# Bolt + Minis + Comcast A Good replacement for Dish Hopper + Joeys?



## JTHOJNICKI (Nov 30, 2015)

Hi,

I am a new member.

I currently have 3 Dish Hoppers + 6 Joeys installed. I pay $12 / month for each Hopper and $8 / month for each Joey plus another $100 for programming. The cost is the same whether I own or lease each device. I think these monthly equipment fees are ridiculous, so am considering dumping Dish and switching to Comcast with 2 Bolts and 6 Minis. Anybody done this? How many cable outlet does each Bolt (with M-Card) count as?

The Bolt / Mini setup looks very similar to the Hopper / Joey setup. Any input is appreciated.

Thank you!


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## smark (Nov 20, 2002)

JTHOJNICKI said:


> Hi,
> 
> I am a new member.
> 
> ...


Each Bolt would count as an outlet. The first one should just just for the cable card but the second one maybe charged ~$10 for another outlet. So you would reduce your monthly cost greatly.


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

Realize that you have 9 tuners now, but would only have 8 with Bolt. You could have 12 tuners if you went with Roamio Pros instead. If you could get by with 6 tuners, then you could avoid the 2nd outlet fee altogether.

As the previous poster said, your fees would be a grand total of $10, down from the $84 you're paying today. In the first year, your savings would be nearly $900, recouping the cost of one Bolt and all 6 Minis.


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## Hilbe (Sep 5, 2005)

JTHOJNICKI said:


> Hi,
> 
> I am a new member.
> 
> ...


I'm small scale, 1 Bolt and 2 Mini on Comcast. TiVo has been great, getting Comcast to activate my CableCARD has been a nightmare. Tech coming tomorrow. Hoping to finally have TV service.

I recommend you buy at Best Buy. They have a promo going when you buy bolt and mini together. Knocks the mini prices down to $100 each.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

We've opted for a hybrid setup: 1 Comcast-CableCARD'd Roamio Pro (6-tuners) and 1 OTA-connected base Roamio (4-tuners) and 8 Minis. (9 TVs); all but 2 Minis are networked via Ethernet, with the 2 other Minis connecting via an Actiontec MoCA adapter.

The OTA-connected DVR lets us pickup a couple of our PBS digital sub-channels not carried by Comcast, as well as getting CW in HD (Comcast only airs our CW channel in SD).*

With all the above equipment, the Pro's CableCARD is "free" (i.e. counted as the set-top included in our TV package), and there's no Comcast charge or fee associated with any of the other equipment. In addition (or subtraction!), Comcast provides a $2.50/month "Customer-owned Equipment" credit associated with the use of the Roamio Pro.

Works great, and results in our Comcast bill being $2.50 less per month that if we had a single TV with a Comcast set-top. (And, theoretically, $92.50* less per month than if we had an equivalent Comcast setup [a single X1 DVR w/ 8 companions] -- though such a setup isn't physically possible, from my understanding, or financially justifiable. *$112.50 less per month if including a 2nd X1 DVR and Comcast's "HD Technology Fee.")

---

As an aside, per published rates, if a Comcast customer adds a 2nd CableCARD TiVo DVR to their setup, they can expect to be charged a $9.95/month "Additional Outlet" fee associated with the DVR, but would then be eligible for an additional $2.50/month "Customer-owned Equipment" credit: making the effective per-month rate $7.45 for the 2nd DVR.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

JTHOJNICKI said:


> I currently have 3 Dish Hoppers + 6 Joeys installed.


Does your Hopper/Joey setup allow you to watch the same program across all your screens, in sync, with the ability to control the playback from any of the locations?

The TiVo whole-home solution can't do that (on its own). Each TiVo device displays to a single connected display (putting aside any custom setups using third-party gear).


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

krkaufman said:


> Does your Hopper/Joey setup allow you to watch the same program across all your screens, in sync, with the ability to control the playback from any of the locations?


Back when I had Hopper/Joey, it didn't work like that. But it's been a few years, so things may have changed.

Doesn't seem like anything anyone but a Church or Sports bar would want to do.

Dish does now have Super Joey client boxes with their own tuners for live TV, so they don't have to borrow one from their host Hopper. But the OP hasn't mentioned having anything like that.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

mdavej said:


> Doesn't seem like anything anyone but a Church or Sports bar would want to do.


Or my sister... as shes roam about her house cleaning, cooking, doing yoga and generally making things happen.

----
Informational only (not looking to take the thread off-topic)...
I would have sworn that one of the major players had a solution that let you watch the same thing across multiple TVs, in sync, and globally controlled from any of the viewing locations.

I've had something in place for my sister for years, but the only problem is that the IR repeater solution we're using has had a couple transmitters die, recently, and I'm having trouble finding replacements. The other downside is that we're still using an SD broadcast solution (AVcast); I just wasn't willing to lay down the money required for an HD solution (e.g. ZeeVee).​


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

krkaufman said:


> I would have sworn that one of the major players had a solution that let you watch the same thing across multiple TVs, in sync, and globally controlled from any of the viewing locations.


DirecTV used to advertise that you could pause in one room and resume in another. But that was pure fiction for the TV commercial. It never actually worked that way. It worked exactly like Tivo.


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## snerd (Jun 6, 2008)

krkaufman said:


> As an aside, per published rates, if a Comcast customer adds a 2nd CableCARD TiVo DVR to their setup, they can expect to be charged a $9.95/month "Additional Outlet" fee associated with the DVR, but would then be eligible for an additional $2.50/month "Customer-owned Equipment" credit: making the effective per-month rate $7.45 for the 2nd DVR.


I have a Roamio Plus, a Premiere 2-tuner and a Mini. I've never been charged the "Additional Outlet" fee, but I've seen plenty of others posting that they pay it. Comcast charges vary from market to market.

Some people are paying the "HD Technology fee" when they don't need to, since removing that from an account does not prevent TiVos from getting HD channels.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

mdavej said:


> DirecTV used to advertise that you could pause in one room and resume in another. But that was pure fiction for the TV commercial. It never actually worked that way. It worked exactly like Tivo.


With the TiVo I can pause a show in one room and resume it another.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

aaronwt said:


> With the TiVo I can pause a show in one room and resume it another.


I recall a recent DirecTV/AT&T commercial that featured some gee-whiz feature that made me jealous... until I noticed the tiny text at the bottom of the screen saying that some of the described features didn't yet exist.

As for pause/resume, TiVo has that, ReplayTVs have had it for over a decade, but the sought-after feature was the ability to effectively multi-cast a given program to multiple displays, in sync, and control the playback from any one. It's possible that it was DISH that the forum user was referencing, since DISH has had an RF distribution component built-in for years. I might have been misinterpreting that feature with the Joeys providing the capability, in HD.


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

aaronwt said:


> With the TiVo I can pause a show in one room and resume it another.


Understood. DirecTV commercial showed the user playing a show, pausing, walking into another room to find the same show already playing but paused in the same spot. Pure fiction.

In reality, like Tivo, in the second room, you have to find the show in your recording list, and when you play it, it resumes from where you left off the last time you played it (in whatever room). It doesn't magically play itself simultaneously in every room and follow whatever trick play one does in any other room as they lead you to believe. There are a lot more steps involved which don't make for a very impressive commercial.

I remember complaining in a thread at the time about this commercial being false advertising. But the consensus was that everybody knows you can't really do this, so it's fine, quit your complaining. Obviously it really did mislead many people, and is still misleading them even though that commercial hasn't run in years.


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## JTHOJNICKI (Nov 30, 2015)

The Joeys only allow simultaneous viewing of live shows. Recorded shows have to be viewed independently - even though multiple Joeys can view the same recorded show; they must be controlled independently,


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## JTHOJNICKI (Nov 30, 2015)

The only option I ever found that let you simultaneously view the same live or recorded video on all TVs simultaneously was a whole-home video distribution system with RF modulators. In the world of Hi-Def video content and digital TV tuners, these modulators are very expensive. I would love to be able to afford a ZeeVee Pro digital, hi-def modulator to distribute my Hoppers without the Joeys. I sounds like the next best, and cheapest, alternative may be two TIVO Bolts with 6 TIVO minis to mimic my current Hopper/Joey setup. Thank you everyone for the info.


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## JTHOJNICKI (Nov 30, 2015)

How do you take advantage of the Best Buy Bolt/Mini bundle deal? I don't see it anywhere online.


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## Hilbe (Sep 5, 2005)

JTHOJNICKI said:


> How do you take advantage of the Best Buy Bolt/Mini bundle deal? I don't see it anywhere online.


Looks like it's over now. You snooze you lose :/


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## JTHOJNICKI (Nov 30, 2015)

Yeah, well I'm trying to sell the CFO (my wife) on the investment cost of buying 2 Bolts and 6 minis in order to dump our Dish Hopper/Joey system. Will save $2,400 over 3 years even after a $1,600 initial investment and 2 annual TIVO subscriptions.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

JTHOJNICKI said:


> The only option I ever found that let you simultaneously view the same live or recorded video on all TVs simultaneously was a whole-home video distribution system with RF modulators. In the world of Hi-Def video content and digital TV tuners, these modulators are very expensive. I would love to be able to afford a ZeeVee Pro digital, hi-def modulator to distribute my Hoppers without the Joeys. I sounds like the next best, and cheapest, alternative may be two TIVO Bolts with 6 TIVO minis to mimic my current Hopper/Joey setup. Thank you everyone for the info.


This looks promising as it modulates HDMI onto coax as a QAM channel from 0-99. I purchased one transmitter and two receivers for work and just finished using them with a large setup with two 10K DLP projectors onto 16' x 9' fastfold rear projection screens and the image coming from an Analog Way PLS-300 switcher/scalar using its test patterns and images were indistinguishable from straight HDMI. Very good quality.

I'm going to be bringing them home to test in a home modulator environment and if they work this will be a very cheap QAM Modulator solution. The trick is to use very high attenuation on the output of the transmitter because the signal is very hot and designed to be run long distances through various cables and splitters.

This is the transmitter, and there is a matching receiver but I'm thinking you won't need it if you already have a qam tuner on the other end as it modulates on standard North American QAM freqs, although very high signal strength as stated earlier.

http://www.mcmelectronics.com/product/33-11970

I'll report my results.


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## Hilbe (Sep 5, 2005)

JTHOJNICKI said:


> Yeah, well I'm trying to sell the CFO (my wife) on the investment cost of buying 2 Bolts and 6 minis in order to dump our Dish Hopper/Joey system. Will save $2,400 over 3 years even after a $1,600 initial investment and 2 annual TIVO subscriptions.


I usually work up a spreadsheet and do a powerpoint 

It's an easy sell really. Up front expect pains since the cable companies go no idea how to setup/provision cable cards though...

Buy at best buy for easy return too in case the CFO gets upset.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

HarperVision said:


> This looks promising as it modulates HDMI onto coax as a QAM channel from 0-99. ...


Looking forward to your report, especially as to whether the receiver modules can be avoided with a compatible TV.

I've been using an AVcast SD solution for years, but the cost for HD replacements has been prohibitive.

Thanks in advance for your efforts.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Hilbe said:


> I usually work up a spreadsheet and do a powerpoint


Spreadsheet with a graph, check. No Powerpoint, though.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

HarperVision said:


> This looks promising as it modulates HDMI onto coax as a QAM channel from 0-99. ...


What remains a mystery is how Stellar Labs recommends control of the devices attached to the transmitters. The AVcast solution included an IR-over-coax extension mechanism, so I'll need to find some replacement for IR control, as well.

Thanks again.


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## Hilbe (Sep 5, 2005)

krkaufman said:


> Spreadsheet with a graph, check. No Powerpoint, though.


You should update your pricing to figure in Bolt and mini. Prices seem a bit high over Amazon.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Hilbe said:


> You should update your pricing to figure in Bolt and mini. Prices seem a bit high over Amazon.


Thanks for the feedback, but I'll leave that to whoever might need the spreadsheet. It's served its purpose, for me (at least until the release of the BOLT Pro), and so I was just providing it as a starting point for anyone else, not as a finished product.


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## Robbo1 (Oct 31, 2015)

My plan is to replace three Cable Co DVRs (at $20/month each) with a Bolt + 2GB HD upgrade+ 2 minis. Total cost is $290 Bolt + $95 HD + $120x2 = $665 (incl tax). That puts me at a 1 year breakeven on the equipment and then i save $570/year thereafter, assuming I can't get a good deal on lifetime after the first year free is up. 

Best part is I am spinning this as a Christmas present to my wife, who hates the Cableco DVR with a passion (and fondly remembers our old ReplayTV)! I actually got the Bolt up and running and recording her shows, so on xmas day I can simply hot swap the cable box out. Also wanted to make sure that I could get the Minis working on my network, which I was able to do without too much trouble.


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## Hilbe (Sep 5, 2005)

Robbo1 said:


> My plan is to replace three Cable Co DVRs (at $20/month each) with a Bolt + 2GB HD upgrade+ 2 minis. Total cost is $290 Bolt + $95 HD + $120x2 = $665 (incl tax). That puts me at a 1 year breakeven on the equipment and then i save $570/year thereafter, assuming I can't get a good deal on lifetime after the first year free is up.
> 
> Best part is I am spinning this as a Christmas present to my wife, who hates the Cableco DVR with a passion (and fondly remembers our old ReplayTV)! I actually got the Bolt up and running and recording her shows, so on xmas day I can simply hot swap the cable box out. Also wanted to make sure that I could get the Minis working on my network, which I was able to do without too much trouble.


The HD is on sale on new egg right now on coupon. $90


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