# Bright House Central FL now SDV?



## joelkfla

BHN Central FL added a bunch of new HD channels (Discovery, Nat Geo, et al) and 2 new digital channels today, but they don't work with cablecards. Also, several old HD channels in the same channel range (Food and HGTV) no longer work. I called customer service, and after 15 minutes or so of research she said "No new HD channels will work with cablecards." She did not know about SDV, and there is no mention on their website of SDV or of any channels not working with cablecards (other than on demand), so I don't know whether they are actually on SDV or just blocked.

She made an interesting offer: they would trade my cablecard for a bare-bones digital box that "works like a cablecard"! She said it would have no remote control and no Navigator, but would be "controlled by my TV's remote." I tried to get more details, but she was not technical and could not tell me how it would work, but she said it would _not _work with a TiVo.

So it seems BHN CFL is actively trying to get their customers off of cablecards, and basically sticking it to TiVo users.


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## TiVoToo

Post on AVS Forum indicates that BHN CFL has made unannounced transition to SDV in order to provide all of the 50+ HD channels to be added during next 18 months. Don't it make you feel good that next month you will pay more for fewer channels than you had yesterday?
Crossing fingers that the USB dongle that will provide compatibility with HD/S3 TiVos will arrive quickly.


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## bigdave2004

TiVoToo said:


> Crossing fingers that the USB dongle that will provide compatibility with HD/S3 TiVos will arrive quickly.


It would be in TiVo's best interest to get this out to us ASAP because it will start to make customers think twice about TiVo. I _JUST_ got my TiVo HD and I was looking forward to these new channels and now this  will I switch back to the cable co dvr, no, but it still sucks for them to do this.


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## windracer

Hrm ... I wonder how long until BHN over here in the Tampa area does the same thing.  :down:

For now, I still receive those new HD channels on my S3 and THD.


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## bigdave2004

Wow, I'm really upset about this and I don't know who to be upset at. Am I mad at brighthouse for switching to SDV without telling anyone and breaking my new TivoHD or am I mad at TiVO for not seeing this sooner and releasing the dongle so I can see these new channels. I guess its a little of both. TiVo's record of CES thing isn't good, we saw the S3 in January and it didn't ship until how many months later..... Is there a beta program for the SDV dongle, I would rather deal with TiVo than brighthouse if its possible.


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## jsnow789

For what its worth, the CSR at BHN I just spoke to was happy to lodge a formal complaint. I think everyone should do it. I also think you should send an email to our buddy Kevin Martin with the FCC and complain about BHN. You can reach him at [email protected]

eta: You can also email Greg Dawson at the Orlando Sentinel, he is the consumer reporter.


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## cavalier

Oh son of a bleepity bleep!

Yep, just got off the phone with CSR at BHN. She found a memo that said essentially "BHN will be rolling out lots of new HD channels this year.... to do that we are using fantastic new SDV technology".. she stopped reading when I started groaning at SDV 

I've lost Alton Brown in HD! The Mrs. has lost her HGTV HD fix! 

Crappity crap crap!

Come on TiVo.. give me some SDV goodness, because your box won't let me just direct a cable box like I've done since forever...


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## eabu

Yes, the channel lineup changes went into effect Feb 1, 2008 for Bright House, Central Florida. As for the speculation its about SDV, why is Tampa getting a change in channel lineup but retaining compatibility with cablecards??



windracer said:


> Hrm ... I wonder how long until BHN over here in the Tampa area does the same thing.  :down:
> 
> For now, I still receive those new HD channels on my S3 and THD.


Bright House Central Florida
Added HD Channels: Animal Planet HD, TLC HD, Discover Channel HD, Sci HD, National Geographic HD
Bad News: None of the new HD channels work on cablecards
Even Worse News: Food Network HD, AETV HD, History HD, HGTV HD have been removed from the cablecard lineup

Now only TNT HD, TBS HD, ESPN1 HD, ESPN2 HD, and Discovery HDT can be viewed on cablecards.

Can't do much with HD TiVo's any more, and we just bought a Series 3 for Christmas. This is looking like a bad investment.


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## Okeemike

Thanks to BigDave for clueing me in on this. I hadn't realized that we actually LOST functionality.

A quick search turned up this article which says the dongles will be ready in Q2 08. Not sure if it can be believed, but it is a ray of hope.

Another potential workaround is to go to pure IP, and push content to the TiVo once the new TTG desktop is released (in March, right?).


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## eitingon

In Orlando here. Same issues as the others.

CSR: I just checked and those new channels do not work with cable cards.
Me: Can I talk to somebody to find out why
CSR: They are just going to tell you the same thing
Me: OK - still want to talk to somebody
CSR: Found a memo - new technology, sdv, blah blah blah

The only ray of hope was that the memo said the new channels are not compatible with cable cards AT THIS TIME...

Perhaps this is a hint of the dongle to come?


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## Okeemike

eitingon said:


> Perhaps this is a hint of the dongle to come?


Your statement brings a question to my mind... is the dongle seperate from BHN, and just a 'plug and play' thing, or is it another piece of equipment that will need a tech to come out and install (we know how efficient that process can be).

I'm guessing that it requires a visit, as it would need to be addressable, but then again, I have absolutely no idea what I'm talking about (as per normal).


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## HerronScott

eabu said:


> Added HD Channels: Animal Planet HD, TLC HD, Discover Channel HD, Sci HD, National Geographic HD
> Bad News: None of the new HD channels work on cablecards
> Even Worse News: Food Network HD, AETV HD, History HD, HGTV HD have been removed from the cablecard lineup
> 
> Now only TNT HD, TBS HD, ESPN1 HD, ESPN2 HD, and Discovery HDT can be viewed on cablecards.


Comcast recently added 14 new HD channels in our area (A&E, National Geographic, HGTV, Food Network, TBS, CNN, USA, Sci-Fi, The History Channel, Discovery Channel, TLC, Animal Planet, Comcast Sportsnet and Versus-Golf Channel), but unlike Brighthouse they were all done without SDV. This is in addition to the 17 channels that were already HD.

I'm curious if Brighthouse is doing this because the system there is not built out to 750MHz or if they offer more programming which requires greater bandwidth? I just checked the lineups on-line and don't see a huge difference in the line-ups.

Obviously, I'm hoping that Comcast doesn't go to SDV in our area anytime soon.

Scott


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## jsnow789

The SciFi channel was dropped totally.

Everyone impacted by this should lodge complaints.

You should also complain to the Florida State Public Services Commission HERE!


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## TiVoToo

jsnow789 said:


> The SciFi channel was dropped totally.
> 
> Everyone impacted by this should lodge complaints.
> 
> You should also complain to the Florida State Public Services Commission HERE!


You will get SciFi channel back as soon as your TiVo calls in. I filed a Lineup form with TiVo last night when I noticed that SciFi had not be moved to 69, just deleted. Got a response from one of their agents almost immediately which stated that they had been made aware of problem, and had made update to add SciFi to 69. I would get update next time the TiVo called in. I forced a connection, and sure enough, SciFi was added. So, this may not have been a BHN problem assuming BHN provided correct data.


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## TiVoToo

Saturday, February 2, 2008

Dear [TiVoToo],

Thank you for your correspondence regarding your Bright House Networks service. We apologize that you are no longer able to receive HD channels through your TiVo device. While we do support the cable cards that we have provided you, we do not support the TiVo device itself and are unable to provide support for it. If you would like to continue using the HD service, we advise using the Cable Card directly in the television or obtaining one of our HD cable boxes so you can receive all of the channels and use our two-way functionality such as On Demand content. If you have any additional questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact us via email. Thank you for taking the time to write to us and have a good day.

Sincerely,

Jonathan - 3976 
Electronic Support Specialist

The Bright House Networks Customer Care Team

Central Florida Division

**************************************************************** 
Original Message Follows: ------------------------

REQUEST INFORMATION 
Subject: Provide Feedback to Bright House Networks 
Category: Concern - Complaint 
Submission Date: 2/1/2008 9:32:58 PM 
Description: 
I want to voice my dissatisfaction with the recent lineup change. I own a TiVo Series 3 DVR. I subscribed to your digital tier specifically for the availability of HD content that could be watched and recorded on this DVR. Because of the unannounced switch to SDV (with which the CableCards in my TiVo are not compatible), I now not only cannot receive the new additions to the HD lineup, I can no longer receive some HD channels that I received yesterday. I'm really not happy that I will be paying more next month for fewer channels than I had yesterday! If I'm going to get less, I think I should be paying less.

CUSTOMER INFORMATION 
Customer Name: [TiVoToo]


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## notnow117

I complained to Bright House about the SDV issue, and the response I received didn't seem accurate. They told me that alot of cable providers are using SDV and it works fine with cable cards, and that problem was actually with the TiVo. I was under the impression there were no cablecard 2.0 devices, and that every cable card device would have these problems. Also, they didn't acknowledge my primary complaint, which was that they made these changes without any notice. The cable card FAQ on their website still doesn't mention SDV or the inability to receive certain HD channels.


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## therlin

I just got this email from BHN:



> Thank you for your correspondence regarding your Bright House Networks service. We apologize but the problem can not be corrected by sending signals. The CableCARD will receive the signal fine but the TiVO is probably not recognizing the SDV (Switched Digital Video). TiVO plans to correct this with an update with a USB dongle from this article http://www.news.com/8301-10784_3-9823095-7.html . Bright House Networks does not support any third party manufacturers concerning your internet or cable services. Due to liability reasons, we cannot support any equipment or software that we do not provide. Please call the equipment or software manufacturer for support. If you have any additional questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact us via email. Thank you for taking the time to write to us and have a wonderful day.


So what I am understanding is that we need some USB dongle that won't be out for a few more months? So basically I'm being forced to give up my tivo for those months and go to one of their DVRs. That's infuriating.


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## notnow117

i was trying to convince them to give me an HD DVR for free until the dongle came out, but i didn't have any luck


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## eabu

Good try, notnow117. If you get something, deal me in.

With TiVO's favorable court decision in its patent lawsuit against Dish Network's DVR, maybe TiVo can get rid of all the cable companies proprietary DVRs. Would cable companies then care about and SDV USB dongles? I still don't understand why hard wire cable companies are monopolies in each region.


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## rickmeoff

just spoke with "lucas" at tivo, asking about when tivo might have a possible solution for this. he seemed very unconcerned, and said that theyre 'currently working on something and hope to have it available by this spring.' said there was no guarantee that it would be ready by then.

to say the least, he wasnt very reassuring. we have a brand new tivohd, and ill return it rather than go through this kindve crap after spending about $500.

hopefully, this doesnt spread to the tampa bay area soon.....


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## bigdave2004

From the BHN cable card thread some of the HD channel issue were resolved with new cards (I don't know why) has anyone gotten brighthouse to schedule a tech to come out. My theory on this is that it works in Tampa, maybe the memo they are reading says they are switching to SDV "soon" and just tell anyone that asks that we've already switched so we can stop giving out cable cards. Just a theory.... This also puts off upgrading my THD as I don't need the space for new HD recordings


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## moyekj

HerronScott said:


> I'm curious if Brighthouse is doing this because the system there is not built out to 750MHz or if they offer more programming which requires greater bandwidth? I just checked the lineups on-line and don't see a huge difference in the line-ups.


 That won't stop them. Cox in my area recently completed system upgrades to 1GHz yet still are rolling out SDV. Already 8 recent HD additions cannot be received by CableCard customers and any new digital channel added from here on our (SD or HD) will be reserved for SDV. The plans call to have 50 HD channels by end of this year and 100 by 2010, so SDV has to be an integral part of their plan, especially as most analog channels will remain.

It definitely seems like critical mass has been achieved with SDV now and the "tuning resolver" solution is overdue.


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## therlin

BH is offering us a free HD receiver if we trade in our CableCARDs, however this is not an HD DVR.

If I want an HD DVR, I'd have to pay $6 for the box plus $9.95 for the DVR service, every month. I was hoping they'd waive the $6 charge since the original offer is for a free receiver, and that way meet me in the middle. But they didn't agree to that.

I figured that I can put up with a $10/month charge until the USB dongle comes out and then return to TiVo. But $16/month is more than I care to give to a company that just seems to give me headaches every month.


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## joelkfla

jsnow789 said:


> You should also complain to the Florida State Public Services Commission HERE!


The PSC site says they do not regulate cable TV, and refers complainants to the FCC.


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## JWThiers

And I bought 2 THD's Jan 30 and had the cable installation on Feb 2. That Explains why I don't get all the HD channels. Now if they could just make it so that CSPAN actually plays on either channel 97 or 195 instead of shopNBC I'll be happy. I don't think they got the install done right. Fortunately I am not getting an HDTV for a few months, so hopefully the SDV dongle will be out by then.


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## bizzy

There's a form to report lineup changes and errors:
http://tivosupport2.instancy.com/LineUpForm.aspx

They seem to take anywhere from a week to three months to process these updates.


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## JWThiers

Thanks for the link. I'm pretty sure its a setup/channel mapping issue not lineup error. The guide data shows it correctly and I tune to the correct channel number, it just shows the wrong station. I'll double check some to be sure but BH will be out this afternoon with new cards and redo the install.


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## bigdave2004

JWThiers said:


> BH will be out this afternoon with new cards and redo the install.


Do you think this will let you see the new HD chanels or is this for another reason?


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## classicsat

FWIW, from what I have read from the Tuning Resolver Specs, it will be a cable provided piece of hardware.TiVo will have to do their part and write the interface software, and testing. 

Since the spec was just released, I wouldn't expect Tivo to publically release software the Tuning resolver support until fall, at the earliest.


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## CharlesH

classicsat said:


> Since the spec was just released, I wouldn't expect Tivo to publically release software the Tuning resolver support until fall, at the earliest.


The spec was just now _officially_ released to the public, but don't you suspect that there have been lots of preliminary specs along the way that TiVo development and resolver vendors have been working with for a while now?


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## acvthree

I've seen it done both ways. I've also seen a specification change quite a lot, or enough, with the release that previous work is not compliant.

Al


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## HiDefGator

CharlesH said:


> The spec was just now _officially_ released to the public, but don't you suspect that there have been lots of preliminary specs along the way that TiVo development and resolver vendors have been working with for a while now?


Yes but I still think it will be the Fall before my local cable company offers to lease me one.


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## tivoknucklehead

what a joke, to lose HD channels we already had. Fortunately I also have a directv receiver and will add my History HD season passes to that until the dongle ships


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## dkahs23

This really Suxs......


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## charlesc

Jan. 31st - My Tivo had a new messgage advising of BHN new HD channel line-up: Animal Planet HD, TLC HD, Discover Channel HD, Sci HD, National Geographic HD. I even received a news letter in the mail about the FREE HD channels being added. However, none of the new HD channels are viewable. They do appear on the guide. Also, the very next day, I lost the HD channels originally added back in late 2007, Food Network HD, AETV HD, History HD, HGTV HD. The only FREE HD channels I continue to receive are the local HD channels, TNT HD (just over the weekend I did receive TBS HD, as of today it's now gone). The others such as HD NET, HD Movies, MOJO, ESPN1, ESPN2 & UHD I continue to receive only because they are considered Prem HD channels $6.00 monthly. SO I called BHN several times, had the cards zapped, removed and TIVO reset 3 times. Finally a tech arrives on Sunday and is told by a BHN rep cablecards will not have the new channel line-up. The tech had made several calls to other techs in the area before speaking with his supervisor to confirm what the rep had told him. I think it's crap, seeing I had the previous HD channels and now no more? AND TBS HD is gone today as well? Oh, the tech was here 2 hours.


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## charlesc

eabu said:


> Yes, the channel lineup changes went into effect Feb 1, 2008 for Bright House, Central Florida. As for the speculation its about SDV, why is Tampa getting a change in channel lineup but retaining compatibility with cablecards??
> 
> Bright House Central Florida
> Added HD Channels: Animal Planet HD, TLC HD, Discover Channel HD, Sci HD, National Geographic HD
> Bad News: None of the new HD channels work on cablecards
> Even Worse News: Food Network HD, AETV HD, History HD, HGTV HD have been removed from the cablecard lineup
> 
> Now only TNT HD, TBS HD, ESPN1 HD, ESPN2 HD, and Discovery HDT can be viewed on cablecards.
> 
> Can't do much with HD TiVo's any more, and we just bought a Series 3 for Christmas. This is looking like a bad investment.


Well, today TBS HD is no longer showing up! It was just there over the weekend and last night. Now, it's gone. I'm getting the same grey screen as it the others.


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## net114

Well I have to join the band wagon. NO notice from BHN here in Central Florida. Something is causing quite a stir over there because I can't even get to a customer service rep...a message says to call back later. Yesterday I was on hold for 45 minutes before I finally gave up. The day before, the same thing.


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## eabu

A tech that came by to check my cablecards, let me see his email for the cablecard lineup changes, and that included the subtraction of TBS HD from the cablecard lineup.


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## orangeboy

These are also missing for me:
Channel 146 - History International
Channel 147 - Biography

I don't see the Digital Sports Pack pay channels (I don't pay for them, but I do get a 'call to order' splash screen from my SA3250 when I tune to them)

I didn't test all of the Music Channels, or obviously any of the InDemand channels.

Because I mis-read the 'M' card 'S' card post from 1/2/08, I had a tech come out to replace my cards. He arrived without any cards, and indicated that they were 'no good', and BHN were trying to get rid of them. I said that would be illegal. He hadn't worked on a device with cable cards, and wasn't aware of the issues with them since 2/1/08. He called his supervisor, and found they had 1 card in inventory. 

Hmm... What if the tables were turned? I come down to pay for my $150 cable bill, give them nothing, but tell them I have $75 in the bank. Think that would be acceptable?


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## charlesc

orangeboy said:


> These are also missing for me:
> Channel 146 - History International
> Channel 147 - Biography
> 
> I don't see the Digital Sports Pack pay channels (I don't pay for them, but I do get a 'call to order' splash screen from my SA3250 when I tune to them)
> 
> I didn't test all of the Music Channels, or obviously any of the InDemand channels.
> 
> Because I mis-read the 'M' card 'S' card post from 1/2/08, I had a tech come out to replace my cards. He arrived without any cards, and indicated that they were 'no good', and BHN were trying to get rid of them. I said that would be illegal. He hadn't worked on a device with cable cards, and wasn't aware of the issues with them since 2/1/08. He called his supervisor, and found they had 1 card in inventory.
> 
> Hmm... What if the tables were turned? I come down to pay for my $150 cable bill, give them nothing, but tell them I have $75 in the bank. Think that would be acceptable?


I just checked and U R correct. These are gone as well. You must be freakn kidding! OK, I just spent 25 min with a TIVO tech and he documented by complaint and ask if I would send a fax basically explaining (again) what has happened. Be sure to write in the fax header, "ATTN: TIVO Customer Support" and fax it .....408.934.9806. It's something, right?


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## JWThiers

bigdave2004 said:


> Do you think this will let you see the new HD chanels or is this for another reason?


Actually, I was only part of the problems I am having is not getting the NEW HD channels. I did got my service connected with CC's the day after the channels were added. When the install was "complete" I checked a few few random channels plus my premiums (HBO/Max) and a few of the HD channels. I got lucky (?) and didn't check one of the missing/newly added channels. After running the guided setup I started to customize the channels I receive, Favorite Channels etc, I noticed that I was missing some HD channels (The newly added ones specifically and the ones that turned SDV) but also noticed accidentally while deleting ShopNBC (Channel 99) that CSPAN (channel 97) shows up in the guide as CSPAN, but the program that is shown is ShopNBC. I found out after the fact (From this thread) that the HD Channels are SDV channels. CSPAN on digital channel 195 also comes up with ShopNBC and CSPAN3 on 197 comes up as not available.

So only part of my problem is SDV. It turns out that the guide data has some problems with the new channel mapping going on. TiVo Tech support said that the problem had already been reported and a fix should be coming "soon".

The New HD's would be nice but I guess I'll have to wait for the "Dongle".


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## jsnow789

joelkfla said:


> The PSC site says they do not regulate cable TV, and refers complainants to the FCC.


Sorry about that...

Here is where you can complain in Florida:

You may also wish to contact the Florida Department of Agriculture, Division of Consumer Services to file a complaint regarding cable service at:

Florida Department of Agriculture
Division of Consumer Services
2005 Apalachee Parkway
Tallahassee, FL 32399-6500
Toll-free Consumer Hotline (within Florida): 1-800-435-7352
Toll-free Spanish Hotline: 1-800-352-9832
General telephone number: 1-850-488-2221
www.800helpfla.com


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## therlin

Is there a reason why they had to go to SDV *now *instead of waiting until the issue with the cablecards is resolved in a few months?


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## cableguy763

therlin said:


> Is there a reason why they had to go to SDV *now *instead of waiting until the issue with the cablecards is resolved in a few months?


Maybe because DirectTV has lots more HD channels NOW...


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## therlin

I understand that, however, was SDV truly necesary at this point to add 5 more channels?

I'm not sure how all that works, all I know is how it's affecting me and my innability to get the content that I am paying for.


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## cableguy763

therlin said:


> I understand that, however, was SDV truly necesary at this point to add 5 more channels?
> 
> I'm not sure how all that works, all I know is how it's affecting me and my innability to get the content that I am paying for.


If a cable system is out of bandwidth, and most are, sdv is the cheapest and quickest way to reclaim some it.


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## RachelF

therlin said:


> Is there a reason why they had to go to SDV *now *instead of waiting until the issue with the cablecards is resolved in a few months?


My vote is that BHN just has the poorest customer service ever. They don't care about its customers because they didn't even have the common courtesy to let us know this was even coming down the pike. I was 6 days shy of my 30 day refund with the TiVo box and am now stuck until someone makes an adapter. As someone else said, I am not sure who to be more angry with, TiVo or BHN.

I sure do appreciate all of the information that everyone has provided, though.


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## eabu

There just has to be a solution with the USB dongle soon, because without it, the conversion to SDV will kill TiVo.

Its kinda getting ridiculous, paying for a $500 TiVo Series 3, $14/month subscription, cablecards monthly charge, and now a USB dongle?

Anyone have the BHN DVR for $6.95/month, is it any good?


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## net114

eabu said:


> There just has to be a solution with the USB dongle soon, because without it, the conversion to SDV will kill TiVo.
> 
> Its kinda getting ridiculous, paying for a $500 TiVo Series 3, $14/month subscription, cablecards monthly charge, and now a USB dongle?
> 
> Anyone have the BHN DVR for $6.95/month, is it any good?


The BHN DVR BLOWS. It is really, really bad. (At least the newer ones with the newer software). Somewhere I have it posted about how bad they are....but when I tried one the tech told me he felt bad he had to install it because he knew I was going to complain. (Its gone now)


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## dkahs23

Not to mention that "Brighthouse" has went up on there prices again.


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## bigdave2004

RachelF said:


> My vote is that BHN just has the poorest customer service ever.


Yeah they do, they won't even troubleshoot over the phone for a basic issue, they'll schedule a service call for which you have 1) be home 2) let some stranger in your house. They suck but we really have no other choice and that sucks even more.



eabu said:


> Anyone have the BHN DVR for $6.95/month, is it any good?


I had the 8300HD (The newest one with the cable card in it) and it didn't even buffer on the channel it was on unless I paused it first. I also miss the tivo noises when ff or rewind, its amazing how accustom to those I've become. I love my TivoHD I just wish I could use it for what I got it for, to watch HD programming. I am really surprised we haven't heard anything from a Tivo employee in this thread. *Tivo do you care?* A timeline or anything to keep our hopes up, seems like you got a whole thread of beta testers. I know I'm willing ...:up:


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## cableguy763

It is not Tivo coming out with the "dongle". SA and Motorola, the two manufacturers of cable headend equipment, are the ones coming out with it. These, of course, will be something you will either get with a cablecard or rented from your cable co. Tivo doesn't have much to do with it.


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## eabu

Can someone with good grammer (lol) email the consumerist.com and cnet.com about this situation in detail. Explain BHN's lack of consumer notification, explain the FCC mandate, the switch over to SDV, the USB dongle, etc? If u can get on consumerist.com it would seriously get BHN's attention. I really doubt the few new HD channels really need to be SDV right now, particularly if BHN in Tampa, which also got the new HD channels, still has it working on their cablecards.


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## net114

Does anyone else note the very real irony in BHN's current "no asterisks" commercial?????? 

I think their current claims of "adding HD channels to your lineup" needs a huge, big, fat...asterisk. 

"...new HD channels!*" 

*Note: our customer service representatives will have no idea what you are talking about if you are using cable cards and some channels have mysteriously disappeared, in addition to some current channels being temporarily unavailable. We recommend renting one of our terrificly terrific fantastic DVR's to solve your problem.


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## eabu

Yeah, on their website, in the digital cable section, they talk about "Watch TV on your terms." Yeah, sure.


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## therlin

We are obviously not getting any assistance from Bright House. They are apparently enjoying the fact that we'll now need to rent their DVRs.

I suggest we take this to the next level, to a place where it can hurt them.

If you live in incorporated Orlando, please file a complaint here http://www.cityoforlando.net/cable/brighthouse.htm

If you live in unincorporated Orlando, please file a complaint here http://www.orangecountyfl.net/cms/DEPT/countyadmin/communications/cable.htm

I needed their assistance once when I was being stone-walled by BH regarding a CableCARD issue. A few days later I got a call from BH and they bent over backwards to fix my issue AND saved me money.

These are the folks who can threaten BH with not renewing their monopoly (and I doubt they get that many consumer complaints.)


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## HiDefGator

You guys can file all the complaints that you want to file. It isn't going to make BHN stop deploying SDV just like every other cable company in America. It also isn't going to make them wait to deploy SDV because it breaks about 600 Tivo's in their service area. Have you not been following this process for the last year? Every month there is a new thread just like this one form a new city that has rolle dout SDV. None of the previous protests have had any affect at all.


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## therlin

My beef with them is that they are willing to give us a free HD receiver ($6.95/month value) but they will not give us the same credit for a HD DVR instead ($6.95/month) even when I say that I will pay for the additional $9.95/month DVR fee.

I'd be happy to pay the DVR fee until the dongle is out and I can return to Tivo.


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## RachelF

net114 said:


> Does anyone else note the very real irony in BHN's current "no asterisks" commercial??????
> 
> I think their current claims of "adding HD channels to your lineup" needs a huge, big, fat...asterisk.
> 
> "...new HD channels!*"
> 
> *Note: our customer service representatives will have no idea what you are talking about if you are using cable cards and some channels have mysteriously disappeared, in addition to some current channels being temporarily unavailable. We recommend renting one of our terrificly terrific fantastic DVR's to solve your problem.


This is CLASSIC!


----------



## bigdave2004

therlin said:


> If you live in unincorporated Orlando, please file a complaint here http://www.orangecountyfl.net/cms/DEPT/countyadmin/communications/cable.htm


So I e-mailed Jae Nale and within minutes I got a phone call from her. She says she's gotten TONS of e-mail from Feb 1 on this issue and she is "actively" working with Brighthouse for a solution. She said this exactly "They told me they didn't think it would affect so many people, and I don't buy that." Is it so hard to see how many customers have cable cards on their account? Anyway what prompted her call was the fact that I said Brighthouse has a monopoly in Central Florida, she wanted to make it very clear that she grants franchises to any company that wants one and that if they don't overlap then its not financially viable for them to do business in my area. She also told me to get satellite to teach Brighthouse a lesson which I also laughed at. She is a Brighthouse customer so she knows our pain first hand. She said she hopes to have a resolution soon, whatever that may be I don't know. There is HOPE!


----------



## JWThiers

Since I am a new Brighthouse (Brevard) customer (I had my install on 2/2) and this is my first HD device, even 1 HD channel is more than I had before. What I would like to see is at least an *official* list of what channels and services you can receive with a Cable Card. Some of the channels I thought I should be getting even with the SDV channels are Not showing up.

Anyone else getting "ShopNBC" instead of CSPAN on both channels 97 AND 195?


----------



## HiDefGator

bigdave2004 said:


> She said she hopes to have a resolution soon, whatever that may be I don't know. There is HOPE!


Be for real. There is no hope. Other cities have had this problem for months (year?) and they have no resolution for it yet. There is no way they will turn off SDV and stop using it because cable card users can't see the HD channels on third party DVR's. There simply is no known resolution they can offer you.


----------



## cableguy763

HiDefGator said:


> Be for real. There is no hope. Other cities have had this problem for months (year?) and they have no resolution for it yet. There is no way they will turn off SDV and stop using it because cable card users can't see the HD channels on third party DVR's. There simply is no known resolution they can offer you.


Austin launced SDV in 2005. Still using it.


----------



## therlin

It sounds like so far the Cable Franchising Office and the Orlando Sentinel are looking into the story and talking to BHN.


----------



## HiDefGator

Perhaps we should place bets on what city this comes up in next. Which major city doesn't have SDV yet? Then maybe people living there can complain before it happens.


----------



## cableguy763

HiDefGator said:


> Perhaps we should place bets on what city this comes up in next. Which major city doesn't have SDV yet? Then maybe people living there can complain before it happens.


Dallas, but I bet it will be using sdv real soon.


----------



## therlin

I just got off the phone with the Senior Director of - I think he said Technology but it could have been Customer Support.

According to him BHN has *NOT* switched to SDV. They said that they will implement SDV in Q3 of 2008 *AFTER* the fix for SDV and TiVos (etc) will be out (he mentioned the USB dongle that fixes the SDV issue.)

He blamed the problem on the old style of CableCARDs and said that if they had M Cards, the channels would work. But he added that they don't have them (I thought they did have them based on other posts I read.)

So his explanation didn't sound very legit to me but I figured it was not my place to argue technology with him since I'm just a TiVo user and don't really care to know what happens behind the scenes.

Anyway, he said that they were offering TiVo users a free HD DVR until the USB dongle that fixes the issue is released.

I am personally willing to live with this resolution for now while I wait for this magical USB device. I will miss TiVo dearly but what else can I do.

The sad thing is that I doubt I would had gotten anywhere with BHN had I not contacted the Orange County Cable Franchising Office.


----------



## eabu

This guy you talked to doesn't know about M-cards or he is lying. On January 31, 2008 a BHN cable technician came to my home to pair my cablecards to my TiVo, he didnt know what he was doing and put an M-card into my TiVo. He was unable to pair the M-card to my TiVo. He called a more experienced technician who came to my home, agreed with me M-cards don't work with Series3 TiVo's and switched my cablecards to S-Cards and was able to pair the cards to my TiVo. Both of them had stacks of cards, both S-cards and M-cards.


----------



## therlin

Yeah, I thought his story was not quite there. Maybe he meant that M-Cards didn't work with TiVo. And I don't even know if that is true.


----------



## eabu

From what I've read, M-cards work with TiVo HD, but not Series3 TiVo's.


----------



## megachirops

therlin said:


> Yeah, I thought his story was not quite there. Maybe he meant that M-Cards didn't work with TiVo. And I don't even know if that is true.


It's not. My S3 TiVo, hooked up back in November, has 1 S-Card and 1 M-Card (that was the only 2 cards the local office had at the time) and works fine. M-Cards function the same as an S-Card in an S3. (And neither tuner can pick up the new stations so I don't think the "M-Cards work" line is true either.)

Also, on a side note for those talking about losing TBS... TBS does appear to be gone, but A&E is back (at least for me). It looks like maybe they switched them?


----------



## bizzy

eabu said:


> From what I've read, M-cards work with TiVo HD, but not Series3 TiVo's.


Wherever you read that, it was wrong. Maybe it was someone else who like you decided to post incorrect information?


----------



## moyekj

eabu said:


> From what I've read, M-cards work with TiVo HD, but not Series3 TiVo's.


 They DO work in Tivo S3's but you need 2 of them (1 per tuner) unlike the THD units where only 1 is required.


----------



## eabu

If you are good with tech, TiVo, CableCards, and have BHN and would like to contribute to a story with the Orlando Sentinal, please PM me.


----------



## TiVoToo

Over on the BHN forum at AVSForum.com, Barry928 who is knowledgeable about all things BHN, has stated that BHN has not yet deployed SDV, but it planning to do so later this year. In preparation, BHN has told the computer to limit channels to everyone with CableCard service. Doesn't that make you feel better?


----------



## bizzy

eabu said:


> M-cards cannot multistream in S3 TiVo's, they become S-cards in S3 TiVo's. Tivo HD supports M-cards and multistreaming. M-cards do not pair with S3's but S-cards DO pair with S3's on Bright House Network in Central Florida.


right. You said m-cards didn't work in S3's. That's wrong.


----------



## eabu

The cable guy spent an hour trying to pair an M-card to my S3, couldnt pair it with multiple tries to the BHN operator, until another tech came to help and switched it to S-cards.


----------



## bizzy

I had a Comcast installer fail over and over to pair s-cards in my S3. It turned out to mean nothing but that the installer was incompetent.


----------



## acvthree

TiVoToo said:


> Over on the BHN forum at AVSForum.com, Barry928 who is knowledgeable about all things BHN, has stated that BHN has not yet deployed SDV, but it planning to do so later this year. In preparation, BHN has told the computer to limit channels to everyone with CableCard service. Doesn't that make you feel better?


I can understand why the FCC would not require the providers to not deploy SDV because it breaks cable card, but I can't understand why the FCC would not have a problem with providers cutting off channels to cablecard just because they feel like it.

Al


----------



## moyekj

acvthree said:


> I can understand why the FCC would not require the providers to not deploy SDV because it breaks cable card, but I can't understand why the FCC would not have a problem with providers cutting off channels to cablecard just because they feel like it.
> 
> Al


 For my local headend (Cox Orange County, CA) Cable Card customers can't tune several new HD channels added in the last few months even though SDV has not yet been deployed. The reasoning given by Cox was that SDV rollout will happen some time this year and they don't want to give Cable Card customers new channels now only to yank them away later - that would make customers madder then not giving it to them in the 1st place. At least for now they haven't removed access to older channels so they have been sticking to the spirit of this reasoning. However when SDV is deployed I wouldn't be surprised to find that some channels I can currently tune will also be taken away...


----------



## charlesc

BHN DVR bites! It's the worst device I've ever used. I'm not not kidding.


----------



## charlesc

megachirops said:


> It's not. My S3 TiVo, hooked up back in November, has 1 S-Card and 1 M-Card (that was the only 2 cards the local office had at the time) and works fine. M-Cards function the same as an S-Card in an S3. (And neither tuner can pick up the new stations so I don't think the "M-Cards work" line is true either.)
> 
> Also, on a side note for those talking about losing TBS... TBS does appear to be gone, but A&E is back (at least for me). It looks like maybe they switched them?


Yes, me too. It's silly, everyday I check and see if any of the HD channels have return, but in this case, AEHD is back.


----------



## charlesc

therlin said:


> I just got off the phone with the Senior Director of - I think he said Technology but it could have been Customer Support.
> 
> According to him BHN has *NOT* switched to SDV. They said that they will implement SDV in Q3 of 2008 *AFTER* the fix for SDV and TiVos (etc) will be out (he mentioned the USB dongle that fixes the SDV issue.)
> 
> He blamed the problem on the old style of CableCARDs and said that if they had M Cards, the channels would work. But he added that they don't have them (I thought they did have them based on other posts I read.)
> 
> So his explanation didn't sound very legit to me but I figured it was not my place to argue technology with him since I'm just a TiVo user and don't really care to know what happens behind the scenes.
> 
> Anyway, he said that they were offering TiVo users a free HD DVR until the USB dongle that fixes the issue is released.
> 
> I am personally willing to live with this resolution for now while I wait for this magical USB device. I will miss TiVo dearly but what else can I do.
> 
> The sad thing is that I doubt I would had gotten anywhere with BHN had I not contacted the Orange County Cable Franchising Office.


Does the free BHN DVR Box also include the 9.95 monthly service fee? Prior to Tivo, I was paying $9.95 for the BHN device plus an additional $9.95 for the BHN DVR service.


----------



## bigdave2004

So they didn't switch to SDV, they are planning on it? And this is a computer function, according to Barry on the AVSforums? And how come AETVHD works again? This is all so confusing. Has anyone successfully gotten brighthouse to remove the "block" for them yet?

-Dave


----------



## therlin

charlesc said:


> Does the free BHN DVR Box also include the 9.95 monthly service fee? Prior to Tivo, I was paying $9.95 for the BHN device plus an additional $9.95 for the BHN DVR service.


He didn't say and I didn't ask. I'm fine paying the DVR fee as long as the box fee is waived until the USB dongle is out.


----------



## bigdave2004

therlin said:


> He didn't say and I didn't ask. I'm fine paying the DVR fee as long as the box fee is waived until the USB dongle is out.


Isn't this just giving into BHN? They obviously did this to make some extra money off cable card users until the dongle is available, should we push harder to get them to allow us to have this channels since we know they are available since they aren't using SDV yet.


----------



## therlin

bigdave2004 said:


> Isn't this just giving into BHN? They obviously did this to make some extra money off cable card users until the dongle is available, should we push harder to get them to allow us to have this channels since we know they are available since they aren't using SDV yet.


TiVo's monthly fee is higher than BHN's $10 fee. And for all that I know, they won't even charge us that. I'm just happy that at least I have a way to view all the channels for now.

Just yesterday they were refusing to even waive the fee on a DVR and just offered a free HD receiver. I didn't push the issue.


----------



## Randman

Count me in as one of the very unhappy people. The person I talked to at BHN was rude, and would not even let me talk to anyone else. I asked her to file a complaint on my behalf, and she said, "what good will that do?".

You know, I'm ok not getting the channels. Just don't charge me for them. Don't raise my rates.

Also, before I got my Tivo, I had cable boxes, and was getting a good rate from BHN. When I switched to cablecards, I lost the good rate, because cablecards were not included in the structure. So, I started with basic, standard and digital. I ended up with basic and standard, and am paying more money for it. Now, I'll be paying more for even less channels.

I can understand new technology. Great. I hope it works. I don't expect them to not upgrade. Just don't screw me over doing it.


----------



## celly

Tivo S3 Do Support M-Cards. : " The DVR must also be running software version 8.0.1c or later. " http://tivosupport2.instancy.com/LaunchContent.aspx?CID=bb83ae57-ea46-4162-ab65-4bfde6a851e4

Can anyone Verify that BHN _DID NOT_ switch to SDV? I find this switch odd since BHN has a decent amount of equipment in the field that doesn't support SDV -- So TiVo users wouldn't be the only ones screwed... And none of the literature about the upgrade stated that users will need to upgrade their boxes.


----------



## cableguy763

All legacy digital boxes in the field will work with SDV. They would not have to swap all of their boxes.


----------



## bigdave2004

celly said:


> Can anyone Verify that BHN _DID NOT_ switch to SDV?


It hasn't been fully verified YET but so far this is what I have found:

This Post from Barry928 at the AVS Forum states this:

"_Hang on. I am seeing a pattern here. BHN intends to move the new HD channels to SDV along with some others so they told the computer to limit channels for everyone with cable card service and now they have entangled the Tivo customers with that broad policy."_

Along with this:

"_I can confirm SDV will be deployed with MDN which is being rolled out on a limited basis right now with new DVR's. BHN will need to switch over all users to MDN to deploy SDV_" (MDN is the new GUI interface on the DVR/STB's)

Last thing is the fact the on the 1st TBSHD worked and AETVHD did not, and now the opposite is true.

To me this all seems like a big push to get cablecard people on the BHN DVR before the dongle is available.


----------



## TiVoToo

It is very frustrating that we cannot get a consistent, reasonable explanation from BHN as to why this they have limited HD channels to CableCARD-based STBs. BHN CSRs are all over the map in their responses - it is SDV, it's not SDV, it's your TiVo, CableCARD not compatible with new HD, etc. However, they all concur on one response:

YOUR PROBLEM IS NOT THE FAULT OF BHN!

The first step to recovery is to first admit that there is a problem. BHN has yet to take this first step. Until they do, we will get no satisfaction.


----------



## BobCamp1

They are doing it to force non-Tivo CableCard customers to switch to the new DVR. Because they will need to.

Tivo users are caught in the cross-fire. Assuming the USB SDV box will get deployed, Tivo users have no such issues and do not need to be forced to switch. The HD channels should be viewable in the meantime. BHN doesn't have their act together, and the left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing. Just call them up, explain the situation, and hopefully they'll reactivate those channels on your account.

Good luck.


----------



## bigdave2004

So here is an e-mail I just got:

_Dear bigdave2004:

I apologize for the issues you are having with your TiVO equipment. *Bright House Networks has not launched SDV that is planned for later this year*. With the rising demand for new HD channels and new programming in general, Bright House must move to this new technology to satisfy the needs of our customers.

I read the Blog attached to your Message and some of the information that is posted there is not correct. As you may have read, the first generation of cable cards that are installed in your TiVO HD DVR are no longer supported by the manufactures because of a new generation of cable cards (M-cards) will be coming out late in the second quarter of this year. In addition, there currently are not any TV manufactures that are building cable card TVs that utilize the first generation one-way cable cards. To my knowledge, TiVO is the only manufacturer still building a product that uses one-way cable cards. Since the one-way cards wont be supported by the manufacture or by TV manufacturing *companies we have stopped adding channel capacity to those cards which is why you are unable to view the HD channels that were launched on February 1st.* The downside to purchasing your equipment is that when technology changes, as it does all too frequently, the consumer is often left out in the cold.

TiVO has been working with a cable industry think tank called CableLabs and has developed a USB adapter that will make the current version of TiVO HD and HD DVRs fully compatible with SDV, all of our HD channels and all of interactive services. Your current TiVO product doesnt support any of our interactive services and never could with one-way cable cards. This product will be available for purchase by consumers sometime in the second quarter of this year according to TiVO.

Mark A. Clark
Sr. Director of Field Operations
Bright House Networks_

This guy thinks I'm a moron. Stopped adding channels to the cards? WTF, this proves they are purposely limiting cablecard users.


----------



## bigdave2004

So I just talked to Mark on the phone and I told him I had an M-Card, and I also pointed out that the M-Cards in the SA8300HDC are receiving the channels. I also pointed out the fact that I didn't just lose the new channels on Feb 1, I also lost existing channels as well (TBSHD, AETVHD, HGTVHD), he wasn't aware of that. I asked why they couldn't add the service tags for the new channels to the m-cards, he didn't have an answer but is going to get one so maybe this will be good news.

-Dave


----------



## PopcornGuy

Makes no sense. I switched to two m-cards back when 9.1 came out and the cablecards had all those problems that 9.2 fixed. Brighthouse gave me an HD DVR today to use at no additional cost until the Tivo fix comes along. Through the holes on top of it I CAN SEE AN M-CARD IN THERE!!! Since they are not yet SDV, it definitely seems like they are purposely restricting those cards that are not in their boxes. Because of pairing necessities I don't think I can pull out their "unlocked" card and put it in my Tivo...can I? Anyways, I think I'd rather have just the SD versions of channels right now if there is still a ray of hope.


----------



## bigdave2004

PopcornGuy said:


> I CAN SEE AN M-CARD IN THERE!!!


Yah if you look on the back there is a door that says M-Card with a piece of tape over it. I am starting to think Brighthouse doesn't know what they are doing because if they are just giving out free DVR's its not really helping their bottom line to do this but well I am still not sure ...


----------



## celly

This is how I just explained the issue to a friend.. Kinda made me giggle..

"... Over the last year, we all purchased two puppies from Brighthouse. On February First we woke up and all of our puppies were really sick. When we called Bright House to make an appointment for a check up, they told us that if we didn't switch to Bright House Brand Puppy Chow, Our puppies would die ..."


----------



## Okeemike

celly said:


> This is how I just explained the issue to a friend.. Kinda made me giggle..
> 
> "... Over the last year, we all purchased two puppies from Brighthouse. On February First we woke up and all of our puppies were really sick. When we called Bright House to make an appointment for a check up, they told us that if we didn't switch to Bright House Brand Puppy Chow, Our puppies would die ..."


Actually, it's more like this:

"If you don't switch for BH Puppy Chow, your dog will die. To compensate you for your loss, we'll give you a fish"


----------



## notnow117

I just got the rundown on my options from brighthouse customer service. The choices they gave me are...



> Customers with CableCARD televisions can choose from four (4) options:
> 
> 1.) Upgrade to HD service with Digital SmartBox (trade in CableCARD)
> 2.) No-monthly-fee HD Digital Receiver (trade in CableCARD)
> 3.) Keep CableCARD without receiving newly added HD channels
> 4.) Keep the CableCARD and ADD the free HD Digital Receiver to the same
> TV using a splitter
> 
> The offer includes offering a free regular HD digital box, not an HD DVR
> digital box.


As far as I'm concerned, options 1 and 3 are them not really doing anything. Option 2 sucks because I can't use my TiVo anymore and don't get any DVR functionality in return. And I fail to see why anyone would choose option 2 when they could choose option 4 instead. Option 4 is close to reasonable, but they should be offering a DVR instead of a receiver.

Has anyone gotten a straight answer yet on why this is happening?


----------



## eabu

bigdave2004, could you contact the consumerist.com about your story?


----------



## orangeboy

How do I know what kind of card (MCARD/SCARD) I have?


----------



## edju

We have a Series 3 Tivo with two M cards, don't have the new channels and have lost the usual channels in other posts.

Just wanted to weigh in since BH seems to think this combo isn't possible and the root of our latest frustrations.

I just don't understand why a "service" provider cares what equipment I use. Lets see they don't have to invest in R&D or support the equipment. All they need to do is provide the best service they can. Seems like both BH and DTV have forgotten about the "service" part of their business. Considering I can take my business elsewhere such as me canceling DTV, why would one company give me reason to leave if keeping me is no cost to them. I just don't understand the business side of it. *Why would you expend resources to actively pursue ways to lose customers!!!!*


----------



## bigdave2004

eabu said:


> bigdave2004, could you contact the consumerist.com about your story?


Not yet, I actually know one of the editors and we chat on AIM from time to time but I think this maybe overly technical for the consumerist, but I have been contacted by the Orlando Sentinel to do an interview so expect to see that soon.


----------



## eitingon

In the Sentinel this morning: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/orl-cable0808feb08,0,6368421.story

I have one (1) M-Card in my HD TiVo and, of course, I lost/am not receiving like everybody else here...


----------



## tivoknucklehead

eitingon said:


> In the Sentinel this morning: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/orl-cable0808feb08,0,6368421.story
> 
> I have one (1) M-Card in my HD TiVo and, of course, I lost/am not receiving like everybody else here...


at least this has gone public now and the thing I like is BH is committed to a fix


----------



## TiVoToo

eitingon said:


> In the Sentinel this morning: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/business/orl-cable0808feb08,0,6368421.story


There are some errors in the story that should be corrected:
1. There are more than a "handful" affected.
2. BHN is providing a free HD STB, not a free HD DVR, until adapter comes out.
3. No explanation from senior VP as to why BHN's own DVR, which uses CableCARD, is not affected.
4. VP needed to be asked why CableCARD users were not informed of channel limitation prior to its implementation.

OTOH, it does provide some publicity for CableCARD. The more subscribers that elect to use the device, the less likely this kind of stuff will happen in the future.


----------



## JWThiers

TiVoToo said:


> There are some errors in the story that should be corrected:
> 1. There are more than a "handful" affected.
> 2. BHN is providing a free HD STB, not a free HD DVR, until adapter comes out.
> 3. No explanation from senior VP as to why BHN's own DVR, which uses CableCARD, is not affected.
> 4. VP needed to be asked why CableCARD users were not informed of channel limitation prior to its implementation.
> 
> OTOH, it does provide some publicity for CableCARD. The more subscribers that elect to use the device, the less likely this kind of stuff will happen in the future.


It also puts BHN as opposed to the generic "Cable Industry" on record that they are indeed working with Tivo on the dongle. That is at least gives some assurance that BHN is planning on supporting them.


----------



## cableguy763

TiVoToo said:


> There are some errors in the story that should be corrected:
> 1. There are more than a "handful" affected.
> 2. BHN is providing a free HD STB, not a free HD DVR, until adapter comes out.
> 3. No explanation from senior VP as to why BHN's own DVR, which uses CableCARD, is not affected.
> 4. VP needed to be asked why CableCARD users were not informed of channel limitation prior to its implementation.
> 
> OTOH, it does provide some publicity for CableCARD. The more subscribers that elect to use the device, the less likely this kind of stuff will happen in the future.


3. The cablecard is not the problem. It is the host device, i.e. Tivo, which does not have two way capability. Cable boxes with cablecards are two way capable.


----------



## celly

cableguy763 said:


> 3. The cablecard is not the problem. It is the host device, i.e. Tivo, which does not have two way capability. Cable boxes with cablecards are two way capable.


Why would you need 2-Way capabilities to watch Animal Planet HD, Food Network HD, or HGTV HD?


----------



## acvthree

cableguy763 said:


> 3. The cablecard is not the problem. It is the host device, i.e. Tivo, which does not have two way capability. Cable boxes with cablecards are two way capable.


Why would you need two way communication to watch a non-SDV, non-VOD, non-PPV channel?

Al


----------



## therlin

TiVoToo said:


> 2. BHN is providing a free HD STB, not a free HD DVR, until adapter comes out.


I'm getting a free HD DVR until the adapter comes out. I was told that this policy has changed lately though, so you may want to call back (if you are interested in a free HD DVR)


----------



## JWThiers

SDV or Switched Digital Video needs a two way to work and BHN and others are moving to this technology. Any channel using SDV are not viewable to Cable Card users. Reading between the lines of the Orlando Sentinel


> In preparing for a new cable delivery technology called "Switched Digital Video," Bright House decided not to deliver these channels to the CableCard customers, Orduna said. The four channels -- HGTV HD, TBS HD, The History Channel HD and Food Network HD -- were pulled last Friday, when Bright House rolled out five new HD channels.
> 
> "It was a mistake on our part for doing that and for having it out there inadvertently," Orduna said. "We are all about creating value with new technology. And sometimes there are hiccups when implementing new technology."


BHN is planning on moving to SDV but hasn't yet. They are restricting access to their new HD channels because they figure its easier to never give you something in the first place rather than taking it away at a later date. Good assumption by the way, look at everyone complaining about having fewer channels now because the took 4 away, they just had poor implementation by letting 4 channels out and are taking them back. But it does beg to question with the Tivo Dongle also coming out 2nd quarter to enable SDV compatibility why not let the Tivo CC users get the channels because they are going to be getting a dongle when they come out anyway and will be able to get them anyway.


----------



## cableguy763

acvthree said:


> Why would you need two way communication to watch a non-SDV, non-VOD, non-PPV channel?
> 
> Al


Because he asked why the cable co's boxes are not affected.


----------



## therlin

JWThiers said:


> They are restricting access to their new HD channels because they figure its easier to never give you something in the first place rather than taking it away at a later date. Good assumption by the way, look at everyone complaining about having fewer channels now because the took 4 away, they just had poor implementation by letting 4 channels out and are taking them back. But it does beg to question with the Tivo Dongle also coming out 2nd quarter to enable SDV compatibility why not let the Tivo CC users get the channels because they are going to be getting a dongle when they come out anyway and will be able to get them anyway.


Exactly. Ideally they should unblock those channels and then send a letter to CableCARD customers a few weeks before they TRULY need to make those channels unavailable. THAT would be good customer service, not what they've done now.


----------



## acvthree

cableguy763 said:


> Because he asked why the cable co's boxes are not affected.


The cable co's boxes that use cable cards don't need two way communications to receive non-SDV, non-PPV and non-VOD channels.

BH is using their control of the cable head ends to artificially block channels to cablecard third party STBs that are available to their own cablecard STBs.

This is not a technological issue. This is a marketing decision.

Al


----------



## celly

therlin said:


> Exactly. Ideally they should unblock those channels and then send a letter to CableCARD customers a few weeks before they TRULY need to make those channels unavailable. THAT would be good customer service, not what they've done now.


Agreed. If they had sent a letter stating what was going to happen I think we would of all coped a little better. So, instead of BHN making this a TiVo issue, they have made it a BHN issue.

I mean, they send me something every week to switch to their Digital Phone service -- So it's not like they are strapped for cash on postage.


----------



## moyekj

You guys should consider yourselves very lucky. At least BHN stepped up to the plate and is offering a free HD DVR until the tuning resolver solution surfaces. That is a lot more than I have heard any other provider rolling out SDV offering. Only wish Cox Orange County, CA would offer such a deal for the 8 HD channels I cannot receive even though SDV hasn't deployed here yet...


----------



## dig_duggler

This story finally hit engadget.

Edit: How exactly is this legal? I realize the cable companies can pretty much do whatever they want and Tivo users are a drop in the pond, but doesn't this seem like a class action lawsuit (I hate bringing that up as much as often as it is thrown out around here)? There is not any technical reason to do this and it seems (on the surface) to be illegal. It seems there might be a reasonable (i.e. non threatening) way to bring this up to Brighthouse but I am not a lawyer....


----------



## bigdave2004

Ok Spoke to Mark Clark, Senior Director of Field Ops again he said that the executive board is going to review the changes that engineer made sometime next week. He stated they did not think it would have the impact that it did and that its become quite the PR headache for them . I told him that TiVo customers are a loyal, *vocal*, and very technical bunch. So we may win after all, I hope. I said I would give him a call in a week to see what the result of that meeting would be. He offered me a free HD DVR again but I turned it down until after the meeting.

-Dave


----------



## BobCamp1

dig_duggler said:


> This story finally hit engadget.
> 
> Edit: How exactly is this legal? I realize the cable companies can pretty much do whatever they want and Tivo users are a drop in the pond, but doesn't this seem like a class action lawsuit (I hate bringing that up as much as often as it is thrown out around here)? There is not any technical reason to do this and it seems (on the surface) to be illegal. It seems there might be a reasonable (i.e. non threatening) way to bring this up to Brighthouse but I am not a lawyer....


Good question. They have to provide CableCards, and their set-top boxes have to have CableCards. Yet all those CableCards don't have to receive the same lineup information. Also, their set-top boxes with CableCards aren't the same as Tivo's -- the cards are not removable and they are regularly bypassed.

The FCC has done a bad job of regulating this. There are many loopholes -- as you've noticed. The FCC may need to issue clarifications, then follow up with fines.

As far as a lawsuit -- you signed the contract. You bought a third-party device with limited functionality. BHN has already offered a deal with these customers, and is supporting the magical SDV box. So you'd be suing BHN for the Tivo monthly fee for six months? That's around $100 total per person. Good luck.

Plus, who do you sue? I think you'd have a better chance suing Tivo for selling you a product with known but unadvertised limitations. But you'd eat up the $100 judgment (plus the cost of the SDV box, less than $100) on airfare to California (you'd probably have to sue them there).


----------



## dig_duggler

BobCamp1 said:


> Good question. They have to provide CableCards, and their set-top boxes have to have CableCards. Yet all those CableCards don't have to receive the same lineup information. Also, their set-top boxes with CableCards aren't the same as Tivo's -- the cards are not removable and they are regularly bypassed.


Why would the cable cards not have to receive the same lineup information (barring technical limitations)?

Edit: I suppose the main point I'm trying to make is that there it would seem there is sufficient enough grounds against the local franchise that a lawsuit wouldn't be thrown out. It would then seem that the most prudent (i.e. least expensive) path for Brighthouse is to simply turn these channels back on. But I'm getting way ahead of myself (there's still other less expensive avenues to explore, the most effective one so far seeming to be the PR one). Lawsuits take money and willing participants and lots of time....


----------



## bigdave2004

I think it would be be best as a company who runs a no asterisks campaign to not add asterisks to their HD service. I also think since they aren't running SDV this change should be as simple as adding the service tags for these new channels to all cable cards.


----------



## celly

I think it's a fair assumption to make, that the majority of us knew that we'd loose, or not be able to access channels _some day_, until someone came out with an SDV CCard fix.

This is just BHN's way to get us back on their Boxes so that we can use their Premium Services instead of Tivo's or other 3rd party boxes. (ie. PPV vs. Amazon vs. New Apple/Windows Vista services) They can deny it, but there is simply no other reason..

The whole "We're just preparing you for something that will happen after the SDV fix is supposed to be available" excuse is BS. Because if that was true, they would of at least told their Customer Service reps (And even better yet -- Their Cable Card Users). Instead they tried to sneak it by what has proven to be a very well educated, and impressively organized group of tivo users.

No matter what, I won't let BHN win. I'll get rabbit ears, comcast, and DTV before I give them the pleasure of putting a HD box where my Tivo sits.


----------



## rickmeoff

HiDefGator said:


> You guys can file all the complaints that you want to file. It isn't going to make BHN stop deploying SDV just like every other cable company in America. It also isn't going to make them wait to deploy SDV because it breaks about 600 Tivo's in their service area. Have you not been following this process for the last year? Every month there is a new thread just like this one form a new city that has rolle dout SDV. None of the previous protests have had any affect at all.


looks like you're wrong about these protests being a waste of time, as this is actually getting quite a bit of notice. and some changes may go into effect because of these 'filed complaints.'

had everyone sat on their thumbs and kept their mouths shut, we would never know.


----------



## notnow117

i just scheduled installation of my free HD DVR, in addition to keeping my cable cards, for first thing monday morning. no changes to my billing. hopefully they just enable the channels at some point. i don't want that thing any longer than necessary.


----------



## Randman

Here is the letter I wrote to Bright House. I'm not sure if it will do anything, but if enough of us complain, hopefully something will happen.

_Sirs:

I know you have heard from many customers, but I also wanted to let my disatisfaction be known in your decision to block channels to cablecard subscribers.

It is my understanding that at this time, Bright House has not implemented SDV. So, the decision to not provide the new HD channels, as well as remove previously available channels, was not made out of technical necessity. It was a decision made without basis.

Hopefully, by the time Bright House does switch to SDV, the new Dongles that allow TIVO and other cablecard using devices to receive SDV signals, will be available, and this will be a moot point.

You have the opportunity to resolve this problem in the customer's favor, and make lifelong Bright House customers. All it will take is allowing customers who are paying the same fees as other customers to receive the same services. Simple as that. Turn the channels back on, and when the time comes for switching over to SDV, we'll work together to utilize the new dongles.

I really do like Bright House. I have all three services you guys offer, and am pleased with 2/3 of them. The balls in your court. Let's see how we can resolve this issue!

Let me know what you will do about this. _


----------



## TiVoToo

I sent a very similar e-mail 2 days ago. Here's the response I received from an Electronic Support Specialist (ESS):

_Thank you for your correspondence regarding your Bright House Networks service. We apologize that the recent introduction of SDV (Switched Digital Video) HD channels is not compatible with your CableCARD device. SDV is a technology that will enable us to offer better HD service by allow us to efficiently utilize our cable network bandwidth. Unfortunately, CableCARDs do not support two-way communication which is required for SDV.

At this time, the National Cable and Telecommunications Association (NCTA) is working with equipment manufacturers, including TiVo, to develop an adapter that will allow CableCARDs to access SDV-broadcast channels. It is expected to be released in the second quarter of this year. In the meantime, we are offering an HD-DVR at no additional charge for our CableCARD subscribers that also have a TiVo box. This offer will be in effect until the adapters become available. _

It then provides contact info.
It appears that members of the BHN organization are still misinformed as to the cause of the problem. This ESS thinks SDV is operational. At least this time they didn't blame TiVo like they did in response to my original complaint of a week ago.


----------



## TomRaz

What do you expect, it's Brighthouse 

They have a pretty good overall product in my area but their communications within the company have always been very poor. 

Maybe the issues in Orlando will help out customers in other areas that BHN serves.


----------



## bigdave2004

TiVoToo said:


> I sent a very similar e-mail 2 days ago. Here's the response I received from an Electronic Support Specialist (ESS):
> 
> _Thank you for your correspondence regarding your Bright House Networks service. We apologize that the recent introduction of SDV (Switched Digital Video) HD channels is not compatible with your CableCARD device. SDV is a technology that will enable us to offer better HD service by allow us to efficiently utilize our cable network bandwidth. Unfortunately, CableCARDs do not support two-way communication which is required for SDV.
> 
> At this time, the National Cable and Telecommunications Association (NCTA) is working with equipment manufacturers, including TiVo, to develop an adapter that will allow CableCARDs to access SDV-broadcast channels. It is expected to be released in the second quarter of this year. In the meantime, we are offering an HD-DVR at no additional charge for our CableCARD subscribers that also have a TiVo box. This offer will be in effect until the adapters become available. _
> 
> It then provides contact info.
> It appears that members of the BHN organization are still misinformed as to the cause of the problem. This ESS thinks SDV is operational. At least this time they didn't blame TiVo like they did in response to my original complaint of a week ago.


I am going to send this to Mark (Sr. Brighthouse Field Ops) as he asked to fwd any reponses that I got from customer service that said the switch to SDV was done as we clearly know its not been done yet.


----------



## JWThiers

bigdave2004 said:


> I am going to send this to Mark (Sr. Brighthouse Field Ops) as he asked to fwd any reponses that I got from customer service that said the switch to SDV was done as we clearly know its not been done yet.


I haven't received that response in writing, But They are blaming any Cable card issues on the Tivo. I started my BHN Central FL (brevard) on the 2nd and in addition to the HD channels that are turned on, I also can't get CSPAN3 on Digital cable channel 197 (I get Channel not available) and CSPAN1 on Analog 97 and digital 195 (I get shopNBC instead on both). Makes me wonder what else is borked up, I only found the CSPAN thing because I was customizing my channels received list and was wondering how I missed a channel called SHOPnbc (I was unmarking the shopping channels).


----------



## Goonhilly

My Toshiba cablecard tv (Brevard county) is suffering the same ailments as discussed here: I did not gain the new HD channels; I'm missing some of the HD channels that I had last month; 146 and 147 are not present, and shopnbc occupies channel 97 instead of CSPAN, so it's not a TiVo specific problem.

By comparison, my BHN cable box behaves as it is supposed to.


----------



## JWThiers

Goonhilly said:


> My Toshiba cablecard tv (Brevard county) is suffering the same ailments as discussed here: I did not gain the new HD channels; I'm missing some of the HD channels that I had last month; 146 and 147 are not present, and shopnbc occupies channel 97 instead of CSPAN, so it's not a TiVo specific problem.
> 
> By comparison, my BHN cable box behaves as it is supposed to.


I was expecting the missing/lost HD channels , but the missing Basic cable, digital cable was unexpected, for me at least. Thanks for that confirmation that it is NOT a TIVO only thing I am suffering, Like BH told me. Anyone else lose any Non HD basic cable channels?


----------



## raymac

I too have lost all of my non-HD basic channels. I get nothing below 1013 except 243 (HBO HD) and 259 (SHO HD). I also lost 1021, 1061, 1091, 1124-1127, 1150-1153, 1342, 1359 and 1361. This is on a new TIVO HD that was activated on 1/26/08. It all changed when they did the 5 channel addition.

Two techs have been out swapping cable cards - all s cards - to no avail. They say they have turned it over to engineering.

My Series 3 (about 15 months old) works as I expected, no new channels and nothing above 1341.


----------



## eitingon

It's a new week - let' keep our fingers crossed for a response. For those heading this up - let the rest of us know what we can do to help. Send letters? Emails? Something else? Thanks!


----------



## dkahs23

eitingon said:


> It's a new week - let' keep our fingers crossed for a response. For those heading this up - let the rest of us know what we can do to help. Send letters? Emails? Something else? Thanks!


I would say everyone who hasn't sent a complaint via the Bright house web site do so. As a start.


----------



## RachelF

dkahs23 said:


> I would say everyone who hasn't sent a complaint via the Bright house web site do so. As a start.


Done. I am glad they have a place to do this on their website.


----------



## Okeemike

RachelF said:


> Done. I am glad they have a place to do this on their website.


Can you reply back what they offer you? They offered me a digital receiver, however others indicate they've been offered a HDDVR.


----------



## therlin

Free HD DVR, but it sounds like it's just the box and not the service.

Personally I think they should just turn the channels back on until they go SDV.


----------



## Okeemike

therlin said:


> Free HD DVR, but it sounds like it's just the box and not the service.
> 
> Personally I think they should just turn the channels back on until they go SDV.


Agreed...totally. BHN is supposted to meet this week to discuss doing just that.


----------



## dkahs23

Okeemike said:


> Can you reply back what they offer you? They offered me a digital receiver, however others indicate they've been offered a HDDVR.


Personally I think they should just turn the channels back on until they go SDV.[/QUOTE]

I think they should give us some credit or a months free of service. I have heard anything from them myself.


----------



## JWThiers

If it was just the upcoming SDV channels they turned off, thats one thing but when they also break other channels, it means they weren't ready to do the switch in the first place. Roll it back until they at least fix the other issues they caused. Then if the want to be stupid about it and block access to their customers..., they can deal with that when they are better prepared.


----------



## notnow117

therlin said:


> Free HD DVR, but it sounds like it's just the box and not the service.
> 
> Personally I think they should just turn the channels back on until they go SDV.


It's free HD DVR and service. At least that's what I was told when I scheduled the installation. The rep said there would be no change to my billing.

On a related note, I had the DVR installed this morning... what a pain! Apparently I was only authorized to have 4 devices on my account (I have the 2 cable cards and 2 cable boxes), so the DVR made a 5th. All that meant for me was I had to acknowledge that I wanted a 5th device, but it meant the tech had to stay on the phone with BH for 45 minutes while they figured out how to add it to my account. What a waste of time for everyone. Wouldn't it be so much easier to just give me my channels back?


----------



## celly

In case anyone hasn't done so yet: Please email/call customer care about the situation and your displeasure about it.

Email: https://cfl.mybrighthouse.com/contact_us/email_us/contact_form.aspx
Cable Customer Care: 1-866-309-EASY (3279)


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## therlin

bigdave2004, any updates from Mark? I'm afraid that now that the weekend has passed, they feel less "PR pressure"


----------



## dkahs23

We have to keep pressing forward with this.


----------



## dkahs23

I just got a response from my complaint I filed with Brighthouse. This is what the said



> "Thank you for your email. As we expand our Cable line up, Bright House Networks and other cable operators plan to start using switched digital video to deliver certain channels. Switched digital video will allow cable companies to deliver more channels and services by making better use of the existing bandwidth.
> 
> We are aware that currently two TiVo models that use CableCards are not compatible with switched digital video channels, but TiVo and the cable industry are developing an external adapter to fix the problem. The adapter is expected to be released this year.
> 
> Bright House is allowing customers to trade in their CableCards for an HD DVR set-top box for free until they are able to view those channels on their TiVos.
> 
> You also have the option of keeping your CableCard ($2.95 monthly fee will still apply) and adding a free HD DVR.
> 
> If you would like to set up an appointment to trade in your CableCard for an HD DVR, please submit the request via the contact form below: "


----------



## celly

therlin said:


> bigdave2004, any updates from Mark? I'm afraid that now that the weekend has passed, they feel less "PR pressure"


Does anyone think we'd have a case if we started filing complaints with the FCC?

http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/complaints_general.html

"(1) deceptive or unlawful advertising and marketing (2) billing, privacy and service quality (3) disability access, (4) emergency and public safety, (5) media (general), and (6) other communications issues."

Might have a chance with (1) and (6)?


----------



## eitingon

Complaint submitted online.

_"Thank you for contacting us, and for your interest in Bright House Networks. We will respond to your inquiry as soon as possible. Using the online form provides faster response than sending an email."_


----------



## therlin

dkahs23 said:


> I just got a response from my complaint I filed with Brighthouse. This is what the said


Notice they didn't say that SDV is the reason why we don't get the channels, and that any person using a CableCARD (not just TiVo owners) is not receiving the same channels. They are treating us like we are stupid.

*


----------



## jsnow789

Here is the 2nd response I've recv'd from the FCC regarding my complaint. I think this is it for them... but I think everyone should use the link to complain.

Here it is:

You are receiving this email in response to your inquiry to the FCC.

Dear JSnow789,

Thank you for contacting the FCC.

Your cable company may have required a CableCARD installed by the cable provider to unscramble the protected channels, even local broadcast stations, allowing subscribers to tune all authorized digital channels without the use of a set-top box. Now, your cable company may require a set-top box to receive two-way services such as video on demand, impulse pay-per-view and cable operator-enhanced electronic programming guides. The FCC noted that the cable and consumer electronics industries continue to work on the development of an agreement for two-way "plug and play" receivers that would eliminate the need for a set-top box to receive these advanced cable services. The FCC encouraged the cable and consumer electronics industries to consult with interested parties and affected industries as the two-way negotiations progress.

You may file an on-line complaint at

https://esupport.fcc.gov/sform2000/formE!input.action.

Regards,
TSR36

Rep Number : TSR36

~~~~~~~~~

Note that is says we might need a box to receive VOD, Impulse, and guides. It doesn't say that they may require a box just to receive one way channels that were previously available.


----------



## bigdave2004

I just e-mailed Mark and I tried to call him. If I don't get a timely response I will try again shortly.


----------



## HiDefGator

therlin said:


> Notice they didn't say that SDV is the reason why we don't get the channels, and that any person using a CableCARD (not just TiVo owners) is not receiving the same channels.
> *


Tivo owners are probably 99.9% of the cable card users today. So they aren't far off.


----------



## eitingon

jsnow789 said:


> Now, your cable company may require a set-top box to receive two-way services ...


BUT - this is not what BrightHouse is doing - they are cutting us off just for the sake of cutting us off!


----------



## RachelF

Okeemike said:


> Can you reply back what they offer you? They offered me a digital receiver, however others indicate they've been offered a HDDVR.


Here is it.. they are just making this a form letter now...



> "Thank you for your email. As we expand our Cable line up, Bright House Networks and other cable operators plan to start using switched digital video to deliver certain channels. Switched digital video will allow cable companies to deliver more channels and services by making better use of the existing bandwidth.
> 
> We are aware that currently two TiVo models that use CableCards are not compatible with switched digital video channels, but TiVo and the cable industry are developing an external adapter to fix the problem. The adapter is expected to be released this year.
> 
> Bright House is allowing customers to trade in their CableCards for an HD DVR set-top box for free until they are able to view those channels on their TiVos.
> 
> You also have the option of keeping your CableCard ($2.95 monthly fee will still apply) and adding a free HD DVR.
> 
> If you would like to set up an appointment to trade in your CableCard for an HD DVR, please submit the request via the contact form below: "


----------



## Randman

Yup. I just got the form letter response, as well. 

Keep up the pressure, folks. More emails. Letters to consumer activists. Whatever it takes to make this a PR nightmare for BHN, so they can't ignore us.


----------



## therlin

Just quoting an old message I posted. These folks have A LOT of pull with Bright House.



therlin said:


> If you live in incorporated Orlando, please file a complaint here http://www.cityoforlando.net/cable/brighthouse.htm
> 
> If you live in unincorporated Orlando, please file a complaint here http://www.orangecountyfl.net/cms/DEPT/countyadmin/communications/cable.htm


----------



## celly

Randman said:


> Yup. I just got the form letter response, as well.
> Keep up the pressure, folks. More emails. Letters to consumer activists. Whatever it takes to make this a PR nightmare for BHN, so they can't ignore us.


Can anyone cut/paste anything they have sent to media outlets w/ links and details on this? This way we can all take a shot at blasting it out to as many as we can find?


----------



## eitingon

bigdave2004 said:


> I just e-mailed Mark and I tried to call him. If I don't get a timely response I will try again shortly.


Any word? I sense we are losing momentum


----------



## therlin

They installed my HD DVR last night and it is painful to use. I had to end up calling support for help creating a manual recording and the agent told me it wasn't possible with the new software (I didn't believe her but I still can't figure it out.)

It's so buggy. For example, when the image shrinks to display a menu and you exit the menu, the video doesn't alway go full screen again.

I'm giving the HD DVR a couple more days, there's a good chance I'll return it and go back to TiVo even if it means fewer channels. So far the channels are not worth the frustration of using their equipment.


----------



## bigdave2004

Left another message and will e-mail him again. I got busy at work yesterday and couldn't call him again but if this keeps up I'll give his number out so everyone can call him. 

UPDATE:
Mr. bigdave2004: 

I haven&#8217;t gotten an update yet from senior management. I expect to get an answer by late tomorrow. Thanks 

Mark A. Clark
Sr. Director of Field Operations
Bright House Networks


----------



## Okeemike

bigdave2004 said:


> Left another message and will e-mail him again. I got busy at work yesterday and couldn't call him again but if this keeps up I'll give his number out so everyone can call him.
> 
> UPDATE:
> Mr. bigdave2004:
> 
> I havent gotten an update yet from senior management. I expect to get an answer by late tomorrow. Thanks
> 
> Mark A. Clark
> Sr. Director of Field Operations
> Bright House Networks


Patiently holding my breath...


----------



## JWThiers

Okeemike said:


> Patiently holding my breath...


I wouldn't do that, you could hurt yourself.


----------



## Okeemike

I assume that if I turn blue, I'll get my way.


----------



## JWThiers

I wouldn't hold my breath on that either.


----------



## therlin

I filed a complaint with the FL Division of Consumer Services, today I received a written acknowledgement of this complaint.

Anyone can easily do so at http://www.800helpfla.com/complnt.html


----------



## eabu

Here are some articles that have been published concerning this event:

Orlando Sentinal
Engadget


----------



## JWThiers

Slightly Off Topic, but it does deal with Cable Cards and Brighthouse in Central FL. Do they have M-Cards in this area? I got 4 S-Cards for my THD and am looking to save $6.


----------



## dkahs23

I have sent a reply back to the email I got from bright house. This is what I emailed back..

This is unacceptable. I do not want a free HD DVR Box because it does not do what my Tivo does. Bright House should not release anything that is not compatible with existing cable cards that you charge a monthly fee and that you have to support, or until there is a way to make it compatible. I want my HD Channels back that I had before your release the new channels. That is not to much to ask. I will be filing a complaint with the FCC and other organizations. Again This is Unacceptable.


----------



## dkahs23

jsnow789 said:


> Here is the 2nd response I've recv'd from the FCC regarding my complaint. I think this is it for them... but I think everyone should use the link to complain.
> 
> Here it is:
> 
> You are receiving this email in response to your inquiry to the FCC.
> 
> Dear JSnow789,
> 
> Thank you for contacting the FCC.
> 
> Your cable company may have required a CableCARD installed by the cable provider to unscramble the protected channels, even local broadcast stations, allowing subscribers to tune all authorized digital channels without the use of a set-top box. Now, your cable company may require a set-top box to receive two-way services such as video on demand, impulse pay-per-view and cable operator-enhanced electronic programming guides. The FCC noted that the cable and consumer electronics industries continue to work on the development of an agreement for two-way "plug and play" receivers that would eliminate the need for a set-top box to receive these advanced cable services. The FCC encouraged the cable and consumer electronics industries to consult with interested parties and affected industries as the two-way negotiations progress.
> 
> You may file an on-line complaint at
> 
> https://esupport.fcc.gov/sform2000/formE!input.action.
> 
> Regards,
> TSR36
> 
> Rep Number : TSR36
> 
> ~~~~~~~~~
> 
> Note that is says we might need a box to receive VOD, Impulse, and guides. It doesn't say that they may require a box just to receive one way channels that were previously available.


I have tried to send one but I keep getting an Internal Server Error.


----------



## celly

JWThiers said:


> Slightly Off Topic, but it does deal with Cable Cards and Brighthouse in Central FL. Do they have M-Cards in this area? I got 4 S-Cards for my THD and am looking to save $6.


They do have M-Cards ... But when I tried to call and get them they told me "The reps come with what we have in stock..." -- Which is quite a few S-Cards from people trading them in for M-Cards... 

Also, TivoHD can use a single M-Card -- S3 Tivo still needs two.

"Currently, the Series3 HD DVR will support M-Cards in single-stream mode, which means that the DVR requires two (2) CableCARDs to run in dual-tuner mode. The DVR must also be running software version 8.0.1c or later. (S-Cards are supported in all software versions.) Your Series3 HD DVR may have shipped with an earlier version of the software installed. The software will be updated automatically, but not until the DVR completes Guided Setup for the first time, and then downloads and indexes the full 14 days of Guide data immediately after Guided Setup."


----------



## Okeemike

Let me add a little fuel to the fire. Yesterday, I decided to try to collect my HD DVR to at least get over the hump of the next couple of week that I assume it will take BHN to resolve this. So, I call Customer Service, and get an agent who explains to me that I am eligible for either an HD DVR or an HD Box at no charge, and that I can pick it up at any BHN customer service center. Cool.

*Step One*
I dive to the Altamonte Springs CS center, and speak with "Anita" who's likely one of the rudest reps I've dealt with in a while. Besides not making eye contact with me, she proceeds to tell me that there's 'no way' that BHN would ever give something away for free. I ask her to look it up in her system, as the person I spoke with on the phone was able to find it. She refuses, and instead tells me that there's nothing in my file to indicate that I should get anything.

*Step Two*
I leave and go outside to call customer support again. The agent I speak with tells me a DIFFERENT story, this time saying that I am only eligible for an HD Box, but I have to give up my cable cards. At this point, I'm tired of arguing, and ask her to note it in my file, which she does&#8230;.

*Step Three*
I go back into the service center again, and speak with the same rep (who obviously isn't happy to see me) . I reintroduce myself, and explain my situation. I ask her to look in my file, and that's all documented there. She again explains to me that there's nothing she can do, and calls her supervisor. Her supervisor, "Cindy" agrees. Even though telephone customer support is advising us of this, there's nothing that they're willing to do. Both the agent, and her boss acknowledge what the phone rep said, they're unwilling, however, to follow through with it. Ultimately, they refused to give me a device, and I left empty handed.

Had the CS agent explained that she's not aware of any issues, and even been the slightest bit empathetic, I would have been fine with it. I understand that this is compex issue, affecting a small number of people, so some confusion is to be expected. However, the attitude of Customer Service was such that she look at me as if I was making this all up (which is why I pushed the issue a second and then third time).

I know that I can likely go schedule a rep to come out, but I don't want to wait three hours for someone to maybe show up to my house, for something as simple as a cable box.


----------



## Randman

Please, oh please Bigdave, forward this story to your contact. There is no excuse for this type of customer nonservice.

There's a term for what we are getting from BHN. And it does not include a reacharound.


----------



## JWThiers

I think I remember one of the reasons I switched to DirecTV in the first place way back when. Service. If only DirecTV used tivo's still... I'm beginning to wonder if I'm gonna end up regretting my switch back to cable.


----------



## Okeemike

JWThiers said:


> I think I remember one of the reasons I switched to DirecTV in the first place way back when. Service. If only DirecTV used tivo's still... I'm beginning to wonder if I'm gonna end up regretting my switch back to cable.


I switched to cable _specifically_ due the ability to go back to TiVo. I tried the DTV HD DVR ,and it drove me insane. (deleting a show WHILE I'm watching it? Come on!). If t weren't for that, however, I'd still be a very happy satellite subscriber. They've got a better HD channel selection, and I never needed a tech to come to my house.

Should something as frivolous as television be this frustrating?


----------



## bhartman1

I had a similar experience as Okeemike this afternoon at the East Colonial BHN center. I was told last night on the phone that I could exchange my HD box for an HD DVR for free (since I still want to use my Tivo HD). When I went to the CS center they said they would only honor the "campaign" if I brought back both cable cards. I argued with her for a while and finally she gave me an HD DVR, but she said I was responsible for calling customer support and getting it activated for free. I am going to try calling tonight and see if they'll honor what they told me on the phone last night.

They seemed unaware at this CS center that we had lost channels - only that we did not receive the new ones.


----------



## bigdave2004

So if we don't get the channels back today or any word I think the least they could do would be to give us a single point of contact at Brighthouse for this issue so we can all stop going through this.


----------



## Okeemike

Perhaps if we all met up this weekend, and stormed one service center (with torches and pitchforks).


----------



## celly

Okeemike said:


> Perhaps if we all met up this weekend, and stormed one service center (with torches and pitchforks).


I have decided that no matter what I'll most likely be leaving Brighthouse for Comcast, mainly because of the way everyone with this issue has been treated. It's silly we have all wasted this much time, and energy on this, with no resolution or even a proper acknowledgement of the situation. They don't even have the courtesy to say "Sorry" in the form mail they sent all of us when we complained. They almost made it sound like it was our fault...

And worst of all, at the end of this month, we're all going to give them more money. WTF?

Granted, this will most likely end up being an issue with Comcast as well -- I did the math and it'll will cost me less for basic cable/Internet, and then pay downloadable HD content I want from a service like AppleTV or Amazon Unbox (as support is added)... (Who are we kidding, the writer strike is going to make new HD shows few and far for a few months)

Either way I end up with at least the same amount of HD content as I have now (if not more) -- And won't be paying BHN a damn dime.


----------



## bigdave2004

No response at all today from my contact. He did forget to edit his signature on the last e-mail I did get so I got his cell number and his nextel direct connect so I'll harass him tomorrow. I am gonna go check but I doubt I have the channels.... 

Nope....


----------



## edju

therlin said:


> I filed a complaint with the FL Division of Consumer Services, today I received a written acknowledgement of this complaint.
> 
> Anyone can easily do so at http://www.800helpfla.com/complnt.html


I would suggest, if you haven't already, to file a complaint with this organization as upon doing so I received a call from BHN CSR within 3 days trying to *resolve* this matter. I also received a letter from FL Dept of Agriculture and Consumer Services explaining the complaint process. If all of us unite, we can get the service back since SDV is not why we have lost our channel, but rather an illegal decision from upper management to take away channel from cablecard users.


----------



## JWThiers

Okeemike said:


> Perhaps if we all met up this weekend, and stormed one service center (with torches and pitchforks).


There was that elderly lady that beat up a computer at a (I think it was a cable company) service center with a hammer. She wanted to get their attention, I think it worked.


----------



## Randman

> I filed a complaint with the FL Division of Consumer Services, today I received a written acknowledgement of this complaint.
> 
> Anyone can easily do so at http://www.800helpfla.com/complnt.html


Complaint Filed. Let's flood these people.

BHN needs to change their ways.


----------



## dkahs23

Well got another response to my email from Bright House.



> Friday, February 15, 2008
> 
> Dear David,
> 
> Thank you for your email. We apologize that the free HD DVR offer is the only resolution that we can provide you with at this time.
> 
> Your email has been forwarded to the appropriate department for further consideration. The suggestions we receive from our customers are valuable and provide us with the opportunity to make changes that will ultimately allow us to serve you better. If you have any additional questions or concerns, please do not hesitate to contact us via email. Thank you for taking the time to write us, and have a great day.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Michael - 1069
> Electronic Support Specialist
> 
> The Bright House Networks Customer Care Team
> 
> Central Florida Division
> 
> ****************************************************************
> 
> Original Message Follows: ------------------------
> 
> This is unacceptable. I do not want a free HD DVR Box because it does not do what my Tivo does. Bright House should not release anything that is not compatible with existing cable cards that you charge a monthly fee for and that you have to support, or until there is a way to make it compatible. I want my HD Channels back that I had before your release the new channels. That is not to much to ask. I will be filing a complaint with the FCC and other organizations. Again This is Unacceptable.
> 
> David


----------



## Okeemike

Has anyone actually been able to obtain the HD DVR?


----------



## notnow117

Okeemike said:


> Has anyone actually been able to obtain the HD DVR?


Yes. I had mine installed on Monday. Making the appt was no problem, but the tech ran into some issues when he tried to have the box added to my account. Something about me exceeding the maximum number allowed devices. It took about an hour to straighten out. Now I have the additional headache of being short on outlets and inputs on my receiver.


----------



## therlin

I got the HD DVR installed too. It's horrible. I got one with some new software that cannot even do half of what the old one can.

I'm seriously considering going back to TiVo and just missing out on those channels.


----------



## net114

therlin said:


> I got the HD DVR installed too. It's horrible. I got one with some new software that cannot even do half of what the old one can.
> 
> I'm seriously considering going back to TiVo and just missing out on those channels.


Hate to say "I told you so" about the "new" HD DVR....but somewhere, some posts back I mentioned that you really don't want to put yourself through the heart ache of the new HD DVR.

It has less features than I had in 1999-2000 era with my first Tivo, and what "features" it has are put together very, very badly.


----------



## orangeboy

I sent this off last night to the Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services :

On 02/01/2008, Bright House Networks intentionally withheld specific HD and non-HD channels for use with my cablecard devices when rolling out new channels. The 5 new channels introduced on that day were not viewable to myself, or other cable card users. In addition to the 5 new channels, 7+ previously working channels have ceased being viewable as well. This decision to withhold these channels is NOT based on technical issues surrounding new technology (switched digital video), but rather the intention of deploying this technology at an undisclosed date in the future. My statement is backed by a response I received from Bright House on 2/13/2008 for complaint KMM764227I22972L0KM: "Later this year, Bright House and other cable operators plan to start using switched digital video to deliver certain channels. Switched digital video will allow cable companies to deliver more channels and services by making better use of the existing bandwidth." With the following statement by Bright House in the same e-mail response, it is apparent that this cable operator would prefer for me to use their equipment (which comes at a higher monthly cost than the cablecards) instead of the hardware I already have: "If you would like to set up an appointment to trade in your CableCard for an HD DVR, please submit the request via the contact form below: https://cfl.mybrighthouse.com/contact_us/email_us/contact_form.aspx". 

Under the rules of the FCC, cable operators are required to support cablecards. No new technology has been introduced the prevents the programming offered by Bright House from being viewed on the cable cards supplied by Bright House.


----------



## net114

Good letter orangeboy.


----------



## eitingon

I sent a similar letter to the FCC.


----------



## jamesweber

To help some people out I see some posts that aren't entirely correct...

1) TiVo isn't making the Tuner Resolver (aka SDV / USB Dongle) It is being made by CableLabs which is controlled by the Cable Companies. TiVo only worked with CableLabs in the develpoment of said device. TiVo has no control of when it will be ready since they do not make it. It does seem to be on schedule for 2Q08 so it shouldn't be to long of a wait.

2) Where as some people have stated that the CableCard is capable of receiving the SDV signal and blame BHN of not sending it is partially correct... It will receive the signal and it can decode it, but without the Tuner Resolver (aka The SDV Dongle) to send the request for the specific channel to be sent to your home there is no signal to decode. So it is not that BHN is no longer supporting the CableCards, it's solely for the fact that SDV can not work without 2way communication hence the long awaited tuner resolver.

3) For those who do not know how the Tuner Resolver connects... It connects into the Coax line before going into the TiVo and into the USB port to power and control the needed outgoing signal to BHN to tell them to send then requested channel that is now SDV. (thus making the TiVo with the help of the Tuner Resolver a 2way connection).


A RAY OF HOPE...
For anyone with a TiVo that has used CableCards for the past couple of years, our troubles with them will soon be comming to an end. Although the FCC made a horrible mistake several years ago forcing cable companies to support CableCards but not forcing them to use them in their own boxes which made it a non-priority to Cable Co's whether the CableCards worked properly or not. That has since been corrected by the FCC and now Cable Co's have to use the CableCards in their new boxes as well. This decision by the FCC will have a DRASTIC AND DRAMATIC EFFECT on the development and support of cable cards going forward from this point forward. BHN has been installing new cable boxes with the CableCards installed in them for the past several months...They have been having a very difficult time which serves them right, if they would have put the neccessary effort into making them work properly years ago they wouldn't be saddled with the problems they are having now. Certainly now that their own boxes are are dependant on CableCards it will be a priority for them to get them finally working properly with their systems.

I hope this clears up some misunderstandings about SDV that some people might have had. After reading so many posts about the topic that were incorrect, I thought I would take a few minutes out of my evening and try to clarify some things.

Have a Great Day everyone
TiVo Rocks


----------



## notnow117

jamesweber said:


> 2) Where as some people have stated that the CableCard is capable of receiving the SDV signal and blame BHN of not sending it is partially correct... It will receive the signal and it can decode it, but without the Tuner Resolver (aka The SDV Dongle) to send the request for the specific channel to be sent to your home there is no signal to decode. So it is not that BHN is no longer supporting the CableCards, it's solely for the fact that SDV can not work without 2way communication hence the long awaited tuner resolver.


Not sure if this is what you're referring to, but to be clear, BHN is not using SDV yet. When they do switch to SDV, then yes, you will need the dongle. But until that time, I think it's fair to say they are not fully supporting CableCARDs. I'm not sure what else you would call it


----------



## acvthree

notnow117 said:


> Not sure if this is what you're referring to, but to be clear, BHN is not using SDV yet. When they do switch to SDV, then yes, you will need the dongle. But until that time, I think it's fair to say they are not fully supporting CableCARDs. I'm not sure what else you would call it


That is correct.

BH is cutting off stations that can be recieved by cable card third party devices.

BH is continuing to send stations to their set top boxes that use cable cards (as all new STBs must).

BH has NOT started using SDV.

This is not an SDV issue or any other technical issue.

It is a marketing decision to use their (effective) monopoly position to reduce the usefullness of a competitor for set top boxes.

Al


----------



## acvthree

jamesweber said:


> I hope this clears up some misunderstandings about SDV that some people might have had. After reading so many posts about the topic that were incorrect, I thought I would take a few minutes out of my evening and try to clarify some things.


Boy, did you miss on this one. I hope these replies have cleared up your complete missunderstanding of the issues at BH.

Have a nice day!


----------



## jamesweber

I never said BH is on SDV already... 

I am perfectly aware that BH pulled the channels early before they had actually launched SDV. 

Certainly I believe BH was wrong, but honestly is anyone really surprised after all it's BrightHouse...they overcharge, have crappy tech support, and for the most part DO NOT care about the customers because they know if you want cable in their area you have no choice but to use them. 

My post was in response to posts that had incorrect information about how SDV works and among other things not whether or not BH has switched over to SDV yet.

Quote from previous thread

"They told me that alot of cable providers are using SDV and it works fine with cable cards"

this among other things is why I posted, Now I'm sorry I took the time


----------



## mbhuff

I may be the lone wolf on this one, but I'm of the very strong belief that SDV is mainly being used to bludgeon cablecard to death. And even when the so-called "dongle" (which btw is now looking like a set top box rather than a cable), is finally available, it will be very slowly rolled out, it will have incompatabilities and by the time it finally is getting close to working, they cable companies will find a reason to introduce SDV 2.0 which is incompatible. 

If you read any of the edgar fillings with the SEC you will see that the cable companies forsee their greatest revenue growth by providing service via "their" set-top boxes. Tivo undermines this. The won't allow it to succeed. They don't mind if it's a few folk that use it, but they will go out of their way to make sure it's as unpleasant as possible. They fought cable-cards from day 1, and with the current feckless FCC, they are going to get rid of it forever.

The only viable solution that I can see as the end-state is something like OCAP which allows the cable companies to completely control the set-top box and decide which version and features of a DVR the end user is "allowed" to have including a Tivo interface if the cable company wants to provide it.

Do I like it? Hell no. But I think that is Tivo ultimate future.


----------



## classicsat

jamesweber said:


> To help some people out I see some posts that aren't entirely correct...
> 
> 1) TiVo isn't making the Tuner Resolver (aka SDV / USB Dongle) It is being made by CableLabs which is controlled by the Cable Companies. TiVo only worked with CableLabs in the develpoment of said device. TiVo has no control of when it will be ready since they do not make it. It does seem to be on schedule for 2Q08 so it shouldn't be to long of a wait.


Not entirely true. The Tuning resolvers will be manufactured by the respective security technology manufacturer; Motorola or Scientific Atlanta. Cablelabs only sets the standards for 3rd paty equipment to adhere to, and certifies that 3rd party hardware does adhere to the standards they set.


> 3) For those who do not know how the Tuner Resolver connects... It connects into the Coax line before going into the TiVo and into the USB port to power and control the needed outgoing signal to BHN to tell them to send then requested channel that is now SDV. (thus making the TiVo with the help of the Tuner Resolver a 2way connection).


I haven't see one, but I'd bet the tuning resolver has its own power supply.


----------



## jamesweber

I certainly wouldn't doubt that it has a plug in power supply, as stated in the post just above what used to look like a small adapter is looking like its going to be a box.

The original plans I saw for the tuner probably more than a year ago now looked somewhat like the old nintendo adapter you used to connect the game unit to your TV which was quite small. I was just searching the other day looking for the design of this device it does look more like a set top box as described in the post above. what it will actually look like will be a surprise since I can't seem to find a pic of it anywhere which is surprising since it's supposed to be out within the next 3-4 months.

As far as my previous post about Cable Labs, I did mis-speak I should have used the term developing instead of making, Of course as with almost everything CableLabs developes it will be made by SA and MOTO. In this forum as well as others on this site I noticed some people that were talking about how TiVo should be making this resolver faster and planned better and how TiVo shouldn't charge for this and so forth. Just wanted to clarify that TiVo has no control over the manufacturing or deployment of the tuner resolver. 

As with everyone on this board as well as other sites I believe...

1) the FCC screwed up major when they didn't require the cable co's to use cable cards from the start.

2) CableLabs only interest is in whats best for the Cable Co's not the consumer

3) BrightHouse Networks is the DEVIL and I will put up with their crap forever before I rent one of their DVR's or use their set top box

4) and their fee of $4 a month per cablecard to access the channels I pay for because I don't want their box is criminal.

The only good thing is that we are not completely alone, at least the FCC is trying to fix these problems and their mistakes of the past. If they are successful or not seems to be the up in the air.


----------



## jamesweber

Just went to BHN site, didn't realize they lowered the Cable Card price to $2.95


----------



## therlin

I have received the response from BHN to the Florida Consumer Services Division regarding my original complaint (before the offer to the free DVR). It says:

"Thank you for forwarding the complaint from XXXX. Bright House Networks will be adding dozens of new high definition channels over the next year. In order to add these channels, a new technology called switched digital video will be deployed. CableCARDs are not compatible with this new technology. Until CableCARDs are compatible with switched digital video technology, high definition programming will be limited to a few channels. In an effort to assist customers in this situation, we are offering to provide them with one (1) free HD DRV and will waive the box deposit."

Notice that they do not say that they turned off previously accessible channels nor that this technology is in place yet.

I will contact the person who responded to the complaint for more information. If I do not get a satisfactory answer, I will file a new complaint with the new information that we are all now aware of.

I once again encourage everyone affected by BHN's latest move to file a complaint at http://www.800helpfla.com/complnt.html


----------



## moyekj

jamesweber said:


> The original plans I saw for the tuner probably more than a year ago now looked somewhat like the old nintendo adapter you used to connect the game unit to your TV which was quite small. I was just searching the other day looking for the design of this device it does look more like a set top box as described in the post above. what it will actually look like will be a surprise since I can't seem to find a pic of it anywhere which is surprising since it's supposed to be out within the next 3-4 months


 The Motorola solution is rumored to take the form factor (and perhaps mostly a stripped down version) of it's compact digital only DCT700 set top box:
http://connectedhome2go.com/2007/11...tched-digital-solution-for-cablecard-devices/
A picture of it here:


----------



## bigdave2004

Looks like we might have more reasons to drop brighthouse:

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment/tv/orl-wkmg1708feb17,0,7182648.story?page=1


----------



## tivoknucklehead

bigdave2004 said:


> Looks like we might have more reasons to drop brighthouse:
> 
> http://www.orlandosentinel.com/entertainment/tv/orl-wkmg1708feb17,0,7182648.story?page=1


first the Magic, then SDV, now this. What a joke BH is becoming


----------



## dkahs23

Go figure.....I wonder if we will put on the back burner, due to this new development with CBS


----------



## bigdave2004

Anyone feel like writing the WKMG Local6 Problem Solvers about our story:

http://www.local6.com/money/2243827/detail.html

It might help both of us.


----------



## eitingon

Yikes! Might need to fire up the old antenna to get locals again (former DirecTV 10-250 user here)


----------



## bigdave2004

hahaha I was looking for a domain to start listing brighthouses issue so naturally I started with brighthousesucks.com and guess who owns it, THEY DO!

Whois Server Version 2.0

Domain names in the .com and .net domains can now be registered
with many different competing registrars. Go to http://www.internic.net
for detailed information.

Domain Name: BRIGHTHOUSESUCKS.COM
Registrar: DSTR ACQUISITION PA I, LLC DBA DOMAINBANK.COM
Whois Server: rs.domainbank.net
Referral URL: http://www.domainbank.net
Name Server: NS1.MYBRIGHTHOUSE.COM
Name Server: NS2.MYBRIGHTHOUSE.COM
Status: clientDeleteProhibited
Status: clientTransferProhibited
Status: clientUpdateProhibited
Updated Date: 01-aug-2007
Creation Date: 27-nov-2002
Expiration Date: 27-nov-2008

>>> Last update of whois database: Sun, 17 Feb 2008 15:44:18 UTC <<<

Domain Services Provided By:
Domain Bank, [email protected]
http:///www.domainbank.com

Registrant:
Bright House Networks, LLC
5000 Campuswood Drive
E. Syracuse, NY 13057
US

Registrar: DOMAINBANK
Domain Name: BRIGHTHOUSESUCKS.COM
Created on: 27-NOV-02
Expires on: 27-NOV-08
Last Updated on: 24-DEC-07

Administrative, Technical Contact:
Hostmaster, Bright House Networks [email protected]
Bright House Networks LLC
2251 Lucien Way
Maitland, FL 32751
US
4072158076
4072158732

Domain servers in listed order:
NS2.MYBRIGHTHOUSE.COM 
NS1.MYBRIGHTHOUSE.COM

I know alot of companies own the <company>sucks.com domain but this just made me laugh, maybe i'll go with brighthouseREALLYsucks.com


----------



## dkahs23

"I don't care who you are....That Sh*$ was funny...."


----------



## eabu

Bright House Networks also owns:

brighthousenetworkssucks.com
brighthousenetworkssucks.net
brighthousenetworkssucks.org
brighthousenetworkssucks.biz
brighthousenetworkssucks.info
brighthousenetworkssucks.us
brighthousesucks.org

Available:

brighthousesucks.net
brighthousesucks.info
brighthousesucks.biz
brighthousesucks.us


----------



## bigdave2004

eabu said:


> Bright House Networks also owns:
> 
> brighthousenetworkssucks.com
> brighthousenetworkssucks.net
> brighthousenetworkssucks.org
> brighthousenetworkssucks.biz
> brighthousenetworkssucks.info
> brighthousenetworkssucks.us
> brighthousesucks.org
> 
> Available:
> 
> brighthousesucks.net
> brighthousesucks.info
> brighthousesucks.biz
> brighthousesucks.us


I got brighthousereallysucks.com.


----------



## eabu

Bright House plays rough...

http://consumerist.com/351664/brigh...ice-after-too-many-unsubstantiated-complaints


----------



## ah30k

It has been stated in this thread that CableCARDs cannot get SDV channels. Remember that it is the one-way host device that does not work with SDV.

The CableCARDs in the MSO DVRs and STBs work just fine with SDV.

OpenCable™ - CableCARD™ Primer


----------



## therlin

ah30k said:


> It has been stated in this thread that CableCARDs cannot get SDV channels. Remember that it is the one-way host device that does not work with SDV.
> 
> The CableCARDs in the MSO DVRs and STBs work just fine with SDV.
> 
> OpenCable  CableCARD Primer


I think we all understand that limitation and we can live with it .... when they implement SDV in Q3 of 2008. There is no reason to turn other channels off until then.


----------



## dkahs23

I have a question with everything that is happening with Bright House and our HD Channels. It is also happening across the states with other cable company's. My question is doesn't a company like TiVo have the insight that SDV was going to happen before they put out TiVo HD or any Series 3 Tivo. And if they did why didn't they make it compatible since they knew SDV was coming? Maybe TiVo is part of the blame as well as the cable company's


----------



## JWThiers

Its a problem with the cable card spec. The current version does NOT allow for 2 way communication with the Cable Companies Headend


----------



## ah30k

JWThiers said:


> Its a problem with the cable card spec. The current version does NOT allow for 2 way communication with the Cable Companies Headend


Absolutely NOT true. Please read the CableCARD primer a couple of posts prior to this one before spreading dis-information with such confidence.


----------



## HiDefGator

dkahs23 said:


> I have a question with everything that is happening with Bright House and our HD Channels. It is also happening across the states with other cable company's. My question is doesn't a company like TiVo have the insight that SDV was going to happen before they put out TiVo HD or any Series 3 Tivo. And if they did why didn't they make it compatible since they knew SDV was coming? Maybe TiVo is part of the blame as well as the cable company's


Tivo didn't really have a choice. They believed they had to have an HD box to gain subscribers. Back when they were working on that box and still today, there was no way for them to solve SDV without the cable companies help. It was ship a box that didn't support SDV or ship nothing at all.


----------



## jamesweber

dkahs23 said:


> I have a question with everything that is happening with Bright House and our HD Channels. It is also happening across the states with other cable company's. My question is doesn't a company like TiVo have the insight that SDV was going to happen before they put out TiVo HD or any Series 3 Tivo. And if they did why didn't they make it compatible since they knew SDV was coming? Maybe TiVo is part of the blame as well as the cable company's


I would Think SDV is just like all the other interactive applications with cable companies. There is or at least was no standard, each cable company has their own individual programmong to make such communications possible with their systems. That's why the cable companies have been pushing so hard for OCAP, they would much rather just download the programming into a chip then deal with cablecards and techs having to make house calls. If the cable companies would have just been bright enough to forsee this before the introduction of cablecards and the trouble they caused and gotten together and absorbed the development cost for 3rd party devices we would not have these issues today. I am sure TiVo as well as any CE manufacturer would have been just as happy to install an on board chip then having to mess arround with cablecard decoders.

So if it is true that SDV is like other interative operations with cable systems there would have been no way at the time of development of the series 3 to even make it possible whether they could forsee SDV or not.

I do remember reading a statement from TiVo before the series 3 came out explaining the constant changes made by Cable Labs during the develoment of the Cable Card which forced TiVo to squeeze in a second CC decoder which was never planned for and pushed the launch date of the series 3 a year past their goal as well as nearly $300 over budget which explained the insane retail price when it did finally come out over a year late.

It all boils down to the greed of the cable companies not wanting anyone to take a piece of their already insane profits. Come on now really basic cable $50+ that's about a $20 increase since I moved in to my Home 10 years ago...and I really don't recall what channels they've added to basic cable that could possibly justify the increase

Ok Done ranting for now, Stay strong


----------



## ah30k

jamesweber said:


> It all boils down to the greed of the cable companies not wanting anyone to take a piece of their already insane profits. Come on now really basic cable $50+ that's about a $20 increase since I moved in to my Home 10 years ago...and I really don't recall what channels they've added to basic cable that could possibly justify the increase.


There certainly is some handsome profit in cable television, but the fees the MSOs have to pay providers like ESPN and CNN have gone up quite a bit as well causing part of the price increase.


----------



## JWThiers

ah30k said:


> Absolutely NOT true. Please read the CableCARD primer a couple of posts prior to this one before spreading dis-information with such confidence.


My Mistake, the spec is for 2 way but...



> This one-way cable-ready receiver was defined by the FCC's Plug & Play order and by the Joint Test Suite (JTS


NOT being a history major, but knowing how government bureaucracies work, I would suspect that the FCC was forced into that because of feet dragging by the cable companies and pressure from outside sources. Regardless, most (I'm tempted to say all) Consumer Electronics available for end user purchase (Tivo, TV's) use the 1 way standard. That makes it the De Facto Standard. I'd be willing to bet that the reason the 2 way spec isn't used is high licensing fees from CableLabs and/or limitations imposed by CableLabs on how the device operates. Good rule of thumb, if you want to find out why something is the way it is follow the money.


----------



## ah30k

Not only is the spec two-way, bu the cards are as well! How do you think the newer Mot DCH-xxxx STBs and SA STBs work with VOD and SDV?

Yes, the licenses call for uni-directional hosts to be one-way (hence the name uni-directional) and kind of pigeon-holed many CE devices to be uni-directional. That is not the card's problems though. They are truly two-way. People should stop claiming that the CableCARD and its specs are one-way only.


----------



## acvthree

The cable cards are two way, but when did cable labs license two way communication?

Al


----------



## bigdave2004

I finally got a response, and it sucks....

_Mr. bigdave2004:

I finally got an answer today about the status of missing and additional channels for cable cards and TiVO. Unfortunately despite my efforts, nothing is going change short team. When the TiVO adapters hit the market in a month or two, we will revisit the issue. I can still provide an HD-DVR for you free of charge until then. I apologize but there is nothing else I can do at this time. Thanks

Mark A. Clark
Sr. Director of Field Operations
Bright House Networks_


----------



## celly

bigdave2004 said:


> I finally got a response, and it sucks....
> 
> _Mr. bigdave2004:
> 
> I finally got an answer today about the status of missing and additional channels for cable cards and TiVO. Unfortunately despite my efforts, nothing is going change short team. When the TiVO adapters hit the market in a month or two, we will revisit the issue. I can still provide an HD-DVR for you free of charge until then. I apologize but there is nothing else I can do at this time. Thanks
> 
> Mark A. Clark
> Sr. Director of Field Operations
> Bright House Networks_


Hmmm.. Welp, looks like I'm canceling brighthouse...


----------



## Okeemike

Everyone please email BHN President Chris Fenger at [email protected]

Not sure if will make a difference, but it sure can't hurt to try.


----------



## bigdave2004

This was my reply to Mark, I CC'd Chris Fenger, Jae Nale (Orange County Franchise Lady) and [email protected] consumerist.com:

_Mark,

Thanks for getting back to me. I can only say I am really disappointed in Brighthouse's decision to do this. The channels are there, on the line, and you're choosing not to let us view them. This is being done for no other reason than we made the choice to use a different set top box than yours. This is not saving bandwidth, and we all realize even if we only had the channels for a month or so, it would still be worth it to us. I can't really understand the logic here and I am really disappointed in your decision. This just goes to show the lack of customer service at Brighthouse. We will continue to file complaints and tell anyone who will listen about what Brighthouse has chose to do. This is not an SDV issue and you've clearly stated that you have not started to use SDV. This is a customer service issue, or rather lack of customer service. At this time I am still weighing my options on whether to stay with Brighthouse or not. Why should I continue to spend money with a company that obviously does not care for its customers? Would it be possible for Brighthouse to set up a contact number so all TiVo owners can take part in the free HD-DVR? A few TiVo owners have tried to take you up on this offer only to meet resistance&#8230;thus further proving my point about your company's poor customer service.

Thanks,
Dave_


----------



## Okeemike

For what it's worth, I also placed a complaint to the WKMG "Problem Solvers" at http://www.local6.com/money/2243827/detail.html.

With the problems that the TV station and BHN are having, I'm sure that Channel 6 is looking for any bad press they can find for Brighthouse.


----------



## bigdave2004

Okeemike said:


> For what it's worth, I also placed a complaint to the WKMG "Problem Solvers" at http://www.local6.com/money/2243827/detail.html.
> 
> With the problems that the TV station and BHN are having, I'm sure that Channel 9 is looking for any bad press they can find for Brighthouse.


You mean Channel 6 is looking for bad press, just because you were on channel 9 news doesn't mean they are the only station.


----------



## Okeemike

bigdave2004 said:


> You mean Channel 6 is looking for bad press, just because you were on channel 9 news doesn't mean they are the only station.


Whatever... If BHN was a big fat guy, I'd be more than happy to run him down.


----------



## dkahs23

Well what are we to do, other than suck it up. And wait for the dongle or what ever it called, Because the HD Tivo will not work with satellite. Right? I'm just as disappointed as the rest of you. It really F-ing sux.


----------



## ah30k

I don't get it. Are the channels lost due to SDV or not? The dongle will only help with SDV channels.

It sounds like some are suggesting that they are still on the plant as broadcast but simply removed these channels from the channel map for the S3.


----------



## acvthree

dkahs23 said:


> Well what are we to do, other than suck it up. And wait for the dongle or what ever it called, Because the HD Tivo will not work with satellite. Right? I'm just as disappointed as the rest of you. It really F-ing sux.


I don't understand your reasoning.

These stations are being blocked from third party CE devices. BH says they have not started to use SDV. This has nothing to do with SDV.

Since this has nothing to do with SDV, I don't understand why you think they will turn those stations back on after they start using SDV and there is a dongle.

Al


----------



## PPC1

ah30k said:


> It sounds like some are suggesting that they are still on the plant as broadcast but simply removed these channels from the channel map for the S3.


That is exactly what the posts are saying. They are accusing BHN of removing these new channels from the channel map for non-BHN cable card equipment, even though they have not implemented SDV yet, and therefore these device could successfully tune the channels at issue but for BHN's deliberate act. The speculated reason of BHN is to prevent a public relations backlash that would come from the effect of the inability of these same non BHN cable card device customers to receive these channels once they actually do implement SDV.

I think you can sense the frustration of some of these posters being told that they can't get these channels due to technical reasons because TiVo cannot yet tune SDV (pending roll out of the SDV dongl), when there was apparently an admission that BHN hasn't rolled out SDV yet, and the real reason is BHN simply turned these channels off for these customers and could if chose turn them back on at any moment.


----------



## dkahs23

acvthree said:


> I don't understand your reasoning.
> 
> These stations are being blocked from third party CE devices. BH says they have not started to use SDV. This has nothing to do with SDV.
> 
> Since this has nothing to do with SDV, I don't understand why you think they will turn those stations back on after they start using SDV.
> 
> Al


I know it doesn't have anything to do with SDV. I realize we are being block. I don't think they will ever turn them back on to cable card subscribers. My whole point is what are we suppose to do. BHN are being corporate A-holes about this.


----------



## dig_duggler

What's the latest word from the local franchising authority?


----------



## bigdave2004

dig_duggler said:


> What's the latest word from the local franchising authority?


I CC'd her on my reply to Mark and haven't heard anything from anyone.

Just to summarize the issue:


Brighthouse has not gone SDV
They have chosen not to add the service tags for these channels only for cable card customers
Still unknown why they have chosen this route.

I was originally thought they had gone to SDV (beginning of this thread) but we've gotten confirmation that they haven't so they are just doing thing because they can.


----------



## dig_duggler

I'd suggest sending a letter to the franchising board in a verifiable way (certified mail, UPS, etc). I _believe_ that once a complaint is filed BHN will have to send somebody to the next board meeting to respond to the complaint. Since on the surface this seems clearly illegal, you are going to have to push them as hard as you can in every available avenue possible. Good ol boy politics may prevail with the franchising board. Any PR you can muster up is good too, and you seem to have already have gotten some.

At least you have a group that can make some attempts. It's much worse being by yourself.

It also might help writing into the Consumerist, detailing all of the efforts so far. If it makes the front page, it might have legs.


----------



## Okeemike

bigdave2004 said:


> ....they are just doing thing because they can.


I hear they also like to kick puppies, and knock down old ladies.


----------



## acvthree

dkahs23 said:


> I know it doesn't have anything to do with SDV. I realize we are being block. I don't think they will ever turn them back on to cable card subscribers. My whole point is what are we suppose to do. BHN are being corporate A-holes about this.


Sorry. I missunderstood your post.

As mentioned, contacting the franchising authority would be important.

A complaint to the FCC saying that BH is cutting off non-SDV channels to third party cable card devices while leaving them on their own cable card devices might be some help.

Al


----------



## PPC1

If the purpose of the cable card mandate was to open up the market for digital cable tuners to competition, it would seem that TiVo may be the real entity with standing to push this issue before the FCC. Of course, the fact that consumers are being harmed probably would not hurt their cause any.


----------



## acvthree

That is a very good point.

Has anyone brought this to Tivo's attention?

Al


----------



## dig_duggler

While we know that Tivo reads most of these threads (and surely this one has enough posts to have been read) they are extreeeemely selective about when they decide to post and even then it is usually to ask about a bug found or comment on a pending release.

I can't recall an instance (on the boards or being reported on the boards) where Tivo got involved with a franchise (unless it was for technical support). Perhaps someone will correct me.

I think this is going to have to be up to the users pushing hard to the local franchising authority (and up the chain, wherever that might lead).


----------



## therlin

dig_duggler said:


> I think this is going to have to be up to the users pushing hard to the local franchising authority (and up the chain, wherever that might lead).


Exactly. I've posted these a couple of times, I feel they bear repeating for the "late comers"

*Franchising Authority*
If you live in incorporated Orlando, please file a complaint here http://www.cityoforlando.net/cable/brighthouse.htm

If you live in unincorporated Orlando, please file a complaint here http://www.orangecountyfl.net/cms/DEPT/countyadmin/communications/cable.htm

*Florida Division of Consumer Services*
http://app1.800helpfla.com/cswebcomplaints/FileComplaint.aspx
(BHN will have 30 days to reply to this complaint.)

If you haven't filed a complaint with both of these organizations, I urge you to do so.


----------



## PPC1

If you are not in Florida, but are say, in Indianapolis and are similarly affected, you might try this link:

http://www.indygov.org/eGov/Cable/contactus.htm


----------



## Okeemike

dig_duggler said:


> While we know that Tivo reads most of these threads (and surely this one has enough posts to have been read) they are extreeeemely selective about when they decide to post and even then it is usually to ask about a bug found or comment on a pending release.
> 
> I can't recall an instance (on the boards or being reported on the boards) where Tivo got involved with a franchise (unless it was for technical support). Perhaps someone will correct me.
> 
> I think this is going to have to be up to the users pushing hard to the local franchising authority (and up the chain, wherever that might lead).


I hate to name drop, but doesn't *TivoPony* work for TiVo's marketing department? Would that be an appropriate place to start within TiVo? I mean, if the cable co's refuse to 'fully' support Cable Cards, it ultimately affects TiVo as a whole, right?


----------



## acvthree

I wouldn't think TivoPony would repspond to this thread, but I do think it is worth the effort for the effected individuals to send him a PM.

At the very least, it can't hurt.

Al


----------



## moyekj

Okeemike said:


> I hate to name drop, but doesn't *TivoPony* work for TiVo's marketing department? Would that be an appropriate place to start within TiVo? I mean, if the cable co's refuse to 'fully' support Cable Cards, it ultimately affects TiVo as a whole, right?


 What are you expecting exactly? Tivo is well aware of the SDV issue and Tivo & CableLabs already collaborated on coming up with a "tuning resolver" solution for SDV (yet to be released of course). The fact that some cable companies like BH and Cox are already denying channels to CableCard customers because they are being reserved for future SDV deployment is completely out of Tivo's control and jurisdiction.


----------



## PPC1

Oh wait, we were all wrong. Cable companies are actively supporting UDCP cable card compliant devices.

http://www.ncta.com/DocumentBinary.aspx?id=459

It must be all in our heads.


----------



## eabu

We know BrightHouse Networks can turn off and turn on HD channels for cablecard users because they initally turned off A & E HD and then turned it back on.


----------



## TiVoToo

bigdave2004 said:


> I finally got a response, and it sucks....
> 
> _Mr. bigdave2004:
> 
> I finally got an answer today about the status of missing and additional channels for cable cards and TiVO. Unfortunately despite my efforts, nothing is going change short team. When the TiVO adapters hit the market in a month or two, we will revisit the issue. I can still provide an HD-DVR for you free of charge until then. I apologize but there is nothing else I can do at this time. Thanks
> 
> Mark A. Clark
> Sr. Director of Field Operations
> Bright House Networks_


BHN will "revisit the issue" when the adapter is available!? What is there to revisit? As soon as I have an adapter attached to my TiVo, I better damn well get all of the HD channels. His wording makes it sound like this might not be the case.


----------



## eabu

TiVoToo said:


> BHN will "revisit the issue" when the adapter is available!? What is there to revisit? As soon as I have an adapter attached to my TiVo, I better damn well get all of the HD channels. His wording makes it sound like this might not be the case.


If BHN isnt using SDV right now, having the SDV dongle doesnt solve anything. They still need to turn on the missing non-SDV HD channels for cablecard users.


----------



## orangeboy

therlin said:


> Exactly. I've posted these a couple of times, I feel they bear repeating for the "late comers"
> 
> *Franchising Authority*
> If you live in incorporated Orlando, please file a complaint here http://www.cityoforlando.net/cable/brighthouse.htm
> 
> If you live in unincorporated Orlando, please file a complaint here http://www.orangecountyfl.net/cms/DE...ions/cable.htm
> 
> *Florida Division of Consumer Services*
> http://app1.800helpfla.com/cswebcomplaints/FileComplaint.aspx
> (BHN will have 30 days to reply to this complaint.)
> 
> If you haven't filed a complaint with both of these organizations, I urge you to do so.


I've submitted my complaint to both! :up:


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## acvthree

"Revisit the issue" is a clear signal that they made withhold channels permanently from third party devices.

I hope this does not become widespread.

I also wish the FCC would support cable card. If cable companies can remove stations from cable card, I just can't envision them not doing it.

al


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## direktr

Hi everyone,

I just finished reading most of this thread and have a question. I was doing some research for my mom as she has a BHN HD-DVR (and old one that is starting to malfunction) and wants to get a Tivo HD. We already have 2 DT Series-2 Tivos that work great. In light of this truly asinine response from BHN, I'm not sure I want to recommend we go through the hassle of trying to get the cablecards set up only to lose functionality. I love my tivo and would never go back to the craptastic SA DVRs (In the 18 mos. before I got a tivo I went through 5 SA DVRs).
My question is this. Has anyone with a BHN cablecard that ISN'T in a Tivo experienced problems with lost channels? I ask because I would be interested to find out if BHN is specifically targeting Tivo customers. Engadget had an excellent article a year or so ago that chronicled the trials and tribulations of the editor trying to get cablecard for his Vista MCE box. It took a small handful of NY cable techs and a team flown in from Microsoft to resolve the issue. This thread says that people with newer SA DVRs have confirmed M-cards in their boxes, and appear to be getting the channels the Tivos can't. This would imply that BHN is actively blocking channels and functionality to anyone that uses cablecard with their tv, through a Tivo, or through a media center pc.

I'll probably recommend we just get a replacement SA box until this issue is resolved, but since some of you said the new s/w on the latest SA boxes is even more craptastic than before, I don't know what to do.

Thanks to everyone for providing much helpful information.


----------



## JWThiers

direktr said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> I just finished reading most of this thread and have a question. I was doing some research for my mom as she has a BHN HD-DVR (and old one that is starting to malfunction) and wants to get a Tivo HD. We already have 2 DT Series-2 Tivos that work great. In light of this truly asinine response from BHN, I'm not sure I want to recommend we go through the hassle of trying to get the cablecards set up only to lose functionality. I love my tivo and would never go back to the craptastic SA DVRs (In the 18 mos. before I got a tivo I went through 5 SA DVRs).
> My question is this. Has anyone with a BHN cablecard that ISN'T in a Tivo experienced problems with lost channels? I ask because I would be interested to find out if BHN is specifically targeting Tivo customers. Engadget had an excellent article a year or so ago that chronicled the trials and tribulations of the editor trying to get cablecard for his Vista MCE box. It took a small handful of NY cable techs and a team flown in from Microsoft to resolve the issue. This thread says that people with newer SA DVRs have confirmed M-cards in their boxes, and appear to be getting the channels the Tivos can't. This would imply that BHN is actively blocking channels and functionality to anyone that uses cablecard with their tv, through a Tivo, or through a media center pc.
> 
> I'll probably recommend we just get a replacement SA box until this issue is resolved, but since some of you said the new s/w on the latest SA boxes is even more craptastic than before, I don't know what to do.
> 
> Thanks to everyone for providing much helpful information.


As pointed out in the link in this post the problem isn't entirely the cable card. The card spec allows for 2 way communication but the FCC/ Joint Test Suite that everyone builds to calls for one way communication. Why is that, your guess is probably as good as mine I blame liscensing fees and restrictions placed on devices that would use Cable card 2 way communication by cable labs (No Proof but it would make sense to me anyway).

Anyway I wouldn't really call it a lose of functionality, its more a limiting of service (Channels you can receive), you can still do everything you could before just not to the channels they are blocking. The question about anyone beside tivo owners getting channels blocked, yes anyone getting a cable card outside of the BHN's box (They are required to have cards now as well) is getting blocked. They just see if you are renting a card and say you can't get these channels (At least until SDV really gets turned on). Their boxes are unaffected by this because they know who has a box and who doesn't. Also as I implied by sending you to the other post, even when SDV rolls out their boxes won't be affected because they had the full card spec built into the box meaning 2 way communication. With the SDV dongle coming out soon the missing channels will soon become a moot point. BHN is just messing with everyone to try to leverage them into their boxes. I just got cable on the 2nd and still don't get CSPAN (both analog and digital) even though it isn't an HD channel. They blame Cable Cards for any problem you may have. I really need to sit down and do a little more research about that.


----------



## BobCamp1

The current CableLabs certification implementation is one-way, because no one can agree on what the two-way spec. should be. There are still two competing camps, OCAP and Sony's (can't remember the name!), with Tivo recently switching sides to OCAP. In the mean time, two-way communication is possible but proprietary. Since it's proprietary, that part of the box isn't required to be validated by CableLabs. Instead, it's probably validated by whomever owns the cable system. You need the cable system's approval before deploying a two-way box -- you only need CableLabs's approval to deploy a one-way box.

You can build a two-way box with a CableCard in it. That's what Motorola is doing for BHN right now. I am curious to know how BHN is distinguishing the CableCards in their box vs. those in a one-way box. Is it simply recorded by the installer and kept at the main office, or is there a secret handshake going on between the box and the other end? Does their box completely bypass the CableCard to view the newly blocked channels?

I'm trying to figure out if that violates anything, and I'm having a hard time. So far, it looks legal. It violates the spirit of the law, which is why the FCC may need to issue a ruling on the subject. Does the guide data in the CableCard have to be accurate? And does it have to include all the channels a one-way box can technically get?


----------



## JWThiers

BobCamp1 said:


> I am curious to know how BHN is distinguishing the CableCards in their box vs. those in a one-way box. Is it simply recorded by the installer and kept at the main office, or is there a secret handshake going on between the box and the other end? Does their box completely bypass the CableCard to view the newly blocked channels?


Could be the S/N of the card or more likely the Host ID of the box.


----------



## orangeboy

Of course BHN knows who has cable cards or not. There has to be some type of ID to let them know what you subscribe to, yeah? I have HBO, he has Showtime, she has only basic cable - If there weren't some type of address or ID associated with your account, how could BHN know what you're allowed to view? It'd be interesting to see how a cable card pulled from a provided STB would act in a Tivo!


----------



## BobCamp1

orangeboy said:


> It'd be interesting to see how a cable card pulled from a provided STB would act in a Tivo!


Normally, the CableCard is paired to its device, so the CableCards won't work unless you tell BHN to re-pair them. Since their box's CableCards are supposed to be "superglued" to their box, that procedure would only be necessary if you had a third-party CableCard device. You'd be busted. Maybe. Or maybe the clueless tech. support person on the other end could be tricked. Or maybe they aren't paired at all, and it would work. Any volunteers?

You could call BHN and simply SAY you have one of their new boxes and that it isn't getting all the HD channels. How do they know? Is it just based on what the installer recorded, or do they check after the fact? If they rehit your CableCard as if it were in one of their boxes, would you suddenly get all the channels?

Furthermore, if you yanked their CableCard out of their box, would the box still work for the SDV channels? Would it work for ALL channels?


----------



## acvthree

>>>Furthermore, if you yanked their CableCard out of their box, would the box still work for the SDV channels? Would it work for ALL channels?

It's funny you should say that.

I know their boxes have cable cards in them. That is the requirement. I've wondered if it is purely a mechanical holder with no electrical connections. That is, manufacturer A is told to include cable cards in future devices. The simplest design solution is to just make mechanical changes to a current design to include the card, but leave all logical operations the same. Poof! New product. It meets the requirements. Minimal development costs.

Anyway, it was just a thought.

Al


----------



## PPC1

BobCamp1 said:


> Furthermore, if you yanked their CableCard out of their box, would the box still work for the SDV channels? Would it work for ALL channels?


Based on my understanding of the FCC mandate, (which admittedly could be wrong) it better not work. As I understand the mandate, the cable providers were ordered to seperate the security device (in this case, the cable card) from the tuner.


----------



## orangeboy

Earlier today, I received a request from Orange County for more information about my complaint. This is what I provided:

I've attached the response from Bright House offering the free DVR. I would like to quote a couple of statements that were made:

"Later this year, Bright House and other cable operators plan to start using switched digital video to deliver certain channels" and 
"Bright House is allowing customers to trade in their CableCards for an HD DVR set-top box for free until they are able to view those channels on their TiVos."

Both of those statements together are the root cause of my complaint. The cable operator has not yet deployed the technology that is incompatible with CableCards, and therefore I am able to view those channels were the cable operator to provide them! The operator has willfully prevented this service based solely on the account information that states I am using cablecards outside of their hardware. The same cablecards found in my Tivo can be found in Bright House Networks set top boxes, without loss of signal or channels. To verify this, I went to the Scientific Atlantic website to find what models are being produced that use Cable Cards. I found the SA 8300HDC model: http://www.scientificatlanta.com/products/consumers/new_explorer8300HDCDVR.htm. I then called Bright House to see if this model was available, and was told by the technician that that model was their newest hardware, was readily available, and going in 95% of new installations. How is it that the same cablecard works in their set top box but not mine?

At this time, a Bright House DVR is not sufficient compensation for me. It physically does not fit in my entertainment center! I know this because several months ago, I ordered a BHN DVR to compare the features and functionality to my Tivo. When the technician arrived with the unit, it was several inches larger than the SA 3250HD (non DVR) set top box I have, and simply did not fit. I opted at the time to continue with the SA 3250HD box (that I use for On Demand programming), and my Tivo Series 3 HD DVR. Until February 1, this combination worked well for me. The compensation that I am looking for is simply the programming that IS compatible with my hardware and that I pay for.

Thank you and kind regards, 
...

Hopefully this may help others out there trying to plead their cases too!


----------



## m_jonis

The reason that a cable STB CAN work with SDV (even if it's a cable-card STB) is that the STB can perform 2-way communication. The cable card simply works as a conditional access device. Since the Tivo CANNOT perform 2-way communication necessary to "tell" the headend that it wants an SDV channel, you cannot watch SDV on a Tivo currently. Please note, that I do not endorse the use of SDV and feel it's a blatant end-run around the FCC cable card mandate and simply another ploy by the cable company to force you to rent their STB.


----------



## acvthree

m_jonis said:


> The reason that a cable STB CAN work with SDV (even if it's a cable-card STB) is that the STB can perform 2-way communication. The cable card simply works as a conditional access device. Since the Tivo CANNOT perform 2-way communication necessary to "tell" the headend that it wants an SDV channel, you cannot watch SDV on a Tivo currently. Please note, that I do not endorse the use of SDV and feel it's a blatant end-run around the FCC cable card mandate and simply another ploy by the cable company to force you to rent their STB.


How is this related to the issue at BrightHouse?

Al


----------



## PPC1

Because it is correcting a false assumption in Orangeboy's response to the request for information from Orange County. Orangeboy suggested that Orange County could infer from the fact that cable cards are in use by BHN in their own DVR that BHn had intentionally disabled the channels for other cable card customers. They cannot. This argument will be easily dispatched with a comment by BHN in its response to Orange County that the non-TiVo devices are capable of two way communication, whereas the TiVo is not. Unless the government employee is sharp enough to see the logical insufficieny of the response, they many accept BHN's response.

Orangeboy's response would have been more pursuasive if he had simply stuck to his argument that the channels are available to other customers that use Brighthouse equipment, and that the implementation of SDV cannot be the explanation why he cannot get these channels on his cable card device given Brighthouse' admission that they have yet to roll out SDV.


----------



## JWThiers

m_jonis said:


> The reason that a cable STB CAN work with SDV (even if it's a cable-card STB) is that the STB can perform 2-way communication. The cable card simply works as a conditional access device. Since the Tivo CANNOT perform 2-way communication necessary to "tell" the headend that it wants an SDV channel, you cannot watch SDV on a Tivo currently. Please note, that I do not endorse the use of SDV and feel it's a blatant end-run around the FCC cable card mandate and simply another ploy by the cable company to force you to rent their STB.


The problem is that *BHN HAS NOT IMPLEMENTED SDV YET*. They are PLANNING on deploying it later this year. They said so in an Orlando Sentinel interview earlier this month. What they are doing is not allowing certain customers (those with Cable Cards not installed in their STB's) to view some HD content. IF they had actually deployed SDV, what you stated would be absolutely true. The Tivo could NOT physically do the 2 way communication to tune the channel. This is more like I am paying for the HBO package which includes 8 (?) channels and they are only letting you get 3 of them because they don't like your DVR.


----------



## BobCamp1

m_jonis said:


> Please note, that I do not endorse the use of SDV and feel it's a blatant end-run around the FCC cable card mandate and simply another ploy by the cable company to force you to rent their STB.


BHN isn't implementing SDV to thwart less than 1% of its customers. It's doing it to provide more HD channels for its other 99% of its customers.

I think complaining to the local franchising authority is good, but BHN has already offered their HD DVR for free in the meantime. I hate to say this, but that's a pretty fair deal, and it's way more than most other cable companies are doing. TWC simply tells you to use their DVR then hangs up on you.

My only problem is that BHN blocked channels in anticipation of SDV, rather then do something like sending a notification letter. It was crude and unnecessary, and possibly against the rules. The sad part is that no one even knows if it WAS against the rules.

At least my parents were able to return their Tivo and get a refund. THey may buy one a year from now once everything has settled down.


----------



## JWThiers

PPC1 said:


> Because it is correcting a false assumption in Orangeboy's response to the request for information from Orange County. Orangeboy suggested that Orange County could infer from the fact that cable cards are in use by BHN in their own DVR that BHn had intentionally disabled the channels for other cable card customers. They cannot. This argument will be easily dispatched with a comment by BHN in its response to Orange County that the non-TiVo devices are capable of two way communication, whereas the TiVo is not. Unless the government employee is sharp enough to see the logical insufficieny of the response, they many accept BHN's response.
> 
> Orangeboy's response would have been more pursuasive if he had simply stuck to his argument that the channels are available to other customers that use Brighthouse equipment, and that the implementation of SDV cannot be the explanation why he cannot get these channels on his cable card device given Brighthouse' admission that they have yet to roll out SDV.


BHN did intentionally disable channels for other cable card customers.

Orlando Sentinel, Feb 8, 2008


> Arthur Orduna, the senior vice president of product for Bright House Networks...In preparing for a new cable delivery technology called "Switched Digital Video," Bright House decided not to deliver these channels to the CableCard customers.


Note it says IN PREPARING FOR SDV. The article also mentions that in addition to the new HD channels that came out Feb 1, Cable card users were never supposed to gotten access to the new channels that came out in Oct and that that had been a mistake.


----------



## JWThiers

BobCamp1 said:


> BHN isn't implementing SDV to thwart less than 1% of its customers. It's doing it to provide more HD channels for its other 99% of its customers.
> 
> I think complaining to the local franchising authority is good, but BHN has already offered their HD DVR for free in the meantime. I hate to say this, but that's a pretty fair deal, and it's way more than most other cable companies are doing. TWC simply tells you to use their DVR then hangs up on you.
> 
> My only problem is that BHN blocked channels in anticipation of SDV, rather then do something like sending a notification letter. It was crude and unnecessary, and possibly against the rules. The sad part is that no one even knows if it WAS against the rules.
> 
> At least my parents were able to return their Tivo and get a refund. THey may buy one a year from now once everything has settled down.


The free HD DVR may be a deal (people have reported problem getting that deal) but even better why not just send a notice to CC users of the pending implemenation of SDV, let people receive the channels that they can physically receive until BHN actually makes the switch and then it is a hardware issue not an authorization issue.


----------



## acvthree

PPC1 said:


> Orangeboy's response would have been more pursuasive if he had simply stuck to his argument that the channels are available to other customers that use Brighthouse equipment, and that the implementation of SDV cannot be the explanation why he cannot get these channels on his cable card device given Brighthouse' admission that they have yet to roll out SDV.


That would have been a much clearer and simpler argument.

al


----------



## orangeboy

To clear things up about what I sent to OC, the response to the request for MORE information was what I provided in this forum last night. Orange County has my original complaint (which I've shared earlier in this forum) where I state: "This decision to withhold these channels is NOT based on technical issues surrounding new technology (Switched Digital Video, or SDV), but rather the intention of deploying this technology at an undisclosed date in the future."

The only false assumption made was that I provided only partial information to Orange County. It is obvious that Bright House CAN disable specific channels to ANY customer, CableCARD user or not. I do not pay for the Sundance channel, therefore BHN specifically disables that channel for my account. However, I DO pay for Digital Cable with HD Service, and BHN specifically disabled non-SDV HD and non-HD channels to my CableCARDs (not to my account - I still get those channels on my SA 3250HD STB, but I cannot view the programming that I want when it is convenient to me like I can with my Tivo.)

Again, the information I'm trying to provide in this forum is for those like me that didn't know how to make a stand. Many contacts and resources were provided to help the voices be heard for those who feel deprived of the services that they pay Bright House for. But very few examples were given of _how_ exactly we were deprived of those services. That first day that I could no longer get the new advertised channels, I had assumed it was a technological issue. Due to the constant busy signal when I called BHN, I knew it wasn't specifically me. When I finally did get through a day or two later, I scheduled a repair. In the meantime, I found this thread and learned more about the issue, and became more outraged at the disservice I was receiving. Instead of submitting complaints like "Bright House sucks because I can't get channels", I tried in the best way I could to come up with accurate information about the problems I am experiencing. If someone else can take what have used as an example to help formulate a valid complaint, it's better for me, and anyone else that is in the same situation.


----------



## PPC1

I think people may have misread part of my prior post. In order to make my point more clear, I will repost the relevant portion with the addition of a few clarifying words:



PPC1 said:


> Orangeboy suggested that Orange County could infer from the fact that cable cards are in use by BHN in their own DVR that BHN had intentionally disabled the channels for other cable card customers. They *[Orange County]* cannot *[so infer]*.


Orangeboy, as you note, you have provided more information than this to Orange County. I do not mean to suggest otherwise. My only point in commenting on this was that by making this argument, it provides an opportunity for BHN to focus their response to this single point, discredit it, besmirch your good name, claim that you are ignorant (all of which are not true) and ignore the rest of your comments, and thereby potentially pull a rhetorical slight of hand misdirection from the real point to your complaint. Such a response to your follow up would certainly be intellectually dishonest, but sometimes this argument tactic is successful.


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## Bschneider

Have you guys read the thread here? http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=331456

Summary: Onelink in PR refused to provide HD channels to the cablecards and a few people filed a complaint with the FCC. The FCC responded (rather shortly after the complaints) and gave Onelink 30 days to provide the HD channels to the cablecards. They now have HD channels via cablecards.


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## net114

That's interesting...it may be the FCC is getting a complaint.


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## orangeboy

When clicking on the online FCC form:

Error 404--Not Found 
From RFC 2068 Hypertext Transfer Protocol -- HTTP/1.1:
10.4.5 404 Not Found
The server has not found anything matching the Request-URI. No indication is given of whether the condition is temporary or permanent.

If the server does not wish to make this information available to the client, the status code 403 (Forbidden) can be used instead. The 410 (Gone) status code SHOULD be used if the server knows, through some internally configurable mechanism, that an old resource is permanently unavailable and has no forwarding address


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## Bschneider

Make sure you fill out FCC FORM 475.. not 475B.


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## dkahs23

Bschneider said:


> Make sure you fill out FCC FORM 475.. not 475B.


Where is form 475? All I see is 475B


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## m_jonis

orangeboy said:


> When clicking on the online FCC form:
> 
> Error 404--Not Found
> From RFC 2068 Hypertext Transfer Protocol -- HTTP/1.1:
> 10.4.5 404 Not Found
> The server has not found anything matching the Request-URI. No indication is given of whether the condition is temporary or permanent.
> 
> If the server does not wish to make this information available to the client, the status code 403 (Forbidden) can be used instead. The 410 (Gone) status code SHOULD be used if the server knows, through some internally configurable mechanism, that an old resource is permanently unavailable and has no forwarding address


I get the same thing. The URL provided above gives you a form 2000 on the FCC website that generates the error.


----------



## therlin

Bschneider said:


> Have you guys read the thread here? http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=331456
> 
> Summary: Onelink in PR refused to provide HD channels to the cablecards and a few people filed a complaint with the FCC. The FCC responded (rather shortly after the complaints) and gave Onelink 30 days to provide the HD channels to the cablecards. They now have HD channels via cablecards.


I looked through most of that thread but nowhere did I see anything about the FCC forcing the cable company to release the channels. I probably missed it, I'll look again, but if someone has the actual post, could you please link to it?

I'm speaking to a BHN higher up on Monday and any kind of facts supporting our side of the issue will be helpful.


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## eitingon

I submitted an FCC complaint a few weeks ago.


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## eabu

therlin said:


> I looked through most of that thread but nowhere did I see anything about the FCC forcing the cable company to release the channels. I probably missed it, I'll look again, but if someone has the actual post, could you please link to it?
> 
> I'm speaking to a BHN higher up on Monday and any kind of facts supporting our side of the issue will be helpful.


Here is a link to some of the posts that show Onelink returning HD channels to cablecard customers.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5967945&highlight=onelink#post5967945


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## dkahs23

Bright House is pissing everyone off Check this out.

http://www.local6.com/sponsors/15339115/detail.html


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## therlin

eabu said:


> Here is a link to some of the posts that show Onelink returning HD channels to cablecard customers.
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5967945&highlight=onelink#post5967945


Perfect, thanks, I'll try to bring this case up tomorrow.


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## orangeboy

The FCC complaint site is available today! I'm using (online) form 2000E. There appears to be a limit to the text allowed in the complaint details section, so choose your words carefully, and make them count! :up:


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## Okeemike

For what it's worth, I have a call today at 2pm EST with the Sr Director of Quality and Customer Care. 

Let's see what she has to say...


----------



## Okeemike

Okeemike said:


> For what it's worth, I have a call today at 2pm EST with the Sr Director of Quality and Customer Care.
> 
> Let's see what she has to say...


Update: The call went well. BigDave and I have been advised that we should know WHY the channels were removed within the next 48 hours. Interestingly, it would seem that BHN has been checking the site out (it was referenced in our call).

Stay tuned! More information as it happens.


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## amheck

Hey guys, just came across this thread. Semi-interested party here as I'm in Tampa and was thinking about getting a few Tivo HD's. Maybe I'll hold off for the time being, but I'm definitely pulling for you guys! I've read all 10 pages and can feel the agony.

One quick question - not sure I totally understand all of the technical reasons behind why all this is happening. But is TIVO working on a "series 4" which might get around all these problems, i.e. no need for the dongle?

Aaron


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## Okeemike

amheck said:


> Hey guys, just came across this thread. Semi-interested party here as I'm in Tampa and was thinking about getting a few Tivo HD's. Maybe I'll hold off for the time being, but I'm definitely pulling for you guys! I've read all 10 pages and can feel the agony.
> 
> One quick question - not sure I totally understand all of the technical reasons behind why all this is happening. But is TIVO working on a "series 4" which might get around all these problems, i.e. no need for the dongle?
> 
> Aaron


So, the issue (at this point) is NOT with two way functionality, which is what the dongle resolves. The issue is that BHN doesn't add the channels to the Cable Cards...it's as simple as that.

They say that they have not added the channels as it WILL be an issue when they go to SDV at some point. However, until then, there is no reason why the cable cards can't receive the channels.

To illustrate this, the BHN cable boxes use the *same cards *and receive *all available channels*. That's a very important point....same exact card. The only difference is that those boxes support two way functionality, so when they go SDV they'll be ready to go.

If TiVo gets the dongle out before BHN goes SDV, this won't even be an issue.


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## acvthree

>>>If TiVo gets the dongle out before BHN goes SDV, this won't even be an issue.

My understanding it the dongle comes from BHN, not Tivo. Is this not the case?

Al


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## net114

Thanks OkeeMike for the updates. I'll be interested to see what they say.


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## TomRaz

It is my understanding that Tivo is developing the usb dongle to resolve the switched digital signal that will be coming out later this year.

It would make no sense for Brighthouse to devote any time of money to a usb dongle, they would rather have you rent their hardware on a month to month basis.


----------



## moyekj

TomRaz said:


> It is my understanding that Tivo is developing the usb dongle to resolve the switched digital signal that will be coming out later this year.
> 
> It would make no sense for Brighthouse to devote any time of money to a usb dongle, they would rather have you rent their hardware on a month to month basis.


 It's neither one "developing" the tuning resolver. The cable box manufacturers - namely Motorola and SA are the ones to manufacture the hardware. Motorola announced Q2 2008 as a potential release date for the hardware, SA has been silent about it thus far so who knows when an SA solution for SA headends may be available. Ultimately your local cable company will be the one that needs to obtain and distribute these to whoever needs them. What's their incentive to do so in a timely and efficient manner? Not much. Tivo also will need to have a software release with updated USB drivers to support the hardware.


----------



## m_jonis

moyekj said:


> It's neither one "developing" the tuning resolver. The cable box manufacturers - namely Motorola and SA are the ones to manufacture the hardware. Motorola announced Q2 2008 as a potential release date for the hardware, SA has been silent about it thus far so who knows when an SA solution for SA headends may be available. Ultimately your local cable company will be the one that needs to obtain and distribute these to whoever needs them. What's their incentive to do so in a timely and efficient manner? Not much. Tivo also will need to have a software release with updated USB drivers to support the hardware.


the only one I've seen actually "published" so far is listed here (scroll down a bit)

http://albanyhdtv.proboards18.com/index.cgi?action=display&board=boxes&thread=1196167536&page=1

Just to get an idea of the "size" of the thing.

Hardly a dongle, IMO.

But better than no SDV.


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## orangeboy

moyekj said:


> It's neither one "developing" the tuning resolver. The cable box manufacturers - namely Motorola and SA are the ones to manufacture the hardware. Motorola announced Q2 2008 as a potential release date for the hardware, SA has been silent about it thus far so who knows when an SA solution for SA headends may be available. Ultimately your local cable company will be the one that needs to obtain and distribute these to whoever needs them. What's their incentive to do so in a timely and efficient manner? Not much. Tivo also will need to have a software release with updated USB drivers to support the hardware.


You make a good point about who's incentive it is. I think it would be interesting if Tivo were to market the dongle. As someone stated earlier about CableCARDs, SA doesn't sell directly to the consumer. Perhaps Tivo could find a way to obtain a batch of CableCARDs and/or dongles to sell to their customers, freeing us from an additional monthly cost presented by our cable operators?


----------



## bigdave2004

orangeboy said:


> You make a good point about who's incentive it is. I think it would be interesting if Tivo were to market the dongle. As someone stated earlier about CableCARDs, SA doesn't sell directly to the consumer. Perhaps Tivo could find a way to obtain a batch of CableCARDs and/or dongles to sell to their customers, freeing us from an additional monthly cost presented by our cable operators?


In a perfect world that would be great but the cable co's would never allow a 3rd party (meaning not provided by them) device to have 2 way communications on their infrastructure it could lead to a compromise.


----------



## moyekj

orangeboy said:


> You make a good point about who's incentive it is. I think it would be interesting if Tivo were to market the dongle. As someone stated earlier about CableCARDs, SA doesn't sell directly to the consumer. Perhaps Tivo could find a way to obtain a batch of CableCARDs and/or dongles to sell to their customers, freeing us from an additional monthly cost presented by our cable operators?


 CableCards have to be specifically programmed at the local cable plant to work and paired to it - you can't just grab them from anywhere and expect them to work. I don't know how much, if any, security will be built into the the tuning resolver AKA dongle as well but it may also require some specific firmware to work properly at your local plant.
Smart cable companies would realize that many Tivo customers have locked in long term deals for service and are likely to stay with Tivo a long time, so with these cable only Tivo boxes they should be ecstatic to have us as customers with a big disincentive to defect to satellite. More likely though from their perspective Tivo consumers are a drop in the bucket to them and too much of a hassle and expense to go out of their way to keep us happy. If anything I think Tivo should be marketing to cable companies the positives of having Tivo owners as their customers...


----------



## JWThiers

amheck said:


> Hey guys, just came across this thread. Semi-interested party here as I'm in Tampa and was thinking about getting a few Tivo HD's. Maybe I'll hold off for the time being, but I'm definitely pulling for you guys! I've read all 10 pages and can feel the agony.
> 
> One quick question - not sure I totally understand all of the technical reasons behind why all this is happening. But is TIVO working on a "series 4" which might get around all these problems, i.e. no need for the dongle?
> 
> Aaron


Personally, never let hardware that is due out "soon" be the sole reason for not buying now. Something better is always just around the corner. My gut feeling is by Christmas this whole issue will be a distant memory. With TV you have 3 possible sources, OTA, Cable and SAT. If you plan on going with either OTA or Cable there is no reason not to get a THD now. Of course an interesting option that has been brought to my attention is going OTA only and then using Amazon unbox for anything that OTA can't get you. $60 a month can get a whole lot of content from unbox.


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## PopcornGuy

Just wanted to update everyone on that free HD DVR Brighthouse* is offering...

Check your bill. More precisely, since Brighthouse* does not itemize the bill and there was a price change recently (you're already expecting a price increase), call about your bill. Brighthouse* is, in fact, charging $9.95 additional for this DVR.:down: The Brighthouse* billing department said they would offer me a two month promotional discount but they would not honor the free offer promise**.

Too bad we're stuck with Brighthouse* for cablecard service. In a competitive market, Brighthouse* would have fixed this by now. Likely, it never would have happened. I'm done talking to Brighthouse* about this, any resolution will be addressed through Jae Nale, the FCC or other means.

*committed to lousy customer service and a hypocritical advertising campaign
**not really an offer afterall


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## dkahs23

PopcornGuy said:


> Just wanted to update everyone on that free HD DVR Brighthouse* is offering...
> 
> Check your bill. More precisely, since Brighthouse* does not itemize the bill and there was a price change recently (you're already expecting a price increase), call about your bill. Brighthouse* is, in fact, charging $9.95 additional for this DVR.:down: The Brighthouse* billing department said they would offer me a two month promotional discount but they would not honor the free offer promise**.
> 
> Too bad we're stuck with Brighthouse* for cablecard service. In a competitive market, Brighthouse* would have fixed this by now. Likely, it never would have happened. I'm done talking to Brighthouse* about this, any resolution will be addressed through Jae Nale, the FCC or other means.
> 
> *committed to lousy customer service and a hypocritical advertising campaign
> **not really an offer afterall


Yeah I would file with the FCC again. Thats BS !!!!


----------



## notnow117

I was explicitly told when I scheduled the installation for the HD DVR that would not affect my billing at all. After reading the latest posts, I checked and sure enough, my bill went up $20. I assume it's due to the whole fiasco that occurred when the tech was out installing it. He had to spend an hour on the phone with BH while they figured out how to add it to my account. They obviously had no clue what they were doing, because my account showed the following credits and charges on the day I had it installed...

Feb 11, 2008 $13.60 HD DIGITAL VIDEO RECORDER Charge
Feb 11, 2008 ($11.19) NAVIGATOR Credit
Feb 11, 2008 $9.50 DIGITAL BOX Charge
Feb 11, 2008 ($4.03) CABLE CARD Credit
Feb 11, 2008 $11.19 NAVIGATOR Charge
Feb 11, 2008 ($9.50) DIGITAL BOX Credit
Feb 11, 2008 $4.03 CABLE CARD Charge
Feb 11, 2008 $1.44 NAVIGATOR Charge
Feb 11, 2008 $9.50 DIGITAL BOX Charge

That's 6 charges and 3 credits, for a net result of $20 in new charges. Complete incompetence as far as I'm concerned. I'll be calling them later to straighten this out, and I'll be demanding the charge be removed. Either I'm getting this HD DVR for free or they can take it back. It's not like I asked for it.

<rant>
Also, if somebody from BH is reading this thread, I'd just like to point out how completely ridiculous this is. At least in my case, this has wasted several hours of my time, several hours of BH's time, and at least an hour of a tech's time, plus giving out an HD DVR which is supposed to be at no charge. In addition, I had to get an HD switchbox because I had no more inputs on my tv, and had to squeeze the DVR onto a rack with very little free space. It's been crappy all around. All because somebody refuses to change a couple of bits on a server somewhere. How this is a good business model, I don't know. Well done BH. If I could use my S3 with DirecTV, I would switch today, because that's all that's keeping me on cable.
</rant>


----------



## Okeemike

notnow117 said:


> I was explicitly told when I scheduled the installation for the HD DVR that would not affect my billing at all. After reading the latest posts, I checked and sure enough, my bill went up $20. I assume it's due to the whole fiasco that occurred when the tech was out installing it. He had to spend an hour on the phone with BH while they figured out how to add it to my account. They obviously had no clue what they were doing, because the my account showed the following credits and charges on the day I had it installed...
> 
> Feb 11, 2008 $13.60 HD DIGITAL VIDEO RECORDER Charge
> Feb 11, 2008 ($11.19) NAVIGATOR Credit
> Feb 11, 2008 $9.50 DIGITAL BOX Charge
> Feb 11, 2008 ($4.03) CABLE CARD Credit
> Feb 11, 2008 $11.19 NAVIGATOR Charge
> Feb 11, 2008 ($9.50) DIGITAL BOX Credit
> Feb 11, 2008 $4.03 CABLE CARD Charge
> Feb 11, 2008 $1.44 NAVIGATOR Charge
> Feb 11, 2008 $9.50 DIGITAL BOX Charge
> 
> That's 6 charges and 3 credits, for a net result of $20 in new charges. Complete incompetence as far as I'm concerned. I'll be calling them later to straighten this out, and I'll be demanding the charge be removed. Either I'm getting this HD DVR for free or they can take it back. It's not like I asked for it.
> 
> <rant>
> Also, if somebody from BH is reading this thread, I'd just like to point out how completely ridiculous this is. At least in my case, this has wasted several hours of my time, several hours of BH's time, and at least an hour of a tech's time, plus giving out an HD DVR which is supposed to be at no charge. In addition, I had to get an HD switchbox because I had no more inputs on my tv, and had to squeeze the DVR onto a rack with very little free space. It's been crappy all around. All because somebody refuses to change a couple of bits on a server somewhere. How this is a good business model, I don't know. Well done BH. If I could use my S3 with DirecTV, I would switch today, because that's all that's keeping me on cable.
> </rant>


This would be funny if it weren't so frustrating. I mean, in the end, it's just television, and is it really worth working this hard?

I'm considering swapping to an antenna in the attic, and getting my remaining content via either AppleTV or through Unbox. (are the both HD?).

Considering that a more than capable antenna is $100 or less, and can be tapped directly into the distribution for the house ,and that $60 / month will buy an awful lot of content, dropping cable seems like a real option.

The only concern is explaining all of this to my wife.


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## eitingon

unbox is very much low-D (not HD). Antenna in the attic will get you the networks in HD. I suggested dropping cable to the wife and was shot down pretty quickly


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## eabu

Just continue to notify the FCC, there is not reason to continue talking with Bright House.


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## notnow117

eabu said:


> Just continue to notify the FCC, there is not reason to continue talking with Bright House.


I still need to clear up the charges, but yes, you're right otherwise. I already filed a complaint with the FCC.


----------



## dkahs23

Is there any other way to Record HD programming on Tivo besides cable cards and Sat/ATN? Can you record HD programming with the DT Tivo?


----------



## dkahs23

There's got to be another way around all of this madness.


----------



## therlin

dkahs23 said:


> There's got to be another way around all of this madness.


Yes, turning the channels back on until they actually implement SDV. Hopefully we'll hear some good news tomorrow (it sounds like they hope to have some sort of decision made by then.)


----------



## dkahs23

But you know? This is happening all over the country, with other cable subscribers. Why are all of them doing this at the same time? It doesn't make sense. The world is going mad!!!


----------



## bigdave2004

dkahs23 said:


> But you know? This is happening all over the country, with other cable subscribers. Why are all of them doing this at the same time? It doesn't make sense. The world is going mad!!!


Cable providers are playing catch up with Sat providers to provide a considerable amount of HD channels. The only way to do that is to switch to SDV since the pipes (tubes? ) are getting over saturated as it is. In the end SDV is what we all want but we want it with a proper resolver (dongle) and with at least some notice so we are aware of the change. We are aware brighthouse was going to switch and we were fine with that in the beginning of the thread besides the zero notice we knew in the end this is a positive thing. When we found out that they HAD NOT implemented and were only limiting cable card users that's where our frustration comes from.


----------



## dkahs23

bigdave2004 said:


> Cable providers are playing catch up with Sat providers to provide a considerable amount of HD channels. The only way to do that is to switch to SDV since the pipes (tubes? ) are getting over saturated as it is. In the end SDV is what we all want but we want it with a proper resolver (dongle) and with at least some notice so we are aware of the change. We are aware brighthouse was going to switch and we were fine with that in the beginning of the thread besides the zero notice we knew in the end this is a positive thing. When we found out that they HAD NOT implemented and were only limiting cable card users that's where our frustration comes from.


Other cable subscribers are complaining of the same thing we are. Losing channels that we already had. And the word is around the net, that we would be lucky to even see the dongle this year.


----------



## dig_duggler

dkahs23 said:


> Other cable subscribers are complaining of the same thing we are. Losing channels that we already had. And the word is around the net, that we would be lucky to even see the dongle this year.


I'm not trying to be smarmy, I ask b/c I do not know. Which markets are losing channels (not to SDV but to cable co's aggressiveness) and where is this 'word' coming from? links por favor.


----------



## Okeemike

dig_duggler said:


> I'm not trying to be smarmy, I ask b/c I do not know. Which markets are losing channels (not to SDV but to cable co's aggressiveness) and where is this 'word' coming from? links por favor.


NYC Metro
http://www.tvtechnology.com/pages/s.0082/t.2799.html

Virginia
http://www.engadgethd.com/2007/08/2...ution-in-virginia-hopes-to-expand-hd-offerin/

Denver and NJ
http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=125584&site=cdn

Austin and Columbia, SC
http://www.cable360.net/ct/news/ctreports/18481.html

Dover, NJ and Richardson, TX
http://telephonyonline.com/mag/telecom_reviving_debate_nynex/

_EDIT : Whoops...I don't think I read the response correctly. This is a listing of locations that are trying out, or have implemented SDV, thus showing that the technological change is on the horizon._


----------



## dkahs23

Comcast, Cox and Time Warner Cable. Just look at this thread.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=357703&page=36


----------



## PopcornGuy

An Open Letter To Brighthouse*:

I know Brighthouse* is monitoring this specific thread. I was personally contacted through this forum.

A lot of us are multi-year or lifetime Tivo subscribers meaning we are very likely to stay with Brighthouse*. There are alternatives as suggested on this thread. None of these are as ideal. If you think I'm giving up Tivo for your DVR, think again. Brighthouse* will go first, including phone and Internet service.

It's time for Brighthouse* to step up now and give us the answers we demand. Identify yourselves and answer your most loyal customers!

PopcornGuy (no "*" needed here-I mean what I say)


----------



## Okeemike

PopcornGuy said:


> I know Brighthouse* is monitoring this specific thread. I was personally contacted through this forum.


BHN contacted you? What's the story there?


----------



## dig_duggler

dkahs23 said:


> Comcast, Cox and Time Warner Cable. Just look at this thread.
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=357703&page=36


Hmm, I see OK city but I only read the last 5 or so pages. What other markets have rolled out pre-SDV channels in this regard (_silently regretting getting my dad a Tivo HD_)?

The tuner issue, I see lots of back and forth speculation. But nothing that would indicate that the '"word is around the net, that we would be lucky to even see the dongle this year." However, Tivo (although not developing this) is always overly optimistic with their target dates.

I was once was contacted by a manager at Brighthouse (different market though) when I was having major problems over a two month period. He did indicate they had people who looked at various tech sites and reported back. I don't know if this is a company wide policy or a market policy, but I wouldn't be surprised if it was company wide.

In my paranoid news, I now have TntHD and HistoryHD in my lineup but they haven't added them to my channel map. I've called CS several times and all signs indicate this is incompetence rather than biased deployment but who knows.


----------



## PopcornGuy

Okeemike said:


> BHN contacted you? What's the story there?


Mr. Berry from Brighthouse* (with a Brighthouse* email address) contacted me through this forum. I will give Brighthouse* the opportunity to post before giving out an email address. He wanted to be able to identify me in order to fix my billing error only (see post #299). I linked again to this thread in my reply. The larger issue was being forwarded to higher ups at Brighthouse*.


----------



## Randman

I think one of the big things that we are missing is this: Without a BHN box, we can't order Pay Per View / On Demand movies and other content. Thus, we will never offer BHN any additional revenue.

And let me tell you, folks, Pay Per View / On Demand is a tremendous profit center for the cable companies. Why do you think they are pushing it so hard? Offering you a free movie, to try the service. Inserts in their mailers.

So, maybe there is a reason they want us out of cablecards?!?!?! Maybe there is a motive to their madness?!?!?!?!?

I'll give you a clue.

$$$


----------



## dkahs23

Randman said:


> I think one of the big things that we are missing is this: Without a BHN box, we can't order Pay Per View / On Demand movies and other content. Thus, we will never offer BHN any additional revenue.
> 
> And let me tell you, folks, Pay Per View / On Demand is a tremendous profit center for the cable companies. Why do you think they are pushing it so hard? Offering you a free movie, to try the service. Inserts in their mailers.
> 
> So, maybe there is a reason they want us out of cablecards?!?!?! Maybe there is a motive to their madness?!?!?!?!?
> 
> I'll give you a clue.
> 
> $$$


That's one thing I can care less about (Pay Per View / On Demand) I just want what I pay for, from month to month.


----------



## orangeboy

Randman said:


> I think one of the big things that we are missing is this: Without a BHN box, we can't order Pay Per View / On Demand movies and other content. Thus, we will never offer BHN any additional revenue.
> 
> And let me tell you, folks, Pay Per View / On Demand is a tremendous profit center for the cable companies. Why do you think they are pushing it so hard? Offering you a free movie, to try the service. Inserts in their mailers.
> 
> So, maybe there is a reason they want us out of cablecards?!?!?! Maybe there is a motive to their madness?!?!?!?!?
> 
> I'll give you a clue.
> 
> $$$


When the dongle/appliance becomes available to Tivo/CableCARD users, won't two-way communication be accomplished, and PPV/On Demand be available to these users? Granted, we're a minority, but incoming cash flow is still incoming cash flow. Why piss us off by depriving us of the service we pay for, when those same people in a short period of time (with a dongle) could be 'new' PPV/On Demand customers? There's more talk about leaving Bright House and going OTA then there is praise for the company of late! If there were competition in my area, I'd have dropped BHN when this all started!


----------



## ah30k

orangeboy said:


> When the dongle/appliance becomes available to Tivo/CableCARD users, won't two-way communication be accomplished, and PPV/On Demand be available to these users?


NO.

SDV only, not VOD.


----------



## therlin

So Wednesday has come and gone and no word from BHN as far as I know. This could be good news (easier to say "no") or they don't want to face our anger until before the weekend and give us a cooling period (little do they know.)


----------



## JimPa

I'm not sure if I should be mad with BHN or not.

My primary concern is picture and sound quality. With SDV, do these channels look as good as satellite? Might be a good time to drop cable and just use my S3 for my OTA channels and add satellite.


----------



## JWThiers

SDV shouldn't impact PQ/SQ at all. SDV lessens the number of channels that your headend is putting on the wires in your area freeing up bandwidth for other things (more Channels). If anything besides extra channels BHN could cut back on compression that they might be adding in. I doubt it, but they could.


----------



## PopcornGuy

I'll post my Brighthouse* contact's email address here by the end of the day if we haven't seen a response by then. It's unbelievable that they are ignoring this issue. Maybe we need to organize a protest in front of the main Brighthouse* office. So we're not confused with any of the other controversies (Local 6, FSN, etc.) we can carry giant asterisks around.


----------



## JWThiers

ah30k said:


> NO.
> 
> SDV only, not VOD.


Would that open the possibility? If you can communicate with the headend to resolve channels, how much more would it take to communicate to get VOD (or any other interactive feature for that matter)? Just curious.


----------



## BobCamp1

JWThiers said:


> Would that open the possibility? If you can communicate with the headend to resolve channels, how much more would it take to communicate to get VOD (or any other interactive feature for that matter)? Just curious.


Tivo would have to write a new software routine to manage the VOD/PPV GUI. Remember, you purchasing PPV, so Tivo needs to confirm the purchase with you. Also, I think trick-play works differently for PPV and VOD. And this software would be unique to each cable company and maybe even several areas within each cable company. So there could be 4 to 20 different branches of Tivo software version 9.4. And 9.5. And 9.6, etc. It would be a nightmare for a small company such as Tivo to keep track of that.

Also, you need to be able to download into the Tivo exactly what's available via PPV and VOD at any given time. I don't think this could be using Tribune or CableCards -- Tivo would have to download it directly from the cable company. More software that's tailor-made for several markets.

That's what's nice about OCAP. The Cable company writes the PPV/VOD GUI and communications software and uploads it to all the boxes. The GUI is the same for everyone, making tech. support easier, and the third-party boxes don't have to create and maintain a dozen different flavors of software.

It's a lot of effort, and Tivo just wants to take baby steps at this point.


----------



## RachelF

PopcornGuy said:


> Mr. Berry from Brighthouse* (with a Brighthouse* email address) contacted me through this forum. I will give Brighthouse* the opportunity to post before giving out an email address. He wanted to be able to identify me in order to fix my billing error only (see post #299). I linked again to this thread in my reply. The larger issue was being forwarded to higher ups at Brighthouse*.


Oh good, if they are monitoring then let me say this. I have had issues with your company before and I have to say it is like the blind leading the blind over there. No one department knows what the other one is doing. And now, you have the gall to "pretend" to provide services to us and then take them away in a sneaky and deceitful way all the while continuing to charge us for things we can't even access. You have a lot of nerve continuing to air those ridiculous commercials that really only highlight your complete incompetence. I didn't appreciate the form letter of apology regarding this issue, either. I hope that after the 11 pages of complaints here, you will actually make this right by everyone but I have NO confidence in that what-so-ever.


----------



## Chris Berry

Tivo Community,

My name is Chris Berry and I do work for Bright House, I have visited the forum several times and have followed the issue for weeks now. In my capacity, I'm not able to offer any additional information that would contribute to the situation. Thus the reason I have not commented or posted on the issue. I contacted PopcornGuy to assist him with a possible billing issue which is in my capacity to do. 

BHN Insider


----------



## Bschneider

PopcornGuy said:


> I'll post my Brighthouse* contact's email address here by the end of the day


Posting Berry's email address won't do any good.. his title is Public Affairs and Internet Communication Manager. He won't be able to help in the situation.

I've emailed my contact at the headquarters in NY to try and help but its not doing any good right now.. with the VP of Brighthouse.



> Suffice it to say weve always tried not to take programming away from customers. While this may not make sense, if we made these channels available until switched deploys, then wed have to explain taking them away when switched does deploy  both to customers and programmers. Just like everything else in this business, its complicated.
> 
> Im not sure what transpired in Orlando, but we shouldnt have opened those channels to CableCard customers in the first place. Plain and simple. Fortunately, we didnt do so in Tampa, so we shouldnt have to pull anything back. We do advise new CableCard users that certain programming wont be available, and can always provide a settop which will display all channels.
> 
> All this is said with the caveat that programming and engineering decisions are written in Jello. They are subject to change as market and technology conditions warrant. So no promises.


I'm still working on it with them.. but right now the best bet is the FCC, until at least BrightHouse deploys SDV.


----------



## dkahs23

Chris Berry said:


> Tivo Community,
> 
> My name is Chris Berry and I do work for Bright House, I have visited the forum several times and have followed the issue for weeks now. In my capacity, I'm not able to offer any additional information that would contribute to the situation. Thus the reason I have not commented or posted on the issue. I contacted PopcornGuy to assist him with a possible billing issue which is in my capacity to do.
> 
> BHN Insider


Well so there you go.... I hope no one held there breath.


----------



## dkahs23

I don't think the FCC is going to do anything either.


----------



## dig_duggler

Bschneider said:


> Suffice it to say we've always tried not to take programming away from customers. While this may not make sense, if we made these channels available until switched deploys, then we'd have to explain taking them away when switched does deploy - both to customers and programmers. Just like everything else in this business, it's complicated.
> 
> I'm not sure what transpired in Orlando, but we shouldn't have opened those channels to CableCard customers in the first place. Plain and simple. Fortunately, we didn't do so in Tampa, so we shouldn't have to pull anything back. We do advise new CableCard users that certain programming won't be available, and can always provide a settop which will display all channels.
> 
> All this is said with the caveat that programming and engineering decisions are written in Jello. They are subject to change as market and technology conditions warrant. So no promises.


This is a logical argument if and only if they do not take away any channels when SDV is deployed. I could be wrong, but I believe that Brighthouse has already done that in other markets. That undermines all the reasoning put forth. They are going to do whatever the hell they want b/c it is advantageous for them to do so, not b/c it is in the interest of customers or programmers.


----------



## acvthree

Would the FTC be of any use? They are using their monopoly status to prevent a competitors device from functioning as well as their own. Restraint of trade?

Before I get blasted, I don't know enough to understand if this is legitimate or not. I'm just offering it as a thought.

Al

The FTC deals with issues that touch the economic life of every American. It is the only federal agency with both consumer protection and competition jurisdiction in broad sectors of the economy. The FTC pursues vigorous and effective law enforcement; advances consumers&#8217; interests by sharing its expertise with federal and state legislatures and U.S. and international government agencies; develops policy and research tools through hearings, workshops, and conferences; and creates practical and plain-language educational programs for consumers and businesses in a global marketplace with constantly changing technologies.


----------



## PopcornGuy

Chris Berry said:


> Tivo Community,
> 
> My name is Chris Berry and I do work for Bright House, I have visited the forum several times and have followed the issue for weeks now. In my capacity, I'm not able to offer any additional information that would contribute to the situation. Thus the reason I have not commented or posted on the issue. I contacted PopcornGuy to assist him with a possible billing issue which is in my capacity to do.
> 
> BHN Insider


You did also say you passed along these questions and concerns to Senior Management. When can we expect to hear from them here?


----------



## orangeboy

Chris Berry said:


> Tivo Community,
> 
> My name is Chris Berry and I do work for Bright House, I have visited the forum several times and have followed the issue for weeks now. In my capacity, I'm not able to offer any additional information that would contribute to the situation. Thus the reason I have not commented or posted on the issue. I contacted PopcornGuy to assist him with a possible billing issue which is in my capacity to do.
> 
> BHN Insider


Thanks Chris. I admire your courage to have a presence in this thread. Although you may not have a direct influence on a positive outcome for our situation, would it be possible to inform your supervisor (and others) that there are some (very) unhappy customers relating to some of the decisions made on behalf of a different department within Bright House? I know in the corporation I work in, we have morning meetings where issues are discussed. If this can be a (annoying) daily topic at Bright House, perhaps the decision to deprive the Bright House customers of the service that they pay for can be reversed, and those same customers can be retained?

Thanks again Chris. I can't speak for anyone but myself. I don't have a problem with Bright House as a whole. I think it has a lot of neat features, good programming options, and is trying to leverage new technology that will benefit everyone in the long-run. Poor planning and lack of communication could be the cause of the grief the CableCARD users are feeling now. Communicating a statement such as "On August 1st, BHN will convert the following channels to SDV: <blah blah blah>. At that time, those using CableCARDs will no longer be able to view those channels without special hardware required for two-way communication. We're sorry for any inconvenience this may cause." Such a statement would have been a lot easier to take opposed to what was actually done: "BH customers: 5 new HD channels will be available on February 1st!" (unspoken: except for you CableCARD users - you'll receive less than what you had before. )


----------



## bigdave2004

acvthree said:


> Would the FTC be of any use? They are using their monopoly status to prevent a competitors device from functioning as well as their own. Restraint of trade?


I spoke to Jae Nale, she grants franchises in Orange County. She said specifically that she will grant a franchise to anyone who wants one. If another provide isn't doing business in my area its not fiscally viable for them to do so. This is what I was told when I said brighthouse had a monopoly. Maybe we should start to email comcast and get them to provide service, not that they are any better. I like to think brighthouse is the lesser of the two evils but they really don't want to budge.


----------



## Chris Berry

PopcornGuy said:


> You did also say you passed along these questions and concerns to Senior Management. When can we expect to hear from them here?


I forwarded your email to the Sr. Director of Quality/Customer Care, the same person OkeeMike spoke with. OkeeMike would be able to tell you sooner than I can about a response since they have discussed the situation.

I also forwarded your email to the Sr. Director and VP of Public Affairs.


----------



## bigdave2004

I guess Mike is busy today, here is what Mike got this morning:

_Hi Mr. Mike,

The discussion is still ongoing here, so I'll contact you again as soon as I have more information or by mid-day Friday (whichever is earlier).

Best regards,

Nice Brighthouse Lady_

So one more day...


----------



## Okeemike

bigdave2004 said:


> I guess Mike is busy today, here is what Mike got this morning:
> 
> _Hi Mr. Mike,
> 
> The discussion is still ongoing here, so I'll contact you again as soon as I have more information or by mid-day Friday (whichever is earlier).
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> Nice Brighthouse Lady_
> 
> So one more day...


Thanks, Dave, for giving me a solid *four minutes *to respond. I was busy "working". 

So, I pulled out my crystal ball, and here is what it told me:

BHN will delay doing anything for cable card customers until SDV is deployed. I am willing to bet that this will happen nearly any day now, as they were supposed to do this Feb 1, with the rollout of the new channels. They will enable them to point the finger back at us, and say that the issue is due to TiVo's inability to be compatible with SDV, this getting them off the hook.

*THEN fast-forward several months to when the dongle is available, and the TiVo will theoretically be compatible. We STILL won't have any channels available as they will not have been added to our tier, and we'll then have to complete this exercise once again.*

I might be cynical, but that doesn't mean I'm wrong.

The more I think about it, the more I realize that this needs to be worked out now, *while we have the attention of Brighthouse*, so that once SDV is implemented, and the dongle is available, everything will work the way it's supposed to.


----------



## JimPa

Mike,

I too take the cynical view, however, aren't the channels already on your tier; its only that you can't receive them??


----------



## PPC1

Okeemike is right. They will just up the pressure on their tech staff to roll out SDV and wait for the storm to blow over under cover of TiVo's technological limits.


----------



## eabu

bigdave2004 said:


> I spoke to Jae Nale, she grants franchises in Orange County. She said specifically that she will grant a franchise to anyone who wants one. If another provide isn't doing business in my area its not fiscally viable for them to do so. This is what I was told when I said brighthouse had a monopoly. Maybe we should start to email comcast and get them to provide service, not that they are any better. I like to think brighthouse is the lesser of the two evils but they really don't want to budge.


Because the cable companies have carved out their territories, I dont think they are interested in directly competing with one another in the same territory. They have a common understanding that if they competed, that would mean lower, more competitive prices (which translates to lower revenue), and more work because they would have to "try" to satisfy their customers with some form of customer service.


----------



## scofow

Hello,

I have decided to go with Direct TV so i have a Tivo here doing nothing. Before i go to ebay i wanted to offer it here first. 

Tivo HD and Wireless adapter, Mint. Looking to sell for $150 . Located in Sanford, Fl.

Thanks,
Scott


----------



## moyekj

Okeemike said:


> T*THEN fast-forward several months to when the dongle is available, and the TiVo will theoretically be compatible. We STILL won't have any channels available as they will not have been added to our tier, and we'll then have to complete this exercise once again.*


 The tuning resolver (AKA dongle) will use it's own channel map independent of the cable cards so I don't think that will be an issue (the cable cards are still necessary for decryption purposes of course). Case in point Cox Orange County is now distributing cable boxes with built in M-card and those boxes can tune channels reserved for SDV while my Tivos cannot.


----------



## orangeboy

I still can't get channels 146 and 147.


----------



## dig_duggler

Are there brighthouse customers in other areas that _are_ getting new HD channels as they are added? Or is this a corporate wide decision (as the VP of Brighthouse suggests above). I'm still working on confirmation, but I think the same thing is happening with Brighthouse in Birmingham, AL (two new channels which are not on the channel map (but in my guide data) and I know the BHN box will tune tune them as tested by a few friends).


----------



## PPC1

I am in Indy. New channels cannot be tuned with my S3. They can with my old Pace box. It's not a cable card box. I don't know whether SDV has been rolled out or not in my area. I did ask the customer service people several times why I can't get the channels on my S3 and was told that cable cards would not work. When I pressed for more information, specificially if the reason the cable cards wouldn't work was due to SDV, they did not know: a) what SDV was, or b) whether it had been rolled out. I presume not, but in all honesty, I don't have confirmation one way or the other. They could have just been clueless CSRs.


----------



## dig_duggler

Yeah, the problem I'm having now is finding someone who knows what I'm talking about. I've gotten three different explanations (all kind of dumb and irrational) as to why this is occuring.

Edit: including one rep who keeps on insisting I need a truck roll b/c "no one else is calling with these problems, and once the signal is out there it affects everyone."

I love "the signal".


----------



## Okeemike

Hi guys. I heard back from BHN, and she (Sr Director of Customer Service) advised that there was no additional news, yet she remained 'hopeful'.


----------



## net114

Thanks Mike for keeping up on getting info from BH.


----------



## orangeboy

Has anybody else experienced this? I just caught my Tivo S3 trying to record "Shockwave" on HistoryHD, 1343. This was a season pass that had been valid prior to 2/1/2008. Since then, I removed the channel from the "Channels List", but neglected to delete the Season Pass. When I flipped the TV on, I was staring at a blank screen. Info shows the proper program and channel for the Season Pass, but Guide shows TBS, (SD channel 12 - I removed all the channels I could get via HD, at the time). It's a shame I had to add back all the SD channels. 

It's frustrating.


----------



## notnow117

orangeboy said:


> Has anybody else experienced this? I just caught my Tivo S3 trying to record "Shockwave" on HistoryHD, 1343. This was a season pass that had been valid prior to 2/1/2008. Since then, I removed the channel from the "Channels List", but neglected to delete the Season Pass. When I flipped the TV on, I was staring at a blank screen. Info shows the proper program and channel for the Season Pass, but Guide shows TBS, (SD channel 12 - I removed all the channels I could get via HD, at the time). It's a shame I had to add back all the SD channels.
> 
> It's frustrating.


i had something similar with sci-fi, which moved from 74 to 69. both cable cards correctly mapped sci-fi to channel 69, and channel 74 didn't show up in the guide or in my channel list, but the upcoming episodes for stargate were listed on 74 and 69. the season pass tried to record it on 74 because that's how it was originally set up, so all i got was a blank screen. i removed the season pass and explicitly re-added it for 69, and at least it's recording now. i haven't checked to see if the episodes on 74 are still listed as upcoming episodes.


----------



## dig_duggler

Anyone want to point me to some corporate email addresses? Nothing on the consumerist that I can find.


----------



## dkahs23

Has anyone heard back from the FCC?


----------



## orangeboy

dkahs23 said:


> Has anyone heard back from the FCC?


Not a word from the complaint I submitted on 2/25.


----------



## eitingon

orangeboy said:


> Not a word from the complaint I submitted on 2/25.


No word back for me either...


----------



## dkahs23

Do they normally respond back?


----------



## Okeemike

dig_duggler said:


> Anyone want to point me to some corporate email addresses? Nothing on the consumerist that I can find.


[email protected] (Made available by the WKMG.com website)
*Central Florida Division President*

An email to this guy resulted in me being put in touch with the Sr Director of Quality and Customer Service, who I have been working with. I suggest everyone draft Mr Fenger a kind, but stern email indicating that we would like to know:

(*) why the channels were removed from our package with no warning, no explanation, and no technological reason.
(*) when we can expect the channels to be returned

Keep in mind that we know they will be moving to SDV at some point in the future, however, an 'anticipated' future move is no reason to purposefully hamstring our devices. (this would be analogous to DirecTV disabling all of their older model HD DVRs, because they're moving to MPEG4).

I was supposed to hear back from the Customer Service contact on Wednesday, but so far there has been nothing. I still believe that they will drag their feet until SDV is ultimately launched, and we all just go away.


----------



## StStephen

TiVo Eulogy - With all the BS BHN is putting me through I'm afraid I'm beginning to think like this: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2261417,00.asp


----------



## eabu

Okeemike said:


> I was supposed to hear back from the Customer Service contact on Wednesday, but so far there has been nothing. I still believe that they will drag their feet until SDV is ultimately launched, and we all just go away.


Makes you wonder how someone could say they work in "Customer Service at Bright House Networks" with a straight face.


----------



## therlin

Tomorrow is Wednesday which will be a week since the original dateline given to us for a decision. They are definitely dragging their feet on this. I don't know why it is so hard to do the right thing.


----------



## net114

StStephen said:


> TiVo Eulogy - With all the BS BHN is putting me through I'm afraid I'm beginning to think like this: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2261417,00.asp


I think he was eulogizing his DirecTivo...and he never really mentioned why he chose to go with their DVR, but probably because they gave it to him free or something. The sign of a true non-fan who just had Tivo because it was available at the time....

I am also anxious as to what BH's reponse will be. I hope we will hear something soon. How hard a decision is this, really? And...what's the next step when they tell us to take our Tivo's and go play somewhere else?


----------



## Okeemike

I emailed the BHN president again Monday... we'll see if that helps any.


----------



## eitingon

net114 said:


> I think he was eulogizing his DirecTivo...and he never really mentioned why he chose to go with their DVR, but probably because they gave it to him free or something. The sign of a true non-fan who just had Tivo because it was available at the time....
> 
> I am also anxious as to what BH's reponse will be. I hope we will hear something soon. How hard a decision is this, really? And...what's the next step when they tell us to take our Tivo's and go play somewhere else?


Those with DirecTV HD TiVos do not get the new HD channels offered by DirecTV (ala SDV)


----------



## dkahs23

Does anyone know if Brighthouse will carry the M-Cards? If so are they willing to swap them out for S-Cards?


----------



## eitingon

dkahs23 said:


> Does anyone know if Brighthouse will carry the M-Cards? If so are they willing to swap them out for S-Cards?


I have an M card from BrightHouse.


----------



## net114

eitingon said:


> Those with DirecTV HD TiVos do not get the new HD channels offered by DirecTV (ala SDV)


Let me rephrase that...I know WHY...but I meant he chose to go that direction instead of getting a TivoHD and switching to cable. Of course, I guess he just has to read this thread!


----------



## bigdave2004

eitingon said:


> I have an M card from BrightHouse.


Me Too!


----------



## eitingon

bigdave2004 said:


> Me Too!


The good news: it "works"
The bad news: BrightHouse has crippled it just like all other CableCards


----------



## dig_duggler

So folks, different market (Birmingham) but possibly an opportunity. I spoke with a manager at Brighthouse today who indicated to the best of his knowledge (but he's not absolutely certain) that we are experiencing the same issue. He is having a technical manager call me next week to field questions I might have. 

So what questions would you have (practical ones please)? Keep in mind it is extremely unlikely I'm going to change anybody's mind and want to keep things very civil as I don't want to burn the only bridge I've got. Besides the obvious (there isn't any technical reason to do this now, so why are you), any technical questions anybody wants fielded?


----------



## PPC1

How about, if this is a nationwide policy?


----------



## JWThiers

dig_duggler said:


> So folks, different market (Birmingham) but possibly an opportunity. I spoke with a manager at Brighthouse today who indicated to the best of his knowledge (but he's not absolutely certain) that we are experiencing the same issue. He is having a technical manager call me next week to field questions I might have.
> 
> So what questions would you have (practical ones please)? Keep in mind it is extremely unlikely I'm going to change anybody's mind and want to keep things very civil as I don't want to burn the only bridge I've got. Besides the obvious (there isn't any technical reason to do this now, so why are you), any technical questions anybody wants fielded?


Just the obvious, Why, if there is no technical reason, are channels being turned off (or not turned on) for cable card users. I would much rather receive a channel for a few months and then get a letter saying that because of technology upgrades cable cards will as of some date no longer be able to receive the following channels..., We are sorry for thre inconvenience.

With the dongle being due out second quarter, the SDV issue may be a nonissue by the time BHN turns it on. Also as paying customers, we are paying to receive certain channels and short of an actual technological reason, they are not providing the service that was agreed to.


----------



## Okeemike

So, because I'm apparently a glutton for rejection, I've sent one final email to the Dir of Cust Support . I do not anticipate a reply, as I have not received one previously. If something happens, I'll let you know.

Does anyone have a BHN contact at a national level?


----------



## therlin

I'm giving BHN to give us an official answer by Friday. After that I will file a new wave of complaints containing all the information that we have learned lately. It may not get us anything, but it's worth a shot and I'm all up for giving them as many headaches as possible at this point.


----------



## orangeboy

dig_duggler said:


> So folks, different market (Birmingham) but possibly an opportunity. I spoke with a manager at Brighthouse today who indicated to the best of his knowledge (but he's not absolutely certain) that we are experiencing the same issue. He is having a technical manager call me next week to field questions I might have.
> 
> So what questions would you have (practical ones please)? Keep in mind it is extremely unlikely I'm going to change anybody's mind and want to keep things very civil as I don't want to burn the only bridge I've got. Besides the obvious (there isn't any technical reason to do this now, so why are you), any technical questions anybody wants fielded?


I posed this question (via e-mail) to Bright House President J. Christian Fenger:

"I enjoy the service that your company provides. I truly would like to remain a customer. What can you do to keep myself and other tivo/cable card users as customers?"

I didn't get a response. Something THEY (president, manager, tech manager) need to remember: WE are the customers! At least for the time being... I had mentioned "As you can see by my e-mail address, I am taking steps to divorce myself from the services the company you work for provides, including internet services." I changed my primary personal e-mail address from cfl.rr.com to gmail.com


----------



## orangeboy

Ok, how's this for inconsistent?
I hit the Tivo button and was greeted with a new message indicating that the Tivo service has detected a change in my cable lieup. Added 1028 WRDQDT2. 

Hmmm... new channel. Using Bright House logic, I shouldn't get this, because it will someday become SDV. But the new channel tunes in for me! Yes, I'm happy and grateful I'm getting this channel, but at the same time I'm frustrated and angry that the promise of new channels is honored only for cableCARD users part of the time!

Ugh - What gives?! I still can't get channels 146 and 147.


----------



## JWThiers

I'll be honest, at this point if it wasn't for my wifes obsession with The Colbert Report and The Daily Show on Comedy Central, I would drop cable altogether. EVERYTHING else that we watch is either on a channel I can get OTA or available on Amazon Unbox. I could get those shows from iTunes but at $2 a pop 4x a week each x 4 weeks is $64 just for those shows a month.


----------



## Okeemike

JWThiers said:


> I'll be honest, at this point if it wasn't for my wifes obsession with The Colbert Report and The Daily Show on Comedy Central, I would drop cable altogether. EVERYTHING else that we watch is either on a channel I can get OTA or available on Amazon Unbox. I could get those shows from iTunes but at $2 a pop 4x a week each x 4 weeks is $64 just for those shows a month.


So, do the math _this_ way:
Cable Service : $60 month (ballpark)
Apple TV : $199 (refurbished)
Colbert and Daily Show season passes ($20 each) : $40

Total: $240

Breakeven: 4 months.

Even if you added another three season passes at $20 each ,that only adds another month to your break even.

The problem, however, is that this is only for one television.

Another alternative would be Xbox 360, however, I don't think it has the variety. Amazon Unbox is a strong possibility, but I haven't looked to see is all of my programing is available.


----------



## Okeemike

orangeboy said:


> Ok, how's this for inconsistent?
> I hit the Tivo button and was greeted with a new message indicating that the Tivo service has detected a change in my cable lieup. Added 1028 WRDQDT2.
> 
> Hmmm... new channel. Using Bright House logic, I shouldn't get this, because it will someday become SDV. But the new channel tunes in for me! Yes, I'm happy and grateful I'm getting this channel, but at the same time I'm frustrated and angry that the promise of new channels is honored only for cableCARD users part of the time!


This is an EXCELLENT point.


----------



## Okeemike

Okeemike said:


> So, because I'm apparently a glutton for rejection, I've sent one final email to the Dir of Cust Support . I do not anticipate a reply, as I have not received one previously. If something happens, I'll let you know.
> 
> Does anyone have a BHN contact at a national level?


Ok, so I got another phone call back from BHN last night. I was told that the topic was being discussed at the 'highest levels', and no one has contacted me becuase there's nothing to report. This makes me thing that this issue is not limited to the Central Florida area, rather, it's a much larger issue than what we know.

BHN has _promised_ that they will give me a phone call back, however, they're advising that any more information is at least a week away.


----------



## JWThiers

Okeemike said:


> Ok, so I got another phone call back from BHN last night. I was told that the topic was being discussed at the 'highest levels', and no one has contacted me becuase there's nothing to report. This makes me thing that this issue is not limited to the Central Florida area, rather, it's a much larger issue than what we know.
> 
> BHN has _promised_ that they will give me a phone call back, however, they're advising that any more information is at least a week away.


Meaning they hope either you will go away or they actually deploy SDV and they can say you can't get channels anyway.


----------



## JWThiers

Okeemike said:


> So, do the math _this_ way:
> Cable Service : $60 month (ballpark)
> Apple TV : $199 (refurbished)
> Colbert and Daily Show season passes ($20 each) : $40
> 
> Total: $240
> 
> Breakeven: 4 months.
> 
> Even if you added another three season passes at $20 each ,that only adds another month to your break even.
> 
> The problem, however, is that this is only for one television.
> 
> Another alternative would be Xbox 360, however, I don't think it has the variety. Amazon Unbox is a strong possibility, but I haven't looked to see is all of my programing is available.


I'm trying to keep it on the tivo to avoid having multiple boxes for watching TV. But I think (I'd have to double check) that it's $20 for 10 shows season pass or some such so it is a recurring $20/per show every 2 weeks or $80/month That puts me real close to my actual cable costs right now. Actually just below, but by the time I add in Battlestar, Stargate Atlantis, and a couple of movie rentals to replace HBO I only save a couple of bucks a month if I am lucky. If Jon and Steven (or actually ANY show that airs daily (would have said Daily Show, but didn't want to cause confusion)) were on only once a week I would be on this like like white on rice.

Even if I went that way, I wonder if Jon and Steven can be transfered to the tivo with tivo desktop. I think I can transfer video podcasts from iTunes this way, but I wonder if this stuff is copy protected? Darn DRM!!!


----------



## dig_duggler

JWThiers said:


> I'm trying to keep it on the tivo to avoid having multiple boxes for watching TV. But I think (I'd have to double check) that it's $20 for 10 shows season pass or some such so it is a recurring $20/per show every 2 weeks or $80/month That puts me real close to my actual cable costs right now. Actually just below, but by the time I add in Battlestar, Stargate Atlantis, and a couple of movie rentals to replace HBO I only save a couple of bucks a month if I am lucky. If Jon and Steven (or actually ANY show that airs daily (would have said Daily Show, but didn't want to cause confusion)) were on only once a week I would be on this like like white on rice.
> 
> Even if I went that way, I wonder if Jon and Steven can be transfered to the tivo with tivo desktop. I think I can transfer video podcasts from iTunes this way, but I wonder if this stuff is copy protected? Darn DRM!!!


You could get an AppleTV ($220). This would increase the timeframe for breakeven (glancing at it, 8 months instead of 4 but I could be missing something), but you also get another movie rental option (if interested, HD at that) and a more robust music server on your tv.


----------



## Okeemike

OFF TOPIC

Ok, so in my world, the best solution would be to bring out a new DirecTivo. I've heard a rumor on BuzzOutLoud that DTV was purchased by someone else, and that somehow opens the door to Tivo coming back into vogue.. Am I making that up, or is there something really going on?


----------



## dig_duggler

Well nevermind. Spoke with a technical manager and the Birmingham, AL market has gone SDV. He was aware of the tuning resolver and indicated they'd love to try it out on me when they get it, but it doesn't exist yet.


----------



## dig_duggler

One interesting note, he seemed perplexed when I asked if they just were not giving us the channels (although it turned out to be SDV). Something to the effect of "we want you to get anything you can".

Not that this helps you guys, but it's not every market at least.


----------



## JWThiers

Do you think he would admit to that kind of mistake after what is going on here?


----------



## JWThiers

dig_duggler said:


> You could get an AppleTV ($220). This would increase the timeframe for breakeven (glancing at it, 8 months instead of 4 but I could be missing something), but you also get another movie rental option (if interested, HD at that) and a more robust music server on your tv.


Lets see $10 for 16 episode (Just Checked)(Thats 3 weeks)(about # per week on average)Times 4 weeks per month is $12 plus Colbert another $12 or $24 might be doable but I just remembered something The set in the bedroom where my wife watches the daily show is an older set with s-video as the best connection it can do. I don't think ATV does s-vid. That means a new TV as well.


----------



## Okeemike

JWThiers said:


> Lets see $10 for 16 episode (Just Checked)(Thats 3 weeks)(about # per week on average)Times 4 weeks per month is $12 plus Colbert another $12 or $24 might be doable but I just remembered something The set in the bedroom where my wife watches the daily show is an older set with s-video as the best connection it can do. I don't think ATV does s-vid. That means a new TV as well.


Bonus! Justification for a new television.

As an alternative, you can get a RF modulator from radioshack, and just convert the signal (this is what I do for my DVD player in our gym)


----------



## BobCamp1

Okeemike said:


> OFF TOPIC
> 
> Ok, so in my world, the best solution would be to bring out a new DirecTivo. I've heard a rumor on BuzzOutLoud that DTV was purchased by someone else, and that somehow opens the door to Tivo coming back into vogue.. Am I making that up, or is there something really going on?


Off topic answer: the first part is correct (purchased by Liberty Media), but you are making up the second part.


----------



## therlin

ON TOPIC 

BHN is saying that they need another week to make a decision. How long does it take to realize that they should do the right things for their customers and turn the channels back on?

We are being played with.


----------



## JWThiers

No Asterisk *


----------



## Okeemike

therlin said:


> ON TOPIC
> 
> BHN is saying that they need another week to make a decision. How long does it take to realize that they should do the right things for their customers and turn the channels back on?
> 
> We are being played with.


It would seem pretty straightforward to decided either to include or not include the channels. However, if the problem IS nation wide, or even just regional (rather than only local), I can imagine that the gears of corporate productivity turn pretty slowly.


----------



## dkahs23

Okeemike said:


> It would seem pretty straightforward to decided either to include or not include the channels. However, if the problem IS nation wide, or even just regional (rather than only local), I can imagine that the gears of corporate productivity turn pretty slowly.


I think it is Nation Wide according to other Blogs, about other cable companys. I don't think its just Brighthouse. But I could be wrong. It Sucks altogether anyway :down::down::down::down::down::down::down:


----------



## dkahs23

Well Today is a new week. And still NO WORD.........................................


----------



## Okeemike

dkahs23 said:


> Well Today is a new week. And still NO WORD.........................................


The contact at BHN advised Thursday that it would be at least a week until we knew something. I anticipate something longer than that, however, I was promised a call back.

So far, she has followed through on her guarantees of contact. When I was not promised a callback, I did not receive one.


----------



## dkahs23

I have a Bright House tech scheduled to come by in the morning. Due to the fact now I have cable card issues. For some reason I lost more HD Channels from channel 1300 up. I have done a Full system reset and everything. So I told the customer service to bring a M-Card with them. So I guess we will see what happens. But is there anything anyone wants me to asked the tech?


----------



## eitingon

dkahs23 said:


> I have a Bright House tech scheduled to come by in the morning. Due to the fact now I have cable card issues. For some reason I lost more HD Channels from channel 1300 up. I have done a Full system reset and everything. So I told the customer service to bring a M-Card with them. So I guess we will see what happens. But is there anything anyone wants me to asked the tech?


The techs are amongst the LEAST knowledgeable people when it comes to cablecards...


----------



## therlin

Last time I requested an M card the guy brought an S card and told me that it is the only type of card they carry (lie.)


----------



## dkahs23

Well the Bright House guy hooked me up with an M-Card. He said it was like pulling teeth to get one. He was very Knowledgeable about what was going on with the HD channels. And new about the dongle. And new about the other channels that was taken away. also told me I could get there DVR for free if I wanted it. So all went well so far.


----------



## eabu

dkahs23 said:


> Well Today is a new week. And still NO WORD.........................................


Time is on BrightHouse Networks' side. They know if they can drag this out, cablecard users will either find acceptance, switch to BHN equipment, or lose interest. That's their idea of "service" that you pay for.


----------



## Okeemike

eabu said:


> Time is on BrightHouse Networks' side. They know if they can drag this out, cablecard users will either find acceptance, switch to BHN equipment, or lose interest. That's their idea of "service" that you pay for.


My money is on them waiting for SDV to be implemented, and then (quite correctly) they can honestly say 'there's nothing we can do, it's a limitation with TiVo'.


----------



## net114

Okeemike said:


> My money is on them waiting for SDV to be implemented, and then (quite correctly) they can honestly say 'there's nothing we can do, it's a limitation with TiVo'.


Let's hope that they do what's right by all of us who are paying customers. I've had serious discussions about moving to OTA and downloading the rest of what I need because of this.


----------



## eabu

It's absolutely absurd that BrightHouse Networks would alienate cablecard users and TiVo users because these are the people that are intimately associated to BrightHouse. If there were no such thing as cablecards and TiVo, everyone would have switched to Dish and DirectTV already with their current vast array of HD programs.


----------



## JWThiers

Unfortunately Cable Card subscribers are a small but vocal MINORITY of BHN customers. They have a propensity to pay more and know more than the average customer, but a minority none the less. Meaning in the long run if you make too much noise BHN really couldn't care less.


----------



## Okeemike

Well, I heard back from the *Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services* as a result of my contacting them a couple of weeks ago.

The letter I received reads in part:


> The Division of Consumer Service, Bureau of Mediation and Enforcement has attempted to mediate your complaint against this business. Unfortunately, the business has refused to cooperate, and we are unable to assist you further. Therefore, we are closing your compliant as "Closed Unsatisfactorily ."


----------



## dkahs23

Not Surprised....


----------



## celly

Okeemike said:


> It would seem pretty straightforward to decided either to include or not include the channels. However, if the problem IS nation wide, or even just regional (rather than only local), I can imagine that the gears of corporate productivity turn pretty slowly.


You happen to hear anything yet?


----------



## orangeboy

I was getting happy the other day - I saw a Comcast truck leaving one of the apartment complexes near me! I thought: hallelujah! An alternative to BHN! When I got home and plugged my zip code into the comcast webpage, I found there's no service from Comcast in my area. My BHN bill keeps getting higher, my satisfaction keeps getting lower


----------



## Okeemike

celly said:


> You happen to hear anything yet?


No, not yet. I was planning on giving them 1 1/2 to 2 weeks before I stated contacting them again. It's only been about a week (I think).


----------



## JWThiers

Okeemike said:


> Well, I heard back from the *Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services* as a result of my contacting them a couple of weeks ago.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> The Division of Consumer Service, Bureau of Mediation and Enforcement has attempted to mediate your complaint against this business. Unfortunately, the business has refused to cooperate, and we are unable to assist you further. Therefore, we are closing your compliant as "Closed Unsatisfactorily ."
> 
> 
> 
> The letter I received reads in part:
Click to expand...

So they can just refuse to cooperate and the division charged with Mediation and ENFORCEMENT, just says they refuse to cooperate so we are closing the complaint???

Ohhhhhh!!!!!! I'm scared of the big bad enforcement agency!!!!


----------



## Okeemike

JWThiers said:


> So they can just refuse to cooperate and the division charged with Mediation and ENFORCEMENT, just says they refuse to cooperate so we are closing the complaint???
> 
> Ohhhhhh!!!!!! I'm scared of the big bad enforcement agency!!!!


Yeah, seems kind of half-assed to me, too.


----------



## eabu

Okeemike said:


> Well, I heard back from the *Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services* as a result of my contacting them a couple of weeks ago.
> 
> The letter I received reads in part:
> 
> The Division of Consumer Service, Bureau of Mediation and Enforcement has attempted to mediate your complaint against this business. Unfortunately, the business has refused to cooperate, and we are unable to assist you further. Therefore, we are closing your compliant as "Closed Unsatisfactorily ."


Not only does BrightHouse Networks ignore its customers, it also ignores government agencies.

This Division of Consumer Service, Bureau of Mediation and Enforcement should just be shut down since it does absolutely nothing but waste our tax dollars pretending to be some type of "Enforcement" bureau with a big dumb name.


----------



## StStephen

Okeemike said:


> Well, I heard back from the *Florida Department of Agriculture and Consumer Services* as a result of my contacting them a couple of weeks ago.
> 
> The letter I received reads in part:


This looks like something our local consumer protection folks would love to take on. Isn't this typical in a business friendly (read anti-consumer) state like Florida!


----------



## joelkfla

Has any one been successful in getting a free BHN HD DVR, while keeping both cablecards, and with no extra charges on their bill?

When I called BHN, the CS rep said I would have to turn in one of my cablecards to get the DVR at no cost. I exclaimed that my TiVo wouldn't work with just one card. She said that that was the deal, and I'd have to come into their office if I wanted to discuss it (which I haven't taken the time to do, yet.)


----------



## JWThiers

Personally I refuse to even bite on the deal. Its either Tivo or nothing until the dongle comes out.


----------



## net114

I have to agree with JW. But if they don't give some kind of answer in the next week or so, I'll be at least cancelling most of my cable package. No reason to pay them for HD content I'm not getting.


----------



## notnow117

joelkfla said:


> Has any one been successful in getting a free BHN HD DVR, while keeping both cablecards, and with no extra charges on their bill?
> 
> When I called BHN, the CS rep said I would have to turn in one of my cablecards to get the DVR at no cost. I exclaimed that my TiVo wouldn't work with just one card. She said that that was the deal, and I'd have to come into their office if I wanted to discuss it (which I haven't taken the time to do, yet.)


Sort of. I got the HD DVR and have been told repeatedly that it should be free. However, I'm still being charged for it because they can't get the computer to not charge me. I've made 2 calls to customer service and sent an email, and it's been elevated twice, but still has not been resolved.


----------



## JWThiers

net114 said:


> I have to agree with JW. But if they don't give some kind of answer in the next week or so, I'll be at least cancelling most of my cable package. No reason to pay them for HD content I'm not getting.


Problem is HD and SD is the same price. Unless you REALLY drop to BASIC cable.


----------



## Okeemike

Got a reply from the Dir of CS just moments ago. No final resolution yet, but perhaps movement in a positive direction?



> Mike:
> 
> I have heard good things about the progress of these discussions, and I am aware that our timeline for resolution was a bit hampered with the WKMG negotiations. Now the team can resume working towards an end result and I will let you know as soon as I have an update.


----------



## dkahs23

Okeemike said:


> Got a reply from the Dir of CS just moments ago. No final resolution yet, but perhaps movement in a positive direction?


Same old song and dance....Delay...Delay....Delay.......Chase the carrot....Don't get me wrong Okeemike. I do appreciate your efforts. But they can move a little faster. Unless they care to explain how difficult it would be to flip the switch on. Because it wasn't that hard to turn it off.


----------



## JWThiers

dkahs23 said:


> Same old song and dance....Delay...Delay....Delay.......Chase the carrot....Don't get me wrong Okeemike. I do appreciate your efforts. But they can move a little faster. Unless they care to explain how difficult it would be to flip the switch on. Because it wasn't that hard to turn it off.


Like many management structures they have a hard time walking and chewing gum at the same time. Now that they have (I assume) finished their WKMG negotiations, they can focus on this issue.


----------



## celly

JWThiers said:


> Like many management structures they have a hard time walking and chewing gum at the same time. Now that they have (I assume) finished their WKMG negotiations, they can focus on this issue.


Yup. Interestingly enough I have now heard of possibly Two communities in East orlando that are dropping BH/Comcast for smaller private cable companies.

The way I understand it, Stonybrook East is working with someone to pull in DirectTV (or Dish?) and OTA local channels then mixing it up and redistributing it to the community.

If cable companies keep up this song and dance they are going to start loosing these community contracts to the sat guys. Satellite is starting to look more and more appetizing to me -- just not digging the contract part...

..... Then again, perhaps if we had some sort of contract with BH we wouldn't be in this mess of them constantly manhandleing us .....


----------



## Okeemike

celly said:


> ..... Then again, perhaps if we had some sort of contract with BH we wouldn't be in this mess of them constantly manhandleing us .....


I disagree. If we had a BHN contract, it would be even more difficult to change.

With regard to DTV, I had zero issues with their service. I simply did not want to use their DVR (I really, really, really hated it). If they had a TiVo option, I'd happily sign a multi-year contract.


----------



## celly

Okeemike said:


> I disagree. If we had a BHN contract, it would be even more difficult to change.


Not necessarily true. Most long term contracts have some sort of consumer protection in them.

Look back at the TDMA/GSM switch for like Cingular. They had so many customers under contract they couldn't force them over to GSM until their contracts expired. Then again, that might had more to do with the fact that the users purchased hardware from them.

I guess now that I think about it is the difference is, since we didn't purchase the Tivos from BHN we don't get this luxury of backwards compatibility. But that doesn't make what they did right -- They have no options to purchase so why should we rent their crap when we can own superior devices...



Okeemike said:


> With regard to DTV, I had zero issues with their service. I simply did not want to use their DVR (I really, really, really hated it). If they had a TiVo option, I'd happily sign a multi-year contract.


My Buddy has one of these:
http://reviews.cnet.com/digital-video-recorders-dvrs/directv-hd-dvr-hd/4505-6474_7-30842839.html

It works really well...

On a side note: Doing my part to be 'green' (and really just for giggles) I have been measuring every device in my house with a Kill-A-Watt. I hooked my one BHN DVR and my tivo up for 2 days each. The Explorer DVR uses 27% more electricity... This surprised me, but my best guess is it has to do with possibly cheaper components. *shrug* "Tivo.. The green DVR" ... hehehe ...


----------



## Okeemike

celly said:


> My Buddy has one of these:
> http://reviews.cnet.com/digital-video-recorders-dvrs/directv-hd-dvr-hd/4505-6474_7-30842839.html
> 
> It works really well...


I guess I should have been more precise... I swapped due to the lack of HD functionality. All of DTV stuff is moving (or has already moved) to the MPEG4 satellite, wich TiVo doesn't support.


----------



## celly

Okeemike said:


> I guess I should have been more precise... I swapped due to the lack of HD functionality. All of DTV stuff is moving (or has already moved) to the MPEG4 satellite, wich TiVo doesn't support.


I thought they had a Dongle for that?


----------



## Okeemike

celly said:


> I thought they had a Dongle for that?


The dongle (which hasn't shipped yet) is supposed to take care of the SDV issue. The HD Tivo and Series 3 are not two way capable...the upcoming S4 is rumored to resolve this problem.


----------



## celly

Okeemike said:


> The dongle (which hasn't shipped yet) is supposed to take care of the SDV issue. The HD Tivo and Series 3 are not two way capable...the upcoming S4 is rumored to resolve this problem.


Ok, now we're really getting our lines crossed.  I thought DTV had a dongle you could use for the MPEG4 streams for legacy equiptment on DTV.


----------



## net114

I'm sure there's been no additional word. I'm gettin' a little frustrated.


----------



## net114

Anyone get any results on this yet?


----------



## orangeboy

net114 said:


> Anyone get any results on this yet?


I'm wondering if enough central Florida folks start plugging in their address here: http://www22.verizon.com/fiosforhome/channels/fiostv/checkavailability.aspx, that someone at Verizon would notice a demand here for something other than Bright House! I know I would switch if I had the opportunity. BHN has had more than enough time to reconcile the programming error that they caused.


----------



## dcanora

Just called Brighthouse Orlando to schedule a CableCard install for my TivoHD... the first rep I spoke with told me - repeatedly - that Brighthouse no longer sells CableCards. I told her she must be mistaken because it is mandated that they must offer them, and told her I would wait while she checked with her supervisor. She came back on fairly quickly and confirmed that "We no longer sell CableCards."

I asked to speak to her supervisor. After a long wait, Sonya came on and apologized saying she didn't know why the first rep said CableCards weren't available, and that the rep was getting coaching from her supervisor while we spoke. She said Brighthouse doesn't recommend them, and that they don't get all the channels, but they do still offer them. She then quickly set me up with an appointment for the install.

So, the question is, was the first rep mistaken (and how would that happen?) or was she doing as she was told? Conspiracy theorists want to know!


----------



## acvthree

Yes, we block some of the channels from being viewed with cable card so we don't recomend the use of cable card.

Funny.


----------



## orangeboy

acvthree said:


> Yes, we block some of the channels from being viewed with cable card so we don't recomend the use of cable card.
> 
> Funny.


Don't forget: "Yes, we block some of the channels from being viewed with cable card (for no technical reason)..."


----------



## Okeemike

It's been a week (today) since I've heard back from BHN. I've reached out toher again. I'll let you all know if I hear anything back.


----------



## net114

Response to my FCC complaint, obviously "REPTSR62" knows nothing about what they are talking about in any way shape or form:

"You are receiving this email in response to your inquiry to the FCC.

Good Afternoon,

FAQ's
1. What are the Cable Carriage Rules for Digital TV?
2. What is "dual carriage"?
3. What is multi-casting?
4. Will my cable company be required to broadcast all the multi-casting signals?
5. Is a DTV-only commercial TV station required to carry a must carry and retransmission consent station?


1. What are the Cable Carriage Rules for Digital TV?
There is no "dual carriage" requirement on cable operators. This would have required them to simultaneously carry broadcasters' analog and digital signals and cable operators are not required to carry more than a single digital programming stream from any particular broadcaster.

2. What is "dual carriage"?
Dual carriage would be to simultaneously carry broadcasters' analog and digital signals.

3. What is multi-casting?
Multi-casting is carrying multiple programming streams.

4. Will my cable company be required to broadcast all the "dual carriage' signals?
Cable operators are not required to carry more than a single digital programming stream from any particular broadcaster.


In FCC Order 01-22 the Commission found that mandatory dual carriage is not necessary either to advance the governmental interests as identified by Congress and the Supreme Court, or to achieve the digital television transition. Therefore, they declined to require cable operators to carry any more than one programming stream of a digital television station.


5. Is a DTV-only commercial TV station required to carry a must carry and retransmission consent station?
A commercial television station, broadcasting in both formats during the transition period, may choose must carry or retransmission consent for its analog signal & retransmission consent for its digital signal. A DTV-only commercial television station may elect either transmission
consent or must carry.




Rep Number : TSR62"


----------



## orangeboy

net114 said:


> Response to my FCC complaint, obviously "REPTSR62" knows nothing about what they are talking about in any way shape or form:
> 
> "You are receiving this email in response to your inquiry to the FCC.
> 
> Good Afternoon,
> 
> FAQ's
> 1. What are the Cable Carriage Rules for Digital TV?
> 2. What is "dual carriage"?
> 3. What is multi-casting?
> 4. Will my cable company be required to broadcast all the multi-casting signals?
> 5. Is a DTV-only commercial TV station required to carry a must carry and retransmission consent station?
> 
> 1. What are the Cable Carriage Rules for Digital TV?
> There is no "dual carriage" requirement on cable operators. This would have required them to simultaneously carry broadcasters' analog and digital signals and cable operators are not required to carry more than a single digital programming stream from any particular broadcaster.
> 
> 2. What is "dual carriage"?
> Dual carriage would be to simultaneously carry broadcasters' analog and digital signals.
> 
> 3. What is multi-casting?
> Multi-casting is carrying multiple programming streams.
> 
> 4. Will my cable company be required to broadcast all the "dual carriage' signals?
> Cable operators are not required to carry more than a single digital programming stream from any particular broadcaster.
> 
> In FCC Order 01-22 the Commission found that mandatory dual carriage is not necessary either to advance the governmental interests as identified by Congress and the Supreme Court, or to achieve the digital television transition. Therefore, they declined to require cable operators to carry any more than one programming stream of a digital television station.
> 
> 5. Is a DTV-only commercial TV station required to carry a must carry and retransmission consent station?
> A commercial television station, broadcasting in both formats during the transition period, may choose must carry or retransmission consent for its analog signal & retransmission consent for its digital signal. A DTV-only commercial television station may elect either transmission
> consent or must carry.
> 
> Rep Number : TSR62"


How did you get them to respond? It's been about a month since I filed form 2000, and I've yet to hear anything! I called the 800 number to ascertain a status, but was too impatient to wait the xx number of minutes for the next CSR to receive my call in the order it came in.


----------



## joelkfla

Bright House is currently running their 2008 customer satisfaction survey. Everyone, make sure you log on to cfl.mybrighthouse.com and give them the ratings they deserve.


----------



## PopcornGuy

joelkfla said:


> Bright House is currently running their 2008 customer satisfaction survey. Everyone, make sure you log on to cfl.mybrighthouse.com and give them the ratings they deserve.


Why bother? We already know customer service doesn't care about this problem.


----------



## RachelF

I filled it out even though I know they don't care about customer service. I thought it would make me feel better to say something but it didn't.


----------



## net114

An update on the FCC complaint, I sent an email back saying that my complaint had nothing to do with "dual carriage", but was about BH not carrying channels on cable cards.

The same rep emailed me back, saying I needed to fill out a complaint form...*and gave me the url of the same one I filled out to get the original answer!!!* Ah...the government at work.


----------



## Okeemike

So, I heard back from BHN, and was told the following:



> The last update I received was that we would have a decision around the end of this month. I have asked for another update and haven't received it, so it is my assumption we are still working on that timeline. I'll contact you once I have heard any news.


----------



## celly

Okeemike said:


> So, I heard back from BHN, and was told the following:


My guess is they are filibustering on the issue to release good news with the Bad... ie:

Brighthouse adds 5 New HD channels!!! _Cablecard customers still screwed..._


----------



## Okeemike

celly said:


> My guess is they are filibustering on the issue to release good news with the Bad... ie:
> 
> Brighthouse adds 5 New HD channels!!! _Cablecard customers still screwed..._


hahahaha. That's funny. (and probably accurate)


----------



## dcanora

I'm almost embarassed to say this, but I just had a VERY smooth CableCard install. Brighthouse tech came with two M-Cards (SA v1.2), popped one in, made a call, and it just worked. He was here 20 minutes, max.

Guy also said he doesn't know why Brighthouse is trying to "phase CableCards out" since Tivos work better than their DVRs!

Now if they'd just let me watch all the channels I pay for...


----------



## acvthree

>>>Guy also said he doesn't know why Brighthouse is trying to "phase CableCards out" since Tivos work better than their DVRs!

Is this confirmation of a deliberate policy?


----------



## dcanora

I suspect it's deliberate, but I bet it's not an official policy.


----------



## Okeemike

I would doubt it. Were the installers 'official' BHN engineers? I trust little, if anything of what the subcontractors say.


----------



## rxache

Has anyone seriously considered a class action lawsuit. **standard disclaimer** I am not a lawyer. But it seems to me that CableLabs (the industry group that produced cablecard) has failed in their responsibilty to ensure compatibility with the device. Obviously BHN made the decsion to switch to a new technology (prematurely) that I wouldn't be suprised to find had be developed in cooperation with.... you guessed it CableLabs.

This situation is intolerable in light of the fact that BHN has yet to actually broadcast using SDV... The hugh and cry that would go up if a Software company (MS or Apple) made an unannounced change that caused 5% of peoples content to become unplayable.


----------



## JWThiers

SDV is compatible with Cable Cards (Cable Cards are used in NEWER BHN devices) so technically they are not the problem. The problem is that BHN is not allowing access to new channels in HD because they will in the future be on SDV. IF they wanted they could flip a switch and everyone with cable cards could have those channels right now.

Class action because they are not allowing use to get the channels that we can technically receive but are being denied access is another story.


----------



## therlin

Newsflash!

All the HD channels (except for TLC HD and Science HD) will be turned back on for cableCARD customers as early as today or tomorrow.

I was told that the bandwidth for the 2 channels that are not being given to us is already allocated for something else. Since I'm not a technical person, I have no way of knowing if this is correct or not, so I'll leave that up to others to discuss.


----------



## celly

therlin said:


> Newsflash!
> 
> All the HD channels (except for TLC HD and Science HD) will be turned back on for cableCARD customers as early as today or tomorrow.
> 
> I was told that the bandwidth for the 2 channels that are not being given to us is already allocated for something else. Since I'm not a technical person, I have no way of knowing if this is correct or not, so I'll leave that up to others to discuss.


I really hope this is true. I was about to post a response about putting up the white flag when I saw this...

Great news... But, Still not holding my breath...


----------



## bigdave2004

therlin said:


> Newsflash!
> 
> All the HD channels (except for TLC HD and Science HD) will be turned back on for cableCARD customers as early as today or tomorrow.
> 
> I was told that the bandwidth for the 2 channels that are not being given to us is already allocated for something else. Since I'm not a technical person, I have no way of knowing if this is correct or not, so I'll leave that up to others to discuss.


How could the bandwidth be allocated for something else when brighouse boxes still get those channels? Great News!!


----------



## Okeemike

Awww... man, someone stole my thunder.

The Director of CS just called me to confirm the following:

(*) We will be receiving the channels that were removed
(*) We will be receiving channels that were added on Feb 1
(*) We will also be getting back History / Biography SD channels.

This is good only until the Aug/Sep timeframe when SDV will be rolled out. The SDV rollout is pending an upgrade from Passport to Maestro on all BHN boxes, which is due in August.

We should be a good shape once the tuning resolver is rolled out, which is looking like Q3 or Q4, but no one knows for sure. BHN is still in conversation with TiVo and related parties as to who will provide the device. BHN is not in the "hardware business" so they don't really want to do it. 

These channel changes should take place today / tomorrow, but be patient...who knows what kind of red tape has to be worked through. I would also expect some cable cards to have a problem with the update...this seems to be the norm.

There will be communication coming from BHN to those of us who complained. That communication (it's an FAQ) will be sent out in the next day or two....I'm sure it will be posted somewhere here.

CONGRATS EVERYONE on sticking with this, and not going silently into the night. The little guy won one this time around.


----------



## celly

http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/03/3...ard-customers-win-battle-get-their-hd-channe/

Seriously, everyone here deserves a big pat on the back...


----------



## JWThiers

Okeemike said:


> Awww... man, someone stole my thunder.
> 
> The Director of CS just called me to confirm the following:
> 
> (*) We will be receiving the channels that were removed
> (*) We will be receiving channels that were added on Feb 1
> (*) We will also be getting back History / Biography SD channels.
> 
> This is good only until the Aug/Sep timeframe when SDV will be rolled out. The SDV rollout is pending an upgrade from Passport to Maestro on all BHN boxes, which is due in August.
> 
> ...
> 
> These channel changes should take place today / tomorrow, but be patient...who knows what kind of red tape has to be worked through. I would also expect some cable cards to have a problem with the update...this seems to be the norm.
> 
> There will be communication coming from BHN to those of us who complained. That communication (it's an FAQ) will be sent out in the next day or two....I'm sure it will be posted somewhere here.
> 
> CONGRATS EVERYONE on sticking with this, and not going silently into the night. The little guy won one this time around.


Thats great news Just shows what a bit of targeted complaining to be reasonable can do.


> We should be a good shape once the tuning resolver is rolled out, which is looking like Q3 or Q4, but no one knows for sure. BHN is still in conversation with TiVo and related parties as to who will provide the device. BHN is not in the "hardware business" so they don't really want to do it.


Next question is given this, and I am sure other cable providers feel the same way about being in the hardware business, when will they allow Tivo to build the resolver INTO a THD. or is it even possible? I don't see any reason it couldn't be. Any local cable company specific communication issues could be setup via firmware update during guided setup.


----------



## Okeemike

JWThiers said:


> ...when will they allow Tivo to build the resolver INTO a THD. or is it even possible...


I thought that the going rumor was it would be included in the S4?


----------



## dkahs23

Excellent....Thanks to everyone for sticking together. :up::up::up::up::up::up:


----------



## JWThiers

I don't much credence on rumors, but that would be logical. Now a release date for the S4 Sept 30, just in time for Christmas??? Sounds like a good rumor to me.

Based on pure speculation and pulling a date out of my rectal orifice.


----------



## Okeemike

JWThiers said:


> ...pulling a date out of my rectal orifice.


At least it'll be in HD now.


----------



## eitingon

Thanks!!!!


----------



## JWThiers

Full moon over cocoa


----------



## joelkfla

Great!

Has there been any news on the SciAtl resolver? I thought we only knew that Motorola was working on one.


----------



## TiVoToo

It's about time. I'm glad BHN has finally come to their senses, but this decision was a no brainer and should have taken 2 weeks, not 2 months.


----------



## Okeemike

TiVoToo said:


> It's about time. I'm glad BHN has finally come to their senses, but this decision was a no brainer and should have taken 2 weeks, not 2 months.


Agreed, better late than never, however. I'm not going to complain.

Checking this evening, it doesn't appears that I have access to the channels yet. Maybe tomorrow or perhaps later tonite.


----------



## eabu

Yay!! I am unashamed to say, thank you, Brighthouse!


----------



## bigdave2004

Here is the e-mail I just got:


> Dear Mr. bigdave2004,
> 
> Thank you for getting in touch with us regarding our cable programming services. This letter is to advise you that Bright House Networks will activate for your cable service the following channels on an interim basis at no additional charge:
> 
> TBS HD
> Discovery HD
> History HD
> Animal Planet HD
> Food HD
> National Geographic HD
> HGTV HD
> History International
> Biography (SD)
> 
> When interactive Switched Digital Video (SDV), or other interactive advanced delivery technologies are deployed, Bright House Networks may need to reclaim these and other channels to create those platforms We expect the first of these new technologies, interactive Switched Digital Video to be available in our service area later this year. You will be notified thirty days in advance of this change.
> 
> If you have TiVo equipment, Bright House Networks fully supports the cable industry and TiVo initiative to design an external adapter to support Interactive Switched Digital Video. This external adapter will enable TiVo digital video recorders that use CableCards to access digital cable channels without using a set top box. Based on our understanding, the external adapter will be designed to attach to TiVo Series 3 HD DVRs. Once the external adapter is designed and made available, customers with this equipment will be able to directly access digital channels offered by Bright House Networks.
> 
> Thank you for being a Bright House Networks customer; we appreciate your business.
> 
> Sincerely,
> 
> Sherrie Wrenchey
> Customer Care Quality Manager
> Bright House Networks Central Florida


YAY!


----------



## Okeemike

Ditto...718pm.


----------



## bigdave2004

I just hope this isn't an early April Fools Joke.


----------



## orangeboy

Okeemike said:


> Ditto...718pm.


Mine came at 7:33pm. 

Same letter - I replied back to Ms. Wrenchey with only 2 words: Thank You.

It's nice of them to acknowledge the tuning resolver, too! Perhaps tivo users aren't quite the silent minority after all!


----------



## Randman

Ditto here, too!

Congrats, everybody. I didn't know if this would happen, but I think everyone here had a huge part in this. It's great to see that we can make a difference.

And, thank you Brighthouse, for making a decision. It would have been easy to say "No", but you said "yes", and I appreciate it.


----------



## PopcornGuy

I just saw the email from Ms. Wrenchey, and yes, MOST of the channel are now on!  I don't think we should claim "victory" just yet. I think we still need some answers. My reply to Ms. Wrenchey:



> Thank you!!!, but...
> 
> Can you please explain the reason though for excluding 1345 (TLC HD) and 1348 (Science Channel HD). Brighthouse is not using SDV, so there is no technical reason (such as bandwidth limitations). I was told that Cablecard exclusion from all of the channels was simply an administrative decision (presumably to avoid complaints later). The channels are being delivered to my house through the "standard" cable method (not by SDV), but I can only access them on 1/2 of my boxes. Since my Pace box gets those channels, I believe there is still no reason I shouldn't get them on my Tivo. Correct?


----------



## PPC1

Any hope for Indianapolis?


----------



## Okeemike

PopcornGuy said:


> I just saw the email from Ms. Wrenchey, and yes, MOST of the channel are now on!  I don't think we should claim "victory" just yet. I think we still need some answers. My reply to Ms. Wrenchey:


According to post #454, this is due to those two channels already being reallocated. (whatever that means)


----------



## Okeemike

PPC1 said:


> Any hope for Indianapolis?


In the conversation that I had with BHN, I was told that the decision to add the channels back to our package was a 'corporate' one. I _assume_ that this means nationwide, but one can never know for sure.

Sniff out the proper 'suits' in your area to complain to...that's how I got hooked up with the people that I did (I emailed the regional (I think) president).


----------



## PopcornGuy

Okeemike said:


> According to post #454, this is due to those two channels already being reallocated. (whatever that means)


Yes, I saw that. But they were not "reallocated" on my Brighthouse cable box. Brighthouse is using the same "locks" for everyone, only our "keys" don't open all of them!


----------



## Okeemike

PopcornGuy said:


> Yes, I saw that. But they were not "reallocated" on my Brighthouse cable box. Brighthouse is using the same "locks" for everyone, only our "keys" don't open all of them!


Good point. To be honest, however, I'm really tired of fighting. I was THIS --> <-- close to dropping cable and going back to DirecTV (God help me), and I'm afraid that if I start complaining about this, my wife will kill me.


----------



## JimPa

Okeemike said:


> Good point. To be honest, however, I'm really tired of fighting. I was THIS --> <-- close to dropping cable and going back to DirecTV (God help me), and I'm afraid that if I start complaining about this, my wife will kill me.


Sounds like a new reality show. "Honey, lets switch back to satellite", question is does wife kill him by drowning, gunshot, poison...


----------



## JWThiers

Okeemike said:


> Good point. To be honest, however, I'm really tired of fighting. I was THIS --> <-- close to dropping cable and going back to DirecTV (God help me), and I'm afraid that if I start complaining about this, my wife will kill me.


you could have been THIS -><- close or worse, THIS -X- close


----------



## Okeemike

JWThiers said:


> you could have been THIS -><- close or worse, THIS -X- close


LOL. Always the optimist....


----------



## celly

> Thank you for getting in touch with us regarding our cable programming services. This letter is to advise you that Bright House Networks will activate for your cable service the following channels on an interim basis at no additional charge:
> 
> TBS HD Discovery HD
> History HD Animal Planet HD
> Food HD National Geographic HD
> HGTV HD History International (SD)
> Biography (SD)


So, they are only giving us back the Orginal channels? And not adding the new channels?

Plus I just checked... Still Bumpkis...


----------



## Okeemike

celly said:


> So, they are only giving us back the Orginal channels? And not adding the new channels?
> 
> Plus I just checked... Still Bumpkis...


My email indicated:

TBS HD
Discovery HD
History HD
Animal Planet HD
Food HD
National Geographic HD
HGTV HD
History International (SD) 
Biography (SD)

I checked this morning as I left the house, and I was receiving all channels 1340-1361, EXCEPT 1345-1348 (TLC and Science Channel).


----------



## celly

Okeemike said:


> My email indicated:
> 
> TBS HD
> Discovery HD
> History HD
> Animal Planet HD
> Food HD
> National Geographic HD
> HGTV HD
> History International (SD)
> Biography (SD)
> 
> I checked this morning as I left the house, and I was receiving all channels 1340-1361, EXCEPT 1345-1348 (TLC and Science Channel).


Oh. Sweet... Lemme do a reboot see if that helps..

Just sucks that now I have to change all my season passes Back to these channels..

Is there an easier way to change channels of a season pass besides rebuilding that pass?


----------



## Okeemike

celly said:


> Oh. Sweet... Lemme do a reboot see if that helps..
> 
> Just sucks that now I have to change all my season passes Back to these channels..
> 
> Is there an easier way to change channels of a season pass besides rebuilding that pass?


Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the TiVo will pick up on the new mappings, and record the HD channels automatically (?).


----------



## Chris Berry

Hello TiVo community. I'm glad Bright House was able to make the HD channels available! You probably already know this, but make sure you do a rescan to recieve the HD channels.

BHN Insider


----------



## bigdave2004

Chris Berry said:


> Hello TiVo community. I'm glad Bright House was able to make the HD channels available! You probably already know this, but make sure you do a rescan to recieve the HD channels.
> 
> BHN Insider


I never removed mine and I would check daily to see if they were "turned back on". However today, THEY WERE! YAY! Just sucks it took this long, but I think the WKMG issue took up some of their bandwidth. Maybe that's why we don't have TLCHD and SCIFIHD??


----------



## celly

Okeemike said:


> Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think the TiVo will pick up on the new mappings, and record the HD channels automatically (?).


Not if you have the Season pass already on a SD channel that also has a new HD channel...

ie. Mythbusters on Discovery vs. Mythbusters on Discovery HD... It doesn't remap, and the only thing I can find to change a channel is to remove, and re-add the pass...


----------



## Okeemike

celly said:


> Not if you have the Season pass already on a SD channel that also has a new HD channel...
> 
> ie. Mythbusters on Discovery vs. Mythbusters on Discovery HD... It doesn't remap, and the only thing I can find to change a channel is to remove, and re-add the pass...


This would be a great time to be able to manage subscriptions online (and reindexing, while we're at it), but that's another thread...


----------



## celly

Okeemike said:


> This would be a great time to be able to manage subscriptions online (and reindexing, while we're at it), but that's another thread...


Yup... Speaking of other threads...

Looks like NBC HD is offline now... *sigh* Why can't this be easy...


----------



## phdeez

celly said:


> Yup... Speaking of other threads...
> 
> Looks like NBC HD is offline now... *sigh* Why can't this be easy...


According to BH there is a power outage at the local NBC station causing NBC HD to be OOS.

I'm glad they "un-SDV'd" the new HD channels! I didn't even call in and have all of them except TLC & SCI-FI... YEAH!!


----------



## net114

Okeemike and everyone who was contacting BH, I want to thank you for your efforts! How many times do people just shrug their shoulders and leave all the effort to someone else? I give you a round of applause for keeping up with this, you've benefited a lot of people.


----------



## melissaox

My hubby was getting mad about the HD issues with BHN and our TiVo this weekend. He was going to complain tonight. Wait until I tell him  We will be checking out the HD tonight 

Thank you so much!


----------



## phdeez

net114 said:


> Okeemike and everyone who was contacting BH, I want to thank you for your efforts! How many times do people just shrug their shoulders and leave all the effort to someone else? I give you a round of applause for keeping up with this, you've benefited a lot of people.


I agree! I thought once cable providers switched channels to SDV, there was no going back and I would just have to wait for the dongle. If I had not checked the board, I would not have even tried the other channels [since I was told they were changed to SDV and I would need to goto a local office and pickup a non-dvr box from BHN and wait for the dongle- not too much help with a TivoHD!].

Thanks everyone for pursuing the SDV issue here locally!!


----------



## jasap

A newly minted Tivo HD citizen, all I can say at this point is whoaa... thankfully I only had to deal with the missing channels issue for a few days but am nevertheless thankful I will not have to endure the wrath of my better half. Our conversion from the (BH) sorry excuse for a DVR is now complete!

After hearing the less than positive experiences with CableCard installations I could not help but share my own: called in to set up the appointment at about 3am with a cust svc rep who did not even flinch at the mention of Tivo/CableCard. Not one but two &#8220;official&#8221; BH techs arrived about 30 mins in to their scheduled four hour window this past Saturday. Both were in uniform and driving fully marked vans. Seemed unusual in that the second tech appeared to be getting trained on the install process?! Anywho, they spent all of 20 mins here. The lead tech took care of business despite the obviously less than experienced rep on the other end of the activation phone call.

Much thanks to Okeemike and the gang for keeping up the good fight, we're all better off!!


----------



## therlin

Well, the BHN tech just left the house.... without doing anything. They didn't tell him to bring CableCARDs. wtf.

He did ask "are those for the Internet?"

He is supposed to come back later, I'm guessing I'll have to guide him through the entire process.

I should have just kept them all along.


----------



## Okeemike

jasap said:


> Anywho, they spent all of 20 mins here. The lead tech took care of business despite the obviously less than experienced rep on the other end of the activation phone call.


The key was that you got an 'official' BHN engineer. When they did my installation in Apopka back in October, I initially got a contractor. He didn't bring a cable card, or know what it was (or speak English for that matter). A quick call to BHN got me a free month of service, and another scheduled app't with an actual engineer . That guy knew what he was doing . 15 minutes, in and out. In speaking with him, he indicated that (at the time) there were only two of them that did all of the Cable Card installations in the area. He was super nice, knew his stuff, and quickly got out of my way.


----------



## therlin

I had a tech show up again, this time he brought a CableCARD, an M-Card actually. No need for 2, I'm recording 2 HD channels with a single card so it seems to work properly (to my surprise.)

UPDATE: While forcing 2 recordings at once works, scheduling two overlapping recordings does not work. They are bringing me a 2nd CableCARD.


----------



## orangeboy

Okeemike said:


> The key was that you got an 'official' BHN engineer. When they did my installation in Apopka back in October, I initially got a contractor. He didn't bring a cable card, or know what it was (or speak English for that matter). A quick call to BHN got me a free month of service, and another scheduled app't with an actual engineer . That guy knew what he was doing . 15 minutes, in and out. In speaking with him, he indicated that (at the time) there were only two of them that did all of the Cable Card installations in the area. He was super nice, knew his stuff, and quickly got out of my way.


I've had hit-r-miss with BHN in the LBV area. The first tech to come out REALLY needed the tivo (S3) install poster to get the cards installed. That was quite awhile ago. More recently with the whole SDV fiasco, I had a tech out to check on channels 146 & 147 which had stopped working on (or after) 2/1/2008, along with the HD channels. He seemed to know quite a bit about tivos, guided setup, and 'zaps' to the cards. As we found out from Ms. Wrenchey's message, 146 & 147 were a part of the channels slated for SDV. Overall, I think I'm batting 200-250 with knowledgleable technicians...


----------



## phdeez

phdeez said:


> I agree! I thought once cable providers switched channels to SDV, there was no going back and I would just have to wait for the dongle. If I had not checked the board, I would not have even tried the other channels [since I was told they were changed to SDV and I would need to goto a local office and pickup a non-dvr box from BHN and wait for the dongle- not too much help with a TivoHD!].
> 
> Thanks everyone for pursuing the SDV issue here locally!!


Just a side-note: received a letter from BH today indicating that channels that were SDV have been switched back [other than TLC HD & SCI-FI HD]. They also said they fully support Tivo users and look forward to the dongle solution.


----------



## cavalier

Chris Berry said:


> Hello TiVo community. I'm glad Bright House was able to make the HD channels available! You probably already know this, but make sure you do a rescan to recieve the HD channels.
> 
> BHN Insider


Holy crap!  :up::up::up::up:

Good move, Bright House!

Let me just say that I have not been following up on this thread for some time. I figured the situation closed and my channels lost until the actual switch to SDV came and I had a USB dongle to handle it.

Imagine my BONAFIDE suprise this evening to come home to a snail mail letter from BHN letting me know my channels are back! On an "interim basis".. still, they're back! Alton Brown in HD, woo hoo!

Well done, while many would jeer you all for making such a [expletive deleted] bone head move in the first place, it takes a touch of humility and leadership to actually come out and make it right.

Please extend my kudos! Well done!


----------



## Okeemike

Did anyone else receive the letter from from the* FL Dept of Agriculture and Consumer Services*?

I know I filed a complaint with them, and I'm wondering if it was that which made the difference. This letter included the text of the physical letter we received.

I'm now thinking that it wasn't BHN being altruistic after all, rather gov't pressure.


----------



## orangeboy

Okeemike said:


> Did anyone else receive the letter from from the* FL Dept of Agriculture and Consumer Services*?
> 
> I know I filed a complaint with them, and I'm wondering if it was that which made the difference. This letter included the text of the physical letter we received.
> 
> I'm now thinking that it wasn't BHN being altruistic after all, rather gov't pressure.


I received 2 letters from them, the first coming on March 28th. It stated: 


> The Division of Consumer Services, Bureau of Mediation and Enforcement has attempted to mediate your complaint against this business. Unfortunately, the business has refused to cooperate, and we are unable to assist you further. Therefore, we are closing your complaint "Closed Unsatisfactorily."


It goes on to say that I may consider contacting a lawyer if I wanted to further pursue this matter.

The second letter is dated April 2nd. It stated the affirmative:


> The Division of Consumer Services, Bureau of Mediation and Enforcement received a response regarding your above referenced complaint. Please review the enclosed business reply and notify me in writing within 15 days if you would like to refute the business response. If you are satisfied with the business response and/or offer, notification is not required.


My personal opinion is the Bureau may have had little influence on the outcome. I only believe that because of the quick turn-around with the letters. Had the Bureau been working closely with BHN for a resolution, I don't think a 'closed unsatisfactorily' letter would have come only 3 business days before the satisfactory (to me) response! It is possible my 'closed unsatisfactorily' letter was one of the very last to go out, and the business reply letter to me being one of the very first to go out, but I think BHN's response was as much a surprise to the Bureau as it was for me! 

Don't get me wrong - I'd use this avenue again if I feel I was treated unjustly, but I doubt I would rely solely on them.


----------



## Okeemike

orangeboy said:


> My personal opinion is the Bureau may have had little influence on the outcome


I just founditstrange that the second letter would have the BHN letter as part of its content. Oh well..I've got Mythbusters in HD, that's really all I wanted.


----------



## orangeboy

Okeemike said:


> I just founditstrange that the second letter would have the BHN letter as part of its content. Oh well..I've got Mythbusters in HD, that's really all I wanted.


That is a good point, but the letter would have held greater merit had I not gotten the BHN e-mail on 3/31! I do suppose electrons travel faster than the postman, though! And I hear ya - I'm very happy that the HD content has been given back to us. I was kind of surprised at all I was missing!


----------



## orangeboy

orangeboy said:


> That is a good point, but the letter would have held greater merit had I not gotten the BHN e-mail on 3/31! I do suppose electrons travel faster than the postman, though! And I hear ya - I'm very happy that the HD content has been given back to us. I was kind of surprised at all I was missing!


Ha! I'm responding to my own post.

Upon closer inspection of the Bureau's letter, I do see that it did address my complaint specifically, and wasn't quite the form letter I first took it for! Maybe I don't join the libertarian party just yet...


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## orangeboy

I'm really not losing sleep over this, but I thought about this early this morning: How did BHN stop the channels from being received on non-BHN devices without actually deploying SDV yet? Was there some field in a database that indicated CableCARD customer, and let's go screw these customers because we can?

I know that's the whole crux of this thread; BHN had no technical reason to stop those channels _yet_, and I'm grateful that the were turned back on, but it still continues to bother me that this cable Operator is dictating what and what not I can view, regardless of how much I pay a month, based on the technology that I choose to use! Maybe it's the current letter to FCC/Senate/House threads that's stirred these embers in me.


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## Okeemike

The cable cards are individually addressable, so I assume that all of the 'non BHN DVR / Cable Box" cards are in a group, and summarily had channels added or removed.


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## dkahs23

Here's something interesting. http://www.news4jax.com/technology/15944379/detail.html


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## bigdave2004

Hate to revive this old thread and there has been some talk in this thread as well. It looks like all previous HD channels and the new ones that have been added since now work with our TiVo and cable cards. Now my questions is has anyone talked to BrightHouse about this? Is this going to stay? Was this an accident? Is this because we haven't gotten a tuning resolver yet?

Just looking for input...

-Dave


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## nandopr

Some Brighthouse Central Florida channels not working anymore with the S3

I realized today that many HD channels, like HBO, Showtime, discovery, TLC and some others stopped working today. 

Anyone else in the area having similar problem?

thank you


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## Fryerszoo

yea i am not getting any channles with my tivo but my other tv with regular cable and my internet is working fine I called and the girl said that they were having outages in my area! i said then why do i have cable on 1 tv and not the other she said that it was a intermittent problem. wow that is intermittent when 1 tv works and the other one dont


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## orangeboy

I'm having problems with ALL channels, including 'basic cable'! I just hit the 3 thumbs down to restart my S3. Failing that, I'll pull the power to the box. Failing that, I'm calling BHN. It's sad that I and a lot of the people I know have the number memorized for the Orlando area: 407-291-2500. I don't even have to look it up.


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## nandopr

I also have the Scientific Atlanta DVR and I can see all the HD channels with that DVR. Only TiVo S3 cable cards are the one that are not working. Maybe they have a big problem at their end. Their phone lines are always busy.


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## TiVoToo

nandopr said:


> Some Brighthouse Central Florida channels not working anymore with the S3
> 
> I realized today that many HD channels, like HBO, Showtime, discovery, TLC and some others stopped working today.
> 
> Anyone else in the area having similar problem?
> 
> thank you


yes.
BHN giveth, BHN taketh away.
Wife is royallly PO'd as she lost a bunch of recordings.

[edit] just informed BHN experiencing major outage of digital cable service since 3pm in Orange, Osceola, and Seminole.


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## orangeboy

No sir, not happy one bit about these circumstances. 
I wasn't actually watching anything at the time, but saw both tuner lights on, recording something. Figured I'd catch up with it later. Maybe instead I'll get an account with Netflix and try out that this evening.

Yep, their phone (BHN) is still busy, too.


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## saeba

Same issue here. BrightHouse M Cable Card... can get network HDTV channels, can't get SD channels, premium channels, or non-network HD channels (HGTV, HDnet.etc). Called them and they tried resending signal to card, tried multiple power resets... no go. So a tech has to come out.  

Looking at recordings... must have happened between 10am and 7pm today.

But watch instantly on Netflix works


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## joefox97

I know it's sacrilege to say, but my time with BHN is making me wish I was back in Comcast territory!

I, like other CFL BHN customers have NO cable access on my Tivo; I imagine that they installed an "upgrade" or something else really dumb that's shut down our access. The phone lines are completely jammed; if anyone gets in and finds out what the deuce is going on, please post; I'll do the same.

joe


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## joefox97

Okay -- they posted a recorded notice on their phone system, finally; it's a network issue, so tech dispatch won't be necessary. They should have it fixed. in the meantime, you can disconnect your cable box, Tivo or other digital device and plug directly into the TV (if you have a tuner -- which many flat screens DON'T), and use that; it should work for a short-term solution.

I think we need to issue a public flogging to them for this; we're a large enough community to be heard. We also need to use this as a springboard to "Where's SDV for Tivo?"

Have a good night all -- and thank goodness for Tivo recordings! I had to catch up on House and Top Chef anyway. ;-)

joe


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## orangeboy

Dunno when, but service has been restored...
I know it was before 11:00 - Curb Your Enthusiasm was recorded


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## celly

> Bright House Networks Announces More High Definition Channels Just in Time for the Holidays at No Additional Charge
> 
> Maitland, FL--Just as Santa begins leaving shiny new High Definition TV's under the tree, Bright House Networks is once again expanding its programming lineup with more HD channels, including the very popular Sci-Fi HD and FX HD channels. Also joining the ever-increasing HD lineup are Travel HD and USA HD and all at no charge to Digital Cable TV customers.
> 
> The new channels, Sci-Fi HD on channel 1369, FX HD on channel 1370, Travel HD on channel 1356 and USA HD on channel 1339 are being added to BHN's HD Basic lineup at no additional charge to Digital Cable TV customers on Dec. 29th. The company expects to add significantly more HD services in early 2009 and is continuing down the path of providing nearly 100 HD channels as planned.
> 
> In addition to the 15 new HD channels added this year, Bright House also offers a significant library of HD Video on Demand services with about 350 selections, a menu that is expected to tripleÿ next year.
> 
> Unlike other providers BHN digital cable customers have a majority of the HD channels without any additional charge. And the delivery of HD programming on Bright House's fiber-rich optic network does not impact the performance of customers' High Speed Data service as some other provider's networks do.
> 
> "Bright House Network customers continue to experience expansion of the HD channel offerings all year at no charge. The customer response has been very encouraging," said J. Christian Fenger, President Bright House Networks Central Florida Division. "We're doing it right and we'll continue to add more channels as we move into the New Year. Our customers have a lot to look forward to with Bright House."
> 
> In addition to adding more HD channels, Bright House also launched this year Caller ID on TV for its Digital Phone customers. The company also won two more J.D. Power and Associate Awards for customer service as well as its Digital Phone product. Bright House has earned five J. D. Power awards in less than two years.
> 
> "We work hard to make life easier for our customers. Making sure they are getting great value and service is a priority for us," Fenger said.
> 
> Here is a summary of the HD channels launched in 2008 by Bright House Networks at no additional charge to HD Cable TV customers:
> 
> • Discovery Channel HD
> • Animal Planet HD
> • TLC HD
> • Science Channel HD
> • National Geographic HD
> • ABC Family HD
> • Disney Channel HD
> • MGM HD - HD Pack
> • CNN HD
> • ESPNU HD
> • Sci-Fi HD
> • FX HD
> • Travel HD
> • USA HD
> 
> In addition, Hallmark Movie Channel HD was launched in 2008 on the optional HD Pack to replace MOJO HD, which ceased operations on Dec. 1, 2008. The price of the HD Pack, which also includes HDNet, HDNet Movies, Universal HD, HD Showcase, and MGM HD remains at $6 per month.
> 
> All Bright House Networks HD customers have access to hundreds of movies in HD anytime through the HD Movies On Demand service available on channel 1123 with 24-hour rental fees starting at $2.99. Given the popularity of BHN's HD On Demand services, the company is working to vastly expland it offerings up to tripling the number of HD movies and shows available on demand next year. Premium HD services from HBO and Showtime are also available to subscribers of those services at no additional charge.
> 
> Bright House Networks HD services are made possible by the company's robust, fiber optic network architecture. This network, created by cable television engineers, was deployed to provide seamless delivery of new products to the public as advanced services and products became available. It has enabled the delivery of the voice, video and data products that the company has made available across the country.


Anyone hear if this will be available to CC customers? Or will we back back to the ol' SDV song and dance again?


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## Okeemike

celly said:


> Anyone hear if this will be available to CC customers? Or will we back back to the ol' SDV song and dance again?


I can only speak (myself) for SCI HD. That's been part of the package for a while now, and mysteriously showed up on my cable card package a month or so ago. I'll have to double check the other channels tonight.

This marketing, however, is likely due to the roll out of UVerse, and BHN attempting to prevent (or limit) any attrition due to the new service being available.


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## celly

Okeemike said:


> I can only speak (myself) for SCI HD. That's been part of the package for a while now, and mysteriously showed up on my cable card package a month or so ago. I'll have to double check the other channels tonight.
> 
> This marketing, however, is likely due to the roll out of UVerse, and BHN attempting to prevent (or limit) any attrition due to the new service being available.


Yeah, U-Verse advertising is hitting hard in East Orlando right now. If they supported Cable cards, I'd switch in a second.

Honestly, If I could get ANY other provider that supported cable cards, they could do anything short of killing my family, and I'd still switch -- Just for the simple fact it's not Brighthouse...

.. Either way, I just checked .. no Sci HD for me ..


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## Okeemike

celly said:


> Yeah, U-Verse advertising is hitting hard in East Orlando right now. If they supported Cable cards, I'd switch in a second.
> 
> Honestly, If I could get ANY other provider that supported cable cards, they could do anything short of killing my family, and I'd still switch -- Just for the simple fact it's not Brighthouse...
> 
> .. Either way, I just checked .. no Sci HD for me ..


Shouldn't they, by law, support cable cards?


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## celly

Okeemike said:


> Shouldn't they, by law, support cable cards?


Nope, it's iptv, not "cable" -- so they are not required to provide cablecards...


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## windracer

Over here in St. Pete, my S3 and THD are now receiving USA-HD, SciFi-HD, and BravoHD. :up:


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## zylont

I think its only a matter of time before the new channels go away...

BigBand Networks' SDV selected by Bright House Networks
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0ECZ/is_/ai_n28100105

"BHN has completed installation of the first phase of BigBand's switched digital video solution (SDV) in Orlando, Florida, USA. BHN has also begun deployment of BigBand SDV in Tampa, Florida and Indianapolis, Indiana. "


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## WBragg

No SciFiHD up here in Sanford on CableCard yet.


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## saeba

For me - Bright House, Belle Isle FL - I can manually tune to SciFi HD on my Bright House DVR, but it doesn't show up on their program guide . 

Can't get it at all on our TiVo. Tried rebooting both, but no change.


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## TomRaz

What is the status of the usb based dongle that Tivo was creating so Series 3 users could get SDV ?


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## JWThiers

TomRaz said:


> What is the status of the usb based dongle that Tivo was creating so Series 3 users could get SDV ?


Soon. Read Here.


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## TomRaz

JW thank you very much for the update. I thought the usb dongles would be coming from Tivo and not BHN. 

I guess the next step is they will tell us the dongles don't exist and we need to use their dvr's


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## bigdave2004

> In other Bright House news, the company activated four new HD channels today, which is six days earlier than planned.
> 
> The channels are:
> 
> * Sci-Fi HD: Channel 1369
> * FX HD: Channel 1370
> * Travel HD: Channel 1356
> * USA HD: Channel 1339


These work for me but no guide data. Hurry it up TiVo! Plz


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## bigdave2004

TomRaz said:


> JW thank you very much for the update. I thought the usb dongles would be coming from Tivo and not BHN.
> 
> I guess the next step is they will tell us the dongles don't exist and we need to use their dvr's


BHN has some dongles in their "labs" and are testing them they said they just need to get the processes in place to distribute them. Last I heard as well is they would be free. We'll see about that tho...


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## saeba

bigdave2004 said:


> These work for me but no guide data. Hurry it up TiVo! Plz


Yep, now I can get the channels on my TiVo, but, as you say, no guide data. Any idea how long it usually takes for TiVo to add new channels to the guide?

And my BrightHouse DVR now has the new channels and the guide data.


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## joelkfla

Received a notice from the FCC that Bright House had "addressed my concerns satisfactorily" in a letter which I should have received a copy of (NOT!). This related to a complaint I filed last summer about Science, TLC, etc.

Wonder if this explains the sudden appearance of the blocked HD channels a few weeks ago?


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## Randman

Got USA the other night. Very happy to be able to get Burn Notice in HD, when it comes back on.

Now, getting anxious about SDV.


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## eabu

Got SciFi HD, Travel Channel HD, FX HD, USA HD on the BHN cable box but not through cable cards in TiVo


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## TomRaz

So for the channels you can't receive from BHN will that require a tuning adapter ?


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## jamesweber

eabu said:


> Got SciFi HD, Travel Channel HD, FX HD, USA HD on the BHN cable box but not through cable cards in TiVo


You should be receiving them... I have mine in Oviedo, I called them and asked them why I didn't see the scifi channel. They said they needed to activate it and a couple seconds later tech told me to try 1369 and it was there.

I then went into the channel listing and had to check mark all the new channels to get them to show up in the guide.

It took 2 days before guide data finally showed up, forcing the connection to TiVo didn't get the info, it just showed up after 2 days.


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## mee081224

Hi ppl I am a noob, forgive my ignorance and lack of reading through 19 pages. It seems many of you fought hard and long to get to where you are today with your tivo and brighthouse. Please help me. I just got a new tivo for fathers day, as a trade with my wife to lower the cable bill (by getting rid of the cable box, or so I hope)

I currently have a packaged deal of phone, internet and cable tv. My hoa pays most of the digital service, so my bill comes out to like $72, i recently signed up for a promo to get the nationwide plan for about $10 less, but they say that my box rental is included on my old plan and my current plan. But my bill shows it broken out as a rental. Am I getting the run around, or are the legit? Also can my Tivo series 3 HD dvr work as a cable box? Please tell me what I need to do or lookup and who to contact at BHN. Everyone I talk to are complete morons. PLEASE HELP

I am going to another thread to ask this as it seems fresher
tc/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=400091&page=12


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## windracer

mee081224 said:


> Also can my Tivo series 3 HD dvr work as a cable box?


Yes, when you have Brighthouse put CableCARDs in it. Otherwise it will only pull the analog channels (and over antenna if you have that). For your THD you'll need either one M-Card (in Slot 1) or two S-Cards.


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## Okeemike

mee081224 said:


> But my bill shows it broken out as a rental. Am I getting the run around, or are the legit?
> tc/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=400091&page=12


You might be in a unique situation, due to the fact that your HOA pays for your cable. I'm guessing (and it's only a guess) that your everything associated with your bill is prenegotiated, and is set up as a package and would therefore not be flexible. I've never lived in an HOA like yours, however, so I don't know what the deal is. I am aware of someone else on this forum who is...I'll ask him to weigh in on this.

What I am doing with my S3, is simply replacing the charge for the cable box with the cost of the cable cards ($2/month + $30 or so install fee). The Tuning Adapter will also be required to receive channels that are part of the SDV (Switched Digital Video) system...these channels would include Versus HD, Universal HD, among others. You likely will not be able to receive the SDV channels without a Tuning Adapter if you are not using Brighthouse's box.


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## mee081224

Okeemike said:


> What I am doing with my S3, is simply replacing the charge for the cable box with the cost of the cable cards ($2/month + $30 or so install fee). The Tuning Adapter will also be required to receive channels that are part of the SDV (Switched Digital Video) system...these channels would include Versus HD, Universal HD, among others. You likely will not be able to receive the SDV channels without a Tuning Adapter if you are not using Brighthouse's box.


Even with the TA, I still need the service to begin with. Is that correct?


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## Okeemike

mee081224 said:


> Even with the TA, I still need the service to begin with. Is that correct?


Yes that's correct.


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