# Daytona and House



## tomhorsley (Jul 22, 2010)

So, NASCAR has already announced several hours before the scheduled time that the Daytona 500 will start at 7 PM tonight. What are the odds that my TiVo will find out when House and Alcatraz have been postponed to? (Or that I will ever find out, for that matter, it certainly isn't on the FOX schedule info web page yet .


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

tomhorsley said:


> So, NASCAR has already announced several hours before the scheduled time that the Daytona 500 will start at 7 PM tonight. What are the odds that my TiVo will find out when House and Alcatraz have been postponed to? (Or that I will ever find out, for that matter, it certainly isn't on the FOX schedule info web page yet .


Since zap2it still has it scheduled for a Noon start, I'd say that the odds are zero that the TiVo will ever find out and that we will have to force record the actual showings of those two episodes.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

tomhorsley said:


> So, NASCAR has already announced several hours before the scheduled time that the Daytona 500 will start at 7 PM tonight. What are the odds that my TiVo will find out when House and Alcatraz have been postponed to? (Or that I will ever find out, for that matter, it certainly isn't on the FOX schedule info web page yet .


Since a 7PM Daytona race will postpone the normal airings, it should pick them up in their next scheduled slot, it's what's so great about a SP. One of the benefits of the new style faster guide updates over the past few years.


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

dianebrat said:


> Since a 7PM Daytona race will postpone the normal airings, it should pick them up in their next scheduled slot, it's what's so great about a SP. One of the benefits of the new style faster guide updates over the past few years.


If the Tivo does not get the guide update in time it will think it already recorded these episodes and so will not record them when they actually air. The chance of everyone getting that update in time is slim at this point.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

WhiskeyTango said:


> If the Tivo does not get the guide update in time it will think it already recorded these episodes and so will not record them when they actually air. The chance of everyone getting that update in time is slim at this point.


Big IF there.. I have seen the new style update method be much more aggressive in pushing out these changes to boxes over the past few years. If the box gets an update push removing these they'll get rescheduled as long as it gets it before 8PM EDT.


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## dave13077 (Jan 11, 2009)

On this subject.. Is there a way to record a certain channel for a certain time frame regardless of what is on? I want to record the Daytona 500 but I think I would have to go in a just record what ever is in the guide for how ever long I think the race will last. Is there another way, if not there should be


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## Len McRiddles (Dec 21, 2002)

Set up a manual recording.


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## That Don Guy (Mar 13, 2003)

dianebrat said:


> Since a 7PM Daytona race will postpone the normal airings, it should pick them up in their next scheduled slot, it's what's so great about a SP. One of the benefits of the new style faster guide updates over the past few years.


Of course, this works both ways - if, somehow, the schedules are updated to take the 7 PM start into account, and then the race is postponed again, then new episodes of House and Alcatraz end up being aired after all with all of the SPs missing them.

(Hopefully, if this does happen, or if NASCAR decides at 7:00 to wait until 8:00 to start and Fox decides to air House an hour early (they have done this before with The Simpsons, albeit with a repeat), Fox is smart enough to air a repeat.

In any event, keep an eye on the schedule, since whatever Fox airs between 8 and 10 Eastern will be considered as new episodes of House and Alcatraz as far as TiVo is concerned, it might not schedule it because it thinks "it was recorded in the past 28 days".)


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## dave13077 (Jan 11, 2009)

Len McRiddles said:


> Set up a manual recording.


How is that done? I looked through the menus and couldn't find a spot to do that.. Thx


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

dianebrat said:


> Big IF there.. I have seen the new style update method be much more aggressive in pushing out these changes to boxes over the past few years. If the box gets an update push removing these they'll get rescheduled as long as it gets it before 8PM EDT.


I don't know what 'new style update method' you are talking about. Tivo updates their servers and any Tivo that makes a connection after that gets the update. They don't push anything out. We (TCF) had an issue with this last summer with the President giving a speech. It was announced the day before and the update was not made available until the afternoon of the day of the speech. Any Tivos that connected before the update was made, had to make a manual connection to get the new data.

It's now after 2pm. The announcement was made about 3.5 hours ago. The update still hasn't reached Zap2It. Which means it is likely at least a few more hours before it gets to Tivo. Don't hold your breath for an update this evening.


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

dave13077 said:


> How is that done? I looked through the menus and couldn't find a spot to do that.. Thx


Find Programs->Record By Time/Channel->Set Up Manual Recording


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## dave13077 (Jan 11, 2009)

WhiskeyTango said:


> Find Programs->Record By Time/Channel->Set Up Manual Recording


Thx. Said that I have had a Tivo for 3 years and didn't know about this.


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## Scyber (Apr 25, 2002)

House and Alcatraz are on Hulu plus, so those that subscribe shouldn't need to worry too much.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

Tribune has updated the listings. TiVo doesn't have them yet but if wait until closer to 7PM EST to force a connection attempt, it should update.


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

rainwater said:


> Tribune has updated the listings.


Where are you seeing that? I just checked and it is still showing House/Alcatraz.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

WhiskeyTango said:


> Where are you seeing that? I just checked and it is still showing House/Alcatraz.


(in bad French accent) "nut anymore".


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

lpwcomp said:


> (in bad French accent) "nut anymore".


It's still not changed. It has the Nascar race on now.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

How long is the Daytona 500? (I'm not a NASCAR fan) Is this something that is likely to effect West coast people? Or just the East coast?

Dan


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## dave13077 (Jan 11, 2009)

Dan203 said:


> How long is the Daytona 500? (I'm not a NASCAR fan) Is this something that is likely to effect West coast people? Or just the East coast?
> 
> Dan


If the race goes off on time (7pm eastern) it should last around 3 1/2 hours. If there are rain delays during the race than it is anyone's guess. A couple of years ago the Daytona race that is in July had rain delays and didn't finish until 2am. That race also started earlier than 7pm.


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## bobfrank (Mar 17, 2005)

Unfortunately, Dan, it always seems that if programs get bumped on the east coast the are also bumped out west even if there is no time conflict in the west.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

WhiskeyTango said:


> Where are you seeing that? I just checked and it is still showing House/Alcatraz.


It's updated for me and should be in the next few hours for everyone. If you wait until around 6 to force a connection, hopefully it will be updated on TiVos servers.


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

rainwater said:


> It's updated for me and should be in the next few hours for everyone. If you wait until around 6 to force a connection, hopefully it will be updated on TiVos servers.


Thanks.


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## That Don Guy (Mar 13, 2003)

bobfrank said:


> Unfortunately, Dan, it always seems that if programs get bumped on the east coast the are also bumped out west even if there is no time conflict in the west.


Correct. When Fox knows that something will be pre-empted in the east, almost always they will not air it in the west (for example, the Coca-Cola 600 on the day before Memorial Day ends before 8 PM Pacific time, but the Fox stations in the west air local programming in prime time that night). Fox used to have "west coast only" airings of shows (usually reruns, but they did burn off new episodes of the last season of 'Til Death this way) from 7 to 8 Pacific on NFL doubleheader days, but they stopped doing this in 2010.

Fox certainly won't air new episodes of popular shows to just 20% or of the country.

As I said in another thread, San Francisco's Fox station has already updated its schedule and does not have any Fox programming scheduled for after the race.


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## Archangel00 (Aug 25, 2006)

Very little difference in NASCAR plate racing and House in quite some time anyway so what's the big deal? Enjoy the sheer boredom, interrupted with a few moments of destruction, pain, and utter nonsense, only presented in a different format tonight.


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

WhiskeyTango said:


> I don't know what 'new style update method' you are talking about. Tivo updates their servers and any Tivo that makes a connection after that gets the update. They don't push anything out. We (TCF) had an issue with this last summer with the President giving a speech. It was announced the day before and the update was not made available until the afternoon of the day of the speech. Any Tivos that connected before the update was made, had to make a manual connection to get the new data.
> .


On occasion, I have seen my guide update without the normal call home. My Tivos usually call home in the middle of the night.
I usually thumb through the guide as part of my morning routine. Sometimes when I look at the guide in the evening I'll see a time slot suddenly change. For a moment, I see what was going to be on, then it quickly changes to what will be on. 
So apparently, TiVo has a way to update the guide in between the normal calls.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

steve614 said:


> On occasion, I have seen my guide update without the normal call home. My Tivos usually call home in the middle of the night.
> I usually thumb through the guide as part of my morning routine. Sometimes when I look at the guide in the evening I'll see a time slot suddenly change. For a moment, I see what was going to be on, then it quickly changes to what will be on.
> So apparently, TiVo has a way to update the guide in between the normal calls.


What you are seeing is a part of the Guide caching TiVo implemented several years ago to make the guide faster. The update of guide data actually occurs during the daily connection (there is no other time that it gets guide changes), but you will see this behavior you experience when TiVo has already cached the guide info for that channel and time.


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

steve614 said:


> On occasion, I have seen my guide update without the normal call home. My Tivos usually call home in the middle of the night.
> I usually thumb through the guide as part of my morning routine. Sometimes when I look at the guide in the evening I'll see a time slot suddenly change. For a moment, I see what was going to be on, then it quickly changes to what will be on.
> So apparently, TiVo has a way to update the guide in between the normal calls.


I'm still not sure that is the case. I saw the same thing you just described about 5 minutes ago when I checked to see if I had gotten the update. Except, it was the change for the Fox afternoon schedule going from the usual daytime talk shows to NASCAR. I just checked it several more times and each time is shows the same behavior, old shows at first, new programming repopulating.

I didn't receive the latest update and my last connection was at 3:11pm today. I think the connection times may be random and you may just happen to catch the guide after it has updated with the daily call. I just checked my other Tivo, last connection today 11:57am, next connection tomorrow 2:41pm. I am going to leave that untouched and see if I get a "pushed out" update from Tivo.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

bobfrank said:


> Unfortunately, Dan, it always seems that if programs get bumped on the east coast the are also bumped out west even if there is no time conflict in the west.


I haven't found that to be true with football. I know you guys regularly miss out on the Sunday night cartoons due to football running over, but we never miss them here in the west. Not sure if something special like a once a year race will make a difference on that front.

Dan


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

WhiskeyTango said:


> I'm still not sure that is the case. I saw the same thing you just described about 5 minutes ago when I checked to see if I had gotten the update. *Except, it was the change for the Fox afternoon schedule going from the usual daytime talk shows to NASCAR. I just checked it several more times and each time is shows the same behavior, old shows at first, new programming repopulating.*
> 
> I didn't receive the latest update and my last connection was at 3:11pm today. I think the connection times may be random and you may just happen to catch the guide after it has updated with the daily call. I just checked my other Tivo, last connection today 11:57am, next connection tomorrow 2:41pm. I am going to leave that untouched and see if I get a "pushed out" update from Tivo.


The difference is the same as the example from last year you gave, broadband Tivos do check in a bit more often than S1 and S2 units that only ever assumed a single daily check. In the old days you would never be able to see a change during the day for that evenings programming, now there's a good chance you might.

I would suspect that there's a flag on their end that says "hey, updated guide data here, when you get a few maybe you should update" in these situations.


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## tomhorsley (Jul 22, 2010)

At least FOX's TV schedule page finally lists NASCAR (now that the race has started . But the only hint it gives about House and Alcatraz is that they will be rescheduled later in March. Nothing more specific available.

I guess I'd better unplug the Tivo this evening before 8 so it won't think it recorded them.


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

dianebrat said:


> The difference is the same as the example from last year you gave, broadband Tivos do check in a bit more often than S1 and S2 units that only ever assumed a single daily check. In the old days you would never be able to see a change during the day for that evenings programming, now there's a good chance you might.
> 
> I would suspect that there's a flag on their end that says "hey, updated guide data here, when you get a few maybe you should update" in these situations.


Except that the update I mentioned showed the race airing from 12-5:30pm today. I didn't get the update until my Tivo made its regular daily call at 3:11pm. The only thing they check in on is for online scheduling requests.

In my example from last year, the only reason I, and others, got the update in time was because the call was made after the data had been updated on Tivo's end. In my case, I had to force a call in that evening, after the Tivo had already made it's daily call.


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## tomhorsley (Jul 22, 2010)

For me the update is a moot point. I forced an update around 7PM, and the schedule info still believed the normal programming was on, so I have my TiVo unplugged for the evening now so it won't believe it recorded House and Alcatraz and maybe it will find them when they are rescheduled by FOX (though I have never once observed the TiVo do this successfully with a show it missed, but maybe being powered off will convince it that it really did miss the show this time .


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

tomhorsley said:


> For me the update is a moot point. I forced an update around 7PM, and the schedule info still believed the normal programming was on, so I have my TiVo unplugged for the evening now so it won't believe it recorded House and Alcatraz and maybe it will find them when they are rescheduled by FOX (though I have never once observed the TiVo do this successfully with a show it missed, but maybe being powered off will convince it that it really did miss the show this time .


All you had to do was cancel your recordings of House and Alcatraz and it would automatically record the next airing assuming you have season passes for them. The only way it would not record it is if you let it record tonight.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

Dan203 said:


> I haven't found that to be true with football. I know you guys regularly miss out on the Sunday night cartoons due to football running over, but we never miss them here in the west. Not sure if something special like a once a year race will make a difference on that front.
> 
> Dan


We do not regularly miss out on the Sunday night cartoons during football season. They get delayed sometimes, even with the "padding" provided by "The OT". But delay and cancellation are two different situations. There is no way Fox would have aired the new episodes of House and Alcatraz in any time zone once they were canceled in the east. They would then be out of synch for the rest of the season.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

In any case it didn't really matter. That giant fire delayed the whole thing for like an extra 2 hours so even on the West it overlapped. (saw the fire live because I was at a bar playing pool)

Dan


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## tiassa (Jul 2, 2008)

rainwater said:


> All you had to do was cancel your recordings of House and Alcatraz and it would automatically record the next airing assuming you have season passes for them. The only way it would not record it is if you let it record tonight.


Exactly, that's what I did when I realized that Daytona was going to preempt Alcatraz.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

rainwater said:


> It's updated for me and should be in the next few hours for everyone. If you wait until around 6 to force a connection, hopefully it will be updated on TiVos servers.


I wish I would have seen this thread yesterday. I would have forced a connection last night. I didn't know that House and Alctraz were being preempted. My Elite did not pick up the new guide data so I have an Alcatraz and a House recording that has NASCAR instead. I'll just need to make sure I manually select the episodes for next week otherwise the TiVo thinks it has already recorded it.

EDIT: I guess I should have read the entire thread first. I guess it wouldn't have mattered. I thought the race was scheduled to be on during prime time but I guess it was just delayed from earlier in the day.


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

aaronwt said:


> I wish I would have seen this thread yesterday. I would have forced a connection last night. I didn't know that House and Alctraz were being preempted. My Elite did not pick up the new guide data so I have an Alcatraz and a House recording that has NASCAR instead. I'll just need to make sure I manually select the episodes for next week otherwise the TiVo thinks it has already recorded it.
> 
> EDIT: I guess I should have read the entire thread first. I guess it wouldn't have mattered. I thought the race was scheduled to be on during prime time but I guess it was just delayed from earlier in the day.


The race was originally scheduled for 12-5:30pm, then changed to 7pm start time. Forcing a connection wouldn't have helped. AFAIK, Tivo never got the guide data updated. I forced 4 connections between 6-8pm and nothing changed. I think rainwater was saying the Tribune data for his area was updated, not Tivo's.


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## That Don Guy (Mar 13, 2003)

Dan203 said:


> I haven't found that to be true with football. I know you guys regularly miss out on the Sunday night cartoons due to football running over, but we never miss them here in the west.


Apparently, you didn't notice the nine Sundays a year during the NFL regular season when Fox doesn't air network programming between 7 and 8 Pacific on Sundays (well, except for postseason baseball). (If you get Simpsons and/or Family Guy episodes between 7 and 8 on those days, those are syndicated repeats run by the local station.)

As I said in an earlier post in this thread, it's not a "one-time thing"; both the Coca-Coca 600 and the NFC Championship Game end before 8 PM Pacific, but Fox does not run any of its shows out west on those nights. Fox's "usual policy" is, if a show has to be pre-empted in the Eastern and Central time zones at the last minute because of an event that runs long, a scheduled repeat will air "as scheduled" out west, but a new episode will not (if possible, Fox will air a repeat of that series in its place).

Then again, I've seen Fox do some strange things - in early 2008, a NASCAR race on Fox was scheduled to end by 8 PM, with normal programming following, but there were various delays, and in the middle of one of them, when Fox realized that they had at least 30 minutes before the race would resume, they announced pretty much out of the blue that they would air that night's planned Simpsons episode "right now" (which was at 9:30 Eastern - and it aired simultaneously out west, even though it was only 6:30 Pacific, although Fox did air it a second time out west that night after the race finally ended).


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

I see the episode of _House_, "Love is Blind", scheduled on USA Network on Friday from 4-5 PM. The episode of _Alcatraz_, "Clarence Montgomery" is nowhere to be found. Perhaps Fox will announce an airing of the programs on Saturday night or something.


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## Aero 1 (Aug 8, 2007)

http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/ent...-programming-alert-daytona-500-house-alcatraz



> FOX has announced make-up times for the programs.
> 
> The network says the episode of "House" previously scheduled for Monday, Feb. 27 will now be seen on Monday, March 19. "Alcatraz" will now have back-to-back new episodes on Monday, March 5.


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## allan (Oct 14, 2002)

I thought mine was okay. I got home yesterday and it said the race was on. But apparently, it didn't get to my ToDo list, and it recorded a chunk of the race, thinking it was Alcatraz.


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## nhaigh (Jul 16, 2001)

mikeyts said:


> I see the episode of _House_, "Love is Blind", scheduled on USA Network on Friday from 4-5 PM. .


I picked up on that and set it to record but I suspect it will get pulled from USA before then - no way USA air an episode before fox do.


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## That Don Guy (Mar 13, 2003)

Aero 1 said:


> http://www.myfoxhouston.com/dpp/ent...-programming-alert-daytona-500-house-alcatraz
> 
> 
> > FOX has announced make-up times for the programs.
> ...


Actually, Fox had already scheduled back-to-back Alcatraz episodes for March 4. However, according to this Fox press release, they have now also scheduled back-to-back episodes on March 25, which I don't think had been planned.


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## tomhorsley (Jul 22, 2010)

My TiVo thinks that the skipped episode will be shown at 11pm following the 2 hour episode. Don't know if I believe they would run 3 hours of Alcatraz together or not. I'll see if it still thinks that by the time the episode rolls around (it also thinks the House episode will appear on USA as mentioned above, and I doubt that I believe that either).


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

That Don Guy said:


> Actually, Fox had already scheduled back-to-back Alcatraz episodes for March 4. However, according to this Fox press release, they have now also scheduled back-to-back episodes on March 25, which I don't think had been planned.


That would actually be March 5th and 26th.


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## Worf (Sep 15, 2000)

nhaigh said:


> I picked up on that and set it to record but I suspect it will get pulled from USA before then - no way USA air an episode before fox do.


It aired SOMEWHERE. I know it aired in Canada (if you have a Canadian proxy, Global TV has it online). I think it's also available via torrents... or maybe that one was from the Canadian showing.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

Well, it did get pulled from USA and replaced with a repeat of the previous episode, even though it _did_ air in Canada. It's been pushed back to the 19th, when the next episode of _House_ would have aired. They'll have to find a night to double _House_ up somewhere or run its season a week long.


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## scandia101 (Oct 20, 2007)

rainwater said:


> All you had to do was cancel your recordings of House and Alcatraz and it would automatically record the next airing assuming you have season passes for them. The only way it would not record it is if you let it record tonight.


Actually, no. that won't work, unless Tivo has made changes and I have no reason to think they have. If you manually cancel a SP episode recording, your Tivo will not just pick up the next airing because it thinks you don't want that episode at all. There are only two ways to get the next airing in a situation like this; create higher priority recordings on all tuners or pull the plug.


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## JosephB (Nov 19, 2010)

scandia101 said:


> Actually, no. that won't work, unless Tivo has made changes and I have no reason to think they have. If you manually cancel a SP episode recording, your Tivo will not just pick up the next airing because it thinks you don't want that episode at all. There are only two ways to get the next airing in a situation like this; create higher priority recordings on all tuners or pull the plug.


Or if you're going to go through all that trouble, just go and manually schedule a recording on the rescheduled showing.


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## Grakthis (Oct 4, 2006)

scandia101 said:


> Actually, no. that won't work, unless Tivo has made changes and I have no reason to think they have. If you manually cancel a SP episode recording, your Tivo will not just pick up the next airing because it thinks you don't want that episode at all. There are only two ways to get the next airing in a situation like this; create higher priority recordings on all tuners or pull the plug.


Then, good news, TiVo has made changes!

I've literally canceled the next airing of the Daily Show (because it overlapped with an NBA game I wanted to record) and the TiVo just automatically picked up the 1AM re-airing instead without me doing anything. This has been in the last month and a half that I did this on a TiVo premiere.


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## andyf (Feb 23, 2000)

The Daily Show doesn't count because of the lack guide data, TiVo wants to get every show.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

TiVo has always been able to switch to a later repeat airing of a program which a higher priority program preempts. What I want is for it to switch to a later repeat airing when there's a conflict even when the first airing is the higher priority recording request if the lower priority program has no repeat airing the guide (or at least an option to tell it to do that).

Fairly recently I've had it skip recording something in order to record a higher priority series on TNT which repeated 2 hours later . I fixed that by adjusting the priorities of the season passes, but I often neglect to go in and adjust the order of season passes when I add a new one. It'd be nice if it asked me if I wanted to do that, or just automatically dumped me in the season pass list with the priority button for the new season pass selected.


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## andyf (Feb 23, 2000)

In the HDUI if you schedule a Season Pass it does ask if you want to go to the Season Pass Manager.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

That's nice to know if I ever decide to get a Premiere .


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

mikeyts said:


> TiVo has always been able to switch to a later repeat airing of a program which a higher priority program preempts. What I want is for it to switch to a later repeat airing when there's a conflict even when the first airing is the higher priority recording request if the lower priority program has no repeat airing the guide (or at least an option to tell it to do that).


That's basically an unsolvable problem -- or at least you'd have to brute force try EVERY possibility. That's why there is the SP ordering - to tell it which shows you care about.

BTW, another case that I don't know if people have mentioned. If you IMPLICITLY cancel a recording, by setting another recording that makes you cancel a show, then the Tivo will (if given enough time) record another showing. It's only when you manually cancel THAT recording that it thinks (rightly) that you don't want to record that episode.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

mattack said:


> That's basically an unsolvable problem -- or at least you'd have to brute force try EVERY possibility. That's why there is the SP ordering - to tell it which shows you care about.


How exactly is that unsolvable? Before preempting a lower priority program which does not recur, it should check whether the preempting program recurs in the guide. Perhaps it could be controlled with a setting which'd specify a time limit within which the higher priority program must recur; if it doesn't recur within that limit, it would go ahead and preempt the non-recurring lower priority program (that way it won't preempt the higher priority program to record it several days later, unless you didn't specify a limit). One of the values of the setting would be to never preempt a recurring higher priority program in order to record it later.

I just want it to make every reasonable effort to record everything I asked it to, if possible.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

And when the repeat gets preempted and you miss the higher priority show? Also, when dealing with season passes, the scheduling decisions are sometimes made before the the additional showings are in the guide data. Sometimes there are conflicts with multiple showings. The kind of scheduling decisions you want the TiVo to make can cascade. The code to implement it is nowhere near as simple as you think it is.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

What I'm asking for _is_ very simple and very specific: before preempting recording a program with no repeat in the guide because it has lower priority than something at the same time, check to see if the higher priority program is repeated within a specified time period and if it is, record it then and record the lower priority program now. That's it--_very_ simple. I realize that TiVo can't guarantee that the next showing of the higher priority program won't be preempted, but neither can it can it guarantee that the first showing of it won't, the topic of this thread in evidence. "You pays yo' money and you takes yo' chances". My suggestion is also that this mechanism be an option that no one is forced to enable.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

It may be simple to describe, but it is far from simple to implement. You have absolutely no clue what would be involved. I don't want TiVo to devote any resources to this issue which, for the most part, can be solved by properly organizing your SPs. The few cases where this wouldn't work definitely don't justify the effort.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

lpwcomp said:


> It may be simple to describe, but it is far from simple to implement. You have absolutely no clue what would be involved. I don't want TiVo to devote any resources to this issue which, for the most part, can be solved by properly organizing your SPs. The few cases where this wouldn't work definitely don't justify the effort.


Though I'm in disability retirement now, I was a software engineer for 30+ years, the last 15 of which were writing systems embedded in consumer equipment, so I _can_ imagine what's involved, your opinion as to its complexity not withstanding. And it would help me, if not you. Multiple times in the past year alone I've missed things because they were preempted by recording requests for programs on cable networks such as TNT, A&E and USA, where every series episode airs twice on its first day and twice again the next day.

You and I have just have differing opinions about this--let's just agree to disagree.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

mikeyts said:


> You and I have just have differing opinions about this--let's just agree to disagree.


Sound's good to me.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

This is why I have all SPs for broadcast networks (which don't repeat all the time) above all the cable networks. Won't stop three broadcast shows from colliding, but does a good job of handling the cable ones because they always get picked up later.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

slowbiscuit said:


> This is why I have all SPs for broadcast networks (which don't repeat all the time) above all the cable networks. Won't stop three broadcast shows from colliding, but does a good job of handling the cable ones because they always get picked up later.


I just set up the missing House for the 19th, just look at upcoming shows of House and you will see the program of House you want.


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## Grakthis (Oct 4, 2006)

andyf said:


> The Daily Show doesn't count because of the lack guide data, TiVo wants to get every show.


My TiVo only records new Episodes of the daily show and only records the show once a night and doesn't record multiple episodes.

So, I guess what I am saying here, is no, you're wrong.


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## Grakthis (Oct 4, 2006)

mikeyts said:


> TiVo has always been able to switch to a later repeat airing of a program which a higher priority program preempts. What I want is for it to switch to a later repeat airing when there's a conflict even when the first airing is the higher priority recording request if the lower priority program has no repeat airing the guide (or at least an option to tell it to do that).
> 
> Fairly recently I've had it skip recording something in order to record a higher priority series on TNT which repeated 2 hours later . I fixed that by adjusting the priorities of the season passes, but I often neglect to go in and adjust the order of season passes when I add a new one. It'd be nice if it asked me if I wanted to do that, or just automatically dumped me in the season pass list with the priority button for the new season pass selected.


The issue there is what if you want to watch the higher priority show as soon as it airs?

I mean, I understand what you're saying. You don't watch shows as soon as they air, right?

But if, for example, my TiVo was set to record all UofL basketball games as a wishlist (highest priority item) and 2 other shows were on at the same time and ESPN is re-airing the UofL game at 4AM I would be furious if my TiVo recorded the 4AM showing of the UofL game and recorded House and Grey's Anatomy instead. Because when I turn on my TV at 7:30 (for a 7PM UofL game) I expect to be able to load up the UofL game and fast forward through the first 30 minutes of commercials and half-time.


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## Grakthis (Oct 4, 2006)

mattack said:


> That's basically an unsolvable problem -- or at least you'd have to brute force try EVERY possibility. That's why there is the SP ordering - to tell it which shows you care about.
> 
> BTW, another case that I don't know if people have mentioned. If you IMPLICITLY cancel a recording, by setting another recording that makes you cancel a show, then the Tivo will (if given enough time) record another showing. It's only when you manually cancel THAT recording that it thinks (rightly) that you don't want to record that episode.


No, I canceled the episode of the Daily Show. I didn't just record something else. I actually went into the "ToDo" list and selected that airing of the daily show and canceled it. Then I went in and added the show I wanted recorded.

This came up in another thread because it was a case where we had Gray's Anatomy running till like 10:05 and the Daily Show starting at 10:00 and I wanted to record the Clippers game that started at 10 and my options were "don't record" or "clip Grays Anatomy." And neither of those was an option (my wife would have thrown a fit if I had clipped the last 5 minutes of Grays!) I was willing to choose. So I had to manually resolve this.

So i went in and canceled the Daily Show and scheduled the Clippers game. I woke up the next morning to find it had recorded the Daily Show during the middle of the night.


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## TiVo_Fanatic (May 29, 2006)

Jut so were all on the same page and I don't have to re-read three pages.

What is the re-air date for houe ?

If I recall, it's the 12th for the Alcatraz ep.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

TiVo_Fanatic said:


> Jut so were all on the same page and I don't have to re-read three pages.
> 
> What is the re-air date for houe ?


3/19.



TiVo_Fanatic said:


> If I recall, it's the 12th for the Alcatraz ep.


Correct. Also another new ep on 3/19.


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## TiVo_Fanatic (May 29, 2006)

lpwcomp said:


> 3/19.
> 
> Correct. Also another new ep on 3/19.


Ty.

Need to set my manuals before I forget.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

mikeyts said:


> What I'm asking for _is_ very simple and very specific: before preempting recording a program with no repeat in the guide because it has lower priority than something at the same time, check to see if the higher priority program is repeated within a specified time period and if it is, record it then and record the lower priority program now. That's it--_very_ simple. I realize that TiVo can't guarantee that the next showing of the higher priority program won't be preempted, but neither can it can it guarantee that the first showing of it won't, the topic of this thread in evidence. "You pays yo' money and you takes yo' chances". My suggestion is also that this mechanism be an option that no one is forced to enable.


This issue that happened with the schedule being pre-empted by racing is something that is extremely rare.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

dianebrat said:


> ...... broadband Tivos do check in a bit more often than S1 and S2 units that only ever assumed a single daily check........


My Tivo HD checks in about every 21 hours. I guess that qualifies as "a bit more often" -- but a pretty small "bit".


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

Dan203 said:


> ...... (saw the fire live because I was at a bar playing pool)


 We've got trouble, right here in river city! A forum moderator and VideoReDo developer hanging out in pool halls? I hope you weren't also consuming alcoholic beverages! 

I suppose the next thing we'll learn is you live in a van down by the river -- except they don't have rivers in Nevada, do they? (Remember Chris Farley on SNL?)


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

dlfl said:


> My Tivo HD checks in about every 21 hours. I guess that qualifies as "a bit more often" -- but a pretty small "bit".


If you're talking about the daily data download, the usual schedule for any TiVo is @ every 26hrs. Any S2 or later broadband connected TiVo "checks in" a lot more often than that. Online scheduling wouldn't be very responsive otherwise. I don't think "pushes" would work very well either.

I am talking about non DTiVos. I have no idea what DTiVos do.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

Grakthis said:


> The issue there is what if you want to watch the higher priority show as soon as it airs?
> 
> I mean, I understand what you're saying. You don't watch shows as soon as they air, right?


If I'm timeshifting it with TiVo I obviously don't care a whole hell of a lot of about watching it as soon as it first airs (though I can see your point about wanting to watch a sporting event as soon as possible after recording it). In any case, I propose that this feature be enabled by settings. I'd also suggest that it not preempt live events in favor of recording a repeat.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

Mike, do you have all your broadcast SPs higher than your cable SPs? This will solve 90+% of your issue, because the lower-priority cable network repeats will be picked up later.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

dlfl said:


> My Tivo HD checks in about every 21 hours. I guess that qualifies as "a bit more often" -- but a pretty small "bit".





lpwcomp said:


> If you're talking about the daily data download, the usual schedule for any TiVo is @ every 26hrs. Any S2 or later broadband connected TiVo "checks in" a lot more often than that. Online scheduling wouldn't be very responsive otherwise. I don't think "pushes" would work very well either........


Hmm... I guess it depends on what "checks in" is defined as. On Friday nights I typically look at the C-SPAN Book TV schedule for the weekend to see what I want to schedule. Frequently I have to force a connection (and yes I have a broadband connection) to get the weekend schedule (apparently because the schedule had not been updated when my TiVo did its schedule update earlier Friday).

So, whatever these more frequent "check ins" you refer to are, they don't help in keeping the schedule up to date. Maybe they only update recordings or SP's you've already been able to schedule?


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

dlfl said:


> Hmm... I guess it depends on what "checks in" is defined as. On Friday nights I typically look at the C-SPAN Book TV schedule for the weekend to see what I want to schedule. Frequently I have to force a connection (and yes I have a broadband connection) to get the weekend schedule (apparently because the schedule had not been updated when my TiVo did its schedule update earlier Friday).
> 
> So, whatever these more frequent "check ins" you refer to are, they don't help in keeping the schedule up to date. Maybe they only update recordings or SP's you've already been able to schedule?


The 'check ins' are just to see if there are any pending online scheduling requests. The only time the guide data is updated is on the daily call in. Any updates to the guide after your Tivo has made it's one daily call would require you to force a connection to redownload the new guide data.


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## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

WhiskeyTango said:


> The 'check ins' are just to see if there are any pending online scheduling requests. The only time the guide data is updated is on the daily call in. Any updates to the guide after your Tivo has made it's one daily call would require you to force a connection to redownload the new guide data.


That's the way I understand it.

I have actually found one of my TiVos showed a schedule change and the other did not because of when they call in, last time I noticed that was just last week (one was calling in early morning the other early afternoon). A manual update will correct the older schedule.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

WhiskeyTango said:


> The 'check ins' are just to see if there are any pending online scheduling requests. The only time the guide data is updated is on the daily call in. Any updates to the guide after your Tivo has made it's one daily call would require you to force a connection to redownload the new guide data.


It can't be that simple. Suppose:
1. Your tivo gets it's "daily" guide update at 10 am.
2. The guide on the server gets updated at 11 am.
3. At 11:30 am you schedule a recording on line.
4. On the updated (online) guide, the program you schedule has changed it's name, description *and start and end times*.

Now there is a complete inconsistency between the program data on your TiVo and what's on the server. How does this get handled when the TiVo "checks in just to see if there are any pending online scheduling requests" ? Just updating the data for that one program can't work because the start and end times now overlap (incorrect) start and end times in the obsolete guide stored on your TiVo. It seems that as a minimum, the guide data for at least the one channel involved would have to be completely updated in order to process the online-scheduled recording.


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

dlfl said:


> It can't be that simple. Suppose:
> 1. Your tivo gets it's "daily" guide update at 10 am.
> 2. The guide on the server gets updated at 11 am.
> 3. At 11:30 am you schedule a recording on line.
> ...


You would probably just get an error message saying the recording could not be scheduled because it is no longer in the guide.


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## Grakthis (Oct 4, 2006)

mikeyts said:


> If I'm timeshifting it with TiVo I obviously don't care a whole hell of a lot of about watching it as soon as it first airs (though I can see your point about wanting to watch a sporting event as soon as possible after recording it). In any case, I propose that this feature be enabled by settings. I'd also suggest that it not preempt live events in favor of recording a repeat.


I would tend to think it would have to be a setting for each season pass. And I am not sure a clear way to word it. But yeah, it seems plausible. You'd want it hidden under an "advanced" menu.


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## johnn34 (Apr 26, 2012)

I remember when I listen Daytona 500 race will start at 7 PM then I&#8217;m shocked. I&#8217;m waiting for this race from 2 weeks ago and suddenly I heard about delay of this race. This was really shocking news for me.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

um, okay... ;


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