# Anyway to force a software update?



## tombonneau (Mar 26, 2009)

Just bought a TiVo and I'm sporting one of the older 9.x versions that only has YouTube (no Netflix, Amazon, etc.).

From browsing threads, there are a lot of older ones that seem to indicate you just have to wait for TiVo to push an update to you. Is that still the case? I set it up two days ago as I have the CC installer coming today, and was hoping everything would be up-to-date.

In case the software isn't updated pre-CC-installation, will that be an issue?


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## pops_porter (Sep 27, 2005)

Force a connection to Tivo and it should pick up the software update soon.

In the network connections, choose connect to the Tivo service now


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## ajayabb (Jan 12, 2007)

It might help to force a connection with Tivo under Phone/Network settings


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## tombonneau (Mar 26, 2009)

Awesome. Thanks for the help guys. Will try that now ...

ETA: Actually, once I unplugged it and plugged it back in, it seems to be connecting to for an update. Of course it started to do that about 15 minutes before the cable guy is to arrive. Splendid ....


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## socrplyr (Jul 19, 2006)

Just hope then that your cable guy is like most of the rest. Late... 
(In fairness, most of mine haven't been late, but they come towards the end of their time windows.)


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

If you force 3-4 connections in a row under Settings -> Phone & Update, that should grab the newest software. Once the Phone & Network screen says "Pending Restart," then you know that a software update is ready for install. To force the installation immediately, restart your DVR under Settings -> Information -> Restart or Reset your TiVo -> Restart the TivoHD DVR.


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## tombonneau (Mar 26, 2009)

socrplyr said:


> Just hope then that your cable guy is like most of the rest. Late...
> (In fairness, most of mine haven't been late, but they come towards the end of their time windows.)


Fortunately they were about 15 min behind and I was able to finish my update. 

Of course, now they are having problems with the M-card and not all the channels are coming through. But going into my TiVo purchase I knew the risk, so I can't complain (too much).


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

tombonneau said:


> Fortunately they were about 15 min behind and I was able to finish my update.
> 
> Of course, now they are having problems with the M-card and not all the channels are coming through. But going into my TiVo purchase I knew the risk, so I can't complain (too much).


If you are able to get some cable HD channels but not others, then that probably means those channels aren't authorized on your account.


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## tombonneau (Mar 26, 2009)

bkdtv said:


> If you are able to get some cable HD channels but not others, then that probably means those channels aren't authorized on your account.
> 
> If they are still there, ask them to install 10dB attenuator, or at least leave you one in case you need it.


Problem was with the M-card. Once they used two S-cards (or whatever the other ones are called) it worked fine. Of course now they are going to hit me up for the cost of two cards every month, so we'll see if I can sweet talk my way out of that ...


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

tombonneau said:


> Problem was with the M-card. Once they used two S-cards (or whatever the other ones are called) it worked fine. Of course now they are going to hit me up for the cost of two cards every month, so we'll see if I can sweet talk my way out of that ...


You bought a TivoHD right? Not the older TiVo Series3 with the orange OLED display on the front?

If you got a TivoHD, there's no reason to pay for two S-CARDs. Sounds to me like they just didn't activate the M-CARD properly, or they stuck it in the wrong slot. It will only work correctly in the slot on the right.


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## tombonneau (Mar 26, 2009)

bkdtv said:


> You bought a TivoHD right? Not the older TiVo Series3 with the orange OLED display on the front?
> 
> If you got a TivoHD, there's no reason to pay for two S-CARDs. Sounds to me like they just didn't activate the M-CARD properly, or they stuck it in the wrong slot. It will only work correctly in the slot on the right.


Yeah, it's a TiVoHD. They definitely had it in the right slot. I was there with the diagram making sure. Some channels were working, others weren't. If they end up trying to screw me and force me to pay double, I'll just make them come back and install an M-card until they get it right, which should cost them a few hundred bucks at a clip.

Of course, the joke is on them, as I was programming all my shows on TiVo, I realized about 9 out of every 10 I was using the OTA HD network signal and got me to thinking, "Wait a minute, am I really going to pay $100/mo. for South Park and The Soup?".

So my guess is Time Warner's days are numbered in my place.


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

tombonneau said:


> Of course, the joke is on them, as I was programming all my shows on TiVo, I realized about 9 out of every 10 I was using the OTA HD network signal and got me to thinking, "Wait a minute, am I really going to pay $100/mo. for South Park and The Soup?".
> 
> So my guess is Time Warner's days are numbered in my place.


Yes. With all the various ways to get extra content on your Tivo _from_ your Tivo, you'll soon realize you don't need cable.


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## JWThiers (Apr 13, 2005)

steve614 said:


> Yes. With all the various ways to get extra content on your Tivo _from_ your Tivo, you'll soon realize you don't need cable.


With the possible exception of broadband internet. And hopefully you wont have any usage caps that hiner the experience.


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## sirpalm239 (Dec 19, 2011)

I have a new Toshiba SD-400 It is 13 years old. It has never been used.When I try to set it up, all I get is plug in the phone line. I don't have a phone line. Tivo dosn't use the phone line setup any longer. How can I get it to setup the wireless adapter?
The wireless adapter doesn't show up on the setup page. I have another Toshiba SD-400 so it't not like I don't know how to set it up.


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## shwru980r (Jun 22, 2008)

sirpalm239 said:


> I have a new Toshiba SD-400 It is 13 years old. It has never been used.When I try to set it up, all I get is plug in the phone line. I don't have a phone line. Tivo dosn't use the phone line setup any longer. How can I get it to setup the wireless adapter?
> The wireless adapter doesn't show up on the setup page. I have another Toshiba SD-400 so it't not like I don't know how to set it up.


I think you will need to copy an image from your other working sd-400 drive and then write the image to your new sd-400 drive using MFS Tools.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

sirpalm239 said:


> I have a new Toshiba SD-400 It is 13 years old. It has never been used.When I try to set it up, all I get is plug in the phone line. I don't have a phone line. Tivo dosn't use the phone line setup any longer. How can I get it to setup the wireless adapter?
> The wireless adapter doesn't show up on the setup page. I have another Toshiba SD-400 so it't not like I don't know how to set it up.


You say it's never been used, but has it ever been subscribed?

Does this unit have a lifetime subscription to the TiVo Service?

Last fall, about the time the new TiVo Bolt model came out, TiVo changed policy and anything older than a Series 4 Premiere that does not have a current subscription can never be subscribed by anyone.


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## tivoyahoo (Sep 4, 2003)

Wasn't the Toshiba SD-400 the model that was released that carried with it a unique lifetime service, called Tivo Basic, which was limited however. I don't remember the details exactly but I think you could record with just the Tivo Basic that came with it, but needed to pay for a subscription for guide data - something like that. but the details I'm sure are on this board somewhere.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

tivoyahoo said:


> Wasn't the Toshiba SD-400 the model that was released that carried with it a unique lifetime service, called Tivo Basic, which was limited however. I don't remember the details exactly but I think you could record with just the Tivo Basic that came with it, but needed to pay for a subscription for guide data - something like that. but the details I'm sure are on this board somewhere.


Yeah, it's one of the models with TiVo Basic, which gives you 3 days of guide data at a time.

I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that these units were, because of last fall's policy change, no longer eligible to be "upgraded" to a regular subscription (at the regular price) as they once were, and if one of them had never been "activated", they may interpret that policy to mean one cannot add them to one's account now to even activate the TiVo Basic service.


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## shwru980r (Jun 22, 2008)

unitron said:


> Yeah, it's one of the models with TiVo Basic, which gives you 3 days of guide data at a time.
> 
> I'm pretty sure I read somewhere that these units were, because of last fall's policy change, no longer eligible to be "upgraded" to a regular subscription (at the regular price) as they once were, and if one of them had never been "activated", they may interpret that policy to mean one cannot add them to one's account now to even activate the TiVo Basic service.


The basic service works right out of the box and you don't need a Tivo account. No need to call Tivo to activate. The basic service doesn't allow you to transfer recordings so there is no point in adding to an account.


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## tivoyahoo (Sep 4, 2003)

shwru980r said:


> The basic service works right out of the box and you don't need a Tivo account. No need to call Tivo to activate. The basic service doesn't allow you to transfer recordings so there is no point in adding to an account.


Which tivo models have tivo basic? only series 2 models and only ones with dvd drive? such as from toshiba, humax, pioneer. isn't the sd-h400 the oddball of the group and could only play discs, whereas the others could burn/record to dvd.

so you can't use kmttg or pytivo to pull/push recordings with any of these models if they have tivo basic service? or would one that had lifetime or one that could be added onto your account with regular service get you transfer? plus 2 weeks of guide data instead of 3 days. were there special offers for lifetime on these since they had basic built in?


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## tivoyahoo (Sep 4, 2003)

shwru980r said:


> I think you will need to copy an image from your other working sd-400 drive and then write the image to your new sd-400 drive using MFS Tools.


because the tivo servers won't do an update on a series 2 regardless of how many times you force a connection?

as far as the wireless adapter not showing up, is that due to the older software that's currently on it not recognizing it? no driver? I believe there are some inexpensive usb to ethernet adapters that will be recognized and allow you to at least connect. I seem to remember some $5 ones made by airlink that worked. I'm sure the details are on this board from 5+ years ago. But that doesn't mean tivo will send down the software update, so I agree with imaging the drive, or a new drive with the latest software. I might have an image for that model as I owned one of those dvd models a long time ago, but I don't know what version the image is. don't know how easy an image for toshiba would be to find.

What is latest software version for series 2 by the way?

However for what it's worth, I just recently connected a TivoHD (652) for the first time in years. It was sitting at 11.0m but 11.0n came out this year for mpeg4 compatibility. I read a few posts saying you needed to contact tivo with your tsn in order to get the update and that tivo had ceased updates to TivoHD. the TivoHD pulled the 11.0n update on the very first connection, never called in the tsn by phone to tivo support.


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## shwru980r (Jun 22, 2008)

tivoyahoo said:


> Which tivo models have tivo basic? only series 2 models and only ones with dvd drive? such as from toshiba, humax, pioneer. isn't the sd-h400 the oddball of the group and could only play discs, whereas the others could burn/record to dvd.
> 
> so you can't use kmttg or pytivo to pull/push recordings with any of these models if they have tivo basic service? or would one that had lifetime or one that could be added onto your account with regular service get you transfer? plus 2 weeks of guide data instead of 3 days. were there special offers for lifetime on these since they had basic built in?


Right, you can't transfer programs to or from a Tivo with basic service over the network.

Tivo won't let you purchase the upgraded full service anymore on a Tivo with basic service.


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## tivoyahoo (Sep 4, 2003)

Going back to the thread title:
Anyway to force a software update?

Is Tivo only providing updates on Series 4 and newer?

What is latest software version for series 2? *Let's say you have a series 2 with tivo basic or lifetime but with less than the current version, how does one go about updating it? Is forcing connections futile because Tivo isn't updating them?* Are you left with having to find an image as the only way to run the latest software?

In the case, of the Series 3 OLED (tsn prefix 648) the latest 11.0m image is readily available via links on TCF. However, the Series 2 has many different models which I believe require specific unique images. Is that the route you have to go as an out of date Series 2 owner? hunt down the latest image for your model?


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## shwru980r (Jun 22, 2008)

tivoyahoo said:


> because the tivo servers won't do an update on a series 2 regardless of how many times you force a connection?
> 
> as far as the wireless adapter not showing up, is that due to the older software that's currently on it not recognizing it? no driver? I believe there are some inexpensive usb to ethernet adapters that will be recognized and allow you to at least connect. I seem to remember some $5 ones made by airlink that worked. I'm sure the details are on this board from 5+ years ago. But that doesn't mean tivo will send down the software update, so I agree with imaging the drive, or a new drive with the latest software. I might have an image for that model as I owned one of those dvd models a long time ago, but I don't know what version the image is. don't know how easy an image for toshiba would be to find.
> 
> ...


I think the latest software version for a Series 2 is 9.3.2. The Tivo wireless G adapters can be had for $10 online if you look, then you know it will work. You might have to buy another S2 of the same model to get an image. You can always resell one of them afterwards. I'll have to check my 652 and see if the software is updated.


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## tivoyahoo (Sep 4, 2003)

shwru980r said:


> I think the latest software version for a Series 2 is 9.3.2. The Tivo wireless G adapters can be had for $10 online if you look, then you know it will work.


Ok, but I think sirpalm239 was sitting at an older release that didn't have a driver that supported his particular wireless adapter. But even if he found a phone connection and forced a connection, even multiple connections, the question is still whether Tivo would deliver the update download or not, i.e. have they abandoned series 2 essentially? because if sirpalm239 can't download the update that has the driver for his wireless adapter, then he's left with only the option of finding an updated image - hopefully 9.3.2. But let's say he finds a 9.2 image and it supports his wireless adapter and then with that he can then connect to tivo all day long for guide data using the internet, if tivo isn't delivering the update on multiple forced connections then he's still stuck at 9.2 and has to just pray for a 9.3.2 image.



shwru980r said:


> You might have to buy another S2 of the same model to get an image. You can always resell one of them afterwards.


yes, but in sirpalm239's case, a Toshiba sd-400 is rare. and you have to hope if you find another one that the second one connected at some point and pulled the 9.3.2 update. otherwise you're at 2 sd-400's that are out of date with no upward update path. I know there are lots of links on this board and pm if you need an image thread for example, but the sd-400 is a rare bird relative to other tivo models.

And then as I'm typing this reply I'm remembering Instant Cake. And I'm seeing lots of images for S2 models at $40:

https://www.dvrupgrade.com/tivo/home.php?cat=3

However it's not specified as to the software version, and if in fact it's the latest and 9.3.2. But they do show an image for the sd-400. looks like they have images for most if not all Series 2.



shwru980r said:


> I'll have to check my 652 and see if the software is updated.


yes, 11.0n is the mpeg4 compatibility update from early this year. If your THD 652 is on an earlier version, please post if it pulls the 11.0n update on first connection attempt (replicating my result), or if it takes multiple forced connections, or perhaps it won't download at all?? and will take a phone call to tivo support to push to your tsn. whatever the case, let us know. thanks.


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## shwru980r (Jun 22, 2008)

tivoyahoo said:


> Ok, but I think sirpalm239 was sitting at an older release that didn't have a driver that supported his particular wireless adapter. But even if he found a phone connection and forced a connection, even multiple connections, the question is still whether Tivo would deliver the update download or not, i.e. have they abandoned series 2 essentially? because if sirpalm239 can't download the update that has the driver for his wireless adapter, then he's left with only the option of finding an updated image - hopefully 9.3.2. But let's say he finds a 9.2 image and it supports his wireless adapter and then with that he can then connect to tivo all day long for guide data using the internet, if tivo isn't delivering the update on multiple forced connections then he's still stuck at 9.2 and has to just pray for a 9.3.2 image.
> 
> yes, but in sirpalm239's case, a Toshiba sd-400 is rare. and you have to hope if you find another one that the second one connected at some point and pulled the 9.3.2 update. otherwise you're at 2 sd-400's that are out of date with no upward update path. I know there are lots of links on this board and pm if you need an image thread for example, but the sd-400 is a rare bird relative to other tivo models.
> 
> ...


9.3.2 has been out for over 7 years. I would think most every Series 2 would have the latest software. Plus the power supplies, hard drives and dvd drives go bad, so it doesn't hurt to have an extra parts machine.

My 652 still has 11.0m and has been up and running for the past 7 years.


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## tivoyahoo (Sep 4, 2003)

shwru980r said:


> My 652 still has 11.0m and has been up and running for the past 7 years.


just confirming we're talking 652 not 648 where the latest is 11.0m

So the 652 has been making daily connections with 11.0n having been out since January and it's never received the update. hmmm... I wonder if it's done by zip code?? are you in an mpeg4 area? or maybe you are, but are set up as ota only??

here's a thread on 11.0n:
http://tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=536450


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## mlcarson (Dec 31, 2007)

So far no luck with my Tivo HD trying to get an upgrade from 11.0m to 11.0n and I'm in a zipcode that is using H.264. I plugged it in on 7/23 and have been doing lots of network connects to the Tivo service. I've sent the email to [email protected] and also have a support ticket in. Wondering why they don't just push it to any Tivo HD that connects which doesn't already have it.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Let me know if you need an image.

Scott


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## mlcarson (Dec 31, 2007)

Tivo's response in their online support ticket was:
1. Power cycle the Tivo
2. Connect to the Tivo Service twice in a row.
3. Call 877-367-8486 if that doesn't work.

That kind of seems like their blowing the ticket off to me since that number is just their general support line. I've done 1 at least once and have done 2 repeatedly.


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## mlcarson (Dec 31, 2007)

Tivo Support is being completely non-helpful. 
I went through the steps they outlined just to prove that it would make no difference and it didn't. I got a hold of somebody via phone support which tells me that 11.0K and 11.0M are the latest versions for the TivoHD. I told him that I know that wasn't true since 11.0N was deployed 6 months ago and provided H.264 MP4 support for the TivoHD. I gave him the version number of 11.0n.B1-01-2-652. He told me that was an older version but it didn't matter because they stopped providing software updates for the TivoHD last month and that they won't deploy any new software.

That's just wonderful. So, HerronScott -- I would appreciate that image.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

HerronScott said:


> Let me know if you need an image.
> 
> Scott


If you have a 652 and/or 658 "n" image, I'd be glad to host it on my Dropbox account.

I'm on Time Warner cable, so all my S3s are still on "m", and I don't expect that to change anytime soon.


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## shwru980r (Jun 22, 2008)

tivoyahoo said:


> just confirming we're talking 652 not 648 where the latest is 11.0m
> 
> So the 652 has been making daily connections with 11.0n having been out since January and it's never received the update. hmmm... I wonder if it's done by zip code?? are you in an mpeg4 area? or maybe you are, but are set up as ota only??
> 
> ...


Yes it's a 652 and I'm OTA only.


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## mlcarson (Dec 31, 2007)

Mine's a 652 that's been offline for about 9 mo's so it missed the 11.0n update but now requires it. I just can't believe Tivo's response on the whole matter. They used to be known for great support. Now they seem worse than Comcast.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

mlcarson said:


> That's just wonderful. So, HerronScott -- I would appreciate that image.


PM sent.

Scott


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## ViddWizard (Sep 28, 2014)

mlcarson said:


> Tivo's response in their online support ticket was:
> 1. Power cycle the Tivo
> 2. Connect to the Tivo Service twice in a row.
> 3. Call 877-367-8486 if that doesn't work.
> ...


With the Tivo Mini I found that I had to power cycle the box after step #2... worked fine once I cycle it.. otherwise it wanted to wait till 2am for the update


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

mlcarson said:


> Mine's a 652 that's been offline for about 9 mo's so it missed the 11.0n update but now requires it. I just can't believe Tivo's response on the whole matter. They used to be known for great support. Now they seem worse than Comcast.


So I have a 652 that ran for basically 10 years and finally the drive's SATA gave out. i used unitron's 652m.tbk image on a new 2TB drive and the Tivo comes up but seems forever stuck in Guided Setup land. Ive rebooted probably a dozen times and it never gets any update. The only thing i get is no guide data for my cable and/or OTA. I tried several kickstarts to get a software upgrade/ install but the error i get is something about a bad connection. Im guessing it's only talking to old outdated servers? If so is my only hope to find a 652 image with 11.0n? A decade run is nothing to sneeze at but i want my Lifetime Service patient out of confinement!

Hoping yall have some wisdom and direction for me...thanks!


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

KQN said:


> So I have a 652 that ran for basically 10 years and finally the drive's SATA gave out. i used unitron's 652m.tbk image on a new 2TB drive and the Tivo comes up but seems forever stuck in Guided Setup land. Ive rebooted probably a dozen times and it never gets any update. The only thing i get is no guide data for my cable and/or OTA. I tried several kickstarts to get a software upgrade/ install but the error i get is something about a bad connection. Im guessing it's only talking to old outdated servers? If so is my only hope to find a 652 image with 11.0n? A decade run is nothing to sneeze at but i want my Lifetime Service patient out of confinement!
> 
> Hoping yall have some wisdom and direction for me...thanks!


Try using zip code 00000 first and check out this post.

Problems using OTA with the 652 models after updates

Scott


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

HerronScott said:


> Try using zip code 00000 first and check out this post.
> 
> Problems using OTA with the 652 models after updates
> 
> Scott


Hi Scott,

Spent a couple hours repeating this process to no avail. The 00000 zip code didnt update the unit and it's the same old Guided Setup repeat process. Tried all permutations of Cable, OTA, Both. I remember it asking me for register only once in the beginning and since i dont have a demo mode, it's not quite the same as the folks in the thread you pointed me to. Should i re image it again with said 652m backup or try and search for an up to date 652n image? Any other tricks you want me to try? Thanks again


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## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

There is a kickstart code that causes the box to reload the last version of the software (two are kept on disc). I'd run that, then see if it will boot up WITHOUT running Guided Setup. If it does, then it should update the software itself without you having to do anything.

From what I have seen, one should NOT run Guided Setup under Bad Rovi on an S3 box unless the software is already at 11n. In a situation where there is no other choice, then run Guided Setup with zip code 00000 first, wait for it to finish and tell you there is no data available for that zip code, them power cycle the box BEFORE running Guided Setup again. In my experience, the box should pick up the software update during the first run with 0000, then apply it on the cold boot. After the update, you can then run Guided Setup normally with your real zip code.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

KQN said:


> Spent a couple hours repeating this process to no avail. The 00000 zip code didnt update the unit and it's the same old Guided Setup repeat process. Tried all permutations of Cable, OTA, Both. I remember it asking me for register only once in the beginning and since i dont have a demo mode, it's not quite the same as the folks in the thread you pointed me to. Should i re image it again with said 652m backup or try and search for an up to date 652n image? Any other tricks you want me to try? Thanks again


If V7Goose's method doesn't work for you, I've got an HD with 11.0n.H1 on it (stock), that I could use to create an image.

Scott


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

V7Goose said:


> There is a kickstart code that causes the box to reload the last version of the software (two are kept on disc). I'd run that, then see if it will boot up WITHOUT running Guided Setup. If it does, then it should update the software itself without you having to do anything.
> 
> From what I have seen, one should NOT run Guided Setup under Bad Rovi on an S3 box unless the software is already at 11n. In a situation where there is no other choice, then run Guided Setup with zip code 00000 first, wait for it to finish and tell you there is no data available for that zip code, them power cycle the box BEFORE running Guided Setup again. In my experience, the box should pick up the software update during the first run with 0000, then apply it on the cold boot. After the update, you can then run Guided Setup normally with your real zip code.


I tried the Kickstart 52 code and unfortunately things have gone worse. It started the reboot and install (I believe) and I went out to go get food and let it do it's thing. When I came back after a few hours it was i nthe "Almost There" phase but the screen had turned pinkish and sat that way for quite a while. So I unplugged the power to reboot. It then started to continually reboot with both phases of Welcome/Almost There, then slowly just Welcome, and now nothing on the screen at all. THe green LED on the fron comes up, blinks a few times and now repeats that phase indefinitely. Has my box given up the ghost? It's crazy how it went from perfectly normal to bat**** in a couple of days...


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

HerronScott said:


> If V7Goose's method doesn't work for you, I've got an HD with 11.0n.H1 on it (stock), that I could use to create an image.
> 
> Scott


Hi Scott, thanks for the offer. I just replied to V7Goose and it looks like my box has taken a turn for the worse. It looks like I may have some other physical problems (power supply?) now which I wonder was related to the initial hard drive death in the first place. Let me do some poking and Ill report back to y'all. Thanks again


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## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

Just jumping to conclusions here, based solely on your brief descriptions, but it does sound to me like you have a bad power supply (or possibly a bad HDD). The HDD may not actually be bad, but just have bad data on it from running with bad power.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

KQN said:


> I tried the Kickstart 52 code and unfortunately things have gone worse. It started the reboot and install (I believe) and I went out to go get food and let it do it's thing. When I came back after a few hours it was i nthe "Almost There" phase but the screen had turned pinkish and sat that way for quite a while. So I unplugged the power to reboot. It then started to continually reboot with both phases of Welcome/Almost There, then slowly just Welcome, and now nothing on the screen at all. THe green LED on the fron comes up, blinks a few times and now repeats that phase indefinitely. Has my box given up the ghost? It's crazy how it went from perfectly normal to bat**** in a couple of days...


It does sound like a power supply issue at this point. Note that some people reported that the update took a long time on their HD/S3's so I would have left it over night before pulling the power in the middle of an update.

Scott


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## Wil (Sep 27, 2002)

HerronScott said:


> some people reported that the update took a long time on their HD/S3's so I would have left it over night before pulling the power in the middle of an update.


I gave up after just a few days (first effort was a couple of weeks, second time despite my commitment to let it run I lost patience and finally just put an H1 image on it myself and it's running fine. There is definitely a problem for at least some of us getting an upgrade. Tivo says it's because the original hard drive has been changed and it's therefore "not eligible" or "not compatible" with updates any more. The two quotes are from two different CSRs.


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

HerronScott said:


> It does sound like a power supply issue at this point. Note that some people reported that the update took a long time on their HD/S3's so I would have left it over night before pulling the power in the middle of an update.
> 
> Scott


I've noted VGoose7's power supply issue and I looked really closely at it. There are some small bulges on the caps that people have noted in other threads. I guess the fact that I limped along for 10 years without opening or seeing ill effects until now must be statistical luck? However I was able to get the box to reboot back with the Welcome/Almost there section again. And like before it shows me up to the Guided Setup for like half a second and reboots repeatedly.

Scott I will give the Kickstart 52 and let it stay overnight and see what happens. Does the pinkish screen indicate frozen or something happening in the background? I guess if you dont mind sending me the 11.0n image Ill try that on another 2TB disk (note these disks are new/never used)


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## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

I suggest you just go ahead and fix your power supply first - ANY bulging in any capacitor is absolutely wrong. The repair is quite simple, and even if you have zero ability with a soldering iron, you shouldn't have much problem finding a friend somewhere that would be willing to do it. Just start asking if anyone knows how to solder . . .


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Wil said:


> I gave up after just a few days (first effort was a couple of weeks, second time despite my commitment to let it run I lost patience and finally just put an H1 image on it myself and it's running fine. There is definitely a problem for at least some of us getting an upgrade. Tivo says it's because the original hard drive has been changed and it's therefore "not eligible" or "not compatible" with updates any more. The two quotes are from two different CSRs.


Definitely sounds like something else was going on in your case. Despite what the CSR reported, there are obviously lots of S3/HD's that have successfully received the update. We have 2 S3 OLED and 1 HD and my brother has 2 HD all with upgraded 1TB or 2TB drives that upgraded fine. I wonder how many S3/HD's are out there that actually still have the original drives at this time. 

Scott


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## Wil (Sep 27, 2002)

HerronScott said:


> there are obviously lots of S3/HD's that have successfully received the update.


Yup. Including about 13 of them in my local support group, when the update was rolled out. But not recently, for this one that had been in storage during the rollout. It may be as simple as blacklisting this unit, getting notes or flags on the account (which ironically I always urge everybody _never_ to do. Get in, be pleasant, get out quickly and with thanks when it's clear you're not going to get any help. Don't get notes on your account.)


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

V7Goose said:


> I suggest you just go ahead and fix your power supply first - ANY bulging in any capacitor is absolutely wrong. The repair is quite simple, and even if you have zero ability with a soldering iron, you shouldn't have much problem finding a friend somewhere that would be willing to do it. Just start asking if anyone knows how to solder . . .


Ok Ill try and solve the power supply woes first then report back...thanks VGoose7 and Scott for your help again


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

I probably won't be able to tear down the HD TiVo until next weekend to get an 11.0n.H1 image. It sounds like Wil already has one so maybe he could share?

Scott


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

HerronScott said:


> I probably won't be able to tear down the HD TiVo until next weekend to get an 11.0n.H1 image. It sounds like Wil already has one so maybe he could share?
> 
> Scott


No worries. Im going to replace the power supply first before I go that route so I can wait. I think the plan is to get a stock replacement power board but also replace the bad caps on the original as a side project. I dont suppose anyone has a a listing of good known suppliers and part numbers? I've been poking around and have heard Rubycon and Panasonic in passing but not found specifics as it seems to be folks that knew exactly what to look for...


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

KQN said:


> No worries. Im going to replace the power supply first before I go that route so I can wait. I think the plan is to get a stock replacement power board but also replace the bad caps on the original as a side project.* I dont suppose anyone has a a listing of good known suppliers and part numbers? *I've been poking around and have heard Rubycon and Panasonic in passing but not found specifics as it seems to be folks that knew exactly what to look for...


It'd be awesome if there were a sticky in the Help forum about this issue.. and there is!  Tivo Series 3 - Bad capacitors in power supply


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

dianebrat said:


> It'd be awesome if there were a sticky in the Help forum about this issue.. and there is!  Tivo Series 3 - Bad capacitors in power supply


dianebrat I coincidentally did start reading through this thread (it is fairly long and deep) but got distracted a while back since I was simul troubleshooting drive, OS, power, kickstart, you name it... Found Scott's list, and will try and follow that to fixing the original power supply. Once I hopefully revive everything Ill create a summary write up. It could stand to be a good reference guide in trouble shooting many of the areas since I've almost touched every problem one could have now


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

KQN said:


> dianebrat I coincidentally did start reading through this thread (it is fairly long and deep) but got distracted a while back since I was simul troubleshooting drive, OS, power, kickstart, you name it... Found Scott's list, and will try and follow that to fixing the original power supply. Once I hopefully revive everything Ill create a summary write up. It could stand to be a good reference guide in trouble shooting many of the areas since I've almost touched every problem one could have now


Since you have an HD, please note that there are 2 different power supplies that were used with the HD and you might need to find one of the lists provided by other users for the HD models. My list for the original S3 OLED is accurate as I did fixed both of mine. I did create a list for one of the HD power supplies but I actually haven't had to replace the capacitors in either of the HD's that we own.

Scott


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## Lurker1 (Jun 4, 2004)

HerronScott said:


> I wonder how many S3/HD's are out there that actually still have the original drives at this time.
> 
> Scott


Mine does.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Lurker1 said:


> Mine does.


Is this the base HD with 160GB or did you get one of the XL models? We were OK for a while with our S3 OLED's with 250GB each back in 2007 but we had 2 and were still recording analog for quite a while. After we switched to HD-only recordings, we quickly upgraded to 1TB drives in both.

Scott


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## Lurker1 (Jun 4, 2004)

HerronScott said:


> Is this the base HD with 160GB
> 
> Scott


Yes, all original, still working. I shudder to think how much of a power hog it probably is.


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

HerronScott said:


> Since you have an HD, please note that there are 2 different power supplies that were used with the HD and you might need to find one of the lists provided by other users for the HD models. My list for the original S3 OLED is accurate as I did fixed both of mine. I did create a list for one of the HD power supplies but I actually haven't had to replace the capacitors in either of the HD's that we own.
> 
> Scott


I took a good close look at the power board after removing it. All the domed caps were 10V 2200uF and 10V 1000uF. I've ordered the Rubycon equivalents and will replace all of the bad and good ones when they come in...


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

KQN said:


> I took a good close look at the power board after removing it. All the domed caps were 10V 2200uF and 10V 1000uF. I've ordered the Rubycon equivalents and will replace all of the bad and good ones when they come in...


Sounds pretty typical. Those are low ESR capacitors correct?

Scott


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## videobruce (Nov 30, 2012)

HerronScott;
Would you PM me a N H1 image for a 652?


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

videobruce said:


> HerronScott;
> Would you PM me a N H1 image for a 652?


I haven't saved an image yet but hope to get to it this weekend.

Scott


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

HerronScott said:


> Sounds pretty typical. Those are low ESR capacitors correct?
> 
> Scott


yes sir. the Rubycon ZLH. Just got them in today. Guess I'll be testing this weekend...


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

KQN said:


> yes sir. the Rubycon ZLH. Just got them in today. Guess I'll be testing this weekend...





HerronScott said:


> I haven't saved an image yet but hope to get to it this weekend.
> 
> Scott


Sorry for the delayed update. I didnt get to fixing the capacitors yet but hope to finally get to them in a few days. In the meantime I got a cheap deactivated Series 3 and poached the power supply. I tried again to use Unitron's 652m image on a my new disk to no avail. It would always come up in guided setup and never talk to the right servers to get updated like before my power supply finally died.

Initially the replacement box I got was on 11.0n.H1 but immediately upgraded itself to 11.0n.K. I tried taking an image backup of that with the Weaknees MFS2.0 ISO to no avail. Kept getting segfaults and other crashes. I found an MF3.2 ISO and using those tools I did a straight disk to disk backup to my larger drive. It came up but had the error 51 where it couldnt see the Tivo Service Number. So I did a clear and delete on the new disk and it set it back to 11.0n.H. After connecting to the net again it also immediately went to went to 11.0n.K. It then didnt have any program info past one day. After connecting a few times to Tivo service, Im happy to say that my patient is out of the hospital with a much larger drive, happy power supply, happy cable card signal strength and what not.

So when I finally get the capacitors replaced on my old power supply Ill have a backup un active Series 3 that I can I can try and make a 652n.K image for the community if someone has a place to serve/host it from. Ill play a bit more with the MFS3.2 tools which I can also provide the ISO for hosting.

If folks find it of use for photo documentation of the capacitor replacement process I'd be glad to take pics of that too and note the source of the replacement parts.

Thanks to Scott, VGoose7, and all the other folks Ive gleamed info from to get my box back up. I learned a lot and salvaged my Lifetime Sub to boot


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

KQN said:


> Initially the replacement box I got was on 11.0n.H1 but immediately upgraded itself to 11.0n.K. I tried taking an image backup of that with the Weaknees MFS2.0 ISO to no avail. Kept getting segfaults and other crashes. I found an MF3.2 ISO and using those tools I did a straight disk to disk backup to my larger drive. It came up but had the error 51 where it couldnt see the Tivo Service Number. So I did a clear and delete on the new disk and it set it back to 11.0n.H. After connecting to the net again it also immediately went to went to 11.0n.K. It then didnt have any program info past one day. After connecting a few times to Tivo service, Im happy to say that my patient is out of the hospital with a much larger drive, happy power supply, happy cable card signal strength and what not.
> 
> So when I finally get the capacitors replaced on my old power supply Ill have a backup un active Series 3 that I can I can try and make a 652n.K image for the community if someone has a place to serve/host it from. Ill play a bit more with the MFS3.2 tools which I can also provide the ISO for hosting.


That's great. From the description above, everything sounds like it went pretty much as expected with the one exception that it flipped back to showing 11.0n.H after C&DE but changed back to 11.0n.K after a service connection (not an update though right?).

Can you use WinMFS and DvrBARS to make backup images? Those tend to be the tools most people use for clean images for HD models.

Scott


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## KQN (Jan 20, 2017)

HerronScott said:


> That's great. From the description above, everything sounds like it went pretty much as expected with the one exception that it flipped back to showing 11.0n.H after C&DE but changed back to 11.0n.K after a service connection (not an update though right?).
> 
> Can you use WinMFS and DvrBARS to make backup images? Those tend to be the tools most people use for clean images for HD models.
> 
> Scott


Alright after the weekend and some days, I've got the capacitors fixed with the new ZLH ones and the bad power supply has been humming over the past few days. I played around with the spare Series 3 HD also and have a DvrBARS image. Since I only have a laptop with a USB-Sata connector it seems WinMFS didnt like it. So I guess the vhd image of 11.0n is the way it's going to be.


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## Wil (Sep 27, 2002)

KQN said:


> Since I only have a laptop with a USB-Sata connector it seems WinMFS didnt like it.


I'm sure it was mentioned here and you've done this, but WinMFS has to be run as an admin.


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## wtkflhn (May 12, 2006)

HerronScott said:


> Definitely sounds like something else was going on in your case. Despite what the CSR reported, there are obviously lots of S3/HD's that have successfully received the update. We have 2 S3 OLED and 1 HD and my brother has 2 HD all with upgraded 1TB or 2TB drives that upgraded fine. I wonder how many S3/HD's are out there that actually still have the original drives at this time.
> 
> Scott


Hey Scott. I have one TIVO HD 652 that still has it's original stock drive it it.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

wtkflhn said:


> Hey Scott. I have one TIVO HD 652 that still has it's original stock drive it it.


I'm impressed as once we switched to HD recordings the 250GB drive in our S3 wasn't anywhere near enough space. 

Scott


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