laugh every time the door to Eli's office bangs into his desk.


My favorite is him stacking reams of paper to get closer to the vent.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

JYoung said:


> Yeah, I think it was a mistake for the long run to basically break the connection of Alicia to Cary, Diane, et all.
> 
> I realize that the producers want to show Alicia being empowered but they still have Matt Czuchry and Christine Baranski under contract and they don't want to get rid of the Lockhart/Gardner sets.
> 
> They're trying to have their cake and eat it too and as a result, I don't think the show is as good as it used to be.


I agree. I still like it, but it's just not the same show. It sometimes feels more like one of those ABC scandal/soaps than a legal show around a politician's wife. I like the two actors that play Eli and the new campaign manager, but their parts are cartoon like. Eli always seemed smart but this season he just seems petty and silly.


----------



## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

Steveknj said:


> I agree. I still like it, but it's just not the same show. It sometimes feels more like one of those ABC scandal/soaps than a legal show around a politician's wife. I like the two actors that play Eli and the new campaign manager, but their parts are cartoon like. Eli always seemed smart but this season he just seems petty and silly.


I like it way better; building a new, little company is a lot more fun than dealing with inter-office politics in a larger company. (I can tell you it's like that IRL as well.) I also like Alicia's new confident take-charge attitude, although how long can that last with the writers we have?


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

I wonder if they plan to put them in the white house eventually? I would kill to see Alicia as first lady.

Also loved when eli was there as they finished in the bedroom. Something like "you have a plan, don't you?" "Always."


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

Robin said:


> I wonder if they plan to put them in the white house eventually? I would kill to see Alicia as first lady.


I wondered that, too, but they seem to really be tying it into real life politics by mentioning Hillary and Bernie.

I think if they were really planning on having him win, they would have picked fictional candidates.


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

It's a long shot, but it would be so awesome to see Alicia as first lady I'm holding out hope.


----------



## Family (Jul 23, 2001)

I wonder if she would run her newest law firm out of The White House.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Well, that would stop random people from knocking on her door.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

Go Eli and Courtney! I love Vanessa Williams and Alan Cummings so having them together is great. I loved the scene in Eli's office where he had to crawl over her (basically straddle her) to get to his chair! But no Margo Martindale this ep was a bit disappointing. 

Go Grace! OK Mom, now you owe me $35K.

Now Florrick Agos opps, Florrick Quinn  are going to compete with Lockhart Agos for clients. Again. This is getting old. I guess the writers can't figure out any other way to keep the stories connected?


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

I enjoy the cast of characters, but anything to do with Chum Hum bugs me.

Loved the scene with Eli and Jason. More of those 2 together, please!


----------



## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

I noticed that they took pains to point out that in the Good Wife universe Chum Hum and Google aren't the same company.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

That's the first time I remember them doing that.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

The episode was pretty blah until the last few minutes.

Cary and Diane sure did pay back Biff and his buddies. :up:

I'm not sure what I think about Eli this episode. He sure fell in love fast. And then to confess to Alicia about the call from Will? Wow, that just seemed so out of character. But I guess if he really fell in love, then I could see him not wanting to cheat Alicia a second time. But, holy smokes! That was just shocking.


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

hummingbird_206 said:


> The episode was pretty blah until the last few minutes.
> 
> Cary and Diane sure did pay back Biff and his buddies. :up:
> 
> I'm not sure what I think about Eli this episode. He sure fell in love fast. And then to confess to Alicia about the call from Will? Wow, that just seemed so out of character. But I guess if he really fell in love, then I could see him not wanting to cheat Alicia a second time. But, holy smokes! That was just shocking.


I thought she was going to throw that glass at him.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

I thought Cary and Diane's payback was awesome - 
although I also admit I had zero idea the associates walked out - I was thinking some kind of conspiracy kidnapping plot was about to happen.

Eli. Sorry - I just don't buy him as straight. The whole story line is ludicrous.


----------



## Dawghows (May 17, 2001)

This show is slowly losing me.

Contrary to some of the posters above, I _hate_ the direction they've taken with Eli this season. He was a great character, and now he's just a cartoon. That final scene being the exception to the (new) rule, obviously.

I also have virtually zero interest in the Lockhart/Agos/Lee storylines now that Alicia is separate from them, and the contrivances of getting them somehow involved with Alicia every week make Cary and Diane seem shoehorned in.

Alicia's story, especially with the new investigator, is still pretty compelling, but overall the show has gone from Must Watch ASAP status to Watch Them Whenever status in our house.


----------



## Jon J (Aug 23, 2000)

Cainebj said:


> Eli. Sorry - I just don't buy him as straight. The whole story line is ludicrous.


Yes.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

Dawghows said:


> overall the show has gone from Must Watch ASAP status to Watch Them Whenever status in our house.


I hate to admit that it has been the same for me and this used to be my second favorite show. Madam Secretary has kindof taken it's place for me.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

I haven't enjoyed the show as much since Alicia left Lockhart-whoever, but I do still like it more than just about anything else on these days.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

Dawghows said:


> This show is slowly losing me.
> 
> Contrary to some of the posters above, I _hate_ the direction they've taken with Eli this season. He was a great character, and now he's just a cartoon. That final scene being the exception to the (new) rule, obviously.
> 
> ...


I find myself in the same spot. But, if they wrote out the Lockhart stuff, I'd enjoy it more. To me it feels like they have these actors under contract so they have to find a way to give them screen time, but they are totally unnecessary at this point.

That said, I kind of liked the whole associates quitting story line. I'm guessing they were just showing how this generation cares little about loyalty or even working hard unless there's something in it for them. I'm glad they got theirs in the end.


----------



## Marc (Jun 26, 1999)

Cainebj said:


> I hate to admit that it has been the same for me and this used to be my second favorite show. Madam Secretary has kindof taken it's place for me.


I think I'd agree with this. As much as I like Julianna Margulies in her role, the rest of the characters aren't as engaging as I would like.

The story lines in Madam Secretary have been far more appealing to me.


----------



## scooterboy (Mar 27, 2001)

This whole season has felt like a different show since Kalinda left. Could be coincidence I suppose.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

Marc said:


> I think I'd agree with this. As much as I like Julianna Margulies in her role, the rest of the characters aren't as engaging as I would like.
> 
> The story lines in Madam Secretary have been far more appealing to me.


True, but I do like her new co-council and the PI a lot. The rest of the characters seem to have lost a lot once Alicia left the original Lockhart-Gardner.

My one problem with Madame Secretary is the plots are completely implausible. I watch because I like Tea Leone and the guy who plays the Chief of Staff. The best scenes are when those two spar.


----------



## Family (Jul 23, 2001)

scooterboy said:


> This whole season has felt like a different show since Kalinda left. Could be coincidence I suppose.


I'd say Eli is the new Kalinda. The story lines with Kalinda's husband and her relationship with the drug dealer were nonsensical. And she had a big "Alicia" backstabbing reveal that appeared out of character just like Eli is this season.

The show has nothing left. I agree with the complaints concerning Lagos/Lockhart being irrelevant to this season, but would you prefer watching more Eli or story lines revolving around a governors/presidential candidate's wife being forced to take $200 cases from bond court to make ends meet?

The Good Wife has lost its fastball. The only hope is a complete reboot with Peter as Vice President.


----------



## GoPackGo (Dec 29, 2012)

No reboot is coming. This will be the last season. We're down to one word titles again, just like in season 1.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

GoPackGo said:


> No reboot is coming. This will be the last season. We're down to one word titles again, just like in season 1.


Has this been confirmed or just speculation?


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

hummingbird_206 said:


> Cary and Diane sure did pay back Biff and his buddies. :up:


That was great. I can't believe the associates fell for it. I didn't know what the trick was going to be, just that there obviously was one.


----------



## Gerryex (Apr 24, 2004)

Family said:


> story lines revolving around a governors/presidential candidate's wife being forced to take $200 cases from bond court to make ends meet?


That's a very good point!! How can the press not know that Peter's wife, the wife of a sitting Governor and a possible First Lady, is forced to take $200 cases from bond court to make ends meet!!

Yes, I agree TGW is not as good as it used to be but its still much better than some of the other junk out there so I'm still enjoying it, just not as much as in the past.

Gerry


----------



## Jon J (Aug 23, 2000)

Robin said:


> That was great. I can't believe the associates fell for it.


They didn't take into account they were rookies playing in the big leagues.


----------



## GoPackGo (Dec 29, 2012)

Steveknj said:


> Has this been confirmed or just speculation?


Pure speculation on my part.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

GoPackGo said:


> Pure speculation on my part.


Ahhhh 

I really used to love this show. I just think it's getting old by this point. If it goes it goes.


----------



## type_g (Sep 9, 2002)

It was a great show when they just focused on Alicia and her law cases. I think it started going downhill last season with her election scandal and all that mumbo jumbo. The more they keep adding the political stuff the more dumb the show gets.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

Yeah, I enjoy the legal cases more than the other stuff. Do not care about elections and all that stuff.


----------



## Flop (Dec 2, 2005)

The quickest way to improve the show would be for Peter to be assassinated, and for Alicia not to decide to run in his place.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

Flop said:


> The quickest way to improve the show would be for Peter to be assassinated, and for Alicia not to decide to run in his place.


 :up:


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

It started going downhill when Will was killed off, which set in motion all the ridiculous stuff including Alicia leaving the firm, starting a new firm and so forth.


----------



## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

I was cool with them starting their own firm but they abandoned that story almost instantly and then went with the states attorney race. Then they abandoned that as soon as it was done with the election scandal! Now they have completely destroyed all of Eli's story lines. 

Now it's like what?


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

I guess Ruth is gone for good? Seems like they really wasted Margo's stint on the show.

I wish Alicia would either go back to the firm or that they'd stop all interactions between her and them. The adversarial dynamic just isn't working for me. 

Grace did a great job with the HOA. I hope Alicia firing Grace means she'll hire Marisa!


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

I still watch and I still like the show - which prior to this year was one of my favorites but it does seem like they are floundering.

Cary suddenly representing a client alongside Alicia? 
The firm stealing clients back from Alicia? I mean how many times are they going to do the people stealing clients sub-plot? LOL

I think perhaps the biggest fail in direction for me is Eli Gold becoming the other major character of the show behind Alicia.

and I guess the prediction the series would end with Alicia moving into the White House won't be happening...

I did like the copyright case and think the show might be better off just going the case of the week route


----------



## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

This show seems to have no direction at all any more, any plot line they try to start seems to be abandoned without any real resolution.

Also, it seems that we are to believe that Will Gardner was the only good lawyer of the bunch, since he died they can't even seem to win cases anymore.


----------



## bikegeek (Dec 28, 2006)

i am hoping that this week's episode was a reset for the show. They got rid of Ruth and the campaign and now we had Cary banging on Alicia's door asking her and Luca to join the firm. Getting back to the case of the week would be nice.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

Yeah, I was talking with my mom about the show the other night and saying that I miss the case of the week. I started watching the show because while it was soapy, I enjoyed the legal drama stuff where they were working on a case every week, and the soapy stuff was the side story.

Now the soapy stuff is the main story and they hardly ever have a case they are working on. Even the cases they do work on lately like this one, it's not really so much about researching the case and what not... it's just different.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

Count me in as another vote to get back to case of the week!

I love Eli, but if they never do another political/election story again, I'd be happy.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

I was reading that the Kings (the Executive producers and showrunners) aren't signed past this season and if the show is renewed, they won't be working on it and they are in fact, working on a new show to air next season.

That may explain the inattention.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

While I too enjoy the case of the week, that's not what this show is about. It's always been about Alicia's struggle, first wither her husband's infidelity then with balancing family and career and then with Will and now, again, a new firm. I just think that it's much less interesting than it used to be. 

On this last episode, was it me, but I had a hard time rooting for the songwriter to win this thing. He just seemed to "out there". I also think they set this up for Marissa to do what Grace was doing. As soon as she showed up and then the neighbor told Alicia about Grace's grades, I said that's where they are going. I'm also tiring of this grudge between Eli and Alicia. It's how many years ago now? Get over it. You don't have to like the guy but why freeze out his daughter?

Anyway, I still enjoy the show for the most part, it's just not "must see" anymore.


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

Alicia's problem with Marisa was because Eli sent her. She even said something along the lines of "visit because YOU want to, not because he sent you." 

I've been waiting for Grace to get booted for a while. She s falling into life as a receptionist and she needs to be focusing on college. No way Alicia was going to allow that. 

Marisa as receptionist is going to be great!


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

Steveknj said:


> I'm also tiring of this grudge between Eli and Alicia. It's how many years ago now? Get over it. You don't have to like the guy but why freeze out his daughter?


It hasn't actually been that long, they've been friendly now for a while... up until he spilled his guts. I don't blame her for being pissed at him right now. You would not be upset to find out that he basically prevented you from running off with your twooo wuvvv who is now dead? IIRC, at the time, she was really waffling about leaving Peter. I think she would have left if she knew Will was going to put up a fight.

I don't think Marissa will get frozen out for long. It seemed to me like her feelings were a little hurt because she originally thought Marissa was coming to see her on her own, but then when she found out Eli had suggested it to her, it seemed like maybe she only came because he told her to, not because she actually wanted to.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

laria said:


> It hasn't actually been that long, they've been friendly now for a while... up until he spilled his guts. I don't blame her for being pissed at him right now. You would not be upset to find out that he basically prevented you from running off with your twooo wuvvv who is now dead? IIRC, at the time, she was really waffling about leaving Peter. I think she would have left if she knew Will was going to put up a fight.
> 
> I don't think Marissa will get frozen out for long. It seemed to me like her feelings were a little hurt because she originally thought Marissa was coming to see her on her own, but then when she found out Eli had suggested it to her, it seemed like maybe she only came because he told her to, not because she actually wanted to.


I don't mean the grudge is long, but it's been a long time since Will was murdered and that phone call Eli erased. To me, Alicia has become a completely unlikable character this season. She seems extremely selfish and uncaring about what others are going through.


----------



## brebeans (Sep 5, 2003)

I know that's not going to happen, but someone said the show started going downhill after Will died. While I think it's still good, I think it's going downhill more because Kalinda isn't there.

That being said, I still watch and like it. However, I agree that the back and forth between firms, starting up "new" ones, then going back to old ones, etc. etc. is getting very old. And, I wish David Lee would just go away. He's nothing but annoying these days.

It's too "all over the place". I like the case of the week, but I wasn't thrilled with this week's show (the copyright case) the primary character (Brody?) who wrote the song was annoying to me and the fact that Luka (sp?) just hooked up with him was just silly. He wasn't all that attractive in looks or personality.

Oh well, I still like the show and hope that it gets back on its suspenseful, intriguing, smart, track soon.


----------



## NorthAlabama (Apr 19, 2012)

brebeans said:


> I know that's not going to happen, but someone said the show started going downhill after Will died. While I think it's still good, I think it's going downhill more because Kalinda isn't there.


i'd be happy if they replaced kalinda with jeffrey dean morgan full time, instead of patching together outtakes.

they need to work on replacing the major characters that have left the show, their step up of resurrecting old story lines is not an acceptable alternative.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

NorthAlabama said:


> i'd be happy if they replaced kalinda with jeffrey dean morgan full time, instead of patching together outtakes.
> 
> they need to work on replacing the major characters that have left the show, their step up of resurrecting old story lines is not an acceptable alternative.


While generally I might agree about resurrecting old story lines, I really enjoyed it when they resurrected the NSA storyline briefly. I thought that was pretty funny.


----------



## NorthAlabama (Apr 19, 2012)

TAsunder said:


> While generally I might agree about resurrecting old story lines, I really enjoyed it when they resurrected the NSA storyline briefly. I thought that was pretty funny.


"is that in your opinion?"

i wasn't clear, i like it when they resurrect old story lines, too, it's part of the series, but bringing them back more frequently isn't a replacement for lost major characters - they need to fill some roles.


----------



## Jon J (Aug 23, 2000)

NorthAlabama said:


> "is that in your opinion?"


Yes Judge, it is.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

brebeans said:


> I know that's not going to happen, but someone said the show started going downhill after Will died. While I think it's still good, I think it's going downhill more because Kalinda isn't there.


Yes and no.

I think that when the actor playing Will decided to leave the show they put a long-term storyline plan in place that was epic and captivating (and INCREDIBLY well done).

Right now it feels like they don't have a plan. It's like shows that start off with an amazing Season 1 and then become clear the creators didn't have a long term concept.



NorthAlabama said:


> i'd be happy if they replaced kalinda with jeffrey dean morgan full time, instead of patching together outtakes.


I wouldn't. JDM irks me the wrong way.


Spoiler



I am nearly devastated (well not really) that he's been cast in The Walking Dead.


----------



## Timbeau (May 31, 2002)

laria said:


> Yeah, I was talking with my mom about the show the other night and saying that I miss the case of the week. I started watching the show because while it was soapy, I enjoyed the legal drama stuff where they were working on a case every week, and the soapy stuff was the side story.
> 
> Now the soapy stuff is the main story and they hardly ever have a case they are working on. Even the cases they do work on lately like this one, it's not really so much about researching the case and what not... it's just different.


This, to me, is the crux of the problem with The Good Wife. I don't care if they're all in the same firm or if Alicia works for herself and has cases against Agos/Lockhart or Canning or Canning/Agos/Lockhart, just as long as the case is the main story and any soap opera stuff is the side story. If the soapy stuff comes from one of the many political stories, that's fine too. But the main story has to be the law cases.

Is it possible the writers are running out of interesting law cases to use?

PS: In my opinion this happening with Grey's Anatomy also. It's always been a soap opera but the medical cases used to be a more prominent part of each episode.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Huh. Margulies may be exiting with the Kings.


----------



## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

The kings and margulese have said (years ago) they were planning on 7 years. I'm not impressed with the end game, so far.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

Timbeau said:


> This, to me, is the crux of the problem with The Good Wife. I don't care if they're all in the same firm or if Alicia works for herself and has cases against Agos/Lockhart or Canning or Canning/Agos/Lockhart, just as long as the case is the main story and any soap opera stuff is the side story. If the soapy stuff comes from one of the many political stories, that's fine too. But the main story has to be the law cases.
> 
> Is it possible the writers are running out of interesting law cases to use?
> 
> PS: In my opinion this happening with Grey's Anatomy also. It's always been a soap opera but the medical cases used to be a more prominent part of each episode.


You want the "Case of the Week" watch Perry Mason. It's never been about that. Sure there always was (and mostly still is) a case of the week. But often even the case reflected something going on with Alicia or one of the firms she worked for. I agree that some of the soap opera stuff is a bit over the top, but it's always been there. To me, I just think the show has run it's course. Alicia has turned from someone you rooted for to a bitter woman who seems to be bothered by the cliche stuff women are often bothered with (which is a shame). I'm just not sure there is much more they can do with he character which hasn't been done.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

Steveknj said:


> You want the "Case of the Week" watch Perry Mason. It's never been about that. Sure there always was (and mostly still is) a case of the week. But often even the case reflected something going on with Alicia or one of the firms she worked for. I agree that some of the soap opera stuff is a bit over the top, but it's always been there. To me, I just think the show has run it's course. Alicia has turned from someone you rooted for to a bitter woman who seems to be bothered by the cliche stuff women are often bothered with (which is a shame). I'm just not sure there is much more they can do with he character which hasn't been done.


I don't care what it is "about" ... the case of the week has always been the best part of the show. The second best thing usually is the election cycle story of the week. The main character arcs are generally pretty low on my list of what makes this show good.


----------



## Flop (Dec 2, 2005)

Steveknj said:


> You want the "Case of the Week" watch Perry Mason. It's never been about that. Sure there always was (and mostly still is) a case of the week. But often even the case reflected something going on with Alicia or one of the firms she worked for. I agree that some of the soap opera stuff is a bit over the top, but it's always been there. To me, I just think the show has run it's course. Alicia has turned from someone you rooted for to a bitter woman who seems to be bothered by the cliche stuff women are often bothered with (which is a shame). I'm just not sure there is much more they can do with he character which hasn't been done.


In your opinion...

I watched the show for the case of the week stuff, so for me it was about the case of the week. I don't give a flying fig about Peter's political career or much of the relationship drama. Now that the cases are taking more of a back seat, my interest in the show is taking a back seat. I used to watch it the night it aired, now I get to it when I get to it.


----------



## edc (Mar 24, 2002)

JYoung said:


> Huh. Margulies may be exiting with the Kings.


It'd actually be pretty amusing for them to pull a "final season of Bob Newhart" (or "The New Girl" this season) for the last year of the show. Lemond Bishop kidnaps Alicia and we don't see her again until the finale of the series


----------



## thewebgal (Aug 10, 2007)

edc said:


> It'd actually be pretty amusing for them to pull a "final season of Bob Newhart" (or "The New Girl" this season) for the last year of the show. Lemond Bishop kidnaps Alicia and we don't see her again until the finale of the series


Bishop is busy as Luke Cage ... and looking good in that role!


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

thewebgal said:


> Bishop is busy as Luke Cage ... and looking good in that role!


Funny you should bring that up when I saw him as Luke Cage, I didn't recognize him and then looked it up and was shocked it was the same actor...


----------



## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

JYoung said:


> Huh. Margulies may be exiting with the Kings.


There was just an ad during the Super Bowl saying this will be the last season.


----------



## David Ortiz (Jul 8, 2002)

pdhenry said:


> There was just an ad during the Super Bowl saying this will be the last season.


Downton Abbey and The Good Wife?!


----------



## rhuntington3 (May 1, 2001)

Michael Ausiello:

__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/696498094922469377
"CBS announces #TheGoodWife's Cancellation During Super Bowl"

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/live-feed/good-wife-final-season-confirmed-862839


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

pdhenry said:


> There was just an ad during the Super Bowl saying this will be the last season.


Yeah, I caught that during the Game and was coming over to see if it was posted here.

CBS advertised it as "The Final Season".


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

That surprised me, in that they would have announced it like that. I figured it was on the fence. Not surprised though. Hopefully it will pick up for the last bunch of episodes as they try to wind the story down. Used to be must watch for me, but I'm afraid it's become habit more than desire anymore. I think this is the right time to end it. It's gotten very stale.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

I'm sad that the show won't be back next season, but I'm not surprised. I wonder if they are going to spin off a show for Diane (Christine Baranski)? They've kept her part pretty large, so I figure she's going to get her own show.


----------



## Big Deficit (Jul 8, 2003)

I don't watch this show, but has the super bowl ever been used to promote a cancelation before? A friend at my party through a conniption when the commercial came on.


----------



## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Big Deficit said:


> I don't watch this show, but has the super bowl ever been used to promote a cancelation before? A friend at my party through a conniption when the commercial came on.


It's not exactly a cancellation in the traditional sense. The network wants more but the producers and main actress wants to end this season.

CBS probably wants to draw as much attention to the final episodes I guess.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

vertigo235 said:


> It's not exactly a cancellation in the traditional sense. The network wants more but the producers and main actress wants to end this season.
> 
> CBS probably wants to draw as much attention to the final episodes I guess.


I'm actually surprised CBS would want more. Considering the talent on the show, I figured it might be costly to produce. The ratings have never been great and now they are kind on the downside. I figured this was a mutual decision.

I don't see a spinoff coming, but I'd have been wrong before. I guess they could do a spinoff of Lockhart's law firm, or, they could finally make her a judge (or, not too far fetched, a SCOTUS justice). That actually might be fun.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

Seems pretty late in the season now. Are all the episodes for the season likely filmed already? I hope they weren't planning on a cliffhanger or anything.


----------



## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

The announcement hit me like a ton of bricks. The Good Wife is probably the best show currently on TV and definitely my favorite. I had no idea they were ending the show until it was announced during the Superbowl. I guess they wanted to end it on a high note rather than drag it out until it was nothing more than a dead carcass like so many other shows that have lasted beyond their expiration dates.


----------



## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Based on how the show has gone the last 2 seasons, I hope they kill off Alicia so she can be with Will.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

mr.unnatural said:


> I had no idea they were ending the show until it was announced during the Superbowl. I guess they wanted to end it on a high note rather than drag it out until it was nothing more than a dead carcass like so many other shows that have lasted beyond their expiration dates.


I'm guessing they didn't know they were ending the show either until Julianna Margulies basically said she wasn't coming back a couple weeks ago.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

TAsunder said:


> Seems pretty late in the season now. Are all the episodes for the season likely filmed already? I hope they weren't planning on a cliffhanger or anything.


I believe that there's still another month or two of filming..

But considering that the Kings seem to be halfway out the door already, I hope they wrapped things up.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

Steveknj said:


> I'm actually surprised CBS would want more. Considering the talent on the show, I figured it might be costly to produce. The ratings have never been great and now they are kind on the downside.


Yes, but it has always been a critical success and Margulies winning the Emmy several years in a row helped.

If they did a spin off with Diane as a judge I would definitely watch!
Although the way they have kept building up Eli's character he would probably be a more likely candidate for a spin-off. That I wouldn't watch.



vertigo235 said:


> Based on how the show has gone the last 2 seasons, I hope they kill off Alicia so she can be with Will.


Uh. That kind of made me laugh.


----------



## jeepair (Apr 22, 2004)

If they did a spinoff, it should be like 5 years in the future with Grace starting out at a firm maybe Lockhart Agos?


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

OK so Alicia leaving the firm was just a thing we had to endure while Peter ran for President and now she's back and not top dawg.

OK. 

But - I did like the ridiculously polite encounter between Diane and Alicia.

Peter is being investigated by the FBI and Department of Justice. I can see where this is going...


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Especially since Ruth basically urged Alicia to dump Peter.

I did not miss how Diane and Cary kept pairing Luca with Monica.
I know that it was meant to show the inherent racism but it's rather out of character for Diane and Cary. It would have been more believable if it was David Lee and Howard.

Wasn't thrilled in the beginning with the rehash of the lost iPhone prototype but Joey Slotnick is funny.

Like Eli beaming with pride at Marissa.


----------



## smak (Feb 11, 2000)

That is a REALLY long time to do the Apple guy lost iPhone in bar retread.

That was almost SIX years ago

-smak-


----------



## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

smak said:


> That is a REALLY long time to do the Apple guy lost iPhone in bar retread.
> 
> That was almost SIX years ago
> 
> -smak-


As was quoted in the episode, this is history repeating itself as farce.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

I loved this episode. I thought the case of the week was entertaining and a good way to bring Alicia and Lucca into the firm. And there was also the story outside the case of the week that gave Eli, Marissa, and Ruth screen time, and I enjoyed that.

I had no idea Lucca is a city in Italy, but I had to google it after Lucca's explanation of the origin of her name. Much better name than Budapest!


----------



## cstelter (Mar 18, 2002)

I don't follow any Hollywood news, so this is likely easily debunked-- I've only read the two links about the cancellation referenced above and based on that-- this could work.

First-- if Alicia divorces Peter, the title of the show no longer applies

Second-- the one article referenced in this thread indicated only that JM confirmed she would be jobless after this season, not that she wanted it to end or was ready to move on.

Third, normally the title sequence hast the GOOD WIFE with the word 'the' in red. 

Fourth, the commercial for the final episode as can be seen by the twitter link above, has the words WIFE and FINAL in red.

Perhaps it will be business as usual under a new title once the 'wife' is no more?


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

This episode drove me crazy. Seriously, they can't get Alicia a working chair? (I get they are trying to show that she's working her way back from the firm from a lower rung). Second, I thought that Alicia was going to come into the firm as a junior partner? If so, why all the references to her that "the partners" need to decide and so forth. Third, and I am still predicting this, Alicia is going to wind up throwing Lucca under the bus, because there's going to be a point where she's going to have to decide between the firm and Lucca and I'm guessing she'll choose the firm.

I also think this will end with divorce from Peter. I think part of that is that she's falling for the new Investigator. Kids are grown, Peter back in trouble, there's no real reason to stick with him anymore.


----------



## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

I agree, when she said "the partners" I just assumed she meant the managing/named partners.


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

I still think Alicia should have gone to work for Canning. That would have been interesting!


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

loubob57 said:


> I still think Alicia should have gone to work for Canning. That would have been interesting!


I agree!


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

loubob57 said:


> I still think Alicia should have gone to work for Canning. That would have been interesting!


I liked Alicia in her own firm. I think they should have kept her there. But, I also liked when she partnered with Cary. That whole thing, like 2 seasons worth of stories seems like a complete waste. She's back where she was, minus Will championing her.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

Is TAPS based on a real entity? It seemed like it must have been based on something.


----------



## Howie (May 3, 2004)

I still like it, lots. It does seem to me that they're trying to set it up for a ... I don't know how to say it... a pleasing backup, one with not too many unanswerable thoughts. It's been a show that I've certainly enjoyed over the years. I'll miss it.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

Yay, Elsbeth was back. I love her (in smallish doses). And Elsbeth, Marissa, and Eli were great together. 

So the FBI is going after Peter, and his doaner, and Marissa worked at the doaner's dairy farm in Israel. This stuff is getting so complicated that I need a score card.

Those NSA guys are slimy. Are they done listening through Alicia's phone, or did they just stop while trying to ID the leak?


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

I don't think they are done... the guy was listening to her current conversation with Jason right when they came to pick him up for questioning.


----------



## stellie93 (Feb 25, 2006)

I like Elsbeth's ex too, and the dog. Have we seen him before?


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

The whole "hot mic" exploit on Alicia's phone had me rolling my eyes.

A shame as the show had previously been pretty good about technical matters.


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

JYoung said:


> The whole "hot mic" exploit on Alicia's phone had me rolling my eyes.
> 
> A shame as the show had previously been pretty good about technical matters.


That exploit is possible. They probably would have had to have physical access to her phone at some point.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

loubob57 said:


> That exploit is possible. They probably would have had to have physical access to her phone at some point.


Yes, I know it's possible but like you say, physical access to the phone would have been required, considering that Alicia's using an iPhone and such code would most likely need to be sideloaded.

They made it sound like they could "just turn it on" with any phone.

Plus, it would eat into her battery life to be constantly transmitting audio.


----------



## robojerk (Jun 13, 2006)

JYoung said:


> They made it sound like they could "just turn it on" with any phone.
> 
> Plus, it would eat into her battery life to be constantly transmitting audio.


Audio is only a few bits a second.. It literally is nothing, and could be something hidden so the OS on your phone cant see it, see below.

Also your phone has 2 OS's. iOS, Android, etc; then the baseband OS.

It's very plausible that the NSA could have helped, or strong armed the radio manufacturers (mainly Qualcomm) into putting backdoors into the baseband that can do things the other OS cant even see.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

robojerk said:


> Audio is only a few bits a second.. It literally is nothing, and could be something hidden so the OS on your phone cant see it, see below.
> 
> Also your phone has 2 OS's. iOS, Android, etc; then the baseband OS.
> 
> It's very plausible that the NSA could have helped, or strong armed the radio manufacturers (mainly Qualcomm) into putting backdoors into the baseband that can do things the other OS cant even see.


Well, I'd say it's possible that the NSA could have done it.
AFAIK, there's no indication that the NSA has actually done so.
(Yes, I know that's the point but there's the Snowden leaks.)

And yes, phone quality audio is low bit rate but still that data has to be transmitted off of the phone.
From the way the show portrayed it, it seemed like the audio was constantly being transmitted off in real time.

If you constantly transmit via cellular voice, it takes power.
If you constantly transmit via cellular data, it takes power.
If you constantly transmit via (good) Wifi, it takes less power but still takes power.

Now I suppose it's possible that the phone just held the daily recording and uploaded it in the middle of the night but it didn't seem to be portrayed that way, especially when you consider how fast the Army Captain got yanked.


----------



## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

JYoung said:


> Well, I'd say it's possible that the NSA could have done it.
> AFAIK, there's no indication that the NSA has actually done so.
> (Yes, I know that's the point but there's the Snowden leaks.)
> 
> ...


So let's see, you made assumptions about how it worked and then rolled your eyes at the conclusions you then drew?


----------



## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

Guys, it's a TV show.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

pdhenry said:


> Guys, it's a TV show.


Obligatory "Are you new here?"


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

pdhenry said:


> Guys, it's a TV show.


It is?


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

JYoung said:


> Well, I'd say it's possible that the NSA could have done it.
> AFAIK, there's no indication that the NSA has actually done so.
> (Yes, I know that's the point but there's the Snowden leaks.)
> 
> ...





pdhenry said:


> Guys, it's a TV show.





hummingbird_206 said:


> Obligatory "Are you new here?"


I never go too deep into the how and whys? When I do, it ruins what was otherwise an enjoyable episode. I wonder if they'll bring in Tim Cook's recent fight with the Feds into this. I also wonder if they ever got a warrant (was that ever mentioned)? I would think you would need a warrant to be able to "hot mic" someone's phone. Also do we know yet what the NSA is after or is this just stuff that was leftover from the Bishop stuff?

Edit: BTW, I'm liking the new investigator dude. I didn't think they'd be able to replace Kalinda, but they found a good character. Whatever happened to the other investigator (the blonde girl who was a bit flighty)?


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

Steveknj said:


> Also do we know yet what the NSA is after or *is this just stuff that was leftover from the Bishop stuff?*


I think so.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

loubob57 said:


> I think so.


So I wonder about the legalities of this? Is there enough time to delve into that?


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

I think it's still related to Bishop, but I also think that those guys just like listening in on her. There was some episode last year where they were really happy that some criteria was met for them to turn back on the surveillance on her. I think they are just nosy.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

laria said:


> I think it's still related to Bishop, but I also think that those guys just like listening in on her. There was some episode last year where they were really happy that some criteria was met for them to turn back on the surveillance on her. I think they are just nosy.


I wonder if that's why they pulled the one kid away at the end of the episode. Maybe they have to stop? Although they did say they were authorized to listen.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

I was a little confused what happened. The guy kept insisting they had authorization for the hot mic, but they never showed the boss man telling them it was ok for them to listen again... only that they needed to stop for now.

So I'm unclear on if he was getting in trouble because he started listening again or if they told them it was ok to start listening again offscreen and he's in trouble for something else.


----------



## Flop (Dec 2, 2005)

laria said:


> I was a little confused what happened. The guy kept insisting they had authorization for the hot mic, but they never showed the boss man telling them it was ok for them to listen again... only that they needed to stop for now.
> 
> So I'm unclear on if he was getting in trouble because he started listening again or if they told them it was ok to start listening again offscreen and he's in trouble for something else.


I thought he might be getting in trouble for being the source of "the leak", but admittedly, I only 1/2 paid attention to this episode. Did they fly Alicia to DC, or did that happen in Chicago? I imagine a meeting of those personages would happen in DC, and there had to be about 5000 other lawyers just in the DC metro area as qualified as Alicia to be called in.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

They must have been in Chicago... since they picked her up on the sidewalk in a car both days, and she had her rendezvous with the investigator the night of the first day.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

laria said:


> *They must have been in Chicago*... since they picked her up on the sidewalk in a car both days, and she had her rendezvous with the investigator the night of the first day.


Which was obviously (to me) New York. I could easily tell by the style of street signs. I've seen this in a few episodes. But probably because I'm from the area I notice. I doubt someone not as familiar with NY or Chicago would.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

laria said:


> I was a little confused what happened. The guy kept insisting they had authorization for the hot mic, but they never showed the boss man telling them it was ok for them to listen again... only that they needed to stop for now.
> 
> So I'm unclear on if he was getting in trouble because he started listening again or if they told them it was ok to start listening again offscreen and he's in trouble for something else.


They had initially stopped listening to Alicia in relation to the Bishop case after they figured out that they were being tapped and Peter made some noises.

They started again after Alicia called the Zach Woods NSA guy who was on the run (in Iceland?), justifying it because they had a "three hop" warrant (which is a real thing ).

I had thought that the NSA chief's actions were all related to finding the leak about the Top Secret hearings Alicia was attending.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

The part I was confused about was all of what happened contained in this episode. The boss told the guys to stop listening because of the leak, then at the end, the guy was listening again. So the part I was confused about was why was he listening again... was he doing it against the boss' instructions or did he get permission again offscreen.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

laria said:


> The part I was confused about was all of what happened contained in this episode. The boss told the guys to stop listening because of the leak, then at the end, the guy was listening again. So the part I was confused about was why was he listening again... was he doing it against the boss' instructions or did he get permission again offscreen.


I think this is why I'm confused, too. The boss told them to stop listening, so I thought that they were done for good. I thought the guy who was listening again was in trouble for continuing to listen and that he's the leak. Maybe we'll see more on that in whatever time remains?


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

laria said:


> The part I was confused about was all of what happened contained in this episode. The boss told the guys to stop listening because of the leak, then at the end, the guy was listening again. So the part I was confused about was why was he listening again... was he doing it against the boss' instructions or did he get permission again offscreen.


Well, you also posted this, which is what I meant to quote. 



laria said:


> I think it's still related to Bishop, but I also think that those guys just like listening in on her. There was some episode last year where they were really happy that some criteria was met for them to turn back on the surveillance on her. I think they are just nosy.


I agree, that the episode didn't explain it well as to why the guy did kept listening.
Maybe he's addicted.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

JYoung said:


> Well, you also posted this, which is what I meant to quote.
> 
> I agree, that the episode didn't explain it well as to why the guy did kept listening.
> 
> Maybe he's addicted.


Ah, yeah... I knew that something happened that let them listen in again but I forgot it was specific to her talking to Jared.

Edit: Err... Zach.  Jared is his name on _Silicon Valley_.


----------



## robojerk (Jun 13, 2006)

I think the fact that they (NSA lackeys) had learned about top secret info while listening to Alicia, and shared it around amongst themselves (like gossips) to the point where the DOD learned that the NSA knew (minus specifics of how the NSA knew) it probably put that (NSA) manager into a precarious position. That NSA lackey is probably going to served up as a sacrificial lamb. It might spill over into the legal world of Alicia, but I doubt she could defend the guy.


----------



## brebeans (Sep 5, 2003)

pdhenry said:


> Guys, it's a TV show.


Yup....this. I don't need to know the details of how it might or might now be possible.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

I just wonder if they were listening for the same reason a lot of young males might listen. Alicia was provocative, there's the chance of hearing her have sex (remember they WERE listening to the open mic while she was with the investigator. So maybe even though there's no REAL reason to listen, they are just intrigued and are having fun with it. It might be nothing more than that.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

Ugh, I hate Alicia's mother. Please let this be the last time we have to see and hear her.

Wonder if Alicia will tell Cary? Interesting that she did tell Lucca though.

And it's looking like Peter broke the law, again. Shocking!


----------



## Howie (May 3, 2004)

I like Alicia's mother more than I do Peter's mother. That's not saying much, though.


----------



## Saturn_V (Jun 2, 2007)

I will endure full episodes of Veronica over a three minute bit with Jackie. Plus I still miss Abigail Bartlett from TWW. 

But she needs to say Jackass more.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

Alicia didn't tell Cary. I'm surprised. I didn't think she'd lie to him when he asked her directly about it.

I think Grace will make a good lawyer.


----------



## JohnS-MI (Jan 25, 2014)

hummingbird_206 said:


> Alicia didn't tell Cary. I'm surprised. I didn't think she'd lie to him when he asked her directly about it.


[Lawyer mode] Technically, she didn't lie as she approached Diane with the question, Diane didn't approach her. [/lawyer] To the rest of us, she lied.


----------



## EWiser (Oct 2, 2008)

How many episodes are left?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## gersh49 (Feb 1, 2003)

EWiser said:


> How many episodes are left?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


5 more episodes (Series Finale on May 8)


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

JohnS-MI said:


> [Lawyer mode] Technically, she didn't lie as she approached Diane with the question, Diane didn't approach her. [/lawyer] To the rest of us, she lied.


That's how I interpreted it.


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

JohnS-MI said:


> [Lawyer mode] Technically, she didn't lie as she approached Diane with the question, Diane didn't approach her. [/lawyer] To the rest of us, she lied.


Thank you! I could tell there was a technicality at play but couldn't remember how the original conversation went.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

Also, there's some pedantry about whether Diane wants to create an "all female firm" or just a firm that happens to be led by females.


----------



## stellie93 (Feb 25, 2006)

hummingbird_206 said:


> Alicia didn't tell Cary. I'm surprised. I didn't think she'd lie to him when he asked her directly about it.
> .


You guys are obviously good at justifying a bare faced lie. 

My question is, did Carey believe her. From the look on his face, I'd say no.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

stellie93 said:


> My question is, did Carey believe her. From the look on his face, I'd say no.


The lie was so obvious it was almost like she told him the truth.


----------



## Marc (Jun 26, 1999)

TAsunder said:


> Also, there's some pedantry about whether Diane wants to create an "all female firm" or just a firm that happens to be led by females.


That's the minute difference I recalled, too.


----------



## efilippi (Jul 24, 2001)

TAsunder said:


> Also, there's some pedantry about whether Diane wants to create an "all female firm" or just a firm that happens to be led by females.


I thought this was made quite clear when Alicia asked Diane that very question: Only females in the firm? No, all named partners will be female.


----------



## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

I think the pedantry being discussed involves Alicia's answer to Carey. Diane didn't approach her about an all-female firm, nor is an all-female firm under discussion. But Carey's still screwed.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

I thought this may have been the best episode of the season. Very classic TGW. Gotta love Eli standing on the trash can (or whatever that was) and listening through the grates. I guess I could do a little bit less with the sex games between the Investigator and Alicia. I get it, they are having fun. I'm not a prude, but for some reason they get me a bit uncomfortable. Otherwise, definitely a first rate episode. Great court case I thought too.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

Steveknj said:


> I guess I could do a little bit less with the sex games between the Investigator and Alicia. I get it, they are having fun. I'm not a prude, but for some reason they get me a bit uncomfortable.


Yeah, I'm watching for the legal show, not their sexcapades.


----------



## stellie93 (Feb 25, 2006)

Isn't Alicia supposed to be keeping up the image of a fake marriage? What's with them sitting in a bar kissing?


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

stellie93 said:


> Isn't Alicia supposed to be keeping up the image of a fake marriage? What's with them sitting in a bar kissing?


Peter lost the election, so not sure it matters anymore.


----------



## HoosierFan (May 8, 2001)

But they're going to great lengths to have her show support for Peter at the grand jury investigation. And I thought he just didn't get the presidential nomination. He's still governor.


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

stellie93 said:


> Isn't Alicia supposed to be keeping up the image of a fake marriage? What's with them sitting in a bar kissing?


There was way more than kissing going on!


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

loubob57 said:


> There was way more than kissing going on!


Seriously, that table cloth was in no way long enough for what was going on there!


----------



## scooterboy (Mar 27, 2001)

stellie93 said:


> Isn't Alicia supposed to be keeping up the image of a fake marriage? What's with them sitting in a bar kissing?


As the camera was zooming out from the table, I really expected to see a phone capturing it on video.

Though we never saw that phone, I still expect to see footage pop up later to trip her up somehow.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

scooterboy said:


> As the camera was zooming out from the table, I really expected to see a phone capturing it on video.
> 
> Though we never saw that phone, I still expect to see footage pop up later to trip her up somehow.


Isn't the NSA still listening in? Can't remember where we left that.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

I gotta say - this was probably the best episode in a while and reminded me of everything I have loved about The Good Wife.

Finally, the characters are stepping up. Both with Alicia going to confront Peter - that one moment before she says that line shows what an amazing actress Margulies is... I also quite enjoyed Diane and Eli sticking it to the Glee prosecutor


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

I rather enjoyed when Peter says "I should kick your ass", and the reply was "You can try".


----------



## Gerryex (Apr 24, 2004)

loubob57 said:


> I rather enjoyed when Peter says "I should kick your ass", and the reply was "You can try".


YES!! :up::up:


----------



## EWiser (Oct 2, 2008)

Yes Peter has a lot of room to talk. An his ass would be kicked for sure. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

Great episode. Alicia seems to be in the middle of EVERYTHING going on. I wonder why Cary just gave up and decided to leave? I also get the idea that Alicia is not too happy being in the middle of the fight between the partners, but at the end of the day becomes a name partner (in the firm she essentially started). Should be a fun ride to the end.


----------



## Saturn_V (Jun 2, 2007)

The Comedian vs. Mr Big? I'd pay $2.99 to see that.

I didn't like Cary Agos' exit at all. I wanted to see him get some payback after 7 seasons of being TGW's whipping boy.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

Just a few episodes left and I really enjoyed this one. 'Your Worship' instead of 'Your Honor' was great. I'm too lazy to google, but I assume that's accurate? And playing the NSA against the Canadian counterpart was hilarious!

I loved it when Peter said 'We're back where we started' as I've been wondering if the show would end like it began, with him going to (or in) prison.

The scene with Diane, David, and the blonde was awesome. I usually hate David Lee, but he was fantastic with the comments and facial expressions. 

I wonder if Diane is going to leave the firm and Cary will come back so we end with Florrick Agos and Lee? Or maybe David leaves, too, and it will be Florrick Agos? I'd be happy to see it as Florrick Agos with Lucca as an unnamed partner.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

My gut is telling me that the producers want to end this with Diane and Alicia running a female led firm.

I'm not necessarily against the idea but I feel they've done a disservice to the character of Cary to get to this point.


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

I got a real kick out of the Canadian CSE workers in their cubicles listening in on the phone calls looking almost exactly like the NSA guys in their cubicles. And after Her Worship had lambasted the US for spying on their own citizens.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

loubob57 said:


> I got a real kick out of the Canadian CSE workers in their cubicles listening in on the phone calls looking almost exactly like the NSA guys in their cubicles. And after Her Worship had lambasted the US for spying on their own citizens.


Weren't all the cubicle panels red? I thought that was an interesting touch. Loved that the Canadian analyst was wearing a Blue Jays tshirt to emphasize that this was CSE not NSA.

I'm STILL not sure why the NSA analysts are still allowed to listen Alicia's phone calls. Was there a warrant issued because of Peter's problems?

After some not so great episodes early in the season, I think it's ending with a bang. Anyone else still cringe when Alicia and the Investigator fool around? My wife and I both think they've driven the point home that they like/love each other with an anvil.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

Steveknj said:


> I'm STILL not sure why the NSA analysts are still allowed to listen Alicia's phone calls. Was there a warrant issued because of Peter's problems?


She got pulled back in because they picked her up talking to the ex-NSA guy while he was still in Iceland, I think.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

loubob57 said:


> I got a real kick out of the Canadian CSE workers in their cubicles listening in on the phone calls looking almost exactly like the NSA guys in their cubicles. And after Her Worship had lambasted the US for spying on their own citizens.


Technically they weren't spying on their own citizens though, right? They were spying on US citizens.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

JYoung said:


> My gut is telling me that the producers want to end this with Diane and Alicia running a female led firm.
> 
> I'm not necessarily against the idea but I feel they've done a disservice to the character of Cary to get to this point.


I don't like how they've treated Cary at all. That's why I'm hoping Diane will retire and Cary will come back. I didn't think it would happen, but seeing Cary on this week's episode makes me think he's not off the show yet. And it gives me hope that he and Alicia will make up and get back together.


----------



## brebeans (Sep 5, 2003)

hummingbird_206 said:


> I don't like how they've treated Cary at all. That's why I'm hoping Diane will retire and Cary will come back. I didn't think it would happen, but seeing Cary on this week's episode makes me think he's not off the show yet. And it gives me hope that he and Alicia will make up and get back together.


So...did I miss something? Was there a scene or conversation where Cary said he was leaving? Or that Diane asked him to leave? Why is David Lee still there, then?

I know they were talking about Alicia being a partner and their were rumors of Diane wanting to start an all female firm and that turned into all female partners, or something like that.

But, all of a sudden, Cary is in a restaurant talking to what's his name, the investigator (Alicia's beau)..just blanking on his name now.

Didn' t know that Cary leaving the firm was a "done deal". But it seems so, now.


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

He decided he was leaving in the episode before this most recent one.


----------



## hahathatsfunny (Jul 29, 2008)

brebeans said:


> So...did I miss something? Was there a scene or conversation where Cary said he was leaving? Or that Diane asked him to leave? Why is David Lee still there, then?
> 
> I know they were talking about Alicia being a partner and their were rumors of Diane wanting to start an all female firm and that turned into all female partners, or something like that.
> 
> ...


Cary was pressured to leave, as Diane felt that he was a mediocre as a named partner. This was discussed when Diane met with Alicia during some lunch. The feeling might have been supported by David Lee. Maybe we will see Cary partner up with Louis Canning (Michael J. Fox) in the next episode or so. We will see Michael J. Fox likely one last time? It does seem like Cary has been marginalized as a character, ever since Kalinda left the show.

I also enjoyed Louis Canning more in the earlier seasons when he was Alicia's foil, but it's also great to see him anytime. I never really like the storylines regarding Alicia's personal life (affairs).

I do like Eli and his daughter, Marissa. I wouldn't mind if a spinoff was done with them as the focus, and maybe Diane and new characters but no Alicia or Florricks, but not sure how that would work.


----------



## Saturn_V (Jun 2, 2007)

Two episodes left. Feels like a very anti climactic finale is coming up. 

I'm hoping Archie Panjabi will cameo.


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

Saturn_V said:


> I'm hoping Archie Panjabi will cameo.


That seems incredibly unlikely, due to the rumors of how she and Julianna Margulies don't get along.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

Amnesia said:


> That seems incredibly unlikely, due to the rumors of how she and Julianna Margulies don't get along.


Huh? I've never heard any rumors they don't get along.


----------



## ADG (Aug 20, 2003)

More than rumors. They wouldn't even sit next to one another in their last scene together - they had to be shot at separate locations and edited to appear as though they were on adjacent bar stools.


----------



## EWiser (Oct 2, 2008)

Yes that was a big thing they didn't even shot their scenes together at the same time.  I am ready for the show to end it has lost my interest just watching to see how a once good show ends.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

So they found an excuse to bring back many of the characters who've been in the show the last few years in the Katubah signing party. It felt like they threw that all together as a send off. The last two episodes will focus on Peter's plight and what Alicia decides to do.

So David Lee is out? They brushed over that so fast that it just felt weird. It felt like they just said it in passing. Oh yea, all girl firm like we wanted. Ummmm, ok, but I expected more fireworks than that.

The episode really felt rushed, like they were just throwing in too many things into one episode.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

Diane said David Lee was fine with the name of the firm being Lockhart, Florrick & Associates because he would still make the same amount of money, and he understood the importance of branding.


----------



## Howie (May 3, 2004)

Amnesia said:


> That seems incredibly unlikely, due to the rumors of how she and Julianna Margulies don't get along.


Maybe Archie also slept with Julianna's real life SO.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

BrettStah said:


> Diane said David Lee was fine with the name of the firm being Lockhart, Florrick & Associates because he would still make the same amount of money, and he understood the importance of branding.


This is so ridiculous. I must have missed that he said he'd remove his name. First of all, having your name on the letter head is a prestige thing. Second, it would make him the token "male" in an all female firm. Third, this is David Lee and what we've seen of his ego, there's no way he'd do this for the same money. After all this buildup, with them kicking Cary out and the conspiring between lawyers to just have this happen in passing is terrible writing.


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

BrettStah said:


> Diane said David Lee was fine with the name of the firm being Lockhart, Florrick & Associates because he would still make the same amount of money, and he understood the importance of branding.





Steveknj said:


> This is so ridiculous. I must have missed that he said he'd remove his name. First of all, having your name on the letter head is a prestige thing. Second, it would make him the token "male" in an all female firm. Third, this is David Lee and what we've seen of his ego, there's no way he'd do this for the same money. After all this buildup, with them kicking Cary out and the conspiring between lawyers to just have this happen in passing is terrible writing.


Yep, I think that is out of character for David Lee. Money isn't the only thing he cares about. He likes power. And having your name on the letterhead gives you more power.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

Steveknj said:


> This is so ridiculous. I must have missed that he said he'd remove his name. First of all, having your name on the letter head is a prestige thing. Second, it would make him the token "male" in an all female firm. Third, this is David Lee and what we've seen of his ego, there's no way he'd do this for the same money. After all this buildup, with them kicking Cary out and the conspiring between lawyers to just have this happen in passing is terrible writing.





loubob57 said:


> Yep, I think that is out of character for David Lee. Money isn't the only thing he cares about. He likes power. And having your name on the letterhead gives you more power.


I don't know if there are any upcoming David Lee scenes, but just because David Lee says he's OK with it doesn't mean that he is actually OK with it. He could just be biding his time while he plots a coup.


----------



## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

Personally, I LOVED this episode.

It had everything.

I was laughing.

I was crying.

But mostly, I was thinking how much I am going to miss this show.

Definitely one of my favorites!!!


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

BrettStah said:


> I don't know if there are any upcoming David Lee scenes, but just because David Lee says he's OK with it doesn't mean that he is actually OK with it. He could just be biding his time while he plots a coup.


That's the David Lee we know and love.


----------



## Howie (May 3, 2004)

What Ninny said.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

I liked the episode, even if I felt they spent a little too much time on the show-with-the-show ... I get that it's a running gag, but it was a bit much knowing that the series is ending soon.


----------



## Gerryex (Apr 24, 2004)

nyny523 said:


> Personally, I LOVED this episode.
> It had everything.
> I was laughing.
> I was crying.
> ...


I agree. I thought it was a great episode and very evident that the show is heading to a series finale.

Gerry


----------



## Graymalkin (Mar 20, 2001)

nyny523 said:


> Personally, I LOVED this episode.
> 
> It had everything.
> 
> ...


I'm with Ninny. It's great that just about everybody got in there. The only person I really missed was Elspeth. Maybe they're holding her in reserve for the finale.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Graymalkin said:


> I'm with Ninny. It's great that just about everybody got in there. The only person I really missed was Elspeth. Maybe they're holding her in reserve for the finale.


It may be a scheduling issue as Carrie Preston has been working on Crowded, which is shot in Los Angeles.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

JYoung said:


> It may be a scheduling issue as Carrie Preston has been working on Crowded, which is shot in Los Angeles.


I'd be surprised if we see her again. I think her appearance a few eps ago was probably the final time we see her.

And I'd be even more surprised if Kalinda makes an appearance. I guess they could make up some reason for her to show up for Peter's trial, but I really doubt it.

So Peter gave the missing bullets to Diane's hubby. Hum, that could get interesting. Eli had hired Diane, and Cary had hired Canning. They made a big point of telling us that Peter's lawyer is out, so wonder who is going to end up representing Peter? You would think it would have to be someone from Lockhart, Florrick and Associates, but I wonder who? Maybe Eli will release Diane so she can represent Peter. But then she might have to throw her hubby under the bus. I really hope we get to see the trial and the verdict. I want to know if Peter goes back to prison or not!

Way too much kid drama. Hope we've seen the last of them.


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

I knew there was no way Peter was really going to take the deal. Then Alicia's phone buzzes and I knew the jury came back early. What else were they going to do for the finale? Will Peter go to jail or not? I'm guessing there isn't a hung jury if they came back so soon.


----------



## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

One more episode.

I'm gonna cry...


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

For some reason last night I thought that was the finale, and so when it ended like that, I was like... whaaaat? That's it?!


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

When they said there was a surprise witness I almost expected it to be Kalinda. But I knew that was a long shot.


----------



## Saturn_V (Jun 2, 2007)

loubob57 said:


> When they said there was a surprise witness I almost expected it to be Kalinda. But I knew that was a long shot.


I did not think I'd miss Archie Panjabi as much as I do. And slightly annoyed in an episode titled "Verdict" we get no verdict.


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

Saturn_V said:


> I did not think I'd miss Archie Panjabi as much as I do. And slightly annoyed in an episode titled "Verdict" we get no verdict.


There is a verdict, we just don't know what it is yet...


----------



## efilippi (Jul 24, 2001)

I think the series has to/will end with a happy ending so the verdict will be 'not guilty' so that the divorce can go forward, and Alicia and Jason can be a couple. 

I'd like to see Cary get a break but not sure how that would happen. Eli and the governor will get along ok, no matter what.

Overall a good show, one that will be missed.


----------



## knuckles (Dec 21, 2002)

I'll be glad when it's over. This season has not been that good for me.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

I didn't really understand Cary's flub on the stand when he said "We knew the bullets damned Peter" when he meant "We knew the bullets damned Locke".

Was that his way of throwing Peter under the bus so the jury would have in their minds that the "bullets damned Peter"?


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

Cainebj said:


> I didn't really understand Cary's flub on the stand when he said "We knew the bullets damned Peter" when he meant "We knew the bullets damned Locke".
> 
> Was that his way of throwing Peter under the bus so the jury would have in their minds that the "bullets damned Peter"?


Or it could make the jury think Cary had it in for Peter, which calls the motive of Cary's testimony into question.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

I said to my wife when he said he'd take the deal...you watch, the phone is going to ring with the verdict and he'll never get the chance...and that's what happened. It was too predictable. I think it will surprise me if they come back with a guilty verdict. Legal Eagles here....can Peter still take the deal before the verdict is read? 

I think there will be one more scene between Peter and Alicia and she will still have difficulty divorcing him because of it. And I'm not sure, in the end, what she's going to do.

And btw, was ANYONE surprised that David Lee didn't take the all-female name firm quietly? Last week, Diane mentioned he was ok with it, because the money was the same either way and he gets branding.....so now all of a sudden he isn't? It seemed so out of character that he would agree to it without a fight.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

I think this objection was that it was more than a marketing/branding ploy because they were interviewing mostly female candidates.


----------



## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

I hope the show doesn't end revealing a 3 year dream with Alicia winding up with Will. Or a 7 year dream with her winding up with Clooney.


----------



## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

I am both excited and sad to see how it ends.

I will really, really miss this show - one of my favorites.


----------



## knuckles (Dec 21, 2002)

Plenty of action but I didn't care for the way it ended.


----------



## Graymalkin (Mar 20, 2001)

Well, that was... interesting.

Some insights about the finale can be gleaned from the creators, Michelle and Robert King, if you go to CBS.com. Now I understand what they were trying to do. I just don't agree with it.

Rewatched the finale for Downton Abbey -- _that_ is how I like a series to end.


----------



## Family (Jul 23, 2001)

I loved this series once, but in the last couple of years it became cartoonish. Story lines were repeated adnauseam and made no sense. 

I liked the ending. After all Alicia represented the series as The Good Wife. For me Dianne slapping her symbolized the audience's feelings concerning how this once great series finished.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

I liked that they brought back Will.
[My only complaint is the kitchen set looked different from the kitchen we have seen in her house prior to this.]

I did not like the last few minutes, particularly the slap.
I am sure there are all sorts of reasons to justify it but. Didn't work for me.


----------



## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

I loved that they brought back Will.

I knew as soon as she walked into the apartment the third time we were going to see him - very exciting.

I'm not gonna lie, I didn't love the finale overall. I do understand the slap, but I didn't like it, either.

For me, the finale was two episodes earlier - I thought that episode really wrapped the show up the way they should have...(the Ketubah party).


----------



## Saturn_V (Jun 2, 2007)

I liked the finale... I like that Alicia wasn't able to get her happy ending- which is fitting for the character. 

Didn't see Josh Charles coming back at all. Pleasant surprise.


----------



## SleepyBob (Sep 28, 2000)

I thought the Will parts were a nice nod, but there was little else to like about the finale. It definitely went out with a whimper.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

Graymalkin said:


> Some insights about the finale can be gleaned from the creators, Michelle and Robert King, if you go to CBS.com. Now I understand what they were trying to do. I just don't agree with it.


Is it as simple as they did not want to give her a happy ending?

I also thought her hair was odd - I know she wears wigs for the shows but something about it was off.


----------



## EWiser (Oct 2, 2008)

Glad the show is over. 6 years is enough and I think they should have ended it 2years ago when more people would have cared. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

I didn't really like how they ended it, either. It was just kind of boring.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

I loved the series, but wasn't thrilled with the finale. I've never cared about Peter, so there was no tension for me at all regarding his trial. I didn't care what happened to him, and I hated how they tied him to Alicia like a boat anchor. She became so much more than just "The Good Wife" that it felt like a disservice to her character that he kept pulling her back.

I really wish they had spent more time on Cary and what was going to happen at the new firm since those are people I did care about. Oh well, it was a great run, just not a great ending. I'll miss this show very much.


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

I heard a review on NPR this morning. It pointed out that this episode mirrored the pilot in several ways. Alicia having to stand by Peter's side at a press conference where he resigns, then when they left in the pilot she slaps Peter, in the finale she gets slapped by Diane.

While it could have been a happy ending and all that, nothing is ever neat and tidy on this show. So overall I'm okay with it.


----------



## ADG (Aug 20, 2003)

Horrible ending


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

hummingbird_206 said:


> I hated how they tied him to Alicia like a boat anchor. She became so much more than just "The Good Wife" that it felt like a disservice to her character that he kept pulling her back.


But that's life. When you divorce someone you have kids with you're tied to them forever. It would have been unrealistic to just drop him.



loubob57 said:


> While it could have been a happy ending and all that, nothing is ever neat and tidy on this show. So overall I'm okay with it.


I agree.


----------



## Dawghows (May 17, 2001)

I'm glad they didn't tie up all the loose ends. It wasn't a spectacular finale, obviously, but spectacular is not what this show was about. I thought it offered a reasonable measure of resolution while also remaining true to the overall vibe of the show.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

I didn't really like the ending. I hated that we had to endure another episode of the trial which I thought was about to be tied up the previous week. I would have rather they spend some time on what happens after the trial. I get the slap was a throwback to the original episode (I said to my wife, back where it all began), but I guess they wanted to show how Alicia hardened after all those years. How she is now, at least professionally the type who just tries and gets what she wants and steps on others. I think over the last two years, the Alicia character was no longer one I respected and had become so cold hearted that I really didn't like her anymore. And in the end, her moves ended with essentially her crushing her best friends marriage and getting slapped. She became a user. She used Eli, she used Cary, she used Peter and she used Diane. I'm glad she didn't get her happy ending.


----------



## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

Alicia was far from a perfect person. One of the things that made this show so great is that all of the characters were gray - there was no black and white to be found.

Was Alicia hardened by the things she went through? Without a doubt. People deal with things differently. She treated a lot of people poorly. But this was a woman who, for all of her life up to the point that the show began, did everything for everyone else. She never put herself first - or even close to first. The arc of the character was a woman finding herself - outside the confines of marriage and motherhood as much as she could. She was far from perfect, but who among us is?

Let's not forget - SHE was betrayed as well. Her husband betrayed her more than once. Eli betrayed her terribly (for his own purposes). Cary betrayed her, too - he was not a loyal partner to her. And Diane was using her for her on needs as well. Let's be real here - she didn't act in a vacuum. You have a lot of very imperfect, HUMAN characters doing what they do. Which, again, made the show great.

I didn't love her at the end - but I respected that the character showed a lot of growth, and learned to survive. One thing the ending showed us is that she is ultimately alone, and when you are alone you need to be strong and be able to take care of yourself. I think Alicia will survive and thrive.


----------



## Dawghows (May 17, 2001)

nyny523 said:


> Alicia was far from a perfect person. One of the things that made this show so great is that all of the characters were gray - there was no black and white to be found.
> 
> Was Alicia hardened by the things she went through? Without a doubt. People deal with things differently. She treated a lot of people poorly. But this was a woman who, for all of her life up to the point that the show began, did everything for everyone else. She never put herself first - or even close to first. The arc of the character was a woman finding herself - outside the confines of marriage and motherhood as much as she could. She was far from perfect, but who among us is?
> 
> ...


Well said. :up:


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

When she went to the office at night and they showed the DANGER sign I thought the floor was going to collapse and that would be the end of Alicia. Anybody else?


----------



## Dawghows (May 17, 2001)

loubob57 said:


> When she went to the office at night and they showed the DANGER sign I thought the floor was going to collapse and that would be the end of Alicia. Anybody else?


It crossed my mind, but I didn't really think they'd go that route.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

nyny523 said:


> Alicia was far from a perfect person. One of the things that made this show so great is that all of the characters were gray - there was no black and white to be found.
> 
> Was Alicia hardened by the things she went through? Without a doubt. People deal with things differently. She treated a lot of people poorly. But this was a woman who, for all of her life up to the point that the show began, did everything for everyone else. She never put herself first - or even close to first. The arc of the character was a woman finding herself - outside the confines of marriage and motherhood as much as she could. She was far from perfect, but who among us is?
> 
> ...


I get that, but in the end, she became THEM. She became everyone who ever stepped on her. She became the kind of ruthless, selfish person they all became, with little of the compassion she had earlier. She became the kind of lawyer that gives the profession a bad name.


----------



## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

Steveknj said:


> I get that, but in the end, she became THEM. She became everyone who ever stepped on her. She became the kind of ruthless, selfish person they all became, with little of the compassion she had earlier. She became the kind of lawyer that gives the profession a bad name.


I don't think it is as clear cut as you are making it to be. I thinks she became more human.

She was perfect Alicia at the start. The "Good Wife". Doing everything she thought she should do, even at the expense of her own life and happiness.

She found herself. Herself is far from perfect, but she is real. She has wants, and needs and goals and aspirations. She is seeking happiness just like the rest of us. She is good at her job. She makes mistakes. She has doubts. She questions her choices.

She is far from the cookie-cutter characters we see in a lot of television shows, which is what set this show apart.


----------



## Marc (Jun 26, 1999)

My only complaint about the ending scene was the slap. More specifically, it was Alicia's reaction to the slap. She seemed surprised and taken aback, but given that she betrayed Diane and saw that Diane was hurt by Lucca's questioning of Diane's husband, Kurt, the shock seemed out of place.


----------



## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

Marc said:


> My only complaint about the ending scene was the slap. More specifically, it was Alicia's reaction to the slap. She seemed surprised and taken aback, but given that she betrayed Diane and saw that Diane was hurt by Lucca's questioning of Diane's husband, the shock seemed out of place.


I think, in the moment, she felt she was finally free to move forward. She left Peter. She was looking for Jason. She was a named partner in a prestigious law firm. Her kids were starting their own lives. I don't think what she had done to Diane the day prior was really on her mind (and perhaps she didn't feel responsible because "she" didn't do it herself).

I think the slap came out of left field for her at that moment. I think it brought reality crashing in. I think she WAS shocked, if for no other reason than the timing.

And frankly, grown professional women don't go around slapping each other everyday - so the act in and of itself would have been pretty shocking...


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

nyny523 said:


> I think, in the moment, she felt she was finally free to move forward. She left Peter. She was looking for Jason. She was a named partner in a prestigious law firm. Her kids were starting their own lives. I don't think what she had done to Diane the day prior was really on her mind (and perhaps she didn't feel responsible because "she" didn't do it herself).
> 
> I think the slap came out of left field for her at that moment. I think it brought reality crashing in. I think she WAS shocked, if for no other reason than the timing.
> 
> And frankly, grown professional women don't go around slapping each other everyday - so the act in and of itself would have been pretty shocking...


And that's the crux of why I felt Alicia changed, and not for the better. She felt nothing for throwing Diane under the bus, and in fact, she didn't even think about it. She turned into exactly what the other shark lawyers were, which at the beginning of the series she felt disdain for. I think part of this is that Will kept her grounded, mentored her, and was the moral conscious of the firm. And even HE had a dark side. Now she's the same SOB as every other lawyer she's encountered over the last year, and some that weren't lawyers. She learned to play their game, and is a much worse person for it. Sure she has her independence, but in my opinion she lost her dignity and much of what was appealing about her as a person.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

Steveknj said:


> And that's the crux of why I felt Alicia changed, and not for the better. She felt nothing for throwing Diane under the bus, and in fact, she didn't even think about it. She turned into exactly what the other shark lawyers were, which at the beginning of the series she felt disdain for. I think part of this is that Will kept her grounded, mentored her, and was the moral conscious of the firm. And even HE had a dark side. Now she's the same SOB as every other lawyer she's encountered over the last year, and some that weren't lawyers. She learned to play their game, and is a much worse person for it. Sure she has her independence, but in my opinion she lost her dignity and much of what was appealing about her as a person.


Alicia's point was that if Diane wasn't personally involved with the witness, she would have been fully on board with cross examining him about the discrepancy with his earlier testimony, and any potential conflicts of interest with that blonde protege of his.


----------



## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

Steveknj said:


> And that's the crux of why I felt Alicia changed, and not for the better. She felt nothing for throwing Diane under the bus, and in fact, she didn't even think about it. She turned into exactly what the other shark lawyers were, which at the beginning of the series she felt disdain for. I think part of this is that Will kept her grounded, mentored her, and was the moral conscious of the firm. And even HE had a dark side. Now she's the same SOB as every other lawyer she's encountered over the last year, and some that weren't lawyers. She learned to play their game, and is a much worse person for it. Sure she has her independence, but in my opinion she lost her dignity and much of what was appealing about her as a person.


I think you are trying to turn Alicia into the kind of cookie cutter character that we are accustom to seeing.

I don't think Alicia is a "bad" person. I don't think she is a "shark". I think she is very good at what she does. I think in order to be good at what she does, there are times when she needs to compromise some of the things she used to be. Does that make her "bad"? I don't think so. I think it makes her flawed. I think it makes her human. I think that in order to move and grow, we are all perhaps placed in situations where we do things that might not be to our liking. That's life. None of us is perfect. None of us always do the "right thing".

But this is precisely why, IMHO, people enjoyed this show. It was a lot of very human characters doing a lot of very flawed things. Here is a woman who was thrust into some very difficult situations - through no fault of her own - and in her own way, she triumphed. She didn't triumph unscathed - that wouldn't be realistic. But she regained her life. She regained control. She ABSOLUTELY made mistakes in doing so - but again, that is what made her so real.


----------



## Flop (Dec 2, 2005)

BrettStah said:


> Alicia's point was that if Diane wasn't personally involved with the witness, she would have been fully on board with cross examining him about the discrepancy with his earlier testimony, and any potential conflicts of interest with that blonde protege of his.


This. Diane let her personal feelings about a witness, not what was best for her client, dictate her legal strategy decisions.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

BrettStah said:


> Alicia's point was that if Diane wasn't personally involved with the witness, she would have been fully on board with cross examining him about the discrepancy with his earlier testimony, and any potential conflicts of interest with that blonde protege of his.


I agree, and that's my point as well. There IS no moral compass for any of these people. They do what they have to do and step on others feelings, friend or foe. It no longer matters. I get that a lawyer is supposed to do whatever it takes for their client, but that's also why lawyers are hated (until you need one of course!!). Alicia became one of them, a finely honed machine that will step on anyone to win a case. Early in the series we saw her have the moral fiber from time to time to find the truth (and she used Kalinda's help often for those cases). Now we see a person who no longer cares as much about the truth as doing whatever it takes. Is she a flawed person? Always was. Did she become a person who I used to like but now don't? Yes. As I said, she became the same as the rest of them. And maybe that's what they were trying to show. I'm not saying she's a cookie cutter character, far from it. I'm saying she developed into something that was not so great. Much more flawed on a personal level and much less so on a professional level.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

Flop said:


> This. Diane let her personal feelings about a witness, not what was best for her client, dictate her legal strategy decisions.


Personal feeling? It's much more than that, it's her HUSBAND. That said Diane would have done the opposite to Alicia if things were reversed. Which goes to my point that Alicia became the same as the rest of them. As I said, Alicia is a much better lawyer, but a much worse person. Sorry, but I have little respect for people who throw their friends under the bus, especially without running it by them first, and if they say no, then it should be no.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

Attorneys should not be in a position of choosing between protecting their expert witness spouse or doing everything possible to defend their client. Diane should have recused herself when it was clear that the best thing for the client was to try to raise reasonable doubt with the expert witness.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

Diane is a hard-ass enuf of a lawyer that I don't think she would have blocked him from testifying in the first place - let alone be so pissed about it that she would slap Alicia over it.

I don't remember Alicia slapping Peter in the pilot episode so I understand it from a come full circle moment but... still doesn't work for me.

I think I agree with the other poster - the party episode is how they should have ended the series.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

The Los Angeles Times' Mary McNamara had a take that I basically agree with.



> I realize that the relationship between audience and creator has changed in the digital age, and who would begrudge a networks quest for multiplatform crossover. But when you have written an intentionally provocative finale to your very popular show, you need to give your audience time and space to be provoked before offering them a mini-lecture on Repetition and Symbolism in The Good Wife.
> 
> David Chase let audiences stew for years about what his maddening stunt of a "Sopranos" finale meant, and most people still arent sure.
> 
> ...


I honestly felt that the Kings could have done a better job but it's nowhere near How I Met Your Mother territory.


----------



## Flop (Dec 2, 2005)

Steveknj said:


> Personal feeling? It's much more than that, it's her HUSBAND. That said Diane would have done the opposite to Alicia if things were reversed. Which goes to my point that Alicia became the same as the rest of them. As I said, Alicia is a much better lawyer, but a much worse person. Sorry, but I have little respect for people who throw their friends under the bus, especially without running it by them first, and if they say no, then it should be no.


I know it's her husband, but it is still "personal feelings" about the witness trumping the best legal strategy for her client. Diane did a disservice to her client. Does this make Alicia a bad person? In this case, probably, but the client is her "husband" and father of her children. So, because Diane wants to protect her husband from a harsh cross-examination, Alicia should roll over and not zealously defend her's? Any other expert in the same position, Diane would have gutted without thought. This just makes her a hypocrite.


----------



## scooterboy (Mar 27, 2001)

Saturn_V said:


> I liked the finale... I like that Alicia wasn't able to get her happy ending- which is fitting for the character.


Can someone explain to me how we know that she didn't get her happy ending (slap aside)?

At the end, she thought she saw Jason, chased him, and saw it wasn't him. Can someone please tell me how that means she didn't get a happy ending?

How do we know she didn't find Jason later?


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

We're judging the show based on what happened in the show, not what might happen in our imaginations.


----------



## Saturn_V (Jun 2, 2007)

scooterboy said:


> Can someone explain to me how we know that she didn't get her happy ending (slap aside)?


Standing by Peter have have cost Alicia both Diane and Jason and she realized that. Walking towards the camera with tears welling in her eyes is a big indicator to me.


----------



## efilippi (Jul 24, 2001)

But why would standing by Peter have ruined things with Jason? I thought they were on the same page.


----------



## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

Again - I don't think it is as black and white as "happy ending" or "not happy ending".

It wasn't an ending of anything but the show. Our characters presumably go on with their lives. 

She finally let Peter go.

Maybe Alicia and Diane make up and work together - maybe they don't. 

She might end up with a stellar political career. Or not.

Maybe she ends up with Jason. Maybe not.

It was certainly not a good night - but it was ONE NIGHT. She's been through worse and survived. No one died this time. She finally made a break from her anchor of a husband. 

She is moving on.


----------



## Family (Jul 23, 2001)

Can someone answer this? Why did the cross examination help Peter? His original testimony conflicted with the correct one. He was wrong and blondie was right. Now new evidence made Peter look more guilty. The trial wasn't about guilt or innocence anyway, but whether Peter was corrupt. The fact that the bullets went missing and they were more likely used in the murder; how does that result in a plea bargain being reduced to a slap on the wrist from a DA who was relentlessly trying to put Peter in jail the longest he could.

And the whole thing with Jason and Alicia was ridiculous. He chases her for several episodes, she whispers in her ear to wait, and then suddenly he disappears? It's the writers who deserved the slap.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

Family said:


> And the whole thing with Jason and Alicia was ridiculous. He chases her for several episodes, she whispers in her ear to wait, and then suddenly he disappears? It's the writers who deserved the slap.


Honestly, I never felt the spark between Jason and Alicia. It seemed to me, more often than not, she used him when she needed him, and maybe that was what the ending was supposed to be about. She uses people, the same way that Peter used people, and maybe Jason realized that. But when she finally realized that maybe there's something there with Jason, he's gone. Good for him.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

I always kinda hoped that she and Peter would really reconcile. I know that's not a very popular opinion and people thought he was a boat anchor dragging her down. 

I never liked the Jason storyline. The whole thing just gave me a weird vibe and for me, the writing just made him come off as slightly creepy. Thanks CBS for ruining Denny Duquette for me.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

laria said:


> I always kinda hoped that she and Peter would really reconcile. I know that's not a very popular opinion and people thought he was a boat anchor dragging her down.
> 
> *I never liked the Jason storyline. The whole thing just gave me a weird vibe and for me, the writing just made him come off as slightly creepy. Thanks CBS for ruining Denny Duquette for me. *


This!! The Jason character always reminded me of the type of character who would eventually snap (they actually alluded to him having temper issues at one point). I was half thinking at one point he'd snap and hold Alicia for hostage or do bad things to her..but that never happened. His slow cadence, was just kind of creepy.


----------



## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

LOL not to mention his casting on The Walking Dead. That one week when he was on BOTH TWD and TGW at 9 pm on a Sunday kinda bugged me out.


----------



## connie_w (Jan 10, 2015)

She ended up with ...nothing. 

No Will, no Peter, no Jason, no friend Diane.


----------



## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

connie_w said:


> She ended up with ...nothing.
> 
> No Will, no Peter, no Jason, no friend Diane.


She lost both Will and Peter a long time ago.

We have no idea if she lost Jason.

Diane was not her friend. She was her business partner. Diane was using her - and she knew it. It was business. So she didn't lose a friend. She MAY have lost a business partner, but knowing Diane, she will do what is best for her business and will likely try to reconcile.

Meanwhile, there was talk of a future political career for Alicia. She is still a good lawyer, regardless of where she ends up working. She has her children. And she has a whole world of possibilities/opportunities in front of her. She is far better off than she was at the start of this journey. She is her own person. She is not a perfect person, but who is?


----------



## connie_w (Jan 10, 2015)

nyny523 said:


> She lost both Will and Peter a long time ago.
> 
> We have no idea if she lost Jason.
> 
> ...


That's the thing about shows. Different viewers, different perceptions.


----------



## Hcour (Dec 24, 2007)

Marathoned the whole season in the last week. It was pretty good but I'm confused as hell about one thing - In the trial the whole thing with the phone and there being another person there when the 911 call was made, minutes before the murder. It was setup like it was going to be this big revelation that was going to solve everything. Then the woman who had the phone gets on the witness stand and it goes absolutely nowhere and just gets dropped from the trial (and the story). Either I completely missed something or it made absolutely no sense.

Also didn't care for the slap and dark ending. I don't need a happy ending but it seemed contrived and too abrupt.


----------



## efilippi (Jul 24, 2001)

I liked the slap but agree that the phone thing didn't seem to make sense. No idea what happened.


----------



## Hcour (Dec 24, 2007)

efilippi said:


> I liked the slap but agree that the phone thing didn't seem to make sense. No idea what happened.


Oh good, it wasn't just me. It was so odd I thought maybe I'd blacked out or had an out-of-body experience or something and just missed it. The way the whole thing was being presented it was like there were two trials going on at once - Peter's and the murder mystery - and it seemed as if the murder would be solved with some kind of twist. Which I thought was very clever. But then it never materialized, they just dropped it. Uncharacteristically poor writing for this show.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

All of the stuff with finding/testing the bullets and the phone call were after the case had gone to the jury. The judge was the only one hearing the evidence in relation to answering questions from the jury. While all of that was going on, Alicia was negotiating with the prosecutor for a plea deal.


----------



## jr461 (Jul 9, 2004)

I just watched the entire series over the last few weeks. For the first 5 seasons i thought it was one of the best drama series, maybe ever. So well written, great characters, etc. Then Will was killed off. I perused some pages here and agree with those who mentioned that that was the beginning of the end of the magic of this show. 

i loved that the show always had lots of law stuff while the politics and personal relationships played a less prominent role. For me, the cases and professional drama surrounding them were the most compelling parts of the show. Peter's politics and shenanigans were an important part of Alicia's character and how it affected her professionally was much more important to me than his political campaigns.

Once Will was killed off, the subsequent episodes were brutal. I get the grieving to a point but from that point she became an adolescent, doe-eyed, sometimes sex crazed, bitter, uncaring shrew. She went from someone to root for to someone to not even care about or want to see on screen. This came and went in varying degrees through her SA campaign and "relationship" with Jason, as the series ended with her chasing him, again, like a schoolgirl after a crush, caring about nothing and no one else.

Overall it was therefore a good series but was was really great. This happens a lot when shows overstay their welcome (Dexter, Homeland, Ray Donovan, Weeds, to name a few) but I suppose those involved in the show are too close to see the deterioration happening in the moment.

I did really like all the guests who appeared and the variety of judges who almost always provided good entertainment.

My favorite character was Eli, by a mile. And if his daughter had more screen time she would be up on the list as well and, in fact, she is great on The Good Fight. Honorable mention to Louis Canning (see love to hate below).

Least favorite became Alicia, again by a wide margin. And her mother. One of those beyond stupid characters I hate on TV shows.

Loved to hate Canning and Jackie. David Lee was on this list initially but he became a cartoon character the last season or so.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

I miss this show. But yeah, the last couple of seasons it went downhill fast. @jr461 where did you stream it from? I wouldn't mind doing a binge re-watch. One of these days I have to subscribe to CBSAA and binge The Good Fight.


----------



## Saturn_V (Jun 2, 2007)

hummingbird_206 said:


> where did you stream it from?


TGW has been on Amazon Prime for several years. It doesn't binge well after the fourth season.

I keep hoping Elsbeth will be a regular cast member of TGF, and that Kalinda Sharma would cameo in.


----------



## NorthAlabama (Apr 19, 2012)

i just binged from season 1, but dropped out mid-way through season 6 for the same reason. still, a great show.

kalinda was always my favorite character, but all of the recurring opposing counsel characters were great.

this moment is probably my favorite scene from any series i've ever watched (season 4?):



Spoiler: kalinda


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

That was a great scene! Kalinda was awesome. I liked her scenes with the drug dealer guy that Alicia represented. Sucked that Kalinda and Alicia stopped having scenes together because Julianna didn't like Archie (or whatever their real life issue was.)


----------

