# Amazon Unbox going away?



## jwehman (Feb 26, 2003)

Engadget is reporting that Amazon's Unbox service is going away, to be replaced by a much better, larger library VOD service. What does this mean for Unbox via TiVo?

Engadget:
http://www.engadget.com/2008/07/17/amazon-video-on-demand-store-streams-video-launches-today/

The original article from NYT:
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/17/t...l?_r=2&ref=technology&oref=slogin&oref=slogin


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

Why are not hearing about NETFLIX on TiVo????????????

This Amazon service on Tivo could be alright if it is subscription based.


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## JuryDuty (Jan 10, 2003)

Wow--very interesting. Will want to see how this plays out...


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

I certainly hope that:



> stream the content to other (any?) Internet connected devices.


means that this will work with TiVo. I have relied on Unbox for series on channels we don't receive. I haven't really wanted to use Hulu since I figured quality, when blown up to 37" will just not be very good.

I may have to try Hulu now and connect my laptop to my TV.


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## dig_duggler (Sep 18, 2002)

Interesting. I don't know why Amazon would want to exclude Tivo (or any device). It just leaked out, but as time goes on silence from Tivo won't be a good sign.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

I guess no one actually read the NYT article?



> Mr. Carr said Amazon would pursue similar deals with other makers of TVs and Internet devices. "We can support both streaming and downloading," he said.


Not to mention Unbox on TiVo probably generates the majority of Amazon's video revenues. I don't see them killing it.


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## dig_duggler (Sep 18, 2002)

davezatz said:


> I guess no one actually read the NYT article?
> 
> Not to mention Unbox on TiVo probably generates the majority of Amazon's video revenues. I don't see them killing it.


Touche.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

FYI I just confirmed this with TiVo. The conversation went something like this: "Is Unbox on TiVo being killed?" "No way." As I suspected, it's basically Amazon rebranding and expanding their service offering. Carry on.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

Yes, the NYT article says nothing about scrapping Unbox, although it incorrectly refers to it in the past tense. (Even assuming that they _are_ scrapping it, the past tense is incorrect, since it's operational right now. They should've written "has been" instead of "was", "requires" instead of "required", and "works" instead of "worked".)



New York Times said:


> Amazon Unbox, the company's original download-only video store, was largely seen as a disappointment because it required customers to download special software to watch the programs they bought. The service also worked only on Windows PCs and TiVo set-top boxes.


Engadget's article appears to be based entirely on the NYT article, which means they're taking an erroneous description and making it even more misleading, by adding the term "scrapping".


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## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

Sounds like PPV hulu.com.
I hope they keep Unbox as an alternative, I don't want to be restricted to ONLY streaming or ONLY download.
when I had a faster internet connection, the downloads were in better-than-realtime so I don't see what advantage streaming would have given me.
I don't know if they have now better compression so I can get it in real-time even with only 1.5 mpbs down, like I do with hulu.com. In that case, I guess this is better.


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## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

Cool. I got one of those Bravia Internet Video Links sitting in a box collecting dust here at work. Might need to pick myself up a Sony Bravia for home.


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

ZeoTiVo said:


> Why are not hearing about NETFLIX on TiVo????????????


Because Netflix now has an exclusive deal with Microsoft (according to their E3 press conference).


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

morac said:


> Because Netflix now has an exclusive deal with Microsoft (according to their E3 press conference).


I believe it's a *gaming console* exclusive. Obiovulsy the Roku box already exists and the LG DVD player with Netflix is on the way.


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## dylanemcgregor (Jan 31, 2003)

davezatz said:


> I believe it's a *gaming console* exclusive. Obiovulsy the Roku box already exists and the LG DVD player with Netflix is on the way.


And they have promised that they are working on another partnership with a third company with a device in "millions of homes." Crossing my fingers that this mysterious third company is TiVo...

I'd probably break down and get a TiVoHD if a Netflix partnership didn't work on the S2 platform (like Youtube).


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## EvilMidniteBombr (May 25, 2006)

From TiVoPony in the YouTube Thread in the Series 3 section.


TiVoPony said:


> Guys - The Dallas Morning News got this a bit wrong. Amazon is not 'ditching' Unbox. They're adding a new streaming capability for PC's, but the download capability is not going away. No worries!
> 
> Pony


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## pomerlp (Apr 22, 2008)

EvilMidniteBombr said:


> From TiVoPony in the YouTube Thread in the Series 3 section.


I saw the title of the thread and I was very interested. I download a lot of things from Amazon Unbox like series I haven't seen before. So I did not want Amazon Unbox to go away.

I read the article and now I have a question. What was the purpose of this thread? In not one place did it mention TiVo. It talked about a different type of service but did not mention anything about TiVo using it or dumping Unbox service for TiVo users.

Then the quote above confirms that it won't affect those of us who use Unbox.

So really that link, while interesting in other ways had nothing to do with TiVo. And this is the TiVo Forum. I think.


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## shady (May 31, 2002)

pomerlp said:


> I saw the title of the thread and I was very interested. I download a lot of things from Amazon Unbox like series I haven't seen before. So I did not want Amazon Unbox to go away.
> 
> I read the article and now I have a question. What was the purpose of this thread? In not one place did it mention TiVo. It talked about a different type of service but did not mention anything about TiVo using it or dumping Unbox service for TiVo users.
> 
> ...


If the OP didn't start this thread, I would have.

If the Unbox service is dumped. then your TiVo is not going to provide the unbox service.

I read the story on Engadget this morning and the very first line of the report said "The New York Times is reporting that Amazon is scrapping its Unbox service".

The first thing that came to my mind was, wow, what about Unbox on TiVo? The TiVo Unbox application is just a front end to the Unbox service, and if that architecture is changed to a streaming service, who knows how long it would take to provide that service on TiVo.

I think the OP was justified in asking this question. Further details have come out that state there will be streaming and downloading, although that wasn't obvious from the beginning.

Now if the article had said Amazon Unbox is adding streaming capability to its existing download functionality and in the process is being rebranded, then I wouldn't have been so concerned.


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## yunlin12 (Mar 15, 2003)

Can we edit the thread name, or find a way to close this misleading thread, now that we know the truth:



> Originally Posted by TiVoPony View Post
> Guys - The Dallas Morning News got this a bit wrong. Amazon is not 'ditching' Unbox. They're adding a new streaming capability for PC's, but the download capability is not going away. No worries!
> 
> Pony


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## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

To reinforce what's already stated: The name is changing, but the service for TiVo DVRs is staying.

In fact, certain small improvements are right around the corner....


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## djwilso (Dec 23, 2006)

TiVoStephen said:


> In fact, certain small improvements are right around the corner....


Like high definition content perhaps?

Sorry, couldn't resist.


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## rocko (Oct 29, 2002)

Found at http://www.afterdawn.com/news/archive/13925.cfm

_Although there have been rumors swirling for months that it was going to happen, TiVo has officially confirmed that Amazon Unbox will be going HD.

"Unbox, the content-downloading service TiVo started with Internet retail leader Amazon.com last year, cant process HD content, though the companies will announce HD capabilities in the not too distant future, Mr. Denney of TiVo said.

Amazon explains the process of using Unbox on TiVo on its official site. "After a simple registration process, you will be able to shop for Unbox videos to your TiVo DVR from two places - the Amazon Unbox website and directly from your TiVo DVR.

If you're shopping on the Amazon Unbox Website, just look for the TiVo logo to find TiVo-enabled videos. You'll be able to select your TiVo DVR as a RemoteLoad download destination each time you purchase or rent a video at amazon.com/unbox.

To shop for Unbox videos from your TiVo DVR, select "Find Programs" > "Download TV & Movies" > "Amazon Unbox". You'll find a great selection of movies and TV shows to watch right on your TiVo."

TiVo executives also added however that a few kinks will need to be "ironed out", mostly bandwidth constraints.

Price is not known for HD movie rentals as of yet but if previous customer surveys are a judge then the cost will be $4.99 USD, the same as iTunes' current model. _


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

I too wish that the Netflix service was available on Tivos.. I'm not going to pay $99 for another box anytime soon... (They don't support Macs.) But hulu or similar might be even better! I do miss an episode (even with Tivos) every once in a while.. being able to still get it *on the Tivo* would be awesome.


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## pomerlp (Apr 22, 2008)

djwilso said:


> Like high definition content perhaps?
> 
> Sorry, couldn't resist.


Now that would be something worth starting a thread about!:up:

I suppose in retrospect that the OP was trying to be informative. However it would have probably been better to mention in his post that TiVo was not mentioned and that you can speculate as you please. Because that's all that post did was cause speculation.

I just felt differently about it after reading the actual link. To me it sounded just like it appears to be. Simply a change in the way they are going to deliver service, not just "dumping" the service altogether.

And thanks Rocko for the link! Sounds like more good news.


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## husky55 (Feb 2, 2008)

I tried Amazon Unbox. Most disappointing to say the least. Amzon would be real smart to get rid of it and replace it with this new (not really new) streaming technology. And of course make it available to TivoHD.


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## acvthree (Jan 17, 2004)

So, it was download vs. streaming that you found dissapointing?


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## husky55 (Feb 2, 2008)

acvthree said:


> So, it was download vs. streaming that you found dissapointing?


I downloaded a Widescreen movie. It took a very long time ( I forgot exactly how much time), and when it was done, it did not have 5.1 audio instead just stereo or mono, came in full screen 4X3 instead of 16x9, etc...

I really do not care about how Amazon does it, download or streaming, but the experience was not to my liking. I did it again with a HD TV show. Same thing. The same show was better on my TivoHD, sound and video.

But I am sure there are people who like it that's why I suggest you try out for yourself.


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## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

husky55 said:


> I downloaded a Widescreen movie. It took a very long time ( I forgot exactly how much time), and when it was done, it did not have 5.1 audio instead just stereo or mono, came in full screen 4X3 instead of 16x9, etc...
> 
> I really do not care about how Amazon does it, download or streaming, but the experience was not to my liking. I did it again with a HD TV show. Same thing. The same show was better on my TivoHD, sound and video.
> 
> But I sure there are people who like it that's why I suggest you try out for yourself.


Yes, they are all letterboxed with stereo sound. That's a definite drawback.


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## Globular (Jun 9, 2004)

TiVoStephen said:


> To reinforce what's already stated: The name is changing, but the service for TiVo DVRs is staying.
> 
> In fact, certain small improvements are right around the corner....


HD Please, please PLEASE!

I'll use Unbox a lot if it has HD movie renals. A LOT.

-Matt


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## yunlin12 (Mar 15, 2003)

TiVoStephen said:


> To reinforce what's already stated: The name is changing, but the service for TiVo DVRs is staying.
> 
> In fact, certain small improvements are right around the corner....


"certain small improvements"?

Is it a literal small improvement, or a Steve Jobs "Oh, one more thing" kind of improvement?


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## acvthree (Jan 17, 2004)

husky55 said:


> I downloaded a Widescreen movie. It took a very long time ( I forgot exactly how much time), and when it was done, it did not have 5.1 audio instead just stereo or mono, came in full screen 4X3 instead of 16x9, etc...
> 
> I really do not care about how Amazon does it, download or streaming, but the experience was not to my liking. I did it again with a HD TV show. Same thing. The same show was better on my TivoHD, sound and video.
> 
> But I am sure there are people who like it that's why I suggest you try out for yourself.


I hope that there are improvments, but just changing from download to streaming may or may not change any of these, particularly since you now don't have to wait for the download to complete before starting to view the movie.

I do agree with you that I was hoping we would have something close to DVD quality and 5.1 by now.

Al


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

TiVoStephen said:


> In fact, certain small improvements are right around the corner....


If by "small" improvement, you mean smaller download sizes by switching to MP4, that would be welcome.


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

djwilso said:


> Like high definition content perhaps?


Or Closed Captioning for the hearing impaired, so these disabled customers can capitalize on the service, perhaps?



djwilso said:


> Sorry, couldn't resist.


Neither could I. It's getting to the point where if the industry continues to neglect disabled viewers like this, it'll result in new regulations stemming from the ADA, which, being regulations, would almost surely cost industry more than voluntarily addressing the needs of these viewers.


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## pomerlp (Apr 22, 2008)

bicker said:


> Or Closed Captioning for the hearing impaired, so these disabled customers can capitalize on the service, perhaps?


Certainly they need to make accommodations for these folks. Didn't a US court recently declare that our currency needs to be changed so people who are sightless can tell what their denominations are?


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## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

I'm very sorry about Closed Captioning. Note that none of the download services have Closed Captioning today, including Amazon Unbox. The studios simply do not make the captions available in the files that are distributed.

We've definitely announced HD will be available later this year; that's not what I was referring to, which was me being coy about a refinement to our UI due soon.


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

TiVoStephen said:


> I'm very sorry about Closed Captioning. Note that none of the download services have Closed Captioning today, including Amazon Unbox.


From what I've been told on AVS Forum, that is no longer true. AppleTV evidently supports Closed Captioning now (since January).



TiVoStephen said:


> The studios simply do not make the captions available in the files that are distributed.


With respect, I believe appropriate accommodation for the disabled should require it, and any company that dirties its hands with content that doesn't satisfy that requirement warrants being painted with the same brush. You have your priorities, and I respect that, but I believe you deserve to be besmirched as much as the studios, since you agree to do business with them even though they don't satisfy this essential need for disabled folks.


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## gonzotek (Sep 24, 2004)

bicker said:


> From what I've been told on AVS Forum, that is no longer true. AppleTV evidently supports Closed Captioning now (since January).


Here's a good article (with pics) describing CC support in Apple TV/iTunes/iPhone, and the paltry amount of content offered with the cc data, posted January '08.

http://www.deafdc.com/blog/adam-sto...-support-for-appletv-but-content-falls-short/


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## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

Yes, though with what AppleTV has done, they've *more effectively *done what I think TiVoStephen's message attempted to do, i.e., try to absolve the service provider from responsibility by redirecting the blame solely to content providers. There is enough blame to go around for all suppliers here, but TiVo needs to take one more step to get me to stop highlighting their omission in this regard. I don't expect them to do so, though, because it is not strictly required by law, and probably not a profitable decision.


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## Globular (Jun 9, 2004)

TiVoStephen said:


> We've definitely announced HD will be available later this year; that's not what I was referring to, which was me being coy about a refinement to our UI due soon.


Why has this taken so damn long? TiVo has been sitting outside of this market long enough for all the other competitors to beat them to the punch. There are so many other alternatives that I (and many others) are looking elsewhere for their HD content; personally I'm begining to wonder if TiVo is necessary at all, and I've been a loyal customer for several years.

Who gives a monkey's about YouTube? The quality stinks, and the content is garbage. Couldn't the effort have gone to HD downloads from Amazon? THAT would have been a noteworthy achievement. The YouTube link is barely getting a mention out there; again, who cares?

Feh.

-Matt


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

Globular said:


> Who gives a monkey's about YouTube? The quality stinks, and the content is garbage.


You're way off base.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

Globular said:


> Who gives a monkey's about YouTube? The quality stinks, and the content is garbage. Couldn't the effort have gone to HD downloads from Amazon? THAT would have been a noteworthy achievement. The YouTube link is barely getting a mention out there; again, who cares?-Matt


OK, YouTube is not as big a deal as just released movies. We all get that. But you assume that TiVo is not doing the HD from Unbox - but I have not seen any available from UNBOX, I think UNBOX is the holdup on HD content but of course TiVo would not wag their finger at a partner.

so instead they find someone with a LOT of H-264 content and work out a deal to make it available on TiVo. TiVo gets to deisgn a real world H-264 setup and then test it out on a lot of boxes in the real world. You tube gets another venue direct on the TV. Win-Win.

Are you contatcting UNBOX about providing TiVo some H-264 content? I think that i the place to get some action.


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## Globular (Jun 9, 2004)

ZeoTiVo said:


> OK, YouTube is not as big a deal as just released movies. We all get that. But you assume that TiVo is not doing the HD from Unbox - but I have not seen any available from UNBOX, I think UNBOX is the holdup on HD content but of course TiVo would not wag their finger at a partner.
> 
> so instead they find someone with a LOT of H-264 content and work out a deal to make it available on TiVo. TiVo gets to deisgn a real world H-264 setup and then test it out on a lot of boxes in the real world. You tube gets another venue direct on the TV. Win-Win.


OK, I'll buy that. I hope it's true. BTW, has TiVo confirmed the H-264 content is being decoded directly on the S3/TiVo HD boxes? I know the circumstantial evidence is strong, but I haven't seen a definitive answer. If I've missed it, I'm sorry.



ZeoTiVo said:


> Are you contatcting UNBOX about providing TiVo some H-264 content? I think that i the place to get some action.


Yes. I have been pestering them as well.

Sorry for the rant, but I'm frustrated. This has been promised for a loooong time now, and many other solutions for downloaded HD content to the TV have appeared since. I could have spent money on any of them but have been waiting for TiVo (and Amazon, or some other provider) to come through with the BEST solution. My patience is wearing thin. If there's a good reason for the delay, I'd love to hear it.

-Matt


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## Globular (Jun 9, 2004)

wmcbrine said:


> You're way off base.


Really? It looks like crud on my TV. If there's a secret way to get high quality HD video from YouTube, I'll change my mind.

And, how many kids dancing in front of a webcam can you watch? Sure, I've seen a funny video or two, but c'mon, skateboarding dogs aren't what I bought a TiVo for.


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

The only time I've ever found good stuff on YouTube was when I was given a link to YouTube content. If you try to "browse" YouTube you find that it really is 99&#37; dreck.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

Globular said:


> BTW, has TiVo confirmed the H-264 content is being decoded directly on the S3/TiVo HD boxes?


Dave Zatz has confirmed it with a TiVo representative. He has posted that in some threads here and on his zatznotfunny site.


> Yes. I have been pestering them as well.
> 
> Sorry for the rant, but I'm frustrated. -Matt


I can understand the frustration, I have not heard of any reason for the delay but the YouTube app certianly shows that TiVo is working full steam on streaming H.264 to the Series 3 line.


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## Globular (Jun 9, 2004)

OK. Thanks Zeo.


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## pomerlp (Apr 22, 2008)

Globular said:


> Why has this taken so damn long? TiVo has been sitting outside of this market long enough for all the other competitors to beat them to the punch. There are so many other alternatives that I (and many others) are looking elsewhere for their HD content; personally I'm begining to wonder if TiVo is necessary at all, and I've been a loyal customer for several years.


Now you listen here mister. You will get your HD when they are darn ready to give it to you!

I'm not as up to date on some stuff. What other alternatives for HD are there other then DVD? (please go easy on me)



Globular said:


> Who gives a monkey's about YouTube? The quality stinks, and the content is garbage. Couldn't the effort have gone to HD downloads from Amazon? THAT would have been a noteworthy achievement. The YouTube link is barely getting a mention out there; again, who cares?
> 
> Feh.
> 
> -Matt


I think I already posted my feelings about YouTube but I agree 100% on this point.


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## kas25 (Mar 10, 2003)

pomerlp said:


> Now you listen here mister. You will get your HD when they are darn ready to give it to you!
> 
> I'm not as up to date on some stuff. What other alternatives for HD are there other then DVD? (please go easy on me)
> 
> I think I already posted my feelings about YouTube but I agree 100% on this point.


Youtube will bring many more new users to Tivo than HD downloads. Youtube is a product used by a HUGE market that Tivo should be going after, younger viewers. While I can't wait for HD content from Amazon, I'd prefer more content rather than higher quality.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

BTW, I thought in the past, my unbox purchases were download compeltely then you can watch. Did an ep last night and I was able to start it right away. Does this mean they are in fact "streaming" now? 

I hope we get some good HD stuff soon. I also hope we get a Netflix option too!!!


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## Globular (Jun 9, 2004)

kas25 said:


> Youtube will bring many more new users to Tivo than HD downloads. Youtube is a product used by a HUGE market that Tivo should be going after, younger viewers. While I can't wait for HD content from Amazon, I'd prefer more content rather than higher quality.


I disagree. Who's going to buy a $300 HD DVR because it has YouTube on it, when almost everyone watches YouTube on their computer at work (in a window a couple hundred pixels in height, with mono sound)? People WILL buy a $300 HD DVR, and add it to their entertainment center, if they can download HD content with surround sound 5.1 No separate player required, only one remote, etc. etc.

-Matt


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## sooka (Sep 24, 2007)

pomerlp said:


> I think I already posted my feelings about YouTube but I agree 100% on this point.


Yes you did Hookbill!


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## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

Globular said:


> I disagree. Who's going to buy a $300 HD DVR because it has YouTube on it, when almost everyone watches YouTube on their computer at work (in a window a couple hundred pixels in height, with mono sound)? People WILL buy a $300 HD DVR, and add it to their entertainment center, if they can download HD content with surround sound 5.1 No separate player required, only one remote, etc. etc.
> 
> -Matt


I'm somewhere in the middle. 

While I don't think anyone will get a TiVo solely to watch YouTube, I think that it can be a contributing factor. Most of all though I think that it might get existing TiVo owners to start using the networking features. I bet many who have a TiVo have had no reason to hook it to their network.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

Globular said:


> I disagree. Who's going to buy a $300 HD DVR because it has YouTube on it, when almost everyone watches YouTube on their computer at work (in a window a couple hundred pixels in height, with mono sound)? People WILL buy a $300 HD DVR, and add it to their entertainment center, if they can download HD content with surround sound 5.1 No separate player required, only one remote, etc. etc.
> 
> -Matt


Many people will hear about TiVo because of the YouTube partnership. While it may not result in direct sales, it will be a factor in people's purchases. Btw, there are people with HDTVs that cost thousands of dollars that are using analog cable because they do not know any better. So I don't think YouTube video quality is of any concern to the majority of people.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

MickeS said:


> I'm somewhere in the middle.
> 
> While I don't think anyone will get a TiVo solely to watch YouTube, I think that it can be a contributing factor. Most of all though I think that it might get existing TiVo owners to start using the networking features. I bet many who have a TiVo have had no reason to hook it to their network.


It's funny. I think many people, or at least me, have TiVo over something else (Comcast DVR, Replay, etc) because it has a vastly superior user interface. Would I switch to the Comcast DVR because it has Youtube....absolutely not. So in this instance, I don't think something like Youtube will get folks to switch. I think TiVo still needs to push the ease of the UI and how good I think, IMHO, it is.

On the other hand, video of TiVoShanan downloaded directly to the TiVo...._that_ is a big selling point to me.


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## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

The new feature I mentioned is now out: Full catalog browse.

Check it out under TiVo Central -> Find Programs & Downloads -> Download TV, Movies, & Web Video -> Amazon Unbox TV & Movies -> Browse Entire Catalog


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## jcaudle (Aug 16, 2004)

pdhenry said:


> The only time I've ever found good stuff on YouTube was when I was given a link to YouTube content. If you try to "browse" YouTube you find that it really is 99% dreck.


I agree. Not worth the time to view it, and if I did, I would off the computer, not TV.


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## nrc (Nov 17, 1999)

jcaudle said:


> I agree. Not worth the time to view it, and if I did, I would off the computer, not TV.


As someone said, it's 99% dreck. But there's a lot of content there and that leaves some good stuff in the other 1%.

YouTube is a greate media outlet for the masses and independent artists. What TiVo needs to do now is allow you to setup a "Wish List" for YouTube content by specific posters. For example, I'd love to setup Wish List for amandapalmer and get each of her new videos as she posts them.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

nrc said:


> As someone said, it's 99% dreck.


Just like real TV!


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