# Tablo vs TiVo OTA



## Pacomartin (Jun 11, 2013)

The Tablo 4 tuner DVR costs $300 + $150 lifetime support + cost of hard disk drive.
So that seems to compare almost exactly with the TiVo OTA $50+$500 lifetime support which includes a 1/2 terabyte drive.

In addition the Tablo has no HDMI plug so you must stream to other devices. It cannot stream to phones (only talets). The TiVo OTA has a choice of HDMI or streaming to either phones or tablets.

So as far as I can see the Tablo is a more limited product for the same money.Is there any counter arguments?


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## jth tv (Nov 15, 2014)

I never would have bought a TiVo if lifetime was the only option.

Entertainment is often a gamble. Go out to a movie, maybe it is worth the money, maybe it is not. 

I did not know if I would like Antenna TV instead of cable. TiVo Roamio Basic without lifetime initially costs less. It was worth trying.

Next year, I will review the options. Maybe I will stay with antenna, maybe I will go back to cable. Maybe I will buy a different DVR. I am willing to pay for the flexibility. It is all just part of the entertainment budget.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

Pacomartin said:


> In addition the Tablo has no HDMI plug so you must stream to other devices. It cannot stream to phones (only talets). The TiVo OTA has a choice of HDMI or streaming to either phones or tablets.


Not correct. Roamio OTA streams to nothing, only output is to direct-connected television (unless you buy $130 Stream accessory or Slingbox). Tablo streams to iOS, Android, Roku, computers, supports Airplay too. Both smartphones and tablets. In the house and out.



> So that seems to compare almost exactly with the TiVo OTA $50+$500 lifetime support which includes a 1/2 terabyte drive.


There is no Lifetime option for the OTA Roamio.


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## Pacomartin (Jun 11, 2013)

davezatz said:


> Not correct. Roamio OTA streams to nothing, only output is to direct-connected television. Tablo streams to iOS, Android, Roku, computers, supports Airplay too. Both smartphones and tablets. In the house and out.


So they are equal in price but different functionality.

Why wouldn't they give you the option for Lifetime on OTA? I suspect that most people wouldn't take it since they are aiming at people who don't want to lay out a lot of cash, but they should at least offer it. Is it because TiVo Inc. is unsure about their commitment to OTA devices?


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## SullyND (Dec 30, 2004)

TiVo wants you to step up to a regular Roamio to get lifetime as it gives them a chance to make money on it.


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## Pacomartin (Jun 11, 2013)

SullyND said:


> TiVo wants you to step up to a regular Roamio to get lifetime as it gives them a chance to make money on it.


I understand that most companies have a higher profit margin on their more expensive items. I assume the margin on the Mega-Tivo is huge.

But forcing people to take only month to month may backfire. Because the entry price of $50 is very low, some people may make $15 a month payment for 10 months and then decide it isn't worth it.

It would be interesting to know what percentage of people opt for lifetime for the different models. My guess is more of the people who spend $600 for equipment, also buy the lifetime.


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

Pacomartin said:


> I understand that most companies have a higher profit margin on their more expensive items. I assume the margin on the Mega-Tivo is huge.


TiVo generally looses money on their hardware and makes it up on the service fee.

The differences between the $150 Base Roamio and the $50 Roamio OTA are pretty minor and I suspect reflect a very minor per unit cost reduction for TiVo.

So to get the initial price down TiVo has to find a way to recoup the revenue in the service fee...

I personally think the Roamio OTA is not a very good deal. No flexibility, terrible resale value. A Base Roamio is a much better purchase - flexibility to switch from OTA to cable on a whim, availability of lifetime service and a significantly improved resale value.

Penny wise and pound foolish if you ask me.


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## Pacomartin (Jun 11, 2013)

bradleys said:


> Penny wise and pound foolish if you ask me.


I use that phrase in the same way you are using it, where you try to save a little money up front and it costs you much more in the long run. But sometimes I think the original meaning was referring to people who save money on the brand soda they drink, then they go to a bar and by drinks for everyone.

I think most people on this forum agree, but there is always a market. News articles generally are very excited about the Roamio OTA.

It's like Google Chromecast. When it came out people went nuts over the $35 price. But some serious reviewers said that they thought that $35 was about right considering what the device can do.
----
But back to the topic. Can you use a thumb drive with Tablo and just carry the drive to another device with the movie?


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## SullyND (Dec 30, 2004)

Pacomartin said:


> some people may make $15 a month payment for 10 months and then decide it isn't worth it.


Someone may decide that it's not worth it at two months too. Either way, they're on the hook for twelve months.


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## scandia101 (Oct 20, 2007)

davezatz said:


> There is no Lifetime option for the OTA Roamio.


Then what's this all about?


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## SullyND (Dec 30, 2004)

scandia101 said:


> Then what's this all about?


A different Roamio.

There is a specific Roamio called the Roamio OTA. DZ wasn't saying you can't get a Roamio that does OTA with lifetime. You cannot get lifetime service on the Roamio OTA.


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## Series3Sub (Mar 14, 2010)

And AFAIK, you can't just plug your Tablo 4 directly into your HDTV. This is an absolute must for many in my family as they are not tech savvy and do NOT want to deal with remote devices and WiFi or Ethernet in ANY way when they want to watch TV. They are traditional TV watchers. They want a DVR box they can plunk down next to the HDTV, connect it, and start recording and watching. That requires no learning curve with them. And that is a TiVo (or Channel Master DVR+) not any of these DVR's dependent on mobile devices or internet. TiVo can still have a strong appeal to those seeking a traditional DVR solution even in these techy times.


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## Pacomartin (Jun 11, 2013)

Series3Sub said:


> And AFAIK, you can't just plug your Tablo 4 directly into your HDTV.


Well you not only can't plug it in with an HDMI port, it has no A/V plugs. Nor does it have a hard disk. So at a minimum if you want a DVR you must plunk down $300 for Tablo and $100 for a hard drive and watch it from your tablets. You still are stuck with an annoying $5/month fee, or another $150 for lifetime support.



Series3Sub said:


> TiVo can still have a strong appeal to those seeking a traditional DVR solution even in these techy times.


So my original question is the Tablo and the TiVo OTA ultimately the same device for a similar price? It seems the answer is a resounding no.


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

TiVo is an easier box to set up, and has a better interface, and has the flexibility (on the Base Roamio) of switching to cable.

However, the Tablo would be far cheaper and easier for a household with several TVs who already has Rokus on the TVs and maybe a few external hard drives laying around.


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## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

Pacomartin said:


> So as far as I can see the Tablo is a more limited product for the same money.Is there any counter arguments?


Unless I missed something, you're answering a question no one asked.


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## Pacomartin (Jun 11, 2013)

astrohip said:


> Unless I missed something, you're answering a question no one asked.


That is quite true.

I was attempting to do my own comparison, and I requested some comments. In fact I made a number of errors which were pointed out to me, for which I appreciate the help.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

scandia101 said:


> Then what's this all about?


OP was discussing the *$50* "Roamio OTA". What you're showing is the $200 "Roamio" that does CableCARD or OTA.


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## Series3Sub (Mar 14, 2010)

Pacomartin said:


> Well you not only can't plug it in with an HDMI port, it has no A/V plugs. Nor does it have a hard disk. So at a minimum if you want a DVR you must plunk down $300 for Tablo and $100 for a hard drive and watch it from your tablets. You still are stuck with an annoying $5/month fee, or another $150 for lifetime support.
> 
> So my original question is the Tablo and the TiVo OTA ultimately the same device for a similar price? It seems the answer is a resounding no.


Good grief! At those total Tablo prices, it comes out to about the same cost as a TiVo Roamio with Lifetime. Gee, the TiVo is actually looking competitive.

I think the answer is if one is techy oriented and live by their mobile device and just prefers that realm to traditional way of watching TV with a traditional DVR, then something like Tablo is what they would prefer. As I said, some people I know just stop me in mid-sentence when I explain the option of Tablo or other devices/services like them because they just don't have the skill set and are not used to dealing with mobile devices and Roku's as the portal for watching TV. They watch TV in their home sitting in front of their HDTV and want a traditional DVR they can understand, so for them TiVo or Channel Master DVR+ or Genie or Hopper or cable co DVR's it is. The young-lings who have grown up with tech would probably prefer the Tablo. It's about which device suits the person.


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## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

I would say that for OTA Tablo & TiVo Roamio are very competitive. It really depends on what the individual user wants which becomes a better deal. I have not used Tablo but certainly believe Dave's review so I will just assume functionality is not an issue and on par with TiVo.

Tablo Costs:
4 tuner unit: $250
Lifetime Service: $150
2TB USB Hard drive: $82
Connection Device for each TV: $35-$90 per TV.
Total for a 1 TV setup with a Roku 3 is $575+/-. This setup will give the user more functionality and more storage than a Roamio with lifetime which can be purchased for $550+/- most anytime with PLSR lifetime discount code or $500 with Promo codes sold on ebay. The Tablo also has a lower cost to add additional TVs ($35-$90) and can stream to almost any computing device without additional cost (the base Roamio will need a $130 stream added to it).

What I am uncertain about the Tablo setup is how much the picture is degraded by the Tablo when the compression format is changed and if the company will be successful enough to stay in business longer term. What I am fairly certain of is that a used Tablo system will have fairly low resale value compared to a Roamio with lifetime and if one wants to go back to cable the Tablo system is useless.

Without having used a Tablo setup I would be hard press to recommend it. Having used a Roamio for OTA it is very easy for me to say it is a great OTA DVR and well worth it's cost.


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## Pacomartin (Jun 11, 2013)

Series3Sub said:


> The young-lings who have grown up with tech would probably prefer the Tablo. It's about which device suits the person.


Yes, one immediately thinks of teenagers and people living in small dorm rooms. Their TV/movie viewing device is the same one they read what used to be called newspapers and magazines.

But the so called "family room" oriented around the big television has probably always rankled some amateur interior designers. There is a fairly large business of manufacturers who try to hide televisions behind mirrors and in trick cabinets. As media watching has primarily become an individual experience, the future home decorator may simply relegate the television to the same level as reading a magazine, with a TV in the drawer.

They may not care about ultra HD or even full HD. No concern about viewing angles or even remotes. Just battery life and something resembling a book stand for when you are tired of lying on your bed with your TV propped up on your knees.


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

Pacomartin said:


> Yes, one immediately thinks of teenagers and people living in small dorm rooms. Their TV/movie viewing device is the same one they read what used to be called newspapers and magazines.
> 
> But the so called "family room" oriented around the big television has probably always rankled some amateur interior designers. There is a fairly large business of manufacturers who try to hide televisions behind mirrors and in trick cabinets. As media watching has primarily become an individual experience, the future home decorator may simply relegate the television to the same level as reading a magazine, with a TV in the drawer.
> 
> They may not care about ultra HD or even full HD. No concern about viewing angles or even remotes. Just battery life and something resembling a book stand for when you are tired of lying on your bed with your TV propped up on your knees.


Aside from OTA DVRs, there is a big move towards viewing on non-TV platforms, and everyone from Netflix to Comcast is marketing towards this market, but I think there is more of a place than ever for a giant TV with a powerful surround sound system, now that there is more HD and now 4K content than ever, in ever increasing quality.


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## Pacomartin (Jun 11, 2013)

Bigg said:


> I think there is more of a place than ever for a giant TV with a powerful surround sound system....


A home theater still holds a big place in people's wish list. It is amazing what the same money will buy today compared to the mid 1990's. Most heterosexual guys think a 65" TV hanging on the wall and subwoofer is the ultimate in room design.

But here is a $600 32" Samsung TV who price balloons to  $4299 to $5799 to hide it in a mirror. That is comparable in price to an unhidden Samsung UN75H7150 75-Inch 1080p 240Hz 3D Smart LED TV with List Price: $4,999.99 Sale Price:$3,797.99

So there is a market out there for people (probably mostly women) who are willing to pay big money to hide their TV's. That must mean there is a huge market out there for people who want TV's to be an accessory, that you pull out like a book.


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

Pacomartin said:


> A home theater still holds a big place in people's wish list. It is amazing what the same money will buy today compared to the mid 1990's. Most heterosexual guys think a 65" TV hanging on the wall and subwoofer is the ultimate in room design.
> 
> But here is a $600 32" Samsung TV who price balloons to  $4299 to $5799 to hide it in a mirror. That is comparable in price to an unhidden Samsung UN75H7150 75-Inch 1080p 240Hz 3D Smart LED TV with List Price: $4,999.99 Sale Price:$3,797.99
> 
> So there is a market out there for people (probably mostly women) who are willing to pay big money to hide their TV's. That must mean there is a huge market out there for people who want TV's to be an accessory, that you pull out like a book.


In order to get my mother to allow him to buy a 55" Samsung TV that cost $1,800 a few years ago, my father had to agree to buy a $6,000 media cabinet from Ethan Allen to put it in.


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## Pacomartin (Jun 11, 2013)

tarheelblue32 said:


> In order to get my mother to allow him to buy a 55" Samsung TV that cost $1,800 a few years ago, my father had to agree to buy a $6,000 media cabinet from Ethan Allen to put it in.


Honey, for that money we could purchase three more of these TV's and hang them on walls around the house. (Male home designer).

----------------------

Nabi 24" tablet is 13 lbs and has a kickstand. At that size the battery won't last long enough, but you can set it up , plug it in, and watch a movie. Now that TiVo supports streaming to Android devices, you can have TV decor that you can easily make invisible by putting them in a closet.

You can see that the device is currently being marketed to children and family use. But I think they will begin marketing to adult women.


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## joetekcor (Sep 15, 2014)

After dropping Dish in October I seriously looked into the Tablo for OTA programming. Every TV in my house has a Roku so it would have been an easy setup. For me, the decision came down to up front cost. The Tablo is still relatively new and I didn't want to put in a lot of money up front before deciding how well it works. The Tivo has a pretty solid user interface and the Roamio OTA works pretty well. At $50 + the monthly fee I wasn't out a whole lot to get started. 
Once I see some maturity on the Tablo and I get more feedback on usability I might switch to it. I like its multi-streaming capabilities across multiple devices.


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

Pacomartin said:


> A home theater still holds a big place in people's wish list. It is amazing what the same money will buy today compared to the mid 1990's. Most heterosexual guys think a 65" TV hanging on the wall and subwoofer is the ultimate in room design.
> 
> But here is a $600 32" Samsung TV who price balloons to  $4299 to $5799 to hide it in a mirror. That is comparable in price to an unhidden Samsung UN75H7150 75-Inch 1080p 240Hz 3D Smart LED TV with List Price: $4,999.99 Sale Price:$3,797.99
> 
> So there is a market out there for people (probably mostly women) who are willing to pay big money to hide their TV's. That must mean there is a huge market out there for people who want TV's to be an accessory, that you pull out like a book.


Even upper-middle class folks aren't buying $5k hidden mirror TVs or other crap like that. They're buying TVs between $1k and $3k, and buying as big as they can. For most people, the TV is part of the room, and what they use the room for. No need for elaborate mechanisms to hide it.


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## Pacomartin (Jun 11, 2013)

Bigg said:


> Even upper-middle class folks aren't buying $5k hidden mirror TVs or other crap like that.


No of course not. I am just saying that there are people who like to have a TV not a prominent part of the room. Some are willing to spend a lot of money to hide it. So there will be people who will spend less money for the ability to put it in the closet when not in use.


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

Pacomartin said:


> No of course not. I am just saying that there are people who like to have a TV not a prominent part of the room. Some are willing to spend a lot of money to hide it. So there will be people who will spend less money for the ability to put it in the closet when not in use.


That has nothing to do with the general market for semi-affordable 4K TVs, however.


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## jth tv (Nov 15, 2014)

Samsung - 55" Class (54.6" Diag.) - LED - 2160p - Smart - 4K Ultra HD TV - Black $1,099.99 SAVE $300 (Reg. $1,399.99). UN55HU6830FXZA.

That is well with reach.

I halfheartedly tried downloading the manual to check on the sneaky stuff (standards) but my pc won't let me.


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

jth tv said:


> Samsung - 55" Class (54.6" Diag.) - LED - 2160p - Smart - 4K Ultra HD TV - Black $1,099.99 SAVE $300 (Reg. $1,399.99). UN55HU6830FXZA.
> 
> That is well with reach.
> 
> I halfheartedly tried downloading the manual to check on the sneaky stuff (standards) but my pc won't let me.


The problem is, that's too small to see 4K unless you're sitting 5' away from it. If you're more than 5' away, you're better off getting a larger 1080p screen.


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