# Spinning Blue Circle after 20.4.6



## iconoclast (Oct 27, 2014)

Since the update, several times, I had spinning blue circle for <1 minute. When I selected a show in My Shows - took long time (½-1 min) b4 it appeared & I could select play.

Previously the delay happened when making a change or setting up a new SP. Havent set up any 1P since the update so dont know if I will get the spinning circle delays for that. 

If this keeps up, I may have to restart/reset/clear program info & clear To Do list. 
Ive done it a couple times b4 when had Spinning Blue Circle.

I thought 20.4.6 was supposed to solve the Spinning Blue Circle problem!

I think it is a disservice to customers that TiVo software requires communicating (hence the delays) with the server in order to do basic DVR functions such as play or change recording options. I know TiVo wants to track everything we do, every button press, for marketing purposes but, they should be able to do this w/o interfering with smooth operation & currently the TiVo software cannot.


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## bornleader (Jan 4, 2015)

The reason I left Comcast's DVR Service (finally) was they had an internal system outage and I could not watch content on my X1 box. I called them and asked if I disconnected the X1 box from the system could I watch content that I had already recorded and was stored locally - Comcast said no - the DVR had to be connected to be used in any way. I immediately purchased a Roamio and mini with lifetime.

Now I see that Tivo is going the way of Comcast. The immediate connection to Tivo's servers is causing local problems. If the guide is loaded recently setting up recording should be a local issue, not a Tivo server issue.

Dave



iconoclast said:


> Since the update, several times, I had spinning blue circle for <1 minute. When I selected a show in My Shows - took long time (½-1 min) b4 it appeared & I could select play.
> 
> Previously the delay happened when making a change or setting up a new SP. Havent set up any 1P since the update so dont know if I will get the spinning circle delays for that.
> 
> ...


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

iconoclast said:


> I think it is a disservice to customers that TiVo software requires communicating (hence the delays) with the server in order to do basic DVR functions such as play or change recording options. I know TiVo wants to track everything we do, every button press, for marketing purposes but, they should be able to do this w/o interfering with smooth operation & currently the TiVo software cannot.


I'm pretty sure that I saw a post where someone disconnected their Internet service and had no issues using their Roamio for functions that didn't require Internet access.

Scott


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## MScottC (Sep 11, 2004)

You can also hit PLAY directly from the MY SHOWS list, and they will play immediately.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

HerronScott said:


> I'm pretty sure that I saw a post where someone disconnected their Internet service and had no issues using their Roamio for functions that didn't require Internet access.
> 
> Scott


I have tested that and you do not need the internet for any function (that does not need immediate internet connection like YouTube) including setting 1P (if the guide data is already on your TiVo) or watching stuff already recorded, IMHO when the TiVo is connected to the internet your TiVo is sending out information on what your doing, as in what 1P are you setting, what your are watching, It would interesting to know if somebody has OPT-OUT from TiVo data collection would ever get the Blue Circles ?


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## joewom (Dec 10, 2013)

You know the DVR does do things other then recordings right. It might be downloading, or something else. Like organizing things. Its like a computer something for no reason it just takes a little while longer to do something. And your phone. Sometimes its instant sometimes not. How is this a complaint and issue?


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## L David Matheny (Jan 29, 2011)

HerronScott said:


> I'm pretty sure that I saw a post where someone disconnected their Internet service and had no issues using their Roamio for functions that didn't require Internet access.
> 
> Scott


I recently reported something like that, but I'm still on 20.4.5c, which I guess I should have mentioned.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

> If this keeps up, I may have to restart/reset/clear program info & clear To Do list.
> I've done it a couple times b4 when had Spinning Blue Circle.


I tried that and it still didnt fix it.



> I thought 20.4.6 was supposed to solve the Spinning Blue Circle problem!


same here. Seems to have gotten worse. If there is more than one program in the folder I get the BSC when selecting the folder.


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## joewom (Dec 10, 2013)

unclehonkey said:


> I tried that and it still didnt fix it.
> 
> same here. Seems to have gotten worse. If there is more than one program in the folder I get the BSC when selecting the folder.


I am not seeing that at all. Very have I gotten the blue spin since I updated almost two weeks ago. And when I did it was for a few secs.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

I get it constantly on my OTA...and its connected via ethernet


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## joewom (Dec 10, 2013)

unclehonkey said:


> I get it constantly on my OTA...and its connected via ethernet


When do you get it mostly? What are you doing when you get it?


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

when the BSC pops up
-trying to set up a season pass....err one pass 
-opening a folder of programs. sometimes it doesnt do it but the more programs in the folder the odds of BSC showing up is good
-editing time on a one time timer (adding time)

those 3 for sure. It doesnt do it setting up a one off timer with no changes. 

But it has gotten to the point I need to change my "end time" in the record defaults for some weekend programming. Justice Network seems to run about 30 seconds over the top/bottom of the hour. Since they rerun shows every 6 hours and some have no guide info a one pass does no good (I dont need 4 episodes of the same thing). So I change the defaults to "1 min later", set up my 4 or 5 programs to record (2 shows each), then set the defaults back to on time.

I've done the "clear thumbs" and "clear to do list"...did it last week and still have issues.

got the new priority update Tuesday IIRC


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## joewom (Dec 10, 2013)

unclehonkey said:


> when the BSC pops up
> -trying to set up a season pass....err one pass
> -opening a folder of programs. sometimes it doesnt do it but the more programs in the folder the odds of BSC showing up is good
> -editing time on a one time timer (adding time)
> ...


Wow might want to call them. That is not normal if its happening that much. like I said mine hasnt done it at all. Since I upgraded my HDD this morning I lost my suggestion on the top of tivo central. Can't figure that out. But no blue spin for me 99% of the time.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

I'm going to try unhooking it from the internet to see what happens

I do have a unique setup as my Roamio is hooked via ethernet....but its hooked to a wifi extender. I use the internet from the community room in the apartment complex which is 2 floors down. When I use to have it via wifi I had enough signal to download the update but the internet would drop more often than not. The extender is more for my roku and my desktop but I noticed youtube streamed faster when hooked to ethernet via wireless. I dont subscribe to any streaming services


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## joewom (Dec 10, 2013)

unclehonkey said:


> I'm going to try unhooking it from the internet to see what happens
> 
> I do have a unique setup as my Roamio is hooked via ethernet....but its hooked to a wifi extender. I use the internet from the community room in the apartment complex which is 2 floors down. When I use to have it via wifi I had enough signal to download the update but the internet would drop more often than not. The extender is more for my roku and my desktop but I noticed youtube streamed faster when hooked to ethernet via wireless. I dont subscribe to any streaming services


That could be the issue. Wifi is not consistent at all. Why I moved all tivos and even have two 4 port moca switches for my kids internet for TIVO and gaming hardware. The bridge is better if it receives both channels as if you are connected to it by Ethernet you will get better speeds however it is still wireless.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

OK I think I narrowed it down to 2 things
-the ethernet cable itself
-the ethernet port on the Roamio

but what is weird is Youtube plays fine. Here is how I figured it out

-unhooked ethernet and set it up for the community room wifi.. looked through the one passes I had set already and very snappy. no BSC. Went to see "upcoming" and it showed right away the new episodes. Set up a couple one passes (just to test) and very snappy. Lost connection once and that is due to again being 2 floors up. Signal around 45-47%

-redid wireless to my wifi extender...again looked through existing one passes and response time was very snappy. set up a couple "one passes" for some shows and again very snappy. No issues. Set up a legit one pass (nascar) and set the options for 30 min late. Again no issues

-hooked up ethernet (which is attached to the wifi extender) and as soon as I went to set up a one pass and hit "options"...BOOM...BSC for 7 seconds. Got BSC when I hit OK Use these changes....Got BSC when it said "recording is set" and I hit "OK". Actually the 1st One Pass timed out so I had to try and reset it

But again Youtube plays perfectly fine on it through ethernet as does the Live365 radio app. I'm going to try another cable later.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

I did do a reboot of the Roamio before I started this whole ordeal to see if maybe that would fix it. Obviously it didnt as the ethernet option was last


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

unclehonkey said:


> -hooked up ethernet (which is attached to the wifi extender) and as soon as I went to set up a one pass and hit "options"...BOOM...BSC for 7 seconds. Got BSC when I hit OK Use these changes....Got BSC when it said "recording is set" and I hit "OK". Actually the 1st One Pass timed out so I had to try and reset it


You don't have wireless and wired connected at the same time in the scenario above do you (if that's possible with a Roamio)?

Scott


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## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

iconoclast said:


> I think it is a disservice to customers that TiVo software requires communicating (hence the delays) with the server in order to do basic DVR functions such as play<snip>


You can play any time. Including any and all trick plays (FF, Rew, etc). Connected or not. No delays. I have binge-recorded shows, unhooked the TiVo and physically taken it to another site w/o Internet or any type of connection, and binge-watched.

The disservice is creating a post with wrong information, and not going back and correcting it.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

astrohip said:


> You can play any time. Including any and all trick plays (FF, Rew, etc). Connected or not. No delays. I have binge-recorded shows, unhooked the TiVo and physically taken it to another site w/o Internet or any type of connection, and binge-watched.
> 
> The disservice is creating a post with wrong information, and not going back and correcting it.


What we (or at least I) don't know is if the Roamio does see a internet connection does it try to send out over the internet what your doing, like trying to play a recording, if there is no internet connection all works as you said above.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

HerronScott said:


> You don't have wireless and wired connected at the same time in the scenario above do you (if that's possible with a Roamio)?
> 
> Scott


no. When you are connected wired and say try to change the settings to wireless it says "you must disconnect the ethernet cable first"


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## joewom (Dec 10, 2013)

unclehonkey said:


> no. When you are connected wired and say try to change the settings to wireless it says "you must disconnect the ethernet cable first"


can you use MOCA? Instead of a wireless bridge?


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

joewom said:


> can you use MOCA? Instead of a wireless bridge?


I don't understand what you are asking. I have just a Roamio OTA. No minis and no other units

My wireless connection point is 2 floors down in the apartment complex community room. I can connect to that but the connection drops due to the spot the Tivo is located.
I have a wifi extender that sits in the corner of my apartment and gets great signal. I run my desktop, roku and Tivo off of it.

If I connect to the community room wifi it works fine...no BSC (or rarely)
If I connect to the wifi extender (which has a different wifi name)...works fine. No BSC
If I connect to the wifi extender via ethernet then the problems start

The reason I plugged in the ethernet is I figured "why have it jump twice to the Tivo? From wifi to extender to Tivo...get rid of the 2nd jump". Well I guess I was wrong. I have been doing this for over a year now. When I had my Series 3 I could move the wireless adapter around for the best signal. The Roamio I would have to move the whole unit for optimum signal if I tapped into the community room wifi name. My post on that after I got the Roamio
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10244207#post10244207


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## joewom (Dec 10, 2013)

unclehonkey said:


> I don't understand what you are asking. I have just a Roamio OTA. No minis and no other units
> 
> My wireless connection point is 2 floors down in the apartment complex community room. I can connect to that but the connection drops due to the spot the Tivo is located.
> I have a wifi extender that sits in the corner of my apartment and gets great signal. I run my desktop, roku and Tivo off of it.
> ...


Oh I might not have read the posts right. You are using a connection that is not solely yours? If that right your using public wifi?


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

joewom said:


> Oh I might not have read the posts right. You are using a connection that is not solely yours? If that right your using public wifi?


yes
in our apartment complex community room there is wifi (with password.....the manager gives it to you). My Tivo can connect to it but at marginal signal
I have a wifi extender in my apartment that extends that (has a different wifi name). My Tivo is connected to that right now
When I was connected to the extender via ethernet is when I constantly got the BSC. Didnt matter when I would use it. At 9AM, noon, 7PM or 3AM. As soon as I unhooked the ethernet it worked fine

(Even if someone was in there the max I have seen is 3 people using it. Most of the time its nobody)
Like I say I have been doing this for over a year with no issues until recently with the BSC.


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## joewom (Dec 10, 2013)

unclehonkey said:


> yes
> in our apartment complex community room there is wifi (with password.....the manager gives it to you). My Tivo can connect to it but at marginal signal
> I have a wifi extender in my apartment that extends that (has a different wifi name). My Tivo is connected to that right now
> When I was connected to the extender via ethernet is when I constantly got the BSC. Didnt matter when I would use it. At 9AM, noon, 7PM or 3AM. As soon as I unhooked the ethernet it worked fine
> ...


Well that's interesting. All the things I can think of like max users and all wouldn't be it then unless more are using it. And or there is something wrong with the ISP. If you are using it just for internet why not just use wireless then and not the bridge. Speed is not going to be that much different.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

joewom said:


> And or there is something wrong with the ISP.


Comcast Business. The apt office has it too



> If you are using it just for internet why not just use wireless then and not the bridge. Speed is not going to be that much different.


Let me preface this by I am not computer savvy. So I'm not 100% sure what you mean by "the bridge" (the wifi extender)??

2 issues as to why I use the extender
-my desktop. Use to have a wifi adapter and a month or so ago it froze up and needed a master reset. Ever since then the adapter would see the wifi but never would connect. So its hard wired
-Using the wifi extender makes it so I can connect easily without any drops (unless the modem downstairs reboots)

I was using the ethernet to the Tivo again because I figured to "get rid of that extra wireless hop"

I'm going to try a different cable and/or a different port on the extender and see what happens


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## joewom (Dec 10, 2013)

unclehonkey said:


> Comcast Business. The apt office has it too
> 
> Let me preface this by I am not computer savvy. So I'm not 100% sure what you mean by "the bridge" (the wifi extender)??
> 
> ...


But you said it worked fine without the bridge so connect direct to the wireless. Unless they have two of A, B, N, or AC the bridge will offer no speed increase. Most public wifi has one band.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

Figured it out. It has something to do with the "handshake" between the extender and the Tivo when using ethernet

Tried 2 different cables on 2 different ports of the extender and same thing. BSC shows up. May be brief but it shows up
Using the wifi connection works fine. No BSC

so I'm just going to use the wireless on the Tivo


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## iconoclast (Oct 27, 2014)

MScottC said:


> You can also hit PLAY directly from the MY SHOWS list, and they will play immediately.


Thanks! Ive been using your suggestion & hitting PLAY directly from the MY SHOWS list, and yes, show plays immediately. Ive experimented with my previous method (Which I think is the intended TiVo method, since it provides more information on the show you are about to play) Maybe ½ the time I get SBC when select show & then hit enter b4 selecting play. I dont recall this happening b4 the 20.4.6 update. Whenever I got the SBC in the past, I had been adding or modifying a SP.

So, for now, unless a folder of multiple shows, I will use "direct Play" method to avoid the SBC. This is NOT a solution, it is a work-a-round of a TiVo problem that still requires a fix by TiVo.


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## gespears (Aug 10, 2007)

Sorry to hijack, but it looks like a good point to do so. I transferred about 250 season passes from my Premiers to my Roamio. I get the SBC when I add a season pass for about 1 minute. Is that normal? I remember that adding them on my old HD was slow but didn't expect to see that on the Roamio.

To make it worse, tonight I tried to add 3 season passes and only one was successful. On the two that didn't work, I got the spinning circle for about 45 for 60 seconds then back to the page but not season pass. It's like nothing happened.


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## NorthAlabama (Apr 19, 2012)

gespears said:


> ...tonight I tried to add 3 season passes and only one was successful. On the two that didn't work, I got the spinning circle for about 45 for 60 seconds then back to the page but not season pass. It's like nothing happened.


there's another thread for bsc and sp failure:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=522798​


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## gespears (Aug 10, 2007)

NorthAlabama said:


> there's another thread for bsc and sp failure:
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=522798​


Thank you very much.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

unclehonkey said:


> Figured it out. It has something to do with the "handshake" between the extender and the Tivo when using ethernet
> 
> Tried 2 different cables on 2 different ports of the extender and same thing. BSC shows up. May be brief but it shows up
> Using the wifi connection works fine. No BSC
> ...


since I have gone wireless I havent seen the BSC when doing the items I previously had issues with


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## gespears (Aug 10, 2007)

unclehonkey said:


> since I have gone wireless I havent seen the BSC when doing the items I previously had issues with


Did you have issues with season passes? Adding them or changing them?


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## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

iconoclast said:


> Thanks! Ive been using your suggestion & hitting PLAY directly from the MY SHOWS list, and yes, show plays immediately. Ive experimented with my previous method *(Which I think is the intended TiVo method, since it provides more information on the show you are about to play)* Maybe ½ the time I get SBC when select show & then hit enter b4 selecting play. I dont recall this happening b4 the 20.4.6 update. Whenever I got the SBC in the past, I had been adding or modifying a SP.
> 
> So, for now, unless a folder of multiple shows, I will use "direct Play" method to avoid the SBC. This is NOT a solution, it is a work-a-round of a TiVo problem that still requires a fix by TiVo.


First, it is a solution. It is an accepted method of playing, not a work-around.

Second, I would bet money most people hit play directly, as versus playing from the info screen. It would be an interesting poll either way.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

I


astrohip said:


> First, it is a solution. It is an accepted method of playing, not a work-around.
> 
> Second, I would bet money most people hit play directly, as versus playing from the info screen. It would be an interesting poll either way.


That would be interesting . II'd bet not since the select button is right there under your thumb when you navigate to your selection.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

In 15 years of TiVo, it never would have occurred to me to play a show by pressing Select twice instead of Play once until somebody here insisted that was the only sane way to do it a few weeks ago...

Just one data point.


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## Mr Tony (Dec 20, 2012)

gespears said:


> Did you have issues with season passes? Adding them or changing them?


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=10400308#post10400308

when the BSC pops up
-trying to set up a season pass....err one pass
-opening a folder of programs. sometimes it doesnt do it but the more programs in the folder the odds of BSC showing up is good
-editing time on a one time timer (adding time)

again this has been fixed by getting rid of my ethernet connection


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

I had a blue Spinning circle last night. I had seen it before but never like this. I was watching the show Stalker, on my Roamio Pro and then wanted to record the local news that had already started 15 minutes earlier. So I went into the guide while the show was still playing in the window. I Selected the news programs and hit record. Then the spinning circle started. 

The show continued to play in the corner. After waiting for a minute I tried hitting some buttons. Nothing. So then I changed the input to my Roamio BAsic. I was still able to access my the Roamio Pro My shows List. And I could see that it was recording that news program. So I continued watching Stalker on my Roamio Basic, streaming it from my Roamio Pro. I finished watching the show in around 25 minutes. 

I then went back to the Roamio Pro, and it still had a blue spinning circle. The guide was still up and Stalker was still playing in window. So I pulled the plug and restarted the Roamio Pro. I don't recall seeing anything like this before.


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## iconoclast (Oct 27, 2014)

Im sure the software engineers @ TiVo did not plan on suddenly having BSC when we do X, Y or Z. Or having BSC while setting or modifying 1P (or SP). In fact, the latest update specifically mentioned fixing the BSC issue!

"Fixed an issue where some customers would see a blue spinning circle when trying to create or update a Season Pass (now OnePass)"
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=525170

Some people DO have issues with BSC & lets hope TiVo fixes it.


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## zaphodbeeblebrox (Feb 14, 2015)

lessd said:


> It would interesting to know if somebody has OPT-OUT from TiVo data collection would ever get the Blue Circles ?


+1


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## zaphodbeeblebrox (Feb 14, 2015)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> In 15 years of TiVo, it never would have occurred to me to play a show by pressing Select twice instead of Play once until somebody here insisted that was the only sane way to do it a few weeks ago...
> 
> Just one data point.


+1


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## zaphodbeeblebrox (Feb 14, 2015)

aaronwt said:


> I had a blue Spinning circle last night. I had seen it before but never like this. I was watching the show Stalker, on my Roamio Pro and then wanted to record the local news that had already started 15 minutes earlier. So I went into the guide while the show was still playing in the window. I Selected the news programs and hit record. Then the spinning circle started.
> 
> The show continued to play in the corner. After waiting for a minute I tried hitting some buttons. Nothing. So then I changed the input to my Roamio BAsic. I was still able to access my the Roamio Pro My shows List. And I could see that it was recording that news program. So I continued watching Stalker on my Roamio Basic, streaming it from my Roamio Pro. I finished watching the show in around 25 minutes.
> 
> I then went back to the Roamio Pro, and it still had a blue spinning circle. The guide was still up and Stalker was still playing in window. So I pulled the plug and restarted the Roamio Pro. I don't recall seeing anything like this before.


I read that it is possible to "un-freeze" by using KMTTG to launch Netflix on the unresponsive TiVo. I tried it, and it worked for me. It's far less disruptive, caused no loss of buffers, and didn't split recordings in progress into two parts, with a gap where the TiVo had to boot before resuming.

Might not work in all cases, but helped me out.


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## iconoclast (Oct 27, 2014)

lessd said:


> ...It would interesting to know if somebody has OPT-OUT from TiVo data collection would ever get the Blue Circles ?


From TiVo Privacy Policy:
"If you have a TiVo Series 4 or newer TiVo product (such as a TiVo Mini or a TiVo Roamio or Premiere series DVR) and opt out, we will still collect your viewing logs, but will use them only to provide you with features of the TiVo service as described in this policy (for example, to suggest a particular TV show that you may enjoy)."
http://www.tivo.com/legal/privacy

So, I doubt it would help at all since the issue may be TiVo communicating with the home server during basic DVR functions when we users do not want it to do so.

Good thought though.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

zaphodbeeblebrox said:


> I read that it is possible to "un-freeze" by using KMTTG to launch Netflix on the unresponsive TiVo. I tried it, and it worked for me. It's far less disruptive, caused no loss of buffers, and didn't split recordings in progress into two parts, with a gap where the TiVo had to boot before resuming.
> 
> Might not work in all cases, but helped me out.


Thanks. If it happens again I'll need to remember that. When it did happen I only had some news shows recording so it wasn't a big deal rebooting.


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