# OTA Tuner Failure Roamio Not Happy



## gregnauman (May 13, 2014)

Well I am a new Tivo customer as of Sept 4 2013. Tired of the high Cable/Sat bills so decided it was time. Looked around at various options and settled on Tivo but did not like being charged the monthly fee just for guide data but what can a person do.

So, I set the Roamio up with my 10 year old antenna in the attic about 15 miles from station transmitters.

I had great service until about 2 weeks ago I suddenly lost channel 41 and channel 4 in Kansas City MO area.

I am a Service engineer with a degree in electronics and work for Toshiba America Medical System in Xray and CT.

The first thing I did was plug the cable into my Sony Bravia and the stations worked perfect.

So I called Tivo support and was told my tivo only has a 90 day warranty. I am like what company only has a 90 day warranty.
They told me that the tuner in the TV is different than the tuner in the Roamio and there was nothing they could do.

No offeres to do ANYTHING, not even an exchange, nothing.

So I get off the phone and look up the warranty and find that the warranty is IN FACT a year on parts and 90 days on parts and labor. So they will cover it but you have to pay labor. Interesting.....

I began to mess with the antenna etc and I figured out by trial and error the Tivo has to see approximately 45-50 or above signal to work properly. My Sony Bravia does not.

In the mean time I decided to relocate my antenna, talked to Denny's antenna out of MI via the web, and ordered a new antenna the HD Stacker, and installed it in the attic in a different location.

I get done, and find after adjusting the antenna to the proper compass setting, that now I don't have 38, 62, 50, 41, 4

All the stations that don't work seem to be around a signal level of 32 on the Tivo. The same I was seeing on 4 and 41 with the old antenna and location. I am thinking maybe I will have to put the antenna outside on the roof.

So, I plug the New antenna into the Sony TV and waalla, perfect OTA TV.

I am thinking what the heck.

Finally I decided to order a new Tivo via amazon since I got no where with Tivo the first go around.

Well, I installed the new Tivo today and ALL stations are perfect and around 65-85 signal strength.

So I call Tivo back and was told I have to pay $50 for a REMANUFACTURED Roamio and I should send back the Tivo I recently purchased from Amazon that arrived yesterday for test purposes.

Needless to say I am really ticked at the Tivo LAME warranty and wonder why the heck I got myself into seemingly ANOTHER COMPANY THAT ACTS JUST LIKE THE CABLE AND SAT COMPANIES.

Anyway, My REFURB Tivo is on its way, they activated my Amazon Tivo so I could use it until the refurb gets to me.

Im now debating SELLING THE Tivo when it gets to me, canceling my subscription to TIVO and trying the new Channelmaster DVR+ 
WITH NO MONTHLY FEES!

http://www.cnet.com/products/channel-master-dvr-plus/

[media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbwfNhtELPA[/media]

*I just can't believe the customer service on a 7 month old device.*

So now come August of this year I have basically spent at least 35 bucks a month on Tivo service in the first year (including the cost of the device and the replacement fee), and *WHO CAN TRUST THIS ONE WILL LAST.*

Kia is making a killing in the Auto world by standing behind their products for 100k, that is what is getting them on the map.

If Tivo continues this kind of poor warranty and poor customer service to a NEW customer they will not be in business long.

Im willing to possibly give this another shot but if this REFURB FAILS or is not up to snuff when I get it this week I am done.

I will be closely watching Channelmaster and their FREE guide service as they are planning on adding apps etc.

I am going to give it to the end of my year I think but if anymore issues Im done!


----------



## aridon (Aug 31, 2006)

$36 for a three year warranty is a bargain. 

Roll the dice, you sometimes lose.


----------



## gregnauman (May 13, 2014)

aridon said:


> $36 for a three year warranty is a bargain.
> 
> Roll the dice, you sometimes lose.


Stand behind your stupid CHINESE MADE products!


----------



## gregnauman (May 13, 2014)

aridon said:


> Figured I'd share my experience with moving to Comast in SE FL from D*. We've had Replay, Series 2 and *the horrendous Premier over the years* and also Directv for many years in between.


Seems things haven't changed with the Roamio.....


----------



## gregnauman (May 13, 2014)

I might add if you have OTA tuner problems after it works for a while, better suspect the Roamio.


----------



## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

OTA reception issues are many and will very depending on many conditions, including weather and perhaps even time of year. I have noted some issues with 1 channel recently, perhaps my antenna has moved slightly with all the high winds or perhaps it is something else who knows. I spent lots of time with my setup last fall and got the best reception I have ever had, but even then reception on all my OTA devices still varied greatly day to day. All my main channels worked well but signal strength would vary and there were some remote low power channels that would show up every now and then, and it didn't matter which device I was checking on. 

None of the companies that sell OTA DVRs make the tuners, they all buy them from third parties. Doesn't matter if it is TiVo, Channel Master, HD Homerun, of someone else. Given that no one else is selling an OTA device capable of tuning 4 channels at once, the OTA tuner in the Roamio is likely not in any other OTA devices and only available from one vendor. That said my Roamio slightly out performs my Series 3 & TiVo HD, significantly out performs my Premiere and HD Homerun, and is on par or slightly inferior to the one in my Panasonic TV, when it comes to OTA reception.


----------



## ss-stingray (Aug 25, 2013)

Quote: Im now debating SELLING THE Tivo when it gets to me, canceling my subscription to TIVO and trying the new Channelmaster DVR+
WITH NO MONTHLY FEES! End Quote :


The Channel Master is not being received very well with lots of problems. Read about the disappointed owners at the AVS forum. I have a channel master pre amp and have great reception and picture. There times because of fog where pic drops out. There nothing that compares to the TIVO.


----------



## tatergator1 (Mar 27, 2008)

gregnauman said:


> Stand behind your stupid CHINESE MADE products!


They're assembled in Mexico. As to where the components come from, some may be made in China, but that's besides the point.

Sounds like you got a lemon, it happens with all consumer electronics.


----------



## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

gregnauman said:


> Stand behind your stupid CHINESE MADE products!


They do don't they? You had a 90 day warranty. After the warranty expired they offered you a replacement for $50. That is a great deal for a device out of warranty. I just don't see how you can complain about it. It certainly is not TiVos fault that you didn't spend a few dollars on an extended warranty. Personally I buy them on all my TiVos. But I've never had a need to use the extended warranties on TiVos before. They have been to help the resale when I sell them later on.


----------



## shwru980r (Jun 22, 2008)

aaronwt said:


> They do don't they? You had a 90 day warranty. After the warranty expired they offered you a replacement for $50. That is a great deal for a device out of warranty. I just don't see how you can complain about it. It certainly is not TiVos fault that you didn't spend a few dollars on an extended warranty. Personally I buy them on all my TiVos. But I've never had a need to use the extended warranties on TiVos before. They have been to help the resale when I sell them later on.


It was still under warranty for parts for 1 year. The first CSR told the OP that he wasn't covered. Otherwise; I think Tivo took care of the issue.


----------



## shwru980r (Jun 22, 2008)

aridon said:


> $36 for a three year warranty is a bargain.
> 
> Roll the dice, you sometimes lose.


The OP only had to pay $50. I think a subsequent failure is highly unlikely. I would gamble and not pay for the extended warranty.


----------



## eboydog (Mar 24, 2006)

It regards to OTA reception, it is my understanding that the Roamio splits the signal between it's 4 tuners meaning that you have 1/4 of the total signal between all the four tuners. Comparing that to your TV tuner, the TV has the full signal strength without splitting the signal between four tuners as it has only one.

One issue too with regards to Tivo warranty is that it's a one time use warranty including the extended warranties as once used and a replacement is sent to you, that replacement is not covered under any future replacements or issues unless you can persuade Tivo to grant you the extended coverage originally purchased to cover the replacement unit.

I have had a few battles with Tivo with regards to their product warranties and so far, they have been very willing to work with me. yes the quality of today's electronics is dismal but this is the build as cheap as possible world we live in.


----------



## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

eboydog said:


> ...
> One issue too with regards to Tivo warranty is that it's a one time use warranty including the extended warranties as once used and a replacement is sent to you, that replacement is not covered under any future replacements or issues unless you can persuade Tivo to grant you the extended coverage originally purchased to cover the replacement unit.
> ...


This statement is not exactly true, during the first 90 days they will replace your unit under warranty as many times as need no cost and no shipping costs either way.

Without an extended warranty they will also replace your unit from 90days to 1 year as many times as needed for the "labor" cost, which I believe is now $50 and I think you have to pay return shipping (not 100% sure).

For both of the above the time period starts from when you purchased the first unit, no extensions for replacement units.

The one time issue however does come in with the extended warranty, which if you have one starts at 90 days and you only get to use it once. I have no idea what the policy is on DOA replacement units when you are using the extended warranty but they must have some policy.


----------



## jcthorne (Jan 28, 2002)

The replacement units carry a 90 day warranty.


----------



## gregnauman (May 13, 2014)

atmuscarella said:


> This statement is not exactly true, during the first 90 days they will replace your unit under warranty as many times as need no cost and no shipping costs either way.
> 
> Without an extended warranty they will also replace your unit from 90days to 1 year as many times as needed for the "labor" cost, which I believe is now $50 and I think you have to pay return shipping (not 100% sure).
> 
> ...


Re-read my first post. The lady on the phone when I first called said they couldn't do anything because it was out of its 90 day warranty. 
Thats not true. It has a 1 year warranty parts, 90 days parts and labor.

I may not have replaced my antenna or anything else for that matter if tivo would have helped me a bit from the get go.

One thing I am glad about they are getting a open box item brand new tivo back through amazon for their poor tech support.

I used it to find out that it was the tivo :up:

I tried to get them to let me keep it and give me a credit and send my old one in but they wouldn't do it. They wanted to send me a REFURB.....

I hope it works. I wrote down all my signal strength data etc so if the refurb isn't up to snuff they will be getting it back.


----------



## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Nothing is wrong with a refurb. I know personally I would prefer a refurb over a new device since a refurb has typically gone through more through testing. But you can always get a lemon whether new or refurb.


----------



## eboydog (Mar 24, 2006)

aaronwt said:


> Nothing is wrong with a refurb. I know personally I would prefer a refurb over a new device since a refurb has typically gone through more through testing. But you can always get a lemon whether new or refurb.


I believe too that the Roamio "refurbished" units being sent out currently aren't used or really refurbished as they haven't been out very long. There was message thread awhile back asking about the serial number designation as typically refurbished Tivo's have a different formatted serial number and so far nothing different as been noted "so" far as indicating the refurbished Roamios are any different than new units.


----------



## gregnauman (May 13, 2014)

Ill let you guys know what the serial number is. They told me it would be refurbished so Ill see what I get.....Coming tomorrow


----------



## DeltaOne (Sep 29, 2013)

eboydog said:


> I believe too that the Roamio "refurbished" units being sent out currently aren't used or really refurbished as they haven't been out very long.


Refurb, in the electronics world, often means the unit failed the Q&A check at the end of the assembly line. It's sent back to be repaired then sold as refurbished.


----------



## gregnauman (May 13, 2014)

Installed the replacement Tivo today. It came in a plain white box, with a sticker on the side that had the serial number etc. Nothings else but the Tivo in the box and it came out of texas.

My original Tivo was August 2013 Manufacturer date
The Tivo from Amazon was December 2013

The "refurb" was March 2014

It had the peel off skin on the top of the device but no peel off skin on the bottom so a bit scratched. No big deal as the shiny black plastic scratches really easy.

OTA antenna signal strength was exact same as the new one from Amazon I tested with.

Model was still TCD846500

Serial was 846-*0011*-xxxx-xxxx

SKU was R8465P

I think the extra 1 in the 6th digit over seems to possibly be the refurb code.

At any rate the date code was much newer.

Someone posted about buying the warranty for 36 bucks.

From what I understand the warranty can only be used 1 time and you will more than likely get a refurb anyway and have to pay for shipping.

I paid $50 and got a refurb and they paid for shipping both directions.

Seems like a pretty fair deal, only I can't believe the first one failed.

Hopefully I don't have this issue again.

I pointed my antenna to 240 degrees which is the recommended direction for my area and my signal strength is 70 or above on EVERY station now.

One thing that clued me in on the problem was multiple stations showed 32 for signal strength and I knew all the bad ones couldn't be 32. Probably they were all using the same tuner....

Now I just have to figure out how to get it to update software. Mine is at 20.3.8 and will not seem to update to the latest.....


----------



## gregnauman (May 13, 2014)

Looks like that is correct according to this post about the premier....



CoxInPHX said:


> I don't know if the Roamio follows the same rule, But a Refurbished Premiere TSN is as follows:
> 
> Refurbished Premiere TSN: 746-*0011*-xxxx-xxxx
> 
> New Premiere: TSN: 746-*0001*-xxxx-xxxx


----------

