# No guide data after 7:30 pm July 2



## tivoknucklehead (Dec 12, 2002)

But my TiVo is connecting ok. Anyone else?
I should by now at least have through July 4 7:30 pm


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

I'm the same. My last connection was at 6:30 AM today.

I'm not really concerned about it unless it doesn't update for a few days.


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## lujan (May 24, 2010)

No, I'm also only showing guide data until 7/2/13 but I usually don't go that far into the future anyway. 7/3/13 is showing "To Be Announced".


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## eric102 (Oct 31, 2012)

Hmm, 10 days out has been normal for my Tivo's recently. Did it used to be 12 days or more?


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

They normally store 14 days of guide data, usually 2 previous and 12 forward


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Same here. Two days I haven't gotten data (today would be day 3).


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

And I just got three days' worth.

So I guess it's not some kind of Tivoyan 2013 End of the World thing after all....


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

At the moment I am showing only 10 days of future guide data, ending 07/02/2013, which is unusual. It should be 14. Last connection was this morning at 3:58am. Says it is connected NOW, too.... which is also unusual. I remember reading on another thread about the daily connections now occurring multiple times a day...


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

crxssi said:


> At the moment I am showing only 10 days of future guide data, ending 07/02/2013, which is unusual. It should be 14. Last connection was this morning at 3:58am. Says it is connected NOW, too.... which is also unusual. I remember reading on another thread about the daily connections now occurring multiple times a day...


Update- the connection finished loading and now guide data ends on 07/05, 13 days from now. Next connection scheduled for tomorrow at 5 something pm.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

This happens every once and while; and people start wearing their tinfoil hats and head to the caves.....geez...


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## Jed1 (Jun 18, 2013)

My TiVo still has guide data until Tuesday July 2nd 7:30 PM. The logs say it will connect to TiVo service tomorrow at 12:10 PM. I hope it updates by then.

The last time my TiVo successfully connected to the service was this morning at 9:51 AM. I do not understand why the guide doesn't update every day like TVGOS used to unless there is a problem with Tribune Media Services.


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## JWhites (May 15, 2013)

tivoknucklehead said:


> But my TiVo is connecting ok. Anyone else?
> I should by now at least have through July 4 7:30 pm


I just checked and I'm seeing program data through Fri 7/5 at 7:30pm. I'm on the east coast with Comcast. Last connection was Sat 6/22 at 2:43pm. Next attempt will be Sun 6/23 6:00am.


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## tivoknucklehead (Dec 12, 2002)

ok, just caught up


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

Hamsters have been fed.


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## sieglinde (Aug 11, 2002)




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## Jed1 (Jun 18, 2013)

I noticed again that my guide is falling behind as there is no listings from July 5th 8:00 PM.
I am new to TiVo and I thought that the guide would update daily as TVGOS did.
I had to manually connect to TiVo service on Saturday night as my recording of Independence Day on A&E HD was incorrect. My TiVo had it starting at 8 PM and ending at 11 PM, then Longmeire from 11 PM to 12 AM, followed by a repeat of Independence Day at Longmeire again.
After getting the guide update A&E HD had the correct listings with Criminal Minds at 8 PM to 9 PM and Independence Day at 9 PM to 12 AM, then the two shows repeated.
In my case, if the TiVo updated every day then this bad recording never would have happened. I did record the repeat airing of Independence Day at 1 AM to 4 AM.
I am assuming that the guide will update tomorrow afternoon. My next scheduled download is Tuesday at 4:10 PM. I am going to let it go and see if it updates itself this time as I do not have any scheduled recording until tomorrow night.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

It has been wonky the past week, but I hasten to add that this is VERY unusual...in fact, it's unusual to miss a day's data, ever.


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## PotentiallyCoherent (Jul 25, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> And I just got three days' worth.
> 
> So I guess it's not some kind of Tivoyan 2013 End of the World thing after all....


Thanks, I was sweating it pretty hard...


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

PotentiallyCoherent said:


> Thanks, I was sweating it pretty hard...


If this is the "new normal", today we should get listings until 7pm July 8. They might skip a day due to the 4th.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

Jed1 said:


> I noticed again that my guide is falling behind as there is no listings from July 5th 8:00 PM.
> I am new to TiVo and I thought that the guide would update daily as TVGOS did.
> I had to manually connect to TiVo service on Saturday night as my recording of Independence Day on A&E HD was incorrect. My TiVo had it starting at 8 PM and ending at 11 PM, then Longmeire from 11 PM to 12 AM, followed by a repeat of Independence Day at Longmeire again.
> After getting the guide update A&E HD had the correct listings with Criminal Minds at 8 PM to 9 PM and Independence Day at 9 PM to 12 AM, then the two shows repeated.
> ...


If you're worrying about bogus recordings 10 days out on a Tivo, you're going to be worrying all the time. Again, like I said over on AVS, don't sweat the small stuff. Anything you see in the ToDo List more than 7 days out is often suspect (at least for SPs and WLs) and is nothing to be concerned about, nor are a few days missing from the end of the guide. There's no reason to obsess over this stuff, it almost always works itself out.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

slowbiscuit said:


> If you're worrying about bogus recordings 10 days out on a Tivo, you're going to be worrying all the time. Again, like I said over on AVS, don't sweat the small stuff. Anything you see in the ToDo List more than 7 days out is often suspect (at least for SPs and WLs) and is nothing to be concerned about, nor are a few days missing from the end of the guide. There's no reason to obsess over this stuff, it almost always works itself out.


But he was talking about a case when it almost didn't work out...where, if he had not forced the call and gotten the finally-updated Guide Data, he would have missed a recording that night.

Which, granted, is a very unusual circumstance...last-minute schedule changes. But apparently, in his case it happened.

(You realize he was talking about Independence Day the movie, not Independence Day the day, right?)


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## scandia101 (Oct 20, 2007)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> But he was talking about a case when it almost didn't work out...where, if he had not forced the call and gotten the finally-updated Guide Data, he would have missed a recording that night.
> 
> Which, granted, is a very unusual circumstance...last-minute schedule changes. But apparently, in his case it happened.
> 
> (You realize he was talking about Independence Day the movie, not Independence Day the day, right?)


"It almost didn't work out" assumes that the change was made available before the day of the broadcast. It's most likely that the change was not available until the day of broadcast. If the Tivo didn't make a daily connection after 3pm EDT it won't have the updated data. It also wouldn't get updated in time if it made a daily connection too close to broadcast time for the data to get indexed.
This is another case of someone not fully understanding how the daily updates work. New data is not actually retrieved with every connection.


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## Jed1 (Jun 18, 2013)

scandia101 said:


> "It almost didn't work out" assumes that the change was made available before the day of the broadcast. It's most likely that the change was not available until the day of broadcast. If the Tivo didn't make a daily connection after 1pm EDT it won't have the updated data. It also wouldn't get updated in time if it made a daily connection too close to broadcast time for the data to get indexed.
> This is another case of someone not fully understanding how the daily updates work. New data is not actually retrieved with every connection.


Rob Helmerichs is correct. I noticed that the guide data for A&E HD was wrong for Saturday night as I checked in on the channel while it was recording. I realized that Independence Day should have been much further into the movie so I went to Zap2It and noticed that the movie started at 9 PM and not 8 PM as indicated in the TiVo guide.
Since it had been reported here that members were getting the guide updates on Saturday, I forced the TiVo to connect to the service to get the guide update as my TiVo was not scheduled to connect to the service until Sunday morning at 11 AM. After it updated my TiVo had the correct listings for A&E HD showing Independence Day starting at 9 PM instead of 8 PM.

I figure that the guide updates every third day so I just checked my TiVo, as it was scheduled to connect to the service at 5:44 PM. When I checked the guide at 5:30 PM the guide data stopped at Friday July 5th at 7:30 PM. I then checked at 5:46 PM and it was still the same but I went to the connect to TiVo service menu and it showed connection in progress so I watched the progress and it took 22 minutes for the download to complete. I then went and checked the guide and now I have listings extending out to July 8th 7:30 PM.
Since the guide only updates every three days the next update will be Friday afternoon and the guide will be filled in and corrected up until July 11th 7:30 PM.

Just because the TiVo connects to the service every 24 to 28 hours does not mean it downloads anything. I watched it connect to the service yesterday and the process only took a minute or two. And as I said it took 22 minutes today because it downloaded new guide data. 
The TiVo also connects for something called VCM every two hours or so. I think one thing that happens here is it updates any changes to your recordings list or recordings set on TiVo.com.


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

Jed1 said:


> The TiVo also connects for something called VCM every two hours or so. I think one thing that happens here is it updates any changes to your recordings list or recordings set on TiVo.com.


That's the TiVo telling the NSA what you have been watching.


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## Jed1 (Jun 18, 2013)

JoeKustra said:


> That's the TiVo telling the NSA what you have been watching.


You might be right. I been trying to get instant email notifications for this site and I never receive anything. I guess the NSA forgot to forward them to me.


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## scandia101 (Oct 20, 2007)

Jed1 said:


> Rob Helmerichs is correct. I noticed that the guide data for A&E HD was wrong for Saturday night as I checked in on the channel while it was recording. I realized that Independence Day should have been much further into the movie so I went to Zap2It and noticed that the movie started at 9 PM and not 8 PM as indicated in the TiVo guide.
> Since it had been reported here that members were getting the guide updates on Saturday, I forced the TiVo to connect to the service to get the guide update as my TiVo was not scheduled to connect to the service until Sunday morning at 11 AM. After it updated my TiVo had the correct listings for A&E HD showing Independence Day starting at 9 PM instead of 8 PM.
> 
> I figure that the guide updates every third day so I just checked my TiVo, as it was scheduled to connect to the service at 5:44 PM. When I checked the guide at 5:30 PM the guide data stopped at Friday July 5th at 7:30 PM. I then checked at 5:46 PM and it was still the same but I went to the connect to TiVo service menu and it showed connection in progress so I watched the progress and it took 22 minutes for the download to complete. I then went and checked the guide and now I have listings extending out to July 8th 7:30 PM.
> ...


Like I said some people just don't fully understand how the update process works.

The reason your Tivo didn't have the correct up to date data is because it made it's "daily" connection that day before the new updated correct information was released.

Under normal circumstances, Tivos do not update every three days, they update daily - 7 days /week and it's been that way since 1998. That updated data is made available by Tivo everyday at 1pm EDT. If a Tivo connects before that time, it will only have the most up to date data. Service connections are not made every 24 to 28 hours. There can be as little as 4 hours between connections or as much as about 40 hours. Just this past weekend my Premiere made three "daily" connections in about 18 hours.

As for the VCM connection, nobody here knows what it is and Tivo isn't saying, so your opinion is pure speculation and wrong. Tivos check every 6 minutes (10 times/hr) for recordings scheduled online.


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

Jed1 said:


> You might be right. I been trying to get instant email notifications for this site and I never receive anything. I guess the NSA forgot to forward them to me.


That's odd. You can add instant email during a reply or from User CP for a selected thread. You do know ptd doesn't allow uppercase? Just a guess.

I always use Gmail and let it forward to my Verizon account.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

scandia101 said:


> The reason your Tivo didn't have the correct up to date data is because it made it's "daily" connection that day before the new updated correct information was released.


In this case, that may or may not be true, since the Guide Data wasn't updated the two previous days. It's entirely possible that the corrected info should have gone out the day before, or the day before that, but didn't because of whatever has been going on this past week (today, I just had Day 3 without Guide Data again).


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## Jed1 (Jun 18, 2013)

JoeKustra said:


> That's odd. You can add instant email during a reply or from User CP for a selected thread. You do know ptd doesn't allow uppercase? Just a guess.
> 
> I always use Gmail and let it forward to my Verizon account.


Thanks Joe but mine are all lower case for ptd. I am using the same for AVS and the instant notifications are working.


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## Jed1 (Jun 18, 2013)

scandia101 said:


> Like I said some people just don't fully understand how the update process works.
> 
> The reason your Tivo didn't have the correct up to date data is because it made it's "daily" connection that day before the new updated correct information was released.
> 
> ...


I set the recording for Independence Day on Thursday morning. My TiVo has been successfully connecting to the service but it does not mean that the guide data is being updated every time the TiVo connects to the service.
The improper listing was not corrected on Thursday, Friday, and Saturday. I forced the connection to the service Saturday night as I seen that my TiVo was not scheduled to connect to the service until Sunday morning around 10 or 11 AM. I think it last connected to the server at 11:10 AM Saturday. The updated listings did not become available until Saturday afternoon so if the TiVo is connecting to the service more than once a day mine didn't do it in time to correct the listings on A&E HD that night, which has existed since Wednesday afternoon.

As for the VCM connection I assumed that it has something to do with the data on the TiVo and the data that is in the account on TiVo.com.
My TiVo made a recording of Major Crimes on Monday at 9 PM and it did not show up in my TiVo.com account until after 3 PM this afternoon, which is right after a VCM connection that occurred at 3:10 PM this afternoon.
Tomorrow I will schedule a test recording on TiVo.com and see how long it takes to show up on my TiVo. It is possible that these are reported faster than the TiVo reporting what was done on the TiVo itself.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

scandia101 said:


> Under normal circumstances, Tivos do not update every three days, they update daily - 7 days /week and it's been that way since 1998. That updated data is made available by Tivo everyday at 1pm EDT. If a Tivo connects before that time, it will only have the most up to date data. Service connections are not made every 24 to 28 hours. There can be as little as 4 hours between connections or as much as about 40 hours. Just this past weekend my Premiere made three "daily" connections in about 18 hours.


This is what it seems to be different nowadays (or possibly different on Premiere vs previous Tivos?).

I'm only comparing this to what I see in last successful connection/next connection time in the Network settings page. Why does it sometimes do another connection within a few hours?
(It didn't seem to do this on my S1s, S3, nor TivoHD.) Again, I don't have a zillion data points for any of them, but I check it enough that I think I would have noticed it.

BTW, I haven't read this whole thread, but I wonder if part of the disconnect was what I have long called the two halves of the Tivo's brain not communicating properly. I VERY often see the To Do list and (View Upcoming or manual guide data listings) showing different results. This can be last minute changes, or "episode info filling in" (changing from generic show info to specific info), or sometimes just seems to be big changes (e.g. MTV seems to do this, and the rare times I record on MTV nowadays, it's often manually going through the next ~2 weeks of guide data and recording various marathons.. every couple of months I do that that is).

So you can have something set to record (as a double-check, not a single check), do a view upcoming, and it is NOT THERE. But the Tivo will still think it recorded that show. I don't quite get why the Tivo doesn't check, right before it starts to record, if the show really still exists before it records it.

This can *also* end up with your recordings having the generic guide data, even if you cancelled that one and set another recording, it would have the full data.


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## ggieseke (May 30, 2008)

Jed1 said:


> You might be right. I been trying to get instant email notifications for this site and I never receive anything. I guess the NSA forgot to forward them to me.


I haven't been able to get email notifications since Feb 2011, and they're not in the junk mail folder either. I just assumed that AT&T (Yahoo) blocked this site for some reason.

On a different note, one thing I like about WMC is the ability to schedule the guide updates. You can also force them via command line, so I used Task Scheduler to create a job that syncs the clock in the PC and updates the guide data at 4:00am & 4:00pm.


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## Jed1 (Jun 18, 2013)

Something else that should be considered is Tribune Company, the owners of Tribune Media Services, has recently exited bankruptcy and is currently in the hands of its creditors. It is possible that there are changes being made to the divisions of Tribune, like staff being layed off, and maybe this is the new normal for guide data.
I noticed that TMS website is completely different and the list of customers they served fell by about half. I noticed Microsoft is no longer listed so I wonder what that may spell for WMC users.
http://www.tribunemediaservices.com/
http://www.tribunemediaservices.com/tms-products-services/entertainment-data-apis
http://www.tribunemediaservices.com/tivo


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> It has been wonky the past week, but I hasten to add that this is VERY unusual...in fact, it's unusual to miss a day's data, ever.


It's not THAT unusual. This happens every once and awhile and TCF-ers start jumping off bridges....


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Missing a day is unusual. Missing several days is VERY unusual.


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## sieglinde (Aug 11, 2002)

Once I found out neither of my Tivos was malfunctioning I did not care. I thought my modem had gone bad


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

Just wondering if anyone still has the original (thread topic) problem?


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

My guide data is good out 13 days....

....and, Rob, I disagree


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Bierboy said:


> ....and, Rob, I disagree


No, you don't.


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

I had my normal randomly scheduled network update at 16:01 EDT. I just checked and my guide data is now 24 hours longer. I give up.

But it is a Friday.


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## JWhites (May 15, 2013)

Jed1 said:


> Something else that should be considered is Tribune Company, the owners of Tribune Media Services, has recently exited bankruptcy and is currently in the hands of its creditors. It is possible that there are changes being made to the divisions of Tribune, like staff being layed off, and maybe this is the new normal for guide data.
> I noticed that TMS website is completely different and the list of customers they served fell by about half. I noticed Microsoft is no longer listed so I wonder what that may spell for WMC users.
> http://www.tribunemediaservices.com/
> http://www.tribunemediaservices.com/tms-products-services/entertainment-data-apis
> http://www.tribunemediaservices.com/tivo


Nice info, if only we could see the whole thing without it being truncated


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## sieglinde (Aug 11, 2002)

Mine goes to 4:30 on July 11th which is 12 full days


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

sieglinde said:


> Mine goes to 4:30 on July 11th which is 12 full days


Your 4pm and my 7pm indicate that the TiVo guide's "day" starts at the same time across the country. Probably Hawai'i is 1pm or 2pm. Like TVGOS, the start time of the program is the cutoff, not the variable end times.

Too bad Canada uses our time zones. Anyone from Alaska care to comment since it is 1 hour before Hawai'i? Maybe someone from Atlantic TZ in Canada?


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## Jed1 (Jun 18, 2013)

Well I got a guide data update on Friday which brought the data to 8 PM Thursday July 11th. I received another guide data update today but I only have data up 8 PM Friday July 12th. So instead of being one day behind after the guide update now I am two days behind.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Jed1 said:


> Well I got a guide data update on Friday which brought the data to 8 PM Thursday July 11th. I received another guide data update today but I only have data up 8 PM Friday July 12th. So instead of being one day behind after the guide update now I am two days behind.




This thread is hilarious....


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Jed1 said:


> Well I got a guide data update on Friday which brought the data to 8 PM Thursday July 11th. I received another guide data update today but I only have data up 8 PM Friday July 12th. So instead of being one day behind after the guide update now I am two days behind.


Umm what? My TiVo updated at 6:30am this morning and has guide data to about 7:30pm on July 12th so 12 full days ahead which is what it should be.

Scott


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

Bierboy said:


> This thread is hilarious....


And a lesson in what constitutes OCD, apparently.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

slowbiscuit said:


> And a lesson in what constitutes OCD, apparently.


I prefer "CDO," actually. "OCD" drives me crazy, with all those out-of-order letters...


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I prefer "CDO," actually. "OCD" drives me crazy, with all those out-of-order letters...


I prefer COD so it passes a spell checker and speling mistakes drive me crazy.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

JoeKustra said:


> I prefer COD so it passes a spell checker and speling mistakes drive me crazy.


This post explains a lot...


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## sieglinde (Aug 11, 2002)

LOL.  worries about a possible modem malfunction added to this now amusing thread. As a nerd, I found the time zone differences interesting.


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