# TE3 or TE4



## KevTech (Apr 15, 2014)

Since the Tivo New Experience (Hydra) Yay/Nay thread just asks what software people prefer I thought I would see what people who visit the forum are actually using right now on their Tivo.


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## Davelnlr_ (Jan 13, 2011)

TE3. I want to be able to replace the hard drive if it goes out again, without worrying about which model, since TE4 is picky.


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## OrangeTurtle (Jul 17, 2015)

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I upgraded (finally) back in March when I got my bolt refurb and went TE4. I just went back to TE 3 last week. I like the look of grid guide on TE4 better, but I feel like the maneuvering through the menu on TE 4 is a little messier. Never been one to need live guide, but it's nice to try once in a while. I likely will go back to TE 4 at some point, but happy to be living in the past again.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

Poll fail, 
You left out "both" as an answer for those of us with multiple units, you can go back and edit that.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

TE3. I'm too used to it to switch.


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## KevTech (Apr 15, 2014)

dianebrat said:


> Poll fail,
> You left out "both" as an answer for those of us with multiple units, you can go back and edit that.


Edited but I will say I know some people who have TE3 on all units and some that have TE4 on all units.


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## just4tivo (Dec 9, 2015)

TE4 doesn't offer anything I want or need so I'll stick to TE3.


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## Joe3 (Dec 12, 2006)

TE4 doesn't offer, it takes away.


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

KevTech said:


> Edited but I will say I know some people who have TE3 on all units and some that have TE4 on all units.


Both. All basic Roamio boxes. Same with Mini: both.

Just to be accurate, there should be a box for "TE3 - No Choice"


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## KevTech (Apr 15, 2014)

JoeKustra said:


> Just to be accurate, there should be a box for "TE3 - No Choice"


added


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

JoeKustra said:


> Both. All basic Roamio boxes. Same with Mini: both.
> 
> Just to be accurate, there should be a box for "TE3 - No Choice"





KevTech said:


> added


Should there also be a "TE4 - No Choice" (for the Bolt OTA)?


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

Joe3 said:


> TE4 doesn't offer, it takes away.


I'm on TE3 exclusively right now. But to be fair, TE4 offers, in a more major sphere, voice and auto ad-skipping.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

KevTech said:


> Edited but I will say I know some people who have TE3 on all units and some that have TE4 on all units.


Those folks can answer for their fleet then 
Thanks for adding the options.


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## Car guy (Sep 22, 2017)

TE4 and hate it. Wish I could go back easily.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Technically I have both, because I have a Bolt in my office that's running TE4. But I almost never use that unit directly. I stream from it using either my main Bolt or my Mini. So I'm 99.9% TE3. I really don't care for TE4. They've improved it since the initial release, but it's still got areas where it's just weird and hard to use.


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## AntiPC (Jul 22, 2005)

Technically I have both too. The Summer Sale Bolt has TE4, but I put it in the living room so I've been using it quite a bit. I'm just not feeling the hate yet, so I'll probably leave it that way. The other 4 tivos and 9 minis are on TE3. I worry more about upgrading the older hardware to a software version with more overhead.


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## cmaquilino16 (Jul 7, 2009)

Have TE3 on roamio Pro and mini. Just got bolt vox in summer deal TE4 on it giving it a try. I will probably leave TE3 on the other two if not broke do not fix it.


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## tiv0 newbie (Aug 28, 2015)

Dan203 said:


> Technically I have both, because I have a Bolt in my office that's running TE4. But I almost never use that unit directly. I stream from it using either my main Bolt or my Mini. So I'm 99.9% TE3. I really don't care for TE4. They've improved it since the initial release, but it's still got areas where it's just weird and hard to use.


Can you tell me what (if any) communication/connection the TE3 devices have with the TE4 Bolt and vice versa? While on the TE4 bolt can you watch recorded shows that are on the TE3 devices and vice versa?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Pokemon_Dad (Jan 19, 2008)

All TE3 all the time. TE4 seems to have been developed to support some as yet unproven product roadmap. It certainly does not serve customer needs.


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## AntiPC (Jul 22, 2005)

tiv0 newbie said:


> Can you tell me what (if any) communication/connection the TE3 devices have with the TE4 Bolt and vice versa? While on the TE4 bolt can you watch recorded shows that are on the TE3 devices and vice versa?


My devices are fully networked and I haven't seen any TE3/TE4 incompatibility. I watch shows from my TE3 Roamio OTA frequently on the new Bolt.


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## justen_m (Jan 15, 2004)

TE3 on my 3TB Bolt and 3TB Roamio Plus.

TE4 removes a function I use frequently -- transferring shows/videos from my PC to my TiVo. I suppose I could move one machine to TE4, but why have two different UIs?


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## OrangeCrush (Feb 18, 2016)

Had been on TE3 from the beginning and migrated to TE4 a few months ago. I liked TE4 at first--seemed faster, appreciated commercial skip & CEC support; but it seems to have gotten sluggish over time on my Roamio & A93 Minis. I'm considering moving away from TiVo entirely and selling it all off, but if I hadn't I probably would have migrated back to TE3 by now.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

tiv0 newbie said:


> Can you tell me what (if any) communication/connection the TE3 devices have with the TE4 Bolt and vice versa? While on the TE4 bolt can you watch recorded shows that are on the TE3 devices and vice versa?
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yes. They can communicate just fine. The only limitation is that the Mini always wants to run the same software version as the TiVo host. You can still select a TiVo running the other version from the Devices list and play shows without having to change versions, but it has to run the same version as the primary host TiVo.


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## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

KevTech said:


> Since the Tivo New Experience (Hydra) Yay/Nay thread just asks what software people prefer I thought I would see what people who visit the forum are actually using right now on their Tivo.


And you won't find out here. The only people who care about these threads are the protest group who want TE3.

I just read through it and that is what it is.


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## Joe3 (Dec 12, 2006)

This community does a lot of heavy lifting for TiVo with its customers and people looking for an unbiased evaluation of their product before purchasing.

This community is not a TiVo created echo chamber or an extension of their marketing department. It is unquestionably not under any agenda, but is dedicated to the ideas for a much better TiVo home entertainment experience going into the future.


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## tim1724 (Jul 3, 2007)

I'm still running TE3. Normally I would be the type to jump into the new version right away but I didn't initially switch for reasons I probably can't talk about. ;-) By the time that was no longer an issue the excitement of TE4 had worn off and people were grumbling about it a lot so I held off. But now that automatic skip mode is a thing I'll probably make the switch at some point. Most of the things people complain about don't matter much to me. (e.g., I haven't used the Live Guide much since my Series 3 days; my Roamio has been set to grid guide since I got it.)

The main holdup now is that I'll probably want to buy a new remote for my girlfriend; she's using an old one without a Back button. (We each have our own remote. I use the one that came with the Roamio and she uses the old one from our previous TiVo.)


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## AntiPC (Jul 22, 2005)

tim1724 said:


> (We each have our own remote. I use the one that came with the Roamio and she uses the old one from our previous TiVo.)


We have one by the chair and one by the couch. So in basketball defense terms, it's "zone" instead of your "man-to-remote".


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

tim1724 said:


> for reasons I probably can't talk about. ;-)


Sounds like maybe the same reason I do have it on my office Bolt. Wasn't a fan during that period and haven't really played with it much since. I've seen that it's changed a bit, but I'm still not really a fan of the navigation and some of the screens just irk me, so I've left all my other units on TE3.


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## omelet1978 (Mar 7, 2006)

For me it’s pretty simple. TE3 until they bring back the Live Guide which is the primary reason I have Tivo over just a cable DVR. 

I signed on with Comcast for 2 more years so I figure I’ll stick with TE3 for the duration of that. If Tivo has not brought back the Live Guide to TE4 by then (and there is no indication they are going to do that) then it’ll just be time to cut ties and go with something else since TE3 will be several years old by then.


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## audax (Mar 11, 2013)

I went to TE4 involuntarily when I had to replace my dead Bolt. Found the interface clumsy but chalked that up to my lack of familiarity. Then I discovered that Thumbs Up / Down was gone from suggestions so I recently reverted to TE3. With TE4 my suggestions would fill up with reality TV shows and other things that I never watch. I'd delete hundreds of shows and the Tivo would immediately begin recording the same ones! What's the point of a DVR that only records things you *don't* want to watch?


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## KevTech (Apr 15, 2014)

audax said:


> I went to TE4 involuntarily when I had to replace my dead Bolt. Found the interface clumsy but chalked that up to my lack of familiarity. Then I discovered that Thumbs Up / Down was gone from suggestions so I recently reverted to TE3. With TE4 my suggestions would fill up with reality TV shows and other things that I never watch. I'd delete hundreds of shows and the Tivo would immediately begin recording the same ones! What's the point of a DVR that only records things you *don't* want to watch?


Could have turned off suggestions in setting then nothing would record that you did not want to.


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## audax (Mar 11, 2013)

KevTech said:


> Could have turned off suggestions in setting then nothing would record that you did not want to.


I liked the TE3 suggestions once I had it trained.


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## JackMcC (Aug 11, 2019)

Just from looking at TE4 on YouTube, I would probably only upgrade if I could scale the video to 3/4 its size (to view unblocked) when calling up images of what's on the other channels, recorded shows and what's on now. Something like that along with the existing voice search would get me to invest in a new remote and bluetooth dongle for my Roamio.

Sent from my SM-G960U using Tapatalk


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## Anotherpyr (May 6, 2015)

Dan203 said:


> Technically I have both, because I have a Bolt in my office that's running TE4. But I almost never use that unit directly. I stream from it using either my main Bolt or my Mini. So I'm 99.9% TE3. I really don't care for TE4. They've improved it since the initial release, but it's still got areas where it's just weird and hard to use.


I'm hijacking a thread, but have you recently started having issues accessing content on the TE4 bolt via the minis or other bolt? I have. Similar setup but a Roamio and minis on TE3. Recently the minis started throwing errors when accessing the bolt, but they are fine with Roamio.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Anotherpyr said:


> I'm hijacking a thread, but have you recently started having issues accessing content on the TE4 bolt via the minis or other bolt? I have. Similar setup but a Roamio and minis on TE3. Recently the minis started throwing errors when accessing the bolt, but they are fine with Roamio.


To be honest I haven't tried in a while. I really only use that Bolt to record a couple of things and I haven't watched any of those shows in a few months.


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## Pokemon_Dad (Jan 19, 2008)

Anotherpyr said:


> I'm hijacking a thread, but have you recently started having issues accessing content on the TE4 bolt via the minis or other bolt? I have. Similar setup but a Roamio and minis on TE3. Recently the minis started throwing errors when accessing the bolt, but they are fine with Roamio.


Try turning off all power saving settings on the Bolt. I had a Bolt on TE3, and it caused similar Mini troubles here until I did that. Eventually I got rid of the Bolt, and pointed all Minis at one reliable Roamio Pro.


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## Anotherpyr (May 6, 2015)

Pokemon_Dad said:


> Try turning off all power saving settings on the Bolt. I had a Bolt on TE3, and it caused similar Mini troubles here until I did that. Eventually I got rid of the Bolt, and pointed all Minis at one reliable Roamio Pro.


I thought it was funny that it has worked fine for so long and then recently it just stopped. It starts to work and then goes into an error state with a call message if it persists. If I restarted the mini it would connect but error out pretty quickly. So I moved the mini over to TE4 and the bolt and it's working fine. I'll check the power saving settings on the bolt, but I usually turn all that stuff off, and move the mini back to TE3 and the Roamio. My bolt is only a 4 tuner, so I prefer to pair the minis with the 6 tuner Roamio.


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## mattyro7878 (Nov 27, 2014)

TE3 is no longer supported as it is only by choice people are using TE3. Well, what about folks with Premieres who have te3 and have no choice? Will these boxes suffer due to the lack of updates and maintenance? At some point will we be given an offer we cant refuse?


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## KevTech (Apr 15, 2014)

mattyro7878 said:


> TE3 is no longer supported as it is only by choice people are using TE3. Well, what about folks with Premieres who have te3 and have no choice? Will these boxes suffer due to the lack of updates and maintenance? At some point will we be given an offer we cant refuse?


It was said TE3 will still have bug fixes.



TiVo_Ted said:


> TE3 was put into maintenance mode almost 2 years ago.





TiVo_Ted said:


> "Maintenance mode" = "Bug fixes only".


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## Anotherpyr (May 6, 2015)

Anotherpyr said:


> I thought it was funny that it has worked fine for so long and then recently it just stopped. It starts to work and then goes into an error state with a call message if it persists. If I restarted the mini it would connect but error out pretty quickly. So I moved the mini over to TE4 and the bolt and it's working fine. I'll check the power saving settings on the bolt, but I usually turn all that stuff off, and move the mini back to TE3 and the Roamio. My bolt is only a 4 tuner, so I prefer to pair the minis with the 6 tuner Roamio.


Well, power saving mode was off on the bolt. I moved the mini back to TE3 by pairing it with the Roamio. And so far it's like it never had an issue. Not sure why restarting it didn't fix it in the first place.


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## tommage1 (Nov 6, 2008)

KevTech said:


> It was said TE3 will still have bug fixes.


Well the problem with that is................. I understand they are not developing/adding new user features to TE3. HOWEVER it seems they are still modifying it to keep up with other things they are doing. And it seems some of these modifications are breaking things, guide problems, certain basic commands and KS commands can brick units, who knows what else. Fine, no more feature updates but LEAVE IT ALONE, these background modifications break things and good luck getting them fixed with TE3............... At least IMO.


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## kdmorse (Jan 29, 2001)

mattyro7878 said:


> TE3 is no longer supported as it is only by choice people are using TE3. Well, what about folks with Premieres who have te3 and have no choice? Will these boxes suffer due to the lack of updates and maintenance? At some point will we be given an offer we cant refuse?


Honestly, one day, yes.



KevTech said:


> It was said TE3 will still have bug fixes.


But in practice, fatal bugfixes only. Medium grade or minor bugs, will almost certainly never be fixed in TE3. If an internal certificate expires that would break everything, that will force them to push down a code fix (already happened once).

I personally prefer TE3, and I'm under no illusion that the various bugs (*cough* quirks!) that annoy me will ever be fixed. Apps will age out over time. Features will fall away. And eventually, something critical will go poof. How many years away that is, I have no idea.

Google: Roll 2D10
Answer: 6. I'm good on TE3 for 6 years.  (That was an awfully low roll for 2D10...)


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

kdmorse said:


> But in practice, fatal bugfixes only. Medium grade or minor bugs, will almost certainly never be fixed in TE3. If an internal certificate expires that would break everything, that will force them to push down a code fix (already happened once).


Over the last few months, (from observation) TiVo has been moving to a single guide. Right now TE3 will die if you attempt a CPI&TDL. I have used that when crappy guide data gets fed to my Roamio. I don't expect a fix. Another process from CPI&TDL is cleaning up the History folder. My fear is that over time the History folder will start affecting other folders. That, I'm afraid, will kill TE3.


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## tommage1 (Nov 6, 2008)

JoeKustra said:


> Over the last few months, (from observation) TiVo has been moving to a single guide. Right now TE3 will die if you attempt a CPI&TDL. I have used that when crappy guide data gets fed to my Roamio. I don't expect a fix. Another process from CPI&TDL is cleaning up the History folder. My fear is that over time the History folder will start affecting other folders. That, I'm afraid, will kill TE3.


Though I have had what I consider major guide problems I have not run any clear and delete or kickstarts, yet. On Premieres I guess can be fatal, there is no TE4 and once drive is bricked have to start completely over with an image (or maybe that countdown kickstart)? Wow, would make buying or selling a used unit dangerous, how dangerous depends on make and model. I think if I was going to SELL one of my TE3 Roamios I'd have to ****grade it to TE4 first, otherwise buyer might run into trouble setting up................ Average user who just wants to buy and use good luck, special or normal commands that don't work, taking apart unit, restoring images etc etc.


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

tommage1 said:


> Though I have had what I consider major guide problems I have not run any clear and delete or kickstarts, yet. On Premieres I guess can be fatal, there is no TE4 and once drive is bricked have to start completely over with an image (or maybe that countdown kickstart)? Wow, would make buying or selling a used unit dangerous, how dangerous depends on make and model. I think if I was going to SELL one of my TE3 Roamios I'd have to ****grade it to TE4 first, otherwise buyer might run into trouble setting up................ Average user who just wants to buy and use good luck, special or normal commands that don't work, taking apart unit, restoring images etc etc.


Luckily a TE3 Roamio just needs it's drive to be reformatted to get running again. And I understand there is a KS code that will get a Premiere or Roamio back to life. But to be safe, I would have TE4 on a Roamio before selling it. I have TE4 on one Roamio and it's not so bad. Pretty, but it benefits from the better processor on a Bolt. It's main purpose is to be a host for my Mini Vox. I can't even use its drive for storage.

As for guide problems, I have two boxes that have program data until 4/30 at 8pm. I can't complain about the content since there's a lot of problems at all the networks trying fill in for missing sports.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

JoeKustra said:


> Luckily a TE3 Roamio just needs it's drive to be reformatted to get running again. And I understand there is a KS code that will get a Premiere or Roamio back to life


KS57 has worked for a few users as reported in a Premiere thread.

Scott


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## Anotherpyr (May 6, 2015)

Anotherpyr said:


> Well, power saving mode was off on the bolt. I moved the mini back to TE3 by pairing it with the Roamio. And so far it's like it never had an issue. Not sure why restarting it didn't fix it in the first place.


Spoke too soon, it errored out a day later with an unexpected c501 error. So it's back to TE4 to see if that is stable for now.


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## Pokemon_Dad (Jan 19, 2008)

Anotherpyr said:


> Spoke too soon, it errored out a day later with an unexpected c501 error. So it's back to TE4 to see if that is stable for now.


That's interesting. That C501 error code is more about contacting the TiVo service over the internet than it is about your Mini contacting a local TiVo. So maybe this has nothing at all to do with TE3 vs. TE4 or anything else we've discussed here.


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## Anotherpyr (May 6, 2015)

Pokemon_Dad said:


> That's interesting. That C501 error code is more about contacting the TiVo service over the internet than it is about your Mini contacting a local TiVo. So maybe this has nothing at all to do with TE3 vs. TE4 or anything else we've discussed here.


Well it always seemed to happen when displaying my shows on the device. So far I haven't experienced it when TE4 is on the mini.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

Pokemon_Dad said:


> That's interesting. That C501 error code is more about contacting the TiVo service over the internet than it is about your Mini contacting a local TiVo. So maybe this has nothing at all to do with TE3 vs. TE4 or anything else we've discussed here.


C501 is also the sign of trying to connect a current TE3 machine to a TE4 machine running it's current OS, there's an incompatibility there at this time.


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## jfalkingham (Jul 23, 2002)

TE3 cannot stream from a TE4 box. This has started around 3/12/2020 with no fix insight or promised. My ticket (and many others on here) remain open. 

Sent from my SM-G986U using Tapatalk


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## dsmoore (Feb 18, 2009)

I have 5 Tivos and two minis. The TiVo BOLT VOX has the TE4 and I regret having installed that version. The others have TE3. On TE4 the guide function flows horizontally and not vertically and as a results slows my ability to quickly scan for upcoming shows. I have also found that the TE4 makes my Tivo run slower. It's a kludgy system. I wish I could be convinced that TE4 is better, but my experience says no. If you love TE4 please tell me why? I'm desperate and open minded for answers.


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

dsmoore said:


> I have 5 Tivo and two minis. The TiVo BOLT VOX has the TE4 and I regret having installed that version. The others have TE3. On TE4 the guide function flows horizontally and not vertically and as a results slows my ability to quickly scan for upcoming shows. I have also found that the TE4 makes my Tivo run slower. It's a kludgy system. I wish I could be convinced that TE4 is better, but my experience says no. If you love TE4 please tell me why? I'm desperate and open minded for answers.


(And just to make sure: you know that you can sidegrade from TE4 back to TE3, right? Note: but not with the Edge platform or the specifically-denominated Bolt OTA box.)


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## dsmoore (Feb 18, 2009)

Mikeguy said:


> (And just to make sure: you know that you can sidegrade from TE4 back to TE3, right? Note: but not with the Edge platform or the specifically-denominated Bolt OTA box.)


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## dsmoore (Feb 18, 2009)

I was told I can go back to TE3 on the Bolt but I would loose all my programs.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

dsmoore said:


> I was told I can go back to TE3 on the Bolt but I would loose all my programs.


In most cases yes, I believe the Bolt OTA is the exception and can't be rolled back.


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## mattyro7878 (Nov 27, 2014)

Just transferred a show from te4 to TE3. I DID NOT GET AN OPTION TO WATCH THE SHOW. It was transfer or delete. I find this odd.


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## PSU_Sudzi (Jun 4, 2015)

dianebrat said:


> In most cases yes, I believe the Bolt OTA is the exception and can't be rolled back.


This is correct.


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## bluemcduff (Sep 8, 2007)

This might be a silly question, but can you roll back an Edge to TE3?


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

bluemcduff said:


> This might be a silly question, but can you roll back an Edge to TE3?


No.


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

And it's not a silly question to ask--quite to the contrary.


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