# BRAND NEW TIVO Premiere $ 95 + FREE SHIPPING!



## Wingershute

6th Ave Electronics has the TIVO Premiere for $ 95 with FREE SHIPPING after using coupon code AFL4COUPON. This is the best deal by far I have seen.
Absolutely incredible!


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## MikeAndrews

Holy crap.

Can't resist!

I ordered one.

It's $95._04_ to be exact.

I hate you.


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## Wingershute

http://www.6ave.com/shop/product.aspx?sku=TVOPREMIEREDVR

These things are flying off the shelves!


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## MikeAndrews

Wingershute said:


> These things are flying off the shelves!


Well... maybe not,....which is why they're at fire sale pricing already.


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## atmuscarella

netringer said:


> Well... maybe not,....which is why they're at fire sale pricing already.


Well I bought one came to $102.65 with tax. wonder if I will be able to find CS rep that will give me lifetime for $199 instead of $299.

Thanks,


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## iglesiab

Just ordered one as well. I had also bought one last week from electroic expo for $160 which will be delivered Monday. Wonder what their return policy is..


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## alyssa

In for one
off to read the entire upgrade thread.

Sell out prediction times? I'm thinking noon est.


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## noeltykay

alyssa said:


> In for one
> off to read the entire upgrade thread.
> 
> Sell out prediction times? I'm thinking noon est.


I am in for one too! I love my Tivo Premiere and can't wait to give the last Motorola DVR back to Time Warner!


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## trip1eX

I bought a 3rd for some reason even though I haven't even used by 2nd Premiere yet. 

I figure I can always give it away as an xmas present or resell it.


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## davezatz

In a moment of weakness, I ordered one too. So my household will be 100% Premiere. With hopes of *streaming* MRV... Now I need to figure out how/where to unload my S3 and THD.


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## MikeAndrews

atmuscarella said:


> Well I bought one came to $102.65 with tax.


Oh. I was going to ask how, but you said, tax.

That coupon is worth $4.


6ave said:


> ZCOUPON 6ave.com - Your Special Savings 1 ($3.96)





atmuscarella said:


> wonder if I will be able to find CS rep that will give me lifetime for $199 instead of $299.


Is that possible? Cool. For once in my life, I'll go for it.

I was thinking I'd give one S3 to my neighbor, but the only thing that prevents me from just having another live HD TiVo elsewhere in the house is the stoopid Comcast additional outlet fee (x 2) for the CableCARDs. I may keep 3 (5 currently!) for a while.

I'm going to do a 2TB disk upgrade on this Premiere ala Comer almost immediately.


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## lessd

Now gone, out of stock, I did get mine at that price.


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## mec1991

Just ordered one; ships in 3 to 5 business days with free shipping and no tax (TX). Thanks for the info! :up:


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## bigpatky

davezatz said:


> In a moment of weakness, I ordered one too. So my household will be 100% Premiere. With hopes of *streaming* MRV... Now I need to figure out how/where to unload my S3 and THD.


1. are the premiere's _capable_ of streaming mrv? 
2. if so, is that something you could see tivo ever implementing?

streaming mrv like what directv has now is pushing me dangerously close to the edge of dropping cable/tivo and going satellite. streaming mrv with the premiere or a tivo "extender" box would keep me for a long time.


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## slowbiscuit

Wow, if this isn't an indication that these are bombing in the market I don't know what is.

In 4 1, they're still in stock.


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## slowbiscuit

bigpatky said:


> 1. are the premiere's _capable_ of streaming mrv?
> 2. if so, is that something you could see tivo ever implementing?


Yes, absolutely. Even the HD/S3's are capable of it.

Who knows? So far they've been incapable of delivering this, and the speculation is that there is some sort of backroom deal with the content providers preventing it. Which doesn't make sense since EVERY OTHER FREAKING DVR with network capabilities can do it, but little from Tivo makes sense these days.


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## smbaker

I'm not even all that happy with the Premiere I do own, and now I've ordered a second.... The psychology of a "good deal" at work.


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## innocentfreak

Best Buy is also supposed to have it for $99 next week in the flyer according to those who got the flyer today. This is supposed to be without a TV purchase.


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## alyssa

lessd said:


> Now gone, out of stock, I did get mine at that price.


I just checked & it's still available.


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## curiousgeorge

innocentfreak said:


> Best Buy is also supposed to have it for $99 next week in the flyer according to those who got the flyer today. This is supposed to be without a TV purchase.


$299 -> $99 in a little over 6 months. If that isn't an indictment of TiVo's poor management of the platform and bad word of mouth on the new release, I don't know what is. It's shocking that heads haven't rolled in management over this debacle.


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## innocentfreak

curiousgeorge said:


> $299 -> $99 in a little over 6 months. If that isn't an indictment of TiVo's poor management of the platform and bad word of mouth on the new release, I don't know what is. It's shocking that heads haven't rolled in management over this debacle.


BB has almost always had it for $99. They just required a TV purchase to get the price. The week before Thanksgiving and Black Friday with so many places doing sales early it isn't surprising it is on sale. These stores are pretty much selling it at cost to bring people in. These stores aren't losing money on them but instead choosing not to make a profit to drive traffic. It makes perfect sense during the holidays.

Google TV is also on sale for Black Friday. The Sony Blu-Ray player will be $299 so already down $100 within what a month or two? You can't use BF and Thanksgiving/holiday sales to really judge how well it is selling.


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## curiousgeorge

innocentfreak said:


> BB has almost always had it for $99. They just required a TV purchase to get the price. The week before Thanksgiving and Black Friday with so many places doing sales early it isn't surprising it is on sale. These stores are pretty much selling it at cost to bring people in. These stores aren't losing money on them but instead choosing not to make a profit to drive traffic. It makes perfect sense during the holidays.
> 
> Google TV is also on sale for Black Friday. The Sony Blu-Ray player will be $299 so already down $100 within what a month or two? You can't use BF and Thanksgiving/holiday sales to really judge how well it is selling.


This isn't a Black Friday thing. EE has had it for $136-$154 shipped for going on three months now. $99 is the natural progression of the fire sale for half-working dog with bad word of mouth. It was half price at EE 3 months after release.


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## ECrispy

New user here, I just ordered from 6ave and can't wait to see what I'm missing after using Comcast all these years.

Off to read drive upgrade thread and prepare for the Tivo.


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## atmuscarella

curiousgeorge said:


> $299 -> $99 in a little over 6 months. If that isn't an indictment of TiVo's poor management of the platform and bad word of mouth on the new release, I don't know what is. It's shocking that heads haven't rolled in management over this debacle.


I wouldn't made too much of it both my Series 2 TiVos were free after rebates. When the Series 3 & HD models came along TiVo tried to stop selling the hardware below cost, maybe they have decided that didn't workout so well and are back to selling the hardware below cost and hoping they make it up with subscriptions and advertising revenue.

Thanks,


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## davezatz

bigpatky said:


> 1. are the premiere's _capable_ of streaming mrv?
> 2. if so, is that something you could see tivo ever implementing?


Yah, the hardware is capable. Someone just has to decide if/when it's a priority to implement. In my current Cox neighborhood, MRV (and TTG) is dead to me other than the locals due to the copy once CCI Byte flap. So I am hopeful it comes to TiVo's retail line in some form as it's something they need to integrate for their cable and satellite provider partners - as illustrated when they joined the Multimedia over Coax Alliance, stating:

_"Integrating MoCA into our products will enable service providers to offer a simple home networking solution that offers unrivalled Quality of Service."_

However, I'm not holding my breath and am exploring FiOS TV (no CCI Byte or SDV tuning adapters!) when we move next month...

By the way, it looks like the deal is still in play however TiVo no longer shows up in 6ave search. Need to use the direct link.


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## innocentfreak

curiousgeorge said:


> This isn't a Black Friday thing. EE has had it for $136-$154 shipped for going on three months now. $99 is the natural progression of the fire sale for half-working dog with bad word of mouth. It was half price at EE 3 months after release.


Correct it has been around $150 shipped for some time. It has also been $99 with purchase of a HDTV from BB for some time. Their cost from the beginning has always been around $100 for the retail chains. We knew this from early on based off some Best Buy employees posting their employee price which is always a percentage over BB cost. This box is cheaper for TiVo to make and therefore cheaper to offer to retail stores.

At $150 they are still making money. Would you rather sell 1 unit for $200 profit or 10 units for $50 profit each while also constantly driving traffic to your site?


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## innocentfreak

davezatz said:


> Yah, the hardware is capable. Someone just has to decide if/when it's a priority to implement. In my current Cox neighborhood, MRV (and TTG) is dead to me other than the locals due to the copy once CCI Byte flap. So I am hopeful it comes to TiVo's retail line in some form as it's something they need to integrate for their cable and satellite provider partners - as illustrated when they joined the Multimedia over Coax Alliance, stating:
> 
> _Integrating MoCA into our products will enable service providers to offer a simple home networking solution that offers unrivalled Quality of Service._
> 
> However, I'm not holding my breath and am exploring FiOS TV (no CCI Byte or SDV tuning adapters!) when we move next month...
> 
> By the way, it looks like the deal is still in play however TiVo no longer shows up in 6ave search. Need to use the direct link.


Maybe we can get you a sit down with TiVo rather than Cnet so you can ask actual questions?


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## ECrispy

Selling at cost still makes Tivo a profit because of the service plan. So they can afford to let the retailers do it, its just a little less profit and makes total sense in the holidays.


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## davezatz

innocentfreak said:


> Maybe we can get you a sit down with TiVo rather than Cnet so you can ask actual questions?


TiVo's always willing to chat with me. But they rarely get into the hypothetical or future plans. So I almost always skip the formal interviews, knowing we won't get many juicy nuggets out of it. They hold things close to the vest and will announce/discuss on their schedule. I'd prefer they excite us by alluding to the numerous things they must be working on, but they're more like Apple than say Verizon FiOS TV in how they handle their outreach.


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## innocentfreak

davezatz said:


> TiVo's always willing to chat with me. But they rarely get into the hypothetical or future plans. So I almost always skip the formal interviews, knowing we won't get many juicy nuggets out of it. They hold things close to the vest and will announce/discuss on their schedule. I'd prefer they excite us by alluding to the numerous things they must be working on, but they're more like Apple than say Verizon FiOS TV in how they handle their outreach.


Yeah I wish they hinted more or even just a hey we are looking into it. Can't wait to see your post on streaming once you get your second Premiere  Maybe Rafe at Cnet misunderstood the second screen prompting from TiVo PR?

I don't mind them keeping things close to the vest like Apple if they are consistent with releases like Apple where you know when you just don't know what. I realize it is a no win situation for TiVo though.


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## bciocco

I got one. I had to call in. The site wasn't offering online ordering of the Premier anymore. I used the coupon AFL4COUPON and got it for $95.04.
I couldn't resist, even though I just installed a 1T Hard drive in my HD a few months ago. I think I want the new interface so the menus will fit on my TV without bleeding off the edge. 
Now I may add a wireless keyboard.


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## DaveMN

I just bit on one of these. Is there any way to get the $199 lifetime offer on this? I already own a Series 1 and a TiVo HD, both with lifetime service.


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## appleye1

Wingershute said:


> http://www.6ave.com/shop/product.aspx?sku=TVOPREMIEREDVR
> 
> These things are flying off the shelves!


Where is the "buy" button on that page? I don't see a way to purchase one. Or maybe that means they've finally run out.


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## innocentfreak

People are still having luck calling to get the price and ordering over the phone.



DaveMN said:


> I just bit on one of these. Is there any way to get the $199 lifetime offer on this? I already own a Series 1 and a TiVo HD, both with lifetime service.


Some have and some haven't. You would have to call TiVo to see if they will give it to you.


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## MikeAndrews

appleye1 said:


> Where is the "buy" button on that page? I don't see a way to purchase one. Or maybe that means they've finally run out.


Yeah. The hint is the "(Limit 2 Per Customer)" that wasn't there before.

How much you wanna bet that one or more of the resellers bought a few hundred because $99 is less than wholesale?


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## alyssa

bciocco said:


> I couldn't resist, even though I just installed a 1T Hard drive in my HD a few months ago. .


Yeah, I don't have need of a new tivo either. My two S3's are chugging along with gobs of space. But... I just finished fixing a DS and I need a new project.


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## treaty

You guys think you'll be able to transfer your existing service plan to these or do you think you'll have to buy a new 12 month service plan at $19.99 a month?

http://www.tivo.com/abouttivo/policies/tivoservicepaymentplanstermsandconditions.html

2.1.2 When purchasing a TiVo Premiere box from a third party retailer at $99.99 (includes an instant $200 savings off MSRP) for the TiVo Premiere box or $299.99 (includes an instant $200 savings off MSRP) for the TiVo Premiere XL box, you may only subscribe to the TiVo Service on a monthly basis for $19.99 a month with a one (1) year commitment (renews monthly after one year).


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## ECrispy

The new terms are a bait and switch aren't they? There was no indication for those who bought at the the $99 price, or those who will buy tomorrow.


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## tcfcameron

TIVO JUST PULLED A BAIT & SWITCH!

http://www.tivo.com/abouttivo/policies/tivoservicepaymentplanstermsandconditions.html

I purchased BEFORE the policy changes, yet apparently will be stuck paying under the new rules, since the units have not arrived yet, and the rules apply based on ACTIVATION DATE.

I had a bit of an odd feeling upon revisiting the product page, a day after purchase, and noticing that there was an added link to TiVo's service agreement, right below the "Purchase" button... Now I know why.

Should I try to refuse delivery?


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## davezatz

I am hoping the 6ave price was a mistake and not related to the price point that Best Buy and TiVo.com have hit with the $20/mo plan. Then again, that'd be REALLY coincidental. If I can't transfer my MSD, I'll send it back.


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## jcthorne

$99 and free shipping now available at Amazon and Tiger Direct as of this morning. No limit at Amazon.


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## davezatz

jcthorne said:


> $99 and free shipping now available at Amazon and Tiger Direct as of this morning. No limit at Amazon.


Actually both are $99.99 whereas 6ave is/was $99 flat. Not sure if this emphasizes it was a pricing mistake or not though... :/ I'm kinda worried I'm going to get hit with the new $20/mo service fee and might see about canceling my order.


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## atmuscarella

tcfcameron said:


> TIVO JUST PULLED A BAIT & SWITCH!
> 
> http://www.tivo.com/abouttivo/policies/tivoservicepaymentplanstermsandconditions.html
> 
> I purchased BEFORE the policy changes, yet apparently will be stuck paying under the new rules, since the units have not arrived yet, and the rules apply based on ACTIVATION DATE.
> 
> I had a bit of an odd feeling upon revisiting the product page, a day after purchase, and noticing that there was an added link to TiVo's service agreement, right below the "Purchase" button... Now I know why.
> 
> Should I try to refuse delivery?


Not sure what is true for those of us that purchased our TiVos on 11/13. The new Tivo Payment Plans clearly states it is for TiVos purchased on or after 11/14 the next section (2.2) addresses TiVos purchased before 11/14 but activated after 11/14 which indicates we have the same options as before.

My bottom line is if I can not get lifetime for $299 or less my unit is going back.

Thanks,


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## davezatz

atmuscarella said:


> Not sure what is true for those of us that purchased our TiVos on 11/13. The new Tivo Payment Plans clearly states it is for TiVos purchased on or after 11/14 the next section (2.2) addresses TiVos purchased before 11/14 but activated after 11/14 which indicates we have the same options as before.
> 
> My bottom line is if I can not get lifetime for $299 or less my unit is going back.
> 
> Thanks,


According to that SlickDeals TiVo chat transcript, somehow it's tied to SKU/TSN. Who knows how accurate that is though. But if we do have to return units to 6ave.com we all may be eating the return shipping fee:

http://www.6ave.com/shop/usertpl.aspx?fle=faq.htm#if_my_q3



> Free shipping
> If your order was shipped for free or at a promotional shipping rate, you will incur the actual "to and from" UPS/Freight charges upon returning merchandise.


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## atmuscarella

davezatz said:


> According to that SlickDeals TiVo chat transcript, somehow it's tied to SKU/TSN. Who knows how accurate that is though. But if we do have to return units to 6ave.com we all may be eating the return shipping fee:
> 
> http://www.6ave.com/shop/usertpl.aspx?fle=faq.htm#if_my_q3


That kind of sucks last time I looked it cost about $25 to ship a TiVo by UPS. However even if they are basing it on SKU/TSNs I am fairly sure they have to have away to manually over ride it and honer what their updated policy says - we did buy the units before 11/14, perhaps 6ave.com wasn't supposed to start selling them until 11/14 but that is not our problem. My email receipt clearly says 11/13 on it.

Thanks,


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## mec1991

atmuscarella said:


> *perhaps 6ave.com wasn't supposed to start selling them until 11/14 but that is not or problem. My email receipt clearly says 11/13 on it.*


Ditto. If they try to lock me in to a $20 plan I am going to be uber-pissed. (Never believed I would sound like one of the trolls we get here. )

This could really turn into a public relations nightmare for the company if a lot of folks buy one not knowing the full details ahead of time. Does anyone remember the "sale" Replay had by selling their lifetime boxes at a much lower price?


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## davezatz

mec1991 said:


> Does anyone remember the "sale" Replay had by selling their lifetime boxes at a much lower price?


Yeah... and there was some trick/science to it. Like only the boxes that had a certain sticker or something. Man, that was a loooong while ago. But I do remember getting a deal somehow.


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## cckrobinson

atmuscarella said:


> perhaps 6ave.com wasn't supposed to start selling them until 11/14 but that is not or problem. My email receipt clearly says 11/13 on it.
> 
> Thanks,


I'll bet that's exactly what happened. They were probably supposed to wait until sunday to sell them at $99 like everyone else (bestbuy, amazon, tigerdirect). Instead, they started selling them early and they sold a boat load of them. I wasn't evening looking for a new Tivo when I bought mine on Friday night. I had intended to buy an external HD drive for my TivoHD. When I saw that the price of the Premiere was within $20 of a 1TB drive I pulled the trigger. This is a touchy situation.


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## DaveMN

My chat this morning with TiVo support:

Kaitlyn: Thank you for verifying your information. How may I assist you today?

Me: I ordered a new Premiere from an online retailer on 11/12. It has not shipped yet. Will I be subject to your new TOS at $20/mo when it arrives, or will I be able to purchase product lifetime service (including my multi-service discount)?

Kaitlyn: You could purchase either the TiVo Product Lifetime Service with a Multi-Service Discount or change your plan to the $20/month offer.

Me: It would be insane to opt-in to a $20/month plan, so you're confirming that (if I qualify for my multi-service discount), I can purchase product lifetime for $299, correct?

Kaitlyn: Yes that is correct.


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## wjdennen

so, wait, if I bought the Tivo from 6ave, I can't get the old pricing?

edit: I just chatted with Harry on 6ave and he said that if you purchased Tivo from them yesterday, you'd get the old pricing. This matches my reading of the new Tivo policy.


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## slowbiscuit

I don't see a problem for those of us who purchased one of these from 6ave before today, because the new service terms specifically say that we can get the old monthly or lifetime plans for a box purchased before 11/14. 6ave jumped the gun on the new price, that's all, and we should benefit from their mistake.

This is kind of like the ReplayTV fiasco in 2003 - in that one, all the 55xx series boxes had lifetime service included but then they switched to a 'service not included' deal - some retailers lowered the price to $150 on old stock but service was still included on the boxes, so Replay had to honor it. I got one of those.


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## wjdennen

slowbiscuit said:


> I don't see a problem for those of us who purchased one of these from 6ave before today, because the new service terms specifically say that we can get the old monthly or lifetime plans for a box purchased before 11/14. 6ave jumped the gun on the new price, that's all, and we should benefit from their mistake.


Agreed. Thanks for the responses.


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## trip1eX

Yes looking good for those who purchased before today.


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## atmuscarella

6ave.com has now updated their site to clearly indicate TiVo's new subscription policy - good for them.


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## smbaker

wjdennen said:


> edit: I just chatted with Harry on 6ave and he said that if you purchased Tivo from them yesterday, you'd get the old pricing. This matches my reading of the new Tivo policy.


This is good news. However, I'd be suspect that when all of us go to activate the units that we aren't going to be presented with the new pricing and have to go through some hoops with Tivo over the phone convincing them it was purchased before the new pricing. It sounds like, as others have said, some merchants jumped the gun and started selling product before they were supposed to.

Personally, I think I'll be putting lifetime on mine.

On a positive side, even if Tivo somehow refused to honor the old price, $95 is a great price for a parts Tivo (spare hard drive, spare power supply, etc).


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## innocentfreak

Most people on SD have verified with TiVo they will let you add lifetime if you bought prior to 11/14, but you will have to call. Now if you were interested in other plans I don't know. 

Some people called in today who bought locally yesterday since they live near 6th Ave and had no problems.


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## smbaker

innocentfreak said:


> Most people on SD have verified with TiVo they will let you add lifetime if you bought prior to 11/14, but you will have to call. Now if you were interested in other plans I don't know.


What is SD?


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## aadam101

smbaker said:


> What is SD?


Slickdeals.net


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## innocentfreak

slickdeals.


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## GPT999

DaveMN said:


> My chat this morning with TiVo support:
> 
> Kaitlyn: Thank you for verifying your information. How may I assist you today?
> 
> Me: I ordered a new Premiere from an online retailer on 11/12. It has not shipped yet. Will I be subject to your new TOS at $20/mo when it arrives, or will I be able to purchase product lifetime service (including my multi-service discount)?
> 
> Kaitlyn: You could purchase either the TiVo Product Lifetime Service with a Multi-Service Discount or change your plan to the $20/month offer.
> 
> Me: It would be insane to opt-in to a $20/month plan, so you're confirming that (if I qualify for my multi-service discount), I can purchase product lifetime for $299, correct?
> 
> Kaitlyn: Yes that is correct.


So is the possible $299 lifetime only if you already had lifetime on a different unit or just as long as you had any service agreement with them on a different unit? I currently am paying the $12.95 or something like that on a HD. As a side note, I am assuming the lifetime is a service agreement is per unit, correct?


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## DaveMN

GPT999 said:


> So is the possible $299 lifetime only if you already had lifetime on a different unit or just as long as you had any service agreement with them on a different unit? I currently am paying the $12.95 or something like that on a HD. As a side note, I am assuming the lifetime is a service agreement is per unit, correct?


I'll get $299 since I qualify for the multi service discount:
http://www.tivo.com/abouttivo/policies/tivomultiservicediscountagreement.html

And yes, the lifetime is per unit.


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## ernda

Called customer service and told them I bought the Premiere yesterday at 6th ave. and there was nothing on the website about only $20 plans available (like there is today). They told me 6th ave jumped the gun when they should not have, etc. I said its not my problem and my choice is cancel the purchase and go with the cable DVR (even though I have two other series 2 boxes, one with lifetime) or offer me lifetime. They were very nice and gave me "one time" option to purchase lifetime for $299 when I activate.


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## tcfcameron

TiVo has also removed the "Change TiVo TSN" option from their website.

You now have to call-in to get that done. I'm going to assume that they have imposed restrictions, and you will have to get approval (beyond simply asking them to do it).

http://www.tivo.com/abouttivo/policies/index.html


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## slowbiscuit

I think the interesting question now is, are the pre-11/14 boxes more valuable because you can still get lifetime or $12.95 monthly on them?

And which retailers, if any, will be offering new boxes now at other than the $99.99 price? Because if you can't get lifetime on these, the $20/mo. price will drive away a lot of potential customers - Tivo is now more expensive than a cable DVR (on most systems).

I don't get the marketing here at all - the average consumer doesn't see the advantages that Tivo has that we do, and if they wanted to do something like this I think they should've priced it lower than cable (say, $15/mo.).


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## darksurtur

slowbiscuit said:


> I think the interesting question now is, are the pre-11/14 boxes more valuable because you can still get lifetime or $12.95 monthly on them?
> 
> And which retailers, if any, will be offering new boxes now at other than the $99.99 price? Because if you can't get lifetime on these, the $20/mo. price will drive away a lot of potential customers - Tivo is now more expensive than a cable DVR (on most systems).
> 
> I don't get the marketing here at all - the average consumer doesn't see the advantages that Tivo has that we do, and if they wanted to do something like this I think they should've priced it lower than cable (say, $15/mo.).


I get the impression the $99 price is the ONLY price retailers will be offering from now on. I imagine this will shoot the price of lifetimed units up a fair bit, as now the cheapest lifetime option for a new subscriber is $700 + any tax (for an existing subscriber with the $199 options, it's still $460, right?).


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## MikeAndrews

There are three new hardware + monthly pricing tiers.

I started a new thread specifically on the pricing model here: http://tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=459176


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## alyssa

Just got off the phone with tivo CS; it'll either be $12.95 or $9.95 depending on if I qualify for a multiService discount. I assume, I'll be able to get lifetime for $299 with my MSD. 

The rep said there'd been a few emails regarding the 6th ave people....
Personally, I think the people who ordered on 11.13.10 squeaked in on a great deal. 
$398.04 for a premier with lifetime? :up:


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## tcfcameron

alyssa said:


> Just got off the phone with tivo CS; it'll either be $12.95 or $9.95 depending on if I qualify for a multiService discount. I assume, I'll be able to get lifetime for $299 with my MSD.
> 
> The rep said there'd been a few emails regarding the 6th ave people....
> Personally, I think the people who ordered on 11.13.10 squeaked in on a great deal.
> $398.04 for a premier with lifetime? :up:


Let's not forget that TiVo can stop offering LT service any time they want, without notice or reason. Some of us, yeah me, spent all our money on the boxes, and will have to wait on LT service, and hope it is still available.


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## mec1991

Is there any way a mod (we still have mods, don't we?) could please merge these two threads? This old man is getting confused trying to keep up with what is going on.


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## alyssa

Respectfully, I don't think this thread should be merged with any other threads. This thread is for people who bought a new unit a day or two prior to the policy change. It is needed because of the gray area brought into the matrix due to 6th Ave jumping the gun.
The other threads are for people trying to understand the new policy.


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## mec1991

Alyssa,

I guess I need to stick with this one then as I ordered one from them on the 13th also. 

Thanks.


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## NullQwerty

I ordered mine on the 13th also. This is definite bull. Of course 6ave is closed now. I sent them an email saying if I will be charged $20 a month, then to cancel my order. They better honor it or I'm making a complaint to the bbb on them and Tivo and also contacting my cc company about disputing the charge and will try to refuse delivery on the package through UPS.

Man...that makes me mad. What shady business practices on the both of them.


----------



## tcfcameron

NullQwerty said:


> I ordered mine on the 13th also. This is definite bull. Of course 6ave is closed now. I sent them an email saying if I will be charged $20 a month, then to cancel my order. They better honor it or I'm making a complaint to the bbb on them and Tivo and also contacting my cc company about disputing the charge and will try to refuse delivery on the package through UPS.
> 
> Man...that makes me mad. What shady business practices on the both of them.


I am so right there with you on everything.

Except, there is potential for it to blow-back on us, leaving us stuck paying shipping both ways, and other potential penalties.


----------



## wjdennen

NullQwerty said:


> I ordered mine on the 13th also. This is definite bull. Of course 6ave is closed now. I sent them an email saying if I will be charged $20 a month, then to cancel my order. They better honor it or I'm making a complaint to the bbb on them and Tivo and also contacting my cc company about disputing the charge and will try to refuse delivery on the package through UPS.
> 
> Man...that makes me mad. What shady business practices on the both of them.


The new policy says if you bought before 11/14, you pay the lower price.

I asked 6ave if this is the case, and they confirmed it is.


----------



## davezatz

tcfcameron said:


> TiVo has also removed the "Change TiVo TSN" option from their website.
> 
> You now have to call-in to get that done. I'm going to assume that they have imposed restrictions, and you will have to get approval (beyond simply asking them to do it).


Considering I'm grandfathered with the $6.95 plan, the only way to migrate MSD from the S3 to a new Premiere was online I'm thinking. Between that, 6ave's return shipping policy (you pay), and the fact I already have a "backup" TiVo HD in the closet I went ahead and canceled my order from the 13th. Ah well, that's $95.04 saved for some other gadget.


----------



## tcfcameron

wjdennen said:


> The new policy says if you bought before 11/14, you pay the lower price.
> 
> I asked 6ave if this is the case, and they confirmed it is.


Did you even read the policy, carefully, all the way through? That is NOT what is says. If it was, there wouldn't be three threads discussing the matter.

Why would you ask 6thAve? They have absolutely zero (0) ability to dictate what TiVo does or promise/guarantee anything about your service plan.

They may be a TiVo Authorized Reseller, but the questions posed about TiVo's contracts/policies need to go through TiVo directly, and as high up the chain-of-command as possible.

Even TiVo gives out wrong information, quite frequently, especially so if dispensed by a low-level CSR, and/or is fairly new.

It's even not unheard of for TiVo to make promises, and then fail to deliver.


----------



## wjdennen

tcfcameron said:


> Did you even read the policy, carefully, all the way through? That is NOT what is says. If it was, there wouldn't be three threads discussing the matter.
> 
> Why would you ask 6thAve? They have absolutely zero (0) ability to dictate what TiVo does or promise/guarantee anything about your service plan.


Please tell me what I got wrong. Policy states:

2.1 For TiVo Premiere boxes purchased on or after November 14, 2010:

(new policy)

2.2 For all other TiVo boxes activated on or after November 14, 2010, you may subscribe to the TiVo Service on a monthly basis for $12.95 a month with a one (1) year commitment (renews monthly after 1 year), you may purchase an annual plan for one (1) year of TiVo Service for an upfront fee of $129, or you may purchase a Product Lifetime Subscription (defined below) for a onetime fee of $399.


----------



## digammatoo

You know what I find funny. Everyone is complaining about the up in price yet nobody has stopped to think that maybe TiVo didn't really have a choice in the matter. The contract with TMS may have renewed and Tribune may have said pay this price or go somewhere else. I don't really have a huge problem with it since I was paying 28 bucks a month for my 10 hour DVR from CableOne.


----------



## tcfcameron

wjdennen said:


> Please tell me what I got wrong. Policy states:
> 
> 2.1 For TiVo Premiere boxes purchased on or after November 14, 2010:
> 
> (new policy)
> 
> 2.2 For all other TiVo boxes activated on or after November 14, 2010, you may subscribe to the TiVo Service on a monthly basis for $12.95 a month with a one (1) year commitment (renews monthly after 1 year), you may purchase an annual plan for one (1) year of TiVo Service for an upfront fee of $129, or you may purchase a Product Lifetime Subscription (defined below) for a onetime fee of $399.


If you read it all carefully, the above highlighted words say it all. 2.2 is talking about TiVos other than Premieres (yes, you can still buy them new, used, and refurbished).

Then there's this: "For service plans activated between March 2, 2010 and November 13, 2010, see these prior terms & conditions." It leads one to believe that they go by activation date, not purchase date, to determine what policy revision you will be bound by.


----------



## trip1eX

digammatoo said:


> You know what I find funny. Everyone is complaining about the up in price yet nobody has stopped to think that maybe TiVo didn't really have a choice in the matter. The contract with TMS may have renewed and Tribune may have said pay this price or go somewhere else. I don't really have a huge problem with it since I was paying 28 bucks a month for my 10 hour DVR from CableOne.


Folks are up in arms only because 6th AVenue sold them a day early at the $99 pricepoint with no mention of the $20/month 1 yr contract required.

And afaik their new rate isn't $20/month. IT's just part of this promotion. AFter that the same 'ole rates apply afaik.


----------



## tcfcameron

trip1eX said:


> The pricing hasn't changed from what I read. This is only a happy middle ground promotion between buying one for $300 up front and signing up for 2 years & $20/month with $0 down.


http://www.tivo.com/abouttivo/policies/index.html

You really should fully & carefully read the whole updated policies (Updated 10/14). I can't imagine that you did, and would then post a statement saying that the pricing hasn't changed.


----------



## smbaker

tcfcameron said:


> If you read it all carefully, the above highlighted words say it all. 2.2 is talking about TiVos other than Premieres (yes, you can still buy them new, used, and refurbished).


That may or may not be what they intended, but that's not what it says.

Section 2.1: "For TiVo Premiere boxes purchased on or after November 14, 2010"

Section 2.2: "For all other TiVo boxes activated on or after November 14, 2010"

The "all other Tivo boxes" in 2.2 means Tivos that were not covered by the preceding section (2.1). A Tivo Premiere purchased prior to Nov 14th is not covered by Section 2.1 and therefore is considered part of "all other Tivo boxes".

Does Tivo do customer support via email? I'd really like to get a statement from a Tivo CSR in writing that my box will eligible for lifetime. It'd save having to argue about it over the phone.


----------



## alyssa

Call us Tivo CS & ask them for an email.
Personally I'm ok with the name of the CSRep. & the reference # of the call.


----------



## t1voproof

Electronics Expo still has the old pricing


----------



## wjdennen

smbaker said:


> That may or may not be what they intended, but that's not what it says.
> 
> Section 2.1: "For TiVo Premiere boxes purchased on or after November 14, 2010"
> 
> Section 2.2: "For all other TiVo boxes activated on or after November 14, 2010"
> 
> The "all other Tivo boxes" in 2.2 means Tivos that were not covered by the preceding section (2.1). A Tivo Premiere purchased prior to Nov 14th is not covered by Section 2.1 and therefore is considered part of "all other Tivo boxes".


This is the way I read it too. It's either a Premiere purchased on or after Nov 14, or it's not.


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## Wingershute

At the last minute, I decided not to purchase from 6 Ave mainly due to being kinda broke nowadays. This was before anyone pointed out the 2.1, 2.2 rule. I'm glad now since it appears Tivo may not honor lifetime. If they don't then everyone can either return the boxes or start up some of lawsuit/complaint against them and/or 6 Ave for not advertising the $20/month change. This may prove to haunt Tivo since everyone is clearly ticked off and feels "had". Just my 2 cents.


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## NullQwerty

It's really just missing a 2.3:
2.3 For Tivo Premier Boxes Purchased on or before November 13, but activated on or after November 14.

I think those of us that bought it for $99 on 11/13 aren't being addressed in those terms and conditions. Probably because they weren't supposed to go on sale until the 14th.


----------



## ebf

NullQwerty said:


> It's really just missing a 2.3:
> 2.3 For Tivo Premier Boxes Purchased on or before November 13, but activated on or after November 14.
> 
> I think those of us that bought it for $99 on 11/13 aren't being addressed in those terms and conditions. Probably because they weren't supposed to go on sale until the 14th.


You're right, but I think the legalese means if it's a Premier purchased 11/14+, see section 2.1, anything else, see 2.2.


----------



## Wingershute

What are the expected ship dates for those of you that ordered a Tivo on 11/13/10 from 6 Ave? It's going to be interesting to hear as everyone chimes in on whether Tivo honored a Lifetime commitment instead of the new in effect plan. This thread will go absolutely bonkers if everyone is denied. To be continued for sure!


----------



## TaurusKev

For that price I am tempted, but I still want Tru2way...


----------



## ebf

Wingershute said:


> What are the expected ship dates for those of you that ordered a Tivo on 11/13/10 from 6 Ave?...


I got my order confirmation email for my order on the 12th, but the website status is still blank. I used PayPal, so maybe my status won't update until they accept the payment on Monday. Fingers crossed.


----------



## Wingershute

ebf said:


> I got my order confirmation email for my order on the 12th, but the website status is still blank. I used PayPal, so maybe my status won't update until they accept the payment on Monday. Fingers crossed.


Please keep all of us posted. We are all following this very closely.

I just thought about something. If I remember correctly, isn't the TSN number displayed on the Tivo box itself? For those of you worried about about receiving Lifetime, why don't you just call Tivo and confirm it's status without opening the box. If Tivo denies you then atleast you still have A BNIB Premiere and can sell it to some dope on EBAY for $150 and still make a profit.  My recommendation for anyone that receives their Tivo is to NOT open the box without confirming first.


----------



## lessd

IMHO TiVo will honer the MSD on Lifetime for the 11/13 sales of any TiVos, I don't think any co. can change things without notice as TiVo is a two part sale (unless purchased from TiVo itself) the user does the purchase than activates the TiVo, there is no requirement that this person read TiVo T&C just before they make a purchase. On the 13th you could get MSD Lifetime Service, if the $99 TiVos have new service restrictions that must be posted with the vendor so one would know before purchase. For $99 one could set up a nice parts dept for later use and sell off the hard drive and the remote.


----------



## smbaker

NullQwerty said:


> It's really just missing a 2.3:
> 2.3 For Tivo Premier Boxes Purchased on or before November 13, but activated on or after November 14.


Technically I think that would have to be a 2.1.5, so that the "all other tivos" clause in 2.2 would apply correctly, or section 2.2 would have to be reworded.



NullQwerty said:


> I think those of us that bought it for $99 on 11/13 aren't being addressed in those terms and conditions. Probably because they weren't supposed to go on sale until the 14th.


I agree, they didn't anticipate this situation happening.

Hopefully the end result will be to our advantage. In the worst case we either wait it out until the service plan becomes sane again, make enough noise to get our way, or we end up with a $95 box full of spare parts. $95 is really a pretty good deal for a hard drive with Tivo image, spare power supply, remote, case, etc. I'm reasonably confident from what people have reported from talking to CSRs that we'll be fine. This would become a very anti-Tivo forum otherwise and a PR nightmare for Tivo.


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## slowbiscuit

TaurusKev said:


> For that price I am tempted, but I still want Tru2way...


LOL, it's dead Jim. That's why the FCC is pitching the new AllVid gateway.

tcfcameron is apparently the only one on this board reading the new policy in a way that he'll get screwed on purchases prior to 11/14 - I am not worried at all, it's very clear to me that we'll get the old service terms. Not to mention that we didn't buy it at $99.99 per the new terms, we got it for $99.00 (minus coupon).


----------



## noeltykay

I ordered my Premiere from 6Ave on the 13th...called up yesterday and when I gave the order number to the 6Ave rep, before I can even tell her why I was calling, she stated, "You will qualify for Lifetime since you ordered prior to the 14th, call Tivo to confirm. If I am wrong call back and cancel your order."

I called up Tivo and spoke with a CSR who confirmed that I do qualify for a Lifetime and I get a multi service discount ($299).


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## slowbiscuit

Not surprised to hear this at all, folks on slickdeals have reported the same. Tivo will honor the old terms for any unit purchased prior to 11/14, as they should - otherwise it's a clear bait and switch.

6ave screwed up, pure and simple, but both parties will make it right. Tivo will probably have to eat the subsidy on these units unless they can get 6ave to make good on them.


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## ht2

I am new user and ordered two from 6Ave.
Can I qualify for two $299 lifetime? (1st one with PLSR code and 2nd one with MSD)


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## NullQwerty

I emailed 6ave after they closed and said if I have to pay 19.99 a month then to please cancel my order. This morning they replied back saying the order was cancelled. 

I then called them this morning to find out the real story. They said that it was all a big screwup but that Tivo will honor the price of $13 a month if you purchased it on the 13th. They said that they will include a special letter to give to Tivo saying I should get it for $13 as proof. I said then can you uncancel my order because my email said to only cancel if I would be charged $20 a month. They said once it's cancelled it can't be uncancelled.


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## ajbeaman

This the response I received from 6th Ave after I cancelled my order based on Tivo's new billing schedule.

Dear

Here's an important message about your TiVo Premier DVR purchase.

As of Sunday, November 14, TiVo has unexpectedly changed their service plan terms and conditions. TiVo's new plan for people who purchase it on or after 11-14-2010 is for $19.99/mo (compared to $12.99/mo before) and the Lifetime Plan is no longer available.
For those who purchased their TiVo before Nov 14, it looks like you may still eligible for the cheaper monthly plan and/or the lifetime plan. If you speak with a TiVo Customer Support team rep via chat or phone at 877-367-8486, and explain the situation, they should honor the pervious subscription rate. Please make sure to mention you purchased the item before Nov 14th and you activate over the phone. Activating online may just give you the new prices.

Now should TIVO for some reason not honor that subscription rate, we will take the item back from you, for full refund and shipping at out our cost.

NOTE: Please DO NOT open the box. You do not need to open the box to set up the subscription with TIVO. All the info needed is on an outer label on the TiVo box itself.

If you still wish to cancel your order, simply let us know and we will.

TIVO NEW TERMS & CONDITIONS
http://www.tivo.com/abouttivo/policies/tivoservicepaymentplanstermsandconditions.html

Thank you for your purchase.
Sincerely,
Veronica Bravo
[email protected]
877-684-2831


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## ebf

ebf said:


> I got my order confirmation email for my order on the 12th, but the website status is still blank. I used PayPal, so maybe my status won't update until they accept the payment on Monday. Fingers crossed.





Wingershute said:


> Please keep all of us posted. We are all following this very closely...


Got my shipping confirmation at 10:30 today. I am hoping to activate it with MSD Lifetime now, even though I have not need for the box ATM, to get in with all the other folks before TiVo "forgets" about the 6ave debacale!


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## NullQwerty

AJBeaman, did they let you uncancel it?


----------



## ajbeaman

NullQwerty said:


> AJBeaman, did they let you uncancel it?


Based on their wording they never cancelled it. I guess they presumed I would keep it based on their "money back Guarantee". 
I did cancel though, since I could no longer slide it in on MSD $6.95 online.


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## smbaker

FYI, emailed 6ave and asked for a confirmation that my order is eligible for the old pricing structure and got back the same form letter as ajbeaman. It bugs me a little that it has words like "may" and "should" in it, but having at least something in writing is good.


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## iwbyte

I spoke with Tivo and they said 'no dice' on using the old terms. I then spoke with 6ave and they said that tivo 'should' honor the old terms, and you may have to speak to a manager/different rep. If Tivo doesn't don't honor the old terms, 6ave.com 'will' provide a full refund and shipping back if we don't open the box.

I would love it if I could upgrade my current Lifetime box to lifetime on the premiere for $199 but I don't think that will happen. I'm debating if I want to do it for $299.. I bought two boxes since it seemed like such a good deal but now i may be stuck with an extra one - i don't think they'll let me return just one at full refund if tivo DOES honor the old terms.


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## ebf

iwbyte said:


> I spoke with Tivo and they said 'no dice' on using the old terms...


Do you have the box yet? It feels like folks calling with hypothetical questions cannot rely, either way, on the answer a CSR gives. Did you mention that section 2.2 of the new plan rules is what would apply to your case?


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## iwbyte

@ebf - Agreed - I figured it wouldn't make sense calling back until I have the box and are ready to jump on whatever they offer me if I want it.

Now i'm just deciding if I want to activate BOTH or just one unit.

We have a Series 2 with lifetime that we'll be replacing in the bedroom (not HD TV, but maybe for Chanukah?  ), and a Humax DVD w/6.95 MSD that we'll be KEEPING downstairs since we like off-loading kids shows to DVD - we'll keep that unit for kids.

THen the question is - get an 'additional' unit for downstairs and do we pay lifetime on that one too?


----------



## tcfcameron

slowbiscuit said:


> tcfcameron is apparently the only one on this board reading the new policy in a way that he'll get screwed on purchases prior to 11/14


I'm not the only one. There are four threads now, all discussing the matter.

One thing I'm not understanding at all (and it concerns me greatly), is why so many people are posting that they contacted either 6thAve or EE, and were promised that the old policies would apply. Resellers/Retailers can not make any such promise or guarantee. It's up to TiVo. Even TiVo hasn't been consistent in what they are telling people (who have reported back here). Some are being told "NO", period, and are being advised to return the TiVo if they don't want the new terms.

For those who haven't read the updated TiVo Policies:

http://www.tivo.com/abouttivo/policies/tivoservicepaymentplanstermsandconditions.html

http://www.tivo.com/abouttivo/policies/tivomultiservicediscountagreement.html

http://www.tivo.com/abouttivo/policies/index.html


----------



## smbaker

tcfcameron said:


> One thing I'm not understanding at all (and it concerns me greatly), is why so many people are posting that they contacted either 6thAve or EE, and were promised that the old policies would apply. Resellers/Retailers can not make any such promise or guarantee.


That's not what they guaranteed me -- the guarantee that I got was that they'd take the box back for full refund and eat the shipping if Tivo refused to honor the old service price. That's really all a retailer can do.

Regardless of what guarantees the retailer makes, the units in question were purchased on Nov 13th and the new policy made effective Nov 14th. I don't know what legal standing we have on this, our only recourse is probably to return the boxes if Tivo refuses to grant the old pricing. I think Tivo will do the right thing due to the PR mess that would occur if they do not. It's only 1 day worth of sales from 1 reseller.


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## slowbiscuit

Well a day and a half actually, 6ave jumped the gun on the 12th.


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## speed_phreak

The way I see it, by purchasing the Tivo from 6th ave, I am looking to become a TiVo customer (not really a 6th ave customer). I see 6th ave as a cell phone reseller, my ongoing relationship is really with the service provider, TiVo. I had a DirecTiVo and would very much like to get back into the TiVo game.

I called TiVo's customer service today and was told they would not honor the pre 11/14 pricing. I will call again to activate when I receive the box, if they refuse again, the box goes back.... If that happens, then I as a consumer will decide to be a TiVo lifetime *non-customer*. Period.

Its not like this wasn't the first sub $100 price for the Premiere...

MythTV, Windows Media Center, Boxee, I'll be evaluating you all soon...


----------



## jpisano

Hi guys,
Long time reader, first time poster. I took a ride out to 6th Ave. in Livingston, NJ on Saturday evening when I got the e-mail advertising the $99 Tivo Premiere and purchased one. I called today to activate it and after explaining the situation with regards to 6th Ave and the fact that I bought the unit a day prior to the service change, the guy on the activation line had to transfer me to someone in customer service. I expained the situation to him, and he put me on hold for a few minutes to see if he could get me the $199 Lifetime multi-service discount (I have a Series 2 and Series 3 box, one with Lifetime). He came back and told me that since I got the Premiere for $99 and bought it on 11/13, I would only be eligible to activate Lifetime service at $299, which I agreed to. I told him I had the receipt in hand and could fax a copy, but he said it wasn't necessary. The whole thing went pretty smoothly and they were pretty cool about it. Remember to explain the situation to the person you initially speak to in Activations, and they will transfer you to someone who can approve Lifetime. Hope this helps.


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## tcfcameron

THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT MSG, THAT I WAS PERSONALLY ASKED BY HIGH MANAGEMENT OF 6TH AVE TO DELIVER HERE, AND IT IS TIME SENSITIVE:

(This information is ONLY applicable to purchases from 6th Ave):

1. The price paid has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not you will be eligible for TiVo Service under old or new policy.

2. The TiVo TSN of your unit has no factor in the same (they are not recording them, or making any list of them).

3. The date of purchase is the only factor, 11/14 being the cut-off date.

4. Orders that have been canceled, are being kept in a special holding queue, to give you the opportunity to un-cancel your order.

5. Some early cancellations were not placed in the above mentioned queue, and will be handled on an individual basis.

6. Today (11/15) is the last day that action can be taken to insure you are eligible for the old TiVo policies. If you do not un-cancel your order today, you will miss the last opportunity to get the old TiVo service terms.

7. 6th Ave has been fighting for us, for 72 hours, trying to insure that TiVo does not deny old service policy to eligible purchasers.

8. 6th Ave has pledged to fight for us, and will fight fiercely with TiVo, should they try to renege in any way.

9. TiVo's call center is supposed to be fully aware of the agreement that exists between TiVo and 6th Ave. If they try to tell you otherwise, try another rep, or contact 6th Ave, and they will fight for you.

10. I have been asked by 6th Ave, to provide links to the forum threads that are regarding this matter. (which I will do shortly).

11. I have been asked by 6th Ave, to report to them any new issues arising from this deal. (and I will).

12. All customers with an existing order, as well as those who canceled (and made the special holding queue), will receive an email from 6th Ave shortly.

-EDIT: It is requested, by 6thAve, that upon receiving your Premiere, that you DON'T OPEN THE FACTORY BOX, until you have called in the TSN (located on the outside of factory box) to TiVo, and verified that TiVo will allow you to activate under the previous TiVo service agreement policies.

6thAve is offering a full refund, including shipping (via pre-paid label), if you are denied activation under the previous TiVo service agreement policies, provided that you have contacted 6thAve to report the denial, and are still unable to resolve the matter.

I can't recall if not opening the factory box is a request, or a condition, regarding the full refund.

You can email [email protected] regarding any issues.

Now, a personal msg from me: I'm sorry if I was the reason for anybody that canceled their order. However, if it had not been for 6th Ave's fight that they took to TiVo, my initial concerns about being stuck with the new policy, would have been true.


----------



## smbaker

tcfcameron said:


> THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT MSG, THAT I WAS PERSONALLY ASKED BY HIGH MANAGEMENT OF 6TH AVE TO DELIVER HERE, AND IT IS TIME SENSITIVE:


Tell them to log into the forum and post this themselves if it is true. There's no reason a reputable company should ask you to post this rather than them doing it themselves. It's as simple as logging in and creating a thread.


----------



## tcfcameron

smbaker said:


> Tell them to log into the forum and post this themselves if it is true. There's no reason a reputable company should ask you to post this rather than them doing it themselves. It's as simple as logging in and creating a thread.


Well, it's too late now, isn't it?


----------



## ht2

Yes good news.
I called Tivo and CSR told me I am qualify for pre 11/14 price and gave me reference number.
Thanks to Tivo and 6Ave for trying to do it right.

Only problem for me is PLSR code is not for new customer so first one is $399 and second one is $299. Ouch!


----------



## slowbiscuit

smbaker said:


> Tell them to log into the forum and post this themselves if it is true. There's no reason a reputable company should ask you to post this rather than them doing it themselves. It's as simple as logging in and creating a thread.


So what was the all-important sh*t-hot message? Looks like tcfcameron deleted it.


----------



## smbaker

slowbiscuit said:


> So what was the all-important sh*t-hot message? Looks like tcfcameron deleted it.


It had a bunch of interesting-looking stuff in it, about 6ave working with Tivo to ensure the old rates were honored, about there being an un-cancel queue, etc.

I'm not sure why he deleted it. I didn't mean to imply the information wasn't useful, but rather that if 6ave wants the information published they ought to do so themselves. It's all too easy for information to get distorted even when everyone has the best of intentions. Hearsay just isn't something we can rely on, nor can I imagine 6ave wants to be bound by statements someone else makes on their behalf.


----------



## ebf

My box is on the way, scheduled for Thursday delivery. Let the CRS fun begin...


----------



## trip1eX

Well my 6th ave Tivo arrived today and Tivo will not let me put lifetime on it. 

My advice is to lie your ass off when you call. Tell them you received it 2 weeks ago as a gift from your father. Tell them you paid regular price.

Guy says no one is receiving lifetime on $99 Tivos. Yeah right. Obviously some are receiving it. 

I bought Nov 12th too. I told him I would fax him my receipt. Doesn't matter. This CSR blamed every retailer for not advertising the 1-yr contract. 

The fun will continue when I call them again after I calm down and see if I can get lifetime on the Premiere I bought 2 months ago and never activated.


----------



## smbaker

trip1eX said:


> Well my 6th ave Tivo arrived today and Tivo will not let me put lifetime on it.


Have you written 6ave about it yet? I'd be interested to hear what they have to say about it, especially after they sent out the emails that tivo "may" and "should" honor the old price. Over at SD, someone quoted another 6ave email that said this:



SD forum said:


> We are writing because you recently purchased a TiVo Premier DVR from us. You requested your order be canceled, likely after hearing that TiVo unexpectedly changed its service plan terms and pricing. We were also unaware that this change would be taking place, but have worked with TiVo to secure the old rate of $12.99 per month for our customers whp purchased the TiVo Premier DVR before November 14th.


It may be a matter of repeated calls to find a CSR who knows what he's talking about (of which the number of CSRs may increase as these 6ave Tivos reach their destinations this week). When my Tivo gets here, I'd much prefer to be honest rather than having to lie to the CSR about it. Mine hasn't even shipped yet, and I'm clear across the country, so it may be next week before I see it.

I wonder if this denial by Tivo has anything to do with the tcfcameron deleting his post of 6ave information? His post is still quoted over at SD (post #816 in the Tivo thread over there). It also asserts that 6ave has worked out a deal for pre-Nov14 units. I'm still surprised that someone from 6ave hasn't posted and clarified the situation. Either they've worked out a deal with Tivo or they haven't -- a simple one sentence official response would eliminate the ambiguity.


----------



## ebf

trip1eX said:


> Well my 6th ave Tivo arrived today and Tivo will not let me put lifetime on it.


Are you a current TiVo customer? I am wondering if they are treating new and old customers differently.


----------



## slowbiscuit

I think it's obvious by now that Tivo has no way of knowing what price you paid or any way to track these by TSN, so if you just lie when you call Tivo for lifetime it's probably the easy way out, at least for the next couple of weeks.

Having said that, they don't have a leg to stand on for pre-11/14 purchases, and could very well get sued for bait-and-switch if they try to take a hard line on this. It's probably just a matter of escalating to a supervisor or getting a different rep.


----------



## ebf

slowbiscuit said:


> I think it's obvious by now that Tivo has no way of knowing what price you paid or any way to track these by TSN, so if you just lie when you call Tivo for lifetime it's probably the easy way out, at least for the next couple of weeks...


Someone, either here or over at SD, was (supposedly) asked to fax in the dated proof for purchase receipt from 6th Ave. So, lying could get sticky.


----------



## tcfcameron

trip1eX said:


> Well my 6th ave Tivo arrived today and Tivo will not let me put lifetime on it.
> 
> My advice is to lie your ass off when you call. Tell them you received it 2 weeks ago as a gift from your father. Tell them you paid regular price.
> 
> Guy says no one is receiving lifetime on $99 Tivos. Yeah right. Obviously some are receiving it.
> 
> I bought Nov 12th too. I told him I would fax him my receipt. Doesn't matter. This CSR blamed every retailer for not advertising the 1-yr contract.
> 
> The fun will continue when I call them again after I calm down and see if I can get lifetime on the Premiere I bought 2 months ago and never activated.


Now does anybody believe me?

Anybody else want to say that I'm the only one that thinks the above can, and will, happen?


----------



## smbaker

slowbiscuit said:


> I think it's obvious by now that Tivo has no way of knowing what price you paid


They do, it's called "Please fax/mail/email me your receipt" at which point I guess we respond "ummm.... sorry my dog ate it". It's one reason why it's good to not lie, even if you are technically on the right side of the issue.

At some point, word is going to get out that customers can simply lie to get lifetime service, and Tivo will have to take the hard line and demand proof of purchase.



tcfcameron said:


> Now does anybody believe me?


It's not a matter of believing or not believing you, it's a matter of what the service plan terms said. The language was clear enough that Premieres purchased prior to Nov 14th are not subject to the new pricing. Tivo has since edited that document, but absent a functional time machine cannot go back in time and undo what was written.


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## Am_I_Evil

smbaker said:


> They do, it's called "Please fax/mail/email me your receipt" at which point I guess we respond "uhhhh...sure..." and head to photoshop...i highly doubt they'll actually follow up with the retailer


fixed


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## smbaker

Am_I_Evil said:


> fixed


The deeper you dig yourself into a lie that harder it is to get back out. Now you've committed fraud by tampering with the receipt and you documented your commission of the fraud by faxing the tampered document to Tivo.

I'm just sayin' .... not the best solution to the problem.


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## ebf

smbaker said:


> ...The language was clear enough that Premieres purchased prior to Nov 14th are not subject to the new pricing. Tivo has since edited that document, but absent a functional time machine cannot go back in time and undo what was written.


 Where is the new document? I am still seeing:


> 2.1 For TiVo Premiere boxes *purchased *on or after November 14, 2010...


and 


> 2.2 For all other TiVo boxes activated on or after November 14, 2010, you may subscribe to the TiVo Service on a monthly basis for $12.95 a month with a one (1) year commitment (renews monthly after 1 year), you may purchase an annual plan for one (1) year of TiVo Service for an upfront fee of $129, or you may purchase a Product Lifetime Subscription (defined below) for a onetime fee of $399.


on this page.


----------



## trip1eX

Well I called twice in the last hour or so.

Denied both times. 

I've been a Tivo customer for 6 years. I have 1 premiere. I just canceled a Series 2 Tivo $6.95/month rate on November 13th. And I have a lifetime SEries 2 tivo.


First time I was denied outright. I argued. Said I would fax my receipt. I said I purchased 2 days before your promotion was announced. I said I bought a Premiere for $150 2 months ago and had no problem getting lifetime on it. Why does $50 make or break getting lifetime on this Tivo? None of that mattered. Guy wouldn't budge. I finally said I know it is not your fault and I don't want to yell at you any more, good-bye. 

Second time the girl put me on hold alot and finally came back and rejected me. She was nice and for a minute seemed like I might get somewhere, but nowhere. It seems they might be keeping track of the TSN because....


.....after I got rejected a 2nd time I put lifetime on my 2nd $150 Premiere which I had laying around unactivated. Figure its value just went up as it seems like it will be difficult for most to buy a Premiere this xmas and get lifetime. All the Premieres are $99. 

I could try again, but from what I read Tivo has modified their policy a 2nd time. The NOv. 14th cutoff date is gone. Now it is just November which conveniently excludes all 6th avenue $99 dvrs.


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## smbaker

ebf said:


> Where is the new document?


I've read in multiple threads that the document was modified, but I confess I haven't actually seen it... You're right, the official page seems to be the same.


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## innocentfreak

I am still seeing the old page also. I would call them and read it right from their web site if they give you problems.


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## MikeAndrews

trip1eX said:


> ...
> I could try again, but from what I read Tivo has modified their policy a 2nd time. The NOv. 14th cutoff date is gone. Now it is just November which conveniently excludes all 6th avenue $99 dvrs.


Maybe we'll have to hurry to send the Premiere back to 6ave before Tivo modifies the policy again to say that we owe them $400 for looking at the outer box.

That's an exaggeration, but it is the issue. We bought the Premiere based on its value when we placed the order. Whether it was 6ave's fault or Tivo's, the value of the offrer was reduced _after_ we ordered it and that is a dirty trick bordering on fraud. 6ave is right to offer to pay for return shipping.


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## SmittyJ

I registered just to chime in. I, too, am a current subscriber who purchased a unit from 6ave on 11/13/10 and was denied by Tivo via e-mail. They stated that all units purchased from 6ave.com only qualify for $20/mo (I had asked about lifetime). I hoped to have better luck over the phone after my unit arrived, but I see that isn't likely now.

I'm a constant critic of frivolous litigation, but in this case a class action might be justified. Tivo's own pricing policy still states that ALL units purchased prior to 11/14 qualify for the old price structure. Others have said this was updated, but I don't see it. I've forwarded this info to legal counsel to see what they think. If we have a case, then perhaps making Tivo aware of that fact will get them to honor their own policy as stated on their web site. If not.....


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## smbaker

SmittyJ said:


> I hoped to have better luck over the phone after my unit arrived, but I see that isn't likely now.


There's several people on the SD forum that are reporting success, a couple seem to have had no issue at all.

Consistency is the problem here, either the units are eligible or they aren't -- different people shouldn't be getting different results. It's a very simple binary proposition.


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## DaveMN

Here's a transcript of my chat with a CSR just now:

Me: As long as I purchased my new Premiere before 11/14, I should be able to still get lifetime service, correct?
Tamina: I can definitely help you with that. Where did you purchase the Premiere from? 
Me: Does that matter?
Tamina: Yes it does. 
Me: Who would I have to purchase it from to NOT be eligible?
Tamina: To know what service plans you qualify for I need to know where you purchased the Premiere and if you received any discount on the box.
Me: Your new terms of service explicitly state that any unit purchased prior to 11/14 is eligible for lifetime service. Are you saying there are additional restrictions not listed in the official terms of service?
Tamina: We are running a holiday promotion but some retailers offered the promotion early and therefore we need to ask these questions. 
Me: Are you denying lifetime service on those units purchased prior to 11/14 if it was purchased from one of those retailers?
Tamina: We are not denying Product Lifetime Service to anyone as long as they did not purchase the Premiere for $99 as part of our holiday pricing promotion. 
Me: Well, yes I did buy it for $99 prior to 11/14. At the time of the purchase, I had no idea TiVo was going to change the terms of service, and the retailer's issue should not be my issue. Are you saying then that I'm not eligible for lifetime service, even though I have 2 TiVos and have been a customer for over ten years?
Tamina: Since you purchased your box prior to 11/14 but for the $99 promotion you will need to call our Customer Support team to activate your service and discuss payment plans. Please explain the situation to them and they will take care of you. 

Me: By "take care of", you mean I will be allowed to buy lifetime?
Tamina: You will have to ask a Customer Service agent when you call in. I do not know if they will be able to offer you the Product Lifetime Service since you did purchase the Premiere at the promotional pricing. 
Me: Thank you- this is a good way to pass the buck.

EDIT: Just called on the phone. First level guy denied me. Went to his "supervisor" and was denied again. I reiterated they were going to lose a 10 year customer over this, and they didn't budge. Cancelling the order.

EDIT II: Called 6ave to cancel. The rep told me that their management had worked with TiVo to ensure that anybody who purchased prior to 11/14 would get the original terms of service. I explained that I'd just been shot down twice by TiVo, and all she could say is to try again after I got the box, and everything would be fine. I pointed out how ridiculous that sounded, and permanently cancelled the order. That's two more businesses that will never see another dime from me.


----------



## mrsean

If anyone is interested, here is the link to file a complaint with the California Attorney General's office.

I may be file one myself shortly.

http://ag.ca.gov/contact/complaint_form.php?cmplt=CL


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## jlb

You know all this price plan crap makes me happy I never left my retentioned rate of $6.95/mo for my TiVoHD. Long paid for, but I'll take the $6.95 in perpetuity anyday now....


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## johnner1999

Hey if any one wants I'll sell one of my 2 Premiers for $100 each ;-) they even have a factory extended warranty via TiVo -- PM me


----------



## smbaker

mrsean said:


> If anyone is interested, here is the link to file a complaint with the California Attorney General's office.


Problem is your complaint may be against 6ave, not against Tivo since 6ave is the one that sold the product. If so, then there's not much to complain about because 6ave has offered to take the units back, shipping included.

Granted, I think this is a very raw deal, and Tivo should simply honor the policy they've placed online. Refusing to budge is making Tivo look quite petty for a situation where the *customer is clearly not the one at fault*. We bought the items based on the full availability on information at the time. I can't think of a recent situation where a company has treated customers this poorly. Nevertheless, I'm reserving my actions until I receive my order and try to activate it myself.


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## alyssa

The wacky thing is, numerous people spoke with tivo on the 14th and were reasured we would be getting the old pricing. I've even got a name & reference #. The CSR even refered to an internal email regarding the policy.
Either the CSR's working today don't know about the policy *or* the policy regarding 'bought on the 13th' changed between the 14th & today.


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## DaveMN

alyssa said:


> Either the CSR's working today don't know about the policy *or* the policy changed between the 14th & today.


After just talking to them both online and on the phone, I get the distinct impression it is the latter.


----------



## innocentfreak

smbaker said:


> Problem is your complaint may be against 6ave, not against Tivo since 6ave is the one that sold the product. If so, then there's not much to complain about because 6ave has offered to take the units back, shipping included.


Actually it would be with TiVo. Their terms clearly state any TiVo purchased on or after 11/14/10. Most of these people bought them on 11/12 and 11/13 which would be prior to their terms. It is TiVo who is not honoring their posted policy.


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## johnner1999

so where is the rats deserting the sinking ship posts? personally I think TiVo has 9 lives and hasn't spent more than 5 at the most ;-)


----------



## smbaker

DaveMN said:


> After just talking to them both online and on the phone, I get the distinct impression it is the latter.


I wonder if it had something to do with the quantity of Tivos sold on 11/12 - 11/13 perhaps being greater than Tivo first anticipated. It's clear that 6ave is still working on shipping Tivos from the 13th. Regardless, you can't just make up the rules as you go telling some people it's covered and others that it's not. It's going to lead to a lot of very angry (and very vocal) customers.



innocentfreak said:


> Actually it would be with TiVo. Their terms clearly state any TiVo purchased on or after 11/14/10. Most of these people bought them on 11/12 and 11/13 which would be prior to their terms. It is TiVo who is not honoring their posted policy.


I'm not so sure... We've entered no contractual agreement with Tivo. Tivo is certainly guilty of false advertising, but we purchased the box from 6ave. 6ave has agreed to take the boxes back, so a remedy is available. Exactly what damages can we claim we've suffered then? Mental anguish and depression at the failure to get the Tivo we desired?


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## johnner1999

smbaker said:


> I wonder if it had something to do with the quantity of Tivos sold on 11/12 - 11/13 perhaps being greater than Tivo first anticipated. It's clear that 6ave is still working on shipping Tivos from the 13th. Regardless, you can't just make up the rules as you go telling some people it's covered and others that it's not. It's going to lead to a lot of very angry (and very vocal) customers.


I agree BUT the retailer sold the product at the subsidized price early. They are the ones at "fault" as others have pointed out. I think the whole $100 price is 'stupid' but hey to each their own right.


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## innocentfreak

johnner1999 said:


> I agree BUT the retailer sold the product at the subsidized price early. They are the ones at "fault" as others have pointed out. I think the whole $100 price is 'stupid' but hey to each their own right.


6th Ave is only at fault for the price they sold it at. TiVo is at fault for not honoring their own policies.

They are punishing the customers/potential customers for a store mistake when they should in fact be taking it up with the store. The problem is without knowing the purchase arrangement between TiVo and 6th Ave it is impossible to know how it should be fixed other than that is between TiVo and 6th Ave and not TiVo and the customer.


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## alyssa

I ordered from 6th ave at 9am on the 13th and it hasn't shipped.


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## smbaker

johnner1999 said:


> I think the whole $100 price is 'stupid' but hey to each their own right.


Agree 100%. I don't know about other consumers, but I am getting extremely conscious of recurring fees. I (and others like me) would be more likely to buy into a lifetime promotion than to buy into this $20/month monstrosity. I think Moxi has the winning marketing model here. The only thing I'd change about Moxi's webpage is to increase the font size of "No monthly DVR fees" and put it in bold red underlined type with a drop shadow.

I think Tivo moved 180 degrees in the wrong direction with this promotion.

Tivo reminds me of a fish that jumps out of my Koi pond only to keep flopping in the wrong direction away from the water as it slowly dies. (someone asked for a 'rats deserting the sinking ship' analogy...)


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## johnner1999

smbaker said:


> Agree 100%. I don't know about other consumers, but I am getting extremely conscious of recurring fees. I (and others like me) would be more likely to buy into a lifetime promotion than to buy into this $20/month monstrosity. I think Moxi has the winning marketing model here. The only thing I'd change about Moxi's webpage is to increase the font size of "No monthly DVR fees" and put it in bold red underlined type with a drop shadow.
> 
> I think Tivo moved 180 degrees in the wrong direction with this promotion.
> 
> Tivo reminds me of a fish that jumps out of my Koi pond only to keep flopping in the wrong direction away from the water as it slowly dies. (someone asked for a 'rats deserting the sinking ship' analogy...)


110% correct... I'm buying a 3 tuner moxi and a mate asap.


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## smbaker

johnner1999 said:


> 110% correct... I'm buying a 3 tuner moxi and a mate asap.


Well I don't know that I'd go that far (yet). I think Moxi has the superior marketing model and the superior MRV model (base + mates), but I still like the Tivo interface, HMO/HME, pyTivo, etc. I've said before that I'll never buy another monthly fee Tivo, so if the lifetime deal can't be worked out, then I'll be moved to the competition by the next generation of hardware.


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## MikeAndrews

johnner1999 said:


> so where is the rats deserting the sinking ship posts? personally I think TiVo has 9 lives and hasn't spent more than 5 at the most ;-)


Yo! If I don't get lifetime I'll be shipping mine back and I won't be buying another TiVo, ever. I'll be selling two of the four that I have.

None of that would cost Tivo a penny except the $299 (third $299 this year) they won't get from me.

Hint: The view over my back yard fence. Let me show it to you.


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## GPT999

alyssa said:


> I ordered from 6th ave at 9am on the 13th and it hasn't shipped.


Me too...


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## johnner1999

netringer said:


> Yo! If I don't get lifetime I'll be shipping mine back and I won't be buying another TiVo, ever. I'll be selling two of the four that I have.
> 
> None of that would cost Tivo a penny except the $299 (third $299 this year) they won't get from me.
> 
> Hint: The view over my back yard fence. Let me show it to you.


hmmm sorry me confused by your post?


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## MikeAndrews

johnner1999 said:


> hmmm sorry me confused by your post?





Spoiler



That's the AT&T Uverse VRAD and the "video" cross connect box. It happens that my phone service comes from that box, which is an anomaly. (There's supposed to be another box in between.) The fiber runs just outside my property line.

I'll be _forced_ to have a 100 foot long DSL loop getting like 30mps+ Internet and HDTV with real multi-room DVR.


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## johnner1999

netringer said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Those are AT&T Uverse VRADs. The fiber runs just outside my property line.
> 
> I'll be _forced_ to have a 100 foot long DSL loop getting like 30mps+ Internet and HDTV with real multi-room DVR.


Thats what I thought - just never saw two so close before. Then again no VRADS with-in 30 miles of my address :-(


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## rbendorf

I just canceled my order with 6ave.com. I also sent an email to Tivo stating that I will drop my yearly service on my HD at the end of this billing cycle. 

I refuse to pay $19.99/mo. and will look for an alternate system i.e. the Moxi or similar. I have enjoyed my Tivo's for years, but this is pretty much the end of my relationship with Tivo.

OTOH: If they do decide to modify their pricing plan, I may reconsider.


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## gespears

I ordered my TiVo from 6th ave on the 12th and got the 95 dollar price. But today I received an email from 6th ave saying the order was canceled. I replied and stated that I didn't want to cancel and that I wanted the order reinstated. But after reading the last several threads I might not want the order reinstated


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## mec1991

Well, I guess my order has been canceled even though I *never* contacted 6ave one way or the other. 

When I checked my bank account online this morning, I noticed the $99 payment I made through Amazon Payments had been *reversed* and the money was back in my account.

Can't say I blame them as TiVo has created such a fiasco by refusing to honor their part of the bargain. *Please - no need for TiVo loyalists (of which I used to be) to tell me they're not at fault here.*

I never thought I would say this in a thousand years, but I am done with the company after owning several since my first Sony series 1 back in 2001. They will never get another dime from me.


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## DaveMN

After being continually denied lifetime service on my 6ave 11/12 purchase, I send-off a politely worded email to customer service, basically accusing them of fraud and not honoring their own published terms of service. An hour later I received notice that they would honor the lifetime, along with a reference number to mention when I activate the box. You probably just need to complain loud enough, and it probably doesn't hurt that I've been a multi-unit customer for a long time. In the end, I'm happy they're doing the right thing, even though I'm not happy about the path required to get there.


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## mec1991

But Dave, if I "uncancel" the order - which I never canceled in the first place, it would go through with today's date, not the 13th. Its just not worth the hassel. I'm not a young man like you.


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## slowbiscuit

Wow, just wow. I can't believe Tivo is being so stupid about this - they need to work this out with 6ave, not take it out on the customer. They're going to get sued for this by someone, I would bet, especially since they're violating their own posted policy. It's just ridiculous.

My order from 6ave on the 13th has still not shipped and shows no status. I wonder if they're trying to work a deal with Tivo before they ship some of these that are pending.


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## MikeAndrews

alyssa said:


> I ordered from 6th ave at 9am on the 13th and it hasn't shipped.





ebf said:


> I got my order confirmation email for my order on the 12th, but the website status is still blank. I used PayPal, so maybe my status won't update until they accept the payment on Monday. Fingers crossed.





gespears said:


> I ordered my TiVo from 6th ave on the 12th and got the 95 dollar price. But today I received an email from 6th ave saying the order was canceled. ...


We're you in touch with 6ave at all?

I haven't contacted them and haven't gotten a word from them other acknowledging my order.

I suspect that the reason we haven't gotten ship notices on the $95 purchase is 6ave was waiting to see if TiVo really honored the old deal. 6ave would be better off getting the units on the dock than shipping them out and having to pay for return shipping en masse.

If all of the orders fall out, TiVo will be getting a few hundred Premieres back from 6ave still on the shipping pallets.

Still waiting to see where I'll stand in getting lifetime.


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## GPT999

So after ordering on sat 11/13 and getting my order confirmation from 6Ave, I had not received any other communications from the company. Online tracking of my order # did not have any info. I called 6Ave this am and they said they were "holding" all Tivo orders from pre 11/14 b/c people were having problems and wanted to cancel. They said they were trying to call every person that ordered one on 11/13 to confirm they really wanted the order. I politely said, "Wouldn't it have been easier to send an email to this effect to 5000 people ( their estimate) or at least an email stating what they were doing?" Anyway, now they say my order will go through ( although they have had my money since saturday) . I am keeping the faith and hope things will work out. I asked them (6Ave) if I could return if have problem and they said they would give full refund, I am still trying to get confirmation on the return shipping charges but I guess if you don't open the box you should be able to return it w/o paying; denial of delivery?

Anyway, I have a beef with 6Ave on how they handled this portion of it, nice of them to want to personally talk to everyone but not feasible in a timely manner.


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## DaveMN

mec1991 said:


> I'm not a young man like you.


Thank you for making my day.


----------



## rbendorf

After deciding to cancel me order, and emailing 6ave.com, I just got the following short email from them:

Helpdesk <[email protected]> Wed, Nov 17, 2010 at 8:57 AM
To: "Richard J. Bendorf" <[email protected]>
Dear Richard,

Your order is ready to ship. Your order is eligible for the previous deal posted earlier. If you have any problems Please do not hesitate to call us for assistace. Please advice if you still wish to cancel.

Thank you,
Jessica Penafiel
877-684-2831

I will wait for the unit to arrive and then, up for a good fight, I will engage Tivo. For me it is now the principal of the thing and not the money. I have two other Tivos, a series 2 with lifetime, and an HD with $99 yearly service. From what I can gather through the great deal of chatter on the forums, Tivo loyalty is amazing and "old guys" i.e. early adopters, would like for Tivo to work this out.

I will also restate/share another thought that I have heard...at present Tivo pricing is arbitrary and inconsistent. It seems that this "promotion" was not thought out well and aimed at new adopters with little or no regard for loyal customers. I also appears to me that this is sloppy marketing/management. Tivo really needs to come up with some kind of statement to clarify or mollify their existing customer base.

This is akin to a soap opera and it will be interesting to see what the final outcome is.

Peace,

Rich


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## mec1991

DaveMN said:


> Thank you for making my day.


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## MikeAndrews

I called 6ave to make sure my order wasn't canceled. For me it was my first contact and I haven't heard anything other than my order acknowledgment on 11/13.

Scary part: The automated order status system searches by phone number. After two tries it didn't know of an order on mine.

The scoop:

The first thing out of her mouth is "You can still get the old $12.95 rate... Some TiVo CSRs don't know but ask for a supervisor." Does that mean MSD and lifetime? I didn't ask.

You can send the Premiere back to 6ave if you can't get the old sub rate from TiVo. I didn't verify if they will pay return shipping.

*NO, 6ave is not canceling orders.* They are calling people who had called to cancel to offer them the chance to uncancel.

Almost does not compute: 6ave is also calling all the (over 600!) people who ordered to make sure they still want the Premiere, because in some cases people are saying they don't want to deal with the hassle of possibly having to ask Tivo repeatedly to get the old subscription rate deal.

I've decided to stay with the bet I placed. I told her to mark me as wanting it. My Premiere should be shipped although maybe 6ave will still call me.


----------



## atmuscarella

netringer said:


> I called 6ave to make sure my order wasn't canceled. For me it was my first contact and I haven't heard anything other than my order acknowledgment on 11/13.
> 
> Scary part: The automated order status system searches by phone number. After two tries it didn't know of an order on mine.
> 
> The scoop:
> 
> The first thing out of her mouth is "You can still get the old $12.95 rate... Some TiVo CSRs don't know but ask for a supervisor." Does that mean MSD and lifetime? I didn't ask.
> 
> *NO, 6ave is not canceling orders.* They are calling people who had called to cancel to offer them the chance to uncancel.
> 
> Almost does not compute: 6ave is also calling all the (over 600!) people who ordered to make sure they still want the Premiere, because in some cases people are saying they don't want to deal with the hassle of possibly having to ask Tivo repeatedly to get the old subscription rate deal.
> 
> I've decided to stay with the bet I placed. I told her to mark me as wanting it. My Premiere should be shipped although maybe 6ave will still call me.


I used their live chat this morning (I also ordered on the 13th early AM) and was told they were backed up due to high order volume and expect to get the Tivos shipped out Thursday and Friday. I didn't ask anything about the service rates; either I will get Liftetime for $299 or I will not sub the unit and just eat the $100 and keep it for spare parts, as I am fairly sure I will end up buying a Premiere sooner or later.

Thanks,


----------



## SmittyJ

*UPDATE*
My first e-mail to Tivo was rejected, despite clearly laying out the purchase date and such.

My second e-mail, in which I linked to their terms and conditions, pointed out the relevant parts (2.1 and 2.2, specifically), and advised them that I had sent a copy of all info to legal counsel, resulted in an apology and an offer of $299 lifetime service using my MSD.



> There has been a lot of confusion surrounding the Premiere's purchased from 6th Avenue on the 13th for $99 since they were not supposed to be sold at that priced until the 14th. Since the terms and conditions do state that units purchased before the 14th are eligible for the normal service fees you will be able to activate service on your new Premiere with Product Lifetime Service and you do qualify for the Multi Service Discount so it will be $299.


Take this with a grain of salt for two reasons. 1) This still appears to be a front line rep. I don't see "supervisor" or "manager in her title. I can see someone else apologizing for _her_ response and starting this all over again. 2) My Tivo isn't here yet, so it hasn't been activated. All I have is promises at this point, which aren't worth spit.

If people keep getting denied after receiving their units, please post it here. That info will be useful to my lawyer _if_ we decide to go forward with this.


----------



## smbaker

SmittyJ said:


> *UPDATE*
> My first e-mail to Tivo was rejected, despite clearly laying out the purchase date and such.


What is the email address folks are using for this? I'd like to get started on getting approval for mine as well.


----------



## alyssa

netringer said:


> We're you in touch with 6ave at all?


No, I was going to call them this morning but an illness got in the way.
Thanks to all who called & posted their results!


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## SmittyJ

smbaker said:


> What is the email address folks are using for this? I'd like to get started on getting approval for mine as well.


It's not technically e-mail. You have to communicate with them via the Tivo web site. They reply via e-mail, but you still have to log in and use the site to respond.


----------



## ~kyle

I emailed 6ave this morning simply asking for the status of my order I placed on the 13th and received this reply:



> Dear Kyle,
> 
> Your order is in processing. Should be shipping within the next 3-5 business days. Once it ships you will receive an email confirmation with a tracking number.
> 
> Thank you,
> Jessica Penafiel
> 877-684-2831


This is the first time they've contacted me since I got my order confirmation.


----------



## MediaLivingRoom

And TiVo wonders why they are losing Stand Along TiVo sales, the people who cheer for TiVo and such are being treated badly. 

Case is point, how many post are on the site for TiVo related posting in 2003, 2004, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010. 

How many stand alone subs are they losing over all, they are losing more per month they they gain from retail.

I bet a lot of people who use to post here were TiVo fans and some are bitter TiVo users.


----------



## miadlor

I purchased on the 12th from 6th ave. and received it yesterday. I called TiVo and just stated I wanted to activate it. The rep asked what option I wished to have and he read off Lifetime $299. (This is my 5th). Never asked me anything else. All activated. I wish I could have gotten the $199 deal. Didn't really ask.


----------



## trip1eX

DaveMN said:


> After being continually denied lifetime service on my 6ave 11/12 purchase, I send-off a politely worded email to customer service, basically accusing them of fraud and not honoring their own published terms of service. An hour later I received notice that they would honor the lifetime, along with a reference number to mention when I activate the box. You probably just need to complain loud enough, and it probably doesn't hurt that I've been a multi-unit customer for a long time. In the end, I'm happy they're doing the right thing, even though I'm not happy about the path required to get there.


Can you post a copy of the email? I'd like to use it and see if I can get lifetime. I could send my own, but it would interesting to see if the same exact email with the details changed around to fit my tivo history would get the same result.


----------



## ~kyle

Just got my shipping confirmation about an hour ago.


----------



## Wingershute

Just coincidentally, there is a class action lawsuit settlement against computer maker HP. The settlement provides small refunds to purchasers/gift receivers of certain HP printers. I won't go into detail but the settlements allege that HP used false pop up messages that confused the users into believing their printers were low on ink or made the printers to stop working all together.
This does not pertain to Tivo but I can envision customers becoming so fustrated with this disastrous policy that a class action lawsuit may be coming.

Check out the settlement:
https://www.hpinkjetprintersettlement.com/Default.aspx


----------



## mec1991

Still no phone call or email from 6ave here and my bank account is still $99 "over". 

Logged into Amazon Payments and the order status is listed as open, so I guess they did not cancel my order of the 13th after all. 

We shall see in another day or two, I guess.


----------



## NullQwerty

After reading on this thread that 6ave was calling up cancelled orders and asking if they wanted to uncancel them, I decided to call 6ave. I asked if it was true. She said it was. I asked if we would definitely get the $13 per month price. She said they've been working with Tivo all week and yes we would definitely get the old pricing, but that I needed to ask to speak to a supervisor. I asked if she uncanceled my order, would the receipt still show it was ordered on the 13th. She said it would. I asked if Tivo wouldn't honor the old pricing, would they still accept the return and would they still pay for return shipping. She said they would. So I asked her to uncancel my order and she did. Took like 5 seconds. I think she said it would be ship on Friday. She actually had a list of all cancelled Tivo orders in front of her. 

We'll see. Time will tell. Scheduled the CableCard install in the mean time.


----------



## cherry ghost

I had no problem getting lifetime for $299 on a Premiere bought from Amazon for $99. Just call in and plead your case.


----------



## SmittyJ

cherry ghost said:


> I had no problem getting lifetime for $299 on a Premiere bought from Amazon for $99. Just call in and plead your case.


This is a new wrinkle. What case did you plead? I wasn't aware that Amazon was selling the cheaper units prior to the 14th. I thought only 6ave.com fell in that boat, hence the reason some of us qualify for the old pricing.


----------



## gespears

netringer said:


> *NO, 6ave is not canceling orders.* .


This is NOT true. I received this from 6th ave:

We are writing to confirm the cancellation of your order.

This cancellation will be processed within 24 hours and the charge on your credit card account will be released within 3-5 business days or less. Please note that credit cards are not charged until orders are shipped. If you have further questions, please contact Customer Service toll free at 1-877-684-2831 or email us at [email protected].

Sincerely,

Sixth Avenue Electronics

Customer Service

I did not ask to cancel the order. They did this on their own accord.


----------



## MikeAndrews

gespears said:


> This is NOT true. I received this from 6th ave:
> 
> We are writing to confirm the cancellation of your order.
> 
> ...I did not ask to cancel the order. They did this on their own accord.


Maybe 6ave couldn't reach you when they called to verify? That could have happened to me since I'm likely to not have recognized the name calling me.

Call and see if you can uncancel.

I got an email notice that mine shipped - after I called.


----------



## ~kyle

netringer said:


> Maybe 6ave couldn't reach you when they called to verify? That could have happened to me since I'm likely to not have recognized the name calling me.
> 
> Call and see if you can uncancel.
> 
> I got an email notice that mine shipped - after I called.


I got my email notice that mine shipped just a few hours after I emailed them to get the status. It makes me wonder if they would have cancelled mine if I hadn't asked about it.


----------



## GPT999

~kyle said:


> I got my email notice that mine shipped just a few hours after I emailed them to get the status. It makes me wonder if they would have cancelled mine if I hadn't asked about it.


Yeah, I got email last night that my unit has shipped, after talking to them yesterday am...


----------



## MediaLivingRoom

TiVo Customer Support said to me that all sales from 6ave.com that were placed before 11/14 will honor the older policy based on your account details regardless of price paid.


----------



## gespears

netringer said:


> Maybe 6ave couldn't reach you when they called to verify? That could have happened to me since I'm likely to not have recognized the name calling me.
> 
> Call and see if you can uncancel.
> 
> I got an email notice that mine shipped - after I called.


I didn't miss a call or get a message. Anyway I emailed them today because I couldn't call. They sent a message saying that they must not have been able to charge my credit card. That's funny because I paid using a paypal balance. I emailed them back again saying I wanted the order reinstated but have not received another response yet.


----------



## mec1991

I emailed 6ave yesterday but it was most likely too late in the day to hear from them so I hope for a reply today.

It has been about 36 hours since I received an automated email from TiVo saying they would respond to my inquiry within 24 hours. 

So I am still pretty much in the dark.


----------



## alyssa

The reply I got yesterday from 6th ave was;


> Thanks for your e-mail. In regards to your order, it is currently in process to be shipped within 1-3 business days. Thanks.


eta; I left a message via the chat thingy


----------



## wjdennen

for what it's worth, mine shipped from 6ave late yesterday (Thursday 11/18) afternoon.


----------



## mec1991

Just received an email from Jasmine Whitaker at 6ave letting me know it has been shipped and that I will receive a confirmation email within 24 hours with tracking information. :up:

Now if only TiVo will live up to their own agreement terms.


----------



## mec1991

As a quick followup, I just got an email from Adam at TiVo Customer Service saying there should be no problem when I call to activate and choose the plan I want. He gave me a reference number to give the CSR I speak with. :up:

Maybe they do read these forums after all.


----------



## smbaker

Something a little weird with the shipping from this outfit. This morning I email asking when it's going to ship and then 30 seconds later, I get an email that it just shipped. This from an order placed on the morning of the 13th. 

To anyone whose order hasn't shipped yet, try sending them an email, maybe they're holding them back for some reason.


----------



## lessd

smbaker said:


> Something a little weird with the shipping from this outfit. This morning I email asking when it's going to ship and then 30 seconds later, I get an email that it just shipped. This from an order placed on the morning of the 13th.
> 
> To anyone whose order hasn't shipped yet, try sending them an email, maybe they're holding them back for some reason.


I think they (6av) got way overloaded on the 12th when people thought that they could purchase a TP for $99 *AND* get the current TiVo service pricing that was on the TiVo web sight that day, what a deal!!
This has been a nightmare for both 6th av and TiVo, just give 6av some time and you will get your TiVo, getting the old service price on it is another thing altogether


----------



## kidvicious1973

Whats the big deal on the price, Amazon has them for $99. Dont you still have to pay the $20 per month sub if you dont have lifetime sub?


----------



## smbaker

kidvicious1973 said:


> Whats the big deal on the price, Amazon has them for $99. Dont you still have to pay the $20 per month sub if you dont have lifetime sub?


The big deal was that they went on sale 2 days before the Tivo service fees went up. It's of no consequence now to anyone who didn't order before Nov 14th.


----------



## lessd

kidvicious1973 said:


> Whats the big deal on the price, Amazon has them for $99. Dont you still have to pay the $20 per month sub if you dont have lifetime sub?


The big deal is that 6th Av started selling the $99 TP on Nov 13th when the old service plan was on TiVos web sight, Amazon did not start selling the $99 TP until Nov 14th when the new service plan was on the TiVo web sight. People who purchased on the 13th had no way to know that the TiVo service plan would change the next day. As of now people looking at the $99 TP on Amazon don't get any info about the new $20/month required.
And I don't know what you mean by *$20 per month sub if you don't have lifetime sub?* If you already had any TiVo with Lifetime, that would not change because TiVo is now selling the TP at $99.


----------



## kidvicious1973

lessd said:


> The big deal is that 6th Av started selling the $99 TP on Nov 13th when the old service plan was on TiVos web sight, Amazon did not start selling the $99 TP until Nov 14th when the new service plan was on the TiVo web sight. People who purchased on the 13th had no way to know that the TiVo service plan would change the next day. As of now people looking at the $99 TP on Amazon don't get any info about the new $20/month required.
> And I don't know what you mean by *$20 per month sub if you don't have lifetime sub?* If you already had any TiVo with Lifetime, that would not change because TiVo is now selling the TP at $99.


That explains a lot. I just bought one today, My first Tivo. I asked the customer service rep how much for two subscriptions. He said $20 each. Guess Ill only be using one.


----------



## rbendorf

kidvicious1973 said:


> That explains a lot. I just bought one today, My first Tivo. I asked the customer service rep how much for two subscriptions. He said $20 each. Guess Ill only be using one.


Welcome aboard. I have 2 Tivo machines and have enjoyed using the Tivo's over the years. I have a Series 2 and an HD machine and the new machines, i.e. HD and Premiere have nicer interfaces and much more capacity. Actually, I think they are a better buy than when I bought my first Tivo.

The 19.95 monthly fee may change at the end of your current subscription, so depending on whether or not they have the lifetime service, it might be a good deal.


----------



## ~kyle

lessd said:


> The big deal is that 6th Av started selling the $99 TP on Nov 13th....


Actually they started selling them at that price early evening of the 12th. It showed up before 8pm est on slickdeals.


----------



## alyssa

just got off chat with 6th ave. 
me; got an eta on my order? 
them; 24-48 business hours. 
me; so it'll ship 10 to 11 days after the order was placed? 
them; yes, we've got thousands of these shipping. 
pause....pause
me; I've got nothing more to say. (what could I say, it's obviously abysmal)

eta; Has anyone who ordered a TP after 9:30am on Sat the 13 gotten a shipping notice?


----------



## MikeAndrews

alyssa said:


> ...
> eta; Has anyone who ordered a TP after 9:30am on Sat the 13 gotten a shipping notice?


Yes.
http://tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=8231373#post8231373



> Saturday, November 13, 2010 12:36 AM
> Thank you for your order number nnnnnnnn. Please take a moment to review your order details.





> Wednesday, November 17, 2010 4:45 PM
> Your 6ave.com order has been shipped


Don't have it as of Friday PM.


----------



## Pasty

Just posting on my experience with TiVo, but first, I want to thank all of you that came before, both here and on SlickDeals, who no doubt made this easier for me.

It took me one call, 10 minutes, on the phone with Kevin and then Dave, his supervisor. Kevin was friendly and helpful. I told him that I had bought it Friday before all the TOS changes, and that I was advised by Customer Service to do a "Service Number Replacement" on my old S2DT box, which was costing me $9.95 with the MultiSubscriber Discount. 

He got the number, typed it in, and we were done.

So, why the conversation with Dave the supervisor? I spoke with Dave because I wanted to make sure Kevin got credit for his hassle-free transition. I told Dave that I knew they've had a lot of headaches in the past weeks, and in light of that, I wanted to praise Kevin for his helpful attitude and doing the right thing.

I hope my experience is the same that you will have, but with 5 minutes to get done and 5 minutes to thank them for their service, I can't have asked for a better transition.

Good luck, all of you!


----------



## mec1991

Just received the official email with the tracking info; UPS says it will be delivered 11/24.


----------



## alyssa

netringer,
I'm glad you've at least gotten a shipping notice.
I ordered a unit about 9 hours *after* you did, at 9.30am ish. I'm wondering if the entire warehouse is so horrendously backed up or if they're deliberately slowing down the shipments.


----------



## smbaker

alyssa said:


> netringer,
> I'm glad you've at least gotten a shipping notice.
> I ordered a unit about 9 hours *after* you did, at 9.30am ish. I'm wondering if the entire warehouse is so horrendously backed up or if they're deliberately slowing down the shipments.


Send them an email asking status. I did and got a shipping notice 30 seconds later. Unfortunately, mine isn't going to be here until the 30th! Of course, it's not like I actually need it.


----------



## lessd

alyssa said:


> just got off chat with 6th ave.
> me; got an eta on my order?
> them; 24-48 business hours.
> me; so it'll ship 10 to 11 days after the order was placed?
> them; yes, we've got thousands of these shipping.
> pause....pause
> me; I've got nothing more to say. (what could I say, it's obviously abysmal)
> 
> eta; Has anyone who ordered a TP after 9:30am on Sat the 13 gotten a shipping notice?


I ordered at about 2PM on the 13th and the unit arrived today VIA UPS Nov 19th, It was very well packed in a large box with popcorn packing and a nice invoice dated Nov 13th.


----------



## hirschma

Pasty said:


> I hope my experience is the same that you will have, but with 5 minutes to get done and 5 minutes to thank them for their service, I can't have asked for a better transition.
> 
> Good luck, all of you!


I wish I had some of your luck 

I ordered on the 12th from 6ave; I have an existing (admittedly, unused) lifetime activated 02/2000.

First attempt to activate: they agreed to offer me a lifetime at $399. Nothing else. Told me that it didn't matter when I ordered the unit, nor if I had proof - just that they were going to treat it as a $99 unit, and they were "doing me a favor" by offering up a $399 lifetime.

Second: they agreed to do a $12.95 monthly, or a $399 lifetime. Nothing else.

Is this really the best that I can do? I really want to start using Tivo again, but man - they're not making it easy 

Thanks for any suggestions.


----------



## overFEDEXed

lessd said:


> I ordered at about 2PM on the 13th and the unit arrived today VIA UPS Nov 19th, It was very well packed in a large box with popcorn packing and a nice invoice dated Nov 13th.


I ordered at 11pm on the 12th, got my tracking number on the 18th. Delivery date is Monday the 22nd. I guess that they have so many people processing orders that there is no logical system in place.

I did buy one at Bestbuy yesterday for the heck of it. I will post my results after I go a couple of rounds with the Tivo csr's. I have a $6.95 HD that I wanted to swap out.


----------



## alyssa

overFEDEXed said:


> ... I guess that they have so many people processing orders that there is no logical system in place.
> ...


:up::up:
I ordered early morning of the 13th & just got a shipping notice. No eta, just a notice. I wonder if other items they've sold are as backed up on shipping. Some how I find that hard to believe. But stranger things have happened.

eta; now I've got to decide between swap out for a 6.95 unit, life time or add a unit for 12.95.....Hey, with MSD, can I get lifetime for $199? or is it $299? How can someone get the 199 price?


----------



## kidvicious1973

rbendorf said:


> Welcome aboard. I have 2 Tivo machines and have enjoyed using the Tivo's over the years. I have a Series 2 and an HD machine and the new machines, i.e. HD and Premiere have nicer interfaces and much more capacity. Actually, I think they are a better buy than when I bought my first Tivo.
> 
> The 19.95 monthly fee may change at the end of your current subscription, so depending on whether or not they have the lifetime service, it might be a good deal.


From what I understand, at the end of one year, I have to call to change it to the plan where I am not subsidizing the cost of the DVR.


----------



## lessd

kidvicious1973 said:


> From what I understand, at the end of one year, I have to call to change it to the plan where I am not subsidizing the cost of the DVR.


That not what TiVos T&C say as of today, once a $99 TP is on the $19.95/month it always will be $19.95/month, just no commitment after the 1 year is up, just month to month. *BUT* 1 year from now all can change as it has from a year ago in the TiVo service plans, so we can all guess away but it will never produce an answer except $99 + $239.40 paid monthly for 1 year of service on $99 TP now.


----------



## ex007

Does anyone think this "special" is going to attract customers? It seems insane that someone would commit to a $20 p/month obligation. It makes no sense at all to me.


----------



## shwru980r

Yes, because it's cheaper for the first year. and then you only have a month to month commitment after that.


----------



## ebf

ex007 said:


> Does anyone think this "special" is going to attract customers? It seems insane that someone would commit to a $20 p/month obligation. It makes no sense at all to me.


I think it would work IF the price was just a bit less than the standard cable co price. They had been touting how much better, and cheaper, TiVo is versus the cable co dvr up until this new change. If the monthly price had been $16.95, with a $99 box, even for two years, I think it would be more appealing to new customers.


----------



## slowbiscuit

shwru980r said:


> Yes, because it's cheaper for the first year. and then you only have a month to month commitment after that.


But will it be at $20/mo. after the year as Tivo says, or can you switch to another plan? This is the big unknown with these 'marked' boxes.


----------



## mec1991

I went to do some online banking this morning and noticed my account was still $99 over, just like it was back on the 17th.

I then went to UPS to check the progress of the shipment and learned the status had not changed; although they still say it will be delivered 11/24 it is still in the "billing information received" state, meaning UPS does not have possession of the TiVo yet.

*So despite my receiving two emails from 6ave and a third one from Amazon Payments informing me the order had shipped, it has not?*

And yes, I have emailed 6ave.


----------



## alyssa

yeah, I checked the shipping status of my order & no change. My last communication stated 24-48 business hrs for shipment, ie tues or wen.


----------



## noeltykay

My order shipped over the weekend from 6AVE with a delivery date of 11/29. When I receive it I will call Tivo and activate the lifetime for $299 prior to opening the box. I will have my Tivo case number in hand. I was told by the CSR that I qualify for lifetime on my unit. Let's hope they keep to their word.


----------



## lessd

noeltykay said:


> My order shipped over the weekend from 6AVE with a delivery date of 11/29. When I receive it I will call Tivo and activate the lifetime for $299 prior to opening the box. I will have my Tivo case number in hand. I was told by the CSR that I qualify for lifetime on my unit. Let's hope they keep to their word.


They will, don't worry, just be nice on the phone, TiVo has been easy to deal with if you have any upgrade offers on your account.


----------



## dpalbsp

Hi,

I will also receive my Premire on 11/29 (ordered on 11/13), is the $299 lifetime plan is for everybody who ordered before 11/14? I am hoping I will also get the 299 lifetime service.

thanks,


----------



## MikeAndrews

Can't say much for the way it was packed. The poorly taped seals on the outer carton were open and it was leaking those work-of-satan Styrofoam peanuts. The shipping guys must have torn through the huge backlog stack.


----------



## rbendorf

netringer said:


> Can't say much for the way it was packed. The poorly taped seals on the outer carton were open and it was leaking those work-of-satan Styrofoam peanuts. The shipping guys must have torn through the huge backlog stack.


I just received my Premiere from 6ave and it was packed OK. On the other hand I did not get the Beaujolais nouveau...oh, well, I guess that I will have to settle for a California Cabernet.

Anyway, I just call Tivo and they offered my a lifetime for $299, which I took. They asked me to fax (no email) them a copy of the bill of sale from 6ave to verify that it was indeed purchased before the 14th.

I will let you know what happens.


----------



## trip1eX

Finally got lifetime on the pre-Nov 14th Premiere purchase.

Rejected the first few times.

Sent an email as someone suggested. Was asked to fax in receipt. and given reference number. Did that and called back today. And wha la. 

Now I have 3 Premieres.


----------



## smbaker

trip1eX said:


> Sent an email as someone suggested. Was asked to fax in receipt. and given reference number. Did that and called back today. And wha la.


Wrote them today and received a similar email asking for a receipt. Mine hasn't arrived from the ups truck yet, but I'm not worried anymore that I'm going to have problems purchasing lifetime. It looks like Tivo is gonna do the right thing.


----------



## mec1991

Glad everyone is having good luck. :up:

Mine is at least in transit now with a rescheduled date of 11/29.


----------



## ~kyle

trip1eX said:


> Finally got lifetime on the pre-Nov 14th Premiere purchase.
> 
> Rejected the first few times.
> 
> Sent an email as someone suggested. Was asked to fax in receipt. and given reference number. Did that and called back today. And wha la.
> 
> Now I have 3 Premieres.





smbaker said:


> Wrote them today and received a similar email asking for a receipt. Mine hasn't arrived from the ups truck yet, but I'm not worried anymore that I'm going to have problems purchasing lifetime. It looks like Tivo is gonna do the right thing.


What email address did you use? Where you both offered $299 lifetime?


----------



## smbaker

~kyle said:


> What email address did you use? Where you both offered $299 lifetime?


I used the online form (somewhere under the section about contacting support). I explained to them when I purchased it (13th), listed the section in the terms (2.1) that mentioned the date of the 14th, let them know I was expecting to get lifetime for $299 (I listed the price), and asked for confirmation of this.


----------



## ~kyle

smbaker said:


> I used the online form (somewhere under the section about contacting support). I explained to them when I purchased it (13th), listed the section in the terms (2.1) that mentioned the date of the 14th, let them know I was expecting to get lifetime for $299 (I listed the price), and asked for confirmation of this.


Thanks, I recieived mine today but haven't contacted them yet. I wonder if I should try calling first or just send an email.


----------



## gespears

Well after sending more emails asking why they canceled my order, and 6th ave still saying there was a billing problem (not true, I paid by PayPal and they actually issued a refund to my PayPal account after they canceled the order,) I called them and they said the supervisor had canceled the order and they had to talk to him. Then they came back to the phone after several minutes and said they would reissue the order. They then transferred me to the sales department where after again going over everything the salesman said "oh I've heard about these PayPal orders." I'm not sure what all this meant but they did reinstate the order.


----------



## GPT999

gespears said:


> Well after sending more emails asking why they canceled my order, and 6th ave still saying there was a billing problem (not true, I paid by PayPal and they actually issued a refund to my PayPal account after they canceled the order,) I called them and they said the supervisor had canceled the order and they had to talk to him. Then they came back to the phone after several minutes and said they would reissue the order. They then transferred me to the sales department where after again going over everything the salesman said "oh I've heard about these PayPal orders." I'm not sure what all this meant but they did reinstate the order.


Huh! I paid with PayPal and had no problems. Me thinks they had some "problems" on their side and are not owning up to it. My unit is arriving today and I hope the activation goes smoothly as it has for some of you!


----------



## ~kyle

I paid with Paypal as well, got mine yesterday with no problems.


----------



## andrews777

Anyone had any luck applying their "upgrade" offer to these units? I am about to buy another one and I have 2 (or perhaps 3 if you believe the Tivo site) upgrades still available.

Brad


----------



## MikeAndrews

andrews777 said:


> Anyone had any luck applying their "upgrade" offer to these units? I am about to buy another one and I have 2 (or perhaps 3 if you believe the Tivo site) upgrades still available.


I just activated my 6ave $95 Premiere with $299 Lifetime. No hassles whatsoever. I clearly said, "purchased on November 13th from 6th Ave Electronics."

The rep explained that I have 3 of the regular MSD "upgrades" remaining where I could have a Premiere with lifetime for $468. This one time $95 deal cost me $394.

I have never been offered the $199 deal because I have PLS on all except one S2DT on monthly.

The scary part? I activated the box before I opened the box, knowing that I can cancel service in the first 30 days.

When I hooked it up with HDMI, after the "starting up..." I got a green screen! I swore, damned my luck, power cycled and got a green screen again. Then I remembered I had the same problem with my recent S3 OLED. I connected the composite video to another old TV and there was the guided setup screen. WTF? How could a customer who didn't have my setup get past that? My HDTV doesn't even have composite inputs. I guess component works? [EDIT: I think I figured it out. My HDTV has three HDMI inputs and evidently only the first two have HDCP working, even though the Tivo said HDMI/HDCP was working. I swapped the cable at the TV and it worked seeing the TiVo. Just great. Defective by design.]

I called Comcast and they're coming out tomorrow. $16 for the truck roll. The good news there is I'll get a 5th CableCard for only $1.50 a month. I'm paying $9.45 and $7.95 + $1.50 (also $9.45) a month for the two cards each in my two S3s now.


----------



## andrews777

I wouldn't have "bought before the 14th" though. That is my concern.

Brad


----------



## radiusmax

Just received my 6ave.com Tivo Premiere today. Called Tivo and told them I purchased my 6ave.com Tivo Premiere on Nov 12th and would like to activate lifetime service on it. He went ahead and told me it would be $299.00 and activated the Tivo for me.

I have a Tivo HD with lifetime and a Series 2 that I had already called in to cancelled monthly service at the end of December.

No issues and simple.


----------



## smbaker

andrews777 said:


> I wouldn't have "bought before the 14th" though.


In your case, you would not be eligible. There are people on the SD forums that openly admit to lying about the purchase date to get the lifetime deal, which is probably why Tivo is now requiring us to fax in receipts to prove our purchase date.


----------



## slowbiscuit

Which is also easy to get around, because it's dirt-simple to edit the order and 'fix' the date before you fax it in. It's not like they're going to call 6ave and verify yours was purchased before the 14th. Not that I'm recommending it btw, but it's something anyone with Notepad could do.


----------



## smbaker

slowbiscuit said:


> It's not like they're going to call 6ave and verify yours was purchased before the 14th.


If people start submitting forged receipts, then they will.


----------



## MediaLivingRoom

TiVoPony,

Can you give us a final ruling on this purchased date vs activation date when is comes to the 6ave sales of 11/13? What if I wanted to wait until late Dec to activate?


----------



## andrews777

I already have 4 lifetime units (3 Tivo HDs, 1 Premier XL). Tivo needs to stop worrying about squeezing every last dollar out of me....

Brad


----------



## MediaLivingRoom

andrews777 said:


> I already have 4 lifetime units (3 Tivo HDs, 1 Premier XL). Tivo needs to stop worrying about squeezing every last dollar out of me....
> 
> Brad


Right on!!!

When they say they have 1.5 million stand alone units, that really means 700,000 customers. Since the average person has about 2 TiVo's each.


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## MikeAndrews

andrews777 said:


> I already have 4 lifetime units (3 Tivo HDs, 1 Premier XL). Tivo needs to stop worrying about squeezing every last dollar out of me....


 I was just vowing that I need to stop jumping on every chance to get another TiVo deal. I even have spare parts!


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## GPT999

I got my unit today and just activated my Premiere for $299 for lifetime! Whew, I thought that was going to be harder! She gave the option w/o me asking so it went very smoothly. Now I will be looking at the Premiere HDD upgrade forum ;-)


----------



## atmuscarella

I am almost embarrassed to post what has happened with my deal. But thought others might find it interesting.


Order a Premiere from 6ave.com on 11/13 (about 7:00 am)
Received unit 11/23 - double boxed came in good shape
Called TiVo 4:00 pm 11/23 to purchase service - was told options were $19.99/mo only. Politely told the person I new that wasn't true and that I wanted to buy lifetime service for it. Was put on hold and then given fax number to fax receipt in and told to call back in 2 hours.
Faxed in receipt and waited until 6:00 pm called back gave them my case number. They looked it up and told me I was approved for $199 lifetime for the unit. 
Purchased lifetime for $199 (plus tax because I live in NY). 

The above is somewhat amazing to me because I never mentioned wanting lifetime service for $199 (actually never mention anything about price). It was there first offer to me.

So I ended up buying a Premiere with lifetime service for $295 (plus tax).

I could not be happier and really thing TiVo provided me with an exceptional deal.

Thanks,


----------



## tcfcameron

atmuscarella said:


> I am almost embarrassed to post what has happened with my deal. But thought others might find it interesting.
> 
> 
> Order a Premiere from 6ave.com on 11/13 (about 7:00 am)
> Received unit 11/23 - double boxed came in good shape
> Called TiVo 4:00 pm 11/23 to purchase service - was told options were $19.99/mo only. Politely told the person I new that wasn't true and that I wanted to buy lifetime service for it. Was put on hold and then given fax number to fax receipt in and told to call back in 2 hours.
> Faxed in receipt and waited until 6:00 pm called back gave them my case number. They looked it up and told me I was approved for $199 lifetime for the unit.
> Purchased lifetime for $199 (plus tax because I live in NY).
> 
> The above is somewhat amazing to me because I never mentioned wanting lifetime service for $199 (actually never mention anything about price). It was there first offer to me.
> 
> So I ended up buying a Premiere with lifetime service for $295 (plus tax).
> 
> I could not be happier and really thing TiVo provided me with an exceptional deal.
> 
> Thanks,


I bought mine under the same circumstances, same price, same reseller, escalated the matter all the way to the top, and was told that the computer simply would not allow $199 Lifetime Service as an option. I was told $299 was the absolute best that could be done, due to it being one of the promotional units that 6th Ave started selling early. I offered to fax my receipt, begged, then eventually allowed them to charge the $299.

I have four TiVo HDs that are all listed under "see my upgrade offers".
The two that have Lifetime service, produce offers of $30-off full price on a Premiere + Lifetime service on the new unit for $199 (while retaining LT on the THD).
The two that are monthly, produce offers of $100-off full price on a Premiere, and no Lifetime (discount) offer.
These offers are, of course, supposed to only be applicable to units ordered directly from TiVo.

Now I am extremely p'd off. I spent days calling, waiting far callbacks, returning calls, can't even remember how many calls total...

But, good for you. Also, good for all the others that have been able to get Lifetime Service, on these units, at all. Things are definitely working out better than I had predicted, early on. Last I heard, from my top level source, was that each case would be determined on an individual basis. But, I just don't understand the disparity in Lifetime service pricing. $100 is a substantial amount of money, period.

Is there anything you could share with the rest of us, that may help those of us who paid $299 to be able to help us get the $100 difference back?

Anything would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance.


----------



## mec1991

It may depend on what you currently have an upgrade offer for. When I checked the website the other day I noticed I have an upgrade offer for my old lifetime Sony S1 TiVo for $199. The offers on my other TiVos are for $399.

I am hoping for $199 naturally but would gladly accept $299.


----------



## ~kyle

I activated my Premiere about an hour ago for $299 with no problems whatsoever. I did email them first and I did fax them my dated invoice. 

The lady I spoke with was very pleasant and helpful, I gave her good marks on their survey afterwards.


----------



## David Platt

Has anybody inquired as to whether the Lifetime will stick with the box if it's ever resold or gifted to another person? At least one person was spreading the rumor that the Lifetime would go away since they were making a special exception on these 'promo' boxes.


----------



## lsuwest

My 6th Ave premiere order (ordered on the 13th) shows its status as shipping with a delivery date of next week. I currently have a single S2 Tivo.

Is the $299 lifetime price being discussed here a multi-tivo discount price or is it the previous standard price for lifetime service? I've only ever done monthly pricing but am considering the lifetime service if I can get it for $299. I'm going to cancel and retire my S2 once I get the premiere up and running.

I figure 12.95 a month and 299 for lifetime are about the same if I plan on using it for about 2 years before upgrading. Of course the lifetime service adds a lot if I want to use it beyond 2 years or use it on a second TV.


----------



## smbaker

David Platt said:



> Has anybody inquired as to whether the Lifetime will stick with the box if it's ever resold or gifted to another person?


I've not inquired, but I don't see any reason for the policy to change for just these boxes. It would probably cost them more to deal with making a special flavor of lifetime for just these 6ave boxes than they would make from enforcing the special policy.

People have speculated that lifetime may not be coming back for 3rd party boxes, which may be what you read. Some people think after Dec 31, Tivo will offer lifetime again, some people don't.



lsuwest said:


> Is the $299 lifetime price being discussed here a multi-tivo discount price or is it the previous standard price for lifetime service?


The previous price for lifetime is $399. MSD was $299. There was also a code out there called "PLS" that some people could use to get the discount. I'm not sure how the code worked or where the code came from.


----------



## ~kyle

David Platt said:


> Has anybody inquired as to whether the Lifetime will stick with the box if it's ever resold or gifted to another person? At least one person was spreading the rumor that the Lifetime would go away since they were making a special exception on these 'promo' boxes.


I was told today by Tivo CS that the lifetime would follow the box if I ever sold it. So I assume nothing's changed in that regard.


----------



## atmuscarella

David Platt said:


> Has anybody inquired as to whether the Lifetime will stick with the box if it's ever resold or gifted to another person? At least one person was spreading the rumor that the Lifetime would go away since they were making a special exception on these 'promo' boxes.


When I purchased my lifetime subscription I was read a script that specifically said lifetime service was for the life of the box and stayed with the box should I transfer ownership to someone else.

Thanks,


----------



## atmuscarella

lsuwest said:


> My 6th Ave premiere order (ordered on the 13th) shows its status as shipping with a delivery date of next week. I currently have a single S2 Tivo.
> 
> Is the $299 lifetime price being discussed here a multi-tivo discount price or is it the previous standard price for lifetime service? I've only ever done monthly pricing but am considering the lifetime service if I can get it for $299. I'm going to cancel and retire my S2 once I get the premiere up and running.
> 
> I figure 12.95 a month and 299 for lifetime are about the same if I plan on using it for about 2 years before upgrading. Of course the lifetime service adds a lot if I want to use it beyond 2 years or use it on a second TV.


The $299 being talked about is the price of lifetime using MSD.


----------



## MikeAndrews

lsuwest said:


> ...Is the $299 lifetime price being discussed here a multi-tivo discount price or is it the previous standard price for lifetime service? ... I'm going to cancel and retire my S2 once I get the premiere up and running.
> 
> I figure 12.95 a month and 299 for lifetime are about the same if I plan on using it for about 2 years before upgrading. Of course the lifetime service adds a lot if I want to use it beyond 2 years or use it on a second TV.


The $299 is the Multi Service Discount rate that you'll qualify for as long as you have that S2 on monthly. Note though that once you buy lifetime for $299 and cancel your S2 you won't have a qualification for another MSD, because it requires a "full price" subscription. You can always get another lifetime for the regular $399.

Lifetime is worth it not only in my case where I've gotten 5 years or more of service on one, but because it adds up to nearly the $300 to the value of the box if you were to sell it on eBay.


----------



## lengel2001

Ordered my tivo just after midnight on 11/13. Received said tivo on 11/24. I called in playing coy saying I wanted to activate my DVR and had a friend who got the lifetime service for $199. The CR said that the computer would not let her and that it would be the $20 a month deal. I asked about other lifetime offers and she said with the discounted price from retailers that there were not lifetime offers. I then dropped all the games and said I ordered before the 14th. She put me on hold after telling me I would have to fax in proof of purchase. She came back in a few minutes and said it was approved and set me up with the $299 lifetime purchase. It was fairly quick and easy only took about 15 minutes total and most of that was me trying to get the $199 deal. All in all I'm pretty happy even though I wasn't looking to buy a new tivo, just got swept up in the deal.


----------



## tcfcameron

mec1991 said:


> It may depend on what you currently have an upgrade offer for. When I checked the website the other day I noticed I have an upgrade offer for my old lifetime Sony S1 TiVo for $199. The offers on my other TiVos are for $399.
> 
> I am hoping for $199 naturally but would gladly accept $299.


I have four TiVo HDs that are all listed under "see my upgrade offers".

The two that have Lifetime service, produce offers of $30-off full price on a Premiere + Lifetime service on the new unit for $199 (while retaining LT on the THD).

The two that are monthly, produce offers of $100-off full price on a Premiere, and no Lifetime (discount) offer.

These offers are, of course, supposed to only be applicable to units ordered directly from TiVo. I had inquired about it during my many phone calls.


----------



## tcfcameron

David Platt said:


> Has anybody inquired as to whether the Lifetime will stick with the box if it's ever resold or gifted to another person? At least one person was spreading the rumor that the Lifetime would go away since they were making a special exception on these 'promo' boxes.


I may be the person you are speaking of. I was not spreading rumors. I was highlighting that there was a fiasco, in which people who had won TiVos in contests, which came with Lifetime Service, which were then put up on eBay (or other sites) as having LT Service (usually including screenshots, showing the LT status). Upon being purchased, then transferred to the new owner's account, the TiVo would then revert to having no service at all.

It was discussed here, within this forum, for some time.

TiVo's explanation was that the LT service was "promotional", and thus, did not fall under the normal terms and agreements. Whether or not the sellers had any idea this would, or could, happen, was never fully disclosed, that I am aware of.

There have been other cases of "dissapearing" LT Service, on TiVo HDs, in which cases, TiVo also used the "Promotional" defense.

Others have already posted about how the current situation should not result in this, as TiVo reads the agreement out-loud, and it is the standard agreement. Having recently experience this new "read the terms and conditions out loud" policy, I would agree that there shouldn't be a problem.

I want to make it clear, that I was always about the "what could happen". Not, "what will happen", unless I was told so by TiVo directly.

TiVo has changed their tune, regarding the units this thread was created about, several times. They are still doing it on the fly, and considering each case, individually. This is why I stopped posting anything for a while.

I would imagine, that there are people out there, who don't participate in forums, who bought prior to the 14th, then were told by TiVo they could only get the promo pricing, accepted it, and none of us will hear of it.

I had posed this question to TiVo: "What if somebody were to buy some of these $99 promo units, sit on them for 6 months, then try to activate, or resell them? TiVo's response was "It wouldn't do any good, as they are marked as promo units, and always will be, so we won't have any problems tracking them, should people try to do things like that".

I went a few rounds with TiVo, over when, exactly, the units are marked as promo. I was told that they are marked before being shipped to the resellers. Other "so what if..." type questions, really never got answered.

So, the best thing that can happen, to a marked promo unit, is to get LT service on it, before TiVo stops allowing it (which very well could happen).

Just to keep it clear, this is focused on promo units that 6th Ave started selling before the 14th, or any other scenario where the same thing may have happened.


----------



## smbaker

tcfcameron said:


> There was an argument posted that it would be too hard, or difficult, for TiVo to track a different kind of Lifetime plan. That's a rubbish argument. In this day and age, it's only a few key presses, and a new category is created, and can be kept fully separate from any others.


Nonsense.

Do you have some specific knowledge of how Tivo's customer service database is designed and implemented that the rest of us do not?

Modifying the database, modifying the user interface that Tivo customer reps use to operate on the database, adding code to detect lifetime Tivos that have changed ownership and de-lifetime them, putting these database changes through QA checking and regression testing to make sure nothing else has broken, training customer service to how to deal with these specially flagged lifetime subscriptions, and finally having to waste even more customer service time dealing with the inevitable service calls when the owners of the de-lifetimed tivos call in and complain about lifetime disappearing on them far outweighs the gain.* Probably by a few orders of magnitude*.

This is more than "a few key presses".


----------



## iwbyte

Adding my data point:

Purchased two Premiere's from 6ave.com for $99 each (less $4.xx coupon) on 11/12.

Just got them today 11/24. Called Tivo - call center sounded swamped. Spoke to a guy who got me lifetime for $299 on each of two Tivos.

Done quickly and politely.

I've just completed setup on the first box - having a few surprises when upgrading to my HUMAX DVD tivo, but i think I figured them all out.


----------



## aadam101

smbaker said:


> Nonsense.
> 
> Do you have some specific knowledge of how Tivo's customer service database is designed and implemented that the rest of us do not?
> 
> Modifying the database, modifying the user interface that Tivo customer reps use to operate on the database, adding code to detect lifetime Tivos that have changed ownership and de-lifetime them, putting these database changes through QA checking and regression testing to make sure nothing else has broken, training customer service to how to deal with these specially flagged lifetime subscriptions, and finally having to waste even more customer service time dealing with the inevitable service calls when the owners of the de-lifetimed tivos call in and complain about lifetime disappearing on them far outweighs the gain.* Probably by a few orders of magnitude*.
> 
> This is more than "a few key presses".


I completely agree. I have worked in a similar industry and even small changes can take weeks of preparation,

That being said, we were always careful NOT TO SCREW UP in the first place. TiVo didn't plan this well.


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## tcfcameron

smbaker said:


> Nonsense.
> 
> Do you have some specific knowledge of how Tivo's customer service database is designed and implemented that the rest of us do not?
> <snip>
> This is more than "a few key presses".


Point taken. I oversimplified. I removed the offending segment.


----------



## smbaker

aadam101 said:


> That being said, we were always careful NOT TO SCREW UP in the first place. TiVo didn't plan this well.


Had the problem been widespread, I'd agree. However it was just one retailer (6ave) that jumped the gun and used the promotional price before the new terms went into effect.


----------



## smbaker

tcfcameron said:


> Do you have such inside/internal/specific knowledge, yourself?


No, but I have extensive knowledge about database programming, software quality control, and deployment and administration of large distributed systems. I've dealt with corporations, large and small, and know how long it takes to get even a minor change pushed into an operational system.



tcfcameron said:


> So, it can't be argued that TiVo has no system in place for promotional Lifetime subscriptions, that don't follow the same terms and conditions that go with non-promotional ones.


Again, you're assuming operational details of the database that you do not have. We don't know how the contest Tivos were implemented in the database. We don't know that the mechanism that supported it generalizes to other scenarios or promotions.



tcfcameron said:


> It was only one line of a rather long post that you chose to take exception to.


Well, I'm also suspect of the statement that the $99 Tivos are "marked as promo units". That's also something that is difficult to do in practice. There could have been tens or hundreds of thousands of units sitting in the distribution chain when the promo went into effect. Are we to believe that inventory was warehoused or shipped back to make room for this new inventory of "marked" units? similarly on 12/31 the remaining marked units will all be shipped back to Tivo and replaced with unmarked units? I don't doubt your word that a Tivo CSR told you that they were, but statements to the contrary have also been posted in this very thread.

The only easy way to do it is to have the sales rep file something with Tivo during each sale at the time of purchase to note the TSN. Doable, but inconvenient.


----------



## tcfcameron

smbaker said:


> Well, I'm also suspect of the statement that the $99 Tivos are "marked as promo units". That's also something that is difficult to do in practice. There could have been tens or hundreds of thousands of units sitting in the distribution chain when the promo went into effect. Are we to believe that inventory was warehoused or shipped back to make room for this new inventory of "marked" units? similarly on 12/31 the remaining marked units will all be shipped back to Tivo and replaced with unmarked units? I don't doubt your word that a Tivo CSR told you that they were, but statements to the contrary have also been posted in this very thread.
> 
> The only easy way to do it is to have the sales rep file something with Tivo during each sale at the time of purchase to note the TSN. Doable, but inconvenient.


In the dozen, or more, phone conversations I've had with TiVo, over the last week, or so, nobody I have spoke with has ever denied that the promo units are marked, via TSN. In my case, it was repeatedly verified as being a fact. I have yet to see anybody post here saying that any TiVo representative has ever denied that.

When I say "marked", I mean within TiVo's system. At some point, TiVo started "marking" TSNs (within their system), that went with units that were intended to be sold as promotional units. There are no special "marks" or differences in the *physical* inventory.

I escalated the matter, with TiVo, all the way to the top. I asked a lot of specific questions, hoping to be able to report back here with SOLID information. What I was told, is that the marked TSNs were that way, before being shipped out. As far as existing inventory, I was told that those units were being handled on an individual basis. That _leads me to believe_, that existing inventory at retail outlets and resellers, probably had unmarked TSNs, but TiVo likely requested an accounting of such inventory, and then added those TSNs to the list of those marked as promotional.

As far as when 01/01/2011 comes, _I would expect _that existing inventory will again be accounted for, and any TSNs that are marked, will be removed as being promotional units. This part is, of course, conjecture on my part, but it is based on what TiVo has told me.

I do understand that it isn't impossible, or unthinkable, that TiVo may have given me wrong information. But, repeatedly, verifying that same information, leads me to think that it is the truth, or at least the representatives I have spoken with believe it to be.

Also, as a side note, is it really so hard to believe that in order to be a TiVo authorized reseller, that the reseller is required to have an accounting of the TSNs of the TiVo units in inventory, as well as a requirement that the TSN be recorded at the point of sale? From my experience, most, if not all, major retailers started recording serial numbers of electronics, at the point of sale years ago, in order to prevent fraud. Since a TSN is the serial number for a TiVo, all that is left is to report the TSNs back to TiVo at some predetermined (by TiVo) intervals. Combine all this with TiVo (supposedly) being able to mark TSNs as "promotional units" in their internal system, and it all seems to fit together as workable. I'm not trying to make this into an argument, or state it as fact, but just positing it as "possible".


----------



## alyssa

MediaLivingRoom said:


> Can you give us a final ruling on this purchased date vs activation date when is comes to the 6ave sales of 11/13? What if I wanted to wait until late Dec to activate?


Yeah, I had no intention of buying a new tivo & don't quite know what to do with it. It's a nice problem to have. 

Regardless, I don't feel comfortable waiting too long to activate it. I'll either go with lifetime or monthly with the intention of moving it into my $6.95 slot eventually. Depends on if I like having 3 tivo's on 2 TV's.

I just got my unit from my 9am order on the 13th.


----------



## mec1991

Alyssa,

Glad you got yours. 

Mine was ordered the same time and arrived at UPS in Secaucus NJ 3 days ago and apparently is still sitting there.


----------



## smbaker

tcfcameron said:


> Also, as a side note, is it really so hard to believe that in order to be a TiVo authorized reseller, that the reseller is required to have an accounting of the TSNs of the TiVo units in inventory, as well as a requirement that the TSN be recorded at the point of sale?


Everyone's point-of-sale and inventory system is a little different. I can't really think of a recent sale where a reseller entered in the serial number of something I purchased, but then again I'm usually not looking for it so it's very possible that you're right.

I'm predicting another mess after December 31st when the "holiday deal" goes away. Are people purchasing on Jan 1 going to be erroneously 'marked' with promo-priced DVRs? Are people purchasing Dec 31 going to be trying to sneak lifetime deals onto their promo-price units?

If I was a betting man, I'd bet that on January 1 the lifetime option magically reappears for all non-activated units regardless of purchase date or TSN.



mec1991 said:


> Mine was ordered the same time and arrived at UPS in Secaucus NJ 3 days ago and apparently is still sitting there.


Something really weird happened with the shipping. I get the feeling that had I not emailed in and asked shipping status, that it would still be sitting there waiting to ship. These things definitely did not ship in the order that the orders were received.

Seems like most of the time I buy something from NY or NJ funny stuff happens.


----------



## antalo

Wingershute said:


> http://www.6ave.com/shop/product.aspx?sku=TVOPREMIEREDVR
> 
> These things are flying off the shelves!


You guys are going to get the surprise of your lives ! ! ! There is NO CHEAP TIVO ! ! ! It is a gimmik to get the money in from the outragously high monthly charges. I don't remember the exact details, but ... I think there is a service commitment for one or 2 years, monthly dues are 19.95 (?) or the best 12.95 and I don't think there is a lifetime for these. If you want lifetime, you buy it for $ 250.- or so and then youget lucky and pay 199 or 299 for lifetime. I considered it, called and was explained the dirty tricks TIVO is using to get paying customers. Let's face it, the boxes are no good w/o subscribtion. DOORSTOPS ! ! The new ones work only with cable input. No sat support. I am not sure even if they have component input like the S2s. Anyway , I am dying to read your comments after you get the boxes and activate them. Currently I have 6 , one for each major (?) networks and 2 for dn. I record and then I watch, saving 20 min each hour. 
antalo


----------



## smbaker

antalo said:


> You guys are going to get the surprise of your lives ! ! ! There is NO CHEAP TIVO ! ! !


I think you failed to read the 9 pages of messages after the original post...



antalo said:


> Anyway , I am dying to read your comments after you get the boxes and activate them.


Careful, don't 'die' on us... the response from people who already got them and activated them with lifetime are already in this thread.


----------



## slowbiscuit

LOL, someone's a LEETLE too late to this thread...


----------



## lessd

antalo said:


> You guys are going to get the surprise of your lives ! ! ! There is NO CHEAP TIVO ! ! ! It is a gimmik to get the money in from the outragously high monthly charges. I don't remember the exact details, but ... I think there is a service commitment for one or 2 years, monthly dues are 19.95 (?) or the best 12.95 and I don't think there is a lifetime for these. If you want lifetime, you buy it for $ 250.- or so and then youget lucky and pay 199 or 299 for lifetime. I considered it, called and was explained the dirty tricks TIVO is using to get paying customers. Let's face it, the boxes are no good w/o subscribtion. DOORSTOPS ! ! The new ones work only with cable input. No sat support. I am not sure even if they have component input like the S2s. Anyway , I am dying to read your comments after you get the boxes and activate them. Currently I have 6 , one for each major (?) networks and 2 for dn. I record and then I watch, saving 20 min each hour.
> antalo


Most of us got Lifetime Service on our pre 11/14 $99 TiVos, as a new customer your correct but most sales of the $99 TiVos clearly state that there is a $19.95/month commitment, now.


----------



## andrews777

In case it was lost in the conversation, the $199 lifetime offer is for those with existing lifetime units. The post a while back that could only get $299 may not have paid for other lifetime services.

I have paid for 4 now, 3 prior to my first "upgrade". 

I am very tempted to buy an additional one for $99 and see what happens, but my house just shuffled around (boomerang children) and I may not need another Tivo now. (A private Tivo is not provided for those who come back.  )

Brad


----------



## tcfcameron

andrews777 said:


> In case it was lost in the conversation, the $199 lifetime offer is for those with existing lifetime units. The post a while back that could only get $299 may not have paid for other lifetime services.
> 
> I have paid for 4 now, 3 prior to my first "upgrade".
> 
> I am very tempted to buy an additional one for $99 and see what happens, but my house just shuffled around (boomerang children) and I may not need another Tivo now. (A private Tivo is not provided for those who come back.  )
> 
> Brad


Hi Brad,

That sounds like my post, that you speak of...

I've been actively following (and sometimes updating) this thread, and the many sister threads since they started.

I have two of those offers on my account, as I have two Lifetime THDs, along with two monthly THDs. Those $199 Lifetime "upgrades" are contingent upon paying TiVo's (higher) upgrade price for the Premiere (direct from TiVo).

They don't allow you to buy retail, or from any other reseller, and then use those offers, for the $199 Lifetime.

There may have been a few long-time TiVo customers, that may have been able to talk TiVo into doing it anyway, but I'm sure that if such a thing did happen, the TiVo representative would have asked that the customer not tell anybody else about it.

I did post about not being able to get $199 Lifetime on my 6th Ave $99 TiVo Premiere, purchased on 11/13, because somebody else got $199 without even asking for $199, while I escalated my case to the top, and was told that $299 was the lowest value that the computer system would even allow for a unit not purchased directly from them. The fact that it was one of the "promo" units, sold a day early, was also used as a reason why the $299 could not be overridden (as in, absolutely not possible).

I'm still looking for a reason for the $100 difference. The whole "computer won't allow it" explanation from TiVo, could be a bluff. The person who got $199, under the same circumstances, did it with one short phone call.

I spent a week calling, returning calls, escalating the matter, rinse and repeat, etc. I'd like to get the $100 difference out of them somehow.


----------



## lessd

tcfcameron said:


> Hi Brad,
> 
> That sounds like my post, that you speak of...
> 
> I've been actively following (and sometimes updating) this thread, and the many sister threads since they started.
> 
> I have two of those offers on my account, as I have two Lifetime THDs, along with two monthly THDs. Those $199 Lifetime "upgrades" are contingent upon paying TiVo's (higher) upgrade price for the Premiere (direct from TiVo).
> 
> They don't allow you to buy retail, or from any other reseller, and then use those offers, for the $199 Lifetime.
> 
> There may have been a few long-time TiVo customers, that may have been able to talk TiVo into doing it anyway, but I'm sure that if such a thing did happen, the TiVo representative would have asked that the customer not tell anybody else about it.
> 
> I did post about not being able to get $199 Lifetime on my 6th Ave $99 TiVo Premiere, purchased on 11/13, because somebody else got $199 without even asking for $199, while I escalated my case to the top, and was told that $299 was the lowest value that the computer system would even allow for a unit not purchased directly from them. The fact that it was one of the "promo" units, sold a day early, was also used as a reason why the $299 could not be overridden (as in, absolutely not possible).
> 
> I'm still looking for a reason for the $100 difference. The whole "computer won't allow it" explanation from TiVo, could be a bluff. The person who got $199, under the same circumstances, did it with one short phone call.
> 
> I spent a week calling, returning calls, escalating the matter, rinse and repeat, etc. I'd like to get the $100 difference out of them somehow.


I think this $199 PLS was in place before the new pricing on 11/14 and it took a week or so to stop giving that price to anybody. I don't think now anybody can get that price, (unless you purchase directly from TiVo). The nice TiVo CSR never told me to keep my $199 price a secret from anybody.


----------



## tcfcameron

lessd said:


> I think this $199 PLS was in place before the new pricing on 11/14 and it took a week or so to stop giving that price to anybody. I don't think now anybody can get that price, (unless you purchase directly from TiVo). The nice TiVo CSR never told me to keep my $199 price a secret from anybody.


I was asked to keep my $299 PLS price on the DL. I even honored that, until everybody, and their brother, started posting they were getting that, or better here.

It's not like I was a late straggler in activating my unit. I was one of the first wave of people to receive and activate.

Anybody else want to chime in on getting $199 PLS? My contact at TiVo won't be in until Monday, so I could use all the help I can get.

By "help", I mean others verifying that they bought a $99 Premiere, before 11/14, from 6th Ave, and were able to get $199 PLS upon receiving and activating it.


----------



## OCSMITH

tcfcameron said:


> I was asked to keep my $299 PLS price on the DL. I even honored that, until everybody, and their brother, started posting they were getting that, or better here.
> 
> It's not like I was a late straggler in activating my unit. I was one of the first wave of people to receive and activate.
> 
> Anybody else want to chime in on getting $199 PLS? My contact at TiVo won't be in until Monday, so I could use all the help I can get.
> 
> By "help", I mean others verifying that they bought a $99 Premiere, before 11/14, from 6th Ave, and were able to get $199 PLS upon receiving and activating it.


I was asked to keep my $299 PLS price on the DL. I even honored that, until "everybody, and their brother", started posting they were getting that, or better here.

LOL,LOL, LOL Don't you hate that? I read where one "lucky bastard" even got one direct from Tivo for $300.00 with lifetime service.


----------



## tcfcameron

OCSMITH said:


> I was asked to keep my $299 PLS price on the DL. I even honored that, until "everybody, and their brother", started posting they were getting that, or better here.
> 
> LOL,LOL, LOL Don't you hate that? I read where one "lucky bastard" even got one direct from Tivo for $300.00 with lifetime service.


I dislike that you're making it sound like I broke confidence with my contact over "one lucky person".

The representative's name, dept, and lots of other things that I could have disclosed, are still secure. There's a whole, long, drawn-out, story to go with my situation. But, other than the "not so special" price I got, it's still held in confidence.

When you are told that "nobody else" will get as good a price, and all reports coming in are that, the same price, is now the "standard" price, while a few come in that there's an even better price, not even requiring an effort to obtain, there's a right to be dissatisfied.

Did you just drop in, or have you actually been following this thread, and all the related sister-threads? I'd guess the former. I'm known to be wrong, though. I actually believed that $299 PLS was a special, for me only, deal (that's what I was told). Silly me.

If I took your post the wrong way, my apologies. It was hard to ascertain who, exactly, the sarcasm was directed toward.


----------



## WVZR1

tcfcameron said:


> I dislike that you're making it sound like I broke confidence with my contact over "one lucky person".
> 
> The representative's name, dept, and lots of other things that I could have disclosed, are still secure. There's a whole, long, drawn-out, story to go with my situation. But, other than the "not so special" price I got, it's still held in confidence.
> 
> When you are told that "nobody else" will get as good a price, and all reports coming in are that, the same price, is now the "standard" price, while a few come in that there's an even better price, not even requiring an effort to obtain, there's a right to be dissatisfied.
> 
> Did you just drop in, or have you actually been following this thread, and all the related sister-threads? I'd guess the former. I'm known to be wrong, though. I actually believed that $299 PLS was a special, for me only, deal (that's what I was told). Silly me.
> 
> If I took your post the wrong way, my apologies. It was hard to ascertain who, exactly, the sarcasm was directed toward.


I've not had a "reason" to call TiVo with problems, my conversations with them have been regarding activations and on every occasion I've dealt with a very pleasant CSR.

I purchased a Premier back in mid October for $99 with an HDTV purchase from a larger retailer. I activated that machine 10/24 and pricing was not an issue. I reacted to the 6th ave offer on the 13th, paid with Paypal and never "pestered" 6th ave about the pricing or the shipping. Mine was received the 23rd and I called to activate it.

There were notes in my account from the 10/24 activation and the activation on the 6th ave box was maybe 10 minutes in length. There were "NO questions" regarding it's origin or for that matter it's purchase date.

I've four life-timed machines presently.

I'd guess you may have created your own situation with "YOUR CLIMB TO THE TOP"! I've read many of the posts and I'm guessing maybe some of the comments regarding pricing were "BAIT" and it seems you "BIT" on a few!

I believe I'd consider just "QUIT WHINING" -

You like many of us got a "terrific" buy on a Premier - enjoy it!

Notice please, I've not mentioned the pricing of my two recent purchases! It's "my business" and there's certainly no way that I'd like to think that TiVo would "budge" on more favorable pricing for you!

I would imagine you'd be a good candidate for a "STONING" from maybe several CSR's!

I'd guess the "tags" on your account would make for interesting reading!


----------



## miadlor

I purchased on the 12th and ended up with the $299 LT. on the 16th
This is my 5th LT rcvr. They would not budge for the $199. Kept asking me what I paid.......Doesn't matter......If I paid $299 for the rcvr, would LT be $99? No!


----------



## OCSMITH

tcfcameron said:


> I dislike that you're making it sound like I broke confidence with my contact over "one lucky person".
> 
> The representative's name, dept, and lots of other things that I could have disclosed, are still secure. There's a whole, long, drawn-out, story to go with my situation. But, other than the "not so special" price I got, it's still held in confidence.
> 
> When you are told that "nobody else" will get as good a price, and all reports coming in are that, the same price, is now the "standard" price, while a few come in that there's an even better price, not even requiring an effort to obtain, there's a right to be dissatisfied.
> 
> Did you just drop in, or have you actually been following this thread, and all the related sister-threads? I'd guess the former. I'm known to be wrong, though. I actually believed that $299 PLS was a special, for me only, deal (that's what I was told). Silly me.
> 
> If I took your post the wrong way, my apologies. It was hard to ascertain who, exactly, the sarcasm was directed toward.


No, no I feel the same way. I have been following all the "$99-$95" threads. The $299 PLS use to be for users who had other LT Tivio on their account when they rised the cost to $399. On my account (ALL PSL) the price for new upgrade Tivo is $199 for PLS. So I can see why some are getting differance offers, but some are getting better deals then others which I don't understand (They call back sometimes utill they get the "right operator")

One guy says he upgrade his PLS Series2 with a Premier for $299 (thats box and PLS)

Its like "Lets Make a Deal". Buying a PSL is like buying a car. "Nothing is Really Set in Stone"

I would not pay $299 knowing others are getting it for $199 with the "same facts" but thats me. Good luck I hope the Gods smile at you for $199!!!


----------



## slowbiscuit

tcfcameron said:


> Anybody else want to chime in on getting $199 PLS? My contact at TiVo won't be in until Monday, so I could use all the help I can get.
> 
> By "help", I mean others verifying that they bought a $99 Premiere, before 11/14, from 6th Ave, and were able to get $199 PLS upon receiving and activating it.


There are many folks in the SD thread that have claimed such, so I don't think it's unusual to talk your way into $199 PLS if you have upgrade-eligible S3/HDs on your account.


----------



## tcfcameron

WVZR1 said:


> I'd guess you may have created your own situation with "YOUR CLIMB TO THE TOP"! I've read many of the posts and I'm guessing maybe some of the comments regarding pricing were "BAIT" and it seems you "BIT" on a few!
> 
> I believe I'd consider just "QUIT WHINING" -
> 
> You like many of us got a "terrific" buy on a Premier - enjoy it!
> 
> Notice please, I've not mentioned the pricing of my two recent purchases! It's "my business" and there's certainly no way that I'd like to think that TiVo would "budge" on more favorable pricing for you!
> 
> I would imagine you'd be a good candidate for a "STONING" from maybe several CSR's!
> 
> I'd guess the "tags" on your account would make for interesting reading!


Thanks for the laugh! I sure needed one today.

I know that my prior posts say that I started out with low-level CSRs and escalated to the top. That's what I was asked to say, regarding posting to this forum, and discussing the subject matter of 6th Ave Premiers, and PLS pricing.

I started at the top. I was already working with the top, regarding other matters, before I saw the 6th Ave Deal, and went for it.

I did call and question a few CSRs on things while I was waiting for my contact to be in their office, after I had purchased from 6th Ave.

My top-tier contact then told me NOT TO go through the regular channels, and to let them handle everything.

I have a very extensive customer file with TiVo. I'm very proud of it, as it actually contains many positive things, including positive notes from those whom I have interacted with.

I'd love to smear all the details of that in your face, but I'll have to abstain.

I wouldn't want to violate any of the agreements that I am legally bound by.

There are people on here, that I know well enough, to know that they wouldn't be on here lying about the price they got on PLS.

Come Monday, I'll be asking for an adjustment. I'll be backing up my request with what others have posted here. As long as people have been truthful, I should have no problems, as things will be verified.

All that I have been looking/asking for, has been for people who received $199 PLS, on 6th Ave Premieres, who have not posted that info, to post it. The more posts verifying that it has been made available at that price, the better...

What's the big deal? My response to somebody who popped in, threw a load of sarcasm in my face, while contributed nothing to the thread?


----------



## tcfcameron

slowbiscuit said:


> There are many folks in the SD thread that have claimed such, so I don't think it's unusual to talk your way into $199 PLS if you have upgrade-eligible S3/HDs on your account.


Thanks! That's exactly the kind of information I was hoping to get.
Do you have a link to the SD thread, that you could PM me? I'm not registered with SD, but I have heard that one of my early posts from here got quoted/cached over there somehow.


----------



## tcfcameron

WVZR1 said:


> <flame-bait snipped>
> I'd guess the "tags" on your account would make for interesting reading!


Oh, yes, they do! I almost blushed with all the positive things that were noted in my customer file.
You haven't a clue, but you made me laugh. Thanks, I really needed a good laugh today!


----------



## tcfcameron

OCSMITH said:


> No, no I feel the same way. I have been following all the "$99-$95" threads. The $299 PLS use to be for users who had other LT Tivio on their account when they rised the cost to $399. On my account (ALL PSL) the price for new upgrade Tivo is $199 for PLS. So I can see why some are getting differance offers, but some are getting better deals then others which I don't understand (They call back sometimes utill they get the "right operator")
> One guy says he upgrade his PLS Series2 with a Premier for $299 (thats box and PLS)
> Its like "Lets Make a Deal". Buying a PSL is like buying a car. "Nothing is Really Set in Stone"
> I would not pay $299 knowing others are getting it for $199 with the "same facts" but thats me. Good luck I hope the Gods smile at you for $199!!!


Yeah, just don't take 'just anybody's' word on what price they claim to have gotten. On the flip-side, I've seen enough posts from people I know well enough to feel they have no reason to pass false information.

Thanks for the encouragement and support!!!


----------



## slowbiscuit

tcfcameron said:


> Thanks! That's exactly the kind of information I was hoping to get.
> Do you have a link to the SD thread?


http://slickdeals.net/forums/showthread.php?sduid=9483&t=2374843

Although I'm not sure why I'm helping you out, since you swore up and down that we were going to get screwed by Tivo ....

happy Thanksgiving!


----------



## mec1991

Never been there, but Secaucus NJ must be a beautiful city as my new Premiere has spent the past 4 days there apparently having a wonderful time. 

Any UPS employees here with an idea why a shipment would scan into a location and then just sit there?


----------



## OCSMITH

slowbiscuit said:


> http://slickdeals.net/forums/showthread.php?sduid=9483&t=2374843
> 
> Although I'm not sure why I'm helping you out, since you swore up and down that we were going to get screwed by Tivo ....
> 
> happy Thanksgiving!


slowbiscuit, this thread made me almost fall out of my wheelchair laughing. Here is one post:

" Just had a great experience.. The tivo rep Paul I believe gave me the $199 upgrade price. I bought the machine on the 15th from 6ave.

What I did was first have a chat session and got a guy named John, here's how my conversation went:

TiVo Customer: i saw in my account i was eligible for an upgrade
TiVo Customer: the premiere for $199 lifetime
John: OK
TiVo Customer: so i went to buy the tivo at my local best buy
TiVo Customer: and i dont see the option to buy the lifetime for $199
John: Right. You would have to get the box and then give us a call via 877 367 8486 to be able to get the upgrade offer of 50% off of the new PLS contract on the new box.
TiVo Customer: i greatly appreciate your help john
TiVo Customer: will I get an email with our conversation?
John: Yes you will. Is there anything else I can help you with today?
TiVo Customer: no that is it
TiVo Customer: can i get a confriamtion
TiVo Customer: number of our conversation?
TiVo Customer: or reference number
John: XXXXXXX-XXXXXXX.
John: Thank you for using TiVo Chat and have a great day!

I called tivo and gave them my reference number. I was very polite and tried making small talk to ease the situation. I told him I had a conversation with John and he told me that I can get the $199 upgrade price if I call. Next thing I know he was reading the TIVO terms and conditions and asking for my credit card number. Before I hung up I confirmed it was $199. I also got an email confirmation with my invoice.

I say keep trying. It's possible. Be nice. Try doing small talk. I showed a little pitty that they had to work today.. "


----------



## andrews777

slowbiscuit said:


> There are many folks in the SD thread that have claimed such, so I don't think it's unusual to talk your way into $199 PLS if you have upgrade-eligible S3/HDs on your account.


That may be the key. I had pushed several months back to convert 2 of my TivoHDs to lifetime already. I paid more there then I should have, as lifetime was not offered when I first got them. I was only able to get that with a single unit.

The initial guy I talked to when I called in to activate the unit thought I wanted to buy one. When I clarified that I had already purchased it (with a deal in a TV combo on Amazon), he passed me to someone else (I forget the department/group now) and that individual quickly activated me for the $199 price.

It is rather stupid to tell us the unit won't work without activation when we are buying a lifetime sub....

Brad


----------



## atmuscarella

slowbiscuit said:


> There are many folks in the SD thread that have claimed such, so I don't think it's unusual to talk your way into $199 PLS if you have upgrade-eligible S3/HDs on your account.


I also think this has allot to do with it - but like pretty much everyone else I have no idea what the actual facts are.

All I can say is that TiVo's pricing has been very variable throughout the 5 years I have had TiVos. Deals come and go and yes some people get better deals than others. I would not get hung up on it - if you new what everyone paid for everything you would find that there are many things sold at different prices to different people.

Thanks,


----------



## overFEDEXed

alyssa said:


> Yeah, I had no intention of buying a new tivo & don't quite know what to do with it. It's a nice problem to have.
> 
> Regardless, I don't feel comfortable waiting too long to activate it. I'll either go with lifetime or monthly with the intention of moving it into my $6.95 slot eventually. Depends on if I like having 3 tivo's on 2 TV's.
> 
> I just got my unit from my 9am order on the 13th.


alyssa,

I called Tivo and they did swap my $6.95 plan from my HD to my 6th Ave pre-14th Premiere. All that she asked was 'Did you buy it before the 14th"

On my other new Premiere (BestBuy post 14th purchase) they offered me $299 Lifetime, $99 annual or $9.95 Monthly. I did ask for the $199 Lifetime after this offer but she said NO.

I called a Tivo Executive rep who had helped me get the $150 lifetime on my other two Tivo HD's. I did leave him a message. He did pretty good calling me back before so....maybe $199. We will see.

Also I tried an online chat later. That rep said that I couldn't get Lifetime on this store-bought Premiere at ANY price. That was weird. Oh well.


----------



## alyssa

overFEDEXed said:


> alyssa,
> ....
> On my other new Premiere (BestBuy post 14th purchase) they offered me $299 Lifetime, $99 annual or $9.95 Monthly. I did ask for the $199 Lifetime after this offer but she said NO.
> 
> I called a Tivo Executive rep who had helped me get the $150 lifetime on my other two Tivo HD's. I did leave him a message. He did pretty good calling me back before so....maybe $199. We will see.
> ....


Let us know if you do end up getting the $199 price.
The Cs I spoke with said the $199 price was only for units bought through Tivo. Due to other silly statements he made, I do not trust his facts.


----------



## bratan

slowbiscuit said:


> But will it be at $20/mo. after the year as Tivo says, or can you switch to another plan? This is the big unknown with these 'marked' boxes.


Can someone confirm this? I'm totally confused. I don't mind being locked into this even for 2 years, but can I switch to $14 plan after that? What if I cancel my service, or sell Tivo to someone? Would it automatically go to $19.95 only plan once reactivated?


----------



## smbaker

bratan said:


> Can someone confirm this? I'm totally confused.


I don't think anyone knows for sure, and anyone who says they does is likely just speculating. Nobody knows for sure what prices will be in effect January 1st.

So, I'll go ahead and speculate too:

1) It's in Tivo's best interest to keep charging $20, so they'll continue to do so.

2) You have the power to cut the cord and cancel the service after 1 year. So, call em up after 1 year, threaten to cancel, and they'll give you the cheaper rate (assuming there is a cheaper rate).

The above is purely rank speculation. (nevertheless, someone will cut and paste it into page 11 of this thread as if it was a fact)


----------



## pldoolittle

mec1991 said:


> Any UPS employees here with an idea why a shipment would scan into a location and then just sit there?


Fell off a box line and hasn't been found yet. Or it was smashed in the process.


----------



## mec1991

pldoolittle said:


> Fell off a box line and hasn't been found yet. Or it was smashed in the process.


You're quite the cheerful one! 

Actually, it was delivered late yesterday, double boxed and in perfect working condition. I set it up, did the update and got the guide data before going to bed. Just got off the phone with CSR "Joe" who set me up with just what I asked for; the entire call lasted less than 5 minutes. :up:


----------



## noeltykay

My Tivo Premiere finally arrived from 6Ave last night. Called into Tivo to activate it this morning and did not have an issue getting Lifetime Service. Easy peasy.


----------



## jimsims22

My 6thAVE TiVo was to be delivered on the 29th. It wasn't here by 6:30pm. I checked the UPS tracking on their website - it said it had been delivered at 4:25pm, on the doorstep. It wasn't on my doorstep. I checked the house next door, and there it was. Great work, UPS. 
Installation and activation went fine, with the $299 lifetime subscription for a multi-TiVo customer. 
Working with Time Warner was another story. I finally got across to the guy apparently in India that I needed an M-Card and probably a tuning adapter. Earliest schedule opening was three days away. We'll see if they get it right.


----------



## MegW

noeltykay said:


> My Tivo Premiere finally arrived from 6Ave last night. Called into Tivo to activate it this morning and did not have an issue getting Lifetime Service. Easy peasy.


When did you buy your TiVo? Was it before the 15th? I'm curious if I can convince the TiVo activation droid to let me have the 299.00 multi-lifetime service deal if I bought the Tivo from 6Ave today.


----------



## smbaker

FYI, just adding to the experiences reported here, received my Tivo yesterday. Called up today and gave them the reference number from the email support, took the rep a couple minutes to find my faxed proof of purchase, and activated for $299 lifetime with no issues. This was on a Premiere purchased 11/13/10.

Oh, and I called up comcast, and they actually *offered* to let me self-install the cablecard!


----------



## noeltykay

MegW said:


> When did you buy your TiVo? Was it before the 15th? I'm curious if I can convince the TiVo activation droid to let me have the 299.00 multi-lifetime service deal if I bought the Tivo from 6Ave today.


11/13.


----------



## wjdennen

My 6ave Tivo arrived. I called Tivo a few days later to activate. 

Rep asked where I bought it (I said "online").

Rep asked how much I paid for it. (I said "$99... from 6ave... before the rule change")

I bought $299 lifetime. Not a problem.


----------



## smbaker

smbaker said:


> Oh, and I called up comcast, and they actually *offered* to let me self-install the cablecard!


In retrospect, self-install was a huge mistake. It amounted to a wasted hour of my time, no cablecard, terrible attitude by comcast service, and a return back home to schedule an appointment by phone, because I refused to deal with those people.


----------



## David Platt

I got my two 6ave Premieres on Tuesday, and called that night to activate them. The CSR asked where I bought them, and I just said "an online retailer, but I bought them on the 13th before the price change." He asked if I would be able to fax in proof of purchase, and then asked me what price I was looking for. I fished for the $199 upgrade deal, but he said that was for boxes purchased from them only. I got both boxes activated for the $299 MSD price with no problem.


----------



## MegW

David Platt said:


> I got my two 6ave Premieres on Tuesday, and called that night to activate them. The CSR asked where I bought them, and I just said "an online retailer, but I bought them on the 13th before the price change." He asked if I would be able to fax in proof of purchase, and then asked me what price I was looking for. I fished for the $199 upgrade deal, but he said that was for boxes purchased from them only. I got both boxes activated for the $299 MSD price with no problem.


Did you actually buy them on the 13th?


----------



## lessd

MegW said:


> Did you actually buy them on the 13th?


If he lived in HI maybe !!!


----------



## smbaker

lessd said:


> If he lived in HI maybe !!!


FYI, mine were ordered early morning on the 13th and arrived on the 30th, and I don't live in HI, but OR. 

6ave shipped some of them very late, and 6ave is on the opposite side of the country. So yes, it's possible that a few of them were still trickling in to customers late this week.


----------



## slowbiscuit

Activated both of my Premieres for $199 PLS (I had two HDs w/lifetime already) - one was purchased from Amazon as a free throw-in with a Samsung plasma back in October and the other was purchased from 6ave on 11/13. Called tech support and a nice gal there hooked me right up, no problem.


----------



## MikeAndrews

slowbiscuit said:


> Activated both of my Premieres for $199 PLS (I had two HDs w/lifetime already) -.


WHAT do you have to do to qualify for the $199 rate? I thought it was for subs with 3 year plans. Gee, I've been a lifetime sub since 2002 who bought THREE subs this year for $299 each. I'm tempted to call to get my $100 credit.


----------



## innocentfreak

netringer said:


> WHAT do you have to do to qualify for the $199 rate? I thought it was for subs with 3 year plans. Gee, I've been a lifetime sub since 2002 who bought THREE subs this year for $299 each. I'm tempted to call to get my $100 credit.


Officially? Buy it through TiVo with an upgrade offer.

Some people have had luck by calling and were able to get the CSR to apply the $199 upgrade if they had one still available. I am sure you could start an is this stealing thread debating the topic.


----------



## jimsims22

jimsims22 said:


> My 6thAVE TiVo was to be delivered on the 29th. It wasn't here by 6:30pm. I checked the UPS tracking on their website - it said it had been delivered at 4:25pm, on the doorstep. It wasn't on my doorstep. I checked the house next door, and there it was. Great work, UPS.
> Installation and activation went fine, with the $299 lifetime subscription for a multi-TiVo customer.
> Working with Time Warner was another story. I finally got across to the guy apparently in India that I needed an M-Card and probably a tuning adapter. Earliest schedule opening was three days away. We'll see if they get it right.


Time Warner installer arrived in the appointed time window, hooked my Premiere up in about 20 minutes with the tuning adapter and cable card. All is working fine!


----------



## MikeAndrews

innocentfreak said:


> Officially? Buy it through TiVo with an upgrade offer.
> 
> Some people have had luck by calling and were able to get the CSR to apply the $199 upgrade if they had one still available. I am sure you could start an is this stealing thread debating the topic.


They aren't offering me $199 PLS even with the upgrade offer.

I guess my $1000 in payments to TiVo this year makes me small potatoes. There will not be any more.


----------



## innocentfreak

Well the $199 is contingent on having a current TiVo with lifetime that has an upgrade offer still available.

https://www3.tivo.com/store/upgrade.do

Currently I can buy a TiVo for $269 and then get lifetime for $199 since I still have a TiVo that hasn't used its upgrade offer.

If you don't have lifetime then usually you have a bigger discount on the box but now $199 lifetime option. You should be able to get lifetime for $299.


----------



## alyssa

I have two tivo's, one with lifetime. Both of them are, according to the web site, eligible for the $199 offers.
Yet, when I questioned the CSR it was a 'no go'.
you got lucky plane & simple.


----------



## smbaker

netringer said:


> I guess my $1000 in payments to TiVo this year makes me small potatoes. There will not be any more.


<offtopic rant>
Lol, $1920 to Comcast this year alone and I made the mistake of asking them for a free truck roll for a cablecard after waiting 30 minutes at their service center. I was told "Understand that we don't work for free". 
</offtopic rant>

As far as the $199 deal and eligibility, when I got it (for my 1st Premiere), it was on the Tivo website, tied directly to an update offer for my old S2 lifetime box. It went away after I used it, so there's no way for me to tell if it's still offered. AFAIK this offer was never supposed to be available to 3rd party purchased Tivos, but only units purchased from Tivo directly (for $269).


----------



## tcfcameron

netringer said:


> They aren't offering me $199 PLS even with the upgrade offer.
> 
> I guess my $1000 in payments to TiVo this year makes me small potatoes. There will not be any more.


Don't sweat it. TiVo will be performing an audit of what their CSRs have been selling lifetime service for, as well as other service plans. In the end, it will eliminate the pricing disparity.

The $199 lifetime service is (supposed to be) ONLY applicable to Premieres purchased *DIRECTLY* from TiVo, using the *upgrade* offers for other lifetime units on your account.

TiVo's system is supposed to have hard limits on how low service plans can be sold for.

For a TiVo Premiere, not purchased under the upgrade offers, and/or not purchased from TiVo directly, that hard limit is $299.

TiVo recently figured out that some of the CSRs terminals were not prohibiting entry of a subscription for less than $299, when applying lifetime service to Premieres, purchased from anyplace other than TiVo. This is how some people got their $199 lifetime.

Once the audit is complete, TiVo will know who received lifetime service, or any other service plan at a price that was sold below the hard limits.

The affected customers will be contacted, notified of the computer error, asked to provide proper proof of purchase, if TiVo don't already have it on file, and offered some options:

A: If you paid $199 for lifetime, you can pay another $100 to keep it.

B: You can change to a different service plan, if the one you have isn't within the hard limits of that plan.

C: You can cancel your service, and return the Premiere (or whatever else you decide to do with it, such as keeping it for parts, re-selling it, etc.

They will also be looking for any fraud that may have been committed by customers; Such as, giving incorrect information in response to TiVo's questions at the time of activation, providing altered/fake proof of purchase submissions, etc.

It will take time to perform the audit. Once finished, it will take time for the uniform procedures and rules to be implemented, for the above options.

It won't do anybody, any good, to contact TiVo and inquire about this, as it has not yet begun, and it will take time for TiVo to get their system to uniformly enforce the hard limits. Then it will take time to update their CSRs with new directives and procedures for handling the matter.

In the end, anybody who received any TiVo service plan, that was sold below the hard limits, will have to either pay the correct amount, or walk away.

I received this information from the highest ranking power of TiVo CS/CR.

I'm just the messenger here. Please don't shoot.

Shoot the people who have been posting about either conspiring to commit fraud, or dictating here how they committed fraud.

TiVo does have people who lurk here within TCF, and report back without every engaging in a thread or posting anything here. TiVo has been monitoring these threads for some time.

It's been the blatant talk, either committed or just conspiring, of fraud & being dishonest to CSRs when activating that triggered what is now to come.

This is all that I know at this point. It would be nice, if the first person to receive the email regarding the audit, would please post a copy here. That will be the indication that the next step has begun.


----------



## slowbiscuit

You're full of it, period. I don't care who you claimed you talked to, there's no way they are going to hit up people for more money. Will they make sure future upgrades are done uniformly? Yes (maybe?). Go after people who have already paid, when they have a completed agreement with Tivo that was read to them over the phone? No.


----------



## tcfcameron

slowbiscuit said:


> You're full of it, period. I don't care who you claimed you talked to, there's no way they are going to hit up people for more money. Will they make sure future upgrades are done uniformly? Yes (maybe?). Go after people who have already paid, when they have a completed agreement with Tivo that was read to them over the phone? No.


That agreement has no clause in it that says anything about computer error and/or fraud, and what will happen if either is discovered. That was simply the PLS agreement, and nothing more.

There are many agreements/policies that are agreed to, in the course of being a TiVo customer.

You agree to a whole booklet of them by continuing past the beginning of guided setup, after plugging the TiVo in. Did you read all of those agreements? There's a whole separate booklet that comes with each TiVo, you agreed to everything in it, by completing guided setup.

You agree to another by activating. You agree to yet some more in order to use some of your TiVo features.

Nowhere, in any of it all, will you find anything that says that if their billing system malfunctions and undercharges you, that you get to have a windfall deal as a result, which TiVo can't correct.

I already stated that I posted all the information that I was given. I know no more than that (other than TiVo often changes policies & procedures on-the-fly).

Right now, only time and TiVo's actions (or lack thereof), can prove that the information I was given, and chose to share here, was wrong (or later reconsidered).

I've already said it once: I'm just the messenger. I'm not one of the people who triggered the audit.


----------



## lessd

tcfcameron said:


> That agreement has no clause in it that says anything about computer error and/or fraud, and what will happen if either is discovered. That was simply the PLS agreement, and nothing more.
> 
> There are many agreements/policies that are agreed to, in the course of being a TiVo customer.
> 
> You agree to a whole booklet of them by continuing past the beginning of guided setup, after plugging the TiVo in. Did you read all of those agreements? There's a whole separate booklet that comes with each TiVo, you agreed to everything in it, by completing guided setup.
> 
> You agree to another by activating. You agree to yet some more in order to use some of your TiVo features.
> 
> Nowhere, in any of it all, will you find anything that says that if their billing system malfunctions and undercharges you, that you get to have a windfall deal as a result, which TiVo can't correct.
> 
> I already stated that I posted all the information that I was given. I know no more than that (other than TiVo often changes policies & procedures on-the-fly).
> 
> Right now, only time and TiVo's actions (or lack thereof), can prove that the information I was given, and chose to share here, was wrong (or later reconsidered).
> 
> I've already said it once: I'm just the messenger. I'm not one of the people who triggered the audit.


TiVo is just trying to get *you* off their back by giving you this bull. (_Sic OK I know that all the people that got the $199 Lifetime have to send the dishonest CSR a $25 check for going around TiVos system, when TiVo finds out there will be hell to pay_)


----------



## David Platt

smbaker said:


> FYI, mine were ordered early morning on the 13th and arrived on the 30th, and I don't live in HI, but OR.
> 
> 6ave shipped some of them very late, and 6ave is on the opposite side of the country. So yes, it's possible that a few of them were still trickling in to customers late this week.


Yes, I too bought on the morning of the 13th and live in OR. I guess we were the stragglers.


----------



## tcfcameron

lessd said:


> TiVo is just trying to get *you* off their back by giving you this bull. (_Sic OK I know that all the people that got the $199 Lifetime have to send the dishonest CSR a $25 check for going around TiVos system, when TiVo finds out there will be hell to pay_)


Prove it. <-- These are the two words I have for anybody that just can't help, but flame-bait me. So, if I don't post a reply to future flame-bait posts, these two words are all I have to say.

I know the difference between being fed BS in an attempt to placate me and get me off the phone, and the opposite spectrum, of professional interaction.

I can't prove what I was told will happen, will happen (or even that it was told to me). Since when does every post on TCF require proof, or verification of facts?

However, nobody, except TiVo, can prove or disprove my post.

It will take time for the audit to even be known among the lower and middle level CSRs.

What next, people posting that they called and asked about this matter, and the CSR they spoke with knew nothing of it?

That only proves that a low-level CSR hasn't heard about it yet. Big surprise. They'll be the absolute last to know, if things work their way through the ranks in the fashion one would normally expect from TiVo.

TCF: My daily source for entertainment and amusement, as the very people I am trying to give solid information, just can't help but mock me and throw virtual rotten tomatos at me.


----------



## smbaker

tcfcameron said:


> I received this information from the highest ranking power of TiVo CS/CR.
> I'm just the messenger here. Please don't shoot.


Yes, but aren't you also the one who posted a list of urgent information from 6ave and then removed it? and the guy who told everyone that Tivo was going to make up a 'special lifetime' that expired on transfer just for 6ave Tivos, even though CSRs are reading the lifetime policy out loud to customers? Also the guy who read the service policy in a different way than everyone else, concluding that Tivos purchased before Nov 14th did not qualify for the old terms?

The odds of Tivo auditing lifetime purchases and deciding to charge people an additional $100 are slim to none.



tcfcameron said:


> However, nobody, except TiVo, can prove or disprove my post.


Your post is hearsay, from a person who's frequently posted hearsay that either hasn't panned out, or has proven to be his own speculations and misunderstandings mixed with rambling disconnected facts. I understand that you seem to be trying to help, but unless you can provide some hard proof such as a directly quoted email, this isn't going to hold much weight.


----------



## slowbiscuit

I'm throwing tomatoes because you're posting a bunch of crap. Whether or not 3rd-party upgrades should be allowed $199 PLS is not clear to me (I can't find anything about this on tivo.com, but I didn't look hard). All I can say is that I called and said I wanted to activate Premieres as upgrade to my current lifetimed Tivo HDs, and that I heard I could do that for $199. I didn't lie about when I purchased them or from whom, but they were both purchased before the plan changed anyway. The nice lady gave me that deal for both.

So why is this my fault (or fraud, as you seem to imply?) And on what basis is Tivo going to try and grab $200 more from me, when their supposedly trained CSR signed me up for it?

I don't buy that you don't have anything to do with this - it's obvious that you feel screwed by Tivo and want to talk to everyone upstairs that you can to make it right. And that's fine, I might do the same. But to come here and spew this junk not knowing whether or not it would actually happen, without any proof other than hearsay, is BS.


----------



## shwru980r

How can Tivo prove that a customer deceived them to get the cheaper lifetime service? The only record Tivo has is what the CSR entered in the records. The CSR could have just entered false information to make a sale. They customer will deny they ever made the false statement. Tivo would need a signed statement from the customer containing the false information for this hold up in court.

I don't believe that the computer error excuse will hold up in court either, because the computer was a secondary source of information for the CSR. This is no different from a cash register malfunction at walmart. The item was rung up at an incorrect price and Tivo has to eat the loss.

The highest ranking power of TiVo CS/CR that you spoke with is probably in hot water over this, and is trying to come up with some way to get the money back to save their job. The legal department is never going to allow this to be implemented.


----------



## lessd

tcfcameron said:


> Prove it. <-- These are the two words I have for anybody that just can't help, but flame-bait me. So, if I don't post a reply to future flame-bait posts, these two words are all I have to say.
> 
> I know the difference between being fed BS in an attempt to placate me and get me off the phone, and the opposite spectrum, of professional interaction.
> 
> I can't prove what I was told will happen, will happen (or even that it was told to me). Since when does every post on TCF require proof, or verification of facts?
> 
> However, nobody, except TiVo, can prove or disprove my post.
> 
> It will take time for the audit to even be known among the lower and middle level CSRs.
> 
> What next, people posting that they called and asked about this matter, and the CSR they spoke with knew nothing of it?
> 
> That only proves that a low-level CSR hasn't heard about it yet. Big surprise. They'll be the absolute last to know, if things work their way through the ranks in the fashion one would normally expect from TiVo.
> 
> TCF: My daily source for entertainment and amusement, as the very people I am trying to give solid information, just can't help but mock me and throw virtual rotten tomatos at me.


Every lawyer knows that one can't prove a negative; you can't prove to anybody *today* that the sun will come up tomorrow, you can make a good guess that it will, but you can't prove it today.


----------



## tcfcameron

smbaker said:


> Yes, but aren't you also the one who posted a list of urgent information from 6ave and then removed it?


I was asked by management as 6thAve to post that. I was later contacted by the same person, who said that higher-management didn't like the use of the words "fight" or "fighting", in any context, as higher mgmt did not want people thinking that 6thAve and TiVo were actually "fighting". I pulled the post voluntarily, to try and keep the manager who asked me to post that information from getting into any further trouble.



> and the guy who told everyone that TiVo was going to make up a 'special lifetime' that expired on transfer just for 6ave Tivos, even though CSRs are reading the lifetime policy out loud to customers?


No, I stated that in the past, that TiVo had somehow applied a 'special lifetime' on TiVos won in contests. People won them, then resold them, and the new owner would find no service on the unit at all, once activated under their own account. I was simply putting it out there as something that could happen. This was some time before the new "read the lifetime agreement out-loud" procedure was implemented, which eliminated any confusion over if history might repeat itself (TiVo applying a non-standard PLS).



> Also the guy who read the service policy in a different way than everyone else, concluding that Tivos purchased before Nov 14th did not qualify for the old terms?


Who wasn't reading the service policies and coming up with their own OPINIONS on what it may mean for the 6thAve TiVos? I actually backed out of that debate, as the legalese is best left for attorneys to translate. Everybody was reading and interpreting those policies, in their own way. I was not ONE person saying it was one way, while 'everybody else' was in agreement and harmony over one alternate interpretation.



> The odds of Tivo auditing lifetime purchases and deciding to charge people an additional $100 are slim to none.


I would think that such a proposed action will have to clear a few departments, post audit, before such a thing can happen. It would likely have to come down to the audit results, cost analysis, and risk of alienating TiVo customers. Customer alienation can go both ways. There are those who paid $199 who will be upset if they are expected to pay $100 more. There are those who paid $299 (denied $199), who will approve of making things fair & balanced. Otherwise, they wind up feeling cheated.



> Your post is hearsay, from a person who's frequently posted hearsay that either hasn't panned out, or has proven to be his own speculations and misunderstandings mixed with rambling disconnected facts. I understand that you seem to be trying to help, but unless you can provide some hard proof such as a directly quoted email, this isn't going to hold much weight.


~98% of what people post here, regarding what they are told by anybody at TiVo is hearsay. Just because some of it doesn't pan out, doesn't automatically make 'reality' make a shift and all future hearsay inadmissible and/or useless.

"directly quoted email"? - TiVo prohibits posting of ANY TiVo-Customer emails. It's on the bottom of every one that they ever send out to anybody. You are asking me to place myself in a position to be sued. Even if I did it anyway, there would be people who would point out that it's way too easy to fake an email, and thus the content can't be validated.

Yes, I am trying to help. Due to some special circumstances, I have easy, direct, access to management with most companies I deal with. I can't disclose what those circumstances are. I'm legally bound that I can not disclose many things. If I could disclose them, it sure would make my life much easier, especially here. Most people can only report here what they say they were told by CSRs (I don't see you calling 'hearsay' on all those posts). I sometimes can post things told to me from the top. But, sometimes I am asked not to repeat what I have been told, and I honor any such request.

I think I covered everything properly. Can we please just wait and see what happens? Maybe I'll call my contact in a week and see if they can tell me if the plans are still on the same track, or if another direction/action has been chosen. Even then, it would still be hearsay, and more tomatos would fly...


----------



## tcfcameron

slowbiscuit said:


> I'm throwing tomatoes because you're posting a bunch of crap. <snip> But to come here and spew this junk not knowing whether or not it would actually happen, without any proof other than hearsay, is BS.


See post #325

http://tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=8263724#post8263724


----------



## tcfcameron

shwru980r said:


> How can Tivo prove that a customer deceived them to get the cheaper lifetime service? The only record Tivo has is what the CSR entered in the records. The CSR could have just entered false information to make a sale. They customer will deny they ever made the false statement. Tivo would need a signed statement from the customer containing the false information for this hold up in court.
> 
> I don't believe that the computer error excuse will hold up in court either, because the computer was a secondary source of information for the CSR. This is no different from a cash register malfunction at walmart. The item was rung up at an incorrect price and Tivo has to eat the loss.
> 
> The highest ranking power of TiVo CS/CR that you spoke with is probably in hot water over this, and is trying to come up with some way to get the money back to save their job. The legal department is never going to allow this to be implemented.


What's with all the talk about "court"? It's been my experience/observation that people who pepper their posts with "court", "sue", or "class-action", are usually just blowing steam. I'm not saying that you are. I'm just trying to better understand your train of thought.

This thread has several parallel threads. In this, and those, threads, people have discussed ways to cheat TiVo, transcribed their attempts/successes in giving TiVo false information, discussed altering receipts, and other things that, if that actually did do them, would be fraud. TiVo has a right to recover any money lost over fraudulent transactions (and possibly an additional amount for "damages").

I don't disagree that there *might* be a possibility of a CSR, or two, that may have "massaged" details to get around the hard limits on pricing. I'm quite sure that we will never hear about it, if they find that when the audit is completed.

Unless you are from the TiVo legal department, where do you think it is a good idea to say what they will, or won't, allow? At least I talked to somebody, and then posted the information from the discussion(s).

You are just stating opinion, as if it were fact.

As has been pointed out by others (to myself), even if you did talk to TiVo Legal, and then repeated it here, it would be hearsay. Hearsay is really all we can have here when sharing our TiVo interactions, so I don't dismiss all of it automatically, like others may do.


----------



## smbaker

tcfcameron said:


> I *would* think that such a proposed action will have to clear a few departments, post audit, before such a thing can happen. It *would likely* have to come down to the audit results, cost analysis, and risk of alienating TiVo customers.


You're already backpedaling. To quote your previous message:



tcfcameron said:


> Don't sweat it. TiVo *will* be performing an audit
> 
> The affected customers *will* be contacted, notified of the computer error, asked to provide proper proof of purchase, if TiVo don't already have it on file, and offered some options:
> 
> A: If you paid $199 for lifetime, you can pay another $100 to keep it.
> 
> B: You can change to a different service plan, if the one you have isn't within the hard limits of that plan.
> 
> C: You can cancel your service, and return the Premiere (or whatever else you decide to do with it, such as keeping it for parts, re-selling it, etc.
> 
> They *will* also be looking for any fraud that may have been committed by customers;


All those 'wills' in your first post are now 'would' and 'would likely' in your second post. Tivo either told you that they *will* conduct and audit and that customers *will* be contacted, or they didn't. This is why hearsay is worthless.



tcfcameron said:


> "directly quoted email"? - TiVo prohibits posting of ANY TiVo-Customer emails. It's on the bottom of every one that they ever send out to anybody.


My email correspondence from 11/22/2010 concerning eligibility for lifetime from Tivo customer support has no such disclaimer. Nowhere. I'm not even sure someone can send you a letter and compel you not to share it without a nondisclosure agreement.

This is yet another example of a generalization you have posted that has proven false. In fact, it's not even possible for you to state that 'on the bottom of every one that they ever send out to anybody' unless you are privy to every email that Tivo has ever sent. Can you not see that you are presenting statements as fact that are clearly not only not true, but facts that are impossible for you to know?

I'm beginning to think that you are a simple troll, contacting the forum every few days to spread falsehoods.


----------



## lessd

Back to the orignal tital/subject of this Thread, in case anyone has forgotten

*BRAND NEW TIVO Premiere $ 95 + FREE SHIPPING!*

It's now $90.30 at 6th AV with the coupon code given in the first post


----------



## tcfcameron

smbaker said:


> My email correspondence from 11/22/2010 concerning eligibility for lifetime from Tivo customer support has no such disclaimer. Nowhere. I'm not even sure someone can send you a letter and compel you not to share it without a nondisclosure agreement.


I have had such an NDA (more of a "do not distribute the contents of this communications" notice) attached to every email I have received from TiVo for some time now. I may have an idea why, but to discuss that would violate the terms to which I am legally bound.

This is what is attached to every email I still have from TiVo:

"This email and any attachments may contain confidential and privileged material for the sole use of the intended recipient. Any review, copying, or distribution of this email (or any attachments) by others is prohibited. If you are not the intended recipient, please contact the sender immediately and permanently delete this email and any attachments. No employee or agent of TiVo Inc. is authorized to conclude any binding agreement on behalf of TiVo Inc. by email. Binding agreements with TiVo Inc. may only be made by a signed written agreement."

I'm going to GUESS, that the TiVo personnel you corresponded with don't rank high enough, or have access to sensitive enough material, in order to require the addition of this agreement attachment.

Yes, I realize, that technically, I went against the agreement by posting the agreement itself. Everybody wants proof from me, while just about anybody else can post conjecture, opinions, and unverifiable communication transcripts... That's what I consider BS.

I'm now ceasing spending any more time going tit-for-tat with you. I'm sure that's no loss to you, since you have so many other battles to wage in other threads.


----------



## smbaker

tcfcameron said:


> I'm going to GUESS, that the TiVo personnel you corresponded with don't rank high enough, or have access to sensitive enough material, in order to require the addition of this agreement attachment.


More backpedaling. You continue to fail to understand, so I will try one last time. This is the statement you made:



tcfcameron said:


> TiVo prohibits posting of ANY TiVo-Customer emails. It's on the bottom of every one that they ever send out to anybody.


The above statement is *false*. Not only is it false, but it is impossible for any person given any reasonable (even generous) set of information to arrive at that conclusion. That has been a recurring theme of your posts, and it is the reason why you are finding that people in this forum are not believing you. I'm only trying to help here.

It doesn't matter what "rank" of person sent and email, nor does it matter the how "sensitive" the information is. The statement you made included '_ANY_' email, at the bottom of '_every one_', that is '_ever_' sent out to '_anybody_'. The scope and intent of your original statement could not have been clearer.

You are right, there is no further point in continuing this conversation.



lessd said:


> It's now $90.30 at 6th AV with the coupon code given in the first post


Everyone ought to pick up one now for spare parts.


----------



## moyekj

$74 at Amazon (sold by Midway which I've never heard of):
http://www.amazon.com/TiVo-TCD74632...R910/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1291465966&sr=8-1
Personally I'm more curious to see what happens after 12/31.


----------



## slowbiscuit

tcfcameron said:


> See post #325
> 
> http://tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=8263724#post8263724


All of which is just your opinion and/or hearsay, driven by your desire to spread FUD after you felt screwed and went on a tear with Tivo customer relations.

None of it addresses what I posted, which is that I asked for and received the activations without deception on my part, and that no one so far has shown that the $199 upgrade price ONLY applies to boxes bought directly from Tivo.

You keep harping on the possible fraud with receipt alterations etc. but no one was proposing that here, just that it was very easy to do if Tivo wanted to take a hard line on post-11/13 activations. I disclaimed more than once that I was not advocating such a thing.

I'm sorry that you felt a need to be some sort of crusader with Tivo etc. here, but what you're posting is worthless speculation.


----------



## waterchange

moyekj said:


> $74 at Amazon (sold by Midway which I've never heard of):
> http://www.amazon.com/TiVo-TCD74632...R910/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1291465966&sr=8-1
> Personally I'm more curious to see what happens after 12/31.


$70.99 at buy.com. Tempted to buy one as a spare.
http://www.buy.com/prod/tivo-tcd746320-digital-video-recorder-cablecard-400-hour-black/q/loc/111/215493017.html


----------



## smbaker

slowbiscuit said:


> You keep harping on the possible fraud with receipt alterations etc. but no one was proposing that here, just that it was very easy to do if Tivo wanted to take a hard line on post-11/13 activations.


Over in the SD forum thread I was surprised at the level of fraud advocated and those who were quite frank in their admission that they committed fraud. The TCF forums, however, seem to have a better class of person. Any advocacy of fraud (rare as it is) here is usually quickly tamped down by responsible users. For someone to suggest otherwise is a mischaracterization of this forum.

Companies are usually forward-thinking, and Tivo has demonstrated that with this whole 6ave issue. They could have taken the hard line that the units were erroneously sold and insisted that users either put up with the new terms or return them to 6ave. They didn't -- what's done is done. They deal with the Nov 13th mistake as best as possible and concentrate on tomorrow's sales not last month's. I find it hard to believe that anyone is going to bother harassing a handful of customers over a $100 difference in price.

I received the $299 lifetime on my 6ave unit, and frankly, I don't care that other people may have received a $199 deal anymore than I care that someone may have been willing to spend more time bartering at a car dealership for a better deal on a car.

What does surprise me is the plunge in price now down to $70. It's going to lead to some griping my customers who paid $95 just last week, and it shows that Tivo must be getting paid very little for these boxes if they can still be sold by a retailer for profit at $70. By comparison, (using THD prices) an instantcake is $39 and a 320gb preloaded hard drive is $129. From a spare parts perspective, it really makes sense for everyone to load up on $70 Tivos.


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## lessd

waterchange said:


> $70.99 at buy.com. Tempted to buy one as a spare.
> http://www.buy.com/prod/tivo-tcd746320-digital-video-recorder-cablecard-400-hour-black/q/loc/111/215493017.html


When one adds this to their cart the price than comes up to over $90, the $70 must be a come-on.


----------



## tcfcameron

slowbiscuit said:


> ...that no one so far has shown that the $199 upgrade price ONLY applies to boxes bought directly from Tivo.


What do you think that the people who call in, and are told $299, get when they ask why not the $199, like on the website?

People have already posted that they were told $199 was only if you bought from TiVo, through their upgrade program.

TiVo's upgrade program prices the box at $269.00, then + $199 for PLS, if you have PLS on a qualifying previous generation TiVo.

I actually don't have an issue with what I paid for PLS, anymore. I paid the proper price, since I had not bought directly from TiVo, under the upgrade program.

The issue is, that somehow an unknown number of TiVo CSRs were offering (or honoring requests for) $199 PLS for TiVos bought from other sources, which are not a part of the TiVo upgrade program (and they may not have even had an "eligible" existing PLS TiVo on their account, which is a condition for the $199 PLS).

So, each and every one who bought from sources, other than TiVo, and then received PLS for $199, did not pay the correct price.

Those who got it on the luck of the draw, on the first call, likely didn't conspire to get pricing they were not entitled to (or did, and were lucky).

Those who posted here about playing "CSR Roulette", knew they were gaming the system, but some probably thought $199 was the "correct price".

Those who posted here about buying under one set of circumstances, then transcribed their TiVo interaction, complete with the lies they used, committed fraud, if they received $199 PLS.

I'll admit, that I advised people, in prior posts, to try CSR Roulette. But, I never once implied that anybody should give false/fraudulent information.

I don't recall accusing you of anything directly. If I did, I apologize, and ask that you point me to the post I (allegedly) did it in, and I'll retract it.

...And, yes, my current opinions/positions, on matters that were posted as opinions/positions, have changed. No need to point it out.

Final note: When I say "posted here" or "people have posted", I mean the whole of TCF, not just this one, single thread.


----------



## ~kyle

tcfcameron said:


> The issue is, that somehow an unknown number of TiVo CSRs were offering (or honoring requests for) $199 PLS for TiVos bought from other sources, which are not a part of the TiVo upgrade program.
> 
> So, each and every one who bought from sources, other than TiVo, and then received PLS for $199, did not pay the correct price.


So what? Who cares? Why would you keep going to TiVo "management" concerning this anyway? I'm an existing customer and I paid $299 for liftime on my 6ave premiere, if someone was able to get it for $199 I'm not going to go crying to TiVo management about how that's not fair. If they got it, good for them.



tcfcameron said:


> "directly quoted email"? - TiVo prohibits posting of ANY TiVo-Customer emails. It's on the bottom of every one that they ever send out to anybody.


None of my emails from customer support have any such disclaimer whatsoever.


----------



## slowbiscuit

tcfcameron said:


> Those who posted here about buying under one set of circumstances, then transcribed their TiVo interaction, complete with the lies they used, committed fraud, if they received $199 PLS.


Again, this is complete BS, because there is no way to commit what you call 'fraud' to get the $199 activations for boxes purchased before 11/14. You are either eligibile for it when you the Tivo CSR checks your account or you are not. No amount of lying is going to get you that price if the rep does his/her job and verifies that you don't have upgrade-eligible boxes.

Also again, there is nothing on tivo.com (that I have seen) that says that the $199 PLS is ONLY for boxes purchased from them. All we have is anecdotal evidence that this is the case (from CSRs or whoever), but if it was programmed into the computer to not allow it as you claimed before then clearly we should not have been able to get it.

This is a simple case of CSR lotto, same as it usually is for deals like this. There is no fraud here if the boxes were purchased before 11/14, and it's ignorant to claim such.


----------



## smbaker

~kyle said:


> None of my emails from customer support have any such disclaimer whatsoever.


What he posted appears to be a standard email disclaimer attached to *some* messages that Tivo employees write. A quick google of the disclaimer text showed it posted in:

* a usenet newsgroup
* a yahoo group
* a blog
* a mailing list

Each group was public, and each of these posts was made by a Tivo employee, usually from an email address at tivo.com. Many organizations will attach these disclaimers to emails, it's standard boilerplate. It likely shows he got an email from a person at Tivo rather than a reply from the customer service system, for whatever that's worth.

It's funny seeing such a disclaimer attached to a public email that a Tivo employee made about going to see a singer at a bar (http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/rust/message/260224), but things like this are common with corporate email systems.

It's not an 'NDA', as was claimed. NDA implies agreement, and people generally know when they've signed or otherwise agreed to one.


----------



## lessd

smbaker said:


> What he posted appears to be a standard email disclaimer attached to *some* messages that Tivo employees write. A quick google of the disclaimer text showed it posted in:
> 
> * a usenet newsgroup
> * a yahoo group
> * a blog
> * a mailing list
> 
> Each group was public, and each of these posts was made by a Tivo employee, usually from an email address at tivo.com. Many organizations will attach these disclaimers to emails, it's standard boilerplate. It likely shows he got an email from a person at Tivo rather than a reply from the customer service system, for whatever that's worth.
> 
> It's funny seeing such a disclaimer attached to a public email that a Tivo employee made about going to see a singer at a bar (http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/rust/message/260224), but things like this are common with corporate email systems.
> 
> It's not an 'NDA', as was claimed. NDA implies agreement, and people generally know when they've signed or otherwise agreed to one.


About 1/3 of my EMails from people have that disclaimer attached, I never paid any attention to it until this post, I guess the senders think they are getting some type of protection, some co. after purchase send you a notice about things they think are part of the purchase, *it's not*, as two people must agree in advance of any transaction the full terms of that transaction, that why TiVo may now be reading the Lifetime stuff to people (not your lifetime but the TiVos lifetime etc). I would guess that if i got an E-Mail in error from say GM telling dealers the brake on XYZ car must be replaced and I shared that E-Mail that had the disclaimer attached I could not be prosecuted. Just look at *Wikileaks*, don't you think all that correspondence had some type of disclaimer attached and the NYT did publish a lot of it.


----------



## PedjaR

tcfcameron said:


> ...
> I have had such an NDA (more of a "do not distribute the contents of this communications" notice) attached to every email I have received from TiVo for some time now. I may have an idea why, but to discuss that would violate the terms to which I am legally bound.
> ...


NDA is an acronym for Non-Disclosure Agreement. Can't have NDA if you did not agree to keep information confidential. Somebody giving you info and adding disclaimer with/after it has nothing to do with NDA.

When you state something as a fact, rather than your opinion, people apparently tend to ask for a proof. That's should not be very surprising, and is not a sign that somebody is picking on you. But when something you state as a fact is not only obviously unprovable, but also very likely to be untrue, such as


tcfcameron said:


> ...
> TiVo prohibits posting of ANY TiVo-Customer emails. It's on the bottom of every one that they ever send out to anybody.
> ...


you appear somewhat less than a completely trustworthy source.

You also say 


tcfcameron said:


> ...
> Customer alienation can go both ways. There are those who paid $199 who will be upset if they are expected to pay $100 more. There are those who paid $299 (denied $199), who will approve of making things fair & balanced. Otherwise, they wind up feeling cheated.
> ...


I'd be curious as to how many people would feel like that, and especially how many would admit to that. "I got a bad deal, so everybody else should get a bad deal" is, IMO, not a particularly admirable way of thinking.


----------



## tcfcameron

smbaker said:


> What he posted appears to be a standard email disclaimer attached to *some* messages that Tivo employees write. A quick google of the disclaimer text showed it posted in:
> 
> * a usenet newsgroup
> * a yahoo group
> * a blog
> * a mailing list
> 
> Each group was public, and each of these posts was made by a Tivo employee, usually from an email address at tivo.com. Many organizations will attach these disclaimers to emails, it's standard boilerplate. It likely shows he got an email from a person at Tivo rather than a reply from the customer service system, for whatever that's worth.
> 
> It's funny seeing such a disclaimer attached to a public email that a Tivo employee made about going to see a singer at a bar (http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/rust/message/260224), but things like this are common with corporate email systems.
> 
> It's not an 'NDA', as was claimed. NDA implies agreement, and people generally know when they've signed or otherwise agreed to one.


I wasn't the one who originally made reference to an NDA (nondisclosure agreement):



smbaker said:


> My email correspondence from 11/22/2010 concerning eligibility for lifetime from Tivo customer support has no such disclaimer. Nowhere. I'm not even sure someone can send you a letter and compel you not to share it without a nondisclosure agreement.


My Reply (simply using "NDA", since that's what smbaker was referring to, was a simplification):



tcfcameron said:


> I have had such an NDA (more of a "do not distribute the contents of this communications" notice) attached to every email I have received from TiVo for some time now. I may have an idea why, but to discuss that would violate the terms to which I am legally bound.


----------



## tcfcameron

Blanket/bulk reply:

I draw the line at name calling. The people doing so, don't deserve my time, or information, that I would otherwise share.

As far as everything that I have not responded to, is still open-ended, or lives on without my continued input: You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.

Enjoy all the... ...whatever. I have other things to do.


----------



## WVZR1

tcfcameron said:


> Blanket/bulk reply:
> 
> I draw the line at name calling. The people doing so, don't deserve my time, or information, that I would otherwise share.
> 
> As far as everything that I have not responded to, is still open-ended, or lives on without my continued input: You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink.
> 
> Enjoy all the... ...whatever. I have other things to do.


It seems, you're "dangerously close" to the "EDGE"! You might like to step back a good bit before a "big breeze" maybe blows you "OFF" into the "ABYSS"!


----------



## smbaker

lessd said:


> About 1/3 of my EMails from people have that disclaimer attached, I never paid any attention to it until this post, I guess the senders think they are getting some type of protection


I think the bit of the disclaimer that actually matters is what disclaims the actions of the sender of the email, this part: "No employee or agent of TiVo Inc. is authorized to conclude any binding agreement on behalf of TiVo Inc. by email. Binding agreements with TiVo Inc. may only be made by a signed written agreement."

The rest of the disclaimer, the confidentiality part, probably doesn't mean a whole lot. It's legal silliness probably more intended to encourage people to voluntarily keep the letter confidential than to actually be enforceable.



tcfcameron said:


> My Reply (simply using "NDA", since that's what smbaker was referring to, was a simplification)


The appropriate thing to do if you don't know what "NDA" means is to google it rather than stating that you have one. A NDA is not a 'simplification' of a disclaimer. They're two different things.



tcfcameron said:


> Enjoy all the... ...whatever. I have other things to do.


Back to our regularly scheduled programming!

I, for one, am enjoying my $95 Tivo with lifetime. It was a good deal, and I'm glad the OP posted it and that I jumped at it when I did!


----------



## alyssa

lessd said:


> *BRAND NEW TIVO Premiere $ 95 + FREE SHIPPING!*
> 
> It's now $90.30 at 6th AV with the coupon code given in the first post


Yeah, but with the $20 buck/month plan


----------



## lessd

alyssa said:


> Yeah, but with the $20 buck/month plan


True, $20/month for now, but for parts or to see what happends after Dec 31st $90 is not much of a risk.


----------



## smbaker

lessd said:


> True, $20/month for now, but for parts or to see what happends after Dec 31st $90 is not much of a risk.


Make sure you check the other threads. There appears to be a deal in the neighborhood of $70 at buy.com.


----------



## moyekj

Just ordered via Amazon (fulfilled by ANTOnline) for $73.70 shipped mostly for a spare - hard to go wrong at that price. I will try and get $199 or else $299 lifetime on it if TiVo will take my money, else I'll just tell them I don't want service on it and perhaps wait a few months to see how things shake out. (I do see upgrade offer of $199 for PLS on my account which my S3 with lifetime makes me eligible for, so perhaps that gives me a chance).


----------



## innocentfreak

Damn you made me look. They have a XL for $213.


----------



## moyekj

innocentfreak said:


> Damn you made me look. They have a XL for $213.


 Sorry.  Just curious why the interest in XL when Premiere hard drive upgrades are a piece of cake thanks to Comer?


----------



## innocentfreak

I honestly haven't followed his threads since I originally upgraded to the XLs before we knew if they would be even possible. 

Maybe I should look again. I doubt I will pull the trigger since I don't really need one, but it is tempting.


----------



## lessd

moyekj said:


> Just ordered via Amazon (fulfilled by ANTOnline) for $73.70 shipped mostly for a spare - hard to go wrong at that price. I will try and get $199 or else $299 lifetime on it if TiVo will take my money, else I'll just tell them I don't want service on it and perhaps wait a few months to see how things shake out. (I do see upgrade offer of $199 for PLS on my account which my S3 with lifetime makes me eligible for, so perhaps that gives me a chance).


Dam !! I can never get the best deal, the best I can now find now is $83.96 on Amazon by 6th AV, (less than 6th AV has on their web sight) I am going to call Amazon management and quoit your post and demand that I get the $73.70 price, note, buy.com is now over $95


----------



## moyekj

lessd said:


> Dam !! I can never get the best deal, the best I can now find now is $83.96 on Amazon by 6th AV, (less than 6th AV has on their web sight) I am going to call Amazon management and quoit your post and demand that I get the $73.70 price, note, buy.com is now over $95


 If it's any consolation there was an indication at the time there was only 1 unit left at that price. buy.com has a very similar deal right now and at the time I was ordering, but I don't really trust ordering from them because of negative feedback. In any case I wouldn't sweat it too much as there seems to be plenty of deals popping up from time to time all over the place on the Premiere these days, so some patience will get you similar if not better price.
(BTW my Amazon order already has estimated delivery of December 9th which is very quick delivery. My previous Premiere I got from Electronic Expo a few months back for $95 shipped took almost 2 weeks to receive, in part because it was shipped from East to West coast via ground).


----------



## MikeAndrews

moyekj said:


> Sorry.  Just curious why the interest in XL when Premiere hard drive upgrades are a piece of cake thanks to Comer?


There's some comment about the THX optimization(?) software that's only on the XL. I have no idea what it does, if anything, but it's mentioned in the Premiere manual.

If it's the same THX feature as on my OLED S3s, it displays a logo and makes a sound in full surround at power up and it sent some desperately needed money to George Lucas.


----------



## ~kyle

netringer said:


> There's some comment about the THX optimization(?) software that's only on the XL. I have no idea what it does, if anything, but it's mentioned in the Premiere manual.
> 
> If it's the same THX feature as on my OLED S3s, it displays a logo and makes a sound in full surround at power up and it sent some desperately needed money to George Lucas.


I'm pretty sure the only difference is that TiVo paid to have the XL tested and certified to meet THX standards. I believe the A/V specs are identical between the two.

This was also mentioned by bfdtv over on the avs forums in the official TiVo Premiere thread.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1232191


----------



## lessd

moyekj said:


> If it's any consolation there was an indication at the time there was only 1 unit left at that price. buy.com has a very similar deal right now and at the time I was ordering, but I don't really trust ordering from them because of negative feedback. In any case I wouldn't sweat it too much as there seems to be plenty of deals popping up from time to time all over the place on the Premiere these days, so some patience will get you similar if not better price.
> (BTW my Amazon order already has estimated delivery of December 9th which is very quick delivery. My previous Premiere I got from Electronic Expo a few months back for $95 shipped took almost 2 weeks to receive, in part because it was shipped from East to West coast via ground).


I guess you did not get my sarcasm in my post as this Thread has turned into* what my price* for PLS on TP/TPXL. Unless your purchasing 100s of TPs what $10 or $20, any price under $100 is a good price for the TP.


----------



## darksurtur

netringer said:


> There's some comment about the THX optimization(?) software that's only on the XL. I have no idea what it does, if anything, but it's mentioned in the Premiere manual.
> 
> If it's the same THX feature as on my OLED S3s, it displays a logo and makes a sound in full surround at power up and it sent some desperately needed money to George Lucas.


THX optimizer software can also be found on many, many DVDs (in SD, of course, but that doesn't matter for most of what it does), some Blu-rays, and online for free, I think. See http://www.thx.com/consumer/home-entertainment/thx-certified-releases/?type=releases&pg=1.


----------



## VideoGrabber

moyekj said:


> Just ordered via Amazon (fulfilled by ANTOnline) for $73.70 shipped mostly for a spare - hard to go wrong at that price.


That's a great price, and I agree it's worth it just for spare parts.



> I will try and get $199 or else $299 lifetime on it if TiVo will take my money,


Technically, you should qualify for neither.  Even if you do have an upgrade offer on your account (as I do). TiVos purchased at these holiday prices (between Nov14 and EOY) are specifically excluded from any MSD pricing, right in the T&Cs.

Heck, I have a TP I bought directly from TiVo this summer, after calling to cancel service on a unit I returned to BB when I discovered the OTA tuner was sub-par compared to my S3. The CSR promised me the issue had been fixed, and would be rolled out within weeks, and knocked 70 bucks off a TP he'd send me to check it out. So I got it for just $200, which seemed like a good price. I passed on the PLS at $199 at the time, because frankly, I didn't believe he was correct. He certainly was persuasive though, and said there'd be no problem to add it later.

In any event, the promised fixes never did materialize (and still haven't), the unit went back in the box, and all my attempts to obtain the $199 PLS in the past week have failed. And it's not like I haven't tried, multiple times. Neither on-line or on the phone, they won't budge from $299, which ironically *would make the net cost cheaper to just buy another one from* them at $270 and get the $199 PLS that way.

[BTW, I did get one online CSR to tell me in a Chat that "_$199 PLS on my unit would be no problem_". I said great!, and should have left it at that. But I made the mistake(?) of asking for a reference #, at which point he then said, "_Oh and the PLS might be $299_".  So much for $199 PLS being "no problem". WTF??]

But if you DO manage to pull off the $199 PLS, _please_ make sure to come back and rub our noses in it. 



> ...else I'll just tell them I don't want service on it and perhaps wait a few months to see how things shake out. (I do see upgrade offer of $199 for PLS on my account which my S3 with lifetime makes me eligible for, so perhaps that gives me a chance).


That's the open issue. What will happen after Jan 1st? There's no way to know that until it happens, and frankly, speculation is rather futile.


----------



## VideoGrabber

lessd said:


> I guess you did not get my sarcasm in my post as this Thread has turned into* what my price* for PLS on TP/TPXL. Unless your purchasing 100s of TPs what $10 or $20, any price under $100 is a good price for the TP.


Les, I get your point about quibbling over a few bucks difference on $100 TPs, but I disagree that "_any price under $100 is a good price for the TP_". If that price means a minimum obligation of $240 for a year of service, I think that's a lousy price.


----------



## lsuwest

Just FYI, I recieved my 6ave Tivo Premiere last week and finally was able to call Tivo this week to activate it. I informed them that I bought it on the 13th and had no problems. I wanted the orginal monthly price and had no problems getting it. I did not inquire about lifetime. Now I have to deal with Comast to set it up....


----------



## moyekj

moyekj said:


> Just ordered via Amazon (fulfilled by ANTOnline) for $73.70 shipped mostly for a spare - hard to go wrong at that price. I will try and get $199 or else $299 lifetime on it if TiVo will take my money, else I'll just tell them I don't want service on it and perhaps wait a few months to see how things shake out. (I do see upgrade offer of $199 for PLS on my account which my S3 with lifetime makes me eligible for, so perhaps that gives me a chance).


 FYI and not too surprisingly ANTOnline botched the order. Amazon estimate for delivery was today so I contacted ANTOnline since they never indicated they shipped the unit and sure enough they responded and said unit wasn't available so the Amazon order will be canceled (credit card had not been charged yet anyway). Probably just as well as I don't really need another unit anyway as I still prefer the more reliable and robust S3 OLED unit, plus I don't have to try and get lifetime unit during this "promo" period.


----------



## MikeAndrews

lsuwest said:


> I wanted the original monthly price and had no problems getting it. I did not inquire about lifetime. ...


You can cancel the subscription or change to 3 year(?), annual or lifetime service in the first 30 days, but in any case you have a one year commitment, so I'd go with annual service at a minimum.


----------



## speed_phreak

smbaker said:


> I, for one, am enjoying my $95 Tivo with lifetime. It was a good deal, and I'm glad the OP posted it and that I jumped at it when I did!


x2! Way better than the crappy Comcast box it replaced. I haven't had any freezes or any other issues with my Premiere, yet.... I am using the SD menus though. The HD menus are a little cluttered with too much going on.


----------



## spiraleyes

Bumping this thread after I saw the Premier on Amazon for $99 a few days ago. I didn't know about this whole holiday promo situation when I saw the price. I didn't see the fine print (or at least realize what it meant) on Amazon.

I called Tivo CS yesterday and told the rep I was looking to upgrade to a Premier and wanted to ensure that I'd be able to transfer my current $12.95 rate to the new box even though I don't renew until Sept. He said it's no problem and to call them back when I get the new box for activation.

Excitedly, I ordered the Tivo from Amazon a few minutes later. Last night I got home from work and started browsing around the Premier reviews on Amazon and the forums here. I was crushed to find out that the $20/mo service was connected to all the holiday promo boxes.

My new Tivo arrives tomorrow and I'm interested to see if Tivo will let me keep my current rate plan or if I'm S.O.L. I don't want to ship it back to Amazon, but I will if Tivo won't keep me at my current rate plan.

I'll keep ya'll updated, wish me luck!


----------



## slowbiscuit

If you gave him your account info you should be ok since they keep notes of your CS calls, but I am surprised that he didn't mention the new terms.


----------



## swkenney

The TCD746320 Premiere is on deal.woot.com for $87 and free shipping.
How much would I have to pay for service if I have a Series 1 with lifetime service?


----------



## Rdian06

swkenney said:


> The TCD746320 Premiere is on deal.woot.com for $87 and free shipping.
> How much would I have to pay for service if I have a Series 1 with lifetime service?


deals.woot.com sale points to Circuitcity.com (aka TigerDirect) with a coupon code to knock $10 off the normal price of $97. The Circuitycity.com page says:

"*Service Bundle Offer: Get a TiVo Premiere box for $99.99 or a TiVo Premiere XL box for $299.99 when you sign up for a new 1-year monthly subscription commitment to the TiVo service at $19.99 per month, plus tax (renews monthly after 1 year). Early termination fees and terms and conditions apply. Offer valid through Feb 28, 2011. TiVo reserves the right to terminate this promotion at any time. "

So it seems the $19.99 pricing has been extended through the end of Feb 2011.


----------



## alyssa

I finally got around to putting lifetime on my new premier. It's one of the pre-price change units from 6th ave.
No problems, didn't even have to fax in my receipt.


----------



## Legacy777

alyssa said:


> I finally got around to putting lifetime on my new premier. It's one of the pre-price change units from 6th ave.
> No problems, didn't even have to fax in my receipt.


I'm looking to try and do this as well. When you upgraded to the lifetime, did you have a previous lifetime tivo, and if so did you get the upgrade price of $199 or have to pay the full price of $399?

I have an existing lifetime tivo and am supposedly eligible for their upgrade lifetime price of $199, but according to the live chat I had with a tivo rep, that price of $199 is only good if purchased directly through them....but wanted to see that is not the case.

Thanks
Josh


----------



## atmuscarella

Legacy777 said:


> I'm looking to try and do this as well. When you upgraded to the lifetime, did you have a previous lifetime tivo, and if so did you get the upgrade price of $199 or have to pay the full price of $399?
> 
> I have an existing lifetime tivo and am supposedly eligible for their upgrade lifetime price of $199, but according to the live chat I had with a tivo rep, that price of $199 is only good if purchased directly through them....but wanted to see that is not the case.
> 
> Thanks
> Josh


TiVo currently appears to have 3 pricing options available for lifetime service.
$399 for people who do not have an upgrade offer or do not qualify for MSD (Multi Service Discount)
$299 for people who qualify for a MSD
$199 for people with existing lifetime units through a direct purchase from TiVo only special upgrade offer.
To confuse the issue TiVo also is selling these sub $100 boxes that do not qualify for lifetime service at all and require a $19.95/mo service fee. This started with sub $100 boxes sold on or after 11/14/2010.

And to confuse the issue even more TiVo appears to not always follow their own policy and grant some people lifetime service outside of the above "rules".

Specifically some people have stated they were able get $299 lifetime pricing on a sub $100 box purchased after 11/14/2010 and some people have stated they were able to get the $199 lifetime pricing on boxes purchased before 11/14/2010 that were not purchased from TiVo directly.

I have not seen anyone state they have received the $199 lifetime pricing on a box purchase after 11/14/2010 unless they purchase it from TiVo directly.

Good Luck,


----------



## Legacy777

atmuscarella,

Thank you for the information! I suspected there'd be some various options that were out there. I will probably end up getting the $199 lifetime through Tivo since that's likely the cheapest option in the long run without having to lie or hassle with trying to get a sub $100 box upgraded.

Josh


----------



## VideoGrabber

atmuscarella said:


> TiVo currently appears to have 3 pricing options available for lifetime service.
> $399 for people who do not have an upgrade offer or do not qualify for MSD (Multi Service Discount)
> $299 for people who qualify for a MSD
> $199 for people with existing lifetime units through a direct purchase from TiVo only special upgrade offer.
> To confuse the issue TiVo also is selling these sub $100 boxes that do not qualify for lifetime service at all and require a $19.95/mo service fee. This started with sub $100 boxes sold on or after 11/14/2010. And to confuse the issue even more TiVo appears to not always follow their own policy and grant some people lifetime service outside of the above "rules".
> 
> Specifically some people have stated they were able get $299 lifetime pricing on a sub $100 box purchased after 11/14/2010 and some people have stated they were able to get the $199 lifetime pricing on boxes purchased before 11/14/2010 that were not purchased from TiVo directly.


That's the most compact, comprehensive, and coherent summary of the situation I've seen posted here. :up: :up: Hopefully that will clarify the situation for those still in the dark. Thanks.


----------



## lessd

atmuscarella said:


> TiVo currently appears to have 3 pricing options available for lifetime service.
> $399 for people who do not have an upgrade offer or do not qualify for MSD (Multi Service Discount)
> $299 for people who qualify for a MSD
> $199 for people with existing lifetime units through a direct purchase from TiVo only special upgrade offer.
> To confuse the issue TiVo also is selling these sub $100 boxes that do not qualify for lifetime service at all and require a $19.95/mo service fee. This started with sub $100 boxes sold on or after 11/14/2010.
> 
> And to confuse the issue even more TiVo appears to not always follow their own policy and grant some people lifetime service outside of the above "rules".
> 
> Specifically some people have stated they were able get $299 lifetime pricing on a sub $100 box purchased after 11/14/2010 and some people have stated they were able to get the $199 lifetime pricing on boxes purchased before 11/14/2010 that were not purchased from TiVo directly.
> 
> I have not seen anyone state they have received the $199 lifetime pricing on a box purchase after 11/14/2010 unless they purchase it from TiVo directly.
> 
> Good Luck,


I may have missed the post but I never saw anybody that purchased (not from TiVo itself) a $99 (or less) TP after 11/13 and got Lifetime Service and not lied to TiVo about the date they purchased the unit, many people that purchased the $95 TP from 6th av on 11/13 did get Lifetime Service, but for that trancation they did not have to lie about the purchase date as it was a 6av error that they sold the TP on that day for that price.


----------



## nycityuser

So does this all mean that those inexpensive Premiere units offered on eBay are eligible for $12.95 pricing only if they were originally purchased before 11/14?

How can one tell? How can TiVo tell when activating a unit?

If I buy one on eBay (I already own 3) and want to add it as a 4th will I be able to activate it online for $99/year or $9.95/month with the MSD?


----------



## atmuscarella

nycityuser said:


> So does this all mean that those inexpensive Premiere units offered on eBay are eligible for $12.95 pricing only if they were originally purchased before 11/14?
> 
> How can one tell? How can TiVo tell when activating a unit?
> 
> If I buy one on eBay (I already own 3) and want to add it as a 4th will I be able to activate it online for $99/year or $9.95/month with the MSD?


If they are being sold as "new" then they haven't been activated yet so my guess is no unless they also are giving you a pre 11/14 receipt from where they bought it. If they are used and have already been used and activated by someone then yes.

Good Luck,


----------



## nycityuser

atmuscarella said:


> If they are being sold as "new" then they haven't been activated yet so my guess is no unless they also are giving you a pre 11/14 receipt from where they bought it.
> Good Luck,


So is it the policy that you need to show TiVo a receipt to prove when it was purchased? Is that part of the TOS?

And again, when does all this come up when trying to register a newly purchased unit via TiVo's website? I mean, do I have to show a pre-11/14 receipt to my computer's camera?


----------



## innocentfreak

nycityuser said:


> So is it the policy that you need to show TiVo a receipt to prove when it was purchased? Is that part of the TOS?
> 
> And again, when does all this come up when trying to register a newly purchased unit via TiVo's website?  I mean, do I have to show a pre-11/14 receipt to my computer's camera?


When you buy direct from TiVo, it ships activated on your account with the plan you chose at time of checkout.


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## nycityuser

innocentfreak said:


> When you buy direct from TiVo, it ships activated on your account with the plan you chose at time of checkout.


And again, if you purchase a NEW unit from a 3rd party (like eBay), how does pricing get handled when you go to activate the unit online? In my case I'd be adding a 4th TiVo to the 3 I already have. I'd like to buy one on eBay for $100 or so and then pay $99/year for the service. I don't want to get stuck paying $19.99/month and that is my concern.


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## lessd

nycityuser said:


> And again, if you purchase a NEW unit from a 3rd party (like eBay), how does pricing get handled when you go to activate the unit online? In my case I'd be adding a 4th TiVo to the 3 I already have. I'd like to buy one on eBay for $100 or so and then pay $99/year for the service. I don't want to get stuck paying $19.99/month and that is my concern.


If you don't want to pay the $19.99/month you can't use the TiVo web site, you must call. Then depending on the mood of the CSR you may or may not get something other than the $19.99/month price. People have reported everything from you must pay the $19.99 price no exceptions to *for you I have a deal at the $9.95/month *to Lifetime Service at $299 (some people have reported getting PLS at $199). Some people have called back a few times till they got a CSR that would/could give them a MSD price.
Its like the lottery; so good luck.


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## nycityuser

lessd said:


> If you don't want to pay the $19.99/month you can't use the TiVo web site, you must call. Then depending on the mood of the CSR you may or may not get something other than the $19.99/month price. People have reported everything from you must pay the $19.99 price no exceptions to *for you I have a deal at the $9.95/month *to Lifetime Service at $299 (some people have reported getting PLS at $199). Some people have called back a few times till they got a CSR that would/could give them a MSD price.
> Its like the lottery; so good luck.


With practices like that and very confusing pricing plans to boot one wonders whether the company really wants to stay in business....


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## lessd

nycityuser said:


> With practices like that and very confusing pricing plans to boot one wonders whether the company really wants to stay in business....


For a new customer $0 down and $20/month may not be such a bad deal, look at what the cell phone co.s are charging for most data packages on top of the phone charge, no MSD there. You all should remember that the $20/month for two years gives you a full two year unlimited warranty, parts and labor in place of the now 90 day TiVo warranty. Even the TiVo 2 year $30 warranty is good for one exchange only. (not that i find I have ever had a TiVo go bad except the hard drive among my friends/family and myself and some of the TiVos are well over 5 years old, that about 40 TiVos)


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