# Why two USB ports?



## gijoecam (Sep 18, 2006)

Just wondering... why are there two USB ports on the back of the series 2 units? Just wondering.... would you hook it up to two networks? Or piggy-back them somehow? Who uses more than one port on the back and what for?

Just wondering....

-Joe


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## Einselen (Apr 25, 2006)

gijoecam said:


> Just wondering... why are there two USB ports on the back of the series 2 units? Just wondering.... would you hook it up to two networks? Or piggy-back them somehow? Who uses more than one port on the back and what for?
> 
> Just wondering....
> 
> -Joe


USB cards come standard with 2 ports? I dunno, just a guess.


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## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

Because it's cheaper from a hardware standpoint to provide 2 ports than 1.


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## ParrtHd2 (Sep 6, 2000)

Does anyone know if you can hook-up a usb keyboard to enter season passes?


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## Gregor (Feb 18, 2002)

ParrtHd2 said:


> Does anyone know if you can hook-up a usb keyboard to enter season passes?


No, you cannot.


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## btwyx (Jan 16, 2003)

The standard USB host controllers come with 2 ports. Its not actually cheaper to hook both of them up, you have to pay for the socket for the second one, but the second one comes for just the price of that socket. Its probably worth the 5¢ cost of the socket to put it there.

You can't use a USB keybaord, the TiVo doesn't recognise the input, it should be pretty trivial to make it work if TiVo cared.


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

gijoecam said:


> Just wondering... why are there two USB ports on the back of the series 2 units? Just wondering.... would you hook it up to two networks? Or piggy-back them somehow? Who uses more than one port on the back and what for?
> 
> Just wondering....
> 
> -Joe


Wouldn't you need the two ports for TivoToGo and MRV? I only use one USB port to connect to my computer, but would I need the other port to connect another Tivo box if I were to get one?

 Duh, I just realized after typing this I would tie the 2nd Tivo into my router.

: slap forhead with open palm :


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## btwyx (Jan 16, 2003)

That's one of the good things about networks, you only need one connection.


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## supasta (May 6, 2006)

Aside from a monetary standpoint, 2 USB ports allows for the ability of future expansion and cabability.

Having only one USB port would count that possibility out all together. 

TiVo has not utilised the USB ports for anything other than Wireless, but the possibility is there.


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## wilcotree (Jun 26, 2006)

I charge up my iPod with them sometimes.


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## wilcotree (Jun 26, 2006)

It would be really cool if you could hook a external hard drive on there!


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## Einselen (Apr 25, 2006)

wilcotree said:


> It would be really cool if you could hook a external hard drive on there!


Using USB interface it would not be able to keep up with the recording of the Tivo. It could maybe be done so after the recording on the main hard drive within the Tivo it would be transfered to the external USB not sure if external USB could keep up with playback, I am not that smart, lol.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

FYI: Our Pioneer DVD-RW unit only has one USB port. So if TiVo ever decides to do anything else with the USB ports people with those are going to be screwed.

Also don't ever expect to use a USB hard drive with your TiVo. USB, even 2.0, is not fast enough to keep up with the realtime demands of a device like a TiVo. That's why S3 units have eSATA ports.

Dan


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## MighTiVo (Oct 26, 2000)

Dan203 said:


> FYI: Our Pioneer DVD-RW unit only has one USB port. So if TiVo ever decides to do anything else with the USB ports people with those are going to be screwed.


A USB hub should solve that problem...



Dan203 said:


> Also don't ever expect to use a USB hard drive with your TiVo. USB, even 2.0, is not fast enough to keep up with the realtime demands of a device like a TiVo. That's why S3 units have eSATA ports.
> 
> Dan


A USB based external hard drive interface shouldn't be that hard to do and I don't know why TiVo hasn't yet.

For playback the external hard drive could look like and operate just as any other MRV site does. Saving to the external drive could be done via the same interface used for the DVD recorders.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Using an external drive for simple manual storage, while possible, is not really what people are asking for. Most people who want USB hard drive support expect it to automatically expand the available recording space on their TiVo. That is simply not possible with the demands TiVo puts on a hard drive and speed of the USB 2.0 bus.

Dan


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## btwyx (Jan 16, 2003)

MighTiVo said:


> A USB based external hard drive interface shouldn't be that hard to do and I don't know why TiVo hasn't yet.


There are a lot of USB developers like that, they don't know why they can't do it. They usually end up asking for help on the developer boards, only to be told it doesn't work like that.

The characteristics of USB are quite different from Sata, and make it quite unsuitable for active DVR storage.


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## restart88 (Mar 9, 2002)

Could use it for a laptop cooler to keep the unit happy.


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## MighTiVo (Oct 26, 2000)

Dan203 said:


> Using an external drive for simple manual storage, while possible, is not really what people are asking for. Most people who want USB hard drive support expect it to automatically expand the available recording space on their TiVo. That is simply not possible with the demands TiVo puts on a hard drive and speed of the USB 2.0 bus.
> 
> Dan


Personally I think that would be a bad idea even if the interface could handle the load. 
What happens when the disk is removed? Do programs span the internal and external disk? Is the database on the internal disk and the program on the external disk? Seems complex and confusing to manage the situation where the drive is removed.

I'd bet if the interface was easy to use many people would enjoy and appreciate the ability to use a USB drive for external storage in a way that worked almost identical to the existing TiVo2Go mechanism without the need to have a PC running software all the time to support it.

Especially if that USB drive could then be attached to another TiVo with the same account (MAK) or even a laptop and the TiVo desktop could access and playback those programs.

So maybe some people are asking for a external drive that operates seamlessly with the OS and becomes a required element, but not me...


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## MighTiVo (Oct 26, 2000)

btwyx said:


> There are a lot of USB developers like that, they don't know why they can't do it. They usually end up asking for help on the developer boards, only to be told it doesn't work like that.
> 
> The characteristics of USB are quite different from Sata, and make it quite unsuitable for active DVR storage.


You didn't understand my post.

I suggested a USB attached drive that would work like MRV. 
If a USB connected ethernet device can handle the transfer from a remote system, a locally connected USB drive can as well.


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## JustAllie (Jan 5, 2002)

I think the external drive idea is in the works. We heard the TiVo people talk about it at this year's TC-Con. Maybe next year??


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## Einselen (Apr 25, 2006)

JustAllie said:


> I think the external drive idea is in the works. We heard the TiVo people talk about it at this year's TC-Con. Maybe next year??


There is plans on opening up the eSATA port on the back of the S3 to allow for a drive to be added. That was planned since the start of S3 however. I don't think S2s will get a drive via the USB interface.


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## gijoecam (Sep 18, 2006)

Please ignore my ignorance... MRV? Please decrypt the acronym for the newbie...

Never thought about 2 ports being the standard connection. Makes sense though.... However, from a practical standpoint, it doesn't sound like the system is currently able to use both ports for any practical purpose.

The USB seems to be able to keep up for straight-time viewing. Of course, it's the bottleneck for data transfer though.

-Joe


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## btwyx (Jan 16, 2003)

Multi-Room Viewing. Transferring shows from one series 2 to another.


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## gijoecam (Sep 18, 2006)

btwyx said:


> Multi-Room Viewing. Transferring shows from one series 2 to another.


Gotcha. Thanks. Can you do that directly, or do they need to be connected via a hub? Mine are connected via my network hub, but it would have been a lot less wiring had I known I could go direct...

-Joe


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

gijoecam said:


> Gotcha. Thanks. Can you do that directly, or do they need to be connected via a hub? Mine are connected via my network hub, but it would have been a lot less wiring had I known I could go direct...
> 
> -Joe


MRV will work in either setup but with the hub involved if you also have broadband internet then the TiVos can get their updates via the network and you open up a bunch of HME apps as well.


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## Einselen (Apr 25, 2006)

gijoecam said:


> Gotcha. Thanks. Can you do that directly, or do they need to be connected via a hub? Mine are connected via my network hub, but it would have been a lot less wiring had I known I could go direct...
> 
> -Joe


You can also setup the Tivos on a peer to peer connection, either wireless or wired.


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## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

Einselen said:


> You can also setup the Tivos on a peer to peer connection, either wireless or wired.


I never tried this ... how do you get guide updates if you are using peer to peer? Phone line?


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## Einselen (Apr 25, 2006)

jfh3 said:


> I never tried this ... how do you get guide updates if you are using peer to peer? Phone line?


I looked it up on Tivo.com as I have not done peer-to-peer, but yes it still uses the phone:



Tivo Support Page said:


> In peer-to-peer setup this is not an issue, since the DVR will still connect to the TiVo service using a phone line.


Source: http://customersupport.tivo.com/LaunchContent.aspx?CID=a77a29ec-fdbf-4977-a65e-726547959320


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## gijoecam (Sep 18, 2006)

Hmm... this has me thinking... it raises two more questions:

1) If connected peer-to-peer, is the transfer rate between boxes any faster than when they're routed through the hub?
2) If they're connected P2P, can they still use the network hub to connect to th e server? (i.e. can they be connected to both the network AND another tivo unit directly?

Thanks, again!


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

gijoecam said:


> Hmm... this has me thinking... it raises two more questions:
> 
> 1) If connected peer-to-peer, is the transfer rate between boxes any faster than when they're routed through the hub?
> 2) If they're connected P2P, can they still use the network hub to connect to th e server? (i.e. can they be connected to both the network AND another tivo unit directly?
> ...


A peer to peer is no faster than using a hub. Sure there are less parts but barring a crappy hub it is not a significant extra parts. 
and no peer to peer is just two connections so no server added in. you are best to use a hub or router


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## mcauble (Nov 19, 2006)

The second USB should be used for accessing photos and music files (from either a hard drive of flashcard). That would allow TIVO subscribers to use the music photo functionality without having to stream from a PC -- it would always be available even when the PC is turned off.


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## TiVo Steve (Nov 8, 2005)

It's handy when your USB-Network adapter connection screws up... you can switch to the other port!


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## rbreding (Dec 12, 2004)

I can't quite tell by the responses, but to add to the foray of info:

The USB port can be used to add a second hard drive. The TiVo must be hacked and the usbstorage.o must be loaded. Then the hard drive can be formatted for an ext2 filesystem for extraction of shows to the hard drive via known methods. The hard drive COULD be added as a MFS storage device, but the problem comes when the hard drive isn't seen or some error happens that corrupts the MFS database. Therefore use as a MFS storage device is seriously not recommended.

BUT as said it can be used as an extraction destination if you didn't have a network active to extract the shows over.


Clear ?


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## Langree (Apr 29, 2004)

wilcotree said:


> I charge up my iPod with them sometimes.


With me it's my 360 controller


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## TishTash (Jan 24, 2008)

Just to update: I think we now know the second USB port can be used for a Tuning Adapter.


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

TishTash said:


> Just to update: I think we now know the second USB port can be used for a Tuning Adapter.


Not for an S2!


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

That's because S2 units use cable boxes for tuning digital channels, which means they have no need for a tuning adapter.

Tuning adapters only apply to CableCARD devices.

Dan


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