# WARNING: Please read before upgrading Series2 TiVo



## weaknees

Hi--

(If you have already upgraded your HDVR2 or Series2 TiVo, this does not apply to you. Also, although we have referenced a potential power issue with the 230040, 240040 and 240080, this is NOT what we are writing about here.)

We don't mean to alarm anyone, but we have encountered a problem that can potentially cause permanent damage to your TiVo. This problem is easily avoided, and will only occur if you are not careful when upgrading your HDVR2 or Series2 TiVo.

The issue we raise below definitely applies to the HDVR2 and we have suspected this problem with the new-architecture Series2 standalone TiVos (230040, 240040 and 240080) as well. 

Overview: When looking inside your TiVo, you will notice a white ribbon cable running from the front panel of the TiVo to the motherboard. It is a white ribbon cable that plugs directly into the motherboard. 

Here's the WARNING: NEVER power-up your TiVo with this cable either slightly or completely removed from the motherboard. It must be firmly seated when you power up the TiVo.

Here's the reason: Doing so can permanently damage your TiVo. In some cases, the TiVo will power up but will not respond to the remote. In other cases, the TiVo will not power up at all (and will just click). With the HDVR2 and, potentially, the other Series2 TiVos, even if you later plug this cable back in, your TiVo still may not respond to your remote. 

Therefore, when removing the power cable and IDE cable from your TiVo's factory hard drive, be VERY careful of this cable. Do not dislodge it. If you do dislodge it, just re-insert the cable before powering up.

We have been including a warning in our HDVR2 upgrade instructions and TwinBreeze bracket instructions, but thought that a bit of UPPER CASE might also help save a TiVo or two.

Good luck with your upgrade... and sorry for the alamist title.

Michael


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## jahf

Thanks for the warning ... I just ordered the twinbreeze + fan setup and I appreciate knowing this in advance (since I might be one of those people who have a tendency to ignore printed stuff


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## 1283

I don't have Series2, so I'm following this just for curiosity. Why would it not work after plugging the cable back in? Is the hardware actually damaged, or is it a software problem that would require restoring the drive from backup?


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## weaknees

Restoring the drive from a backup doesn't help - but if anyone has other thoughts, please tell us!

Michael


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## 9047

I saw this white ribbon/cable when I upgraded my HDVR2 two weeks ago. I guess I was carefull enough not to disconnect it. Lucky me. Hinsdale, would it be possible to add this info to your guide too?


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## Ye Ha

OK, this just happened to me. It was not mentioned in the hinsdale how to, and I saw this post after I encountered problems and searched this board.

Sure enough, the cable came slightly out and I didn't see it until after I plugged TiVo back in and had problems. Now the remote doesn't work.

Am I screwed?


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## designr

> _Originally posted by weaknees _
> *Restoring the drive from a backup doesn't help - but if anyone has other thoughts, please tell us!
> 
> Michael *


My first thought was that you'ld have to reset the PRAM or the NVRAM or maybe even the PMU (Power Management Unit). My thinking being that it is a PowerPC logic card...

Not knowing the internals, I have no idea how to do that or if it's even possible. (It must be or Hughes wouldn't be able to fix these things.) Is there a little, teeny tiny button somewhere near the CPU? Is there some combination of front panel buttons that reset or drop the device into firmware during the boot cycle?

Then I had an entirely different thought. What if it were as simple as retraining the remote? See page 115 of the HDVR2 manual. Manually navigate to the System Information panel, scroll down two panels to where it should say "Remote Address: Not Set(0)" (if it still says that) and try setting it back to "0."

Let me know what happens. I'm curious.


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## designr

Question: Do all Series 2 TiVos support multiple recorders with independent remotes (like the HDVR2)?


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## Ye Ha

Huh? Wut? Manually navigate? Are you talking about a series 2?


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## unixadm

I put this as a sticky since it could save people from damaging their TiVos.


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## designr

> _Originally posted by Ye Ha _
> *Huh? Wut? Manually navigate? Are you talking about a series 2? *


If you have an HDVR2, there are controls built into the face of the unit. It was my understanding that the TiVo will no longer respond to the remote. The controls built into the face of the unit may still work.

What I'm suggesting is to use those controls on the front of the unit to navigate to the System Information page containing "Remote Address: Not Set(0)" and then following the directions for making the TiVo learn an individual remote.

Sorry. I have no intention of trying this myself because mine still works. Good luck.


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## stevel

I'm guessing that there is a component that "blows" on the motherboard when the front panel connector is not seated during power up - at least that's what I read in to what has been said before. I doubt it's a mere case of changing the remote code.

It's not that Hughes "can't" fix it, but it's more cost effective for them to just swap in a new (or refurbished) mainboard.


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## designr

It just seems odd to me that a missing component would cause physical damage to something on the main logic card. I could understand it if the component, in this case a daughter card, were seated improperly (ie, half out). But, weaknees is saying it happens if the main logic card is powered up and the daughter card is completely disconnected.

What's really odd is that, at least from my reading of weaknees' report, the controls on the face of the HDVR2 still work once the daughter card is reconnected. (Weaknees?) The same daughter card controls the IR input and those face controls.

If some component on the main logic card were physically damaged by a missing external component (ie, hard disk, RAM, IR sensor) at boot time, bench testing the main logic card would be a huge problem. I just have difficulty believing that such a huge design mistake could have been made.

What seems more likely to me is that a PRAM or Non-Volatile RAM (Firmware) setting is lost or corrupted when the IR sensor is not found during the hardware test. Again, probably a design mistake.

But, generally, a logic card reset (ie, PRAM reset, NVRAM reset or PMU reset) will force everything back to a factory baseline and the main logic card will be forced to relearn all of its components. That is, if the engineers had the foresight to plan for such a contingency.

On some systems, this may require a complete power drain. Basically, pull the power cord then pull the main logic card backup battery (that little round silver thing, looks like a big watch battery). Leave it out for a few hours. This will kill any settings stored in semi-permanent programmable RAM (ie, the clock, receiver settings, etc.).

THIS IS A LAST RESORT! IT MAY REALLY CAUSE BAD MOJO!!!!!!

Short of that, most main logic cards are designed to be reset in one way or another. (Some are really designed to be reset by pulling the backup battery.)

It may be policy that Hughes does not want people touching the main logic card. And, once an HDVR2 is returned, Hughes would have an onus to return a guaranteed refurb. This would require a bench test of all components. In that case, it would be cheaper to strip each box, assembly line the bench tests of all the components and build refurbs for return. Hence, a flat $150 charge for all out of warranty repairs.

That being said, it may be that the firmware can only be reprogrammed on a bench and there is no way to fix this problem except at the factory. Again, from my thinking, a bad design flaw.

But then I noticed that I can buy two or three HDVR2s and train each box/remote pair so that each box will only respond to one of the remotes. That way all three or four HDVR2s can be in the same room and still be controlled independently.

So, my thought is that the main logic card has simply forgotten about the factory default setting: "Remote Address: Not Set(0)." So following the instructions on page 115 of the HDVR2 manual may allow for the reset of that lost default.

In Hughes' mind, this problem is caused by user "abuse" and is not covered by warranty. They probably don't want to tell people how to fix something that violates their warranty terms, especially if that requires putting hands close to an unshielded power supply.

If the battery were bad (ie, shorted out somehow, had bad contacts), it could cause the same problem and a lot more. That would probably be covered by warranty.

Just a few thoughts.


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## designr

jonny_ns brings up an interesting question in the thread: Changing the HDVR2 IR Code Set 


> _Originally posted by jonny_ns _
> *Also, there is the following line in "System Information":
> 
> IR Controller Version: TiVo!
> 
> Does anyone know what this means?*


My first thought was: "Doubtless, the main logic card is designed to support future versions of the IR remote by simply replacing the IR daughter card."

Weaknees- What does the "IR Controller Version:" report in damaged HDVR2s?


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## weaknees

All of your suggestions are great. We had the exact same reaction when we first encountered it. We were sure to post only after we had tried everything possible. There are a number of IR code resets, remote resets, etc. that we tried. We, too, were surprised to find that the front panel will work (on the HDVR2), but that the remote will not.

Bottom line: Having that cable partially engaged creates some sort of a short that will knock out one of the chips. It is the chip immediately to the right of the connector, closest to the edge of the motherboard. In the HDVR2, permanent damage may also result if the cable is completely removed when the TiVo powers up.

Michael


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## designr

Well, then. That begs the question: How can Hughes prove the device failure was a result of user abuse and not from a inherent design flaw?

I once received a brand new computer that was factory sealed and DOA. When I opened it up, the CPU daughter card was laying on its side, loose on the main logic card. One RAM DIMM was half out and the VRAM contacts were corroded. After I put it back together, everything worked just fine (except the CD-ROM which was toast). I needed it that day, otherwise I would have returned it.

My point is that Hughes' quality control can not guarantee a 100% grade. Shipping abuse can easily unseat connectors that are a little out of tolerance. Moving the device from one room to another might be just enough to jiggle an already loose connector and short that chip. Even a little corrosion, maybe even a particularly humid day, could result in this kind of damage.

Is there even one HDVR2 that has outlived its one year warranty?

I'm sure not everyone with these defective HDVR2s wants to go the RMA route and wait 6-8 weeks for an in-warranty replacement. But, if Hughes knew of some "unofficial" trick to resurrect these boxes, they would never risk the liability of suggesting users open the box.

So, I guess all these defective HDVR2s will have to be returned to Hughes for free replacement. The same would go for any other defective Series2 TiVos.

After all, who's to say a Hughes assembly line worker didn't nudge the connector wrong causing a pin on the connector to get loose which resulted in an intermittent short between the main logic card and the daughter card which ended up causing a failure months later.

Arguably, such a design flaw combined with such poor quality control could result in a class action lawsuit that would force Hughes to recall and/or extend the warranties of all HDVR2s under the provisions of some States' lemon laws.

I would be incensed and immediately demand a refund if it were mine...  

Just another thought.


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## Ye Ha

I have a TiVo Series 2 TCD230040. There are no controls on the box itself, just the remote.

I called TiVo and opened a case, they know that I have opened the box.

I read the warranty in the installation manual. There is no mention that opening the box voids the warranty, nor was there any sort of sticker nor label on the box itself.

I've had the TiVo for almost 3 months, so, although the cable "may have come lose in shipping," it has been operating fine.

Having said that, I used to design computers as well as qualify others for purchase and I required that all cables have locking connectors to that they couldn't come lose. I can't believe the cable in question does not have a locking connector in light of the potential to damage the unit.

I plan to call corporate on Monday and pursue the warranty issue with them.

Sorry the moderators didn't make this thread sticky sooner as it would have saved me a lot of aggravation as well as potentially $150.


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## designr

> _Originally posted by Ye Ha _
> *I have a TiVo Series 2 TCD230040. I called TiVo and opened a case... *


Well... Do you still have your case number? You opened a case, they should have given you a case number. You may need to refer to the case number for the case that you opened.

Perhaps you misspoke, or perhaps you were misquoted. Certainly, you didn't mean to suggest that you opened the case of your TiVo. Regardless, that's hearsay because I heard you say you opened a case...


> I wasn't there, nobody saw me, you can't prove a thing.
> - Bart Simpson


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## Eccles

> _Originally posted by designr _
> *Well, then. That begs the question: How can Hughes prove the device failure was a result of user abuse and not from a inherent design flaw?
> 
> So, I guess all these defective HDVR2s will have to be returned to Hughes for free replacement. The same would go for any other defective Series2 TiVos.
> 
> After all, who's to say a Hughes assembly line worker didn't nudge the connector wrong causing a pin on the connector to get loose which resulted in an intermittent short between the main logic card and the daughter card which ended up causing a failure months later.
> *


Are there any cases of this happening to anyone who has _not_ had the box open and been muddling around inside? If not, and you're suggesting that folks who had inadvertently broken their TiVos _themselves_ send them back for warranty repair, then I have to ask whether you're familiar with the word *fraud*.

If someone takes it upon themselves to go rummaging around in the innards of their TiVo, and buggers it in the process, then they should be prepared to accept the consequences of their actions. It's called _personal responsibility_, and it seems to be a scarce commodity these days.


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## weaknees

Eccles...

WELL SAID!

Michael


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## tivoupgrade

> _Originally posted by Eccles _
> *
> If someone takes it upon themselves to go rummaging around in the innards of their TiVo, and buggers it in the process, then they should be prepared to accept the consequences of their actions. It's called personal responsibility, and it seems to be a scarce commodity these days. *


This *is* a good point. One would like assume that folks who take a risk in doing this are prepared to hold themselves accountable for their actions. Unfortunately, some folks don't even think about the consequences of their actions in the first place, or are willing to knowingly compromise their integrity, even if it negatively impacts others; there's always been a fear that entering into the upgrade process blindly, then involving the vendors in ongoing support issues could ruin the game for everybody.

They really should put the warranty labels on the back of the units like they used to; perhaps with even stronger wording.


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## designr

Eccles...

As you have no doubt been following the discussion, you noticed that the Series 2 TiVos in question, the HDVR2 and the TCD230040, have absolutely no warranty exclusion regarding the opening of the box. There is absolutely no warranty exclusion regarding the removal and replacement of the existing hard drive. And, there is absolutely no warranty exclusion regarding the addition of a second hard drive.

The only exclusion regarding the modification of these devices applies only to their modification for use with a non-original broadcast system, say changing the device from NTSC to PAL:


> A product that has been modified or adapted to enable it to operate in any country other than the country for which it was designed, manufactured, approved and/or authorized, or repair of products damaged by these modifications.


As with any small computer system, these TiVos are implicitly, if not explicitly, upgradeable by the end users. And, as this discussion board makes so patently obvious, it is common practice to upgrade and enhance these TiVo computer systems.

If Dell or Apple or HP sold boxes that could not be upgraded, they would be out of business in a heartbeat. If Dell or Apple or HP invalidated their warranties every time a user added a hard drive, their sales would drop dramatically. So, also with TiVo. I, and many others, would have opted for ReplayTV or the new DVD equipped HP Media Center PVR instead.

And, such an "unauthorized modification" exclusion would not, if one existed, be enforceable insofar as TiVo (and Hughes) is obliged to respect the provisions of the Gnu General Public License, one provision of which explicitly restricts TiVo (and Hughes) from imposing restrictions on copying (and using) the system software:


> 6. Each time you redistribute the Program (or any work based on the Program), the recipient automatically receives a license from the original licensor to copy, distribute or modify the Program subject to these terms and conditions. You may not impose any further restrictions on the recipients' exercise of the rights granted herein. You are not responsible for enforcing compliance by third parties to this License.


[In fact, the legality of the private El Gamal key is questionable in light of the provisions of the Gnu General Public License. This El Gamal public/private encryption system prevents the modification of the Open Source system software in direct contravention of one of the explicit provisions of the Gnu General Public License.]

Had you been following this thread more closely, it would have been apparent to you that the failure of these TiVos is the direct result of a *design defect.* Only an idiot designs a main logic card that self-destructs if something is missing, in this case the IR daughter card.

These users did nothing outside bounds of a normal hardware upgrade. These users did not scratch the main logic card. These users did not damage a connector. These users did not short the power supply. In fact, an industry standard technique for troubleshooting computer systems is to disconnect external devices in order to isolate the source of problems.

As with all manufacturers, Hughes includes one broad exclusion which addresses "misuse" and "unauthorized repairs:"


> Product replacement because of misuse, accident, lightning damage, unauthorized repair, or other cause not within the control of TiVo Inc.


It is painfully obvious to those that have been following this thread that Hughes is shirking their _personal responsibility_ and hiding behind these exclusions by crying "unauthorized repair" and blaming end users for their own *design defect*.

I, for one, wholeheartedly endorse forcing Hughes to prove that these TiVos died as a result of "misuse" or "unauthorized repair" and not as a result of Hughes' own engineering mistakes.

Say you bought a new truck and, say, you then bought and installed a third-party camper shell. By your reasoning, your bumper to bumper warranty would be null and void because you made a non-factory modification.

Let's say you took your new truck to the local gas station and got an oil change. And, let's say the gas jockey unplugged the computer to get at the oil filter. By your reasoning, your bumper to bumper warranty would be null and void when your new truck explodes in a huge fireball because you made an unauthorized repair.

Let's say you were driving your new truck down the road, going a few miles an hour over the speed limit. Now, let's say you hit a great big pothole. And, let's say that great big pothole damaged your suspension.

By your reasoning, you'd go to the dealership, apologize for going to fast and for hitting a pothole and demand to be allowed to pay for the repairs.

I don't think so.

So, don't get all high and mighty with me about how people should take _personal responsibility_ for a *design defect* in their TiVos when you know as well as I do that Hughes is not going to take _personal responsibility_ for their lack of engineering quality control.

And, perhaps you shouldn't bandy about the word "Fraud" so lightly or someone else might also bandy about the words "Libel" and "Slander."


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## designr

Weaknees (Michael) ...

I applaud you for disclosing this problem to the public the moment you found out about it. Many companies would want to sweep such an issue under the rug.

Needless to say, you will be more than happy to take _personal responsibility_ for your failure to adequately test every possible contingency before shipping your mod/instruction kits.

No doubt, you will be want to take _personal responsibility_ for your failure to warn your customers that by failing to reconnect the white cable properly, permanent damage to their TiVos would result.

And, you will insist upon doing the right thing by paying for the repairs of all the TiVos that were damaged during unauthorized modifications performed using your mod kits and your original instructions which failed to warn of this issue.

I don't think so.

I agree with you that damaging a board or connector as a result of neglect should invalidate the TiVo warranty. People who are not comfortable making these upgrades should let someone else perform the upgrade. And that third party should be prepared to take responsibility for their workmanship.

Arguably, leaving a serial connector partially connected is very bad form and may well be construed as "misuse."

But, leaving a connector completely disconnected should never result in physical damage to a main logic card.

If Hughes insists that these TiVos died as a result of "misuse" or "unauthorized repair" and not as a result of their own *design defect*, then I see no reason to help them shirk their _personal responsibility_.


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## designr

Tivoupgrade (TiVoKing)...

How does insisting that Hughes build a more reliable and less proprietary product "negatively impact others?"

I suppose that if Hughes resumed putting warranty surrender stickers on the backs of new TiVos, they could also stop using Open Source software and pay for their own programmers. And, I suppose they would be willing to accept reduced sales figures as subscribers migrate to other platforms.


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## weaknees

Designr--

While we still respectfully disagree with your view, we did want to point something out: We are quite confident that leaving your cable partially connected will very likely (if not definitely) cause permanent hardware problems.

We believe (but are not 100% sure) that pulling the cable out entirely can cause harm in the HDVR2. We have seen one situation in which the cable was out and the remote did not work...but there was no way for us to confirm whether the cable was indeed fully dislodged while the TiVo was powered up.

Our goal, frankly, was to raise a BIG red flag and to be very conservative. This is a big issue, and if there is even a slight chance that pulling the cable can cause harm, we thought it best to let people know.

If your beef is with a "defect" caused by a cable being completely removed, then let's give Hughes the benefit of the doubt here. 

I'm quite confident that this problem would not arise (or would arise in extraordinarily rare circumstances) if no TiVo customer ever opened a TiVo. 

Michael


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## Eccles

> _Originally posted by designr _
> *These users did nothing outside bounds of a normal hardware upgrade.*


True, but through bad luck or ineptitude, they disconnected a critical component and caused damage.



> *Let's say you took your new truck to the local gas station and got an oil change. And, let's say the gas jockey unplugged the computer to get at the oil filter. By your reasoning, your bumper to bumper warranty would be null and void when your new truck explodes in a huge fireball because you made an unauthorized repair.*


 Oh goody, analogies. Okay, I'll play along...

When it comes time to replace the brake pads on my hypothetical truck, I elect to do the job myself because, heck, it's routine maintenance and I won't void my warranty. But in the process of refitting the brake caliper, I somehow damage the hydraulic line, and the first time I hit the brakes at the end of my street, the pedal goes to the floor and my truck self-destructs into a telegraph pole.

You want to tell me that the manufacturer should fix that under warranty?


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## tivoupgrade

> _Originally posted by designr _
> *Tivoupgrade (TiVoKing)...
> 
> How does insisting that Hughes build a more reliable and less proprietary product "negatively impact others?"
> 
> I suppose that if Hughes resumed putting warranty surrender stickers on the backs of new TiVos, they could also stop using Open Source software and pay for their own programmers. And, I suppose they would be willing to accept reduced sales figures as subscribers migrate to other platforms. *


I never insisted that Hughes build a more reliable and less proprietary product. In fact, I didn't even suggest it, nor do I desire it. I think that the system is just fine as it is -- even with the flat ribbon cable inside. Don't think we weren't aware of it either - we've been well aware of it. Just as aware in fact, as the fan which one could easily catch ones tongue in, especially if the unit were plugged in at the time.

My desire is that they put the warranty sticker on it -- just to let people know (as they should already know) that taking the cover off represents the breaking of their warranty - and the fact that it is not intended that folks go in - and if folks do, all the power to them, risks and all.

So I agree with Eccles - people need to take responsibility for their actions -- even if they don't realize what they are doing when they are doing it.


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## 1283

We all agree that's a poor design. There's no question about it. However, if it breaks because you have opened the case and messed with it, you pay for it. There is a warranty sticker on the unit, and it says "common sense".


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## FourSKY

I bought a defective tivo series 2 on ebay a few weeks ago for $130. When I got it, I pluged it in, and it powered up and gave me the setup screen. The remote would not work at all. I tested the remote on my other tivo, and is worked fine. I looked inside the box and found the cable you are referring to halfway connected ( is was in there like this < ). I plugged it back in and it powered up and worked fine.


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## Barb

I just went through an upgrade of my Series 2 AT&T Tivo (ended up not working because my new drive was bad), but when I plugged my old drive back in, my screen kept freezing once I started watching t.v. I opened the Tivo back up, reseated everything, and it still happened. Finally, I took the white ribbon cable out and reseated that (even though I had been very careful not to touch it during the upgrade.) When I turned the Tivo back on, everything started working perfectly again. For what it's worth, if anyone runs into the problem of the screen freezing, pull out the ribbon and reseat it -- that might do the trick for you.


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## weaknees

FourSKY and Barb-

Glad to hear that your cable issues didn't cause permanent damage to the TiVos.

Barb - which AT&T do you have? The 130040 or the 230040? We haven't seen problems at all with the 130040, FYI.

Michael


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## Ye Ha

I reported that powering up the TDC230040 a week ago with the cable partially out seemed to have blown a component on the board which resulted in the unit no longer responding to the remote. At that time, I carefully removed and reseated the offending cable, but this failed to resolve the problem. I also checked all of the other cables.

I removed the power cord from the unit and let it sit for a week.

Yesterday, I decided to test my new 120 GB disk to see if it would at least get me to the TiVo screen as I had been unsuccessful previously, but had noticed that I used the wrong mfsbackup options (fyi - if this happens to you; if you get a black screen after "a few more seconds," check the command switches, the first one says "Series 2", however the second one says TDC230040, something I failed to notice the first time around).

The disk booted up normally, so I decided on a whim to test the remote and viola, it worked!  

The only theory I have at this point is that some disabling capacitive effect occurs if you power up with the cable partially or completely out and then dissipates over time.

Bottom line, if this happens to you, don't rush to pay $150 to replace the motherboard. Let it sit for some time and try it again. 

On another note, although I concur that there is nothing on either the box or the written warranty stating that if open the box you void the warranty, and, further, that this is a poor design as I do believe that it could come loose in shipping, I was not advocating making TiVo pay if you damage your TiVo while modifying it.

As far as I'm concerned, if you open your TiVo solely to look inside and you inadvertently jar that cable, you should be covered under the warranty and I have gotten some legal folks to agree with that opinion.


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## Barb

I have the TCD130040.


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## kdmorse

Wow - I wish I'd seen this thread earlier. Fortunately I didn't shoot myself in the foot, but I certainly could have.

Just fwiw...

I received two brand new 80 hour series 2's (240-0080's) and installed them just to make sure they worked. After a week of running, I cracked both open to tinker with. In one of them, I unplugged and replugged the white ribbon in question just to see where it went. 

When I put them back together and reinstalled them in my entertainment center, neither was quite right. On one, the remote (and entire unit) worked, but there were no lights on the front panel. On the other, we had lights on the front panel, but the remote didn't work. Both units were power cycled repeatedly in this state.

I popped both of them back open, and found the white ribbon only half seated in both cases (One right to left, and the other left to right). I reseated the cable in each, and they've both been perfect since.

Possibly this means that the newest 80-hour units are better built. But it also might mean that I just didn't fully trigger the problem. And no, I ain't goin back in to try harder  ....

-Ken


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## Duke

> _Originally posted by weaknees _
> *....Our goal, frankly, was to raise a BIG red flag and to be very conservative. This is a big issue, and if there is even a slight chance that pulling the cable can cause harm, we thought it best to let people know.
> Michael *


Thanks for broadcasting this warning, Michael. When I upgraded the HD in my HDVR2 I noticed how easy it was to dislodge that white cable (because I accidentally bumped it while replacing the disk). Luckily for me there was no power involved, and I noticed it right away, but it's sure easy to pull it out of the connector.

Duke


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## techno-user

My new HDVR2 box had a loose drive rattling around inside. It pulled out the ribbon connector and caused the unit not to boot.

When I reconnected the cable the set worked fine. Just lucky I guess


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## weaknees

Clearly, this doesn't affect everyone, but it does hit some.

In any event, if you read this, you got the warning and that's what counts. Better safe than sorry.

Michael


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## One Way

Wow,

I'm glad I read through this thread. I'd like to thank weaknees, unixadm, designr, and all the rest of you for your input here. It all helps.

I'm customizing a lot of TiVo's as a paying hobby for all my 'week-kneed' friends and relatives. The thread and the discussions raised here is VERY much APPRECIATED.

Keep up all the good work, people!

One Way


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## dark strider

> _Originally posted by designr _
> *
> Is there even one HDVR2 that has outlived its one year warranty?
> *


Um, not sure they've been out that long...<smile>


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## weaknees

It's actually a 1-year parts, 90-days labor, so some are partway there. Although in practice, they seem to treat is as about an 80% charge after the 90-days - I guess their time is worth a lot and parts are cheap.

Michael


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## nick_marden

When I was hax0ring my TiVo Series 2 to put in a second drive, I accidentally bumped this cable half way out. Upon reboot, a diode to the right of the cable seating got really hot (I mean, it was glowing *white*) and then started smoking. I corrected the cable seating and rebooted, but the TiVo software complained and wanted to make a phone call to send diagnostics to TiVo. Since I have Vonage that wasn't really going to be possible.

My best guess is that, like the original poster suggested, I shorted some part of of the IR circuitry and ran a lot of power through a diode that is intended to handle a much smaller voltage. In so doing, though, I think I might have solved the white LED problem, however briefly 

The nice folks at Circuit City seemed to buy my explanation that "I started it up...smoke came from the motherboard...and it didn't work any more" (all of which is true) and gave me a new one. *That* made me feel a little dirty, but I feel better now that I've given TiVo my $150 for 2 licenses for Home Media Option.


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## weaknees

Sorry to hear about the problem - can you tell us exactly what model you had?

Michael


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## myridom

Thanks for the info about this.. Now I dont feel as bad about blowing up mine. I have a series 2 that I got back in Feb that did this after I tried to upgrade the HD in it. 

Once it stopped responding to the remote I just put it in the closet and went and got another one, figuring I would get back to fixing it later. I have yet to pull it back out, guess I will start tinkering with it. No harm now I guess.. 
I chucked it up to bad luck and thought about it a bit more before attempting the upgrade on the second unit.. which I have yet to do..

Lance


----------



## weaknees

Well, at least you now know what the problem was.

Presumably, you can get your TiVo repaired for the standard repair fee at TiVo or Hughes of about $150 - still worthwhile.

Michael


----------



## Aquatic

> _Originally posted by designr _
> *
> Is there even one HDVR2 that has outlived its one year warranty?
> *


Pretty damn difficult to outlive a one year warranty when it hasn't even been on the market for a whole year!

I got mine just after Thanksgiving 2002, got it up and working early in December. Since it's nearing early June, that's about 6 months of flawless Tivoing.. well, okay, 1 second audio dropouts non-withstanding. It IS upgraded ( did that just before Christmas 2002) to 2x120Gb Samsungs.

So, I guess the jury is out for another 6 months--at least in my case.....


----------



## weaknees

Just for those who search on RCA DVR39 - this warning applies to that unit also. For the record, these are the models that have the potential problem:

230040
240040
24004A
240080
HDVR2
DSR7000
DVR39

Be careful!

Michael


----------



## numbersix

Well, my adventure begins just after the installers left my flat this morning . . . I opened the chassis of my Hughes DVR2 and began installing two new hard drives. One of the drives didn't appear to be spinning, and I was stuck on the 'Welcome' screen. I then used this wonderful community to begin my troubleshooting.

While I was perusing the messages I read this thread; and I was relieved that I didn't jiggle the white strip from the MoBo. I decided to connect my old drive back up - to see if things would move past the Welcome screen - which it did, and that, dear readers, is when I got burned. Once again, I plugged in the new drives and inserted the power cord into the rear of the receiver. I saw a glow and a stream of smoke from where the strip connects to the MoBo! I immediately unplugged the cord but, it appears, I was too late.

After rereading all the posts about this issue, I began making phone calls to DirecTV, TiVo and, finally, Hughes (who happen to have about the worst 800 line I've ever had the displeasure to dial). After resetting the system (idea from TiVo) and trying every method in the manual to have the receiver recognize the remote, I realized everything pointed to phoning Hughes (954 597 2080) on my dime - which I did. After trying to change the Remote Address from 0 (universal) to any other address, the tech said "well that's all I can do for you". He stated I voided the warranty policy and my receiver was mine to do whatever I wish. I asked about where I could send it to have it repaired. He told me that Hughes won't touch it. It's dead. Though he did mention a certain CCS Corporation (800 354 3114) that might be able to fix it.

Has this happen to anyone else? Are we really in this much a disposable society, where a manufacturer won't fix hardware - even when I'm willing to pay for my mistake? Has anyone ever dealt with CCS? Am I really this unlucky?

God, the luck of the Irish rears its ugly head, yet again.

Please let me know your thoughts.
Sincerely,
NumberSix


----------



## MaddogX007

This Forum is fun. I have had Tivo 6000r for 1 1/2 years and finally it got burned. I never had backups of anything, so I lost some valuable recordings, bummer. I opened up the Tivo, figuring what the heck, nothing to loose, out of warranty anyway, and have been trying to upgrade this device, and these Forums have led me into a new hobby. 

In meantime, whle learning all the MFS Tool2.0 and what the heck is needed to get my Tivo 6000 up and running, I went out and bought the Hughes Direct TV /Tivo. All I can say is this, I got the 3 yr warranty because it was cheapt about 29bucks. So the best guarantee is your prevention, and where you buy it. 

When something goes wrong, return it! No matter what the issue. The manufacturer will fight you, but will not fight Circuit City!

Good luck with that remote issue, and glad I joined this place!

P.S. I am a computer store owner, and have been a consultant for 18 years in the Silicon Valley, and let me tell you, it has been a challenge to figure Tivo upgrade capabilities. Linux may be great, but DOS and Windows, well lets just say, the MS wagon has been feeding my family for years. But it's fun to start a new challenge with LInux. I have setup a cheap PC system, downloaded MFS2.0 Tools, burned the ISO on a CD, and hope to mess around with my Tivo 6000R, and linux. This way I can succeed at something with my 6000R before I screw up my new Hughes Tivo.


----------



## PeteyBoy23

> _Originally posted by kdmorse _
> *Wow - I wish I'd seen this thread earlier. Fortunately I didn't shoot myself in the foot, but I certainly could have.
> 
> Just fwiw...
> 
> I received two brand new 80 hour series 2's (240-0080's) and installed them just to make sure they worked. After a week of running, I cracked both open to tinker with. In one of them, I unplugged and replugged the white ribbon in question just to see where it went.
> 
> When I put them back together and reinstalled them in my entertainment center, neither was quite right. On one, the remote (and entire unit) worked, but there were no lights on the front panel. On the other, we had lights on the front panel, but the remote didn't work. Both units were power cycled repeatedly in this state.
> 
> I popped both of them back open, and found the white ribbon only half seated in both cases (One right to left, and the other left to right). I reseated the cable in each, and they've both been perfect since.
> 
> Possibly this means that the newest 80-hour units are better built. But it also might mean that I just didn't fully trigger the problem. And no, I ain't goin back in to try harder  ....
> 
> -Ken *


QUITTER! 

Well, I'm happy as hell that I read this thread, even though I don't think I have this model. I need to be VERY careful when I do my replacement this weekend. Thank you all for the information. Love this forum!


----------



## weaknees

Yes - you don't have an affected model, but you should be careful nontheless.

We certainly don't recommend removing the cable if you don't have to - just check it before closing up the unit to see that none of the metal contacts are visible - they should be fully inside the connector on the motherboard.

Michael


----------



## heh2k

> _Originally posted by designr _
> *
> And, such an "unauthorized modification" exclusion would not, if one existed, be enforceable insofar as TiVo (and Hughes) is obliged to respect the provisions of the Gnu General Public License, one provision of which explicitly restricts TiVo (and Hughes) from imposing restrictions on copying (and using) the system software:[In fact, the legality of the private El Gamal key is questionable in light of the provisions of the Gnu General Public License. This El Gamal public/private encryption system prevents the modification of the Open Source system software in direct contravention of one of the explicit provisions of the Gnu General Public License.]
> *


WRONG. tivo has the patched gpl'ed code on their site. NOTHING in the gpl says you have to be able to open any device containing gpl'ed sw to get to the binaries.

there is more than one company making signed binaries (for security and support reasons). there is absolutely nothing in the gpl that forbids this.

it's great that more people are reading the gpl, but many people are totally misinterpreting it. if you really want to know what it means, ask a qualified ip lawyer, or read a good book about ip laws.


----------



## amgqmp1

I definitely do not have an afflicted (more apt desc.) TiVo (Sony SVR2000). However, my heart goes out to those of you that have been burned by this problem. Put in the simplest terms, this design flaw is a safety hazard. 

Warranties aside, in 3-4 years if one of these boxes ends up in some hobbyists hands that isn't versed in the ignorance of Hughes 3-4 year old componenent designs, it sounds as if glowing hot metal and smoke (and potentially fire or electrical shock) are a likely possibility.

Very poor design...  Thanks for posting this info so that owners hopefully won't hurt themselves (or their equipment), and so that people like me will never buy any of those models.


----------



## weaknees

We can only hope that the engineering problem has been fixed - either that or this thread is very effective, because there basically haven't been many/any reports of the problem recently.

Michael


----------



## Zirak

> _Originally posted by Eccles _
> * I hit the brakes at the end of my street, the pedal goes to the floor and my truck self-destructs into a telegraph pole.*


My gosh, whats the year make and model of THAT truck?


----------



## HTH

A circuit normally in parallel with another would end up with a higher amperage through its components, possibly more than they were designed to withstand and could overheat/blow, if the second circuit were disconnected.


----------



## weaknees

The Samsung SIR-S4120R is the same layout and motherboard, and thus is also subject to this problem.

Michael


----------



## tivoyahoo

weakness, do you have any other details on what's inside the samsung? Even though it looks different outside, is it the same inside? or is there anything new besides the look? What drive is being used? Have you opened one up yourself or just read reports? Does it have 2 drive capability? Thanks.


----------



## weaknees

Inside, it's basically the same as the Hughes HDVR2, Philips DSR7000, and RCA DVR39. It uses - inexplicably - a Western Digital 120 GB drive. We actually find those to be much less reliable than Samsung drives.

As far as 2-drive capability, our TwinBreeze will work in this unit.

Michael


----------



## MyM3

> _Originally posted by weaknees _
> *Inside, it's basically the same as the Hughes HDVR2, Philips DSR7000, and RCA DVR39. It uses - inexplicably - a Western Digital 120 GB drive. We actually find those to be much less reliable than Samsung drives.
> 
> Michael *


All due respect, but how is this "inexplicable" if the S4120R is made in the same Mexican factory as the Hughes SD-DVR120 (I'm assuming that the Hughes 120 Gb machine also uses the WD drive)? Economies-of-scale at work.

On another note, is the Operating System any faster, in general, with the un-modded Samsung SIR-S4120R vs. a Weaknees-modded HDVR2/DSR7000 with TwinBreeze? Is there anything that can be done to "speed up" the O/S for the HDVR2/DSR7000 (like TurboNET)?


----------



## tivoupgrade

Architecturally, the Series2 units are the same. The operating system shouldn't be any faster whether upgraded or not; its really dependant upon your use of the system - if you have many many short recordings vs a small number of large ones, now playing functions will slow down. Lots of season passes? The interactivity of prioritization is affected (think about all the dependencies among season passes that must be recalculated each time one is moved. 

As for 'inexplicable' scenarios, generalizations should be avoided. Samsung, Maxtor, Western Digital, IBM, etc drives are for the most part, comparable in terms of reliability (and all exceed performance requirements for this application); they are commodities, and at any given time, can be substituted for one another, as long as they are certified for use as a component and have the manufacturer's approval. The biggest impact to drive reliability is shipping and handling.

Lastly, the Mexican 'factory' is really more 'assembly' not manufacturing. Most of the electronic components are manufactured in Singapore.


----------



## weaknees

Actually, no, the DSR7000 and the HDVR2 both use Maxtor drive, so that doesn't really explain the Western Digital in the Samsung unit. We just find it odd that Samsung wouldn't use their own drive in their own unit - and a little disconcerting - especially since our experience is that Samsungs are far better than Western Digitals.

Michael


----------



## weaknees

Just an update here - we just cracked a Hughes SD-DVR120 and it has a Western Digital 120 GB drive also. So a change seems to be underway.

Michael


----------



## tivoyahoo

weakness, can you detail exactly which 120gb WD model drive you are finding in the new units? thanks for the update.


----------



## weaknees

On Monday I should be able to.

Michael


----------



## Gun-HO

happy to not need the warning asit wasin the how-to i read when i upgraded mine


----------



## FSL

Warning:
Needs very good SMT component soldering skill. Please DON'T DIY if you never work on SMT before. Ask some one with the skill or bring your Tivo to an electronics repair shop let the technician do it for you.

Who need fix:
If you power up the HDVR2 with ribbon cable unevenly plug into CN10 on motherboard and found the Remote malfunction. Most likely you need this fix.

Cause:
HDVR2 use 3 pins IR sensor (in front panel). Pin1=+5V, Pin2=Ground, Pin3=IR signal out. For general circuit design, usually direct connects pin2 to common ground. But HDVR2 IR sensor pin2 goes through a ribbon cable and Inductor L30 on the motherboard side connects to ground. When ribbon cable unevenly plug into CN10, The contact pins on cable cause shortage between pins inside CN10. When power up the Tivo, DC current from shorted pins inside CN10 goes through Inductor L30 to ground. If enough current apply to L10, itll generates too much heat and burned open. The IR sensor pin2 will no longer connect to ground even you plug back the ribbon cable right next time.

Fix:
Replace L30 (inside red circle on the attached picture) with a new one (any value will work). If can't find any inductor, just use a thin wire short L30 will work.

Good Luck


----------



## HTH

> _Originally posted by FSL _
> *When ribbon cable not plug in, the Inductor L30 burn open and let the IR sensor has no ground path. *


 I'm sorry, but could you rephrase that?


----------



## justinkwaugh

I believe what he is saying is that an inductor (component L30) on the motherboard, burns out when the cable is half plugged in. When it burns out it is in an 'open' state, meaning there is no connection from one side of the component to the other. The IR sensor needs to have pin 2 connected to ground. It does this through that inductor. So when the inductor is burned out, the IR sensor pin 2 has no connection to ground, and therefore does not work.

Replacing the inductor (or shorting its pads directly) will solve the problem.


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## GBaz

If you have to ask what SMT is I dont suggest trying this.


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## anode505

L30, I haven't had the problem (thank God) But curious about it. Do we know the mH of the inductor? Just jumering it out doesn't sound like the best solution ( and that *could* be done with a fine point soldering iron. No SMD rework station needed) I'll have to dig deeper into whats going on.


----------



## Supevisor

I am wondering if I just spliced the white cable to expose the ground portion of the wire and then soldered a wire to the exposed portion of the wire. Then connect the other side of the wire to the tivo case to ground it. How bad would it be to ground it to the case. Could it cause any harm? Or does it have to goto the inductor? Thanks in advance......


----------



## SanFranGun

Sunday, December 14, 2003, 0858 hrs. pst.

I am a fairly clumsy and forgetful home handyman, so I read _all_ instructions before attempting anything. When I received the Weaknees upgrade kit for my HDVR2 (2X120g), I noted the caution about dislodging the white cable. However, when I opened the lid of the housing, I exerted too much pressure downward and the lid "may" have touched the circuit board. I scrutinized the board carefully immediately after and saw nothing wrong. A moment later I looked again and saw that the white ribbon was sitting right next to its coupler rather than in it. Since it was immediately behind the coupler, it's possible that I didn't notice it on first look because there was no asymmetry. But I don't think so. I think that the white cable was so loosely fixed in the coupler that exposing it to the faint breeze from a distant fan caused it to be pushed out of the coupler. I reinserted it with pressure and didn't suffer any damage.

I'm posting this so that folks will know that you don't even have to _touch_ the cable to dislodge it. Since this was assembled in Mexico, my thought is that the component arrived defective (loose) but the line workers simply plugged it in as instructed. Having a quality control guy on the line would have cost an extra 15 cents.


----------



## PaGe1

You can fix this, and sure is a lot cheeper then $150!!

First, Thanks goes out to everyone here and to _____FSL_____ in particular.

I too rebooted my HDVR2 with the white ribbon cable disloged, and lost my remote functionality... 

But after some reading.... and soldering, My HDVR2 is back up and running!  

What I did: (Note I and everyone here take no responsibilty for you trying this)

I removed the L30 inductor with a tweezers and soldering iron
Then took 1 strand of copper wire from an 22 gauge coated wire and laid it across the two terminals.

Finaly took the iron and warmed up the solder again to hold the copper strand inplace.

****SEE PICTURE****


Thanks again to FSL!!!

If you have any questions please let me know.

-PaGe1


----------



## ldeblasiis

Hi - I just upgraded my TIVO Series 2 (240040A) using the WeaKnees 160 gb kit to add a second drive. Followed instructions and watched that little white cable. The upgrade went perfectly. Thanks WeaKnees!

Next week, I intend to add a Panasonic E50 DVR and use the Copy to VCR pick to go to a DVDR from the TIVO unit. 

Love that TIVO!!!


----------



## chino

after looking for the cause of my remote not working I found this post. My from pannel is working fine, but my remote is not.

I did as I now know many have done and pulled the ribon out a bit while working with the HD. At one point my DSR704 would not bootup and that's how I saw that the cable was not fully inserted.

I found the L30 and it was charred cantacts and all. At least that takes care of using the soldering iron to remove the bad part.

Now I don't have much of an area to solder a wire or another inductor. 

I was wondering if I could run a straight wire from P2 on the IR sensor to ground or/and put some sort of fuse that could go instead of a more important part on the MB or from pannel.


----------



## chino

I ran a small wire from the ground contact on the CN10 and sandwitched between the conact on the CN10 and the ribon cable to keep it in place. The other then of this wire already had a grounding hook ( spair part from modding my xbox ) and I just hooked it to one of the grounding pads on the MB.

Sure, if you shake it hard enough it'll fall out, but I don't plan on doing that. 

That brought back my remote. I've shut it back off and still want to know if there is any kind of danger in running the ground straight w/o some sort of fuse. Could I be setting my self up for an even bigger problem?


----------



## chino

here is a pic


----------



## corye

i did have this problem with a 2nd tivo that i had
been upgrading the hard drive on.

i saw the smoke coming off that part and
the white cable melted slightly.
so i unplugged it right away. but the damage was done.

i had figured it had blown the ir recvr on the
front of the case, but am so glad to hear that
i just have to short that part.

so i had set the unit aside for a week or so.

but now i will be trying this later today.

thanks for the info


----------



## corye

after 5 minutes work. the remote is working again.


----------



## dcadiman

I am considering upgrading my Hughes from a 40 gig to 120, but I am concerned about this ribbon cable. Is my unit one that is affected? I apologize if it was mentioned, but I spent over an hour reading all of the replies and my eye started to cross.


----------



## mac4lyfe

Well I didn't get the bad remote problem... My box was open and I inadvertently hit the HD and it barely touched the smaller white cable which connects the power supply to the motherboard. The unit immediately shut off and won't come back on. No power, no clicking... dead. This is on a philips 7000's

The ribbons are straight as an arrow an there was no sign of shorts (smells, sparks)

I am going to break out my multimeter to see if the power supply is dead but has anybody else experienced this???


----------



## mac4lyfe

On further inspection, I replaced fused F1 which is closest to the AC ~ IN near the back of the unit and all is well. The fuse was covered in a black plastic sheath and has a rating of 3.15 A / 250 V 

When not working, replace a fuse Doh!!! Well maybe this may help someone else in a similar situation. What is unusual is that the HD power cord BARELY touched the small white ribbon if at all.


----------



## ctmtnbkr

has anyone else tried this fuse thing?

Im having the remote problem, but it seemed my white cable was firmly in place.


----------



## robpreshall

Just want to say, "Thank you" FSL. I had the white cable disconnected on startup and lost the ability to use the remote on my Hughes Series 2 Tivo, but once I did the short to the L30 problem was resolved and I was once again able to use the remote with no problems to the Tivo unit at all. Thanks again.


----------



## tiffman

> _Originally posted by chino _
> *I ran a small wire from the ground contact on the CN10 and sandwitched between the conact on the CN10 and the ribon cable to keep it in place. The other then of this wire already had a grounding hook ( spair part from modding my xbox ) and I just hooked it to one of the grounding pads on the MB.
> 
> Sure, if you shake it hard enough it'll fall out, but I don't plan on doing that.
> 
> That brought back my remote. I've shut it back off and still want to know if there is any kind of danger in running the ground straight w/o some sort of fuse. Could I be setting my self up for an even bigger problem? *


Is the ground on the contact the first wire on the ribbon (the end closest to the L30)? I've tried the first wire and haven't had any luck, but it's possible I don't have a good connection. This is the simplest way for me if I can get it to work, but I want to make sure I'm grounding the right wire (though I can solder a wire in if need be). Thanks.


----------



## TiVo-Thom

1st, please forgive my niavity, but there are several cachecard threads and things seem to run together so I'll ask for grace and make this post anyway. It appears that the cachecard is finally a reality for the HDVR2. Here is my situation. I have one of my HDVR2s upgraded with 2 maxtor 160gB drives, though no LBA48 was available for my unit, so I just went with 137gB x2, No other mods, used MFS tools 2.x and expanded the swap, and dropped in the drives (used Weaknees stuff) Well one of the drives seems to have died (GSOD) I got another pair of drives (Mx-160gBs) but want to do the LBA48, and Cachecard, TiVonet, etc. Basically all of the "make it better Mods (hacks). Looking for guidance and suggestions!


----------



## Lowcarb

I've got a new Hughes SD-DVR40 and I have to report that the ribbon cable is very securely attached. I read all the reports about problems with it so (with the power off) I tugged on mine and could not dislodge it. 

Perhaps they changed the connector hardware between the HDVR2 and the SD-DVR40.

Also, I very releived to know that there is a fix I can apply if things do ever go south on me an I have this problem.

Thanks, LowCarb:up:


----------



## Jim Skripchuk

mac4lyfe

Yes, I got the fuse surprise also. I didn't even know what I did, unit was just dead.

After freaking out and even go as far as looking up repair centers on the web, I noticed the fuse and broke out the ohm meter. Jumped it and it booted up. Then off to Rat Shack and the drones didn't have a clue as to a 3.15 fuse. So I pigtailed a 3 on it . So as long as it makes it to April, I'm happy!


----------



## BiscuitSlayer

Not to beat a dead horse, but Hughes should be a little ashamed that they put out a unit that obiously has some issues. I know that when you crack the case and void the warrenty it is your responsibility and you suffer the consequences, but for god's SAKE! I don't think anything in the history of technology has been hacked and modified as much as the tivo except for personal computers. The manufactures should take this into account when they are building their units.

I have to tell you that I have had my "stock" tivo for a couple of years now, and I am scared to death to mess with it in any way. The sad part about it is that I am an experienced System Administrator. I work with over one thousand servers, and here I am scared of the fragile little tivo.

The more I read on this forum, the more scared I become. I read about more issues then anything else.


----------



## tivoupgrade

> _Originally posted by BiscuitSlayer _
> *
> The more I read on this forum, the more scared I become. I read about more issues then anything else. *


The problem is that there are more people who post their negative experiences here than positive ones; after all, the forum is where people who need help go, and there are more people here who need help than there are who don't have problems and just 'hang out.' There are also folks who like to prey on the fears of others, and seem to enjoy scaring each other.

Fact is that the TiVo boxes out there (old ones and new ones) are quite durable, and as long as you are not a complete klutz, you shouldn't have any problems working on a unit. As an example - I have about 10 units, all with the covers off, used constantly for tests and experimentation. Admittedly, they are not treated with the utmost of care, and I have yet to blow one up or break one.

Noting that these units were NEVER designed for end-user servicability or with hacking in mind, I defend the design (after all, it is hackable, and most consumer devices are not) and the quality from my own experiences.

Don't be scared off by the negative posts on the forums; it would be akin to going to a hospital, seeing all the sick people, and thinking you were doomed...


----------



## TiVo-Thom

Why is it that when someone asks for help; 1st, the forum thinks they are some sort of moron or script-kiddie (whichever adjective you prefer!) unless they talk TiVo or T-Linux speak. My main system has been DOWN for over a month, and granted I have been exceptionally busy with my job and all, but it would be nice to get more than a "Gee, too bad" or "this is not the forum to post this on" (yes I was desparate and posted out of forum/thread looking for guidance). I just want to fix my unit and maybe not loose all of my recordings or maybe even support LBA48 on my unit. I tempted to post a picture of me begging if that would help...


----------



## tivoupgrade

> _Originally posted by TiVo-Thom _
> *Why is it that when someone asks for help; 1st, the forum thinks they are some sort of moron or script-kiddie (whichever adjective you prefer!) unless they talk TiVo or T-Linux speak. My main system has been DOWN for over a month, and granted I have been exceptionally busy with my job and all, but it would be nice to get more than a "Gee, too bad" or "this is not the forum to post this on" (yes I was desparate and posted out of forum/thread looking for guidance). I just want to fix my unit and maybe not loose all of my recordings or maybe even support LBA48 on my unit. I tempted to post a picture of me begging if that would help... *


Thom -

What is the nature of your problem and what is it you need help with? We can help you get your post into the right thread, if that is the issue. If your unit is broken, there are certainly ways to get it repaired; even using the manufacturer's services, if necessary. If you are looking to upgrade your unit yourself, we can send you the right pointers to the info, and if you are looking to have a professional do it, we are all over the forum, too.

I think you will find that the more general the request, the more general the answers will be - the more specific your question is, the more specific an answer you will get.

Lou


----------



## Robert S

Actually, Lou, he got a specific answer to exactly this question over a month ago, so I have no idea what his problem is. If he wanted clarification on anything I mentioned, he hasn't asked for it yet.


----------



## antalo

> _Originally posted by ctmtnbkr _
> *has anyone else tried this fuse thing?
> 
> Im having the remote problem, but it seemed my white cable was firmly in place. *


I had a blown fuse once. The TIVO fell off of a small waste basket and something shorted out. The TIVO was dead. It is what we used to call a "pigtail " fuse. It has the wires coming out of the ends. I went to a "repair" shop to get it replaced, because my hands are not as steady as they used to be. He wanted $20.- to replace the fuse. I told him where he can go and do what. He asked $1.- for a 3.15A fuse. I dug out my soldering iron and went to work. Unsoldered the fuse. I knew it was bad. because I shorted it out earlier and the TIVO worked. Used a small jumper cord . I had to cut that plastic footer from the fuse. It is a heat shrink tubing. After removing the tubing, I saw the end of the wires were connected to a circular "gizmo" which was pushed on to the fuse. With a knife or anything sharp enough to pry that circular gizmo off the fuse. Grab the fuse with a pair of pliers and force that gizmo off of the fuse. If the fuse breakes, no big deal. Once you got both ends off, attach them to the new fuse. If you have a 3/16 " heat shrink, put a length over the fuse to cover just the fuse., than attach the second end to the fuse. Solder it back into the board and you are done. If you never soldered, it's worth the $20.- to get it done. It would cost more than that to ship it somewhere. 
To find out for sure if it is the fuse, or not, take a small jumper cable and AFTER YOU UNPLAG the TIVO and removed the AC cord (be safe and not sorry) attache the cord to both end of the fuse, and plug in the TIVO. If it doesn't smoke, the fuse is blown. On the other hand it is worth to spend 10 or 20 bucks on a small multimeter and check the fuse that way. In my case I knew something shoted out while the TIVO fell, but it could have demaged something before the fuse went. 
Good Luck,
antalo


----------



## Jaydeath

Can somebody please write a detailed step by step guide on how to repair the tivo after this happens. Nobody really made it clear on exactly what to do after the remote stops working. Just so you know, I had the white ribbon completely out on my 240080 and started it up without knowing the ribbon was out :-X so obviously something shorted. Please help me!


----------



## TiVo-Thom

Lou,
As I work tons, have little "daily" time to interact on the forum, and even less to pour through the numerous tidbits of "cool" things to do to fix when broke or do when starting over. Nearly a month ago, I lost the primary drive do to file system corruption, (GSOD) so I asked if anyone could assist me in recovery of the F/S enough to save my season's comprehensive episodes that I didn't want to loose. Was told to use Maxblast to fix, Maxblast says the drives (both) are fine. DD Copy indicates unreadable records, a copy of both drives to a pair of new drives renders a machine that doesn't boot. So now it appears that I have 2 projects; 1st- I need to make a driveless HDVR2 and 2 new maxtor 160s a D-Tivo, one with those hacks a tweaks that all here regard as required for total enjoyment and flexibility LBA48, USB networking, to do things like TiVi-Web and the sort, and anything else of value that this forum embraces and I don't even know where to begin to start! The second is trying to prepare the drives that I pulled to save my shoes either by direct extraction or fixing enough for play back with my other D-TiVo HDVR2. Can anyone lead me by the hand on this??


----------



## TiVo-Thom

Lou,
your response to my post of irritation was defensive as if one didn't have any reason to say what I did, this is what I'm talking about;

"This thread is about running LBA-48 patches on Series 1 TiVoes. If you want to do such things (or, indeed, any other hacks like TiVoWeb) on an HDVR2, you're going to have to look elsewhere."

Look Where? Why won't it work? I guess I should already know this..
This is the kind of response to assistance that prompted my post. Some of us just do not have the experience to know if something "is just not talked about" because it violates some unspoken code, or if it is so stupid that one doesn't want to get caught explaining it to a "newbie". In either case it leaves one somewhat frustrated here...


----------



## jcastellaw

i have a HDVR2. how do I know if it is a series 2?
it has the white ribbon inside


----------



## weaknees

It's a series 2 - at least hardware-wise. That unit can certainly get this problem, so be careful.

Michael


----------



## Robert S

TiVo-Thom, sorry I missed this reply. It's to a post I made in the 160Gb thread in the Underground and I never thought to look for a reply here.

Unfortunately what I said is the only thing I can say. Series 2 hacking is not discussed on this site, therefore you won't find the info you're seeking here. I can't direct you to the site where these things are discussed because the Forum rules prohibit me from doing that and the scripts would remove the URL if I posted it anyway.

You could find it in about 10 seconds with Google, of course.

My post was intended as a bald statement of fact; the information you seek is not here, look for it elsewhere. If you read a hectoring or obstructive tone into my comment, perhaps it will seem less so in light of the above facts.


----------



## tramahound

from my brief experience at these forums I can safely say Robert S is the most helpful person here. I doubt he would be saying something in an effort to put you off or anything negative like that. I would try reading his comments from the viewpoint of somebody other than yourself...
oh, and to keep this semi-on-topic; I will be trying to upgrade my Series 2 and will be very aware of that damned white cable!


----------



## loydb

I just bought a brand new 810, and want to put in a different HD. I'd be really appreciative of a copy of the magic image. I've got a series 1 that I upgraded myself, looking forward to the burner on the new one.

Many thanks,

loydb

[email protected]


----------



## dishman

Thanks for this post on the white ribbon cable. I was extremely careful of it while adding a second drive, checked it before closing the box, and sure enough, it had come loose.


----------



## weaknees

Excellent - another one saved!

Michael


----------



## mrfkzer

If this happens it is usually because you have toasted one of the inductors that carry the 3.3 and 5v to the front panel. They are labeled Lxx (example L35). They are located next to the connector you desrcribed (CN10 on my box) Use an ohm meter with the unit unplugged and find the one that is open , you can solder a short across it and your unit should function once again. But like you said be sure the cable is tight before applying power.
Enjoy, MrFkzer


----------



## pgorbas

I am about to do my first TiVo upgrade tomorrow, and I am reviewing the post to skim for thoughts. I have a Phillips DSR704 unit and I am planning on following "Hinsdale-How-To featuring Tigers Mfs Tools 2.0 as an all-in-one upgrade solution" method. I just got a new 120 gig Seagate Barracuda from a local Comp USA ( Cost will be about $67.50 after rebates - tomorrow is the last day of this deal folks - you can get it online too ).

With the white cable warning I wonder if any has thought to glue the darn thing in place so it CAN'T come disconnected. Say a dab of epoxy on the outside of the connector to the motherboard?


----------



## Drestylz

I had read this thread before I did my upgrade and I STILL managed to kill my HDVR2 remote. No smoke or other dramatic blow outs. It's just not working. I guess I'll be getting out the sodering iron this evening.

Any other tips?


Thanks!


----------



## rs808

If you use a thin wire to short the L30 Inductor do you need to remove the inductor first or can you just solder the wire between the 2 points? 
Thanks in advance for replies.


----------



## rs808

Update:
I left the inductor in place and soldered a wire to both points. My remote is now functioning properly. 
Thanks to everyone who contributed in this thread.
rs808


----------



## 2TiVoEric

I haven't read all the posts, so I don't know if anyone said this yet or not, but perhaps Tivo has built this in to happen so you don't mess (hack) with the machine.

Just one thought that popped into my head.


----------



## philhu

no, this is a design flaw

My new Tivo brand 40 hour unit (refurbished series 2 for $99), came out of the box with the remote not working.

Called them for a free replacement and got ahold of someone there who was chatty. Told me that they get more calls for remotes not working than any other problem and ususally 'right out of the box'

So, I think it must be a design problem


----------



## Rshnrocket

I tried to go to a larger drive with the hinsdale info..... Very Confusing so after trying to do it, I gave up & went back to original drive & when i started it up it got stuck on power up screen, ahhhh checked jumpers on drive & found them to be wrong. I changed jumpers to master & tried again. Thats when I knew something was wrong cause the fan was not strong & the power supply seemed to be clicking. Needless to say it did not turn on. Went to your site & read this post about the white ribbon, sure enough partially dislodged. I pushed it back down & the unit turned on but is still hanging on the power up screen????? I can't even get to see if the remote stuff works or not. Only thing I can think of is we did try the unlock tool to unlock. I am not sure if we did or not. Could this be the problem or is it cause of white ribbon???? Please help, very frustrated & kinda sorry I even attempted to do this. Should have gotten a new tivo drive, ready to just slide in.


----------



## weaknees

Doesn't sound the same problem - see my post here:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?postid=2194877#post2194877

Michael


----------



## Goines

Hey,

I just picked up an additional hdvr2, which was known to be broken. I've noticed that the only thing wrong with it is that ir doesn't work. Following the directions below I can see that I think the L30 will need to be replaced (it looks slightly darker than normal). But in checking it, i noticed that L31 (on the other side of the ribbon cable) is toasted. It was completely cooked.

I'm just curious if i can replace it with a similar approach, or if i need to actually get the proper part for it, or...?

Any ideas?

Thanks



> _Originally posted by FSL _
> *Warning:
> Needs very good SMT component soldering skill. Please DON'T DIY if you never work on SMT before. Ask some one with the skill or bring your Tivo to an electronics repair shop let the technician do it for you.
> 
> Who need fix:
> If you power up the HDVR2 with ribbon cable unevenly plug into CN10 on motherboard and found the Remote malfunction. Most likely you need this fix.
> 
> Cause:
> HDVR2 use 3 pins IR sensor (in front panel). Pin1=+5V, Pin2=Ground, Pin3=IR signal out. For general circuit design, usually direct connects pin2 to common ground. But HDVR2 IR sensor pin2 goes through a ribbon cable and Inductor L30 on the motherboard side connects to ground. When ribbon cable unevenly plug into CN10, The contact pins on cable cause shortage between pins inside CN10. When power up the Tivo, DC current from shorted pins inside CN10 goes through Inductor L30 to ground. If enough current apply to L10, itll generates too much heat and burned open. The IR sensor pin2 will no longer connect to ground even you plug back the ribbon cable right next time.
> 
> Fix:
> Replace L30 (inside red circle on the attached picture) with a new one (any value will work). If can't find any inductor, just use a thin wire short L30 will work.
> 
> Good Luck *


----------



## tivoboy

When the fuse, or this cable goes, what happens to the tivo.
From this other thread I posted, my tivo died completly the other day. I have replaced the power supply board, but that didn't seem to work I think the power supply in there was fine.

I get no boot up at all, and a clicking coming from the power supply area. When the cable connecting the mother board and the power supply board is disconnected, NOT the front panel board stuff, the other cable, THEN the hard drives boot up, but of course the tivo won't work that way.

Any way to know, if the FUSE is gone, I would imagine there would be NO power to the power supply board.


----------



## 1283

You replaced the motherboard? You might as well replace the whole TiVo unit.

Sounds like the power supply shuts down because the motherboard is trying to draw more current than the power supply can handle. Hard to say which one is at fault.


----------



## tivoboy

just removed the MB, to see if I could see anything on the top, or the bottom.


----------



## 1283

I see that you have changed "motherboard" to "power supply" in the original message. In that case, sounds like the motherboard is dead. Unplugging the IR cable would only disable the remote function, not causing the whole TiVo to be dead.


----------



## tivoboy

Man, in five years of tivo, 10 tivos, beta testing, upgradding, etc, I have never had or heard of an MB failure. 

The board looks fine, but of course something within it must be hosed.


----------



## 1283

If it makes you feel any better, I just replaced the motherboard in one of my TiVos last weekend. It would cause system errors and reboot from time to time. I first thought it was caused by the drives, but that was not it. After 4 years, I'm willing to accept that failure.


----------



## tivoboy

And, did you have to do the whole, remarriage dance to get it to work?
I guess, a new MB is the same cost as a new TIVO, pretty much. The only advantage to MB replacement is no new contract re-upping?

Send me a link where you got it, if you have one I might go that route. Were you able to figure out if the MB was test, or did you just swap and test?


----------



## 1283

Mine is Series1, not Series2. I had a complete spare TiVo just for situation like this. Saw the system error messages in the log files, and just swap and test.


----------



## morac

I'm about to do an upgrade and am curious as to how easily the cable pops out (eg. can it pop out while I'm putting the cover back on)? 

Also is it easy to see if it is dislodged or should I press down on it before closing up just to be safe?


----------



## nottelling

> I'm about to do an upgrade and am curious as to how easily the cable pops out (eg. can it pop out while I'm putting the cover back on)?
> 
> Also is it easy to see if it is dislodged or should I press down on it before closing up just to be safe?


When opening the HDVR2 the top seperates from the rest of the unit. The front panel should remain attached. It is possible to bump the white cable, but it is unlikely that you will have a problem. Just make sure it is seated when you are replacing the cover. Good luck.


----------



## djliquidice

this just happened to me because i was careless and foolish.

anyone know the resistance for R 272? I want to attempt a fix for this.


----------



## doodood

well, hate to say it but the stupid white cable got me too....much thanks to everyone who has posted on this topic, i am happy (and damn relieved) to say that my remote control now works after shorting out L30 with a fine strand of wire....

ptvupgrade should warn of this on their instruction sheet..or maybe they did and i missed it....


----------



## jonpcar

I successfully upgraded my Hughes DVR40 to 160GB (137 usable) yesterday. Although I thought I was being extremely careful the entire time...I noticed just as I was about to put the cover back on that I had dislodged the connector to the front panel. I am so thankful that I knew to check specifically for this problem because of this thread. In any case...I pushed the cable back in and everything went smoothly. Now if I could just get my Directv upgrade to 6.2 so that I can catalog all my programs and large disk space using folders.....


----------



## ycartf

I just got through upgrading the second TiVo 540040 I have done in two weeks (one my sister's and the other a friend's) and with both of them it seemed apparent that it would be difficult to remove the end of the white ribbon on this model. Although I did not tug on it very hard, it appeared to be permanently affixed on the TiVo 540040, just for what it's worth.

Tracy


----------



## djliquidice

I successfully transplanted inductor "L31" from a TCD1*A series2 and my old tivo works like a charm!


----------



## rawbutt

i'm desperately trying to figure out a fix for my RCA DVR40 after making the clumsy mistake of pulling that white ribbon cable loose when switching hard drives. my situation is that i have inspected L30 and I can't see any physical damage whatsoever, but i'm showing all the signs that i have the problem (remote not working and no LED's on front after dislodging white ribbon cable. since i see no damage, should i try to merely run a wire across the top of L30, or remove L30 and then short ? i sure would appreciate some help! thanks


----------



## feldon23

Completely burned mine to a crisp. Thump-Thump-Thump from the speakers followed by the smell of magic smoke. Thanks, TiVo!


----------



## jasch

Wow. I never read this thread. Obviously my L30 was hosed, and I found the thread by searching.

I removed the L30 and replaced it with a wire, and my TiVo is working again.

My question is should I take the time to replace the inductor at all? I know the wire works, but I am wondering of long time effects. I mean, the inductor is there for a reason, and it blew out probably to protect something on the motherboard.

If this should happen againt to me (short), will not having the inductor in place damage something else on the motherboard?

Thanks


----------



## HomeUser

Id probably replace the inductor with a pico fuse in series with a new inductor.


----------



## jasch

Wow. It happened again! (yeah I know). But this time I wasn't my mistake. I smelled smoke, and quickly re-seated the ribbon cable. The unit powered on fine, the remote worked...

BUT, when the unit is recording, I loose all remote functionality. The recording ends, the remote works again. (a better explanation would be that the remote functionality stops when the red - recording - light comes on).

As an observation the lights on the front panel are not a lit as before (more like dimmed).

Problem with the L30 again? (I checked it and it seems fine). Would it be better replacing it? Anybody had this similar problem?


----------



## dsturgeon

I am trying to find out exactly what that diode/inductor whatever it is called is so that I can have another one put back in. Can someone help me with this? I have waded through a lot of forums but as of now have not found the values for it.


----------



## Paawk

Any idea where I can find someone to do the soldering?

I had the same white ribbon problem. I believe I just need someone to solder a copper wire across L30? But I have no clue what type of repair shop I should look for. I couldn't even find any electronic repair shops in my area.

How hard is it to do it yourself if you've never done it before? *lol*

Thanks.


----------



## feldon23

For those of us who obliterated the entire L30 inductor, removing all hope of bridging two contacts, which pin on the 20 pin connector is ground?

chino posted some _almost_ complete info and a fuzzy picture.


----------



## jcf168

today i was upgrading my series 2 tivo 540040, and when i put the new drive into the system it powered up, saw no screen after power up (in the end it was because cable tv was not connected) but i changed jumper settings, turned on the tivo and smelled something so i quickly disconnected power. i checked inside and verified the white ribbon was intact and seated correctly, so i booted again and i hear a clicking noise that was coming from the hard drive. to verify this i pulled the drive out and put it into my computer and the drive was no recognized by the seagate utility and it was making the same clicking noise. i put the original drive in the tivo it booted fine, no smells or noise and i navigated the menus fine but i didnt not attempt to record or play any content. 


point of my story: am i a victim of the evil white ribbon?

i got another seagate drive from CompUSA tonight, i told them the drive was DOA, and i am going to use the weaknees iso tomorrow and upgrade again, hopefully i can record and use my remote when i am done, i will update when i know.


----------



## HomeUser

> point of my story: am i a victim of the evil white ribbon?


No, I don't think there is any connection between the front panel ribbon cable and the HD. Check the length of the screws you are mounting the drive with if they are too long then they will short or physically break something inside the drive.


----------



## sarvaid

Glad I did a little searching and found this thread. Same thing happened to me last night... Would have probably ebayed for a replacement tonight. Instead, I'll break out my iron, and give it a whirl.
Thanks!


----------



## Willy

Just got a refurbished HDVR2 from DTV. Before doing anything to it, I plugged it in and the remote worked fine for about a day. Then the remote stopped working. I opened the case and the white ribbon appeared in place, however it was very loose, not fully secured. I plugged it back in securely, and my remote worked again. However, now I get the symptoms of the remote not working when the unit has been on for a day or so. Seems to be temperature related. Is that a sympton of a bad L30? Has anyone else had problems of the remote not working when the unit warmed up?

If I let the Tivo cool down and reboot, the remote is recognized and works fine. The front panel buttons have always worked regardless of temperature. On inspection, the L30 appears to be intact. Can I just bypass it with a wire or do I have to remove it first? How can I salvage the HDVR2?

I called DTV to have them replace it since it was essentially DOA, but they are sending an R15 as a replacement. I'm not very interested in keeping, the R15, but I'd rather fix this one instead. Some ideas please? 

Thanks, all.


----------



## mattack

Does anybody know if a series 2 IR board will work in a series 1?

My series 1 IR board has mostly stopped working.. (I know this thread is about series 2s).
I can swap the boards between my two series 1s, which I think proves the case that it's the board.. (I guess I should separate the ribbon cable from the board and absolutely check the connections -- but it doesn't look loose)

It works very sporadically and obviously no control via remote makes it unusable!


----------



## rcs1630

Thanks For The Heads Up, New To This Whole Scene. Trying To Learn As I Bump Along
Rcs


----------



## copi

I just wanted to pass along some info that might help. I melted the L30 so bad that I couldnt solder a wire between the conductors but I was able to fix the hughes dvr40 but going from the pin closest to L30 on the ribbon cable an inserting a wire and connecting it to ground. I also noticed it would be easy to take a wire from ground and run it to the front panel and connect it to pin 2 on the IR sensor. Either way fixed my DVR40 after I let the smoke out from a loose ribbon cable


----------



## jasch

mattack said:


> Does anybody know if a series 2 IR board will work in a series 1?


Weakneed sells IR boards. for $39.. They currently have on stock for any phillips HDR or SONY SVR-2000 (S1)

Of course, if you look at the prices of replacement parts (1 power supply goes for $100), you might better get a new unit, and use the old one for spare parts.


----------



## tebz1123

Looks like I successfully acquired the same problem...only the L31 component is what is fried and the L30 component appears to be in ok shape. as was asked below can I simply solder a thin wire accross L31 contacts as described for the L30 fix? No one ever posted an answer to the same question quoted below.

thanks. AMT



Goines said:


> Hey,
> 
> I just picked up an additional hdvr2, which was known to be broken. I've noticed that the only thing wrong with it is that ir doesn't work. Following the directions below I can see that I think the L30 will need to be replaced (it looks slightly darker than normal). But in checking it, i noticed that L31 (on the other side of the ribbon cable) is toasted. It was completely cooked.
> 
> I'm just curious if i can replace it with a similar approach, or if i need to actually get the proper part for it, or...?
> 
> Any ideas?
> 
> Thanks


----------



## Lord Vader

FSL said:


> Warning:
> Needs very good SMT component soldering skill. Please DON'T DIY if you never work on SMT before. Ask some one with the skill or bring your Tivo to an electronics repair shop let the technician do it for you.
> 
> Who need fix:
> If you power up the HDVR2 with ribbon cable unevenly plug into CN10 on motherboard and found the Remote malfunction. Most likely you need this fix.
> 
> Cause:
> HDVR2 use 3 pins IR sensor (in front panel). Pin1=+5V, Pin2=Ground, Pin3=IR signal out. For general circuit design, usually direct connects pin2 to common ground. But HDVR2 IR sensor pin2 goes through a ribbon cable and Inductor L30 on the motherboard side connects to ground. When ribbon cable unevenly plug into CN10, The contact pins on cable cause shortage between pins inside CN10. When power up the Tivo, DC current from shorted pins inside CN10 goes through Inductor L30 to ground. If enough current apply to L10, itll generates too much heat and burned open. The IR sensor pin2 will no longer connect to ground even you plug back the ribbon cable right next time.
> 
> Fix:
> Replace L30 (inside red circle on the attached picture) with a new one (any value will work). If can't find any inductor, just use a thin wire short L30 will work.
> 
> Good Luck


This appears to be my problem, because when I look closely at L30, it's fried big time. In fact, it's all black and literally breaking apart into ashes.

So all I have to do is replace it and I should be good to go, huh?


----------



## jkirkbride

I got a new S2 Directivo this week and before I did anything with it I wanted to back up the drive. I have done this for all of my Tivo's in the past (5 of them now) and never had a problem. Well, after working on this Philips unit, my remote stopped working. Tried all kinds of stuff and couldn't figure it out. I FINALLY stumbled on this thread. Now, I've done some soldering before but never SM stuff. So before I dragged out my iron and screwed it up even more, I remembered something I bought a while back. It's a CircuitWriter pen from Caig Labs. The pen allows you to literally draw circuits on surfaces. I figured it can't hurt to try, so instead of removing L30 I simply drew a circuit around the edge of it to connect the two pads without even removing the component. I plugged everything back in and voila! I had my remote back. Here's a link to the product, available at Radio Shack.

http://www.radioshack.com/product/i...cuitwriter&kw=circuitwriter&parentPage=search

So if you screw up your remote by leaving the cable out, there is a $6.49 fix, no soldering necessary.


----------



## zewone

I think this happened to me. After installing a new hard drive, my RCA DVR39 will go to the "almost done" screen and reboot. I opened it back up and notice the white ribbon is completely out! I made sure to be careful about it, I don't know how it happened. After reconnecting it, same problem, Tivo reboots itself after the "almost done" screen. What are my options at this point?


----------



## Lord Vader

Which ribbon was disconnected? The one from the front panel to the front of the motherboard, or the one from the power supply to the motherboard? If the latter, you may have a defective power supply unit and can pick one up from Weaknees. If the former, search this thread for a fix.


----------



## Lord Vader

jkirkbride said:


> I got a new S2 Directivo this week and before I did anything with it I wanted to back up the drive. I have done this for all of my Tivo's in the past (5 of them now) and never had a problem. Well, after working on this Philips unit, my remote stopped working. Tried all kinds of stuff and couldn't figure it out. I FINALLY stumbled on this thread. Now, I've done some soldering before but never SM stuff. So before I dragged out my iron and screwed it up even more, I remembered something I bought a while back. It's a CircuitWriter pen from Caig Labs. The pen allows you to literally draw circuits on surfaces. I figured it can't hurt to try, so instead of removing L30 I simply drew a circuit around the edge of it to connect the two pads without even removing the component. I plugged everything back in and voila! I had my remote back. Here's a link to the product, available at Radio Shack.
> 
> http://www.radioshack.com/product/i...cuitwriter&kw=circuitwriter&parentPage=search
> 
> So if you screw up your remote by leaving the cable out, there is a $6.49 fix, no soldering necessary.


It'd be nice if you were able to post a pic of just what you did and how you did this. I'm trying to envision this.


----------



## zewone

Lord Vader said:


> Which ribbon was disconnected? The one from the front panel to the front of the motherboard, or the one from the power supply to the motherboard? If the latter, you may have a defective power supply unit and can pick one up from Weaknees. If the former, search this thread for a fix.


From the front panel to the front of the motheroboard. After reading this thread, I didn't see anyone with the same problem. Maybe, I damaged something else.


----------



## jkirkbride

Lord Vader said:


> It'd be nice if you were able to post a pic of just what you did and how you did this. I'm trying to envision this.


I'll see what I can do to get a picture. It's closed up now and running so I have to crack the case. The pen contains a conductive ink that allows you to draw circuits. It is mainly for repairing damaged traces on boards but seemed to do a nice job rerouting around the damaged component here.


----------



## Tinkergirl

I replaced my power supply and then spent some time uploading my old HD shows via wireless internet to my computer to then burn to DVD.

The reason I am telling you all of this is that I was planning to install an new HD since I was already in there. The Tivo box (Tivo brand, series 2) was either open or partially covered by the cover (but not screwed in) for a week. 

So, to make a long story short, I was bitten by the nasty white cable snake. When I had a problem booting up, I checked around inside and found the cable partially dislodged. This is AFTER I had powered it up.

I replaced the white cable to its place and both the old and new HDs will boot up, but once it comes to the screen to hit "select" (new HD) or the screen to update my program info (old HD), my remote doesn't work (batteries are fine). I tried another Tivo remote and it wouldn't work either. 

The lights on the front of the unit work.

I tried it again today after letting it sit unplugged overnight. It still won't work. I am too impatient to wait yet another week to see if it somehow resets itself as has been the case for a few others earlier in this thread.

My l30 and l31 both look good. The pins on the white cable look fine as well. I don't have a soldering iron and have never had reason to buy one. The whole idea scares me a bit anyway. I am afraid I would melt the circuit board. One person who posted said they removed the l30 first. Would I have to remove it?

I liked the idea about the pen from Radio Shack but I have no idea how to go about this (a picture WOULD help). In theory, if you can solder a wire between them (does it have to be copper?) couldn't you draw a line with this pen between the two metal bars on l30 instead of around them? Is it really as simple as drawing a line from say the outside of one side (touching the metal bar) to the outside of the other side (touching the metal bar) of l30 with this pen?

How do the fuses (I think that is what they are) on the power supply relate to the identical numbers on the circuit board? My l30 and l31 "fuses" look fine from above. Is there possibly damage to the connecting wire underneath the power supply? Or is that completely unrelated to this problem?

Do I need to remove the faceplate to check the connection of the white cable in the front? I haven't done that yet. 

I appreciate any advice you might have. I live in Marin County, CA and if anyone knows of a person who could help me out if I cannot fix this myself, I would appreciate it.

Thanks!


----------



## Tinkergirl

If I do choose to solder, do I have to remove the black stuff between the two l30 metal bars? It looked like someone had done that in one of the pictures (PaGe1). In another (FSL), it looked like the new wire may have been just laid on top of the old black stuff. 

Can I use the rosin solder wire that comes with the soldering iron to attach a wire (copper?) between the two sides of l30?

If I am going to Radio Shack to buy something, should it be the soldering iron set at $7.99 or the circuit pen at $6.49?

Sorry I don't know the technical terms and refer to things as "stuff"


----------



## jkirkbride

I posted earlier about the pen. It really is as simple as drawing a line between the two pads that the component connects. I was asked for a pic before, and I knew I should have taken one before I closed it up. Now it is on a stand, under an LCD TV and getting to it will take some work. The pen has a small tip that depresses into the body of the pen, which allows the 'ink' to flow. It doesn't come pouring out, you just draw with it like a pen. Connect the two pads and you are in business. Mine has been running 24x7 since I posted before and it works flawlessly.


----------



## Tinkergirl

between the two pads over the black stuff or around l30 altogether? Should I be careful not to draw over any white lines?


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## jkirkbride

OK. here is a picture of a circuit board with a similar component, that I have modified to illustrate what needs to be done with the pen, since I can't crack my Tivo right now. Keep in mind, this is not a Tivo board, it is not the anything remotely close. It is just for illustration. This is what you would do to the L30 component on your Tivo mainboard.










SM components are mounted to the contact pads using a vey small amount of solder. Since the problem that occurrs when you leave the cable out at powerup is that L30 shorts out, the circuit containing L30 becomes open, thus electricity cannot pass. By using the pen to "draw" a circuit, you are connectiong the pads at either end of the component, closing the circuit and allowing electricity to flow again. Electrons will take the path of least resistance, so they will go around L30 in favor of your newly created path. If you want to test it first, get a piece of paper and use the pen to draw a line on the paper. The use an ohmmeter to test the continuity of your line. You will see that it conducts electricity. You want to avoid getting the ink on anything but where you want it, as it might short out other components.


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## MarsUltor

I just encountered a similar problem that I thought all of you would like to know. I was installing the weekness bracket, and i inadvertantly disconnected the white ribbon cable going from the powersupply to the mother board, but the cable rested in a position that looked like it was still in place. When i plugged the tivo in, a clicking sound emanated from the vicinity of the powersupply. Finally, after checking, i realized the position of the ribbon cable, and secured it into its proper position. Now that the cable is installed, and everything is hooked up properly, the tivo works flawlessly with no problems... both hard drives work beautifully, and the remote works fine (unlike the problem mentioned at the beginning of the thread), i just have to say the weekness sytem works great, and is highly recommended


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## Tinkergirl

Thanks JKirkBride for your great picture and your advice. I went to my local Radio Shack and they didn't have the pen in stock, so I bought the solder kit for 7.99. I finally got around to trying it out tonight - keep in mind that this is my first time soldering - it took me awhile just to get the piece of copper wire (I used a piece I cut from the twisted copper side of speaker wire) to sit on top of l30. Then getting the pieces of the rosin solder to stay on top of the wire to get it soldered into place was tough. I probably did this completely wrong but I finally got the wire to stay put with the solder adhering it to l30. 

It looks like a complete mess and the wire itself doesn't actually touch both sides of the top of l30 but the solder must act as a conductor because IT WORKED!

Also - according to the soldering iron instructions, before I started, I sanded the top of l30 a bit and vacuumed up with a computer vacuum. (I used the end of an emery board to sand). Contrary to what I said earlier, upon close inspection of l30, I could see some brown discoloration (burnt?). I sanded it off before I started.

I tried to take a picture but my camera didn't have good enough resolution that close up and the angles were difficult. Sorry.

To all of you out there who have had the nasty white cable problem - don't lose hope. With an $8 soldering iron and some patience (or the Circuit Writer Pen if you can get it) you too can fix this "fatal" problem. I had never touched a circuit board in my life before this...

Good luck to all of you and thank goodness for these forums!


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## ADent

Thanx for this thread.

I have been in my MIL's (Mother in Law) HDRV2 many times and I 'always' check that white cable.

Well the last time I was in a hurry and I knocked the white cable askew and fried L30 big time and lightly fried L31.

The solder pen is a brilliant idea, esp since I own one. It was kinda dried up, but I removed the tip (left hand threaded) and stuck a toothpick in it. Did L30 - no go, did L31 all is good.


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## steve614

jasch said:


> I removed the L30 and replaced it with a wire, and my TiVo is working again.
> 
> My question is should I take the time to replace the inductor at all? I know the wire works, but I am wondering of long time effects. I mean, *the inductor is there for a reason*, and it blew out probably to protect something on the motherboard.


I am also wondering about this. IIRC, inductors are used to smooth power spikes and replacement with a straight wire connection would allow these power spikes to pass thru to other components.

Has anyone who did this back in '04 have any other related problems?


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## mrbriggs

Just wanted to add that I too was bite by the dislodged white ribbon snake. I checked continuity on L30 and L31. L31 checked out fine, but L30 had nothing. I soldered a short piece of solid wire (strand from a cat5 cable) connecting both sides of L30, jumpering it and my remote works fine now. 

One interesting note is that the non functioning remote started yesterday and I could not get either of my two Tivo peanut remotes to work at all, but a universal remote that I had JP1 programmed years ago for my Series 1 Tivo worked fine. However after powering up tonight non of the remotes worked. After jumpering L30, all three work fine.

Thank you everyone.


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## gardavis

I tried to wire in an extra IR sensor in my S1 Sony but messed it up, shorting out something. After reading this thread, it sounded like my symptoms. So I went looking for the L30/L31's but found none nor anything else the looked like it might have been fried. Maybe that's why S1's did not experience the issue of dislodged connectors.

I got a S1 Philips from eBay cheap and swapped the IR board and it worked. Phew.

Gary Davis


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## gnome

Well, my friend gave me his tivo because it wouldnt work. I opened it up to see if anything was wrong. The cable was loose and it wouldnt response to the remote.

I didn't know about this white cable issue. I searched google, found this forum and today at work..... I soldered off the jumper. I took a copper wire and soldered it to the board. I put some sample pix attached. GOOD LUCK!! IT WORKS!!


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## ciper

With the jumper in place what happens when you short the cable a second time? Why not replace the burnt component with a fuse?


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## saylestock

You guys are awesome. I thought I was screwed. I jumped L30 and it worked for me. Thanks!!!!


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## strfish7

Much thanks to all who posted about this problem and their solution to it. I, too, had the white ribbon issue (complete with smoke and a burning smell); after examination, my L30 was completely fried. The L31 didn't look too good either. I contrived a grounding wire and sandwiched it between the ribbon cable and the housing and soldered a copper wire between the terminals of my L31. Success!! Since this unit had lifetime service, it was imperative for me to restore it. Very nice to see that it wasn't just my own carelessness that caused the problem....


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## AGP19

I too fell victim to a fried L30 due to the white ribbon being dislodged. After reading this thread, I attempted the first method of repair using a soldering iron. This unfortunately didn't work too well for me. I decided to try the circuit writer pen instead. This is what worked for me, and it only took a couple minutes compared to the hour I spent trying to solder a thin piece of copper wire to the circuit board. If you have no experience in soldering, I highly recommend getting a circuit writer pen.


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## timtimmins

AGP19 said:


> I too fell victim to a fried L30 due to the white ribbon being dislodged. After reading this thread, I attempted the first method of repair using a soldering iron. This unfortunately didn't work too well for me. I decided to try the circuit writer pen instead. This is what worked for me, and it only took a couple minutes compared to the hour I spent trying to solder a thin piece of copper wire to the circuit board. If you have no experience in soldering, I highly recommend getting a circuit writer pen.


First time poster. . .

I also was careless and started the TIVO up with the White Cable of Life only partially attached. 

Attached are photos of my fix, which is similar to AGP19's. I used the conductive "paint" provided in a rear window fogger repair kit. I got mine at a hardware store - FYI, Home Depot did not have this item. Most auto repair stores should have it, too, for under $10.

I used to collect and fix classic arcade games, but I'm still a bit of a hack when it comes to soldering PLUS my L30 was SO fried that it took the traces right off the contact pads with it when it died. So, I had to scrape down and get some more metal trace, then spread the paint on with a toothpick, being very careful not to scrape/paint any nearby unrelated traces or parts.

Pics attached.

I HIGHLY recommend this fix or the circuit pen fix for anyone who has never soldered before.

So, now I upgraded to 130 hours from 70 with a spare 60GB drive I had sitting around and the remote is good as new. 

Great thread, thanx!


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## afoglia

I too may have fallen victim to this problem. After my upgrade, when I plugged in the TiVo, I did smell smoke, and the remote wouldn't work. I opened it back up, noticed right end (nearest to the HD) was up and nearly out. Also L31 was obviously damaged. (I couldn't find L30, and didn't find these pictures until after I reclosed the TiVo.) I reseated the cable, and restarted the TiVo. My remote's now working. Should I try to fix L31 (and L30) with a conductive pen, or just thank my lucky stars?


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## George Bush

Anybody find a source for a replacement inductor at L30?


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## classicsat

Just jumper over it.


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## innocentfreak

I think this happened to my mother's Tivo but is there any way to visually verify before I go trying to swap the IR board. 

I just upgraded her Directivo and checked everything but I didn't hook it up here to verify. I get to her place connect everything and it powers up fine. LED light is yellow instead of green and no response to remote but the front buttons work for the most part on her Phillips DSR704. She of course no longer can find the tools I left with her when I did her upgrade previously so I take it home. I found the white cable slightly angled almost like it was starting to slip out. It pulled out easily and I reseated it. This time I hooked it up and everything worked fine including green LED and with my remote. I took it back to her place and hooked it up and none of her remotes will control it with a zero remote address. Thoughts?

I have absolutely no soldering skills not to mention I don't have steady hands so I am trying to avoid it if I can. The part that confuses me is my remote worked. I do have an extra DSR704 which I can use as a donation box for parts. I believe it even works so I could always use it instead but I assume I will lose all the saved recordings.


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## oliver27

I have a Toshiba SD-H400, which is a series 2 Tivo plus a DVD. It had a loose white ribbon cable, I plugged it in, and the remote stopped working. It has all the symptoms of a fried L30, but I can't find an L30. None of the pictures in this thread resemble any part of any of the circuit boards. 

Does anyone know anything about this model? 

I am hoping to run a wire directly from the connector to ground, but I'm not sure which end to run it from.


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## rbtravis

Not familiar with your motherboard but on mine it is located to the right of the connector where you plug in the white cable. It looks like a surface mount resistor or capacitor.


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## glennclifford

The Circuit Writer pen worked great--very simple. Thanks


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## southwos

oliver27 said:


> I have a Toshiba SD-H400, which is a series 2 Tivo plus a DVD. It had a loose white ribbon cable, I plugged it in, and the remote stopped working. It has all the symptoms of a fried L30, but I can't find an L30. None of the pictures in this thread resemble any part of any of the circuit boards.
> 
> Does anyone know anything about this model?
> 
> I am hoping to run a wire directly from the connector to ground, but I'm not sure which end to run it from.


I too have the Toshiba SD-H400 and a Pioneer DVR-57H. They are both not responding to any remotes. I have taken them both apart and cannot find a L30 on the motherboards. I know this is an old thread, but if anyone has any suggestions I would appreciate it.


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## unitron

southwos said:


> I too have the Toshiba SD-H400 and a Pioneer DVR-57H. They are both not responding to any remotes. I have taken them both apart and cannot find a L30 on the motherboards. I know this is an old thread, but if anyone has any suggestions I would appreciate it.


Did you ever have them apart before?

Was there ever a time when you might have inadvertantly partially dislodged the ribbon cable from the front panel where it connects to the motherboard?

If not, this problem is likely not your problem, even though the symptoms may be the same or similar.

When an S2 or S3 starts exhibiting strange behavior, the first thing to suspect is one or more capacitors gone bad on the power supply ciruit board, almost always in the +5V and/or +12V output circuits.

Go here:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/index.php?

Click up near the top where it says Search, and enter

power supply capacitor

into the search box.


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## southwos

unitron said:


> Did you ever have them apart before?
> 
> Was there ever a time when you might have inadvertantly partially dislodged the ribbon cable from the front panel where it connects to the motherboard?
> 
> If not, this problem is likely not your problem, even though the symptoms may be the same or similar.
> 
> When an S2 or S3 starts exhibiting strange behavior, the first thing to suspect is one or more capacitors gone bad on the power supply ciruit board, almost always in the +5V and/or +12V output circuits.
> 
> Go here:
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/index.php?
> 
> Click up near the top where it says Search, and enter
> 
> power supply capacitor
> 
> into the search box.


I have had these two TiVo's since I bought them new in 2004. I have been using them in our spare bedrooms. Recently I have purchased two premiere's that replaced these. I hadn't turned either of them on for about 6 months. I hooked one up and it was working fine until about a week ago. The problem was a green screen with white writing on it. I don't remember what it said exactly, but it said to call TiVo tech support. I did and they said the unit was out of warranty and suggested I call Weaknees. When I originally purchased these TiVo's I bought a replacement Hard Drive for each one as I figured that would be the one thing that would eventually fail. So, I decided to replace the hard drive in the one with the green screen, this is the first time I have opened the case. I work in the computer field, so changing a hard drive is not that difficult. When I booted the TiVo after the HD replacement it boots to the out of box experience I would have expected with a new HD. The remote did not work after this, so I grabbed the other TiVo that had been setting for 6 months and plugged it in expecting it to work without any issues. It did not respond to any remote inputs, but it has some buttons on the front so I was able to tell that the TiVo was functioning. I had not opened the case on the second TiVo at this point. Yes I verified the remote works with other TiVo and tried the other remotes that I have in the house. It's just really strange that both of them are showing the same issues. I'll check out your links to the power issues and see if anything gets them working again. Thank you!!


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## unitron

southwos said:


> I have had these two TiVo's since I bought them new in 2004. I have been using them in our spare bedrooms. Recently I have purchased two premiere's that replaced these. I hadn't turned either of them on for about 6 months. I hooked one up and it was working fine until about a week ago. The problem was a green screen with white writing on it. I don't remember what it said exactly, but it said to call TiVo tech support. I did and they said the unit was out of warranty and suggested I call Weaknees. When I originally purchased these TiVo's I bought a replacement Hard Drive for each one as I figured that would be the one thing that would eventually fail. So, I decided to replace the hard drive in the one with the green screen, this is the first time I have opened the case. I work in the computer field, so changing a hard drive is not that difficult. When I booted the TiVo after the HD replacement it boots to the out of box experience I would have expected with a new HD. The remote did not work after this, so I grabbed the other TiVo that had been setting for 6 months and plugged it in expecting it to work without any issues. It did not respond to any remote inputs, but it has some buttons on the front so I was able to tell that the TiVo was functioning. I had not opened the case on the second TiVo at this point. Yes I verified the remote works with other TiVo and tried the other remotes that I have in the house. It's just really strange that both of them are showing the same issues. I'll check out your links to the power issues and see if anything gets them working again. Thank you!!


When you say you bought spare hard drives, do you mean from a specialist that pre-installed the TiVo software on them?

Because otherwise the out of box experience I'd expect would be the motherboard shows the initial welcome screen and then can never find the TiVo software on the blank, unformatted drive, so it never moves on.

You should have taken closer note of the exact wording of that Green Screen Of Death (which is usually a green screen of severe indigestion).

Usually it's something about the TiVo has a problem and you need to let it sit unmolested for a few hours to try to straighten it out.

I think you're supposed to call TiVo if it shows that screen for about 3 hours, then reboots and shows it again, then reboots again in 3 hours and shows the screen again--in other words, if it never manages to fix its problem.

And make sure you're using the correct remote, the Toshiba for the Toshiba and the Pioneer for the Pioneer, and that the batteries in each are fairly new, and the motherboard battery could probably stand to be replaced in each by now as well.

Big Lots has a card with 4 2032s on it for $2 right now.


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## southwos

unitron said:


> When you say you bought spare hard drives, do you mean from a specialist that pre-installed the TiVo software on them?
> 
> Yes, puchased both of them new from Weaknees, never installed them until I got the green screen on the pioneer.
> 
> 
> Because otherwise the out of box experience I'd expect would be the motherboard shows the initial welcome screen and then can never find the TiVo software on the blank, unformatted drive, so it never moves on.
> 
> You should have taken closer note of the exact wording of that Green Screen Of Death (which is usually a green screen of severe indigestion).
> 
> Usually it's something about the TiVo has a problem and you need to let it sit unmolested for a few hours to try to straighten it out.
> 
> I think you're supposed to call TiVo if it shows that screen for about 3 hours, then reboots and shows it again, then reboots again in 3 hours and shows the screen again--in other words, if it never manages to fix its problem.
> 
> That is the screen that the pioneer was displaying. I did wait 3 hours, twice, before calling TiVo.
> 
> And make sure you're using the correct remote, the Toshiba for the Toshiba and the Pioneer for the Pioneer, and that the batteries in each are fairly new, and the motherboard battery could probably stand to be replaced in each by now as well.
> 
> I tried everything but replacing the batteries on the motherboard. I might try that when I get home.
> 
> Big Lots has a card with 4 2032s on it for $2 right now.


Thanks!!


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## unitron

southwos said:


> Thanks!!


You should have at least temporarily installed the Weaknees drives to set them up and test them while there was still some warranty on them.

Are you sure you put the right drive in the right TiVo?

Have you tried the Toshiba remote on the Pioneer and the Pioneer remote on the Toshiba?


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## southwos

unitron said:


> You should have at least temporarily installed the Weaknees drives to set them up and test them while there was still some warranty on them.
> 
> Are you sure you put the right drive in the right TiVo?
> 
> Have you tried the Toshiba remote on the Pioneer and the Pioneer remote on the Toshiba?


I bought the drives as a backup in case/when the originals failed. Didn't really think about them again until the green screen appeared.

It is interesting that you asked if I put the right drive in the right TiVo. When I went to get the drives, I noticed I had written on the boxes which one was for which TiVo. When I opened the boxes, they both had the same instructions (I think they were both for the Toshiba) and they are both the same drive. I guess it couldn't hurt swaping the drives as a test. Like I said though the Toshiba TiVo appears to be working in as much as you can with the limited physical buttons. The pioneer doesn't have physical buttons, so it's hard to say if it's working or will work.

I have tried all combo's of remotes possible. Both units also do not have any faceplate lights working. It's just weird that both of them died on the same day.


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## unitron

southwos said:


> I bought the drives as a backup in case/when the originals failed. Didn't really think about them again until the green screen appeared.
> 
> It is interesting that you asked if I put the right drive in the right TiVo. When I went to get the drives, I noticed I had written on the boxes which one was for which TiVo. When I opened the boxes, they both had the same instructions (I think they were both for the Toshiba) and they are both the same drive. I guess it couldn't hurt swaping the drives as a test. Like I said though the Toshiba TiVo appears to be working in as much as you can with the limited physical buttons. The pioneer doesn't have physical buttons, so it's hard to say if it's working or will work.
> 
> I have tried all combo's of remotes possible. Both units also do not have any faceplate lights working. It's just weird that both of them died on the same day.


Both may have developed a problem or problem recently at about the same time, and then putting in the new drives may have introduced new new problems as well.

I'm strongly suspicious of bad caps in the power supply, especially if they've been sitting unused for awhile and then suddenly were subjected to the full voltage they'd normally face, although the possibility that you accidently partly dislodged the ribbon cable from the front panel where it connects the motherboard should be considered as well.

The reason I brought up using the "wrong" brand remote is because when I experimented with running S1 Sony software on an S1 Philips and vice versa, I learned that it boots and runs (although the first time it calls the mothership it'll probably get hopelessly confused), but it expects the remote codes from the brand of machine from which it came, not the brand in which it's currently working.


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## southwos

unitron said:


> Both may have developed a problem or problem recently at about the same time, and then putting in the new drives may have introduced new new problems as well.
> 
> I'm strongly suspicious of bad caps in the power supply, especially if they've been sitting unused for awhile and then suddenly were subjected to the full voltage they'd normally face, although the possibility that you accidently partly dislodged the ribbon cable from the front panel where it connects the motherboard should be considered as well.
> 
> The reason I brought up using the "wrong" brand remote is because when I experimented with running S1 Sony software on an S1 Philips and vice versa, I learned that it boots and runs (although the first time it calls the mothership it'll probably get hopelessly confused), but it expects the remote codes from the brand of machine from which it came, not the brand in which it's currently working.


I re-checked everything tonight. I even replaced the battery on the motherboard of the pioneer unit. Didn't see any burnt spots on the MB or any loose cables. Oh well, I guess they just died. They appear to work as far as what you see on screen, just no remote controls work. I was just going to use these as extras for the spare bedrooms. I'll just recycle them. Thanks for all your suggestions and advice.


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## unitron

southwos said:


> I re-checked everything tonight. I even replaced the battery on the motherboard of the pioneer unit. Didn't see any burnt spots on the MB or any loose cables. Oh well, I guess they just died. They appear to work as far as what you see on screen, just no remote controls work. I was just going to use these as extras for the spare bedrooms. I'll just recycle them. Thanks for all your suggestions and advice.


Don't head for the landfill just yet, let me see what else I can think of.

When they boot up, do they get all the way to TiVo Central?


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## southwos

unitron said:


> Don't head for the landfill just yet, let me see what else I can think of.
> 
> When they boot up, do they get all the way to TiVo Central?


Yes, the toshiba has some functional buttons on the face plate that allows navigation of TiVo menus and to watch live tv. The pioneer boots into first time user guide, but the pioneer has no external button so I'm dead in the water there.


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## unitron

southwos said:


> Yes, the toshiba has some functional buttons on the face plate that allows navigation of TiVo menus and to watch live tv. The pioneer boots into first time user guide, but the pioneer has no external button so I'm dead in the water there.


And this "won't respond to the remote" happened on both units after both sat unplugged for half a year, but before you put the "new" Weaknees spare drives in either unit or otherwise opened them up?


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## southwos

Yes that's pretty much what happened, except the pioneer was working for about a week before it green screened.


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## WO312

A shot in the dark here, but any chance it is a remote code problem? As in, the Tivo is set for say 5 and none of your remotes is set for that code?

It's been a LONG time since I've messed with remote codes, but I think a "0" coded remote will activate any code that the Tivo is set for. Can't hurt to try.


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## unitron

WO312 said:


> A shot in the dark here, but any chance it is a remote code problem? As in, the Tivo is set for say 5 and none of your remotes is set for that code?
> 
> It's been a LONG time since I've messed with remote codes, but I think a "0" coded remote will activate any code that the Tivo is set for. Can't hurt to try.


The deal is that a remote set to 0 will operate any TiVo (which it could operate otherwise), no matter to which remote address the TiVo is set, and a TiVo set to 0 will get operated by a remote that can operate it no matter to which address the remote is set.

But there's no setting that will make an S1 Philips TiVo's remote work an S1 Sony, or the other way around, and since the S2s being discussed here aren't TiVo brand TiVos but a Toshiba and a Pioneer, I wasn't really sure what would or wouldn't work what.

But it couldn't hurt to set each ones remote to 0 as long as they're being tested in a room other than the one with his S4(s) in it.


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## WO312

unitron said:


> The deal is that a remote set to 0 will operate any TiVo (which it could operate otherwise), no matter to which remote address the TiVo is set, and a TiVo set to 0 will get operated by a remote that can operate it no matter to which address the remote is set.
> 
> But there's no setting that will make an S1 Philips TiVo's remote work an S1 Sony, or the other way around, and since the S2s being discussed here aren't TiVo brand TiVos but a Toshiba and a Pioneer, I wasn't really sure what would or wouldn't work what.
> 
> But it couldn't hurt to set each ones remote to 0 as long as they're being tested in a room other than the one with his S4(s) in it.


I would assume that the weaknees imaged drive would have been set to 0, so maybe this won't work, but it never hurts to try.


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## southwos

WO312 said:


> A shot in the dark here, but any chance it is a remote code problem? As in, the Tivo is set for say 5 and none of your remotes is set for that code?
> 
> It's been a LONG time since I've messed with remote codes, but I think a "0" coded remote will activate any code that the Tivo is set for. Can't hurt to try.


I have tried several different remotes and set the remotes back to 0 as well still no luck.

Remember the pioneer was working for about a week before it green screened.


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