# 6.3f is here



## kenr

I noticed my TiVos now have version 6.3f ready to install. Two versions show up in my MFS:

6.3f-01-2-101	tyDb	3395068	12/08/07 03:11 780
6.3f-01-2-121	tyDb	3395073	12/08/07 03:11	780

Perhaps this is the fix for the 6.3e problem?


----------



## biker




----------



## BigFoot48

After yet another reboot during a recording a few days ago, I'm ready!


----------



## Dkerr24

Good luck with 6.3F... Think I'll stick with rock solid 6.2a


----------



## SteelersFan

Dkerr24 said:


> Good luck with 6.3F... Think I'll stick with rock solid 6.2a


I'm with you! Nothing beats 6.2a with MRV!


----------



## rbtravis

You mentioned 6.f but no one said what what model? This is almost as good as listening to half a newscast.


----------



## CrashHD

Series2 DTivos, including the HR10-250. The R10 is the only one I have not seen a slice for yet, but I'm sure it will be soon.


----------



## rbtravis

I just tried to restart my system to try a new version. Nothing happened. Guess it isn't out yet on the west coast, Maybe only in the area having problems.


----------



## dcstager

My Hughes SD-DVR80 has two new entries in the SwModule MFS entry dated 12/07/07, but no new choices in the SwSystem MFS area. Hmmm?


----------



## kenr

Since some people were wondering what units got the new software, here's my situation.

On a Philips, DSR704, currently running 6.2a-01-2-301, I got:
6.3f-01-2-101	tyDb	3395068	12/08/07 03:11 780
6.3f-01-2-121	tyDb	3395073	12/08/07 03:11	780​
On a RCA, DVR40, currently running 6.2a-01-2-321, I got:
6.3f-01-2-101	tyDb	2298952	12/08/07 03:14 780
6.3f-01-2-121	tyDb	2298957	12/08/07 03:14	780​
On my two Hughes, DVR40s, running 6.2a-01-2-351, I did not get 6.3f

When 6.3f was downloaded, 6.3e was removed from SwSystem in MFS.

I plan on not letting these versions install since I want to continue using MRV.


----------



## stevel

I don't see a 6.3f in the MFS of my HR10 as of tonight.


----------



## robpickles

::Glimmer::

I see hope on the horizon. But i will wait for more before trying it.

Rob


----------



## rcwinter

I have a hr10-250 and it has 6.3f-01-2-357 ready to be install.


----------



## jcf2001

stevel said:


> I don't see a 6.3f in the MFS of my HR10 as of tonight.


My R10 does not show an update either. How do you tell if one is ready to be installed?


----------



## bengalfreak

jcf2001 said:


> My R10 does not show an update either. How do you tell if one is ready to be installed?


Your system info screen will say 'Pending Restart'.


----------



## chrishicks

my parents are forcing calls like crazy hoping to get this. they are seeing reboots at least 2 times a day on a fairly new hdd(installed and received 6.3e 2 days later). as of now still nothing.


----------



## CrashHD

they are unlikely to get it over the phone. I believe DTV typically sends out updates for a long period of time (4-6 weeks??) over the sat, and they don't usually put it out over the phone until after it's done on the sat.


----------



## wedgecon

CrashHD said:


> they are unlikely to get it over the phone. I believe DTV typically sends out updates for a long period of time (4-6 weeks??) over the sat, and they don't usually put it out over the phone until after it's done on the sat.


Actually all software updates are now done via the sat. The unit then has to call in to activate the download, and this part is staggered over a 4 to 6 week period.

Right now it appears that various units are in the process of receiving the download but it is not known if any activations have happened.


----------



## CrashHD

not as of a week ago. I had a unit freshly imaged at 6.2a, set it up to dial in, and it downloaded that way (sat was not even hooked up).


----------



## stevel

Forcing calls multiple times a day will not accomplish anything. If their TSN is not in the list to install an update, it won't install.


----------



## chrishicks

stevel said:


> Forcing calls multiple times a day will not accomplish anything. If their TSN is not in the list to install an update, it won't install.


I know that but they are just so fed up with 6.3e they just won't listen to reason.


----------



## rock_doctor

chrishicks said:


> I know that but they are just so fed up with 6.3e they just won't listen to reason.


I know how they feel! ;-)

mark


----------



## Dkerr24

CrashHD said:


> not as of a week ago. I had a unit freshly imaged at 6.2a, set it up to dial in, and it downloaded that way (sat was not even hooked up).


Why on earth would you let a unit with 6.2a dial in and get one of these new bug infested versions?


----------



## CrashHD

It's just a test unit. It's for tinkering with things like HME apps, testing kernels. I set it to download 6.3e so I could capture the slices. I was 90% done when someone told me where I could find the slices already captured. 

Testing 6.3e on it gave me a proper appreciation for what a fine version 6.2a is (although the HME weather applet in Galleion was a gadget I liked a lot.)


----------



## Dkerr24

CrashHD said:


> It's just a test unit. It's for tinkering with things like HME apps, testing kernels. I set it to download 6.3e so I could capture the slices. I was 90% done when someone told me where I could find the slices already captured.
> 
> Testing 6.3e on it gave me a proper appreciation for what a fine version 6.2a is (although the HME weather applet in Galleion was a gadget I liked a lot.)


Ahh... now I understand.

One of the things about this site that cracks me up are all these folks that think they really need to leave a landline plugged in. A Tivo version is much like a computer motherboard BIOS version. Once you got one that works, don't screw with it by downloading a new one!


----------



## dcstager

I definetely have 6.3f in the MFS of my Hughes SD-DVR80 - it is the 151 version even though my 6.2a install is a 351 version. I'm not going to mess with it until more is known.


----------



## CrashHD

The version suffix stopped matching with 6.3e see post 5 here. (Anyone know how to link directly to a post instead of a whole thread?)

The short of it is this:
R10's will still be -521
HR10's will still be -357
Samsung models will still be -381

Everything 1xx should have a numbers matching slice
Everything else -3xx will now be -1xx


----------



## badagliacca

Will HDVR2 units be upgraded to 6.3f?


----------



## CrashHD

unless you stop it by upgradesoftware=false or no phone connection, I'm pretty sure yes.


----------



## chrishicks

I take it no one is using this yet?


----------



## CrashHD

6.3f slicepack, includes all SD series2, HR10, and R10.

6.3f


----------



## bengalfreak

CrashHD said:


> here. (Anyone know how to link directly to a post instead of a whole thread?)


Yup, click the post number in the upper right hand corner. Then use the resulting URL in your link. It will take you to the thread with the selected post first a the top of the screen.


----------



## Gunnyman

After playing with the HME stuff for a couple of days, I'm bck to 6.2 on both of my Tivos.


----------



## John T Smith

1st notice of this was 12/9 and it is now 12/15 and I'm still at 6.3e

4 stock units (3 SD 1 HR10) and nothing at all shows as "pending" (Vancouver WA) so I guess the rollout hasn't made the Pacific time zone


----------



## CrashHD

I don't think it's area/timezone specific. Only two of my units have gotten 6.3f from the sat. Also worth noting, I've seen several reports of the new software being present in MFS, but no reports of the software installing yet. Your units may already have 6.3f on them, and just be waiting for an installation activation phone call.


----------



## John T Smith

CrashHD said:


> may already have 6.3f on them, and just be waiting for an installation activation phone call.


Hmm... I've forced the call, twice on one of the units, and still no install

I guess it's possible DTV wants to wait for a certain date until the trigger will run the installer


----------



## stevel

Still no sign of 6.3f in MFS on my HR10.


----------



## litzdog911

No 6.3f on my HR10-250 or R10 DVRs yet.


----------



## CrashHD

<EDIT> There's a superpatch in this thread at post 58. Better to use that than this. I'm leaving this here though, just for the fact that it allows you to patch the 6.3f tivoapp somewhere other than while it's running on the tivo</EDIT>

Here's a script to patch 6.3f:


Code:


#!/bin/sh

echo "Patching 6.3f Tivoapp"
echo "Copying /tvbin/tivoapp /tvbin/tivoapp.tmp"
cp /tvbin/tivoapp /tvbin/tivoapp.tmp
echo "Done copying, now patching tivoapp.tmp"

# Disable Encraption:
echo -ne "\x3c\x02\x00\x00" | dd conv=notrunc of=/tvbin/tivoapp.tmp bs=1 seek=1602336
# Enable 30sec skip:
echo -ne "\x10\x40\x00\x2b" | dd conv=notrunc of=/tvbin/tivoapp.tmp bs=1 seek=6707932
# Backdoors:
echo -ne "\x24\x10\x00\x01" | dd conv=notrunc of=/tvbin/tivoapp.tmp bs=1 seek=2804772
# HMO/HME:
echo -ne "\x34\x11\x00\x00" | dd conv=notrunc of=/tvbin/tivoapp.tmp bs=1 seek=903776
echo -ne "\x24\x10\x00\x01" | dd conv=notrunc of=/tvbin/tivoapp.tmp bs=1 seek=1118652 
echo -ne "\x10\x00\x00\x14" | dd conv=notrunc of=/tvbin/tivoapp.tmp bs=1 seek=5705052
# Remove "*Tivo Plus features (trial ends today)"
echo -ne "\x24\x02\x00\x00" | dd conv=notrunc of=/tvbin/tivoapp.tmp bs=1 seek=918052
# Enable on-screen clock (SPS9S toggle)
echo -ne "\x10\x40\x00\x1e" | dd conv=notrunc of=/tvbin/tivoapp.tmp bs=1 seek=176752


echo "Moving the running /tvbin/tivoapp to /tvbin/tivoapp.orig.bak"
mv /tvbin/tivoapp /tvbin/tivoapp.orig.bak
echo "Done that, moving /tvbin/tivoapp.tmp /tvbin/tivoapp"
mv /tvbin/tivoapp.tmp /tvbin/tivoapp

exit

There are no version checks as with superpatch, so be careful what you do with it. When superpatch gets updated for 6.3f, that will probably be the better thing to use.

Also, bufferhack uses the same patch points as it did for 6.3e:


Code:


set sys(6.3f)[list 0x0d6af2  0x0d690a  0x71   0x19e7e6  22029540  A9846DD76AEF86CEA6B3E69CE3758227598991A0]


----------



## dcstager

Anyone who has upgraded, care to share what's new in this release?


----------



## stevel

From what I have read so far, there's no user-visible feature changes. It's probably a bug fix release, though what it supposedly fixes I have not seen stated.


----------



## ebonovic

From what I have been told.

It is a fix to address the recent stability/restart issues.
No new features, no other fixes.


----------



## lew

Do you know what 6.3e changed?



ebonovic said:


> From what I have been told.
> 
> It is a fix to address the recent stability/restart issues.
> No new features, no other fixes.


----------



## chuckg

I have not seen anything to indicate it has actually been activated on any series 2 receivers. Has it?

To see how stable 6.3f is I might put a spare 160GB drive with 6.3e on it back into my second unit which I powered down recently until I need to record more than two channels simultaneously. Late spring probably.


----------



## dthreet

chrishicks said:


> I take it no one is using this yet?


I have this on both my HR10's but I cant tell any diffrence


----------



## JimSpence

ebonovic above mentioned this may be fixing stability and restart issues. Since the HR10s don't seem to be having as many of these issues, it isn't surprising that differences won't be noticed.


----------



## dtremain

lew said:


> Do you know what 6.3e changed?


The interface for setting up the Channels I Receive and Favorites lists was greatly improved with 6.3e.

I didn't see any improvements other than that, just the problems that have been described here on one of my two units (the other has worked flawlessly.)


----------



## dcstager

I have to wait for an updated superpatch before risking it. Is anyone working on that? CrashHD's script seems to have all the patches, but I'm still hoping for a special superpatch such as the one that was issued for 6.2a.


----------



## CrashHD

I'll probably be able to take a crack at making a superpatch module by the end of this weekend, if no one else does by then.


----------



## kenr

ebonovic said:


> From what I have been told.
> 
> It is a fix to address the recent stability/restart issues.
> No new features, no other fixes.


It's nice to see DirecTV is admitting to fixing a problem that they wouldn't admit existed in the first place


----------



## dcstager

CrashHD said:


> I'll probably be able to take a crack at making a superpatch module by the end of this weekend, if no one else does by then.


I know I'd appreciate it. I'm sure it will be used by hundreds of people. I think this version of tivoapp may be out there a while as current. They did promise a lot of new features by first quarter 2008, but I'm sure it be more like a year from now.

The Directivo is about the only reason to keep a standard 4:3 tv anymore. It's the most useful and reliable TV invention and now that they got it perfect, regular tv is fading and the invention is becoming obsolete.

I've got to find me a 40" Sony CRT and hang on a little longer.


----------



## Brainiac427

Has 6.3f gone national yet? I don't want to plug my phone line back in until it does.


----------



## dtremain

Brainiac427 said:


> Has 6.3f gone national yet? I don't want to plug my phone line back in until it does.


It obviously hasn't loaded up on anyone's system yet. You'll know when it does. This thread will be about 20 pages long.


----------



## CrashHD

Brainiac427 said:


> Has 6.3f gone national yet? I don't want to plug my phone line back in until it does.


Why? I can see having the phone unplugged to avoid the update, but if you sound like you do want it. If you do, why not plug it in?


----------



## rminsk

CrashHD said:


> Why? I can see having the phone unplugged to avoid the update, but if you sound like you do want it. If you do, why not plug it in?


Because the roll out has not started yet. The OP would download 6.3e which the OP does not want.


----------



## Brainiac427

CrashHD said:


> Why? I can see having the phone unplugged to avoid the update, but if you sound like you do want it. If you do, why not plug it in?





rminsk said:


> Because the roll out has not started yet. The OP would download 6.3e which the OP does not want.


Actually, I'm already stuck with 6.3e. I learned on here about pressing Pause-5-2 to reinstall the software on the alternate partition. I actually thought I would be reinstalling the old 6.2a, but all I got was 6.3e again. However, I was doing fine with it. I left the phone line plugged in just in case a fix was released. Then one day the box spontaneously rebooted even though it was in standby mode. I noticed under system information that a call to the mother ship went out that morning. That was it for me. I did the Pause-5-2 thing again and unplugged the phone line. I haven't had any problems since, though admittedly I've been using it sparingly because I don't trust it. If I can get 6.3f, and it proves to be stable, I might start trusting it again to use it more.


----------



## CrashHD

superpatch for 6.3f is done. In testing now. If the box boots, it shall be posted.


----------



## CrashHD

Done. Tested working on a DirecTV R10. I believe tivoapp is the same on all of them, but I'm not certain. Anybody that tries it, please post your results. Consider it as beta software until a few positive test reports come back, and even then, use at your own risk. 

Upload to your tivo in your favorite way. Chop .txt off the filename to make it .tcl. chmod 0755, and execute it. Enjoy


----------



## dcstager

Thanks Crash. The work is much appreciated.


----------



## bwash

ebonovic said:


> From what I have been told.
> 
> It is a fix to address the recent stability/restart issues.
> No new features, no other fixes.


Do you have any idea when all of us who are experiencing reboots, and freeze ups will get this upgrade. I had 6.3e for a few months before I started having problems (hard drive is less than 1 year old and worked perfect under 6.2), and now I do get problems over a few days and then it stops for a week or two and starts up again.

I wonder how many of us are out here?


----------



## ssorrell

I have a Phillips Series 2 DSR704 and am still waiting on the upgraded version to see if all these dang restarts stop. My wife is ready to go out and buy a new DirecTivo because she doesn't understand that it is a software issue and not a problem with the unit itself. 

If they've got a fix for all of these problems, why in the world isn't it getting out faster? August was horrible. Then it got better. Now for the last couple of weeks it's worse than ever, even rebooting in the middle of watching a recorded program. And now it's a problem on all channels, not just a few like it was in August.

If I don't get the fix soon, my service will be virtually useless as we can't watch TV without freezes and restarts. It's quite frustrating.


----------



## dcstager

The patch worked on my SD-DVR80. I had to remember to run it with tivosh though. The only thing I could not get to work after the upgrade was the gotomydvr application. I don't know why that would occur, but it has.

I redid the full tweak.sh thing and everything, but no more gotomydvr.


----------



## bwash

dcstager said:


> I redid the full tweak.sh thing and everything, but no more gotomydvr.


I don't believe ssorrell has a hacked unit, but rather waiting for the 6.3f version to be updated via the phone call after the software is downloaded to his system.


----------



## dcstager

Just giving CrashHD some feedback since no one else seems to have reported success with his superpatch for 6.3e. It worked and everything seems fine, except that one utility gotomydvr.

I updated to 6.3f-01-2-151 on a Hughes SD-DVR80. The service number of my unit begins with 351, so I was not sure the 151 software would work. However, the information that the software version numbers are changing and may no longer match the service number has panned out since the 151 version worked on a 351 unit.


----------



## CrashHD

Thanks for the feedback.

I've never used the gotomydvr utility, so I'm not familiar with it, but I am doubtful any tivoapp patches would cause it to work/not work. I would think the problem with it must be elsewhere.

If 6.3f is like past versions in this regard, -101, -121, or -381 would have also booted up and run on your unit. -151 is the best guess at what is supposed to be the correct software. Any of the software versions will work, except the -521. The -521 has different hardware, and needs it's own different kernel to run. Even the HR10 version runs on the standard Series2 units. To be honest, I don't really know why it's actually important to keep the exactly correct software on it. I always do, just in case there is an important reason the correct software needs to be on it.


----------



## ssorrell

Correct...I do not have a hacked unit.

After 4 reboots yesterday, I called DTV in the middle of a freeze during a PPV program. The tech support person was going to "escalate" it to engineering to see if I could get a fix soon. If I haven't heard anything or received any update in a WEEK, I am supposed to call them back. She acted like this was the first time she had ever heard anything about the freezes and reboots. 

I guess I'll see if anything happens...what other choice do I have?


----------



## dtremain

ssorrell said:


> She acted like this was the first time she had ever heard anything about the freezes and reboots.


CSRs for all companies almost always act that way. Why the "suits" think that it's a good business practice to treat customers like they are stupid is beyond me. But, it's, by no menas, just Directv.


----------



## dcstager

Just as a bit of an update... Tivoweb and gotomdvr aren't working, but I believe it's because the new software has a screen to "enable home network applications" and to specify the IP address of your computer running Tivo Desktop. So, this version looks a lot like the one mentioned in press releases for 2008. None of the applications such as are visible under a standalone series 2 are actually there. Not sure how they get installed. Under Music, Photos and more is where the enable home network applications menu selection and Tivo Desktop setup are. But no live365 or Podcaster or any of that stuff. Can't connect to it by http, but still can FTP and telnet. It looks like the way is being paved to future upgrades, but not all there yet.


----------



## Da Goon

dcstager said:


> Tivoweb and gotomdvr aren't working, but I believe it's because the new software has a screen to "enable home network applications" and to specify the IP address of your computer running Tivo Desktop. So, this version looks a lot like the one mentioned in press releases for 2008.


Nope. That stuff is just the remnants of HME code that wasn't stripped away. The same as MRV/HMO in the past with 6.2. Tivoweb and gotomydvr work just fine here.


----------



## dcstager

Are you running Tivoweb and gotomydvr on 6.3e? If these screens are leftover, why weren't they present on 6.2a? Of course this could all be my own screw-up of something.

Help me out please.


----------



## dcstager

Notice to all. Just stick with 6.2a as long as possible. Sigh.


----------



## Gunnyman

dcstager said:


> Are you running Tivoweb and gotomydvr on 6.3e? If these screens are leftover, why weren't they present on 6.2a? Of course this could all be my own screw-up of something.
> 
> Help me out please.


because 6.2a doesn't HAVE HME, just HMO/MRV.
tivoweb and gotomydvr work just fine on 6.3.


----------



## dcstager

I have screwed up something then. Now comes the fun of figuring out exactly what.


----------



## newswatcher

dcstager said:


> Notice to all. Just stick with 6.2a as long as possible. Sigh.


How do you get back to 6.2a without a new image? I have 6.3 and the restarts are driving me mad. Any other way to get 6.2a?

Thanks!


----------



## Da Goon

newswatcher said:


> How do you get back to 6.2a without a new image?


Unfortunately, you don't.


----------



## dssdbs

Dkerr24 said:


> Ahh... now I understand.
> 
> One of the things about this site that cracks me up are all these folks that think they really need to leave a landline plugged in. A Tivo version is much like a computer motherboard BIOS version. Once you got one that works, don't screw with it by downloading a new one!


spreading misinformation? If you have more than 1 DirecTV receiver, in order to only pay the mirroring fee, you have to have a phone line connected to all your receivers. PERIOD!


----------



## CrashHD

newswatcher said:


> How do you get back to 6.2a without a new image? I have 6.3 and the restarts are driving me mad. Any other way to get 6.2a?
> 
> Thanks!


I'm working on that. I have used dvrupgrade's slicer to install 6.2a over 6.3f on my test unit, without problems. That unit was only used in 6.3f for a few days, and only had a few recordings, but it did work for that one.

Installing 6.2a over 6.3f without the slicer gave an error, and crashed out without installing anything. I was working on that, but that was a while ago, and I seem to have deleted my notes when I cleared my desktop since then, so I'm going to have to start over.


----------



## Gunnyman

dssdbs said:


> spreading misinformation? If you have more than 1 DirecTV receiver, in order to only pay the mirroring fee, you have to have a phone line connected to all your receivers. PERIOD!


ummm
no
I haven't had a land line to any of my 3 DTivos for going on 5 years now.
Mirrored just fine.
don't be spreading misinformation yourself.


----------



## CrashHD

Gunnyman said:


> ummm
> no
> I haven't had a land line to any of my 3 DTivos for going on 5 years now.
> Mirrored just fine.
> don't be spreading misinformation yourself.


Actually, I believe he's correct. I've read it on DirecTV's website. If you have a mirrored receiver, the phone lines are _supposed_ to be connected, but I have never heard of an instance of this policy being enforced. As more people are discontinuing their land lines in favor of other means, I have a hard time seeing this antiquated policy ever being enforced, too.


----------



## Gunnyman

dtv has dropped the phone line requirement since the R-15 doesn't need one. 
I never had to let it call in to activate like the DTivos do.


----------



## roehrle

I have verizon voicewing and haven't called in for over a year. Not that I intend to call in but I was wondering if it is possible to call in with VOIP ??


----------



## stevel

Some VoIP works better than others. VoiceWing seems to work, Vonage usually doesn't.


----------



## Rich584

I only have one TiVo that I use. D* Series 2 with a large HD. I've been going thru the same reboots that everyone else has for about 6 months or so. I have noticed that if I record on both tuners, thereby having no live buffers (I think), I can watch for as long as they are both recording. I'm talking football games here, about 4 hours each. No reboots that I can remember while recording on both tuners. Does this make sense to you, Gunny?

Rich



Gunnyman said:


> ummm
> no
> I haven't had a land line to any of my 3 DTivos for going on 5 years now.
> Mirrored just fine.
> don't be spreading misinformation yourself.


----------



## Rhughes

CrashHD said:


> Actually, I believe he's correct. I've read it on DirecTV's website. If you have a mirrored receiver, the phone lines are _supposed_ to be connected, but I have never heard of an instance of this policy being enforced. As more people are discontinuing their land lines in favor of other means, I have a hard time seeing this antiquated policy ever being enforced, too.


I activated my last DirecTivo a couple of weeks ago and even told the CSR I didn't have it connected to the phone line. I have two on the phone, and one not connected.


----------



## TivoPete1

I have two HDVR2 Tivos, one of which was upgraded to a Weaknees 400GB HD. The Weaknees unit started having reboot probs back in October coincidentally when the 6.3e software was installed. The DVR would freeze and reboot numerous times per day. I ordered a replacement HD from Weaknees but kept it in the box for the last 8 weeks as the rebooting problem gradually went away. This weekend I removed the 400GB HD and installed another, still in the box 300GB Weaknees HD, that I had ordered for my second HDVR2. After the install I kept the phone line connected only long enough to access the latest local phone numbers and then disconnected the phone line. I confirmed that the software version on the Weaknees HD was 6.2a but imagine my frustration when I encountered the same pixelization problem and "freezing" images with the newly installed 300GB Weaknees HD as I had with the "corrupted" 400GB (DTV software upgraded 6.3e) Weaknees HD that I had just replaced. The question I have, is WHY do I still have this problem with a newly installed 6.2a software version Weaknees HD? Is it really possible that I received a corrupted HD from Weaknees or is there something else going on here?


----------



## wscannell

Sounds like you may have the "tuner 2" problem where you get pixelization on tuner 2. If you have both composite and S-video outputs connected, try disconnecting one of them and see if the problem goes away.


----------



## TivoPete1

Thanks for the tip. I did have both S-Video and RGB connected. I have disconnected the S-Video and so far so good. I will keep my fingers crossed.
I am puzzled, however, that I had not had any problems with having both types connected over the last couple years. Is this connection/"pixelization" problem related at all to the 6.3e software upgrade problem?

Thanks again.


----------



## wscannell

The Sat 2 pixelization problem has been around for quite some time, so it is not related to 6.3e. The restart issue that you mentioned is a 6.3e problem. Removing the S-video cable will not fix the restarts.


----------



## CrashHD

No...this problem appears to be much older than the 6.3e software. It may even pre-date the 6.2 software, I'm not sure.


----------



## robpickles

Rich584 said:


> I only have one TiVo that I use. D* Series 2 with a large HD. I've been going thru the same reboots that everyone else has for about 6 months or so. I have noticed that if I record on both tuners, thereby having no live buffers (I think), I can watch for as long as they are both recording. I'm talking football games here, about 4 hours each. No reboots that I can remember while recording on both tuners.


This will also work if you set your tuners to XM stations.

When on the XM stations the buffers wont record, hence no reboots.

Rob


----------



## Rich584

Thanx for the tip Rob, I will be doing that. Wait... How do I do that? I can tune to one, but how about the other tuner? I have D* Series 2 SD TiVos.

I have determined over the last few months that the TiVos won't reboot if two tuners are recording or when the sat feeds are disconnected. I also spent about $300 on my own equipment, thinking that surely the rebooting must be my fault. D* pretty much said tough and offered to send a tech to the house to "fix" my software. How? They didn't know the answer to that.

Thanx,
Rich



robpickles said:


> This will also work if you set your tuners to XM stations.
> 
> When on the XM stations the buffers wont record, hence no reboots.
> 
> Rob


----------



## Rich584

CrashHD said:


> No...this problem appears to be much older than the 6.3e software. It may even pre-date the 6.2 software, I'm not sure.


I haven't had a beer or any alcohol for eight years and every time I see your signature I miss beer. I sure hope the benefits of not drinking outweigh the harm done by drinking. Nothing like a beer and an Italian meal. I envy you.

Rich


----------



## dtremain

Rich584 said:


> I haven't had a beer or any alcohol for eight years and every time I see your signature I miss beer. I sure hope the benefits of not drinking outweigh the harm done by drinking. Nothing like a beer and an Italian meal. I envy you.
> 
> Rich


Congratulations. As one Yankee fan to another, it must be particularly hard to stay dry at playoff time.

Keep up the good work.


----------



## Rich584

dtremain said:


> Congratulations. As one Yankee fan to another, it must be particularly hard to stay dry at playoff time.
> 
> Keep up the good work.


Thanx, and it is not something I think about any more. I am pessimistic and always think we are going to lose. 'Specially in the playoffs. Been right too often the last few years.

About the beer, I haven't lost weight. I exercise vigorously for hours several times a week when the weather permits and still can't lose weight. Don't have hangovers anymore, that's a plus. But I think I'm walking proof that "beer belly" is another urban myth.

Rich


----------



## dtremain

Rich584 said:


> Thanx, and it is not something I think about any more. I am pessimistic and always think we are going to lose. 'Specially in the playoffs. Been right too often the last few years.
> 
> About the beer, I haven't lost weight. I exercise vigorously for hours several times a week when the weather permits and still can't lose weight. Don't have hangovers anymore, that's a plus. But I think I'm walking proof that "beer belly" is another urban myth.
> 
> Rich


I guess we're hi-jacking the thread, but we're not the first.

I hardly ever drink (I've never had difficulty with it, as I know many people do), and if I have one or two beers a year (at a certain ballpark in the Bronx, perhaps), that's a lot.

But, I've sure got a beer belly. (One friend compares me to Homer Simpson and I can't deny it.)

It my case, it's all food (and I do go to the gym).


----------



## Rich584

dtremain said:


> I guess we're hi-jacking the thread, but we're not the first.
> 
> I hardly ever drink (I've never had difficulty with it, as I know many people do), and if I have one or two beers a year (at a certain ballpark in the Bronx, perhaps), that's a lot.
> 
> But, I've sure got a beer belly. (One friend compares me to Homer Simpson and I can't deny it.)
> 
> It my case, it's all food (and I do go to the gym).


Beer Belly = the newest urban myth. I'm really beginning to think it's true. When I was drinking, I never ate cake or candy or snacks. Didn't eat much at all. I've heard that booze is "empty calories".

As for hijacking the thread, that's how people learn. Not a bad thing to do as long as it doesn't get out of hand. And that is what the Moderators get the big bucks for.

Rich


----------



## dtremain

Rich584 said:


> And that is what the Moderators get the big bucks for.


LOL.


----------



## robpickles

Rich584 said:


> I have determined over the last few months that the TiVos won't reboot if two tuners are recording or when the sat feeds are disconnected. I also spent about $300 on my own equipment, thinking that surely the rebooting must be my fault. D* pretty much said tough and offered to send a tech to the house to "fix" my software. How? They didn't know the answer to that.


Just change one station to an XM station, then hit the INFO button and move down to the other tuner (the two dots which turn red when recording on the info screen - one for each tuner) and hit select. After you switch it, then tune in to another XM station.

There is probably an easier way but old habits die hard.

Rob


----------



## Rich584

Wow, over six years playing with TiVos and I had no idea you could do that. Never ceases to amaze me what you can do with the simple "peanut" remote. I use both the "peanut" and the HR20 D* Hi Def remote every day and it is really difficult to recall the buttons after using one and going to another.

Thanx,

Rich



robpickles said:


> Just change one station to an XM station, then hit the INFO button and move down to the other tuner (the two dots which turn red when recording on the info screen - one for each tuner) and hit select. After you switch it, then tune in to another XM station.
> 
> There is probably an easier way but old habits die hard.
> 
> Rob


----------



## Stephen M. Smith

robpickles said:


> There is probably an easier way but old habits die hard.
> Rob


Err, like just pushing the down arrow on the 4-way thumbpad?


----------



## johnhartshorn

For those wondering, I let my R10 phone home for the first time in ~180 days, and it loaded 6.3e (Wish I had checked here before letting it reboot, but that's life). Only been a few hours, but no random "Searching for satellite" yet.. NOt sure what version it was before (maybe 6.2 something)

This was more to let you know that 6.3f is apparently not switched "on" to everyone yet.

John


----------



## Curtis

robpickles said:


> Just change one station to an XM station, then hit the INFO button and move down to the other tuner (the two dots which turn red when recording on the info screen - one for each tuner) and hit select. After you switch it, then tune in to another XM station.
> 
> There is probably an easier way but old habits die hard.


You can just punch in any channel number that you don't receive.


----------



## CrashHD

Stephen M. Smith said:


> Err, like just pushing the down arrow on the 4-way thumbpad?


Or the LiveTV button while already watching LiveTV


----------



## BigFoot48

Still no 6.3f here, and no reboots or weird pauses in a month either.


----------



## stevel

My HR10 (6.3e) froze Wednesday - first time I've seen any problem in several months. There is still no 6.3f in MFS.


----------



## ssorrell

johnhartshorn said:


> For those wondering, I let my R10 phone home for the first time in ~180 days, and it loaded 6.3e (Wish I had checked here before letting it reboot, but that's life). Only been a few hours, but no random "Searching for satellite" yet.. NOt sure what version it was before (maybe 6.2 something)
> 
> This was more to let you know that 6.3f is apparently not switched "on" to everyone yet.
> 
> John


Yeah...I haven't gotten 6.3f either.

But...if and when you start to experience the problems that everyone else has had, you won't get any "Searching for satellite" message...the picture will freeze, audio will stop, both will come in and out for brief moments, and then the picture and audio will go out entirely. This could last for 5 minutes or 20 minutes, then it will eventually reboot itself. And...then it could do all of that all over again in a very short time period. I was watching a PPV movie the other day and it froze and rebooted twice in an hour and a half. Thank goodness it was an All Day Ticket.


----------



## wedgecon

ssorrell said:


> Yeah...I haven't gotten 6.3f either.
> 
> But...if and when you start to experience the problems that everyone else has had, you won't get any "Searching for satellite" message...the picture will freeze, audio will stop, both will come in and out for brief moments, and then the picture and audio will go out entirely. This could last for 5 minutes or 20 minutes, then it will eventually reboot itself. And...then it could do all of that all over again in a very short time period. I was watching a PPV movie the other day and it froze and rebooted twice in an hour and a half. Thank goodness it was an All Day Ticket.


Does anybody who did not manually hack their DirecTivo's have 6.3f yet? As far as I know DirecTV has not turned it on for anyone.


----------



## dtremain

wedgecon said:


> Does anybody who did not manually hack their DirecTivo's have 6.3f yet? As far as I know DirecTV has not turned it on for anyone.


None that I've seen. My units have called in several times since this was first posted, and no sign of a re-boot from the calls.

Everything looks normal on the standard menus.


----------



## SteelersFan

Here's what I have on one of my boxes but I won't be letting it install 6.3x. I like my MRV!


----------



## richierich

Both of my HR10-250s rebooted last night and the one downstairs is unplugged from the phone line so I the latest software download want get activated, in case there are problems such as reboots with this latest software version.

So I gather that since it says "Pending Restart", that I will get the latest version of the software activated at around 2:00 A.M. tomorrow morning (according to the message about the Pending Restart). 

What will this version number be??? I guess we will then have overlap protection and ability for Remote Scheduling, etc.


----------



## stevel

No, the overlap protection and remote scheduling is coming some unspecified time later this year. 6.3f is a bug fix update only.


----------



## Rich584

johnhartshorn said:


> For those wondering, I let my R10 phone home for the first time in ~180 days, and it loaded 6.3e (Wish I had checked here before letting it reboot, but that's life). Only been a few hours, but no random "Searching for satellite" yet.. NOt sure what version it was before (maybe 6.2 something)
> 
> This was more to let you know that 6.3f is apparently not switched "on" to everyone yet.
> 
> John


Worry about the rebooting. That's more likely than "searching..."

Rich


----------



## John T Smith

I wonder if this update is regional or maybe only to a SAMPLE of people?

Over here on the West Coast (Vancouver WA) I'm still running 6.3e and that is even after forcing a call to the DVR service and restarting several times... the last one about 5 minutes ago


----------



## wedgecon

John T Smith said:


> I wonder if this update is regional or maybe only to a SAMPLE of people?
> 
> Over here on the West Coast (Vancouver WA) I'm still running 6.3e and that is even after forcing a call to the DVR service and restarting several times... the last one about 5 minutes ago


That may be the way they roll it out, but as far as anybody knows DirecTV has not rolled this out to anybody yet. It may have downloaded to your DirecTivo but it will not activate until DirecTV turns it on. Your receiver will be notified of the change when it calls in. Some people with hacked Tivo's have found a way to force their Tivo's to this software version.


----------



## stevel

And some of us with hacked DTiVos don't have this version waiting on disk. Very odd.


----------



## CrashHD

I've noticed something of a pattern to this before. Units that have not dialed in in a very long time, if ever, seem to be delayed in getting slices from the sat. I had two units that still had not gotten 6.1a (the DST fix) even several weeks after the DST time change back last April. When I set one unit up to dial in, the next day, it had the 6.1a slices. They did come in from the sat, as the phone call was only about 5 minutes long, after which I re-disconnected it.

It is different this time, as dialing in results in a download of 6.3e. If anyone out there is running hacked 6.3e has a unit dial in, it would be interesting to see if their box downloads 6.3f via sat in short order, or not.


----------



## stevel

Well, I got previous updates (6.3c, d and e) in slices very promptly, even though my box has not actually dialed out in two years. I'm not going to sweat it - especially as it seems 6.3f is not yet in a full rollout and I'm doing ok on 6.3e.


----------



## gsjenkins

Of my three hacked 6.2a non-RID, not phone line connected units, one has 6.3e and f, one has 6.3e and one has ONLY 6.2a in /SwSystem. I'm located in NE Texas. Thank goodness none of them is rebooting.


----------



## robpickles

Stephen M. Smith said:


> Err, like just pushing the down arrow on the 4-way thumbpad?


He wanted to switch to the other tuner - not change the channel.

Rob 

Edit: I stand corrected - You learn something new everyday in this forum! I never knew that.


----------



## markbox

robpickles said:


> He wanted to switch to the other tuner - not change the channel.
> 
> Rob


_
Pressing the down arrow on the 4 way pad while watching live
TV switches to the other tuner on my Hughes SDVR40.


----------



## robpickles

markbox said:


> _
> Pressing the down arrow on the 4 way pad while watching live
> TV switches to the other tuner on my Hughes SDVR40.


Well what do you know...

You guys are right. You learn something new everyday. I love this forum.

Rob


----------



## CrashHD

It would be nice if there was a comprehensive listing of the remote's functions like this.
I didn't learn about the keypad number shortcuts for 2 years, and now I use them all the time (From DirecTV Central, 1->SPM 2-> Todo 3-> Wishlist, etc.)


----------



## codespy

John T Smith said:


> I wonder if this update is regional or maybe only to a SAMPLE of people?
> 
> Over here on the West Coast (Vancouver WA) I'm still running 6.3e and that is even after forcing a call to the DVR service and restarting several times... the last one about 5 minutes ago


Beta testers?


----------



## rbtravis

codespy said:


> Beta testers?


Directv doesn't need Beta Testers, they have us and they don't have to pay us.


----------



## stevel

DirecTV has beta testers - it's called the CE (Cutting Edge) program. But as far as I know, it doesn't include TiVos. I don't think there has been a beta of DTiVo software in a very long time, but maybe the "enhancements" later this year will have one. Last I asked my TiVo contacts, which was a while ago, they had no clue who would be running such a beta if there was one.


----------



## rminsk

CrashHD said:


> It would be nice if there was a comprehensive listing of the remote's functions like this.
> I didn't learn about the keypad number shortcuts for 2 years, and now I use them all the time (From DirecTV Central, 1->SPM 2-> Todo 3-> Wishlist, etc.)


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=122090


----------



## Rich584

CrashHD said:


> It would be nice if there was a comprehensive listing of the remote's functions like this.
> I didn't learn about the keypad number shortcuts for 2 years, and now I use them all the time (From DirecTV Central, 1->SPM 2-> Todo 3-> Wishlist, etc.)


I saw a pretty comprehensive list of things you can do with the remote, but I cannot remember where. I don't think it was on this forum. Try dbstalk.com and see if it is on the TiVo forum. Or it might be on weaknees.com. They have forums too, I think. Too much to remember for me. Never ceases to amaze me tho, just how much that little peanut can do. The tip I got about the DLBs was great. That one I remember and use and it has cut my reboots to zip, so far.

Rich

Rich


----------



## rubybear

I just thought Id share with you what I was told when I called DirecTV today about the 6.3f software upgrade. He told me this upgrade will NOT be a fix for any of their customers with a TIVO receiver. He said they are no longer going to support the TIVO receivers, so I will eventually need to buy their own brand. He said they no longer have a business relationship with TIVO. He said the 6.3e software detected an issue with a partition of the TIVO receivers, and basically made that partition permanently unusable. So, for those of you that said DirecTV broke my TIVO, you are absolutely right. I guess we are being forced to dump all our TIVOs, what else can we do? Even DISH has their own DVR, not a TIVO. 

My Series 2 Samsung S4080R is freezing/rebooting when I have one of the tuners on a local channel (ABC, NBC, CBS, etc.). Basically, any channel on Transponder B. Its freezing from 3-10 times a day. As long as I only watch the other cable channels (on Transponder A), it doesnt freeze. I asked them if they would let me have the ABCW, CBSW, etc. channels, since they have rendered my local channels useless, and he said they dont have any control over that, the FCC wont let them.

He didnt offer me an R-15 receiver for only the shipping charges, either, like they have been doing. I guess they realize theyve got us backed in the corner, and they might as well charge us $99.00 for a refurbished unit. Yes, he told me if I replaced my unit with one of their R-15 DVRs, it would be a refurbished one, not a new one. No wonder so many have had problems within days of receiving these units. I told him that Ive read all the complaints about the R-15, and I didnt want one. He said they now have a newer unit, the R-16, and I should go to Best Buy and get one for $99.00. He claims its a better unit. Anyone have any experience with this one?


----------



## Da Goon

Ugh... the csr was misinterpreting a script. Don't believe what they told you. 6.3x shouldn't "break" your tivo unless the drive was already on its way out. Newer csr's just go ahead and tell everyone to get a new box since they haven't been around long enough to know how to properly troubleshoot issues with tivos. Directv doesn't care whether or not you're using a tivo box or an R15 so long as you pay your monthly bill.


----------



## ForrestB

rubybear said:


> I just thought Id share with you what I was told when I called DirecTV today about the 6.3f software upgrade. He told me this upgrade will NOT be a fix for any of their customers with a TIVO receiver. He said they are no longer going to support the TIVO receivers, so I will eventually need to buy their own brand. He said they no longer have a business relationship with TIVO. He said the 6.3e software detected an issue with a partition of the TIVO receivers, and basically made that partition permanently unusable. So, for those of you that said DirecTV broke my TIVO, you are absolutely right. I guess we are being forced to dump all our TIVOs, what else can we do? Even DISH has their own DVR, not a TIVO.
> 
> My Series 2 Samsung S4080R is freezing/rebooting when I have one of the tuners on a local channel (ABC, NBC, CBS, etc.). Basically, any channel on Transponder B. Its freezing from 3-10 times a day. As long as I only watch the other cable channels (on Transponder A), it doesnt freeze. I asked them if they would let me have the ABCW, CBSW, etc. channels, since they have rendered my local channels useless, and he said they dont have any control over that, the FCC wont let them.
> 
> He didnt offer me an R-15 receiver for only the shipping charges, either, like they have been doing. I guess they realize theyve got us backed in the corner, and they might as well charge us $99.00 for a refurbished unit. Yes, he told me if I replaced my unit with one of their R-15 DVRs, it would be a refurbished one, not a new one. No wonder so many have had problems within days of receiving these units. I told him that Ive read all the complaints about the R-15, and I didnt want one. He said they now have a newer unit, the R-16, and I should go to Best Buy and get one for $99.00. He claims its a better unit. Anyone have any experience with this one?


CSR's don't set the policy for the company. According to DirecTV's own press release http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=127160&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1034357&highlight=

EL SEGUNDO & ALVISO, Calif.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--July 31, 2007--DIRECTV, Inc. (NYSETV), the nation's leading satellite television service provider, and TiVo Inc. (NASDAQ:TIVO), the creator of and a leader in television services for digital video recorders (DVR), will develop a software upgrade to enhance the user experience for DIRECTV customers who have DIRECTV DVRs with TiVo(R) service built on the Series2(TM) platform.

DIRECTV and TiVo began their relationship in 2000 with the launch of the first DIRECTV DVR with TiVo. In April 2006, both companies announced an extension of their commercial and advertising relationship through early 2010.


----------



## dtremain

Da Goon said:


> Directv doesn't care whether or not you're using a tivo box or an R15 so long as you pay your monthly bill.


Not exactly true. They have to pay a percentage to TiVo for all of the TiVo based units out here. They get to keep all of the non-TiVo money themselves.


----------



## dtremain

rubybear said:


> He said the 6.3e software detected an issue with a partition of the TIVO receivers, and basically made that partition permanently unusable.


Since Directv distributed the units, that would make the problem their responsibility. This doesn't make sense.


----------



## Duffycoug

CrashHD said:


> I didn't learn about the keypad number shortcuts for 2 years, and now I use them all the time (From DirecTV Central, 1->SPM 2-> Todo 3-> Wishlist, etc.)


How exactly do you use the shortcuts....I know nothing about them.....I did now about the "pressing down on the pad to switch tuners though".


----------



## wedgecon

rubybear said:


> I just thought Id share with you what I was told when I called DirecTV today about the 6.3f software upgrade. He told me this upgrade will NOT be a fix for any of their customers with a TIVO receiver. He said they are no longer going to support the TIVO receivers, so I will eventually need to buy their own brand. He said they no longer have a business relationship with TIVO. He said the 6.3e software detected an issue with a partition of the TIVO receivers, and basically made that partition permanently unusable. So, for those of you that said DirecTV broke my TIVO, you are absolutely right. I guess we are being forced to dump all our TIVOs, what else can we do? Even DISH has their own DVR, not a TIVO.
> 
> My Series 2 Samsung S4080R is freezing/rebooting when I have one of the tuners on a local channel (ABC, NBC, CBS, etc.). Basically, any channel on Transponder B. Its freezing from 3-10 times a day. As long as I only watch the other cable channels (on Transponder A), it doesnt freeze. I asked them if they would let me have the ABCW, CBSW, etc. channels, since they have rendered my local channels useless, and he said they dont have any control over that, the FCC wont let them.
> 
> He didnt offer me an R-15 receiver for only the shipping charges, either, like they have been doing. I guess they realize theyve got us backed in the corner, and they might as well charge us $99.00 for a refurbished unit. Yes, he told me if I replaced my unit with one of their R-15 DVRs, it would be a refurbished one, not a new one. No wonder so many have had problems within days of receiving these units. I told him that Ive read all the complaints about the R-15, and I didnt want one. He said they now have a newer unit, the R-16, and I should go to Best Buy and get one for $99.00. He claims its a better unit. Anyone have any experience with this one?


Never believe what a CSR tells you, they are not kept informed of DirecTV's policies and in general are not very knowledgeable. Many of them do no even work for DirecTV and are out scoured to third party service companies.

Every statement in your post is untrue and or incorrect.


----------



## CrashHD

Duffycoug said:


> How exactly do you use the shortcuts....I know nothing about them.....I did now about the "pressing down on the pad to switch tuners though".


From within DirecTV Central, just push a number key. Each number key is a shortcut to somewhere else in the menu system, e.g. 1 goes to Season Pass Manager, 2 goes to To Do List, 3 goes to Wish list, etc.


----------



## rubybear

wedgecon said:


> Never believe what a CSR tells you, they are not kept informed of DirecTV's policies and in general are not very knowledgeable. Many of them do no even work for DirecTV and are out scoured to third party service companies.
> 
> Every statement in your post is untrue and or incorrect.


Gee, I sure hope you aren't saying that every statement I made was untrue or incorrect. I do hope that everyone is right, and that the csr was just feeding me alot of misinformation. If that's the case, I am going to do nothing, and wait and see if I ever get 6.3f, and if it solves the problem. I DO want to keep my TIVO, it's only 2 1/2 years old!

Some of my statements were indeed correct:

1. DISH uses their own DVR, not a TIVO.

2. My explanation of my problems with freezing/rebooting are true, I'm living with them daily!

I guess this really wasn't the forum to ask about DirecTV's new R16 DVR, but I can't seem to find any reviews about it, and I hoped maybe someone had a tip or a link to share.


----------



## rubybear

ForrestB said:


> CSR's don't set the policy for the company. According to DirecTV's own press release http://phx.corporate-ir.net/phoenix.zhtml?c=127160&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=1034357&highlight=
> 
> EL SEGUNDO & ALVISO, Calif.--(BUSINESS WIRE)--July 31, 2007--DIRECTV, Inc. (NYSETV), the nation's leading satellite television service provider, and TiVo Inc. (NASDAQ:TIVO), the creator of and a leader in television services for digital video recorders (DVR), will develop a software upgrade to enhance the user experience for DIRECTV customers who have DIRECTV DVRs with TiVo(R) service built on the Series2(TM) platform.
> 
> DIRECTV and TiVo began their relationship in 2000 with the launch of the first DIRECTV DVR with TiVo. In April 2006, both companies announced an extension of their commercial and advertising relationship through early 2010.


About that press release; I remember when they emailed it to me last summer, and I mentioned that to the CSR, too, even quoted some of it to him. I said why would DTV send us something like that, if they weren't planning on supporting TIVO's anymore? He said the press release was incorrect. What a moron. (oops, did I really say that?)


----------



## wedgecon

rubybear said:


> Gee, I sure hope you aren't saying that every statement I made was untrue or incorrect. I do hope that everyone is right, and that the csr was just feeding me alot of misinformation. If that's the case, I am going to do nothing, and wait and see if I ever get 6.3f, and if it solves the problem. I DO want to keep my TIVO, it's only 2 1/2 years old!
> 
> Some of my statements were indeed correct:
> 
> 1. DISH uses their own DVR, not a TIVO.
> 
> 2. My explanation of my problems with freezing/rebooting are true, I'm living with them daily!
> 
> I guess this really wasn't the forum to ask about DirecTV's new R16 DVR, but I can't seem to find any reviews about it, and I hoped maybe someone had a tip or a link to share.


I meant every statement the CSR told you...


----------



## rminsk

rubybear said:


> I just thought I'd share with you what I was told when I called DirecTV today about the 6.3f software upgrade...


You fell victim to one of the classic blunders! The most famous is never get involved in a land war in Asia, but only slightly less well-known is this: never believe a CSR on any thing! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha... (drops dead)


----------



## szvers

rminsk said:


> You fell victim to one of the classic blunders! The most famous is never get involved in a land war in Asia, but only slightly less well-known is this: never believe a CSR on any thing! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha! Ha ha ha... (drops dead)


Classic...I'm dying here.


----------



## SteelersFan

szvers said:


> Classic...I'm dying here.


+1


----------



## rock_doctor

I do feel the CSR's are purposefully told to give this mis-information to the customers that call in. I guess DTV considers it damage control. As I have said before, the average consumer will have a crash and reboot problem develop and call in. The CSR will then tell them that DTV is not having any problems with the tivo's and they must have a bad one. Then the uninformed customer agrees to a R15/R16 at cost (from what I have read they rarely, now a days, send them for free) to the customer to replace their mechanically fine TiVo. It is an ideal weeding process, while it may not have been intentional, it definitely is getting these old units out of service. Which, I would suspect is welcomed by DTV.


----------



## Rich584

rubybear said:


> Gee, I sure hope you aren't saying that every statement I made was untrue or incorrect. I do hope that everyone is right, and that the csr was just feeding me alot of misinformation. If that's the case, I am going to do nothing, and wait and see if I ever get 6.3f, and if it solves the problem. I DO want to keep my TIVO, it's only 2 1/2 years old!


From what I have read, 6.3f will not fix the rebooting problem.



> Some of my statements were indeed correct:
> 
> 1. DISH uses their own DVR, not a TIVO.


You are absolutely correct and Dish has a lot of problems with their DVRs as does FIOS.



> 2. My explanation of my problems with freezing/rebooting are true, I'm living with them daily!


So am I. Well, mine don't freeze up, but they reboot randomly as yours do.



> I guess this really wasn't the forum to ask about DirecTV's new R16 DVR, but I can't seem to find any reviews about it, and I hoped maybe someone had a tip or a link to share.


If you Google "DirecTv +R16 +DVR" you will find sites that are allowing "preorders". Apparently they are not for sale in stores or on D*'s web site (I checked). Here is one link. http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=R16

You are on the correct thread for the information you want. Don't let other people who don't read the whole post (yours or theirs) put you off. Most of us are either seeking info or help just like you are. Some people think everything that comes out of their mouths is true because they said it. One of the signs of paranoia.

Whatever the reason for the problems, I never had any until 6.3e downloaded.

He is right about the CSRs not knowing anything. You should join the Protection Plan. Their CSRs and techs are far better informed and capable than the CSRs you get if you don't have the PP. And if your are in the PP, you are directed (normally) to the PP CSRs or techs. It is worth the 5.99 a month (or whatever it costs).

Ya gotta be kind of thick skinned on these forums.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

wedgecon said:


> I meant every statement the CSR told you...


I just saw your clarification. Don't go berserk when you read post #143.

Rich


----------



## rubybear

Rich584 said:


> From what I have read, 6.3f will not fix the rebooting problem.
> 
> If you Google "DirecTv +R16 +DVR" you will find sites that are allowing "preorders". Apparently they are not for sale in stores or on D*'s web site (I checked). Here is one link. http://www.solidsignal.com/prod_display.asp?PROD=R16
> 
> Whatever the reason for the problems, I never had any until 6.3e downloaded.
> 
> He is right about the CSRs not knowing anything. You should join the Protection Plan. Their CSRs and techs are far better informed and capable than the CSRs you get if you don't have the PP. And if your are in the PP, you are directed (normally) to the PP CSRs or techs. It is worth the 5.99 a month (or whatever it costs).
> 
> Rich


Rich, if the 6.3f wont fix the problems, does that mean we are just going to have to live with this problem indefinitely? I dont dare record anything on a national channel at the same time a local channel is playing, because the likelihood that it will freeze/reboot is about 80%. This has totally changed how I watch & record tv, and I end up missing alot of shows. I cant believe I have to pay over $50.00 a month for such unreliable service.

At this point, would it actually do any good to start paying DirecTv even more to be on their protection plan? It certainly wont make them fix my software problem. I figure all it would do is make them nice enough to offer me their cruddy R15 as a replacement for less than the $99.00 the csr quoted me.

Thanks for the R16 link, Ive already checked that one out. It only shows the retail info for the unit, I was hoping I could find some user reviews. Apparently its too new for anyone to have reviewed it. The csr told me I could get one at Best Buy, but it isnt on their website yet.


----------



## chuckg

rubybear said:


> Rich, if the 6.3f wont fix the problems, does that mean we are just going to have to live with this problem indefinitely?


Only if you choose too. 

http://www.weaknees.com/misc.php Prep a Replacement "A" Drive if you have a spare drive or you send them yours. I have done it several times since 6.3e @ $55 a whack.

Or
http://www.weaknees.com/dtv-tivo-upgrade.php Or just buy the appropriate drive. Replace your existing drive. Then ship it (the existing drive) for a Prep which leaves you with it as a spare.


----------



## Rich584

rubybear said:


> Rich, if the 6.3f wont fix the problems, does that mean we are just going to have to live with this problem indefinitely?


No, I hope not. I have talked to several people who are apparently high in the food chain at TiVo and they are aware of the problem. This is also happening on TiVo Series 3 TiVos. While I am reasonably certain 6.3f will NOT correct the problem, I have been led to believe the next major upgrade will. You have to remember, when you enter a stage of D*Hell, you must have patience. Altho mine is wearing thin too.



> I dont dare record anything on a national channel at the same time a local channel is playing, because the likelihood that it will freeze/reboot is about 80%.


I watch nothing "live" as a rule. Disabling the DLBs seems to stop the rebooting while watching a recorded show. You might want to try that. And it doesn't reboot if I record a show and put the other tuner on an XM station or record two shows while watching a previously recorded show. Try these modes.



> This has totally changed how I watch & record tv, and I end up missing alot of shows. I cant believe I have to pay over $50.00 a month for such unreliable service.


My bill is over $200 a month and I live with it. I truly believe that D* is not that concerned with the issues you have because they can stop them by giving you an R15. I know that is not what you want, but...



> At this point, would it actually do any good to start paying DirecTv even more to be on their protection plan? It certainly wont make them fix my software problem. I figure all it would do is make them nice enough to offer me their cruddy R15 as a replacement for less than the $99.00 the csr quoted me.


You could get the R15, which several posters on another forum have said is pretty stable now. Should be, they've been working on it for a couple years. Never tried one and I have two of them in boxes, never used. The swap would be at no cost to you for the R15 or shipping if you belong to the PP. That alone would pay for a year's subscription to the PP.



> Thanks for the R16 link, Ive already checked that one out. It only shows the retail info for the unit, I was hoping I could find some user reviews. Apparently its too new for anyone to have reviewed it. The csr told me I could get one at Best Buy, but it isnt on their website yet.


Far as I can tell, they are not on the market yet. You will notice on that link it says "preorders". That's the extent of my knowledge of the R16.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

chuckg said:


> Only if you choose too.
> 
> http://www.weaknees.com/misc.php Prep a Replacement "A" Drive if you have a spare drive or you send them yours. I have done it several times since 6.3e @ $55 a whack.
> 
> Or
> http://www.weaknees.com/dtv-tivo-upgrade.php Or just buy the appropriate drive. Replace your existing drive. Then ship it (the existing drive) for a Prep which leaves you with it as a spare.


Done both, it does not stop the rebooting.

Rich


----------



## Sartori

Really? And where exactly is it, cause I'm not seeing it anywhere on my units.....


----------



## Rich584

Sartori said:


> Really? And where exactly is it, cause I'm not seeing it anywhere on my units.....


What post are you replying to?

Rich


----------



## wedgecon

Rich584 said:


> Done both, it does not stop the rebooting.
> 
> Rich


Are your sure?

As far as I know nobody who has 6.2a has the rebooting problem. The problem is with the 6.3e version of the DirecTivo software only. I do not think there is any relation to the problem with the Series 3 as it is a completely different Tivo. Also there are no Series 3 DirecTivo's and I am not even sure you can make a Series 3 work with DirecTV.


----------



## stevel

For the record, my HR10 runs 6.3e and has not rebooted itself in over a year.


----------



## Rich584

So, you get a different version than 6.3e and don't hook up a phone line to it when you get the HD back from W*? Or can you ask W* to put in an older software version?

Been dealing with Weaknees for years and the last time I talked to them, they thought the problem was the partitioning on the HDs.

Bought a new HD from them. Didn't help the rebooting problem. But, I left the phone line hooked up after the initial install and ended up with 6.3e. That was last summer.

Rich



chuckg said:


> Only if you choose too.
> 
> http://www.weaknees.com/misc.php Prep a Replacement "A" Drive if you have a spare drive or you send them yours. I have done it several times since 6.3e @ $55 a whack.
> 
> Or
> http://www.weaknees.com/dtv-tivo-upgrade.php Or just buy the appropriate drive. Replace your existing drive. Then ship it (the existing drive) for a Prep which leaves you with it as a spare.


----------



## Rich584

wedgecon said:


> Are your sure?As far as I know nobody who has 6.2a has the rebooting problem.


One of the threads addressing rebooting on this forum goes back to January of last year and several posters with 6.2x were having rebooting problems. I never had the problem until 6.3e reared it's ugly head.



> The problem is with the 6.3e version of the DirecTivo software only. I do not think there is any relation to the problem with the Series 3 as it is a completely different Tivo.


You are correct in both statements. But, the Series 3 stand alone is experiencing reboots and freeze ups just as the Series 2 D* TiVos are.

That seems like quite a coincidence to me. That's the only reason I mentioned the 3's. Seems like a TiVo "systemic" software problem. Maybe they are not related. But if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...



> Also there are no Series 3 DirecTivo's and I am not even sure you can make a Series 3 work with DirecTV.


Correct again. Never meant to imply there was or imply you could.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

stevel said:


> For the record, my HR10 runs 6.3e and has not rebooted itself in over a year.


I have absolutely no experience with the HR10 DVR. I gather that is the Hi Def version? All my Hi Def DVRs are HR20s. And all my TiVos are SD.

Rich


----------



## rubybear

Rich584 said:


> I watch nothing "live" as a rule. Disabling the DLBs seems to stop the rebooting while watching a recorded show. You might want to try that. And it doesn't reboot if I record a show and put the other tuner on an XM station or record two shows while watching a previously recorded show. Try these modes.
> 
> Rich


At the risk of sounding really dumb, what are the DLBs? I also should have clarified better when the rebooting occurs. If one of my tuners is on a local channel, (which it needs to be to record the program on it), it will probably reboot, even if I am watching something previously recorded from my Now Playing List, and have the other tuner on a national channel. Im finding that CBS and NBC are the worst culprits. If Im actually watching one of those channels, I can see the pixilation start, which is my warning that its about to go, and if I change the channel quickly enough to a non-local channel, Ive prevented a reboot. Of course, when I have recordings set up while Im not there to babysit the TV, Im out of luck.


----------



## CrashHD

Dual Live Buffers. It's the Live TV Buffer for each tuner.


----------



## dtremain

rubybear said:


> If one of my tuners is on a local channel, (which it needs to be to record the program on it), it will probably reboot,


While I have only had a handful of re-boots, they have all been when one tuner was on a local channel (NYC marekt).

Sometimes, I have pixelation which leads to a momentary freeze and then everything comes back. This is also always on a recording of a local channel.

It never happend before 6.3e and started happening immediately. The occurrence used to be daily with the momentary freeze, but the porblem seems to have lessened to being a real rarity now.

I have two Directv TiVo units, both with 6.3e and both completely stock and unhacked. This only seems to be happening on one, although the other is in my son's room and I don't see it as much.

What you are describing is definitely related to the 6.3e software. I'm not sure why it just affects local channels, but for many people, that seems to be the case.


----------



## rubybear

CrashHD said:


> Dual Live Buffers. It's the Live TV Buffer for each tuner.


Ahhh, thanks for educating me!


----------



## rubybear

As far as the R15 being a better product now, I just spent some time reading reviews on Cnet and Amazon, and as recent as 12/28/07, people are still saying it's a horrible product.

I would include the links here, but they are massively long. Can anyone tell me if there's a way to make a link to a website shorter for use in this forum?


----------



## xunil76

rubybear said:


> I would include the links here, but they are massively long. Can anyone tell me if there's a way to make a link to a website shorter for use in this forum?


yes....use the following code:



Code:


[.url=http://www.whatever.com]<<insert your shorter text here>>[/url]

just remove the period from in front of the first url above, paste in the actual URL after the = sign, and don't put the << & >> where it says "insert your shorter text here".

for instance, typing the following code (without the period in front of the first "url":



Code:


[.url=http://www.tivocommunity.com]Tivo Community[/url]

gives you:

Tivo Community


----------



## stevel

I don't know about the R15, but I like the HR20.


----------



## bwash

rubybear said:


> As far as the R15 being a better product now, I just spent some time reading reviews on Cnet and Amazon, and as recent as 12/28/07, people are still saying it's a horrible product.


I have one and at first I would agree, however right now it is a very acceptable dvr. I use both an r15 and dtivo, I like the tivo for the wishlist, other than that both work equally as well (I don't really use the dual buffer switch much).

I will probably be going to HD in the near future and I look forward to using the HDVRs that directv has now. At the rate some of the older dtivos are breaking (my hdvr2 with the 2nd tuner problem) and wanting HD I would expect the directivos to simply die out after a couple of years.


----------



## CrashHD

stevel said:


> I don't know about the R15, but I like the HR20.


That seems to be the general consensus.

Could a person wanting an Standard Defintion DVR get an HR20, and just use it for SD? It seems to make sense? As far as DirecTV is concerned, an HD receiver, an SD DVR, and an HD DVR, are all "advanced" receivers, thusly activating one of them requires a longer committment period than standard equipment. It makes sense then, even for folks who just want an SD DVR, since either way, you're on the hook for the same commitment, to just get the HR20, even if you're only going to use it for SD.


----------



## Rich584

stevel said:


> I don't know about the R15, but I like the HR20.


Steve, you never answered my question. What is an HR10?

Rich


----------



## Rich584

rubybear said:


> At the risk of sounding really dumb, what are the DLBs?


Not a "dumb" question. It is one that I asked a year ago. The TiVos have the ability to save or "buffer" up to 30 minutes of a live show. Something I never used and was completely ignorant of. D*'s proprietary DVRs don't have that ability. Lots of complaining about the lack of DLBs last year when we were all learning to use the HR20s. Still don't get why people thought they were so important.

I think a question asked because of ignorance is the sign of an intelligent person (if you choose to define intelligence as the ability to learn). If you don't ask, how will you learn? People think "stupidity" and "ignorance" are synonymous, but they are not. Stupidity is repeating the same mistake over and over and waiting for a different result. Borders on insanity at times.



> I also should have clarified better when the rebooting occurs. If one of my tuners is on a local channel, (which it needs to be to record the program on it), it will probably reboot, even if I am watching something previously recorded from my Now Playing List, and have the other tuner on a national channel.


That is when you want to switch to an XM station on the unused tuner and hope for the best.



> Im finding that CBS and NBC are the worst culprits. If Im actually watching one of those channels, I can see the pixilation start, which is my warning that its about to go, and if I change the channel quickly enough to a non-local channel, Ive prevented a reboot. Of course, when I have recordings set up while Im not there to babysit the TV, Im out of luck.


I don't have that problem. Rarely watch locals on my TiVo.

More questions? Glad to help, I am.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

CrashHD said:


> Could a person wanting an Standard Defintion DVR get an HR20, and just use it for SD?


Yes.



> It seems to make sense? As far as DirecTV is concerned, an HD receiver, an SD DVR, and an HD DVR, are all "advanced" receivers, thusly activating one of them requires a longer committment period than standard equipment. It makes sense then, even for folks who just want an SD DVR, since either way, you're on the hook for the same commitment, to just get the HR20, even if you're only going to use it for SD.


You are correct in your assumptions. As for the commitment, it is really not that much money to get out of it and D*, in my opinion, is the best deal in town.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

Rebooted again last night. Screwed up a football game today. Nutz!


----------



## Rich584

Got a "service down load" at three o'clock this morning. I guess that caused the reboot? Is that possible?

Rich


----------



## Da Goon

Rich584 said:


> I think a question asked because of ignorance is the sign of an intelligent person (if you choose to define intelligence as the ability to learn). If you don't ask, how will you learn? People think "stupidity" and "ignorance" are synonymous, but they are not. Stupidity is repeating the same mistake over and over and waiting for a different result.


Well, since the advent of the "World Wide Web", you could always google something and find your answer almost immediately instead of posing it more than once. Hint. 
There's a difference between ignorance and laziness.


----------



## newswatcher

Rich584 said:


> You could get the R15, which several posters on another forum have said is pretty stable now. Should be, they've been working on it for a couple years. Never tried one and I have two of them in boxes, never used. The swap would be at no cost to you for the R15 or shipping if you belong to the PP. That alone would pay for a year's subscription to the PP.
> 
> Rich


Stable? I had one (replaced my DTV TiVo Hughes SD-DVR40), and, after three-weeks of numerous problems (losing recorded shows, DTV forcing "backward" software "updates" etc.), went back to the TiVo (in fact, due to my extreme dissatisfaction with the R-15, DTV gave me a "retention" credit of over $150 "to keep me with DTV..."). Love the TiVo, hate the R-15. Tell these ppl at dbs the R-15 is "stable" right now...



Code:


http://www.dbstalk.com/forumdisplay.php?f=106


----------



## Rich584

newswatcher said:


> Stable? I had one (replaced my DTV TiVo Hughes SD-DVR40), and, after three-weeks of numerous problems (losing recorded shows, DTV forcing "backward" software "updates" etc.), went back to the TiVo (in fact, due to my extreme dissatisfaction with the R-15, DTV gave me a "retention" credit of over $150 "to keep me with DTV..."). Love the TiVo, hate the R-15. Tell these ppl at dbs the R-15 is "stable" right now...
> 
> 
> 
> Code:
> 
> 
> http://www.dbstalk.com/forumdisplay.php?f=106


Just repeating what I read. I made a comment about the R15 and a few people corrected me. Now you're correcting them. I guess I'll leave the two R15s that I have in the boxes. Had enough problems last year with the HR20s.

Rich


----------



## newswatcher

Nothing personal... It's more of a reaction to the R-15 (which irritates me to no end) that my supposed "correcting" was directed. The TiVo is so much easier to use than the horrible R-15 (plus the TiVo dual-tuner ability) that my dislike of DTV (for one) and the R-15 has me on edge regarding this topic. Please, leave the R-15's in the box (mine is). They are a poison to watching television in a comfortable way IMHO. Nothing personal (I repeat)...


----------



## stevel

Rich584 said:


> Steve, you never answered my question. What is an HR10?


I didn't spot your question.

The HR10-250 is a TiVo-powered DirecTV HDTV receiver. Until the TiVo Series 3, it was the ONLY HDTV TiVo. The HR10 is no longer manufactured and is not capable of receiving DirecTV's newest HDTV channels. Nevertheless, it has many fans, myself included. (I have one each HR10, HR20 and HR21.)


----------



## Rich584

newswatcher said:


> Nothing personal... It's more of a reaction to the R-15 (which irritates me to no end) that my supposed "correcting" was directed. The TiVo is so much easier to use than the horrible R-15 (plus the TiVo dual-tuner ability) that my dislike of DTV (for one) and the R-15 has me on edge regarding this topic. Please, leave the R-15's in the box (mine is). They are a poison to watching television in a comfortable way IMHO. Nothing personal (I repeat)...


Are they really that bad? I'm replacing the TiVo I watch about 3-4 hours a day with an HR21 later this month. I can't take the rebooting anymore. Wrecked another football game for me yesterday.

Embarrasses me to admit that my 24" computer monitor is also capable of being used as a Hi Def TV monitor. Have had it for a while and never read the manual. Hooked it up to an HR20 and got a beautiful picture yesterday, so at least I don't have to buy a new TV for the 21.

I will take your advice and leave the 15s in the boxes. I have been saving TiVos and the 15s to sell on eBay when the digital day comes. If it ever does. Should get at least what I paid for them.

Appreciate the info, thanx,

Rich


----------



## Rich584

stevel said:


> I didn't spot your question.
> 
> The HR10-250 is a TiVo-powered DirecTV HDTV receiver. Until the TiVo Series 3, it was the ONLY HDTV TiVo. The HR10 is no longer manufactured and is not capable of receiving DirecTV's newest HDTV channels. Nevertheless, it has many fans, myself included. (I have one each HR10, HR20 and HR21.)


The reasons I asked were:

Does the HR10 have the 30 skip like the Series 2 SD TiVos do and if so, do you use it? I've never used a Hi Def TiVo mainly because I thought the cost of upgrading the hard drives was too great.

So you do have 6.3e and no reboots? Perhaps the reboots are confined to SD TiVos with the same software?

Do you think sending out software that is used for SD and HD is causing the reboots?

Thanx,
Rich


----------



## Rich584

Da Goon said:


> Well, since the advent of the "World Wide Web", you could always google something and find your answer almost immediately instead of posing it more than once. Hint.
> There's a difference between ignorance and laziness.


Read post #176 and give me a link from Google (it is capitalized, by the way) that answers those questions.

I will admit to being lazy, haven't worked for years. Not the case here. I find your assumption that I was too stupid (or lazy, but I think you meant stupid) to use Google (I use FoxFire, by the way, much faster) offensive. But I guess that's the result you were looking for, wasn't it? That link told me nothing I didn't know. Waste of time.


----------



## Sartori

Still no 6.3f here, are you sure this is going out to all Directivos?? And to the guy that was wondering what I was responding too, I was responding to the thread in general....


----------



## wedgecon

Sartori said:


> Still no 6.3f here, are you sure this is going out to all Directivos?? And to the guy that was wondering what I was responding too, I was responding to the thread in general....


Nobody except hackers has 6.3f as it has not been released by DirecTV yet.


----------



## ssorrell

What the heck is taking so long to get a fix for this problem that has been plaguing us since 6.3e came out in August? Yesterday I had 4 reboots in a 12 hour period.

I was about ready to simply switch over to a DTV HD DVR, but in reading their forums, they've got a host of issues too, including freezing and re-booting. Some folks have gone through 3 or 4 units and still have problems. So, I'm not so sure that switching over will solve my problems.

The re-boots are really ridiculous. Especially when you invest 5 hours of your life watching a mini-series, only to have it reboot during the last 15 minutes.


----------



## Sartori

wedgecon said:


> Nobody except hackers has 6.3f as it has not been released by DirecTV yet.


Well aren't they just special......


----------



## Rich584

ssorrell said:


> What the heck is taking so long to get a fix for this problem that has been plaguing us since 6.3e came out in August? Yesterday I had 4 reboots in a 12 hour period.
> 
> I was about ready to simply switch over to a DTV HD DVR, but in reading their forums, they've got a host of issues too, including freezing and re-booting. Some folks have gone through 3 or 4 units and still have problems. So, I'm not so sure that switching over will solve my problems.
> 
> The re-boots are really ridiculous. Especially when you invest 5 hours of your life watching a mini-series, only to have it reboot during the last 15 minutes.


Read my posts. The only reason I have for posting on this forum is a search for the answer to the rebooting problem. I'm convinced it is the software. 6.3f will not fix the rebooting problem. I have found no way to stop the reboots. Read my posts.

I have read too many conflicting posts to even consider an R15. Stick with the TiVo. They have to fix this soon.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

Sartori said:


> Well aren't they just special......


From what I understand, 6.3f will not solve the rebooting or freeze up problems.

Rich


----------



## ssorrell

Rich584 said:


> Read my posts. The only reason I have for posting on this forum is a search for the answer to the rebooting problem. I'm convinced it is the software. 6.3f will not fix the rebooting problem. I have found no way to stop the reboots. Read my posts.
> 
> I have read too many conflicting posts to even consider an R15. Stick with the TiVo. They have to fix this soon.
> 
> Rich


I've read nearly every post in this and every other forum about these issues for a couple of months now. My eyes are crossed...

Why are we to believe that they will fix this "soon"? We've had these issues since August.

Besides all of the issues that people seem to be having with their hr20 and hr21 units from dtv, I don't like spending $200 on a leased piece of equipment. Does anyone know what the terms of this lease are?


----------



## stevel

FWIW, neither my HR20 nor HR21 has had any problems in the past seven months I've had them.

The lease is pretty simple - you don't own the box and must return it if you close your account. The advantage is that if the box breaks, they'll replace it for a shipping charge, since they own it, not you.


----------



## Rich584

ssorrell said:


> Why are we to believe that they will fix this "soon"? We've had these issues since August.


I find it quite appalling. I can't for the life of me understand how a company like TiVo can let this persist. I've called them and all I get is "we're working on the problem". All we can do is wait for the next big national release and hope that cures it.



> Besides all of the issues that people seem to be having with their hr20 and hr21 units from dtv, I don't like spending $200 on a leased piece of equipment. Does anyone know what the terms of this lease are?


The "lease" just requires you to return the unit to D* if you deactivate it. Everything else is pretty much the same.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

What do you think of the rebooting problem, Steve? I know you don't have the problem, but lots of us do. Heard anything pertinent?

Rich



stevel said:


> FWIW, neither my HR20 nor HR21 has had any problems in the past seven months I've had them.
> 
> The lease is pretty simple - you don't own the box and must return it if you close your account. The advantage is that if the box breaks, they'll replace it for a shipping charge, since they own it, not you.


----------



## ssorrell

stevel said:


> FWIW, neither my HR20 nor HR21 has had any problems in the past seven months I've had them.
> 
> The lease is pretty simple - you don't own the box and must return it if you close your account. The advantage is that if the box breaks, they'll replace it for a shipping charge, since they own it, not you.


But, it is just the one time charge to upgrade? Or is the lease term for x number of months?

So, I pay $199 to upgrade to a hr21. Of course I have to continue to pay for my monthly sat service and the HD charge. But...if the unit malfunctions and needs replacing in say a couple of years or more, all I have to pay is the shipping?

Quite frankly, I'm tired of waiting for a fix. And with my 50 inch plasma HDTV, I'm sort of itching to get into the HD game anyway. But right now I really don't need to shell out $200 if I can help it. So, I either can take the reboots on the chin and shut up my complaining, or I can switch over. Right now, I'm thinking about making the switch, even with the $200 upgrade fee...

So Steve...can you tell me about any disadvantages I might find if I change?


----------



## rbtravis

6.3f is here, Directv promises 100 HD channels by Dec31,2007, My Bald Head is growing hair, NOT!! why keep a tread of Lies


----------



## stevel

It's a one-time "lease upgrade" charge. To the best of my knowledge, all you pay is shipping if the box needs replacing.

And rbtravis, please show me where DirecTV said ANYTHING about 6.3f. I also think you are mistaken about the timeframe for the 100 channels.


----------



## rbtravis

Their commercials stated 100 channels by December, 6.3f in early Janurary was in their telephone announcement recorded on my voice mail in August, Directv is like politicians, it relies on peoples poor memories.


----------



## macizcool

Rich584 said:


> From what I understand, 6.3f will not solve the rebooting or freeze up problems.
> 
> Rich


By looking at the version number, you would probably be able to tell that it's not going to fix anything considerable. If they were to release a software update that fixed our problems, it would be numbered 6.4. Just my assumption.


----------



## stevel

rbtravis said:


> 6.3f in early Janurary was in their telephone announcement recorded on my voice mail in August


I'm sure that here it's your memory that is failing. The phone announcement you refer to talked about new features coming in 2008 but did not include anything like a version number (DirecTV never does that.)

The only reason we know 6.3f exists is that some who have hacked their boxes see it in MFS. It has not been deployed and it isn't even on everyone's box (not on mine, for example.)


----------



## dcstager

As a 6.3f user there is no visual or functional difference from 6.2a. I think this is simply a bug fix release. I didn't have any bugs with 6.2a. I never used the multi-room viewing function in the first place, but I understand that has been removed from 6.3f.

If they could come up with a DVR that handled the new MPEG4 HD streams that was otherwise identical to my existing Hughes SD-DVR80's functionality it would be the dream machine in the business. However, the SD versions are now obsolete and their days are surely numbered. I like to watch stuff in HD and I hardly ever use the DTivo any more.

What I'd really like is the ability to put stuff ON the Tivo in HD. There are more and more movies and TV episodes in HD quality available for download, but I don't want to watch it on my computer. Converting and uploading it to the Tivo via the Tivo Desktop reduces everything to SD quality. I'd particularly love cheap Amazon UnBox rentals of HD material that I could play on a Series 3.

Tivo seems like an ideal platform for HD video on demand. I have no interest in ripping things off of the tivo -- I want to put good stuff on it to watch.


----------



## snickerrrrs

I haven't had any reboot problems with my R10 or DVR40 both with 6.3e. The 80GB main drive in my R10 is very noisy so I know it's getting ready to fail but still no reboots. No rhyme or reason to the reboot problems.


----------



## Rich584

macizcool said:


> By looking at the version number, you would probably be able to tell that it's not going to fix anything considerable. If they were to release a software update that fixed our problems, it would be numbered 6.4. Just my assumption.


That would be my assumption, too.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

ssorrell said:


> But, it is just the one time charge to upgrade? Or is the lease term for x number of months?


It is at least a year's commitment to stay with D*. Since they are the best provider that I know of, that shouldn't matter to you.



> So, I pay $199 to upgrade to a hr21.


If you can work the phones and be polite, and patient, you should be able to get a new HR20/21 for at most $99. The only people I have found that can help you with the cost are "resolution specialists" and the Retention Dept. My suggestion would be to try retention. Just tell the first CSR you want to cancel your service. You will be transferred to retention. They have the power to satisfy you.



> Of course I have to continue to pay for my monthly sat service and the HD charge. But...if the unit malfunctions and needs replacing in say a couple of years or more, all I have to pay is the shipping?


The first thing I would do is join the Protection Plan. You will never have to pay shipping again. If something goes wrong with the HR20/21 it is replaced quickly. If you have to have one service call a year the plan will pay for itself.



> Quite frankly, I'm tired of waiting for a fix. And with my 50 inch plasma HDTV, I'm sort of itching to get into the HD game anyway. But right now I really don't need to shell out $200 if I can help it. So, I either can take the reboots on the chin and shut up my complaining, or I can switch over. Right now, I'm thinking about making the switch, even with the $200 upgrade fee...


I have three Panny plasmas and I rarely, if ever watch SD shows anymore. Except for the TiVo in my hidey hole, and that's being replaced with an HR21 at the end of the month. You are gonna love the Panny!

Rich


----------



## Rich584

stevel said:


> I'm sure that here it's your memory that is failing. The phone announcement you refer to talked about new features coming in 2008 but did not include anything like a version number (DirecTV never does that.)


*Steve!* Just wanted to make sure you noticed this post. I agree with the above statements. I couldn't figure out where he heard that on a phone conversation. Certainly not from D*. I was surprised to get the phone call at all.



> The only reason we know 6.3f exists is that some who have hacked their boxes see it in MFS. It has not been deployed and it isn't even on everyone's box (not on mine, for example.)


And it's not going to be the major update or fix the rebooting problems.

What is an "MFS"?

Rich


----------



## Rich584

dcstager said:


> As a 6.3f user there is no visual or functional difference from 6.2a. I think this is simply a bug fix release. I didn't have any bugs with 6.2a. I never used the multi-room viewing function in the first place, but I understand that has been removed from 6.3f.


No rebooting?



> If they could come up with a DVR that handled the new MPEG4 HD streams that was otherwise identical to my existing Hughes SD-DVR80's functionality it would be the dream machine in the business. However, the SD versions are now obsolete and their days are surely numbered. I like to watch stuff in HD and I hardly ever use the DTivo any more.


I gotta say that last year, at this time, I was wishing for the same things you are now. Doesn't look like that is gonna happen. Ever.

In the course of the last year, I have come to really enjoy the HR20s. They do more than a TiVo and are faster. Let me say that I have never owned or used a Hi Def TiVo, just going by comparisons I have read. I do have SD TiVos and would not think of getting an R15. But the HR20 has become stable, they don't randomly reboot and they work with eSATAs.

Rich


----------



## bengalfreak

Rich584 said:


> The first thing I would do is join the Protection Plan. You will never have to pay shipping again. If something goes wrong with the HR20/21 it is replaced quickly. If you have to have one service call a year the plan will pay for itself.


The Protection Plan, like almost all service warranties, is a horrible idea. I've been with DirecTV for 7 years and never had a service call. Why would you ever need one? My DTivos have been rock solid, except for one or two new nard drives, for as long as I've been a satellite customer.


----------



## stevel

Rich584 said:


> What is an "MFS"?


Media File System - it's the way a TiVo stores recordings, guide data and other things on the internal hard disk. If you have "hacked" your TiVo so that you can see what is in MFS (think of it as doing a directory on a normal disk), you can see the current and any new software versions present on the disk. New versions come over the satellite but don't install until triggered by a call to the TiVo servers when TiVo (DirecTV) decides that your specific box is to do the install.

Some people have noticed 6.3f waiting on their box and used more "hacks" to install it manually, even though nobody, as far as I know, has seen 6.3f install automatically. My guess is that they found some problems and there will be a 6.3g at some point. My own DTiVo does not have 6.3f in its MFS.


----------



## markbox

What we need to see is someone that is having reboot problems
currently running 6.3e get 6.3f running and report that the
reboot problems have been resolved.
_
So far as I know no one has done this at this time.


----------



## ssorrell

Rich584 said:


> It is at least a year's commitment to stay with D*. Since they are the best provider that I know of, that shouldn't matter to you.


Considering I've been with DTV since its launch in 1994, I doubt I'll be dropping it.



Rich584 said:


> The first thing I would do is join the Protection Plan. You will never have to pay shipping again. If something goes wrong with the HR20/21 it is replaced quickly. If you have to have one service call a year the plan will pay for itself.


$6 per month for 12 months is $72. Surely shipping for a one time repair service won't cost that much?!

Besides, how fair is it that it is leased equipment, yet I have to purchase a Protection Plan? Why do I have to buy "insurance" on something that I don't own? Sounds like just another way to get more money...


----------



## stevel

What the protection plan buys you is coverage for a service call - say, something goes wrong with the dish or wiring. It also makes it faster to get a replacement receiver.

For me, it isn't worthwhile. I can see that for some it might be.


----------



## Rich584

bengalfreak said:


> The Protection Plan, like almost all service warranties, is a horrible idea.


If I thought it was a horrible idea, I would not have suggested it. This is not like the warranties you purchase at BB or CC. This one works really well.



> I've been with DirecTV for 7 years and never had a service call. Why would you ever need one?


To have multiswitches installed. To have the proper wiring installed for Hi Def. To replace a damaged multiswitch. To install new wiring for each of my HR20s. To have the Dish realigned twice. Enough?



> My DTivos have been rock solid, except for one or two new nard drives, for as long as I've been a satellite customer.


Mine haven't. Most of the web sites where I have purchased large HDs have told me that if you get three years out of a DVR's hard drive you have done well.

I went thru all the arguments about the Protection Plan (PP) on another forum. Last year was the year of the HR20. I had seven service calls for various reasons. That would have cost me $490 by itself. Paid for the previous 5-6 years of paying for the PP right there.

I had Ultimate TV before the switchover to TiVos. Those things went bad constantly. Each one replaced without cost for shipping or any cost whatsoever. I've had many TiVos blow their HDs. Replaced in a day or two, no cost.

The CSRs at the PP's call centers, especially Oregon, are more knowledgeable than the CSR you get when you call D* (when you're in the PP, you can be directed to it immediately by saying "protection plan" at the phone prompt. The techs are more knowledgeable than D*'s standard tech.

One of your TiVos goes it might take up to three weeks to get a replacement. If you have the PP, 3 days at most, usually the next day.

I have 5 functioning HR20s. Over the course of the last year I have had so many replacement HR20s that I have lost count, but I'm pretty sure it was over 30 units to end up with the five I have now. At 19.99 D* charges you for shipping, that looks like a bit over $600. With the PP, no cost.

At the moment, I have 11 DVRs running in my home. I can't imagine being without the PP.

Take a moment and ponder my answer. Just because I disagree with you doesn't mean that I am wrong. Last year alone, I saved at least $1000 by being in the PP. And got treated really well by just about everyone.

Oh, one question for you. Have you ever been a member of the Protection Plan?

Rich


----------



## Rich584

*Steve!*

Man, I really racked my mind over that acronym. If we were in the Navy, the first two words of MFS would have been, well, you know. Between that and the context of the post, I had no idea. I truly think acronyms should be banned on forums. The other day I read a post that had SFU in it. Try to figure that one out when it's not used in the proper or expected context.



stevel said:


> Media File System - it's the way a TiVo stores recordings, guide data and other things on the internal hard disk. If you have "hacked" your TiVo so that you can see what is in MFS (think of it as doing a directory on a normal disk), you can see the current and any new software versions present on the disk. New versions come over the satellite but don't install until triggered by a call to the TiVo servers when TiVo (DirecTV) decides that your specific box is to do the install.
> 
> Some people have noticed 6.3f waiting on their box and used more "hacks" to install it manually, even though nobody, as far as I know, has seen 6.3f install automatically. My guess is that they found some problems and there will be a 6.3g at some point. My own DTiVo does not have 6.3f in its MFS.


----------



## Rich584

markbox said:


> What we need to see is someone that is having reboot problems
> currently running 6.3e get 6.3f running and report that the
> reboot problems have been resolved.
> _
> So far as I know no one has done this at this time.


I read one post that led me to believe that the poster had experienced no reboots since getting 6.3f. Forget where.

But if the percentage of TiVo users having rebooting problems is truly 65%, how are we to know if the problem still exists? He might be one of the 35% that never has a rebooting issue.

And here's another question: If D* can download a national release to it's proprietary DVRs within a week or so, why does it take so long to get a small download like 6.3f to a TiVo?

Not to be too paranoid, but I still have it in the back of my mind that D* is benefiting from the TiVo reboots. But the "stand alone" Series 3 TiVo used for cable and OTA (I think) Hi Def recording is having similar problems. Seems to be systemic.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

ssorrell said:


> Considering I've been with DTV since its launch in 1994, I doubt I'll be dropping it.
> $6 per month for 12 months is $72. Surely shipping for a one time repair service won't cost that much?!
> 
> Besides, how fair is it that it is leased equipment, yet I have to purchase a Protection Plan? Why do I have to buy "insurance" on something that I don't own? Sounds like just another way to get more money...


Read post #205 and consider this: This actually happened to me last year. And it must have happened to others.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

stevel said:


> What the protection plan buys you is coverage for a service call - say, something goes wrong with the dish or wiring. It also makes it faster to get a replacement receiver.
> 
> For me, it isn't worthwhile. I can see that for some it might be.


What we ended up deciding in that other forum was that people who have a lot of equipment get the most out of the PP.

I think a lot of people have read articles in consumer magazines that state that warranties are not necessary and are little more than an extra income stream for places like BB and CC. I agree with that. Absolutely. The PP is something different.

Check out post #205, that actually happened to me last year.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

ssorrell said:


> Considering I've been with DTV since its launch in 1994, I doubt I'll be dropping it.


What was it like in 1994? I had cable then and had a dozen VCRs hooked up to many cable lines. Weren't DVRs then, were there? Ultimate TV was the first one, no? With D*, I mean. They were great DVRs, when they worked properly, which was rare.

Rich


----------



## bengalfreak

Rich584 said:


> Oh, one question for you. Have you ever been a member of the Protection Plan?
> 
> Rich


Yup, had it for six months when I first got DirecTV. It was useless to me. I self installed my first system. When I upgraded to a larger dish, DirecTV did it for free. When my multiswitch needed replacement due to locals being moved to a spotbeam satellite, again DTV did it for free. I started out with two Ultimate TV's. Had them for two years before I replaced them with two series one Sony DTivos. Those have been replaced with series 2's and three more added for a total of five. In that time, over seven years, I have replaced two hard drives for about $100 each at least doubling capacity each time. I have had no system failures whatsoever, no dish realignment problems. I stop my DTivos from automatically updating software so I am usually unaffected by the problems that plague new software.

I see that it has worked out for you monetarily, however, to advise someone else to purchase the protection plan is not wise. 99% of all who purchase it will lose financially. If they didn't DTV would not sell it, plain and simple. They sell it because it makes them money, and takes money from their customers period.

Sorry for hijacking the thread.


----------



## bengalfreak

Rich584 said:


> *Steve!*
> 
> Man, I really racked my mind over that acronym. If we were in the Navy, the first two words of MFS would have been, well, you know. Between that and the context of the post, I had no idea. I truly think acronyms should be banned on forums. The other day I read a post that had SFU in it. Try to figure that one out when it's not used in the proper or expected context.


http://www.acronymfinder.com/

I use it religiously.


----------



## ssorrell

Rich584 said:


> What was it like in 1994? I had cable then and had a dozen VCRs hooked up to many cable lines. Weren't DVRs then, were there? Ultimate TV was the first one, no? With D*, I mean. They were great DVRs, when they worked properly, which was rare.
> 
> Rich


In 1994, of course everything was expensive. I remember paying $799 for my dish and receiver. I had DTV and USSB service, but at the time, the plans were reasonablely priced.

No DVRs then...they were not introduced until 1999. Tivo and ReplayTV were first having been launched at the Consumer Electronics Show in 1999. Tivo's first units started shipping in March and Microsoft's Ultimate TV didn't hit the market until late in the year, even though the units were previewed at the Electronics Show also. But yes, Ultimate TV was the first DVR to be integrated with DTV service.

I bought the first Tivo unit at Sears in 1999, when no one in the store even knew what it was or how to use it. My family fell in love with the device quickly...we didn't know how we lived without it before it was introduced. But those early units...man, they had lots of problems, or at least I did with mine. I bet I had to send my Tivo back three or four times within a 6 month period, mainly because of modem failures. Customer service was a pain in the arse back then, usually taking an hour for a call only to be told to ship it back for diagnosis. Oddly enough, over the next couple of years, after my warranty expired, my modem would fry again within a week or so. But, by that time,Tivos were practically free with all the rebates they gave to get the product out and into service. The biggest problem with that was that the subscription was tied to the box, so if I ditched it and got a new one, I had to pay for a new service subscription again. It did get a little expensive. When DirecTivos were introduced, I quickly made the move, not only because it made the connections behind my home stereo much more concise and efficient, but the fees for the Tivo service through DTV were much more economical.

All in all, the reliability of the DirecTivo hardware has been far superior to the earlier units that I had. Until now. With my older units in the beginning, even after I had a modem melt down and my daily calls stopped, at least I could still watch live TV, pause it, record it, etc. I just couldn't program recordings for the future as I lost programming data without the calls. But with this current problem in the DTivo units, I can't perform ANY function with any amount of reliability. And the inability of DTV or Tivo to fix this problem for such a long time now has given me some serious doubts about both companies that I have been with since their inception. But, apparently that doesn't matter to anyone.


----------



## fasTLane

Funny, no problems here with Directivo. Flawless for months now. 6.3e and holding.


----------



## dcstager

My first generation Series 1 is still going without a problem since July 1999. The modem has never failed. I do wish they'd do just one more software update. It's going to be sad to abandon all this nice Tivo hardware, but it's the end for standard def tv. They simply are becoming no longer useful for what I want to use them for.

Tivo simply has got to come up with a DirectTV HDTV unit similar to the Tivo HD or Series 3.


----------



## dtremain

dcstager said:


> Tivo simply has got to come up with a DirectTV HDTV unit similar to the Tivo HD or Series 3.


"Simply" not going to happen since Directv is marketing their own unit and saving the TiVo fee per subscriber by doing so.


----------



## chuckg

fasTLane said:


> Funny, no problems here with Directivo. Flawless for months now. 6.3e and holding.


With which model?


----------



## Rich584

bengalfreak said:


> Yup, had it for six months when I first got DirecTV. It was useless to me. I self installed my first system. When I upgraded to a larger dish, DirecTV did it for free. When my multiswitch needed replacement due to locals being moved to a spotbeam satellite, again DTV did it for free. I started out with two Ultimate TV's. Had them for two years before I replaced them with two series one Sony DTivos. Those have been replaced with series 2's and three more added for a total of five. In that time, over seven years, I have replaced two hard drives for about $100 each at least doubling capacity each time. I have had no system failures whatsoever, no dish realignment problems.


You have to be one of the luckiest people on Earth. Or have never had an HR20. Buy a lottery ticket!



> I see that it has worked out for you monetarily, however, to advise someone else to purchase the protection plan is not wise. 99% of all who purchase it will lose financially.


Somehow, I doubt your 99% figure. Altho, I must admit that I am one of the few people I know who actually sits down and reads warranties.

In 1983 I purchased a 78 Honda. I paid for an extended warranty ($300, I think, for two years) and everybody laughed at me. Over the next two years I had a new motor installed, a new transmission, a new water pump...see where I'm going with this? I sat in the salesman's cubicle for an hour while I read the details of the extended warranty before I purchased it.

After two years I had rebuilt that car. And the salesman said to me one day, "You know, you're the only person that's ever used the extended warranty that they bought." He went on to explain to me that no one at the dealership even knew how to administrate the warranty until my motor blew.



> If they didn't DTV would not sell it, plain and simple. They sell it because it makes them money, and takes money from their customers period.


Of course they make money on it. That's the whole point of offering it. A lot of people don't know how to use it or what it is. And most of the people in this country think everything they read in the consumer magazines is Gospel. Some warranties are senseless. I'm not arguing that point. I agree with you.

Just for the better service I get with the PP I think it is worth 6 bucks a month. And if I'm the only one using it and happy with it, I'd be amazed.



> Sorry for hijacking the thread.


Hey, no problem. I used to teach at a local college and I loved it when people argued. What you learn in a heated discussion (which is what an argument is supposed to be) sticks in you mind.

If our argument spurs one person to READ the PP and understand what it can do for you and purchase it, I will feel justified.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

*Steve!*
I should have known. Thanx so much for the link. Cracked me up! First thought I had was "You gotta be kidding!" I do love a good chuckle and I WILL use that site religiously.

Thanx again,

Rich



bengalfreak said:


> http://www.acronymfinder.com/
> 
> I use it religiously.


----------



## Rich584

Rich584 said:


> *Steve!*
> I should have known. Thanx so much for the link. Cracked me up! First thought I had was "You gotta be kidding!" I do love a good chuckle and I WILL use that site religiously.
> 
> Thanx again,
> 
> Rich


I just used it for USSB and it gave three meanings. So, I guess you have to understand the context too.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

That was a great story. I didn't switch until 2002 because of the Yankees problem. D* had them and Cablevision didn't. I loved the Ultimate TV DVRs and had about 20 of them. They were typical Microsoft products, great software, poor hardware. But they had the right ideas for the GUI before TiVo did. If I remember correctly they had the folders option way before TiVo did. Good story, hope everyone enjoys it as much as I did.



> And the inability of DTV or Tivo to fix this problem for such a long time now has given me some serious doubts about both companies that I have been with since their inception. But, apparently that doesn't matter to anyone.


There are two threads going on this forum that address the TiVo software problems. We care. And D* can solve the problem quickly. Get one of their DVRs. I'm awaiting the arrival of my sixth HR20/21 next week and hope to have eight running in a few months. I will give up the TiVos then. Been a good run. The HR20/21 is the future.

Of course D* is benefiting greatly from the TiVo problems. So are websites selling HDs for TiVos. First time I had the rebooting problem, I figured it was a HD problem and bought a new one. I had a lot of TiVos go south and each time it was the HD. I spent over $300 on my hardware because I thought the rebooting was caused by something I had done.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

fasTLane said:


> Funny, no problems here with Directivo. Flawless for months now. 6.3e and holding.


Where are you? You can enter a location on your "User CP". I'm interested in the geographic location of people who experience problems and those who don't. I'm looking for a pattern and I'm pretty sure there is no pattern geographically.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

dcstager said:


> Tivo simply has got to come up with a DirectTV HDTV unit similar to the Tivo HD or Series 3.


Try the HR20/21. Give it a month or so. Really different. Little steeper learning curve. You can't help but like them once you learn how to operate them.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

dtremain said:


> "Simply" not going to happen since Directv is marketing their own unit and saving the TiVo fee per subscriber by doing so.


I wonder if D* still has to pay TiVo fees? Bet they do. What do you think?

From what I understand, D* has 20,000,000 subscribers. I wonder what percentage of those subs have at least one active TiVo in their homes?

Rich


----------



## Rich584

chuckg said:


> With which model?


The problems don't seem to occur on any particular model. They occur on all the Series 2 units. Don't know about the Series 1 units.

Rich


----------



## JimSpence

Rich584 said:


> Try the HR20/21. Give it a month or so. Really different. Little steeper learning curve. You can't help but like them once you learn how to operate them.
> 
> Rich


True statement!



Rich584 said:


> I wonder if D* still has to pay TiVo fees? Bet they do. What do you think?
> 
> From what I understand, D* has 20,000,000 subscribers. I wonder what percentage of those subs have at least one active TiVo in their homes?
> 
> Rich


I still have a series 1 T60 and the HR10 on my account. I believe DirecTV pays $1/month to TiVo.



Rich584 said:


> The problems don't seem to occur on any particular model. They occur on all the Series 2 units. Don't know about the Series 1 units.
> 
> Rich


Series 1 DirecTV TiVos don't have 6.x software, they are at 3.5 something. My HR10 has 6.3e and I haven't had the problems reported on SD units.


----------



## dtremain

Rich584 said:


> I wonder if D* still has to pay TiVo fees? Bet they do. What do you think?


No qauestion about it. They still have to pay the fee for TiVo units. TiVo owns the software.

My statement was a response to someone's sanguine hope that TiVo will develop software for a Directv HD DVR. Directv, of course, would not utilize it because it would cut their income.


----------



## Cudahy

Simple solution: An extra 3 dollar a month fee for Tivo interface on the "HR25".


----------



## stevel

I have an HR10 running 6.3e and it is fine. I also have an HR20 and HR21 and they're fine too.


----------



## dtremain

Cudahy said:


> Simple solution: An extra 3 dollar a month fee for Tivo interface on the "HR25".


Not going to happen if I understand American business these days.

The strategy is to offer less quantity for the same price, not equal or better service for more money.

That's why a "pound" can of coffee has not gone up in price but only contains 13 oz.

Or, haven't you noticed?


----------



## CrashHD

Cudahy said:


> Simple solution: An extra 3 dollar a month fee for Tivo interface on the "HR25".


That would work for some, but not all. A few reasons it would not work for me: Tivo is not just an interface. It's a linux box which can be manipulated. Storage can be upgraded, hacks can be installed giving more features. Once it's hacked, it can do that thing what we don't talk about. If it misses a recording for one reason or another, that recording can be "obtained" with a pc and put on the tivo. I think most of those things are more dependant on "tivo hardware" to run than on "tivo interface"

It would be better than nothing, though.

If by "interface" you mean the box would become capable of everything an unhacked Series3 is capable of, that would be satisfactory to me...anything less than that, and I'll just be happy to stick with my hacked SD DTivos.


----------



## manhole

It seems that this thread has gone completely off topic 

Is there any positive news for when we will have 6.3f installed on our boxes? This rebooting is getting really bad.


----------



## CrashHD

I haven't heard any reports of a 6.3f which installed by itself. I don't know if it's coming anytime soon or not. Only one of my units even has the slices. It's had them for 6 weeks now. I'm wondering if this rollout wasn't aborted before it even started.

Best advice I could give to someone with an unhacked unit is to obtain/install a 6.2a image. using bootpage to set upgradesoftware=false will prevent an unhacked box from updating, without the need to deny a phone connection.


----------



## Rich584

dtremain said:


> No qauestion about it. They still have to pay the fee for TiVo units. TiVo owns the software.


That was my assumption.



> My statement was a response to someone's sanguine hope that TiVo will develop software for a Directv HD DVR. Directv, of course, would not utilize it because it would cut their income.


I agree with you. D* would be foolish to drop their "lease" program, which I think is a wise business decision, and let TiVo back in. Those leased units all add to D*'s bottom line as "owned" (by D*) equipment.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

*Steve!*

You never answered my question in a previous post. I will ask it again. How do you know the HR10 is not rebooting? I know when mine reboot when I'm not watching because I lose the 30 second skip. I don't remember reading very many posts about the HR10's randomly rebooting.

Rich



stevel said:


> I have an HR10 running 6.3e and it is fine. I also have an HR20 and HR21 and they're fine too.


----------



## rminsk

Rich584 said:


> Try the HR20/21. Give it a month or so. Really different. Little steeper learning curve. You can't help but like them once you learn how to operate them.


Between all the reboots and short recordings on my HR20 I really hate my HR20. I'm glad I still have my HR10 as a backup.


----------



## Rich584

rminsk said:


> Between all the reboots and short recordings on my HR20 I really hate my HR20. I'm glad I still have my HR10 as a backup.


As far as the reboots go, I live with two HR20s that crash if I leave them in standby. I have solved this problem by leaving them "On" constantly. My other three I can leave in standby. As long as that is what you are talking about, leaving them On all the time should solve the crashing problem which can only be solved by manually rebooting them.

If you are having short recordings, I would definitely suggest replacing the unit. That's the only way I know of to fix that problem. My five have never done that. Of course I have gone thru over 30 HR20s to get five that work properly (or close enough for me).


----------



## Rich584

rminsk said:


> Between all the reboots and short recordings on my HR20 I really hate my HR20. I'm glad I still have my HR10 as a backup.


By the way, you would not believe the problems I had for a year with HR20s. One wouldn't recognize ANY remote control. Several wouldn't record anything. The recordings would show up in the "List", but all I got was a blank screen. Two had front panels that I had to stuff paper into to stop the vibrations. A couple sounded like they had angry rattlesnakes living in them. One would not turn on at all. Checked the cord and had 120 VAC at the female end. DVR was dead as a doornail. I could go on... and on...

But when they work correctly, they are really good.

Get a new one.

Rich


----------



## rminsk

Rich584 said:


> If you are having short recordings, I would definitely suggest replacing the unit. That's the only way I know of to fix that problem. My five have never done that. Of course I have gone thru over 30 HR20s to get five that work properly (or close enough for me).


All four of mine have programs that record completely and then about half way through playback I get the delete or keep screen. Do not tell me I have bad power. All of the power is coming off a 225kVa Mitsubishi's 9700 Series Uninterruptible Power Supply.

So you had to go through 30 just to get 5 that work. Then there is a huge problem. How could you be happy with that?


----------



## Rich584

rminsk said:


> All four of mine have programs that record completely and then about half way through playback I get the delete or keep screen. Do not tell me I have bad power. All of the power is coming off a 225kVa Mitsubishis 9700 Series Uninterruptible Power Supply.


I wasn't going to suggest anything about your power supply. Just that I doubt that you are going get a fix for your recording problem other than replacing the unit.



> So you had to go through 30 just to get 5 that work. Then there is a huge problem. How could you be happy with that?


I wasn't happy. Took a year to finally settle down. Now everything is OK. I hope. It was a nightmare for a while.

Rich


----------



## rubybear

Rich, thanks for the belly laughs while reading your saga of the HR20s. Rattlesnakes, even! Glad to see youre still sane after all that.

Ive sort of been able to control my freezing/reboots by avoiding my local channels for the most part. I seem to be having fairly good luck with NBC & ABC, but Ive pretty much had to abandon CBS altogether, and FOX is temperamental. The main thing is to make sure both of the tuners are not tuned to a local channel, unless Im actually watching or recording a program on one. As soon as Im done with the local channel, I switch to a national channel, such as Discovery. Still have the reboots while on a local channel, but not as often. (By the way, I tried your XM suggestion, and had a reboot 2 seconds into watching CBS on the other tuner. So much for that.)

After reading all the R15 forums Ive gone to, there is no way Ill ever get one of those! At least my Series 2 Samsung D-Tivo records the shows I set up, all the way through, and Im able to watch them, fast forward, reverse, whatever, with no problems. However, with no software updates for this bug apparently ever coming, I realize Im eventually going to have to retire my D-Tivo.

My Toshiba SDTV is only 2½ years old, so Im not in any hurry to go HD. Ill have this TV for a long time. Now for my questions:

Should I try to get an HR20 or 21 to replace my D-Tivo? I think someone posted earlier that you can use it with an SDTV. Or, will it really work with SD? Would I need a new dish, or would my current dish work? Do I have to subscribe to the HD service if I have one of these DVRs, even though I dont have HDTV? Can I really get it for $99.00?

Another option; should I replace it instead with the new R16 for $99? I still cant find any user reviews, sure would like to hear from anyone who has one of these new DVRs, to see if there are bugs like with the R15.

Im assuming a stand alone Tivo won't work with my DirecTV service. Is that true?

Sorry for all the questions, but you guys are always so helpful!

rubybear


----------



## bengalfreak

Rich584 said:


> Of course I have gone thru over 30 HR20s to get five that work properly (or close enough for me).


Wow, I can't believe you didn't give up and dump DirecTV. I would have long before going thru anything close to 30 DVR's. And somehow you are posting positive comments about them. I would have never said a good word about that piece of equipment if it had given me 100 yrs. of service after that kind of start. Does DirecTV even have a beta test program anymore?


----------



## stevel

Yes, DirecTV has a beta test program. Every receiver, and every software version, gets beta tested by dozens or even hundreds of regular users (which is more than I can say for TiVo.)

I've been following the HR2x for nearly a year (and have had both an HR20 and HR21 for many months now), and I have never seen a hint, either with myself or from others, of such a level of trouble. I have to wonder what else is going on.


----------



## Rich584

rubybear said:


> Rich, thanks for the belly laughs while reading your saga of the HR20s. Rattlesnakes, even! Glad to see youre still sane after all that.


Actually, I could probably write a book about my experiences with HR20s. This started in November of 2006 and is still going on.

I have actually added to RRL because of the problems I have had. For instance, RRL #176 is: "There is no such thing as a Refurbished HR20, they are just repackaged and sent back out without testing." This was proven by the HR20 "refurb" that would not recognize ANY remote. If they tested the units they send out, that one couldn't have passed the simplest test.



> Ive sort of been able to control my freezing/reboots by avoiding my local channels for the most part. I seem to be having fairly good luck with NBC & ABC, but Ive pretty much had to abandon CBS altogether, and FOX is temperamental. The main thing is to make sure both of the tuners are not tuned to a local channel, unless Im actually watching or recording a program on one. As soon as Im done with the local channel, I switch to a national channel, such as Discovery. Still have the reboots while on a local channel, but not as often. (By the way, I tried your XM suggestion, and had a reboot 2 seconds into watching CBS on the other tuner. So much for that.)


You should have read my post refuting the XM idea. The only TiVo I watch regularly is never on a local station. Shoots that idea of yours down, unfortunately. That TiVo will be replaced next week by an HR21. I just can't take it anymore. Geography seems to be an opinion shared by many as a cause, but I have read every thread I can find and the problem seems to be spread all over the country.

I truly think that the only cure will be the national release of the software that TiVo promised for 2008. From what I've read, 6.3f will NOT cure the problem.



> My Toshiba SDTV is only 2½ years old, so Im not in any hurry to go HD. Ill have this TV for a long time.


RRL #44: "Never buy anything by Toshiba". I bought one Toshiba TV and it was, by far, the worst large screen (32" SD) TV that I have ever bought. Were I you, (and forgive me for this, I'm not being insensitive to your financial condition) I would call up the Salvation Army and donate that Toshiba and purchase a Panasonic plasma that you can hook up four HR20/21s to. RRL #5: "If you can afford something you want, buy it immediately (after doing your homework, first, of course), you could get run over by a truck tomorrow."



> Should I try to get an HR20 or 21 to replace my D-Tivo?


The HR20-700 is the more stable of the two HR20 models. The HR20-100 is the other model and I have had eight of them and sent seven back.

Kept one and that just started crashing (needs to be rebooted manually) if left in "standby" overnight. I have one 700 that does the same thing. I leave both units "on" (they are always on, the only way to shut them off is to unplug them) and that has solved the crashing problem. I went thru this several months ago and kept all 20s "on" all the time.

The 20s have OTA capability and the 21s don't. If you don't need an antenna either will work.

My personal favorite right now is the HR20-700.

If you do decide to change, be prepared for a totally different experience. To begin with, you'll be lucky to get one that works properly. My experience bears that out. Have patience, be polite and subscribe to the Protection Plan.



> I think someone posted earlier that you can use it with an SDTV. Or, will it really work with SD?


Yes.



> Would I need a new dish, or would my current dish work? Do I have to subscribe to the HD service if I have one of these DVRs, even though I dont have HDTV? Can I really get it for $99.00?


Not sure what kind of deals D* has on upgrades. Go to their website, sign in and click on "receivers" and click on the first DVR. You should next see a balloon over the receiver that says "$100 Off", or something like that. Click on "Upgrade" and see how much it will cost you. I think that's how it works. In any event, you should be able to get free installation of a 5 LNB dish and an HR20/21 for $99. Might take a while to reach someone who can get you that price, but if you ask for "retention" at any time, you will be sent to someone whose job it is to retain customers and they have the power to offer you the best deals.



> Another option; should I replace it instead with the new R16 for $99? I still cant find any user reviews, sure would like to hear from anyone who has one of these new DVRs, to see if there are bugs like with the R15.


Better to go to the HR20/21 now. Why waste money on an unknown unit?



> Im assuming a stand alone Tivo won't work with my DirecTV service. Is that true?


As far as I know, you are correct. And they are relatively expensive (Costco has one for $279 today, online). You have to pay a higher monthly rate for that service, too, I think. And they will only receive MPEG2 which takes up a lot more recording space than the MPEG4 that D* is switching over to.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

stevel said:


> I have to wonder what else is going on.


Steve, believe me, I have not caused any problems with 20s. Several of the replacements I got were because of HDMI issues.

Apparently the easiest course of action for a CSR at the time was send a replacement, which had the same problem because nobody had any idea that the HDMI connection might be the problem.

Finally reached a woman a the PP's Oregon call center and the first thing she asked me was did I have a Sony TV and was the HDMI cable hooked up. She told me to switch to component and the problems would go away. And they did.

All the things I have documented in this post and other posts actually happened to me and are still happening. I have two 20s that have to be on all the time. If I put them in standby, I have to reboot them in the morning.

Rich


----------



## stevel

Very strange. FWIW, I have a Sony TV and use HDMI and have no issues with either the HR20-100 or HR21-700 I have.


----------



## Rich584

stevel said:


> Very strange. FWIW, I have a Sony TV and use HDMI and have no issues with either the HR20-100 or HR21-700 I have.


The Sonys I referred to were CRTs. I had the 40" and still have a 36". I believe these were the last 4:3 tube HD sets that Sony sold. I know they sold 16:9 (or close) tubes, but I believe they have abandoned the CRT. My 40" weighed 500 pounds and paid for having one of my family rooms redone. Contractor did a straight swap. Last year.

I know several other manufacturers had the same problem. Don't recall who they were. Don't forget, this was in November and December of 2006. The HDMI worked perfectly with the Sony and Samsung upscaler DVD players that I hooked up to them.

I haven't seen any mention of HDMI issues for months. But they happened.

Rich


----------



## Marrelli

rubybear said:


> Do I have to subscribe to the HD service if I have one of these DVRs, even though I dont have HDTV?


I'm also have this same question, whether you can get the HR20 or HR21 box without subscibing to the HD ervice?


----------



## Marrelli

rubybear said:


> Do I have to subscribe to the HD service if I have one of these DVRs, even though I dont have HDTV?


 I emailed Directv with this question, here is their response:

"Dear Mr. Matz,

Thanks for writing us. If you would like a HD-DVr you can get it for a standard TV, but you will be paying an additional $9.99 for HD programming and $5.99 per month for DVR service, both are required with HD-DVR."


----------



## bengalfreak

Rich584 said:


> Somehow, I doubt your 99% figure. Altho, I must admit that I am one of the few people I know who actually sits down and reads warranties.


Rich if you still doubt the 99% figure, check out the pole in this same forum. Out of 37 responders to the poll, 34 have had zero or one service call from DirecTV over the lifetime of them having the service. Four of the people responding have had zero service calls in 15, 11+, 11 & 9 years respectively. While this poll is not scientific, you can see that for the masses, the protection plan would be a bad idea. For the most part, DirecTV's hardware has been rock solid for many years. There does seem to be a problem with the HR20's however. One responder did say his first 2 service calls ever have come in the few months since he got one.


----------



## CrashHD

I've had DirecTV since 2002. I do not have the protection plan. I've had two non-dvr SD receivers burn out, one 3x4 multiswitch burn out, and one side of a dual-lnb quit getting half the transponders. 

I got the receivers replaced for free with a little bit of phone negotiation. The multiswitch cost me $20. One time I saw a satellite dish put out with someone's curbside trash, so I took it. The spare lnb I got from that cost me $0.

My first tivo was a 80GB R10, to which I added a 160GB drive. After 2 years, the 160GB drive I had added failed. I repaired that unit with a single 250GB drive. Since it was my added drive that failed, and I could have repaired that unit simply by reimaging the original drive, I don't count that among the repair total.

In 6 years, I've had a few failures, repaired them myself, for a total cost of $20 + a few hours of my time. Would I have been better off with the PP? No. That doesn't mean I should go around telling people they should or should not sign up for it. I'm better off without it, because I'm a pretty resourceful person, and I'm able and willing to fix my problems myself. 

The PP is basically just like insurance for your DBS hardware. You know exactly what your repair/maintenance costs are: $x.xx/months. Whether something goes wrong, or nothing goes wrong, that's what it costs. Some people may get a peace of mind from that certaintly, peace of mind that may make the PP worthwhile for them, even if it turns out to cost them more.

Without the PP, it's just like being uninsured. Your repair/maintenance cost vary by what goes wrong. It's a lot like a car. If it's old, and the replacement value is low, it's not worth insuring (for full coverage...I'm not suggesting anyone drive an uninsured car). 

Whether or not to get the PP is a personal choice. Some people will be money ahead with it. Some will not. Some will vary by circumstance. For example, I've explained how I've been better without it, but if I had several hr20's or hr21's, with their unestablished reputation for reliability, I would probably choose differently. 

That being said, the point I make here is the same, to the folks insisting the PP is a must-have option, and the folks insisting the PP is throwing away money. You can't assume your circumstances apply to everyone, so if you would please, kindly mind your own business and allow this thread to return to topic. If you want to debate the merits/lack thereof/ of the PP, please start your own thread to do so.


----------



## Kimtsu08

yes for 6.3...


----------



## Brainiac427

May as well plug the phone line back in. I was lying in bed today just before 9 a.m. EST when I noticed the green light on. That can only mean one thing--spontaneous reboot. I turned on the TV, and sure enough, it was. The phone line's been unplugged for over two months now, and I disabled the DLB by setting them on XM stations (as recommended by this forum), and it still rebooted. God knows how many times it's rebooted without my knowing it. I suspected rebooting might be taking place yesterday when I turned the DirecTiVo on and noticed that both tuners were tuned to the same XM station (which is not how I left it), and the channel banner was almost full screen (which is not how I left it). That always happens with a reboot--both tuners tune to the same channel, and the channel banner resets to the default setting, almost full screen.

Could all this spontaneous rebooting shorten the life of the hard drive?

I'm fresh out of ideas at this point. I could always have DirecTV send me a free R15 since I'm with the Protection Plan, but I don't want to give up my last TiVo yet. I could always try the Instantcake route, but that would mean starting all over from scratch with a fresh hard drive, and I don't want to lose everything I already have on there. I've been holding out waiting for this 6.3f alledged bug fix. When's it going to be rolled out?


----------



## Rich584

bengalfreak said:


> Rich if you still doubt the 99% figure, check out the pole in this same forum. Out of 37 responders to the poll, 34 have had zero or one service call from DirecTV over the lifetime of them having the service. Four of the people responding have had zero service calls in 15, 11+, 11 & 9 years respectively. While this poll is not scientific, you can see that for the masses, the protection plan would be a bad idea. For the most part, DirecTV's hardware has been rock solid for many years. There does seem to be a problem with the HR20's however. One responder did say his first 2 service calls ever have come in the few months since he got one.


I never had a service call when using TiVos either. Never said I did. This all began with the HR20s. Once you go Hi Def the problems begin.

I really don't want to argue the point. Obviously you are not going to change your opinion and neither am I.

But to put this in perspective, I would have spent over $1000 last year if not for the PP. My monthly bill is well over $200 a month as a rule and I don't mind paying 6 bucks a month to protect the $2400 (at least) a year I pay for sat service.

I'm not making these figures up and I'm not the only one that had problems with dish alignments and other hardware troubles last year and it is still happening.

That said, I believe you are correct if you just look at TiVo owners. Try another forum that addresses the HR20s and you'll see what I mean.

My point about the better trained CSRs and techs at the PP is not something I made up. They are better trained and better able to communicate than the people you reach if you don't belong to the PP. That alone is worth 6 bucks a month to me.

Right now we are comparing apples and oranges. Even if you were to get the HR20/21 now you would probably not experience the problems we had to deal with last year and the year before. I think the 20 was introduced in August of 2006. I got my first one in November of that year.

I've already stated that I don't believe in most service plans or warranties. But there are exceptions. Did you read the post about the 78 Honda I bought? Now when I buy a car, it's usually a year old and I pay the certification fee just to get the extended warranty. Costs $1000. Ever had a Caddy repaired for anything? Usual bill is at least $500. That certification pays for itself every time.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

CrashHD said:


> That being said, the point I make here is the same, to the folks insisting the PP is a must-have option, and the folks insisting the PP is throwing away money. You can't assume your circumstances apply to everyone, so if you would please, kindly mind your own business and allow this thread to return to topic. If you want to debate the merits/lack thereof/ of the PP, please start your own thread to do so.


The original statement I made in post #197 was in regard to the HR20. It was a suggestion. I don't assume my situation is like anyone else's. As for telling me to mind my own business, that's just rude.


----------



## Rich584

Brainiac427 said:


> May as well plug the phone line back in. I was lying in bed today just before 9 a.m. EST when I noticed the green light on. That can only mean one thing--spontaneous reboot. I turned on the TV, and sure enough, it was. The phone line's been unplugged for over two months now, and I disabled the DLB by setting them on XM stations (as recommended by this forum), and it still rebooted. God knows how many times it's rebooted without my knowing it. I suspected rebooting might be taking place yesterday when I turned the DirecTiVo on and noticed that both tuners were tuned to the same XM station (which is not how I left it), and the channel banner was almost full screen (which is not how I left it). That always happens with a reboot--both tuners tune to the same channel, and the channel banner resets to the default setting, almost full screen.


Nothing helps. I tried the XM thing and that didn't work. I never have locals on the TiVo I use every day, so that is not a logical solution. Just have to wait for a software fix.



> Could all this spontaneous rebooting shorten the life of the hard drive?


Probably doesn't do them any good.



> I'm fresh out of ideas at this point. I could always have DirecTV send me a free R15 since I'm with the Protection Plan, but I don't want to give up my last TiVo yet. I could always try the Instantcake route, but that would mean starting all over from scratch with a fresh hard drive, and I don't want to lose everything I already have on there. I've been holding out waiting for this 6.3f alledged bug fix. When's it going to be rolled out?


From what I've read the 6.3f won't clear up the rebooting. You probably won't like the R15 or R16. The 15 has had many issues and the R16 probably won't be any better. The Instantcake seems like the best way to get a new OS, but I'm switching to HD DVRs. Had enough of the reboots.

Rich


----------



## Rich584

Argggg. This TiVo just rebooted again.


----------



## Rich584

Brainiac427 said:


> I suspected rebooting might be taking place yesterday when I turned the DirecTiVo on and noticed that both tuners were tuned to the same XM station (which is not how I left it), and the channel banner was almost full screen (which is not how I left it). That always happens with a reboot--both tuners tune to the same channel, and the channel banner resets to the default setting, almost full screen.


Mine just rebooted and sure enough the tuners are on the same station. Didn't know that. Thanx.

Rich


----------



## JimSpence

I have a question for all of you that are having many problems. Have you checked the quality of your electric source? Maybe the voltage is too low or high. Which really shouldn't be a problem with switching type power supplies (which I believe are being used), but it is something to think about.


----------



## Brainiac427

JimSpence said:


> I have a question for all of you that are having many problems. Have you checked the quality of your electric source? Maybe the voltage is too low or high. Which really shouldn't be a problem with switching type power supplies (which I believe are being used), but it is something to think about.


It's on a UPS. Should not be an issue.


----------



## Brainiac427

Rich584 said:


> From what I've read the 6.3f won't clear up the rebooting.


----------



## rock_doctor

JimSpence said:


> I have a question for all of you that are having many problems....


Mine are also on a UPS.


----------



## Da Goon

Rich584 said:


> The original statement I made in post #197 was in regard to the HR20. It was a suggestion. I don't assume my situation is like anyone else's. As for telling me to mind my own business, that's just rude.


This thread has nothing to do with the HR20 or the pp, but you've LITTERED it with posts and posts about those 2 things. Crash asked pretty politely to not clutter this thread anymore with things unrelated to 6.3f software. Threadcrapping all over the place about things OT is rude. Making 8 posts in a row to respond to previous posts and drop more OT garbage is also rude.  Ever wonder why sometimes it's difficult to find useful information in threads like this? It's usually due to threadcrap such as nearly every post you've added to this thread so far. If you find my comments rude, get thicker skin. Back On Topic People!


----------



## rubybear

Marrelli said:


> I emailed Directv with this question, here is their response:
> 
> "Dear Mr. Matz,
> 
> Thanks for writing us. If you would like a HD-DVr you can get it for a standard TV, but you will be paying an additional $9.99 for HD programming and $5.99 per month for DVR service, both are required with HD-DVR."


Thanks for getting back with that information. Well, that's pretty much a deal-breaker for me. There's no way I'm going to pay an extra $10 a month for HD programming, when I don't even have HDTV!


----------



## rubybear

Rich584 said:


> RRL #44: "Never buy anything by Toshiba". I bought one Toshiba TV and it was, by far, the worst large screen (32" SD) TV that I have ever bought. Were I you, (and forgive me for this, I'm not being insensitive to your financial condition) I would call up the Salvation Army and donate that Toshiba and purchase a Panasonic plasma that you can hook up four HR20/21s to. RRL #5: "If you can afford something you want, buy it immediately (after doing your homework, first, of course), you could get run over by a truck tomorrow."


I don't know what the problem is with Toshibas. I've been very happy with my 24" SD LCD . Sorry to say I don't have the luxury of giving a 2-year old TV away and buying a plasma (presumably HD). I actually acquired this TV as a gift from my son, which was a replacement for a 15-year old 20" Magnavox. I'm not offended - you don't know my financial situation, of course.

It's looking like I'll just have to wait this thing out and HOPE that DTV will decide to honor what their July press release states:



> Press Release
> 
> DIRECTV to Introduce Additional TiVo Features
> EL SEGUNDO and ALVISO, Calif., July 31, 2007  DIRECTV, Inc. (NYSE: DTV), the nation's leading satellite television service provider, and TiVo Inc. (NASDAQ: TIVO), the creator of and a leader in television services for digital video recorders (DVR), will develop a software upgrade to enhance the user experience for DIRECTV customers who have DIRECTV DVRs with TiVo® service built on the Series2 platform.
> 
> Launching in early 2008, the new software download will provide these customers with DVR enhancements offered with the TiVo service, including a Recently Deleted Folder and Overlap Protection, as well as DIRECTV's Remote Booking feature. In addition, DIRECTV and TiVo will continue to explore ways to bring future enhancements to DIRECTV customers with TiVo receivers.
> 
> "It is important to us that our customers with TiVo service also have access to the latest DVR technology and we look forward to exploring additional opportunities with TiVo," said Derek Chang, executive vice president, Content Strategy and Development for DIRECTV, Inc. "DIRECTV's launch of these additional features underscores the uniqueness of TiVo's DVR service," said Naveen Chopra, vice president, Corporate Development and Strategy for TiVo.
> 
> DIRECTV and TiVo began their relationship in 2000 with the launch of the first DIRECTV DVR with TiVo. In April 2006, both companies announced an extension of their commercial and advertising relationship through early 2010. [End Quote]
> 
> Sigh...


----------



## Sartori

JimSpence said:


> I have a question for all of you that are having many problems. Have you checked the quality of your electric source? Maybe the voltage is too low or high. Which really shouldn't be a problem with switching type power supplies (which I believe are being used), but it is something to think about.


Do you have the record for amount of posts?


----------



## Rich584

JimSpence said:


> I have a question for all of you that are having many problems. Have you checked the quality of your electric source? Maybe the voltage is too low or high. Which really shouldn't be a problem with switching type power supplies (which I believe are being used), but it is something to think about.


I've checked. I'm an electrician by trade and in the area I live in, the voltage is a steady 120 VAC (give or take a volt). Measured with an industrial digital Fluke and an analog Simpson multi-meter.

Most electrical appliances and home devices are built to run from 95 VAC to 130 VAC. Obviously at 95 VAC you are getting into "brownout" conditions. And you don't want to run the devices at the ends of the range for long periods of time.

The average desirable voltage is about 117 VAC. I even borrowed a "constant voltage transformer" which is a device that puts out a constant 120 VAC (roughly) when connected to the 95-130 VAC range. I also used a fairly large variable transformer and could not cause reboots at higher or lower voltages.

I've tried everything I could think of, and I give up. The only logical conclusion I can come up with is a combination of software and hardware problems. I think you have to factor hardware problems in, but that doesn't explain the people who have no problem. Or the fact that I have six TiVos that reboot randomly and are all different models and manufacturers. But all Series 2 units. None of them rebooted randomly until I got 6.3e. The software has to be a factor.  And yet it works on a lot of poster's Series 2 TiVos.

It's not the power here that's causing the problem. Our section of the the national power grid is quite stable.

And, I've read every post on every forum that I could find looking for a geographic pattern and can find no evidence of one.

Have any thoughts?

Rich


----------



## Rich584

JimSpence said:


> I have a question for all of you that are having many problems. Have you checked the quality of your electric source? Maybe the voltage is too low or high. Which really shouldn't be a problem with switching type power supplies (which I believe are being used), but it is something to think about.


Whoa, Jim, that's an impressive amount of posts!

Rich


----------



## chuckg

Rich584 said:


> Argggg. This TiVo just rebooted again.


Assuming you posted at the exact time - 10:19 AM - that the reboot occured, you turned it on at 9:36 AM, 7 minutes before your first post on this thread. Or you turned it on at 9:19 or possbily 8:56 AM.


----------



## CrashHD

I've been running 6.3f on my test box for about a week now, and I've been noticing, that about every other day, I get a message from "the DVR service". They're all short messages advertising tivo features. One about showcases, one about "the channel list", and one about "POWER, VOL, & MUTE buttons". I never saw this with 6.2 or 6.2a. Anyone else see this?


----------



## RandCfilm

CrashHD said:


> I've been running 6.3f on my test box for about a week now, and I've been noticing, that about every other day, I get a message from "the DVR service". They're all short messages advertising tivo features. One about showcases, one about "the channel list", and one about "POWER, VOL, & MUTE buttons". I never saw this with 6.2 or 6.2a. Anyone else see this?


I've been running 6.3f since 12/20/2007 on one unit and have never seen anything like that. I forgot to set up crond for fakecall and I did get the "not made a call" message but that's been it. Also I have showcases disabled so that might make a difference.


----------



## rpiotro

My HR10-250 got the slices for 6.3f overnight!

6.3f-01-2-357 tyDb 200168 02/03/08 08:50

Are they finally being deployed?

I plan on staying with my 3.1.5f for now. I've suffered too much pain. I'll trade the slow operation for reliability any day. Remember how well your Tivo used to work?

I am tempted to plug the phone line back in on my R10 though. Would someone please report as soon as they get 6.3f on their series 2 SD machine?

Rich Piotrowski


----------



## codespy

CrashHD said:


> I've been running 6.3f on my test box for about a week now, and I've been noticing, that about every other day, I get a message from "the DVR service". They're all short messages advertising tivo features. One about showcases, one about "the channel list", and one about "POWER, VOL, & MUTE buttons". I never saw this with 6.2 or 6.2a. Anyone else see this?


I get these same messages, but usually after I imaged a drive and fire it up for the first time. I have gotton it on 6.2, 6.2a, 6.3b,c,d and e.


----------



## incog-neato

6.3F Will "officially" begin activation next week. The only (announced) fix in this release is random reboot problem.


----------



## wedgecon

incog-neato said:


> 6.3F Will "officially" begin activation next week. The only (announced) fix in this release is random reboot problem.


Do you have a source for this information?


----------



## incog-neato

Yes  http://www.cartoonstock.com/lowres/cga0289l.jpg


wedgecon said:


> Do you have a source for this information?


----------



## CrashHD

better source.

earl said so.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=118752


----------



## rpiotro

CrashHD said:


> better source.
> 
> earl said so.
> 
> http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=118752


Makes sense. See my post #272. It wasn't the tooth fairy that put them there.

Rich Piotrowski


----------



## rbtravis

Apparently only updates for 10-250 Directv TiVo machines, No updates yet for my RCA DVR40 series 2's, Just like the military, Continue to wait.


----------



## rpiotro

rbtravis said:


> Apparently only updates for 10-250 Directv TiVo machines, No updates yet for my RCA DVR40 series 2's, Just like the military, Continue to wait.


I stopped at home for lunch today. While I was fixing a sandwich I decided to force a call on my DVR40 in the kitchen. Got the "Pending Restart"! Did it and now have 6.3f there also!

Now if I would just get it on my R10 I would be happy. That is the machine that has misbehaved the most plus, it is the one I use to record some of the shows my wife watches that are in SD anyway. I have to watch it like a hawk to keep the peace.

If that R10 is not fixed with the 6.3f release, I am going to throw it off the roof, dust off my SAT-T60 and put it back in service.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

rpiotro said:


> If that R10 is not fixed with the 6.3f release, I am going to throw it off the roof, dust off my SAT-T60 and put it back in service.


DirecTV will probably add a 2 yr commitment to your account if you do that.


----------



## codespy

Phantom Gremlin said:


> DirecTV will probably add a 2 yr commitment to your account if you do that.


Use your AAA membership for discount and add another year onto those 2.


----------



## CrashHD

!!?

Is there seriously a DirecTV discount with AAA?


----------



## Bill R

Phantom Gremlin said:


> DirecTV will probably add a 2 yr commitment to your account if you do that.


They have done that (or tried to do that) on everyone that I know that tried to reactivate an owned older receiver. It is only those that went through a lot of phone hassle that have had the two year commitment removed.

There is some lawyer that has been posting in the Usenet newsgroups about a possible law suit over this.


----------



## codespy

CrashHD said:


> !!?
> 
> Is there seriously a DirecTV discount with AAA?


800-242-9114. For new AND existing customers.

You get something like $50 off now and again later on. Worth it for us since cable is not conducive to RV travel.

We now resume this thread to normal posting after the hi-jack.


----------



## Rainy Dave

Just checked my DTiVos. My R10 has 6.3f, the DVR40 still has 6.3e.


----------



## Rainy Dave

codespy said:


> 800-242-9114. For new AND existing customers.
> 
> You get something like $50 off now and again later on. Worth it for us since cable is not conducive to RV travel.
> 
> We now resume this thread to normal posting after the hi-jack.


Thanks for the heads up. On the phone with them now.


----------



## gibverse

rpiotro said:


> I stopped at home for lunch today. While I was fixing a sandwich I decided to force a call on my DVR40 in the kitchen. Got the "Pending Restart"! Did it and now have 6.3f there also!


I forced a call on my DVR40 a few minutes ago and was pleased to see "Pending Restart" as well. I'm now running 6.3f-01-2-151. Now to see how it compares to 6.3e...


----------



## fadein34

Where would you see "Pending Restart"? Under System Information???


----------



## CrashHD

I believe in the same general area that gives the status of the last daily call.


----------



## Tim32672

I have a Hughes SD-DVR80 and just did a connect to DVR service and I now have 6.3f01-2-151... so far everything is stable...I did not get it on my R10...


----------



## Duffycoug

rbtravis said:


> Apparently only updates for 10-250 Directv TiVo machines, No updates yet for my RCA DVR40 series 2's, Just like the military, Continue to wait.


But you dont' have any problems, so you dont' have to worry about the update.


----------



## rbtravis

Duffycoug said:


> But you dont' have any problems, so you dont' have to worry about the update.


That doesn't stop me from wanting the latest and greatest & from seeing what changes have been made.  You don't have to have problems to want new software.


----------



## robpickles

I got it! And it's about time! Now let's see if it does what it should.

Edit: R10 in New York

Rob


----------



## danimal107

I have an R10. I forced a call last night and did not get the update. I forced a call on my DVR40 and the update came through. Ufortunately, my DVR40 had not showed signs of the reboot problem, whereas my R10 reboots about an hour into watching every evening.


----------



## gshumaker

Forced calls last night on all 3 of my boxes and got 6.3f only on one. 

I noticed immediately that the remote delays seemed to go away.

Only other difference that I noticed was on the VIDEO setting screen for how to display widescreen format on 4:3 TV - either pan and scan or letterbox.

I'm in Virginia for those tracking locations!!


----------



## rbtravis

Please indicate your states so we can see where DirecTV is updating. Thanks.


----------



## Ingavar

:up:

Just turned on my HDVR2 and had a pending restart notice and the receiver restarted and the "F" undate was installed.

It made it's last call A 7:01 am this morning (02/08/08).

I'm in Portland, Oregon.

Will check my bedroom receiver and post results.


----------



## xplorer001

Got update on one of my R10s but not the other. Strange.


----------



## danimal107

BTW - I am in Beaverton, OR


----------



## danimal107

rbtravis said:


> Please indicate your states so we can see where DirecTV is updating. Thanks.


BTW - I am in Beaverton, OR


----------



## Sartori

rbtravis said:


> Please indicate your states so we can see where DirecTV is updating. Thanks.


Both R10's got the update yesterday, I'm in Montana


----------



## Ingavar

:up:


----------



## Ingavar

Just checked my bedroom R52180 and had no update. I forced a call and didn't get any updates.....yet.

Portland, Oregon


----------



## dtremain

xplorer001 said:


> Got update on one of my R10s but not the other. Strange.


Not at all. It is randomly done by units, not by subscriber. The whole process usually takes a few weeks.


----------



## rbtravis

I received update on one of my basement Tivo's but not on my other systems. Dtremain is correct, rollout by system ID.


----------



## codespy

1 of 3 SD receivers updated, 1 of 4 HD receivers updated.

Brett Favre, WI


----------



## bbristow

My Hughes SD-DVR 80 got 6.3f last night. I noticed tonight when I went into menus that they were all back at the top of each, so I checked, and sure enough, there it was. Just hope if fixes these reboots and freezes. The other night, it froze and rebooted 5 times in a little over an hour!!!


----------



## biggersavings

I saw the pending restart then right in the middle of watching a live show 6.3e decides to reboot as it has been doing every couple of days causing me to miss the end of the show. When it came back up I had 6.3f. My other two units rebooted overnight and all three now have 6.3f. Hopefully that was the last of the random reboots.


----------



## litzdog911

Forced a call and got 6.3f on my R10 DirecTivo. No luck on my HR10-250 yet.


----------



## kniederberger

6.3f on my R10 this morning in Jarrettsville, MD. However, no slices yet on my Philips 7000R where the upgrade is needed more... Can the slices be forced to download or is there somewhere I can download them from and ftp them to the DVR?


----------



## Brainiac427

Someone on dbstalk.com reported a spontaneous reboot on 6.3f. Doesn't sound promising.


----------



## rbtravis

Brainiac427 said:


> Someone on dbstalk.com reported a spontaneous reboot on 6.3f. Doesn't sound promising.


It was reported on a 10-250, You reported in the wrong forum, that is how rumors get started.:down:He said possible hard disk problems.


----------



## robpickles

Brainiac427 said:


> Someone on dbstalk.com reported a spontaneous reboot on 6.3f. Doesn't sound promising.


None so far for me.

Rob


----------



## Rhughes

My R10 picked up the f yesterday. DSR708 still waiting.

Dewey Arizona


----------



## balboa dave

Just got it here in So Cal on one my R10s a few minutes ago, the one in the living room. With 6.3e, I never had a reboot problem, but the remote control response was flaky and the To Do list was a real ***** to navigate and edit. So far, the remote control response seems to be fixed. When entering the To Do list, something happened, since it took a minute or so to first load up. It is better, but not 100% fixed. Sometimes deleting a program a day or two ahead returns you to the beginning of list, not the place in the list where it was, as it used to work before 6.3e. Simple paging up and down still has weird delays, but not as bad as before. Better, not perfect.

I forced a call on the R10 in the bedroom, but no 6.3f is available for that one yet. It reboots daily, but I only watch it for maybe an hour at the time, so it hasn't been a big problem for me. I guess I'll just have to wait to see if that gets fixed.


----------



## ssorrell

Shoot. Just my luck. I've been complaining about the reboot problem since August and now when everyone starts to get the update and activation of 6.3f, my 50" plasma is on the fritz and I can't check it out. Repairman should be home today to fix it.

Question...last Friday morning is when my TV blew. Saturday morning the light on the front of the DTV unit was flickering, which worried me. I couldn't turn on the TV to see what was going on. Is this possibly a sign that it was pending a restart, or can anyone tell me why that light (the one that usually lights up yellow when a phone call is being made) was flickering between yellow and green?


----------



## Brainiac427

rbtravis said:


> It was reported on a 10-250, You reported in the wrong forum, that is how rumors get started.:down:He said possible hard disk problems.


There was nothing in that message over there that stated that it was a 10-250 or a hard disc problem.


----------



## Rainy Dave

Brainiac427 said:


> There was nothing in that message over there that stated that it was a 10-250 or a hard disc problem.


I was poking around over there in the "DirecTV powered by Tivo DVR Support Q&A" section. I don't see any non HR10-250 threads where they mention random reboots on 6.3f. Can you post a link?


----------



## Brainiac427

Rainy Dave said:


> I was poking around over there in the "DirecTV™ powered by Tivo DVR Support Q&A" section. I don't see any non HR10-250 threads where they mention random reboots on 6.3f. Can you post a link?


http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=1445953#post1445953

The thread says "HR10-250 update"; however, the thread appears to be a generic one, not specific to the HR10. At least that's how it appears. The poster with the reboot doesn't say what his box is. I do hope it's a hard drive issue, not a software issue.


----------



## markbox

Hooked up an older 40Gig drive that had 6.2a installed last 
Friday. Forced a few calls hoping to get 6.3f. Unfortunately
I ended up with 6.3e. sigh... Location is N. California.
Perhaps I have to wait a bit for the 6.3f slices to appear.
I wasn't about to risk my 500Gig drive running 6.2a with no 
software related problems on an unproven software update.


----------



## WillieWildcat

Brainiac427 said:


> Someone on dbstalk.com reported a spontaneous reboot on 6.3f. Doesn't sound promising.


Just happened yesterday on my 6.3f R10 (bedroom). The other R10 still has 6.3e. SSDD!


----------



## gibverse

WillieWildcat said:


> Just happened yesterday on my 6.3f R10 (bedroom).


My DVR40 with 6.3f just rebooted on its own as well. I guess I need to watch everything so I can go back to 6.2


----------



## dcstager

If at all possible stay with or re-image to 6.2a. There does not seem to be any practical benefit to 6.3f and the removal of MRV is reason enough to avoid 6.3f. And I think all you people getting frequent re-boots need a new hard drive. Re-imaging to 6.2a with the zipper and a new drive is going to solve everything for you. I didn't realize how much I used MRV until it was unavailable. I don't want to download things from the Tivo and burn DVDs. I've got enough box sets gathering dust. I want to upload .avi files from the Internet and watch them on the Tivo and you need the MRV to do that.


----------



## llurgy

dcstager said:


> If at all possible stay with or re-image to 6.2a. There does not seem to be any practical benefit to 6.3f and the removal of MRV is reason enough to avoid 6.3f. And I think all you people getting frequent re-boots need a new hard drive. Re-imaging to 6.2a with the zipper and a new drive is going to solve everything for you. I didn't realize how much I used MRV until it was unavailable. I don't want to download things from the Tivo and burn DVDs. I've got enough box sets gathering dust. I want to upload .avi files from the Internet and watch them on the Tivo and you need the MRV to do that.


I am sorry but except for your first sentence your post is of no relevence what-so-ever in this thread.
Mandy


----------



## ssorrell

Okay...weird...

I reported yesterday that my TV had gone out recently, and I have been awaiting service on it. I was curious whether I had received the 6.3f download yet since I couldn't pull up a picture on the TV.

Yesterday I took a small TV home from work to get my through until the 50 incher is repaired. I plugged everything back in and the DTivo unit was in a constant reboot loop. I would get the "Welcome" screen, followed by the "Almost there" screen, then the green "A Serious Error has Occurred" screen. After about 2 minutes, it would start all over again. 

I called DTV and they quickly without question ordered a replacement DirecTivo unit for me...no charge. My unit was purchased at a store more than a couple years ago, yet they are sending me another one free of charge, and they are waiving the shipping charge of $19.95. I was also told that after I receive the other unit, that when I call the Card Activation Dept to make sure that it is activated as an owned unit instead of a leased one. 

Why would DTV offer to send me a free replacement for a unit that I purchased years ago at a local store? Is it possible that I did indeed get 6.3f and the software caused a malfunction and they are trying to avoid lawsuits?
I know...just speculation here, but I can't for the life of me figure out why they were so eager to send me a free unit.

anyone have any clue?


----------



## CrashHD

gibverse said:


> My DVR40 with 6.3f just rebooted on its own as well. I guess I need to watch everything so I can go back to 6.2


I've been testing rolling a unit back to 6.2a. I've run into troubles doing it with manual methods, but I've been successful using the slicer.

I updated my 6.2a test box to 6.3f back in early January. I ran it for several weeks, put 7 season passes on it, and let it fill the drive (40GB) several times.

I then made a backup copy of the 6.3f disk (so I can test other manual methods of 6.2a rollback). Today, I dbloaded the 6.2a slices, and installed them with the slicer. Upon rebooting, the unit ran guided setup as though it was new, not like when you rerun GS, but like the first time, including unit activation instructions, etc. Once all that was complete, it proceeded to function normally. I still need to test things like mrv, but I'll have to re-superpatch first, and I'm out of time this morning (damn jobs....).


----------



## Budget_HT

ssorrell said:


> Okay...weird...
> 
> I reported yesterday that my TV had gone out recently, and I have been awaiting service on it. I was curious whether I had received the 6.3f download yet since I couldn't pull up a picture on the TV.
> 
> Yesterday I took a small TV home from work to get my through until the 50 incher is repaired. I plugged everything back in and the DTivo unit was in a constant reboot loop. I would get the "Welcome" screen, followed by the "Almost there" screen, then the green "A Serious Error has Occurred" screen. After about 2 minutes, it would start all over again.
> 
> I called DTV and they quickly without question ordered a replacement DirecTivo unit for me...no charge. My unit was purchased at a store more than a couple years ago, yet they are sending me another one free of charge, and they are waiving the shipping charge of $19.95. I was also told that after I receive the other unit, that when I call the Card Activation Dept to make sure that it is activated as an owned unit instead of a leased one.
> 
> Why would DTV offer to send me a free replacement for a unit that I purchased years ago at a local store? Is it possible that I did indeed get 6.3f and the software caused a malfunction and they are trying to avoid lawsuits?
> I know...just speculation here, but I can't for the life of me figure out why they were so eager to send me a free unit.
> 
> anyone have any clue?


Your free "replacement DirecTiVo" will likely not be a TiVo at all, but rather a DirecTV R15 non-TiVo DVR. That is what happened to me, and many others who have reported so here.

I hope you are more satisfied than we are with the non-Tivo unit.


----------



## ssorrell

Budget_HT said:


> Your free "replacement DirecTiVo" will likely not be a TiVo at all, but rather a DirecTV R15 non-TiVo DVR. That is what happened to me, and many others who have reported so here.
> 
> I hope you are more satisfied than we are with the non-Tivo unit.


I specifically asked and was told it was indeed a Tivo powered unit, a refurb. He said they had a few around there.

Of course, the guy could be lying. 

I'll find out in a couple of days...


----------



## jacket88

ssorrell said:


> Why would DTV offer to send me a free replacement for a unit that I purchased years ago at a local store? Is it possible that I did indeed get 6.3f and the software caused a malfunction and they are trying to avoid lawsuits?
> I know...just speculation here, but I can't for the life of me figure out why they were so eager to send me a free unit.
> 
> anyone have any clue?


Yes, that is the only logical explanation. If I were you, I would see a lawyer and pursue a lawsuit to protect your rights. BTW, I have been running 6.3f for the past 3 days or so with no issues.


----------



## Rhughes

I have experienced a strange happening with both of my Series 2 DirecTivo's. One an R10, and the other a DSR708. With 6.3e they were both giving me fits for months. Pixelization, blank screens, frozen video with the audio still running, smeared colors, etc. The only thing I was not getting was the random reboots.

Then a couple of weeks ago, with both still at 6.3e, the problems just stopped. It was unbelievable. Even the R10, which had programs recorded from last year, and always played tricks at least once during playback of a show, ran them with no problems. Is it possible that there was something besides 6.3e causing all this grief? The R10 is now at 6.3f and the DSR708 is still at 6.3e, but nothing has changed good or bad. I'm happy everything is back to normal, but based on all the discussion in this thread, it is a complete mystery.


----------



## ssorrell

jacket88 said:


> Yes, that is the only logical explanation. If I were you, I would see a lawyer and pursue a lawsuit to protect your rights. BTW, I have been running 6.3f for the past 3 days or so with no issues.


I can't tell...are you serious? Or sarcastic?


----------



## Pascal

R10 running 6.3e just outside of Chicago. After stumbling across this thread, I checked my system information and it hadn't made a call in a while, so I forced one. Came back pending reboot, so I told it to do so.

10 minutes later I get "The Recorder was not able to find information for all channels...". I hit "Try Again to Acquire Information" but it just dumps me to the main menu. No program guide data, but it had upgraded to 6.3f.

Couple minutes later it had data; it just likes to scare me.

Edit:
Ok, now this is really weird, none of my channels work. Says it is searching for signal on both inputs. Tried rebooting again, same thing as above. It was recording a program just fine right until I told it to reboot the first time, so I doubt it is a physical problem. Signal strength is 85-100 on all transponders but 4, 12, and 20. Are these three unused? Any way to downgrade to software that works?

-Pascal


----------



## CrashHD

Pascal said:


> Any way to downgrade to software that works?
> 
> -Pascal


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5972472#post5972472

It does require the unit be hacked, which may be a problem for your R10. The only other method I know is to re-image.


----------



## Brainiac427

CrashHD said:


> I've been testing rolling a unit back to 6.2a. I've run into troubles doing it with manual methods, but I've been successful using the slicer.


What is a slicer?


----------



## rbtravis

Brainiac427 said:


> What is a slicer?


It is a DVRupgrade product for hacked machines.


----------



## Pascal

CrashHD said:


> Pascal said:
> 
> 
> 
> Any way to downgrade to software that works?
> 
> -Pascal
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5972472#post5972472
> 
> It does require the unit be hacked, which may be a problem for your R10. The only other method I know is to re-image.
Click to expand...

Shouldn't it be as simple as swapping the active partitions? 4 vs 7? Been too long since I really played with these things though, don't recall how to do so. Anyone have a link to a good walkthrough?

It'd be really nice if there was some key combination I could hit during startup to tell the Tivo to switch the active flags for me.

-Pascal


----------



## CrashHD

It should be that simple, but I've tried it twice, and gotten reboot loops.


----------



## dcstager

llurgy said:


> I am sorry but except for your first sentence your post is of no relevence what-so-ever in this thread.
> Mandy


You missed the part in earlier messages where I detailed adopting and using 6.3f very early in the game when CrashHD posted a patch for it. I know it's important to make these kinds of proclamations here because so many people make them, but in this case you just didn't get the context or the point.

I've used the new software and evaluated its functions completely and can say with some authority that 6.3f offers no practical benefit.

Thank you for your relevance policing efforts -- there are many threads here needing your attention so get to work.


----------



## john-duncan-yoyo

6.3f loaded on one of the two sd40s in my living room. Yippee.


----------



## poppagene

dcstager said:


> Thank you for your relevance policing efforts -- there are many threads here needing your attention so get to work.


+1


----------



## balboa dave

dcstager said:


> You missed the part in earlier messages where I detailed adopting and using 6.3f very early in the game when CrashHD posted a patch for it. I know it's important to make these kinds of proclamations here because so many people make them, but in this case you just didn't get the context or the point.
> 
> I've used the new software and evaluated its functions completely and can say with some authority that 6.3f offers no practical benefit.
> 
> Thank you for your relevance policing efforts -- there are many threads here needing your attention so get to work.





poppagene said:


> +1


You guys have your head so far up your hardware that you can't even realize that 6.3f does address the problems it's designed to fix, and the majority of users don't care about the geekified hack world you live in.


----------



## dcstager

balboa dave said:


> You guys have your head so far up your hardware that you can't even realize that 6.3f does address the problems it's designed to fix, and the majority of users don't care about the geekified hack world you live in.


Let's get relevant here Dave. Did 6.3f install on your machine and fix the reboot problem? I personally feel that the problems people have are related to failing hardware and you're going to have to be somewhat of a geek to replace the drive. Tivo won't do it. Directv won't do it. Only you can do it.

So the problems here require some technical knowledge. If you want to glorify being Forrest Gump, that's fine. Aren't you a geek then reading about obscure software revisions of an obsolete bit of hardware?

The fixes would not even have been created without people on this forum experiencing them and reporting them and talking about them. Directv is perfectly willing to replace your old Tivo with one of their machines. But the point here is that people want to keep the old hardware and for it to work properly.

This is a geeky thread. I mean it started by a guy who was able to patch the original tivo application to enable deactivated features. It hardly gets much geekier than that. The Tivo manual is as non-geeky as there is and using the machine is simple enough for Bubba, let alone Forrest Gump. But the solutions to your problem isn't in the official manual.

Don't be insulting geeks. Make your own relevant comment and be positive here -- or at least try and be funny. I always find the effort of people to censor and properly categorize posts absurd. The whole board is easily searched.

This is a great forum so be nice.


----------



## Rainy Dave

My DVR40 picked up 6.3f sometime yesterday.


----------



## CrashHD

balboa dave said:


> You guys have your head so far up your hardware


I'm a geek. That's where I like to keep my head. It's a nice place to be. What's your point?



balboa dave said:


> and the majority of users don't care about the geekified hack world you live in.


Those would be the joe sixpacks that don't know a tivo from a cableco,dish,or DirecTV dvr. You're right. They don't care. They are not reading here. The ones reading here are those of us that do want to discuss whether the next software version is better than the last one.

If it's too "geeky" for you, put your helmet back on. Your short bus is waiting.

sorry. i should refrain from posting while having a bad day. i was out of line.


----------



## mrbonzo

Got 6.3f this morning on my R10 in Orlando, FL.


----------



## dtremain

CrashHD said:


> If it's too "geeky" for you, put your helmet back on. Your short bus is waiting.


God, was that ever unnecessary. How about we don't attack anyone?


----------



## mhn2

Got 6.3f on my HR10-250 on Sunday in DFW. No luck so far on my R10 or DSR7000. Naturally, my HR10-250 was the one box that wasn't rebooting, so I can't confirm whether or not 6.3f fixes the problem.


----------



## bengalfreak

ssorrell said:


> I specifically asked and was told it was indeed a Tivo powered unit, a refurb. He said they had a few around there.
> 
> Of course, the guy could be lying.
> 
> I'll find out in a couple of days...


I'll bet $50 its not a DirecTivo. I have read no postings whatsoever, in the last 6 months of anyone successfully acquiring a tivo from DirecTV.


----------



## bengalfreak

dtremain said:


> God, was that ever unnecessary. How about we don't attack anyone?


I believe that was a counter attack.


----------



## Rhughes

I finally bit the bullet and forced a call on my DSR708 which was at 6.2. It has been disconnected from the phone line since I put it into service a few months ago. The download seemed to go OK, but wondering about the content. The download only took 2 or 3 minutes. I thought a major software change would take much longer over a dial-up phone line connection. Was that long enough, or will I need to let it do it again? I didn't force a restart. I was just going to let it do its thing tonight. I guess I will know tomorrow what actually happened.


----------



## CrashHD

my apologies to balboa dave. 

I was having a bad day already, and when his post rubbed me the wrong way, I unloaded. Sorry, I was out of line.


----------



## stevel

Rhughes said:


> The download only took 2 or 3 minutes. I thought a major software change would take much longer over a dial-up phone line connection.


If your receiver has been connected to the satellite dish, it got the software over the satellite. The phone call provides only the "trigger" to do the install, otherwise the software just sits on your box waiting for the ok.


----------



## Rhughes

stevel said:


> If your receiver has been connected to the satellite dish, it got the software over the satellite. The phone call provides only the "trigger" to do the install, otherwise the software just sits on your box waiting for the ok.


Thanks Steve. It will be interesting to see what it comes up with. My other DSR708 is still waiting for 6.3f. My R10 already has it.


----------



## dtremain

bengalfreak said:


> I believe that was a counter attack.


Maybe I'm missing something, but short buses and helmets would tend to indicate disabled children. I'm nor clear on how they drew anyone's wrath here.


----------



## balboa dave

dcstager said:


> Let's get relevant here Dave. Did 6.3f install on your machine and fix the reboot problem? I personally feel that the problems people have are related to failing hardware and you're going to have to be somewhat of a geek to replace the drive. Tivo won't do it. Directv won't do it. Only you can do it.
> 
> So the problems here require some technical knowledge. If you want to glorify being Forrest Gump, that's fine. Aren't you a geek then reading about obscure software revisions of an obsolete bit of hardware?
> 
> The fixes would not even have been created without people on this forum experiencing them and reporting them and talking about them. Directv is perfectly willing to replace your old Tivo with one of their machines. But the point here is that people want to keep the old hardware and for it to work properly.
> 
> This is a geeky thread. I mean it started by a guy who was able to patch the original tivo application to enable deactivated features. It hardly gets much geekier than that. The Tivo manual is as non-geeky as there is and using the machine is simple enough for Bubba, let alone Forrest Gump. But the solutions to your problem isn't in the official manual.
> 
> Don't be insulting geeks. Make your own relevant comment and be positive here -- or at least try and be funny. I always find the effort of people to censor and properly categorize posts absurd. The whole board is easily searched.
> 
> This is a great forum so be nice.


What's relevant is your snide remarks to llurgy proves your contributions are being made to the wrong forum. You need to reread my post with the knowledge that 1, you're talking about hacked DirecTiVos, which is specifically discouraged in this forum, and 2, your post belongs in the underground forums, where the other hacked machine geeks gather and find relevance in what you're writing about. You should reread my post in context, and you'll see it was cleverly phrased like an insult, but wasn't.

I already posted my experience with 6.3f, but maybe it wasn't technical enough to get your interest. I only got it on me second (unhacked!) box this morning, so it's a little early to know if the reboots stop.



CrashHD said:


> I'm a geek. That's where I like to keep my head. It's a nice place to be. What's your point?]
> 
> Those would be the joe sixpacks that don't know a tivo from a cableco,dish,or DirecTV dvr. You're right. They don't care. They are not reading here. The ones reading here are those of us that do want to discuss whether the next software version is better than the last one.
> 
> If it's too "geeky" for you, put your helmet back on. Your short bus is waiting.


For the record, I make the reference designs manufacturers of set top boxes and high end A/V equipment are using for their next generation of hardware (hint: it's all about HDMI 1.3), so I deal with, and I guess by default am a member of, geekdom. I have hardware knowledge that would drive hackers into ecstasy, but won't, since that would be unprofessional (meaning I would lose my customers).


> sorry. i should refrain from posting while having a bad day. i was out of line.


Yes you should, and you were.


CrashHD said:


> my apologies to balboa dave.
> 
> I was having a bad day already, and when his post rubbed me the wrong way, I unloaded. Sorry, I was out of line.


I accept your apology, but maybe you should be paying more attention to your real life, and not wasting time on your toys, if a simple misunderstanding sends you off on a rant of personal insults.


----------



## dcstager

Balboa Dave I guess you'll just have to settle for the Directv DVR then. I have responses that would drive veteran flamers into ecstasy, but won't, since that would violate forum rules.

Please discuss HDMI 1.3 in the appropriate thread because we want to keep this topic on point. Likewise, all ravings about your superior knowledge, intellect, abilities and talents -- anything self-aggrandizing should be listed on your facebook page. Telling us about your locked closet of knowledge is pretty lame. Impress us with technical knowledge instead and maybe do something about how much HDMI cables cost. The DirectTivo doesn't even have an HDMI output. It's standard definition. Jeezz!


----------



## zone 5

ssorrell said:


> I specifically asked and was told it was indeed a Tivo powered unit, a refurb. He said they had a few around there.
> 
> Of course, the guy could be lying.
> 
> I'll find out in a couple of days...


Good luck. I was told the same thing multiple times. It NEVER happens. I always got the piece of garbage DTV R15. The only way you are going to get TiVo is through Ebay of other online places. DTV has none.


----------



## zone 5

ssorrell said:


> I was also told that after I receive the other unit, that when I call the Card Activation Dept to make sure that it is activated as an owned unit instead of a leased one.
> 
> Why would DTV offer to send me a free replacement for a unit that I purchased years ago at a local store?
> I know...just speculation here, but I can't for the life of me figure out why they were so eager to send me a free unit.


The 1st replacement unit R15 that Dtv sent me, they charged me the shipping. They have sent me several more since at no charge. They don't even suggest that I have to pay, they just send them out. They WANT us to not have TiVo, and they are willing to give us their stuff for free because of that.


----------



## rpiotro

I have had 6.3f on my DVR40 and HR10-250 since the fourth of this month. I finally got it on my R10 last night. The remote control response is back to normal. Why is it that the machine that needs it the most is the last to get it. I hope that this fixes it. The odd thing is that the R10 has been behaving for the last two weeks. Previously, it would occasionally lockup and or reboot. Not to the extent reported by other members here but it has missed a show or two. Go figure.

My DVR40 is in the kitchen in single tuner mode and does not record anything. I use it strictly as a receiver with trick play features. It has never had a problem with 6.3e.

My HR10, when on 6.3e, would suffer the occasional lockup and reboot only when switching to an OTA channel. Ten days is not conclusive but it has been OK so far!


----------



## STUNTx2

I have been having the same problems as before since it "upgraded" to 6.3f. My system installed 6.3f in the middle of a lock up/reboot episode a few days ago and has been continuing to lock up or reboot on a daily basis. When it reboots, or I restart after a lock up both tuners are on the same chanel (291) if I don't beat the clock and get the channels changed in a timely manner it reboots, if not, well lucky me I get to try again. I have removed this channel from my guide and canceled the season passes on it in an effort to avoid the only common factor in the reboots. Remote response is still amazingly slow. Any chance that since it instaleed in the middle of a glitch that I might not have gotten a good install? Is there anyway to reinstall, or am I stuck with what I got untill the next new version is released? As it stands, 6.3f is not realy a fix in my opinion.


----------



## Jumi

Northern Ohio - got 6.3f last night with its restart - so far, so good.


----------



## ukerin

I have a DSR-708 Phillips.And I got the new software last night .What is this new software version supposed to do?because and this may be stupid but I did not notice anything different like new folders or anything like that .I thought that sometime in 08 new things like recently deleted programs folder was to be added.Do I turn off the Tivo and turn it back on to activate the new sofware?BTW mine was working fine before the new software download and it still is.


----------



## llurgy

dcstager said:


> You missed the part in earlier messages where I detailed adopting and using 6.3f very early in the game when CrashHD posted a patch for it. I know it's important to make these kinds of proclamations here because so many people make them, but in this case you just didn't get the context or the point.
> 
> I've used the new software and evaluated its functions completely and can say with some authority that 6.3f offers no practical benefit.
> 
> Thank you for your relevance policing efforts -- there are many threads here needing your attention so get to work.


There is no need to be sarcastic.

This thread actually started and was carried on initially by people hoping that 6.3f was going to stop all the reboots. Whether or not it works is the only thing of consequence here and people whom want to talk about hacking should point people in the direction of the underground forum.
I am not a geek, neither am I totally clueless. I have a hard drive in my Directivo which has been in there since long before easy cake or whatever it is came out, I chose for my own reasons not to hack my directivo, but it isnt because I am unable to.
I have an hacked xBox/iPhone touch and DS.

This thread is entitled *6.3f is here* and so your post truly has no relevance.

Mandy


----------



## Pascal

STUNTx2 said:


> I have been having the same problems as before since it "upgraded" to 6.3f. My system installed 6.3f in the middle of a lock up/reboot episode a few days ago and has been continuing to lock up or reboot on a daily basis. When it reboots, or I restart after a lock up both tuners are on the same chanel (291) if I don't beat the clock and get the channels changed in a timely manner it reboots, if not, well lucky me I get to try again. I have removed this channel from my guide and canceled the season passes on it in an effort to avoid the only common factor in the reboots. Remote response is still amazingly slow. Any chance that since it instaleed in the middle of a glitch that I might not have gotten a good install? Is there anyway to reinstall, or am I stuck with what I got untill the next new version is released? As it stands, 6.3f is not realy a fix in my opinion.


A kickstart 52 will overwrite your old copy of 6.3e with another copy of 6.3f and then boot off it.

-Pascal


----------



## jboote

llurgy said:


> There is no need to be sarcastic.
> 
> This thread is entitled *6.3f is here* and so your post truly has no relevance.
> 
> Mandy


While there is no need to be sarcastic, there is also no need to be so pedantic about what does/does not belong in the thread. I had the reboot problems on my R10, and therefore downgraded the version (by replacing the entire harddrive).

I specifically watch this thread as a way to determine when/if I should plug my R10 back into the phone line.

The fact that the new version seemingly provides no additional wanted features other than to limit the bugs that were introduced in 6.3e is very relevant to making that decision.

jeff


----------



## dcstager

I think the best course of action for people with 6.2a is to wait for the next DirecTV software release where they enable remote scheduling. People with 6.3e should take the upgrade to 6.3f if they are getting random reboots and they are certain it's not a hard drive failure. If you are not getting reboots and everything is going fine with 6.2a, there is no practical benefit to 6.3f. The 6.2a code is pretty solid based on the experiences of most users.

Right now it's a "if it's not broke don't fix it" situation so use your best judgment. If people out there have unmodified boxes then there is no reason to avoid 6.3f -- just keep the phone line installed as usual and let the machine update itself or not. There is no problem with 6.3f. But if your Tivo is hacked, you've got to stick with 6.2a and enjoy.

That summary should be the end of this thread. The relevance police can stand down.


----------



## STUNTx2

Pascal said:


> A kickstart 52 will overwrite your old copy of 6.3e with another copy of 6.3f and then boot off it.
> 
> -Pascal


Thanks for the tip. Now how exactly do I do I kickstart 52. I've got a Philips DSR704 by the way.


----------



## Brainiac427

STUNTx2 said:


> Thanks for the tip. Now how exactly do I do I kickstart 52. I've got a Philips DSR704 by the way.


When the machine is booting up, there will be a few-second window when the green light flickers yellow. During that window, press Pause-5-2, and the new software will be installed on the alternate partition.


----------



## Ingavar

Now we wait to see if this fixed the problems of re-booting.

Portland, Oregon


----------



## Syzygy

My HR10 got updated on the 8th of February. (My SD TiVo was also updated to 6.3f, a few days later.)

But on the 13th the HR10 hung and had to be rebooted by pulling its plug. I was in the process of deleting a show (American Idol results) that had just played to the end -- an unusual occurrence, since most shows don't run over. The screen went green but didn't get populated with any text. I waited a couple of minutes, trying several buttons on the remote and all of the ones on the front of the box, before pulling the plug.

Obviously there are still bugs.


----------



## snickerrrrs

My R10 and DVR40 are now 6.3f no noticeable changes, but I wasn't having reboot problems.


----------



## litzdog911

ukerin said:


> I have a DSR-708 Phillips.And I got the new software last night .What is this new software version supposed to do?because and this may be stupid but I did not notice anything different like new folders or anything like that .I thought that sometime in 08 new things like recently deleted programs folder was to be added.Do I turn off the Tivo and turn it back on to activate the new sofware?BTW mine was working fine before the new software download and it still is.


6.3f just addresses the random reboot problem that's plagued some of the DirecTivos. Mid-year we're expecting another update with new features, like Remote Scheduling.


----------



## ukerin

snickerrrrs said:


> My R10 and DVR40 are now 6.3f no noticeable changes, but I wasn't having reboot problems.


Same here what kind of changes should there have been.I thought there was new additions orsomething coming in 08?


----------



## rock_doctor

6.3f is only a bug fix. You should not see any changes other then (hopefully) your TiVo is no longer rebooting.


----------



## ssorrell

zone 5 said:


> Good luck. I was told the same thing multiple times. It NEVER happens. I always got the piece of garbage DTV R15. The only way you are going to get TiVo is through Ebay of other online places. DTV has none.


Of course you guys are right...I figured I wouldn't get a DTivo. In fact, not only did I get the DTV unit, I got two...one sent to my service address and one sent to my billing address.

My other DTivo in the house isn't rebooting as much as the one that just died. In fact, I haven't seen a reboot on it in over a week. It's unplugged from the phone line and after losing one DTivo during the 6.3f rollout, I'm afraid to plug it in. It's still on 6.3e.

I know this has been answered before, but dang there's a lot of threads here...what happens if I don't plug it into the phone jack?


----------



## Budget_HT

Budget_HT said:


> Your free "replacement DirecTiVo" will likely not be a TiVo at all, but rather a DirecTV R15 non-TiVo DVR. That is what happened to me, and many others who have reported so here.
> 
> I hope you are more satisfied than we are with the non-Tivo unit.





ssorrell said:


> Of course you guys are right...


I would say, unfortunately we are right (based on prior experiences).

I am about ready to purchase a HDD so I can repair my failed series 2 DirecTiVo so I don't have to put up with the R15.


----------



## CrashHD

ssorrell said:


> I know this has been answered before, but dang there's a lot of threads here...what happens if I don't plug it into the phone jack?


It doesn't make phone calls. An activated, unhacked unit, will continue to function normally, with the following exceptions:

1) The initial phone call to activate the unit must have already been made.
2) After about 14 days, you will get a once daily message, "The recorder has been unable to make a daily call for xxxx days". It's an annoyace, but it goes away in 3-4 seconds, and is a once daily occurrance.
3) The unit will not report PPV ordered via remote to DTV. If you order PPV without the phone hooked up, I don't know what happens, but on the off chance that it is not good, I order all my PPV via www.


----------



## Varmus

I now have 6.3f on my two machines. Both have rebooted several times since the upgrade, and one has frozen. So far, the problems are worse than ever.


----------



## Rhughes

Varmus said:


> I now have 6.3f on my two machines. Both have rebooted several times since the upgrade, and one has frozen. So far, the problems are worse than ever.


I really have a hard time understanding what is going on with these software problems. There seem to be three groups of users. One group has random reboots. One group, like me, never has a reboot, but has/had the pixelization, freezing, black and white and other annoying problems. The last group has both kinds of problems.

I have three Series 2 DirecTivo's. Two DSR708's, and one R10. All have been upgraded by me with larger hard drives. One of the DSR708's was at version 6.2 (not 6.2a) and I left it unconnected from the phone line. The other two Tivo's stayed connected. All three run off the same dish and multiswitch.

As soon as 6.3e was downloaded, both of the Tivo's on the phone line started having horrible pixelization problems, etc. There was no doubt in my mind that 6.3e was the culprit. The DSR708 at 6.2 ran with no problems.

Then along comes 6.3f, but I am still at 6.3e. A few weeks ago, all my pixelization problems, etc. completely stopped. Both Tivo's are operating perfectly. This was obviously not related to the 6.3e problem, but something else going on. I have to conclude that D** fixed the problems on their end without a software change.

Now, I have 6.3f on one of the 6.3e Tivo's and the 6.2 Tivo. Nothing has changed. Both still work perfectly. I tried to force a call on the remaining 6.3e Tivo this morning, but it still isn't picking up 6.3f. It's not a concern right now because it works perfectly on 6.3e. As I said earlier, I have never had the random reboots on any of my Tivo's.

So the mystery continues. Why do some folks get random reboots and other do not? Why does 6.3f seem to help some and makes no difference to others? I'm happy that I don't have any problems, but I sure don't understand why others do, unless they are hardware problems and not software problems.


----------



## IminMs

I am running 6.2a on three tivos and I noticed about 2 weeks ago, when they reboot, they have to reacquire the sat data twice. Usually it loads the first time. D* must have changed something in the guide data or something.


----------



## bbristow

I have a Hughes SD-DVR80 and things are worse now that 6.3f has come to town! It rebooted no less than 4 times last night within a few hours' time. Now, a new problem of "Searching for Satellite 1" has cropped up! It lasts for a few seconds to a few minutes, then it will come back. If I didn't have all these programs on the HD, I'd get Instant Cake to put 6.2a back on the thing.

Is anyone else having problems with rebooting and searching with 6.3f?


----------



## adamm

rock_doctor said:


> 6.3f is only a bug fix. You should not see any changes other then (hopefully) your TiVo is no longer rebooting.


Yea right... I just got 6.3f installed two hours ago. Here I am two hours later and my tivo is in the middle of rebooting on me again when I'm going from a recorded show back to the now playing list. And this is WITH 6.3f

I'm holding on to my tivo for dear life though... I really don't want to go to a DirecTV DVR.

I was really hoping that 6.3f would fix the pixelation and reboots.

EDIT: I have a DSR7000 that I purchased brand new around 2k3.


----------



## ukerin

Ok dumb question time what is pixelization and rebooting problem mean.Do they occur with just one channel or all of them?


----------



## codespy

OK, all my SD and HD TiVo's at 'F' effective 2-15-08. I have activated the clock on each unit. That will tell me if I have had a reboot or not when I am not watching.

Holding by breath.


----------



## rock_doctor

adamm said:


> Yea right...


Hang in there. I found I needed two more reboots after install to make "f" work ok. I still have the pixelation but no reboots. That may be all we get.... If you are still rebooting then you may need more work to be done on the unit. Maybe try to have it installed onto another part of the drive. This was discussed earlier in the thread.


----------



## gibverse

rock_doctor said:


> Hang in there. I found I needed two more reboots after install to make "f" work ok.


Rock Doc: Do you mean you had to manually reboot two more times, or let it reboot on its own? Since mine upgraded to 6.3f, I've noticed that it reboots much less than 6.3e did, however it has rebooted on its own twice (both times overnight). If that's all it takes to clear things up, I'll be very relieved.

Another note on 6.3f, I've noticed that it trying to phone home even though it isn't scheduled to connect to the DVR service again till early next week and I haven't done any PPV. I'm going to keep the phone line plugged in to see if maybe that helps, but I'm curious if anyone has an idea why or where it is calling.


----------



## fadein34

Got 6.3f a few days back BUT two or three units are still randomly rebooting... not as often though. Regardless it's a bunch of BS!

In fact both of them are rebooting right now! At the same time???

Hello Dish. Goodbye DirecTV and TiVo??? Pains me to think about it.


----------



## Brainiac427

Got 6.3f last night. We'll see what happens.


----------



## dcstager

To CrashHD -- which is the latest/correct kernel that will work with 6.3f in the slice package? I recall that the kernel for 6.2a had difficulty with network functions and DHCP. Can I use a newer kernel with 6.2a?


----------



## CrashHD

Unless your running a monte, your kernel choices are limited to two, and AFAIK, both 2.4.20 killhdinitrd kernels work with 6.3f. I think I used the one from Tivo v.3.1.5, but if you want DHCP to work, I believe that can be accomplished with the killhdinitrd kernel from 7.2.0 

I did most of my 6.3f testing on an R10 with a prom mod, so I could use any kernel I wanted with it. I tested with the one that comes with the zipper cd, and a custom compiled one. I never tried DHCP with 6.3f. If you apply the superpatch for 6.3f, you can manually specifiy network info in the phone/network setup screen, so setting network stuff manually isn't nearly the nuisance it used to be. IIRC, I tried to use DHCP with 6.2 a long time ago, and I think it worked with the 7.2.0 kernel, but not the 3.1.5 one. 6.3f probably works the same.


----------



## dtremain

Rhughes said:


> A few weeks ago, all my pixelization problems, etc. completely stopped. Both Tivo's are operating perfectly. This was obviously not related to the 6.3e problem, but something else going on. I have to conclude that D** fixed the problems on their end without a software change.


Same thing with me. It's led me to the same assumption.

I believe that there are a multiplicity of issues going on here that only appear to be the same thing. They may have all been triggered with 6.3e but they are not all the same.

I had the pixelation while playing back certain shows, all on local OTA channels. Never on anything on a national "cable" channel.

I only had re-booting once every couple of weeks, not the constant re-booting deescribed by others.

And, it all went away a few weeks ago and everything has been fine.

By the way, unlike others here, my units are completely unhacked and unmodified.


----------



## robpickles

Two weeks strong with my R10 and 6.3f. No reboots or any other problems at all.

Rob


----------



## Duffycoug

I have two units that are still running 6.3e (HDVR2 & SDDVR80)....when should I expect the update to 6.3f if ever? Both machines are hooked up with phone lines and make the calls regularly without a problem if that matters.

** Nevermind, I just forced a call with both machines and they updated to 6.3f.....looking forward to no more reboots...gonna have to dust off my old SDDVR40 that DTV Cust. Serv. Rep. told me was shot, since now we know better.


----------



## SLOmike

I checked this weekend and I have 6.3f on my RCA DVR40 (120 hrs).

No problems before or after the upgrade.

-Mike


----------



## Duffycoug

SLOmike said:


> I checked this weekend and I have 6.3f on my RCA DVR40 (120 hrs).
> 
> No problems before or after the upgrade.
> 
> -Mike


Consider yourself VERY lucky...you are the one in a hundred that was not decimated with 6.3e....and trust me, 1 in a hundred might be understating it.


----------



## Pauli

Duffycoug said:


> Consider yourself VERY lucky...you are the one in a hundred that was not decimated with 6.3e....and trust me, 1 in a hundred might be understating it.


I also have never experienced any problems with 6.3e on either my R10 or Philips S2. I think that most people that don't have any problems have nothing to post about. 1 in 100 is probably WAY _overstating_ it.


----------



## Rainy Dave

I guess I'm a lucky one too. I had maybe 1 or 2 reboots during the 6.3e era between my DVR40 and R10.


----------



## Rhughes

Rainy Dave said:


> I guess I'm a lucky one too. I had maybe 1 or 2 reboots during the 6.3e era between my DVR40 and R10.


I have had no reboots on either of my 6.3e TiVo's. One of them is now 6.3f, but nothing has changed. I still think there is more to this than just 6.3e.


----------



## CrashHD

I think you're right. I think it's more than just 6.3e. Aging hardware, perhaps? How many of these units that are rebooting have original drives, or drives that have been powered on, constantly reading/writing, 24/7 for more than 3 or 4 years? That's a lot to ask of an enterprise-class SCSI drive, let alone a commodity grade IDE drive. Just my $.04 (inflation) worth.


----------



## Rainy Dave

CrashHD said:


> I think you're right. I think it's more than just 6.3e. Aging hardware, perhaps? How many of these units that are rebooting have original drives, or drives that have been powered on, constantly reading/writing, 24/7 for more than 3 or 4 years? That's a lot to ask of an enterprise-class SCSI drive, let alone a commodity grade IDE drive. Just my $.04 (inflation) worth.


Hmm...maybe it's just the justification I need to pop 500 gb drives into both of my machines.


----------



## gibverse

CrashHD said:


> I think you're right. I think it's more than just 6.3e. Aging hardware, perhaps? How many of these units that are rebooting have original drives, or drives that have been powered on, constantly reading/writing, 24/7 for more than 3 or 4 years? That's a lot to ask of an enterprise-class SCSI drive, let alone a commodity grade IDE drive. Just my $.04 (inflation) worth.


That was a thought I had, but I removed my drive and tested it with the drive manufacturer's (Maxtor) diagnostic tools. It came back with a clean bill of health, not a single bad sector. I've been toying with the idea of a larger drive, but not sure I want to spend money on a new drive if there are other problems with the unit causing the reboots.

I'm starting to wonder if the problem is the smaller swap file on older (smaller) drives, and the newer software needs more memory or has a memory leak and reboots when there is no swap left. Anyone with upgraded drives and experiencing reboots recall if they enlarged the swap when they upgraded? Perhaps this is related to the shorter capacity after upgrading from 6.2 to 6.3 as well.

I'm trying to watch everything on mine so that I can pull the drive and either try 6.3f again with a larger swap and/or new drive, or just save the pain and go back to rock-solid-stable 6.2a.


----------



## CrashHD

gibverse said:


> That was a thought I had, but I removed my drive and tested it with the drive manufacturer's (Maxtor) diagnostic tools. It came back with a clean bill of health, not a single bad sector.


Passing a manufacturer diagnostic is not the same as a clean bill of health. It's more like a bill of "not dead". Remember, these are the diagnostics that determine whether a drive gets RMA'd under warranty. Passing a mfr. diagnostic means the drive has no obvious defects (or at least should not).

[opinion]I think the tivo itself is a pretty good hdd diagnostic. If there's a weakness in a drive, a tivo will find it, and probably sooner than a diagnostic program. It just doesn't say where, when, and what kind of problem it is. [/opinion]


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

CrashHD said:


> Passing a manufacturer diagnostic is not the same as a clean bill of health. It's more like a bill of "not dead".


IBM figured out the wording on this over 30 years ago. I was an operator on a mainframe. On power-up the microcode printed either

GO / NO GO FAILED
or
GO / NO GO COMPLETE

Notice that they never said "passed". The opposite of "failed" is "complete"!


----------



## Ingavar

1 week on another, unhacked, no re-boots-yet!

Portland, OR


----------



## freebird01752

Well It been 2 weeks for me also. I can tell you that the problems was not due to hard drive failures. I had one unit that had never been activated that had problems as soon as I let it upgrade to 6.3e. I had another one that had problems and move it to another room and that problem went away. The third unit the one that I have own for the longest time never had any problems.

So I wonder how may people swap out good hard drives that did not need to be replaced. And how many d*tivo there are that people gave up on that just need to have 6.3f loaded on them to make them work again.

Steve


----------



## dcstager

If it was a software bug, it would affect everyone the same way, and especially the same machines the same way. It's bad hard drives or a failing power supply in most every case. The reasoning has been repeated hundreds of times already but of course when it happens to you it is different.


----------



## Rhughes

dcstager said:


> If it was a software bug, it would affect everyone the same way, and especially the same machines the same way. It's bad hard drives or a failing power supply in most every case. The reasoning has been repeated hundreds of times already but of course when it happens to you it is different.


It would certainly seem so, but that doesn't explain why (in my case) three TiVo's go crazy for months under 6.3e, then suddenly all three work perfectly, also under 6.3e. I have been involved with electronics most of my adult life, and computers since the 70's, and I can pretty much guarantee you that, at least on my three TiVo's, it's not hard drives or power supplies.


----------



## Ingavar

hard drive failures either.

I have had no problems before "E" and have had no problems since "F", yet.

I had constant re-booting problems with "E".

I'm just hoping for the best now.


----------



## dtremain

dcstager said:


> If it was a software bug, it would affect everyone the same way, and especially the same machines the same way. It's bad hard drives or a failing power supply in most every case. The reasoning has been repeated hundreds of times already but of course when it happens to you it is different.


No two hard drive based units are ever the same. Their use creates differences between them.

It is very clear that 6.3e caused the issues. The problems were not identical because the units are not identical from the first day of their use.


----------



## Wekiva

Finally got 6.3f on Thursday or Friday. Was experiencing lock ups just about every day the last few weeks...none since the update. Will need to go a few more days to see any trend though.


----------



## Brainiac427

I turned on the DirecTiVo today and noticed that both tuners were tuned to the same station. (I had left them on two different XM stations.) Also, the channel banner was back at full-screen default. That suggests a spontaneous reboot sometime within the last 24 hours with 6.3f.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

Brainiac427 said:


> That suggests a spontaneous reboot sometime within the last 24 hours with 6.3f.


What about missing 30-second skip? That's one way to be *sure* the box rebooted.


----------



## Brainiac427

Phantom Gremlin said:


> What about missing 30-second skip? That's one way to be *sure* the box rebooted.


I've never set a 30-second skip. How do you do that? I've always just pressed fast-forward until the commercial was over and then pressed play.


----------



## Brainiac427

Brainiac427 said:


> I've never set a 30-second skip. How do you do that? I've always just pressed fast-forward until the commercial was over and then pressed play.


Just set the 30-second skip, plus put the clock in the lower right corner. Now I'm well-equipped to see if there's a reboot.


----------



## RandCfilm

Brainiac427 said:


> I turned on the DirecTiVo today and noticed that both tuners were tuned to the same station. (I had left them on two different XM stations.) Also, the channel banner was back at full-screen default. That suggests a spontaneous reboot sometime within the last 24 hours with 6.3f.


Brainiac, if you have TWP can you check the kernel and tverr log file to see if before the reboot you had "can not remove unwritten live file" or something like that. I cleared my logs or I would have the exact wording.


----------



## Jumi

10 days with f and NO issues. I've had plenty during e's tenure. I hope it's a fix.


----------



## John T Smith

1 HR10-250 and 2 RCA-80 models have updated to f but the Samsung-120 is still at e

I guess that last unit will update itself "some day" (PS - all stock, no hacks)


----------



## Wekiva

Wekiva said:


> Finally got 6.3f on Thursday or Friday. Was experiencing lock ups just about every day the last few weeks...none since the update. Will need to go a few more days to see any trend though.


Well screw that...2 days into 6.3f and it froze up. Big old pile of poo. I just realized it 20 minutes into the Oscars. My tivo has gone from being a dream addition to my TV experience to a pain in the ass.


----------



## Brainiac427

RandCfilm said:


> Brainiac, if you have TWP can you check the kernel and tverr log file to see if before the reboot you had "can not remove unwritten live file" or something like that. I cleared my logs or I would have the exact wording.


I don't know what TWP is, nor how to check it. Shoot, I just learned how to put the clock in the lower right corner and set a 30-second skip.


----------



## RandCfilm

Brainiac427 said:


> I don't know what TWP is, nor how to check it. Shoot, I just learned how to put the clock in the lower right corner and set a 30-second skip.


Thanks, you have to hack your TiVo to install TWP. TWP is an interface that allows you to view information from the TiVo unit on your PC.


----------



## robpickles

It has already been suggested that those experiencing problems AFTER 6.3f has installed could be due to OTHER problems with your unit such as, hard drive, power supply or cable input problems.

I have had 6.3f for over 3 weeks now and have not had one reboot problem since the update. I also did *NOT* have any problems *BEFORE 6.3e* was installed. So , for me at least, 6.3f corrected the rebooting problems.

I did experience a weird lockup problem at one point with 6.3f, but I attributed it to too many remote clicks at one time and have not had another problem since that one occurance.

Rob


----------



## danimal107

My R10 had run 2+ weeks w/o any reboots after finally getting 6.3f update. Prior to that it would reboot once per day. Well, I got a reboot last night right as I started to watch a recorded show. Previously, w/6.3e it would take about an 1hr of viewing (live or recorded) before the reboot would occur. So, it appears 6.3f has helped, but did not completely fix my reboot problem.

Is my next step here to delete all hoping some bad sectors are the culprit? Or should I go for a new HDD?

-Dan in Beaverton, OR


----------



## bskouby

My DVR80 has been running on 6.3f for about two weeks now. It has been rock solid, no reboots, no freeze ups. Before on 6.3e it would reboot almost like clock work every Sunday afternoon/evening. Sometimes it lock up (if I forgot to clear the buffer when I started it up in the morning) and reboot. 

After 6.3f, I haven't suffered a reboot, and the unit is responsive as soon as I bring it out of standby. On 6.3e, the unit would be lethargic when coming out of standby, and would take several seconds (~30) before it would allow me to switch tuners and such. 

Before 6.3e, my unit was rock solid (even on 6.2a).


----------



## manhole

Has anyone with a Samsung branded receiver gotten the 6.3f update?


----------



## codespy

After 2 weeks strong with 7 TiVo's and no reboots, had my first one 2-27-08 at around 11:00am CST on one of my HR10's.


----------



## dtremain

manhole said:


> Has anyone with a Samsung branded receiver gotten the 6.3f update?


Not yet. My R10 has had it for a while. But not my Sammy yet.


----------



## Cedric

I have an R10 with a non-working modem. When 6.3f shows up (haven't seen it on my other DTivos yet) will it still install or does it need a phone call to kick it off?

Any methods to make the slices load (short of hacking)?

John
Dallas


----------



## tigercat74

6.3f on my Hughes and it rebooted with heavy snow on the dish. My two Samsungs are still on 6.3e and they also rebooted. I should state that my three only reboot with heavy rain or heavy snow on my dish.


----------



## PhillyJimbo

I have a Hughes that would reboot while on 6.2e. I've had 6.2f for a couple of weeks and have had no reboots, but I still see the problem when I bring it out of standby and one of the tuners seems to have a full 30 minute buffer. The two times it's happened, I changed the channel before anything bad occurred. I think it still needs some work.


----------



## CrashHD

tigercat74 said:


> my three only reboot with heavy rain or heavy snow on my dish.


That is odd. That sounds like an installation problem, or a hardware problem outside of the receiver box.


----------



## tigercat74

CrashHD said:


> That is odd. That sounds like an installation problem, or a hardware problem outside of the receiver box.


This never happened before they downloaded 6.3e to the boxes. Do you think i might have a problem with my multiswitch?


----------



## dishrich

manhole said:


> Has anyone with a Samsung branded receiver gotten the 6.3f update?


Yep, a 4120 & it was the 2nd of my 4 Tivo's to get it. Had no problems with it before or now.


----------



## chuckg

dishrich said:


> Yep, a 4120 & it was the 2nd of my 4 Tivo's to get it. Had no problems with it before or now.


Does it have the original hard drive? Is it hacked?


----------



## dishrich

chuckg said:


> Does it have the original hard drive? Is it hacked?


All as is from factory...


----------



## dm999

Just checked my 2 HR10-250's:

Directory listing of /SwModule 
Name Type Id Date Time Size 
2024509 tyDb 2024509 04/19/07 02:35 140 
2024510 tyDb 2024510 04/19/07 02:35 140 
2024511 tyDb 2024511 04/19/07 02:35 152 
2024512 tyDb 2024512 04/19/07 02:35 148

Directory listing of /SwModule 
Name Type Id Date Time Size 
1791694 tyDb 1791694 04/19/07 05:40 140 
1791695 tyDb 1791695 04/19/07 05:39 140 
1791696 tyDb 1791696 04/19/07 05:39 152 
1791697 tyDb 1791697 04/19/07 05:39 148 
2836623 tyDb 2836623 12/07/07 05:46 140 
2836624 tyDb 2836624 12/07/07 05:45 140

The 202* and 179* modules are 6.3d, the 2 283* modules are 6.3f.  Is there any way to get the remaining modules from 6.3f, or find out why they aren't coming down on thier own?

Thanks

Trace



dcstager said:


> My Hughes SD-DVR80 has two new entries in the SwModule MFS entry dated 12/07/07, but no new choices in the SwSystem MFS area. Hmmm?


----------



## CrashHD

One of my units got part of the modules several weeks before finally getting the rest. I know of nothing you can do about it, short of downloading and installing the slices manually (links can be found earlier in this thread).


----------



## Da Goon

dm999 said:


> The 202* and 179* modules are 6.3d, the 2 283* modules are 6.3f. Is there any way to get the remaining modules from 6.3f, or find out why they aren't coming down on thier own?


Check /State/Keyring. If you're missing a SWE* entry, then your box is missing the key it needs to decrypt the swsystem slice. If it's missing, grab the slices and insert them manually. This will bypass the need for your box to decrypt anything since the posted swsystem slice has already been decoded.


----------



## dm999

Da Goon said:


> Check /State/Keyring. If you're missing a SWE* entry, then your box is missing the key it needs to decrypt the swsystem slice. If it's missing, grab the slices and insert them manually. This will bypass the need for your box to decrypt anything since the posted swsystem slice has already been decoded.


Here is what I have

Directory listing of /State/Keyring 
Name Type Id Date Time Size 
BACKHAUL_PRIVATE-20060120 tyDb 857224 09/15/06 07:45 652 
BACKHAUL_PUBLIC-20060120 tyDb 857225 09/15/06 07:45 644 
BACKHAUL_THUMB-20060120 tyDb 857226 09/15/06 07:45 640 
SOFTWARE-199801 tyDb 857223 09/15/06 07:45 116 
ST_gilbert_12-production-7-13603-180-I-13783-A-13783-A tyDb 1708483 03/31/07 14:59 1380 
ST_gilbert_14-production-4-13603-180-A-13783-A-13783-A tyDb 1708484 03/31/07 14:59 1380 
TIVOVID_2-12000-32767-00000000 tyDb 1956160 05/26/07 22:40 1248 

and

Directory listing of /State/Keyring 
Name Type Id Date Time Size 
TIVOVID_2-12000-32767-00000000 tyDb 2158856 05/26/07 12:56 1248 

So it looks like I"m missing the SWE* key. Is there a way to get it back?

The only link I saw was an ed2k link earlier in the post, is that the one you are talking about? I've seen some other posts with URLs at dvrupgrade where slices can be pulled. Would that be another good option for getting the slices?

Thanks

Trace


----------



## Da Goon

Yep, you're missing the key. The only way I know of to get it is to force a call, but that doesn't always work, and can come along with some other unneeded cruft sometimes. Have you run set_mrv_name on this box? I don't know why else you'd have a TIVOVID key...anyways...go here to get the slices.


----------



## rock_doctor

Augh! I am sorry to say my HDVR2 rebooted today. A little more then three weeks since updating to 'f'... We will have to see how the future goes....


----------



## skinnyjm

Still don't have it in MFS on my RCA DVR80. Not that I want it, 6.2a is the best, but just for those who are wondering...that's all.


----------



## dm999

Da Goon said:


> Yep, you're missing the key. The only way I know of to get it is to force a call, but that doesn't always work, and can come along with some other unneeded cruft sometimes. Have you run set_mrv_name on this box? I don't know why else you'd have a TIVOVID key...anyways...go here to get the slices.


Yep, I did run the set_mrv_name when I initially Zippered the unit. Was under the (mistaken) impression that MRV was possible on this unit, but alas, no (WHAH!!!)

Trace


----------



## tigercat74

My box with 6.3f rebooted this morning when snow got on the dish. My two with 6.3e just lost signal and did not reboot. The only time mine reboot is during heavy rain or snow.


----------



## dcstager

For the time being, a zippered 6.2a is the best thing going. The patches available enable a lot of good features which have been carefully removed from 6.3f. If you want stability and usability and the best feature set, just invest in a quiet large hard drive and build it from scratch and read everything on deal database before you start doing anything. If you are still getting reboots after that - your unit is just broken.


----------



## keyoctave

I have a Samsung SIR-4080 which has 6.3e. It is not hacked. It have not received the 6.3f update. My other DVR (a Philips) did weeks ago. I have called D on two different times, days apart, and spoke with tech support. They had me force calls, had my unit call them back and checked to make sure my DVR was in the system to be upgraded. Both times they said to wait up to 24 hours to trigger the download. They said there is no reason why I should not have received the update. I have forced more calls and tried restarting. I have been hooked up to a working phone line. My unit seems to be working fine except for the occasional reboot. Any thoughts?


----------



## dtremain

keyoctave said:


> I have a Samsung SIR-4080 which has 6.3e. It is not hacked. It have not received the 6.3f update. My other DVR (a Philips) did weeks ago. I have called D on two different times, days apart, and spoke with tech support. They had me force calls, had my unit call them back and checked to make sure my DVR was in the system to be upgraded. Both times they said to wait up to 24 hours to trigger the download. They said there is no reason why I should not have received the update. I have forced more calls and tried restarting. I have been hooked up to a working phone line. My unit seems to be working fine except for the occasional reboot. Any thoughts?


H-m-m-m. My Samsung S4120R doesn't have it yet either. My R-10 has had it for weeks.

Sounds like a little slip-up on Directv's part to me.

I was beginning to wonder. Apparently they think they are all done. I don't think they are correct.


----------



## Marrelli

I have the Samsung SIR4040 still at 6.3e also.


----------



## bbristow

My Hughes SD-DVR80 is just as bad or WORSE since the 6.3f update. It is rebooting nearly daily now. If not, it locks up completely, failing to record any shows until I have to unplug it and restart manually. I also have the floating color and B&W problem as before. When I called DTV a half hour ago, I was put on hold, held for 30 minutes as they were "transferring" me to tech people, then I was disconnected. I figured there was no need to call back as there was to be no help from these idiots. First rep said they could send me a new DVR, but I told her I refused to take a crappy R15 AND pay a lease fee for it!!!! So I suppose I will be forced to get Instant Cake and go back to 6.2a until sometime next year or two when I see they've made the promised "first quarter 2008" upgrade for TiVo.


----------



## dm999

Just put 6.3f on my 2 zippered HR10-250's (thanks to Da Goon for the upgrade script!!). The primary rebooted 7-8 times yesterday before the install. Since the install, no reboots yet. Here's hoping this will address the reboot issue!!!!


----------



## shubmsp

I noticed this on the forum today

noticed my TiVos now have version 6.3f ready to install. Two versions show up in my MFS:

6.3f-01-2-101 tyDb 3395068 12/08/07 03:11 780
6.3f-01-2-121 tyDb 3395073 12/08/07 03:11 780

Question is, how do I get this version?
How do I now it has been downloaded?
What features does this version bring to my HR10-250?

Many thanks from this newbie to the forum

Steve


----------



## jdmac29

keyoctave said:


> I have a Samsung SIR-4080 which has 6.3e. It is not hacked. It have not received the 6.3f update. My other DVR (a Philips) did weeks ago. I have called D on two different times, days apart, and spoke with tech support. They had me force calls, had my unit call them back and checked to make sure my DVR was in the system to be upgraded. Both times they said to wait up to 24 hours to trigger the download. They said there is no reason why I should not have received the update. I have forced more calls and tried restarting. I have been hooked up to a working phone line. My unit seems to be working fine except for the occasional reboot. Any thoughts?


I have the samsung 4040r, not hacked but I did put in a larger hard drive but I just imaged it from the original. I am still on 6.3e also, I have forced calls still no luck. My brother in law has a hughes and he has 6.3f. I have not had a reboot for about 4 days now but it usually happens a couple times a week. 
I will call directv tomorrow just to let them know about not getting the update.


----------



## tigercat74

Neither of my two Samsungs have updated to 6.3f, but my hughes has.


----------



## manhole

Looks like a trend to me. I'm glad it's not just me.

Is there anyone left who has not received the 6.3f update on a non-Samsung Tivo? (with the exception of those of you who do not have your phone line plugged in of course).


----------



## chuckg

I have had one Samsung S4040R running 6.3e 24/7 with phone line attached from 1/08/08 to today 3/12/08 waiting for update. No 6.3f. Reboots under 6.3e if non-viewed channel is not changed, at least momentarily, when turned on.

Both of my Samsungs are now running 6.2 with phone lines disconnected. And at 6.2 they shall remain for the foreseeable future. Which is measured in years, not months.


----------



## shubmsp

Please fellow/ladies, tell me where to look for the software update, whether it be 
63f or whatever. surely there must be someone out there who can tell me!

TIA

Steve


----------



## shubmsp

Will someone please respond to these questions (again):

Question on 63f:

How do I now it has been downloaded? 
Where will it show up? (How do I access the information on an update?)
What does MFS mean?
What features does this version bring to my HR10-250?

TIA
Steve


----------



## dtremain

shubmsp said:


> Will someone please respond to these questions (again):
> 
> Question on 63f:
> 
> How do I now it has been downloaded?
> Where will it show up? (How do I access the information on an update?)
> What does MFS mean?
> What features does this version bring to my HR10-250?
> 
> TIA
> Steve


In the menu, go to "messages and setup" and then to "system information." Look for the software version among the first few lines of information.

The first few numbers will tell you what version you have. Probably 6.3e or 6.3f.

There are no new features on 6.3f. Just some bug fixes.


----------



## Da Goon

shubmsp said:


> How do I now it has been downloaded?


Hack your box and check /SwSystem via mfs_ls, echo mls /SwSystem | tivosh or browing via TWP. 


> Where will it show up? (How do I access the information on an update?)


/SwSystem in MFS. You can't check unless you've hacked your box. Well, you could pop your drive in a pc, boot up with a linux disc or a full linux distro with tivopart and use the x86 version of mfs_ls, but that's a bit of work just to get that information.


> What does MFS mean?


Media FileSystem. It's TiVo's proprietary filesystem that houses your recordings, season pass information, thumb ratings, etc.


> What features does this version bring to my HR10-250?


Features? None. Just bug fixes supposedly. All I've noticed is that DCHP functionality was broken with the removal of dhclient and dhclient-script.


----------



## llurgy

I have had the 6.3f on my R10 and my Hughes HR2 now for about 2 weeks.
I am happy to say (fingers, toes and eyes crossed) that my reboots have now stopped.


----------



## shubmsp

Thank you for your replies. I know it was elementary stuff, but that's why they call me a newbie. Thanks again.


----------



## skipw

My R10 is running 6.3f-01-2-521 ... not sure when it was updated, but it has been about 1 week since it last rebooted on it's own. Tonight, Survivor didn't record from the Season Pass. I also have it recording on my second R10 and it did record on that one. 

Is it possible that the show info gets changed and the season pass does not recognize it?

This happened last week as well on another show and the History said "Not recorded due to someone changed the season pass" or something like that.

So looks like there are still some bugs in 6.3f. And I have noticed that changing between screens is a lot slower.

I've just about had it with DTV... and I hate to say it but I'm thinking of moving to Dish Network if they can give me a deal. And I just upgraded the hard drive 2 months ago.


----------



## OLdDog

tigercat74 said:


> Neither of my two Samsungs have updated to 6.3f, but my hughes has.


Also posted on another site:
Well I HAVE received the update on one of my two Samsungs but not on the other.

I have had no issues with either software version.

The only strange thing is that the one that received the update is only about a year old (One of the last ones when they were on clearance from CC) and the one that did not get it is over 3 years.

Also, in the strange category, the new one never gets the star adds but the older one does.

I have NO idea how any of that relates to the update.


----------



## keyoctave

Well, after two calls to tech support in a week, I called back and asked to speak with a supervisor. After being on hold for about 15 min, the supervisor came on the line. She was very nice as I explained about my Samsung unit not getting the update to 6.3f. I also told her that this was being discussed in different forums and that it seems to be a common occurance with other Samsung units as well. I explained to her that I was speaking to her to make sure D* was aware of this problem and that a supervisor should be able to let the right people know of this so it can be corrected. She said they were aware of this problem. From her explination, it seems that it is on the Tivo side of things, not D*. Evidently, Tivo did not code the Samsung units in for the update. She said she would contact Tivo with a 'problem' request on my unit and get back to me when she heard something from them. She said it usually takes a few days to hear back from Tivo with these kinds of requests. I spoke with her on Wednesday. She promised to call me back with an answer. 

So, we'll see.


----------



## dtremain

keyoctave said:


> Well, after two calls to tech support in a week, I called back and asked to speak with a supervisor. After being on hold for about 15 min, the supervisor came on the line. She was very nice as I explained about my Samsung unit not getting the update to 6.3f. I also told her that this was being discussed in different forums and that it seems to be a common occurance with other Samsung units as well. I explained to her that I was speaking to her to make sure D* was aware of this problem and that a supervisor should be able to let the right people know of this so it can be corrected. She said they were aware of this problem. From her explination, it seems that it is on the Tivo side of things, not D*. Evidently, Tivo did not code the Samsung units in for the update. She said she would contact Tivo with a 'problem' request on my unit and get back to me when she heard something from them. She said it usually takes a few days to hear back from Tivo with these kinds of requests. I spoke with her on Wednesday. She promised to call me back with an answer.
> 
> So, we'll see.


thank you for calling and for letting us know. It will be interesting to see what happens.


----------



## dtremain

OLdDog said:


> The only strange thing is that the one that received the update is only about a year old (One of the last ones when they were on clearance from CC) and the one that did not get it is over 3 years.
> 
> Also, in the strange category, the new one never gets the star adds but the older one does.


Is it an unhacked unit. Given that other Samsungs don't seem to be getting the update and Keyoctave's latest post, it makes me wonder if it was a new unit they sold you, or one that someone else had tampered with so that it no longer looks like a Samsung to the software upgrade (and is somehow rejecting the showcases).


----------



## OLdDog

dtremain said:


> Is it an unhacked unit. Given that other Samsungs don't seem to be getting the update and Keyoctave's latest post, it makes me wonder if it was a new unit they sold you, or one that someone else had tampered with so that it no longer looks like a Samsung to the software upgrade (and is somehow rejecting the showcases).


The only hack is both of them have upgraded drives. The upgrades for these both came from Weaknees and there is no other hack at all.

As far as the newest unit. It was in the original box and the seals seemed intact. Also, since I put a new drive in the day I received it any hacks that might have been on the original drive are calmly sitting in a drawer.

Both of the system info screens show exactly the the same thing except for the software ver and other numbers that make the unit unique.

As I said the difference is simply strange.

Maybe D* just likes the new one better. But I will keep that quite as I do not wish to deal with any sibling rivalries between my children.


----------



## dtremain

OLdDog said:


> Maybe D* just likes the new one better. But I will keep that quite as I do not wish to deal with any sibling rivalries between my children.


----------



## dm999

dm999 said:


> Just put 6.3f on my 2 zippered HR10-250's (thanks to Da Goon for the upgrade script!!). The primary rebooted 7-8 times yesterday before the install. Since the install, no reboots yet. Here's hoping this will address the reboot issue!!!!


Just a quick update...6.3f hs been on both boxes since last Sunday, and NO unscheduled reboots.

I did notice at the same time that the /busybox/wipelog script had a couple of extra ^M's in it. looking at /var/log, all the log files were pretty large, so I"m not sure if it was actually working. cleaned it up and verified that it is now working. So, I'm not 100% sure 6.3f was the fix, as I've heard several times that the HR10-250's can get whacky if they start running low on space.

Thanks again to all here how keep doing an amazing job...


----------



## Marrelli

keyoctave said:


> Well, after two calls to tech support in a week, I called back and asked to speak with a supervisor. After being on hold for about 15 min, the supervisor came on the line. She was very nice as I explained about my Samsung unit not getting the update to 6.3f. I also told her that this was being discussed in different forums and that it seems to be a common occurance with other Samsung units as well. I explained to her that I was speaking to her to make sure D* was aware of this problem and that a supervisor should be able to let the right people know of this so it can be corrected. She said they were aware of this problem. From her explination, it seems that it is on the Tivo side of things, not D*. Evidently, Tivo did not code the Samsung units in for the update. She said she would contact Tivo with a 'problem' request on my unit and get back to me when she heard something from them. She said it usually takes a few days to hear back from Tivo with these kinds of requests. I spoke with her on Wednesday. She promised to call me back with an answer.
> 
> So, we'll see.


Any response from D* about the Samsung units not getting 6.3f. Mine is still at 6.3e.


----------



## dtremain

Marrelli said:


> Any response from D* about the Samsung units not getting 6.3f. Mine is still at 6.3e.


Mine too. My R-1o got 6.3f weeks ago.


----------



## dcstager

Everyone having problems should give up on directtv solving or fixing anything. You can and should fix it all yourself. It's really easy. Check out one of our sponsors:

http://www.dvrupgrade.com/dvr/stores/1/index_tcf.cfm

If you just want to buy a new, fast, and large hard drive and keep all your recordings and do it yourself:

http://www.mfslive.org/

And if you really want your Directtivo humming along blissfully with all the great features everyone is talking about and that Direct TV doesn't trust you to have. A rock-solid reliable system can be created yourself simply by following instructions here:

http://www.mastersav.com/tivo_zipper.html

Any of these three methods WILL fix your machine and are ALL within your personal control - not at the whim of Tivo or Direct TV. Each are easy, do it yourself solutions far better than any advice you'll get writing messages complaining that your machine is re-booting because of Direct TV's indifference. No customer service rep will be able to help you as much as you can help yourself. Give it a shot. There are a lot of people here that will help you if you get into trouble. But just read through the instructions before you start and get a clear picture, then proceed. It really is quite easy.


----------



## manhole

dtremain said:


> Mine too. My R-1o got 6.3f weeks ago.


My Samsung is still on 6.3e as well. It's looking more and more like we are going to have to wait until the next release to get our update.


----------



## dtremain

manhole said:


> My Samsung is still on 6.3e as well. It's looking more and more like we are going to have to wait until the next release to get our update.


Well, outside of freezing up in the bad weather a couple of times, my Samsung's been working fine. At first, with 6.3e, it was having re-boots and pixelation on recordings of local channels, but that all seemed to end months ago.

So, since it's pretty well doing fine, I guess I would just as well not worry about pushing for new problems.


----------



## dcstager

http://tivo.upgrade-instructions.com/index.php


----------



## Brainiac427

Doing well with no reboots over the past two months (almost). It appears the TiVo is becoming trustworthy again.


----------



## keyoctave

Marrelli said:


> Any response from D* about the Samsung units not getting 6.3f. Mine is still at 6.3e.


I have not heard a thing. Still at 6.3e. I am getting ready to upgrade to HD so I will not push this issue with them anymore. I wonder if they are letting things happen (not deliberate, just not as fast to respond to problems) with the Tivo units so people will get fed up with them and switch over to D*'s own DVR's?


----------



## dtremain

keyoctave said:


> I have not heard a thing. Still at 6.3e. I am getting ready to upgrade to HD so I will not push this issue with them anymore. I wonder if they are letting things happen (not deliberate, just not as fast to respond to problems) with the Tivo units so people will get fed up with them and switch over to D*'s own DVR's?


Well, I'm not getting 6.3f on my Samsung, but I'm no longer having problems with it either. Since it's doing everything I need it to do, such a plan wouldn't be working with me.

There are plenty of posts here of people with 6.3f who are having problems.

I'm not sure e or f is a very big issue.


----------



## robpickles

Brainiac427 said:


> Doing well with no reboots over the past two months (almost). It appears the TiVo is becoming trustworthy again.


Thursday, April 17th, 6:37pm...

REBOOT with 6.3f on my R10 for the first time since it was updated.

Here we go again.

Rob


----------



## RFSmith

dcstager said:


> Everyone having problems should give up on directtv solving or fixing anything. You can and should fix it all yourself. It's really easy. Check out one of our sponsors:
> 
> http://www.dvrupgrade.com/dvr/stores/1/index_tcf.cfm
> 
> If you just want to buy a new, fast, and large hard drive and keep all your recordings and do it yourself:
> 
> http://www.mfslive.org/
> 
> And if you really want your Directtivo humming along blissfully with all the great features everyone is talking about and that Direct TV doesn't trust you to have. A rock-solid reliable system can be created yourself simply by following instructions here:
> 
> http://www.mastersav.com/tivo_zipper.html
> 
> Any of these three methods WILL fix your machine and are ALL within your personal control - not at the whim of Tivo or Direct TV. Each are easy, do it yourself solutions far better than any advice you'll get writing messages complaining that your machine is re-booting because of Direct TV's indifference. No customer service rep will be able to help you as much as you can help yourself. Give it a shot. There are a lot of people here that will help you if you get into trouble. But just read through the instructions before you start and get a clear picture, then proceed. It really is quite easy.


I baked a fresh 6.3a drive last week and all was well until D** hit me with 6.3f...now I have to do it all over again.


----------



## rock_doctor

RFSmith said:


> I baked a fresh 6.3a drive last week and all was well until D** hit me with 6.3f...now I have to do it all over again.


Redo it and unplug your phone line. You will be ok then...


----------



## bg711

robpickles said:


> Thursday, April 17th, 6:37pm...
> 
> REBOOT with 6.3f on my R10 for the first time since it was updated.
> 
> Here we go again.
> 
> Rob


Same exact problem for me today. 6.3f had fixed my reboots until today. My R10 rebooted for the 1st time since I got 6.3f. UGHH.


----------



## jambajuice

My R10 was frozen. I reboot and it says powering up...then grey screen. What happened and is there a way to fix this?


----------



## dtremain

jambajuice said:


> My R10 was frozen. I reboot and it says powering up...then grey screen. What happened and is there a way to fix this?


Hard drive failure.

Replace the hard drive. Either by buying one from somplace like Weaknees or formatting one yourself. I've never done either, so someone else here can tell you how.


----------



## Cosmic

bg711 said:


> Same exact problem for me today. 6.3f had fixed my reboots until today. My R10 rebooted for the 1st time since I got 6.3f. UGHH.


First freeze since 6.3f on 2 DTiVos last night (DVR39 and DVR80). Neither is my main recorder - an R10 that my wife and I BOTH use. On the R10, I record ESPN and Comedy Central for 5 minutes each morning @ 2:00am, to make sure the recorder isn't left on a local when my usual updates take place (2:30ish). That worked pretty well when I had 6.3e and I left it like that. I don't usually watch locals on the DVR 80, but the Red Wings game was on NBC yesterday and when I rebooted that machine today, it came up with both tuners on my local NBC channel.

Interestingly enough, the DVR39 came up after reboot on TMC on both tuners. ??????????????????

I had unplugged my phone lines, once I got 6.3f. So much for THAT fix. I'll probably go the hacked route now BACK to 6.2. All 3 Series 2s are unhacked at this point.

I'm fairly PC savvy. I have a Windows 2000 box and an Ubuntu 6.06 Linux box.

Since I have 3 DIFFERENT models, which is the best route? Isn't there a different version of "Instant Cake" for EACH model?

I'm sick of this CRAP!! I've had DTiVos since they were first introduced, and I'm convinced this is a DirecTV ploy to get rid of ALL DTiVos and force everyone over to their DVRs. Seems to me this is the 3rd time in 4 years that similar things have "happened" to DTiVos and NOT DirecTV DVRs after system updates.

Excuse me while I check out the hovering black helicopter outside my house. 

TIA

Cos


----------



## dtremain

Cosmic,

"There are 10 kinds of people in the world....those who understand binary....and those who don't. "

I love it.


----------



## cwa126

I've had 6.3f for weeks on my Hughes DVR80. In fact, my random reboot problem did not start until I got 6.3f. Problem is ... it could still be an aging hard drive. Is anybody still having the reboot problem after installing a new drive (under 6.3f)?


----------



## litzdog911

cwa126 said:


> I've had 6.3f for weeks on my Hughes DVR80. In fact, my random reboot problem did not start until I got 6.3f. Problem is ... it could still be an aging hard drive. Is anybody still having the reboot problem after installing a new drive (under 6.3f)?


A few folks did, and most likely those were indeed hard drive problems. It's not unusual for a new software update to trigger hard drive issues because the updated software gets installed to a previously unused drive partition. Problems on that partition can cause these symptoms. By and large it seems that 6.3f solved the "random reboot" issue for many folks. My Tivo's haven't rebooted one time since the update.


----------



## jambajuice

litzdog911 said:


> A few folks did, and most likely those were indeed hard drive problems. It's not unusual for a new software update to trigger hard drive issues because the updated software gets installed to a previously unused drive partition. Problems on that partition can cause these symptoms. By and large it seems that 6.3f solved the "random reboot" issue for many folks. My Tivo's haven't rebooted one time since the update.


So is there a chance this can start working again or is it dead in the water? I mean, there is no way to reverese the current software or anything i geuess.


----------



## dtremain

jambajuice said:


> So is there a chance this can start working again or is it dead in the water? I mean, there is no way to reverese the current software or anything i geuess.


I don't think litzdog is talking about units that won't re-boot at all. He means issues that a number of people have had where the unit suddenly and randomly does a re-boot, but fully restores itself when it's done.

No, I'm afraid you need a hard drive.


----------



## Cosmic

I still have a Phillips 6000, my original DTiVo. It's at least 6, maybe 7 years old. I've NEVER had any problem with it after ANY system update. The only problems I've ever had are with the series 2 (R10, DVR39 & DVR80). the R10 is only 1 1/2 years old. Hardly an "old" drive. Is there some difference between a series 1 and series 2 that would cause a hard disk drive failure on the 2 after something like a system update? I guess I'm wondering WHY this only affects NON DirecTV made DVRs (with the exception of Series 1s)?

I don't know if I ever had any sporadic re-boots. Never while I was watching. My problem has always been freeze ups, and that's "gone away" as long as I don't leave either tuner on a local overnight.


----------



## snickerrrrs

jambajuice said:


> My R10 was frozen. I reboot and it says powering up...then grey screen. What happened and is there a way to fix this?


I was able to take a hard drive out of a dead Humax Tivo and use spinrite software to get it to boot again. But at $90 a pop, you might as well purchase a new hard drive from weaknees.com or dvrupgrade.com instead. I'm a IT manager and I use spinrite all the time so it was worth it for me to purchase it.

The hard drive is the heart of your system, so replacing it is almost like getting a new system (tuner and power supplies do fail also, but not nearly as often). Keep your dvr clean inside and in a cool well ventilated place (heat prematurely kills electronic devices) and it will last for many years (or until you decide to upgrade your entertainment system to High-Def). Good Luck


----------



## kc1ih

I finally got 6.3F on my R-10. The difference I noticed is it now shows the time in the lower right of the screen. If viewing a recorded show it shows the time it was recorded and how far into the show you are.


----------



## CrashHD

That's the on-screen clock. It is enabled by the remote code <Select-Play-Select-9-Select>

It is not specific to version 6.3f

An unhacked unit should not be displaying that clock without having the remote code entered.


----------



## macizcool

CrashHD said:


> That's the on-screen clock. It is enabled by the remote code <Select-Play-Select-9-Select>
> 
> It is not specific to version 6.3f
> 
> An unhacked unit should not be displaying that clock without having the remote code entered.


Are there anymore secret codes like that?


----------



## stevel

macizcool said:


> Are there anymore secret codes like that?


See here, but many of the codes mentioned do not work any longer or require that "backdoors" be enabled.


----------



## bengalfreak

Cosmic said:


> I still have a Phillips 6000, my original DTiVo. It's at least 6, maybe 7 years old. I've NEVER had any problem with it after ANY system update.


If you still have the original hard drive in that thing, it is definitely living on borrowed time. And your results are just coincidence. The most likely time for a Tivo or DTivo hard drive to die is after a software upgrade. Due to the fact that the DVR is using a section of the hard disk that wasn't being used before. It matters not the model of the Tivo, nor the model of the hard drive.


----------



## macizcool

stevel said:


> See here, but many of the codes mentioned do not work any longer or require that "backdoors" be enabled.


Thanks for the link. You're right about many codes not working.


----------



## Cosmic

bengalfreak said:


> If you still have the original hard drive in that thing, it is definitely living on borrowed time. And your results are just coincidence. The most likely time for a Tivo or DTivo hard drive to die is after a software upgrade. Due to the fact that the DVR is *using a section of the hard disk that wasn't being used before*. It matters not the model of the Tivo, nor the model of the hard drive.


I guess I don't understand this. All 4 of my PCs use new parts of their drives every time I add a program or data. Eventually I'll delete things and free up some space, but until that time, EVERYTHING that gets saved is being written on a part that wasn't being used before. What's different here?


----------



## Da Goon

Cosmic said:


> What's different here?


The tivo has 2 root filesystems, on partitions 4 and 7. Only one is active at a time. When a partition is inactive, it's never even mounted, it's essentially untouched. When a tivo initiates a sw update, it installs the new sw on the alternate (previously unused) partition. Tivos don't use the whole of the disk when it needs space. Partitions 1, 2 and 5 for example won't ever change unless the you intentionally do something with them.


----------



## CrashHD

Cosmic said:


> I guess I don't understand this. All 4 of my PCs use new parts of their drives every time I add a program or data. Eventually I'll delete things and free up some space, but until that time, EVERYTHING that gets saved is being written on a part that wasn't being used before. What's different here?


This explanation of "previously unused area of the disk gone bad" is an ASSUMPTION based upon the FACT that it has been observed that a higher percentage of tivo failures occur during upgrade periods, with some of them failing during the upgrade. I think (i.e.--unproven opinion) there's another explanation...something about the upgrade process is stressful to weak tivos.


----------



## codespy

Congratulations Crash...on you having reply #500 to this thread.

You WIN a DirecTV R15 receiver.....

A CSR will hopefully call you in the next couple days for info on the prize.


----------



## CrashHD

If an R15 is the prize, I don't wanna play the game.


----------



## bengalfreak

Cosmic said:


> I guess I don't understand this. All 4 of my PCs use new parts of their drives every time I add a program or data. Eventually I'll delete things and free up some space, but until that time, EVERYTHING that gets saved is being written on a part that wasn't being used before. What's different here?


What's different is that those areas are not marked unusable. Look at it this way, when your personal computer writes to an empty section of the hard disk, that sector is checked and if found to be in good condition, the write takes place. Now, say you've had said computer for 5 years, and you put a program on the hard disk right after you bought it, but haven't run the program since. If the hard disk has developed a bad sector in the area the program is stored, then the program won't run. When new software is downloaded to your DTivo, the parts of the software that have changed are written to the alternate partition of your hard disk that has not been used recently. If one of the unchanged areas of this partition has developed a bad sector, the DTivo will not boot.


----------



## chuckg

bengalfreak said:


> What's different is that those areas are not marked unusable. Look at it this way, when your personal computer writes to an empty section of the hard disk, that sector is checked and if found to be in good condition, the write takes place. Now, say you've had said computer for 5 years, and you put a program on the hard disk right after you bought it, but haven't run the program since. If the hard disk has developed a bad sector in the area the program is stored, then the program won't run. When new software is downloaded to your DTivo, the parts of the software that have changed are written to the alternate partition of your hard disk that has not been used recently. If one of the unchanged areas of this partition has developed a bad sector, the DTivo will not boot.


My understanding is that the software download is the complete OS. i.e. when 6.2a was downloaded it was the complete OS loaded in the current unused partition with the complete 6.2 OS in the previous partition. Which in turn means 6.3e was then loaded into the 6.2 partition.


----------



## CrashHD

That is correct. The root partitions alternate every time there is an upgrade.


----------



## chuckg

CrashHD said:


> That is correct. The root partitions alternate every time there is an upgrade.


Which means that to the extent the partition was fine under 6.2 it likely will be fine under 6.3e except where additional previously unused sectors are used which contain bad "spots".

Or, perhaps, sectors which can be read fine no longer can be written fine.


----------



## CrashHD

I'm not a believer in this theory of "bad sectors in the root partition wreck tivo upgrades", but if I were to play devil's advocate for a moment...

A typical tivo root filesystem partition is 256MB. Some are 128MB for one reason or another, but for the purpose of discussion, lets call it 256MB.

IIRC, 6.2 has about 40MB worth of files in it's root partition. 6.3e/f has about 50MB. So, it's possible (unlikely), there could be a bad sector, in the root partition, but no file from 6.2 occupied that sector (<philosophizer>if you tear a blank page out of a book, is the page really missing</philosophizer>), so it's presence had no effect. Now, along comes 6.3(e/f) which uses 10 MB more. Lets say an important file in that extra 10MB lands on the bad sector. Oops.

FWIW, the fact that 6.3 is 10 megs bigger is probably irrelevant. I don't know enough about the ext2 filesystem to know the order/pattern with which it propagates its sectors with files. It is a reasonable assumption that a volume could be formatted twice, filled with the same files each time, and they may land on different sectors each time.

Now, being done playing devil's advocate, I'll tell you one of several reasons I don't believe this theory. One of the first steps in an upgrade, is the preparation of the alternate root partition. This is the part where it is formatted by mke2fs. mke2fs scans for bad sectors as part of the format process.

I'm not a big fan of topic policing...especially after I just wrote this, but this issue really has little to do with 6.3f


----------



## chuckg

CrashHD said:


> ...
> I'm not a big fan of topic policing...especially after I just wrote this, but this issue really has little to do with 6.3f


Point well taken. I apoligize.

Unfortunately we don't really know what 6.3f was supposed to do. And whether it did what it was supposed to do.


----------



## Brainiac427

The clock disappeared about a week ago from the lower right corner, indicating a reboot sometime over a period of a few days last week. No recordings seem to have been affected. I hope this isn't the start of it all over again.


----------



## JimSpence

Is this thread really relevant anymore? 

Or must we wait for either 6.3g or it to hit 1000 posts?


----------



## rbtravis

JimSpence said:


> Is this thread really relevant anymore?
> 
> Or must we wait for either 6.3g or it to hit 1000 posts?


To answer your question NO. but this forum is no longer very active either.
Maybe we should discontinue both?


----------



## JimSpence

No No No, not for at least another 2100 or so posts.


----------



## dtremain

JimSpence said:


> Is this thread really relevant anymore?


If you have a Samsung. (They never got 6.3f. Another golden moment for the TiVo/Directv engineers.)


----------



## manhole

dtremain said:


> If you have a Samsung. (They never got 6.3f. Another golden moment for the TiVo/Directv engineers.)


Yep. I've got a Samsung and put up with 2 - 3 reboots per week in hopes that we will some day get an update to fix the problems introduced with 6.3e


----------



## stevel

I would not be so quick to blame the software. I went many months without a problem with 6.3e and no issues at all with 6.3f.


----------



## dtremain

stevel said:


> I would not be so quick to blame the software. I went many months without a problem with 6.3e and no issues at all with 6.3f.


Hardly the point, Steve. There are many Samsung units out here. The software was supposed to update them. It has not. Directv knows that. So far, they have done nothing about it. One has to suspect that that is going to stay the case.

I realize that Samsung units are the only Series 2's made in a different facility and that that might account for differences in them. Directv and TiVo know that too and should speicifically test their software against at lesat *one *Sammy before sending it out.

Doesn't seem like too much to ask.

I've always been a Directv booster and am still good with the fact that I dumped cable for them about nine years ago, but, I must say, since Fall 2006 and the errors that were occurring then, the technical decline of the operation has been quite bad.

I hope that new ownership, when it actually becomes effective, will make a difference. I've never had any respect for Rupert Murdoch, and did fear for the worst when he got involved.

Time will tell.

But, in the meantime, how about having them upgrade the software on Samsungs before we pronounce the issue closed? My upgraded R-10 is running beautifully (as it always did). My Samsung on 6.3e is continuing to have the occasional re-boot which started with 6.3e. Initially, the problems were much worse with briefly freezing motion everytime I watched a recording of the New York CBS local.

But, many problems seem to have gone away, thus demonstrating that it had nothing to do with my hard drive but with a combination of the software and incoming signal.

I'd like to see if the upgrade will repair it completely, but, I guess I'll never know.


----------



## manhole

stevel said:


> I would not be so quick to blame the software. I went many months without a problem with 6.3e and no issues at all with 6.3f.


The upgrade to 6.3e is what started the rebooting. I suspected it was the hard drive so I had it replaced. The new hard drive had 6.2a on it and worked great. I made the mistake of leaving the phone line in and it upgraded itself to 6.3e. Since then it started rebooting again. I'm quick to blame the software because the software is at fault.

Over the years I have gotten used to the Tivo interface and I don't particularly care to upgrade to a DirecTV receiver and lock myself into another contract. I just want my Tivo to work correctly. I would love to hear about this from DirecTV. Nobody seems to know why the Samsung's have not received the update.


----------



## chuckg

JimSpence said:


> Is this thread really relevant anymore?
> 
> Or must we wait for either 6.3g or it to hit 1000 posts?


Of course. My Samsungs reboot under 6.3e. I spent my money, $65 each, to revert to 6.2 while waiting for the "fix". From 1/8/08 to 3/12/08 I had a 6.3e drive in my #2 unit phone line connected, daily call made, occasional forced daily call, waiting for 6.3f. It never arrived.

Where is it?

Does anyone truly know what percentage of Samsungs did not receive 6.3f?


----------



## manhole

chuckg said:


> Of course. My Samsungs reboot under 6.3e. I spent my money, $65 each, to revert to 6.2 while waiting for the "fix". From 1/8/08 to 3/12/08 I had a 6.3e drive in my #2 unit phone line connected, daily call made, occasional forced daily call, waiting for 6.3f. It never arrived.
> 
> Where is it?
> 
> Does anyone truly know what percentage of Samsungs did not receive 6.3f?


I can't say that I have seen anyone with a Samsung report that they received 6.3f.


----------



## dtremain

chuckg said:


> Does anyone truly know what percentage of Samsungs did not receive 6.3f?


I think that I read on DBSTalk a while back that none of them have, and that it was being worked on. But, that was a long time ago and I don't see any results from the "work."


----------

