# Why don't people watch 30 Rock?



## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

30 Rock is one of the smartest, funniest, best written shows on TV. The combo of Tina Fey and Alec Baldwin and Tracy Morgan just works. 

But yet, the ratings are constantly crappy. It's not like people haven't heard of it. It's been on four years and won Emmys. 

What's the deal? 

I've liked shows in the past and known "Ok, I like this b/c I'm a nerd but there's no way that this show is going to last," and I've been right.

I don't see that with 30 Rock though. I don't get why it hasn't become the big hit.

Is it too New York for the rest of the country? Jack would certainly think so.


----------



## mrdazzo7 (Jan 8, 2006)

I wonder this myself and I"ve concluded that many people aren't into that kind of specific humor. I think it's witty/sarcastic kind of humor which, let's face it, some people just don't get, so they won't find it funny. As opposed to traditional sitcoms like "Raymond" or "Friends" that pretty much everyone on the planet can get into. 

I love 30 Rock but I don't know one other person who can stand it. I think it's similar humor to The Office, but that one is more accessible because, like the others, it's much more relatable (sp?) than 30 rock...


----------



## writdenied (Sep 2, 2003)

I offer you a quote from the "When Aliens Attack" episode of "Futurama":

*Fry:* {rejecting Leela's suggestion that he re-write a t.v. script to include a "clever and unexpected" plot twist} That's not why people watch TV. Clever things make people feel stupid, and unexpected things make them feel scared.


----------



## Magnolia88 (Jul 1, 2005)

Because it's up against _Grey's Anatomy_ and _CSI_. And most people who watch TV are already committed viewers of one of those shows.

Because a lot of people don't think it's funny.

And they talk so darn fast, it's hard to even understand them sometimes. There's no laugh track that tells the audience when there's a punch line and when they're supposed to laugh.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

I watched the first few eps and didn't enjoy it. I had a limited number of tuners available when it was on and I didn't enjoy it enough for it to get recorded.

A few months ago I thought I'd give it another try since it does get such great reviews. I got the first season on DVD from Netflix and still didn't enjoy it. I don't know why, I love Tina Fey and Alec Baldwin, but 30 Rock just doesn't entertain me.


----------



## DeDondeEs (Feb 20, 2004)

I really like Tina Fey and Alec Baldwin and their character interactions. But Tracy Morgan just annoys the heck out of me, he acts like a grown up 4 year old man-child on that show. The goofy page guy and his antics annoy me too. 

Also for the non-DVR crowd the fact that it is on at 9:30 after the Office probably doesn't help either also as previously mentioned it is up against two popular hour long shows on other networks that people have committed to already. 30-Rock should be on at 8 or 9 on a non-Thursday, it would probably do better. This whole compete for Thursday primetime thing has killed many good shows I am sure.


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

I just have too many other things I record... we stream it from Netflix though in the summer.


----------



## TiVo'Brien (Feb 8, 2002)

Ever notice 30 Rock has a bit of class elitism? I like the show and watch it every week, but I sometimes wonder if it turns off the common folk when it pokes fun at the suburban lower middle class.

Jack: "Hurry Lemon, let's get back to New York in our rented Kia Sorrento."


----------



## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

TiVo'Brien said:


> Ever notice 30 Rock has a bit of class elitism? I like the show and watch it every week, but I sometimes wonder if it turns off the common folk when it pokes fun at the suburban lower middle class.
> 
> Jack: "Hurry Lemon, let's get back to New York in our rented Kia Sorrento."


But shouldn't the suburban middle class be laughing at the stuck up clueless New York nitwit?

I dunno.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

I've seen every episode of the show, and I find it moderately funny. But it's definitely not at the top of the list of sitcoms I enjoy right now, and if it were canceled, I wouldn't mourn its loss.

I love the Liz Lemon, Jack Donaghy and Kenneth Parcells characters, but I can't stand Tracy Jordan and Jenna Maroney, and I think too much of their presence in the episodes can ruin an otherwise good show. 

In addition, I think there's something to the fact that it's a little too smartass, a little too sarcastic, and a little too NYC for the masses. There are just far too many "in jokes" for those that are familiar with NYC and the entertainment industry for it to be accessible to the everyman. Like I said, I enjoy the show, but it's not for everyone.

Finally, that timeslot is the most competitive hour of the entire week. The combination of The Office and 30 Rock are the best NBC has to offer and therefore, it's reasonable that they've place these shows in that slot, but it should come as no surprise to anyone that when a show is on the fourth place network and it's running opposite some of the most popular shows on TV, it's going to lose that battle more often than not.

All of these things factor into the overall poor ratings that the show receives. It's not likely to get better anytime soon, as NBC is in a downward spiral and there are no near-term prospects of that changing.


----------



## terpfan1980 (Jan 28, 2002)

I gave it a small chance and it never clicked with me. I would much rather have seen Studio 60 survive and have 30 Rock kicked to the curb, but NBC thought differently.

Now NBC's ratings are in the crapper across most of their schedule and I really don't care to go out of my way to watch anything they air. Heroes lost me along the way, and beyond Sunday Night Football a few times per season I can't think of much else that NBC airs that I even consider watching.

Putting Leno on for 5 nights a week in what could be an hour of good drama doesn't help either since I'm not watching in the 10pm hour where I might see a promo for another show that looks like it might be worth watching.


----------



## YCantAngieRead (Nov 5, 2003)

Turtleboy said:


> But shouldn't the suburban middle class be laughing at the stuck up clueless New York nitwit?
> 
> I dunno.


I'm very firmly lower-middle class, and I look at like that. I find it hilarious.

No offense to anyone who doesn't watch it, but I think it's too smart for some. It's just not as easily digested as other shows. (On the other hand, even when it is a smart show, not all smart viewers will watch it-take Arrested Development. I should have loved that show. I've yet to be able to get into it.)

It's also rather absurdist, which can turn off some folks.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

YCantAngieRead said:


> No offense to anyone who doesn't watch it, but I think it's too smart for some. It's just not as easily digested as other shows. (On the other hand, even when it is a smart show, not all smart viewers will watch it-*take Arrested Development. I should have loved that show. I've yet to be able to get into it.*)


The first season is currently available for viewing on Hulu for free. You should definitely take advantage of that while it's there. In my opinion, there was no better sitcom in the history of TV than Arrested Development.


----------



## MonsterJoe (Feb 19, 2003)

My humor is about as sarcastic as they come, and I don't find it particularly funny. I haven't tried it that much, either, so it's a limited sample.


----------



## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

DeDondeEs said:


> Also for the non-DVR crowd the fact that it is on at 9:30 after the Office probably doesn't help either also as previously mentioned it is up against two popular hour long shows on other networks that people have committed to already.


But that would mean that The Office wouldn't have a strong audience either. Isn't The Office a strong show? Shouldn't it be a good lead-in to 30 Rock?

Maybe I'm not paying attention but I didn't think The Office was hurting for viewers...


----------



## secondclaw (Oct 3, 2004)

I've been giving this show a try every so often, even got one of my near-empty dvr's to keep recording it. Unfortunately I really cannot get into it, no matter how much I like the actors. Every time I watch it I just wonder why people find it so interesting and funny - granted there are laughs ... but not enough to justify me spending time on it.


----------



## justen_m (Jan 15, 2004)

I can't say I dislike it, or like, because I've never watched even a single episode. I just don't watch sitcoms. Also, a show about behind the scenes antics of a sketch comedy just doesn't have any appeal to me. Of course, lack of a plot didn't hurt Seinfeld or Cheers.

Nothing about it looked good enough for me to watch the premier, so I just decide to pass on this show. I'm not going to bother picking it up now.

[edit] I mean I don't watch any sitcoms on the major networks. I watch Southpark and It's Always Sunny in Philadelphia. Maybe it is a scheduling issue - those two shows are very late here - they start an hour after major network primetime ends. Up until recently I only had two tuners.


----------



## SullyND (Dec 30, 2004)

I don't like the actors or the characters. I also don't find it remotely funny.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

Turtleboy said:


> Is it too New York for the rest of the country? Jack would certainly think so.





TiVo'Brien said:


> Ever notice 30 Rock has a bit of class elitism?





DevdogAZ said:


> In addition, I think there's something to the fact that it's a little too smartass, a little too sarcastic, and a little too NYC for the masses. There are just far too many "in jokes" for those that are familiar with NYC and the entertainment industry for it to be accessible to the everyman. Like I said, I enjoy the show, but it's not for everyone.


All of these, but especially the last one. 30 Rock is smartass, smug, self-referential, absurd and very "in joke." Shows like Modern Family, The Office and even Arrested Development are able to balance those traits with straight characters, moments and sweet stories and relationships. But in 30 Rock, everything is absurd. I enjoy the show, but I get so tired of the winking at the camera about how cool and self-aware they are. Look we can make a funny joke about product placement! Look we can make a funny joke about continuity! LOOK AT HOW FUNNY WE ARE1!!!111!!!1!!!

Some people just don't have the patience for that and without the sweet to balance the absurd, there is nothing there for them. Every episode of 30 Rock is just a series of running gags, there is nothing to get invested in and no reason for people to come back.

I thought 30 Rock was a lot better the first season or two. Lately, it is just too absurd.


----------



## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

I thought it was doing well 
We like it. 
Could do without Tracey but will gladly put up with him for Jack/Liz/Kenneth.


----------



## Kablemodem (May 26, 2001)

I record 30 Rock along with all the other Thursday night NBC shows, but it is the last one I watch, sometimes weeks later. I often find it funny, but it's not a show that I look forward to each week.


----------



## jsmeeker (Apr 2, 2001)

DevdogAZ said:


> In addition, I think there's something to the fact that it's a little too smartass, a little too sarcastic, and a little too NYC for the masses. There are just far too many "in jokes" for those that are familiar with NYC and the entertainment industry for it to be accessible to the everyman. Like I said, I enjoy the show, but it's not for everyone.


Is it like "Entourage"? I got a kick out of that show because of the amount of time I spent in Los Angeles, and specifically in the area where a lot of the show happens. I was familiar with a lot of the places. If I had never been there or didn't like it, I could see how I would not like the show so much.

FWIW, I've never watched "30 Rock"


----------



## DougF (Mar 18, 2003)

I've never watched it. I think it's because it's intelligent TV and I'm too dumb to get it if I did watch it.


----------



## Enrique (May 15, 2006)

I started watching it a year or so back, but I lost track of which episode was the last I saw so I didn't feel like searching for it.


----------



## Todd (Oct 7, 1999)

For me, I watched the first 20 minutes of the first episode and turned it off. I thought it was awful. Maybe it's improved since then, but I never bothered with it again.


----------



## Peter000 (Apr 15, 2002)

DevdogAZ said:


> there was no better sitcom in the history of TV than Arrested Development.


Hah! Now that's comedy right there. 'Cause I don't really like Arrested Development either. Never got the love for that program.

Neither of them (30 Rock or AD) are all that bad or anything, just not my cup of tea.


----------



## latrobe7 (May 1, 2005)

I don't watch sitcoms until they reach syndication.


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

To watch 30 Rock, you have to be an _active_ viewer -- you have to pay attention to every line and every scene to get the jokes and the humor. You actually (gasp) have to _think_ to enjoy this show. If you just want to sit back and be spoon-fed your humor, this show is not for you. I enjoy this show very much specifically because it's not like all other TV sitcoms which have to tell you when to laugh. This show just puts it out there, and if you get it, hilarious. If you don't, dud.


----------



## Idearat (Nov 26, 2000)

I really like the show, but it's a scheduling thing with me. I'm down to my last functioning DirecTiVo, so only 2 tuners and it doesn't make the cut. I don't watch "The Office", so to record "30 Rock" I'd have to give up an hour long show to record an 1/2 hour show. I'll catch it in reruns in the summer.

I've never understood the idiots who schedule TV. Since back in the "Seinfeld" era, 8-10 on Thursday has pbeen where they fight toe to toe, while other slots in the week go begging. There are plenty of spots open other times of the week where I'd love to have soemthing good to record. Cable channels really have them beat on this. I enjoy a few shows on FX and TNT. With multiple showings in a week I never miss one. Network shows I either try for Hulu or put in a Season Pass when the summer reruns start


----------



## laria (Sep 7, 2000)

jsmeeker said:


> Is it like "Entourage"? I got a kick out of that show because of the amount of time I spent in Los Angeles, and specifically in the area where a lot of the show happens. I was familiar with a lot of the places. If I had never been there or didn't like it, I could see how I would not like the show so much.
> 
> FWIW, I've never watched "30 Rock"


I don't think so. We've only watched the first 2 seasons, because the 3rd wasn't available on Netflix yet this summer, but most of the show takes place in 30 Rock... as in, inside the building.


----------



## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

DevdogAZ said:


> In my opinion, there was no better sitcom in the history of TV than Arrested Development.


I agree, but I'll add that I think Married... with Children comes a close second. 


Hank said:


> To watch 30 Rock, you have to be an _active_ viewer -- you have to pay attention to every line and every scene to get the jokes and the humor. You actually (gasp) have to _think_ to enjoy this show. If you just want to sit back and be spoon-fed your humor, this show is not for you. I enjoy this show very much specifically because it's not like all other TV sitcoms which have to tell you when to laugh. This show just puts it out there, and if you get it, hilarious. If you don't, dud.


So now I know why I don't "get" this show. 

Actually, I think Arrested Development ruined sit-coms for me. AD set such high marks with me that I tend to want to compare all others against it...and they just don't make the cut.


----------



## bengalfreak (Oct 20, 2002)

Magnolia88 said:


> Because it's up against _Grey's Anatomy_ and _CSI_. And most people who watch TV are already committed viewers of one of those shows.


You hit the nail right on the head. Its the same reason Fringe ratings are in the tank this year after becoming a minor hit last season. You can't put a good show up against Grey's/CSI and expect anything but bad ratings. In a few years, when those two juggernauts have had a chance to fade a bit maybe. But not now.


----------



## madscientist (Nov 12, 2003)

Bleah. Greys and CSI faded a long time ago for me. _30 Rock_ is far and away a better use of time. I'm not sure why it's important that we be able to invest in the characters: it's a half-hour comedy. It makes me laugh (a lot) and that's what's important to me. That being said, I think Liz is very "investable"... she's a fantastic character. Tracy and Jenna don't bother me that much, although I agree that the characters are limited enough that some of their shtick is getting old.


----------



## TheDewAddict (Aug 21, 2002)

I loved Arrested Development, and I love the Office and Modern Family, so by all accounts I should like 30 Rock. I've seen a few episodes, and found them somewhat humorous, but never enough where I've felt I couldn't miss the show. I guess I always thought it was trying too hard to be clever and funny and cool, whereas the Office and AD just were what they were. I've always thought 30 Rock was just too pretentious.


----------



## Jebberwocky! (Apr 16, 2005)

TB, I started to watch and liked it, then I heard it had been cancelled and I cancelled my SP - it wasn't until much later I realized I was given bad intel (from here of all places )

I have it on my Netflix instant que to watch - when I get the time.


----------



## IndyJones1023 (Apr 1, 2002)

_30 Rock_ is too clever for most people, I think. Coincidentally, I'm rewatching _Arrested Development_ via Netflix with my sons. It's their favorite show. Ever.


----------



## kaszeta (Jun 11, 2004)

It's one of those shows that I somehow never even thought to watch, until I watched it on a business trip (where I don't have my DVR) and got hooked.

Like Indy, to me it has a lot of the same appeal that Arrested Devel had.


----------



## leeherman (Nov 5, 2007)

I've been watching the show but I don't find it consistantly funny. Most of the humor is way too obvious.

While I disagree with Alec Baldwin's politics and he's gotten press for being a bit of an a$$, he's the main reason I watch the show.

LH


----------



## 6079 Smith W (Oct 2, 2000)

I wouldn't have a problem with a show that's considered too "intelligent", "sarcastic" or "elitist/NYC", because frankly, I'm all 3. 

Seriously, the "no sold" for me with 30 Rock was seeing that it had a Saturday Night Live cast member in the lead role. I don't think anything remotely funny came out of SNL after the Belushi years, so I (probably unfairly) just figured this would be yet another unfunny pile of SNL garbage.

While some of the comments here make me think that I might actually enjoy 30 Rock, my interest level just isn't enough to get me to start watching.

Contrast with "Curb Your Enthusiasm" which I had ignored until this year. Now I can't get enough of it, recording every old episode I can find and/or queueing it up in Netflix.


----------



## Alfer (Aug 7, 2003)

I've watched a few episodes and the main reason I did was Alec...he is funny as hell.

Some of the other characters are amusing but Tracey and Jane Krakowski are too annoying IMO.

The humor seems too high brow if you will for the masses to enjoy or care about...it's mainly a show for folks who work on TV shows etc because they get a lot more of the "humor" of the situations etc...heck I think even EW mentioned something along these lines when they talked about the show.

The masses don't want "insider jokes" or things similar...they want simple...be it comedy schtick like Big Bang or Two and Half Men or run of the mill procedural stuff like The Mentalist, CSI, etc...not to mention their cravings for reality shows.

30 Rock will probably continue on just fine without the masses for a while longer...it's won plenty of awards and should be proud of it's staff etc for making the best of it...it's just not the type of humor that most of America likes/enjoys.


----------



## vman41 (Jun 18, 2002)

6079 Smith W said:


> Seriously, the "no sold" for me with 30 Rock was seeing that it had a Saturday Night Live cast member in the lead role. I don't think anything remotely funny came out of SNL after the Belushi years, so I (probably unfairly) just figured this would be yet another unfunny pile of SNL garbage.


Oh come on. Eddie Murphy wasn't remotely funny? Dana Carvey wasn't remotely funny? Phil Hartman wasn't remotely funny? Daryl Hammond wasn't remotely funny?


----------



## wouldworker (Sep 7, 2004)

Magnolia88 said:


> Because it's up against _Grey's Anatomy_ and _CSI_. And most people who watch TV are already committed viewers of one of those shows.


I don't think there would be much overlap in the viewers of Grey's Anatomy and 30 Rock even if they weren't up against each other.



> Because a lot of people don't think it's funny.


That's why they don't watch.



> And they talk so darn fast, it's hard to even understand them sometimes. There's no laugh track that tells the audience when there's a punch line and when they're supposed to laugh.


And that's why they don't think it's funny. A lot of people watch sitcoms by waiting for the laugh track and then retrieving the joke from short-term memory. Cell phones and Hot Pockets are what really consume their attention.


----------



## TIVOSciolist (Oct 13, 2003)

hummingbird_206 said:


> I watched the first few eps and didn't enjoy it.


I watched the first episode and didn't think that it was funny. I didn't watch it again until Al Gore had a guest appearance. Since then, I have not missed an episode. Very funny stuff.


----------



## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

vman41 said:


> Oh come on. Eddie Murphy wasn't remotely funny? Dana Carvey wasn't remotely funny? Phil Hartman wasn't remotely funny? Daryl Hammond wasn't remotely funny?


Don't forget Jimmy Fallon! :up:


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

TheDewAddict said:


> *I've always thought 30 Rock was just too pretentious.*


YES! Exactly.


----------



## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

I recently saw the episode with Jeff Dunham. Is that's what's funny these days?


----------



## IJustLikeTivo (Oct 3, 2001)

Turtleboy said:


> 30 Rock is one of the smartest, funniest, best written shows on TV. The combo of Tina Fey and Alec Baldwin and Tracy Morgan just works.
> 
> But yet, the ratings are constantly crappy. It's not like people haven't heard of it. It's been on four years and won Emmys.
> 
> ...


Two words. Tracy Morgan. Not funny. Write him out and I'd watch a lot more. I FF all his scenes. I find it completely implausible that anyone could be as clueless as his character is and that ruins it for me.


----------



## wouldworker (Sep 7, 2004)

IJustLikeTivo said:


> Two words. Tracy Morgan. Not funny. Write him out and I'd watch a lot more. I FF all his scenes. I find it completely implausible that anyone could be as clueless as his character is and that ruins it for me.


It's an absurdist farce. It's not supposed to be plausible. None of it. Not one single moment of the show is supposed to be plausible.


----------



## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

Sheinhardt-Universal - now that's plausible!


----------



## Legion (Aug 24, 2005)

I never miss it and I have my iPod loaded with every episode from Seasons 1-3. Watching Season 2 Episode 3 as I type this. Jack just gave his cookie jar collection to Kenneth. Should I of spoilerized that? SOrry.

Anyway......great show. Donaghey is one of the best sit come characters ever created. The whole show is fantastic. I always wonder how many of the bits are taken from behind the scenes/real life. Truth stranger than fiction kind of thing.


----------



## eddyj (Jun 20, 2002)

I used to watch it, but Tracy would really bug me, and at some point I just stopped watching. I did like the Fey/Baldwin interactions best of all.


----------



## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

One reason -- Baldwin.


----------



## TIVO_GUY_HERE (Jul 10, 2000)

I watch it but it piles up before I get to it. Why I don't watch... 2 words

Tracy Morgan.


----------



## Steeler Mike (May 5, 2005)

I know a lot of actors are liberal & I'm fine with that, but I look at Tina Fey & Alec Baldwin & to me they REALLY represent outspoken leaders of the looney far left fringe, & can't stand to watch them. 

The Office is my favorite show, so I often watch the first 5 minutes of 30 Rock, & have tried to get into it, but that is about all I can stand before I think its stupid & turn the channel.


----------



## kdelande (Dec 17, 2001)

Couldn't make it past half-way in the pilot and have never returned.

KD


----------



## swinca (Jun 19, 2003)

I've watched it a few times and thought it was pretty funny. But I don't like Tracy Morgan to the point that he makes the show unwatchable for me.


----------



## IndyJones1023 (Apr 1, 2002)

For those who bailed on the first episode - try it again. The first 2 or 3 episodes were disastrous. It became an entirely new show after that. MUCH funnier.


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

IJustLikeTivo said:


> Two words. Tracy Morgan. Not funny. Write him out and I'd watch a lot more. I FF all his scenes. I find it completely implausible that anyone could be as clueless as his character is and that ruins it for me.


Tiny Fey says that the Tracy Morgan character is 90% based on real-life stuff from the SNL days. He really is that freaky.

But I still agree with everyone else, Less Jenna, More Tina! Less Tracy, more Jack!


----------



## Ereth (Jun 16, 2000)

wouldworker said:


> It's an absurdist farce.


Hmmm. Perhaps that's why I don't like it.

I tried it. I didn't enjoy it. I thought the pilot was mildly interesting until Tracy Morgan came on and I hated him immediately.

I could never understand why it survived and Studio 60 was cancelled. Studio 60 was the superior show in my mind, and it has many of the same features mentioned by fans here (fast talking, witty, self-referential).

When we hit reruns last season, I figured I'd give 30 Rock another shot, since it was still on and had won some awards. And I simply didn't enjoy it. I didn't find it funny. I wasn't insulted or anything, it just didn't fit my humor (and I despise laugh tracks, so it's not that). I can't really say why, I just didn't enjoy watching it.


----------



## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

> Why don't people watch 30 Rock?


I don't know; why *do* people watch "I'm A Celebrity, Get Me Out Of Here"?


----------



## zuko3984 (May 4, 2002)

Why is it that when people try to defend shows like 30 rock or arrested development they almost always say things like "it's smart comedy' or "you need to think to like this show" or things along those lines. It's like they are implying that if you don't like this show you must be dumb. 

Maybe people just have different taste and especially in comedy what is funny to one person is not to another.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

jsmeeker said:


> Is it like "Entourage"? I got a kick out of that show because of the amount of time I spent in Los Angeles, and specifically in the area where a lot of the show happens. I was familiar with a lot of the places. If I had never been there or didn't like it, I could see how I would not like the show so much.
> 
> FWIW, I've never watched "30 Rock"


No, it's not like that at all. Can't really describe the difference, but I really enjoy the behind-the-scenes aspects and entertainment industry references of Entourage, while on 30 Rock they're just different.


Idearat said:


> I've never understood the idiots who schedule TV. Since back in the "Seinfeld" era, 8-10 on Thursday has pbeen where they fight toe to toe, while other slots in the week go begging. There are plenty of spots open other times of the week where I'd love to have soemthing good to record. Cable channels really have them beat on this. I enjoy a few shows on FX and TNT. With multiple showings in a week I never miss one. Network shows I either try for Hulu or put in a Season Pass when the summer reruns start


It's as simple as this. The networks are able to charge more for ads on Thursday nights than on any other night of the week, because advertisers want to reach the audience before the weekend (movies, sales, etc.). Therefore, in order to maximize advertising revenue, the networks have to put their best shows on Thursday night, despite the fact that they're all competing against one another.


----------



## YCantAngieRead (Nov 5, 2003)

TIVOSciolist said:


> I watched the first episode and didn't think that it was funny. I didn't watch it again until Al Gore had a guest appearance. Since then, I have not missed an episode. Very funny stuff.


I've said a million times...the pilot of 30 Rock SUCKED. I hated it. And yet, I gave it a few more episodes and now it's my favorite show.



Turtleboy said:


> I recently saw the episode with Jeff Dunham. Is that's what's funny these days?


No. As much as I love this show, that episode sucked. I hate Jeff Dunham.


----------



## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

zuko3984 said:


> Why is it that when people try to defend shows like 30 rock or arrested development they almost always say things like "it's smart comedy' or "you need to think to like this show" or things along those lines. It's like they are implying that if you don't like this show you must be dumb.
> 
> Maybe people just have different taste and especially in comedy what is funny to one person is not to another.


It's possible for smart people to dislike the show. No one is saying otherwise.

It's just that it's impossible for dumb people to like it.


----------



## leeherman (Nov 5, 2007)

Turtleboy said:


> I recently saw the episode with Jeff Dunham. Is that's what's funny these days?


Guess I must be one of the dumb people who don't get intelligent humor as that was probably my favorite episode.

LH


----------



## Neenahboy (Apr 8, 2004)

Took me a long time to get past the pilot, but since I did it's become a show that I watch regularly (I bet that's something I'll be saying about Parks and Recreation eventually, but the wounds are still too fresh  ). Still, I have to be in a certain mood before I can stomach Tracy Morgan and Jane Krakowski for 22 minutes, and that often takes several weeks to build up.


----------



## SorenTodd (May 26, 2009)

I prefer "dysfunctional family" type sitcoms (like Home Improvement, Malcolm, or Bill Engvall Show), so 30 Rock just doesn't cut it for me. Watched the first season and realized that it just wasn't all that funny.


----------



## classicX (May 10, 2006)

I've seen clips and always thought it was hilarious but I suppose I didn't want to jump into the show in the middle without knowing the back story.

Which seems weird, since I jumped into "The Office" and I didn't know that back story either. Maybe I'll give it a go.


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

SullyND said:


> I don't like the actors or the characters. I also don't find it remotely funny.


Same here. Well, I like Alec Baldwin, but none of the others.

It's just too silly and not remotely connected to the real world for it to be funny to me. Of course, I've only seen one episode, but based on that I don't know what could be considered "well written" in it. I thought it was just dumb.


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

Zevida said:


> 30 Rock is smartass, smug, self-referential, absurd and very "in joke." Shows like Modern Family, The Office and even Arrested Development are able to balance those traits with straight characters, moments and sweet stories and relationships. But in 30 Rock, everything is absurd. I enjoy the show, but I get so tired of the winking at the camera about how cool and self-aware they are. Look we can make a funny joke about product placement! Look we can make a funny joke about continuity! LOOK AT HOW FUNNY WE ARE1!!!111!!!1!!!


And this.  Way too desperate for a laugh.


----------



## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

IndyJones1023 said:


> For those who bailed on the first episode - try it again. The first 2 or 3 episodes were disastrous. It became an entirely new show after that. MUCH funnier.


Sorry, but no it doesn't. Tried it several times...same result....stinko.


----------



## StacieH (Jan 2, 2009)

For me the main reason is that I&#8217;m not a fan of sketch comedy (SNL hasn&#8217;t been funny in eons), and am not interested in watching a fictional show that takes place behind the scenes of a sketch comedy show.

I realized not too long ago that I watch only a few comedies, period. I&#8217;m more interested in dramas.


----------



## jeepair (Apr 22, 2004)

Bierboy said:


> One reason -- Baldwin.


This.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Neenahboy said:


> Took me a long time to get past the pilot, but since I did it's become a show that I watch regularly (I bet that's something I'll be saying about Parks and Recreation eventually, but the wounds are still too fresh  ). Still, I have to be in a certain mood before I can stomach Tracy Morgan and Jane Krakowski for 22 minutes, and that often takes several weeks to build up.


If you're enjoying P&R, you should check out Alan Sepinwall's blog post for the most recent episode, as well as the comments. It appears that some people are really enjoying P&R this season.


StacieH said:


> For me the main reason is that Im not a fan of sketch comedy (SNL hasnt been funny in eons), and am not interested in watching a fictional show that takes place behind the scenes of a sketch comedy show.
> 
> I realized not too long ago that I watch only a few comedies, period. Im more interested in dramas.


While there's still a chance you may not like the show, don't discount it solely because it takes place at a sketch show. There is very, very little of the 30 Rock show that has anything to do with the actual content of the TGS show.


----------



## DreadPirateRob (Nov 12, 2002)

Bierboy said:


> Sorry, but no it doesn't. Tried it several times...same result....stinko.


No, actually it does. You're wrong.  I barely made it through the pilot because it was so unfunny, but by the end of the first season it had become one of my favorite shows. It's not quite as good now as it has been in the past, but it's still a great show.

That said, it's not for everyone. It's fairly high-brow and absurdist in its comedy, which doesn't appeal to a lot of people who like their laughs more predictable. And yes, it is "smart" comedy. That doesn't mean that if you don't like it you're not smart (although it might ), but it does mean that many people are simply not going to get it.

And I live by the beach in SoCal, which means I'm about as far from being a NY insider as anyone, but I don't have any problem "getting" the show as long as I'm paying attention.


----------



## cmaasfamily (Jan 26, 2006)

30Rock holds the record for most SP's set up and then deleted in my house. And probably most episodes recorded but never watched.

It is an odd thing. I travel on long haul international flights a lot and frequently there are a couple of 30R episode on the in-flight entertainment system. I watch 'em. I love 'em. I laugh out loud. I get home and set a SP - and almost never watch or watch 10 minutes of an episode and delete the SP. Repeat.

So, a couple of things are going on:

1) the few episodes that make it to in-flight are cherry picked, best-of; suggesting there may be inconsistency, and 
2) there is something to the "must pay attention to really get it" line of discussion postulated here. 'cause there sure aren't many distractions midway through a 12-15 hour flight.


----------



## billypritchard (May 7, 2001)

It's too witty for dumb-ass america.



Actually, since it's so absurd, I don't know that I consider it witty. Some of the stuff is plain stupid humor. But I do love it.

And I don't really get the 'liberal elite' aspect of why people don't like it. Are Baldwin and Fey liberal types? Yes. But the show skewers left and right alike. Jack often wins the day with his point of view, and he's the conservative. It's like the show wants to take digs at the right, but in the end they think the right will win anyway.

The above mentioned Kia Sorrento joke was completely making fun of east coast snobbery. They do that all the time.


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

DreadPirateRob said:


> And I live by the beach in SoCal, which means I'm about as far from being a NY insider as anyone


Maybe geographically, but not culturally. SoCal is way closer to the east coast than is much of the country that lies between the two.

The characters on 30 Rock, save one, are self-centered and unlikeable. The one who isn't a self-centered, unlikeable elitist is portrayed as a complete rube.

It's not about left and right. It's about urban and not urban.

Though, people said the same thing about the characters in Seinfeld (though, no rube), but it did extremely well in the ratings despite it.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

> * Frank:* Tracy, did you hear? Fred Dawkins, the incredibly overweight guy Pac-man was based off of died.
> 
> *Tracy:* I will eat a bowl of cherries and some ghost meat in his honor.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

aindik said:


> Maybe geographically, but not culturally. SoCal is way closer to the east coast than is much of the country that lies between the two.
> 
> The characters on 30 Rock, save one, are self-centered and unlikeable. The one who isn't a self-centered, unlikeable elitist is portrayed as a complete rube.
> 
> ...


Or this (except it still doesn't explain 'Seinfeld'):


> *Jack:* The American public doesn't want your elitist, east coast, alternative, intellectual, left wing-
> 
> *Liz:* Jack, just say Jewish, this is taking forever.


----------



## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

MickeS said:


> Of course, I've only seen one episode, but based on that I don't know what could be considered "well written" in it. I thought it was just dumb.


So you're opinion is based upon the same sort of information as Alfer's on Macs, right?


----------



## Alfer (Aug 7, 2003)

Turtleboy said:


> So you're opinion is based upon the same sort of information as Alfer's on Macs, right?


Nice zing there Turtle!!


:up:


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

Turtleboy said:


> So you're opinion is based upon the same sort of information as Alfer's on Macs, right?


Probably... 30 minutes of actual use and then a seemingly endless stream of commercials and promos everywhere? 

If I don't like a show from the beginning I won't force myself to watch it after that. Too much stuff that I DO like from the beginning that I can watch instead.


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

BrettStah said:


> Or this (except it still doesn't explain 'Seinfeld'):
> 
> 
> > *Jack:* The American public doesn't want your elitist, east coast, alternative, intellectual, left wing-
> ...


Is Liz Lemon supposed to be Jewish? The main 5 actors aren't Jewish, and the three male characters definitely aren't.

By contrast, all the characters on Seinfeld acted out all the Jewish stereotypes, even if they (absurdly) gave them names like Costanza and Benes.


----------



## Magnolia88 (Jul 1, 2005)

Liz Lemon isn't Jewish. She's from small town Pa, and her family is basic middle American protestant. That's one of the many reasons Jack mocks her, her very white-bread middle-class small town USA background.

_ETA:_ I didn't think of Elaine Benes as any kind of "Jewish stereotype" either. She was from Towson, MD, and was supposed to be from an upper class finishing school type of family. Jerry makes fun of her in that episode about the mohel (sp?).

_The finest finishing schools on the eastern seaboard, equestrian competitions, debutante balls . . . and look at you now, interviewing mohels._ Or something like that.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

Anyone hungry for some chuckles?


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

aindik said:


> Is Liz Lemon supposed to be Jewish? The main 5 actors aren't Jewish, and the three male characters definitely aren't.
> 
> By contrast, all the characters on Seinfeld acted out all the Jewish stereotypes, even if they (absurdly) gave them names like Costanza and Benes.


No clue - I'll have to ask JPriller.


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

BrettStah said:


> No clue - I'll have to ask JPriller.


Wow, two references in one thread to a guy who hasn't posted here in years.


----------



## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

DreadPirateRob said:


> ....It's fairly high-brow and absurdist in its comedy, which doesn't appeal to a lot of people who like their laughs more predictable. And yes, it is "smart" comedy. That doesn't mean that if you don't like it you're not smart (although it might ), but it does mean that many people are simply not going to get it.....


That's the most absurd post I've ever seen. We'll agree to disagree on this, but to claim that it's a "high-brow" and "smart" comedy is asinine. When you come down from your perch, let me know....:down: :down: :down:


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

I guess I'm on the same high-up perch as DPR. Great view up here.


----------



## IndyJones1023 (Apr 1, 2002)

If anyone's view is skewed, it's Bierboy. It's okay to not like a show, but your opinions seem very out of whack to me.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

IndyJones1023 said:


> If anyone's view is skewed, it's Bierboy. It's okay to not like a show, but your opinions seem very out of whack to me.


Some people are special, like a black stripper with blue eyes.


----------



## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

IndyJones1023 said:


> If anyone's view is skewed, it's Bierboy. It's okay to not like a show, but your opinions seem very out of whack to me.


Thank you....I don't march to the same drummer as everyone else around here seems to... This show ranks very high on my suck-o-meter.


----------



## daveak (Mar 23, 2009)

Bierboy said:


> Thank you....I don't march to the same drummer as everyone else around here seems to... This show ranks very high on my suck-o-meter.


This.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

aindik said:


> Is Liz Lemon supposed to be Jewish? The main 5 actors aren't Jewish, and the three male characters definitely aren't.
> 
> By contrast, all the characters on Seinfeld acted out all the Jewish stereotypes, even if they (absurdly) gave them names like Costanza and Benes.





Magnolia88 said:


> Liz Lemon isn't Jewish. She's from small town Pa, and her family is basic middle American protestant. That's one of the many reasons Jack mocks her, her very white-bread middle-class small town USA background.
> 
> _ETA:_ I didn't think of Elaine Benes as any kind of "Jewish stereotype" either. She was from Towson, MD, and was supposed to be from an upper class finishing school type of family. Jerry makes fun of her in that episode about the mohel (sp?).
> 
> _The finest finishing schools on the eastern seaboard, equestrian competitions, debutante balls . . . and look at you now, interviewing mohels._ Or something like that.


Wasn't there an episode all about how Elaine was a "shiksa," or non-Jewish girlfriend of a Jewish guy?


----------



## smak (Feb 11, 2000)

aindik said:


> Maybe geographically, but not culturally. SoCal is way closer to the east coast than is much of the country that lies between the two.
> 
> The characters on 30 Rock, save one, are self-centered and unlikeable. The one who isn't a self-centered, unlikeable elitist is portrayed as a complete rube.


And this is one of the things i will never get. Who cares if they are unlikeable? It's not a tearjerker, it's a comedy.

-smak-


----------



## sooperkool (Mar 18, 2009)

its not funny to me and I'm not a fan of "mushmouth" Tracy Morgan


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

I think that I hated every single sketch that Tracy Morgan was in on SNL. I was completely surprised at the fact that I find him to be hilarious on '30 Rock'.


----------



## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

Bierboy said:


> That's the most absurd post I've ever seen. We'll agree to disagree on this, but to claim that it's a "high-brow" and "smart" comedy is asinine. When you come down from your perch, let me know....:down: :down: :down:





Bierboy said:


> Thank you....I don't march to the same drummer as everyone else around here seems to... This show ranks very high on my suck-o-meter.


Bierboy, you are certainly entitled to your opinion, and I agree that the show ranks high on the suck-o-meter. But was the Attack on Dev's opinion really necessary? Seems mean-spirited and unnecessary to me.

Edit, opps, meant Dread's, not Dev's!


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

BrettStah said:


> I think that I hated every single sketch that Tracy Morgan was in on SNL. I was completely surprised at the fact that I find him to be hilarious on '30 Rock'.


I hated every single sketch he was on on SNL too, but I also hate every scene he is in on 30 Rock!


----------



## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

Bierboy said:


> That's the most absurd post I've ever seen. We'll agree to disagree on this, but to claim that it's a "high-brow" and "smart" comedy is asinine. When you come down from your perch, let me know....:down: :down: :down:


But it is high-brow and smart comedy.

A puppet saying "I keel you" might be funny, but is not high-brow.


----------



## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

I tend to like my humor quite subtle, based more on sarcasm, irony, and amusing wordplay and less on broad situational comedy, in-your-face jokes, and overly expressive body language and facial reactions. I also tend to like where comedy flows more naturally into the story, and where the story is allowed to become more serious if required.

Hence, I'm not a fan of 30 Rock. I am particularly put off by Tracy Morgan, who is worse than nails on chalkboard to me. He demonstrates virtually everything I hate about traditional American-style comedy.

(Oh, and for the record, I also hated Arrested Development; I found that show insufferably smug and way too in love with itself. To use a phrase that "the kids" are using these days, I'd say that AD was one of the douchiest shows I've ever seen.)


----------



## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

LoadStar said:


> I To use a phrase that "the kids" are using these days, I'd say that AD was one of the douchiest shows I've ever seen.)


I didn't know that you could say that!

Douchiest
******
******bag.

Aha!


----------



## DreadPirateRob (Nov 12, 2002)

Bierboy said:


> That's the most absurd post I've ever seen. We'll agree to disagree on this, but to claim that it's a "high-brow" and "smart" comedy is asinine. When you come down from your perch, let me know....:down: :down: :down:


So we'll agree to disagree, but then you accuse me of being up on a perch? How exactly does that work? How about this - I'll agree to disagree with you, and I'll even do so while being civil about it. You should try it sometime.

I don't see that what I wrote was derogatory in any way - I didn't insult you (or anyone else who doesn't like the show). All I said was that 30 Rock is high-brow and absurdist, and that it is "smart" comedy, because that is exactly what it is. That doesn't mean that if you don't like it then you must be dumb, it just means that you have to watch it closely and without distraction to pick up on a lot of the jokes. You may not think it is funny, and that is certainly your right, but there is no denying the type of comedy that it is attempting to be. It is on the (far) opposite side of the comedy spectrum from say, Larry the Cable Guy.


----------



## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

latrobe7 said:


> I don't watch sitcoms until they reach syndication.


Then you're missing at least a few minutes of each episode cut out for more commercials.


----------



## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

SorenTodd said:


> I prefer "dysfunctional family" type sitcoms (like Home Improvement, Malcolm, or Bill Engvall Show), so 30 Rock just doesn't cut it for me. Watched the first season and realized that it just wasn't all that funny.


But "30 Rock" is a dysfunctional family....
Liz & Jack are the parents
Tracy & Jenna are the unruly kids..

the rest of the staff on the show are, I dunno, annoying neighbors or cousins..

I'm mostly joking with this comparison.. but it sort of fits (esp with the Liz & Jack subplot in this last episode using the romantic cliches for a business relationship).

I think I agree with a lot of the other comments in the thread.. I think this show is intellectual in some ways, and also *very goofy* in other ways.

I disliked Tracy on SNL, but *some* of the stuff he does on this show is funny.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

LoadStar said:


> I tend to like my humor quite subtle, based more on sarcasm, irony, and amusing wordplay and less on broad situational comedy, in-your-face jokes, and overly expressive body language and facial reactions. I also tend to like where comedy flows more naturally into the story, and where the story is allowed to become more serious if required.
> 
> Hence, I'm not a fan of 30 Rock. I am particularly put off by Tracy Morgan, who is worse than nails on chalkboard to me. He demonstrates virtually everything I hate about traditional American-style comedy.
> 
> (Oh, and for the record, I also hated Arrested Development; I found that show insufferably smug and way too in love with itself. To use a phrase that "the kids" are using these days, I'd say that AD was one of the douchiest shows I've ever seen.)


What are some sitcoms that you do find funny, if you don't mind me asking?


----------



## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

BrettStah said:


> What are some sitcoms that you do find funny, if you don't mind me asking?


Not many at all, to be honest. Scrubs is probably the best, I guess... that, or Sports Night (though that's more of a "drama-dy" than a straight sitcom).


----------



## jsmeeker (Apr 2, 2001)

I'M BRIAN FELLOW!!!!



yeah. I can see how that could get a little annoying.


----------



## bengalfreak (Oct 20, 2002)

wouldworker said:


> I don't think there would be much overlap in the viewers of Grey's Anatomy and 30 Rock even if they weren't up against each other.


You would think there would be very little overlap between viewers of Fringe and Grey's also. But since moving to Thursdays, Fringe ratings have been abysmal.


----------



## Jesda (Feb 12, 2005)

The pacing makes it hard to enjoy 30 Rock in the background. I have to get off the internet and focus to pick up on all the subtle gags. Its rewarding though.


----------



## justen_m (Jan 15, 2004)

bengalfreak said:


> You would think there would be very little overlap between viewers of Fringe and Grey's also. But since moving to Thursdays, Fringe ratings have been abysmal.


I think there is overlap between Fringe and CSI viewers. Heck, I know that I record and watch both. CSI is no slouch in the ratings.


----------



## scooterboy (Mar 27, 2001)

LoadStar said:


> (Oh, and for the record, I also hated Arrested Development; I found that show insufferably smug and way too in love with itself. To use a phrase that "the kids" are using these days, I'd say that AD was one of the douchiest shows I've ever seen.)


Does. Not. Compute. 

"Insufferably smug and way too in love with itself"? I don't get that from AD. I easily see how someone could get that from 30 Rock, but not AD. As previously mentioned, 30 Rock sometimes winks at the cameras and makes inside industry jokes but I don't recall AD doing that.

Not trying to change your mind about how good or bad AD was - different strokes and all. I'm just honestly curious about how you think AD earns that description.


----------



## JoeTiVo (Jun 25, 2001)

Steeler Mike said:


> I know a lot of actors are liberal & I'm fine with that, but I look at Tina Fey & Alec Baldwin & to me they REALLY represent outspoken leaders of the looney far left fringe, & can't stand to watch them.


That's my reason. I MIGHT have been able to stomach one of them, but not the both of them in one show. Was never interested in checking it out.


----------



## sushikitten (Jan 28, 2005)

I wanted to watch it, but I think I had a conflict--and at the time, only one tuner (we now have three). I'd like to watch it, but since I'm so far behind, it would be difficult to get caught up, as we have a hard enough time watching our current shows. (And, I'm one of those people who have to watch the eps, from the beginning, in order.)

In fact, I have to hurry up and watch the first two episodes of Glee online, otherwise I will just end up deleting the other 7 or so eps that have recorded because it just feels too overwhelming to catch up.


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

DevdogAZ said:


> Wasn't there an episode all about how Elaine was a "shiksa," or non-Jewish girlfriend of a Jewish guy?


The characters of George and Elaine were given non-Jewish names and were not supposed to be Jewish. However, both were portrayed by Jewish actors, inspired by/based on real life Jewish people, and (much more so George than Elaine, and even more so George's parents than George himself) were written and portrayed with Jewish mannerisms and stereotypes. It was almost like they didn't think the country could accept a show where all the lead characters were Jewish, so they made two not Jewish but wrote them as if they were.

BTW, "shiksa" just means non-Jewish woman. A non-Jewish woman is a "shiksa" whether she dates/marries a Jewish man or not. The Seinfeld episode was about "shiksa-peal," an attraction of Jewish men to non-Jewish women. (I think that term is something Jerry Seinfeld and Larry David made up).


----------



## DougF (Mar 18, 2003)

LoadStar said:


> ...(Oh, and for the record, I also hated Arrested Development; I found that show insufferably smug and way too in love with itself. To use a phrase that "the kids" are using these days, I'd say that AD was one of the douchiest shows I've ever seen.)


Arrested Development was too intelligent for most people to get. Might I suggest Two and a Half Men as a show that would be more your speed?


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

aindik said:


> The characters of George and Elaine were given non-Jewish names and were not supposed to be Jewish. However, both were portrayed by Jewish actors, inspired by/based on real life Jewish people, and (much more so George than Elaine, and even more so George's parents than George himself) were written and portrayed with Jewish mannerisms and stereotypes. It was almost like they didn't think the country could accept a show where all the lead characters were Jewish, so they made two not Jewish but wrote them as if they were.
> 
> BTW, "shiksa" just means non-Jewish woman. A non-Jewish woman is a "shiksa" whether she dates/marries a Jewish man or not. The Seinfeld episode was about "shiksa-peal," an attraction of Jewish men to non-Jewish women. (I think that term is something Jerry Seinfeld and Larry David made up).


Thanks. I did always think that George and his parents were portrayed as Jewish, but I never got that from Elaine or Kramer. Are you saying that the character of Kramer was actually Jewish? I don't recall that ever coming up during the show.


----------



## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

DevdogAZ said:


> Thanks. I did always think that George and were portrayed as Jewish, but I never got that from Elaine or Kramer. Are you saying that the character of Kramer was actually Jewish? I don't recall that ever coming up during the show.


I'm just basing that on the name "Kramer" being a Jewish name.


----------



## Ereth (Jun 16, 2000)

Just wondering out loud, but perhaps it's one of those shows where it's better if you've watched all the episodes in order? Some shows take a while to get into and you really can't jump into them mid way and appreciate it (Babylon 5 comes to mind). I have many shows that I love that I know my friends didn't enjoy because they didn't watch from the beginning. I know I disliked "Buffy the Vampire Slayer" when I watched the occasional episode, but fell in love with it when they replayed it from the beginning, even though you had to sit through some bad episodes to get to the better stuff, the background and setup were necessary to truly appreciate the later stuff.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

aindik said:


> I'm just basing that on the name "Kramer" being a Jewish name.


Ah, didn't realize that. Not having grown up around many Jewish people, the only names I recognize as being Jewish are the obvious ones that end in "stein," "baum," "berg," "feld," etc. (Interesting that those are all German nouns describing physical geographic items/places.)


Ereth said:


> Just wondering out loud, but perhaps it's one of those shows where it's better if you've watched all the episodes in order? Some shows take a while to get into and you really can't jump into them mid way and appreciate it (Babylon 5 comes to mind). I have many shows that I love that I know my friends didn't enjoy because they didn't watch from the beginning. I know I disliked "Buffy the Vampire Slayer" when I watched the occasional episode, but fell in love with it when they replayed it from the beginning, even though you had to sit through some bad episodes to get to the better stuff, the background and setup were necessary to truly appreciate the later stuff.


While there are definitely some backstory elements to 30 Rock (Sheinhardt Wig Company, why Tracy Jordan is on The Girlie Show, etc.), I don't think most of the comedy or plot derives from a knowledge of these items. Most of the shows are pretty self-contained provided you know the general traits of each of the main characters.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

Ereth said:


> Hmmm. Perhaps that's why I don't like it.
> 
> I tried it. I didn't enjoy it. I thought the pilot was mildly interesting until Tracy Morgan came on and I hated him immediately.
> 
> ...


Funny thing is when Studio 60 and 30 Rock were both on (and of course compared with each other as their premise was similar), I like Studio 60 better. I didn't like the first 2 or 3 eps of 30 Rock. But as the series both evolved, Studio 60 became the REAL pretentious series everyone is making 30 Rock out to be, while once I got to know the characters in 30 Rock, I came to love the show. Maybe it's because I am all the things that 30 Rock appeals to...lefty, NYC, smart, etc. but I find the show a hoot and I constantly rewind to find little hidden gems I missed. I like smart sarcastic humor a lot more than something like Three and Half Men, which is the most popular sitcom, yet I find it not funny at all.

I would never think this would be a big hit, but throwing it against 2 juggernauts is a recipe for disaster.

Just remember "smart TV" rarely gets ratings. Look at the top rated shows and they all appeal to the masses. AI, Dancing with the Stars are on a level that would appeal to anyone. CSI, NCIS are typical cop shows that have appealed to the masses for 50 years. It's rare that anything "different, and smart" succeeds on network TV.


----------



## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

DevdogAZ said:


> Are you saying that the character of Kramer was actually Jewish?


"Not that there's anything wrong with that!"


----------



## JoeyJoJo (Sep 29, 2003)

I love this show so much I want to take it out behind the middle school and get it pregnant!


----------



## JoeyJoJo (Sep 29, 2003)

jsmeeker said:


> I'M BRIAN FELLOW!!!!
> 
> yeah. I can see how that could get a little annoying.


But the one where he was pissed at that parrot? Gut busting funny!


----------



## jamesbobo (Jun 18, 2000)

I wonder how many people watch this online. Since I record Supernatural and Fringe, I watch Rock and Office at nbc.com. 
Does online viewing count in the ratings? I'm sure NBC knows how many shows are downloaded.


----------



## jdedit2001 (Mar 23, 2004)

I just now got the Pac Man joke that Bierboy quoted, despite having watched that episode twice.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

jdedit2001 said:


> I just now got the Pac Man joke that Bierboy quoted, despite having watched that episode twice.


I think that was me (in post #79). Bierboy doesn't like 30 Rock.


----------



## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

BrettStah said:


> I think that was me (in post #79). Bierboy doesn't like 30 Rock.


----------



## jsmeeker (Apr 2, 2001)

JoeyJoJo said:


> But the one where he was pissed at that parrot? Gut busting funny!


That bird is CRAZY!!

( i think that is how it went)


----------



## StanSimmons (Jun 10, 2000)

Turtleboy said:


> 30 Rock is one of the smartest, funniest, best written shows on TV. *The combo of Tina Fey and Alec Baldwin and Tracy Morgan just works.
> *
> But yet, the ratings are constantly crappy. It's not like people haven't heard of it. It's been on four years and won Emmys.
> 
> ...


I find Tracy Morgan extremely unfunny and very annoying. Alec Baldwin just seems smarmy all the time... and Tina Fey... I can watch her if the sound is off.

I've watched maybe 5 eps of 30 Rock and just couldn't get over my dislike of Tracy Morgan's acting style to be able to stomach the show.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

I love '30 Rock' so much I wanna take it back behind the middle school and get it pregnant.


----------



## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

JoeyJoJo said:


> I love this show so much I want to take it out behind the middle school and get it pregnant!





BrettStah said:


> I love '30 Rock' so much I wanna take it back behind the middle school and get it pregnant.


IOW... you agree with Joey.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

busyba said:


> IOW... you agree with Joey.


You're next, right after I'm done with '30 Rock'.


----------



## realityboy (Jun 13, 2003)

I didn't expect to like it as much as I do. It is my favorite comedy now, but I almost didn't even bother to set up a season pass when it first started. The premise really doesn't sound that great, and I hated Tracy Morgan on SNL. I do agree that it is a smart comedy, but I think some people might be turned off by how absurd it is. It's a particular mix of smart and absurd that doesn't appeal to everyone.

I really don't think the show would do any better on another night. Sure, it is against CSI and Grey's but so is The Office so at 9:30p the choice is to stay on NBC and watch or turn to one of the other networks and watch 1/2 an hourlong drama.


----------



## jsmeeker (Apr 2, 2001)

busyba said:


> IOW... you agree with Joey.


Someone is getting sloppy seconds.


----------



## pex (Oct 21, 2002)

aindik said:


> I'm just basing that on the name "Kramer" being a Jewish name.


What about "Cosmo" though. I'm going to save a few minutes of my life and restrain from googling, but isn't that a Greek name?

Back on topic, consider me another who hasn't been able to get into 30 Rock. It's okay, but just okay. I am put off by some of the characters. Sitcoms are a vanishing breed, but ones that I've liked fairly recently have been Seinfeld, Arrested Development, and (tentitively) Modern Family. Cranking it back a few more years, I recall enjoying Cheers, but when I happen across a rerun, I have absolutely _no idea_ what drew me to that show. Likewise, I remember tuning into M.A.S.H with anticipation at one time. It all seems pretty unfunny now.


----------



## JoeyJoJo (Sep 29, 2003)

C'mon! Who couldn't love Tangier the Lion??


----------



## jdedit2001 (Mar 23, 2004)

BrettStah said:


> I think that was me (in post #79). Bierboy doesn't like 30 Rock.


 Oops.....I knew it was a name that started with a B. My apologies to you both.


----------



## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

LoadStar said:


> I tend to like my humor quite subtle, based more on sarcasm, irony, and amusing wordplay and less on broad situational comedy, in-your-face jokes, and overly expressive body language and facial reactions. I also tend to like where comedy flows more naturally into the story, and where the story is allowed to become more serious if required.


hmmm... i think 30rock leans towards subtle, sarcasm, irony, amusing wordplay... i think that's what "smart" comedy is.

i think 30rock has some of the best sitcom writing on TV.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

Loved this, from a recent episode:


> *Jenna:* You probably don't know this, because you've never played a moonologist, but werewolves can only come out at night.
> 
> *Liz:* Yes, I remember that from the Thriller video.
> 
> *Tracy: *TOO SOON!


----------



## frankmint (Feb 1, 2004)

I had no idea who Tracy Jordan was before I watched 30Rock. I love the show and his character is as absurd as all the others, in my opinion. Now, if you have seen that same character (or actor who cannot act) in other shows, I can understand all the hate.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

frankmint said:


> I had no idea who Tracy Jordan was before I watched 30Rock. I love the show and his character is as absurd as all the others, in my opinion. Now, if you have seen that same character (or actor who cannot act) in other shows, I can understand all the hate.


I don't think that has anything to do with it. I had no opinion of Tracy Morgan from SNL, but I simply can't stand his character on this show. Has nothing to do with his acting ability. It's simply the ridiculousness of the character.


----------



## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

DougF said:


> Arrested Development was too intelligent for most people to get. Might I suggest Two and a Half Men as a show that would be more your speed?


Even with the original smiley, that's annoying.

I think both 30 Rock & 2.5 Men are hilarious shows.


----------



## DougF (Mar 18, 2003)

mattack said:


> Even with the original smiley, that's annoying.
> 
> I think both 30 Rock & 2.5 Men are hilarious shows.


I agree. It is annoying. It was just a poke at Loadstar for a similar post he made one time. It was also a friendly jab at the "intelligent TV" crowd.


----------



## Sacrilegium (Dec 14, 2006)

I watched an episode back in the beginning. (Was it the pilot? Was it the 2nd? The 3rd? I can't say, but one of those.) Didn't care for it.

From the way you guys describe it, I might like it now. I should give it a chance, I suppose. 

I know this is stupid, but for some reason I'm just not in a "take on a new show" mood lately. I'm afraid of TV show commitment right now. After several of my loves got canceled in the past year, I'm afraid to love again. I'll just huddle in the corner with my XBox...


----------



## lateforwork (Apr 10, 2006)

I love 30 rock! My fav person on it has to be Tracy Morgan. hes hilarious! found an interview with him here. http://video.msg.com/Videos/New-York-Knicks/0NauoL7v5DW_zhn6l_B7bFt9RuUh__Fo the interview is really annoying I don't know why he doesn't slap her


----------



## Uncle Briggs (Sep 11, 2004)

Hank said:


> You actually (gasp) have to _think_ to enjoy this show.


Wow, maybe one day I will be as enlightened as you and be able to enjoy this show.


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

Magnolia88 said:


> There's no laugh track that tells the audience when there's a punch line and when they're supposed to laugh.


That makes my heart hurt.


----------



## Lori (Feb 20, 2000)

Thought the first episode was abysmal. I have come to understand that it got better, but I really don't like Tracy Morgan, and I really don't have time for more TV.

If they wanted me, they needed to hook me early.


----------



## FilmCritic3000 (Oct 29, 2004)

I have a friend who doesn't like Alec Baldwin. That's her primary reason for not watching it. She said she's never seen him in a performance that "wowed" her (i.e. he plays the same person (himself) over and over; she says the same thing about George Clooney).


----------



## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

Your friend is a poor judge of actors.


----------



## FilmCritic3000 (Oct 29, 2004)

marksman said:


> Your friend is a poor judge of actors.


I concur. I fail to see how someone's acting ability or their merit as an actor is only equal to the number of times they turn in "different" performances.

(That being said, Cuba Gooding Jr, Eddie Murphy - get it together ASAP.)


----------



## Todd (Oct 7, 1999)

FilmCritic3000 said:


> I have a friend who doesn't like Alec Baldwin. That's her primary reason for not watching it. She said she's never seen him in a performance that "wowed" her (i.e. he plays the same person (himself) over and over; she says the same thing about George Clooney).


I can't stand Alec either. Another reason I don't watch.


----------



## mclark11 (Feb 19, 2003)

I would like a pole with the following choices
1 I don't like it
2 I like it but can't watch it because there's other shows on other networks that I prefer

My choice is 2.


----------



## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

30 Rock is a show I only watch occasionally. I only started watching it this year. The ones I have seen were extremely funny. I do wish I watched it regularly and from the beginning but I already watch too much stuff.
I'll probably make this one of the Summer shows I watch next year. If all the seasons are still on Netflix streaming, next Summer, it will make it very easy to watch.


----------



## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

mclark11 said:


> I would like a pole


North or south?


----------



## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

aaronwt said:


> 30 Rock is a show I only watch occasionally. I only started watching it this year. The ones I have seen were extremely funny. I do wish I watched it regularly and from the beginning but I already watch too much stuff.
> I'll probably make this one of the Summer shows I watch next year. If all the seasons are still on Netflix streaming, next Summer, it will make it very easy to watch.


I think the past two years (before this year), it was the funniest show on television. This year there is more competition as there are a lot more sitcoms on and other shows are cycling, so it is debatable.

I do think it is a bit in your face for some people and they get turned off on it.


----------



## Sacrilegium (Dec 14, 2006)

After reading this thread, I watched two episodes from Season Four on On Demand. I counted one laugh total out of two eps. Sorry, I just don't find it funny. If we're going the "clever writing with no laugh track" route, give me _The Office_ any day. Heck, give me _Parks and Recreation_. Maybe even _Community_, but I'm on the fence with that show.

I really don't like the _Family Guy_-style lazy joke/flashback reveal punchline. It reminds me of that time I bought shoes from an ice cream truck.

***flashback***

I'd like to buy shoes.
Here you go! (hands me shoes shaped like ice cream cones)

***end flashback***

No. Just no.

I didn't think it was _bad_ overall, just not very funny. Saw most of the jokes coming. If I find myself bored and it's on I might check out more, but I didn't find it SP-worthy. YMMV

/two cents


----------



## idkwis4 (Aug 18, 2010)

There's really only one reason people don't like 30 Rock - they aren't smart enough to understand its humor. The show is really geared toward intelligent people and our friends in the Midwest and the South are just too mentally slow to follow the wit. This doesn't apply to everyone in those areas but it's a simple fact that folks in those parts of the country just don't have the educational system we have in New York. Just a fact.


----------



## appleye1 (Jan 26, 2002)

idkwis4 said:


> There's really only one reason people don't like 30 Rock - they aren't smart enough to understand its humor. The show is really geared toward intelligent people and our friends in the Midwest and the South are just too mentally slow to follow the wit. This doesn't apply to everyone in those areas but it's a simple fact that folks in those parts of the country just don't have the educational system we have in New York. Just a fact.


 You had me going there for a second. Good job! (Do you write for 30 Rock? )


----------



## eddyj (Jun 20, 2002)

Yeah, Tracy Morgan humor is sooooooo intellectual.


----------



## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

I don't even know what the show is about. Can anyone suggest any "If you like <this show> then you'll like 30 Rock" comparisons?


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

eddyj said:


> Yeah, Tracy Morgan humor is sooooooo intellectual.


Not TM per se, but the some of his tiny one-liners are brilliant humor which fly over most peoples' heads. And of course, it's not TM himself, but the 30 Rock writers. Personally, I don't care for the actor or the character, but some of the best 30 Rock lines come from him. They're very quick and easy to miss.


----------



## IJustLikeTivo (Oct 3, 2001)

Turtleboy said:


> 30 Rock is one of the smartest, funniest, best written shows on TV. The combo of Tina Fey and Alec Baldwin and Tracy Morgan just works.


I watch it IN SPITE of Tracy Morgan. It would be way better without him. NO ONE that idiotic could actually survive. ( Unless you count Kanye West)


----------



## eddyj (Jun 20, 2002)

Hank said:


> Not TM per se, but the some of his tiny one-liners are brilliant humor which fly over most peoples' heads. And of course, it's not TM himself, but the 30 Rock writers. Personally, I don't care for the actor or the character, but some of the best 30 Rock lines come from him. They're very quick and easy to miss.


He does get some great lines. But he is so annoying that it totally ruined the shoe for me, and I stopped watching.


----------



## IndyJones1023 (Apr 1, 2002)

eddyj said:


> He does get some great lines. But he is so annoying that it totally ruined the *shoe* for me, and I stopped watching.


Thanks for letting us know, Ed Sullivan.


----------



## vman41 (Jun 18, 2002)

eddyj said:


> He does get some great lines. But he is so annoying that it totally ruined the shoe for me, and I stopped watching.


It's ironic that his character was added to TGS to increase ratings.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

IJustLikeTivo said:


> I watch it IN SPITE of Tracy Morgan. It would be way better without him. NO ONE that idiotic could actually survive. ( Unless you count Kanye West)


I could do without Tracy and Jenna. If the show were Liz, Jack, Kenneth and more of the writers (and Cirie), I think that would be a superior show.


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

DevdogAZ said:


> I could do without Tracy and Jenna. If the show were Liz, Jack, Kenneth and more of the writers (and Cirie), I think that would be a superior show.


:up:


----------



## YCantAngieRead (Nov 5, 2003)

idkwis4 said:


> There's really only one reason people don't like 30 Rock - they aren't smart enough to understand its humor. The show is really geared toward intelligent people and our friends in the Midwest and the South are just too mentally slow to follow the wit. This doesn't apply to everyone in those areas but it's a simple fact that folks in those parts of the country just don't have the educational system we have in New York. Just a fact.


I guess I'm too stupid to follow it, since I'm from the midwest.

Oh wait. It's my favorite show. I must just like the pretty colors.


----------



## IJustLikeTivo (Oct 3, 2001)

DevdogAZ said:


> I could do without Tracy and Jenna. If the show were Liz, Jack, Kenneth and more of the writers (and Cirie), I think that would be a superior show.


Jenna doesn't add anything, that's true but I find the Jane to be fine eye candy so I live with it.


----------



## billypritchard (May 7, 2001)

I guess I see the show from a wider out view. Without the 'crazy' talent, we'd lose perspective on the Liz and Jack and writers. They all have their parts to play, and I don't think it would be the same show with Tracy and Jenna.


----------



## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

YCantAngieRead said:


> I guess I'm too stupid to follow it, since I'm from the midwest.
> 
> Oh wait. It's my favorite show.


Clearly you need to move to a smarter part of the country, if for no other reason than you're completely messing up the curve for the rest of your neighbors.


----------



## trainman (Jan 29, 2001)

YCantAngieRead said:


> Oh wait. It's my favorite show. I must just like the pretty colors.


Well, it _does_ have the NBC peacock logo on-screen a lot...


----------



## madscientist (Nov 12, 2003)

heySkippy said:


> I don't even know what the show is about. Can anyone suggest any "If you like <this show> then you'll like 30 Rock" comparisons?


I doubt we'll get much agreement on this but I'll give it a shot. I'd say if you liked _Arrested Development_ and/or _Sports Night_ you'll like _30 Rock_. Both of those shows were, on average, better than _30 Rock_ but I think they have the same sensibilities, and when _Rock_ is on, it can make me laugh just as much.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

madscientist said:


> I doubt we'll get much agreement on this but I'll give it a shot. I'd say if you liked _Arrested Development_ and/or _Sports Night_ you'll like _30 Rock_. Both of those shows were, on average, better than _30 Rock_ but I think they have the same sensibilities, and when _Rock_ is on, it can make me laugh just as much.


I can agree with the comparison to Arrested Development, since AD had deadpan humor coupled with complete wackiness. However, I remember Sports Night being a little more realistic, without the absurdities you see on 30 Rock or AD.


----------



## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

IJustLikeTivo said:


> I watch it IN SPITE of Tracy Morgan. It would be way better without him. NO ONE that idiotic could actually survive.


That's funny, because when I see him in interviews, he's basically the same guy.. and obviously surviving.


----------



## madscientist (Nov 12, 2003)

DevdogAZ said:


> I can agree with the comparison to Arrested Development, since AD had deadpan humor coupled with complete wackiness. However, I remember Sports Night being a little more realistic, without the absurdities you see on 30 Rock or AD.


Yeah, that's certainly true. I don't know why I think they're similar. The situations and plot engines and even sensibilities are certainly very different. It just seems to me that if you liked _SN_, you'll like _Rock_. I can't say exactly why.

Must be time for a poll!!


----------



## fmowry (Apr 30, 2002)

Did not like Sports Night at all but love 30 Rock.


----------



## mtnagel (Nov 15, 2003)

idkwis4 said:


> There's really only one reason people don't like 30 Rock - they aren't smart enough to understand its humor. The show is really geared toward intelligent people and our friends in the Midwest and the South are just too mentally slow to follow the wit. This doesn't apply to everyone in those areas but it's a simple fact that folks in those parts of the country just don't have the educational system we have in New York. Just a fact.


Way to try to fit in with your first post 

Good thing I got my education from NY so I can understand this show


----------



## hapdrastic (Mar 31, 2006)

madscientist said:


> Yeah, that's certainly true. I don't know why I think they're similar. The situations and plot engines and even sensibilities are certainly very different. It just seems to me that if you liked _SN_, you'll like _Rock_. I can't say exactly why.
> 
> Must be time for a poll!!


Huge fan of Sports Night. I think 30 Rock is just ok. The characters just really don't do it for me on this show - it's a funny show, but I don't care, so I don't watch.


----------



## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

Huge fan of Sports Night. Can't stand 30 Rock.


----------



## DougF (Mar 18, 2003)

idkwis4 said:


> There's really only one reason people don't like 30 Rock - they aren't smart enough to understand its humor. The show is really geared toward intelligent people and our friends in the Midwest and the South are just too mentally slow to follow the wit. This doesn't apply to everyone in those areas but it's a simple fact that folks in those parts of the country just don't have the educational system we have in New York. Just a fact.


30 Rock is a Sorkin show?


----------



## jsmeeker (Apr 2, 2001)

DougF said:


> 30 Rock is a Sorkin show?


Nope.

The Sorkin show about a late night comedy/variety show had a short life. That's the one I watched. I picked it over a 30 minute sit com. I think this is why I don't watch 30 Rock.


----------



## DougF (Mar 18, 2003)

I was joking. I figured any show that I don't watch because of my lack of intelligence must have been created by the brilliant genius Aaron Sorkin. His shows are so brilliantly genius that common-folk like me don't get it.


----------



## jsmeeker (Apr 2, 2001)

DougF said:


> I was joking. I figured any show that I don't watch because of my lack of intelligence must have been created by the brilliant genius Aaron Sorkin. His shows are so brilliantly genius that common-folk like me don't get it.


I know. I just thought I was helping you out.


----------



## YCantAngieRead (Nov 5, 2003)

I tried to watch Sports Night, and I just couldn't get into it. I just wasn't interested.


----------



## billypritchard (May 7, 2001)

Big Fan of Sports Night and 30 Rock. But i wouldn't really compare them. Sports Night also did drama with great complexity and elegance. SN is a much better show overall.


----------



## IJustLikeTivo (Oct 3, 2001)

billypritchard said:


> Big Fan of Sports Night and 30 Rock. But i wouldn't really compare them. Sports Night also did drama with great complexity and elegance. SN is a much better show overall.


Sports Night was my favorite TV show ever. The only ones I like nearly as much are West Wing and Studio 60. There must be some commonality.

I miss them all.


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

IJustLikeTivo said:


> Sports Night was my favorite TV show ever. The only ones I like nearly as much are West Wing and Studio 60. There must be some commonality.


You're joking, right?


----------



## jsmeeker (Apr 2, 2001)

Hank said:


> You're joking, right?


I think he is continuing the joke DougF started


----------



## IJustLikeTivo (Oct 3, 2001)

Hank said:


> You're joking, right?


yep



jsmeeker said:


> I think he is continuing the joke DougF started


yep+1


----------



## tgrim1 (Sep 11, 2006)

If I want intelligent comedy without a laugh-track, I watch old episodes of Corner Gas.


----------



## wprager (Feb 19, 2006)

DougF said:


> I was joking. I figured any show that I don't watch because of my lack of intelligence must have been created by the brilliant genius Aaron Sorkin. His shows are so brilliantly genius that common-folk like me don't get it.


Loved Sports Night and The American President. Never got into The West Wing. Mildly enjoyed S60, but it certainly wasn't nearly as good as I had expected.


----------



## idkwis4 (Aug 18, 2010)

mtnagel said:


> Way to try to fit in with your first post
> 
> Good thing I got my education from NY so I can understand this show


Truth be told, I'm from the Midwest and drive a Kia Sorento.


----------



## appleye1 (Jan 26, 2002)

WellIlikeanyshowwhere
theytalkrealfast. 
Becauseifyoutalkrealfast
itmakesyousoundlikeyou're
veryintelligentandsupercool
evenifyou'renot.


----------



## stiffi (Jun 14, 2006)

heySkippy said:


> I don't even know what the show is about. Can anyone suggest any "If you like <this show> then you'll like 30 Rock" comparisons?


Anything Tina Fey wrote.

The Movies "Mean Girls", "Baby Mama"
Her skits on SNL, like pretty much the entire "Weekend Update" while She and Jimmy Fallon were the hosts, and even for the hosts just prior to her.
Also, any of the Sarah Palin stuff from last year while she was a guest

I personally find it similar to the Hannah Barbera cartoons from the 70s. They always had the stupid slapstick stuff for the kids, obviously, but also lots of high brow jokes thrown in that only the adults would get. 30 Rock is kind of like that. You could laugh your butt off just watching Tracey Morgan ham it up (or for me just hearing his crazy voice), but the actual lines he's reading have other more high brow meanings.

Hope that helps.


----------



## eddyj (Jun 20, 2002)

stiffi said:


> You could laugh your butt off just watching Tracey Morgan ham it up (or for me just hearing his crazy voice), but the actual lines he's reading have other more high brow meanings.


More like, if you can stop throwing up from Tracey Morgan's idiocy and annoying voice, you might be able to laugh at the funny stuff.


----------



## mtnagel (Nov 15, 2003)

Man you people are really making me want to watch Sports Night now. I've only seen a couple episodes and I know I liked them...


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

YCantAngieRead said:


> I tried to watch Sports Night, and I just couldn't get into it. I just wasn't interested.


The first few episodes didn't much grab me but then I finally got into it and now I love it! I can't tell you how excited I was when I discovered there were two seasons and not just one like I thought.



jsmeeker said:


> The Sorkin show about a late night comedy/variety show had a short life. That's the one I watched. I picked it over a 30 minute sit com. I think this is why I don't watch 30 Rock.


Studio 60, which I also loved.

Studio 60 is to 30 Rock what ER is to Scrubs. They're both great shows but very different, despite the similar subjects. If you go in expecting them to be the same you'll be disappointed.


----------



## Fleegle (Jan 15, 2002)

idkwis4 said:


> Truth be told, I'm from the Midwest and drive a Kia Sorento.


I still think you're a shill for the show or NBC...


----------



## vman41 (Jun 18, 2002)

mtnagel said:


> Man you people are really making me want to watch Sports Night now. I've only seen a couple episodes and I know I liked them...


The reaction to the first episode of Sports Night I saw was "This is great, but it's doomed". Basically, the show was too intense for either the audience or the writers to keep up without the former getting fatigued and the latter burning out.


----------



## YCantAngieRead (Nov 5, 2003)

Robin said:


> The first few episodes didn't much grab me but then I finally got into it and now I love it! I can't tell you how excited I was when I discovered there were two seasons and not just one like I thought.


I think I only watched the first two. I'll probably give it another try eventually.


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

And FWIW I hate sports and the only sports I've ever watched on TV are a few glimpses at the Olympics.


----------



## speaker city (Sep 28, 2005)

idkwis4 said:


> There's really only one reason people don't like 30 Rock - they aren't smart enough to understand its humor. The show is really geared toward intelligent people and our friends in the Midwest and the South are just too mentally slow to follow the wit. This doesn't apply to everyone in those areas but it's a simple fact that folks in those parts of the country just don't have the educational system we have in New York. Just a fact.


I like this guy :up:

It's true. 30 Rock is a smart show. You have to be pretty sharp to keep up. I love it.

People that can't grasp the humor of 30 rock are better off watching 2 and a Half men and enjoying it's 22 minutes of sex jokes.


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

speaker city said:


> It's true. 30 Rock is a smart show. You have to be pretty sharp to keep up. I love it.
> 
> People that can't grasp the humor of 30 rock are better off watching 2 and a Half men and enjoying it's 22 minutes of sex jokes.


Or Big Bang Theory.


----------



## YCantAngieRead (Nov 5, 2003)

Man, Hank. You really hate that show.


----------



## fmowry (Apr 30, 2002)

speaker city said:


> I like this guy :up:
> 
> It's true. 30 Rock is a smart show. You have to be pretty sharp to keep up. I love it.
> 
> People that can't grasp the humor of 30 rock are better off watching 2 and a Half men and enjoying it's 22 minutes of sex jokes.


That's like saying the people who understand such smart comedy probably haven't had enough sex to understand the sex jokes on 2.5 Men.

I'm not sure why you can't like low brow zingers in 2.5 men and "intellectual" comedy like 30 Rock.


----------



## Magnolia88 (Jul 1, 2005)

billypritchard said:


> Big Fan of Sports Night and 30 Rock. But i wouldn't really compare them. Sports Night also did drama with great complexity and elegance. SN is a much better show overall.


ITA.

I love, love, love SN and it's one of my favorite shows of all-time, but I don't see that is much in common with 30 Rock.

30 Rock is a wacky comedy, in a bizarro world that doesn't try to do anything but make the audience laugh. SN was more of a dramedy -- it was about people, and dealt with real issues, and the comedy was only a side benefit. And SN has Sorkin's trademark hyper-verbal characters who talk just like the people on _The West Wing_ and _Studio 60_, who love to show off how smart they are. The characters on 30 Rock do not pretend to be smart, and the ones who are smart (Liz and Jack) are pretty goofy in other ways.

I think the better comparison to _30 Rock_ would be _Arrested Development_. The writing is very clever, but it's still a wacky comedy with crazy nutty characters who live in a bizarro world. Also, both of them have a reasonably normal sane character at the center (Liz and Michael) and they are surrounded by crazy people.


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

YCantAngieRead said:


> Man, Hank. You really hate that show.


I actually don't really hate that show, it's just that I hate how many people are falling over themselves over it. It's not bad, but it's no 30 Rock or Sports Night.


----------



## smak (Feb 11, 2000)

I think the reason is people think it's a sophisticated NY comedy when it's mostly a wacky throw anything at the screen comedy.

They think it's going to be a Sorkin type wordy dramedy when it's really not.

-smak-


----------



## wprager (Feb 19, 2006)

stiffi said:


> Anything Tina Fey wrote.
> 
> The Movies "Mean Girls", "Baby Mama"
> Her skits on SNL, like pretty much the entire "Weekend Update" while She and Jimmy Fallon were the hosts, and even for the hosts just prior to her.
> ...


I especially like the high-brow line in the re-run last night:


> Then tomorrow is the wine and cheese tastingor as I like to call it, 'singles fart suppression.'


Took me 20 minutes to clean up the stains from the spit-take that followed.


----------



## Magnolia88 (Jul 1, 2005)

I can't think of anything about 30 Rock that I would remotely call "high brow." 

I guess there are a lot of political jokes, like when Jack does his name dropping (he dated Condie Rice) that are only funny if you know who they are talking about. But is that really "highbrow"? 

And the whole episode about Lee Marvin vs. Derek Jeter . . . it's funnier if you know who Lee Marvin is, and understand the comparison, and that is probably a small segment of the 30 Rock audience. There are a lot of people who know who Lee Marvin is, but they are over 50 and probably aren't watching 30 Rock. But you don't have to know Lee Marvin to find the show funny because there are plenty of lowbrow jokes too. If you don't understand one reference (I'm sure I don't get half of Tracy's comments), they will move along very quickly to something else.


----------



## stiffi (Jun 14, 2006)

Magnolia88 said:


> I
> 
> I guess there are a lot of political jokes, like when Jack does his name dropping (he dated Condie Rice) that are only funny if you know who they are talking about. But is that really "highbrow"?
> 
> And the whole episode about Lee Marvin vs. Derek Jeter . . . it's funnier if you know who Lee Marvin is, and understand the comparison, and that is probably a small segment of the 30 Rock audience. There are a lot of people who know who Lee Marvin is, but they are over 50 and probably aren't watching 30 Rock. But you don't have to know Lee Marvin to find the show funny because there are plenty of lowbrow jokes too. If you don't understand one reference (I'm sure I don't get half of Tracy's comments), they will move along very quickly to something else.


Yeah, That's what I meant. I certainly didn't mean to compare it to Chaucer, just that it's more complicated than King of Queens or 2 and a half Men.


----------



## Frylock (Feb 13, 2002)

I'm sorry, but 30 Rock is not some intellectual show that the common man cannot get. That's just fans of the show being snobby. While I didn't watch it from the beginning, I did catch up on Netflix. It's ok, but I lump it in with Arrested Development. Amusing shows that I like, but can see why others don't watch them, and don't see why people think they are the greatest show ever.

However, now I really have to go check out SN!


----------



## gschrock (Dec 28, 2001)

Loved SN. Can't stand 30 Rock, it's just not funny to me. Never liked Arrested Development or The Office either. But then, I'm from the midwest (but don't drive a Kia Sorrento, those are merely speed bumps for real suvs).


----------



## IndyJones1023 (Apr 1, 2002)

I'm so confused. I'm from the mid-west, drive a Kia Sorento, and love _Sports Night_, _Arrested Development_, _The Office_, and _30 Rock_. Does that mean I'm stupid or smart?


----------



## eddyj (Jun 20, 2002)

IndyJones1023 said:


> I'm so confused. I'm from the mid-west, drive a Kia Sorento, and love _Sports Night_, _Arrested Development_, _The Office_, and _30 Rock_. Does that mean I'm stupid or smart?


Start.


----------



## Fleegle (Jan 15, 2002)

I've mentioned it before, but I am proud to have helped 30 Rock make some good changes before it ever aired. I am signed up for several market Research companies, and I was called to do one as a test audience member for 3- Rock. We watched the pilot and gave feedback for around 1 1/2 or 2 hours. The biggest change I noticed is that Jenna was originally played by Rachel Drasch, and nobody believed her in that role. I'm glad she got re-cast.

I also don't think Pete or Kenneth were supposed to be regular characters. The person leading teh group seemed surprised that we liked them so much.


----------



## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

Fleegle said:


> I've mentioned it before, but I am proud to have helped 30 Rock make some good changes before it ever aired. I am signed up for several market Research companies, and I was called to do one as a test audience member for 3- Rock. We watched the pilot and gave feedback for around 1 1/2 or 2 hours. The biggest change I noticed is that Jenna was originally played by Rachel Drasch, and nobody believed her in that role. I'm glad she got re-cast.
> 
> I also don't think Pete or Kenneth were supposed to be regular characters. The person leading teh group seemed surprised that we liked them so much.


The original pilot is floating around the torrents or the YouTube. I agree, she wasn't any good.

But she also was (now past tense I guess) Tina Fey's best friend.


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

Yeah, Drasch was good for the zanny SNL characters, but by-george -- stay off of regular TV!


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Didn't Dratch have bit parts in several of the first episodes, always playing a different character? I wondered if that was going to become a recurring bit and was her "compensation" for having been recast out of one of the lead roles. But then she just disappeared altogether and hasn't been seen since.


----------



## Fleegle (Jan 15, 2002)

DevdogAZ said:


> Didn't Dratch have bit parts in several of the first episodes, always playing a different character? I wondered if that was going to become a recurring bit and was her "compensation" for having been recast out of one of the lead roles. But then she just disappeared altogether and hasn't been seen since.


I'm pretty sure they did that instead of buying her out of her contract for the first year.


----------



## Flop (Dec 2, 2005)

LoadStar said:


> Huge fan of Sports Night. Can't stand 30 Rock.


+1


----------



## vman41 (Jun 18, 2002)

eddyj said:


> Start.


Or smupid.


----------



## YCantAngieRead (Nov 5, 2003)

Frylock said:


> I'm sorry, but 30 Rock is not some intellectual show that the common man cannot get. That's just fans of the show being snobby. While I didn't watch it from the beginning, I did catch up on Netflix. It's ok, but I lump it in with Arrested Development. Amusing shows that I like, but can see why others don't watch them, and don't see why people think they are the greatest show ever.
> 
> However, now I really have to go check out SN!


I think you'll enjoy SN.

I don't think 30 Rock is the dumbest show out there, but it is smarter than some. And that's okay. I like some of the dumber ones, too. There's something for everyone on TV.


----------



## DougF (Mar 18, 2003)

IndyJones1023 said:


> I'm so confused. I'm from the mid-west, drive a Kia Sorento, and love _Sports Night_, _Arrested Development_, _The Office_, and _30 Rock_. Does that mean I'm stupid or smart?


There's only one way to know. If you tried watching Studio 60 but didn't like it, that means you were too dumb to get it.


----------



## IndyJones1023 (Apr 1, 2002)

I enjoyed _Studio 60_, as well. It was very full of itself, but I hung in 'til the end.


----------



## YCantAngieRead (Nov 5, 2003)

I liked Studio 60, too, and that surprised me a little. I haven't enjoyed any other Sorkin projects. But I haven't given West Wing a lot of effort, either.


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

If I had only two choices, and those choices were either 30 Rock or SN, I'd go SN every time. And I love 30 Rock.


----------



## roylee (Oct 8, 2011)

Now that _30 Rock _is in syndication, I can catch eps; haven't watched since first season when I was moderately interested for its sometimes non-linear capabilities w/ humor. Now that non-linear sensibility just turns out to be no plot; instead, it's a series of setups that cutaway from the joke only to come back at any inappropriate time with poor, unrelated punch lines, none of which have to do with each other.

One thing that conventional sitcoms do is have a minor or sub or even sub sub plot that reflects the major conflict or major plot that subconsciously reinforces itself. This has none of that.

Now someone who bills himself (hey, we're all stars, right?) as devil dog AZ claims that Arrested Development, another show that took its nonlinear format to an extreme of comedic absurdity, as the best sitcom ever.

Ladies, gentlemen, I have to tell you, the best sitcom ever is _Buffalo Bill _and its single greatest episode which by default makes it the greatest ep ever of sitcoms is the one all about Geena Davis's character, written and directed by the then so young Geena Davis; it is 24:30 of non-stop funny, slap-your-thighs, catch-your-breath, hoo-hah, out-loud, pee-your-pants funny. I almost ran out of hyphens in that hyper-compound-adjective encomium; but hey, that's how funny it is.

OK, it's just an opinion, but if you get the chance watch a few eps, especially the one written, directed, and starring Geena Davis, do take the time.

for those who are thinking, and I know you are, "if that's the best half-hour sitcom, what's the best hour show"? That would be _Moonlighting_ whose single best episode is, you guessed it "Atomic Shakespeare."


----------



## roylee (Oct 8, 2011)

Re: "2 and a Half men and enjoying it's 22 minutes of sex jokes." I thought it was mostly fart and snot jokes. Hah Hah hah laughing at fart jokes ha hah it's snot funny hah hah there's something about snotty mary adam sandler presents 88 minutes of farts. hah hah not even suitable for the lower levels of amateurs @ you tube.

On the other hand, in jokes about TV and NYC aren't too difficult, not really the stratosphere of comedy, even if I did grow up in Ashville, Ohio. It's not really what litcrit calls absurdist, more absurd in its vulgar or colloquial understanding versus _Being There _or _Waiting for..._.

Try reading Barth, Barthelme, or TC Boyle. Then act all smarmy because you get it.

Or, and be very careful because you will laugh out loud and snort--on the subway, on a bus, on a bench at the park during your lunch break, or any other prepositional-dependent context: in an office, over dinner, at home--read _The Hitchhiker's Guide_, _The Restaurant at the End of the Universe, _ and all the rest for anti-hi-brow non-fart humor.

It's just funny


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

_Moonlighting_ was just ok, better than most... not great.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

roylee said:


> Now that 30 Rock is in syndication, I can catch eps; haven't watched since first season when I was moderately interested for its sometimes non-linear capabilities w/ humor. Now that non-linear sensibility just turns out to be no plot; instead, it's a series of setups that cutaway from the joke only to come back at any inappropriate time with poor, unrelated punch lines, none of which have to do with each other.
> 
> One thing that conventional sitcoms do is have a minor or sub or even sub sub plot that reflects the major conflict or major plot that subconsciously reinforces itself. This has none of that.
> 
> ...


Two things:
1. My name isn't Devil Dog. It's Devdog. Big difference.

2. Your sense of humor has been betrayed by your citing of a show nobody has ever heard of as the funniest sitcom ever.


----------



## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

DevdogAZ said:


> Two things:
> 1. My name isn't Devil Dog. It's Devdog. Big difference.
> 
> 2. Your sense of humor has been betrayed by your citing of a show nobody has ever heard of as the funniest sitcom ever.


To be fair about Buffalo Bill, it was probably considered the "Arrested Development" of it's day. A show critics generally loved, and nobody watched. Me, I saw it a couple of times, but never got what all the fuss was about. It was very "dry" humor that you either got or didn't.

Moonlighting? A very average show that was just "hip" to watch, because it was a bit different than what else was on in those days. I wasn't a fan of it, but now, 25-30 years later, I think it was a show I probably would enjoy.

Neither IMO was the best of either genre (actually today Moonlighting would probably be considered a comedy).


----------



## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

I liked Buffalo Bill.


----------



## wprager (Feb 19, 2006)

I wouldn't go so far as to say Buffalo Bill is a show no-one has heard about. I remember it quite well. Best ever? I don't think so, but it was one of the first (and, in the 80s, probably the only) to have a very unlikeable character as the star of the show. I guess Archie Bunker had a lot of unlikable qualities about him but I don't think he was ever presented as an anti-hero. "Buffalo" Bill, Larry Sanders (as well as Artie), most of the Bluths -- "Buffalo" Bill was one of the first, if not *the* first.


----------



## smak (Feb 11, 2000)

Comedy wise, Buffalo Bill was nowhere near AD.

-smak-


----------



## Frylock (Feb 13, 2002)

YCantAngieRead said:


> I think you'll enjoy SN.
> 
> I don't think 30 Rock is the dumbest show out there, but it is smarter than some. And that's okay. I like some of the dumber ones, too. There's something for everyone on TV.


I finally watched all of Sports Night. I rank it well below 30 Rock and Arrested Development. Season 1 was painful. Season 2 seemed to solve some of the problems it had in S1, but not enough to make me wish there was a 3rd season.

I do see why fans of one of them would be fans of the others. They definitely all fall into the same genre of shows. I also don't think one has to, or necessarily is, high brow or intelligent for liking any of these shows.


----------

