# Need Advice - New House - Time to Upgrade my Tivo's



## CA2DC (Dec 5, 2010)

I'm a long time Tivo user (since '99) but not too technically savvy. 

Moving from smaller house with a 2 TV - 2 Premier box set-up, to a newer/bigger house where I hope to have 5-6 TV's all with Tivo. Figure it's about time to upgrade my Tivo set-up, but I'm not exactly sure what my optional set-up might be. No lifetime subscriptions to transfer (should have bought them back in the day, but wasn't sure in the early years if Tivo would survive - bad biz decision on my part). 

Cost of my new system/set-up isn't as much a factor as having a seemless Tivo experience, though I'd prefer minimizing Tivo monthly subscription fees by paying more now for lifetime (if avail).

I know I want:
1 Tivo with lots of storage (prob family room)
1 Tivo with minimal/average storage (guest/mother-in-law's room, so she has her own recordings)
3-4 more TVs with Tivo access (man cave, 2-3 bedrooms)

We have Verizon Fios but don't have Ethernet in all the rooms. There is coax in all the TV rooms. Our wifi signal is strong across the whole house. 

My initial thought is 2 Bolts and 3-4 Minis, but I'm open to alternatives. 

Questions:
- Is my initial set-up above optimal? Or is there something better?
- Do I need to use MoCA, or can the Minis all connect to the primary box using wifi?
- If I need to go the MoCA route, do I need to buy a Tivo bridge & filter?
- Amazon reviews imply some problems with the 3TB Bolt...would it be less (possible) headache to go with 1TB Bolt + a big eSata hard drive?
- How challenging will my installation be?
- Is there an "easier" way to transfer my 60-70+ recording preferences & hierarchy without having to manually enter them all again?

Any and all advice/answers would be appreciated. 
Thank You!!


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## chicagobrownblue (May 29, 2008)

CA2DC said:


> I know I want:
> 1 Tivo with lots of storage (prob family room)


Easy to add 3TB to a Roamio or Bolt. Beyond that you have to run a program. The Bolt uses 2.5" drives while the Roamio uses 3.5". I think there are much larger capacity 3.5" drives than 2.5".



CA2DC said:


> We have Verizon Fios but don't have Ethernet in all the rooms. There is coax in all the TV rooms. Our wifi signal is strong across the whole house.


I'd do Ethernet where you can but MOCA would be better than WiFi for streaming.


CA2DC said:


> My initial thought is 2 Bolts and 3-4 *Minis*, but I'm open to alternatives.


There is a rumored 4K Mini. It may come out in September. I'd wait so that you can either get the old minis cheap or get the 4K improvement and whatever else is added.



CA2DC said:


> Questions:
> - Amazon reviews imply some problems with the 3TB Bolt...would it be less (possible) headache to go with 1TB Bolt + a big eSata hard drive?


Two drives means dual failure points. If one drive fails, you lose all recordings on both drives. I would not go the eSata route.



CA2DC said:


> Thank You!!


You're welcome.


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## kpeters59 (Jun 19, 2007)

The Bolt does 4k, if that might someday be a consideration on where it would be placed. The Man Cave?

Maybe put one of the Premiere's in the MIL room?

You might be able to 'threaten' TiVo with 'abandoning' TiVo and see if they'll offer you a cheaper Lifetime on the Premiere's.

-KP


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

kpeters59 said:


> The Bolt does 4k, if that might someday be a consideration on where it would be placed. The Man Cave?
> 
> Maybe put one of the Premiere's in the MIL room?
> 
> ...


FiOS will only be offering 4K over IPTV. And when that rolls out, when you get IPTV, you give up the ability to do QAM channels. WHich is what the Bolt needs.


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## chicagobrownblue (May 29, 2008)

CA2DC said:


> - Is there an "easier" way to transfer my 60-70+ recording preferences & hierarchy without having to manually enter them all again?
> 
> Any and all advice/answers would be appreciated.
> Thank You!!


You can backup your One passes using kmttg:

kmttg / Wiki / remote_season_passes

Once you have new boxes, you can copy One Passes from box to box by logging into your account on Tivo.com.


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## Fant (Sep 1, 2016)

Just get a single bolt+ with lifetime subscription .. that will get you 6 tuners with just one cablecard. Then get a mini for each tv. Hook up the mini via either Ethernet or coax. Fios router or the bolt itself can be the Ethernet/coax bridge for moca. Then if you want upgrade the bolt+ drive to an external 8tb (save the 3tb in case you ever have problems). That should be a good setup for minimal monthly cost.


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## kpeters59 (Jun 19, 2007)

CA2DC said:


> Questions:
> 1- Is my initial set-up above optimal? Or is there something better?
> 
> 2- Do I need to use MoCA, or can the Minis all connect to the primary box using wifi?
> ...


1: I'd lean towards the Bolt+ and re-deploy the Premiere (if you can get a good deal towards Lifetime).

2: The Minis' CANNOT use WiFi, so either MoCA With a POE Filter) Or Ethernet. FIOS already has MoCA built in to their routers, so you should be able to get by without a bridge.

4: Most everybody is going to steer you away from the external SATA drive...put me in that camp!

5: It ought to be fairly straight forward if the new house has a well organized wiring layout. I'd lean towards MoCA to everything, if for no other reason than you won't need an Ethernet switch due to running out of ports on you router. Use a single splitter with a high frequency capability and low port isolation that has just enough ports to handle the number of outlets you'll use. Put the POE Filter on the input to it.

6: Use KMTTG to back up your Season Passes and OnePasses and Thumbs Ratings (do it now!). Transfer them when the new hardware arrives.

-KP


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

If budget is not a concern Bolt+ for house use, standard Bolt(4 tuners) for the inlaw suite and extra minis as needed, use MoCA for certain especially if you get/use the Verizon G1100 router with MoCA 2.0 on by default. Value purchase Roamio Pro/Plus with lifetime, reuse one of your old Tivos for inlaw suite, or splurge with a Roamio base with lifetime but you would need one MoCA adapter for that one. The used Roamios with lifetime are a relative bargain right now and they are pretty solid units with easy to upgrade hd's up to 8TB if you so desire.


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## Fant (Sep 1, 2016)

I agree get fios installed with their equipment first to ensure everything is working for a few days. Then get the cablecard added. Once you have the TiVo working with the cablecard for a few days, return the fios equipment.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

fcfc2 said:


> Value purchase Roamio Pro/Plus with lifetime, reuse one of your old Tivos for inlaw suite, or splurge with a Roamio base with lifetime but you would need one MoCA adapter for that one. The used Roamios with lifetime are a relative bargain right now and they are pretty solid units with easy to upgrade hd's up to 8TB if you so desire


Was going to make this same suggestion as well if cost was an issue and no need for 4K on the few apps that support it on the Bolt. He can probably get the $99 lifetime offer on one of his Premieres at this point for the guest/MIL room.

Scott


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

HerronScott said:


> Was going to make this same suggestion as well if cost was an issue and no need for 4K on the few apps that support it on the Bolt. He can probably get the $99 lifetime offer on one of his Premieres at this point for the guest/MIL room.
> 
> Scott


Another great point...


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## Sparky1234 (May 8, 2006)

Posted this in Premiere forum but wanted to copy is here as it is germane.

Added: Pay someone if you can't do it yourself for ethernet (cat 6) wire your house. It will pay for itself over and over again.

Copied:
Just want to comment on how slow XL is compared to XL4 > Roamio Pro > Bolt+. With each iteration TiVo has gotten faster. Any fence sitters reading this should note that the Bolt+ is significantly faster than XL and noticeably faster than Roamio. It was hard to discern the quality improvement that I have experienced from reading other posts on this topic.

Additional pluses:
-RF remote for Bolt+ and Mini ver 2 (930000)
-Faster streaming, especially from Amazon Prime Video.
-Updates install faster.
-Commercial skip same and Roamio.
-Scrolling my shows and pytivo downloads are much faster (cat 6 ethernet).
-Using the Bolt+ is just a much more pleasant experience compared to older models mentioned.

I still use all models listed. The older models are set and forget to capture TV series or movie genre that I transfer to the Bolt+.


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## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

I agree with Sparky1234. I have a Bolt, base Roamio, & dual tuner Premiere all used for OTA for direct comparison. For streaming I used Amazon, Vudu, YouTube, Plex, and Pandora lightly and would not use any of those except Pandora on the Premiere. Also of note for me is the Premiere's OTA tuners are noticeably worse than the Roamio or Bolt.


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## chicagobrownblue (May 29, 2008)

Sparky1234 said:


> Copied:
> Just want to comment on how slow XL is compared to XL4 > Roamio Pro > Bolt+. With each iteration TiVo has gotten faster. Any fence sitters reading this should note that the Bolt+ is significantly faster than XL and noticeably faster than Roamio. It was hard to discern the quality improvement that I have experienced from reading other posts on this topic.


The GUI is faster with each generation. I was fine with my base Premiere running in SD mode and I am fine running my base Roamio with the HD GUI, i.e. the Premiere did not have hardware fast enough to really run the HDUI well and the HDUI software was not initially ready for prime time.



Sparky1234 said:


> Additional pluses:
> -RF remote for Bolt+ and Mini ver 2 (930000)


RF remote for my base Roamio also.



Sparky1234 said:


> -Faster streaming, especially from Amazon Prime Video.


Well, the streaming is the same. I think what you are saying is the Amazon app loads faster as does the Netfilx app.


Sparky1234 said:


> -Updates install faster.


I wouldn't know. Updates happen automatically when I'm not watching. The time disappears from the TV screen is the only way I know an update has installed or my TiVo has rebooted. My Roamio reboots much faster now and meets my expectations. This is the constant upgrade process that TiVo engineers produce.



Sparky1234 said:


> -Using the Bolt+ is just a much more pleasant experience compared to older models mentioned.


Using the SD menu on the Premiere was a much more pleasant experience than using the HDUI on my Premiere. When I got my Roamio, I could not find the SD option, but the HDUI worked well on my base Roamio. The Roamio had better hardware and various issues with the HDUI software were fixed. The HDUI on the Roamio works well. I don't have a Bolt but I would concede the point that the HDUI is faster. Not a selling point for me.

A friend of mine has a Premiere. He came over to my place and watched something on Netflix. Then he plowed through all the Netflix offerings and tried to memorize things he might want to watch. I said there must be a way to tag these shows. I found out how to add his shows to his list and that was pleasant. He was using Netflix on his Premiere and my Roamio badly. Now -- with no hardware upgrade -- it is a much more pleasant experience. Maybe he is now an upgraded user? He would also hit the Tivo button on the remote and restart the Netflix app. I showed him how to go back into the Netflix menus.



Sparky1234 said:


> I still use all models listed. The older models are set and forget to capture TV series or movie genre that I transfer to the Bolt+.


Because the TiVo does a great job at basic DVR functionality. But, you realize that the transfer is a push operation. So, pushing shows to your Bolt+ will be slow due to the hardware limitations of your older Tivos.


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## Sparky1234 (May 8, 2006)

chicagobrownblue said:


> The GUI is faster with each generation. I was fine with my base Premiere running in SD mode and I am fine running my base Roamio with the HD GUI, i.e. the Premiere did not have hardware fast enough to really run the HDUI well and the HDUI software was not initially ready for prime time.
> 
> RF remote for my base Roamio also.
> 
> ...


Roamio remote is RF but the Bolt+ RF remote connects better.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Sparky1234 said:


> Roamio remote is RF but the Bolt+ RF remote connects better.


Connects better? What do you mean?

I haven't seen any difference here but we do have the Slide Pro Remote for the Roamio Pro and the standard remote for the Bolt.

Scott


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

HerronScott said:


> Connects better? What do you mean?
> 
> I haven't seen any difference here but we do have the Slide Pro Remote for the Roamio Pro and the standard remote for the Bolt.
> 
> Scott


They all work the same for me. The stock Bolt remotes work with my Romaios the same as they do with my Bolts.


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## Sparky1234 (May 8, 2006)

HerronScott said:


> Connects better? What do you mean?
> 
> I haven't seen any difference here but we do have the Slide Pro Remote for the Roamio Pro and the standard remote for the Bolt.
> 
> Scott


Works at greater distances and off angles.


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## Sparky1234 (May 8, 2006)

aaronwt said:


> They all work the same for me. The stock Bolt remotes work with my Romaios the same as they do with my Bolts.


See my last.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Sparky1234 said:


> Works at greater distances and off angles.


Sounds like you are in IR mode and not RF mode then since angle shouldn't come into play in RF mode. Ours works all the way across our house through 2 walls (about 55 feet).

Scott


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## mattyro7878 (Nov 27, 2014)

I thought e-sata was dead completely. No?


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## Sparky1234 (May 8, 2006)

HerronScott said:


> Sounds like you are in IR mode and not RF mode then since angle shouldn't come into play in RF mode. Ours works all the way across our house through 2 walls (about 55 feet).
> 
> Scott


Nope. In RF mode. I'm seeing a difference.


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