# Bolt stuck at 72% and / or 89%



## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

Long time Tivo user (S3, HD, Roamio) but new to the Bolt. It has not been a good 24 hours. Everything was OK until I tried to pair the Comcast cable card. Long painful story short.... took four cable cards, three trips to the Xfinity store and a good five hours on the phone with Comcast over almost a day before I got the last of four cable cards to work. Yesterday Comcast said that I should keep trying cable cards until I got one to work. Then today they said it was a signal issue in spite of the fact that it was failing on the very same outlet and ethernet connection that runs the Roamio just fine. And even after I removed a 3 way splitter and increased the signal by at least 3dB. Even before removing the splitter, the Roamio plugged into that same outlet reported a 92% signal level. Everyone seems to be guessing what the problem "might be". 

The root problem seemed to be that the cable card paired, but never validated. In the status screen, the "Val:" parameter was a "?". On the fourth cable card, we got it to validate (Val: changed to "V") but even then hitting live TV brought up the "acquiring channels" screen stuck at 89% until I rebooted (for the zilllionth time) and then it finally came to life. 

I did some searching and found a one year old thread describing this very issue, but with Cox (I'm on Comcast). There was much finger pointing and troubleshooting but the thread petered out and it was not clear if it was ever resolved. Perhaps not. 

So what is "the word"? Is this a "thing" with the Bolt? IS it a signal issue? Or a handshaking issue? Does anyone really know? 

Paul


----------



## Luke D (Dec 14, 2016)

I was getting the exact same issue on my first cable card. It worked on my second, it sounds like there are a lot of bad cards.


----------



## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

I find it hard to believe that there are that many defective cards out there. More likely it is a firmware revision level issue that Comcast is not tracking when they hand out cards. But like everything else in this saga, it is..... just a guess. 

Paul


----------



## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

Possible additional data point....

First of all, the incoming cable is initially split two ways. One tap feeds the cable modem and the other feeds a 3 way splitter. Those three taps feed the family room (Roamio), library (Bolt) and the bedroom (DTA). 

1. Signal strength reported by the Roamio AND the Bolt in the family room (with and without the 3 way splitter) is 92% with zero reported errors. 

2. Signal strength reported by the Bolt in the library is also 92% with zero reported errors. 

3. With the Bolt in the library (once I got a cable card working), cable channels are clean with no issues. However, Xfinity On Demand does have moderate pixellation that is NOT present when the Bolt is moved to the family room and connected in place of the Roamio. Same reported signal strength in both locations. 

The cable run is longer to the library than to the family room.... perhaps there is noise injected that does not show up in the signal strength measurement? 

Paul


----------



## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

FOUND IT! Turns out there was a bad connector on the run to the library. Signal strength was low on the very low channels (that we do not watch) but OK on everything else. Once I replaced the connector, on demand is fine. 

It is tempting to blame the cable card issues on the bad connector, but two of the three cable cards I brought home today didn't pair successfully even in the family room with good clean signal. 

Paul


----------



## tivoboy (Jan 14, 2002)

ARGHH!!! this problem is still in play. Just activated a new Bolt, put in a comcast cable card, and stuck at either 72% or 89%, CC can't make anything of it, other than "go back and get another cable card from the store, and while you're at it, maybe pickup two"

Really. REALLY!!! Swap out and replace. Why do they even hand them out. what a waste of human time and effort.


----------



## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

Well, here is what I learned....

To pair a cable card and get it to validate ("V" in the "Val:" field on the cable card "conditional access" page), Comcast has to send a signal over the cable (vs. the internet). If you have low RF levels or interference, that signal might not be sufficient to activate the card. And it is only a one way communication, so they don't know on their end if it was successful. It is very possible (and claimed by Comcast) that it takes a higher RF level than required for good picture quality. 

The above makes some sense and is (paraphrased) what Comcast claimed. But.... on a clean signal of higher than normal strength (I removed a three way splitter for the attempt and moved the Bolt to a known good outlet), two of three cable cards still would not validate. The third validated immediately. Of the four that I eventually tried, it was the one that looked obviously used (it even has a small dent in it). The others looked new. 

This Bolt is going to be a Christmas gift to my wife, so I am REALLY glad I went through this ahead of time. Christmas (or the day after) would have been a very frustrating day had I not  

Paul


----------



## thyname (Dec 27, 2010)

pgoelz said:


> Well, here is what I learned....
> 
> To pair a cable card and get it to validate ("V" in the "Val:" field on the cable card "conditional access" page), Comcast has to send a signal over the cable (vs. the internet). If you have low RF levels or interference, that signal might not be sufficient to activate the card.


I second this observation. 100% correct


----------



## alexb (Jan 4, 2003)

I have found the key questions to ask comcast are:


have you disassociated the card from any other device it might have been used in
you did send the 'hit signal' to the device didn't you (this one is critical)
I have NEVER had a pairing failure on any device (over 100 pairings) once i learnt to ask these questions and ensured it was the motorola M-card with the white lable and orange/red print.

I also concur that DB level may look good but that you can still have weird ass issues, i kept having my cable modem drop down to less than 1MBPs every so often due to a discontinuity on my hidden run in the house. comcast worked around it by over amplifying signal and then using attenuators to pull the signal level back down. Interestingly i had to remove the attenuator when the bolt+ arrived to stop pixelation on a channel or two.


----------



## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

alexb said:


> I have found the key questions to ask comcast are:
> 
> 
> have you disassociated the card from any other device it might have been used in
> you did send the 'hit signal' to the device didn't you (this one is critical)




The several CSRs I have spoken to in the pairing department seemed to know exactly what they were doing and sent multiple pairing hits to the card using two different systems without validation success. As for disassociating the card, is that something the pairing people can see / control? Or does the Xfinity store handle that when the cards are turned in? I did not ask that specific question, but everyone I spoke with appeared to examine the pairing data and programming closely.

Paul


----------



## enthalpy (Oct 11, 2006)

Comcast nearly always argues with me about this. In the most recent case I upgraded from a Series 3 to a Bolt. I pulled a working M card out of the Series 3 (when it was power down of course), and plugged it into the Bolt (which I then powered up). Called Comcast, asked them to activate the M card. Didn't work, and Comcast said I should drive and get another one from them. My response: It worked one hour ago in the Series 3, it will work now. Please try again. So they did and the M card did.


----------



## combatcolonel (Dec 28, 2016)

pgoelz said:


> Possible additional data point....
> 
> First of all, the incoming cable is initially split two ways. One tap feeds the cable modem and the other feeds a 3 way splitter. Those three taps feed the family room (Roamio), library (Bolt) and the bedroom (DTA).
> 
> ...


I had to replace my family room series 2 as it failed. Replaced with a bolt. Have gone through 6+ cards, new cabling through out house, tech help both tivo and comcast now what


----------



## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

combatcolonel said:


> I had to replace my family room series 2 as it failed. Replaced with a bolt. Have gone through 6+ cards, new cabling through out house, tech help both tivo and comcast now what


Get more cable cards. Get as many as they will give you and try them all several times. Maybe do all this with the Bolt connected as directly to the cable as possible (you still need one splitter for your cable modem so the Bolt has internet access).

I had success on the last of four cable cards I tried. The Comcast CSR person advised me that the Xfinity office near me had something like 13 of them and he advised I get all 13. The office would only give me three at a time.

Also examine your bill online after the dust settles..... Comcast hit me with a bogus $50 installation fee (cable cards are DIY) and I had to get them to back it out of the bill. And of course make sure that you are only being charged for the CC you keep. In my experience, if there is something that Comcast billing can screw up, they WILL screw it up.... and then create more headaches un-screwing it.

And one more piece of advice for anyone dealing with Comcast support.... before you call, pee first  You will be on the phone longer than you think.

Paul


----------



## AttilaTheHun (Dec 21, 2016)

pgoelz said:


> Long time Tivo user (S3, HD, Roamio) but new to the Bolt. It has not been a good 24 hours. Everything was OK until I tried to pair the Comcast cable card. Long painful story short.... took four cable cards, three trips to the Xfinity store and a good five hours on the phone with Comcast over almost a day before I got the last of four cable cards to work. Yesterday Comcast said that I should keep trying cable cards until I got one to work. Then today they said it was a signal issue in spite of the fact that it was failing on the very same outlet and ethernet connection that runs the Roamio just fine. And even after I removed a 3 way splitter and increased the signal by at least 3dB. Even before removing the splitter, the Roamio plugged into that same outlet reported a 92% signal level. Everyone seems to be guessing what the problem "might be".
> 
> The root problem seemed to be that the cable card paired, but never validated. In the status screen, the "Val:" parameter was a "?". On the fourth cable card, we got it to validate (Val: changed to "V") but even then hitting live TV brought up the "acquiring channels" screen stuck at 89% until I rebooted (for the zilllionth time) and then it finally came to life.
> 
> ...


Yes the same story hear after 2 days with no pairing and endless calls to Tivo and Comcast no luck, in addition now I lost the signal to all my 5 TV's and a Comcast guy as to come, but as we know the problem is someone mass up my account, two M-card and no pairing, after the tech goes I will go back to the store and try to get as many cards that I can


----------



## AttilaTheHun (Dec 21, 2016)

AttilaTheHun said:


> Yes the same story hear after 2 days with no pairing and endless calls to Tivo and Comcast no luck, in addition now I lost the signal to all my 5 TV's and a Comcast guy as to come, but as we know the problem is someone mass up my account, two M-card and no pairing, after the tech goes I will go back to the store and try to get as many cards that I can


Ok the Comcast guy left by the way he was good, so that what he find my amplifier outside the house was bad (just happened when I try to hookup tivo) so he put a new one in and all my TV's stat to work, the tiro-nada he tried all the setups including his iPhone programs, nothing. I try to tell him about the bad Comcast cards he said no they are good, after all he called for help and they did something on there side took over half an hour but it works , that M- card that didn't paired is pairing now. so my advice don't go to the Comcast store to change card just talk to an expert Comcast support or them send a tech it's not our fault that the regular stuff can't solve the issue


----------



## Josepie (Jan 8, 2017)

I'm stuck on a call with CC support for over an hour. This is a waste of everyones time. I'm starting to regret the Tivo Bolt purchase.


----------



## Josepie (Jan 8, 2017)

Josepie said:


> I'm stuck on a call with CC support for over an hour. This is a waste of everyones time. I'm starting to regret the Tivo Bolt purchase.


[edit] CC is now saying I have to activate my Tivo with Comcast first.... Seems very strange. They do have a Tivo support department which I'm being transferred to.

And they just hung up.

FYI, if your stuck calling CC, there do have a department called Tivo support. This is where you need to be. He (Tivo support from CC) was able to 1st register my Tivo Bolt box with CC, then resend the single to register the cablecard.

When you call, ask to be put through to Tivo support directly, don't waste your time with regular support.

Hope this helps others...


----------



## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

Josepie said:


> I'm stuck on a call with CC support for over an hour. This is a waste of everyones time. I'm starting to regret the Tivo Bolt purchase.


Have you tried the online CableCARD activation?

Welcome Page

I recently exchanged an old S-Card that was in a S3 OLED for a new Motorola M-Card with firmware 6.25.

I thought pairing would be a pain, but using the online system was pretty painless. 5 minutes and everything was done right the first time. I think they ask you for your account # and the phone # for the account for verification and that took a couple of tries because it came back with some unspecified account verification error the first few tries.

The CableCARD swap at the store was pretty simple too. First card he brought out looked a bit worn so I just asked that they grab the newest card they had and then scan the old, scan the new, sign the slip, and out of there. Took about 10 minutes.


----------



## Josepie (Jan 8, 2017)

sfhub said:


> Have you tried the online CableCARD activation?
> 
> Welcome Page
> 
> ...


I tried about 10 times, doesn't seem to work.


----------



## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

Back while I was having serious issues pairing and after many phone calls to Comcast, out of curiosity I tried the online pairing page (several times). At the end of the pairing process, the page returned an unspecific error message. Don't you just love it when the error message is something like "An error occurred. Please try again later". Yes, really helpful. On the next phone call to Comcast, I asked and was told that "the system can't send a signal" whatever that means. 

Paul


----------



## Josepie (Jan 8, 2017)

pgoelz said:


> Back while I was having serious issues pairing and after many phone calls to Comcast, out of curiosity I tried the online pairing page (several times). At the end of the pairing process, the page returned an unspecific error message. Don't you just love it when the error message is something like "An error occurred. Please try again later". Yes, really helpful. On the next phone call to Comcast, I asked and was told that "the system can't send a signal" whatever that means.
> 
> Paul


How did you resolve your issues in the end?


----------



## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

Josepie said:


> How did you resolve your issues in the end?


Persistence. On the fourth card, it just worked. But it took an entire day..... the first card didn't work after a whole evening or trying and waiting and trying so the next morning I took it back and got three more (the most they would give me). The first two also did not pair (technically they would show they were paired on the pairing screen but the authorization code never changed from a "?" and the Bolt never showed any channels). The third one worked. I think on the second try. This was on a line that was one 2-way splitter away from the incoming feed. The Bolt (after pairing) and the Roamio both show signal strengths in the low 90s with S/N of 37dB on that tap.

Paul


----------



## Josepie (Jan 8, 2017)

pgoelz said:


> Persistence. On the fourth card, it just worked. But it took an entire day..... the first card didn't work after a whole evening or trying and waiting and trying so the next morning I took it back and got three more (the most they would give me). The first two also did not pair (technically they would show they were paired on the pairing screen but the authorization code never changed from a "?" and the Bolt never showed any channels). The third one worked. I think on the second try. This was on a line that was one 2-way splitter away from the incoming feed. The Bolt (after pairing) and the Roamio both show signal strengths in the low 90s with S/N of 37dB on that tap.
> 
> Paul


I might have a different issue, I have 99% of the channels and mine shows as paired - Next to; 
Val: V 0x06
Auth:FWK


----------



## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

pgoelz said:


> Persistence. On the fourth card, it just worked. But it took an entire day..... the first card didn't work after a whole evening or trying and waiting and trying so the next morning I took it back and got three more (the most they would give me). The first two also did not pair (technically they would show they were paired on the pairing screen but the authorization code never changed from a "?" and the Bolt never showed any channels). The third one worked. I think on the second try. This was on a line that was one 2-way splitter away from the incoming feed. The Bolt (after pairing) and the Roamio both show signal strengths in the low 90s with S/N of 37dB on that tap.
> 
> Paul


In the past I've gotten a "returned" CableCARD. It looked brand new, but apparently someone had tried pairing and failed and then it takes extra work to get the card working. I'm sure if I was persistant enough it could be made to work (and I've done that in the past with the cable installer by my side as they insisted on truck roll back then). The competing solutions were to navigate bureaucracy to find the guy who could make it work, or always try and get new CableCARDs fresh out of box that have never been returned. Some store guys know which ones are brand new and others don't. Now I just insist on getting fresh cards and doing the pairing myself so nothing gets broken the first time.


----------



## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

Josepie said:


> I tried about 10 times, doesn't seem to work.


Which part didn't work? Verifying my account took several tries (using the same info every time, so it wasn't a problem with the info on my end), but after it got my account verified, the rest worked very smoothly. I had a brand new card that didn't require extra config and extra hits they send to the card so can't comment on whether the system can do that.


----------



## Josepie (Jan 8, 2017)

sfhub said:


> Which part didn't work? Verifying my account took several tries (using the same info every time, so it wasn't a problem with the info on my end), but after it got my account verified, the rest worked very smoothly. I had a brand new card that didn't require extra config and extra hits they send to the card so can't comment on whether the system can do that.


Verifying the account worked fine, it takes you to the next part where you confirm you card details etc. You hit submit to pair and.... it spins... it comes back with an error and to try again. Tried many times, no success.


----------



## Josepie (Jan 8, 2017)

sfhub said:


> In the past I've gotten a "returned" CableCARD. It looked brand new, but apparently someone had tried pairing and failed and then it takes extra work to get the card working. I'm sure if I was persistant enough it could be made to work (and I've done that in the past with the cable installer by my side as they insisted on truck roll back then). The competing solutions were to navigate bureaucracy to find the guy who could make it work, or always try and get new CableCARDs fresh out of box that have never been returned. Some store guys know which ones are brand new and others don't. Now I just insist on getting fresh cards and doing the pairing myself so nothing gets broken the first time.


You might be on to something here. When I received the card from the store, it was in a regular plastic "sandwich type bag" with a piece of cardboard. Nothing else. Potentially used.


----------



## Josepie (Jan 8, 2017)

This is off topic, but calling Comcrap for help is one hell of an experience. I've been bounced around from department to department, hung up on and kept on hold for hours. Soon Comcrap I will be cancelling you forever...


----------



## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Josepie said:


> This is off topic, but calling Comcrap for help is one hell of an experience. I've been bounced around from department to department, hung up on and kept on hold for hours. Soon Comcrap I will be cancelling you forever...


Are you calling the Comcast CableCARD dedicated phone number? There should be no reason to go to any other department to get a CableCARD paired unless there's an account issue.

Comcast CableCARD Hotline: 1-877-405-2298

I didn't have any issues with my most recent experience last October when we got the Roamio Pro and my brother's experience was also good not long after.

Scott


----------



## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

alexb said:


> I have found the key questions to ask comcast are:
> 
> 
> have you disassociated the card from any other device it might have been used in
> ...


"have you disassociated the card from any other device it might have been used in"
I believe this is the cause of most of the reported failures of cable cards and not just with Comcast as is demonstrated when attempting to move a known working cable card to a new device. I suspect that few know the proper procedure to "unpair" these cards with a account/device and then successfully repair the card with the new device.
I also believe that most of the cards which are returned as bad are immediately put back on the shelf to be reissued but until they get "unpaired" or find a competent employee they continue to be recycled.


----------



## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

And if all the above wasn't enough....

Since we replaced our Roamio with the Bolt (plus a new cable card, for a total of two... one in the Bolt and one in the Roamio) I decided to revert the Roamio back to OTA and return the cable card to Comcast. Which I did this morning. 

Came home to "this channel is not authorized" on all channels. WTF!!!!!!!! And this only a day after spending two hours on the phone with Comcast over a billing SNAFU that they NEVER figured out. So I called them again and got a regular CSR after specifying I needed to pair a cable card. She offered to transfer me but said they had a >30 minute wait. She said she could see if she could pair the card (which WAS showing as not active) on her system. And suddenly the channels came back. Crisis averted  

Paul


----------



## alexb (Jan 4, 2003)

I have seen issues like this, they have a bug in their system, I once returned an unused cable mode. Got home all was ok. 10 mins later no internet or cable tv. The CSR on normal line was no help, rang cable card activation number and they fixed both cable card and modem. Bottom line only call cable card hotline, they have never failed me. Failing that the Comcast customer care twitter is very responsive too.


----------



## alexb (Jan 4, 2003)

Oh one other suggestion, make sure to retighten all your coax connections on all splitters, wall and devices regularly as they can loosen over time, and put terminators on unused outlets that are connected or on unused ports on a splitter.


----------



## sfhub (Jan 6, 2007)

This is an old thread but I encountered the same problem on Comcast and was able to get it working.

First the Bolt was stuck at 72%. At some point I did a clear and delete everything and after repeating guided setup it was stuck at 89%

I was absolutely sure the pairing information, HostID and Data were correctly entered through having the rep read back the information to me and matching with TiVo screens, so that wasn't the issue.

You can bypass all the checks for the splitter or the signal from the wall being an issue by going to

Settings & Messages->Remote, CableCARD, & Devices->CableCARD Decoder->CableCARD Options (For Installer)->DVR Diagnostics

Then scroll down a couple of pages using Channel Down and look for OOB SNR

Mine was at 38dB which is a decent signal. There was no reason to pursue the angle that there was an issue with the coax cable, splitter, or signal coming into the house. If you have the OOB signal locked with decent SNR, then your card is able to get configuration info from Comcast.

I then went to

CableCARD Options (For Installer)->CableCARD Menu->Conditional Access

I had
Con: No
Val: ?

Which (I believe) essentially means it hasn't received EMM (Entitlement Management Message). I decided to remove the CableCARD while TiVo was still on and plug it back in. Went back and looked at the Conditional Access menu and now it said

Con: Yes
Val: V

Great, so the CableCARD was able to get something from the system to that says it was validated, so the communication to the back-end was working to some extent.

I went to LiveTV and it was still stuck at 89% acquiring channels. So if I received conditional access info from the back-end what does this stuck at 89% actually mean?

Went back to the Conditional Access menu and scrolled down to
Channel List Received:
VCT ID:

Both said something that indicated they weren't completed.

So my CableCARD is paired correctly and it received conditional access info from the back-end. What it is really stuck on is retrieving the VCT (virtual channel table) that maps the channels #s to the physical frequencies.

I remember a long time ago I encountered an issue with a CableCARD not downloading the VCT so I called Comcast CableCARD activation hotline

1-877-405-2298

and explained the situation, then asked if they could check if the CableCARD was coded for the correct head-end. He said they did have another tool he could go to and check that. He came back and verified my area and confirmed it was set to the correct area. Then after doing that, he also sent a ccv and net hit. Within 3 minutes, my unit was unstuck from 89% and channels were tuning.

So how did my unit get stuck at 72%/89%? I remember when I first got the card it was actually at a lower percentage and increasing the percentage periodically. I left it in the Bolt unpaired for almost a week because I was trying to use the online CableCARD activation page, but it kept telling me it couldn't access my account. Eventually I got tired and called the 877 # and paired it manually, but by that time, it was already stuck at 72% (prior to pairing). I believe there is some process at the back-end or there is some bug in the card if it is left in an unpaired but installed state long enough (or the previous person that had your card and returned it did that) it will get into this state.

I believe if the problem was in the back-end, when the Comcast rep used the other tool to check whether my CableCARD was coded to the correct head-end, that reset that state.

I believe if the problem was on the CableCARD, then the ccv and net hit they sent fixed the problem. They had done a hit before and it didn't make a difference, so I think the act of using the other tool to check the head-end (and possibly hitting commit which made the system think there was a head-end change, even though it was the same head-end), then sending the ccv and net hit did the trick to get the system out of its funk.

Anyway, if you encounter the stuck at 72% or 89% "Acquiring channels" issue, know that it can be repaired without swapping cards, without going through a bunch of signal tests on your coax, without exchanging your Bolt, and without repeating guided setup (and also without doing clear and delete everything)

The problem is on the Comcast side. For some reason the CableCARD guys have this procedure where they have you remove the CableCARD, repeat guided setup, then insert the CableCARD and this is supposed to fix the problem. I went through the whole procedure and it made no difference. I rebooted the unit and waited 2 hours and it made no difference, still stuck at 89%.

Only after I had them check the head-end using the other tool, then send the new hits did the problem resolve itself.

Hope this ends up helping someone.

As an aside, on the TiVo Bolt running the latest software, doing a Clear and Delete Everything does not result in new Data for the CableCARD pairing. For some reason, I had the impression Clear and Delete Everything would require me to re-pair because the Data would be changed. That isn't the case on Bolt with latest software. I don't know if it ever was the case, but I recall in the S3 OLED days I was under the impression pairing was lost on a Clear and Delete Everything.


----------



## aforkosh (Apr 20, 2003)

I just installed a new TiVo Bolt + yesterday to replace my original TiVo S3 which dated from about 2007 and was the first Cablecard-required DVR in my house. Before starting installation, I exchanged the 2 S-cards from the Series 3 for an M-card at my local Comcast store. After doing the Guided Setup and doing an initial Cablecars activation, no channels appeared and channel activation was stuck at 89%. I called Comcast again for help and ran through their activation troubleshooting protocol. It turned out that there was a glitch in my billing coding. I'm guessing this was related to the removed S-cards using a code that couldn't be used for the new card. The agent made some changes in codes that I needed which I needed to agree to (as far as I can see, no change in my costs). After the changes they sent a new hit and all was resolved.


----------

