# TiVo Flashing Lights Of Death



## Thom (Jun 5, 2000)

[EDIT BEGINS]
Quick troubleshooting tip for Flashing Lights Of Death on base Roamio: Swap the power supply first before messing with hard drive. It's easy to do and the power supply can cause F.L.O.D.
[EDIT ENDS]

I upgraded my base Roamio to dual 6 TB hard drives 2 or 3 years ago. It's been working fine.

Turned on my TV and found a TiVo message that the external drive was unavailable. So I power-cycled the Roamio.

It sat on the Welcome screen for a long time, then began the Flashing Lights Of Death (green, yellow, blue, and ALL red leds flashing rapidly.) I think this means the TiVo main board cannot boot from internal hard drive.

So I power-cycled it a few more times, but same thing.

Pulled the internal 6 TB drive and ran Spinrite 6.0 on it. No problems found, SMART data looks good. Took 2 or 3 hours for Spinrite level 2 test.

Ran Spinrite level 2 test on external drive. No problems found, SMART data looks good. Wait a minute...internal drive took 2 or 3 hours for test to complete but external drive only took 1 hour when connected to same sata port of same computer. Both drives are same size, make, and model. Hmm...maybe internal drive is taking longer to read because it's having ECC-corrected read errors...maybe.

Ran level 2 test on internal drive again. Spinrite calculates about 3 hours to complete test.

Interrupted test and started level 3 data surface refresh pass (Spinrite reads every sector, keeps data in memory, clears drive cache, then writes data back to drive surface, clears drive cache, then reads data again and compares.)

Will take about 30 hours according to Spinrite. When this pass completes, I will try a quick level 2 test again to see if test time goes down to same as external drive test time.

Will connect drives back to Roamio Wednesday night and hope Roamio boots, knock on wood.

It's situations like this that make me miss the Series 3 with the OLED display. That OLED display would display an External Drive message that I would see, even if the TV was not on. Very handy. I might have noticed this problem hours or even a day or two earlier with a Series 3 (I have 4 Roamios connected to my living room TV through an HDMI switch, so a TiVo with problems often isn't noticed right away.)

[EDIT] Looking in History, problem began Saturday morning, 10-7. I didn't flip my HDMI switch to this box and see External Storage Missing message until Monday or Tuesday. I really miss the OLED display that the Series 3s had...


----------



## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

Thom: How did you marry the drives together? Is that information (and any software needed) available to the public/posted on this forum somewhere? 

Thanks and good luck with your drives!


----------



## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

Thom said:


> Will connect drives back to Roamio Wednesday night and hope Roamio boots, knock on wood.


You are probably already aware, but don't plug in any other drive in the interim just to see if the hardware works. If you do that, the shows won't be viewable once you put the original drives back in.

Also some people with Bolts who modified their setup to run a SATA cable to eSATA external enclosure (single drive connected to motherboard but through a SATA to eSATA conversion) found that their drive was no longer usable (4 blinking lights) immediately after the most recent 20.7.2.RC24 update.

When they replaced the SATA->eSATA portion with just a long SATA cable direct from motherboard to external drive, bypassing the eSATA connector on the enclosure, their units recovered and all shows were viewable.

20.7.2.RC24 has been out a while so I don't know if this has relevance for your setup, but am providing the info in case it helps.

There was talk on another thread of 20.7.4.RC2 being out in the wild. You probably can't tell what you have right now, but might be possible another software update came down the pipes.


----------



## Thom (Jun 5, 2000)

atmuscarella said:


> Thom: How did you marry the drives together? Is that information (and any software needed) available to the public/posted on this forum somewhere?
> 
> Thanks and good luck with your drives!


I bought a preconfigured pair from Weakknees.com.


----------



## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

Thom said:


> I bought a preconfigured pair from Weakknees.com.


Thanks - was hoping the community had figured this out and I had just missed it. Guess WeaKnees has done a good job of keeping their method under wraps.


----------



## ggieseke (May 30, 2008)

atmuscarella said:


> Thanks - was hoping the community had figured this out and I had just missed it. Guess WeaKnees has done a good job of keeping their method under wraps.


MFSTools 3.2??


----------



## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

ggieseke said:


> MFSTools 3.2??


Is there away to use MFSTools 3.2 to marry together drives (with one of the drives being in an eSATA enclosure) for use in Roamios and Bolts?


----------



## Thom (Jun 5, 2000)

sfhub said:


> You are probably already aware, but don't plug in any other drive in the interim just to see if the hardware works. If you do that, the shows won't be viewable once you put the original drives back in.
> 
> Also some people with Bolts who modified their setup to run a SATA cable to eSATA external enclosure (single drive connected to motherboard but through a SATA to eSATA conversion) found that their drive was no longer usable (4 blinking lights) immediately after the most recent 20.7.2.RC24 update.
> 
> ...


I wasn't aware of the not connecting a different drive for testing. Thanks for the info. My problem base Roamio has 20.7.2.RC24. My other base Roamios have 20.7.4.RC2.

After 1.5 days of drive testing by Spinrite with zero problems found, my problem Roamio still had the Flashing Lights Of Death.

So I connected a different power supply...

Problem solved. Wish I had tried the power supply first as it is quick and easy to do on a base Roamio.


----------



## ggieseke (May 30, 2008)

atmuscarella said:


> Is there away to use MFSTools 3.2 to marry together drives (with one of the drives being in an eSATA enclosure) for use in Roamios and Bolts?


I think you can do it with the mfsadd command, but I would post in that thread to be sure.


----------



## jim-j (Nov 24, 2013)

Thom said:


> Quick troubleshooting tip for Flashing Lights Of Death on base Roamio: Swap the power supply first before messing with hard drive. It's easy to do and the power supply can cause F.L.O.D.


Thank you Thom for sharing that the power adapter is the fix for this. When I saw all of my lights flashing I had assumed my hard drive had gone bad, but before opening up my Roamio OTA I googled this and found your post. What an easy fix, you saved me a lot of time!

In my case I was able to quickly get my Roamio back online by searching my house for a 12 volt 2.0 amp power supply. I discovered that my TiVo stream power adapter not only looked like my Roamio power adapter, it had the same 12 volt 2 amp output specs (the only difference is that my Stream adapter has an RFI choke ferrite on it). My Roamio came back to life as soon as I plugged my Stream power supply into it.

I assume that any 12 volt 2 amp power adapter with the right sized connector and polarity would work. I found some cheap ones on eBay, but I didn't want to risk getting a poor quality power adapter. Therefore I bought my permanent replacement power supply straight from TiVo here.

They list it at $5.99, but with shipping and tax the total came to $20.54. Therefore I decided to add a second power adapter which only increased the total to $26.94 (so now I have a spare adapter for my Stream and Roamio).

//Updated 19FEB2018 to add polarity based on just4tivo's post.


----------



## Thom (Jun 5, 2000)

jim-j said:


> Thank you Thom for sharing that the power adapter is the fix for this. When I saw all of my lights flashing I had assumed my hard drive had gone bad, but before opening up my Roamio OTA I googled this and found your post. What an easy fix, you saved me a lot of time!
> 
> In my case I was able to quickly get my Roamio back online by searching my house for a 12 volt 2.0 amp power supply. I discovered that my TiVo stream power adapter not only looked like my Roamio power adapter, it had the same 12 volt 2 amp output specs (the only difference is that my Stream adapter has an RFI choke ferrite on it). My Roamio came back to life as soon as I plugged my Stream power supply into it.
> 
> ...


I'm glad the info helped you, that's why I added it to my message. I wish I had thought to try a simple power supply swap first before I spent 30 hours testing my dual drives.


----------



## JLV03 (Feb 12, 2018)

jim-j said:


> Thank you Thom for sharing that the power adapter is the fix for this. When I saw all of my lights flashing I had assumed my hard drive had gone bad, but before opening up my Roamio OTA I googled this and found your post. What an easy fix, you saved me a lot of time!
> 
> In my case I was able to quickly get my Roamio back online by searching my house for a 12 volt 2.0 amp power supply. I discovered that my TiVo stream power adapter not only looked like my Roamio power adapter, it had the same 12 volt 2 amp output specs (the only difference is that my Stream adapter has an RFI choke ferrite on it). My Roamio came back to life as soon as I plugged my Stream power supply into it.
> 
> ...


I see the Bolt power supply is only a few dollars more, any reason to not use that one? I believe the Bolt is 3A output.

TiVo Accessories| BOLT Black Power Adaptor


----------



## just4tivo (Dec 9, 2015)

Thom said:


> So I connected a different power supply...
> 
> Problem solved. Wish I had tried the power supply first as it is quick and easy to do on a base Roamio.


First lesson in Diagnostics 101 and the most often lesson ignored... ALWAYS START AT SQUARE ONE

And then there's always Ockham's Razor.


----------



## just4tivo (Dec 9, 2015)

jim-j said:


> I assume that any 12 volt 2 amp power adapter (with the right sized connector) would work.


Right sized CONNECTOR and the CORRECT POLARITY


----------



## Thom (Jun 5, 2000)

JLV03 said:


> I see the Bolt power supply is only a few dollars more, any reason to not use that one? I believe the Bolt is 3A output.
> 
> TiVo Accessories| BOLT Black Power Adaptor


If connector size and polarity match, it would be a better choice.


----------



## Thom (Jun 5, 2000)

just4tivo said:


> First lesson in Diagnostics 101 and the most often lesson ignored... ALWAYS START AT SQUARE ONE
> 
> And then there's always Ockham's Razor.


The symptom would seem to point away from the power supply at first glance. The base Roamio uses a wall-wart that only puts out a single voltage (12 vdc). The Roamio powers up, attempts to boot, fails, and begins TiVo Flashing Lights Of Death. In order for Roamio to flash all lights, the main board must be running its on-board software. Since the main board uses the single voltage from external.power supply to run, logic would suggest the external power supply is good. Nope. Apparently, the main board needs less power and/or has better filtering than hard drives have.


----------



## just4tivo (Dec 9, 2015)

Thom said:


> The symptom would seem to point away from the power supply at first glance. The base Roamio uses a wall-wart that only puts out a single voltage (12 vdc). The Roamio powers up, attempts to boot, fails, and begins TiVo Flashing Lights Of Death. In order for Roamio to flash all lights, the main board must be running its on-board software. Since the main board uses the single voltage from external.power supply to run, logic would suggest the external power supply is good. Nope. Apparently, the main board needs less power and/or has better filtering than hard drives have.


With respect, the SYMPTOM is a textbook example of a low quality wall wart power supply failure.
Seen it many, many times and that's why it's the first thing to check and the easiest to rule out.


----------



## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Thom said:


> The symptom would seem to point away from the power supply at first glance. The base Roamio uses a wall-wart that only puts out a single voltage (12 vdc). The Roamio powers up, attempts to boot, fails, and begins TiVo Flashing Lights Of Death. In order for Roamio to flash all lights, the main board must be running its on-board software. Since the main board uses the single voltage from external.power supply to run, logic would suggest the external power supply is good. Nope. Apparently, the main board needs less power and/or has better filtering than hard drives have.


The main board would step the 12V down to 3.3V/5V for its components so you might not see an issue with a power supply that is only slightly under performing. I believe that the full 12V is used for the hard drive motor.

Scott


----------



## JLV03 (Feb 12, 2018)

Thom said:


> If connector size and polarity match, it would be a better choice.


I might give it a try sometime.

Embarrassing story time - one time I tried to use the power supply from my Mini to power up an eBay Roamio TiVo I bought for parts, you know to save the step of not stringing out the Roamio power supply just to boot it up. Needless to say, it didn't work - lights were flashing, but nothing on the television screen. Once I dug out the Roamio adapter and plugged it in, the problems went away.


----------



## Sportsnut (Apr 11, 2014)

My Tivo Roamio basic suddenly stopped working tonight while I was watching something and began flashing two green lights and one blue light. There is no picture at all. I assume these are the flashing lights of death. Is there somewhere I can buy another power supply other than Tivo so I could get it a little quicker. I put a 3tb hard drive in it right after I got it and has been working great for just about 4 years until tonight.


----------



## Thom (Jun 5, 2000)

Sportsnut said:


> My Tivo Roamio basic suddenly stopped working tonight while I was watching something and began flashing two green lights and one blue light. There is no picture at all. I assume these are the flashing lights of death. Is there somewhere I can buy another power supply other than Tivo so I could get it a little quicker. I put a 3tb hard drive in it right after I got it and has been working great for just about 4 years until tonight.


The Flashing Lights Of Death is ALL leds (green, yellow, blue, and red) flashing simultaneously, not just some of them. The blink code you are getting is unknown to me. You might try contacting TiVo for its meaning. Perhaps an HDMI or HDCP problem?


----------



## jim-j (Nov 24, 2013)

Sportsnut said:


> Is there somewhere I can buy another power supply other than Tivo so I could get it a little quicker.


THom reports above that the TiVo Bolt power supply would be a better choice for the Roamio.

In this thread they report that this Kastar AC Adapter from Amazon works for the Bolt. Therefore I'd assume that it also works for the Roamio. If you have Prime you could have this in two days for free.

Note I got my Roamio power supply from TiVo in less than a week, so it's not a super long wait time for them either.

Lastly this video shows what my FLOD looked like.


----------



## Sportsnut (Apr 11, 2014)

Thom said:


> The Flashing Lights Of Death is ALL leds (green, yellow, blue, and red) flashing simultaneously, not just some of them. The blink code you are getting is unknown to me. You might try contacting TiVo for its meaning. Perhaps an HDMI or HDCP problem?


Thanks for the info. I will contact Tivo and see what they say. I'm hoping it is the power supply even though the flashing is different. I have two minis and they say connection to the main TiVo is lost so I'm guessing it's not an HDMI problem.


----------



## Sportsnut (Apr 11, 2014)

jim-j said:


> THom reports above that the TiVo Bolt power supply would be a better choice for the Roamio.
> 
> In this thread they report that this Kastar AC Adapter from Amazon works for the Bolt. Therefore I'd assume that it also works for the Roamio. If you have Prime you could have this in two days for free.
> 
> ...


I do have Prime, just not sure if it's ok to use the one for the Bolt for a Roamio. I will ask Tivo support if they think it's the power supply. I noticed the support hours are much less than they used to be, I guess that's one of the results of the new ownership.


----------



## Sportsnut (Apr 11, 2014)

I contacted Tivo through chat but they weren't very helpful. Just suggested unplugging all cables for 15 seconds and I told them I already tried unplugging last night but wasn't home now to try again and they said contact back if the issue persists and gave me the support phone #. I asked if it could be the power supply and they said "mostly it is hardware issue." I'll have to call tonight when I get home from work, hopefully the phone support will be more knowledgeable.


----------



## Sportsnut (Apr 11, 2014)

I called and was given the same instructions, unplug all cords, make sure it is plugged into an outlet directly and not a power strip. I tried all that and nothing worked. They offered a replacement for $150 since it's out of warranty. I told them I have an extended warranty through Best Buy and they said to go there first. I'm wondering if I should try to put the original hard drive back in and see if that works. I guess that would mean I would lose everything on the current hard drive, but if it's shot it wouldn't matter anyway.


----------



## Sportsnut (Apr 11, 2014)

My friend who has the same basic Roamio I have let me borrow his power supply but I get the same flashing lights so it's not the power supply.


----------



## Thom (Jun 5, 2000)

Sportsnut said:


> My friend who has the same basic Roamio I have let me borrow his power supply but I get the same flashing lights so it's not the power supply.


Do you have lifetime service on your broken TiVo?

If yes, then Weakknees.com has fixed older TiVo models with the flashing green light problem. Maybe they can fix yours. Or, for a fee ($150?) TiVo may exchange your broken TiVo for another and transfer lifetime to replacement box.

If no lifetime, buying another is probably your best bet.


----------



## Sportsnut (Apr 11, 2014)

I do have lifetime. The customer service rep didn't say the lifetime would transfer to the replacement unit but I assume it would for the $150 fee. I will have to call back to confirm before I go that route. However, I do have an extended warranty from Best Buy which they told me to pursue but I'm not sure how that would work with the lifetime tied to the box. If Best Buy gave me a new one, which I don't know how they'd be able to get a new Roamio, I don't know how the lifetime would get transferred without some type of coordination between Best Buy and Tivo.

I am going to take it apart tonight and put the original hard drive back in to see if that works. Unfortunately I guess I will lose all the recordings on my current 3tb hard drive which was 98% full.

If it's not the hard drive and I get a replacement Roamio from Tivo and then try to put my current 3tb hard drive in the new Tivo will I lose everything that's already recorded?


----------



## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

Sportsnut said:


> I do have lifetime. The customer service rep didn't say the lifetime would transfer to the replacement unit but I assume it would for the $150 fee. I will have to call back to confirm before I go that route. However, I do have an extended warranty from Best Buy which they told me to pursue but I'm not sure how that would work with the lifetime tied to the box. If Best Buy gave me a new one, which I don't know how they'd be able to get a new Roamio, I don't know how the lifetime would get transferred without some type of coordination between Best Buy and Tivo.
> 
> I am going to take it apart tonight and put the original hard drive back in to see if that works. Unfortunately I guess I will lose all the recordings on my current 3tb hard drive which was 98% full.
> 
> If it's not the hard drive and I get a replacement Roamio from Tivo and then try to put my current 3tb hard drive in the new Tivo will I lose everything that's already recorded?


yes


----------



## scurrypsu (Feb 18, 2015)

UCLABB said:


> yes


I'm curious as to why that is. Is there data pertaining to the current recordings stored in some component other than the hard drive that gets wiped when the TiVo detects that a different drive has been installed?


----------



## Thom (Jun 5, 2000)

Sportsnut said:


> I do have lifetime. The customer service rep didn't say the lifetime would transfer to the replacement unit but I assume it would for the $150 fee. I will have to call back to confirm before I go that route. However, I do have an extended warranty from Best Buy which they told me to pursue but I'm not sure how that would work with the lifetime tied to the box. If Best Buy gave me a new one, which I don't know how they'd be able to get a new Roamio, I don't know how the lifetime would get transferred without some type of coordination between Best Buy and Tivo.
> 
> I am going to take it apart tonight and put the original hard drive back in to see if that works. Unfortunately I guess I will lose all the recordings on my current 3tb hard drive which was 98% full.
> 
> If it's not the hard drive and I get a replacement Roamio from Tivo and then try to put my current 3tb hard drive in the new Tivo will I lose everything that's already recorded?


In the past, TiVo has transferred Lifetime to a replacement box received via an extended warranty from a TiVo-authorized reseller, of which I think Best Buy is one. Contact TiVo and specifically ask if Lifetime will transfer over to a replacement box from Best Buy.


----------



## Sportsnut (Apr 11, 2014)

Thom said:


> In the past, TiVo has transferred Lifetime to a replacement box received via an extended warranty from a TiVo-authorized reseller, of which I think Best Buy is one. Contact TiVo and specifically ask if Lifetime will transfer over to a replacement box from Best Buy.


I found an old thread that quoted that from the Tivo website but the link no longer works. i started a thread in Tivo Help Center about it and someone thought it recently happened with a Bestbuy extended warranty so hopefully that's still the case.


----------



## Sportsnut (Apr 11, 2014)

Thom said:


> In the past, TiVo has transferred Lifetime to a replacement box received via an extended warranty from a TiVo-authorized reseller, of which I think Best Buy is one. Contact TiVo and specifically ask if Lifetime will transfer over to a replacement box from Best Buy.


I did contact Tivo and they said it would transfer if it was still under the extended warranty. I took my Roamio back to Bestbuy today and thankfully they had a couple Bolts in stock at the store. They let me exchange the Roamio for the Bolt, I just had to pay $20 plus tax for the difference between the $179 I paid for the Roamio and the $199 the Bolt cost. I had a manager call Tivo for me while I was in the store and was able to get the lifetime transferred over after sending them a picture of the receipts from Bestbuy.


----------



## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

scurrypsu said:


> I'm curious as to why that is. Is there data pertaining to the current recordings stored in some component other than the hard drive that gets wiped when the TiVo detects that a different drive has been installed?


Recordings are encrypted with a unique key found on the motherboard; no other TiVo has the same key, so no other TiVo can play those recordings. (Bolt's are said to erase foreign drives detected during power-on, but that is another issue.)


----------



## scurrypsu (Feb 18, 2015)

ej42137 said:


> Recordings are encrypted with a unique key found on the motherboard; no other TiVo has the same key, so no other TiVo can play those recordings. (Bolt's are said to erase foreign drives detected during power-on, but that is another issue.)


Thanks. So, is there a way to retrieve that encrypted key and save it (not sure if it's alphanumeric or digital) so that if something on the TiVo other than the drive breaks later I could access the recording files via a PC? I know there are programs to copy the files off while the TiVo is working, but if I don't do that regularly and the motherboard or something goes, does having that key allow one to retrieve the file contents by connecting the drive to a PC?


----------



## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

If your TiVo was a Series 3, the EPROM that stored the key was identified and it might be possible to desolder that chip and read the key from it, or put it into another Series 3. I gather later TiVo models have been hardened against such an attack. Even if you could get the key, I doubt PC software to recover programs from your TiVo hard disk on a PC are available. If they were, they would certainly be in violation of the Digital Millennium Copyright act.

So no, you can't do what you want.


----------



## mattyro7878 (Nov 27, 2014)

if you ever send a box back to tivo, dont they immediately know if the hd has been tampered? im guessing at some point you break a tab or some kind of security feature. wont that void all warrantees? even lifetime?


----------



## Thom (Jun 5, 2000)

mattyro7878 said:


> if you ever send a box back to tivo, dont they immediately know if the hd has been tampered? im guessing at some point you break a tab or some kind of security feature. wont that void all warrantees? even lifetime?


They did that in the beginning, but not anymore as far as I know.


----------



## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

mattyro7878 said:


> if you ever send a box back to tivo, dont they immediately know if the hd has been tampered? im guessing at some point you break a tab or some kind of security feature. wont that void all warrantees? even lifetime?


I've opened three Roamio boxes. Nothing to indicate any protection. I have saved my original drives from those I changed.


----------



## Sportsnut (Apr 11, 2014)

I was curious if there would be any questions if i had to send my Roamio back to Tivo but mine went back to BestBuy. I did put the original hard drive back in it but there were no seals or anything to show it was opened.


----------



## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

I am glad you got your old box replaced by Best Buy and had no trouble with the Lifetime transfer. It seems that Best Buy has always been very good about this.

Just in case this was not clear in other responses to this thread, there is no way at all to ever recover a recording from any drive removed from any model of TiVo. If the drive is not functional in the original TiVo box where the recordings were made, then the recordings are lost forever. And with a Bolt, if you boot it with a new drive, then you cannot even reinstall the original drive without loosing all recordings on it. Basically, every time the Bolt sees a different drive than the last one it booted with, it will wipe the new drive.


----------



## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

mattyro7878 said:


> if you ever send a box back to tivo, dont they immediately know if the hd has been tampered? im guessing at some point you break a tab or some kind of security feature. wont that void all warrantees? even lifetime?


No security features on the TiVo itself these days (the early ones had a security tape that would theoretically show if you opened the case), but they do know if you upgrade the hard drive as that information is uploaded back to TiVo with your service connection. They could refuse warranty service and there have been a couple of reports of it over the years but generally they seem to turn a blind eye if you reinstall the original hard drive (YMMV).

Scott


----------



## videobruce (Nov 30, 2012)

I can't believe there are problems with these outboard PS's already. :thumbsdown:

As long as it is a switching supply with at least a 2 amp rating (more is fine) and the correct size coaxial plug (a RF choke is a plus), that should be fine. Having a DVM is a plus if you know your way around to check the output voltage under load to confirm which can be done before you connect it. If the plug is not correct, reuse the old plug.

All Electronics & Marlin Jones are nice places to start. I would pass on e-bay thou.


----------



## Thom (Jun 5, 2000)

videobruce said:


> I can't believe there are problems with these outboard PS's already. :thumbsdown:


In my case, the outboard power supplies had been in use for a few years.


----------

