# Picture of the New Ad's



## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

Well I got a piture of what I believe is the new ad's Tivo will be putting in with commercials, I spoke about this before and I had thought it would be something that would happen only when you fast forward, but I can tell you it comes up during the commercial in real time, Only Problem is I can't figure out how to post the attachment here, Someone help me??? I click on attachment and it say script text here


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

Instead of using the icon for adding a picture use the Additional Options down further where it says Manage Attachments


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

Thanks for the help and here is the picture 

All in all not that bad actually as it doesn't really take up much space on the screen
and this type of ad's gets you access to the first 4 min on the movie which I think is they way to go. Much like AOL you can get Tivo exclusives to Movies and such


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## mick66 (Oct 15, 2004)

The thumbs up ads have been around nearly forever, they've just been modified a little.


> I had thought it would be something that would happen only when you fast forward


That's exactly how the new ads will appear - during FF playback only.


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## DCIFRTHS (Jan 6, 2000)

devlindark said:


> Thanks for the help and here is the picture
> 
> All in all not that bad actually as it doesn't really take up much space on the screen
> and this type of ad's gets you access to the first 4 min on the movie which I think is they way to go. Much like AOL you can get Tivo exclusives to Movies and such


I saw one first hand, and I agree with you.

The ads are not intrusive (IMO), and refined. I think TiVo did a good job especially considering that that they are unwanted additions.

I can live with them.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

DCIFRTHS said:


> I saw one first hand, and I agree with you.
> 
> The ads are not intrusive (IMO), and refined. I think TiVo did a good job especially considering that that they are unwanted additions.
> 
> I can live with them.


We agree that they are unwanted additions.

I accept but differ ,however, with your opinion that they are not intrusive. I find them HIGHLY intrusive. And I won't repeat the expletives from my wife when one pops up on her.

We'll live with them. We don't have much choice. There are enough plusses with TiVo to offset these negatives --for now.

Roy (who's expecting to see the usual "If you don't like it --sell it" drivel )


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## spaced (Jan 10, 2002)

RoyK said:


> (who's expecting to see the usual "If you don't like it --sell it" drivel )


Roy, this is exactly like being forced to watch commercials before a movie at the theater if you paid for a ticket. In my mind, being of the Internet generation, ads make things free, and paying makes them go away. One could argue to just show up late to the movie and miss the commercials, but then you're forced to take the worst seat in the house. Same thing with TiVo... either sit through the ads, or don't use fast forward. You do have a choice! 

I'm definitely with you on this one... down with the ads!


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

BTW, when I watched the first "4 minutes of Stealth" from the Showcase menu, my status bar only showed 3 minutes.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

spaced said:


> Roy, this is exactly like being forced to watch commercials before a movie at the theater if you paid for a ticket. In my mind, being of the Internet generation, ads make things free, and paying makes them go away. One could argue to just show up late to the movie and miss the commercials, but then you're forced to take the worst seat in the house. Same thing with TiVo... either sit through the ads, or don't use fast forward. You do have a choice!
> 
> I'm definitely with you on this one... down with the ads!


Thanks.

Yes the ads that pop-up when FF thru them are terrible but at least they're brief. The ones like these (usually over promos for upcoming shows etc) appear real-time. No fast forwarding here.

Roy


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## kbmb (Jun 22, 2004)

RoyK said:


> Thanks.
> 
> Yes the ads that pop-up when FF thru them are terrible but at least they're brief. The ones like these (usually over promos for upcoming shows etc) appear real-time. No fast forwarding here.
> 
> Roy


So your complaining about an AD within an AD?

-Kevin


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

kbmb said:


> So your complaining about an AD within an AD?
> 
> -Kevin


You are quite astute.


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## HeyGuy (Jul 16, 2005)

funny, i have encountered those ads since december of 04, Now they say it is new? how strange, I have encountered many commercials with the thumbs up for more info for close to 9 months now.


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

Those aren't the new ads.


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## dgh (Jul 24, 2000)

HeyGuy said:


> funny, i have encountered those ads since december of 04, Now they say it is new?


They've been around much longer than that. The new bit is the customizable bottom part of the Icon. Tiny changes freak some people out. The promo/record this icons have always been very handy but there aren't nearly enough of them in my experience.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

HeyGuy said:


> funny, i have encountered those ads since december of 04, Now they say it is new? how strange, I have encountered many commercials with the thumbs up for more info for close to 9 months now.


A quick look at devlindark's join date shows he's new to the TiVo Community. It's reasonable to assume that to him they are new. Others of us have been enduring them for much longer. New or old many of us find them intensely irritating. Many don't. Their newness or lack thereof have nothing to do with that.


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## timr_42 (Oct 14, 2001)

I've always said that if they don't "MAKE" me watch, then I'm ok with it. If a little bug pops up, and I don't want to watch then I ignore it. Now, when they start making me watch things I don't want to that will be a different story. But I just have never seen why people get upset over this, or the yellow star on the main menu.


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

But there _are_ "new" ads, that is the fast forward ads.

What he saw are not them.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

I noticed the new ads (fast forward and not fast forward) for some movie preview yesterday. I'm glad Tivo got graphic artists involved in this - they're cute. I doubt I'll ever click on one, but I see this type of advertising as inevitable regardless of DVR platform going forward. (In fact there is an article in this week's Business Week regarding some a company that offers customized ad content.) So I'm glad Tivo at least made them somewhat unobtrustive and attractive. 

I still find it ironic that Tivo sells us the ability to skip ads, then sells advertisers the ability to put them back in some form. Maybe ironic isn't the right word, maybe clever business strategy is more accurate. 

While I'm posting anyone want to trade a 140HR Tivo with 8 months of service for a Toshiba SD-H400? We want to go Tivo Basic on one of our TV's. PM if interested.


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## dgh (Jul 24, 2000)

davezatz said:


> I still find it ironic that Tivo sells us the ability to skip ads, then sells advertisers the ability to put them back in some form. Maybe ironic isn't the right word, maybe clever business strategy is more accurate.


TiVo has been talking about this sort of thing since 1998 so I believe clever is indeed the better term.  It will be interesting to see if tweaks like these can save commercial TV in the long run, or whether it still ends up as PayTV or continuous product placement. I read an article in Newsweek recently that said that advertisers were already shrinking their budgets for broadcast TV due to the 5% of homes with DVRs where 70% of the users skip ads. It will be interesting to see how it shakes out.


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## jmoak (Jun 20, 2000)

_HIGHLY intrusive... down with the ads!... ads () are terrible... intensely irritating..._

I use to see these kind of responses and wonder "What the heck are they talking about?!?" Being a tivo user for more than five years now, I've really never been upset about what years ago were called "Tivomatic Icons", later renamed "IPreview Icons" and since dubbed by the reactionary press as "(Evil) Popups". It use to bug me to no avail how some could get so upset about something I never even notice unless I go looking for them.

But I think I've figured it out.

_I really never even see them._

*Really!*

Now wait a minute before you poopoo this post and skip it saying, "Ahhh... Just another damn fanboy."

I actually hardly see them, and if I do it's only for a fraction of a second. You see, I'm a hard core 30 second skip user.

That's right! The old "Select, Play, Select, Three, Zero, Select" trick.

Some of you guys are use to the rapid fast forward and have actually mastered it well. I can fully understand your reluctance to use another method of commercial skipping after getting so use to it. But in using the fast forward method, you have to see these ads that upset you so. One has even gone as so far as mentioning that he can't even "repeat the expletives from (his) wife when one pops up on her"!

So in an effort to rid yourselves of "HIGHLY intrusive, terrible (and) intensely irritating" ads, and maybe even keeping the peace at home, give the 30 second skip a try. You may jump into the program sometimes using it, but the "7 seconds back" button is great for this. It won't take long to get use to it!

It may take a little bit to get use to, but it's got to be better than hearing your wife curse at the tv!


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

jmoak said:


> I actually hardly see them, and if I do it's only for a fraction of a second. You see, I'm a hard core 30 second skip user.
> 
> That's right! The old "Select, Play, Select, Three, Zero, Select" trick.
> 
> So in an effort to rid yourselves of "HIGHLY intrusive, terrible (and) intensely irritating" ads, and maybe even keeping the peace at home, give the 30 second skip a try.


Until everyone starts using and forces Tivo to remove it.  Seriously, I'd use it if our main unit (Tosh SD-H400) supported it - no ttat the ads bother me.

Too bad none of the current DVR makers have the cajones or care enough about the subscribers to implement the auto commercial skip that Replay had. That's why I love Netflixing last season on DVD (Rescue Me, Entourage, MI-5, Monk, whatever) instead of on TV - no commercials, no skipping, and I can watch an entire season at my convenience in a week or so.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

jmoak said:


> _HIGHLY intrusive... down with the ads!... ads () are terrible... intensely irritating..._
> 
> I actually hardly see them, and if I do it's only for a fraction of a second. You see, I'm a hard core 30 second skip user.
> 
> That's right! The old "Select, Play, Select, Three, Zero, Select" trick.


Well my friend in the first place maybe you hardly see them but others do and in the second place the 30 second skip doesn't work on my Toshiba units.

You don't find them intensely irritating. Super. I do.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

When TiVo implements the "can't FF through these ads" is when the complaints will really fly here.


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## jmoak (Jun 20, 2000)

RoyK said:


> Well my friend in the first place maybe you hardly see them but others do and in the second place the 30 second skip doesn't work on my Toshiba units.
> 
> You don't find them intensely irritating. Super. I do.


Ahhh.... A tivo with no 30 second skip... dude, that's just not right.


The only reason I don't find them irritating is simply that I don't see them. If I had a box that would not let me skip in 30 second increments, I'd might feel the same way you do.

If you ever need a voice or a signature in trying to get Toshiba to add it, let me know. If that don't work, I'll join in with you in trying to get tivo to lay what pressure they can on them.

If my tivo's did not have the ability to skip 30 seconds at a pop..... well, I would not own a tivo. Call me crazy, but it's a "got to have it" for me.

My friend, I feel for ya. That just sucks.
:down:


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## jmoak (Jun 20, 2000)

JimSpence said:


> When TiVo implements the "can't FF through these ads" is when the complaints will really fly here.


_""can't FF through these ads"???_
I personally think that would be the ultimate in stupidity for tivo. I give them more credit than that. They can't be that moronic.

You're taking a little creative license with that "When", aren't you? If not, please point me to that statement from tivo corp. ("expert analyst speculation" does not count!)

If that's implemented, I just would not use tivo's.

They _can't_ be that stupid.


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## dgh (Jul 24, 2000)

jmoak said:


> You're taking a little creative license with that "When", aren't you? If not, please point me to that statement from tivo corp. ("expert analyst speculation" does not count!)


Does "When Pigs Fly" mean they're working on it?


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## HeyGuy (Jul 16, 2005)

RoyK said:


> A quick look at devlindark's join date shows he's new to the TiVo Community. It's reasonable to assume that to him they are new. Others of us have been enduring them for much longer. New or old many of us find them intensely irritating. Many don't. Their newness or lack thereof have nothing to do with that.


what? I dont know if that is a beef or what but all I am saying is I have seen ads like that for sometime, and if TiVo claims that to be new ad technology, well its been around.


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

RoyK said:


> Well my friend in the first place maybe you hardly see them but others do and in the second place the 30 second skip doesn't work on my Toshiba units.
> 
> You don't find them intensely irritating. Super. I do.


OK, here's a quiz question.

When you're FF'ing through the ads (without the 30-second skip feature), how long is a 30 second commercial on your screen?



Spoiler



A half second.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

pdhenry said:


> OK, here's a quiz question.
> 
> When you're FF'ing through the ads (without the 30-second skip feature), how long is a 30 second commercial on your screen?
> 
> ...


Ever get an electrical shock? Stick yourself with something sharp? How long did the discomfort last? Want it on a regular basis?


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## mick66 (Oct 15, 2004)

I don't get why so many supposedly intelligent people have to get their panties in a wad over such a non issue. Especially in a thread started by someone who didn't have a clue that the ad he saw was not what he thinks it is.

The major thing with Tivo is time shifting. You FF through a set of commercials at the speed of your choice (1xff, 2xff, 3xff). At 2xff you'd only see one of the new ads placed over a 30 second commercial for about 3 seconds and at 3xff you can cut that time in about half. While the ad is being displayed for those seconds you are still doing your timeshifting exactly as you have before. So every once in a great while you'll see something for 3 seconds that you wouldn't see otherwise, BFD. Even if every advertiser chose to use these ads on Tivo for every one of their commercials, your quality of life would not be affected. If those seconds of an ad are so obstructive and intrusive to your life, you have much bigger problems to deal with.


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## mick66 (Oct 15, 2004)

pdhenry said:


> OK, here's a quiz question.
> 
> When you're FF'ing through the ads (without the 30-second skip feature), how long is a 30 second commercial on your screen?


That all depends on if you're using 1xff, 2xff, or 3xff. I'm not sure if recording quality has anything to do with it or not.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

mick66 said:


> I don't get why so many supposedly intelligent people have to get their panties in a wad over such a non issue. Especially in a thread started by someone who didn't have a clue that the ad he saw was not what he thinks it is.
> 
> The major thing with Tivo is time shifting. You FF through a set of commercials at the speed of your choice (1xff, 2xff, 3xff). At 2xff you'd only see one of the new ads placed over a 30 second commercial for about 3 seconds and at 3xff you can cut that time in about half. While the ad is being displayed for those seconds you are still doing your timeshifting exactly as you have before. So every once in a great while you'll see something for 3 seconds that you wouldn't see otherwise, BFD. Even if every advertiser chose to use these ads on Tivo for every one of their commercials, your quality of life would not be affected. If those seconds of an ad are so obstructive and intrusive to your life, you have much bigger problems to deal with.


The ad he saw was, um well you said it, an ad. He saw it. He didn't like it. He has his opinion. I share it.

If the ads don't bother you fine. Why get "your panties in a wad?".


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## dgh (Jul 24, 2000)

RoyK said:


> He saw it. He didn't like it. He has his opinion. I share it.





devlindark said:


> All in all not that bad actually


OK.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

mick66 said:


> If those seconds of an ad are so obstructive and intrusive to your life, you have much bigger problems to deal with.


And you, sir, just crossed the line between a civil discussion and lack of civility.


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

RoyK said:


> Yes the ads that pop-up when FF thru them are terrible but at least they're brief. The ones like these (usually over promos for upcoming shows etc) appear real-time. No fast forwarding here.


At the risk of sounding repetitive, I'll repeat kbmb's question: You're upset about an ad over an ad? Why? What makes these more repulsive than the original ad? They are a means to draw your attention to additional content (or a shortcut to setting up a recording) that TiVo already has on your box. And if these are so offensive to you, why, oh why, are you sitting through them IN REAL TIME??? Why aren't you fast forwarding?

And for the record, I don't think mick66 displayed any lack of civility...



RoyK said:


> And I won't repeat the expletives from my wife when one pops up on her.


Free television ain't free. If you choose to watch advertiser-supported TV, you shouldn't be complaining about advertising. Instead, use your TiVo to timeshift everything, and fast-forward thru anything you don't want to see (whether it's commercials or really boring content).

Tim


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

TiMo Tim said:


> At the risk of sounding repetitive, I'll repeat kbmb's question: You're upset about an ad over an ad? Why? What makes these more repulsive than the original ad? They are a means to draw your attention to additional content (or a shortcut to setting up a recording) that TiVo already has on your box. And if these are so offensive to you, why, oh why, are you sitting through them IN REAL TIME??? Why aren't you fast forwarding?
> 
> And for the record, I don't think mick66 displayed any lack of civility...
> 
> ...


sigh


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

RoyK said:


> sigh


And with that, I continue on my quest to find someone who can explain in real words why TiVo-matic icons and popups are so intrusive and painful to sit through or fast-forward through. (And no, references to electric shock and pointy objects don't count, as they both can have lingering physical pain).


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

TiMo Tim said:


> And with that, I continue on my quest to find someone who can explain in real words why TiVo-matic icons and popups are so intrusive and painful to sit through or fast-forward through. (And no, references to electric shock and pointy objects don't count, as they both can have lingering physical pain).


Give up. You'll never find what you're questing for because the why is immaterial. Some find the advertising popup crap intrusive and objectionable. Fact. Period. You don't. Fact. You won't convince me that black is white and I won't try to convince you to the contrary.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

TiMo Tim said:


> Free television ain't free.


The vast majority of my channels cost me money AND have ads. Heck, movies at the megaplex have ads. My frickin' gym has banners and standees to buy Jeeps and Chryslers and fitness snake oil. My own car used to advertize the dealer that screwed me with rust protection, but I took care of that. I need to time/space shift so much more than just free TV.


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

RoyK said:


> Give up. You'll never find what you're questing for because the why is immaterial. Some find the advertising popup crap intrusive and objectionable. Fact. Period. You don't. Fact. You won't convince me that black is white and I won't try to convince you to the contrary.


I don't want/need anyone to convince me that "advertising popup crap" is "intrusive and objectionable". I just want to hear the reason why. If you can't put into words why it is so "intrusive and objectionable", then how is anyone going to take that argument seriously? If it's just a pure hatred of all advertising or self-promotion of a TiVo's features, just say so. I personally haven't had any ill effects from advertising, but maybe I'm the exception?!?

People on my side of the fence state that TiVomatic icons and popups do nothing to interfere with your navigation through the show or commercials. The commercials were there before, they're still there now. You fast-forwarded past them before, and you can still do that now.


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

davezatz said:


> The vast majority of my channels cost me money AND have ads. Heck, movies at the megaplex have ads. My frickin' gym has banners and standees to buy Jeeps and Chryslers and fitness snake oil. My own car used to advertize the dealer that screwed me with rust protection, but I took care of that. I need to time/space shift so much more than just free TV.


Except for the car dealer you mentioned (whose ads/stickers/license-plate-frames you can remove yourself), you can choose whether or not to patronize those places where you feel advertising has become a distraction. Cancel the gym membership. Skip the movie. But if you do that, tell them why.

Regardless of the channel (free vs. pay), TiVo is still there, allowing you to fast forward past anything you don't want to see.


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## jmoak (Jun 20, 2000)

TiMo Tim said:


> I don't want/need anyone to convince me that "advertising popup crap" is "intrusive and objectionable". I just want to hear the reason why.


I'd like to pose a reason, if I may. 
_(bear with me, playing devil's advocate here...)_

Ad insertion in a paid service.

It's the same thing as we saw with the "yellow star" ad's on the main menu. I myself raised a stink about them when they first appeared. It wasn't so much about them being there, it was just the idea of it. It wasn't long before I got use to them and actually found them useful sometimes. But I digress...

Now it's the "popups". It hasn't been helped by outright misleading headlines like "TiVo Will No Longer Skip Past Advertisers" which morphed into "Tivo Will No Longer Let Users Skip Commercials!!" on the pages of many "Me Too!" bloggers. Even some local tv news departments have gotten into the act of spreading this poo, spawning threads as recently as just the other week!

Considering the crappy coverage from the "Damn the truth, PROTECT MY PROFIT STREAM BY HOOK OR CROOK!" media, I can understand at least where some of the concern comes from.

With almost every salesman in the country (including Tivo!!) touting commercial skipping as one of it's main features and some folks buying them just for that reason, I can see their point.

I don't like sushi and cannot for the life of me understand why some just love it (my god, it's RAW FISH!!!.), but I'm not gonna fuss at someone for eating it.

We've all got our crosses to bear, eh?


okok, sorry 'bout carrying on like this, but I just recently stepped back and looked at this from the view of another and besides, I'm feeling literary today and have this overwhelming urge to overuse the quote key!


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## mick66 (Oct 15, 2004)

spaced said:


> ads make things free, and paying makes them go away.


Really? How many of those cable/satellite channels with commercial advertising are you getting for free?


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## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

So is there a picture of the new ads in this thread or isn't there?


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

HDTiVo said:


> So is there a picture of the new ads in this thread or isn't there?


There is not. Just confused people.


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

jmoak said:


> With almost every salesman in the country (except Tivo) touting commercial skipping as one of it's main features and some folks buying them just for that reason, I can see their point.


Actually, according to this thread, coincidentally started by yours truly, TiVo is now using the "skip commercials" line in their advertising.

However, I think part of the problem here is that for many anti-ads-at-all-costs people, they erroneously equate "skip commercials" with "skip ads". "I bought TiVo to skip commercials, and now they're cramming more down my throat, dammit!"


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## dgh (Jul 24, 2000)

TiMo Tim said:


> However, I think part of the problem here is that for many anti-ads-at-all-costs people, they erroneously equate "skip commercials" with "skip ads". "I bought TiVo to skip commercials, and now they're cramming more down my throat, dammit!"


Also, perhaps they failed to notice the part in the service agreement that says they can change the service any time they like.

When I bought lifetime a little over 5 years ago, I seriously considered whether the service would become intolerably ad-infested before the 20-month break-even. Now it's about 63 months later and the ads haven't become anywhere near as bad as I feared.


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## jmoak (Jun 20, 2000)

TiMo Tim said:


> Actually, according to this thread, coincidentally started by yours truly, TiVo is now using the "skip commercials" line in their advertising.


Thank You Sir! I stand corrected!


TiMo Tim said:


> However, I think part of the problem here is that for many anti-ads-at-all-costs people, they erroneously equate "skip commercials" with "skip ads". "I bought TiVo to skip commercials, and now they're cramming more down my throat, dammit!"


As Crackhead Bob sez, "Dat's It!"
Although I too see "ads" and "commercials" as interchangable terms.

Now I fully realize that I may be wrong with that, but I can't stand sushi either!

Your last sentence sums up the apparent feelings of those who are so upset over the icon insertions quite well, I might add. We may not agree with them, but there you go.


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## Kanyon71 (Feb 13, 2003)

TiMo Tim said:


> And with that, I continue on my quest to find someone who can explain in real words why TiVo-matic icons and popups are so intrusive and painful to sit through or fast-forward through. (And no, references to electric shock and pointy objects don't count, as they both can have lingering physical pain).


Because for Free TV it sure cost's me a lot each month. The cost of the Tivo, the cost of the monthlhy service (don't even start of the lifetime) then my Sat bill every month. I for one don't like being forced to see something I don't want to see when I hve to pay for on top of it. Yes the commercials in the movie theater REALLY annoy me also. The Tivo stuff bothers me but I live with it. Though I have honestly notied it a LOT more over the past couple of weeks. Not sure why but they seem to be popping up a ton lately where before I never really noticed them.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

TiMo Tim said:


> Actually, according to this thread, coincidentally started by yours truly, TiVo is now using the "skip commercials" line in their advertising.
> 
> However, I think part of the problem here is that for many anti-ads-at-all-costs people, they erroneously equate "skip commercials" with "skip ads". "I bought TiVo to skip commercials, and now they're cramming more down my throat, dammit!"


Huh?

com·mer·cial Audio pronunciation of "commercial" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (k-mûrshl)
adj.

1.
1. Of or relating to commerce: a commercial loan; a commercial attaché.
2. Engaged in commerce: a commercial trucker.
3. Involved in work that is intended for the mass market: a commercial artist.
2. Of, relating to, or being goods, often unrefined, produced and distributed in large quantities for use by industry.
3. Having profit as a chief aim: a commercial book, not a scholarly tome.
4. Sponsored by an advertiser or supported by advertising: commercial television.

n.

A paid advertisement on television or radio.

ad·ver·tise·ment Audio pronunciation of "advertisement" ( P ) Pronunciation Key (dvr-tzmnt, d-vûrts-, -tz-)
n.

1. The act of advertising.
2. A notice, such as a poster or a paid announcement in the print, broadcast, or electronic media, 
designed to attract public attention or patronage.

Sort of looks to me like the definition of "commercial" (noun) is "paid advertisement"


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

(credit to your source?)

OK, so a commercial is an advertisement. Not all between-program, non-program content is a commercial-- public service announcements, for example. But we call them "commercials", just because they're filler. We want to fast forward past them, and we do.

However, not all advertising is a commercial. We have network "bugs" (static and animated), TiVomatic icons, pop-ups, etc.

That's the point I'm making. TiVo still lets you skip (fast-forward) "commercials". TiVo does not promise to let you skip all advertising.


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

Well guys for all of you whom seem to know that these are not the new ads
do you have anything to show me that they aren't?

I have had my Tivo for only 1 1/2 years now and this is the first Tivo Piture ad I have ever seen
- I have seen the thumbs up by itself for some time now
but for all of my Tivo viewing this is the first time ever that the Thumbs up has been accompanied by a static addtional picture ad as well.

Thus the reason for this post

so if you got something to show me otherwise please do so


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

devlindark said:


> I have had my Tivo for only 1 1/2 years now and this is the first Tivo Piture ad I have ever seen
> - I have seen the thumbs up by itself for some time now
> but for all of my Tivo viewing this is the first time ever that the Thumbs up has been accompanied by a static addtional picture ad as well.


Yeah... I've never see picture ads before. Not sure what prompted TurtleBoy's condescending comment about us being confused - perhaps he's been getting those types of ads longer than the rest of us. (And yes, I know there are _other_ FF banner ads in the pipeline - which we previously encountered a few months ago when they were broken.)

Regardless, it's pathetic how these conversations deteriorate into attacks on someone's competence or perspective. I'm not egocentric enough to tell anyone my opinion on ads is the right one or should be the only one, yet that's what I see every time this topic comes up. Instead of sharing perspectives, it becomes a battle of who is right/wrong.


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

davezatz said:


> Yeah... I've never see picture ads before. Not sure what prompted TurtleBoy's condescending comment about us being confused - perhaps he's been getting those types of ads longer than the rest of us. (And yes, I know there are _other_ FF banner ads in the pipeline - which we previously encountered a few months ago when they were broken.)


But those are back, are they not?

You know there are two different things, but does the OP?


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## dgh (Jul 24, 2000)

Turtleboy said:


> You know there are two different things, but does the OP?


I think the confusion is that there are "two and a half" different things: There was the original simple pre-defined thumbs up icon, there is the enhanced version of this with the customized bitmap below and there is the FF banner.

I think of this as "the old thing" but it is slightly different.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

Today's Tivo press release for discussion:

08/01/2005

TiVo Launches Direct Response Interactive Advertising Program

Offering Delivers Dramatically Increased Response Rate for Advertisers

ALVISO, Calif.  August 01, 2005  TiVo Inc. (NASDAQ: TIVO ), a leader and the creator in advertising solutions and television services for digital video recorders (DVRs), today announced that five recognizable brands have agreed to use its innovative, next generation advertising technology solution for direct response programs. The five companies are: Ameriquest, E*TRADE FINANCIAL, Nautilus, Inc., Novartis, and Tylenol.

The features of the new direct response interactive advertising solution will enable these select advertisers to insert a customized call to action or branded "tag" in their commercial spots, eliminating the need for long form advertising content and leading to a better response rate over traditional direct mail campaigns. Participating in the direct response campaign, advertisers will have the ability to further engage their target audience.

Dave Courtney, Executive Vice President, Group Executive, Corporate Products & Services , and CFO at TiVo commented, "TiVo continues to lead the advertising industry in technological advancements and innovative advertising solutions by enabling advertisers to reach the most interested and highest value consumer. These new features allow TiVo to partner with leading pharmaceutical and financial companies with significant experience in the direct response space."

As part of the expanded offering, Ameriquest, E*TRADE FINANCIAL, Nautilus, Inc., Novartis, and Tylenol each are first time users of the interactive solution. With the opportunity to provide more information and special offers to further engage a highly valuable target audience, these advertisers will be able to reach over 1 million TiVo Series2 subscribers.

"E*TRADE's marketing model is based on a test-and-learn approach, which provides us with innovative ways to reach our target, value-driven customer," said Nicholas Utton, Chief Marketing Officer, E*TRADE FINANCIAL. "Our motto, to challenge the ordinary, compels us to work with a broad spectrum of partners and technologies, like TiVo and direct response technology, to expose television viewers to our unique brand and value proposition."

According to Mr. Courtney, "TiVo provides the only DVR platform to effectively enhance TV advertising using an interactive lead generation program. TiVo is committed to providing our advertisers with the information they need to know about what type of content their target audience is voluntarily viewing and what types of interactive advertising features can enhance their advertising messages."


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## Ereth (Jun 16, 2000)

This is an important point here:

"TiVo is committed to providing our advertisers with the information they need to know about what type of content their target audience is voluntarily viewing and what types of interactive advertising features can enhance their advertising messages."

The viewer has the choice to view the additional ad or not. If the viewer chooses to do so, that information is quite useful to the advertiser. Here is someone who actually is interested, at least minimally, in their message. If they choose NOT to view it, that's info for the advertiser, too. Was the ad bad? Is the target market wrong, etc? They can learn to improve their ads so that we WANT to watch them.

I'm ok with all of that. Ads for things I'm actually interested in do not annoy me. The choice to view more information is mine, and it's the same choice as going to the companies web site to get more info. It provides the advertiser with feedback, and provides the viewer with options. 

Since we all know TV is ad supported, the addition of a Tivomatic icon over an ad should provide no downside. You were already skipping past the ad, and ignoring the content. Continue ignoring the icon and nothing changes. 

I see this as a positive, really. More revenue for TiVo, more choices for us, and maybe ads that are actually interesting to watch. Everybody wins.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

TiMo Tim said:


> (credit to your source?)


Sure. Should have put it in above.
http://dictionary.reference.com


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

davezatz said:


> Regardless, it's pathetic how these conversations deteriorate into attacks on someone's competence or perspective. I'm not egocentric enough to tell anyone my opinion on ads is the right one or should be the only one, yet that's what I see every time this topic comes up. Instead of sharing perspectives, it becomes a battle of who is right/wrong.


Couldn't have said it better myself.

Far too much "if you don't see it my way you're (you name it) since my way is obviously the only way" attitude around here. But then that seems to pervade society in general. Read the letters to the editor in your local paper for more prime examples.

Thanks.

Roy


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

davezatz said:


> Today's Tivo press release for discussion:
> 
> 08/01/2005
> 
> ...


My hat is off to Dave, or rather his sales types. First generate a subscriber base by touting the ability to skip commercials (which I'd bet the majority of TiVo users do on a regular basis) as a benefit then sell commercials by telling the advertisers that their customer base is the "most interested and highest value consumer".

Neat trick -- as long as they can get away with it.

Roy


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## Stainless Steele (Feb 2, 2004)

Well if that is what it will be then I guess it could be wrose! I can live with it.


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

Ereth said:


> Since we all know TV is ad supported, the addition of a Tivomatic icon over an ad should provide no downside. You were already skipping past the ad, and ignoring the content. Continue ignoring the icon and nothing changes.


But ignoring the icon isn't possible for some. The icons are "intrusive and objectionable", and cause spouses to use expletives to voice their displeasure.

And that, we (and by "we", I mean "I" and probably some others) will never understand.


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## dgh (Jul 24, 2000)

I'm sure that there's someone out there who finds the fact that TiVo contains electronics to be intrusive and objectionable, and will never understand that either. You can't please everyone. Hopefully they please enough people.


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

Maybe it's just me... maybe I'm too easy-going.

I watch TV. I see a commercial break starting, so I fast-forward. Hey, there's one of those thumbs-up icons. It's gone now. I wonder what that one was for? Another commercial flying by. Probably just one more before I stop fast forwarding. There's the show. <Click> Oooh, got it pretty close, only a few seconds of the last commercial to sit through. Now, back to the show.


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## HeyGuy (Jul 16, 2005)

I believe the person who turned this into a yelling match was RoyK, I mean I just added to the post about this ad technology and he goes ballistic, literally.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

HeyGuy said:


> I believe the person who turned this into a yelling match was RoyK, I mean I just added to the post about this ad technology and he goes ballistic, literally.


Quote:

Your first post on the subject:
Originally Posted by HeyGuy
funny, i have encountered those ads since december of 04, Now they say it is new? how strange, I have encountered many commercials with the thumbs up for more info for close to 9 months now.
===================
My response:
A quick look at devlindark's join date shows he's new to the TiVo Community. It's reasonable to assume that to him they are new. Others of us have been enduring them for much longer. New or old many of us find them intensely irritating. Many don't. Their newness or lack thereof have nothing to do with that.
===================

Ballistic?


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## HeyGuy (Jul 16, 2005)

yes, IMO my first post about how TiVo is claiming new tech when its not, and you ream me for it, yes, thanks for providing the text.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

HeyGuy said:


> yes, IMO my first post about how TiVo is claiming new tech when its not, and you ream me for it, yes, thanks for providing the text.


If you found that comment offensive you have my apology. It certainly wasn't intended to "ream" you or anyone else.


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## HeyGuy (Jul 16, 2005)

I fully accept, but obviously you thought I was saying that a certain member was clueless or was not up to date with TiVo news, not the case, I intended my message to be about TiVo Inc. claiming new ad technology when I have seen the same or very similar ads for about 9 months now.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

HeyGuy said:


> I fully accept, but obviosuly you thought I was saying that a certain member was clueless or was not up to date with TiVo news, not the case, I intended my message to be about TiVo Inc. claiming new ad technology when I have seen the same or very similar ads for about 9 months now.


That was indeed my reading of your post. Had I read it the way you state it here I wouldn't have responded at all. The claiming of a "new technology" by a company is routine fluff to be routinely taken with a grain of salt IMO.

Either way to state that I went "ballistic" just isn't the fact.


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## Stu_Bee (Jan 15, 2002)

So I read this entire thread hoping to see a pic of the new pop-up ads. 
The only pic was the re-vamped Thumbs Up ad icon.

If anyone sees anything else please post.

So far the only Thumbs Up things I ever see are the old ones that appear on the Encore channel. For some reason, they are always half off the screen. like this:


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

Stu_Bee said:


> So I read this entire thread hoping to see a pic of the new pop-up ads.
> The only pic was the re-vamped Thumbs Up ad icon.
> 
> If anyone sees anything else please post.
> ...


Any chance you have your TV set to a different aspect ratio, or that it is on a zoom setting? That is the only reason I can think of that they would look like that. 

Dylan


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

Turtleboy said:


> Those aren't the new ads.


So I have read the whole thread, and I feel I usually keep up pretty well on what is going on at TiVo, but I think I might have missed something here. Why are these not the new ads? I know they do not look like the huge ad that some people saw on the test run, and that the new ads were only supposed to show up on fast forward...but I figure the test run was just that a test, and that some things could have changed between then and now. Besides, didn't TiVoOpsMgr say that the design and placement of the bugs was left up to the advertiser, as long as they stayed within some guidelines?

I always thought that the thumbs up combined with a banner for the product, sensibly placed in one corner of the screen, made the most sense. I also thought they should show up even when I am not fast forwarding. I mean imagine it is the first commercial of the break, and it immediately catches my attention so I do not fast forward. It seems crazy that I would never know that my TiVo was just dying to show me more information about the product...if only I had fast forwarded through the ad.

So the people that are saying this is not the new ad, are you saying that just because it does not look like the one for The Negotiator that was tested a few months ago, or is there something else that was supposed to be part of the new ads that I am missing?

Sorry for the long post, but it would be nice if someone spelled this out for me. Thanks.

Dylan


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

dylanemcgregor said:


> Any chance you have your TV set to a different aspect ratio, or that it is on a zoom setting? That is the only reason I can think of that they would look like that.
> 
> Dylan


Now that you mention it I went back and looked at the pic devlindark posted (3rd message in this thread) Looks to me like it also is mostly outside the picture area.
Strange


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

RoyK said:


> Now that you mention it I went back and looked at the pic devlindark posted (3rd message in this thread) Looks to me like it also is mostly outside the picture area.
> Strange


Well the one that devlindark posted seems to be a complete ad to my eyes with a box around it and everything, but it is not as long as the original thumbmatic ads. Stu_Bee I would say definitely has his ad cut off for some reason, right through the word record. I think this is most likely a TV setting, but I could be wrong.


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## Stu_Bee (Jan 15, 2002)

dylanemcgregor said:


> Well the one that devlindark posted seems to be a complete ad to my eyes with a box around it and everything, but it is not as long as the original thumbmatic ads. Stu_Bee I would say definitely has his ad cut off for some reason, right through the word record. I think this is most likely a TV setting, but I could be wrong.


I'd have to say that it's not the TV setting. You'll notice in the pic that the Encore Love banner at the bottom looks correct. Also all my Tivo banners and guide look fine too (centered, not cut off). The Comcast banner that momentarily appears from the Digital cable box when the channel changes looks fine as well.

I've included a pic of my menu screen for comparison with your Tivo's.

It's an AT&Tivo with Comcast Digital.
----
I had a theory that they changed the location of the ThumbsUp on the screen for the upcoming new icon type/size. But if I'm the only one getting this...I guess not.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

dylanemcgregor said:


> Well the one that devlindark posted seems to be a complete ad to my eyes with a box around it and everything, but it is not as long as the original thumbmatic ads. Stu_Bee I would say definitely has his ad cut off for some reason, right through the word record. I think this is most likely a TV setting, but I could be wrong.


Take another look. In devilindark's photo the TV image (not the ad) isn't filling the whole screen. Like viewing a non-hd image on a hd set without zooming.

The Ad's lower left corner seems to be in about the same position on the tv image as the lower left of the ad in Stu_Bee's. If the tv image in devilindark's photo were zoomed to fill the whole screen the ad in his picture would also be cut off.


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## dgh (Jul 24, 2000)

RoyK said:


> Take another look. In devilindark's photo the TV image (not the ad) isn't filling the whole screen. Like viewing a non-hd image on a hd set without zooming.


It just looks letterboxed to me.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

dgh said:


> It just looks letterboxed to me.


Thanks
Couldn't think of the word. Still zoom it to the whole screen and ad is cut off (not that there's anything wrong with that)


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

This is just the beginning! Just wait until you start seeing "Press Thumbs Up to see more about Jack Bower's shoes" icons popping up during 24.  

Seriously these things are used so rarely that I'm kind of excited when I see one. If they do ever get to the point where they're common I'll be fine with them as long as they don't cover up enough of the screen to prevent me from timing my FF correctly. And if you really don't like them now... turn on 30 second skip!  

Dan


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

RoyK said:


> Now that you mention it I went back and looked at the pic devlindark posted (3rd message in this thread) Looks to me like it also is mostly outside the picture area.
> Strange


What you are seeing is the paused commercial of the new movie Stealth
which is Displaying in Wide Screen nothing else

there is nothing wrong with the picture other than i wish it was High def


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

dylanemcgregor said:


> So I have read the whole thread, and I feel I usually keep up pretty well on what is going on at TiVo, but I think I might have missed something here. Why are these not the new ads?
> Dylan


Thank you Thank you Thank you

someone gets it finally
I post a picture and people say that isn't it
but yet they have nothing to offer to the contrary


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## dgh (Jul 24, 2000)

devlindark said:


> I post a picture and people say that isn't it
> but yet they have nothing to offer to the contrary


I can't imagine that this is "it" because "it" was supposed to "suck" according to you 

I do think there will be other FF ads in the future. They just haven't been spotted yet. If they never do, well that will be much ado about nothing once again on the TCF.


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

devlindark said:


> Thank you Thank you Thank you
> 
> someone gets it finally
> I post a picture and people say that isn't it
> but yet they have nothing to offer to the contrary


Because I've seen something like that before.

Because the "new ads" that are really getting people upset are the static images that appear *WHILE YOU FAST FORWARD!!!!!!!*.

What you posted is something different.


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## LiveBlues (Oct 30, 2001)

Add me to the list of those that don't really care. They won't bother me in the least. I might actually click on some of them if I ever see one (and it interests me). For those that it really seems to bother a lot, sorry. But I think that you are going to see more of them. It is inevitable that something will change when we all skip the ads.

RoyK, I understand that you are passionate about this subject and that is fine by me. I have a question though. Do you read magazines? If not, is it because of the ads? If you do, do all of the ads annoy you as much as these do? I see these as much the same. I glance at them, and 99.5% (maybe 99.6%, I've never really calculated it) of the time, I turn the page and it is about the furthest thing from my mind.


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## ltucci1924 (Jul 24, 2005)

HI: I often see the thumbs up at the top of my screen and it says if you want to record this show press the thumbs up. I think it is very helpful. I never saw an add when using my 30 second skip. I have a philips 708 80 GB 70 hour record with 6.2 software. I am new here and have only had the 708 for about 2 weeks now and am very impressed with it. I gave the VCR and all the tape away to a nice neighbor and could never go back to VHS tapes. LOL.

OH I put the 30 second skip in as well as the time. Great two features.


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

dgh said:


> I can't imagine that this is "it" because "it" was supposed to "suck" according to you
> 
> I do think there will be other FF ads in the future. They just haven't been spotted yet. If they never do, well that will be much ado about nothing once again on the TCF.


Thinking isn't knowing. and most of you have stated that these aren't it
but yet you offer nothing more than your opinion


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

Turtleboy said:


> Because I've seen something like that before.
> 
> Because the "new ads" that are really getting people upset are the static images that appear *WHILE YOU FAST FORWARD!!!!!!!*.
> 
> What you posted is something different.


Well then what are these mystery ad's you say exsist. I am not saying there may not be some, but this add is clearly seen and read while fast forwarding 
and if you pause it the Thumbs up continues to change saying press for more info

so where are these ad's

I said that I thought they were only going to be when you FF, but these might be it, I came with a picture that is new as it is the first I have ever seen in 1 1/2 years and you come with an opinion and nothing more.

so to bluntly say "these aren't it" isn't anymore true than me saying these are the ad's and this is all it will be guys


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## skanter (May 28, 2003)

RoyK said:


> We agree that they are unwanted additions.
> 
> I accept but differ ,however, with your opinion that they are not intrusive. I find them HIGHLY intrusive. And I won't repeat the expletives from my wife when one pops up on her.
> 
> ...


One solution is to stop using FF and use 30 sec skip instead. I've always used 30SS, never saw one of these commercials...


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

dgh said:


> I can't imagine that this is "it" because "it" was supposed to "suck" according to you
> 
> I do think there will be other FF ads in the future. They just haven't been spotted yet. If they never do, well that will be much ado about nothing once again on the TCF.


Yes the thought of anymore advertising to me sucks, but if this is it then I really don't care anymore - now if turtleboy is right and there are some outlandish banner ads like I had previously believed there would be they might very well suck!

these are not much to worry about , hell I thought getting to see the first few min of Stealth was a Genius Idea by them. I would like to see more Tivo exclusive things like that worked in, making it not so much advertisement but a sort of service you enjoy which is what it is all about.


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## Stu_Bee (Jan 15, 2002)

devlindark said:


> Thinking isn't knowing. and most of you have stated that these aren't it
> but yet you offer nothing more than your opinion


There's always the possibility that the people with strong opinions that this is not the new static ad's, were part of a Tivo Beta. If this is true, then they are under a NDA not to discuss there participation in the beta, nor even acknowledge that they are part of beta testing.

Tivo usually has a Beta test program for new features before rolling them out..whether they did it for this one or not is unknown to me.

Just thought I'd add a bit of conspiracy theory


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## mick66 (Oct 15, 2004)

devlindark said:


> Well then what are these mystery ad's you say exsist. I am not saying there may not be some, but this add is clearly seen and read while fast forwarding
> and if you pause it the Thumbs up continues to change saying press for more info
> 
> so where are these ad's
> ...


"These aren't it" because they (the "new" ads) have not been put into use yet.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

skanter said:


> One solution is to stop using FF and use 30 sec skip instead. I've always used 30SS, never saw one of these commercials...


As I replied to another who suggested this I would certainly use tho 30ss were that an option. Unfortunately it isn't with my Toshiba box.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

LiveBlues said:


> RoyK, I understand that you are passionate about this subject and that is fine by me. I have a question though. Do you read magazines? If not, is it because of the ads? If you do, do all of the ads annoy you as much as these do? I see these as much the same. I glance at them, and 99.5% (maybe 99.6%, I've never really calculated it) of the time, I turn the page and it is about the furthest thing from my mind.


Oh my. Magazines are even worse. All those blasted inserts getting in the way. If I'm reading my own copy surgery is necessary to remove them before I can even begin.

Actually I read far fewer these days since many of them are available on the internet where thanks to firefox and adblock I can read them -- ad free.


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

devlindark said:


> these are not much to worry about , hell I thought getting to see the first few min of Stealth was a Genius Idea by them. I would like to see more Tivo exclusive things like that worked in, making it not so much advertisement but a sort of service you enjoy which is what it is all about.


That is how I have always thought of these, as an added part of the service. Sure most the time it is a part of the service that does not interest me very much, but sometimes something cool comes along. Like the 'Drink' Yellow Star ad from a couple of months ago, I thought that was pretty interesting.



mick66 said:


> "These aren't it" because they (the "new" ads) have not been put into use yet.


I thought the press release from a couple of weeks ago said just the opposite, that they had launched these new ads, and that GM and The WB were the first to use them. In fact in the sticky thread a few people mentioned seeing one for Saturn. I realize that Stealth is not a Warner Brothers film, so I guess that is one way to know that this ad is not one of the new ads. But the description of the Saturn ad sounded pretty similar. Unfortunately no one has snapped a picture of that one yet.

Dylan


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

devlindark said:


> Well then what are these mystery ad's you say exsist. I am not saying there may not be some, but this add is clearly seen and read while fast forwarding
> and if you pause it the Thumbs up continues to change saying press for more info
> 
> so where are these ad's
> ...


I saw them when they first tried them out, but at to pull them b/c of the glitch.

The ads that are only visible when you fast forward, are only visible when you fast forward.

If you could see these when you aren't fast forwarding, then you are seeing something different.

I feel like I'm arguing with a flat earther.


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

Turtleboy said:


> I saw them when they first tried them out, but at to pull them b/c of the glitch.
> 
> The ads that are only visible when you fast forward, are only visible when you fast forward.
> 
> If you could see these when you aren't fast forwarding, then you are seeing something different.


So because you saw something that had to pulled because of a glitch 
you say this can't be it? Is it possible these are it, as it was only a week later that they broke the news again and again on TV that they were coming and suprisingly we get this new ad never seen before?

"let me say that I could be wrong, but this ad seems to be a better Idea
than just fast forward as it comes up in real time, stays clear in fast forward and contiues to work in pause



Turtleboy said:


> I feel like I'm arguing with a flat earther.


As usual when you diehards don't agree you resort to petty insults


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

mick66 said:


> "These aren't it" because they (the "new" ads) have not been put into use yet.


Again I ask this question "how do you know this?"


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## dgh (Jul 24, 2000)

Patience, Grasshopper.


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

devlindark said:


> "let me say that I could be wrong, but this ad seems to be a better Idea
> than just fast forward as it comes up in real time, stays clear in fast forward and contiues to work in pause


Have to agree with devlindark here, this seems a much better implementation than the ads that were tested. The only visible on fast forward, while I know that that was mentioned here when the ads were first announced, seems like bad implementation, especially if you can not easily get to the content in another way. Which has been true with the constant rotating of the yellow star ads.

Having said that, I agree that these are not the new ads...not because of the FF thing, but because the distributor of Stealth is not one of the initial customers of the new ads. Here is a link to the PR with the customers of the new ads. I believe this is in addition to GM and The WB, but I might be wrong.

http://biz.yahoo.com/prnews/050801/sfm033a.html?.v=1


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

devlindark said:


> So because you saw something that had to pulled because of a glitch
> you say this can't be it? Is it possible these are it, as it was only a week later that they broke the news again and again on TV that they were coming and suprisingly we get this new ad never seen before?
> 
> "let me say that I could be wrong, but this ad seems to be a better Idea
> ...


I don't think it was an insult... I think you may just be the most misunderstood person on the forum today. It all stems from your posting style, the likes of which have never been seen here before.

Please take the time to re-read (and edit) your posts before submitting. Organize thoughts into sentences. Add some punctuation where appropriate. We've seen you do it-- some of the recent posts here are readable-- but it sometimes appears as though two different people are typing your posts, inserting thoughts at random.


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

misunderstood

YES I AGREE


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

how this can be interpreted is anyone's game

_The features of the new direct response interactive advertising solution will enable these select advertisers to insert a customized call to action or branded "tag" in their commercial spots, eliminating the need for long form advertising content and leading to a better response rate over traditional direct mail campaigns._ - Tivo inc.

*Call to action Branded Tag:*
To me that is what I am seeing right now with the stealth ad
and I saw the same style of ad for a Chevy commercial

*Eliminating the need for long form advertising content*:
This is to me up in the air for another whole thread discussion
as to what they are talking about, could it be that they are going 
to shorten the commercials? I highly doubt it but who knows
anyone here have any idea what that statement actually means?

again nothing in that article says anything about when they will show up - and does not 
even speak of Fast Forward. Probably for good reason but just something else to think about


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

Fine, so there was some confusion.

Was what you took a picture of slightly different from the ipreviews (f/k/a Tivomatic) that have been there for years? Yes. Hooray.

But you've been here for less than a month. For the past 6 months we've been getting, "OMFG TIVO ISN'T GOING TO LET ME SKIP ADS ANYMORE!!!" or "Tivo is going to insert ads over my fast forwarding!!! WTF??!!!"

Those threads have been endless and annoying. When people talk about "the new ads" that is what they are and always have been talking about. Not the slightly different iPreviews.

So when you say, "I have a picture of the new ads" and people say, "no, those aren't them. The new ads are the static billboards that appear when you fast forward and are different," well, the new ads are static billboards that appear when you fast forward and are different.

I don't know what else you want.


----------



## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

TiVo said:


> The features of the new direct response interactive advertising solution will enable these select advertisers to insert a customized call to action or branded "tag" in their commercial spots, eliminating the need for long form advertising content and leading to a better response rate over traditional direct mail campaigns.


Taken in context, it looks like this means that advertisers won't have to use "long form advertising content", whatever that means. Maybe it means there won't be as much junk mail in our mailbox. They're allowing TiVo users to "click" on their ad spot to request more info, instead of mass-mailing it. It doesn't mean they'll be shortening commercials.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

TiMo Tim said:


> Taken in context, it looks like this means that advertisers won't have to use "long form advertising content", whatever that means. Maybe it means there won't be as much junk mail in our mailbox. They're allowing TiVo users to "click" on their ad spot to request more info, instead of mass-mailing it. It doesn't mean they'll be shortening commercials.


You wish. 
As I understand the sequence you click on the ad requesting more info. You are then asked if you authorize your contact info to be sent so that they can provide the info. According to TiVo's privacy policy ( http://www.tivo.com/5.11.3.asp )your "contact information' will be sent to the advertisor (or advertising agency).

Your contact info comprises "your name, address, telephone number, and e-mail address."

Now the ad agency has you marked as the type who is likely to respond to ads.

Lists of responders to ads are sold far and wide so you'll soon be on everybody's mailing list.

Also your email address will be on the lists of responders. Here comes the spam.

Your phone number is also sent. Since you initiated the contact with the advertisor (or agency) they don't have to comply with the do-not-call law as far as you are concerned.

Enjoy your "convenient" ads


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

RoyK said:


> You wish.
> As I understand the sequence you click on the ad requesting more info. You are then asked if you authorize your contact info to be sent so that they can provide the info. According to TiVo's privacy policy ( http://www.tivo.com/5.11.3.asp )your "contact information' will be sent to the advertisor (or advertising agency).
> 
> Your contact info comprises "your name, address, telephone number, and e-mail address."
> ...


Now if this is true then the end result of clicking on an ad will indeed suck


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

Turtleboy said:


> Fine, so there was some confusion.
> 
> Was what you took a picture of slightly different from the ipreviews (f/k/a Tivomatic) that have been there for years? Yes. Hooray.
> 
> ...


What I said in the begining of this post was this

_Well I got a piture of what I believe is the new ad's Tivo will be putting in with commercials_

This post had nothing to do with complaining about the ad's and was just the oposite, I submited a picture of what I believe might be the ad's 
and I went on to change my opinion IF this is ALL THEY ARE. 
nothing more.

you jumped in with No those aren't. so do you have a picture of what you claim to be the FF ad's?

anyway soon enough we will all all either see or not see a different form of ad


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

Turtleboy said:


> Fine, so there was some confusion.
> 
> Was what you took a picture of slightly different from the ipreviews (f/k/a Tivomatic) that have been there for years? Yes. Hooray.


Been around for years? maybe the Thumbs up itself
but with that ad below it? I have had my Tivo for 1 1/2 years
and this is the first one I have ever seen

whatever you want to call it - I would label this as new


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

devlindark said:


> Now if this is true then the end result of clicking on an ad will indeed suck


This is not the initial click. You can view all of the information that TiVo has on the machine, including whatever long form video there is, without having TiVo give out your info. It is only if you request more information, by clicking on a link, and then confirming that you want TiVo to share your information, that you will get sent anything at all. So all of that is your choice.

It would be nice if TiVo would only do business with advertisers who agree not to sell or share your information with others, so that you could click on an ad to get information on one product without having to worry about getting bombarded with direct mailings...but I do not know if this is what they actually do.

I do not worry about it much since TiVo has no personal info of mine to share. [/shrug]


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## dt_dc (Jul 31, 2003)

short form vs. long form advertisements

It's a bit fuzzy where the exact line is ... as is often the case with industry buzzwords ... especially marketing buzzwords.

This gives you a good idea of the difference:
http://www.allbusiness.com/blog/BetterLocalMarketing/3992/002686.html


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## Leo Valiant (Apr 19, 2000)

devlindark said:


> do you have a picture of what you claim to be the FF ad's?


Here's a picture of a FF ad from a few months back when they were testing them in the wild.

http://www.engadget.com/entry/1234000100038148/


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

dylanemcgregor said:


> It would be nice if TiVo would only do business with advertisers who agree not to sell or share your information with others, so that you could click on an ad to get information on one product without having to worry about getting bombarded with direct mailings...but I do not know if this is what they actually do.
> 
> I do not worry about it much since TiVo has no personal info of mine to share. [/shrug]


Note the recent (posted since yesterday) addition to the privacy policy...

"TiVo intends to make available new services in the future. These services will be governed by the privacy policies of the respective service providers."


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## jmoak (Jun 20, 2000)

RoyK said:


> Note the recent (posted since yesterday) addition to the privacy policy...
> 
> "TiVo intends to make available new services in the future. These services will be governed by the privacy policies of the respective service providers."


that's in reference to the new "TiVo content delivery service ("CDS") ".

IPTV?!??!?!


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## Guyute1210 (Jan 3, 2005)

mick66 said:


> I don't get why so many supposedly intelligent people have to get their panties in a wad over such a non issue. Especially in a thread started by someone who didn't have a clue that the ad he saw was not what he thinks it is.
> 
> The major thing with Tivo is time shifting. You FF through a set of commercials at the speed of your choice (1xff, 2xff, 3xff). At 2xff you'd only see one of the new ads placed over a 30 second commercial for about 3 seconds and at 3xff you can cut that time in about half. While the ad is being displayed for those seconds you are still doing your timeshifting exactly as you have before. So every once in a great while you'll see something for 3 seconds that you wouldn't see otherwise, BFD. Even if every advertiser chose to use these ads on Tivo for every one of their commercials, your quality of life would not be affected. If those seconds of an ad are so obstructive and intrusive to your life, you have much bigger problems to deal with.


Can i get an AMEN from the congregation!


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

Guyute1210 said:


> Can i get an AMEN from the congregation!


Unfortunately I'm sure you will.


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## tazzftw (Mar 26, 2005)

Yep, I've seen that. The way I see it, if you don't mind watching 5 seconds of fast forwarded ads, then you shouldn't mind watching 1 second of a popup ad. 

Man, have we become that picky?


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## Devedander (Sep 30, 2004)

tazzftw said:


> Yep, I've seen that. The way I see it, if you don't mind watching 5 seconds of fast forwarded ads, then you shouldn't mind watching 1 second of a popup ad.
> 
> Man, have we become that picky?


QUOTE:

Commercials take airtime away from programs. In the 1960s a typical hour-long American show would run for 51 minutes excluding commercials. Today a similar program would only be 42 minutes long. In other words, over the course of 10 hours American viewers will see approximately an hour and a half more commercials than they did in the sixties. Furthermore, if that sixties show is rerun today it is almost certain to be cut by 9 minutes to make room for the extra commercials.

END QUOTE

SOURCE: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Television_commercial#Length_and_effects_of_commercials

If you don't mind watching 60 seconds you won't mind watching 90 seconds.

If you don't mind 90 seconds of commercials you won't mind 120

If you don't mind 120 seconds you won't mind 160 seconds.

If you don't mind 160 seconds...

As long as the commercials are paying for TV... oh wait...

For those who can't understand how everyone is so picky and worried about them doing these commercial things let me just remind you of a wonderful logic tool called the slippery slope.

If you want to make a big negative change, just make it in tiny increments. The masses who don't look foward far enough to see the long term effects will always effectively drown out the few who do.

Repeat.

After all would any of us be making such a big deal or spending hundreds on these tivo boxes in the first place if commercial breaks were still only 30 seconds?

Hell I remember when I was a little kid TV commercials were kind of interesting to watch. New products and snazzy songs. I even remember when I fgot my first junk mail, who cares that it was a magazine subscription add, it was mail with MY name on it! Don't be fooled by little things that "aren't that bad" right now, a snowball rolling down a mountain isn't that bad right now either...

Don't be short sited. We love Tivo because it helped us get away from advetisers. We even paid Tivo to do it!

But like anyone else I pay to do something for me, I expect them to do it. If I pay a security guard to keep people out of my house, but he decides he will start to let a few people in who slip him a $5 I don't say "Whatever, he keeps most of the people out and he seems to choose pretty nice peopel to let it"...

You don't mind a little adverisement here and there in a service you paid largely to keep adds out? What's it feel like to be a sheep?

Oh and you know what? I do mind watching 5 seconds of fast foward adds, and I especially hate it when I have to think about the fact I paid the cable company to get them in the first place, then paid tivo to shrink them down as much as possible... I become even less happy when I realize the company I am paying to get rid of the stuff the other company I am paying forces on me is now going to force on me (in however small increments) the exact thing I am trying to get rid of...


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## tazzftw (Mar 26, 2005)

These popups appear during the commercial time that we're fast forwarding over. It's still the same amount of time to fast forward past.

You bring up some good points about the ever increasing time of commercials. Those are indeed some shocking numbers. But what does this have to do with the popups in TiVo, especially since they don't take up any additional ad time?

I didn't pay for a service to keep ads out. They're still there. Always have been, always will be. However, I do have the ability to quickly move though them at a speed much faster than a VCR. But it both cases, you can still see them. And since they're still there, what's the point of having a Tivo? Let's see.... a much easier way to record, all those live TV tricks, a full archive of shows I love that I can watch at any time. 

Don't give me wrong. I hate how commercials are getting longer (I once edited a recording I had of MXC. From beginning to end, it was 20 minutes to the second). And if this new popup thing starts appearing during actual shows, then I'll be just as angry as you are. But until then, I don't mind a popup during a commercial that I'm already fast forwarding past. 

And that sheep comment was harsh. So I'm calling you a duck.


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## Devedander (Sep 30, 2004)

tazzftw said:


> These popups appear during the commercial time that we're fast forwarding over. It's still the same amount of time to fast forward past.
> 
> You bring up some good points about the ever increasing time of commercials. Those are indeed some shocking numbers. But what does this have to do with the popups in TiVo, especially since they don't take up any additional ad time?
> 
> ...


You miss the point... these adds aren't the last thing Tivo will put in, and they are only going to get more prevalent.

And what will happen then? Someone will come along and say "hey we already had these once in a while, what's a few more?"

Then they will get bigger and cover more the screen "yeah well they are only covering up other adds anyway"

Then they wil start to be banners and corner adds during regular shows "hey it's not that bad, at least it's not the full screen crap we get during fast fowards"

Sure that's all only possibilities, but do you think the advertisers will really stop encroaching on your screen? One way or the other they want your eyeball time.

Aren't we just essentially funding the new direct marketing method? If Tivo were to say make the service free because of these adds then I would feel a little more give and take, but we pay for a service, and they turn around and sell the opposite of the service to the very people we are trying avoid.

If you don't complain when it's small it's pointless to complain when it's huge.

We can complain now and hope to have an effect because if we stop paying now Tivo is in trouble. Once Tivo is in the pockets of the advertisers we wil have almost no say.

Look at it this way: Commercial breaks used to be 30 seconds to a minute... now I am fastfowarding for about 30 seconds... so really I am still getting a 30 second disruption in my show, if Tivo fills that 30 seconds with ads what essentially happened? I paid 2 parties (tivo and the cable company) to force me into being right back where I started: 30 seconds of adds. the only difference? Now I HAVE to watch the screen to know when to hit play again... it's not even like commercials were before where I could just tune them out, I will be willingly staring right at them.

And don't count on that 30 second trick staying around forever either, you think our $7-14 a mont will override advertisers demands?


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## tazzftw (Mar 26, 2005)

Devedander said:


> You miss the point... these adds aren't the last thing Tivo will put in, and they are only going to get more prevalent.
> 
> And what will happen then? Someone will come along and say "hey we already had these once in a while, what's a few more?"
> 
> ...


Allrigh, now I see. You beleve that it'll only get worse, and that it's better to complain early than later when it'll be too late. I guess it's not who I am. I'm not a complainer at heart. If something isn't really that annoying, I don't see a reason to complain.

The 30 second trick never worked for me. I got the ding, but it never actually functioned.


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## Devedander (Sep 30, 2004)

tazzftw said:


> Allrigh, now I see. You beleve that it'll only get worse, and that it's better to complain early than later when it'll be too late. I guess it's not who I am. I'm not a complainer at heart. If something isn't really that annoying, I don't see a reason to complain.
> 
> The 30 second trick never worked for me. I got the ding, but it never actually functioned.


I don't consider myself a complainer often, but the writing is on the wall here... It's advertisers we are talking about... it's not if it will get more prevelant and get worse, but when and how...

the 30 second trick doesn' twork on some units (my sd h400 doesn't do it but it does make the ding). It's invaluable though.... wish there was some way to get it to work for you...


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## 4inziksych (Mar 1, 2003)

How to get the 30 second skip --- I'm not sure if this is correct, or if I'm just making an erroneous assumption, but I used to always get the ding and never get the skip either. Then one day I found out I could turn the Tivo sound affects off which I did because they drove me crazy, and the next time I tried to install the 30 second skip it worked. I think that somehow waiting for that ding messes people up. When I do it without the sound affects, which i Have done several times because I've unplugged the tivo, I just do it in natural time and it works. 

Hope i explained this well.


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

PVRBlog has a picture that looks pretty much like the one posted by Devlindark at the beginning of this thread, but it is for GMC, and it sounds like it is only visible on fast forward...so is this one of the new ads?

Dylan


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

dylanemcgregor said:


> PVRBlog has a picture that looks pretty much like the one posted by Devlindark at the beginning of this thread, but it is for GMC, and it sounds like it is only visible on fast forward...so is this one of the new ads?
> 
> Dylan


It would seem that it is. However note the blog entry reading:

Posted by: brian w at August 3, 2005 07:34 PM

I saw this ad last night when not fast forwarding through the ad, so basically I think I should be having the service free, if on top of $13 a month I get force fed ads.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

Devedander said:


> Look at it this way: Commercial breaks used to be 30 seconds to a minute... now I am fastfowarding for about 30 seconds... so really I am still getting a 30 second disruption in my show, if Tivo fills that 30 seconds with ads what essentially happened? I paid 2 parties (tivo and the cable company) to force me into being right back where I started: 30 seconds of adds. the only difference? Now I HAVE to watch the screen to know when to hit play again... it's not even like commercials were before where I could just tune them out, I will be willingly staring right at them.
> 
> And don't count on that 30 second trick staying around forever either, you think our $7-14 a mont will override advertisers demands?


Actually I'm amazed that the 30 second trick has lasted as long as it has. It's an undocumented "feature" that could be switched off in a heartbeat. Toshiba has already done that in fact. After all most TiVo users probably don't even know it exists since it isn't in the manual and they don't frequent forums like this.

I have no doubt whatever that when one or two big dollar advertisors dangle a fatter contract in front of TiVo on the condition that they remove the feature it will quickly disappear.

There would be, of course, a roar of outrage here. But then it will be rationalized away with comments like "what's the big deal - we can still fast forward and hey TiVo is really a time shifting service anyhow etc etc."

Then along come the really big boys - you know the ones who spend billions trying to convince us that we have disease that we don't have, promote the drugs to cure those diseases, then bribe the doctors with seminars and dinners to prescribe them to us --. They dangle more bucks on the condition that fast forwarding be disabled while their ad is on.

There would be an uproar here. But then it would be rationalized away with "well its only a couple of ads that do that" and "Yeah but TiVo is really for time shifting and it has wish lists and season passes and lots of other good stuff and...."


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

RoyK said:


> It would seem that it is. However note the blog entry reading:
> 
> Posted by: brian w at August 3, 2005 07:34 PM
> 
> I saw this ad last night when not fast forwarding through the ad, so basically I think I should be having the service free, if on top of $13 a month I get force fed ads.


Interesting. That was not there when I copied the link. George just said that it was visible during 3X and 20X FF, and not during 60X FF. I thought he would have mentioned if it was visible when not FFing.


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## azitnay (Jan 20, 2003)

RoyK said:


> Actually I'm amazed that the 30 second trick has lasted as long as it has. It's an undocumented "feature" that could be switched off in a heartbeat. Toshiba has already done that in fact. After all most TiVo users probably don't even know it exists since it isn't in the manual and they don't frequent forums like this.


True, the SD-H400 units don't have it, but the newer RS-TX units do, so it's not like it's turned off on all Toshibas. Very odd; hopefully it sticks around.



RoyK said:


> There would be an uproar here. But then it would be rationalized away with "well its only a couple of ads that do that" and "Yeah but TiVo is really for time shifting and it has wish lists and season passes and lots of other good stuff and...."


As much as I love TiVo, I can guarantee that if TiVo ever disabled fast-forwarding in any situation, that'd pretty much be the end for me. I don't see it happening, though.

Drew


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## jmoak (Jun 20, 2000)

RoyK said:


> ... the really big boys ... dangle more bucks on the condition that fast forwarding be disabled while their ad is on.
> ... it would be rationalized away with "well its only a couple of ads that do that" and "Yeah but TiVo is really for time shifting and it has wish lists and season passes and lots of other good stuff and...."


Like hell it would.

But once again, I give tivo more credit than that. They can't be that stupid. That defies everything that the brand name was built on.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

jmoak said:


> Like hell it would.
> 
> But once again, I give tivo more credit than that. They can't be that stupid. That defies everything that the brand name was built on.


\

Think not?

From the August 2 press release --

Dave Courtney, Executive Vice President, Group Executive, Corporate Products & Services , and CFO at TiVo commented, "TiVo continues to lead the advertising industry in technological advancements and innovative advertising solutions by enabling advertisers to reach the most interested and highest value consumer. These new features allow TiVo to partner with leading pharmaceutical and financial companies with significant experience in the direct response space."

Does that leave any doubt in your mind what business TiVo is in?


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## jmoak (Jun 20, 2000)

RoyK said:


> \
> 
> Think not?
> 
> ...


I have no doubt about what business they are in. I also know why I use their product over the offerings from their competitors. If they remove the benefits of the service, they loose subscribers. Without subscribers, they have no business.

If they want to add ad's that don't impact the features that I use the service for, that's fine. If they want to ad icons or banners to commercials that I'm skipping anyway, I'm fine with it. As long as they don't remove or cripple the features that attracted me to their product in the first place, I'm a happy camper.

If they remove or cripple features, I will no longer be a subscriber. It's that simple.

My last reply was to your assumption that tivo is willing to remove key features to make the big bucks and that subscribers would simply "rationalize away" these actions. I don't think they would risk running off subscribers for one. And more importantly, I don't think they want to do that kind of pr damage to their brand. (all the rationalization in the world would not quell the uproar from disabling the ability to fastforward)

But once again, I give tivo more credit than that. They can't be that stupid. Removing or limiting key features defies everything that the brand name was built on.

...and Dave Courtney's statements do not lead me to believe any differently.

And btw, I can understand your concern over the commercial icons. I don't agree, but I can see your point. (as I tried to point out in my earlier post. Heck, I even tried to explain to TiMo Tim the reason for your concern back in post #42!!!)


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

jmoak said:


> My last reply was to your assumption that tivo is willing to remove key features to make the big bucks and that subscribers would simply "rationalize away" these actions. I don't think they would risk running off subscribers for one. And more importantly, I don't think they want to do that kind of pr damage to their brand. (all the rationalization in the world would not quell the uproar from disabling the ability to fastforward)
> 
> But once again, I give tivo more credit than that. They can't be that stupid. Removing or limiting key features defies everything that the brand name was built on.
> 
> ...


Only time will tell which of us has the better crystal ball. I hope its you.


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## devlindark (Jul 20, 2005)

you guys make a good point - what is the next step from these ads

I was wathcing a show the other night and with out hitting any buttons on the remote
a Tivo message pops right up on my screen, without warning or asking me if I wanted to read
it at all. It was all about their privacy policy ect ect. Now that pissed me off big time

Yes it took me to the same menu where you read the messages and I had to hit watch Live TV to get back to my show, and it was done while I was watching a show not a commercial. So now I just missed some of my show and have to rewind it. What kind of crap it that. Sounds like Tivo is covering their own but so if you click on the Thumbs up for ads and start to get phone calls and emails and junk mail - hey we warned you.


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## jmoak (Jun 20, 2000)

RoyK said:


> Only time will tell which of us has the better crystal ball. I hope its you.


I hope so too, buddy.

If not, I hear people raving about something called "mythtv"....


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## dt_dc (Jul 31, 2003)

Devedander said:


> After all would any of us be making such a big deal or spending hundreds on these tivo boxes in the first place if commercial breaks were still only 30 seconds?


Yes ... I would.


Devedander said:


> Don't be short sited. We love Tivo because it helped us get away from advetisers. We even paid Tivo to do it!
> (...)
> You don't mind a little adverisement here and there in a service you paid largely to keep adds out? What's it feel like to be a sheep?


I don't pay Tivo to get away from advertisers ... or to keep adds out ... never did. I pay Tivo for _time_.

To watch the content that interests me in a typical hour of broadcast TV w/o Tivo I have to waste 18+ minutes of my time watching commercials (or more often, waiting for the commercials to end as I do putz around doing other things). With Tivo that gets reduced down to 20 seconds or so.

That's what _I_ pay Tivo for ... time.

Now, if Tivo extends that 20 seconds at all ... I'll be ticked. As long as they don't ... and I've seen nothing to indicate that they are ... I could care less.

Keep adds out? Much of the content I watch is thinly veiled adds ... F1, American Chopper, Big Brother, Survivor, Trading Spaces, etc.


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## tazzftw (Mar 26, 2005)

dt_dc said:


> Yes ... I would.I don't pay Tivo to get away from advertisers ... or to keep adds out ... never did. I pay Tivo for _time_.
> 
> To watch the content that interests me in a typical hour of broadcast TV w/o Tivo I have to waste 18+ minutes of my time watching commercials (or more often, waiting for the commercials to end as I do putz around doing other things). With Tivo that gets reduced down to 20 seconds or so.
> 
> ...


Thank you. Someone agrees with me. Us sheep (and for that matter, puppets) have got to stick together.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Ok. I too am one who doesn't see this as a big deal. The only time I could see being pissed about layover content (my new term) taking up a lot of screen space during a commercial (as in the picture *Devlindark* posted) is if it were to cover up a commercial such as the new one from Victoria's Secret. And, I guess I wouldn't be fast forwarding through that anyways, so I wouldn't see the layover content in the first place.

So......to sum up......If it looks like a commerical I actually want to watch, I'll rewind and watch it at normal speed (and no layover content). If it's a commercial I don't care to watch at normal speed, I'll just fast forward and make sure I don't accidentally press a button that opts me in for anything.....though from a prior poster, it sounds like you would then go to a confirmation screen to opt in formally.

Of course, i could just see someone complaining about wanting to kill their cat for stepping on their remote at just the right time to opt in to some form of advertising. LOL!


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## Stu_Bee (Jan 15, 2002)

Turtleboy said:


> I saw them when they first tried them out, but at to pull them b/c of the glitch.
> The ads that are only visible when you fast forward, are only visible when you fast forward.
> If you could see these when you aren't fast forwarding, then you are seeing something different.
> I feel like I'm arguing with a flat earther.


Maybe the OP did get the new ads after all. Here's the Shareholder meeting minutes as posted by 'dylanemcgregor'.
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=252837
=====
Q. When can we expect to see "pop-up" ads?
A. "Pop-up" ads are a misnomer. These are going to be more like little tags, that the user can select Thumbs-up for. Tivo doesn't want to impose on users some sort of forced commercial watching.
=====
Wouldn't the comment of 'little tags' make it sound like they have given up on the bigger screen ads and are going the kinder gentler way.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

Stu_Bee said:


> Maybe the OP did get the new ads after all.


Well he/we certainly did see A new type of ad. And it does have a picture and it is persistant when fast forwarding. Also you can request info be sent to you, which is something new and one of the reasons why the privacy policy was updated.

We'll see who apologizes to the new guy...


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

RoyK said:


> \
> 
> Think not?
> 
> ...


Like jmoak, I know what business they're in. What is your take on this?

I'm not sure how you're connecting the Press Release above to any restriction on current functionality. You might be right about an advertiser (do you have some grudge with drug companies?) offering bigger bucks to eliminate 30-sec-skip, but as you've pointed out, it's not core functionality-- it's an undocumented feature-- a freebie. If it goes away, we'll lose a few subscribers (die-hard 30-sec-skip users), but not a significant number.


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

devlindark said:


> I was wathcing a show the other night and with out hitting any buttons on the remote
> a Tivo message pops right up on my screen, without warning or asking me if I wanted to read
> it at all. It was all about their privacy policy ect ect. Now that pissed me off big time
> 
> Yes it took me to the same menu where you read the messages and I had to hit watch Live TV to get back to my show, and it was done while I was watching a show not a commercial. So now I just missed some of my show and have to rewind it. What kind of crap it that. Sounds like Tivo is covering their own but so if you click on the Thumbs up for ads and start to get phone calls and emails and junk mail - hey we warned you.


So you've had your TiVo for 1.5 years... I'd like to introduce you to the PTCM (Pre-TiVo-Central Message), a message of great importance that TiVo Inc. wants everyone to see. Updates to the privacy policy are a good reason to use a PTCM. Sorry that it "pissed you off big time". I don't know why it would have popped up without you hitting any buttons, but maybe you hadn't used the remote in over 30 minutes and TiVo assumed you weren't watching.

BTW, most people (at least most here) don't watch Live TV, so they wouldn't have the same inconvenience as you in having to rewind a show you're watching.


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## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

RoyK said:


> It would seem that it is. However note the blog entry reading:
> 
> Posted by: brian w at August 3, 2005 07:34 PM
> 
> I saw this ad last night when not fast forwarding through the ad, so basically I think I should be having the service free, if on top of $13 a month I get force fed ads.


  Thanks for the laugh! I love the "force feeding" comments. And the request for free service? Priceless (pun intended). He complains about being force fed an ad while not fast-forwarding that same advertiser's commercial.

TiVomatic (thumbs-up) icons have always shown up like this-- when not fast-forwarding, and when fast-forwarding (albeit for a fraction of the time).

Reminder to all: using 60x FF (3FF or >>>), a 30-second commercial flashes by in a mere one half of one second.

P.S. I don't remember who said it in the last few pages, but can we not bring up the comment about paying for cable? That's your choice. Your standalone TiVo works just fine with OTA (broadcast) TV. Thanks.


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

davezatz said:


> Also you can request info be sent to you, which is something new and one of the reasons why the privacy policy was updated.


The requesting info be sent to you is not new, but I do think it might start to be more widely used. I remember seeing it when GM was introducing a new car a couple of years ago, and you could request to have a brochure sent to you. Also there have been a couple of sweepstakes that required your consent to send your information to the advertiser. I remember a Disney cruise and some contest for a really fancy pen...I think I have seen a couple more too. I guess these Yellow Star ads really do stick with you. 

Dylan


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## Stu_Bee (Jan 15, 2002)

Got the "new ad" on my Tivo (program recorded yesterday).
Screenshot attached, but nothing new from the OP's.
Displays on Pause, Play, FF, FF2, but not FF3.

Hitting Thumbs up when the ad is displayed, pauses the program & takes you to a screen with ads like the Star Ads we see in Tivo Central. Arrowing left took me back out to where I left off in the show.

And to think I woulda missed it if I was triple-fast forwarding, instead of eating my lunch


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## ufo4sale (Apr 21, 2001)

Stu_Bee said:


> Got the "new ad" on my Tivo (program recorded yesterday).
> Screenshot attached, but nothing new from the OP's.
> Displays on Pause, Play, FF, FF2, but not FF3.
> 
> ...


It's called interactive TV, get use to it.


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## sibum (Apr 25, 2005)

spaced said:


> Roy, this is exactly like being forced to watch commercials before a movie at the theater if you paid for a ticket. In my mind, being of the Internet generation, ads make things free, and paying makes them go away. One could argue to just show up late to the movie and miss the commercials, but then you're forced to take the worst seat in the house. Same thing with TiVo... either sit through the ads, or don't use fast forward. You do have a choice!
> 
> I'm definitely with you on this one... down with the ads!


Some of you say you pay Tivo for time....I pay Tivo for a service. One part of the service is that it saves time....the other part is that I don't have to endure ton's of ads during my porgrams. I already have to watch pop-up ads across the bottom of my screen during my show....I hate that, and realize that it is not Tivo's doing, but now not only during the show, but during the commercial that I want to skip I must see and ad.....ridiculous.

I pay Tivo, as well, for convenience. I have the knowledge and ability to make my own DVR with a huge hard drive, excellent quality, and as many video cards as I have memory on the machine. Free OS, Free Software, and I can completely skip the commercials as long as I can estimate their length....not too difficult.

Tivo is simply convenient to me to not have to build it. Which in all honesty would probebly take me a couple of hours in one afternoon.

Anyone who is interested in this technology....pm me, email me...whatever, and I will send you the info.

For now I will stick with Tivo, but I think it is a horrible move, and am looking already for the parts to build my own.

Best....Tivo....I love your service, please don't mess it up.

Email me for the info...subject: Myth TV Box Instructions?

Mac


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## dgh (Jul 24, 2000)

sibum said:


> Anyone who is interested in this technology....pm me, email me...whatever, and I will send you the info.


Gee, thanks, but I think I'll just Google


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## Stu_Bee (Jan 15, 2002)

sibum said:


> but now not only during the show, but during the commercial that I want to skip I must see and ad.....ridiculous.


I had one of those ThumbsUp ad's the other day....I was fastforwarding x3 and I almost missed it...it was like a half-second display in the small top right corner of the screen. I had to rewind it and replay it several times before I realized just how upsetting this was.
Sorry, I'm being a little sarky. Some people have a lower threshold of annoyance for specific things and I should respect it. The current thumbs-up ad system is a far cry from what was originally tested (an almost full screen popup) and I don't find the current implementation annoying in the slightest....and I'm usually the picky one. Unless your just watching the commercial at regular speed ("hey it's blocking a partial view of the Ad") I don't understand the high irksome level it is causing in the few people that have posted such.

Unless sibum is seeing something else I have yet to experience.


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## timo123 (Sep 13, 2004)

What sold me on Tivo wasn't the ability to skip ads, it was the ability to not miss a show ever again due to whatever is going on in my life. The commercial skip thing was just an added bonus. As others have mentioned, as long as I can cut an hour show down to 40 minutes, who cares what Tivo decides to throw onto the screen while I'm ziping past the show break. Tivo could throw a guy in Nikes, drinking a Coke, dancing on the hood or a Ford truck, in front of a Togo's while the doublemint twins in Levi jeans watch and take pictures with their Nikon cameras during my zip past the commericals, and I could care less. As long as don't have to sit through 5 minutes of commercials anymore, it's all good. 

I realize some people hate all types of advertising, which is apparent in some of the posts here and in previous threads. But let's face it, these popups, which are not hindering your ability to skip commercial breaks in the slightest, bring revenue to Tivo, which allows them to continue to upgrade the service and provide new features at no additional cost beyond the monthly service (or no cost at all for us lifetimers). That to me is more important.


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## reachforthestars (Feb 9, 2006)

I have never seen any since I've had my tivo... do they ever use the iPreview for upcoming shows??


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