# What DTV "admits" to knowing



## John T Smith (Jun 17, 2004)

New thread for reports about what DirecTv SAYS they know about the problem of lost Season Pass information and/or Random Restarts

My call, dated 01-03-2007
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4733649#post4733649


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## mxyztplk (Nov 6, 2003)

My call dated 01-02-2007

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4729555#post4729555

They know about the problem, have NOT diagnosed the cause, have NO estimate for repair.


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## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

And here's my call info, dated 12/23/2006.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4704436&&#post4704436

The bottom line is that "what DirecTV knows" is only as reliable as the CSR you are talking to, and varies greatly according to the knowledge and experience of that CSR ...

In other words ...


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## petersweston (Nov 2, 2006)

My call the other day went nowhere and i did not ask to go anywhere else(I should have) At first she said we are aware of a problem (would not be specific) Than said I should clear and delete everything (NO F***ing way i have over 400 hours of programs) Next she said something that I never heard any support person say in 5 years(I should try and reformat the hardrive?????????) Than she said i should get a replacement( Yeh right trade in my 447 hour tivo for an r15 (not while I am still breathing) Obviously this person was clueless so i hung up IMHO I dont think we are going to get a straight answer on what The F*** is up!


Sorry no date or names I may try again and log all info. Gonna shoot for the $5 credit and 6 months of showtime


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## ozlifter (Jan 4, 2007)

I just got off the phone with a representative. 
She knows about the problem, but only had one piece of advice for fixing it.

1st, with a pen and paper, write down all your season passes and wish lists.
2nd, manually go through and delete every single season pass and wish list.
3rd, unplug the receiver from the wall.
4th, after waiting several seconds, plug it back in.
5th, give it several hours to reboot.
6th, Finally, reprogram your season pass list and wish list.

Will this work? Or will this be a big waste of time for me?


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## John T Smith (Jun 17, 2004)

ozlifter said:


> Will this work? Or will this be a big waste of time for me?


Asked, and answered, in another message
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4736368#post4736368


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## John T Smith (Jun 17, 2004)

I looked at the Dates of the Start of Problem Reports

12/18 Season Pass Problems
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=332166
12/19 No Guide Data (see above)
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=332358

So the first problems, related to each other, were Dec 18 and 19... which to me, means that DirecTv did "something" on the 17th or 18th

Then, we get to the problem of random restarts

12/23 Random Restarts
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=333005
12/26 Another Random Thread
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=333247

To ME, this would indicate that DirecTv knew by 12/23 that something was wrong... and their efforts to fix the problem only made it worse... adding random restarts to the problem of bad guide data and messed up season passes

Seem logical?

In any event, I think I'm going to write a letter to DirecTv... quoting the above message threads... and giving them the HINT that they need to go back to whatever it is they did before the first problem reports to try and figure out what is causing all the problems


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## goony (Nov 20, 2003)

ozlifter said:


> Will this work? Or will this be a big waste of time for me?


From what I can gather, just doing a reboot and forcing a phone call will do as much good - I wouldn't go the route of deleting/adding all of your WLs and SPs.


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## TXTIGHTEND (Sep 29, 2006)

Well, TIVO and D* made a deal to support D* Tivo recievers for 3 years. Yeah, whatever. Until TIVO wins it pat dispute with DIS*, and D* starts to sweat, we must continue to suffer. This is the worst crap I have ever been thru with TIVO and I've been a customer since '98.


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## extension 721 (Sep 29, 2005)

My guess is this:

D*'s own dvr wasn't recording *every episode* quite the way they wanted, so they modified the guide information to make it more reliable, with the unintended consequence of making tivo's less reliable. 

They can afford to buy tivo, and should do so.


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## John T Smith (Jun 17, 2004)

Send an email to DirecTv... the more complaints, the faster they
will work on a solution (well... maybe... who knows with DirecTv)
http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/customer/howToReachUs.jsp


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## John T Smith (Jun 17, 2004)

I received a "canned" response from DirecTv... will be interesting to see what their specialist has to say... do note the "receiving more email than expected"

Write your own letter... keep the pressure on!

--------------------------------------
Dear Mr. Smith,

Thanks for writing. I'm sorry to hear about the problems you have had with your receivers. I just wanted to let you know that we received your email and I have forwarded it to a specialist who will contact you within the next few days.

Normally, we are able to get back to you within a day or two, but we're receiving more email than expected, so it may take a little longer. Our agents are working overtime to be able to help you as fast as possible, but if you need immediate assistance, please call us at 1-800-531-5000.

I know this is an inconvenience for you. I apologize for that, and I thank you very much for your patience and understanding.

Sincerely,

Janet


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## dtremain (Jan 5, 2004)

John T Smith said:


> I received a "canned" response from DirecTv


Actually, it doesn't sound "canned" to me. It sounds like a real acknowledgement of the problem.

That's a good thing.


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## John T Smith (Jun 17, 2004)

dtremain said:


> doesn't sound "canned" to me


Hmm... maybe so... now I just have to hope that there is, someday, a 2nd level response... with some real information

I find it possible they could make changes without being 100% sure the changes would not cause problems, but I just find it hard to believe that they would make changes and then claim later they had "no idea" of the problem cause

If they DID make a change in the guide data, and problems started right after, it would seem clear to ME that what they did is the cause of the problem

Oh well... large programming teams (of which I was part of in the past) have to be VERY careful that everyone is kept up to date on what each team member is doing... or it is easy for someone to make a small change "here" which has a large consequence over "there" and then everyone has to scramble to figure out how to fix the problem (which is not always as simple as it might seem, once data is corrupted)


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## tem (Oct 6, 2003)

John T Smith said:


> I looked at the Dates of the Start of Problem Reports
> 
> So the first problems, related to each other, were Dec 18 and 19... which to me, means that DirecTv did "something" on the 17th or 18th


I had the same problem a month ago and others have seen it since early November.


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## skodises (Jan 3, 2007)

Just got a similarly-worded canned message from DirecTV. "Sorry for the inconvenience", but no acknowledgement of any kind that the problem is a: theirs to fix, or b: being addressed as affecting a relatively large number of their customers. Occam's Razor makes a strong case for it not to be a simultaneous hardware failure for so many of us with products from different manufacturers and of different ages.

It's not an inconvenience, dammit: it is a wholesale disruption of the services I've been paying for for a number of years now. It'll be interesting to see this episode become a study for some MBA program of how a business implodes, in the fullness of time: my money has it that this is D*'s "New Coke" debacle.


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## roehrle (Feb 8, 2004)

I sent an e-mail over 24 hrs ago and have not received a reply... I guess they are really getting swamped ??
When my tivo reboots my r15 is not effected. Looks like they are playing games with tivo users ???


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## petersweston (Nov 2, 2006)

extension 721 said:


> My guess is this:
> 
> D*'s own dvr wasn't recording *every episode* quite the way they wanted, so they modified the guide information to make it more reliable, with the UNINTENDED consequence of making tivo's less reliable.
> 
> They can afford to buy tivo, and should do so.


I say HAH!! To UNINTENDED HAH!! HAH!! IMO ITS INTENDED. If someday we can prove it Class action I say!!


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

I have four DirecTiVo boxes and haven't seen any problems. My boxes are all hacked. Does that make a difference?


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## goony (Nov 20, 2003)

It shouldn't make any difference, but my 4 hacked boxes have seen minimal problems (only 2 instances of missed recordings, one on each box).

Since nobody has clear info as to what is causing the issue it is only speculation at this point, but it does _seem_ that the hacked boxes aren't affected as much.

From other posts in the DirecTV HD forum it would seem that that HR10-250 boxes had this issue cropping up sooner than the standard def DTivos.


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## petersweston (Nov 2, 2006)

Arcady said:


> I have four DirecTiVo boxes and haven't seen any problems. My boxes are all hacked. Does that make a difference?


sometimes yes and sometimes no. Arcady are any of your SP's off of local channels?


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

Many of my SP's are for shows on local channels. But not many local channels are playing new episodes right now for shows I watch.


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## bengalfreak (Oct 20, 2002)

Four hacked DTivos and so far no missed recordings. My Tvlogs were growing at an exponential rate however. I think the reason that hacked DTivos are not having anywhere near as many problems is that most of them are already automatically rebooting once or twice per week in order to avoid the nag screen to make a daily call.


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## old_school_blue (Sep 25, 2005)

I also wrote to DirecTV this morning. I've been having the same problems that everyone else is reporting. I have 4 TiVo's (one HR10-250). I've seen season pass problems on three of them. The 4th is currently out of service. 

Last week, my wife's soap didn't record. When I looked, it showed no episodes scheduled, and reported the "someone modified" message for the missing episode. We have been remodeling the house, so some rooms have been out of operation for a while. Since that TiVo had been in the closet for about 6 months, and I had just reinstalled it, I figured it was a problem with the unit. I did the clear all programming option. That took about an hour, but it did not help. I set up a manual recording for the time slot of the Show. 

Then, I looked at the programming on my HR10-250, and found similar problems. Last night, the HR10-250 had no episodes scheduled for any of my season passes. I forced a phone call, and the machine went into some mode processing the data. I eventually turned the TV off, and left it to continue processing. I looked again this morning. All SP's now look normal again. 

In addition, I am seeing reboots on all 3 active machines. I have had to put the 30 second skip in several times in the past few weeks. 

Hopefully, if enough people write or call, they will begin to realize the impact of whatever went wrong.


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## roehrle (Feb 8, 2004)

The fact that people are having multiply units going out at the same time eliminates the possibility of HD failures. This has to be something with D*


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## rbreding (Dec 12, 2004)

bengalfreak said:


> Four hacked DTivos and so far no missed recordings. My Tvlogs were growing at an exponential rate however. I think the reason that hacked DTivos are not having anywhere near as many problems is that most of them are already automatically rebooting once or twice per week in order to avoid the nag screen to make a daily call.


You have to reboot to avoid the nag screen ? Man....I have DirecTiVos that have been up over 40 days without "1" nag screen. Maybe you should try fakecall.


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## McGurk (Jan 8, 2007)

I am glad I found this online place that discusses this issue. I was going to call Directv but first figured that people would be talking about it on the internet somewhere. I see that I am not the only one with problems. No way do I want to touch a newer Directv recorder as my brother has one and it is pure crap.

Here is what I just sent to them in an email+
+++

When is DirecTV going to address the issue of the Tivo-based DVRs rebooting and missing the recording of programs? This has been going on for a few weeks.

I would like a formal response to this specific question and not a canned response.

The reason that I prefer DirecTV is the Tivo-based DVRs and I have four of them on my account. If DirecTV were to suggest that I replace all of them with Directv's newest non-Tivo DVRs to fix this issue then I would insist that I instead replace them all with Dish DVRs and Dish Network service.

Do you read me DirecTV? Please fix this issue or at least give me a timeframe when it will be fixed.

Thanks,

Larry McGurk


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## chrishicks (Dec 31, 2003)

I have 2 standalone Tivos(DTS2 + S3) arriving tomorrow. I subscribe to both DTV and Comcast service. if they don't fix this issue soon I'm out with DTV and will make Comcast my only provider in my house. I want my Tivo and if D* doesn't want me to use my DTivo I say screw them, they don't deserve my $.


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## rogrrr (Jan 17, 2004)

I finally called DTV 2 days ago, at my wife's urging, to "register" our complaint. After being transfered and put on hold with out warning, I finally got to talk to some dude.

Here's the thing: The next morning, I noticed that both feeds were on the same channel- one of those Directv info channels. I checked the To Do list and everything seems to be in order, ie: no dreaded "Somebody in your household changed the Season's Pass" msgs. And the WishLists are working. I didn't do a thing. If the R10 rebooted, I'm not aware of it. 

So...I'm keeping my fingers crossed...


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## o2bonn (Dec 23, 2005)

I noticed the same thing - both channels on 201. I went away for Christmas, came back on the 27th and found my HD tivo box hung up in a reboot. It sort of burned an image in my plasma. As you can imagine, I was PISSED. I calld D* and *****ed. A level 2 tech agreed to credit me for $20 for 12 months. I managed to condition the burn out. And, two days ago I got 6.3b.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

Why would you leave your TV on while you went away for Christmas?


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

Exactly. Obviously the TiVo needs to be left on (it never turns off unless unplugged) but never leave a TV on regardless of its type.


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## goony (Nov 20, 2003)

Arcady said:


> Why would you leave your TV on while you went away for Christmas?


The cat turned it on to watch and didn't turn it off.


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## ttodd1 (Nov 6, 2003)

o2bonn said:


> I noticed the same thing - both channels on 201. I went away for Christmas, came back on the 27th and found my HD tivo box hung up in a reboot. It sort of burned an image in my plasma. As you can imagine, I was PISSED. I calld D* and *****ed.


And you were pissed at DTV??? You left it on (or your cat) and blame them?


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## Markman07 (Jul 18, 2001)

ttodd1 said:


> And you were pissed at DTV??? You left it on (or your cat) and blame them?


Oh my I am soooo sorry, I can't help it. I haven't laughed this hard in a long time. I almost feel guilty. The cat turns on the TV and .... oh I can't go on.


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## goony (Nov 20, 2003)

They were showing "Puss N' Boots" on one of the adult channels... the cat was quite miffed (aka "pussed off").


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## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

o2bonn said:


> I noticed the same thing - both channels on 201. I went away for Christmas, came back on the 27th and found my HD tivo box hung up in a reboot. It sort of burned an image in my plasma. As you can imagine, I was PISSED.


Did you leave the TV on with the Yule Log running, thinking that would keep the house warm while you were away?



o2bonn ... I'll give you a lot of credit if you make it back into this thread after some of the replies, mine included, but I need to know: WHY? Why would you leave your plasma on while you went away?!


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## Markman07 (Jul 18, 2001)

drew2k said:


> WHY? Why would you leave your plasma on while you went away?!


The puddy cat turned it on while he was gone! (mentioned above) . Those crazy cats. I just called Directv because my dog just ate my remote and am asking for a large credit.


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## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

Markman07 said:


> The puddy cat turned it on while he was gone! (mentioned above) . The crazy cats. I just called Directv because my dog just ate my remote and am asking for a large credit.


Yeah - mentioned by someone ELSE, not by o2bonn...


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## jonbig (Sep 22, 2003)

o2bonn said:


> I noticed the same thing - both channels on 201. I went away for Christmas, came back on the 27th and found my HD tivo box hung up in a reboot. It sort of burned an image in my plasma. As you can imagine, I was PISSED. I calld D* and *****ed. A level 2 tech agreed to credit me for $20 for 12 months. I managed to condition the burn out. And, two days ago I got 6.3b.


Why did you leave your plasma on for more than two days?


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## Jon J (Aug 23, 2000)

Markman07 said:


> I just called Directv because my dog just ate my remote and am asking for a large credit.


You should calm down since this too shall pass. It may take a day or two, though.


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## rogrrr (Jan 17, 2004)

Well, folks, so much for keeping my fingers crossed. Sometime today, probably in the PM, the *To Do List * _magically_ transformed into the *To* *Don't* *List*. I missed the beginning of the Daily Show- not a big deal since it replays numerous times but then we decided to investigate and discovered that _everything_ was gone, including all the big Thurs night shows. When we looked at the list earlier today, everything was hunky-dory. What the F**k happened in the intervening hours?? I was home for the better part of the day, so I'm quite certain there was no re-boot. The only things that didn't vanish (from the To Do List) are the manual recordings.


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## bbristow (Jan 15, 2003)

Last night, I was waiting to manually add time to "The Simpsons" since I noticed it was going to start late due to ball game. The recording NEVER started, even though it was on "To Do" list on Season Pass. Had to record it manually. Did anyone else have this problem?


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## Gordon Gekko (Apr 3, 2005)

Same thing happened here. Two weeks ago had the problem with certain season passes not being recorded, gave it a couple of days and it fixed itself. Then tonight I saw that the same thing was going on, I specifically checked the to do list and Two and a Half Men was listed to record. I went to check it 5 minutes after it started and it was not recording.

So I came back here and read all of the baloney that Directv was telling everybody, I decided to call to add to the list of disgruntled customers. They bumped me up two levels, the rep said that I could either do a reboot, if that didn't work I could erase all of the SP's and then put them back in. He took down my email address saying Directv was actively trying to fix this and they would email me when they solved the problem.

I'd like to call into retention and get some sort of a credit but I doubt I will considering I am already receiving a credit from another screw up and I don't think they allow 2 credits at once.

At this point I don't know what to do, the bad thing is even shows that say they will record don't record, so you can't even manually put something in to record.


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## mitchb2 (Sep 30, 2000)

dtremain said:


> Actually, it doesn't sound "canned" to me. It sounds like a real acknowledgement of the problem.
> 
> That's a good thing.


It's word-for-word the same response I got when I emailed telling them I had distorted audio on local networks. So yes, it is quite canned.


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## rogrrr (Jan 17, 2004)

Gordon Gekko said:


> At this point I don't know what to do, the bad thing is even shows that say they will record don't record, so you can't even manually put something in to record.


Really? The jury is out for me, I'll see if it records my manuals that I set up awhile back.


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## Stutabaker (Jan 11, 2007)

I sure the cable companies would love to get the information on DirecTV's problems. Anyone have a good contact?


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## unicornpegasus (Jan 8, 2007)

I and my father (2 seperate households, 2 seperate D* accounts, same Tivo glichtes/problems [random reboots, lost to do lists, sluggish menus and remotes, freezing up]) both called tech support and were both told it's a software issue they _are_ aware of and _are_ in process of trying to fix with an eta of 2 days, 2 weeks, or several months. In other words, there's no eta at all. Very helpful. (These were both the most recent calls we made. Prior I had called 3 times each getting the "I've never heard of this" response.)

He was offered $5 off his bill for 3 months for the inconvince, I was told there is no compensation program in place and I won't get any money back for the hassle. I will be calling them back tonight.

The Tech that came out to our house yesturday said he hadn't heard of any issue but another of his customers had similar if not the same symptoms and we should unplug all the phone lines unless we need to use PPV or NFL Ticket and then reformat all of the hard drives since that fixed the other customer's problems. And if that doesn't solve it get the DVR's. He has both DVR's and Tivos and has had no problems with the DVRs. I'm so very, very SICK of them trying to get us to switch to their shoddy DVR's.


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## ironchef (Dec 27, 2002)

Is it just me or is dtv perhaps upgrading our Tivo units to give them the same level of reliability their non-Tivo boxes have???


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## NFLnut (Apr 22, 2000)

ironchef said:


> Is it just me or is dtv perhaps upgrading our Tivo units to give them the same level of reliability their non-Tivo boxes have???


PLEASE .. NO!!

The HR20 also serves as a fine boat anchor!


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## Billy Bob Boy (Jul 25, 2004)

NFLnut said:


> PLEASE .. NO!!
> 
> The HR20 also serves as a fine boat anchor!


Also with holes cut in the sides and placing cheese in it it makes a great electric mouse trap


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## Tamika24 (Apr 26, 2005)

I can't post the link as I do not have enough posts here yet, but there is a recent article on ZDNet about our problem. You can find it by going to Google News and typing in DirecTV and Tivo. Brief excerpt/commentary:
DirecTV spokesman Robert Mercer says that he is aware of the problem and alleges that the problem should be fixed by this evening.
I agree that it *should* be fixed by this evening (it *should* have been fixed a long time ago), but whether it will be is another question as far as I am concerned.


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## snoop (Oct 10, 2002)

Ugh...next time I have a problem i'm checking here first.

We started having this problem on all three of our directivo's last month and because I saw a few momentary power blips I thought it was being caused by low voltage or momentary outages. Our old series 1 units would do weird things when they got a power blip.

Figuring a problem with all three units must be power related, I just blew $250 on three UPS's for the three locations to solve a problem I didnt really have.

Never occurred to me that dtv would have screwed something up that would have persisted for weeks on end. 

This problem isnt completely new though. I posted about it months ago after doing some research and finding a number of threads with the same symptoms. A program doesnt record and when you check the recording history it says the program didnt record because someone modified the season pass. Which of course didnt happen. You can see stuff in the 'live tv guide' but you cant look it up in 'pick programs to record' or in 'view upcoming episodes'. Its there, but not indexed.

For those troubleshooting, I've 'cleared and deleted the to do list and guide information' and reentered the season passes on two of them, which actually seemed to make it worse, but that seems coincidental with others reporting an increase in problems in late december. I've redone guided setup. Nothing seems to be a permanent fix.

Called directv and they gave me a $20/mo six month credit and advanced tech support told me they have absolutely no fixes or short term workarounds, but are working on a fix that they hope to complete by the end of this month (january).

I stopped short of asking them to replace the three directivo's with r15's, as I still havent heard a dang good thing about them.


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## sher (Feb 24, 2002)

We have 3 directivo units, which it looks like we will keep for a while since I refuse to pay 300.00 for a pos new hd box. 

Anyhow, none are hooked up to phonelines and its been 225 days. None of us have had an issue. Looks like I'll keep the phone lines off in case its software being downloaded. 

Problems with the old boxes, new boxes, I have been a customer since 2000, and am very disappointed in the direction Directv has gone. Very sad.


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## goony (Nov 20, 2003)

snoop said:


> For those troubleshooting, I've 'cleared and deleted the to do list and guide information' and reentered the season passes on two of them, which actually seemed to make it worse, but that seems coincidental with others reporting an increase in problems in late december. I've redone guided setup. Nothing seems to be a permanent fix.


Looks like DirecTV un-did whatever caused the problem (begin reading here) - the issue seems to be corrected for the moment. It is suspected that the reversed whatever they did to the guide data that caused these issues to begin with.

Now we'll have to wait and see if there is some kind of forthcoming software update that will permit the units to be able to handle whatever it is that they were trying to do in the first place.


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