# Strange SP glitch (Haven)



## Rob Helmerichs

My Season Pass isn't catching the 9/2 episode of Haven. It's been in the Guide Data since yesterday, it doesn't show up in the Recording History with any kind of explanation, and if I look at that episode, it says "Record This Episode Also" instead of "Get Season Pass" (which is what it says when an SP glitch results in a series not being recognized as the same one you have the SP to).

I'm inclined to just let it ride and see if it corrects itself, but I've never seen anything like this before. Has anybody else?


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## lpwcomp

For some reason, the TiVo thinks it is a repeat. At least, that is the reason given in my "To Do List Recording History" for not recording it. Hopefully, the guide data will be corrected prior to 09/02. I note that the guide data for that episode is currently very sparse, including having no "Original Air Date". This is probably the cause.


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## Rob Helmerichs

But mine doesn't show up in the Recording History at all.


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## lpwcomp

What does the guide data show?


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## Rob Helmerichs

lpwcomp said:


> What does the guide data show?


It shows the episode. "...and if I look at that episode, it says "Record This Episode Also" instead of "Get Season Pass" (which is what it says when an SP glitch results in a series not being recognized as the same one you have the SP to)."


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## balboa dave

Your SP is troubled.


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## mattack

Rob Helmerichs said:


> But mine doesn't show up in the Recording History at all.


If you have a show set to record only new episodes, the fact that an episode is a rerun will NOT show up in the Recording History.

Only items that "would have fulfilled" your requests show up there.

(with possible exceptions I'm not thinking about.. but I am fairly confident that the first sentence is 100% true.)


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## lpwcomp

mattack said:


> If you have a show set to record only new episodes, the fact that an episode is a rerun will NOT show up in the Recording History.
> 
> Only items that "would have fulfilled" your requests show up there.
> 
> (with possible exceptions I'm not thinking about.. but I am fairly confident that the first sentence is 100% true.)


Did you miss my first post in this thread? I am quite certain that your first sentence is 100% false.

The following entry is still in my Recording History:



> Fri 9/2 10:00PM Haven Won't Record


Details for that entry:



> Will Not Be Recorded​
> Haven: "Friend or Faux" on Fri Sep 2, 10:00 pm 874 SYFYHD
> 
> This episode will not be recorded because it is a repeat,and the Season Pass or Wishlist that requested it is set to record first run only.


There is a similar entry for the Sat 9/3 12:00AM showing.


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## mattack

lpwcomp said:


> Did you miss my first post in this thread? I am quite certain that your first sentence is 100% false.


Are you on a Premiere? I'm still very very certain that I don't see "because it's a repeat" on my S1, S3, or TiVo HD ever.. The closest situation is when it was originally scheduled as a generic recording (i.e. no guide data) then guide data comes in, and it goes to the recording history showing the 28 day rule info..

Plus, I interpreted "it doesn't show up in the Recording History with any kind of explanation" as meaning it doesn't show up, but it seems to me like you really mean it shows up but doesn't have an explanation.. (but then your reply above says it DOES have an explanation, because it's a repeat????)


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## Rob Helmerichs

He's not the one with the problem, I am (his first post in the thread wasn't _the _first post in the thread!).

It doesn't show up in the Recording History at all. I thought it should even if it's a repeat, but now I'm not so sure.


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## lpwcomp

The entry I described above is on my Premiere. And I quoted it exactly. It's still there. There are similar entries for episodes of other shows, "Futurama", "South Park", and "Jeopardy!" to name but three, but in those cases it actually is a repeat.

There are also entries for prior dates. Only on those entries, the wording changes from "will not be" to "was not", for obvious reasons.


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## Rob Helmerichs

And I have an S3, which seems to explain the discrepancy we're all experiencing.

So hug it out, you two!


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## lpwcomp

Ok. Finally got a chance to check my HD. There are no entries in the Recording History like that. It appears to be a Premiere only feature.

On the original issue, I think the incomplete Guide data is making the TiVo think it is a rerun so it is not being scheduled by a First Run Only season pass. It just doesn't explicitly tell you that on anything other than a Premiere.

Just checked. The guide data is still incomplete and it is still not scheduled to record.


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## Rob Helmerichs

The weird thing is, usually incomplete Guide Data makes reruns record on FRO passes, not makes first-runs not record.

It will be interesting to see when and if it fixes itself...


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## lpwcomp

Rob Helmerichs said:


> The weird thing is, usually incomplete Guide Data makes reruns record on FRO passes, not makes first-runs not record.


Yeah, I see that too. For instance, there are bunch of episodes of "Robot Chicken" scheduled to record. When I look at the info for them, they all have the same "Original Air Date", 2/20/05. The subject episode of "Haven" is missing that datum.


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## lpwcomp

I just checked and nothing has changed except the 09/09 episode has the same problem.


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## Rob Helmerichs

Same here.

I guess I'll file a TiVo problem report.


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## lpwcomp

I checked zapit and the those episodes are missing the "First Aired" date, so I sent them feedback and included a link to this thread in it also. Looks like Tribune is source of the original problem. Hopefully, this attack on multiple fronts will result in a satisfactory and timely resolution.


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## iowacyclone

I noticed my tivo missing the recording of the upcoming Haven episodes still today as well. How do we go about trying to get TIVO to correct the error?


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## wtkflhn

Why don't you just select "record this episode, also"? Problem worked around!

Don H


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## Rob Helmerichs

I just switched my SP to First-Run And Reruns (or whatever they call it), and that works just fine.

At least until they go into reruns!


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## lpwcomp

I have heard back from zapit. Her is a copy of the exchange:



> Dear Zap2it user,
> 
> Thank you for your feedback.
> 
> We apologize for the inconvenience.
> 
> We have forwarded your email to our editorial team.
> 
> If you should have any other questions, please be sure to reference our new Help page at:
> 
> http://www.zap2it.com/services/site/help/zap-help-gettingstarted,0,3122155.htmlstory
> 
> Thank you for being a Zap2it user.
> 
> The Zap2it Customer Feedback Team
> 
> From: James L. Sutherland [mailto:*<redacted>*]
> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2011 7:38 AM
> To: TMS-LA Feedback
> Subject: Re: Original Air Date missing from next 2 new episodes of "Haven"
> 
> Since this is a national cable channel and the the problem exists on your site, Most of the requested data is irrelevant. The relevant data is:
> 
> Channel: SYFY
> Name of Program: Haven
> Air Dates : 09/02 & 09/09
> Air Time: 10:00PM EDT
> 
> On 8/30/2011 5:59 PM, TMS-LA Feedback wrote:
> 
> Dear Zap2it user,
> 
> Thank you for your email.
> 
> We are sorry to hear you are experiencing difficulties with the site.
> 
> We would be glad to look into this and the other issues you sent. Would you be so kind as to provide the following, if you have not done so already so that our data team can recreate and resolve the issue?:
> 
> - Zip code
> 
> - Cable/Satellite Provider name
> 
> - Channel number
> 
> - Call letter
> 
> - Name of program
> 
> - Air date
> 
> - Air time
> 
> We apologize for any inconvenience and thank you for being a Zap2it user.
> 
> If you should have any other questions, please be sure to reference our Help page at:
> 
> http://www.zap2it.com/services/site/help/zap-help-gettingstarted,0,3122155.htmlstory
> 
> Regards,
> 
> The Zap2it Customer Feedback Team
> 
> From: James L. Sutherland [mailto:*<redacted>*]
> Sent: Monday, August 29, 2011 2:52 PM
> To: TMS-LA Feedback
> Subject: Original Air Date missing from next 2 new episodes of "Haven"
> 
> The Original Air Date is missing from the next 2 new episodes of "Haven". This is causing TiVos to treat them as repeats and thus they are not being picked up by a First Run Only Season Pass. See this thread in the TiVo Community Forum.


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## AbMagFab

Mine didn't record either. Tivo HD.


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## lpwcomp

wtkflhn said:


> Why don't you just select "record this episode, also"? Problem worked around!
> 
> Don H


I did that for the 09/02 episode but I would like zapit and/or SYFY to address the problem so it doesn't continue to be a problem and perhaps spread to other shows.


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## Rob Helmerichs

lpwcomp said:


> I did that for the 09/02 episode but I would like zapit and/or SYFY to address the problem so it doesn't continue to be a problem and perhaps spread to other shows.


Indeed. This is exactly why we have TiVo in the first place...so we don't have to worry about knowing whether there's a new episode this week!


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## CoxInPHX

I'm new to TiVo within the last 30 days, and have had several New, First Run episodes not record or not scheduled to record. Very disappointed in the reliability of the guide data so far. I still have my Cox DVR running Rovi Guide Data and it has been correct with the exception that it also listed 09/03/11 "Doctor Who" as a Repeat.

08/17/11 - "The Hour" BBC America - Not Scheduled to record - New episode.
08/24/11 - "The Hour" BBC America - Not Scheduled to record - New episode.
08/31/11 - "The Hour" BBC America - Not Scheduled to record - New episode.
09/07/11 - "The Hour" BBC America - Not Scheduled to record - New episode.

09/02/11 - "Haven" SyFy - Not Scheduled to record - New episode.
09/09/11 - "Haven" SyFy - Not Scheduled to record - New episode.

09/03/11 - "Doctor Who" BBC America - Not Scheduled to record - New episode, Listed as Repeat in Guide.

Doctor Who had the correct "First Aired" date in the TiVo Guide Data, so why did it list it as a Repeat? Zap2It does not show the 09/03/11 episode as "New". Does Tivo also look at the "New" tag to determine whether to record?


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## HTH

I set it to record the episode (and next week's too) manually, but it failed to record anyway because of tuning adapter failure to provide the signal. And of course it didn't try to get the repeat airings the same night since it was just a single event recording in Now Playing. Maybe if the data had been corrected it could have gotten one of the repeats that night, but in my experience it won't attempt to get another showing for 12 hours, too late for Syfy's repeat schedule.

Syfy doesn't appear to have this full episode available for streaming (yet?).


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## Rob Helmerichs

Looks like it's been fixed...both the upcoming episodes are now set to record under FRO.


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## lpwcomp

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Looks like it's been fixed...both the upcoming episodes are now set to record under FRO.


On mine, the 9/9 episode is fixed and is set to record. The 9/16 episode has no Original Air Date and is not set to record. Hopefully, it will be addressed by next week. If not, I guess the next step is e-mail to SYFY.


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## Rob Helmerichs

Interesting...on mine, the 9/16 episode was scheduled to record yesterday, but isn't today!

This is your TiVo. _This _is your TiVo on drugs.


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## bgc

I've got an S2DT and it didn't record the 9/2 episode either. There was no mention of Haven at all in the recording history. The SP is set to First Run and I just looked and the 9/9 episode is in the to do list. 

Luckily I have Cox cable and the Syfy On Demand channel had the missed episode.


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## JoeTaxpayer

I actually have an HD, an S3 and Premiere. 
Until yesterday 9/6, Haven 9/9 did not show up on any TiVo. I set the premiere to manually record. Yesterday the other two TiVos both show the 9/9 will record. The Premiere won't record at 10PM as I set the manual for midnight, just as an experiment. Yes, I find it odd that it took until 3 days prior to set as a future recording.


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## iowacyclone

I notice that the 9/16 episode of Haven is also missing from my premiere and I have it set to record new episodes. Though I notice that the 9/9 episode now is listed to record.


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## JoeTaxpayer

9/16 Haven is not on any of my machines yet. I'm around, and will make a note to peek at it on Friday, curious if and when it will.
I'm starting to see other shows less than 10 days out that dont appear yet. In one case, it can't record due to a conflict, and I wonder if I'll get some kind of notification, prior to the not recording. It's a season pass that was there from last year. 
Next few week, I'll need to jungle the machines for a few conflicts due to new season.


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## Rob Helmerichs

You'll never get a notification if a SP doesn't record because of a conflict. The only time you'd see something like that is when you're actually setting up the SP.


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## ghuido

Missed the 09/02 recording. :-( TIVO HD

09/09 is set to record tonight but the 09/16 is not scheduled to record.


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## JoeTaxpayer

Rob, given that shows on Bravo and SyFy will often repeat at say, midnight and 1am, I wonder if I delete the 10pm season pass, letting the old show take the slot, and then request the midnight show on SyFy, if that will get me a midnight based season pass. maybe I need to allow first run and repeats to get that working? 
Make sense?


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## lpwcomp

Season passes are not time based. Just use the season pass manager to move season passes for non-repeating shows above those of shows that do repeat.


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## Rob Helmerichs

No, the SP is for a specific channel, not for a specific time. If you have an SP, it will record the first available showing on that channel, unless there's a conflict with a higher SP; then it will go to the next showing; etc.

If you set Haven to first run and repeats, it will work just fine...until the show goes into repeats. But for now, that's the only way to be sure. One hopes they will get this sorted out eventually, and not just on a week-to-week basis.


lpwcomp said:


> Season passes are not time based. Just use the season pass manager to move season passes for non-repeating shows above those of shows that do repeat.


This is how I do it. First, all the one-time-only shows; then all the repeating show. I also do finer gradations within the repeating shows, but that's something you can work out to your own tastes and anal-compulsiveness.


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## JoeTaxpayer

Rob Helmerichs said:


> This is how I do it. First, all the one-time-only shows; then all the repeating show. I also do finer gradations within the repeating shows, but that's something you can work out to your own tastes and anal-compulsiveness.


If I got it right, assuming there are three shows same time, with the one that repeats. By deleting the repeat SP, and then adding to lower priority, it should work, recording all three. Does the repeater need to be set for "all shows" or is first run still going to find the first instance it can record?


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## Rob Helmerichs

You don't need to delete the repeater, just move it down in the SP list. Other than that, yes, you've got it.

FRO will pick up any show that A) is not a rerun (i.e., it aired for the first time in the past 28 (I think) days) , and B) hasn't been recorded in the past 28 (I think) days.


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## JoeTaxpayer

Thanks Rob. The conflict will occur 9/20 which hasn't loaded yet, so by tomorrow I'll see how the TiVo handles it. 

For what it's worth, we had the hurricane Irene cause a cable outage (nothing else, so I'm grateful) and Sunday night one show didn't record. A few night later, the TiVo recorded it for us. I thought that was pretty cool.


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## lpwcomp

JoeTaxpayer said:


> If I got it right, assuming there are three shows same time, with the one that repeats. By deleting the repeat SP, and then adding to lower priority, it should work, recording all three. Does the repeater need to be set for "all shows" or is first run still going to find the first instance it can record?


No need to delete and recreate it. Just move it using Season Pass Manager - that's what it's for. And no, it doesn't need to be set for "all shows".

The fastest way to get into "Season Pass Manager" is to hit a "1" on the remote when at "TiVo Central".


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## Rob Helmerichs

JoeTaxpayer said:


> For what it's worth, we had the hurricane Irene cause a cable outage (nothing else, so I'm grateful) and Sunday night one show didn't record. A few night later, the TiVo recorded it for us. I thought that was pretty cool.


TiVo's pretty freakin' amazing that way. Glitches like this Haven one are rare, and it remains more powerful and flexible than any other DVR software I've ever seen.


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## lpwcomp

Rob Helmerichs said:


> TiVo's pretty freakin' amazing that way. Glitches like this Haven one are rare, and it remains more powerful and flexible than any other DVR software I've ever seen.


And the "Haven" problem needs to be addressed at the source - either Tribune or SYFY.


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## JoeTaxpayer

lpwcomp said:


> And the "Haven" problem needs to be addressed at the source - either Tribune or SYFY.


If it weren't recording at all, I'd understand there's an issue needs fixing. But it recorded just fine, making the list just 3 days before airing. What do you think changed that it showed up at that time?


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## Rob Helmerichs

Something buried in the Guide Data that tells TiVo it's not a repeat.

Last week, it didn't get fixed in time. Whoever is messing up the Guide Data (Syfy or Tribune) needs to resolve the problem that's causing the glitches, instead of just fixing it on a week by week basis.


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## lpwcomp

What's missing is the "Original Air Date" (TiVo's term), "First Aired" date (on Zapit (Tribune)).


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## CoxInPHX

lpwcomp said:


> What's missing is the "Original Air Date" (TiVo's term), "First Aired" date (on Zapit (Tribune)).


I believe that TiVo needs both, an "Original Air Date" (TiVo's term), "First Aired" date AND a NEW tag from the Guide provider. Without the NEW tag the TiVo will assume it is a Repeat.

See my posting for Doctor Who on page 1, repeated below:

09/03/11 - "Doctor Who" BBC America - Not Scheduled to record - New episode, Listed as Repeat in Guide.

Doctor Who had the correct "First Aired" date in the TiVo Guide Data, so why did it list it as a Repeat? Zap2It does not show the 09/03/11 episode as "New". Does Tivo also look at the "New" tag to determine whether to record?


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## lpwcomp

What does your "Recording History" say is the reason that episode of "Doctor Who" wasn't recorded?


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## Rob Helmerichs

I don't think TiVo looks at the "New" tag...


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## JoeTaxpayer

Update - To spell things out - on Tuesday nights, my wife and I wanted to record Body of Proof and Parenthood. And The Kid wanted The Rachel Zoe Project. All at 10pm, but the Zoe is a Bravo chanel and repeats same night, at 11pm.
I took the advice here, and online just rearranged priorities, so of these three shows, Zoe was third. 9/20 is now in my to do list, all three shows will record with the Zoe recording at 11. All three ask for 'first run' only. This is excellent.

No sign of the 9/16 Haven yet.


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## lpwcomp

As an experiment, I went in and added BBCA to the channels I recieve (I don't actually receive it, you understand. It's not in the "Digital Starter" package). I then created an FRO SP for "Doctor Who" and it added the first showing of all of the upcoming episodes whose "Original Air Date" falls within the range that TiVo uses to determine whether or not it is new, even those identified as a repeat.

I suppose it is possible that the scheduling algorithm behaves differently when you initially create a Season Pass, but I doubt it.

I did notice one rather odd thing. When I created the SP, it had one showing (09/18 12AM) in the "Will NOT record" list because of a conflict. Since this is a repeat of the 09/17 9PM showing, it shouldn't be recorded anyway. I told it to get all episodes of the season pass and it worked like it is supposed to - it didn't actually schedule that showing to record nor did it cancel the conflicting recording. I guess it checks for conflicts before it checks to see if it is already being recorded earlier.


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## lpwcomp

I sent feedback to syfy.com asking them if they were no longer providing "First Aired Date" in their episode information for "Haven" that they send to Tribune. I should have gone further as they don't appear to be providing anything beyond the episode title.


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## CoxInPHX

lpwcomp said:


> As an experiment, I went in and added BBCA to the channels I recieve (I don't actually receive it, you understand. It's not in the "Digital Starter" package). I then created an FRO SP for "Doctor Who" and it added the first showing of all of the upcoming episodes whose "Original Air Date" falls within the range that TiVo uses to determine whether or not it is new, even those identified as a repeat.
> 
> I suppose it is possible that the scheduling algorithm behaves differently when you initially create a Season Pass, but I doubt it.
> 
> I did notice one rather odd thing. When I created the SP, it had one showing (09/18 12AM) in the "Will NOT record" list because of a conflict. Since this is a repeat of the 09/17 9PM showing, it shouldn't be recorded anyway. I told it to get all episodes of the season pass and it worked like it is supposed to - it didn't actually schedule that showing to record nor did it cancel the conflicting recording. I guess it checks for conflicts before it checks to see if it is already being recorded earlier.


That One Episode of Doctor Who on 09/03/11 at 9PM EST / 6PM PST was a unique glitch where the First Run Date was correct but the TiVo guide listed it as a Repeat and Zap2It did not have a New tag. My Cox DVR with Rovi guide data also listed it as a Repeat. I ended up setting a One Time recording for the re-airing later that evening, so I do not know how TiVo would have handled recording that episode on it's own.


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## CoxInPHX

Is there a way to see both Recording Conflicts when setting a Season Pass?

Usually the TiVo only shows one of the two Recording Conflicts and only gives the option of not recording one of the Conflicts. However if I set the Season Pass up from the Guide Listings and not the Search, I do see both conflicts.

If I go into Season Pass Manager it also only lists one of the two scheduled recordings for that time. How do I see both conflicts so I can decide which one to modify.

Is flipping back and forth between the To Do List and the Season Pass Manager, the only way to resolve conflicts? I am talking about three Major Network Prime Time shows that will not have a repeat episode. If so, that is pathetic, my Cox DVR is able to resolve conflicts much easier and on the same Menu. The To Do List should show conflicts and have the ability to resolve them in that one place.


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## JoeTaxpayer

Tomorrow's Haven is still not showing. I put in one TiVo to do it manually. We'll see what the other two do. 
Considering the surreal nature of the show, it's ironic to me this is the show having issues. Kind of like when I woke with my first bloody nose in 40 years, and the shirt I bled on said "give blood." It was free from a day I donated. Completely unrelated, I know.


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## Rob Helmerichs

Maybe if you hadn't worn that shirt that day, we wouldn't be having this problem. Didja ever think of that? Huh? Didja?!?


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## JoeTaxpayer

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Maybe if you hadn't worn that shirt that day, we wouldn't be having this problem. Didja ever think of that? Huh? Didja?!?


LOL. Of course I did.  cause and effect is a strange thing.....


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## lpwcomp

*ALERT**ALERT* *** THREAD HIJACKING ATTEMPT *** *ALERT**ALERT*


CoxInPHX said:


> Is there a way to see both Recording Conflicts when setting a Season Pass?
> 
> Usually the TiVo only shows one of the two Recording Conflicts and only gives the option of not recording one of the Conflicts. However if I set the Season Pass up from the Guide Listings and not the Search, I do see both conflicts.
> 
> If I go into Season Pass Manager it also only lists one of the two scheduled recordings for that time. How do I see both conflicts so I can decide which one to modify.
> 
> Is flipping back and forth between the To Do List and the Season Pass Manager, the only way to resolve conflicts? I am talking about three Major Network Prime Time shows that will not have a repeat episode. If so, that is pathetic, my Cox DVR is able to resolve conflicts much easier and on the same Menu. The To Do List should show conflicts and have the ability to resolve them in that one place.


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## sieglinde

That is more of a Tivo Help question. <shrug>


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## hybucket

I am also having the HAVEN problem w/ HD TiVo. Started another thread on this before someone pointed me here. Obviously a guide problem. Only solution seems to be to set it to record new and rerun. It did not record tonight and was not going to record next weeks. Has only a couple of items under INFO.


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## lpwcomp

SYFY never responded to my query about what they were or were not providing to Tribune vis-a-vis Haven.


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## hybucket

Has anyone contacted Tribune on this? They've been pretty responsive in the past.


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## AbMagFab

So now that's two Haven's that I've missed, thanks to Tivo.

It might be time to just cut the cord and stream directly from iTunes. Having a million of us record the same bits on hard drives in each of our homes is silly when you think about it. Just stream it when you're ready to watch.

If Tivo can't record 100% reliably (no matter who's at fault - them or the listings or SyFy), then it's of no use to me. I'd rather dump cable and stop paying Tivo, and fund paying for shows as I want to watch them...

Anyone with me?!?


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## lpwcomp

AbMagFab said:


> So now that's two Haven's that I've missed, thanks to Tivo.
> 
> It might be time to just cut the cord and stream directly from iTunes. Having a million of us record the same bits on hard drives in each of our homes is silly when you think about it. Just stream it when you're ready to watch.
> 
> If Tivo can't record 100% reliably (no matter who's at fault - them or the listings or SyFy), then it's of no use to me. I'd rather dump cable and stop paying Tivo, and fund paying for shows as I want to watch them...
> 
> Anyone with me?!?


I'm certainly not. You have a number of options - change your SP, explicitly select the episode to "Record this episode also", get Tribune/and or SYFY to fix the problem. Abandoning TiVo due to a problem with one show is ridiculous. Missing any episode except the 9/2 one was far more _*your*_ fault than any fault in the TiVo.

You've been on this "ditch cable and TiVo and go to streaming" bandwagon for a while now. The last part of your sig says it all. Claiming that it has anything to do with this particular issue is disingenuous at the least. Do you perhaps have a personal stake in iTunes or some other streaming service?

If you want to continue to proselytize this position, go ahead. Just don't clutter up threads like this one with it.


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## AbMagFab

lpwcomp said:


> Missing any episode except the 9/2 one was far more _*your*_ fault than any fault in the TiVo.


Wait, what? How was it my fault? I set up a season pass, Tivo didn't record it. How is that my fault? Or are you saying, because I happen to subscribe to this thread, that I should have manually recorded it? Hmm... that seems like odd logic to me.

No, I don't have a stake in iTunes or Apple or anyone related to streaming.

But I have:

1) Replaced half my Tivo's with MythTV for OTA recording. As convenient as streaming on demand is, if I can record OTA accurately, I can cut my streaming costs in half. And if I can drop my monthly Tivo bill, that's another big revenue savings, since MythTV has no monthly cost. (And MythTV supplements with PSIP data, so it seems to be far more accurate for OTA at least.)

2) Cut 1/3 my cable bill out by dropping all premium channels. I now pull in what I want to watch via iTunes (or Netflix).

3) I've been spot-purchasing other series via iTunes to see how the process works, and to slowly get my wife on board.

4) Watching shows that my Tivo misses, like the 2 episodes of Haven, via iTunes.

By the end of the year, if I'm on schedule, I should be cutting cable completely, and moving to MythTV for OTA (and thus dropping Tivo completely).

Tivo is so old-school. Time to move on. And things like this Haven nonsense (which is hardly unique) are just further evidence.


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## lpwcomp

AbMagFab said:


> Wait, what? How was it my fault? I set up a season pass, Tivo didn't record it. How is that my fault? Or are you saying, because I happen to subscribe to this thread, that I should have manually recorded it? Hmm... that seems like odd logic to me.


I am saying that since you were aware of the problem and that there were options available to you to address it which you chose not to exercise, the failure to record the second time is far more your fault than TiVo's. You apparently preferred to keep it as an issue so you could continue to push your agenda, for whatever reason. Hmm... that seems like irrational behavior to me.

Maybe if more people were sending feedback to zapit and SYFY as I have done, the actual problem would get addressed.


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## JoeTaxpayer

lpwcomp said:


> I am saying that since you were aware of the problem and that there were options available to you to address it which you chose not to exercise, the failure to record the second time is far more your fault than TiVo's.


I've changed the SP to first run and repeat. SyFy repeats a number of times so no excuse for missing this. I missed the recording last night but then manually got it at midnight.

Really, what's oddest to me is this show. All other SyFy shows (the 3 on Monday) record fine.


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## TiVo Bob W

lpwcomp said:


> Missing any episode except the 9/2 one was far more _*your*_ fault than any fault in the TiVo.


Don't be an a**. Yes, there are options to get around this issue. The point is we pay for a service with both TiVo and Tribune Media. When an issue is reported it should be taken care of ASAP.

Before you jump all over me, I have had a TiVo since '01 and am a loyal supporter. But recently both TiVo and Tribune have been less than helpful with guide data issues. I realize that this is also the fault of the networks but we pay TiVo for the service!

Bob


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## JoeTaxpayer

TiVo Bob W said:


> Don't be an a**. Yes, there are options to get around this issue. The point is we pay for a service with both TiVo and Tribune Media. When an issue is reported it should be taken care of ASAP.


No need for name calling. Yes, it should be fixed, but knowing there's an issue, why wouldn't anyone just force a manual recording after knowing the issue existed? Complaining here and then paying iTunes for the second show makes no sense.


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## sieglinde

Yeah, I had an issue (I solved it by having two SPs for a show) and they did not fix it. PoliticsNation and MSNBC Live are the same show.


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## RMBittner

AbMagFab said:


> stream directly from iTunes


This isn't possible. You can _buy_ episodes from iTunes for $2.99 each and download them to your iPod, iPad, PC/Mac -- and I'm a big fan of that -- but, as far as I'm aware, iTunes doesn't offer streaming. (Of course, you can also pick up missed episodes from Amazon right on your TiVo. And, if you're willing to wait a while, a lot of TV shows _are_ showing up for streaming on Netflix, but you won't typically get the current season.)

Not that it's at all helpful, but I'm wondering if this whole "Haven" issue might be related to specific cable providers. I'm on a small, independent cable co in mid-Michigan, and my "Haven" SP has picked up everything.

Bob


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## Rob Helmerichs

RMBittner said:


> I'm on a small, independent cable co in mid-Michigan, and my "Haven" SP has picked up everything.


Well, aren't _you _special!


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## hybucket

Just to keep this going, because I know how much fun some get from knocking TiVO, when I noticed that TiVO would not record "Haven," I set it to manually record the midnight showing. When I figured out what the problem was (the guide data), I changed the options in SP to record repeats and first run. Solved the problem for the time being. I also have problems with several BBCA shows which, because the data shows "original air date" as the date they were showed in the UK, not US, were not picked up as "new" by the TiVO. Yes, it's a glitch, but that's life. Seems to me that to just change the options makes a lot more sense than searching around for a replacement like iTunes or other such nonsense cause you're not getting one recording out of...how many..?
And yes, I have notified Tribune and SyFy of this problem.


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## RMBittner

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Well, aren't _you _special!


Well, don't take my comment as praise for my local cable provider. As soon as DirecTV releases their HDDirecTiVo, I'm leaving. The local co offers great customer service -- in terms of service calls and troubleshooting -- but they're way behind when it comes to adding HD channels.

And, honestly, I don't know if they're the ones to thank for my Haven SP... I just know I haven't missed anything. (But I haven't been motivated enough to go digging to see why things are working.)

Bob


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## lpwcomp

RMBittner said:


> Well, don't take my comment as praise for my local cable provider. As soon as DirecTV releases their HDDirecTiVo, I'm leaving. The local co offers great customer service -- in terms of service calls and troubleshooting -- but they're way behind when it comes to adding HD channels.
> 
> And, honestly, I don't know if they're the ones to thank for my Haven SP... I just know I haven't missed anything. (But I haven't been motivated enough to go digging to see why things are working.)
> 
> Bob


More likely that you set up the SP with defaults, which is "Repeats & first run", rather than "First run only".

I just checked "zapit" and the 9/23 episode has a "First Aired" date. Still missing on the 9/30 episode. My Premiere is scheduled to connect in <30 mins, so I will check it later this afternoon. I know I could force a connection now but why bother.


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## RMBittner

lpwcomp said:


> More likely that you set up the SP with defaults, which is "Repeats & first run", rather than "First run only".


Very possible. I almost never do that, but I'm new to the show -- I've been catching up on iTunes -- and it's possible that I included repeats "just in case."

Darn it. Now you've made me curious...

ADDED: Nope. "First-run only." And I got the episodes from the 10th and the 17th.

Bob


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## lpwcomp

RMBittner said:


> Very possible. I almost never do that, but I'm new to the show -- I've been catching up on iTunes -- and it's possible that I included repeats "just in case."
> 
> Darn it. Now you've made me curious...
> 
> Bob


Also be interesting to know what it set to record on 9/30. They are running a mini-marathon leading up to the season finale.


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## hybucket

lpwcomp said:


> Also be interesting to know what it set to record on 9/30. They are running a mini-marathon leading up to the season finale.


 Well if you go by Zap2It's current listings online, none of the episodes for 9/30 have a "first-aired" date (for HAVEN).


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## RMBittner

lpwcomp said:


> Also be interesting to know what it set to record on 9/30. They are running a mini-marathon leading up to the season finale.


Oddly...the 2:00PM (ET) "Haven" episode is the only one from that day that's appearing in the ToDo list.

Bob


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## phox_mulder

RMBittner said:


> Not that it's at all helpful, but I'm wondering if this whole "Haven" issue might be related to specific cable providers. I'm on a small, independent cable co in mid-Michigan, and my "Haven" SP has picked up everything.
> 
> Bob


I'll just add in that my DirecTV DVR picked all the questionable Havens up just fine with no intervention.
There wasn't much in the description, so I'm thinking the DTV DVR must err on the side of caution and record just in case.

phox


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## lpwcomp

hybucket said:


> Well if you go by Zap2It's current listings online, none of the episodes for 9/30 have a "first-aired" date (for HAVEN).


That no longer seems to be the case. The only episode still missing a "First Aired" date is the one new episode for 9/30/.


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## hybucket

lpwcomp said:


> That no longer seems to be the case. The only episode still missing a "First Aired" date is the one new episode for 9/30/.


Yes you are correct. The one new episode for 9/30 is the season finale, so even if it doesn't show there, we don't have to worry about it again for a while.


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## lpwcomp

Still not there on my TiVo. I'll check again tomorrow.


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## wtkflhn

hybucket said:


> Just to keep this going, because I know how much fun some get from knocking TiVO, when I noticed that TiVO would not record "Haven," I set it to manually record the midnight showing. When I figured out what the problem was (the guide data), I changed the options in SP to record repeats and first run. Solved the problem for the time being. I also have problems with several BBCA shows which, because the data shows "original air date" as the date they were showed in the UK, not US, were not picked up as "new" by the TiVO. Yes, it's a glitch, but that's life. Seems to me that to just change the options makes a lot more sense than searching around for a replacement like iTunes or other such nonsense cause you're not getting one recording out of...how many..?
> And yes, I have notified Tribune and SyFy of this problem.


 I had this problem with "Friday Night Lights" when it ran on NBC. The guide data said it first ran last fall, but that was on Direct TV. The work around was to change the SP to record new and re-peats. That solved the problem. I've been watching the "To do List", te see if Haven shows up. When is doesn't, I go tell it to "record this show anyway".

Don H


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## AbMagFab

RMBittner said:


> This isn't possible. You can _buy_ episodes from iTunes for $2.99 each and download them to your iPod, iPad, PC/Mac -- and I'm a big fan of that -- but, as far as I'm aware, iTunes doesn't offer streaming. (Of course, you can also pick up missed episodes from Amazon right on your TiVo. And, if you're willing to wait a while, a lot of TV shows _are_ showing up for streaming on Netflix, but you won't typically get the current season.)
> 
> Not that it's at all helpful, but I'm wondering if this whole "Haven" issue might be related to specific cable providers. I'm on a small, independent cable co in mid-Michigan, and my "Haven" SP has picked up everything.
> 
> Bob


Yes iTunes absolutely does stream TV shows.

Buy an AppleTV2 (for $99), and then you can buy and stream shows directly from your TV - no download needed, no iTunes client needed. And you can do it as many times as you want - they keep a record of what you purchased, and you can stream (or download if you really want) as many times as your want, on any device attached to your account, including iPads, iPhones, etc.

I use Favorites on the AppleTV to replace my Season Pass list. It clearly displays, with pretty album, art, which shows have new episodes, and how many episodes are new. Then I just click in, and play the shows marked as not watched.


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## AbMagFab

lpwcomp said:


> I am saying that since you were aware of the problem and that there were options available to you to address it which you chose not to exercise, the failure to record the second time is far more your fault than TiVo's. You apparently preferred to keep it as an issue so you could continue to push your agenda, for whatever reason. Hmm... that seems like irrational behavior to me.
> 
> Maybe if more people were sending feedback to zapit and SYFY as I have done, the actual problem would get addressed.


If part of owning a Tivo is having to stay on top of forums like this, then Tivo has lost it's way, and it's no longer worth it. I bought a Tivo so I wouldn't have to manage my TV viewing.

Streaming is now real, and far more practical than all of us having pointless hard disks in each of our houses to record the exact same thing millions of times. Stream it once from the source (see my previous post).


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## Rob Helmerichs

lpwcomp said:


> Still not there on my TiVo. I'll check again tomorrow.


I changed my pass to FRO, and all the future showings dropped off.


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## RMBittner

AbMagFab said:


> Yes iTunes absolutely does stream TV shows.


Good to know. Thanks.

At the risk of taking this thread even further off-topic...

While I enjoy streaming Netflix to my iPad/TV, I'm not nearly as enamored with it as you are. Because, frankly, there's more available on TV -- on my hard drive, so to speak -- than there is in the cloud. Probably half of what I watch on a regular basis is not available on Amazon, iTunes, or Netflix. Sure, that may change in time. But for now, I'd rather have ownership of my viewing than rely on a third-party provider.

Bob


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## Rob Helmerichs

And it's nice to have most of my TV watching (foreign shows notwithstanding) available without having to do anything. And let's face it, this kind of glitch is extremely rare, at least for me.


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## hybucket

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I changed my pass to FRO, and all the future showings dropped off.


As of this moment, the Zap2It listings for SyFy show all the Sept. 30th daytime reruns of HAVEN have First Date Aired. However, the new episode and season finale at 10PM, they do not. For this week's episode (Sept 23), the 10PM listing does NOT list FDA....however, the repeat of it at midnight does. Go figure.
I sent an email to TiVO about the problem, but have yet to receive a reply.


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## Rob Helmerichs

As of this moment, on my TiVo this week's is now scheduled to record (which just happened today), but next week's isn't.


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## hybucket

Rob Helmerichs said:


> As of this moment, on my TiVo this week's is now scheduled to record (which just happened today), but next week's isn't.


Well, MY TiVO is scheduled to record this and next week's, but only because I added it manually and I'm not about to mess around with it at this point. It shouldn't be this much work...lol.


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## lpwcomp

AbMagFab said:


> If part of owning a Tivo is having to stay on top of forums like this, then Tivo has lost it's way, and it's no longer worth it. I bought a Tivo so I wouldn't have to manage my TV viewing.


You continue to be deliberately obtuse. What I said was that in THIS PARTICULAR INSTANCE YOU WERE AWARE OF THE PROBLEM!



AbMagFab said:


> Streaming is now real, and far more practical than all of us having pointless hard disks in each of our houses to record the exact same thing millions of times. Stream it once from the source (see my previous post).


And Streaming the same content millions of times is better?

Just sell your TiVos and go away.


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## lpwcomp

hybucket said:


> As of this moment, the Zap2It listings for SyFy show all the Sept. 30th daytime reruns of HAVEN have First Date Aired. However, the new episode and season finale at 10PM, they do not. For this week's episode (Sept 23), the 10PM listing does NOT list FDA....however, the repeat of it at midnight does. Go figure.
> I sent an email to TiVO about the problem, but have yet to receive a reply.


If you look at the "Full Episode Details", it is there for the 9/23 10PM showing. I looked at other shows identified as "NEW" and they were all like that.


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## hybucket

lpwcomp said:


> If you look at the "Full Episode Details", it is there for the 9/23 10PM showing. I looked at other shows identified as "NEW" and they were all like that.


It is listed in FED for the 23rd but not for the 30th. The Date First Aired is not, however, listed in the listings themselves for either episode, and I suspect that's what TiVO uses for its info.


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## lpwcomp

What I am saying is that I checked other shows that are marked new in zapit, like "Blue Bloods" and none of them had a "First Aired" date in the primary entry, only in the "Full Episode Details".

The 9/23 10PM showing of "Haven" has appeared in my "To Do List" and it has an "Original Air Date".


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## Johncv

The Wishlist caught it!!!! Haven Friend or Fuax will be repeated on Friday 9/30 at 11:00am pt. If you live on the East cost that may be around 0800. SyFy may be doing a marathon.


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## JoeTaxpayer

One TiVo now has the 9/23 just fine, and the 2PM episode on 9/30. But not the right show at 10PM on 9/30. 
Second TiVo misses 9/23 but has that 2PM 9/30.
Third TiVo (where I allowed repeats) will get the whole season 2 by next Friday night.

For those new to thread, this is not complaining, just sharing, and curious why #1 and #2 are not identical. Also curious what's special about that 2PM show on 9/30? 

The season is almost over for Haven, and this is the only show I've seen this glitch.


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## JoeTaxpayer

Johncv said:


> The Wishlist caught it!!!! Haven Friend or Faux will be repeated on Friday 9/30 at 11:00am pt. If you live on the East cost that may be around 0800. SyFy may be doing a marathon.


11am PT = 2pm ET , but I have to ask, this episode doesn't look familiar. Was it pre-empted or generally missed? I take it the TiVo thinks it's new.


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## lpwcomp

JoeTaxpayer said:


> 11am PT = 2pm ET , but I have to ask, this episode doesn't look familiar. Was it pre-empted or generally missed? I take it the TiVo thinks it's new.


It's the episode first aired on 9/2. The first one that "Haven" FRO SPs failed to pick up and this thread's raison d'être.


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## JoeTaxpayer

lpwcomp said:


> It's the episode first aired on 9/2. The first one that "Haven" FRO SPs failed to pick up and this thread's raison d'être.


Thanks, I thought I caught the issue prior to actually missing any. 
Bonus points for using the term _raison d'être_.


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## Rob Helmerichs

Looks like it's working as it should now (tonight's and next week's both scheduled to record on a FRO SP).

It will be interesting to see what happens when the last episode of the season makes it into the Guide Data!


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## lpwcomp

Not fixed on my TiVo yet but I see that it is fixed on Zapit so I should get it with the next d/l tomorrow morning. The interesting thing now, though not related to this problem, is that zapit has it identified as the "Finale" while IMDB has a new episode scheduled for 10/7, "Silent Night". Garn's Guides has a spot for a new episode after 9/30 but no Air Date or Title.

With that title, it might be a Christmas episode and not actually be shown until around then.


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## JoeTaxpayer

Just checking back in. The SP is now going to record both that missing 2PM (Friend of Faux) as well as the regular 10PM. 

I assume the 9/30 is the season finale.


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