# Cable company went all digital now no guide?



## kelleyseiler (Apr 27, 2009)

I have a series 4 Tivo and last week my local cable company (Antietam Cable) went all digital, since then almost all of my season passes no longer work because the channels they recorded from are no longer there. ie. channel 65 Bravo is now 65-1 and there is no guide for that channel. I am lost! Will I have to get a M-card from my cable office (and pay an additional $4.00 a month) to use my Tivo?


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## kwajr (Dec 31, 2010)

kelleyseiler said:


> I have a series 4 Tivo and last week my local cable company (Antietam Cable) went all digital, since then almost all of my season passes no longer work because the channels they recorded from are no longer there. ie. channel 65 Bravo is now 65-1 and there is no guide for that channel. I am lost! Will I have to get a M-card from my cable office (and pay an additional $4.00 a month) to use my Tivo?


yes but first card should be free


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## aadam101 (Jul 15, 2002)

kelleyseiler said:


> I have a series 4 Tivo and last week my local cable company (Antietam Cable) went all digital, since then almost all of my season passes no longer work because the channels they recorded from are no longer there. ie. channel 65 Bravo is now 65-1 and there is no guide for that channel. I am lost! Will I have to get a M-card from my cable office (and pay an additional $4.00 a month) to use my Tivo?


Did you rerun guided setup? If you didn't have 65-1 before, Tivo probably doesn't know the channel exists.


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## sethw (Dec 27, 2008)

kelleyseiler said:


> I have a series 4 Tivo and last week my local cable company (Antietam Cable) went all digital, since then almost all of my season passes no longer work because the channels they recorded from are no longer there. ie. channel 65 Bravo is now 65-1 and there is no guide for that channel. I am lost! Will I have to get a M-card from my cable office (and pay an additional $4.00 a month) to use my Tivo?


I am also experiencing this frustration, Kelley. I tried to explain this situation to the Tivo "lineup team," but apparently they fail to comprehend the difference between ATSC and NTSC. The only reason we should need a cable card is if we want to receive pay-per-view or scrambled premium channels. I even sent them the link to Antietam Cable's web site where they showed the Discovery Channel as 45.0.

Tivo responded to my explanation by sending me a canned response that said they verified the lineup and told me to contact my cable provider. So I am supposed to contact Antietam Cable about my problem with Tivo's equipment?


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

TiVo's inability to map QAM channels, clear or encrypted, without a CableCARD is an ancient issue. Search this and the S3 forum for thread titles with "QAM" in them.

The earliest thread about this issue that I can find is from September 2006. TiVo has not come up with a way to provide guide data for digital systems without a CableCARD in all of that time--I doubt that it's going to happen.


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## WVZR1 (Jul 31, 2008)

They seem "prepared" and the checks required by you are pretty straight forward as to what is required on you're end of the "conversion"!!

http://www.antietamcable.com/support/digital_conversion.html

A "cable/card" when available using digital-cable is certainly the preferred! A simple "walk-in" to local office or phone call should get you all of the help you need.


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## compnurd (Oct 6, 2011)

This is nothing new.... you need a cable card


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## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

sethw said:


> ...
> Tivo responded to my explanation by sending me a canned response that said they verified the lineup and told me to contact my cable provider. So I am supposed to contact Antietam Cable about my problem with Tivo's equipment?


Nothing wrong with your TiVo, it requires a cable card to work with digital cable. You and others may not like it but that is the way it has been since the first Series 3 TiVo was released. So the instructions to contact your cable provider are correct.


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## ajwees41 (May 7, 2006)

kwajr said:


> yes but first card should be free


don't always assume not all cable providers offer first one free.


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## lujan (May 24, 2010)

ajwees41 said:


> don't always assume not all cable providers offer first one free.


That's true. My cable company is Comcast and they charge for the first one. I sent them back the cable card and the digital boxes and now just have the outdoor antenna attached to the TiVo. Works just fine.


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## ajwees41 (May 7, 2006)

lujan said:


> That's true. My cable company is Comcast and they charge for the first one. I sent them back the cable card and the digital boxes and now just have the outdoor antenna attached to the TiVo. Works just fine.


Cox also charges for the 1st one.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

They charge for the first one EVEN IF YOU HAVE NO CABLE BOXES?

The "first one free" is really instead of the cable box that would be with the digital subscription...


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

mattack said:


> They charge for the first one EVEN IF YOU HAVE NO CABLE BOXES?
> 
> The "first one free" is really instead of the cable box that would be with the digital subscription...


I do not now nor have I ever had cable service where each and every leased STB was not a separate line item with yet another item for service on that STB (not a lot--Cox "Advanced TV" is $4 per).


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## ajwees41 (May 7, 2006)

mattack said:


> They charge for the first one EVEN IF YOU HAVE NO CABLE BOXES?
> 
> The "first one free" is really instead of the cable box that would be with the digital subscription...


yes Cox does they do not offer the the first piece of equipment free like other companies do.


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## sharkster (Jul 3, 2004)

With Charter (here anyway) the 'first one is free' has a caveat that you have MORE than one. 

If I only have one cable box I am charged $5. If I have two cable boxes I am only charged $5.

The same applies to my CABLECards - If I only had one, I'd be charged $2. Since I have two I am charged only $2. 

I still have one cable box, so I'm charged $5 for that now, whereas when I had three cable boxes I was charged $10 ($5 for each of the two ADDITIONAL ones, beyond the first 'free' one).


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## sethw (Dec 27, 2008)

Attention everyone: this is not 2006. I was trying to use a Tivo Premiere. I tuned in channel 45.0 just fine on the Tivo. It even showed up as *DSC. To suggest that the Tivo device cannot map the channels is ridiculous. If it can map a channel to *DSC, it can map it to DSC. 

If Tivo even did nothing more than give their users the ability to manually map the channels as a last resort, I could have worked with that. Do you want to try to explain why they "can't" do that, too? 

There is a monthly charge for the cable card and I would have an inferior quality of service if I installed it. Pay more for less service? Does that really make sense to you all?


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Most cable companies are shifting toward encrypting all channels to prevent theft via clear QAM. (if you pay for internet only you can still access clear QAM channels) In fact a few of them are seeking waivers to allow encrypting of even the local channels so you wont be able to get anything without a box or CableCARD. 

It may be possible for TiVo to offer this feature, and may have even been beneficial 4 years ago, but as it is now it's probably not worth their time since the feature will soon be useless. (or close to it)

Dan


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

sethw said:


> Attention everyone: this is not 2006. I was trying to use a Tivo Premiere. I tuned in channel 45.0 just fine on the Tivo. It even showed up as *DSC. To suggest that the Tivo device cannot map the channels is ridiculous. If it can map a channel to *DSC, it can map it to DSC.


There is no way for the TiVo to know to which stream the channel should be mapped. This is inherent in the CableCard design and was the intent of separable security from the outset. Every receiver is intended to have a security device, and that device is the CableCard.



sethw said:


> If Tivo even did nothing more than give their users the ability to manually map the channels as a last resort, I could have worked with that. Do you want to try to explain why they "can't" do that, too?


It can most certainly be done, but it is a bad idea, like allowing certain people to cheat on their taxes. The whole idea of separable security, demanded by the FCC for the benefit of CATV subscribers (and hated by the CATV companies, BTW) was intended to be ubiquitous. The other option is no 3rd party devices like DVRs or DCR TVs, at all.



sethw said:


> There is a monthly charge for the cable card and I would have an inferior quality of service if I installed it.


Your service would in absolutely no way be inferior. Exactly what makes you think it would be inferior, and in what way? You may not be interested in the additional channels to which it would potentially allow you access, but that is certainly not inferior service.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

Dan203 said:


> It may be possible for TiVo to offer this feature


Sure. It's availabel on any modified TiVo, for that matter.



Dan203 said:


> and may have even been beneficial 4 years ago


It is only "beneficial" in the most short sighted and self-centered terms, with a few very narrow exceptions. It is certainly beneficial on any system that does not report their channel line-up to Tribune Media.



Dan203 said:


> but as it is now it's probably not worth their time since the feature will soon be useless. (or close to it)


It's not far from it right now, in the sense it is only of any use for anyone who does not have a CableCard. By the FCC's intent, that is essentially no one who has cable.


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## hasservision (Jul 16, 2007)

This just happened to me back on Sept. 12th. I live in an apartment building that offers what it called "free cable", although it's comcast without personally subscribing to comcast. So when I moved in 6 years ago I bought a Tivo and everything was just peachy.
Now that Comcast took away even the local SD channels, I decided to rescan, and found I was receiving the local OTA digital signals through the cable. Of course the channels say what they are but don't have any program info.

I know I either need to officially subscribe to comcast & get a cable card, or go OTA (which I have tried with a low power indoor antenna & I only receive 1 or 2 channels).
My question is... what would happen if I plug the "cable" cable into the OTA slot on the back of the tivo? Would the Tivo receive the required frequencies for the OTA, and give me the correct channel guide/info? Or would that hurt the Tivo?!?!


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

I tried that once, it didn't work. The OTA port is expecting ATSC the canle port is expecting QAM. They use similar frequencies, but are different modualtion technologies. 

Your only options are the two you layed out. 

Dan


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## hasservision (Jul 16, 2007)

Good to know Dan203. Thanks for the input.
Guess I could always invest in a better antenna, or build the DIY one I've seen online that's apparently pretty good. Only problem is I live in a place that's blocked by hills along the ocean, and the OTA tower is not in the line of sight from them. That, and I'm in an apartment building so I can't have an outdoor antenna. 
It's too bad there's no way to manually assign a channel profile/guide info to a specific channel in Tivo. That way I could just tell the Tivo what channel identity is of the signal it's receiving.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Is your apartment complex going to supply you with a box now that all the channels went digital? Or was this some sort of under the table type thing? If it was a legit agreement and they supply you with a box you might be able to trade that in with the cable company for a CableCARD instead.

Dan


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## xirian (Oct 10, 2008)

hasservision said:


> This just happened to me back on Sept. 12th. I live in an apartment building that offers what it called "free cable", although it's comcast without personally subscribing to comcast. So when I moved in 6 years ago I bought a Tivo and everything was just peachy.
> Now that Comcast took away even the local SD channels, I decided to rescan, and found I was receiving the local OTA digital signals through the cable. Of course the channels say what they are but don't have any program info.
> 
> I know I either need to officially subscribe to comcast & get a cable card, or go OTA (which I have tried with a low power indoor antenna & I only receive 1 or 2 channels).
> My question is... what would happen if I plug the "cable" cable into the OTA slot on the back of the tivo? Would the Tivo receive the required frequencies for the OTA, and give me the correct channel guide/info? Or would that hurt the Tivo?!?!


Are you renting from someone who has a spare unit in their house or an apartment complex? My sister had cable through her complex and wanted a dvr so she had a separate account in her name that only charged her for the dvr, she didn't need to pay for a full account.


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## hasservision (Jul 16, 2007)

I live in a multi-unit apartment complex. I know the Comcast guy is here a lot, so other renters apparently have their own personal accounts. I have cable because the apt manager told me I would receive basic cable in my unit even if I didn't subscribe. So it must be an under-the-table sort of deal, or perhaps the techs don't bother filtering each units cable? Don't really know...


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

I lived in one HOA housing complex where basic cable (Cox San Diego North) was included in the maintenance fees. When you're negotiating basic service for 50 homes you probably get a substantial discount. We added services on top of that and didn't get charged for the basic.


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## hasservision (Jul 16, 2007)

mikeyts said:


> I lived in one HOA housing complex where basic cable (Cox San Diego North) was included in the maintenance fees. When you're negotiating basic service for 50 homes you probably get a substantial discount. We added services on top of that and didn't get charged for the basic.


Interesting! I guess I should just call and ask Comcast... although I thoroughly detest them.


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## philw1776 (Jan 19, 2002)

hasservision said:


> Interesting! I guess I should just call and ask Comcast... although I thoroughly detest them.


Tried that. Comcast on Cape Cod will not allow me to add anything to my condo Basic cable since I have a HDTV. They don't want my money. I have a home in FL with Brighthouse with HOA Basic. Brighthouse is very happy to take my $ for additional services. Comcast is pathetic.


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## hasservision (Jul 16, 2007)

philw1776 said:


> Tried that. Comcast on Cape Cod will not allow me to add anything to my condo Basic cable since I have a HDTV. They don't want my money. I have a home in FL with Brighthouse with HOA Basic. Brighthouse is very happy to take my $ for additional services. Comcast is pathetic.


Yeah, they are... I really hate dealing with them. Maybe I'll just get Hulu Plus.
But I know there has to be a programmer out there who could a program or addition to Tivo that would allow you to assign your own channels... don't you think? Now, would Tivo go along with that? Probably not..


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