# V53 and V58 Errors



## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

OK so let me get this straight. If I downgrade my Pro to a basic (yes I know the differences and its ok), I won't get anymore V58 errors because that's what I'm getting due to not being able to tune the extra 2 tuners on the plus/pro because of my crappy Cisco TA with old firmware. I will however still get the occasional V53 tuning error where it just fails to tune, right? I think I got that right, but now I'm just so damned confused I don't know which way is up anymore!


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## nws alpine (Nov 7, 2013)

HarperVision said:


> OK so let me get this straight. If I downgrade my Pro to a basic (yes I know the differences and its ok), I won't get anymore V58 errors because that's what I'm getting due to not being able to tune the extra 2 tuners on the plus/pro because of my crappy Cisco TA with old firmware. I will however still get the occasional V53 tuning error where it just fails to tune, right? I think I got that right, but now I'm just so damned confused I don't know which way is up anymore!


Well you can't use your cablecard with the basic so that may end that option. You can disable the tuners on the Pro until the fix rolls out early next year (guessing you are on Comcast).


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## AdamNJ (Aug 22, 2013)

nws alpine said:


> Well you can't use your cablecard with the basic so that may end that option.


Sorry, but that is totally wrong info.

The Roamio basic model is either ota (no cablecard inserted) or cable (cablecard inserted into the panel that opens on the bottom). So a cablecard totally does work with the basic 4 tuner model.


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## jwbelcher (Nov 13, 2007)

So what's the difference between a Basic and a Pro w/ 2 tuners disabled? You'd think not much in terms of the software, right? I know that my TivoHD with only 2 tuners (and very old software) never has these issues. It seems the folks with 2 tuner premiers claim the same thing.


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## grey ghost (Feb 2, 2010)

HarperVision said:


> OK so let me get this straight. If I downgrade my Pro to a basic (yes I know the differences and its ok), I won't get anymore V58 errors because that's what I'm getting due to not being able to tune the extra 2 tuners on the plus/pro because of my crappy Cisco TA with old firmware. I will however still get the occasional V53 tuning error where it just fails to tune, right? I think I got that right, but now I'm just so damned confused I don't know which way is up anymore!


Harper, I've got a Plus and was constantly getting v58 errors. I'm running a Comcast Cisco cablecard with 1.5.2 Fp1401 firmware. A week and a half ago, I downgraded to 5 tuners and have not experienced any problems since then. I hope this continues.

I'm still harassing Comcast about the firmware upgrade so that I can use all 6 tuners, but at least right now, I'm able to use my Tivo consistently and I'm not holding my breath every time I switch channels.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

jwbelcher said:


> So what's the difference between a Basic and a Pro w/ 2 tuners disabled? You'd think not much in terms of the software, right? I know that my TivoHD with only 2 tuners (and very old software) never has these issues. It seems the folks with 2 tuner premiers claim the same thing.


Exactly my point. Why on earth would I want to pay the premium for the pro when I don't need moca, I can't stream hardly anything outside the home due to oceanic time warner and their wonderful copy protection on everything except locals, so I use a Slingbox and Vulkano like I always have. I checked my busiest night of recording and I think 4 tuners should suffice and I'm more of a watch and delete kinda guy, so huge storage isn't that big of a deal either. If it does become an issue I can always throw in a bigger drive though. Other than that, why would I pay $400+ more for the pro, when it seems like the basic now at $150 should suffice?

To top it off I'm seriously considering cutting the cord in the not too distant future and the basic with the OTA tuner may come in handy for that as well. I'm actually even considering trying the new dual tuner Simple.TV and dumping TiVo all together. I really think there's more than meets the eye under the surface with TiVo. It seems there's more strange issues and things going on that makes me feel real uneasy with them. I really wish MS would've kept WMC development going and would've matured that incredible solution further. Oh well.......


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

grey ghost said:


> Harper, I've got a Plus and was constantly getting v58 errors. I'm running a Comcast Cisco cablecard with 1.5.2 Fp1401 firmware. A week and a half ago, I downgraded to 5 tuners and have not experienced any problems since then. I hope this continues.
> 
> I'm still harassing Comcast about the firmware upgrade so that I can use all 6 tuners, but at least right now, I'm able to use my Tivo consistently and I'm not holding my breath every time I switch channels.


I use Cisco CC and TA as well. My FW is 1.5.3 fp0601. I've been downgraded to 5 tuners for months now, since Margret posted it. I still get black screens and V53 errors. I don't know about you, but I feel duped that I bought this 6 tuner Mercedes but am told I can only drive a 4 tuner Kia Rio for the time being while my nice car is in the shop for recall repairs that God knows may or may never be completely fixed! As I've said in numerous other posts, Ceton fixed the same issue for me in less than 24 hours!!!


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## DigitalDawn (Apr 26, 2009)

grey ghost said:


> Harper, I've got a Plus and was constantly getting v58 errors. I'm running a Comcast Cisco cablecard with 1.5.2 Fp1401 firmware. A week and a half ago, I downgraded to 5 tuners and have not experienced any problems since then. I hope this continues.
> 
> I'm still harassing Comcast about the firmware upgrade so that I can use all 6 tuners, but at least right now, I'm able to use my Tivo consistently and I'm not holding my breath every time I switch channels.


If you can at least get Comcast to update your card to 2401, it would be a huge improvement using 4 tuners.


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## grey ghost (Feb 2, 2010)

DigitalDawn said:


> If you can at least get Comcast to update your card to 2401, it would be a huge improvement using 4 tuners.


Yea, I don't want a firmware upgrade until I can get the 1.5.3.1101 upgrade. At least this way, I can use 5 of my 6 tuners. I don't want to "upgrade" to 1.5.2.2401 and actually lose a tuner.


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## grey ghost (Feb 2, 2010)

HarperVision said:


> I use Cisco CC and TA as well. My FW is 1.5.3 fp0601. I've been downgraded to 5 tuners for months now, since Margret posted it. I still get black screens and V53 errors. I don't know about you, but I feel duped that I bought this 6 tuner Mercedes but am told I can only drive a 4 tuner Kia Rio for the time being while my nice car is in the shop for recall repairs that God knows may or may never be completely fixed! As I've said in numerous other posts, Ceton fixed the same issue for me in less than 24 hours!!!


I share your frustration about Comcast not upgrading firmware like they should. Your machine is still a Mercedes. The road it's on just doesn't allow it to go as fast as we would all like.

I'm with Comcast too, but I don't have to use/never had to use a TA. Is that only for certain systems?


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

grey ghost said:


> I share your frustration about Comcast not upgrading firmware like they should. Your machine is still a Mercedes. The road it's on just doesn't allow it to go as fast as we would all like.
> 
> I'm with Comcast too, but I don't have to use/never had to use a TA. Is that only for certain systems?


Thanks for the support! I'm on Oceanic Time Warner, not Comcast. Yes the TA is used for systems that have deployed switched digital video (SDV) to save bandwidth for digital channels while maintaining their old legacy analog channels for those still stuck in 1996. 

Basically it's a way for them to fit 10 lbs of crap into a 5 lb sack.


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## JohnParks (Sep 20, 2013)

I too have V58 issues using a Cisco TA and CC (1.5.2-Fp.2401) and a Roamo+, but am a Charter cable subscriber. Would deactivating a turner work for me? If so how does one go about doing that?


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## grey ghost (Feb 2, 2010)

JohnParks said:


> I too have V58 issues using a Cisco TA and CC (1.5.2-Fp.2401) and a Roamo+, but am a Charter cable subscriber. Would deactivating a turner work for me? If so how does one go about doing that?


Go to the linked thread and look at post #40
Reduce # of tuners


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## JohnParks (Sep 20, 2013)

Thanks for your for help Gray. The turner reduction didn't see to help. Haven't had any luck with Charter on cc firmware upgrade.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

JohnParks said:


> .... The turner reduction didn't see to help. ....


Is that where you go in and delete TBS and TNT from your channel list? Oh no, that's right, the TiVo Roamio does that for you already whether you like it or not!


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## grey ghost (Feb 2, 2010)

DigitalDawn said:


> If you can at least get Comcast to update your card to 2401, it would be a huge improvement using 4 tuners.


Dawn, I'm currently using 5 tuners. Why would I "upgrade" to 2401 when I know that I would only get 4 tuners and it would not give me any more reliable Tivo service? Should I have turned my sarcasm meter on??


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## DigitalDawn (Apr 26, 2009)

No sarcasm meter necessary 

In PBC 2401 is just a lot more stable than 1401. I would rather have less tuners but better and more consistent tuning.

If you aren't having any tuning problems then stay at your current firmware. If you are having tuning troubles you could also try using 5 tuners on 2401. I never tried it, but it may work for you.


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## BobCamp1 (May 15, 2002)

JohnParks said:


> Thanks for your for help Gray. The turner reduction didn't see to help. Haven't had any luck with Charter on cc firmware upgrade.


You need to reboot after entering those codes.


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## barrett14 (Aug 21, 2013)

I have been getting V53 and V58 errors as well. Tivo is sending me a new box but based on what I am reading, I am not sure if that will fix it. I am using a Cisco cable card from Charter. 

How do I disable tuners to see if this fixes it? What else can I do?

p.s. - Tivo is blaming the issue on my Signal Strength and SNR being too high... even though I have used attenuators to bring them down.


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## aristoBrat (Dec 30, 2002)

barrett14 said:


> How do I disable tuners to see if this fixes it?


Post 13 above has a link to the thread where that's discussed.


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## grey ghost (Feb 2, 2010)

barrett14 said:


> I have been getting V53 and V58 errors as well. Tivo is sending me a new box but based on what I am reading, I am not sure if that will fix it. I am using a Cisco cable card from Charter.
> 
> How do I disable tuners to see if this fixes it? What else can I do?
> 
> p.s. - Tivo is blaming the issue on my Signal Strength and SNR being too high... even though I have used attenuators to bring them down.


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=507973&page=2


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## aristoBrat (Dec 30, 2002)

barrett14, in case the URL above starts you with post #41 being the top of the page (which is what it did for me), you're looking for post #40. 

Everyone can have a different "posts per page" display setting, which can cause people to land in different parts of the thread when clicking on URLs that refer to specific pages.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

aristoBrat said:


> barrett14, in case the URL above starts you with post #41 being the top of the page (which is what it did for me), you're looking for post #40.
> 
> Everyone can have a different "posts per page" display setting, which can cause people to land in different parts of the thread when clicking on URLs that refer to specific pages.


Very true, and very often overlooked.

I have my posts/page set to the max, not the default, PLUS I have the highest numbered post first (listed in descending order). So every time somebody says below/above, it's the opposite for me...


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## pshivers (Nov 4, 2013)

JohnParks said:


> I too have V58 issues using a Cisco TA and CC (1.5.2-Fp.2401) and a Roamo+, but am a Charter cable subscriber. Would deactivating a turner work for me? If so how does one go about doing that?





barrett14 said:


> I have been getting V53 and V58 errors as well. Tivo is sending me a new box but based on what I am reading, I am not sure if that will fix it. I am using a Cisco cable card from Charter.
> 
> How do I disable tuners to see if this fixes it? What else can I do?
> 
> p.s. - Tivo is blaming the issue on my Signal Strength and SNR being too high... even though I have used attenuators to bring them down.


I am a Charter Cable Customer in Sunny Southern California (San Gabriel Valley) and am also running a Cisco CC at 1.5.2-Fp.2401 (I think all Charter Cisco cards are at this firmware release), Charter still uses a TA.

I set my Tivo Roamio Pro up for 5 tuners to correct the V58 errors about a month ago and have had zero tuning problems since that change.

It would be nice if Charter would come into the current decade and upgrade the firmware to the current release (1.5.3-Fp.1101??? ) and eliminate the TA altogether, as far as I know Charter is all digital now so I don't think there is a real need for the TA anymore.

I am adding a total of 4 Tivo Mini's to my system, but I have stopped at 2 right now. I will add the 3rd and 4th Mini when I am able to use all 6 tuners on the Roamio.

I am still very pleased with the Roamio Pro, it is a HUGE improvement over the Cisco DVR's that Charter offers even with only 5 usable tuners.

From another Post to change the number of active tuners on your Roamio:

Go to Settings > Channels > Channel List
and enter one of the following number sequences using the number buttons on the remote. This will tell Roamio the how many tuners it can use.
- 88633 = use 3 tuners
- 88634 = use 4 tuners
- 88635 = use 5 tuners
- 88636 = use 6 tuners
Then force a reboot of the tivo:
tivo >> settings >> help >> restart


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## JohnParks (Sep 20, 2013)

I had to give up two tuners, but so far no more V58 errors on the Roamio+. Now to get charter to up-date the cc firmware.


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## barrett14 (Aug 21, 2013)

So is this issue with the Charter cable cards and not with the Tivo? Why is Tivo tech support blaming the signal strength and/or SNR on this?


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

barrett14 said:


> So is this issue with the Charter cable cards and not with the Tivo? Why is Tivo tech support blaming the signal strength and/or SNR on this?


Here's some "tech-babble":

All I can tell you, for sure, is that TiVo measures (calculates) SNR in a way different than the rest of nearly all related industry/companies. Also, rather than measure Signal Strength in dBmV, like the cable companies, and most others do, they use a 0-100 scale, where 100 means 0 dBmV, or higher (positive) value, and anything lower than 100 is something that would be a negative dBmV value (negative is not bad, in dBmV terms, until it hits a threshold, which varies).

If they'd just stick to the standards that have been in place for a long, long, time, which nearly everybody else uses, we wouldn't give the impression that all TiVo users are idiots, when saying "we need 36 or less SNR". If TiVo measured/calculated in the way nearly everybody else does, "the higher the SNR, the better" would be true, as it seems to be with everything except TiVo.

For a non "tech-babble" explanation, and a better answer to your question, do some reading here, and in TiVo's knowledge base section.

I'm sure somebody will come along, and give you a more direct, and less technical explanation, than I did, and/or post links to direct you to posts and KB articles that better explain this. I don't have them bookmarked, so I can't, without hunting them down again. Sorry.


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## pshivers (Nov 4, 2013)

In a word Yes! The Cisco cable card firmware is outdated and needs to be updated to the current release by Cisco. That will not happen until Charter finishes their approval process and sends out the update, (Could be a very long wait). 

I have found that most support personnel (TiVo and Charter) are not current on Tivo problems like these and rely on the script they follow while trying to diagnose your problem. The 6 tuner problem being caused by out of date CableCard firmware does not come up as a diagnosis... Most Field Techs go through similar "canned" steps when they come to your home to try and "Fix" the problem, and are not aware that it will not be fixed unless the Firmware is updated, something they can't do anyway... At least they do usually eliminate any other possible problems while they are there with your cable service.

When I first reported the problem, Charter Service was convinced the problem could not be the CableCard at all... They swapped out 4 TA's, ran separate drops from the outside, bypassed my internal cabling, eliminated the cable pass-thru on the TA using a splitter instead, verified that that signal strength was good at all connection points. It wasn't until they (Charter) and I both started doing Internet searches and found articles in the Tivo Community describing the problem and recent solution that they finally concluded that the Cisco CableCard Firmware needed to be upgraded.


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## barrett14 (Aug 21, 2013)

Is it possible to buy an updated cable card on your own or is the only option to wait for Charter? How will you know when Charter releases the new firmware? 

p.s. - I reduced my tuners from 6 to 5 but its still doing it. I have not tried 4 tuners yet.


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## AdamNJ (Aug 22, 2013)

barrett14 said:


> Is it possible to buy an updated cable card on your own or is the only option to wait for Charter? How will you know when Charter releases the new firmware?
> 
> p.s. - I reduced my tuners from 6 to 5 but its still doing it. I have not tried 4 tuners yet.


You have to wait for charter (or bother them) for them to get on the ball. At least one person here has bought a card off ebay, but they are not generally available and more importantly your cable co probably won't allow/install it on it's network.


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## pshivers (Nov 4, 2013)

barrett14 said:


> Is it possible to buy an updated cable card on your own or is the only option to wait for Charter? How will you know when Charter releases the new firmware?
> 
> p.s. - I reduced my tuners from 6 to 5 but its still doing it. I have not tried 4 tuners yet.


Make sure you restart your Tivo Box after changing the number of active tuners. The change will not work properly without a restart.



AdamNJ said:


> You have to wait for charter (or bother them) for them to get on the ball. At least one person here has bought a card off ebay, but they are not generally available and more importantly your cable co probably won't allow/install it on it's network.


Even if you do get a "Aftermarket" CableCard to work, once the Cable company sees it on their network they will automatically install the Firmware they are using, in this case the Firmware would be downgraded.

I have not seen it yet, but it is my understanding you will see a message on your Tivo the CableCard is being updated. Of course if this process occurs and finished while your asleep you may never know the update has occurred. You can go into Setting and view what Firmware release you have at anytime.


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## barrett14 (Aug 21, 2013)

Well I hooked up the new Tivo that they sent me... Immediately had V53 and V58 errors again. I switched the numbers of tuners to 4 and now its working... We will see if it stays that way. 

I don't know why Tivo wasn't prepared for the fact that Charter doesn't have a 6 tuner cable card? Not once did Tivo tech support say that this could have been the issue.


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## nws alpine (Nov 7, 2013)

barrett14 said:


> Well I hooked up the new Tivo that they sent me... Immediately had V53 and V58 errors again. I switched the numbers of tuners to 4 and now its working... We will see if it stays that way.
> 
> I don't know why Tivo wasn't prepared for the fact that Charter doesn't have a 6 tuner cable card? Not once did Tivo tech support say that this could have been the issue.


The cablecard is multistream and can decode 6 channels at the same time. The problem is the firmware that Charter supplies is not the latest and does not work properly. This is not a Tivo issue. Tivo does supply a temp workaround by at least allowing you to disable the tuners.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

nws alpine said:


> The cablecard is multistream and can decode 6 channels at the same time. The problem is the firmware that Charter supplies is not the latest and does not work properly. This is not a Tivo issue. Tivo does supply a temp workaround by at least allowing you to disable the tuners.


I'm pretty sure that was built into them the day they started selling them.

Then when it became clear it was necessary, they posted the remote sequences to use that "workaround".

TiVo was likely hoping for the best, but expecting the worst. Good thing they had that contingency plan in place.

The time between first reports of the problem, and the posting of the sequence codes was too close for it to not already be in the software, IMHO.


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## barrett14 (Aug 21, 2013)

nws alpine said:


> The cablecard is multistream and can decode 6 channels at the same time. The problem is the firmware that Charter supplies is not the latest and does not work properly. This is not a Tivo issue. Tivo does supply a temp workaround by at least allowing you to disable the tuners.


I have been dealing with these V53 and V58 errors since I bought this thing on the day it came out. After calling Tivo numerous times, they kept blaming it on the signal strength... It took me digging through these forums to figure out that my cable card couldn't handle 6 tuners. Tivo should have tried this fix with me when I called them.


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## jntc (Dec 5, 2013)

Is there a way to definitively confirm whether or not the cablecard/company can support 6 tuners?

I've had 5 shows recording and able to switch live tv channels with no problems, indicating that I can do 6 tuners.

However, I'm plague with random, but frequent (~60%) v58 errors when changing channels.

I can switch up and down a few channels, and 'sometimes' the v58 channel(s) will tune right in. It's on both premier, regular, HD and non-HD channels across the board.

I'm just about ready to box all this up (roamio plus and 3 minis) and go back to the dreaded comcast dvr boxes. (At least I could reliably tune a channel)


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## jwbelcher (Nov 13, 2007)

jntc said:


> Is there a way to definitively confirm whether or not the cablecard/company can support 6 tuners?
> 
> I've had 5 shows recording and able to switch live tv channels with no problems, indicating that I can do 6 tuners.
> 
> ...


Has reducing tuner count helped out at all? If so, I'd think that would confirmed it. I also have v58 issues. However, for me, it pops up after being on a channel for a while.


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## jimmypowder (Oct 24, 2013)

V58 error this morning trying to watch A Christmas Story on TBS !! 

Can't wait for the C133 error to show up later 

Merry Christmas Tivo !


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## jntc (Dec 5, 2013)

jwbelcher said:


> Has reducing tuner count helped out at all? If so, I'd think that would confirmed it. I also have v58 issues. However, for me, it pops up after being on a channel for a while.


No reducing the tuners does not help at all. I'd say a good 60-70% of the time, I get v58's on various channels.

I've got to say, I'm about fed up with all of this. As much as I hate Comcast DVR's (especially the old SA's we're stuck with in our county) I never had a tuning problem with them.


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## jimmypowder (Oct 24, 2013)

jntc said:


> No reducing the tuners does not help at all. I'd say a good 60-70% of the time, I get v58's on various channels. I've got to say, I'm about fed up with all of this. As much as I hate Comcast DVR's (especially the old SA's we're stuck with in our county) I never had a tuning problem with them.


Yep never had a tuning problem with a SA box .

It's a shame they are awful otherwise


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

DirecTV Genies are good, as well as Dish Hoppers/Joeys. Better than cable DVRs but not quite a TiVo (when they're working properly).


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## barrett14 (Aug 21, 2013)

Update on my situation: I stopped getting V53 and V58 errors after I cut it down to 4 tuners. (Using Charter) 

Everything is working perfectly (except having 4 tuners instead of 6 but that doesn't really bother me.


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## jwbelcher (Nov 13, 2007)

barrett14 said:


> Update on my situation: I stopped getting V53 and V58 errors after I cut it down to 4 tuners. (Using Charter)
> 
> Everything is working perfectly (except having 4 tuners instead of 6 but that doesn't really bother me.


What's Cisco firmware version they have you on?


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## mburnno (Oct 1, 2003)

jimmypowder said:


> V58 error this morning trying to watch A Christmas Story on TBS !!
> 
> Can't wait for the C133 error to show up later
> 
> Merry Christmas Tivo !


LOL, I was thinking the exact same thing! It's bad when Tivo gets this predictable.


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## mburnno (Oct 1, 2003)

HarperVision said:


> OK so let me get this straight. If I downgrade my Pro to a basic (yes I know the differences and its ok), I won't get anymore V58 errors because that's what I'm getting due to not being able to tune the extra 2 tuners on the plus/pro because of my crappy Cisco TA with old firmware. I will however still get the occasional V53 tuning error where it just fails to tune, right? I think I got that right, but now I'm just so damned confused I don't know which way is up anymore!


If my memory is correct, I believe Tivo Marget posted codes on how to disable the number of Tuners your Tivo will use. This should stop the error messages you are receiving. I say *should* because you never know with Tivo.

You should be able to use the codes listed below:

Settings --> Channels --> Channel List

88633 = use 3 tuners
88634 = use 4 tuners
88635 = use 5 tuners
88636 = use 6 tuners

Reboot when done setting # of tuners


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

mburnno said:


> If my memory is correct, I believe Tivo Marget posted codes on how to disable the number of Tuners your Tivo will use. This should stop the error messages you are receiving. I say should because you never know with Tivo.
> 
> You should be able to use the codes listed below:
> 
> ...


Thanks for the suggestion, but I did that the day it was posted, months ago. The whole point of me starting this thread was questioning why I should pay so much for a six tuner Cadillac when all it was capable of was being a 4-5 tuner Kia. Last I checked I purchased a six tuner DVR, so why should I not expect to at least get what I paid for? (FYI, the latest firmware appears to have fixed a lot of the mis-tunes, time will tell)


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## jwbelcher (Nov 13, 2007)

HarperVision said:


> Thanks for the suggestion, but I did that the day it was posted, months ago. The whole point of me starting this thread was questioning why I should pay so much for a six tuner Cadillac when all it was capable of was being a 4-5 tuner Kia. Last I checked I purchased a six tuner DVR, so why should I not expect to at least get what I paid for? (FYI, the latest firmware appears to have fixed a lot of the mis-tunes, time will tell)


Dave - Have you noticed any pattern getting the V58 error? I'm also running 1.5.3 0601 and its almost silly how predictable its gotten. I get V58 literally every ~56 mins on tuner 5. I can set a clock to it. I just started watching tuner 6 to see if it occurs there too.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

jwbelcher said:


> Dave - Have you noticed any pattern getting the V58 error? I'm also running 1.5.3 0601 and its almost silly how predictable its gotten. I get V58 literally every ~56 mins on tuner 5. I can set a clock to it. I just started watching tuner 6 to see if it occurs there too.


While I'm not Dave, and I only have a 4-tuner base Roamios, I could also set a clock to all three of them seemingly "timing-out" into an automatic state of requiring me to manually re-acquire the channel.

I think it could be by design, and perhaps a cross-platform cause of additional problems for those with 6-tuner models.

I keep up to date with all the platforms' issues, as best I can.


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## jwbelcher (Nov 13, 2007)

nooneuknow said:


> While I'm not Dave, and I only have a 4-tuner base Roamios, I could also set a clock to all three of them seemingly "timing-out" into an automatic state of requiring me to manually re-acquire the channel.
> 
> I think it could be by design, and perhaps a cross-platform cause of additional problems for those with 6-tuner models.
> 
> I keep up to date with all the platforms' issues, as best I can.


FWIW, I haven't had to re-tune when getting this time-out. Usually video freezes (doesn't effect audio) and then recovers. I wonder if its re-authorizing or performing a CP key rotation on a periodic basis.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

jwbelcher said:


> FWIW, I haven't had to re-tune when getting this time-out. Usually video freezes (doesn't effect audio) and then recovers. I wonder if its re-authorizing or performing a CP key rotation on a periodic basis.


I swear I read somewhere that SDV is designed to de-authorize idle tuners in order to make SDV work as designed (or keep it working as designed). It seems to make some sense, that if many multi-tuner devices were allowed to sit idly on SDV frequencies, the whole premise of SDV RF networking could become overloaded (maybe?)...

My TA and, more easily, kmttg can tell me what state my tuners and DVRs are in (idle, foreground, background, live buffering, recording, standby, etc.), which also seems to give an appearance of there being a means, and possibly a demand, for knowing if devices actually need-to-be authorized after a period of time.

This kind of makes the "What To Watch Now" feature less useful. I've also noticed an absence of a Live TV buffer on SDV channels that I leave idle, whether foreground, or background. If I press Pause or Play on such a buffer-less, but displaying (still authorized, at least somewhat) channel, it begins buffering at the moment I press the buttons, but does not backfill the buffer.

This development didn't happen until the last month, or so (that I've noticed). As long as scheduled recordings are able to re-acquire/re-authorize a channel that's gone "timeout", I guess I can live with it.


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## jwbelcher (Nov 13, 2007)

nooneuknow said:


> I swear I read somewhere that SDV is designed to de-authorize idle tuners in order to make SDV work as designed (or keep it working as designed). It seems to make some sense, that if many multi-tuner devices were allowed to sit idly on SDV frequencies, the whole premise of SDV RF networking could become overloaded (maybe?)...
> 
> My TA and, more easily, kmttg can tell me what state my tuners and DVRs are in (idle, foreground, background, live buffering, recording, standby, etc.), which also seems to give an appearance of there being a means, and possibly a demand, for knowing if devices actually need-to-be authorized after a period of time.


Recently I noticed that SDV channels don't go idle / de-auth unless they're the foreground tuner. If the SDV channel is in the background, it seems to stay active and buffering. I haven't been tracking the SDV states; I'll need to get kmttg setup to tell me this stuff to make it easier to correlate.



> This kind of makes the "What To Watch Now" feature less useful. I've also noticed an absence of a Live TV buffer on SDV channels that I leave idle, whether foreground, or background. If I press Pause or Play on such a buffer-less, but displaying (still authorized, at least somewhat) channel, it begins buffering at the moment I press the buttons, but does not backfill the buffer.
> 
> This development didn't happen until the last month, or so (that I've noticed). As long as scheduled recordings are able to re-acquire/re-authorize a channel that's gone "timeout", I guess I can live with it.


I've noticed this too for SDV channels. The live buffer doesn't accumulate properly after getting the "press SELECT to tune it again" screen message. Once you get this message, Tivo's buffer is reset / erased under these conditions :
1) Pressing SELECT to tune again (as expected)
2) Pressing Tivo button with Preview enabled in the Discovery Bar
3) Pressing Live button to exit Tivo Central (or any menus) to go back to watching live t.v.​
For some reason, after the channel is de-authorized, Tivo now gets into a weird state on that tuner. Any time the video is re-rendered, the buffer gets zapped out. From what I found, the only time this doesn't happen is pressing Guide / then Zoom to exit. The only way to reset the tuner so your buffer isn't zapped by pressing Tivo or Live buttons is to change channels. By looking at the DVR diagnostics, pressing Live or Tivo buttons, is causing the channel to tune again, it shows that both the seconds since tune and resolution time are both reset. If this tuner happens to be recording at the time, and you press the Tivo button, it will stop the recording causing it to fail.

Also, one major annoyance, the popup to "press SELECT" to re-acquire goes away when pressing various other buttons. Then if you press clear, your left with a blank screen waiting for the popup to come back to re-tune. And if you don't wait for the "press SELECT" popup, and go ahead and press the select button, it brings up the mini guide. Doh! frustrating.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

jwbelcher said:


> Doh! frustrating.


I really can't add too much more at this point. Except, yeah, more frustrating than the level of frustration before the timeout period started happening (suspiciously close to the same time I moved cablecards around and called to get them paired-up properly again)...

The trouble with knowing exactly what is going of with background channels, is they are in the background. Bringing them to the foreground makes them no longer in the background, obviously...

kmttg reports the "what's on" status as "loopset", when I let the foreground tuner idle-timeout and lose its buffer.


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## jwbelcher (Nov 13, 2007)

nooneuknow said:


> kmttg reports the "what's on" status as "loopset", when I let the foreground tuner idle-timeout and lose its buffer.


Do you have to enable suggestions to get the "what's on" to record? Sorry to hijack


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

jwbelcher said:


> Do you have to enable suggestions to get the "what's on" to record? Sorry to hijack


Suggestions have never been enabled of any TiVo I have every owned.

"What's On" is just an entry for what is being sent to the TV screen in kmttg.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

jwbelcher said:


> Dave - Have you noticed any pattern getting the V58 error? I'm also running 1.5.3 0601 and its almost silly how predictable its gotten. I get V58 literally every ~56 mins on tuner 5. I can set a clock to it. I just started watching tuner 6 to see if it occurs there too.


Not that I'm aware of, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. When I actually do have the time to test it, I usually just set 5 SDV HD channels to record and then channel surf with the remaining tuner, where occasionally I'd see a channel that fails to tune. I have to admit though, the latest FW seems to have made a big improvement so far, although I haven't had time to test rigorously yet.


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## mburnno (Oct 1, 2003)

HarperVision said:


> Not that I'm aware of, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen. When I actually do have the time to test it, I usually just set 5 SDV HD channels to record and then channel surf with the remaining tuner, where occasionally I'd see a channel that fails to tune. I have to admit though, the latest FW seems to have made a big improvement so far, although I haven't had time to test rigorously yet.


Hate to say it HarperVision, it seems like you have joined the crowd of Tivo users who have experienced nothing but frustration including myself. As much as I like Tivo when it is working properly, I hate it even more than the Cable DVR when it doesn't. There are times that I wish I could throw this damn DVR out the window or kick the design team in the ass. But that wouldn't really solve anything, plus I would more than likely get charged with a felon and its not worth that.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

mburnno said:


> Hate to say it HarperVision, it seems like you have joined the crowd of Tivo users who have experienced nothing but frustration including myself. As much as I like Tivo when it is working properly, I hate it even more than the Cable DVR when it doesn't. There are times that I wish I could throw this damn DVR out the window or kick the design team in the ass. But that wouldn't really solve anything, plus I would more than likely get charged with a felon and its not worth that.


Like I said, the latest FW was a big improvement for me, and I don't recall having hardly any Tuning errors in normal viewing scenarios now. I do have that feeling like "why did I bother, I should've just stayed with DirecTV" though. I think it's because of the money invested. It's better than dtv, but doesn't seem THAT much better or worth all the hassles, if you catch my drift.


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## jwbelcher (Nov 13, 2007)

HarperVision said:


> Like I said, the latest FW was a big improvement for me, and I don't recall having hardly any Tuning errors in normal viewing scenarios now.


Have you had any V58 errors since 20.3.8? I am on 20.3.7 still and asked to hang back since both a TA and CableCARD fw update was anticipated on my cable. My SDV has been flawless since, but I'm still waiting for the CC update and haven't heard anything about a new time frame. I'm starting to think that I should request the 20.3.8 and get current.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

jwbelcher said:


> Have you had any V58 errors since 20.3.8? I am on 20.3.7 still and asked to hang back since both a TA and CableCARD fw update was anticipated on my cable. My SDV has been flawless since, but I'm still waiting for the CC update and haven't heard anything about a new time frame. I'm starting to think that I should request the 20.3.8 and get current.


20.3.8 for as long as it's been available, still getting them (V58 through V52 and other ones that either don't have a Vxx error number, or there's no displayed error, but there should be.)

Three base Roamios, all w/cablecards and TAs.

Cisco STA1520 TA, PKM80x cablecards, on "current" firmware (not the newest firmware versions being tested in small regions, which are not being officially rolled-out just yet). Cox Cable Market in NV.


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## jwbelcher (Nov 13, 2007)

nooneuknow said:


> 20.3.8 for as long as it's been available, still getting them (V58 through V52 and other ones that either don't have a Vxx error number, or there's no displayed error, but there should be.)
> 
> Three base Roamios, all w/cablecards and TAs.
> 
> Cisco STA1520 TA, PKM80x cablecards, on "current" firmware (not the newest firmware versions being tested in small regions, which are not being officially rolled-out just yet). Cox Cable Market in NV.


Ugh. V58 alone is driving me nuts and I'm too stubborn to reduce tuner count.

On a better note, I would recommend asking for the new TA FW : STA1.0.0_1520_LF_F.1901.

Many of the random issues that had no way to reliably reproduce seem to be MUCH better.

I've not seen these since the BHN TA FW update on 12/13/2013 (and running 20.3.7) :

Black screen when changing channels 
Missed recordings due to no signal
V52 / V53 signal errors
Error where channel tunes, but then a unavailable popup after a few seconds
Repeated "unavailable" errors when pressing SELECT to re-acquire
I'm sure 20.3.8 reduces the occurrences for some of these, but not sure about all the other _bizarre_ stuff that was going on with the TA.


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## Xabanero (Dec 12, 2013)

jwbelcher said:


> Ugh. V58 alone is driving me nuts and I'm too stubborn to reduce tuner count.
> 
> I've not seen these since the BHN TA FW update on 12/13/2013 (and running 20.3.7) :
> 
> ...


I've had my Roamio+ for about a month and had no issues until about a week ago when all my channels completely blacked out. Pulled plug and rebooted and *most* of my channels came back but I still have several that say something like "Channel not available. Contact cable provider."

It's driving me nuts and I'm missing recorded shows.


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## Wiggum (Jun 11, 2004)

Does anyone know the latest version for the NDS M-Card for cablevision? 
Mine says NDS s/w 3.92.15 Oct 08, 2013 18:20:55
H/W model 0900 Ver 0010
OS ver Vguard 3.0.8_F.p.0601


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

I am still getting V53 and V58 errors on Cox and I am losing recordings. I find it intolerable that the TiVo will just not record something and then never tell the user there was a problem.

At least once a week (sometimes much more often) I come home and turn on the TV, there is a "V53" error on whatever was being tuned "live". Sometimes I can press up chan then down chan and it will fix it. Other times I have to power cycle the stupid tuning adapter- which I CAN NOT DO if something is actually recording, because I will lose all recordings in progress.

Are other people still having these nightmares? Is there some kind of definitive guide to dealing with this? Today, I can't tune EpixHD at all, although I can tune most other channels, including SDV ones. I finally gave up and power cycled the tuning adapter and now I can tune EpixHD again. I am almost tempted to put some type of timer on the adapter's plug to power cycle it every night.


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## pshivers (Nov 4, 2013)

crxssi said:


> I am still getting V53 and V58 errors on Cox and I am losing recordings. I find it intolerable that the TiVo will just not record something and then never tell the user there was a problem.
> 
> At least once a week (sometimes much more often) I come home and turn on the TV, there is a "V53" error on whatever was being tuned "live". Sometimes I can press up chan then down chan and it will fix it. Other times I have to power cycle the stupid tuning adapter- which I CAN NOT DO if something is actually recording, because I will lose all recordings in progress.
> 
> Are other people still having these nightmares? Is there some kind of definitive guide to dealing with this? Today, I can't tune EpixHD at all, although I can tune most other channels, including SDV ones. I finally gave up and power cycled the tuning adapter and now I can tune EpixHD again. I am almost tempted to put some type of timer on the adapter's plug to power cycle it every night.





pshivers said:


> I am a Charter Cable Customer in Sunny Southern California (San Gabriel Valley) and am also running a Cisco CC at 1.5.2-Fp.2401 (I think all Charter Cisco cards are at this firmware release), Charter still uses a TA.
> 
> I set my Tivo Roamio Pro up for 5 tuners to correct the V58 errors about a month ago and have had zero tuning problems since that change.
> 
> ...


The issue you are having has been resolved for many months now.

Check your Firmware release on your CableCard and make sure it is at 153.1101, I am assuming you have a Cisco or SA CableCard.

If the firmware is older than this you will need to follow the instructions above to reduce your Tivo to 4 or 5 tuners until your Cable Company can upgrade or replace the Cable Card to the required firmware release level.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

pshivers said:


> The issue you are having has been resolved for many months now *[but only for...]* I am assuming you have a Cisco or SA CableCard.


This is a Motorola cable card and Motorola tuning adapter on Cox.


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## overFEDEXed (Nov 11, 2002)

crxssi said:


> This is a Motorola cable card and Motorola tuning adapter on Cox.


I have the same Cox cable, Motorola cable cards and TA's, with the V53/V58 errors now.
I had them once in a while until recently, when I noticed it every few days.

Nothing has changed in my setup except that I was missing some channels and called Cox cable. They said that my Host ID info on both cable cards/Tivos was hosed. Anyway, they fixed it, I got my channels back and now I get the errors. I even missed some recordings last night. I takes a reboot to clear it most of the time.

I should have left well enough alone, or did Cox do something with the cable cards?


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## tds4182 (Dec 16, 2003)

grey ghost said:


> Harper, I've got a Plus and was constantly getting v58 errors. I'm running a Comcast Cisco cablecard with 1.5.2 Fp1401 firmware. A week and a half ago, I downgraded to 5 tuners and have not experienced any problems since then. I hope this continues.
> 
> I'm still harassing Comcast about the firmware upgrade so that I can use all 6 tuners, but at least right now, I'm able to use my Tivo consistently and I'm not holding my breath every time I switch channels.


Grey Ghost, what is your signal strength? If it's ~100%, step it down to the upper 80s-low 90s with an attenuator (splitter) and activate the 6th tuner and see if you still get the V58 error message.

This solution worked for me on a Suddenlink M card and a Tivo Plus.:up:


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