# To HD Upgrade or not HD Upgrade



## GoHurdler1 (Jan 6, 2006)

Hello All,

I still have the Dir*ecTV DVR R10 TiVo*. I recently purchased an HD 1080p monitor/TV. Needless to say the standard DirecTV looks like crap on the TV. I called DirecTV and I asked a customer service rep for the *HR 23-700 *receiver, which has the 1080 p on it. The CSR stated that DirecTV cant guarantee what receive model I will get. I told her that I have a 1080p monitor and that they have some 1080p programming available that I would like to get. I told her from what I have read; all of the older HD DVR models such as the HR22 are only 1080i. I told her that I have read this online and I saw the HR22 boxes at Best Buy and thats what they said. She then proceeded to tell me that the receivers at Best Buy are refurbished models because all of their current receivers are capable of 1080p.

I told the CSR rep that I dont want to get screwed over by them sending me an HR22 now and then xx amount of months from now they only offer 1080p models. The rep pretty much said that if I wanted another model after I get the HR 22 that I would be charged yet another fee.

I was going to wait for the new *DirecTiVo *model but from what I have read, that wont happen until sometime in *2010 *if we are all lucky. Should I go ahead and place an order and take my chances or should I wait who knows how many more months for an HR 23-700 model?


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## litzdog911 (Oct 18, 2002)

There's really no functional difference between the HR22 and HR23. They both have the same size disk drive. The only slight difference is that the HR23 does not require the B-Band Converter modules.


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## whitepelican (Feb 15, 2005)

And to continue litzdog's point, ALL of the HR2x series DVRs, even going back to the very first HR20-700, have the capability to output 1080p. You realize the 1080p content is only PPV and VOD right? None of the regular broadcast programming is in 1080p.


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## cthomp21 (Jul 15, 2007)

I'm waiting on some more info on the upcoming HD DirecTivo before investing in an HD upgrade.

If you're dying to get some HD content while still retaining a Tivo interface, swap out your R10 with an HR10-250. Just connect an antenna, and you'll get your locals in HD (sat channels with be in SD). You can pick up one pretty inexpensively off of eBay. Put your R10 on another television.


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## robpickles (May 19, 2005)

I am in the same situation.

I bought a rockin' new tv. Have an R10 and want to upgrade.

I called Dtv and they said they would send me the new reciever for $99 and of course the upgrade and everything would cost an additional $10 month.

My question is... is it worth upgrading now and to pay for the new box, especially when I KNOW i will be gettign the new Tivo HD box when it comes out? Seems kind of silly to me to buy their box, when i am going to switch it out in a year or less.

Any suggestions?

Rob


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

robpickles said:


> I am in the same situation.
> 
> I bought a rockin' new tv. Have an R10 and want to upgrade.
> 
> ...


First to clarify something...the $10 a month is the HD access fee. Doesn't have anything to do with the DirecTV receiver type you get. You'll pay that even with the new Tivo box.

Second, the new Tivo box has already been delayed once. It may be delayed yet again. So I guess you need to ask yourself this: Do you want to wait a year or longer and have no HD? What if the new Tivo box actually gets canceled? To me, assuming you plan to stay with DirecTV anyway, $99 seems a small price to pay to get 100 HD channels in the meantime. But then that's just me. When I got my first HDTV 6 years ago I paid $600 for an HD receiver to get 2 HD channels. :up:

Then a year from now if the Tivo is out you can get that in addition to the receiver you get now and have 4 tuners of HD goodness.


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## Matt L (Aug 13, 2000)

Just do it. I sat on the fence so long and finally pulled the trigger and am glad I did. You can find more info in my thread "Dark Side"

IF you do the CE download the receivers are pretty much functionally the same, things are just laid out differently, yes even dual live buffers - and they re not limited to 30 minutes either a big plus. The only thing that is missing are Suggestions. But that is totally outweighed by the fact I can network these puppies and watch anything recored on any of them in any room with a DVR.


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## GoHurdler1 (Jan 6, 2006)

Hello Rob,

Yeah, I gave in and bought the *HR-22.* Even though I have been a customer for over *10 years DirecTV *didn't offer me any kind of a discount for the receiver. They actually lied to me and told me that my account would be billed after the unit was installed and activated. I was charged after placing the order and apparently they added an extra installation to another room. I cancelled the order and bought a unit at a store with a discount. The installer was a jerk. I told him that I didn't want him to come in the house but to just install the new slimline dish. He refused gave me attitude along with his dispatcher. The prick installer then said "I'm cancelling the order" and took off. I was suppose to have received a call from a manager, that never happened.

When I called DirecTV to complain, the customer service reps were all rude and dismissive. I was like I've been a customer for *over 10-years!!!* They basically said that if I didn't want someone coming into my home and mess with the cables etc that I had to find a local installer and pay them to do the work.

When I threatened to look into some other services such as *AT&T's U-Verse *or *Time Warner Cable*, they were like go ahead. 
I hate the user interface of the HR-22, and apparently it doesn't have a "wish list" like TiVo and it can't find shows to record unless they are currently in the guide.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

GoHurdler1 said:


> I hate the user interface of the HR-22, and apparently it doesnt have a wish list like TiVo and it cant find shows to record unless they are currently in the guide.


Actually it has similar functionality. Do a keyword search for example and even if it finds no matches you can choose the option to "autorecord" it. It will function like an autorecord wishlist. And in fact with boolean operators you can get pretty crazy with how detailed of a search you want and can limit it to a single channel or range of channels. There is a pretty large thread on DBSTalk all about searching. But of course there is certainly things about a Tivo wishlist that are better. Was just pointing out that you can indeed setup a "wishlist" even if something is not in the guide.


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## samo (Oct 7, 1999)

> The installer was a jerk. I told him that I didn't want him to come in the house but to just install the new slimline dish. He refused gave me attitude along with his dispatcher. The prick installer then said "I'm cancelling the order" and took off.


I don't know who was a jerk in this situation. Installers are people who work for a paycheck and not about to violate company rules because some jerk doesn't let them in a house to verify that dish installation was done correctly.
Not only they are required to verify that everything works (in my case guy verified that signal has good strength on all of the transponders and did have to go out and adjust alignment a little to get better signal on one of the transponders), they also required to replace all the cable connectors on both ends (multi-switch and IRD). When I told my installer to forget it, the connectors are good - he told me "Sorry, but I have to do it because if quality control check the installation I could get fired". I didn't believe him, but 3 days later we had a very polite man at the door from DirecTV QC. He asked to come in and check the installation. Had I insisted not to replace connectors, the installer could get fired.
Sorry, I have no sympathy for you. You didn't want to let the guy in and do his job he is paid by his company to do , so pay out of pocket to somebody else. It is your problem.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

The installer that did my free upgrade 3 years ago needed to come inside. They have to to at the least verify signal strength and force a software update on the DVR. They *have* to do these things. I told him that I just wanted him to swap out the dish and that I would replace the multiswitch and receiver. He came in and checked my work (all lines run and all that) and he was impressed with it. Said "cool" and went out and did the dish while I worked inside. After he was done he came in the check signal strength, told him I already updated the software and he checked that, I signed my paper and off he went.

And installer can't just put up a dish and leave and never actually verify that the installation was correct. If you work with the installer and help out with a good attitude then things would go a lot better then just refusing to let the guy in. No wonder he left.

Honestly, if you never want an installer in your house then simply buy the equipment on your own and install it yourself. That's what I always do other then that one free upgrade.


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## Phil17108 (Apr 17, 2006)

What is the CE download, and is it for the new Directv 20 plus units, and how do we get it?


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## sjberra (May 16, 2005)

Phil17108 said:


> What is the CE download, and is it for the new Directv 20 plus units, and how do we get it?


go to www.dbstalk.com register and access the Cutting edge forum


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## fjwagner (Jan 22, 2006)

GoHurdler1 said:


> Hello Rob,
> 
> Yeah, I gave in and bought the *HR-22.* Even though I have been a customer for over *10 years DirecTV *didn't offer me any kind of a discount for the receiver. They actually lied to me and told me that my account would be billed after the unit was installed and activated. I was charged after placing the order and apparently they added an extra installation to another room. I cancelled the order and bought a unit at a store with a discount. The installer was a jerk. I told him that I didn't want him to come in the house but to just install the new slimline dish. He refused gave me attitude along with his dispatcher. The prick installer then said "I'm cancelling the order" and took off. I was suppose to have received a call from a manager, that never happened.
> 
> ...


I think I have to take sides with DTV on this one.


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## GoHurdler1 (Jan 6, 2006)

samo said:


> I don't know who was a jerk in this situation. Installers are people who work for a paycheck and not about to violate company rules because some jerk doesn't let them in a house to verify that dish installation was done correctly.
> Not only they are required to verify that everything works (in my case guy verified that signal has good strength on all of the transponders and did have to go out and adjust alignment a little to get better signal on one of the transponders), they also required to replace all the cable connectors on both ends (multi-switch and IRD). When I told my installer to forget it, the connectors are good - he told me "Sorry, but I have to do it because if quality control check the installation I could get fired". I didn't believe him, but 3 days later we had a very polite man at the door from DirecTV QC. He asked to come in and check the installation. Had I insisted not to replace connectors, the installer could get fired.
> Sorry, I have no sympathy for you. You didn't want to let the guy in and do his job he is paid by his company to do , so pay out of pocket to somebody else. It is your problem.


No, I dont think its cool that some jerk installer arbitrarily decides to cancel the order after *DirecTV screwed up my first install order*. Adding a standard receiver to the install order and charging me before the installation even took place. I then had to cancel that order and do a new order and wait around for these clowns to show. Oh yeah and when I was told that a manager would be giving me credit for the charge it never happened. I had to call AGAIN and the rep who finally gave me credit said that she *couldnt find any notes* stating that a manager would be giving me credit. WOW, I am shocked a lazy CSR not doing their job. I also never received a call from any manager as promised regarding the installer who took off. I have never had any previous DirecTV installers or CSRs act like pricks before.

Yes, I actually found someone who installed the new Slimline Dish. And guess what, he diddnt f*ck with my cables and didnt come inside and d*ck with my setup etc. And everything works just fine!

And when I made the initial call asking about an HD Receiver and if there was a discount for a long term customer I was told NO! So I was *never *presented the *$99.99 *offer that robpickles was given. And they still havent activated the free 3 months of the six HD channels that I was sent via e-mail even though *I asked for it!*

Remember the CUSTOMER IS ALWAYS RIGHT especially when he is helping to pay your salary!! Oh yeah and telling a long term customer to essentially f-off is not customer service. At any other call center that attitude would not be tolerated and the rep would get *FIRED*!


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## fjwagner (Jan 22, 2006)

GoHurdler - you sound like an angry person. I am not surprised that DTV gave you the treatment that they did. Right or wrong, when you do not treat people with respect they eventually will reach their threshold. I can imagine the notes in your electronic file!


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## vicmeldrew (Sep 28, 2007)

i just scheduled a replacement of one of my 2 tivo sd receivers for one HD dvr - either a 22 or 23 - told them i would not accept anything less; retention said no problem; got it for 99 dollars and a waiver of the $10 monthly hd fee for one year; i didnt have to beg for it etiher but would have taken nothing less; learned this from reading seveal forums. I only decided to do this when dlb was made available thru cutting edge and will be downloading this as soon as the install is done.

guess i just got lucky with retention; told him i would not upgrade other tivo until the new HD tivo is available


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## sjberra (May 16, 2005)

fjwagner said:


> GoHurdler - you sound like an angry person. I am not surprised that DTV gave you the treatment that they did. Right or wrong, when you do not treat people with respect they eventually will reach their threshold. I can imagine the notes in your electronic file!


QFT - add one thing, the customer is always right is a urban legend.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

vicmeldrew said:


> I only decided to do this when dlb was made available thru cutting edge and will be downloading this as soon as the install is done.


Please make sure you read what the cutting edge is all about. It's about testing and not about getting cool wiz bang new features. They are just starting the CE cycle now that includes DLB and MRV and it's been very high risk downloads so far, several bugs including random reboots, and the 2nd night has been canceled a few times. Unless you want to be a part of the testing and can stand bugs including a non functional receiver I would recommend you wait a month or two into the cycle as it becomes more stable.

Just a suggestion.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

GoHurdler1 said:


> Yes, I actually found someone who installed the new Slimline Dish. And guess what, he diddnt f*ck with my cables and didnt come inside and d*ck with my setup etc. And everything works just fine!


Sure everything works fine. You know what you're doing with your setup. But you have to realize that 99.9% of people don't and DirecTV has been burned so many times with chargebacks and such that they have clamped down on installs.

Yea you found someone to install the new Slimine for you. Private company you paid to do it? That's what some here suggested to you before. Or if you actually work with your free installer and not be a prick to them you can get it done as well. There are better ways to present your wishes then throwing up a wall of "stay the f*ck out of my house", ya know?


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## rcfuzz (Nov 20, 2001)

Rob, I had the same dilemma last month when I upgraded my last SD TV (still using my beloved DirecTivo R10) in the house to HD and reluctantly got a DirecTV HR-22 HD DVR. I too was waiting for the promised new Tivo unit, but I couldn't hold out until 2010 (or beyond). Although I went kicking and screaming, I quickly learned to really love the HR-22. Sure the interface is different from the Tivo and I really miss the dual tuner buffers (and my trusty peanut), but the HR-22 works great and I can do a lot of functions faster than I ever could on my Tivo. HD picture looks great too and the VOD 1040p is amazing. Don't fear the HR-22 and dive in. You won't be sorry.



robpickles said:


> I am in the same situation.
> 
> I bought a rockin' new tv. Have an R10 and want to upgrade.
> 
> ...


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## robpickles (May 19, 2005)

Well... I guess I will take the plunge and order the HR-22 or 23 unit, whatever they give me. I really want to take full advantage of my new tv and I guess waiting for the Tivo is going to be way too long. Most likely I will still switch it out when it does finally become available, probably get a small hdtv for my bedroom by then too! 

Thanks all for your help! Wish me luck!

Rob 



rcfuzz said:


> Rob, I had the same dilemma last month when I upgraded my last SD TV (still using my beloved DirecTivo R10) in the house to HD and reluctantly got a DirecTV HR-22 HD DVR. I too was waiting for the promised new Tivo unit, but I couldn't hold out until 2010 (or beyond). Although I went kicking and screaming, I quickly learned to really love the HR-22. Sure the interface is different from the Tivo and I really miss the dual tuner buffers (and my trusty peanut), but the HR-22 works great and I can do a lot of functions faster than I ever could on my Tivo. HD picture looks great too and the VOD 1040p is amazing. Don't fear the HR-22 and dive in. You won't be sorry.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

robpickles said:


> Well... I guess I will take the plunge and order the HR-22 or 23 unit, whatever they give me. I really want to take full advantage of my new tv and I guess waiting for the Tivo is going to be way too long. Most likely I will still switch it out when it does finally become available, probably get a small hdtv for my bedroom by then too!
> 
> Thanks all for your help! Wish me luck!
> 
> Rob


That's what I keep telling people. If you plan to stay with DirecTV anyway, why suffer at least another year, maybe longer with basically no HD other then what you might get OTA? If you want the other HD channels why not get an HR2x and if/when the new Tivo unit comes out then upgrade to that, assuming by then you still can't live without Tivo. No lose situation to me, assuming you want to stick with DirecTV anyway. If not then it's not so cut and dried.


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## MrAP (Sep 14, 2003)

I don't really trust DirecTV reps to give me honest and clear answers, so I'm asking here.

Two questions I need help answering:
1) Has anyone been able to purchase the new HD DVR's? (I really don't want to pay the monthly lease.)
2) I have an SD DTV Tivo DVR that was purchased 6+ years ago. We do not have a landline and so the DVR hasn't phoned home since the original install (we had a landline at the time. If I upgrade now, will I need a landline?

Thanks!


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

MrAP said:


> I don't really trust DirecTV reps to give me honest and clear answers, so I'm asking here.
> 
> Two questions I need help answering:
> 1) Has anyone been able to purchase the new HD DVR's? (I really don't want to pay the monthly lease.)
> ...


1. If you own it, you have to pay an additional receiver fee if it isn't your only receiver. If you lease it, they waive the additional receiver fee but charge you a lease fee which is the same amount as the additional receiver fee so it is cheaper to lease with Directv since they double dip on you if you own the receiver.

2. I don't believe the new ones need a phone line and work over the Directv lines. I believe most if not all have ethernet also.


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## MrAP (Sep 14, 2003)

innocentfreak said:


> 1. If you own it, you have to pay an additional receiver fee if it isn't your only receiver. If you lease it, they waive the additional receiver fee but charge you a lease fee which is the same amount as the additional receiver fee so it is cheaper to lease with Directv since they double dip on you if you own the receiver.


Thanks for the reply! I only have 1 receiver and was going to replace it, but when I looked at DTV online, they only offer a lease option, so I'm wondering if anyone has been able to buy the receiver and how.

Thanks!


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

I believe the only HR DVR you can buy is the HR21 Pro. All others, no matter where "bought", will be leased.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

MrAP said:


> Thanks for the reply! I only have 1 receiver and was going to replace it, but when I looked at DTV online, they only offer a lease option, so I'm wondering if anyone has been able to buy the receiver and how.
> 
> Thanks!


If it's your only receiver then there is no monthly fee, even if leased.

Call it what you want but the monthly fees for owned or leased are exactly the same.

There is no monthly fee for your first receiver.
If you have more then one receiver then your 2nd receiver and beyond is charged 4.99 monthly fee. 
If owned it's called "additional receiver fee".
If leased it's called "lease fee".

You can actually buy a receiver from DirecTV directly but it will cost $400+ and you probably will have to call several times to get a CSR that even knows it's an option. The only other buy option is the HR21 Pro. Otherwise no matter where you get it, it will be leased.

So if this is your one and only receiver:
You can buy for $400+ with no monthly fee, or you can lease for anywhere from free to at most $199 (depends on what you negotiate), again with no monthly fee.

If you own and it dies you will replace it on your own. If you lease and it dies DirecTV will replace it for free (or at most a $20 shipping charge).

So what you do is up to you.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

innocentfreak said:


> 1. If you own it, you have to pay an additional receiver fee if it isn't your only receiver. If you lease it, they waive the additional receiver fee but charge you a lease fee which is the same amount as the additional receiver fee so it is cheaper to lease with Directv since they double dip on you if you own the receiver.


LOL. The fact is that no matter what, owned or leased, any receiver beyond your first is $4.99 a month. It's been called different things on your bill over the years but it's something they have always charged since the beginning 15 years ago, long before there was any lease program.

The fact is that forever it was called "programming mirror fee". When they started leasing they split it and called it "additional receiver fee" for owned and "lease fee" for leased. All for tax depreciation purposes on their end. No great conspiracy to screw the customers. In the end, same $4.99 fee no matter what.


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## MrAP (Sep 14, 2003)

But with the leased ones, don't you have to return the DVR to them? Plus not being able to hack/add bigger drives?


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

MrAP said:


> But with the leased ones, don't you have to return the DVR to them? Plus not being able to hack/add bigger drives?


True and not true. Currently, there are no "hacks" for the HR2x units. You can add an external HDD to get larger storage.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

MrAP said:


> But with the leased ones, don't you have to return the DVR to them? Plus not being able to hack/add bigger drives?


Yes you return leased boxes if you drop DirecTV. But how long do you have to have that owned box to make it worth paying all that extra money for it? And by the time you'd get rid of it and try to sell it on eBay it would be pretty much worthless since a next gen box would be out and people can get them practically free as a lease upgrade anyway. Could always find a sucker on eBay though I guess.

No you can't hack them.

Yes you can add bigger drives. Just buy an external eSata drive and plug it in. It does replace the internal one, it's not additive. So having a 2 TB drive is as simple as plug and play, no hacking needed. Not really much at all to hack anyway since many of the things you'd hack an old DirecTivo for are built in features of the DirecTV DVRs anyway. But I guess it depends on the hacks you're thinking of if you would miss them or not.


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## Matt L (Aug 13, 2000)

JimSpence said:


> I believe the only HR DVR you can buy is the HR21 Pro. All others, no matter where "bought", will be leased.


Not really. I bought and they are listed as OWNED, 3 HR20s on ebay. All in the last few weeks. You have to call D and check the RID number. The early HR20s could be owned and if they are in the system as owned they remain owned. The HR10-250 swapped receiver, an HR23 is listed as leased, but all the others on my account are listed as owned, and I do not have a commitment to deal with.


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## sjberra (May 16, 2005)

MrAP said:


> But with the leased ones, don't you have to return the DVR to them? Plus not being able to hack/add bigger drives?


right in one, but why even bother when you can hang a external estata drive on the unit, restart and have the drive available? 5 minutes work as compared to 2 hours or so to take the unit apart, add a drive then put it back together and hope you did not screw something up


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## MrAP (Sep 14, 2003)

I pulled the trigger and have an HR23 now. I *really* miss the captions when fastfowarding  Otherwise, it's okay!


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## llurgy (Nov 5, 2003)

I have a few questions on this topic.

We are proud new owners of a 54" Panasonic V10 Plasma.
We have a SD Directivo on it. All along I have been planning to wait until the new HD DirecTivos come along but the picture from the SD receiver looks so bad.

Are the Direct TV HD DVR's still as bad as they were regarding usability?

Would I regret getting one now or should I wait for the Tivo version?

They are dual tuner arent they? Can I record the same as on my DirecTivo? 

Can I record two programs whilst watching something from my now playing list?

What are the main differences between the Tivo software and the Directv software?

We own our receivers, one in the living room and one in the bedroom, we are planing on swapping the living room one out for now. At the moment we pay an extra reciver charge and the Tivo DVR charge. Will the extra reciever charge stay the same? Will there still be only one DVR charge even though one will be a Tivo DVR software and the other a Directv software?

If we were planning on eventually swapping out the other receiver in the bedroom for an HD receiver, would the $10 HD charge cover both receivers? 

Finally......We own our present recievers and these are leased. As they are leased does that cover any repairs? Do you still have to buy the insurance?

Thanks in advances for any help given 

Mandy


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## HiDefGator (Oct 12, 2004)

They are dual tuner so you an record just like your directivo. 
You can record 2 shaows and watch a third at the same time.
the monthly bill will be exactly the same as now exept you will need to add the $10 GHD charge if you are not currently getting HD.
The $10 HD charge, like the DVR charge covers all of them. I have 4 HR20's and each additional one only costs $5 a month extra.

You will really only notice a few differences. The remote is very different and will take some getting use to. The menus are VERY different and they will take some time to find your way around. 

The only thing I still find not so great about them is they are not as responsive as the old directivos I had for years. If they are busy (and you never know when) they kind of wait a half second before doing what you asked them to do. I never noticed this with the directivos. 

No way you will regret getting one now. The new DTivo when iot is released will be new hardware and new software, if past expereince is any guide you should wait 6 months for them to work out the bugs first. This was even true of the original directivos when they first came out.


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## llurgy (Nov 5, 2003)

Thank you for your reply 

I am in the procsess of investigating Dish too as I dont know if they would have a better option.
Obviously I am going to spend many hours in front of my puter finding out the pros and cons of each.
I am in the enviable position of being contract free......for now


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## Rainy Dave (Nov 11, 2001)

We recently added an HR21-700 to our entertainment. It sits next to our 2 DirecTiVos. I gotta say, I like the HR21. It's fairly simple to use and has a great picture. 

We ended up getting the HD DVR for free (with free install, 3 months of free Showtime and a $10/month discount for a year). The installer had to run 4 lines from the dish to the multi-switch. He did a great job though we had a horrendous storm while he was performing the install.

Overall, we are quite happy. Will we get a new DirecTiVo when they come out? We shall see what the price is.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

The question I have concerning the new DirecTV HD TiVo is will it be bug free? Probably not, since all newly introduced electronics have problems.


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## fredk (Oct 20, 2008)

I have a Samsung SIR-S4120R and thinking of going HD. If I order from the Directv website, which HD box are they going to send? Did I read correctly in that the new boxes do not have duel tunner buffering? That would not be good. It's nice to be able to jump back and worth between shows.


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## Rainy Dave (Nov 11, 2001)

fredk said:


> I have a Samsung SIR-S4120R and thinking of going HD. If I order from the Directv website, which HD box are they going to send? Did I read correctly in that the new boxes do not have duel tunner buffering? That would not be good. It's nice to be able to jump back and worth between shows.


The new boxes do have dual tuner buffering with the latest software update.

As for which box you'll get, it all depends on what is available at the moment. If you want a specific box, you should go to a store (Best Buy, Costco) and pick one up.


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## llurgy (Nov 5, 2003)

I dont think "I" could just pick one up from the store as I think I would need a new dish and install wouldnt I?
We have no HD reception at the moment only SD with a dual LNB dish outside


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## Rainy Dave (Nov 11, 2001)

llurgy said:


> I dont think "I" could just pick one up from the store as I think I would need a new dish and install wouldnt I?
> We have no HD reception at the moment only SD with a dual LNB dish outside


Ah, true. I'd call them and see what kind of a deal you can get. We ended up getting a "free" HR21-700, free install, $10/month discount for a year and 3 months of Showtime back in September.


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## litzdog911 (Oct 18, 2002)

fredk said:


> I have a Samsung SIR-S4120R and thinking of going HD. If I order from the Directv website, which HD box are they going to send? Did I read correctly in that the new boxes do not have duel tunner buffering? That would not be good. It's nice to be able to jump back and worth between shows.


Definitely call DirecTV. They have some sweet deals for customers upgrading to HD equipment, including free HD dish installation.


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## fredk (Oct 20, 2008)

Thanks, I think I will call them to upgrade. I noticed on their website they said the HD DVR available are HR20 or HR21.

When I call do I need to specify I want an HR22 or HR23? I'm assuming these here are the more updated ones, meaning they have the dual tuner buffers, plus other features?


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

They all have the same features. The major differences are disk size and whether an OTA tuner is integrated (HR20 only). I would not put much stock in what the web site says as far as model goes.


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## llurgy (Nov 5, 2003)

Just called.
I wanted 2 hd dvr receivers and got them both for $250.
They are doing this loyalty thing and the $10 HD charge is waived forever so there will be no difference in my monthly billing.
The installation is this coming Monday afternoon.

I didnt ask for a Showtime offer as we are about 6 weeks into a three month loyalty promotion at the moment. 

I am happy with the outcome as I wasnt looking forward to the HD charge every month but now that has gone away.


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## fredk (Oct 20, 2008)

Just called and got one HD DVR for $99 plus the $10 HD fee waived for one year. That's good, I'm happy. Been a customer since 1997. Didn't threaten to leave, although when I called in I said "cancel service" and got to that department, but never discussed cancelling.


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## llurgy (Nov 5, 2003)

fredk said:


> Just called and got one HD DVR for $99 plus the $10 HD fee waived for one year. That's good, I'm happy. Been a customer since 1997. Didn't threaten to leave, although when I called in I said "cancel service" and got to that department, but never discussed cancelling.


Did you specify a tuner?
When I asked she couldnt say what I would get, but then again I dont know the good from the bad anyway so it wouldnt have meant anything even if she had have been able to tell me.

On the phone I was a bit non-plussed about the HD access. She told me that I would get the HD access free for life as that is ehat was coming up when she looked. I clarified that it was the $10 charge she was talking about and she said yes, you wont have to pay that at all.
I was happy as I thought that I would get a years worth and that would be it.
Maybe they will do away with the HD charge eventually and thats why they were so willing to giving it me free without even asking....I dont know
Roll on Monday


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## HiDefGator (Oct 12, 2004)

I suspect the only way you will get a box with a tuner is if you live in a town small enough to not have locals on the SAT yet.


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

The AM-21 add-on tuner is available for the HR21 and above. DirecTV will usually supply it if you say you are currently using an antenna for OTA, otherwise you can buy it for $50. Even when DirecTV offers locals, it's usually only a small fraction of the available OTA channels.


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## llurgy (Nov 5, 2003)

I duh-hed, sorry...
I wrote tuner and I meant receiver.
I think I can get 4 of my locals in HD.

Mandy


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## llurgy (Nov 5, 2003)

Just to confirm something to settle it in my mind.......
I will still be able to access and watch recorded programs on my old Directivo DVR's without service wont I?
Both of them are quite full and I would hate to think I wont be able to get to watch what I have on them.
I always thought that once you have recorded something you just have to hook up the receiver and treat it like a DVD/Video player, I hope that I am right.....


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

Yes, you can watch any existing recordings without service and without a satellite connection. Press the DirecTV (TiVo) button to skip the "Searching for satellite" message.


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## llurgy (Nov 5, 2003)

stevel said:


> Yes, you can watch any existing recordings without service and without a satellite connection. Press the DirecTV (TiVo) button to skip the "Searching for satellite" message.


Thanks for the reassurance and the tip.
I would have been waiting through all the searching for satellite if you hadnt have said anything.

Install's been pushed back to Thursday as the technician doesnt have everything he needs to do the upgrade. This doesnt surprise me as I only phoned DirecTV on late Friday afternoon to set it up. Still disappointing though, especially as the TV has been brought out into the middle of the room to provide access for the set-up. Now we have to move it all back again and then bring it all out again.


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## HiDefGator (Oct 12, 2004)

stevel said:


> Yes, you can watch any existing recordings without service and without a satellite connection. Press the DirecTV (TiVo) button to skip the "Searching for satellite" message.


doesn't it keep popping up every few minutes? making it really really annoying to try to watch existing recordings.


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

It gives up after a while, I think. Or pull the access card - it will complain about that for a while and then stop.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

If I remember correctly, and it's been a few years since my last DirecTivo was alive, is you want to make sure you pull the satellite cable input *before* you call in to cancel it. Reason is that if you don't the de-authorization of the access card will get to it and it may cause it to be not much more then a brick. So just unhook the coax inputs before calling just to be safe.


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## fasTLane (Nov 25, 2005)

Wait untill 2010 to maybe get an HD DirecTiVo


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## fredk (Oct 20, 2008)

So, the installers come today for my HD upgrade. They tell me there is a big tree in the way and HD will not work. What a bummer! He pulled out a meter to check angles or something and said I would need to cut about 10 feet off a tree in my yard for HD to work. My standard dish works fine, signal strength about 92 on both tuners, but he said something about HD needing to pick up five satellites. I really would hate to go with comcast, but may not have a choice.


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## llurgy (Nov 5, 2003)

fredk said:


> So, the installers come today for my HD upgrade. They tell me there is a big tree in the way and HD will not work. What a bummer! He pulled out a meter to check angles or something and said I would need to cut about 10 feet off a tree in my yard for HD to work. My standard dish works fine, signal strength about 92 on both tuners, but he said something about HD needing to pick up five satellites. I really would hate to go with comcast, but may not have a choice.


Oh, not nice!!!

I do hope I don't have that problem on Thursday when they come to do mine. I only have a choice of DirecTV or Dish, no cable and if DirecTV can't get a good signal then odds on neither will Dish


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## fredk (Oct 20, 2008)

The installers were telling me I was the fourth person of the day that could not get done because of trees. They said one guy just bought three new LCD HD TV's in anticipation of the install, and he was pissed.

I called Directv to make sure they knew what happened, they are sending a new installer on thursday as a second opinion. It did sort of seem like these guys today didn't feel like working, but there is a huge tree in my yard that I often worried about as it continues to grow taller.

I also questioned them to see if they could mount it on pole to get a bettter angle of the tree, but for some reason they said they could not do that.


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

I have heard stories from quite a few people whom installers told them there was a tree blocking the satellites and, on further inspection, this was not the case. Get the second opinion. I also suggest you pick up a compass, a protractor and a paper towel tube and do some sighting of your own. One thing to keep in mind is that the dish is actually "looking" some 20 degrees higher in the sky than it seems, due to the offset of the LNBs.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

fredk said:


> , but he said something about HD needing to pick up five satellites. I really would hate to go with comcast, but may not have a choice.


They are incorrect. They are probably looking at installing the Slimeline 5 which indeed looks at 5 sats (99/101/103/110/119) and that does need a pretty big clear window to get a signal thru.

Instead they could install you with the Slimline 3 which only sees 99/101/103 which is the "core" were all the HD is and most of the programming. The only thing on 110 and 119 are international stations and SD locals. Now if your SD locals come off 119 that could be why they want to do the SL5 dish, but see if they will just do the SL3 (it doesn't need much more clear sky then your old dish) if they can't find a location to put up the SL5. By the way, can you put it on a pole in your backyard or something? Doesn't have to go on your roof and in fact I feel it's one of the worse places to put a dish anyway since it will be hard to get at to do a minor adjustment or scrape snow off, etc.


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## cdma (Nov 16, 2001)

Yes I bought a New TV and yes I am still using the 2 old DVR's with hack software and MRV. However the picture looks like crap on the TV. So first tried an up converter. No Dice. Still looks crappy. So now do I take the chance of divorce because the wife LOVES MRV or do I just continue to deal with the crappy picture. I guess it is all about what is important to you. NFL in HD or the wife?

ALso has anyone figured out, if you can put an external drive on an HD DVR can you share that drive between two boxes with a usb HUB


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## bigpuma (Aug 12, 2003)

cdma said:


> Yes I bought a New TV and yes I am still using the 2 old DVR's with hack software and MRV. However the picture looks like crap on the TV. So first tried an up converter. No Dice. Still looks crappy. So now do I take the chance of divorce because the wife LOVES MRV or do I just continue to deal with the crappy picture. I guess it is all about what is important to you. NFL in HD or the wife?
> 
> ALso has anyone figured out, if you can put an external drive on an HD DVR can you share that drive between two boxes with a usb HUB


The HR2x series will soon be capable of MRV, but only between each other. As for the usb idea the HR2x series uses eSata not USB.


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## fredk (Oct 20, 2008)

shibby191 said:


> They are incorrect. They are probably looking at installing the Slimeline 5 which indeed looks at 5 sats (99/101/103/110/119) and that does need a pretty big clear window to get a signal thru.
> 
> Instead they could install you with the Slimline 3 which only sees 99/101/103 which is the "core" were all the HD is and most of the programming. The only thing on 110 and 119 are international stations and SD locals. Now if your SD locals come off 119 that could be why they want to do the SL5 dish, but see if they will just do the SL3 (it doesn't need much more clear sky then your old dish) if they can't find a location to put up the SL5. By the way, can you put it on a pole in your backyard or something? Doesn't have to go on your roof and in fact I feel it's one of the worse places to put a dish anyway since it will be hard to get at to do a minor adjustment or scrape snow off, etc.


Thanks for that info. It really seemed like these guys didn't feel like working. They didn't even get on the roof with their little meter, they just added 10 feet or so while checking from the ground. And they said the tree is about 10 feet too big, which seems like a lame guess and only 10 feet would seem small enough to overcome somehow.

Also, he said my current signal strength of 92 was too low, and with HD it would be even less. He said you need at least a signal of 95+ for HD to work properly. Not sure I believe that either.

I can't really put it on a pole in the yard, I live in a wooded area and anything other than on the roof would be worst. Can it be put on a pole on the roof?

I'll let you all know what happens when the new installers come tomorrow, hopefully these guys will find a way to make it work.


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## cdma (Nov 16, 2001)

bigpuma said:


> The HR2x series will soon be capable of MRV, but only between each other. As for the usb idea the HR2x series uses eSata not USB.


Well with my luck I will go out and upgrade and the Tivo version will come out and it will be on another platform and my TIVO lifetime subscription will end up useless with the Directv DVR software. Oh well.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

cdma said:


> Yes I bought a New TV and yes I am still using the 2 old DVR's with hack software and MRV. However the picture looks like crap on the TV. So first tried an up converter. No Dice. Still looks crappy. So now do I take the chance of divorce because the wife LOVES MRV or do I just continue to deal with the crappy picture. I guess it is all about what is important to you. NFL in HD or the wife?
> 
> ALso has anyone figured out, if you can put an external drive on an HD DVR can you share that drive between two boxes with a usb HUB


MRV is in testing right now and has been for months. If you get in on the Cutting Edge (CE) downloads detailed at DBSTalk then you'll have MRV right away.

You can use an external eSata drive (no USB) but it's tied to the DVR it's on and can't be shared. You could of course use it on another DVR once it's formatted.


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## fredk (Oct 20, 2008)

Second opinion installer came today, but for some reason it was the same installer that came the first time. Directv is retarded. Not sure why they would send the same people. So today the installers said the same thing, tree in the way. Oh well, good bye directv, it's been nice knowing you. And hopefully you didn't lose thousands of dollars of my money because you have lame installers.


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## HiDefGator (Oct 12, 2004)

have you considered a chainsaw?


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## fredk (Oct 20, 2008)

Yes.

I just went out there with a protractor and compass. Not even getting on the roof but standing along side the house on a retaining wall, I measured about 30 degrees to the top of that tree from where the dish would be. Installer said he needed 35 degrees +/- 10. I'm not sure how anyone would have enough clearance if 25 degrees is the minimum height needed.

I'm tempted to call DTV back and just have them install it anyway, I really think it will work. But if not, I'm sure I could take down those top limbs.


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## HiDefGator (Oct 12, 2004)

I suspect part of the problem is that they won't get paid if they can't get it to work. So they include a huge margin of error into the decision to start the work or not.


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

You could go the private install route. Won't be free but you'll get a much better install and someone that actually cares about getting you installed if you contact a local company and pay for them to install you. Might even get DirecTV to give you some credits toward the install.


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## fredk (Oct 20, 2008)

I called DTV again, told them the 2nd opinion installer was the same as the first, and they were pretty surprised. They are sending a new installer (hopefully) for another 2nd opinion.

Those little meters the installers have, does that pick up the satellite signal? I would think they would have a little device that simply picks up the signal and determines the strength. If it's just a fancy compass and protractor, that would seem to leave a lot of error in sighting.

Sorry for the threadjack.


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

The installers do have a device that reads the satellite, but it requires being connected to a dish. I've never seen one that was standalone.


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## kaszeta (Jun 11, 2004)

HiDefGator said:


> have you considered a chainsaw?


This is what I had to do to get decent 99 signals in the summer. Big maple tree. Heated my house for about 5 weeks on that wood.


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## samo (Oct 7, 1999)

stevel said:


> The installers do have a device that reads the satellite, but it requires being connected to a dish. I've never seen one that was standalone.


You got that right. Not only that, there are cheaper devices that just beep and more expensive ones that that have a meter. First guy who came in to install my antenna spent 4 hours and could not get a signal. The next guy had a fancy meter and was able to get me perfect alignment in 15 minutes. It is a luck of the draw who you get on your install.


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## llurgy (Nov 5, 2003)

We got our new Dish installed yesterday.
They wouldnt put it on the existing wooden pole as they said there was too much shift in it.
They dug a hole a few feet away from it and planted a steel pole 3 foot in and maounted the dish on that. It looks really wierd because it only stands about four foot from the ground, the other was 6 or 7 foot high. We have the 3 slimline.
Picture is good.....Ahhhh.....HD Goodness


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