# 20.4.4 Release Notes



## TiVoMargret

Later tonight we will begin updating TiVo Roamio, TiVo Premiere, and TiVo Mini boxes with the 20.4.4 "Fall Update". There is still time to request an early update at tivo.com/priority. Customers that don't request a priority update will be automatically updated near the end of this month.

Here are some of the changes:
- You can set a Season Pass to record on all channels, instead of just one
- You can set up a Season Pass even if there is no episode airing in the next two weeks. (Shows may appear in Search up to six months before they first air.)
- New Home Shopping Network app in Apps & Games
- Updated Spotify app with an enhanced playlist and new look (in Music & Photos)
- Fixed the bug where Panel model would reset to Full mode after a restart
- Fixed a problem where some deleted shows never left the "Recently Deleted" folder
- Note: this release is required in order to use Android Streaming once the new Android App is released (expected at the end of this month)

I am expecting one more update this year, most likely in late November.

--Margret


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## Keen

Thanks!


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## Sixto

Cool, looking forward to it. Thanks. (have all 7 boxes set to update)


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## pjw150

Thanks you Margret.


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## innocentfreak

Thanks I am definitely excited about the new season pass options. 

Does this also address the reboots some of us have had randomly since the last update?


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## BigJimOutlaw

Thanks Margret!!



TiVoMargret said:


> I am expecting one more update this year, most likely in late November.


How do you do that Vudu so well?  (sorry, had to do it.)


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## tatergator1

BigJimOutlaw said:


> Thanks Margret!!
> 
> How do you do that Vudu so well?


I'm inclined to think Vudu will show up before the November update. Based on nooneuknow's posts, it's probably already in the current Tivo software.

I think Amazon Prime will be the big news of the November update.


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## BlackBetty

tatergator1 said:


> I think Amazon Prime will be the big news of the November update.


I hope you are right.


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## Joe Siegler

TiVoMargret said:


> - You can set up a Season Pass even if there is no episode airing in the next two weeks. (Shows may appear in Search up to six months before they first air.)


I can stop using the trick of using a wishlist, and then switch over to a season pass within two weeks then. 

I also wish when you're going through the deleted folder list and do something with one of them it stays there, instead of snapping back up to the top. When you have around 800 programs in there, that's a big pain in the backside.


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## consumedsoul

+1 for season pass features (all channels and 6 months ahead)!

Thanks Margaret!


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## NorthAlabama

these will all be very useful to operation and welcomed, thanks for the improvements and the "heads up"...signed up and waiting for the priority list upgrades to begin! 

margret - will you be starting a "release notes" thread in the premiere forum?


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## JWhites

TiVoMargret said:


> - Note: this release is required in order to use Android Streaming once the new Android App is released (expected at the end of this month)
> 
> I am expecting one more update this year, most likely in late November.


When can we get the actual Stream updated itself?


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## sirfergy

Any chance we can get a prefer HD option for season passes?


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## JWhites

sirfergy said:


> Any chance we can get a prefer HD option for season passes?


If not, I'd just uncheck the SD version of the channel in the channel lineup. This way only the HD channel is available to choose from. Much easier.


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## Jed1

NorthAlabama said:


> these will all be very useful to operation and welcomed, thanks for the improvements and the "heads up"...signed up and waiting for the priority list upgrades to begin!
> 
> margret - will you be starting a "release notes" thread in the premiere forum?


This is not necessary anymore since the Premiere and Roamio share the same UI.


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## NorthAlabama

Jed1 said:


> This is not necessary anymore since the Premiere and Roamio share the same UI.


yes, understood, but this thread is in the roamio forum, where premiere users might not think to look.

also, i know it seems redundant, but the hardware is different, and each might react differently to the same software - like the same software might react unexpectedly on different computers.


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## trip1eX

cool. the first 2 issues were a bit annoying.


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## JWhites

NorthAlabama said:


> yes, understood, but this thread is in the roamio forum, where premiere users might not think to look.


I understand what you mean, it needs to be posted in both threads because Premiere users may not check the Roamio threads same as Roamio users may not check the Premiere threads.


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## Jed1

NorthAlabama said:


> yes, understood, but this thread is in the roamio forum, where premiere users might not think to look.
> 
> also, i know it seems redundant, but the hardware is different, and each might react differently to the same software - like the same software might react unexpectedly on different computers.


Looking at Margret's post count, she's not on the forum that much. About five times since the summer update. Same goes for her Twitter page. Either she does not have much time or she may have more important things to do.

One main problem with both the Roamio and Premiere threads is every time someone has a problem they start a new thread instead of posting the issue in Margret's update thread. It gets very difficult to keep track of issues.

It is probably easier on Margret to have one master thread to cover each update.


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## innocentfreak

JWhites said:


> If not, I'd just uncheck the SD version of the channel in the channel lineup. This way only the HD channel is available to choose from. Much easier.


Not always an option. For example I get Fox Sports 1 in HD and Fox Sports 2 in SD only and the same with History channel and H2 which is SD only.


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## JWhites

Jed1 said:


> Looking at Margret's post count, she's not on the forum that much. About five times since the summer update. Same goes for her Twitter page. Either she does not have much time or she may have more important things to do.
> 
> One main problem with both the Roamio and Premiere threads is every time someone has a problem they start a new thread instead of posting the issue in Margret's update thread. It gets very difficult to keep track of issues.
> 
> It is probably easier on Margret to have one master thread to cover each update.


She's done it many times with previous updates and usually it's just a copy and paste unless the update specifically addresses an issue with one product line and not the other.


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## JWhites

innocentfreak said:


> Not always an option. For example I get Fox Sports 1 in HD and Fox Sports 2 in SD only and the same with History channel and H2 which is SD only.


Ok then don't uncheck those SD channels in the channel lineup settings if you don't get them in HD as well.


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## innocentfreak

JWhites said:


> Ok then don't uncheck those SD channels in the channel lineup settings if you don't get them in HD as well.


This doesn't address the issue then of having HD as the preferred option especially when a show runs on both channels.


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## Sixto

Downloaded. Restarting now.


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## Dan203

innocentfreak said:


> This doesn't address the issue then of having HD as the preferred option especially when a show runs on both channels.


TiVo always prefers HD. SPs are not actually channel specific, they're call sign specific. In some areas people have two channels with the same call sign, one SD and one HD, and TiVo added a feature long ago to prefer HD when both are active in the list. I'm betting that with this feature if the same show is available on two channels, at the same time, it will give preference to HD. Unless you have "all episodes with duplicates" set in which case it will record both. If they're not at the same time then likely the first one will record, regardless of channel, and subsequent recordings will be ignored due to the 28 day rule.

Personally I have all non-HD channels turned off. I can't stand SD anymore, even if it's the only option, so if something is only available in SD I stop watching or I download from BT.


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## JWhites

innocentfreak said:


> This doesn't address the issue then of having HD as the preferred option especially when a show runs on both channels.


It does if by unchecking the SD variant of the channel, you are only offered the choice of the HD versions left. For example all my channels are offered in SD between 2 through 300 and offered in HD from 800 and beyond. I went into settings, then channel list, and unchecked all the SD channels that I also received in HD, so now I'm only offered those channels in HD in the channel guide, season passes, discovery bar, and what to watch now, since now as far as the TiVo is concerned the SD variant doesn't exist in my lineup. In short, if I "hide" the SD version, I'm only offered the HD version. I started doing this before I was aware of the mechanism Dan203 mentioned in his post above since I think it only applies to season passes and not the discovery bar or what to watch now offerings.


Dan203 said:


> Personally I have all non-HD channels turned off. I can't stand SD anymore, even if it's the only option, so if something is only available in SD I stop watching or I download from BT.


Same here, only instead of BT, I look for it on demand or Netflix or Hulu Plus.


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## Sixto

Just setup a few future shows, works well on 20.4.4.


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## innocentfreak

JWhites said:


> It does if by unchecking the SD variant of the channel, you are only offered the choice of the HD versions left.


If you only get the SD channel, there is no HD version left.

Yes it is great if you can remove all the SD variants and assuming they stay removed which doesn't always happen, the original request doesn't affect you. 
This isn't always the case which is why having a HD preferred option would be beneficial.


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## rainwater

innocentfreak said:


> This isn't always the case which is why having a HD preferred option would be beneficial.


If it works like wishlists, the HD preferred option is implied. Since last year, wishlists prefer HD channels over SD channels when on at the same time.


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## tomhorsley

TiVoMargret said:


> - Note: this release is required in order to use Android Streaming once the new Android App is released (expected at the end of this month)


OK, Now I have a reason to sign up for the update .


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## nooneuknow

Those who have been updated might want to force a manual service connection post-update. I did, and the "Loading" final step is taking longer to complete than the download, loading, reboot, and install of the actual update.

I can hear the hard drive thrashing like mad (usually I can't hear it). So, that post update connection is making a LOT of changes to something.

Once it's done, I'll go hunting in the logs to see if there's any sign of the Amazon module being present, but not available for use, like I found with VuduHost, before this update.

I see things going one of two ways:

1. TiVo holds-out on allowing access to Vudu, until Amazon is ready.
2. TiVo "flips the switch" allowing access to Vudu before the next update, but Amazon comes later.


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## jaj2276

My 20.4.4 is up and running on a Tivo Premiere. As expected with the release notes, there's really nothing to note (I never experienced the aspect ratio bug, I don't have a Spotify premium account, and I couldn't imagine ever opening an HSN app let alone watching something on HSN).


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## jaj2276

And I just changed my Pardon the Interruption Season Pass to cover all channels (sometimes they get preempted on ESPN and air on ESPN2 or even ESPNNEWS). Currently the "new" one airs on ESPN at 5:30 and then reruns are later in the evening on 2 or news. I'll be curious to see if Tivo will pick up only the ESPN airing.

Also I used the Add Season Pass for shows not in guide feature. I've added Gotham. The channel choice was only the "All Channels" selection. I'm curious as to whether I'll be able to add mid-season shows this far in advance.

So at least these two things seem to work as advertised.


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## Rob Helmerichs

One issue I'm having is that I can't set up Season Passes for certain shows...although it's a Search issue, not an SP issue. E.g., American Horror Story...it just won't search for it. Another one is Big Driver. The message is something like "Search is not available; try again later," but if I search for something else it works fine.


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## lpwcomp

jaj2276 said:


> And I just changed my Pardon the Interruption Season Pass to cover all channels (sometimes they get preempted on ESPN and air on ESPN2 or even ESPNNEWS). Currently the "new" one airs on ESPN at 5:30 and then reruns are later in the evening on 2 or news. I'll be curious to see if Tivo will pick up only the ESPN airing.


Looking at the guide data, I suspect it will pick up every scheduled showing. However, if you're expecting it to be recorded from an alternate channel if it gets moved at the last minute, it ain't gonna happen.


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## rainwater

lpwcomp said:


> Looking at the guide data, I suspect it will pick up every scheduled showing. However, if you're expecting it to be recorded from an alternate channel if it gets moved at the last minute, it ain't gonna happen.


What do you mean? It surely will only record the first airing of the day and not the repeats. And there are times when the first airing is on ESPN2 so it should record from that channel. Obviously if the guide data is wrong, it will not record the correct airing but that is rare.


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## kbmb

nooneuknow said:


> Those who have been updated might want to force a manual service connection post-update. I did, and the "Loading" final step is taking longer to complete than the download, loading, reboot, and install of the actual update.
> 
> I can hear the hard drive thrashing like mad (usually I can't hear it). So, that post update connection is making a LOT of changes to something.
> 
> Once it's done, I'll go hunting in the logs to see if there's any sign of the Amazon module being present, but not available for use, like I found with VuduHost, before this update.
> 
> I see things going one of two ways:
> 
> 1. TiVo holds-out on allowing access to Vudu, until Amazon is ready.
> 2. TiVo "flips the switch" allowing access to Vudu before the next update, but Amazon comes later.


2 boxes updated and 2 forced connections post install. Both went quickly, no issues.

-Kevin


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## AdamNJ

TiVoMargret said:


> - Note: this release is required in order to use Android Streaming once the new Android App is released (expected at the end of this month)


Margaret, I hope the app will debut in the Amazon app store the same time it becomes available in the Google play store; I know some apps, like a game I play, is always weeks or months behind on updates to Amazon devices.


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## rainwater

nooneuknow said:


> Those who have been updated might want to force a manual service connection post-update.


I would advise against it. Unless there is some sort of post install service hiccup, forcing a connection right after the install is always going to take forever because the system is usually rather busy right after an update.


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## lpwcomp

rainwater said:


> What do you mean? It surely will only record the first airing of the day and not the repeats. And there are times when the first airing is on ESPN2 so it should record from that channel. Obviously if the guide data is wrong, it will not record the correct airing but that is rare.


The guide data for PTI does not contain individual episode information, so the TiVo has no way to know what had or has not been recorded. It looks like this is the case for everything on the ESPN channels except for actual sporting events.

Check your todo list to see what is scheduled to record.


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## nooneuknow

kbmb said:


> 2 boxes updated and 2 forced connections post install. Both went quickly, no issues.
> 
> -Kevin


30+ minutes on the first post-update forced connection, for mine. The second flew right through. Maybe my guide data had something wrong with it and it was spotted by the integrity checks updates runs. Who knows...


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## nooneuknow

rainwater said:


> I would advise against it. Unless there is some sort of post install service hiccup, forcing a connection right after the install is always going to take forever because the system is usually rather busy right after an update.


I could see that on a Premiere, but never have seen it on a Roamio. I always do a forced connection, immediately following an update, going all the way back to my first TiVo HDs.

If anything, by the time it completes, that would be a good indicator that all post-update routines had finished, and it's time to start trying things out, IMO.


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## rainwater

lpwcomp said:


> The guide data for PTI does not contain individual episode information, so the TiVo has no way to know what had or has not been recorded.


That is true. I checked and PTI does not have a original air date which would make it record all airings.


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## jaj2276

lpwcomp said:


> Looking at the guide data, I suspect it will pick up every scheduled showing. However, if you're expecting it to be recorded from an alternate channel if it gets moved at the last minute, it ain't gonna happen.


Last minute I don't have an issue with, just when ESPN covers the US Open (golf or tennis) and moves the show to ESPN2. I too suspect that it will grab all the recordings but that's fine since I have elected it to only keep 2 episodes (I don't really care if I get the ESPN and ESPN2 recordings or the ESPN2 and ESPNNEWS recordings). I'll make sure this season pass is the lowest priority so its repeat showings won't take priority over our other season passes.

Interestingly enough, it didn't seem like changing this existing recording to "All Channels" worked. I must have changed it like 10 times and every time I went back in to Season Pass Manager, it still showed the recording for ESPN as opposed to "all channels."

I then tried changing the season pass to a different real channel (ESPN2) and increase the episodes. Both of these changes are kept.

I next tried changing the season back to all channels and increasing the episodes. Both of these changes were kept. So not sure why I had to pick a new real channel and then select all channels, but


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## mattack

sirfergy said:


> Any chance we can get a prefer HD option for season passes?


and I would vote for the opposite (though I realize they'll likely never add that -- I just have many HD channels un-checked, esp so they don't accidentally "catch" recordings via wishlists)... as an option, that is.

Even though I love wishlists, being able to record on all channels(*) is good... so I don't have to cull out other recordings that match "Nova" title wishlist, for example.

(*) The really geeky me would want to be able to optionally pick very specific channels.. that would also let me work around the "don't want HD" issue.. but I realize this is too rare of a use case to actually be added.


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## lpwcomp

I'm really looking forward to changing my WSOP season pass to "All channels".


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## nooneuknow

mattack said:


> and I would vote for the opposite (though I realize they'll likely never add that -- I just have many HD channels un-checked, esp so they don't accidentally "catch" recordings via wishlists)... as an option, that is.


Yeah, +1 vote for wanting to force SD only. Otherwise, I have to make my ARWLs the slow & hard way, specifying multiple parameters, or I could get too many unwanted ones, taking up too much space, too fast, even with 3TB. That aside, I'd still prefer 98% of ARWLs in SD.

ARWLs also make a mess of the TDL and history lists, when you create one that's too broad (like tends to happen when you simply use the auto create wishlist function), remove or reconfigure it, then have to see all the "won't record/didn't record because a member of your household cancelled it" entries.

I've had to to Clear Program Info & TDL, just to clean up the resulting mess, from letting the TiVo create the wishlist, then cancelling/changing it.

I want FRO recordings in HD, and repeats/everything in SD. I don't see getting much use out of the multi-channel SP function.

I've surpassed 600 1 hour episodes of Supernatural, and 600 30 minute episodes of The Simpsons in SD. Either one, in HD would take more than 3TB, for a single SP.

I guess I should just be thankful I have Cox, not TWC, where everything gets forced to HD. That would ruin everything for me.

I still miss the HD Recordings folder (for finding quick picks to free space). But, KMTTG fills in for that, as long as I have my laptop at my side.

Checking and unchecking channels from the list is useless with Cox. They are always renaming groups of channels, like FXPHD to FXHDP to FXHD to FXP, and on and on. TiVo sees this as I just had 20 channels deleted, followed by 20 channels added, plus every cablecard firmware update resets the list. The list is so haphazard in what has both SD & HD, and what is only one, or the other, it's all just too much work to manage and maintain. It's easier to just make multiple SPs.


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## Sixto

BTW, it's actually 20.4.4a on the Roamio.


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## JWhites

After this update I have noticed that the Dolby Digital logo (and closed captioning logo too?) is now blue instead of gold. Now it's not washed out when highlighted. :up:


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## JWhites

Sixto said:


> BTW, it's actually 20.4.4a on the Roamio.


Same here on the Premiere. 20.4.4a-01-2-xxx
xxx is the first three digits of the TSN.


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## cherry ghost

Rob Helmerichs said:


> One issue I'm having is that I can't set up Season Passes for certain shows...although it's a Search issue, not an SP issue. E.g., American Horror Story...it just won't search for it. Another one is Big Driver. The message is something like "Search is not available; try again later," but if I search for something else it works fine.


I was able to set an SP for "American Horror Story:Freak Show". It didn't show up until I got to "American H" in the search. Previous seasons were showing with just "American".


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## trip1eX

The "all channels" is good for sports which often switch channels. And I guess shows on Premium channels because they play on multiple channels. Also syndicated shows that are on multiple cable channels.


But...

seems like you still need 2 seasons passes if you want to record new seasons of a show and syndicated repeats but don't want the syndicated repeats to erase your new episodes before you watch them. Syndicated repeats are show much more frequently and sometimes they will run a marathon of them.

hhhmm maybe I'd be pretty safe if I switched the amount of shows to keep at 25 instead of 10.


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## The Merg

Update done. Anyone else have Pandora listed twice when they go to Music apps? 


- Merg

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## shamilian

The Merg said:


> Update done. Anyone else have Pandora listed twice she they go to Music apps?


It has been that way...

One is the newer ( worse ) html5 version,
the other the older ( better ) Flash version.

This is only on Roamio, not on Premiere


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## rainwater

cherry ghost said:


> I was able to set an SP for "American Horror Story:Freak Show". It didn't show up until I got to "American H" in the search. Previous seasons were showing with just "American".


That is based on popularity. So for a newer show that hasn't aired, it will not come up as quickly.


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## lpwcomp

jaj2276 said:


> Interestingly enough, it didn't seem like changing this existing recording to "All Channels" worked. I must have changed it like 10 times and every time I went back in to Season Pass Manager, it still showed the recording for ESPN as opposed to "all channels."
> 
> I then tried changing the season pass to a different real channel (ESPN2) and increase the episodes. Both of these changes are kept.
> 
> I next tried changing the season back to all channels and increasing the episodes. Both of these changes were kept. So not sure why I had to pick a new real channel and then select all channels, but


I just modified my WSOP SP to "All Channels" and it worked first time. Did you press the "A" button after making the change?


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## Rob Helmerichs

rainwater said:


> That is based on popularity. So for a newer show that hasn't aired, it will not come up as quickly.


But NOTHING came up. It just said the message about search not being available.

(I really miss Search Classic. It worked, always. This one kinda works, sometimes.)


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## JWhites

Worked for me by putting in AMERICAN, I just had to scroll down a little bit. It was below American Horror Story: Asylum. Also came up with AMER again with some scrolling.


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## Dan203

When you add a new SP for a show that is not currently in the guide it sets it for All Channels automatically. No way to manually select the channel you actually want it for, which means I have to go back and fix it once the show airs. Not quite as useful that way.


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## lpwcomp

Dan203 said:


> When you add a new SP for a show that is not currently in the guide it sets it for All Channels automatically. No way to manually select the channel you actually want it for, which means I have to go back and fix it once the show airs. Not quite as useful that way.


Still better than a wishlist.


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## innocentfreak

Dan203 said:


> When you add a new SP for a show that is not currently in the guide it sets it for All Channels automatically. No way to manually select the channel you actually want it for, which means I have to go back and fix it once the show airs. Not quite as useful that way.


Why would you change it? It should only pick up that specific show? I could see if you set for repeats though since you would now pickup syndicated airings.


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## rainwater

innocentfreak said:


> Why would you change it? It should only pick up that specific show? I could see if you set for repeats though since you would now pickup syndicated airings.


Yeah, for 99% of shows, it would not make any difference for at least for several years when it goes to syndication.


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## tim1724

Dan203 said:


> When you add a new SP for a show that is not currently in the guide it sets it for All Channels automatically. No way to manually select the channel you actually want it for, which means I have to go back and fix it once the show airs. Not quite as useful that way.


That's because it has no way of knowing which channels would show it if it's not yet appearing in the guide data.

What else can they do? List every channel in your lineup?


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## Rob Helmerichs

JWhites said:


> Worked for me by putting in AMERICAN, I just had to scroll down a little bit. It was below American Horror Story: Asylum. Also came up with AMER again with some scrolling.


Just tried it again and it worked. Maybe their servers were getting hammered last night and it chocked on common words?


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## JWhites

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Just tried it again and it worked. Maybe their servers were getting hammered last night and it chocked on common words?


Quite possibly. Don't forget that the search engine is ever-changing and dynamic and can continually improve behind the scenes. Whether TiVo is making those improvements I don't know.


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## jaj2276

lpwcomp said:


> I just modified my WSOP SP to "All Channels" and it worked first time. Did you press the "A" button after making the change?


Yep, both the A button and scrolling to the "Save the Season Pass with these settings" (or whatever it says).


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## lpwcomp

I was setting up some advance season passes and I realized there is a problem with the "All Channels" option. There is no way to tell it to prefer/limit it to the HD (or SD) channel(s).


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## JWhites

lpwcomp said:


> I was setting up some advance season passes and I realized there is a problem with the "All Channels" option. There is no way to tell it to prefer/limit it to the HD (or SD) channel(s).


Unless you hide the SD variant of the channel so the only option is HD. A work around.


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## lpwcomp

JWhites said:


> Unless you hide the SD variant of the channel so the only option is HD. A work around.


Yes, I know. But I have some SP's set up on SD channels.


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## sbiller

Latest version in my Roamio Pro is 19.1.7-USB-6

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10234487#post10234487


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## JWhites

lpwcomp said:


> Yes, I know. But I have some SP's set up on SD channels.


Then don't hide those specific channels.


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## Leon WIlkinson

Love the update!!

I was waiting for Android streaming before buying a Tab with it. So in May I bought a new Dell Computer for my Nephew...I upgraded the free Venue to the Venue 8 Pro.


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## Leon WIlkinson

Also with Copy Right flags on most stuff.  I guess the streaming won't be that big of a deal. Sending a another email to deaf ears coming in the near future.


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## Dan203

innocentfreak said:


> Why would you change it? It should only pick up that specific show? I could see if you set for repeats though since you would now pickup syndicated airings.


For the most part the "new only" setting and 28 day rule will keep the SP confined to the proper channel, but bad guide data can easily trip that up.



tim1724 said:


> That's because it has no way of knowing which channels would show it if it's not yet appearing in the guide data.
> 
> What else can they do? List every channel in your lineup?


Yes. List every channel and let me pick.

My biggest concern is conflicts. What if I set up a SP for a new show and give it a high priority. Then a few years later it's in syndication, the SP is set to "All Channels" and some bad guide data causes it to record some repeat instead of a first run of another lower priority show?

This is the kinda thing that's likely to trip people up long term.


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## markp99

Android app = yay!


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## ertyu

Some long awaited excellent new features!

I just wish there was hardware that worked here that supported them.


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## Bierboy

lpwcomp said:


> Still better than a wishlist.


Not much...


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## lpwcomp

Bierboy said:


> Not much...


At least it doesn't pick up episodes of a different series whose episode title matches.

I have to say though that they really didn't think the "All Channels" option through. They should have also added the "Get only in HD". Better yet, the options should have been "All Channels", "All HD Channels", "All SD Channels". Maybe even, for Premieres, "Cable Only", "OTA only". Even better if these were preferences rather than absolutes.


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## morac

The future Season Pass setup doesn't seem to work for all programs. I was able to add one for Gotham, but I couldn't add one for the new Flash series.


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## Rob Helmerichs

morac said:


> The future Season Pass setup doesn't seem to work for all programs. I was able to add one for Gotham, but I couldn't add one for the new Flash series.


For some of the new series, there were multiple entries, one of which was the series and one of which was...something else. I eventually figured out the right one for The Flash (IIRC, it didn't show up when I searched for Flash, but did for The Flash).


----------



## jaj2276

Rob Helmerichs said:


> For some of the new series, there were multiple entries, one of which was the series and one of which was...something else. I eventually figured out the right one for The Flash (IIRC, it didn't show up when I searched for Flash, but did for The Flash).


Same here. Searching for "Flash" only showed an entry for Flash (1990). I then went back and searched for "The Flash" and I found it.

Humorously I went to set up a season pass for A to Z and in the results, it was shown as:

to Z, A

Also, I was able to set up season passes for series that start (supposedly) in March of 2015. I was impressed with that.


----------



## Bytez

For Fios users, is it safe to assume the local channels won't be able to be streamed outside the home like the Fios Mobile app and the same channels will be available as well?


----------



## Dan203

Are you talking about TiVo streaming? TiVo streaming outside the home works for any channel not flagged as "copy once". There is a law that prevent cable companies from flagging local broadcast channels. So local channels definitely WILL be able to be streamed outside the home. In some areas those are the only channels that can be streamed because the cable company flags everything else. But I think FIOS only flags HBO, you should be able to stream everything else.

Also streaming inside the home works with all channels, even flagged ones. Only out of home streaming has limits.


----------



## TIVO_GUY_HERE

Season passes for new fall shows set up.

Didn't work so well for returning shows that also run on cable channels.


----------



## Bytez

Dan203 said:


> Are you talking about TiVo streaming? TiVo streaming outside the home works for any channel not flagged as "copy once". There is a law that prevent cable companies from flagging local broadcast channels. So local channels definitely WILL be able to be streamed outside the home. In some areas those are the only channels that can be streamed because the cable company flags everything else. But I think FIOS only flags HBO, you should be able to stream everything else.
> 
> Also streaming inside the home works with all channels, even flagged ones. Only out of home streaming has limits.


Yes, that's what I meant.

But, why are there only a limited number of channels that could be streamed inside/outside the home on the Fios Mobile app if they only flag HBO as copy once?


----------



## andyf

TIVO_GUY_HERE said:


> Season passes for new fall shows set up.
> 
> Didn't work so well for returning shows that also run on cable channels.


Shouldn't "New Only" take care of that. Oh Wait! Shows on cable that don't have a valid description, I get it!


----------



## lpwcomp

TIVO_GUY_HERE said:


> Season passes for new fall shows set up.
> 
> Didn't work so well for returning shows that also run on cable channels.


Why would you need it to?


----------



## morac

Rob Helmerichs said:


> For some of the new series, there were multiple entries, one of which was the series and one of which was...something else. I eventually figured out the right one for The Flash (IIRC, it didn't show up when I searched for Flash, but did for The Flash).


Thanks that worked. I had found "The Flash (2014)", which seems to be for Amazon only.

Also, not that I care, but I don't see the Home Shopping Network app in App & Games on my Roamio Pro after the update. I tried resetting the HDUI, but it's still not there.


----------



## Odds Bodkins

So excited for the update, I restarted while forgetting I was currently recording some shows. C'est la vie!


----------



## mattack

nooneuknow said:


> I don't see getting much use out of the multi-channel SP function.


I have multiple PBS stations, so turning things like Nova and Frontline into multi-channel SPs could help me slightly cut down my SP list. (Actually, I think I have some shows as ARWLs, and some as multiple separate SPs.. It would help get rid of duplicate SPs, and reduce the amount of false positives for ARWLs, which I think I mentioned before.)

Also, a few of my stations preempt shows for local sports fairly often but DO have regular other channels that then air the programs.. So that could be moved to single any channel SPs... (with the risk of possibly getting more syndicated no-guide-data recordings.)


----------



## TIVO_GUY_HERE

lpwcomp said:


> Why would you need it to?


I set up a season pass for "Scandal" I changed it to all channels ( since 1st run ABC isn't in guide yet) and it picked up a slew of showings on BET.


----------



## Keen

Huh. I got the update today, but I didn't sign up for the priority list. I was hoping to do so after a few days of hearing what issues people found with the new update.


----------



## andyf

I'm not sure I like the fact that once the "All Channels" actually matches the show I want, you can't modify the season pass to change it to just that channel.


----------



## BigJimOutlaw

Bytez said:


> Yes, that's what I meant.
> 
> But, why are there only a limited number of channels that could be streamed inside/outside the home on the Fios Mobile app if they only flag HBO as copy once?


To add to what Dan said, HBO and Cinemax are flagged on Fios. Everything else can be streamed. As for why the locals and a number of other channels are blocked on their app, it's mostly a licensing matter, not a technical one. Since Tivo doesn't have a distribution license with individual channel providers, it's all-go (except for the flagged ones).


----------



## Rob Helmerichs

andyf said:


> I'm not sure I like the fact that once the "All Channels" actually matches the show I want, you can't modify the season pass to change it to just that channel.


Yes, you can. Under recording options, if it's in the Guide Data, you can change it to any channel that's there. (If it's not currently in the Guide Data, it just says "All channels" with no way to change it.)


----------



## David Platt

BigJimOutlaw said:


> To add to what Dan said, HBO and Cinemax are flagged on Fios. Everything else can be streamed.


Not all FiOS is created equal. Nothing but locals here.


----------



## bryan4980

Anyone else missing the option to automatically create wishlists? I like the new season passes but being able to automatically create wishlists for things not currently airing was something I used all the time.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs

bryan4980 said:


> Anyone else missing the option to automatically create wishlists? I like the new season passes but being able to automatically create wishlists for things not currently airing was something I used all the time.


I never did that, so I don't know: What would the benefit be?

The way it works now is if TiVo knows it's a series, it offers an all-channel SP; if not, it offers a WL. That seems ideal to me...

(The exception being in cases where, e.g., The Flash is available both as an upcoming series and as an Amazon download, in which case you have multiple entries with different options, but to me that minor annoyance is worth the substantial benefit of being able to set up advance SPs.)

So why would you need or want the option to set up a WL which at best will serve exactly the same function as an SP, and at worst give false hits?


----------



## JolDC

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I never did that, so I don't know: What would the benefit be?


I have used it and I agree.

If the show is a series and has a series id, the new All Channels season pass is acting exactly like a ARWL but with the added benefit of using the series id (or other metadata unique to that series). No more worries that setting up a ARWL for the next season of "Top Chef" will grab the infomercials that include Top Chef in the title. Yay.

If the show has no series id, you get the options to create a ARWL.


----------



## Bierboy

Odds Bodkins said:


> So excited for the update, I restarted while forgetting I was currently recording some shows. C'est la vie!


Geeez, I did that too. Didn't even notice it was recording....it would be nice if TiVo would give you an alert reminding you that you're recording something before you hit enter after punching three thumbs down for a restart...


----------



## bryan4980

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I never did that, so I don't know: What would the benefit be?
> 
> The way it works now is if TiVo knows it's a series, it offers an all-channel SP; if not, it offers a WL. That seems ideal to me...
> 
> (The exception being in cases where, e.g., The Flash is available both as an upcoming series and as an Amazon download, in which case you have multiple entries with different options, but to me that minor annoyance is worth the substantial benefit of being able to set up advance SPs.)
> 
> So why would you need or want the option to set up a WL which at best will serve exactly the same function as an SP, and at worst give false hits?


The main benefit was if you were behind a few seasons on a show and you did not want all episodes but just one or a select few, now if they made wishlists or season passes able to record only episodes from a certain season or year then that would work.


----------



## JolDC

bryan4980 said:


> The main benefit was if you were behind a few seasons on a show and you did not want all episodes but just one or a select few, now if they made wishlists or season passes able to record only episodes from a certain season or year then that would work.


If I go into the series Episodes list and select an episode I am interested in, it still allows me to create a wishlist for the episode.


----------



## innocentfreak

Also it appears the IOS app will need an update since I still get the create a wishlist off of the search for shows not in the guide yet.


----------



## lpwcomp

TIVO_GUY_HERE said:


> I set up a season pass for "Scandal" I changed it to all channels ( since 1st run ABC isn't in guide yet) and it picked up a slew of showings on BET.


Prior to posting, I thought I had tested this with "N.C.I.S." but when I tested again, I discovered that there is an episode showing on CBS.

So I tested with "Scandal". Guess what? There are two episodes on ABC next Thursday, so one of your options should have been your local ABC affiliate.

I do note that in this case, "NEW only" would not have solved the problem since BET has chosen not to provide episode data for most of what they show, including "Scandal".


----------



## lpwcomp

JolDC said:


> If I go into the series Episodes list and select an episode I am interested in, it still allows me to create a wishlist for the episode.


True, but if you want to record an entire previous season or two, you must create a wishlist entry for each episode.


----------



## Dan203

Is anyone else slightly disappointed that they still haven't finished the HDUI? 4 1/2 years in and we still have SD screens for Find By Time/Channel and most settings screens. I thought maybe the switch to Haxe would speed that along, but I guess not.


----------



## bradleys

The last real HDUI update was that intermediate help screen menu - I just do not think it is a priority for them. 

Frankly, it doesn't bother me - the frequency of me entering an SD screen is pretty low. I see it more often with my PYTiVo share than anything else.

OTOH, I just cannot believe that it would be that hard to complete - and it would be nice for the people to have one less thing to whine about.


----------



## tivoknucklehead

they need "record to all HD channels" option


----------



## L David Matheny

bradleys said:


> The last real HDUI update was that intermediate help screen menu - I just do not think it is a priority for them.
> 
> Frankly, it doesn't bother me - the frequency of me entering an SD screen is pretty low. I see it more often with my PYTiVo share than anything else.
> 
> OTOH, I just cannot believe that it would be that hard to complete - and it would be nice for the people to have one less thing to whine about.


Earlier I thought that TiVo could stop the whining by just changing the screen resolution of the remaining screens to HD, but now we would also expect the preview window to remain active for all those screens, so converting would probably be a nontrivial exercise. I agree that it's really not a big deal.


----------



## Keen

tivoknucklehead said:


> they need "record to all HD channels" option


I need an SD version of this for one Season Pass.


----------



## JWhites

bradleys said:


> The last real HDUI update was that intermediate help screen menu - I just do not think it is a priority for them.
> 
> Frankly, it doesn't bother me - the frequency of me entering an SD screen is pretty low. I see it more often with my PYTiVo share than anything else.
> 
> OTOH, I just cannot believe that it would be that hard to complete - and it would be nice for the people to have one less thing to whine about.


I completely agree. I mean at this point, yeah, the amount of times I'm seeing an SD menu is only when I'm going into the System Info or diagnostic screens. I'm at the pinnacle of happiness with my TiVo right now. Now I'm just afraid they're going to screw something up.


----------



## danm628

nooneuknow said:


> Those who have been updated might want to force a manual service connection post-update. I did, and the "Loading" final step is taking longer to complete than the download, loading, reboot, and install of the actual update.
> 
> I can hear the hard drive thrashing like mad (usually I can't hear it). So, that post update connection is making a LOT of changes to something.


My TiVo was pending restart when I got home today. I manually restarted it since it wasn't recording anything at the moment. The next scheduled service connection was for today when I restarted it. After the restart I went off to check work emails (a never ending battle). When I checked back on the TiVo about 30 minutes later it was in the "Loading" stage of a service connection.

So it appears the update caused a new service connection automatically. Or the manual restart caused one.


----------



## bryan4980

JolDC said:


> If I go into the series Episodes list and select an episode I am interested in, it still allows me to create a wishlist for the episode.


Tried the exact same thing, go to explore then episodes and then click on an episode not currently airing and all it gives me as options is get from amazon, set up season pass or explore. So maybe it's just my box, I'll try calling support and see if they have any ideas for me.


----------



## Joe Siegler

Dan203 said:


> Is anyone else slightly disappointed that they still haven't finished the HDUI? 4 1/2 years in and we still have SD screens for Find By Time/Channel and most settings screens. I thought maybe the switch to Haxe would speed that along, but I guess not.


+1


----------



## lpwcomp

bryan4980 said:


> Tried the exact same thing, go to explore then episodes and then click on an episode not currently airing and all it gives me as options is get from amazon, set up season pass or explore. So maybe it's just my box, I'll try calling support and see if they have any ideas for me.


+1. I too am no longer getting the "Create Wishlist" option


----------



## JolDC

lpwcomp said:


> +1. I too am no longer getting the "Create Wishlist" option


Yes, I tried it again once I got home and it is also not giving me the option. Sorry for the mislead.


----------



## lpwcomp

Played with the "All Channels" option and found some interesting things.

It selected the HD channel when it scheduled the recording. Unknown whether this is an actual preference for HD or it simply picked the higher number channel.

It did let me modify the Channel for "Madam Secretary", which premieres on 9/21 but would not let me modify it for "Scorpion" which premieres the next night. I'll check again tomorrow when I will have another day of guide data.

It's also flagging the showing on the SD channel as a conflict.


----------



## Jed1

I know that this is not a popular item with the Fall Update but I did not get the Home Shopping Network App on my two Premiere 4s this morning.
I even connected to the service on both Premieres and rebooted them but no App.
Anybody else not get this App?


----------



## Captainbob

Jed1 said:


> I know that this is not a popular item with the Fall Update but I did not get the Home Shopping Network App on my two Premiere 4s this morning.
> I even connected to the service on both Premieres and rebooted them but no App.
> Anybody else not get this App?


Another thread on this that I started this morning. They told me it would take a day or two for the Apps to download.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=520860


----------



## Jed1

Captainbob said:


> Another thread on this that I started this morning. They told me it would take a day or two for the Apps to download.
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=520860


Thanks. I remember it was the opposite the last time with the Summer Update were I actually had the Huffington Post App before my two Premieres restarted to apply the update.


----------



## ScaryMike

Does anyone know when the season pass "6 month" feature will come to the mobile app? I stopped creating season passes on the Tivo since its so much faster on the app. 

Currently, you still can't create season passes more than 2 weeks out on the app.


----------



## npgerry

Tonight when I turned on my TV hooked up to my Premier (2 tuner) I had a blue screen saying it could not find the external storage. I have the approved 1TB WD drive hooked up. I tried rebotting everything and still got the message.

My Elite received the update sometime last night and I am assuming that my Premier did as well. I will call Tivo tomorrow to try and confirm. If I did receive the update, is there someway to roll back seeing as the unit doesn't make it all the way through bootup?

Thanks,

Norman


----------



## JWhites

This is just a shot in the dark. Try reversing the eSATA cable, maybe that might work. I know some users of the expander drive have experienced the cable failing in the past but it was rare.


----------



## FitzAusTex

The new season pass functionality is very much an improvement, but why the arbitrary decision of 6 months? Tried to set a season pass for Game of Thrones, but can't yet. What would be the issue of expanding whatever database tivo is using to include shows that are obviously going to exist later than 6 months? Anyway...

On a separate note, is anyone else having YouTube playback issues since the Fall Update? I can see the various videos within YouTube, but all are getting "playback issue".


----------



## lpwcomp

I checked again today and I was able change the SP for "Scorpion" from "All Channels" to the local HD channel.


----------



## lpwcomp

FitzAusTex said:


> The new season pass functionality is very much an improvement, but why the arbitrary decision of 6 months? Tried to set a season pass for Game of Thrones, but can't yet. What would be the issue of expanding whatever database tivo is using to include shows that are obviously going to exist later than 6 months? Anyway...


This is mainly designed for series that have not yet premiered. It is very rare for pre-knowledge like this to be more than 6-months out. In addition, I suspect that Tribune has to at least have assigned a series Id.

In the specific case of GOT, I don't know what your problem is but my Roamio gave me the option to create an SP for it.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs

lpwcomp said:


> I checked again today and I was able change the SP for "Scorpion" from "All Channels" to the local HD channel.


Same here, although the first time I tried (and failed) I went in through the Season Pass Manager, and the second time (succeeded) through the To Do List. So next time, I will experiment by trying to do it through the SP list first to see if there's a glitch that prevents you from doing it there, or if it really changed between the first and second time I tried...


----------



## lpwcomp

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Same here, although the first time I tried (and failed) I went in through the Season Pass Manager, and the second time (succeeded) through the To Do List. So next time, I will experiment by trying to do it through the SP list first to see if there's a glitch that prevents you from doing it there, or if it really changed between the first and second time I tried...


Just FYI, I did it through the Season Pass Manager.


----------



## NorthAlabama

Dan203 said:


> Is anyone else slightly disappointed that they still haven't finished the HDUI? 4 1/2 years in and we still have SD screens for Find By Time/Channel and most settings screens. I thought maybe the switch to Haxe would speed that along, but I guess not.


this is my single biggest disappointment with tivo, and there's no excuse for tivo not to have completed the hdui for premiere and roamio users by now imho. :down:


----------



## Joe01880

Integration with Verizon On Demand would make me a very happy camper.

Sent from my SPH-L720T using Tapatalk


----------



## FitzAusTex

lpwcomp said:


> This is mainly designed for series that have not yet premiered. It is very rare for pre-knowledge like this to be more than 6-months out. In addition, I suspect that Tribune has to at least have assigned a series Id.
> 
> In the specific case of GOT, I don't know what your problem is but my Roamio gave me the option to create an SP for it.


Thanks for your reply. After reading it, I tried again by using "Search", and still no results for GOT. Am I supposed to be creating it using a different method?


----------



## lpwcomp

FitzAusTex said:


> Thanks for your reply. After reading it, I tried again by using "Search", and still no results for GOT. Am I supposed to be creating it using a different method?


I don't know what to tell you. It's the first thing on the list when I enter "G" on the "Search" page. This is both my Roamio and Premiere. HD menus, Comcast cable, U-verse internet, wired connection, fixed IP address.

Prior seasons seem to be available from XFINITY On-Demand and/or Netflix. So if you are not on Comcast, have you perhaps removed Netflix from your video providers?


----------



## BigJimOutlaw

GOT isn't on Netflix. Xfinity would explain it, though. It's likely more than 6 months out (April-ish -- and no reruns are planned in the next 2 weeks), but if it's available from a VOD partner (xfinity in this case) the show will show up in Search.


----------



## lpwcomp

BigJimOutlaw said:


> GOT isn't on Netflix. That would explain it, though. It's likely more than 6 months out (and no reruns are planned in the next 2 weeks), but if it's available from a VOD partner (xfinity in this case) the show will show up in Search.


You're correct. It's Amazon. Blame my poor eyesight.


----------



## Bierboy

NorthAlabama said:


> this is my single biggest disappointment with tivo, and there's no excuse for tivo not to have completed the hdui for premiere and roamio users by now imho. :down:


Yeah, what a HUGE disappointment....especially how it affects the recording of programs....


----------



## lpwcomp

Bierboy said:


> Yeah, what a HUGE disappointment....especially how it affects the recording of programs....


Yeah, who cares about how well (or poorly) it functions as long as it looks good. I mean really, when are they going to give us a snazzier "Just a few minutes more" screen?


----------



## swerver

The missing hd screens doesn't bother me much, other than on the "why wouldn't they just finish this already" level. Much more annoying is when the sound drops when going to tivo central. Wish they'd fix that.


----------



## jhav

Joe01880 said:


> Integration with Verizon On Demand would make me a very happy camper.


+1


----------



## Dan203

I'd rather have Amazon, Vudu and HBOGo then HDUI, but it still annoys me a bit that the HDUI isn't finished after all these years.


----------



## BigJimOutlaw

By golly if I can't monitor the CableCard decoder screens in HD I'm gonna flip! 

After SPM, TDL, and WL menus were done, the pressure was probably off for the most part. For what it's worth, Haxe is going to let them do some more interesting things in the UI. Remember when we used to have animations and things until flash ate up all the cpu and killed it? That. Margret's group is probably doing their thing. Will probably take a while still, but...


----------



## JWhites

Joe01880 said:


> Integration with Verizon On Demand would make me a very happy camper.
> 
> Sent from my SPH-L720T using Tapatalk


Me too and I don't even have FiOS.


----------



## MHunter1

After my Premiere Elite/XL4 with SD menus updated to v20.4.4a, paging up and down through the My Shows list is excruciatingly slow with Groups turned on. And when I turn Groups off, the highlight bar jumps to another row with no user input whenever a new program begins recording or transferring. Are all SDUI users experiencing these frustrations?


----------



## pig_man

lpwcomp said:


> I mean really, when are they going to give us a snazzier "Just a few minutes more" screen?


Yes, I want the TiVo guy dancing around, doing the Moonwalk, maybe some old soft shoe, tap dancing, etc.


----------



## Dan203

BigJimOutlaw said:


> By golly if I can't monitor the CableCard decoder screens in HD I'm gonna flip!


The cable card screens come from the card itself, so their UI is controlled by the cable company and/or the manufacturer of the card and will likely never be in HD. 

I mainly don't like how the settings screens flip back and forth. It's annoying to transverse them and constantly have my screen go black for a second as it switches back and forth.



BigJimOutlaw said:


> For what it's worth, Haxe is going to let them do some more interesting things in the UI. Remember when we used to have animations and things until flash ate up all the cpu and killed it? That. Margret's group is probably doing their thing. Will probably take a while still, but...


The old UI backgrounds were actually just short MPEG-2 video clips, they weren't animated on the fly. The graphics hardware in older units prior to the Premiere was pretty rudimentary. It could basically overlay pre-made images and text over video. They were able to crudely animate the overlay elements so they would slide into view in sync with the video, but it was jerky by comparison.

Flash is vector based so the graphics for the HDUI are actually being drawn on the fly. Animating them smoothly would take quite a bit more horsepower. I'm not sure even with Haxe they'll be able to do that. Plus I think that sort of animation in UIs has fallen out of style, so I don't think they'd bring it back even if they could.


----------



## FitzAusTex

swerver said:


> The missing hd screens doesn't bother me much, other than on the "why wouldn't they just finish this already" level. Much more annoying is when the sound drops when going to tivo central. Wish they'd fix that.


I hate the audio dropout. Don't even think it needs to happen. Pulling up guide with guide button, no dropout. Dismiss guide with guide button, no dropout. Use back button to dismiss guide, dropout. Tivo Central dropouts are far longer when watching something recorded. I suspect if they ever complete the HD gui, they'll likely get rid of these Dropouts since they obviously don't have to be there.


----------



## tomhorsley

I get the same audio dropout when I'm watching live TV at the time a recording starts on that same channel (there is no dropout at the start of the recording as near as I can tell).


----------



## NorthAlabama

Bierboy said:


> Yeah, what a HUGE disappointment....especially how it affects the recording of programs....





lpwcomp said:


> Yeah, who cares about how well (or poorly) it functions as long as it looks good. I mean really, when are they going to give us a snazzier "Just a few minutes more" screen?


so you're both using the sdui?


----------



## Bierboy

NorthAlabama said:


> so you're both using the sdui?


Yeah, I'm sure that was what we were saying....


----------



## NJ Webel

Of course TiVo isn't going to win with people on the HDUI at this point. Even if every screen was HD tomorrow, all you'd likely see on here would not be thanks, but rather choruses of 'took them long enough!' and 'it's about time!'.


----------



## slowbiscuit

MHunter1 said:


> After my Premiere Elite/XL4 with SD menus updated to v20.4.4a, paging up and down through the My Shows list is excruciatingly slow with Groups turned on. And when I turn Groups off, the highlight bar jumps to another row with no user input whenever a new program begins recording or transferring. Are all SDUI users experiencing these frustrations?


1) This is the Roamio forum, and
2) *shrug* switch to the HDUI, it's better now on Premieres


----------



## anthonymoody

Dan203 said:


> Is anyone else slightly disappointed that they still haven't finished the HDUI? 4 1/2 years in and we still have SD screens for Find By Time/Channel and most settings screens. I thought maybe the switch to Haxe would speed that along, but I guess not.


+1



ScaryMike said:


> Does anyone know when the season pass "6 month" feature will come to the mobile app? I stopped creating season passes on the Tivo since its so much faster on the app.
> 
> Currently, you still can't create season passes more than 2 weeks out on the app.


+1. The app>>>>>>>>the TiVo itself.



Dan203 said:


> I'd rather have Amazon, Vudu and HBOGo then HDUI, but it still annoys me a bit that the HDUI isn't finished after all these years.


+1000000000



NJ Webel said:


> Of course TiVo isn't going to win with people on the HDUI at this point. Even if every screen was HD tomorrow, all you'd likely see on here would not be thanks, but rather choruses of 'took them long enough!' and 'it's about time!'.


...which would be true.


----------



## Jed1

Well after waiting 3 days and trying the old connect to service and reboot for the HSN App to show up I decided to contact Margret by email today. I sent her a short message and my TSNs and surprisingly she responded back and had me connect to the service and do a reboot and the App showed up.

If I remember correctly I had this same issue back in January with the Opera App store. That never showed up with the Winter update and after about two weeks of waiting and doing the old connect to service and rebooting, I had to contact Margret to have it sent to my TiVos.

I noticed with this update that coming back to live TV from TiVo Central is much faster than before. I used to have a 3 to 5 second delay and now it is only about a second or two.


----------



## JWhites

slowbiscuit said:


> 2) *shrug* switch to the HDUI, it's better now on Premieres


+3 :up:


----------



## JWhites

Rebooted my premieres today because, why not, and the HSN app showed up. Pretty cool.


----------



## LoadStar

Dan203 said:


> I'd rather have Amazon, Vudu and HBOGo then HDUI, but it still annoys me a bit that the HDUI isn't finished after all these years.


It doesn't annoy me so much as baffle me. It seems like at the very least, they could take the exact same menu items and display them in the HDUI without a terrible amount of effort. Could they do more, like rearranging the entire menu structure? Sure, but that could be done independently of moving 100% to the HDUI.

It just seems to me that it would make the TiVo Central more uniform, and feel more "complete," to have all the same UI. There's enough of a difference between the SD and HDUIs that it's kind of glaring when you have to jump back and forth between them.

Yes, I too agree that there are higher priority items... but it seems (to this outsider, with no access to the codebase) like moving to the HDUI could be something they could have an intern do.


----------



## akwing12

Any chance you guys have any ideas for getting my Roamio Plus and my Mini to catch the update? I have been connecting to Tivo daily, multiple times in a row and have yet to see the pending restart.


----------



## JWhites

I know this isn't something you'll want to hear, but be patient and it will come. Did you sign up for the priority update? http://www.tivo.com/priority20.4.4


----------



## ShayL

akwing12 said:


> Any chance you guys have any ideas for getting my Roamio Plus and my Mini to catch the update? I have been connecting to Tivo daily, multiple times in a row and have yet to see the pending restart.


Did you put your TSN in the priority update?


----------



## akwing12

I just put my TSNs in. Guess I have to be an adult and wait. Lol


----------



## JWhites

lol bah! When has being an adult ever been any fun?


----------



## minimeh

I like to use wish list queries to record a couple of college's football games no matter what channel they are broadcast. After the 20.4.4 update, these long-standing wishlist items came up empty even though I could see that games for both schools were on Tivo's schedule. To be fair, this issue may have been introduced with a previous update but now is when the college football games have started.

What I discovered is that turning on the "HD only" option for auto-record was the culprit. The channel that the games are coming up on is an HD channel. However, the specific broadcasts apparently are not marked HD.

Okay, fair enough. I can see why they should not auto-record. What I believe is a bug is that they don't even appear on the wishlist results. Even when I turned off auto-record, they still do not appear.

Seems like "HD only" for auto-record should not affect the search results for a wishlist item, only the auto-recording of said item. And it most definitely shouldn't have any bearing when auto-record is turned off for the wishlist item.

I didn't really need the "HD only" option since I have removed all SD channels from my lineup. I removed the "HD only" option from both wishlist items and now I have full functionality back as I had last year.


----------



## preilly44

So I got the update a few days ago on my Roamio Pro and it wiped out all of my thumbs up/down ratings and it brought back quite a few of my deleted shows (about 10% of my HD space worth).

Has anybody else had this happen and is there a way to get everything back how it was?


----------



## Lenonn

The only problem that I've noticed since the update is that my MoCA connection doesn't seem to be working. I can't tell if that is from the update, but the problems started up soon after the update installed. I hadn't made any changes to MoCA at first, and it appears that when I forced a connection, I get a C11 (Connection Interrupted). I managed to get the Pro to succesfully connect once by changing to the wifi network, running a connection and then changing back to MoCA. A few hours later, same problem again. When I go to change the MoCA settings on the TiVo, briefly it appears that the TiVo can't find any network connection whatsover.


----------



## Baseballsucks

Immediately after receiving this update last week on my Roamio Plus, one of my 6 tuners now displays error V52. The other 5 tuners have zero issues. No matter what channel I try on the dead tuner the result is V52. I've tried rebooting, reinserting the cable card, but no luck correcting this issue.

Any ideas?

Thanks!


----------



## JWhites

I've had no issues with the update.


----------



## mattack

minimeh said:


> I like to use wish list queries to record a couple of college's football games no matter what channel they are broadcast. After the 20.4.4 update, these long-standing wishlist items came up empty even though I could see that games for both schools were on Tivo's schedule. To be fair, this issue may have been introduced with a previous update but now is when the college football games have started.
> 
> What I discovered is that turning on the "HD only" option for auto-record was the culprit. The channel that the games are coming up on is an HD channel. However, the specific broadcasts apparently are not marked HD.


Report this in forum.tivo.com


----------



## headless chicken

I haven't received the update yet but now I'm scared to, after reading about all these kinks and issues.


----------



## Bierboy

headless chicken said:


> I haven't received the update yet but now I'm scared to, after reading about all these kinks and issues.


Bleh...the vast majority of users (like me) are reporting no issues at all


----------



## uw69

most updates go fine. I did however quit signing up to be one of the first to get them just in case.


----------



## tomhorsley

uw69 said:


> most updates go fine. I did however quit signing up to be one of the first to get them just in case.


I didn't sign up till the release notes came out and said I'd need this version for android streaming (of course we are still waiting for the android app update we need on the other end .


----------



## JWhites

tomhorsley said:


> I didn't sign up till the release notes came out and said I'd need this version for android streaming (of course we are still waiting for the android app update we need on the other end .


Don't forget the Stream update too...


----------



## bigpatky

I've had Netflix crash my Roamio at least 4 times since I've updated to this software. Anyone else?


----------



## Bierboy

bigpatky said:


> I've had Netflix crash my Roamio at least 4 times since I've updated to this software. Anyone else?


I have a premiere, but no problem with Netflix. EDIT: I should add that I am on 20.4.4a, and just logged in to Netflix to check.


----------



## Dan203

JWhites said:


> Don't forget the Stream update too...


Only applies to standalone Stream, the update to the imbedded Stream in Roamio Plus/Pro units is part of this software update.


----------



## Dan203

JWhites said:


> Oh that's news. According to TiVo and an engineer I spoke to it's two separate updates which is why not everyone with plus/pro models on the priority list got that part of the update yet.


I got it at the same time as the main update. I just assumed everyone else did too. Maybe I'm mistaken and I just happen to be on the test list.


----------



## JWhites

I was just saying that the update is still needed for the stand alone Stream to do Android streaming.

Anyway according to TiVo and an engineer I spoke to it's two separate updates which is why not everyone with plus/pro models on the priority list got that part of the update yet.


----------



## Ikrion

mattack said:


> Report this in forum.tivo.com


* shudder *

Useful? Yes. User friendly? Nope.


----------



## headless chicken

Finally got the update this morning. Thankfully I haven't seen or experienced any major bugs.

I did notice, however, that all the new shows not yet in guide/scheduled to air have these amateurish looking title cards written in the same generic white font. Hopefully these are just place holders?


----------



## jwbelcher

headless chicken said:


> Finally got the update this morning. Thankfully I haven't seen or experienced any major bugs.
> 
> I did notice, however, that all the new shows not yet in guide/scheduled to air have these amateurish looking title cards written in the same generic white font. Hopefully these are just place holders?


The artwork should update automatically once its available for the show.


----------



## javabird

I just got the update last night and I love it! I immediately deleted my "wish lists" for several new shows that hadn't showed up in the guide yet and got them as Season Passes for "any channel." Those features alone make the upgrade worth it to me.


----------



## JWhites

jwbelcher said:


> The artwork should update automatically once its available for the show.


Keyword is "should be". I've had brand-new shows not have their poster artwork updated ever, or current shows not get updated either. A good example is "ABC World News Tonight with David Muir". The poster art still leaves out "Tonight". Another example is "Penn & Teller: Fool Us" where there still is no artwork and they're in their sixth episode as of tonight. Really not sure who is in charge of the artwork but even Zap2it which also gets their information from Tribune Media has inaccurate or missing artwork. I have noticed that sometimes if a show has been on my DVR for a few days and Comcast on demand or Netflix or Hulu plus gets it in its lineup that the artwork suddenly gets updated.


----------



## Ficman

Sweet... Nice to see these threads and updates!!!


----------



## FitzAusTex

javabird said:


> I just got the update last night and I love it! I immediately deleted my "wish lists" for several new shows that hadn't showed up in the guide yet and got them as Season Passes for "any channel." Those features alone make the upgrade worth it to me.


 Dish Network has a handy hybrid that I wish tivo would consider. Their Dish Pass, which is like tivo's Wish List, has an option to allow the Dish Pass to be set for all channels, or any specific channel. This is very handy in that it eliminates extra to-dos from scheduling if you only want Game of Thrones, for example, to record on the main HBO channel. It won't schedule recordings on any other channel. I know tivo likes to keep things simple, but I used it for years, and it really is pretty simple.


----------



## TravisM

Thank you.


----------



## lpwcomp

FitzAusTex said:


> Dish Network has a handy hybrid that I wish tivo would consider. Their Dish Pass, which is like tivo's Wish List, has an option to allow the Dish Pass to be set for all channels, or any specific channel. This is very handy in that it eliminates extra to-dos from scheduling if you only want Game of Thrones, for example, to record on the main HBO channel. It won't schedule recordings on any other channel. I know tivo likes to keep things simple, but I used it for years, and it really is pretty simple.


Why would you use a wishlist for Game of Thrones?


----------



## FitzAusTex

lpwcomp said:


> Why would you use a wishlist for Game of Thrones?


Have to use a wish list, or wait to set up an SP until it is in the database. Many can't currently set up an SP for GOT. I think only folks with VOD (comcast) on their tivo can set an SP.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs

lpwcomp said:


> I checked again today and I was able change the SP for "Scorpion" from "All Channels" to the local HD channel.


I think I solved this mystery. On the To Do List when you select a show, underneath the "This episode will be recorded" there are icons for the source of the show. When an episode first shows up, instead of those icons it says "Not currently available." I think there is still some processing going on behind the scenes; it shows up in the To Do List before it is fully integrated into the Guide Data. Once that's finished, you should be able to change the channel for the SP.

I have one like that right now. I'll check from time to time to see how long it takes the "Not currently available" to go away and to verify that it's then and only then that you can change the channel.


----------



## tomhorsley

I still have no idea why a season pass isn't just a subset of a wishlist. I don't understand the need for two different things with mostly overlapping functions (even more overlapping now that you can say any channel in a season pass).


----------



## AdamNJ

So it's been a month since Tivo officially announced android streaming was coming in sept. How about it? Are we going to have to wait until the 30th?


----------



## tomhorsley

AdamNJ said:


> So it's been a month since Tivo officially announced android streaming was coming in sept. How about it? Are we going to have to wait until the 30th?


I'm betting on the 37th .


----------



## jrtroo

AdamNJ said:


> So it's been a month since Tivo officially announced android streaming was coming in sept. How about it? Are we going to have to wait until the 30th?


Why would you have thought otherwise?


----------



## JWhites

I'm concerned because TiVo has so much work ahead of them, especially getting the iOS app updated, the Android app updated, and the Stream software updated.


----------



## slowbiscuit

AdamNJ said:


> So it's been a month since Tivo officially announced android streaming was coming in sept. How about it? Are we going to have to wait until the 30th?


They didn't say which year. Not that it matters because their lame-ass lawyers and CableLabs ensured that it's streaming-only, no downloads, even for unprotected content. So if you have a connection that doesn't support streaming, too bad.


----------



## Stuckeyboss

I have a Roamio, Premiere XL, and Mini -- prior to all of them being on the 20.4.4 update if you browsed the Premiere from the Roamio or XL the menu was in HD. It's now dropping to old SD screen with no image previews. This started once the Premiere picked up the 20.4.4 update.

Is anyone else seeing this behavior? I'm at loss for why it's doing it (other than a bug) or if there is anything to configure to get it back to the way it was.


----------



## lpwcomp

Stuckeyboss said:


> I have a Roamio, Premiere XL, and Mini -- prior to all of them being on the 20.4.4 update if you browsed the Premiere from the Roamio or XL the menu was in HD. It's now dropping to old SD screen with no image previews. This started once the Premiere picked up the 20.4.4 update.
> 
> Is anyone else seeing this behavior? I'm at loss for why it's doing it (other than a bug) or if there is anything to configure to get it back to the way it was.


I'm confused. You wrote "I have a Roamio, Premiere XL, and Mini", so how are you browsing "the Premiere from the ... XL"? Should that "XL" been "Mini"?

When you highlight the Premiere entry in "My Shows" of the Roamio, what does it show on the right side of the screen?

Is the Premiere the only one that has been updated?


----------



## mmf01

Anyone else having issues with TiVo Stream on Roamio Pro downloading to a device after this update? 

When attempting to transfer multiple shows to multiple devices at the same time, the stream basically craps out and stalls after transferring only 2 shows to each device. I queued up like 4 shows to download on both iPad and iPhone and each time the app gives an error and stops after about 2 transfers. Yes, the devices aren't going to sleep and doing the exact same thing worked flawlessly prior to this update.

The only solution is to cancel all pending transfers on each device and "release" the pending transfers within the clients menu under system info. Or, just restart the stream.


----------



## ej42137

When I browse my Premiere from my Roamio I still see HD menus and preview images. So I guess it's just you.


----------



## JWhites

Stuckeyboss said:


> I have a Roamio, Premiere XL, and Mini -- prior to all of them being on the 20.4.4 update if you browsed the Premiere from the Roamio or XL the menu was in HD. It's now dropping to old SD screen with no image previews. This started once the Premiere picked up the 20.4.4 update.
> 
> Is anyone else seeing this behavior? I'm at loss for why it's doing it (other than a bug) or if there is anything to configure to get it back to the way it was.


First time I've heard of this issue. Have you tried cycling the menu on the mini and XL from HD to SD then back to HD, or restarted all three TiVo's? Is this occurring every time or once in a while?


----------



## JWhites

mmf01 said:


> Anyone else having issues with TiVo Stream on Roamio Pro downloading to a device after this update?


What software version is your stream?


----------



## AdamNJ

slowbiscuit said:


> They didn't say which year.


Well actually they did say "next month", not september.


----------



## Bytez

AdamNJ said:


> Well actually they did say "next month", not september.


In august, they said next month on twitter so it's September.


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/501353359886934016


----------



## aaronwt

Still nine more days left in the month. They could come out as late as September 30th and it would still be considered the month after August. But as I've said before, I'll believe it when I see it.


----------



## danjw1

AdamNJ said:


> So it's been a month since Tivo officially announced android streaming was coming in sept. How about it? Are we going to have to wait until the 30th?


I don't remember the exact wording, but I doubt they were especially firm about a release date. I expect there was some equivocation in the statement, since that is the safe way to go.

Would you rather have something now that didn't work well or wait a bit longer for bugs to get fixed? I am computer programmer and I understand that it can sometimes take longer to get a product out than you initially expected. Problems arise when the marketing guys decide to just ship it now, without concern for serious bugs. I know you have been waiting a long time for it and that is frustrating. But, that is just how it is going to be sometimes. You run into unexpected issues and find it is best to hold the release a bit longer.


----------



## JWhites

When I called a couple weeks ago the agent was insistence on September 30th. Also an RCN rep from dslreports.com also was saying The same thing.


----------



## tomhorsley

JWhites said:


> When I called a couple weeks ago the agent was insistence on September 30th. Also an RCN rep from dslreports.com also was saying The same thing.


I wonder if there is any chance the app is actually complete and they have a 30th release date planned because they expect the fall update to have been pushed to everyone by then? (Apparently the fall update is a prereq for android streaming).


----------



## mmf01

JWhites said:


> What software version is your stream?


19.1.7-USB-6
Build Date: June 10th 2014

I believe this was updated along with 20.4.4


----------



## CoxInPHX

Stuckeyboss said:


> I have a Roamio, Premiere XL, and Mini -- prior to all of them being on the 20.4.4 update if you browsed the Premiere from the Roamio or XL the menu was in HD. It's now dropping to old SD screen with no image previews. This started once the Premiere picked up the 20.4.4 update.
> 
> Is anyone else seeing this behavior? I'm at loss for why it's doing it (other than a bug) or if there is anything to configure to get it back to the way it was.





JWhites said:


> First time I've heard of this issue. Have you tried cycling the menu on the mini and XL from HD to SD then back to HD, or restarted all three TiVo's? Is this occurring every time or once in a while?


I used to have this problem quite frequently, about a year ago, rebooting the router usually fixed it for a while, but it always returned, It ended up being an issue with that particular router, (D-Link DIR-825), and it's settings regarding Multicast and UPnP.

If I swapped out to an older router that I had, the problem was fixed, I ended up purchasing a new ASUS RT-N66U and the problem also disappeared.


----------



## nooneuknow

CoxInPHX said:


> I used to have this problem quite frequently, about a year ago, rebooting the router usually fixed it for a while, but it always returned, It ended up being an issue with that particular router, (D-Link DIR-825), and it's settings regarding Multicast and UPnP.
> 
> If I swapped out to an older router that I had, the problem was fixed, I ended up purchasing a new ASUS RT-N66U and the problem also disappeared.


What's your recommendations for setting routers that have the option to use UPnP / multicast, and being able to disable one, or both?


----------



## CoxInPHX

nooneuknow said:


> What's your recommendations for setting routers that have the option to use UPnP / multicast, and being able to disable one, or both?


There was some issue with the router I had, It was refurbished, so possibly it was just bad, with that router changing the settings did not make any difference.

Usually the router defaults should work fine, each router configuration menu is different.
Multicast - Enabled/On (although my ASUS default is Disabled and works fine)
UPnP - Enabled/On


----------



## L David Matheny

FWIW, my 4-tuner Roamio (basic) installed the 20.4.4a update this morning about 8:00 or 8:30. I was not on any priority list, so this must be the general release (which may or may not have been reported already).

I checked my 2-tuner Premiere after lunch, and it hadn't updated yet but was pending restart, so I restarted and updated it to 20.4.4a too.

I still find it bizarre that my Roamio (OTA only) _never_ reports any corrected errors on any channel. It seems that surely the tuner chipset should correct some errors occasionally, and it makes me wonder if the TiVo is polling the wrong register or mishandling that count in some other way.


----------



## nooneuknow

L David Matheny said:


> FWIW, my 4-tuner Roamio (basic) installed the 20.4.4a update this morning about 8:00 or 8:30. I was not on any priority list, so this must be the general release (which may or may not have been reported already).
> 
> I checked my 2-tuner Premiere after lunch, and it hadn't updated yet but was pending restart, so I restarted and updated it to 20.4.4a too.
> 
> I still find it bizarre that my Roamio (OTA only) _never_ reports any corrected errors on any channel. It seems that surely the tuner chipset should correct some errors occasionally, and it makes me wonder if the TiVo is polling the wrong register or mishandling that count in some other way.


If you have a Tuning Adapter, it handles all that, even on non-SDV channels. You can get your error stats from the TA menus, or disconnect the USB cable to the TA, and then see the DVR diags error counts start working again.

I miss having the errors in the DVR Diags. It made it quick and easy to spot an issue. Now, I have to navigate the TA screens, and that's no picnic, rather a PITA.

TiVo should substitute a "-" in place of the "0", to not give false confidence in the error counts, when a TA is connected.

Anybody without a TA missing their error counts?


----------



## L David Matheny

nooneuknow said:


> If you have a Tuning Adapter, it handles all that, even on non-SDV channels. You can get your error stats from the TA menus, or disconnect the USB cable to the TA, and then see the DVR diags error counts start working again.
> 
> I miss having the errors in the DVR Diags. It made it quick and easy to spot an issue. Now, I have to navigate the TA screens, and that's no picnic, rather a PITA.
> 
> TiVo should substitute a "-" in place of the "0", to not give false confidence in the error counts, when a TA is connected.


Remember, I'm OTA only, so no tuning adapter. But are you saying that with a _4-tuner Roamio_ (basic) that you see _corrected_ errors being counted when you disconnect your tuning adapter? On broadcast TV, I _never_ see any corrected errors counted, only the uncorrected errors.


----------



## lpwcomp

L David Matheny said:


> Remember, I'm OTA only, so no tuning adapter. But are you saying that with a _4-tuner Roamio_ (basic) that you see _corrected_ errors being counted when you disconnect your tuning adapter? On broadcast TV, I _never_ see any corrected errors counted, only the uncorrected errors.


My Comcast connected Roamio shows "0" for corrected errors.


----------



## nooneuknow

L David Matheny said:


> Remember, I'm OTA only, so no tuning adapter. But are you saying that with a _4-tuner Roamio_ (basic) that you see _corrected_ errors being counted when you disconnect your tuning adapter? On broadcast TV, I _never_ see any corrected errors counted, only the uncorrected errors.


I have a hard time keeping track of who is OTA and/or CATV, what their provider is, and if they use a TA. So, I tend to err on the side of being broad about what I say, trying to cover as much as I can. I follow and participate in threads where there is no incentive for me, but can still help others.

Yes, if I disconnect my TA, and let the cablecard re-assume the role of being in charge of mapping (and many other things that would be completely under the control of the TA, while the USB link is up), I will go from seeing 0/0 errors, to seeing some of each type, rather than always 0/0 all the time. If I dig into the TA Diags screen, when the TA is connected, the "missing" errors will be found there.


----------



## morac

I'm pretty sure the correctable errors have nothing to do with retransmits (how would that even work?) and work like every other kind of error recovery system, using ECC and FEC.

http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Error_detection_and_correction#Error-correcting_code

As such, I'm pretty sure it works with OTA.


----------



## L David Matheny

morac said:


> I'm pretty sure the correctable errors have nothing to do with retransmits (how would that even work?) and work like every other kind of error recovery system, using ECC and FEC.
> 
> http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Error_detection_and_correction#Error-correcting_code
> 
> As such, I'm pretty sure it works with OTA.


I think you're right. ATSC broadcasts over-the-air can (and should and normally do) include error correction, or the inevitable signal glitches that occur would cause noticeable video or audio glitches. With a good signal, my 2-tuner Premiere counts occasional corrected errors and rare uncorrected errors. Receiving the same signal (from a 2-way splitter), my 4-tuner Roamio generally has even fewer uncorrected errors, but it _never_ reports any corrected errors. Surely the tuner is doing its job and correcting whatever errors it can, but the TiVo isn't reporting those for some reason. I wish TiVo would fix this or at least explain it. I believe someone posted some time ago that the _6-tuner_ Roamios do report corrected errors.


----------



## NJ Webel

From the Stream sub-forum:










Tivo's own troubleshooting page also now references android streaming. Looks like it's here...


----------



## nooneuknow

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reed–Solomon_error_correction

For those who would like to read-up on the "RS" corrected/uncorrected error counts, and Reed-Solomon error correction, which is what I've been lead to believe the "RS" stands for.

I'll admit that I don't know how it works/relates with OTA. All I know is I've never seen any value other than "0" for corrected/uncorrected, since Cox activated my tuning adapters, unless I pull the USB link, and let the cablecard resume tuning what isn't SDV. When active, the TA takes over many duties the cablecard would handle, and does not limit what it takes-over to SDV-only.


----------



## dcstager

I was hoping the MLB app would be updated, but it wasn't. I noticed a new bug with the fall update.

Start MLB.TV app
Select an archived or game in progress and start from beginning.
Press the info button to skip to an inning.
Select inning.
Program jumps to the inning, but does not erase the lower portion of the screen so you still see the line score on the bottom of the screen while the game plays out on the top portion of the screen.
Work around is to press info again and watch the game in the inset screen for 2-3 minutes. Press info again and screen displays normally. If you press info and not wait a few minutes, pressing it again results in the same corrupted display.

Exiting MLB by pressing left arrow sometimes works and sometimes it doesn't. When it does work, it asks if you want to exit MLB 2013. One of the selections to choose is Exit MLB 2014. So at least part of the 2013 program is still there.

Fix it please. Playoffs coming. Please fix it.


----------



## elborak

nooneuknow said:


> I have a hard time keeping track of who is OTA and/or CATV, what their provider is, and if they use a TA.


No need to keep track, he states that he was OTA only in the very post you quoted in your reply. You probably just read too quickly.

But thanks for trying to help.


----------



## jstechinla

My Roamio box updated a few nights ago and ever since then all streams are extremely pixelated. I tried reducing the streams to 3 - small improvement but still unviewable.
Nothing on my wiring has changed just the Tivo update. Was anything done that would make the pixelation problem worse? I have had TWC out about 6 or 7 times and the last time they finally got things working about 99% - then the Tivo update and I am back to step 1. I have a Cisco cablecard and have requested a Motorola cablecard but TWC will take a while to get this. 
Has anyone else had the same problem with the 20.4.4 update?


----------



## HarperVision

jstechinla said:


> My Roamio box updated a few nights ago and ever since then all streams are extremely pixelated. I tried reducing the streams to 3 - small improvement but still unviewable. Nothing on my wiring has changed just the Tivo update. Was anything done that would make the pixelation problem worse? I have had TWC out about 6 or 7 times and the last time they finally got things working about 99% - then the Tivo update and I am back to step 1. I have a Cisco cablecard and have requested a Motorola cablecard but TWC will take a while to get this. Has anyone else had the same problem with the 20.4.4 update?


If you have a Cisco Cablecard then chances are extremely likely that their headend is Cisco/Scientific Atlanta, so a Motorola Cablecard won't work and will do you no good even should they acquire one. You need to talk to their engineer to set them straight. They seem clueless.


----------



## AZrob

MHunter1 said:


> After my Premiere Elite/XL4 with SD menus updated to v20.4.4a, paging up and down through the My Shows list is excruciatingly slow with Groups turned on. And when I turn Groups off, the highlight bar jumps to another row with no user input whenever a new program begins recording or transferring. Are all SDUI users experiencing these frustrations?





slowbiscuit said:


> 1) This is the Roamio forum, and
> 2) *shrug* switch to the HDUI, it's better now on Premieres


I don't doubt that HDUI has sped up - but both my wife and I, who are in our sixties, prefer the larger fonts in the SD menu. I am sure there are others who still feel that way as well.

There is no joy in seeing the degradation in responsiveness - it's significant. Are Roamio users seeing this at all? Or is this going to be another way that Tivo forces us to buy newer, faster hardware?

Rob from AZ


----------



## SullyND

AZrob said:


> There is no joy in seeing the degradation in responsiveness - it's significant. Are Roamio users seeing this at all?


My Roamio is as speedy as ever. Of course, Roamio does not support the SD Menus.


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## headless chicken

JWhites said:


> I've had brand-new shows not have their poster artwork updated ever, or current shows not get updated either.


Right now, most of my shows have new title cards displaying on the Season Pass page, but the To Do List and Explore this show pages still have amateurish artwork with the same generic white font. I don't know why this bugs me so much considering I was perfectly happy with the SD Series3 menus (partly because the text was large and easy to read), but it does.

I also noticed that if you're browsing all the recorded episodes of a selected show, there are more options now at the bottom of the page like "Explore this Show," "Modify Season Pass," etc. Is there any way to turn this off? I don't like all the additional room being allocated to these submenu options when that valuable screen space could be used to display more recorded episode names.



AZrob said:


> There is no joy in seeing the degradation in responsiveness - it's significant. Are Roamio users seeing this at all?


Yes! My Roamio Plus (upgraded to 3TB) has been sluggish ever since the Summer 2014 update. Before that breezing through menus was super fast and convenient. Although I enjoy the left side bar and categorization, I don't think it was worth the additional expense of slowing down the speed of operation.


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## lpwcomp

headless chicken said:


> I also noticed that if you're browsing all the recorded episodes of a selected show, there are more options now at the bottom of the page like "Explore this Show," "Modify Season Pass," etc. Is there any way to turn this off? I don't like all the additional room being allocated to these submenu options when that valuable screen space could be used to display more recorded episode names.


They're not really taking up any screen space since they're at the bottom of the list.


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## headless chicken

lpwcomp said:


> They're not really taking up any screen space since they're at the bottom of the list.


Not true. Previously I could see eight episodes at one time. Now that number has been reduced to three between the advertising and additional menu options on the bottom.


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## Bierboy

headless chicken said:


> .....Although I enjoy the left side bar and categorization, I don't think it was worth the additional expense of slowing down the speed of operation.


You know you can disable this don't you?


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## headless chicken

Bierboy said:


> You know you can disable this don't you?


Yes, aware of that. I don't think the sidebar is entirely responsible for the slow performance post summer update though. There have to have been some other coding changes which caused the menu loading speed to drop precipitously.


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## ggieseke

My Pro seems just as fast as ever (summer or fall). There have been a few times when it got sluggish, but every time it happened there were several others with the same problem at the same time posting here. I'm pretty sure their servers were having issues those nights.


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## lpwcomp

headless chicken said:


> Not true. Previously I could see eight episodes at one time. Now that number has been reduced to three between the advertising and additional menu options on the bottom.


Only if you are at the end of the list.


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## JWhites

I've seen no problems between the Summer and Fall updates, still as great as ever.


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## jstechinla

HarperVision said:


> If you have a Cisco Cablecard then chances are extremely likely that their headend is Cisco/Scientific Atlanta, so a Motorola Cablecard won't work and will do you no good even should they acquire one. You need to talk to their engineer to set them straight. They seem clueless.


So, if I am understanding your post, I need to ask for a new tuning adapter that will work with a Motorola card?


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## morac

Saw something I've never seen before. Played a recording and got sound, but no picture. I went to the menus and the picture showed up in the video window. When I zoomed everything worked fine.


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## HarperVision

jstechinla said:


> So, if I am understanding your post, I need to ask for a new tuning adapter that will work with a Motorola card?


No, it means their entire system is based on a Cisco/Scientific Atlanta Headend, so Motorola equipment in your home will not communicate or work properly with it.

An analogy that may help you understand would be trying to use a DISH Network receiver on a DirecTV satellite system and vice versa.


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## danm628

nooneuknow said:


> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reed–Solomon_error_correction
> 
> For those who would like to read-up on the "RS" corrected/uncorrected error counts, and Reed-Solomon error correction, which is what I've been lead to believe the "RS" stands for.


A quick search found a description of how 8VSB (ATSC modulation) works and what forward error correcting codes are used. Something I hadn't looked at

There are two levels of FEC in ATSC. The first is the Reed-Solomon code you mention which can handle 193 microsecond bursts of noise. RS is done before the data interleaver so that adjacent bytes in the modulated bit stream are not adjacent in the RS bit stream. This allows longer noise bursts to be corrected.

The second level of FEC is a Trellis encoder applied after the interleaver in the transmitter. This takes a 2 bit value and converts it to a 3 bit value (a 2/3 convolution code) which are then mapped to the 8 signal levels in 8VSB for transmission.

The receiver is using a Viterbi decoder for the 2/3 code. It is unlikely that this decoder can count corrected errors.

Most likely the TiVo only reports the RS errors in the 8VSB transmission.

It does seem odd that the TiVo isn't reporting more errors though. I would be shocked if all the errors were corrected by the 2/3 convolution code.

This is a reasonably good description of 8VSB in case anyone wants to know more: http://www.tek.com/document/primer/fundamentals-8vsb

- Dan


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## astrohip

headless chicken said:


> Not true. Previously I could see eight episodes at one time. Now that number has been reduced to three between the advertising and additional menu options on the bottom.


Not for me.

My groups show all the shows, and ONLY shows, and as many as fit. I can keep scrolling down until the end, and ONLY then does it show these menu options.

For example, my Game of Thrones group has 40 shows. It starts at the top, and requires several {downs} before it gets to the bottom and the menu options



lpwcomp said:


> Only if you are at the end of the list.


Or what he said.


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## bradleys

astrohip said:


> Not for me.
> 
> My groups show all the shows, and ONLY shows, and as many as fit. I can keep scrolling down until the end, and ONLY then does it show these menu options.
> 
> For example, my Game of Thrones group has 40 shows. It starts at the top, and requires several {downs} before it gets to the bottom and the menu options
> 
> Or what he said.


Same for me - and that is how it has always worked. HeadlessChicken, can you post a photo of what you are seeing?

I personally am not seeing it, and frankly the community would be blowing up if this were wide spread.


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## morac

Did this version do something weird with back to back recordings on the same channel? I have two back to back hour long SP recordings on the same channel, both set to record one minute extra. Today the first recording showed a play bar of one hour and one minute, but only actually recorded one hour. The second recording recorded 61 minutes as expected. It's like the first recording was clipped, but this is on a Roamio Pro that was only recording those 2 shows, plus 2 suggestions. No clipping should have occurred.


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## lpwcomp

morac said:


> Did this version do something weird with back to back recordings on the same channel? I have two back to back hour long SP recordings on the same channel, both set to record one minute extra. Today the first recording showed a play bar of one hour and one minute, but only actually recorded one hour. The second recording recorded 61 minutes as expected. It's like the first recording was clipped, but this is on a Roamio Pro that was only recording those 2 shows, plus 2 suggestions. No clipping should have occurred.


My recordings of this past Sunday's "The Good Wife" and "CSI" both had padding and overlapped. The beginning of "CSI" is at the end of "The Good Wife" and the end of "The Good Wife" is at the beginning of "CSI". Same story with "The Walking Dead" and "Talking Dead" This is on a Pro and at 10:00PM, all 6 tuners would have been active. Trailing padding on "The Walking Dead" & "The Good Wife" and 4 shows that began at 10 - "CSI", "Talking Dead", "Manhattan", & "Revenge".

I have both clipping and suggestions disabled.


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## nooneuknow

I'm having the same issue with ends of programs on the beginnings of others, and visa-versa, as well as my padding suddenly being ignored.

It started at the same time the new larger, more intrusive, graphical pause ads showed up. Before that (which happened right after the Roamio boot-looping issue), such things were not happening.

I guess we just are supposed to accept that every time TiVo finds a way to take up more screen real-estate w/ads and/or creates new ad formats, we should just remain calm, while our TiVos are boot-looping, spontaneously rebooting, or rebooting at the moments ads might tend to appear, and feel good, knowing that TiVo is upgrading the ads, as well as the software...

No generation TiVo seems safe, unless pre-S3...


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## Keen

morac said:


> Did this version do something weird with back to back recordings on the same channel? I have two back to back hour long SP recordings on the same channel, both set to record one minute extra. Today the first recording showed a play bar of one hour and one minute, but only actually recorded one hour. The second recording recorded 61 minutes as expected. It's like the first recording was clipped, but this is on a Roamio Pro that was only recording those 2 shows, plus 2 suggestions. No clipping should have occurred.


I noticed the same thing on one of my Sunday night recordings. I don't think that all 6 tuners were active at the time, but I'll double-check tonight.


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## JWhites

I don't see how this is a problem, if there actually is something going on.


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## mattack

morac said:


> Did this version do something weird with back to back recordings on the same channel? I have two back to back hour long SP recordings on the same channel, both set to record one minute extra. Today the first recording showed a play bar of one hour and one minute, but only actually recorded one hour. The second recording recorded 61 minutes as expected. It's like the first recording was clipped, but this is on a Roamio Pro that was only recording those 2 shows, plus 2 suggestions. No clipping should have occurred.


I've noticed something like this lately a few times too.. but haven't noticed actual glitchy recordings (which is another case of the time bar not actually being filled in).

I've seen a much more minor version of the "glitch where recordings overlap" a few times too, but I have been paranoid it was my new hard drive going bad..


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## morac

It did it again tonight, but this time the recording were on different channels. The 8 PM recording was 60 minutes and the 9 PM one was 61 minutes. They both should have been 61 minutes.


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## lpwcomp

Just to be clear, what I am seeing as detailed in this post is proper behavior. IOW, I am not seeing the problem.

Has it been reported to TiVo? Additional data might be useful:

Clipping enabled?

TA in use?

Cable company?

In my case, it is no, no, and Comcast.


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## morac

I have clipping enabled. I'm in contact with TiVo email support and they suggested turning clipping off. There's no indication that clipping is occurring though.

I guess I could try recreating the season passes if that doesn't work, but what's odd is I'm only seeing this problem with season passes I've modified recently to record an extra minute.


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## lpwcomp

morac said:


> I have clipping enabled. I'm in contact with TiVo email support and they suggested turning clipping off. There's no indication that clipping is occurring though.


Actually, it sounds exactly like clipping, which is why TiVo suggested you turn it off. If I were you, I would try that first before recreating the SPs, which is far less likely to change anything.


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## morac

lpwcomp said:


> Actually, it sounds exactly like clipping, which is why TiVo suggested you turn it off. If I were you, I would try that first before recreating the SPs, which is far less likely to change anything.


Clipping normally indicates the show was clipped. I'm not seeing that. Also clipping should only happen if all tuners are in use, which they weren't.


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## lpwcomp

morac said:


> Clipping normally indicates the show was clipped. I'm not seeing that. Also clipping should only happen if all tuners are in use, which they weren't.[/QUOTE}How was it not clipped? It was supposed to record 61 minutes but only recorded 60.
> 
> Of course it's not _*supposed*_ to happen, but _*something*_ is happening that is not supposed to happen.


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## morac

It did it again this week. I have Gotham (Fox) set to record 61 minutes and it only recorded 60 minutes. I record Sleepy Hollow (Fox) after it and the Blacklist (NBC) after that. Gotham recorded 60 minhtes, while the other 2 recorded 61. 

Tomorrow I record The Flash (CW) at 8 PM and Agents of SHIELD (ABC) at 9 PM. Last week Flash recorded 60 minutes despite being set to record 61. 

I changed overlap protection off as a test. I just hope The Flash doesn't get canceled.

I will mention that one thing in common about Gotham and Flash is that they were both originally created as "ALL CHANNEL" passes before the shows were in the guide. I originally set them up to end on time. I changed them to end 1 minute later, but that change hasn't taken effect, despite showing that it has in the UI.


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## nooneuknow

morac said:


> It did it again this week. I have Gotham (Fox) set to record 61 minutes and it only recorded 60 minutes. I record Sleepy Hollow (Fox) after it and the Blacklist (NBC) after that. Gotham recorded 60 minhtes, while the other 2 recorded 61.
> 
> Tomorrow I record The Flash (CW) at 8 PM and Agents of SHIELD (ABC) at 9 PM. Last week Flash recorded 60 minutes despite being set to record 61.
> 
> I changed overlap protection off as a test. I just hope The Flash doesn't get canceled.
> 
> I will mention that one thing in common about Gotham and Flash is that they were both originally created as "ALL CHANNEL" passes before the shows were in the guide. I originally set them up to end on time. I changed them to end 1 minute later, but that change hasn't taken effect, despite showing that it has in the UI.


I think you are onto something, with the afflicted SPs being originally created for all channels, to start and end normally, later changed to specific channel, then does not adhere to the padding later assigned, after that.

I'll leave my clipping on, and see what other data comes in, before I make any further changes.

Perhaps an email to TiVoMargret with TSNs and a copy of your report might allow her to catch something in the logs, if she puts your TSNs on active log monitoring status.


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## morac

Well The Flash recorded 61 minutes as it was set to do. This was with Overlap Protection off. Don't know if that was the "fix" or something else happened. I turned it back on to see what happens next week.


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## morac

Gotham only recorded 60 minutes instead of 61, despite me modifying the season pass last week. 

I'll see what The Flash does tomorrow since last week it did record 61 minutes, but I turned overlap protection off after it did.


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## ajwees41

tatergator1 said:


> I'm inclined to think Vudu will show up before the November update. Based on nooneuknow's posts, it's probably already in the current Tivo software.
> 
> I think Amazon Prime will be the big news of the November update.


got update no Prime or Vudu


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## Keen

ajwees41 said:


> got update no Prime or Vudu


Wrong thread, there's another thread for the new 20.4.5 update.


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## Furmaniac

FitzAusTex said:


> Have to use a wish list, or wait to set up an SP until it is in the database. Many can't currently set up an SP for GOT. I think only folks with VOD (comcast) on their tivo can set an SP.


Also a wishlist is the only way to keep the programs under my shows organized in user-generated folders such as game shows, documentaries, favorite actresses Etc


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