# Tivo MRV transfer/streaming over a VPN bridge? Possibilities?



## CrashHD (Nov 10, 2006)

If one had sufficient internet upstream bandwidth, would it be possible to link two home networks via a VPN bridge? In theory, a VPN bridge should cause the ethernet segments on either side of the bridge to behave as they are on one subnet, which should, in theory, allow tivos on both sides of the bridge to behave as though they were on the same subnet, in the same physical network segment.

As we all know, theory put in to practice is where things usually get interesting.

I use DDWRT on my home routers, and have found it to be very configurable. Most likely my first attempt to do so will use this, but I am open to other custom router firmwares if necessary.

There is a possibility, for complicated reasons, I may be pursuing a job which has me at a second home several hours away from my first home, during the week. I have OTA Tivo at the first home (recently cut cord w/satellite) and have found OTA and streaming services to deliver 90% of the shows we used to watch. My second home will likely be a cheap apartment where I may very well not be able to put up an antenna, so I am considering basic cable, and as long as I'm doing that, interested in bridging the two home networks to gain back access to a few cable shows my wife missed out on.

This is purely a hypothetical exercise at this point. I'm just having a little fun putting the thought into it. It looks to me like a workable idea, but rather than reinvent the wheel, I thought I'd put a should out here first and see if anyone else has done this before.


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## Tico (Dec 10, 2002)

Old Thread:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=456028&highlight=vpn


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## Tico (Dec 10, 2002)

More recent:

http://tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=510571


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

CrashHD said:


> If one had sufficient internet upstream bandwidth, would it be possible to link two home networks via a VPN bridge? In theory, a VPN bridge should cause the ethernet segments on either side of the bridge to behave as they are on one subnet, which should, in theory, allow tivos on both sides of the bridge to behave as though they were on the same subnet, in the same physical network segment. As we all know, theory put in to practice is where things usually get interesting. I use DDWRT on my home routers, and have found it to be very configurable. Most likely my first attempt to do so will use this, but I am open to other custom router firmwares if necessary. There is a possibility, for complicated reasons, I may be pursuing a job which has me at a second home several hours away from my first home, during the week. I have OTA Tivo at the first home (recently cut cord w/satellite) and have found OTA and streaming services to deliver 90% of the shows we used to watch. My second home will likely be a cheap apartment where I may very well not be able to put up an antenna, so I am considering basic cable, and as long as I'm doing that, interested in bridging the two home networks to gain back access to a few cable shows my wife missed out on. This is purely a hypothetical exercise at this point. I'm just having a little fun putting the thought into it. It looks to me like a workable idea, but rather than reinvent the wheel, I thought I'd put a should out here first and see if anyone else has done this before.


I have an Asus to Asus router OpenVPN setup between PA and here in HI and they do indeed act as if they're all on the same local network. I can see the Roamio plus and all it's recordings in PA within My Shows and under My Devices on the Roamio plus here in HI. It easily transfers shows between the two, limited to the speed of the upload in PA of course, which seems to be about 12Mbps. This isn't fast enough to stream between the two though, as I get a network error message when I try that. I've been wanting to switch from Comcast to fios in PA to get faster upload speeds, but haven't been able to yet.


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## telemark (Nov 12, 2013)

HarperVision said:


> It easily transfers shows between the two, limited to the speed of the upload in PA of course, which seems to be about 12Mbps. This isn't fast enough to stream between the two though, as I get a network error message when I try that.


What happens when you try to stream in SD?


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

HarperVision said:


> I have an Asus to Asus router OpenVPN setup between PA and here in HI and they do indeed act as if they're all on the same local network.


Can you tell me more about your setup? I would like to do the same. I have two ASUS RT-N66Us. I saw mentioned that these routers do take advantage of OpenVPN. I'm assuming that makes the setup a lot easier. I would also assume I still need to purchase VPN service independently.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

telemark said:


> What happens when you try to stream in SD?


I thought of that awhile ago and tried it but that didn't work either. Not sure why and I didn't investigate any further. I'll play with it again tonight after work if I get a chance.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

waynomo said:


> Can you tell me more about your setup? I would like to do the same. I have two ASUS RT-N66Us. I saw mentioned that these routers do take advantage of OpenVPN. I'm assuming that makes the setup a lot easier. I would also assume I still need to purchase VPN service independently.


It should be easy for you then. I use two AC66U's for mine. What I would do is flash them with the Merlin FW (do a google search) and then set the host location's router as the OpenVPN server and the other one as the client. The setup is pretty easy and self explanatory on the Merlin website. No need to purchase VPN service because YOU will be the VPN host on your OpenVPN server router.


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## kdmorse (Jan 29, 2001)

I've had no problems streaming (Minis, MRV, or MRS) HD from a 50x50 Fios line, to a 150x10 comcast line. No problems between two 50x50 Fios locations. 

But streaming from the 150x10 comcast location to either fios location is spotty. MRV always works. MRS works for SD, and lower bitrate HD. High bitrate HD is a crapshoot - sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. The mini's however - were never happy in that direction, they couldn't run for 5 minutes without losing connection to something.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

kdmorse said:


> I've had no problems streaming (Minis, MRV, or MRS) HD from a 50x50 Fios line, to a 150x10 comcast line. No problems between two 50x50 Fios locations. But streaming from the 150x10 comcast location to either fios location is spotty. MRV always works. MRS works for SD, and lower bitrate HD. High bitrate HD is a crapshoot - sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. The mini's however - were never happy in that direction, they couldn't run for 5 minutes without losing connection to something.


That's so cool. It'd be awesome if you can help me tweak my vpn to at least be able to stream SD. What're you using for VPN server and clients? I would LOVE to get a mini working on his side through the VPN to the plus on the other side in PA!!!

I'll have to really push to get my parents to change to FiOS!


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## kdmorse (Jan 29, 2001)

HarperVision said:


> That's so cool. It'd be awesome if you can help me tweak my vpn to at least be able to stream SD. What're you using for VPN server and clients? I would LOVE to get a mini working on his side through the VPN to the plus on the other side in PA!!!
> 
> I'll have to really push to get my parents to change to FiOS!


Once of the reasons I don't often go into the details, is that my setup isn't really very useful as a roadmap for anyone else. It's an odd perversion that does just exactly what I need, does it well, and nothing more. And I keep hoping someone will come along with a better, simpler, general purpose solution.

Each location's router to the internet is a full fledged linux router, running RHEL 5.5, 6.2, or 7.1. On each router is OpenVPN, running a bridging VPN between the three locations in a triangle. (STP is permitted to eliminate loops).

IP Addresses are each location were selected so they can be consolidated (due to other constraints, they're not 192.168's). But as a simple example, assume one location is 192.168.1.*, one is 192.168.2.*, another 192.168.3.* - should work the same. Each location runs with a prefix of /24. All systems at each location use their own local default route. (.1 on each subnet).

DHCP runs at each location, but is prohibited from crossing the bridge. In fact, only Tivo MAC addresses are allowed to cross the bridge. DHCP gives normal addresses to non-tivo equipment, but lies to the Tivos, telling them their netmask is 255.255.0.0. (But they all keep their own local default route). Other netmasks can be used of course, it just needs to be wide enough to encompass all the smaller networks at once.

Thus, the tivos believe they are all on one big network. The computers et al know they're on three small networks. The computers can talk to the local tivos. But because of the way the netmask is forged, the computers cannot talk to tivos on remote networks. (I have a workaround for this at the IP level, but it only fixes icmp and http. It doesn't for example let Tivo Desktop work remotely).

I have never attempted to set up a Mini against a remote tivo. The Mini is always configured on the same network as its parent, and once it's happy, can be moved to a remote network. I have not attempted to fool the Tivo Watch-on-your-pc software, nor my cell phone. I built this before any of that existed, purely for MRS/MRV.

None of this is sane. None of it is expected to be particularly helpful to anyone. It violates several aspects of Networking 101. It just works for me.


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## jcthorne (Jan 28, 2002)

I use my plex server to stream content from my tivos to remote locations. No VPN required.

Sling box works too.


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

HarperVision said:


> It should be easy for you then. I use two AC66U's for mine. What I would do is flash them with the Merlin FW (do a google search) and then set the host location's router as the OpenVPN server and the other one as the client. The setup is pretty easy and self explanatory on the Merlin website. No need to purchase VPN service because YOU will be the VPN host on your OpenVPN server router.


*What's your secret?* I have installed Merlin installed on 2 ASUS RT-N66Us, but I'm not having any luck getting OpenVPN to work. I set up the server. I exported the client.opvn file and imported it to the OpenVPN client. I activated it. Both the server and client say the are running.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

waynomo said:


> What's your secret? I have installed Merlin installed on 2 ASUS RT-N66Us, but I'm not having any luck getting OpenVPN to work. I set up the server. I exported the client.opvn file and imported it to the OpenVPN client. I activated it. Both the server and client say the are running.


If it says they're running, are you sure it's not working? It's been awhile since I set mine up so don't recall every step in the process. Did you follow all the instructions on Merlin's site?

What is it you're seeing.....or not seeing? Did you check the box saying something like "route internet through this connection" in the menu?


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

HarperVision said:


> If it says they're running, are you sure it's not working? It's been awhile since I set mine up so don't recall every step in the process. Did you follow all the instructions on Merlin's site?
> 
> What is it you're seeing.....or not seeing? Did you check the box saying something like "route internet through this connection" in the menu?


Well, let's just saying it's not working properly. The statistics show that packets are being sent and received, but I can't reach anything at location 1 that is in location 2 and vice versa.

Which instructions on the Merlin site are you referring to? If you could show me the page it would be appreciated.

Hmm, I don't remember that check box. I will see if I can find it. I assume that would mean on both the server and client routers.

I've seen some instructions on the site like this, but I didn't get the impression that any of this was necessary.

https://github.com/RMerl/asuswrt-me...ver-VPN-and-Drop-connections-if-VPN-goes-down


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

waynomo said:


> Well, let's just saying it's not working properly. The statistics show that packets are being sent and received, but I can't reach anything at location 1 that is in location 2 and vice versa. Which instructions on the Merlin site are you referring to? If you could show me the page it would be appreciated. Hmm, I don't remember that check box. I will see if I can find it. I assume that would mean on both the server and client routers. I've seen some instructions on the site like this, but I didn't get the impression that any of this was necessary. https://github.com/RMerl/asuswrt-merlin/wiki/How-to-Direct-Traffic-over-VPN-and-Drop-connections-if-VPN-goes-down


No, only check it on the server side not the client. Also remember that any time you change anything on the server you must generate a new client file.

I'll check into it more when I have time to research for you.


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## TlVOUser (Dec 7, 2016)

kdmorse said:


> Once of the reasons I don't often go into the details, is that my setup isn't really very useful as a roadmap for anyone else. It's an odd perversion that does just exactly what I need, does it well, and nothing more. And I keep hoping someone will come along with a better, simpler, general purpose solution.
> 
> Each location's router to the internet is a full fledged linux router, running RHEL 5.5, 6.2, or 7.1. On each router is OpenVPN, running a bridging VPN between the three locations in a triangle. (STP is permitted to eliminate loops).
> 
> ...


Would you be willing to share how you were able to get the Tivo to get the forged netmask?

I'm trying to connect a Tivo mini via a VPN connection to a Tivo, but the two networks are on different subnets and haven't been able to figure out a way to get the Mini to be able to have the Tivo Broadcast packet travel to the appropriate subnet.

Any help is greatly appreciated.


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## kdmorse (Jan 29, 2001)

TlVOUser said:


> Would you be willing to share how you were able to get the Tivo to get the forged netmask?


Note: I am in no way saying this is a sane solution, I just happened to have the pieces and parts already in place to do it trivially.

In the main DHCP server for the network, I blacklisted the mac addresses of the tivos, so they didn't get addresses from the normal pool. On a linux server, I set up reservations for each tivo, that included the wrong netmask. (Linux dhcpd will let you override the netmask on a host by host basis, I was unable to find anything in windows dhcp server that would allow me to set the netmask at anything other than the scope level).

And you could of course accomplish the same thing by going static for the tivos.


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## TlVOUser (Dec 7, 2016)

Do you think (In theory) that would work if I programmed the Tivo units itself with the wrong netmask instead of going through blacklisting? 

Thanks so much for your quick response!


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