# Sold Out Tivos



## Justin Thyme (Mar 29, 2005)

Anyone else run into Tivo shortages? Or are your local stores all well stocked. I am wondering if we are just having a local shortage or if this is more broadly based.

I got caught. Naturally, my sister let's me know at the last minute that they need another Tivo due to them becoming addicted to the Tivo way and now refusing to watch the other TVs in the house without Tivo. 

In a mocking tone that only sisters can achieve, she asked me why I gave her family heroin.

OK- so too late to go online, off to Compusa but sold out of all 40 hour units (snagged a 160GB drive at 25cents/gig though). Compusa online said they had them in stock, ok so when you need their inventory system most, it is on the fritz. Ok, so I drive to two other stores. NO 40 Hour Tivos in my city's Compusa. Guess that free promotion kind of wiped them out a little early.

No sweat, Go to BestBuy and their are tons of people in the aisle looking at the Tivo videos and trying to make up their mind. Fine. 4 Tivos with 40GB left, so I snag that one. 

At least it wasn't as bad as the poor bastards who were waiting from early morning for the XBox 360's.

Only this device is not this year's model nor is it last year's model. Amazing times.


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## peteypete (Feb 3, 2004)

I think 140s are sold out at all BBs, and it looks like amazon is using target to fulfill some orders, so it looks like the pipeline is getting cleared out.


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## lajohn27 (Dec 29, 2003)

As noted in another thread.. the higher capacity units are appearing to NOT be restocked in any meaningful way throughout the country.

For example.. TIVO.COM even no longer sells the 300 Hr. Humax, the 140 Hr. TIVO, or the 80 Hr. Humax DVD unit.

Those same units are getting harder and harder to find in the retail channels as well.

The last time this happened was during the switch from the previous 240 series two units to the 540 series 'nightlight' series two boxes.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

CES should be interesting, no?


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## smark (Nov 20, 2002)

Crapload around here.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

lajohn27 said:


> As noted in another thread.. the higher capacity units are appearing to NOT be restocked in any meaningful way throughout the country.
> 
> For example.. TIVO.COM even no longer sells the 300 Hr. Humax, the 140 Hr. TIVO, or the 80 Hr. Humax DVD unit.
> 
> ...


40 hour TiVos in BB today and 40 hour DVD humax models. One 80 hour TiVo

yep the high capcity are clearing out. makes me look forward to 1st half of next year when you have the low end series 2 along side the high end Cable card unit


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## audiocrawford (Oct 19, 2005)

Wow, every store in my area has stacks and stacks of 40hr units.

I'm really curious about TiVo's manufacturing. I just went through several new 140 units (two defectives...grrr...) from vendors on opposite sides of the country, and they all were manufactured in the same two-week period in 2004.

Then the 140 unit disapeared from the TiVo website, replaced by the Humax 300HR. I made a post about it, and a day or two later it went away and currently the three featured models are the 40HR, the 80HR, and a DVD unit. I'm curious how much of the marketing is based on what they have for existing inventory.

AC


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## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

The Best Buy stores in my area (L.A.) have stacks of boxes, too. Though they seem to be selling, I don't think there is any danger of them running out.

Amazon seems to be selling a lot. The 40-hour box is currently #15 on the electronics top-seller list. They're giving 5% off the $169.99 price, for a net of $11.49 after rebate. Free standard shipping, too, and you still get it by Christmas.


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## Justin Thyme (Mar 29, 2005)

ZeoTiVo said:


> yep the high capcity are clearing out.


 Huh- opposite here. They had 80 hour units or Tivo DVD burners with 40 hours, but not 40 hour units. At BB they had many more higher capacity units than low. I think Compusa stores in my city must have way underestimated reaction to their "free Tivo" promotion.


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## lajohn27 (Dec 29, 2003)

My bets:

- The hardware inventory reductions thru attrition and not restocking are planned.

- In addition to the cablecard HD TIVO we keep hearing so much about... There will be a new higher capacity analog box.. loosely based on the Taiwan hardware.


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## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

lajohn27 said:


> My bets:
> 
> - The hardware inventory reductions thru attrition and not restocking are planned.


While I agree with your basic premise, there is an another possibility: TiVo was scaling down production earlier in the year under Ramsay. Rogers, however, has decided to go on a subscription drive. Since the change came late in the year, they had to quickly ramp up production. So they dropped the 140, focused on the 40 for retail and the 80 for their new analog cable partners (with the leftovers going to retail). Though they didn't make a lot of the 140s, by dropping them the manufacturer could drop one production changeover (drives, testing, packaging), as could the printer of the boxes, and so on. It probably allowed them to produce a lot more 40s.


> - In addition to the cablecard HD TIVO we keep hearing so much about... There will be a new higher capacity analog box.. loosely based on the Taiwan hardware.


Considering the strategic shift toward the analog cable market, I wouldn't be surprised to see a dual-tuner analog box sometime next year. Though I doubt they would announce that until it was actually shipping.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

ChuckyBox said:


> Considering the strategic shift toward the analog cable market, I wouldn't be surprised to see a dual-tuner analog box sometime next year. Though I doubt they would announce that until it was actually shipping.


that is a read that can make sense as well. Though I think they are headed to a dirt cheap or free Analog 40 or 80 hour TiVo and dual tuners just would not fit dirt cheap. 
I imagine the higher end Cable card TiVo with dual tuners will work with those who only have extended basic cable on Analog with no set top box.


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## Justin Thyme (Mar 29, 2005)

What surprizes me is how stubborn that analog segment is.

My sister and one of my brothers are on analog and seem at least to me to be almost irrationally insistent about not wanting/ needing a cablebox. Cable to them is appealing only because it is better reception and a few more channels than over the air. They simply aren't interested in more, and have become even more deeply entrenched in their opinion due to their use of Tivo to magnify the amount of interesting content available at any time.

Although this market seems to me to be very price sensitive, Tivo can be a competitive alternative for analog users tempted by the amount of content available if they converted to digital.


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

My local Costco had dozens of 140-hour models on the shelf this evening.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

Justin Thyme said:


> What surprizes me is how stubborn that analog segment is.
> 
> My sister and one of my brothers are on analog and seem at least to me to be almost irrationally insistent about not wanting/ needing a cablebox. Cable to them is appealing only because it is better reception and a few more channels than over the air. They simply aren't interested in more, and have become even more deeply entrenched in their opinion due to their use of Tivo to magnify the amount of interesting content available at any time.
> 
> Although this market seems to me to be very price sensitive, Tivo can be a competitive alternative for analog users tempted by the amount of content available if they converted to digital.


while I do not think I am irrationally entrenched, I saw nothing in digital that I wanted save for HD and that I can wait for. Not so much price sensitive as looking at the value in my case. For less than the monthly cost of going to digital and renting the cable boxes and DVRs I have 4 SA TiVos that also do HME and TTG
and pull off the kind of content I want.

Now I do add in Netflix to get the movies and that way get them at DVD release date instead of VOD release. so that changes the cost but still I just hook the cable up to the TiVo and have no hassles.

I am another one that just does not see the allure of digital the way it is structured now by the cable companies and the way they pushed cable card away.


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## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Let me know which Best Buy stores you see that are sold out. Our information shows that they all have plenty of stock (to go along with the free Three-Month Gift Card promotion they are currently holding).

Best regards,
Stephen


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## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

TiVoOpsMgr said:


> Let me know which Best Buy stores you see that are sold out. Our information shows that they all have plenty of stock (to go along with the free Three-Month Gift Card promotion they are currently holding).
> 
> Best regards,
> Stephen


Best Buy may have plenty of stock, but apparently tivo.com doesn't. You're out of the 40-hour and the Humax DVD boxes. Amazon ran out of the 40s, too.

I thought the big guy said you had sufficient inventory for the holidays.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

Justin Thyme said:


> What surprizes me is how stubborn that analog segment is.
> 
> My sister and one of my brothers are on analog and seem at least to me to be almost irrationally insistent about not wanting/ needing a cablebox.


You consider it irrational.

I love the fact that all of my stuff has cable ready (analog) tuners in it. I have the cable split a bunch of times and have 2 Tivos, a hard-drive/DVD recorder, my TV, and in the past, a VCR connected. That's just in my room -- downstairs has more.

The DirecTivos, with their dual tuners, were the first thing that made me ever even consider satellite. (2 DirecTivos would pretty much cover the same as I have now, at least for most uses.)

I really want to see the dual-tuner cable card Tivo too, but I hope it'll have dual analog tuners too.

If ALL of the channels that I watch went digital, then obviously I'd prefer cable card rather than a box. As it is now, the cable box's added value is relatively low to me, especially since I'd need to not only get the box, but go up another significantly expensive tier in cable rates, for only a couple of channels that I care about. I still have (and probably will again in the future) tried digital cable when they had special short term deals, but I stopped it as the deal ran out.

As a box-hater, I admit I'm fairly intrigued by the $90 HD tuner box from radio shack. If standalone Tivos could control it, I'd probably get one immediately just to play with (for the PBS multiple channels, at least).


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## DCIFRTHS (Jan 6, 2000)

This is a shot of one of the smaller BB stores in my area (there are four of them). The picture only shows half the wall. It was much higher (with TiVos) a few weeks ago.

Pic is from a camera phone and digitally zoomed, so no comments on how bad the quality is 

Click Here.


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## LBCABob (Apr 21, 2001)

An observation:

This thread would have more meaning if those posting had the "location" part of their logon information filled in (at least the state).


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## mike3775 (Jan 3, 2003)

Like HD, some people prefer to not have to pay cable companies even more money just to watch TV.

I know for a fact if Comcast were to move every single channel to digital and not offer analog, alot of my friends would simply be buying alot more DVD's of TV shows, and they would also pirate others as well to watch.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

mike3775 said:


> I know for a fact if Comcast were to move every single channel to digital and not offer analog, alot of my friends would simply be buying alot more DVD's of TV shows, and they would also pirate others as well to watch.


That day is coming... Comcast drops two more channels from my analog line-up next week. Personally, I'd be fine with OTA. I might miss a few shows from cable but I'd get over it. Not to mention, we've already started watching most TV shows via Netflix and only watch news and sports via cable/TiVo.


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## mike3775 (Jan 3, 2003)

davezatz said:


> That day is coming... Comcast drops two more channels from my analog line-up next week. Personally, I'd be fine with OTA. I might miss a few shows from cable but I'd get over it. Not to mention, we've already started watching most TV shows via Netflix and only watch news and sports via cable/TiVo.


Exactly, Iforgot about renting stuff as well. They would do that as well I imagine.

I have digital, but if the rates keep going up, I'm going to drop it in a heartbeat and go to sateelite(as long as they do not raise their rates)


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## jmoak (Jun 20, 2000)

TiVoOpsMgr said:


> Let me know which Best Buy stores you see that are sold out. Our information shows that they all have plenty of stock (to go along with the free Three-Month Gift Card promotion they are currently holding).
> 
> Best regards,
> Stephen


Best Buy
1900 Evans Rd, Melbourne, FL 32904

Visited yesterday.
After finding none of any kind on the floor, a sales drone rolled his eyes and said, "YOU want one, TOO?" and told me they had sold out of 40 and 140hr boxes and had a "few" 80's in their computer but he had no idea where to find them and coldly suggested I come back tomorrow.

btw,
Congrats on the estimated 200,000 dtivo sales in the month of october.
Not too bad....


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## nhaigh (Jul 16, 2001)

jmoak said:


> Congrats on the estimated 200,000 dtivo sales in the month of october.
> Not too bad....


Isn't that down to panic buying?


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## JohnTivo (Dec 2, 2002)

Panic buying or not, it shows that people still want a DirecTV DVR powered by Tivo.


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## neekoh (Jan 2, 2005)

Justin Thyme said:


> What surprizes me is how stubborn that analog segment is.
> 
> My sister and one of my brothers are on analog and seem at least to me to be almost irrationally insistent about not wanting/ needing a cablebox. Cable to them is appealing only because it is better reception and a few more channels than over the air. They simply aren't interested in more, and have become even more deeply entrenched in their opinion due to their use of Tivo to magnify the amount of interesting content available at any time.
> 
> Although this market seems to me to be very price sensitive, Tivo can be a competitive alternative for analog users tempted by the amount of content available if they converted to digital.


I am one of these people that subscribe only to basic-extended cable, not because I'm necessarily non-technical or price sensitive, but exactly because I wanted better reception and can find enough good content with basic-extended cable and TiVo.

TiVo needs to be marketing to "Homer Simpson" -- those folks in middle America who enjoy their MTV and ESPN but don't require the super-duper bleeding edge technology. These folks are less price sensitive as much as they need a compelling reason to buy. I think you hit the nail on the head. TiVo should position itself as a maximizer of basic extended cable, but I'm not sure of Comcast would appreciate positioning TiVo that way.


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## 1283 (Sep 8, 2000)

I have analog basic cable, not even extended basic. With 3 TiVos, I'm already watching too much TV. Not interested in paying more for channels I don't have time to watch.


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## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

neekoh said:


> I think you hit the nail on the head. TiVo should position itself as a maximizer of basic extended cable, but I'm not sure of Comcast would appreciate positioning TiVo that way.


TiVo is doing exactly that. The new CEO has targeted the analog basic cable market as TiVo's best opportunity for growth in the standalone box market.

The Comcast offering will be software running on the Motorola dual-tuner digital DVR hardware. It will only be offered to digital cable subscribers.


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## Justin Thyme (Mar 29, 2005)

Tagging it as "analog" doesn't really go to the core of this market segment though, Right? Because the users in this segment are going to remain in the same coherant group long past the digital switchover. I mean like 10 years from now when someone buys the most affordable 27 inch DTV, the most affordable content for that set will be Over the Air (OTA) digital channels, and because of FCC carriage rules, most of those will be in the Basic cable package.

So at that point, for Tivo to serve that segment it makes sense to me that you have a box that does what the current S2 does, but also will record ATSC digital directly from OTA or from their basic digital package.

Whether or not that individual has an antennae on their roof, as I understand the legislation that looks like a done deal now, everyone with an analog set is eligible for a $40 check (2 coupons per family)

See where I'm going here? Such a ATSC QAM Tivo would qualify as a digital converter box, and Moore's law will bring the cost of that Tivo down to practical nothing by 2009. So the beauty is that an SA Tivo's hardware cost in that timeframe could largely be paid for by the feds. That's my crackpot observation of the day.

Antiquarian as it may seem now, the antennaes may start sprouting again on rooftops. Digital also means that each station can have 4 channels instead of one ("multicasting"), it also means that digital transmissions are much more free of the kind of reception noise problems that analog suffers from.

So over the air with a Tivo as a mulitplier becomes a viable alternative to basic cable service. In many metropolitan areas, it is a viable replacement for even more. Areas with as few as 6 channels now will be able to broadcast 24 digital, and many cable users buying more comprehensive packages may ask why they aren't keeping their money and use OTA instead.


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## neekoh (Jan 2, 2005)

ChuckyBox said:


> TiVo is doing exactly that. The new CEO has targeted the analog basic cable market as TiVo's best opportunity for growth in the standalone box market.
> 
> The Comcast offering will be software running on the Motorola dual-tuner digital DVR hardware. It will only be offered to digital cable subscribers.


Internally or to those who follow the company knows that this is their future position with the Comcast deal. But in the mainstream audience, they need to be more overt. The commercials and ads I've seen mainly say that TiVo can be used to replace the VCR. No one wants to pay extra for that. Instead, the TiVo is a device that allows you to get the most out of your existing channels. With TiVo, you don't need digital cable at all -- the monthly fee gives you better access to all the shows in your regular channel lineup.

Slingbox has done a good job of explaining their benefit -- watch TV from anywhere in the world. TiVo's message is still clouded. Maybe in March when they start targeting Comcast's customers, they will go for this messaging/positioning.


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## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

neekoh said:


> The commercials and ads I've seen mainly say that TiVo can be used to replace the VCR. No one wants to pay extra for that. Instead, the TiVo is a device that allows you to get the most out of your existing channels. With TiVo, you don't need digital cable at all -- the monthly fee gives you better access to all the shows in your regular channel lineup.


I agree that TiVo's marketing has never been well-targeted, but I think the new CEO is working to refine their message for maximum possible effect. As for your second point, go to www.tivo.com and have a look. The "Get More For Your Money" tab is just what you are talking about, so they're at least aware of that selling point.



> Maybe in March when they start targeting Comcast's customers, they will go for this messaging/positioning.


What happens in March?


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## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

Justin Thyme said:


> Tagging it as "analog" doesn't really go to the core of this market segment though, Right? Because the users in this segment are going to remain in the same coherant group long past the digital switchover.


I agree that the market will evolve over the next several years, but I don't know how coherent that group will remain. You point out a couple of different options, and there are others -- some people will stick with cable, some will go OTA, some will defect to IPTV and Satellite.

You make a good point about TiVo-as-converter-box. I imagine that will be a practical solution for many people.

I realize the FCC is forcing broadcasters to go digital over the air, but is there anything in the law that says that cable companies can't keep pumping analog signals through coaxial cable? If not, then the easiest solution for many people might just be to stick with analog cable.


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## calitivo (Dec 6, 2002)

I was somewhat surprised to see so many Tivo's at the Best Buy near me in west LA. At least 300, probably more like 500. Mostly 40's, dozens of 80's. No Humax's to be found, but maybe they were stored somewhere I didn't look.

Saw that there were two different types of boxes for the 40 hours....one was larger than the other. I wonder if some were 240's. Didn't think about looking.


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## neekoh (Jan 2, 2005)

ChuckyBox said:


> The "Get More For Your Money" tab is just what you are talking about, so they're at least aware of that selling point.


Nice. Now if they can translate that to an interesting 30-second ad on TV/Radio and make a billboard, then maybe they will indeed be sold out. They can't rely on their website to sell this to the mass market.

What happens in March?

I thought that was when TiVo will begin releasing boxes for Comcast.


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## dwarner (Feb 14, 2003)

Justin Thyme said:


> What surprizes me is how stubborn that analog segment is.
> 
> My sister and one of my brothers are on analog and seem at least to me to be almost irrationally insistent about not wanting/ needing a cablebox. Cable to them is appealing only because it is better reception and a few more channels than over the air. They simply aren't interested in more, and have become even more deeply entrenched in their opinion due to their use of Tivo to magnify the amount of interesting content available at any time.
> 
> ...


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## megazone (Mar 3, 2002)

I have digital cable and I'm paying for it - but I moved in July and I never got around to connecting my cable boxes again! So I've been using just analog cable since July, connected directly to my TiVos. There are a couple of shows on digital I used to record, but I haven't missed them much.

I'll get around to it sometime - actually last week I finally unboxed all the stuff for the entertainment center, I just haven't wired it up yet.

Though I admit it is tempting to just dump digital cable and stick with analog until a CableCARD TiVo is out.


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## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

neekoh said:


> What happens in March?
> 
> I thought that was when TiVo will begin releasing boxes for Comcast.


Ah, I see. Based on recent comments from TiVo execs, the Comcast-TiVo service isn't expected to be available until the 2nd half of the year, possibly not until the fourth quarter.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

Justin Thyme said:


> Anyone else run into Tivo shortages?


Here's an email I got:


> I wanted to provide you with an update on the latest TiVo promotion, which will carry on into the new year. On Monday, December 19th, tivo.com ran out of stock on the Series-2 40 hour boxes, which were on sale for $49.99 with the purchase of a one-year subscription.


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## audiocrawford (Oct 19, 2005)

Justin Thyme said:


> What surprizes me is how stubborn that analog segment is.


For many people, it's not about "stubborn", it's just about what you watch and what you need.

I love how TiVo works seamlessly with analog cable, because analog cable is all I need, or even want. When I see threads abou people setting up tin-foil tents around their "IR BLASTER" and their cable box I just shake my head and thank goodness I don't have to deal with such matters.

I've looked into digital cable and sattilite many times. It's just not for me, and I am one of those tech-loving mid-to-early level adopters who should be the #1 target audience of their service. It's also not much more expensive than what I'm paying now for my analog cable/internet package, so it's not even cost. It's that I took a hard look at what the service offered, and I just have no use for it. I don't think I am alone, either.

In terms of cable programming, my local digital service gives exactly two channels I can ever see myself watching : SoapNet and the Game Show Network. Literally. I don't watch sports, and I prefer watching movies on DVD (Netflix or purchased). The Game Show Network would be funny for a distraction, but since I have a TiVo I wouldn't even need that. That leaves SoapNet, and the programs I'd watch on it are either out on, or coming to DVD anyway (and are shows I would collect anyway).

Even the "frills" are useless to me now that I have a TiVo. On-screen guide? Got it. Music? Instead of endless channels of music I don't care for, I can stream all my personal music straight to my entertainment system (and even be watching something on the TV muted on top of it). The psudo-VOD? Why bother - I've got TiVo, and always have something to watch. Much of digital cable is simply reruns of regular cable shows anyway.

If there was a compelling reason to switch, I would. I just don't see any positives, and quite a few negatives, for the way I watch TV. It also makes life with TiVo SO much easier. I never have to worry about making little tin foil tents, or my TiVo chaning to channel 5 when it meant 45. And yet I still always have something to watch waiting for me.

Just another perspective,

AC


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

neekoh said:


> What happens in March?
> 
> I thought that was when TiVo will begin releasing boxes for Comcast.


it has been tossed about on this forum that the cbale card might be released on TiVo's Blue moon day*, which is in March. With all the hoopla around the cable card TiVo, I can imagine TiVo folks would find it very cool to be able to relase it in March.

* The original Series 1 was released sometime in March that coincided with a Blue Moon. Since then TiVo inc. has had a blue moon day.


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