# No Audio over HDMI??



## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

Hi my HD-tivo is being a bit strange.... 

according to the folks I have spoken to over in the FAQ thread if I connect Component and HDMI at the same time I should not get any video over the Component connection.... 

However, tonite I connected my HD-Tivo to a Denon 2807 via both the Component and HDMI inputs... and I am getting video on Both....... problem is I am not getting any Audio over HDMI! I have the HDMI audio assigned to the HDMI video input and Optical audio in assigned to the Component input. 

I am getting audio just fine over Optical, but nothing over HDMI... 

Is there a fix for this, or do I have to call DTV and ask for another unit???


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## jsirota (May 26, 2003)

If the source is DD5.1 and you have that enabled on the HR10, then all audio will be on the optical out and nothing will be on the HDMI. At least, that's what the manual says. I can't tell you for sure because I have DD disabled on my HR10.


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

So if you disable Dolby Digital... then you CAN use HDMI audio?

That seems really really really weird.......

So if I deselct DD on the Tivo menu then what happens when I am watching a HD channel that is broadcasting in Dolby Digital? Am I just stuck with stereo???

Too Weird.....


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

Well even though weird I tried it out....

I selected DD off on the Tivo menu and then went back to the receiver setup and assigned HDMI video one to HDMI audio one and guess what......... Still No Audio.... :-(


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## hancox (Dec 17, 2004)

Something is very wrong. I have both non-DD and DD 5.1 going from my HR10-250 to my JVC 702 receiver.


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## jfischer (Oct 14, 1999)

HiHoStevo said:


> So if you disable Dolby Digital... then you CAN use HDMI audio?


Yep. That's what I had to do on mine. Wasn't worth losing DD on the receiver, so I quit trying to use audio over HDMI.


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## Robalo (Apr 24, 2006)

I am using HD-Tivo with HDMI to my Denon 2807 and from there via HDMI as well to my Plasma. Video OK but no audio.

My next test will try to determine if the problem is in the Denon or in the Tivo. I will be testing an HD-DVD with HDMI to the DENON.

If this does not work I guess I am stuck with an extra Optical cable from the HD-TIVO to the DENON. 

Arturo.


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

Robalo........

Please post back your experience........

I just called DTV and whined that the HDMI out did not have audio, so they are sending me a replacement HD-Tivo.

If you find out the problem is with the Denon, please let me know...... that would really suck as these things are brand new and supposedly would have the latest and greatest when it comes to HDMI!

If your HD-DVD will not send audio through the 2807 then we will have to talk to Denon to find out what the dealio is......!


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## Robalo (Apr 24, 2006)

Hi,

This morning I talked to some guy in Denon USA Tech Support and told me that the problem was with some kind of software or firmware update that the HD-Tivo required. He told me to contact DirecTV for this. I did not like his answer so I have not talked to DTV. I rather do some more testing on my own before I call them. I will keep you posted via this forum. Please advise if you find out anything else. Here is my email: arrobalado (at) hotmail com

Thank you,

Arturo.


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## MisterEd (Jun 6, 2001)

I had no audio over HDMI on my 36" Sony XBR (4:3 CRT HD Ready) set. I replaced the Sony with a new 50" Plasma and everything is fine. Evidently the 2.5yr old Sony had some HDMI compatibilty issues. Point is, it could be the TV.


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## Superpuppy (Mar 6, 2006)

How ironic
I spent over an hour with the Directv support over this very issue

I have a brand new Mitsubishi LCD with 2 HDMI inputs
No sound over HDMI

I have tried different cables and unplugging everything else off the back of the unit with no luck.

They are sending me a new unit that I should receive tomorrow or Wed.

I have yet to return two broken units back to them
pup


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

pup........

Let us know if you get one that works!!

I am going to be out of town until next Saturday when I can check the next HD-Tivo DTV is going to send me to see if it makes any difference than the one I have.

If it is a "firmware thing" I sure hope they get the new firmware on the one they are sending me!

I had hoped to be able to use the HDMI audio & Video out of the HD-Tivo for all of my HD viewing and then switch over to Component & Optical for all SD viewing... it seems that the scaler/de-interlacer built into my projector (Faroudja) does a better job than the scaler/de-interlacer built into the HD-Tivo for converting 480i.


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## Robalo (Apr 24, 2006)

Stevo,

I did some testing today. I connected the HD-TIVO directly to
the HDMI on my plasma taking the Denon out of the loop.
At first it did not work. Then I turned OFF the Dolby Digital option
in the TIVO Settings and it worked. There was sound.
I guess this means that the HD-TIVO only outputs analg sound
via the HDMI. My guess is that upgrading the TIVO firmware or
software version might solve this issue.

Please advise if the TIVO that DTV will be sending you works. I suggest
you write down all relevant information in your current TIVO so
you can compare with the new one.

Hope this helps,

Arturo.


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

Thanks Arturo I appreciate the update...

I will let you know what happens when I get the new Tivo in.

I just cannot for the life of me figure out what was going through the minds of the engineers that decided they should only send out a simple analog stereo signal over the HDMI interface... that is just bizarre... Oh guys weve got this great digital interface with huge capabilities... let not use any of it and just give the customer old school stereo... if they want anything better let's make them use the optical connection...... whooee what a great idea!


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

Robalo said:


> At first it did not work. Then I turned OFF the Dolby Digital option
> in the TIVO Settings and it worked. There was sound.
> I guess this means that the HD-TIVO only outputs analg sound
> via the HDMI. My guess is that upgrading the TIVO firmware or
> software version might solve this issue.


No, it means that your TV set does not support 5.1 audio over HDMI. There is no such thing as analog audio over HDMI. Many TV sets only support 2 channel digital audio over HDMI, especially if they only have two speakers. (Why support 5.1 if the set can't play it anyway?)

The best way to connect an HD TiVo to both a receiver and an HDMI TV set and not have to change the DD5.1 setting is probably to run optical to the receiver and analog audio to the TV set (if your set supports using an analog audio input while using HDMI/DVI to display video.) DD5.1 is automatically down-sampled to stereo on the RCA audio outputs.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Or run through a scaler, DD 5.1 over HDMI works fine when I send the audio/video over HDMI to my VP30 scaler. Then the VP30 sends the video to my TV over HDMI and audio to my receiver over optical/coaxial.


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## judson_west (Nov 10, 2001)

I just got a new TV, Sony KD-34XBR970. I will be getting a HR10 in a couple of days. In the meantime I was looking at these threads talking about HDMI issues. I am planning to hook my HR10 to the TV via HDMI with audio going to my A/V receiver via optical. I don't plan on listening to the TV speakers at all, ever. I expect to get all of the audio from the HR10 (2-ch stereo, DD5.1) via the optical. Will I be dissapointed?


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

Your plan will work fine. I have my system connected the same way. I don't use the speakers in TV sets.


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

Arcady said:


> Your plan will work fine. I have my system connected the same way. I don't use the speakers in TV sets.


Arcady........

The issue is WHY do our receivers not show any HDMI audio coming from the HD-Tivo. So far I have only seen one person here answer that they are getting DD from an HD-Tivo over HDMI and he had to buy a $1900 scaler to get it to work! 

I cannot image many folks are interested in sending the audio direct to their TV..., but why in the world would the instructions for the HD-Tivo tell you that you have to turn OFF DD 5.1 in order to receive audio over HDMI?

I even tried doing that, but it made absolutely no difference to my new Denon 2807... either way it reports no audio signal over HDMI!

Why the gent with the VP30 is receiving DD to his scaler is a complete mystery... why should the scaler see audio that receivers or HDMI equipped TV's are not? Unless this individual's Tivo has a newer firmware that allows the audio over HDMI to work properly. He could check this by finding out what firmware revision he has and posting it... or he could also try plugging his HDMI cable directly into his receiver rather than going through the scaler to see if he is still getting DD over HDMI.


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## jsirota (May 26, 2003)

HiHoStevo said:


> I cannot image many folks are interested in sending the audio direct to their TV...


Why not? If you're watching boring old TV (and it mostly is), then why not just use the TV's speakers?

Then there are those of us who just want to watch TV -- we don't even have any fancy audio system. The only speakers in the living room are the ones in the TV.

Since we have no stereo system, we disable DD5.1 on the HR10, and it all works fine ... we get audio over HDMI in that case.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

I have already explained this. Your TV does not decode 5.1 audio. You need to turn it off to hear sound. What is the issue? Is this so hard to understand? YOUR TV DOES NOT DO 5.1. ?????


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

HiHoStevo said:


> Arcady........
> 
> The issue is WHY do our receivers not show any HDMI audio coming from the HD-Tivo. So far I have only seen one person here answer that they are getting DD from an HD-Tivo over HDMI and he had to buy a $1900 scaler to get it to work!
> 
> ...


My receiver doesn't have an HDMI input. The HDTiVos send audio/video over the HDMI to my VP30. Then the VP30 sends the video to the TV over the HDMI and the audio to my receiver over an optical/coaxial cable.


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## hancox (Dec 17, 2004)

HiHoStevo said:


> The issue is WHY do our receivers not show any HDMI audio coming from the HD-Tivo. So far I have only seen one person here answer that they are getting DD from an HD-Tivo over HDMI and he had to buy a $1900 scaler to get it to work!


You missed my post, then  I have a nice cheap all-digital receiver with HDMI in, and get both non-encoded and DD5.1 without issue.

My $$$ would be on Denon muffing this, as we should all have the same firmware for the HD Tivo's now.


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## Robalo (Apr 24, 2006)

Hancox,

I agree that Denon might be the problem. But why is DTV exchanging
units to customers that call to report this problem ?

Arturo.


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

hancox said:


> You missed my post, then  I have a nice cheap all-digital receiver with HDMI in, and get both non-encoded and DD5.1 without issue.
> 
> My $$$ would be on Denon muffing this, as we should all have the same firmware for the HD Tivo's now.


Absolutely it could be a Denon issue...... that is what I am hoping to narrow down.

Although in another thread where I was talking about this one of the folks there has a 2807 and an HD-Tivo and he is getting DD 5.1 through the HDMI with no problem.

Once we isolate exactly where the problem is, then maybe we can get a firmware update to fix it.

hancox.... you are getting the DD5.1 over HDMI from your HD-Tivo correct?

Are you using the JVC 702B receiver?


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## Robalo (Apr 24, 2006)

Here is some info that my Denon Dealer sent me today. I have not tested these instructions yet.

Dear Mr. Guerra:

I have some instructions that will let you set up your receiver to
accept the DirecTV video and sound through the HDMI connection. If at
any point you experience difficulties with this, don't hesitate to
e-mail me back or call me.

Step 1: On your remote control, press the "SYSTEM SETUP" key. It will
be to the upper-left of the round set of "arrow" buttons. Throughout
this procedure, you will be using those arrow buttons to navigate the
menus and the "ENTER" button in the middle to confirm your choices.
Once you've pressed the "SYSTEM SETUP" button, the System Setup menu
should appear on your television.

Step 2: Arrow down to option #4 ("Video Setup") and press ENTER.

Step 3: Arrow up or down to the "HDMI In Assign" option in the Video
Setup menu and press ENTER.

Step 4: Arrow up or down to whichever Input is being used for DirecTV
(most likely "TV" or "DBS"). From there, use the left and right arrows
to select which HDMI terminal is receiving the signal from the DirecTV
box (probably HDMI 1).

Step 5: Arrow up or down to select "Audio" (which will appear once you
have assigned "HDMI 1" or "HDMI 2" to an input). From there, use the
left and right arrows to set the output to "AMP".

Step 6: Press ENTER.

At this point, you should be able to go back through and exit out of the
menus by arrowing down to "EXIT" and pressing ENTER. This should
conclude the setup.

Once again, if you have encounter any troubles with this, let us know.
Thanks!

John Balch
AudioSystems McAllen


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

That is exactly what I did when I set up my 2807!

However on the screen where you select "AMP" just above that my screen says "no signal."

I have run through this a couple of times and it has not made any difference at least for me... still no audio over HDMI.

I am currently on the road, but you might email back to your dealer and tell him my experience.


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## Robalo (Apr 24, 2006)

Steve,

I have also tested my dealer´s instructions with same negative results.

I have emailed my Dealer this info.

I hope that your new TIVO that DTV will be sending you will shed some light on this topic.

By the way: I don´t connect my TIVO to the phone line. My wife and I use Cell phones. So if TIVO needs some kind of update it will have to come in thru the satellite link. 

"Let´s see what happens"... said de blind man...

Arturo.


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## hancox (Dec 17, 2004)

HiHoStevo said:


> Absolutely it could be a Denon issue...... that is what I am hoping to narrow down.
> 
> Although in another thread where I was talking about this one of the folks there has a 2807 and an HD-Tivo and he is getting DD 5.1 through the HDMI with no problem.
> 
> ...


Yes and yes. HDMI DD coming into HDMI on the 702B


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## Robalo (Apr 24, 2006)

Hancox,

So I guess there is light at the end of the tunnel....

When you have a chance could you post firmware and software info from your TIVO ?

Is it an HR10-250 ?

Thanks,


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## hancox (Dec 17, 2004)

yup - HR10-250, f version, nothing out of the ordinary


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

Well I returned home this evening and the new/replacement HD-Tivo was sitting on the porch. So I took it downstairs and hooked it up with great anticipation...........

However, it works exactly like the other one... video over HDMI is just fine, but NO audio... After about an hour on the phone with DTV's HD-Tech support they are sending me a third HD-Tivo to try out and see if it makes any difference........

Supposedly the supervisor that authorized the 3rd HD-Tivo for the test has an HD-Tivo himself that is hooked to an audio receiver (I should have asked which one) and according to him his transmits audio over HDMI just fine!


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## Don B (May 13, 2000)

I've had entermitent problems with the 6.1 audio thru my receiver as well as 2 channel stereo thru my newer tv coming from some programs from the 10-250. As I said, its on again, off again. I figured its either the source station(local) or its a software problem in the 

10-250. I haven't attempted to use the HDMI at this point and using component connection along with both analog composite on the tv and optical into my Yamaha receiver which by 

the way, has other optical sources that work just fine so its not the Yamaha and as I said, the tv set in new. 

Draw your own conclusions.


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

Well to try and eliminate the Denon as the problem I picked up a Toshiba upconverting DVD player today that has HDMI out for both audio and video. 

After hooking up and setting the receiver, low and behold I had both audio and video over HDMI to the Denon and out to the screen and speakers.... 

This would seem to eliminate the Denon as the problem for not receiving audio via the HDMI cable from the HD-Tivo and put the ball squarely in Tivo/Hughes court. 

One interesting fact however... when I was playing the DVD through the HDMI port from the Toshiba, my Denon was only showing a "DVD Stereo" on the front panel... when I put this same DVD in my Oppo and output sound via the digital coax then the front panel says "Dolby Digital." 

I find this quite strange and confusing... it did the same connected to either HDMI 2 or HDMI 1. I did not have a lot of time to mess around and see if I could discover any changes... everything was set the same for both DVD players other than the source of the signal HDMI vs. digital coax. After this brief test I returned the DVD player from the folks I had borrowed it from. 

Looking forward to hearing any results from the rest of you..........


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

Well I just got off the phone with HD Tech Support at DTV. 

I had attempted to hook up my third HD-Tivo to see if I could receive audio over the HDMI connection. Unsuccessfully I might add......... this one was a "refurb" where the last two were new units. 

After a bit of checking the tech came back and told me that "yes" there is a "known issue" with HDMI audio support on the HD-Tivo. He claims it is a motherboard issue and that some of the Tivo's will work, but most will not! 

When I queried him on a "fix" he stated that DTV was coming out with a new HD-DVR later in the year, although he did not know exactly when. So I asked him, " by that statement am I to understand that DTV has no plans to update the current HD-Tivo's so that they can output audio over HDMI?" His answer was "yes, we are not going to do any update or fixes on the HD-Tivo." 

So the deal is if you have an HD-Tivo that outputs audio over HDMI consider yourself extremely lucky! If your HD-Tivo does not output audio over HDMI "welcome to the boat." 

Get comfortable with what you have, because nothing is going to change apparently.


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## hancox (Dec 17, 2004)

HiHoStevo - think you're getting crap from a CSR 

I believe they lumped the old HDMI problem (see the numerous long threads) with yours.

I offer the numerous threads on AVSForum and elsewhere regarding your Denon model, as well as my success with using a different amp, as evidence that the ball stays with Denon.

Good luck...


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## dougfetter (May 14, 2006)

I have only recently starting reading through the forums here looking for information about a VERY similar problem. Last weekend I connecting a Denon AVR-4306 between my HR10-250 HDTV TiVo and Mitsubishi HDTV, and have run into two HDMI related problems. The first appears to be identical to Stevo's:

1) The Denon 4306 is not recognizing the audio on the HDMI cable; I cannot get the 4306 to play the audio via its own amp, nor am I able to get the 4306 to pass the audio through to the HDTV. However, if the HDMI cable is connected directly to the HDTV the audio plays just fine, unless it is DD5.1 which the Mitsubishi HDTV does not handle. So I am using the optical output of the HR10-250 to route audio to the 4306.

2) Without the Denon receiver being added to the mix, all 4 of the video formats (480i, 480p, 720p & 1080i) were passed from the HR10-250 via the HDMI cable (along with audio) to the HDTV. However, the 4306 is not recognizing video in 480i format from the HR10-250 on the HDMI cable. I am able to get 480i video by connecting the HR10-250 to the 4306 via component cables, and sending the output of the 4306 to the HDTV via an HDMI cable.


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

Doug, sorry to hear you are having the same HDMI issues with your HD-Tivo that I am having... I was sort-of hoping that it was my Denon that was screwing up! If so I was going to trade up to the 4306 for the extra HDMI in!

Have you connected any other DVD players (especially the new Toshiba HD-DVD) to your 4306 via HDMI??? If so, what were your results?

Thanks,


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## dougfetter (May 14, 2006)

Similar to your thinking, one of my reasons for buying the Denon 4306 was because it had 3 HDMI inputs. But since I am still waiting for the dust to settle on HD-DVD vs BluRay, the only other HDMI component I have is an OPPO 971 DVD player. And this actually has a DVI output, so I use the DVI to HDMI cable, but this does not include audio. Thus I have no other HDMI source with which to check the Denon 4306's HDMI audio handling abilities.

So to workaround the problem of HR10-250-to-Denon HDMI audio problem, and because the OPPO DVD player is DVI & not HDMI, at this time I am using the optical audio outputs of these two sources. Works great, but requires an additional cable between each making you ask the question "Now what was the advantage of HDMI"?


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

Hi Doug I feel your pain...

I actually wanted the 4306, but cash was a bit short that week and so I jumped on the 2807 bandwagon instead.... I incorrectly surmised that in that it was Denon's newest offering that it would be more squared away in the HDMI department...

I ordered an HD-DVD player a couple of weeks ago from a good friend (my DTV dealer) and am "patiently....." waiting for him to get some back in stock. I was hoping to be able to use the Toshiba this weekend to put to rest whether this is a Denon issue or an HD-Tivo issue.

But alas it was not to be........


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

Doug.......

Have you compared the HDMI output from your HD-Tivo to its Component output?

I have played back and forth with this somewhat and am still not certain which I prefer... although I am leaning towards the HDMI. By using the Component outs from the Tivo I can allow the projector (InFocus) to use it's built in Faroudja chip to handle the heavy lifiting instead of whatever chip the Tivo is using. I think the colors might be a bit better with the Components, but the HDMI out has a smoothness to it that I find attractive.....


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## LlamaLarry (Apr 30, 2003)

I just got my new HDTiVo installed today. I hooked it up to my LCD that was previously hosting a DVD player via component connections and all was well. I broke out the HDMI cable in the box and got video but no audio. I searched about and found this thread (among others) and ended up calling Philips. We did discover that on my TV I can still get sound over an analog input. 

Since I still wanted to reduce cable clutter, I tried a different DVD player I had that has HDMI output and got the same results - video but no audio. I am going to try and find another HDMI cable tomorrow so I can try to determine if my problem is the cable that came with the box or HDMI audio decoding on the TV itself.


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## HomieG (Feb 17, 2003)

Unless your TV has a built-in decoder for the audio over HDMI, which most don't, you won't get audio on your TV through HDMI.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

If you turn off dolby digital (either on the TiVo or your DVD player) you may get sound from HDMI. Your TV apparently does not decode 5.1 (as most TV's don't).


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## LlamaLarry (Apr 30, 2003)

Right, I tried both DD settings on the TiVo (but did not reboot between changes). I also got no system sounds in either state.

On the DVD player I can choose PCM or Bitstream, but no audio with either one.

Do I need to powercycle the device, the TV, unplug the HDMI when I make changes for the TV to "pick it up"?


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

It should just work if your TV is capable of playing the sound being fed to it. I had a lot of difficulty getting my DVD player to work on HDMI - I ended up using a stereo RCA cable, but my HD TiVo works fine (with DD off.)

Turning off your TV or maybe changing inputs and then changing back might make it re-sync the HDMI port.


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## ortofl (May 22, 2006)

Hi guys, this sounds like the problem I posted under "chatter/rattling" noise I was getting from the HDMI input to my HDTV when I had dolby enabled on the HR10-250. As was told to me in a reply, normal stereo sound on the TV did result from disabling the 5.1 output from the HR10. The opinion was that it did, however still exist on the optical audio out and would be recorded. I guess most people with TVs or AV HDMI amps get silence from the HDMI when dolby is enabled-- I got a loud chatter noise with no intelligible audio from my TV speakers. 

What does confuse me is why this thread seems to say that newer AV amps still cannot decode dolby sent ofer HDMI!! I thought that HDMI was the universal input of the future. Would somebody familiar with the EE facts of HDMI reply if it is intended/designed to carry 5.1 without problems?


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

I get the DD5.1 over HDMI from my HDTiVos. They go to a VP30 which takes the video off the HDMI and forwards it to my TV over HDMI and takes the audio from the HDMI and forwards it to my receiver over an optical cable.


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## hancox (Dec 17, 2004)

ortofl said:


> I guess most people with TVs or AV HDMI amps get silence from the HDMI when dolby is enabled-- I got a loud chatter noise with no intelligible audio from my TV speakers.
> 
> What does confuse me is why this thread seems to say that newer AV amps still cannot decode dolby sent ofer HDMI!! I thought that HDMI was the universal input of the future. Would somebody familiar with the EE facts of HDMI reply if it is intended/designed to carry 5.1 without problems?


Wrong about people with amps. The problem, in your situation, is that your TV doesn't decode DD, while every HDMI amp will just fine.


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## HiHoStevo (Apr 1, 2003)

hancox said:


> Wrong about people with amps. The problem, in your situation, is that your TV doesn't decode DD, while every HDMI amp will just fine.


No hancox......... you are not correct.........

Most TV's will NOT decode DD 5.1 that part is correct..... the part that most amps with HDMI inputs will receive DD5.1 over that HDMI input from the HR10-250 is the incorrect part.

The vast majority 90% plus from my discussions and reviews of folks with HT receivers with HDMI inputs CANNOT receive ANY audio from the HR-10-250 over the HDMI input. I personally tried 4 new and 1 refurb'd HD-Tivo's from DTV and NONE of them would send ANY audio at all through my Denon 2807. There are a "very few" who have been sucessful, but according a "senior technician" that I spoke with at DTV it is a "motherboard issue," and DTV has absolutely no plans on fixing it. Some motherboards will work..., most will not.

Now if like Aaron... you are willing to insert a $2000 external scaler into your lineup then you can split off the audio and make it all work. 

Personally I am dumping my Denon 2807 (which according to Denon has the latest and greatest HDMI available) and am going to try the new Pioneer Elite 84 with fingers crossed.....


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Well the VP30 wasn't that much. After my HD+ trade in and selling my SDI card and SDI DVD player the VP30 only cost me around $100. The issue is the HDTiVo not the 2807 since the HDTiVo isn't passing the audio like it's supposed to. I never tried connecting my HDTiVos directly to my 2807/3806 since I used the HDMI through the VP30 and prior to that with my 3805 I was using the optical out.


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