# Anyone else told they have to have the Virgin phone?



## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

I only have broadband L and TV XL and have just been told I can't have TiVo unless I get a phone line as well. I'm tied into a BT contract until Septmber and just don't want a Virgin line. The best he can offer me is £51 but that's another £3 on top of the standard extra £3 for TiVo for something I don't need.

I am so gutted. He said that the offer might change and leave if for a few days.

I could have had it installed on the morning of 15th Feb.


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## sjp (Oct 22, 2001)

while not tied in to any BT contract I kinda like the idea of having a phone that survives a power cut - guessing any V phone might die with the box when the power goes.


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## M_at (Dec 10, 2000)

sjp said:


> while not tied in to any BT contract I kinda like the idea of having a phone that survives a power cut - guessing any V phone might die with the box when the power goes.


What makes you think would it fail when the power goes? They deliver telephony services in the same way as BT - Twisted pair is run alongside the coax.

Virgin do not deliver any VOIP services to domestic users as standard.


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## sjp (Oct 22, 2001)

isn't the phone plugged into their "hub"? assumed it was, happy to hear my concerns are unfounded


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## okonski_uk (Dec 28, 2000)

No, it's a real phone line just like BT, delivered on an additional telephone cable pair that is in a sheath round the standard coax. As far as 'needing' a phone line, I do not believe it is the case. 

Anyone to takes TV is charged for a phone line (whether used or not) so irrespective of whether you plan to use it, you might as well have it than not, as there is no discount available for not taking it.


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

I've always had the discount for having broadband and TV. Their website gives a price of &#163;45 for Broadband L and TV XL. Individually both of these are &#163;51.50, so there is a discount applied.

I was offered &#163;51 to include Phone M so that would make TiVo cost me an extra &#163;6 a month, &#163;3 of which would be for something I won't use.


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## staffie2001uk (Apr 1, 2004)

The guy that called me said that the code for TV only wouldn't work on the system, and offerred me a phone and TV deal that worked out at less than £2 extra for the first year. 

I assume that I can cancel the phone after 12 months. 

Even though I love my TiVo, the service is going to have to be good and the TV worth having or I'll scrap it after the 12 months. So the enforced phone line shouldn't be a problem for me.


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## spitfires (Dec 19, 2006)

> I was offered £51 [...]


I'm not dissin' any of you guys on here but do you seriously not think twice about forking out £50 *per month* to watch tele? That's £600 a year. To watch television. Which is mostly sh*te. Or repeats. Or repeats of sh*te. Which might (on a good day) entertain but ('QI' excepted) certainly won't educate.

I guess it follows on from what was said in another thread about people nowadays not being able to multiply by 12/52/365... "buy this .... it's only 1.90 a day". Yeah that's _£700_ a year! I can see why people claim to "have no money".

< / rant>

(and yes I _am_ half Scottish!)


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

The &#163;51 actually includes broadband and phone. Only part of it will be for watching TV.


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## okonski_uk (Dec 28, 2000)

staffie2001uk said:


> I assume that I can cancel the phone after 12 months. .


Of course you can. Just don't expect your bill to drop. Only BB hasa no requirement to take the Phone Service, for TV, it remains chargeable and mandatory.


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## okonski_uk (Dec 28, 2000)

spitfires said:


> (and yes I _am_ half Scottish!)


As am I - but then before BB I had ISDN and for 2 x 64k channels, I paid £84 per quarter (around £27 a month) just for internet. My current bill for TV, VoD, BB and phone is £60pm and with TiVo, £63. I still believe I get excellent value for money.


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## jonphil (Aug 7, 2002)

I compared mine with Sky and if I take off the cost of the BB the actual cost of the TV is comparable to Sky.
Yes I will be paying more for the BB, but I should be getting over triple the speed that I'm paying Sky for.  even faster if I automatically get 30mb instead of 20mb.


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## mikerr (Jun 2, 2005)

spitfires said:


> I'm not dissin' any of you guys on here but do you seriously not think twice about forking out £50 *per month* to watch tele? That's £600 a year. To watch television. Which is mostly sh*te. Or repeats. Or repeats of sh*te. Which might (on a good day) entertain but ('QI' excepted) certainly won't educate.


Considering the time spent watching it - TV is a real bargain, even at premium channel subscription rates.

Watch, say a modest 2 hours a night, and compare that to other entertainment costs...

As for content - there may often be "nothing on" live tv at the time you sit down
But that's what TiVo is for - to filter down all the days tv to your schedule


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## cwaring (Feb 12, 2002)

spitfires said:


> I'm not dissin' any of you guys on here but do you seriously not think twice about forking out £50 *per month* to watch tele? That's £600 a year.


Firstly.....


teresatt said:


> The £51 actually includes broadband and phone. Only part of it will be for watching TV.


Secondly, and not that it's really any of your business or anything, but I live alone, don't drink or smoke, don't go out socialising much, don't eat out or get take-aways.

My cable services aren't a "lifeline" by any definition but the money I save not doing the things mentioned above mean that I can afford to spend the money on them instead.



> (and yes I _am_ half Scottish!)


And I'm a full Yorkshireman


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## spitfires (Dec 19, 2006)

I _did_ say I wasn't dissin' any of you guys  . If you are happy with what you are paying and can rationalise it somehow then fine.

Sure it means you work for (only) _one whole day_ every month to pay for your tele subs, but even so I just think it all adds up. £50 here, £15 there, £12 somewhere else, £17 over there, £16 for the new sofa... "don't know where all the money goes". Consumerism rules.

If all else fails the missus can always drop another sprog so we can get some more "child" benefit to pay for a Sky upgrade.


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

Success!! I've just got my TiVo ordered and it's due to be installed on 15th Feb in the afternoon. I could have had it installed in the morning but I'm out.

The only way he could do it was to add a phone onto it but he will remove the phone just before installation. I should end up paying &#163;48 for TiVo and Broadband L.

Yippee!! I can't wait. Less than two weeks to go now.


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

My contract has just come in the post and the phone line rental is on it. I've just spent half an hour on the phone to them and it seems that my entire order has to be cancelled and re ordered. They can't just cancel the phone. They still seem to be having problems and have to call me back.

I'm not holding out much hope for this. It looks like I'll end up cancelling the whole upgrade and try to get my money back. On top of the &#163;149 and &#163;3 a month extra, I can't really justify stretching to yet another &#163;3.49 a month for a phone line I'll never use.

I was so looking forward to TiVo next week.


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

They called back and will not let me have TiVo without a phone line so I've had to cancel.

I am really, really upset about this. Looks like I'll have to wait and see if they introduce any flexibility into the packages sometime in the future.


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## Muttley1900 (Dec 23, 2008)

teresatt said:


> so I've had to cancel.


Bad luck.


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## cwaring (Feb 12, 2002)

That is completely wrong. You do _not_ have to have a phone line. However, doing so does bring the price of your other things down.


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

As I posted in the Cable Forum, There is still a small chance for me I think. After talking to customer services, I called back the guy who put the order through for me as he had given me his direct number. I explained to him what had happened and he said to call back next Monday and he should be able to do something as the system should be accepting TiVo without a phone line then. I've lost my install slot for next Tuesday but he said I should still be able to get it in February.

Carl, it looks like I should be able to have TiVo without a phone line but Virgin's computer system has not been set up to accept an order without one. I'm really hoping the chap who took my order can sort something out for me. If I don't have the phone line, my monthly charge would be &#163;3.49 less.

I'll keep my fingers crossed.


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## ptruman (Jan 8, 2003)

teresatt said:


> They called back and will not let me have TiVo without a phone line so I've had to cancel.
> 
> I am really, really upset about this. Looks like I'll have to wait and see if they introduce any flexibility into the packages sometime in the future.


Maybe they've changed terms massively then since I joined (which is likely!)

I joined when it was Telewest, and I FIRST got broadband (nothing else), THEN TV, THEN phone. All separate, no mention of one with the other.

Also, I presume Walsall and Brum are being served by two different teams, as I got my call a while back, and can't be installed until the 18th! :\


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## okonski_uk (Dec 28, 2000)

cwaring said:


> That is completely wrong. You do _not_ have to have a phone line. However, doing so does bring the price of your other things down.


Only if they've rewritten their price guide. Having a phone line does NOT bring other prices down. It is a set charge for everyone taking TV. and had not been a cancelled requirement for those taking TiVo. This has happened since 2006 (probably earlier) on NTL/CableTel. You could ask for it not to be installed, but the PRICE you paid stayed the same regardless. For 8 years I never used it, but BT were getting silly so I left them and started using my 'free' phone line. Jut as well I let them install it. Ported my BT number over, then used Skype VOIP for outbound calls (over BB). The best of both worlds.

Anyone can have TV and not have the phone provided, but the bill stays the same. ONLY BB has no phone requirement. If the system is updated after ordering a TiVo, the ability to cancel any unwanted phone line remains a choice for the consumer, but no way to save money.


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

Virgin's website allows you to build a package bundle with just TV and broadband. You can see it here http://shop.virginmedia.com/build-your-bundle. If you add the phone line the package price goes up, it doesn't stay the same.

I've always had a discount for having TV and broadband together and I was expecting to pay the package price on the website plus £3 for TiVo.


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## cwaring (Feb 12, 2002)

okonski_uk said:


> Having a phone line does NOT bring other prices down..


Okay. I just tried an experiment as a "new customer".

Broaband on it's own = £16 (£21.50 after 3 months)
BB + TV Bundle = £32.50
BB+ TV + Phone Bundle = *£10*, but of course add £12.99 for Line Rental.

So yes, adding the phone line _does_ bring the _package_ price down; which is what I said 

Add a phone line and only, actually, pay 49p more. How weird is that


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## Tony Hoyle (Apr 1, 2002)

IIRC there are some combinations where adding the phone is actually cheaper.

The mystery that is the VM billing policy is one of those things I'll never understand...


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

Carl, however, if you do the same but use TV XL instead of TV M, the package price is &#163;45. If you add Phone M the price goes up to &#163;51. I'm on TV XL currently and that is the requirement for TiVo.

If I add the phone to my current package it will cost me &#163;6 more. It's weird how adding the phone to the basic package brings the cost down but not if you have a higher package.


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## ptruman (Jan 8, 2003)

teresatt said:


> If I add the phone to my current package it will cost me £6 more. It's weird how adding the phone to the basic package brings the cost down but not if you have a higher package.


Not really, I suspect it's a bit of a loss leader to get people in the door, and then when they want to upgrade (as most may well do) the prices go up and they recoup some of the costs. Most of the deals are normally for X months initially only.

If you're a long term customer, just ring C/S and say you're unhappy with the pricing, and considering leaving, and see what they'll do for you. Customer Retention can be a useful tool


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## cwaring (Feb 12, 2002)

ptruman said:


> If you're a long term customer, just ring C/S and say you're unhappy with the pricing, *and considering leaving*, and see what they'll do for you. Customer Retention can be a useful tool


The bit in bold is not necessary. At least, it wasn't for me.


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## jonphil (Aug 7, 2002)

I found it was cheaper to have the unlimited phone than the evenings and weekends.
I think part of it is based on assumption as people just assume something will be cheaper than the other 'more expensive' package.


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

If I add the unlimited phone the price goes from &#163;45 for just BB L and TV XL to &#163;58.99 which is considerably more. By the time I've added caller display and factored in for having to pay for 0870 and 0845 nos on Virgin and not on BT, it's much cheaper for me to stay with BT. However, I'm tied in with BT anyway until September as I've paid line rental up front to get a saving.

The bottom line is that if I have TiVo and add a phone line I will pay more than &#163;3 a month extra. In fact my contract showed it to be &#163;6.49 more than I'm paying now. Much as I desperately want TiVo, I'm already stretched to pay the &#163;3 a month extra for it and I certainly can't justify paying an extra &#163;6.49 a month. 

If the chap who took my order can't sort something out for me on Monday, I will just have to be patient and hope that the packages become more flexible when TiVo is made available to everyone.


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## okonski_uk (Dec 28, 2000)

Tony Hoyle said:


> The mystery that is the VM billing policy is one of those things I'll never understand...


Amen to that!


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## mhopley (Mar 5, 2002)

I have signed up for tivo (not a VM customer before) and
my contact has come through with a phone phone line with a monthy cost of *£40.24* 
The VM salesman mentioned that he had to add the phone due to a bug in the system but it would be cancelled.

Has anyone else had their contract yet?


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

Yippee!!! Yippee!!! Just called Virgin back and their system can finally accept an order without a phone line. Unfortunately they are now very busy and my install date isn't until 10th March. However, I'm still very pleased that I am going to have TiVo soon after all.


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## tdenson (Oct 3, 2002)

teresatt said:


> Yippee!!! Yippee!!! Just called Virgin back and their system can finally accept an order without a phone line. Unfortunately they are now very busy and my install date isn't until 10th March. However, I'm still very pleased that I am going to have TiVo soon after all.


When you say you called Virgin back - on what number ? I am in the same situation, I am having Tivo installed this Thursday but they insisted on a phone line. It would nice to try and get it removed but without losing my install date.


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

tdenson said:


> When you say you called Virgin back - on what number ? I am in the same situation, I am having Tivo installed this Thursday but they insisted on a phone line. It would nice to try and get it removed but without losing my install date.


It's the direct number for one of the TiVo team and is an 0161 number. I don't want to give the number out publicly as it is likely to get inundated with calls.

Their system can now accept an order without a phone line so you may be able to get it changed through normal customer services. However, they may still insist on cancelling your whole order and redoing it which might mean you losing your install date.


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## tdenson (Oct 3, 2002)

teresatt said:


> It's the direct number for one of the TiVo team and is an 0161 number. I don't want to give the number out publicly as it is likely to get inundated with calls.


It's alright I've used that one before. I'll give them a try.


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## tdenson (Oct 3, 2002)

Result - they've removed my phone line from the installation.


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## teresatt (Dec 21, 2001)

That's great, Tony. You don't have long to wait now.


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## 10203 (Nov 11, 2001)

+1 for not needing to order a phone line. Talked to them yesterday morning - install scheduled for the 23rd


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## sjp (Oct 22, 2001)

and, seemingly, you can ask for the phone line to not be installed when your installation takes place.

i'll report back Friday with how well I got on.


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