# Announcing: TiVo Stream! Now available



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Official press release: http://pr.tivo.com/press-releases/t...m-enabling-subscribers-to-nasdaq-tivo-0927032

*TiVo Launches TiVo Stream, Enabling Subscribers to Watch Recordings on Their iPads for the First Time
*
*Finally, Viewers' Favorite Recorded Shows Can Be Streamed on any iPad, iPhone or iPod touch in the House or Loaded Up to Take on Any Trip
*
ALVISO, CA--(Marketwire - Sep 6, 2012) - TiVo Inc. (NASDAQ: TIVO), a leader in the advanced television entertainment market, today announced the launch of its TiVo® Stream, an accessory allowing TiVo® Premiere DVR users to watch recordings on their iPads or for the first time instantly stream their favorite shows and DVR content to their iPad®, iPhone® or iPod touch® in the house without interrupting normal viewing on the television. TiVo Stream is also the ideal TiVo accessory for entertainment fans on-the-go; allowing users to load it up and take their favorite recordings on any trip.*

"Finally, consumers can have the flexibility they have long demanded by enjoying their favorite entertainment content anywhere -- be it at home, in the air, or on-the-road," said Jim Denney, GM and VP of Product Marketing for TiVo Inc. "With the launch of TiVo Stream, we are ushering in a new era of flexibility, empowering our users to watch their recorded entertainment regardless of location. The ability to quickly and easily stream content to second screens like smartphones and tablets via the TiVo app helps TiVo users get even more from their TV-watching experience."

*First Simultaneous Streaming and Download of Recorded Content*
TiVo Stream is the first device to enable simultaneous streaming or downloading of recorded shows to up to four mobile devices without interrupting what is currently playing on TV.

With support for up to four streams at once, users can now watch previously recorded and currently recording content over their home network, allowing mom to enjoy her favorite cooking program in the kitchen, dad to stay on top of the game while in the garage, and give the kids an opportunity to catch up with their favorite cartoons in the backyard.

For on-the-go users, TiVo Stream allows TV fans to download recordings from their TiVo Premiere DVR for viewing later outside of the home, via TiVo's app for iPad, iPhone and iPod touch*. Users can download a one hour show to their mobile device in as little as 15 minutes and view it later even when not connected to a network. TiVo knows a device's storage space is sacred, and lets users know how much space is required prior to downloading and gives them a choice of two file sizes, making it ideal for travelers.

*Award-Winning User Experience*
Harnessing the power of the world's most innovative user experience, TiVo Stream takes advantage of TiVo's intuitive search and browsing experience that enables users to quickly and easily find or discover television and broadband programs, then converts it to a format that's easily viewable or downloadable to a compatible second-screen device. Additionally, content plays in the TiVo app, allowing users to navigate features such as cast information, or scrub through a show. This compatibility creates a consistent experience -- no matter where users watch.

The TiVo Stream is compatible with TiVo's line-up of Premiere DVR products, including TiVo Premiere, TiVo Premiere XL, TiVo Premiere 4 and TiVo Premiere XL4. It requires TiVo's free app for iPad, iPhone, or iPod touch to bring an intuitive on-screen experience and remote control operations to users' compatible devices.

TiVo Stream Specifications and Requirements:

* Compatible TiVo products:
- TiVo Premiere
- TiVo Premiere XL
- TiVo Premiere 4
- TiVo Premiere XL4 (previously Premiere Elite)
* Inputs: Gigabit Ethernet, 12v DC power
* Dimensions: 4" x 4" x 1.05"
* Weight: 0.3 pounds
* Requires wired connection between TiVo DVR and wireless router (Ethernet or MoCA)
* Requires one or more iPad, iPhone or iPod touch devices running iOS5.1 or later
- For a list of supported devices, please visit www.tivo.com/stream
* Requires free TiVo App for iPad, iPhone or other supported device
* The TiVo Stream incorporates TiVoGuard for Mobile, a CableLabs-approved content protection technology

The TiVo Stream is now available through tivo.com and coming soon to most Best Buy and Magnolia Home Theater stores, with an MSRP of $129.99. For more information on the product, please visit www.tivo.com/stream.

*Ability to download content subject to rights management policies of programmers in accordance with FCC rules.


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## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

This product is now on sale at tivo.com for $129.99! (No monthly fee.)

From http://www.tivo.com/products/tivo-stream/index.html

TiVo Stream adds flexibility to your TiVo experience by letting you stream shows to mobile devices in your home, or wirelessly transfer shows and take them to go.

* Stream your recorded shows from your TiVo Premiere series DVR simultaneously to multiple mobile devices
* Watch a show on a mobile device as it's being recorded
* Wirelessly transfer shows to mobile devices
* Transfer a one-hour show in as little as 15 minutes"

TIVo Stream Spotlight video: [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=90seBcVnwLo&feature=em-subs_digest[/media]

TiVo Stream Tutorial video: [media]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eAkLL5x4zaU&feature=em-subs_digest[/media]

WSJ review and video review: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390444230504577617424154596142.html - "After using TiVo Stream in my home, I'm dreading sending it back after this column publishes, as is my policy for returning products. Without calling the cable company or buying new televisions, I was suddenly able to watch TV in several rooms of my house. As I chopped vegetables in the kitchen, I watched a streaming episode of the Food Network's "Barefoot Contessa" for inspiration. I watched the ending to an old favorite movie, "My Best Friend's Wedding," from the comfort of my bed rather than from the living room. I even played live U.S. Open tennis matches in the bathroom while doing my makeup so as not to miss a minute of my favorite tennis tournament. At one point, I had a Kim Clijsters tennis match simultaneously playing on my TV, on two iPads and on an iPhone."

(Requires a TiVo Premiere with a wired or MoCA connection to your network, and one or more iOS devices.)

Available soon from Best Buy or now from TiVo.com.

I didn't work on this, but congrats to the team here at TiVo that did -- this works really well, and the early reviews are very positive.

Questions?


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

I pre-ordered one and got it yesterday. It's pretty great! 

Dan


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

I still don't understand the TiVo Stream Spotlight video. They say in the video that you can stream to *any* tablet or smart phone connected to your home network. But then in fine print, at the bottom, it says it's only for the iPad, iPhone and the iPod Touch. So why not just say that it's for apple products the Spotlight Video?


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## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Dan, great to hear that!

aaronwt, that's a good question. I'll just quote from the support article (http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2405/kw/stream): "*At this time*, the TiVo Stream does not support Android and other mobile devices."

I accidentally bolded the first three words but I cannot disclose why. I wish I could put in something definitive here, but for now, this is for iOS devices only.


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## dugbug (Dec 29, 2003)

wonder if the tivo apps will support airplay. Then my phone could throw the stream onto my tv.


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## Aero 1 (Aug 8, 2007)

TiVoStephen said:


> Questions?


are there any plans to up update Tivo Desktop to take advantage of the stream?


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## NotNowChief (Mar 29, 2012)

How long do we have to wait for Android compatibility, like we did for the TiVo app?


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## TishTash (Jan 24, 2008)

Got mine too, works like a charm, and as a bonus, you can stream copy-protected files (i.e., HBO) as well (although you can't download them, natch).

For the rest of you: Now's the perfect excuse to finally get an iPhone or iPad!


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## dugbug (Dec 29, 2003)

TishTash said:


> Got mine too, works like a charm, and as a bonus, you can stream copy-protected files (i.e., HBO) as well (although you can't download them, natch).
> 
> For the rest of you: Now's the perfect excuse to finally get an iPhone or iPad!


can you airplay the tivo stream from your ios device?


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

I don't have an Apple TV so I can't test that. But for streaming to another TV you're probably better off waiting for the Mini. 

Dan


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Aero 1 said:


> are there any plans to up update Tivo Desktop to take advantage of the stream?


Yes this please. Or at least could someone leak details to wmcbrine or moyekj so we can get it unofficially working with PyTiVo and KMTTG.

It does look like a nice little product though.


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

NotNowChief said:


> How long do we have to wait for Android compatibility, like we did for the TiVo app?


Asked a million times already. The best answer we have has been provided just a few posts before yours.


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## dugbug (Dec 29, 2003)

Dan203 said:


> I don't have an Apple TV so I can't test that. But for streaming to another TV you're probably better off waiting for the Mini.
> 
> Dan


Oh I thought that was what this was. The one nice thing about the tivo stream if it airplays is that I can use my apple tv as the front end TV GUI.

So is the Mini the tivo box that steals an encoder from another home unit
-d


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## gsr852 (Aug 19, 2012)

And of course long time Tivo owners/subscribers are left in the dust... I have purchased 3 units since 2001 each had a lifetime subscription. 

Do we have to be penalized if we can't keep putting out money for the latest and greatest? These new features seem software based , so why must loyal customers "pay" because they can't keep paying for new equipment AND a new subcription ($100 discount still equals $399.99)?

I'm sorry to all, I felt the need to vent


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

There is little doubt that the older hardware could not support this functionality. Ever try to move content off of a pre-premiere unit?

Software is obviously updated, but clearly, this is hardware at its finest.


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## gsr852 (Aug 19, 2012)

jrtroo said:


> There is little doubt that the older hardware could not support this functionality. Ever try to move content off of a pre-premiere unit?
> 
> Software is obviously updated, but clearly, this is hardware at its finest.


With all due respect, I "move content" to and from my Tivo series 3 all the time. If I can stream Xfinity content to my apple device, via Xfinity's app (owning hardware that is as old as my Tivo) then I find it hard to believe the same can not be done via Tivo. If Tivo made it more affordable to migrate to new hardware (once again I refer to the cost associated to get "new service" when upgrading Tivo hardware) this would be a non-issue.


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## dugbug (Dec 29, 2003)

Believe the limit is the USB driver. I can however transfer an sd show from a series 2 in faster than real time. Would be nice is streamer could offer this over enet.


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

You are moving three streams of content from your S-3 concurrently? And this is taking place at a pace of a 1hr show in ~20 minutes, so you can fast forward seemlessly? An S-3 cannot output over ethernet that quickly.

Want what you want, that is fine. But, it's not a conspiracy against you. It is hardware moving on.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

dugbug said:


> Oh So is the Mini the tivo box that steals an encoder from another home unit


Yes

Dan


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## Thunderclap (Nov 28, 2005)

While I like the idea of Tivo Stream, the $130 price point is the deal breaker for me. Pass.


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## Royster (May 24, 2002)

No Android == FAIL


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## PTFunk (Feb 24, 2012)

Why does the Tivo Stream require a wired network connection? I thought wireless (especially Wireless N) had enough bandwidth to stream, even in HD. 

Perhaps a pre-configured plug-in wireless adapter (such as Tivo's own adapter that I use with my Premiere) can be used? Or maybe I could connect the Stream into a second wireless router that talks to my main wireless router?


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

It will work if you connect it to a wireless bridge. And if your WiFi network is setup properly it shouldn't have an issue. The problem is that most WiFi networks are not setup properly so people aren't able to achieve optimum bandwidth.
Which will cause issues especially when streaming HD.

Sent from my HTC ReZound using Forum Runner


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## Johncv (Jun 11, 2002)

TiVoStephen said:


> Questions?


Will this work on the iPad Mini?


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## mrizzo80 (Apr 17, 2012)

What percentage of Android devices are running 4.0+ right now? Not many. 

4.0 was the first version to support DRM I think. I doubt Streaming will be enabled on anything less than 4.0. So I think the addressable Android user base is probably pretty small right now.

So TiVo has 2 options: simply say the Android version is not available yet. Or release it now but have it not work on the overwhelming majority of devices and take heat from their users. I think they chose the former.


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## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

gsr852 said:


> And of course long time Tivo owners/subscribers are left in the dust... I have purchased 3 units since 2001 each had a lifetime subscription.
> 
> Do we have to be penalized if we can't keep putting out money for the latest and greatest? These new features seem software based , so why must loyal customers "pay" because they can't keep paying for new equipment AND a new subcription ($100 discount still equals $399.99)?
> 
> I'm sorry to all, I felt the need to vent


And I'm still waiting for my original Droid to get updated to Jelly Bean, like my Galaxy S3 runs.

Oh wait, it won't.

Enough already with the "I need to vent...". It ain't gonna happen. They're not screwing you, they're providing NEW functionality to newer devices. Just like every other electronic manuf in the world.

Remember, they aren't removing any functionality from your older devices. Simply not putting the latest apps on them.

Get over it.


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## dugbug (Dec 29, 2003)

Royster said:


> No Android == FAIL


Hurt feelings?


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## cosmarc (Mar 14, 2002)

I have a wireless N adapter that is going into my Tivo Premiere - using the ethernet connection opening. How will I use this if I need that port for the Tivo Stream device?

Thank you


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## cwoody222 (Nov 13, 1999)

I already have a Slingbox so I don't need this.

But is there a way to transfer shows I download to my PC (Mac) into the newly updated App? Or do I have to transfer the shows the traditional way via iTunes, to the iOS default Video app?


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## Hippster (Nov 28, 2001)

Mine arrived a few hours ago. I plugged it into the network and went to look at my router's DHCP table to make sure it had grabbed an IP address. The MAC address on both the product box and actual device DOES NOT MATCH what grabbed an IP address. I hope there was not a major labeling fiasco at the factory.


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## ronaldheft (Aug 18, 2011)

cosmarc said:


> I have a wireless N adapter that is going into my Tivo Premiere - using the ethernet connection opening. How will I use this if I need that port for the Tivo Stream device?
> 
> Thank you


You don't plug the TiVo Stream into your TiVo, you plug it into your wireless router.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Hippster said:


> Mine arrived a few hours ago. I plugged it into the network and went to look at my router's DHCP table to make sure it had grabbed an IP address. The MAC address on both the product box and actual device DOES NOT MATCH what grabbed an IP address. I hope there was not a major labeling fiasco at the factory.


I had this happen when I first setup mine too. Then I rebooted it and the mac address did match and I never saw the other mac address again. I wonder if it uses some sort of trickery when you're first setting it up and it's communicating with the TiVos?

Dan


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

cosmarc said:


> I have a wireless N adapter that is going into my Tivo Premiere - using the ethernet connection opening. How will I use this if I need that port for the Tivo Stream device?
> 
> Thank you


Plug the stream directly into your router. The TiVo will stream to it via wifi and then it will stream to the iPad via wifi. It's entirely network based so it does not need a physical connection to the TiVo itself. Although with that setup you'll be taxing your wifi network quite a bit so you may only be able to stream one thing at a time rather then the maximum 3.

Dan


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## Hippster (Nov 28, 2001)

Dan203 said:


> I had this happen when I first setup mine too. Then I rebooted it and the mac address did match and I never saw the other mac address again. I wonder if it uses some sort of trickery when you're first setting it up and it's communicating with the TiVos?
> 
> Dan


I just went through setup on my iPhone and it applied software updates and it rebooted... and the MAC address now shows correct on my router. I'm glad I am not the only one who noticed something strange there!


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

I kind of wish I had written it down. It may be something we can exploit to get at the stream via a computer.

Dan


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## westside_guy (Mar 13, 2005)

It seems a little excessive to need a separate box for this. Really this sort of functionality should be built into the Tivo - maybe the next generation will do it.

In any case, I don't intend to incorporate a limited unitask box like this into my home setup. The thing costs more than a Roku box or an Apple TV!


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## dugbug (Dec 29, 2003)

Yeah it is too much $. It does allow you to dl a show for offline play though


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## SullyND (Dec 30, 2004)

westside_guy said:


> It seems a little excessive to need a separate box for this. Really this sort of functionality should be built into the Tivo - maybe the next generation will do it.


Man, TiVo just can't win with some people. Yes, stream is likely to be incorporated into the next generation. Could you imagine the uproar if they added it to the Series4 and required a new box to get that feature?

"Sorry, we know you just bought your XL4/Elite a couple months ago, but if you want to use the Stream feature you'll need a new box". There'd be pitchforks. Even people with 2 year old Premieres would be complaining.

The Stream Box makes perfect sense, and I expect the price to drop at some point in the usual TiVo fashion.


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## jcthorne (Jan 28, 2002)

Anyone that thinks the box is overpriced simply does not understand what the device does. It is not a Roku or apple tv. It has FAR more processing power under the hood to accomplish .h264 for 4 HD streams simultainiously. This may be the first consumer grade device to have anywhere near that level of processing on board. Heck, my quad core i7 laptop cannot do this.


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## windracer (Jan 3, 2003)

cosmarc said:


> I have a wireless N adapter that is going into my Tivo Premiere - using the ethernet connection opening. How will I use this if I need that port for the Tivo Stream device?


The Stream doesn't need to connect to your Premiere (directly), it just needs to connect somewhere on your network (i.e., to your router).

That being said, keep in mind the requirements say:



> A wired Ethernet or MoCA connection between your DVR and home network


_edit:_ oops, didn't see there was a second page to this thread when I replied, sorry.


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## dugbug (Dec 29, 2003)

jcthorne said:


> Anyone that thinks the box is overpriced simply does not understand what the device does. It is not a Roku or apple tv. It has FAR more processing power under the hood to accomplish .h264 for 4 HD streams simultainiously. This may be the first consumer grade device to have anywhere near that level of processing on board. Heck, my quad core i7 laptop cannot do this.


Ok so a 4-stream h.264 encoder asic. A nice feature for four concurrent HD streams. Would not equate that to an i7 'processing power'.

-d


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## Royster (May 24, 2002)

mrizzo80 said:


> What percentage of Android devices are running 4.0+ right now? Not many.
> 
> 4.0 was the first version to support DRM I think. I doubt Streaming will be enabled on anything less than 4.0. So I think the addressable Android user base is probably pretty small right now.


HBO Go and Netflix streaming work on Froyo. But I have 5 ICS or JB devices in my home right now.


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## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

Dan203 said:


> I kind of wish I had written it down. It may be something we can exploit to get at the stream via a computer.


My box is arriving today, so I haven't set it up yet. Exactly where in the process did you see this faux MAC address? I'll try to grab the info in case it's useful to anyone


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## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

I agree with previous posters on the pricing/form. $129 is very fair, given the functionality. 

Do I expect it to be incorporated in at least on box in the Series 5 line? Absolutely. 

If you have an iPad (or really, any tablet - Android support is clearly in the works), this is a terrific addition to your home network.

I bought an iPad about a year and a half ago primarily to use the Tivo ap, so buying this to actually watch programs on it is a no-brainer.

This may be a niche product, but, other than the baffling pre-order campaign "contest", it looks like a home run - which is something Tivo hasn't exactly been able to deliver often.

As soon as this goes below $100 - it's in impulse buy territory for many. I was going to be in on day 1 as long as (a) there was no monthly fee and (b) it was $149 or less. Sold.


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## Hippster (Nov 28, 2001)

jfh3 said:


> My box is arriving today, so I haven't set it up yet. Exactly where in the process did you see this faux MAC address? I'll try to grab the info in case it's useful to anyone


Right after you plug it in and it grabs an IP address.


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## C_A_Jones (Jan 5, 2001)

aaronwt said:


> I still don't understand the TiVo Stream Spotlight video. They say in the video that you can stream to *any* tablet or smart phone connected to your home network. But then in fine print, at the bottom, it says it's only for the iPad, iPhone and the iPod Touch. So why not just say that it's for apple products the Spotlight Video?


Sort of like the time-share come ons to get you in the door. (Those "free" airline tickets evaporates when you read the fine print.) The spotlight video also says "wirelessly," another half-truth.

Wonder why they feel compelled to dance around the truth?


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

They only want to have to produce one video. They can remove the fine print in post after the Android app is released. But it would be much more difficult to reshoot the whole video. 

Dan


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## 241705 (Mar 9, 2010)

Congrats, TiVo. Sounds pretty cool - I'm not on-board right now with more Android than iOS devices in the house, but I will definitely be paying attention to future developments here. The ability to download for off-line playback and choose different file sizes is slick - and would end the need for that painful TiVo Desktop/ file conversion step that I have to go through now.


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## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

The "pseudo" MAC I got was 00:13:74:00:5c:38

Still waiting for the initial software update to finish.

If anyone else gets the same address, maybe someone more clever than I can use that info.


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## Dpordy99 (Nov 7, 2011)

I have a slingbox but this might replace my slingbox. The quality on my Slingbox is awesome however the connection does drop out and it does stutter at times. Another problem with the slingbox is that it is an absolute pain to pull up programs on my DVR and fast forwarding through commercials is kind of a pain as well.

This is a great deal considering a slingbox is double this, plus I had to pay $60 for both apps.

I think I'm going to buy this and if I like it better than the slingbox I will sell my slingbox.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

It's MUCH better then a Slingbox if you only ever use a your Slingbox for local streaming from a TiVo. If you have the Slinbox connected to any other source or use it for remote streaming, then you'll probably need to keep it.

My Slingbox broke a few months ago, and I only ever used it for TiVo anyway, so getting a Stream instead of a new Slingbox was a no brainier for me.*

Dan

* Remote streaming on the Slingbox was a nice feature to have, but I rarely travel and when I do the network connections at the hotels are usually terrible and can't support the Slingbox anyway.


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## mschnebly (Feb 21, 2011)

Call me crazy but I cant see sitting at home streaming a movie to my phone instead of just turning on the TV and watching it on a far bigger screen. What am I missing here?


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

mschnebly said:


> Call me crazy but I cant see sitting at home streaming a movie to my phone instead of just turning on the TV and watching it on a far bigger screen. What am I missing here?


People like to watch TV in parts of the house other then the living room. Like the kitchen while cooking, the bathroom, the backyard, etc... In my case my wife wont let me put a TV in the bedroom but she's OK with me using my iPad on my nightstand to watch TV while I fall asleep. That's my main purpose for buying one.

The side loading is also nice for trips.

Dan


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## Johncv (Jun 11, 2002)

astrohip said:


> And I'm still waiting for my original Droid to get updated to Jelly Bean, like my Galaxy S3 runs.
> 
> Oh wait, it won't.
> 
> ...


This is why people buy the iPhone and/or the iPad because they know it will receive update and support from Apple.


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## nrc (Nov 17, 1999)

jfh3 said:


> The "pseudo" MAC I got was 00:13:74:00:5c:38
> 
> Still waiting for the initial software update to finish.
> 
> If anyone else gets the same address, maybe someone more clever than I can use that info.


That MAC address indicates Atheros hardware. I'm guessing that initially the device comes up with it's actual hardware MAC address and then once the TiVo software is active it presents a TiVo MAC address (00:119:xx:xx:xx).


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## nrc (Nov 17, 1999)

Johncv said:


> This is why people buy the iPhone and/or the iPad because they know it will receive update and support from Apple.


Nonsense. When will IOS6 for the original iPhone or iPhone 3GS be coming out?


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## SullyND (Dec 30, 2004)

nrc said:


> When will IOS6 for the original iPhone or iPhone 3GS be coming out?


iOS6 for the 3GS will be available at the same time as it is available for the 4 and 4s.


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## nrc (Nov 17, 1999)

SullyND said:


> iOS6 for the 3GS will be available at the same time as it is available for the 4 and 4s.


Ok, the 3GS. But not the 3G, original iPhone, original iPad, or anything earlier than a 4th Gen iPod Touch. Some of those devices were still being sold less than two years ago.

The point is that every consumer electronics manufacturer stops providing updates for older hardware at some point, including Apple.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

mschnebly said:


> Call me crazy but I cant see sitting at home streaming a movie to my phone instead of just turning on the TV and watching it on a far bigger screen. What am I missing here?


I don't have a Premiere, but I can imagine getting it (and an iPad!) to use on the treadmill in another room, or for others to use the sideloading functionality to use an iPad *at the gym* to watch their recordings.


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## Dpordy99 (Nov 7, 2011)

WOW! I totally misread this. So this only works in your home wifi network? Yeah I think I and everybody else is better off with the slingbox. 

My slingbox is actually perfect on my home network, it's when I'm in somewhere like a hotel is where it gets dropped connections and stutters on wifi. It doesn't work at all on the airplane wifi.


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## Dpordy99 (Nov 7, 2011)

The more I read about this, the less I want this. So now you can't even transfer copy once shows to your portable device? This basically does the exact same thing as the free Cox cable app, so basically Tivo is catching up with services that other cable companies provide instead of being ahead of the game, the only difference is that many of those cable companies give you this for free whereas Tivo is charging you for it.

And as far as transfering shows go. Probably 95% of the programming on my cox provider is copy protected. I hate to say this but your best bet is to buy a slingbox and then if you want to transfer something try downloading the show off the piratebay.


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## dugbug (Dec 29, 2003)

nrc said:


> Ok, the 3GS. But not the 3G, original iPhone, original iPad, or anything earlier than a 4th Gen iPod Touch. Some of those devices were still being sold less than two years ago.
> 
> The point is that every consumer electronics manufacturer stops providing updates for older hardware at some point, including Apple.


Well it's a dumb point. There is a difference between 5 year support and little to no updates. Everyone with a pulse acknowledges the advantage apple has with supported updates


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

dugbug said:


> Well it's a dumb point. There is a difference between 5 year support and little to no updates. Everyone with a pulse acknowledges the advantage apple has with supported updates


Definitely. Apple is still updating the OS in a 3 year old phone (3GS) in a market with 2 year lifetimes, while some Android phones bought last year aren't getting updates.

Case in point:

2012 is still the year of Gingerbread

It is somewhat comparing apples to oranges (no pun intended) though since it's up to carriers to push out updates to Android, while iOS is pushed out directly from Apple.

In any case, it's likely the Stream app was originally coded for iOS for multiple reasons:
1. The iPad is the tablet with the most users currently.
2. The TiVo iOS app is currently more mature than the Android app so it's likely easier to update that first and then port over to Android.


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## SullyND (Dec 30, 2004)

It does irk me that my iPad which I bought just over a year and a half ago cannot be updated to the new OS.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Dpordy99 said:


> WOW! I totally misread this. So this only works in your home wifi network? Yeah I think I and everybody else is better off with the slingbox.
> 
> My slingbox is actually perfect on my home network, it's when I'm in somewhere like a hotel is where it gets dropped connections and stutters on wifi. It doesn't work at all on the airplane wifi.





Dpordy99 said:


> The more I read about this, the less I want this. So now you can't even transfer copy once shows to your portable device? This basically does the exact same thing as the free Cox cable app, so basically Tivo is catching up with services that other cable companies provide instead of being ahead of the game, the only difference is that many of those cable companies give you this for free whereas Tivo is charging you for it.
> 
> And as far as transfering shows go. Probably 95% of the programming on my cox provider is copy protected. I hate to say this but your best bet is to buy a slingbox and then if you want to transfer something try downloading the show off the piratebay.


You contradict yourself a bit here. Why would you buy a Slingbox if it doesn't work reliably when you're not at home? The main advantage of a Slingbox is it's ability to stream away from home.

I have both and I can tell you that the TiVo Stream works better for home network streaming because there is no lag with the controls like there is with a Slingbox. So if the only advantage to a Slingbox is that it can stream outside the home, and that part doesn't work well, then why would someone want to choose a Slingbox over a Stream?

As for the copy protection thing... It sucks, but TiVo has to play by the cable companies rules. In my area only the premium channels are copy protected so I can transfer almost anything. So for me it has lots of value.

Dan


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## nrc (Nov 17, 1999)

dugbug said:


> Well it's a dumb point. There is a difference between 5 year support and little to no updates. Everyone with a pulse acknowledges the advantage apple has with supported updates


My mistake, I thought the original comment was about TiVo. Yes, in general iOS devices are much more likely to get updates than Android devices. That's the benefit to deal with a relatively small number of high volume devices.


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## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

jfh3 said:


> The "pseudo" MAC I got was 00:13:74:00:5c:38
> 
> Still waiting for the initial software update to finish.
> 
> If anyone else gets the same address, maybe someone more clever than I can use that info.


For all you developers out there, I just tried a new Tivo Stream. Its' initial MAC address is the same - 00:13:74:00:5c:38


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Weird. I wonder why they would all have the same initial MAC? MAC addresses are suppose to be unique. Maybe TiVo uses some sort of MAC filtering on their servers and the devices have to spoof this MAC to gain access?

Dan


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

What do mean by "initial" MAC? You should be able to see the MAC of the Stream by logging into your router and it should be unique.


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## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

moyekj said:


> What do mean by "initial" MAC? You should be able to see the MAC of the Stream by logging into your router and it should be unique.


It is unique after the initial set up of the Stream is complete. But a brand new one first iD's itself with what I called the pseudo MAC. See earlier in this thread for the poster that first noticed this.


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

Dan203 said:


> Weird. I wonder why they would all have the same initial MAC? MAC addresses are suppose to be unique. Maybe TiVo uses some sort of MAC filtering on their servers and the devices have to spoof this MAC to gain access?
> 
> Dan


More than likely it's simply that TiVo forgot to change the default MAC address (which contains a company ID), since the MAC address isn't sent out in TCP/IP packets and never makes its way out over the Internet. The MAC is only available locally (via ARP). The only thing the default MAC would tell you is whose parts/chips TiVo is using.


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## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

morac said:


> More than likely it's simply that TiVo forgot to change the default MAC address (which contains a company ID), since the MAC address isn't sent out in TCP/IP packets and never makes its way out over the Internet. The MAC is only available locally (via ARP). The only thing the default MAC would tell you is whose parts/chips TiVo is using.


Yes, but your theory is far less interesting than the idea the pseudo MAC could somehow be used to gain control over the box.


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## nrc (Nov 17, 1999)

morac said:


> More than likely it's simply that TiVo forgot to change the default MAC address (which contains a company ID), since the MAC address isn't sent out in TCP/IP packets and never makes its way out over the Internet. The MAC is only available locally (via ARP). The only thing the default MAC would tell you is whose parts/chips TiVo is using.


It's probably just the way the network chip works. It presents the chip manufacturer's MAC until the chip firmware is updated with the device manufacturer's MAC. TiVo could have done that in advance but it's not really necessary unless you expect to have multiple Streams going through setup plugged into the same switch at the same time.


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## westside_guy (Mar 13, 2005)

jcthorne said:


> Anyone that thinks the box is overpriced simply does not understand what the device does. It is not a Roku or apple tv. It has FAR more processing power under the hood to accomplish .h264 for 4 HD streams simultainiously. This may be the first consumer grade device to have anywhere near that level of processing on board. Heck, my quad core i7 laptop cannot do this.


I think you are making some unwarranted assumptions regarding what this box does and doesn't do. Reading the small print at the bottom of the Tivo Stream page, it appears the Tivo Premieres are providing the actual streams - this box is essentially just forwarding them.

If (and I say this seriously, not snarkily) you can point me to information showing that I am in error, I would appreciate it. But I don't believe the Tivo Stream box is doing any encoding at all.


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## Aero 1 (Aug 8, 2007)

westside_guy said:


> I think you are making some unwarranted assumptions regarding what this box does and doesn't do. Reading the small print at the bottom of the Tivo Stream page, it appears the Tivo Premieres are providing the actual streams - this box is essentially just forwarding them.
> 
> If (and I say this seriously, not snarkily) you can point me to information showing that I am in error, I would appreciate it. But I don't believe the Tivo Stream box is doing any encoding at all.


You are in error. TiVo records in native 1:1 mpeg 2 from the source, which can be many gigs in size. The iPad and iPhone can't accept or play mpg 2, they need to be .h264. The stream will transcode the mpeg2 to mp4, a native format to the idevice in a more manageable file size without quality loss. The premiere can't do any of this, the hardware is not capable.

TiVo can record mpeg4, I believe only fios has 3 or 4 channels that are mpeg4 but the hundreds others are mpeg2, but TiVo can't convert them locally to mpeg4 in order for them to be streamed to the iPad.

This brings up the question, anyone with fios record an mpeg4 channel and side load it to the iPad via the stream to so how fast it happens.


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## westside_guy (Mar 13, 2005)

Aero 1 said:


> You are in error. TiVo records in native 1:1 mpeg 2 from the source, which can be many gigs in size. The iPad and iPhone can't accept or play mpg 2, they need to be .h264. The stream will transcode the mpeg2 to mp4, a native format to the idevice in a more manageable file size without quality loss. The premiere can't do any of this, the hardware is not capable.


Tivo Premieres have been able to *stream* to other Premieres since a software update that occurred earlier this year. It is unlikely this streaming is being done using MPEG-2.

This streaming is different than the older MRV (multi-room viewing) functionality that's been available since the days of the Series 2. MRV transfers do move MPEG-2 files from one Tivo to another, and are a lot slower.


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## Aero 1 (Aug 8, 2007)

westside_guy said:


> Tivo Premieres have been able to *stream* to other Premieres since a software update that occurred earlier this year. It is unlikely this streaming is being done using MPEG-2.
> 
> This streaming is different than the older MRV (multi-room viewing) functionality that's been available since the days of the Series 2. MRV transfers do move MPEG-2 files from one Tivo to another, and are a lot slower.


why is it unlikey? premiere to premiere streaming is native. it doesnt transcode to anything. an mpeg2 file from one premiere is streamed as mpeg2 to the other. there is no .tivo decryption, mpeg2 transcoding, then immediate streaming.

MRV is a 1 to 1 copy to another premiere, and i can achieve 80+ Mbps MRV.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Yes and H.264 is streamed as H.264 from Premiere to Premiere as well. FiOS had eight H.264 channels in mid May and I think they have added a few more since then. But they are all Sports channels and Spanish channels. I recorded some of the Baseball H.264 channels when they had a free weekend as a test.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Premiere to Premiere streaming is always native because the playback device (i.e. the other Premiere) is always capable of playing the source stream. However the iPad can not play MPEG-2 at all and actually has limits on various aspects of the H.264 encoding so I'm betting that the Stream is used to recode shows even if the source is already H.264. It's just safer, and a lot less complicated, that way. Plus no one would ever really notice the quality difference anyway and it allows TiVo to always control the bitrate of the video so that all shows are consistent in size and bandwidth requirements. 

Trust me I deal with native H.264 streams ALL THE TIME and they are all over the board when it comes to the encoding parameters they use and the vast majority of them will not play on an iPad without recoding.

Dan


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## NotVeryWitty (Oct 3, 2003)

westside_guy said:


> I think you are making some unwarranted assumptions regarding what this box does and doesn't do. Reading the small print at the bottom of the Tivo Stream page, it appears the Tivo Premieres are providing the actual streams - this box is essentially just forwarding them.
> 
> If (and I say this seriously, not snarkily) you can point me to information showing that I am in error, I would appreciate it. But I don't believe the Tivo Stream box is doing any encoding at all.


You're the one who is making unwarranted assumptions.

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-rele...o-revolutionize-multiroom-dvrs-168753786.html

"Zenverge, a leading developer of advanced content networking ICs, today announced that its ZN200 quad HD content networking SOC powers the TiVo® Stream, a sophisticated transcoding platform that connects TiVo Premiere multiroom digital video recorders (DVRs) with other IP-connected devices. Relying on the ZN200's powerful multistream networked transcoding technology, TiVo Stream enables television viewers owning a TiVo Premiere DVR to stream and download high-quality live and recorded content simultaneously to multiple wireless devices on the home network."


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

westside_guy said:


> I think you are making some unwarranted assumptions regarding what this box does and doesn't do. Reading the small print at the bottom of the Tivo Stream page, it appears the Tivo Premieres are providing the actual streams - this box is essentially just forwarding them.


It doesn't just forward them it also recodes them to H.264. iPads can;t play MPEG-2 video natively and the CPU isn't fast enough to decode HD MPEG-2 in realtime. However the iPad has a hardware based H.264 decoder. So what the Stream does is it intercepts the MPEG-2 stream from the TiVo, resamples and recodes it to H.264, then passes that along to the iPad. This is why it supports a maximum of 4 streams at once, because the chip being used in the Stream can only recode 4 streams at a time.

Now I say "only 4 streams" but in reality that is very, very, impressive. A top of the line i7 PC couldn't record 4 HD streams from MPEG-2 to H.264 in real time. The chip being used in the Stream is state of the art.

Dan


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

morac said:


> Definitely. Apple is still updating the OS in a 3 year old phone (3GS) in a market with 2 year lifetimes, while some Android phones bought last year aren't getting updates.


About the only thing I know about Android phones is what I see in the CNET videos my Tivo downloads.. But even there, there are still lots of phones NOT running Gingerbread.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

morac said:


> More than likely it's simply that TiVo forgot to change the default MAC address (which contains a company ID), since the MAC address isn't sent out in TCP/IP packets and never makes its way out over the Internet. The MAC is only available locally (via ARP). The only thing the default MAC would tell you is whose parts/chips TiVo is using.


Tangential question. Can you explain how WiFi router MAC spoofing works then?

Does the spoofer have to be listening in on traffic between a 'real' device and the router to get the MAC to spoof, or can it somehow figure out what MACs are allowed otherwise?


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

mattack said:


> Tangential question. Can you explain how WiFi router MAC spoofing works then?
> 
> Does the spoofer have to be listening in on traffic between a 'real' device and the router to get the MAC to spoof, or can it somehow figure out what MACs are allowed otherwise?


I'm not exactly sure what you are asking, but I'm assuming you are asking how someone can figure out what MAC addresses are allowed to access a wireless router (I.e. MAC address filtering) and spoof an allowed MAC.

All wireless (802.11) packets contain the source and destination MAC addresses in the clear; even if wireless encryption is used. Someone just needs to be close enough to "overhear" the transmissions. This is all passive and the 'real' device and router never talk to the sniffer. There are programs which can do this automatically assuming the wireless card can be put into promiscuous mode. That's the reason why MAC filtering is pointless and why at least WPA2 AES encryption (with a long random key) should always be used since even with a spoofed MAC, the spoofer would need the encryption key. Also turn off WPS since it can be used to quickly "crack" the encryption key do to a flaw in the algorithm.


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## DocNo (Oct 10, 2001)

nrc said:


> Yes, in general iOS devices are much more likely to get updates than Android devices. That's the benefit to deal with a relatively small number of high volume devices.


It's also a benefit in dealing with a company where YOU are the customer, not the cell phone companies. They are incintivized to continually make the experience as good as possible to EVERYONE, not just the new people signing up or renewing to get a phone. I have a less than three month old brand new work-issued Android phone and it's three OS versions behind. It *MIGHT* get some version of 4, but who knows. And it's from Motorola, which I'm pretty sure Google purchased recently... go figure.


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## DocNo (Oct 10, 2001)

westside_guy said:


> If (and I say this seriously, not snarkily) you can point me to information showing that I am in error, I would appreciate it. But I don't believe the Tivo Stream box is doing any encoding at all.


Well, I think the already expressed empirical evidence that the fan gets louder, it heats up and also uses more power would imply there is _something_ going on in there...


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## DocNo (Oct 10, 2001)

Dan203 said:


> Trust me I deal with native H.264 streams ALL THE TIME and they are all over the board when it comes to the encoding parameters they use and the vast majority of them will not play on an iPad without recoding.


Bingo.

If talk of bit rates and concepts like VBR make your head hurt when discussing or thinking about MP3's, then do yourself a favor and don't get anywhere near video codecs - "black art" doesn't even touch it!


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## DocNo (Oct 10, 2001)

mattack said:


> Does the spoofer have to be listening in on traffic between a 'real' device and the router to get the MAC to spoof


That's how all MAC spoofing works. Obviously this is much harder to do on a wired network than a wireless one - with wireless you just have to be close enough to "hear" the devices talking.

It's also why things like hiding SSIDs and MAC filtering are completely useless - MAC filtering on wireless in particular. Strong encryption, like morac pointed out, is the ONLY solution for "secure wireless". Anything less than WPA2 personal is just asking for trouble.


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## Finalrinse (Jan 13, 2005)

I really want one of these, but not sure if I will use it much, but still want one! Is this normal?


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## Johncv (Jun 11, 2002)

Finalrinse said:


> I really want one of these, but not sure if I will use it much, but still want one! Is this normal?


Do you have an iPad? You want one also.


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## Finalrinse (Jan 13, 2005)

Johncv said:


> Do you have an iPad? You want one also.


Yes, I have an iPad 3 and two Premiers with one being a new 4-tuner model. So I know I'm a prime candidate for a Stream. The problem is I have three HD TV's (Living room, Computer room, and master Bedroom), so I'm trying to understand where I might use my iPad in my home to watch TV or even if I want to. I may get use out of it to download though. I'm either going to talk myself into it or out of it?


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

I could have used a stream on Sunday, if it would have worked with Android. I watched the first half of the Redskins game on an HDTV, but at halftime I started playing some Modern Warfare 3. So I was streaming the game on my Kindle Fire from my Hava HD connected to my Premiere. That way I could see what was going on with the football game while playing MW3. Using the Stream would have been better.


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## NotVeryWitty (Oct 3, 2003)

aaronwt said:


> I could have used a stream on Sunday, if it would have worked with Android.


Hey Aaron, we get it, you want it on your beloved Android. You've only brought this up about a thousand times now.

Patience, Grasshopper, it's coming...


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Finalrinse said:


> Yes, I have an iPad 3 and two Premiers with one being a new 4-tuner model. So I know I'm a prime candidate for a Stream. The problem is I have three HD TV's (Living room, Computer room, and master Bedroom), so I'm trying to understand where I might use my iPad in my home to watch TV or even if I want to. I may get use out of it to download though. I'm either going to talk myself into it or out of it?


Bathroom? 

Be ware that the downloading only works on non-copyprotected channels. So if you have one of those canble comapnies that protects everything then the downloading wont be much use. Mine only protects premium channels so I can download most things, but others protect everything except the locals so they can't download much of anything.

Dan


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## Finalrinse (Jan 13, 2005)

Dan203 said:


> Bathroom?
> 
> Be ware that the downloading only works on non-copyprotected channels. So if you have one of those canble comapnies that protects everything then the downloading wont be much use. Mine only protects premium channels so I can download most things, but others protect everything except the locals so they can't download much of anything.
> 
> Dan


I wouldn't hesitate a minute if movies were not protected but they are. I'm with Comcast, there's quite a bit that is not protected but it seems most movies are for sure, at least that is what I have come across from trying to transfer from one Premier to another. But, still considering a Strem or a $98 Vulkano Flow for the addition of out of network use.


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## HenryFarpolo (Dec 1, 2008)

Finalrinse said:


> I really want one of these, but not sure if I will use it much, but still want one! Is this normal?


Perfectly!!


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## overFEDEXed (Nov 11, 2002)

Dan,

I have a Premiere in my Master Bathroom. Or should I say my wife does.
She watches Big Brother while she gets ready for work.

Anyway, It will SOON be replaced with a Mini.

Come on Mini, come on.


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## tlc (May 30, 2002)

TiVoStephen said:


> I'll just quote from the support article (http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/2405/kw/stream): "*At this time*, the TiVo Stream does not support Android and other mobile devices."
> 
> I accidentally bolded the first three words but I cannot disclose why. I wish I could put in something definitive here, but for now, this is for iOS devices only.


Any non-comments on the possibility of streaming outside the house someday?

Will the API to request streams be open?


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## nrc (Nov 17, 1999)

Interesting, email promo says "Due to overwhelming response quantities are limited." Sounds like they underestimated their first production run.


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## tomm1079 (May 10, 2005)

aaronwt said:


> I could have used a stream on Sunday, if it would have worked with Android. I watched the first half of the Redskins game on an HDTV, but at halftime I started playing some Modern Warfare 3. So I was streaming the game on my Kindle Fire from my Hava HD connected to my Premiere. That way I could see what was going on with the football game while playing MW3. Using the Stream would have been better.


its funny you say that. I only bought this so i can play video games and watch tv at same time.

or on sunday to stream red zone to the ipad


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## Johncv (Jun 11, 2002)

overFEDEXed said:


> Dan,
> 
> I have a Premiere in my Master Bathroom. Or should I say my wife does.
> She watches Big Brother while she gets ready for work.
> ...


Who have a TV in the Bathroom? You people have too much money, I am currently accepting donations.


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## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

Johncv said:


> Who have a TV in the Bathroom? You people have too much money, I am currently accepting donations.


In fairness, he said he had a Premiere in the master bathroom, not a TV.


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## Finalrinse (Jan 13, 2005)

Finalrinse said:


> I wouldn't hesitate a minute if movies were not protected but they are. I'm with Comcast, there's quite a bit that is not protected but it seems most movies are for sure, at least that is what I have come across from trying to transfer from one Premier to another. But, still considering a Strem or a $98 Vulkano Flow for the addition of out of network use.


I ordered a "Vulkano Flow" for $98 from Amazon and will get it today. The app is $12.99 for iPad/iPod/iPhone. I know it is not a direct replacement for the Stream, but I'm looking to gain access to my TiVo away from home so hope this will serve dual purpose. I will report back with how well it works if anyone is interested.


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## dugbug (Dec 29, 2003)

Finalrinse said:


> I ordered a "Vulkano Flow" for $98 from Amazon and will get it today. The app is $12.99 for iPad/iPod/iPhone. I know it is not a direct replacement for the Stream, but I'm looking to gain access to my TiVo away from home so hope this will serve dual purpose. I will report back with how well it works if anyone is interested.


How does the vulkano know whats on the tivo or are you just going to use it as a remote control looking at the live display streamed?

The tivo stream box has several advantages and one disadvangate that pisses me off:
1. It is like random access streaming: integrated into the tivo app browsing in-app the contents of your tivos.
2. Does not take over your tivo

And the thing that irks me
3. No airplay (according to reports). You HAVE to watch the tivo show on the device. No external display via airplay.

Since the tivo mini (according to reports) won't support my 2-tuner premier the stream looked to be a good way to make up for watching tivo content in an adjacent room sans another tivo and more cable card crap, etc. Maybe 2 tuner premiers will drop in price and Ill just get one as analog cable/multi-room viewer (wonder about subscription costs too).

-d


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## Finalrinse (Jan 13, 2005)

dugbug said:


> How does the vulkano know whats on the tivo or are you just going to use it as a remote control looking at the live display streamed?
> -d


The component output of the TiVo is plugged into the Flow, you tell the Flow what type of STB you have and in my case a Premier TiVo. The Flow even has a look alike onscreen TiVo remote for the PC software application. I only have a few hours of use. First use was with my PC, and it worked very good, I could go full screen on my 30" Dell 2550 x 1600 and what ever scaling it was doing it looked very good with no hickups or stutters. Next use was with my iPad 3 in my home, it also looked very good with no problems, even full screen. Then I took my wife to Kohl's shopping, I sat in the car and watched live TV, changed channels etc... It worked well on the normal video setting which produced a smaller window on the iPad. If I went full screen it looked not so good. There's a bit of a lag going through the TiVo menu and changing channels using remotely but I think that is expected. I was able to access all the TiVo menu items, My Shows, etc... They also have their own TV Guide that is downloaded so that works quicker if you choose to use that. So far quite pleased. If you want to watch the Flow on another TV, say in a vacation home you need to buy another Vulkano box, either a Lava or Blast. Again, not a direct replacement for the Stream just something different.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Finalrinse said:


> I wouldn't hesitate a minute if movies were not protected but they are.


You realize you can stream anything right? Even protected content. You just can't side load the protected stuff.

Also the advantage to the Stream, compared to the Slingbox or Vulkano is that it does not tie up the TiVo. So someone can be watching a show on the TiVo via the TV and you can watch a different show on the iPad.

Dan


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## tomhorsley (Jul 22, 2010)

I don't suppose there are any plans for a Windows streaming client?


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

That would be nice. I'd like to see an updated TiVo Desktop that can talk to the Stream. Or at the very least a Windows 8 metro app.

Dan


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## Finalrinse (Jan 13, 2005)

Dan203 said:


> You realize you can stream anything right? Even protected content. You just can't side load the protected stuff.
> 
> Also the advantage to the Stream, compared to the Slingbox or Vulkano is that it does not tie up the TiVo. So someone can be watching a show on the TiVo via the TV and you can watch a different show on the iPad.
> 
> Dan


Dan- If I rent a movie from Amazon Prime on one of my Premiers can I stream it from the Stream. I know I can't from my other Premier, it has the red circle and line through it only allowing to watch it from the Premier it was rented on. If you can stream it from the Stream this is great?

I am not worried about tying up one of my Tivos with a Vulkano as I have my own, but I know this is not the case for most people.

Thanks,
Tom


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## ShayL (Jul 18, 2007)

Dan203 said:


> Also the advantage to the Stream, compared to the Slingbox or Vulkano is that it does not tie up the TiVo. So someone can be watching a show on the TiVo via the TV and you can watch a different show on the iPad.
> Dan


I would like to add to what Dan is saying which I completely agree with. You are not relying on the IR blaster and the imho quirky slingplayer controls.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Finalrinse said:


> Dan- If I rent a movie from Amazon Prime on one of my Premiers can I stream it from the Stream. I know I can't from my other Premier, it has the red circle and line through it only allowing to watch it from the Premier it was rented on. If you can stream it from the Stream this is great?


No Amazon movies can not be streamed, but you can get those directly on your iPad using the Amazon app so why would you need to?

However all recorded content can be streamed. That includes movies from HBO, etc... that are normally protected from transferring.

Dan


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## Finalrinse (Jan 13, 2005)

Dan203 said:


> No Amazon movies can not be streamed, but you can get those directly on your iPad using the Amazon app so why would you need to?
> 
> However all recorded content can be streamed. That includes movies from HBO, etc... that are normally protected from transferring.
> 
> Dan


Well, my wife rents movies on the premier 4 in the main living room and sometimes it would be nice to watch them on the other Premier or the iPad without renting them again.

The other part is good though.

Thanks,
Tom


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## Finalrinse (Jan 13, 2005)

ShayL said:


> I would like to add to what Dan is saying which I completely agree with. You are not relying on the IR blaster and the imho quirky slingplayer controls.


I agree about the Slingplayer, the Vulkano seems to work really nice though. I will probably buy a Stream too, I like all this stuff!


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Finalrinse said:


> Well, my wife rents movies on the premier 4 in the main living room and sometimes it would be nice to watch them on the other Premier or the iPad without renting them again.
> 
> The other part is good though.
> 
> ...


I don't think you'd have to rent them again. I think you can go to you Amazon account and just tell it to download to another TiVo. And for the iPad I think it's streamed, not downloaded, so that should be instant.

That being said it would be nice if they'd allow streaming of Amazon downloads.

Dan


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

If it's a rental, you only get a short viewing period. If it's a purchase(like a TV episode since I think all TV episodes are still purchases). Then you can always go back and have it downloaded to another TiVo. As long as you haven't reached your limit of the types of devices it can be on. Then you need to delete a copy of a device to be able to put it on another one.
And of course those titles that are purchased can be streamed to the devices that are capable of streaming. At least it seems like all my TV episode purchases over the last four years show up to stream on my Kindle Fire HD and other Amazon streaming devices.


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## b_scott (Nov 27, 2006)

I don't understand why you need a new box to stream - Tivo is already networked, and I can stream data off my NAS without a different box.

I thought this was going to be like the streaming only Moxi boxes, the smaller ones you'd buy for each room to stream off the original box. This just seems like a money grab to me.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

b_scott said:


> I don't understand why you need a new box to stream - Tivo is already networked, and I can stream data off my NAS without a different box.
> 
> I thought this was going to be like the streaming only Moxi boxes, the smaller ones you'd buy for each room to stream off the original box. This just seems like a money grab to me.


As it has already been covered multiple times, iPads don't support Mpeg2 so it has to be transcoded into a format that the iPad supports.

The TiVo's version of the Moxi box is called the Mini and is coming soon.


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## ShayL (Jul 18, 2007)

b_scott said:


> I don't understand why you need a new box to stream - Tivo is already networked, and I can stream data off my NAS without a different box.
> 
> I thought this was going to be like the streaming only Moxi boxes, the smaller ones you'd buy for each room to stream off the original box. This just seems like a money grab to me.


The TiVo equivalent to moxi mate will the TiVo Mini. The stream is just to stream to iphone or iPad currently. It also supports downloading directly to the ios app if the content is not marked copy protected so you take the content outside of your home.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

b_scott said:


> I don't understand why you need a new box to stream - Tivo is already networked, and I can stream data off my NAS without a different box.
> 
> I thought this was going to be like the streaming only Moxi boxes, the smaller ones you'd buy for each room to stream off the original box. This just seems like a money grab to me.


TiVos record in MPEG-2 and iPads, and most portable devices, can only play MPEG-4 video. The Stream sits in the middle and transcodes.

Dan


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Did anyone find out if there was any issue with the MPEG4 recordings being sent to the Stream from the TiVo? Since some channels are in MPEG4 errr H.264. Depending on your provider.

Sent from my HTC ReZound using Forum Runner


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

aaronwt said:


> Since some channels are in MPEG4 errr H.264


 I know that was directed at me. I used MPEG-4 in my post because most mobile devices are capable of playing both MPEG-4 part 2 and MPEG-4 part 10 (aka H.264, aka AVC) MPEG-4 was used as a blanket term to encompass both standards. 

Dan


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## daroach74 (May 8, 2007)

This question may have been asked (I searched first, honestly!), but I couldn't find an answer. Here's my question - is this able to stream copy protected shows (like those from premium channels)? It sounds like there are two functions here: streaming and offline viewing. I'd assume that you couldn't offline view for the copy protected shows (which, in my view, is short sighted, but that's another issue), but I was wondering if you could nonetheless still stream copy protected shows (like the current premiere to premiere streaming).

Derek


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

daroach74 said:


> This question may have been asked (I searched first, honestly!), but I couldn't find an answer. Here's my question - is this able to stream copy protected shows (like those from premium channels)? It sounds like there are two functions here: streaming and offline viewing. I'd assume that you couldn't offline view for the copy protected shows (which, in my view, is short sighted, but that's another issue), but I was wondering if you could nonetheless still stream copy protected shows (like the current premiere to premiere streaming).
> 
> Derek


It works just like the Premiere to Premiere. Copy protected content can be streamed but not downloaded or transferred. Copy freely content can be streamed or downloaded.


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## b_scott (Nov 27, 2006)

innocentfreak said:


> As it has already been covered multiple times, iPads don't support Mpeg2 so it has to be transcoded into a format that the iPad supports.
> 
> The TiVo's version of the Moxi box is called the Mini and is coming soon.





ShayL said:


> The TiVo equivalent to moxi mate will the TiVo Mini. The stream is just to stream to iphone or iPad currently. It also supports downloading directly to the ios app if the content is not marked copy protected so you take the content outside of your home.





Dan203 said:


> TiVos record in MPEG-2 and iPads, and most portable devices, can only play MPEG-4 video. The Stream sits in the middle and transcodes.
> 
> Dan


Thanks. I didn't see anything about the Mini in any tech news or on the Tivo site, and I hadn't been scanning threads here. I don't see why the Tivo itself can't transcode, with it being a powerful machine, but whatever. The mini might be useful if I didn't already have two Tivos for two TVs.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

b_scott said:


> I don't see why the Tivo itself can't transcode, with it being a powerful machine, but whatever.


that's the thing, it's NOT a powerful machine. It's barely got enough processing power to run it's own UI let alone transcode video. However the TiVo CEO mentioned that a future version of the TiVo would have this capability built in.

Dan


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Dan203 said:


> that's the thing, it's NOT a powerful machine. It's barely got enough processing power to run it's own UI let alone transcode video. However the TiVo CEO mentioned that a future version of the TiVo would have this capability built in.
> 
> Dan


Hopefully it will be a six tuner TiVo and hopefully it will also be available for retail purchase.

Of course I'm still hoping Android support comes out sooner rather than later for the Stream as well.


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

I hope TiVo thinks ahead next time and uses an 8 core processor.


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

The more powerful you make the the TiVo the more energy it needs to draw. Everything is a trade off...

But, I do think a single box with 6 or more tuners and a number of Mini extenders is the way to go.


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

bradleys said:


> The more powerful you make the the TiVo the more energy it needs to draw. Everything is a trade off...


That depends on how they design it. Modern chips which can go into a low power state when processing power isn't needed and then ramp up as needed. The big issue I would think is heat. From what I've read, the Stream gets quite hot. Put the same functionality inside the TiVo and you may have cooling issues.


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## SullyND (Dec 30, 2004)

bradleys said:


> The more powerful you make the the TiVo the more energy it needs to draw. Everything is a trade off...


For the most part, as TiVos have gotten more powerful, they have become more efficient.


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## Johncv (Jun 11, 2002)

aaronwt said:


> Hopefully it will be a six tuner TiVo and hopefully it will also be available for retail purchase.
> 
> Of course I'm still hoping Android support comes out sooner rather than later for the Stream as well.


TiVo will not release a six turner DVR because the tuning adapter cannot support it. I just hate the f**king TA, whenever there is an Emergency Broadcast Alert it f**k up the TiVo.


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## SullyND (Dec 30, 2004)

Most people do not have tuning adapters. Some TAs do support 6 tuners. MSOs, who are becoming more and more a part of TiVos customer base, do not have to worry about TAs. (TiVo has shown a 6 tuner DVR for MSOs).

Can you hang more than one TA off a TiVo?


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

bradleys said:


> The more powerful you make the the TiVo the more energy it needs to draw. Everything is a trade off...
> 
> But, I do think a single box with 6 or more tuners and a number of Mini extenders is the way to go.


For cable use it needs to stay at six. Once you exceed six tuners, then you need a second cable card.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

morac said:


> That depends on how they design it. Modern chips which can go into a low power state when processing power isn't needed and then ramp up as needed. The big issue I would think is heat. From what I've read, the Stream gets quite hot. Put the same functionality inside the TiVo and you may have cooling issues.


I would think you wouldn't have any cooling issues by having it in a larger box with a larger fan and more airflow. The stream is in very small enclosure and has a very small fan. Which is why it would be getting hot. With more space to dissipate the heat and more airflow, cooling should not be an issue.


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

aaronwt said:


> I would think you wouldn't have any cooling issues by having it in a larger box with a larger fan and more airflow. The stream is in very small enclosure and has a very small fan. Which is why it would be getting hot. With more space to dissipate the heat and more airflow, cooling should not be an issue.


True, if all you had was the stream hardware in a larger box. I was actually talking about putting an overall more powerful processor in a TiVo box.

The Premiere has a dual core 400MHZ processor. Throw in a 3 GHz quad core or something and see how well the current fan works. 

Any way if TiVo used a CPU that supported dynamic frequency scaling, then it could run in low power mode for normal DVR functionality and then step up when transcoding. That way they could have a "green" DVR that also supports real time transcoding.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

There is no need to put a 3GHz quad core processor in a TiVo. A modest bump in clock speed and bump down in manufacturing process will pay huge dividends on a device like a TiVo. All the hard stuff, like recording, is done via specialized chips that don't need to be 3GHz to do their job. x86 chips need super high frequencies for better processing because they are mulch-purpose chips designed to do a lot of different things. With specialized chips designed specifically for one task you can be much, much, more efficient.

Dan


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

I wasn't serious putting a 3 Ghz chip in the TiVo (hence the smiley), it was just an example.


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