# How do foreign actors do an American accent?



## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

I usually can't tell a foreign actor by the accent. But people like Rachel Griffiths (Six Feet Under), Hugh Laurie (House), and Joely Richardson (Nip/Tuck), I can't tell. Whenever I try a British accent I end up sounding like I"m from Alabama.  

So how do they cover it up so well?


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## Jon J (Aug 23, 2000)

Maybe because they're actors?


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## JMikeD (Jun 10, 2002)

It's called acting.  

Plus, the ones that have trouble doing the accent will have dialogue coaches to work with them. Even with help, some don't manage very well. A paycheck is a good incentive to learn.


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

I had no idea Marianne Jean-Baptiste from Without A Trace is British until I saw her do one of those little PSA's. It was really weird to hear, but ever since I've been able to detect a trace of British accent sometimes. Although she does a bit of a New York accent in the show too, so maybe it's that.

I'm not surprised they can learn to eliminate their accents to sound American. I think the hard part is having to be conscious of it the entire time you're filming. I mean do they just switch back and forth throughout the filming? Or do they have to switch to it full-time in order to stay practiced?


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## SoldOnTiVo (Mar 5, 2003)

jeff125va said:


> I had no idea Marianne Jean-Baptiste from Without A Trace is British until I saw her do one of those little PSA's. It was really weird to hear, but ever since I've been able to detect a trace of British accent sometimes. Although she does a bit of a New York accent in the show too, so maybe it's that.
> 
> I'm not surprised they can learn to eliminate their accents to sound American. I think the hard part is having to be conscious of it the entire time you're filming. I mean do they just switch back and forth throughout the filming? Or do they have to switch to it full-time in order to stay practiced?


I'd probably equate that somewhat to speaking another language. Even if english is my second language, I've been speaking it for so long that I can switch to it without thinking. You do end up "thinking" in whatever language you're speaking. 'might be kind of the same with accents.

Edit: I had no idea Marianne Jean-Baptiste was British. All I hear is the NY accent. Is it a good one or not, I can't say. but that's what I hear.


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## jschuur (Nov 27, 2002)

English is my second language too (although I started speaking it at 5) and I've spent time living in the UK and the US and find that once I'm back in another country for a while, I tend to slip into the local dialect (and vocabulary). Once you get over that initial hump of learning the dialect, it's easy to get back into it without even thinking about it.


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## scottykempf (Dec 1, 2004)

Actors have many chances to get it right for a line reading.


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## dcheesi (Apr 6, 2001)

I guess the real question is, are foreign actors better at american accents than we are at theirs? 

I've heard some pretty convincing british accents from what turned out to be american actors, but I kind of assumed that actual brits would be able to tell. Yet there are british actors who I'd be hard-pressed to identify if I didn't already know.


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## JMikeD (Jun 10, 2002)

I saw Hugh Laurie on some talk show a while ago and he said that he has a devil of a time doing the accent, using the cane, and doing the medical dialogue all at the same time. Might make for a lot of retakes, and we only see the finished product.


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## scottykempf (Dec 1, 2004)

If you want to hear Hugh Laurie's real accent, check out the remake of Flight of the Phoenix.


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## Sapphire (Sep 10, 2002)

Practice.

If I try hard enough and no one sees me or knows my name, they wouldn't know I wasn't born in America.


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## jakerock (Dec 9, 2002)

That is a silly question. We don't have an accent. They're the ones that sound different.

Sheesh.


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## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

Half the cast of Without a trace is from the UK or Australia.


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## TomK (May 22, 2001)

Havana Brown said:


> Whenever I try a British accent I end up sounding like I"m from Alabama.


Hey now! You act like that's a bad thing.


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## johnspalm (Dec 24, 2002)

JMikeD said:


> It's called acting.


Funny you should mention.

I saw Marina Sirtis (aka Counselor Troi, ST:TNG, et al) at a convention one time. 
She has a pretty thick UK accent. Someone in the audience asked her the same question. I believe her response was "I'll tell you a secret....it's called acting!".


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## Jon J (Aug 23, 2000)

scottykempf said:


> If you want to hear Hugh Laurie's real accent, check out the remake of Flight of the Phoenix.


Or Blackadder.


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## mwhip (Jul 22, 2002)

What I find odd is movies like 'Green Street Hoolignas' (good movie BTW) where Claire Forlani plays an American living in London. She is in London doing an American accent. That one threw me for a loop. 

Brit's have said Gwyneth Paltrow is quite good at English accents. Reese Witherspoon...not so much. Could it be because Reese is a southern girl?


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

I thought Johnny Depp's accent on Finding Neverland was horrrrrible.


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## Vito the TiVo (Oct 27, 2003)

Christian Bale threw me because for a long time around "Shaft" and "American Psycho" he did all interviews in the accent as well.


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## zordude (Sep 23, 2003)

Jon J said:


> Or Blackadder.


Beat me to it. I was just about to post that.

Blackadder is much more entertaining too.

Z


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## doom1701 (May 15, 2001)

You know, it's probably silly, but the one that throws me for a loop most of all is David Tennant. A Scot doing a British Accent. It's so startling to hear him talking in his real voice that I wind up doing a double take.


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

I never knew Kevin Costner was British either until I saw Robin Hoodrince of Thieves.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

SoldOnTiVo said:


> Edit: I had no idea Marianne Jean-Baptiste was British. All I hear is the NY accent. Is it a good one or not, I can't say. but that's what I hear.


Not only that, but Poppy Montgomery and Anthony LaPaglia from the same show are Australians.

LaPaglia especially blows me away--he seems so quintessentially New York that when he speaks with his native accent, it sounds like he's faking it!


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## JMikeD (Jun 10, 2002)

Jon J said:


> Or Blackadder.


I hope that's tongue-in-cheek. His Blackadder accent is not much like his own, to my ears.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

When I saw Jamie Bamber (Lee Adama on BSG) on Celebrity Poker Showdown, I was surprised to hear his British accent. I vaguely remember hearing or reading that he was British, but actually hearing it threw me for a loop.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

devdogaz said:


> When I saw Jamie Bamber (Lee Adama on BSG) on Celebrity Poker Showdown, I was surprised to hear his British accent. I vaguely remember hearing or reading that he was British, but actually hearing it threw me for a loop.


Irish, not British!

(There's a difference, you know... )


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## sieglinde (Aug 11, 2002)

House's accent is pretty bad. No one can identify where in the US he is supposed to be from.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Irish, not British!
> 
> (There's a difference, you know... )


I did know there was a difference, but didn't hear him speak enough to spot it. He mostly just said a few words here and there.


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## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

jeff125va said:


> I'm not surprised they can learn to eliminate their accents to sound American.


Huh?

I think this sentence sums up the whole thread. They are doing American accents (which there are many, actually, as there are many British accents), not removing accents.

Just as a northerner can mimic a southern accent or a mid-westerner can talk Bahston (pahk the cah), it is all the same.

And remember, THEY invented English. We only speak it.


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## omnibus (Sep 25, 2001)

I'm always amazed when I hear American born orientals speaking perfect colloquial english.

I'm sure their physical features have a lot to do with what we expect to come out of their mouths.

Pat Morita was an excellent example. He was asked whether he knew Karate and replied in perfect english that "I know how to spell it"


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## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

omnibus said:


> I'm always amazed when I hear American born orientals speaking perfect colloquial english.
> 
> I'm sure their physical features have a lot to do with what we expect to come out of their mouths.
> 
> Pat Morita was an excellent example. He was asked whether he knew Karate and replied in perfect english that "I know how to spell it"


Asian-Americans. Oriental describes a rug.


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## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

I heard Toni Collette in an interview the other day. She said it mostly came from watching so much American tv growing up.

I think English and Australian actors do such good american accents because they are exposed to a lot of them. Especially Australians. It is amazing how much American Culture Australians are exposed to on a regular basis.


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## Bars & Tone (Aug 28, 2004)

TonyD79 said:


> ...or a mid-westerner can talk Bahston (pahk the cah)...


Sez you!  
Ever heard Ken "The White Shadow" Howard trying his Boston accent on _Crossing Jordan_?  
It hurts mommy!! Make the bad man stop!!! LOL!


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## Redux (Oct 19, 2004)

TonyD79 said:


> Huh?
> 
> I think this sentence ("I'm not surprised they can learn to eliminate their accents to sound American") sums up the whole thread.


I have copied that post and plan to share it with a number of Brits I work with. Will probably use the quote for years. Most entertaining post in many, many weeks. Very close to _literally_ ROFL.


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Redux said:


> I have copied that post and plan to share it with a number of Brits I work with. Will probably use the quote for years. Most entertaining post in many, many weeks. Very close to _literally_ ROFL.


I have to admit, I guess I was being too subtle but I meant that sort of jokingly, capturing the sentiment from a few posts later:


jakerock said:


> That is a silly question. We don't have an accent. They're the ones that sound different.
> 
> Sheesh.


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## Redux (Oct 19, 2004)

jeff125va said:


> I have to admit, I guess I was being too subtle but I meant that sort of jokingly, capturing the sentiment from a few posts later:


 "Sort of" jokingly??????

Too modest. I took it as a beautiful put-on. Well done.


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## alpacaboy (Oct 29, 2004)

A couple weeks ago, I was watching Buffy the Vampire Slayer Season 4 - Before watching the extras, I hadn't realized James M isn't British. Though I'm not a Brit, so I'm not that sensitive to it. What I thought was great though was one episode where Spike is doing a bad American/Cowboy accent.


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## SparkleMotion (Feb 2, 2004)

The one that probably surprised me the most was Caroline Dhavernas from "Wonderfalls". She was born and raised a French-speaking Quebecan, but on that show she has nary a trace of a Canadian-French accent. Perfectly colloquial American upper-midwest. It's really quite amazing because that show had such intentionally quirky dialogue that depended on a properly delivered syntax...and she fulfilled it really well. :up:


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## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

Well, since you bring up Buffy, both Tony and James alter their accents for the show. James normally has a California accent, and Tony has a slight West Country british accent.

For the show, James created an accent that was actually based on Tony's real accent (Tony even helped a bit with it). As for Tony, he does more of a "standard English" accent for the character of Giles, in order to portray his character as more cultured or educated.


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## atrac (Feb 27, 2002)

LoadStar said:


> Asian-Americans. Oriental describes a rug.


YES! I'm curious as to how many people (like me) had to learn this fact from "The Real World: San Francisco" back in the early 90's???


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## PeternJim (Sep 25, 2004)

I'm hardly a professional, but I've done a lot of community theater, including things with various accents. When I did one, I had a British friend tell me that I sounded so natural that he found it odd hearing me speak with an American accent afterwards.

All I can say is that for me, it "just happens." Once I have the details of the accent worked out, I just flip a switch in my head and it comes out that way, and when there is a slip, it "feels wrong" and I can correct it and train myself for it to sound right in rehearsal.

On the other hand, physical characterizations, walking "old" or playing a physically goofy or stodgy character, is something I have to concentrate on, while other people who can't do accents to save their lives slide effortlessly into physical characterizations that are truly amazing -- you almost wouldn't recognize them, even with no change in clothes or makeup.

I guess different actors have different natural strengths.

I wish I could remember who it was, but there was recently an article about an American actress that I recognized (big screen person -- usually a redhead) becoming very popular playing French characters in French-language historical dramas, and that the French felt her accent was flawless. THAT is impressive.

But then, so was the Japanese actress who was the lead in Shogun -- who spoke no English at all and learned her lines phonetically. YIKES!

Peter


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## Crrink (Sep 3, 2002)

atrac said:


> YES! I'm curious as to how many people (like me) had to learn this fact from "The Real World: San Francisco" back in the early 90's???


"Oriental" is an adjective that means Eastern. There is no rule against applying the same adjective to both people and things, and in fact it is normal to do so.
The term ought to be no more offensive than "Middle Eastern" which we're still allowed to use.
People are far too sensitive about unimportant things these days IMO.


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## SparkleMotion (Feb 2, 2004)

PeternJim said:


> I'm hardly a professional, but I've done a lot of community theater, including things with various accents. When I did one, I had a British friend tell me that I sounded so natural that he found it odd hearing me speak with an American accent afterwards.


In April I did a local production of "The Rocky Horror Show" in which I played Eddie and Dr. (von) Scott. I used a really broad and exaggerated German-like accent which I did no research or study for...I wanted it to be comic and silly.

After one performance during the audience meet 'n' greet, one woman came up to me and asked what part of Germany I was from!  I said "The over-exaggerated, badly-accented part" in my normal null American voice.


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## murgatroyd (Jan 6, 2002)

PeternJim said:


> I'm hardly a professional, but I've done a lot of community theater, including things with various accents. When I did one, I had a British friend tell me that I sounded so natural that he found it odd hearing me speak with an American accent afterwards.
> 
> All I can say is that for me, it "just happens." Once I have the details of the accent worked out, I just flip a switch in my head and it comes out that way, and when there is a slip, it "feels wrong" and I can correct it and train myself for it to sound right in rehearsal.
> 
> ...


These two examples are not as different as they may seem.

All changes in sound that you make when you speak are produced by a change in shape of your vocal apparatus. When you speak with a "different accent" part of what happens is that you are using different muscles in your face or using them in a different way than you do ordinarily.

Thus a "different accent" is very much like what the dancers are doing every week on the TV show _So You Think You Can Dance_ when they are assigned different styles of dance, which can have VERY different ways of moving.

Some dancers are far more adept at switching styles and picking up other styles quickly than others.

For acting, some of the best work I've heard is when the actors attempt a specific accent copied from an actual person, and they have source material from that person to work from.

For instance, in the movie Cross Creek (1983), actor Peter Coyote had as his model the person whom he was portraying, Norton Baskin. This has to be the ideal scenario for an actor working on an accent, especially when your informant is working as a consultant on the film. If his accent started to slip a little, all he would have to do is go over and talk to Baskin and brush it back up again. As a Florida native, I can tell you, Coyote did a very good job. :up:

One spectacular instance of an actor doing changes in both vocal and physical performance is Alan Rickman's portrayal of Eamon de Valera in the movie Michael Collins (1996). There's a famous speech that de Valera gives (filmed on Rickman's first day on the set) which nearly catapaulted me out of my chair, in part because the speech itself is so electric, but also because it was so different from anything I had seen Rickman do in the past.

I had an email pal in Dublin at the time and asked him what the reaction of the Dublin audiences had been. He said "it was as if we had seen a ghost" and that Rickman's performance had been spot-on.

Note too that a lot of actors "lose their accent" when singing, in part because the way you have to move your vocal apparatus is different from what you do in ordinary speech.

One of the productions that drove me mad was the 1999 Trevor Nunn _Oklahoma!_ with Hugh Jackman as Curley McLain which was televised on PBS. Jackman actually had one of the better accents in the cast, but there was one vowel in particular where his Aussieness was evident -- it's one of the vowels that, if you are an American doing an Aussie accent, it's not easy to match. I would be listening to Hugh and he sounded perfectly believable and then  -- there would be that vowel again. It's a fine performance, recommended to anyone not cursed by an over-trained ear. 

So for those of you who are actors and who need to do an accent for a show, my advice would be to get a large sound sample of one person speaking the accent you are trying for and to practice sounding like that specific person. It will give you a much better target to focus on than using multiple models.

Jan (MA Linguistics, '80)


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## TiVo Mel (Jun 21, 2005)

One that impresses me is Ian McShane on Deadwood. Ian is a british actor that definitely sounds American. Very impressive if you've ever heard his real voice.


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## murgatroyd (Jan 6, 2002)

Bob Hoskins' performance in _Who Framed Roger Rabbit?_ should also be given a big :up:

Jan


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

LoadStar said:


> Asian-Americans. Oriental describes a rug.


The "Preferred" term today is Asian.
(Not that I care, one way or another)

The classic example of the accent is Vivian Leigh in "Gone With the Wind".
She was British and married to Laurence Olivier to boot.

To go the other way, a good example is John Hillerman of "Magnum P.I.".
The man who portray the cultured and proper Higgins was born and raised in Texas.
So when he portrayed his illegitimate, bronco busting, half brother, he was doing his normal accent or at least the one he grew up with.


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## WeBoat (Nov 6, 2002)

Funny every here seems to have missed Colin Farrel. He has a very thick Irish accent as his normal speaking voice, but in movie after movie I think he nails both a midwestern and a NY accent depending on the role.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

WeBoat said:


> Funny every here seems to have missed Colin Farrel. He has a very thick Irish accent as his normal speaking voice, but in movie after movie I think he nails both a midwestern and a NY accent depending on the role.


That's odd, I always hear the Irish in him. Faint, but definitely there...


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## SparkleMotion (Feb 2, 2004)

murgatroyd said:


> So for those of you who are actors and who need to do an accent for a show, my advice would be to get a large sound sample of one person speaking the accent you are trying for and to practice sounding like that specific person. It will give you a much better target to focus on than using multiple models.


I think the key problem some people have when trying to do this, is that they can hear they're doing _something_ wrong, but aren't able to isolate exactly what it is...which is why dialect coaching by someone who is able to pinpoint the discrepancy and help you to both recognize and overcome it is often key.


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## murgatroyd (Jan 6, 2002)

SparkleMotion said:


> I think the key problem some people have when trying to do this, is that they can hear they're doing _something_ wrong, but aren't able to isolate exactly what it is...which is why dialect coaching by someone who is able to pinpoint the discrepancy and help you to both recognize and overcome it is often key.


Indeed.

There's also the added complication that sometimes people have to learn how to reliably reproduce two sounds which are not different in their own dialect (e.g. in Southern American English the words _pen_ and _pen_ often are pronounced with the same vowel, whereas other dialects have them as separate vowels). It's hard to reproduce this difference unless you have learned to hear it first, which is a process one of my instructors called "cleaning out your ears".

Jan


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## Spire (Jun 6, 2001)

murgatroyd said:


> (e.g. in Southern American English the words _pen_ and _pen_ often are pronounced with the same vowel, whereas other dialects have them as separate vowels).


FWIW, I tend to pronounce them with the same vowel.


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## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

If anyone is curious to hear Hugh Laurie's real accent, FOX has some videos up on their page for House. Not quite what I was expecting... I think I may have heard him before in Blackadder, and there I believe he may have over-exaggerated his accent, and that's probably what I was expecting.


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## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

WeBoat said:


> Funny every here seems to have missed Colin Farrel. He has a very thick Irish accent as his normal speaking voice, but in movie after movie I think he nails both a midwestern and a NY accent depending on the role.


His "brooklyn" accent in 'Phone Booth' was horrid. Granted, it wasn't Irish, but it wasn't brooklyn or any kind of NYC.

He did a really good Bono on SNL though. 

Back in college, a friend of mine was in a play where he had to have a russian accent. He lucked out in that he had a fantastic dialect coach. A friend of his who was of russian descent came to the show and brought his grandfather, who grew up in russia. After the show, when the grandfather met the actor, he said to him, _in Russian_, "Your english is very good".


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## murgatroyd (Jan 6, 2002)

Spire said:


> FWIW, I tend to pronounce them with the same vowel.


Over-correction! 

That should have been 'pen' and 'pin'. 

Jan


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## smak (Feb 11, 2000)

I can usually tell. Without dozens of years of speaking with that accent, they tend to pronounce all words out phonetically instead of slurring them all together like us proud Ameicans do.

Like Kate Winslet in Titanic.

I actually just watched Batman Begins last night, and a Nip/Tuck episode 10 minutes ago, and I think Julian McMahon pulls it off better than Bale.

-smak-


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## emandbri (Jul 5, 2004)

Damian Lewis in band of brothers and dreamcatcher did a really good job with an american accent, I had no idea he was british until they had some making of it segments.

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0507073/

Emily


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## Marco (Sep 19, 2000)

emandbri said:


> Damian Lewis in band of brothers


Stole my thunder!
Amazing that he's not American-born.


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## aforkosh (Apr 20, 2003)

I'm suprised Dominic West and Idris Elba from The Wire haven't come up in this discussion. It was a bit jarring on an HBO Buzz insert last night to hear West talking about the show in his native accent (especially after having seen him playing McNulty moments before).


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## NoThru22 (May 6, 2005)

I would not list Colin Farrel as someone who could pull off an American accent perfectly. His non-regional in SWAT was pretty bad.


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## 7thton (Mar 3, 2005)

The guy who plays Apollo on Battlestar Galactica is British & has a fairly thick accent. Can't tell it from BSG though...


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

7thton said:


> The guy who plays Apollo on Battlestar Galactica is British & has a fairly thick accent. Can't tell it from BSG though...


Smeek! (And as I said the first time, Irish, not British!)


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## TIVOSciolist (Oct 13, 2003)

johnspalm said:


> I saw Marina Sirtis (aka Counselor Troi, ST:TNG, et al) at a convention one time. She has a pretty thick UK accent. Someone in the audience asked her the same question. I believe her response was "I'll tell you a secret....it's called acting!".


1. For ST:TNG, she made up an accent that is somewhere between British and American. During an interview I saw, someone asked her to say a few words using the Counselor Troi accent. She declined, saying that she preferred to save that for the show.

2. I was watching an episode "Absolutely Fabulous" and seeing this character who seemed pretty strange. I kept wondering what was wrong with her. It took me a while to realize that she was just trying to do an American accent (and doing a bad job of it).


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

On the other hand, Adrian Brody's American accent always impresses me--even though he's American.

I guess I just can't believe he's American or something...


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## Bai Shen (Dec 17, 2004)

devdogaz said:


> When I saw Jamie Bamber (Lee Adama on BSG) on Celebrity Poker Showdown, I was surprised to hear his British accent. I vaguely remember hearing or reading that he was British, but actually hearing it threw me for a loop.


If you watch the dvds, there's a bit with him and the guy that plays Baltaar. I'm drawing a blank on the name atm. Anyways, they were commenting on the fact that Jamie can't use his accent while Baltaar can. And Jamie was complaining about not being able to say bugger. It's was pretty amusing.


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## Bai Shen (Dec 17, 2004)

Anybody know where the actor who plays Sark on Alias is from? They did an episode where he had an american accent and that was interesting. He has a british accent normally on the show.


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## Brown57 (Oct 21, 2002)

TIVOSciolist said:


> 2. I was watching an episode "Absolutely Fabulous" and seeing this character who seemed pretty strange. I kept wondering what was wrong with her. It took me a while to realize that she was just trying to do an American accent (and doing a bad job of it).


The only regular "American" character in AbFab that I recall was "Bo" the Californian girlfriend of Marshall, Edina's ex-husband. Bo was played by the actress Mo Gaffney, who is from San Diego. But perhaps you're referring to somebody else.


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## NoThru22 (May 6, 2005)

The guy that plays Sark, Anders, is American and that was his real accent on that episode of Alias.

Talking about that Ab Fab episode made me think of the first episode of MI:5 (Spooks) where the woman is supposed to be an anti-abortionist from the south and English people must've thought she did a good Southern accent but it was horrible!


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## SoldOnTiVo (Mar 5, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Not only that, but Poppy Montgomery and Anthony LaPaglia from the same show are Australians.
> 
> LaPaglia especially blows me away--he seems so quintessentially New York that when he speaks with his native accent, it sounds like he's faking it!


I still have a hard time believing he's the same guy that played "the Blade" in "The Client".


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

TIVOSciolist said:


> 1. For ST:TNG, she made up an accent that is somewhere between British and American. During an interview I saw, someone asked her to say a few words using the Counselor Troi accent. She declined, saying that she preferred to save that for the show.


I thought that her accent was supposed to be Greek with some Betazoid thrown in.


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## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

JYoung said:


> I thought that her accent was supposed to be Greek with some Betazoid thrown in.


I understand that Roddenberry spared no expense in getting Marina a dialect coach who was born on Betazed.


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## Brown57 (Oct 21, 2002)

NoThru22 said:


> Talking about that Ab Fab episode made me think of the first episode of MI:5 (Spooks) where the woman is supposed to be an anti-abortionist from the south and English people must've thought she did a good Southern accent but it was horrible!


That was Lisa Eichorn, from New York. American accents are tough for Americans too, huh?


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## tetspa (Mar 17, 2005)

It's called PHONICS...more specifically vowel sounds. In U.S. we pronounce the word "mate" with a long a sound for the a. In Austrailia, the long a is replaced with a long i - "mite"/"might"; day becomes "diy"/"die". "Good-Day Mate" becomes "Good-Die Might"


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## rondotcom (Feb 13, 2005)

jeff125va said:


> I never knew Kevin Costner was British either until I saw Robin Hoodrince of Thieves.


 Hey! You owe me a monitor... this one has coffee spewed all over it!


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

tetspa said:


> It's called PHONICS...more specifically vowel sounds. In U.S. we pronounce the word "mate" with a long a sound for the a. In Austrailia, the long a is replaced with a long i - "mite"/"might"; day becomes "diy"/"die". "Good-Day Mate" becomes "Good-Die Might"


Heeeey, that's pretty good!


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Smeek! (And as I said the first time, Irish, not British!)


Speaking of that, I looked at his IMDB page today and it said he was born in London. It says his father is American and his mother is Irish, but doesn't say where he grew up. Are you sure his accent is Irish?


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

devdogaz said:


> Are you sure his accent is Irish?


Sounds Irish to me...


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Sounds Irish to me...


IMDB says he spent his early years in Paris until he was 7. Under those circumstances, he probably learned his accent from his mother so that would explain the Irish.


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## tsings31 (Dec 13, 2003)

Also Portia de Rossi (Arrested Development). She once mentioned in an interview that she'd been using an American accent for so long, that when she went home to Australia to film a movie, playing an Australian, the director asked, "You call that an Australian accent?"


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## smak (Feb 11, 2000)

Bai Shen said:


> Anybody know where the actor who plays Sark on Alias is from? They did an episode where he had an american accent and that was interesting. He has a british accent normally on the show.


I'll put him as having one of the best British accents of American actors. I would have never guessed until I heard about it a few years ago.

-smak-


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

How come they all sing like Americans?

Better add the smiley!


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## 7thton (Mar 3, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Smeek! (And as I said the first time, Irish, not British!)


The only thing worse than smeeking is...being the one anal enough to point out the smeek.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

When I watched the extras on the Lost DVDs, I was surprised to hear Naveen Andrews' perfect British accent. Now, watching the show, I guess his Iraqi (or, generic middle eastern) accent isn't all that great. But it was still surprising to hear his real accent for the first time.

Also from that show, it was odd to hear Yoon-jin Kim (Sun) and Daniel Dae Kim (Jin) both speak perfect English (his is less accented than hers). Daniel Dae Kim has never acted in Korean before Lost. Now he has to play someone who speaks native Korean and only a few English words in a heavy accent.


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## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

Swedgin!


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## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

aindik said:


> Daniel Dae Kim has never acted in Korean before Lost. Now he has to play someone who speaks native Korean


Fortunately for him, the vast majority of Lost viewers are not in a position to notice if he's doing a bad job of it.


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## Meathead (Feb 19, 2002)

While this is not one nation to another, it is still relevant. I love The Closer, but the southern accent that Kyra Sedgewick attempts to use is like nails on a chalkboard to me. It is a complete stereotype accent & not at all accurate. The only worse accents I have heard were the ones used in the original movie The Big Easy.

As a New Orleans native & Atlanta resident (two places known for strong accents), very few people ever get those right.


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## omnibus (Sep 25, 2001)

Did you know that John Mahoney (Frasier's dad), was born and spent his formative years in Great Britain.


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

I just saw Rachel Griffiths in a movie this weekend and she did a great job on the American accent. I think a couple times she slipped but then it sounded more like a Baltimore accent.


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## vman41 (Jun 18, 2002)

The Brits are better at doing American accents than thery were 30-40 years ago. I think watching a lot of American T.V. shows and movies gives you an ear for it that helps to mimic it when acting.


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## BriGuy20 (Aug 4, 2005)

I've heard that Forest Whitaker did a good British accent in The Crying Game. Can't say how good his Psychlo accent is in Battlefield Earth, though.


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## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

BriGuy20 said:


> I've heard that Forest Whitaker did a good British accent in The Crying Game. Can't say how good his Psychlo accent is in Battlefield Earth, though.


Umm, there is NOTHING good in the B.E. movie! (Read the book though and forget about the movie.)


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## BriGuy20 (Aug 4, 2005)

It has a few so-bad-it's-good moments. But yes, by and large a gigantic train wreck.


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## Langree (Apr 29, 2004)

The pub I frequent has alot of scots, britains (from different parts and I can now tell the difference in their dialects), and Irish. It's funny when one of them tries to do a Southern accent and don't totally lose their own, makes for some funny sounding dialogue.


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## Granny (Mar 29, 2005)

My friend from Singapore learned English from the British missionary priests at the school she attended. I had a deuce of a time understanding her until I realized she was speaking American with a Chinese/British accent.


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## ccooperev (Apr 24, 2001)

omnibus said:


> I'm always amazed when I hear American born orientals speaking perfect colloquial english.
> 
> I'm sure their physical features have a lot to do with what we expect to come out of their mouths.
> 
> Pat Morita was an excellent example. He was asked whether he knew Karate and replied in perfect english that "I know how to spell it"


Considering that Pat was born and raised in California, I'm not surprised at all.


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

ccooperev said:


> Considering that Pat was born and raised in California, I'm not surprised at all.


Considering that that fact isn't nearly as well known as his roles in Happy Days and The Karate Kid, where he did speak with a heavy accent, I'm sure more people would be surprised than not. Well, past tense I guess, since he's deceased.


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## Bai Shen (Dec 17, 2004)

jeff125va said:


> Considering that that fact isn't nearly as well known as his roles in Happy Days and The Karate Kid, where he did speak with a heavy accent, I'm sure more people would be surprised than not. Well, past tense I guess, since he's deceased.


What?? When did he die?


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## classicX (May 10, 2006)

I consider myself to have an ear for languages (both French and Israeli people have comment on my lack of an accent when speaking their respective languages, French and Hebrew). To me it doesn't seem difficult to copy the sounds that another person makes, and notice the basic "rules" for how to pronounce certain sounds. It's then just a matter of applying those "rules" to new words and phrases. I don't have much trouble imitating accents if I can listen to it long enough.

As for the previous poster to commented on how it's just different vowel sounds, that's really only true for speakers of the same language (i.e. Americans and Brits). The vowels are probably the most important, but the consonants can be VERY different to someone speaking in a language not native to them, which is why you get the Japanese mixing of the letters "l" and "r" when they speak English, for example.

And FWIW, as most Americans can barely tell the difference between two different British accents, most Brits can't tell the difference between an American (non-Southern) and a Canadian, whereas we Americans think Canadians just sound goofy.

You spend a lot of time around someone with a different accent, you learn how to imitate them - it's how our brains work and why children can learn to speak a language just by being exposed to it long enough, and 100% of the time they sound like the person that they hear the most.

This doesn't explain, however, why Americans think British and Australian accents are so SEXY, while other accents are not. I thought Kate Beckinsale's accent in the Underworld movies was put on, only to see an interview with her and realize that she was British. She gained 2 sexy points just from the accent.


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## Magnolia88 (Jul 1, 2005)

Bai Shen said:


> What?? When did he die?


Pat Morita died on November 24, 2005.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

classicX said:


> (both French and Israeli people have comment on my lack of an accent when speaking their respective languages, French and Hebrew).


This is absolutely not a commentary on you in any way, but this reminds me of a guy I met at a group dinner during an academic conference. He was Russian, and VERY proud of his perfect, un-accented English. The problem is, while his English was very fluent, he had a pronounced Russian accent. At first, we thought he was joking, but as he went on (and on and on and on) about it, it became clear that he honestly believed he had no accent.

If he'd been a nicer guy, we probably wouldn't have laughed at him to his face...


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## classicsat (Feb 18, 2004)

classicX said:


> And FWIW, as most Americans can barely tell the difference between two different British accents, most Brits can't tell the difference between an American (non-Southern) and a Canadian, whereas we Americans think Canadians just sound goofy.


I am Canadian, and can tell some British accents apart.

I can tell from a more upper class from a working class accent. 
I can't really discern regional accents, except I casm mostly telly Irish and Scottish accents.



> This doesn't explain, however, why Americans think British and Australian accents are so SEXY, while other accents are not.


It is an exoticism of those accents, or at least certain regional accents. Some working class accents aren't that sexy to me, although their speakers are.


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Magnolia88 said:


> Pat Morita died on November 24, 2005.


Yeah, sorry. I did realize that that wasn't common knowledge and meant to bear the news a little more gently.


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## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

jeff125va said:


> Yeah, sorry. I did realize that that wasn't common knowledge and meant to bear the news a little more gently.


Or at least put it in spoiler tags!


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## ccooperev (Apr 24, 2001)

I read that Ralph Macchio (his Karate Kid co-star) gave a moving tribute to him at his funeral.


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## murgatroyd (Jan 6, 2002)

LoadStar said:


> If anyone is curious to hear Hugh Laurie's real accent...


... then set your TiVos to catch his appearance on Bravo's _Inside the Actors Studio_. You'll even be able to compare his speaking and singing voices. 

Jan


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## getreal (Sep 29, 2003)

Dick van ****'s horrifyingly awful Cockney accent in "Mary Poppins" may have been the straw that broke the camel's back and got Hollywood producers to decide to hire dialogue coaches.


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## BobB (Aug 26, 2002)

Granny said:


> My friend from Singapore learned English from the British missionary priests at the school she attended. I had a deuce of a time understanding her until I realized she was speaking American with a Chinese/British accent.


You ain't heard nothin' 'til you've heard a Russian speaking English with a Swedish accent!


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## Bai Shen (Dec 17, 2004)

BobB said:


> You ain't heard nothin' 'til you've heard a Russian speaking English with a Swedish accent!


I'm sorry, but you've exceeded your allowed apostrophe usage. Only I am allowed to use that many apostrophes in one post. Thank you and have a nice day.


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## classicX (May 10, 2006)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> This is absolutely not a commentary on you in any way, but this reminds me of a guy I met at a group dinner during an academic conference. He was Russian, and VERY proud of his perfect, un-accented English. The problem is, while his English was very fluent, he had a pronounced Russian accent. At first, we thought he was joking, but as he went on (and on and on and on) about it, it became clear that he honestly believed he had no accent.
> 
> If he'd been a nicer guy, we probably wouldn't have laughed at him to his face...


I've met people like that too. Far be it from me to make fun of them to their face, you guys are just mean. 

And FWIW I have never commented on my own accent in any language, even English - everyone has an accent to someone.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

classicX said:


> I've met people like that too. Far be it from me to make fun of them to their face, you guys are just mean.


Ya had to be there. The point where we lost it was when he insisted that because we were actual Americans, we couldn't tell the nuances, and thus couldn't recognize the perfection of his accent.

(I can't remember his exact words, but that was the gist of his argument.)


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## classicX (May 10, 2006)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Ya had to be there. The point where we lost it was when he insisted that because we were actual Americans, we couldn't tell the nuances, and thus couldn't recognize the perfection of his accent.
> 
> (I can't remember his exact words, but that was the gist of his argument.)


ROFL


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

BobB said:


> You ain't heard nothin' 'til you've heard a Russian speaking English with a Swedish accent!


Thought of this thread during Prison Break last night: a Swede speaking English with an Italian accent.


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

When I watch House now I try to see if I can catch a hint of his accent.


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## atrac (Feb 27, 2002)

I am watching "Stuart Little" as I type this and was *shocked* to hear Hugh Laurie using his American accent! I thought that "House" was his 'debut' using it, so to speak. I guess watching SL is where the producers got the idea to audition him?

Also, Gillian Anderson...what's up with her? I've read she grew up in Michigan, but I saw her on Graham Norton and she sounded completely British to me. Was she pulling a "Madonna?"


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## Jeeters (Feb 25, 2003)

BobB said:


> You ain't heard nothin' 'til you've heard a Russian speaking English with a Swedish accent!


I worked with a Vietnamese guy a couple years who spoke English with both a strong French and strong Vietnamese accent at the same time. (He had immigrated to Quebec as a teen I believe).


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## dmdeane (Apr 17, 2000)

atrac said:


> I am watching "Stuart Little" as I type this and was *shocked* to hear Hugh Laurie using his American accent! I thought that "House" was his 'debut' using it, so to speak. I guess watching SL is where the producers got the idea to audition him?
> 
> Also, Gillian Anderson...what's up with her? I've read she grew up in Michigan, but I saw her on Graham Norton and she sounded completely British to me. Was she pulling a "Madonna?"


I did see that Gillian Anderson was in a British production of Bleak House that was on PBS a while back....checking her out on IMDB it does appear that's she has been working in Britain a lot of late (all her work since X-Files have been for British or Irish productions):

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0000096/

I don't know Gillian's biographical details but given her recent filmography it appears she must have moved to Britain (married a Brit maybe?) since that's where she is working now; but as I said I don't know her bio nor have I been keeping up with what she has been up to. But if she's working exclusively in Britain now then she may have picked up a British accent, plus she's been doing some period pieces where she would have to have a British accent anyway so maybe she just talks that way now. It's easy enough to pick up accents if you live in a place for a while, and if your job requires it that makes it even easier.


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Havana Brown said:


> When I watch House now I try to see if I can catch a hint of his accent.


We've been watching MI-5 on DVD and just a saw a couple episodes with him, with the British accent, of course, as well as a much more "dapper" appearance. It was funny to see him like that, especially since his character also had a bit of a sarcastic wit (certainly milder than House's, but still).


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## LordFett (May 6, 2005)

murgatroyd said:


> ... then set your TiVos to catch his appearance on Bravo's _Inside the Actors Studio_. You'll even be able to compare his speaking and singing voices.


I'd rather gargle drain-o and then rinse my mouth out with sulfuric acid then sit through that "show" no matter who is on. I did always enjoy the MAD Tv spoofs though.


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## dolfer (Nov 3, 2000)

I know it's stupid, but for some reason I feel betrayed and duped!  Does anyone know of a web page that lists these actors? I think it would be cool to see an extensive list of "American" characters who are actually natives of other countries.

I knew about many of these characters, but was shocked by McNulty on The Wire! I never would have guessed it.


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## MerlinMacuser (Jan 4, 2004)

aforkosh said:


> I'm suprised Dominic West and Idris Elba from The Wire haven't come up in this discussion. It was a bit jarring on an HBO Buzz insert last night to hear West talking about the show in his native accent (especially after having seen him playing McNulty moments before).


There was an episode two seasons ago where McNulty was undercover and supposed to affect a British accent to infiltrate a Russian call-girl operation. His friends on the force teased him about his accent...a classic episode which included one of my favorite McNulty quotes on TV: "There were two of them!"


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## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

dolfer said:


> I know it's stupid, but for some reason I feel betrayed and duped!


A believe a class-action lawsuit is called for.

(hey, it isn't any more ridiculous than the James Frey lawsuits..... )


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

I think on Celebrity Duets Lucy Lawless does a nice job singing and I can't hear her accent.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

Havana Brown said:


> I think on Celebrity Duets Lucy Lawless does a nice job singing and I can't hear her accent.


Singing in an American accent seems to be much more common for people who speak in something other than an American accent, as compared with speaking in an American accent. In fact, many British and Australian singers sing in an American accent (or, at least what sounds to us Americans like an American accent) naturally. I don't think they're trying to put on the accent, like actors. I think it just happens.

When I was younger, I was always very surprised to hear a singer speak with a British or Australian accent after hearing them sing.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

I don't think it's a matter of singing with an American accent, so much as singing with a singing accent.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I don't think it's a matter of singing with an American accent, so much as singing with a singing accent.


It sounds American to me. Yes, I'm an American. Does the accent sound British to a British person?


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## Magnolia88 (Jul 1, 2005)

I agree that most singers tend to "sound American" when they are singing in English, even if they are British or Australian or Kiwi (like Lucy Lawless). 

The only group that always sounded British was the Monkees.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Magnolia88 said:


> The only group that always sounded British was the Monkees.


...3/4 of whom were Americans!


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## Magnolia88 (Jul 1, 2005)

I know! That's why I used the emoticon thing, to express that it was funny that the Monkees always sounded British. 

British bands tend to sound "American" when they are singing, but the Monkees always went out of their way to sound British. At least I thought so. Especially on "Last Train to Clarksville," it's sort of ridiculous.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

Magnolia88 said:


> I know! That's why I used the emoticon thing, to express that it was funny that the Monkees always sounded British.
> 
> British bands tend to sound "American" when they are singing, but the Monkees always went out of their way to sound British. At least I thought so. Especially on "Last Train to Clarksville," it's sort of ridiculous.


For Americans who try to sound British when singing, there's also Billy Joe from Green Day.

And then there's Madonna. An American who trys to sound British when speaking but still sounds American when singing.

Some "singing accents" sound like the influences of the singer. Paul McCartney is (perhaps subconsciously) trying to sound like Chuck Berry. Billy Joe is trying to sound like the guy from the Sex Pistols.


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## BriGuy20 (Aug 4, 2005)

aindik said:


> Singing in an American accent seems to be much more common for people who speak in something other than an American accent, as compared with speaking in an American accent. In fact, many British and Australian singers sing in an American accent (or, at least what sounds to us Americans like an American accent) naturally. I don't think they're trying to put on the accent, like actors. I think it just happens.
> 
> When I was younger, I was always very surprised to hear a singer speak with a British or Australian accent after hearing them sing.


I actually think it's better to sing with a somewhat British accent. Brits actually PRONOUNCE their words, so it's easier to understand a singer that's annunciating.

Just my $0.02.


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## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

aindik said:


> For Americans who try to sound British when singing, there's also Billy Joe from Green Day.


 You lost me on that one - he sounds very American to me!


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## LectermanTX (Sep 17, 2005)

jeff125va said:


> I had no idea Marianne Jean-Baptiste from Without A Trace is British until I saw her do one of those little PSA's.


You should rent the Mike Leigh movie "Secrets & Lies". It was the first thing I ever saw her in. She, Brenda Blethyn, and Timothy Spall give great performances.


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## betts4 (Dec 27, 2005)

smak said:


> I actually just watched Batman Begins last night, and a Nip/Tuck episode 10 minutes ago, and I think Julian McMahon pulls it off better than Bale.
> 
> -smak-


Anything Julian McMahon pulls off is great!!! 

I am amazed each week listening to Hugh Laurie. I saw him interviewed on Inside the Actors Studio and he sounded so different. He did say that handling the american accent, the cane and juggling things as he talks makes it a lot more difficult.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

It's not American, but it always freaks me out when I hear Naveen Andrews (Sayid on Lost) speak in his native accent--he's very British.

I often wonder how Iraqi his Lost accent really is...

And although Yunjin Kim (Sun) really is Korean, she can speak flawless American English.


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## betts4 (Dec 27, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> It's not American, but it always freaks me out when I hear Naveen Andrews (Sayid on Lost) speak in his native accent--he's very British.
> 
> I often wonder how Iraqi his Lost accent really is...
> 
> And although Yunjin Kim (Sun) really is Korean, she can speak flawless American English.


And of course, Daniel Dae Kim (Jin) was born and raised in Pennsylvania, can dabble in Korean.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

betts4 said:


> And of course, Daniel Dae Kim (Jin) was born and raised in Pennsylvania, can dabble in Korean.


I've heard that his Korean was atrocious to begin with, but has improved dramatically.

But of course, for a true sci-fi geek his Americanocity is no surprise...


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## Uncle Briggs (Sep 11, 2004)

devdogaz said:


> When I saw Jamie Bamber (Lee Adama on BSG) on Celebrity Poker Showdown, I was surprised to hear his British accent. I vaguely remember hearing or reading that he was British, but actually hearing it threw me for a loop.


I didn't know that. All I notice about him is what a bad actor he is.


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## Brown57 (Oct 21, 2002)

atrac said:


> Also, Gillian Anderson...what's up with her? I've read she grew up in Michigan, but I saw her on Graham Norton and she sounded completely British to me. Was she pulling a "Madonna?"


Gillian Anderson lived in London until she was 11 and deliberately lost her British accent when she was teased about it at high school in Michigan. She's just reverting to the accent she had before, so not pulling a Madonna 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gillian_Anderson


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## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

The worst Brit doing an American accent that I've heard recently is on MI-5. They had a US CIA man on and on certain words you could hear the British accent coming through to where it just sounded funny and absurd. He was even saying some typically British expressions in his phony American accent.

I always thought Mel Gibson does a great American accent.

As for singers. I think there were quite a few Beatles songs where the British accent came through (The Ballad of John and Yoko is one that comes to mind). The Clash and Squeeze and many of the late 70s punk rockers tried to maintain their native accents while singing.


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## Magnolia88 (Jul 1, 2005)

Steveknj said:


> I always thought Mel Gibson does a great American accent.


Well, since he's American, I would think that would be easy for him. 

Mel was born in the USA and moved to Australia as a teenager. He did develop an Australian accent while living there (see _Mad Max_, the original version), but after getting into movies and moving back to US, his accent has sort of naturally evolved back into its American cadence. (At least that's what he said once in an interview when asked about it.)

I'm surprised that more people don't know that Mel is actually American. The story of his family moving to Australia because of his, uh, "eccentric" dad and his political/religious beliefs has been pretty well publicized. Especially lately.


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## Steveknj (Mar 10, 2003)

Magnolia88 said:


> Well, since he's American, I would think that would be easy for him.
> 
> Mel was born in the USA and moved to Australia as a teenager. He did develop an Australian accent while living there (see _Mad Max_, the original version), but after getting into movies and moving back to US, his accent has sort of naturally evolved back into its American cadence. (At least that's what he said once in an interview when asked about it.)
> 
> I'm surprised that more people don't know that Mel is actually American. The story of his family moving to Australia because of his, uh, "eccentric" dad and his political/religious beliefs has been pretty well publicized. Especially lately.


You got me there. I had NO idea!!


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## Magnolia88 (Jul 1, 2005)

Steveknj said:


> You got me there. I had NO idea!!


You're not the only one - a lot of people don't know this, because articles about him often refer to him as a "native Australian." But he's not. And he's pretty open about being American. (Although he doesn't like to talk about his father and the reasons for moving to Australia, because whenever he talks about his dad, he gets into PR problems. And that was *before* his latest problems.)

FYI, Nicole Kidman was also born in the USA (in Hawaii). But she was born to Australian parents and was raised entirely in Australia. I think she has dual-citizenship (so does Mel, iirc).

Fwiw, Russell Crowe is also frequently described as a "native Australian" and he's not either. He was born in New Zealand, but raised mostly in Australia.

And I'm embarrassed that I know all of this. That's what I get for watching too much _Entertainment Tonight_.


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## milo99 (Oct 14, 2002)

Crrink said:


> "Oriental" is an adjective that means Eastern. There is no rule against applying the same adjective to both people and things, and in fact it is normal to do so.
> The term ought to be no more offensive than "Middle Eastern" which we're still allowed to use.
> People are far too sensitive about unimportant things these days IMO.


heh, just looked at this thread, and when i read the earlier post about the "fact", i too had this reaction.

dictionary.com gives a good summary.
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/oriental


> Usage Note: Asian is now strongly preferred in place of Oriental for persons native to Asia or descended from an Asian people. The usual objection to Orientalmeaning easternis that it identifies Asian countries and peoples in terms of their location relative to Europe. However, this objection is not generally made of other Eurocentric terms such as Near and Middle Eastern. The real problem with Oriental is more likely its connotations stemming from an earlier era when Europeans viewed the regions east of the Mediterranean as exotic lands full of romance and intrigue, the home of despotic empires and inscrutable customs. At the least these associations can give Oriental a dated feel, and as a noun in contemporary contexts (as in the first Oriental to be elected from the district) it is now widely taken to be offensive. However, Oriental should not be thought of as an ethnic slur to be avoided in all situations. As with Asiatic, its use other than as an ethnonym, in phrases such as Oriental cuisine or Oriental medicine, is not usually considered objectionable.


the part that gets me is that nobody is really sure exactly *why* it's considered by some to be offensive.

I mean, just like Middle Eastern describes a people, it can describe objects as well. Same with any other cultural adjective. Greek, French, European, African, or even ASIAN (asian cuisine for example).


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## pendragn (Jan 21, 2001)

Jeeters said:


> I worked with a Vietnamese guy a couple years who spoke English with both a strong French and strong Vietnamese accent at the same time. (He had immigrated to Quebec as a teen I believe).


I work with a Vietnamese gentlemen and it took me forever to figure his accent out. He wasn't speaking English with a Vietnamese account, he was speaking English with a French account with a Vietnamese accent. He's old enough that he lived in Viet Nam when the French were there and he learned French, then English from them. First time I'd encountered that.


aindik said:


> For Americans who try to sound British when singing, there's also Billy Joe from Green Day.


For whatever reason I've always thought the same thing. Although sometimes he sounds British, and sometimes he just sounds nasally. I'm not sure how a sound can be either British or nasal, but he is.

tk


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## BriGuy20 (Aug 4, 2005)

You can sound british by annunciating words, and with a few select letter changes.

Sounding nasal just involves singing more towards the back of your throat.

Don't know how to explain this any better to a non-singer.


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## JerryLBell (May 3, 2002)

> I'm always amazed when I hear American born orientals speaking perfect colloquial english.


I think most of us suffer from a form of "lazy racism". We don't dislike a particular ethnic group or anything, but we slip into expectations of their behavior that are simply wrong. We get startled when we see an actor of Asian heritage speak with a strong regional American accent instead of a Chinese (or Japanese or Korean or whatever) accent or when we see an actor of African heritage speak with a strong Irish or British accent instead of some generic "inner city hoodlum" accent. I think the fault is evenly split between our own intellectual laziness and the fact that American television tends to reinforce many stereotypes. A cure for that is to watch television from other countries. Canadian programming seems far better than American at integrating people all kinds of ethnic and racial heritages into programs where their heritage is not germaine to the story. When you see a Native American actor in an American TV show, it's probably because the story line revolves around some "Indian" issue. When you see the same actor in a Canadian show, it's more likely that the story has nothing to do with "Indian" issues. British TV is still somewhat segregated but you see people of all kinds of obvious racial and ethnic heritages speaking all kinds of accents as characters in the stories are not only going to be from different regions in Great Britain but from all over the continent and the world. Their characters are definitely more international than what you see on our TV. I'm glad I've got BBC TV on my cable and wish we had access to a Canadian network or two as well. Heck, we've got Spanish-speaking channels from both the US and Mexico, why not north of the border? I could get into watching some 9-pin bowling, darts and curling! (And no, I won't tack on "eh?" to that as that's a Scandinavian thing you'll hear across Southern Ontario, Northern Michigan and into Wisconsin; it's NOT really a Canadian thing.)


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

milo99 said:


> the part that gets me is that nobody is really sure exactly *why* it's considered by some to be offensive.


More than once, I've heard "I'm not a rug."


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## pendragn (Jan 21, 2001)

BriGuy20 said:


> You can sound british by annunciating words, and with a few select letter changes.
> 
> Sounding nasal just involves singing more towards the back of your throat.
> 
> Don't know how to explain this any better to a non-singer.


Not sure why you assumed I'm not a singer. I sang throughout my entire school career including getting an Outstanding in solo contest my junior year and making the All-State choir the same year.

I know what causes someone to sound nasal. I know what causes someone to sound British. This is exactly why I am surprised that those two seem to sound the same with this particular individual.

tk


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> More than once, I've heard "I'm not a rug."


I think the point is that at one point it was considered acceptable to refer to Asians as Orientals. Then, suddenly it was not OK. Nobody really knows what spurred that change.

FWIW, I work in the same room with two Asians. A week or so ago, one of them referred to herself as Oriental. I told her that I thought you weren't supposed to refer to the people as Oriental, but that they were Asian and then things such as food and rugs were Oriental. She said she'd never heard that before. The other Aisian backed me up on it, but I found it interesting that someone who is "supposed" to be offended by a certain description was not even aware that it was offensive.


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## Magnolia88 (Jul 1, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> More than once, I've heard "I'm not a rug."


So when someone says that I'm French, I should respond "I'm not toast" or "I'm not a door!" 

I've heard people say that, too. But I still don't get it because I don't understand why it's offensive. I once thought it was because "Oriental" applies to a large area without regard to a specific country - Chinese, Korean, etc. - but Asian also applies to a whole continent. Are people with Russian ancestors also "Asian"? They are Asian-American, too. (Just like Charlize Theron is African-American, I guess.)

And to get back on-topic, Charlize Theron does a great American accent. (She guest-starred on AD, so that makes her on-topic for TV talk, I guess. Although she did a weird faux-British accent on AD.)


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## Sherminator (Nov 24, 2004)

Bai Shen said:


> If you watch the dvds, there's a bit with him and the guy that plays Baltaar. I'm drawing a blank on the name atm. Anyways, they were commenting on the fact that Jamie can't use his accent while Baltaar can. And Jamie was complaining about not being able to say bugger. It's was pretty amusing.


Well duh, everyone knows that a character with an English accent in an American feature = Evil.  It's James Callis BTW.


getreal said:


> Dick van ****'s horrifyingly awful Cockney accent in "Mary Poppins" may have been the straw that broke the camel's back and got Hollywood producers to decide to hire dialogue coaches.


Sadly, many US financed productions still believe that all of the United Kingdom, still speak like Dick Van **** and live in Victorian times.


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## milo99 (Oct 14, 2002)

devdogaz said:


> I think the point is that at one point it was considered acceptable to refer to Asians as Orientals. Then, suddenly it was not OK. Nobody really knows what spurred that change.


EXACTLY! This happened somewhere in the 80's. all of a sudden, huh? wha? Oh, we can't use that anymore...



devdogaz said:


> FWIW, I work in the same room with two Asians. A week or so ago, one of them referred to herself as Oriental. I told her that I thought you weren't supposed to refer to the people as Oriental, but that they were Asian and then things such as food and rugs were Oriental. She said she'd never heard that before. The other Aisian backed me up on it, but I found it interesting that someone who is "supposed" to be offended by a certain description was not even aware that it was offensive.


i've seen this exact thing as well.



Magnolia88 said:


> I've heard people say that, too. But I still don't get it because I don't understand why it's offensive. I once thought it was because "Oriental" applies to a large area without regard to a specific country - Chinese, Korean, etc. - but Asian also applies to a whole continent. Are people with Russian ancestors also "Asian"? They are Asian-American, too. (Just like Charlize Theron is African-American, I guess.)


again, exactly. I always thought calling them Asians was a bit off, since Asia is the largest freagin continent. I know that some have noticed this bit of hypocricy and refer to themselves as East Asians to be more specific, but then that just brings as back to Oriental for all intents and purposes.


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## JMikeD (Jun 10, 2002)

On TV this morning I saw a brief interview with Louise Lombard, who plays Sofia on CSI:LV. Once again I'm caught by surprise: out of character, she speaks with an English accent.

I went back and replayed part of Thursdays CSI episode. She does a good job of Americanizing her speech.


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## jpwoof (May 19, 2004)

How come Brad Pitt's accent in Troy sounded so bad.


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## DreadPirateRob (Nov 12, 2002)

JMikeD said:


> On TV this morning I saw a brief interview with Louise Lombard, who plays Sofia on CSI:LV. Once again I'm caught by surprise: out of character, she speaks with an English accent.
> 
> I went back and replayed part of Thursdays CSI episode. She does a good job of Americanizing her speech.


Hmm. I've always thought her accent sounded very.... "off" is probably the best word. It certainly doesn't sound like any of the American variants.


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## JMikeD (Jun 10, 2002)

DreadPirateRob said:


> Hmm. I've always thought her accent sounded very.... "off" is probably the best word. It certainly doesn't sound like any of the American variants.


She does talk without a lot of tonal variation, but many Americans I've known do that also. I've noticed this about Hugh Laurie, also. Perhaps tonal variation isn't exactly descriptive of the sound, but it's the best I can do at the moment. It's sort of flat.


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## DreadPirateRob (Nov 12, 2002)

JMikeD said:


> She does talk without a lot of tonal variation, but many Americans I've known do that also. I've noticed this about Hugh Laurie, also. Perhaps tonal variation isn't exactly descriptive of the sound, but it's the best I can do at the moment. It's sort of flat.


It's very flat. The comparison to Hugh Laurie is accurate - if, that is, you are talking about his "House" accent. In fact, both accents are so flat they don't sound like they're from anywhere I've ever been or met someone from -and I'm from CA, where everyone is a transplant.


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## Sherminator (Nov 24, 2004)

Michael McKean & Christopher Guest both did excellent British accents (spoken & singing) in This is Spinal Tap

Doctor Who 2006's David Tennant is Scottish but gives a good East London accent as the Tenth Doctor.


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## JMikeD (Jun 10, 2002)

DreadPirateRob said:


> It's very flat. The comparison to Hugh Laurie is accurate - if, that is, you are talking about his "House" accent. In fact, both accents are so flat they don't sound like they're from anywhere I've ever been or met someone from -and I'm from CA, where everyone is a transplant.


Yeah, I was talking about his "House" accent. Nobody would accuse him in his Bertie Wooster persona of having a flat accent.


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## teknikel (Jan 27, 2002)

Havana Brown said:


> I just saw Rachel Griffiths in a movie this weekend and she did a great job on the American accent. I think a couple times she slipped but then it sounded more like a *Baltimore accent*.


That would be "Bawlmer egg scent".

kel


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## teknikel (Jan 27, 2002)

jpwoof said:


> How come Brad Pitt's accent in Troy sounded so bad.


His dialect coach was from Schenectady.

kel


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## teknikel (Jan 27, 2002)

I'd like to add Lindsay Lohan for a decent accent in "The Parent Trap". Her American was flawless. And while we're at it, let's add Hayley Mills and Patty Duke.

When I was in Interlaken, Switzerland I met a guy in a bar who was Swiss but spoke his English with a Southern American-German accent. He was an exchange student in Atlanta.

I paraded him around the bar to all the Americans there (Interlaken was/is[?] a big American backpacking hangout) and even took him to other bars and everyone who met him laughed out loud when they heard him talk. He was use to it and liked his celebrity from it.

kel


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## JMikeD (Jun 10, 2002)

teknikel said:


> I'd like to add Lindsay Lohan for a decent accent in "The Parent Trap". Her American was flawless. And while we're at it, let's add Hayley Mills and Patty Duke.
> 
> kel


Patty Duke is an American. She ought to have a good American accent.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

JMikeD said:


> Patty Duke is an American. She ought to have a good American accent.


As is Lindsay Lohan. I suspect a joke, although I can't figure out why it's supposed to be funny...


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

How 'bout Phil from the Amazing Race? He's a Kiwi. Last nite was the first time I heard JUST A BIT of an accent.


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## teknikel (Jan 27, 2002)

Havana Brown said:


> How 'bout Phil from the Amazing Race? He's a Kiwi. Last nite was the first time I heard JUST A BIT of an accent.


I thought he was Dutch when I first heard him.

kel


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## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

One issue I have with actors "American Accent" is that for some reason a mid-west accent is considered neutral. So naturally all the foreign actors that do an american accent do the accepted neutral accent. I'd like to see one of them do a southern accent without completely flubbing it or making it stereotypical.


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

Stormspace said:


> I'd like to see one of them do a southern accent without completely flubbing it or making it stereotypical.


Did you watch House last week?


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## classicX (May 10, 2006)

Havana Brown said:


> Did you watch House last week?


That chapel scene had me cracking up. He was just OK at the southern accent though, it was "southern neutral".

Some of us "yankee" Americans know that there isn't just one Southern accent, there are many that vary from state to state and even some within the same states.

I can hear the difference too - I'm partial to Kentucky accents.


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## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

Havana Brown said:


> Did you watch House last week?


I would classify that one as stereotypical, which is of course the whole point of that scene.


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## mwhip (Jul 22, 2002)

Saw an on set interview with the cast of The Class and was shocked that Lucy Punch (Holly) is English.


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

mwhip said:


> Saw an on set interview with the cast of The Class and was shocked that Lucy Punch (Holly) is English.


Good catch Mike. I thought there was something up with her, but I wouldn't have guessed British. I thought she talked like she had a mouth full of marbles.


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

mwhip said:


> Saw an on set interview with the cast of The Class and was shocked that Lucy Punch (Holly) is English.


I trying to "catch" her accent on the last episode, but couldn't.


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## David Platt (Dec 13, 2001)

In the last few episodes of Nip/Tuck, I've REALLY been noticing Julian McMahon slipping in and out of accent, particular when his character is supposed to be mad. He usually does a great job, so it's kind of jarring.


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

David Platt said:


> In the last few episodes of Nip/Tuck, I've REALLY been noticing Julian McMahon slipping in and out of accent,.


What??? I thought it was only Julia who was a Brit!!!


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Havana Brown said:


> What??? I thought it was only Julia who was a Brit!!!


Nope. Dr. Troy is from OZ.


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

Ooooh, that's sexy.


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

Ooooh, I heard that Brit accent slip on House last night. 

I guess these must try for a more "nasaly" sound to sound American?


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

I just saw the guy who plays Rob Hawkins on Jericho in an English show (The State Within), presumably with his native British accent. A bit jarring!


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

I can pick out Eddie Izzard's accent in the Riches. I've watched a lot of his comedy and he acts the same in the show.


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## whitson77 (Nov 10, 2002)

Christian Bale is a known master of several different accents. He can do a great job sounding different from one film to the next.


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## David Platt (Dec 13, 2001)

Havana Brown said:


> I can pick out Eddie Izzard's accent in the Riches. I've watched a lot of his comedy and he acts the same in the show.


Yeah, his "American" accent was frighteningly bad. Dawn just assumed the character was supposed to be British, and was surprised that they never mentioned it.


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## stalemate (Aug 21, 2005)

classicX said:


> Some of us "yankee" Americans know that there isn't just one Southern accent, there are many that vary from state to state and even some within the same states.
> 
> I can hear the difference too - I'm partial to Kentucky accents.


I didn't realize anyone not from the south could hear the difference. Well, I assumed most people could distinguish Louisiana from the rest (I can barely understand some of them) but I thought the rest of us all sounded the same to you guys


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## Sapphire (Sep 10, 2002)

I pretty much learned 'em all, listening to people from different parts of the country on the ham radio.


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