# Cheap MOCA solution: my experience MI424WR rev E



## jbarm

Just wanted to share my experience in using a Verizon Actiontec MI424WR rev E router to network my Tivo Mini's.

I know this has been discussed on various threads, but thought I could clarify things that I have learned in my research.

1. Bought a MI424WR rev E from ebay for less than $25 shipped. If you buy a MOCA adapter from Tivo it will cost over $60 shipped -- and TIVO is the cheapest place to buy a MOCA adapter for some reason.
2. The MI424WR rev E is a Verizon wireless router with multiple lan ports, wireless G and MOCA networking capabilities. Despite what I have read in various places, the specs describe this rev as having only MOCA 1.0, not 1.1. This version is cheaper than later versions I have seen on eBay, however.
3. The router is apparently not that great on the wireless side, so I disabled it and use it as a simple MOCA bridge. 
4. I have a Roamio basic connected in my AV stack to the internet via a Powerline Networking adapter which is connected to a simple switch which then connects to my Tivo, WDTV and other items. The Powerline adapter works just fine in streaming Netflix and so I don't want to change it out.
5. I followed the directions on setting the MI424WR as a bridge from the AVS forum thread here: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/36-ho...tiontec-mi424wr-cheap-moca-bridge-all-41.html.
6. Once I followed the directions to set up the MI424WR, I plugged the MI424WR into a coax cable from a splitter near my Tivo, plugged a cable into one of the Ethernet ports and plugged the other end into the nearby switch and powered it up.
7. Attached coax cable to my Tivo Mini. Told it to use MOCA and it just worked. Fast response, easy to use.

Hope this helps someone.

jb


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## aaronwt

I have five of the old Actiontecs FiOS has given me from early revisions to a more recent one in 2012 gathering dust in my closet. It's good that they work well. I had decided not to use any of these for my MoCA devices and instead ordered an Actiontec MoCA Bridge from Amazon with GigE ports for $80.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CZ6WC3A/ref=wms_ohs_product?ie=UTF8&psc=1
I was never a fan of the FiOS Actiontec routers and their capabilities so I never liked messing with them and their more restrictive software.


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## soobaerodude

I just picked up an Actiontec MI424WR rev F, followed the avsforum instructions linked in the OP and successfully used it as a MoCa bridge that my Mini can connect to.

Tomorrow, I will receive the rev I version of the Actiontec router, so that I can have gigabit ports


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## NotNowChief

Over the ports of the router you'll have gigabit, between the devices connected directly to it I believe.

Is has been my understanding that outisde of the router you will be limited to the 240 up/down MoCA speed? 

I have FiOS and have the VZ supplied Rev I. as my host, and then I have a seconf Rev. I and a Rev. F that I procured that I use as MoCA clients for devices in other parts of the house. I was always under the impression that my throughput from router to router was limited to 240 and not 1000...?


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## soobaerodude

True, throughput between MoCa bridges will be limited to 240 Mbps. However, the actual throughput between two rev I routers will be higher than routers with 10/100 ports because of gigE on both ends. I have seen users report 135 Mbps between two rev I routers. I will receive another rev I next week, and hope to approach this amount of throughput.

Anything less than rev I will be bottlenecked by the 10/100 Mpbs ports. Right now I am getting 91 Mbps between a rev F and a rev I.



NotNowChief said:


> Over the ports of the router you'll have gigabit, between the devices connected directly to it I believe.
> 
> Is has been my understanding that outisde of the router you will be limited to the 240 up/down MoCA speed?
> 
> I have FiOS and have the VZ supplied Rev I. as my host, and then I have a seconf Rev. I and a Rev. F that I procured that I use as MoCA clients for devices in other parts of the house. I was always under the impression that my throughput from router to router was limited to 240 and not 1000...?


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## jbarm

Question: How much of a real world benefit does anyone get out of a gigabit connection anyhow, relative to a 90 or even a 50 mbs connection? Is it even real, given other constraints on a network and servers?

I suppose if you are transferring ISO's around the house or something?

Help me out here.


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## webcrawlr

Realistically very little. Transfer times will be shorter but the extra bandwidth is very rarely needed for anything other than switch trunk ports and server/nas.


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## aaronwt

jbarm said:


> Question: How much of a real world benefit does anyone get out of a gigabit connection anyhow, relative to a 90 or even a 50 mbs connection? Is it even real, given other constraints on a network and servers?
> 
> I suppose if you are transferring ISO's around the house or something?
> 
> Help me out here.


For the Minis it won't make any difference, but with the GigE connection from my Roamio Pro, it means I get up to 180Mb/s transfer rates to my PC running KMTTG/TiVo Desktop. While the transfer rates would be under 100Mb/s otherwise.

For PCs and unRAID servers though, I can get speeds many times faster than that. I only wish I could go faster than gigabit. Since that is the bottle neck between my main PCs now since I'm using SSDs in all of them. So internally I can get 4Gb/s speeds between drives but I can't go over 950Mb/s outside of the PC because the GigE ports are too slow.


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## senorgregster

I went with a similar approach as the OP but I have both routers set up with wifi on. They both use the same name and password which has enabled me to make the whole house wireless. Not run into any problems. My devices seem to switch between the routers seamlessly which really surprised me. I forget the thread that alerted me to this potential option. I'll try to dig it up if anyone is interested.

edit: not the post that alerted me to this option but a pretty darn good description of it. 
http://www.hanselman.com/blog/Confi...thOneSSIDNetworkNameAtHomeForFreeRoaming.aspx


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## soobaerodude

jbarm said:


> Question: How much of a real world benefit does anyone get out of a gigabit connection anyhow, relative to a 90 or even a 50 mbs connection? Is it even real, given other constraints on a network and servers?
> 
> I suppose if you are transferring ISO's around the house or something?
> 
> Help me out here.


It also gives more bandwidth for devices to use at the same time. The Rev. I next to my tv gives network access to my Roamio and a WDTV streaming device. I can stream a 1080p movie to the WDTV from my NAS without worry of starving bandwidth from my Mini in the other room

I also received a second rev I. and am able to get 145 Mbps transfers between them.


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## jbarm

How much bandwidth does HD streaming really require though? I thought a 10 meg connection was more than enough for a HD stream. So unless you are streaming 10 or more HD streams at once, would gigabit really make a difference?

I know a Slingbox HD stream only requires 2 to 3 megs as a reference point.

I realize that the higher speeds will probably be needed with 4k streaming and who know what else will come, but still don't see where a typical higher end AV setup utilizes gigabit much.

Of course it is always nice to have a car that can go 150 mph, even if you never go that fast, just in case you want/need to in the future.


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## aaronwt

For the cable channels the bandwidth required will depend on the cable provider. Here on FiOS the bitrates for the HD channels can range between 10.6 Mb/s and 18.5Mb/s.(According to KMTTG with my current recordings) and of course whether it's using MPEG2 or H.264 could also be a factor in the bitrate too. But the top two fastest bitrate channels I have in my recordings are over 18Mb/s. One uses MPEG2 and the other uses H.264.


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## Series3Sub

jbarm said:


> Question: How much of a real world benefit does anyone get out of a gigabit connection anyhow, relative to a 90 or even a 50 mbs connection? Is it even real, given other constraints on a network and servers?
> 
> I suppose if you are transferring ISO's around the house or something?
> 
> Help me out here.


It is much more about the LAN and the transfer of files as you have stated or large amounts of data. In my case I am ripping my CD collection and after a while I'll have several ripped and the want to transfer them to primary and backup locations. The transfer to one location using v I a LAN to a USB 2.0 HDD Can take about, for example, 18 minutes. Then transferring the same data via LAN that is Gigabit to Gigabit takes a little less than 3 minutes. Now, I'm no being precise with those numbers, I saying that at several sessions, the USB2.0 transfer can take over 15 minutes, while the same data transfer using all gigabits takes often less than 4 minutes. That's the gigabit difference, and yes I do move about some VOB now and then, and Giga makes all the difference in the world.


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## Random User 7

jbarm said:


> Just wanted to share my experience in using a Verizon Actiontec MI424WR rev E router to network my Tivo Mini's.
> 
> I know this has been discussed on various threads, but thought I could clarify things that I have learned in my research.
> 
> 1. Bought a MI424WR rev E from ebay for less than $25 shipped. If you buy a MOCA adapter from Tivo it will cost over $60 shipped -- and TIVO is the cheapest place to buy a MOCA adapter for some reason.
> 2. The MI424WR rev E is a Verizon wireless router with multiple lan ports, wireless G and MOCA networking capabilities. Despite what I have read in various places, the specs describe this rev as having only MOCA 1.0, not 1.1. This version is cheaper than later versions I have seen on eBay, however.
> 3. The router is apparently not that great on the wireless side, so I disabled it and use it as a simple MOCA bridge.
> 4. I have a Roamio basic connected in my AV stack to the internet via a Powerline Networking adapter which is connected to a simple switch which then connects to my Tivo, WDTV and other items. The Powerline adapter works just fine in streaming Netflix and so I don't want to change it out.
> 5. I followed the directions on setting the MI424WR as a bridge from the AVS forum thread here: http://www.avsforum.com/forum/36-ho...tiontec-mi424wr-cheap-moca-bridge-all-41.html.
> 6. Once I followed the directions to set up the MI424WR, I plugged the MI424WR into a coax cable from a splitter near my Tivo, plugged a cable into one of the Ethernet ports and plugged the other end into the nearby switch and powered it up.
> 7. Attached coax cable to my Tivo Mini. Told it to use MOCA and it just worked. Fast response, easy to use.
> 
> Hope this helps someone.
> 
> jb


I read this a few weeks ago and ordered two MI4242WR Rev Fs for about $20 each. Worked great, thanks!


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## slowbiscuit

Yep, these are great as cheap MoCA adapters, I've been using one with a Mini and an Xbox with the Roamio Plus as the bridge and have had absolutely no issues. And the MI424 is on an old RG59 run to boot (!). Cost me $10 shipped from fleabay, had to supply my own PS though.


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## krkaufman

I just bought a Rev.I off eBay, for under $30 shipped, to have a test device and, wow, they're huge (relative to what I expected). I was thinking the size would be similar to my ECB3500T combo MoCA adapter/4-port switch, but suppose I hadn't accounted for the wireless tech.


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## mae

krkaufman said:


> I just bought a Rev.I off eBay, for under $30 shipped, to have a test device and, wow, they're huge (relative to what I expected). I was thinking the size would be similar to my ECB3500T combo MoCA adapter/4-port switch, but suppose I hadn't accounted for the wireless tech.
> 
> View attachment 27361


Just FYI, that is a Frontier Rev I, and most of the experience/instructions on DSL Reports are based on Verizon routers. It should work, but there have been reports of some differences in the firmware. Both companies push the updates, so as far as I know, you can't flash a Frontier router with VZ firmware as easily as you should be able to. Just in case you haven't seen it, and for anyone else considering it, here are pretty comprehensive instructions for setting up a Rev I as a bridge, How-to: Make Actiontec MI424WR Revision I (Rev.I) a Network - Verizon FiOS | DSLReports Forums . I have one of these and a Rev F that I use. I also use them as access points.


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## mae

For anyone considering this from these posts, here is a link to the specs for the various revisions, https://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/2065743~8951f1dcab65bbc80a582e4c7a3d9279/atspecs.jpg

Only the Rev F and above should be purchased since earlier models are MoCA 1.0 and won't play nice with the built in MoCA in TiVos, something I discovered when I installed my Romio Plus on a network with a 1.0 NIM 100. 

While Frontier and Fairpoint branded routers should work, as I pointed out above, their firmware may cause problems.


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## krkaufman

mae said:


> https://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/2065743~8951f1dcab65bbc80a582e4c7a3d9279/atspecs.jpg
> ...
> While Frontier and Fairpoint branded routers should work, as I pointed out above, their firmware may cause problems.


*Thanks for the feedback* on the Frontier aspect; I wondered if I wasn't risking something going w/ a Frontier model vs Verizon.

Also, that atspecs.jpg image link isn't working, at least for me. (I'm guessing one needs to be logged-in to DSLReports to see the image. edit: Yep, logged in and image was viewable. Thanks.)


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## Random User 7

Been working for me for about 2 years. I did have to reset and reconfigure once and the occasional reboot but I've been happy with it.


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## krkaufman

I had to do some unexpected configuration of Network Connections, but I was able to get the wireless access point working w/ my Frontier Rev.I; however, I'm wondering if the 130 Mbps link rate and 85 Mbps up/down wireless throughput is the best I can expect from the MI424-WR Rev.I wireless. Thoughts?

(dual-antenna Wireless-N laptop)


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## fcfc2

Hi,
Those types of wireless speeds are not unusual in my experience. The specs for the Rev I, just like almost every router I have ever seen give you the max. theoretical speeds, marketing BS in other words. I forget the details, but one issue being that these are 2.4GHz only is that like all "good neighbor" routers, any bit of wireless congestion/interference and it will drop down to 20MGz width even if you had tried to force it to 40MGz. Even in clean conditions, with ideal circumstances, you might show a link connection of 130Mbps, but your actual throughput due to normal wireless overhead, you could easily loose 15-20%. 
Make sure you are using AES encryption also, but in my experience, you are already maxed out in terms of real world speeds.


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## krkaufman

fcfc2 said:


> any bit of wireless congestion/interference and it will drop down to 20MGz width even if you had tried to force it to 40MGz.


I've made sure to use WPA2/AES and have set it to do N-only, but you mention my roadblock and what I was hoping to learn: *is* there a setting allowing 40 MHz? I looked and couldn't find that most elusive setting.


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## krkaufman

My current firmware version (40.20.4.2) is old. Time to roll the dice on a firmware upgrade. (edit: then again...)

Meh, given my MI424-WR Rev.I is physically branded as a Frontier device, I'm going to assume I'm on the latest firmware... and that the device's max N link speed is just 130 Mbps, per the "802.11 Mode" configuration page...






​
... contrary to the "300 Mbps" comments I've seen (link).

edit: p.s. This post over on the Verizon forums confirms the 130 Mbps max link speed. Maybe Actiontec's "GigE" version w/ 300 Mbps support never made it to Verizon/Frontier, as a Rev.J+ ... seemingly corroborated by this other product page on Actiontec for the "MI424WR (GigE for Verizon FiOS)", with the wireless speed still limited to 130 Mbps.


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## mdavej

What firmware version exactly? I've seen some later ones that can no longer be downloaded anywhere.


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## fcfc2

krkaufman said:


> My current firmware version (40.20.4.2) is old. Time to roll the dice on a firmware upgrade. (edit: then again...)
> 
> Meh, given my MI424-WR Rev.I is physically branded as a Frontier device, I'm going to assume I'm on the latest firmware... and that the device's max N link speed is just 130 Mbps, per the "802.11 Mode" configuration page...
> 
> View attachment 27914​
> ... contrary to the "300 Mbps" comments I've seen (link).
> 
> edit: p.s. This post over on the Verizon forums confirms the 130 Mbps max link speed. Maybe Actiontec's "GigE" version w/ 300 Mbps support never made it to Verizon/Frontier, as a Rev.J+ ... seemingly corroborated by this other product page on Actiontec for the "MI424WR (GigE for Verizon FiOS)", with the wireless speed still limited to 130 Mbps.


The more I learn about wireless and it's if's, and's, and but's, the more I realize why I like alternatives like Ethernet or MoCA which also have their versions of marketing "expansion". The advertisements and marketing blurbs always list the top COMBINED totals for their various routers. A router which touts AC 1750 or whatever will never ever connect to any device at 1750Mbps or even the 1300Mbps theoretical possible on it's 5GHz band.


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## krkaufman

mdavej said:


> What firmware version exactly? I've seen some later ones that can no longer be downloaded anywhere.


I'm on 40.20.4.2.



fcfc2 said:


> The more I learn about wireless and it's if's, and's, and but's, the more I realize why I like alternatives like Ethernet or MoCA which also have their versions of marketing "expansion". The advertisements and marketing blurbs always list the top COMBINED totals for their various routers. A router which touts AC 1750 or whatever will never ever connect to any device at 1750Mbps or even the 1300Mbps theoretical possible on it's 5GHz band.


Yeah, even MoCA gets that treatment, with PHY rates often used interchangeably as effective throughput rates.


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## mdavej

krkaufman said:


> I'm on 40.20.4.2.


Thanks. Mine's a bit newer than that.

Here's the latest I've managed to find if you wan to give it a shot. Unfortunately, it sets you back to defaults after your update.

https://upgrade.actiontec.com/MI424WR-GEN3I/MI424WR-GEN3I.rmt


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## krkaufman

mdavej said:


> Thanks. Mine's a bit newer than that. ... Here's the latest I've managed to find if you want to give it a shot.


I think I may have found that file, as well, along with another, but I'll need to get back to the desk to confirm.

Can you report the f/w version number associated with that file?


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## mdavej

40.21.10.2

Some folks have 40.21.18, but I can't find it anywhere. Seems to have had some issues anyway, so probably best to avoid.


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## krkaufman

mdavej said:


> 40.21.10.2
> 
> Some folks have 40.21.18, but I can't find it anywhere. Seems to have had some issues anyway, so probably best to avoid.


The 'rmt' file you linked is identical to the first one I downloaded. (checked via binary compare) Is this considered, then, the "latest" known-good firmware for the Verizon-branded MI424WR?

I also found this one: MI424WR-GEN3I-40.22.3.3.rmt ... though opinions seem to indicate it *primarily changes branding from Verizon to Frontier.*

See:
[Internet] New Actiontec MI424WR rev I firmware - Frontier Communications | DSLReports Forums
How to update router firmware - Frontier Communications | DSLReports Forums
&
http://bitcast-a.bitgravity.com/2wi.../000FB3/40.22.3.3/MI424WR-GEN3I-40.22.3.3.rmt​


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## krkaufman

mae said:


> For anyone considering this from these posts, here is a link to the specs for the various revisions, https://www.dslreports.com/r0/download/2065743~8951f1dcab65bbc80a582e4c7a3d9279/atspecs.jpg


I probably could have saved myself some time by reviewing mae's linked specs table, from DSLReports, since it clearly states a maximum wireless spec of "130n." Done.


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