# Thinking through lifetime (all-in) or not



## MustHaveTivo (Mar 15, 2005)

Hi, realizing that in the end it comes down to personal choice, I'm interested in current thinking regarding purchasing lifetime or not. Mine has been a TiVo household since I'm not even sure how long ago (DirecTV GXCEBOT times). We're now planning to change from 2 TivoHDs to a 3TB Bolt Vox + 2 Minis. We had kind of sworn off lifetime after we had a lifetime TivoHD die out of warranty, but seeing that the current rack rate $550 is paid for in only 37 months at $15, we started to reconsider. Then again, Black Friday deals on monthly could push that up into the 41-45 month range. Plus there's now the "Continual Care" on monthly/annually, and if I am understanding this right (am I?), $149 swaps for failed lifetime equipment. We're completely able to change out hard drives if that's a needed repair, but I'd say we find it a less interesting hobby than we did 15 years ago...

So, how are people deciding between all-in and monthly/annual these days?


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

If you are looking for a "value" purchase, I would consider picking up a used Roamio Pro/Plus with lifetime. These are going for good prices and the payback will be much quicker and if you just get a couple non-VOX minis, you will save a bunch more.


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## Sparky1234 (May 8, 2006)

MustHaveTivo said:


> Hi, realizing that in the end it comes down to personal choice, I'm interested in current thinking regarding purchasing lifetime or not. Mine has been a TiVo household since I'm not even sure how long ago (DirecTV GXCEBOT times). We're now planning to change from 2 TivoHDs to a 3TB Bolt Vox + 2 Minis. We had kind of sworn off lifetime after we had a lifetime TivoHD die out of warranty, but seeing that the current rack rate $550 is paid for in only 37 months at $15, we started to reconsider. Then again, Black Friday deals on monthly could push that up into the 41-45 month range. Plus there's now the "Continual Care" on monthly/annually, and if I am understanding this right (am I?), $149 swaps for failed lifetime equipment. We're completely able to change out hard drives if that's a needed repair, but I'd say we find it a less interesting hobby than we did 15 years ago...
> 
> So, how are people deciding between all-in and monthly/annual these days?


Really depends on how long you will live. LOL.


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## chicagobrownblue (May 29, 2008)

I prefer to buy new and pay for prepaid annual to include the Continual Care. I may do this with one of the Black Friday deals since the Bolt is now available in black. I'm not comfortable changing out the HD in a Bolt since you inevitably break some tabs.

If you buy all in / lifetime I would put your Bolt on a UPS and run the coax through a coax surge suppressor. My barber unplugs all of his consumer electronics during a lightning storm.


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

Continual care with non-Lifetime is attractive. At the same time and without guarantees, TiVo has been known to give sweetheart deals to Lifetime users whose TiVo box has suffered a catastrophic loss.


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## scandia101 (Oct 20, 2007)

MustHaveTivo said:


> So, how are people deciding between all-in and monthly/annual these days?


To me, All-In is a no brainer. The question I ask is 'will the absence of $550 in my bank account have any kind of negative impact on my life?' and the answer is, 'No, it won't and it will be a completely non issue very quickly and I'll never have to think about paying for service again. That is a much better option to me than having to think about how much service is costing me on a continual basis.
Plus, there's the fact that having All-In actually gives a tivo some resale value. Not that I'd like to recoup some money, but because it gives me a good reason to get an unused box out of my home rather than allowing it to take up space.
17.5 year subscriber.


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

With the longevity of my first TiVo box, a Toshiba Series 2 TiVo box, my Lifetime subscription worked out to around 1 Starbucks grande coffee per month.


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## rjrsouthwest (Feb 19, 2016)

Tivo gave me a monthly deal after the included 1st year free ended of $6.95 a month for as long as i keep my Bolt active with continual care of $49 replacement cost if it should ever need to be replaced. I just could not justify the all in fee in lieu of the $6.95 monthly they offered.


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

rjrsouthwest said:


> Tivo gave me a monthly deal after the included 1st year free ended of $6.95 a month for as long as i keep my Bolt active with continual care of $49 replacement cost if it should ever need to be replaced. I just could not justify the all in fee in lieu of the $6.95 monthly they offered.


In part, you've purchased an extended warranty--a fair call.


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## MustHaveTivo (Mar 15, 2005)

fcfc2 said:


> If you are looking for a "value" purchase, I would consider picking up a used Roamio Pro/Plus with lifetime. These are going for good prices and the payback will be much quicker and if you just get a couple non-VOX minis, you will save a bunch more.


Thanks for the suggestion, but we're going for the Bolt VOXs. As evidenced by our 11-year-old TivoHDs, we don't swap frequently so prefer to get the latest...


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## rjrsouthwest (Feb 19, 2016)

Mikeguy said:


> In part, you've purchased an extended warranty--a fair call.


Yes at $6.95/month for the Tivo service and a reasonable replacement cost if it should ever fail I just couldn't figure out any way to justify paying for the all in service up front, it just would take to long to start to see any financial advantage with all in and the low unit replacement cost if it ever fails was also helpful in making the monthly choice.


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

2 TiVos x $6.95/month x 12 months/year x 11 years = $1834.80 is what OP didn't pay in monthly charges because he bought Lifetime.


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## jth tv (Nov 15, 2014)

ATSC 3.0 is suppose to appear in 2020.


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## Sparky1234 (May 8, 2006)

jth tv said:


> ATSC 3.0 is suppose to appear in 2020.


This shouldn't affect cable TiVos.


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## OrangeCrush (Feb 18, 2016)

MustHaveTivo said:


> Thanks for the suggestion, but we're going for the Bolt VOXs. As evidenced by our 11-year-old TivoHDs, we don't swap frequently so prefer to get the latest...


Do you intend to stick with the old user interface, or go with the "new experience" (which will be the default on a new box purchase)?

The reason I ask is because the Vox remote is a pain if you want to stick with the old UI. Any time you accidentally hit the microphone button, you'll launch the upgrade program. If that's the case, then you'll want to keep an eye out for a non-vox Bolt or Roamio.

Otherwise, black friday deals are your best bet. I would go with an annual plan unless a really good deal on all-in shows up.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

MustHaveTivo said:


> Thanks for the suggestion, but we're going for the Bolt VOXs. As evidenced by our 11-year-old TivoHDs, we don't swap frequently so prefer to get the latest...


It's a shame you didn't take advantage of the upgrade sales they've had if your existing 2 HD's have lifetime. We upgraded my son's HD to a Bolt back in April 2017 for $299 including the All-in (500GB drive which we upgraded to 2TB).

Scott


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

HerronScott said:


> It's a shame you didn't take advantage of the upgrade sales they've had if your existing 2 HD's have lifetime. We upgraded my son's HD to a Bolt back in April 2017 for $299 including the All-in (500GB drive which we upgraded to 2TB).


A good point, and raising another option: if it's possible, sit back and wait and see if TiVo has another upgrade offer in the next year--it's had a few in the past couple of years.


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## MustHaveTivo (Mar 15, 2005)

ej42137 said:


> 2 TiVos x $6.95/month x 12 months/year x 11 years = $1834.80 is what OP didn't pay in monthly charges because he bought Lifetime.


Nice analysis. But we went for lifetime on one, and annual on the other. And I don't know whether we would have predicted 11 years when we bought those, but I'm certainly not counting on that long this time. Eligible for retirement in 4.5 years and if we're stupendously lucky, could be moving to a satellite-type region not too long after that. I wouldn't prepay 6 years, put it that way.

BTW if anyone's mind is going there, OTA is not an option here. There's like a mile of granite between us and the transmitters.



OrangeCrush said:


> Do you intend to stick with the old user interface, or go with the "new experience" (which will be the default on a new box purchase)?


We're game to try the new experience. We had an airbnb with a Dish Hopper box this summer and we started to get the hang of it, so I feel like our brains might handle it ok.



HerronScott said:


> It's a shame you didn't take advantage of the upgrade sales they've had if your existing 2 HD's have lifetime. We upgraded my son's HD to a Bolt back in April 2017 for $299 including the All-in (500GB drive which we upgraded to 2TB).


We plan to retain the lifetime TivoHD, so lifetime transfers are not tempting. The non-lifetime one has issues (power supply suspected) and we're done with it.

Thanks to all for thinking out loud. Final decision will depend on the Black Friday prices offered, but I think we're leaning toward annual. The continual care offer sweetens that deal.


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## dmurphy (Jan 17, 2002)

MustHaveTivo said:


> Nice analysis. But we went for lifetime on one, and annual on the other. And I don't know whether we would have predicted 11 years when we bought those, but I'm certainly not counting on that long this time. Eligible for retirement in 4.5 years and if we're stupendously lucky, could be moving to a satellite-type region not too long after that. I wouldn't prepay 6 years, put it that way.


To be honest, I've always come out ahead on lifetime deals ...

I bought my first DirecTiVo back in ~2000 or so - I paid $200 for the lifetime plan, right before it was discontinued. That then got transferred to DirecTV, and became a "Lifetime DVR Service" plan from DirecTV. I left DirecTV 7 years ago when I moved to FiOS territory; so that was 12 years of DVR service for $200. Definitely a win. And if I went back to DirecTV tomorrow, for whatever reason, I could reactivate it. Section 6 of the DirecTV Customer Agreement - "If you paid a "lifetime service fee," you will not be charged a fee for your DIRECTV DVR Service as long as you maintain television programming service from DIRECTV on the same account. If you disconnect your DIRECTV television programming service and later reconnect on the same account, your DIRECTV DVR Service will be reconnected and you will not be charged a fee for DIRECTV DVR Service."

Once I moved over to FiOS, I played with their boxes for a bit and then finally came home to TiVo. I managed to pick up a pair of Roamios for $300/ea with lifetime service. Those have been a home run too. I also picked up a Roamio Pro at the same time and paid for lifetime on it as well. Sold that to a family member last year when I upgraded to a BOLT+. Came out basically even on the Roamio Pro.

So for a summary I have active:

2x Roamios ($300+$300) (Fam room, master BR)
1x BOLT+ ($799) (Basement)
7x Minis ($100/ea average) (exercise room, living room, spare BR, child BR, mancave, fireplace tv, deck tv)
Total investment: $2,099

Cost avoidance monthly:
Fios Quantum Premium DVR: $30/mo
Fios STB (10x): $120/mo
Minus cost of CableCards w/ TiVo ($15/mo):
Total savings monthly: $135/mo

By month 16, I'm ahead of the game. And with a VASTLY, VASTLY superior product. Night and day.

I love my TiVos. Been lucky to time upgrades and such right historically, but if I had to buy another TiVo tomorrow, it'd be a no brainer. I'm so far ahead - I've put thousands of dollars back in my pocket with TiVo... not to mention how HAPPY I am.


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

MustHaveTivo said:


> Thanks to all for thinking out loud. Final decision will depend on the Black Friday prices offered, but I think we're leaning toward annual. The continual care offer sweetens that deal.


The TiVo BF offers, as announced by TiVo_Ted in the Black Friday thread here earlier:



TiVo_Ted said:


> Our holiday sale starts on the 20th and runs through the 26th. Supplies are limited, but as usual we're going to have some exclusive deals on factory renewed products. These are mostly open-box returns that are polished, tested and repackaged. Here are the offers. Some launch on the 20th, others don't come online until the 23rd.
> - Renewed BOLT 500GB (white) - $99.99 + $9.99/month
> - Renewed BOLT 1TB (white) - $149.99 + $9.99/month
> - Renewed Roamio OTA 1TB - $299.99 with All-In service included
> ...


TiVo's "Winterfest Thanksgiving Sale" now is live:

TiVo Winterfest Thanksgiving Sale - Get a TiVo BOLT VOX 500GB $0 down!
​


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## OrangeCrush (Feb 18, 2016)

Mikeguy said:


> TiVo's "Winterfest Thanksgiving Sale" now is live:
> 
> TiVo Winterfest Thanksgiving Sale - Get a TiVo BOLT VOX 500GB $0 down!


Interesting, I haven't seen them alter the monthly pricing like this by device before.

The Bolt Vox comes for $0 down and $20/mo w/ a 2 year commitment while the refurb non-Vox Bolt is $110 down w/ a $10/mo service plan (looks like no year-long commitment either)


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

OrangeCrush said:


> Interesting, I haven't seen them alter the monthly pricing like this by device before.


Right this had been discussed in the new Bolt OTA thread. Obviously trying to attract the cord-cutters who are already looking at reducing their costs without doing what they did on the Roamio OTA and including All-in service.

Scott


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