# TIVO Mini Can't Connect to my TIVO Box in livingroom.



## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

I just recently moved into a new house and had to re-do my TIVO setup and now the Mini can't recognize the Main TiVO (Series 5 Roamio with a TIVO bridge). I set the bridge up the same way I did at my other place; but there is a different modem, and I'm wondering if that has something to do with it. My old modem did not have a "MoCA" light on it, but this new one, the Ariss Touchstone TG 2472 does, even though it's not on. So I set up a bridge with the modem, and a bridge at the TIVO also. I used a POE filter inside the house, because now there is one line coming in for internet and cable, instead of two separate lines (I don't know if this also made a difference), and used a splitter rated 5-2500 Mhz to go to the modem/bridge and the TIVO/bridge. When I turned everything on, the TIVO is running and it's using the "ethernet" connection so I thought it was good. When I went into the back room to plug in the Mini, it gives me an error saying it can't find the living room TIVO, check the connections and ensure they are connected. Can anyone help me out?


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> Can anyone help me out?


Likely, yes, but more info would be helpful.

How many tuners in your Roamio, 4 or 6?

Are you tuning OTA antenna or digital cable (w CableCARD) with the Roamio?

Do you have a separate cable modem & router, or are you using a combo modem/router (aka gateway)?

Who is your cable provider?

Do you know where all your coax runs centrally connect, and do you have access to this location?

Can you provide more details on how the devices, rooms and incoming signal(s) interconnect? Where, precisely, you installed the "PoE" MoCA filter? A diagram, however rough, can be immensely helpful. (see attached for example diagrams, for inspiration)


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

H






































































ey thanks. I'm at work now but I had my son take pictures of the outside configuration and it's attached. It's the four tuner Roamio with cable card and the provider is Fidelity Communications. It's a seperate modem and router although the modem is capable of both, but I have my own router so opted not to have it activated. As you can see there are two lines coming in from outside. But there's one line coming in from where my cable and internet are. I drew a pic and also set my bridges up the way they are in the TIVO instructions (diagram attached)


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> So I set up a bridge with the modem, and a bridge at the TIVO also.
> 
> View attachment 34403
> View attachment 34402


The supplied TiVo Bridge connection diagrams are correct for each setup, assuming the Roamio OTA is in a different room from the modem & router. Is it?

If the Roamio OTA and modem/router are in the same room, the Roamio OTA can just be connected directly to the router via Ethernet, and you'd only need a single MoCA adapter to establish the MoCA network (to provide the Mini with its wired network connection).



armyrctr0 said:


> When I turned everything on, the TIVO is running and it's using the "ethernet" connection so I thought it was good.


_Forgetting the Mini for a moment..._

Is the Roamio able to connect to the Internet in this current setup?

And with everything powered-up and the Roamio "working," can you report the state of the status lights on the TiVo Bridge MoCA adapters at each location? And the status of the MoCA light on the TG2472 gateway?



armyrctr0 said:


> I used a POE filter inside the house, because now there is one line coming in for internet and cable, instead of two separate lines (I don't know if this also made a difference), and used a splitter rated 5-2500 Mhz to go to the modem/bridge and the TIVO/bridge.


Assuming the Roamio is able to connect to the Internet, this would mean that the two MoCA adapters are communicating ... MoCA is working ... so it's just the Mini that can't connect to the MoCA network. The cause would likely be one of the following...

The "PoE" MoCA filter was installed in the wrong location, blocking the MoCA signals from reaching the Mini. (My guess.)
The Mini's coax outlet isn't connected back to the same coax plant as the Roamio, modem and MoCA adapters.

From my interpretation of the outside pics you'd posted, it looks like your incoming cable line enters a cable junction box on the side of the house, out of which two coax runs exit. These two coax lines are then "F" barrel-connected to coax runs into the house that appear to have been previously connected to a satellite setup.

See this annotated pic:






​
If my interpretation is correct, your main splitter is inside the cable junction box, and your "PoE" MoCA filter needs to be installed on the input of this splitter inside the junction box. The outputs of this splitter, via the "F" barrel connection loops stapled to the eaves, are likely running to the Mini location and the coax line that you've been working with. Moving the "PoE" MoCA filter to the correct location inside the cable box may get you going, but no guarantees until you've opened the cable junction box and confirmed the connections and the connecting component.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

The Roamio can connect, but it's in the same room. I did not know I could connect it directly into the ethernet cable and get rid of that bridge. So if I do that, do I keep the bridge at the modem/router? Also, all the lights are on on the bridges and the modem (except the MoCA light). Here





















are pictures of my connection showing that it's an ethernet connection at the Roamio and a picture showing the lights on the modem. It looks like the MoCA light is on, but it's not.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

I am also wondering if I connect the Roamio directly into the router via ethernet, I know I can undo the bridge coax but do I undo the coax going from the splitter into the back of the Roamio also?


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> The Roamio can connect, but it's in the same room. I did not know I could connect it directly into the ethernet cable and get rid of that bridge. So if I do that, do I keep the bridge at the modem/router?





armyrctr0 said:


> I am also wondering if I connect the Roamio directly into the router via ethernet, I know I can undo the bridge coax but do I undo the coax going from the splitter into the back of the Roamio also?


Yes, the Roamio can definitely be directly connected to the router LAN.

Direct-connect the Roamio via Ethernet to a LAN port on the router.

You now only need one MoCA adapter. Remove one MoCA adapter and its associated splitter (and connecting coax); which adapter you choose to keep is up to you, and you can adjust the connections later if needed.

The MoCA adapter that remains must be connected via Ethernet to a LAN port on the router.

The Roamio, modem and remaining MoCA adapter should all be connected to your coax plant. (A 3-way splitter could be used to connect them all to a single coax wall outlet -- your choice of a balanced or unbalanced 3-way.)

Most importantly, remove the "PoE" MoCA filter from the inside-the-room location. It needs to be installed in the outside cable junction box (unless my previous interpretation is wrong), as previously detailed, above.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> ... but do I undo the coax going from the splitter into the back of the Roamio also?


The Roamio needs a coax connection to the incoming cable line for its cable TV signal.

You'll be able to downsize the splitter configuration and associated coax connections, but the Roamio, modem and remaining MoCA adapter will all still need to connect to your coax plant -- as will the Mini, at its remote location.

----
edit: p.s. Your setup should be similar to the following diagram, though with just a single Mini and so elimination of the associated secondary 4-way splitter. The standalone switch is optional, and, of course, the combo modem/router would need to be separated into distinct devices.







​More specifically...






​


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

Thanks. I'll give it a try


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

I hooked up the filter in three different spots. I tried both sides of the two way splitter and on the "in" part of the four way splitter. None of it worked.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

One of the two way cables splits to the four way and the other goes to one of the cables under the eave.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

First, the DLPS-15D is a surge suppressor device, so the incoming cable connection should be feeding into that device first, then from there to the 3-way splitter.

http://www.cableinnovations.com/index_htm_files/Catalog - DLPS-15d 15DP.pdf

and

http://www.cableinnovations.com/index_htm_files/DLPS-15D Install single page FEB 2013.pdf

This is a dual directional protector, so either connector can be the service port and the other connector would be the customer port.
...
It is very important that the DLPS-15D is connected to a very good ground system preferably the power service grounding electrode system. The ground wire should be at least #12 copper. The grounding conductor should be run to the grounding electrode (rod) in as straight a line as possible. If bends are needed make the bend radius not less than 4". Insert the wire under the grounding screw of the unit, and make sure that the wire is tightly secured under the screw.​


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

A wider-angle picture of those components and the connecting cables would be handy.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> I tried both sides of the two way splitter





armyrctr0 said:


> One of the two way cables splits


What "two way splitter"? Are you referring to the DLPS-15D as a two way splitter?

If so, are you sure that one of the coax runs from the DLPS-15D is going to the eaves ... and not over to the PVC pipe coming-up from the ground? (i.e. the incoming cable feed)


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

I'll check again but I'm pretty sure it's going up. I had to cut the zip ties so I have to go pick some up before it starts raining. I'll check again when I'm back.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Ah, zooming way in, it does appear that there may be 3 coax lines heading up to the eaves...






​
... but the pics don't have the clarity or the context needed for me to trace where they're going. (At least this explains why there's a 3-way splitter inside the box.)

I'd start by tracing where the lone coax cable coming from the PVC pipe is feeding within the cable junction box ... I'm expecting this to be the incoming cable provider feed ... and then go from there. Just be sure to make note of the specific ports to which each coax run/cable connects.

(Though, alas, it sounds like we may have a rain delay.)


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

I'm sorry you're right. The other goes into a PVC pipe going into the ground


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

Pretty uch.





















I traced the lines. One of them goes from the two way into the four way splitter, that's the one I put the POE on in the last picture. Two of them go into the circular connection under the eave before going inside, and then the last one isn't included in that loop, it goes directly into the house in the hole under the eave.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

So this should be the setup, then...







​Though ...

You may need to verify the cable run destinations to confirm connectivity at the Mini location. One solution, when you can afford the Internet outage, is to connect the modem to a given coax wall outlet, and then connect only a single coax at a time to the incoming cable feed in the junction box until the modem is able to sync, indicating you've found the associated coax line to the room.

You'd probably want to use unbalanced 3-way splitters to direct the strongest possible signal to the DVR and/or modem.

You may also want/need to upgrade both splitters to known-good MoCA 2.0 splitters; Holland's GHS-PRO-M series are recommended. (see here)

It's possible that you'd want to upgrade the "F" barrel connectors to 3 GHz models. (Something to keep in mind if MoCA just can't be made to work. See here.)

The "PoE" MoCA filter needs to be installed on the input of the splitter in the junction box.

One port on the surge suppressor is where the incoming cable feed connects, and the other port should connect to the input of the splitter (so to the "PoE" MoCA filter, which is installed on the splitter's input).



armyrctr0 said:


> I'm sorry you're right. The other goes into a PVC pipe going into the ground


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> I traced the lines. One of them goes from the two way into the four way splitter, that's the one I put the POE on in the last picture. Two of them go into the circular connection under the eave before going inside, and then the last one isn't included in that loop, it goes directly into the house in the hole under the eave.


Those sound and look correct, though it remains a mystery as to which of the three cables entering the hole/house is running to the modem/Roamio location, which to the Mini, and where the third coax run is destined.

The MoCA-compatibility of the splitters and barrel connectors is also an unknown.

That said, the outside connections at least sound/look correct, now. Have you reconnected the modem, Roamio and MoCA adapters per above, and verified that the Roamio remains functional, now direct-connected via Ethernet to the router? And can the Roamio still tune TV content after all the shenanigans in the outside junction box?

And the only "PoE" MoCA filter in the setup is now installed on the input of the splitter in the cable junction box?

If the Roamio is fully functional, then it's time to try the Mini again.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

It's raining now. So to make sure I understand-I need to find out which of the cables goes into the room with the Mini. After I figure that out, what then. Do I hook anything up any differently, or just change hardware as you expalined? It seems everything is connected the right way.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

Also, there are three coax runs, but there are four rooms in my house with television. So one of them has to go to to two rooms. Is that right?


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

I also could not hook up the Roamio in the new way. I thought I had a three way splitter, but I don't. I'll have to pick one up tomorrow.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> I also could not hook up the Roamio in the new way. I thought I had a three way splitter, but I don't. I'll have to pick one up tomorrow.


You can skip the 3-way splitter, for now, I'd think. (In favor of waiting to place a larger order of MoCA-compatible splitters.)

I'm assuming you had 3 2-way splitters in that setup, before, and now just 2. Yes? The Roamio could be directly connected to an output of the initial splitter within the room, and then the other splitter cascaded from the second output. (Super short-term, you could probably even get away with just powering-down the MoCA adapter to be removed and keep the Roamio connected via coax as-is, only switching its Ethernet connection to the router LAN.)


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> Also, there are three coax runs, but there are four rooms in my house with television. So one of them has to go to to two rooms. Is that right?


It would seem so, and so that may complicate matters if the additional splitter cannot be found.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

krkaufman said:


> You can skip the 3-way splitter, for now, I'd think. (In favor of waiting to place a larger order of MoCA-compatible splitters.)
> 
> I'm assuming you had 3 2-way splitters in that setup, before, and now just 2. Yes? The Roamio could be directly connected to an output of the initial splitter within the room, and then the other splitter cascaded from the second output. (Super short-term, you could probably even get away with just powering-down the MoCA adapter to be removed and keep the Roamio connected via coax as-is, only switching its Ethernet connection to the router LAN.)


I do. But I just ordered Holland splitters and they will be here Thursday.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

I do. But I just ordered Holland splitters and they will be here Thursday.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

krkaufman said:


> If the Roamio is fully functional, then it's time to try the Mini again.


Note that you can *test the Mini prior to deploying it* to its permanent location.

*Ethernet ::* Provided a video connection for the Mini, you can connect the Mini temporarily at the Roamio/router location and connect the Mini via Ethernet to a router LAN port, to verify its basic functionality and ensure that its software is up-to-date.

*MoCA ::* And once you're confident in the Mini's Ethernet functionality, you can try a similar, simple direct-connect test for MoCA, to verify the Mini's MoCA hardware/software is functional. To test basic MoCA connectivity with the rest of your residence's coax plant out of the equation...

Temporarily move the Mini to the main bridging MoCA adapter's location and direct-connect the the Mini and MoCA adapter via a single coax cable, and ensure that the Mini's video output is viewable. (You'll be disconnecting the MoCA adapter from the rest of the coax plant and connecting it via coax only to the Mini.)

With the MoCA adapter still connected via Ethernet to the router, acting as a MoCA bridge, you should be able to configure the Mini, connected only via the coax cable, for a MoCA client connection and quickly confirm MoCA connectivity.

Once connected, the Mini should be able to make TiVo service connections, stream from Internet services, and play live or previously recorded TV content -- same as if connected via Ethernet.

After you're done testing, restore the MoCA adapter's connection to the coax plant and give the Mini a try at its permanent location -- or any of the other coax wall outlet locations. Maybe one of the others works better.

edit: p.s. As an afterthought, you also could have tested the Mini's MoCA functionality by simply connecting it where the second MoCA adapter was previously connected and working, off the splitter output, rather than doing the direct-connect via the remaining MoCA adapter.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

Thanks. I'll try that when I get home.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> Also, there are three coax runs, but there are four rooms in my house with television. So one of them has to go to to two rooms. Is that right?


Can you have your kid shimmy up into the attic, under supervision (given Spring/Summer heat), to find the coax entry point at the eaves and then see if they can locate the additional split(s)?


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

Will do. It will have to be later when I get home from work. It's a late one for me and I won't be home until about 8 p.m. (CST), but it's still light out. I'll have him check then, or I may go up.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Whenever is convenient; TCF isn’t going anywhere.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

OK I just tracked it. The one cable that's not in the loop is the one that is going to the living-room. The modem, the router, and the Roamio. The other two are going to the four bedrooms.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> one that is going to the living-room. ... The other two are going to the four bedrooms.


I thought the main goal of tracing the cable in the attic was to find the mystery splitter that was allowing 3 coax runs to reach 4 rooms:


armyrctr0 said:


> Also, there are three coax runs, but there are four rooms in my house with television. So one of them has to go to to two rooms. Is that right?





krkaufman said:


> It would seem so, and so that may complicate matters if the additional splitter cannot be found.



But now it seems there are actually 5 rooms with TV access, and so 2 mystery splitters to locate. Did you find where the 2 coax runs have additional splitters?


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

No, those are under a ton of fiberglass


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> No, those are under a ton of fiberglass


Bummer.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

My Holland splitters come in today as well as a new Holland POE filter. I'll try replacing the hardware with the new stuff.

When I traced the cables I noticed the only new cable was the one the cable installer installed leading to my living-room since it's laying on top of the insulation. It appears the other two that split have been there since the house was built since they are under all the insulation. What I believed the instalker did was cut the satellite connections under the wave and spliced them into his box. Hence the three coax cables. I'm pretty sur hee didn't want to deal with the mess that's up there on top of the cables so he used them since he knew they went into the rooms.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> What I believed the instalker did was cut the satellite connections under the wave and spliced them into his box. Hence the three coax cables. I'm pretty sur hee didn't want to deal with the mess that's up there on top of the cables so he used them since he knew they went into the rooms.


That's my theory (and concern), as well, but he didn't have to cut them, from what your pics indicate. It looks like he just disconnected the in-house runs from the IN/OUT ports of the two Holland STVC diplexers (red-labeled splitter-like components) under the eaves and used barrel connectors to join those two runs to the lines coming from the new cable box. The diplexers make me curious as to what happened to the antenna runs that would have been connected to their VHF/UHF ports, but that's immaterial to your solution.

Anyway, fingers crossed that the new MoCA-friendly components boost the performance and get you working. But there's still concern that the two mystery splitters could be MoCA-hostile.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

OK, I got home and the stuff was not here. I called Amazon and they said it was delivered. They're sending it out again and should be here Saturday.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

If it ain’t one thing, it’s another...

p.s. Obviously, check with the fam to make sure nobody else reeled it in.


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

Yep, I'll keep you posted


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## armyrctr0 (Dec 22, 2016)

My Holland hardware came in yesterday and I replaced it all this morning now the Mini is working. I'm not sure what piece fixed it, but it's working now. Thanks for all your help. I really appreciated it.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

armyrctr0 said:


> My Holland hardware came in yesterday and I replaced it all this morning now the Mini is working. I'm not sure what piece fixed it, but it's working now. Thanks for all your help. I really appreciated it.


Great to hear!

It might be worthwhile checking/documenting the MoCA stats on the Mini, to gauge the performance of the MoCA network, and as a baseline against which future changes can be compared.


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