# Rovi Data and TivoHD?



## 11274 (Dec 1, 2001)

My TivoHD is still running the "M" firmware, with no update in years. I was expecting an update (hopefully to "N") with the shift to Rovi data.

Am I already getting the Rovi guide data with no need for firmware change?
If not is there a deadline for the switch, and updated firmware?


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

11.0n adds h.264 recording ability, usually on cable.


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## 11274 (Dec 1, 2001)

ThAbtO said:


> 11.0n adds h.264 recording ability, usually on cable.


Yes, I am aware of that and its my main reason for wanting "N". Tivo stopped updating "M" to "N" months ago, and my expectation was that they were intending to incorporate it in a single update that also dealt with changes for the Rovi guide data.

As time goes on and there is no update, I'm just wondering if I am already getting Rovi data and there will be no update for it.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

They may have ended software updates entirely for Series 3 and older models, just focusing on Premiere and newer (v20.6x) They already ended updates for my S3-652, but I still have guide data. Rovi started this 9/1.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

ThAbtO said:


> They may have ended software updates entirely for Series 3 and older models, just focusing on Premiere and newer (v20.6x) They already ended updates for my S3-652, but I still have guide data. Rovi started this 9/1.


Why do you think you have Rovi guide data on your THD?


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

Rovi started on Roamio on 9/1 and I have just checked on the S3. Guide data is there but does not say Rovi yet.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

ThAbtO said:


> Rovi started on Roamio on 9/1 and I have just checked on the S3. Guide data is there but does not say Rovi yet.


OK. Why do you think that the THD will not be updated?



Ira Bahr said:


> There is a two-step process. Just this week, we updated the software on the S2-S6 boxes for the new data feeds. Starting next week we will be transitioning these boxes to the new data. During that download which will occur in the early AM hours and take two to three hours, the box will not be fully functional. After that, the DVR will function normally. We've done a ton of testing but we're counting on you guys to post any anomalies you might observe. Right now, we think the most obvious defect will be generic poster art on certain assets.


I'm not sure that the S2s and S3s have actually been updated yet but they are supposed to be.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

There is new software for the S3/HD for the Rovi data but it's still in beta testing. I haven't seen any notices here that anyone has gotten a new version yet (and not sure what the version will be yet either).

Scott


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

lpwcomp said:


> OK. Why do you think that the THD will not be updated?
> 
> I'm not sure that the S2s and S3s have actually been updated yet but they are supposed to be.


Was referring to any Tivo software updates, not Rovi or guide data.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

ThAbtO said:


> Was referring to any Tivo software updates, not Rovi or guide data.


A s/w update is required to use the Rovi data.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

lpwcomp said:


> A s/w update is required to use the Rovi data.


Ok, I assumed it had Rovi, because I had guide data for the next 10+ days. So Tivo guide must still be available for it.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

ThAbtO said:


> Ok, I assumed it had Rovi, because I had guide data for the next 10+ days. So Tivo guide must still be available for it.


Gracenote data.


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## jctivo (Jan 17, 2005)

I have tivohd or series 3. Not sure which. 

Anyway, I don't have any guide data. Did Tivo officially announce in twitter, facebook, on their website or in this forum that tivohd and/or series 3 doesn't have guide data because of the rovi switchover? Or are we just left to figure it out on our own?


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

I got the "TiVo Service Upgrade" message for my S3 dated 8/30, but I haven't gotten Rovi guide data yet. It's still on 11.0m, so it doesn't look like there is a software release for the S3 TiVos.


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## jctivo (Jan 17, 2005)

So you have no guide data?


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

You need a version past 11.0n to use the Rovi data, they're currently beta testing it.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

ej42137 said:


> I got the "TiVo Service Upgrade" message for my S3 dated 8/30, but I haven't gotten Rovi guide data yet. It's still on 11.0m, so it doesn't look like there is a software release for the S3 TiVos.


As Diane indicated, there is a software update for the S3/HD's that's needed for the Rovi data. Looks like your S3 just got the message early for some reason.

Scott


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

jctivo said:


> I have tivohd or series 3. Not sure which.
> 
> Anyway, I don't have any guide data. Did Tivo officially announce in twitter, facebook, on their website or in this forum that tivohd and/or series 3 doesn't have guide data because of the rovi switchover? Or are we just left to figure it out on our own?


I have a tivo HD. I have guide data through September 15. Software is 11.0n.

You should force a connection. If the connection was successful and you don't get guide data contact tivo support. If the connection wasn't successful and you can't fix it (disconnected or bad patch cable for example) contact support


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## equinoxe (Aug 26, 2007)

FWIW - I have 2 Tivo 3's (658 & 652) that have received the notice for the guide update on 8/30 and nothing has happened since with respect to the Rovi change over. Both show normal operation for GC, connections & guide data updates. I guess it's just hurry up and wait mode for us.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

I just got Gracenote data through September 16. It's taking over an hour to load data. I guess it's reloading everything, not just the incremental data for an extra day.


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## ustavio (Oct 19, 2013)

dianebrat said:


> You need a version past 11.0n to use the Rovi data, they're currently beta testing it.


Sure hope the beta testing is more comprehensive than that which preceded the Roamio "upgrade". Despite the "end of the week" fix.... I've still got many movies still not in the movie folder and no guide data for three new PAC 12 channels just added by Frontier.

I DO, however have full Gracenote/Tribune guide data for the PAC 12 channels on my TiVo HD.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

ustavio said:


> Sure hope the beta testing is more comprehensive than that which preceded the Roamio "upgrade". Despite the "end of the week" fix.... I've still got many movies still not in the movie folder and no guide data for three new PAC 12 channels just added by Frontier.
> 
> I DO, however have full Gracenote/Tribune guide data for the PAC 12 channels on my TiVo HD.


Don't count on better testing. They're up against a hard deadline.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

ustavio said:


> Sure hope the beta testing is more comprehensive than that which preceded the Roamio "upgrade". Despite the "end of the week" fix.... I've still got many movies still not in the movie folder and no guide data for three new PAC 12 channels just added by Frontier.
> 
> I DO, however have full Gracenote/Tribune guide data for the PAC 12 channels on my TiVo HD.


Guide data and channel lineups are going to be the same no matter whether it's a Roamio or S3/HD so don't expect any difference there. Just be sure to report line-up issues to TiVo and hopefully they'll be resolved before the S3/HD upgrades rollout.

Scott


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## jebbbz (Sep 7, 2007)

Possibly dumb question, here. I recently de-mothballed my TiVo HD and got it running. I manually connected and updated the software to M (from K -- it had been a while). If I just leave it running unattended and connected to the net will it eventually get the N software and the Rovi data with no intervention from me? It is running disconnected from cable without a display and I thought I would check it, oh, weekly or so and re-mothball it once it was updated as a backup for my Premiere 4 and Mini.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

jebbbz said:


> Possibly dumb question, here. I recently de-mothballed my TiVo HD and got it running. I manually connected and updated the software to M (from K -- it had been a while). If I just leave it running unattended and connected to the net will it eventually get the N software and the Rovi data with no intervention from me? It is running disconnected from cable without a display and I thought I would check it, oh, weekly or so and re-mothball it once it was updated as a backup for my Premiere 4 and Mini.


Almost certainly won't get N but hopefully will get the release that is compatible with Rovi data. N added the capability to record H.264 channels and has nothing to do with Rovi data.


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## jebbbz (Sep 7, 2007)

lpwcomp said:


> Almost certainly won't get N but hopefully will get the release that is compatible with Rovi data. N added the capability to record H.264 channels and has nothing to do with Rovi data.


Thanks. My confusion. Back into mothballs.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

I'd be surprised if tivo releases two new software versions for Tivo HD. I'll speculate the new software (11.0o?) will be an upgrade from 11.0n. Everyone will be able to record h.264 encoded stations.

I suggest keeping your old unit hooked up for the next week or so


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

lew said:


> I'd be surprised if tivo releases two new software versions for Tivo HD. I'll speculate the new software (11.0o?) will be an upgrade from 11.0n. Everyone will be able to record h.264 encoded stations.
> 
> I suggest keeping your old unit hooked up for the next week or so


I agree.


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## jebbbz (Sep 7, 2007)

lew said:


> I'd be surprised if tivo releases two new software versions for Tivo HD. I'll speculate the new software (11.0o?) will be an upgrade from 11.0n. Everyone will be able to record h.264 encoded stations.
> 
> I suggest keeping your old unit hooked up for the next week or so


Will do. Thanks all.


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

My Series 3 is rebooting at this moment with a new release. This will be interesting.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

ej42137 said:


> My Series 3 is rebooting at this moment with a new release. This will be interesting.


Let us know what the version is (and I assume you are not participating in the beta)!

Scott


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## HomeUser (Jan 12, 2003)

Scott FYI:
My 648 OLED just got 11.0.n.H1, the reboot took over an hour.
The S3 is sorting the guide data now. Looking at the programs data through the Web interface it is now "Copyright Rovi, Inc." not the old "Copyright Tribune Media Services, Inc."


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

So looks like the S3/HD rollout has started and they kept 11.0n but incremented the next part beyond the version that was deployed on the HD's for MPEG4 (that was 11.0n.B1).

Scott


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## lcualoping (Nov 22, 2011)

I rebooted my Series3 around 2 hours ago and it is still on the "Preparing the service update. This may take up to an hour, possibly longer." message. Hopefully it didn't brick itself and will be up-and-running in the morning.


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

My release is now 11.0n.H1, it took at least three hours to get past "Preparing the Service Update" and it's still reloading the guide.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

I hate to think how long it will take on my S2.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

lpwcomp said:


> I hate to think how long it will take on my S2.


Probably one of the reasons tivo decided against updating S1. I don't remember how much RAM and processor speed the S1 has. I suspect the conversion would "take forever". A solution which starts with clear and delete everything would be less popular then the path tivo went with. JMO


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## lcualoping (Nov 22, 2011)

I checked my Series3 this morning and it finished getting all the Guide data overnight. Everything seems OK now and it's using Rovi data. Firmware is on 11.0n.H1. Unfortunately, the MPEG-4 channels still don't work on this model 648.


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## Blahman (Mar 4, 2002)

lcualoping said:


> I checked my Series3 this morning and it finished getting all the Guide data overnight. Everything seems OK now and it's using Rovi data. Firmware is on 11.0n.H1. Unfortunately, the MPEG-4 channels still don't work on this model 648.


This is the reason I've still not upgraded to newer TiVo devices. I've just switched to alternatives as the functionality TiVo claimed would be provided never materialized but was required for different services.
My S3 OLED models were the last.
At least they're still workhorses and great devices overall even if never properly supported.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

lcualoping said:


> I checked my Series3 this morning and it finished getting all the Guide data overnight. Everything seems OK now and it's using Rovi data. Firmware is on 11.0n.H1. Unfortunately, the MPEG-4 channels still don't work on this model 648.


MPEG4 recording was not coming for the OLED (648, S3 original) model, just the 652 (HD) and 658 (HD XL), basically the 11.0n, not the Rovi update.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

ThAbtO said:


> MPEG4 recording was not coming for the OLED (648, S3 original) model, just the 652 (HD) and 658 (HD XL), basically the 11.0n, not the Rovi update.


Exactly,

and all is not happy in S3 648 land for me, my unit is one of the unhappy ones, but I'm dealing with it through the appropriate channels, but it's very nice it's a tertiary unit for my house.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Blahman said:


> This is the reason I've still not upgraded to newer TiVo devices. I've just switched to alternatives as the functionality TiVo claimed would be provided never materialized but was required for different services.
> My S3 OLED models were the last.
> At least they're still workhorses and great devices overall even if never properly supported.


What are you referring to for claimed functionality that didn't materialize and not properly supported? I have 2 S3 OLED's purchased in December 2006 and January 2007 which were upgrades from 2 S1's with the $199 lifetime transfers they were offering at the time. I don't recall missing anything on the support side for the last 8 and 1/2 years (give or take). I did take advantage of their offer for longtime TiVo users to upgrade to the Roamio Pro with All-in for $600 last October (with free Slide Pro Remote) due to Comcast's upgrade to MPEG4 and the higher cost of lifetime service and have been very happy with the Roamio.

Having used the SD interface for 15 years and liking it's simplicity, I'll admit that I wasn't sure if I would have any issues with the HD interface but we had no issues with it as it seems to be a natural progression from the original interface.

Scott


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## Blahman (Mar 4, 2002)

And to top it off, even though there is clearly guide data from Rovi, every single Season pass, my entire To-Do List all listed as no longer recording, and going to Season Pass manager says there is no guide data. All after multiple successful connects and reboots. Nothing recorded on the devices that updated, and still won't unless done manually, what a crock.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

Blahman said:


> And to top it off, even though there is clearly guide data from Rovi, every single Season pass, my entire To-Do List all listed as no longer recording, and going to Season Pass manager says there is no guide data. All after multiple successful connects and reboots. Nothing recorded on the devices that updated, and still won't unless done manually, what a crock.


Yes, you have a unit that's having issues with the update, you're not the only one, but there are plenty more folks that have upgraded successfully, it's strongly suggested that you open a case with Tivo on this.

As far as the promise of unfulfilled features, the only one that comes to mind is the m-stream S3OLED issue that was never resolved because the specs came out after the hardware was shipped and it wasn't resolvable in a software update. But please do expand on how Tivo has broken their promises to you?


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## Worf (Sep 15, 2000)

Well, for my S3, it rebooted last night (saw it reboot), and all I got was no more guide data, but still another update pending. Oddly, it says it's ready for Rovi data as well. Tried to do the daily call and it just said it was all done. 

Guess I'll see what happens when it reboots again.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

I'd go ahead and manually reboot and then force 2 more connections.

Scott


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

The suspense is killing me, as they say. Just forced a connection on my beloved S3/OLED and it grabbed TMS guide data out to 9/21, but still no N version update to deal with. I'd prefer to go through this ordeal today and get it over with.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Wonder when my TiVoHD will update....no messages yet


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## karpodiem (Mar 18, 2008)

My 652 unit that had the original 11.0n beta was upgraded 11.0n.H1

No MPEG-4 channels in the Detroit area w/Comcast (yet), so I can't test MPEG-4.


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## Big Deficit (Jul 8, 2003)

I was "upgraded" to 11.0n.H1 several days ago. This morning I saw an out of guide data warning. Connected with the head office, no issue. Still no data. A restart got rid of the warning...but still no data. So at this point, my HD that was severely neutered by Tivo with a buggy downgrade several months ago is now little more than a cable box/manual vcr combo? At least the premier still seems to be functioning but its lackluster performance and how Tivo treated the HD are the reasons that after owning at least one if not more of every series of Tivo made (up to the premier) and being a huge advocate of them, the premier will be the last I own.


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## karpodiem (Mar 18, 2008)

Big Deficit said:


> I was "upgraded" to 11.0n.H1 several days ago. This morning I saw an out of guide data warning. Connected with the head office, no issue. Still no data. A restart got rid of the warning...but still no data. So at this point, my HD that was severely neutered by Tivo with a buggy downgrade several months ago is now little more than a cable box/manual vcr combo? At least the premier still seems to be functioning but its lackluster performance and how Tivo treated the HD are the reasons that after owning at least one if not more of every series of Tivo made (up to the premier) and being a huge advocate of them, the premier will be the last I own.


I understand your frustration, and I know this guide transition has been a bit of a headache, but the fact they're trying to add MPEG-4 support to a 7 year old piece of hardware is largely unheard of in this industry. Can you imagine the service providers (Comcast) even attempting something like this? Heck no.

I'm very grateful that TiVo is making an attempt to get TiVo HD units working - I recommend TiVo to anyone that has a Cableco DVR.

I'll be picking up a Roamio w/Lifetime at some point - I still love TiVo!


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

karpodiem said:


> I understand your frustration, and I know this guide transition has been a bit of a headache, but the fact they're trying to add MPEG-4 support to a 7 year old piece of hardware is largely unheard of in this industry. Can you imagine the service providers (Comcast) even attempting something like this? Heck no.
> 
> I'm very grateful that TiVo is making an attempt to get TiVo HD units working - I recommend TiVo to anyone that has a Cableco DVR.
> 
> I'll be picking up a Roamio w/Lifetime at some point - I still love TiVo!


The software to accommodate mpeg4 channels was released almost 6 months ago. The hardware always accommodated mpeg4, users have been "pushing" h.264 encoded videos for years. Tivo ported software which was already written for Australian (or New Zealand?) customers years ago.

I'm impressed tivo only decided to eol S1 units. I'm surprised they are releasing software so S2 units will work with Rovi (Tivo) guide data.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

Big Deficit said:


> I was "upgraded" to 11.0n.H1 several days ago. This morning I saw an out of guide data warning. Connected with the head office, no issue. Still no data. A restart got rid of the warning...but still no data. So at this point, my HD that was severely neutered by Tivo with a buggy downgrade several months ago is now little more than a cable box/manual vcr combo? At least the premier still seems to be functioning but its lackluster performance and how Tivo treated the HD are the reasons that after owning at least one if not more of every series of Tivo made (up to the premier) and being a huge advocate of them, the premier will be the last I own.


They have not made them boat anchors, some folks, are having issues with the upgrade and there are several troubleshooting steps, one is to disconnect the network cable for 24-48 hours to allow it to run some maintenance scripts it does internally, also have it manually connect a few times and reboot again. If those don't work reach out to Tivo support on Monday.

My S3OLED and my Dad's THD are both having guide data issues, but plenty of folks managed to get through the upgrade process with issue.

Too bad you stopped at the Premiere, the Roamio is an awesome upgrade, especially with its built in drive formatting.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Big Deficit said:


> I was "upgraded" to 11.0n.H1 several days ago. This morning I saw an out of guide data warning. Connected with the head office, no issue. Still no data. A restart got rid of the warning...but still no data. So at this point, my HD that was severely neutered by Tivo with a buggy downgrade several months ago is now little more than a cable box/manual vcr combo? .


It took 2 reboots and then 2 service connections when my Roamio got the update message and even after the final connection allow time for the data to index. Have you made 2 more connections after the last restart (although I'm assuming it already made one since you got rid of the warning and you just need to allow time to index now).

What buggy downgrade several months ago are you talking about?? Oh and like Diane said the Roamio is great. We upgraded from 2 S3 OLED's to a Roamio.

Scott


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## Big Deficit (Jul 8, 2003)

dianebrat said:


> Too bad you stopped at the Premiere, the Roamio is an awesome upgrade, especially with its built-in drive formatting.


Yeah, I get it. I was so close to pulling the trigger on a Roamio and a few mini's when they were reasonably priced with "all in" a year ago. The poor performance of the Premier made it impossible for me to reward Tivo with another purchase. I kind of regretted that and was waiting to see if a continuous 16 year 10 unit customer who once even did a couple of in-store events and was an early beta tester could get another deal with something less than the absurd $550 "all in" cost, then they neutered my HD. Maybe I'm just wistful for those long lost days when Tivolutionalry (Richard) was here and I felt I belonged. Heck, I even left here for a year or two ( i modded and was admin at several other forums and didn't have the time) and came back to find my account locked (for no reason that I'm aware). I was (am) AndyK and was one of the more active posters here for quite a while. I could probably be convinced to return to the fold if the deal was right, but the current pricing for the Bolt/Roamio and mini's is insane when I already have streaming options that cost less than $50. I still have to reactivate the old S1 that my mom gave back to me to get my $75, unfortunately, my wife ran over the other one sitting in the garage a few years ago after the kids took it down from the shelf to check it out and left it on the garage floor.

FWIW, 3 reboots finally got the guide data back. After the second reboot, the data was there and recording started again but there was no data when I searched for programs (there was guide data when I used by time or channel??).


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## cannonz (Oct 23, 2011)

Just hooked up a 652 that hasn't connected in a while, went thru guided set up hoping would get the update after loading info got pending restart message, is loading new software now. My other 652 that connects daily still has not even received message about change yet.


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## cannonz (Oct 23, 2011)

The 652 that is updating was up to N software the daily connector is only K, does it have to be N or will the K still get the guide update?


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## Russell_ (May 21, 2016)

Due to a variety of reasons (primarily capacitors needing replacement) we've not used our TCD648250B for the past 3 months or so. It's now been fixed and was reconnected last week. Fortunately, we didn't miss anything major since all this happened over the summer.

It's now back as our workhorse and we're getting ready for the new TV season. We only use it OTA. My wife has spent a substantial amount of time putting Season passes in place. She discovered our guide runs out of data on Sep 19. After puzzling about this for a while and trying various things I googled and ended up here.

Please keep in mind that this TCD648250B was powered down for about 3 months. Is it possible I've missed the software update that would help it understand the new Rovi guide format and connect to that new source of truth? It's still on 11.0m-01-2-648 and my understanding from reading this thread is that needs to change - correct?

When folks say reboot twice, do you mean by choosing "Restart the TiVo Digital Media Recorder" from "Restart or Reset System". I've tried that to no avail.

Essentially, I'm trying to determine if I've missed the upgrade due to the the device being powered down for a while and whether I need to take some kind of action myself (e.g., contact the beta address that I see in this thread).

I would greatly appreciate any feedback.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

The update has only been out a few days. I'm still waiting. I gave guide data through September 23. You might force a couple of connections.


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## Russell_ (May 21, 2016)

lew said:


> The update has only been out a few days. I'm still waiting. I gave guide data through September 23. You might force a couple of connections.


Before I started googling, I forced multiple connections ... but still only till and including the 19th/20th (I forget which, not being at the unit, at the moment). Was your suggestion to force connections to update the guide data or to get it to update the software, @lew?


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

Make a connection for guide data. You won't get the software upgrade until tivo has your unit scheduled. Forcing connections won't speed things up.


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

My old S3 must be last in line to get the software update. IIRC, I should get it by no later than 9/15 or are they going to dance right up to the 9/29 deadline with me I wonder.
I suppose I should just retire this old guy, but I'm one of those use it until it literally falls apart people. Once new shows start in a week or so, I don't want to be messing with this, but I don't even know if it will survive the software update. If not, then I'll move on, but I'd like to know that today and not next week or even the week after. Oh well.


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

I have an S3 that has been running along without issue for many years now except for a power supply replacement.

Received the 'n' upgrade two nights ago. Install appeared to happen without issue.

Anyway I have NO guide data at all. System information screen and network screen both show unit successfully connected to service. I've tried numerous reboots and manual connections.

Any suggestions before I call TiVo?

Thanks...


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Since you've tried multiple reboots and connections, check your cable provider listed and see if it looks right. Even if it does, you might try redoing guided setup in order to verify there isn't another option (you can also enter your zip at www.tvguide.com which appears to show the same Rovi options).

Finally you might be in a similar position as this post and need to call support.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10995199#post10995199

Scott


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## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

I don't have much to offer in this thread YET - my S3 648 and THD 652 boxes are both still running perfectly with the "m" software and Tribune data this morning, but I post here in preparation for the unwanted "update" that will undoubtedly show up soon.

Here is the background on why I think my experience might be useful for others when I can finally report it. I am in a remote area of the New Mexico mountains with very limited OTA signals - all from local translators (that seems like very significant information with the Rovi clusterF). I recently just cut the cord and booted Dish as far out of my life as possible. My old S3 boxes had been sitting unused for several years, but last month they both fired right back up and updated to the current release just fine All the local channels are there, and the only issue with the Tribune Guide data is no listing for four of the independent sub-channels being broadcast by the network affiliates.

Now here is the interesting stuff - I had just received a new Bolt, and it MOSTLY came up fine under the old Tribune data too - I had one strange problem with a duplicated channel that could not be tuned in (was not a problem with the S3 boxes), and the Guide data was identical to what I had on the older boxes. And then Rovi showed up, told me to bend over and grab my ankles, and it reamed my Bolt BAD!!! No lube or nuthin', just pure pain! And it went from Bad to BAD BAD BAD AND WORSE over the following two weeks.

Suddenly most of my local channels were gone from the channel list, but they stuffed over 200 other bogus channels in there from all over the entire southwest. A new channel scan after guided setup could still find the local channels, but within a day or two they started being duplicated in a way that made them totally inaccessible. I won't go into the issues with the guide data, other than to say it was at least as bad as the channel lineup problems. The data and lineup for all four zip codes in this mountain community SHOULD have been identical, but all were totally different and required separate fixes.

After working through MANY problems and iterations and updates with the lineup support team, I finally provided them a list of the exact FCC call letters for the 11 currently available channels in these mountains and convinced them to add them exactly like that to the lineup. After that, it took them another four days or so to eventually get the guide data populated correctly (except for channel names, which are still wrong).

So here is where my bolt sits now: there are still over 200 BOGUS channels in the lineup, but I can de-select them and all is fine. The guide data is populated for all channels (even the independents), and it is mostly correct. 

And why should S3 owners give a ratsass about my Bolt experience? Well, it will be interesting to see, when this crapstorm hits my S3 boxes, whether or not all those massive Rovi problems I already had fixed for my Bolt lineup are still fixed on the S3s. That should at least tell us if there are some special issues with the older hardware and software that need special attention, or if it is all just the same terrible Rovi data that needs to be cleaned up for ALL users, no mater what box you are running.

If you live in an area with lots of other TiVo users, count yourself lucky - someone else has probably already dealt with those issues and had them fixed before the change got to you. I'll let y'all know how my S3 boxes make out when this stuff finally hits them!


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

TiVo Bob W said:


> I have an S3 that has been running along without issue for many years now except for a power supply replacement.
> Received the 'n' upgrade two nights ago. Install appeared to happen without issue.
> Anyway I have NO guide data at all. System information screen and network screen both show unit successfully connected to service. I've tried numerous reboots and manual connections.
> Any suggestions before I call TiVo?
> Thanks...


Unplug your network cable for 24-48 hours, there are some built-in maintenance scripts that will run in that scenario that MAY clean up your issue, then plug it back in, force a connection, and restart.

This has been suggested by folks "in the know" several times and has been known to resolve some of the Rovi guide update issues as long as everything else went well.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

V7Goose said:


> So here is where my bolt sits now: there are still over 200 BOGUS channels in the lineup, but I can de-select them and all is fine. The guide data is populated for all channels (even the independents), and it is mostly correct.
> 
> And why should S3 owners give a ratsass about my Bolt experience? Well, it will be interesting to see, when this crapstorm hits my S3 boxes, whether or not all those massive Rovi problems I already had fixed for my Bolt lineup are still fixed on the S3s. That should at least tell us if there are some special issues with the older hardware and software that need special attention, or if it is all just the same terrible Rovi data that needs to be cleaned up for ALL users, no mater what box you are running.
> 
> If you live in an area with lots of other TiVo users, count yourself lucky - someone else has probably already dealt with those issues and had them fixed before the change got to you. I'll let y'all know how my S3 boxes make out when this stuff finally hits them!


We have 2 S3 OLEDs and a Roamio all on Rovi guide data and the lineup information is the same so your S3's should be good with the same provider/OTA zip code selected.

Like you said if someone else has reported the issues and gotten them resolved then the S3's should have fewer lineup issues.

Scott


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## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

HerronScott said:


> We have 2 S3 OLEDs and a Roamio all on Rovi guide data and the lineup information is the same so your S3's should be good with the same provider/OTA zip code selected.
> 
> Like you said if someone else has reported the issues and gotten them resolved then the S3's should have fewer lineup issues.
> 
> Scott


Yup. While I was suffering through all the initial Rovi pain, I kept re-doing guided setup for all four of our local zip codes - as I said, all were very different, but they should NOT have been, since there is only one peak with one set of translators that can even remotely cover this area. I kept reporting the different problems with each zip code until I finally got a message from the lineup team that said basically _'enough already, we know those zip codes should all be the same and we will make the same changes!'_ If I had not done all that testing, the next TiVo user that might live just a mile down the road, but use a different post office, would have run into the same pain and heartache when they got the change or bought their first TiVo.

I think it is important to try other local zip codes when you are having problems with the lineup or guide data - I doubt those folks have any realistic way of knowing if 88312 should be the same as 88345 or not, since I am sure they are not spending all their time researching the FCC database for antenna coverage and signal strength maps!


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

I'd like to thank everyone for the suggestions.

I've been trying to avoid repeating guided setup but I thought it very well might come to that. Before I do that I going to try unplugging cable for a day or two and see what happens.

I'll keep the forum apprised of the results


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

lew said:


> Make a connection for guide data. *You won't get the software upgrade until tivo has your unit scheduled. * Forcing connections won't speed things up.


Is it possible to miss the window?

I've got 7 S3s or S3 HDs in the other room, the 648s on antenna and the 652s on TWC cable cards and antenna.

Until Sunday I didn't realize that the wireless router in there (running DD-WRT in bridge mode) hadn't been talking to the wireless router connected to the cable modem in here for about a week or 2 until "someone" in the family finally mentioned that they were all running out of guide data.

Got the router problem solved (pulled the power plug on both, plugged them back in), forced connections to TiVo on all 7 machines.

All of them still have the Tribune Media Services copyright notice and all are still running the "m" version of the software, with no new added letters or numbers indicating an update newer than the St. TiVo's Day Massacre of a few years back.

Most have guide data out to the 20-something-th, but the most used one runs out Monday, 09/12/16, at 7:30pm and the second most used one has only a day more than that.

I've forced another service connection and done a reboot, to no avail, so I'm wondering if they were supposed to have gotten the OS update while they were offline, and aren't getting it now because they were already supposed to have gotten it a week or 2 ago, but because they were supposed to get it and have it by now, aren't being fed any new Trib/Gracenote listings because they're supposed to be using the Rovi data now.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

Mine is still on 11.0m. It hasn't missed a day of connections.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

I have Gracenote data through 9/22. In the past you'd get new software a connection ( or two) after your unit was scheduled for new software. Tivo never updated this many units in this fast. One poster said forcing a connection gets you dropped to the back of the line.

I'd call if I have less then a week if guide data.


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## Russell_ (May 21, 2016)

unitron said:


> Is it possible to miss the window?
> 
> I've got 7 S3s or S3 HDs in the other room, the 648s on antenna and the 652s on TWC cable cards and antenna.
> 
> ...


I'm in the same boat - "m" version with the machine having been offline until late last week. Guide data running out a week from today.

And, please all post back if and when you see a resolution.


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

lew said:


> I have Gracenote data through 9/22. One poster said forcing a connection gets you dropped to the back of the line.


I think that is an urban myth. Otherwise, they'd get a lot of units all then having to get the download on the last possible day which would defeat the entire purpose of staggering the installations. Now, if I were doing their support, I'd rather deal with those who know what is going on and are trying to be proactive, first, now, and leave the sleepy, blissfully ignorant for last.

Anyway, at this point, I want to be at the back of the line. As long as I continue to get old TMS/Gracenote guide data out to 9/29 with the "M" firmware. However, I'm seriously thinking I should Plan B this thing and set up a bunch of manual recordings this week and move them up at the top of my manager queue just in case.

I thought the OTA HD transition was a nightmare, but turns out that was nothing compared to what I'm reading about for this mess on various community threads.


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

UPDATE: Decided to rerun guided setup last night. Went fairly well but I did have to go through the channels again as the were all messed up. 

Checked this morning and still no guide data. Forced a connection and data is loading now.

I'll update everyone here latter in the day.

Finger crossed


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

cogx said:


> I think that is an urban myth. Otherwise, they'd get a lot of units all then having to get the download on the last possible day which would defeat the entire purpose of staggering the installations. Now, if I were doing their support, I'd rather deal with those who know what is going on and are trying to be proactive, first, now, and leave the sleepy, blissfully ignorant for last.
> 
> Anyway, at this point, I want to be at the back of the line. As long as I continue to get old TMS/Gracenote guide data out to 9/29 with the "M" firmware. However, I'm seriously thinking I should Plan B this thing and set up a bunch of manual recordings this week and move them up at the top of my manager queue just in case.
> 
> I thought the OTA HD transition was a nightmare, but turns out that was nothing compared to what I'm reading about for this mess on various community threads.


I have Gracenote data through 9/24. My next call isn't scheduled until tomorrow. I may try tivo online chat.

I don't know if it's, at least partially, urban myth. Forcing a connection, sometimes, advances the time of your next scheduled connection. My experience is forcing a connection won't get you new software until the servers have your unit tagged for upgrade. If your unit is tagged based on scheduled connection time forcing a connection could delay new software. I don't think the typical tivo customer forces connections.

People who report issues seem to find the errors corrected in a day or two. The "nightmare" seems to be having to go back and deselect channels and a temporarily issue with grouping movies. I would have been happy staying with Gracenote but for the most part tivo is solving issues almost as fast as people are reporting them.'

edited to add: I gave online chat a shot. Rollout to TivoHD units started on September 5. It's a "long update" and he doesn't have an estimated end date.
Do we think tivo has many S3 customers still using dialup?

I won't panic until I stop getting guide data. We know S1 units are scheduled to stop connecting around the 15th and lose guide data by the end of September.

I suspect tivo could pay Gracenote $$ to continue guide data to some customers. I don't know if tivo would rather pay Gracenote, pay overtime to get the upgrade done or have some customers without working units for a few weeks.

I'd feel better if a tivo employee would post something.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

I guess my TiVoHD isn't scheduled yet for the guide transition. I hope it's soon....would love to have it be this week so I can ensure all looks well before the glut of premieres next week....


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

UPDATE 2: Arrived home to find guide data at last. All the channels are listed but unfortunately the majority of the HD channels have no data.

Looks like it's time for a call to TiVo. This whole thing has been nothing but a headache.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

Russell_ said:


> I'm in the same boat - "m" version with the machine having been offline until late last week. Guide data running out a week from today.
> 
> And, please all post back if and when you see a resolution.


A temporary resolution.

Doing several "phone home"s and reboots resulted in TMS/Gracenote guide data updates through the 23rd or 24th, but no new OS version so far.

So I'll have to keep keeping a close eye on them.


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

lew said:


> I suspect tivo could pay Gracenote $$ to continue guide data to some customers. I don't know if tivo would rather pay Gracenote, pay overtime to get the upgrade done or have some customers without working units for a few weeks.


A different thread made it sound like there was zero chance of an extension for the TMS/Gracenote guide data, but who knows. I also now have TMS/Gracenote data out through 9/24, actually early AM 9/25. My hunch is that all of us with older units will be scheduled to get software N by no later than this coming weekend.


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## Big Deficit (Jul 8, 2003)

So, has anyone opened a ticket via email on the HD's loss of guide data and been contacted back? I contacted support on Saturday evening, was told on the 'message sent' page that a support specialist would contact me within 24 hrs, received an immediate email giving me a report #......that's it. It's Tuesday now, no further email or phone contact, not a peep beyond the Bolt+ announcement. Not that it's important now, but if you say we'll call/email back? Do it! 
Oh, and my NFL football wishlist that I used for many years no longer works properly, it now only finds some Sunday games and no Monday/Thursday/Sunday night games at all. I used it to manually set up the records so the 1hr default padding didn't prevent recording, having only 2 tuners. New data source, find new slightly more difficult ways to what was easy.


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

FINAL UPDATE: TiVo CS had me repeat GS again last night to no avail. They suggested one more thing I that tried this morning...

Repeated GS using the wrong ZIP and provider. Let it go through the motions and forced a connection. Once completed I ran GS again this time using the correct info. It worked. All channels now have the correct data as they should. Had something to do with clearing the garbage can and the cache.

Hopefully this will help someone else in a similar situation.


Thanks again everyone


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

Interesting, just got a message on my S3 (648) that says I'll get the software update in the next 24 hours.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

TiVo Bob W said:


> Repeated GS using the wrong ZIP and provider. Let it go through the motions and forced a connection. Once completed I ran GS again this time using the correct info. It worked. All channels now have the correct data as they should. Had something to do with clearing the garbage can and the cache.


Yes, the failure of the garbage collection process is why there's a recommendation to leave the NIC unplugged for 24/48 hours, there's a GC maintenance script that runs when it's been idle an extended amount of time.


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

dianebrat said:


> Yes, the failure of the garbage collection process is why there's a recommendation to leave the NIC unplugged for 24/48 hours, there's a GC maintenance script that runs when it's been idle an extended amount of time.


I also had this in my old All Things TiVo doc about GC, not sure if it is true or not, never had a reason to try it before:

"Someone figured out that going to 'Settings > Channels > Channel' list then hitting enter, this will trigger a garbage collection and guide download + index."


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

dianebrat said:


> Yes, the failure of the garbage collection process is why there's a recommendation to leave the NIC unplugged for 24/48 hours, there's a GC maintenance script that runs when it's been idle an extended amount of time.


I didn't doubt you but had the time to redo GS so I thought, why not.

Anyway, the FINAL UPDATE above may not have been the end of the issue. Went to watch TV a little later and had a message of a pending Service Update. Forced a connection and sure enough there was another update. Have not heard anything about this but there it is. Unfortunately it's been a few hours now and TiVo still shows "Preparing the service update." Hopefully it will be good by morning. Like I already stated this has been nothing but a headache.


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## Russell_ (May 21, 2016)

cogx said:


> A different thread made it sound like there was zero chance of an extension for the TMS/Gracenote guide data, but who knows. I also now have TMS/Gracenote data out through 9/24, actually early AM 9/25. My hunch is that all of us with older units will be scheduled to get software N by no later than this coming weekend.


My TMS data too now extends through 9/24 - up from 9/19.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

I just got a message on my S3_652 with a "Pending Restart" to boot.










So now, I have to power cycle to restart (soft reboot does not work for me).

Update: It finally finished updating for over an hour and its now at 11.0n.H1, and no guide data.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

TiVo Bob W said:


> I didn't doubt you but had the time to redo GS so I thought, why not.
> 
> Anyway, the FINAL UPDATE above may not have been the end of the issue. Went to watch TV a little later and had a message of a pending Service Update. Forced a connection and sure enough there was another update. Have not heard anything about this but there it is. Unfortunately it's been a few hours now and TiVo still shows "Preparing the service update." Hopefully it will be good by morning. Like I already stated this has been nothing but a headache.


On your experience I redid guided setup and it appeared to work.
However as you noticed, they have pushed another update, I suspect you'll find you're on revision J which may have been released to help in these outlying scenarios where we're seeing failures.


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## jtso (Oct 2, 2009)

My TiVo HD updated this evening. I got the TiVo service message pictured above by ThAbtO, then I forced a connection. The upgrade went without problems, although it took about 3 hours complete the upgrade. Then I had to force another connection to download the guide data. Now I've got guide data out to September 26. So far so good.


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## cwerdna (Feb 22, 2001)

jtso said:


> I got the TiVo service message pictured above by ThAbtO.


Ditto on my TiVo HD. Also received the message 9/13.

I'm on software version 11.0n-B1-01-2-652, at the moment.

Let's just hope that I also am not left screaming about the apparently crappy Rovi guide data.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

cwerdna said:


> ditto on my tivo hd. Also received the message 9/13.
> 
> I'm on software version 11.0n-b1-01-2-652, at the moment.
> 
> Let's just hope that i also am not left screaming about the apparently crappy rovi guide data.


+1


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## Russell_ (May 21, 2016)

Got the message described previously. Here's mine:









I then looked at settings and it said "Pending Restart", so I went to the menu item to reboot the 648. It rebooted and then went ahead and installed the update. Said just a few minutes and took just a few minutes and happened before I could capture that screen. The next phase is "Preparing the service update". You can see what it says below:


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

Got my update late last night, so let it run overnight. It's up and running with software 11.0n this morning, but my channel lineup looks to be a bit of a horror show. Won't have time to deal with it until tomorrow. But, at least it made it through the software update, that was the most important part for me.


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

On the "J" update now. As stated above my line-up is a "horror show." Tried everything that was suggested to correct it by TiVo CS with no luck. 

Called in and the message stated approximately a two minute wait. Wait for more than an hour and no one picked up. Come on TiVo. I know you are having issues but change the message if you can not pick-up in a timely manner.

Anyway, was told on the previous call that if the suggestions did not work the would have to rebuild the entire line-up and had no idea on an ETA.

I went through this before when Comcast purchased Adelphia in this region. Getting the line-up mostly straight took months. And after years there were still about six stations that had incorrect data. Hopefully it goes much, much smoother this time.


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## worachj (Oct 14, 2006)

My model 648 was updated this morning. The OTA Guide data was not too bad, but there are some problems.

Version: 11.0n.H1.01-2-648


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## cannonz (Oct 23, 2011)

My other 652 got the update coming message as did all the S2's.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

Still no Update. I guess I'll be in the last group.


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## Russell_ (May 21, 2016)

Russell_ said:


> Got the message described previously. Here's mine:
> 
> View attachment 26431
> 
> ...


All recording fine this evening. I'm on 11.0n.H1-01-2-648.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Just got message this evening. Since I have nothing scheduled the next 3 days that I really care about, I may try to let things happen naturally.

I'm also hoping the fact that I only subscribe to locals that problems may be limited to very few.


Sent from my iPad Mini 3 using Tapatalk


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Impatient and would like to have mine settled in before football on Sunday. Kicked off a manual restart and we will go from there.


Sent from my iPad Mini 3 using Tapatalk


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## sbourgeo (Nov 10, 2000)

I just got 11.0n.H1-01-2-652 on my TiVo HD. Is this version MPEG-4 friendly?


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

sbourgeo said:


> I just got 11.0n.H1-01-2-652 on my TiVo HD. Is this version MPEG-4 friendly?


For HD's it shoudl include all prior updates (including the MPEG4 update).

Scott


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Our HD got the message yesterday but hasn't updated yet. Our 2 S3 OLED's are still on 11.0n.H1 but no problems with it.

Scott


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Mine is installing the software now. I'm about 1.5 hours into the "this could take an hour or longer".


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## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

I posted earlier in this thread (several days ago) about how miserable my experience was when the Rovi Rape hit my Bolt - 2-3 weeks of hell. After fighting the battles to get the channel lineup and guide data fixed, I wondered just how bad things were going to be when the Rovi Rape finally hit one my S3 boxes. Well, it has happened, and there is both good and bad news.

My THD-652 got screwed last night. The good news is that the hard-won battles to fix the channel list and guide data DID show up on the THD. They stuffed the same billions of bogus channels in the lineup, but the correct ones were still there and do work. The guide data seems to be the same as the Bolt, which is to say mostly correct.

The bad news is that my schedules and season passes are FUBAR. Thankfully I don't really use this box all that much now, so I had fewer things to fix. There is no rhyme or reason for what still works and what does not. Most of my season passes for morning news programs still LOOKED right, but show NOTHING scheduled. When I open them, they show something like "11 upcoming episodes", but then when I check the To Do list, each episode is marked "No longer in the program guide." So the season pass says on the first screen that they ARE in the guide, but then the list of upcoming episodes shows all of them but that none of them will be recorded.

These are not a case of the program name changing - if I create another IDENTICAL season pass, then both the old one and the new one show all the episodes with double-checks, but then deleting the new SP removes all the scheduled recordings from the first one too. The only fix is to completely delete all the original season passes that no longer show scheduled recordings and re-create them.

Some wish lists have changed too, particularly my "Masterpiece" wishlist (this is a well-reported problem in other forums). Not able yet to say how many of these problems are related to changed guide data/program names, and how many are just stupid unknown foul-ups like the season passes.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

V7Goose said:


> ....The only fix is to completely delete all the original season passes that no longer show scheduled recordings and re-create them......


If guide data populates correctly and all I have to do is redo my SPs on my TiVoHD, this weekend before the premieres next week....then I am ok with that.


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## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

But do not count on that unless you know that your zip code lineup has ALREADY been fixed! It may or may not have already been addressed by someone with a newer model that has been raped earlier. If I did not have the Bolt and had already spent HUGE amounts of time reporting problems and begging the lineup team to fix the problems, it would just be starting for me now. For all I know, I may be the ONLY TiVo customer in these mountains.

I cannot say how widespread those problems are across the country, but from everything I have seen, they are to be totally expected for anyone with OTA reception in a rural area served by translators instead of primary networks.

Bottom line is that any lineup problems or guide data issues seem to be identical for ALL models, so once those are fixed for the first person reporting them, they will be fixed for everyone using that same zip code AND provider. But the S3 models have their own issues with previously created schedules that will have to be addressed by each person, even if the lineup is already correct.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

yeah agreed. All of the potential problems are likely to be easier for me as I only sub to locals. And my SP list is only about 25. Thus, managing the fallout shouldn't be too bad for me.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Ok, for anyone with a TiVoHD that has gone thru the process already....how long did it take to get past the "preparing service update, may take an hour or longer" screen....


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## danm628 (May 14, 2002)

jlb said:


> Ok, for anyone with a TiVoHD that has gone thru the process already....how long did it take to get past the "preparing service update, may take an hour or longer" screen....


I was in the beta and when my S3 updated it took over 3 hours. All at the "hour or longer" screen. It has to delete all of the old guide data which is slow. Once that was completed it made a connection and downloaded new channel list. Then a little later it made another connection and downloaded new guide data which took a while to install.

- Dan


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

danm628 said:


> I was in the beta and when my S3 updated it took over 3 hours. All at the "hour or longer" screen. It has to delete all of the old guide data which is slow. Once that was completed it made a connection and downloaded new channel list. Then a little later it made another connection and downloaded new guide data which took a while to install.
> 
> - Dan


Thanks Dan. So I am still very much in the same window then. Is it ok to try and force the second connection, once it appears the channel list is populated?


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## danm628 (May 14, 2002)

jlb said:


> Thanks Dan. So I am still very much in the same window then. Is it ok to try and force the second connection, once it appears the channel list is populated?


Once it shows the call is completed in network/phone you can force the next connection.

Having said that it doesn't save that much time unless you are standing watching the full conversion. It seems to schedule the next call about 30 minutes after finishing the previous step. So if you stand watching it you might save an hour in the conversion.

Personally I made one of the calls earlier since I happened to walk by the TiVo and checked it. The other one went on it's own schedule since I was doing other things at home.

I think they timed it like this assuming that it would happen in the middle of the night. So a 2 AM reboot, 3 hours to delete data and a couple of connections to get the updated lineup and guide data. It would be done by sometime between 6 and 7 AM. Most people wouldn't notice the downtime.

- Dan


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Thanks again Dan. I'm working from home today and walk by the TV often so if I see the first call completed, I may just force #2....

EDITED to Add: actually, I might look at the list first and since I only sub to locals, bop in there and make sure I tick only the channels I receive....


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## danm628 (May 14, 2002)

jlb said:


> Thanks again Dan. I'm working from home today and walk by the TV often so if I see the first call completed, I may just force #2....


Watch for the "out of guide data" message. That's when it's done and ready to call.

I switched to the beta when I was working at home. So every 30 minutes or so I went and checked on it.

- Dan


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Finally finished the software load. I even had a message on screen to connect to get guide data. Did that and it zipped through the entire connection process super fast. Weird. Then I forced a second connection again and now it seems to be doing the usual loading of (a lot of) data.

I did peek in between connections at the cable provider and channel list. Still properly lists my usual provider and only has ticked off the same channels as before. 

Based on rate of loading I think it will be loaded in about 20 min, but I have no idea how long it will take to index everything.


Sent from my iPad Mini 3 using Tapatalk


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## Pressed250 (Sep 15, 2016)

TiVO HD, downloaded the update last night, performed a manual re-boot this morning. Just about three hours passed and still have the "Preparing the service update" screen. I am guessing it will take about an hour, possibly longer. ;-)

I plan to give it six hours to do its thing ... does that sound like ample time before doing a power-cycle?

In some parallel universe, I envision a progress bar ...


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Pressed250 said:


> TiVO HD, downloaded the update last night, performed a manual re-boot this morning. Just about three hours passed and still have the "Preparing the service update" screen. I am guessing it will take about an hour, possibly longer. ;-)
> 
> I plan to give it six hours to do its thing ... does that sound like ample time before doing a power-cycle?
> 
> In some parallel universe, I envision a progress bar ...


Read my messages from above. My TiVoHD took about 3.5 hours to get past the install.


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## LynnL999 (Oct 7, 2002)

My HD updated. Thanks to the previous struggles, the lineup and data seem mostly okay. But some things that should be getting caught by season passes aren't. 

I wonder if this is because the pre-update season pass had the show removed during the TBA guide mess. This is mostly a backup box for me, so I'll give it a week to see if things sort out before re-creating all my SP's. Especially since I can no longer do so online.

(Also can we not call this "rape?" I mean, yes, inconvenient, annoying, etc., but let's not drastically overstate.)


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

because my SP list is rather small to begin with, about 25, I may just plan to recreate if anything looks off....


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

LynnL999 said:


> (Also can we not call this "rape?" I mean, yes, inconvenient, annoying, etc., but let's not drastically overstate.)


I've actually reported that post for that reason, that's unacceptable language in a forum like this, but I would say the poster doesn't appear to care about anyone else's viewpoints.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Ok, I have forced multiple connections and all that. I still show "program info has run out". My system information shows an "indexing" date of Thursday, December 31. 

How long should I have to wait before the indexing actually kicks in? 

I've tried rearranging some SPs but that didn't seem to help.

Do I just need to leave it for a few hours?

Should I rerun Guided Setup?


All else looks fine, right software version, right provider, etc. 

Am I just impatient?


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

TiVo Support wants me to rerun GS.....ok, I guess


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## Pressed250 (Sep 15, 2016)

Good news: after ~4 hours I got a clean boot-up. Channel lineup appears unchanged.

Bad news: after multiple "successful" service connections, I continue to have "Program info has run out." Those service connections are quite short, so clearly the motherlode is NOT being downloaded. Threw a reboot in there: no joy.

Going through GS now ...


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

That's exactly what I'm doing now too


Sent from my iPad Mini 3 using Tapatalk


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

One positive thing for me...after it disconnected, the loading info now says "organizing". I haven't seen that with the other attempts I had before.... fingers crossed.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Ok this may be progress after running GS. It "organized" and then said I had 1 day of data to get started. And then would update later with more. Then if I go to live tv it says "titles available soon"

I then went into system info and it had (finally) updated the indexing date to today.

It also said next connection scheduled for a time 30min hence.

I forced that connection. I still don't see guide data yet but now I think I force one more connection or two and then wait a while.


Sent from my iPad Mini 3 using Tapatalk


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## Pressed250 (Sep 15, 2016)

On a related note, yesterday I received a message titled (yes, it was in all caps) RECORDING WILL FAIL AFTER 9/29.

In short, it explained that the combination of TiVO Premiere + dial-up connection = no more program data. 9/15 would be the last download.

That struck me as VERY odd, given: (a) I have a TiVO HD and (b) I use a wired Ethernet connection.

Anyone else get that message? Or am I just EXTRA lucky?


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

IT doesn't make me warm and fuzzy but I guess I need to try and wait now. I reran GS, forced a couple more connections, etc. I don't yet have populated date but maybe it will take a little time now.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Just for reference, in a Twitter chat I had with TiVo support, once guided setup has completed, it could take a few "hours" to populate the data. And it will probably do a 7 day chunk. And then in 24-36 hours it should grab another chunk to go out to the full 14 days.


Sent from my iPad Mini 3 using Tapatalk


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

FWIW to those running guided setup.

For those of us earlier in the process there was a very good suggestion that worked reliably and that was to rerun guided setup for a different ZIP and CableCo, then rerun bringing it back to the correct one.

We tried guided setup in the past for the same CableCo and it didn't always reset the guide data, using the bogus lineup forced it to clear previous entries completely.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

jlb said:


> Just for reference, in a Twitter chat I had with TiVo support, once guided setup has completed, it could take a few "hours" to populate the data. And it will probably do a 7 day chunk. And then in 24-36 hours it should grab another chunk to go out to the full 14 days.
> 
> Sent from my iPad Mini 3 using Tapatalk


Are you planning on cross-posting every time?


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## Nicholsen (Nov 4, 2007)

Pressed250 said:


> On a related note, yesterday I received a message titled (yes, it was in all caps) RECORDING WILL FAIL AFTER 9/29.
> 
> In short, it explained that the combination of TiVO Premiere + dial-up connection = no more program data. 9/15 would be the last download.
> 
> ...


You are not alone! My TiVo HDXL got exactly the same (and very odd) message. Interestingly, my regular HD's did not.

One HD (OTA only) upgraded quickly and successfully. The second HD and the HDXL (with cable cards) are now in the upgrade process. Both have been downloading for 3+ hours now. The process is slow. However, I remain guardedly optimistic.

Yes, the upgrade is a bit of a pain. However, I think Rovi/TiVo deserve a tip of the hat for doing what is required to keep 10 year old equipment operational. :] Change is never easy.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

lpwcomp said:


> Are you planning on cross-posting every time?


No....I just ended up in similar convos in both. Sorry if that bothered you.

Sent from my iPad Mini 3 using Tapatalk


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

dianebrat said:


> FWIW to those running guided setup.
> 
> For those of us earlier in the process there was a very good suggestion that worked reliably and that was to rerun guided setup for a different ZIP and CableCo, then rerun bringing it back to the correct one.
> 
> We tried guided setup in the past for the same CableCo and it didn't always reset the guide data, using the bogus lineup forced it to clear previous entries completely.


When did you rerun with the real lineup? Right after it said it was done with the bogus or did you wait for it to populate, etc? And how bogus....same level of service in a diff locale or same locale with different channels?

Thanks!

Sent from my iPad Mini 3 using Tapatalk


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

jlb said:


> No....I just ended up in similar convos in both. Sorry if that bothered you.
> 
> Sent from my iPad Mini 3 using Tapatalk


Once probably wouldn't have bothered me but you did it twice within a few hours.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

I'm sorry if my anxiety over the problem manifested itself in a way that bothered you. I'm a long time member and understand your frustration.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

jlb said:


> When did you rerun with the real lineup? Right after it said it was done with the bogus or did you wait for it to populate, etc? And how bogus....same level of service in a diff locale or same locale with different channels?


Here's the way I did it, and it worked fine, keep in mind I had guide data listed in the system summary, but TBA on all channels and no actual guide data.

Did a service connect to be sure
Ran Guided Setup for my ZIP and chose Comcast as a provider, I am not a comcast customer
After connection verified I had channels listed and guide data listed, if only for today, channels didn't matter, only that they had guide data
Ran Guided Setup and chose my correct Verizon as provider
After connection verified my channels were now correct and guide data was showing


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Ok this is interesting. Waaaay back when I first got my TiVoHD and set it up, i put in my zip code of 01950. That's Newburyport, MA. The only cable provider that came up was Comcast Ipswich. That's a few towns over but it's all part of the same overall lineup for greater Boston/eastern MA. It's what I've used since installation. After watching some Netflix, I went in to the system info. It now reads Comcast Newburyport. I did not choose that. But obvi it's more appropriate. I'm guessing perhaps there was some form of conflict in my data. Anyways, it's finishing a connection. And based on the "loading info" readout, I'm getting a new big chunk of data. 

Perhaps this is finally it for me. I'm also prepared for the fact I could possibly have to redo SPs, but given the channel numbers and stations are exactly the same, I am hoping not.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

dianebrat said:


> Here's the way I did it, and it worked fine, keep in mind I had guide data listed in the system summary, but TBA on all channels and no actual guide data.
> 
> 
> Did a service connect to be sure
> ...


I think what I posted just before you kinda of equates to what you did. It just turns out this "new" lineup that pushed "itself" is more appropriate for me and will hopefully work fine now.

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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

So we are definitely making progress here. Now about 33% thru the "loading". Data is starting to populate which can be seen in the guide itself and in live TV. Finally. Looking ok










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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

At 73% loaded. Interestingly, the descriptions all seem to have an * after them. Oh well.


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## phox_mulder (Feb 23, 2006)

jlb said:


> At 73% loaded. Interestingly, the descriptions all seem to have an * after them. Oh well.


That's normal.
The * just means it's Rovi data instead of Gracenote/Tribune.

phox


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

jlb said:


> I think what I posted just before you kinda of equates to what you did. It just turns out this "new" lineup that pushed "itself" is more appropriate for me and will hopefully work fine now.


Actually it doesn't, previously people were doing guided setup with their existing settings of ZIP and CableCo and were not having the issue resolved, the different step was placing a bogus entry in thus forcing the unit to reload ALL guide data. However guided setup is supposed to pull all new data, there's the suspicion that it wasn't always doing so if you made no changes in provider.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Yeah, but however it happened, my provider did change. Not sure how, but it did and it's more appropriate now


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## earget (Mar 16, 2014)

Nicholsen said:


> You are not alone! My TiVo HDXL got exactly the same (and very odd) message. Interestingly, my regular HD's did not.
> 
> One HD (OTA only) upgraded quickly and successfully. The second HD and the HDXL (with cable cards) are now in the upgrade process. Both have been downloading for 3+ hours now. The process is slow. However, I remain guardedly optimistic.
> 
> Yes, the upgrade is a bit of a pain. However, I think Rovi/TiVo deserve a tip of the hat for doing what is required to keep 10 year old equipment operational. :] Change is never easy.


I got this same message on a broadband connected HD. I have a pending restart scheduled for 2am, and nothing recording tonight. Forcing a reboot now and we shall see whether I come out the other end with the new guide or not.
The New Tivo (Rovi) gets no credit from me for this cluster. I paid for lifetime service and expect to receive it. The service was always for the guide, and if they stop providing that, they break their contracts, pure and simple. The poor communication from Rovi over this change and the multiple bad experiences = a dysfunctional, unpromising start.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

When I went to bed last night, I was at about 90% loaded on the data. This morning all looks great. Data is here, SPs all look fine, no TBA, etc. went very well ultimately, for me. 

TVoHD with a sub only to lifeline basic on Comcast (essentially just locals).


Sent from my iPad Mini 3 using Tapatalk


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

jlb said:


> Ok, I have forced multiple connections and all that. I still show "program info has run out".
> 
> All else looks fine, right software version, right provider, etc.
> 
> Am I just impatient?


All your connections completed successfully after that? I found that I was getting an S01 on the next connection after the update and needed to do another reboot to resolve that followed by 2 more service connections to complete the process (adn allow many hours for the load and indexing to complete before checking ToDo lists etc).

Scott


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

they did complete successfully, but likely not pulling full data. Once (somehow) my provider changed, it pulled the mother-load.

All looks great today. There were 2 or 3 SPs that I had to delete and recreate. Other than that, all is swell.


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## Russell_ (May 21, 2016)

Can someone with a TCD 648 bring up Search By Title and let me know if the area where input is reflected looks "funny" (the box goes off the left edge of the screen) as shown below:


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

Russell_ said:


> Can someone with a TCD 648 bring up Search By Title and let me know if the area where input is reflected looks "funny" (the box goes off the left edge of the screen) as shown below


Confirmed. Good thing the inputted letters still align properly on the screen.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

Russell_ said:


> Can someone with a TCD 648 bring up Search By Title and let me know if the area where input is reflected looks "funny" (the box goes off the left edge of the screen) as shown below:
> 
> View attachment 26450


As best I remember it's always been that way, ever since the S1s.


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

For me, the Rovi guide data channel listing wasn't as bad as I initially feared. I do have a few changes I reported, but luckily for me they are not for channels I have season passes associated with. However, one thing that initially threw me for a loop is that the Rovi data has a channel associated with the non-CableCARD digital sub channels - so, there are multiple channel 94s, multiple channel 95s, etc. It took me a lot more clicking to un-check all those than I ever had to do with the TMS/Gracenote data. All in all, though, I'm one of those that feared 3rd degree burns and ended up with just an annoying, but tolerable rash. In fact, my old S3's UI is actually quite a bit snappier after the 11.0n upgrade, so I'll take that as a silver lining.

As for actual quality of the Rovi program data that affects things like not having recordings for past episodes when you have it set to only record new episodes, that remains to be seen. Not that the TMS/Gracenote was perfect in that regard, but the forums here seem to suggest the quality is below what we had before. I guess as long as it doesn't outright skip recordings that one intended it to record, as that would be unacceptable.


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

unitron said:


> As best I remember it's always been that way, ever since the S1s.


Could be, it's funny how one can just adapt and not even notice something like that after a period of time.


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

cogx said:


> Could be, it's funny how one can just adapt and not even notice something like that after a period of time.


This is so funny....I was thinking, it's not that way on my TiVoHD. So I went over, and sure enough it was. I am guessing I never really noticed, or adapted, because even though the shape rolls off the side, the entered letters do not....


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Did someone report they had gotten 11.0n.J1? My 2 S3 OLED's still have 11.0n.H1 and our HD just upgraded to 11.0n.H1.

Scott


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

Russell_ said:


> Can someone with a TCD 648 bring up Search By Title and let me know if the area where input is reflected looks "funny" (the box goes off the left edge of the screen) as shown below:
> 
> View attachment 26450


Mine looks exactly the same. If you look in the user's guide you can see that it has always looked this way.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

HerronScott said:


> Did someone report they had gotten 11.0n.J1? My 2 S3 OLED's still have 11.0n.H1 and our HD just upgraded to 11.0n.H1


11.0n.H1 is the publicly released released version, I believe J1 is in the beta groups.


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## wtkflhn (May 12, 2006)

Since the no longer have and S2 group, I'll ask here. Has anyone got the update for the S2? I got the upgrade message on the 9/14. But nothing since then. 

 UPDATE: I got the update on Saturday, 9/17. All went well.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

wtkflhn said:


> Since the no longer have and S2 group, I'll ask here. Has anyone got the update for the S2? I got the upgrade message on the 9/14. But nothing since then.


I thought mine had been since the descriptions on the recordings I looked at had "* Copyright Rovi, Inc." at the end. Then I realized that the shows I looked at weren't grouping and had probably been transferred from the Premiere. When I looked at one in a group, it did not have the "* Copyright Rovi, Inc.". My S2 is difficult to look at directly as it resides in someone else's bedroom.

Then again, there's this thread


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## Pressed250 (Sep 15, 2016)

For those experiencing the "my Guide is wonky" problem, here is another tool for your consideration:
TiVO > Messages & Settings > Clear Program Information and To Do List

As the name implies, that command scrubs the entire guide clean ... and for better or worse, your To Do List, SPs, and thumb ratings get the same treatment. Oh, and the command takes a solid hour.

In any case, it fixes the problem. I imagine it achieves the same result as the less obvious though far more elegant "dosey-doe with my zip code" technique.

I appreciate the assistance from those on this board, and hopefully the above contribution will help someone out.

For the life of me, I cannot imagine how the "average" user makes it through this SNAFU.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

My Series 3 used to have episode numbers displayed on the shows, but now with Rovi, they are gone. 

For example, for "This Old House", the next airing should show episode #3513, now that line is gone.
Good thing the Roamio still shows it, even though its not fully correct (#3613 for the same episode.)


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

ThAbtO said:


> My Series 3 used to have episode numbers displayed on the shows, but now with Rovi, they are gone.
> 
> For example, for "This Old House", the next airing should show episode #3513, now that line is gone.
> Good thing the Roamio still shows it, even though its not fully correct (#3613 for the same episode.)


I noticed that on a couple of shows already as well. I'm sure there are one or more threads dedicated to this issue too. Clearly TMS/Gracenote data has been superior to what Rovi has been doing. It makes me wonder why there is even a market big enough for more than one guide data provider in the first place. How did Rovi ever win business over Gracenote is my question now.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

cogx said:


> I noticed that on a couple of shows already as well. I'm sure there are one or more threads dedicated to this issue too. Clearly TMS/Gracenote data has been superior to what Rovi has been doing. It makes me wonder why there is even a market big enough for more than one guide data provider in the first place. How did Rovi ever win business over Gracenote is my question now.


1. They own the patent on the grid guide so probably made package deals.

2. Cheaper (in every sens of the word, unfortunately)


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## jlb (Dec 13, 2001)

Perhaps it's not that big a deal for me as my SP list is not big, but for most things I just use "first run and repeats" for everything and sometimes I add "with dupes"


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## KustomMerc (Jun 1, 2007)

ok Tivo said to re set up guide twice then do a power down then re-set up guide twice , then do that again and it should work.........well I can tell you with all these set-ups and power downs and restarts I still don't have any guide or a machine that will record off of a season manager. When I was told the bad code came with the firmware update I expected Tivo to fix it or ? send me a new black bolt! (they cost about the same with life serv.) I can't keep spending hours hoping I get the dam guide do restarts and set-ups.......hello?


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## Pressed250 (Sep 15, 2016)

KustomMerc said:


> ok Tivo said to re set up guide twice then do a power down then re-set up guide twice , then do that again and it should work.........well I can tell you with all these set-ups and power downs and restarts I still don't have any guide or a machine that will record off of a season manager. When I was told the bad code came with the firmware update I expected Tivo to fix it or ? send me a new black bolt! (they cost about the same with life serv.) I can't keep spending hours hoping I get the dam guide do restarts and set-ups.......hello?


It sounds like you are stuck in the same problem that I had. I solved the problem (see post above) as follows:

[1] TiVO > Messages & Settings > Clear Program Information and To Do List
[2] *Before* connecting to service, perform a Guided Setup

See the important caveats wrt step 1, as it wipes out a bunch of your data.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Are you on cable or OTA? If cable, is your cable provider selected correctly after the upgrade. If OTA, there are definite lineup issues especially if you are getting stations on translators or from multiple markets.

Scott


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## karpodiem (Mar 18, 2008)

*Edit, see post from 9/18. Things ended up working out.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

karpodiem said:


> Tried imaging 11.0n.J1 onto another TiVo, getting a green screen of death. Thought it might have been the drive of that other TiVo, tried imaging another TiVo - same result.
> .


Had this other TiVo already been updated to 11.0n.H1 at least with the Rovi guide data? If not, I'm pretty sure you're going to have to stick with 11.0m or 11.0n.B1 with that one until it's updated. Of course it could be caused by something else, but that's my first thought. 

Scott


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## pL86 (Oct 11, 2009)

The Rovi update was pushed out to my Tivo HD yesterday. My Tivo was already on 11.0n and it's gone relatively smoothly. I have a 100+ season passes, both cable and OTA channels, and only one OTA program needed to be re-done. The biggest issue I've seen so far is how the season passes schedule recordings of repeats. Most of my season passes are set to record "new and repeats." The season passes were smart enough not to record repeats of an episode once it was recorded until after a certain time period had passed. If an episode was recorded at 9am Friday, the season pass wouldn't record a repeat of the episode that aired at 5pm later that day or even one week later, even though it was set to record "new and repeats." Only 30 days after the initial recording does the season pass start scheduling repeats. That's how it used to work but since the Rovi update, the season passes have gone dumb and now schedules every repeat for recording. I had to delete a number of repeats that was set to record just hours after the first recording. I can change the season passes to record new only but aside from the time it will take, I lose the capacity to be reminded of repeats later. I don't really understand why a change in the guide data provider changed the way the season pass worked.


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## equinoxe (Aug 26, 2007)

Patience is necessary -- I got the 11.0n.H1 upgrade started Thurs afternoon. After about 5 1/2 to 6 hours of "This will a take about an hour, maybe longer...", the Tivo started up and began downloading new guide data. After another 6hrs of loading data status slowly creeping toward completion, I had about 10days of guide data and no ToDo List or "find by title" until indexing was complete and another large data ingest completed. By Friday the Tivo Guide looked complete (about 12-14 days) and my Season Passes were scheduled with some minor duplication's and one missing show.

Now... along comes 11.0n.J1 and the process has started all over again. Grrrrr....

BTW - I have a pretty extensive cable lineup from VZ FiOS so I guess that is the reason for so much time and guide data.


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## InFromTheCold (May 29, 2008)

pL86 said:


> The Rovi update was pushed out to my Tivo HD yesterday. My Tivo was already on 11.0n and it's gone relatively smoothly. I have a 100+ season passes, both cable and OTA channels, and only one OTA program needed to be re-done. The biggest issue I've seen so far is how the season passes schedule recordings of repeats. Most of my season passes are set to record "new and repeats." The season passes were smart enough not to record repeats of an episode once it was recorded until after a certain time period had passed. If an episode was recorded at 9am Friday, the season pass wouldn't record a repeat of the episode that aired at 5pm later that day or even one week later, even though it was set to record "new and repeats." Only 30 days after the initial recording does the season pass start scheduling repeats. That's how it used to work but since the Rovi update, the season passes have gone dumb and now schedules every repeat for recording. I had to delete a number of repeats that was set to record just hours after the first recording. I can change the season passes to record new only but aside from the time it will take, I lose the capacity to be reminded of repeats later. I don't really understand why a change in the guide data provider changed the way the season pass worked.


I believe it was in this thread that I read that the Rovi data doesn't include episode numbers. As a result, there's no longer a way to distinguish the new from the repeats. Going to be annoying, for sure.


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## pL86 (Oct 11, 2009)

InFromTheCold said:


> I believe it was in this thread that I read that the Rovi data doesn't include episode numbers. As a result, there's no longer a way to distinguish the new from the repeats. Going to be annoying, for sure.


Seriously? So even if the season pass is set to record new only, it's going to record every episode?! I have many season passes set to record shows that literally have a 100+ airings in a 10 day period (any series on Disney, Nickelodeon or Cartoon Network). I now have to delete all these recordings manually if I want to continue using season passes? And if I don't, I'm suppose to monitor the channel guides and manually set up new recordings when they air? What exactly is the point of paying a fee for guide data and DVR functionality if my DVR has effectively been turned into a VCR? This makes me seriously consider finding non-Tivo options. If this is how Tivo is going to work from now on, it's genuinely a dealbreaker for me.


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## danm628 (May 14, 2002)

InFromTheCold said:


> I believe it was in this thread that I read that the Rovi data doesn't include episode numbers. As a result, there's no longer a way to distinguish the new from the repeats. Going to be annoying, for sure.


That's true for some shows. Others seem to have reasonable episode numbers.

My season passes (or 1P) on my S3 and Roamio aren't recording every episode of shows. But I apparently am not recording shows where this is an issue.

So depending on what shows you watch this is either a non-issue (like me) or a huge problem (various other people).

- Dan


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## cwerdna (Feb 22, 2001)

cwerdna said:


> Ditto on my TiVo HD. Also received the message 9/13.
> 
> I'm on software version 11.0n-B1-01-2-652, at the moment.
> 
> Let's just hope that I also am not left screaming about the apparently crappy Rovi guide data.


I'm now on 11.0n-H1-01-2-652.


Pressed250 said:


> On a related note, yesterday I received a message titled (yes, it was in all caps) RECORDING WILL FAIL AFTER 9/29.
> 
> In short, it explained that the combination of TiVO Premiere + dial-up connection = no more program data. 9/15 would be the last download.
> 
> ...


Yes, I also got that message and that was very weird because I also meet conditions A and B.

And, I semi-figured that I would have TMS/Gracenote data until 9/29. But nope.... due to the prepare for service interruption message or whatever, I got upgraded I guess Friday or Saturday sometime. Now on the program guide, it says the Program Information is copyright Rovi Corporation.

What was really odd is that on Fri 9/16. I got a message "Program info has run out!... Date: Fri 9/16

The Tivo HD DVR has no more program information. To get more program information, the DVR must connect..."

I also got "A lineup change has occurred..." message with a ton of channels deleted and added.

So far, things look mostly ok. I've had to redo/make new SPs for various airings of the news. I normally have SPs for local and national news across 3 channels at around 5 to 7 pm and 11 pm.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

lpwcomp said:


> 1. They own the patent on the grid guide so probably made package deals.
> 
> 2. Cheaper (in every sens of the word, unfortunately)


I remember reading, in the internet so it must be true, Rovi was able to poach some customers when Tribune was in bankruptcy. Some customers had concerns dealing with a company with questionable financial status.

I suspect, but have no evidence to support it, you can combine 1 and 2. Microsoft office grew when Microsoft offered OEM s a great dealing bundling windows and office.


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## FaFaFooey (Sep 25, 2012)

Pressed250 said:


> For those experiencing the "my Guide is wonky" problem, here is another tool for your consideration:
> TiVO > Messages & Settings > Clear Program Information and To Do List
> 
> As the name implies, that command scrubs the entire guide clean ... and for better or worse, your To Do List, SPs, and thumb ratings get the same treatment. Oh, and the command takes a solid hour.
> ...


It's funny, I thought the "Clear and Delete Eveything" option would be the last thing I'll try, but will definitely get things working again. I did everything that was suggested here first to no effect. No guide update.
After 3 days, I did the full wipe and I still didn't have guide data updating afterwards.

What worked for me was (just by dumb luck) I had just made a truncated backed of my drive with winMFS of 11.0m. I restored that and when it dialed home I got the 11.0n update again. This time it installed after 6+ hours, and this time, 3 days of headaches and frustration later I was met with a message stating channel were renamed or were deleted. I forced an update and now have guide data slowly filling in.

Ultimately, I think this was just a huge f-up from TiVo and the providers.
It seems like someone jumped the gun on this 11.0n update before the content providers and rovi synchronized their data to each other. The customer gets to be beta testers yet again on updates. 
Redoing this update 3 days later was so much less annoying than 3 days of trying to figure out how to trick things into working.

Thanks everyone for the tips!


UPDATE 10/04: Guide Data stopped updating again and now there's no channel or show info. Nothing is filling in even after changing zip/cable provider etc. Not fun!


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

FaFaFooey said:


> Ultimately, I think this was just a huge f-up from TiVo and the providers.
> It seems like someone jumped the gun on this 11.0n update before the content providers and rovi synchronized their data to each other. The customer gets to be beta testers yet again on updates.
> Redoing this update 3 days later was so much less annoying than 3 days of trying to figure out how to trick things into working.
> 
> ...


Rather than jumping the gun, I think they waited until the last possible moment to release this update. Gracenote data has a hard deadline for going away, and the Fall season is about to start; they didn't do the migration before they absolutely had to because there was no more guide data from Tribune and there was still a little bit of time to iron out problems before the new programs started coming in. I also suspect they were delayed testing the migration because of restrictions imposed by the merger with Rovi not being final.

Having said that, while I don't think it's productive to ***** and moan, I do think that it is very important that people quickly and consistently report every problem with the guide data to TiVo so that it has the best chance of getting fixed quickly. I'm sure that there is a great amount of focus on the quality of the guide data within TiVo/Rovi right now, and this is a window of opportunity for improvement.


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## karpodiem (Mar 18, 2008)

Turns out that letting 11.0n.J1 image onto another TiVo, letting the green screen do its thing for three hours, will eventually get you back into the main menu. Patience is a virtue. Then you can do your clear and delete everything, and you're up and running.

Takes about six hours, but it works. Did it with three boxes successfully, bringing my fourth back online now.

Woo! Glad to have all my TiVos on the latest build.


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## Russell_ (May 21, 2016)

karpodiem said:


> Turns out that letting 11.0n.J1 image onto another TiVo, letting the green screen do its thing for three hours, will eventually get you back into the main menu. Patience is a virtue. Then you can do your clear and delete everything, and you're up and running.
> 
> Takes about six hours, but it works. Did it with three boxes successfully, bringing my fourth back online now.
> 
> Woo! Glad to have all my TiVos on the latest build.


Are those getting 11.0n.J1 part of a beta program or is it rolling out to the all?


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

karpodiem said:


> Turns out that letting 11.0n.J1 image onto another TiVo, letting the green screen do its thing for three hours, will eventually get you back into the main menu. Patience is a virtue. Then you can do your clear and delete everything, and you're up and running.
> 
> Takes about six hours, but it works. Did it with three boxes successfully, bringing my fourth back online now.
> 
> Woo! Glad to have all my TiVos on the latest build.


You didn't answer if the others had already upgraded to 11.0n.H1 yet?

Scott


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

InFromTheCold said:


> I believe it was in this thread that I read that the Rovi data doesn't include episode numbers. As a result, there's no longer a way to distinguish the new from the repeats. Going to be annoying, for sure.


Well that's not accurate. All of the shows that I'm recording at this time which are active have season and episode information. There are some that do not and some where it's incorrect (TiVo said they need to "map" the asset?), but note that it does not use this information to decide what's new.

That's the OAD/First Aired information which again for my shows is OK, but has been a big issue especially for sports.

Other than 1 corrupt 1P on our Roamio, this change hasn't impacted the recording of our shows yet but I am paying more attention to the ToDo list (note that we don't record sports or new or have ARWL which seem to have the biggest impact due to the guide data change outside of lineup issues).

Scott


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## karpodiem (Mar 18, 2008)

HerronScott said:


> You didn't answer if the others had already upgraded to 11.0n.H1 yet?
> 
> Scott


They had not. They were running a very old build, 11.0K. Had the TiVos sitting in a closet.

The single unit I had running 11.0n.H1 was enrolled in the beta program that they were asking TSN's for, back in February or so? That unit running 11.0n.H1 was upgraded to 11.0n.J a few days ago - that was the TiVo I took a backup from, and imaged all the other TiVos.

Interestingly, even with all the units on 11.0n.J, they all only have two days worth of guide data. This is after a forced network connection to the TiVo service. Hopefully they get new data soon?


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

karpodiem said:


> They had not. They were running a very old build, 11.0K. Had the TiVos sitting in a closet.
> 
> The single unit I had running 11.0n.H1 was enrolled in the beta program that they were asking TSN's for, back in February or so? That unit running 11.0n.H1 was upgraded to 11.0n.J a few days ago - that was the TiVo I took a backup from, and imaged all the other TiVos.
> 
> Interestingly, even with all the units on 11.0n.J, they all only have two days worth of guide data. This is after a forced network connection to the TiVo service. Hopefully they get new data soon?


I'm still not so sure it's a good idea to image a TiVo with the 11.0n.J1 software that hasn't had its TSN mapped for the Rovi data. I would have just connected them and let them at least get to 11.0n.H1 through the normal process first. It will be interesting to see if you get any more data loaded with service connections so let us know (although hard to tell at what point those would have been mapped for the update and Rovi data - could have already happened).

Scott


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## karpodiem (Mar 18, 2008)

Worse comes to worse I'll reach out to Margret.


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

So, does the existence of an 11.0n.*J*1 (beta) version suggest we all will eventually need another software upgrade or could that version be to address an issue for only a subset of customers either related to specific TiVo model(s) or perhaps for customers of a specific cable provider? The TiVo hackers out there (on a different forum) have seen the J version for the 652 model, but I see no reference yet for the 648 model like I have. I'd like to think that part of it is behind me and I can just hope they eventually get lineup changes I requested made and then I can move on with my life.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

I would expect that unlike the 11.0n.B1 that only seemed to go to 652's primarily in Comcast markets for the MPEG4 update, that eventually the 11.0n.J1 would go out to all assuming it tests successfully. I wouldn't worry about it though as it should just be like any other normal update that we've received in the past except for the Rovi guide change. 

Scott


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## Philtho (Feb 10, 2006)

I've got 11.0n.H1-01-2-652 and I noticed quite a few season passes are no longer working. Shows like American Horror Story 6 needed to be reset up, and it no longer distinguishes between Bering Sea Gold and Bering Sea Gold: Under the Ice (Two different shows). 

It also no longer shows season and episode numbers... Is this a Series 3 only thing? Is it time for me to upgrade? I kind of need this info, I've had many shows where I needed to find out which is what.


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## pL86 (Oct 11, 2009)

Philtho said:


> I've got 11.0n.H1-01-2-652 and I noticed quite a few season passes are no longer working. Shows like American Horror Story 6 needed to be reset up, and it no longer distinguishes between Bering Sea Gold and Bering Sea Gold: Under the Ice (Two different shows).
> 
> It also no longer shows season and episode numbers... Is this a Series 3 only thing? Is it time for me to upgrade? I kind of need this info, I've had many shows where I needed to find out which is what.


Unfortunately, no, the missing season and episode numbers is not limited to Series 3, it's a hole in the Rovi data that affects all Tivos. I don't know how an electronic program guide could be missing something as fundamental as season and episode data but here we are. If you go over to the Coffee House section, you'll find two threads devoted to the Rovi switch that are 23 and 34 pages long, respectively. Let's just say they're not filled with praise for the switch. Many, although not all, shows are missing season and episode data and it's wreaking havoc.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Philtho said:


> I've got 11.0n.H1-01-2-652 and I noticed quite a few season passes are no longer working. Shows like American Horror Story 6 needed to be reset up, and it no longer distinguishes between Bering Sea Gold and Bering Sea Gold: Under the Ice (Two different shows).
> 
> It also no longer shows season and episode numbers... Is this a Series 3 only thing? Is it time for me to upgrade? I kind of need this info, I've had many shows where I needed to find out which is what.


American Horror Story has always required a new SP each year. Had you already set one up for this years series before the update? I don't record Bering Sea Gold so can't comment on that one.

Episode number does seem to be missing although not all shows had it before (Chopped had it before but not on ones recorded since the update but Grimm didn't have it before the update either).

Scott


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

I got 11.0n.J1 without being in any beta program. When it went from H1 to J1 it went through the six hour guide refresh process again.

The migrated provider data for my Roamio is:
Time Warner Cable SD HollywoodWestchester Standard Cable *​but my Series 3 migrated provider data is:
Time Warner Cable SD Lomita Standard Cable *​I live in Westchester; Lomita is on the other side of Los Angeles. The channel map for the two providers is identical except for the name of the local access channels.
For the Series 3 there is also a provider choice of:
Time Warner Cable *HD* HollywoodWestchester Standard Cable *​for my ZIP code, but when I reran guided setup making that choice I didn't have any guide data so I quickly changed back to the migrated provider. It appears to me like some of the providers that TiVo/Rovi lists are not (yet?) populated with guide data. Or I could be running into the problem some are having with the guide data not successfully loading on the first try.


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## karpodiem (Mar 18, 2008)

Yeah, I noticed the same thing with guided setup.

Comcast Standard (what was presented to me upon 11.0n.J guided setup) vs. Comcast Digital (what I was presented with before)

Haven't noticed any channel discrepancies, yet.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

HerronScott said:


> American Horror Story has always required a new SP each year. Had you already set one up for this years series before the update? I don't record Bering Sea Gold so can't comment on that one.
> 
> Episode number does seem to be missing although not all shows had it before (Chopped had it before but not on ones recorded since the update but Grimm didn't have it before the update either).
> 
> Scott


 I've got almost all of the previous 3 seasons of "Grimm" and every one has a Season and Episode #.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

lpwcomp said:


> I've got almost all of the previous 3 seasons of "Grimm" and every one has a Season and Episode #.


This is on your S3 or HD? I usually see Episode on the program screen and Episode Num if you hit Info on the S3 if a show has that information. None of the 89 episodes that were recorded on that S3 OLED have an Episode entry for us (up to January 2016).

The ones recorded on the Roamio are a different matter and have both (started last fall when we got the Roamio), but we were talking about S3/HD's here.

Scott


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

HerronScott said:


> This is on your S3 or HD? I usually see Episode on the program screen and Episode Num if you hit Info on the S3 if a show has that information. None of the 89 episodes that were recorded on that S3 OLED have an Episode entry for us (up to January 2016).
> 
> The ones recorded on the Roamio are a different matter and have both (started last fall when we got the Roamio), but we were talking about S3/HD's here.
> 
> Scott


Well, they all have epsisodeNumber in the metadata but that may be built from the components by kmtttg.

I don't think I have one on either my Premiere or S2 so can't check in the SDUI. The only thing I could do would be to pull one and it would probably get set by the transfer. My THD died a while back.

In any case, episodeNumber was often unreliable.

Sorry I failed to notice the context. Too many threads on similar subjects and my response was written during the break of a poker game.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

lpwcomp said:


> Well, they all have epsisodeNumber in the metadata but that may be built from the components by kmtttg.
> 
> I don't think I have one on either my Premiere or S2 so can't check in the SDUI. The only thing I could do would be to pull one and it would probably get set by the transfer. My THD died a while back.
> 
> ...


I looked back at the rest of the series that we have recorded on the 2 S3's and Grimm was one of the few that didn't have it before the update. Most of the rest had it (Flash, Arrow, Gotham Chopped, Dr Who, Elementary, Grey's Anatomy, iZombie, Dark Matter, Wayward Pines, The Librarians, Supernatural, Supergirl, Star Trek) and it was accurate for those at least.

Scott


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## karpodiem (Mar 18, 2008)

Looks like the guide data came through for the next few weeks on all my 11.0n.J1 boxes, I'm all set.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

karpodiem said:


> Looks like the guide data came through for the next few weeks on all my 11.0n.J1 boxes, I'm all set.


Good to hear!

Scott


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## SC0TLANDF0REVER (Dec 9, 2001)

Just ran into this "Upgrade" on my OLED S3. Horrible timing to do this right before the Fall Premieres.

Was there a federal deadline to meet or something?


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

SC0TLANDF0REVER said:


> Just ran into this "Upgrade" on my OLED S3. Horrible timing to do this right before the Fall Premieres.
> 
> Was there a federal deadline to meet or something?


It was a "Gracenote (the old Tribune Media Services) wasn't willing to offer a short-term contract extension and wanted a lot of money for a long term one, and Rovi merged with TiVo and does guide data themselves" deadline.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

ej42137 said:


> I got 11.0n.J1 without being in any beta program. When it went from H1 to J1 it went through the six hour guide refresh process again.
> 
> The migrated provider data for my Roamio is:
> Time Warner Cable SD HollywoodWestchester Standard Cable *​but my Series 3 migrated provider data is:
> ...


Do you have any idea what the j version does vs the H? Any features? or just fixes for unacknowledged "bugs"


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

lew said:


> Do you have any idea what the j version does vs the H? Any features? or just fixes for unacknowledged "bugs"


Not a clue, there's no difference that I saw except for the release name.


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

Thought I'd give a quick update. Although the TiVo is now working fine I'm still having line-up issues. Turns out that all my lower channels are correct but the upper HD are not. I have another package option to choose and that one has the opposite issue.

Still waiting for them to build a correct package. This is going on two weeks now. Not impressed . . .


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

TiVo Bob W said:


> Thought I'd give a quick update. Although the TiVo is now working fine I'm still having line-up issues. Turns out that all my lower channels are correct but the upper HD are not. I have another package option to choose and that one has the opposite issue.
> 
> Still waiting for them to build a correct package. This is going on two weeks now. Not impressed . . .


Did you submit a lineup ticket? Does the lineup incorrect on tvguide.com as well?

Scott


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

I have noticed something with the Rovi guide.

This week, for "This Old House" the S3 showed only 5 upcoming episodes, but the Roamio shows 6 for my lineup.


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## spocko (Feb 4, 2009)

Is everyone receiving the J1 update? I still have H1.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

no update, still 11.0n.h1.


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

Same here, haven't received the mysterious J1 update yet on my S3/648.


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

ej42137 said:


> I got 11.0n.J1 without being in any beta program. When it went from H1 to J1 it went through the six hour guide refresh process again.
> 
> The migrated provider data for my Roamio is:
> Time Warner Cable SD HollywoodWestchester Standard Cable *​but my Series 3 migrated provider data is:
> ...


I had occasion to run Guided Setup again for a new TiVo Bolt+; just for fun I tried "Time Warner Cable *HD* HollywoodWestchester Standard Cable *" again. This time guide data was successfully loaded; although the channels were named differently than before the Rovi data, the most interesting thing was that a large number of premium channels which used to be SD channels now have names which indicate they are HD, and most of them (but not quite all) are now indeed coming in glorious HD. Apparently this is due to TWC being bought by Charter and becoming Spectrum; elsewhere on TCF someone has pointed out that Spectrum has far more channels in HD than TWC had.

The bad news is that copy protection is still present on almost everything except the broadcast channels. No word yet as to whether they're going to take away our 300 Mb Internet.

Oh yeah, still no obvious difference between 11.0n.H1 and 11.0n.J1 that I can detect.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

ej42137 said:


> Oh yeah, still no obvious difference between 11.0n.H1 and 11.0n.J1 that I can detect.


From what has been said, it appears to just be a bug fix for some units having issues with the guide data update so I wouldn't expect to see any difference. I do wonder if they'll roll it out to everyone though.

Scott


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

HerronScott said:


> Did you submit a lineup ticket? Does the lineup incorrect on tvguide.com as well?
> 
> Scott


Yes, I did submit a lineup ticket on Sept 14th online. When this first started I was told I did not need to submit a ticket as it would all be resolved, yeah right. Anyway turns out even though I reported a lineup change and was told it would be submitted immediately it was now. Date on ticket shows it was submitted on the 19th. I asked the status on the 22nd and was told I was all set and to please repeat guided setup which I did but nothing changed. Did the same earlier today with the same results. This time I call CS and am told the lineup issue was never fixed as I was told. So here I am waiting again...

My biggest issue with this whole thing is that I was told it was all set and the new lineup was pushed out. Basically tech sup pot lied to me and that has been confirmed yet all TiVo has to say is "Sorry." I used to think of them as having amazing customer service. That feeling is changing with this situation. When a company starts lying to try and make their customers happy there is a serious issue. This is something I would expect out of some cable companies but not TiVo.

And yes, the data on TVGuide.com is correct.

Later...

-------------------------------

UPDATE: Forgot one thing. Original estimates on lineup / Guide data corrects was 5 to 7 days last week. As of today it's 7 to 10 days.


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## Jim5506 (Oct 3, 2004)

I have an old TiVo HD that had not been in service for over a year, not subscribed, so I got it out and powered it up last night. It was on the 11.0m software. Did the guided setup, it said it would perform a software update at 2am.

This morning it is on 11.0n.H1, so the software update is almost immediate after connecting.

Now, the problem I'm having both with my Premiere and my subscribed TiVo HD (Model 652), there are at least 4 digital sub-channels that Grace Note/Tribune had correct guide data for that are now "To be announced". Channels like BUZZER, Movies, Bounce Heroes & Icons all have lost guide data and if I set manual timers, they seem to get disconnected with the overnight guide update, showing they will not record in the To Do List because they are no longer in the guide - they NEVER were in the guide, that's why I set a manual timer stupid!! - There I feel a little better now.
I have gone through and deleted all my manual timers for these channels and am in the process of rebuilding them, we'll see if the TiVo rejects them because they are not in the guide overnight.

Another problem is that Heroes & Icons and Movies are on real channel 19, but TiVo thinks they are on real channels 48 - that's where the guide data is, but signal comes in on real channel 19 - confusion all around.

VERY frustrating.

I submitted a report to TiVo last Friday, waiting for some sort of resolution.


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## angra (Apr 12, 2002)

Well, I just discovered this thread after returning from a trip to find my TivoHDs without any guide data, despite repeated succesful callins. They are both on 11.0m. Is there a user-activatable way to force a software update, say, on the tivo.com website?


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

Just got off the phone with TiVo support as I am still missing about half of my guide data.

After a rather extensive conversation the rep checked with a senior tech. Now I'm not sure I'm buying this but I was told that another software update will be pushed in the next 24 - 48 hours. I asked what the update did and was told it was for boxed that were not accepting a change in line-up and/or data. I explained how I was told to repeat guided setup, pick a different provider, complete setup. Do it all over again with the correct provider and that would fix the issue. Those of you who have been following this thread know that worked for me but data was now missing on about half the channels.

Wondering if they are just blowing smoke at this point and trying to push everyone off until data can be corrected.

So, everyone keep their eyes open for yet another update.


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

TiVo Bob W said:


> Just got off the phone with TiVo support as I am still missing about half of my guide data.
> 
> After a rather extensive conversation the rep checked with a senior tech. Now I'm not sure I'm buying this but I was told that another software update will be pushed in the next 24 - 48 hours. I asked what the update did and was told it was for boxed that were not accepting a change in line-up and/or data. I explained how I was told to repeat guided setup, pick a different provider, complete setup. Do it all over again with the correct provider and that would fix the issue. Those of you who have been following this thread know that worked for me but data was now missing on about half the channels.
> 
> ...


Current software is 11.0n.H1. According to posters tivo has been selectively releasing 11.0n.J

Sounds like the software is finished testing and is going to be deployed.

Some posters seem to be stuck on 11.0m Make sure you didn't modify your software in a way which inhibits software upgrades.


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## angra (Apr 12, 2002)

lew said:


> Some posters seem to be stuck on 11.0m Make sure you didn't modify your software in a way which inhibits software upgrades.


apologies for regressing to newbie state, but aside from bootpage, what else can I check? I forced 6 calls in a row without getting a "Pending Restart" which implies it's not even downloading the new software (right?).


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

lew said:


> Current software is 11.0n.H1. According to posters tivo has been selectively releasing 11.0n.J
> 
> Sounds like the software is finished testing and is going to be deployed.
> 
> Some posters seem to be stuck on 11.0m Make sure you didn't modify your software in a way which inhibits software upgrades.


As I stated earlier in the thread I've been on 11.0n.J1-01-2-648 since the 14th. I was told they are rolling out another update.

If anyone can confirm this it would be great


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

TiVo Bob W said:


> As I stated earlier in the thread I've been on 11.0n.J1-01-2-648 since the 14th. I was told they are rolling out another update.
> 
> If anyone can confirm this it would be great


I missed that. My bad.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

angra said:


> Well, I just discovered this thread after returning from a trip to find my TivoHDs without any guide data, despite repeated succesful callins. They are both on 11.0m. Is there a user-activatable way to force a software update, say, on the tivo.com website?


Go into Settings, Phone & Network, to make sure they're still connecting to the TiVo servers every day.

They should have gotten a newer version than m by now.

And force a restart on both.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

angra said:


> apologies for regressing to newbie state, but aside from bootpage, what else can I check? I forced 6 calls in a row without getting a "Pending Restart" which implies it's not even downloading the new software (right?).





unitron said:


> Go into Settings, Phone & Network, to make sure they're still connecting to the TiVo servers every day.
> 
> They should have gotten a newer version than m by now.
> 
> And force a restart on both.


You must've missed his second post.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

lpwcomp said:


> You must've missed his second post.


My eyes are getting old even faster than the rest of me. 

S/He could try a KickStart 51, 52, or 56, to see if any of those make anything happen.

https://www.weaknees.com/tivo-kickstart-codes.php


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## angra (Apr 12, 2002)

unitron said:


> My eyes are getting old even faster than the rest of me.
> 
> S/He could try a KickStart 51, 52, or 56, to see if any of those make anything happen.
> 
> https://www.weaknees.com/tivo-kickstart-codes.php


I have about 18 hours at home between trips later this week, I'll give those a try when I get home. Which of the three (if any, if you know) is most likely to result in a successful pull of most recent software?

PS there's not a way to launch a kickstart via shell without direct physical access to the unit, is there?


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## osterber (Feb 13, 2001)

OK - so what do I do in my situation....? I have an S3 HD Tivo that is unhacked except that I upgraded/replaced the hard drive right after I bought it. For the past year, about every month or so, it suddenly loses the guide data. I've been through Tivo support, and they tell me to restart, and re-connect three times, etc. I figured out on my own (Tivo never said this) that re-running Guided Setup would fix the problem. So every month or so, whenever the guide stops working without warning, I just re-run guided setup, and it comes back to normal.

Until now. Now nothing works. I tried guided setup. I tried switching my zip code, but any zip code I try other than my own, it says "No channel information for that zip code." (Hard to believe there's no channel lineup for Cambridge, MA.)

I tried resetting all program data and recording to start over, which took forever, but didn't do anything. (In fact - it didn't even wipe out my recordings!)

I also just noticed that I'm apparently on software version 11.3b7, which from what I'm seeing, doesn't even exist, and I should be on 11.0-something. 

I've given up on Tivo support because in the past, I've just ended up fixing it myself. A comcast-branded DVR is looking more and more attractive, even though I've already paid for lifetime service on this device. The device itself appears to be working from a hardware perspective. This appears to be a software bug that Tivo appears incapable of fixing. I know it's an older device, but I at least expect them to not break what was already working!!!

-Rick


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

Well, as I assumed there was no update and CS has no idea what I'm talking about.

At this point there is so much missinformation at TiVo CS. I could call four times and receive four different answers. It's also a shame when a CS supervisor apparently starts outright lying as I had the rep yesterday read some of the notes to me and statements absolutely contradict each other. Either these people do not care and are sick of fielding these calls about this disaster of an issue that appears to be country-wide or are outright lying. Take your choice. :End Rant: 

Anyway, back to my line-up issue. Here we are over a month that I first reported I was having issues and 21 days since the line-up correction report was filed. Funny how on the original call I was told it would take a few days at the most.

If anyone here from TiVo would like to discuss this situation . . . I'm listening . . .


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## cogx (Sep 23, 2006)

TiVo Bob W said:


> If anyone here from TiVo would like to discuss this situation . . . I'm listening . . .


::Raises Hand:: Then, can I be next?


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

osterber said:


> OK - so what do I do in my situation....? I have an S3 HD Tivo that is unhacked except that I upgraded/replaced the hard drive right after I bought it. For the past year, about every month or so, it suddenly loses the guide data. I've been through Tivo support, and they tell me to restart, and re-connect three times, etc. I figured out on my own (Tivo never said this) that re-running Guided Setup would fix the problem. So every month or so, whenever the guide stops working without warning, I just re-run guided setup, and it comes back to normal.
> 
> Until now. Now nothing works. I tried guided setup. I tried switching my zip code, but any zip code I try other than my own, it says "No channel information for that zip code." (Hard to believe there's no channel lineup for Cambridge, MA.)
> 
> ...


Don't know what you did when you replaced your drive but you don't have a valid software version. I have a theory, but it's not relevant. You need to get a good image then restore it to your hard drive. Read the threads at least one poster has a link.

I don't think a software download from tivo will be the answer.


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## reneg (Jun 19, 2002)

lew said:


> Don't know what you did when you replaced your drive but you don't have a valid software version. I have a theory, but it's not relevant. You need to get a good image then restore it to your hard drive. Read the threads at least one poster has a link.
> 
> I don't think a software download from tivo will be the answer.


Maybe http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=515001


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## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

reneg said:


> Maybe http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=515001


Good find. I suggest poster send an email to Margaret.


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## angra (Apr 12, 2002)

unitron said:


> My eyes are getting old even faster than the rest of me.
> 
> S/He could try a KickStart 51, 52, or 56, to see if any of those make anything happen.
> 
> https://www.weaknees.com/tivo-kickstart-codes.php


51 and 52 do nothing detectable. 56 reports "bad connection". I'm not sure what to make of that or how to debug it. The tivo connects to service just fine when running the tivo software.


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## osterber (Feb 13, 2001)

lew said:


> Don't know what you did when you replaced your drive but you don't have a valid software version. I have a theory, but it's not relevant. You need to get a good image then restore it to your hard drive. Read the threads at least one poster has a link.
> 
> I don't think a software download from tivo will be the answer.


I replaced the hard drive using a pre-configured drive from Weaknees, 8 years ago when I bought the Tivo in the first place.

-Rick


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## osterber (Feb 13, 2001)

lew said:


> Good find. I suggest poster send an email to Margaret.


Thanks. Based on that other thread, it explains why this Tivo has been misbehaving so much for the past year or so!

I've emailed Margret. Fingers crossed.

-Rick


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

This should probably move to another thread because this is no longer a Series 3 issue and not a data issue but I will continue here as it's where I started.

Can someone please confirm that Seasons Passes are tied to a networks call letter and not the actual station. The reason I'm asking is TiVo had me move my lineup to a nearby market that has the same lineup but different call letters. Actually I was told they merged two different lineups to fix my issue. Another words, FOX is still FOX but with different and now incorrect call letters. Not one of my network TV passes works not. You say, no big deal, just change them. Well that works fine for the shows that are currently airing but not for the ones that are between seasons. It appears to me that TiVo just put a stop-gap measure in place but really did not fix the issue

Any help with this situation would be much appreciated as I'm really getting sick of calling TiVo CS.


Thanks in advance, Bob


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

Certainly seems that way to me since I've had stations change channel numbers with Comcast (moved from 200 to 800 range) and the SP continued to work. What are the call letter differences as some came with the Rovi guide data change so there has to be some kind of mapping (although I think those were mostly adding E or W to cable channels for east coast and west coast feeds).

Scott


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

TiVo Bob W said:


> This should probably move to another thread because this is no longer a Series 3 issue and not a data issue but I will continue here as it's where I started.
> 
> Can someone please confirm that Seasons Passes are tied to a networks call letter and not the actual station. The reason I'm asking is TiVo had me move my lineup to a nearby market that has the same lineup but different call letters. Actually I was told they merged two different lineups to fix my issue. Another words, FOX is still FOX but with different and now incorrect call letters. Not one of my network TV passes works not. You say, no big deal, just change them. Well that works fine for the shows that are currently airing but not for the ones that are between seasons. It appears to me that TiVo just put a stop-gap measure in place but really did not fix the issue
> 
> ...


Season Passes internally use a code to identify the channel, not call letters or the channel number. That is the source of your difficulty.

You could wait until the programs come around again to edit the Season Passes, but you might forget. What I do when the channel changes like this and the program is no currently broadcasting is to set the Season Pass to "All" and every once in a while check for the Season Pass list for entries that are highlighted because they are about to record something but don't have a specific channel specified; it is pretty easy to scan through the Season Passes to do this.

If you had kmttg and were running a Premiere or later there might be a way to fix the season passes by writing a program to edit the JSON Season Passes backups, but that wouldn't work for a Series 3.


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## osterber (Feb 13, 2001)

Let's just say I'm pretty disappointed by TiVo's response to my situation.
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=11026695#post11026695
-Rick


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

osterber said:


> Let's just say I'm pretty disappointed by TiVo's response to my situation.
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=11026695#post11026695
> -Rick


Did you hear back directly from Margret?

(wondering if she survived the merger)


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

unitron said:


> Did you hear back directly from Margret?
> 
> (wondering if she survived the merger)


She last posted here on 9/28 regarding sending her e-mails with any lineup issues.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=11015658&highlight=#post11015658

And it looks like she last logged in here on 10/5.

Scott


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## osterber (Feb 13, 2001)

unitron said:


> Did you hear back directly from Margret?
> 
> (wondering if she survived the merger)


Yes, and she referred me to someone else. So I did get a response, just a completely unsatisfactory one.

-Rick


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

osterber said:


> Yes, and she referred me to someone else. So I did get a response, just a completely unsatisfactory one.
> 
> -Rick


I agree, it is completely unacceptable of them to have caused the problem for you and others, offered others a fix, overlooked you, and then basically have taken the attitude that it's not their fault they didn't offer you the fix at the time and therefore they owe you no consideration or compensation.


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## TiVo Bob W (Mar 3, 2003)

Yet another update . . .

To solve my issue they merged the lower channels from on lineup with the higher channels from another to modify a current package that IS NOT in my market area. I asked if that would cause issues for the others that currently used that package. I received a definite, "no." Well to my surprise with a little tweaking of a few channels through lineup reports all worked as intended. End of story or so I thought.

Over the last few days I have been receiving messages on my S# indicating a lineup change has taken place. Guess what I guess merging the two databases wasn't a good idea after all as about eight channels have returned to their previous state and are no longer correct. I'm not talking about correct network but wrong call letters here. They are completely wrong, not even close.

I have to ask again does TiVo have any idea what they are doing and how to actually resolve this situation. They took a shortcut in my case instead of rebuilding the correct package. Today I tried what should be the correct package and it is still wrong. Had they just rebuilt it as they should have my issue would be resolved. But no . . . we'll just keep screwing around and wasting my time.

A currently very disappointed TiVo customer since 2001.

PS - I see that mystery update I was told about never came to fruition.


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