# Lost - 3/2/05 - Untagged Spoilers



## holee (Dec 12, 2000)

I really don't like Walt. He's the last person who should be casting stones at Sawyer.

Hurley's story is amusing enough so far. Not sure why he's so careless though, but maybe that'll be explained.


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## shaunrose (Sep 13, 2001)

I wonder how many people will play those numbers in the lottery this week!


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## holee (Dec 12, 2000)

Okay last person who should be going on a rickety bridge is going on a bridge.

So Hurley is somehow lucky at the expense of others?

So it's Hurley's fault that the plane crashed?

But he doesn't have any answers, nor does he know how to break the curse. If he thinks he's cursed he should tell the others. Or he could stay silent and watch them die. 

So the French team broadcast cursed numbers..... Oops, not the French team. The pre-pre castaways.

So does this mean that ABC will be responsible for the destruction of the world?

Good to see that French Chick is only partially deranged.

The mystery is borderline magic borderline coincidence. I hope this doesn't become another Rambaldi thing and start getting ludicrous.


Man ABC really wants us to watch Blind Justice.


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## GameGuru (Dec 12, 2003)

Awesome episode but ...


STOP WITH THE DAMN REPEATS!

This is driving me crazy. Two new episodes, repeat, two new episodes, repeat!

I need my Lost fix weekly and this is killing me!


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## GameGuru (Dec 12, 2003)

Are we to assume the box company Hurley owns alot of stock in is the same one Locke worked at?


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## holee (Dec 12, 2000)

GameGuru said:


> Are we to assume the box company Hurley owns alot of stock in is the same one Locke worked at?


Ohhhh didn't even see that.


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## Ladd Morse (Feb 21, 2002)

GameGuru said:


> Are we to assume the box company Hurley owns alot of stock in is the same one Locke worked at?


Oh I love that one!


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## sushikitten (Jan 28, 2005)

So are we to assume that thing they showed at the end is another hatch (just not buried)?


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## tanstaafl (Oct 22, 2002)

GameGuru said:


> Awesome episode but ...
> 
> STOP WITH THE DAMN REPEATS!
> 
> ...


There were seven new episodes, starting with _Whatever the Case May Be_ on January 5...

Now we just have to wait until May sweeps...


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## Mike20878 (Jun 8, 2001)

GameGuru said:


> Awesome episode but ...
> 
> STOP WITH THE DAMN REPEATS!
> 
> ...


More than that... There isn't a new episode now until 4/13! What is ABC doing?


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

6 weeks until the final 6 episodes start on April 13th.

OMG I love this show! How creepy!

The box company? You're right. All this stuff is coming together.


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## Ekims (Oct 18, 2002)

Okay guys. You have deciphered everything in this show to date. What do the numbers mean? I didn't see any pattern there, but everything in this show is significant.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Time to start analyzing the numbers.... 

4-8-15-16-23-42


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## Keith_R90210 (Jul 26, 2003)

> Are we to assume the box company Hurley owns alot of stock in is the same one Locke worked at?


I didn't think of that but it would cause another tie-in between characters. I really liked this episode, it kept me on edge and it was interesting seeing Hurley's back-story. Charley and Hurley talking at the end was hysterical:

"Dude, back home I'm worth 156 million"
"Fine don't tell."
"Dude..."
"I open my heart to you and all I get is jokes!"

Priceless!

this whole thing about the numbers has me intrigued. I wonder who thought of them and what they represent, all these questions it drives me crazy!

are we approaching the end of the season?


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## alpacaboy (Oct 29, 2004)

Keith_R90210 said:


> this whole thing about the numbers has me intrigued. I wonder who thought of them and what they represent, all these questions it drives me crazy!


Well, 42... that should be an easy one to analyze.


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## Keith_R90210 (Jul 26, 2003)

> Well, 42... that should be an easy one to analyze.


ok, I apologize for my ignorance but this goes over my head, how is 42 easy to analyze in comparison to the other numbers?


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## GameGuru (Dec 12, 2003)

I am upset that we didn't get any explanation for Hurley's comment early in the season:

"Back home I am considered something of a warrior."

What did he mean by that?


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## Mike20878 (Jun 8, 2001)

alpacaboy said:


> Well, 42... that should be an easy one to analyze.


  J.J. and his numbers...


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## GameGuru (Dec 12, 2003)

Were there originally 42 survivors?


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## Mike20878 (Jun 8, 2001)

GameGuru said:


> Were there originally 42 survivors?


No, I think it was 47 or 48.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Keith_R90210 said:


> ok, I apologize for my ignorance but this goes over my head, how is 42 easy to analyze in comparison to the other numbers?


It's a joke. A reference to The Hitchikers Guide To The Galaxy.
If you haven't read it, you don't get it.
(Actually, 42 was in the 2nd book, right? Geez, it's been so long since I read that)


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## stagemaster (Jun 14, 2002)

GameGuru said:


> Were there originally 42 survivors?


That was my first thought, but further research revealed it to be 48.


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## Redux (Oct 19, 2004)

hefe said:


> Time to start analyzing the numbers....
> 
> 4-8-15-16-23-42


Ah, 815 again

Weren't the 8 1 5 marked with lines, arrows?

The other #s, at least to the right, may have also had lines but they weren't as distinct and may just have been folds or wrinkles in the paper.


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## Paperboy2003 (Mar 30, 2004)

For those of you who also watch Curb your Enthusiasm, please recall this last season or the season before when the person who plays Hurley was on that show and portrayed a drug dealer who Larry bought drugs from. I found it funny that for all the things the cops could have arrested him for in California...it was for selling drugs.


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## alpacaboy (Oct 29, 2004)

hefe said:


> It's a joke. A reference to The Hitchikers Guide To The Galaxy.
> If you haven't read it, you don't get it.
> (Actually, 42 was in the 2nd book, right? Geez, it's been so long since I read that)


I think it was established in the first book, but the third book was named "Life, the Universe, and Everything." It's been a long time since I've read those, but I still remember it as the series that redefines the word trilogy.  (Though I think I've heard "Jersey Trilogy" or something in reference to Kevin Smith movies)

Anyway, yes, I was just making a joke about the significance of 42 there. Though now that I think about it, I don't think it would be a stretch for Hurley to have picked 42 for that reason. Though he might be a little young. (Though J.J. is about the right age.)


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Redux said:


> Ah, 815 again
> 
> Weren't the 8 1 5 marked with lines, arrows?
> 
> The other #s, at least to the right, may have also had lines but they weren't as distinct and may just have been folds or wrinkles in the paper.


Here's the paper...


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## trainman (Jan 29, 2001)

Channel *4* -- ABC affiliate in Pittsburgh, Seattle, Salt Lake City, et al.
Channel *8* -- ABC affiliate in Dallas, Richmond, New Haven, et al.
Channel *15* -- ABC affiliate in Phoenix, Florence/Myrtle Beach (SC).
Channel *16* -- ABC affiliate in Scranton, Jackson (MS).
Channel *23* -- ABC affiliate in Bakersfield, Missoula, Eugene (OR).
Channel *42* -- ABC affiliate in Palm Springs, Kennewick (WA).


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Pardon my memory if it is off, but weren't they on Oceanic Flight 815?


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## Kamakzie (Jan 8, 2004)

GameGuru said:


> Are we to assume the box company Hurley owns alot of stock in is the same one Locke worked at?


I told my dad the same thing.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Oh, and (I just checked to make sure) in the Kate flashback episode where she takes the contents of the safe deposit box, she asks for box 815.

Box 815. What kind of boxes did the company make???


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

BTW, Locke is the man. 

Again, he knows exactly what someone else needs, and provides it.


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## JadeWolf07 (Jan 1, 2004)

Why would Hurley be on TV in another country for winning the lottery, unless it was an incredibly huge jackpot (which I don't think it was)??


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

JadeWolf07 said:


> Why would Hurley be on TV in another country for winning the lottery, unless it was an incredibly huge jackpot (which I don't think it was)??


It was huge. The TV announcers said before Hurley passed out that whoever has the numbers "has won or will share in a near-record jackpot....this is the 16th week without a winner."

But then I would think he'd be worth more than 156 million, since his finance guy also said he had doubled his worth later.

Maybe he shared it with someone...?


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## Test (Dec 8, 2004)

hefe said:


> Maybe he shared it with someone...?


his uncle....

SAM!

dun dun


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

8 people died in the fire at Hurley's shoe factory in Canada.


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

hefe said:


> It was huge. The TV announcers said before Hurley passed out that whoever has the numbers "has won or will share in a near-record jackpot....this is the 16th week without a winner."
> 
> But then I would think he'd be worth more than 156 million, since his finance guy also said he had doubled his worth later.
> 
> Maybe he shared it with someone...?


Undo the amortization to get the actual amount of cash won as a lump sum, subtract taxes, and allow for "near record" to mean "not the highest" and you're in the right ballpark. Then remember he probably spent some, so doubling what he started with may not mean doubling the jackpot.

Is it insider trading to use your mystical bad luck to trade stocks?


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

I was hoping Sun's "escape time" from the airport would tie in, but that was 11:15.


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## transpizzle (Nov 6, 2003)

GameGuru said:


> I am upset that we didn't get any explanation for Hurley's comment early in the season:
> 
> "Back home I am considered something of a warrior."
> 
> What did he mean by that?


Seems to me he may have a mental illness from something happening to him. To get over something like that could be why people called him a warrior.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

What an awesome episode!!! I caught the reference to the box company in Tustin, but it seemed like there were a couple more tie-ins that I recognized and now I can't remember what they were.


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## MMG (Dec 11, 1999)

4-8-15-16-23-42= -100


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## spot1x (Jun 8, 2004)

What was that concrete/metal thing at the very end with the number etched on it? Anybody know?


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## whitson77 (Nov 10, 2002)

spot1x said:


> What was that concrete/metal thing at the very end with the number etched on it? Anybody know?


The hatch where boone and Locke are working.


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## spot1x (Jun 8, 2004)

spot1x said:


> What was that concrete/metal thing at the very end with the number etched on it? Anybody know?


Ahhh cool missed that...

thanks


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## tanstaafl (Oct 22, 2002)

Just to add more things to discuss, Sawyer's latest book is _A Wrinkle in Time_.

Now _that_ should stir up some speculation!


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

A few more items...

I quoted it before, but it didn't hit me until now...How many weeks had the lottery gone without a winner? *16*

What game was the crazy guy, Lenny, playing in the mental hospital? Connect *4*.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

I am thinking Hurley may have been a mental patient at one time. Twice he asserted "I'm not crazy," and he glared at Charlie when he said he was acting like a lunatic.

And the crazy French chick saw something in him that made her open up. Crazy likes crazy.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Mike20878 said:


> No, I think it was 47 or 48.


It was 48, but at the time they said that, they hadn't discovered the pilot yet.

Hey, now we've met 2 folks in Australia with fake limbs. The woman tonight, and the rancher that Kate worked for.


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## niea_7 (Nov 5, 2003)

hefe said:


> I am thinking Hurley may have been a mental patient at one time.


I agree. How would the doctor there have recognized him and commented that he didn't think he was that close to Lenny? I thought that maybe Hurley volunteered there, but now I don't think so. I think Hurley was a patient there, which is how he got to know everyone and why he's so sensitive to being called "crazy".


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## lpamelaa (May 3, 2004)

I loved this episode. More answers, more questions and more tie-ins.

I'm sure the box company HUGO (ahahaha) owned in Houston was the one Locke worked at. 

Haven't heard this mentioned yet....Lenny & Sam heard the broadcast numbers 16 years ago. Sayid calculated that the transmission began looping 16 years ago. Rousseau confirmed this by revealing why her ship went off course. So Rousseau and Sam/Lenny must have heard the same transmission. Can't remember...where were Sam/Lenny monitoring signals from?

New questions:
1) Why did HUGO (ahahahaha) spend time in a mental ward. I assume this is what he was referring to when saying he'd put his family through a lot.

2) How exactly did Rousseau's crewmates become "sick"?

3) 

ok, forget it, my fingers will fall off if I type all my questions!


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

lpamelaa said:


> I loved this episode. More answers, more questions and more tie-ins.
> 
> I'm sure the box company HUGO (ahahaha) owned in Houston was the one Locke worked at.
> 
> ...


Answers:

The box company was in Tustin. When Hurley took a census several episodes ago, Locke revealed that he lived most of his life in Tustin, California.

Forgot the 16 years part, another 16 to add to the number coincidences...
Sam and Lenny were in the Navy in the Pacific scanning for transmisisons somewhere in the Pacific.

We never got much more than that about the sickness, except that it happened after they returned from "black rock."

And another thing...
When Hurley took the census, Ethan Rom said he was from Ontario, and Hurley said, "Right on. Love Canada." His overinsured sneaker factory was in Canada.

And another, another thing...Hurley's financial guy said that his orange futures did very well when the storm hit Florida...Locke made a creepy smile at Kate in the first episode with an orange peel in his mouth. I remembered that because it reminded me of the symbolism of oranges in the Godfather.


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## transpizzle (Nov 6, 2003)

hefe said:


> I am thinking Hurley may have been a mental patient at one time. D


I agree, I posted a little while ago I thought he may have had some mental illness.


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## A.C. (Sep 16, 2002)

niea_7 said:


> I agree. How would the doctor there have recognized him and commented that he didn't think he was that close to Lenny? I thought that maybe Hurley volunteered there, but now I don't think so. I think Hurley was a patient there, which is how he got to know everyone and why he's so sensitive to being called "crazy".


He also mentioned how he had "put his family through a lot lately" at the press conference.....


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Man there's a lot of stuff intersecting...Recap...

Numbers:
Lottery: 4-8-15-16-23-42
Lenny's game at the hospital, Connect 4
Years since Sam killed himself...4
Years since grandpa's pacemaker was installed...4
Number of people that died in the sneaker factory fire...8
Number of weeks without a lottery winner...16
Number of years the French transmission was playing...16
Flight number of the plane...815
Safe Deposit box number...815

Let me guess...Claire will give birth in her 42nd week. 

Boxes:
Jack's father (casket)
Kate's safe deposit box
Rousseau's music box
The box that Michael's letters to Walt were kept in.
Locke working in the box factory
Hurley owning the box factory
Lenny shouting when he heard that Hugo used the numbers, "You've opened the box!"


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## jami (Dec 18, 2003)

I loved Hurley's comment to Sayid. "She says 'hey'". That line had me laughing out loud. His delivery is just priceless!

So he bonded enough with Frenchie to get her to give him a battery. Yet, they part ways and no more mention (on camera, at least) is made of her. I would think that there would be many more questions from the others.


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## spot1x (Jun 8, 2004)

was lock building the crib in clairs dream or am i remembering incorrectly?


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

spot1x said:


> was lock building the crib in clairs dream or am i remembering incorrectly?


In the dream, Locke is sitting at a table turning over cards. Claire runs into the jungle where there is an empty white crib with a mobile hanging above it with Oceanic airplanes on it. She reaches into the white blanket and comes out with blood on her hands.


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## lpamelaa (May 3, 2004)

We've interpretted several people as being possibly "responsible" for the plane crash.

1) Walt -- did he "wish" it to crash?
2) Claire -- her baby CANNOT be raised by another
3) Hurley -- unlucky lottery numbers

Yet it's benefitted some of the survivors

1) Locke -- returned use of his legs
2) Charlie -- unhooked from heroin

And it's in the possible process of redeeming others (Sawyer, Sayid, Boone, Shannon, Jin, Jack and Kate). I'm not sure where I'm going with this...just typing out loud.


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## lpamelaa (May 3, 2004)

One more thought...this was the second time a survivor talked about his past life and wasn't believed.

1) Locke told some one (Boone?) he worked at a box company and got the response "Yeah, right."
2) Hurley told Charlie about his net worth of $156 million and wasnt believed.

Did this happen to anyone else?


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

hefe said:


> Time to start analyzing the numbers....
> 4-8-15-16-23-42


Well, JJ seems to have a thing for *47* and 
(8-4) = *4* and (15-8) = *7*


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## Sinuralan (Dec 27, 2001)

Hurley's luck doesn't seem to have been particularly bad on the island. Or rather, the luck of those around him. Not to the degree they were showing in his before life. Perhaps he finally found a way to rid himself of the money (being stranded), and thus is free?


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## GadgetFreak (Jun 3, 2002)

spot1x said:


> What was that concrete/metal thing at the very end with the number etched on it? Anybody know?


More of it was uncovered... it looked almost like a capsule. The number on the hatch matching the number being broadcast might make sense?

If it were some kind of experiment with multiple capsules, and one crashes, would it (or it's crew) broadcast which one went down?


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## brott (Feb 23, 2001)

GameGuru said:


> Are we to assume the box company Hurley owns alot of stock in is the same one Locke worked at?


That's what clicked .. I heard Box Company and thought to myself ... "Why do I remember that?" .. You hit the nail on the head .. I missed by a bloody mile.


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## jerobi (Sep 28, 2000)

How about seat #s on the plane - do we know any of those? Perhaps people that are connected, rows that died, etc...

I LOVE the numbers game. Best wrinkle in a few episodes now. Lots of possibilities. Somehow, I just don't see this working out as a mathematical equation, so it must be something else. Regardless, all of these subtle in-joke clues that were interwoven into the background of past episodes - that's some great writing.


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## jerobi (Sep 28, 2000)

GadgetFreak said:


> If it were some kind of experiment with multiple capsules, and one crashes, would it (or it's crew) broadcast which one went down?


I like that reasoning for the broadcast source.

But if the French Woman has been to the radio tower to change the transmission, I'm thinking your theory would have to be built around having a crew (vs. just an automatic beacon going off).


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## getbak (Oct 8, 2004)

Another number that was mentioned during the episode...Claire told Locke that she is "almost nine months pregnant."

Although there has been plenty of speculation, I don't know if she has ever said how far along she is before.


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## pyhill (Jul 10, 2004)

I an very interested in getting this metal thing out of the ground since it has the numbers etched in it. I am assuming it belonged to the first set of people who landed on the island and they sent the original transmission of the numbers (maybe to identify their boat/plane?). Everything about the numbers seems to have started from this point.


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## jasonander (Jan 9, 2005)

What happened during minutes 32 and 33? Between when Lenny was being dragged out of the room in the psych ward and Hurley was walking on the suspension bridge? The cable company decided to inform us about a kid that was kidnapped over 100 miles away then. They could have at least done it on a commercial or done it with some scrolling text at the top of the screen, not interrupt LOST!


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## TIVOSciolist (Oct 13, 2003)

jasonander said:


> What happened during minutes 32 and 33? Between when Lenny was being dragged out of the room in the psych ward and Hurley was walking on the suspension bridge? The cable company decided to inform us about a kid that was kidnapped over 100 miles away then. They could have at least done it on a commercial or done it with some scrolling text at the top of the screen, not interrupt LOST!


Hurley shows up next in Australia in the middle of nowhere and meets the widow of the man whose name the mental patient was screaming.

Can anyone tell me what the Australian woman and Hurley said after she showed off her missing leg? Here in Oakland, a lot of the stations went blank for an Amber Alert. However, the ABC station turned to snow with no sound. Strange.


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## emandbri (Jul 5, 2004)

getbak said:


> Another number that was mentioned during the episode...Claire told Locke that she is "almost nine months pregnant."
> 
> Although there has been plenty of speculation, I don't know if she has ever said how far along she is before.


I think in the first episode she said she was 7 1/2 months which would be 33 weeks. She couldn't have been more then 35 weeks when the plane crashed because the airlines won't let women fly international flights after 35 weeks.

Emily


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## getbak (Oct 8, 2004)

TIVOSciolist said:


> Hurley shows up next in Australia in the middle of nowhere and meets the widow of the man whose name the mental patient was screaming.
> 
> Can anyone tell me what the Australian woman and Hurley said after she showed off her missing leg? Here in Oakland, a lot of the stations went blank for an Amber Alert. However, the ABC station turned to snow with no sound. Strange.


She said that after the accident, she lost her leg and her husband was unharmed. Then, bad things started happening to their friends and family, and her husband started to believe that the numbers were bad luck, so they moved to the middle of nowhere to get away from it, but the bad things kept happening.

Hurley asked if her husband had found any way to stop the curse and she said that he stopped it by putting a gun in his mouth.

Hurley then asked if there was no way to stop the curse, and she said that she didn't believe in any curses, that bad things just happen and a few numbers couldn't cause bad things to happen, just as not using the numbers wouldn't have prevented the bad things. Hurley disagreed and said that he believed the numbers are cursed.


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## FauxPas (Jan 8, 2002)

Just found something "coming soon" here
http://www.4815162342.com/


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## smak (Feb 11, 2000)

It's a little late now, who wants to try calling that number in the morning?

-smak-


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## dagojr (Jan 9, 2004)

holee said:


> Ohhhh didn't even see that.


i would think so, they seem to drop a small clue each episode.

makes you think all the survivors are connected somehow.


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## firerose818 (Jul 21, 2003)

I think that the fact that Jack and Sayid didn't die in the explosion and Charlie made it across the bridge shows that Hurley's "luck" has changed on the island, with people around him no longer getting hurt and dying. I think Hurley is getting the same fresh start on the island that the other survivors have been granted.

-Rose


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## Vendikarr (Feb 24, 2004)

Isn't the fourth book of the Bible called Numbers, like this episode.

And the book of number is basically about a group of lost people (the Israelites) finding their spiritual redemption before entering into the promised land.

Interesting parallel.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

More questions than answers once again. Must...resist...looking...at...the...final espisode thread on this board. Just someone tell me if there is a nice pay-off at the end of this season...yes or no? It's buggin me because I think Alias was ruined by this kind of stuff.


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## shaunrose (Sep 13, 2001)

MMG said:


> 4-8-15-16-23-42= -100


4, 8, 15, 16, 23, 42

4+8+15+16+23=66 4+2=6 -- 666 (and there are 6 numbers)


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## f0gax (Aug 8, 2002)

FauxPas said:


> Just found something "coming soon" here
> http://www.4815162342.com/


Looks like that domain was registered very recently. It doesn't show up in any whois search and the ones I searched were updated yesterday.

As for calling 481-516-2342; that does not appear (via a quick Google) to be a US area code. Though one Google search I did seemed to come up with an Australian area code (or whatever their equivalent is). But in Australia, don't they have a different phone number format and length as well?


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

jamijc said:


> I loved Hurley's comment to Sayid. "She says 'hey'". That line had me laughing out loud....


 That reminded me of Goober in Andy Griffith.


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## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

Smak stole my thought. I also thought that it could be a US phone number.

I didn't initially catch that Locke could work in HUGOs box company. People on this board are sharp. Also how was it that Locke knew it was Claire's birthday. It is not coincidental that he just happened to be making a cradle.....

My biggest contribution to this thread will be this. Up until this point all we have seen was the small metal hatch. That last shot of it showed the hatch plus some extra metal with the numbers etched in. Now, we don't yet know if all that time Locke and Boone spent in the woods they were diging it up. From what they showed us I don't think it is a bunker but maybe the hatch to a submarine or other kind of boat. Since Boone and Locke never told anyone hatch and nobody else knows about the numbers (or their significance by being cursed) it will be interesting to see how these two lines intersect.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Why didn't Hurley ask the French lady if she new Sam?


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## MassD (Sep 19, 2002)

Keith_R90210 said:


> ok, I apologize for my ignorance but this goes over my head, how is 42 easy to analyze in comparison to the other numbers?


Read Douglas Adams' "Hitchhickers' Guide to the Galaxy"..... its all explained there.


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## miscellaneous (Oct 28, 2004)

danplaysbass said:


> I didn't initially catch that Locke could work in HUGOs box company. People on this board are sharp. Also how was it that Locke knew it was Claire's birthday. It is not coincidental that he just happened to be making a cradle.....


Don't think I agree - that's what you do if you're a thoughtful person and you are sharing a remote island with a pregnant woman. No coincidence there.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

pmyers said:


> Why didn't Hurley ask the French lady if she new Sam?


Why didn't Hurley tie the woman up and beat lots more information out of her!! Like who was Ethan, what is the monster, when is JJ Abrams gonna let us in on a secret! That whole scene made me mad. Oh, there is a radio tower...great. HOW DID IT GET THERE?!


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## brott (Feb 23, 2001)

4, 8, 15, 16, 23, 42

Maybe totally off the wall, but when I see these numbers, I keep getting the phrase:

for 815, 16 .. Then I lose it on the 23, 42 .. I want to say "years" in this spot, but I cannot make it work.

The other thing that these numbers gave us was our first true link to the outside world. We now know that these numbers were heard from the island 16 years ago .. In addition, we know that Roussou(sp?) changed the message (and probably reset the counter) at that time. So, the message has been running for longer than the original 16 years that we suspected.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

Can someone post a pic of the capsule with the numbers shown at the end?


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

mask2343 said:


> Can someone post a pic of the capsule with the numbers shown at the end?


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

mask2343 said:


> Can someone post a pic of the capsule with the numbers shown at the end?


I would have called it a bunker, not a capsule...


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## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

Amnesia said:


> I would have called it a bunker, not a capsule...


So the real question is does this capsule/bunker hold the key to the island and how do we get in it.


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

mask2343 said:


> Why didn't Hurley tie the woman up and beat lots more information out of her!! Like who was Ethan, what is the monster, when is JJ Abrams gonna let us in on a secret! That whole scene made me mad. Oh, there is a radio tower...great. HOW DID IT GET THERE?!


Well, we don't know what else he might've asked or been told. We don't know he didn't feel he could come back anytime. We don't know she's any more clued in even after 16 years than the more recent survivors.


----------



## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

dswallow said:


> Well, we don't know what else he might've asked or been told. We don't know he didn't feel he could come back anytime. We don't know she's any more clued in even after 16 years than the more recent survivors.


We also know that she moved her camp so where is her new camp?

Oh the other thing I keep on forgetting to mention.....they found the power cable. They have twice followed it into the woods but never gone to the sea. there might be something out there just offshore. Plus when they found where it went into the ground I would have started digging right there.....


----------



## MassD (Sep 19, 2002)

The way I see it, Hurley was overcome with relief. He just realized that there was some kind of external force driving his fortune... The biggest question in his life was answered and he now knows that it wasn't his fault. I can see how he might not have pushed the French Lady for more information.


----------



## jwjody (Dec 7, 2002)

I assumed that the listening post that Sam and Lenny were at is the island. But that would have put them there during the time of the French Lady (she's been there for 16 years, and it was 4 years ago that the guys left the island right?). But that would explain why a radio tower is on the island and perhaps why there is a bunker.

Weren't a lot of nuclear bombs tested on Pacific atolls?

Is that Lost season finale thread real spoilers? Or possible spoilers?

J


----------



## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

jwjody said:


> I assumed that the listening post that Sam and Lenny were at is the island. But that would have put them there during the time of the French Lady (she's been there for 16 years, and it was 4 years ago that the guys left the island right?). But that would explain why a radio tower is on the island and perhaps why there is a bunker.
> 
> Weren't a lot of nuclear bombs tested on Pacific atolls?
> 
> ...


ya we do test a lot on pacific islands. We dont do nuclear stuff but we test the reentry vehicles (A nuclear delivery system) and their accuracy. Think the bomb minus the bomb.


----------



## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

danplaysbass said:


> ...Oh the other thing I keep on forgetting to mention.....they found the power cable. They have twice followed it into the woods but never gone to the sea. there might be something out there just offshore. Plus when they found where it went into the ground I would have started digging right there.....


Don't even get me started on that power cable! I swear, the people just have no curiosity!


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

MassD said:


> The way I see it, Hurley was overcome with relief. He just realized that there was some kind of external force driving his fortune... The biggest question in his life was answered and he now knows that it wasn't his fault. I can see how he might not have pushed the French Lady for more information.


And as has been noted, we don't know what happened between them after the camera cut away. He may have beaten her to within an inch or her life. He may have murdered her. They may have played D&D. Or, more likely, she recognized him as somebody who's as nuts as she is, and spilled her guts gladly.


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

hefe said:


>


Darn, I was hoping they were situated in a manner that meant something, like a date. Just another mystery.


----------



## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

Best. Episode. Yet. ??

Maybe, I dunno?

There are so many that are awesome!

I caught the "Box company in Tustin" as being the one Locke worked for immediately. The wording and voice inflection of the way the financial advisor described the company was identical to how Locke described it to boone.

Locke: "I worked for a box company [pause], yeah, we made boxes..."

Financial advisor: "Your box company in Tustin is way up. [pause], yeah, they make boxes... people need boxes..."

I'm still not sure that cable is a power cable. It seems to have only one "conductor" for one thing. I think it may be some kind of tether. Of course, that still doesn't explain where the power comes from.

"She says 'hey'". Yep, absolutely priceless line, beautifully delivered.


----------



## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Fish Man said:


> ...I'm still not sure that cable is a power cable. It seems to have only one "conductor" for one thing. I think it may be some kind of tether. Of course, that still doesn't explain where the power comes from...


Well, it definately has some type of rubberized coating on it which makes me think it's not some kind of tether cable which I would assume would just look like twisted steel.


----------



## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

pmyers said:


> Well, it definately has some type of rubberized coating on it which makes me think it's not some kind of tether cable which I would assume would just look like twisted steel.


I use stuff like that all the time at work. Its just a big outer shell with multiple conductors inside. If you're thinking that it is like your average roadside powerline......well lets just say you wouldn't want to touch it like they were if it were live.


----------



## Cboath (Jun 22, 2004)

danplaysbass said:


> We also know that she moved her camp so where is her new camp?
> 
> Oh the other thing I keep on forgetting to mention.....they found the power cable. They have twice followed it into the woods but never gone to the sea. there might be something out there just offshore. Plus when they found where it went into the ground I would have started digging right there.....


I was wondering why nobody followed it into the water too. Hurley was on a mission this time, but they could have come back to it any time before this.

I also think that Locke somehow knew it was Claires birthday. Of course it is the nice thing to do, but why not yesterday or tomorrow. He knew.


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

Geez guys, even castaways need cable. They don't want to miss Ameican Idol.


----------



## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

Ha ha.

I hope they're getting better rates than I am!!! Comcast Sucks!!!


----------



## Jim__Clark (Nov 5, 2003)

The numbers on the bunker, capsule, hatch, look like the registration numbers on the aft of a boat hull. I don' think so but could be a buried hull with a entrance hatch.

The repeating radio transmission with numbers is a take off on the numbers stations that abound on HF radio. Here is a link to numbers station information.

http://home.freeuk.com/spook007/

Jim


----------



## chewbaccad (Feb 16, 2005)

Definitely a candidate for best episode yet...

So nice of ABC to give us a number puzzle and then several weeks to figure it out!! I want more now!

Claire is not the sharpest knife in the drawer...


----------



## bdlucas (Feb 15, 2004)

Fish Man said:


> I caught the "Box company in Tustin" as being the one Locke worked for immediately. The wording and voice inflection of the way the financial advisor described the company was identical to how Locke described it to boone.
> 
> Locke: "I worked for a box company [pause], yeah, we made boxes..."
> 
> Financial advisor: "Your box company in Tustin is way up. [pause], yeah, they make boxes... people need boxes..."


OK, it's a long shot - but could the "boxes" be coffins? As in "people need coffins", eventually? This would tie them both in some way to the empty coffin...


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Fish Man said:


> ...The wording and voice inflection of the way the financial advisor described the company was identical to how Locke described it to boone.
> 
> Locke: "I worked for a box company [pause], yeah, we made boxes..."
> 
> Financial advisor: "Your box company in Tustin is way up. [pause], yeah, they make boxes... people need boxes..."


Well, not exactly..Did he make an explanation to another person?


> BOONE: What do you do in the real world, Mr. Locke?
> 
> LOCKE: I was a ... regional collections supervisor for a box company.
> 
> ...


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

It's funny how Hurley was considered "crazy" in the states. He is the most sane one on the island now. His line about the monster and how it is strange that nobody is looking for it (or any other answers) was great. It is what most of us viewers are asking too.

And Claire mentioned her pregnancy length. I'm tellin you, the writers read this message board!


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

bdlucas said:


> OK, it's a long shot - but could the "boxes" be coffins? As in "people need coffins", eventually? This would tie them both in some way to the empty coffin...


Sure, could be...I posted a "box list" a bit a few pages back...linked for those just joining...http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=2661079&&#post2661079


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

hefe said:


> Boxes:
> Jack's father (casket)
> Kate's safe deposit box
> Rousseau's music box
> ...


You forgot the briefcase with the guns and the capsule/bunker. Maybe even backgammon box. Stretches, but maybe relevant.


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

Where is the "black box" from the aircraft?


----------



## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

mask2343 said:


> You forgot the briefcase with the guns and the capsule/bunker...


And apparently so did Jack! Why wouldn't he have brought a gun or two with them on their trip?


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

mask2343 said:


> You forgot the briefcase with the guns and the capsule/bunker. Maybe even backgammon box. Stretches, but maybe relevant.


I did consider the first two, I wasn't sure that fit the theme, but they may.
And the black box is a good one!


----------



## Paperboy2003 (Mar 30, 2004)

Hate to nitpick, but people who are worth 156 mil don't fly commercial.

Just thought I'd throw that out there....Loved the episode though


----------



## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Paperboy2003 said:


> Hate to nitpick, but people who are worth 156 mil don't fly commercial.
> 
> Just thought I'd throw that out there....Loved the episode though


well he was new to money...plus he could have been in first class


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

Or he couldn't fit into a Learjet. G-5 should have been good though.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

jwjody said:


> I assumed that the listening post that Sam and Lenny were at is the island. But that would have put them there during the time of the French Lady (she's been there for 16 years, and it was 4 years ago that the guys left the island right?). But that would explain why a radio tower is on the island and perhaps why there is a bunker.
> 
> Weren't a lot of nuclear bombs tested on Pacific atolls?
> 
> ...


I don't think so... it seemed apparent to me that they were on the mainland and had picked up the transmission from the island. They said it was very faint. The lady also mentioned the reason why they were at the post which indicated to me that it was not in the middle of nowhere.


----------



## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

mask2343 said:


> Or he couldn't fit into a Learjet. G-5 should have been good though.


Thats priceless!!!!!!

I didn't think about the fact the he might not be flying commercial. There could be many reasons he was flying commercial.

I think you usually have to be worth slightly more than him to have your own plane and crew. Think of how much of his money is tied up in investments and stocks. He doesn't have $156 million in fluid cash....


----------



## getbak (Oct 8, 2004)

He may be worth $156 million, but I don't think he had embraced his "good fortune" enough to think about not flying a commercial flight.


The thing I wondered about though, if he thinks the numbers are cursed, why would he have flown on Flight #815? Surely there must have been other flights available.

I wonder if he was hoping for the plane to go down?


----------



## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

hefe said:


> Well, not exactly..Did he make an explanation to another person?


The entire line was, in fact:



> LOCKE: I was a ... regional collections supervisor for a box company [pause] yeah, we made boxes. (The part after the pause delivered very much like the financial advisor saying, "yeah, they make boxes.")
> 
> BOONE: (scoffs) Yeah, right.





bdlucas said:


> OK, it's a long shot - but could the "boxes" be coffins? As in "people need coffins", eventually? This would tie them both in some way to the empty coffin...


That thought crossed my mind to as I watched the episode.

Who knows?


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

bdlucas said:


> OK, it's a long shot - but could the "boxes" be coffins? As in "people need coffins", eventually? This would tie them both in some way to the empty coffin...


You're suggesting that Locke and the broker were both talking about the same company and that they both referred to it as a "box company" instead of a "coffin company"?

Sounds unlikely.


----------



## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

I don't think the boxes are coffins. I mean not everyone get s a coffin. Some are creamated....


----------



## cl44 (May 11, 2004)

4-8-15-16-23-42
15+16+23=54
54-8-4=42


----------



## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

Where is John Nash when you need him.....


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

cl44 said:


> 4-8-15-16-23-42
> 15+16+23=54
> 54-8-4=42


If we're going down the "Hichhiker's Guide to the Galaxy Route" the capsule show us that white mice run the island and are using it to build other islands and find the meaning of life.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Paperboy2003 said:


> Hate to nitpick, but people who are worth 156 mil don't fly commercial.
> 
> Just thought I'd throw that out there....Loved the episode though


They do if they want to continue to be worth $156 mil for very long.

Seriously though, it probably cost him $1000 or less to fly round trip to Australia on Oceanic. I would probably cost tens or hundreds of thousands to fly a private jet. Not really any reason to do that for one person. However, I do question why he was in coach. Isn't the section of the plane that all the survivors were sitting in the middle? Didn't we see Hurley in one of the crash flashbacks sitting by the other characters? Would he even fit in a coach seat?


----------



## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

Amnesia said:


> You're suggesting that Locke and the broker were both talking about the same company and that they both referred to it as a "box company" instead of a "coffin company"?
> 
> Sounds unlikely.


I agree. Why would either Locke of the Financial adviser be using a euphemism, they'd have just said "casket company".

However, "boxes" of whatever type appear to be a recurring theme on the show.

And to bring the issue completely down to earth:

I've actually seen articles about how the production of cardboard shipping boxes has increased by many times over the last 10 years or so as internet shopping becomes more and more popular. Locke probably worked for (and Hurley owned majority share in) a company that made cardboard shipping boxes. As "unsexy" as this business sounds, it is indeed very lucrative and profitable.


----------



## 5thcrewman (Sep 23, 2003)

devdogaz said:


> ...Seriously though, it probably cost him $1000 or less to fly round trip to Australia on Oceanic. I would probably cost tens or hundreds of thousands to fly a private jet. Not really any reason to do that for one person. However, I do question why he was in coach. Isn't the section of the plane that all the survivors were sitting in the middle? Didn't we see Hurley in one of the crash flashbacks sitting by the other characters? Would he even fit in a coach seat?


Even *2* Coach seats would be cheaper than First Class and who thinks Oceanic wouldn't have charged Hurley for 2 seats?

BIG QUESTION FOR SCREEN CAPPERS:
When Hurley was driving his H*2* he was wearing some bling around his neck. *2* necklaces of what appeared to be Chinese symbols- anyone with a translation?


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Amnesia said:


> You're suggesting that Locke and the broker were both talking about the same company and that they both referred to it as a "box company" instead of a "coffin company"?
> 
> Sounds unlikely.


True, we're throwing out all kinds of possible links, but the one sure thing is that they are talking about the same company. Both are box companies, both are in Tustin...


----------



## chipsndip (Jul 8, 2002)

The numbers website is up now, and it is definitely alias related. Not too much there yet, and the page source doesn't reveal anything interesting, except that the image name is 4815162342pi.jpg . Is that PI, the magic number? Or does it stand for something? Hmm.

Hurley is a great scene stealer - it was great to see his whole episode. My favorite line (after a three second pause)... "Dude - is someone shooting at us?". 

-Sean


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Fish Man said:


> The entire line was, in fact:
> 
> Well shame on me for assuming that the transcript I've got bookmarked is complete!  Now I'll have to watch that again.


----------



## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

chipsndip said:


> Is that PI, the magic number? Or does it stand for something? Hmm.


No that is not the mathematical PI.

pi = 3.1415........this goes on for a long time..........


----------



## chipsndip (Jul 8, 2002)

Maybe that sequence in contained within the PI sequence somewhere... 

Also, forgot to mention - with all the numbers symbolism - Locke has theoretically been paralyzed for 4 years - in Walkabout he says "I've been living with it for four years".

-Sean


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

5thcrewman said:


> Even *2*
> BIG QUESTION FOR SCREEN CAPPERS:
> When Hurley was driving his H*2* he was wearing some bling around his neck. *2* necklaces of what appeared to be Chinese symbols- anyone with a translation?


Or Korean??? Holee, where are you?!
Click to enlarge
 

He also had a nice watch that Jin would be jealous of..


----------



## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Damn you guys are good! I bet that symbol turns out to have some meaning.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

chipsndip said:


> Maybe that sequence in contained within the PI sequence somewhere...
> 
> Also, forgot to mention - with all the numbers symbolism - Locke has theoretically been paralyzed for 4 years - in Walkabout he says "I've been living with it for four years".
> 
> -Sean


Oh, yeah...great catch!


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

danplaysbass said:


> pi = 3.1415........this goes on for a long time..........


A very, very long time...


----------



## chipsndip (Jul 8, 2002)

Update: page source now reveals meta keywords, including

spoiler?? I don't know how to do spoiler tags... :

Number stations. Quote from Wiki: "Numbers stations appear and disappear continuously, although some stick to regular schedules, and their overall activity has increased slightly since the early 1990s. It has been speculated that these stations operate as a simple and foolproof method for government agencies to communicate with spies "in the field", using the transmitted codes as a one-time pad cryptosystem. "

-Sean


----------



## JoeBarbs (Dec 1, 2003)

The one thing that I really don't understand is how is Hurley not losing any weight?!?!?!?! Its been a month now that they have been on this island, no? If the guy playing Hurley was truly a good actor, he would be sheding the pounds.


----------



## jerobi (Sep 28, 2000)

I don't think pi is involved. Here's the url of that image:

http://img181.exs.cx:81/img181/3195/48151623423pi.jpg

Some quick Google scans show that exs.cx is a generic image hosting site. The subdirectories seem normal for the other images it hosts, so no clues there. I noticed a lot of images seem to have a random 2-character ending. Not all of them as a rule, but a lot.


----------



## 5thcrewman (Sep 23, 2003)

hefe said:


> Or Korean??? Holee, where are you?!
> Click to enlarge
> 
> 
> He also had a nice watch that Jin would be jealous of..


There was a second medallion below the one seen here. I think you can see both of them better as he's helping his mom out of the Hummer.

NEXT QUESTIONS:
Number on Hurley's jersey? Any significance to the letter 'G' on the collar of the shirt worn under the jersey?


----------



## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

JoeBarbs said:


> The one thing that I really don't understand is how is Hurley not losing any weight?!?!?!?! Its been a month now that they have been on this island, no? If the guy playing Hurley was truly a good actor, he would be sheding the pounds.


Can we just please let this go.....I guess if the girl who plays Claire was truly a good actress she would be gaining weight instead of looking like a 95 pound stick with a bowling ball under her shirt?


----------



## jerobi (Sep 28, 2000)

Some Whois info. Looks like this was reg'd late last night and someone is protecting the registration info. So late and presumably after the time the show airedin fact, that it makes me wonder if this is just a quick-thinking fan that likes to mess with people. 

Domain name: 4815162342.COM

Registrant Contact:
RegisterFly.com - Ref# 16209516
Whois Protection Service - ProtectFly.com ([email protected])
+1.2122952121
Fax: +1.2122952153
230 Park Avenue
Suite 864
New York, NY 10169
US

Administrative Contact:
RegisterFly.com - Ref# 16209516
Whois Protection Service - ProtectFly.com ([email protected])
+1.2122952121
Fax: +1.2122952153
230 Park Avenue
Suite 864
New York, NY 10169
US

Technical Contact:
RegisterFly.com - Ref# 16209516
Whois Protection Service - ProtectFly.com ([email protected])
+1.2122952121
Fax: +1.2122952153
230 Park Avenue
Suite 864
New York, NY 10169
US

Billing Contact:
RegisterFly.com - Ref# 16209516
Whois Protection Service - ProtectFly.com ([email protected])
+1.2122952121
Fax: +1.2122952153
230 Park Avenue
Suite 864
New York, NY 10169
US

Status: Active

Name Servers:
NS.PRO-DNS.NET
NS1.PRO-DNS.NET

Creation date: 02 Mar 2005 21:28:27
Expiration date: 02 Mar 2006 21:28:27


----------



## chipsndip (Jul 8, 2002)

New update ... I think they're spying on us!! Source code now reads...

"<! --
There are no secrets hidden in the source code. Feel free to look, but, anything you find will only be a coincidence.
-->"

-Sean


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

Pi not involved

http://www.angio.net/pi/bigpi.cgi?UsrQuery=4815162342


----------



## jerobi (Sep 28, 2000)

jerobi said:


> I don't think pi is involved. Here's the url of that image:
> 
> http://img181.exs.cx:81/img181/3195/48151623423pi.jpg


hey, I just noticed that there is an extra 3 at the end. There wasn't when someone mentioned it earlier. Maybe this guy is messing with the images?


----------



## JoeBarbs (Dec 1, 2003)

pmyers said:


> Can we just please let this go.....I guess if the girl who plays Claire was truly a good actress she would be gaining weight instead of looking like a 95 pound stick with a bowling ball under her shirt?


Now why would she be gaining weight? other than in her belly? Oh thats right, because of all those late night urges for pickles and ice cream. She keeps running out to that Ben & Jerry's open 24 hrs a day on the north side of the island


----------



## jerobi (Sep 28, 2000)

```
<meta name="keywords" content="LOST, Lost TV, 4815162342, 4, 8, 15, 16, 23, 42, radio transmissions, number stations, the hatch, lost secrets, lost episodes, abc lost, Jack, Kate, Charlie, Hurley, Boone, Shannon, Michael, Walt, Sayid, Sawyer, Locke, Jin, Sun, Claire, Ethan, J.J. Abrams, Damon Lindelof">
```
Ok, I'm officially writing it off. Now there are meta tags in there. Give it a week or two once enough people start linking to it and it will be full of Google Adwords ads. This is just someone who registered the site after it aired and is having fun with it. Enjoy the magic if you want, but it's clue value is zero to me.


----------



## Rangers4me (May 18, 2001)

The chinese character around his neck is "fu," meaning fortune, happiness.


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

My favorite thing about this episode is that Walt has repeatedly talked about how much money Hurley owes him from backgammon. Last week, Walt told Locke Hurley owed $83,000.

I'd always assumed it was just a number pulled from the air because no way would Hurley be good for it. Now we know that's pocket change to him.


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

Okay, now my gripe about recent episodes: the raft. Why are some of the survivors so worried about who will get to be on the raft? In particular, why would Sawyer buy a place on the raft? I don't see the benefit.

Assuming the raft makes it to civilization, I would expect the rafters to tell the authorities that there are other survivors on the island, and a rescue party would be sent out to the right location.

For that matter, it has bothered me that Michael would put Walt's life at more jeopardy taking him out on the ocean, when if Michael could successfully get to civilization, he could send someoen back for his son. And if the raft trip failed, well, then at least he hasn't killed his kid too.


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

JoeBarbs said:


> Now why would she be gaining weight? other than in her belly? Oh thats right, because of all those late night urges for pickles and ice cream. She keeps running out to that Ben & Jerry's open 24 hrs a day on the north side of the island


Then we'd have the whole endless "Emilie DeRaven -- Fat!" thread to contend with for weeks on end.


----------



## JoeBarbs (Dec 1, 2003)

mqpickles said:


> Okay, now my gripe about recent episodes: the raft. Why are some of the survivors so worried about who will get to be on the raft? In particular, why would Sawyer buy a place on the raft? I don't see the benefit.
> 
> Assuming the raft makes it to civilization, I would expect the rafters to tell the authorities that there are other survivors on the island, and a rescue party would be sent out to the right location.
> 
> For that matter, it has bothered me that Michael would put Walt's life at more jeopardy taking him out on the ocean, when if Michael could successfully get to civilization, he could send someoen back for his son. And if the raft trip failed, well, then at least he hasn't killed his kid too.


who's to say that the island is any safer than being on the raft? You've seen that monster thing. You know they aren't alone.

There best bet is to put Hurley on the raft alone. We all know that good things happen to him, while bad things happen to those around him.


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

JoeBarbs said:


> There best bet is to put Hurley on the raft alone. We all know that good things happen to him, while bad things happen to those around him.


 Good idea!
We know he is safe on rickety, not-up-to code structures.
And maybe he'd lose some weight on the trip.


----------



## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

mqpickles said:


> Okay, now my gripe about recent episodes: the raft. Why are some of the survivors so worried about who will get to be on the raft? In particular, why would Sawyer buy a place on the raft? I don't see the benefit.
> 
> Assuming the raft makes it to civilization, I would expect the rafters to tell the authorities that there are other survivors on the island, and a rescue party would be sent out to the right location.
> 
> For that matter, it has bothered me that Michael would put Walt's life at more jeopardy taking him out on the ocean, when if Michael could successfully get to civilization, he could send someoen back for his son. And if the raft trip failed, well, then at least he hasn't killed his kid too.


I totally agree. Unless that "monster" starts killing lots of people, I'd rather stay on the island and hope that the people who go in the raft find help and send it back. I'd say your chances for survival are much better on the island than on the raft.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

pmyers said:


> I totally agree. Unless that "monster" starts killing lots of people, I'd rather stay on the island and hope that the people who go in the raft find help and send it back. I'd say your chances for survival are much better on the island than on the raft.


Like Hurley said, maybe it's just a pissed off giraffe. 

But would you really want Hurley's bad luck on the rescue raft? Everyone needs that to succeed.


----------



## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

JoeBarbs said:


> The one thing that I really don't understand is how is Hurley not losing any weight?!?!?!?! Its been a month now that they have been on this island, no? If the guy playing Hurley was truly a good actor, he would be sheding the pounds.


Hurley had a conversation with someone early on. They asked why he wasn't losing weight. He said he was. It was 20 lbs. or something like that. He said it was tough to notice because he was so big to begin with. 20 lbs. on somebody that big would be nothing. 20 lbs. on someone like me (155 lbs) would be very noticable.


----------



## JoeBarbs (Dec 1, 2003)

PJO1966 said:


> Hurley had a conversation with someone early on. They asked why he wasn't losing weight. He said he was. It was 20 lbs. or something like that. He said it was tough to notice because he was so big to begin with. 20 lbs. on somebody that big would be nothing. 20 lbs. on someone like me (155 lbs) would be very noticable.


So are you saying his weight loss is equivalent to throwing a chair off the Titanic?

Also, how the hell would he possibly know if he lost 20 pounds? I haven't seen any scales on the island.


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

mqpickles said:


> Assuming the raft makes it to civilization, I would expect the rafters to tell the authorities that there are other survivors on *the island*, and a rescue party would be sent out to the right location.


You make it sound as if they knew where the island was.

Lets say the raft travels for a week before running into a ship. The people on the raft are saved, but now the authorities have to try to figure out where the island is.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

Amnesia said:


> You make it sound as if they knew where the island was.
> 
> Lets say the raft travels for a week before running into a ship. The people on the raft are saved, but now the authorities have to try to figure out where the island is.


When they KNOW there are survivors out there, they will search until they find them. There is only so much land on earth...if they ARE on earth.


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

Rangers4me said:


> The chinese character around his neck is "fu," meaning fortune, happiness.


You mean "fortune" as in "luck"? What about bad luck? Is that the same character?


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

mask2343 said:


> When they KNOW there are survivors out there, they will search until they find them.


Sure, but look how long it took for the survivors of _The Minnow_ to be rescued...


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## JoeBarbs (Dec 1, 2003)

Amnesia said:


> You make it sound as if they knew where the island was.
> 
> Lets say the raft travels for a week before running into a ship. The people on the raft are saved, but now the authorities have to try to figure out where the island is.


I thought of that also. But at least they would then know that there are survivors on a island. up to this point for all they know is that the plane went down in the middle of the ocean.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

Amnesia said:


> Sure, but look how long it took for the survivors of _The Minnow_ to be rescued...


Ah, but they WERE rescued!


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## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

Amnesia said:


> You make it sound as if they knew where the island was.
> 
> Lets say the raft travels for a week before running into a ship. The people on the raft are saved, but now the authorities have to try to figure out where the island is.


 Well, from the earliest episodes, we know they were 1000 miles off course when they crashed. That's what the pilot said. I don't remember if they said 1000 miles in which direction, but even if not, it narrows things down.


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## Paperboy2003 (Mar 30, 2004)

mqpickles said:


> My favorite thing about this episode is that Walt has repeatedly talked about how much money Hurley owes him from backgammon. Last week, Walt told Locke Hurley owed $83,000.
> 
> I'd always assumed it was just a number pulled from the air because no way would Hurley be good for it. Now we know that's pocket change to him.


From last weeks thread:



Paperboy2003 said:


> A slight lead (I thought) into next week's episode is when Walt says he's been playing backgammon and that Hurley owes him $83,000. With his lottery (or whatever) winnings, I bet we find out he can pay that debt easily.


great minds think alike....


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## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

Good call, Paperboy.


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

JoeBarbs said:


> So are you saying his weight loss is equivalent to throwing a chair off the Titanic?
> 
> Also, how the hell would he possibly know if he lost 20 pounds? I haven't seen any scales on the island.


Back then chairs probably weighed more than 20 pounds; things were built with real solid stuff, ya know.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

dswallow said:


> Back then chairs probably weighed more than 20 pounds; things were built with real solid stuff, ya know.


Yeah, that Titanic was REAL solid.


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

mask2343 said:


> Yeah, that Titanic was REAL solid.


Even solid things can break.


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## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

Based on the wikipedia site, I'm going to guess that the finding nemo song preceded each broadcast.

20 lbs a month is amazing weight loss. I doubt many people here could lose that weight legitimately (i.e. not sweating out all your water or taking laxatives). I thought he said he lost inches, not specific weight. He also is likely building muscle which tends to offset fat loss early on.

So maybe the station was originally an encoded spy broadcast but the numbers ala Pi (the movie, not the number) had some secret power that the original broadcasters were not aware of. As a result, things are going wrong now. The hatch will thus reveal some sort of spy type stuff and they will discover that the spies who manned the station had some fortune or misfortune.

I hope there is no alias tie in. That would be unbelievably lame unless executed flawlessly.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

TAsunder said:


> I hope there is no alias tie in. That would be unbelievably lame unless executed flawlessly.


Do you mean like the capsule being the Rimbaldi device? That would be lame. :down:


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## emandbri (Jul 5, 2004)

Paperboy2003 said:


> Hate to nitpick, but people who are worth 156 mil don't fly commercial.
> 
> Just thought I'd throw that out there....Loved the episode though


He also could afford more then a $40 cd player (I have the same one)! lol

Emily


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## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

Amnesia said:


> You make it sound as if they knew where the island was.
> 
> Lets say the raft travels for a week before running into a ship. The people on the raft are saved, but now the authorities have to try to figure out where the island is.


There's also the French woman's transmission. If they know what frequency it's on, they should be able to zero in on it.


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## goman (Dec 16, 2004)

Fish Man said:


> I agree. Why would either Locke of the Financial adviser be using a euphemism, they'd have just said "casket company".
> 
> However, "boxes" of whatever type appear to be a recurring theme on the show.
> 
> ...


Actually I watched a PBS program on Walmart and while this point is not specifically about Walmart, they were interviewing someone from the shipping yards in Long Beach/San Pedro and the US #1 export to China is guess what.. recycled cardboard boxes. We send China empty cardboard boxes and they fill them up with Tivos!


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## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

TAsunder said:


> 20 lbs a month is amazing weight loss. I doubt many people here could lose that weight legitimately (i.e. not sweating out all your water or taking laxatives).


Last year I lost 25 lbs. in 2 months (thank you Dr. Atkins) and I wasn't that big to begin with. Living on a high protein diet (lots of fish and boar meat), no processed sugar (fresh fruit and veggies) is very Atkins. 20 lbs. in one month for someone his size is not unheard of.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

PJO1966 said:


> Hurley had a conversation with someone early on. They asked why he wasn't losing weight. He said he was. It was 20 lbs. or something like that. He said it was tough to notice because he was so big to begin with. 20 lbs. on somebody that big would be nothing. 20 lbs. on someone like me (155 lbs) would be very noticable.


He never gave an actual weight. Here is the converastion with Charlie:


> (Charlie and Hurley walk through the jungle. Hurley's carrying some luggage
> back to the caves.)
> HURLEY: Food from the plane's been gone over a week, Dude.
> CHARLIE: What, no secret stash for emergencies? You and jack have got a bunch of stuff in that cave.
> ...


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## Kamakzie (Jan 8, 2004)

Would you guys say Hurley is somewhere between 350-400 pounds?


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## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

PJO1966 said:


> Last year I lost 25 lbs. in 2 months (thank you Dr. Atkins) and I wasn't that big to begin with. Living on a high protein diet (lots of fish and boar meat), no processed sugar (fresh fruit and veggies) is very Atkins. 20 lbs. in one month for someone his size is not unheard of.


I agree but people seem to be expecting him to be a twig. 20lbs is at the high end of what could be expected in a month. I said amazing not unbelievable. 100lbs would be outrageous and unhealthy.


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## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

Thanks for the clarification... I remembered the gist of that conversation. I knew I could count on someone here for details!


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

Except for the initial peanut butter scenes and Hurley's reluctance to eat food Jin had gathered, I don't really recall anyone moaning about being hungry; seems like they aren't eating too poorly so far.


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## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

I imagine if the survivors managed to make it back to the US our government could use satellite imagery to help in the search (if they can use satellites to track to warm bodies in a building's basement like on 24 surely they could do this).

If/when they actually get this raft off the island they better have a great plan in place to either navigate or coordinate with a search....


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Here's another thought that just popped into my head...

The box factory that Hurley acquired...could Locke have been injured at the factory when Hurley and his luck came along? But wait, Locke said he had been dealing with his condition for 4 years. (Another 4) I don't think Hurley had the money that long ago, especially since there was what seemed like such a recent story on Hurley on Korean TV.

Oh, well...my brain is working overtime...


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

hefe said:


> Here's another thought that just popped into my head...
> 
> The box factory that Hurley acquired...could Locke have been injured at the factory when Hurley and his luck came along? But wait, Locke said he had been dealing with his condition for 4 years. (Another 4) I don't think Hurley had the money that long ago, especially since there was what seemed like such a recent story on Hurley on Korean TV.
> 
> Oh, well...my brain is working overtime...


The story on TV wasn't too recent. Wasn't that on at the time that Jin got the puppy. And we know that the puppy grew up into a full sized dog before the crash. How fast do dogs grow...1-2 years?


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Kamakzie said:


> Would you guys say Hurley is somewhere between 350-400 pounds?


 He's 6-1 and 350 pounds.


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## TiVoSoFine (Mar 19, 2001)

Amnesia said:


> You mean "fortune" as in "luck"? What about bad luck? Is that the same character?


It means "good" fortune or luck.


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## MacThor (Feb 7, 2002)

hefe said:


> Here's another thought that just popped into my head...
> 
> The box factory that Hurley acquired...could Locke have been injured at the factory when Hurley and his luck came along? But wait, Locke said he had been dealing with his condition for 4 years. (Another 4) I don't think Hurley had the money that long ago, especially since there was what seemed like such a recent story on Hurley on Korean TV.
> 
> Oh, well...my brain is working overtime...


I thought the same thing.....Locke's condition happened when Hurley bought the company. The timeline did seem too short in the flashbacks, though. Specifically, driving the H2 in what seemed to be the first year after winning the lotto.

Hurley couldn't hit up Rousseau for some AAA's for his CD player?


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

emandbri said:


> He also could afford more then a $40 cd player (I have the same one)! lol
> 
> Emily


 We don't know that it's his CD player though. My guess is it's just something he found in the wreckage.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

mask2343 said:


> The story on TV wasn't too recent. Wasn't that on at the time that Jin got the puppy. And we know that the puppy grew up into a full sized dog before the crash. How fast do dogs grow...1-2 years?


Perhaps, but the time between the accountant telling him he had acquired a box factory, to the time he went to the mental hospital and then to Australia would have been less than 4 years. Probably more like a couple weeks.
(What's it come to? Now I'm debunking my own theories...)


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## jimborst (Aug 30, 2001)

hefe said:


> Here's another thought that just popped into my head...
> 
> The box factory that Hurley acquired...could Locke have been injured at the factory when Hurley and his luck came along? But wait, Locke said he had been dealing with his condition for 4 years. (Another 4) I don't think Hurley had the money that long ago, especially since there was what seemed like such a recent story on Hurley on Korean TV.
> 
> Oh, well...my brain is working overtime...


Hurley did have time to double his money, so the win must have been a while ago. Have we decided if Hurley was a patient with the guy that said the numbers over and over, or a worker?


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

hefe said:


> Here's another thought that just popped into my head...
> 
> The box factory that Hurley acquired...could Locke have been injured at the factory when Hurley and his luck came along? But wait, Locke said he had been dealing with his condition for 4 years. (Another 4) I don't think Hurley had the money that long ago, especially since there was what seemed like such a recent story on Hurley on Korean TV.
> 
> Oh, well...my brain is working overtime...


 When Hurley was about to tell Charlie his secret, just before they started getting shot at, Hurley said, "About a year ago..."

So I assume the lottery win happened about a year ago. That's enough time for Jin and Sun's puppy to grow and for her to learn english.


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## MitchO (Nov 7, 2003)

Kamakzie said:


> Would you guys say Hurley is somewhere between 350-400 pounds?


I have a friend who is 6'5" and 320, and he probably looks in a bit worse shape than Hurley.

I'd guess in the 310 range.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Dogs grow fast....I put about 6 months to a year between Hurley winning the lottery and the plane crash. Same time frame for Sun and Jin


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## ovr8ted (Feb 27, 2005)

Can we please stop obsessing about Hurley's weight? What about Jack's hair or Sayid's trimmed beard? C'mon people! (Leyton Hewett's voice there  )

Now, it seems to me that in order for the "Curse" to end, the tower must be destroyed, and no new people may come to the island. This, of course, means our castaways must end their days there. Are humans willing to sacrifice themselves for the good of everyone else? Sounds like a question an alien might ask.


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## dreamst8 (Oct 1, 2004)

4+15+23 = 42

8+16.......= 24

Hmmmm



Ever notice the 2 scratches on Jack's face are on only 1 side, his right side, but there are plenty of scenes where it is on the left side?? (The Premier Episode reveals this flaw...or does it)


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## MacThor (Feb 7, 2002)

Oh, I totally loved the "in-joke" when the accountant said "How could the Police Department mistake you for a drug dealer?" Kind of like the "paper company in Slough."

JJ said he saw Jorge playing the drug dealer in "Curb Your Enthusiasm" and wanted him for the part.


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## MacThor (Feb 7, 2002)

ovr8ted said:


> Can we please stop obsessing about Hurley's weight? What about Jack's hair or Sayid's trimmed beard? C'mon people! (Leyton Hewett's voice there  )


NO. Matthew Fox must be a terrible actor because Jack's hair hasn't grown.


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## mwhip (Jul 22, 2002)

"I can make it. I'm spry". 

I can actually relate for being a big guy I can move around pretty well.


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## digdug (Jan 13, 2004)

Jim__Clark said:


> The numbers on the bunker, capsule, hatch, look like the registration numbers on the aft of a boat hull. I don' think so but could be a buried hull with a entrance hatch.
> 
> The repeating radio transmission with numbers is a take off on the numbers stations that abound on HF radio. Here is a link to numbers station information.
> 
> ...


Very interesting. I did some digging and came up with a site where you can download and listen to Mp3 files of actual Numbers Station recordings from the last 20 years.

http://www.archive.org/audio/audio-...ed&PHPSESSID=adc7edd0a9905cf40aa7de434a3203ee


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## JETarpon (Jan 1, 2003)

devdogaz said:


> So I assume the lottery win happened about a year ago. That's enough time for Jin and Sun's puppy to grow and for her to learn english.


II think it would take a heck of a lot longer than a year for a puppy to learn english.


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## TivoDaddy (May 3, 2000)

emandbri said:


> He also could afford more then a $40 cd player (I have the same one)! lol
> 
> Emily


Has it been revealed that it was actually his CD player and not just one that he found amongst the scattered belongings?

Edit: to add that *devdogaz* already answered that.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

JETarpon said:


> II think it would take a heck of a lot longer than a year for a puppy to learn english.


   Boy I needed that laugh today.


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## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

I think we are looking too hard at the numbers. I assume that whoever originally broadcast those numbers knew or had seen the capsule/bunker with the numbers on it. It could just be a serial number of some sort. Our government uses all kinds of numeric codes which represent various things...


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## JoeBarbs (Dec 1, 2003)

Kamakzie said:


> Would you guys say Hurley is somewhere between 350-400 pounds?


He's north of 400. My guess is 425


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## MitchO (Nov 7, 2003)

Just a note: the numbers' site has added a forum.


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## swinca (Jun 19, 2003)

5thcrewman said:


> There was a second medallion below the one seen here. I think you can see both of them better as he's helping his mom out of the Hummer.
> 
> NEXT QUESTIONS:
> Number on Hurley's jersey? Any significance to the letter 'G' on the collar of the shirt worn under the jersey?


The Jersey appears to be the Sean John label. The shirt under it could be G-Unit or another hip-hop clothing label.


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

danplaysbass said:


> I think we are looking too hard at the numbers. I assume that whoever originally broadcast those numbers knew or had seen the capsule/bunker with the numbers on it. It could just be a serial number of some sort. Our government uses all kinds of numeric codes which represent various things...


I agree. When we saw them at the end, I just figured that was the origin of the numbers. Obviously there are still some gaps to be filled in, but as far as where they came from or their ultimate significance, I don't think it goes beyond some sort of serial number on that capsule or whatever it is. Which, btw, it appears they've made some progress on digging around it... I think?

And I remembered right away about Locke working for a box company, but it amazes me that some of you guys caught the whole Tustin thing, pretty much confirming it was the same company.


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## LostMommy (Feb 22, 2005)

Okay, this is my first post here but I've been reading along for several weeks now. My observations (keeping in mind I missed 2-3 episodes in the beginning, but not the pilot):

About the hatch/bunker: Why doesn't Locke and Boone dig around it to see how extensive it is? If they can't open it, they could at least try and see if it is indeed a submarine, boat, or just a long, thin capsule/missile. I think perhaps the contents of this thing has some evil force/vibe, hence, the numbers carrying the badness with it?

About Hurley: Bad things only happen to those he CARES about. He may like his fellow castaways but I don't think they're too tight yet, not like a family member would be. And in an earlier episode didn't he say something like he was like a super hero, that nothing bad ever happened to him?

Okay, no one has asked yet, but what was the song Hurley was jamming to in his Hummer when his mom slugged him?

Why do children tend to go missing on Wednesday nights btwn 8-9? We missed the part between when Hurley sat down w/Lenny and asked about the numbers, then it jumped to him just getting across the bridge.

This was our first episode in HD (recorded, too busy putting the chitlins down during airing) and it was magnificent!

Hope you guys are still out there!
Sarah


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

I have never read "A Wrinkle in Time". Anyone care to tell us the significance of Sawyer reading that book?


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

LostMommy said:


> ...About Hurley: Bad things only happen to those he CARES about. He may like his fellow castaways but I don't think they're too tight yet, not like a family member would be. And in an earlier episode didn't he say something like he was like a super hero, that nothing bad ever happened to him?...


I don't believe that's true. Remember the guy falling/jumping off the building, or what we assume was going to happen to the guy changing the lightbulb?


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## Blackwolf (May 21, 2001)

MitchO said:


> Just a note: the numbers' site has added a forum.


This is exactly why I'm not convinced that this is by ABC. They already have an official board at The Fuselage.

I'm not going to "look for clues" on the site, since it's getting to be even more obvious that it's a fanmade site trying to capitalize on the Lost phenomenon.

Wish I had thought of that. :/


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## Talsin (Mar 4, 2002)

Not in the first 100 million digits at least...


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## Kevdog (Apr 18, 2001)

PJO1966 said:


> Last year I lost 25 lbs. in 2 months (thank you Dr. Atkins) and I wasn't that big to begin with. Living on a high protein diet (lots of fish and boar meat), no processed sugar (fresh fruit and veggies) is very Atkins. 20 lbs. in one month for someone his size is not unheard of.


Actually, Hurley in an earlier episode said he was eating mostly fruit. That's a very un-Atkins hi-carb diet. (Though probably healthier than the buckets of fried chicken he was eating before he won the lottery.)


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## Kevdog (Apr 18, 2001)

danplaysbass said:


> ya we do test a lot on pacific islands. We dont do nuclear stuff but we test the reentry vehicles (A nuclear delivery system) and their accuracy. Think the bomb minus the bomb.


Not to be too nit-picky, but we don't do nuclear tests in the Pacific *any more*. But from from 1946 to 1963 (when the atmospheric test ban treat took effect), the. U.S. conducted 106 atmospheric nuclear tests (think mushroom clound) on the Bikini, Enewetak and Johnston Atolls, all of which are in the rough vicinity of where Lost is set. We conducted below ground tests there more recently (through the early 1970s, I believe.) The British conducted a number of nuclear test explosions at Kiritimati and Malden islands in Kiribati from 1957 to 1958. France conducted below ground tests on the Mururoa Atoll from 1966 to 1974.

Sorry, can't help it. I'm a geek and a former history major.


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## tigger (Feb 17, 2002)

dswallow said:


> Except for the initial peanut butter scenes and Hurley's reluctance to eat food Jin had gathered, I don't really recall anyone moaning about being hungry; seems like they aren't eating too poorly so far.


Although at the end of this episode, when Charlie came up to Hurley at the fire, he made a joke that even though food was "scarce" (don't remember the exact wording, but that was the impression I remember), Hurley didn't have to eat his shirt....[because he was drying his shirt over the fire].


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## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

It's good carbs though... complex carbs.

I agree that it's not just people he cares about. 8 people he didn't know at all died in that fire, for example.


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## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

Kevdog said:


> Not to be too nit-picky, but we don't do nuclear tests in the Pacific *any more*. But from from 1946 to 1963 (when the atmospheric test ban treat took effect), the. U.S. conducted 106 atmospheric nuclear tests (think mushroom clound) on the Bikini, Enewetak and Johnston Atolls, all of which are in the rough vicinity of where Lost is set. We conducted below ground tests there more recently (through the early 1970s, I believe.) The British conducted a number of nuclear test explosions at Kiritimati and Malden islands in Kiribati from 1957 to 1958. France conducted below ground tests on the Mururoa Atoll from 1966 to 1974.
> 
> Sorry, can't help it. I'm a geek and a former history major.


Thanks for the update but the person you quoted also said we don't do them any more.


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## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

Kevdog said:


> Actually, Hurley in an earlier episode said he was eating mostly fruit. That's a very un-Atkins hi-carb diet. (Though probably healthier than the buckets of fried chicken he was eating before he won the lottery.)


That's a pretty common misconception about Atkins. fresh fruit plays a big part of Atkins. It's processed sugar that's to be avoided. With Atkins, most of your carbs come from fruit and vegetables.


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## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

ovr8ted said:


> Now, it seems to me that in order for the "Curse" to end, the tower must be destroyed, and no new people may come to the island. This, of course, means our castaways must end their days there. Are humans willing to sacrifice themselves for the good of everyone else? Sounds like a question an alien might ask.


There's no need for the tower to be destroyed. The French woman changed the broadcast 16 years ago. The numbers are lo longer being broadcast, it's now her distress call.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

PJO1966 said:


> There's no need for the tower to be destroyed. The French woman changed the broadcast 16 years ago. The numbers are lo longer being broadcast, it's now her distress call.


But it's drawing people to the island...where bad things happen to them.


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## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

mask2343 said:


> But it's drawing people to the island...where bad things happen to them.


Who did her message draw to the island? The survivors of the plane crash didn't pick it up until after the crash.


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## chipsndip (Jul 8, 2002)

mask2343 said:


> I have never read "A Wrinkle in Time". Anyone care to tell us the significance of Sawyer reading that book?


In "A Wrinkle In Time" a teen girl meets a trio of eccentric women who take her, her boyfriend, and her brother on an adventure to rescue her missing father. Her father worked for an un-named and un-known branch of the government as a physicist, and has been missing for quite some time. The "wrinkle" the title refers to is the ability to bend space/time like a wrinkle in a piece of paper - then you are able to travel from point A to point B via a very short distance, instead of the standard "long" route. The story also involves "the force of darkness" spreading and trying to consume the universe... Those are the things that immediately stand out as potentially relating to the current story.

-Sean


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## Kevdog (Apr 18, 2001)

PJO1966 said:


> That's a pretty common misconception about Atkins. fresh fruit plays a big part of Atkins. It's processed sugar that's to be avoided. With Atkins, most of your carbs come from fruit and vegetables.


Wasn't dissing Atkins, just pointing out that Hurley wasn't getting a lot of protein. Remember, he couldn't fish til Jin taught him how and Locke and Boone weren't catching any boar. An all fruit diet, despite being "good" sugar, is still a mostly sugar diet. Not the best thing for weight loss. Just sayin'...


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

PJO1966 said:


> Who did her message draw to the island? The survivors of the plane crash didn't pick it up until after the crash.


Well nobody yet (that we know). But the radio tower DID bring her group there. Not sure about Ethan's group (if it is a different group). I imagine if someone heard the numbers call, then someone can hear the distress signal. Just throwin ideas out there.


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## Donbadabon (Mar 5, 2002)

Amnesia said:


> You mean "fortune" as in "luck"? What about bad luck? Is that the same character?


I sent the photo to a Chinese co-worker, who doesn't know anything about the show, and they replied:

"It means good fortune, blessing"

Similar to what others have stated, but of course maybe the translation is slightly different


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## Redux (Oct 19, 2004)

JETarpon said:


> I think it would take a heck of a lot longer than a year for a puppy to learn english.


Leaving the court, having promised to teach the emperor's dog to speak within the year or have his previously-imposed death sentence immediately enforced, the scholar listened to his friend's lament: "But sir, you cannot teach a dog to speak, and so you will surely die."

The wise man replied "Ah, but for now, I live. And a year is a long time; who knows. The dog may die. The emperor may die. I may die. The dog may speak."


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## KRS (Jan 30, 2002)

I guess it was just me, but I thought that this episode of Lost was a bit over the top and had a different _jokey_ tone than the rest. His mother breaks her ankle, then the house catches on fire, _and then_ the cops falsely arrest him. <----a little over the top.

Maybe Hurley was on TV in Korea thanks to the odd press conference where his grandfather keeled over.

With $156,000,000+, wouldn't Hurley have gone ahead and gotten some liposuction?

So if Michael needs that lawnmower battery to create a signal*, then I guess all of their flares are used? Hindsight would say that they should have saved them for a passing ship or plane - that would be more valuable than triangulating a radio transmission.

* He will also need a good deal of engineering help creating a device to make the signal


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## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

Kevdog said:


> Wasn't dissing Atkins, just pointing out that Hurley wasn't getting a lot of protein. Remember, he couldn't fish til Jin taught him how and Locke and Boone weren't catching any boar. An all fruit diet, despite being "good" sugar, is still a mostly sugar diet. Not the best thing for weight loss. Just sayin'...


Sorry... I forgot he hadn't been eating fish. I was counting that as his primary source of food.


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## jwjody (Dec 7, 2002)

KRS said:


> So if Michael needs that lawnmower battery to create a signal*, then I guess all of their flares are used? Hindsight would say that they should have saved them for a passing ship or plane - that would be more valuable than triangulating a radio transmission.


Hindsight yeah. At the time they thought it was a way off the island. It wasn't until Sayid went looking did they find out it was fruitless. I think at that time they still expected to be rescued though.

J


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

LostMommy said:


> About Hurley: Bad things only happen to those he CARES about. He may like his fellow castaways but I don't think they're too tight yet, not like a family member would be. And in an earlier episode didn't he say something like he was like a super hero, that nothing bad ever happened to him?


8 people died in the fire at a sneaker factory he owned and didn't realize he even had.
The priest at his grandfather's funeral was struck by lightning.
A guy he didn't know jumped or fell off a building.

What Hurley said in an early episode was "Back home, I'm known as something of a warrior myself." No further elaboration.

Another tidbit on Hurley:

At the time he was taking the census, he also said, "We don't know who's living here, and who's still at the beach. I mean, we don't even know each other. My name isn't Hurley. It's Hugo Reyes. Hurley's just a nickname I have, all right? Why? I'm not telling. The point is, we got to find out who everyone is."

And another:

While playing backgammon (and losing) with Walt: "I didn't just start playing. I took 17th in a tournament once."


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

Maybe Hurley is an online-poker tournament player (user name = Hurley). There was a poker player in the World Series this year that had a background in Backgammon. He could have gotten addicted and was sent to the psych ward.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

mask2343 said:


> Maybe Hurley is an online-poker tournament player (user name = Hurley). There was a poker player in the World Series this year that had a background in Backgammon. He could have gotten addicted and was sent to the psych ward.


There's probably something game related in his past. He played backgammon in a tournament. His "buddy" at the cuckoo's nest was playing Connect Four by himself, maybe that's an obsession the guy has and he and Hurley used to play.


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## jradford (Dec 28, 2004)

The numbers are part of a code by Dan Brown that unlocks the key to selling 15 million books in 2 years.


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## JoeBarbs (Dec 1, 2003)

mask2343 said:


> There was a poker player in the World Series this year that had a background in Backgammon.


Paul Magriel?


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

JoeBarbs said:


> Paul Magriel?


There are a couple of top poker players who play high-stakes backgammon...


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## jwjody (Dec 7, 2002)

Amnesia said:


> There are a couple of top poker players who play high-stakes backgammon...


Staying off topic-- Gus Hanson is a world champion Backgammon player also.

J


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## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

Ok, I think this thread has run its course for today. I'll be signing off now. Probably. Ok maybe not. Definately not. Aww crap!!


----------



## GadgetFreak (Jun 3, 2002)

Paperboy2003 said:


> Hate to nitpick, but people who are worth 156 mil don't fly commercial.
> 
> Just thought I'd throw that out there....Loved the episode though


The founder of IKEA is a billionaire and he flies commercial..in coach. I remember reading that Sam Walton also flew coach.

For the life of me I can't figure out why (other than good PR).


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

danplaysbass said:


> Ok, I think this thread has run its course for today. I'll be signing off now. Probably. Ok maybe not. Definately not. Aww crap!!


Oh, you can't get away so easily...there's always another angle to mess with your head...

For example: Unless they are using a smaller town with the same name, the mental hospital (or whatever it actually is) is in Santa Rosa. It is on Hurley's Visitor's pass. That is about an hour north of the SF Bay area. So if Hurley/Hugo's family is in L.A., and he is living with his mom when he wins the lottery, what would he have been doing in a facility in northern CA? Just a job? Was he living in that area? Or was he a resident in that facility?


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## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

It seemed like they all but flat out stated that he had been a patient there.


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## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

TAsunder said:


> It seemed like they all but flat out stated that he had been a patient there.


Agreed. I'm going home now.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

> He's north of 400. My guess is 425





MitchO said:


> I have a friend who is 6'5" and 320, and he probably looks in a bit worse shape than Hurley.
> 
> I'd guess in the 310 range.


 No, really, he is 6-1 and 350 pounds.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

GadgetFreak said:


> The founder of IKEA is a billionaire and he flies commercial..in coach. I remember reading that Sam Walton also flew coach.
> 
> For the life of me I can't figure out why (other than good PR).


 An individual who is rich may not want to spend the kind of money required to fly private or in first class when coach gets you to the same place at the same time. It is this kind of mentality that got them rich in the first place.

As for the CEO of a company like Sam Walton, it's an example thing. Sam Walton ran a company that was famous for being frugal. They ask their employees to find ways to save money. They make employees double up on hotel rooms and stay in cheap hotels. How would it look if the president of the company didn't follow that same advice?


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

TAsunder said:


> It seemed like they all but flat out stated that he had been a patient there.


I'd say that's an overstatement. I think it was left quite ambiguous, although reason seems to support him being a patient.


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## MitchO (Nov 7, 2003)

Bierboy said:


> No, really, he is 6-1 and 350 pounds.


Heh, well i understand where you are coming from on this one, but I know the stats for fact instead of word of mouth because of a hospital stay (unrelated to the weight).


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## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

MitchO said:


> Heh, well i understand where you are coming from on this one, but I know the stats for fact instead of word of mouth because of a hospital stay (unrelated to the weight).


You know the actor's weight for fact because of a hospital stay? I'm confused...


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Sam's wife said that he used the numbers to guess the number of beans in some contest. How would he have done that? If nobody had ever won, which means getting within 10 beans, and he got it exact with the numbers, how did he do that?

If you string them all together, you get 4,815,162,342 which is obviously an unreasonable number, but if you add them together, you get 108. Surely someone would have guessed correctly with so few beans.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

TAsunder said:


> You know the actor's weight for fact because of a hospital stay? I'm confused...


 So am I. The information I posted IS fact. I don't know how he gets his "fact".


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## KRS (Jan 30, 2002)

hefe said:


> Sam's wife said that he used the numbers to guess the number of beans in some contest. How would he have done that? If nobody had ever won, which means getting within 10 beans, and he got it exact with the numbers, how did he do that?
> 
> If you string them all together, you get 4,815,162,342 which is obviously an unreasonable number, but if you add them together, you get 108. Surely someone would have guessed correctly with so few beans.


Dang, that's a good point.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

hefe said:


> Sam's wife said that he used the numbers to guess the number of beans in some contest. How would he have done that? If nobody had ever won, which means getting within 10 beans, and he got it exact with the numbers, how did he do that?
> 
> If you string them all together, you get 4,815,162,342 which is obviously an unreasonable number, but if you add them together, you get 108. Surely someone would have guessed correctly with so few beans.


Why is that an unreasonable number? Wasn't it a boat full of beans? What's unreasonable is that the guy actually counted them to know that there would be that many...


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

devdogaz said:


> An individual who is rich may not want to spend the kind of money required to fly private or in first class when coach gets you to the same place at the same time. It is this kind of mentality that got them rich in the first place.


True, but lottery winners tend to be pretty spendthrift. They're not like "self-made men" in that way.

Hurley was wearing a lot of bling and driving a H2 right after winning. My theory is that once he thought the money was cursed (or brought about because of a cursed number), he started living a more modest lifestyle as kind of a penance. He hasn't shown any flashy watch or other jewelry or expensive clothes on the island, or in Australia, or in the hospital, or while visiting his broker.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

TAsunder said:


> Why is that an unreasonable number? Wasn't it a boat full of beans? What's unreasonable is that the guy actually counted them to know that there would be that many...


Maybe it is, maybe it isn't, but my gut reaction is there is no way to count or document nearly 5 billion beans. And how much space _would_ that take?

How much volume does a bean occupy when pooled with other beans? I'll guess a half a cubic centimeter...I have no idea...

So that many beans of that volume would occupy around 3,200 cubic yards. Or put another way, a square container 45 feet on all sides.


----------



## 5thcrewman (Sep 23, 2003)

hefe said:


> Maybe it is, maybe it isn't, but my gut reaction is there is no way to count or document nearly 5 billion beans. And how much space _would_ that take?


Maybe Amazon.com wouldn't fit, but 5 Billion beans? Maybe-


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Sam and Lenny heard the transmission 16 years ago. Coincidentally, that was how long ago Rousseau changed the trasmission. So those two events had to happen right about the same time.

Perhaps the numbers broadcast only started up a very short time before it was changed. Sam and Lenny had only just started hearing it, and they were on a listening post where that's all they did. But did they also hear Rousseau's broadcast? Lenny must know more.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

hefe said:


> Sam's wife said that he used the numbers to guess the number of beans in some contest. How would he have done that? If nobody had ever won, which means getting within 10 beans, and he got it exact with the numbers, how did he do that?
> 
> If you string them all together, you get 4,815,162,342 which is obviously an unreasonable number, but if you add them together, you get 108. Surely someone would have guessed correctly with so few beans.


Did Sam's wife mention exactly how he used the numbers?

Maybe he grouped some of them together differently than we're thinking he did, and then added or multiplied them together?

If we take 4, 8, 15, 16, 23, and 42 and add them, we get 108 of course. If we multiply them, we get 7,418,880.

But maybe he grouped 48151 together, and added it to 62342, and came up with 110,493, etc.


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## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

All she said was he used the numbers. She didn't say how.


----------



## Jeeters (Feb 25, 2003)

KRS said:


> I guess it was just me, but I thought that this episode of Lost was a bit over the top and had a different _jokey_ tone than the rest. His mother breaks her ankle, then the house catches on fire, _and then_ the cops falsely arrest him. <----a little over the top.


It was definitely jokey; you could tell by the light background music which was sort of wonderfalls-ish.

But it *needed* to be over the top to drive home Hurley's claim that it wasn't just random happenings. He'd try and tell people he thought the numbers were the problem and they'd just reply that bad things happen to everbody. He knew it was more than that, though, because he knew that what was happening was too over the top.


----------



## Jeeters (Feb 25, 2003)

LostMommy said:


> About the hatch/bunker: Why doesn't Locke and Boone dig around it to see how extensive it is? If they can't open it, they could at least try and see if it is indeed a submarine, boat, or just a long, thin capsule/missile.


Seeing it last night, that's exactly what I thought they *have* been doing - digging out around it. When we first saw it, it was just a sheet of metal under the dirt under their feet. They've completely dug out the top and we can also see the side of it which is where the numbers are. Looks like they're trying to dig it out now, not necessarily just get into it.


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## LostMommy (Feb 22, 2005)

So Sam and Lenny were in the service together. Were they serving during a war? What war was going on 16 years ago in the Pacific? Was Sam Australian and Lenny American (Sam's wife was definitely Australian)? If so, then how were they in the same military service together?

Again, no takers on the song Hurley was playing whilst driving? 

???
Sarah


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

LostMommy said:


> So Sam and Lenny were in the service together. Were they serving during a war? What war was going on 16 years ago in the Pacific? Was Sam Australian and Lenny American (Sam's wife was definitely Australian)? If so, then how were they in the same military service together?
> 
> Again, no takers on the song Hurley was playing whilst driving?
> 
> ...


There didn't have to be a war. Monitoring radio transmissions is a routine intelligence gathering task that is done at all times. She said they were both in the Navy, I just presume Sam was an American.


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## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

hefe said:


> Fish Man said:
> 
> 
> > The entire line was, in fact:
> ...


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

LostMommy said:


> So Sam and Lenny were in the service together. Were they serving during a war? What war was going on 16 years ago in the Pacific? Was Sam Australian and Lenny American (Sam's wife was definitely Australian)? If so, then how were they in the same military service together?
> 
> Again, no takers on the song Hurley was playing whilst driving?
> 
> ...


 I didn't think Sam's wife's accent sounded Australian at all. I was trying to figure out where it was from and then she said Sam moved us down here in the middle of nowhere, so I took that to mean they left the US and moved as far away as possible. Didn't she say where the carnival was where he guessed how many beans were in the jar? I don't remember exactly where she said it was, but I have this vague memory of it being in Canada or the Northern U.S.


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## Jeeters (Feb 25, 2003)

devdogaz said:


> I didn't think Sam's wife's accent sounded Australian at all.


Hmm. She sounded *very* Australian to me. Very strong accent, in fact; I had hard time undestanding her a few times.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Jeeters said:


> Hmm. She sounded *very* Australian to me. Very strong accent, in fact; I had hard time undestanding her a few times.


 Oh, she definitely had a strong accent. I just didn't think it sounded Australian.


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

devdogaz said:


> How would it look if the president of the company didn't follow that same advice?


It would look typical.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Fish Man said:


> hefe said:
> 
> 
> > I just re-watched the relevant scene of BOTH episodes. The parallel is even more striking than I remembered it. The dialog of both parties involved in the conversation mirrors extremely closely.
> ...


----------



## tanstaafl (Oct 22, 2002)

A handful of responses to earlier posts in no particular order...

Another article about numbers stations

_A Wrinkle in Time_ has a lot of interesting concepts. It's supposedly a kids but but has a lot of surprisingly deep subtext. Superficially it's about good aliens, bad aliens and alternate dimensions. Underneath it's about the struggle between good and evil, except in this case evil is represented by conformity and good by individualism.

And tesseracts... can't forget tesseracts...

And a surprising number of very wealthy people fly commercial airlines and fly in coach when they do. I think it is because a lot of wealthy people got to _be_ wealthy by learning how to use money carefully and most of them probably don't consider the premium on first class travel to be worth the investment.

Did anyone get the impression that Locke was hoping to get more information out of Claire than he did?


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## tanstaafl (Oct 22, 2002)

Oh yeah, for whoever said they wouldn't know where the island was... The lostaways should be able to get their exact coordinates within a degree or two. All they need is a tiny bit of luck and a functioning calculating device that does trig functions somewhere in Sawyer's pile of salvage.

Let's start with longitude, since that is the easiest. All we need here is someone with a watch set to a known time zone. I suspect that everyone's watch was probably set to either Sydney or Los Angeles time; I'm going to assume they can find one set to LA.

Stick a stick into the sand. Have someone watch its shadow. When the shadow is at its shortest, it is local noon.

Let's say that local noon turns out to be 3:30 pm in LA. That means we are three and a half time zones west of the reference for LA's time zone.

Each time zone represents 15 degrees of longitude. Now, we know that at zero degrees longitude, at Greenwich, the sun is directly overhead at local noon. The LA time zone is 8 time zones west of Greenwich and we are 3 1/2 beyond that, so we are 11 1/2 time zones west of Greenwich. 11 1/2 x 15 = 172.5 so the island is at 172.5 degrees west longitude.

Latitude is a bit trickier; now we need the calculator. Use the same stick, except when the shadow is at its shortest we measure its length. (We don't need to use any particular measurement unit as long as we can measure both the stick and its shadow in that unit.) Take the ratio of the length of the shadow to the length of the stick then take the arctangent of that ratio. That gives us the angle of the sun.

Let's say the shadow is 3 units long and the stick is 8 units long. Arctan(3/8) = 20.5 degrees. So, the sun is 20.5 degrees away from being directly overhead.

Now, the sun is directly above the equator at local noon only on the spring or autum equinoxes. The rest of the time it is drifting north or south until it reaches a maximum of 23.5 degrees away at the winter or summer solstice.

Assume it is four weeks past the autum equinox. That means that at local noon the sun will be roughly (4 / 13) x 23.5 or 7.2 degrees south of the equator. Combine that with the angle we got earlier (which shows how far south of the sun we are) and we know we are around 28 degrees south latitude.

OK, its not GPS precision but this is more or less how navigation was done until only about a century ago. It could certainly get a rescue ship close enough to find them with a fairly short aerial search.


----------



## WinBear (Aug 24, 2000)

tanstaafl said:


> Did anyone get the impression that Locke was hoping to get more information out of Claire than he did?


I thought Locke was putting Claire in a position to be able to tell her baby that she helped build the cradle.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

I thought it ws Locke's usual way of knowing what people need and what will make them feel better. She thanked him for giving her something to do, and it was a nice gesture to boot. Did he know it was her birthday beforehand? Don't know, but Locke just has that knack of doing or saying the right thing at the right time.


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

tanstaafl said:


> Let's start with longitude, since that is the easiest.


First off, you're confusing latitude with longitude. Just remember "Latitude is fat-itude". Latitude shows where you are going around the equator, the "fattest" part of the globe.

Let's see---the earth has 24 time zones and it's approximately 25,000 miles around.

That means that each time zone is a little over 1000 miles wide on average.

Your stick-in-the-sand technique might have a chance if everyone knew where LA was in that 1,000 mile window. Is LA towards the east or the west edge of its time zone? I certainly have no idea. What about Sydney? And the 1000 miles is only an average.

Let's say I use your technique using NY as a reference point. I calculate I'm 5000 miles from NY. My buddy uses Chicago as a reference point. He calculate he's 5000 miles from Chicago. Who's right? The two cities are over 700 miles apart.

As for longitude, your suggestion relies upon accurate measurements of distance. I doubt anyone brought a tape measure on their trip. (And forget about the calculator.)


----------



## alpacaboy (Oct 29, 2004)

Amnesia said:


> As for longitude, your suggestion relies upon accurate measurements of distance. I doubt anyone brought a tape measure on their trip. (And forget about the calculator.)


The units of distance don't need to be a standard unit like inches or cm. 1 unit could, for example, be the distance between 2 teeth of a comb. They could probably find _something_ to use as a measuring device/standard.

As for the calculator, I don't think it's that far fetched that someone on the plane had a calculator and/or has one built into a cell phone. Granted, a scientific calculator might not be that common. Or maybe someone like Hurley could just derive the Taylor expansion for arctan or something. Isn't the first derivitive something simple like 1/(1+x^2) or something like that?

As for latitude, you're blocking off resolutions in 1 hr chunks, but they can probably measure it down to 5 min resolution or so to get fractional placement inside the timezone. I'd guess for reference, maybe they could use Greenwich, England as the zero point rather than LA, NYC, Chicago, ...

They might not get super accurate measurements, but I think they can do better than what you're suggesting.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Amnesia said:


> First off, you're confusing latitude with longitude. Just remember "Latitude is fat-itude". Latitude shows where you are going around the equator, the "fattest" part of the globe.


No he isn't. Longitude marks the degrees to the east and west of the Prime Meridian which runs from N pole to S pole through Greenwich England. Latitude marks the degrees north or south above or below the equator. His method is correct for getting a very crude position, but it wouldn't be of use to the castaways.

The reason it is a crude approximation (he said it wasn't GPS-accurate) is precisely because on the longitude, you don't know what part of the time zone you are in, and on the latitude, the amount the sun shifts north or south from the equinox relative to the date on the calendar is non-linear. You would need to have a chart of the analemma (that figure 8 thing you see on globes) handy to see what the actual angle to the sun is.



> Let's say I use your technique using NY as a reference point. I calculate I'm 5000 miles from NY. My buddy uses Chicago as a reference point. He calculate he's 5000 miles from Chicago. Who's right? The two cities are over 700 miles apart.


You couldn't both come up with 5,000 miles. Using Chicago as the reference point means your watch is set to Central time. Using New York means you are set to Eastern time. You have an hour difference built into the base measurement that will result in that 1,000 mile difference. So if your Chicago guy said 5,000 miles, your New York guy would have to say about 6,000.

And anyway, it wouldn't be that useful because if they had a way to transmit their position, they could simply transmit any distress call and be located.


----------



## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

hefe said:


> No he isn't. Longitude marks the degrees to the east and west of the Prime Meridian which runs from N pole to S pole through Greenwich England. Latitude marks the degrees north or south above or below the equator. His method is correct for getting a very crude position, but it wouldn't be of use to the castaways.
> 
> The reason it is a crude approximation (he said it wasn't GPS-accurate) is precisely because on the longitude, you don't know what part of the time zone you are in, and on the latitude, the amount the sun shifts north or south from the equinox relative to the date on the calendar is non-linear. You would need to have a chart of the analemma (that figure 8 thing you see on globes) handy to see what the actual angle to the sun is.
> 
> And anyway, it wouldn't be that useful because if they had a way to transmit their position, they could simply transmit any distress call and be located.


It would be useful though in the sense they can record those measurements and take with them on the raft; once they've been found, then things can be compared and evaluated to determine a more accurate position in which to begin the search.

They don't need to determine a latitude and longitude themselves; they need the raw data that would be used to determine it.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

dswallow said:


> It would be useful though in the sense they can record those measurements and take with them on the raft; once they've been found, then things can be compared and evaluated to determine a more accurate position in which to begin the search.
> 
> They don't need to determine a latitude and longitude themselves; they need the raw data that would be used to determine it.


If this were more than a few years ago, I'd agree, but not in the days of satellite tracking and high tech detection equipment. They could tell the people that they hit a land mass, an island. They know the general region of the earth. They know what the flight plan was. Even though they were far off course, they would still not be able to peg their location well enough to narrow the search appreciably.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

dswallow said:


> They don't need to determine a latitude and longitude themselves; they need the raw data that would be used to determine it.


Let me partially correct myself...yes, with the raw data, if they are sure they had used accurate time and calendar data, they could use that at a later time having access to the proper charts to do a better job.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Oh, by the way... I can't remember if this was mentioned lately...

We know that the plane was flight 815.

We know that the safe deposit box Kate got was number 815.

But also, when Charlie tried to become a copier salesman for his "girlfriend," he was trying to demonstrate the "awesome speed of the C-815" to some customers.


----------



## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

hefe said:


> Let me partially correct myself...yes, with the raw data, if they are sure they had used accurate time and calendar data, they could use that at a later time having access to the proper charts to do a better job.


Also remember that with much of the earth photographed from space, and with the island they were on being rather large and with various geological features that are identifiable, they sure should be able to focus searchers in the regions they need to with just the simple raw data described above and the basic knowledge of the pilot having provided info about being X miles off course... it really shouldn't be that difficult for that to happen. And all they really need to do is take those measurements, bring the same watch used to get the time with them, and keep track of the number of days since they took the measurements.

The searchers will also be able to use knowledge of currents and time the raft was drifting and location they were picked up to coordinate the other info.


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## getbak (Oct 8, 2004)

dswallow said:


> The searchers will also be able to use knowledge of currents and time the raft was drifting and location they were picked up to coordinate the other info.


That's what I was thinking. As long as they know how long they've been floating, they should be able to backtrack the ocean currents to determine their starting point.

It doesn't need to be acurate to the foot or anything. I can't imagine that there are that many deserted islands in the middle of the Pacific with radio transmitters on top of a big black rock (assuming that the "Black Rock" is in fact a big black rock).

Of course, what I find amusing is that we're debating how the people who leave on the raft will be able to send the rescue parties back to get the other survivors. I'm sure we all must realize that there is zero chance that the raft will ever leave the island (especially with Michael, Sawyer, and Jin aboard).


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## MacThor (Feb 7, 2002)

So all these tricks should work on an island where north isn't really north?


----------



## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

MacThor said:


> So all these tricks should work on an island where north isn't really north?


Considering none of these "tricks" depend upon magnetic readings...


----------



## GadgetFreak (Jun 3, 2002)

If the raft makes it... the fact that they know they were 1000 miles off course should help. The original flight plan will be on file. Did the pilot tell them which direction before he got skinned?


----------



## scooterboy (Mar 27, 2001)

It *must* be the same box company. They made such a point about mentioning it...


----------



## mitchb2 (Sep 30, 2000)

holee said:


> Man ABC really wants us to watch Blind Justice.


LOL! NO KIDDING! I've never seen so many promos for a show.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

How many blind lawyer, police officer, detective, samauri, etc. shows have to fail before people figure out it is a STUPID idea?

Then again, I thought LOST was a stupid idea.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Here's something in common with the numbers from Lost: retired New York Yankees numbers.

4 - Lou Gherig
8 - Yogi Berra
15 - Thurman Munson
16 - ****** Ford
23 - Don Mattingly
42 - Jackie Robinson (retired by all clubs)

I win!


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

cheesesteak said:


> Here's something in common with the numbers from Lost: retired New York Yankees numbers.
> 
> 4 - Lou Gherig
> 8 - Yogi Berra
> ...


It's the "evil empire" at it again! That's it! You solved it!


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

cheesesteak said:


> Here's something in common with the numbers from Lost: retired New York Yankees numbers.
> 
> 4 - Lou Gherig
> 8 - Yogi Berra
> ...


 I like it!


----------



## bdlucas (Feb 15, 2004)

cheesesteak said:


> Here's something in common with the numbers from Lost: retired New York Yankees numbers.
> 
> 4 - Lou Gherig
> 8 - Yogi Berra
> ...


Sounds promising, but you don't win  until you can explain whay those six numbers of the fifteen numbers the Yankees have retired (http://newyork.yankees.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/nyy/history/retired_numbers.jsp)...


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## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

dswallow said:


> Considering none of these "tricks" depend upon magnetic readings...


Still, the fact that compasses "don't work" on the island worries me.

Suppose the raft makes it to a ship, inhabited land, or whatever. A search party is sent.

What if the compasses on the search craft go wonky when they approach the island?

Well, they still have GPS right? As weird as the island is, I'll bet GPS goes on the fritz in its vicinity too. (IMHO it would be cool if in one episode they have the castaways find a GPS unit in the luggage and have the GPS unit show they're in downtown Cleveland or something! It would tie in well with the island "magically" disabling compasses. It disables GPS units too! :up:  )


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

Wouldn't a large power source (maybe by the radio tower) or other electromagnetic field make the compass go squirly?


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

mask2343 said:


> Wouldn't a large power source (maybe by the radio tower) or other electromagnetic field make the compass go squirly?


It's far too weak. If that were true, compasses here would never work with all the transmitters around...Tv, radio, cellphone & PCS towers, microwave, airports, WiFi, Bluetooth, etc...


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

hefe said:


> It's far too weak. If that were true, compasses here would never work with all the transmitters around...Tv, radio, cellphone & PCS towers, microwave, airports, WiFi, Bluetooth, etc...


Well yeah, obviously it is probably something out of the ordinary. But I'm just trying to come up with a "real life" explanation instead of a "supernatural" one.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

mask2343 said:


> Well yeah, obviously it is probably something out of the ordinary. But I'm just trying to come up with a "real life" explanation instead of a "supernatural" one.


Then you're doomed to being wrong!


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

mask2343 said:


> Well yeah, obviously it is probably something out of the ordinary. But I'm just trying to come up with a "real life" explanation instead of a "supernatural" one.


Well, I guess I can't say we should discount it as a reason in the Lost world...it's not unusual to take a few liberties with physics for the sake of a story.
But I will guess that there is something larger that we don't know about causing a deflection in the magnetic field lines on the island...perhaps some long buried lines or tunnels or electronic equipment. Or maybe there is just a very large amount of naturally magnetic stone on this island...ooh... just thought, maybe this "black rock" is a magnetic rock, or not a rock at all... Hmmmmm....


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## LlamaLarry (Apr 30, 2003)

Amnesia said:


> I would have called it a bunker, not a capsule...


Looks more like a de/compression chamber to me or at least like the ones I have been in.


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

hefe said:


> Well, I guess I can't say we should discount it as a reason in the Lost world...it's not unusual to take a few liberties with physics for the sake of a story.
> But I will guess that there is something larger that we don't know about causing a deflection in the magnetic field lines on the island...perhaps some long buried lines or tunnels or electronic equipment. Or maybe there is just a very large amount of naturally magnetic stone on this island...ooh... just thought, maybe this "black rock" is a magnetic rock, or not a rock at all... Hmmmmm....


Yeah, I figured "black rock" didn't necesarily mean a real rock. Maybe some kind of material or element wanted by the US governement during the war. Ah, who am I kidding? It's all a supernatural thing.


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## mitchb2 (Sep 30, 2000)

If the series of numbers begins with 48 and ends with 42....maybe that could refer to the number of survivors? Six casualties?


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## thatmeowgirl (Oct 8, 2004)

i just read through this thread and I can't believe we got all the way back to talking about Hurley's weight and Claire being pregnant so long.

I think Devdog said it best that the the show was originally planned for 13 episodes only. 

And re: Jorge Garcia, I have worked with the actor, and he is indeed a large man. If he lost 20 lbs. it would be difficult to notice.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

I found an interesting theory on the 4815162342.com forum. Deals with the Bible.

----------------------------------------------------

Genesis 4:8 (first two numbers are 4 and *)
"And Cain talked with Abel his brother: and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother, and slew him."

Black and White, Good and Evil, blah blah blah...

Genesis 15:16 
"But in the fourth generation they shall come hither again: for the iniquity of the Amorites [is] not yet full."

Eludes to the fact that people will return to the island because the folly/experiment of what those before were doing (see post by BeOPSVMo)is not yet over. Also notice that the number 4 appears again and a lot of tragedy surrounding the inhabitants of the island occured 4 years ago. Not to mention the fact that if you count "Adam and Eve" (the two people found in the caves that Jack identified as being over 50 years old) as the first generation, the french group as the second, and this group as the third, then claire's baby would be the fourth generation and everyone here recognized the importance of the baby.

Again since I can't really find the significance of 23 and 42 this may be a coincidence but it is interesting.

As a side note the 23rd book of the bible is Isaiah which contains the most references in the bible to creation, and there is a reference to God returning at the end times at the "42nd occurence". Couldn't really decipher what the site was talking about in referencing "occurences" but 23 and 42 does relate to the beginning and the end (even if by stretching).


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

thatmeowgirl said:


> I think Devdog said it best that the the show was originally planned for 13 episodes only...


Well...yes and no.

The series actually got sold to the network without a script at all, just a 25 page outline. It's not that the vision for the show was only for 13 episodes, that's just how TV works. They make an initial order of X episodes. If the show fails, they don't produce anymore, it ends there. The creators absolutely planned on going further than that, and since the show was such a hit, they got their full season order.

If you count the pilot as one episode, as it was originally aired, the 13th was "Special," the backstory of Michael and Walt. Clearly, things that have happened since then all tie in tightly to what was begun early in the series.

I think the larger question is, do the writers have an idea of what the ultimate resolution to all this is? Was that part of their original outline, or are they going to just keep answering and raising smaller questions untill it appears the end of the series is near, and they have to wrap it up?


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## thatmeowgirl (Oct 8, 2004)

Hefe-
You make a good point re: do they know where they're going, but I've heard otherwise re: the 13 episodes. I heard they were hit off guard, and didn't expect it to be more that a mini-series.

Just things you hear here in LA. I dunno.


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## ashu (Nov 8, 2002)

Farrrk! 300+ posts! This time I'm going to avoid reading anything until I atcually catch up


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

thatmeowgirl said:


> Hefe-
> You make a good point re: do they know where they're going, but I've heard otherwise re: the 13 episodes. I heard they were hit off guard, and didn't expect it to be more that a mini-series.
> 
> Just things you hear here in LA. I dunno.


I remember that conversation on this board. Wasn't that the reason for the break in Dec/Jan...so that they could actually go and film more episodes because they had run out?


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

hefe said:


> Well...yes and no.
> 
> The series actually got sold to the network without a script at all, just a 25 page outline. It's not that the vision for the show was only for 13 episodes, that's just how TV works. They make an initial order of X episodes. If the show fails, they don't produce anymore, it ends there. The creators absolutely planned on going further than that, and since the show was such a hit, they got their full season order.
> 
> ...


 True, but there was rumor earlier in the season that they originally had scripts for episodes 12 and 13 that would have ended the series but they were scrapped and rewritten when they got the full season order.

As for the compass, I'm surprised they haven't tried to go around the perimeter of the island to see if the compass always seems to point in the same direction, or if it is always pointing to the interior of the island. My guess is that the earth's magnetic field is overridden by some greater magnetic force on the island.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

thatmeowgirl said:


> Hefe-
> You make a good point re: do they know where they're going, but I've heard otherwise re: the 13 episodes. I heard they were hit off guard, and didn't expect it to be more that a mini-series.
> 
> Just things you hear here in LA. I dunno.


Perhaps what happened is that they didn't believe they could justify the expense for an ongoing series. If they originally bought 13 episodes of such an expensive series, it would make sense that they cover all contingencies, like, if it's not a hit, we need to wrap it up at 13 episodes. But if it is, well, this is TV. If it makes money, it will air. So they probably had an option built into the deal to buy further episodes without having to renegotiate after the success. So maybe the answer is somewhere in the middle.


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## thatmeowgirl (Oct 8, 2004)

pmyers said:


> I remember that conversation on this board. Wasn't that the reason for the break in Dec/Jan...so that they could actually go and film more episodes because they had run out?


I heard it from an industry person here in LA. But industry ppl can be full of it too.

When I worked with Jorge on a film, he had just started shooting Lost. He flew back and forth from LA to Hawaii during that time. I got the impression he was working on a mini-series. He told us stuff about shooting the pilot with the explosions, etc. I didn't ask much more.


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## thatmeowgirl (Oct 8, 2004)

hefe said:


> Perhaps what happened is that they didn't believe they could justify the expense for an ongoing series. If they originally bought 13 episodes of such an expensive series, it would make sense that they cover all contingencies, like, if it's not a hit, we need to wrap it up at 13 episodes. But if it is, well, this is TV. If it makes money, it will air. So they probably had an option built into the deal to buy further episodes without having to renegotiate after the success. So maybe the answer is somewhere in the middle.


Definitely. Good points!


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## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

I have heard from several sources that J. J. Abrams was told, in no uncertain terms, "Do not expect ABC to pick up the 2nd half of the season".

Several credible sources say that Michael Eisner *HATED* the show's concept, and expected it to be a colossal flop. It was over his loud protests that some other execs at ABC pushed for it to be given a chance. (Eisner reportedly *HATED* "Desperate Housewives" too. Shows why he is CEO, but not the director of programming!  )

Anyway, the creators of the show tentatively had planned to wrap it up in 13 episodes. However, about the time episode 10 or 11 was aired, ABC did pick up the 2nd half of the season, and episodes ~12 - 13 were re-written (perhaps even some scenes re-shot) to extend the series. (They _always_ had a "plan B", in case the show was a hit, but they were told to not expect more than 13 episodes.)


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Fish Man said:


> I have heard from several sources that J. J. Abrams was told, in no uncertain terms, "Do not expect ABC to pick up the 2nd half of the season".
> 
> Several credible sources say that Michael Eisner *HATED* the show's concept, and expected it to be a colossal flop. It was over his loud protests that some other execs at ABC pushed for it to be given a chance. (Eisner reportedly *HATED* "Desperate Housewives" too. Shows why he is CEO, but not the director of programming!  )
> 
> Anyway, the creators of the show tentatively had planned to wrap it up in 13 episodes. However, about the time episode 10 or 11 was aired, ABC did pick up the 2nd half of the season, and episodes ~12 - 13 were re-written (perhaps even some scenes re-shot) to extend the series. (They _always_ had a "plan B", in case the show was a hit, but they were told to not expect more than 13 episodes.)


Well, I can accept that they may have been told to expect that at the executive level, but David Fury said in an interview published Sep. 7, before the series premiered...


> From Sci-Fi Wire:
> 
> David Fury, co-executive producer of ABC's upcoming SF series Lost, told SCI FI Wire that one of the most mysterious characters on the new series about plane crash survivors stranded on a mysterious South Pacific island is the island itself. "It is very interesting and has its own mythology that will hopefully unfold over many seasons," Fury (Buffy the Vampire Slayer) said in an interview.


Additionally they had some strong support:


> By Maria Elena Fernandez, Los Angeles Times
> 
> When J.J. Abrams turned in an outline for Lost last year, Lloyd Braun, then ABC Television Group's chairman, bragged excitedly to a buddy, "This, my friend, is ER."
> 
> ...


So I guess my point is that though they may have been told to expect that, their creative vision was greater than the limits of a mini-series from the start.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Of course their creative vision was greater than the limits of a mini-series. No one pitches a show to a network and hopes/expects it to get canned after half a season. I'm sure the creators always had faith that it would be picked up and be a great show for many seasons. Of course they always had a Plan B to make the series go longer and of course the network had the option to pick up the rest of the season at a predetermined fee regardless of the shows success. The only point being made is that as it was originally scripted (and maybe even shot), it was going to end after 13 eps. Those last two eps had to be retooled to prolong the series.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

We've seen too many shows end with no resolution to believe that they had an ending written for episode 13. If the show wasn't a hit, they would just end it cold. Like the Lyon's Den and others. If nobody was watching, nobody would notice.


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

Bierboy said:


> That reminded me of Goober in Andy Griffith.


Gee thanks. 

We all talk that way in the South. lol.


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## Rcrew (Jan 3, 2002)

Phew! Long, long read. Last time I wait so long to watch an ep!  

Didn't see any comments about Charlie's acting in this ep. While I would agree this was a terrific episode, the one comment my GF and I shared after watching was what the heck happened to his acting. He totally sucked in this episode.


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## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

hefe said:


> Well, I can accept that they may have been told to expect that at the executive level, but David Fury said in an interview published Sep. 7, before the series premiered...
> 
> Additionally they had some strong support:
> 
> So I guess my point is that though they may have been told to expect that, their creative vision was greater than the limits of a mini-series from the start.


According to an article I read in some trade rag (upon which I based my previous post), Lloyd Braun was *FIRED* by Eisner _because he "forced 'Lost' down ABC's throat"_ and Eisner was convinced it would flop.

Of course, Braun has been vindicated, in spades, and can write his own ticket anywhere he might want to work in the industry.

Point is, there were some visionary people at ABC who saw the potential of "Lost", and other narrow-minded types that "didn't get it".

The compromise was to give it a chance.

The visionaries were right, the non-believers now "get it". Some people just have to be hit over the head with a 2x4 to "get" certian things!


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

I don't disagree at all about the contingency planning or how networks operate or what they may have intially done for the sake of practical planning. Maybe it's too fine a point to differentiate, but my view is that it was not planned as a 13 episode story. The story is not suffering or changing from whatever original vision there was because it was picked up, as seems to have been implied here and other forums. Now they get to do what they planned on doing, and despite having to plan for a possible 13 week run, they fully expected going beyond that.

Interview with Executive Producer Bryan Burk in July:


> But "outing" the Big Noisy Thing will not be the death knell of "Lost." The creators and producers of this series are more forward thinking than that. This is a series for which JJ Abrams already knows how the next six seasons will end. Or was it seven or eight seasons?
> Isn't that being just a touch optimistic, you ask? After all, ABC has only picked up the show for 11 episodes. And a full season for a TV show is 22 episodes.
> Let's put it this way: "Lost" is not a series which will run out of ideas. Nor is it a series short on savvy. Bryan paraphrased Damon Lindelof, one of the creators of "Lost," by saying that doing a series was a lot like a cross country drive. You have to know where you're going. You might make some detours and you might change your destination, but you do have a general idea about where you hope to wind up when you set out.
> "We're huge fans of 'Twin Peaks,'" Bryan said. "And we loved it, but our fear (with 'Lost') was to have a situation like 'Who Killed Laura Palmer?' In Episode 9 (of 'Twin Peaks') they tell you and it's like, now what?"
> If JJ and Co. know how each season will end for the next six (or was it eight?) seasons, it doesn't look like "now what?" will be an issue.


And and interview with show co-creator Damon Lindelof in August, before Lost ever premeired:


> Most of the fans know that Lost is currently filming eleven episodes. A season is typically 22 episodes. So where does that leave the rest of the season? Will we see the 40 days and 40 nights in those 13 episodes (two-hour pilot plus the other eleven)?
> "The 13 episodes will be roughly the first 20 days," Damon told us. "Each episode is roughly 48 hours. But we are anticipating being picked up."


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## Jeeters (Feb 25, 2003)

There was an interview with JJ Abrams a few months ago (I think I read it on aintitcoolnews?) where he stated they've been thinking up *tons* of ideas for the characters.


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## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

Fish Man said:


> According to an article I read in some trade rag (upon which I based my previous post), Lloyd Braun was *FIRED* by Eisner _because he "forced 'Lost' down ABC's throat"_ and Eisner was convinced it would flop.


This just proves that the network execs feel they have to "dumb down" prgramming for their viewers. They don't give the viewers nearly enough credit. A deep, well crafted drama like Lost proves them wrong. Something can be intelligent and still be popular. I swear some of these guys long for the days of Dukes of Hazzard and Three's Company. Yes, these shows had their purpose, but we as viewers deserve better. I'm glad there are a select few out there who understand this.

[/rant]


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

My guess is that if they had ended it at 13, we would not have been happy with the resolution. It would have just been a fake, tacked-on thing to give a false sense of closure.


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

MitchO said:


> I have a friend who is 6'5" and 320, and he probably looks in a bit worse shape than Hurley.
> 
> I'd guess in the 310 range.


I'm 5' 11" and 280.

I don't look ANYWHERE as large as Hurley. I think it has a lot to do with body structure.


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

mwhip said:


> "I can make it. I'm spry".


I LMAO when I heard him say this. Priceless. :urock:


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Fish Man said:


> According to an article I read in some trade rag (upon which I based my previous post), Lloyd Braun was *FIRED* by Eisner _because he "forced 'Lost' down ABC's throat"_ and Eisner was convinced it would flop.


I just read a few articles on that. It appears their feud predates Lost, but Eisner sure did hate it. Even after the premier scored good numbers he said (excerpted from the book DISNEYWAR) in this article,



> On September 29, 2004, I met with Eisner at his office at ABC headquarters in New York. That morning I'd read a full-page ad in the New York Times touting the success of "Lost," which had debuted the previous week to glowing reviews and strong ratings. After so many years, it looked like ABC might have a hit. Simply as a pleasantry, I mention seeing the "Lost" ad.
> 
> To my surprise, Eisner seems annoyed. "That New York Times ad was a total waste of seventy-five or hundred thousand dollars," he says angrily. "It's all about ego, impressing the so-called New York intelligentsia. Let me tell you, that ad isn't going to get one more viewer. Maybe if it had been in USA Today < ...>" His voice trails off, but it turns out he is just warming to the subject. " `Lost' is terrible," he says. "The pilot was two hours; it was broken into two one-hour episodes. Then the show goes off a cliff. There's no more plane crash! Who cares about these people on a desert island?"


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

He's right...who cares? Let's put together another season of The Benefactor! Yeah, that's the ticket.

Talk about out of touch with society.


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

tanstaafl said:


> OK, its not GPS precision but this is more or less how navigation was done until only about a century ago. It could certainly get a rescue ship close enough to find them with a fairly short aerial search.


Thats pretty interesting tanstaafl. I enjoyed reading it.


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## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

This is way off topic, but somewhere along the last few years, Eisner must have hit his head. He was not always like this.

I've been meaning to buy Disneywar, I guess I will get that this weekend.


----------



## LostMommy (Feb 22, 2005)

Philly Bill said:


> I LMAO when I heard him say this. Priceless. :urock:


Philly Bill:

My thoughts EXACTLY!!!

"I'm spry."

So simple, yet so perfect. The writers are genii (plural of genius?). Hurley does get the best lines, doesn't he?

Sarah


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

Maybe if they were found on a raft they would just say they were the only ones and that there was no one else... Seemed like on Gilligans Island, anyone that found the island and left never wanted to tell anyone that there were 7 castaways there.. lol.


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

bdlucas said:


> Sounds promising, but you don't win  until you can explain whay those six numbers of the fifteen numbers the Yankees have retired (http://newyork.yankees.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/nyy/history/retired_numbers.jsp)...


Thurman Munson died in a plane crash. 

What number did Roberto Clemente wear? lol.


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

Fish Man said:


> Well, they still have GPS right?


Should have been a unit in the plane. Battery too... lol.


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## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

Philly Bill said:


> What number did Roberto Clemente wear? lol.


21


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

hefe said:


> ...It's not that the vision for the show was only for 13 episodes, that's just how TV works. They make an initial order of X episodes. If the show fails, they don't produce anymore, it ends there...


- Pilot? What's a pilot?
- Well, you know the shows on TV?
- I don't watch TV.
- Yeah, but you are aware that there is an invention called television,
- and on this invention they show shows, right?
- Yeah.
- The way they pick TV shows is they make one show. That show's called a pilot.
- Then they show that one show to the people who pick shows...
- and on the strength of that one show, they decide if they wanna make more shows.
- Some get chosen and become television programs.
- Some don't, become nothin'.
- She starred in one of the ones that became nothing.


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## 5thcrewman (Sep 23, 2003)

#332
THIS, this is why they give us such long gaps between new eps. Writing cramps are a *****!


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

5thcrewman said:


> #332
> THIS, this is why they give us such long gaps between new eps. Writing cramps are a *****!


Bah!... No symmetry.. I got #333 

With 6 weeks 'til a new episode, we may get to 815


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## ovr8ted (Feb 27, 2005)

PJO1966 said:


> This just proves that the network execs feel they have to "dumb down" prgramming for their viewers. They don't give the viewers nearly enough credit. A deep, well crafted drama like Lost proves them wrong. Something can be intelligent and still be popular. I swear some of these guys long for the days of Dukes of Hazzard and Three's Company. Yes, these shows had their purpose, but we as viewers deserve better. I'm glad there are a select few out there who understand this.
> 
> [/rant]


These types of shows offer execs the privilege of having part time viewers. They can also schedule shows during other events, such as March Madness due to the fact that the overlying theme is "See ya next week for more whackiness, and by the way, if you missed this week, don't worry, next week will be totally disconnected, and the General Lee will be just as purty as she once was"

These shows seem to be less of a risk. New viewers can show at almost anytime during the season and still get a good laugh. I think this is why Arrested Development is having so many problems. That and the ever changing time slot


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

For the record, I LOVE Dukes of Hazzard and Knight Rider


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## Kevdog (Apr 18, 2001)

hefe said:


> I think the larger question is, do the writers have an idea of what the ultimate resolution to all this is? Was that part of their original outline, or are they going to just keep answering and raising smaller questions untill it appears the end of the series is near, and they have to wrap it up?


It may be a stretch, but one of Lost's producers is David Fury (he also writes and directs, I believe). Fury did a lot of work with Joss Whedon on both _Buffy the Vampire Slayer_ and _Angel_. Whedon has often spoken of how entire season arcs were developed for both shows before a single script was written or shot. I'm guessing Fury et. al. have taken a similar approach with _Lost._


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## chewbaccad (Feb 16, 2005)

hmm... Black Rock wreaking havoc with the magnetic field surrounding the island... Meteor? Aliens are afoot? Polar Bear aliens?


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## NerdXing (Aug 4, 2004)

My guess is an underground bunker. If the numbers are significant how about:

Coordinates, don't you need 6 coordinates to pinpoint a place in the sky?
Lock Combination
Radio Frequency?


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

NerdXing said:


> Coordinates, don't you need 6 coordinates to pinpoint a place in the sky?


In Star Trek, perhaps.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

NerdXing said:


> My guess is an underground bunker. If the numbers are significant how about:
> 
> Coordinates, don't you need 6 coordinates to pinpoint a place in the sky?


You just need Right Ascension and Declination. Well, and a reference point for the R.A.


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

hefe said:


> You just need Right Ascension and Declination. Well, and a reference point for the R.A.


And distance.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

dswallow said:


> And distance.


Only if you want to actually _go to_ that point. I think he was just talking about finding a point in the sky, like an astronomer.


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

hefe said:


> Only if you want to actually _go to_ that point. I think he was just talking about finding a point in the sky, like an astronomer.


Technically that's a line in the sky then, isn't it?


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

dswallow said:


> Technically that's a line in the sky then, isn't it?


Technically, it's a line in the sky and then right through into space...

Ha! Take that!


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## JoeBarbs (Dec 1, 2003)

Maybe the numbers have to do with Hurley's girth


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

hefe said:


> Technically, it's a line in the sky and then right through into space...
> 
> Ha! Take that!


Technically it's a line in the sky, through space, through matter, possibly including planets or stars or alien spaceships/planets/beings or even our own spaceships. Of course the line goes both ways, so it probably passes through the Earth, maybe even people, buildings, pollutants in the atmosphere, et. al.


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## lordargent (Nov 12, 2002)

NerdXing said:


> Coordinates, don't you need 6 coordinates to pinpoint a place in the sky?





dswallow said:


> In Star Trek, perhaps.


The numbers correspond to constellations.

The creature is Hathor.

The others are jaffa.

That hatch leads to an ancient outpost.

/black rock anyone?









/needs point of origin


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## orome (Dec 30, 2004)

Keith_R90210 said:


> this whole thing about the numbers has me intrigued. I wonder who thought of them and what they represent, all these questions it drives me crazy!


23 is sacred to Discordians, fwiw.


----------



## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

I wanted to add to this thread, but this is all I'm left with: Sawyer called Walt "Short Round". Later, there was a suspension-bridge. Get it?


----------



## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

Oh, and I saw the actor that plays Jin today in a trailer for an upcoming Paul Haggis film (Crash). It looks like another feel-good movie along the lines of Million Dollar Baby; you know, 'life sucks and then you die' kind of stuff.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Back to the bean thing for a sec, we had talked about how it seemed unreasonable for the numbers to be used to guess the beans since when you put them together it's almost 5 billion beans. Here's the transcript of the bean scene:


> Mrs. Toomey: A couple days later, we're at the fair in Kalgoorlie, and some Wally there's got this jar. Must have been big as a pony. And it's filled to the rim with beans. Filly's offering 50 grand to anyone able to guess how many beans are in that jar, within 10.
> 
> Hurley: Sam used the numbers.
> 
> Mrs. Toomey: Yep. The answer was exact, to the bean. Man had been running the scam for 40 years. Nobody'd ever come close. So we won the money.


I don't think a jar that big could reasonably hold that many beans. Unless they are really teeny tiny beans.

The other thing is that she called it a scam. Maybe that number was just written in an envelope or something even though it was wrong so nobody would ever guess. When they guessed that number, they had to fork over the loot.


----------



## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

hefe said:


> I don't think a jar that big could reasonably hold that many beans. Unless they are really teeny tiny beans.


So off Googling I go to search out how many beans in a jar info on the web, and I find:

http://www.sermons4kids.com/godknowsall.html

Halfway through it I was gonna try to find a way of alluding to maybe Hurley being God. But then that page just went off the deep end. But still...


----------



## borther (Jan 22, 2004)

I don't know how long it takes to film this many shows but I'll bet Hurley is down a bunch of weight at the beginning of the next season.


----------



## borther (Jan 22, 2004)

If the others died from illness after visiting the Black Rock, maybe they died of radiation poisoning.


----------



## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

When they get around to exploring the black rock, I hope the episode is titled Bad Day At Black Rock.


----------



## EMoMoney (Oct 30, 2001)

I was really not liking this episode until they tied it all together. I was feeling the back story of Hurley was a little too corney, but it all makes sense now. Will the curse be broken now that he found somebody that actually agreed with him they were cursed?


----------



## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

borther said:


> If the others died from illness after visiting the Black Rock, maybe they died of radiation poisoning.


In the episode that introduced Danielle, I felt it was strongly implied that the "illness" was mental in nature, not physical.

Danielle _murdered_ her colleagues because they had "the illness".

She warned Sayed, "Watch your friends, they _will_ change."

This has always led me (and others) to speculate _who_ really had the mental illness, Danielle, or her colleagues?


----------



## Test (Dec 8, 2004)

Fish Man said:


> In the episode that introduced Danielle, I felt it was strongly implied that the "illness" was mental in nature, not physical.
> 
> Danielle _murdered_ her colleagues because they had "the illness".
> 
> ...


and ethan was a little wacka-do...or was he?


----------



## BeanMeScot (Apr 17, 2002)

Man, this thread got off track. What do the number of episodes ordered have to do with THIS episode? 

I got another number to add to the mix. Boone's t-shirt had the Chinese symbol for the number 80. Anyone got anything? 

And I was wondering if the good fortune symbol Hurley was wearing is also associated with a number. For instance, I know the number (4 or 9?) that is considered very bad luck to the Chinese. It's because the word for the number is similar to Death.


----------



## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

BeanMeScot said:


> Man, this thread got off track. What do the number of episodes ordered have to do with THIS episode?


The concept is that if this were intended to be close to the end, there'd be resolutions to storylines, and if there were last-minute rewrites to extend the season, we might be able to identify some things.


----------



## borther (Jan 22, 2004)

Fish Man said:


> In the episode that introduced Danielle, I felt it was strongly implied that the "illness" was mental in nature, not physical.
> 
> Danielle _murdered_ her colleagues because they had "the illness".
> 
> ...


All good points. I humbly agree


----------



## trainman (Jan 29, 2001)

hefe said:


> Maybe that number was just written in an envelope or something even though it was wrong so nobody would ever guess. When they guessed that number, they had to fork over the loot.


I thought about this as I was closed-captioning this episode, and that was my interpretation. It would take a very, very long time to accurately count that you were putting 4,815,162,342 beans into a jar (that's 4 billion, 815 million...).

Hey, look how another 815 shows up when you write the number like that.


----------



## Magister (Oct 17, 2004)

What kind of work did Sun's Father do? I was wondering if his factories were related to the Factory that Hurley had some money in...

And by the way... Hugo was known as Hurley at the institution. I am betting he got his name there. They knew him as Hurley (the inmates). And yes he was an inmate there as well.

Lots of fun.


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

Sun's father seems to be the CEO of a car manufacturer, IIRC.


----------



## balboa dave (Jan 19, 2004)

It's done statistically. You weigh a known number of beans, a large enough sample to account for variance in bean size, then weigh all the beans. Total weight divided by sample weight times the number of beans in the sample will get you the total number of beans. It's extremely accurate.


----------



## Redux (Oct 19, 2004)

balboa dave said:


> It's done statistically. You weigh a known number of beans, a large enough sample to account for variance in bean size, then weigh all the beans. Total weight divided by sample weight times the number of beans in the sample will get you the total number of beans. It's extremely accurate.


Except in the swing states.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

balboa dave said:


> It's done statistically. You weigh a known number of beans, a large enough sample to account for variance in bean size, then weigh all the beans. Total weight divided by sample weight times the number of beans in the sample will get you the total number of beans. It's extremely accurate.


Except if you need to guess 4.8 billion beans to within 10 beans. It's not going to be that accurate. If you're gonna do it that way, you should be guessing the weight, not the count. And how much would that many beans weigh, anyway?


----------



## Kevdog (Apr 18, 2001)

Donbadabon said:


> I sent the photo to a Chinese co-worker, who doesn't know anything about the show, and they replied:
> 
> "It means good fortune, blessing"
> 
> Similar to what others have stated, but of course maybe the translation is slightly different


So, has anyone put together all of the Asian words or characters that have variously been worn by the Lost crew? Hurley was wearing "fortune"; at various times Boone has worn a shirt with a character on it that appears to be either Chinese or Korean; before she was abducted, Claire wore a pendant in the shape of an Asian character. And what about Jack's tattoo's (can't recall if they were characters or just pictures, but I have a vague recollection that they look like Thai.) Do all of these add up to anything?


----------



## BeanMeScot (Apr 17, 2002)

Kevdog said:


> at various times Boone has worn a shirt with a character on it that appears to be either Chinese or Korean;


As I stated on the previous page, it's Chinese and the number 80.


----------



## TiVoSoFine (Mar 19, 2001)

BeanMeScot said:


> As I stated on the previous page, it's Chinese and the number 80.


It's actually 84.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Kevdog said:


> ... And what about Jack's tattoo's (can't recall if they were characters or just pictures, but I have a vague recollection that they look like Thai.) Do all of these add up to anything?


I had posted them way back when on the other forum, I'll see if a link works.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/attachment.php?s=&attachmentid=28334

Edit: Nope...I'll just copy and in-line link it....


----------



## lostcristina (Mar 6, 2005)

I took a snapshot of the other medallion...... I think this is the only decent shot you can see. I went frame by frame. Hope this helps someone!




5thcrewman said:


> There was a second medallion below the one seen here. I think you can see both of them better as he's helping his mom out of the Hummer.


----------



## balboa dave (Jan 19, 2004)

hefe said:


> Except if you need to guess 4.8 billion beans to within 10 beans. It's not going to be that accurate. If you're gonna do it that way, you should be guessing the weight, not the count. And how much would that many beans weigh, anyway?


 I was replying to trainman's questiion about how to count a large quantity. I described the method used. I wasn't talking about verifying the count, just reaching the original number someone wrote down. And it is still just speculation that the total number of beans was 4.8 billion something.


----------



## BitbyBlit (Aug 25, 2001)

What I want to know is what happened on April 7, 1719, other than the death of Jean-Baptiste de la Salle. Did Rambaldi die or disappear or something? We know he made the prophecies around 400 years ago, but I wonder when he was thought to have been born and to have died, if he was thought to have died at all. It might be interesting if that date had some Rambaldi significance. But, Rambaldi probably has nothing to do with anything here.


----------



## 5thcrewman (Sep 23, 2003)

Speaking of dates: 
Can anyone look up what date the earth's population hit-
4,815,162,342?


----------



## smak (Feb 11, 2000)

BeanMeScot said:


> Man, this thread got off track. What do the number of episodes ordered have to do with THIS episode?
> 
> I got another number to add to the mix. Boone's t-shirt had the Chinese symbol for the number 80. Anyone got anything?
> 
> And I was wondering if the good fortune symbol Hurley was wearing is also associated with a number. For instance, I know the number (4 or 9?) that is considered very bad luck to the Chinese. It's because the word for the number is similar to Death.


It's 4. For example, the new Wynn hotel in Las Vegas will not have a floor #4.

-smak-


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

BitbyBlit said:


> What I want to know is what happened on April 7, 1719, other than the death of Jean-Baptiste de la Salle. Did Rambaldi die or disappear or something? We know he made the prophecies around 400 years ago, but I wonder when he was thought to have been born and to have died, if he was thought to have died at all. It might be interesting if that date had some Rambaldi significance. But, Rambaldi probably has nothing to do with anything here.


You do realize that's a different show, right?


----------



## MMG (Dec 11, 1999)

5thcrewman said:


> Speaking of dates:
> Can anyone look up what date the earth's population hit-
> 4,815,162,342?


Late 1984


----------



## MacThor (Feb 7, 2002)

Hmmmm....

Connect Four has 42 spaces on its grid - 7 colums, 6 rows.....

Not sure of the relevance but I thought I'd throw it out there.....

Backgammon is played with 15 checkers (each)....

Chess is played with 16 pieces (each)

There are also 42 territories in a game of "Risk"


----------



## bobcarn (Nov 18, 2001)

GameGuru said:


> Are we to assume the box company Hurley owns alot of stock in is the same one Locke worked at?


Whoa!!!

I just started reading the thread this morning, and only got a few posts into it when you mentioned this. (I couldn't watch the show until last night).

I would definitely assume that Hurley owns the box company. We're already seeing how everyone is interconnected in some way or another.


----------



## DancnDude (Feb 7, 2001)

It is really interesting seeing how all the characters are connected on the outside. It may be even more interesting seeing the characters discover this for themselves. We've had a small taste of this from Sawyer about Jack's dad.


----------



## thenightfly42 (Mar 5, 2002)

I just looked up a map for Latitude: 4° 8 Min. 15 Sec., Longitude: 16° 23 Min. 42 Sec., but that spot is in the middle of Africa. I was really hoping that would point to the location of the island.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

The pilot said that they had their problems 6 hours into the flight. What is it from Sydney to LA? 12 hours? 15? So they were almost halfway when they got into trouble and tried to turn back to Fiji.

Flight Plan Map: http://gc.kls2.com/cgi-bin/gc?PATH=...LOR=white&MAP-STYLE=&MAP-CENTER=SYD&ETOPS=330

Crude region map:


----------



## chipsndip (Jul 8, 2002)

OK, so I thought maybe the numbers were a cipher code against the lyrics to "La Mer", since it was also written on the maps. If I take the words corresponding to the numbers, I get "voit des la mer la voyez", which according to BabelFish means "The sea sees see it". Not exactly clarifying, but strange that all the "see" words show up...

Probably nothing, but worth a shot.

-Sean


----------



## spot1x (Jun 8, 2004)

thenightfly42 said:


> I just looked up a map for Latitude: 4° 8 Min. 15 Sec., Longitude: 16° 23 Min. 42 Sec., but that spot is in the middle of Africa. I was really hoping that would point to the location of the island.


Put them in backwards and your in the ocean, but off the coast of italy

Map


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

spot1x said:


> Put them in backwards and your in the ocean, but off the coast of italy
> 
> Map


 It doesn't really make much difference, but you put 26 instead of 23 in your coordinates. It's still in the middle of the Mediterranean if you do it right.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Well, you're never going to get close until you adjust the numbers to be in the southern and western hemispheres...that is, negative numbers.
Now, if you break up the numbers like this, you are pretty much right in the flight path...

-4° 8' 15" , -162° 34' 2"


----------



## jash69 (Feb 25, 2005)

dude!

this show you why eisner is a complete friggin' idiot and should have been tossed from disney years ago!


----------



## BitbyBlit (Aug 25, 2001)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> You do realize that's a different show, right?


Yeah, but like a local news reporter trying to find the [insert city/town] connection, I saw the 4 and 7 and tried to make the Rambaldi connection. The connection looks even weaker now, though, as in fact 1719 is around 300 years ago, not 400.

<Jon Stewart>Damn you non-existant 0th century!</Jon Stewart>

I still stand by my last sentence, however.


----------



## oski87 (Dec 12, 2003)

jasonander said:


> What happened during minutes 32 and 33? Between when Lenny was being dragged out of the room in the psych ward and Hurley was walking on the suspension bridge? The cable company decided to inform us about a kid that was kidnapped over 100 miles away then. They could have at least done it on a commercial or done it with some scrolling text at the top of the screen, not interrupt LOST!


I'm going to assume that was a bad attempt at humor, otherwise you have priorities so messed up that even referring to you as a member of the human race is pretty questionable!!


----------



## BrettStah (Nov 12, 2000)

oski87 said:


> I'm going to assume that was a bad attempt at humor, otherwise you have priorities so messed up that even referring to you as a member of the human race is pretty questionable!!


It's not so much a matter of priorities of the viewer than that of the local TV stations... how often do they interrupt the commercial breaks with tornado warnings, amber alerts, etc.? In my experience, they don't. They interrupt the show instead. What some of my local stations have gone to is a shrunken box with the show, with scrolling text at the bottom, with possibly some radar image on the side. This seems to be a good compromise, as long as they don't overuse it.


----------



## JoeBarbs (Dec 1, 2003)

Lets get back to talking about Hurleys weight. its much more interesting. Maybe by the final episode he will actually be heavier than the first episode.


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

There was a clue in that Amber Alert...I'm sure of it!


----------



## Kevdog (Apr 18, 2001)

BrettStah said:


> It's not so much a matter of priorities of the viewer than that of the local TV stations... how often do they interrupt the commercial breaks with tornado warnings, amber alerts, etc.? In my experience, they don't.


Ummm, that's because it's supposed to be *important* information they cut away for and TV stations know that people walk away from the TV (or, if you have Tivo, fast forward) during commercials.


----------



## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

Not to mention they would seriously piss off their sponsors if a commercial that they paid to air did not... no matter what the reason.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

PJO1966 said:


> Not to mention they would seriously piss off their sponsors if a commercial that they paid to air did not... no matter what the reason.


In other words, commerce trumps public service, which I think was the original point...


----------



## pawchikapawpaw (Aug 17, 2004)

hey is this relevant? i just realized, hurley just acquired a box company, and locke worked in a box company. i just thought it was interesting.


----------



## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

pawchikapawpaw said:


> hey is this relevant? i just realized, hurley just acquired a box company, and locke worked in a box company. i just thought it was interesting.


yup.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/search.php?searchid=123431


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Dontcha hate when a thread hasn't even broken the 400 mark, and people still can't be bothered to read before posting?


----------



## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Dontcha hate when a thread hasn't even broken the 400 mark, and people still can't be bothered to read before posting?


Amateurs... 

Obligatory disclaimer: My above snide comment should in no way be construed to be inflammatory. It is a joke. I have been guilty of the same myself.


----------



## pawchikapawpaw (Aug 17, 2004)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Dontcha hate when a thread hasn't even broken the 400 mark, and people still can't be bothered to read before posting?


well geez, SOR-REEE, mr. hall monitor.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

I was hoping he was joking...


----------



## pawchikapawpaw (Aug 17, 2004)

me too. let it be a joke, otherwise, i'd have to bring it, work it, put my thang down and reverse it.


----------



## PJO1966 (Mar 5, 2002)

"It's already been broughten"


----------



## TiVoJedi (Mar 1, 2002)

Hey! It took me like 4 days to read this thread.. albeit a little at a time, but finally got to the end. Muhahaha! 

Excellant episode!


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

pawchikapawpaw said:


> me too. let it be a joke, otherwise, i'd have to bring it, work it, put my thang down and reverse it.


I meant you...


----------



## JLWINE (Jun 18, 2002)

digdug said:


> Very interesting. I did some digging and came up with a site where you can download and listen to Mp3 files of actual Numbers Station recordings from the last 20 years.
> 
> http://www.archive.org/audio/audio-...ed&PHPSESSID=adc7edd0a9905cf40aa7de434a3203ee


Listening to some of those, especially "The Swedish Rhapsody" is kind of creepy.


----------



## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Some pretty funny MadTV Lost skits:

http://www.lost-mm.com/video/madtv1.wmv

http://www.lost-mm.com/video/madtv2.wmv


----------



## lew313 (Jul 2, 2002)

orome said:


> 23 is sacred to Discordians, fwiw.


Why don't they just get Agent whats is name's brother from Numb3rs to figure it all out. LOL


----------



## whoknows55 (Jun 17, 2001)

Where is a good place to get a summary? My TiVo ran out of space while I was out of town.


----------



## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

whoknows55 said:


> Where is a good place to get a summary? My TiVo ran out of space while I was out of town.


television without pity, of course.


----------



## Mike20878 (Jun 8, 2001)

Turtleboy said:


> television without pity, of course.


If you want to read through 15+ pages...


----------



## whoknows55 (Jun 17, 2001)

Turtleboy said:


> television without pity, of course.


I'm trying but I think there was a glossary that I missed.


----------



## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

I finally watched the show, and I finally read this entire thread. Guess which took longer? 

And now oh so many weeks until we find out what's inside of that German submarine.


----------



## MannyVjr (Nov 20, 2002)

Paperboy2003 said:


> Hate to nitpick, but people who are worth 156 mil don't fly commercial.


And they don't drive themselves either, but my guess is that Hurley being "new money" he's not used to the jet set life.


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

NerdXing said:


> My guess is an underground bunker. If the numbers are significant how about:
> 
> Coordinates, don't you need 6 coordinates to pinpoint a place in the sky?
> Lock Combination
> Radio Frequency?


No, you just need 2, right ascention and declanation. RA is like longitude, left to right and declanation is like latitude, up and down.

-p (just watched the show via Tivo 9 days later)


----------



## JMikeD (Jun 10, 2002)

philw1776 said:


> No, you just need 2, right ascention and declanation. RA is like longitude, left to right and declanation is like latitude, up and down.
> 
> -p (just watched the show via Tivo 9 days later)


Two coordinates, but six numbers: hours, minutes, seconds, and degrees, minutes, seconds.


----------



## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

philw1776 said:


> No, you just need 2, right ascention and declanation. RA is like longitude, left to right and declanation is like latitude, up and down.
> 
> -p (just watched the show via Tivo 9 days later)


It's a long thread, but we already went through this. 

You need 3, BTW. 2 numbers gives you a line through space. The third, a distance, can give you a point. Of course that point is relative from some position, too, but you might assume something like the center of the Earth as the origin, or the sun, or something else. Oh, but then you need to consider time, too, since all those things in space, including your reference point are moving relative to everything else.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

dswallow said:


> You need 3, BTW. 2 numbers gives you a line through space. The third, a distance, can give you a point.


Actually, if you're using longitude and latitude, the first number gives you a line, the second gives you an intersecting line, and then you have your location.


----------



## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Actually, if you're using longitude and latitude, the first number gives you a line, the second gives you an intersecting line, and then you have your location.


If you're limiting yourself to surface-of-the-earth.


----------



## miscellaneous (Oct 28, 2004)

Nerds.


Sorry, just wanted to make a contribution.  

I can only imagine the path this thread is going to take before the next ep airs....


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

dswallow said:


> It's a long thread, but we already went through this.
> 
> You need 3, BTW. 2 numbers gives you a line through space. The third, a distance, can give you a point. Of course that point is relative from some position, too, but you might assume something like the center of the Earth as the origin, or the sun, or something else. Oh, but then you need to consider time, too, since all those things in space, including your reference point are moving relative to everything else.


Yah, I posted B4 I realized that I was not at the end of the topic.
However, celestial coordinates are not time sensitive. They're self correcting, i.e. the RA shifts with time.

Loved the show. Hurley has really grown on me (no pun intended) as an actor. Love his comments. Well written stuff.

Unfortunately, I will be missing future episodes as it conflicts with American Dreams and I wish to stay married.

-p (can't record one channel and watch another)


----------



## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

philw1776 said:


> Unfortunately, I will be missing future episodes as it conflicts with American Dreams and I wish to stay married.


Lost is rerun often enough you'll probably catch them all if you keep a season pass on it, just at lower priority than American Dreams.

And American Dreams doesn't seem to be long for this Earth, anyway.


----------



## Muftak (Sep 19, 2004)

MacThor said:


> Hmmmm....
> 
> Connect Four has 42 spaces on its grid - 7 colums, 6 rows.....


This is interesting, the paper that Hurley swipped with the numbers on it has 7 colums and 6 rows of the numbers too.

Do the red and black checkers that are in the Connect Four game have any meaning?


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

philw1776 said:


> Unfortunately, I will be missing future episodes as it conflicts with American Dreams and I wish to stay married.


First, when did American Dreams move to Wednesday? Second, why would they move to this timeslot? Isn't Lost bigger competition than Extreme Makeover Home Edition and The Simpsons?

Third, you don't have to miss Lost. Just go get the eps you missed on www.btefnet.net.


----------



## whodat1 (Jul 7, 2004)

Some people in this thread have mentioned Hurley and the curse of the numbers. How this curse does not seem to be affecting the other castaways (in fact benefitting them, since they DID get the battery they were after). I wonder if the curse is nullified because Hurley is back on the island where the numbers originated from? Maybe the curse only works in the outside world?

which brings up another problem....Sam & Lenny heard the numbers while working in a military listening post. Why has no one heard the French girls broadcast in 16 years of ever increasing technology????


----------



## MacThor (Feb 7, 2002)

Muftak said:


> This is interesting, the paper that Hurley swipped with the numbers on it has 7 colums and 6 rows of the numbers too.
> 
> Do the red and black checkers that are in the Connect Four game have any meaning?


I just started looking at classic two-person strategy games that have light/dark pieces.

Backgammon, used often on the show - 15 pieces each.
Chess - 16 pieces each.
In a stale-mated game of C4, you could have 42 pieces. 21 each, however.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

MacThor said:


> I just started looking at classic two-person strategy games that have light/dark pieces.
> 
> Backgammon, used often on the show - 15 pieces each.
> Chess - 16 pieces each.
> In a stale-mated game of C4, you could have 42 pieces. 21 each, however.


Go, 361 pieces, 180 white, 181 black...


----------



## mwhip (Jul 22, 2002)

Just wanted everyone to know that the hiatus is not going to be 6 weeks only 4. They moved it up, lifted from TvTome.com:



> 19. 1-19	118	30-Mar-2005 Deux Ex Machina
> 20.	1-20	119	06-Apr-2005 Do No Harm
> 21.	1-21	120	20-Apr-2005 The Greater Good (a.k.a. Sides)
> 22.	1-22	121	27-Apr-2005 Born to Run


----------



## Azlen (Nov 25, 2002)

mwhip said:


> Just wanted everyone to know that the hiatus is not going to be 6 weeks only 4.


They are going to have two episodes in May as well. Lost is going to have 24 episodes this season rather than the regular 22.


----------



## mitkraft (Feb 21, 2003)

philw1776 said:


> -p (can't record one channel and watch another)


I'm just curious how this is possible. Are you using Satelite with a stand alone tivo in an area that doesn't get ANY over the air signal or what?

I mean in a pinch I can stick my finger on the coax-in of my TV and get a fuzzy channel 13 (my local Lost carrier). Can you not tune a TV to analog OTA?


----------



## tigger (Feb 17, 2002)

Azlen said:


> They are going to have two episodes in May as well. Lost is going to have 24 episodes this season rather than the regular 22.


Good news on both fronts! Notice, though, that there is a 1-week gap in the new schedule, no new episode on April 13 apparently. (just to make sure everyone noticed....  )


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

mitkraft said:


> I'm just curious how this is possible. Are you using Satelite with a stand alone tivo in an area that doesn't get ANY over the air signal or what?
> 
> I mean in a pinch I can stick my finger on the coax-in of my TV and get a fuzzy channel 13 (my local Lost carrier). Can you not tune a TV to analog OTA?


Right, no OTA available that is viewable. I used to get my TiVo and HDTV signal OTA when I lived west of Boston. Great reception. 
Seacoast NH is just too far, plus blocked by an elderly housing 4 story complex.

My bet is that after the episodes I'll miss, they'll still be lost and we won't know the sectets of the island. Any takers?

-p


----------



## DLiquid (Sep 17, 2001)

LlamaLarry said:


> Looks more like a de/compression chamber to me or at least like the ones I have been in.


The hatch is actually the exit of the holodeck.


----------



## Muftak (Sep 19, 2004)

MacThor said:


> I just started looking at classic two-person strategy games that have light/dark pieces.
> 
> Backgammon, used often on the show - 15 pieces each.
> Chess - 16 pieces each.
> In a stale-mated game of C4, you could have 42 pieces. 21 each, however.


I meant more on the placement of the checkers rather than the colors red and black. For example, do the red checkers make a certain pattern that means something.

Probably thinking about it way too much...


----------



## Vito the TiVo (Oct 27, 2003)

Azlen said:


> They are going to have two episodes in May as well. Lost is going to have 24 episodes this season rather than the regular 22.


And eppy 24 will be 90 minutes with the last half hour airing commercial free!!!!


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## chewbaccad (Feb 16, 2005)

they tried for millenia to figure out what the question was to the answer of 42 

Maybe the writers are just Douglas Adams fans.


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

Maybe they're episode numbers when something important or related happens.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

dswallow said:


> Maybe they're episode numbers when something important or related happens.


 Well, if you count the pilot as two episodes, ep. #4 was Walkabout, where we found out about Locke's previous life. Ep. #8 was Confidence Man where we found out about Sawyer's story and that he is not really Sawyer at all. Ep. #15 was Homecoming where Claire returned but didn't remember anything, we found out about Charlie's need to prove that someone can count on him, and Charlie capped Ethan. Ep. #16 was Outlaws where we learn that Sawyer killed the wrong guy and met Jack's dad in the bar. We don't yet know anything about Eps. #23 and 42.


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## ronsch (Sep 7, 2001)

Finally got around to watching this one last night and it did take longer to read this thread than to watch the episode.

I can't believe nobody mentioned another great line. When Hurley went to visit Sam's wife and she opens the door and sees him:

"If we weren't in the middle of nowhere I'd think you were someone who is *LOST* . Or something close to that anyway....


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

ronsch said:


> Finally got around to watching this one last night and it did take longer to read this thread than to watch the episode.
> 
> I can't believe nobody mentioned another great line. When Hurley went to visit Sam's wife and she opens the door and sees him:
> 
> "If we weren't in the middle of nowhere I'd think you were someone who is *LOST* . Or something close to that anyway....


It was probably mentioned in the thread for "Numbers." We have made note of the useage of the word "lost." It's happened several other times also.


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## thenightfly42 (Mar 5, 2002)

shaunrose said:


> I wonder how many people will play those numbers in the lottery this week!


OK, I'm bouncing this thread from a distance, but I was reading a lottery article linked from FARK (N.Y. cookies help diners win fortune), which included the following quote:


> He added: "We had to look at everything to do with humans: television shows, pattern plays, lottery columns."
> 
> Earlier that month, an ABC television show, "Lost," included a sequence of winning lottery numbers. The combination didn't match the Powerball numbers, though hundreds of people had played it: 4, 8, 15, 16, 23 and 42.


Oy.


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## Solemnwishes (Oct 12, 2005)

Newbie to the forum, in the UK we have just seen sawyer and kate find bodies in the water, and her case with the plane in!! I have been reading this thread (fantastic by the way) and wanted to post about the numbers being episode numbers, maybe they mean something? Looks like someone here went with that , unfortunately I will have to wait much longer than you for episodes 23 and 42 lol.

Anyone remember the program "Fantasy Island"? Place where people went make their wishes come true? Locke can now walk, charley is off drugs, Walt is a Father etc.

Thats my idea anyway!!!

Ade.


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## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

Repeating this episode tonight. Just wanted to say that, yes, they do add up to 108.


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