# Mini's sleep mode



## NSPhillips

My wife complained that the Mini is annoying because if it stays on the same channel for a while it will ask to go into sleep mode.

I tried to explain that she should be watching recorded content so she doesn't have to see commercials and that the remote buttons would keep it "awake", but she has no interest in doing so.

Is this set at something like 90 minutes? Has anyone found an option for it in the menus? I'd like it to at least be as long as a two-hour movie.


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## moyekj

I think it is 90 minutes and there is no setting to change it AFAIK. Simply having your wife tap the volume or mute button once an hour or so should be enough to avoid the timeout.


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## teklock

moyekj said:


> I think it is 90 minutes and there is no setting to change it AFAIK. Simply having your wife tap the volume or mute button once an hour or so should be enough to avoid the timeout.


Yeah, i'm not a fan of the sleep thing either. There should be a setting for that.


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## moyekj

I think it's good there is a sleep as I wouldn't want live TV to be the default timeout option for the Mini and needlessly streaming while nobody is watching. But I agree there should be a setting to control timeout period.


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## aaronwt

I would like to be able to make the timeout period shorter. Like 30 minutes.


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## PCurry57

This is where a power button would be nice, turn it of sleep mode, turn it on wakeup. Linda depends on the definition of power on/off or sleep/wake.


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## lessd

aaronwt said:


> I would like to be able to make the timeout period shorter. Like 30 minutes.


I talked to TiVo tech support, and they also never though enough about this 90 minute automatic time out, they are going to go back to TiVo eng to see if this can be fixed, it would helpful if others called TiVo and complained about this. Even the CSR I talk to uses her TiVo-TV to go to sleep, and would not like her TV to go off every 90 min. (Until she asked someone she did not even know this was an unadvertised feature of this product.)

*SO lets call*


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## HDRyder9

Is the sleep mode the precursor to dynamic tuner allocation? After 90 minutes of non use the Mini gives up the tuner?


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## jano18

My wife has been complaining about this feature also. She also doesn't like that she has to hit live or select a recording. I told her I will set up a macros to execute live upon entering the TiVo Mini activity. I hope Tivo will offer an adjustable setting for the timer in a future update.


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## lessd

HDRyder9 said:


> Is the sleep mode the precursor to dynamic tuner allocation? After 90 minutes of non use the Mini gives up the tuner?


The problem what is non use, just leaving the TV on when you are working or in bed trying to go to sleep is use but not using the Mini remote for 90 minutes, is that non use, TVs do not go off if left on, my computer has a setting to control when it goes to sleep if at all.
We do not now have dynamic tuner so that not an issue, at least for now.


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## Jonathan_S

HDRyder9 said:


> Is the sleep mode the precursor to dynamic tuner allocation? After 90 minutes of non use the Mini gives up the tuner?


Maybe. It already helps today _if_ you have enough minis to oversubscribe your Elite/4/4 XL's networked tuners. (2 minis w/ only 1 tuner shared or 3 minis).

Dropping from liveTV allows a different mini to grab the tuner. If all network tuners are currently streaming you just get an error message when the next mini tries to view live tv.

Of course it'll be must more useful, and to a wider range of users, if/when dynamic tuner allocation is rolled out, since it'll be recordings, not just other minis, competing for the tuner.


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## zubinh

So you're essentially saying that one cannot watch a two hour movie uninterrupted with a Tivo Mini. Great Feature Tivo.

Does anyone know how to put the Mini in standby with just one click on the remote? I'd like to program my Harmony to do that when turning off. 

Thanks.


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## 2trill4925

I've emailed support on this issue. I was debating defecting to Ceton, but the thought of my toddlers jamming objects into an XBOX 360 DVD tray put me off. I really want to like this piece of tech, but this is a slap in the face. I was just trying to stream live TV to my kids' rooms. Something tells me that Tivo and the Cable Providers made a backroom deal as the cable companies are about to go mainstream with their own implementation of the same technology.

The least Tivo could've done was made retail consumers aware of this feature.


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## Digital Man

zubinh said:


> So you're essentially saying that one cannot watch a two hour movie uninterrupted with a Tivo Mini. Great Feature Tivo.
> 
> Thanks.


Can't you just tap a key on the remote once every 90 minutes to re-start the 90 minute sleep timer? If that's the case it's really not that bad. I agree they should allow us to configure the timer, but it's really not that big of a deal.

DM


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## lessd

Digital Man said:


> Can't you just tap a key on the remote once every 90 minutes to re-start the 90 minute sleep timer? If that's the case it's really not that bad. I agree they should allow us to configure the timer, but it's really not that big of a deal.
> 
> DM


I did test out the 2 hour movie and no time out when streaming a program, the time out only happens when watching Live TV for more than 90 minutes and not tapping the remote in that time, each tap add another 90 minutes, but if you use the Mini in the bedroom to go to sleep with Live TV do you want to get up every 90 minutes to tap the remote, how about working in the kitchen, this time out is a pain, for now I don't know what purpose it serves as the power the Mini uses stays at 5 watts.


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## innocentfreak

lessd said:


> TVs do not go off if left on


My Panasonic Plasma does when it detects nothing coming from the HDMI. Every once and a while I will forget to turn the TV off after finishing a movie and powering off the Blu-Ray. A few minutes later I will see a popup saying TV will power off in 5 minutes. If I let it go and shut off, when I power it back on it tells me it was turned off by the power off function or something to that effect.


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## lessd

innocentfreak said:


> My Panasonic Plasma does when it detects nothing coming from the HDMI. Every once and a while I will forget to turn the TV off after finishing a movie and powering off the Blu-Ray. A few minutes later I will see a popup saying TV will power off in 5 minutes. If I let it go and shut off, when I power it back on it tells me it was turned off by the power off function or something to that effect.


But at least it is looking at the HDMI cable, no going off with TV playing.


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## brholl

I think the best solution might be for the TiVo Mini to figure out whether the TV is still powered on or not through the HDMI cable. If it's powered on and still sending a signal to the TV, then don't put the Mini to sleep. I also wish when you turn the TV on that you didn't have to push the Live TV or TiVo button. Pushing the power button on the TiVo remote should automatically default it to Live TV or My Shows (your choice in the settings).


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## 2trill4925

brholl said:


> I think the best solution might be for the TiVo Mini to figure out whether the TV is still powered on or not through the HDMI cable. If it's powered on and still sending a signal to the TV, then don't put the Mini to sleep. I also wish when you turn the TV on that you didn't have to push the Live TV or TiVo button. Pushing the power button on the TiVo remote should automatically default it to Live TV or My Shows (your choice in the settings).


That is an interesting suggestion. :up:


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## 2trill4925

I decided since the clock is ticking on my 30 day satisfaction agreement, it would be wiser to contact Tivo. The response I got was half-baked, and I wouldn't be surprised if my suggestion ended with the CSR.

Hello 2trill4925,

Thank you for contacting TiVo Customer Support. The Mini does have a limit of a 90 minute tuner allocation before that tuner goes back to the use of the host DVR. I would be happy to forward your suggestion to our engineers. If you think of anything else, you can make suggestions directly at: http://advisors.tivo.com/wix5/p2272893819.aspx

Please continue to use reference number xxxxxx-xxxxxx for further contact regarding this request. In order to respond to this email, please log into your account at www.tivo.com/mysupport. Replies directly to this email will not be received.

Sincerely,
Beth

TiVo Customer Support Representative
www.tivo.com/support
http://forums.tivo.com


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## lessd

Now that I got my Mini fully working I have tested out the sleep mode, and I have good news, as the Mini will not go to sleep if watching Live TV or a recorded show, it only goes to sleep if left in the menu for 90 minutes, so when dynamic tuner software comes along one would just leave the Mini in the menu and the system could take over the extra tuner. A normal TiVo left in the menu will default back to live TV.


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## Loach

lessd said:


> Now that I got my Mini fully working I have tested out the sleep mode, and I have good news, as the Mini will not go to sleep if watching Live TV or a recorded show, it only goes to sleep if left in the menu for 90 minutes, so when dynamic tuner software comes along one would just leave the Mini in the menu and the system could take over the extra tuner. A normal TiVo left in the menu will default back to live TV.


I had my Mini on live TV watching hoops yesterday and it timed out. I don't know whether it was technically in "sleep mode" but it absolutely timed out and went to a screen saver-type warning message.


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## lessd

Loach said:


> I had my Mini on live TV watching hoops yesterday and it timed out. I don't know whether it was technically in "sleep mode" but it absolutely timed out and went to a screen saver-type warning message.


I will try it again, but I turned on the TV by its own power button so I would not use the TiVo remote to turn on the TV as a rest, as the Mini may respond to any IR signal in some way.


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## moyekj

lessd said:


> Now that I got my Mini fully working I have tested out the sleep mode, and I have good news, as the Mini will not go to sleep if watching Live TV or a recorded show, it only goes to sleep if left in the menu for 90 minutes, so when dynamic tuner software comes along one would just leave the Mini in the menu and the system could take over the extra tuner. A normal TiVo left in the menu will default back to live TV.


 Live TV does time out after 90 minutes of no interaction with remote by design. One of the main purposes to time out is so as not to needlessly be streaming when nobody is watching.


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## lessd

moyekj said:


> Live TV does time out after 90 minutes of no interaction with remote by design. One of the main purposes to time out is so as not to needlessly be streaming when nobody is watching.


I have not tested Live TV a 2nd time, but the Mini does not time out when watching a recording, I set it up on a 3 hour game and left the room, no remote action, came back in 2 1/2 hours later and the Mini was still streaming that program.


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## moyekj

lessd said:


> I have not tested Live TV a 2nd time, but the Mini does not time out when watching a recording, I set it up on a 3 hour game and left the room, no remote action, came back in 2 1/2 hours later and the Mini was still streaming that program.


 And that's a good thing. I can't say I've ever confirmed that though, since I never watch anything without touching the remote either to skip commercials or to skip back 8 seconds to catch something I missed, or to turn on/off captions, etc. So even if it did time out for recorded shows it wouldn't be a big deal to me, but it makes more sense if it does not. I did have a tuner dedicated to the Mini initially and left it on live TV several times intentionally to make sure it did time out, which it did.

Timing out live TV is what matters. I don't have a tuner dedicated to the Mini anymore, but if I did I would want a timeout to screensaver mode as is the case now since I would not want live TV streaming unnecessarily with nobody watching.


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## lessd

moyekj said:


> And that's a good thing. I can't say I've ever confirmed that though, since I never watch anything without touching the remote either to skip commercials or to skip back 8 seconds to catch something I missed, or to turn on/off captions, etc. So even if it did time out for recorded shows it wouldn't be a big deal to me, but it makes more sense if it does not. I did have a tuner dedicated to the Mini initially and left it on live TV several times intentionally to make sure it did time out, which it did.
> 
> Timing out live TV is what matters. I don't have a tuner dedicated to the Mini anymore, but if I did I would want a timeout to screensaver mode as is the case now since I would not want live TV streaming unnecessarily with nobody watching.


I recheck and the Mini did time out after 4 hours (I don't know when it went to sleep in that 4 hour time), but the TV was off, I am going to try leaving the TV on and check in about 90 minutes.


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## aaronwt

I see that it times out quickly after watching a recorded show. I've come back a short time after watching a show and it's on the screen saver or whatever it's called. Personally I would rather have a static screen instead of something moving around. It's been eight years since I've had an HDTV that can get burn in.


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## lessd

lessd said:


> I recheck and the Mini did time out after 4 hours (I don't know when it went to sleep in that 4 hour time), but the TV was off, I am going to try leaving the TV on and check in about 90 minutes.


The Mini does time out on Live TV, TiVo should fix this as some people may want to use the Mini in the bedroom and getting up every 90 minutes would be a bummer, also some people like to have the TV on in the Kitchen when working and not have it go off every 90 minutes.
IMHO

*TiVo should fix this time out problem!!!* or as TiVo may call it "a good feature"


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## moyekj

A configurable setting is what is really needed to please everyone as already discussed, including option for no timeout.


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## Loach

moyekj said:


> A configurable setting is what is really needed to please everyone as already discussed, including option for no timeout.


+1. Many times I have live sports on while I'm doing other things. I'm more "monitoring" as opposed to "watching". This is when I've experienced the timeout and it is annoying.


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## Loach

Last night I had live TV on while reading the paper. After 90 minutes, a message popped up that said:

"Are you still there? Press OK to continue viewing."

I pressed OK and it continued live TV. Not sure how long the message would have stayed on the screen as I noticed it immediately and cleared it.


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## lessd

Loach said:


> Last night I had live TV on while reading the paper. After 90 minutes, a message popped up that said:
> 
> "Are you still there? Press OK to continue viewing."
> 
> I pressed OK and it continued live TV. Not sure how long the message would have stayed on the screen as I noticed it immediately and cleared it.


I have called TiVo about this and it would help if others also called TiVo about this 90 minutes sleep time out, the only reason I think TiVo did this is to stop using network resources if nobody is watching, it should be user controlled, on/off or set up your own time. A good place to use the Mini would be the bedroom for people who want to sleep with the TV on, can't use the Mini for that. I don't think future dynamic tuner control has anything to do with the time out, as a normal TiVo just gives you a message that a recording is going to start, the default is for the recording to start and the channel will change, or you can take some action to stop the recording, I think the Mini will work like that when this option is, or ever ready.

*So please call TiVo*


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## jmpage2

The reason that they did it is that if you leave a TiVo Mini on watching Live TV as many of you are describing it will tie that tuner up indefinitely without a timeout.

Which means that if someone wants to watch Live TV from another Mini they will have to go to the Mini in question (hours or days later potentially) and put it back in the TiVo menu in order to release the tuner.

I suspect that the 90 minute timeout is also there to lay the groundwork for dynamic tuner allocation. How exactly can the main TiVo know that a tuner is available to record if all of the Minis are tuned to Live TV and no human is there watching them?

While the timeout might be annoying and _should be configurable_ it is actually pretty clear why it is there.

There will never be an option for "never time out".


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## mahohmei

There's a very simple solution to this, but it would require a hardware change to the TiVo mini:

Bundle with the TiVo mini a current-sensing ring; this would be a ring that snaps around the TV's AC power cord and would have a 1/8", two-conductor plug that would plug into the TiVo mini. It could detect if the TV is powered on or off--if the TV is on, the stream keeps going. If the TV is turned off, the stream is stopped to conserve network bandwidth and power.

Almost all of us here have two current-sensing rings at home: one on each phase in the electric meter.


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## jmpage2

mahohmei said:


> There's a very simple solution to this, but it would require a hardware change to the TiVo mini:
> 
> Bundle with the TiVo mini a current-sensing ring; this would be a ring that snaps around the TV's AC power cord and would have a 1/8", two-conductor plug that would plug into the TiVo mini. It could detect if the TV is powered on or off--if the TV is on, the stream keeps going. If the TV is turned off, the stream is stopped to conserve network bandwidth and power.
> 
> Almost all of us here have two current-sensing rings at home: one on each phase in the electric meter.


That's actually an excellent solution.... however I can see why TiVo won't do it. The last thing they want to do is provide tech support for people installing these (as simple as it is people will hose it up)... or God forbid, suing TiVo for damages when they manage to damage the cord on their TiVo or manage to electrocute themselves.


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## moyekj

What if TV is being used for another device on a different input and/or you are going through an AMP? There's too many configurations that will violate basic assumptions for any such solution. I say empower the user to set the timeout option as desired - a simple and software only solution.


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## mahohmei

moyekj said:


> What if TV is being used for another device on a different input and/or you are going through an AMP? There's too many configurations that will violate basic assumptions for any such solution. I say empower the user to set the timeout option as desired - a simple and software only solution.


True, I'd want the timeout to be a user-adjustable solution. I just had the theory that it would be cool for there to be a dry-contact input that could be used to tell the TiVo mini, if the user so desires, "If this contact is open, don't stream". The user could then use any sort of circuit logic, such as closing the contact when the TV or AVR are powered on.


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## todd_j_derr

You could just use a "smart" power strip to kill power to the mini when the TV was off... but unfortunately I think the boot time is too long to make that practical.


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## grawdon

I think the timeout is a terrible idea. As others have said, sometimes you just want the TV on for background. Or maybe to keep a child or pet company. Having to go to the remote every 90 minutes is silly. This should be an option, not mandatory. I called TiVo and they told me it wouldn't be changed. Period. No discussion. 

I'm thinking of returning mine as I am in the 30 day return period.


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## jmpage2

grawdon said:


> I think the timeout is a terrible idea. As others have said, sometimes you just want the TV on for background. Or maybe to keep a child or pet company. Having to go to the remote every 90 minutes is silly. This should be an option, not mandatory. I called TiVo and they told me it wouldn't be changed. Period. No discussion.
> 
> I'm thinking of returning mine as I am in the 30 day return period.


Preventing a timeout from ever happening means that each Mini will need a tuner ALWAYS (tuner never available for another Mini or for recording). Maybe it should be an option but I think the timeout is understandable for the current configuration they are offering.


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## lessd

jmpage2 said:


> Preventing a timeout from ever happening means that each Mini will need a tuner ALWAYS (tuner never available for another Mini or for recording). Maybe it should be an option but I think the timeout is understandable for the current configuration they are offering.


It should be an option but is home network use for the Mini 24/7 that had TiVo put in the 90 minutes sleep mode, how many people would go to the trouble of putting the Mini in sleep mode before they left the room.


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## jmpage2

lessd said:


> It should be an option but is home network use for the Mini 24/7 that had TiVo put in the 90 minutes sleep mode, how many people would go to the trouble of putting the Mini in sleep mode before they left the room.


I think we are saying the same thing. The reason there is a "timeout" mode is because people very often walk away from a TV without ever exiting out of live TV viewing.

In the case of the Mini this would result in a tuner being more or less permanently hijacked by the Mini unless it was being used to watch a recording.

The timeout might be frustrating to some users, but it serves an important function, freeing up a tuner after a certain period of time for use by other Minis... or, eventually for recording (when dynamic tuner allocation is delivered).

I agree that TiVo should make it a user selectable duration, but the problem with a "never timeout" option is that people will set this, then not understanding what it actually does, complain when they don't have free tuners for other Minis in the home, or to do recordings.


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## lessd

jmpage2 said:


> I think we are saying the same thing. The reason there is a "timeout" mode is because people very often walk away from a TV without ever exiting out of live TV viewing.
> 
> In the case of the Mini this would result in a tuner being more or less permanently hijacked by the Mini unless it was being used to watch a recording.
> 
> The timeout might be frustrating to some users, but it serves an important function, freeing up a tuner after a certain period of time for use by other Minis... or, eventually for recording (when dynamic tuner allocation is delivered).
> 
> I agree that TiVo should make it a user selectable duration, but the problem with a "never timeout" option is that people will set this, then not understanding what it actually does, complain when they don't have free tuners for other Minis in the home, or to do recordings.


I don't have two Minis but I though with 2 Minis I had to give up two tuners on my TP-4, each Mini is locked to a TP-4 tuner, that tuner can't be used for anything but the Mini locked to it. Dynamic tuner allocation has nothing to do with this time out, when we get dynamic tuner allocation, what will happen is the same thing that happens now on any TiVo that is on Live TV and that channel is needed for an upcoming recording, you get a warning that the channel will change and if you want you could say no and the program will not record, I assume the same thing will happen with the Mini.


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## moyekj

lessd said:


> I don't have two Minis but I though with 2 Minis I had to give up two tuners on my TP-4, each Mini is locked to a TP-4 tuner, that tuner can't be used for anything but the Mini locked to it. Dynamic tuner allocation has nothing to do with this time out, when we get dynamic tuner allocation, what will happen is the same thing that happens now on any TiVo that is on Live TV and that channel is needed for an upcoming recording, you get a warning that the channel will change and if you want you could say no and the program will not record, I assume the same thing will happen with the Mini.


 No, that's not the way it works. On 4 tuner unit you specify how many tuners you want to allocate for live TV viewing on Minis. If you only set it to 1 and you have 2 Minis then 1st come, 1st served basis only 1 Mini can do live TV at a time. I fully expect if/when dynamic tuning is available that this timeout will still be in place, though still would be better with option to change timeout and turn it off if desired.


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## jmpage2

lessd said:


> I don't have two Minis but I though with 2 Minis I had to give up two tuners on my TP-4, each Mini is locked to a TP-4 tuner, that tuner can't be used for anything but the Mini locked to it. Dynamic tuner allocation has nothing to do with this time out, when we get dynamic tuner allocation, what will happen is the same thing that happens now on any TiVo that is on Live TV and that channel is needed for an upcoming recording, you get a warning that the channel will change and if you want you could say no and the program will not record, I assume the same thing will happen with the Mini.


What you say is correct if you have assigned enough tuners to cover all of your Minis.

What happens if you have more Minis than you have tuners allocated? Now you have trouble.

It could be solved if TiVo implemented the ability to "hijack" another Mini. You go to watch Live TV and are asked if you want to rob a tuner from another Mini, and then that Mini gets a warning that you took the tuner.

Could result in some rather interesting family fights, at least until they put some kind of rights management system in there.


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## lessd

moyekj said:


> No, that's not the way it works. On 4 tuner unit you specify how many tuners you want to allocate for live TV viewing on Minis. If you only set it to 1 and you have 2 Minis then 1st come, 1st served basis only 1 Mini can do live TV at a time. I fully expect if/when dynamic tuning is available that this timeout will still be in place, though still would be better with option to change timeout and turn it off if desired.


I have one Mini now and one tuner on one TP-4 locked off for that Mini, are you saying if I got another Mini I could also lock the new Mini to the same TP-4 tuner, for me that does not compute because if someone stops watching Mini #1 and 20 minutes later someone goes to Mini #2 they would have to wait another 70 minutes for Live TV to work, or go back to Mini #1 and manual put it to sleep, I don't have a 2nd Mini but I would surprised if that the way TiVo has 2 Minis work in your home.


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## jmpage2

lessd said:


> I have one Mini now and one tuner on one TP-4 locked off for that Mini, are you saying if I got another Mini I could also lock the new Mini to the same TP-4 tuner, for me that does not compute because if someone stops watching Mini #1 and 20 minutes later someone goes to Mini #2 they would have to wait another 70 minutes for Live TV to work, or go back to Mini #1 and manual put it to sleep, I don't have a 2nd Mini but I would surprised if that the way TiVo has 2 Minis work in your home.


It might not compute, but if you have two Minis (and are sharing one tuner) that is EXACTLY how it works today. If Mini #1 is watching Live TV, and you walk away, Mini #2 can't watch Live TV until Mini #1 times out (or someone walks up to it and puts it back in the TiVo menu)... which is why they have 
the time-out interaction in the first place.

A better option would be to allow "force takeover" of a tuner... but in larger households that might have several TiVos this could become problematic because you could take over a tuner that someone is actually watching.


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## Loach

lessd said:


> I have one Mini now and one tuner on one TP-4 locked off for that Mini, are you saying if I got another Mini I could also lock the new Mini to the same TP-4 tuner, for me that does not compute because if someone stops watching Mini #1 and 20 minutes later someone goes to Mini #2 they would have to wait another 70 minutes for Live TV to work, or go back to Mini #1 and manual put it to sleep, I don't have a 2nd Mini but I would surprised if that the way TiVo has 2 Minis work in your home.


That's how I have mine set up. 1 tuner allocated for live TV among 2 Minis. And no I don't have to wait 70 minutes for live TV to work. It releases the tuner if you hit the Tivo button because you have exited live TV.

So say I'm watching live TV on the Mini in the family room. I decide to go to bed so I hit the Tivo button and turn everything off and go upstairs (actually the "off" button macro on my URC does all that for me). I go upstairs and turn the bedroom TV on with Mini #2 and I'm immediately able to watch live TV.

There are never any conflicts in my house because nobody is ever watching live TV in the family room and bedroom at the same time. If anyone is watching live TV while I'm in bed, it's the teenagers watching the P4 in the basement rec room.


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## aaronwt

I always hit the TiVo button when I finish watching a Mini. As long as you do that there will be no issues when going to another Mini to watch something.


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## lessd

Loach said:


> That's how I have mine set up. 1 tuner allocated for live TV among 2 Minis. And no I don't have to wait 70 minutes for live TV to work. It releases the tuner if you hit the Tivo button because you have exited live TV.
> 
> So say I'm watching live TV on the Mini in the family room. I decide to go to bed so I hit the Tivo button and turn everything off and go upstairs (actually the "off" button macro on my URC does all that for me). I go upstairs and turn the bedroom TV on with Mini #2 and I'm immediately able to watch live TV.
> 
> There are never any conflicts in my house because nobody is ever watching live TV in the family room and bedroom at the same time. If anyone is watching live TV while I'm in bed, it's the teenagers watching the P4 in the basement rec room.


But your careful to turn off the family room Mini before going to the bedroom, my wife would never remember to do that, I am lucky if she turns off the TV when she leaves the room. Not having two Minis I concede the point about two Mini sharing one tuner, good information to have.


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## aaronwt

lessd said:


> But your careful to turn off the family room Mini before going to the bedroom, my wife would never remember to do that, I am lucky if she turns off the TV when she leaves the room. Not having two Minis I concede the point about two Mini sharing one tuner, good information to have.


How do you turn off the Mini?


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## slowbiscuit

grawdon said:


> I think the timeout is a terrible idea. As others have said, sometimes you just want the TV on for background. Or maybe to keep a child or pet company. Having to go to the remote every 90 minutes is silly. This should be an option, not mandatory. I called TiVo and they told me it wouldn't be changed. Period. No discussion.


Classic case of Tivo knowing yet again what is best for the user with no option to change the behavior. Regardless of who agrees that the timer should be there or not, the user should be given options. It's not that difficult but apparently not the Tivo Way, just like the silliness of always defaulting to live TV instead of having a screensaver option on main boxes.


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## Loach

lessd said:


> But your careful to turn off the family room Mini before going to the bedroom, my wife would never remember to do that, I am lucky if she turns off the TV when she leaves the room. Not having two Minis I concede the point about two Mini sharing one tuner, good information to have.


I don't have to really be careful about it because my universal remote macro takes care of it for me. But I will grant you that at least until dynamic tuner allocation is implemented, the Mini isn't an elegant solution for every situation.

I have a 4th TV in my office that I will eventually want to add to my whole home system. At certain times I do have that TV and the family room TV on live TV at the same time. So in order to do that I would have to dedicate 2 tuners for Minis. Don't really need to decide until football season


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## lessd

aaronwt said:


> How do you turn off the Mini?


Just stop Live TV, hit the TiVo button, turns off Live TV, after 90 minutes the Mini will go to sleep.


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## sarahanne

The time out feature is a nice feature to have when you're going to sleep by it and want to save energy. I totally get that...

But what about people who are mentally disabled and can't click on the remote every 90 minutes to keep it active?
During night time, what if you're a night owl and stay up until the wee hours of the night and don't want to have to keep hitting the freaking remote every 90 minutes?

TiVo needs to have a setting for you to choose the length of time or completely disable it all together.

This is ridiculous.


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## jmpage2

sarahanne said:


> The time out feature is a nice feature to have when you're going to sleep by it and want to save energy. I totally get that...
> 
> But what about people who are mentally disabled and can't click on the remote every 90 minutes to keep it active?
> During night time, what if you're a night owl and stay up until the wee hours of the night and don't want to have to keep hitting the freaking remote every 90 minutes?
> 
> TiVo needs to have a setting for you to choose the length of time or completely disable it all together.
> 
> This is ridiculous.


I think ridiculous is a strong word. While I agree that TiVo should offer some adjustment of this value it could be problematic for TiVo to prevent the timeout completely as that would permanently sacrifice a tuner for each mini set this way. Most customers don't understand these things.

Additionally, most users, while watching a TiVo device do not watch a single station for hour upon hour. Most will change the channel, pause live tv or skip a commercial every 90 minutes.

So ya, "ridiculous" is rather strong.


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## Arcady

The TiVo sees when you press TV buttons on your remote. Why doesn't it just keep the stream going until it sees that you have pressed the TV power button? I think the TiVo can safely assume that if you turn off the TV, then you don't need an active stream.

At least make this an option.


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## jmpage2

Arcady said:


> The TiVo sees when you press TV buttons on your remote. Why doesn't it just keep the stream going until it sees that you have pressed the TV power button? I think the TiVo can safely assume that if you turn off the TV, then you don't need an active stream.
> 
> At least make this an option.


That sounds easy but it's not. For the TiVo to know the state of power of your TV it has to first learn whether it is on or off, then it needs to know the IR code of your tv. Sometimes you might press the TV power button and the TV doesn't turn on, so you press it a second time, the TiVo might now think the TV is off when you just turned it on. Sometimes you turn it on to do something other than use the TiVo like play a video game. Something with programmatic context driven help like a harmony has a hard time keeping tabs on what the power state of devices look like, would be very difficult for TiVo to do it. Better to offer a longer timer, but people will complain regardless.


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## bradleys

Arcady said:


> The TiVo sees when you press TV buttons on your remote. Why doesn't it just keep the stream going until it sees that you have pressed the TV power button? I think the TiVo can safely assume that if you turn off the TV, then you don't need an active stream.
> 
> At least make this an option.


I think Crispy gave the best answer to this idea in another thread - discussing a concern that the mini keeps the connection too long...



CrispyCritter said:


> But there isn't a Power Off button, there's only a Power toggle, and TiVo has always assumed that it doesn't know whether the TV is on or off by use of that toggle button. I think that's a wise choice of their's, given the number of times my AV receiver and TV get "out-of-sync" because one of them didn't receive the Power signal. Getting "out-of-sync" with tuner release would be very annoying!
> 
> Just pressing the TiVo button will release the tuner. Yes, it's an extra thing to remember, but it will only rarely be important.


Without a reliable HDMI handshake option - timeout is the best solution AFAIAC.

Funny, i haven't bounced against this issue yet... But don't fall asleep in front of the TV.


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## aaronwt

Arcady said:


> The TiVo sees when you press TV buttons on your remote. Why doesn't it just keep the stream going until it sees that you have pressed the TV power button? I think the TiVo can safely assume that if you turn off the TV, then you don't need an active stream.
> 
> At least make this an option.


But in my case, with one of my Minis, I still need it playing the content when I turn the TV off. I have a stand alone DVD burner in that room, and I will put the Lifetime movies I record for my girlfriend on disc. So when I do that I will turn off the TV after I start the recording. When I had a Premiere in the room I had no issue, but with the Mini, I need to make sure I go into the room and hit the info button so it doesn't time out. Well I've never tested it to see if it will time out, but from what I've read it should timeout after 90 minutes. I wish it was adjustable, that way I would make the timeout 180 minutes in that room. While the mini in my other room I would make the timeout only 15 or 20 minutes.

Or does the Mini still timeout when playing back a previously recorded show? If not, then I don't need to worry about it any more?


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## Jeremy5

I scripted a telnet command to send IRCODE CC_OFF every 60 minutes to both of my minis. They haven't went to sleep in about a week now. 

I sure hope Tivo gives us some control over this setting, but for now this is working.


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## bradleys

Jeremy5 said:


> I scripted a telnet command to send IRCODE CC_OFF every 60 minutes to both of my minis. They haven't went to sleep in about a week now.
> 
> I sure hope Tivo gives us some control over this setting, but for now this is working.


That would work as long as you place your Mini onto the menu when you are done. Otherwise you are permanently allocating a tuner to your Mini.

I would rather see HDMI CEC control enabled. With CEC control the Mini will know that the TV is on and receiving a signal from the Mini.

If it is off, it can release the tuner immediately, if it is on then I keeps it forever.

Older receivers and TV's may not support the CEC communication, but this is exactly what it was designed for.


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## jmpage2

I think that some people would be okay with permanent allocation of a tuner to a Mini... the problem is, many more who would NOT be okay with it would turn the setting for timeout to "never" anyway, then complain that a tuner was unavailable for recording.


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## lessd

bradleys said:


> That would work as long as you place your Mini onto the menu when you are done. Otherwise you are permanently allocating a tuner to your Mini.


With six tuners permanently allocating of one tuner is not so bad for many people, my wife keeps the TV on in the kitchen most of the day when she is home, Mini not going to work, she also likes the bedroom TV on all night, Mini not going to work for that, so I have only one place to use a Mini, in my wife's dressing table/bathroom as she never spends more than 90 min in there without using the remote.


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## Jeremy5

bradleys said:


> Otherwise you are permanently allocating a tuner to your Mini.


Which is exactly my intention.


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## bradleys

lessd said:


> With six tuners permanently allocating of one tuner is not so bad for many people, my wife keeps the TV on in the kitchen most of the day when she is home, Mini not going to work, she also likes the bedroom TV on all night, Mini not going to work for that, so I have only one place to use a Mini, in my wife's dressing table/bathroom as she never spends more than 90 min in there without using the remote.


Then it sounds like Jeremy's simple solution is a good one - if you have an always on PC or server. I do and it sounds like Jeremy does - but, I suspect most don't.

Just as a thought exercise, I wonder how hard it would be to setup a Raspberry Pi to do that kind of duty...


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## Loach

aaronwt said:


> But in my case, with one of my Minis, I still need it playing the content when I turn the TV off. I have a stand alone DVD burner in that room, and I will put the Lifetime movies I record for my girlfriend on disc. So when I do that I will turn off the TV after I start the recording. When I had a Premiere in the room I had no issue, but with the Mini, I need to make sure I go into the room and hit the info button so it doesn't time out. Well I've never tested it to see if it will time out, but from what I've read it should timeout after 90 minutes. I wish it was adjustable, that way I would make the timeout 180 minutes in that room. While the mini in my other room I would make the timeout only 15 or 20 minutes.
> 
> Or does the Mini still timeout when playing back a previously recorded show? If not, then I don't need to worry about it any more?


I'm fairly certain the Mini only times out during live TV - not during playback of a recorded show.

The 90-minute timeout would be a lot less annoying to me if it would treat non-Tivo IR commands as a "reset". For example, I'm always fiddling with the volume, but that doesn't reset the timeout. Last night watching the Cardinals game I had to remind myself to toggle the guide button periodically so it didn't time out at an exciting point in the game.


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## lessd

Loach said:


> I'm fairly certain the Mini only times out during live TV - not during playback of a recorded show.
> 
> The 90-minute timeout would be a lot less annoying to me if it would treat non-Tivo IR commands as a "reset". For example, I'm always fiddling with the volume, but that doesn't reset the timeout. Last night watching the Cardinals game I had to remind myself to toggle the guide button periodically so it didn't time out at an exciting point in the game.


I think you get a screen warning before the Mini goes to sleep.


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## Loach

lessd said:


> I think you get a screen warning before the Mini goes to sleep.


Yes, true. But when you clear the warning the screen blanks out for a couple seconds and when it returns it seems to be a couple seconds behind live TV. I have to hit the skip button to catch back up to live TV. Very annoying during live sports.


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## aaronwt

Loach said:


> Yes, true. But when you clear the warning the screen blanks out for a couple seconds and when it returns it seems to be a couple seconds behind live TV. I have to hit the skip button to catch back up to live TV. Very annoying during live sports.


It's always going to be behind something live since it is written to the hard drive and then read off of it before you view it. And this is after any delay introduced by the broadcaster or cable provider.


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## lessd

Loach said:


> Yes, true. But when you clear the warning the screen blanks out for a couple seconds and when it returns it seems to be a couple seconds behind live TV. I have to hit the skip button to catch back up to live TV. Very annoying during live sports.


How are you clearing the warning ??


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## TC25D

NSPhillips said:


> My wife complained that the Mini is annoying because if it stays on the same channel for a while it will ask to go into sleep mode.





lessd said:


> Even the CSR I talk to uses her TiVo-TV to go to sleep, and would not like her TV to go off every 90 min. (Until she asked someone she did not even know this was an unadvertised feature of this product.)





lessd said:


> TiVo should fix this as some people may want to use the Mini in the bedroom and getting up every 90 minutes would be a bummer, also some people like to have the TV on in the Kitchen when working and not have it go off every 90 minutes.





grawdon said:


> you just want the TV on for background. Or maybe to keep a child or pet company. Having to go to the remote every 90 minutes is silly. This should be an option, not mandatory. I called TiVo and they told me it wouldn't be changed. Period. No discussion.
> 
> I'm thinking of returning mine as I am in the 30 day return period.





sarahanne said:


> But what about people who are mentally disabled and can't click on the remote every 90 minutes to keep it active?
> During night time, what if you're a night owl and stay up until the wee hours of the night and don't want to have to keep hitting the freaking remote every 90 minutes?





aaronwt said:


> But in my case, with one of my Minis, I still need it playing the content when I turn the TV off. I have a stand alone DVD burner in that room, and I will put the Lifetime movies I record for my girlfriend on disc.





jmpage2 said:


> I think that some people would be okay with permanent allocation of a tuner to a Mini... the problem is, many more who would NOT be okay with it would turn the setting for timeout to "never" anyway, then complain that a tuner was unavailable for recording.


All these use cases indicate TiVo should simply give us the option to make the Timeout = 0, i.e., never timeout.

Sadly, the vitriolic posts, e.g., calling the current situation 'ridiculous' and accusing TiVo of some kind of ill intent are childish.


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## slowbiscuit

You're reading WAY more into what people are posting than what I see, they're just frustrated (with good reason) that Tivo has once again decided for the user what they think everyone should have. Nobody here is accusing Tivo of maliciously doing this.

Lack of configurability for basic options like this (frex, the live TV buffer length) is one of my biggest beefs w/Tivo.


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## Loach

lessd said:


> How are you clearing the warning ??


By pressing the Select button in response to the "Still there?" message.


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## Loach

aaronwt said:


> It's always going to be behind something live since it is written to the hard drive and then read off of it before you view it. And this is after any delay introduced by the broadcaster or cable provider.


Yeah that recently dawned on me while on the phone with my brother during an NLCS game. He was watching on a Cox HD cable box and clearly was seeing the action before I was on my Mini.


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## jaredmwright

Jeremy, do you mind sharing your script with those of us here? I wouldn't mind trying this out as I am considering rolling out Minis to replace my Premieres.


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## pillpusher84

jaredmwright said:


> Jeremy, do you mind sharing your script with those of us here? I wouldn't mind trying this out as I am considering rolling out Minis to replace my Premieres.


yes, please share ... I would also like to test out


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## 172pilot

Jeremy5 said:


> I scripted a telnet command to send IRCODE CC_OFF every 60 minutes to both of my minis. They haven't went to sleep in about a week now.
> 
> I sure hope Tivo gives us some control over this setting, but for now this is working.


That is a great idea.. I'm going to do that too.. I basically know what times I DONT want the mini to turn off, so I can schedule a task to just run during those times.. I had envisioned an arduino with an IR diode doing the same thing, but network based is easier and more reliable.. Thanks!


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## cmaquilino16

I got the message are you still there this morning tuning on tv, I only have one mini connected to office tv with Ethernet, from a roamio pro. You'll I get the press live tv or the channel I was last watching. So should I hit the TiVo button then turn off tv. Also changing channels takes about two to four second to change is this something with TiVo mini.


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## dlfl

cmaquilino16 said:


> I got the message are you still there this morning tuning on tv, I only have one mini connected to office tv with Ethernet, from a roamio pro. You'll I get the press live tv or the channel I was last watching. So should I hit the TiVo button then turn off tv. Also changing channels takes about two to four second to change is this something with TiVo mini.


Assuming you want the mini to unlock the Roamio's tuner it was using, yes hit the TiVo button on the mini's remote and turn of the TV connected to the mini.

I get the impression a few seconds to change channels on a mini is normal. It takes a second or two also on my Roamio.


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## donbwms

The TiVo needs several options:
1. I want to be able to set TiVo Mini timeout option for much more than 90 minutes, PERIOD. There are times when I want my house to sound lived in while I'm away for more than 90 minutes. My wife, family, and many friends agree. Based on comments in this forum, many people seem to agree.
2. I want a feature the gives me the option to manually force disconnect a remote device such as a TiVo Mini from using a tuner. 
3. I want a feature the gives me the option to automatically force disconnect a remote device such as a TiVo Mini from using a tuner in order to satisfy a high priority todo recording.
4. At least for TVs connected via HDMI, the TiVo Mini should be able to detect whether the TV is on or not. I've noticed that while my laptop is connected to my TV using a HDMI cable, the laptop detects whether the TV is on or not. Therefore, the TiVo Mini should be able to do the same.


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## JoeKustra

donbwms said:


> The TiVo needs several options:
> 1. I want to be able to set TiVo Mini timeout option for much more than 90 minutes, PERIOD. There are times when I want my house to sound lived in while I'm away for more than 90 minutes. My wife, family, and many friends agree. Based on comments in this forum, many people seem to agree.


The timeout on a Mini is four hours. For other suggestions:http://advisors.tivo.com/wix/5/p2272893819.aspx

I wish the others worked also.


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## TonyD79

I thought recordings on the host bump minis already. 

It would be nice to relieve mini locked tuners from another TiVo so you don't have to go to the other unit. Currently I use my iPhone app to do it.


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## twalsh22

donbwms said:


> The TiVo needs several options:
> 1. I want to be able to set TiVo Mini timeout option for much more than 90 minutes, PERIOD. There are times when I want my house to sound lived in while I'm away for more than 90 minutes. My wife, family, and many friends agree. Based on comments in this forum, many people seem to agree.
> 2. I want a feature the gives me the option to manually force disconnect a remote device such as a TiVo Mini from using a tuner.
> 3. I want a feature the gives me the option to automatically force disconnect a remote device such as a TiVo Mini from using a tuner in order to satisfy a high priority todo recording.
> 4. At least for TVs connected via HDMI, the TiVo Mini should be able to detect whether the TV is on or not. I've noticed that while my laptop is connected to my TV using a HDMI cable, the laptop detects whether the TV is on or not. Therefore, the TiVo Mini should be able to do the same.


"You'll get nothing and like it."
-Judge Smails


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## YDI99

I have the same issue, the timeout feature sucks and should be addressable. Have complained to Tivo they just send me a link to the features.


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## dlfl

YDI99 said:


> I have the same issue, the timeout feature sucks and should be addressable. Have complained to Tivo they just send me a link to the features.


What we have here is a failure to communicate care!


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## sfhub

donbwms said:


> 2. I want a feature the gives me the option to manually force disconnect a remote device such as a TiVo Mini from using a tuner.


I know this is an old thread, but you can do this with an older TiVo remote (or use a programmable remote) and press the standby button.


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## Anon1

sfhub said:


> I know this is an old thread, but you can do this with an older TiVo remote (or use a programmable remote) and press the standby button.


Is it correct you use the standby command on the Mini?


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## sfhub

Anon1 said:


> Is it correct you use the standby command on the Mini?


I just re-tested standby toggle IR command with Mini and latest 20.7.2 and it worked fine. I could also simulate a "discrete" off/standby by creating a remote control macro, chaining TiVo+n sec Pause+Standby


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