# Upgrade hard drive format



## davidg716 (Jan 20, 2015)

I cloned my 1tb drive to a new 3tb drive and of course TiVo still thinks it's a 1tb drive still. If I run the onboard factory reset will it reformat and see the entire drive? Or do I need to pull it and format it clean on a pc first?


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

Are you in the right forum? Roamio upgrades to 3tb by just connecting the drive, no other work needed...


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## davidg716 (Jan 20, 2015)

jrtroo said:


> Are you in the right forum? Roamio upgrades to 3tb by just connecting the drive, no other work needed...


Yes.

I tried to clone the old drive to save all of my settings and recorded shows. It didn't work.

Neither did trying to install the 3tb drive and factory restoring. It still only shows 150 hours remaining.


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

davidg716 said:


> I cloned my 1tb drive to a new 3tb drive and of course TiVo still thinks it's a 1tb drive still.
> 
> If I run the onboard factory reset will it reformat and see the entire drive?
> 
> Or do I need to pull it and format it clean on a pc first?


At this time I believe so.


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## ggieseke (May 30, 2008)

davidg716 said:


> I cloned my 1tb drive to a new 3tb drive and of course TiVo still thinks it's a 1tb drive still. If I run the onboard factory reset will it reformat and see the entire drive? Or do I need to pull it and format it clean on a pc first?


You need to wipe it, or at least the first few sectors. If you present a Roamio with an intact file system that it recognizes it will treat it as gospel. If you wipe the drive on a PC the Roamio will reformat it and use the entire 3TB.

There is no way (at this time) to expand a Roamio and keep the settings and recordings. Hopefully that will change one of these days.


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## davidg716 (Jan 20, 2015)

Teeps said:


> At this time I believe so.





ggieseke said:


> You need to wipe it, or at least the first few sectors. If you present a Roamio with an intact file system that it recognizes it will treat it as gospel. If you wipe the drive on a PC the Roamio will reformat it and use the entire 3TB.
> 
> There is no way (at this time) to expand a Roamio and keep the settings and recordings. Hopefully that will change one of these days.


Went a head and pulled the TiVo and formatted the drive on my windows PC, now its reinitializing in Tivo setup. Should be good to go now.


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

ggieseke said:


> You need to wipe it, or at least the first few sectors. If you present a Roamio with an intact file system that it recognizes it will treat it as gospel. If you wipe the drive on a PC the Roamio will reformat it and use the entire 3TB.
> 
> There is no way (at this time) to expand a Roamio and keep the settings and recordings. Hopefully that will change one of these days.


I sure hope so. 
My wife's Roamio basic is nearly 47% full in 5 weeks!


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Teeps said:


> I sure hope so.
> My wife's Roamio basic is nearly 47% full in 5 weeks!


You can always transfer the exisiting recordings and backup the Season Passes with KMTTG. Assuming the recordings aren't restricted. Then you just load the Season Passes and transfer the shows back to the new drive.


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## davidg716 (Jan 20, 2015)

aaronwt said:


> You can always transfer the exisiting recordings and backup the Season Passes with KMTTG. Assuming the recordings aren't restricted. Then you just load the Season Passes and transfer the shows back to the new drive.


That's actually exactly what I did with the shows I didn't want to lose. I did lose a bunch of kids shows that are on Disney all of the time (just because it takes so long to transfer them) but I can just rebuild that library. The 20mo old won't noticed some of his episodes are missing...lol

Fortunately all of our regular channels are 0x00


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

aaronwt said:


> You can always transfer the exisiting recordings and backup the Season Passes with KMTTG. Assuming the recordings aren't restricted. Then you just load the Season Passes and transfer the shows back to the new drive.


They are mostly I Love Lucy reruns so not a problem rebuilding the library.


davidg716 said:


> That's actually exactly what I did with the shows I didn't want to lose. I did lose a bunch of kids shows that are on Disney all of the time (just because it takes so long to transfer them) but I can just rebuild that library. The 20mo old won't noticed some of his episodes are missing...lol
> 
> Fortunately all of our regular channels are 0x00


All OTA channels are copy freely so I could transfer all but it takes too long.


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## tootal2 (Oct 14, 2005)

jrtroo said:


> Are you in the right forum? Roamio upgrades to 3tb by just connecting the drive, no other work needed...


you don't need that cloning program to upgrade the drive in a TiVo roamio?


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

tootal2 said:


> you don't need that cloning program to upgrade the drive in a TiVo roamio?


No, it automatically upgrades any new drive up to 3TB.


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## tootal2 (Oct 14, 2005)

HarperVision said:


> No, it automatically upgrades any new drive up to 3TB.


that's fantastic. I think I will order a roamio basic this week.


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## tootal2 (Oct 14, 2005)

Are there anyone upgrade instructions? and recommended hard drives?


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

Upgrade instructions: Unplug Tivo. Remove old drive. Insert new drive. Plug in TiVo.

WD AV drives are my choice, same as what TiVo uses.


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## dcline414 (May 1, 2014)

Arcady said:


> WD AV drives are my choice, same as what TiVo uses.


Is there any difference between the AV and purple (24/7 Surveillance) line? The specs and intended useconstant video recordingare the same and I can't find a single difference in the technical specs.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

I haven't tried a purple drive. I have been using AV-GP in my TiVo boxes.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

tootal2 said:


> Are there anyone upgrade instructions? and recommended hard drives?


@nooneuknow is the resident pro in this department. You can find all the info you need in the Hard Drive upgrade thread in the Roamio forum.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Now that TiVo has a way to move recordings and bypass copy restrictions they should add the feature to MRV so that it's easy to migrate to a new TiVo, or temporarily move shows to a second TiVo when upgrading the drive.

In fact they should add a Migrate feature that moves all shows, settings, 1Ps, thumb ratings, etc... to a new TiVo. Making it easier for people to transition will make it more likely for them to upgrade.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

Dan203 said:


> Now that TiVo has a way to move recordings and bypass copy restrictions they should add the feature to MRV so that it's easy to migrate to a new TiVo, or temporarily move shows to a second TiVo when upgrading the drive.
> 
> In fact they should add a Migrate feature that moves all shows, settings, 1Ps, thumb ratings, etc... to a new TiVo. Making it easier for people to transition will make it more likely for them to upgrade.


I agree 100%. When you buy a new Mac, the first thing it does is ask if you want to import everything from your old Mac. TiVo should be able to do the same thing. TiVo already knows what boxes are on your account, so it should be easy to say "which of these boxes do you want to import from?" Then you pick a box or choose "none" if you are adding a TiVo.


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

Dan203 said:


> Now that TiVo has a way to move recordings and bypass copy restrictions they should add the feature to MRV so that it's easy to migrate to a new TiVo, or temporarily move shows to a second TiVo when upgrading the drive.


Since when has tivo been able to bypass copy protection?

Any copy protected (by content provider) material cannot be moved to any other device, only streamed. Said material always remains on the original recording device.


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

No, it can be MOVED, it cannot be COPIED.

It's not a bypass, it is following the rules with more flexibility. Streaming got it done within the home, outside of upgrading scenarios.

The new iOS app moves the content, so it gets deleted from the Tivo.


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

jrtroo said:


> No, it can be MOVED, it cannot be COPIED.
> 
> It's not a bypass, it is following the rules with more flexibility. Streaming got it done within the home, outside of upgrading scenarios.
> 
> The new iOS app moves the content, so it gets deleted from the Tivo.


Understood.
So, the content is move and is now on the iOS device. 
Can the content be moved back to a TiVo?
If so, only the TiVo from which it came or a different TiVo?


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

It can not be moved back to the TiVo, but I suspect that's a limitation of the format TiVo uses.

Comcast uses a system where you "check out" a recording. This "moves" it to the mobile device, making it unplayable on the host DVR, but it's still there. If you delete the recording from the mobile device then it's checked back into the host DVR and the original recording becomes active again.

TiVo does it a bit different. The recording is copied to the mobile device but is unplayable until it completes. At the very end of the copy it finalizes the transfer which unlocks the copy on your mobile device and permanently deletes it from the host TiVo. If you interrupt the process in any way, or prevent the source file from being deleted, then the copy is never unlocked and is unplayable. So there is never two playable copies in existence. There is nothing preventing them from doing the same thing with MRV.


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

Dan203 said:


> It can not be moved back to the TiVo, but I suspect that's a limitation of the format TiVo uses.
> There is nothing preventing them from doing the same thing with MRV.


Copy protection set by the content provider, would be my guess.

IMO moving content at near real time speeds makes MRV impractical for large chunks of data.
And, in the end, it's just TV... the content is out there a person just has to find it...


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

Teeps said:


> Understood.
> So, the content is move and is now on the iOS device.
> Can the content be moved back to a TiVo?
> If so, only the TiVo from which it came or a different TiVo?


I think MOVED is the wrong word to use in this scenario. The content is trans-coded from the original .tivo MPEG2 format to a very specific chuncked up MPEG4 format.

It could never be moved back because the quality / encoding of the original content has been deleted.

If TiVo had implemented a check-in / check-out system the original file would still be available.

Now it isn't


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

bradleys said:


> I think MOVED is the wrong word to use in this scenario. The content is trans-coded from the original .tivo MPEG2 format to a very specific chuncked up MPEG4 format. It could never be moved back because the quality / encoding of the original content has been deleted. If TiVo had implemented a check-in / check-out system the original file would still be available. Now it isn't


Is there a way/hack to get it off your iDevice and onto your PC, even as an MPEG4 file? PM me if you're not allowed to say publicly.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Teeps said:


> Copy protection set by the content provider, would be my guess.
> 
> IMO moving content at near real time speeds makes MRV impractical for large chunks of data.
> And, in the end, it's just TV... the content is out there a person just has to find it...


It's not a copyright issue. They are getting around that by moving the copy they already have, rather then making a new copy. However the format of the file on the iPad is very different so it would not be easy to simply move it back.

Like I mentioned above Comcast gets around this by retaining the original recording on the DVR itself but marking it unwatchable. If you want to move it back then they delete it from the mobile device and reinstate the original recording on the DVR. This avoids the issue of trying to move the transcoded file back to the DVR. As long as there is never two copies of the show that are actually watchable at any moment then they are technically adhering to the rules of the CCI byte.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

HarperVision said:


> Is there a way/hack to get it off your iDevice and onto your PC, even as an MPEG4 file? PM me if you're not allowed to say publicly.


No. The files are stored on the iDevice as an encrypted HLS stream. HLS is basically hundreds of short segments of the video stored as TS and then ordered according to a playlist file. The encryption key is transmitted from the host device to the client using an SSL HTTP connection. At that point I assume the TiVo app stores the key using the built in encryption methods that iOS provides. If you could somehow get the key then you could decrypt the TS files and rejoin them into a single file. But as far as I know, even with a jailbroken device, there is no way to get at the encrypted data stored by an individual app.


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