# Better Call Saul S1:E10 Marco - 4/6/2015 Season Finale



## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)




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## David Platt (Dec 13, 2001)

Turtleboy said:


>


LOL. I totally forgot about that line; that's awesome.

I know a few others have said it, but I'll agree: S1 of BCS was better than S1 of BB.


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## DeDondeEs (Feb 20, 2004)

Haha. Yeah, best line of the whole episode: "Hey, you're not Kevin Costner".


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## MikeAndrews (Jan 17, 2002)

It's worth $1000s!


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## pjenkins (Mar 8, 1999)

Pretty disappointed with the finale - the scene with the bingo game was unwatchable, his schemes with his bar buddy were ridiculous, and not much of anything actually happened that was in any way compelling. Funny line about Kevin Costner was the only redeemable part of it.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Now we know what a "Chicago Sunroof" is and why Jimmy was facing sex offender charges for it.

Friggin' Todd

I loved that final scene where Jimmy is about to go in, meet the lawyers from the Santa Fe firm and start his new life as a mainstream lawyer, but then he stops, something snaps, and he realizes that's not who he is or who he wants to be. He's Slippin' Jimmy, and he's not going to let his quest to make Chuck proud hold him back any longer.


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## Beryl (Feb 22, 2009)

pjenkins said:


> Pretty disappointed with the finale - the scene with the bingo game was unwatchable, his schemes with his bar buddy were ridiculous, and not much of anything actually happened that was in any way compelling. Funny line about Kevin Costner was the only redeemable part of it.


Was thinking the same thing. Great series but the finale was a let down in comparison.


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## Numb And Number2 (Jan 13, 2009)

Realized it wasn't his fault he couldn't please a dysfunctional brother. A week long farewell to a best friend. Every great grandmother's great grandson. Lots of love from Kim and Howard. Enjoying earned respect in the local legal community. Knows a guy. Betsy is available. Where is Charlie Hustle's angst coming from?


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## Cainebj (Nov 11, 2006)

Yeah I kindof agree - I have been enjoying the show but as a season finale? 

And OMG that bingo scene!!! Viewer torture.


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## DeDondeEs (Feb 20, 2004)

I was also disappointed in how he seemingly becomes "Saul." It was sort of hoping it would have been some single event where he got screwed over for the last time or a final straw and he had no choice. 

But instead he had a great opportunity in front of him and he left it on the table and choose to become "Saul". Sort of makes him less likable to me.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Considering the initial order was two seasons, I suspect they "have a plan," and that this was just an awkward breaking point within that plan. Maybe this will look better in retrospect, after we've seen Season 2.

Hopefully, anyway. They've earned some benefit of the doubt. But I agree...it was a very strange and low-key way to end what had become a very gripping season.


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## kaszeta (Jun 11, 2004)

DeDondeEs said:


> Haha. Yeah, best line of the whole episode: "Hey, you're not Kevin Costner".


Yeah, I laughed pretty hard when that happened, since I remembered the original line from BB.

They are surprisingly good with continuity. We also got a backstory on the pinky ring.


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## kaszeta (Jun 11, 2004)

Cainebj said:


> Yeah I kindof agree - I have been enjoying the show but as a season finale?


I dunno, Breaking Bad had most of its finest moments in the penultimate season episodes. I pretty much expected the same here.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

pjenkins said:


> Pretty disappointed with the finale - the scene with the bingo game was unwatchable, his schemes with his bar buddy were ridiculous, and not much of anything actually happened that was in any way compelling. Funny line about Kevin Costner was the only redeemable part of it.


I agree....finale was definitely disappointing. Those fanboys who keep chirping about how much better this show is than BB (first seasons) have been too busy dipping into WW's product....


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## jsmeeker (Apr 2, 2001)

As I watched the bingo scene, I was dying. I almost hit the fast forward button. It went on and on and on. Way too long.


I don't really get why Jimmy decided to just forget the real job thing. He can get more cash by being Slipping Jimmy? I kinda figured Jimmy would take the job in Santa Fe, then something else would happen.


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## kdonnel (Nov 28, 2000)

DevdogAZ said:


> I loved that final scene where Jimmy is about to go in, meet the lawyers from the Santa Fe firm and start his new life as a mainstream lawyer, but then he stops, something snaps, and he realizes that's not who he is or who he wants to be.


It's the pinky ring. It has magical evil properties!


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

jsmeeker said:


> I don't really get why Jimmy decided to just forget the real job thing. He can get more cash by being Slipping Jimmy? I kinda figured Jimmy would take the job in Santa Fe, then something else would happen.


The whole episode was Jimmy basically buying into his brother's opinion of him.

Presumably, next season will be people (Kim, Howard, maybe even Chuck) trying to reverse his path, and his struggle with where he's going and who he is.

One thing that came through this episode that kinda surprised me is how much how many people LIKE Jimmy. He has a lot of potential, but the only person he listens to is the only person who can't see that. The story's a tragedy because we already know how it ends, but obviously he's not ready to get there yet...because they have at least one more season to go (and probably several)!


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

I also think this was better than season 1 of BB. But the reason is obvious. In season 1 of BB, they were still figuring things out. They didn't know what they were doing yet.

Here, this is like season 6 of Breaking Bad, where everyone already knows how to do things right.


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## Beryl (Feb 22, 2009)

Even though I was disappointed in the finale, I think Emmy nominations should go to both Bob Odenkirk and Jonathan Banks.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Beryl said:


> Even though I was disappointed in the finale, I think Emmy nominations should go to both Bob Odenkirk and Jonathan Banks.


I wholeheartedly agree with this....especially Banks.


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## bsnelson (Oct 30, 1999)

Numb And Number2 said:


> Realized it wasn't his fault he couldn't please a dysfunctional brother. A week long farewell to a best friend. Every great grandmother's great grandson. Lots of love from Kim and Howard. Enjoying earned respect in the local legal community. Knows a guy. Betsy is available. Where is Charlie Hustle's angst coming from?


I agree with this. The delivery wasn't that great, but the "long farewell" is spot on.

It's like Sandra Dee singing "Goodbye to Sandra Dee" right before she puts on the leather and goes into "You're the One That I Want" 

Brad


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## getreal (Sep 29, 2003)

Bierboy said:


> I agree....finale was definitely disappointing. Those fanboys who keep chirping about how much better this show is than BB (first seasons) have been too busy dipping into WW's product....





Beryl said:


> Even though I was disappointed in the finale, I think Emmy nominations should go to both Bob Odenkirk and Jonathan Banks.


Disappointing season one finale, but looking forward to S2. It did not exceed BB, IMHO, though Bob and Jonathan surely deserve Emmy noms.

Off to check out the insider podcast ...


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

Bah. The worst of Vince Gilligan TV is better than the best of 90% of other TV.


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

Do we have a date for S2 yet?


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

Turtleboy said:


> Do we have a date for S2 yet?


Thirteen episodes in early 2016, apparently.

http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2014/06/19/amc-releases-first-photo-from-better-call-saul/275154/


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## markp99 (Mar 21, 2002)

MikeAndrews said:


> It's worth $1000s!


But not more than this one!:


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

DeDondeEs said:


> I was also disappointed in how he seemingly becomes "Saul." It was sort of hoping it would have been some single event where he got screwed over for the last time or a final straw and he had no choice.
> 
> But instead he had a great opportunity in front of him and he left it on the table and choose to become "Saul". Sort of makes him less likable to me.


I don't think we've seen how he becomes Saul yet. Yesterday I listened to an episode of the KCRW The Spin Off podcast which was a panel discussion with all of the main actors as well as Vince, Peter Gould, and Tom Schnauz. I highly recommend listening to it if you like this show.

Two things that I wanted to highlight from the discussion:

1. Vince Gilligan said that as they were making S1, he felt like he needed to be in a hurry to turn Jimmy into Saul and that this is what all the viewers would be expecting. But then he said that now that they're working on S2, he feels just the opposite. He doesn't feel that need and instead wants to stretch it out. He said that people already know who/what Saul is, but Jimmy is a new character and should be explored a little more.

2. Peter Gould (co-creator) made a very interesting comment. He talked about how they brainstormed and created the Jimmy McGill character. Then he said (paraphrasing), "I was thrilled to find out we were starting with the nail salon years." That really struck me because I think most TV writers just come up with the story that's going to be on the screen, but these guys created an entire life for Jimmy before ever deciding how to tell that story on TV, and then they had to decide when and what parts of Jimmy's life they were going to use to make the TV show.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

I'm not irritated that it's taking "so long" for Jimmy to morph into "Saul". What I found disappointing about this episode is the long, drawn out bingo monologue (which some reviewers are calling "outstanding" and "classic") that bogged down the finale that had such promise. I understand that Gilligan, et al, have more time now to flesh out the character (and the others -- Mike, Kim, Howard, Chuck), and that's fine. But this finale seemed just TOO slow for my liking...


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

I really liked the ep. Not the best, but after Mad Men on Sunday it would have been impossible to disappoint me. I really feel the final scene in the parking lot told us a whole lot about who he is becoming...who they're both becoming. The rest of the show was just kind of fun and sort of filled in the gaps from little stories we heard about here and there.


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## modnar (Oct 15, 2000)

I've enjoyed the disciplined pacing of the story. It's what you get when you have a network that has confidence in writers. It's the difference between someone racing through reading a story to their kids or actually *telling* the story.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Bierboy said:


> I'm not irritated that it's taking "so long" for Jimmy to morph into "Saul". What I found disappointing about this episode is the long, drawn out bingo monologue (which some reviewers are calling "outstanding" and "classic") that bogged down the finale that had such promise.


The bingo scene was brilliantly written, acted, and filmed. Jimmy's speech made the people in the bingo hall uncomfortable and it made the viewers uncomfortable. We wanted it to end just like the bingo players did. But that's exactly the emotion that scene was designed to create. Jimmy is feeling unmoored and lost and doesn't know what to do with his life. Everything he had been working toward has just been pulled out from under him. The scene was designed to help the viewer understand those feelings.

If you're just watching to find out what happens and see how Jimmy turns into Saul, you'll be missing out on an amazing, in-depth character study, and you'll probably be disappointed, because the character development is going to be much more important to the writers than the plot.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

DevdogAZ said:


> ...If you're just watching to find out what happens and see how Jimmy turns into Saul, you'll be missing out on an amazing, in-depth character study, and you'll probably be disappointed, because the character development is going to be much more important to the writers than the plot.


If you read my post carefully, you'd see that I'm NOT "just watching to find out what happens and see how Jimmy turns into Saul." I accept and embrace character development, etc., and am not *****ing about plot dragging. It's that bingo scene that, sorry, was NOT "brilliantly written, acted and filmed" (IMO). I guess we'll agree to disagree, but it was simply pedantic....


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## Craigbob (Dec 2, 2006)

Count me as one of those "Fanboys" who thinks this a better first season the BB's was. I expected that since the creators etc... had several years to get things to mesh. I love the character growth and development. 

But that bingo scene... Oy vey... Very uncomfortable and way too long. I get the discomfort bit of how they were trying to make the audience feel the character's pain, but it went on far longer than necessary.

Poor Marco. Can't wait for next season.


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## SeanC (Dec 30, 2003)

I really enjoyed the Bingo scene. I sympathize with Jimmy. He just wants to get through the day and not think about his brother, and he's just doing his bingo spiel, I as in..., O as in...

Then he gets B, and he clearly doesn't want to say Brother, or think about Brother, and he keeps getting B, and that damn B just keeps putting it right in his face, Brother, Betrayal, until he just lost it.

Yeah, I thought that was an excellent scene.


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## Beryl (Feb 22, 2009)

SeanC said:


> I really enjoyed the Bingo scene. I sympathize with Jimmy. He just wants to get through the day and not think about his brother, and he's just doing his bingo spiel, I as in..., O as in...
> 
> Then he gets B, and he clearly doesn't want to say Brother, or think about Brother, and he keeps getting B, and that damn B just keeps putting it right in his face, Brother, Betrayal, until he just lost it.
> 
> Yeah, I thought that was an excellent scene.


It was disturbing but I appreciate it and his acting even more. He loved his brother more than his brother loved him, IMO.


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## DeDondeEs (Feb 20, 2004)

What are the odds of drawing that many consecutive "B" numbers in a game of bingo?


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## SeanC (Dec 30, 2003)

And how many was it? 5 right? He didn't pull 6 in a row did he?


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## Gunnyman (Jul 10, 2003)

Does anyone know when the BCS Insider Podcast usually drops? I'd love to hear the one for this episode.


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

Wow, great episode. Just about perfect.


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

DeDondeEs said:


> What are the odds of drawing that many consecutive "B" numbers in a game of bingo?





SeanC said:


> And how many was it? 5 right? He didn't pull 6 in a row did he?


So (1/5)^5?


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## kaszeta (Jun 11, 2004)

Turtleboy said:


> So (1/5)^5?


At the beginning of the game, worse than that, since you are depleting the set of B balls you can draw.

At the very beginning, the odds are

(15/75)*(14/74)*(13/73)*(12/72)*(11/71) = 1.7e-4 = 1/5747

But depending on where in the game they are, and how many B and non-B balls have already been called, the odds could be better or worse. I don't have a screenshot of the scene with the big number board to know.


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

DevdogAZ said:


> Friggin' Todd


It's probably a little too bad that I recognized Marco as Todd long before I recognized him from the old Cicero hustle.


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## SeanC (Dec 30, 2003)

b2, b4, b12, b7, b5, b? he does pull a 6th b but never calls the number, this is when he launches into his "Chicago Sunroof" story.

Lit on the board: 1, 2, 4, 7, 12, 20, 29, 32, 39, 42, 51, 57, 61, 64, 68, 73.

5 is not in the lit list, but he does call it.


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## ElJay (Apr 6, 2005)

This was pretty bad. The best part was Jimmy making amends with Hamlin and it was downhill from there. That bingo scene was a Chicago Sunroof on the viewers. I feel like this episode must've been rewritten into the bland crap it was after they found out it was renewed.


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## pjenkins (Mar 8, 1999)

heySkippy said:


> Wow, great episode. Just about perfect.





ElJay said:


> This was pretty bad.


That's what I love about TV and forums such as this. People watching the same thing with wildly different viewpoints of it


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## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

I'm behind and haven't seen it yet but this discussion is causing me to try and find time


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Cearbhaill said:


> I'm behind and haven't seen it yet but this discussion is causing me to try and find time


Make sure you allow two hours because it'll seem like it by the time it's over....


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## MikeAndrews (Jan 17, 2002)

SeanC said:


> I really enjoyed the Bingo scene. I sympathize with Jimmy. He just wants to get through the day and not think about his brother, and he's just doing his bingo spiel, I as in..., O as in...
> 
> Then he gets B, and he clearly doesn't want to say Brother, or think about Brother, and he keeps getting B, and that damn B just keeps putting it right in his face, Brother, Betrayal, until he just lost it.
> 
> Yeah, I thought that was an excellent scene.


The only fallacy is with all of those B numbers somebody had to have a Bingo in the B column.


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## SeanC (Dec 30, 2003)

MikeAndrews said:


> The only fallacy is with all of those B numbers somebody had to have a Bingo in the B column.


Is that necessarily true?

Even with 7 B's selected there are still 8 unused B numbers, there's no reason to assume that someone would have gotten a bingo from the currently selected 7.


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## smak (Feb 11, 2000)

Bierboy said:


> I'm not irritated that it's taking "so long" for Jimmy to morph into "Saul". What I found disappointing about this episode is the long, drawn out bingo monologue (which some reviewers are calling "outstanding" and "classic") that bogged down the finale that had such promise. I understand that Gilligan, et al, have more time now to flesh out the character (and the others -- Mike, Kim, Howard, Chuck), and that's fine. But this finale seemed just TOO slow for my liking...


The finale was basically one long setup for next year. It did end this year's story, but just in the fact of setting up next year.

-smak-


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## Worf (Sep 15, 2000)

You know, I don't think Jimmy becomes Saul until the very end. I mean, when you think about it, Saul Goodman isn't that interesting a character - he's just your typical slimy questionable lawyer working in the strip mall, and well, BB pretty much covered it.

OTOH, his journey from Jimmy to Saul... now THAT's fascinating.


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## danterner (Mar 4, 2005)

Worf said:


> You know, I don't think Jimmy becomes Saul until the very end. I mean, when you think about it, Saul Goodman isn't that interesting a character - he's just your typical slimy questionable lawyer working in the strip mall, and well, BB pretty much covered it. OTOH, his journey from Jimmy to Saul... now THAT's fascinating.


The series we got (at least season one of it) is so different than the series I envisioned when it was announced that BCS was going to spin off from Breaking Bad. I did imagine the show being about Saul's practice at the strip mall. Very procedural, but in a darkly perverted way, with each episode focused on various criminal clients and their cases and on Saul doing whatever necessary - ethics be damned - to win without going into court, but with lots of courtroom hijinx, too. I envisioned Huell as a main character.

I'm glad I'm not a writer for the show, because I like what we got much better than what I had imagined.

As for this specific season finale episode, while I agree it felt more like a regular episode than a finale, I did enjoy it. Even (especially) the bingo scene, though I understand why others didn't. I was expecting there to maybe be a significant BB cameo appearance, like perhaps the introduction of Gus as a new character, or even just something more with Tuco or maybe Tio.


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## zalusky (Apr 5, 2002)

Worf said:


> You know, I don't think Jimmy becomes Saul until the very end. I mean, when you think about it, Saul Goodman isn't that interesting a character - he's just your typical slimy questionable lawyer working in the strip mall, and well, BB pretty much covered it.
> 
> OTOH, his journey from Jimmy to Saul... now THAT's fascinating.


It all depends on what this show is to cover.


Spoiler



Vince Gilligan has said he will show Saul before, during, and after Breaking Bad.

Now in the first episode we see Saul working in a Cinnabon in what can be said as "After" but only for one scene. We are clearly seeing him before now. We have yet to see any "During" and whether we will see any more "After".


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## MonsterJoe (Feb 19, 2003)

I wasn't disappointed at all in the finale - I thought it was great.


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## markymark_ctown (Oct 11, 2004)

I like the finale...except for the bingo scene which I thought was wayyyyyyy too long. Thought I'd be in the minority in not liking it. 

Otherwise, good wrap up on the season and set up for next year.


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## kaszeta (Jun 11, 2004)

Yeah, I thought the bingo scene was okay, but should have been edited down a bit.


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## Bob Coxner (Dec 1, 2004)

I enjoyed the episode *and* the bingo scene. It was like God was forcing Jimmy to face the fact of what his (B)rother thought of him. It was a pivotal moment in the character's development and needed some time.

This reminds me of the debates about the endless chicken fights on Family Guy. Some love 'em, some hate 'em. Although, they're probably not necessary to explain Peter's character development.


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## SeanC (Dec 30, 2003)

I was hoping someone was gonna crunch the numbers on the odds of pulling 6 B's in a row after I posted the lit numbers, and that he did in fact pull not 5 but 6, I am curious.


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## Marco (Sep 19, 2000)

SeanC said:


> b2, b4, b12, b7, b5, b? he does pull a 6th b but never calls the number, this is when he launches into his "Chicago Sunroof" story.
> 
> Lit on the board: 1, 2, 4, 7, 12, 20, 29, 32, 39, 42, 51, 57, 61, 64, 68, 73.
> 
> 5 is not in the lit list, but he does call it.


Including B-5, 17 numbers have been drawn. 58 numbers remain.
6 B's have been drawn. 9 remain.

Probability of a B# next: 9/58, or approximately 15%.

Kaszeta already covered the probability of 5 B's in a row. For 6 in a row, multiply that number by, in this case, 9/58.
(The result is in the neighborhood of 1 in 36,000.)


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## SeanC (Dec 30, 2003)

Actually 7 B's had been drawn, B1 was drawn before the run of B's, so that drops it to 13.8%.


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## Marco (Sep 19, 2000)

SeanC said:


> Actually 7 B's had been drawn, B1 was drawn before the run of B's, so that drops it to 13.8%.


Well, you said 1, 2, 4, 7, and 12 had been drawn, then B-5. That's 6 numbers in the B-range (1 to 15).


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## DougF (Mar 18, 2003)

I liked it. The bingo scene was great. It gave us a glimpse of what Jimmy was going through and made the viewers as uncomfortable as the bingo players must have been. Well done.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

DevdogAZ said:


> The bingo scene was brilliantly written, acted, and filmed. Jimmy's speech made the people in the bingo hall uncomfortable and it made the viewers uncomfortable. We wanted it to end just like the bingo players did. But that's exactly the emotion that scene was designed to create. Jimmy is feeling unmoored and lost and doesn't know what to do with his life. Everything he had been working toward has just been pulled out from under him. The scene was designed to help the viewer understand those feelings...


I agree. It was uncomfortable but I thought it was a great scene.


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

Marco said:


> Kaszeta already covered the probability of 5 B's in a row. For 6 in a row, multiply that number by, in this case, 9/58.
> (The result is in the neighborhood of 1 in 36,000.)


Kaszeta calculated the first five balls being Bs. The eleven non-Bs also drawn increase the odds of subsequent draws being a B, and other Bs drawn before the streak reduce the odds of drawing a B. It's like counting cards in blackjack.


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

The Better Call Saul finale's last scene explains the whole show - and Breaking Bad

http://www.vox.com/2015/4/7/8362853/better-call-saul-finale-recap


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## MikeAndrews (Jan 17, 2002)

Turtleboy said:


> The Better Call Saul finale's last scene explains the whole show - and Breaking Bad
> 
> http://www.vox.com/2015/4/7/8362853/better-call-saul-finale-recap


Good take.

It occurs that BCS could also have us join present day Jimmy to see him be tempted to go back and put a toe in to bringing Saul back.

Who is threatening Saul in present day anyway? All are dead, except Jesse. The cops?


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## SeanC (Dec 30, 2003)

Marco said:


> Well, you said 1, 2, 4, 7, and 12 had been drawn, then B-5. That's 6 numbers in the B-range (1 to 15).


Just to put it in order:

B1 had been drawn, we didn't see that happen, it was on the board.

Then the run in order as called:

B2, B4, B12, B7, B5, B Unknown number.

For whatever reason B5 does not get lit on the board, and the last B we are never told the number.

So that's a total of 7 B's that were pulled, just the last one the number was never given, but we know for certain it was a B cuz he freaks out and launches into his diatribe.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

DougF said:


> ...and made the viewers as uncomfortable as the bingo players must have been...


The players were too old to be uncomfortable any more than they are all day long....


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## tivoboyjr (Apr 28, 2003)

I thought the finale was the weakest episode of the series by far and it still wasn't bad.

I love BCS but there's no way this was better than S1 of BB, but maybe that's just me.

I don't really get the relationship with Kim. Seems like more than a friendship and less than a romance. Maybe they were more involved in the past and are just friends now? Anyhoo, I bring that up because Kim really wanted Jimmy to take the law firm job and if I'm Jimmy, I'm thinking of Kim a lot more than I'm thinking about Chuck, and it seemed that Jimmy didn't give any thought to what would make Kim happy, that with a respectable job maybe he and Kim could settle down, etc. We know where Jimmy is headed so this is all academic, I guess, but that relationship doesn't feel quite right to me.


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## mooseAndSquirrel (Aug 31, 2001)

I really like this show. I think the episode that featured Mike's backstory was one of the best episodes of any TV show ever. The reveal of Chuck was also awesome.

But the pacing of the series and some episodes within are just off. One week it's riveting and rapid, the next week it's largely a snooze.

I thought the penultimate episode was extremely strong and a major windup for Jimmy to go nuts. It frankly would have worked better as the finale than the actual finale. Instead of going deeper and darker with the writing, Jimmy goes to Chicago and you get a weird montage that seems like a year's worth of scams. And then you find out it was a week! The bingo meltdown was 5 times longer than it needed to be. 

If Jimmy had made his decision right after Chuck berated him as "not a real lawyer" it would have made sense to me. Instead, he tells his slippin' Jimmy partner he is a real lawyer and has to get back to it. Then he is offered a perfect, partner track job in a city hours away from Chuck. And then he makes his decision?

The finale diluted the perfection of the buildup to me.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

I like the reference to Belize for one of the Bingo balls.


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## midas (Jun 1, 2000)

mooseAndSquirrel said:


> If Jimmy had made his decision right after Chuck berated him as "not a real lawyer" it would have made sense to me. Instead, he tells his slippin' Jimmy partner he is a real lawyer and has to get back to it. Then he is offered a perfect, partner track job in a city hours away from Chuck. And then he makes his decision?


But in between telling Marco that he is a real lawyer and him going back he agrees to do one final scam. And Marco, on his death bed says that it had been the best week of his life. And I think when Jimmy decides to drive away it finally hit him that it was also the best week of his life.

Makes sense to me.


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## tivoboyjr (Apr 28, 2003)

midas said:


> But in between telling Marco that he is a real lawyer and him going back he agrees to do one final scam. And Marco, on his death bed says that it had been the best week of his life. And I think when Jimmy decides to drive away it finally hit him that it was also the best week of his life.
> 
> Makes sense to me.


I think we're also supposed to see that as Jimmy realizing the scam artist guy is who he is (and not the law partner guy) and deciding to go with it instead of fighting it.


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## Odds Bodkins (Jun 7, 2006)

I loved the bingo scene.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Odds Bodkins said:


> I loved the bingo scene.


...hence your user name....


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

midas said:


> But in between telling Marco that he is a real lawyer and him going back he agrees to do one final scam. And Marco, on his death bed says that it had been the best week of his life. And I think when Jimmy decides to drive away it finally hit him that it was also the best week of his life.
> 
> Makes sense to me.


I think Jimmy also had to think about how Marco told him that if he's a real lawyer and he's not making bank, he must be doing something wrong. Maybe that got Jimmy thinking that his way of toiling and struggling to get old people to pay him $140 to do a will was never going to get him where he wants to be.


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## SoupMan (Mar 1, 2001)

I liked the bingo scene. The weird, trippy scam montage was what I FF'd through and thought was terrible.


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## series5orpremier (Jul 6, 2013)

mooseAndSquirrel said:


> If Jimmy had made his decision right after Chuck berated him as "not a real lawyer" it would have made sense to me. Instead, he tells his slippin' Jimmy partner he is a real lawyer and has to get back to it. Then he is offered a perfect, partner track job in a city hours away from Chuck. And then he makes his decision?


I took that final scene as Jimmy was coming out of the interview to mean he wasn't going to be offered that perfect partner track job. At the core I still blame Chuck for the whole thing. Jimmy wouldn't have gone down the path to the dark side if Chuck hadn't pushed him away.


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

series5orpremier said:


> I took that final scene as Jimmy was coming out of the interview to mean he wasn't going to be offered that perfect partner track job. At the core I still blame Chuck for the whole thing. Jimmy wouldn't have gone down the path to the dark side if Chuck hadn't pushed him away.


Jimmy never went to the interview/hearing.


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## series5orpremier (Jul 6, 2013)

He didn't want any more judgment and after his experience with Chuck was mistrustful he wouldn't just be used and thrown aside.


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## MonsterJoe (Feb 19, 2003)

Turtleboy said:


> Jimmy never went to the interview/hearing.


Jimmy never left the parking lot.


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## tivoboyjr (Apr 28, 2003)

Jimmy likes Elaine.


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

Jimmy realized (later than the rest of us) that his whole motivation for wanting to be a "successful" lawyer was to earn Chuck's respect.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

tivoboyjr said:


> Jimmy likes Elaine.


 Not that there's anything wrong with that....


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

If anyone's wondering about the status of the Insider Podcast for this episode, Kelley Dixon has tweeted a couple of times today that she's still waiting for producer notes as part of the process to release the podcast to the channels.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

pdhenry said:


> If anyone's wondering about the status of the Insider Podcast for this episode, Kelley Dixon has tweeted a couple of times today that she's still waiting for producer notes as part of the process to release the podcast to the channels.


Thanks. I keep refreshing the feed, hoping it will be there. Glad to know it's still coming and I should just be patient.


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## xuxa (Oct 8, 2001)

tivoboyjr said:


> I thought the finale was the weakest episode of the series by far and it still wasn't bad.
> 
> I love BCS but there's no way this was better than S1 of BB, but maybe that's just me.
> 
> I don't really get the relationship with Kim. Seems like more than a friendship and less than a romance. Maybe they were more involved in the past and are just friends now? .....


I believe they showed them in a relationship in the flashback when Jimmy was in the mailroom and she was a low level clerk.


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## MonsterJoe (Feb 19, 2003)

They did. They kissed in that scene, too


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## gweempose (Mar 23, 2003)

For those of you that think BCS had a better first season, I wonder if you would have felt the same way if you had watched BCS first. Obviously, it's impossible to watch BCS without bringing into it all the knowledge we have about the characters from the previous show. Because of this, the prequel was able to hit the ground running. This was not the case with BB, since every character was completely new. It would be very interesting to see which season someone would prefer if they had never seen BB, and then were shown the first season of both.


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

I thought the first season of BB sucked the first time I watched it. I gave up on BB a couple episodes into the 2nd season as too soapy. I gave it another try a couple years later with my wife and kept with it until it got better somewhere deep in season 2.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

I disagree with those who disliked BB's first season. I began watching it three seasons in based on discussion here. I liked it from the get go...


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## MonsterJoe (Feb 19, 2003)

It took me 3 or 4 tries to get into BB


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## Beryl (Feb 22, 2009)

MonsterJoe said:


> It took me 3 or 4 tries to get into BB


Me too. I got hooked when Gus was introduced and went back and watched the first 2 seasons. I might have gotten hooked in Season 2 but I'd given up in Season 1.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Let's not forget that S1 of BB was cut short due to the writer's strike and so it kind of ended abruptly without the typical build up and cliff hanger of later BB seasons. Because of this, many people were left a little cold by S1 of BB and it wasn't until the more fully fleshed-out S2 and S3 that it really picked up momentum and started gaining viewers.


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## Hank (May 31, 2000)

heySkippy said:


> I thought the first season of BB sucked the first time I watched it. I gave up on BB a couple episodes into the 2nd season as too soapy. I gave it another try a couple years later with my wife and kept with it until it got better somewhere deep in season 2.





MonsterJoe said:


> It took me 3 or 4 tries to get into BB


I just don't get it... my g/f and I were 100% hooked on BB after the first episode. It was gripping, we binge watched the first season in two or three nights and never looked back. I even bought an AppleTV (v2) so we could watch the latest season on iTunes.

Was BCS that good? Nope. It's great, but not BB great.


----------



## Hank (May 31, 2000)

MikeAndrews said:


> It occurs that BCS could also have us join present day Jimmy to see him be tempted to go back and put a toe in to bringing Saul back.
> 
> Who is threatening Saul in present day anyway? All are dead, except Jesse. The cops?


Yeah, the cops. Once they investigate all the players, Saul had his hands in pretty much all of it. Now maybe he had it well covered up, but so did Mike, and they found and took his booty, what -three times.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

I saw the first season of BB, but for some reason missed the second. By the time people started really talking about it I couldn't remember much about it. Eventually, the buzz overcame me, but I didn't start in again (from the beginning) until after the fourth season. And that time, it totally grabbed me.


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## MonsterJoe (Feb 19, 2003)

Hank said:


> I just don't get it... my g/f and I were 100% hooked on BB after the first episode. It was gripping, we binge watched the first season in two or three nights and never looked back. I even bought an AppleTV (v2) so we could watch the latest season on iTunes.
> 
> Was BCS that good? Nope. It's great, but not BB great.


/shrug

It was the first 3 episodes that I kept getting stuck on. Once I got through episode 5 or 6, I was hooked.

I don't think it does any good to compare BB and BCS - other than the tone and universe, they're completely different shows so far.


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## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

Yeah, I'm with *Monster Joe*.
I tried to watch BB when the buzz started and couldn't get into it.
Then when the buzz got mega big we started over and powered through the first few episodes and then we were hooked.


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## Hank (May 31, 2000)

MonsterJoe said:


> I don't think it does any good to compare BB and BCS - other than the tone and universe, they're completely different shows so far.


Agreed. They each stand on their own for different reasons.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

Hank said:


> I just don't get it... my g/f and I were 100% hooked on BB after the first episode. It was gripping, we binge watched the first season in two or three nights and never looked back. I even bought an AppleTV (v2) so we could watch the latest season on iTunes. Was BCS that good? Nope. It's great, but not BB great.


I watched the pilot of BB the night it aired and was hooked. I think I watched every episode on the first night it aired. I loved S1 and the whole show. But I'll admit that looking back, S1 was pretty uneven and wasn't paced and plotted nearly as well as the subsequent seasons. While I don't share this view, I can see how some people may not have been totally sold on the series after S1.


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## DougF (Mar 18, 2003)

We were late to the party (2012 or so) but were both hooked on BB from the first epsiode.


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

DougF said:


> I liked it. The bingo scene was great. It gave us a glimpse of what Jimmy was going through and made the viewers as uncomfortable as the bingo players must have been. Well done.


YES! That was the point I felt. You got to see somewhat of an internal quiet meltdown or sorts. Was he thinking about the money he wanted to steal at that very moment? Was he thinking how bad doing that bingo game just plain sucked? I mean I've been in meetings giving lectures to over 100 people and had moments just like that. I was talking about routers and stuff and all I really could think about was how I'd much rather have taken a different path. I didn't let it show, but I know how Saul felt. This to me is genius (at least TV world genius). We've all been there to some degree, right? Now if you just look at the Bingo scene as a bingo scene then yes, it would be boring. If you never had that kind of experience before it would not resonate with you. But I bet you have, even if it was talking to your boss about his/her weekend.

Also, I wish people would stop comparing this to Breaking Bad. It is not Breaking Bad...just its cousin sharing the same crew.


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## Dawghows (May 17, 2001)

Got into a bigger-than-usual conversation about TV with my coworkers yesterday afternoon, and I'm finding it interesting to read the different perspectives here comparing the BCS and BB first seasons. 

Of the five people in our discussion, I was the only one who enjoyed S1 one of BB. Three of the four other people were bored enough that they never finished BB at all. But all of them are totally hooked on BCS.


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## kaszeta (Jun 11, 2004)

I swear, there's nearly zero overlap between my TV viewing and my coworkers. Only one of them has even seen BB.


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## Dawghows (May 17, 2001)

kaszeta said:


> I swear, there's nearly zero overlap between my TV viewing and my coworkers. Only one of them has even seen BB.


There's TONS of overlap between all my coworkers. We all have at least two or three shows in common with each other.


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## SeanC (Dec 30, 2003)

Dawghows said:


> Of the five people in our discussion, I was the only one who enjoyed S1 one of BB. Three of the four other people were bored enough that they never finished BB at all. But all of them are totally hooked on BCS.


I find it interesting that people remember season 1 as individual from the series. Do you guys remember the seasons well enough to reference them all individually?

I remember the promos before BB aired and I knew I was in from the description. Highschool teacher becomes a meth cook? I'm in!

And I watched the whole series again in the last year, but I couldn't tell you anything really that happens in S1 or remember it significantly different from other seasons. I just remember really enjoying it and that it was a great show.


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## Dawghows (May 17, 2001)

SeanC said:


> Do you guys remember the seasons well enough to reference them all individually?


I don't, and I couldn't tell you where S1 ended and S2 began. But I definitely remember that it was pretty slow-moving in the beginning, and although my wife and I both enjoyed it, we were not sure why my sister (who was three seasons in at the time) had been *so* adamant that we start watching it.


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## MikeAndrews (Jan 17, 2002)

We should remember that after going for the Kettleman stash, Jimmy had no hesitation that it go to the court_ along with_ the $30,000 Jimmy had.

We see here that he wonders what he was thinking back then.

We needed to see Jimmy turn during the bingo scene, and explore "Slippin' Jimmy" to revisit his old dark side.

The dark side takes him in the end,


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## ibergu (May 9, 2004)

Hank said:


> I just don't get it... my g/f and I were 100% hooked on BB after the first episode. It was gripping, we binge watched the first season in two or three nights and never looked back. I even bought an AppleTV (v2) so we could watch the latest season on iTunes.
> 
> Was BCS that good? Nope. It's great, but not BB great.


+1

I remember being truly riveted by the first five minutes of the first episode of BB (RV barreling down a dusty road, pants flying in the air, Walt in his tighty whities and gun in hand), and knew from the beginning that this was going to be one helluva ride.

I thought BB was excellent (from start to finish). I think BCS has started equally as good, but am concerned where they will take it in season 2.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

MikeAndrews said:


> We should remember that after going for the Kettleman stash, Jimmy had no hesitation that it go to the court along with the $30,000 Jimmy had.
> 
> We see here that he wonders what he was thinking back then.
> 
> ...


Exactly. He just spent a week pulling cons with Marco and probably didn't make a fraction of that $30k that he had and gave back. Made him realize that if he combines his best attributes (being personable, getting people to trust him) with his profession and his lack of ethics, he could be unstoppable.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

SeanC said:


> I find it interesting that people remember season 1 as individual from the series. Do you guys remember the seasons well enough to reference them all individually?
> 
> I remember the promos before BB aired and I knew I was in from the description. Highschool teacher becomes a meth cook? I'm in!
> 
> And I watched the whole series again in the last year, but I couldn't tell you anything really that happens in S1 or remember it significantly different from other seasons. I just remember really enjoying it and that it was a great show.


I remember the basic plot from S1: 


Spoiler



Walt meets Jesse, they cook together, they end up with Krazy 8 and the other guy in Jesse's basement. They dissolve the bodies in the tub. They start dealing with Tuco and Walt blows up the fulminated mercury in Tuco's office. (I remember the name of the chemical thanks to the Mythbusters episode.)



I don't remember exactly how S1 ends, but I remember that S2 starts with Walt and Jesse trapped in a junkyard trying to get away from some bad guys, and I think that's exactly where we left them at the end of S1.

As for my memory of subsequent seasons, 


Spoiler



S2 is when they go cook in the desert and get stuck in 4 Days Out. Walt claims he was in a fugue state. Jesse starts dating Jane. Jane dies because Walt does nothing to help her. Jane's dad has a nervous breakdown and the plane crashes over Walt's house.

S3: First half is the Cousins until Hank's showdown with them in One Minute and the second half they start doing business with Gus Fring. Walt finds out Skyler cheated on him in I.F.T. Walt saves Jesse from the drug dealers at the end of Half Measures ("Run!") and then Jesse pays a visit to Gale's apartment at the end of Full Measures.

S4: This is mostly the Season of the Superlab and starts with that chilling scene with Walt, Jesse, and Gus in the lab (Box Cutter), includes the classic episode Fly, and ends with Tio Salamanca ringing his bell for Gus in Face Off.

S5: Walt and Jesse start getting their ingredients from Lydia, we're introduced to the German company, Madrigal. They rob a train. They distribute through the Skinheads. Walt orchestrates a bunch of prison murders and starts selling overseas. Skyler hides the cash in a storage unit. Hank has a realization on the toilet. Buried money, desert shoot out, robotic trunk gun, etc.



I've only ever watched the episodes once as they aired, but I've also read lots of recaps and commentaries and listened to podcasts, so I guess that has helped galvanize all that stuff in my mind.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Hank said:


> ....Was BCS that good? Nope. It's great, but not BB great.


 I know it's scary....but I agree with Hank.


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## stellie93 (Feb 25, 2006)

I first decided BB was an awesome show and not just a good one whenever the bathtub episode aired in S1. :up:


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## sharkster (Jul 3, 2004)

I'm just hoping to watch BB during the hiatus of BCS. Then I'll probably be able to follow along on the BCS threads better, too. 

As for BCS, as a stand-alone for me not yet having seen BB, I enjoyed the season and the character development.


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

Makes me wonder what the minimum set of BB episodes is to fully understand and appreciate the BCS backstory.

Everything to understand where Jimmy and Mike end up and why, skipping all that distracting Walt and Jesse chemistry stuff that doesn't further the Jimmy/Saul and Mike story.


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## SoBelle0 (Jun 25, 2002)

Zero? 

I haven't yet watched a single episode of BB and I have most thoroughly enjoyed this first season of BCS. 

As a member of society, and TCF, I do have an inkling of Saul as a slimy kind of 'ambulance chasing' guy who works out of a strip mall. That is the extent of it, though. And also the reason I don't read these threads. And, I have no frame of reference for a future Mike. But I love the hell out of that character. 

It was funny, I popped into this one just to see what y'all said about the Slippin' Jimmy bits. I did not think that week with his old pal was enough to take him so far off track. Or what I guess will be so far off track... I was really surprised when he didn't even go in to the interview. I would have thought it would take more to dissuade him from the dream that pushed him to secretly work for the degree, etc.


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## Bob Coxner (Dec 1, 2004)

SoBelle0 said:


> Zero?
> 
> I haven't yet watched a single episode of BB and I have most thoroughly enjoyed this first season of BCS.
> 
> ...


The dream was to gain respect from his brother. It just happened to be a law degree that he chose for that. He didn't dream of being a lawyer. Now that he knows his brother will never respect him, no matter what he does (including the possible Sante Fe job), then it's back to Slippin Jimmy.


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## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

SoBelle0 said:


> It was funny, I popped into this one just to see what y'all said about the Slippin' Jimmy bits. I did not think that week with his old pal was enough to take him so far off track. Or what I guess will be so far off track... I was really surprised when he didn't even go in to the interview. I would have thought it would take more to dissuade him from the dream that pushed him to secretly work for the degree, etc.


I didn't think the trip took him off track as much as he took the trip because he _was_ off track.

Jimmy is lost.

I've had similar periods- you don't know whether you are lost because you are losing your mind or losing your mind because you are lost.
Chuck's betrayal really rocked his world. He's pragmatic enough to know he has to keep going but he just doesn't know where.
When we are at sixes and sevens- confused and not knowing which way to turn- we often go back to a more comfortable and familiar state of being or place.
Hence his return to Slippin' Jimmy.

He didn't go to the interview because his whole law degree dream was about making Chuck proud. Knowing he will never get Chuck's approval no matter how good or respected a lawyer he might become took the wind out of his sails. He just doesn't have it in him to try right now.
So he's taking the easier, more familiar path.

I found it a very sad episode.


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

pdhenry said:


> Makes me wonder what the minimum set of BB episodes is to fully understand and appreciate the BCS backstory.
> 
> Everything to understand where Jimmy and Mike end up and why, skipping all that distracting Walt and Jesse chemistry stuff that doesn't further the Jimmy/Saul and Mike story.


I loved BB but I would say zero too. It stands on its own, in my opinion. Now, I have no idea how BCS will end but I bet it would be fun to have never seen BB, watch BCS, then go watch BB. If I had a time machine...


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## Worf (Sep 15, 2000)

MikeAndrews said:


> We should remember that after going for the Kettleman stash, Jimmy had no hesitation that it go to the court_ along with_ the $30,000 Jimmy had.
> 
> We see here that he wonders what he was thinking back then.
> 
> ...


Easy. Back then he though the only reason why he doesn't have an office at HHM was Hammond was because of Hammond. The first few episodes were all about screwing him over.

Jimmy treated Chuck as a god - leaving Chicago after getting bailed to join his brother. He'd do anything to please him.

Only to find out in the end he wasn't being screwed by Hammond, but by his brother. With that, he gave up - his brother was backstabbing him all the way, he was putting in the hours to take care of him, and yet, he was still Slippin' Jimmy. After all that work.

So in the end, he basically went back to his old life, found he actually enjoyed that bit, and decided he wasn't going to try to please his brother anymore.

He thought he had an ally. He didn't, and playing it by the straight and narrow wasn't getting him out of that closet in a nail salon.

I think BCS will end basically shortly after he becomes Saul and intersects with Breaking Bad.

At first, I thought the descriptions of the show would be showing how Saul came about with his legal tricks to get people off, but instead, it appears to be less formulaic, and more to show the journey. Saul was a 2-dimensional character in BB. BCS shows he's far more complex, human, and not necessarily the scumbag lawyer you know him as.

I can see maybe the third season onwards we'll see him weasel through cases, but only for a few episodes per season so it's not like another court show. Everything else will be more development and journey-oriented. The last season will be the big intersection and it'll probably be like extended scenes from BB.


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## MikeAndrews (Jan 17, 2002)

Gilligan says that the writers are considering going to what's happens to Jimmy in Omaha - after after he goes underground at the end of BB.

My opinion: For them a positive is that that story doesn't have a ending known to the audience.


----------



## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

MikeAndrews said:


> Gilligan says that the writers are considering going to what's happens to Jimmy in Omaha - after after he goes underground at the end of BB...


Source?


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## MikeAndrews (Jan 17, 2002)

Bierboy said:


> Source?


That KCRW podcast linked above. It has many in the cast and Vince and "Shnozz" the director/writer.


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## Hank (May 31, 2000)

Worf said:


> Easy. Back then he though the only reason why he doesn't have an office at HHM was *Hammond* was because of *Hammond*. The first few episodes were all about screwing him over.


FYI, it's HAMLIN. As in "Hamlin, Hamlin & McGill".

I was thinking, I don't think the transition to Saul will happen that quickly in S2. They have a lot of room and time to do that.. I think it's going to be a slow progression, just like it was in S1. While he clearly "turned the corner" towards Saul, I think he still needs quite a bit more of development to actually become the Saul Goodman we know from BB. Maybe by or towards the very end of S2 we'll finally see Saul Goodman as we know him, but we have a ways to go.

And like mentioned above, once he does transition into Saul, then it just becomes another "court show" --- how many weeks would the audience stand to see Saul's questionable legal antics? I think once Saul is fully developed, the show's over. Unless they FF into the Omaha timeline to see him do another morph from Cinnabun Asst. Manager into another incarnation of Slippin' Jimmy. That would be cool.


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## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

DevdogAZ said:


> The bingo scene was brilliantly written, acted, and filmed. Jimmy's speech made the people in the bingo hall uncomfortable and it made the viewers uncomfortable. We wanted it to end just like the bingo players did. But that's exactly the emotion that scene was designed to create. Jimmy is feeling unmoored and lost and doesn't know what to do with his life. Everything he had been working toward has just been pulled out from under him. The scene was designed to help the viewer understand those feelings.
> 
> If you're just watching to find out what happens and see how Jimmy turns into Saul, you'll be missing out on an amazing, in-depth character study, and you'll probably be disappointed, because the character development is going to be much more important to the writers than the plot.


Totally agree. Loved this episode. So well done. :up:


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## Numb And Number2 (Jan 13, 2009)

In the you-can't-work-here negotiations Hamlin told Jimmy: "We can probably up it a bit" in reference to the $20,000 of-counsel fee. It's unrealistic that Jimmy wouldn't have capitalized on that comment when he turned over the class action case to HHM.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

I got about halfway through the Bingo scene and switched to something else to watch. I came back to it two days later and still wanted to ffwd through the rest of the scene. I'm glad I didn't because of the payoff but it was a painful watch. Although it may have been brilliantly written and acted, it wasn't "real" to me. At least one of the Bingo players should have started catcalling Jimmy to shut the hell up and just read the frickin' numbers.


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## danterner (Mar 4, 2005)

cheesesteak said:


> I got about halfway through the Bingo scene and switched to something else to watch. I came back to it two days later and still wanted to ffwd through the rest of the scene. I'm glad I didn't because of the payoff but it was a painful watch. Although it may have been brilliantly written and acted, it wasn't "real" to me. At least one of the Bingo players should have started catcalling Jimmy to shut the hell up and just read the frickin' numbers.


When Jimmy tossed the final B ball to the player at the end of the scene, I really wanted to see the player call out the number and have the crowd thank him.


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## Hank (May 31, 2000)

danterner said:


> When Jimmy tossed the final B ball to the player at the end of the scene, I really wanted to see the player to call out the number and have the crowd thank him.


Me too! Let Jimmy blabber on and on, but at least call the damn number first! These are old people, they don't have all day!!

Also, people who complain about this scene probably didn't like the "Fly" episode in BB either.


----------



## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

danterner said:


> When Jimmy tossed the final B ball to the player at the end of the scene, I really wanted to see the player to call out the number and have the crowd thank him.


And someone shout "Bingo!"


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## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

DevdogAZ said:


> I think Jimmy also had to think about how Marco told him that if he's a real lawyer and he's not making bank, he must be doing something wrong. Maybe that got Jimmy thinking that his way of toiling and struggling to get old people to pay him $140 to do a will was never going to get him where he wants to be.


Yup.

Think back to when Jimmy was doing the $140 will for the old lady. He was bored, disengaged, uncomfortable. He had to do smooth talking to get it done, but he didn't enjoy it at all.

Then think about the half-dollar scam. Made about the same amount of money in about the same amount of time. But he was loving it, he was alive, he was in the zone.

I too think the week with Marco and the things Marco said sunk in and he realizes what makes him feel alive.


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## Turtleboy (Mar 24, 2001)

I can't believe we have almost a full year to talk about - well not much - until the new season.


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## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

heySkippy said:


> I thought the first season of BB sucked the first time I watched it. I gave up on BB a couple episodes into the 2nd season as too soapy. I gave it another try a couple years later with my wife and kept with it until it got better somewhere deep in season 2.


Agreed. The part of BB that involved the son, or Hank and his wife, or most any of the family stuff was pretty bad.

Better Call Saul avoids all that marital soap-opera crap, and benefits greatly for it.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

uncdrew said:


> Agreed. The part of BB that involved the son, or Hank and his wife, or most any of the family stuff was pretty bad.
> 
> Better Call Saul avoids all that marital soap-opera crap, and benefits greatly for it.


Yup. BCS is a "smaller" show with a much tighter focus.


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

cheesesteak said:


> I got about halfway through the Bingo scene and switched to something else to watch. I came back to it two days later and still wanted to ffwd through the rest of the scene. I'm glad I didn't because of the payoff but it was a painful watch. Although it may have been brilliantly written and acted, it wasn't "real" to me. At least one of the Bingo players should have started catcalling Jimmy to shut the hell up and just read the frickin' numbers.


No one in the audience was going to give Jimmy any trouble because they like him. A lot. They camera kept cutting to the audience members faces during the bingo scene and there was zero anger or impatience that I saw.


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## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

They like him, they like his style. Many old people are accustomed to sitting around, and at least with Jimmy the sitting around is entertaining.


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## brianric (Aug 29, 2002)

What surprised me was the bingo players only had one card (matrices) in front of them while playing. Back in the early 1980ies while stationed onboard the USS Vinson (CVN-70) I would help the local Knights of Columbus run their Bingo games. Some of the players would have ten or more cards in front of them while playing.


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## MikeAndrews (Jan 17, 2002)

brianric said:


> What surprised me was the bingo players only had one card (matrices) in front of them while playing. Back in the early 1980ies while stationed onboard the USS Vinson (CVN-70) I would help the local Knights of Columbus run their Bingo games. Some of the players would have ten or more cards in front of them while playing.


Yeah, that's how it goes in most places I've been.

I won at Bingo at the casino in Milwaukee, where they give out cards in groups of 8.


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## MikeAndrews (Jan 17, 2002)

uncdrew said:


> Yup.
> 
> Think back to when Jimmy was doing the $140 will for the old lady. He was bored, disengaged, uncomfortable. He had to do smooth talking to get it done, but he didn't enjoy it at all.
> ...


Plus he had to allow the old lady to give him a partial check or whatever she had. There's no joy in taking from those who don;'t it.

With a con...you can't con a mark who doesn't have larceny in his heart.


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

The Insider Podcast for episode 10 finally posted sometime in the last 24 hours.


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## Hank (May 31, 2000)

The funny thing I've always thought about BINGO is that it's essentially predetermined based on the cards. Reduced to it's lowest level, a computer needs to first pull all the balls/numbers randomly, in order, and then each card could have a QR code that embeds the layout of each card.. and as you walk into the hall, you could just scan the QR code of each card against the current set of randomly pulled balls, and once everyone enters their cards, the computer could instantly determine who would get "BINGO" first. None of this waiting and waiting and waiting for the next ball to be called BS. 

It's easier to just assign each player a single random number (or set of random numbers based on how many cards they bought), and then pick from those for the prizes and dispense with the cards and balls.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

MikeAndrews said:


> With a con...you can't con a mark who doesn't have larceny in his heart.


Sure you can. There are plenty of cons that prey on ignorance or confusion, not malice. That's why there are all those stories on the news about little old ladies who get tricked out of their life savings.


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

Cons vs. scams, perhaps.


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## MikeAndrews (Jan 17, 2002)

Hank said:


> The funny thing I've always thought about BINGO is that it's essentially predetermined based on the cards. Reduced to it's lowest level, a computer needs to first pull all the balls/numbers randomly, in order, and then each card could have a QR code that embeds the layout of each card.. and as you walk into the hall, you could just scan the QR code of each card against the current set of randomly pulled balls, and once everyone enters their cards, the computer could instantly determine who would get "BINGO" first. None of this waiting and waiting and waiting for the next ball to be called BS.
> 
> It's easier to just assign each player a single random number (or set of random numbers based on how many cards they bought), and then pick from those for the prizes and dispense with the cards and balls.


Yep. Except that marking the numbers and tracking is part of the game. When you call Bingo the attendant actually calls out only _the card serial number _to verify that your card is a winner - meaning that the numbers on the cards are in a computer database which also tracks the drawn balls on the table.

The Bingo parlor even has electronic tablets that they "pre-load" with your "cards." The tablet knows which ball was drawn but _you still have to touch the number on your card to mark it._

They have those tight rules like that you have to call Bingo before the next ball is drawn, but I don't how they can rule that the last ball drawn wasn't the one that you won with. Certainly if the next ball gave somebody else a Bingo, you lose.


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## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

brianric said:


> What surprised me was the bingo players only had one card (matrices) in front of them while playing. Back in the early 1980ies while stationed onboard the USS Vinson (CVN-70) I would help the local Knights of Columbus run their Bingo games. Some of the players would have ten or more cards in front of them while playing.


Fine point.

In casinos and bingo halls, it's about the casino making money. So they'll sell you as many cards as you want.

In an old-folks home, it's about giving them something to do that doesn't take too much staff/resources. So... one card only. 

* I used to help run a bingo night at a children's hospital. It was fun.


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## sharkster (Jul 3, 2004)

Hank said:


> These are old people, they don't have all day!!


My favorite line of the whole thread.  Thanks for the chuckle. I needed that.


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## heySkippy (Jul 2, 2001)

pdhenry said:


> Cons vs. scams, perhaps.


Yeah. A hallmark of a con is that it depends on the greed of the mark to succeed.


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## Anubys (Jul 16, 2004)

heySkippy said:


> No one in the audience was going to give Jimmy any trouble because they like him. A lot. They camera kept cutting to the audience members faces during the bingo scene and there was zero anger or impatience that I saw.


Well, everyone loves Matlock!


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## uncdrew (Aug 6, 2002)

Another funny line was when the woman realized he wasn't Kevin Costner, and he says:

"If you build it, I will come."


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## TheSlyBear (Dec 26, 2002)

Turtleboy said:


> And someone shout "Bingo!"


I was fully expecting this and felt a lack of closure when it didn't happen.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

pdhenry said:


> The Insider Podcast for episode 10 finally posted sometime in the last 24 hours.


I'm listening right now. I highly recommend it for any of you that like the show. The insights they provide into all facets of the writing and production process are fascinating. For example:

-They had written most of the first season. They were trying to come up with the story for episode 10 and were stuck. They also knew that they were going to be short on episode 4 and weren't sure how to fill that gap. This is when the Marco character was created, and the opening scene in S01E04 with Jimmy and Marco pulling the fake Rolex scam was written at that time. In fact, the scene where Marco dies in the alley was filmed the day before the scene where Jimmy pulls the fake Rolex scam in the alley.

-There were over six hours of footage for the bingo scene in this episode. The editor spent days trying to put it together the right way and she agonized over it and felt like Jimmy's speech was very moving and heartbreaking. Then when Vince saw her edit he laughed because he thought it was funny and she was afraid she'd done something terribly wrong, because she didn't intend the scene to be funny at all.


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## DreadPirateRob (Nov 12, 2002)

Finally watched the finale last night (was out of town all of last week). It was good, but not as great as the more recent episodes leading up to it had been. Still, all in all I do think the first season of BCS was better as a whole than the first season of BB. That is not to denigrate BB in any way - it's just that BCS has the built-in advantage of a showrunner/creator and writing team at the height of their powers and who have already figured out the universe of the show, and already have two fully-formed and incredibly riveting characters to base their show around. So there's not the typical "find out who/what your characters are all about" breaking-in process.


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## pjenkins (Mar 8, 1999)

Guess I might be in the minority, but I considered the first season of BB better because the storyline was so much more compelling. While BCS is good, the storyline really isn't all that compelling to me, the Mike storylines actually are the best part of the show to me. I guess I just don't connect with Jimmy in a way like I did with WW.


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## jsmeeker (Apr 2, 2001)

I just don't see how someone who had never seen BB could get really into Better Call Saul.

I like BCS a lot because I always loved Saul in BB. Mike too. They throw us some bones, too. (Tuco!!!)


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## Wheens (Jan 1, 2003)

Maybe Chuck really isn't "loony toons".
http://www.popsci.com/achieve-radio-silence-west-virginia-town


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

jsmeeker said:


> I just don't see how someone who had never seen BB could get really into Better Call Saul.
> 
> I like BCS a lot because I always loved Saul in BB. Mike too. They throw us some bones, too. (Tuco!!!)


I think I could because its funny, sad, all that. I do think, however, having a BB vet explain the nuances to you would be of great benefit. Of course that would be annoying to the explainer but sometimes like with my wife I want her to like what I like and am happy when she does even if I have to explain the hilarity of large magnets to her. Plus Bob is/was a great comedian before any of this began. That shows through in my opinion.


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## Worf (Sep 15, 2000)

Wheens said:


> Maybe Chuck really isn't "loony toons".
> http://www.popsci.com/achieve-radio-silence-west-virginia-town


No, they're loonies.

There is one recorded case and the guy lives miles from civilization in a rural quiet area (Sweden, I think). Vehicles must park a mile from his house, no electronics or electrics - so mechanical watches, mechanical manual film cameras (no metering or electronics here) are to be used. Naturally, no electricity at all.

And he got it through a lifetime of work at Ericsson, working on cellphone base stations - to the point where he was issued an RF suit which worked for a while, but eventually he was forced to retire in the countryside.

That national radio quiet zone is not EMI free - those towers have plenty of electronics in them, and it appears they have electricity. They're not allowed RF transmitters (which as anyone knows, is everything electronic, so the place disallows INTENTIONAL RF transmitters).

Especially damning is the photo where you can clearly see a computer on the desk - an Apple iMac, with WiFi and Bluetooth.

Now, I won't discount their symptoms - it's been proven it's psychosomatic, so yes, they do have the symptoms and they're as real as can be tested. However, it originates from the mind, and nothing physical. Just seeing the tower makes them sick, even though they'll happily use the smartphone in their hand (pay attention next time people complain about smart meters causing headaches).

Other damning information is basically you'll have plenty of reports of "EMI sensitivity" even if the equipment isn't switched off. Tower erectors know that they never power up the equipment "when the button is pushed" - they either have the tower running already, or they keep the tower off. This way they know any reports are quacks because either the tower has been in operation for months without a complaint, or it's still off.

Finally, you'd think people like this would be happy to submit to actual tests - a double-blind RF sensitivity study would settle the question, but...

And Chuck? Well, he managed to use a cellphone, survive a car ride in a high RF environment (on the street), and only after all that did he arrive at HHM who turned off the power for them. If you've got sensitivity issues, you'd really be living closer to an Amish lifestyle. Except without the phone.


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

There was also the hospital bed trick that didn't affect him.


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