# Lightening Strikes



## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

I have been receiving an increased number of emails recently due to Tivo's being damaged by the amount of thunder storms we have been having. 

It's little consolation to those people that are already affected but you really need to consider disconnecting Tivo (and any other equipment for that matter) from the phone lines when there's lightening around. 

Surge protection is another route to think about! 

As the modem is built onto the main board of the Tivo, repairs of this nature are generally in the region of £100 + vat from a specialist repair center! 

An alternative route to repair is to network your Tivo. The costs are likely to be similar but in my opinion, this is a better route because you are adding functionality rather than spending money just to get back to where you were! 

If you have a permentant internet connection (e.g. Broadband via a Router with Switchports), networking your Tivo simply requires a Cache/Turbonet card and the networking drivers and associated software installed.

If this all sounds like a lot of hassle, there are people (myself included) who will carry out the work for you. 


Regs
Dave.


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## RWILTS (Apr 21, 2006)

Daft question , but if my phone line is taken from NTL via cable am I still vulnerable?


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## groovyclam (Feb 18, 2002)

When my modem was blown by lightning my TiVo *was* disconnected from the phone line.

It was still plugged into the electric socket and recording at the time though.


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## blindlemon (May 12, 2002)

I agree with Dave that there seems to be an epidemic of blown modems at the moment!

Hopefully, we're preaching to the converted on this forum as there are enough posts here to alert people to the danger. However, most of the calls I'm getting are from people who've never seen this forum... 

Wouldn't it be useful if TiVo could send a daily message called "What to do with your TiVo in a thunderstorm"


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## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

groovyclam said:


> When my modem was blown by lightning my TiVo *was* disconnected from the phone line.
> 
> It was still plugged into the electric socket and recording at the time though.


The mind boggles how a surge through the mains managed to knock-out the modem still when there's plenty more logic to have cop'ed it 

Still thats the force of nature!


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## sanderton (Jan 4, 2002)

I've had network cards blow in PCs when the router got fried by a surge, so even networking doesn't make you bulletproof.


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## groovyclam (Feb 18, 2002)

> The mind boggles how a surge through the mains managed to knock-out the modem still when there's plenty more logic to have cop'ed it


The discharge must have been very near because the lightning flash and thunderclap were "together" and the loudest I had ever experienced. I nearly cacked myself.

I had disconnected all the phone lines when the storm had started and unplugged the office 'puters and hardware but I left the TiVo and Sky box recording. The french window was also open in the TiVo room ( don't know if EM pulses are blocked by windows or not! )

The thunderclap happened and the TiVo rebooted but to green-screen and I had to disable the modemtest file to get it working again. After asking on the forum I decided on a CacheCard as a fix. Definitely a better solution to spending on a modem repair if you can network the TiVo easily in your home with all the extra functionality it provides.


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## melissaw (Jul 8, 2006)

My french windows were open too and the lightening was so close it made me jump and the kids started crying. How does networking help? Especially if you aren't on broadband?


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## groovyclam (Feb 18, 2002)

If you get a cachecard and network the TiVo to your 'puter ( either with a cat5e cross-over cable between the TiVo and the 'puter or wirelessly ) you can:

1) pull recordings off TiVo to the 'puter as MPEG2 files ( no further discussion of how to do this is allowed on this forum! So don't ask here! )
2) get listings via the 'puter modem ( you would have to dial-into the internet on the 'puter and then start the TiVo call manually in the TiVo's menu )
3) run TiVoWeb which, if you don't have a permanent broadband connection is more limited in use, but you could setup Mode0 for better recording resolution and look at the TiVo's menus and set recordings via the 'puter instead of infront of the TiVo
4) you will have a telnet connection to the TiVo which allows for setting up endpad soft padding utility ( and other home-brew utilities written by forum members )
5) adding a bit of memory to the cachecard makes the TiVo menus faster ( especially scrolling through the "to-do" list )


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## artsyone (Jul 18, 2006)

A lightning bolt triggered my breakerbox and fried my phone - although the phone still has power, just can't get a dialtone. My Tivo suffered - not sure if through the phone line or power outlet. But Tivo will not turn on. I bought a new power cord just in case it was bad. I've been reading where people can still turn Tivo on and just need to replace the modem. But since I can't even power the unit - it is a total loss? Any chance I can salvage the harddrive and 80 hours of saved programs?


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## blindlemon (May 12, 2002)

What do you mean when you say "can't even power the unit"? What happens when you plug it in?

If you're lucky you have a bad drive or a bad PSU. Both are replaceable. If you're very lucky you have a disconnected hard drive - reconnecting it is free 

If you're unlucky you have a fried motherboard - but at least you may be able to salvage the recordings if you transfer your drive to another TiVo...

I guess what I'm saying is: it's unlikely that the news is all bad


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## aerialplug (Oct 20, 2000)

I've networked my TiVo. However, the network cable runs straight into a router, which is plugged directly into the phone line. I appreciate that this had added a little protection, but I suspect a lightning strike would go straight through the router and earth through all my PC equipment including TiVo...


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## Furball (Dec 6, 2001)

Lightning is VERY distructive , and generally even disconnecting stuff isnt fool proof. 

If you get a strike near by the emf pulse thats generated will knock out all kinds of stuff regardless of if you have unplugged it or not !! 
One of the most sensitive things is anything that can recieve a signal i.e TV's, TiVos , radios etc if you think of how sensitive the recievers have to be to pick up the low powered signals that are transmitted to them, having a lightning strike near by is like having shout in your ear with a mega phone !!!

I've been called out to houses where they have been hit and its most bizzare what gets trashed and what dosnt ??

Fur


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## Ian_m (Jan 9, 2001)

We have had two damaging hits at work (who said lightning never strikes twice) once on phone line and once on tin roof but jumped onto ethernet.

First phone line strike took out modem, coax based ethernet cards of 486 PC acting as fire wall (PC OK, carried on fine after ethernet ISA card were bought from Ebay) and our Linux servers coax ethernet cards but never got further than the first switch after the server. Replaced cards, modem, microfilter and all worked OK.

2nd strike got into an old 10Mb coax network, destroying all the ethernet cards attached and our old Novell file servers PSU. Also destroyed coax to RJ45 hubs but nothing on RJ45 network touched.

Now got proper lightning protectors on phone line (£100 each) and ethernet out on the modem, as well as not using the coax network any more and retiring the Novell file server.


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## artsyone (Jul 18, 2006)

blindlemon said:


> What do you mean when you say "can't even power the unit"? What happens when you plug it in?
> 
> Nothing happens. No startup noises, the fan doesn't begin to spin, the hard drive does not begin to spin up, the light on the front does not come on, it is totally dead. If the power supply is all that is damaged, would that have affected the power to the harddrive as well since it gets its power from the same source?
> If I try to swap drives with another Tivo, is there any chance that the possibly damaged drive would "hurt" the new Tivo box?


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## AMc (Mar 22, 2002)

I can't see how a damaged drive will hurt another Tivo. If you have a PC handy then you could disconnect any Windows drives and connect your Tivo drive to it with one of the bootable discs for doing upgrades or something like powermax to test the drive (search on here for links).

If you have absolutely no response when you plug it in then it sounds to me like (at least) the Tivo Power Supply has been damaged. These are relatively inexpensive (<£10) and can be replaced quite easily (search a well known auction site for "tivo power supply").

Of course there may be other damaged components but if the drive is OK a new PSU would seem the next sensible replacement to me.


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## sanderton (Jan 4, 2002)

No, none.

And you can pick up a replacement PSU cheaply.


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## blindlemon (May 12, 2002)

I would certainly suspect the PSU from what you describe. 

No PSU = no power. Simple really


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## chimaera (Nov 13, 2000)

aerialplug said:


> I've networked my TiVo. However, the network cable runs straight into a router, which is plugged directly into the phone line. I appreciate that this had added a little protection, but I suspect a lightning strike would go straight through the router and earth through all my PC equipment including TiVo...


The obvious question is, why don't you have a surge protector between the master socket and the router? It doesn't have any impact on DSL performance.


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## ciper (Nov 4, 2004)

Ian_m: coax ethernet and novell? Do you work in a bank or a non profit maybe?


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## kitschcamp (May 18, 2001)

I deal with lots of companies everyday who still use those combos. For a building backbone it's still remarkably common.


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## Ian_m (Jan 9, 2001)

ciper said:


> Ian_m: coax ethernet and novell? Do you work in a bank or a non profit maybe?


If its not broken then don't touch it. Its was Novell 3.1 (I think, might have been V4) running our company accounting and database, it worked, it never crashed, only used by a couple of people who were all happy. 10Mb connection to Novell + Internet was perfectly fast enough for the people using it. Rest of company used 100Mb/Gb ethernet,2003 Server etc etc all wired in along side the Novell network.

The Novell server + Linux servers, Linux firewalls all been turned off now as everything moved to the lost more cost effective Server 2003 platform.

The coax network is still used, a lot of the embedded devices/platforms we use/build have a 10Mb coax connection running a proprietary protocol (ie not TCP/IP or NETBUEI or IPX) on the network.


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## TrevorCotterell (Sep 20, 2004)

Having just got my Tivo going again by installing a cachecard, after what looks like a lightning strike 3 weeks ago (and it's thundering here now), what is the recommended best/simplest measure to take to get a reasonable level of protection for the future? My router is powered via sure protected supply - I suspect I really ought to do the same with my hifi/Tivo etc!

In fact I had my entire hifi system blown up many years ago - lightning came through the power supply (we know - there was a large black mark around the socket and it was burnt out inside but still fried pretty much everything). Still, got a new systew on the insurance!


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## tray (Jul 11, 2005)

Found this wrt to protecting your phone line

http://web.ukonline.co.uk/freshwater/lightng.htm

NB I believe it's a no-no to modify the BT Master socket


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## NickDvl (Oct 31, 2002)

Furball said:


> If you get a strike near by the emf pulse thats generated will knock out all kinds of stuff regardless of if you have unplugged it or not !!


Best thing to do is to earth the TiVo's casing when it's unplugged - it's all metal (unlike most other electronic gizmos) and _should_ protect it against EMP. In theory at least...


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## Milhouse (Sep 15, 2001)

chimaera said:


> The obvious question is, why don't you have a surge protector between the master socket and the router? It doesn't have any impact on DSL performance.


I generally buy the Belkin 8-gang sockets with built-in surge protection and shed loads of equipment warranty (it's about the only Belkin products I do own!).... does anyone have an opinion whether the surge protection is effective against lightning? The product blurb suggests it will provide a benefit (ie. it mentions lightning), however Belkin go further with this product and explicitly mention lightning protection as a feature.


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## sanderton (Jan 4, 2002)

Depends on what you mean. Against lightning stiking power cables several miles away yes. If it hits the power cable outside your house then nothing is going to stop it!


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## Milhouse (Sep 15, 2001)

sanderton said:


> Depends on what you mean. Against lightning stiking power cables several miles away yes. If it hits the power cable outside your house then nothing is going to stop it!


I'm guessing (hoping!) the latter is possible but extremely unlikely to occur, and that most people have suffered fried modems due to power cables taking a hit several miles away?


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## frogster (Jan 4, 2006)

TrevorCotterell said:


> what is the recommended best/simplest measure to take to get a reasonable level of protection for the future?


The phone line is far and away the most likely to do damage to your kit.
Pull all the phone plugs out of the wall when you hear thunder, or when it is forecast. Permanently disconnect any device that doesn't actually need the phone to work (Sky box).

Buy UPS units for the power. (SVP had some great ones for just £19.99 a few months ago.)

These two measures will protect your kit from anything bar a direct strike on your house, after which the state of your Tivo would probably be the least of your worries anyway.


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## Ian_m (Jan 9, 2001)

Milhouse said:


> I generally buy the Belkin 8-gang sockets with built-in surge protection and shed loads of equipment warranty (it's about the only Belkin products I do own!).... does anyone have an opinion whether the surge protection is effective against lightning? The product blurb suggests it will provide a benefit (ie. it mentions lightning), however Belkin go further with this product and explicitly mention lightning protection as a feature.


Couple of problems here... they are not really lighnting resistant and also the insurance is not new for old with a pretty dire rate reducition (might be they devalue to zero over 3 years). I speak from Belkin experience. These are really only meant to stop interference from things like passing unsupressed motorbikes, washing machines and sparking boilers messing things up.

Real "man size" lightning protection is not cheap. We have some on our work overhead ADSL line, after loosing a couple of modems and since fitting, not had an issue. eg Here Also you really have to keep all the bits say 12 inches apart, as there is no point fitting a protector only to have the lightning jump from phone line to mains at master socket thus missing the your wonderful lightning protector. Our protectors are mounted on a board on the wall along with ADSL modem and further ethernet protectors.


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## AMc (Mar 22, 2002)

sanderton said:


> Depends on what you mean. Against lightning stiking power cables several miles away yes. If it hits the power cable outside your house then nothing is going to stop it!


If the energy available has arced thousands of volts from the clouds onto your house your Tivo is not going to be protected by much - possibly a Faraday cage? 
http://www.lightningsafety.com/nlsi_lhm/lpts.html though this suggests even that might not work! Nothing you can buy in Maplin is going to help to earth that.


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## RWILTS (Apr 21, 2006)

Sorry to bring this old thread back to life, but thought I would pass this on EBUYER are currently selling BELKIN 'PROFESSIONAL' SURGE PROTECTION (INC MODEM LINE) 4 way extension leads for about £2.50. I ordered two on monday, chose cheapest delivery option and they arrived this morning.

Have installed all my Tivo / TV stuff (new lcd of course). Can someone in the know comment on how effective these are? Seems good value to me.


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