# Southland Season 4 (yes there will be spoilers)



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

Action-filled season premiere. Some of the segments seem pulled directly from actual incidents, such as the runaway car. There is a COPS episode from Las Vegas about 20 years ago where there was a runaway car behind one of the casinos, and Cooper's attempt to stop it is an almost frame-by-frame exact re-enactment of that COPS episode.

Another one is the ambush of the police station. There was a similar incident at Detroit PD a few years ago and this too looks like a re-enactment of the security footage of that shoot out.

I am NOT liking Lucy Liu's character thus far. She reminds me of what I see a lot in this line of work: overcompensating for being female in a (still) largely male profession. Yet, her command presence was not all that convincing, as the traffic stop of the young black male in the old Celica showed. And considering she had been nearly killed on another stop (the dash-cam footage Cooper was watching at the end), her tactics on that stop were terrible.


----------



## dowalker (Sep 29, 2002)

Glad it is back!
Great show overall


----------



## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

I like Lucy's character.

Damn was I hoping her YouTube would be mud wrestling or something.


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

It was a good show. I immediately recognized some of the incidents from real life events, especially the station shoot out.

I don't dislike Lucy's character but lots of bad tactics for sure. I also don't agree with the rest of the squad making fun of her because of the video.


----------



## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

Where's the intro tune?


----------



## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

uncdrew said:


> Where's the intro tune?


It was there on mine.

Greg


----------



## Ment (Mar 27, 2008)

Random Mad Momma: 'Its going to take Jesus and two more white folk to keep me from kicking your ass!"

Best cop show going. Southland..so glad you're back!


----------



## Unbeliever (Feb 3, 2001)

Ment said:


> Random Mad Momma: 'Its going to take Jesus and two more white folk to keep me from kicking your ass!"


"Now I understand why you preferred jail"

--Carlos V.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

snowjay said:


> I also don't agree with the rest of the squad making fun of her because of the video.


This. Their comments initially made me believe she did something to look like the LAPD's equivalent of Kim Kardashian, but in reality that attack was quite brutal.



Ment said:


> Random Mad Momma: 'Its going to take Jesus and two more white folk to keep me from kicking your ass!"





Unbeliever said:


> "Now I understand why you preferred jail"


The best part of the episode, and something which reminds me of an actual incident at work. I had to take a juvenile African-American girl home to her grandmother (and actual guardian) after she had been arrested. She had been quite sassy with me and my partner, until we pulled up to her house, and then she got VERY quiet.

We quickly realized why. You could tell Grandma ruled that household with an iron fist. My partner and I got out of there real quick before Grandma did something in front of us that would necessitate us arresting her


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

RonDawg said:


> This. Their comments initially made me believe she did something to look like the LAPD's equivalent of Kim Kardashian, but in reality that attack was quite brutal.


That's what I thought too. The look on Coopers face at the end might of been a little foreshadowing for a possible event later in the season if he were to meet up with this guy.


----------



## NatasNJ (Jan 7, 2002)

Great episode. Loved it from top to bottom. This episode seemed to have 2-3 major events where typically it felt like they only had 1 per episode. Bravo... 

Love watching the old rookie take over as his mentors clone by trying to follow the book. Should make for very interesting conflicts ahead...


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

This show packs so much into an episode it is crazy. There was a big payoff and it went to commercial break so I figured we were at the end and were going to come back to the 5 minute wrap-up, then I checked the time and we were only halfway into the show! 

I am a little bummed at how much the budget cuts have slashed the cast. While I enjoy the patrol and I think Lydia is a very strong detective, I quite liked the gang unit detectives and will miss those characters and stories. There used to be 8-10 people in the opening credits, now there are five maybe? You'd think instead of paying big name guest stars for 3-5 episodes they could pay some nobodys for a full season.


----------



## phox_mulder (Feb 23, 2006)

Anyone know who played the huge Lucy Liu attacker?

Is he really that big?
Is she really that tiny?
Or was there camera trickery afoot.

He looked semi familiar, like a wrestler maybe (though I've never watched wrastlin')


phox


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

She looked really tiny next to Cooper. I wonder if we are used to seeing her in 4" heels and as a cop character she is in flats. Her IMDB bio says 5'3".


----------



## Gunnyman (Jul 10, 2003)

I have a continuity question regarding this show.
I recall seeing a couple of seasons ago that C Thomas Howell's character retired. Am I remembering something wrong? Also he seems a whole lot less abrasive than he was in the past.


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

Gunnyman said:


> I have a continuity question regarding this show.
> I recall seeing a couple of seasons ago that C Thomas Howell's character retired. Am I remembering something wrong? Also he seems a whole lot less abrasive than he was in the past.


He was a drunk, retired, went to rehab and came out of retirement.


----------



## Gunnyman (Jul 10, 2003)

Ah ok Thanks Snowjay.
I missed the first tNT season. This must be when that all happened.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

snowjay said:


> He was a drunk, retired, went to rehab and came out of retirement.


I think the rehab was separate from the return. The episode where he was drunk and went nuts on Chickie and flipped the car and caused him to go to rehab was the end of season 1. His retirement party was early in season 1. I think he returned because he had nothing better to do or his wife wanted him out of the house or something.

I looked it up. Dewey's retirement party was S01E02. He was then immediately in the next episode. I think he never actually retired.


----------



## TheMerk (Feb 26, 2001)

So glad this show remains on the air.


----------



## LlamaLarry (Apr 30, 2003)

So, no more Chickie?


----------



## Ment (Mar 27, 2008)

LlamaLarry said:


> So, no more Chickie?


She was headed towards a career in LAPD SWAT at the end of last season. Given the reductions in the cast due to budget, think she's a goner as far as screentime.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

snowjay said:


> He was a drunk, retired, went to rehab and came out of retirement.


Actually Dewey came out of retirement well before his meltdown and subsequent rehab. His wife left him right after the retirement party, and for financial reasons he had to come back to work.


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

That's what I get for watching the first 3 seasons out of order.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

Storyline continuity has been a bit weak since the TNT acquisition. Season 2 was all messed up since NBC stopped filming before all the episodes were complete, but Season 3 wasn't a lot better.

For example, the woman who showed up on Lydia's doorstep (and was later found dead on the beach): was that a continuation from a previous Season? I don't remember why she was "paid" for her testimony.

There are a lot of unresolved plot loose ends from the previous seasons. Did Chickie make SWAT? What happened to Salinger's marriage? Whose cop funeral did Cooper and Sherman attend in Palm Springs, and who was that inconsolable deputy who was crying worse than the widow?


----------



## jsmeeker (Apr 2, 2001)

RonDawg said:


> There are a lot of unresolved plot loose ends from the previous seasons. Did Chickie make SWAT? What happened to Salinger's marriage? Whose cop funeral did Cooper and Sherman attend in Palm Springs, and who was that inconsolable deputy who was crying worse than the widow?


Who was that deputy? Probably the cop's boyfriend.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

jsmeeker said:


> Who was that deputy? Probably the cop's boyfriend.


That's what I was wondering too. That also didn't appear to be an LODD (Line of Duty Death) since the church would normally be overrun with cops, some coming from hundreds if not thousands of miles away. It could have been a suicide, which sadly is a problem (an NYPD cop took his own life just a few days ago while on duty  ). Plus, Cooper and Sherman went in Cooper's personal car and not in a police vehicle, which would be expected for an cop's LODD funeral.


----------



## Mikeyis4dcats (Oct 2, 2003)

it was pretty clear that the cop that died was a "friend" of Coops.

I miss Sal he most.


----------



## Mikeyis4dcats (Oct 2, 2003)

big guy was played by Milos Milicevic, who is an assist. director on the show.


----------



## Generic (Dec 27, 2005)

I really like this show. I tend to like Southern California based cop shows over shows from other parts of the country since I can identify with them more then other places. I have always preferred the street patrol story lines but the detective story lines have been good too. Sometimes, the personal stories have become a little too "soap opera-ish" at times for me as I like the job stories lines the best (a la Adam-12).


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

I enjoyed last nights episode but I can't help but think the writers are taking the easy way out inserting real life events in the episodes.


----------



## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

Yeah, millionare hubby happy that cheating wife is dead. :down:


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

uncdrew said:


> Yeah, millionare hubby happy that cheating wife is dead. :down:


I thought that was hilarious. Especially the butler's response: "La bruja es muerta."


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

snowjay said:


> I can't help but think the writers are taking the easy way out inserting real life events in the episodes.


It worked for "Law & Order." "Ripped from the headlines" as they used to advertise.


----------



## NatasNJ (Jan 7, 2002)

Is the Blonde from last season no longer part of the cast?


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

RonDawg said:


> It worked for "Law & Order." "Ripped from the headlines" as they used to advertise.


Yeah but there it was the basic premise and they would throw in their own twists and turns so it would turn out differently than it did in real life.

Between the station shooting last week and Ben punching the girl last night, there really was no unique twist to either of them to make it different. Just seems lazy, like they are just sticking in real life events verbatim to take up space.


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

NatasNJ said:


> Is the Blonde from last season no longer part of the cast?


Chickie, she was transferred to metro.


----------



## NatasNJ (Jan 7, 2002)

snowjay said:


> Chickie, she was transferred to metro.


What does that mean? She off the show?


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

NatasNJ said:


> What does that mean? She off the show?


Yes.


----------



## Generic (Dec 27, 2005)

I just don't believe Ben Sherman goes from a somewhat idealistic rookie cop last season to a burned out veteran cop this season (or at least this episode). Maybe he thinks he has just enough street experience to make him a little cocky?


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

I think he's just overcompensating...he's been the rookie, and now he thinks that because somebody is even rookier than him, he can act like a veteran. And he doesn't realize what a tool he's being.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

Generic said:


> Maybe he thinks he has just enough street experience to make him a little cocky?


That's exactly what has happened and that's how he lost his cool during the loud music (from the yellow Sentra) scene.


----------



## ADG (Aug 20, 2003)

snowjay said:


> Yeah but there it was the basic premise and they would throw in their own twists and turns so it would turn out differently than it did in real life.
> 
> Between the station shooting last week and Ben punching the girl last night, there really was no unique twist to either of them to make it different. Just seems lazy, like they are just sticking in real life events verbatim to take up space.


And my opinion is precisely the opposite of yours. I love that the show is including recreations of real-life events. Why not show some scenes of what really happens out there? It's not as though it's turning into a documentary series - just the occasional recreation of true life instead of (or in addition to) something from some writer's imagination, that's all. I'm a fan.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

This show is so fantastic. I would be ok with less "real life" but I'm also ok with them including it. It pulls me out a little bit, but not so bad.

That poor lady under the car.  Even if she was a witch! And I even feel bad for the dad who killed her. He made one bad decision that ended a life and ruined his own and maybe that of his family.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Zevida said:


> That poor lady under the car.  Even if she was a witch!


The scene where her husband and servants react to the news of her death was perfectly played.


----------



## Kablemodem (May 26, 2001)

As soon as he said his wife was out with her boyfriend I knew he wasn't going to be too broken up over her death.

What did the guy say he thought he hit? Whatever it was, it wasn't something that roams the streets of L.A.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

NatasNJ said:


> What does that mean? She off the show?


The writers apparently have written her off the show, and used her transfer to Metro (of which SWAT is a part) as the excuse to do so.


----------



## phox_mulder (Feb 23, 2006)

Kablemodem said:


> What did the guy say he thought he hit? Whatever it was, it wasn't something that roams the streets of L.A.


Coyote.

They do frequent the hills around L.A., so it is plausible.

phox


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

I love the "Southland Style"

Interesting article (no spoilers):

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/shawn-hatosy/southland-preview-_b_1227506.html


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> (...) because somebody is even rookier than him, he can act like a veteran.


Who played the new cop that he teased/flirted with? She looks very familiar...


----------



## Unbeliever (Feb 3, 2001)

Amnesia said:


> Who played the new cop that he teased/flirted with? She looks very familiar...


http://www.imdb.com/name/nm1770441/

--Carlos V.


----------



## Unbeliever (Feb 3, 2001)

Awww, nobody got the "Brenda" reference?

--Carlos "227" V.


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

No, it was Rose Rollins, who was a regular on _Chase_ (and one season of _The L Word_).


----------



## Unbeliever (Feb 3, 2001)

Amnesia said:


> No, it was Rose Rollins, who was a regular on _Chase_ (and one season of _The L Word_).


Hmm... I think you're right. Their IMDB face shots were too similar for me.

--Carlos V.


----------



## Kablemodem (May 26, 2001)

Unbeliever said:


> Awww, nobody got the "Brenda" reference?
> 
> --Carlos "227" V.


I think that was her character's name on the show 227.

--Kablemodem ""


----------



## Unbeliever (Feb 3, 2001)

Kablemodem said:


> I think that was her character's name on the show 227.


That's half of it.

I didn't get it until the 2nd "Brenda" with the shot full centered on Gibb's/Gamma's Face.

--Carlos V.


----------



## Kablemodem (May 26, 2001)

I had recognized her as Marla Gibbs, but I didn't know it was a reference to 227 since I never watched the show.


----------



## Gerryex (Apr 24, 2004)

About the car that killed the lady, how did Regina King and her partner go from the location of the torn off hand and bag to the house where the suspected car was? It looks like they just jumped from one location to the next with no rationale shown that led them to the suspected car's location.

Gerry


----------



## Unbeliever (Feb 3, 2001)

Gerryex said:


> About the car that killed the lady, how did Regina King and her partner go from the location of the torn off hand and bag to the house where the suspected car was? It looks like they just jumped from one location to the next with no rationale shown that led them to the suspected car's location.


As they were first walking up to the handbag, mention was made of calling to get the traffic camera tapes.

--Carlos V.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

phox_mulder said:


> Coyote.
> 
> They do frequent the hills around L.A., so it is plausible.


That had to have been an awfully big HUGE coyote in order to be plausible. When the camera panned around to the front of the SUV, you could see the hood was caved in, not just the bumper.

No, it's just another lame excuse law enforcement hears from DUI drivers. Another common one from someone who is very intoxicated is that they only had "two beers."


----------



## Gerryex (Apr 24, 2004)

Unbeliever said:


> As they were first walking up to the handbag, mention was made of calling to get the traffic camera tapes.
> 
> --Carlos V.


Yes! You are right. I remember that now that you mention it.

Thanks,
Gerry


----------



## Mr Flippant (Jan 2, 2009)

RonDawg said:


> That had to have been an awfully big HUGE coyote in order to be plausible. When the camera panned around to the front of the SUV, you could see the hood was caved in, not just the bumper.
> 
> No, it's just another lame excuse law enforcement hears from DUI drivers. Another common one from someone who is very intoxicated is that they only had "two beers."


That and a woman's body lining the wheel well.


----------



## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

RonDawg said:


> I thought that was hilarious. Especially the butler's response: "La bruja es muerta."


I've just seen that exact scene of 3 or 4 shows over the years. Saw it coming miles away. It is good the first time.


----------



## Generic (Dec 27, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I think he's just overcompensating...he's been the rookie, and now he thinks that because somebody is even rookier than him, he can act like a veteran. And he doesn't realize what a tool he's being.


Ya, I think you are right. When I typed that, I was thinking about his behavior only on incidents and not the entire episode. Maybe it is a little of both.


----------



## Ment (Mar 27, 2008)

Everyone still have episode 3 'Community' on their DVRs and haven't watched? 

Never heard of 'Hood Day' before this viewing but apparently its a block party every year in the hood. 

How do I get a Ben Bunny.  Wonder if its true that cops that make the news for bad things they do attract the badge bunnies. Ben's got round 2 lined up at his DCA coronation.

Sammy is a badass. I don't know if its because he has a fatalistic view of life after his partner got killed but he just doesn't give a f*ck. Don't remember if Crawford have anything directly with Nate's death, but IA is going to get pulled in with a cuffed suspect dying on him.


----------



## CharlieW (May 30, 2001)

I'm still enjoying Southland, but the elimination of so many beloved characters from earlier seasons has caused this show to drop a few notches. Chickie, Sal, Russell -- all characters sorely missed. I wish they'd get Sammy back into plainclothes and give him a new partner, get Cooper and Sherman riding together again and cast Lucy Liu into the La Brea Tar Pits. Could we get just one MORE scene with her yelling into that stupid cell phone (while they were engaging potential criminals and crime scenes)? If I were Cooper, I would have tossed the damn thing out the window and told her to pay attention to her job. So far, she's proven to be an average cop at best -- and she's supposed to be judging whether Cooper can return to full duty? 

Since I'm ranting -- I'm not sure I really want a Lydia/pregnancy/single-mom-trying-to-be-a-cop storyline. She can be a bit of a dreary character as it is -- we don't need her to cross the line over into martyr territory. I don't need "who's going to watch the baby?" drama out of my cop shows. That being said, I understand that this is truly a character study, more than a cop show -- Ann Biderman has written a very strong female character in a "man's world" in 'Lydia' and I think Regina King does a terrific job portraying the character. 

One other thing, her new partner, (Ruben?) is kind of blah. 

I do like Carl Lumbly as the new Captain though, probably the best new addition into this season's cast. 

By the lack of activity in this thread over the last couple of episodes, I'm wondering if the rest of you 'Southland' fans are finding this season a little below standard so far?


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

I'm still watching and I still love the show. I think it is just as excellent as ever, but I agree that I miss the ensemble aspect of the show. I miss the gang squad detectives the most. I am enjoying having Sammy in uniform and paired up with Ben, I think they are a lot of fun to watch together.

I'm fine with Lucy Lui's character and I'm enjoying watching her and Cooper as well.

I'm a bit conflicted on the baby story. In general they just kind of suck and are full of a lot of cliches. On the other hand it is a pretty organic and true to life story of how a single woman in a man's profession has to balance her home life and her work life and how many times men don't face the same challenges and pressures. If they can keep it to just a passing mention in each show, ok, but if it is a big focus every week like it was this week, I'll get tired of it.

I do love Regina King though - maybe they are setting her up for an Emmy episode? She deserves one.


----------



## CharlieW (May 30, 2001)

Zevida said:


> I do love Regina King though - maybe they are setting her up for an Emmy episode? She deserves one.


She truly is deserving, I enjoy her work very much and I feel she is the true "heart" of the show.

And again, I still love the show, too. It's better than most shows on the air today -- if I had to make a Top 10 shows list right now, it would certainly fit in there someplace. I love the feel of this show -- the way they allow us to sort of stumble into scenarios along with the characters, sometimes without even getting a radio call. It gives it a level of realism that you don't see in many shows of this genre.


----------



## Ment (Mar 27, 2008)

Dewey was hilarious pranking Sammy on his dog rescue. +1 on Regina King, she'll get an Emmy nom for sure. For those who are interested in the 'realness' factor of the show you'll be interested to read the review blog of Southland EPs from a law enforcement perspective. http://www.leelofland.com/wordpress/category/southland/ Its a great read and you learn alot about procedure. Southland gets it right most of the time.


----------



## calitivo (Dec 6, 2002)

First two episodes of the season were good, but the last two weren't up to par. Regina King is fantastic in this show. I think Lucy Lui has been a great addition, but seems like they will kill her off with her being a "special guest". I do miss Chickie though. Lydia's new partner is AWFUL, but I haven't liked any of her partners, especially Tom Everett Scott. Confused about why Ben isn't rich any more.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

My understanding is that Ben IS rich...he's always had the nicest car of any of the characters (this season it's the new Range Rover Evoque). However as another example of lack of storyline continuity, the writers have not brought up his upbringing at all since perhaps Season 2.

The writers need to tighten up their stories too. Some of the things that happened, like Sammy shooting the dog, or Sammy and Ben leaving their post because they were bored only to return after several people were killed, doesn't just get swept under the rug. In the real LAPD they'd be on "administrative leave pending an investigation." I'd be very disappointed if the writers continue with this sloppiness; accuracy of portrayal is what used to separate this show from your typical cop show.


----------



## CharlieW (May 30, 2001)

RonDawg said:


> ...Sammy and Ben leaving their post because they were bored only to return after several people were killed, doesn't just get swept under the rug. In the real LAPD they'd be on "administrative leave pending an investigation."


I'm glad you mentioned that, Ron -- my immediate thought was how they were going to explain being out of their area. They couldn't say there was a request for back-up, I'm sure that would be logged/recorded somewhere.

This was a case of Sammy just wanting the situation to "work itself out" -- which is not unusual behavior for him as it seems he very often likes to inflame a situation or really go outside of what would seem to be normal protocol. To me, he comes off as a bit of a renegade cop. Obviously, as a city cop, you're always going to need eyes in the back of your head, but when your partner is Sammy, it seems even more so. He's always stirring the pot.


----------



## MikeMar (Jan 7, 2005)

CharlieW said:


> I'm glad you mentioned that, Ron -- my immediate thought was how they were going to explain being out of their area. They couldn't say there was a request for back-up, I'm sure that would be logged/recorded somewhere.
> 
> This was a case of Sammy just wanting the situation to "work itself out" -- which is not unusual behavior for him as it seems he very often likes to inflame a situation or really go outside of what would seem to be normal protocol. To me, he comes off as a bit of a renegade cop. Obviously, as a city cop, you're always going to need eyes in the back of your head, but when your partner is Sammy, it seems even more so. He's always stirring the pot.


Didn't they field a call and Ben asked Sammy why they were taking it.


----------



## CharlieW (May 30, 2001)

MikeMar said:


> Didn't they field a call and Ben asked Sammy why they were taking it.


I think you're right, (I was battling the flu while watching this episode, so I was admittedly a little groggy  ) -- it came up as a "convenient excuse" to leave the area where they knew something was about to go down. And now, if the questions started to fly, Ben would be put in a position where he'd have to lie for his partner.

Maybe RonDawg could shed some light - if you were staking out an area where you had a pretty good feeling that something was about to happen, would protocol be to ask your dispatcher to see if there was another car that could pick up the incoming call so that you could remain at your post?


----------



## ADG (Aug 20, 2003)

Sorry, but may I ask what the story is with these "season threads"? What's the point?


----------



## Ment (Mar 27, 2008)

ADG said:


> Sorry, but may I ask what the story is with these "season threads"? What's the point?


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=470892&highlight=season

You can spend an hour reading the thread, have your questions answered or further contribute to the thread or let it die.


----------



## ADG (Aug 20, 2003)

Ment said:


> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=470892&highlight=season
> 
> You can spend an hour reading the thread, have your questions answered or further contribute to the thread or let it die.


Thanks, I'm not a fan.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

CharlieW said:


> Maybe RonDawg could shed some light - if you were staking out an area where you had a pretty good feeling that something was about to happen, would protocol be to ask your dispatcher to see if there was another car that could pick up the incoming call so that you could remain at your post?


Actually, what was happening was the dispatcher was asking for "any available unit" to handle a high-priority call. Basically, everybody is tied up on something, a call that cannot wait has come in, and the dispatcher is asking for a volunteer to clear their call early (if they can) and respond. That's not unusual at an agency as busy as the LAPD, and sometimes happens even in departments like mine which aren't as busy.

What happened here is that Sammy thought the detail was BS and so used the excuse of hot calls coming in as the reason to abandon his post. That's despite the fact that the Captain himself had posted them there. That's why Ben was questioning him...at the real LAPD (or any other police agency), those officers could have been disciplined for failure to obey orders and/or dereliction of duty. It would have ESPECIALLY happened given the outcome, as police services were promised but not fulfilled, opening up the agency to civil liability.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

Another stellar episode this week. It is amazing how they can intertwine the laughs with the drama. All of the pranks got me laughing. I did appreciate Sammy with no towel. 

I think they are setting up Lucy to be killed by her stalker. Interesting that both she and Cooper blew that off when they should have known better. 

Cooper is such a great character. He could have been so one dimensional as the tough cop but he really has a lot of layers and depth, plus charisma. 

I know people have been griping about him but I like the new detective. He and Regina King play off each other nicely and friendly. It's a welcome change after her combative last partner.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Zevida said:


> He and Regina King play off each other nicely and friendly.


One thing I especially noticed this week is how _everybody _plays well off each other. There's a ton of great chemistry in the current cast.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

I've grown to like Lucy Liu's character. Since the season premiere, the writers have backed off her original Pat Benatar persona* and have made her more human.

If it weren't for Cooper being gay, I can SO see them hooking up. It might still happen.

*"Hit me with your best shot"


----------



## Gunnyman (Jul 10, 2003)

Is this the first time Cooper has acknowledged his orientation in "public"? I know his partner now knows but the other cops on the scene can out him now.


----------



## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> One thing I especially noticed this week is how _everybody _plays well off each other. There's a ton of great chemistry in the current cast.


Yup, digging it all myself too.

Enjoyed this week's show a ton. Wished it could have gone longer.


----------



## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

Gunnyman said:


> Is this the first time Cooper has acknowledged his orientation in "public"? I know his partner now knows but the other cops on the scene can out him now.


Yeah, wasn't sure about that. I know Dewey respects Cooper a ton, but Dewey is a ******bag and would be making gay jokes towards Cooper all the time if he knew.

He would be doing it in a friendly hateful way, not a mean hateful way.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

Gunnyman said:


> Is this the first time Cooper has acknowledged his orientation in "public"?


It's not the first time he's outed himself to another cop though. Remember the long drive back from Palm Springs, where they visited both Dewey (in rehab) as well as the cop's funeral? Cooper did basically the same thing to Sherman, who had a rather shocked look on his face as the scene faded to the credits.

For some reason the writers never went any further with that.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

uncdrew said:


> Yeah, wasn't sure about that. I know Dewey respects Cooper a ton, but Dewey is a ******bag and would be making gay jokes towards Cooper all the time if he knew.
> 
> He would be doing it in a friendly hateful way, not a mean hateful way.


This. Just look at how he talks to Tang sometimes. The man is a poster child for Hostile Work Environment.


----------



## Ment (Mar 27, 2008)

Gunnyman said:


> Is this the first time Cooper has acknowledged his orientation in "public"? I know his partner now knows but the other cops on the scene can out him now.


Dewey will get on it right after he gets done toasting Cooper and adding to Tang's tab. 

Writers did a great job exploring Cooper's orientation and looking past his 'tough guy' exterior. I wondered if they buried forever after the Palm Spring episode.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

I like how they handle Cooper being gay a LOT. It is just a regular part of his character. They don't go around all the time talking about every character's sex life. Sometimes it comes up naturally in the story and sometimes it doesn't. We don't have to have it as a focus all the time or be reminded of it constantly. It really adds power to the "he's a regular guy" and being gay is just a small part of that, not his whole identity. It is important to him and who he is, but not the focus of the show.


----------



## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

Zevida said:


> I like how they handle Cooper being gay a LOT. It is just a regular part of his character. They don't go around all the time talking about every character's sex life. Sometimes it comes up naturally in the story and sometimes it doesn't. We don't have to have it as a focus all the time or be reminded of it constantly. It really adds power to the "he's a regular guy" and being gay is just a small part of that, not his whole identity. It is important to him and who he is, but not the focus of the show.


Yet we sure do get Sherman's sex life thrown at us nearly every week (thankfully).


----------



## Gunnyman (Jul 10, 2003)

RonDawg said:


> It's not the first time he's outed himself to another cop though. Remember the long drive back from Palm Springs, where they visited both Dewey (in rehab) as well as the cop's funeral? Cooper did basically the same thing to Sherman, who had a rather shocked look on his face as the scene faded to the credits.
> 
> For some reason the writers never went any further with that.


I missed that season it seems. I wonder if I can watch it anymore online.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

uncdrew said:


> Yet we sure do get Sherman's sex life thrown at us nearly every week (thankfully).


That's only been this season - and it shows his development as a character from the rookie to acting like a real cop and reaping the rewards.

We've seen Cooper getting out of bed with a guy so it's not like we haven't seen his sex life either.


----------



## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

I remember it from earlier seasons too. Like the years he was living with that rich family with the whiney kid.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

uncdrew said:


> I remember it from earlier seasons too. Like the years he was living with that rich family with the whiney kid.


That took me a minute then I LOLed.


----------



## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

loving the show... one thing bugs me:

cooper had years of back pain, and then surgery... and he's 1000% healthy?... 
realistically, a guy his age and history, no back surgery is 100% effective.

when he caught the jumper, no way his back holds up from that... i keep waiting for the "cooper's back goes out on him" storyline.. but i guess they're going to drop the whole bad back storyline... which is fine with me.... just sayin....


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

Yeah I was waiting for his back to suddenly go out while trying to prevent that suicide.

Again another example where the writers are becoming sloppy with their storylines.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

I was kind of tired of the back storyline, so I hope that the miracle surgery continues to hold for many years!


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

Maybe Cooper had the same doctors that operated on Steve Austin (not the wrestler).


----------



## Unbeliever (Feb 3, 2001)

As someone with the same back problems and surgery as Cooper is said to have (lower lumbar), his abilities are believable to me. Cooper is shown as a fitness/workout nut. Get the initial problem stabilized, and having a strong set of core muscles and lower back muscles will help tremendously, even if there was residual pain. He was shown in the premier strengthening those muscles.

Given the way he was holding the jumper, he wasn't using his back at all. It was all arms and chest. What I DON'T believe about that scene was that he didn't have any anchoring to the building. Nothing holding his legs down. The jumper's momentum would have pulled Cooper over the side. (like the fireman-over-the-railing death at that baseball game a while back).

--Carlos V.


----------



## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

Zevida said:


> That took me a minute then I LOLed.


Since they're in Los Angeles I half expect the gang from the OC to show up.


----------



## Kablemodem (May 26, 2001)

Sandy, while there to defend some third striker, drops off some bagels to cheer everyone up.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

Unbeliever said:


> Given the way he was holding the jumper, he wasn't using his back at all. It was all arms and chest. What I DON'T believe about that scene was that he didn't have any anchoring to the building. Nothing holding his legs down. The jumper's momentum would have pulled Cooper over the side. (like the fireman-over-the-railing death at that baseball game a while back).


Remember though that Tang and two other cops (I do like that the show uses a lot of real LAPD officers as extras) were pulling on Cooper by his gun belt. With the weight of that kid on his arms, and him bent over in a u-shape, that had to have been extremely stressful on his back.


----------



## CharlieW (May 30, 2001)

I enjoyed this week's episode a lot. Probably my favorite of the season thus far.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

The last two minutes of this week's episode were intense. My heart was pounding when it was over.


----------



## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

Unbeliever said:


> As someone with the same back problems and surgery as Cooper is said to have (lower lumbar), his abilities are believable to me. Cooper is shown as a fitness/workout nut. Get the initial problem stabilized, and having a strong set of core muscles and lower back muscles will help tremendously, even if there was residual pain. He was shown in the premier strengthening those muscles.
> 
> Given the way he was holding the jumper, he wasn't using his back at all. It was all arms and chest. What I DON'T believe about that scene was that he didn't have any anchoring to the building. Nothing holding his legs down. The jumper's momentum would have pulled Cooper over the side. (like the fireman-over-the-railing death at that baseball game a while back).
> 
> --Carlos V.





RonDawg said:


> Remember though that Tang and two other cops (I do like that the show uses a lot of real LAPD officers as extras) were pulling on Cooper by his gun belt. With the weight of that kid on his arms, and him bent over in a u-shape, that had to have been extremely stressful on his back.


espeically because of the way he was holding the jumper and didn't have an anchor, it was his back and back muscles that would have allowed him to catch the jumper without going over. we're talking 150+ lbs dead falling weight.

also, he had the one fight with the pcp guy.. where he landed hard a few times... that alone would aggravate many post op patients.... that's more believable that he could tolerate fighting and being body slammed... the catching the jumper one would hurt alot of healthy people.


----------



## ewolfr (Feb 12, 2001)

'Southland' puts viewers on L.A.'s mean streets

The gritty TNT crime series uses former gang members and off-duty LAPD personnel to bolster the reality quotient of story lines that are usually filmed on location.

http://www.latimes.com/entertainment/news/tv/la-ca-southland-20120304,0,2679113,full.story


----------



## camyahoo (Jan 5, 2012)

ewolfr said:


> 'Southland' puts viewers on L.A.'s mean streets
> 
> The gritty TNT crime series uses former gang members and off-duty LAPD personnel to bolster the reality quotient of story lines that are usually filmed on location.


Thay have filmed two scenes in my bank over the years, and they always use the bank employees as extras. I was in a second season episode for about two seconds.


----------



## gastrof (Oct 31, 2003)

I'm sorry if I've missed any discussion there was of this, but I caught up this weekend with a few episodes.

Was anyone else a little surprised that Cooper was still alive after (apparently) having half his neck bitten off?

He looked like he was barely alive and was about to bleed to death.

Next week, he's got a bandage with, after a chase, a little spot of blood? He's in perfect shape? Or once the bandage comes off do we see a hunk of Cudlitz's neck missing thanks to CGI?

___________________
Make the light a sandwich, thank you. Bark the bandaid.


----------



## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

They didn't give any indications of how long he was laid up. For all we know, this is 6 months later.

Greg


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

I wouldn't call the "Dracula scene" having half his neck bit off, but yes there was a lot of blood. I can still see him returning to work a week later though if nothing major was injured (esophagus/carotid/jugular).

At least they made it more realistic by showing him with bandages (and later, exposed stitches) where the wound was, along with the bruise on Tang's face which lasted at least two episodes after their run-in with the PCP guy.


----------



## Unbeliever (Feb 3, 2001)

Holy search consent bluff, Batman! It worked, though.

_United States v. Fuentes_ "The mere refusal to consent to a stop or search does not give rise to reasonable suspicion or probable cause."

Ben had reasonable suspicion on voyeur guy's location, the laptop, and his behavior, I think, but bluffing the consent makes the evidence building easier.

Although it strains credulity for me that the cruiser can be sitting there motionless, with lights on, and someone is clueless enough to run full speed into it. Ben's going to take all sorts of crap from his partner if he survives.

--Carlos V.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

Unbeliever said:


> Although it strains credulity for me that the cruiser can be sitting there motionless, with lights on, and someone is clueless enough to run full speed into it. Ben's going to take all sorts of crap from his partner if he survives.


OTOH it did seem unbelievable. That Crown Vic had been in the middle of that intersection for quite some time before the crash.

Then again this is LA, which hardly has a shortage of idiot drivers.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

I also LOL'd at Cooper's comment about the driver of the Nissan Leaf he and Tang pulled over: "An a**hole with a small carbon footprint is still an a**hole."


----------



## weaver (Feb 27, 2004)

Unbeliever said:


> ...
> Although it strains credulity for me that the cruiser can be sitting there motionless, with lights on, and someone is clueless enough to run full speed into it. Ben's going to take all sorts of crap from his partner if he survives.
> 
> --Carlos V.


The lights weren't on. Still makes no sense, though; it was there a long time.


----------



## gastrof (Oct 31, 2003)

gchance said:


> They didn't give any indications of how long he was laid up. For all we know, this is 6 months later.
> 
> Greg


How long is the female detective going to be pregnant, then? 

__________________
Only with my silent alarm.


----------



## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

gastrof said:


> How long is the female detective going to be pregnant, then?


Depends how deep that stab wound was.


----------



## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

gastrof said:


> How long is the female detective going to be pregnant, then?


D'oh!

Greg


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

After last week's awesome episode, this week's show (and season finale) seemed to be a bit of a letdown. I was expecting a lot more during the robbery of the car wash, for example. I also thought Sherman killing Ronny the pimp seemed a bit predictable.

It's almost as if the writers said, "Let's just get this episode done to fulfill our contract, then we can rest until next season." There was really nothing to keep us anticipating the next season premiere.

I did LOL at the spoiled rich kid being forced to sing "SuperBass" on the steps of Hollywood High School in order to avoid getting a $450 red light ticket


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

Yeah, this didn't seem like a season finale episode to me. I kept expecting Tang to get shot/killed or something.

I didn't expect Bryant to recover so fast. Actually, so many of my shows have killed off main characters this month that I expected him to be dead too.


----------



## type_g (Sep 9, 2002)

Anyone notice the gun from the pimp looked like the same gun that Sherman had on his workbench when he was in the garage, putting and taking apart his service pistol???


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

type_g said:


> Anyone notice the gun from the pimp looked like the same gun that Sherman had on his workbench when he was in the garage, putting and taking apart his service pistol???


I believe that's the point. Sherman planted the gun on the pimp so he could say the pimp pulled a gun on him. That way the shooting would be justified.


----------



## Big Deficit (Jul 8, 2003)

I believe the point is to make us believe Sherman planted the gun. I'm guessing that we'll find out next season that he didn't...because he's the good guy.


----------



## Unbeliever (Feb 3, 2001)

It was late, so I didn't have the energy last night to go back to the beginning of the episode to compare, so I'll double check tonight.

However, someone on another board observed that Ben's backup gun on the cleaning table was a S&W 3913, while the gun found next to the pimp was an H&K USP.

--Carlos V.


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

Unbeliever said:


> However, someone on another board observed that Ben's backup gun on the cleaning table was a S&W 3913, while the gun found next to the pimp was an H&K USP.
> 
> --Carlos V.


I noticed the two guns being different as well. The one on his workbench was definitely a 3rd generation S&W of the natural stainless/alum variety. The one picked up from Ronnie had a natural slide but frame was black in finish.

S&W 3913:









I actually thought the gun picked up from the perp was a Kahr but it could be an H&K

Kahr:









H&K USP:


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

I went back and looked. When Sherm's partner holds the gun up and says we are good you can get a clear look at it if you freeze the frame when the camera is over his shoulder.

It is an H&K as the other poster mentioned, the visible hammer and slide profile make it easy to identify in that shot.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

The burned kid in the hospital was    . That was sad and scary and ghastly. Lydia's reaction was very raw and real.

Other than that, this episode lacked a bit of punch. I kept expecting Tang to die, I was so sure her stalker from early in the season would come back.

I really did not care for the Sherman the social worker and I hope we leave that far in the rearview mirror. I think it would have been fine in one episode, but to continue him trying to save the world over the course of several was taxing. This show to me thrives when it stays very in the moment and I prefer it as non-episodic as possible. I don't mind a few minor personal threads (Sammy's divorce, Lydia's pregnancy) but Sherman the social worker was not one I want to see again.

I did not think Sherman planted the gun, but he did everything in his power to put himself in a position to create a justifiable shooting and obviously he'd be fired and maybe even prosecuted if the full story was known.


----------



## RonDawg (Jan 12, 2006)

Zevida said:


> I really did not care for the Sherman the social worker and I hope we leave that far in the rearview mirror. I think it would have been fine in one episode, but to continue him trying to save the world over the course of several was taxing. This show to me thrives when it stays very in the moment and I prefer it as non-episodic as possible. I don't mind a few minor personal threads (Sammy's divorce, Lydia's pregnancy) but Sherman the social worker was not one I want to see again.


The social worker thing is a very real hazard of the job. You do come on the job thinking you could save the world, and people will treat you like a hero for it, and when it doesn't happen it could lead to a period of burnout and disillusionment.

That's what Sammy was really talking about when he said "I know what it's like" from his hospital bed. Clearly he's been there, done that, got the t-shirt.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Zevida said:


> I really did not care for the Sherman the social worker and I hope we leave that far in the rearview mirror.


I think we have to the extent that by the end of the show he's pretty clearly gone over to the dark side, and we haven't in the sense that it's a pretty big part of what drove him there.


----------



## MikeMar (Jan 7, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I think we have to the extent that by the end of the show he's pretty clearly gone over to the dark side, and we haven't in the sense that it's a pretty big part of what drove him there.


What I got as well. It was like he was going to the dark side, and this one last thing was something good he could do, but had to kill someone to do it.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

A the beginning of the show, the VO said something like "There comes a time when every officer has to decide what kind of cop he's going to be." Looks like Sherman made his choice, and it wasn't a good one...


----------



## Pawn23 (Mar 24, 2012)

I've attached two images that show "Ronnie" the pimp and his gun. The first is from episode nine when Ronnie is shooting from his Escalade at the cops. The second is Officer Ferguson holding up the gun he picked up next to the dead Ronnie after being shot by Sherman. Both guns look the same.


----------



## Pawn23 (Mar 24, 2012)

I've attached two snapshots from episode 10 that show Officer Sherman cleaning two guns and him holding the gun he fired to kill "Ronnie" the pimp. Neither gun appears to match Ronnie's gun (see previous post).


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

So I take it your point is that it's far from clear that Ben planted the gun.
And even if he's comfortable---or even happy---with the fact that Ronnie died, that doesn't mean that he gone over to "the dark side"...


----------



## Gunnyman (Jul 10, 2003)

was last week's the finale for the season?


----------



## Gunnyman (Jul 10, 2003)

Love that the orange tip was kept on the keyring. hmmm saving for use later if needed?


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

Gunnyman said:


> was last week's the finale for the season?


Yes.


Gunnyman said:


> Love that the orange tip was kept on the keyring. hmmm saving for use later if needed?


I thought it was just to remind himself that people don't always act the way he wishes they would.

I don't think the tip itself is useful to implicate Tang---there's been no "chain of custody" (it could the tip off of any toy gun).


----------



## snowjay (Mar 27, 2007)

I thought the tip was being kept to remind him everyone makes mistakes.


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

snowjay said:


> I thought the tip was being kept to remind him everyone makes mistakes.


I don't think his issue with Tang was that she made a mistake (in shooting the kid), it was that she didn't own up to it.


----------



## phox_mulder (Feb 23, 2006)

Until I read this thread it didn't even occur to me that Sherman may have planted the gun.

They looked very different to me, not to mention Ronnies gun was a little big to have as a ankle holstered backup.

Although, where did Ronnie have the gun stashed when he was running? I remember him wearing sweats or at least very loose pants.


phox


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

phox_mulder said:


> Although, where did Ronnie have the gun stashed when he was running? I remember him wearing sweats or at least very loose pants.


"Is that a gun in your pocket...?"


----------



## Mikeyis4dcats (Oct 2, 2003)

I wish Coop would have turned Tang in...I'm sick of her attitude.

Didn't like how they glossed over Lydia getting stabbed. Apparently she didn't report it to her superiors, otherwise no way they let he return to duty.


----------



## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

Is this show coming back next season?

Please say yes...


----------



## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

I read in Variety that they are leaning towards picking up another season. Which of course means nothing, but it's more optimistic than hearing the opposite.


----------



## mwhip (Jul 22, 2002)

That was the season finale? Didn't feel like it at all. I was waiting for the next episode.


----------

