# Software Version 11.0j



## adamshipley (Aug 21, 2002)

I noticed that I had a pending restart this afternoon and my series3 was upgraded to 11.0j. I did a quick check around the menus and I don't see anything different. 

Does anybody know what it adds or fixes?


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

You're supposed to tell us. You're the one with new software. 

Obviously TiVo has started the CS Ramp. Only a select portion of the users get the update at first so TiVo can see if there are ill effects without affecting everyone at once.
Last update, very few people posted until the software was fully released.

We know what _needs_ to be fixed - grey screens on analog channels, and the reboot problem when you lose the network while watching Netflix, to name a couple.

We should know more in a couple of weeks.


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## DaveDFW (Jan 25, 2005)

steve614 said:


> ...We know what _needs_ to be fixed - grey screens on analog channels, and the reboot problem when you lose the network while watching Netflix, to name a couple...


And a fix for Suggestions for those of us with TAs.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

Did they skiip 11.0i ? Or did that go to another country?


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

They probably skipped i so people wouldn't confuse it for an l or a 1, although I don't know why that would make a difference.


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## adamshipley (Aug 21, 2002)

The only issue I have seen with my Tivo is the Netflix rebooting. 

I went and pulled the network cable while playing a movie. I came back 10 min later and plugged it back in. The tivo didn't reboot but was locked up. After waiting another 10 min. I had to pull the power cable to restart the tivo. So 11.0j didn't fix that issue.


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

We just started CS Ramp for 11.0j, which should resolve persistent grey screens on analog channels and GSAS (green screen and screeching/siren)

We'll be reviewing all CS cases for a little longer than normal to see if this can be released to the wider audience. If we do roll, it will only take a few days to get to all S3 HD boxes, so there is no priority list to sign up for.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

Thanks for the clarification, Jerry.

Any word on a fix for the "no suggestions" bug many of us are seeing?


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

Arcady said:


> Thanks for the clarification, Jerry.
> 
> Any word on a fix for the "no suggestions" bug many of us are seeing?


....or on the SDV tuning failures many of us see?


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## Martin Tupper (Dec 18, 2003)

TiVoJerry said:


> We just started CS Ramp for 11.0j, which should resolve persistent grey screens on analog channels and GSAS (green screen and screeching/siren)
> 
> We'll be reviewing all CS cases for a little longer than normal to see if this can be released to the wider audience. If we do roll, it will only take a few days to get to all S3 HD boxes, so there is no priority list to sign up for.


Jerry,

Thanks for the update (about the update).


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## dcstager (Feb 16, 2002)

Since series 3 and 4 tivos depend so much on reliable operation of the tuning adapter, that should be near the top of bug fix list. I have not experienced any bugs more serious than the SDV tuning issue, but in Austin at least, the problem is gone with the 1202 firmware update. Here's what my TA reports from the diagnostic screen:

PTV OS: Explorer1kg6 NGP OS
FLASH: STA1.0.0_1520_LR_F.1202
App(s) SARA v1.61.41.a101

I hope those are the right numbers the technical people need to know about.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

dcstager said:


> Since series 3 and 4 tivos depend so much on reliable operation of the tuning adapter, that should be near the top of bug fix list. I have not experienced any bugs more serious than the SDV tuning issue, but in Austin at least, the problem is gone with the 1202 firmware update. Here's what my TA reports from the diagnostic screen:
> 
> PTV OS: Explorer1kg6 NGP OS
> FLASH: STA1.0.0_1520_LR_F.1202
> ...


How recently did you get the .1202 firmware update? I think most Cisco TA's are on .1001 still. How certain are you the tuning failures went away with the .1202 update? I'm almost afraid to ask TWC Southwest Ohio about pushing a new update. When they first tried to push .1001 they killed all the TA's for a day. At least I got a $5 credit for loss of service.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

TiVoJerry said:


> We just started CS Ramp for 11.0j, which should resolve persistent grey screens on analog channels and GSAS (green screen and screeching/siren)


Jerry,

That's great! My brother will be very happy as he still got these occassionally even after installing CableCards.

Any chance that you can give us any information on the cause and the fix? It didn't seem to affect the original S3 so something with the tuner and/or chipset?

Thanks!

Scott


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## dcstager (Feb 16, 2002)

I did not notice when the update occurred, but I think in August. Causal reasoning is always difficult, I can only say I have not had a missed SDV recording since around the same time. I didn't even check the firmware until the tuning adapter stopped working as a result of an outage that occurred here because of effects from hurricane Hermine. I had to unplug and replug in the tuning adapter and while checking it's operation, noticed the firmware update. The outage was on the evening of September 6 and I rebooted on September 7. I'd definitely demand the firmware update. This is the first time it's operated completely reliably since SDV was implemented. Since Tivo denys responsibility for the problem and won't include any retuning adjustments to workaround the problem, this is the only chance there is of fixing it.


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## DaveDFW (Jan 25, 2005)

Arcady said:


> Thanks for the clarification, Jerry.
> 
> Any word on a fix for the "no suggestions" bug many of us are seeing?


One of my S3s has received the J update. The suggestions list is still empty.

I assume from Tivo's silence on this issue that they have no interest in correcting it.


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

DaveDFW said:


> One of my S3s has received the J update. The suggestions list is still empty.
> 
> I assume from Tivo's silence on this issue that they have no interest in correcting it.


If you mean by TiVoJerry's silence, you read too much into it. I just haven't taken the opportunity to familiarize myself with that particular investigation and all of its intricacies enough to post a knowledgeable reply.


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## bobdirt (Feb 26, 2010)

well lets see from what i know that the 11.0j software update is supposed to fix the gray screening with HD and XL boxes that are affected by it as well as a green screen with siren that is annoying they have looking into this and they sent out this SW update to fix the gray screen issue all boxes should receive the update soon enough


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## DaveDFW (Jan 25, 2005)

TiVoJerry said:


> If you mean by TiVoJerry's silence...


My comment wasn't directed at you personally--I appreciate having Tivo folks represented on the board.


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## mattld1 (Aug 17, 2010)

By the "gray/black screen issue" are we referring to the issue several of us in Houston on Comcast (and any other providers) are experiencing where when we tune to 2-3 specific HD channels it causes the entire cable signal to go dead (i.e. put a gray/black screen up) with the only known fix being to restart the TiVo?


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## djwilso (Dec 23, 2006)

dlfl said:


> How recently did you get the .1202 firmware update? I think most Cisco TA's are on .1001 still. How certain are you the tuning failures went away with the .1202 update? I'm almost afraid to ask TWC Southwest Ohio about pushing a new update. When they first tried to push .1001 they killed all the TA's for a day. At least I got a $5 credit for loss of service.


Here in Phoenix (Cox Cable), I have F.0901 on my TA with almost no issues other than every once in a great while all channels will go black, requiring a power cycle of the TA and TiVo to get signal back.

Tuning channels works with no problems, so I am very grateful.


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

DaveDFW said:


> One of my S3s has received the J update. The suggestions list is still empty.
> 
> I assume from Tivo's silence on this issue that they have no interest in correcting it.


I've found out a little more about the lack of Suggestions issue. I can't say much but suffice it to say that the issue is being worked on. I thought you would like to know.


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## dcstager (Feb 16, 2002)

I've been putting the Series 3 through a lot of trial and error. The SDV tuning bug is still there when you are channel surfing manually. Some channels still require a tune up tune down key sequence to tune in the desired channel. However, all of my scheduled recordings have been occurring without a hitch. My machine hasn't missed one for months, and I'm assuming it has something to do with the 1202 firmware update, but there's no way to know. My best guess is that the bug has more to do with the infrastructure of the cable company's SDV distribution system or software.

Here in Austin we have very good Tivo savvy technical people, so I bet behind the scenes someone has worked on this from the inside at the local Time-Warner and just made sure they have updated and tweaked all the settings and software within their control. I'm going to guess that not all local cable operators are as concerned or making the effort to address this kind of problem that affects relatively few customers.

Now, if I can just get time warner to make a deal with the NFL network. It seems like the NFL HD channel is a glaring omission in the channel lineup. I've read all the wikipedia stuff about NFL channel demanding they get a spot on a basic cable channel or some deal killing restriction. But come on, let's try getting that channel again. Maybe one side or the other has softened.


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## vectorcatch (Nov 21, 2008)

TiVoJerry,

Just curious, but it seems like TiVo has suddenly has been dumping a little more effort into getting some long time issues fixed and seems to be responding to new ones (i.e. Premiere "out of memory") a little more quickly than in the past.

Has the software effort increased in this regard or is it in my head? Regardless, I wanted to let you know it is much appreciated.


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## SCSIRAID (Feb 2, 2003)

TiVoJerry said:


> I've found out a little more about the lack of Suggestions issue. I can't say much but suffice it to say that the issue is being worked on. I thought you would like to know.


Great news Jerry.... My S3 and THD havent recorded suggestions in a loooong time. My wife really misses the suggestions...

Thanks,


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## SCSIRAID (Feb 2, 2003)

dcstager said:


> I've been putting the Series 3 through a lot of trial and error. The SDV tuning bug is still there when you are channel surfing manually. Some channels still require a tune up tune down key sequence to tune in the desired channel. However, all of my scheduled recordings have been occurring without a hitch. My machine hasn't missed one for months, and I'm assuming it has something to do with the 1202 firmware update, but there's no way to know. My best guess is that the bug has more to do with the infrastructure of the cable company's SDV distribution system or software.
> 
> Here in Austin we have very good Tivo savvy technical people, so I bet behind the scenes someone has worked on this from the inside at the local Time-Warner and just made sure they have updated and tweaked all the settings and software within their control. I'm going to guess that not all local cable operators are as concerned or making the effort to address this kind of problem that affects relatively few customers.
> 
> Now, if I can just get time warner to make a deal with the NFL network. It seems like the NFL HD channel is a glaring omission in the channel lineup. I've read all the wikipedia stuff about NFL channel demanding they get a spot on a basic cable channel or some deal killing restriction. But come on, let's try getting that channel again. Maybe one side or the other has softened.


We still have the SDV tuning bug here in Raleigh. Doesnt happen all that often but missing a recording because the TiVo and TA cant get on the same frequency is frustrating. Dont know whose problem it is but TiVo could work around it very easily.


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## DaveDFW (Jan 25, 2005)

TiVoJerry said:


> I've found out a little more about the lack of Suggestions issue. I can't say much but suffice it to say that the issue is being worked on. I thought you would like to know.


Great, thanks for the info!


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## oViTynoT (May 18, 2007)

...probably a final push to get to a point they won't get a lot of backlash for EOS'ing the box.


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## dcstager (Feb 16, 2002)

SCSIRAID said:


> We still have the SDV tuning bug here in Raleigh. Doesnt happen all that often but missing a recording because the TiVo and TA cant get on the same frequency is frustrating. Dont know whose problem it is but TiVo could work around it very easily.


Of course as soon as I said I haven't missed a recording in months - the darn thing missed a recording this afternoon. I still have 11h. I was getting pretty hopeful there. I did a lot of dual SDV recording tests and everything and no problems. But, as soon as I post it's fixed, it turns out that it isn't.

What now?


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## theguru1974 (Apr 9, 2002)

I've read this whole thread and still am not sure - is the 11j version supposed to fix the live TV freezing (black screen) issue on HD channels?


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## BigJimOutlaw (Mar 21, 2004)

It's intended to fix a bug that causes analog channels to freeze or go to gray/black screens. Digital HD channels are unrelated to this particular fix.


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

We have fixed persistent grey/black (depending on letterbox color setting) screens on analog channels in LiveTV (one or both tuners). Menus are still fine, digital channels are fine, playback is fine.

We have fixed Green Screens with Screeching/Siren Audio. Caused by toxic channels. May not always be a green screen, may not come with the siren audio. Box is completely locked up at this point.

Based on your problem description, I don't know what you are experiencing. Some people refer to a loss of video as a "freeze" even though the box is not locked up. It is possible you are experiencing either issue and you could see resolution with this release.

However, I have also seen a relatively recent thread describing a new issue that is not resolved with the latest SW.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

TiVoJerry said:


> We have fixed persistent grey/black (depending on letterbox color setting) screens on analog channels in LiveTV (one or both tuners). Menus are still fine, digital channels are fine, playback is fine.
> 
> We have fixed Green Screens with Screeching/Siren Audio. Caused by toxic channels. May not always be a green screen, may not come with the siren audio. Box is completely locked up at this point.
> 
> ...


Wish you'd speed up the distribution. I'm still at version h and just got the first gray screen I've had in 3 months or so. TiVoHD recording ended 30 secs into a program. LiveTV was showing gray screen. SD-H400 on same splitter had no problem recording the same program.


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## PeteTV (May 6, 2006)

I received 11.0j on my original S3 around the beginning of Sep and ever since I've been seeing a couple odd things (possibly unrelated) and I'm wondering if anyone else with 11.0j has seen these and if they are known problems:

1) The system will temporarily freeze. The video stops and the system won't respond to any commands from the remote. If I do nothing, about 5-10 seconds later it starts up again, just where it left off. If I happen to press a bunch of buttons on the remote while the system was frozen (as I did in the beginning when it first started to happen), then when the system resumes it will process all those commands at once, so I might see indications such as the progress bar on/off, info area on/off, into the menus, back to live tv, all depending on exactly what buttons I pressed.

It's not a problem with the particular show, because I can replay the section where it froze and it will work just fine. It behaves as though some other process has consumed all the CPU preventing anything else from happening.

2) Video Stuttering. Prior to 11.0j I would very rarely see a problem where there was a brief interruption in the video with pixelation and skip a small section. I generally attributed it to a problem from the original source (ie the cable provider). In other words, not a problem with the TiVo. But after 11.0j it seems like it's become much more frequent to the point where I wonder if it is the TiVo. In this case, the system doesn't freeze, it will still respond to commands from the remote and replaying the bad section doesn't help, so the video must have been recorded with the bad section. This very well may still be a problem with the source, but given the freezing problem that **SEEMS** to have been introduced with 11.0j, I'm wondering if this could be associated with 11.0j as well.


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

11.0j started CS Ramp on 9/15. *If *your issues were happening before that date, the software would not have been a factor. You may wish to perform a Kickstart 54 to see if any hard drive errors surface.


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## PeteTV (May 6, 2006)

TiVoJerry said:


> 11.0j started CS Ramp on 9/15. *If *your issues were happening before that date, the software would not have been a factor.


It definitely started happening after I received 11.0j... I didn't recall exactly when that was, I thought it was "around" the beginning of Sep, but if 11.0j wasn't released until 9/15, then I must have received it around mid Sep.



TiVoJerry said:


> You may wish to perform a Kickstart 54 to see if any hard drive errors surface.


I started a KS54 and it passed the Initial/Short and Conveyance tests. Working on the Extended test, but so far no issues.

I previously had a WD MyDVR Expander and it had hard-drive problems, but that behaved differently. During that period, the video would stop, but the system wouldn't freeze. It would still respond to commands from the remote. And if I replayed the program it would cause the same error at the same point. This seems different, mainly because it causes the entire system to freeze and replaying the same section works.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

TiVoJerry said:


> 11.0j started CS Ramp on 9/15. .......


I still don't have it. How long is the "ramp" ?

It's not pending restart either.


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## wtkflhn (May 12, 2006)

TiVoJerry said:


> 11.0j started CS Ramp on 9/15. *If *your issues were happening before that date, the software would not have been a factor. You may wish to perform a Kickstart 54 to see if any hard drive errors surface.


Jerry.

I am having a different problem. I have 3 TIVO's. An S3 and 2 HD's. Since 11.0h came out, I have seen the network icons from my various TIVO's pretty much come and go, at will. While the icons were gone, this would not stop the TIVO from connecting to the network for a download. Untill this week!! Now, my S3 looses its network connectivty entirely. The diagnostics show no signal. But the other TIVO on the wireless portion of the network, is working fine. So, I don't think it's a network problem. Booting or power cycling the TIVO does not correct the problem. I replaced the USB and the Antennae, to no avail. I'm, at this point, not sure if it's a software problem or a hardware problem. Again, I did not have ANY of this problems before 11.0h came out.

So, I guess my questions to you are, when will you start pushing out 11.0j, and do you think it will help me any?

Don H.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

PeteTV said:


> I received 11.0j on my original S3 around the beginning of Sep and ever since I've been seeing a couple odd things (possibly unrelated) and I'm wondering if anyone else with 11.0j has seen these and if they are known problems:


Your issues sound like a hard drive starting to go bad.

It may or may not be that.. but even if it IS that, people often seem to think it's related to a software update, just because that's when they notice more problems happening.. or that (IIRC) the new software is on a different partition of the drive than the previous software was so if there is now an area of the drive with a bad spot being used more often, it can cause glitches.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

tcfcameron said:


> "CS Ramp", as TiVoJerry has stated in various threads, is a one-time, one-off, distribution to completely random TiVos. It is not an ongoing process.
> 
> It is a buffer, to allow for the people who receive it to call CS and report any problems they experience. If the CS load is minimal, and no show-stopping new bugs surface, it will go to public release.
> 
> ...


I guess I was somewhat confused because the TiVo "Software Version" page says 11.0j is the version for my HD. Based on what you say, that seems premature until "the time comes" and "TiVoJerry will post an announcement".


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## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

dlfl said:


> I guess I was somewhat confused because the TiVo "Software Version" page says 11.0j is the version for my HD. Based on what you say, that seems premature until "the time comes" and "TiVoJerry will post an announcement".


My S3 also shows 11.0j (but my HD is still on 11.0h). I have no idea when I got the new version on the S3 - didn't look until just now. Either we are part of the totally random selection for the CS Ramp, or the roll out has started.


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

V7Goose said:


> My S3 also shows 11.0j (but my HD is still on 11.0h). I have no idea when I got the new version on the S3 - didn't look until just now. Either we are part of the totally random selection for the CS Ramp, or the roll out has started.


Or, the 11.0j for S3 TiVos is not the same thing as 11.0j for the S3/HD TiVos. Just because they are keeping the version revision the same between the two, doesn't necessarily mean the software is actually the same. That's as far as I care to speculate on it.

I just performed TiVo Service Connections on all four of my TiVo HD units, and none of them downloaded anything new. I don't have an S3 to check.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

dlfl said:


> I guess I was somewhat confused because the TiVo "Software Version" page says 11.0j is the version for my HD. Based on what you say, that seems premature until "the time comes" and "TiVoJerry will post an announcement".


@V7Goose.

You asked "why premature?" (in the title of this post) Because I think if TiVo says 11.0j is the correct software version for my HD on their web pages, my HD should be picking it up when it connects -- which it hasn't -- and it is connecting OK every day.


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

Sorry for the confusion. CS updated the SW version page prematurely. 11.0j is still under review. I will not post a release date until the switch has been thrown.


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## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

dlfl said:


> @V7Goose.
> 
> You asked "why premature?" (in the title of this post) Because I think if TiVo says 11.0j is the correct software version for my HD on their web pages, my HD should be picking it up when it connects -- which it hasn't -- and it is connecting OK every day.


Seems like I misunderstood you. I thought you were saying that your TiVo box was showing that you had 11.0j (like my S3 does), and I didn't know why you thought that was premature. Sorry.
Goose


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

TiVoJerry said:


> Sorry for the confusion. CS updated the SW version page prematurely. 11.0j is still under review. I will not post a release date until the switch has been thrown.


Thanks! At this point I wish I hadn't said anything. I was probably the only person who even noticed this anyway.  I would rather your time be spent on important things (like the SDV tuning retry issue, hint, hint ) than on these little details.


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## chrisdfw (Dec 4, 2008)

DaveDFW said:


> One of my S3s has received the J update. The suggestions list is still empty.
> 
> I assume from Tivo's silence on this issue that they have no interest in correcting it.


On the suggestions bug. Mine also stopped working when the tuning adopter was deployed and would populate when I unplugged it. For the past two weeks my TiVo has been complaining about running out of guide data. Finally it had no guide data and had an error when loading the downloaded data. To fix this I deleted guide data and suggestions. After the reset the TiVo is now recording suggestions. Has anyone else tried this to fix this bug?


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## dcstager (Feb 16, 2002)

How do you go about deleting guide data?


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## SCSIRAID (Feb 2, 2003)

chrisdfw said:


> On the suggestions bug. Mine also stopped working when the tuning adopter was deployed and would populate when I unplugged it. For the past two weeks my TiVo has been complaining about running out of guide data. Finally it had no guide data and had an error when loading the downloaded data. To fix this I deleted guide data and suggestions. After the reset the TiVo is now recording suggestions. Has anyone else tried this to fix this bug?


THe only way I have been able to get suggestions going is to unplug the TA for a couple hours. The suggestions page will then repopulate. I can then plug the TA back in and suggestions will record for several days and then dwindle as the ones that populated the page get recorded... Then its back to one in a blue moon.


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## jeremyz (Apr 12, 2006)

mattack said:


> Your issues sound like a hard drive starting to go bad.
> 
> It may or may not be that.. but even if it IS that, people often seem to think it's related to a software update, just because that's when they notice more problems happening.. or that (IIRC) the new software is on a different partition of the drive than the previous software was so if there is now an area of the drive with a bad spot being used more often, it can cause glitches.


I've had the same/similar video stuttering issues concurrent with the same software deploy. It's frustrating.


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

dcstager said:


> How do you go about deleting guide data?


I don't know for sure because I have never done it myself, but there is an option under "Restart or Reset System" called "Clear program information & To Do List" that sounds like it would accomplish that.


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## dcstager (Feb 16, 2002)

steve614 said:


> I don't know for sure because I have never done it myself, but there is an option under "Restart or Reset System" called "Clear program information & To Do List" that sounds like it would accomplish that.


Sorry, the other poster said you fix the suggestion bug by deleting guide data. Seems pretty drastic and there isn't any way of doing it without erasing almost everything else too.

It sure seems like it's a bug, but maybe the Series 4 is non-compliant with the SDV spec and the Series 3 is complaint with the spec. Even if the cable companies deny programming their systems to reject speculative recordings - it's not like they are infallible in their knowledge and operation of the software that controls the SDV systems. In spite of the apparent evidence to the contrary, I'm looking to Occam's razor to explain the symptoms.


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## chrisdfw (Dec 4, 2008)

dcstager said:


> Sorry, the other poster said you fix the suggestion bug by deleting guide data. Seems pretty drastic and there isn't any way of doing it without erasing almost everything else too.
> 
> It sure seems like it's a bug, but maybe the Series 4 is non-compliant with the SDV spec and the Series 3 is complaint with the spec. Even if the cable companies deny programming their systems to reject speculative recordings - it's not like they are infallible in their knowledge and operation of the software that controls the SDV systems. In spite of the apparent evidence to the contrary, I'm looking to Occam's razor to explain the symptoms.


I am still getting suggestions after the guide delete. It does not remove any recorded content on seasons passes. It just removes thumbs up and guide. My guess is a bug, but bug related to SDV causing corrupted guide data.


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## Hawkeye22 (Aug 8, 2007)

TiVoJerry said:


> We have fixed persistent grey/black (depending on letterbox color setting) screens on analog channels in LiveTV (one or both tuners). Menus are still fine, digital channels are fine, playback is fine.


I've had 11.0j for about 3 weeks. Yesterday was the first time I got the black screen since the update. I had to reboot the tivo to fix it. I haven't reported it to TiVo yet since it was only a one time occurance. I have basic cable (analog) and antenna (OTA). Before 11.0j I used to get balck screens about once every 10-14 days.

If it happens again, I'll be sure to notify TiVo.


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

My S3 connected this morning and no 11.0J. Maybe it's only being pushed out to HD models?


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

morac said:


> My S3 connected this morning and no 11.0J. Maybe it's only being pushed out to HD models?


I forced 2 connections this morning and 1 last night. Still no love on the THD.

Robb


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## sbourgeo (Nov 10, 2000)

I got it on my HD last night.


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## janry (Jan 2, 2003)

Got it yesterday. I wasn't having any problems before so I hope this didn't break anything.


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## whitepelican (Feb 15, 2005)

morac said:


> My S3 connected this morning and no 11.0J. Maybe it's only being pushed out to HD models?


I just got it on one of my S3 units.


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## tiassa (Jul 2, 2008)

I thought I had gotten it this AM since one of my THD's had rebooted, jut it isstill showing version "h"


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## deandashl (Aug 8, 2008)

How do you know your TiVo has rebooted?


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## a68oliver (Jul 15, 2000)

deandashl said:


> How do you know your TiVo has rebooted?


In my case, I routinely run the clock in the lower right hand corner. I believe the code is SPS9S. It does not survive a reboot so if it disappears, I know my Tivo rebooted.


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## jonapt (Apr 23, 2010)

deandashl said:


> How do you know your TiVo has rebooted?


When pressing Skip takes me to the end of the recording rather than 30 seconds. It happens more often on the HR10s than the S3s.

FWIW, one of three S3s has been at 11.0j for a few weeks, the other two are still at 11.0h.


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## phbigred (Sep 11, 2004)

Black screens only every 10-14 days would be awesome. Unfortunately not so lucky. Every 3-4 days I have to do a reboot due to my analog only signal. Too bad my SD-H400 doesn't have dual tuners as I've been trying to sell the upgrade to HD to my wife.

Now she's very unhappy with me as her shows always seem to "grey screen". And no I'm not doing that on purpose...


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## tiassa (Jul 2, 2008)

deandashl said:


> How do you know your TiVo has rebooted?


Both tuners were on the same channel, which was a station that the Tivo had recorded something on early in the AM


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

FYI - Rollout has officially begun.


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## whitepelican (Feb 15, 2005)

tiassa said:


> Both tuners were on the same channel, which was a station that the Tivo had recorded something on early in the AM


I will never understand that behavior. Why in the world does the Tivo not go back to both tuners buffering on the same two channels they were on before the reboot? Under normal operation you can't even force both tuners onto the same channel, and yet when you reboot they always end up that way.


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## RayChuang88 (Sep 5, 2002)

deandashl said:


> How do you know your TiVo has rebooted?


The next time you turn on the TiVo DVR, especially if you press the TiVo logo button on top of the remote. On my TiVo HD XL, when I pressed that specific button on the remote early this morning, I got a THX logo screen *AND* the TiVo logo screen, and I noticed I now have 11.0j software.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

deandashl said:


> How do you know your TiVo has rebooted?


When all your menu selections default to the top item on the menu instead of the choice you selected when last using that menu (before the reboot).

I doubt the "both-tuners-on-same-channel" method is reliable. What if scheduled recordings were made on 1 or 2 different channels between when it rebooted and when you are checking?


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## a68oliver (Jul 15, 2000)

dlfl said:


> I doubt the "both-tuners-on-same-channel" method is reliable.


I agree. I would swear that I have had both tuners on the same channel and I know my Tivo has not rebooted. The clock that I leave running in the bottom of the screen is still running. It won't survive a reboot.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Both of my S3's have upgraded to 11.0j and been configured for Pandora.

Thanks TiVo! 

Scott


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## apsarkis (Nov 16, 2004)

TiVoJerry said:


> FYI - Rollout has officially begun.


Well, my HD is "Pending Restart" (until my wife finishes watching her evening shows), but I've connected my S3 a few times, and no update there yet


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## FiosUser (Nov 16, 2007)

S3 is Pandora'd.

Thanks, Tivo!


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## SkorpioN (Jun 21, 2006)

Well my Tivo HD got the software upgrade yesterday.

Yet instead of fixing the stalled black screen for Netflix, it caused it. For some darned reason now my Netflix doesn't work. I get all the menus but it won't play anything.


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

SkorpioN said:


> Well my Tivo HD got the software upgrade yesterday.
> 
> Yet instead of fixing the stalled black screen for Netflix, it caused it. For some darned reason now my Netflix doesn't work. I get all the menus but it won't play anything.


Try a hard reboot by unplugging and waiting 15 seconds then plugging it back. That always seems to fix my Netfix woes.

Robb


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

SkorpioN said:


> Well my Tivo HD got the software upgrade yesterday.
> 
> Yet instead of fixing the stalled black screen for Netflix, it caused it. For some darned reason now my Netflix doesn't work. I get all the menus but it won't play anything.





Robbdoe1 said:


> Try a hard reboot by unplugging and waiting 15 seconds then plugging it back. That always seems to fix my Netfix woes.
> 
> Robb


I wouldn't assume 11.0j caused this. Netflix on TiVo is quite capable of getting into a snit for who knows what cause. I'm still on 11.0h and the other night, Netflix suddenly wouldn't even bring up the menu. Fortunately I got distracted by something and didn't go into my usual "obsessive TiVo troubleshooting mode", because a few hours later, and ever since, it's been fine. Face it folks, TiVo Netflix is a fragile system. Just be happy if it works OK most of the time.


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## SkorpioN (Jun 21, 2006)

@Robbdoe1 - Thank you for your concern. I had to hard reboot it ten times while attempting to take it through a proper process of elimination, no joy. The unit operates correctly as long as I don't try to watch "Netflix".

@dlfl - "I wouldn't assume 11.0j caused this. Netflix on TiVo is quite capable of getting into a snit for who knows what cause." 

I was watching netflix when it blew it's cork. I haven't had "much" trouble in the past version, barring some outside influence i.e. ISP, router, temporary netflix outage and so on. 

This time, no matter what I did, it would not recover. So through deductive reasoning and process of elimination the only common factor I have found is the software upgrade.


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

I have not used mine since the new version. I have been busy listening to GNR on Pandora . I better check it tonight.

Is it dead dead? You get nothing? Networks good? you can use other streaming services? Sounds like you know what you are doing so I'm just tossing stuff out there.

Robb


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## Jimbo713 (Dec 25, 2001)

I saw on the news that Netflix is seeing more streaming than CD rentals now and, most recently, has experienced server trouble. That could explain the problems we've been having with their streaming service.


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## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

jonapt said:


> When pressing Skip takes me to the end of the recording rather than 30 seconds. It happens more often on the HR10s than the S3s.
> 
> FWIW, one of three S3s has been at 11.0j for a few weeks, the other two are still at 11.0h.


FWIW, I now have 11.0j on my HD so it must have rebooted. However, my 30 second skip still works without re-programming.

Paul


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## DougJohnson (Dec 12, 2006)

pgoelz said:


> FWIW, I now have 11.0j on my HD so it must have rebooted. However, my 30 second skip still works without re-programming.
> 
> Paul


The 30 second skip has been "sticky" for a couple of years. I know I've rebooted when the ads on pause come back and I have to re-enter "S-P-S pause S". -- Doug


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

SkorpioN said:


> Well my Tivo HD got the software upgrade yesterday.
> 
> Yet instead of fixing the stalled black screen for Netflix, it caused it. For some darned reason now my Netflix doesn't work. I get all the menus but it won't play anything.


Netflix suggered an outage  at the same time you received your software. Give it a try now.


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## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

What's in the new release other than Pandora?


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

Stormspace said:


> What's in the new release other than Pandora?


Actually Pandora came to one of my HDs before the new release.


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

Yep. I've got Pandora and have yet to receive the software update.

*What's taking so long?* I feel we need to resurrect the Priority List.


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

Heyyy, I only announced the official rollout two days ago!  The last batch of folks should get it tonight or tomorrow and we should be done at that point. 

See post #31 for the list of things fixed in this rollout.


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

TiVoJerry said:


> Netflix suggered an outage  at the same time you received your software. Give it a try now.


Netflix is offering a 2% discount via an email link if you were affected by the outage. Very decent of them.

Robb


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

TiVoJerry said:


> Heyyy, I only announced the official rollout two days ago!  The last batch of folks should get it tonight or tomorrow and we should be done at that point.
> 
> See post #31 for the list of things fixed in this rollout.


All of which are very much appreciated. 

Scott


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## Jadedone (Sep 9, 2006)

I received the 11.0j update on Thursday and I was finally able to get analog channels on both tuners.

But it only lasted for one day, The "grey screen" returned on one of my S3s tuners.

I tried a reboot and repeated a guided setup, no luck.

I am so disappointed..........


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

Jadedone said:


> I received the 11.0j update on Thursday and I was finally able to get analog channels on both tuners.
> 
> But it only lasted for one day, The "grey screen" returned on one of my S3s tuners.
> 
> ...


Shoot Jerry a PM. Maybe they can help?

Robb


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## wtkflhn (May 12, 2006)

Well, I been waiting for a while before I commented on 11.0j. I have had the gray screen issue with some of my TIVO's (2 hd's and 1 S3) But I haven't seen it in the last few months. When possible, I try to use the broadcast digitals on cable or OTA. My really BIG problem has been the loss of my TIVO icons on one machine or another, at one time or another. This was making MRV very unreliable. But since 11.0j came out, this seems to be corrected.

Thank you TIVO.

Don H.

PS. I knew if I said anything, my problem would return. Well, it has!
Sorry TIVO, I spoke to soon. Should have hept my mouth shut!


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## pgoelz (May 1, 2005)

Is it just us, or has the amount the Tivo backs up after a fast forward changed? It used to be near perfect and just recently we realized that it doesn't back up far enough any more. I don't think our reaction times have changed. We also switched to a Harmony 300 remote, but I don't think that changed the equation....

So, did the new software change the fast forward / backup relationship? 

Paul


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Jadedone said:


> I received the 11.0j update on Thursday and I was finally able to get analog channels on both tuners.
> 
> But it only lasted for one day, The "grey screen" returned on one of my S3s tuners.
> 
> ...


This is an original S3 with the OLED display? I had not seen anyone post that they had this problem with an original S3 (versus an HD).

Scott


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

HerronScott said:


> This is an original S3 with the OLED display? I had not seen anyone post that they had this problem with an original S3 (versus an HD).
> 
> Scott


I have been using one of my orignal Series 3s without cable cards for over 3 years and never had this grey screen problem. (It is used for SD network recording only by somebody in my family)


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Les,

I have 2 S3's - one with cablecards and the second without and have not seen it as well. My brother has an HD and had numerous problems with it before installing cablecards and fewer incidents of it afterward (but still some). He'll be very happy if this fixes the issue for him.

Scott


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## sbourgeo (Nov 10, 2000)

One weird thing happened last night with 11j that I haven't seen before. I decided to delete an old season pass from the to-do list and my TiVo HD crashed and rebooted. It's been fine since though...


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## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

TiVoJerry said:


> Heyyy, I only announced the official rollout two days ago!  The last batch of folks should get it tonight or tomorrow and we should be done at that point.
> 
> See post #31 for the list of things fixed in this rollout.


I remember now. I was hoping the code to ignore the CCI would have been put in.


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## Jadedone (Sep 9, 2006)

HerronScott said:


> This is an original S3 with the OLED display? I had not seen anyone post that they had this problem with an original S3 (versus an HD).
> 
> Scott


Yes. Original S3 with OLED display. I've had grey screens on my analog channels it seem like forever. I mainly record the analog shows on my Tivo HD and transfer them over to the S3 when required. My S3 CC sare single stream.


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## Videodrome (Jun 20, 2008)

Mine crashed after the new software installed. I did a hard reboot and it came back after about 20mins.


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

Jadedone said:


> Yes. Original S3 with OLED display. I've had grey screens on my analog channels it seem like forever. I mainly record the analog shows on my Tivo HD and transfer them over to the S3 when required. My S3 CC sare single stream.


Not sure what the issue is here for you, but I can guarantee you that the software fix for analog grey screens was only focused on the TiVo HD models. Since your issue involves an original S3 & predates 11.0j, I suspect you may have a hardware issue (assuming you have already troubleshot your signal strength).


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

For the original poster (Jadedone), as well as anybody else, that may find this helpful:

There is a good article describing how to go about this on TiVo's web support:

http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/150

If you have any digital channels that the signal strength is always "pegged" at 100 Signal Strength, especially if the SNR is at, or above 35, you may need to attenuate the signal. You can either buy attenuators online, or wait for a cable truck to be in your area, and ask for some. They usually carry -6dB and -3dB ones. In some cases, you may need one of each (in-line), or two -6dB and one -3dB (in-line), if your signal is exceptionally strong.

Sometimes you can use different dB rated ports on your splitters to attenuate as well. I prefer to use a Cable Modem adjustable attenuator, which allows you to adjust to changing signal conditions without interrupting the feed to the tuners.

Excessive signal strength can cause all sorts of problems, including grey or black screens on your analog channels (sometimes even loss of digital ones), and in extreme cases, can cause permanent damage to the tuners. TiVo tuners are more sensitive to cable signal strength & SNR than any other device that I am aware of. You have to use the digital channels to get your strength and SNR readings because TiVos (and most other devices) do not provide readings for analog channels. However, if your digital is out of acceptable range, your analog generally will be as well. If you only have analog service and/or don't have a cable card, you should still have some ClearQAM digital channels (re-broadcast local stations) to work with.

EDIT: (should have been included with the other parameters of whether attenuation may be needed): If you are getting RS errors (corrected or uncorrected), even though your picture quality seems good, and your signal strength is pegged at 100, you may need attenuation.


TiVoJerry said:


> Not sure what the issue is here for you, but I can guarantee you that the software fix for analog grey screens was only focused on the TiVo HD models. Since your issue involves an original S3 & predates 11.0j, I suspect you may have a hardware issue (assuming you have already troubleshot your signal strength).


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

tcfcameron said:


> .......If you have any digital channels that the signal strength is always "pegged" at 100 Signal Strength, especially if the SNR is at, or above 35, you need to attenuate the signal. ........


*EDIT: tcfcameron's statement as later edited would have eliminated any need for this post.*

I believe this statement is too severe, i.e., alarmist and overkill. Many of us have many channels pegged at 100 and they exhibit no problems at all. The statement should be something like: "If you have video problems on a channel and signal strength is pegged at 100, you may need to attenuate..."

Quoting from the TiVo link you provided:



> NOTE: If your signal strength is at 100 and the video looks fine - this is not an error. The signal strength meter sets 100 at a safe threshold. If the signal is at this threshold or a bit beyond, your picture quality should be excellent. If the signal strength is well beyond the threshold, it will still register as "100", but you may experience poor picture quality as some DVR components cycle in and out of "protect" mode to prevent damage.


SNR is a ratio and high SNR actually is good and doesn't damage components -- it's excessive signal strength that might do that.

Unfortunate that TiVo didn't go a step further and put up an informative message when '..some DVR components cycle in and out of "protect" mode'.


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

dlfl said:


> I believe this statement is too severe, i.e., alarmist and overkill. Many of us have many channels pegged at 100 and they exhibit no problems at all. The statement should be something like: "If you have video problems on a channel and signal strength is pegged at 100, you may need to attenuate..." SNR is a ratio and high SNR actually is good and doesn't damage components -- it's excessive signal strength that might do that. Unfortunate that TiVo didn't go a step further and put up an informative message when '..some DVR components cycle in and out of "protect" mode'.


I stand firm in what I posted. I have been dispensing this advice for months, before I became aware of the aforementioned TiVo support article, which seemed to say the same things, with added screen-shots. However, they did neglect to publish some very relevant data. Otherwise, I'd just post the link and say nothing.

One person, in the past, had stated "Well, I thought the higher the SNR, the better." To this I say, that depends on the level of noise, since SNR is Signal to Noise Ratio.

If there is excessive noise, combined with an excessive signal strength, you get a high SNR. However, that is not the same as having minimal noise, and a "normal" signal, which will also result in a high SNR. These two conditions could cause the same SNR reading, while one condition is good, and the other, not so much.

Next, just because the tuners have some degree of protection built in and can cycle in and out of protect mode, does not mean you should rely on that protection. A good analogy would be if you have a UPS with over-voltage protection, and you find the UPS often cycling into over-voltage protection. Would you just allow that to be, or would you do what it takes to fix the problem with the line current? Sooner or later the over-voltage protection may fail due to constant cycling of a protection mode that is meant to really only be triggered sparsely.

Your blanket viewpoints of SNR being high as being a good thing (without regard to how much noise is in the equation), and that excessive signal strength can be handled by the TiVo switching in-and-out of protect mode is dangerous.

Attenuators are either free off a cable truck, or very inexpensive to purchase. Adjustable ones are a tad pricey, but well worth it if you have some channels that have much lower signal strength, and/or you experience fluctuations (seasonal, or other) in your signal levels.

You may not have any problems right now, but just how many "protect cycles" do you think your tuner chips are rated for?

Here's a hypothetical comparison of a different nature: I have a "device" that is rated for a 6V input, but I couldn't find one. I found that a 9V supply works fine. - Just how long will this work, before the internal voltage regulator fails? Why risk it?

Do you ever use closed captioning? I have found that many channels won't display them at all if I don't keep my signal strength below 100 and my SNR 35 or lower. If I didn't use CC, the same channels would appear to work "just fine" with readings of 100/36.

Why is it that, seemingly, ever time I try to post help and/or advice, that I know is sound, that somebody has to come along and pick at it? People that do that just piss off people that are actually willing to try and help. After enough, people just stop helping.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

tcfcameron said:


> I stand firm in what I posted. I have been dispensing this advice for months before TiVo took most of the same data, added screen-shots to it, and made it a technical article. However, they did neglect to publish some very relevant data. Otherwise, I'd just post the link and say nothing.
> 
> One person, in the past, had stated "Well, I thought the higher the SNR, the better." To this I say, that depends on the level of noise, since SNR is Signal to Noise Ratio.
> 
> ...


I for one thank you as I only looked at signal strength so at 100% one did not know if the real number was 101% or 150% so i always keep it under 100%, I will now look as the SN using your explanation.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

tcfcameron said:


> I stand firm in what I posted. I have been dispensing this advice for months before TiVo took most of the same data, added screen-shots to it, and made it a technical article. However, they did neglect to publish some very relevant data. Otherwise, I'd just post the link and say nothing.


Have you tried the link you posted? It takes me to a TiVo support page entitled "Troubleshooting digital cable signals on HD TiVo boxes". Is that what you're calling a "technical article"? I'm pretty sure that page has existed longer than your "months". Are you claiming TiVo got all that stuff from your posts (or some other inputs)?


tcfcameron said:


> If there is excessive noise, combined with an excessive signal strength, you get a high SNR. However, that is not the same as having minimal noise, and a "normal" signal, which will also result in a high SNR. These two conditions could cause the same SNR reading, while one condition is good, and the other, not so much.


I follow that but isn't the problem still too much signal, with the amount of noise being irrelevant?



tcfcameron said:


> Next, just because the tuners have some degree of protection built in and can cycle in and out of protect mode, does not mean you should rely on that protection. A good analogy would be if you have a UPS with over-voltage protection, and you find the UPS often cycling into over-voltage protection. Would you just allow that to be, or would you do what it takes to fix the problem with the line current? Sooner or later the over-voltage protection may fail due to constant cycling of a protection mode that is meant to really only be triggered sparsely.


TiVo's note (quoted in my earlier post) includes this statement:


> If the signal strength is well beyond the threshold, it will still register as "100", but you may experience poor picture quality as some DVR components cycle in and out of "protect" mode to prevent damage.


Perhaps it is wrongly worded, or perhaps I'm interpreting it wrongly, but this says to me that if you indeed are triggering protect mode, you will see poor picture quality -- thus if your picture quality is OK, you are NOT triggering the protect mode, thus not damaging components.



tcfcameron said:


> Your blanket viewpoints of SNR being high as being a good thing (without regard to how much noise is in the equation), and that excessive signal strength can be handled by the TiVo switching in-and-out of protect mode is dangerous.


Well, that seems to be a matter of my opinion versus yours, so far. Perhaps other "experts" will weigh in to resolve that. So far you haven't presented evidence to support your opinion as more than just an opinion.


tcfcameron said:


> Why is it that, seemingly, ever time I try to post help and/or advice, that I know is sound, that somebody has to come along and pick at it? People that do that just piss off people that are actually willing to try and help. After enough, people just stop helping.


Yeah, I have the same problem. I know I'm right all the time yet people still have the nerve to disagree with me despite my self-proclaimed expertise.  Sorry, I still think your statement was too severe, at least until I see a more credible technical analysis (or a statement from a TiVo expert).

EDIT: This should have been mentioned early in the discussion. If you are getting RS errors (corrected or uncorrected), even though your picture quality seems good, and your signal strength is pegged at 100, you may need attenuation.


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

tcfcameron said:


> I stand firm in what I posted. I have been dispensing this advice for months before TiVo took most of the same data, added screen-shots to it, and made it a technical article.
> 
> <SNIP>
> 
> Why is it that, seemingly, ever time I try to post help and/or advice, that I know is sound, that somebody has to come along and pick at it? People that do that just piss off people that are actually willing to try and help. After enough, people just stop helping.


In the interest of defending TiVo CS, I took the time to confirm that this article has been in place for a very long time and was only recently updated to change a few pieces of data. Nothing was taken from any of your postings, so I ask that you please refrain from inferring any responsibility for the language or content on our support site. I am not trying to upset you with this response or undermine your positive intentions, but I do feel it takes away from the men and women of CS who continually strive to improve our knowledge articles. Please keep in mind that this statement does not take away from the valuable knowledge & assistance you have dispensed here.

I do, however, happen to agree that the statement should stand as "qualified" by reading as "you *may *need attenuators". One of the hardest things to do with a knowledge article is to use language that leaves open the possibility for an exception while still making sense to the greatest number of readers. Despite what some might think, this is rarely an easy task.

With respect...


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

In the time it took me to make this post, other posters have weighed in, so there may be some overlap.


dlfl said:


> Have you tried the link you posted? It takes me to a TiVo support page entitled "Troubleshooting digital cable signals on HD TiVo boxes". Is that what you're calling a "technical article"? I'm pretty sure that page has existed longer than your "months". Are you claiming TiVo got all that stuff from your posts (or some other inputs)?


EDIT: I'm only saying that the content, minus the illustrations, contains the same data that I would convey if I were writing an article on the same subject. I had no part in the construction of the article, contents, its publication, or recent updates.



> I follow that but isn't the problem still too much signal, with the amount of noise being irrelevant?


I'm going to suggest you do some of your own research on this. I spent a month gathering current data to supplement what I already had learned in the past. But, I will say the the "noise" is never irrelevant. Otherwise there wouldn't be a need to monitor the SNR. It wouldn't be a ratio, if the noise wasn't figured into the equation.



> TiVo's note (quoted in my earlier post) includes this statement:
> 
> Perhaps it is wrongly worded, or perhaps I'm interpreting it wrongly, but this says to me that if you indeed are triggering protect mode, you will see poor picture quality -- thus if your picture quality is OK, you are NOT triggering the protect mode, thus not damaging components.


Why keep your levels "just on the threshold", when a simple attenuator can keep you from being right on the edge? I wouldn't be surprised if the article is updated again to clarify this.



> Well, that seems to be a matter of my opinion versus yours, so far. Perhaps other "experts" will weigh in to resolve that. So far you haven't presented evidence to support your opinion as more than just an opinion.


I hope they do. I used to contract for a cable company. Isn't that good enough?



> Yeah, I have the same problem. I know I'm right all the time yet people still have the nerve to disagree with me despite my self-proclaimed expertise.  Sorry, I still think your statement was too severe, at least until I see a more credible technical analysis (or a statement from a TiVo expert).


I think that TiVoJerry might weigh in on this if/when he has the time. I consider myself as close to an expert on this matter as one can be, without being employed by TiVo. Again, I have to limit what I say due to the terms of my NDA.


> EDIT: This should have been mentioned early in the discussion. If you are getting RS errors (corrected or uncorrected), even though your picture quality seems good, and your signal strength is pegged at 100, you may need attenuation.


That is discussed in the aforementioned TiVo support article, if you expand all of it. Why they compressed it, I don't know, it could cause confusion for some if they don;t expand and get the whole article. I don't disagree, as I usually include that exact sentence when I discuss this matter. I'll update the original post.


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## TiVoCylon (Mar 25, 2006)

tcfcameron said:


> I'm not claiming that I am actually responsible for the content of the article. I can only say so much about how I know what I know, as I have an NDA that I have to be careful not to breach the terms of.


forgive my igonrance but isn't the mere mention of a NDA a breach of it?


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

lessd said:


> I for one thank you as I only looked at signal strength so at 100% one did not know if the real number was 101% or 150% so i always keep it under 100%, I will now look as the SN using your explanation.


Thank You. You are dead-on right.

When the Signal Strength is pegged at 100, you have no idea exactly how high it is. Using the SNR as a second data-point, you can have a rough idea how far past the 100 mark you are. I find that SNR 35 or less works best, but some channels only work best if it is below 35. I have found nothing good coming out of a SNR higher than 35 (RS Corrected/Uncorrected increase, and closed captioning ceases to work on most channels).

I have four TiVo HDs, which I would consider enough "test platforms" to verify what I post.


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

TiVoJerry said:


> In the interest of defending TiVo CS, I took the time to confirm that this article has been in place for a very long time and was only recently updated to change a few pieces of data. Nothing was taken from any of your postings, so I ask that you please refrain from inferring any responsibility for the language or content on our support site. I am not trying to upset you with this response or undermine your positive intentions, but I do feel it takes away from the men and women of CS who continually strive to improve our knowledge articles. Please keep in mind that this statement does not take away from the valuable knowledge & assistance you have dispensed here.
> 
> I do, however, happen to agree that the statement should stand as "qualified" by reading as "you *may *need attenuators". One of the hardest things to do with a knowledge article is to use language that leaves open the possibility for an exception while still making sense to the greatest number of readers. Despite what some might think, this is rarely an easy task.
> 
> With respect...


Point(s) taken, and posts edited accordingly.

I can see how what I said (meant to say) could be taken as something completely different.

Please advise if you see the need for further edits.

With Respect,
tcfcameron


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

TiVoCylon said:


> forgive my igonrance but isn't the mere mention of a NDA a breach of it?


Not that I am aware of. I think I could even go as far as to say what parties or companies the NDA is binding to, but I think it is wise to not go that far.

I'm not sweating it. I post far too much technical data, in far too many places, to not use the NDA card, when I am questioned how I know what I know (especially when giving technical advice). Some of what I know I can not speak of. That's the tricky part.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

tcfcameron said:


> ......When the Signal Strength is pegged at 100, you have no idea exactly how high it is. Using the SNR as a second data-point, you can have a rough idea how far past the 100 mark you are. I find that SNR 35 or less works best, but some channels only work best if it is below 35. I have found nothing good coming out of a SNR higher than 35 (RS Corrected/Uncorrected increase, and closed captioning ceases to work on most channels).


Unless you make the assumption that noise levels are the same across all cable systems, using SNR to infer how far your signal strength is above 100 is invalid -- period. It may hold true for some systems, but it's based on this questionable assumption.


tcfcameron said:


> ......I have four TiVo HDs, which I would consider enough "test platforms" to verify what I post.


Only if you claim that what you post applies to just your house. Signal conditions, including variations with channel frequencies (which you haven't mentioned) can vary substantially across a single neighborhood, depending on how carefully the system has been adjusted. Not to mention system-to-system variations.

Sorry, but you just seem to have the innate desire to extrapolate limited experience to general rules -- and I have the innate desire to prevent that.


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

dlfl said:


> Unless you make the assumption <snip>


I will say that I have an "unusual" arrangement with the local cable tech, which allows me to use multiple scenarios with multiple taps off the main trunk.

You have no idea how easy it would be for me to just keep going tit-for-tat with you. But I'm not taking the bait.

I know your posting style and I'm not going to participate in polluting this thread with whose banter is bigger.

I have edited my posts to better reflect a wider range of possibilities and factors, and removed what could be interpreted as inferences that TiVo CS used my words in their support article.

It must be nice to be right all the time. Enjoy it.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

tcfcameron said:


> Not that I am aware of. I think I could even go as far as to say what parties or companies the NDA is binding to, but I think it is wise to not go that far.
> 
> I'm not sweating it. I post far too much technical data, in far too many places, to not use the NDA card, when I am questioned how I know what I know (especially when giving technical advice). Some of what I know I can not speak of. That's the tricky part.


This is starting to border on the bizarre! Please give a sampling of the "too many places" you have posted "too much technical data on". I checked your posts on this forum and didn't find anything very impressive.

And could you give one possible constructive purpose served by name dropping an NDA connection here? The "tricky part" would be to defend your statements without the NDA card.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

TiVoCylon said:


> forgive my igonrance but isn't the mere mention of a NDA a breach of it?


No, not usually. There are circumstances where the act of admitting one is under NDA will convey enough information to an outside party to deduce certiain covered aspects of the NDA, but in general stating one is limited by NDA is not a breach of the NDA in and of itself.


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## Jonathan_S (Oct 23, 2001)

tcfcameron said:


> In the time it took me to make this post, other posters have weighed in, so there may be some duplicity.


Side tangent, did you mean 'duplication'? 



google said:


> Definitions of duplicity on the Web:
> 
> fraudulence: a fraudulent or duplicitous representation
> acting in bad faith; deception by pretending to entertain one set of intentions while acting under the influence of another
> ...


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

Jonathan_S said:


> Side tangent, did you mean 'duplication'?


Thanks for the grammar-check.

I edited the post to say "overlap" instead of "duplicity".

I'm not even going to ask if you didn't have anything better to do...


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## Jonathan_S (Oct 23, 2001)

tcfcameron said:


> Thanks for the grammar-check.
> 
> I edited the post to say "overlap" instead of "duplicity".
> 
> I'm not even going to ask if you didn't have anything better to do...




Normally I wouldn't bother pointing out something like that, but in this case that incorrect word really altered the meaning in an unfortunate way.


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

I noticed another bug fix...

The parental control issue that was documented here has been squashed. :up:


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## bdj470 (Sep 19, 2004)

I moved into an apartment with my wife about a year ago. We opted to go with Comcast's Triple Play Package deal they had at the time. We since moved out of the apartment and transferred our Comcast service to the new location. They are now charging me 15.95 for the DVR.

Now to the point. 

I re-installed my Tivo-HD (has no cablecard installed). In the past I had if I come home from work or wherever. When I turned on my tv my Tivo-HD screen would be frozen on the channel it was on. 

Sometime over the past couple of days my Tivo-HD updated to 11.0j. And still issues with my Tivo-HD freezing every once and awhile. Also when I was switching channels on the standard channels (i.e. 2 - 99). Some of the channels were gray. Before 11.0j they were fine.

I would like to switch to the Tivo but hesitant. I like Tivo much better then the Comcast DVR as with that I am getting shows that are getting recording cancellation by the DVR box. Don't ask why they just are.


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

bdj470 said:


> Now to the point.
> 
> I re-installed my TiVo-HD (has no CableCard installed). In the past I had if I come home from work or wherever. When I turned on my TV my TiVo-HD screen would be frozen on the channel it was on.
> 
> ...


Software 11.0j, in my experience, has introduced more problems than it fixed. Sure, now it supports USB keyboards, Pandora, and larger external drives, but I hadn't had a grey-screen or frozen picture in nearly a year, now they are back, I have audio drop-outs in my analog recordings, and my TiVos have started rebooting themselves when they are under heavy load.

Considering that I have four TiVo HDs, two old, two fairly new, and the 11.0j induced problems affect ALL of them (and I have gone to great lengths to insure that the incoming cable signal is good and is attenuated to the levels that the TiVo HD requires), how can I believe it to be anything other than a TiVo problem? No other cable-connected device in the house has ANY problems, including a non-TiVo DVR.

As of the release of 11.0j, I went from recommending TiVos to all, and defending their being so finicky about the cable signal levels, to not being able to, in good faith, recommend TiVo to anybody. Sad, very sad...

However, just because my four TiVos are performing like crud, doesn't mean that yours necessarily will. All you can do is try it and see. If you do, I wish you luck. I love(d) my TiVos. Now they are my sole, biggest source of daily frustration.

BTW: I tried giving the Premiere a shot, but after getting two DOA in a row, I gave up. They were XLs, and each one had one defective tuner that introduced noise into LiveTV and recorded programming.


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## sbourgeo (Nov 10, 2000)

tcfcameron said:


> Software 11.0j, in my experience, has introduced more problems than it fixed. Sure, now it supports USB keyboards, Pandora, and larger external drives, but I hadn't had a grey-screen or frozen picture in nearly a year, now they are back, I have audio drop-outs in my analog recordings, and my TiVos have started rebooting themselves when they are under heavy load.
> 
> Considering that I have four TiVo HDs, two old, two fairly new, and the 11.0j induced problems affect ALL of them (and I have gone to great lengths to insure that the incoming cable signal is good and attenuated to to the levels that the TiVo HD requires), how can I believe it to be anything other than a TiVo problem? No other cable-connected device in the house has ANY problems, including a non-TiVo DVR.
> 
> ...


I feel your pain. I went through almost 2 years of unreliable use because of gray screens. I'm hoping that 11j does the trick, but I still have to check my TiVo HD before prime time recordings because I don't trust it yet.


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## sbourgeo (Nov 10, 2000)

sbourgeo said:


> I feel your pain. I went through almost 2 years of unreliable use because of gray screens. I'm hoping that 11j does the trick, but I still have to check my TiVo HD before prime time recordings because I don't trust it yet.


No such luck. I just got my first gray screen with 11j.  This time all analog and digital channels were impacted, where it had occurred with analog only previously. I also was unable to fix the problem by changing channels or going to the signal strength screen and had to reboot to fix the issue.


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## TiVoJerry (Jul 26, 2005)

We had several reports of issues like this during testing. Each one was brought back for failure analysis, after which it was determined that a hardware failure had occurred. It was not due to any single point of failure.

Unfortunately with the duration of the analog grey screens being a known issue for so long, it would've been impossible for an agent to separate the hardware failures from the software failures. Now that software has been taken out of the equation, the remaining hardware problems are finally being noticed. *If *all basic troubleshooting has been completed, there is a strong chance that an exchange will be warranted at this time.

Agents may still be hesitant to provide exchanges for this symptom, and I can't blame them. We've tried to instill a sense of confidence in them about the software but I suspect it will only come with time. I'm sure the same even applies here in the forums....it will take a few posts saying "yes, an exchange took care of my problem" before you will have that confidence as well.

Of course, this could all come back to haunt me later if I'm wrong.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

TiVoJerry said:


> We had several reports of issues like this during testing. Each one was brought back for failure analysis, after which it was determined that a hardware failure had occurred. It was not due to any single point of failure.
> 
> Unfortunately with the duration of the analog grey screens being a known issue for so long, it would've been impossible for an agent to separate the hardware failures from the software failures. Now that software has been taken out of the equation, the remaining hardware problems are finally being noticed. *If *all basic troubleshooting has been completed, there is a strong chance that an exchange will be warranted at this time.
> 
> ...


I don't have this problem (never did) but I for one *appreciate* your honest response to others that do have this problem. Thank you.

Les Daniels


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

TiVoJerry said:


> Of course, this could all come back to haunt me later if I'm wrong.


I was always taught not to prove a ninja wrong.


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

TiVoJerry said:


> Now that software has been taken out of the equation, the remaining hardware problems are finally being noticed. *If *all basic troubleshooting has been completed, there is a strong chance that an exchange will be warranted at this time.
> 
> Of course, this could all come back to haunt me later if I'm wrong.


I'll be happy to haunt you right now. 

How can software be taken out of the equation, when two of my units never had grey screens until 11.0j, and the other two had them long ago, when they were new, but had not had them since I learned how to attenuate the signal to the proper level, then after a year of no problems, 11.0j causes grey screens to re-emerge, and worse than they used to be, before attenuation, as well as introducing new problems, including analog audio drop-outs, and occasional reboots when operating under heavy load?

I'm having a hard time buying what you are are selling, at least in this context.

Two of my units were bought brand-new in June. Are you saying that they have already experienced hardware failures, even though they operated perfectly with 11.0g, and upon receiving 11.0j they stopped working properly?

If memory serves correctly, out-of-warranty units are sometimes exchanged for the amount of $49, each, plus shipping, both ways.

I paid $99, each, for my two news units, that I purchased in June. I got them from a local Blockbuster store. All the area stores are all out of them now.

If you are pinning the problem on hardware, I'm inclined to believe that the "failures" are really "defects" (as in either engineering or manufacturing defects), which aren't the same thing. If the problem lies in defects, I know that it is not something TiVo will ever actually admit to.

So, with all that being said, and with all four of my TiVos experiencing grey screens, what am I supposed to do? What should I expect?

It would be a tremendous help to know details of where the alleged hardware "failures" lie. I'd like to know what components have been pinpointed, as I am fully equipped to test nearly anything, just so long as I know where to look and what I am looking for. But, again, I know this is something that TiVo will not allow.

What comes next? I'm growing contempt of TiVo and wish I had never purchased lifetime service on any of my units. I feel like I should be complaining to the BBB, and any other agencies that are there to protect consumers from being sold lemons, and the being stuck with them, or having to pay to have something fixed, that was factory defective.

So, it's really beginning to sound like this: TiVo sold lots of defective TiVo HD units, couldn't figure out what the problem was for years, then found something hardware related, but thought a software patch could work around it (11,0j). Upon unleashing 11.0j, it made matters worse for some (numbers currently unknown to those of us that don't work for TiVo). Now we are hearing about "hardware failures" and exchanges (further indication of hardware issues, perhaps defects, or the result of defects).

What is the price that the customer is expected to pay? As I know TiVo will never admit to selling defective products, this will be the key point in how I perceive TiVo as a company, whether I continue to be a customer, whether I will recommend TiVo to others, and whether I start writing letters to consumer advocacy & rights agencies.

I'm just sick and tired of companies that sell defective products, period. My Tivo should be a source of entertainment and relaxation, not unwatchable programming and stress.
.
.
.


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## sbourgeo (Nov 10, 2000)

TiVoJerry said:


> We had several reports of issues like this during testing. Each one was brought back for failure analysis, after which it was determined that a hardware failure had occurred. It was not due to any single point of failure.


Boy, would that be the icing on the cake.


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## Joe01880 (Feb 8, 2009)

dont always trust what TiVo techs tell you, with 11g i was having lots of reboot issues and slow screen transitions and switching from some screens to others would cause my TiVo HD to reboot, i even woke up a few times to a grey screen and had to reboot my TiVo to get it working again, sometimes a few time before it would run good. I ran a kickstart 54 as was suggested by this community, all passed yet the problems continued, then 11j gets pushed through and now my TiVo HD is working better than it ever has, fast screen transitions, everything loading very fast and NO reboots..no grey screens. Something wasnt right someplace, it started with 11g and ended with 11j..think TiVo would own it...no way!


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## sbourgeo (Nov 10, 2000)

Joe01880 said:


> dont always trust what TiVo techs tell you, with 11g i was having lots of reboot issues and slow screen transitions and switching from some screens to others would cause my TiVo HD to reboot, i even woke up a few times to a grey screen and had to reboot my TiVo to get it working again, sometimes a few time before it would run good. I ran a kickstart 54 as was suggested by this community, all passed yet the problems continued, then 11j gets pushed through and now my TiVo HD is working better than it ever has, fast screen transitions, everything loading very fast and NO reboots..no grey screens. Something wasnt right someplace, it started with 11g and ended with 11j..think TiVo would own it...no way!


It is possible that could be due to bad sectors on the disk partitions that your 11g install was using and your 11j install is not using.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

sbourgeo said:


> It is possible that could be due to bad sectors on the disk partitions that your 11g install was using and your 11j install is not using.


I had the same thought. I've read somewhere that two partitions are dedicated to the OS and it ping pongs between the two each time there is an upgrade, i.e., keeping the previous version on the unused partition.

According to Weaknees.com's guide on Kickstart Codes there is a kickstart code #52 that "... attempts to reinstall the last version of the TiVo OS on the unit."

I've never seen discussion of the actual use of KS52 but I'm guessing it uses the previous OS version, normally kept on the currently unused partition, to do this.

It seems the other KS codes (54, 57, 58) should find bad sectors even if they are in the currently unused OS partition. Anyone know if this is true or not?

I do know that there are HDD problems that the KS tests will not detect. The only definitive test is to remove the drive, connect it to your PC, and run the mfr's "extended" diagnostic test on it, which typically takes hours.

If the extended test finds a bad sector, you may lose recordings or the TiVo OS, but if the HDD is that bad, you probably need to scrap it anyway as it's in the process of failing.


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

dlfl said:


> I had the same thought. I've read somewhere that two partitions are dedicated to the OS and it ping pongs between the two each time there is an upgrade, i.e., keeping the previous version on the unused partition.
> 
> According to Weaknees.com's guide on Kickstart Codes there is a kickstart code #52 that "... attempts to reinstall the last version of the TiVo OS on the unit."
> 
> ...


Kickstart 52 does not reinstall the last/previous version of the software. It takes the most recent software from the active system partition and copies it to the alternate system partition. Then it sets the boot sector to use the partition to which the software has just been copied. I believe that during the process, the VAR partition gets a bit of spring cleaning (which is why TiVo hackers hate it when software updates are released). There is no way to fall-back to the prior software version.

I like to use KS52 after a software update, because it then makes mirror image system partitions with the most recent software, which allows me to use WinMFS to change which partition the TiVo boots from. This can be handy if I suspect corruption on the active partition.

Kickstart 57 is capable of resolving bad sectors, provided they aren't in a critical area of the disk. Sometimes KS57 will take a flaky TiVo and turn it into a brick, via the GSOD loop, which can not be recovered from.

Theres more information here:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showpost.php?p=5643823&postcount=2


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## lombard (Dec 6, 2001)

pgoelz said:


> Is it just us, or has the amount the Tivo backs up after a fast forward changed? It used to be near perfect and just recently we realized that it doesn't back up far enough any more. I don't think our reaction times have changed. We also switched to a Harmony 300 remote, but I don't think that changed the equation....
> 
> So, did the new software change the fast forward / backup relationship?
> 
> Paul


Odd, I recently noticed the exact same thing. I just upgraded to a Harmony 900 remote. I don't notice any delay between remote button press and activity on the screen, but the back up time frame from fast forward is driving me nuts now.


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## mearlus (Nov 1, 2004)

Has anyone started to experience very long delays when paging down in your Netflix instant queue since the update?

Netflix takes a 2-3 minutes to load the initial screen and then for each page down it takes another 1-1.5 minutes to load.

I do not experience a delay when using Netflix on my WD Live HD Plus device on the same Netflix account and same house/network.

I've had to reboot the Tivo HDXL multiple times due to it locking up w/ a Pink screen as well (started a thread here about that: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=8238109)


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## socrplyr (Jul 19, 2006)

mearlus said:


> Has anyone started to experience very long delays when paging down in your Netflix instant queue since the update?
> 
> Netflix takes a 2-3 minutes to load the initial screen and then for each page down it takes another 1-1.5 minutes to load.
> 
> ...


I haven't had problems with mine. Also, the Netflix app isn't likely to be affected much by the software version as it is run on Tivo's servers.


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## Joe01880 (Feb 8, 2009)

mearlus said:


> Has anyone started to experience very long delays when paging down in your Netflix instant queue since the update?
> 
> Netflix takes a 2-3 minutes to load the initial screen and then for each page down it takes another 1-1.5 minutes to load.


I have a TiVo HD with a WD 1 TB My DVR expander.

It took 13 seconds for Netflix to load then 2 seconds on each screen to scroll through the queue.

I have 34 things in my queue with 6 of those being season folders with 22 episodes each.

It takes 1 second for a folder to open and 1 second to scroll between screens in each folder so i would think you have a problem with your box, when i select play an episode from within a folder starts to play within 15 seconds. Perhaps the software update did not load correctly if you did not have this problem prior to 11.j

I have a Premiere on the way, it will be interesting to see how fast it respondes in relation to my TiVo HD, both will be hooked up side by side.


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## mearlus (Nov 1, 2004)

Joe01880 said:


> I have a TiVo HD with a WD 1 TB My DVR expander.
> 
> It took 13 seconds for Netflix to load then 2 seconds on each screen to scroll through the queue.
> 
> ...


Those speeds sound like how it was prior. I'm hoping its something that'll just get fixed. It was painful trying to get to the part of the queue tonight for a movie for our toddler. Not so patient


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

mearlus said:


> Those speeds sound like how it was prior. I'm hoping its something that'll just get fixed. It was painful trying to get to the part of the queue tonight for a movie for our toddler. Not so patient


Mine was slow last night at 8:30 PM. Last time it acted up Tivo Jerrry posted that the server on Netflix side was down. I just assumed Netflix was acting up last night. I'll check tonight to see.

Robb


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## VinceA (May 13, 2002)

I was hoping 11.0j would fix the issue described here but so far, no luck:
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=424234


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## mearlus (Nov 1, 2004)

Robbdoe1 said:


> Mine was slow last night at 8:30 PM. Last time it acted up Tivo Jerrry posted that the server on Netflix side was down. I just assumed Netflix was acting up last night. I'll check tonight to see.
> 
> Robb


Hmm, could be. However it was speedy on my Western Digital media device that streams Netflix. But they could be talking to different servers/clusters/systems etc.

I'll try again tonight as well and see what happens.


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

mearlus said:


> Hmm, could be. However it was speedy on my Western Digital media device that streams Netflix. But they could be talking to different servers/clusters/systems etc.
> 
> I'll try again tonight as well and see what happens.


Worked like a champ last night for the kiddies. I guess it must just flake out sometimes.

Robb


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## mearlus (Nov 1, 2004)

Robbdoe1 said:


> Worked like a champ last night for the kiddies. I guess it must just flake out sometimes.
> 
> Robb


Tested it again tonight with similar problems. Worked on the Wii and WD Live TV devices...

The way it responds to commands it almost seems like something is eating CPU cycles.


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## LDLDL (Jan 12, 2002)

For the past few weeks, my Tivo HD still has version 11.0h and every morning I wake up to a black screen searching for signals. I do a hard reboot and everything works fine again. The next morning, the same thing again. Is my hard drive going bad? I also have the WD expander connected to it.


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

mearlus said:


> Tested it again tonight with similar problems. Worked on the Wii and WD Live TV devices...
> 
> The way it responds to commands it almost seems like something is eating CPU cycles.


You might wanna try taking everything off that is hooked up to it and see if it eases the CPU use. Are you hardwired or wireless?

Also check the rs corrected and un corrected values to see if they are moving. That could be a sign of a bad tuner which can eat the CPU.

Robb


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## tcfcameron (Aug 4, 2010)

LDLDL said:


> For the past few weeks, my Tivo HD still has version 11.0h and every morning I wake up to a black screen searching for signals. I do a hard reboot and everything works fine again. The next morning, the same thing again. Is my hard drive going bad? I also have the WD expander connected to it.


You need to contact TiVo. There is no reason that your unit should be still on 11.0h (unless there is something wrong with your unit, that is keeping the update from installing).


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## LDLDL (Jan 12, 2002)

tcfcameron said:


> You need to contact TiVo. There is no reason that your unit should be still on 11.0h (unless there is something wrong with your unit, that is keeping the update from installing).


Will do and will keep you posted.
Thanks!


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## gregnash (Nov 9, 2006)

I was told by a tivo csr that 11.0j was supposed to also fix the Flaky IR issues that a number of people have reported. As soon as I got the update I began futzing with the unit. Everything worked fine for about 2wks and then it reared its ugly head again. I have gone through multiple processes to try and figure out what the culprit is (hoping it was something in the room causing it) and the only thing I can come up with is that the IR Receiver on the tivo unit (either the eye or the board) is not calibrated for the proper frequencies that the remotes emit. My thought process behind this is that I can be 12" away and have intermittent response. Move up right in front and it responds everytime, then I can move back and it will work for a short period of time. If the remote "goes to sleep" (i.e. not used for awhile) then it seems that the process must be repeated. I am contacting Tivo Support tonight to go through the normal troubleshooting processes to see if they can come up with something I can't to fix it. If not she is going back before the warranty is over. I love and hate this thing all at once, really just wish it would "work."


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## wtkflhn (May 12, 2006)

gregnash said:


> I was told by a tivo csr that 11.0j was supposed to also fix the Flaky IR issues that a number of people have reported. As soon as I got the update I began futzing with the unit. Everything worked fine for about 2wks and then it reared its ugly head again. I have gone through multiple processes to try and figure out what the culprit is (hoping it was something in the room causing it) and the only thing I can come up with is that the IR Receiver on the tivo unit (either the eye or the board) is not calibrated for the proper frequencies that the remotes emit. My thought process behind this is that I can be 12" away and have intermittent response. Move up right in front and it responds everytime, then I can move back and it will work for a short period of time. If the remote "goes to sleep" (i.e. not used for awhile) then it seems that the process must be repeated. I am contacting Tivo Support tonight to go through the normal troubleshooting processes to see if they can come up with something I can't to fix it. If not she is going back before the warranty is over. I love and hate this thing all at once, really just wish it would "work."


 Hi.

TIVO support will probably tell you do this, but if you haven't done this yet, power cycle the unit. That does a lot more than a reboot. I had this trouble some time ago on my S3 system. Power cycling fixed the problem. You can also look at the IR coming our of the remote by looking at it with a cell phone camera. It won't tell you that Infra red is the correct freq. but it will tell you id there's a nice, bright looking signal.

Don H


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

Just to add, power cycle = pull the plug. Don't just do a menu restart.

Also, try fresh batteries in the remote if you haven't already. "New" batteries that have been sitting in a drawer for a while may not be fresh.


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## mearlus (Nov 1, 2004)

mearlus said:


> Tested it again tonight with similar problems. Worked on the Wii and WD Live TV devices...
> 
> The way it responds to commands it almost seems like something is eating CPU cycles.


So this has continued to plague our HDXL. I kept googling and stumbled across this YouTube video someone made of the -exact- same problem I was having.






Based on their comments they tried similar things I had, including pulling the power plug in order to 'reboot' it.

The last thing they tried was to do a Restart from the Tivo menu's. Low and behold the Netflix issue disappeared. They were unsure if it was coincidence or not.

Anyway, after recordings finished tonight I went a head and did the menu restart function.

It worked. Our Netflix queue now responds reasonably.

A menu restart must issue some command that's different than if power is lost. That I'm not to surprised of. I'm more surprised that it had a different affect for this issue. If anything I would have thought/assumed pulling the power would do a more thorough boot up and removing any glitch from volatile memory.

I'd love to see why the reboot from the software update seems to have triggered this. (I'm assuming this due to when the queue slowed down and the update occurring)

I guess I'll have to keep in mind that power pull and menu restarts are different animals in the future!


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

dlfl said:


> I had the same thought. I've read somewhere that two partitions are dedicated to the OS and it ping pongs between the two each time there is an upgrade, i.e., keeping the previous version on the unused partition.


Actually, it's five partitions. There are two kernel partitions, two root partitions, and /var. The active kernel is held in one partition, and the previous or future (as the case may be) kernel is held in another. Similarly, all the active ordinary files other than those in /var are in one partition, while all the old or future files are held in the another. When upgrading, the new kernel is written to the inactive kernel partition and the new OS files are written to the inactive root partition. Then the activity flags are swapped and the system is rebooted. The /var partition can be completely wiped, and the TiVo can rebuild it, so it has no backup.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

wtkflhn said:


> TIVO support will probably tell you do this, but if you haven't done this yet, power cycle the unit. That does a lot more than a reboot.


Not so much, really. Other than drive spin-up issues, I can't answer to why some people are reporting one method being more effective than the other, but a software reboot triggers a re-load of all the software, kernel up, just as if the unit were shut down. The same train-of-trust is established (if it weren't, the TiVo could not finish its boot process), and every last byte of information is loaded back from the hard drive.


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