# Channels DVR Server Now Available For Tivo Stream 4K



## spiderpumpkin

[EXPERIMENTAL] DVR server on SHIELD Tube, etc

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.getchannels.dvr&hl=en_US


----------



## schatham

Talk about a slap in the face. No Tivo DVR stream but your competitor can do it on your device.


----------



## babsonnexus

So basically, instead of setting up a stand-alone server, you are using the Stream 4K as one (with external storage). It's an interesting option if you don't want to set up an always-on PC or Raspberry Pi or the like. Since I already have one set up, not needed.

But let's not pretend like this creates the promise of recordings and streaming bookmarks in one place; you'll still have to launch the Channels app separate to get to your recordings and manage your OTT bookmarks elsewhere. And right now, trying to get Channels to embrace TiVo's promise is not popular with the community:

Feature Request: Add Realgood or something like it


----------



## Scooter Scott

IN YOUR FACE TIVO!

I do laugh at this. The biggest complaint with the TS4K is that it doesn't interact with their own DVRs. Channels has worked since day 1...and now they have even setup their own DVR engine on the device.


----------



## tivolocity

Scooter Scott said:


> IN YOUR FACE TIVO!
> 
> I do laugh at this. The biggest complaint with the TS4K is that it doesn't interact with their own DVRs. Channels has worked since day 1...and now they have even setup their own DVR engine on the device.


:tearsofjoy::tearsofjoy::tearsofjoy:


----------



## spiderpumpkin

babsonnexus said:


> So basically, instead of setting up a stand-alone server, you are using the Stream 4K as one (with external storage). It's an interesting option if you don't want to set up an always-on PC or Raspberry Pi or the like. Since I already have one set up, not needed.
> 
> But let's not pretend like this creates the promise of recordings and streaming bookmarks in one place; you'll still have to launch the Channels app separate to get to your recordings and manage your OTT bookmarks elsewhere. And right now, trying to get Channels to embrace TiVo's promise is not popular with the community:
> 
> Feature Request: Add Realgood or something like it


I think there are a couple different reasons people are buying the Tivo Stream 4K. Some want it just as an Android TV box, and others want it to have one app that brings all their streaming services together with Stream app.

I mainly bought it because it's an Android box that can run a couple of my favorite apps. I really don't have a need for an app like TiVo Stream or Realgood that searches all the streaming apps for me. The first thing I did was remove the new TiVo Stream app and never even launched it once.


----------



## tivolocity

babsonnexus said:


> So basically, instead of setting up a stand-alone server, you are using the Stream 4K as one (with external storage). It's an interesting option if you don't want to set up an always-on PC or Raspberry Pi or the like. Since I already have one set up, not needed.
> 
> But let's not pretend like this creates the promise of recordings and streaming bookmarks in one place; you'll still have to launch the Channels app separate to get to your recordings and manage your OTT bookmarks elsewhere. And right now, trying to get Channels to embrace TiVo's promise is not popular with the community:
> 
> Feature Request: Add Realgood or something like it


They have good reason to be concerned. I started with using Plex as a DVR, but switched to Channels. One of the reasons was because the Plex UI is really cluttered and recorded shows ended up way too deep in the navigation.


----------



## md wass

I did the same, Channels App is one of the best apps out there for a variety of reasons, but nothing even comes close for viewing/recording live tv, among several other things it does better than others as well..


----------



## BillyClyde

Scooter Scott said:


> ...and now they have even setup their own DVR engine on the device.


To be fair, they didn't have to do any extra work on it to make it work. They already had an Android ARM processor capable Channels DVR Server app for the nVidia Shield in the Google Play store. All you had to do was download the app and configure it, the same as you would do on the Shield.


----------



## tivolocity

It's sad we're even having this conversation. Based on the comments in this forum, Stream 4k is clearly not the revolutionary device to return TiVo to its glory days. It's more like the last gasp of a company that was squeezed out by the hardware of cable/sat providers and then failed to innovate fast enough to be relevant in related markets.


----------



## Channels App

BillyClyde said:


> To be fair, they didn't have to do any extra work on it to make it work.


This is not quite fair. The SHIELD Pro is a 64-bit ARM device. The TiVo Stream is ARMv7 32-bit device. There was considerable engineering effort involved to make it work.


----------



## siratfus

What happened to the HomeRun Prime 6 tuners? I'm very confused reading up on it. It seems like it was a product from 2017, but then it's nowhere to be found. I see old youtube videos talking about the 6 tuner, but yet on their own webpage, it says "Under Development." SMH. I have tivo gear, so I haven't been following. Does anybody have the 411?


----------



## mdavej

siratfus said:


> What happened to the HomeRun Prime 6 tuners? I'm very confused reading up on it. It seems like it was a product from 2017, but then it's nowhere to be found. I see old youtube videos talking about the 6 tuner, but yet on their own webpage, it says "Under Development." SMH. I have tivo gear, so I haven't been following. Does anybody have the 411?


Has never been and never will be a product. Prototypes have made appearances at CES a few years, but it never gets released. Silicon Dust is about as good as Tivo at finishing projects. They talk a big talk, then nothing. They always have an excuse (a supplier discontinued a component, etc., etc.) Get yourself two 3 tuner Primes or an old 6 tuner Ceton and forget about the 6 tuner Prime vaporware. Besides, they've already moved on to the next product they'll never deliver:
HDHomeRun ATSC 3.0


----------



## BillyClyde

Channels App said:


> This is not quite fair. The SHIELD Pro is a 64-bit ARM device. The TiVo Stream is ARMv7 32-bit device. There was considerable engineering effort involved to make it work.


I stand corrected! Thanks so much for clearing that up and I apologize for assuming such.

So is the performance similar to the Shield Pro with all this new engineering that had to be done?

Keep up the great work. I love you guys!


----------



## mdavej

BillyClyde said:


> So is the performance similar to the Shield Pro with all this new engineering that had to be done?


Not even in the same ballpark. But keep in mind the Stream is a quarter of the price.


----------



## m86

The Nvidia Shield TV (2019) is 32-bit and Nvidia Shield TV Pro (2019) is 64-bit.


----------



## BillyClyde

mdavej said:


> Not even in the same ballpark. But keep in mind the Stream is a quarter of the price.
> View attachment 49256





m86 said:


> The Nvidia Shield TV (2019) is 32-bit and Nvidia Shield TV Pro (2019) is 64-bit.


I was more asking about the re-engineered app itself and its performance compared to the same app running on the Shield, than the boxes themselves where the differences are fairly obvious and a given.


----------



## Pokemon_Dad

siratfus said:


> What happened to the HomeRun Prime 6 tuners? I'm very confused reading up on it. It seems like it was a product from 2017, but then it's nowhere to be found. I see old youtube videos talking about the 6 tuner, but yet on their own webpage, it says "Under Development." SMH. I have tivo gear, so I haven't been following. Does anybody have the 411?





mdavej said:


> Has never been and never will be a product. Prototypes have made appearances at CES a few years, but it never gets released. Silicon Dust is about as good as Tivo at finishing projects. They talk a big talk, then nothing. They always have an excuse (a supplier discontinued a component, etc., etc.) Get yourself two 3 tuner Primes or an old 6 tuner Ceton and forget about the 6 tuner Prime vaporware. Besides, they've already moved on to the next product they'll never deliver:
> HDHomeRun ATSC 3.0


Working sign-off samples of the ATSC 3.0 product, the Connect Quatro 4K, have already been delivered even before the crowdfunding campaign has ended. The Prime 6 is a very different project, not a quick Kickstarter but a long slog that's as much about paperwork as it is about development, and I wouldn't infer anything about SiliconDust based on that situation.

The Prime 6 requires approval by the CableCARD Consortium, and during that excruciatingly slow process chipsets have twice been discontinued by the manufacturers, each time forcing SiliconDust to begin the development and approval process all over again. Even if approved, if any of the built-in content protection fails then SiliconDust will be liable for very expensive penalties that would likely bankrupt them. So as I said, it's a long slow slog, and a very careful one at that. And for all those troubles, one must wonder if the CableCARD market will be around long enough to make all that effort and expense worthwhile.

Rather than wait for a Prime 6, I easily went on eBay to buy two mint-condition 3-tuner Prime units in their original boxes. I am running one with the card that used to be in my buggy Bolt. I haven't activated the other one yet, as I also have a 4-tuner Quatro receiving OTA signals, and a Quatro 4K on the way. We have only one TiVo server left here, a good ol' Roamio Pro, but when that one dies I'll use its card in my other Prime, and then we'll have fully transitioned to Channels DVR.


----------



## jakep_82

Wow, this is very interesting. This would allow me to ditch the mini PC I have handling my Channels DVR. If Tivo ever fixes the HDR and CEC issues, this could become the ultimate streaming stick for me. As it is right now the HDR problem makes it unusable.


----------



## Pokemon_Dad

Posted by Channels dev @tmm1 on the Channels Community:


> For anyone who wants to try running the DVR on FireTV Cube, soundbar or TV edition, you can now download Channels DVR Server 1 from the Amazon Store.


----------



## siratfus

Pokemon_Dad said:


> Working sign-off samples of the ATSC 3.0 product, the Connect Quatro 4K, have already been delivered even before the crowdfunding campaign has ended. The Prime 6 is a very different project, not a quick Kickstarter but a long slog that's as much about paperwork as it is about development, and I wouldn't infer anything about SiliconDust based on that situation.
> 
> The Prime 6 requires approval by the CableCARD Consortium, and during that excruciatingly slow process chipsets have twice been discontinued by the manufacturers, each time forcing SiliconDust to begin the development and approval process all over again. Even if approved, if any of the built-in content protection fails then SiliconDust will be liable for very expensive penalties that would likely bankrupt them. So as I said, it's a long slow slog, and a very careful one at that. And for all those troubles, one must wonder if the CableCARD market will be around long enough to make all that effort and expense worthwhile.
> 
> Rather than wait for a Prime 6, I easily went on eBay to buy two mint-condition 3-tuner Prime units in their original boxes. I am running one with the card that used to be in my buggy Bolt. I haven't activated the other one yet, as I also have a 4-tuner Quatro receiving OTA signals, and a Quatro 4K on the way. We have only one TiVo server left here, a good ol' Roamio Pro, but when that one dies I'll use its card in my other Prime, and then we'll have fully transitioned to Channels DVR.


When you removed the cablecard in your tivo to put into the HDhomerun, is it plug and play? Or, do you have to talk to your cable company to relay info so they can configure on their end?


----------



## Pokemon_Dad

siratfus said:


> When you removed the cablecard in your tivo to put into the HDhomerun, is it plug and play? Or, do you have to talk to your cable company to relay info so they can configure on their end?


Anytime you move a CableCARD, even between two TiVo boxes, you have to re-pair it with the new device. Unless you do that, it may at first appear to be working, but you will eventually discover channels are missing unless you're on the most basic tier.

Pairing is faster and far far less painful than it used to be. With Xfinity I can do that over the web, and most cable companies now offer CableCARD hotlines. Pairing the HD HomeRun via that website was painless.


----------



## Charles R

Pokemon_Dad said:


> Working sign-off samples of the ATSC 3.0 product, the Connect Quatro 4K, have already been delivered even before the crowdfunding campaign has ended.


_If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?_  As far as I'm concerned it's not _delivered_ until it's available to be used. With zero (current) plans for ATSC 3.0 in my market it's a non-event. Not to mention it only has two ATSC 3.0 tuners and if ATSC 3.0 ever comes around (and they don't completely step on the signal quality which is what I expect) I'd have to wait until the four tuner version shipped.

Bottom line I'm pretty sure I'll be _off air_ long before it will ever become viable. Yesterday I happened to look at my To Do list and before I dreamed up a few more I had one showed scheduled to record for the next two weeks.


----------



## Pokemon_Dad

Charles R said:


> _If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?_  As far as I'm concerned it's not _delivered_ until it's available to be used. With zero (current) plans for ATSC 3.0 in my market it's a non-event. Not to mention it only has two ATSC 3.0 tuners and if ATSC 3.0 ever comes around (and they don't completely step on the signal quality which is what I expect) I'd have to wait until the four tuner version shipped.
> 
> Bottom line I'm pretty sure I'll be _off air_ long before it will ever become viable. Yesterday I happened to look at my To Do list and before I dreamed up a few more I had one showed scheduled to record for the next two weeks.


I'm in one of the "first markets" listed on the ATSC 3.0 deployments page, though apparently not the very first. The Connect 4K will have two ATSC 3.0 tuners and two legacy tuners. The Kickstarter FAQ page says the following, and there is plenty of discussion at various points in the comments thread:

_Here in Phoenix the major networks are sharing a single ATSC 3.0 physical channel. We expect to see a similar approach in other markets where broadcasters share one or two physical channels broadcasting ATSC 3.0 content.

ATSC 3.0 demods are expensive - ATSC 3.0 new, and it requires supporting four concurrent demodulations per channel making the hardware a lot more expensive.

Two tuners supporting ATSC 3.0 provides a good cost balance and is unlikely to be a limitation for many years._​


----------



## siratfus

Pokemon_Dad said:


> Anytime you move a CableCARD, even between two TiVo boxes, you have to re-pair it with the new device. Unless you do that, it may at first appear to be working, but you will eventually discover channels are missing unless you're on the most basic tier.
> 
> Pairing is faster and far far less painful than it used to be. With Xfinity I can do that over the web, and most cable companies now offer CableCARD hotlines. Pairing the HD HomeRun via that website was painless.


Ahh, Xfinity on the ball. For Spectrum, this is the best I can find, will still need to call in.


----------



## Pokemon_Dad

siratfus said:


> Ahh, Xfinity on the ball. For Spectrum, this is the best I can find, will still need to call in.


My sympathies. If they don't know what an HD HomeRun is and try to select some other product they see listed on their screen, don't worry about that it will still pair.


----------



## jakep_82

In the Kickstarter description they state that they plan to support tuning of 4 simultaneous ATSC 3.0 subchannels. Based on what they're seeing in Phoenix, this should allow tuning of 4 separate major networks at the same time. Maybe this changes down the line, but by then 3.0 tuners will likely be less expensive and more broadly available.

"We plan to enable multi-channel support so you can watch up to 4 ATSC 3.0 sub-channels across the 2 ATSC 3.0 tuners, all in high definition!"

I happen to be in a market that already has a live 3.0 channel, so I'm just waiting on hardware. Based on what I've seen so far, I feel confident that I'll be watching ATSC 3.0 content by August.


----------



## mdavej

siratfus said:


> Ahh, Xfinity on the ball. For Spectrum, this is the best I can find, will still need to call in.





Pokemon_Dad said:


> My sympathies. If they don't know what an HD HomeRun is and try to select some other product they see listed on their screen, don't worry about that it will still pair.


Exactly.
Having paired cards with Spectrum dozens of times over the years with HomeRun, Ceton, Hauppauge, WinTV, etc., ALWAYS just tell them you have a Tivo, and confirm that you give them both the DATA and HOST IDs. If they don't know what those are, hang up and try again. Once you get someone who knows what a cable card is, don't hang up until it's working.


----------



## cybergrimes

tivolocity said:


> They have good reason to be concerned. I started with using Plex as a DVR, but switched to Channels. One of the reasons was because the Plex UI is really cluttered and recorded shows ended up way too deep in the navigation.


Emby does a great job with DVR imo and the UI is still very straightforward with personal media being the center. None of all the fluff Plex keeps adding/taking away.
I would probably switch to Channels for my DVR product (streams start fast, UI is beautiful) but Emby makes it easier for letting my father-in-law watch as a remote user for both live OTA TV and DVR recordings. Channels doesn't do Roku because of MPEG2 limitations but Emby will just transcode to make it happy. Not sure why Channels doesn't just go there, they already transcode for web, etc. Also Channels only works as a single user setup. It's a shame it's so great in some ways but so limited in others.


----------



## Pokemon_Dad

cybergrimes said:


> Emby does a great job with DVR imo and the UI is still very straightforward with personal media being the center. None of all the fluff Plex keeps adding/taking away.
> I would probably switch to Channels for my DVR product (streams start fast, UI is beautiful) but Emby makes it easier for letting my father-in-law watch as a remote user for both live OTA TV and DVR recordings. Channels doesn't do Roku because of MPEG2 limitations but Emby will just transcode to make it happy. Not sure why Channels doesn't just go there, they already transcode for web, etc. Also Channels only works as a single user setup. It's a shame it's so great in some ways but so limited in others.


The Channels devs refuse to have transcoding happening over the local network, as a matter of principle. So no Roku.


----------



## philco782

Pokemon_Dad said:


> The Channels devs refuse to have transcoding happening over the local network, as a matter of principle. So no Roku.


Annoying when there are arbitrary limitations that could technically be accomplished. There's a guy on YouTube who arranged a system that can tweet from a 60 year old teletype. Why? Because it can be done!

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## Pokemon_Dad

philco782 said:


> Annoying when there are arbitrary limitations that could technically be accomplished. There's a guy on YouTube who arranged a system that can tweet from a 60 year old teletype. Why? Because it can be done!
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


This is not an arbitrary choice. It performs better that way, with less demand on your server and LAN. I've found it runs faster than Plex here. The client platform must be up to the task, but in the client apps' Settings you're offered a choice of hardware or software transcoding.


----------



## BillyClyde

vurbano said:


> i loaded it the plus DVR on my PC. It doesnt pick up all of my sling channels. Its doesnt use my Airtv2 (it wants a homerun) and it doesnt seem to have a way to use IPTV services and record. Seems like its best to load the server on a PC and use the App of 4K or firesticks to schedule and watch recordings. No cigar from me. I cant believe some say this is the best.


It was designed from the ground up to work with hdhomerun tuners, not airtv. I don't even think AirTV was even a thing when Channels came out. That would be like being mad at a cheap Homeworx DVR because it doesn't have the TiVo interface or something. It was never designed that way in the first place!

Not getting all the channels for Sling isn't Channel's fault either. Sling is the one who has to offer more TVE channels because that's what Channels uses if you aren't using a prime HDHomerun cable tuner. The TVE channels you can get are dependent on the provider you're signed up for, NOT Channels DVR, so blame your provider, in this case Sling, not Channels. If you had Xfinity or something you'd get a lot more.


----------



## Scooter Scott

BillyClyde said:


> It was designed from the ground up to work with hdhomerun tuners, not airtv. I don't even think AirTV was even a thing when Channels came out. That would be like being mad at a cheap Homeworx DVR because it doesn't have the TiVo interface or something. It was never designed that way in the first place!
> 
> Not getting all the channels for Sling isn't Channel's fault either. Sling is the one who has to offer more TVE channels because that's what Channels uses if you aren't using a prime HDHomerun cable tuner. The TVE channels you can get are dependent on the provider you're signed up for, NOT Channels DVR, so blame your provider, in this case Sling, not Channels. If you had Xfinity or something you'd get a lot more.


Well said


----------



## spiderpumpkin

vurbano said:


> i loaded it the plus DVR on my PC. It doesnt pick up all of my sling channels. Its doesnt use my Airtv2 (it wants a homerun) and it doesnt seem to have a way to use IPTV services and record. Seems like its best to load the server on a PC and use the App of 4K or firesticks to schedule and watch recordings. No cigar from me. I cant believe some say this is the best.


They don't support IPTV services officially. I've seen some discussion of people doing such things but not something I've ever tried.

Channels DVR also supports Locast if it's in your market. Once it authenticates your location the DVR never has to check location for Locast again.


----------



## Pokemon_Dad

vurbano said:


> I say the app has work to do if it wants to say it supports something but really only does it half way. That reminds me of Tivos integration of SLing. Maybe there could be 2 lists of providers. The ones if really works with and the ones only sort of. If I still had a cable provider like "Xfinity or something" I would be using a Tivo edge not a trying to run a server on a little 50 dollar dongle.


It's a technical issue, not a business decision. Channels can only access TVE channels that offer web streaming.


----------



## BillyClyde

vurbano said:


> I say the app has work to do if it wants to say it supports something but really only does it half way. That reminds me of Tivos integration of SLing. Maybe there could be 2 lists of providers. The ones if really works with and the ones only sort of. If I still had a cable provider like "Xfinity or something" I would be using a Tivo edge not a trying to run a server on a little 50 dollar dongle.


When I said "Xfinity or something", I was referring to the TVE (TV Everywhere) channels, NOT using a cablecard with a cable company. It is ONLY Slings fault why there aren't more channels available on TVE from them and has no bearing whatsoever on the fault of Channels DVR or its developers. As I said, Xfinity and just about every other MSO provider that supports TVE has more channels authorized than Sling. Choose a better provider. That's your answer, not trying to fix Channels DVR. Channels DVR will support every non-DRM channel if you choose to use it the same as a TiVo as well, with a cablecard. At least Channels offers BOTH solutions. Can't say the same for TiVo!

I'm thinking maybe you need to do more research on exactly what Channels DVR is.


----------



## vurbano

spiderpumpkin said:


> They don't support IPTV services officially. I've seen some discussion of people doing such things but not something I've ever tried.
> 
> Channels DVR also supports Locast if it's in your market. Once it authenticates your location the DVR never has to check location for Locast again.


iF IT SUPPORTED IPTV AND PROVIDED A PLACE TO ENTER A SERVER HTTP ADDRESS, USER AND PASSWORD FOR A PLAYLIST AND EPG IT WOULD BE THE BEES KNEES.


----------



## spiderpumpkin

vurbano said:


> iF IT SUPPORTED IPTV AND PROVIDED A PLACE TO ENTER A SERVER HTTP ADDRESS, USER AND PASSWORD FOR A PLAYLIST AND EPG IT WOULD BE THE BEES KNEES.


Maybe someday.


----------

