# Price of HR10-250 after 2/28



## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

What are your expert opinions on what the price will be after the rebate period ends on 2/28? 

I think I'm ready to jump in with the HDTiVo.


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## jamesbobo (Jun 18, 2000)

Isn't Direct TV supposed to convert to rental of boxes instead of ownership? If so, the HR10-250 would be no initial cost.


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## kdonnel (Nov 28, 2000)

jamesbobo said:


> Isn't Direct TV supposed to convert to rental of boxes instead of ownership? If so, the HR10-250 would be no initial cost.


You really must stop using logic.

Dish still charges an initial fee for their advanced technology boxes even though they are rental only.

DirecTV is not lowering the monthly cost or initial start up cost for a new subscriber. They are just going to charge you for right to pay a monthly rental fee and collect the box if you ever cancel. The get to keep the equipment on their books so it does not look like it costs quite as much each time they bring a new customer on board. A win win for Directv and a lose lose for the customer!


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## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

jamesbobo said:


> Isn't Direct TV supposed to convert to rental of boxes instead of ownership? If so, the HR10-250 would be no initial cost.


Take this with a grain of salt (or possibly a whole Morton's container) but in this post: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=287514 someone who says they have inside info is reporting a new upfront contribution of $499 plus a fee and you will not own the box.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

So essentially, you still "buy" the box and the rental fee replaces the Protection Plan.

Looks like I should buy the box before 2/28.

I'll call DirecTV and report my findings.


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## Jon J (Aug 23, 2000)

kdonnel said:


> Dish still charges an initial fee for their advanced technology boxes even though they are rental only.


A Dish CSR told me the upcharge for an HD capable DVR would be $299 with no ownership rights and I can't remember the term of the committment. She did not sound like she was kidding when she said it. 

Oh, and the Nashville locals are up in HD but it requires a new MPEG-2/4 receiver and antenna setup which I assume very few people already have.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

Okay, I just got off the phone with DirecTV retention.

Here's the scoop I got.

Before 2/28 the HR10-250 is $599 - $200 rebate + $99 installation fee.
If bought from DirecTV you have to get the installation.

If leased now, it is still $599 - rebate + the rental fee of $5.99. No installation fee.

After 2/28 the cost goes up to $749 - $100 rebate.

So I'm off to see what the retailer's prices are.

Has anyone done business with Bright & Sleek?
Their price for the HR10-250 is $522 with free shipping.
See http://www.brightandsleek.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=HR10250&Show=ExtInfo


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

I'm sure glad I joined the HD bandwagon last year when they were giving them away  I think i'll fix/maintain/repair what I have because no way will I pay that big an up front fee. Heck 100 bucks for a t60 power supply doesn't sound so bad compared to the up front cost for a non tivo product 

the new HDtivo price wouldn't be 'soooo' bad if you knew you'd get a hdtivo back if yours ever went bad. But I'm betting if your hdtivo goes bad, they will give you the new dvr, not a hdtivo.


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

Jim, you can buy one for $454 w/ .06 shipping here:
http://www.6ave.com/product.jsp?x=HR10250

(seems like they are currently having server issues, but I ordered one yesterday and this page was active a short while ago).

Bill



JimSpence said:


> Okay, I just got off the phone with DirecTV retention.
> 
> Here's the scoop I got.
> 
> ...


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## bgtimber75 (Jun 2, 2002)

Huh? It cost $749 to lease one but only $599 for outright ownership if I do it in the next week? What kind of plan is that. If only my local comcast had there DVR's in stock....


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## leftcoastdave (Sep 4, 2003)

JimSpence said:


> Okay, I just got off the phone with DirecTV retention.
> 
> Here's the scoop I got.
> 
> ...


Last Thursday I saw a stack of HR10-250's at Best Buy for $399.00. I do not know if that price required a mail in rebate.


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## RonH54 (Jul 3, 2004)

If you saw my post below(what happens after Feb. 28th) you see I am in a situation like most concerning H10-250 price as of Mar. 1st. It seems the best thing to do cost wise for me(since I am not going to have HD TV until April) is buy one of these units off ebay(alot going in $399 range) have Directv just activate with NO HD package at the moment and use as a Std. receiver Tivo until I get the HD TV. I know I want get any rebate but it still cost less than what Directv has planned for March 1st,if the info we seeing is correct.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

Philly Bill said:


> Jim, you can buy one for $454 w/ .06 shipping here:
> http://www.6ave.com/product.jsp?x=HR10250
> 
> (seems like they are currently having server issues, but I ordered one yesterday and this page was active a short while ago).
> ...


When I go to the PVR page it says "No items available".



leftcoastdave said:


> Last Thursday I saw a stack of HR10-250's at Best Buy for $399.00. I do not know if that price required a mail in rebate.


The Best Buy website has it listed as $599.99, so I suspect what you saw was the after rebate price. And even if it were the in store price it is probably restricted to your local store. Also, I don't have a BB near me.


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## sotapoppy (Feb 7, 2004)

Check out Value Electonics here

Their site lists it at $549 before the $200 rebate.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

I checked out Value's price and with the 5 year extended warantee added in it's not a bad deal. I have to pay NY Sales Tax however.


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## gimletmaker (Feb 6, 2006)

Newegg $489 - $200 Rebate =$289 + 7.99 (3 day shipping) = $296.99

Search for HR10-250.


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## rifleman69 (Jan 6, 2005)

Wherever you buy it from Jim, do it yesterday!


The only good thing from the leasing vehicle is that whenever your box breaks or stops working, DirecTV would be required to get you a new box (could be refurb, but it's a new box to you) for free. Other than that, it's a lose-lose situation for the customer.


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

JimSpence said:


> When I go to the PVR page it says "No items available".


Try again. It works for me....


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

I hate paying a rental fee, especially if I'm "buying" the box as well. That is just plain stupid in my opinion. Also, you can't add another hard drive to a rental. Well, I suppose you could.

The Retention CSR I talked to actually bought one from eBay.  And, couldn't really figure out why the cost structure was how it is. BTW, the CSRs are getting their training for this on 2/28. My CSR had to go find the manual to look up the details.

Here's another question about the rebate. Say I order it today, but it doesn't arrive until after 2/28 so I can't activate it before then. Will the rebate still be honored? I realize this is probably a rhetorical question, but would like your conjecture. 



Philly Bill said:


> Try again. It works for me....


Sorry no can do.
I clicked on the PVR link on this page http://www.6ave.com/cat_main.jsp?b=Tv / Video
Hmmm, your original link now works, but what I tried didn't?????


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

Philly Bill said:


> Jim, you can buy one for $454 w/ .06 shipping here:
> http://www.6ave.com/product.jsp?x=HR10250
> Bill


After I went back to check this link I see the price has now dropped to $450. Another 4 bucks. Damn, I shoulda waited.. lol.


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## dvdude (Aug 25, 2003)

I wonder how this will affect the used market......?


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

Well, it looks like 6ave has the nod from me. 
I hope it comes quickly. Coming from NJ should be quick. 

Hey there Philly Bill, let me know when you receive your unit, okay?


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## PlasMAN (Dec 28, 2001)

It is sad to see the attitude and policies of DirecTV getting eerily like the cable company.

I may have it wrong, but I think I heard that the rental fee of $5.99 replaces the additional receiver fee of $4.99 - so it is not that bad on a monthly basis. If they fulfil the promise of 100's of HD channels and give us better quality - I for one will still be a happy camper. The only big disappointment is that we won't have a TIVO interface to enjoy all those MPEG4 channels.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

I agree, but I'll cross that MPEG4 bridge when it is built. I suspect that I'll never sign up for locals even when they are offered, unless at some point I have to take them. I'm perfectly happy with having SD and HD DNS waivers in place.  The HDTiVo will work quite well for me for a couple of years. I hope!


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## bgtimber75 (Jun 2, 2002)

PlasMAN said:


> It is sad to see the attitude and policies of DirecTV getting eerily like the cable company.


At least cable companies don't charge you up front to lease there equipment.


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## Smuuth (Sep 21, 2005)

With the idea of purchasing an HR10-250 from a 3rd party before the 28th, does anyone know how long after the 28th one has to activate it and still get the rebate?


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## Texceo (Mar 11, 2003)

The unit has to be activated by 2/28/2006 to get the $200 rebate


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## good.deals (Jan 28, 2006)

I got my hr10-250 for $99... dunno why you guys are having problems like this.


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## dogdoctor (Feb 20, 2006)

Texceo said:


> The unit has to be activated by 2/28/2006 to get the $200 rebate


No offense but I am looking at the rebate form and I see no where does in say you have to activate by a specific date...you just have to have a receipt showing the DVR _purchased between 10/16/05-2/28/06_, a copy of the _directv bill showing activation_, and _postmarked by 4/30/06_. Thus doing the round about math: that give us new guys...really till the end of march billing cycle for activation, showing proof on the april bill and time to get it in the mail. Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong as I want the rebate a much as the next guy.


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## rifleman69 (Jan 6, 2005)

dogdoctor said:


> No offense but I am looking at the rebate form and I see no where does in say you have to activate by a specific date...you just have to have a receipt showing the DVR _purchased between 10/16/05-2/28/06_, a copy of the _directv bill showing activation_, and _postmarked by 4/30/06_. Thus doing the round about math: that give us new guys...really till the end of march billing cycle for activation, showing proof on the april bill and time to get it in the mail. Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong as I want the rebate a much as the next guy.


Yeah it's PURCHASE, and not activated (but you have 30 days from Feb 28th to activiate).


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

I wonder if printing your account list, showing activation, from the website is sufficient proof of the activation? This whole thing is going to cost me an extra $0.39, since I use online payment for my bills.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

JimSpence said:


> I wonder if printing your account list, showing activation, from the website is sufficient proof of the activation? This whole thing is going to cost me an extra $0.39, since I use online payment for my bills.


It would have to. If they are aware they aren't sending people paper bills, there simply is no other proof is there?


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## Mr. Bill (Jan 18, 2006)

JimSpence said:


> I wonder if printing your account list, showing activation, from the website is sufficient proof of the activation? This whole thing is going to cost me an extra $0.39, since I use online payment for my bills.


Just bring up your invoice history online and print that month's invoice.

Or, bring up 'recent activity' and print that and circle the line items. That's what I did.


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

JimSpence said:


> Well, it looks like 6ave has the nod from me.
> I hope it comes quickly. Coming from NJ should be quick.
> 
> Hey there Philly Bill, let me know when you receive your unit, okay?


I will Jim. It is supposed to ship today... but I'll believe it when I get a tracking number.

6thave.com has it down to $439 now. lol.


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## Cabinwood (Mar 11, 2000)

You all have me thinking about getting one of these. Can anyone tell me what the value would be of the 5 year guarantee from Value Electronics or Solid Signal if DirecTV quits selling these in a year or two? Or, would ordering from them with the guarantee be a waste of money -- should I just go with the cheapest???


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## sotapoppy (Feb 7, 2004)

Cabinwood said:


> You all have me thinking about getting one of these. Can anyone tell me what the value would be of the 5 year guarantee from Value Electronics or Solid Signal if DirecTV quits selling these in a year or two?


FWIW, when I bought my 2nd HR10 from VE last fall, I asked that question and Robert told me at that time the 5 yr warranty transfers over to an exchanged unit, ie the new HR20. I'm not sure how the new leasing plans effect this if at all. I suggest you call VE and ask Robert that question


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

sotapoppy said:


> FWIW, when I bought my 2nd HR10 from VE last fall, I asked that question and Robert told me at that time the 5 yr warranty transfers over to an exchanged unit, ie the new HR20. I'm not sure how the new leasing plans effect this if at all. I suggest you call VE and ask Robert that question


If anyone calls, please post the results. I'm sure I'm not the only one that would be much less than thrilled to get a non tivo unit as a replacement.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

Mine has also shipped. DHL tracking says delivery is today. 

I hope to activate is about 10ms after I get it. 

I guess 6ave wants to reduce their inventory.

Edited to add that the unit arrived at 10am. But, it will take me a little longer than 10ms to get it up and running. I want it to reach room temperature before plugging it in. I also need to redo the wiring a little. I need another sat line to the LR. I have four to the LR now, 2 for the T60, 1 for the HTL-HD and 1 for the Dish 301. The OTA antenna is diplexed on the line to the HTL. I can initially set this up using the HTL and Dish lines. In case anyone doesn't remember my situation, I have Dish for the Superstations. 

The packing list that came with this unit says that there are 185 units in stock. So here's a good plug to 6ave for quick delivery and a low price. I paid $450.

Did I get mine before Philly Bill?


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

JimSpence said:


> The packing list that came with this unit says that there are 185 units in stock. So here's a good plug to 6ave for quick delivery and a low price. I paid $450.
> 
> Did I get mine before Philly Bill?


Wow. 

Go 6thave! Today the price is still $439. I paid $454. Gotta love .06 shipping too huh?

I don't live as close as you Jim. My delivery date is the 27th. 

I have wiring to run anyway. I'm not in any big hurry.

BTW, what exactly does HDMI do? Is that video only? Audio Only? Both?


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## DTV TiVo Dealer (Nov 13, 2002)

sotapoppy said:


> FWIW, when I bought my 2nd HR10 from VE last fall, I asked that question and Robert told me at that time the 5 yr warranty transfers over to an exchanged unit, ie the new HR20. I'm not sure how the new leasing plans effect this if at all. I suggest you call VE and ask Robert that question


Correct as usual sotapoppy. Our 5 yr. extended warranty is transferable. Just notify the warranty company with the new model # and s/n.

Even when DIRECTV goes to a lease model you would want to transfer the warranty as the lease does not include maintenance..

-Robert


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## InertiaGirl (Jan 21, 2006)

How important is it to have the triple-LNB dish, especially if I plan to get locals OTA?

Also, I already have the multiswitch and 2 cables running downstairs to my current TiVo from the satellite dish, will that be enough? I am considering getting one of the OTA antennas that clips onto the satellite dish, will that mean I need to run another cable downstairs? 

Gah, happy to be getting HDTV and new HD TiVo, but not so happy about all of the installation nonsense!


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

Most of DirecTV's HD content is from 101 or 119 satellites. So the Phase III is needed.
CBS east and west and NBC east are on 101.


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## dagap (Dec 5, 2003)

>>> How important is it to have the triple-LNB dish, especially if I plan to get locals OTA? <<<

If you don't want any HD from DTV then you can probably get by with your older round dish for now.

>>> Also, I already have the multiswitch and 2 cables running downstairs to my current TiVo from the satellite dish, will that be enough? <<<

Sure... you'll get every channel you currently get.

>>> I am considering getting one of the OTA antennas that clips onto the satellite dish, will that mean I need to run another cable downstairs? <<<

Maybe. You can use diplexors to merge the OTA signal onto one of the existing cables, but that results in signal loss. It's better to run a dedicated coax cable for the OTA antenna.

And regarding a clip-on... are you close to the broadcast towers? Visit antennaweb.org if you don't know.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

Okay, the HR10-250 has been activated.

Now I have to wait until it finishes indexing the guide data. 

The ATSC tuner in this unit doesn't do as well as the one in the HTL-HD.
But then I need to relocate the antenna. 

I was also able to get 3 months free for the HD pack.


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## willardcpa (Feb 23, 2001)

Damned UMF, and Jim too!  
After talking on the phone w/DTV yesterday for over half an hour trying to get a better deal I pulled the trigger on the 6th Ave deal this morning. Now how to explain it to the wife.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

JimSpence said:


> Okay, the HR10-250 has been activated.


have you ever mentioned what your viewing unit is for this baby?


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

I have a 48" Mitsubishi HD RPTV. I'm using component because it doesn't have HDMI/DVI inputs. The PQ looks as good with this as it did with the HTL-HD receiver.


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## LlamaLarry (Apr 30, 2003)

willardcpa said:


> After talking on the phone w/DTV yesterday for over half an hour trying to get a better deal I pulled the trigger on the 6th Ave deal this morning. Now how to explain it to the wife.


yeah, I am this close to buying my second HDTiVo from 6th Ave - but maybe I will give DirecTV a call just in case they decide to offer me a good deal.


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## baritony (Jan 8, 2002)

Hey Jim, If you look at the rebate thing, it says you *need a receipt.* I doubt you can get a valid receipt from an ebay purchase.


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## heathramos (Jul 26, 2004)

Geting a 2nd hd tivo is interesting but I have a few questions...

after directv goes to leasing, what do you think will be the upfront cost for their hd dvr?

it sounds like directv is planning on adding national hd channels next year. don't you think these channels will be in mpeg4? if so, and you have to pay upfront costs for both the hd tivo and hd dvr, wouldn't you be better off with the directv version?

my ota signal strength is weak so I have been thinking of getting the hd dvr directv is going to offer when it comes out and the locals are available in my area.

I also recently bought a 2nd hdtv and have been using a standard directivo with it.


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## herdfan (Feb 5, 2003)

JimSpence said:


> I hate paying a rental fee, especially if I'm "buying" the box as well. That is just plain stupid in my opinion.


Doesn't the "lease" fee just replaces the "mirror" fee? As far as I can tellf rom what I have read, the only difference is that you will never own the box. Costs will be the same, or similar, to what you pay now, but you will have to return the box if you cancel.

So for customers like me who have no intention of going anywhere in the near future, this change makes very little difference. For those that bounce around between services like a ping-pong ball, they will have a different experience.


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## herdfan (Feb 5, 2003)

I am going to pick up another one this week at BB or CC. Then hold it until I see what the cost structure acutally is come 3/1. Then I will either keep it or return/repurchase if the cost structure is better.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

The CSR on Tuesday said that the upfront cost of the HR10-250 after 3/1 would be $749, and this is still a lease. That's why I went with an online dealer. And the receipt thing is what kept me away from eBay.

A printed receipt of the email confirmation from the online retailer works just fine. And, for the activation verification, a printed version of the DirecTV online account is sufficient.


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## Texceo (Mar 11, 2003)

dogdoctor said:


> No offense but I am looking at the rebate form and I see no where does in say you have to activate by a specific date...you just have to have a receipt showing the DVR _purchased between 10/16/05-2/28/06_, a copy of the _directv bill showing activation_, and _postmarked by 4/30/06_. Thus doing the round about math: that give us new guys...really till the end of march billing cycle for activation, showing proof on the april bill and time to get it in the mail. Please feel free to correct me if I am wrong as I want the rebate a much as the next guy.


On Tuesday of this week i called and ordered my second unit. Was told by Retention department i had to activate the unit by 2-28-2006. So i guess anything is possible.


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## SonicRanger001 (Nov 5, 2005)

So whats the deal if I buy a unit at Circuit City and get the $200 rebate, they have it for $600 so that will make it $400.

You bought it online for $4~~ and will STILL get the $200 rebate thus making it $2~~ ???


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## hyimted (Apr 13, 2003)

mind if i ask a few clarifying questions?

the hr10-250 (which i own) is an mpeg2 box ... correct? if so, why would you guys want to still buy one knowing about the mpeg4 boxes? is it simply to get into hd dvr at this point in time at a cheaper cost? aren't you worried about future compatibility, etc?

just curious as to whether i'm missing something....


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## Dignan (Jan 27, 2002)

hyimted said:


> mind if i ask a few clarifying questions?
> 
> the hr10-250 (which i own) is an mpeg2 box ... correct? if so, why would you guys want to still buy one knowing about the mpeg4 boxes? is it simply to get into hd dvr at this point in time at a cheaper cost? aren't you worried about future compatibility, etc?
> 
> just curious as to whether i'm missing something....


For me, I bought a second unit (at 6th Ave, thanks!) for a backup as I see the days of HD Tivo as numbered. I get my HD Nets from the Conus sat, it will stay mpeg2 for years. I may miss out on some newer stations coming on mpeg4, but at the rate they are bringing out locals it will be a while. I'm not going to get local in my area for a long time.


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## heathramos (Jul 26, 2004)

where did you get the rebate form?

also, anyone else worried about only having 56 bit encryption on the 6th Ave site?

What is the return ploicy there?


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## slapshot (Feb 12, 2002)

heathramos said:


> where did you get the rebate form?
> 
> also, anyone else worried about only having 56 bit encryption on the 6th Ave site?
> 
> What is the return ploicy there?


As far as the rebate form,download and print it from here.

http://www.directv.com/imagine/pdf/dvr_rebate_form.pdf

or try
http://www.directv.com/see/landing/hdrebate_cust.html


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

hyimted said:


> mind if i ask a few clarifying questions?
> 
> the hr10-250 (which i own) is an mpeg2 box ... correct? if so, why would you guys want to still buy one knowing about the mpeg4 boxes? is it simply to get into hd dvr at this point in time at a cheaper cost? aren't you worried about future compatibility, etc?
> 
> just curious as to whether i'm missing something....


at a minimum, you will always have a 5/month OTA tivo unit (assuming ota is good of course). I would pay 5/month just for this service alone. Also, if you dont need hd locals mpeg4, you can use your hdtivo for years to come as mpeg2 will in my opinion be around at least 2-3 years


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

SonicRanger001 said:


> So whats the deal if I buy a unit at Circuit City and get the $200 rebate, they have it for $600 so that will make it $400.
> 
> You bought it online for $4~~ and will STILL get the $200 rebate thus making it $2~~ ???


Well for me, the $150 difference is a big deal.


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## hyimted (Apr 13, 2003)

newsposter said:


> Also, if you dont need hd locals mpeg4, you can use your hdtivo for years to come as mpeg2 will in my opinion be around at least 2-3 years


yeah, i think that's gonna be my problem. i have very crappy hd ota here ... i'm gonna be "dependent" on d*'s service.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

aww that bites. Well if you never had OTA, i hear mpeg4 will be just fine. It's just us PQ freaks with ota that don't like the mpeg4 compression. I'm sure you will be ok with the h20.


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## guyricardo (Feb 25, 2003)

JimSpence said:


> The CSR on Tuesday said that the upfront cost of the HR10-250 after 3/1 would be $749, and this is still a lease. That's why I went with an online dealer. And the receipt thing is what kept me away from eBay.
> 
> A printed receipt of the email confirmation from the online retailer works just fine. And, for the activation verification, a printed version of the DirecTV online account is sufficient.


Does anyone know if the all or some of the $749 is a actually deposit? i.e. when you return the unit you get your money back. If you trash it, then you eat the $749. Otherwise DTV is cutting there expenses AND getting us to pay just as much.
And how would the lease program affect 3rd party resellers if DTV "owns" the box?


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## Paul_PDX (Nov 12, 2002)

baritony said:


> Hey Jim, If you look at the rebate thing, it says you *need a receipt.* I doubt you can get a valid receipt from an ebay purchase.


The rebate form I have say I need a copy of the DirecTV bill showing activation by 2/28 not the purchase receipt -- are there two different forms?

FORGET IT -- I just found a post to the other form -- There are two forms.


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## Paul_PDX (Nov 12, 2002)

Well I went for the 6thave deal as well -- nothing as good out there.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

I didn't really want to start a new thread for this question.

But, are we absolutely sure that the HR10-250 won't be getting any new software?

It would be nice to get folders. Not to mention a quicker interface. 

Mine is working quite well. I have noticed a stutter just after changing channels and the channel changing is slower with a black or gray screen showing before the channel is displayed. I suspect the latter is because the unit needs to do a bit more to process an HD signal. 

BTW, now I know why I got a universal remote, absolutely hate the peanut.  No flaming please. 
Gotta reprogram the universal.


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## joetoronto (Jul 26, 2004)

JimSpence said:


> BTW, now I know why I got a universal remote, absolutely hate the peanut.  No flaming please.
> Gotta reprogram the universal.


no flaming, i'm just curious, what's wrong with the peanut remote?


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## Erictaub (Mar 5, 2004)

Don't know where others are getting their information about having to pay $749 for an HD TiVo after 3/1, but I was told something completely different.

On 2/23 I spoke to a DirecTV customer retention person who said she was a supervisor, and had already had her training on the new leasing plans. She said that from 3/1 the HD TiVo box would be leased for $4.99/month. This fee would replace the mirroring fee, so in essence, there is no lease fee. 

She also said quite clearly that there was no upfront cost; just the lease fee. She did say there was a $99 install fee. Given that installing one of these is about as complicated as plugging in a toaster I called back and spoke to another customer retention person yesterday who had not yet had her lease training. 

She put me on hold and spoke to someone who supposedly had had the training. Then she told me that after 3/1, you could get the HD TiVo box without paying the install fee. It still seemed somewhat confused, however, as she said they still wouldn't mail the box to you, but you would have to tell the install guy when he called that you would install the box yourself and that he should drop it off at your house. If true, this part seems ridiculous, given that HD TiVos are sold in Costco and elsewhere with no demand that you hire an installer.

By the way, the customer retention rep also gave me some instant credits on HBO, the HD package, and the TiVo monthly fee ($5 credit on that one, for six months), even though I hadn't yet actually decided to buy the TiVo before 3/1 or lease it.

The first customer retention person (the supervisor) said that the MPEG4 PVRs would be available around June. However, given that I live in L.A. which already gets digital locals via MPEG2, she said they wouldn't let me lease an MPEG4 PVR even if I wanted one, as they have such a demand for MPEG4 equipment where locals are not available.

Finally, they won't even take lease orders on the HD TiVo until 3/1. The idea, voiced by others here, that you have to buy the box for $749 and then still pay a monthly lease fee makes no sense. One benefit to DirecTV with leasing is that you're paying for the box forever, and they can send you a refurbished one, which keeps their costs down.


----------



## fastep (May 22, 2004)

DTV TiVo Dealer said:


> Correct as usual sotapoppy. Our 5 yr. extended warranty is transferable. Just notify the warranty company with the new model # and s/n.
> 
> Even when DIRECTV goes to a lease model you would want to transfer the warranty as the lease does not include maintenance..
> 
> -Robert


Are you KIDDING ME??!!! $649 later and I DON'T own the box. I then pay a monthly rental fee and maintenance is EXTRA??!!!!! I hope that I read that wrong! Does DTV think we are that stupid??!!! Why don't they just politely ask us to leave? GOOD LUCK DTV !


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

JimSpence said:


> I didn't really want to start a new thread for this question.
> 
> But, are we absolutely sure that the HR10-250 won't be getting any new software?
> 
> ...


Jim I hate it too. Had to get a sony vl900. I like the numbers on the bottom just like the t60. If you like t60 you hate the peanut. It's perfectly understandable!

About folders...you've seen that long thread so you already know that answer 

And everything is slower with hdtivo than your old receiver. It's a sacrifice I've learned to live with .

I forget if you use suggestions to monitor disk space but if you dont, do yourself a favor and DO IT! I regret not listening to people and had more than a weeks worth of shows wiped out because I forgot HD is about 8x the size of SD. oops


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

Erictaub said:


> She also said quite clearly that there was no upfront cost; just the lease fee. She did say there was a $99 install fee. .


I believe you were told that but I'm sorry there's no way I believe that's true info. I think she was wrong. if they would rent me HDtivo at even 10 bucks a month with no up front cost, i'd order tonight! heck i could even deal with the 99 install fee.

I DO hope you are right though!!!!


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## joetoronto (Jul 26, 2004)

fastep said:


> Are you KIDDING ME??!!! $649 later and I DON'T own the box. I then pay a monthly rental fee and maintenance is EXTRA??!!!!! I hope that I read that wrong! Does DTV think we are that stupid??!!! Why don't they just politely ask us to leave? GOOD LUCK DTV !


i thought you already left, fastep.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

joetoronto said:


> no flaming, i'm just curious, what's wrong with the peanut remote?


Well, my original DVR is a Sony T60, then I got the Philips DSR6000 which has a peanut remote. Never really liked it, probably bvecause I used the Sony remote for a few months first. Then to control both DVRs I got a URC6131 universal remote and after using it for a few years, going back to a peanut is living hell. I keep hitting wrong buttons. The basic thing wrong with it is that it is symetrical.


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## rifleman69 (Jan 6, 2005)

JimSpence said:


> I hate paying a rental fee, especially if I'm "buying" the box as well. That is just plain stupid in my opinion. Also, you can't add another hard drive to a rental. Well, I suppose you could.
> 
> The Retention CSR I talked to actually bought one from eBay.  And, couldn't really figure out why the cost structure was how it is. BTW, the CSRs are getting their training for this on 2/28. My CSR had to go find the manual to look up the details.
> 
> ...


I haven't ever had the 6ave.com link work for me yet...anyone else?

Edit: Now it semi-work but there's nothing under the PVR category...are they out?

2nd edit: Found it through shopping.com This link works: http://www.6ave.com/product.jsp?zipz=11001&x=HR10250&w=1


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## map121 (Feb 26, 2006)

I'm about ready to order an HR10-250, but I have a lingering question about the rebate.

I know that I will be obligated to subscribe to total choice for 24 months. I don't have a problem with that. And I know that I will have to activate the HD package. The rebate form says "For $200 rebate, DIRECTV HD package activation required."

My question: will I be obligated to subscribe to the HD package for 24 months, or can I cancel the HD after I receive my rebate check?

I've had the HD package in the past and I don't think it's worth the money. I am only interested in recording OTA locals in HD.

Thanks


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## qposner (Sep 28, 2003)

I just called customer retention to see what the deal would be. The CSR said she just went through training on this and that it wold be a $499 upfront fee with a $4.99 lease fee (replaces mirror fee). She said you can own it with no further commitment for $799. 

This is absurd. $499 and you don't own it! Comcast may have me back sooner than later. What is DTV thinking?!?!


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## rifleman69 (Jan 6, 2005)

map121 said:


> I'm about ready to order an HR10-250, but I have a lingering question about the rebate.
> 
> I know that I will be obligated to subscribe to total choice for 24 months. I don't have a problem with that. And I know that I will have to activate the HD package. The rebate form says "For $200 rebate, DIRECTV HD package activation required."
> 
> ...


Pretty sure you just have to activate HD service (it's free for 3 months). It's only 9.99 now with one more channel. But I do agree with you that it'll be just fine for many years down the road being an OTA DVR. 5.00 (or 6.00 if it's a second receiver) is a good price for that IMO. Not too sold on mpeg4 yet at all.


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## fastep (May 22, 2004)

joetoronto said:


> i thought you already left, fastep.


No - still have DTV account and one active HDTivo due to a CONTRACT issue. I wished someone would have warned me last year!

I just won't stand for DTV pulling any fast ones to anyone else who may have choices! I am sorry to hear about limited choices in Canada but dont hate me - it's not my fault!


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## joetoronto (Jul 26, 2004)

fastep said:


> No - still have DTV account and one active HDTivo due to a CONTRACT issue. I wished someone would have warned me last year!
> 
> I just won't stand for DTV pulling any fast ones to anyone else who may have choices! I am sorry to hear about limited choices in Canada but dont hate me - it's not my fault!


lol, why would i hate you?


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## mgoblue02 (Feb 22, 2006)

It seems to me the most important feature of the rebate to D* is the two year commitment. So, while I just bought a new HD Plasma, I am waiting until after March 1 to go with the leasing program (or switch to cable, if need be). I'm guessing they will offer a similar rebate or equivalent credit to get that commitment. 

After March 1, I figure D* will either switch to a pricing model that competes with cable, or at worst, have a new rebate/credit which results in up front costs the same as or less than the pre-March 1 upfront cost of buying. 

As noted by others, D* is also interested in accounting for the depreciated value of the boxes. They can have it. If the upfront costs of leasing are the same (or better) than buying, then the difference between leasing and buying an HR10-250 is negligible to me. By the time my commitment would be up the box won't be worth too much on ebay if I leave D*. And if the up front costs of leasing are lower than buying, then I'll be psyched. 

My concern is not if the change to lease pricing will lead to better upfront pricing than the purchase model, it's how long after March 1 I can wait for the better prices to become available.

This post is all my own conjecture. So...grain of salt and all.


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## TDgobucks (Mar 30, 2004)

I am looking to purchase the HR-10 and activate HD until I get the rebate. Since I don't yet have locals in my area I would need an OTA antenna. My tv does not have an integrated HD tuner, would I be able to use the tuner on the HR-10 to decode the OTA signal regardless of wheher or not I have the HD activated?


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## qposner (Sep 28, 2003)

mgoblue02 said:


> After March 1, I figure D* will either switch to a pricing model that competes with cable, or at worst, have a new rebate/credit which results in up front costs the same as or less than the pre-March 1 upfront cost of buying.


It appears the upfront cost will be the same or worse than it is now. At least now you OWN the equipment. After 3/1, they get the same $ out of you and THEY own the equipment. Ridiculous...


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## rifleman69 (Jan 6, 2005)

mgoblue02 said:


> It seems to me the most important feature of the rebate to D* is the two year commitment. So, while I just bought a new HD Plasma, I am waiting until after March 1 to go with the leasing program (or switch to cable, if need be). I'm guessing they will offer a similar rebate or equivalent credit to get that commitment.
> 
> After March 1, I figure D* will either switch to a pricing model that competes with cable, or at worst, have a new rebate/credit which results in up front costs the same as or less than the pre-March 1 upfront cost of buying.
> 
> ...


For people who can currently get their local's via OTA, the HR10-250 will be in use for a looooooooooooooooooooooooong time. Those (the towers in your area) aren't switching to mpeg4 or anything else anytime within the next five years minimum. 5.00 to record ota, as well as everything else non-HD is a great deal.


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## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

I just bought one from 6Ave last night. I used the direct link posted earlier as they are having some issues with their site indexing evidently.

I get my locals OTA and I am betting that D* will not have all the rest of their stuff ready as soon as they originally said anyway.


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## onin24eagle (Feb 17, 2006)

Philly Bill said:


> After I went back to check this link I see the price has now dropped to $450. Another 4 bucks. Damn, I shoulda waited.. lol.


Linc worked for me. Thanks for the heads up. I bought it for $417 today. After rebate and $150 instant credit form D* it will net out at $67. No brainer. The only bummer is I haven't had a contract in 10 years and now I will have. I don't see leaving them in the next 2 years though.


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## RonH54 (Jul 3, 2004)

I went ahead and purchased one from 6Ave. today and got for $415 but went ahead and added their own 3 year extended warr. It did add $125 to make Final cost $540.67 but I feel better having this unit cover for replacement for 3 years after reading about alot of problems that this unit seems to have for some people after several months of use. Now I got to get an HDTV to watch..LOL. Glad I got 30 days to activate to get rebate.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

Does the warranty assure you that you will get hdtivo in return or just an HD dvr? (ie directv's in a few months)


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## RonH54 (Jul 3, 2004)

newsposter said:


> Does the warranty assure you that you will get hdtivo in return or just an HD dvr? (ie directv's in a few months)


Good question and I need to contact 6ave. and ask. I was just assuming it would replace/repair the HR10-250 if needed after the Manf. Warr. runs out. If these units aren't around in stay 2-3 years and I need replacement perhaps it means a totally different type of HD DVR.


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## chris_h (Dec 17, 2003)

TDgobucks said:


> I am looking to purchase the HR-10 and activate HD until I get the rebate. Since I don't yet have locals in my area I would need an OTA antenna. My tv does not have an integrated HD tuner, would I be able to use the tuner on the HR-10 to decode the OTA signal regardless of wheher or not I have the HD activated?


Yes. See the FAQ for more info.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

RonH54 said:


> Good question and I need to contact 6ave. and ask. I was just assuming it would replace/repair the HR10-250 if needed after the Manf. Warr. runs out. If these units aren't around in stay 2-3 years and I need replacement perhaps it means a totally different type of HD DVR.


Robert from valueelectronics has already confirmed that his warranty transfers to the new hd dvr and all you have to do is call and change serial numbers. Therefore it's obvious (and was really wishful thinking) that our units will be replaced with whatever is available, not necessarily hdtivos. This is the norm in most industries of course. Just got spoiled with hdtivo and realize I may have to pay for my own repairs to ensure keeping using the unit i love.


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## RonH54 (Jul 3, 2004)

Does anyone know or has read about the future on the HR10-250? Are they going to keep being even made?


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## rifleman69 (Jan 6, 2005)

RonH54 said:


> Does anyone know or has read about the future on the HR10-250? Are they going to keep being even made?


Not going to be made anymore, but it'll be a great DVR for both non-HD as well as your OTA stuff for a good many years.


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## Paul_PDX (Nov 12, 2002)

rifleman69 said:


> Not going to be made anymore, but it'll be a great DVR for both non-HD as well as your OTA stuff for a good many years.


As long as directv or TiVo lets us keep getting guide data for them.


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## RonH54 (Jul 3, 2004)

I contacted 6ave. about replacing this unit if it failed and it couldn't repaired and the HR10-250 units where no longer available. They said they would provide a replacement unit.


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## hakamarob (May 1, 2002)

i ordered one from 6ave yesterday, looks like it will get here tomorrow. and i just finished redoing my pronto. oh well, it will be worth it


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## rifleman69 (Jan 6, 2005)

Paul_PDX said:


> As long as directv or TiVo lets us keep getting guide data for them.


Guide data works just the same like your regular non-TiVo boxes. They're not going anywhere.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

BB lists them for 499 at this moment
http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=6338929&type=product&id=1076627785569

CC has the lease details up

http://www.circuitcity.com/ccd/category.do?catOid=-12877&N=20012866+20012877&cmSearchKeyword=directv

Note: DIRECTV® services sold separately. A maximum of six (6) receivers may be leased per year, but not more than two (2) DVR receivers, two (2) HD receivers and one (1) HD DVR receiver may by leased in a given year. A separate monthly equipment leasing fee of $4.99 applies.


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## psyco2 (Feb 2, 2006)

newsposter said:


> CC has the lease details up
> 
> Note: DIRECTV® services sold separately. A maximum of six (6) receivers may be leased per year, but not more than two (2) DVR receivers, two (2) HD receivers and one (1) HD DVR receiver may by leased in a given year. A separate monthly equipment leasing fee of $4.99 applies.


These new terms smell real funny. I am interested to see how this pans out. I'm not interested in "leasing" anything electronic for $500. I'm glad I took advantage of and upgraded/purchased my Receivers before this "leasing" took effect. Oh well, after this committment is over. DISH may actually considered as an alternative.


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## RonH54 (Jul 3, 2004)

It will be interesting to see how eBay prices will go on the HD10-250 unit now that the rebate time has past.


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## dcborn61 (Dec 9, 2002)

So my timing wasn't great, decided yesterday to buy a HDTV and called DirecTV today. First I called Comcast to see what they would offer me for switching. Their pricing for my set-up (2 DVRs, digital channels and HBO) was $98.80, and they said they'd knock $25 off a month for 16 months.

I called the Retention number and got the $499 "upgrade" charge to get the HR10-250 with installation. I tried to get from her why I would pay $499 to lease something, her answer was that the fee went for the new dish, installation and an upgrade charge. To match my competitive offer, they were willing to knock $15 off my bill for 6 months.

I think I'm going to live with standard def for awhile, because I don't see how DirecTV is going to keep this new leasing pig in the air for very long. If their churn numbers bump up, they will have to change the deal.


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## durvivor (May 27, 2003)

dcborn61 said:


> I think I'm going to live with standard def for awhile, because I don't see how DirecTV is going to keep this new leasing pig in the air for very long. If their churn numbers bump up, they will have to change the deal.


You know in all the time I've been watching this train wreck coming it never occured to me that DTV might change their minds. So, thank you for saying what you did and giving me hope that this horrible plan might change.

I'm not going to say I'm the smartest cookie in the drawer, but I CAN NOT get my head around DTV calling the $499 I would have to pay at Best Buy this morning a Lease at the same time that they call the $4.99 a month I pay a lease fee.

In my poor mind the $499 at Best Buy is a PURCHASE. So, I'm fighting with a co-worker this morning, At Circut City.com DTV says customers can "lease" up to 6 DTV devices. Customer can lease no more than 1 HD PVR a year. So, in my mind since I'm paying $4.99 lease fee each month, that means DIRECTV is telling me I am only allowed to have 1 hd pvr.

Why are they saying lease when they mean purchase.... GRRRR.


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## mgoblue02 (Feb 22, 2006)

I am 5 yr SD customer but am now officially a new HD leasing customer. The deal I got today was:

$499 for HDTivo, new dish, free OTA antenna (no install charge)
-$100 (mail in rebate)
-$100 (account credit)
-$60 ($5 of Total Choice Plus for 12 moths)
-$60 ($10 off HBO for 6 months + free Showtime for 6 months--I am an HBO sub but not Show time so I see this as $10 per month for me)
-$12 (protection plan drops in price by $2 per month for 6 months)
_______

Net cost=$167+ 2 yr commitment


Thought an outline of the new deals they are offering might be useful to others.


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## bidger (Mar 30, 2001)

mgoblue02 said:


> -$12 (protection plan drops in price by $2 per month for 6 months)


  If you're leasing, why would you be doing a protection plan on top of that?


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## mgoblue02 (Feb 22, 2006)

bidger said:


> If you're leasing, why would you be doing a protection plan on top of that?


I think for the equipment we already own (an SD Tivo and 3 other boxes). We'll probably just cancel the protection plan anyhow.

She initially gave me a total of $179 as my net cost so I don't think they were trying to scam me. But when I did the math of all the credits she offered me it came to $167 (the $12 difference was obviously in the protection plan).

So, I guess in the end, I just cancel the protection plan--which saves me another $7.99 per month long term anyhow. We had kinda forgotten we even had the plan so we'll be glad to dump it now that the cost of that SD equipment is nil. It's like the HD Tivo will now pay for itself...uh, not really.

Also, it is worth noting that the whole cost will be spread over three months bills--no credit card costs.


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## codespy (Jan 7, 2006)

I was told the protection plan is $5.99 now which covers DVR's down from $7.99.


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## Col. O'neill (Mar 1, 2006)

mgoblue02 said:


> I am 5 yr SD customer but am now officially a new HD leasing customer. The deal I got today was:
> 
> $499 for HDTivo, new dish, free OTA antenna (no install charge)
> -$100 (mail in rebate)
> ...


who did you talk to to get this deal?


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## mgoblue02 (Feb 22, 2006)

Customer retention but I don't remember her name.

I explained to the rep that I had gotten a new HDTV and had called several times in the past week about the pricing to buy the HDTivo. I told her I had held off because I didn't love the cost of buying available last week and I understood they were converting to a leasing structure today. I then asked for the new leasing info. Initially the price was $499 less a $100 mail in rebate.

I then politely explained that I would be deciding whether to switch today but that Comcast was basically offering $400 in credits over 16 months to switch over to them. I said I would greatly prefer to stay with D* but that when you count the Comcast credits, the difference in the start up price was at least $800. 

I also said because I prefer D*, I would be glad to pay a couple of hundred out of pocket to stay with them but that a $800 difference was way too big. I think this gave her an objective of getting under $200 to keep my business and I think it helped that I nicely explained that I was going to decide today because the TV was coming.

Note: Everything I told her was absolutely true. I did prefer to stay with D*, I was gonna take the Comcast credit and I intended to decide today--so I don't think she believed me to be BSing.

She then told me that the lease pricing was new and kindly asked that I wait on hold for several minutes while she checked out whether there is anything futher she could do. She came back with that deal and I did not quibble over it any further.

Last week, I was convinced that CSR roulette was a myth and that everything depended on how much you spent with them each month. But she was alot nicer than the five prior customer retention folks I spoke to and I believe she actually tried to get under my $200 number to keep my business today. I am now convinced who you get really matters and it is essential to keep trying and be nice to all of them.

I have actually always been happy with D* and their service. I wanted to keep NFL ST and March Madness and a few other things I wouldn't get from cable--so I would have been bummed to swtich but I would have done it. They were tough about giving me a better deal on my purchase inquiries last week but they were really cooperative about the lease today.

Plus, I don't care whether I own the equipment because it won't be worth much when I am done with it. This way, I can upgrade for free when I want.


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## Dignan (Jan 27, 2002)

Hmm, I'm getting a little concerned. I have an unactivated HR10-250 that I tried to activate last night, they said their systems were down. I already have an existing HR10-250 that I've had for over a year.

Just curious what this leasing plan means TODAY, am I only allowed 1 HD-DVR?


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## JasonK (Aug 8, 2003)

I called retention about 5 times over the last 2 weeks. They would never move from the $599 - $200 mail in rebate + $99 installation. I was always polite and told them that I had a new HDTV but I wanted to limit the expense of upgrading my Directivo to HD, but they would never change from this story. I spoke to someone on Sunday and asked for any information regarding the leasing. She did say that there will be a "small fee" for leasing and told me to call back on the 1st.

Did so this morning, the CSR (retention) was not prepared at all for the questions about leasing. I told her that I wanted to cancel my service because I have just got Time Warner HD (which is true, but I hate...). She said that there is a "small fee" (those words again) and told me to lease the HR-10 250 would be $499. - Crap, that's not "small". I asked her why would I pay this amount for leasing the box, she couldn't tell me (told you that she wasn't prepared!). I asked to speak to a supervisor. He got on and said $499 minus the $100 rebate... for installation. So on top of $499, I would have to pay $100 for installation? Yep.

I cancelled my service today - I am mad because I do like Directv PQ and I really hate my Time Warner DVR. 

But I can't justify paying $500 for it to be worthless in 6-12 months, and then Directv gives me $99 for a replacement. That's quite a depreciation.


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## Cabinwood (Mar 11, 2000)

Dignan said:


> Hmm, I'm getting a little concerned. I have an unactivated HR10-250 that I tried to activate last night, they said their systems were down. I already have an existing HR10-250 that I've had for over a year.
> 
> Just curious what this leasing plan means TODAY, am I only allowed 1 HD-DVR?


I had ordered a new HD Tivo last week but it didn't get delivered until today (darn DHL  - was on the truck for delivery Monday) I was expecting problems when I called to activate it, but it went ok. It did come up in the computer as a "lease" but when I explained that I bought it on the internet and it just got delivered today they went ahead and changed it to read that I owned it. The CSR did have to transfer me up the line because his computer wouldn't do it, so it took a few extra minutes, but I'm happy...


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## Dignan (Jan 27, 2002)

Thanks Cabinwood. Do you remember which department they moved you to? I'd just like to cut to the chase. 

BTW your HD Tivo arrived via DHL early this week for me, it was delivered yesterday and was supposed to get here tomorrow.


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## Keith Elkin (Oct 16, 2002)

So what happens if I go to best buy and buy a HR10-250 today? Is it now leased instead of owned?


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## Cabinwood (Mar 11, 2000)

Keith Elkin said:


> So what happens if I go to best buy and buy a HR10-250 today? Is it now leased instead of owned?


Leased.


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## Cabinwood (Mar 11, 2000)

Dignan said:


> Thanks Cabinwood. Do you remember which department they moved you to? I'd just like to cut to the chase.
> 
> BTW your HD Tivo arrived via DHL early this week for me, it was delivered yesterday and was supposed to get here tomorrow.


I don't remember "exactly" what department it was, but it had something to do with the access card...


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## fastep (May 22, 2004)

JasonK said:


> I called retention about 5 times over the last 2 weeks. They would never move from the $599 - $200 mail in rebate + $99 installation. I was always polite and told them that I had a new HDTV but I wanted to limit the expense of upgrading my Directivo to HD, but they would never change from this story. I spoke to someone on Sunday and asked for any information regarding the leasing. She did say that there will be a "small fee" for leasing and told me to call back on the 1st.
> 
> Did so this morning, the CSR (retention) was not prepared at all for the questions about leasing. I told her that I wanted to cancel my service because I have just got Time Warner HD (which is true, but I hate...). She said that there is a "small fee" (those words again) and told me to lease the HR-10 250 would be $499. - Crap, that's not "small". I asked her why would I pay this amount for leasing the box, she couldn't tell me (told you that she wasn't prepared!). I asked to speak to a supervisor. He got on and said $499 minus the $100 rebate... for installation. So on top of $499, I would have to pay $100 for installation? Yep.
> 
> ...


If TW is all digital and offers cablecard - look into getting sony DHG hdd250 or hdd500 - single tuner but FREE onscreen guide (check it out at tvgos.com) has 250gb or 500gb HDD space depending on model and records HD. Very nice unit if you hate the cable dvr. If you have to spend $499 you might as well get something reliable that you will OWN!!!

Lastly, I think my Comcast PQ is better with the sony than with the moto6412.


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## RonH54 (Jul 3, 2004)

Cabinwood said:


> Leased.


I think if you buy from someone other than D* it not leased,you bought it. Now if you get from D* now it is a "leased" unit.


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## Cabinwood (Mar 11, 2000)

RonH54 said:


> I think if you buy from someone other than D* it not leased,you bought it. Now if you get from D* now it is a "leased" unit.


I'm really not sure what the rules are. But she made sure I had purchased it before today and told me since I bought it last week, I owned it.


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## 300M (Dec 1, 2005)

I went to my local Best Buy and they only had two HR10-250s in stock. I asked the BB associate if I was puchasing the equip for $499 or leasing it. He said it would be a considered a purchase. Guess I'll find out for sure once I call D* and activate it.


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## RonH54 (Jul 3, 2004)

I'd like to see D* try to take away an item from someone that was purchased from a company besides D*...LOL


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## Philly Bill (Oct 6, 2004)

Wow. I don't even see ANY TIVOs on 6th Aves website anymore. I guess they're not selling them any longer.


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## 300M (Dec 1, 2005)

300M said:


> I went to my local Best Buy and they only had two HR10-250s in stock. I asked the BB associate if I was puchasing the equip for $499 or leasing it. He said it would be a considered a purchase. Guess I'll find out for sure once I call D* and activate it.


Just got off the phone with D*. The agent activated the receiver no questions asked. When I look at my D* account online, I see that there is a pro-rated leasing charge of $2.33 and an additional receiver credit of $2.33. Looks like the leasing fee is a replacement for the additional receiver fee. I just wanted to get an HR10-250 before they disappear forever.


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## hiker (Nov 29, 2001)

It's my understanding that after 2/28 all D* equipment will be considered leased whether obtained directly from D* or from a retailer. There's a brief explanation of leasing on the CC website here.
Notice the first sentence " Receivers activated after 3/1/06 will be subject to terms and conditions of the DIRECTV lease model."

Has anyone yet got a reading on how they will deal with previously owned equipment?
For example, if I want to upgrade my owned HD DVR HR10 with the new model HR20 when available, will I not own the HR20 but lease it?


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## BanditoB (Feb 9, 2006)

If you have to pay $499.00 to lease the HR10-250 now and you cancel service a few months down the road, wouldn't they have to refund the $499.00. You don't own it, they do, so when it's returned you should get your money back.

My guess is that these rules won't last very long as customers learn about them and just say no thanks. That along with the limitation on what equipment you can have is totally outrageous.

I'll buy what I want to and take my business elsewhere if this keeps up for very long.


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## schuang74 (Sep 6, 2002)

I purchased the HR10-250 on the 28th from Best Buy. I am hoping to go back now and do a price match from the price I bought it for ($599) to the price they list it at now ($499). Since they seem oblivious to the current lease pricing, I think I should get a $100 back along with the $200 rebate I will apply for, for activating new HD service. I am hoping this will work.....


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## onin24eagle (Feb 17, 2006)

Philly Bill said:


> Wow. I don't even see ANY TIVOs on 6th Aves website anymore. I guess they're not selling them any longer.


Just got an email that mine shipped. Last I checked it was in PA on its way to me.


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## Paul_PDX (Nov 12, 2002)

This is on the Circuit City site (amazing DirecTV site still talks about purchasing):

DIRECTV® equipment leasing 
Receivers activated after 3/1/06 will be subject to terms and conditions of the DIRECTV lease model. Equipment available for leasing includes standard receivers, digital video recorder (DVR) receivers, high-definition (HD) receivers, and HD DVR receivers. A maximum of six (6) receivers may be leased per year, but not more than two (2) DVR receivers, two (2) HD receivers and one (1) HD DVR receiver may by leased in a given year. Hardware offer ends 7/1/06. On approved credit. A programming commitment is required. Existing DIRECTV customers may upgrade their current owned hardware by leasing a second DVR receiver or HD receiver for $99.99 or an HD DVD receiver for $499.99. Standard professional installation is included with the lease of a receiver. A separate monthly equipment leasing fee of $4.99 applies. Other applicable fees include a monthly DVR leasing fee of $5.99 per month (required with the lease of a DVR receiver), and an HD fee of $10.99 a month (with optional HD service). Programming is sold separately.


So does this mean those of us who bought from 6ave last week and haven't received or activated yet can be forced into a lease where we have to give the boxes back?

Also will they honor the rebate?? -- it said purchase by Feb 28 and activate within 30 days.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

Philly Bill said:


> Wow. I don't even see ANY TIVOs on 6th Aves website anymore. I guess they're not selling them any longer.


valueelectronics seems to have their normal HDtivo page up



BanditoB said:


> You don't own it, they do, so when it's returned you should get your money back.
> .


No offense to you but that really made me laugh. I know you dont believe it so I feel safe saying that. It does exemplify what a joke DTV is becoming. If you cancel even in one day, you lost 500 bucks.

I'll be monitoring the financials to see how many new customers they get this year.


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## schuang74 (Sep 6, 2002)

newsposter said:


> valueelectronics seems to have their normal HDtivo page up
> 
> No offense to you but that really made me laugh. I know you dont believe it so I feel safe saying that. It does exemplify what a joke DTV is becoming. If you cancel even in one day, you lost 500 bucks.
> 
> I'll be monitoring the financials to see how many new customers they get this year.


It will be interesting to see how they will do. With the $499 charge you are essentially paying for their "depreciation" costs. You know that there is absolutley no way they will be redeploying any of this hardware if and when it gets returned. Espcially since this isn't forward compatible with any of the Mpeg 4 services. I think its a bad call on their part. But companies do crazy things when they aren't performing well. There may be an actual reason to call their Retention Services number now.


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## Dignan (Jan 27, 2002)

I finally called, the CSR made no mention of the $499 leasing fee, just $4.99 for the addtional receiver. I checked on my account online and it says Leased Receiver Fee $4.99, nothing else. I probably screwed up by not pressing the whole buy vs. lease status of my account but I did mention that I bought it last week. I have 4 upgraded receivers at this point, not going anywhere for a while.

I'm just glad I kept my distant SD nets and LA HD networks ("mover").

I'm going to get on with my life now and watch some HD....


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## fastep (May 22, 2004)

Paul_PDX said:


> This is on the Circuit City site (amazing DirecTV site still talks about purchasing):
> 
> DIRECTV® equipment leasing
> Receivers activated after 3/1/06 will be subject to terms and conditions of the DIRECTV lease model. Equipment available for leasing includes standard receivers, digital video recorder (DVR) receivers, high-definition (HD) receivers, and HD DVR receivers. A maximum of six (6) receivers may be leased per year, but not more than two (2) DVR receivers, two (2) HD receivers and one (1) HD DVR receiver may by leased in a given year. Hardware offer ends 7/1/06. On approved credit. A programming commitment is required. Existing DIRECTV customers may upgrade their current owned hardware by leasing a second DVR receiver or HD receiver for $99.99 or an HD DVD receiver for $499.99. Standard professional installation is included with the lease of a receiver. A separate monthly equipment leasing fee of $4.99 applies. Other applicable fees include a monthly DVR leasing fee of $5.99 per month (required with the lease of a DVR receiver), and an HD fee of $10.99 a month (with optional HD service). Programming is sold separately.
> ...


In addition, the "lease" fee does not include insurance against defects. You must spend an additional $5.99 per month for this. DTV better do an indept competitive analysis QUICK if they want to survive. Customers may be loyal but they're not DUMB!!!!!!!!!!


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## hiker (Nov 29, 2001)

fastep said:


> In addition, the "lease" fee does not include insurance against defects. You must spend an additional $5.99 per month for this. DTV better do an indept competitive analysis QUICK if they want to survive. Customers may be loyal but they're not DUMB!!!!!!!!!!


The lease agreement includes without additional cost the protection plan for the receiver or DVR so defective replacement is included. But it does not cover the dish, multiswitch, wiring and the $5.99 is optional to cover those items.


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## fastep (May 22, 2004)

hiker said:


> The lease agreement includes without additional cost the protection plan for the receiver or DVR so defective replacement is included. But it does not cover the dish, multiswitch, wiring and the $5.99 is optional to cover those items.


I apologize if this is true. I called yesterday and retention supervisor told me the lease agreement did not cover protection of the unit. Does any one else have feedback on this?


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## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

I activated mine last night. No real problems, though I was clear with teh guy up front that I bought this last week and I definietly did not want a lease. He did say that the computer automatically assumes lease and puts that in there, so he had to manually go and change it.

I called the rgular number to do it and I simply asked that since I was commiting myself for another 2 years, if they could give me anything in return for that and he put me on hold for a minute, then said they would give us programming credits of $20 per month for 6 months. Sure, some got slightly better and I might have if I had called retention and threatened to leave, but all-in all I am happy to get the HR10-250 for a net cost of $97. Heck, the hard drive is worth that almost. 

Really, the guy was extremly competent, pleasant and went out of his way to make it easy. One of the best CSR experiences I have had in a while with any company.

Now, I just need to get used to how glacially slow this thing is compared to the SD DVR 40 with 6.2 it is replacing.


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## DCBnG (Mar 1, 2006)

Lee L said:


> I activated mine last night. No real problems, though I was clear with teh guy up front that I bought this last week and I definietly did not want a lease. He did say that the computer automatically assumes lease and puts that in there, so he had to manually go and change it.
> 
> I called the rgular number to do it and I simply asked that since I was commiting myself for another 2 years, if they could give me anything in return for that and he put me on hold for a minute, then said they would give us programming credits of $20 per month for 6 months. Sure, some got slightly better and I might have if I had called retention and threatened to leave, but all-in all I am happy to get the HR10-250 for a net cost of $97. Heck, the hard drive is worth that almost.
> 
> ...


Hmm, I'll be calling tonight to activate mine that I bought on the 27th. I'll let everyone know how it goes....

Though it irks me to think of it as a lease...I'm wondering if I'm better off as I'd have their protection on the box right? That way if it busts, I can just call it in. Though, could anyone spell out the drawbacks of the lease, other than the monthly fee? My understanding is that i'd have to pay the monthly fee anyways....


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## riekl (Jan 29, 2001)

So lets look at this now ..

DirecTV -- $499 , plus a monthly fee, and you don't own the equipment

Comcast -- -$400 (yes thats a -), $10/month, and you don't own the equipment but any new dvr's that come out you can upgrade for free.

WTF is DTV doing ? Are they TRYING to push customers to Comcast ? Now that Cable providers have HD LIL and are picking up many of the sports packages, and DTV is dumping Tivo ..

What possible reason is there to stay with DTV ? You can get Comcast cheaper (for 16 months with their dishbuy program which will cut $25 off your bill) no upfront hardware costs, and in most area you get your LIL HD, in addition to OnDemand.

It sure didnt take News Corp long to figure out how to kill every single one of DTV's advantages did it ?


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## af250xxl (Jan 24, 2006)

I am so confused now... 

If I go to BestBuy tonight and buy a HD DVR, I don't actually own it? Does this mean I have to return it to D* if I decided to cancel service? How about the 
$499 I paid BestBuy? Will I get the $499 back? Is the $499 sort of like a security
desposit?


The Mercedes minivan(um.. I meant R-class) that I ordered is arriving on Friday. 
When I walk into the dealership to sign the lease, will I be expected to pay
$50,000 for the minivan and then pay a monthly lease for 3 years? (and return
the vehicle after three years)


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## phox_mulder (Feb 23, 2006)

You buy it from Best Buy or any other retail store, you own it.

You buy it from DirecTV, you are leasing it and it is not yours.


phox


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## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

Not necesarrily. AFAIK, if you buy it for $499 from Best Buy, you do not own it and will not get your money back. If you buy it somewhere for $749, it is yours.


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## af250xxl (Jan 24, 2006)

are there any lawyers around here interested in a class-action lawsuit against D*? 

Isn't it illegall to make people pay for the cost of the equipment and then demand
lease payment of the same equipment?

Is it just me or is D* digging a hole for itself? 


Cable companies are not wasting any minute with this issue. My local company, Cox, has sent me a post card with a list of reasons for me to ditch D* and go back to Cox. One of the reason listed was "Do you realize that you do not own the DirecTV receivers?" (this post card was dated 2/25/06.... so Cox was probably watchin DirecTV's move very closely)


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## tubs (Feb 28, 2002)

So I can buy an HR10-250 from somebody locally for ~$250. He claims it's never been activated and he's selling because his new house doesn't have line of site. The seller has a receipt dated October, 05. If I buy it and activate it, is DTV going to put me on the lease program? Also is this a good deal? What's the best way for me to get a dish for it? I'm a new customer...

TIA


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

here's a good summary of leasing

http://www.longhornxp.net/directv-urgent.html

I didn't copy/paste because it appears he changes it with some regularity and dont want to post bad info


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## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

tubs, even if it had been activated, there is no reason they should not put it under an ownership program. HEck the fact that it was activated before would be good proof that it was not bought recently.


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## DVRaholic (Mar 28, 2004)

Cablevision's SA 8300HD DVR (24 hrs HD, 140 hrs SD)

Is looking much more attractive with $0 down and $9.99 per month
with NO contract!!

Also to add a external drive is easy Plug-n-Play SATA
The drive formats itself and is ready to go in minutes.

I think its time to suspend my account for the maximum 9 months
until Directv can get their act together


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## tubs (Feb 28, 2002)

You might want to try out that 8300HD before you get too excited. Depending on which OS is run by your cable company, the 8300HD can either be a great performer or a buggy dog. In my case (TW in Austin, TX), it messes up recordings regularly, is missing basic functions and overall just sucks. I believe I run the SARA software. Read more at avsforums.


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## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

DVRaholic said:


> Cablevision's SA 8300HD DVR (24 hrs HD, 140 hrs SD)
> 
> Is looking much more attractive with $0 down and $9.99 per month
> with NO contract!!
> ...


Hope you'll find this useful. I posted it in another thread. Still haven't returned it, cuz I needed the extra tuners, but it IS definitely going back before my 30 days is up.

By the way, if you do not currently have a digital channel package, you will need the $4.95 Navigation package to get the interactive channel guide. Otherwise, you just have a digital VCR and you need to manually set recordings. 


drew2k said:


> Here's the Cablevision scoop:
> 
> *Equipment:* Scientific Atlanta 8300HD
> *Monthly DVR Service Fee:* $9.95
> ...


This is SARA software, and my biggest beefs about the box are:

- lack of tick-marks while playing back a recording. 
- Every time I try to leave the DVR-list ("Now Playing"), it's a different key combination. Can't seem to figure out why. 
- To see the guide, have to press Guide then select. 
- The guide only shows 4 rows and to see info about the highlighted show, have to press INFO again, then press INFO again to clear it. 
- Can't assign priorities to scheduled recordings. 
- Dual tuners are enabled, but to swap, have to open pip, switch windows, and close pip. 
- The onscreen graphics look like crap on a 42" plasma. 
- And on and on ...

It's definitely not TiVo ... I'm waiting for TiVo Series 3 and will rent the cable card from Cablevision for $1.45 a month...


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## tubs (Feb 28, 2002)

Honestly, I think you missed the two biggest beefs I have the my 8300HD running SARA on TWC:

- When wanting to watch a recording already in progress, you're forced to start watching "live" and use the 3x rewind to go back to the beginning. AND, there's no skip to beginning to handle this...

- Also, if you're watching a recording in progress but are still in the buffer (not live), you'll be kicked out of the show when the recording ends real time. You'll then need to play it again from the BEGINNING and fast forward to the point you were watching. Simply unbelievable to me that they have not fixed this.


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## Mary H (Jun 16, 2003)

Aren't you fellows a bit off-track? Isn't this thread supposed to be about the HR10-250?


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## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

See, I can't even criticize it properly because I've only had it for about two weeks, and have spent as little time as possible using it! I have never used it "live", so I have not matched your experience, but it is a total wonder to me that this software ever left a quality assurance shop with passing marks... 

(The designers certainly seemed to have skipped a usability lab, as well.)


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## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

Mary H said:


> Aren't you fellows a bit off-track? Isn't this thread supposed to be about the HR10-250?


yes it is, and now the poster looking into the 8300HD may have a litle more incentive to check out the HR10-250: reliable (if slow), well-tested and mostly-praised user interface, excellent search abilities, etc.


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