# A good deal? Philips HDR612BK's for sale



## jmace57 (Nov 30, 2002)

There is an outfit I have done business with before - www.surpluscomputers.com and they have some Series 1 TiVo's for sale for cheap prices - never seen them for sale here.

$25 for a 60 hour http://www.surpluscomputers.com/348535/philips-hdr612bk-60gb-tivo-dvr.html

$30 for an 80 hour http://www.surpluscomputers.com/348536/philips-hdr612bk-80gb-tivo-dvr.html

$35 for a 120 hour http://www.surpluscomputers.com/348537/philips-hdr612bk-120gb-tivo-dvr.html

Philips HDR612BK's - I find it impossible to believe, but it shows the condition as "new" (I think it is a really old listing copied and pasted, but not sure - says it has a 90 day warranty).

I was thinking for parts machines for those of you with Series 1's.

Jim

UPDATE - 120 gig versions are sold out.

UPDATE2 - All back in stock, but priceof 80 gig increased $5 and 120 gig by $10


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## lafos (Nov 8, 2004)

I just took a look and all three models are listed as refurbished now. No bad prices for parts.


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## maartsen (Feb 14, 2009)

I ordered the 120 hr day before yesterday, and they are now no longer listed . At least I know mine is in UPS...


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## jmace57 (Nov 30, 2002)

I received mine today. I would swear it is new...not a single scuff or scratch on it. Mine has a status of 1: New...at least one person (from the Fatwallet forum said theirs arrived with 5: Lifetime).

All are sold out now.

Jim


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## tpsmak (Feb 8, 2009)

I just saw they are available again... they have 120GB, 20GB, and 40GB. I'm going to pick a few up for parts!


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## jmace57 (Nov 30, 2002)

tpsmak said:


> I just saw they are available again... they have 120GB, 20GB, and 40GB. I'm going to pick a few up for parts!


My 60 gig one I bought showed up with a 20 gig...21 hours recording time at basic. Doesn't matter soo much as I was going to replace the drive anyway...
Jim


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## jmace57 (Nov 30, 2002)

Follow up - apparently they did the same image for all of these...I ordered a 60 and it says 21 hours...someone else got a 120 - says the same thing - they opened it up and indeed there was a 120 gig drive in it.

Jim


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## Prestond (Feb 4, 2008)

I saw these, but am curious they advertise that you dont need Tivo subscription? I am not sure how that would work... here is their quote:

"These units can be used as a digital VCR WITHOUT A SUBCRIPTION TO TIVO!"

Here is the link

So these are essentially Tivo 1's? I have analog cable in spare room and thinking about getting one so they should still work for that. Now surplus computers are showing these as being Philips CES11963, but I couldnt find much on this model.

Anyone having any experience with these models? What should be my expectations for simple analog recording off analog cable?


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## urwathrtz (Jan 18, 2008)

Do they work OK? I'd love to get one for the bedroom. Nothing else going on there any way.


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## MichaelK (Jan 10, 2002)

Prestond said:


> I saw these, but am curious they advertise that you dont need Tivo subscription? I am not sure how that would work... here is their quote:
> 
> "These units can be used as a digital VCR WITHOUT A SUBCRIPTION TO TIVO!"
> 
> ...


if i recalls- very old boxes of a certain vintage will permit MANUAL recordings without the tivo service. You would need to set up all the recordings like a vcr- channel X, start at Y, record for Z minutes.


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## scandia101 (Oct 20, 2007)

jmace57 said:


> Follow up - apparently they did the same image for all of these...I ordered a 60 and it says 21 hours...someone else got a 120 - says the same thing - they opened it up and indeed there was a 120 gig drive in it.
> 
> Jim


Apparently they don't know that they have to expand the image to fit the larger hard drives. At least it can be pulled out and expanded after the fact so that you can use the whole drive. Even if I were replacing the drive with a larger one, I'd expand this one as long as I already had my pc set up for it.


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## jmace57 (Nov 30, 2002)

scandia101 said:


> Apparently they don't know that they have to expand the image to fit the larger hard drives. At least it can be pulled out and expanded after the fact so that you can use the whole drive. Even if I were replacing the drive with a larger one, I'd expand this one as long as I already had my pc set up for it.


Exactly my plan amigo!

Jim


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## Prestond (Feb 4, 2008)

When I get mine I am going to open her up and check the hard drive size...if it is larger capacity drive with smaller image, what is the easiest way to increase the image size to make full use of the hard drive?


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## classicsat (Feb 18, 2004)

Use mfsadd on the MFStools disc.


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## sanderskm (Mar 3, 2009)

classicsat said:


> Use mfsadd on the MFStools disc.


How do you do that? I imagine you have remove the tivo hard drive and install it in a PC and run the aforementioned utility? Does the MFStools disc run in Windows XP or is it a boot disc? And where do you get the MFStools disc?


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## scandia101 (Oct 20, 2007)

http://mfstools.sourceforge.net/


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## Prestond (Feb 4, 2008)

Well I got the Philips S1 and for refurbished you cannot tell. Its like brand new not a scratch on it.

I connected the phone line, Brighthouse cable and video and power and booted it up, then tried to watch Live Tv. All the channels were locked with Parental Control password locked. I was never presented with a password entry window or anything like that during bootup so sat perplexed. I just then tried "12345" and pressed enter. That worked surprisingly.

I then allowed the Tivo to make the call as the time was off. It downloaded the Brighthouse channel lineup and after a restart of the Tivo box when download was complete the time straightened itself out with all the channels listed for my area with Brighthouse.

The performance is exactly the same as my other sub'd TivoHD but of course no Guide data and I will have to schedule any recording using Date, Time and Duration with manual settings. It does display the channel id (ex. SciFi, LMN TLC, etc) but no program information as the box is unsub'd.

If another one comes up for sale from Surplus Computers (they have one now on sale without hard drive) I will certainly think about getting another one.

Overall I am extremely happy with the functionality and overall performance of the unit.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

That's great, but IMHO, subscriptionless Tivo is more of a pain than other subscriptionless devices.. though for reliability's sake, that may be one reason to go with it.

e.g. my non-Tivo hard drive/DVD recorder has "VCR-like" programming, but I can enable and disable individual slots, give manual names to the programming slots, and a bunch of other things.. Everything on a Tivo will show up as "manual recording 10pm" IIRC. (The one repeating manual recording I have currently on my Tivo is for a section of World News Now in the middle of the night... and it gets the name from the guide data since that's there..)

Also, of course, the analog channels will _eventually_ go away, even for cable subscribers. I know you can redo guided setup, but I don't know if you can control a box subscriptionless.


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## classicsat (Feb 18, 2004)

Yes you can control a box without subscription. As said in other places, OTA isn't officially or fully there, but there are tricks to have at least primary (.1) channels.


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## Prestond (Feb 4, 2008)

For Brighthouse I cant see them totally turning off their analog cable anytime real soon as it would affect so many customers with analog tuners. That is one of their advertisements by the way to go to Brighthouse and still use your analog tv. Now at some point in the future I can see these old analog sets dying through attrition and eventually it will be not cost effective...but I think we are well off from that point for a $20 investment to not pay off. As I said I use this in the bedroom, so it is fine for casual tv viewing, in the family room on the hdtv I enjoy my TivoHD


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## Prestond (Feb 4, 2008)

Well the unit now is pixelating and it sounds like the hard drive is chugging about every 30 minutes. You can pull the plug and reboot.

Not sure if these units come with a warranty, will have to start troubleshooting, hopefully its just the hard drive.


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## sanderskm (Mar 3, 2009)

This reply is way, way late for this thread, but I do appreciate your responses. Just my belated update:

I did try running msadd from mfstools, and it didn't work. The 120GB Platinum drive seems locked at 9MB. I tried qunlock and diskutil (and one or two other things I can't remember now) to unlock it but none worked. This is my first venture into linux so it took a few tries for me to get it right.

Any other suggestions?


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## jmace57 (Nov 30, 2002)

Just FYI - they have reduced the price of the ones with no drive to $14.99 + shipping now.

http://www.surpluscomputers.com/348578/philips-tivo-hdr-series-diy.html


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## nuuby101 (Apr 30, 2009)

Hi,

My apologies - I have to cross post since I am not allowed to post URLS - this is my exact post from a related thread:

I have already searched this forum for the surplus computer offered box.

Just as the OP, I am also considering buying the surplus tivo without HDD. I realize it is most likely a Series 1 and what that means. However, I have the following questions which are too technical for me:

Will any HDD work (EIDIE, 250GB or 500GB)?
Will I have to purchase a separate software to format a brand new HDD with, before this thing even boots up ?
Is there anyone who has successfully set this particular unit (with no HDD in it) with a large HDD ?

For the record, surplus is charging $15 + $25 Shipping + say $40 for a new HDD = total of $80. If new software is also needed the cost would be about $100.

I am trying to determine is the jump from a list price of $15 to actual cost incurred of $80 or $100 is worth it or not.

Any suggestions will be appreciated.

TIA


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## timckelley (Oct 15, 2002)

The nice thing about these older TiVos with smaller drives is that you don't have to burn a CD with MFStools on it to do the expanding. You can use a 3.5" diskette instead.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

nuuby101 said:


> Just as the OP, I am also considering buying the surplus tivo without HDD. I realize it is most likely a Series 1 and what that means. However, I have the following questions which are too technical for me:
> 
> Will any HDD work (EIDIE, 250GB or 500GB)?
> Will I have to purchase a separate software to format a brand new HDD with, before this thing even boots up ?
> ...


Read the Tivo hacking FAQs. IDE hard drive.. You will need to update the kernel to go above ~137 gigs (IIRC). If you want to use it as 'only' 137 gigs, you can do the standard upgrade.

But yes, legally you would need to purchase the OS. I forget, I believe there's one company besides Tivo authorized to sell the Tivo OS images.

For me, it was showing $11.something shipping.


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## hiker (Nov 29, 2001)

UPDATE
Philips Tivo HDR Series DIY Kit (No Hard Drive) $9.99 + shipping


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## timckelley (Oct 15, 2002)

Sweet deal. You don't have to subscribe those to make them work.


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## Grandpapi (Jun 3, 2009)

Hello, i too have done some business with surplus computers with good results. i'm interested in the tivo they're offering now they say it's part# CES11994. What is this? Is it suitable to use as a standalone recorder, replacing a vcr? Thanks for the help.

Dan


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## classicsat (Feb 18, 2004)

That is the Philips Series 1 this thread is about.

It can be used as a recorder to manually record like a VCR, or subbed to get guide data and recording features.


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## Grandpapi (Jun 3, 2009)

Thanks, gonna give it a go. Look for my posts, i'm sure i'll need some guidance.

Dan


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## budies3 (Aug 24, 2008)

Im going to buy one If its ok to ask, I would like to put a 250GB drive in it. So I guess 3 questions come to mind, and would anyone care to point me to the right area to read on it please Can I put that big of drive in it? What software do I need to make the drive work? What do I have to do, to make the unit take that size of drive? Thanks for any info


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## camivo (Jun 10, 2009)

The guides all reference creating a backup form the original Tivo drive, so if the refurb Tivo does not come with a drive, where do you get the backup to configure the new drive?


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## camivo (Jun 10, 2009)

Moreover, I know that the InstantCake is available to purchase, but I was wondering if it is possible to obtain a generic "tivo.bak" file complete the process outlined in the DIY tutorials using Mfs tools.


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## timckelley (Oct 15, 2002)

Once when I upgraded the hard drive on my S1 TiVo, there was a person here on these boards who was sending TiVo images for free (I think by email). He nicely gave me the image I needed, so I didn't have to make my own backup.


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## jmace57 (Nov 30, 2002)

timckelley said:


> Once when I upgraded the hard drive on my S1 TiVo, there was a person here on these boards who was sending TiVo images for free (I think by email). He nicely gave me the image I needed, so I didn't have to make my own backup.


I just wanted to say I am dieting and your avatar makes me hungry...
Jim


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## timckelley (Oct 15, 2002)

Actually my avatar changes every few weeks, but as my sig explains, it's only there like that because of a Fun House game I'm playing. (The avatars we pick there are supposed to match the themes of the games we're playing.)


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## budies3 (Aug 24, 2008)

budies3 said:


> Im going to buy one If its ok to ask, I would like to put a 250GB drive in it. So I guess 3 questions come to mind, and would anyone care to point me to the right area to read on it please Can I put that big of drive in it? What software do I need to make the drive work? What do I have to do, to make the unit take that size of drive? Thanks for any info


I guess Im not suppose to ask this, or has it been asked to many times already? Thank you.


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## timckelley (Oct 15, 2002)

When installing hard drives into TiVo, I've found This website to have helpful step-by-step instructions for doing it.


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## budies3 (Aug 24, 2008)

timckelley said:


> When installing hard drives into TiVo, I've found weaknees.com/upgrade-instructions.php This website to have helpful step-by-step instructions for doing it.


Thank you


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## timckelley (Oct 15, 2002)

budies3 said:


> Thank you


Oh, I just clicked on the link, and it looks like instructions for installing already configured hard drives. I think you also need instructions for copying your image onto the hard drive. I could have sworn the weaknees website had that too... maybe it's elsewhere on that website.

I do know the Upgrade Forum of this tivo community website has lots of threads devoted to this topic as well.


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## budies3 (Aug 24, 2008)

timckelley said:


> Oh, I just clicked on the link, and it looks like instructions for installing already configured hard drives. I think you also need instructions for copying your image onto the hard drive. I could have sworn the weaknees website had that too... maybe it's elsewhere on that website.
> 
> I do know the tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=&f=25 Upgrade Forum of this tivo community website has lots of threads devoted to this topic as well.


Thanks for pointing that out I have much to learn!


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## vidarr (Jul 12, 2009)

I got this a while back, bought the hard drive kit pre-imaged and got it to dial into TIVO.

Question is, how can I run this without the service? It really tries to beat you into submission...

I don't mind the "VCR-like" behavior. Truly. It's being used to replace my VCR for recording weekly shows I cannot watch when the air...holding them long enough to watch, no more.

If I wanted the full monty, I'd purchase a newer gen or go with the DVR offered by my satellite provider.

Any help is appreciated.


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## timckelley (Oct 15, 2002)

I assume you have an S1 that doesn't require subscriptions. You still should go through guided setup to let it know your channel lineup, and then always leave your phone line plugged in, so that that the clock will stay synched. (You don't have to, but I found it to be helpful to prevent clock drift.) All this should be available to do, even without a subscription.

Once all that's done, you should be able to set up manual recordings, including "manual repeating recordings", and unlike a VCR, you even get access to the keep at most settings as well, so this really is a bit better than a plain VCR. Plus the To Do List will still work as well, even without a subscription.

Having said all this, if I remember clearly (it's been a long time since I owned a series 1 TiVo), after a certain amount of time passes (can't remember if it's minutes or hours) with no remote control activity by you, whenever you want to access the TiVo menus, it will remind you that you're not subscribed. (In other words, the "nag screen" trying to persuade you to subscribe.) You can just ignore that. I think you just hit select, and it gets you by that screen.

It's just one click of a button to dismiss that nag screen, so I never saw that as a big deal.


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## vidarr (Jul 12, 2009)

Thanks. That's good to know. The xerox copy of the manual just said, "TIVO does not support blah blah blah." But, it didn't expound on HOW to not use them. 

I'll check into the cost...it might be worth it. I have noticed that it's a tad glitchy to change channels on my DISH 301 series...but as I found on these forums, that's a known issue.

Thanks again for the info.


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