# Goodbye TiVo. It's been a good run.



## emmgee (Dec 18, 2010)

[I hope someone from TiVo participated in this forum. If not, I send the following "out into the Universe.]

I don't remember exactly when I bought my first TiVo. Probably 2002 or 2003. My wife and I loved the ability to time-shift given our new family and we loved having a catalog of things to watch when the regular TV schedule wasn't very good.

I think I've upgrade four times. The most recent was a few months back to the Bolt. I hated the Bolt. The new software was a big step backwards. It was very confusing. I hoped that the voice search (or search in general) would increase our viewing options. It didn't help at all. My wife couldn't figure out how to use the new software and I wasn't far ahead of here. I wanted to go back to the way it was.

Then came the threat of ads that precede shows. What?!?! That's a big reason I liked TiVo - you could skip commercials quickly or in some cases TiVo inserted automatic skips. And now I'm going to have to see ads that TiVo inserts? And do I need Tivo +? No! I have Apple TV, Netflix, etc. I don't need one more streaming service and subscription fee.

The nail in the coffin came with a letter from Comcast. They announced they were increasing Internet speeds but would have to upgrade my equipment. To make a long story short I learned via this process that I could subscribe to X1, get the X1 DVR, and gigabit Internet for $80 less per month than I was paying. $80 x 12 = about a thousand bucks a year savings. I couldn't turn that down.

But was the X1 DVR any good? The jury is still out after less than a week but it's not bad. The hard drive is very noisy. It doesn't have the skip feature. But the UI is logical and as far as I can tell they aren't trying to put commercials in front of shows that I record. I miss some things about the old TiVo UI but I miss NOTHING about the new UI.

I am willing to pay for a better DVR. Unfortunately TiVo is no longer a better DVR. I stuck with TiVo for over 15 years but they have let me down. I sympathize that TiVo has struggled vs. the cable TV DVRs. I understand that they have to make money some way. But for any product, if the features get worse and someone else has better features, then over time people will migrate to "better".

I'll keep an open mind about the future. I have been with Comcast/Infinity for a long time too and they used to drive me crazy. But I have to admit they are getting better. The Internet service is rock solid. They come for service appointments when they say they will. The guy who came last week to install the X1 was very solid. The tech support is pretty good. TiVo has gone in the opposite direction.

So I reluctantly am saying goodbye. I hope that TiVo finds a good customer base that is willing to pay their price and watch their ads. I'm no longer in their target market.


----------



## lucidrenegade (Aug 21, 2013)

:up:


----------



## Bruce24 (Jan 8, 2003)

emmgee said:


> [. It doesn't have the skip feature.


The X1 has what Comcast calls Smart Resume to skip through commercials. It only works on what they consider to be the most popular shows. To use it, you just hit fast forward when the commercial starts and it will resume play after the commercials. The X1 also support the 30 second skip or any time interval you set.

see: 
Smart Resume for Fast-Forwarding Commercial Breaks in Select DVR Recordings - Xfinity
How to program a 30-second skip button for Xfinity X1


----------



## ManeJon (Apr 14, 2018)

I suspect, depending upon the real impact (not complaints) that cable services will start adding commercials to the beginning of recorded programs. If they can figure a way to make more money they all will.


----------



## zalusky (Apr 5, 2002)

This angst sort of reminds me of jobs I worked at. I really enjoyed the late 90s and to some extent the early 2000s but since then its been downhill. Parties are gone. Sabbaticals are gone. Cubes and offices are gone. Heck even dedicated workspaces are gone.


----------



## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

Bruce24 said:


> The X1 has what Comcast calls Smart Resume to skip through commercials. It only works on what they consider to be the most popular shows. To use it, you just hit fast forward when the commercial starts and it will resume play after the commercials. The X1 also support the 30 second skip or any time interval you set.
> 
> see:
> Smart Resume for Fast-Forwarding Commercial Breaks in Select DVR Recordings - Xfinity
> How to program a 30-second skip button for Xfinity X1


Yep and you can also use voice to skip commercials and it works pretty well. We would say skip 2 minutes or fast forward 2 minutes and it would skip the 2 minutes.


----------



## just4tivo (Dec 9, 2015)

Comcast promo pricing is appealing... till the first year is up and you pay regular price.


----------



## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

emmgee said:


> I hated the Bolt. The new software was a big step backwards. It was very confusing. I hoped that the voice search (or search in general) would increase our viewing options. It didn't help at all. My wife couldn't figure out how to use the new software and I wasn't far ahead of here. I wanted to go back to the way it was.


The Bolt can be reverted to "TiVo Experience 3", which also avoids the pre-roll ads. No voice search, though.


----------



## dishrich (Jan 16, 2002)

just4tivo said:


> Comcast promo pricing is appealing... till the first year is up and you pay regular price.


Not if you get on a 2-year promo where (at least) the base price IS fixed the same...I'm in the middle of a 2 year now & while the broadcast TV fee went up $5 next month, that IS the only increase that happened to me.


----------



## NorthAlabama (Apr 19, 2012)

emmgee said:


> They announced they were increasing Internet speeds but would have to upgrade my equipment. To make a long story short I learned via this process that I could subscribe to X1, get the X1 DVR, and gigabit Internet for $80 less per month than I was paying. $80 x 12 = about a thousand bucks a year savings. I couldn't turn that down.


in our market, you can take advantage of this pricing and still use tivo, even though the x1 included with the pricing - just ask for tivo to be set as the primary box on your account, and you'll even get a monthly credit, too (i receive the "equipment upgrade" solicitations).


----------



## just4tivo (Dec 9, 2015)

dishrich said:


> Not if you get on a 2-year promo where (at least) the base price IS fixed the same...I'm in the middle of a 2 year now & while the broadcast TV fee went up $5 next month, that IS the only increase that happened to me.


One year versus two year promo varies by area. Here there's just the one year promo.


----------



## reneg (Jun 19, 2002)

dishrich said:


> Not if you get on a 2-year promo where (at least) the base price IS fixed the same...I'm in the middle of a 2 year now & while the broadcast TV fee went up $5 next month, that IS the only increase that happened to me.


I'm 10 months into a year promo with Comcast. Besides the broadcast fees get jacked up next month, in my package, Comcast has dropped MGM, TMC, Cinemax (replaced with HITZ) and Starz is slated to move out of my package and replaced with Epix at the end of this month. My Comcast bill has increased $20/month since I started this promo rate. I plan to dump Comcast and keep Tivo for OTA & Channels DVR for OTT Streaming. I wish you better luck with Comcast than I had. I'm so happy that I have a choice for Internet providers.


----------



## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

emmgee said:


> I hated the Bolt. The new software was a big step backwards. It was very confusing. I hoped that the voice search (or search in general) would increase our viewing options. It didn't help at all. My wife couldn't figure out how to use the new software and I wasn't far ahead of here. I wanted to go back to the way it was.


Just downgrade the Bolt to the old software and everything will be exactly like it was.


----------



## mazman (Nov 13, 2002)

reneg said:


> I'm 10 months into a year promo with Comcast. Besides the broadcast fees get jacked up next month, in my package, Comcast has dropped MGM, TMC, Cinemax (replaced with HITZ) and Starz is slated to move out of my package and replaced with Epix at the end of this month. My Comcast bill has increased $20/month since I started this promo rate. I plan to dump Comcast and keep Tivo for OTA & Channels DVR for OTT Streaming. I wish you better luck with Comcast than I had. I'm so happy that I have a choice for Internet providers.


What does Comcast charge for additional outlets (TiVo mini) + equipment?

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


----------



## reneg (Jun 19, 2002)

mazman said:


> What does Comcast charge for additional outlets (TiVo mini) + equipment?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk


For my local Comcast, they charge an additional Outlet Fee which is bundled with the second cablecard ($9.95 Outlet Fee -$2.50 Customer owned equipment credit). First cablecard has no Outlet Fee. I have two Tivo minis and no charges from Comcast on these. If Comcast could figure out a way, I'm positive they would find another fee to charge for them.


----------



## Aaron Malloy (Oct 30, 2019)

I've been with Tivo for about 5 years. I've enjoyed having it for the most part. But I recently ended service because I feel that $180 a year for a guide is simply too much. But because my viewing habits are now 75% streaming, and the rest local/network OTA programs recorded on the Tivo, it's not like I'll be missing much. All network stuff ends up online at some point anyway.

When I called to cancel Tivo, there was no discount incentive for me to stay. In fact, there was to concern about me leaving at all. 

My new toy is the Fire Stick 4K that I got for $25. It easily beats Tivo's streaming apps.


----------



## wbrightfl (Oct 31, 2013)

Next month my Roamio Pro, which still works beautifully on TE3, will reach the 5 years in service point. Have they stopped giving discounted All-in plan pricing? I tried calling during this summer and was told it would be $549.99 for the plan so I declined. I then read somewhere on these forums I think that they won't offer a discount until you pass the 5 year point. I am going to try next month on the 5 year anniversary and see if they offer me a good price to go All-in.


----------



## mulscully (May 31, 2003)

Aaron Malloy said:


> I've been with Tivo for about 5 years. I've enjoyed having it for the most part. But I recently ended service because I feel that $180 a year for a guide is simply too much. But because my viewing habits are now 75% streaming, and the rest local/network OTA programs recorded on the Tivo, it's not like I'll be missing much. All network stuff ends up online at some point anyway.
> 
> When I called to cancel Tivo, there was no discount incentive for me to stay. In fact, there was to concern about me leaving at all.
> 
> My new toy is the Fire Stick 4K that I got for $25. It easily beats Tivo's streaming apps.


I would pay for a better experience. All my Tivos have lifetime on them, so there is not a monthly fee for me except the cable card fee. However, I have resisted and new equipment or upgrades because I don't know if/when I will be converting to new equipment. The streaming apps on the Tivos stink compared to a $25 streaming device. I use to be excited about new innovations from Tivo, but it has been so long. (I do enjoy the automatic skip) I did upgrade to Experience 4. I am use to it now so it does not bother me like others have reported, but I don't necessarily think it's better. Although I have not been plagued with the new commercials yet.

Sorry for the stream of thought here but I really wish we had the old innovative Tivo company back

Lou


----------



## Rey (Oct 6, 2015)

Bruce24 said:


> The X1 has what Comcast calls Smart Resume to skip through commercials. It only works on what they consider to be the most popular shows. To use it, you just hit fast forward when the commercial starts and it will resume play after the commercials. The X1 also support the 30 second skip or any time interval you set.
> 
> see:
> Smart Resume for Fast-Forwarding Commercial Breaks in Select DVR Recordings - Xfinity
> How to program a 30-second skip button for Xfinity X1


Yeah,I have a Xg1v4 and that has never really worked well. In other words it stinks. I'm pretty much done with it as I was only using it for the college football games in 4k.


----------



## Rey (Oct 6, 2015)

wbrightfl said:


> Next month my Roamio Pro, which still works beautifully on TE3, will reach the 5 years in service point. Have they stopped giving discounted All-in plan pricing? I tried calling during this summer and was told it would be $549.99 for the plan so I declined. I then read somewhere on these forums I think that they won't offer a discount until you pass the 5 year point. I am going to try next month on the 5 year anniversary and see if they offer me a good price to go All-in.


I'd try again. I've been with them for 4 years and got lifetime on my roamio pro for $199.


----------



## Pokemon_Dad (Jan 19, 2008)

wbrightfl said:


> Next month my Roamio Pro, which still works beautifully on TE3, will reach the 5 years in service point. Have they stopped giving discounted All-in plan pricing? I tried calling during this summer and was told it would be $549.99 for the plan so I declined. I then read somewhere on these forums I think that they won't offer a discount until you pass the 5 year point. I am going to try next month on the 5 year anniversary and see if they offer me a good price to go All-in.


Wow. For that price you could buy a lifetime plan _with _a refubished Roamio Pro warrantied by Weaknees. But first I'd call TiVo again, and play CSR roulette. You may be able to get a cheaper lifetime deal even before you hit that five-year mark.


----------



## Sparky1234 (May 8, 2006)

Pokemon_Dad said:


> Wow. For that price you could buy a lifetime plan _with _a refubished Roamio Pro warrantied by Weaknees. But first I'd call TiVo again, and play CSR roulette. You may be able to get a cheaper lifetime deal even before you hit that five-year mark.


Calling TiVo and inquiring about a Lifetime discount is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you will get. Call daily, I know a pain, until you get the chocolate you want.


----------



## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

Sparky1234 said:


> Calling TiVo and inquiring about a Lifetime discount is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you will get. Call daily, I know a pain, until you get the chocolate you want.


lol i wish that worked for a box of chocolates.


----------



## just4tivo (Dec 9, 2015)

trip1eX said:


> lol i wish that worked for a box of chocolates.


pssst.... Whitman's Samplers have a map in the lid so you always know what you're going to get.


----------



## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

just4tivo said:


> pssst.... Whitman's Samplers have a map in the lid so you always know what you're going to get.


That's cheating.


----------



## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

And _real_ men don't use maps.


----------



## Davelnlr_ (Jan 13, 2011)

mazman said:


> What does Comcast charge for additional outlets (TiVo mini) + equipment?


My boss just upgraded to X1 Preferred. 250Mb/s Internet and All basic channels. $80/mo for two years, plus $5 per box in extra rooms (3 extra rooms). I dont *think* the room boxes can stream off the X1 DVR, but I might be wrong.

As for contracts, when my two year promo ran out this summer, I just went to the Xfinity store and signed up for a new promo with more channels, for $20 less per month, including no cap internet. They are pretty good about working with you around here, anyway.


----------



## dishrich (Jan 16, 2002)

Davelnlr_ said:


> My boss just upgraded to X1 Preferred. 250Mb/s Internet and All basic channels. $80/mo for two years, plus $5 per box in extra rooms (3 extra rooms). *I dont *think* the room boxes can stream off the X1 DVR, but I might be wrong.*


They do actually, they're "mini X1" boxes called XiD's. Under Comcast's new package pricing in many systems, ANY/ALL models of cable boxes are now [email protected]$5/month, X1 or not. They even changed how they charge the DVR service; the "DVR service" is still $10, but that covers multiple (physical) DVR boxes a sub might have on their account, which those physical DVR boxes are now $5/each as well. (each DVR box used to be $20/each)


----------



## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

emmgee said:


> The nail in the coffin came with a letter from Comcast. They announced they were increasing Internet speeds but would have to upgrade my equipment. To make a long story short I learned via this process that I could subscribe to X1, get the X1 DVR, and gigabit Internet for $80 less per month than I was paying. $80 x 12 = about a thousand bucks a year savings. I couldn't turn that down.


but don't you still have a Tivo that's already paid for?

you could keep using it, with its better interface and STILL get the lower price..


----------



## Puppy76 (Oct 7, 2004)

IMO the new interface is worse, but not THAT bad, it still gets the job done. I’m more annoyed that TiVo desktop no longer works for me at all. I can still use the web server interface at least. 
If that goes...


----------



## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

Mikeguy said:


> And _real_ men don't use maps.


Real men DO use maps but furtively, and pretend to real women that they don't need to.


----------



## just4tivo (Dec 9, 2015)

Mikeguy said:


> And _real_ men don't use maps.


If they have a peanut allergy they do or they never will...


----------



## dbperkins (Oct 21, 2003)

In my opinion, Tivo is dyeing a slow death. Tivo's voice(vox) remote is junk compared to Xfinity's X1 series. No more spinning circles. Apps are advaible on Xfinity X1 series. The small X1 box in my bedroom has same feature except no hard drive for recording, it uses records on one of the other DVR's. I don't care about keeping programs for years. I don't want to copy to my computer. To me it is a big waste. The Xfinity X1 is quiet and cool to the touch. Bolt always ran hot and needed external fans. Tivo was nice but I just want something that I don't have to baby sit.


----------



## dishrich (Jan 16, 2002)

dbperkins said:


> Tivo was nice but I just want *something that I don't have to baby sit.*


AND, because Comcast uses Gracenote data, DEFINITELY 2nd that one! :thumbsup:


----------



## Pokemon_Dad (Jan 19, 2008)

Puppy76 said:


> IMO the new interface is worse, but not THAT bad, it still gets the job done. I'm more annoyed that TiVo desktop no longer works for me at all. I can still use the web server interface at least.
> If that goes...


You can still use pyTivo and pyTivo desktop, with TiVo desktop running in the background. You can do more with kmttg too. If a TiVo is on TE4 you can download from it but cannot pull content onto it, which is yet another reason to stick with TE3. So no Edge for me.


----------



## shwru980r (Jun 22, 2008)

reneg said:


> For my local Comcast, they charge an additional Outlet Fee which is bundled with the second cablecard ($9.95 Outlet Fee -$2.50 Customer owned equipment credit). First cablecard has no Outlet Fee. I have two Tivo minis and no charges from Comcast on these. If Comcast could figure out a way, I'm positive they would find another fee to charge for them.


In my area Comcast/Xfinity won't use a splitter if you only want one outlet. They run the coax directly to room with the TV. I already had 6 rooms wired and they guy would not use my splitter. I had to go out and reconnect to my splitter to hook up all the outlets and install the POE filter. They would charge $10 per month to connect service to an additional room, but you could call and cancel the second outlet and they would not come out and disconnect the coax but you might get charged an extra $10 for the first month.


----------



## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Rey said:


> I'd try again. I've been with them for 4 years and got lifetime on my roamio pro for $199.


Did you just ask for it or did you get the offer after requesting to cancel service?

Scott


----------



## Rey (Oct 6, 2015)

HerronScott said:


> Did you just ask for it or did you get the offer after requesting to cancel service?
> 
> Scott


 I asked for it. They asked me why and I said it would help with my monthly cable bills.


----------



## lynncosbm (Dec 12, 2006)

Well, I have to say I’ve loved my TiVos over the years and still do but unfortunately my cable company is not supporting cable cards anymore and is only doing digital TV over the air so I have cancelled their service and unfortunately won’t be able to use TiVo anymore. I have two Bolts, one with lifetime and one with annual service. However, I am still able to get a couple local channels over air and am wondering if I cancel the annual service, will I still be able to watch a number of shows I have recorded over the years and also still attach to my lifetime Bolt to watch any new shows I record there? I’d really prefer not to still pay for the annual service if I could do that without it. I'd be grateful for any advice please!


----------



## Pokemon_Dad (Jan 19, 2008)

lynncosbm said:


> Well, I have to say I've loved my TiVos over the years and still do but unfortunately my cable company is not supporting cable cards anymore and is only doing digital TV over the air so I have cancelled their service and unfortunately won't be able to use TiVo anymore. I have two Bolts, one with lifetime and one with annual service. However, I am still able to get a couple local channels over air and am wondering if I cancel the annual service, will I still be able to watch a number of shows I have recorded over the years and also still attach to my lifetime Bolt to watch any new shows I record there? I'd really prefer not to still pay for the annual service if I could do that without it. I'd be grateful for any advice please!


If you cancel TiVo service on one of your Bolts, then you can still watch the recordings on that unit using a TV attached to it, but the two units will not be able to see each other so you won't be able to view or transfer recordings over your network.

Before you cancel the annual service you should transfer all recordings to the Lifetime unit, and if you want to access the Lifetime Bolt from another room then maybe sell the decommissioned Bolt and buy a Mini new, used, or refurbished.

Minis come with Lifetime/All-In and can be had for total price similar to or less than one year's annual service on a Bolt.


----------



## lynncosbm (Dec 12, 2006)

Pokemon_Dad said:


> If you cancel TiVo service on one of your Bolts, then you can still watch the recordings on that unit using a TV attached to it, but the two units will not be able to see each other so you won't be able to view or transfer recordings over your network.
> 
> Before you cancel the annual service you should transfer all recordings to the Lifetime unit, and if you want to access the Lifetime Bolt from another room then maybe sell the decommissioned Bolt and buy a Mini new, used, or refurbished.
> 
> Minis come with Lifetime/All-In and can be had for total price similar to or less than one year's annual service on a Bolt.


Thanks very much. That is just the advice I was looking for! I do have one Mini so that will still work. I'll consider buying another one, I might know someone who has one available. As far as selling the decommissioned Bolt, I'm actually in Bermuda, so the cost of shipping it overseas might make it not worth it. I might consider offering it for free to anyone who would pay the shipping though. I have until March to decide though. Thanks again!


----------



## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

end of an era. I sold off my roamio plus and minis and can't imagine going back to a cable Tivo ever again.

YTTV makes it obsolete as far as I'm concerned.

OTA Tivo is another story. I could see it plus Netflix etc plus direct to consumer sports streaming packages replacing YTTV. 


...unless YTTV evolves into a sports and news service for a cheaper price. They really should position themselves as such if possible in my mind.


----------



## NashGuy (May 2, 2015)

trip1eX said:


> ...unless YTTV evolves into a sports and news service for a cheaper price. They really should position themselves as such if possible in my mind.


The head of Hulu mentioned his desire over a year ago to offer a smaller package of live channels that wouldn't include entertainment channels, basically just channels focused on sports and news (including, I guess, the big 4 broadcast nets/locals). I don't think the content/network owners are at a point yet where they're ready to allow for that kind of package but, as cable TV continues to decline while those owners continue to build up their own entertainment-focused on-demand streaming services (e.g. Hulu, HBO Max, etc.), I think it will eventually come to pass.

But, realistically, what would be the cost of such a package if it included all the following?

ABC and the ESPN channels (including SEC Network, ACC Network, etc.)
NBC, NBCSN, Golf, MSNBC
CBS, CBS Sports Network, CBSN
Fox, FS1, FS2, Big Ten Network, Fox News, Fox Business
Sinclair-owned regional sports networks (necessary in order to get Sinclair-owned affiliates of the big 4 networks)

Such a package might also include the Warner-owned CNN, TBS and TNT as well, although it could probably attract enough subscribers without them (and live sports and news from those networks will likely become available inside HBO Max eventually, anyhow).

Comcast cable TV is already charging $15/mo for local broadcast nets plus about $8.50 for RSNs, so that's $23.50/mo for those. Add another $10 for the ESPN channels, plus several bucks for everything else listed. Hard to see such a package coming to market for less than $40, I'd say.


----------



## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

NashGuy said:


> The head of Hulu mentioned his desire over a year ago to offer a smaller package of live channels that wouldn't include entertainment channels, basically just channels focused on sports and news (including, I guess, the big 4 broadcast nets/locals). I don't think the content/network owners are at a point yet where they're ready to allow for that kind of package but, as cable TV continues to decline while those owners continue to build up their own entertainment-focused on-demand streaming services (e.g. Hulu, HBO Max, etc.), I think it will eventually come to pass.
> 
> But, realistically, what would be the cost of such a package if it included all the following?
> 
> ...


Probably. Channels would have to evolve. The networks would have to spin off their sports into a separate package. Same with a TNT and TBS.

But there's a whole section of Lifestyle channels: aMC, Bravo, ComeTV, Cozi, Discovery, E!, Food Network, FX, FXM, FXX, HDTV, ID, IFC, Motortrend, Nat Geo, Nat Geo Wild, Own, Oxygen, Pop, StartTV, SundanceTV, Tastemade, TBS, TLC, TNT, Travel Channel, TruTV, TCM, Universo, USA, Wetv.

then Family channels: Animal Planet, Cartoon Network, Disney, Disney Jr, Disney XD, Freeform, PBS Kids, Smithsonian, Univeral Kids

They could dump those. Maybe take out news too. Take out: BBC America, BBC World News, Cheddar Business, Cheddar News, CNBC, CNBC World, CNN, Fox Business, Fox News, HLN, Local Now, MSNBC, Newsy, TYT Network

Maybe they could get it down by $15-$20. But they would have to add in the sports from TNT maybe TBS. And then if you could get rid of the prime time network programming and morning crap and day time stuff. ...

...that would probably be an ideal package for me. ...if the price went down by at least $20/mo. I would rather spend the $20/mo savings on additional streaming services than on those cable channels.

But yeah the other problem is as they split stuff out it can get more expensive per channel. Sports is high priced but at the same time subsidized by a ton of cable customers who don't watch sports. So it will probably be even higher if they split it out so just sports fans are paying for it.

But end of an era for Tivo and the cable dvr for me. I just don't see a case where I would ever come back to a Tivo cable dvr. Stuff like YTTV will only get better at a faster pace than Tivo and we are only going to see more sports move to streaming with more options.


----------



## mntvjunkie (May 13, 2009)

This is why Comcast was so smart to invest in the X1 platform when they did, IMO. It is still more expensive than Youtube TV, but at least is on feature parity with them in the ability to access all of your things from wherever you are (which is a big appeal to OTT services like YTTV). Tivo tried to dip their toes in that barrel, but it is all still dependent on home hardware and internet that you need to maintain yourself. That's probably the biggest thing that has me starting to look at X1, the ability to access everything from everywhere and have it just WORK every time. This all includes in the home too, as it seems to never fail that I sit down to watch something on my Mini, tablet, or PC only to have that component stop working and require a reboot to fix.

The second appeal to YTTV is to not have to worry about hardware failure since everything is already in the cloud, meaning that you won't lose recordings due to a hard drive dying or even a power failure. And Comcast answers that too by either having a hybrid solution where you have a local hard drive, but the last certain number of hours is also in the cloud, or moving 100% to the cloud like they are starting to do now.

Lastly, the third thing I am looking forward to with X1 is because I have already used the Stream app to define all of my favorite channels, shows, etc. when I get the hardware it will already be set up (and once the recordings are set up, if I ever change the hardware it should retain that as well).

This is the future of linear TV, as long as it continues to exist. Watching whatever you want, wherever you want, with no friction. And that requires having the entire ecosystem to do.


----------



## NashGuy (May 2, 2015)

trip1eX said:


> But yeah the other problem is as they split stuff out it can get more expensive per channel. Sports is high priced but at the same time subsidized by a ton of cable customers who don't watch sports. So it will probably be even higher if they split it out so just sports fans are paying for it.


Yup. And stripping out all those entertainment/lifestyle/family channels from a package only brings the cost down so much, because their carriage fees are generally low. It's sports that costs so much.

I do think that sports will eventually all become available via streaming services too, as opposed to remaining exclusively within linear channels. In fact, the logical end point I'd say is for the most popular sports to be sold and streamed like all other major video entertainment will be, direct-to-consumer from the content owners. I don't see why the NFL, NBA, MLB, NHL and major NCAA Div 1 men's college sports aren't packaged up and sold directly by the leagues/teams themselves. There could still be a place for one or two multi-sport channels/services like ESPN to offer consumers a "variety mix" of games across various sports/leagues. But it's hard to see how in the future you won't be able to just buy a season ticket to stream all the games from your local team directly from the league. MLB seems to have been flirting with that idea (as opposed to just out-of-market games) for awhile now.


----------



## NashGuy (May 2, 2015)

mntvjunkie said:


> This is why Comcast was so smart to invest in the X1 platform when they did, IMO. It is still more expensive than Youtube TV, but at least is on feature parity with them in the ability to access all of your things from wherever you are (which is a big appeal to OTT services like YTTV). Tivo tried to dip their toes in that barrel, but it is all still dependent on home hardware and internet that you need to maintain yourself. That's probably the biggest thing that has me starting to look at X1, the ability to access everything from everywhere and have it just WORK every time. This all includes in the home too, as it seems to never fail that I sit down to watch something on my Mini, tablet, or PC only to have that component stop working and require a reboot to fix.
> 
> The second appeal to YTTV is to not have to worry about hardware failure since everything is already in the cloud, meaning that you won't lose recordings due to a hard drive dying or even a power failure. And Comcast answers that too by either having a hybrid solution where you have a local hard drive, but the last certain number of hours is also in the cloud, or moving 100% to the cloud like they are starting to do now.
> 
> Lastly, the third thing I am looking forward to with X1 is because I have already used the Stream app to define all of my favorite channels, shows, etc. when I get the hardware it will already be set up (and once the recordings are set up, if I ever change the hardware it should retain that as well).


Yep. AT&T will aim to do the same thing with their new AT&T TV. But instead of developing their own hardware/software platform in-house, as Comcast did with X1, they're just relying on Google's Android TV Operator Tier and their own apps for a range of popular retail devices. But the key is having all your content -- live channels, on-demand, DVR recordings -- in the cloud and available on whatever device you want, wherever you go, as long as you're connected to the internet. That's where cable TV has to go to survive in the 2020s.


----------



## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

NashGuy said:


> Yup. And stripping out all those entertainment/lifestyle/family channels from a package only brings the cost down so much, because their carriage fees are generally low. It's sports that costs so much.


My cable company has a package (not on their rate card) that removes all sports channels. Both local and national. It doesn't affect the networks like CBS NFL Sunday games. I save $30 a month. But I can't have any premium channels or other specials, just basic cable. It's all I watch anyhow. It seems that HBO/Cinemax are unencrypted every month anymore. It used to be in the clear just every 3 months.


----------



## buscuitboy (Aug 8, 2005)

All this talk of Comcast reminds me of my days of being with them. I used to love TiVo, but when I was able to find an IPTV service that includes EVERYTHING for only $15/month, I quickly dumped TiVo/Comcast and have never looked back.

All my locals, every cable tv channel on the planet, premium movie channels (hbo,showtime,Cinemax, etc) sports packages (nhl/nba/nfl/mlb) and weekly PPV events. Yea, this new IPTV service I got May not last forever, but there are 50 others just like it right around the corner. This is the true reason I think they are all raising rates. Long live TiVo and Comcast


----------



## boulderskies (Aug 23, 2013)

wmcbrine said:


> The Bolt can be reverted to "TiVo Experience 3", which also avoids the pre-roll ads. No voice search, though.


What's the link to the how-to for reverting back to 3? The one provided doesnt seem to have it.
Thanks, Scott


----------



## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

How to Rollback Hydra from Roamio and Mini's v1 works for Bolt except for the OTA models ending in "V".


----------



## dstoffa (Dec 14, 2005)

trip1eX said:


> But yeah the other problem is as they split stuff out it can get more expensive per channel. Sports is high priced but at the same time subsidized by a ton of cable customers who don't watch sports. So it will probably be even higher if they split it out so just sports fans are paying for it.


I read an article on-line four years or so ago about the true cost of a-la-carte payTV. If ESPN were to maintain existing revenue, and spread that cost to only those who watch it, it would be a $25 per month channel.

Like Doctor Zaius said, "Be careful Taylor, you might not like what you find...."


----------



## NashGuy (May 2, 2015)

buscuitboy said:


> All this talk of Comcast reminds me of my days of being with them. I used to love TiVo, but when I was able to find an IPTV service that includes EVERYTHING for only $15/month, I quickly dumped TiVo/Comcast and have never looked back.
> 
> All my locals, every cable tv channel on the planet, premium movie channels (hbo,showtime,Cinemax, etc) sports packages (nhl/nba/nfl/mlb) and weekly PPV events. Yea, this new IPTV service I got May not last forever, but there are 50 others just like it right around the corner. This is the true reason I think they are all raising rates. Long live TiVo and Comcast


Those IPTV services with ridiculously low rates are all illegal copyright infringers that routinely get busted and shut down by law enforcement. As long as you're willing to buy stolen goods, sure, the price is great!


----------



## jmccorm (Oct 8, 2000)

emmgee said:


> The most recent was a few months back to the Bolt. I hated the Bolt. The new software was a big step backwards. .... And do I need Tivo +? No!


After a very long run with TiVo, I'm close to where OP is at. I'm not running to a Cox Contour DVR because it is special, I'm just running away from the pain.

*Any chance I have of sticking it out comes down to these two questions:*

*1.* If I downgrade my Bolt to its original v3, will I still get guide data?
*2.* If I downgrade my Bolt to its original v3, will the guide data be infested with fake Tivo+ channels?

Thanks all.


----------



## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

jmccorm said:


> After a very long run with TiVo, I'm close to where OP is at. I'm not running to a Cox Contour DVR because it is special, I'm just running away from the pain.
> 
> *Any chance I have of sticking it out comes down to these two questions:*
> 
> ...


1. Yes
2. No


----------



## KevTech (Apr 15, 2014)

jmccorm said:


> After a very long run with TiVo, I'm close to where OP is at. I'm not running to a Cox Contour DVR because it is special, I'm just running away from the pain.
> 
> *Any chance I have of sticking it out comes down to these two questions:*
> 
> ...


Before you go to TE3 use kmttg to backup your onepasses and channel list then after you are back on TE3 you can put these back on your Tivo.


----------



## jmccorm (Oct 8, 2000)

You're both jewels and appreciated!

Thanks for the answers Joe, we're going TE3.

Kev, I was going to copy our Onepasses to another device (using the TiVo websites) and then copy back once completed, but you've saved me the effort of fighting their Java interface which (in the past) had trouble working with so many entries (only ~100).

Channel listings? Boy that was going to be a real pain to rebuild. Thanks! (And thanks to kmttg!)


----------



## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

Just remember, it's not as pretty.


----------



## jmccorm (Oct 8, 2000)

JoeKustra said:


> Just remember, it's not as pretty.


I like to think that TE3 has a pettier interface "on the inside". (The flow of the user interface, not the appearance.) RESULT: Finally, relief. We're putting away the pitchforks for now.

Only one question about a TE4 feature which is missing in TE3:

The ability to search for the title of any Movie or TV Episode, and then have it tell me which provider(s) offer it, and at what cost(s). It sounds like a problem the cord-cutters would have already come across.

Is there a good website for seeing which services offer which titles, and any additional incremental cost?

PS: Thanks again!


----------



## Pokemon_Dad (Jan 19, 2008)

jmccorm said:


> Only one question about a TE4 feature which is missing in TE3:
> 
> The ability to search for the title of any Movie or TV Episode, and then have it tell me which provider(s) offer it, and at what cost(s). It sounds like a problem the cord-cutters would have already come across.
> 
> ...


In TE3 when you search a for something and then select its title, in the next screen you'll see little icons for TV and/or streaming services in the lower right corner of the screen, just to show you the options. If you select Get This (or move right), the next menu may offer OnePass, Bookmark, Wishlist and/or Watch Now depending on where it's available.


----------



## Lurker1 (Jun 4, 2004)

jmccorm said:


> Is there a good website for seeing which services offer which titles, and any additional incremental cost?
> 
> PS: Thanks again!


justwatch.com does exactly that.


----------



## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

jmccorm said:


> I like to think that TE3 has a pettier interface "on the inside". (The flow of the user interface, not the appearance.) RESULT: Finally, relief. We're putting away the pitchforks for now.
> Only one question about a TE4 feature which is missing in TE3:
> The ability to search for the title of any Movie or TV Episode, and then have it tell me which provider(s) offer it, and at what cost(s). It sounds like a problem the cord-cutters would have already come across.
> Is there a good website for seeing which services offer which titles, and any additional incremental cost?
> PS: Thanks again!


What they said. Additionally, I find (I have a TE4 box too) the voice search is more like Google than TiVo's Search. I ask for "Fury". It's not free. My recording preferences are set to "free" only. Voice doesn't care. While my default for a 1P/Search is Recording and Streaming", it is also set to Rent or Buy: No. So TiVo doesn't show me Fury (the one with Brad Pitt). At one time TiVo promoted the integration of their services. Not so much anymore.


----------



## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

jmccorm said:


> I like to think that TE3 has a pettier interface "on the inside". (The flow of the user interface, not the appearance.) RESULT: Finally, relief. We're putting away the pitchforks for now.
> 
> Only one question about a TE4 feature which is missing in TE3:
> 
> ...


There's a good app for that, on iOS and presumably Android: "JustWatch". Don't know if it's available as a web site.


----------



## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

dlfl said:


> There's a good app for that, on iOS and presumably Android: "JustWatch". Don't know if it's available as a web site.


As lurker1 pointed out yesterday, JustWatch does indeed have a website as well as apps.


----------



## filovirus (Aug 22, 2013)

reneg said:


> I'm so happy that I have a choice for Internet providers.


Having choices for broadband is the big deal. My new home offered only a latent Wisp and outdated CenturyLink DSL. Tried them both while begging and pleading Comcast to expand their plant to my side of the street. They were about 1/3 to 1/2 mile away. Finally after about 6 months of letters to the CEO, they agreed to expand without charging me. While I am happy with having access to their service, I do see that without competition, my internet only bill will eventually climb to what it was for TV and Internet bundles. And short of moving, I will have to pay.


----------



## buscuitboy (Aug 8, 2005)

NashGuy said:


> As long as you're willing to buy stolen goods, sure, the price is great!


I think the robbing all starts from the top with the cable companies and providers so #$%& just runs downhill is the way I see it


----------



## Prestond (Feb 4, 2008)

zalusky said:


> This angst sort of reminds me of jobs I worked at. I really enjoyed the late 90s and to some extent the early 2000s but since then its been downhill. Parties are gone. Sabbaticals are gone. Cubes and offices are gone. Heck even dedicated workspaces are gone.


OMG and you do not look that old in your profile picture to appreciate the old days, but spot on, its gone downhill.


----------



## zalusky (Apr 5, 2002)

Prestond said:


> OMG and you do not look that old in your profile picture to appreciate the old days, but spot on, its gone downhill.


You are very kind. I have been working since the 70s. I have seen a lot of transitions.


----------



## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

zalusky said:


> You are very kind. I have been working since the 70s. I have seen a lot of transitions.


Child labor?


----------



## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

X1 is nowhere near as good as TiVo. The problem for TiVo is that it's "good enough" for 99% of Comcast's users. The new XG1v4 does get rid of a lot of the hardware-related problems that they had with the first couple of generations of boxes that were sluggish and crashed a lot.


----------



## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

Also, the users who are sophisticated enough to want a better DVR are too sophisticated for Comcast's crappy TV service with it's poor video quality and high prices, so they are already on a streaming service. There's no room for TiVo left in Comcast land.


----------

