# Biting the HR-2X bullet...



## Klankster (Aug 13, 2004)

Looks like we're going to throw in the TiVo towel and go to the new DirecTV DVR so we can continue to get HD NFL -- So I have a quick question. I'd sure appreciate your input and insight here.

Q: Is it worth it to buy my own HR-20 from Weaknees or should I get one from DirecTV? Generally I like to own my own equipment, but if there is a high failure rate or lots of problems, will having one from DirecTV be beneficial? i.e. will DirecTV support it quickly if something goes wrong? Conversely, if I get it from Weaknees, are they good at supporting you when equipment goes down?

I'm gonna keep my HR10-250 as a backup because we like it so darn much.

Anyway, I do appreciate hearing the opinions of people who have experience with both of these options. Thanks!


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## TonyTheTiger (Dec 22, 2006)

However you obtain your HR21 (as that's what it'll most likely be), it will be leased, so I would go with the D* option. Chances are, if you push the fact that you will sign up for NFLST, you can push for free Superfan and maybe even get the equipment for free or at least cheaper than advertised.


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## bigpuma (Aug 12, 2003)

You should be able to get DirecTV to give you a free HR21 or at least a very reasonable price since you have an HR10 and NFLST. As TonyTheTiger said it will be leased no matter what so get it as cheap as possible.


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## sjberra (May 16, 2005)

TonyTheTiger said:


> However you obtain your HR21 (as that's what it'll most likely be), it will be leased, so I would go with the D* option. Chances are, if you push the fact that you will sign up for NFLST, you can push for free Superfan and maybe even get the equipment for free or at least cheaper than advertised.


Unless they get the HR21-Pro, starts at around 600, pretty sure this one is a outright purchase


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## 20TIL6 (Sep 7, 2006)

_Bite the Bullet may refer to: Accepting something difficult or unpleasant, or adopting an attitude that allows one to do so. The expression alludes to the battlefield medical technique of literally biting a bullet during surgical procedures as a primitive form of pain management._

And now we can add this example:

When referring to the HR-2X DVR from DirecTV, as in accepting it into your home. A primitive form of pain management from the loss of TiVo.

I am sure this is marketing effect DirecTV had in mind. "We are rendering your HD TiVo useless. Here, bite this."


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## Jebberwocky! (Apr 16, 2005)

sjberra said:


> Unless they get the HR21-Pro, starts at around 600, pretty sure this one is a outright purchase


pretty sure it's a lease 

I'm very happy with my HR2X's (have 4) BTW - you may be surprised as well once you start to use it.


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

The HR21-Pro is a purchase, not a lease. All others are leased.


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## joed32 (Jul 9, 2005)

Klankster said:


> Looks like we're going to throw in the TiVo towel and go to the new DirecTV DVR so we can continue to get HD NFL -- So I have a quick question. I'd sure appreciate your input and insight here.
> 
> Q: Is it worth it to buy my own HR-20 from Weaknees or should I get one from DirecTV? Generally I like to own my own equipment, but if there is a high failure rate or lots of problems, will having one from DirecTV be beneficial? i.e. will DirecTV support it quickly if something goes wrong? Conversely, if I get it from Weaknees, are they good at supporting you when equipment goes down?
> 
> ...


There is really no advantage in owning a receiver now. Technology changes and if you ever want to sell, it won't be worth much. Leased units will be replaced by Directv, although if you owned you could carry the service plan to cover it. Weaknees is a very good company but they charge top dollar and as the other posters stated you are in a good position to deal. Why don't you just call and "swap" your HR10 for an HR21 so that you can get Sunday Ticket in HD. The HR21 and installation will be free and since you own your HR10 they won't take it. You can run both.


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## sjberra (May 16, 2005)

stevel said:


> The HR21-Pro is a purchase, not a lease. All others are leased.


Was pretty sure that was the case with a 600 + up front cost


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## Klankster (Aug 13, 2004)

Thanks for the replies. I'm going to go ahead and arrange for DirecTV to do the upgrade, since I need the new dish and want to go with the HR-20 (I want OTA reception).

(I still don't get how buying an HR-20 from Weaknees ends up being a lease...)

And yes, 20TIL6, that's about how I look at this process -- I like my TiVo receiver. My wife, who is not a technology geek like me, likes the TiVo interface way more than the HR2X interface -- We found one at the local Costco the other day and played around with it for a while. We weren't impressed. TiVo fits much more information in their channel guide display than the HR20 does, and the option to list the upcoming stuff on one channel was agonizingly slow. How the HR20 designers managed to get that processor to run that slowly is beyond me.

Anyway, we'd rather keep the TiVo interface but since they aren't giving us much of an option, we see this as a step down, not an improvement.


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## rlj5242 (Dec 20, 2000)

Klankster said:


> I'm going to go ahead and arrange for DirecTV to do the upgrade, since I need the new dish and want to go with the HR-20 (I want OTA reception).


 You will get what the installer brings. If you get an HR-21, then get the AM-50 OTA module for it.



Klankster said:


> (I still don't get how buying an HR-20 from Weaknees ends up being a lease...)


 Same way it costs $$$ to walk out of Best Buy with an HR-21. Same way it costs $$$ to drive off the lot with a leased car.

-Robert


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## 20TIL6 (Sep 7, 2006)

I hear ya'.

How is cable in your area? Can you get FiOS? Either of those will work with the new TiVo HD units.

If you can put off your decision for 30 days, you could try a TiVo HD with cable or FiOS. Just to see if a different provider could meet your needs. I say 30 days because within that time you can cancel TiVo service (and return the unit) without penalty, and you could do the same for cable or FiOS. BTW, TiVo HD comes with digital OTA tuners. Free locals in HD via OTA is wonderful.

Everything you like about your DirecTV/TiVo will be amplified on a new TiVo HD. There are just some really cool features that they have, things you will wish you always had.

BUT, if your driving force is Sunday Ticket, then I can understand your need to stay with DirecTV. The local broadcasts, plus ESPNHD, and NFL network in HD has helped... But Sunday Ticket is still an advantage for DirecTV.

If you do go with the HR20/21 (I am thinking you will get an HR21, so you will need their add-on piece for OTA), just try to get the DirecTV CSR to waive the 2 year commitment. Folks here are beginning to report that they have been able to do that with success.

Good luck.


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## Klankster (Aug 13, 2004)

Very interesting. There's not a word about a "lease" on Weaknees on the HR20 product page. You have to go to the HR2X FAQ page -- I have to admit, I'd be pretty pi$$ed off if I "bought" one of these receivers only to find out later that I didn't actually own it.

So this is really a moot point -- Going through DirecTV or Weaknees is essentially the same thing in the end, so I'll take the cheaper route.

Thanks again for all the ENLIGHTENING information!


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## TyroneShoes (Sep 6, 2004)

Klankster said:


> Very interesting. There's not a word about a "lease" on Weaknees on the HR20 product page. You have to go to the HR2X FAQ page -- I have to admit, I'd be pretty pi$$ed off if I "bought" one of these receivers only to find out later that I didn't actually own it.
> 
> So this is really a moot point -- Going through DirecTV or Weaknees is essentially the same thing in the end, so I'll take the cheaper route.
> 
> Thanks again for all the ENLIGHTENING information!


If DTV considers it a lease, and Weaknees swears up and down its not, it's still a lease. Since it is proprietary and can be used only with DTV, then they have the power to make the rules, fair or unfair. If you end up on opposite sides of the issue and things come to a head, all DTV has to do is deauthorize it. Then it won't really matter if it was a purchase or a lease, because it will then be a door stop.


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## memnoch (Dec 25, 2004)

I talked to DirecTV today and they are "swapping" my HR10 for a 20 or 21 and said that being I bought the 10, then I will own this new one and it will not be a lease AND that I can keep my 10. 
I'm adding a second HR20 or 21 to another room though and she said that one will be leased.


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## kdonnel (Nov 28, 2000)

memnoch said:


> I talked to DirecTV today and they are "swapping" my HR10 for a 20 or 21 and said that being I bought the 10, then I will own this new one and it will not be a lease AND that I can keep my 10.
> I'm adding a second HR20 or 21 to another room though and she said that one will be leased.


Check you bill because it WILL say leased. I don't think you can own any of their new equipment except for the rack mountable dvr.


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## memnoch (Dec 25, 2004)

Thanks. That's what I had heard as well and ran that past her, but she assured me that because I own what is being swapped that I will own this new unit outright and would not even need a new 2 year commitment to do the swap, even though a new dish was needed as well. They got the commitment out of me anyway for getting the 2nd DVR. Honestly, it doesn't bother me either way if I'm not paying for it, and I'll still be using the HR10 in another room. I do plan on checking though, so thanks.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

kdonnel said:


> Check you bill because it WILL say leased. I don't think you can own any of their new equipment except for the rack mountable dvr.


it says leased vs owned on our bills now? wow i really havent been paying attention. This used to be top secret information in the past


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## kdonnel (Nov 28, 2000)

newsposter said:


> it says leased vs owned on our bills now? wow i really havent been paying attention. This used to be top secret information in the past


For the additional receivers I own it says "Additional Receiver $4.99". For the additional receivers I lease it says "Leased Receiver $4.99".

I don't know if there is a way to tell if you own or lease the main receiver. The receiver listed as my main receiver is one I own but I don't see anything other then "Premiere Monthly".


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## weaknees (May 11, 2001)

Just to confirm, any HR20 or HR21 from us would show up as a leased receiver.

An HR21 Pro would be owned.

If you want OTA, get the HR20.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

weaknees said:


> Just to confirm, any HR20 or HR21 from us would show up as a leased receiver.
> 
> An HR21 Pro would be owned.
> 
> If you want OTA, get the HR20.


Do you have to pay directv anything to get authorization to crack the cases on these machines?


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

newsposter said:


> Do you have to pay directv anything to get authorization to crack the cases on these machines?


There is no procedure to get "authorization" to open the boxes. The supported disk expansion method is eSATA. As with TiVos, the official line is "no user-serviceable parts inside". The boxes are not designed with the intent of end-users opening them (especially given the exposed power supply.)


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## moab747 (Jul 10, 2003)

Peel the rubber off of the feet and remove the screws.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

stevel said:


> There is no procedure to get "authorization" to open the boxes.


i refuse to believe weakness and other 3rd parties would openly violate a lease agreement by cracking the cases to upgrade....unless they had proper authorization

if they dont, then DTV needs to take down all these 3rd parties doing blatantly illegal things


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

"blatantly illegal"? Nope. What I see from the Weaknees site is that they are selling boxes at something approaching a non-subsidized rate and instructing customers to request that DirecTV mark the box as owned and not leased, based on the sales price. (See the Weaknees FAQ.) Since it's the customer and not the retailer that has the lease agreement, I think this falls into a gray area. Realistically, I doubt DirecTV cares unless the modification damaged the box.


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## flatcurve (Sep 27, 2007)

20TIL6 said:


> If you do go with the HR20/21 (I am thinking you will get an HR21, so you will need their add-on piece for OTA), just try to get the DirecTV CSR to waive the 2 year commitment. Folks here are beginning to report that they have been able to do that with success.
> 
> *Good luck*.


Emphasis mine.

Even if the CSR says they're going to waive the 2-year commitment, don't necessarily take their word for it. If they absolutely insist that you will not get stuck in another two year contract, get all of their information (name, operator #, etc... heck, I'd even try recording the call) because you'll need it when you try and fight the early termination fee in less than two years if you decide to cancel.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

stevel said:


> instructing customers to request that DirecTV mark the box as owned and not leased, .


their own post above said that the boxes are leased. I havent checked out their page but why would they post here that it's leased but then on their site tell you it's owned? A reconciliation of information appears in order.

and i still submit that since i've seen the mods over in dbs say it's illegal to open the box, absent any agreement it is illegal for anyone to crack it. Why would you make a policy that is 'only maybe' applicable?


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## flatcurve (Sep 27, 2007)

I don't think it's "illegal", it may just be a warranty issue. I'm not even sure what law that would break.


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## sjberra (May 16, 2005)

flatcurve said:


> I don't think it's "illegal", it may just be a warranty issue. I'm not even sure what law that would break.


Might be closer to breach of contract then illegal - which is still answerable in a court of law if pushed


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

From http://www.weaknees.com/dtv_faq_detail.php?categoryID=6#q61



> If you order an upgraded HR20/HR21 from weaKnees, you may be able to have DIRECTV characterize the unit as being owned. To do that, you must call 800-DIRECTV and ask for the access card department. Tell them that you ordered an HR20/HR21, give them the price and tell them that you want it to be characterized as being owned. In some cases, the price alone will be enough to have DIRECTV characterize the unit as purchased. IMPORTANT NOTE: If you have a unit characterized as owned, you will NOT be able to get the unit (or a dish) installed for free or at a discounted price. In addition, you will NOT be entitled to any discounted replacement equipment should the unit fail.


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