# Is now the time to buy?



## heh3d (Aug 2, 2007)

Hey guys,
I'm considering buying a Premier 4 since I'm moving from an apartment with UVerse to one where I'll need to get Comcast; and I don't think I can take the Comcast supplied DVR. I long ago had a first gen DirecTivo but haven't had any flavor of TiVo since and I've always looked forward to getting another some day.

My question is, should I maybe wait? I understand the Premier 4 is a few years old at this point and TiVo likely has something new coming down the channel in a few months or so? As much as I hate Comcast's boxes, does it maybe make more sense for me to hang out and get whatever the new offering is with a lifetime sub once it becomes available rather than dropping a couple hundred on something now and retiring it in a year?

Any advice is much appreciated.


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## BigJimOutlaw (Mar 21, 2004)

Tough for me to recommend buying anything now unless you NEED it now, with the new boxes likely dropping in only 2-3 months. Personally I would probably tolerate the Comcast DVR just for the short term and swap it for a cablecard and Series 5 later. Barring any unlikely catastrophic issues, it's probably going to be considerably more enjoyable to use than the current line.


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## jakerock (Dec 9, 2002)

Don't forget to factor in a few months for anything new that comes out to have the bugs worked out of it. Generally when TiVo first releases new hardware there are things about it that really distress people until they are changed with future SW releases.


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## 9300170 (Feb 21, 2003)

And the boxes have a premium price at first. I still smart over my $1K Series 3.


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## spaldingclan (Aug 22, 2012)

oof. I guess the $35 I paid for my Series 3 is a good deal


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

The price of an XL4 right now is $300, lowest price since the Woot sell-off of the Elite branded XL4 model.
http://www.amazon.com/TiVo-Premiere-TCD758250-Digital-Recorder/dp/B005TI1ILS/

I don't recall having seen a Woot sale of Refurbished XL4's yet, so we may yet see those priced around $250 at some point soon.


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## monkeydust (Dec 12, 2004)

I'd certainly wait and buy a S5 if they are coming out in a couple months. I've own a S1, S2, S3, Elite and Mini. They don't really support previous models that well with software updates and the Premier's are dreadfully slow when it comes to apps like Hulu and Netflix.


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## supasta (May 6, 2006)

Wait and the new model will be delayed for months.
Buy now and the new model will release the following day. 

There just really isn't any way to know.


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## poofy (Jan 16, 2012)

CoxInPHX said:


> The price of an XL4 right now is $300, lowest price since the Woot sell-off of the Elite branded XL4 model.
> http://www.amazon.com/TiVo-Premiere-TCD758250-Digital-Recorder/dp/B005TI1ILS/
> 
> I don't recall having seen a Woot sale of Refurbished XL4's yet, so we may yet see those priced around $250 at some point soon.


I am waiting for XL4 to hit around $250!

The only advantage that an S5 (which I do not think will be out until April 2014 at the earliest) might or might not have will probably be:
1. 6 tuners instead of 4 with OTA
2. Built in wifi
3. Larger HD and possibly faster processor
4. Price tag of $499-$699
5. Super buggy for the initial 6 months after release.

None of the above matters to me, so come on Amazon or Best Buy or who ever bring XL4 down to $250!!!! Although $300 is good too if you need one right now.


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## NotNowChief (Mar 29, 2012)

TiVo is REALLY bad with this.

They speculate this Fall for new boxes, which really means late Spring 2014. At best.

If you need something, go for it and take advantage on one of the deals. If you are patient and can wait another year or so, then hold out.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Heck, I update my box every few years anyhow...which I can afford since I keep my Hondas for 15 years or more...


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## stoli412 (Nov 22, 2003)

Personally I'd by a cheap no-committment Premiere off of eBay or something for right now and wait for the new Series 5 to come out, hopefully this fall.

Watch out for the refurb deals from Woot and other places. They are still locking you into a 1-year committment for TiVo service.


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## heh3d (Aug 2, 2007)

Thanks guys, this is really helpful. I'm thinking with the Premier 4 being pretty inexpensive right now, it might be good to pick one up to use for a while until the 5s bugs and price are knocked down. Since it's all pretty new to me I don't feel the need to be super early adapter. I've done fine with 3 HD tuners and ~70 hours HD recording space with UVerse; and tend to use my PS3 for Netflix etc. anyway. I'm guessing the guide and general interface is pretty acceptable (read: not too slow) in the Premier 4/4XL - so fixing that won't be one of the 5s features?


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

heh3d said:


> Thanks guys, this is really helpful. I'm thinking with the Premier 4 being pretty inexpensive right now, it might be good to pick one up to use for a while until the 5s bugs and price are knocked down. Since it's all pretty new to me I don't feel the need to be super early adapter. I've done fine with 3 HD tuners and ~70 hours HD recording space with UVerse; and tend to use my PS3 for Netflix etc. anyway. *I'm guessing the guide and general interface is pretty acceptable (read: not too slow) in the Premier 4/4XL - so fixing that won't be one of the 5s features?*


The current SW Vers 20.3.1 has really slowed the HDUI down for me, on the XL4, before this latest update the HDUI was very acceptable, speed wise, others will disagree, I am assuming this will be fixed with the next update (hoping anyway).

As for the rumored S5s they should be noticeably, much faster than the current 4/XL4s.


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## moedaman (Aug 21, 2012)

heh3d said:


> Thanks guys, this is really helpful. I'm thinking with the Premier 4 being pretty inexpensive right now, it might be good to pick one up to use for a while until the 5s bugs and price are knocked down. Since it's all pretty new to me I don't feel the need to be super early adapter. I've done fine with 3 HD tuners and ~70 hours HD recording space with UVerse; and tend to use my PS3 for Netflix etc. anyway. I'm guessing the guide and general interface is pretty acceptable (read: not too slow) in the Premier 4/4XL - so fixing that won't be one of the 5s features?


I would buy right now. Get lifetime on it and then down the road sell it to help pay for a S5 after some of the birthing pains are fixed. They are still fine dvrs and if you use your PS3 for streaming, you might not even need to upgrade for quite some time anyway.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

CoxInPHX said:


> ...As for the rumored S5s they should be _*noticeably, much faster*_ than the current 4/XL4s.


And you base this statement on what?


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

Bierboy said:


> And you base this statement on what?


Hope!!


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## L David Matheny (Jan 29, 2011)

CoxInPHX said:


> As for the rumored S5s they should be noticeably, much faster than the current 4/XL4s.





Bierboy said:


> And you base this statement on what?


After all the complaints about inadequate processing power in the Series 4 units, he's just assuming that that there is enough collective intelligence at TiVo that they won't make that same pathetic mistake again. If the Series 5 units don't have considerably more memory and much faster CPUs, they will probably fail in the marketplace, as indeed they should.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

Given that the Mini already shows huge performance boost vs series 4 units I'd say it's a safe bet that series 5 units will be on par or better than the Mini's performance or at least significantly better than series 4 units. I can't wait to dump my laggy Elite in favor of a faster model with 6 tuners even with the inevitable early adopter issues that come with a new unit.


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## Rose4uKY (Mar 28, 2003)

I have 2 series 3 Tivo's now and I am moving. One is on Lifetime the other isn't. I was thinking maybe selling the LT for 200 and the other for 100. We want to get the highest Premiere 2000 HR/300HD hour DVR plus 2 minis we have 3 TV's total. I hear people talking about Elite what is that? Is it another name for the Premiere XL?

And my last question is and I didn't want to start a new thread or read through a ton of threads but Tivo offered me 2 deals one for a factory renewed Tivo with a free moca or a new one at a discounted price but I buy the moca.. I forgot the price on both and will call them back tomorrow to verify but is a factory renewed one ok to buy anyone ever gotten one? I guess I need to ask Tivo what the warranty is on it I think they told me it's the same as a new one I am not sure though I forget. But I just wondered what other people thought if I should get the factory renewed with free moca or get new Tivo and pay I think the mocha is 50 bucks. And of course I will need 2 minis there's no discount on them there 99 bucks. I have beena Tivo customer since the 1st single tuner Tivo. Just not sure which route to go thanks...



moyekj said:


> Given that the Mini already shows huge performance boost vs series 4 units I'd say it's a safe bet that series 5 units will be on par or better than the Mini's performance or at least significantly better than series 4 units. I can't wait to dump my laggy Elite in favor of a faster model with 6 tuners even with the inevitable early adopter issues that come with a new unit.


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

Rose4uKY said:


> I have 2 series 3 Tivo's now and I am moving. One is on Lifetime the other isn't. I was thinking maybe selling the LT for 200 and the other for 100. We want to get the highest Premiere 2000 HR/300HD hour DVR plus 2 minis we have 3 TV's total. I hear people talking about Elite what is that? Is it another name for the Premiere XL?
> 
> And my last question is and I didn't want to start a new thread or read through a ton of threads but Tivo offered me 2 deals one for a factory renewed Tivo with a free mocha or a new one at a discounted price but I buy the mocha.. I forgot the price on both and will call them back tomorrow to verify but is a factory renewed one ok to buy anyone ever gotten one? I guess I need to ask Tivo what the warranty is on it I think they told me it's the same as a new one I am not sure though I forget. But I just wondered what other people thought if I should get eh factory renewed with free mocha or get new Tivo and pay I think the mocha is 50 bucks. And of course I will need 2 minis there's no discount on them there 99 bucks. I have beena Tivo customer since the 1st single tuner Tivo. Just not sure which route to go thanks...


The Elite IS the Premiere XL4 they just changed the name. An Elite would be an older unit manufactured before approx July 2012, all Refurbs from TiVo will most likely have an XL4 name plate.

What is TiVo asking for a Factory Refurbished XL4? You can get a new one from Amazon for $300.

Would you use the MoCA adapter? If not then I wouldn't choose that bundle option, pure Ethernet is better and simpler if Ethernet is an option.

A Factory Refurbished unit from TiVo does carry the same warranty as a new unit, and is eligible for the same extended warranty, so that should not be an issue.

TiVo has an $80 off Premiere 4/XL4 and Mini Bundle also
http://www3.tivo.com/promo/minidvrbundles/index.html?WT.ac=tivohome_mantle_minidvrbundles


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## Rose4uKY (Mar 28, 2003)

Thank You So Much! I forgot what they offered me for the Factory Renewed with Mocha and new without. I just called them back and there not their yet. My boyfriend said we may not need the Mocha but to take it if it's free but if I am better off getting a new than a factory renewed I will. I think one was 369 with Mocha and the other was 349 without I think. He said the renewed is not a refurb I don't know he said it's different. So If I am going to have 3 TV"s and 2 minis in the bedroom if it were you would you sell your other Tivo with the lifetime or keep it just in case. I don't know what to do. My one without lifetime I'm gonna try to get a 100 for it but if I sell the Lifetime I'll try for 200. I'll also check Amazon is 300 for the latest one with 2000 hours/ 300 HD hours. I'll never have to worry about anything recording with that no more message telling me I need to delete this to record this.
Thanks Again!

Edit: Ok turns out Amazon was a 100 cheaper but than my monthly would be 14.99. If I get rid of my one Tivo that I was paying 6.95 on and keep my Lifetime and my boyfriend can get rid of his which was 9.95 a month and I transfer service to new box from my grandfathered in 6.95 box I can get the new Premiere XL4 paying regular price but pay 6.95 a month over 14.99. So I hope I did the right thing I paid 399 plus bought 2 mini's and I am getting a brand new box and he still through in a free moca adapter and a Point Of Interest thing we need. He said you've been a customer for 10 years so I hope I did the right thing. Was considering Dish and the Hopper with there Joey's but have had and liked Tivo for so long that were sticking it out. I love Tivo so I hope I got a decent deal. And if I can at least sell my one Tivo for a 100 bucks that's not lifetime that will help. And my boyfriend maybe can sell his too. Thanks Again for your input I appreciate it.



CoxInPHX said:


> The Elite IS the Premiere XL4 they just changed the name. An Elite would be an older unit manufactured before approx July 2012, all Refurbs from TiVo will most likely have an XL4 name plate.
> 
> What is TiVo asking for a Factory Refurbished XL4? You can get a new one from Amazon for $300.
> 
> ...


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## riz (Dec 30, 2000)

Do you guys the the s5 will will have software features that will NOT work on my XL4?


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

riz said:


> Do you guys the the s5 will will have software features that will NOT work on my XL4?


If anybody gives you a answer they would be guessing, nobody who does know will post that information on this forum.


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## monkeydust (Dec 12, 2004)

riz said:


> Do you guys the the s5 will will have software features that will NOT work on my XL4?


Based on what the S4 has versus the S3, I'd have to guess "yes".


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## Rose4uKY (Mar 28, 2003)

I have two more questions one since I'm moving in with my boyfriend and we both have lots of different season passes is there a way to separate like have his seasons passes in one folder maybe and mine in another. Or are we both going to see each others season passes in the now now playing list? Just got word my Tivo Premiere and Mini's were shipped today just ordered and I am not moving till next Friday. It's going to be so nice to just go to any Tivo in my new condo and watch any recorded show. Now I have to transfer from one Tivo to the other.. But will I still be able to transfer shows to my computer? I have Tivo desktop but will probably buy the plus for converting and I want to be able to put a show on my internet tablet which is Android so I can watch at work on my break. Also I just watched this video on the TiVo Mini's so they need cable cards too and is it a single or multi? Thanks!


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

There is no way to seperate Season Passes or My Shows it will only be one list. TiVo never did release the User profiles.

The Mini does not need a CableCARD, not sure what video you saw, but it wasn't the TiVo Mini. All a Mini needs is either a MoCA connection or an Ethernet connection.
http://www.tivo.com/assets/pdfs/products/Mini_Start_Here_Poster.pdf


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## t1voproof (Feb 6, 2010)

I would buy now and include lifetime. You can sell later and at least break even if you choose to upgrade.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

riz said:


> Do you guys the the s5 will will have software features that will NOT work on my XL4?


In the short term probably not. Right now the Mini and the Premiere units run the same software, so it's likely the new units will be synced to the same version as well. (or more likely all boxes will be synced to whatever version the new box ships with)

However the new boxes will have much faster hardware so long term they may start adding features that are only capable of running on the new hardware.

No one really knows except TiVo what their plans are for the Premiere going forward. But given how many they have deployed to cable partners they may be obligated to support them a big longer then they have in the past.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

Dan203 said:


> <snip>
> No one really knows except TiVo what their plans are for the Premiere going forward. But given how many they have deployed to cable partners they may be obligated to support them a big longer then they have in the past.


That seems like a double-edged sword: The whole partner thing. TiVo seems to drop the ball on the retail consumers when they are distracted with lawsuits and other business matters. Let's hope they got/get better at juggling...

EDIT/ADD: Then again, maybe I'm just still miffed a bit over all the Premieres I ran out and bought when both TiVo and Cox said they had an agreement to do On-Demand, then it never happened, and each side still blames the other for it not happening... Yet, the press-release for it is still on TiVo's website, like they leave it there for good PR, for those who don't know it never actually happened...


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## garycase (Jul 29, 2013)

Considering buying a Premier (or two) ... but have some questions about long term archival storage.

=> What are the restrictions on transferring shows to a PC via Tivo Desktop? I know shows you can't transfer are marked -- but since I don't have a Tivo unit yet, I have no idea how common that is. Are most major network shows freely transferrable? Cable networks? etc. I'd guess that the restrictions are primarily on premium channels (HBO, etc.), but would appreciate some feedback from those of you who have these units.

=> Is there a limit on the size of the datastore for Tivo Desktop? i.e. if I map a drive to a large RAID array [e.g. 10TB or larger] will it work okay with that?

=> Can you watch shows saved on a PC from another PC that's also running Tivo Desktop?

=> Basically the "Tivo infrastructure" I'm thinking about is a new 4-tuner XL4, with a bunch of PCs running Tivo Desktop. My understanding is this will let me watch anything that's recorded from any PC on our network. Is this correct? The 2nd part of that is to transfer everything we want to keep for a while to the main Tivo Desktop system (with the BIG storage array), so it doesn't have to occupy space on the XL4. I'd appreciate any feedback on whether or not this will all work okay as I'm planning it. [e.g. do shows transferred to a PC via Tivo Desktop have to stay on the XL4? ... which would, of course, kill my idea !!]


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

The first Question is who is your Cable Provider, and City.

With Cox and TWC basically everything except the Local stations are copy protected and cannot be transfers off the TiVo, to a PC or even another TiVo. Copy protected recordings can only be Streamed between Premieres and a Mini using TiVo's Multi-Room Streaming.

For transferring non-copy protected recordings you will want to look at KMTTG and pyTivo along with Streambaby, also, will make life much easier.


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## ggieseke (May 30, 2008)

There are no size limits, and you can watch the recordings on another PC as long as Desktop is installed and set to the same Media Access Key.


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

CoxInPHX said:


> The price of an XL4 right now is $300, lowest price since the Woot sell-off of the Elite branded XL4 model.


Dropped another $10 now $290.67 or $284.99 from Yogi Computers via Amazon.
http://www.amazon.com/TiVo-Premiere-TCD758250-Digital-Recorder/dp/B005TI1ILS/


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

garycase said:


> Considering buying a Premier (or two) ... but have some questions about long term archival storage.
> 
> => What are the restrictions on transferring shows to a PC via Tivo Desktop? I know shows you can't transfer are marked -- but since I don't have a Tivo unit yet, I have no idea how common that is. Are most major network shows freely transferrable? Cable networks? etc. I'd guess that the restrictions are primarily on premium channels (HBO, etc.), but would appreciate some feedback from those of you who have these units.
> 
> ...


For *many* people, only premium channels (e.g. HBO) are protected. I think that's the case for me, though I have a smaller set of channels than I used to at my previous house (though I still have HBO due to a package deal). As someone else said, some cable networks protect even more.

They are legally required to NOT protect the cable versions of broadcast channels, so you can complain to the FCC if those are protected.

The "datastore" is just a drive you connect to your computer. After you download (and decrypt) the files, they're just regular MPEG files.


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

CoxInPHX said:


> The price of an XL4 right now is $300, lowest price since the Woot sell-off of the Elite branded XL4 model.





CoxInPHX said:


> Dropped another $10 now $290.67 or $284.99 from Yogi Computers via Amazon.


Closeout???
Price just keeps dropping, How low will it go?
Dropped another $15 now $274.85
http://www.amazon.com/TiVo-Premiere-TCD758250-Digital-Recorder/dp/B005TI1ILS/

Best Buy appears to be out of stock.
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/Premiere+High-Definition+Digital+Video+Recorder/3438692.p?


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

Yeah I could've sworn I saw the XL4 on Amazon new for ~$223 a day or so ago!


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

I'm sure they're trying to get rid of stock. Rumor has it the new S5 will be released in the next couple months.


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## Rose4uKY (Mar 28, 2003)

I just bought a new Premiere I guess it's the XL 4 the 300 hour one and I was told I couldn't keep my 6.95 if I bought from Amazon and they knocked 50 bucks off the price and I got 2 minis and they gave me a free Moca so that wasn't bad. I've been with them for 10 years and stuck with them over the Hopper and Joeys. I love the new Premiere over my series 3 and we still can't get over how many shows we have and only 13% full. I have 66 HD shows when before I only could have 20 and never had it over 10-15 to save space LOL! This thing is awesome!



HarperVision said:


> Yeah I could've sworn I saw the XL4 on Amazon new for ~$223 a day or so ago!


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## HenryFarpolo (Dec 1, 2008)

The XL4 is $266 today on Amazon with free shipping if you have a Prime acct.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

Dan203 said:


> I'm sure they're trying to get rid of stock. Rumor has it the new S5 will be released in the next couple months.


I'm thinking available for _purchase_ in September and I'm really hoping they don't _announce_ before Labor Day when everyone's on vacation... but signs are pointing that way. Hope I'm wrong.


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## HenryFarpolo (Dec 1, 2008)

The XL4 is $248 and the Premiere 4 is $148 at my local BB. (Salem NH) if you are interested. Only one of each on the shelf.


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## stack (Aug 19, 2013)

I am in the same boat. Thinking of picking up a 4 with lifetime so i can get a mini as well. Moving into a place with Cox cable and need to figure out the best route to take and how long to wait before everyone starts putting their 4's online for sale with lifetime.


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## thyname (Dec 27, 2010)

stack said:


> I am in the same boat. Thinking of picking up a 4 with lifetime so i can get a mini as well. Moving into a place with Cox cable and need to figure out the best route to take and how long to wait before everyone starts putting their 4's online for sale with lifetime.


Well, Romeo is out. Check Tivo website. This is the new Series 5 tivo with 6 tuners and built in Tivo Stream!


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