# Trouble with accounts.



## TrainManG

Greetings.

I may well be Sky/TiVo/Whatever's best customer - I have 12, sad isn't it?

I've been having some trouble with the accounts on 2 of them, both of which were operational and Direct Debiting correctly.

Suddenly, one of them has gone to 8:Closed and the other, which I have had for nearly 6 years, has gone to 7:Never set up!!!!

Despite umpteen repeated calls to Livingston and them sending the dreaded 'Snooze' command, all that happens is they drop to 4:TiVo internal testing and then back to states 7: and 8: after about 5-6 days.

BTW, these are unmodified TiVos - the only 2 left in such a state.

I've even called the States, and they say all they are getting is the 'Snooze' command for these units, which, in their words, is a waste of time!

A check on my Bank Account today shows Sky are debiting for these units and have now taken £40 for blocking my service.

Anyone else had similar problems? I do hope not!

Geoff - TrainManG


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## Pete77

Make sure you contact Tivo using the non 0870 number available on the www.saynoto0870.com website.

Unfortunately no suggestions as to what may be the cause of these problems though. Has anyone else still paying a monthly sub had similar problems?


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## cwaring

Only one Tivo here, but no problems with it right now.


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## Pete77

cwaring said:


> Only one Tivo here, but no problems with it right now.


For the benefit of the OP Carl presumably meant to add that he is one of those still paying a monthly sub.


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## cwaring

Yeah. I think this bit, from you post, probably gave it away 


Pete77 said:


> Has anyone else still paying a monthly sub had similar problems?


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## TrainManG

Just had a call back from TiVo UK (er, Sky that is!).

They tell me that there is a problem in the US with 'some software' which was removed 'cos they didn't realise the UK was still using 'Snooze' commands. (Not applicable to Series 2 and 3, apparently.)

It looks like it isn't doing what it used to, i.e., pausing the system so the account status can be automatically renewed or made 3:, 5:, 11: etc.

All it is doing is letting downloads happen for 4-6 days then failing the account status.

They are working on it, but have admitted it may take a little while as they have to get the US IT section to deal with it. They also say there are a couple more UK subscribers who have developed the same problem. They are dealing with it and have credited me with a couple of months subscription FOC.

Keep an eye out for your TiVos they may end up in the same boat. (I do hope not. This has gone on for 5 weeks now!)

BTW, I've just taken delivery of yet another (!!) unit which has turned up trumps. Account status 11: (Yippee!).
Daily Called twice, downloaded and stayed the same. It had not been done for 8 months! Hope it remains so, as I've been watching other threads discussing this issue.

Thaks to all who responded. Will keep you informed.

Geoff.


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## Tim L

Just the one Tivo here too, but it's still showing Account in good standing.


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## Nero2

TrainManG said:


> BTW, I've just taken delivery of yet another


Can I ask why on earth you need 13 Tivos?

Thanks


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## TrainManG

I repair and update them for people. I loan them one for a month and they pay me a tenner a month for the subscription whilst I (try to) fix their faulty one.

I keep the subscriptions going so they don't lose service. Been doing it for about 3 years, now.

Of course, as you all know, some end up so duff they are just door stops. Usually caused by 'a friend' who tried to fix it for them. Don't get too many of them, though. At least the cases and PSUs are handy as spares.

In the process of sorting one that had 'Hooch!' installed and then a new 'B' drive put in some time after. Guess what! They checked them BOTH on a Windows PC first. RIP. New install time, I suppose.

Geoff.


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## Nero2

Now I understand, I had some mad mental picture of multi-Tivos/TVs scattered around blabbering away in a vast manision of a house.

Shame to spoil the picture, real life is is much more mundane.

Thanks


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## Pete77

Nero2 said:


> Now I understand, I had some mad mental picture of multi-Tivos/TVs scattered around blabbering away in a vast manision of a house.


I think Cyril still holds the record for real use of Tivos by a genuine individual. He was running four or five of them with Lifetime Subs at one stage.


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## spj20016

One of mine has gone like this, was working fine and then on Monday got a messege telling me my account is closed. Phoned customer services who told me it's a problem at there end. It is still closed even though I was told it should be up and running again within 24hrs. Might phone up and ask for a months refund.


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## TrainManG

Just as I feared, there are more out there. Best of luck. Mine have been problematic for some weeks. Just got to wait for the USA to sort it out. Today's call to Livingston advised me it could be many weeks! The people across the pond are being less than helpful. Ho Hum!!

PS. I've got all 13 of them running, but aerial only just to keep them up to date. Only 3 are lifetime, and one is 11: - the latest. Probably keep that one in service.

Geoff.


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## healeydave

Hey, its Dave here from Tivoland.

We got to the point where we were simply testing units and if they had faults (even simple ones), they were simply re-stocked into a separate pile due to time constraints.

As a result I have hundreds of Series 1 UK Tivo's tagged with various faults like modem, sound etc. Some are just bodged NICAM fixes (by Thomson themselves) because they had in-experienced people trying to fit the 0 ohm link resistor under the tuner and didn't quite get it right 

By the way anyone know if there is still any value in a few thousand new PCB mounted Scart sockets and a few thousand Phono Inputs amongst other things, hehehe. I really could do with the space back now


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## Pete77

healeydave said:


> Hey, its Dave here from Tivoland.


Its good to see you make a guest appearance here Dave. Just when the citrus and mikerr probably thought that they had finally got the Tivo upgrading market to themselves.

Not to mention this new TrainManG fellow who has suddenly loomed on the horizon.

Are you saying that any of these broken Tivos has a Lifetime Sub? If so surely someone would be willing to take those off your hands for a small consideration and get them fixed up back to operational condition again for onwards sale? If they don't have a Lifetime Sub then it clearly isn't worth either the bother or cost of trying to fixe them at this stage.

Two still rather more active Tivo upgrading outfits spring almost instantly to mind as potential buyers of any of your broken units with a Lifetime Sub.


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## healeydave

I've been around occasionally, just not active for quite a period of time due to other projects.

Yeah there are lifetime's, evaluation subs etc, if I could be bothered to check them out. I've found quite a few over the years but if the unit's had an obvious fault testing stopped, so they would all need to be gone back through with a test dial to check them all out 

I see the latest HD freesat boxes still have two scarts, so perhaps there is still a market for the boxes of PCB Scarts I have, just need a buyer contact from one of the manufacturers heheh. 

I'm going to be taking boxes of hdd brackets to the scrap merchant soon, its amazing how much value can be extracted out of these excellently designed units still, I always knew I had more brackets than could ever be sold


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## deadsquirrel

TrainManG said:


> Greetings.
> 
> I may well be Sky/TiVo/Whatever's best customer - I have 12, sad isn't it?
> 
> I've been having some trouble with the accounts on 2 of them, both of which were operational and Direct Debiting correctly.
> 
> Suddenly, one of them has gone to 8:Closed and the other, which I have had for nearly 6 years, has gone to 7:Never set up!!!!
> 
> Despite umpteen repeated calls to Livingston and them sending the dreaded 'Snooze' command, all that happens is they drop to 4:TiVo internal testing and then back to states 7: and 8: after about 5-6 days.
> 
> BTW, these are unmodified TiVos - the only 2 left in such a state.
> 
> I've even called the States, and they say all they are getting is the 'Snooze' command for these units, which, in their words, is a waste of time!
> 
> A check on my Bank Account today shows Sky are debiting for these units and have now taken £40 for blocking my service.
> 
> Anyone else had similar problems? I do hope not!
> 
> Geoff - TrainManG


I've had 3 weeks of tripe from TIVO - sent round the houses every time! So reading your post was brilliant - and when I confronted TiVO with it, they confessed, and promise to update my account every day to keep it in state 4 until the US find/implement a fix. Aaaaarrrhgghhh!!!!!!


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## Pete77

deadsquirrel said:


> I've had 3 weeks of tripe from TIVO - sent round the houses every time! So reading your post was brilliant - and when I confronted TiVO with it, they confessed, and promise to update my account every day to keep it in state 4 until the US find/implement a fix. Aaaaarrrhgghhh!!!!!!


If they offered to convert everyone they have caused this problem for to Lifetime Sub for only £100 rather than the usual £200 would having a Lifetime Sub then make this problem go away?

Or as its their fault perhaps even £100 is a bit much. Let's compromise and say £75 to convert to a Lifetime Sub.

Or is this problem also affecting Tivo owners with a Lifetime Sub too. I have a Lifetime and don't seem to have any issues here.


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## deadsquirrel

Pete77 said:


> If they offered to convert everyone they have caused this problem for to Lifetime Sub for only £100 rather than the usual £200 would having a Lifetime Sub then make this problem go away?
> 
> Or as its their fault perhaps even £100 is a bit much. Let's compromise and say £75 to convert to a Lifetime Sub.


I'd go for that.


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## Pete77

deadsquirrel said:


> I'd go for that.


Perhaps try that suggestion then by phone to a supervisor at Sky Tivo and to Tivo Inc in the USA by email.

If you don't ask you don't get.


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## TrainManG

deadsquirrel said:


> I've had 3 weeks of tripe from TIVO - sent round the houses every time! So reading your post was brilliant - and when I confronted TiVO with it, they confessed, and promise to update my account every day to keep it in state 4 until the US find/implement a fix. Aaaaarrrhgghhh!!!!!!


Oh let joy be unconfined. It's not only me they hate!!

I'll try the same thing myself when it packs up again. (5 times now!)

BTW, I'm not setting up as a repairer. Just 33 years of broadcast TV engineering put to good use helping out local folks. Other repairers out there, have no fear. You will never see me advertising.

Having recently spoken to the States, they don't appear to be wanting to do anything. The vast bulk of their money comes from their local units, and providing a fix for us 'isn't cost-effective' they say. They may never be useable in their correct status' again. Looks like 4: for the rest of their working lives. Not good, but a workaround.

Oh well, I'll just go back to banging my head against the wall. It's far less frustrating.

I'll keep you posted.


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## djavery

I'm getting the exact same problem as TrainManG. It's been going on for around 5 weeks now and is exactly as described!!!! 

I had a monthly direct debit with TiVo for nearly 5 years and then decided enough was enough and bought a TiVo from Ebay with a lifetime subscription. Bought it for &#163;150, so saved &#163;50 on a lifetime subscription. TiVo won't reduce the cost of the lifetime sub, even though I paid for it twice over in 5 years!

I'm writing to them now as the constant 'account closed' business is drving me nuts now.

I was a big TiVo fan until this debacle happened.


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## deadsquirrel

TrainManG said:


> Oh let joy be unconfined. It's not only me they hate!!
> 
> I'll try the same thing myself when it packs up again. (5 times now!)
> 
> I'll keep you posted.


I have a question - we have a 'modified' drive Tivo which is doing the status 4, and an original one that is in the loft. Would I be right in thinking I can take the modified units' drive out and put it in the original - might this be a way for us to escape status 4 hell?! Help!


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## TrainManG

deadsquirrel said:


> I have a question - we have a 'modified' drive Tivo which is doing the status 4, and an original one that is in the loft. Would I be right in thinking I can take the modified units' drive out and put it in the original - might this be a way for us to escape status 4 hell?! Help!


Only if the original in the loft still has a subscription running. The service number is 'popped' in the motherboard. You might end up with another 4: if you have to re-subscribe it. I'm sure you don't want to end up with 2 in the status 4: hell.

Still no luck with UK or US TiVo responses. Might try the US Embassy complaining about fraud. (My solicitor's advice.)

Back to banging my head again, I suppose.


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## mikerr

So this is now affecting lifetime subs (djavery) as well as monthlies ?

If you have mutliple tivos: 
Since the service number is stored on the motherboard, you can swap a drive into the working one, make a daily call, and swap back again
..would work ok if you have at least one tivo without the problem.


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## Pete77

This certainly all sounds very odd. What could be worse than for Sky's customer service staff to manage to cut off Tivo's remaining UK Tivo income stream by discontinuing the monthly subs of those still willing to pay them.

I would suggest a couple of possibilities to try and get this resolved as the people at Sky really do not seem very motivated to try too hard on our behalf to get this kind of issue resolved.

Firstly send a PM and/or email to US forum member and Tivo staff member TivoPony who previously took a strong interest in the development and roll out of the UK service in its main hay day here.

You can do this at his profile page at:

www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/member.php?u=22926

Alternatively or additionally you may also want to send an email to Mark Roberts, Tivo's Vice President of Consumer Products and Operations. Clearly Operations covers this kind of technical failing by Tivo.

His email address should be [email protected]

See http://investor.tivo.com/management.cfm

You may also want to make a post about this in the US Setup & Support Tivo help forum and see what kind of response, if any, this brings. So far as I can see you can register for the US Tivo Setup & Support forum without needing to have a US Tivo service number.

See http://forums.tivo.com/pe/action/forums/defaultview?msgBoardID=10100105

I suppose ozsat may also be trying to work on this for us although it seems odd that he has had nothing to report back on this front so far.

I don't think Sky really gives two hoots about UK subscriber's losing Tivo service so the only way to make Tivo sit up and pay attention is to take the matter to the horse's mouth so to speak.

Let me know how you get on with this.


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## ColinYounger

I think they're experimenting with closing the UK service and seeing what reaction they get.


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## TrainManG

ColinYounger said:


> I think they're experimenting with closing the UK service and seeing what reaction they get.


Hmm. Closing it whilst still taking money is classed as fraud in any language. I've e-mailed the US Vice-President. I'll let you know if he has the manners to reply.

Geoff


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## Pete77

ColinYounger said:


> I think they're experimenting with closing the UK service and seeing what reaction they get.


Sound more like a foulup (my previous use of a variant of this term involving a male member of the British poultry family and the word up was mysteriously censored by the American forum software) than a conspiracy to me here. Especially given the random nature of what is going on and the fact that it is limited to only a small percentage of currently active UK Tivo customers.

Having said that I found no mention of Mike Ramsay on the current list of Tivo board directors, not even as non exec Chairman, so if he has now gone completely there may be less sentimental attachment to keeping the British service going on the Tivo board.

However I don't think they can really afford any bad publicity about their abortive efforts to set up a service in the UK market just at the moment when they are attempting to launch a new service in Australia.


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## djavery

mikerr said:


> So this is now affecting lifetime subs (djavery) as well as monthlies ?


It's probably affecting me as I'm a new lifetime subscription customer. I should have just left the account running from the guy I bought it off. It did say lifetime subscription then.


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## TCM2007

TrainManG said:


> I've e-mailed the US Vice-President. I'll let you know if he has the manners to reply.


Let us know if Dick Cheney replies.


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## deadsquirrel

Well, after I contacted Tivo and said I KNEW they had a problem with these account status=4 boxes, and that 'Snoozing' the boxes only got me a 5-6 day window of the box working, they promised they would get Snooze messages sent every couple of days, and they (Customer Services) would do this for me without me calling them up. 

Well, guess what - I'm back at account closed(8) status, and now Tivo say they can't and shouldn't have offered to keep sending Snoozes. They say they appreciate my frustration, but basically it's tough, I'll have to wait.

I resorted last night to getting my original Tivo out of the loft and getting that registered with Tivo - that's gone from account status 3 (as it was when it went away), to status 8 (I connected too soon after registering) to now back at status 3 and downloading EPG. So, my plan is to now move my harddrive from unit with status 4 to this Tivo and hopefully be back running reliably. THEN, I start on Tivo for free/reduced price lifetime subscription or 6 months free etc. 

The whole point about Tivo was it's superior functionality over Sky+ and generally being ace. This experience has severely dented my enthusiasm and trust, let's hope it'll soon be behind me and others.


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## TrainManG

TCM2007 said:


> Let us know if Dick Cheney replies.


No, he didn't - but I got an interesting picture of Hillary Clinton

Seriously, no response from TiVo US at all.

Time for the newspapers, I suppose.

Ever onward.

Geoff.


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## Pete77

TrainManG said:


> No, he didn't - but I got an interesting picture of Hillary Clinton
> 
> Seriously, no response from TiVo US at all.
> 
> Time for the newspapers, I suppose.


Try posting on their US help forum as I suggested above and see if you have any luck there.

Mention that the Sky people at Tivo UK customer service do not know how to fix the problem.

Also did you send a PM to TivoPony as I suggested. He normally replies to PMs.


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## TrainManG

Pete77 said:


> Try posting on their US help forum as I suggested above and see if you have any luck there.
> 
> Mention that the Sky people at Tivo UK customer service do not know how to fix the problem.
> 
> Also did you send a PM to TivoPony as I suggested. He normally replies to PMs.


Yes, 'done' to all of the above. My post and its replies were removed within 36 hours by the 'moderator'. There was no ranting, just a polite request to anyone else worldwide if they had the problem that we are getting. Looks like TiVo US know about it, but don't want anyone else to.

BTW, no response from TivoPony - as yet.

Geoff.


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## Pete77

TrainManG said:


> Yes, 'done' to all of the above. My post and its replies were removed within 36 hours by the 'moderator'. There was no ranting, just a polite request to anyone else worldwide if they had the problem that we are getting. Looks like TiVo US know about it, but don't want anyone else to.


I should post again and demand to know why your previous post was removed when it was not offensive, profane, libelous etc, etc.


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## deadsquirrel

Pete77 said:


> I should post again and demand to know why your previous post was removed when it was not offensive, profane, libelous etc, etc.


Are these answers to the questions asked of Tivo US? I'd like to know what they said.

On my personal case, I have eventually spoken to a very knowledgable person at Tivo UK Customer services, who confirmed the problem, that there's not much immediate promise of a solution for the reasons already given in this thread... I did what I was planning - take my hard drive (with all season passes, recordings on etc) out of a status 4 unit and put it in what was initially a status 3 unit (it was like that when I powered it off in Jan). I resurrected its account with Tivo, but tried to do a daily call too early and it went to status 8. I waited a few hours and did it again - miraculously it's now back to status 3 and is staying in this status....

So, I may be lucky, or not, but it's some more information.


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## TrainManG

All may not be lost!!!! :up:

After today's call to TiVo/Sky, they tell me they are very close to resolving the problem.

It seems there are now quite a lot of subscribers getting this problem - increasing every day.

Sky have determined that all signals sent from the UK are correct and that the problem is definitely in the US. The UK and US IT teams are trying to establish what went wrong and are close to some sort of resolution.

Watch this space.

BTW, I now have 3 of my units exhibiting the same problem!! 

Geoff.



Pete77 said:


> I should post again and demand to know why your previous post was removed when it was not offensive, profane, libelous etc, etc.


PS. I reposted as a reply to someone in the US with a similar sort of problem, and it has remained there.


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## Pete77

TrainManG said:


> PS. I reposted as a reply to someone in the US with a similar sort of problem, and it has remained there.


Either they have now decided they cannot sweep the problem under the carpet or someone has pointed out to the forum moderator that UK Tivo owners have no other legitimate place where they can publicly raise concerns about technical issues with their S1 Tivos.

At the end of the day a failure to successfully resolve this issue is going to reduce their subscription revenue in the UK whilst not creating any new Tivo sales (as there is no replacement product) and surely a loss of subscription revenue ought to be a matter that can then justify the allocation of programmer time (by the Tivo bean counters) in order to achieve a successful resolution.


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## djavery

Lo and behold my TiVo has gone to '5' Lifetime Service at last!

The account was closed on Sunday again (4th or 5th time now). This time the representative in Livingston was a bit more apologetic and said he would send the snooze yet again.

Did a daily call this morning and I'm on a '5'!!!!!!!!!!

I did send a letter to TiVo a week ago, expressing my disgust at the continual problems. I had a reply from Sky today saying I don't appear to have a TiVo account!!!!! AAAAARRRRRRGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

What the hell are they doing there??????


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## Pete77

djavery said:


> I did send a letter to TiVo a week ago, expressing my disgust at the continual problems. I had a reply from Sky today saying I don't appear to have a TiVo account!!!!!
> 
> AAAAARRRRRRGGGGGHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


I recently had to fight a running battle with Sky to cancel my account when the clearly given promises of two call centre advisers that my account had now been cancelled and with immediate effect were not implemented.

Then after speaking to someone in their so called All Customer Care high level customer relations department who assured me the matter had now been resolved and that he had created a credit to offset the week's subscription I should not have paid I received another letter sent the next day (the day after my further phone call definitely agreeing cancellation) headed "Phew!" and saying "although we received a request from you to cancel your account, we were thrilled to hear on 7/05/2008 that you'd changed your mind. I'm therefore pleased to confirm that your Sky account is still active and your request for cancellation will not be processed"

This letter was signed by Mark Anderson, Customer Marketing Director but when I try to email [email protected] alerting him to his organisation's repeated incompetence, although I received a read receipt from him he never replied in person and instead I got another phone call from some other footsoldier of the line in All Customer Care. This person then felt it was not in their job description to explain either why I could not cancel my Sky subscription or return to Sky through my online Sky account or why or how I had incorrectly received the "Phew" letter.:down:

So my money would still be on the screw up being down to the Sky Tivo customer service staff and some of the newer ones not being correctly trained in how to work the Tivo subscription system.


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## TrainManG

Submit a TiVo question to Tom Rogers here:
http://allthingsd.com/d/ask-a-question/

Worth a go, re: Account Statuses!

Suggest everybody tries this. I've just done it. The more they get from the UK the less likely they will ignore them, after all it's NOT TiVo's own people asking the questions. The Americans don't like poor service and if they see the US being dragged through the mud by a financially targeted management team they may well react in our favour - I hope!

Still got 3 not working. Heigh-Ho!


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## TiVoJerry

Hey guys, one of the members of our Operations Team asked me to post and ask for you to send me private messages with your TSNs so he can look into it. 

I'm just passing along info and don't have any insight into the specific problem you are having, but the person asking will know what to do with it. Sorry to hear you've been having such a lousy time of it.


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## Pete77

TiVoJerry said:


> I'm just passing along info and don't have any insight into the specific problem you are having, but the person asking will know what to do with it. Sorry to hear you've been having such a lousy time of it.


Hi Jerry,

Its really good to see someone from Tivo itself posting in our Tivo UK forum.

There have certainly been times in the last few years when your die hard but extremely loyal UK Tivo S1 user base had begun to wonder if we had been completely forgotten back at Tivo head office in Aviso. That impression was unfortunately also further reinforced a few months back when Tivo Inc overlooked renewing its ownership of the domain name www.tivo.co.uk

The relationship of UK Tivo customers with your outsourced UK customer service agents at Sky is unfortunately sometimes a rather delicate subject since as you may know these days Sky sell a rival but distinctly inferior PVR service in the UK that goes by the name of Sky+. Also many of Sky's Tivo supporting customer service agents only spend part of their day supporting Tivo calls and then the rest supporting Sky products. Whilst they undoubtedly try their very best unfortunately the lines of communication for technical problems that require a resolution back at Tivo HQ do often seem to be both rather long and also sometimes rather confused.

One could therefore possibly be forgiven for asking why Tivo does not now support its UK customers directly back in Aviso, especially given that we all speak the same language (at least after a fashion and certainly with a lot more similarity than when dealing from the UK with people who allege to speak English in an Indian call centre) and especially given that Sky is not now an altogether Tivo friendly company.

I am sure that TrainManG and the other affected UK Tivo users will be PM'ng you shortly with details of their own individual Tivo Service Numbers.


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## TrainManG

FYI, TivoJerry's friend has not yet responded to me (anyone else?) and the disgraceful situation continues.

I am seriously considering buying all the Lifetime Sub units I can find and putting the rest in the skip. (Less Turbonets, cachecards, HDDs etc.)

It's getting a joke, now. Tivo/Sky even remember my account numbers when I ring up. Either that or they're written up somewhere with 'that bloody Sassenach again' next to them!

Will there ever be a solution or are the people in the US (who I used to think were supportive) hoping we will all go away?

Time for a search on Ebay I think.

A very disillusioned Geoff.


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## Pete77

I started up a Lifetime Subbed unit on Saturday that had not been used for 6 months and re-ran Guided Setup to a different platform and it was still showing 5 - Lifetime with no problem after making all the relevant calls.

Are we saying that this problem is only affecting the monthly subbed units and not the Lifetime ones?

Ironic, of course, seeing as how Tivo and Sky only derive any new income from the monthly subbed UK Tivo boxes..........


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## deadsquirrel

Pete77 said:


> Ironic, of course, seeing as how Tivo and Sky only derive any new income from the monthly subbed UK Tivo boxes..........


So, logically, if it's not fixed, what's to stop them just closing it all down?


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## Pete77

deadsquirrel said:


> So, logically, if it's not fixed, what's to stop them just closing it all down?


I suspect their renewed plans to launch a new PC based and/or dedicated PVR service and the fact that reneging on the Lifetime service commitment is very bad corporate PR.

They have never so far gone back on Lifetime Subs and if they did the news would inevitably crossover to the much larger US customer base courtesy of discussions on this forum.......................

Of course if Tivo was ever swallowed up some large, nasty and faceless organisation like Sky then the chances of cancellation of the Lifetime Subs would be much higher and all bets are off.

I am sure that as long as we keep this thread running the current problem with some montly subbed UK Tivos will get fixed sooner or later.


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## TiVoJerry

TrainManG said:


> FYI, TivoJerry's friend has not yet responded to me (anyone else?) and the disgraceful situation continues.
> 
> I am seriously considering buying all the Lifetime Sub units I can find and putting the rest in the skip. (Less Turbonets, cachecards, HDDs etc.)
> 
> It's getting a joke, now. Tivo/Sky even remember my account numbers when I ring up. Either that or they're written up somewhere with 'that bloody Sassenach again' next to them!
> 
> Will there ever be a solution or are the people in the US (who I used to think were supportive) hoping we will all go away?
> 
> Time for a search on Ebay I think.
> 
> A very disillusioned Geoff.


Sorry for the delay. I had passed along the information immediately as requested but have been traveling since then. I have pinged him with a reminder.


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## Pete77

TiVoJerry said:


> Sorry for the delay. I had passed along the information immediately as requested but have been traveling since then. I have pinged him with a reminder.


I do hope that those affected hear some further positive news soon Jerry but in any case many thanks for your own commendable bravery in posting in the Tivo UK section, the home of what sometimes seems like the long forgotten small yet exclusive band of British Tivo S1 users.


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## TrainManG

Pete77 said:


> I do hope that those affected hear some further positive news soon Jerry but in any case many thanks for your own commendable bravery in posting in the Tivo UK section, the home of what sometimes seems like the long forgotten small yet exclusive band of British Tivo S1 users.


Well, I've just had a PM from TivoJerry seeming to indicate that our account updates seem to be, either 1) not being received and acted upon by the US, or 2) not being sent correctly by the UK. I have forwarded this in full to TiVo/Sky and they are dealing with it.

The strangest thing is that one I have had fully subscribed from the start of TiVo in the UK is now showing '7:never set up' and not associated with any account in the US. ODD. They are checking these with Sky in the UK

I will let you know how it progresses. Meanwhile, the 'snooze' process continues.

Geoff.


----------



## TiVoJerry

I'd like to reiterate that I've only received info from TrainManG. If others are experiencing this issue, please send me your TSNs so we can investigate and see if there is a pattern. The more info the better.


----------



## Pete77

TiVoJerry said:


> I'd like to reiterate that I've only received info from TrainManG. If others are experiencing this issue, please send me your TSNs so we can investigate and see if there is a pattern. The more info the better.


deadsquirrel Jerry is waiting to hear from you.


----------



## cwaring

I assume he can read, Pete


----------



## deadsquirrel

cwaring said:


> I assume he can read, Pete


err,, just about.....


----------



## TrainManG

Update.

I've had a couple of PMs from TivoJerry regarding one of my accounts.

It's a bit worrying as he has found out that, initially there was no record of my unit stuck at 7: ever having been set up. This was set up on the day of purchase from Comet over 5 years ago!

The next PM indicated that it had been set up, cancelled, transferred to a new owner, cancelled and is now in the 7:never set up mode.

This is quite scary. I've passed on the relevant PMs to Sky who are dealing with it. One of the problems that Sky appear to have is the complete non-cooperation of Alviso in trying to solve the problem. They appear not to respond to e-mails and phone calls. It must be as frustrating for Sky as it is for us who are affected.

Someone messaged me suggesting there may be someone 'out there' cloning service numbers. It would partially explain the problem, but, if this is true, heaven help us. I can't think of a way to stop them, and on TiVo US's current performance with the UK users, I wouldn't think they're the slightest bit interested.

I have asked TivoJerry to speak to the US CS dept., if possible, to chase them up. Let's hope he can exert some influence.

Meanwhile, my 3 have been 'snoozed' for the 6th time!

Onward and upward.

Geoff.


----------



## Pete77

TrainManG said:


> Someone messaged me suggesting there may be someone 'out there' cloning service numbers. It would partially explain the problem, but, if this is true, heaven help us. I can't think of a way to stop them, and on TiVo US's current performance with the UK users, I wouldn't think they're the slightest bit interested.


Jerry seems to be interested so this is surely at least some kind of progress.

I have long since thought that UK Tivo users would obtain better quality customer support if they were allowed to communicate directly with customer service staff in Aviso rather than at arms length via Sky.


----------



## TiVoJerry

TrainManG, until all the details are fleshed out it might be best not to divulge every detail of our communications publicly. I am not normally involved in accounting issues, particularly regarding the UK. As such, I can't speak as to whom Sky is trying to contact, but I have a hard time believing we are ignoring their requests for information. 

The fact that they're saying they work with the US CS department is the first piece of inaccurate data, as they would likely be working with our Ops department instead. As such, let's try to keep this neutral until the issue has been investigated further. 

Thank you.


----------



## TrainManG

TiVoJerry said:


> TrainManG, until all the details are fleshed out it might be best not to divulge every detail of our communications publicly. I am not normally involved in accounting issues, particularly regarding the UK. As such, I can't speak as to whom Sky is trying to contact, but I have a hard time believing we are ignoring their requests for information.
> 
> The fact that they're saying they work with the US CS department is the first piece of inaccurate data, as they would likely be working with our Ops department instead. As such, let's try to keep this neutral until the issue has been investigated further.
> 
> Thank you.


OK. But you must understand that this is a serious, and very frustrating problem which needs fixing ASAP, as it has gone on for many weeks. I now have 14 Series 1 units (seriously!) and I check them every day as I'm very worried that they may all start to be 'closed down'.

Sky's words not mine about contacting the US CS. Perhaps they may have meant Ops. You may have different names for it there.

BTW, I am not inferring for one second that you have anything to do with this, or its solution, just that you are a very welcome, well-meaning voice in this thread.

Best regards,

Geoff.


----------



## Raisltin Majere

Wouldn't it be in everybody's best interest for TiVo to ditch sky's "support" and allow us to deal with the US office?

And then, ya know, allow us to import S3 machines and register them and stuff.


----------



## Pete77

TrainManG said:


> One of the problems that Sky appear to have is the complete non-cooperation of Alviso in trying to solve the problem. They appear not to respond to e-mails and phone calls. It must be as frustrating for Sky as it is for us who are affected.


Personally I would be far more inclined to believe the word of personnel working for Tivo than the employees of a Sky call centre on any day of the week.

Sky customer service staff have a longstanding history of misleading customers over matters as fundamental as the terms and conditions for cancelling Sky accounts or the minimum contract length on their own Sky products. Also on the Tivo service Sky staff have persistently misled customers that certain channels in the Sky EPG are not in the Tivo EPG because the channel concerned was not willing to provide EPG data to Tribune. Whereas the reality is that certain not very widely watched and more obscure FTA satellite channels in the Sky EPG that are not part of Sky's own pay subscription channel range are not mandated to be provided to customers by Tribune Media Services under the terms of their EPG contract with Tivo.

Also at this point in time very few Sky staff handling Tivo calls spend most of their day talking to Tivo customers (they spend most of it talking to Sky customers) so they may simply just not be aware of the more technical detail of how these matters are handled by the Tivo accounting staff in Alviso.


----------



## BrianHughes

Pete77 said:


> Personally I would be far more inclined to believe the word of personnel working for Tivo than the employees of a Sky call centre on any day of the week.
> ...


I don't know about global warming but Hell hath frozen over!!!  I agree with Pete!!!


----------



## TrainManG

Pete77 said:


> Personally I would be far more inclined to believe the word of personnel working for Tivo than the employees of a Sky call centre on any day of the week.
> 
> And from BrianHughes.
> 
> I don't know about global warming but Hell hath frozen over!!! I agree with Pete!!!


Hmmmm!

I worked 'alongside' Sky since I was involved with the initial work on British Satellite Broadcasting. (The old square dishes.) I only gave it up 10 years ago whem Maggie screwed up the Broadcasting Industry!

I can say that they aren't quite as devious or ill-informed as you both seem to think. They are doing the best that a somewhat restrictive system will allow. I always find them helpful and ready to try things, when their system will let them.

Don't knock them too much or they may pull back on the help they are giving on this issue. They do look at this thread and the Community as a whole.

Geoff.

Anyway, this is a bit off-topic, isn't it?


----------



## spj20016

Is there any update on this fault. Mine is still off and I just can't be bothered to phone them anymore. All I get is the same old answer, it's in the hands of America. I just hope they don't take any money from my account this month. I've paid last months subscription and only had about 8 days worth of tivo service.:down:


----------



## TiVoJerry

This is still actually being looked into. I don't have any more details than that but I do know at least one of the affected members has been contacted by my coworker.


----------



## SCOOBY.C

i've got a lifetime sub tivo and it seems to be having the above problems too, eg used to connect and says account is ok but not anymore and cs have confirmed my part is ok and keep sending the info to the "us team"


----------



## TrainManG

Still no news on mine. A couple more have failed and I've closed their subscriptions.

The rubbish we're now being told about there being 'software problems' in Alviso is nothing short of a lie. I now believe we are being deliberately ignored by the US.

I have had some conversations with people in New Zealand who have been told by TiVoNZ the UK service is being closed down by the end of this year after negotiations with Microsoft and Virgin. (Whatever that means!)

Are they slowly closing it by deliberately failing accounts so people will leave by their own accord to save the embarrassment that would arise from shutting it all at once? Who knows? If the folks across the pond ever spoke to us mere mortals then we might get some answers.

But we're only British, so we have to wait at the back of the queue.


----------



## Pete77

TrainManG said:


> But we're only British, so we have to wait at the back of the queue.


I think they have read up on the Brits and found out that we queue (or stand in line as they call it across the pond) far more patiently than the average Tivo user in the USA would be inclined to.

However it does appear to only be a very small number of Tivo users affected, even though it is obviously poor that nothing is being done to address this in a rapid fashion.

I don't like the sound of those New Zealand rumours about the UK Tivo service. However I doubt they are true as the shockwaves would be felt in a big way back on the US side of the forum if this were to ever come to pass.


----------



## TiVoJerry

TrainManG said:


> The rubbish we're now being told about there being 'software problems' in Alviso is nothing short of a lie. I now believe we are being deliberately ignored by the US.


And my posting here does nothing to sway your belief?


----------



## Pete77

TiVoJerry said:


> And my posting here does nothing to sway your belief?


Jerry,

I can't speak for TrainManG but certainly I have always been persuaded that your appearance in this thread was very good news indeed and a clear sign that Tivo was indeed taking this issue seriously.

It just seems a pity that getting to the bottom of and resolving whatever the problem is appears to be such a lengthy and protracted process.


----------



## speedyrite

TrainManG said:


> I have had some conversations with people in New Zealand who have been told by TiVoNZ the UK service is being closed down by the end of this year after negotiations with Microsoft and Virgin. (Whatever that means!)


Sheesh, I very much hope that this story of a possible closedown of TiVo service in the UK is absolutely not true!!!

For heaven's sake, my home entertainment systems will be totally wrecked without my fully functioning TiVos...


----------



## TrainManG

TiVoJerry said:


> And my posting here does nothing to sway your belief?


Sadly, no. Your postings and PMs to me were very welcome, but it's not you fixing the problem, is it? You're very kindly passing on info to your contact, but it seems to go no further than him/her.

I've had no contact, personally, from them, so it must be someone else who he/she had been in contact with.

I'm flying to the US in 2 weeks time and I have taken time from my schedule to make a formal complaint, in person, (only regarding my problems,) to TiVo about the dismissal of any request from the UK side and the poor backup to UK users. I will also be contacting the News International media whilst there and pressing the problem with them as they are the parent company of Sky.

My personal telephone conversations with the staff at CS in Alviso result in being 'kicked around' the building with no sensible response. It seems that once a UK Series 1 account packs up, there is little or no interest in reviving it from the US.

It seems to be happening now to Lifetime Service accounts, going by recent posts in this thread. This is truly unforgiveable, and it's a shame that you are the only person from TiVo US that has had the decency and courage to post here.

Thanks for your efforts, but if a member of staff can't get any form of result, what hope is there?

Geoff.


----------



## SCOOBY.C

tried forcing a daily call again as requested and funnily enough nothing. I've paid good money for this and just now its a very large paperweight! Hope they can sort this soon but beginning to think not


----------



## a_tivo_noob

sorry - haven't followed all of this thread, however could those affected demand that Tivo send you a replacement as it looks like the problem won't appear to be resolved any time soon - compensation for undelivered (but paid for) services...?


----------



## cwaring

It's a problem at the _US server_ end of the system, not the users boxes. There might be a case for a refund of monthly subs for those affected who currently pay monthly, but that's about it.


----------



## Pete77

cwaring said:


> It's a problem at the _US server_ end of the system, not the users boxes. There might be a case for a refund of monthly subs for those affected who currently pay monthly, but that's about it.


I would have thought those with Lifetime Subs could easily argue for £10 per month back Pro Rata for any period in which they are unable to obtain service from the date that they first officially reported it to Sky Tivo Customer Services.


----------



## cwaring

Given that they aren't actually now technically paying for the service at all, then I think that would be very unfair.


----------



## cleudo

TrainManG said:


> I have had some conversations with people in New Zealand who have been told by TiVoNZ the UK service is being closed down by the end of this year after negotiations with Microsoft and Virgin. (Whatever that means!)


Hmm, maybe we're going to be offered a virgin box (if you live in a cable area) or a free Microsoft media center PC in lieu of the uk service?

lol - it could happen..


----------



## Pete77

cleudo said:


> Hmm, maybe we're going to be offered a virgin box (if you live in a cable area) or a free Microsoft media center PC in lieu of the uk service?
> 
> lol - it could happen..


More optimistically perhaps Virgin are finally going to make available a version of their UK V+ box with a Tivo software option and/or perhaps Microsoft are planning to convert Windows MCE's tv recording functionality to a pay only product and will justify this by further upgrading it to have a Tivo style interface with the addition of Suggestions.

More likely is that none of this applies and when the Tivo board looks at the small cost of carrying on the UK service compared to the potential damage to their public reputation in cancelling Lifetime Service they will carry on with it.


----------



## TCM2007

As time goes on that PR hit gets less and less. Ending support for a product six or seven years after it was last sold would not be seen as unreasonable by most. Those of us who got almost eight years from our 20-months-worth of subs up front could hardly claim to have been hard done by.


----------



## Pete77

TCM2007 said:


> As time goes on that PR hit gets less and less. Ending support for a product six or seven years after it was last sold would not be seen as unreasonable by most. Those of us who got almost eight years from our 20-months-worth of subs up front could hardly claim to have been hard done by.


Well I suppose it all depends on the real net current cost of continuing the UK service and also on whether anything constituting a comparable replacement actually exists. It also depends on the state of Tivo's finances and the personalities of those on the Tivo board and their emotional attachment to the UK Tivo product.

If they really wanted to pull the plug I would also expect the words Freesat and Freeview and their PVR products to be in there somewhere. Windows MCE will not suit many of those used to a set top box solution.


----------



## TCM2007

The negative PR effect, which is what I was talking about, doesn't depend on any of those things?


----------



## cwaring

Pete77 said:


> More optimistically perhaps Virgin are finally going to make available a version of their UK V+ box with a Tivo software option...


No chance; unfortunately


----------



## Pete77

It seems Tivo are selling Lifetime Subs in the US again. So any idea that Tivo can renege on Lifetime Subs while boxes are still in working order is not likely to be good PR for them back home.

See http://crave.cnet.com/8301-1_105-9944974-1.html


----------



## TCM2007

Not a particularly good deal though, taking best part of three years to be neutral.

Anyway I doubt if UK ones being turned off seven years after TiVo effectively ceased trading would cause many problems.

If you'd asked me in 2002 if the EPG would still be going in 2008 I'd have said no.


----------



## Pete77

TCM2007 said:


> Anyway I doubt if UK ones being turned off seven years after TiVo effectively ceased trading would cause many problems.


Its only just over 5 years since I and many UK owners of Tivo acquired them in late 2002. To my mind Tivo was still trading in the UK then as lots of high street stores were still stocking them. Its in fact just over 7 years since Tivo began selling them in the UK. Not since they stopped selling them.



> If you'd asked me in 2002 if the EPG would still be going in 2008 I'd have said no.


That's because you are a well paid gadget fanatic who constantly disposes of perfectly good working equipment to feel that you are at the cutting edge of technology. More normal people keep still working electrical goods for many years.


----------



## TCM2007

Pete77 said:


> Its only just over 5 years since I and many UK owners of Tivo acquired them in late 2002. To my mind Tivo was still trading in the UK then as lots of high street stores were still stocking them. Its in fact just over 7 years since Tivo began selling them in the UK. Not since they stopped selling them.


And they haven't stopped the service yet, I was projecting it to some future decision.

If you bought a TiVo in late 2002, presumably in the £99 clearance, and didn't know it was an end-of-line clearance then your research seems to have let you down.



> That's because you are a well paid gadget fanatic who constantly disposes of perfectly good working equipment to feel that you are at the cutting edge of technology. More normal people keep still working electrical goods for many years.


You misunderstand me Pete, as ever. I'll make it clearer for you:

"If you'd asked me in 2002 _ when TiVo had already gone off sale_ if the EPG would still be _being provided by TiVo_ in 2008 I'd have said no."


----------



## Pete77

TCM2007 said:


> "If you'd asked me in 2002 _ when TiVo had already gone off sale_ if the EPG would still be _being provided by TiVo_ in 2008 I'd have said no."


I don't think you are really helping the cause of those of us who are happy with our Tivos and want to go on using them for as long as possible by making such statements though.

Do you think the backup plan is still operative in the event of the worst happening. Or have those who would have been the main movers and shakers largely moved on elsewhere to other non Tivo devices?

I suppose I could see blindlemon probably cobbling together some sort of usable data feed for us to use with the help of one or two others. But at a price of course no doubt.


----------



## TCM2007

I don't think I'm have any effect whatsoever Pete!

I suspect quite a few of those who would have put together an alternative EPG have moved on, but the systems to do it have all been worked out by the Aussies. Perhaps you could do it if it came to it?


----------



## a_tivo_noob

cwaring said:


> It's a problem at the _US server_ end of the system, not the users boxes. There might be a case for a refund of monthly subs for those affected who currently pay monthly, but that's about it.


 ah apologies... just got back from US so wasn't in a 'reading' frame of mind... assumed as it was only certain users, it was some config on their boxes...

will try to read the OP when i get chance


----------



## cwaring

a_tivo_noob said:


> ...assumed as it was only certain users...


It _is_ only certain users, but it's not their boxes, it's the US end of things


----------



## SCOOBY.C

update- after another phone call to cs yesterday, my tivo connected and dowloaded some programme guides at last! My account status now shows 4 - internal testing - is it just a matter of time now before it plays up again? What should it be at? Thanks.


----------



## spj20016

It will stay on for 5-8 days than your be back to account closed. It should be on 3: account in good standing


----------



## SCOOBY.C

ok, thanks.


----------



## TrainManG

I thought you had a 'Lifetime' unit, in which case it should really show '5:Lifetime Service'.

The 4:'s are getting very common now and the US has shown absolutely no interest in curing it. They are primarily interested in selling their Series 3 models and couldn't give a fiddler's f*** about the UK and it's Series 1's now. Look at the US eBay site and see how many S1's are for sale. They don't even seem to care about their own residents.

Sign of a BIG corporation. Getting very common these days!!

Geoff.


----------



## cwaring

Yeah, because it _has_ to be a really easy problem to fix, which should only take a couple of minutes, isn't it? 

While you may have a (very small) point, unless you know speficics it would be best not to judge. Well, that's my policy, anyway


----------



## TrainManG

Well, it all worked terribly well until the new 'auto' system was put in for the US series 3 HD units, then it fell to pieces.

What does that tell you?

Geoff.


----------



## cwaring

As I don't know anything about the Tivo back-end, it tells me precisely nothing. The one event _might_ not even be related to the other.


----------



## SCOOBY.C

TrainManG said:


> I thought you had a 'Lifetime' unit, in which case it should really show '5:Lifetime Service'.
> 
> The 4:'s are getting very common now and the US has shown absolutely no interest in curing it. They are primarily interested in selling their Series 3 models and couldn't give a fiddler's f*** about the UK and it's Series 1's now. Look at the US eBay site and see how many S1's are for sale. They don't even seem to care about their own residents.
> 
> Sign of a BIG corporation. Getting very common these days!!
> 
> Geoff.


ok, ill get back onto them to see whats happening.
update; contatced cs and said whats the story will it "trip" off on me again and he said yes it will! I asked well what can he do about it and hes set it up so they'll hopefully renew it every week. He mentioned problems with a server on the us side and said they had no idea when a fix would be available. I asked was it correct that its been going on for the last few months and he said probably longer! Don't know whats going to happen next and have no faith that my tivo will work when i want it to, not good


----------



## aerialplug

I really feel for all of you having problems. Not wanting to rub salt into wounds, mine's fine at present. I do know however that if mine stopped working in this way, I wouldn't have a leg to stand on - for various reasons I can't go into, my account isn't a lifer but behaves as such. It's a legit account and the box is legitimately mine but I'd have no means of contacting customer services as the box's legitimate lifetime use and the purpose of its strange 5: In Good Standing account has long expired.

Its been living on borrowed time for the longest time now - I hope it'll continue for long into the future but I do now have modern alternative (and inferior in some way) technology in regular parallel use.

Should it go, I'd have to upgrade my current Sky+ to a Sky HD (long overdue due to the size of my TV) and have the Sky+ converted to second room status (as my TiVo is currently running). I'd miss suggestions (but not much since they suddenly stopped being accurate a couple of years ago) but what I'd miss the most is the way season passes set in 2000 still record new shows today.


----------



## verses

aerialplug said:


> I really feel for all of you having problems.


I know what you mean, the people having problems have my every sympathy.

I'm really not sure what I'd do if mine packed in. I torrent main TV series (24, Dexter, Life on Mars etc) on my Mac Mini and watch them on that rather than TiVo them, but for the missus's Eastenders/Corrie fix, and for shows like HIGNFY it's much more handy to have the little silver box doing all the work for me. Going back to watching TV without Wishlists and Season Passes seems incomprehensible after 6 years of having them, watching TV at other peoples houses is painful 

I guess I'd maybe try the Elgato EyeTV solution for the Mac, although it doesn't appear to be a patch on TiVo.

Ian


----------



## spj20016

Phoned customer services again today because they took the monthly charge yesterday. They did a manual activation again which he said would keep it working until 24/06/08. I asked if I can phone up again when it closes and have a manual activation again, he said yes we can do it up to 3 times. Today was the 3rd time that they have done it so I don't know when my tivo will be functioning again. The customer service agent I spoke to didn't know anything about the trouble we are having, and he said that there are no notes on my account about it even though I've phoned them up 8 times about it. The only thing that I am happy about is the fact that he refunded the 2 months of charges.


----------



## TiVoJerry

spj20016 , can you send me your account and TSN information in a private message? We can then look in the backfiles to see what the records say and compare them against what Sky is sending us.


----------



## TrainManG

Update.

Recent experiments with setting up new account on one of my units has resulted in the following conclusion.

Any Series 1 account that has been closed during the last 14 months cannot be re-activated by the TiVo US system. Seems to be unable to reset the status to the correct one no matter what they do. Also change of ownership by status 5: units seems to cause the same problem.

Telephone calls to the US Tech Dept. confirm this problem, but, until they get some sort of workable solution and authorisation they will do nothing.

Sickening, isn't it??

Geoff.


----------



## SCOOBY.C

yes when i had what seemed like a fulling working tivo and changed the account to my name which seems to have bu66ered it up


----------



## Pete77

So the solution would appear to be to allocate the affected units a new Service Number and set those new Service Numbers up as per the Service Number that has now been Closed in the Tivo database.

However I don't know if Tivo have any way to alter a Tivo's Service Number from 
Alviso remotely when it dials up their servers or if this can only be done using bash access (which many of the affected owners will not have as they have no network card).

I still can't quite think what Tivo could have changed in their database to make it impossible to re-open a closed UK Series 1 Tivo account. After all as far as I know the US Series 1 Tivos are still in use in quite a few cases.


----------



## TrainManG

Very true, but they are rapidly coming up for sale on the US eBay site and other US auction sites.

My 'contact' there - who's only talking to me on condition I don't reveal their identity - says that it is a very different setup with the US system now.

Changing the S/N may well be an answer, but it may be the first 8 digits of the S/N that are causing the problem. (Unique to the UK Series 1's.) I doubt - like you - that it can be changed remotely. I will speak to my contact this evening and see if I can find out about these issues.

If it is impossible, then I see no solution without the co-operation of Alviso.

Geoff.


----------



## mikerr

So anyone who buys/sells a lifetime subbed tivo would now be advised not to update ownership details,
as that will likely cuase the sub to go into limbo...


----------



## TrainManG

That would be a very sensible piece of advice. However, unfortunately, not everybody who buys an LTS unit reads this forum - and I doubt that Sky would be allowed to give it out.

It just gets more and more frustrating. I'm off to the States soon, and I will make a point of visiting Alviso to see what their view is - in person. Might see if I can get on a local news channel to raise our point of view.

You never know - it might help.

Geoff.


----------



## jrg

Pete77 said:


> the words Freesat and Freeview and their PVR products to be in there somewhere. Windows MCE will not suit many of those used to a set top box solution.


This is a bit of a digression, but...

All the Freesat/Freeview PVRs seem to be very inferior to TiVo's 8 year old product, lacking in any user interface design. Even the more expensive end of the market (the brands such as Sony and Panasonic) don't seem to have a usable product for anyone that isn't a complete geek. I'm looking for something for my parents at the moment, and I'm seriously considering the purchase of a second-hand Tivo instead (but this thread gives me cause for concern.)

I've experience of Elgato Eye-TV software. Its interface just doesn't make a consumer-electronics product, and is deficient in the EPG and Series-recording department. I've never used Windows MCE, but I wouldn't get my hopes up.


----------



## TrainManG

This is getting very bizzarre!!!

2 of the units that I have re-downloaded their OS during the night and are now on 2.5.5a. Both still showing status 4: What on earth is going on?

Maybe they are doing something, on the quiet.

Geoff.


----------



## ptruman

I've got a monthly subbed box, and it's showing "3: Account in good standing" (updating over the net).

I'll keep an eye on it mind!


----------



## SCOOBY.C

don't know when it happened (been sitting on green light only whenever i powered it up last few days but just fitted another power supply) and my system information shows;
5: Lifetime Service!!!
Have they found a fix? Heres hoping everyone elses get sorted too


----------



## spj20016

Just made daily call, still getting closed account messege. I hope this problem is fixed soon. Never received refund so will be phoning CS tommorrow to find out what is going on. I'm not going to keep paying &#163;10 per month for a subscription to a service that doesn't work.


----------



## cwaring

spj20016 said:


> I'm not going to keep paying £10 per month for a subsciption to a service that doesn't work.


I'd've gone for a refund/credit well before now if this had happened to me


----------



## TrainManG

Have made 2 requests, in last 48 hours, to Sky to snooze 2 units that I am paying for.

As yet no snooze.

Getting very fed up with the lack of progress over this issue.

Have got 3 interviews booked with US news channels immediately on my arrival in the States next week. (Regarding my complaints and, apparently, the many thousands that TiVo are getting from within the US.)

Also have a meeting with Humax president who is very keen to hear about TiVo's failure on all their promises to UK owners.

Watch this space.

Geoff.


----------



## Pete77

TrainManG said:


> Have got 3 interviews booked with US news channels immediately on my arrival in the States next week. (Regarding my complaints and, apparently, the many thousands that TiVo are getting from within the US.)


Are these experiencing the same kind of subscription problem and all only on old US Series 1 units?



> Also have a meeting with Humax president who is very keen to hear about TiVo's failure on all their promises to UK owners.


TrainMan you seem to be a guy with far more connections and influence in the industry than was originally apparent. Can you give us more detail on your background as an "old telly man"


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## TrainManG

Will post a CV Sun PM.

Meanwhile, it seems that Sky are deliberately dragging their heels with 'snoozing' units.

Despite 3 phone calls, each promising a 'snooze', nothing has happened.

Start of the end??

Geoff.


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## cwaring

TrainManG said:


> Start of the end??


Ever the optimist, eh Geoff.


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## TrainManG

cwaring said:


> Ever the optimist, eh Geoff.


Usually I am.

I bought another TiVo 'on spec' last week and it turned out to have a cachecard, 256Mb, 2 x 360BGb, and Lifetime. Owner didn't have a remote so couldn't see what was in it. Cost? £29.00.

Sometimes you do get a result!!

Geoff.


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## TrainManG

Quick CV.

1965 From school to Butlins Pwhelli, Lighting and projection.
1966 To BBC AP TVN, Film, studio, OB's.
1968 To Rank Cintel, Head of mechanism test 16mm and 35. (Only me in it!!)
1970 To LWT. Telecine engineer and VTR editor. Then OB's. Nominated BAFTA.
1981 To Complete Video. Editor. Worked extra-curricular on design of BSB - Square aerials - useful later.
1984 To TVS. Technical Co-ordinator, Maidstone and Southampton. Worked on design of studios in the QE2 Conference Centre for TVS.
1992 Freelance engineer working around UK on design and operational projects in satellite and cable operations.
1996 Retired from TV work and started a proper job. Now teaching people to drive trains!!

Over the period 1967 to 1970 did BSc Physics.

Member RTS.
Member SMPTE.


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## Pete77

Thanks for the info TrainmanG.

What kind of trains are you driving or teaching people to drive?


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## cwaring

TrainManG said:


> I bought another TiVo 'on spec' last week and it turned out to have a cachecard, 256Mb, 2 x 360BGb, and Lifetime. Owner didn't have a remote so couldn't see what was in it. Cost? £29.00. Sometimes you do get a result!!


YOU BAS......KET CASE  Why does that never happen to me?


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## TrainManG

Pete77 said:


> Thanks for the info TrainmanG.
> 
> What kind of trains are you driving or teaching people to drive?


Class 357 phase 1 and 2. Hi-tech computer controlled things on c2c. A great job. Similar to drive to the 375s on SouthEastern.

Geoff.


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## TrainManG

cwaring said:


> YOU BAS......KET CASE  Why does that never happen to me?


I just bid and look about. Don't pay some of the silly prices people ask for basic ones. Sometimes I get a real lemon. Had one that smoked a lot!!!!

Boot sales - where I got the goodie - are a great source. Had 5 over the past 12 months. One's a doorstop!!

Geoff.


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## Ashley

TrainManG said:


> 1970 To LWT. Telecine engineer and VTR editor.


I've worked in LWT's Telecine dept installing (and trying to keep in sync with Rank Cintel Mk3s) a Sondor sound follower.


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## TCM2007

TrainManG said:


> Class 357 phase 1 and 2. Hi-tech computer controlled things on c2c. A great job. Similar to drive to the 375s on SouthEastern.
> 
> Geoff.


I had to look that up on Wikipedia, never having heard of a Class 357 or indeed c2c.

Someone has added a section to the entry on these trains giving the exact format of the automatic voice announcements. Why, for the love of Gd, why...?


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## ghstone

getting back on _track _ here %^; what's happening to the subscription/account status problems ?

I have 5 here at the moment, and know of another 5, all with good Lifetime subs, I have no intention of trying to change the identity of the owner on any of them, so hopefully they'll stay okay;

But what about those with monthly subs, and particularly those that haven't been sub'ed for a while ? Will those work if I either give them away to family or sell them on, or am I making a whole lot of trouble for myself in a few weeks time when they stop working ? There's not much point me buying and configuring new Disks if I'm just creating paperweights...


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## gallen9

sorry to resurrect this one but it seems like a good place for my question.

I've got two boxes, one that's got a lifetime sub (and has had for 5 years) and a second that's never been used.

Just had a disk failure to my first upgrade and have bought another disk and a turbonzet card to go up to a networked Tivo.

I had planned to stick the new drive and the network card into the unused machine and ask nicely if my lifetime could move across.

Should I infer from this thread that do so would invite a closed account that couldn't be resurrected?

I've also got another problem with not being able to find my lineup anymore but I'll post that separately.

cheers

Martin


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## Pete77

gallen9 said:


> Should I infer from this thread that do so would invite a closed account that couldn't be resurrected?


Yes that is what you should infer at the present time unless and until Tivo in the USA manage to sort out their problems with opening and closing accounts and transferring lifetime subs between one owner and another.

In short don't do it and instead put your new hard drive and Cachecard in the machine with the working Lifetime Sub.


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## gallen9

Thanks for such a quick reply - looks like I'll need to get the hoover out to clean five years of dust.

Next step - find a cheap wireless bridge!


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## Automan

TrainManG said:


> Class 357 phase 1 and 2. Hi-tech computer controlled things on c2c. A great job. Similar to drive to the 375s on SouthEastern.
> 
> Geoff.


I have used the ones on Southern made by http://www.corys.com/ located at Selhurst & Worthing for 377s and 171.

Such fun setting up support link to makers in France 

Automan.


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## forsterj

Have just signed-up again after 3 years inactivity and am getting the 8: Account Closed message, phone calls to Tivo proved fruitless, they've given me a free month but I'm getting the impression I should just toss the unit in the bin?


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## Goooner1

I don't know if you've seen the other thread about suggestions not recording, but that's being "looked into" as well, with no sign of a fix, myself and a few others too, I'm sure are currently wieighing up whether to continue paying a tenner a month for a service that doesn't work correctly


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## forsterj

I suspect they want to run the service into the ground. It did look encouraging when the guy from the states seemed to be getting involved but that looks to have become a dead-end, shame.


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## cwaring

Yeah. He's got nothing to do except post in here of course 



Goooner1 said:


> I'm sure are currently wieighing up whether to continue paying a tenner a month for a service that doesn't work correctly


Well mine's working perfectly. I don't use suggestions  Six of one... etc.


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## Pete77

Goooner1 said:


> myself and a few others too, I'm sure are currently weighing up whether to continue paying a tenner a month for a service that doesn't work correctly


But if you stop paying then Tivo now won't ever let you back on board.

Kind of damned if you do and damned if you don't................................


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## TiVoPony

Hi all,

Appreciate the reports of issues. We've been working with Sky to identify what happened here, and it turns out that some of their systems were no longer connected to us (thus preventing updates to accounts). That has been corrected, and the two teams (TiVo and Sky) are doing the final checks as to whether everything is back as it should be.

I expect the issues described here should largely be resolved very, very soon.

Thanks,
Bob Pony


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## blindlemon

Thanks Bob,

Will this require any action from people whose machines are currently awaiting re-activation, or will they suddenly just spring into life of their own accord?

Cheers
Steve
www.tivoheaven.co.uk


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## clivewilliams

Has anyone successfully managed to activate a new account recently? Is this confirmed solved?

Thanks in advance,

Clive


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## speedyrite

see the bottom of this thread:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=406485

where there seem to be reports of some positive activity on this front


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## mista_c

clivewilliams said:


> Has anyone successfully managed to activate a new account recently? Is this confirmed solved?
> 
> Thanks in advance,
> 
> Clive


I wouldn't say its solved exactly, but a big step has been taken in that Tivo UK can now use the 'snooze' tool again, i.e. they can temporarily enable boxes to download listings. How this will work in practice, I don't yet know, but Tivo UK have given me assurances that, if necessary, the snooze signal will be sent on a periodic basis so that there will be no interruption of service.


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## TiVoJerry

I've been told that we have consistently received regular updates from Sky again since the beginning of the month and that they should no longer need to continually snooze an account to keep service active. If your DVR is still not properly activated, please contact them for further assistance.


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## countjocular

Yesterday I made the 3rd call in 2 weeks to TiVo CS/Sky for them to snooze the unit. It goes to 4. TiVo Internal Testing for about a week then 8. Account Closed. This is despite (supposedly) going onto a list of accounts that they were going to snooze regularly.

TiVoJerry, what further assistance can Sky provide when they're limited to sending snooze commands?

Cheers,
Phil


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## TiVoJerry

They should no longer be using the snooze tool on a regular basis. They should be activating the unit properly. The snooze tool is just meant to cover the gap between your call and when the service activation can be delivered to us.

It's disappointing to hear that they still aren't processing your subscription properly. My recommendation would be to ask for a supervisor who can get the activation done correctly. Now that communications have been restored, I'll have to ask the internation relations team how they would want examples delivered and get back to you. I'm trying not to insert myself into the escalation process for every single account issue that they have.


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## hifly2000

can some one tell me how to get on the auto snooze list as i'm getting fed up with missing programs and having to ring up every week to get my service back.

thanks


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## TiVoJerry

There should be no "auto snooze" list anymore as they should now be processing account activations normally. If the service rep cannot help get your account restored properly, ask to speak with a supervisor. Communications from us to Sky don't seem to make it to every one of their agents on the floor.


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## countjocular

Called customer service Fri 17th and asked them to reactivate my account properly, get a supervisor to do it etc.
By the monday or tuesday I was pleasantly surprised to see the Lifetime service had been reinstated!
I hope everyone else affected gets their service back soon, though I presume it won't happen automatically. How long has the TiVo CS number been missing from the on-screen information?

Cheers,
Phil


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## cwaring

countjocular said:


> How long has the TiVo CS number been missing from the on-screen information?


Forever, as far as I kmow.


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## hifly2000

I have just spoken with the call center and been told that some accounts are still not working, the guy i spoke to (peter) went and checked with his supervisor and was told there was no auto snooze and they would have to maually snooze my account every week until the problems are sorted. 

He has made a note in his diary to do the snoozing every monday so i don't have to miss shows and make calls to get it sorted. Watch this space.........


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## hifly2000

so much for re-snoozing me without me having to phone up every week. just lost my account again. this is beyond a joke. asked to talk to supervisor to be told there was not one currently there!!


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## BrianHughes

You're not supposed to need snoozing any more - the official line is that the underlying problem has been fixed & they should just be able to activate your account.


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## hifly2000

It seems not all accounts have been fixed, 

I will be calling tomorrow to talk to a supervisor again but was told on the 28/11 (after he consulted with his super) that there were still accounts that were not fixed.


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## RichardJH

> was told on the 28/11


I guess you meant 28/10. Even Tivo isn't that good


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## hifly2000

ok, an update,

spoke to a supervisor a couple of weeks ago who said " its all been sorted for weeks now and i can do it properly for you"

fantastic i said, no more lost programs when it cancelles my account when i'm out.

1 week later and my account is closed again and i can't get the same supervisor to give him an "update" (read piece of my mind)

So just for anyone from tivo that is reading this

WHAT IS GOING ON!!!!!!!!!!!!!?


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## mista_c

The Tivo which I bought for my Aunt around 4 months ago has in the last week or so finally been activated with a status 5 lifetime subscription. This was after numerous requests for them to activate the unit properly (i.e. not rely on snoozing), as per TivoJerry's posts above. It was extremely frustrating, but if you follow his advice I am sure you will get there in the end.


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## hifly2000

Just to let you all know how things are going, my account is still not working.

I am having to be snoozed every 6 days to keep it going. I have even had a new account started from scratch to try and sort it but that did not work either. The guys in the uk are doing all they can but they are having to wait for the guys in the US to come up with a fix.

any comments tivojerry?


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## Cainam

I got hold of a new Tivo with Lifetime sub last week. The previous owner phoned up Tivo CS and let them know he had got rid of it. I phoned up a day later and registered it in my name. Next time Tivo dialled out it had status "Closed". Less than 48 hours later it dialled out again and now has status "5: Lifetime".

So it looks like there is nothing major wrong with any of the systems in the UK. While I know this does not help hifly2000 hopefully it will reassure other people who need to do something similar!


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## TiVoJerry

hifly2000 said:


> Just to let you all know how things are going, my account is still not working.
> 
> I am having to be snoozed every 6 days to keep it going. I have even had a new account started from scratch to try and sort it but that did not work either. The guys in the uk are doing all they can but they are having to wait for the guys in the US to come up with a fix.
> 
> any comments tivojerry?


As you can see by my current signature, I am out of the office. I'm actually starting vacation/holiday shortly so I have private messaging turned off. I am going to turn it on to send you an email address that I monitor, and then PM will be turned off again. I will attempt to pass along the details of your situation but will not be around to follow up with you personally for quite some time.


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## Pete77

pgogborn said:


> (and perhaps you are conflating Richard42 with RichardJH)


How I could possibly do that when this person lives in Hanworth and the other Richard lives in Wisbech.

The only common theme between them is that they are both called Richard and both share a slight antipathy to Pete 77 although I find RichardJH on the whole a much more mild mannered and reasonable fellow in that regard than Richard42.


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## Automan

Whenever I have reported spam I never have added a post as when the bad post is removed the next post saying "spam reported" refers to a post which has been removed which could cause confusion.

Perhaps we need another admin person as I think we only have the one.

Automan.



cwaring said:


> Wow! What a completely pointless argument
> 
> Any spam I see I report. I don't worry that someone else may already have done so. Never even crosses my mind. I really don't think the Admins will worry if two or three people report the same spam post. Better that that no-one doing so. Actually, posting that you have reported the spam gives them *extra* work if they want to delete the "spam reported" post too as it would be pointless to leave it in the thread


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## cwaring

Automan said:


> Whenever I have reported spam I never have added a post as when the bad post is removed the next post saying "spam reported" refers to a post which has been removed which could cause confusion.


Which is what I said; but badly 



> Perhaps we need another admin person as I think we only have the one.


I guess I'm as likely to get the job as Pete77


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## ghstone

so, from this recent exchange I'm guessing that there was SPAM but now there isn't ?

confused of Leek


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## Pete77

Automan said:


> Perhaps we need another admin person as I think we only have the one.


Judging by the speed with which reported commercial spammers posts get removed I wonder if the Report Post messages don't just go to the first available Tivocommunity moderator and if it is a simple thing like a straightforward account hacking spammer they deal with it by deleting the post and the account.

However if it is a different opinion based matter like one established members flaming or attacking another member it is then probably passed on to the moderator of that forum section for further action (if deemed appropriate).


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## Pete77

ghstone said:


> so, from this recent exchange I'm guessing that there was SPAM but now there isn't ?
> 
> confused of Leek


Correct.

I suppose the off topic posts in this thread about how to deal with spam could now do with turning in to a sticky thread of their own.

But I somewhat hesitate to suggest anything that might mean more work for Ozsat to have to do.


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