# Anyone tried Tivo OTA and Mini



## crayboy (Apr 28, 2007)

I have an OTA waiting for me at BestBuy, because Tivo support told me they are compatible. Margret Schmidt ( Tivo VP ) tweeted that they are not.
I have replied to both CS and Margret asking for clarification.

Has anyone actually tried a Mini with an OTA? I would rather not make two trips to BestBuy!


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## ncted (May 13, 2007)

crayboy said:


> I have an OTA waiting for me at BestBuy, because Tivo support told me they are compatible. Margret Schmidt ( Tivo VP ) tweeted that they are not.
> I have replied to both CS and Margret asking for clarification.
> 
> Has anyone actually tried a Mini with an OTA? I would rather not make two trips to BestBuy!


I am very interested to hear the real world answer to this too.


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## spaldingclan (Aug 22, 2012)

why would you not believe the head honcho of engineering at tivo?


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## crayboy (Apr 28, 2007)

Because Customer Support says they will work - and confirmed it again today after I sent them the link to Margret's tweet.

I also saw that Tivo removed the reference to the Mini in the OTA promo material. So I am about 90% convinced that it WONT work. 

I have both tweeted, and emailed Margret directly, so far no reply. 
Very frustrating. I love Tivo's platform, but the company has always seemed completely clueless! After 9 years I am actually thinking about bailing ( tablo ) ( nah, not really, not this time! )


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## turbobuick86 (May 3, 2002)

At $14.99/mo it is/was the most expensive dvr tivo ever produced. 

I do see as of today they are offering that same price now for the whole tivo house. Strange way to roll out a new bargain(sic).


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

turbobuick86 said:


> At $14.99/mo it is/was the most expensive dvr tivo ever produced.
> 
> I do see as of today they are offering that same price now for the whole tivo house. Strange way to roll out a new bargain(sic).


How do you figure that. For those of us that pay monthly, the OTA is $150 less for* any length of ownership*, than say a Roamio basic. Not everyone likes, or buys the lifetime subscription.


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## crayboy (Apr 28, 2007)

Margret just replied with ( for me ) good news:
TiVo Margret Schmidt
@tivodesign

@crayboy I've confirmed as well: Roamio OTA will work with TiVo Mini after all! (sorry for the confusion)


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

crayboy said:


> Margret just replied with ( for me ) good news:
> TiVo Margret Schmidt
> @tivodesign
> 
> @crayboy I've confirmed as well: Roamio OTA will work with TiVo Mini after all! (sorry for the confusion)


I guess the sky isn't falling then...


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## Ikrion (Aug 31, 2014)

crayboy said:


> Margret just replied with ( for me ) good news:
> TiVo Margret Schmidt
> @tivodesign
> 
> @crayboy I've confirmed as well: Roamio OTA will work with TiVo Mini after all! (sorry for the confusion)


Oh seriously? How do you mess that up? I bought the Roamio because I wanted Mini specifically and just use OTA.

Well... Maybe it will lead to better success for the unit.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

crayboy said:


> Margret just replied with ( for me ) good news: TiVo Margret Schmidt @tivodesign @crayboy I've confirmed as well: Roamio OTA will work with TiVo Mini after all! (sorry for the confusion)





Captainbob said:


> I guess the sky isn't falling then...


Wow that's a first. It's usually Margret correcting the erroneous information passed on by their CSRs, not the other way around.

For that alone I think the sky IS falling!


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## jwbelcher (Nov 13, 2007)

HarperVision said:


> Wow that's a first. It's usually Margret correcting the erroneous information passed on by their CSRs, not the other way around.
> 
> For that alone I think the sky IS falling!


Smells of a reversal, if so, good.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

turbobuick86 said:


> At $14.99/mo it is/was the most expensive dvr tivo ever produced.


How do you figure that? $14.99/month is more expensive than $19.99/month? There were plenty of TiVos sold at that rate plan.


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## L David Matheny (Jan 29, 2011)

jwbelcher said:


> Smells of a reversal, if so, good.


It does make you wonder. There was much disbelief expressed here that a feature having nothing to do with cable vs antenna would be arbitrarily withheld from the Roamio OTA. If there is (presumably) no hardware issue with using the Mini, was this just miscommunication from the start, or did TiVo finally agree that it's silly to cripple the OTA that way? I'll still be interested to hear someone report successful use of the two units together.


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

I just got on a Chat with Tivo Support and asked them if the OTA will work with the mini. The answer I just got 5 minutes ago was this:

"At this time there is no definitive answer on that, unfortunately. We are even getting conflicting answers from our engineers."

I then told them that this was a poor way to do business, because people were going to order something that some people at Tivo say will work with the Mini, and others say it won't. I find it hard to believe that nobody can figure out the correct answer especially after the days of speculation on about this issue from potential customers. 

His reply was ( and I am paraphrasing). Well, it comes with a 30 day guarantee, so if you buy it, and it doesn't work with the mini, you can return it for a refund> 

What a ridiculous way to market a new product. It also occurred to me, that maybe they don't even have one of these units at Tivo to test and see if it works, in other words, maybe it is still vapor ware until they receive the first units from the factory, which they haven't yet.


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## tatergator1 (Mar 27, 2008)

This is still essentially a base-model Roamio, presumably with the QAM decoder chip stripped out. It will run the same base Roamio software, with the options to setup for Cable stripped from Guided Setup. Any limitation to use a Mini with it has always been a choice made by Tivo, presumably for marketing purposes: Cripple Mini usage to up sell to the base-model Roamio for OTA only uses who want a whole-home setup. 

I'm in the group that guesses this was an about-face on Tivo's part based on feedback from potential customers.


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## dcline414 (May 1, 2014)

L David Matheny said:


> If there is (presumably) no hardware issue with using the Mini, was this just miscommunication from the start, or did TiVo finally agree that it's silly to cripple the OTA that way?


It would seem that this was either a miscommunication between product development and marketing, or it was an intentional limitation coded into the software. The hardware must support it (as do all other 4-tuner models), and I doubt a software change has been made so quickly.


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## ncted (May 13, 2007)

tatergator1 said:


> This is still essentially a base-model Roamio, presumably with the QAM decoder chip stripped out. It will run the same base Roamio software, with the options to setup for Cable stripped from Guided Setup. Any limitation to use a Mini with it has always been a choice made by Tivo, presumably for marketing purposes: Cripple Mini usage to up sell to the base-model Roamio for OTA only uses who want a whole-home setup.
> 
> I'm in the group that guesses this was an about-face on Tivo's part based on feedback from potential customers.


Knowing how product development happens often without any engineering input, my guess is this is an approximation of what happened:

1. The business decided to leave off Mini support
2. Told engineering to make it happen
3. Found out how much it would cost to develop the software for this model separately
4. Changed their mind and decided to leave Mini support in
5. Decided they could say it wasn't supported, even though it would be
6. When a bunch of customers called tech support asking questions, the CSRs asked the engineers who said "of course Mini is supported."
7. Faced with this public information, the business folks decide the cat's out of the bag and "clarify" their statement.

Through the course of all this, the advertising and website folks probably got the Mini support information all confused, so it's no wonder conflicting information is everywhere.


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## crayboy (Apr 28, 2007)

tatergator1 said:


> This is still essentially a base-model Roamio, presumably with the QAM decoder chip stripped out. It will run the same base Roamio software, with the options to setup for Cable stripped from Guided Setup. <SNIP>


Actually, the option to use cable is still in setup!
I have not seen a regular Roamio, but I am pretty sure this is the base model with cable card connect pulled. There is a door in the base labeled cable card, under it is a multi pin connector, but it would need at least a 90degree adaptor to plug a cable card in.

Also, I can confirm from experience that the OTA DOES work with a Mini - running them both now.


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## tatergator1 (Mar 27, 2008)

crayboy said:


> Actually, the option to use cable is still in setup!
> I have not seen a regular Roamio, but I am pretty sure this is the base model with cable card connect pulled. There is a door in the base labeled cable card, under it is a multi pin connector, but it would need at least a 90degree adaptor to plug a cable card in.
> 
> Also, I can confirm from experience that the OTA DOES work with a Mini - running them both now.


Seems odd to leave the option in. Perhaps it's just a temporary situation until they fork the main Tivo software for the Roamio OTA. I wonder if the QAM tuner is still there and you could tune clear QAM from a cable feed?


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## ncted (May 13, 2007)

crayboy said:


> Actually, the option to use cable is still in setup!
> I have not seen a regular Roamio, but I am pretty sure this is the base model with cable card connect pulled. There is a door in the base labeled cable card, under it is a multi pin connector, but it would need at least a 90degree adaptor to plug a cable card in.
> 
> Also, I can confirm from experience that the OTA DOES work with a Mini - running them both now.


Sweet!


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## ncted (May 13, 2007)

tatergator1 said:


> Seems odd to leave the option in. Perhaps it's just a temporary situation until they fork the main Tivo software for the Roamio OTA. I wonder if the QAM tuner is still there and you could tune clear QAM from a cable feed?


We could ask crayboy to crack his open and see if anything else is missing.


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## crayboy (Apr 28, 2007)

ncted said:


> We could ask crayboy to crack his open and see if anything else is missing.


What would I be looking for?!

Also, attaching a ( bad ) picture of the side of the box showing text that it works with Mini.


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## tatergator1 (Mar 27, 2008)

"Connects to Tivo Mini.." plainly written on the side of the box. It does appear to have a footnote, which is conveniently not on the same side of the box. 

At least one group at Tivo has always expected this to support the Mini since the packaging indicates as much.


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

tatergator1 said:


> "Connects to Tivo Mini.." plainly written on the side of the box. It does appear to have a footnote, which is conveniently not on the same side of the box.
> 
> At least one group at Tivo has always expected this to support the Mini since the packaging indicates as much.


Footnote is in parentheses and says (sold separately)


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

tatergator1 said:


> Seems odd to leave the option in. Perhaps it's just a temporary situation until they fork the main Tivo software for the Roamio OTA.


The whole thing strikes me as a test... IF they sell a ton, they'll invest in redesigning the hardware and enclosure, perhaps even guts beyond stripping CableCARD tuner. Not sure what the deal is with the on again off again Mini, but ON is the proper position.


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## manhole (Apr 15, 2005)

Those of you who have received your Roamio OTA, can you confirm if they have stripped the wifi out of it?


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

manhole said:


> Those of you who have received your Roamio OTA, can you confirm if they have stripped the wifi out of it?


It says on the side of the box that a Broadband connection is required, so I would bet there is no wifi.


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

Captainbob said:


> It says on the side of the box that a Broadband connection is required, so I would bet there is no wifi.


I wonder if it would work with the TiVo wireless adapter.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

Captainbob said:


> It says on the side of the box that a Broadband connection is required, so I would bet there is no wifi.


Wifi is broadband too. It's certainly not dial-up! 

In another OTA thread I think I recall someone mentioning hooking it via wireless and having spotty reception and it getting better by just moving it a few inches one way or the other.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

unclehonkey said:


> I dont have one (nor need it) so dont know a couple quirks I noticed -in the setup it says "what are you using...cable only or antenna only". Wonder if it works with unencrypted cable? *-the wireless is really sensitive. A inch one way or another and it drops dramatically*


From here: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10244207#post10244207


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

tarheelblue32 said:


> I wonder if it would work with the TiVo wireless adapter.


The current TiVo wireless-n adapter is just a bridge. So it will work with any ethernet device.


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

HarperVision said:


> Wifi is broadband too. It's certainly not dial-up!
> 
> In another OTA thread I think I recall someone mentioning hooking it via wireless and having spotty reception and it getting better by just moving it a few inches one way or the other.


Incorrect.....Broadband and Wifi are totally different technologies. http://www.utilis.ie/wi-fi-broadband-what-is-the-difference/


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

Captainbob said:


> Incorrect.....Broadband and Wifi are totally different technologies. http://www.utilis.ie/wi-fi-broadband-what-is-the-difference/


It is if your "WIFI" router is connected to "broadband" Internet service.

From the link you posted:



> What is Wi-Fi? Wi-Fi access points seem to be everywhere these days, but what is Wi-Fi? WiFi is a network technology which uses radio waves to allow you to access a local network or access the Internet over *high speed broadband* like ADSL.......


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

HarperVision said:


> It is if your "WIFI" router is connected to "broadband" Internet service.
> 
> From the link you posted:


Guess you didn't read the article. Broadband is *wired *into your home. Wireless Broadband is like 3G or 4G or LTE from your cell phone provider.

Wifi is a different technology, that can be connected to broadband using a Wifi router, but they are not the same technology. If a device has Wifi capabilities, it will be stated in the specs, and printed on the box. In the case of the OTA, neither is stated.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

Captainbob said:


> Wifi is a different technology, that can be connected to broadband using a Wifi router, but they are not the same technology.


WiFi implies broadband. And they could indeed be the same for all practical purposes if the basis of the label is a specific or minimum speed/throughput. No, I didn't read the article either. However, I do agree that if wireless was included, they would/should state it. But this has been a bungled launch from the get go in terms of communication and capabilities, so who knows.


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

davezatz said:


> WiFi implies broadband. And they could indeed be the same for all practical purposes if the basis of the label is a specific or minimum speed/throughput. No, I didn't read the article either. However, I do agree that if wireless was included, they would/should state it. But this has been a bungled launch from the get go in terms of communication and capabilities, so who knows.


Well I just contacted Tivo tech support on chat, and they said that the OTA does in fact have built in Wifi.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

Captainbob said:


> It says on the side of the box that a Broadband connection is required, so I would bet there is no wifi.


LOL.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

Captainbob said:


> Well I just contacted Tivo tech support on chat, and they said that the OTA does in fact have built in Wifi.


I already pointed out yesterday from a first hand user that it did:  http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10244207#post10244207

But it's certainly nice that they verified it.


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

HarperVision said:


> I already pointed out yesterday from a first hand user that it did:
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10244207#post10244207


Curious as to what the "official" response would be from Tivo.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

Captainbob said:


> Curious as to what the "official" response would be from Tivo.


Who ever really knows that, with the OTA/mini support debacle!


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

Captainbob said:


> It says on the side of the box that a Broadband connection is required, so I would bet there is no wifi.


Here's _another_ side of the box... WiFi included to access your broadband.










I don't think you can stream to Mini over wireless, but you can get your apps and box/guide updates in that manner.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

davezatz said:


> Here's _another_ side of the box... WiFi included to access your broadband.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


With the Roamio BAsic you could stream to a Mini over WIreless. At least when I was using only wireless with my Roamio BAsic it did. But I've had it on a wired connection for the last few months.


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## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

Captainbob said:


> It says on the side of the box that a Broadband connection is required, so I would bet there is no wifi.


Broadband = high-speed, typically always on, connection from a premises to the internet. In this case, broadband most commonly means DSL or Cable, although there are other connection methods.

WiFi = wireless connection within the premises. WiFi is the marketing term for IEEE 802.11 technologies.

Requiring broadband has nothing to do with whether or not a device does or does not have WiFi. In this case, it just means that it needs a high-speed, always-on connection from the premises to the internet.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

HarperVision said:


> I already pointed out yesterday from a first hand user that it did: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10244207#post10244207
> 
> But it's certainly nice that they verified it.


yeah its got wifi. I wouldnt have gotten one without that as I don't have internet in my apartment. I use the community room's wifi which is 2 floors down. Thats why I said a inch or so makes a difference in signal


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## Mattman13 (Sep 24, 2014)

I have been using the Roamio OTA and Mini for the past week. I am using ethernet between them. They work as expected.

The Roamio OTA seems to be a rebranded Roamio that is subsidized by Best Buy with no lifetime subscription option. 

My 3TB drive should arrive today so I will be upgrading the capacity soon.

I eventually plan on getting the Stream.

There seems to be issues with stocking the units at Best Buy. Very few units have been shipped to Best Buy and Roamio OTA site keeps changing the availability dates for the units. I am not sure what is going on, but I am glad I was able to get it as we will officially be cutting this weekend.

-MM13


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## Captainbob (Sep 1, 2014)

Mattman13 said:


> I have been using the Roamio OTA and Mini for the past week. I am using ethernet between them. They work as expected.
> 
> The Roamio OTA seems to be a rebranded Roamio that is subsidized by Best Buy with no lifetime subscription option.
> 
> ...


On another post, someone mentioned that they now removed all the Best Buys delivery dates from the Tivo website. I just looked, and yes, the dates are gone. I wonder if there is a problem with the product, keeping them from shipping it.


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## Mattman13 (Sep 24, 2014)

If I had to guess I would think that they rushed a re-branded Roamio as the OTA without making all of the changes to the product to differentiate it and are now looking to change more under the hood stuff. Like the "cable' option in the software menus.

Besides the Cable Card being disabled and the name on the front, it seems like the same exact box as the Roamio.

Another thought is that at $49 I could forgo the warranty and get an additional OTA for $49. This would kill their pricing model as they need the consumer to activate to recoup the HW costs and currently there is no way to guarantee that the buyer won't buy an extra on for a rainy day.

-MM13


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