# Suggestions no longer recording



## riggers

I've just noticed that my Tivo has stopped recording suggestions as from Sunday. There's plenty of suggestions recorded before that.

Further investigation shows that it thinks I've not rated any programmes.

Is it just me or has something else bit the dust?


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## JanB

Me too! This happened a few months ago then seemed to get better but I have had no TIVO suggestions recorded for nearly a week now. Very annoying as TIVO often catches one off programmes that I have missed. And a useful way of seeing how much free disc space is available.

Jan B


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## ColinYounger

This might be a result of the recent problems with series links.


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## riggers

Without seeming to be rude, I'm glad it's not just me. I was starting to imagine it was a hard-disk or database problem on my machine.

No doubt it'll sort itself out at some point.


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## SCOOBY.C

happening to me too, just as i get the account sorted they go and knacker one of the best bits!!


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## TrainManG

Me too!

On 3 units. Stopped about 10 days ago on all of them, whilst I was away. Series link wierdies too.

Geoff.


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## steveroe

Can this thread be turned into a poll?

Mine have also stopped, Tivo is asking me to rate programmes, when programmes are clearly rated...


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## mdolan

Just to add my 2p worth, it's stopped here as well....

Cheers,
Mike


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## digitaria

Most recent suggestions for me are from Monday 25th at 15:00. It would normally record 7 or 8 every 24 hours. No forthcoming suggestions either.


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## sibo999

All my tivos have stopped recording suggestions (since 28th). I get the message about thumbs ratings, although individual programs still have thumbs.

Rang Tivo CS (well you never know). They weren't aware of the problem but are now reporting to the states. 

'Breath now baited'


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## Ian_m

No "suggestions" here either. (according to TiVoWeb).

Not that I have ever used them as I found that one recording/season pass from Cbeebies "infected" the suggestions with all suggestions from Cbeebies.....


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## digital_S

Whether it'll help or not, for everyone to post if their suggestions have stopped... 
I'm the same, I wondered why nothing was being recorded between today (Friday) and Sunday afternoon. Now I know.

As steveroe asked, I'd like to see a poll here too


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## kev160967

No suggestions here either. Last one was on Sunday 24th. Symptoms exactly as reported by everyone else

Kev


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## Davyburns

yup, same here!
is it lifetime subs, or monthly or both
A poll seems to be the right idea


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## PaulWilkinsUK

The cupboard is indeed bare...


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## kitschcamp

steveroe said:


> Can this thread be turned into a poll?
> 
> Mine have also stopped, Tivo is asking me to rate programmes, when programmes are clearly rated...


Yeah, same here too. As others said, I was thinking it had just got screwed up on mine.


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## OzSat

OK - I've set up a poll for you all

Please can everybody vote?


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## cwaring

I'm sure my suggestions also disappeared some time ago but I forgot all about it.


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## Glen

time for me to chime in. Same here! Been this way for sometime now.


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## cwaring

I feel a song coming on.....

_"There may be trouble ahead........"_

Yeah. I don't have the legs (or voice!) for it


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## DeadKenny

Nothing here either.

I know I had something problems with them a while back too but that was it just suddenly recording completely crazy suggestions that seemed unrelated to my preferences. It seemed to recover but now nothing at all.

It's looking like it's the same for everyone.

Oh, and I don't know if it's related but my box restarted itself the other week. No power cut, just whilst I was watching live TV I think and it restarted.


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## Mostin

Same for me. I restarted thinking it might sort it out. It didn't so i reset my thumbs up/down suggestions and gave thumbs up to some programs and now the suggestions are slowly starting to appear again. 

Really annoying as i go on holiday this week and tivo doesn't know me anymore


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## GJB

Mine has stopped recording too - not too happy if I have to reset all thumbs up and down and then start again, Tivo took ages to learn I hate Reality TV 

Don't know when mine gave up, guessing it was about 4 days ago.

Absolutely nothing in Pick Porgrammes to Record - Tivo's Suggestions despite many many preferences being given 

I really like my Tivo unit but if this does not come back might as well have Sky Plus, so far held off that (and HD) as Tivo's software with the suggestions suits my way of viewing (or has taught me to view that way - chicken / egg / chicken)


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## Milhouse

I've got news on this, just researching the details - will post later in the week.


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## mikerr

Hmm, so suggestions are not generated on the tivo itself,
but from tivo's main server?
Thats what this thread would suggest - your thumbs are uploaded,
and a list of suggestions sent on the daily call....


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## OzSat

Suggestions are generated on your TiVo based on your selections.


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## woody

my tivo just says that it's new and no thumbs data is available. Not true, and plenty of thumb selections over the last 4 or 5 years. Not that bothered as I don't record suggestions, but nice to look at occasionally to see whats on.


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## Davyburns

GJB said:


> I really like my Tivo unit but if this does not come back might as well have Sky Plus, so far held off that (and HD) as Tivo's software with the suggestions suits my way of viewing (or has taught me to view that way - chicken / egg / chicken)


Could this be what Sky are aiming at? one step at a time?

If thats the case, I would rather do without than be "bullied"


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## penna

Ours has also stopped making suggestions - everything else works fine


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## digital_S

Isn't it funny when something goes wrong, more people register  (i know I'm one to talk) 
No change yet with suggestions returning... 
After last time this happened, they came back a few at a time.


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## cwaring

digital_S said:


> After last time this happened, they came back a few at a time.


I was just going to ask if re-setting them would help or if they'll come back in their own time with the settings I currently have


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## Mostin

Last time? I didn't realise its happened before.


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## kitschcamp

Yeah, it's happened a few times before. They suddenly and spontaneously start to re-appear. Don't be tempted to fiddle with your box. It won't help!


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## johala_reewi

<aol>
Me Too
</aol>


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## steveroe

sibo999 said:


> Rang Tivo CS (well you never know). They weren't aware of the problem but are now reporting to the states.
> 
> 'Breath now baited'


Did they happen to give you a fault ticket or number - would be useful so that we can quote it when we all call and they deny knowledge


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## Goooner1

Add me to the list 

Over the last couple of months, I've had a couple of times when the suggestions just peter out over a couple of weeks (glad it's not just me!!) I reset the box, then it seemed to sort itself out, this was obviously just a coincidence.


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## broughn

No suggestions recorded since the Dr Who Movie on Monday 25th August (I don't think there were any further suggestions between that recording and the next scheduled call). Since then, my ratings are all intact, but nothing is been shown on the "suggestions" page and absolutely nothing is being recorded other than season passes and deliberate recordings.

I never realised how much I used them! It's making my vague idea of tinkering with MythTV look a lot more interesting...

<p.s. yes I look like a "new" registration, but I actually forgot my password, and have moved jobs since I last posted...>


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## RWILTS

Hi,

Just to say that I am having NO problems with suggestions. I only turned them back on last week as the v+ has taken responsibility for recording everything now.

And regarding the suggestion that suggestions are picked on server. My Tivo only makes a call every two weeks or so when i realise that guide data is missing and i stretch the extension cable through 3 rooms of the house


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## steveroe

RWILTS said:


> Hi,
> 
> Just to say that I am having NO problems with suggestions. I only turned them back on last week as the v+ has taken responsibility for recording everything now.
> 
> And regarding the suggestion that suggestions are picked on server. My Tivo only makes a call every two weeks or so when i realise that guide data is missing and i stretch the extension cable through 3 rooms of the house


Interesting - when was the last time you did connect?


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## mista_c

My machine hasn't recorded any suggestions since last thursday, 28th Aug. However, my mothers tivo recorded a suggestion yesterday. I think she has a telephone lead permanently connected, but I'll find out when her tivo last made a succesful call.


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## GJB

I leave mine permanently connected, last successful call was Sunday 04:11. Yesterdays failed. Manually forced one this morning and after 60 mins of watching it call, download, expand, and load ................

Suggestions still did not work :-(

Davy Burns - Don't see how Sky can be blamed for this.

ps: used to be on this forum years ago but became less and less active as Tivo cared about us less and less as witnessed by no new hardware / software. Visited brother in law in US and saw what we miss out on. Even so stayed loyal to Tivo as I think UK std Tivo is better than Sky Plus.


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## kitschcamp

Even as a dumb recorder Tivo is better than what else is on offer. I've just finished converting my unsubbed spare Tivo into a manual recorder for Canal Digital. Beats into a cocked hat the hard disc recorder I tried to use.


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## Sneals2000

kitschcamp said:


> Even as a dumb recorder Tivo is better than what else is on offer. I've just finished converting my unsubbed spare Tivo into a manual recorder for Canal Digital. Beats into a cocked hat the hard disc recorder I tried to use.


Heresy I know - but does Windows Media Center support the Canal Digital line-up ?


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## kitschcamp

Don't know, to be honest! Never thought to check. Canal Digital uses Conax for the encryption, and the premium channels are tied to specific boxes (similar to the Sky premium channels), so it'd probably have to be via an MPEG encoder, I suppose?


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## ericd121

I, too (On two {Tivos}), have Suggestions Cessation.


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## warrenrb

No suggestions here either. I rely on them quite heavily here to record kid's programmes, to keep all the crap away from the 'proper' programmes at the top, so we are really missing them here.

Gonna have to set season passes for the kid's stuff if it doesn't fix soon.


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## Goooner1

All my daily calls have been succesful (with the last one being late last night).

Gave a thumbs up to a couple of films last night, and overnight I have gone from 2 suggestions in my list to 5. It was also recording something that wasn't in the suggestions list.

No idea if this is purely coincidental or what, just thought I'd mention it in case it shed any more light on the problem


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## katman

Cant really say if mine stopped working because I turned them off many years ago because my Tivo was an FVR (Family Video Recorder) rather than a PVR and it kept suggesting everyone elses programs.

Having said that its probably MY fault they stopped working because I upgraded my Tivo last week and reset everything so that it would learn afresh and suggest programs that I might like. As others I have reported, it is telling me to use the thumbs buttons to highlight programs I like and is not currently suggesting anything.


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## sibo999

steveroe said:


> Did they happen to give you a fault ticket or number - would be useful so that we can quote it when we all call and they deny knowledge


I've just spoken to CS and the problem has been reported to the states:up:, However it hasn't progressed any further than that:down:. 
I presume it just affects UK S1's but perhaps anyone reading this from the states (or elsewhere) could confirm.

As an aside apparently CS in the UK don't allocate TT (trouble ticket) references to customer problems as 'nobody checks on them anyway'.


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## Sneals2000

kitschcamp said:


> Don't know, to be honest! Never thought to check. Canal Digital uses Conax for the encryption, and the premium channels are tied to specific boxes (similar to the Sky premium channels), so it'd probably have to be via an MPEG encoder, I suppose?


Yes - I think that is the only way to do it legitimately, and the quality would be slightly lower than a Tivo as the Tivo can accept RGB and Media Center-compatible PC capture cards are S-video and Composite only.


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## kitschcamp

I shall have to do some investigating. The budget at the moment is going into buying a new dish - the thick end of &#8364;1 000 including delivery - so it might have to wait a little while.


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## Davyburns

GJB said:


> Davy Burns - Don't see how Sky can be blamed for this.


Well, If Sky are running CS for Tivo, you cant rule it out!


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## broughn

Davyburns said:


> Originally Posted by GJB View Post
> Davy Burns - Don't see how Sky can be blamed for this.
> Well, If Sky are running CS for Tivo, you cant rule it out!


True, but I don't think Sky run customer support for anyone other than Sky.

I'm not getting any suggestions on the analogue, non-sky channels either, so I know it's something on the Tivo. Must be either that Tivo have stuffed up the data coming down on the schedules, or broken our systems with a software update (but I don't know if our S1s are still updated at all). Can't think of anything else it might be.


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## OzSat

TiVo US are looking into this


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## pandabreath

My suggestions have stopped for the last two weeks or more, here in California, USA. I have plenty of ratings and have suggestions "on" in set-up menu.


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## Mark Bennett

broughn said:


> True, but I don't think Sky run customer support for anyone other than Sky.
> .


When you call Tivo customer support in the UK, you are actually talking to Sky. Sky run the Tivo support in the UK


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## katman

*Tivo recorded a suggestion last night !!!!*

However.... NOTHING is showing on the suggestions page, it tells me I need to use the thumbs but more worringly is the fact that it recorded something on SkyArts. I have NEVER watched Sky Arts and the only programs that heve been recorded on the box since it was rebuilt are from the Discovery channels, things line Megastructures, ExtremeEngineeering, Holmes on Holmes, RenovationNation etc.

Why would it think that I was interested in "Sky Arts at the Globe Theatre" - Sky arts goes behing the scenes at the Globe Theatre as it gears up for their latest production of 'Liberty', a play set during the French Revolution.


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## Goooner1

No more news on this?

Further to my earlier post, I tried giving the thumbs up to a couple of new programmes again last night and sure enough they appeared in my suggestions list. So maybe it's something to do with the new guide data ignoring the old thumbs up/down?

I wonder what would happen if I reset all the thumbs? Would it start recording suggestions normally? Dare I try it I wonder and risk losing all my ratings for nothing


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## riggers

I completely reset my thumbs a couple of days ago and added thumbs up to a few programmes but still not getting anything in Suggestions.

Not a major problem but they did tend to pick up interesting programmes that I'd not spotted.


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## JaybirdUK

same for me, no suggestion. Very annoyed as its the best feature of TiVo 

I actually reset my thumbs (stupid I know!) in a bid to make it work, still no luck.

Why do TiVo treat us like lepers?


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## tonywalk

2 more boxes to add to the list.

The box where there was still space to record suggestions stopped recording them on the 30th August. I suspect the other was around the same date.

Both boxes have network cards and connect to Tivo over my broadband connection and seem to do so reliably every day.

Regards,
Tony.


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## jonphil

No Suggestions here since Thursday 21st. No suggestions in the list either.
Hope they get it sorted soon, or is this a sign that the Tivo Service in the UK is getting cut back?


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## mikerr

This is quite widespread, as I'm getting several emails per day asking why suggestions have stopped working.
I'm currently pointing people to this thread, but I'm going to put a status page on the website shortly...


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## ericd121

I, too, have had a Suggestion recorded.

Last Friday, I was Browsing by Channel and gave a Thumbs Up to "First Cut" which was recorded that evening.

I've given Thumbs Up to several programmes today, so we'll see.


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## a_tivo_noob

"River of No Return" was recorded yesterday for me (2pm'ish on More4 i think...) nothing since though...


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## Suds

I noticed my TiVo had stopped recording suggestions maybe a month ago, I don't know how long it had been like that as I'd thumbed down quite a lot of stuff and it was much more selective so didn't record that many - the way I like it 

I ended up reluctanty resetting my thumbs ratings and thumbed up a few programs. This seemed to work and the suggestions started recording again -complete with all the naff stuff again! 

That appears to have only lasted for a week or so. Last night I noticed they had stopped again with the "If your TiVo recorder is new..." text on the suggestions page. (Last suggestion recorded on Saturday the 30th.)

Instead of resetting the thumbs ratings, I just turned off suggestion recording, reset the TiVo, turned suggestion recording back on and thumbed up one program. Within a few minutes, one suggestion had appeared, to be recorded today - a movie called "Creature" and it was indeed recorded this morning at 2:40am on Sci-Fi +1.

But now, the suggestions page has gone back to "If your TiVo recorder is new..."

Lol - I was never a big fan of suggestions but I realise now how much I do use them and actually like them!


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## AENG

It'll be a real shame if this doesn't get fixed. We've seen quite a lot of interesting stuff over the years that TiVo has found for us on channels we seldom view. If it's not going to do this any more, that will be one more nail in a coffin that seems to be looming ever closer.


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## GJB

AENG said:


> It'll be a real shame if this doesn't get fixed. We've seen quite a lot of interesting stuff over the years that TiVo has found for us on channels we seldom view. If it's not going to do this any more, that will be one more nail in a coffin that seems to be looming ever closer.


I agree - sometimes Tivo has recorded something I have never heard of and I find I like it and set a Season Pass, to me it is the single most important advantage Tivo has.

I don't think Tivo treat us like lepers merely like a group of people who they don't make money out of. I do believe they support us on a "best endeavours" basis as one day, should they ever return to the UK, we will be the ones at the front of the queue to buy the new kit ie. they do the best they can on limited budgets :down: cant find it in my heart to blame them though.

I object to moving to Sky+ HD and giving Sky even more money but I also object to the lower recording quality of Tivo (yes have the Tivo Heaven Quality Upgrade) and now the major benefit of Tivo vs Sky does not work, and has not, for more than two weeks with no sign of it being fixed.

Not Angry but Sad.

Graham


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## steveroe

Ozsat - any news from the states?


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## JaybirdUK

Still no fix and it was the one feature really keeping me a TiVo owner...

Might be ringing Virgin for a HD V+ next week, I'll give the TiVo until Friday


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## Benedict

Like others, the suggestions list has been empty on both my TiVos since early last week, yet one of them somehow managed to record a single suggestion over the weekend!!


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## Goooner1

JaybirdUK said:


> Still no fix and it was the one feature really keeping me a TiVo owner...
> 
> Might be ringing Virgin for a HD V+ next week, I'll give the TiVo until Friday


Same for me. When I got my Sky HD box, I had every intention of ditching my TiVo, but I found with the suggestions and the season pass manager etc I just couldn't get rid of it.

With the suggestions now seemingly gone (forever? Who knows ) and a new Sky HD EPG imminent, I'm wondering if now is the time to finally retire my beloved TiVo.


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## mikerr

Yes, I have V+ for HD, but it doesn't replace tivo though - like sky+ it only (barely) offers series recording.
No good if you rely on wishlists.

As for suggestions, I'm sure someone could write a hack to look at the thumbs database and set suggestions in the todo list if its not already been done (not volunteering!)

I did get a single random suggestion recorded last night, didn't seem very relevent though "history of radio" - no explicit thumbs, and not a genre I record...


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## SCOOBY.C

Milhouse said:


> I've got news on this, just researching the details - will post later in the week.


any word yet?


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## Ashley

Why and how does the mother ship control *OUR* suggestions?


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## ColinYounger

I believe that the suggestions are derived from genres, and the mothership tells our TiVos what genres each program is.


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## 6022tivo

Maybe.. Just maybe it is a much bigger problem, maybe a software bug due to the date 080808 that has just passed???

Imagine if tivo had to do a software update to fix the issue, this would kinda screw up anyone with a larger than 120gb hdd, with the updated kernal..


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## ag5002

Hi all, new to this forum.

My Tivo has also stopped recording suggestions. I wonder if it is due to a wider scale problem though. My subscription failed and I had a letter from Tivo UK saying 'sorry to lose you'. On calling them, my direct debit had failed for some reason, and they could not set it back up.

Apparently there has been a major software upgrade in the US, and ever since the UK has had all sorts of problems. They re-activated my subscription by charging my debit card, and the suggestions have failed to work ever since.

Has anyone else experienced other faults or subscription issues? I think we need to collectively campaign for Tivo UK to be upgraded. I tried Sky plus but returned to Tivo as it was much better!


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## ColinYounger

@6022tivo - I can't imagine why 080808 would cause a problem! Also, if TiVo updated our software, the build number would change. My software version is the same as ever according to the system information screen.

@ag5002 - Renewing\activating subscriptions is a known problem at the moment with no solution in sight. There are various threads discussing this which I think you'll come across soon.


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## mista_c

ag5002 said:


> They re-activated my subscription by charging my debit card, and the suggestions have failed to work ever since.


Hi there, welcome to the forum. When you say they re-activated your subscription, was your account actually closed and then a new one set up, or was it just the direct debit that was re-activated?

If it was the former, I would be interested to know if you are still able to successfully download listings.


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## Automan

If Tivo ever did update our UK boxes a lot of us would be in trouble due to our large hard drives.

From what I recall the upgrade process would trash our drives and stop them from booting.

Automan.


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## RWILTS

Sorry its been a few days to get back but v busy...

Anyway I have joined the club, last suggestion recorded on 30th August - nothing since. Suggestions page has the 'If your new to Tivo etc...' message.

Sorry if i gave false hope to anyone


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## wonderboy

my two tivos have stopped recording suggestions also. I was away on holiday and came back to nothing!! Arrghhh, I use them all the time. GRRR


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## ag5002

mista_c said:


> Hi there, welcome to the forum. When you say they re-activated your subscription, was your account actually closed and then a new one set up, or was it just the direct debit that was re-activated?
> 
> If it was the former, I would be interested to know if you are still able to successfully download listings.


I closed my account when _upgrading_ to Sky plus. Didn't like it so went back to Tivo and re-activated my old account. It was then that the DD failed and my account was suspended. I had no problem downloading listings upon the re-activation, and no problem downloading once they charged my debit card; just no suggestions since the suspension.

Incidentally, someone suggested that it is to do with the genre tags, but I can still search by genre using wishlists.


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## ag5002

Just managed to get hold of someone in UK Tivo tech. 

They are aware of the suggestions problem, and are investigating it. So a software fault has occured at central level somewhere. They are hoping to have a fix, but no time scales could be given.

Also, although they could not confirm for certain that Tivo would stick around in the UK, they stated that they were not aware of any plans to pull out, and in fact they continue to take on new customers.

Unofficially, they also stated that management were discussing the possibility of a re-launch in the UK. :up: One can only hope! perhaps we need to collectively start campaigning for this?


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## Automan

ag5002 said:


> Just managed to get hold of someone in UK Tivo tech.
> 
> They are aware of the suggestions problem, and are investigating it. So a software fault has occured at central level somewhere. They are hoping to have a fix, but no time scales could be given.
> 
> Also, although they could not confirm for certain that Tivo would stick around in the UK, they stated that they were not aware of any plans to pull out, and in fact they continue to take on new customers.
> 
> Unofficially, they also stated that management were discussing the possibility of a re-launch in the UK. :up: One can only hope! perhaps we need to collectively start campaigning for this?


I think you will find Tivo have zero presence in the UK and it has been this way for several years.

The UK "Help Desk" is operated by personel working for Sky TV.

Automan.


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## Goooner1

I've mentioned elsewhere, I'd happily pay &#163;1000 right now for a Sky HD box with a bigger harddrive and the latest TiVo software


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## riggers

My Tivo recorded a suggestion last Friday. A single episode of The Simpsons. Nothing else since 24th August and nothing again in suggestions. 

Wonder why it suddenly decided to record that one programme?


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## Suds

Riggers, did you happen to thumb any programs or recordings shortly before your one suggestion got recorded?

I ask because I deliberately looked for something to thumb last night - I thumbed-up at least one program and this morning I find I have exactly one suggestion recorded but back to "If your TiVo is new..."


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## Goooner1

That's exactly what I've done a couple of times over the last week. Thumbed a couple of things and they appear in the suggestions list but once they've been recorded or expired, then back to the "If your TiVo..." message.

Apart from that, I've had no suggestions in over a week now.


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## katman

Ive had a total of two suggestions recorded since I rebuilt my Tivo. Nothing showing in Suggestions and I havent thumbed anything. the only thumbs are from programs recorded by Season passes. Neither of the programs recorded had anything in common with what I like to watch !!!


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## Nero2

My Tivo hadn't recorded a suggestion since 24/08, but just a few minutes ago it decided to record something off Film4 (Joe Wright on David Lean).

Maybe all is not lost just yet.

ETA: It's the only thing showing in the suggesestion list though.


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## wonderboy

Will it help if we all call Tivo support about this or do we take it for granted that something is being done about it?

Without suggestions I may as well get sky+, which I do not want!!


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## 6022tivo

Goooner1 said:


> I've mentioned elsewhere, I'd happily pay £1000 right now for a Sky HD box with a bigger harddrive and the latest TiVo software


But no one else would to be honest..


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## digital_S

Nero2 said:


> My Tivo hadn't recorded a suggestion since 24/08, but just a few minutes ago it decided to record something off Film4 (Joe Wright on David Lean).
> 
> Maybe all is not lost just yet.
> 
> ETA: It's the only thing showing in the suggesestion list though.


So basically it seems like the 'thumbup' database on our TiVo's have been erased in someway or another?
As others have asked, do we start giving our programs more thumbups to compensate, or leave it and as wonderboy asked, do we wait till it goes back to normal?


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## hmallett

I've logged in to this site to post for the first time in years, having noticed I've had no suggestions since 22nd August.
In a way I'm glad it's not just me, as I upgraded the hard disk about 6 months ago, and I thought it may be related to that.
Hope it gets fixed reasonably quickly - you don't realise how nice it is to have the suggestions until they disappear.


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## JaybirdUK

wonderboy said:


> Will it help if we all call Tivo support about this or do we take it for granted that something is being done about it?


yes! it will help, I rang TiVo the other day and again today and they say they are waiting for an update but so far not many customers have complained.

Give them a ring on 01506 421710, the more people make them aware of the issue the bigger deal it is and eventually the Americans might listen.


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## Goooner1

Well, I've now done just that.

The guy said that they were aware of it, but they had no idea why it has happened or how to remedy it but that it had been passed on to America and unfortunately they had no idea on a timescale for a fix.

As JaybirdUK says, the more people that complain/report the problem, hopefully, the more urgently it may be treated.


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## AENG

The guy I spoke to claimed to know nothing about the problem and suggested I re-boot the TiVo by unplugging it


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## steveroe

I've spoken to customer services tonight, the initial operator didn't know of the problem but spoke to a supervisor and they confirmed that it was known and under investigation - no time scale.


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## sibo999

Coincidently I've chased it up again today too. Similar story. The matter has been reported to the states and is currently sat in the black hole over there. Supposedly they've been very busy recently with a new launch in foreign lands down under. 
As mentioned earlier in the thread the more people who get onto CS the better. 
I'm missing my suggestions.


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## philatio

Neeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeed suggestions!


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## mikerr

Hack to make suggestions on the current channel:

[edit] Now has its own thread:
forced suggestions


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## andonevris

I noticed something this morning that might mean something to someone.

I manually thumbed a load of programs yesterday and sure enough they started showing up in suggestions shortly thereafter. By the time I went to bed I had 8 suggestions scheduled for recording over the next few days.

This morning suggestions were empty again with none of the previously listed ones having been recorded. This made me wonder if the overnight processing of suggestions is the cause of all this. Tivo sees the thumbs when they are fresh but once the processing happens this info is lost somehow.

I don't know enough about the inner workings of tivo to understand exactly what's happening but it might mean something to someone.

Also since all this started happening at the same time for everyone has anyone considered it might be some kind of date problem? (Think Y2k bug without the y2k). 

BTW I rang Tivo customer "service" and was told to reboot my box...grrrr...

I think they have a flow chart which reads
a)Take Payment Details -name -credit card number - - -
b)*whatever the problem* -Reboot your box

Morons


----------



## KennyP

I had the same problem since about Aug 29. 

I tried this a couple days ago and my suggestions are NOW WORKING.

1) change the "record suggestions" option to OFF.
2) reboot Tivo
3) change the "record suggestions" option to ON.
4) reboot Tivo
5) force daily call

That was it. I found this on another site -- sorry, I don't remember where it was and cannot give credit where it is due. 

I did nothing else and now Tivo is again recording suggestions, just like it was two months ago. I hope this works for others.


----------



## kitschcamp

I tried that last week, and it's not had any impact on mine.


----------



## OzSat

The problem is not that TiVo is not recording suggestions - it is not creating suggestions to record.


----------



## SCOOBY.C

phoned in to register my problem and was told they were aware of it although no timescale for a fix, and was also monitoring the forums on the subject too!


----------



## einstein

Thanks to the co-operative efforts of TiVo users on the forums, I can stop scratching my head.

I've three TiVos, two on £10 a month, and a lifetime.

I love suggestions, especially when the TV is rubbish, and I've exhausted all TV programs. I start watching suggestions, but the other evening, there were none on my lifetime TiVo in Now Playing, I checked the TiVo Suggestions menu, and none were listed other than the standard, use thumbs up and down. I checked all the menus and settings, checked programs had Thumbs Up and Down on programs in guide, all were present, I created new Suggestions, and TiVo has recorded some of these, (2) but not many!

now, my other two TiVos are not recording suggestions!

All three TiVos look very empty in now playing! (tivoweb doesn't show any either!).

A new TV in UK - really? I want one!


----------



## Tim L

JaybirdUK said:


> Give them a ring on 01506 421710, the more people make them aware of the issue the bigger deal it is and eventually the Americans might listen.


Have added my voice to the chorus. The guy I spoke to suggested resetting my thumb data, which I did as it's moot at this point anyway, but I expect it will have the usual effect - record one suggestion then go back to twiddling its thumbs.

This is especially annoying to me as one of the biggest pros on Tivos side when weighing up an upgrade vs Freeview PVR a while ago was suggestions.


----------



## SPR

Phoned yesterday. Took a while to answer & was met with an another one suggesting "huh" and was told the same as others have been.

I asked for the reference number if it was a known problem so that I could get future updates and was told there isn't one; she just notifies daily of the number of calls she gets on the topic.

Can somebody that knows the internal working better explain the reason why a server problem has this impact?
I had always assumed that suggestions were decided locally on an algorithm based upon the thumbs database matched against the epg programme title & categories.

She said I could have the call noted on my account though.

At least I now know that I did remember to change my address with them when I moved as I passed the 'security check'! Was glad, as I feared that such an update may have put me in the dead account situation of others :-o


----------



## steveroe

From the Tivo manual page 10:



> Subscribing to TiVo will enable all of the personal TV functions. If you do not subscribe, your TiVo Recorder will have severely limited functionality. Subscription allows your Recorder to receive the following information via a daily telephone call:
> 
>  Programme Guide Data: Every day you will receive the latest programme guide data to make sure you always have up to two weeks worth of listings. Any changes in broadcast programming that have already been downloaded are made automatically. This programme guide data allows you to schedule recordings and book Season Passes. *It also enables TiVos Suggestions*
> 
>  Channel Highlights
> 
>  Inside TiVo
> 
>  Software updates from TiVo: As we add new features and makes enhancements, TiVo may occasionally update the software on your Recorder directly from the daily call. We will give you information on these additions via the Messages & Setup screen when they occur.


(My emphasis). I would say that they are not providing the paid for service anymore and could be in breach of contract?


----------



## Goooner1

Had my first suggestion recorded in over a week yesterday. None since and still nothing in the suggestions "to do" list.


----------



## BanditWS6

Crap, I have the same issue! My TiVo HD hasn't recorded a suggestion since 8/24. Seems to be the same date for everyone here!

I recently threw a Western Digital 1TB drive into it (replaced the old one) and was hoping that it wasn't something to do with that upgrade! Anyone else here got an upgraded hard drive, or are most of you running the stock drive? At first I thought the drive got full, so I deleted a bunch of recordings, but it didn't help. (Even so, if the drive were full, TiVo normally just deletes the oldest suggestions to make room for the new ones.)

When I look at my list of upcoming TiVo Suggestions, I have a list that's maybe 3 pages long covering the next two weeks. This list used to be a lot longer, if I recall correctly. But more importantly, none of the programs on that list ever wind up getting recorded as suggestions. It's very weird.

Suggestions are one of the top reasons I have a TiVo instead of a cable company "dumb box." Since there is no official fix yet, I'm going to try the aforementioned "toggle suggestions on/off, reboot and force a connection to TiVo" idea and see what happens. If I have any luck with anything, I'll let you all know.

BTW, I also have an old TiVo Series 2, and as far as I can see, it _is_ still recording suggestions. I should point out that I have Lifetime Service on both units. (I'll check my System Info screen and see if my account is still listed as "In Good Standing.")

Edit: I should add that I'm in the U.S. I found this thread by searching for "Suggestions."


----------



## riggers

KennyP said:


> I had the same problem since about Aug 29.
> 
> I tried this a couple days ago and my suggestions are NOW WORKING.
> 
> 1) change the "record suggestions" option to OFF.
> 2) reboot Tivo
> 3) change the "record suggestions" option to ON.
> 4) reboot Tivo
> 5) force daily call
> 
> That was it. I found this on another site -- sorry, I don't remember where it was and cannot give credit where it is due.
> 
> I did nothing else and now Tivo is again recording suggestions, just like it was two months ago. I hope this works for others.


Tried this but no suggestions have appeared


----------



## Goooner1

Thumbed up Lord of the Rings a short while ago and it immediately appeared in my suggestions list, so the problem would appear to be with the daily update call, rather than the thumbs.


----------



## ag5002

riggers said:


> Tried this but no suggestions have appeared


I have also tried the reboot toggle, but still no suggestions. 

I agree that technically Tivo are in breach of contract. Perhaps if enough of us keep phoning them and complaining they may take us seriously. I am going to phone tomorrow and see if they are prepared to give me a rebate! Will report how I get on.


----------



## RWILTS

Thats going to be a problem for those of us that have lifetime subscriptions that were not transferred properly when tivo bought second hand.


----------



## TCM2007

ag5002 said:


> I agree that technically Tivo are in breach of contract.


Suggest you read the T&C. Tivo can vary (or indeed cease) any or all aspects of the service at any time.


----------



## DeadKenny

Best you can get out of a breach of contract like this anyway would be they have no longer an obligation to deliver the service and you have no obligation to pay for it.

The contract however I think doesn't specify you have to pay (unlike say a lock in mobile contract), so there's no come back.

I should think any commitment in regards to a lifetime contract isn't worth the paper it's written on anyway. No company can truly be expected to deliver its service for ever. Consumer rights would also back this up as it's been more than enough time to consider it a reasonable lifetime of service.

Doubt a piddly thing like suggestions would really peak any lawyer's interest anyway.

Sucks, but it's another nail in the coffin. I've been seriously considering options for more than a couple of years now anyway, and it wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if it just gets switched off soon. I'd just been hoping it will hold on long enough for Sky to drop the HD monthly charge. Still struggling to bring myself to downgrade to their crappy EPG though.


----------



## Pete77

TCM2007 said:


> Suggest you read the T&C. Tivo can vary (or indeed cease) any or all aspects of the service at any time.


I believe that would be deemed to be an "unfair contract term" if the matter were to ever to go to court.


----------



## Pete77

No Suggestions of any kind here, neither any Scheduled Suggestions (as differentiated by Tivoweb) or other Suggestions. Also on the Tivo itself Suggestions shows "if your Tivo recorder is new" etc, etc, etc and there are no Suggestions provided. Nor have any Suggestions recorded in recent weeks.

Note that I am someone who has not been having the issues many of you have had with Suggestions on the whole and have had a good crop until the recent issue affecting all UK Tivo customers.

If I try User Interface/Preferences/Explicity Thumbed in Tivoweb I am getting the following error instead of a listing of my many thousands of thumbed series and programs. Does this mean anything to anyone here:-



> INTERNAL SERVER ERROR
> --cut here--
> action_preferences '/15' ''
> can't open object (0x00030007)
> 
> while executing
> "db $db openid $fsid"
> ("uplevel" body line 3)
> invoked from within
> "uplevel $body"
> invoked from within
> "ForeachMfsFileTrans fsid name type "/Preference/a/$preftype" "" 25 {
> set orphan 0
> set pref [db $db openid $fsid]
> set item [dbobj $pref get..."
> (procedure "::action_preferences" line 77)
> invoked from within
> "::action_$action $chan $part $env"
> ("eval" body line 1)
> invoked from within
> "eval {::action_$action $chan $part $env}"
> --cut here--


Further checks on my Tivo EPG show that all the thumb choices I have previously logged for programs/series are still held by the Tivo and are shown when I look up an EPG listing for a new program in that series. So it does not therefore appear as though Tivo (or even a Sky mole working for Tivo) have managed to send out a command to wipe our existing database of thumbs.

Thus the reasons why our Tivos are not generating any Suggestions any more remain a mystery.


----------



## Pete77

ozsat said:


> The problem is not that TiVo is not recording suggestions - it is not creating suggestions to record.


But why is it not creating any suggestions to record and why are all UK Tivo S1 users affected if, as you have previously maintained, the Suggestions are created by the Tivo itself using its own database and are not supplied by Tivo from its central database?

Does this mean you are still attempting to investigate what has gone wrong in conjunction with Tivo?


----------



## mikerr

Every other time suggestions have had a problem its been to do with genres being missing or assigned wrong in the guide data.


----------



## TCM2007

Pete77 said:


> I believe that would be deemed to be an "unfair contract term" if the matter were to ever to go to court.


As you can cancel your sub at any time, the idea that there would be a case for legal action because suggestion don't work is daft.


----------



## TCM2007

mikerr said:


> Every other time suggestions have had a problem its been to do with genres being missing or assigned wrong in the guide data.


Wasn't there a problem recently with SPs coming through on re-used TMSIDs? I wonder if that could be related somehow.


----------



## einstein

Tim L said:


> Have added my voice to the chorus. The guy I spoke to suggested resetting my thumb data, which I did as it's moot at this point anyway, but I expect it will have the usual effect - record one suggestion then go back to twiddling its thumbs.
> 
> This is especially annoying to me as one of the biggest pros on Tivos side when weighing up an upgrade vs Freeview PVR a while ago was suggestions.


added my voice as well, although the customer support person, didn't seem very interested, in all four TiVos have now stopped recording suggestions. He told me it was a know issue, and it was todo with Tivo communications from UK to US!

encryptLog called with infile = /var/persist/thumbslog.log.gz outfile = /var/persist/thumbslog.log.gz.bfg keyname = BACKHAUL_THUMB
09/14:01:36:56: /tvbin/TClient: EncryptLog Could not find /var/persist/thumbslog.log.gz
09/14:01:36:56: /tvbin/TClient: encryptLog called with infile = /var/log/tivoLog.prv.gz outfile = /var/log/tivoLog.prv.gz.bfg keyname = BACKHAUL_PRIVATE

i found this in the logs, dont know if it's normal, but the thumbslog.log.gz doesnt seem to be uploaded to TiVO HQ! Is this needed for Suggestions to work?


----------



## Pete77

TCM2007 said:


> As you can cancel your sub at any time, the idea that there would be a case for legal action because suggestion don't work is daft.


But you have already paid for the Lifetime sub in advance and so can't get your money back if they cancel the service.


----------



## Pete77

mikerr said:


> Every other time suggestions have had a problem its been to do with genres being missing or assigned wrong in the guide data.


Good point mike. I'm sure that's going to be at the back of the problem.


----------



## DanielB

I just rang up, and as soon as I said 'a question about suggestions?' I received a sigh, they know about, they say they have are passing it on to TiVo US the fact that people are calling in with the problem.

I get the feeling it is going to be a little while on this one.


----------



## Pete77

I called up Sky Tivo CS tonight on the 01506 number on the www.saynoto0870.com website and spoke to what I would call one of their very best long term Tivo CS reps (she has been there all the way since Tivo started in 2000) who said that she and the few long term dedicated Sky Tivo reps knew all about this Suggestions problem and were still chasing Tivo to do something about it along with the inability to transfer Lifetime Subs and inability to start a new monthly subs account on an existing box for a new owner.

She said she had heard that some customers were now so frustrated that they were even taking these matters up directly with Tivo in the States. It appears she and/or some of her other most senior colleagues keep an occasional eye on this forum and I'm sure were thinking of the heroic efforts in particular of TrainManG.

She said that officially Tivo are supposedly working on trying to fix all these problems and Tivo's publicly stated position is that there is no question at all of them suggesting they won't be fixed due to the increasing age of our UK S1 boxes. However unofficially she seemed to indicate she was personally pessimistic that Tivo was putting in much effort at all to do what was required to fix the various problems.

She also said that a lot of the direct online access interfaces they used to have to Tivo's systems to alter customer records at Sky had now been withdrawn and were no longer available and they could only carry out these operations by sending messages to Alviso and hoping they might then be acted upon by staff there. Reading between the lines she certainly appeared to paint a picture similar to that of the last days of the Roman Empire in respect of the priority Tivo Inc seems to attach to fixing these issues, most of which I was convinced she felt were originated by actions taken by Tivo and not by Sky's dedicated Tivo CS staff.

When I asked about many members of the forum getting vague answers or being told to clear out thumbs etc when they telephoned she said that was because only about three of them there had been doing Tivo support long term and the rest were other Sky staff who just covered the lines when they were busy as the total Tivo call volumes had been so low until the last week or two. She said there had been a huge surge in call volumes in the last 10 days or so due to the No Suggestions issue and especially since the forum thread had made people realise the issue was not due to a problem with just their Tivo box or hard drive. She said she had owned a Sky provided Tivo for several years but when the hard drive failed Sky had not given her an option to repair or replace the Tivo.

I am convinced this CS rep knew her stuff and the issues we are experiencing are therefore being generated by the continued reduction of allocated IT and other resources at Alviso to supporting the UK Tivo S1 platform. It would appear likely the loss of Suggestions for UK Tivo S1's is due to somebody at Tivo Inc doing something drastic to the genres information that affects not just Tivoweb but now also the normal UK S1's main Suggestions menu.

Anyhow I felt the above information was sufficiently good and accurate to post and it shows that some employees at Sky Tivo CS do know their stuff and do love the Tivo (as this lady assured me she had done through all its early years as it was much easier than Sky+ to use and also more flexible) but they feel powerless to do anything about what appears to be Tivo Inc's general willingness to let the UK service now run slowly in to the ground through a process of active neglect.:down:


----------



## Tim L

Ho hum. Is it worth emailing them at Alviso about this, or will we just get told it isn't their problem?


----------



## RWILTS

I have found that at 07:03am on Sunday 14th ' A NEW LIFE IN CANADA' on BBCRW (thats BBC RADIO WALES!!!). Yes a RADIO broadcast!!! was recorded for me as a suggestion.

No other suggestions listed for future recording though.......


----------



## cleudo

I got Primary Colors recorded off BBC4 as a suggestion at 10pm last night (Sunday), but no future suggestions scheduled.

Why don't we all email tivo hq? Address anyone?


----------



## Pete77

Tim L said:


> Ho hum. Is it worth emailing them at Alviso about this, or will we just get told it isn't their problem?


You can find the names of Tivo's senior staff on their website but I have never yet had a read receipt let alone a response to any email I have ever tried to send them over several years using all normal possible variants of corporate email address formats (eg firstname.lastname, firstnamelastname, firstname_lastname, firstname, firstnamex or xlastname etc). They seem to have a policy of actively ignoring all customer emails to their top brass from what I can tell.

Tribune Media Services have a much better record and I have had responses to queries about missing channels etc from staff in both their US HQ and at their European subsidiary. However I think this Suggestions problem will be a Tivo Inc database issue and not a Tribune Media Services EPG issue.


----------



## Pete77

cleudo said:


> Why don't we all email tivo hq? Address anyone?


To stand any hope of a reply at all I would try using the following contact forms on their website:-

Media Enquiries at www.tivo.com/abouttivo/contactus/tivo_media_inquiries.html

and

Investor Relations at http://investor.tivo.com/contactus.cfm

I am not convinced their three other contact forms for suggestions for new features or for feedback about their website or for their dealer hotline are likely to be taken any notice of as these will be dealt with by less skilled and educated Tivo staff who will probably decide that questions from British customers are nothing to do with them.

Media Enquiries and Investor Relations usually employ staff with a brain so you may stand at least some vague chance of your query being passed on to the right person in the company.


----------



## TiVoPony

Hey all,

We had this brought to our attention a few days ago and are investigating. I hope to have something to share with you soon.

I do know that Tribune recently updated their show identifiers for the UK (similar change that we took here in the US last Fall). Will let you know what we find...

Thanks, appreciate your patience!

Pony


----------



## Tim L

Cheers!


----------



## Pete77

TiVoPony said:


> We had this brought to our attention a few days ago and are investigating. I hope to have something to share with you soon.
> 
> I do know that Tribune recently updated their show identifiers for the UK (similar change that we took here in the US last Fall). Will let you know what we find...


Hi Pony,

This must be good news indeed if Tivo is now taking this whole issue seriously enough for us to have the now very rare pleasure of you making an appearance in the UK section of the forum.

If you say that the problem with us now having no Suggestions is linked with Tribune altering their show identifiers that does make sense in view of the extensive recent problems also recently noted with corrupted Season Passes linking to episodes of programs from other series. Something seems to have gone significantly amiss in communication between Tribune and Tivo but I guess that Tribune in fact controls almost every aspect of our Tivos that is related to the actual shows and the selection of shows for recording by Season Passes, Wishlists and Suggestions.

One thing I guess we could also appreciate a comment from Tivo Inc on is the long running issue with transferring Lifetime Subscriptions or changing the payer of a monthly subscription on a Tivo to a different owner. I know your colleague Jerry was kindly looking in to that for us over on another thread but there never seems to have been a positive resolution of that issue.

Fortunately I am not affected by it myself but several other forum members are. So I'm sure that anything more you can tell us on progress in also resolving that issue would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks once again for stopping by to reassure us UK Tivo types that the guys back in California are concerned about and are investigating our various current little issues.:up:


----------



## cwaring

You could have just said "thanks" Pete


----------



## kitschcamp

Quite. Many thanks TivoPony for letting us know what's going on and reassuring us that we're not forgotten.


----------



## AENG

TiVo Pony - Thank you! The most encouraging post on this forum I've seen in a long time. Now, about HD...


----------



## 7tplus

My faith in Tivo once again restored.
The fact that someone in the US even reads the British forum
is reassuring in itself.
Why oh why don't you sell them over here again? After all,
you are the best.


----------



## Pete77

7tplus said:


> My faith in Tivo once again restored.
> The fact that someone in the US even reads the British forum
> is reassuring in itself.


7tplus where have you been hiding for all this time? Or did you only feel the need to make your first post here when the Suggestions function broke on your Tivo? I see you did actually join the forum over three years ago though in April 2005.

Regarding TivoPony yes his post is encouraging but I would hold off on the praise being too fulsome until Tivo actually fix the issues with Suggestions being broken, Season Passes now regularly getting broken and cross linking to other series and with lifetime subscriptions not being amendable and new subscribers not able to join Tivo on a monthly basis until they have attended to and fixed all of those problems.

As we saw with the previous attempt to help us by TivoJerry there is a big difference between Tivo saying it wants to sort out the UK Tivo issues and it actually sorting them out on a permanent basis.


----------



## cwaring

Pete77. With all due respect, do you _have_ to be so negative all the time and, if the answer is yes, would it be possible for you to restrain yourself within this Forum; even just this once? 

The problem has been noticed and they're in the process of trying to fix it. Jeez. Give them a break will ya!


----------



## Pete77

cwaring said:


> The problem has been noticed and they're in the process of trying to fix it.


So long as their efforts are more timely and successful than those of Network Rail than I will be happy.

Customer service departments the world over will always tell you that a company is working on fixing a problem if you raise it as a customer. But the key difference is those companies who actually fix their problems or better still never have them in the first place and those companies who always say they are still working on their problems (eg Virgin ADSL or Talktalk) but never actually seems to manage to fix them.......

TivoPony has clearly arrived to try to pour oil on the troubled waters but I only hope he and his colleagues in marketing are now also able to call upon the necessary resources in Tivo's IT area to work through these various problems and fix them.


----------



## andonevris

Maybe it's attitudes like yours Pete77 that puts people off posting. What's your problem if this is his first post??

Some people lurk and use forums for tech support, others feel the need to rack up their post counts and be active members of the community. I see nothing wrong with either.


----------



## Pete77

andonevris said:


> Some people lurk and use forums for tech support, others feel the need to rack up their post counts and be active members of the community. I see nothing wrong with either.


andronveris,

You make a fair point and I make no claim that my posts are of special merit. And I note you have only posted very sparingly yourself in the last 7 years but have posted a number of times before.

I was not criticising the other poster for posting but merely saying the loss of Suggestions and the fact that Tivo are now officially (since any post by TivoPony is surely a representation the official Tivo corporate line on matters relating to UK customers and the UK Tivo service) saying that they will work to restore them must be very important to the OP to have suddenly prompted them in to posting after 3 years or so of simply quietly monitoring what was posted on the forum now and again.

This surely proves that Suggestions are an important and valued Tivo function for many Tivo owners.


----------



## OzSat

TiVoPony said:


> Hey all,
> 
> We had this brought to our attention a few days ago and are investigating. I hope to have something to share with you soon.
> 
> I do know that Tribune recently updated their show identifiers for the UK (similar change that we took here in the US last Fall). Will let you know what we find...
> 
> Thanks, appreciate your patience!
> 
> Pony


Thanks for posting Pony.

Can I just clarify that I originally raised this issue on 29th August and it was being investigated then - so its more than a few days.

I think the concern of many UK subscribers is that "we no longer matter" - as this is the second problem which is now dragging on - the first is now months old.

I know there have been some issued with the guide data (SPs etc) - but when spotted they are fixed asap - the problem is they are often not spotted with enough time to get fixed.

It is nice to know that the US still remembers that the UK is still here - even if we are on old technology - and still hoping for something new


----------



## Pete77

ozsat said:


> I think the concern of many UK subscribers is that "we no longer matter" - as this is the second problem which is now dragging on - the first is now months old.


Well said ozsat. This is a pretty strong statement by your normally highly diplomatic standards and it is of course exactly how the UK customers feel.

I would imagine that you have already been working on this behind the scenes through your various special contact channels with Tivo but clearly so far this has been without any form of positive outcome. My own conversation last night with a very long serving Sky Tivo rep also pretty much convinced me that Sky are not in any way to blame for most of the recent problems, although I will reserve judgement on the issue of not being able to transfer Lifetime Subs or start up a new Monthly Sub for a new subscriber.


----------



## andonevris

Pete77 said:


> andronveris,
> I was not criticising the other poster for posting but merely saying the loss of Suggestions and the fact that Tivo are now officially (since any post by TivoPony is surely a representation the official Tivo corporate line on matters relating to UK customers and the UK Tivo service) saying that they will work to restore them must be very important to the OP to have suddenly prompted them in to posting after 3 years or so of simply quietly monitoring what was posted on the forum now and again.
> 
> This surely proves that Suggestions are an important and valued Tivo function for many Tivo owners.


Fair enough Pete. It's easy to understand why someone was prompted into posting on this subject, especially when reading back through the thread where there has been talk of Tivo shutting down the UK service by active neglect etc... and I agree, I believe suggestions are an important function of the tivo service. I just felt your tone was a bit harsh just because someone decided to make their first post on this particular subject.

I too was very encouraged to read the US haven't forgotten us and although I take your point that acknowledging the fault is no indication that the problem will be imminently fixed at least we know the US now knows about it and are looking into it...better than the tumbleweeds we normally get blowing across the UK forums from America.

For me personally my Tivo has been one of the best purchases of electronic goods I've ever made, it just does its job with no fuss. I've had my box since the very beginning and for years resisted the natural hacker in me and just left it as standard, because it worked so well. I too was very happy indeed when I saw the post from Tivopony.

These forums have been an invaluable resource for the odd occasion when things have gone wrong and since I've hacked my box even more so, but nothing from any "official" sources just the dedicated tivo lovers on these boards, so a nod from Tivo HQ is very encouraging... anyway I digest (sic)

Let's just be happy that something is (hopefully) being done about our current problems...


----------



## Pete77

I agree with all the points you make in your last post andonevris and I am pleased to hear that you finally took the plunge on upgrading. It also took me nearly 3 years to upgrade and it was only really when the cost fell so much and the increase in recording hours became so huge that it became irresistible. It was the same thing with buying Tivo originally as their rather poor marketing effort in the UK meant I did get round to getting one until they seemed a bargain in December 2002.

I am hopeful that TivoPony's intervention means that Tivo are now conscious that enough problems have conspired to accumulate and are causing sufficient upset with the UK customer base that the time of a programmer or two can be allocated to properly work through and resolve those problems. I'm sure its just a question of programmer time and there are no insuperable technological obstacle caused by the passage of time that cannot be overcome. I have no wish to consign my Tivo to the attic (or the loft as I should say as a Brit) as yet, especially as I find the lure of HD television to not be especially strong in my own case.


----------



## ColinYounger

Pete77 said:


> especially as I find the lure of HD television to not be especially strong in my own case.


Right - would the real Pete please stand up? This is obviously not him.


----------



## Pete77

ColinYounger said:


> Right - would the real Pete please stand up? This is obviously not him.


Yes it is the real me.

TCM will vouch for the fact that I have consistently been unpersuaded that the extra costs of HD in terms of equipment and subscriptions are worth it ever since it was first launched.


----------



## ColinYounger

Ahh - but the real Pete uses more forceful language. But enough drift - I'll be getting bored of myself soon.


----------



## rondun

Seems I've had this problem for a while too, just haven't noticed it until recently when I started deleting programmes because the hd was full.

Anyway it's started recording suggestions again this morning - although why Cheaper by the Dozen is currently being recorded is beyond me!

Didn't realise I missed the suggestions until now!


----------



## Pete77

rondun said:


> Anyway it's started recording suggestions again this morning - although why Cheaper by the Dozen is currently being recorded is beyond me!


Still no Suggestions recording here.


----------



## mafiu

My suggestions stopped as well - Glad I googled this thread to watch what was going on..

Matthew


----------



## Pete77

Pete77 said:


> You can find the names of Tivo's senior staff on their website but I have never yet had a read receipt let alone a response to any email I have ever tried to send them over several years using all normal possible variants of corporate email address formats (eg firstname.lastname, firstnamelastname, firstname_lastname, firstname, firstnamex or xlastname etc).


Regarding the above I just wanted to say that I now recally TivoPony did once reply to a PM I sent him a year or two back and that he said he had passed on my comments to the relevant department.

So to be fair TivoPony and TivoJerry are actually a way to make official comments to Tivo but as both of them are now already well aware of the UK S1 Tivo Suggestions, Subscriptions and Broken SP issues and have participated in the relevant threads I don't think there is any point in each of us inundating their personal Tivo PM mailboxes on the matter. It would be more productive to call Sky Tivo Customer Services and bump up the official complaint statistics that somone somewhere at Tivo must surely be monitoring?


----------



## TiVoPony

Pete77 said:


> So to be fair TivoPony and TivoJerry are actually a way to make official comments to Tivo but as both of them are now already well aware of the UK S1 Tivo Suggestions, Subscriptions and Broken SP issues and have participated in the relevant threads I don't think there is any point in each of us inundating their personal Tivo PM mailboxes on the matter. It would be more productive to call Sky Tivo Customer Services and bump up the official complaint statistics that somone somewhere at Tivo must surely be monitoring?


Just to be fair here, I must admit that I wasn't aware of the broken Season Pass issue or the Lifetime issue until reading this thread just now. Looking on the forum I found what I think you're describing as the Season Pass issue...it appears that someone here at TiVo worked with Ozsat and got a hiccup in the data resolved (I have a good idea who that was). I didn't find a thread for the Lifetime issue you mention. Feel free to point me in the right direction. 

On Suggestions, still looking into it, but if our suspicions are correct we may not have a great solution to pull out of the hat. We're dealing with very old technology here (as I can tell every time I look in the mirror - man, where did that young kid that shipped Series1 go?).

More as the details become available...

Thanks,
Pony


----------



## OzSat

TiVoPony said:


> Feel free to point me in the right direction.


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=392168

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=401875


----------



## kweller

I came on here after a long absence to see if I could find an answer to something else and I'm glad I did, I can stop trying to get Suggestions to work now!



> On Suggestions, still looking into it, but if our suspicions are correct we may not have a great solution to pull out of the hat. We're dealing with very old technology here


I have to say that doesn't sound very encouraging.

Kevin


----------



## Pete77

TiVoPony said:


> On Suggestions, still looking into it, but if our suspicions are correct we may not have a great solution to pull out of the hat. We're dealing with very old technology here (as I can tell every time I look in the mirror - man, where did that young kid that shipped Series1 go?).


Does that mean that Suggestions also no longer work on the Tivo S1 models across the pond then in the land of the brave and the free? Alternatively if they do still work for equally old US S1 Tivos then what has happened to break things for our UK S1 Tivo units? I guess this has to be do with some major kind of change in either Tribune or Tivo's database structures in order to enhance facilities for the S3 units?

Perhaps it would be unacceptable to break things like Suggestion on the US S1 Tivo models because there are a lot more of those customers left than in the UK and because of the negative marketing ramifications that might then have in a marketplace where you are still selling new units bearing the Tivo brand name?


----------



## BanditWS6

I've been mostly posting my experiences with the suggestions problem over in this thread, because it seems to be mostly other U.S. customers over there. But I wanted to also cross-post my findings here.

Specifically, the "turn suggestions off / reboot / turn suggestions back on / reboot / force a call to TiVo" sequence seems to have worked for me. My list of upcoming suggestions is now 8-10 pages long, and 60-70 suggestions have recorded since 9/13, when I implemented the above sequence. My TiVo is now operating just as it was before suggestions mysteriously stopped working.

In the other thread, we've had some users report success with this sequence, and others report failure. It's of interest (to me at least) that most, if not all, of those who have reported failure are using Series1 TiVos. I myself have a TiVo HD (as well as a 2004 vintage Series2 that has behaved normally through all of this.)


----------



## OzSat

I only see an option to 'turn pff/on recording of suggestions' - the suggestions should be generated and viewable whether or not you are recording them.

The UK only has 'Series 1' machines.


----------



## Pete77

BanditWS6 said:


> Specifically, the "turn suggestions off / reboot / turn suggestions back on / reboot / force a call to TiVo" sequence seems to have worked for me.


We have had another UK Tivo S1 user suggest that this worked for him but I tried it and it didn't work for me (I use a Tivo S1 as do all of us here in the UK). What method was used for the reboot during the above process? Was it a soft reboot from the System Reset menu or a hard reboot by pulling the power plug after first choosing System Reset and then pulling the plug at the Powering Up screen?


----------



## Pete77

ozsat said:


> I only see an option to 'turn pff/on recording of suggestions' - the suggestions should be generated and viewable whether or not you are recording them.


I agree. Whereas currently Suggestions are empty as though the Tivo is new and has only been turned on a few hours and nothing has yet been thumbed.



> The UK only has 'Series 1' machines.


To be fair I got the impression that our friend from the US side of the forum was aware of that but was simply trying to draw our attention to the similar problems that have been occurring across the pond. I know that I for one mainly only look at the Tivo UK and UK General Chit-Chat forum sections on the whole.


----------



## wonderboy

Does anyone know if this problem occurs on an unmodified vanilla Tivo with dial-up?


----------



## Pete77

wonderboy said:


> Does anyone know if this problem occurs on an unmodified vanilla Tivo with dial-up?


Yes it does.


----------



## sibo999

Unfortunately yes. I've got modified and unmodified , dial up and network, and they all have the same symptoms. :-(


----------



## wonderboy

Well at least that is good news for those of us with hacked boxes (i.e. Tivo cannot point the finger and say "it's your fault!")

I am seriously shocked we can't get an official statement from them that they are actually looking in to this though...


----------



## BanditWS6

ozsat said:


> I only see an option to 'turn pff/on recording of suggestions' - the suggestions should be generated and viewable whether or not you are recording them.


Correct. It was technically the _recording_ of suggestions that I switched on and off. Beforehand, my generated list of suggestions was much shorter than it should have been, and none of the programs on that list were getting recorded, despite recording of suggestions being enabled at the time.



Pete77 said:


> What method was used for the reboot during the above process? Was it a soft reboot from the System Reset menu or a hard reboot by pulling the power plug after first choosing System Reset and then pulling the plug at the Powering Up screen?


In both cases, it was a soft reboot from the System Reset menu.



Pete77 said:


> To be fair I got the impression that our friend from the US side of the forum was aware of that but was simply trying to draw our attention to the similar problems that have been occurring across the pond.


You're correct in that this was my intention. I've noticed a seemingly disproportionate number (admittedly with only a small sample) of Series1 users on the U.S. forums are having trouble with suggestions, and thought it might be valuable to note here that U.S. TiVo users are having the suggestions issue as well.


----------



## ColinYounger

TiVoPony said:


> if our suspicions are correct we may not have a great solution to pull out of the hat.


My pessimistic take on this is:

"We've implemented a wonderful new S3 feature, which involved a database restructure. We thought this would be OK for S1/S2, but it looks like a latent bug in the S1 software has reared it's ugly head because of the restructure. Trouble is, to fix it we have to remove the new feature - and we can't remove functionality or we'll suffer current users having a revolt".

"There are more paying S3\S2 users than S1 users - so we'll see what we can do, but no promises."

Pony - I appreciate that you're trying to help, but we've only got sugared water so far.

[NOTE: Pete has hijacked this account]


----------



## Mostin

WOW this post has got big!! I've been away on holiday for a few weeks and hoped this might be sorted by now.

I'm a big F1 fan and have used a seasons pass happily for years. As soon as i got back i checked tivo and i see that it missed qualifying, live race and the highlights for belgium but recorded all of them for monza last weekend.

It recorded something else i set on the sunday night and i didn't have a power cut. If suggestions were on it might have done it for me

I'm a bit lost on why it wouldn't do the grand prix for me. Is this another problem thats connected with this?


----------



## Pete77

ColinYounger said:


> My pessimistic take on this is:
> 
> "We've implemented a wonderful new S3 feature, which involved a database restructure. We thought this would be OK for S1/S2, but it looks like a latent bug in the S1 software has reared it's ugly head because of the restructure. Trouble is, to fix it we have to remove the new feature - and we can't remove functionality or we'll suffer current users having a revolt".


That was also how it sounded to me. A good translation there on your part of marketing man speak with your seasoned programmer's view also concurring with that of a natural cynic about the headless chickenlike and press on regardless nature of much of business today. However I'm not convinced that there is necessarily a killer new Tivo S3 feature that has actually been released in to the wild already that is directly responsible. After all they might just have restructured the database to see if they could provide for the killer new S3 feature but not yet released the new software with the new feature to end users. This means they ought to be able to rollback the database to its earlier state and then think of a different way to provide the killer new feature for the S3.



> Pony - I appreciate that you're trying to help, but we've only got sugared water so far.


His mistake was clearly to first appear in the thread initially sounding optimistic that a resolution would be found only to downgrade the state of health of the patient later. Whereas had he said he noted our concerns and would do what he could but couldn't promise a positive outcome then no one would have had their hopes falsely raised. Its that old "always under promise and over deliver" thing again.........



> [NOTE: Pete has hijacked this account]


You just hate to admit that on some things both you and I think alike.


----------



## cwaring

Pete77 said:


> His mistake was clearly to..


Come in here at all with posters like you around?


----------



## DeadKenny

sibo999 said:


> Unfortunately yes. I've got modified and unmodified , dial up and network, and they all have the same symptoms. :-(


Likewise here. Unmodified and shows the same problem.

That said, for some reason it recorded one suggestion on the 15th. But that's it, and still the suggestions page shows no suggestions and tells me I should thumb some stuff (which I've tried but doesn't help).

If I turn off & on suggestions do I lose my current data? I don't really want to do that as it's built up my preferences over a lot of years.


----------



## MarkH

Have had this problem myself and thanks to everyone in their efforts to resolve this, hopefully the company can demonstrate their integrity, by resolving this issue for all the subscribers who love their tivos!


----------



## martink0646

Hi All,

I had a suggestion record overnight!!!! It was the Southampton Boat Show??

When my boy has finished watching a DVD I will check to see if anymore are scheduled.

Martin


----------



## Mostin

Still nothing for me. I really miss the suggestions


----------



## JaybirdUK

Im getting a bit annoyed by this now, its the one reason Ive continued to pay my &#163;10 per month and not got another PVR.

Tivo need to fix this or at least suspend the monthly sub until fixed.

Keep calling the TiVo centre and pester them into a solution


----------



## steveroe

Same here - on the 24th it will be a month and I will be requesting some sort of refund...

You never know how much you value something until it's gone, as they say (or someone does).


----------



## cwaring

I have to say that Suggestions is the one feature of Tivo that I have almost never used. I record far to much via SPs to ever bother with them


----------



## Tim L

steveroe said:


> Same here - on the 24th it will be a month and I will be requesting some sort of refund...


Me too. Suggestions are the feature that weighed in Tivo's favour when I considered replacing it with a Freeview PVR a while ago.


----------



## wonderboy

I had a suggestion recorded yesterday, but only because my wife "thumbed-up" a show she was watching - tivo then recorded another the same day, nothing since. 

Circumstantial, but Looks as though all the thumb ratings are being 'forgotten' by the daily call. Has anyone tried disconnecting from network and re-doing a lot of thumb rating?

With two weeks guide data it may be worth a shot...


----------



## rondun

wonderboy said:


> I had a suggestion recorded yesterday, but only because my wife "thumbed-up" a show she was watching - tivo then recorded another the same day, nothing since.


I think that's exactly what happened to me - accidentally hit a thumb then got 2 suggestions recorded. Nothing since. I subconsciously keep deleting stuff because I think my HD is too full for suggestions.
Guess I miss them more than I realised.


----------



## mista_c

ag5002 said:


> I closed my account when _upgrading_ to Sky plus. Didn't like it so went back to Tivo and re-activated my old account. It was then that the DD failed and my account was suspended. I had no problem downloading listings upon the re-activation, and no problem downloading once they charged my debit card; just no suggestions since the suspension.
> 
> Incidentally, someone suggested that it is to do with the genre tags, but I can still search by genre using wishlists.


@ ag5002: I am trying to resolve an issue I have with a Tivo that will not re-activate. Tivo UK have seen your posts here and would like to investigate this further. Could you PM me please? Many thanks


----------



## ag5002

JaybirdUK said:


> Im getting a bit annoyed by this now, its the one reason Ive continued to pay my £10 per month and not got another PVR.
> 
> Tivo need to fix this or at least suspend the monthly sub until fixed.
> 
> Keep calling the TiVo centre and pester them into a solution


I agree. I love my Tivo but one of the reasons for the subscription is the suggestions. You can buy an inexpensive freeview PVR with no ongoing costs. However the UI is poor by comparision.

I really hope Tivo come up with a fix for this. I reckon I will give them 30 more days before moving on. Does anyone know of a freesat PVR yet? (HD )


----------



## 6022tivo

Reading this thread every couple of days makes me feel very sad that nothing is being resolved....


----------



## AMc

ag5002 said:


> Does anyone know of a freesat PVR yet? (HD )


Humax have announced a model and shown it at trade shows but not yet made it available for sale. It's supposed to be released before the end of the year. I'm waiting to see how it's reviewed before seriously considering it - it's all about the UI!


----------



## Goooner1

ag5002 said:


> I agree. I love my Tivo but one of the reasons for the subscription is the suggestions. You can buy an inexpensive freeview PVR with no ongoing costs. However the UI is poor by comparision.
> 
> I really hope Tivo come up with a fix for this. I reckon I will give them 30 more days before moving on. Does anyone know of a freesat PVR yet? (HD )


Same here, I'll give them another month and if no solution is forthcoming, much as I love my TiVo, I'll cancel my sub and make do with my Sky HD box (hopefully the new EPG will be an improvement on the current one, but obviously nowhere near as good as the TiVo one)


----------



## RWILTS

Although i accept peoples opinions I have to say that suggestions has been the least used function of my Tivo use in the last 2 years. Yes its a key feature but without it and assuming that this is not the beginning of a series of issues we still have a killer bit of kit best in class.

1. Excellent GUI
2. Intel/ working season pass feature
3. Hackable 
4. Nice to be part of a community

So 1 , 2 , 3, "Always look on the bright side of life"


----------



## pj280167

My brother's TiVo gave up recording suggestions after I upgraded his hard drive  He's not happy with me...I think I'm going to bit copy from my old one when I upgrade and hopefully I'll get away with it. If you're monitoring this thread TiVo is there a fix on its way ?


----------



## cwaring

RWILTS said:


> Although i accept peoples opinions I have to say that suggestions has been the least used function of my Tivo use in the last 2years.


Absolutely. Although, of course, you meant 'perspective' didn't you?


----------



## a_tivo_noob

hmmm, Father Ted recorded today which is a regular suggestion... I did nothing to prompt it either (so i didn't "thumbs down, thumbs up it")

this is the second random one i've had...


----------



## TiVoPony

Still investigating this guys. Nothing new to share, just wanted you to know that it hasn't been forgotten.

Thanks,
Pony


----------



## RogerL

Not investigating very hard I don't think.

This is no intermittent problem, we're all suffering it and its been a month now.

I appreciate the UK Tivos won't come very high in the priority of things, but something that takes this long to fix is causing me to lose faith in the brand I love.


----------



## ag5002

RWILTS said:


> Although i accept peoples opinions I have to say that suggestions has been the least used function of my Tivo use in the last 2 years. Yes its a key feature but without it and assuming that this is not the beginning of a series of issues we still have a killer bit of kit best in class.
> 
> 1. Excellent GUI
> 2. Intel/ working season pass feature
> 3. Hackable
> 4. Nice to be part of a community
> 
> So 1 , 2 , 3, "Always look on the bright side of life"


You are so right. I too was reminded last night about the other important aspects of Tivo. While watching a recording, there was a trailer for a programme I wanted which had already passed. I went into the record by time feature, stepped *backwards* in the EPG, (the only system to allow this) and after finding the programme, looked at 'upcoming broadcasts' to find another showing. Sorted!

How many other PVRs offer such functionality?


----------



## ag5002

TiVoPony said:


> Still investigating this guys. Nothing new to share, just wanted you to know that it hasn't been forgotten.
> 
> Thanks,
> Pony


Thanks TivoPony. We are all really hoping that Tivo do sort this. It is obvious there is still a big following in the UK, and we don't want to all be forced to end up with some second rate rival platform.

How about a proper re-launch?  Plenty of beta testers around here!


----------



## Goooner1

ag5002 said:


> You are so right. I too was reminded last night about the other important aspects of Tivo. While watching a recording, there was a trailer for a programme I wanted which had already passed. I went into the record by time feature, stepped *backwards* in the EPG, (the only system to allow this) and after finding the programme, looked at 'upcoming broadcasts' to find another showing. Sorted!
> 
> How many other PVRs offer such functionality?


Whilst I agree, TiVo is streets ahead of anything else out there, never having got around to getting a lifetime sub, is it worth £10 per month when it's not performing as it should? Personally, I don't think it is, especially in the current climate where money is getting tighter.

Whilst all that functionality is great to have, since suggestions haven't been working, I seem to be relying less on my TiVO and using my Sky HD box more, so if it isn't sorted soon, I'm sure I can manage without and save myself a tenner a month. It'd be one less box under the TV toom which I'm sure the mrs would appreciate


----------



## TCM2007

I find it fascinating that people use their TiVos so differently. I always had Suggestions turned off on mine.


----------



## Automan

TiVoPony said:


> Still investigating this guys. Nothing new to share, just wanted you to know that it hasn't been forgotten.
> 
> Thanks,
> Pony


If you can't fix it can we have a nice new Tivo model for the UK market?

Automan.


----------



## kitschcamp

Automan said:


> If you can't fix it can we have a nice new Tivo model for the UK market?


And Scandinavia! There isn't a decent PVR available here for either of the two big pan-Scandinavia sat providers, or the cable networks.


----------



## verses

TCM2007 said:


> I find it fascinating that people use their TiVos so differently. I always had Suggestions turned off on mine.


I used to have them enabled, but I only really used them as an indication of how much free disc space was left. I disabled them a while back (I can't remember why) and they've not been missed.

Ian


----------



## Goooner1

Whether anyone used the suggestions or not, if you're on a monthly sub, you're paying for something you aren't getting, so the need to either fix it or reduce the sub, or I'll be (somewhat reluctantly) ditching my TiVo after all this time.


----------



## verses

Goooner1 said:


> Whether anyone used the suggestions or not, if you're on a monthly sub, you're paying for something you aren't getting, so the need to either fix it or reduce the sub, or I'll be (somewhat reluctantly) ditching my TiVo after all this time.


Absolutely, my comment wasn't meant to imply that it is excusable for Suggestions to be broken, more that I'm surprised at how many people miss them.

Ian


----------



## ColinYounger

Hey TCM - why not post a comparison between our TiVo's and VMC? Perhaps someone on TechRadar could do a comparison like this old article that I've posted before.

With all this Suggestions malarkey, I'm sure that we could give some useful advice.

As I am of a technical nature, if you want to supply me with some review kit, I'll write one up myself. <heh> I'll even investigate how easy it is to hack and see if Suggestions are possible.


----------



## TCM2007

It would be quite easy to write a suggestions plug-in for VMC - at least so far as the basic program goes. Getting an intelligent suggestions algorithm might be tougher.


----------



## F. Jones

I suggest that everyone having this problem call and threaten to cancel their subscriptions if it is not fixed. Many of us across the pond are also having this problem and tech support is saying they've never heard about this. We need to get their attention.


----------



## Pete77

F. Jones said:


> I suggest that everyone having this problem call and threaten to cancel their subscriptions if it is not fixed.


Careful though because as things now stand if you unsubscribe a monthly subbed S1 Tivo you can then no longer resubscribe the unit and will be forced to upgrade to a Tivo S2 or S3 instead if you live across the pond.

That could be exactly what Tivo want to try and force you to do.

Over here in the UK though the situation is more complicated as they refused to make the S2 and S3 platforms available for their UK customer base (even though they could if they wanted to) so we have to keep our ageing S1 units still running to continue receiving Tivo service.


----------



## ag5002

Spoke to Tivo UK customer service again last night.

They _assure_ me that Tivo are aware of the problems, and are working to provide a solution. The problems are far more than just the suggestions and in many ways it is good to hear that they also affect US customers, as this means there is more chance of a proper fix. Tivo cannot ignore this as it would threaten their entire business model.

I suggest we all hold on a bit longer and hope.


----------



## davisa

I seem to have just done the unthinkable and 'won' a cheap Topfield 5800PVR on ebay. If this works out I will cancel both cable TV and TiVo £10/month service, after 7 years of being a TiVO evangelist. I almost hope it doesn't...


----------



## ag5002

davisa said:


> I seem to have just done the unthinkable and 'won' a cheap Topfield 5800PVR on ebay. If this works out I will cancel both cable TV and TiVo £10/month service, after 7 years of being a TiVO evangelist. I almost hope it doesn't...



So sad. Where's my prozac?


----------



## andonevris

The Toppy looks nice, I've mulled over it myself. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on it davisa.

Now if someone would write a suggestions module for it I'd switch tomorrow.


----------



## F. Jones

ag5002 said:


> Tivo cannot ignore this as it would threaten their entire business model.


They seem to have done a pretty good job of ignoring it so far. Although if the information TiVo gave you is correct, maybe they actually are trying to fix the problem and just have bad lines of communication within the company.

I'm rooting for the lesser of two incompetences.


----------



## AMc

I'm hoping that the fix can be made in the guide data alone - if it's a .1 change to the 2.5.5 software and they don't add kernel changes to deal with >137GB then it could bork my upgraded Tivo and trash my hacks. There's something to mull  !


----------



## ashagplz

no suggestions for me either..btw..off-topic but why is it that no one else has put tivo like software in their pvr's?


----------



## mikerr

ashagplz said:


> why is it that no one else has put tivo like software in their pvr's?


Frightened of tivo lawyers? Tivo licensing fees too high?


----------



## pj280167

Having being a little cocky in another thread by saying that my TIvo's working fine it's now not...... The last suggestion recorded was on 20/09 but the most recent ones before that were 22/08... Now no suggestions at all despite plenty of spare space on the hard drive. Also nothing showing in the suggestions menu. I miss this feature more than I thought I would


----------



## steveroe

Over the last few days TiVo has recorded a couple of suggestions - not every day, but on a couple of days it has recorded 1 or 2. A couple for thumbed programmes and some for not.


----------



## warrenrb

Yes, my suggestions history is as follows (1 suggestion each day):
1 on the 31/8, then 16/9, 21/9, 22/9 and 24/9.

They are all either Roary the Racing Car or The Save-Ums! (Roary has 2 thumbs, save-ums has 1).

Interesting.


----------



## TCM2007

AMc said:


> I'm hoping that the fix can be made in the guide data alone - if it's a .1 change to the 2.5.5 software and they don't add kernel changes to deal with >137GB then it could bork my upgraded Tivo and trash my hacks. There's something to mull  !


The chances of TiVo sending a new software version out are near zero - it's a big download, and they pay for the data call.


----------



## davisa

andonevris said:


> The Toppy looks nice, I've mulled over it myself. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on it davisa.
> 
> Now if someone would write a suggestions module for it I'd switch tomorrow.


It seems the iGuide TAP offers what they call 'May I Suggest' functionality which appears similar! I'll be trying MyStuff TAP first though as it looks excellent, as well as the Radio Times data feed running on a Linksys NSLU2 which I also picked up cheap 

Edited to add: I love the iGuide manual. This is the footnote on the 'May I Suggest' function "If no recordings have already been identified, May I Suggest... falls back to a TiVo-emulation mode, in which every episode of the Simpsons is recorded."

(sorry for being a bit off topic...)


----------



## andonevris

davisa said:


> It seems the iGuide TAP offers what they call 'May I Suggest' functionality which appears similar! I'll be trying MyStuff TAP first though as it looks excellent, as well as the Radio Times data feed running on a Linksys NSLU2 which I also picked up cheap
> 
> Edited to add: I love the iGuide manual. This is the footnote on the 'May I Suggest' function "If no recordings have already been identified, May I Suggest... falls back to a TiVo-emulation mode, in which every episode of the Simpsons is recorded."
> 
> (sorry for being a bit off topic...)


Thanks for the update.....does the toppy only record suggestions which you have previosly recorded or are they true suggestions as in shows which you haven't recorded but match the style of show you like?

Also does it know if an episode has been recorded before and won't record it again? The toppy is definitely sounding like a nice bit of kit.

I guess it's not really off topic, if suggestions aren't fixed I am seriously thinking of ditching my tivo, I can't see what my £10 a month is for without full functionality, so I and perhaps others may fiind it useful to know of alternatives to tivo.

Saying that I could see this veering off into a long discussion so perhaps a new thread on the merits of the toppy v Tivo might be in order.


----------



## steveroe

andonevris said:


> Thanks for the update.....does the toppy only record suggestions which you have previosly recorded or are they true suggestions as in shows which you haven't recorded but match the style of show you like?
> 
> Also does it know if an episode has been recorded before and won't record it again? The toppy is definitely sounding like a nice bit of kit.
> 
> I guess it's not really off topic, if suggestions aren't fixed I am seriously thinking of ditching my tivo, I can't see what my £10 a month is for without full functionality, so I and perhaps others may fiind it useful to know of alternatives to tivo.
> 
> Saying that I could see this veering off into a long discussion so perhaps a new thread on the merits of the toppy v Tivo might be in order.


You can find the manual for iGuide here

"4.May I Suggest... predictive programming

The May I Suggest... feature attempts to identify programmes you may like but not already know about, based on recordings youve already made and indicated you enjoyed. Again, fuzzy logic is used to compare upcoming programmes with existing recordings."(my underlining)


----------



## andonevris

steveroe said:


> You can find the manual for iGuide here
> 
> "4.May I Suggest... predictive programming
> 
> The May I Suggest... feature attempts to identify programmes you may like but not already know about, based on recordings youve already made and indicated you enjoyed. Again, fuzzy logic is used to compare upcoming programmes with existing recordings."(my underlining)


Thanks Steve. This thing is looking better and better.....


----------



## gotty

I just thought I'd add my 2p'rth to the comments.I'm getting very frustrated without suggestions as they are at least as important to me as season passes (they provide something other than the narrow choice-based view and I rarely fail to see something worthwhile in them).

So my TiVo is now little better than any other PVR I might buy, including Sky+, and I would't have to pay the subscription.

It's now a month since this debacle and, despite "we haven't forgotten" noises here there I cannot help feel that the problem is so major that a fix is unlikely. 

The question has to be asked as to why this happened in the first place. Is there no testing ahead of changes?

Is this the end of TiVo? At least in the UK


----------



## cwaring

gotty said:


> Is this the end of TiVo? At least in the UK




Sorry, but how many times a week do we read this on this Forum.

Even _without_ suggestions I think Tivo is better than Sky+. How can it be worse as Sky+ doesn't ever _do_ suggestions?


----------



## Goooner1

I'm not so sure, without suggestions, TiVo is just another PVR to me.

I'd certainly take the way better picture/audio quality, not to mention the dual recording ability of my Sky HD over TiVo any day, the only thing lacking is a good season pass (season pass manager isn't _as_ important due to dual recording) and it doesn't cost me an extra tenner a month.


----------



## cwaring

Personally, I find Wishlists more useful than Suggestions, and Sky+ doesn't do those either


----------



## tonywalk

How bizzarre,

Both my Tivos which usually record different genres, this afternoon (Saturday), recorded the same film off TCM.

I got all excited for a moment thinking we'd been sorted. Then I checked upcoming suggestions and nada.

I'm 99.9% sure I'd not thumbed anything within 48 hours of the recording (and not for a while).

Hmmm.....


----------



## DeadKenny

TCM2007 said:


> The chances of TiVo sending a new software version out are near zero - it's a big download, and they pay for the data call.


More than that, it costs money to get some developers on the case and it takes longer to get developers who may have moved on to other projects to look back at dated code they would rather forget about.



cwaring said:


> Sorry, but how many times a week do we read this on this Forum.
> 
> Even _without_ suggestions I think Tivo is better than Sky+. How can it be worse as Sky+ doesn't ever _do_ suggestions?


Indeed. Although suggestions is one of the big selling points of TiVo for me, but the lack of suggestions and lack of fix indicates to me that there may not be too much hope for the guide data feed to remain for much longer. Once that's gone then it's no better than a VHS machine!

All it will take is a "technical issue" with the guide where suddenly it will stop and no one will want to fix it for our models. How long also until Sky or another provider decide to change their channel number system in a way that TiVo can't support? e.g. 4 digits like with radio. They're not going to do a new software release for that.

Sky HD is now getting much cheaper through various deals, and it can't be long now until they drop the £10 a month fee. Whilst it's a rubbish platform and very buggy, I can see a lot more TiVo owners jumping ship, with many perhaps being monthly subs. That's less money to TiVo and more incentive to drop it.

I can fully understand TiVo's position. If I was one of their execs and looking at it from a purely financial point of view, I'd pull the plug as surely supporting the UK must be costing too much money.

I really hope it remains, but it's not looking promising.

Now if only they'd come up with a Freesat PVR powered by TiVo...


----------



## wadadli

It doesn't matter whether people use Suggestions or not. The fact is that TiVo has seriously let us down here. One minute my TiVo is happily recording Suggestions and the next minute, because of something TiVo has done, it's not. So, I have come to the following conclusions:
1) I thought the Daily Call was only to get Programme Data. Clearly, that's proven not to be true as they can interfere with the normal working of the box. This implies that they can shut down all our boxes completely if they so wish.
2) If they have the software engineers to interfere with the normal working of the Series 1 TiVo, those same engineers can reverse what they've done. If they can't, it's a serious procedural issue and any trust I had in TiVo is fast disappearing.
3) Everyone affected by this issue should consider very carefully whether they want to purchase another TiVo box and the longer it goes on without a fix means even less potential customers. Me included.
4) I have a lifetime subscription which, perhaps mistakenly, I took at face value. If they are going to start trying to wind the TiVo service down by force I will not be happy. If I was paying a monthly subscription I would withhold it until the issue was fixed.


----------



## TCM2007

wadadli said:


> It doesn't matter whether people use Suggestions or not. The fact is that TiVo has seriously let us down here. One minute my TiVo is happily recording Suggestions and the next minute, because of something TiVo has done, it's not. So, I have come to the following conclusions:
> 1) I thought the Daily Call was only to get Programme Data. Clearly, that's proven not to be true as they can interfere with the normal working of the box. This implies that they can shut down all our boxes completely if they so wish.


The problem with suggestions almost certainly connected to the metadata included in the guide data. They haven't downlaoded a change to the software. But of course the operation of the TiVo depends on the contents of the daily call, so yes TiVo could "switch off" our boxes if they wanted.



> 2) If they have the software engineers to interfere with the normal working of the Series 1 TiVo, those same engineers can reverse what they've done. If they can't, it's a serious procedural issue and any trust I had in TiVo is fast disappearing.


If they changed the guide data to introduce a feature for the millions of TiVo boxes in the US, and that accidentally breaks a few thousand old boxes in teh UK, they are not going to reverse it just for us. Agreed it should have been found in testing.



> 3) Everyone affected by this issue should consider very carefully whether they want to purchase another TiVo box and the longer it goes on without a fix means even less potential customers. Me included.


Erm, TiVo boxes haven't been on sale for about six years now?



> 4) I have a lifetime subscription which, perhaps mistakenly, I took at face value. If they are going to start trying to wind the TiVo service down by force I will not be happy. If I was paying a monthly subscription I would withhold it until the issue was fixed.


While not disagreeing that they should fix the problem, TiVo can vary the terms of the service at any time - you have the right to cancel f you don't liek it. In the past this has usually been to add features, but it can equally well be to close some down. Some, like recording things on behalf of a sponsoring company, have not seen seen too many complaints at their withdrawal.

If you had just bought a brand new box and taken out a lifetime sub, you might have grounds for complaint/refund if they reduced the service, but none of us are in that position. Most TiVos have been in service for 6-8 years, and for many of us have been operating at a significantly higher level of service (2.5.5 vs 1.5.2) than we signed up to.

Cancelling/suspending your sub would seem to be cutting off your nose to spite your face in this instance.


----------



## mikerr

Should the guide service stop, there are of course ways of adding it back in by other means. Our australian cousins worked that one out long ago...

We did get support for freesat on day of release, so we aren't totally left out...


----------



## DeadKenny

ashagplz said:


> no suggestions for me either..btw..off-topic but why is it that no one else has put tivo like software in their pvr's?


Patents most likely.

Though there are I think some about that are a little closer. Some of the Freeview PVRs?

The key features really are just suggestions (likely highly patented to TiVo being a unique feature) and wishlists. The latter may be a bit more difficult to enforce a patent as surely it's an acceptable feature for a PVR to be able to record by search and keywords?


----------



## TCM2007

Media Centre has wishlists, as I believe does the Topfield PVR. 

No-one else has suggestions, but I suspect thats's because no-one else thinks they are a good idea!

TiVo's patents are not as comprehensive as many believe. They can easily bee looked up on the US patenet Office webiste


----------



## Goooner1

cwaring said:


> Personally, I find Wishlists more useful than Suggestions, and Sky+ doesn't do those either


But I think Digiguide can, can't it? OK, it'd take a bit more effort on my part, I'd have to set the recordings myself rather than TiVo doing it automatically, but for £10 per year as opposed to £10 per month, I think I might be able to live with that 

Don't get me wrong, I love my TiVo, it's the best gadget I've ever owned (and I've owned plenty!! ) But when it's not working as it should, yet still costing the same with no fix in sight and just vague promises that it's being looked into and money seems to be getting tighter by the day, could I live without it? Ask me that before suggestions went wrong and I'd have probably said no, without even thinking about it. Since it's been less than 100% functional for the last few weeks and I've been using the Sky HD box more, I'm starting to think, well maybe I could.


----------



## gotty

cwaring said:


> Even _without_ suggestions I think Tivo is better than Sky+. How can it be worse as Sky+ doesn't ever _do_ suggestions?


Sky+ does things that the TiVo doesn't. It can record two things at once, for instance, and the quality is superior to the TiVo's (because it records the original data and doesn't have to go through a double analogue conversion and compression). You can also set to record a trailed programme just by pressing a button, and can have digital sound.

I agree that TiVo does wishlists and suggestions, and has the hacker-friendly internals, but if you take away the suggestions from someone who uses them the balance tips considerably and those who are paying £10 a month are going to seriously start to consider cancelling their subscriptions. And, since it's only those with the £10 a month subscriptions that are providing TiVo-UK with any income, that would certainly be a significant risk.


----------



## gotty

TCM2007 said:


> TiVo can vary the terms of the service at any time - you have the right to cancel f you don't liek it.
> 
> Cancelling/suspending your sub would seem to be cutting off your nose to spite your face in this instance.


I don't have my contract to hand, but if it says that TiVo can vary the terms of the service without formal notice, then a contract solicitor's view is that this term would be unenforceable - if it says that they can vary the terms with notice, that is different (but of course they haven't)

Technically, TiVo is in breach of contract and could be sued. Whether it would be worth doing is a different matter, of course.

Stopping the sub would only be a case of "cutting off your nose" if you're not really bothered with suggestions and otherwise have an emotional attachment to the TiVo (which many of us do, of course). But paying £10 a month for something that is now only working to a part of its orginal functionality is something that has to be considered carefully, particularl for those of us on limited incomes.


----------



## TCM2007

gotty said:


> I don't have my contract to hand, but if it says that TiVo can vary the terms of the service without formal notice, then a contract solicitor's view is that this term would be unenforceable - if it says that they can vary the terms with notice, that is different (but of course they haven't)


It does say that.



> 6. Changes to Your TiVo Service. TiVo may at its discretion and from time to time change, add, or remove features and functionality of the TiVo service or the TiVo DVR without notice. If you are dissatisfied with any such changes to the TiVo service, you may cancel your use of the TiVo service as provided in Section 15 ("Termination of Service"). TiVo reserves the right to discontinue one, some, or all of the features of the TiVo service you receive at any time at its discretion.


 TiVo wouldn't need to "enforce" it though - they wouldn't be demanding you keep paying. You can just stop.



> Technically, TiVo is in breach of contract and could be sued. Whether it would be worth doing is a different matter, of course.


Any service based contract can be varied or cancelled by the service provider; so long as the recipient is not tied in to having to pay for something they no longer want there isn't an issue. I can't sue Sky because the analogue box in my attic no longer receives Sky One.

If any reduction happened within 20 months of taking out a lifetime sub, you might have a case for some kind of partial refund, but virtually no-one is in that position.



> Stopping the sub would only be a case of "cutting off your nose" if you're not really bothered with suggestions and otherwise have an emotional attachment to the TiVo (which many of us do, of course). But paying £10 a month for something that is now only working to a part of its orginal functionality is something that has to be considered carefully, particularl for those of us on limited incomes.


If Suggestions were the main thing you get from TiVo that would be true. I'd suggest that for most they are at best a nice little extra, not the core of the service, which is to record shows you have explicitly requested.


----------



## Goooner1

TCM2007 said:


> If Suggestions were the main thing you get from TiVo that would be true. I'd suggest that for most they are at best a nice little extra, not the core of the service, which is to record shows you have explicitly requested.


If I just want something to record shows I explicitly request, there are plenty of other options out there, which will arguably do it better and not cost a tenner a month.

To me TiVo is a package, recording what I want + suggestions + wishlists etc... if parts of it don't function correctly (which they don't at the moment, and who knows if or when they will) then why would anyone on monthly payment continue paying the sub? It's obvioulsy different for someone with a lifetime sub as they have no ongoing costs.


----------



## cwaring

TCM2007 said:


> If Suggestions were the main thing you get from TiVo that would be true. I'd suggest that for most they are at best a nice little extra, not the core of the service, which is to record shows you have explicitly requested.


This was to be my point but I couldn't figure out how to best express it 



Goooner1 said:


> If I just want something to record shows I explicitly request, there are plenty of other options out there, which will arguably do it better and not cost a tenner a month.


Now maybe, but there wasn't when most of us got our Tivos


----------



## TCM2007

Goooner1 said:


> If I just want something to record shows I explicitly request, there are plenty of other options out there, which will arguably do it better and not cost a tenner a month.


Not too many actually. Sky+/Sky HD's Series Links are seriously inferior to Season Passes. I haven't had any experience of FreeView+ or Freesat's systems yet. "Regular" Freeview PVRs don't offer the feature.



> To me TiVo is a package, recording what I want + suggestions + wishlists etc... if parts of it don't function correctly (which they don't at the moment, and who knows if or when they will) then why would anyone on monthly payment continue paying the sub? It's obvioulsy different for someone with a lifetime sub as they have no ongoing costs.


Because the parts of the service which do still work provide a service worth £10. Of course if suggestions were the bit which you found valuable about TiVo the you're right. I had them switched off, so for me they were worth £0!

I think you said you bought your TiVo in 2001 - if so, Wishlists can't have been a one of the things you bought it for as they were only introduced with v2.5.5 software in 2002.


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## Goooner1

You must be confusing me with someone else, I don't think I've ever said when I got my TiVo, I honestly can't remember, but it wasn't at launch and I'm pretty sure it updated itself to 2.5.5 when I first set it up, or if not then very shortly afterwards.

My point is though, Sky HD may not do all that TiVo does, I know the series links are hit and miss at times, there's no season pass manager, but arguably you don't need one, as it can record two things at once, pic and audio quality beat TiVo hands down and it doesn't cost me an extra &#163;10 per month.

If they were to reduce the sub, to reflect the fact that it isn't working correctly, fine, but I doubt they will and if they did I'm sure it would piss off those people with lifetime subs.


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## AENG

Goooner1 said:


> .
> 
> If they were to reduce the sub, to reflect the fact that it isn't working correctly, fine, but I doubt they will and if they did I'm sure it would piss off those people with lifetime subs.


It wouldn't me (2 lifetime subs)! I'm very grateful to those who've shouldered the burden of monthly subs all these years for our collective benefit . It's been said elsewhere, I think, that TiVo Inc. might have taken a different line much sooner, were it not for the (admittedly small) income stream generated by monthly subs.


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## Glen

For those of you who havent seen the thread yet. TiVo Suggestions are no longer a part of the UK Service as our boxes software is just too old and incompatible. TiVo have also said that they have no plans to update the software that runs our TiVo's to make them compatible. sorry guys!


----------



## Andy Leitch

TCM2007 said:


> If any reduction happened within 20 months of taking out a lifetime sub, you might have a case for some kind of partial refund, but virtually no-one is in that position.


I just bought a LT sub on the 10th September and no mention was made of a reduced featureset when changing from monthly to LT.


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## steveroe

The official position can be found in this thread


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## cwaring

Andy Leitch said:


> I just bought a LT sub on the 10th September and no mention was made of a reduced featureset when changing from monthly to LT.


Given that Tivo have _only just_ announced the _official_ demise of Suggestions, then can't say I'm surprised. They can't tell you what they don't know


----------



## Pete77

Andy Leitch said:


> I just bought a LT sub on the 10th September and no mention was made of a reduced featureset when changing from monthly to LT.


If it was that recently and direct from Tivo it seems to me you have a good case for seeking a partial refund. Except that they have not yet reduced the price of the Monthly Sub, as they ought to in this situation.

It seems to me that Tivo ought to reduce the price of the Monthly Sub to £6.99 and a Lifetime Sub to say £149 on an S1 machine if they want to avoid the punters being too unhappy.


----------



## gotty

TCM2007 said:


> Any service based contract can be varied or cancelled by the service provider;


Only if the contract is deemed fair. One of the selling points of the TiVo is suggestions, and its withdrawal (as they've now done) is a significant variation in service.

Suggestions are a significant part of the service.

I've now found my contract and run it past a friend who's a contract lawyer, and she is certain that there would be a case for legal action. However, it may be limited to a full refund of subscriptions paid for the duration of the service not being supplied, plus costs.


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## mikerr

Any permanent reduction/change in fees would require a tivo-US accountant to look at the UK operation, 
and at that moment they may decide it aint worth continuing it at all 

Sometimes it better to remain under the radar... 

unless of course they decide to give us the nero PC-tivo software or a S3 machine....


----------



## cleudo

You could take the view, however, that they haven't *increased* the sub in the last 8 years or so, so in real terms it's already a lot cheaper now than it was then... 

What would it have been if it had been increased by rpi each year from then till now?


----------



## Tim L




----------



## Pete77

cleudo said:


> You could take the view, however, that they haven't *increased* the sub in the last 8 years or so, so in real terms it's already a lot cheaper now than it was then...


Except that the value of 10GBP became worth a lot more than it was in US Dollars in October 2000 for most of the ensuing period due to exchange rate changes.

Also they don't charge as much in US Dollars for Tivo service as they do in the UK and I believe reduced the monthly cost in US Dollars at some point along the way.


----------



## Goooner1

cleudo said:


> You could take the view, however, that they haven't *increased* the sub in the last 8 years or so, so in real terms it's already a lot cheaper now than it was then...
> 
> What would it have been if it had been increased by rpi each year from then till now?


They probably realised they were pushing their luck with £10 per month, had they increased it further, I'd expect they'd have even less customers than now. Even Sky managed to, for all intents and purposes, drop altogether their £10 Sky+ charge.


----------



## Pete77

Tim L said:


>


Quite.

Your post eloquently makes the point that not only do we not get Suggestions recorded any more but there is no point in Thumbsing Up and Thumbsing Down anything any more on our Tivos. So two of my favourite buttons on the Tivo remote are no longer of any use.

This is a big reduction in service the more you think of it. A Tivo isn't really a Tivo at all without the Suggestions feature working.:down:


----------



## cwaring

Goooner1 said:


> Even Sky managed to, for all intents and purposes, drop altogether their £10 Sky+ charge.


Took them a while though; and it's still there if you don't subscribe to Sky services.


----------



## AdrianWJ

Maybe there is a new TiVo solution on the horizon:

New software turns PC into TiVo TV recorder

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080929/ap_on_hi_te/apfn_tec_tivo_for_the_pc

http://www.nero.com/enu/liquidtv-introduction.html



> Joshua Danovitz, vice president and general manager of international business at TiVo, said the plan is to launch it in Europe next year.


----------



## Goooner1

cwaring said:


> Took them a while though; and it's still there if you don't subscribe to Sky services.


But certainly a lot less time than TiVo, obviously

There's a a school of thought that Sky only thought they'd charge a £10 per month fee for Sky+ because TiVo were already doing so.


----------



## cwaring

There's a lot of "schools of thought" around Sky, Sky+ and Tivo


----------



## TCM2007

Pete77 said:


> If it was that recently and direct from Tivo it seems to me you have a good case for seeking a partial refund. Except that they have not yet reduced the price of the Monthly Sub, as they ought to in this situation.


I think it would be fair to offer a cancellation and full refund in those circumstances.

The fee didn't go up when loads of features were added back in 2002, so I'm not sure why it should be reduced because one is removed in 2008?

It may change the value-for-money calculation so that while they felt it was worth £10 before it's now not. Those people should cancel their subs.

From a business perspective, reducing ALL subs to £8 or whatever means you are giving money back to people who still thought that £10 was fine, even without Suggestions. You'd have to expect over 20% of the whole subscriber base to cancel for that to make any sense; my guess is that the number of people who think Suggestions were that core and essential is lower than that.


----------



## TCM2007

Pete77 said:


> A Tivo isn't really a Tivo at all without the Suggestions feature working.:down:


Many of us ran with Suggestions turned off, so that is of course just your opinion masquerading as fact!


----------



## OzSat

The only time I ever looked at the suggestions was when people reported problems in this forum.


----------



## TCM2007

Pete77 said:


> Also they don't charge as much in US Dollars for Tivo service as they do in the UK and I believe reduced the monthly cost in US Dollars at some point along the way.


The opposite, they put it up. Was originally $9.95 IIRC, now $199 for a year, which is - oh - about £10 a month!

Edit: they've cut it recently to $12.95 a month. Lifetime is $399


----------



## ColinYounger

TCM2007 said:


> Suggestions turned off


Ditto. But then I'm obsessively minimalistic about my NPL and start to get stressed when I go over a page.


----------



## cleudo

TCM2007 said:


> Many of us ran with Suggestions turned off, so that is of course just your opinion masquerading as fact!


Woo - that seems a bit harsh..
To be fair - those thumb buttons are very prominent on everyone's remote and they are (were) a major part of TiVo functionality whether you used the feature or not.


----------



## cwaring

cleudo said:


> Woo - that seems a bit harsh..


Not really 'harsh' in the slightest' simply true. but perfectly true. I've noticed in other Forums/newsgroups that some people state opinions as fact; which is not on


----------



## andonevris

cwaring said:


> Not really 'harsh' in the slightest' simply true. but perfectly true. I've noticed in other Forums/newsgroups that some people state opinions as fact; which is not on


Is that a fact or an opinion??


----------



## cwaring

Touch&#232;; almost  The latter is opinion while the former is fact


----------



## Pete77

mikerr said:


> unless of course they decide to give us the nero PC-tivo software or a S3 machine....


Thereby allowing us to become a free testbed for the soon to be relaunched UK Tivo service (quietly hands back set of rose tinted spectacles temporarily borrowed from blindlemon)


----------



## cwaring

Yeah, 'cos they've always flatly refused a return to the UK market, haven't they


----------



## johala_reewi

Although I have record suggestions turned off on my Tivo, I would often pop into the suggestions screen to see what Tivo thought I might like and used the thumbs to tell Tivo what I didn't like.

PS you still need the thumbs down to do a tivo reset so that key still has a use.


----------



## Pete77

johala_reewi said:


> Although I have record suggestions turned off on my Tivo, I would often pop into the suggestions screen to see what Tivo thought I might like and used the thumbs to tell Tivo what I didn't like.


Although I did always have Suggestions enabled as I have a huge recording capacity on my Tivo with hundreds of programs in Now Playing I would only be aware of them when I viewed Now Playing via Tivoweb but I did then quite often find something I would change to Save Until I Delete status that I wanted to view.

In addition I made even more use of the manual Suggestions list to find things I liked the look of that I then set to record. I would also regularly thumbs up unthumbed items in manual suggestions that I liked the look of and thumbs down in anything in that list that was not to my tastes.

So both ways round this is a major loss in functionality.



> PS you still need the thumbs down to do a tivo reset so that key still has a use.


That sounds more like the kind of answer I would expect TivoPony or TCM to come up with.


----------



## mikerr

I could never understand the point of turning suggestions off at all.
I'm sure most people who did that misunderstood the way suggestions worked;
it didn't save space, or wear and tear(!), and suggestions never prevented anything recording... 

Only thing you possibly gain is a longer live buffer, and possibly a smaller NPL.


----------



## Pete77

mikerr said:


> I could never understand the point of turning suggestions off at all.
> 
> I'm sure most people who did that misunderstood the way suggestions worked;
> it didn't save space, or wear and tear(!), and suggestions never prevented anything recording...
> 
> Only thing you possibly gain is a longer live buffer, and possibly a smaller NPL.


But if you have Tivoweb and like to Undelete things that you suddenly think better of having deleted then having Suggestions enabled will mean that you cannot Undelete most deletions done more than a day or two ago as Suggestions does regard deleted programs as being free space that it can consume with Suggested recordings.


----------



## TCM2007

mikerr said:


> Only thing you possibly gain is a longer live buffer, and possibly a smaller NPL.


Fewer shows with "sex" in the title on the disk for the kids to see, just because you once thumbed up Sex in the City?

My TiVos always ran full, so Suggestions being off or on was academic really.


----------



## Pete77

TCM2007 said:


> My TiVos always ran full, so Suggestions being off or on was academic really.


This is true of mine on the whole but there is always a Suggestion at the bottom of the list that gets replaced every day or so. And sometimes one sees one of the things it is recording when the tv is sitting there live recording with the volume turned down and so end up setting up a Season Pass for the program in that way.


----------



## verses

mikerr said:


> Only thing you possibly gain is a longer live buffer


For me it was to guarantee that TiVo wouldn't change channel while live TV was being watched - heresy, I know.
When mine or my wife's parents would babysit, it was easier to cancel all upcoming recordings and let them watch Live TV than try to explain that TiVo would want to change channel from time to time.
As this situation arose far more often more often* than TiVo recording a suggestion that I actually wanted to watch I eventually just left suggestions disabled.

Cheers,

Ian

*Even then it's only a handful of times a year that they babysit, which say something for how valuable I found suggestions to be when they were enabled.

PS: I suppose there's a potential hack there that temporarily disables TiVo's recording functions while a non-TiVo person is wanting to use the telly.


----------



## DeadKenny

AdrianWJ said:


> Maybe there is a new TiVo solution on the horizon:
> 
> New software turns PC into TiVo TV recorder
> ...


Plenty of software like that about. They've been doing TiVo-like PVR systems on Linux for years. Okay not by TiVo themselves.

Though getting one that will record direct off Sky is somewhat tricky (not to mention involving some legal issues!). The best of them legally can only do what TiVo does and involve analogue/digital conversions. In which case Sky+ and more so Sky HD is attractive as a replacement if you want better picture quality.

When I first got TiVo it wasn't really relevant as I had a 28" CRT and then later a 32" CRT. But moving up to a 40" HD LCD where the picture is massive and the clarity of an LCD is pin-sharp by comparison, I find TiVo's picture to be a struggle. Even compared to upscaled SD DVDs.

Really, if I'm to replace my Series 1 TiVo, I want something with a better picture, and if I want to keep Sky, my only choice for a decent picture, sadly is Sky+ or Sky HD (the latter preferable for both the HD picture and also upscaling of SD).



ozsat said:


> The only time I ever looked at the suggestions was when people reported problems in this forum.


Doesn't mean suggestions should be just dismissed though because some people saw no value in them. I can see how some will want to cling onto hope and try to dismiss it though in a "well, I never used it anyway, who needs it" kind of way. Doesn't make it any better though. TiVo UK is on it's way out.

For me I found it learnt my viewing habits very well and the bonus of this is it would record things I might want to watch if I have time but without filling up the player. i.e. things I really wanted to watch took priority.

As I never bothered upgrading the player this was rather important for space reasons.


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## Goooner1

DeadKenny said:


> Doesn't mean suggestions should be just dismissed though because some people saw no value in them. I can see how some will want to cling onto hope and try to dismiss it though in a "well, I never used it anyway, who needs it" kind of way. Doesn't make it any better though. TiVo UK is on it's way out.


If you're on a lifetime sub, with no extra additional costs each month, I suppose it's a lot easier to dismiss suggestions as not important, but when you're now, like me, paying out £120 per year, for what's now basically a poor-mans Sky+ with much poorer pic/audio quality but with a half decent EPG.

I'm still waiting for someone to tell me what the TiVo EPG (without suggestions) can do that Digiguide can't, only a hell of a lot cheaper


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## mikerr

Goooner1 said:


> I'm still waiting for someone to tell me what the TiVo EPG (without suggestions) can do that Digiguide can't, only a hell of a lot cheaper


The digiguide data doesn't link series together where the title changes. Thats partly what the TMSID is for.

Without it season passes are just title wishlists.


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## Pete77

Goooner1 said:


> I'm still waiting for someone to tell me what the TiVo EPG (without suggestions) can do that Digiguide can't, only a hell of a lot cheaper


How about Wishlists or easily showing all possible showings of that program on any channel in the next three weeks on one screen? Also does Digiguide do three weeks of data rather than just one week?

Also does Digiguide have a 28 day rule not to record another showing of the same episode of the program during the next 28 days.


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## cwaring

Goooner1 said:


> I'm still waiting for someone to tell me what the TiVo EPG (without suggestions) can do that Digiguide can't, only a hell of a lot cheaper


Doesn't automatically record anything 

I've lost suggestions and paying monthly; and although I agree it's slightly annoying, I'm really not that bothered.


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## TCM2007

Pete77 said:


> How about Wishlists or easily showing all possible showings of that program on any channel in the next three weeks on one screen? Also does Digiguide do three weeks of data rather than just one week?


Actually Diguigide does all those things.



> Also does Digiguide have a 28 day rule not to record another showing of the same episode of the program during the next 28 days.


DigiGuide's just an EPG, so it doesn't record anything.


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## Goooner1

TCM2007 said:


> Actually Diguigide does all those things.
> 
> DigiGuide's just an EPG, so it doesn't record anything.


Well, so far there don't seem to be too many downsides to Digiguide compared to TiVo and to save £115 per year, I think I could live with setting up recordings myself 

Someone give me a reason to keep my TiVo, as I do really love it, honest  It's without doubt the best gadget I've ever owned, but losing suggestions has put into perspective how much I'm spending on it (especially now money is getting tighter than ever, with just about everything going up on a seemingly weekly basis ) for what it actually does. A month ago, I would happily have continued with TiVo for ever more, but now I'm starting to see how it would be possible to live without it, something I daren't even consider before


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## mikerr

Goooner1 said:


> Well, so far there don't seem to be too many downsides to Digiguide compared to TiVo and to save £115 per year, I think I could live with setting up recordings myself


Setting up recordings yourself...on what?

Liefetime subbed tivos have never been cheaper on ebay,
but for a monthly sub:

Is 33p a day really too much for the convenience tivo brings?


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## Goooner1

Sky HD.

33p per day compared to 1p per day for Digiguide. Don't get me wrong, as I've said the TiVo EPG is great, but then if I record everything on Sly, I'm also getting superior audio and picture quality. 

I rarely use wishlists, most stuff I watch is either via season pass or suggestions, with suggestions now gone that leaves the season pass, which Sky HD can cope with, not as well admittedly but it's not that bad and the pressing the green button during a trailer to set up a recording is quite handy at times too.


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## DanielB

So not really adding any original thought except general annyance, at buying a TiVo for my friend a couple of months back to give to them for there wedding (last week) as a gift, and now the main feature I was raving about have vanished. 

imho it is approaching now being no more specail than most PVRs, and without this, I do wonder if it is any better than the integration you get from say having a single vendor solution like the Sony TV and Sony DVR and single remote, recording ease and integration. 

I hope they return soon, or time to look for another gift..... Doh....

I get no suggestions, I was a way for a week and checked in and not a single one. Also the sequence of off/on/force call makes no difference.


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## martink0646

DanielB said:


> So not really adding any original thought except general annyance, at buying a TiVo for my friend a couple of months back to give to them for there wedding (last week) as a gift, and now the main feature I was raving about have vanished.
> 
> imho it is approaching now being no more specail than most PVRs, and without this, I do wonder if it is any better than the integration you get from say having a single vendor solution like the Sony TV and Sony DVR and single remote, recording ease and integration.
> 
> I hope they return soon, or time to look for another gift..... Doh....
> 
> I get no suggestions, I was a way for a week and checked in and not a single one. Also the sequence of off/on/force call makes no difference.


Hi Daniel,

Sorry to tell you but they are gone for good. See here - http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=406543

There is a solution though. See this link - http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=404932

Hope that helps.

Martin


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## pj280167

TiVo's been recording both the first and repeat showings of the following programmes.

Never Mind The Buzzcocks ( New series, not the repeats on Dave )
Later Live with Jools Holland
Mock the Week
8 out of 10 Cats ( If I remember correctly )

Does anyone know whether this is a function of the new EPG data format or just my TiVo misbehaving ? I vaguely remember this issue being mentioned elsewhere in the forum but for the life of me can't find the thread.


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