# Tivo HD (TCD652160) eSATA Port is enabled now



## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

Looks like eSATA port is enabled for Tivo HD w/ the latest software update (8.1.7c2-01-2-652)

There is no easy kickstart method or easy plug and play method found as of yet.

So you will have to use mfstools (Mfslive Linux Boot CD) or WinMFS.

Screenshot is here.

Connect both internal and eSATA drive to your computer:

For WinMFS, use mfscopy (answer "yes" at the end), restore(answer "yes" at the end) or mfsadd and will take care of it.

For mfstools, mfsadd -x -r 4 /dev/sda /dev/sdb (notice there is no "e" that was required for Tivo S3)
/dev/sda is your internal drive, dev/sdb is your eSATA drive.

If you don't have a Tivo HD (TCD652160), go out and get one ASAP b/c you are missing out.


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## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

I think I speak for all of us here, even as a non TiVoHD owner, when I say that you rock.


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## CCourtney (Mar 28, 2006)

Great News - Got it working with a RAID 0 yet ;-) (Thinking about 2 750Gb's)

CCourtney

PS: I posted some questions about your 2.5Gb RAID 0 setup on your 'TiVo HD Finally Upgraded' thread if you get a chance.


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## MirclMax (Jul 12, 2000)

Well that's wonderful.. great find! But of course.. now I have more choices and continue to be confused by them.

As someone who was about to do a 750 or 500 GB internal drive swap on a THD .. can you come up with any advantages do doing it via the eSATA port instead other than the extra storage space that keeping the original drive inside would provide? 

If the kickstart worked I'd probably jump right on it .. but if I have to yank drives out anyhow .. I'm thinking internal drive upgrade now ... maybe eSATA later? (As needed) .. that make sense? Am I missing anything in my thought process?


-MirclMax


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

MirclMax said:


> If the kickstart worked I'd probably jump right on it .. but if I have to yank drives out anyhow .. I'm thinking internal drive upgrade now ... maybe eSATA later? (As needed) .. that make sense? Am I missing anything in my thought process?


Remember, Tivo told some reviewers that it planned to officially support eSATA expansion by the end of the year.

Upgrading the internal drive now should make it easier to upgrade storage further using eSATA later this year.


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

bkdtv said:


> Remember, Tivo told some reviewers that it planned to officially support eSATA expansion by the end of the year.
> 
> Upgrading the internal drive now should make it easier to upgrade storage further using eSATA later this year.


I'm not sure if you can add eSATA using Plug & play if you upgrade internal drive now. Maybe Tivo Inc will change things around to make it work but up to now, Tivo never had this ability. (BlessTivo or Kickstart)

I will poke around some more and see if plug & play can be enabled somehow.


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## sergiu (Mar 15, 2002)

i got my tivo hd 2 days ago and the external drive last night. g still need the esata cable. i'll wait for the kickstart....for a few more days....i hate to void the warranty...


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## rcamille (Dec 24, 2002)

I just upgraded my internal drive to a 500gb. (Thanks Spike). I now have 64 HD hours. I am thinking that this is sufficient for my needs, but if it turns out to be inadequate. I will put the OEM drive back into the TiVo HD and put the 500gb drive into an enclosure and connnect via eSATA once it is oficially enabled. 

I think the benefit of upgrading the internal drive is that the unit remains self contained.


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## sergiu (Mar 15, 2002)

rcamille said:


> I just upgraded my internal drive to a 500gb. (Thanks Spike). I now have 64 HD hours. I am thinking that this is sufficient for my needs, but if it turns out to be inadequate. I will put the OEM drive back into the TiVo HD and put the 500gb drive into an enclosure and connnect via eSATA once it is oficially enabled.
> 
> I think the benefit of upgrading the internal drive is that the unit remains self contained.


if you got it in ....just leave it you can add even more om esata later ....even the original drive


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

Thanks Spike, good stuff as usual. :up: 

It'll be interesting to see if the glitches some are seeing w/eSATA expansion on the S3's appear with THD boxes. (Ours has been flawless since May 12th, but not so with others.) 

I'd agree...if you need to pop the case, just upgrade to the largest drive you can afford and wait for TiVo to support eSATA for even more real estate. (Has anyone installed a 1TB drive in the THD yet?)


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

richsadams said:


> Thanks Spike, good stuff as usual. :up:
> 
> It'll be interesting to see if the glitches some are seeing w/eSATA expansion on the S3's appear with THD boxes. (Ours has been flawless since May 12th, but not so with others.)
> 
> I'd agree...if you need to pop the case, just upgrade to the largest drive you can afford and wait for TiVo to support eSATA for even more real estate. (Has anyone installed a 1TB drive in the THD yet?)


Many people told me they have upgraded to 1TB.

I looked around some more yesterday did not see any easy plug and play way to add an eSATA drive. Looks like Tivo Inc. has to do yet another software update to support their Plug & Play eSATA drives. Also, it may not work on already upgraded internal drive.


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## TXTivoUser (Nov 27, 2002)

I just got my 500 installed on Wednesday, and I don't really forsee any need for more space anytime soon. I'll just keep the OEM drive and firmware in place and use my 500g drive for now. If/when the need arises, I'll probably slap the OEM drive in, update its firmware and use this 500g as eSATA, or maybe even just slap a 1TB drive internally if the 500 isn't enough. I, however, doubt that'll ever be the case for me.

Now - if somehow THD starts supporting 2 multi stream cards for a toal of 4 tuners....then we might have a space issue.


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## normychas (May 10, 2007)

TXTivoUser said:


> Now - if somehow THD starts supporting 2 multi stream cards for a toal of 4 tuners....then we might have a space issue.


this is not possible. This is a hardware issue. First of all the TivoHD has two slots, one supports multistream and one supports single stream. My tech tried to install a multi stream card into the second slot so i know for a fact that it wont even recognize the card. Second of all the TivoHD only has two tuners so while it has the ability to split the signal internally for the two cable cards there would be no way to tune even a third signal which would be possible with a multi and single stream cable card. Now this is a message board so I'm sure if i am incorrect somebody will harshly correct me but this is my understanding of the TivoHD


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## BlackBetty (Nov 6, 2004)

TXTivoUser said:


> Now - if somehow THD starts supporting 2 multi stream cards for a toal of 4 tuners....then we might have a space issue.


is the TiVo fairy going to magically fly into your box and add an additional 2 tuners in order to make this possible?


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## SullyND (Dec 30, 2004)

TXTivoUser said:


> Now - if somehow THD starts supporting 2 multi stream cards for a toal of 4 tuners....then we might have a space issue.


1 M-CARD supports more than two tuners. As noted, the THD hardware is what is limited to two tuners.


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## GoldenTiger (Apr 11, 2002)

Awesome, I may add more space now that I can use two drives like this !


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## cr33p (Jan 2, 2005)

So this also means that we could install an addl internal drive that technically speaking is an external drive but just happens to be inside the machine? Providing we have a bracket manufactured.


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## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

richsadams said:


> (Has anyone installed a 1TB drive in the THD yet?)


Yes, thanks to Spike's tool. Quick and easy.


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## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

TXTivoUser said:


> I just got my 500 installed on Wednesday, and I don't really forsee any need for more space anytime soon.


By soon, do you mean next week? 

500GB is not as much as you think ...


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

jfh3 said:


> Yes, thanks to Spike's tool. Quick and easy.


 :up:


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## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

TXTivoUser said:


> Now - if somehow THD starts supporting 2 multi stream cards for a toal of 4 tuners....then we might have a space issue.


What's the point? A single multi-stream card can already support 200Mbps or around 5 QAM256 6MHz bands.


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## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

What is this, the "pile on TXTivoUser for not knowing the ins and outs of TiVo tuning" thread?


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## Evilmonkee (Sep 8, 2007)

Forgive me for being a bit confused. Hopefully someone can clarify this for me with a straight answer.

First of all, I just picked up my new TivoHD today. I'm getting my new HDTV tomorrow but I'm setting up the Tivo tonight so it will be ready for the cable card install tomorrow.

So I noticed the SATA port on the back and I thought, "Cool, I can get an external drive if I need space." Then I come here and it seems that this port is not yet enabled. Is this true?

If it is, it seems odd to me that they included a SATA port that doesn't even work. If it is not enabled then tell me this, can I expect a software update sometime in the future that will enable the port and simple allow you to plug in an external SATA drive and increase storage capacity?

TIA,
Keith


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

Evilmonkee said:


> Forgive me for being a bit confused. Hopefully someone can clarify this for me with a straight answer.
> 
> First of all, I just picked up my new TivoHD today. I'm getting my new HDTV tomorrow but I'm setting up the Tivo tonight so it will be ready for the cable card install tomorrow.
> 
> ...


It only works if you pull the internal drive and married an eSATA drive using a PC and WinMFS software or MFSLive Linux Boot Cd.

I have not been able to figure out how to add a plug and play eSATA drive and I doubt you can do that with the current software.

I read some place that Tivo is planning on releasing Tivo branded eSATA drives that are plug and play.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

Evilmonkee said:


> Forgive me for being a bit confused. Hopefully someone can clarify this for me with a straight answer.
> 
> First of all, I just picked up my new TivoHD today. I'm getting my new HDTV tomorrow but I'm setting up the Tivo tonight so it will be ready for the cable card install tomorrow.
> 
> ...


Welcome and congrats on your new TiVo HD!

As Spike mentioned the external eSATA port, multi-room viewing and TiVoToGo features are not currently active on the TiVo HD. Disclaimers to that effect can be found at the retailers and on TiVo's website. MRV and TTG are slated for November and word has it that the eSATA feature may be supported by year-end, but no guarantees. Everything needed is in your new TiVo; an eventual software upgrade (automatically delivered from TiVo when it's ready) is all that is required for each feature to work.

There are other threads on these subjects if youd up for in-depth discussions.


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## TXTivoUser (Nov 27, 2002)

MickeS said:


> What is this, the "pile on TXTivoUser for not knowing the ins and outs of TiVo tuning" thread?


It's cool - I can take it, but I appreciate you sticking up for me.

I appreciate the comments, and have now learned something from it. :up:

After having read the comments, I realized that I knew all of this before and had the proverbial brain fart.

Hey - we all get 'em sometime....just some of us admit it more than others. 

Anyway - to the poster who asked...



jfh3 said:


> By soon, do you mean next week?
> 
> 500GB is not as much as you think ...


By the reports on my TiVo, 65 HD hours is more recording than I've ever needed for my family's watching habits.

I had a FIOS HD DVR that only supported 30 hours of HD content (or up to something like 60-80 hrs of SD) and we never got over 75% used on that drive.

However, that may change and 500 may not be enough as I'm starting to try to let TiVo manage space and keep the drive relatively full at all times. Who knows...but the fall season starts soon, so this is a prime opportunity to test it out.


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## robomeister (Feb 4, 2005)

Not to jump on the 'bash TXTiVoUser bandwagon,' but in the specification for the Multi Stream Cable Cards, they can handle up to six (6) streams of data, to feed 6 different tuners. Now we need a six tuner TiVo. 

robomeister


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## Mephisto (Dec 25, 2004)

Just added a Seagate DB35 500 GB drive (in an Antec MX-1 enclosure) to a Hitachi 1 TB internal drive. 218 HD hours. Thanks, Spike!


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## sergiu (Mar 15, 2002)

even at microcenter


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

sergiu said:


> even at microcenter


Try the following post: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=350510

First post #31 has links for eSATA II cables


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## djstix (Aug 30, 2007)

Spike2k5

if i want to use the original drive (since i upgraded the internal and happen to have a spare drive enclosure and eSata cable) do i still need to use the WinMFS restore or is there some other steps i would need to do?


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## bdlucas (Feb 15, 2004)

spike2k5 said:


> It only works if you pull the internal drive and married an eSATA drive using a PC and WinMFS software or MFSLive Linux Boot Cd.
> 
> I have not been able to figure out how to add a plug and play eSATA drive and I doubt you can do that with the current software.
> 
> I read some place that Tivo is planning on releasing Tivo branded eSATA drives that are plug and play.


Meaning that non-TiVo branded drives would not be plug-and-play?


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## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

bdlucas said:


> Meaning that non-TiVo branded drives would not be plug-and-play?


I think he is saying there doesn't appear to be plug and play hooks in the current TiVo HD software like there partially is on the TiVo S3 (kickstart) On TiVo HD if you want to add an external drive the only current way is to take the drive out and marry it using a winmfs. When/If TiVo adds some form of official plug and play mechanism for their own esata drive, the mechanism will need to be examined to see how it meshes with the current upgrade tools. It might just work with no changes, but their might be something in the current upgrade process that interferes with the plug and play. We won't know until we see it.


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

djstix said:


> if i want to use the original drive (since i upgraded the internal and happen to have a spare drive enclosure and eSata cable) do i still need to use the WinMFS restore or is there some other steps i would need to do?


if you want to add an eSATA drive to an internal drive,
all you have to do is

mfsadd -x -r 4 /dev/sda

winmfs->tools->mfsadd


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## brianlees (Apr 16, 2007)

Can we clarify the original title of this post? It isn't enabled by default so that Joe consumer can just plug in a eSATA drive and just use it. As I understand, you have to do a little work to use it. 

I'm an IT Manager and would consider doing this, but then I thought I shouldn't have to do it...it should just work. So, I'll wait for it to "just work" and know that I've got a pristine box without any mods. I'm worried that mods will cause things not to work later on. And, a working box is more important than my impatience for this feature to be officially supported.


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

brianlees said:


> I'm an IT Manager and would consider doing this, but then I thought I shouldn't have to do it...it should just work. So, I'll wait for it to "just work" and know that I've got a pristine box without any mods. I'm worried that mods will cause things not to work later on. And, a working box is more important than my impatience for this feature to be officially supported.


It should be "plug and play" when Tivo officially supports eSATA drive expansion, which they told reviewers (like megazone) would happen before year's end.


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## djstix (Aug 30, 2007)

Spike 2k5

is it essential that both drives are connected to my laptop when i use MFSadd ?
Apologies for repeated questions


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

djstix said:


> Spike 2k5
> 
> is it essential that both drives are connected to my laptop when i use MFSadd ?
> Apologies for repeated questions


Yes, you will need both drives connected.


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## Mephisto (Dec 25, 2004)

Mephisto said:


> Just added a Seagate DB35 500 GB drive (in an Antec MX-1 enclosure) to a Hitachi 1 TB internal drive. 218 HD hours. Thanks, Spike!


 My eSATA drive is being divorced as I type this message, due to frequent freezes. Divorce is not currently supported for this setup in WinMFS, so it is being done at boot time.

Emptied Tivo Suggestions and Recently Deleted folders with no improvement. Not sure what to attribute the problem to. The eSATA drive worked fine previously in an S3.


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

Mephisto said:


> My eSATA drive is being divorced as I type this message, due to frequent freezes. Divorce is not currently supported for this setup in WinMFS, so it is being done at boot time.
> 
> Emptied Tivo Suggestions and Recently Deleted folders with no improvement. Not sure what to attribute the problem to. The eSATA drive worked fine previously in an S3.


Use the built in divorce. 
So just boot up your Tivo w/o eSATA connected and follow the onscreen instruction.

Antec MX-1 cable is not all that good. I would try another SATA II cable first before divorcing.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=350510
#31 for the links to good quality eSATA II cables.
Shorter the better.


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## Mephisto (Dec 25, 2004)

Thanks for the suggestion, spike. I'll try again when I get a better cable.


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## sergiu (Mar 15, 2002)

I returned the esata drive and I got an s3 open box for the same price if I can get the rebate....


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## Chimpware (Jan 30, 2002)

Anyone try a Tivo HD after 9.1 update to see if Kickstart method now works?


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## cckrobinson (Aug 20, 2007)

Chimpware said:


> Anyone try a Tivo HD after 9.1 update to see if Kickstart method now works?


It didn't work for me, and I tried multiple times. I had been previously using the eSATA drive in my PC (FAT32 formatted). I was really hoping that this would work with 9.1.


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

cckrobinson said:


> It didn't work for me, and I tried multiple times. I had been previously using the eSATA drive in my PC (FAT32 formatted). I was really hoping that this would work with 9.1.


Kickstart still doesn't work.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

* Sevenpants* tried a brand new eSATA drive (WD/MX-1 combo) on a TiVo HD with the new v9.2.j software using P&P but encountered an "Unsupported Device" error.

More info here.


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## Joybob (Oct 2, 2007)

richsadams said:


> * Sevenpants* tried a brand new eSATA drive (WD/MX-1 combo) on a TiVo HD with the new v9.2.j software using P&P but encountered an "Unsupported Device" error.
> 
> More info here.


Maybe we gotta format the drives or something before sticking them in?


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

Joybob said:


> Maybe we gotta format the drives or something before sticking them in?


Not sure. With the KS62 method/hack  of installing them in S3's TiVo automatically formats the eSATA drive during the marrying process so whatever was on the drive is lost. For THD's it's a bit more complicated (see here).

Spike is probably the one that will crack this early. Otherwise I think we'll have to wait for the "official" P&P support to see what that means.

That some existing eSATA drives are operating properly with the new upgrade is encouraging though.

IMHO it's very possible that eSATA plug and play...although listed in the new menu now, is still not activated...the same way that MRV and TTG remnants can be found in previous releases without being operational.


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## kas25 (Mar 10, 2003)

I'm new to this eSata stuff but I'd appreciate an answer to 2 questions, if at all possible. 

1) Once enabled, will I be able to plug in an external hard drive to Tivo without having to open the box or program anything ( I assume this is plug and play)
2) If so, can I access this drive from my PC?
3) If 2, can I dump my music library on this external drive and have the Tivo play this music? (assuming they are all MP3s)


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## Polarorbit (Mar 17, 2003)

My understanding is that, no, the eSATA drive will not work on your PC. Tivo spreads files across the drive and pulling it from the Tivo will also goof up the Tivo programs.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

kas25 said:


> I'm new to this eSata stuff but I'd appreciate an answer to 2 questions, if at all possible.
> 
> 1) Once enabled, will I be able to plug in an external hard drive to Tivo without having to open the box or program anything ( I assume this is plug and play)
> 2) If so, can I access this drive from my PC?
> 3) If 2, can I dump my music library on this external drive and have the Tivo play this music? (assuming they are all MP3s)


To elaborate on *Polarorbit's * post...

1) When TiVo officially supports eSATA drive expansion it will be plug and play. It is not officially enabled on either the original S3 or TiVo HD at this time. It is unknown if any eSATA drive will work with P&P or if TiVo will only "bless" certain drives (which may or may not be of their own brand).

2) No. If your TiVo is connected to your home network you will only be able to access certain files (recordings) not the eSATA or "A" drive individually . When TiVoToGo is enabled on the S3 and THD (ETA: November) you will be able to access your TiVo recordings on your P.C.

3) As above, no but you will be able to access the music files domiciled on your P.C. via your TiVo and play them back using TiVo.

Click here for more about TiVo Network Features (again, TTG and MRV are active on TiVo Series 2 now and soon on Series 3 and TiVo HD's).


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

Looks like TivoHD is looking for Tivo branded drive when it comes to P&P eSATA drive.
No kickstart 62 nor any back doors on 9.2j software.

You can still add eSATA by pulling the internal drive and marry an eSATA of our choice.


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## fred2 (Jan 20, 2006)

spike2k5 said:


> Looks like TivoHD is looking for Tivo branded drive when it comes to P&P eSATA drive.
> No kickstart 62 nor any back doors on 9.2j software.
> 
> You can still add eSATA by pulling the internal drive and marry an eSATA of our choice.


What about the S3? Have they changed that? Will kickstart still work on the S3 model.


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

fred2 said:


> What about the S3? Have they changed that? Will kickstart still work on the S3 model.


I don't know yet. I don't have 9.2 software for Tivo S3 yet.
Got a backup image you can share?


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## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

spike2k5 said:


> Looks like TivoHD is looking for Tivo branded drive when it comes to P&P eSATA drive.
> No kickstart 62 nor any back doors on 9.2j software.
> 
> You can still add eSATA by pulling the internal drive and marry an eSATA of our choice.


If the eSATA feature is not intended to work with all eSATA drives, I'm guessing a "TiVo-branded" drive will be a normal drive with some identifying information in the boot block or something similar. It sure would be nice if there was a TiVo-branded drive to look at.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

Have a look at the  "eSATA Announcement Soon" thread. Interesting "code" from the recent TiVo Newsletter.


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## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

So if I enter that "code" in Search by Title, is it going to make eSATA work with any drive?


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## TokyoShoe (Jul 27, 2007)

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=370629

I've got 9.2j on my TivoHD, it activated "External Storage" as a setting to adjust. It auto-detects my WD MYBOOK 500GB eSATA Drive.. and prompts me to set it up. I choose to set it up, and it tells me it won't (No error, not that it can't.. that it WON'T) and directs me to go to *http://www.tivo.com/expand* for further details.

THAT website tells me to stay tuned for a new "Tivo Branded and Verified External Storage Solutions" service that is being launched soon.

So apparently you can only use eSATA on a TivoHD officially if you buy the eSATA drive directly from TIVO?


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

TokyoShoe said:


> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=370629
> 
> I've got 9.2j on my TivoHD, it activated "External Storage" as a setting to adjust. It auto-detects my WD MYBOOK 500GB eSATA Drive.. and prompts me to set it up. I choose to set it up, and it tells me it won't (No error, not that it can't.. that it WON'T) and directs me to go to *http://www.tivo.com/expand* for further details.
> 
> ...


I've poked around abit today and it appears to be that way as I posted eariler.
I'll take a look at S3 when I get the update.


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## control-z (Mar 4, 2004)

spike2k5 said:


> I've poked around abit today and it appears to be that way as I posted eariler.
> I'll take a look at S3 when I get the update.


 And if course it will be twice as expensive as doing it yourself.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

From this post (with text corrections) regarding eSATA P&P:



> TiVo support in a phone call yesterday steered me directly to the Western Digital My DVR Expander available from Western Digital's website for $199 as "the only device TiVo is going to support"


 Link to WD My DVR Expander.


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

richsadams said:


> From this post (with text corrections) regarding eSATA P&P:
> 
> Link to WD My DVR Expander.


So what model of WD SATA drive is in this device?
Anyone know?


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Whatever their 500GB SATA drive is. they are definitely charging a premium considering a bare 500GB WD drive is under $100.


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## stm378 (Oct 10, 2007)

Ok so this may be a mistake on the part of best buy, but to everyone going nuts waiting for this "exciting new product" it's something. I think I may have stumbled across something that hints that the people saying that it's gonna be the My DVR Expander could be right on.

(Excuse my newbie status, it won't let me put in a direct link)

go to google product search and search for "my dvr expander". When you do this only one thing will come up "MyBook Tivo DVR Expander" from Best Buy for Business. If you click on this one there will be a product that actually has Tivo in the title, could be a mistake on part of best buy, but could also be an accidental leak of what's coming.

-S-


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## TokyoShoe (Jul 27, 2007)

stm378 said:


> Ok so this may be a mistake on the part of best buy, but to everyone going nuts waiting for this "exciting new product" it's something. I think I may have stumbled across something that hints that the people saying that it's gonna be the My DVR Expander could be right on.
> 
> (Excuse my newbie status, it won't let me put in a direct link)
> 
> ...


I've got a Western Digital MyBook Premium ES, $159 when I bought it online.. 500GB w/USB2.0 and eSATA. Why on earth won't this be "good enough" for my TivoHD?


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## stm378 (Oct 10, 2007)

TokyoShoe said:


> I've got a Western Digital MyBook Premium ES, $159 when I bought it online.. 500GB w/USB2.0 and eSATA. Why on earth won't this be "good enough" for my TivoHD?


Functionally it will be about the same (less the "passive cooling on the my dvr expander") but my guess on why it won't be "good enough" as far as Tivo (the company not the box) is concerned is that Tivo didn't make any money off of that sale...just a thought.

I wouldn't give up hope just yet...I'd bet that in time Spike will figure out a workaround...he is, after all, the Tivo storage rockstar!!

-S-


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

Ok so before everyone jump out to get DVR expander, for Tivo S3 any SATA drive works.

You just a get warning message and says Tivo won't support it.

quick guide


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

spike2k5 said:


> Ok so before everyone jump to get DVR expander, for Tivo S3 any SATA works.
> Just added WD SATA drive connected directly to eSATA port.
> You just a get warning message and says Tivo won't support it.
> 
> I will post some screeenshots shortly.


Good news...thanks for that! :up:


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## TokyoShoe (Jul 27, 2007)

spike2k5 said:


> Ok so before everyone jump to get DVR expander, for Tivo S3 any SATA works.
> Just added WD SATA drive connected directly to eSATA port.
> You just a get warning message and says Tivo won't support it.
> 
> I will post some screeenshots shortly.


Sorry, I am a tad confused. Can you please clarify this for some of us? You added the WD eSATA drive through the eSATA port, despite the warning message that it's not supported? This would be awesome if you can post directions!


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

TokyoShoe said:


> Sorry, I am a tad confused. Can you please clarify this for some of us? You added the WD eSATA drive through the eSATA port, despite the warning message that it's not supported? This would be awesome if you can post directions!


I've posted screenshots.

Direction is very simple.
Plug in an eSATA drive to Tivo S3 w/ Tivo S3, and eSATA drive powered off.
Power on eSATA drive, wait few seconds, power on S3.
Wait for the eSATA drive detection message, the follow the on screen instruction.

It better than Kickstart I think.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

TokyoShoe said:


> Sorry, I am a tad confused. Can you please clarify this for some of us? You added the WD eSATA drive through the eSATA port, despite the warning message that it's not supported? This would be awesome if you can post directions!


Spike was able to do that for an S3, not a TiVo HD like you have...yet.


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## stm378 (Oct 10, 2007)

spike2k5 said:


> I've posted screenshots.
> 
> Direction is very simple.
> Plug in an eSATA drive to Tivo S3 w/ Tivo S3, and eSATA drive powered off.
> ...


But this is just S3 correct....it won't work for HD....or will it? (I just noticed that this is the 2nd of 3 messages in a row basically saying the same thing) 

Sometimes it's hard work being a rockstar huh Spike? 

-S-


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## TokyoShoe (Jul 27, 2007)

spike2k5 said:


> I've posted screenshots.
> 
> Direction is very simple.
> Plug in an eSATA drive to Tivo S3 w/ Tivo S3, and eSATA drive powered off.
> ...


Wait wait, you got the eSATA "Unsupported Device" message, but it still paired up the device?


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## TokyoShoe (Jul 27, 2007)

richsadams said:


> Spike was able to do that for an S3, not a TiVo HD like you have...yet.


OH, ok. I'm sorry, this was my confusion point. Gotcha, this is on an Series 3 ONLY.

Ok. I'll start doing some research to see if I can get any further details on this mysterious "Tivo DVR Expander" thing.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

spike2k5 said:


> I've posted screenshots.
> 
> Direction is very simple.
> Plug in an eSATA drive to Tivo S3 w/ Tivo S3, and eSATA drive powered off.
> ...


Excellent news! Thanks...and agreed..._much _ better than any KS method! Thanks again for that. :up:

If you can figure out a way to do that on a THD it will certainly give some people (who shall remain nameless  ) something else to do.

Thanks again!


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## TokyoShoe (Jul 27, 2007)

richsadams said:


> If you can figure out a way to do that on a THD it will certainly give some people (who shall remain nameless  ) something else to do.


Me me me!


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

TokyoShoe said:


> OH, ok. I'm sorry, this was my confusion point. Gotcha, this is on an Series 3 ONLY.
> 
> Ok. I'll start doing some research to see if I can get any further details on this mysterious "Tivo DVR Expander" thing.


Don't rush anything...it's more than possible that you'll be able to use the drive you already have. Be patient.

FWIW, here's the link to the "officially supported" drive:

http://www.westerndigital.com/en/products/Products.asp?DriveID=334

But again, there's a good chance other drives may work, they just won't be supported by TiVo support services. Hang in there!


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

spike2k5 said:


> Ok so before everyone jump out to get DVR expander, for Tivo S3 any SATA drive works.
> 
> You just a get warning message and says Tivo won't support it.
> 
> ...


Hi Spike. FYI, it doesn't appear that the two links you've posted work.


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## stm378 (Oct 10, 2007)

richsadams said:


> Don't rush anything...it's more than possible that you'll be able to use the drive you already have. Be patient.
> 
> FWIW, here's the link to the "officially supported" drive:
> 
> ...


  Be patient?!?!?!? How can we be patient....all of the new shows just started and my tivo HD is filling up quickly. It's hard work keeping up with all of these shows to keep it under 20(ish) hours (wiping brow of sweat) 

-S-


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## TokyoShoe (Jul 27, 2007)

stm378 said:


> Be patient?!?!?!? How can we be patient....all of the new shows just started and my tivo HD is filling up quickly. It's hard work keeping up with all of these shows to keep it under 20(ish) hours (wiping brow of sweat)
> 
> -S-


Actually this is the EXACT problem I'm dealing with. I've got TONS of new shows starting this season that are almost all in HD. My hard drive space is getting eaten up quick, and I've got all this 500GB Storage space on an eSATA drive that I can't use.

I am slowly working my way towards the "being patient" side of the room, but it's still a long walk for me. Heh


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

richsadams said:


> Hi Spike. FYI, it doesn't appear that the two links you've posted work.


I forgot about hot link protection.

I've put up a quick quide.

guide


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

spike2k5 said:


> I forgot about hot link protection.
> 
> I've put up a quick quide.
> 
> guide


You 'da man! :up:


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## Joybob (Oct 2, 2007)

spike2k5 said:


> I forgot about hot link protection.
> 
> I've put up a quick quide.
> 
> guide


We require more screenshots of the pairing process as well as the name of the drive utilized.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

Joybob said:


> We require more screenshots of the pairing process as well as the name of the drive utilized.


Why? Spike said "any SATA Drive" and provided specific instructions. He's likely working hard on P&P solutions for THD's and some other projects now.

For a new kid you're awfully demanding of other people's free advice and hard work. 

FWIW, here's what an "unauthorized drive" entry looks like on the System Info menu...










Let the poor guy do his work.


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## Joybob (Oct 2, 2007)

richsadams said:


> Why? Spike said "any SATA Drive" and provided specific instructions. He's likely working hard on P&P solutions for THD's and some other projects now.
> 
> For a new kid you're awfully demanding of other people's free advice and hard work.
> 
> ...


I was just wondering what happened after the third screenshot; once he hit thumbs down three times.

Besides, I don't think you're allowed to test 2 drives then say ALL drives are supported.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

Joybob said:


> I was just wondering what happened after the third screenshot; once he hit thumbs down three times.
> 
> Besides, I don't think you're allowed to test 1 drive then say ALL drives are supported.


Again, you're new here...I wouldn't question Spike's work or word...period.


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## rrman (Mar 6, 2005)

Great. Thanks, Spike! I had just purchased a 750GB Seagate (DVR version). I came very close to buying the WD My DVR drive, but wanted 750GB instead of 500GB (I also thought of getting the Hitachi 1TB drive designed for DVRs, but it wasn't easy to find). If I had waited a week later, I probably would have gotten the officially supported drive. Given that I can't return my Seagate drive, I suppose I'll try Spike's method w/ my Seagate once I get 9.2.


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## spike2k5 (Feb 21, 2006)

Joybob said:


> I was just wondering what happened after the third screenshot; once he hit thumbs down three times.
> 
> Besides, I don't think you're allowed to test 2 drives then say ALL drives are supported.


I've posted more screenshots.


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## bizzy (Jan 20, 2004)

control-z said:


> And if course it will be twice as expensive as doing it yourself.


Until someone buys a fancy tivo-branded drive and copies the magic cookie off.
I'd do it (and return the drive afterwards) just for the screw-you-tivo factor.


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## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

spike2k5 said:


> I've posted screenshots.
> 
> Direction is very simple.
> Plug in an eSATA drive to Tivo S3 w/ Tivo S3, and eSATA drive powered off.
> ...


So is there a way to expand the internal drive in such a way that TiVo thinks it is an original internal drive, just bigger?

I was under the impression the old kickstart 62 process checked the partition table and barfed if there were too many partitions as would happen during expansion using mfs tools with the standard options.

I'm thinking what this would involve is expanding one of the existing 2 MFS media regions as opposed to creating a third MFS media region.

This would have the advantage of a large internal drive plus Plug & Play support for external drives.

Any thoughts?


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## lmsyl (Aug 30, 2007)

spike2k5 said:


> I forgot about hot link protection.
> 
> I've put up a quick quide.
> 
> guide


*As with Kickstart 62, this method will not add an eSATA to already expanded internal drive*

Does that indicate we have to use original internal drive for TIVOHD for expanding? Has anyone tried that?

My internal driver has been expanded, will that be a bad decision?


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## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

lmsyl said:


> *As with Kickstart 62, this method will not add an eSATA to already expanded internal drive*
> 
> Does that indicate we have to use original internal drive for TIVOHD for expanding? Has anyone tried that?
> 
> My internal driver has been expanded, will that be a bad decision?


There was someone who posted earlier eSATA expansion using the new 9.2 method with TiVo HD original drive did not work, so based on that, eSATA expansion on TiVo HD doesn't work regardless of whether your internal drive is upgraded.

On S3, according to spike's post, it only works with a drive that hasn't been expanded, which is the same as kickstart 62.

If you want to expand your TiVo HD, safest bet is to use winMFS or MFS tools from spike.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

sfhub said:


> There was someone who posted earlier eSATA expansion using the new 9.2 method with TiVo HD original drive did not work, so based on that, eSATA expansion on TiVo HD doesn't work regardless of whether your internal drive is upgraded.


Do you know if someone's actually tried installing the  WD 500GB drive My DVR Expander using P&P on a stock TiVo HD? Based on the earlier post it sounds like that is the one and only one that will work on those.


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## Islanti (Dec 13, 2001)

I installed a 1TB eSATA drive using WinMFS (mfsadd w/supersize) last night on my Tivo HD running 9.1. I got 9.2J today and all is well.


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## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

richsadams said:


> Do you know if someone's actually tried installing the  WD 500GB drive My DVR Expander using P&P on a stock TiVo HD? Based on the earlier post it sounds like that is the one and only one that will work on those.


It would be nice if someone had a chance to verify the TiVo rep statement that the My DVR expander is supported but I haven't read about any user experiences to that effect.

I'm guessing though that if there is a restriction on the expansion for S3 eSATA drives that the internal drive has not been expanded, then that limitation (at least for 9.2) will also exist on the TiVo HD using My DVR expander, which hasn't been confirmed to work (yet) but has been mentioned 2nd hand from someone who spoke to a TiVo rep.

I'm wondering which mechanism they would be using though to identify the My DVR Expander because I imagine over time WD will change the drives they put in that enclosure and it seems like unnecessary maintenance for TiVo to maintain a list of identifiers for the drives that are supported. Much better to do it the S3 way where they say we don't support the other drives, but still let you marry the drives. Maybe that is the way TiVo HD is supposed to work and it is just broken right now.


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## diskus (Sep 22, 2004)

So If Im correct after reading through this thread


A new TIVO HD unaltered with 9.2, plug an esata drive into the port will not work as it stands now


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## hiker (Nov 29, 2001)

diskus said:


> So If Im correct after reading through this thread
> 
> A new TIVO HD unaltered with 9.2, plug an esata drive into the port will not work as it stands now


It looks like only one drive currently will work. See the thread here.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

diskus said:


> So If Im correct after reading through this thread
> 
> A new TIVO HD unaltered with 9.2, plug an esata drive into the port will not work as it stands now


So far owners of TiVo HD's with v9.2.j have _not _ been successful in adding an eSATA drive using the P&P method. HOWEVER no one has posted that they have tried to add the TiVo "authorized device",  WD 500GB drive My DVR Expander, which may be the only one that will work.

The original TiVo Series 3 with v9.2.j _will _ apparently allow any eSATA drive to be added via the P&P method with a warning that it is not supported.


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## hiker (Nov 29, 2001)

richsadams said:


> ...
> The original TiVo Series 3 with v9.2.j _will _ apparently allow any eSATA drive to be added via the P&P method with a warning that it is not supported.


TiVo probably allowed S3's since so many of us where already using eSATA drives and didn't want a huge uproar, don't you think?


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

hiker said:


> TiVo probably allowed S3's since so many of us where already using eSATA drives and didn't want a huge uproar, don't you think?


Great minds think alike!


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## [NG]Owner (Dec 19, 2006)

This question pertains only to the TivoHD:

Is it possible to have both an increased internal HD in the TivoHD, _and_ a married eSATA drive as well? For example, a 500 GB internal hard drive and a 500 GB external eSATA drive as well?

If so, how does one go about that?

[NG]Owner


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

[NG]Owner said:


> This question pertains only to the TivoHD:
> 
> Is it possible to have both an increased internal HD in the TivoHD, _and_ a married eSATA drive as well? For example, a 500 GB internal hard drive and a 500 GB external eSATA drive as well?
> 
> ...


Why yes you can! If you're willing to do a little work. Details are on the Official eSATA Drive Expansion: FAQ + Discussion. Section III, #10 should get you started.

However, FWIW, if you're happy with 1TB of total disk space, your best (and possibly most cost efficient) bet would be to simply upgrade the internal drive.


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## lmsyl (Aug 30, 2007)

I finally decided to be hacker again.  It is so easy to add external Drive through winMFS, done in 10 minutes. I am using I-Rocks 9410 enclosure and ST DB35.


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## GoldenTiger (Apr 11, 2002)

Awesome, I got a random TiVo marketing mail about the "official" eSATA support, so I came to look on the forums about using normal drives in an enclosure and found it works... I have had my internal drive on my TiVo HD already upgraded to a 500gb since day 1 of its release basically, but I may plop an external drive on the TiVo after doing the WinMFS stuff with it again . More storage = good for these things .


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## mcalhoon (Aug 25, 2007)

Well I picked up a My DVR Expander at Best Buy yesterday. They were charging $220 pre-tax, but I got it down to $198 after tax with some coupons I had. 

I am going on a 10 day vacation on Thursday, and I was worried about my Tivo HD filling up. Usually I would try a hack, but I thought I would just pay the extra cash for the supported version.

Unfortuntely I am still at 9.1, and the drive is not being dectected yet. I signed up on the upgrade priority list, but that might take 7 days. As long as I get it before Thursday I will be happy.

Mike


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## Bob723 (Oct 24, 2007)

> Originally posted by *Islanti*:
> 
> I installed a 1TB eSATA drive using WinMFS (mfsadd w/supersize) last night on my Tivo HD running 9.1. I got 9.2J today and all is well.


Help! I think I screwed up. Islanti's post looks helpful. I have a TiVo HD. I got a 1 TB Hitachi Cinema Star drive to add as eSATA. I used winMFS. The process worked fine but I believe I used the wrong commands. The TiVo sees the drive but won't accept it. When I ran winMFS, I used mfscopy. Based on Islanti's comment, looks like I should have used mfsadd. Can I run winMFS again using mfsadd to fix this or do I need to format the drive first? If I have to format, any advice on the best way to do it will be appreciated.


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## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

Bob723 said:


> Help! I think I screwed up. Islanti's post looks helpful. I have a TiVo HD. I got a 1 TB Hitachi Cinema Star drive to add as eSATA. I used winMFS. The process worked fine but I believe I used the wrong commands. The TiVo sees the drive but won't accept it. When I ran winMFS, I used mfscopy. Based on Islanti's comment, looks like I should have used mfsadd. Can I run winMFS again using mfsadd to fix this or do I need to format the drive first? If I have to format, any advice on the best way to do it will be appreciated.


Just to mention that since you spent time and did a copy, you might want to add the 1TB either as a single internal or single external. More reliable than 2 drives.

Either way, later you could add a big eSata on top of the 1TB internal *OR * you could easily copy the 1TB external to a bigger external and never open the case again. 

To get what you want, you might not have to delete format, but winMFS has a 'delete format'  function in the file menu. Takes about 2 seconds.  Then do it the right way... (you don't actually format the drive separately, winMFS does whatever it needs to under the hood.)


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## Bob723 (Oct 24, 2007)

> Originally Posted by *HDTiVo*
> Just to mention that since you spent time and did a copy, you might want to add the 1TB either as a single internal or single external. More reliable than 2 drives.
> 
> Either way, later you could add a big eSata on top of the 1TB internal OR you could easily copy the 1TB external to a bigger external and never open the case again.
> ...


Thanks HDTiVo. I still chose to set up the 1TB as eSATA - meaning I wasted 3 hours doing the copy yesterday.  Your advice helped. I did the delete format and then mfsadd. It went very fast. Connected the TiVo again and started. A screen came up saying external storage was added - I basically accepted and that was it. I now have 168 HD hours and 1593 SD hours. Spike is da man!


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## sgresser (Feb 26, 2004)

I've installed the Seagate FreeAgent Pro 1TB eSATA drive. "Hey, this drive's not supported - wanna use it anyway?" YEP! Now it's 162 hours of HD, or 1561 of SD, availalable.

That said, cable cards are still junk (Cox uses Scientific America's cards, which required two visits, three cards, a dozen phone calls, a tech and a supervisor in the house to get 'em running), I've got the wireless adapter and the ATSC powered antenna from my (soon to be disconnected) DirecTV (for whom TiVo needs to program a new DVR, please!), and after a day I was watching one HD program from Cox while another started recording, and it caused a reboot which, oddly, made the S3 think there was no hard drive. Might've been a power problem because it recognized it after changing UPSes. It then went in to the "Serious Error" screen for about 20 minutes and is now back up-n-running.

Will I need supplemental cooling if the HDD is in a large, open space behind my plasma? It really doesn't seem to get terribly hot back there as there's plenty of circulation.

Thanks!

Steve


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

Wow Steve...how did you manage to dig up this thread? Did you use the search feature like everyone else, um, doesn't?  Nice work, but you'll more likely find everything you need regarding eSATA info on the Official eSATA Drive Expansion in 9.2: FAQ + Discussion.

With regard to adding your new eSATA drive...well done. :up: The FAP's have had their share of issues and one of them was heat since they have no fan. It sounds like you've taken precautions by keeping it in a very well ventilated location, away from any other components that generate heat (does your plasma get hot?). If you run into issues you might want to consider swapping it for one of the recommended drives and enclosures listed in the first post of the FAQ mentioned above. The same goes for the OEM eSATA cables which can be problematic as well. (Replacements are also listed in the FAQ.)

A lot of us feel your pain with cable cards. SA's still seem to be the worst for some reason. Hang in there and keep us posted in the other thread about your experiences! :up:


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## dms92969 (May 24, 2003)

Everyone keeps talking about the S3s ... What about the TivoHD models??? I just ordered a TivoHD, and would like to plug in a Esata. Can I do that by just plugging in or do I have to pull the original drive out and marry the drive together etc.

Thanks


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## socrplyr (Jul 19, 2006)

dms92969 said:


> Everyone keeps talking about the S3s ... What about the TivoHD models??? I just ordered a TivoHD, and would like to plug in a Esata. Can I do that by just plugging in or do I have to pull the original drive out and marry the drive together etc.
> 
> Thanks


You can just plug in a WD My DVR Expander, or (I think) you can buy your own but you must first remove the internal drive and marry them.

Josh


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

dms92969 said:


> Everyone keeps talking about the S3s ... What about the TivoHD models??? I just ordered a TivoHD, and would like to plug in a Esata. Can I do that by just plugging in or do I have to pull the original drive out and marry the drive together etc.
> 
> Thanks


As mentioned, everything you need to know can be found in the Official eSATA Drive Expansion in 9.2: FAQ + Discussion sticky thread.


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## dms92969 (May 24, 2003)

That thread is confusing.. Like I said .. everything mostly says S3.. nothing much about TivoHD... some say you can marry it.. some say you just plug it in, and bypass the errors etc... No real straight answer.



richsadams said:


> As mentioned, everything you need to know can be found in the Official eSATA Drive Expansion in 9.2: FAQ + Discussion sticky thread.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

dms92969 said:


> That thread is confusing.. Like I said .. everything mostly says S3.. nothing much about TivoHD... some say you can marry it.. some say you just plug it in, and bypass the errors etc... No real straight answer.


It's pretty simple. For the TiVo HD, if you want to just plug something in and work, you need the TiVo Branded drive. For any other eSATA drive, you must use WinMFS or something similar to marry the 2 drives.


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## WO312 (Jan 24, 2003)

dms92969 said:


> That thread is confusing.. Like I said .. everything mostly says S3.. nothing much about TivoHD... some say you can marry it.. some say you just plug it in, and bypass the errors etc... No real straight answer.


Hmmm, section III.10 seems pretty straightforward to me.


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

dms92969 said:


> That thread is confusing.. Like I said .. everything mostly says S3.. nothing much about TivoHD... some say you can marry it.. some say you just plug it in, and bypass the errors etc... No real straight answer.


If you're confused by the first post on the sticky thread your best bet is to buy a Western Digital My DVR Expander, connect it to your TiVo HD, follow the on screen instructions and tah-dah...end of story, all done. No more confusion. :up:


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## richsadams (Jan 4, 2003)

WO312 said:


> Hmmm, section III.10 seems pretty straightforward to me.


Yep, and Section III, #7 is pretty clear with regard to TiVo HD's as well.


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