# LOST * Left Behind * 4/4/07 *SPOILERS



## sushikitten (Jan 28, 2005)

Wow, never started one of these before....I rarely watch in real time.

So much to think about, I cannot even comprehend it at this point...the connections, the black smoke, Juliette and Kate, the cons....


----------



## mwhip (Jul 22, 2002)

How long until part of the group moves to the village? I mean it would be nice to have all those amenities.


----------



## NatasNJ (Jan 7, 2002)

I am starting to think Juliet is a spy for the others. I think she is there for a reason and that it will come back to bite Jack.


----------



## tem (Oct 6, 2003)

mwhip said:


> How long until part of the group moves to the village? I mean it would be nice to have all those amenities.


Why wouldn't they all move back to the village ?


----------



## billboard_NE (May 18, 2005)

Great episode, I hope they keep up the pace for the rest of the season, even if Juliet is playing straight she can never be trusted. 

Question, was Kates friend in the flashback Sawyer's ex?


----------



## scottykempf (Dec 1, 2004)

mwhip said:


> How long until part of the group moves to the village? I mean it would be nice to have all those amenities.


I was thinking that too. Sure, they wouldn't have fish, but they would have houses, presumably water, warm beds. Sure beats the beach.

Locke: "They told me who you are Kate, and what you did." Finally, someone talked to someone else on this show!!! You have all these flashbacks in every episode, all this shocking stuff, but no one ever compares notes. Claire/Jack's Dad wanted to tell Claire his name, but no. Kate asked the woman (Joanie Stubbs from Deadwood) what the con man's name was, but no.

Kate: "Will someone tell me what is going on around here." Yes, we would all like to know.

So why did they drag Kate and Juliet out into the jungle, but they left Jack and Sayid in the houses? Why?

OH NO, Juliet turned on the sonic barrier!!!! I guess the magical FLYING smoke monster didn't think to FLY OVER THE BARRIER now did it????

Screw you, Lost. Screw you.


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

NatasNJ said:


> I am starting to think Juliet is a spy for the others. I think she is there for a reason and that it will come back to bite Jack.


Sayid, are you posting here?


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

billboard_NE said:


> Great episode, I hope they keep up the pace for the rest of the season, even if Juliet is playing straight she can never be trusted.
> 
> Question, was Kates friend in the flashback Sawyer's ex?


Yes. They showed her being conned by Sawyer in the intro.


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

Couple things.
Any episode with Kate and Juliette wrestling wet and covered with mud is a keeper.
Said it before, but the smoke monster SO reminds me of the Forbidden Planet Id construct.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

"Now you know what it feels like not to know what's going on."


----------



## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

scottykempf said:


> OH NO, Juliet turned on the sonic barrier!!!! I guess the magical FLYING smoke monster didn't think to FLY OVER THE BARRIER now did it????


It was a good thing the control panel was right where they were, huh? 

But what I want to know is how Juliette knew the barrier was OFF ...


----------



## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

By the way, Jack's father is dead. Yup, dead. Juliette said so.


----------



## wprager (Feb 19, 2006)

Hate to say it, but my favorite part was when Kate tried to tomahawk Juliet with the pool cue and Juliet totally Ramboed her. Not that I dislike Kate, but that was great and I laughed and applauded there.

This was Juliet coming through a door, carrying a plate, not knowing where Kate was.

Then little while later, when she must have known what she was saying would piss Kate off, Juliet gets sucker-punched by Kate and then destroyed in a little wrestling match? Nah-huh, shouldn't have happened, and she had her even before the shoulder. Something's not right there.


----------



## zuko3984 (May 4, 2002)

scottykempf said:


> So why did they drag Kate and Juliet out into the jungle, but they left Jack and Sayid in the houses? Why?


I think Juliet did that herself. She wanted to get Kate to trust her. Now was that part of a plan by all the others, Did they leave her as a spy or did they really leave her and she wanted to get Kate to trust her so she wouldn't be left all by herself. What i don't get is why she and kate got up from the gas way before jack and Sayid did. Maybe Juliet was never knocked out and is still working for the others but Kate still got up way before Jack and Sayid.


----------



## wprager (Feb 19, 2006)

So, Sawyer's a daddy. Interesting how they had him holding Aaron a little earlier. I totally expected Sun to smile at that -- I guess she's still holding a grudge.

The Others don't know what the Smoke Monster is, but know that it's affected by the sonic fence. It also seems to be discouraged by bamboo. What was with the flashes? Was it taking pictures? Are we ever going to see a Smokey flashback


----------



## zuko3984 (May 4, 2002)

drew2k said:


> It was a good thing the control panel was right where they were, huh?
> 
> But what I want to know is how Juliette knew the barrier was OFF ...


I'm thinking Juliet turned it off herself. Since she set up Kate and her in the Jungle.


----------



## zuko3984 (May 4, 2002)

wprager said:


> Hate to say it, but my favorite part was when Kate tried to tomahawk Juliet with the pool cue and Juliet totally Ramboed her. Not that I dislike Kate, but that was great and I laughed and applauded there.
> 
> This was Juliet coming through a door, carrying a plate, not knowing where Kate was.
> 
> Then little while later, when she must have known what she was saying would piss Kate off, Juliet gets sucker-punched by Kate and then destroyed in a little wrestling match? Nah-huh, shouldn't have happened, and she had her even before the shoulder. Something's not right there.


It may have to do with Juliet wanting to gain Kate's trust. If she put a beat down on Kate that wouldn't go a long way to earning her trust. But by letting kate dislocate her shoulder she got sympathy from her.


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

So, what's up with the flash bulb effect from smokey?
How come hiding in the tree trunks is sanctuary from smokey? Hasn't that worked before too?
For those believing that smokey dirtnaps anyone unreconciled with their past transgressions, Kate seems to have some repentin' to do.


----------



## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

Obvious question time: Kate, Sayid, Locke and Rousseau can climb over the barrier. Why can't the smoke monster do the same thing?


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

I thought the Sawyer/Hurley scenes were good. But it looks like Sawyer shouldn't get too used to being in charge. (Anyway, he's a figure head, since Hurley is pulling his strings, as he has pulled Jack's sometimes too by the way.)

IIRC, this was also the first Kate-flashback episode that didn't completely suck. (Of course, Kate's flashback kind of sucked, but on the whole, this was a good show.)

So, it turns out if you blow up a gal's true love, or if you kidnap a gal, the gal doesn't forgive and forget right away. Hmm.


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

drew2k said:


> Obvious question time: Kate, Sayid, Locke and Rousseau can climb over the barrier. Why can't the smoke monster do the same thing?


It didn't have an axe to chop down a tree.


----------



## Peter000 (Apr 15, 2002)

drew2k said:


> Obvious question time: Kate, Sayid, Locke and Rousseau can climb over the barrier. Why can't the smoke monster do the same thing?


Because it doesn't have a brain to think of that?


----------



## appleye1 (Jan 26, 2002)

Peter000 said:


> Because it doesn't have a brain to think of that?


Yeah, from what I've seen monsters in general are pretty stupid. And I imagine smoke monsters would be among the stupidest of monsters. Frankenstein and Godzilla on the other hand would be on the upper end of the scale, but even they would probably be too stupid to figure out that you can go over the barrier.


----------



## lordargent (Nov 12, 2002)

scottykempf said:


> OH NO, Juliet turned on the sonic barrier!!!! I guess the magical FLYING smoke monster didn't think to FLY OVER THE BARRIER now did it????


Maybe it can't actually fly, maybe it's some sort of ethereal hovercraft


----------



## justapixel (Sep 27, 2001)

wprager said:


> So, Sawyer's a daddy.


I don't think that's news to us. Last season (I think) he got a letter saying he has a child named Clementine.

I don't know what to say about this episode. They really do need to start telling us what's going on. Throwing out lines like "now you know how it feels not to know what is happening" is cute and all, but I really would like a clue.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

I see that Kate doesn't believe in the five second rule.

The question is, where does Juliet's loyalties lie now?
After all, she's not exactly Ben's biggest fan.


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

I liked this episode, it felt like vintage "Lost". 

Interesting to see the flashback with Kate's connection to Sawyer, but everything else in the flashback felt like repeated info. Although it did give (more) explanation of why mom screamed like crazy when Kate visited her in the hospital.

Will be interesting to see where Sawyer's newfound (forced) connection to the tribe leads. I wonder if there will be even more tension between him and Jack.

Juliet is a damn good liar. I don't believe for a second that she was left behind the way she said.

I agree that they need to move forward now. The smoke monster can only be shown so many times before we need to know what it is...


----------



## TiVoDan (Jun 2, 2002)

Well it looks like Locke is officially on of the "others" now, but we kind of knew that something like that was coming last year when ben said "You're one of the good ones" Of course, I expect that to change again, before the season ends.


----------



## smickola (Nov 17, 2004)

justapixel said:


> I don't think that's news to us. Last season (I think) he got a letter saying he has a child named Clementine.


He was told about his daughter in the prison flashback last year, but it was left wide open that it was possibly a scam, with her conning Sawyer into giving up the money he made from the Warden as revenge - this is the first confirmation that it's true.

Wow, Locke really took over quickly, didn't he? Great episode!


----------



## wprager (Feb 19, 2006)

justapixel said:


> I don't think that's news to us. Last season (I think) he got a letter saying he has a child named Clementine.


Clementine, of course I remember that now. This show is funny that way -- so many characters, so many tid-bits of information spread over a fairly long time, that it's very easy to forget. I wonder how the writers don't trip over this once in a while; they probably hired hefe to proof-read each script before production begins


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

I read this episode summary on tv.com before Lost aired:



Spoiler



Kate and Juliet are stranded in the jungle after Kate learns that there is a traitor in the survivor's midst. Meanwhile, Sawyer's poor attitude and selfish ways towards the beach community may earn him a vote of banishment if he doesn't have a change of heart.



Did I miss something?



Spoiler



When did Kate learn that?


----------



## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

Re: The smoke monster not going over the fence. 

Didn't the smoke monster go "vertical" when it pulled the pilot (or co-pilot) out of the cockpit in Season 1? So we know it can go "up" and change directions in three planes. This is why I wondered why it couldn't go over the fence.


----------



## Jeeters (Feb 25, 2003)

zuko3984 said:


> i don't get is why she and kate got up from the gas way before jack and Sayid did.


Because she and Kate were removed from the gas while Jack and Sayid were left to continue breathing it?


----------



## Jeeters (Feb 25, 2003)

So nobody mentioned those bright flashes that the Monster did to Kate and Juliette? What was up with that? And after it did so, the camera changes to the monster's view and we see the view pull up a couple of hundred feet into the air. Interesting.

As for why the monster didn't go over. How is supposed to know it can? Whoever said that it has reasoning abilities? Sure, Locke and company figured it out, but they could have just as easily been wrong and got killed. There are plenty of animals that would be just as 'stupid'.

Thought Evangeline did really great in this episode; she's improved as an actress. She does some really good reactions to things using just her eyes. Didn't care much for the backstory, though.


----------



## cwoody222 (Nov 13, 1999)

markz said:


> I read this episode summary on tv.com before Lost aired:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Locke is the traitor.

I totally think Juliette is lying and is a spy. Just like Ben was last year. I haven't trusted her since day one. I think next week's episode is a(nother) Juliette flashback ep so hopefully we'll learn more.

I took the smoke monster's flash bulb stuff to be it ID'ing Juliette as someone it was programmed to leave alone or something.

My problem is Lost is this... in season 1 the whole juxtaposition of Sawyer holding Aaron and us learning he has a kid would have been touching. But now it gets lost among things like smoke monsters and sonic walls.

Did anyone else notice that Kate and Juliette were both mud-covered BEFORE they fell in the mud puddle? Obviously a slight production error but it was funny. I watched it in slo-mo a few times. Wonder how many times the actresses had to pull that stunt?


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

cwoody222 said:


> Did anyone else notice that Kate and Juliette were both mud-covered BEFORE they fell in the mud puddle? Obviously a slight production error but it was funny. I watched it in slo-mo a few times. Wonder how many times the actresses had to pull that stunt?


Noticed that too. I'm guessing the male crew members had a memorable day when filming those scenes.

"We don't know what it is, but we know it doesn't like our fences." They really DON'T get the island if they don't know what the monster is. I wasn't expecting her to not know.

I don't think Juliette is a spy. But it will be interesting to see her allegiances when confronted with Ben and company again. They still have all the power.

Why in the world would they go back to the beach when they could stay in that community? Go get everyone and bring them back. Protection from the monster, a nice bed, food...too common sense for the Lostaways.

Locke was really creepy.


----------



## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

The Others vanished where? Underground?
Sawyer's gonna freak when he sees Jules.
Kate is 19% hotter in flashbacks and 6% cuter in a ball cap.


----------



## speedcouch (Oct 23, 2003)

My favorite part of the episode was Hurley conning Sawyer. When he talked to Claire and Hurley gave him the thumbs-up, my husband said "he's making it all up" and the lightbulb went on for me. I thought he was trying to get Sawyer "intergrated" into the rest of the group and stop being an outsider. When Sawyer figured it out and confront Hurley and he said he was the new leader, I thought that was a great reveal. Because it was true. Also saying Jack didn't ask to be the leader either was an excellent point. It was good to see Sawyer smiling, relaxed and having a good time with the rest of the group. Too bad it his leadership is short-lived. 

The smoke monster is just too stupid to believe. I still think it's some sort of automated special effect the Darma group created to protect the island.

Cheryl


----------



## Menarion (Sep 28, 2006)

> I was thinking that too. Sure, they wouldn't have fish, but they would have houses, presumably water, warm beds. Sure beats the beach.


Why wouldn't they have fish? The submarine was at a dock pretty close to the village.


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

speedcouch said:


> The smoke monster is just too stupid to believe. I still think it's some sort of automated special effect the Darma group created to protect the island.


Automated special effects don't usually pick you up, ram you up against a tree, repeatedly beat you into the ground, and kill you. 

I do think it is a little stupid, but only if they don't have a good story behind it.


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

Fool Me Twice said:


> The Others vanished where? Underground?
> Sawyer's gonna freak when he sees Jules.
> Kate is 19% hotter in flashbacks and 6% cuter in a ball cap.


and 137% cuter when handcuffed to Juliet and wrestling in the mud!


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

drew2k said:


> Re: The smoke monster not going over the fence.
> 
> Didn't the smoke monster go "vertical" when it pulled the pilot (or co-pilot) out of the cockpit in Season 1? So we know it can go "up" and change directions in three planes. This is why I wondered why it couldn't go over the fence.


Note, however, that the smoke monster did not hit the fence and stop. It hit the fence and ran like hell in the other direction.

I just assumed that it found hitting the fence a very bad and unexpected experience, and ran away like a dog would if it hit an electric fence...

(It's even possible that it now thinks humans can pass the fence, but smoke monsters can't--that has certainly been its experience!)

And since Juliet has no clue what it is, it is perhaps reasonable to assume that SM has no prior experience with the fence...


----------



## wprager (Feb 19, 2006)

Fool Me Twice said:


> The Others vanished where? Underground?
> Sawyer's gonna freak when he sees Jules.
> Kate is *16*% hotter in flashbacks and *8*% cuter in a ball cap.


There, fixed it for you.


----------



## TriBruin (Dec 10, 2003)

mask2343 said:


> I don't think Juliette is a spy. But it will be interesting to see her allegiances when confronted with Ben and company again. They still have all the power.


Agreed. I am taking for face value that Juliette is no longer an "Other" and that she was truely left behind. She had never been truely integrated and bought in to Ben's (or Jacob's?) master plan. She tried to have Ben killed by Jack. And she was about to leave the island. I doubt Ben has much trust in her any more.

Let me just say: Kate, Juliette, Rain, Catfight, Mud, AWESOME!!!!


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

wprager said:


> There, fixed it for you.


Of course, that logic puts a 42% cap on hotness while mud wrestling with Juliette.

And that's just WRONG.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

The hurley con was obvious from the start, that's what made it so amusing.

So Locke blew up their only chance to go home, worked at a pot farm, has failed to mention he was paralyzed, blew up a house possibly intentionally, killed an other - aka one of the people he's now with - and yet he is judging kate, eh?

I like how Jack didn't respond to kate's crying confession. That leaves open the question of whether juliet was right, or whether jack wanted her to stay away for her safety because he had a plan to get out.

It was rude for Tom not to say goodbye. What a jerk.


----------



## JDHutt25 (Dec 27, 2004)

In the scene where the others slapped on their masks and took off, I could have sworn one of them was Juliette, at least based on the outfit. Did anyone else notice that?


----------



## cherry ghost (Sep 13, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> And since Juliet has no clue what it is, it is perhaps reasonable to assume that SM has no prior experience with the fence...


Juliet--"Alright, we don't know what it is, but we know that it doesn't like our fences."


----------



## sushikitten (Jan 28, 2005)

Wow, only two pages? I was sure I'd have an hour's worth of reading to do this morning.



JDHutt25 said:


> In the scene where the others slapped on their masks and took off, I could have sworn one of them was Juliette, at least based on the outfit. Did anyone else notice that?


I thought that as well. But then I thought maybe she was with them, but once they got into the room they took off her mask and let her get knocked out? Implausible, but possible.

One small bit that confused me. At the beginning, Kate is taken down by Juliet and was on the floor, laying amidst her sandwich. The next time we see her after her flashback, she's sitting there on the floor when Locke comes in and says his goodbye. The next time we see her, she's back laying on the floor again next to her sandwich - which would seem to imply that's where she has been the whole time after being knocked out by Juliet, except that she was up and about with Locke. Why would she go back and lay on the floor when she was in a room with couches? I am guessing production error, but maybe I'm missing something?


----------



## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

Wow, they are really piling on the connections between characters now. Look like Sawyer taught his girlfriend to be a good little con artist too.


----------



## headytiger (Oct 17, 2003)

JDHutt25 said:


> In the scene where the others slapped on their masks and took off, I could have sworn one of them was Juliette, at least based on the outfit. Did anyone else notice that?


Yeah, I saw that. That kind of threw me off for the rest of the show.


----------



## headytiger (Oct 17, 2003)

Could there be two monsters? Smokey and Clanky Loud Flashbulb Thingy?


----------



## sushikitten (Jan 28, 2005)

I just went back and looked and although it was a blonde it wasn't her - the girl in the mask was wearing purple shirt and jeans. Juliet was wearing a blue shirt and... khakis? Getting a screenshot now...

ETA: Okay, my screenshot didn't work, but you can see it here: http://losteastereggs.blogspot.com/


----------



## Peter000 (Apr 15, 2002)

jenhudson said:


> One small bit that confused me. At the beginning, Kate is taken down by Juliet and was on the floor, laying amidst her sandwich. The next time we see her after her flashback, she's sitting there on the floor when Locke comes in and says his goodbye. The next time we see her, she's back laying on the floor again next to her sandwich - which would seem to imply that's where she has been the whole time after being knocked out by Juliet, except that she was up and about with Locke. Why would she go back and lay on the floor when she was in a room with couches? I am guessing production error, but maybe I'm missing something?


You left out when they threw the smoke/knockout bomb into the house. Locke comes in, says "good-bye, I'm going with them," they throw the smoke-bombs into the house, she collapses, then wakes up in the jungle.

After thinking about it, I'm 99% sure Juliette is a spy. She admitted taking Kate into the jungle, which means she wasn't knocked out by the smoke bombs. Obviously the bombs have a long lasting effect, as witnessed by Jack being out for at least 24 hours, until Kate woke him up. I wouldn't trust ANY of the others.


----------



## sushikitten (Jan 28, 2005)

Okay, here we go:

Unknown character, short purple shirt, jeans.










Juliet, long blue shirt, jeans.


----------



## JDHutt25 (Dec 27, 2004)

Nice work Jen. Looks like they are indeed different people.


----------



## sushikitten (Jan 28, 2005)

Peter000 said:


> You left out when they threw the smoke/knockout bomb into the house. Locke comes in, says "good-bye, I'm going with them," they throw the smoke-bombs into the house, she collapses, then wakes up in the jungle.
> 
> After thinking about it, I'm 99% sure Juliette is a spy. She admitted taking Kate into the jungle, which means she wasn't knocked out by the smoke bombs. Obviously the bombs have a long lasting effect, as witnessed by Jack being out for at least 24 hours, until Kate woke him up. I wouldn't trust ANY of the others.


No, I didn't forget that part, because that was at the very end. What confused me is she was 1) on the floor knocked out and recovering, 2) up and moving around talking to Locke, then 3) back laying on the floor eating the sandwich...which afterwards came 4) knocked out by the stuff.

Why would she be back laying on the floor after being up and talking to Locke?


----------



## Peter000 (Apr 15, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Note, however, that the smoke monster did not hit the fence and stop. It hit the fence and ran like hell in the other direction.


No it didn't... it hit the fence, then paused and had a little standoff with Juliette (like it was glaring at her angrily), then left. At least as far as I remember it.


----------



## drevnock (Jan 24, 2003)

Why did Jules have a handcuff key with her?
She said she didn't know what was going on yet she had handcuff keys on her?
SPY SPY SPY!


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

jenhudson said:


> I just went back and looked and although it was a blonde it wasn't her - the girl in the mask was wearing purple shirt and jeans. Juliet was wearing a blue shirt and... khakis? Getting a screenshot now...
> 
> ETA: Okay, my screenshot didn't work, but you can see it here: http://losteastereggs.blogspot.com/


According to a screenshot on that page, the cannisters thrown into the rooms was CS Gas. CS Gas doesn't know people out. It just burns their eyes and makes uncontrollable snot flow from their nose.

I experienced enough CS gas in the Army and never once passed out.

I also don't think that the Others would need to be wearing masks when they made their get away since Kate & Jack were both inside with the canisters. And Sayid wouldn't have been that effected by the gas being outside with the wind to help it dissipate.


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Of course, that logic puts a 42% cap on hotness while mud wrestling with Juliette.
> 
> And that's just WRONG.


Actually, it puts a 108% cap.


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

mask2343 said:


> "We don't know what it is, but we know it doesn't like our fences." They really DON'T get the island if they don't know what the monster is. I wasn't expecting her to not know.


I have stopped believing anything she says, so I figured they do know.


----------



## TonyTheTiger (Dec 22, 2006)

I know we haven't seen the last of the Others.

Locke wouldn't go with them if they were leaving the island as he's said many times (and we know) he would be back in a wheelchair if he ever left. He even went as far as blowing up the sub to avoid leaving! I think they've just relocated and will appear again later.


----------



## Mike Farrington (Nov 16, 2000)

A small and stupid tidbit: Did anyone else notice that DHARMA uses A-1 brand steak sauce? It wasn't just DHARMA "Steadk Sauce", it said "A-1".

-Mike


----------



## Mike Farrington (Nov 16, 2000)

As far as the flashing from the monster. I initially thought it was erasing here memory (like Men In Black), but she obviously didn't forget anything (unless she forgot the next-level kinda stuff). Then, I thought it might be Ben giving her instructions (assuming they are in control of the monster).

But, as someone else stated, it could have been identifying her.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

drevnock said:


> Why did Jules have a handcuff key with her?
> She said she didn't know what was going on yet she had handcuff keys on her?
> SPY SPY SPY!


Did you fall asleep when juliet explained that?


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

markz said:


> According to a screenshot on that page, the cannisters thrown into the rooms was CS Gas. CS Gas doesn't know people out. It just burns their eyes and makes uncontrollable snot flow from their nose.
> 
> I experienced enough CS gas in the Army and never once passed out.
> 
> I also don't think that the Others would need to be wearing masks when they made their get away since Kate & Jack were both inside with the canisters. And Sayid wouldn't have been that effected by the gas being outside with the wind to help it dissipate.


Do we know that Sayid wasn't brought inside?


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

mqpickles said:


> Do we know that Sayid wasn't brought inside?


No, not really. He had been chained outside in a previous episode. And in this episode, Juliette (who may be lying) said that he was "in one of those back yards".


----------



## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Mike Farrington said:


> A small and stupid tidbit: Did anyone else notice that DHARMA uses A-1 brand steak sauce? It wasn't just DHARMA "Steadk Sauce", it said "A-1".
> 
> -Mike


But Hurley referred to it as Dharma Steak Sauce...he conveniently left out "A-1".


----------



## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

I thought they said Dharma A-1 and left out steak sauce?


----------



## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Lee L said:


> I thought they said Dharma A-1 and left out steak sauce?


Yeah, maybe that was it. I don't remember things too good anymore....


----------



## Jericho Dog (Feb 10, 2006)

Lee L said:


> I thought they said Dharma A-1 and left out steak sauce?


Yeah, they did say A-1.
I mentioned to my wife that I think that was the first brand name they've used.


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

Jericho Dog said:


> I mentioned to my wife that I think that was the first brand name they've used.


What, you don't have any Mr Clucks in your area?


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Just to get the quote right:

He said "Dharma A-1 and paprika..."


----------



## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

MickeS said:


> Interesting to see the flashback with Kate's connection to Sawyer, but everything else in the flashback felt like repeated info. Although it did give (more) explanation of why mom screamed like crazy when Kate visited her in the hospital.


the point of the flashback was to give more insight into kate. remember, this is a show driven by the intricacies of the characters.

she was betrayed by her mom, and now is betrayed by jack.


----------



## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

jenhudson said:


> One small bit that confused me. At the beginning, Kate is taken down by Juliet and was on the floor, laying amidst her sandwich. The next time we see her after her flashback, she's sitting there on the floor when Locke comes in and says his goodbye. The next time we see her, she's back laying on the floor again next to her sandwich - which would seem to imply that's where she has been the whole time after being knocked out by Juliet, except that she was up and about with Locke. Why would she go back and lay on the floor when she was in a room with couches? I am guessing production error, but maybe I'm missing something?


Yeah my wife caught that too.


----------



## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

bruinfan said:


> the point of the flashback was to give more insight into kate. remember, this is a show driven by the intricacies of the characters.
> 
> she was betrayed by her mom, and now is betrayed by jack.


Plus they reused the line "you can't choose who you love" (can't remember exactly what the original context was, but I thought it was Kate related).


----------



## modnar (Oct 15, 2000)

Regarding the inconsistency of Kate on the floor then up talking to Locke and then back on the floor... maybe when she was with Locke that was just a not-so-distant flashback.


----------



## MacThor (Feb 7, 2002)

So, as someone who is unfamiliar with the "Left Behind" series of novels, were there any significant parallels?


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

markz said:


> No, not really. He had been chained outside in a previous episode. And in this episode, Juliette (who may be lying) said that he was "in one of those back yards".


I missed that. Thanks. Doesn't seem like the kind of thing worth lying about, so maybe Sayid wasn't gassed, just tied up and perhaps a bit woozy.

(We've been having sound and tiling problems with our digital cable that magically disappear when the cable guy comes over. I blame Widmore.)


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

bruinfan said:


> the point of the flashback was to give more insight into kate. remember, this is a show driven by the intricacies of the characters.
> 
> she was betrayed by her mom, and now is betrayed by jack.


Yeah, and I appreciate that aspect of the show. But we already knew about her mom's betrayal. It didn't have very much impact now to see her rejected by her mother when we had already seen it - twice. First in season one's "Born to run" and later in season two's "What Kate did". The third time we learn that she's rejected by her mother... not exactly heartstopping material anymore.


----------



## unicorngoddess (Nov 20, 2005)

So, did this episode put everyone on the same page with Nikki and Paulo. Are we all in agreement yet that they're actually dead.

I liked this episode. LOVED that Hurley was able to con Sawyer into being nice and Sawyer didn't even see it coming.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

No... we are not in agreement. Kiele has stated she doesn't know if she's alive or dead and that none of the show makers have told her. There have been lots of wacky things with live and dead bodies and healing and disappearing to know for sure. Just not mentioning it is not the same thing as answering it definitively. Just because hurley thinks they are dead doesn't mean they are - he didn't even know they were paralyzed.


----------



## Jericho Dog (Feb 10, 2006)

MickeS said:


> What, you don't have any Mr Clucks in your area?


Last time I ate there I almost got hit by a meteor.


probably should get one of those Toyota trucks.....


----------



## mask2343 (Jan 6, 2003)

MacThor said:


> So, as someone who is unfamiliar with the "Left Behind" series of novels, were there any significant parallels?


No. Unless it turns out that the others vanished into thin air and that Jesus is returning after years of plagues.


----------



## scottykempf (Dec 1, 2004)

TAsunder said:


> No... we are not in agreement. Kiele has stated she doesn't know if she's alive or dead and that none of the show makers have told her. There have been lots of wacky things with live and dead bodies and healing and disappearing to know for sure. Just not mentioning it is not the same thing as answering it definitively. Just because hurley thinks they are dead doesn't mean they are - he didn't even know they were paralyzed.


You could replace "wacky" with "stupid".


----------



## ElJay (Apr 6, 2005)

TAsunder said:


> No... we are not in agreement. Kiele has stated she doesn't know if she's alive or dead and that none of the show makers have told her. There have been lots of wacky things with live and dead bodies and healing and disappearing to know for sure. Just not mentioning it is not the same thing as answering it definitively. Just because hurley thinks they are dead doesn't mean they are - he didn't even know they were paralyzed.


Huh? She has been buried for at least a few hours at this point and it's not exactly easy to dig yourself out of a few feet of sand... Especially with no air to breathe. I think the only way she could survive was if the island suddenly allowed her lungs to breathe in sand in place of air. I expect this is coming with the magic turtle if this is the case.


----------



## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

TAsunder said:


> No... we are not in agreement. Kiele has stated she doesn't know if she's alive or dead and that none of the show makers have told her. There have been lots of wacky things with live and dead bodies and healing and disappearing to know for sure. Just not mentioning it is not the same thing as answering it definitively. Just because hurley thinks they are dead doesn't mean they are - he didn't even know they were paralyzed.




This reminds me of a certain other show! Does thinking you are a Cylon mean you are a Cylon? Does being buried alive mean you are dead and buried? Answers! Answers! We demand answers! (but not from external sources, please!)


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

So with the way Hurley tricked Sawyer, does this make Hurley the anti-Ben?

And did anyone else catch the look on Kate's face when Juliet mentioned that Jack had been married?


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

drew2k said:


> <snip>We demand answers! (but not from external sources, please!)


Unless they are tagged as spoilers!


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

bruinfan said:


> the point of the flashback was to give more insight into kate. remember, this is a show driven by the intricacies of the characters.
> 
> she was betrayed by her mom, and now is betrayed by jack.


Yeah, except objectively, I don't think these should really count as betrayals.

Kate's mom turned her in, but that's because she committed a premeditated murder. That's what you're supposed to do, even if it is your own kid and she thought she was doing it to help you.

And Jack was going to leave the island and planned to come back for her.

This ep. shows that Kate has poor judgment and wacked-out morals/priorities. But I don't think that's news (we've known that at least since she shot her bank-robbing partner to get a toy airplane from a safety deposit box -- talk about betrayal).


----------



## lew (Mar 12, 2002)

I think they're dead but we don't know that. Producers can bring them back whenever they want to. Flash back--show them being buried--show the survivors leaving the grave site--show Vincent digging them up--show them replacing the sand and then disappearing into the jungle. It looks like they're only buried 2-3 feet down. I guess it's even possible for the flash back to show them digging themselves out.



unicorngoddess said:


> So, did this episode put everyone on the same page with Nikki and Paulo. Are we all in agreement yet that they're actually dead.
> 
> I liked this episode. LOVED that Hurley was able to con Sawyer into being nice and Sawyer didn't even see it coming.


----------



## DancnDude (Feb 7, 2001)

"Your baby looks less wrinkley than last week" "eer, uhh thanks I guess he does" LOL


----------



## Mike Farrington (Nov 16, 2000)

JYoung said:


> And did anyone else catch the look on Kate's face when Juliet mentioned that Jack had been married?


 It seemed like she took it all as "He told you all this? You've only known each other x-days". I'm not sure if Kate knows that they have extensive dossiers on everyone.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

They've been buried for a bit only if nothing happened to them that we haven't seen. Out of sight does not mean nothing happens in this show.

Furthermore, as I said last week, a few hours does not mean they are dead, because the paralytic has not necessarily worn off enough. In the special Lost universe, unlike Fugu poisoning, they didn't need respiratory support despite seemingly not breathing.

Not saying I think they are definitely alive, but it's far from conclusively settled.


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

JYoung said:


> And did anyone else catch the look on Kate's face when Juliet mentioned that Jack had been married?


Yes. It was Priceless.
A major characteristic shared by Kate, Locke and sometimes Jack is impulsive precipitous action based on emotional response.


----------



## Mike Farrington (Nov 16, 2000)

mqpickles said:


> Yeah, except objectively, I don't think these should really count as betrayals.
> 
> Kate's mom turned her in, but that's because she committed a premeditated murder. That's what you're supposed to do, even if it is your own kid and she thought she was doing it to help you.
> 
> ...


The point of the flashback in this episode was that Kate murdered her stepfather, thinking she was helping/rescuing her mother. But her mother did not need or want her help. Same with Jack. She came to Jack's rescue, only he did not need or want to be rescued.

So, it shows that Kate keeps "rescuing" people who do not want this and end up rejecting her help.


----------



## Mike Farrington (Nov 16, 2000)

TAsunder said:


> They've been buried for a bit only if nothing happened to them that we haven't seen. Out of sight does not mean nothing happens in this show.
> 
> Furthermore, as I said last week, a few hours does not mean they are dead, because the paralytic has not necessarily worn off enough. In the special Lost universe, unlike Fugu poisoning, they didn't need respiratory support despite seemingly not breathing.
> 
> Not saying I think they are definitely alive, but it's far from conclusively settled.


Even if they only need a tiny bit of oxygen while being paralyzed, how are they going to get it when their paralyzed chest muscles can't breath against tons of sand.

They're toast. Plain and simple.

Besides... what a cop-out it would be to save them. The writers wouldn't be able to look themselves in the mirror.


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

What makes you think their chest muscles were working even a little?

It would only be somewhat of a cop out, because they have already established that "nothing stays buried" and weird healing properties of the island.


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

Mike Farrington said:


> Even if they only need a tiny bit of oxygen while being paralyzed, how are they going to get it when their paralyzed chest muscles can't breath against tons of sand.
> 
> They're toast. Plain and simple.
> 
> Besides... what a cop-out it would be to save them. The writers wouldn't be able to look themselves in the mirror.


...or a reflection in a window!


----------



## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

mqpickles said:


> Yeah, except objectively, I don't think these should really count as betrayals.


she felt betrayed, is a better way to put it.

but mikefarrington put it best.


----------



## unicorngoddess (Nov 20, 2005)

Mike Farrington said:


> It seemed like she took it all as "He told you all this? You've only known each other x-days". I'm not sure if Kate knows that they have extensive dossiers on everyone.


She has to know they have some way of knowing...Locke told her that the Others told her what she had done. So she has to know they have some way of getting this information.


----------



## madscientist (Nov 12, 2003)

jenhudson said:


> No, I didn't forget that part, because that was at the very end. What confused me is she was 1) on the floor knocked out and recovering, 2) up and moving around talking to Locke, then 3) back laying on the floor eating the sandwich...which afterwards came 4) knocked out by the stuff.
> 
> Why would she be back laying on the floor after being up and talking to Locke?


I just figured she was down there thinking about whether or not to eat the sandwich after all. I certainly never thought she'd been down there the entire time, nor did I think we were meant to interpret the scene that way. In fact, IIRC Kate never lost consciousness when Juliet threw her down. She might have closed her eyes, but it didn't look to me like she was unconscious.

Put me on the list of those who think Juliet is a spy. I don't buy her explanations for one moment.

It seems to me I've seen that very same jewelry scam before. Wasn't that something Sawyer taught her as a minor scam, before they started working on the big one?


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

madscientist said:


> It seems to me I've seen that very same jewelry scam before. Wasn't that something Sawyer taught her as a minor scam, before they started working on the big one?


Yep, I think Sawyer did it in a previous episode. She obviously hadn't perfected it.  Probably because you need two people to do it properly...


----------



## Jericho Dog (Feb 10, 2006)

Mike Farrington said:


> Besides... what a cop-out it would be to save them. The writers wouldn't be able to look themselves in the mirror.





markz said:


> ...or a reflection in a window!


Vampires...?


----------



## sushikitten (Jan 28, 2005)

madscientist said:


> I just figured she was down there thinking about whether or not to eat the sandwich after all. I certainly never thought she'd been down there the entire time, nor did I think we were meant to interpret the scene that way. In fact, IIRC Kate never lost consciousness when Juliet threw her down. She might have closed her eyes, but it didn't look to me like she was unconscious.
> 
> Put me on the list of those who think Juliet is a spy. I don't buy her explanations for one moment.
> 
> It seems to me I've seen that very same jewelry scam before. Wasn't that something Sawyer taught her as a minor scam, before they started working on the big one?


1. I know Kate wasn't KNOCKED OUT per se, but knocked on her a$$ I guess would have been better to say. 

2. I am on the fence with this. Remember, she was branded in a recent ep so they do not like her. Maybe they took this time to be rid of her for good.

3. Yes, Sawyer taught her that scam.


----------



## Mabes (Jan 12, 2001)

I quit watching the show after about the 2nd show this year, but I've seen the past 2 and they got my interest. Is there anywhere I can go to get a brief, 2-3 paragraph summary of what's happened this season? Or is it still basically that there are The Others who are mysterious and we don't know what they are doing there and neither do any of the characters?


----------



## getreal (Sep 29, 2003)

mqpickles said:


> ... it looks like Sawyer shouldn't get too used to being in charge. (Anyway, he's a figure head, since Hurley is pulling his strings, as he has pulled Jack's sometimes too by the way.)


Good observation. Hurley may be flying under the radar, but he seems to exert more control than anyone else has noticed.

Why do you suppose the smoke monster has to announce its presence with that eerie howl, but it can flee back through the woods quietly, instead of yelping like a scared dog who just hit an electrical fence?


----------



## getreal (Sep 29, 2003)

Mabes said:


> I quit watching the show after about the 2nd show this year, but I've seen the past 2 and they got my interest. Is there anywhere I can go to get a brief, 2-3 paragraph summary of what's happened this season? Or is it still basically that there are The Others who are mysterious and we don't know what they are doing there and neither do any of the characters?


I'd suggest you try sticking with the show and quit being a "fairweather fan". There's just so much going on in every episode.

Personally, I've enjoyed ALL episodes since the beginning of LOST. I suspend my disbelief for an hour each week and get lost in the story. That's what these shows are for. Don't over-analyze or over-rationalize and you can maintain your enjoyment.

But I think that when people invest too much time into analysis and questions, that they set themselves up for disappointment when the writers take a different direction than what the viewer is expecting.

I think this is exactly the reason some viewers get upset, while other viewers continue to enjoy LOST.


----------



## Mabes (Jan 12, 2001)

getreal said:


> I'd suggest you try sticking with the show and quit being a "fairweather fan". There's just so much going on in every episode.
> 
> Personally, I've enjoyed ALL episodes since the beginning of LOST. I suspend my disbelief for an hour each week and get lost in the story. That's what these shows are for. Don't over-analyze or over-rationalize and you can maintain your enjoyment.
> 
> ...


But if I'm right, I don't need to bother reading about the past 10 or so episodes, I can just pick it up from here. It's not important to me to know every detail of every character.


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

getreal said:


> Good observation. Hurley may be flying under the radar, but he seems to exert more control than anyone else has noticed.
> 
> Why do you suppose the smoke monster has to announce its presence with that eerie howl, but it can flee back through the woods quietly, instead of yelping like a scared dog who just hit an electrical fence?


I figured that howl is some kind of mechanical noise, like a hatch opening or something. Although, it should make that same noise when it closes I suppose.


----------



## Mike Farrington (Nov 16, 2000)

Mabes said:


> I quit watching the show after about the 2nd show this year, but I've seen the past 2 and they got my interest. Is there anywhere I can go to get a brief, 2-3 paragraph summary of what's happened this season? Or is it still basically that there are The Others who are mysterious and we don't know what they are doing there and neither do any of the characters?


I can't help you with the short synopses, but try televisionwithoutpity.com and lostpedia.org or episode by episode infomation.

I forgot televisionwithoutpity.com has "recaplets" which are nice and short. Here is one from last night's episode: http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/articles/content/a12959/

Edit: after reading that recaplet, it is very hard to understand unless you've seen the episode.


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

Mabes said:


> But if I'm right, I don't need to bother reading about the past 10 or so episodes, I can just pick it up from here. It's not important to me to know every detail of every character.


Yes, overall there hasn't changed much. But there has been a bunch of interesting stories about some characters, and really interesting details.


----------



## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Mabes said:


> I quit watching the show after about the 2nd show this year, but I've seen the past 2 and they got my interest. Is there anywhere I can go to get a brief, 2-3 paragraph summary of what's happened this season?


http://abc.go.com/primetime/lost/episodes?season=3&episode=4

More than a couple paragraphs, but not too bad.


----------



## brianp6621 (Nov 22, 1999)

jenhudson said:


> Okay, here we go:
> 
> Unknown character, short purple shirt, jeans.
> 
> ...


Actually I'm not at all convinced of this. To me that shirt looks blue with long sleeves, just in one it is tucked in, the other it isn't.

So I'm in the, that is Juliet but either they knocked her out later, or the whole thing is another scam.


----------



## Church AV Guy (Jan 19, 2005)

unicorngoddess said:


> She has to know they have some way of knowing...Locke told her that the Others told her what she had done. So she has to know they have some way of getting this information.


Yes, but he immediately followed it with, "They are not big on forgiveness." He never said exactly what he was told. I think the forgiveness line suggests that Locke was told what Kate did to hurt The Others, not anything particular about her pre-island past.

Are we to assume that Juliet, all by herself, dragged an unconscious Kate all that way into the jungle alone? She is tough, and strong, and knows a lot about martial arts for a fertility doctor, but I doubt she is up to that level of effort.

Hugo is pretty fair at manipulating people. Even, apparently, con men, who should be able to spot those things.

Sawyer cleaning that fish was just too much. And what did he do with his hair?


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

brianp6621 said:


> Actually I'm not at all convinced of this. To me that shirt looks blue with long sleeves, just in one it is tucked in, the other it isn't.
> 
> So I'm in the, that is Juliet but either they knocked her out later, or the whole thing is another scam.


I was thinking the same thing. The lighting is completely different in the two scenes, and the shirt is soaking wet in one of them as well (which is something this show could use more of, btw). I'd still say it's inconclusive whether they're the same person though.


----------



## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

Mabes said:


> I quit watching the show after about the 2nd show this year, but I've seen the past 2 and they got my interest. Is there anywhere I can go to get a brief, 2-3 paragraph summary of what's happened this season? Or is it still basically that there are The Others who are mysterious and we don't know what they are doing there and neither do any of the characters?


Remember this post. It should be referred back to any time someone says nothing's happening, nothing's being revealed, that this season has been a throwaway.

A lot has happened and changed since the sky was so purple & people runnin' everywhere.

Greg


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

bruinfan said:


> she felt betrayed, is a better way to put it.
> 
> but mikefarrington put it best.


I agree with what mikefarrington said and I understand what you're saying.

I still think she doesn't have any good reason to feel betrayed, except by her own bad judgment. To the extent she blames her mom or Jack for her situation, she is way off base.


----------



## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

brianp6621 said:


> Actually I'm not at all convinced of this. To me that shirt looks blue with long sleeves, just in one it is tucked in, the other it isn't.
> 
> So I'm in the, that is Juliet but either they knocked her out later, or the whole thing is another scam.


Clearly, clearly, not the same person. I love it when some people get latched on to an idea and won't let it go after being shown clear proof.

Sheesh! Every blond woman is not Juliet!

I remember when we had people insisting that "Penny" (Desmond's girlfriend), Sarah (Jack's ex), and Juliet were all the same person. Clearly not. Three different blond actresses, similar physical type.


----------



## NoThru22 (May 6, 2005)

drew2k said:


> By the way, Jack's father is dead. Yup, dead. Juliette said so.


When was this in doubt? Jack went to Sydney and got his _corpse_ in the second or third episode of the series.


smickola said:


> He was told about his daughter in the prison flashback last year, but it was left wide open that it was possibly a scam, with her conning Sawyer into giving up the money he made from the Warden as revenge - this is the first confirmation that it's true.


Didn't he leave something like half a million dollars to his "daughter." I'd say that confirmed it was true. When was that in doubt???


headytiger said:


> Could there be two monsters? Smokey and Clanky Loud Flashbulb Thingy?


Please be kidding. Please be kidding.

Hopefully that won't turn into anything like other others.


----------



## brianp6621 (Nov 22, 1999)

Fish Man said:


> Clearly, clearly, not the same person. I love it when some people get latched on to an idea and won't let it go after being shown clear proof.
> 
> Sheesh! Every blond woman is not Juliet!
> 
> I remember when we had people insisting that "Penny" (Desmond's girlfriend), Sarah (Jack's ex), and Juliet were all the same person. Clearly not. Three different blond actresses, similar physical type.


How so? What CLEARY makes it not the same person? Even if she was in a COMPLETELY different outfit, she could very easily still have been the same person. The fact that they are in VERY similar outfits makes it that much more suspicious.

I understand not being overly suspicious of everything but given how the last 3 years of lost have gone, you don't seem suspicious enough.


----------



## Sirius Black (Dec 26, 2001)

Mike Farrington said:


> So, it shows that Kate keeps "rescuing" people who do not want this and end up rejecting her help.


You've Jack with a constant need to fix something often things that can't or shouldn't be fixed.

You've Kate with a constant need to rescue people who don't want/need rescuing

You've Locke who has trusts people who shouldn't be trusted.

How many people think Locke going with the Others has something to do with his Dad being on the island?


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

Sirius Black said:


> How many people think Locke going with the Others has something to do with his Dad being on the island?


Uh... how about how many people DON'T think that? It seemed pretty obvious to me.


----------



## tanstaafl (Oct 22, 2002)

About Nikki and Paulo (since that is still coming up).

From this article on the Entertainment Weekly site:



> So what about the final fate of Nikki and Paulo? On a scale of 1 to 10, just how dead are they?
> 
> 10 = Dead as dead can be.
> 5 = You never know: maybe some dead Others will inhabit their bodies and crawl out of those graves!
> 1 = Resurrection Island, baby!


Producer Lindelof's response? (Spoilered for safety)


Spoiler



Damon Lindelof replies: ''Paulo and Nikki are a full-on Nigel Tufnel 11!!!''


----------



## goMO (Dec 29, 2004)

The woman in the top picture has a much slimmer body type that Juliette. Juliette looks hot for a (around) 40 yr old. Although there's not too much to go on, the woman in the upper pic looks to have the body type of a younger woman. jmo...


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

Fish Man said:


> Clearly, clearly, not the same person. I love it when some people get latched on to an idea and won't let it go after being shown clear proof.
> 
> Sheesh! Every blond woman is not Juliet!
> 
> I remember when we had people insisting that "Penny" (Desmond's girlfriend), Sarah (Jack's ex), and Juliet were all the same person. Clearly not. Three different blond actresses, similar physical type.


 4 now, or are you saying that this unidentified other is really Penny or Sarah?


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

mqpickles said:


> 4 now, or are you saying that this unidentified other is really Penny or Sarah?


I am pretty sure that it is Nikki. She & Paulo were probably buried right above another hatch. So, as soon as Hurley et al walked away, the hatch was opened from the inside and they made their escape!

I am kidding!


----------



## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

jenhudson said:


> No, I didn't forget that part, because that was at the very end. What confused me is she was 1) on the floor knocked out and recovering, 2) up and moving around talking to Locke, then 3) back laying on the floor eating the sandwich...which afterwards came 4) knocked out by the stuff.
> 
> Why would she be back laying on the floor after being up and talking to Locke?


I saw the same sequence and the minute I saw her wake up on the floor and look at the sandwich, I thought "damn.. that Locke speech we just saw was a dream"

It's not like Lost to have that big a continuity glitch, I'll await a ruling in a podcast or anything from the producers.

(I remember the big hubub on the date on the X-Ray, and the producers flat out said "we missed it, our bad, it's not part of the story")

Diane


----------



## brianp6621 (Nov 22, 1999)

Fish Man said:


> Clearly, clearly, not the same person. I love it when some people get latched on to an idea and won't let it go after being shown clear proof.
> 
> Sheesh! Every blond woman is not Juliet!
> 
> I remember when we had people insisting that "Penny" (Desmond's girlfriend), Sarah (Jack's ex), and Juliet were all the same person. Clearly not. Three different blond actresses, similar physical type.


As a followup, I watched the scenes again during lunch.

My conclusion? I feel slightly that it isn't Juliet, but not because of anything in this thread. In fact the info in this thread is wrong. On my TV, the woman Kate sees is wearing a blue top almost the EXACT same color as Juliet and it is long sleeve, and they both are wearing similar/same jeans.

However, when you first get a slight glimpse of the side of the womans face it doesn't seem to look like Juliet.

Second, the woman is clear show wearing a brown belt. Juliet is clearly shown to have none. So either they explain that when they dropped Juliet, they also took her belt (possibly to remove the firearm/big knife holster we see attached to it), or it isn't Juliet.

I'm leaning just so slightly to it not being Juliet but could VERY easily see how later they could show/say that it was.

There is CERTAINLY no CLEAR proof that it isn't her...

Edit...
Ok, I now am more/pretty certain it isn't Juliet, but again, not because of evidence found in this thread. If you watch the scene in slo-mo it is obvious that the womans shirt IS short and not tucked it (not something you could tell from the screen caps posted here) and that Juliet's is longer with a slit up each side.


----------



## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

No way are they the same. The shirt that Juliet is wearing is a tunic like loose linen shirt. The one of mystery woman is a tighter, knit shirt.


----------



## brianp6621 (Nov 22, 1999)

Lee L said:


> No way are they the same. The shirt that Juliet is wearing is a tunic like loose linen shirt. The one of mystery woman is a tighter, knit shirt.


I agree, but this is only really conclusive after watching the scenes. A simple tuck in of the shirt could have produced the same effect scene on the screen caps in the thread.


----------



## mitkraft (Feb 21, 2003)

MacThor said:


> So, as someone who is unfamiliar with the "Left Behind" series of novels, were there any significant parallels?


Hmm, well lets see if I can stretch it a bit:

Both of them begin on an airplane in mid flight (the series not this episode).

Waking up to find everyone has vanished and left a "ghost town" like scene behind is similar in the book to last night's episode.

The underground bunkers are reminiscent of where the heroes in the books were hiding later on in the story.

The idea of the "good ones" being the ones that get taken that the Others keep referring to is similar to the whole concept of the book which is the Christian belief that before the Tribulation all the people living on earth who are saved will be suddenly taken (to heaven) and only those that arent saved will be left behind.

Another big plotline in the book is that of the Antichrist which may have further comparisons to Ben. The Antichrist is a powerful charismatic figure who has to power to sway most everyone by simple schmoozing, trickery, Illusion, or outright brainwashing.

The bulk of the series deals with the believers (those who were left behind but later found God) being in conflict (hiding from, living underground, fighting against, trying not to be exterminated by) the established society (led by the Antichrist) which seems to parallel our Losties and their position on the island with the already established society (the others).

Im sure a more in-depth dissection would reveal more, but that was just off the top of my head. After looking back at this, the island does seem to be a sort of micro version of the left behind world. Hmmm this connection could be deeper than we thought.


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

mitkraft said:


> the Christian belief that before the Tribulation all the people living on earth who are saved will be suddenly taken (to heaven) and only those that arent saved will be left behind


OT: Actually, a very small portion of Christians believe this.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Fish Man said:


> Clearly, clearly, not the same person. I love it when some people get latched on to an idea and won't let it go after being shown clear proof.
> 
> Sheesh! Every blond woman is not Juliet!
> 
> I remember when we had people insisting that "Penny" (Desmond's girlfriend), Sarah (Jack's ex), and Juliet were all the same person. Clearly not. Three different blond actresses, similar physical type.


BTW, Sun did not sleep with Jae.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

JYoung said:


> BTW, Sun did not sleep with Jae.


Of course she didn't. They were just keeping each other warm.


----------



## Jericho Dog (Feb 10, 2006)

JYoung said:


> BTW, Sun did not sleep with Jae.


Spoiler tags please!!!


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

JYoung said:


> BTW, Sun did not sleep with Jae.


And Chloe is Lois.


----------



## TiMo Tim (Jul 20, 2001)

Lee L said:


> No way are they the same. The shirt that Juliet is wearing is a tunic like loose linen shirt. The one of mystery woman is a tighter, knit shirt.


I agree, but to be certain, we must see them both after a good wetting-down. 

Changing gears, a question: was Jack's dad's corpse on the plane?


----------



## Fish Man (Mar 4, 2002)

JYoung said:


> BTW, Sun did not sleep with Jae.


And "Elizabeth" who gave Desmond his sailboat is not the same person as lostie "Libby".


----------



## unicorngoddess (Nov 20, 2005)

TiMo Tim said:


> Changing gears, a question: was Jack's dad's corpse on the plane?


Yes. Jack was suppose to be bringing the body back to be burried. Back in season one he found his dad's coffin, but it was empty.


----------



## Bryanmc (Sep 5, 2000)

MickeS said:


> OT: Actually, a very small portion of Christians believe this.


True, the others believe it will happen _after_ the Tribulation.


----------



## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

NoThru22 said:


> drew2k said:
> 
> 
> > By the way, Jack's father is dead. Yup, dead. Juliette said so.
> ...


It's been questioned on and off since the coffin was found but Jack's father's body wasn't, and since his father was seen wandering the island. Don't forget - they're on a mysterious island that cures disease and causes fights over whether or not people who are buried alive might still not be dead several hours/days later ...


----------



## tem (Oct 6, 2003)

what I want to know is, where the F is the Man from Tallahassee ?

Talk about a red herring. Or at least a totally unnecessary tease.


----------



## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

tem said:


> what I want to know is, where the F is the Man from Tallahassee ?
> 
> Talk about a red herring. Or at least a totally unnecessary tease.


I cannot teach him. The boy has no patience.


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

tem said:


> what I want to know is, where the F is the Man from Tallahassee ?
> 
> Talk about a red herring. Or at least a totally unnecessary tease.


so, you've just started watching LOST?


----------



## JETarpon (Jan 1, 2003)

unicorngoddess said:


> Yes. Jack was suppose to be bringing the body back to be burried. Back in season one he found his dad's coffin, but it was empty.


If it was empty, how do we know Claire's dad's corpse was on the plane?


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

JETarpon said:


> If it was empty, how do we know Claire's dad's corpse was on the plane?


Snarky answer, because Jack SAW his Dad on the island


----------



## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

tem said:


> what I want to know is, where the F is the Man from Tallahassee ?
> 
> Talk about a red herring. Or at least a totally unnecessary tease.


Remember when I said I didn't look forward to



Spoiler



the people complaining about not having the Man from Tallahassee for six weeks?



Here we go.

Greg


----------



## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

Mike Farrington said:


> A small and stupid tidbit: Did anyone else notice that DHARMA uses A-1 brand steak sauce? It wasn't just DHARMA "Steadk Sauce", it said "A-1".
> 
> -Mike


I remember"dharm-A-1". Sounds like a Sawyerism.


----------



## tanstaafl (Oct 22, 2002)

drew2k said:


> It's been questioned on and off since the coffin was found but Jack's father's body wasn't, and since his father was seen wandering the island. Don't forget - they're on a mysterious island that cures disease and causes fights over whether or not people who are buried alive might still not be dead several hours/days later ...


Interesting tease, also from the EW web site.


Spoiler



In the final moment of ''The Man From Tallahassee,'' when Locke's eyes went wide and he said ''Dad?'' was Lost paying ironic homage to the classic ''Mom?'' moment in J.J. Abrams' other cult-pop classic, Alias? Despite the fact that the episode was written by former Alias scribes Drew Goddard and Jeff Pinkner, Lindelof and Cuse say no homage intended. But the moment was supposed to evoke the memory of another Lost moment  specifically, the episode from season 1 when Jack began seeing visions of his father on The Island and went hunting for his coffin, only to discover that the body was missing. Hmmmm...

Are we supposed to be wondering what happened to the corpse of Jack's dad, or is that fact totally irrelevant? Lindelof: ''Yes, you should be wondering about that.''


----------



## unicorngoddess (Nov 20, 2005)

JETarpon said:


> If it was empty, how do we know Claire's dad's corpse was on the plane?


Remember Jack arguing with the clerk at the airlines? He didn't have the proper papers to be flying a body back. In order to get a coffin on the plane it has to be checked. The person bringing the body back has to make a final inspection of it before its put on the plane. I think Jack would notice if he went to inspect his dad's coffin and it was empty.


----------



## hapdrastic (Mar 31, 2006)

tem said:


> what I want to know is, where the F is the Man from Tallahassee ?
> 
> Talk about a red herring. Or at least a totally unnecessary tease.


Are you upset because they didn't show more about Locke's father, or did you not get that his father *is* the Man from Tallahassee? (at least, that's how I took last week's episode)


----------



## stellie93 (Feb 25, 2006)

A couple things that seem really out there--where could the Others have gone? They have this comfortable little town they've lived in for years, evidently--why leave it? I'm sure they could keep the Losties out without too much trouble. 

Second, why gas masks? Are they needed to get where they're going? 

And last, why on earth aren't the Losties packing up as we speak and moving into town? At the very least they should make a more thorough search for communications. They're taking Ben's word for it that they can't contact the world? I assume the light on the fence means the electricity is still on. That would be a nice little plus. 

As for Juliet--if that is how she tries to suck up to someone, her social skills need work.


----------



## JETarpon (Jan 1, 2003)

stellie93 said:


> Second, why gas masks? Are they needed to get where they're going?


The gas masks were needed so the Others didn't get knocked out by the gas they lobbed into the Lostie's rooms.


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

stellie93 said:


> And last, why on earth aren't the Losties packing up as we speak and moving into town?


Because Jack et al haven't gone back and told them about the village yet, I assume.

I agree that it would make sense for everyone to move to the village, if it's deemed safe to do so.


----------



## thedudeabides (Aug 7, 2003)

stellie93 said:


> As for Juliet--if that is how she tries to suck up to someone, her social skills need work.


I've been thinking about this a lot, and I'm not sure I believe Juliet's assertion that she handcuffed herself to Kate so that she would not leave her behind. Like Ben, I think Juliet is well versed in the practice of mind games. Rather than suck up to Kate, I think she wanted to have time with her to firmly establish the wedge between Jack and Kate. This way, Jack will continue to trust Juliet (as evidenced by his insistence that she accompany them to the Losties camp). Jack's opinion will carry a lot of weight with the group, and if he trusts her, they will too (even though Sayid and Kate know better).

Anyway, that's what I think. I don't trust her one bit.


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

gchance said:


> Remember when I said I didn't look forward to
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I was thinking about that that very post, but



Spoiler



I thought it was the 4 weeks of episodes without TMFT, and now 2 down, 2 to go.


----------



## stellie93 (Feb 25, 2006)

I've never tried to gas anyone, but if you're outside lobbing the cannisters into a building, do you need a gas mask? Can't you just throw and then slam the door?  Plus, to gas 3 or 4 people why does the entire group need the masks? Couldn't 1 or 2 men do it?


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

stellie93 said:


> I've never tried to gas anyone, but if you're outside lobbing the cannisters into a building, do you need a gas mask? Can't you just throw and then slam the door?  Plus, to gas 3 or 4 people why does the entire group need the masks? Couldn't 1 or 2 men do it?


"Who knows why those people do anything?"


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

stellie93 said:


> I've never tried to gas anyone, but if you're outside lobbing the cannisters into a building, do you need a gas mask? Can't you just throw and then slam the door?  Plus, to gas 3 or 4 people why does the entire group need the masks? Couldn't 1 or 2 men do it?


I have experienced CS Grenades first hand in the Army. No, they would not need gas masks to lob the grenades into a closed building.

You pull the pin but keep ahold of the grenade. When it leaves your hand, the spoon flies off and activates the smoke. At that point, it is already inside the building and the door has been reclosed. And as I posted earlier, CS is teargas. It doesn't knock you out. It makes your eyes burn and causes breathing difficulty by wreaking havok on your sinuses.

Not fun stuff.

Whenever we had to go to the gas chamber for training, the guy running the chamber had built up a tolerance to the stuff and could stand in the room without a mask without any problems.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

markz said:


> I have experienced CS Grenades first hand in the Army.


But were they Dharma CS grenades?

I think not.


----------



## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

stellie93 said:


> I've never tried to gas anyone, but if you're outside lobbing the cannisters into a building, do you need a gas mask? Can't you just throw and then slam the door?  Plus, to gas 3 or 4 people why does the entire group need the masks? Couldn't 1 or 2 men do it?


Depending on how fast acting the gas is and how long the affect lasts once exposed, maybe the gas masks were needed to immediately go in and pull Kate out. They might have pulled out Kate while the grenade was still smoking, which reduced Kate's exposure and allowed her to wake up relatively quickly in the jungle.


----------



## TIVOSciolist (Oct 13, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> But were they Dharma CS grenades?


Could anyone make out the website address on the CS grenade? It was too fuzzy for me, even with HDTV.


----------



## Gene Plantz (Dec 31, 1999)

jenhudson said:


> One small bit that confused me. At the beginning, Kate is taken down by Juliet and was on the floor, laying amidst her sandwich. The next time we see her after her flashback, she's sitting there on the floor when Locke comes in and says his goodbye. The next time we see her, she's back laying on the floor again next to her sandwich - which would seem to imply that's where she has been the whole time after being knocked out by Juliet, except that she was up and about with Locke. Why would she go back and lay on the floor when she was in a room with couches? I am guessing production error, but maybe I'm missing something?


I noticed the odd timing as well.

But, it occurs to me now that maybe Kate was DREAMING the Locke conversation. After all, we all think this is what Locke would say.... so maybe, subconsciously, she did as well. She was knocked out, awoke briefly, dreamed this and conked out again.

The Others have their prize (Locke) and abandoned all the other Losties and moved to "secondary accommodations".


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

TIVOSciolist said:


> Could anyone make out the website address on the CS grenade? It was too fuzzy for me, even with HDTV.


Yeah, its the same as the manufacturer. http://www.alstechnologies.com
I don't think it's of any significance


----------



## madscientist (Nov 12, 2003)

Gene Plantz said:


> I noticed the odd timing as well.
> 
> But, it occurs to me now that maybe Kate was DREAMING the Locke conversation. After all, we all think this is what Locke would say.... so maybe, subconsciously, she did as well. She was knocked out, awoke briefly, dreamed this and conked out again.


Er... no. You guys will latch onto anything! 

Just look at where she ends up on the floor after being flipped, versus where she is when she's staring at the sandwich. What, she dreamed Locke was there and also sleep-crawled over to another part of the floor before she woke up?

She was just bored and hungry, so she was looking at the sandwich wondering how much of her dignity she could afford to lose by eating it.


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

madscientist said:


> Er... no. You guys will latch onto anything!


No kidding!


----------



## skinnyjm (Feb 10, 2005)

I'm with Sayid on this one and he didn't see what Paulo saw.


----------



## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

skinnyjm said:


> I'm with Sayid on this one and he didn't see what Paulo saw.


I'm guessing you're agreeing with some other post in this thread, but I have no idea what this is about ...

Whachoo talkin' 'bout, Willis?


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

I take it from what Kate's mom said to her about calling for help the next time she saw her, that the next time she saw her was when Kate went to see her on her death bed in the hospital. If that's the case, I really don't think that what we've learned explains her mom's reaction in the hospital (I think that episode is from season 1.) Saying that she'd call for help because she said that she would is one thing, but there was absolute terror in that woman's eyes when she saw Kate, as if she were in immediate danger. Nothing we know really justifies that, or she would have had the same reaction when she saw Kate in the bathroom at the diner.


----------



## Jericho Dog (Feb 10, 2006)

jkeegan said:


> I cannot teach him. The boy has no patience.


Nice one.

...and no smeek this week...


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

drew2k said:


> I'm guessing you're agreeing with some other post in this thread, but I have no idea what this is about ...
> 
> Whachoo talkin' 'bout, Willis?


A guess: he's agreeing with Sayid that Juliet is still on the Others' side. Paolo saw Juliet and Ben discussing the strategy of how to get Jack to cooperate (this was before they had captured Jack and co though).


----------



## snodgrass23 (Apr 26, 2006)

thedudeabides said:


> I've been thinking about this a lot, and I'm not sure I believe Juliet's assertion that she handcuffed herself to Kate so that she would not leave her behind. Like Ben, I think Juliet is well versed in the practice of mind games. Rather than suck up to Kate, I think she wanted to have time with her to firmly establish the wedge between Jack and Kate. This way, Jack will continue to trust Juliet (as evidenced by his insistence that she accompany them to the Losties camp). Jack's opinion will carry a lot of weight with the group, and if he trusts her, they will too (even though Sayid and Kate know better).
> 
> Anyway, that's what I think. I don't trust her one bit.


I'm in agreement with this theory. I'll add the rest of my take on it, specifically the part about the handcuffs and fence.

Why was the fence off, and how did Juliet know it was off? My theory is Juliet turned it off when going out to the jungle with Kate, otherwise it would need to always be off which would leave Patchy still alive somewhere. She left if off because she knew she needed to get back through to get back to camp to get Jack. This is also why she happened to have the key in her pocket. Smokey was either a surprise, or the others control it and wanted it to attack so that Kate would gain a little more trust with Juliet.


----------



## goMO (Dec 29, 2004)

why is it that they have plenty of time to run from the smoke monster and hide in the trees, but when the smoke monster ran from the fence, it was lightning fast? 

When it was chasing them, it seems like it was a giant animal with mechanical sounds and it stomped down the grass, but when its smoke, it just flies through the air. Is it not smoke when it was chasing them, but then smoke when it got near the fence?


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

One thing about Juliette, her shock and confusion about Smokey seemed genuine. She may well be lying about everything else, but I don't think she's ever seen nor hear of Smokey before...


----------



## goMO (Dec 29, 2004)

if they don't know about smokey, then why the big fence? She seemed to know that it didn't like the fence.


----------



## PVRMEASAP (Jun 11, 2005)

drew2k said:


> Re: The smoke monster not going over the fence.
> 
> Didn't the smoke monster go "vertical" when it pulled the pilot (or co-pilot) out of the cockpit in Season 1? So we know it can go "up" and change directions in three planes. This is why I wondered why it couldn't go over the fence.


I too thought long and hard about this and it lead me to 2 possible conclusions.

1. When Locke pushed the Russian Guy (can't remember his name so I'll just call him R.G.) into the fence, he went right on through and then began to shake and convulse and spew blood and brain matter from his ears. Why then was the smoke monster stopped completely by the fence? Could it be that the fence was never actually "armed" when R.G. (and subsequently Locke, Kate and Sayid) first encountered it and R.G.'s death was actually caused by something else?

2. While this may be a bit of a stretch perhaps, could it be that the fence's "force field" only covers the areas between the pillars and therefore Locke, Kate and Sayid were able to cross directly over the pillar where there was no "force field"? If so, then it's possible that the smoke monster was either not intelligent enough to figure out it needed to pass directly above a pillar or perhaps it couldn't squeeze through that small of an area. Although it is smoke...presumably.

Anyhow, these are all just thoughts rattling around my head.

bmoore


----------



## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> One thing about Juliette, her shock and confusion about Smokey seemed genuine. She may well be lying about everything else, but I don't think she's ever seen nor hear of Smokey before...


Even though she said they knew about it but didn't know what it was in the episode?


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

PVRMEASAP said:


> 1. When Locke pushed the Russian Guy (can't remember his name so I'll just call him R.G.) into the fence, he went right on through and then began to shake and convulse and spew blood and brain matter from his ears. Why then was the smoke monster stopped completely by the fence? Could it be that the fence was never actually "armed" when R.G. (and subsequently Locke, Kate and Sayid) first encountered it and R.G.'s death was actually caused by something else?


I think it is possible that Mikhael chomped down on some poison capsul or something. Not likely, but possible.

Another possibility is that Smokey somehow sensed the danger from the fense and didn't want to try to cross it.


----------



## bdlucas (Feb 15, 2004)

Regarding the smoke monster not going up and over the fence - have we ever seen the smoke monster go up and _not_ remain connected to the ground, where it seems to live? If it has to remain connected to the ground that could explain why it couldn't go over the fence.


----------



## markz (Oct 22, 2002)

bdlucas said:


> Regarding the smoke monster not going up and over the fence - have we ever seen the smoke monster go up and _not_ remain connected to the ground, where it seems to live? If it has to remain connected to the ground that could explain why it couldn't go over the fence.


I assume the smoke monster is what pulled the pilot (Greg Grunberg) out of the cockpit of the plane. That was up off the ground in the trees at the time wasn't it?


----------



## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

markz said:


> I assume the smoke monster is what pulled the pilot (Greg Grunberg) out of the cockpit of the plane. That was up off the ground in the trees at the time wasn't it?


It might still have stayed connected to the ground.


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

Since the show ignores the laws of physics (a statement, not a complaint - I like LOST) I think it's utter futility to speculate on why Smokey couldn't go over or under the barrier or who should wake up when from some sleeping gas. Smokey's limits and capabilities are what the writers say they are, within the bounds of willingly complicit suspension of disbelief.


----------



## JMikeD (Jun 10, 2002)

philw1776 said:


> I think it's utter futility to speculate


That hasn't stopped anyone in this forum from coming up with the most outrageous and unsubstantiated ideas I've ever seen about everything on the show.

It's part of the charm of the forum.


----------



## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

Me, I like the characters and their interactions in a surreal environment.


----------



## tanstaafl (Oct 22, 2002)

markz said:


> I assume the smoke monster is what pulled the pilot (Greg Grunberg) out of the cockpit of the plane. That was up off the ground in the trees at the time wasn't it?


When Smokey the Monster was bashing Eko about it grabbed him with a "tentacle" and was using that to throw him around with, but I think the bulk of it remained in a single mass on or near the ground. It could have extended a similar tentacle up to grab the pilot and later throw him into the top of the tree.

I just want to know, every time someone hides from Old Smokey, do they always hide in that exact same circle of trees? It always looks like the same one to me.


----------



## Hunter Green (Feb 22, 2002)

Mike Farrington said:


> Besides... what a cop-out it would be to save them. The writers wouldn't be able to look themselves in the mirror.


When Exposé was wrapping, the guy talking to Nikki about how they could bring her character back ("bulletproof vest? bulletproof breasts?") already set up that "cop-out". The writers could have been agreeing with you... but then, given how that scene also included the line about "you know what happens to guest stars", they could also be setting themselves up.


----------



## skinnyjm (Feb 10, 2005)

skinnyjm said:


> I'm with Sayid on this one and he didn't see what Paulo saw.





drew2k said:


> I'm guessing you're agreeing with some other post in this thread, but I have no idea what this is about ...
> 
> Whachoo talkin' 'bout, Willis?





MickeS said:


> A guess: he's agreeing with Sayid that Juliet is still on the Others' side. Paolo saw Juliet and Ben discussing the strategy of how to get Jack to cooperate (this was before they had captured Jack and co though).


Yeah, I'm just sayin', if Sayid knew about what Paulo witnessed, he probably would have shot Juliette on site...

I guess we will find out what happens *NEXT* !!!


----------



## Fool Me Twice (Jul 6, 2004)

Fish Man said:


> And "Elizabeth" who gave Desmond his sailboat is not the same person as lostie "Libby".


Oh, and BTW, congratulations on your recently completed swim of the Amazon river:

" 'Fish Man' completes his 3,200-mile Amazon swim "
http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article2434931.ece

Truly amazing!


----------



## danplaysbass (Jul 19, 2004)

Fool Me Twice said:


> Oh, and BTW, congratulations on your recently completed swim of the Amazon river:
> 
> " 'Fish Man' completes his 3,200-mile Amazon swim "
> http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/article2434931.ece
> ...


And utterly pointless.


----------



## hapdrastic (Mar 31, 2006)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> One thing about Juliette, her shock and confusion about Smokey seemed genuine. She may well be lying about everything else, but I don't think she's ever seen nor hear of Smokey before...


Well, she'd at least heard of it before, because she said "alright, I'll admit it, we don't know what it is but we know it hates our fences" (or something to that effect). Although I do agree that it seems genuine.


----------



## drew2k (Jun 10, 2003)

danplaysbass said:


> And utterly pointless.


Posting the link, or swimming across the Amazon?


----------



## mqpickles (Nov 11, 2004)

drew2k said:


> Posting the link, or swimming across the Amazon?


If he took 3200 miles to swim *across *the Amazon, a lot of that would be pointless.


----------



## NoThru22 (May 6, 2005)

PVRMEASAP said:


> 1. When Locke pushed the Russian Guy (can't remember his name so I'll just call him R.G.) into the fence, he went right on through and then began to shake and convulse and spew blood and brain matter from his ears. Why then was the smoke monster stopped completely by the fence? Could it be that the fence was never actually "armed" when R.G. (and subsequently Locke, Kate and Sayid) first encountered it and R.G.'s death was actually caused by something else?


Keegan, is that you?

Wow, that post just makes me say "huh?" There are not two groups of Others!


----------



## jkeegan (Oct 16, 2000)

NoThru22 said:


> Keegan, is that you?
> 
> Wow, that post just makes me say "huh?" There are not two groups of Others!


Nope, the guy died because of the audio fence thingy there..

If Juliette knows about the keypad combo to open up the fence, she's gotta know how it works.. maybe there's some green light on the keypad we didn't see that let's 'em know it's active or something..

..or, maybe she OPENED THE FENCE TO GET OUT WITH KATE. 

..or maybe not. 

Lost tonight!!!


----------

