# Need help with wiring for OTA + Cable Internet + MoCA



## johnpagan (Apr 29, 2016)

Hello TiVo Community,

Previously I was using DSL Internet + OTA Antenna and I had a TiVo Mini. This setup was working well but my DSL Internet was jacked up in price after 12 months. So I recently switched to Cable Internet.

The problem is that now I have Cable Internet and OTA Antenna signals on the same coax cable. Now the antenna does not work. I tried different ways to make both work on the same coax but I was not successful. Has anybody used Cable Internet + OTA + MoCA successfully? How?

BTW, I went to the TiVo support site and I found this picture, which is exactly what I need except the TiVo mini is not shown. I will be trying this after all the parts arrive in the main.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

johnpagan said:


> BTW, I went to the TiVo support site and I found this picture, which is exactly what I need except the TiVo mini is not shown. I will be trying this after all the parts arrive in the main.


Yeah, so about that diagram...

See this post: 
Cannot watch/record OTA when connected to MoCA network


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Recent thread w similar issue...

50% signal loss OTA when connecting to Spectrum provider

(His diagram helped a lot, but some sort of details on your setup is required to make any specific suggestions.)


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## Luke M (Nov 5, 2002)

That diagram makes no sense to me.

The cable TV line should be connected directly to the cable modem and nothing else. The rest should be the same as your previous DSL setup, right?


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## johnpagan (Apr 29, 2016)

krkaufman said:


> Yeah, so about that diagram...
> 
> See this post:
> Cannot watch/record OTA when connected to MoCA network


@krkaufman - This post is exactly where my research was taking me today. But i could not find any evidence that it would work. Now I have confirmation of at least one person who has this setup working. I will have to get a diplexer and try it. I will post back with my results.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

johnpagan said:


> This post is exactly where my research was taking me today. But i could not find any evidence that it would work. Now I have confirmation of at least one person who has this setup working. I will have to get a diplexer and try it. I will post back with my results.


To be clear, the recent thread referenced isn't a solved case since the OP hasn't yet installed the recommended changes; however, the diplexer workaround has worked for *many* others. That said, I can't say whether it would work for your setup not knowing anything about the available connections and device locations. But here's hoping...

p.s. Recommended parts >here<.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

DirecTV/Dish signals were always designed to share a cable with OTA signals, and they do (did?) this by occupying a different part of the RF spectrum. MoCA is the same way. But this is not true of cable TV/modem signals, which use the same frequencies as OTA TV. A diplexer is not sufficient to overcome this.

The easiest, best thing is to run separate lines. I won't say that you _can't_ combine them, but it's not worth the effort and expense required.

Edit: So, to be clear --

OTA + MoCA: yes
Cable + MoCA: yes
Cable + OTA: no


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

wmcbrine said:


> The easiest, best thing is to run separate lines.


I'm not seeing the time/effort advantage, but good point; I've been referring to the diplexer "workaround" without explicitly stating that the best, correct solution is a dedicated coax run to the cable modem/gateway. A side benefit will be that the dedicated run also prepares the setup for DOCSIS 3.1, where MoCA and D3.1 have overlapping frequencies. (... pushing "Cable + MoCA" towards "yes, with caveats")



wmcbrine said:


> A diplexer is not sufficient to overcome this.


But "this," as I've interpreted how you've framed it, isn't the goal; the diplexer workaround isn't intended to allow for cable+OTA operation on a given run of coax but simply to act as a filter to allow each to operate on either side of the diplexer dam, while allowing MoCA* to flow between the diplexer-joined segments. (* A bit more than just MoCA signals can flow into the OTA segment from the cable side, but the OTA gear can ignore it and the diplexer will keep it from getting to the antenna, same as it has for satellite signals.)


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## johnpagan (Apr 29, 2016)

Hello TiVo Community,

I am happy to report that the diplexer "method" worked for me. I now have OTA + Cable Internet + MoCa running at home. Big thanks to krkaufman for pointing me in the right direction.

The reason the diplexer works is because it blocks the cable internet signal and lets the OTA signal into the TiVo. This does not mean that OTA and Cable Internet are going over the same coax. In my case, I do not have the time or money or patience to run a separate cable to the modem, so I am very happy the diplexer works.

Also, let's not forget who screwed up here. A long time ago TiVo devices had two coax inputs, one for Cable and one for Antenna. At some point in time they decided to merge those into a single input and that is why we need to find these workarounds. Not only that but their website has bad information. The diagram I posted before is wrong. It could be right if they replaced the splitter with a diplexer.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Glad to hear it's working...!



johnpagan said:


> Also, let's not forget who screwed up here. A long time ago TiVo devices had two coax inputs, one for Cable and one for Antenna. At some point in time they decided to merge those into a single input and that is why we need to find these workarounds. Not only that but their website has bad information. The diagram I posted before is wrong. It could be right if they replaced the splitter with a diplexer.


The cable+OTA port change on the TiVo boxes is unrelated, at least for most cases, since the typical roadblock is that there's a single coax run to a given location, so there wouldn't be separate coax cables (cable & OTA) to take advantage of a TiVo box with separate coax inputs.

You're entirely correct re: the diagram, though; it's awful ... though, owing to two coax runs to the gateway location, the issue could also be solved, drawing within the lines (i.e. "the right and proper way"), using a MoCA-compatible splitter and a standalone MoCA adapter, rather than using the diplexer workaround.


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

Are you sure about that second diagram? Diplexer in place of the bottom splitter would not mix OTA and Cable, but at the top it would.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

mdavej said:


> Are you sure about that second diagram? Diplexer in place of the bottom splitter would not mix OTA and Cable, but at the top it would.


If this comment is directed at me and referencing this diagram...






​
... yeah, I'm pretty sure it's correct, since it's about the same as what the OP implemented; but if not, I'm interested in having my eyes opened.

Re: OTA+cable mixing, since the SAT port's pass-band can be around 950-2150 MHz, yeah, some of the cable TV/Broadband signal will make it through to the OTA+MoCA segment, as mentioned above...


krkaufman said:


> (* A bit more than just MoCA signals can flow into the OTA segment from the cable side, but the OTA gear can ignore it and the diplexer will keep it from getting to the antenna, same as it has for satellite signals.)



As for replacing the bottom splitter with a diplexer, I'm not sure how a diplexer could be used at that location without potentially affecting the cable Internet signal delivered to the gateway. Consider an antenna/satellite diplexer's typical pass-band frequencies:

VHF/UHF(ANT): 40-806
SAT: 950-2150​Neither port is suitable for passing cable TV or cable Internet signals (generally, though a user could verify frequencies in use by their provider to confirm all are within the ANT pass-band, though frequencies can be changed by the provider at any time).


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