# TiVo, Slingbox, Australia... Thoughts wanted!



## Aussie (Jan 11, 2001)

Hi Folks

I've been thinking... that's dangerous! 

I'm one of the lucky few with a TiVo down under (well, 3 TiVos actually) I've been using TiVo here for more than 5 years and I love it, but there's always been one problem! TV in Australia is very limited in choice, even if you have PayTV... We get everything months, if not years, after the USA, and often not at all.

But the Slingbox would now seem to offer a solution to this!

I figure that with a "partner" in the USA I could get them to install a TiVo, some form of PayTV service and a Slingbox, and I could soon be watching US TV right here live in Aus!

Can anybody suggest why this wouldn't work? It could even be a business, I bet there would be others like me outside the USA who would pay a tidy sum to expand their TV watching choices... I envisage a warehouse full of TiVo's, Slingboxes and a big fat network connection bringing the cream of US TV to viewers all over the world? (Yes, that was slightly "tongue in cheek!" I know not all US TV is great!)

I'd love to try to set up a prototype of this, just to see how well it would work... I've just ordered a US Slingbox to play with here (it seems it will work fine with our PAL system, except for the internal tuner which I don't care about), but for now I'd like to ask a big favour...

Is there was anybody with a Slingbox and a TiVo who'd let me access their Slingbox to see what the performance is like under real world conditions?

I'd like to see if the quality is acceptable on devices larger than a normal PC or Laptop screen. Is anybody using Sling output on "big TVs" like Front or Rear Projectors, Plasmas, etc? Is it okay?

I'd be interested in all or any comments people using the Slingbox and TiVo together might care to make, and do remember that I've never yet even seen a Slingbox and I'm totally depending on info found on the web, so if there's anything I've misunderstood please correct me!

Cheers
Ron
[email protected]


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## cynthetiq (Mar 13, 2004)

I was thinking about providing this service to some of my friends...I'd rent cable boxes for them and everything...


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## Aussie (Jan 11, 2001)

cynthetiq said:


> I was thinking about providing this service to some of my friends...I'd rent cable boxes for them and everything...


Keep thinking! Can I be your friend? 

Seriously, what's a typical cable service cost per month in the USA? ... Here in Aus I pay AU$130.00 (about US$95) for my Foxtel PayTV Service, that gets me two foxtel STB's and about 60 channels, few of which have anything much that I even bother watching!

Cheers
Ron
[email protected]


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## murgatroyd (Jan 6, 2002)

I have Comcast Analog cable and pay less than $60 US for basic + extended cable (76 channels). Of course that includes TV Guide channel (not much use to me). 

You may know all this already, but just in case:

Here's a link to the United States Postal Service where you can Find a zip code.

And here's a link to one of our big TV Listings sites, Zap2It.

Pick a US City, find a zip code from that city, plug it into Zap2It, and you can see what TV lineups people have. For instance, for my lineup, plug in 94704 and choose Comcast -- Berkeley (I don't have digital).

That will allow you to compare and see how much we have in the US that also isn't worth watching. 

Jan


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## Guindalf (Jun 13, 2001)

I hate to sound like an internet cop, which I assure you is not my intention, but have you considered the legal implications here?

I haven't looked into it, but I think you'll find that re-transmitting programming out of the country is probably illegal - or at least against copyright laws. You may be inviting a huge lawsuit - and you know how litigeous the US can be!

I'm sure the networks would turn a blind eye to someone using a Slingbox when traveling - and may even endorse it - but when it comes to actually providing it as a service or setting it up as a permanent solution ot crap TV in someone's own country, then I think they may do something about it.

After all, how are the advertisers going to make a profit from you if you are unable to buy their product? Even companies like Coca-Cola and McDonalds would have a legitimate complaint as their US advertising budget was being used in Australia!

Just a thought.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

Aussie said:


> Can anybody suggest why this wouldn't work? It could even be a business, I bet there would be others like me outside the USA who would pay a tidy sum to expand their TV watching choices... I envisage a warehouse full of TiVo's, Slingboxes and a big fat network connection bringing the cream of US TV to viewers all over the world? (Yes, that was slightly "tongue in cheek!" I know not all US TV is great!)


under US law it would be illegal to do what you suggest as a business venture. You can not grab a broadcast and send it somewhere else for profit. There was a canadian service a few years back that streamed TV shows on the internet. Star Trek next Generation came on during lunch. I was really liking it and the site was still only ad supported but then the service was shut down as for profit.
edit to add - and I think Guindalf is right that it may be illegal even if done out of good naturedness. But I doubt the internet police will come crashing down the door anytime soon on one hookup.

So find the Friend and make private arrangements. You are correct that all you need is a TiVo and a slingbox plus a good internet pipe to make it work. You may need to work with slingbox support though as your tests may show problems with latency as you get through all the hops between US and Australia.

Good luck.


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## TerpBE (Jan 23, 2003)

I have Slingbox + Tivo. It's a great combination. I don't see any technical problems with your scenario. I've heard of a lot of situations like soldiers deployed overseas using Slingbox to watch their TV at home.

You might want to check out slingcommunity.com.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

I don't think the quality would be acceptable on those "big TVs" that Ron is asking about. Most "big TVs" (here in the US anyway) are HD nowadays which would only magnify the flaws. Watching full screen laptop/PC inside my place is acceptable, but away from home I watch in a window.

As everyone else mentioned reselling cable TV internationally is probably a no-no, but if you can drop a Slingbox at a friend's house in the US... OR maybe buy someone a Slingbox (which you own but they host) and it might be more acceptable.

He may be better off getting tv shows off file sharing networks, ebay, or using a proxy and downloading from network web sites once they start offering them. Of course all of those are of questionable legality.


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## Aussie (Jan 11, 2001)

Hi Folks

Thanks for all the comments... I was mostly thinking of a "private" deal, just between friends, rather than actually making a business out of it, that was really more of a daydream that ocurred to me as I was writing. But it's hard to see why a cable company would object really... I'd be paying for my subscription, it's a one to one deal (my understanding is that a Slingbox can only service one connection at any given time) so there's not really a re-broadcasting issue, it would rather be an extremely "narrowcast" re-transmission, from a subscription I paid for, from hardware I would own, to me personally. 

This kind of globalisation of TV is almost inevitable, I think, if the technology exists to do it then it WILL happen! 

Sure, I could grab most of the big shows and movies as a torrents, but that is definitely illegal and most of the material that actually would interest me is somewhat of a "niche" nature and would probably be hard to find, even if I didn't care about the legal and moral issues. 

Quality is what I really wanted to find about in the first instance, if that was not acceptable (I have a big DLP rear projector in the lounge, and plasma in the bedroom, both HD capable) then it would be a no-go anyway... I'd still like to see what the results would be like! And it would be a cool set-up... The TiVos used to have a major "cool factor" but even in Aus they're starting to become a bit run of the mill these days! 

Cheers
Ron


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

Download the SlingPlayer to your PC and ping me... I'll give you 24 hours to check it out on my analog cable feed (IR and TiVo aren't set up with my SB). In exchange you give me two decent pictures for my blog - one of the SlingPlayer in a Window on your plasma (with a good view of the streaming bitrate) and one full screen so we can all check out the quality across the globe. Deal?

Download here:
http://www.slingmedia.com/support/downloads.php?version=1.0.5.140&type=full


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## classicsat (Feb 18, 2004)

Aussie said:


> Hi Folks
> But it's hard to see why a cable company would object really... I'd be paying for my subscription, it's a one to one deal


It is not that that US based cable company or sling box would be irked (they may get concerned if a lot slingboxes are serving to foreign clients), it is that elements of your local broadcasts industry won't like you watching the programs they have the rights to and them not getting a piece of the action.



> This kind of globalisation of TV is almost inevitable, I think, if the technology exists to do it then it WILL happen!


Not any time soon. Rightholders are very strong, and they won't let technology change their rights.


> Sure, I could grab most of the big shows and movies as a torrents, but that is definitely illegal and most of the material that actually would interest me is somewhat of a "niche" nature and would probably be hard to find, even if I didn't care about the legal and moral issues.


Currently Slingbox may be illegal even across local markets, let alone across the world. If intenrational slingboxing becomes a problem for TV industry, you can be sure that in their drive to eliminate international slinging, they will get rid of domestic out-of-market slinging, or get sued out of business.


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## angelp (Jan 14, 2006)

We have a slingbox set up at the in-laws so we can watch the local sports teams...the quality is fine on the computer, but on a big screen....not so much. 

I definitely think there's a problem with you charging someone for this service.


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## terryfoster (Jul 21, 2003)

I forsee all sorts of bandwidth problems here.... but if it works, more power to you. Not like this would be the most illegal thing going on, on the internet.


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## Joeg180 (Jun 1, 2003)

Aussie want's this for his own use, he would pay for the slingbox and cable connection?

He is not providing this as an alternative to Australian TV?

Bandwidth would be my concern as well.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

We hope to conduct our experiment in the near future and will report back.  FYI a month or two ago, Alice Hill of RealTechNews tried watching her box while globe trotting and got similar streaming bitrates that I get down the road from mine.


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## classicsat (Feb 18, 2004)

Joeg180 said:


> Aussie want's this for his own use, he would pay for the slingbox and cable connection?


Yes. 


> He is not providing this as an alternative to Australian TV?


Yes, but some of the programming on Aus TV is from US sources, usually delayed to suit the TV market there.
By watching from US sources, he would not be at least seeing the local ads, and at most not subbing to domestic pay services.


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## Dajad (Oct 7, 1999)

I'd be keen to know how the davezatz experiment went?

Yes, indeed, this is frought with legal issues. FYI, here's my recent post on Hollywood contemplating sueing Slingblade out of existence:

http://www.daledietrich.com/imedia/Apr06.htm#27Apr06f

My take on it, without any real reasearch, is that slingblade will be fine so long as uses like those contemplated in this thread are kept to a minimum! 

...Dale


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

I heard Slingblade was a great movie, though I never saw it. 

Ron just started playing around with the Slingbox/player and hasn't gotten it up on the plasma or projector yet, but the bitrate is good at 320-350kbps (which is about what I get outside the home locally). He says sound is perfect and in stereo, and as I predicted video looks good in a window but full screen quality (and fast action sequences) is less than perfect. The SlingPlayer software does have some settings to tweak, including a Fast Action mode, so maybe Ron will make some adjustments and report back.

Ron, feel free to elaborate and don't let me put too many words in your mouth.


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## Dajad (Oct 7, 1999)

oops ... Yes, Billi Bob was terrific in it!  

 ... Dale


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## Aussie (Jan 11, 2001)

Hi Folks

Finally I have time to write up my experience accessing Dave's Slingbox from Australia. Dave's already said most of what our experience was like, I found it very good on the PC in a window, less good full screen, and still less good on a "big Screen", but in all cases I would definitely call it watchable! It's not good on the big TVs, but it's good enough that I want to proceed to try to get a set-up in place.

We achieved a fairly constant bit rate of around 350kbs and channel changing was very fast (much less lag than I expected, probably as fast as the TiVo can change my STB via the blaster).

I was surprised to see a big cross-over between the PayTV channels in Australia and the USA, so much so that I would no longer bother retransmitting PayTV to Australia, what I really need is Free To Air TV, not Pay! One thing we really enjoyed (although I'm sure the novelty would soon wear off) was the advertisements! They were very different in style to many of ours, and I was amazed by the number of car commercials!

I agree with everybody who has said that a commercial service offering this sort of deal would be fraught with problems, so what I'm going to try to do is find an expatriate Aussie in the USA who would like Aussie TV in the USA and simple do a swap, I'll set up a Slingbox (and possibly TiVo) here for him to get his Aussie TV fix, and he does the same for me over there. No money changes hands and we both get what we want!

There are a few websites dedicated to Aussies living in the USA and I'll fish around them to se if anybody is interested, but I'd be happy to hear from any expats who might be on this board and be interested in this sort of proposition, or, for that matter anybody who would just like to have access to Aussie TV! If you want to see a TV guide for my location, go to:
http://www.yourtv.com.au/guide/ and select ACT-ACT as the Free to Air broadcast region. (My local PayTV provider is Foxtel Analogue Satellite, but I'm not really proposing that would be Slingboxed, although I guess it could be, by negotiation.)

Anyway, thanks to everybody for their comments, and especially to Dave (davezatz) for actually making this test a reality! It was fun! I just hope I can find somebody to work with on the project!

Cheers
Ron


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## anom (Apr 18, 2005)

Aussie said:


> I'd be happy to hear from any expats who might be on this board and be interested in this sort of proposition, or, for that matter anybody who would just like to have access to Aussie TV!


I think you'll find that the reason the expats left in the first place was because they were sick of having nothing to watch but rugby matches and Kylie Minogue videos.


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## Aussie (Jan 11, 2001)

anom said:


> I think you'll find that the reason the expats left in the first place was because they were sick of having nothing to watch but rugby matches and Kylie Minogue videos.


No doubt! That's why I want US TV!  Just to have another, less parochial, view of the world!

Cheers
Ron


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## manooosie (Apr 10, 2005)

hmmm, i lived in Brisbane for a couple of years, and I do miss the cricket and rugby matches. Give me a pm!


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## kensteele (Dec 28, 2002)

I've watched my own slingbox from Japan and Korea and it works just fine, as you discovered.


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## bibu (Feb 22, 2010)

Moved to new thread.
Sorry.


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## jsnc (Feb 3, 2015)

Aussie said:


> so what I'm going to try to do is find an expatriate Aussie in the USA who would like Aussie TV in the USA and simple do a swap, I'll set up a Slingbox (and possibly TiVo) here for him to get his Aussie TV fix, and he does the same for me over there. No money changes hands and we both get what we want!
> 
> There are a few websites dedicated to Aussies living in the USA and I'll fish around them to se if anybody is interested, but I'd be happy to hear from any expats who might be on this board and be interested in this sort of proposition, or, for that matter anybody who would just like to have access to Aussie TV! select ACT-ACT as the Free to Air broadcast region. (My local PayTV provider is Foxtel Analogue Satellite, but I'm not really proposing that would be Slingboxed, although I guess it could be, by negotiation.


Im interested in this but only if it isnt free to air and its slingboxed.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

jsnc said:


> Im interested in this but only if it isnt free to air and its slingboxed.


You replied to a person that hasn't posted on here in six years...


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