# 9.1 Bugs



## RoyK

Well the update on my box is a whole hour long and I just hit my first bug - a rather serious one I think.

When setting up a recording on the Browse by Channel screen I set the date to today Tue 10/3 and the channel to my local CBS channel and scrolled down to the evening hours where I saw the Tuesday schedule.

Then I changed the date to WEDNESDAY 10/4. The schedule didn't change. TUESDAY's programming was still displayed. No matter what date I scrolled to the programming didn't update.

With the cursor on the (wrong) program schedule scrolling DOWN the list of programs didn't change anything. Scrolling UP flips the date back to TUESDAY. Bizarre! 

Another screwed update! Ah, well, I've come to expect it.


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## lessd

RoyK said:


> Well the update on my box is a whole hour long and I just hit my first bug - a rather serious one I think.
> 
> When setting up a recording on the Browse by Channel screen I set the date to today Tue 10/3 and the channel to my local CBS channel and scrolled down to the evening hours where I saw the Tuesday schedule.
> 
> Then I changed the date to WEDNESDAY 10/4. The schedule didn't change. TUESDAY's programming was still displayed. No matter what date I scrolled to the programming didn't update.
> 
> With the cursor on the (wrong) program schedule scrolling DOWN the list of programs didn't change anything. Scrolling UP flips the date back to TUESDAY. Bizarre!
> 
> Another screwed update! Ah, well, I've come to expect it.


The work around is to move the channel after changing the date say up then down then back and the guide data will change


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## RoyK

lessd said:


> The work around is to move the channel after changing the date say up then down then back and the guide data will change


Yeah I found that too. Thanks. Now I need to explain to my wife why she needs to change the channel in order to change the date.......


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## jlb

RoyK said:


> Well the update on my box is a whole hour long and I just hit my first bug - a rather serious one I think........


Everyone has their opinion, but I would tend to disagree with this being a serious issue. I say that only based on the fact that I almost never do a manual recording. But thanks for pointing this out for future reference.

BTW, I didn't realize we are up to 9.x. I thought we were still in the 8's.........


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## RoyK

Also when scrolling forward through the guide in grid view the time slot following 11:30 pm Tue displays as 12:00am TUES and the next slot as 12:30am TUES. The date doesn't change until 1:00 am. 

Scrolling backwards changes the date back to Tuesday when the 11:30 pm time slot is scrolled into (as it should).

Edit:
On closer observation the date IS properly changing on the tab at the top but not the date displayed just above the channel list.


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## Amnesia

RoyK said:


> _(...)_ I set the date to today Tue 10/3 _(...)_ Then I changed the date to WEDNESDAY 10/4.


What year were you using?

Today is Tuesday the *2*nd. Tomorrow is Wednesday the *3*rd.


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## Soapm

Amnesia said:


> What year were you using?
> 
> Today is Tuesday the *2*nd. Tomorrow is Wednesday the *3*rd.


Whew! I thought I lost a day again...


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## RoyK

Amnesia said:


> What year were you using?
> 
> Today is Tuesday the *2*nd. Tomorrow is Wednesday the *3*rd.


Yep you're right. It was 10/2 not 10/3. My typo but the problem is real and repeatable.


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## DaveLessnau

When deleting a program from the To Do list, when the list comes back, you're moved to a different page. I haven't pinned it down, yet, but it looks like it bumps you back two pages (and it's slow refreshing the display, too).

EDIT: OK, the specifics are that if you go into the program listing from the To Do list and delete it there, when it returns to the To Do list, it's in the right place. If you just highlight the program in the To Do list and hit the Clear button to delete it, when it returns you're on the first page of the To Do list (with the Recording History entry moved just off the top) with the highlight on the same number of rows down that the deleted entry was on.


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## rigidrunner

I would like to know what idiot thought that sending out a software update the week of the Fall Premiere was a good idea. My Tivo DOESN'T get me!


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## astrohip

rigidrunner said:


> I would like to know what idiot thought that sending out a software update the week of the Fall Premiere was a good idea. My Tivo DOESN'T get me!


I'll ditto this. Especially since I have heard of a case or two where a reboot or two was required to "settle" everything. Isolated cases of channels disappearing, that sort of thing. Resolved by rebooting, or indexing finally updating. But updating during the busiest time in the last 12 months is not good planning. And in my case, I was out of town from Thur-Sun, and my S3 was working overtime with new shows.

Do this two weeks earlier, or two weeks later.


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## worachj

The new update changed my video output format for my S3. I had it set to 720p fix and the update changed it to native. I had no video until I checked the video setting where I found that it was changed. I changed it back to 720p fix and everything is fine.


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## ZeoTiVo

DaveLessnau said:


> When deleting a program from the To Do list, when the list comes back, you're moved to a different page.


This has been in the last 2 updates or so. Not a new bug


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## usnret

I have 3 Tivo's. An SD-400 and 540 in the basement and a DT iupstairs in the family room. I record programs on the 2 basement ones and "bring them up" to the DT for viewing. The network is wired. All 3 of them have received the 9.1 update (I don't know when it was received and didn't ask for it). The big thing that I have noticed is that it now takes more than an hour to "bring up" an hour long program from the basement Tivo's to the DT. It used to take less than an hour. I don't know if this is a result of the 9.1 or not, but if it is, would hope that a fix is forthcoming. It also appears that the transfer's from the 540 now take longer than the ones from the SD-400. Never used to be this way, but will have to look into it further (actually time them).


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## Joey Bagadonuts

Hey TiVo. Two words you should seriously consider before the final release of the next update: *BETA TESTING*


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## George Cifranci

Joey Bagadonuts said:


> Hey TiVo. Two words you should seriously consider before the final release of the next update: *BETA TESTING*


Oh you hadn't heard? We are all beta testers. At least that is how I feel since I got my Series 3 in early January 2007.


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## RoyK

usnret said:


> I have 3 Tivo's. An SD-400 and 540 in the basement and a DT iupstairs in the family room. I record programs on the 2 basement ones and "bring them up" to the DT for viewing. The network is wired. All 3 of them have received the 9.1 update (I don't know when it was received and didn't ask for it). The big thing that I have noticed is that it now takes more than an hour to "bring up" an hour long program from the basement Tivo's to the DT. It used to take less than an hour. I don't know if this is a result of the 9.1 or not, but if it is, would hope that a fix is forthcoming. It also appears that the transfer's from the 540 now take longer than the ones from the SD-400. Never used to be this way, but will have to look into it further (actually time them).


I've noticed no difference in MRV speed with my 3 wired SD-H400's (about twice real time - best quality)

Now Playing List response is very sluggish 12 hours after upgrade installation however.

Edit: Clarification - by twice real time I mean twice as fast - eg 1 hr show transfers in about 30 min.


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## DaveLessnau

ZeoTiVo said:


> This has been in the last 2 updates or so. Not a new bug


Under the previous version, I believe that bug was in the Now Playing list or the Deleted Shows list. But, I had no problem in the To Do list (I scan and remove things from the To Do list daily).


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## StuffOfInterest

I've run across one, hopefully small, issue so far. My S2DT records a show every evening which is on both the cable box and internal tuner channel lists. In the past, TiVo would try to use the internal tuner as it would leave the cable box free for any non-analog available shows. When the show recorded this evening it used the cable box. Maybe once the system finishes the reported internal reindexing this will go back to normal, but it is a change in behavior.


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## RoyK

A problem was reported in the Series3 HDTV forum with manual recordings.

Link


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## ZICRON

The only bug I've come across so far with version 9.1-01-2-540 is that on tranferred files to the tivo series 2, I get audio, but no video, just a black screen.

Anyone else getting that?


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## Doh

astrohip said:


> I'll ditto this. Especially since I have heard of a case or two where a reboot or two was required to "settle" everything. Isolated cases of channels disappearing, that sort of thing. Resolved by rebooting, or indexing finally updating. But updating during the busiest time in the last 12 months is not good planning. And in my case, I was out of town from Thur-Sun, and my S3 was working overtime with new shows.
> 
> Do this two weeks earlier, or two weeks later.


+1

For the first time in a long time my tivo hung up me while I was trying to figure out how to record the MLB playoffs and new shows, and when I finally gave up and restarted it by pulling the plug it began installing the update and my tivo is now totally unavailable to me when I'd like to be scheduling/watching something.


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## DaveLessnau

I don't know if this can be called a bug, but Browse by Time (BBT) is now essentially unusable (to me, anyway). Because I've Thumbed almost everything in the Guide, the Suggestions engine doesn't suggest much of anything unless I've already given it two Thumbs Up. The only way to find new things is, every day, to BBT through a 24 hour period. The way BBT used to work was I could quickly page down within the detailed listings 6 times (about 2 seconds), wait for the watch symbol to disappear (about 1 second) and repeat ad nauseum until I finished the day. With 9.1, if I page down faster than once per second, it boings at me: I'm overrunning its buffer. What used to be a chore (since TiVo won't implement an ability to filter out anything with a Down Thumb), has now graduated to unbearable. For all intents and purposes, :down: this new release has made it impossible for me to find new things to watch. :down:


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## Krellion

Minor display issue on the To Do List:

I had a recording set up for _Eureka_'s midnight (ET) broadcast last night. I have the Season Pass for it set to start recording one minute early. The recording start time showed up as 11:59pm (correct), but still had the date as 10/3 instead of 10/2 like you'd think it would. Technically the date is correct, since the actual show schedule date is for 10/3, but since the beginning was shifted back to the previous day, it should indicate this.

Like I said, it's a minor issue that doesn't affect the actual recording time.


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## ZeoTiVo

DaveLessnau said:


> I don't know if this can be called a bug, but Browse by Time (BBT) is now essentially unusable (to me, anyway). Because I've Thumbed almost everything in the Guide, the Suggestions engine doesn't suggest much of anything unless I've already given it two Thumbs Up. The only way to find new things is, every day, to BBT through a 24 hour period.


you can go to Settings - restart or reset System - Clear Thumb ratings and suggestions

that will let you start over. As you have found too many Thumb ratings essentially render the suggestions moot. Best to do positive one thumb up ratings and let suggestions find similar offerings. maybe two thumbs up if you really like the whole genre.


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## DaveLessnau

ZeoTiVo said:


> you can go to Settings - restart or reset System - Clear Thumb ratings and suggestions
> 
> that will let you start over. As you have found too many Thumb ratings essentially render the suggestions moot. Best to do positive one thumb up ratings and let suggestions find similar offerings. maybe two thumbs up if you really like the whole genre.


That still won't solve either my problem with finding shows I haven't watched before or with the slow browsing speed under 9.1. I've seen and rated at least one instance of the VAST majority of everything in the Guide. If I clear my Thumbs (and I've done it before), I have no way to know if I've seen a program. Even with only Thumbs Up ratings, TiVo's Suggestion engine will not be able to find those very few items I haven't seen (though 9.1 seems to have improved that engine -- I now have many One Thumb Up shows in the Suggestion list, whereas, before, I had none). Since there's no way to filter or search by Thumbs, browsing (though irritating) was my only other option. 9.1 broke that.

BTW: I've confirmed that any list of shows that TiVo generates under 9.1 is unusably slow to browse through (more than 3 times slower than before). It now takes more than a second to Channel/Page down one show at a time (with an annoying boing if you go too fast) and the "please wait" timer that used to be at the end of each group of 7 or 8 shows is now missing (that pause now takes three seconds instead of one). So, you sit there repeatedly hitting Channel/Page down and listening to the boing until it's ready to go again.


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## wierdo

Hmm, neither my S3 nor my S2.5 (nightlight, not DT) bong. Once I fix my S2 (TCD140), I'll see how that one does. I can page down six or seven times on my suggestions list. It'll bong at me a few times once I get to the end if I page up or page down 10 times, since there aren't 10 pages.

The S2.5 is vastly slower at scrolling through a list of shows, but it doesn't seem much slower than I remember.


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## RoyK

We have 3 SD-H400s. 

In previous software versions we've been able to transfer between them with no restrictions - including simultaneous transfer of programs from one box to both of the others. This no longer works and if attempted gives a failure to record message (in to do list) stating that the (source) box was unavailable or could not be found which was ridiculous since I'd just navigated to that box to start the transfer.

To clarify Box A is in the process of transferring a program to box B. Box C attempts to start a transfer (any program) from box A. Get the error message. Transferring from box B to box C is no problem.

Once the transfer from box A to Box B is stopped, then box C can transfer from box A with no problem. 

This is unacceptable in a household with multiple viewers!!!

Edit: I just confirmed this by attempting to transfer a program from box B to box C. Transfer started fine. Then went to box A and attempted to transfer a (different) program from box B to box A and got the same error. None of the boxes were recording other than the usual buffer at the time. 

It is confirmed that under 9.1 a box cannot source programs to more than one other box at a time.


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## CuriousMark

The well organized feature and bug report thread in the S3 forum area is where I posted this bug report.
For 595 owners who don't read over there, I am adding the link here. It appears that the workaround of using a standard remote with separate buttons works for now. If anyone finds a different or better workaround, I am all ears.

CuriousMark

*Edit: I take it back. A restart fixed it up. Anyone else seeing this problem should simply restart their Humax DVD burner TiVo to fix it.*

I have also been told that simply pressing the TiVo button on the remote should fix it. It seems this may not even be a 9.1 issue at all.


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## DaveLessnau

wierdo said:


> Hmm, neither my S3 nor my S2.5 (nightlight, not DT) bong. Once I fix my S2 (TCD140), I'll see how that one does. I can page down six or seven times on my suggestions list. It'll bong at me a few times once I get to the end if I page up or page down 10 times, since there aren't 10 pages.
> 
> The S2.5 is vastly slower at scrolling through a list of shows, but it doesn't seem much slower than I remember.


It's hard to describe this properly. The slowness and the overflow boinging isn't in the list view of the programs. Instead, use Select on one of the programs on the list to enter its program information page. From there, use the Channel/Page Down button to move down into the next show on the list. That's where things slow to a crawl.

Side note: If TiVo would add Thumb information to the list view of the various browsing screens (like they have in the Suggestions list), that would fix my find-a-program problem.


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## ormder

New question (thread?):
I have a series 2 Tivo, and a "Lifetime Subscription" which I am very happy with, do not want any "upgrades" (except perhaps the needed ones Tivo sends over my phone line), but I REALLY would like to know if anyone out there knows how to re-establish contact with Tivo via my phone line AFTER I move to a different state/area code? I was told by an aquaintance that my Tivo DVR would not be good any more if I disconnect my Tivo here, and try to re-connect in another area.
Any info or advice, would be greatly appreciated.


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## bkdtv

ormder said:


> I have a series 2 Tivo, and a "Lifetime Subscription" which I am very happy with, do not want any "upgrades" (except perhaps the needed ones Tivo sends over my phone line), but I REALLY would like to know if anyone out there knows how to re-establish contact with Tivo via my phone line AFTER I move to a different state/area code? I was told by an aquaintance that my Tivo DVR would not be good any more if I disconnect my Tivo here, and try to re-connect in another area.


Whoever told you that was confused. They were confusing the cable company DVRs -- which require a connection to your cable company to work -- with the Tivo. You can connect the Tivo to a network or phone line anywhere in the country. You can use it wherever you want without restrictions. It will not affect the operation of the unit.

Of course, if you want to download guide information for your new area, you'll have to re-run guided setup.


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## Chew

Two more bugs:

Minor: Two recordings requested via the internet two weeks ago showed up again as new recordings today, including messages.

Major: use of PyTivo (also appears to be TiVo Desktop) results in no video, but good audio.


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## crowfan

DaveLessnau said:


> When deleting a program from the To Do list, when the list comes back, you're moved to a different page. I haven't pinned it down, yet, but it looks like it bumps you back two pages (and it's slow refreshing the display, too).
> 
> EDIT: OK, the specifics are that if you go into the program listing from the To Do list and delete it there, when it returns to the To Do list, it's in the right place. If you just highlight the program in the To Do list and hit the Clear button to delete it, when it returns you're on the first page of the To Do list (with the Recording History entry moved just off the top) with the highlight on the same number of rows down that the deleted entry was on.


I am seeing this exact same thing. It's a pain when there is a marathon of shows with bad data, cause you can't just hit Clear to delete them. You have to go into each one individually.


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## ScottNY845

Anyone else notice that when viewing your pics from the computer under the MUSIC, PHOTOS, & MORE and you see your COMPUTER within that list...

Well before the update when viewing the pics, the quality was fantastic, and the pic was auto-sized to fit the screen. Now with the update the pics look like you are viewing them as if in a CIRCUS MIRROR that makes you look short and fat and distorted...unless you really are short and fat...

This feature was perfect before the update...anyone else having this issue?


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## TeddS

When listening to music through the Galleon app, the screen is now flickering dark, then light, then dark. I think the latest version of Galleon isn't compatible with something in this latest release of the TiVo software...

--Tedd


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## m_jonis

How about this one: It keeps tuning my "cable" (not the box, but the cable) input on my DT unit to channel 2. Channel 2 isn't even listed in the channel lineup. So far, I've come down and three times I've seen the "Tivo can't detect a cable signal " blah blah.


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## Fraser+Dief

ScottNY845 said:


> Well before the update when viewing the pics, the quality was fantastic, and the pic was auto-sized to fit the screen. Now with the update the pics look like you are viewing them as if in a CIRCUS MIRROR that makes you look short and fat and distorted...unless you really are short and fat...


It's definitely screwed up. My photos are 4:3 on the computer, and they're coming up taller than wider onscreen, there's a large black space on either side of the photo.

I've only looked at it once before, can't say for sure what it used to look like before the update.


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## RoyK

More info on the broken MRV problem described above (post #28).

While a box steadfastly refuses to transfer a program to another box if it is already transferring (not necessarily the same) program to a third box, it has no problem transferring to a PC (via web browser https login) under the same conditions.

Edit: 
BTW it doesn't matter whether the recordings in question were recorded before or after the 9.1 upgrade.


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## flip123

I have not seen this bug in this list yet:

I have shows recorded previously on my Tivo that no longer play after the fall service update. I reported this problem in the Tivo Help Center.

Link

Phil


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## RoyK

flip123 said:


> I have not seen this bug in this list yet:
> 
> I have shows recorded previously on my Tivo that no longer play after the fall service update. I reported this problem in the Tivo Help Center.
> 
> Link
> 
> Phil


Interesting. Have you experienced the same problem with a program that was transferred in its entirety before the update -- not from a paused point?


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## TivoZorro

Transfering Issue

Three Series 2 Tivos. Transfering from either my 649 or 240 to my 540. 

1. Pick shows to transfer 
2. Check To Do List on the 540 - shows awaiting transfer are listed there.
3. Go back a few minutes later and some of the shows are gone and nothing is listed in Recording History. If I don't check the To Do List and they disappear then they don't appear on NPL as transfered. 
4. Have to go back and set up the transfers again.


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## RoyK

TivoZorro said:


> Transfering Issue
> 
> Three Series 2 Tivos. Transfering from either my 649 or 240 to my 540.
> 
> 1. Pick shows to transfer
> 2. Check To Do List on the 540 - shows awaiting transfer are listed there.
> 3. Go back a few minutes later and some of the shows are gone and nothing is listed in Recording History. If I don't check the To Do List and they disappear then they don't appear on NPL as transfered.
> 4. Have to go back and set up the transfers again.


That happened to my wife tuesday morning (3 SD-H400s). I tried to reproduce it but couldn't.

It appears to me that TiVo has done a major rewrite to the MRV code in order to make it work with S3 series boxes and has screwed it up royally.


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## trackzero

astrohip said:


> I'll ditto this. Especially since I have heard of a case or two where a reboot or two was required to "settle" everything. Isolated cases of channels disappearing, that sort of thing. Resolved by rebooting, or indexing finally updating. But updating during the busiest time in the last 12 months is not good planning. And in my case, I was out of town from Thur-Sun, and my S3 was working overtime with new shows.


My TiVo still hasn't recovered. I'm just glad most of the new shows are available for direct playback from the major network websites...bad timing, tho.


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## rseligman

Let's say I have a show recorded on TiVo A on 9/1, and I transfer it to TiVo B on 9/5. If I look at the Now Playing list on TiVo B, the show has the date 9/1 next to it. But if I go to TiVo A and choose TiVo B to see its Now Playing list, the show in the TiVo B list has 9/5 next to it.

Can anyone else confirm this?


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## carroca

For those having MRV transfer problems, are all of your TiVos on 9.1 or are some still on 8.X? MRV will not work between 9.1 and older versions.


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## RoyK

all 9.1


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## Crrink

Urgh, discovered yesterday that one of my four TiVo's was updated to 9.1, meaning it can't share shows any more.
Thought about signing up for the priority list, but after reading all these bugs here, I think I'll just deal with it.
Suppose I can still transfer to pc, then to TiVo if I need to all that badly.


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## TivoZorro

all 9.1 here.

I just fired up Tivo Desktop 2.5 on my laptop. When I went to transfer some shows from my 540 Desktop said it couldn't access it. Went upstairs and unplugged and replugged the USB Tivo Adaptor. Now it sees it and I'm good to go. I was transfering from Tivo to Tivo this morning so I don't know why Desktop couldn't see it. 

As far as the tranfered shows set to transfer that are disappearing from TDL that has happend two mornings in a row. Maybe recycling the adaptor will help with that?


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## TivoZorro

Well I spoke too soon. Desktop still can not see my 540. What is going on? I will go recycle my router. But it still doesn't explain why I can get on the Internet and all of my Tivos can see each other but Desktop can't see 540.


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## TivoZorro

Tivo Desktop will not see my Weakness 540 Tivo.

What I have tried

1. recycled Tivo Adaptor 
2. recycled wireless router
3. rebooted DSL modem and wireless router
4. rebooted Tivo
5. rebooted laptop

Nothing works! My 540 Tivo can see my PC but my PC can not see Tivo. 

I transfer all of my shows to my computer from this Tivo. Now it looks like it is broken. Anybody have any suggestions. I'd have to transfer from it to another Tivo and then to the PC.


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## ZeoTiVo

RoyK said:


> More info on the broken MRV problem described above (post #28).
> 
> While a box steadfastly refuses to transfer a program to another box if it is already transferring (not necessarily the same) program to a third box, it has no problem transferring to a PC (via web browser https login) under the same conditions.
> 
> Edit:
> BTW it doesn't matter whether the recordings in question were recorded before or after the 9.1 upgrade.


Roy - 9.1 came to my DVRs last night - I just easily setup a MRV from one box to two different boxes(different shows) so that should be working for you.

and yes TTG uses different ports than MRV so you can do a TTG alongside MRV no problems. My understanding is you can do one TTG and one TTCB at a time per box. You can do multiple MRVs to other boxes and one MRV at a time into a box.


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## RoyK

ZeoTiVo said:


> Roy - 9.1 came to my DVRs last night - I just easily setup a MRV from one box to two different boxes(different shows) so that should be working for you.
> 
> and yes TTG uses different ports than MRV so you can do a TTG alongside MRV no problems. My understanding is you can do one TTG and one TTCB at a time per box. You can do multiple MRVs to other boxes and one MRV at a time into a box.


Nope. It still absolutely refuses on mine and I've tried every permutation. Again as soon as I stop the transfer to a box or it completes then the other is able to transfer fine.

I'll try resetting the boxes but don't hold much hope for it.


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## ZeoTiVo

rseligman said:


> Let's say I have a show recorded on TiVo A on 9/1, and I transfer it to TiVo B on 9/5. If I look at the Now Playing list on TiVo B, the show has the date 9/1 next to it. But if I go to TiVo A and choose TiVo B to see its Now Playing list, the show in the TiVo B list has 9/5 next to it.
> 
> Can anyone else confirm this?


I got 9.1 this morning. I am seeing the corrct recording date follow the file around via MRV.

eg a 9/28 Colbert Report shows as 9/28 on the DVR I MRVed it to as well.


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## RoyK

I reset all three boxes. No change. Still getting "Cant Transfer" error message if I try to transfer from a box that is already transferring to another box.

To be clear there was no problem doing this before the boxes updated. It's something we do very frequently indeed.

FWIW all boxes use fixed IP. There is no conflict.


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## Dajad

Given all the wonderful 9.1 enhancements to Wishlists I went into the Wishlists on my S3, 

- I clicked on "VIew all upcoming Wishlist Programs".
- I decided to delete my "HD & Documentaries" wishlist
- This crashed/froze my system!

This left me on "Upcoming Programs" screen. The TiVo would not respond to any further commands. I had to reboot/unplug, the system to get my TiVo working again.

Upon reboot the "HD & Documentaries" wishlist WAS gone, so at least the delete worked BEFORE it froze up! 

...Dale


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## Dajad

worachj said:


> The new update changed my video output format for my S3. I had it set to 720p fix and the update changed it to native. I had no video until I checked the video setting where I found that it was changed. I changed it back to 720p fix and everything is fine.


The update did the same thing to me. It seems like "Native" is a new option that I don't recall being there before. I prefer it because my TV can display all of the specified resolutions natively.

So, I'm happy for the change. I wouldn't known it was even a new option but for this thread.

...Dale


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## TivoZorro

Still won't recognize my 540. Do you think if I unintall Desktop 2.5 and then download and reinstall it if that will make any difference?

I have moved the Wireless Adaptors to different Tivos and nothing has changed so it's not the adaptor.


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## tothebeat

m_jonis said:


> How about this one: It keeps tuning my "cable" (not the box, but the cable) input on my DT unit to channel 2. Channel 2 isn't even listed in the channel lineup.


I've got the same thing.

And what's with my overlapping SP not being recorded on my DT unless I set one of them up on the cable box and one on the basic signal.

What a pain...


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## RoyK

RoyK said:


> I reset all three boxes. No change. Still getting "Cant Transfer" error message if I try to transfer from a box that is already transferring to another box.
> 
> To be clear there was no problem doing this before the boxes updated. It's something we do very frequently indeed.
> 
> FWIW all boxes use fixed IP. There is no conflict.


It may not be that the box refuses to transfer to a second box but rather that all aspects of MRV including viewing now playing on remote boxes are incredibly SLOW since the update and when a box is already transmitting it is slowing down just enough more to cause a timeout when a third box requests a transfer.

That would jibe with the error message in the to do list of the third box saying that the already transmitting box could not be found when it is obviously there.

(Boxes use wired connection FWIW)


----------



## flip123

RoyK said:


> Interesting. Have you experienced the same problem with a program that was transferred in its entirety before the update -- not from a paused point?


- No, shows that were transferred prior to the update in their entirety work.
- Little 4 minute clips transferred after the update also work.

If there is anybody out there who has not received the updates yet, it would sure be nice if you could transfer the last 4 minutes of a 60 minute show, let the update occur and see if you see the same thing I do.

If you see the same thing, I will hold out hope that Tivo will eventually fix the problem. If this is isolated to my Tivo and my collection of Jay Leno's musical guests, then I guess they are just lost.

Phil


----------



## RoyK

flip123 said:


> ....
> If you see the same thing, I will hold out hope that Tivo will eventually fix the problem. If this is isolated to my Tivo and my collection of Jay Leno's musical guests, then I guess they are just lost.
> 
> Phil


Try transferring them to your pc. On the tivo menu go to messages & settings/settings/Phone & Network and write down the IP addr shown in the upper right corner - something like 192.168.1.100

Then in the address bar of your web browser on your PC type in

https://192.168.1.100 (substitute your tivo's IP. Don't neglect the 's' in https)

Click OK to any message talking about security certificates. You should then get a login window. For username enter 'tivo' (no quotes) for password enter your tivo's Media Access Key (find it in Account & System Information).

You should then see a list of programs on your tivo. Click the 'download' link at the right of each program to download to the PC.


----------



## flip123

Oh, I liked that suggestion! Unfortunately, the shows that don't work after the update give me a 404 error when I try to download them. I can download the good shows just fine.

Phil


----------



## klia

Just got 9.1 this afternoon (not happy that it tied up my phone line for more than 2 hours in the middle of the day, but whatever), and haven't seen anyone mention these bugs yet. 

1. Wish List: I wanted to check upcoming programs for one of my Wish Lists, and after doing so, hit the left arrow twice to go back to my list of Wish Lists, and instead of being on the name I'd just checked, it was on a random name toward the top of my list -- 8 screens back. So, I tried selecting the same name as before, viewing upcoming programs, and again hit the left arrow twice to get back to my list of names, and ended up on a different random name toward the top of my list. Restarting has made one difference: now, no matter what name I select and view upcoming programs for, when I try to go back to my list of names, I find the highlight bar on the very first Wish List name at the top of my list. If defaulting back to my first Wish List is deliberate, it's VERY annoying, especially if I wanted to check another Wish List farther along the alphabet, because it means a lot of extra paging down that I've never had to do before.

2. Browsing by Channel: I checked a high number digital cable channel for a show I thought was on tonight, then backed out (3 left arrows, to where you can choose All channels or Favorite channels), realized I'd forgotten to check something else, and when I selected All channels again, the channel had defaulted back to 2, which is my lowest-numbered channel, and it persists in doing this, rather than leaving it at the last channel accessed, which is what it used to do. Again, if TiVo thinks resetting back to the lowest-numbered channel every single time is a benefit to users, well, I'm here to say it's not; it's annoying to have to push more buttons than I used to.


----------



## mattack

ZeoTiVo said:


> This has been in the last 2 updates or so. Not a new bug


At least for me, this one didn't happen before the latest update.. (I'm on a S3).

Now, the other "to do list bug" still happens.. when you do a view upcoming and change a recording, then going back left moves you into the details of a DIFFERENT program... even if you weren't in the to do list originally.

i.e. (approx steps I'm not at my Tivo) browse by time, pick a specific program, view upcoming, set a recording for a DIFFERENT ep than the one you first entered....
go left
-> Now you will be in the TO DO list for a *different* item even though you weren't in the To Do list originally.

Some sort of very bizarre problem that I'm amazed isn't crashing the software! (Though I haven't tried, I was able to crash the old version on demand.)

Tivo needs a bug reporting page.


----------



## rseligman

ZeoTiVo said:


> I got 9.1 this morning. I am seeing the corrct recording date follow the file around via MRV.
> 
> eg a 9/28 Colbert Report shows as 9/28 on the DVR I MRVed it to as well.


Just to be clear, the date on the receiver TiVo is correct when you check it _on the receiver TiVo_. But the problem I see is if you then go to the _sender TiVo's_ Now Playing list, and select the receiver TiVo (as if you were going to transfer the program back again). That's where the date is wrong.


----------



## briang5

klia said:


> Just got 9.1 this afternoon (not happy that it tied up my phone line for more than 2 hours in the middle of the day, but whatever), and haven't seen anyone mention these bugs yet.
> 
> 1. Wish List: I wanted to check upcoming programs for one of my Wish Lists, and after doing so, hit the left arrow twice to go back to my list of Wish Lists, and instead of being on the name I'd just checked, it was on a random name toward the top of my list -- 8 screens back. So, I tried selecting the same name as before, viewing upcoming programs, and again hit the left arrow twice to get back to my list of names, and ended up on a different random name toward the top of my list. Restarting has made one difference: now, no matter what name I select and view upcoming programs for, when I try to go back to my list of names, I find the highlight bar on the very first Wish List name at the top of my list. If defaulting back to my first Wish List is deliberate, it's VERY annoying, especially if I wanted to check another Wish List farther along the alphabet, because it means a lot of extra paging down that I've never had to do before.
> 
> 2. Browsing by Channel: I checked a high number digital cable channel for a show I thought was on tonight, then backed out (3 left arrows, to where you can choose All channels or Favorite channels), realized I'd forgotten to check something else, and when I selected All channels again, the channel had defaulted back to 2, which is my lowest-numbered channel, and it persists in doing this, rather than leaving it at the last channel accessed, which is what it used to do. Again, if TiVo thinks resetting back to the lowest-numbered channel every single time is a benefit to users, well, I'm here to say it's not; it's annoying to have to push more buttons than I used to.


I also see issue #1 and it is a real pain ....


----------



## jtown0620

I have 2 DT and I received the update last night. Now, every once in a while, the screen goes crazy! Just a rainbow of colors and very distorted but the sound is perfect. I pressed the TiVo button on the remote and returned to live tv to find the picture corrected. This has happened on both TiVos! Has anyone else encountered this? 

Also the wireless transfer is definitely slower since the update! I have owned & loved my TiVos for a while and must say I love the new GUI but the amount of bugs in this update is really unacceptable! This reminds me of a Microsoft update looks nice performs like crap!


----------



## rodalpho

Agreed, 9.1 is one of the worst upgrades in a looong time.


----------



## Ted19111

Since the Fall 9.1 update, multi-room viewing (MRV) of Now Playing on remote boxes is incredibly slow for me since the update. Scrolling through remote Now Playing is taking longer, and viewing a show's details on remote boxes is taking up to 16 seconds (with the Please Wait displayed the entire time).

Everything was fine until the 9.1 update.

My TiVo's are a 540 (S2 single tuner) and 649 (S2 dual tuner). Both are wired on the network (not using wireless).

Is anyone else seeing this behavior on MRV? Any ideas on how I can fix it?

Thanks,
Ted.


----------



## Soapm

jtown0620 said:


> I have 2 DT and I received the update last night. Now, every once in a while, the screen goes crazy! Just a rainbow of colors and very distorted but the sound is perfect. I pressed the TiVo button on the remote and returned to live tv to find the picture corrected. This has happened on both TiVos! Has anyone else encountered this? !


Yes, in addition to that my S2 649 seems far less stable with the new OS 9.1. A lot of little intermittent things that appear from time to time like blank menu screens, the play bar at the bottom stops appearing when I hit the play button, reboots for no apparent reason, times when it appears to freeze for a minute or so then go again etc

Something I can duplicate consistently, my To Do list has several shows like Frasier, eave it to Beaver where the channel is 0. That is not correct, it happened with this OS. When I select that show I get a screen that says there is no guide data. When I back out of that screen the Tivo will reboot. It does this 100% of the time.

Ive tried resorting my season passes, redoing the channels and I still have the 0 for the channel. I have about 6 or 7 shows doing this. I dont want to delete the guide data because it will wipe out all my season passes and whish lists which I worked so hard to build and arrange in the order I have them. 


Every now and then Ill change the channel to a new show and notice the channel number is 2-66??? And the show will be listed as to be announced. I can hit channel up and it goes back to normal without changing the channel.


It seems like I have a single tuner box when it first boots up. When I it the live TV button to go back and forth between tuners the guide box that appears doesnt show the second tuner and it is noticeable that it displays the same channel each time you press the live TV button. I can change to another channel like say 36 then go back to pressing the live TV button and it shows 36 each time I press the button. After being up for a while you can see the second tuner kick in.


----------



## DaveLessnau

mattack said:


> Tivo needs a bug reporting page.


I agree. I went to their web page and looked around. But, the closest I could find was a "Suggestion" reporting page which had all kinds of garbage in it that wouldn't apply. Since their competitive advantage is their software, I'd think they'd make it easy to report bugs. Of course, I'd think very obvious UI problems like tripling how long it takes to scroll through shows and returning to a list in the wrong place wouldn't make it through even a cursory test.


----------



## RoyK

DEAR TIVO ENGINEERING:

RE: MRV PROBLEM - BOX UNABLE TO SOURCE TO MORE THAN ONE OTHER BOX

If anyone from TiVo is interested I've written a detailed description of the problem I've been complaining about complete with screen photos, detailed equipment descriptions, hookup info and what I've tried to do to resolve the problem.

Contact me by PM and I'd be pleased to email a PDF of the report to you.


----------



## robaustin

Saw a weird thing this morning. Saw I got the update, went into Now Playing on my downstairs TIVO box. Noticed when it sees the other TIVO - it doesn't just say "Bedroom DVR" but it says "Now Playing on Bedroom DVR." Oh wow, cool. SO I selected the Bedroom DVR to see what was on it, and it said "There are no recordings to show for the Bedroom DVR."

I didn't have time to look into the issue further. Just wondering if it might be because the bedroom TIVO didn't get the update yet. I know there's stuff on there.... I just found it strange. I'll investigate further when I get home, but wondering if anyone else has seen this.

I remoted into my home PC, and the TIVO Desktop sees everything on the Bedroom DVR, by the way....

--*Rob


----------



## RoyK

robaustin said:


> .....and it said "There are no recordings to show for the Bedroom DVR."
> 
> I didn't have time to look into the issue further. Just wondering if it might be because the bedroom TIVO didn't get the update yet. ...


Yes, that is exactly the reason. MRV on 9.1 is not compatible with earlier versions.


----------



## robaustin

RoyK said:


> Yes, that is exactly the reason. MRV on 9.1 is not compatible with earlier versions.


Ya know....that's a big flaw - because in households with two TIVOs, when one doesn't get the update, it breaks a function entirely. Unfortunately TIVO isn't looking at accounts when it updates - to see if two are on the same account.

Grrrr.... I hope that TIVO gets its update today - I think it dials home at like 11 AM every day.

--*Rob


----------



## jbondsr

RoyK said:


> Yes, that is exactly the reason. MRV on 9.1 is not compatible with earlier versions.


All my Tivos have the new update and I get "DVR has no recordings msg" when goto now playing. The new update also rebooted in the middle of my recording a show at 9 pm, this update sucks.


----------



## Soapm

RoyK said:


> DEAR TIVO ENGINEERING:
> 
> RE: MRV PROBLEM - BOX UNABLE TO SOURCE TO MORE THAN ONE OTHER BOX
> 
> If anyone from TiVo is interested I've written a detailed description of the problem I've been complaining about complete with screen photos, detailed equipment descriptions, hookup info and what I've tried to do to resolve the problem.
> 
> Contact me by PM and I'd be pleased to email a PDF of the report to you.


How can I take screen shots of my Tivo problems?


----------



## Crrink

robaustin said:


> Ya know....that's a big flaw - because in households with two TIVOs, when one doesn't get the update, it breaks a function entirely. Unfortunately TIVO isn't looking at accounts when it updates - to see if two are on the same account.
> 
> Grrrr.... I hope that TIVO gets its update today - I think it dials home at like 11 AM every day.
> 
> --*Rob


I think they might be - one of my TiVo's got the update 2 days ago, and my other three all got it yesterday.
Could be a coincidence, but hopefully not.


----------



## RoyK

Soapm said:


> How can I take screen shots of my Tivo problems?


I used a digital camera. Turned off the flash.
Roy


----------



## RoyK

Crrink said:


> I think they might be - one of my TiVo's got the update 2 days ago, and my other three all got it yesterday.
> Could be a coincidence, but hopefully not.


TiVoJerry stated in a post in the TivoHD forum that they intend to roll out the update by account - i.e. send the update to all boxes registered to an account as close together as they can.


----------



## oo7plyr

S3 user here. To add to the list of bugs.

Creates second Amazon Unbox folder.
Unbox Download appears both in the Unbox folder and in the Now Playing list.


----------



## StuffOfInterest

Found another cable box bug with S2DT. Two days ago I had two suggestion programs recording at once. One was recording via the internal tuner and a second via the cable box. I went to kill the recording on the internal tuner as it was not anything I was interested in seeing. When I killed the recording, TiVo changed chanels on the cable box to chanel 01 and stopped recording the show it was working on.

Yesterday, I had another suggestion program recording off of the internal tuner. The 2nd tuner (neither internal nor cable box) was not recording at the time. When I killed the recording the cable box again changed to channel 01.

The first time I was willing to call it a fluke, but as the behavior is repeating I'm more inclined to call it a bug now.


----------



## bicker

RoyK said:


> DEAR TIVO ENGINEERING:
> 
> RE: MRV PROBLEM - BOX UNABLE TO SOURCE TO MORE THAN ONE OTHER BOX
> 
> ...
> 
> Contact me by PM and I'd be pleased to email a PDF of the report to you.


Hahahaha... thanks for the laugh... I needed it today.

It's sort of like putting a note on the mirror in your bathroom: DEAR DENTIST: I have a toothache. Please call me to make an appointment.


----------



## RoyK

bicker said:


> Hahahaha... thanks for the laugh... I needed it today.
> 
> It's sort of like putting a note on the mirror in your bathroom: DEAR DENTIST: I have a toothache. Please call me to make an appointment.


Happy you find it amusing.


----------



## MaryT

One of my tivos (DT) got the update and the other did not and like everyone else, we lost the ability to transfer shows.

Another weirdness though... I signed up for the priority list and when I got home last night the single tuner series 2 said pending restart and I restarted it. The system came back really quickly and there was no change in version number.

I did this a few times with the same results. I forgot to check it this morning, but has anyone else seen this happen?

When the DT got it, I restarted, and after an hour it was good to go.


----------



## timstack8969

I found a bug since the 9.1 Update. I use the "Serial connector" to change channels and when you change a channel you see the last channel you had on for about 2 sec before you see the channel you switched to. I used to be able correct this problem when I reran my "Serial Setup" but not this time using 9.1. It's aliitle annoying.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

bicker said:


> Hahahaha... thanks for the laugh... I needed it today.
> 
> It's sort of like putting a note on the mirror in your bathroom: DEAR DENTIST: I have a toothache. Please call me to make an appointment.


It's even worse. Unfortunately for us, the dentist is walking around with a button on his lapel. The button says: ASK ME IF I GIVE A FLYING F*** ABOUT YOUR PROBLEMS!

It's sad, and unsurprising, that this update is so buggy.


----------



## Bierboy

Phantom Gremlin said:


> ...It's sad, and unsurprising, that this update is so buggy.


That's a gross misstatement. For many of us (I dare say the majority who wouldn't bother posting) this update has been seamless. I've had no problems at all with the update on my S3.


----------



## rodalpho

You haven't noticed a slower UI or the frozen video on 30 second skip? The former may be in my head, but the latter is definitely changed.


----------



## lmdoc50

I have a Tivo Series 2. Before the Fall Update I had more than 100 Seasons Passes. Now there are 99. The programs show up in the To Do List but I cannot access them for changes in the Season Pass screen. Also Manual Recordings are not showing up in the Season Pass list but again they are in To Do List and when I add a program to record that conflicts with either a Season Pass that was numbered higher than number 99 or a Manual Recording, I get the conflict message.

Has TiVo limited number of Season Passes?

Anyone else having this problem? 

Thanks for any feedback.


----------



## klia

timstack8969 said:


> I found a bug since the 9.1 Update. I use the "Serial connector" to change channels and when you change a channel you see the last channel you had on for about 2 sec before you see the channel you switched to. I used to be able correct this problem when I reran my "Serial Setup" but not this time using 9.1. It's aliitle annoying.


I'm running into that, too, and nothing I've tried has fixed it, either. I'm not just getting blackscreen, either; when the picture comes in, it's weird and jerky and pixelly for several seconds before it stabilizes.


----------



## klia

Addendum to my other post:

When I go to Browse by Channel, not only does it default back to the lowest-numbered channel every time you exit that screen, but also, if I page to, say, 8pm in channel 2's listings, if I left arrow back to check a different channel, then right arrow to get the listings to pop up, it's no longer at 8pm, it's defaulted back to midnight, or the earliest show listed for that day. Another really annoying change that translates to lots of extra paging down. NOT happy about this!


----------



## HDTiVo

Just remember when calling these things bugs that TiVo knows what's good for you. In many cases TiVo may have determined you are better off with the change/"bug."


----------



## RoyK

HDTiVo said:


> Just remember when calling these things bugs that TiVo knows what's good for you. In many cases TiVo may have determined you are better off with the change/"bug."


If you find one in this thread we'd be better off with, please point it out.


----------



## jon01

my MRV between my series 2 DT and my regular series 2 is really slow. not sure about the transfer speeds yet, i mean the menus. its taking forever. using tivo wireless g adapters on both tivos.


----------



## steve614

rodalpho said:


> You haven't noticed a slower UI or the frozen video on 30 second skip? The former may be in my head, but the latter is definitely changed.


Some of the "bugs" reported in this thread I will not encounter since I may not use my Tivo in a particular way.

I have noticed a _slight_ lag in the UI when populating screens, but nothing I would consider alarming. I just got the update, so the Tivo may need time to "sort things out", or at worst, a reboot.

As for the 30 sec. skip, I use it often and I seem to remember the video freezing _before_ the update as well as after. I haven't noticed a change in this function.


----------



## Soapm

klia said:


> I'm running into that, too, and nothing I've tried has fixed it, either. I'm not just getting blackscreen, either; when the picture comes in, it's weird and jerky and pixelly for several seconds before it stabilizes.


I didn't notice this but you're right...

I thought folks from Tivo monitored this site. Is there a better place to report our problems?


----------



## vasilemj

So I turned my TiVo on today and was informed that the Fall update was downloaded to my TiVo. Great I thought....until I went to watch a 16x9 program that I moved from my computer to my TiVo. Now the aspect ratio is all screwed up.

Last week I moved a 16x9 program to my TiVo and everything played fine on my wide-screen TV. Today, after recovering that same program from my Deleted Items folder, I notice that the aspect ratio is all messed up. I get black bars on the top and bottom and the picture is elongated on my screen. This never happened before. All my wide-screen shows played perfectly fine.

Anyone else experiencing the same thing? This is going to be very annoying if it isn't fixed soon.


----------



## jtown0620

Well for the first time ever my living room TiVo locked up! I had to unplug/replug just to get it to reboot. Thanks 9.1! Not to mention the colors went crazy again on my TiVos! At least I know the work around of hitting the TiVo button then live tv button fixes it. The prettier GUI is well worth all these problems wouldn't you say?!


----------



## pldoolittle

This is not a bug per-se, but 9.1 breaks the popular NowPlaying.xhtml script. It still works fine on 8.3. There is another thread here that is tracking this issue.


----------



## rainwater

vasilemj said:


> So I turned my TiVo on today and was informed that the Fall update was downloaded to my TiVo. Great I thought....until I went to watch a 16x9 program that I moved from my computer to my TiVo. Now the aspect ratio is all screwed up.
> 
> Last week I moved a 16x9 program to my TiVo and everything played fine on my wide-screen TV. Today, after recovering that same program from my Deleted Items folder, I notice that the aspect ratio is all messed up. I get black bars on the top and bottom and the picture is elongated on my screen. This never happened before. All my wide-screen shows played perfectly fine.
> 
> Anyone else experiencing the same thing? This is going to be very annoying if it isn't fixed soon.


Try setting your aspect ratio in the options to 16:9 and it should play fine.


----------



## jaybird13

Ted19111 said:


> Since the Fall 9.1 update, multi-room viewing (MRV) of Now Playing on remote boxes is incredibly slow for me since the update. Scrolling through remote Now Playing is taking longer, and viewing a show's details on remote boxes is taking up to 16 seconds (with the Please Wait displayed the entire time).
> 
> Everything was fine until the 9.1 update.
> 
> My TiVo's are a 540 (S2 single tuner) and 649 (S2 dual tuner). Both are wired on the network (not using wireless).
> 
> Is anyone else seeing this behavior on MRV? Any ideas on how I can fix it?
> 
> Thanks,
> Ted.


I'm having the same exact problem. MRV is painfully slow now on all my wired TiVos (3 DTs & 1 ST).


----------



## jrm01

MaryT said:


> One of my tivos (DT) got the update and the other did not and like everyone else, we lost the ability to transfer shows.
> 
> Another weirdness though... I signed up for the priority list and when I got home last night the single tuner series 2 said pending restart and I restarted it. The system came back really quickly and there was no change in version number.
> 
> I did this a few times with the same results. I forgot to check it this morning, but has anyone else seen this happen?
> 
> When the DT got it, I restarted, and after an hour it was good to go.


Same here. My S3 and THD got 9.1 OK. My S2 was Pending Restart, but restart did not get new update.


----------



## bicker

I have noticed no degradation in the UI on my S3, and a slight improvement on my S2. I never used 30 second skip before on either, but used it for the first time last night on my S3, and it was great, no frozen video.


----------



## bicker

Soapm said:


> I thought folks from Tivo monitored this site. Is there a better place to report our problems?


Yes. Call TiVo directly.


----------



## epsilondelta

pldoolittle said:


> This is not a bug per-se, but 9.1 breaks the popular NowPlaying.xhtml script. It still works fine on 8.3. There is another thread here that is tracking this issue.


*greg_burns* and *morac* found and implemented the solution, beginning here, and morac has further enhanced this fine script.

The script displays all the info you could want about your NP list(s) & clicking the file size transfers said file to PC. (A little unituitive [to me], but saves a column.)

R-click this link to get the 9.1-compatible version.

Many thanks to *morac* for his enhancements to *Gman662*'s original. :up:

Ken


----------



## RoyK

Soapm said:


> I didn't notice this but you're right...
> 
> I thought folks from Tivo monitored this site. Is there a better place to report our problems?


Folks from TiVo most assuredly do monitor this site. For example it took TiVoPony less than two hours to respond to the "*Tivo discontinued in 2010*" thread.

But you do have alternatives -- you can report bugs online at TiVo's site -- oops, forgot, they don't provide a way to do that -- or you can call TiVo and hope you get lucky. My experience has been very long hold times after which I get disconnected


----------



## bicker

Yup, the point is that while TiVo folks monitor this site, they participate as they see fit here; they have no obligation with regard to anything posted here, while if you call tech support there is such an obligation.


----------



## RoyK

ZeoTiVo said:


> Roy - 9.1 came to my DVRs last night - I just easily setup a MRV from one box to two different boxes(different shows) so that should be working for you.
> 
> and yes TTG uses different ports than MRV so you can do a TTG alongside MRV no problems. My understanding is you can do one TTG and one TTCB at a time per box. You can do multiple MRVs to other boxes and one MRV at a time into a box.


Thanks for the input Zeo.

I think the difference between your experience and mine may be our equipment. I've made a lot of observations in the last few days and I'm now pretty sure I know what's going on.

With my setup (Three SD-H400s hardwired using Linksys USB200Ms into a Linksys WRTG54 router) I note the following since the 9.1 update:

1. There is no doubt that MRV has been extensively modified - almost certainly in preparation for the projected November incorporation of MRV on the S3 with it's much larger data files for HD recordings.

2. MRV transfers of shows from box to box on 9.1 is nearly twice as fast as with earlier versions. A 30 min program (best quality) that used to take about 15 minutes to transfer now takes about 8 on my system. That would make sense if users are to be able to view HD recordings as they transfer.

3. When a box is in the process of transferring a program (especially the source box) any attempts to navigate the NPL on that box from another slows to a crawl often with "Please Wait" messages lasting for 10-20 seconds as one navigates into and out of folders.

4. Attempts to transfer a program to a third box from a box already in the process of transferring a program to another result in an error saying that the source box was unavailable or could not be found.

I believe what is happening is that at least with my hardware the resources needed to transfer a file at the higher speed with whatever the new protocol is are taxed to the point that responses to requests to transfer a second file are delayed just long enough to cause a timeout to occur thereby resulting in the box unavailable or not found error.

The solution may be as simple as increasing the timeout time.


----------



## barlav

Ted19111 said:


> Since the Fall 9.1 update, multi-room viewing (MRV) of Now Playing on remote boxes is incredibly slow for me since the update. Scrolling through remote Now Playing is taking longer, and viewing a show's details on remote boxes is taking up to 16 seconds (with the Please Wait displayed the entire time).
> 
> Everything was fine until the 9.1 update.
> 
> My TiVo's are a 540 (S2 single tuner) and 649 (S2 dual tuner). Both are wired on the network (not using wireless).
> 
> Is anyone else seeing this behavior on MRV? Any ideas on how I can fix it?
> 
> Thanks,
> Ted.


Same exact problem here with 3 series 2 TiVo's using TiVo wireless G adapters. This is unacceptable!!


----------



## vasilemj

rainwater said:


> Try setting your aspect ratio in the options to 16:9 and it should play fine.


My aspect ratio on the TiVo is set to 16x9. It always has been since they incorporated that option. Tried flipping back and forth between 4x3 and 16x9 and both options result in the same messed up aspect ratio. I would expect it when I have the 4x3 option selected but not the 16x9.

Seems as if it's stuck in 4x3 mode

FYI, I have one of the original 60-hour Series 2 models.


----------



## RodEllison

vasilemj said:


> My aspect ratio on the TiVo is set to 16x9. It always has been since they incorporated that option. Tried flipping back and forth between 4x3 and 16x9 and both options result in the same messed up aspect ratio. I would expect it when I have the 4x3 option selected but not the 16x9.
> 
> Seems as if it's stuck in 4x3 mode
> 
> FYI, I have one of the original 60-hour Series 2 models.


I have the EXACT same issue on both of my series2 boxes. Have widescreen TVs, and tried every combination of the TVs aspect with either of the Tivos aspects 4:3 or 16:9. No matter what, it forces the widescreen into a 4:3 box...so its stretched horizontally, black bars on both top and bottom... Didn't do this prior to 9.1...


----------



## WebG

RoyK said:


> Well the update on my box is a whole hour long and I just hit my first bug - a rather serious one I think.
> 
> When setting up a recording on the Browse by Channel screen I set the date to today Tue 10/3 and the channel to my local CBS channel and scrolled down to the evening hours where I saw the Tuesday schedule.


I am moving my post on this topic from the other thread.

I just got the 9.1 two days ago and I HATE the manual recording screen redo.

For those of you who haven't seen it, let me walk you through the old way / new way:

OLD WAY:

- Go to FIND PROGRAMS / MANUAL RECORD / BY TIME & CHANNEL / FAVORITE CHANNELS
- Scroll up/down to date, scroll up/down to channel, then you can scroll up/down to a specific timeslot. 
- **** then you can press the back button, change channels, and the program listing is updated for the new channel _AT THE SAME TIME SECTION THAT YOU JUST USED_. 
- This way, you can browse quickly through all the channels to see what's on at 9pm for the next 2 weeks.

NEW WAY:
- Go to FIND PROGRAMS / MANUAL RECORD / BY TIME & CHANNEL / FAVORITE CHANNELS
- Scroll up/down to date, scroll up/down to channel, then you can scroll up/down to a specific timeslot. Notice that the program guide always begins at midnight of the day that you selected.
- When you press the back button to change channels, the program listing resets back to midnight on the new channel, forcing you to scroll through the days' programming.
- This way, you can NOT browse through all the channels to see what's on at 9pm for the next 2 weeks without having to scroll through an entire day for each channel that you're looking at.

Does anyone have a way to report this as a bug, or is there a reasonable workaround/fix for this way-too-annoying "feature" that obviously didn't go through enduser QA usability testing?​
I will agree that this is a MAJOR usability issue but not that it's a "serious bug". For all the raves we've given TiVo about their superior usability, this software update fails miserably.


----------



## sconi1

Here's my dilema:

In the Season Pass Manager, I noticed some programs have a yellow circle with one check while others have a purple circle with two checks...the ones with purple have the same show listed twice.

Also, when I was trying to check the scheduled recordings, the TiVo now seems to prompt conflicting shows that don't really conflict. For example:

I have Family Guy scheduled to tape on Sunday at 9pm. However, TiVo tells me it now conflicts with two shows I have scheduled on Thursday.....CSI at 9 pm and Supernatural at 9 pm. Under normal circumstances these two shows on Thursday tape at the same time because of the dual tuner.

Now I do have a TiVo Series 2 Dual Tuner and all of the main basic cable channels are clicked to record on both analog inputs if there is a conflict. I have never had these issues until the recent software upgrade. 

Very strange and frustrating. Anyone have any insight or answers? Has TiVo metnioned anything about it? Thanks!


----------



## WakkoME

This morning I got the 9.1 update and this is the bug I've noticed. I have some season passes where I have it record first run and repeats, but I don't want to watch all the repeats so I clear out the ones I don't want to watch from the To Do List screen. The problem I get is this: When I go into certain shows (not all of them), that I already have the season pass for, and it shows the new pretty purple double-check mark symbol, and I select "view upcoming episodes" when I highlight an episode, whether its set to record via season pass or not set to record at all, instead of the "view upcoming episodes" "cancel only this episode" and "modify season pass" options, I get "get a season pass" or "cancel this recording". (And these are all on the same channel, its not because its on a different channel like I would expect) Even when I go down the episode list and pick the episode that I used to get from the To Do List screen and selected view upcoming episodes from, it still shows the options like I don't have a season pass, yet shows the purple double-check mark symbol. Also, by going into the Season Pass screen and looking at the upcoming episodes, I get the same problem with the same shows, but no problems with the same others.

The "record as planned" option isn't a problem on any of the ones that it says its recording, and the "record this episode" isn't a problem on any of the ones it says it isn't recording, just all the options underneath that first option. The few season passes I've noticed the problems with is Good Eats on Food network, Little People Big World on TLC, A Haunting on Discovery and Everyday Food on a local PBS station. These are in positions 32, 40, 49 and 57 on my season pass list of 62 season passes

Also, I think it added back a season pass I had deleted less than a week ago for Chuck to the bottom of my season pass list, unless my boyfriend added it back on subconsciously because neither of us added it back on.


----------



## wmcbrine

bicker said:


> Yup, the point is that while TiVo folks monitor this site, they participate as they see fit here; they have no obligation with regard to anything posted here, while if you call tech support there is such an obligation.


That seems incredibly naive. If you call, you get to sit on hold, then talk to a know-nothing who'll get your information all wrong; and in the end, your ticket will most likely be closed without resolution.


----------



## usnret

Maybe dumb question but what exactly does the new purple circle with 2 check marks indicate??


----------



## HDTiVo

wmcbrine said:


> That seems incredibly naive. If you call, you get to sit on hold, then talk to a know-nothing who'll get your information all wrong; and in the end, your ticket will most likely be closed without resolution.


That's more realistic.

Why would TiVo send out this update now when they could have fixed bugs for another 4-6 weeks and still gotten HiDef Transfers launched in early to mid-Nov?

Back to the same old TiVo after an early Summer respite of a handful of decent news.


----------



## dwgsp

Add me to the list of folks experiencing MRV performance issues on their units (540s in my case) since the 9.1 update was installed. Specifically, displaying the "Now Playing" list from a remote unit is extremely slow. Both our our units are on our wired network, connected via a 10/100 switch.

My wife uses this feature several times a day, and she's pretty unhappy.

/Don


----------



## HDTiVo

wmcbrine said:


> That seems incredibly naive. If you call, you get to sit on hold, then talk to a know-nothing who'll get your information all wrong; and in the end, your ticket will most likely be closed without resolution.


That's more realistic.

Why would TiVo send out this update now when they could have fixed bugs for another 4-6 weeks and still gotten HiDef Transfers launched in early to mid-Nov? Imagine the cost of the extra support calls, the further erosion of confidence in TiVo's once good name for reliability, sub cancellations, etc. :shakeshead:

Back to the same old TiVo after an early Summer respite of a handful of decent news.


----------



## RoyK

The season pass list on one of my boxes has 8 passes set up. I just went in and added the 9th. After the "press select to continue" the writing on the screen disappeared and I'm left with just the animated green background ("TiVo" and "Programs" cycling back and forth at the top, the white box outline and the rotating gear and animated spiral slide.

Its been like that for seven minutes. The box is completely unresponsive to any keypresses on the remote. 

I finally gave up and rebooted (pulled the plug) after 10 min....


----------



## RoyK

usnret said:


> Maybe dumb question but what exactly does the new purple circle with 2 check marks indicate??


I THINK its a flag that the program was scheduled by a season pass. Would make sense (two checkmarks = multiple recordings?)


----------



## RoyK

dwgsp said:


> Add me to the list of folks experiencing MRV performance issues on their units (540s in my case) since the 9.1 update was installed. Specifically, displaying the "Now Playing" list from a remote unit is extremely slow. Both our our units are on our wired network, connected via a 10/100 switch.
> 
> My wife uses this feature several times a day, and she's pretty unhappy.
> 
> /Don


Hmmm. Maybe your wife and mine are long-lost sisters. Mine isn't given to profanity but I've heard more than one expletive from her since the update.


----------



## vasilemj

RodEllison said:


> I have the EXACT same issue on both of my series2 boxes. Have widescreen TVs, and tried every combination of the TVs aspect with either of the Tivos aspects 4:3 or 16:9. No matter what, it forces the widescreen into a 4:3 box...so its stretched horizontally, black bars on both top and bottom... Didn't do this prior to 9.1...


Nice to know that someone else is feeling my pain. I like to record HD OTA feeds to my computer and then process them for viewing on my TiVo. This update has really screwed things up for me.


----------



## mrjam2jab

and it still doesnt leave the stuff on the PC in the folders i put them in....

I have 33 eps of a kid's show...and 38 eps of one of my shows...all of which take up space on NPL of PC...

guess i gotta move them to a folder outside of MY Tivo...


----------



## Testpattern

We returned from vacation day before yesterday to find TiVo updated with 9.1. I initially thought "great" but not for long. 

Went to view trip pictures downloaded from our trip to the computer via Desktop. After several hours of trying to connect TiVo and our PC I was finally able to get pictures to transfer... at an incredibly slow speed. So slow it was impractical to use. Never was able to find our audio files. Both pictures and audio via DeskTop had not been an issue prior to the 9.1. Currently Desktop operation is so poor and limited we're actually thinking of removing the program.

Viewing television over the past two nights reviewed another "new trait". At first I thought we were just seeing some pixel blocking from some weak cable feeds. Not a common issue with Cox but it has occurred. Checked the signal strength and it was superb at 96 - 98.

Watching the video more closely I noticed it wasn't your typical pixelization. The picture would freeze for a fraction of a second and then speed forward to catch up sometimes producing a burst of pixel blocks. This was occurring on several channels including Discovery and National Geographic which are normally rock solid. This is definitely something never observed prior to the 9.1 update.

This really frost me. We were completely satisfied with the prior revision and now I have this crap to deal with.

Has anyone ever been successful at forcing TiVo to revert a revision change to the prior version?


----------



## RoyK

Testpattern said:


> ........
> Has anyone ever been successful at forcing TiVo to revert a revision change to the prior version?


No, at least not in the past few years


----------



## Soapm

bicker said:


> Yes. Call TiVo directly.


I called and got a lot of apologies but didn't leave with the impression they cared or would report my problems to anyone who could really look into them.

Unfortunately they have everyone in a contract so it's not like you can leave if you suddenly dis-like the service. I agree with others, they need a place on their website site to report anomolies and make suggestions. This would give the user a feeling of belonging to a family where your voice, personal experience and satisfaction (within reason) matters.


----------



## bicker

wmcbrine said:


> That seems incredibly naive.


Quite the opposite. If TiVo wanted its staff to be obligated wrt online communications, then they'd provide that capability on their own website. Indeed, it is naive to believe that our desire to have a direct line to the "gods" makes it so.


----------



## drron

Standalone Series 2 user connected tivo to network via wireless. Extensive user of Tivo2Go to transfer programs to my computer. Everything working great until the 9.1 update. After the update, my computer wireless suddenly cuts out when I'm using transferring programs. Not only do the files stop transferring, the wireless connection for my computer is suddenly gone and has to be "repaired" via windows to get back on the network. It could be a bizarre coincidence that the wireless adaptor for the computer is getting bad, but 1) It never happened until today 2) It only cuts off when I'm transferring files. It especially stinks today because I needed to transfer a ton of programs off my Tivo since I'm replacing the hard drive this weekend. Any thoughts or workarounds?


----------



## Drew47

After the 9.1 Upgrade, I find that the channels have changed on some of my Season pass programs. For instance, Desperate Housewives set to record on channel 7 was showing as now trying to record on channel 246 and saying will not record. Channel 246 was a Dish Network Local Network channel I had about a year ago and had deleted that season pass when dish changed channel numbers. Also had Judge Judy on channel 2 and that was coming up with Channel 242. Deleted both passes and re submitted but wondering how it found those channel numbers?


----------



## wgw

Where they scheduled online by any chance? I've always had season passes that were scheduled on-line trying to come back to life. I quit using the online scheduler because of it.


----------



## fred2

wgw said:


> Where they scheduled online by any chance? I've always had season passes that were scheduled on-line trying to come back to life. I quit using the online scheduler because of it.


Hmmm. I have rarely attempted to schedule anything ONLINE. But just the other day I did. I scheduled a Season Pass. The odd thing - It recorded each day for 4 days but the ToDo List/History kept showing that "someone in your household has cancelled...." or similar message for each day's recording. I was going to post about it but did not bother until now.


----------



## DaveLessnau

Browsing through lists within the program description screen is even worse than I thought. Its BEST behavior is in things like Browse by Time or Browse by Channel. Today, I tried browsing through Sci-Fi shows (Find Program | Search by Title | Sci-Fi and Fantasy | Don't specify a subcategory | 0 (to start at the top of the list) | Right-arrow into the top show's program listing). Using the Channel/Page Down button to scroll through the list results in random pauses of up to 5 seconds. In Browse by Time/Channel, you page through groups of 8 listing with a 3 second blank pause at the end of each 8. Here, the pauses don't follow that rule of 8. They're entirely inconsistent in when they appear (I even had them happen after each listing). Plus, the pause is even longer.


----------



## Soapm

I have a 649 DT and I am in reboot city since 9.1. Today I was trying to create wishlist and everytime it goes to save my entries, reboot! I got tired of that so I went into my to do list to geti rid of stuff I don't want, each time I removed something from my to do list, reboot... And I mean everytime as in I can no longer purge my to do list which is my sunday ritual...

This really sucks.


----------



## scottb

See the threads here:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=368914

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=362661

Tivo Support was no help in the matter.

scottb


----------



## jimnoblett

jtown0620 said:


> I have 2 DT and I received the update last night. Now, every once in a while, the screen goes crazy! Just a rainbow of colors and very distorted but the sound is perfect. I pressed the TiVo button on the remote and returned to live tv to find the picture corrected. This has happened on both TiVos! Has anyone else encountered this?


My wife says this happens on our 4 month old S2DT every morning. She has to reset the box to clear it though. After that the picture is fine the rest of the day.


----------



## Iluvatar

> Originally Posted by jtown0620
> I have 2 DT and I received the update last night. Now, every once in a while, the screen goes crazy! Just a rainbow of colors and very distorted but the sound is perfect. I pressed the TiVo button on the remote and returned to live tv to find the picture corrected. This has happened on both TiVos! Has anyone else encountered this?


this started happening on my 649DT also. Screen will go crazy red and green for about 5 seconds while watching something and if I rewind to see if it was in the analog feed, it is gone. It happens maybe every other day.


----------



## StuffOfInterest

On a S2DT two suggestion programs are recording, one from direct cable and one from the cable box. If the recording from the direct cable ends or is canceled, the cable box is reset to channel 01. This doesn't end the recording from the cable box, it just changes the channel right in the middle of the recording. I've seen this occur several times now and it appears to be a consistent behavior. I haven't seen if it occurs when it is a scheduled recording (rather than suggestion) on the cable box channel.


----------



## usnret

> Testpattern
> Watching the video more closely I noticed it wasn't your typical pixelization. The picture would freeze for a fraction of a second and then speed forward to catch up sometimes producing a burst of pixel blocks. This was occurring on several channels including Discovery and National Geographic which are normally rock solid. This is definitely something never observed prior to the 9.1 update.


I am experiencing the same thing on my DT. I thought that it might be the hard drive acting up.


----------



## Lennie

ScottNY845 said:


> Anyone else notice that when viewing your pics from the computer under the MUSIC, PHOTOS, & MORE and you see your COMPUTER within that list...
> 
> Well before the update when viewing the pics, the quality was fantastic, and the pic was auto-sized to fit the screen. Now with the update the pics look like you are viewing them as if in a CIRCUS MIRROR that makes you look short and fat and distorted...unless you really are short and fat...
> 
> This feature was perfect before the update...anyone else having this issue?


Same problem here. Worked perfectly before the update, now viewing pictures through the Tivo is worthless as the aspect ratio is all screwed up. Already tried changing the aspect ratio from 16:9 to 4:3 a couple times and re-booted and it didn't make a difference. Major problem for us, hope they address it soon.


----------



## hp4atc

Any partial shows that were transferred from one tivo to another prior to the Fall update 9.1 are in the Now Playing list but will not play when selected.

"The tivo DVR was not able to record this program because there was no video signal on the channel. You may have been trying to record on a channel that you don't receive."

These are snippets that were transferred and watched many times before the 9.1 update. 

Partial shows transferred after 9.1 play back fine---so far. 

We have HUNDREDS of these snippets that were saved for archiving. Losing them is ABSOLUTELY unacceptable. 

Secondly, we did not put our name on the priority list. Why would we get the update on all 5 of our S2 tivos prior to some who asked for it?


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## RoyK

.....
I then selected the program again and selected "Delete Now". It went back to the NPL. The program was still there. Again went in and selected "Delete Now". Again the program failed to delete. I repeated this 3 more times because I didn't quite believe it was happening. Finally I got rid of it with the "Clear" button.

This is NOT a repeatable bug. I've deleted many programs using the menu since 9.1 with no problem.

........

Update - while not repeatable this bug is occurring very frequently - I'd estimate 10-15% of the time. Never had this happen before 9.1


----------



## ackurv

m_jonis, I am experiencing the same issue. How did you resolve it? Every day when I come home from work, I have to restart my Tivo.


----------



## mrjam2jab

RoyK said:


> This happened to me yesterday and it just happened again. We were watching a program as it was recording. We finished watching before the recording completed so I went into the NPL, selected the program and told it to stop recording, which it did.
> 
> I then selected the program again and selected "Delete Now". It went back to the NPL. The program was still there. Again went in and selected "Delete Now". Again the program failed to delete. I repeated this 3 more times because I didn't quite believe it was happening. Finally I got rid of it with the "Clear" button.
> 
> This is NOT a repeatable bug. I've deleted many programs using the menu since 9.1 with no problem.
> 
> EDIT: Before you jump all over me and tell me to use the Clear button I never programmed it on my Harmony remote. (Wife uses the regular remote). I just kinda got used to "Delete Now" ummm Deleting Now.


I've had this same thing happen to me several time BEFORE the 9.1 update...i have not noticed any kind of pattern to it any time that it has happened...show, source, etc...

although..i have noticed that if i try to delete something while transferring from PC it will delete the transfer. ... but again not ALL the time...


----------



## RoyK

I'll take your word for it although I'd never seen it in several years of TiVo use before yesterday. Still it IS a bug in 9.1. I admit it will probably be a tough one to track down though.


----------



## Ruth

I've noticed that when I delete the last listed program in a full folder, I initially get the "this group is empty and no longer needed" message. I have to back out to Now Playing and then go into the folder again to see the other shows in there. Not dealbreaking, but a little irritating. 

I've also noticed some overall slowness.

And I had one incident of the crazy-blurry-colors everywhere thing, but then when I instant-repayed the video was clear again and I couldn't get it to repeat.


----------



## HDTiVo

RoyK said:


> I'll take your word for it although I'd never seen it in several years of TiVo use before yesterday. Still it IS a bug in 9.1. I admit it will probably be a tough one to track down though.


I've also had "unstoppable" recordings. In my case, I could not get it to stop recording from the NPL menu. I managed to stop it by going to ToDo and cancel recording there. Don't think I've had trouble deleting.


----------



## MultimediaJones

hp4atc said:


> Any partial shows that were transferred from one tivo to another prior to the Fall update 9.1 are in the Now Playing list but will not play when selected. These are snippets that were transferred and watched many times before the 9.1 update.


This was mentioned earlier in the thread and I'd touched on it in an earlier thread about 9.1. You aren't alone. Experimenting with new partial recordings and comparing their info to old partial recordings, here's what I've noticed:

MRV transfers from before 9.1, whether full or partial, show the recording quality they were originally recorded at. If partial, they show "(Partial)" after the duration. Only full transfer shows will play now. Post-9.1 MRV transfers, whether full or partial, show being "uknown" quality, but play fine. "Duration" shows only the length of the clip on a partial transfer, without the "partial" marker.

So the fact that complete pre-9.1 transfers play confirms that 9.1 can still read whatever format they were transfered in, even though it may differ from 9.1. The difference in the partial indicator indicates some change in behavior, although there may be no way for us to tell if that's directly related to the problem. It is likely that TiVo just didn't test partial MRV recordings. While someone who hadn't finished watching one partial show might be frustrated, I doubt TiVo anticipated people keeping collections using them, though the way MRV works certainly permits doing so.

Trying to transfer such partials back to another TiVo fails much as playback does, and someone has already said they can't be downloaded via the http interface. It will be interesting as 9.1 becomes more widespread how many more people appear that have this problem. Oh, and TiVo randomly sends software updates to some units early, to catch major problems before they get rolled to massive numbers of units.

Different subject: Am I the only one who has noticed that button presses are much more likely to get 'eaten' now? As the interface slowed in 8.x, I got used to getting a button press or two ahead and the TiVo would catch up with me in a few seconds. Now any subsequent presses are ignored. It wouldn't be an issue if responses in lists for example were instant, but interface slowness and eating keypresses together is the pits. Add to that the Wish List now also "losing its place" when returning from viewing items on a given list, and it makes me sad that we've had to trade a flawless GUI experience for new features.


----------



## RoyK

Another one. Watching a recorded program. When the program ends the image freezes for a couple of seconds then the screen turns solid black. I let it set for at least three minutes. No change. Solid black screen - no text, no image.

Pressing the left button brought up the Delete Screen on the still solid black background. Selected "Delete" and got back to the normal Now Playing screen.

I repeated this one after watching another program.


----------



## pldoolittle

RoyK said:


> I THINK its a flag that the program was scheduled by a season pass. Would make sense (two checkmarks = multiple recordings?)


It's one check = manual, two = season pass.


----------



## RoyK

Situation: You initiate a MRV transfer then select the "Start Playing" option to watch as it transfers. The program ends. If you then Fast Forward over the commercials to the end of the buffer the "Transferring more of the program. Please wait a moment then press PLAY" notification comes up - even though the transfer operation has long been completed (Transfers occur faster than real time) and there isn't anything to transfer!


----------



## beach6412

I read through this entire thread and don't recall seeing this one mentioned: some of our old wishlists, especially any that used asterisks and quotes together, are no longer producing results. When I delete and recreate them in the new system, they start finding programs again.

Series 2, 540


----------



## ort

My TiVos are now totally borked up.

Browsing my other unit via multi-room or whatever it's called moves at a glacial pace. When I choose a file to transfer, it does not seem to do anything at all.

When attempting to delete a show from my now playing list, it doesn't do anything. It returns to the main screen and the show is still there. Hitting the clear button removes them though.

There are also a million other things going on. It's super sluggish and just feels "off".

What is going on? How does an update turn my fully functional and snappy TiVos into glitchy pieces of garbage?

How did this happen?


----------



## aine

beach6412 said:


> some of our old wishlists, especially any that used asterisks and quotes together, are no longer producing results.


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=369103

Quotes and Ampersands are definitely not rendered correctly, and some are reporting that recordings are being missed.


----------



## westside_guy

ort said:


> Browsing my other unit via multi-room or whatever it's called moves at a glacial pace.


Ditto this. SERIOUSLY glacial - I browse to the other Tivo and all I get is a blank screen for 15-20 seconds. Then the shows appear. But when I go up/down to the next page (still on the remote Tivo), for roughly 5 seconds I see just the top show on the page before the rest of the page fills in. It's totally ridiculous.

I'm wondering what new adware this "fall update" brings us. They must've spent all the beta test efforts on that stuff - it certainly wasn't on the user interface...


----------



## westside_guy

aine said:


> ... some are reporting that recordings are being missed.


Hey I thought Comcast licensed Tivo's software, not the other way around...


----------



## HDTiVo

westside_guy said:


> Hey I thought Comcast licensed Tivo's software, not the other way around...


 

Maybe a case of being known by the _company _ you keep. HEHEHEHE


----------



## flip123

ort said:


> When attempting to delete a show from my now playing list, it doesn't do anything. It returns to the main screen and the show is still there. Hitting the clear button removes them though.


This happened to me too last night.


----------



## MickeS

OK, here's a BIG bug for me. Really, this pisses me off more than anything else.

After transferring a 16:9 video to the Series 2, it no longer shows the correct aspect ratio!

No matter what I set the TV Aspect Ratio setting to on the TiVo (I have a widescreen TV), it LETTERBOXES a 16:9 video (tried it with two videos), so that the picture gets sqeezed with black bars on top and bottom.

I used the Series 2 currently exclusively for my son's shows and to watch videos from the PC on the TiVo. This is really, really irritating. And not a good sign if they're about to turn on MRV/TTG/TTCB for Series 3.

What the hell are they doing...


----------



## klia

Quotes and Ampersands are definitely not rendered correctly, and some are reporting that recordings are being missed.[/QUOTE]

I tried making a new WL with quotes, and I can't even make quotes, anymore. Pressing the pause button no longer creates quotes, or any other character.


----------



## klia

WebG said:


> I will agree that this is a MAJOR usability issue but not that it's a "serious bug". For all the raves we've given TiVo about their superior usability, this software update fails miserably.


I don't think it's a bug at all, because I've noticed all sorts of similar things with this update, like defaulting/resetting to the beginnings of lists/schedules after completing an action (deleting something off TDL, checking an individual WL, checking schedules by channel, changing scheduled deletion date on NPL). I think TiVo thinks these are improvements, but frankly, all the extra paging, and fumbling around trying to figure out where the heck you are, is extremely frustrating. Until now, I'd never in my life gotten so fed up with a TiVo bug that I basically gave up trying to do something.

Bad UI designers/programmers!


----------



## DaveLessnau

You don't need quotes in the Wishlists any more. Whatever set of strings you enter into one keyword spot is treated as quoted. If you want to AND, OR, or NOT some keywords, you'd enter individual ones.


----------



## Stu_Bee

Probably not considered a bug.....but since we are on the subject of wishlists.....

I see the "HD" designation in the guide data....so why doesn't Tivo let us Series2 owners find shows using "HD" as a keyword in wishlists. bah.


----------



## RoyK

Gee I thought I'd be able to go a whole day without finding another bug. No such luck.
Just went into find programs/Download TV & Movies. Got black screen with Please Wait message so I waited -- and waited -- and waited at least three minutes. The only way I could recover was pressing the live tv button on the remote.

Yes the internet was fine - I'd just Been in the Music, Photos, Products, & More menu which populated with all the normal stuff.


----------



## HDTiVo

Stu_Bee said:


> Probably not considered a bug.....but since we are on the subject of wishlists.....
> 
> I see the "HD" designation in the guide data....so why doesn't Tivo let us Series2 owners find shows using "HD" as a keyword in wishlists. bah.


TiVo has determined you don't need that. Don't buck TiVo.


----------



## ort

I am currently unable to transfer shows between my TiVos. Setting them to transfer does nothing at all. It acts like it should be copying, and gives me an option to cancel the transfer, but nothing shows up on the other TiVo. Ever.

This isn't a bug. It's a freaking 400 lbs. Scorpion. What is going on with this? Seriously?


----------



## Digger

Another MRV issue: unit won't receive a MRV recording because it thinks one is still transferring 

Let me add my voice to MRV issues. Firstly, browsing the recorded shows on a remote unit is painfully slow. Secondly, my units will only transfer one show. For example: Setup a transfer from unit a to unit b. The first recording transferred from unit a to unit b transfers fine. Setup a second transfer from unit a to unit b and it never shows up. If I check the todo list on unit b, the recording to be transferred is listed as pending waiting for a prior transfer to finish. Unfortunately, nothing is waiting to finish. If I reboot unit b, the program will transfer. I have a recording that had been pending transfer for 2 days. Reboot and it transferred fine. 

2 x model 240's 
hardwired Ethernet 
9.1 software


----------



## WebG

klia said:


> I don't think it's a bug at all, because I've noticed all sorts of similar things with this update, like defaulting/resetting to the beginnings of lists/schedules after completing an action (deleting something off TDL, checking an individual WL, checking schedules by channel, changing scheduled deletion date on NPL). I think TiVo thinks these are improvements, but frankly, all the extra paging, and fumbling around trying to figure out where the heck you are, is extremely frustrating. Until now, I'd never in my life gotten so fed up with a TiVo bug that I basically gave up trying to do something.
> 
> Bad UI designers/programmers!


When all I want to do is scroll through (let's say) what ABC, FOX, NBC, CBS are airing from 8p - 11p next Thursday... what I used to be able to do in 9 clicks now takes me at least 24 clicks. Now do that for each day you're scrolling through the schedule looking for conflicts or other things that might catch your eye and you can see it's an issue. ("use the grid" you say? almost worse, as the grid won't show you 8p-11p on one screen, and it doesn't easily show you what is already marked for recording)


----------



## MickeS

I found another bug, related to the one I mentioned above:
A file that's transfered from a PC to a TiVo only shows the time in seconds, not in minutes. I had an old file on the TiVo, and it shows the time in minutes. After transfering the same file again, using 9.1, it only shows seconds.

I really hope these bugs have to do with TTG and will be fixed when the new TTG for Series 3 is activated...


----------



## HDTiVo

MickeS said:


> I found another bug, related to the one I mentioned above:
> A file that's transfered from a PC to a TiVo only shows the time in seconds, not in minutes. I had an old file on the TiVo, and it shows the time in minutes. After transfering the same file again, using 9.1, it only shows seconds.
> 
> I really hope these bugs have to do with TTG and will be fixed when the new TTG for Series 3 is activated...


That bug started in the last version, or the one before. I bet you thought you didn't have that bug a couple months ago. 

Also, as part of that bug, the number of seconds at the end point of the progress bar is always a multiple of 60. Try watching a 133 sec video and seeing the progress bar to 180 and then of course the videos ends at 133.

And I remember some funky stuff with a short video having the progress bar end at 0 sec, or one slightly over a minute mark being longer than the progress bar which still stops at 60X the prior minute.


----------



## MickeS

HDTiVo said:


> That bug started in the last version, or the one before. I bet you thought you didn't have that bug a couple months ago.


It only used to happen to me if I played the file back while it was still transferring. After transfer, it would show minutes again.

For some reason, the old 8.3-version transfer file still shows minutes.


----------



## choccy

Ruth said:


> I've noticed that when I delete the last listed program in a full folder, I initially get the "this group is empty and no longer needed" message. I have to back out to Now Playing and then go into the folder again to see the other shows in there. Not dealbreaking, but a little irritating.


Just got the update Monday, and just had this happen too. Went to delete an old episode of Heroes and the entire group was empty  Going out and back in to the group 'fixed' it.. this on a nightlite S2.5.


----------



## bicker

RoyK said:


> Just went into find programs/Download TV & Movies. Got black screen with Please Wait message so I waited -- and waited -- and waited at least three minutes. The only way I could recover was pressing the live tv button on the remote.


I've had that happen to me before, before 9.1.


----------



## DaveLessnau

klia said:


> I don't think it's a bug at all, because I've noticed all sorts of similar things with this update, like defaulting/resetting to the beginnings of lists/schedules after completing an action (deleting something off TDL, checking an individual WL, checking schedules by channel, changing scheduled deletion date on NPL). I think TiVo thinks these are improvements, but frankly, all the extra paging, and fumbling around trying to figure out where the heck you are, is extremely frustrating. Until now, I'd never in my life gotten so fed up with a TiVo bug that I basically gave up trying to do something.
> 
> Bad UI designers/programmers!


Definitely bugs. The slowness in browsing lists, I'd guess to be from lack of indexing on appropriate fields. Also, they don't seem to populate the lists in the background. The non-remembering of list positioning seems to be a developing problem. Over the last couple of releases, this has shown up in different places. I think TiVo is trying to have one re-usable list processing routine, and they messed it up. They seem to be saving only part of the list state when they transition to a new state. Specifically, they seem to save the offset within a page of items, but they're not saving what page they're on. When they return to the original list, it ends up back on the first page with the proper offset highlighted (just the wrong page). And, since this a re-used object/module, the behavior comes up everywhere. I just don't understand why they didn't fix the problems with this before they standardized on it. People have been complaining about this behavior in some lists for two releases.

And, like you, I've had to give up doing things on my TiVo that are central to my watching television. Because of these bugs, I've lost core capabilities and TiVo has provided nothing to replace them. With 9.1, I just can't do important things anymore. Inconceivable.


----------



## RoyK

bicker said:


> I've had that happen to me before, before 9.1.


It is no less a bug in 9.1 just because it might not be a new one.


----------



## bicker

Agreed... my point was only that it is a long-standing issue, and seems to me to be more a lack of robustness rather than a logic error... important distinctions with regard to pursuing a fix.


----------



## RoyK

bicker said:


> Agreed... my point was only that it is a long-standing issue, and seems to me to be more a lack of robustness rather than a logic error... important distinctions with regard to pursuing a fix.


Agreed...


----------



## Y-ASK

Anybody actually call Tivo about the problems they are having? You need to flood Tivo with calls about what you think about this update if want to get anything fixed.

Y-ASK

As usual Tivo personnel are silent about the topic...


----------



## RoyK

Y-ASK said:


> Anybody actually call Tivo about the problems they are having? You need to flood Tivo with calls about what you think about this update if want to get anything fixed.


Yes - with the usual results - interminable hold times, proclaimed ignorance of any problem - summary disconnect.



Y-ASK said:


> As usual Tivo personnel are silent about the topic...


I'd be silent too.


----------



## ZeoTiVo

RoyK said:


> Thanks for the input Zeo.
> 
> I think the difference between your experience and mine may be our equipment. I've made a lot of observations in the last few days and I'm now pretty sure I know what's going on.
> 
> 4. Attempts to transfer a program to a third box from a box already in the process of transferring a program to another result in an error saying that the source box was unavailable or could not be found.
> 
> I believe what is happening is that at least with my hardware the resources needed to transfer a file at the higher speed with whatever the new protocol is are taxed to the point that responses to requests to transfer a second file are delayed just long enough to cause a timeout to occur thereby resulting in the box unavailable or not found error.
> 
> The solution may be as simple as increasing the timeout time.


I agree with your analysis that what you are seeing on your DVRs is a resource/timeout issue.

Not sure why you are seeing that though. In my test I used a 240, DT and SD H400 model. The SD H400 is basically a 240 model with a DVD drive added.

I did not experience long delays on the DVRs specific NPL and just the ususal short 2 or 3 second delays on displaying a different DVRs NPL to do MRV. Right after 9.1 installed I had some of the "can not transfer, file not found" timeouts but that cleared up within a couple of hours and I tried my multi MRV test about 6 hours after 9.1 was actually installed.

I am curious if your MRV has gotten any better over time?

total speculation part of the post
Do the DVRs work alright otherwise? Are all the problems showing up in network related DVR functions?
Maybe TiVo is doing something different with MTU or frame rate, etc.. that your brand of router is having trouble with?
Something else in your network that is blowing the communication between DVRs?


----------



## RoyK

9.1 Bug d'jour - MRV

Last night my wife went to her bedroom and started a transfer from one of our other SD-H400s. We had watched the first 25 minutes or so of a one hour show. She selected The transfer from paused point option.

She then went to NPL and watched a couple of programs that were recorded on her machine. After that she started to watch the program she had transferred. She noticed that the blue dot indicator that the program was transferring was still on - after an hour!

The show played for about 5 seconds then froze. She went back to NPL and tried to delete the program. The TiVo hung up with a "Please Wait" Since I was already asleep she waited until this morning to tell me about the problem. The box was still hung up - completely unresponsive to any remote or front panel command. 

I pulled the plug and rebooted. The program was there in the NPL IN ITS ENTIRETY - ALL ONE HOUR not the 35 minutes or so remaining from the paused point.

I was able to delete it.


Edit: Subsequent attempts to transfer any program from the machine she was transferring from last night to any other machine gave an error report saying the machine was unavailable or could not be found. Obviously absurd since the machine must be there in order to navigate into its NPL to initiate a transfer!
Rebooting THAT machine fixed the problem.

This is NOT under the same set of circumstances as one of my earlier posts where another transfer was already underway.


----------



## ZeoTiVo

Y-ASK said:


> Anybody actually call Tivo about the problems they are having? You need to flood Tivo with calls about what you think about this update if want to get anything fixed.
> 
> Y-ASK
> 
> As usual Tivo personnel are silent about the topic...


a lot of the things listed here are performance problems related to specific TiVo boxes of the owners. There are some concrete ones of course, such as the highlight not returning to the right place on a list when returning but basically if a TiVo rep came in here he would be doing individual case work in no time 

Most companies remain publicly quiet about their bugs as speaking to them would just add more fuel to the fire versus any productive public discourse.

that being said - yes -calling TiVo and opening personal case numbers will move getting a bug fixed higher up the priority list, especially if the CSR is made to add comments such as "I no longer can use my TiVo to do what I think is a central task because I have to scroll around in the list too much"


----------



## MickeS

RoyK said:


> Yes - with the usual results - interminable hold times, proclaimed ignorance of any problem - summary disconnect.


That's why I haven't called, but I think I'll give it a shot today.

The sad thing though is that I can almost guarantee that the majority of these bugs are well known by the developers, but to meet some deadline they pushed this release out anyway. Maybe the Rhapsody deal needed it?


----------



## RoyK

MickeS said:


> That's why I haven't called, but I think I'll give it a shot today.
> 
> The sad thing though is that I can almost guarantee that the majority of these bugs are well known by the developers, but to meet some deadline they pushed this release out anyway. Maybe the Rhapsody deal needed it?


Possibly the reason is Rhapsody but I doubt it. I expect that the reason is the commitment that they made to have MRV working with S3 units in November.


----------



## bicker

ZeoTiVo said:


> Most companies remain publicly quiet about their bugs as speaking to them would just add more fuel to the fire versus any productive public discourse.


 :up: :up:


----------



## HDTiVo

RoyK said:


> I'd be silent too.


I thought it interesting that they didn't come to crow about Rhapsody. They must really be in the bunker on this.


----------



## bicker

Or maybe they're getting the message that they really should be communicating better to customers via their website?


----------



## HDTiVo

MickeS said:


> That's why I haven't called, but I think I'll give it a shot today.
> 
> The sad thing though is that I can almost guarantee that the majority of these bugs are well known by the developers, but to meet some deadline they pushed this release out anyway. Maybe the Rhapsody deal needed it?


How about calling and saying 'I want to cancel my sub.' Reason: '9.1 has so many bugs.' Let customer retention 'talk' you into staying after you've given some detail about the problems. Bet that'll get some closer attention paid, especially if they talk you into a credit of some kind. 

One of the things that really freaks TiVo out is churn. I'll bet customer retention feedback has a real priority in the organization.


----------



## SnakeEyes

Got the update for my TiVo HD today and manually rebooted to install the update sooner and see what happens. First thing I did was go watch a recorded show and got the no video, only gray screen, and all my menus have a gray background glitch. Only way to fix this of course is to reboot. So far I haven't seen the glitch again. Connecting via component video


----------



## HDTiVo

bicker said:


> Or maybe they're getting the message that they really should be communicating better to customers via their website?


If they've interpreted the message to mean communicate better at Co Website and drop communication elsewhere, that's not a good thing. More communication overall, not redistributed communication to a closed venue.

As to *keeping quite to avoid fueling a fire. That is completely the wrong approach*. Only the incompetent do that. Genuine and frank statements quiet down the the public as they wait for a fix to what the company has expressed awareness and importance of.


----------



## HDTiVo

RoyK said:


> Possibly the reason is Rhapsody but I doubt it. I expect that the reason is the commitment that they made to have MRV working with S3 units in November.


My big thing with that is that delaying rollout 4-6 weeks to do more testing/fixing would have had this in people's hands anyway by early to mid Nov.


----------



## HDTiVo

DaveLessnau said:


> Definitely bugs. The slowness in browsing lists, I'd guess to be from lack of indexing on appropriate fields. Also, they don't seem to populate the lists in the background. The non-remembering of list positioning seems to be a developing problem. Over the last couple of releases, this has shown up in different places. I think TiVo is trying to have one re-usable list processing routine, and they messed it up. They seem to be saving only part of the list state when they transition to a new state. Specifically, they seem to save the offset within a page of items, but they're not saving what page they're on. When they return to the original list, it ends up back on the first page with the proper offset highlighted (just the wrong page). And, since this a re-used object/module, the behavior comes up everywhere. I just don't understand why they didn't fix the problems with this before they standardized on it. People have been complaining about this behavior in some lists for two releases.
> 
> And, like you, I've had to give up doing things on my TiVo that are central to my watching television. Because of these bugs, I've lost core capabilities and TiVo has provided nothing to replace them. With 9.1, I just can't do important things anymore. Inconceivable.


Your theories are interesting. This list thing is very elementary.


----------



## vasilemj

MickeS said:


> OK, here's a BIG bug for me. Really, this pisses me off more than anything else.
> 
> After transferring a 16:9 video to the Series 2, it no longer shows the correct aspect ratio!
> 
> No matter what I set the TV Aspect Ratio setting to on the TiVo (I have a widescreen TV), it LETTERBOXES a 16:9 video (tried it with two videos), so that the picture gets sqeezed with black bars on top and bottom.
> 
> I used the Series 2 currently exclusively for my son's shows and to watch videos from the PC on the TiVo. This is really, really irritating. And not a good sign if they're about to turn on MRV/TTG/TTCB for Series 3.
> 
> What the hell are they doing...


Welcome to my world. I've got the same problem as do a few others who have posted to this thread. I noticed this right after the update....tried to move a 16:9 show to TiVo and the aspect ratio was all messed up. Changed my setting on TiVo to 4:3 and then back to 16:9 with no luck. And it's not just on new shows that you transfer. Any old 16:9 recordings that you transfer have this problem as well. TiVo seems to be forcing the widescreen into a 4:3 box

TiVo, get your act together.....you really blew it on this release.


----------



## ZombiE

RoyK said:


> Possibly the reason is Rhapsody but I doubt it. I expect that the reason is the commitment that they made to have MRV working with S3 units in November.





HDTiVo said:


> My big thing with that is that delaying rollout 4-6 weeks to do more testing/fixing would have had this in people's hands anyway by early to mid Nov.


Then they wouldn't have had 4-6 weeks of everyone testing out their software for them, now would they?  Every 'new' release of the Tivo software is getting worse. They are pushing crap out the door broke and not even fixing past issues.  The problems are starting to add up to a very unusable Tivo experience. I'm more annoyed by this update because I use MRV and TTG a lot and they have totally screwed it up. GREAT JOB TIVO!!!! I guess we'll sit around and wait a month or two for a fix.............

Z


----------



## vasilemj

HDTiVo said:


> If they've interpreted the message to mean communicate better at Co Website and drop communication elsewhere, that's not a good thing. More communication overall, not redistributed communication to a closed venue.
> 
> As to *keeping quite to avoid fueling a fire. That is completely the wrong approach*. Only the incompetent do that. Genuine and frank statements quiet down the the public as they wait for a fix to what the company has expressed awareness and importance of.


The lack of a basic acknowledgement from TiVo employees who regularly frequent these boards is, in my opinion, completely arrogant and a slap in the face to their loyal customers. They know that their loyal customers regularly post to these boards and they know darn well that they can find the most loyal and tech-savvy of their customers right here.

To not even acknowledge such a huge mistake (and yes, TiVo, it was definitely a MISTAKE to release this update) is a complete and total insult.

To those of you who were not fortunate enough to get in on the "lifetime-subscription" plan, how do you feel about paying your monthly fee to a company that won't acknowledge they screwed up and have now handcuffed you in your ability to use your TiVo in the manner in which they have advertised?


----------



## MickeS

vasilemj said:


> Welcome to my world. I've got the same problem as do a few others who have posted to this thread. I noticed this right after the update....tried to move a 16:9 show to TiVo and the aspect ratio was all messed up. Changed my setting on TiVo to 4:3 and then back to 16:9 with no luck. And it's not just on new shows that you transfer. Any old 16:9 recordings that you transfer have this problem as well. TiVo seems to be forcing the widescreen into a 4:3 box


Ah, I just looked through the thread again and saw that you and someone else mentioned the same thing. Good we're not alone, I guess.


----------



## HDTiVo

vasilemj said:


> To those of you who were not fortunate enough to get in on the "lifetime-subscription" plan, how do you feel about paying your monthly fee to a company that won't acknowledge they screwed up and have now handcuffed you in your ability to use your TiVo in the manner in which they have advertised?


Please include the LTs - I have some of each BTW.

Just because someone paid their money all upfront doesn't make them any less deserving; it makes them more vulnerable because they can't cancel, etc. 



> arrogant and a slap in the face


This happens to be a long term corporate cultural issue. It becomes very apparent at times like this.


----------



## ZeoTiVo

HDTiVo said:


> As to *keeping quite to avoid fueling a fire. That is completely the wrong approach*. Only the incompetent do that. Genuine and frank statements quiet down the the public as they wait for a fix to what the company has expressed awareness and importance of.


Exactly why TiVo did come to the forums and talk about the pixellation issues and cable card issues on TiVo HD and I assume S3 back when. There was already a fire going that needed some calming waters.

now for the bugs in 9.1 - while annoying and possibly resulting in some lost custoemrs -they are not showstoppers and do not need the direct approach. Instead they just need to be working the priority list and getting these bugs knocked out.

perhaps the better anaolgy for 9.1 would be "setting a match to dry tinder"


----------



## bicker

HDTiVo said:


> How about calling and saying 'I want to cancel my sub.'


That may be the most compelling argument I've seen in favor of the new commitment-driven pricing model they've implemented.



HDTiVo said:


> If they've interpreted the message to mean communicate better at Co Website and drop communication elsewhere, that's not a good thing.


Not a good thing for us, but perhaps a good thing for them.



HDTiVo said:


> More communication overall, not redistributed communication to a closed venue.


That sure would be nice, but again, perhaps their best interests are served by acting more like a company and less like a college.



HDTiVo said:


> As to *keeping quite to avoid fueling a fire. That is completely the wrong approach*.


The wrong approach from our perspective, but perhaps a good thing from theirs.



HDTiVo said:


> Only the incompetent do that.


Or the intelligent.



HDTiVo said:


> Genuine and frank statements quiet down the the public as they wait for a fix to what the company has expressed awareness and importance of.


That's never been the case.


----------



## bicker

vasilemj said:


> The lack of a basic acknowledgement from TiVo employees who regularly frequent these boards is, in my opinion, completely arrogant and a slap in the face to their loyal customers.


By "loyal customers", are you referring to the customers suggesting that the best approach is to call to cancel subscriptions in order to exact some sort of retention discount?  Just kidding....

I'm not sure if it is arrogant or not, but the only way it would be a "slap in the face" is if the reader chooses to make it so. That's not something "they" do to "us" but something "we" do to "ourselves".



vasilemj said:


> To not even acknowledge such a huge mistake (and yes, TiVo, it was definitely a MISTAKE to release this update) is a complete and total insult.


I think what is a MISTAKE is to take things like this personally. We shouldn't feel insulted. Disappointed, perhaps, but not insulted.



vasilemj said:


> To those of you who were not fortunate enough to get in on the "lifetime-subscription" plan, how do you feel about paying your monthly fee to a company that won't acknowledge they screwed up and have now handcuffed you in your ability to use your TiVo in the manner in which they have advertised?


What does being a lifetime subscriber have to do with anything? Are lifetime subscribers second-class citizens in this realm?


----------



## Stu_Bee

Be nice if someone created a Bug/Wiki page for the current version of Tivo Software.

That way we see all the reported issues at a glance, rather than trodding thru the non-related comments (like this one). Any takers


----------



## bicker

I'd like to actually see TiVo maintain a web page showing bugs, including number of subscribers reporting the bug, and status (not confirmed, confirmed, accepted for fix, fixed, released). Pipe dream eh?


----------



## steve614

This thread brings back memories of the 8.1 release.
IIRC, Tivo kept quiet amidst all the 'bug' reports back then.


----------



## HDTiVo

ZeoTiVo said:


> Exactly why TiVo did come to the forums and talk about the pixellation issues and cable card issues on TiVo HD and I assume S3 back when. There was already a fire going that needed some calming waters.
> 
> now for the bugs in 9.1 - while annoying and possibly resulting in some lost custoemrs -they are not showstoppers and do not need the direct approach. Instead they just need to be working the priority list and getting these bugs knocked out.
> 
> perhaps the better anaolgy for 9.1 would be "setting a match to dry tinder"





bicker said:


> That may be the most compelling argument I've seen in favor of the new commitment-driven pricing model they've implemented.
> 
> Not a good thing for us, but perhaps a good thing for them.
> 
> That sure would be nice, but again, perhaps their best interests are served by acting more like a company and less like a college.
> 
> The wrong approach from our perspective, but perhaps a good thing from theirs.
> 
> Or the intelligent.
> 
> That's never been the case.


That's why TiVo is what it is today.

The alternative choices to the ones I advocate are the ones with much lower probability of benefiting TiVo.


----------



## ZeoTiVo

steve614 said:


> This thread brings back memories of the 8.1 release.
> IIRC, Tivo kept quiet amidst all the 'bug' reports back then.


yep and all the bad ones are gone now. Guess after they got through slapping us around they went and did some work versus doing some PR.

MRV was completetly overhauled and this is the first common base for S2 adn S3 and TiVo HD that came out. Issues are expected and most likley 9.1 will get followed up on just like 8.3 came along soon after 8.1.

Maybe TiVo should stop trying to keep their porduct line current and go back to the good old days of just have single tuner SD for years before the next change


----------



## Stu_Bee

ZeoTiVo said:


> just like 8.3 came along soon after 8.1.


Was that the bugs that rendered many models sluggish to non-responsive? Man, it took them a long time to release the fix for that. Recollection of issues now fixed always makes them seem less of an issue at the time.

Of course Tivo should go ahead with implementing new features...but obviously we'd all benefit from some Trials,Testing,feedback prior to the release.
Also a maintained bugs list, would at least make users feel like the issues will be addressed at some point....rather than these communication blackouts that seem to occur when new versions are released.


----------



## psyton

ZeoTiVo said:


> Maybe TiVo should stop trying to keep their porduct line current and go back to the good old days of just have single tuner SD for years before the next change


Or perhaps Tivo should just invest in a real QA department that actually does Quality Assurance and engineers that at least unit test their changes before releasing into the wild?


----------



## MickeS

ZeoTiVo said:


> yep and all the bad ones are gone now. Guess after they got through slapping us around they went and did some work versus doing some PR.


PR is work, just not done by the same people that do what you mean by doing work. 

I wonder if TiVos code right now is just so unwieldy and the retention so low that every little new feature is done by a new programmer, in a tangled web of old code, that just keeps getting touched up enough to work "right now"...


----------



## mrjam2jab

and another MRV "bug"...

I _still_ cant *PUSH* the programs between machines...


----------



## moyekj

Stu_Bee said:


> Be nice if someone created a Bug/Wiki page for the current version of Tivo Software.
> 
> That way we see all the reported issues at a glance, rather than trodding thru the non-related comments (like this one). Any takers


 At least a few of the bugs posted here are captured in this summary thread:
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=368411
If there are others confirmed bugs not already listed there let me know...


----------



## RoyK

psyton said:


> Or perhaps Tivo should just invest in a real QA department that actually does Quality Assurance and engineers that at least unit test their changes before releasing into the wild?


Heresy!!


----------



## RoyK

ZeoTiVo said:


> ....
> 
> Right after 9.1 installed I had some of the "can not transfer, file not found" timeouts but that cleared up within a couple of hours and I tried my multi MRV test about 6 hours after 9.1 was actually installed.


My errors are of box isn't there variety -- not file not found. Obviously not true since I had just navigated to the box's NPL to request the file transfer.



ZeoTiVo said:


> I am curious if your MRV has gotten any better over time?


No. Still having the same problems and it is 100% repeatable. Can't transfer from a box that is already transferring to another box. MRV NPL interactions and repopulation are EXTREMELY slow .


ZeoTiVo said:


> total speculation part of the post
> Do the DVRs work alright otherwise? Are all the problems showing up in network related DVR functions?


No, since 9.1 there are many UI related problems that I have mentioned in this thread that are not network related. However they do record and play back just fine.


ZeoTiVo said:


> Maybe TiVo is doing something different with MTU or frame rate, etc.. that your brand of router is having trouble with?
> Something else in your network that is blowing the communication between DVRs?


The router is a Linksys WRT54G - very commonly used router. The only other things on the network are two PCs. Both of these PCs go to standby when not being used and were on standby when the problems first occurred. However subsequent testing shows that it makes no difference whether the PCs are in standby or active.

I also have an 8 port switch that I connected all three boxes to in order to troubleshoot the problem. The boxes were the only things on the switch. The problem was exactly the same with that switch.

BTW I use non-conflicting static IP on everything.

MRV was flawless prior to the day 9.1 was loaded to all three boxes.


----------



## etsolow

Since my S3 got upgraded I've had the same problem twice now: I power up my system and find the S3 in an unresponsive state. It's not locked up or anything, it's playing whatever channel it happens to be tuned to, but it won't respond to any remote control commands or presses of front panel buttons. All I can do is cut power and reboot.

That's getting old pretty fast!


----------



## HDTiVo

Stu_Bee said:


> Was that the bugs that rendered many models sluggish to non-responsive? Man, it took them a long time to release the fix for that. Recollection of issues now fixed always makes them seem less of an issue at the time.
> 
> Of course Tivo should go ahead with implementing new features...but obviously we'd all benefit from some Trials,Testing,feedback prior to the release.
> Also a maintained bugs list, would at least make users feel like the issues will be addressed at some point....rather than these communication blackouts that seem to occur when new versions are released.


And some of the bugs are still in 9.1. They didn't all go away. I don't subscribe to the blissful version of the past, but the last version was an instance where a lot more was caught up on than damaged.



MickeS said:


> PR is work, just not done by the same people that do what you mean by doing work.
> 
> I wonder if TiVos code right now is just so unwieldy and the retention so low that every little new feature is done by a new programmer, in a tangled web of old code, that just keeps getting touched up enough to work "right now"...


That certainly seems to fit what is being observed over the years. Its why I've said I live in fear of them touching the DVR interface. While it needs to be done, there isn't the talent, vision or institutional memory to do it well.

Many problems have been isolated outside the DVR interface by the use of HME and HMO for development. When you screw up there you don't screw up the core functionality. But there is the need now to do things like integrate internet and broadcast content acquisition and it really can't be done right without integrating the new stuff into the DVR interface.


----------



## pdhenry

bicker said:


> I've had that happen to me before, before 9.1.


I'm seeing it for the first time in 9.1 on two different TiVos - a ST and a DT.

I forced a network connection on the DT and can now access the TiVoCast Downloads screen again.


----------



## bicker

HDTiVo said:


> The alternative choices to the ones I advocate are the ones with much lower probability of benefiting TiVo.


I can't agree. There's simply no reason to believe that.


----------



## cnmurray8

I found this problem last night after receiving 9.1 update. Series 2 DT. All of the season passes will only record from the cable box not the direct cable in. Season passes no longer recognize both channels - example ABC from the cable box and ABC from the direct cable in. Under 8.3 when you set a season pass both would be checked and it would use the cable in first so you could still watch any other channel.

Another major problem that now exists because of this when you have 2 shows set to record at the same time and both are available on the cable box and cable in it will only record from the cable box and will not record the other show on the cable in. This basically makes this a 1 tuner box now for season pass recodings. 

I have tried to reset the box and this has not corrected the problem.


----------



## DaveLessnau

cnmurray8,

I don't have a dual tuner TiVo, but, out of curiosity, what happens if you convert the SPs to Wishlists? Do they get recorded on both tuners?


----------



## Ken-6809er

I'm not sure if this is related to 9.1 or not, but I noticed this morning that both of my Series 2 boxes (one DT, one not) have only 6 days of guide data cached. I used to see roughly 2 weeks in advance, and I was a bit dismayed to see this morning that I could only see shows up to 6 days in the future in my To-Do list.

Anybody else notice this?


----------



## HDTiVo

Ken-6809er said:


> I'm not sure if this is related to 9.1 or not, but I noticed this morning that both of my Series 2 boxes (one DT, one not) have only 6 days of guide data cached. I used to see roughly 2 weeks in advance, and I was a bit dismayed to see this morning that I could only see shows up to 6 days in the future in my To-Do list.
> 
> Anybody else notice this?


You need to check the last time your tivo connected to tivo inc. on the Settings/phone&network screen.

Its certainly possible 9.1 disrupted your network settings. Using Test Connection and the option to change network settings should give you answers and relief. Also try unplugging the various switchs along the way to let them reboot. Finally try unplugging the TiVo for 10 sec.

Chances are you'll be fine.


----------



## Ken-6809er

HDTiVo said:


> You need to check the last time your tivo connected to tivo inc. on the Settings/phone&network screen.
> 
> Its certainly possible 9.1 disrupted your network settings. Using Test Connection and the option to change network settings should give you answers and relief. Also try unplugging the various switchs along the way to let them reboot. Finally try unplugging the TiVo for 10 sec.
> 
> Chances are you'll be fine.


That was my very first thought, so I forced a connection this morning. No problems connecting on either Tivo.


----------



## cnmurray8

DaveLessnau said:


> cnmurray8,
> 
> I don't have a dual tuner TiVo, but, out of curiosity, what happens if you convert the SPs to Wishlists? Do they get recorded on both tuners?


I tried to create with the wishlist and still have the same problem. It only will record from the 1 tuner. When I go in and look at upcoming episodes both showings will be listed for cable box and cable in. Now only the one I set it on will be checked. Under 8.3 when you set it and looked under upcoming episodes both of them were checked and the Tivo used the one that was available at the time of showing using the cable in first. Now it appears to not recognize the second channel at all.


----------



## HDTiVo

Ken-6809er said:


> That was my very first thought, so I forced a connection this morning. No problems connecting on either Tivo.


If you have given it enough time to fully load the guide data then it sounds like you've got a problem. 

Oh...wait, you said you looked at the ToDo list. Are you tight on space? Maybe nothing will record in 6 days because the drive will be full.


----------



## RoyK

Don't know whether to class this as a bug or just a weirdity. 

I started a transfer from a program that was in a folder on box A to Box B, then cancelled the transfer after a few seconds leaving a partial recording on box B. About an hour later having forgotten I'd done that (senior moment) I went to box A and initiated a transfer of that partial recording back from box B to box A.

The transfer completed in a few seconds --no surprise there -- however the file was in the NPL outside the folder and was in it's entirety - the full half hour. It was also still in the original folder.


----------



## Ken-6809er

HDTiVo said:


> If you have given it enough time to fully load the guide data then it sounds like you've got a problem.
> 
> Oh...wait, you said you looked at the ToDo list. Are you tight on space? Maybe nothing will record in 6 days because the drive will be full.


*sigh* It looks like I'm going to have to call support and see what is going on with my setup. I checked the settings, specifically the guide cache-to date. It's telling me it's cached until 10/17.


----------



## bmgoodman

psyton said:


> Or perhaps Tivo should just invest in a real QA department that actually does Quality Assurance and engineers that at least unit test their changes before releasing into the wild?


I'd rather they hire another VP!


----------



## jbcheshire

Has anyone noticed an issue where you have a SP on a show and when you go into the "To Do" list and look at the "Info" on the show there is a selection called "options" at the bottom of the page that lets you modify your curent SP on the show. Well when you do this it doesn't recognize that you already have a SP for the show and asks if you want to create a SP for the show. So for grins I did this and now it shows two SPs for the same show. The old/previous SP is listed correctly in SP manager site for rankings and now displays the new SP i just created at the bottom of the priority list...

Anyone else notice this? Because this is how I modified my current SPs and now I can't do that. Very frustrating!!!


----------



## CaseyK24

Digger said:


> Another MRV issue: unit won't receive a MRV recording because it thinks one is still transferring
> 
> Let me add my voice to MRV issues. Firstly, browsing the recorded shows on a remote unit is painfully slow. Secondly, my units will only transfer one show. For example: Setup a transfer from unit a to unit b. The first recording transferred from unit a to unit b transfers fine. Setup a second transfer from unit a to unit b and it never shows up. If I check the todo list on unit b, the recording to be transferred is listed as pending waiting for a prior transfer to finish. Unfortunately, nothing is waiting to finish. If I reboot unit b, the program will transfer. I have a recording that had been pending transfer for 2 days. Reboot and it transferred fine.
> (


I'll second this one - One transfer was "stuck" in the To Do list (wasn't actually transfering). Then could not transfer any other program and the cancel of the stuck one in the To Do List didn't work until I re-booted to clear it off the To Do list.

ALSO more MRV problems as noted by many:
Slooooooooooooooooow display of remote play list. Transfers don't always start correctly. New one maybe: Deleting transferred show deletes the wrong date of the same show. I.E. "Heros" 10/17 and 10/24 transfered. Delete 10/17 "Heros" from Now Playing and the 10/24 got deleted not the 10/17 one.

9.1 for MRV - OUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


----------



## fergie8

So, what's your least favorite 9.1 bug?

I'd have to say mine is the one when you select a wish list item and then back out of the selection only to find the wish list pointing to a different item on someone else's TiVo located in another state. Then you have to travel all the way back to your own TiVo and drive around the neighborhood there trying to remember where you were when you left. Now *that* is really annoying.

Okay, maybe it doesn't happen exactly like that, but sometimes it sure seems like it does. 

Cheers,

-- 
Michael


----------



## CaseyK24

ZeoTiVo said:


> a lot of the things listed here are performance problems related to specific TiVo boxes of the owners. There are some concrete ones of course, such as the highlight not returning to the right place on a list when returning but basically if a TiVo rep came in here he would be doing individual case work in no time


Performance problems of specific Tivo Boxes???????????? Dude, MRV is messed up - read through these messages - slow - not functioning - stuck....not related to specific boxers or owners or routes or wireless adapters or anything else.


----------



## CaseyK24

Ken-6809er said:


> I'm not sure if this is related to 9.1 or not, but I noticed this morning that both of my Series 2 boxes (one DT, one not) have only 6 days of guide data cached. I used to see roughly 2 weeks in advance, and I was a bit dismayed to see this morning that I could only see shows up to 6 days in the future in my To-Do list.
> 
> Anybody else notice this?


I had one of my 3 Tivo's lose connection to my network after the 9.2 upgrade. I tried to reset the network settings and password but it still didn't work until....I again tried to reset the network settings (5th time) but this time as a peer network - I only went half way through then started over with the normal setting (that I had been trying for an hour) and finally it worked. So don;t just try to reset the same settings - try the peer network settings and then got back to your normal setup.


----------



## CaseyK24

CaseyK24 said:


> I had one of my 3 Tivo's lose connection to my network after the 9.2 upgrade.


I meant 9.1 upgrade before anyone either slams me or wonders if a new one came out

ck


----------



## ZeoTiVo

CaseyK24 said:


> Performance problems of specific Tivo Boxes???????????? Dude, MRV is messed up - read through these messages - slow - not functioning - stuck....not related to specific boxers or owners or routes or wireless adapters or anything else.


yes and for others it is working as expected and has all the noted functions.
So it is not simple small code fixes but figuring out where the bottlenecks are and re-architecting for better *performance* eg the bugs are just symptoms of performance issues - and yes individual boxes and network setups will contribute to that performance issue and is something end users can try and work out on their own so I mention them.

My point in that specific post was "What could TiVo say at this point?" We did a major overhaul of MRV to include S3 platform and it looks and feels like version 1.0 of something. Sure that would be honest, but we already know that and thus it would not be informative. Could they say they are working on it? Well that would be warm and fuzzy for us but without being able to give some specific timeline it also is not very helpful or informative. So again, what would anyone gain from TiVo talking about the bugs right now?

So keep reporting away on bugs - I am sure they are reading the forum; though called in reports with case numbers probably hold a lot more weight for prioritizing resources to work on issues.


----------



## HDTiVo

CaseyK24 said:


> Performance problems of specific Tivo Boxes???????????? Dude, MRV is messed up - read through these messages - slow - not functioning - stuck....not related to specific boxers or owners or routes or wireless adapters or anything else.


The question of what is causing the problem is certainly not closed at this point.


----------



## bareyb

steve614 said:


> This thread brings back memories of the 8.1 release.
> IIRC, Tivo kept quiet amidst all the 'bug' reports back then.


FWIW I called TiVo Inc. today to report the "Video Lag" bug on 30 second skip and Instant Replay. While not directly acknowledging the problem the CSR did tell me that TiVo is aware of "a number of issues" with the 9.1 release and is working hard on a patch to deal with them. Supposedly this patch will predate the November update that is already scheduled.

So while it's not directly from anyone official at TiVo they do seem to be telling the CSR's that they are aware of some of these problems are working to fix them. I wonder why they can't come here and say the same thing? Perhaps avoiding the onslaught of questions? Either way, I hope that's the case, because the "video lag" bug is driving me crazy. It doesn't appear to affect all users but I have it bad on both my S3's. It's most pronounced on HD recordings for me.

I suggest calling Tivo directly and getting a case number.


----------



## Talmany

I just got my 9.1 update the other night and ever since then my Tivo has been acting weirdly. I cannot watch live TV or a recorded show without it pausing or pixelating. i have restarted my Tivo about a dozen times already and it's gotten ridiculous already. any ideas?


----------



## pdhenry

Sounds like impending hard drive failure...


----------



## tdwidner

jtown0620 said:


> I have 2 DT and I received the update last night. Now, every once in a while, the screen goes crazy! Just a rainbow of colors and very distorted but the sound is perfect. I pressed the TiVo button on the remote and returned to live tv to find the picture corrected. This has happened on both TiVos! Has anyone else encountered this?
> 
> Also the wireless transfer is definitely slower since the update! I have owned & loved my TiVos for a while and must say I love the new GUI but the amount of bugs in this update is really unacceptable! This reminds me of a Microsoft update looks nice performs like crap!


 I am having similar issues the sound is perfect but the video is distorted. I posted in the help section. No replies yet. 
See my message below.

Forgive me if this is a repeated question. I have searched the forum but all I am seeing is pixelation issues with the HD units.

Everyday since the upgrade last Saturday I have had pixelation issues.
When I turn my TV on for the first time each day, the screen is yellowish, with lines and the snow looking stuff almost as if its split into 4 separate distorted places on the screen. I have had to power cycle it to get it to clear. Yesterday I just went into the menu and came back out and that cleared it. Is anyone else seeing this on their series 2? I called, was told they would log a ticket with a specialist and to all back in a week. Go Figure. I'm really upset as I still have 2 more years on my contract and don't feel I should have to pay when this is happening. Nothing has recorded with this distortion. I turn the tv sound on during the day for my dog. But the tv stays off. It doesn't usually record anything during the day and doesn't change channels. Nothing is happening yet when I turn it on I see this yellowish distortion/pixelation. Sorry if I don't describe it well.

Any help/comments appreciated!

Tara


----------



## scott816

OK, this update is killing me. My Tivo's (S3, DT, 2 S2's) have several problems. For 2 nights now two of my season passes have failed to record. Occasionally my main tivo changes to channel 1 for no reason. It doesn't try to record channel 1 it just changes to channel one. When pausing live TV and then deciding to record the show, after pressing record it deletes the 30 minute buffer and jumps to real time and starts recording! What the hell? It has never done that before. My old SA HD DVR used to do that crap. When i use to punch in channel 4 (NBC) on the tivo remote to view a channel that is broadcast in digital (channel 4, analog 34) it used to always know to use the cable box to view channel 4 but now it prefers analog channel 4 which is some public access crap. I have to use the remote and reenter channel 4 to get it to switch over to the box. I really hope this gets resolved soon.

SB


----------



## TiVoEvan74

Slow, slow on displaying the Now Playing list of another TiVo on a wireless MRV set up. Other menus also slower than usual. Preferred the yellow check marks to the blue ones, but that's aesthetic.

The update also knocked all the "season passes" for TiVo casts.


----------



## Dajad

scott816 said:


> When pausing live TV and then deciding to record the show, after pressing record it deletes the 30 minute buffer and jumps to real time and starts recording! What the hell? It has never done that before. My old SA HD DVR used to do that crap.SB


Scott, this is NOT a 9.1 problem. TiVo has been behaving t his way for at least a year. I know TiVo didn't USE to do this but I noticed about a year ago when I did what you describe (decide to record a show you are watching because it got interesting), it deletes the buffer and only starts recording as of the current moment. It's too bad because I know way back TiVo didn't do that, it recorded what was in the buffer (and still part of the show you are watching) and anything from that point in time forward to the end of the show.

...Dale


----------



## acej80

I am now having a problem where previously recorded shows from analog channels will not play sound thru my AV system, until I manually set my receiver to a 2-channel stereo mode. I did not have this problem prior to the 9.1 update. I looked thru this thread and didn't see anyone else reporting this problem, but I can't imagine my set-up is unique. Anyone seen this?


----------



## scott816

Dale,

I did some testing and this problem only seems to occur when live TV is a new show and you are viewing the buffer. For example if you are watching a hour long show and there is 10 minutes left in the show you can click record and it will use the buffer and capture the last 30 minutes and continue recording. However if a show ends at 1pm and you are watching a the show that ran from 1230pm to 1pm using the buffer and the current time is 110pm and you click record it will release the buffer and record whatever the live show is and drop the buffer of the previous show. Make sense?


----------



## Boodzy

Hello, Since the update my sony dvr-3000 will not transfer from my other tivo nor will it cancel the transfer. 
Also there are some speed issues things seem to be going much slower especially the network. 
Any thoughts? Fixes?
thanks Boodzy


----------



## TriBruin

I know that 9.1 is causing a lot of MRV issues, but I didn't see mine listed:

Both Tivo's have been updated (downgraded?) to 9.1. When I go to the NP list and select my "Living Room" Tivo from my "Bedroom" Tivo, now shows are listed to transfer, screen is blank. However, if I go to "Living Room" and select the "Bedroom" Tivo, i can see all the shows on the "Bedroom" Tivo, although after a small delay.

I have tried restarting both Tivos without success. Any one else seen this (or did I miss a post?) Any other suggestions?


----------



## kriechm

I've got a S2 810 with DVD player. DVD no longer plays any DVDs since the 9.1 update. That is a serious bug!


----------



## Arcady

My DVR-810H still plays (and records) DVDs after the 9.1 update.


----------



## vasilemj

MickeS said:


> I found another bug, related to the one I mentioned above:
> A file that's transfered from a PC to a TiVo only shows the time in seconds, not in minutes. I had an old file on the TiVo, and it shows the time in minutes. After transfering the same file again, using 9.1, it only shows seconds.
> 
> I really hope these bugs have to do with TTG and will be fixed when the new TTG for Series 3 is activated...


Count me in on this bug as well. Just noticed it. What's even more bizarre is that I can't even transfer TiVo files from my PC to my TiVo anymore. When I attempt a transfer I get an error message stating: "There was a problem transferring the requested program to this DVR." Then it directs me to the "View Recording History" page which politely provides the detailed description: "This program was not transferred onto this DVR because of a transfer error. You may want to try this transfer again."

However, this only affects my ability to transfer TiVo files. Transferring MPG files works perfectly fine though I experience the "seconds" time bar described by MickeS as opposed to the normal one broken up into minutes and hours with the hash marks.


----------



## poletip

Anybody have the problem with 9.1 of not seeing any recording under "Now playing" when looking at another networked Tivo? I have a Series 2 and a Series 2DT - before 9.1 I could see and transfer between the two units, now with 9.1, I am told that there are no programs to transfer from the other system. Does this sound familar to anybody?

Also, on my Tivo Desktop, when I try to "Pick Recordings to Transfer" - I get "error attempting to retrieve data from the selected DVR"

Am I cursed with 9.1?


----------



## vasilemj

Yet another bug to report. When going into the "View Recording History" screen to see why my TiVo file would not transfer from my PC to my TiVo (see post above) I happened to notice that two of our shows that are set for Season Passes were labeled as "Won't Record". Selecting them informs me that "This program will not be recorded because it is no longer in the program guide."

However, when I go into the "To Do List", there they are, apparently scheduled to record. I guess I'll have to wait and see if they actually record.

I did go into the program guide to double-check and it does appear to be fully populated. My shows are listed as normal in the program guide.


----------



## pdhenry

poletip said:


> now with 9.1, I am told that there are no programs to transfer from the other system.


Do both TiVos have 9.1?

I think I may have had to reboot the TiVos to get stuff working well (or at least better).


----------



## tstape

I have this problem after the update for my Series 2. The channels that show up when I hit Guide are not the channels I have selected in setup. Any suggestions? I did reboot.


----------



## bkdtv

tstape said:


> I have this problem after the update for my Series 2. The channels that show up when I hit Guide are not the channels I have selected in setup. Any suggestions? I did reboot.


I assume you have you double checked your Setup -> Channels -> Channel list screen? And you are not applying a guide filter? Display the guide and press ENTER to see if you are applying a filter.


----------



## pdhenry

scott816 said:


> Occasionally my main tivo changes to channel 1 for no reason. It doesn't try to record channel 1 it just changes to channel one.


I just had that happen on my S2DT.

Channel 1 is not checked in my TiVo's channel list, but this morning I found the box tuned to Channel 1, and the TiVo channel banner acknowedged that it had tuned the box to Channel 1.

As you may know, once the cable box gets into channel 1 the TiVo is incapable of tuning the box to any other channels.


----------



## Karlp327

I had the same issue of not seeing any recordings to transfer. I restarted and viola they were all there.

All my systems are running 9.1.


----------



## renkablue

vasilemj said:


> Nice to know that someone else is feeling my pain. I like to record HD OTA feeds to my computer and then process them for viewing on my TiVo. This update has really screwed things up for me.


Gonna ask a dumb question: How do you record HD over the air feeds to your computer? Have you got your computer set up to receive video signals like a tv does?


----------



## RoyK

renkablue said:


> Gonna ask a dumb question: How do you record HD over the air feeds to your computer? Have you got your computer set up to receive video signals like a tv does?


There are several manufacturers of HD TV Tuner cards & usb HD Tuners for PCs. They come with software to schedule recordings and lots of good stuff. There is also Media Center software for PCs.

Try googling PC hd tuner .


----------



## TriBruin

poletip said:


> Anybody have the problem with 9.1 of not seeing any recording under "Now playing" when looking at another networked Tivo? I have a Series 2 and a Series 2DT - before 9.1 I could see and transfer between the two units, now with 9.1, I am told that there are no programs to transfer from the other system. Does this sound familar to anybody?
> 
> Also, on my Tivo Desktop, when I try to "Pick Recordings to Transfer" - I get "error attempting to retrieve data from the selected DVR"
> 
> Am I cursed with 9.1?


I had the same problem (see above). It appears to have fixed itself after about a day. And yes, I tried rebooting both Tivos.


----------



## renkablue

RoyK said:


> There are several manufacturers of HD TV Tuner cards & usb HD Tuners for PCs. They come with software to schedule recordings and lots of good stuff. There is also Media Center software for PCs.
> 
> Try googling PC hd tuner .


Thanks for the information.


----------



## sepstein

Pixelation has been a real problem with my S2 since the upgrade. Seems we had this problem before after another upgrade as well.

Anyone else?

Steve


----------



## mrjam2jab

Not sure if this is related to the upgrade...as i added the 3rd tivo at the same time the upgrade came into being.

I have 3 tivos...I'll call them Small World, Epcot Center, and Magic Kingdom....all with 9.1 software....and the PC (Tower of Terror) with TD 2.5.

Since the upgrade...I can NOT see MK from EC, SW or TT....but from MK I CAN see EC, SW and TT....

The new one is SW...

If you ignore MK for a moment...all the other attractions can see each other just fine.

Hoping this is something simple....


----------



## krazyrabbit

Pixelation on my S2 as well. Has anyone had any luck with rebooting? I'm almost afraid it might make matters worse, so haven't tried it yet. 

Karen


----------



## Arod

I'm not sure if the following is a 9.1 problem or not. My unit just upgraded to 9.1 a few days ago. For about a little over a year, I wasn't using my Tivo unit much because I switched to cable tv with an HD DVR in the cable box.

Recently I hooked up my Tivo to another TV in the family room and started using it again. When I first got the unit around 3 years ago, I was semi-excited about the ability of the unit to write to DVDs. That ended quickly when I found out it took several DVDs to do a 2 hour show. In fact, if my memory is correct, it took 2 DVDs to record a half hour show at the highest quality.

Today I tried to record a 2 hour show and a message came up stating that it would take 2 DVDs which I expected. However, after the first DVD recorded, the Tivo bounced back to the normal menu without asking me to insert an 2nd DVD to complete the recording. I tried the same thing with another show that was 1 hour and got a message that it too would require 2 DVDs. Again, I didn't get the option to put the 2nd DVD in the recorder.

Also, I seem to remember in the past that when recording to a DVD, I would get an option as to what quality I wanted (high, medium or low.) I no longer get these choices. Also, when recording, it prompts me about a title (which I selected.) After recording, and then playing the DVD in my Tivo unit, no title appears as to what the DVD contains.

Are all these differences a result of 9.1?

Somewhere else on this form, it mentions a 30 second skip option. Is this a function of only series 3 plays as I can't find this option while using my series 2.

Except for the above, it seems to me that 9.1 is an improvement to my unit. Since I paid for the lifetime service, I don't expect to upgrade to a series 3 unit anytime soon.


----------



## RoyK

Recorded today's Va Tech vs Duke football game (VT 43, Duke 14). Had padded the recording an extra hour. After the game went into NPL and tried to stop the recording. No joy. Couldn't stop it from the "Stop Recording" menu and couldn't do it with the clear button either. In both cases popped me back to NPL and the game was still recording. LED on the box still on too.

Finally tried changing channels and got the option to stop recording there and that worked.

Thanks again TiVo for 9.1!!


----------



## klia

DaveLessnau said:


> I think TiVo is trying to have one re-usable list processing routine, and they messed it up. They seem to be saving only part of the list state when they transition to a new state. Specifically, they seem to save the offset within a page of items, but they're not saving what page they're on. When they return to the original list, it ends up back on the first page with the proper offset highlighted (just the wrong page). And, since this a re-used object/module, the behavior comes up everywhere. I just don't understand why they didn't fix the problems with this before they standardized on it. People have been complaining about this behavior in some lists for two releases.
> 
> And, like you, I've had to give up doing things on my TiVo that are central to my watching television. Because of these bugs, I've lost core capabilities and TiVo has provided nothing to replace them. With 9.1, I just can't do important things anymore. Inconceivable.


Thanks for explaining this. I'm not a programmer, so I had no idea it was a programming screw-up, rather than something TiVo had done deliberately. That makes it far worse in my book. I'm really upset about how these glitches have affected my TiVo use. If someone had told me a month ago that I'd throw up my hands at my TiVo and walk away in disgust, I would've thought they were insane. Inconceivable is right!


----------



## klia

pdhenry said:


> I just had that happen on my S2DT.
> 
> Channel 1 is not checked in my TiVo's channel list, but this morning I found the box tuned to Channel 1, and the TiVo channel banner acknowedged that it had tuned the box to Channel 1.
> 
> As you may know, once the cable box gets into channel 1 the TiVo is incapable of tuning the box to any other channels.


Okay, thank you, because I thought I was going crazy, or something. My S2 TiVo switched my box to Channel 1 while I was in the middle of watching something, and I was positive I hadn't accidentally hit any buttons on my remote. Reassuring to know it's not just me, but geez, that's a heinous bug!


----------



## DaveLessnau

klia said:


> Thanks for explaining this. I'm not a programmer, so I had no idea it was a programming screw-up, rather than something TiVo had done deliberately....!


Remember, I'm just an end-user like you. I'm just guessing about the causes here. But, they seem reasonable.


----------



## tstape

bkdtv said:


> I assume you have you double checked your Setup -> Channels -> Channel list screen? And you are not applying a guide filter? Display the guide and press ENTER to see if you are applying a filter.


 No. I don't have a filter selected. When I select display favorites, it does not show the channels I selected. I need to view all channels to see everything. This problem coincided with the 9.1 update.


----------



## shulcslt

sepstein said:


> Pixelation has been a real problem with my S2 since the upgrade. Seems we had this problem before after another upgrade as well.
> 
> Anyone else?
> 
> Steve


 Have been having pixellation problems for several months on both my Humax DRT800's. Pulled the drives and tested them and both come up clean. I'm pretty convinced it's an OS problem.


----------



## carroca

sepstein & krazyrabbit

I have pixelation problems on both of my 540 S2s after 9.1 update (as well as most of the other problems mentioned here). Which models do you have? I'm wondering if it's happening on all S2s or just the slower 540 model. Don't worry about rebooting, it didn't make it any worse for me, but it didn't make it any better either.

It seems all the work TiVo did to resolve the S3 pixelation problems pushed the problem to S2s 

I hope we see 9.1.1 soon!!


----------



## vasilemj

renkablue said:


> Gonna ask a dumb question: How do you record HD over the air feeds to your computer? Have you got your computer set up to receive video signals like a tv does?


I have a Samsung SIR-T165 OTA Tuner which has a firewire output. I run a firewire cable from the tuner to the firewire input on my laptop and then use a program called CapDVHS to record. If you have some time, it is all explained in this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=403695

I've got the ZIP file and instructions to install and use if you're interested.


----------



## bugzod

Thought I'd chime in. 

I have two 540 S2's and both got 9.1 on 10/12. 

One is not corrected to a cable box and seems to be working fine with no pixelation. No other major problems with this one except maybe some menu slowing. 

The other is connected to a comcast cable box and I have had multiple probs -- pixelation, deleted shows will not permanently delete, unit froze while checking network connection, super slow menus, NPL etc. 

This sucks. I hope they don't make us wait months for a fix like the old TTG problem from a while back. Right now, my wife is crabbing coz she is a "flipper" and it takes about 5 seconds to change the channel...


----------



## juanian

Here's a bug I noticed but I had trouble confirming it (until now).

On the Program Details screen, sometimes the text is "missing" a line between the pages.

A current example is the upcoming episode of Spin City on FX Thu 10/18 at 9 AM. The first page lists the Actors on the show, and the second page should start with the Guest Stars, but the first line of the Guest Stars is missing.


----------



## vasilemj

vasilemj said:


> Yet another bug to report. When going into the "View Recording History" screen to see why my TiVo file would not transfer from my PC to my TiVo (see post above) I happened to notice that two of our shows that are set for Season Passes were labeled as "Won't Record". Selecting them informs me that "This program will not be recorded because it is no longer in the program guide."
> 
> However, when I go into the "To Do List", there they are, apparently scheduled to record. I guess I'll have to wait and see if they actually record.
> 
> I did go into the program guide to double-check and it does appear to be fully populated. My shows are listed as normal in the program guide.


Update: My program DID record as scheduled. I guess this is a good thing but yet another bug they'll have to work out.

Geez, I do not envy the programmers over at TiVo right now. If I were them, I wouldn't even know where to start in resolving all these bugs. There seems like hundreds of them!


----------



## Expat

Latest problems here  

Ordered Unbox rentals on Friday Night for Tivo #1.
No show on Saturday by Lunch, called very helpful and available Support at Amazon :up: :up: 
They re-sent the show.
2Hrs later no shows on Tivo #1.
called Amazon Unbox folks again, spoke wit a TiVo enthusiast  
Sent the shows to TiVo #2, shows were downloading within 20 mins  
The agent said they had heard of a lot of problems with the latest update.

The shows finished downloading, but show in Now Playing TWICE, once in Now Playing and also in a Unbox Folder.

I'm watching a show on Tivo #1, season pass, with 5 episodes, all set to save until I delete. Finisf show select delete, and am suddenly presented with the message " this folder is empty and shows are available else where in the now playing list"  

I return to Now Playing and the folder has re-apperaed by BUG magic with the remaining shows.

THIS SUCKS  

Tivo Dsektop can see both Tivo's but they can't see each other which makes MRV a breeze not!


----------



## bicker

vasilemj said:


> Geez, I do not envy the programmers over at TiVo right now. If I were them, I wouldn't even know where to start in resolving all these bugs. There seems like hundreds of them!


I'd be curious to know which ones are actually being reported to TiVo; I could imagine that the programmers at TiVo have a much smaller number to work through than it seems from these threads.


----------



## Expat

bicker said:


> I'd be curious to know which ones are actually being reported to TiVo; I could imagine that the programmers at TiVo have a much smaller number to work through than it seems from these threads.


First they would have to admit that there is a problem, not exposed in beta testing


----------



## RoyK

Expat said:


> First they would have to admit that there is a problem, not exposed in beta testing


Thanks. I needed a good laugh.

Just taught my wife how to pull the power connector from the back of her SD-H400 after it hung in the Now Playing Screen yet again with no text displayed and completely unresponsive to remote keypresses or the on-box TiVo button. The wall socket and UPS are hard to reach. Thinking about adding a power strip with a switch on it to make it easier for her.


----------



## bobsoron

Wow, 10 pages and I've got a new bunch. (I allow that some of these are not bugs but design decisions that are outright stupid. Nonetheless.)

I use the S1 remote since, when I upgraded to the nightlight S2, I found the new remote a really badly designed, physically unbalanced, failed experiment. Worked great until this update. For some reason -- just think, they must have had meetings about this -- the Live TV/Guide button no longer brings up the Guide. In the past with the S2, if I were doing anything other than watching Live TV, it would move me to Live TV; if I was current with the buffer, it would show me the Guide. Can't get the Guide now unless I use a badly designed remote.

I have about three dozen wishlists, and often go into detail pages to make decisions about recording specific episodes. Before, returning to the main Upcoming Programs screen was very fast because the list of found programs was cached. Apparently now the list is no longer cached, as it takes a long time to return to the list... every single time. Also, it no longer tells you how many programs it found.

I have no use for Suggestions, have the feature turned off, try to make sure nothing appears in the list even. I understand some love it; I really have no use for it. But every time I record a program now, it gets a thumbs up. Back in my beloved S1 days, you could hit a green and a red and that was the end of things; that show was no longer a factor in Suggestions and no future action would ever disturb that. I never quite figured out how the S2 OSes changed that behavior, but I had to be more aggressive at balancing out the thumbs. Now? If I've ever thumbs-downed a show and then record it, it's back to green.

The lag between a button press on the remote and the Tivo's response is made even more noticeable by the fact that the Tivo makes the badoop sound immediately but takes no other visible action for a moment. 

The eye candy has made text much less legible. The flat blue of the old program banner was perfectly readable; the gradient now, not so much. 

When searching by title, you used to be able to hit Clear on the remote at any time to empty and return to the field. Now the button on the remote doesn't work if you're in the scrolling program list. 

The onscreen scroll arrows used to be clear and visible; now they're tiny smudges that blend into the animated background.

Whether they're bugs or design decisions, they've made the Tivo significantly less pleasant to use. Some screens have also had their layouts tweaked in a way that seems to give me less information, but I can't A/B anything, obviously; I just feel like I'm seeing many more ellipses in lists.

Oh, and while the unit says it connected to the mothership a few hours ago and my program listings go through Sat. Oct. 27, in fact the info seems to go only until Thursday night. Friday and Saturday it shows only my repeating manual recordings.

Hey, I did just find a genuine bug -- Universal Swivel Search gives me the black screen/Please Wait combo. I can back out of it, fortunately, but when the unit returns to the Find Programs screen, To Do List is highlighted rather than Universal Swivel Search. The unit is wired to my router and has a connection.


----------



## Traal

Last night, I started watching a brand new show from the beginning of the episode. About 5 minutes in, I decided to get a season pass to that show. That caused it to automatically start recording (as expected) but only from the 5 minute point on. The first 5 minutes was lost even from the 30-minute buffer.


----------



## Soapm

bobsoron said:


> I have about three dozen wishlists, and often go into detail pages to make decisions about recording specific episodes. Before, returning to the main Upcoming Programs screen was very fast because the list of found programs was cached. Apparently now the list is no longer cached, as it takes a long time to return to the list... every single time. Also, it no longer tells you how many programs it found..


In addition to this, mines doesn't seem to recognize my old wishlist entries so I am having to build duplicate entries from scratch. Same with my season passes. This is taking a very long time;

Ex... I had a season pass entry for Frasier. It shows no episodes to record so I do a title search for Frasier and discover there are 98 episodes to record. So I make a new season pass to record Frasier. After doing this I can then go to the original season pass and notice it now see's the 98 episodes. What's even stranger, if I don't delete one, my now playing list will have two different folders with Frasier episodes.

I am having to do this with each of my season passes and I had well over 200 because most of the shows I like (Frasier) show on multiple channels and you have to make a season pass for each channel.

By the way, anyone know why we must make a season pass for the same show on each channel? Can't their be a "record all channel" question?


----------



## DaveLessnau

bobsoron,

Mostly, I agree.
I've confirmed the S1 remote no longer brings up the Guide like it used to.
Generating a list of Wishlist hits is definitely slow and not cached. However, on my system, it gives me the number of matches.
Recording a Thumbed Down show doesn't change the Thumb rating, here. I still have the problem where Thumbs don't stick if I apply them in the Now Playing List (I have to make sure I Thumb things as I'm watching them).
The badoop sound/Thumb icon lag bothers me, too. When I was still trying to Browse shows under 9.1 (I've given up because it's so slow), I'd apply a Thumb rating and feel like I did something wrong. Before, I think the icon changed and and then the sound happened (perhaps they were simultaneous). Now, the sound happens, a slight pause, and then the icon changes. Disconcerting.
I'm not very enamoured with the gradient. The top line looks washed out and I do have some trouble making out anything up there.
I've confirmed CLEAR no longer clears the entry and pops out of the Browse By Title list.
I was just noticing the new scroll arrows this morning. I believe I was waiting for a Wishlist list of hits to show up and I was wondering what those smudges on the screen were. As you noted, those are the new scroll arrows. The old ones were better.


----------



## DaveLessnau

Soapm said:


> By the way, anyone know why we must make a season pass for the same show on each channel? Can't their be a "record all channel" question?


I might be misreading this, but that sound like an AutoRecording Wish List.


----------



## bicker

Expat said:


> First they would have to admit that there is a problem, not exposed in beta testing


I know you were kidding, but what you wrote is absolutely correct. Nothing will get fixed until the problem is reported to TiVo and TiVo is provided enough information to convince them that there actually is a problem.


----------



## astrohip

bobsoron said:


> I have about three dozen wishlists, and often go into detail pages to make decisions about recording specific episodes. Before, returning to the main Upcoming Programs screen was very fast because the list of found programs was cached. Apparently now the list is no longer cached, as it takes a long time to return to the list... every single time. Also, it no longer tells you how many programs it found.


This is not new to 9.x. The slow WL problem started in 8.x. And mine does tell me how many hits.


----------



## FilmCritic3000

Since the update, I've had to restart my S2 TiVo (standalone) several times. There's a noticeable lag every now and then between my actions with the remote and the TiVo's response but the most troubling aspect was last night when I was trying to watch episodes of _The Office_. It would pause during the episode and I could not get it to start playing again. The unit would not respond to the remote at all.

After I unplugged and replugged it several times (possibly more than several), it's worked like a charm (knock on wood) ever since.

Also, I must state that I do not like the new way of accessing WishList items. If you're browsing through your WishList, then you access an item, and then return to the main list, you're returned all the way back to the beginning of your WishList.


----------



## Soapm

DaveLessnau said:


> I might be misreading this, but that sound like an AutoRecording Wish List.


No, this is really season passes.

Ex; MASH. I have to create 4 season passes for MASH in order to record it on all the channels it is played. Why can't I make one season pass for MASH and have an option to record all channels? Then I would not have to have 4 MASH season passes, I can just have one that records any channel MASH comes on.

The problem with using a MASH wishlist is it will record any show with the word MASH in it.


----------



## fredct

Soapm said:


> The problem with using a MASH wishlist is it will record any show with the word MASH in it.


You can be a little more clever. You can make a Wishlist for:
MASH & Comedy/Sitcom & Farr/Jamie (or anyone whose name is typically in the description)

You might get some MASH specials or something, but you'd be pretty close.


----------



## DaveLessnau

Soapm said:


> The problem with using a MASH wishlist is it will record any show with the word MASH in it.


And with the new NOT capability in 9.1, you can specifically exclude those shows that you can't filter out otherwise.


----------



## bobsoron

astrohip said:


> This is not new to 9.x. The slow WL problem started in 8.x. And mine does tell me how many hits.


Well, Wishlists have never been fast -- but my reference to their slowness referred to the lack of caching after returning to the Upcoming Programs screen from a detail screen, which I don't remember in 8.x.

FWIW, I'm looking at it now, and Upcoming Programs starts with "Here are up to the first 10 matching programs for each WishList:" Of the 15 WLs that have hits currently, some have only one or two results, while others (such as the keyword Poker) have dozens. Don't know if any of those might make a difference.


----------



## klia

juanian said:


> Here's a bug I noticed but I had trouble confirming it (until now).
> 
> On the Program Details screen, sometimes the text is "missing" a line between the pages.
> 
> A current example is the upcoming episode of Spin City on FX Thu 10/18 at 9 AM. The first page lists the Actors on the show, and the second page should start with the Guest Stars, but the first line of the Guest Stars is missing.


I just noticed that today, myself, when trying to see guest actors for an upcoming show. Another incredibly annoying bug!


----------



## klia

bobsoron said:


> The eye candy has made text much less legible. The flat blue of the old program banner was perfectly readable; the gradient now, not so much.
> 
> (snip)
> 
> The onscreen scroll arrows used to be clear and visible; now they're tiny smudges that blend into the animated background.
> 
> Whether they're bugs or design decisions, they've made the Tivo significantly less pleasant to use. Some screens have also had their layouts tweaked in a way that seems to give me less information, but I can't A/B anything, obviously; I just feel like I'm seeing many more ellipses in lists.


Agree with you on the readability and the scroll arrows. Nothing like trying to see white on very light blue.

I agree, too, that this update has made TiVo a lot more difficult to use, and a lot less pleasant. All of this extra paging is extremely trying.


----------



## RoyK

RoyK said:


> ........
> 
> After the game went into NPL and tried to stop the recording. No joy. Couldn't stop it from the "Stop Recording" menu and couldn't do it with the clear button either. In both cases popped me back to NPL and the game was still recording. LED on the box still on too.
> 
> Finally tried changing channels and got the option to stop recording there and that worked.


This bug confirmed by at least two others see here


----------



## astrohip

bobsoron said:


> Well, Wishlists have never been fast -- but my reference to their slowness referred to the lack of caching after returning to the Upcoming Programs screen from a detail screen, which I don't remember in 8.x.


Yes, we are talking about the same thing. Before 8.x, the return to the main screen was almost instant. The delay you see started with 8.x. I'm a heavy WL user, and I noticed this immediately when it changed. Now having said this, it's possible that there was a difference between Series 2 & 3 on when it became painful. I'm on an S3 unit. Maybe S2s are just now seeing this?



FilmCritic3000 said:


> Also, I must state that I do not like the new way of accessing WishList items. If you're browsing through your WishList, then you access an item, and then return to the main list, you're returned all the way back to the beginning of your WishList.


I like to think this is not "the new way", but a bug that will be quickly fixed (fingers crossed).



Soapm said:


> The problem with using a MASH wishlist is it will record any show with the word MASH in it.


Absolutely perfect application for the new WishLists. Try it! :up:


----------



## formulaben

Soapm said:


> *In addition to this, mines doesn't seem to recognize my old wishlist entries so I am having to build duplicate entries from scratch. Same with my season passes. This is taking a very long time;*


I was going to ask if the season passes get wiped when upgrading. I've got 8.1 from a relatively new unit. Will I need to re-enter all my season passes?


----------



## RoyK

formulaben said:


> I was going to ask if the season passes get wiped when upgrading. I've got 8.1 from a relatively new unit. Will I need to re-enter all my season passes?


Mine survived ok, others complain theirs didn't.


----------



## MickeS

I finally called TiVo about the 16:9 bug I mentioned earlier in the thread (and about an S3 related issue, but I'll post that in the S3 forum ). The girl I talked to was very nice, but insisted that it was an "aspect ratio issue" and not related to the widescreen format of my files, because the Series 2 doesn't support that, even though I explained that I wasn't talking about recording, but about playing back files from the PC on a widescreen TV.

After some back and forth, I just asked her to forward the issue to someone else... while she seemed very nice, I don't have much hope of that phone call from me doing anything good with regards to notifying TiVo about this issue.


----------



## ZeoTiVo

vasilemj said:


> Update: My program DID record as scheduled. I guess this is a good thing but yet another bug they'll have to work out.
> 
> Geez, I do not envy the programmers over at TiVo right now. If I were them, I wouldn't even know where to start in resolving all these bugs. There seems like hundreds of them!


 For such things the process is to maintain a priority list and rank the bugs on that list. A sizing of the fix for the bug is included and small stuff can get knocked out without having to prioritze perhaps but mainly the technology side confers with the business side on which things are the most important to work on.

This feedback from the customers is of course very important to the business as they think in terms of sales and marketing impacts for which bugs need fixing first. Calling in and getting a case number on a bug will give the business that feedback.


----------



## ZeoTiVo

formulaben said:


> I was going to ask if the season passes get wiped when upgrading. I've got 8.1 from a relatively new unit. Will I need to re-enter all my season passes?


in general no worry. Season passes and wishlists and recordings are all meant to move along with the update and not be impacted.

That said there was a major overhaul of Wishlists so some few are experiencing a bug and having to redo some things as discussed in this bug thread.


----------



## Natron

I would like to add that the aux is not working due to 9.1 update to this thread. Since it worked before the update it is probably do the 9.1 update. The aux used to allow input that could be watch live or recorded. It is good for camcorder, DVD and video game input. Now it does not show on the screen just the searching message.

Here is a thread I start and a work around:
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=369578


----------



## Georgia Guy

CaseyK24 said:


> I'll second this one - One transfer was "stuck" in the To Do list (wasn't actually transfering). Then could not transfer any other program and the cancel of the stuck one in the To Do List didn't work until I re-booted to clear it off the To Do list.
> 
> ALSO more MRV problems as noted by many:
> Slooooooooooooooooow display of remote play list. Transfers don't always start correctly. 9.1 for MRV - OUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


*I'll third this one*. Also, if I start tranferring a program to a Tivo I am watching and then go thru my NPL deleting some old shows, it will kill the transfer. Also, if I had more than one show set up for transfer, they will all show in the To Do list as "waiting for previous transfer to finish"... including the first one that self-aborted. Any attempt to cancel the offending "stuck" transfer fails...the show will not go away, and no subsequent transfer will ever start, until I do a full reboot.

As you said, scrolling thru remote "now playing" lists take *FOREVER*.

Never had any problems like this until the 9.1 update (which is on all of my machines).


----------



## MickeS

Everyone needs to call TiVo, so they know for sure all this stuff is going on.


----------



## DavidDal

I just signed up to say I am getting pixelation when changing channels since the 9.1 update. I have an older Series 2 box.

It was already slow changing channels but this is ridiculous! The guide is also harder to read, but that is just a minor annoyance really.

I plan on reporting this problem to Tivo because it has seriously hampered my tv watching and has got me peeved. Seems like they tried to fix what wasn't broken...


----------



## bobsoron

Well, this one just happened, and I apologize that it's not obviously repeatable. I inadvertently OKed a channel change that would take me away from the ALCS, and with the clock ticking I went into the To Do list -- left arrow, 2 button -- to remote the imminent recording.

I hurriedly pressed down arrow to highlight the upcoming program so I could hit Clear, but apparently I was far faster than the Tivo's event buffer and got the thud... _and the highlight bar vanished._

At this point I could press the down arrow and get the normal pop sound, but if I pressed the up arrow, I got a thud. At no point was the highlight bar visible.

Pressing left arrow to get back to the main menu and 2 to return to To Do brought back the highlight bar and I canceled the recording in time.

But losing the highlight bar in the To Do list, anytime, ain't a good thing.


----------



## mattack

I'm not sure if this one has ben mentioned yet. It's on the lower end of seriousness but is still annoying.

When you view by channel, you now have to hit enter/right arrow twice to get to the channels. It seems to be related to the fact that the channel area now accepts 4 digits rather than 2.

view by channel
go to channel area
type 45 for example
right arrow
(now the channel name fills in)
now you have to right arrow again to actually get to the listings. You used to be able to just right arrow after typing or up/down arrowing to the specific channel.


----------



## Billyh1026

Instead of using the Live TV button to swap from one tuner to the other I use the Enter button after I'm on the 2 channels I want. Anyone know why the banner clears faster using the Enter button? I prefer it to go as fast as possible. I do have it set to clear fast in the setting also.

Another thing is that I've canceled programs from the To Do list that are recording. When I do it makes my pointer jumps almost all the way down to the bottom of my To Do list. It stops at the point where the last recording is scheduled and the programs with nothing scheduled to record start.

Anyone else have either of these happen to them??


----------



## briang5

I havent read all the posts so this may have already been reported but I noticed a bug with the new wishlist. If I create a wish list such as Lauren Graham and NOT Gilmore girls, it will give me some "bonus" shows that dont include Lauren Grahem, but include someone with the first name Lauren, and someone else with the last name Graham. If the wish list is JUST for Lauren Grahem with not the exclusion of gilmore girls, then there are no erroneous shows, just way to many episodes of Gilmore girls. Not that you can ever have too many episodes of the Gilmore girls .... Ah Lorelie, Ah rory, but I digress .....


----------



## Soapm

DavidDal said:


> It was already slow changing channels but this is ridiculous! The guide is also harder to read, but that is just a minor annoyance really..


It's a major problem to me, I find white letters on light blue background next to impossible for me to read so I can hardly tell what I'm watching.


----------



## RoyK

Last night we attempted to stop an in-process MRV transfer from the NPL Menu. It took five tries before the transfer stopped. This is NOT repeatable.


----------



## bicker

I've had that happen a bunch of times over the past couple of years.


----------



## RoyK

bicker said:


> I've had that happen a bunch of times over the past couple of years.


Interesting. We have been heavy MRV users for over 3 years and had never seen it before last night.


----------



## TivoZorro

This happened twice now:

1. Initiate multiple transfers from Tivo to Tivo Desktop
2. somewhere down the line one of the transfers failes. Number 1 makes it but number 2 fails
3. have to cancel all of the transfers and delete partial transfers from Tivo Desktop and clean my computer cache
4. Reboot laptop
5. Head upstairs and reboot Tivo
4. Head back to laptop and decide that the only way it can transer is to do one at a time.
5. Major pain in the butt as I am going on away on a job and I wanted to get 5 shows transfered before I left. Guess I'm stuck doing whatever I can before 1 PM

This is the first time I've really been pissed. Somebody needs to get these issues fixed soon.


----------



## astrohip

briang5 said:


> If I create a wish list such as Lauren Graham and NOT Gilmore girls, it will give me some "bonus" shows that dont include Lauren Grahem, but include someone with the first name Lauren, and someone else with the last name Graham.


This is caused by using a person's name as a Keyword Search. Instead use Actor's Name as the search field, and enter Graham, Lauren. That will ONLY find shows with her, not just a Lauren or a Graham. Then add -GILMORE as a Keyword or Title field, and you will have what you want.


----------



## formulaben

Billyh1026 said:


> Instead of using the Live TV button to swap from one tuner to the other I use the Enter button after I'm on the 2 channels I want.


My old HDVR2 DirecTivo used the down arrow to swap tuners...a very nice shortcut. My HDT doesn't do that. I thought the enter button switched to last tuned channel (same tuner)? At least that's what it did on the HDVR2.


----------



## wmcbrine

astrohip said:


> This is caused by using a person's name as a Keyword Search. Instead use Actor's Name as the search field, and enter Graham, Lauren. That will ONLY find shows with her, not just a Lauren or a Graham. Then add -GILMORE as a Keyword or Title field, and you will have what you want.


Are the Advanced Wishlists documented somewhere? It looks like the manuals haven't been updated on Tivo.com yet. I see people talking about functionality that I haven't figured out yet.


----------



## CaseyK24

One more problem which I haven't seen in all these pages.

When going through the process to record a show by time and I get to the last screen with the Date Box the Time Box then the list of shows to the right. I keep the current date - advance the time to say 10:00pm then move the cursor right and it goes to the first channel on the list which is channel 2 which is "Shark" - then when I pick the select button it shows the info from another channel for that time so if I'm not observant I pick the wrong show to record. If I press the cursor left its on the other show say channel 7.

If I go from the time to the right and it goes on channel 2 then I pick down to channel 3 then up to channel 2 then it gets it right when I press select. but for some reason it doesn't realize which show is highlighted by default when you go from the time to the shows by pressing left once (even though the channel 2 show is highlighted visually).

Casey


----------



## DavidDal

Soapm said:


> It's a major problem to me, I find white letters on light blue background next to impossible for me to read so I can hardly tell what I'm watching.


It is definitely a poor design and I can understand how it is a big deal to some people.

I guess what I meant is, I wouldn't call the design, fonts, and color changes a "bug". The people at Tivo obviously made those choices on purpose (and they made poor choices).


----------



## richsadams

FYI, it looks like the v9.1 "patch" - actually v9.2.J is rolling out as a trial. The few that have gotten it claim that it's fixing their issues (let's hope so), plus has other support features.

More info.


----------



## thehepcat

crowfan said:


> I am seeing this exact same thing. It's a pain when there is a marathon of shows with bad data, cause you can't just hit Clear to delete them. You have to go into each one individually.


This is a big one for me. Daily maintenance time has gone up noticeably. Any word on a fix???

Otherwise, I haven't had any other problems. I like the new graphics.


----------



## yunlin12

thehepcat said:


> This is a big one for me. Daily maintenance time has gone up noticeably. Any word on a fix???
> 
> Otherwise, I haven't had any other problems. I like the new graphics.


See post above yours


----------



## RoyK

The announced 9.2 is for S3 and HDTV units only. See here


----------



## MultimediaJones

As someone else mentioned in this thread, I've come across the Swivel Search just going to a black screen with Please Wait [entered via NP More Options on an S2 240].

Also, have made the mistake once of pressing SELECT after the channel number during browse by channel. Froze the interface completely where it was. The background animation continued but the remote no longer did anything, not even pressing the TiVo button, though the other TiVo could still access it via MRV. After 30 minutes, rebooted it, and won't press select there again.

Also had one today I think I've seen mentioned but couldn't find again. After the latest daily connection, with nothing else having changed, one TiVo had resurrected what seemed like every season pass I've ever had. None were associated with any channel, many duplicated valid SPs, some were listed two or three times in different places, and they were intermixed priority-wise with the valid SPs. I suppose since they weren't linked to a channel they wouldn't do much as far as scheduling, but what a mess it made of the SP manager.

It isn't encouraging to hear 9.2 is not for S2, while hearing no word as far as what TiVo is going to do for S2 owners. What is especially puzzling is I thought 9.x was going to unify the code base for S2/S3, so if 9.2 fixes bugs that S2 users have why wouldn't it be rolled out for S2's?


----------



## sdjeep

Like many people here, I noticed serious issues after the last service update. I have 4 TiVos which are hard wire networked and they were working great before the update. Not navigating the menus is very sluggish especially if you try to transfer a program from another TiVo to the one you want to watch it on. Not only is the navigation of the programs on the other TIVO's extremely sluggish, transfer speed has been obviously degraded as well.  :down: :down: :down:


----------



## richsadams

sdjeep said:


> Like many people here, I noticed serious issues after the last service update. I have 4 TiVos which are hard wire networked and they were working great before the update. Not navigating the menus is very sluggish especially if you try to transfer a program from another TiVo to the one you want to watch it on. Not only is the navigation of the programs on the other TIVO's extremely sluggish, transfer speed has been obviously degraded as well.  :down: :down: :down:


Im guessing youve tried rebooting TiVo (unplug it for 10 to 15 seconds and plug it back in) as well as rebooting your network components?

If that doesnt help, let us know if you see an improvement once you receive v9.2 software upgrade. It's only in trial distribution now, but should start rolling out to everyone soon. Hang in there!


----------



## BobCamp1

Richsadams,

The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.

This comes from TivoPony himself.

(In other words, S2 users will have to live with these bugs for quite a while longer. This is implied by what TivoPony didn't say -- he didn't mention the S2s at all.)

Most people posting in this forum are S1/S2 owners. Mainly because S3/HD owners have their own forum. I realize that you own both, but many people here only own an S1 and/or an S2. 

As bad as 9.1 was for S2 users, it was much worse for S3 owners.


----------



## Joey Bagadonuts

BobCamp1 said:


> Richsadams,
> 
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> 
> This comes from TivoPony himself.
> 
> (In other words, S2 users will have to live with these bugs for quite a while longer. This is implied by what TivoPony didn't say -- he didn't mention the S2s at all.)
> 
> Most people posting in this forum are S1/S2 owners. Mainly because S3/HD owners have their own forum. I realize that you own both, but many people here only own an S1 and/or an S2.
> 
> As bad as 9.1 was for S2 users, it was much worse for S3 owners.


Gee, this wouldn't be a ploy on TiVo's part to get their S2 users to upgrade to S3 or HD units, would it???


----------



## astrohip

wmcbrine said:


> Are the Advanced Wishlists documented somewhere? It looks like the manuals haven't been updated on Tivo.com yet. I see people talking about functionality that I haven't figured out yet.


Not any documentation. But a detailed thread with some tips & tweaks is here . . .
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=368964


----------



## carroca

wmcbrine said:


> Are the Advanced Wishlists documented somewhere? It looks like the manuals haven't been updated on Tivo.com yet. I see people talking about functionality that I haven't figured out yet.


Here's the TiVo Setup & Support page that explains Advanced Wishlists: http://customersupport.tivo.com/LaunchContent.aspx?CID=7E7238A7-E649-40D4-8255-0A783A80C29B
Most of the new "advanced" features are listed under item 3.


----------



## FilmCritic3000

Joey Bagadonuts said:


> Gee, this wouldn't be a ploy on TiVo's part to get their S2 users to upgrade to S3 or HD units, would it???


You and I are on the same page with that train of thought.

I guess I'll have to live with these annoying bugs, as I can't afford to make the jump to a S3 at the moment.


----------



## Billyh1026

formulaben said:


> My old HDVR2 DirecTivo used the down arrow to swap tuners...a very nice shortcut. My HDT doesn't do that. I thought the enter button switched to last tuned channel (same tuner)? At least that's what it did on the HDVR2.


The enter button on my S2 does switch back to the previous channel IF I don't use the Live TV button to switch to the other tuner. Once I do use the Live TV button to change tuners the Enter button functions just like the Live TV button swapping back and forth between tuners. AND, the banner clears MUCH faster. Not jut a little faster...a lot faster.


----------



## richsadams

BobCamp1 said:


> Richsadams,
> 
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> The 9.2 update is for S3 and HD units only.
> 
> This comes from TivoPony himself.


 Did your copy and paste routine get stuck? Oh...wait...youre trying to make a pointDOH! I get it. 



BobCamp1 said:


> Most people posting in this forum are S1/S2 owners. Mainly because S3/HD owners have their own forum. I realize that you own both, but many people here only own an S1 and/or an S2.
> 
> As bad as 9.1 was for S2 users, it was much worse for S3 owners.


 There's nothing in the OP's post that indicates what type of TiVo's they have. The OP did say that they are all hard wired...which could mean they are S2's w/adapters OR S3's where hard wiring is more common, or a combination (likely IMHO). Unlike us old timers, its not uncommon for new posters to end up in the wrong thread. So you're ASSuming that the OP has S2's _only_?

I could have/should have added the caveat that the trial upgrade, v9.2.J, is being sent to a few S3's and THD's at this time. Thanks for pointing that out in such a polite manner.

I offered some support to someone asking for help. Other than trying to make me wrong, its nice to know that your post was helpful to the OP as wellI think.


----------



## BobCamp1

richsadams said:


> Did your copy and paste routine get stuck? Oh...wait...youre trying to make a pointDOH! I get it.
> 
> I offered some support to someone asking for help. Other than trying to make me wrong, its nice to know that your post was helpful to the OP as wellI think.


I was just trying to not offer false hope.

Also, someone else posted that 9.2 was S3/HD only prior to your post, but it didn't look like you saw it based on your response. You saw my post though. 

I also saw in another thread today (where someone else pointed out to you that 9.2 was not for S2s) where you realized that 9.2 was S3/HD only.

Anyway, for anyone who wants to go back to 8.3, keep in mind that MRV won't work with other 9.x machines. But if you want to do it, you just have to find an 8.3 image (DVRUpgrade.com is still at 7.2), pull the hard drive from your Tivo, restore it (losing all recordings & season passes), perform a clear & delete everything , then run SApper (see the Tivo Underground forum) which I think contains the hack to block future software updates.

Edit: Forgot that SApper can work with 8.3, probably. You may also need to replace your PROM with a hacked PROM.


----------



## pjhartman

If this is some sort of play by TiVo -- fix the S3/HD units but leave the S1/S2 users with a buggy release -- to try to push upgrades to a newer unit, then it's not working in my case. I've about had it with TiVo as their software releases keep getting slower and buggier each time.


----------



## Joey Bagadonuts

pjhartman said:


> If this is some sort of play by TiVo -- fix the S3/HD units but leave the S1/S2 users with a buggy release -- to try to push upgrades to a newer unit, then it's not working in my case. I've about had it with TiVo as their software releases keep getting slower and buggier each time.


Depending on how long it takes TiVo to fix the 9.1 bugs for S2 users, I, too might cancel my 3 TiVo S2's and just go with Time Warner DVRs. Until 9.1 came out, TW's DVR software couldn't hold a candle to TiVo's but with this recent "upgrade", they're now fairly comparable. Not to mention (but I will anyway), the S3's are still way too over priced and some TWC customers are still having terrible experiences with cable card installs.


----------



## TiVoPony

briang5 said:


> I havent read all the posts so this may have already been reported but I noticed a bug with the new wishlist. If I create a wish list such as Lauren Graham and NOT Gilmore girls, it will give me some "bonus" shows that dont include Lauren Grahem, but include someone with the first name Lauren, and someone else with the last name Graham. If the wish list is JUST for Lauren Grahem with not the exclusion of gilmore girls, then there are no erroneous shows, just way to many episodes of Gilmore girls. Not that you can ever have too many episodes of the Gilmore girls .... Ah Lorelie, Ah rory, but I digress .....


If you can, please let us know if you entered Lauren Graham as an actor or as a keyword.

I've just tried replicating this with the engineer that wrote the code...it worked perfectly here.

Thanks!
Pony


----------



## brianp

Count me as another TiVo user who's pretty fed up with the 9.1 "upgrade". If TiVo won't acknowledge the problems, maybe they can be shamed into taking action.

I just sent a tip to CNET News (news,com) about us unhappy TiVo owners. Maybe they'll look into it and publish a story. Other tech news sites would probably be interested in this as well. Some bad PR might encourage TiVo to fix things.

I'm generally a happy TiVo owner, but I paid a lot of good money for my TiVo units and in return, I expect a certain level of quality and support. Even good companies sometimes need a kick in the butt.

-Brian


----------



## briang5

TiVoPony said:


> If you can, please let us know if you entered Lauren Graham as an actor or as a keyword.
> 
> I've just tried replicating this with the engineer that wrote the code...it worked perfectly here.
> 
> Thanks!
> Pony


TIVOPONY,

Its really cool that you are looking at my issue. (This post is a little long but it has what you need at the end!)

I tried to recreate the problem I had seen after seeing your post, and I couldnt. This frustrated me, because I debug silicon issues all day and if there is one thing I should know how to do is write up a good bounded , reproducable bug report !!!

So I kept hacking at it to try to recreate it and I finally did.

The title exclusion was just a red herring. It has to do with the actors name, and if it is being ORed with anyone else. For example, the search of shows with Lauren Graham doesnt return any false shows, but a search of Lauren Graham or Natalie Portman does. To further simplify things, you dont even need the second actor, as simply having the () around the actors name will cause bad search results.

For Example, this is OK
GRAHM, LAUREN

This is not
(GRAHM, LAUREN)

The later will return the shows men in trees and alien nation. These shows do not show up on the former search. Both of the "false" shows have a lauren xxx, and a XXXX grahem in them, just not "lauren grahem". Both searchs were "actor" searches" and not "keyword" searches.

Thanks for fixing our bugs !!! Also, while I have you attention, here is one of my posted suggestions. I think it would make a fine feature for a future release !!! http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=369096


----------



## bkdtv

briang5,

Be aware that search results may not be accurate while the Tivo is re-indexing its guide data, which occurs after some software updates.


----------



## carroca

briang5 said:


> Lauren Graham





briang5 said:


> For Example, this is OK
> GRAHM, LAUREN
> 
> This is not
> (GRAHM, LAUREN)





briang5 said:


> lauren xxx, and a XXXX grahem in them, just not "lauren grahem"


Also note that you spelled "Graham" 3 different ways in your post. Make sure you're not making spelling errors on the TiVo.


----------



## mpmclaugh33

I'll add my 9.1 experiences.

1. Pixelation - Happens every time I change the channel on my 40hr Series2 but not an issue at all on my 60hr Series2
2. MRV - I could transfer shows from 40hr to 60hr but 60hr one would show an empty screen when I tried to view shows on the 40hr one. both had 9.1 I rebooted the 60hr one and it still didn't work. I rebooted the 40hr one and it now works ok
3. Light blue screen at times when changing channels or navigating screens on the 60hr, not experiencing this on the 40hr.
4. Occasional light blue splotches on the screen for many shows on the 60hr, same color as the light blue screen in #3.
5. Possible sound issue...wife just called me and said there was a lot of "noise" coming from the speakers. had her switch sources on the receiver and it was not an issue for the cable box not hooked up to a tivo. Told her to reboot. I don't know if its a true issue or if the reboot fixed it.
6. Same slowness reported by others when navigating the MRV now playing list.

Overall I find this to be a lot of annoyances for a software release with no significant end user features other than the wish list enhancements. I understand that its more likely intended to lay some foundation in order to support S3/S2 MRV. My main concerns are the different behaviors on my older tivo vs the newer one and the blue screen/splotches on the 60hr and the pixelation on the 40hr. 

All in all I gained no real benefit from 9.1 and now have some minor annoyances to deal with but being in the software industry, there will always be bugs. I do hope they put out a patch in the next couple of weeks to address these issues.


----------



## briang5

carroca said:


> Also note that you spelled "Graham" 3 different ways in your post. Make sure you're not making spelling errors on the TiVo.


Carroca,

Alas it is true, I am a horrific speller, and a really poor typist. Once at college I had a friend who was studying to be a teacher and she giave me like a 5th grade spelling test and I failed.

Lucky for me TIVO lets me pick Lauren Grahems names from a list!. Although the post had spelling errors the bug reported was accurate(at least the second time it was). In fact, It would be cool it someone else could reproduce it because I get the feeling everyone thinks I may be a tad crazy. Try and actor search with you know who, then try it with the "()" and without the "()". Hopefully you will see what I mean and see "alien nation" and "men in trees" when you do it with the "()", and not when you dont use the parenthesis

BKDTV,

I dont think the error has anything to do with updating the guide data as the solftware update was at least a week ago.


----------



## Lenonn

I've had a bug since 9.1 got installed, but it's hard to describe, and I haven't figured out any rhyme or reason for when or why it occurs. I've noticed it so far only on shows recorded of digital cable (CBS and NBC - most notable any of the _CSI_ shows and how with _The Tonight Show with Jay Leno_). With the CBS shows, I noticed the bug when watching recordings; with NBC, it was when watching live. It seems to happen after fast forwarding through commercials.

The bug is some sort of weird visual effect (almost like how you can look at video recorded on film and video recorded on digital media and can see the difference). As I said, difficult to describe. Almost as though not every frame is being shown. If I pause and unpause the recording, the video "syncs" back up and plays as it should. I wish I could record a video of it, though. Sorry for the vague description.

I am using a TiVoHD with RCN cable service and a Motorola M-card. The video worked fine until 9.1.

*Addendum:* Our TiVoHD has not been hacked or edited in any way. It has software 9.0-01-2-652. Our sources: we have an M cable card (program source 2; Motorola card, hardware version 0469927002), plus we have an antenna connected (program source 1). We use the default remote (alongside our Harmony 880 remote, but the Harmony hasn't been used at all when these problems occur). All the channels and recordings that show this problem are all ones we received via cable (and were digital/HD channels).

I again noticed this problem when watching my recording of Thursday evening's episode of _Smallville_. Pausing and unpausing the video makes the video normal again, sometimes for only a few minutes. Things actually got better in the second half-hour. It almost seems as though the hard drive and processor can't handle the signal. I've checked and it looks like the cable signal strength in in the 50-60 range.


----------



## TwiceOver

Yeah I'm having a real hard time keeping with my TiVos now. Before the price was actually better than from my provider, but with the bugs, I don't know if I can last long.

What the 9.1 update did for me:

Series 2 2400 ST: Slow. 3-5 second blue screen in between switching channels. 5-10 second for guide to come up. 5+ second switch between guide pages. Operating so slow my Series2 DT cannot browse the MRV data. I can literally it the Guide button, get up, get a beer, sit back down and the data is just coming up. The visual effects are worthless, if it is going to cause this slowness, dump 'em.

Series 2 DT: Messed up season pass information by adding to the amount of shows I would like to keep at once. Some of them were bumped up to 25! Cannot browse my other TiVo as listed above (Probably a problem with that TiVo). This TiVo operates much better than the older 2400 model.

They really gotta watch the effects with different hardware. My DT handles the update fairly well, but the ST is just worthless. Also there is the problem with folder browsing on the computer. Still can't do that.


----------



## TiVoPony

briang5 said:


> TIVOPONY,
> 
> Its really cool that you are looking at my issue. (This post is a little long but it has what you need at the end!)
> 
> I tried to recreate the problem I had seen after seeing your post, and I couldnt. This frustrated me, because I debug silicon issues all day and if there is one thing I should know how to do is write up a good bounded , reproducable bug report !!!
> 
> So I kept hacking at it to try to recreate it and I finally did.
> 
> The title exclusion was just a red herring. It has to do with the actors name, and if it is being ORed with anyone else. For example, the search of shows with Lauren Graham doesnt return any false shows, but a search of Lauren Graham or Natalie Portman does. To further simplify things, you dont even need the second actor, as simply having the () around the actors name will cause bad search results.
> 
> For Example, this is OK
> GRAHM, LAUREN
> 
> This is not
> (GRAHM, LAUREN)
> 
> The later will return the shows men in trees and alien nation. These shows do not show up on the former search. Both of the "false" shows have a lauren xxx, and a XXXX grahem in them, just not "lauren grahem". Both searchs were "actor" searches" and not "keyword" searches.
> 
> Thanks for fixing our bugs !!! Also, while I have you attention, here is one of my posted suggestions. I think it would make a fine feature for a future release !!! http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=369096


This level of detail in your report is really helpful. Thanks.

We've been able to reproduce the issue here now, and will work a fix into a future release. In the meantime, if you're using an actor as an optional term, adding that actor as a keyword will work. Again, thanks for the detailed description, it really helps in tracking these kind of problems down.

Pony


----------



## TiVoPony

In trying to set expectations, yes, we're aware that there are bugs to be fixed in 9.1.

Series3 and TiVo HD systems now have 9.2 available (via the priority page).

For Series2, as some have surmised, the issues in 9.1 tend to be more on the cosmetic or nuisance side...they don't tend to break the basic functionality of the box. I know that in saying that there will be examples posted that people do believe are impossible to live with.

If you post such an example, please help us help you. Post as much detail as you can about the behavior your seeing. Include the make and model of your box. The software version. Whether you've hacked things. Is the behavior the same on all of your DVR's, or is it model specific. All of that is important in sorting and prioritizing...and it makes it much easier to respond. A polite, thoughtful post is always appreciated. The Wishlist issue that briang5 discovered above in this thread is an excellent example.

I'd ask that you also appreciate that this forum is not a substitute for customer support. If you have an issue, you should report it via customer support. Jerry and I are only two people, and posting here is not our full time job. We participate here because we're allowed to, we love TiVo, and we want to try and help the community where we're able.

Thanks,
Pony


----------



## boettcht

Hi Pony,

Long time Tivo & forum user, but quite poster. I have 3 S2 units (140, 240, & 540) and the MRV has been really slow & not working at all since the 9.1 update. My biggest issue is with my 140 unit and it failing it Tivo call ins with a failed to get configuration. Also the Music, Photos & More is now giving me the message about connecting my Tivo to broadband to get more features. This feature has always worked for me since it was introduced. This update is very frustration, I can not transfer any shows between my Tivos which is a necessary daily task in my household.
I do plan on calling support but have not had the time due to work. Any help you could provide would be greatly appreciated.

140 Wired Netgear FA120
240 Wireless Netgear WG111
540 Wired Netgear M200 Ver 2


----------



## richsadams

Thanks very much Pony. We appreciate yours and Jerry's help and continued consideration. :up:


----------



## TiVoPony

boettcht said:


> Hi Pony,
> 
> Long time Tivo & forum user, but quite poster. I have 3 S2 units (140, 240, & 540) and the MRV has been really slow & not working at all since the 9.1 update. My biggest issue is with my 140 unit and it failing it Tivo call ins with a failed to get configuration. Also the Music, Photos & More is now giving me the message about connecting my Tivo to broadband to get more features. This feature has always worked for me since it was introduced. This update is very frustration, I can not transfer any shows between my Tivos which is a necessary daily task in my household.
> I do plan on calling support but have not had the time due to work. Any help you could provide would be greatly appreciated.
> 
> 140 Wired Netgear FA120
> 240 Wireless Netgear WG111
> 540 Wired Netgear M200 Ver 2


Slow transfer speeds between your Series2 systems is not expected. Slow navigating of a remote Now Playing List is expected, and has to do with changes put in place to support Series3 transfers in the future. Whether that browsing can be sped up or not and maintain S3 compatibility is being investigated, but we all understand that browsing a remote DVR is slower than before.

This however is not what you're refering too, correct? You're saying the actual transfers between units are slower. Can you provide measures? We did test this within beta, and while there were a small number of slow reports, the vast majority of people thought it was equal or faster than before...the sat numbers looked very good. There was nothing done that would cause us to expect Series2 to Series2 transfers to be slower. So additional detail here will help a lot.

Let us know the length of show, quality recorded at, and how long it takes to go from one box to the other (as well as which one is feeding and which one is receiving). Wired or wireless, and which way around (feed/receive). Etc.

Thanks!
Pony


----------



## TiVoPony

While I'm posting on transfer speeds, I'll share a bit more, to help set expectations for things to come...

Some will key that I'm specifically saying S2 to S2 as not intended to be slower in the post above. 

I'll share that S2 to S3 (and S3 to S2 transfers) will be slower by design. S2 and S3 architectures do not record in exactly the same format, so there is some conversion done for analog recordings. Internally we call these 'non-native' transfers (whereas s2 to s2 or s3/THD to s3/THD is always 'native'). 

As stated in the past, HD content recorded on a S3 architecture will not be supported for transfers to S2 architectures. Only SD content can go from S3 to S2 or TiVo HD to S2.

Pony


----------



## TiVoPony

boettcht said:


> My biggest issue is with my 140 unit and it failing it Tivo call ins with a failed to get configuration. Also the Music, Photos & More is now giving me the message about connecting my Tivo to broadband to get more features. This feature has always worked for me since it was introduced.
> 
> 140 Wired Netgear FA120
> 240 Wireless Netgear WG111
> 540 Wired Netgear M200 Ver 2


Realized I didn't ask about your network connectivity issue. I don't know if it's related to the transfer speed issue or not. I wonder if others can correlate.

Have you tried rebooting the boxes? (sorry for the classic first-step suggestion).

I see you have three different netgear adapters. The biggest problem you've had is with the 140 unit. If you switch that adapter with the one on the 540, does the problem follow the adapter?

Thanks,
Pony


----------



## boettcht

TiVoPony said:


> Realized I didn't ask about your network connectivity issue. I don't know if it's related to the transfer speed issue or not. I wonder if others can correlate.
> 
> Have you tried rebooting the boxes? (sorry for the classic first-step suggestion).
> 
> I see you have three different netgear adapters. The biggest problem you've had is with the 140 unit. If you switch that adapter with the one on the 540, does the problem follow the adapter?
> 
> Thanks,
> Pony


I have tried rebooting all 3 systems. I have not tried moving the adapters around yet. Haven't been home a lot since the update came down so I haven't had time to do anything more then the basic troubleshooting of rebooting. I will try that when I get home.

What I have noticed is that MRV browsing is very slow, from listing the programs on the remote system to being really slow bringing up a programs details. This all when MRV is working sometimes I can't connect at all.

On the 140 the Photos, Music, & more sometimes works and sometimes displays the message to attach a broadband adapter to use these features. I can't figure out why it is switching back and forth. You can enter it and it working go back out to the main menu and go back in and it won't be working.

Once again thanks for your time and support.


----------



## RoyK

TiVoPony please take a look at post 110 in this thread especially paragraph 4. This is a serious MRV problem. I did extensive testing and can provide you with a complete writeup including screen shots in PDF format.


----------



## formulaben

RoyK said:


> TiVoPony please take a look at post 110 in this thread especially paragraph 4. This is a serious MRV problem.


Link to 110 --->http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5572299&&#post5572299


----------



## TiVoPony

boettcht said:


> I have tried rebooting all 3 systems. I have not tried moving the adapters around yet. Haven't been home a lot since the update came down so I haven't had time to do anything more then the basic troubleshooting of rebooting. I will try that when I get home.
> 
> What I have noticed is that MRV browsing is very slow, from listing the programs on the remote system to being really slow bringing up a programs details. This all when MRV is working sometimes I can't connect at all.
> 
> On the 140 the Photos, Music, & more sometimes works and sometimes displays the message to attach a broadband adapter to use these features. I can't figure out why it is switching back and forth. You can enter it and it working go back out to the main menu and go back in and it won't be working.
> 
> Once again thanks for your time and support.


As I mentioned, browsing a remote now playing list is slower by design. It would be interesting to know how slow your system typically is to pull up a page full of information. As always, knowing which box is the source, which the receiver, and things like network adapters is always important.

Thanks,
Pony


----------



## TiVoPony

RoyK said:


> TiVoPony please take a look at post 110 in this thread especially paragraph 4. This is a serious MRV problem. I did extensive testing and can provide you with a complete writeup including screen shots in PDF format.


I'm reading this:

4. Attempts to transfer a program to a third box from a box already in the process of transferring a program to another result in an error saying that the source box was unavailable or could not be found.

That is a known limitation of the present implementation of MRV. A DVR can only source one recording at a time. The error message does not sound correct, I'll ask about that, I believe the intended behavior is for the transfer to be queued. In making Series2 capable of sharing recordings with Series3/TiVo HD the ability to simultaneously source to multiple DVRs was no longer possible.

Pony


----------



## RoyK

formulaben said:


> Link to 110 --->http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5572299&&#post5572299


Thanks. How did you get that link straight to the post?


----------



## RoyK

TiVoPony said:


> I'm reading this:
> 
> 4. Attempts to transfer a program to a third box from a box already in the process of transferring a program to another result in an error saying that the source box was unavailable or could not be found.
> 
> That is a known limitation of the present implementation of MRV. A DVR can only source one recording at a time. The error message does not sound correct, I'll ask about that, I believe the intended behavior is for the transfer to be queued. In making Series2 capable of sharing recordings with Series3/TiVo HD the ability to simultaneously source to multiple DVRs was no longer possible.
> 
> Pony


Then how do you explain ZeoTiVo's comment to the contrary quoted in my post?


----------



## boettcht

TiVoPony said:


> As I mentioned, browsing a remote now playing list is slower by design. It would be interesting to know how slow your system typically is to pull up a page full of information. As always, knowing which box is the source, which the receiver, and things like network adapters is always important.
> 
> Thanks,
> Pony


I'll will get this info sometime tonight when I get a chance to test it out and get you some hard numbers.


----------



## TiVoPony

RoyK said:


> Then how do you explain ZeoTiVo's comment to the contrary quoted in my post?


Sorry guys, I'm not getting into any he-said, she-said arguments. I'm only one guy, and there are only so many hours in the day. I just don't have the time to go investigate what someone else said, or the debate that so often follows.

I'm here to share, and be productive. Not to referee.

Pony


----------



## RoyK

TiVoPony said:


> Sorry guys, I'm not getting into any he-said, she-said arguments. I'm only one guy, and there are only so many hours in the day. I just don't have the time to go investigate what someone else said, or the debate that so often follows.
> 
> I'm here to share, and be productive. Not to referee.
> 
> Pony


Sorry, wasn't intending a dispute here. It is just that what you reported doesn't seem to be what some others are seeing.


----------



## richsadams

RoyK said:


> Thanks. How did you get that link straight to the post?


If you look to the top right of every post there is a number next to the (print) link, like #110 for instance. The numbers are actually links. If you click on the number it will bring up the thread's web page that starts with that specific post. You can then copy and paste that web page URL into your message.


----------



## Stu_Bee

Seems like the S3 codebase compatibility is crippling, in some places intentionally, the Series2's functonality.
Kinda sucks for those that had (prior to 9.1) nicely working S2's with no S3's.


----------



## RoyK

Dang. Thanks Rich - learn something every day.


----------



## TiVoPony

RoyK said:


> Sorry, wasn't intending a dispute here. It is just that what you reported doesn't seem to be what some others are seeing.


If it's really capable of simultaneously sourcing to multiple units, trust me, I'd be happy to be wrong. 

I wonder if the earlier discussion you mentioned really is talking about the same thing. The written language is a tricky thing.

Thanks,
Pony


----------



## RoyK

TiVoPony said:


> If it's really capable of simultaneously sourcing to multiple units, trust me, I'd be happy to be wrong.
> 
> I wonder if the earlier discussion you mentioned really is talking about the same thing. The written language is a tricky thing.
> 
> Thanks,
> Pony


Yes it was. Zeo and I had discussed it further up.


----------



## TiVoPony

Stu_Bee said:


> Seems like the S3 codebase compatibility is crippling, in some places intentionally, the Series2's functonality.
> Kinda sucks for those that had (prior to 9.1) nicely working S2's with no S3's.


Crippling is a strong word, full of emotion. I'd typically apply it to limitations far worse than waiting an extra couple of seconds for a list of programs from across the house to appear on your tv screen, or not being able to simultaneously transfer an episode of The Office to every DVR in the house.

You probably didn't intend it as such, I realize that. I don't mean to single you out in any way, or minimize the issues you raise. I'm just suggesting that perspective is a good thing, and word choice an important one, in all the communication we do.

If on the other hand, we did not offer compatibility with Series3 at all, the term 'crippling MRV' would also be used, just by a different set of people. You know it's true. 

In any case, feedback is always valuable, and appreciated. Thanks!

Pony


----------



## RoyK

TiVoPony said:


> Crippling is a strong word, full of emotion. I'd typically apply it to limitations far worse than waiting an extra couple of seconds for a list of programs from across the house to appear on your tv screen, or not being able to simultaneously transfer an episode of The Office to every DVR in the house.


Make that often up to 20 seconds. And yes, at least in our house with 3 units often two people in different rooms desire to watch a show that happens to have been recorded on the same unit - and not necessarily the same show. Loss of the ability to do that combined with seriously degraded navigation speed is, indeed, crippling.



TiVoPony said:


> ....
> 
> If on the other hand, we did not offer compatibility with Series3 at all, the term 'crippling MRV' would also be used, just by a different set of people. You know it's true.
> 
> ...
> 
> Pony


Sorry, I just don't feel however you want to spin it that degrading the performance of systems of one set of customers in order to provide features to another set is acceptable. And yes, if I owned S3 I'd be screaming for MRV too.


----------



## CharlesH

Thanks to TiVoPony for the insights into some of the development issues involved with supporting S2 <-> S3 MRV. :up:


----------



## TiVoPony

RoyK said:


> Sorry, I just don't feel however you want to spin it that degrading the performance of systems of one set of customers in order to provide features to another set is acceptable. And yes, if I owned S3 I'd be screaming for MRV too.


Often decisions must be made that are neither clean nor simple. There are few choices that do not come with some consequence or tradeoff.

I can do nothing else for you regarding this other than to apologize and wish you well. If given the circumstances the choice we've made is not acceptable to you, that is your personal decision, but we of course would enjoy having you as a customer.

I guess I would add that 20 seconds seems rather far outside of the bounds of the norm, so it is quite possible that your experience is not typical.

Pony


----------



## boettcht

Here are some of my findings so far

Browsing my 240 (wireless, netgear wg111) from my 140 (wired, netgear fa120)
Browse: 8 secs
Folder: 3 secs
Show Details: 27 secs
Transfer Start: 20 secs

This is all noticeably much slower than the previous version of the Tivo software. Also clicking left to go back through the programs/list takes just as long. 

So now have a show transferring from 240 to my 140.

I now go to my 540 and browse to my 240:

Browse: 10 secs
Folder: 3 secs
Show details: 38 secs
Transfer Start: 23 secs until error msg

"Can't Transfer"
There was a problem transferring the requested program to this DVR. To view which programs won't be transferred and why, go to Tivo Central and select "Find Programs" > "To Do List" > "View Recording History"

In the previous version of the Tivo software I was able to transfer two different show simultaneously from the same source Tivo to two different destination Tivos

Message in "View Recording History"

"Show title" from "Tivo Name" (transfer attempted on 10/19/07 at 11:43pm)

This program was not transferred onto this DVR because the "Tivo Name" was unavailable or could not be found. If you try the transfer again, make sure that the "Tivo Name" is plugged in, connected to the network, and that its network settings are correct.

Also other disturbing things I have discovered is that a transfer that I request yesterday never completed, no partial in "Now Playing" but the transfer with the blue record button to the left and in the details "This program is now transferring onto the "Tivo Name" DVR. Selecting the Stop Transferring only resulted in a bong, so did Play and Continue Transferring.

I rebooted the Tivo and when it came up the transfer was removed from the To Do list. In the last version a failed or interrupted transfer would resume again after the Tivo had completed its reboot.

I will test moving the Network adapters around (tomorrow) but I do really do not believe they are the issue since they have been preforming rock solid for years (minus the M200, I acquired that one 9 months ago) I have been doing MRV with these Tivo's since MRV was introduced.

Pony I am willing to do additional testing if it help fix these problems. As an IT person I understand the pieces that go into something like this but to roll out an update that breaks and degrades performance and features is not acceptable. I expect more from Tivo.


----------



## Saxion

TiVoPony, thanks for your participation here. It is really appreciated to have the ear of TiVo employees.

As an S3 owner, I was really disappointed that 9.1 and 9.2 did not deliver guide support for digital cable channels received without CableCARDs (via manual channel mapping, or some other means). Can you comment on TiVo's plans for this, or its relative priority?


----------



## RoyK

boettcht said:


> ....
> Browsing my 240 (wireless, netgear wg111) from my 140 (wired, netgear fa120)
> Browse: 8 secs
> Folder: 3 secs
> Show Details: 27 secs
> Transfer Start: 20 secs


TiVoPony maintains that these times are outside the normal. They agree closely with what I see and even a casual reading of this thread reveals many other complaints of glacial slowness in MRV navigation.



boettcht said:


> ....
> In the previous version of the Tivo software I was able to transfer two different show simultaneously from the same source Tivo to two different destination Tivos
> ......


This is precisely the feature that TiVoPony says above that S2 owners must sacrifice in order to allow transferring to S3 boxes. My protest that this is unacceptable resulted in the most polite invitation to pound sand that I've ever seen.



boettcht said:


> ....
> Also other disturbing things I have discovered is that a transfer that I request yesterday never completed, no partial in "Now Playing" but the transfer with the blue record button to the left and in the details "This program is now transferring onto the "Tivo Name" DVR. Selecting the Stop Transferring only resulted in a bong, so did Play and Continue Transferring.


This has happened to me several times also. Only rebooting the source box would resolve the problem.


----------



## bicker

Stu_Bee said:


> Seems like the S3 codebase compatibility is crippling, in some places intentionally, the Series2's functonality.


I haven't read anything about functionality being crippled. Rather, even the worst changes associated with SD compatibility, which TiVoPony referred to, change the existing functionality in a comparatively marginal way. For example, browsing a remote unit is now a certain amount slower -- not crippled.


----------



## DaveLessnau

bicker said:


> I haven't read anything about functionality being crippled. Rather, even the worst changes associated with SD compatibility, which TiVoPony referred to, change the existing functionality in a comparatively marginal way. For example, browsing a remote unit is now a certain amount slower -- not crippled.


Depends on your definition of crippled and how much you do with it. For instance, my problem with browsing any lists from within the program details screens is three times slower than it was (from, say 1/3 of a second before to a bit over 1 second, now). That doesn't sound like much. But, when you go through more than a handful of programs this way, the delay becomes intolerable. As I noted earlier, I've had to give up looking for new shows on my TiVo because of this (instead of a 15 minute daily task, it became an hour long one). Since there's no alternative way for me to do this, 9.1 has crippled my TiVo.


----------



## timstack8969

Now I noticed that when I change channels I now see a "Light Blue Screen" for a few seconds before the new channel comes up. I am using a "Single Tuner series 2 with the serial connector. Anybody else have the "Light Blue Screen"


----------



## mpmclaugh33

timstack8969 - I too have the light blue screen thing. I have two tivos and only experience this on one of them. I get the blue screen thing when I navigate to the amazon unbox screen in the menus too. I mentioned it in my post a few days ago in this thread...I am glad I am not the only one experiencing it! I read through 13 pages on this thread and you are the only other person who has mentioned this.

I have also noticed that the time to browse the remote now playing lists through MRV has improved. I don't have timings but I would say it went from unacceptably slow to acceptable. I have no idea why its faster now...maybe an indexing thing or something?


----------



## boettcht

I too have seen the light blue screen, it is in the first split second of every recording done since 9.1 on every Tivo I have. It does not effect the recording at all, it looks like replaced the split sec of the previous channel that was recorded before the channel was changed to the channel being recorded. I have not seen it anywhere else in UI. I don't have an issue with it.


----------



## bicker

DaveLessnau said:


> Depends on your definition of crippled


No, not really. You could say that your *efficiency *using the service is crippled, but not the service itself. The service still works.

When reporting bugs, it is very important not to obfuscate the issue with hyperbole. It makes it that much less likely that anyone will derive any constructive result from your report.


----------



## RoyK

bicker said:


> No, not really. You could say that your *efficiency *using the service is crippled, but not the service itself. The service still works.
> 
> When reporting bugs, it is very important not to obfuscate the issue with hyperbole. It makes it that much less likely that anyone will derive any constructive result from your report.


crippled: anything that is impaired or flawed. Like 9.1


----------



## bicker

We must be speaking different languages.


----------



## TiVoPony

RoyK said:


> My protest that this is unacceptable resulted in the most polite invitation to pound sand that I've ever seen.


I apologize if my response was unsatisfactory. I do value politeness and constructive dialog.

Pony


----------



## TiVoPony

I have to reiterate a request - please post as much detail as possible when describing an issue. Those with the light blue screens described above, please can you provide more detail. What make/model DVR, software version, what is the source (cable/sat/antenna), do you use serial or IR control, when does it happen, is it 100% or intermittent, etc. If you can provide the details, it really helps in understanding and tracking issues...there are a lot of models out there, various configurations, and multiple software versions in the field. Thanks.

Pony


----------



## boettcht

Pony I've seen the light blue screen on all of my systems (S2 140, 240, 540) It happens at the beginning of every recording and lasts about half second. All of my systems are cable driven. (Comcast Motorola boxes, serial connected). It seems the light blue screen has replaced the channel changing that was previously recorded. I used to see the Tivo send the channel numbers and then channel change to the channel to be recorded.


----------



## boettcht

Some further testing reveals that the light blue screen shows up when ever you start to play a recording from the show details even if it is resume recording.


----------



## RoyK

Here's more on slow MRV TiVoPony


----------



## EwanG

Well, just got 9.1, and being a Rhapsody fan, I was looking forward to making use of it. However, yesterday I powered off the unit because I was changing my setup to use a different cable box, and when I powered it back on, it said the External Drive was missing. Since it's a Series 2, I thought it was more than a little confused, and I did another power cycle and got the same message.

Figuring I was already in for it, I let it "fix" the problem - which did wipe out all my recordings just like it said it would. It also unbridged my second hard drive in the unit, cutting my recording capacity by half.

Needless to say, the thought of getting rid of the unit has started becoming rather intense, and I don't mean replacing it with another Tivo.

Anyone else had the same experience? Anything I can do short of just "living with the problem"? I have lifetime on the unit, so I'm a little more willing to be patient than I would be if I was paying monthly...


----------



## dugbug

I had MRV working fine prior to 9.1. Now both Tivos are at 9.1. They are a panasonic DVD-RW and a HUMAX DVD-RW on hard wire ethernet.

They see the network fine and can receive program updates.

The HUMAX can see and browse the Panasonic (though it is now very slow).

The Panasonic *CAN NOT SEE* the HUMAX (as in, there is no folder by the other tivo's name in the now playing area).

Damnest thing. I have tried rebooting both tivos, I have reentered the networking prefs, etc.

And did I mention MRV GUI interaction is slow? Oh man is it slow. The 8.x software had a little delay here and there (especially when requesting to start a transfer), but this just looks broken.

-d


----------



## austin-dude

I'm not sure who else is seeing this, but I'm having a reboot issue with my Series 2 DT boxes. I was a participant in the 9.1 beta. I had such trouble with that code I had to be removed. I re-installed my 2 DT units from original 7.x software and upgraded back to the 8.x code and have been working flawlessly until this week when my boxes got the 9.1 code again. So here goes...

While watching live TV, or a recorded program my box will spontaneously reboot without displaying an errors. This happens any time (while recording or not). This will happen to recordings too when I'm not home, I'll get multiple segments of a 1 hour program due to the multiple reboots.

The day after I got the software BOTH S2DT units froze and had to be power cycled (no response from remote). 

I reported the issue to support earlier this week. The technician completely dismissed it as my hard drive has flaws and that's why it does it. I really don't agree with that simple diagnosis, as I've been running on the SAME hard drives from 8.x -> 9.1 beta -> 8.x and now 9.1 production. All the sudden after the 9.1 upgrade I'm back to the same spontaneous reboots that happen multiple times per hour, that I experienced during the 9.1 beta.

So to humor TiVo support, today I reinstalled a BRAND NEW, sealed 250GB Seagate hard drive in my S2DT unit today. Put the 7.x code and let it upgrade to 9.1. Low and behold, I tried to watch a 1 hr program that it recorded earlier today. It rebooted 3 times in less than 30 minutes just watching a recorded program. This is beyond a minor inconvenience. I think this qualifies as making my units completely unusable. So now having installed a BRAND NEW hard drive I think can lend credibility to my arguement that their are spontaneous reboot issues with the 9.1 software.

Yes I understand I modified and upgraded my TiVo. However I do have my original TiVo 80GB hard drive that is still untouched from the factory. 

Since both of my S2DT units are having this problem, I would highly suspect that someone else is seeing this issue.

FYI - One interesting quirk that I found is that the 30 second skip stays in-tact after these spontaneous reboots. Not that I'm complaining, but maybe that helps something.


----------



## govardha

Hello,

We are a family of Tivo users. I just activated a TCD240 model last week and it upgraded itself to the latest version of the s/w(9.1). All was well for a few days and I started getting the S03 errors. I tried multiple kick starts, but it just kept bailing on me at various stages of loading info. From various posts, people kept alluding to the HD's failing, so I swapped hard drives out and things look ok.

But here's the catch, my aunt who lives in Atlanta has multiple tivo's and her tivo's updated to the newest s/w. Unfortunately she kept getting the same S03 errors. She also tried the kick start, but to no avail. 

In desperation she hooked up her phone line to do the downloads and a few days later lo & behold all's well and everything seems to be working fine. I am not sure where this is a bug to do with 9.1. Hopefully tivo investigates it.

G


----------



## JazzerAlto

TiVoPony said:


> I guess I would add that 20 seconds seems rather far outside of the bounds of the norm, so it is quite possible that your experience is not typical.
> 
> Pony


I am seeing the same thing with my 2 Series2 and Humax DRT800. I counted some screen updates into the high 20 second range trying to browse another DVR play list and then hit 30 waiting for a transfer to begin. I never timed these activities before for comparison but the additional delay feels extremely long.

I can't imagine that this would be acceptable during your development cycle.


----------



## timstack8969

"Pony" I started getting the "Light Blue Screen" it seems when I added channels to my channel list because we have the "Free Showtime Preview" this weekend and I wanted to see what was on. Now I don't if has anything to do with the Blue screen or not. This morning I "Restarted" my TIVO and now I'm not getting the "Blue Screen" I have a "Single Tuner Tivo 240" series using the serial connector with a Comcast Motorola DCT2000 box.


----------



## dugbug

dugbug said:


> I had MRV working fine prior to 9.1. Now both Tivos are at 9.1. They are a panasonic DVD-RW and a HUMAX DVD-RW on hard wire ethernet.
> 
> They see the network fine and can receive program updates.
> 
> The HUMAX can see and browse the Panasonic (though it is now very slow).
> 
> The Panasonic *CAN NOT SEE* the HUMAX (as in, there is no folder by the other tivo's name in the now playing area).
> 
> Damnest thing. I have tried rebooting both tivos, I have reentered the networking prefs, etc.


just an update: I rebooted the panasonic and the ethernet switch it was using. The panasonic could temporarily see the humax and browse the humax contents. The humax folder is now gone from the panasonic's now playing menu.

-d


----------



## Soapm

austin-dude said:


> It rebooted 3 times in less than 30 minutes just watching a recorded program. This is beyond a minor inconvenience. I think this qualifies as making my units completely unusable. So now having installed a BRAND NEW hard drive I think can lend credibility to my arguement that their are spontaneous reboot issues with the 9.1 software..


I was getting frequent spontaneous reboots also when my 649DT upgraded to 9.1. Someone suggested I delete everything but the recordings. I did that and have been fairly stable since.

The only consistent reboot I can duplicate since deleting everything but my recordings is when I am watching a movie being downloaded either via Amazon Unbox or pyTivo and both tuners kick in to record. My Tivo reboots 100% of the time in this scenario. In the past I would get the message asking if I wanted to cancel my scheduled recording.


----------



## vasilemj

TiVoPony said:


> I have to reiterate a request - please post as much detail as possible when describing an issue.
> 
> Pony


Pony-

Thanks for taking the time to review this thread and address our concerns. Quite frankly, I would have liked to have seen some acknowledgement of 9.1 bugs by TiVo personnel significantly earlier than post #347 to give us some comfort that you guys were aware of the problems and working on resolutions but, I'll take what I can get with your participation in this thread. You know that your loyal customers come to this forum first to complain and praise TiVo. I don't think any of us expect immediate results but it would be nice to extend the curtesy of an acknowledgement with a quick posting to alleviate the concerns of forum users to give us a bit of comfort that you're aware of the situation and working to resolve the issues. I think extending this type of olive branch would go a long way with your customers. It's quick, easy and doesn't cost any money at all....the best marketing TiVo could employ.

Nevertheless, as I posted earlier in Post #99, I am having problems when I transfer 16:9 MPG content from my PC to my TiVo. It seems as if TiVo is disregarding the aspect ratio that is set in the Video Settings and forcing everything into 4:3 mode.

I have a 60-hour Series 2 TiVo. 140 Model.

Thanks for any insight you can provide.


----------



## subat0mic

just got a "system update" on my *TivoS3* last night. now today, under "music, photos, products & more" the TivoS3 can no longer see Tivo Desktop's mp3 collection or photos - but it CAN see the NEW photo mode (it used to show all 3, now only 1)...

I tried doing a reboot, and it fixed it, all 3 show. Now, 5 hours later, only 1 is showing again... I'm running Tivo Desktop 2.5 in high priority with the new photo mode enabled.

anyone got ideas?

*UPDATE*: I just tried doing a 2nd reboot, and it fixed it again. all 3 show again. Looks like TivoS3, over time, loses the connection to the TivoDesktop mp3 and photos collections (but not the NEW photo mode)


----------



## Expat

dugbug said:


> just an update: I rebooted the panasonic and the ethernet switch it was using. The panasonic could temporarily see the humax and browse the humax contents. The humax folder is now gone from the panasonic's now playing menu.
> 
> -d


Same problems here, can see both series 2's from TiVo Desktop, but can't see TiVo's from each other unless they have just been restatred 

After we recieved 9.1, we lost power for about 3hrs a few days later, so I know everything in the house was rebooted then :up: :up:

TiVo's are Series 2 Humax 80hr unit, and a Night Light TiVo 80 hr.
Been hooked USB to ethernet adapter to wireless G since day one.

Slow as treacle running down hill too 

I just tried addding a city to the weather feature,entered city ask I wanted to save it, yes, returned to menu NO new city, what gives?

Both our units had more than 3 cities prior to 9.1, now both only have 3, and as far as I can tell only 3 are allowed.


----------



## etz

Expat said:


> I just tried addding a city to the weather feature,entered city ask I wanted to save it, yes, returned to menu NO new city, what gives?
> 
> Both our units had more than 3 cities prior to 9.1, now both only have 3, and as far as I can tell only 3 are allowed.


I currently have 6 cities shown in yahoo weather with 9.1 on a 540 box.


----------



## RoyK

This is a record for us with 9.1 - It's been three days since one of our SD-H400s locked up while navigating the NPL and I had to power-up reset - Until 5 minutes ago.


----------



## austin-dude

Well after doing more digging I found the Kickstart 57 procedure. Did that on both boxes, now it's been stable. Amazing. It would make sense to me that TiVo would do this BEFORE it installs new software (and maybe after). This would make sure that the hard drive is ready for the new files and there are no errors.

If you haven't tried Kickstart 57, then do it.

- D


----------



## richsadams

austin-dude said:


> Well after doing more digging I found the Kickstart 57 procedure. Did that on both boxes, now it's been stable. Amazing. It would make sense to me that TiVo would do this BEFORE it installs new software (and maybe after). This would make sure that the hard drive is ready for the new files and there are no errors.
> 
> If you haven't tried Kickstart 57, then do it.
> 
> - D


 Glad to hear things are back to normal. :up:

The KS method may or may not work and there's a question if it still works with v9.2.j, but JIC, here are the instructions for KS57 and KS52 again...

*Kickstart 57:*

1. Unplug TiVo and wait 15 seconds.
2. Plug TiVo in, get the TiVo remote and aim it at TiVo.
3. Press and hold the pause button until the yellow light(s) comes back on by itself.
4. Release the pause button and immediately type in the numbers 5 and 7 on the remote (you have about 10 seconds to do this step).
5. TiVo will reboot and the GSOD screen will come on saying TiVo has encountered a serious error. It will then run the disk management tool which can take from 10 minutes to 3 hours to complete. During this time it will look for and correct configuration problems as well as isolating any bad sectors on the hard drive so they can no longer be used.
6. TiVo will automatically reboot again and hopefully things will return to normal. (Programs that used any bad sectors may be lost.)​It's also possible that the new upgrade may have been corrupted. If so you could try reinstalling the software by using "Kickstart 52".

*Kickstart 52 - Reinstalling TiVo Software:*

1. Go to TiVo Central
2. Select Messages & Setup
3. Select System Reset
4. Select Restart Receiver
5. Press Thumbs Down three times
6. Press Enter
7. While the system is restarting, during the initial screen, press and hold the PAUSE button until only yellow light(s) illuminate.
8. Put the remote down and wait. The system will proceed to the "Almost There..." screen for a moment and then jump to a new screen , "TiVo is installing new software from the TiVo service".
9. After a time (a few minutes to an hour) TiVo will automatically reboot again.​
EDIT: Removed KS58 and Updated KS52 per TiVoJerry


----------



## sepstein

TiVoPony said:


> I have to reiterate a request - please post as much detail as possible when describing an issue. Those with the light blue screens described above, please can you provide more detail. What make/model DVR, software version, what is the source (cable/sat/antenna), do you use serial or IR control, when does it happen, is it 100% or intermittent, etc. If you can provide the details, it really helps in understanding and tracking issues...there are a lot of models out there, various configurations, and multiple software versions in the field. Thanks.
> 
> Pony


Thanks Pony for starting to field some of these.

Here goes:

THE PROBLEM: Since the 9.1 upgrade, the first seconds of playback from a recorded show are highly pixelated, with video and sound dropouts as well. This can last anywhere from 3-4 seconds up to about 20 seconds. I'm not positive if it only occurs when a channel is changed at the start of the recording, but I'm pretty sure that's what's happening. Happens all the time. We tend to record at basic or medium quality.

I seem to recall a similar problem after a previous update, but I don't recall which one.

THE SYSTEM DETAILS: Series 2, 40 hour. Software version 9.1-01-2-540. Source is cable (RCN), using a Motorola digital STB. Serial control. No "enhancements." Networked using an approved Linksys USB adapter (802.11b).

Steve


----------



## dugbug

richsadams said:


> Glad to hear things are back to normal. :up:
> 
> The KS method may or may not work and there's a question if it still works with v9.2.j, but JIC, here are the instructions for KS57 and KS58 again...
> 
> *Kickstart 57:*
> 
> 1. Unplug TiVo and wait 15 seconds.
> 2. Plug TiVo in, get the TiVo remote and aim it at TiVo.
> 3. Press and hold the pause button until the yellow light(s) comes back on by itself.
> 4. Release the pause button and immediately type in the numbers 5 and 7 on the remote (you have about 10 seconds to do this step).
> 5. TiVo will reboot and the GSOD screen will come on saying TiVo has encountered a serious error. It will then run the disk management tool which can take from 10 minutes to 3 hours to complete. During this time it will look for and correct configuration problems as well as isolating any bad sectors on the hard drive so they can no longer be used.
> 6. TiVo will automatically reboot again and hopefully things will return to normal. (Programs that used any bad sectors may be lost.)​It's also possible that the new upgrade may have been corrupted. If so you could try downloading a fresh copy of the software by using "Kickstart 58".
> 
> *Kickstart 58:*
> 
> 1. Go to TiVo Central
> 2. Select Messages & Setup
> 3. Select System Reset
> 4. Select Restart Receiver
> 5. Press Thumbs Down three times
> 6. Press Enter
> 7. While the system is restarting, during the initial screen, press and hold the PAUSE button until only the yellow light(s)  illuminates.
> 8. As soon as the yellow lights come on, press "5" then "8" on the remote.
> 9. Put the remote down and wait. The system will proceed to the "Almost There..." screen for a moment and then jump to a new screen, "TiVo is installing new software from the TiVo service".
> 10. TiVo will reboot and the GSOD screen will come on saying TiVo has encountered a serious error. It will then run the disk management tool which can take from 10 minutes to 3 hours to complete. During this time it will look for and correct configuration problems as well as isolating any bad sectors on the hard drive so they can no longer be used.
> 6. TiVo will automatically reboot again and hopefully things will return to normal. (Programs that used any bad sectors may be lost.)​I would be interested in hearing from anyone that's tried either KS w/v9.2.j and the results.


Do any of those tricks erase season pass info or any preferences?

-d


----------



## richsadams

dugbug said:


> Do any of those tricks erase season pass info or any preferences?
> 
> -d


No, SP's, WL's, etc. remain intact. As mentioned, the only things that may be lost are recordings that used bad sectors which were isloated on the HDD by the diagnostics and clean up.


----------



## TiVoJerry

richsadams said:


> It's also possible that the new upgrade may have been corrupted. If so you could try downloading a fresh copy of the software by using "Kickstart 58".
> 
> *Kickstart 58:*
> 
> 1. Go to TiVo Central
> 2. Select Messages & Setup
> 3. Select System Reset
> 4. Select Restart Receiver
> 5. Press Thumbs Down three times
> 6. Press Enter
> 7. While the system is restarting, during the initial screen, press and hold the PAUSE button until only the yellow light(s)  illuminates.
> 8. As soon as the yellow lights come on, press "5" then "8" on the remote.
> 9. Put the remote down and wait. The system will proceed to the "Almost There..." screen for a moment and then jump to a new screen, "TiVo is installing new software from the TiVo service".
> 10. TiVo will reboot and the GSOD screen will come on saying TiVo has encountered a serious error. It will then run the disk management tool which can take from 10 minutes to 3 hours to complete. During this time it will look for and correct configuration problems as well as isolating any bad sectors on the hard drive so they can no longer be used.
> 6. TiVo will automatically reboot again and hopefully things will return to normal. (Programs that used any bad sectors may be lost.)​I would be interested in hearing from anyone that's tried either KS w/v9.2.j and the results.


A few corrections:
"52" reinstalls software, not "58". 
Neither "52" or "58" wil trigger a green screen.

"58" runs fsfix with an additional option that causes it to make multiple passes over the inodes, re-hashing them and clearing collision bits.
"57" triggers an MFS assert (green severe error screen), which marks the filesystem as being damaged. The repair process detects and repairs inode problems, and then runs mfscheck to clean up database and directory problems.

The only kickstart code that does not work in 9.2 is "62". The official interface is now in place so that code was no longer needed.


----------



## richsadams

TiVoJerry said:


> A few corrections:
> "52" reinstalls software, not "58".
> Neither "52" or "58" wil trigger a green screen.
> 
> "58" runs fsfix with an additional option that causes it to make multiple passes over the inodes, re-hashing them and clearing collision bits.
> "57" triggers an MFS assert (green severe error screen), which marks the filesystem as being damaged. The repair process detects and repairs inode problems, and then runs mfscheck to clean up database and directory problems.
> 
> The only kickstart code that does not work in 9.2 is "62". The official interface is now in place so that code was no longer needed.


Excellent! Time to update the info. Thanks Jerry! :up:

EDIT: Post re; KS52 & KS57 above updated.


----------



## TiVo Steve

On the network connection. On my Sony SVR-3000, every few days I would lose my network connection. NO changes were made to my network! (It worked perfectly before 9.1.) I gave up and am now using the phone for downloading the guide info.

Amazon Unbox is going to lose a lot of revenue from me!!! 

On the plus side, I like how the "Find Programs to Record" now ends with the To Do list!

But my biggest gripe with 9.1 is browsing by channel in the "Find Programs...". When I change the day, nothing changes in the listings! (unless I do a ch. up, ch. down...)


----------



## RoyK

RoyK said:


> This is a record for us with 9.1 - It's been three days since one of our SD-H400s locked up while navigating the NPL and I had to power-up reset - Until 5 minutes ago.


ANOTHER LOCKUP!

Happened again - on a different sd-h400 this time. Wife says in both cases she was in Browse By Channel and pressed the TiVo button to get back to the main menu. That locked it up both times requiring power-up reset. I was unable to make it happen however.

(Yes, I told her not to do that again.)


----------



## Expat

etz said:


> I currently have 6 cities shown in yahoo weather with 9.1 on a 540 box.


Ok I selected a 4th city on my Humax unit, saved, congratulations screen etc.

Return to the menu, No 4th city 

I know I had a 4th & 5th city on the Humax pre 9.1 as I have family at those locations so would check.

What Gives 

I just convinced a friend at work to buy another a 2nd Series 2 DT, what will I tell him when Yahoo weather and MRV doesn't may not work


----------



## TiVoPony

sepstein said:


> Thanks Pony for starting to field some of these.
> 
> Here goes:
> 
> THE PROBLEM: Since the 9.1 upgrade, the first seconds of playback from a recorded show are highly pixelated, with video and sound dropouts as well. This can last anywhere from 3-4 seconds up to about 20 seconds. I'm not positive if it only occurs when a channel is changed at the start of the recording, but I'm pretty sure that's what's happening. Happens all the time. We tend to record at basic or medium quality.
> 
> I seem to recall a similar problem after a previous update, but I don't recall which one.
> 
> THE SYSTEM DETAILS: Series 2, 40 hour. Software version 9.1-01-2-540. Source is cable (RCN), using a Motorola digital STB. Serial control. No "enhancements." Networked using an approved Linksys USB adapter (802.11b).
> 
> Steve


Thanks for the information Steve. I don't know if it's related at all, but have you seen any 'light blue screen' when changing channels or starting playback of a recording? Thanks.

Pony


----------



## TiVoPony

timstack8969 said:


> "Pony" I started getting the "Light Blue Screen" it seems when I added channels to my channel list because we have the "Free Showtime Preview" this weekend and I wanted to see what was on. Now I don't if has anything to do with the Blue screen or not. This morning I "Restarted" my TIVO and now I'm not getting the "Blue Screen" I have a "Single Tuner Tivo 240" series using the serial connector with a Comcast Motorola DCT2000 box.


Thank you for the information. I'm glad a reboot helped resolve this. Chime in if it comes back!

Pony


----------



## timstack8969

"TivoPony" The "Light Blue Screen" came back today. I also notice now some "pixalization" when watching shows that I TIVOed. I think it could be related to "Rhapsody". I didn't sign up for it but I did notice the "Blue Background" used with "Rhapsody" looks the like the same blue color. Also when I go to "Music & Photos" and then one of the sub titles like "weather" or "Traffic" I see the "TIVO Hour Glass" with the Blue Screen. Again using "Single Tuner 240 series" with serial connector w/motorola DCT2000 box.


----------



## formulaben

My last Tivo was an HDVR2, so that's my frame of reference, but my TivoHD seems to be "stuttering" each time I hit GUIDE or the TIVO CENTRAL button. Just wondering if this is a bug or just the way it is with the HD box. 

Also, why doesn't the box cache the list of items in the MUSIC, PHOTOS, & MORE folder? It seems to take over 5 seconds for the menu to come up, and a bit more to populate.

Also, the 30-second skip works great on the video side, but the audio lags about 1-2 seconds.


----------



## bicker

I've read this thread front-to-back, but it is so long that I don't remember all of it, at this point. Did anyone report the following:

-- Watching an SD recording on a S3 (or HD).
-- Occasionally, throughout an hour, the recording appears to "skip", seemingly losing a couple of seconds of video.
-- Rewinding and playing the sequence again has the same result (so the problem is in the recording, not in the playback).

I'm not sure if this is really what happened. Since both recordings where we noticed this were on the same channel (BBC America) we figured it was the source (something wrong with their playback equipment). 

Did anyone note this kind of issue?


----------



## RoyK

bicker said:


> I've read this thread front-to-back, but it is so long that I don't remember all of it, at this point. Did anyone report the following:
> 
> -- Watching an SD recording on a S3 (or HD).
> -- Occasionally, throughout an hour, the recording appears to "skip", seemingly losing a couple of seconds of video.
> -- Rewinding and playing the sequence again has the same result (so the problem is in the recording, not in the playback).
> 
> I'm not sure if this is really what happened. Since both recordings where we noticed this were on the same channel (BBC America) we figured it was the source (something wrong with their playback equipment).
> 
> Did anyone note this kind of issue?


I noted it the other night with my S2 on the History Channel. I passed it off as being a cable problem. But I've seen so many gotchas since 9,1 I don't know whether it was or not.


----------



## RoyK

Expat said:


> ......
> I just convinced a friend at work to buy another a 2nd Series 2 DT, what will I tell him when Yahoo weather and MRV doesn't may not work


Welcome him to 9.1


----------



## mpmclaugh33

Some info on the blue screen and on pixelation when changing channels.

Series2 60hr (model 540?) has blue screen for a few seconds when changing channels and also when navigating to menus like amazon unbox. get hourglass and blue screen

Series2 40hr (model 140?) - pixelation for 2-5 seconds when changing channels. Here is something interesting I have noticed. I only get the pixelation when changing channels to a non-digital channel. when I change to a digital channel it is fine. I have comcast and a scientific atlanta box, IR blaster, S-Video connection from box to tivo.


----------



## shulcslt

Since the 9.1 update, on both my Humax DRT800's, pressing the "play" button on the program listing, in Now Playing, doesn't work. Using the right arrow to enter the listing and then pressing play will work. Individual show listings, within a folder will work, sometimes - backing out of the folder, then back in will sometimes allow the show to start from the listing.


----------



## richsadams

bicker said:


> I've read this thread front-to-back, but it is so long that I don't remember all of it, at this point. Did anyone report the following:
> 
> -- Watching an SD recording on a S3 (or HD).
> -- Occasionally, throughout an hour, the recording appears to "skip", seemingly losing a couple of seconds of video.
> -- Rewinding and playing the sequence again has the same result (so the problem is in the recording, not in the playback).
> 
> I'm not sure if this is really what happened. Since both recordings where we noticed this were on the same channel (BBC America) we figured it was the source (something wrong with their playback equipment).
> 
> Did anyone note this kind of issue?


Yes, IIRC that's been reported a few times here and there (too many threads on this  )

We've also seen the same thing on our S3 when we had v9.1, but I haven't seen it since I received v9.2.j last week...so there's hope. :up:


----------



## AlphaDelta

I don't know if this constitutes a bug, or a feature removal, but ...

When you have the keyboard up, you used to be able to hit channel-up or -down to move the cursor over to the show list (simultaneously performing the page-up or -down). Now you just get the BONG, forcing you to arrow over to the list in order to browse the list. This was a timesaver I miss already, and I've only had 9.1 a couple days


----------



## TiVoPony

AlphaDelta said:


> I don't know if this constitutes a bug, or a feature removal, but ...
> 
> When you have the keyboard up, you used to be able to hit channel-up or -down to move the cursor over to the show list (simultaneously performing the page-up or -down). Now you just get the BONG, forcing you to arrow over to the list in order to browse the list. This was a timesaver I miss already, and I've only had 9.1 a couple days


I agree, I miss it also. It was an undocumented ability that was lost in the conversion of the Find Programs screens to our new authoring toolchain. It may be possible to reinstate in a future release, but for now it's no longer available.

Pony


----------



## timstack8969

I think I found a new 9.1 bug. Ok Comcast added the "NHL Network" this morning to channel 276 in Philly so when I tried to go to the channel my cable box would not even try to go to the channel number and TIVO guide had "????" on the guide. Now usually even if "TIVO" didn't receive the new channel added to the TIVO guide I was still able to atleast tune to any channel I wanted. Now this afternoon I received a "TIVO"message that the "NHL Network" has been added to my TIVO guide so everything is fine now but I think this 9.1 related. (series 240 using serial connector w/motorola DCT2000)


----------



## CaseyK24

Tivo Pony,

A problem I don't see anyone else reporting (and as a programmer I can just see the type of code that needs to be updated for this

S2 (240) and S2(540)
No Hacking
9.1 update:

This happens frequently on both models and is repeatable when it does happen but does not happen every single time.

Select Record by Time and Date - then Record by Time
In record by time screen:
Keep selected date and move to the right to time (I pushed pad to right).
Move time up to say 10:00pm (doesn't matter but move time up)
Push pad to the right and it highlights the channel 2 show (first on the list - say "Shark")
Press select - the next screen does not show the channel 2 show Shark but another show at the same time say 20/20 on channel 7. 
Press pad back to left and 20/20 is highlighted not Shark as before.

If I do this again with the same show - go back to time and go to 10:30 and 10:00 then back to pushing right to get to "Shark" which is automatically highlighted and again press select - it goes back to 20/20 and then to the left and 20/20 is highlighted.

TO FIX:
Select 10:00pm push to right.
Shark (channel 2 - first channel) is highlighted 
This time push pad down to channel 3 then back up to channel 2.
Push select
Now Shark is the show selected to "record this episode".

So basically when you press right on the pad and it highlights the first show - there is some variable in the program which does not get set correctly. If I go down it updates the variable and then back up to the channel 2 show up it updates again and is now correct.

I never saw this happen before the 9.1 update and can make it happen if I play with it and do the procedure a couple of times. I recorded the wrong show a few times by selecting and then going to record this episode without checking that the show title was wrong in the last screen. Now that I'm aware I see it happen but know to look.

Thanks,
Casey


----------



## bobsoron

Had a very weird hang just now. Series 2 nightlight (540, right?). The unit was recording a show. I had a folder with two episodes of another show; I finished watching the earlier one, deleted it, hit up arrow to go to the other episode, and hit Play, and got the green animation with no nothin' else. System was completely hung. Didn't respond to any button on the remote, including the Tivo button.

I didn't want to restart it because I hoped it actually was recording the show I wanted it to and didn't want to lose anything.

At 9PM the red light went off -- and the Tivo started playing the episode I'd asked it to start playing nearly an hour earlier.


----------



## Soapm

> For Series2, as some have surmised, the issues in 9.1 tend to be more on the cosmetic or nuisance side...they don't tend to break the basic functionality of the box. I know that in saying that there will be examples posted that people do believe are impossible to live with.


S2 DT 649080 upgraded to a 500 gig drive
9.1-01-2-649
Hacked using Sapper
Only the one box in the house so I have no means to compare

You are correct, my issues now are more of a cosmetic nuisance, however, when 9.1 first loaded my Tivo was very unstable. The box would reboot anytime I selected anything in my Todo list. I had man, many, many other random reboots I couldn't duplicate.

The biggest nuisance was none of my Wish lists or Season Passes worked meaning none of them would record. By this I mean my post 9.1 Wish list or Season Passes didnt recognize any programs in the programming guide so nothing was recording. They would all say, No future Episodes even though I could do a manual search and see many episodes coming up.

Deleting everything but my recordings seems to fix most of my 9.1 troubles though it really sucked deleting months of recording information then having to rebuild all my wish list and season passes manually. It has taken me a couple of weeks to get to where I am today.

I called in a couple of times and the last suggestion was that I delete everything to see if that helps. I really dont want to delete all my recordings as I have worked hard to get my Tivo to where it is today. You will see more what I mean in a bit.

Here are the remaining problems I am hoping can be fixed.

Here is a snapshot of my Now Playing list. I have one Wish list for COPS but notice how it list twice in my Now Playing list. This never happened before 9.1. I have several other wish list that do this also (SWAT, Runs House etc). Sometimes it looks like I have 4 tuners when two wishlist are recording simultaneously



Here is the CPOS Wishlist



The other very frustrating part are the post 9.1 Season Passes dont correspond or record to the same folders as the pre 9.1 season passes. This means I am recording shows I already have on my drive over again. Below I will put a snapshot of what I mean with MASH.

Mash old



MASH New



Lastly, when I am downloading and watching a movie via Amazon Unbox or pyTivo, if both tuners suddenly kick in to record, my Tivo reboots 100% of the time in this scenario. In the past I would get the message asking if I wanted to cancel my scheduled recording. Now, when it is time for the second tuner to start recording my Tivo will reboot.

Thanks for your time and sorry for the poor quality pictures, I had to use the wifes cell phone...

EDITEd to add... Put me down as one vote no for the new theme and colors. They are very hard for me to see with the slight contrast of light blue/white.


----------



## klia

TiVoPony,

My latest 9.1 issues are a bit worrying. 

Once when I tried to left arrow out of my TDL, and once after browsing by channel, my picture went to a blank TiVo animation screen and stayed that way until I basically had to pull the plug. Pressing buttons on the remote did nothing at all. Both times I left it alone for at least 10-15 minutes, thinking it was just being laggy, before I finally had no choice but to yank the plug and let the unit power back up. It's also spontaneously rebooted a couple of times, once in the middle of recording a show. I've never had anything like this happen before 9.1, and never on my S1 box (still running 3.0).

The S2 unit is a single tuner Humax (it says Model T800 on the back), running software 9.1-01-2-590. Nothing's been hacked, nothing's networked, no transferring shows between TiVos (I'm a Mac user). I only record shows via a Comcast Motorola DCT2244 cable box, and play them back. That's it.

I hope there's a fix coming for us S2 owners, and we're not just stuck with these issues until the next big software update, because I'd be a very unhappy customer.


----------



## jtonra

I believe I've come across a new problem which has yet to be reported here. Since the 9.1 upgrade, I'm having consistent problems with MRV. What happens for me is that I browse the second TiVo and find something I want to transfer. I select transfer but do not start watching immediately. The program is added to the ToDo list but the transfer never actually starts. When you browse the ToDo list, the program is listed as "will transfer as soon as previous transfers are complete". I'm sure I don't have the exact wording there but that's the gist of it. If I try to remove this from the list by deleting it, nothing happens. They only way to clear it off of the list is to reboot the unit. 

This has happened every time I've tried to transfer something. One thing I did try today to see if it made a difference was to start watching the program immediately rather than returning to browsing the remote TiVo. This seemed to make it function OK but I won't be sure until I get home tonight as I started this and then left for work.

The TiVos involved are all S2 units. The "target" Tivo in all cases has been a 540 which is wired to the router. The "source" has been a 240 which is also wired or a 540 which is wireless. None of the units are hacked in any way.


----------



## CrashMeister

Georgia Guy said:


> *I'll third this one*. Also, if I start tranferring a program to a Tivo I am watching and then go thru my NPL deleting some old shows, it will kill the transfer. Also, if I had more than one show set up for transfer, they will all show in the To Do list as "waiting for previous transfer to finish"... including the first one that self-aborted. Any attempt to cancel the offending "stuck" transfer fails...the show will not go away, and no subsequent transfer will ever start, until I do a full reboot.
> 
> As you said, scrolling thru remote "now playing" lists take *FOREVER*.
> 
> Never had any problems like this until the 9.1 update (which is on all of my machines).


Ditto... I complained about this in the Help forum days ago.

This is the worst upgrade I have ever seen, and I include Microsoft in that list. It really takes some doing to screw something up worse that MS, but Tivo has delivered. I hope the whole QA department (all 1 of them probably) gets fired.

Craig.


----------



## CrashMeister

jtonra said:


> I believe I've come across a new problem which has yet to be reported here. Since the 9.1 upgrade, I'm having consistent problems with MRV. What happens for me is that I browse the second TiVo and find something I want to transfer. I select transfer but do not start watching immediately. The program is added to the ToDo list but the transfer never actually starts. When you browse the ToDo list, the program is listed as "will transfer as soon as previous transfers are complete". I'm sure I don't have the exact wording there but that's the gist of it. If I try to remove this from the list by deleting it, nothing happens. They only way to clear it off of the list is to reboot the unit.
> 
> This has happened every time I've tried to transfer something. One thing I did try today to see if it made a difference was to start watching the program immediately rather than returning to browsing the remote TiVo. This seemed to make it function OK but I won't be sure until I get home tonight as I started this and then left for work.
> 
> The TiVos involved are all S2 units. The "target" Tivo in all cases has been a 540 which is wired to the router. The "source" has been a 240 which is also wired or a 540 which is wireless. None of the units are hacked in any way.


Your problem is that you deleted some other recording while a transfer was in progress. This deletes the transfer instead (it should not) and Tivo thinks it is still transferring it.

This explains why some folks are having problems deleting programs - it is deleting the wrong ones.

You have to reboot to resolve the transfer issue.

Way to go Tivo :down:

Craig.


----------



## barbeedoll

DaveLessnau said:


> When deleting a program from the To Do list, when the list comes back, you're moved to a different page. I haven't pinned it down, yet, but it looks like it bumps you back two pages (and it's slow refreshing the display, too).
> 
> EDIT: OK, the specifics are that if you go into the program listing from the To Do list and delete it there, when it returns to the To Do list, it's in the right place. If you just highlight the program in the To Do list and hit the Clear button to delete it, when it returns you're on the first page of the To Do list (with the Recording History entry moved just off the top) with the highlight on the same number of rows down that the deleted entry was on.


 Thank you, thank you, thank you for the EDIT note which explains the workaround.

Barbeedoll


----------



## barbeedoll

RoyK said:


> Well the update on my box is a whole hour long and I just hit my first bug - a rather serious one I think.
> 
> When setting up a recording on the Browse by Channel screen I set the date to today Tue 10/3 and the channel to my local CBS channel and scrolled down to the evening hours where I saw the Tuesday schedule.
> 
> Then I changed the date to WEDNESDAY 10/4. The schedule didn't change. TUESDAY's programming was still displayed. No matter what date I scrolled to the programming didn't update.
> 
> With the cursor on the (wrong) program schedule scrolling DOWN the list of programs didn't change anything. Scrolling UP flips the date back to TUESDAY. Bizarre!
> 
> Another screwed update! Ah, well, I've come to expect it.


 ...to add to the description of the problem, hopefully to help Tivo programmers:

When you choose Tivo/5 Browse by Channel, and select a date for which Tivo has not yet downloaded schedule data, a message used to appear alerting you to the reason you see no schedule. It still does -- if you go to that date which is too far in the future first.

However, if you choose Tuesday, Oct 30 for example, Channel 9, and pull up the list of programs (which is easy to troubleshoot since now programs are Halloween specials rather than the usual ones) they appear correctly.

But if you then left arrow back to the date and change it to Tuesday, Nov 6 (outside the window of downloaded schedule information) AFTER choosing the earlier date, the program listings stay stuck on the Oct 30 shows (the Halloween ones). No alert appears that you are too far into the future to access a schedule.

The difference I am adding, is that the programming link to the screen alerting you that the data is not yet available is also broken...not just the programming commands that update the schedule screen to coordinate with the date screen. Same symptoms and work around on the user end, probably different lines of programming code to be unit tested by Tivo.

I do know the work around, thanks to the boards.

Barbeedoll


----------



## RoyK

Well let's hope that once Tivo finishes patting each other on the back for finally bringing MRV to the S3 crowd they'll now go back and pay attention to all the things they trashed in order to do it.


----------



## dugbug

Man I sure wish MRV would work again for my series 2 tivos. This 9.1 is a bummer.


----------



## Scoopo

To chime in here - and to add my name to the queue, I guess:

We have 4 TiVos in the house - 2 single-tuners and 2 dual-tuners.
All connected with wired Ethernet connection to a Gigabit switch.
(as well as multiple PCs and wireless devices - I'm a Networking professional)

All the TiVos have been working pretty much fine. A few annoying bugs such as the aforementioned issue with a folder claiming it's empty after deleting one show, making me have to back out of the folder then go into it again to see the other shows within.
That's no biggie and existed before 9.1

All the boxes received the 9.1 "upgrade" the same night last week or the week before.
Immediately apparent was the absolutely glacial (completely accurate phrase I read here) slowness when trying to browse the other boxes.
Then the kicker: Failure to transfer! WTH?!
I checked all the versions and restarted all the boxes, to no avail.

I came to the forum here and started reading this long thread of all these, and many other, issues.
Later that evening the transfers started working again so we all chilled and figured a patch or fix would be quickly forthcoming. I now see that hasn't happened yet... and the issues have again resurfaced. The agonizing slowness never left.

When I was unable to transfer today I checked and sure enough the living room was transferring from the source box I was failing to pull a show from.
I waited and when it was all finished I tried again. Still failing.
I once again found myself here reading... rather than enjoying the tiVo service I had been enjoying previously.
This is really not a good thing and has us debating other options.

In short, my list of complaints in order of severity are:
1. Failure to transfer or properly queue. - This is huge and indeed "crippling", as we are unable to use a service we pay for and which has worked just fine before the "upgrade" of o/s version.
2. EXTREME slowness when browsing remote TiVo boxes.
3. Inability to properly delete a recording or (today I noticed) even stop a Suggestion recording.

Someone should probably get on the ball and un-break the service very soon.
This update is so bad that if a fix isn't implemented very soon we, along with countless others, will be taking our money and redirecting it away from TiVo into some other option such as DTV or Charter Digital DVR service.

We have loved our TiVos since day one and would very much like to continue to do so. As it is right now we ARE NOT enjoying them and are not very happy to have had our faithful TiVo DVR boxes stop functioning as they always have and as they are supposed to.

Please, TiVo, patch, fix, roll back, whatever this absolutely unacceptable 9.1 software version. Please unbreak what was broken. Do it soon!
Even the most patient of us are reaching our limits.


----------



## GoAWest

I'm also seeing extreme slowness (as many others have reported) when trying to access my other TiVo over my hardwired LAN. This is when trying to browse the remote TiVo's Now Playing list or initiate a transfer. Much slower than before 9.1.

I've also had at least "Failure to transfer" (from one TiVo or from TiVo Desktop on Windows) since 9.1 even though MRV worked OK for several days after both TiVos had received the 9.1 update. I ended up manually restarting (rebooting) that TiVo and I've been good for the last week.


----------



## klia

My SPs for Law & Order: Criminal Intent and CSI apparently can no longer understand "First run only," because they're grabbing every ep airing on USA and CBS. In the past few days, I've had to manually delete about a dozen reruns off my TDL. Oh, and I can't just hit Clear, anymore; I have to select each ep, then select "Cancel only this episode," or I run into the losing-its-place-on-lists bug, and it would take even longer, because I would've had to page through my entire TDL a dozen times.

Unbelievable.


----------



## mattack

klia said:


> My SPs for Law & Order: Criminal Intent and CSI apparently can no longer understand "First run only," because they're grabbing every ep airing on USA and CBS. In the past few days, I've had to manually delete about a dozen reruns off my TDL. Oh, and I can't just hit Clear, anymore; I have to select each ep, then select "Cancel only this episode," or I run into the losing-its-place-on-lists bug, and it would take even longer, because I would've had to page through my entire TDL a dozen times.
> 
> Unbelievable.


I'm surprised about this happening on CBS, but on USA I presume they don't have info for each episode.

Also, this bug is fixed I believe in 9.2, you could sign up for the priority list.

Also II, a slight workaround is to enter one episode, do a view upcoming, then delete from that list rather than the to do list directly.


----------



## bobsoron

klia said:


> TiVoPony,
> 
> My latest 9.1 issues are a bit worrying.
> 
> Once when I tried to left arrow out of my TDL, and once after browsing by channel, my picture went to a blank TiVo animation screen and stayed that way until I basically had to pull the plug. Pressing buttons on the remote did nothing at all. Both times I left it alone for at least 10-15 minutes, thinking it was just being laggy, before I finally had no choice but to yank the plug and let the unit power back up. It's also spontaneously rebooted a couple of times, once in the middle of recording a show. I've never had anything like this happen before 9.1, and never on my S1 box (still running 3.0).
> 
> The S2 unit is a single tuner Humax (it says Model T800 on the back), running software 9.1-01-2-590. Nothing's been hacked, nothing's networked, no transferring shows between TiVos (I'm a Mac user). I only record shows via a Comcast Motorola DCT2244 cable box, and play them back. That's it.
> 
> I hope there's a fix coming for us S2 owners, and we're not just stuck with these issues until the next big software update, because I'd be a very unhappy customer.


Klia, note that I had the same problem as you, so can confirm it (two posts above yours). If you can mention whether your unit was recording at the time, it might help Tivo track down and fix the bug (mine was, so if yours wasn't, that isn't a factor). (And I hope I'm not being optimistic about S2 owners getting a bugfix version eventually. Is 9.1 is still rolling out to S2s even as 9.2 is going out to S3s? That would be a pretty bad sign.)


----------



## TiVoEvan74

Thanks, TiVo Pony for being willing to gather details from us on the problem.

We have a Humax DRT-800 and a Toshiba RS-TX60. We have Linksys USB Wireless B adapters WUSB11. We use an Airport Express router connected to a cable modem.

In the past, the display of the Now Playing list on the other unit was < 1 second... pressing the down/up channel to scroll through the list was virtually instantaneous... the screen would be seen to redraw, so it was not as fast as on the native unit but never an issue. After starting a transfer, the menu display on the other unit remained fast--or at least not noticeably slower!

After the latest update, here's what the times are now.

*Time to display the other unit's Now Playing.... 8-9 seconds. *

*Time to scroll down ONE screen via down channel button... 8-9 seconds*

If one has to scroll through a long list to get to a show near the bottom, this can take a minute or longer to do!

*After picking a show, the time it takes for the Transfer option to appear on the screen.... 16 seconds *

That used to be MUCH faster.

*After picking transfer, time it takes for the Now Playing list to reappear... 35 seconds and counting+++ *

I gave up and chose the left arrow to return to the native unit's screen.

Now, all these times get MUCH longer when a show is being transferred, something that wasn't true before.

*While a show is being transferred*

*Time it takes before NP showed up... 21 seconds *

*Time to scroll one screen down the list (channel down).... 19 seconds*

Now we're talking 2 minutes+ to pick a show way down the list for a second transfer.

It really hampers the use of the MRV. Even when we weren't transferring, we would use this feature to check on what the other TiVo was showing-- which sitcom we might watch later on the other TiVo--but now it takes TOO long to make that a viable, fun, easy to use option!

I truly hope that a subroutine could be added to the code that handles displays so that it uses a different algorithm for the S2s than the one for the S3s. The current OS does make using MRV a real drag! 

Hope this helps!


----------



## Grimm1

I have a Humax Series 2 TiVo with the 9.1 update. My video source is Time Warner cable and most shows are recorded at BEST quality. Ever since the update 25-50% of my recordings have a glitch in the video that last for about 2-5 seconds. By glitch I mean the audio will drop and the video will get choppy and look pixilated or blocky.


----------



## RoyK

Update: My wife just called me into the den - the SD-H400 had locked up as she tried to back out of the Find Programs menu...... greenish screen - "Find Progams" at the top - 3-sided box drawn but nothing inside it. Doing power up reset right now.

THIS IS GETTING OLD DAMNED FAST!


----------



## tenthplanet

I also have run into the slowness when browsing the now playing list remotely. It also takes longer for transfers to start from one box to another.The funny thing is once they start the transfers are as fast as they have ever been. The boxes are on a wired connection and I haven't run into the other problems others have.
If any of the programmers are reading these and/ or advanced digital users. I'm noticing that some of the remote/MRV problems people are having are similar to the problems that HDMI has when two units are trying to communicate with each other. Sure we don't use HDMI on the Tivo's but the connection principles are same.
Something to think about.


----------



## bareyb

I can't say I noticed anything with 9.1 except the 30SS lag. However. With 9.2 I now have pixilation. Not severe but I had virtually no pixilation problems prior to 9.2. It was all but flawless before that update. I"m sure they'll get this stuff ironed out eventually. They always have in the past.


----------



## TivoGuy33

Did 9.1 remove the "Stop Transfer and Delete from Now Playing" option in MRV? It seems now that I can only stop the transfer, whereas before I remember an option to stop the transfer and delete the partial transfer from the Now Playing list on the destination Tivo.


----------



## RoyK

TivoGuy33 said:


> Did 9.1 remove the "Stop Transfer and Delete from Now Playing" option in MRV? It seems now that I can only stop the transfer, whereas before I remember an option to stop the transfer and delete the partial transfer from the Now Playing list on the destination Tivo.


No, that's been gone for some time. I miss it also. It was incredibly useful.


----------



## TivoZorro

My Tivo recorded "The Dog Whisperer" last night. Luckily I went to watch it quickly because there was no audio. Backed out of it and checked the tuner and there was no sound on any channels on it. Rebooted the Tivo and the sound came back. This is a DT 649. Sure glad I caught this before it recorded both Las Vegas and Numb3ers at 10:00 P.M. 

Now I'm afraid to trust it at all. I hate the thought of doing a Clear and Delete but do you think I shoould to make it stable again?


----------



## RoyK

bareyb said:


> .... I"m sure they'll get this stuff ironed out eventually. They always have in the past.


Yes. Its a sad commentary on the performance of the company when that is considered the normal mode of operation.


----------



## HDTiVo

RoyK said:


> No, that's been gone for some time. I miss it also. It was incredibly useful.





RoyK said:


> Yes. Its a sad commentary on the performance of the company when that is considered the normal mode of operation.


+1

If you were one of the really good people at TiVo, imagine how frustrating it would be working for a company that has so much going for it and yet performs the way it does.


----------



## RoyK

Repeated attempts to "Stop transfer" failed to stop the transfer of yet another program. "Clear" button wouldn't do it either. The transfer just kept going until the entire program had transferred.


----------



## Scoopo

As is readily apparent by my having been registered on these forums since Jan. 06 but not having posted till Oct 07, and now posting more than once in this thread... I have been loving my TiVo and have since purchased 3 more for the household.
This software version is a bad, bad thing.
I am appalled that this was rolled out to the public. It feels like a badly coded beta which hasn't even been tested at all.
If it has been tested I would hate to see how bad it was originally that this is considered acceptable. IT IS NOT!


The other day when I was unable to transfer from the other DT TiVo I was able to transfer from the ST TiVos. I don't know for sure if it's related but both tuners on the source box were in use. We stopped the recordings (Suggestions) and afterward were able to queue a transfer.
Never had to do that before. Ever.
We use the MRV function literally on a daily basis and have done so since the day we set up the second box nearly two years ago. We are no longer able to do so without major headache.

Additionally, Delete is not working most of the time from the option within the show information screen (entering into the show where the date, actors, info etc are displayed). Using the CLEAR button in the main show list works. That's ok... annoying but at least it will delete.
If the Delete option will no longer be working perhaps it should be removed...?

Initiating a transfer a few minutes ago added it to the To Do list, or queue. (Great!... at least I wasn't once again presented with a message saying the transfer would not happen as the source isn't on the network. Of course it's on the network! That's how I was able to browse to and choose the show to transfer!)
It says it will be transferred after other transfers complete.
There is another show queued from yesterday as well.
Problem is there are NO transfers occurring at this time. None of our 4 TiVos are currently transferring but the To Do list has them queued up and waiting. For what I do not know.


Are all us Series 1 and 2 users going to be expected to upgrade to Series 3 boxes in order to regain the functionality we're paying for and have enjoyed all this time... until now?
I suppose if TiVo offers a trade-in program and credits the value of all 4 of our boxes to the purchase price of the Series 3 models we could possibly be persuaded. However, in addition to a trade-in credit, I would require a guarantee that the Series 3 machines will work as advertised and as all 4 we currently own have worked up until this 9.1 software joke.

As the above is unlikely I can only assume we users of the now freshly broken boxes are supposed to just accept this huge list of bugs and be happy that our previously properly functioning TiVos are working at all.

This disaster of an "update" has been essentially rammed down our throats.
It is unacceptable and ridiculous.
If something isn't done to un-break our boxes and restore them all to their previous functionality soon I'm sad to say we will have no choice but to sever our relationship with TiVo and seek other service and hardware which does function as advertised and as we've come to enjoy and rely on.

(yes, I'm upset)
Thanks for reading.


----------



## klia

bobsoron said:


> Klia, note that I had the same problem as you, so can confirm it (two posts above yours). If you can mention whether your unit was recording at the time, it might help Tivo track down and fix the bug (mine was, so if yours wasn't, that isn't a factor). (And I hope I'm not being optimistic about S2 owners getting a bugfix version eventually. Is 9.1 is still rolling out to S2s even as 9.2 is going out to S3s? That would be a pretty bad sign.)


No, mine wasn't recording either time I got just the blank TiVo animation screen.

I hope we S2 owners get a fix, but I have to say I'm steamed that S3 owners got priority.


----------



## klia

mattack said:


> I'm surprised about this happening on CBS, but on USA I presume they don't have info for each episode.
> 
> Also, this bug is fixed I believe in 9.2, you could sign up for the priority list.
> 
> Also II, a slight workaround is to enter one episode, do a view upcoming, then delete from that list rather than the to do list directly.


I checked the info for the USA eps, and every one I've had to delete specifically says it's a rerun in the episode synopsis, and the original air date on the info screen says 9/30/01. So, I don't know why TiVo is seeing that as a first run ep, but it is. It's still doing it, too; I had to delete another 3 today.

Thanks, I've been using your workaround, which is less of a pain.

Re: 9.2 -- I thought that was just for S3 owners, wasn't it?


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

Scoopo said:


> If something isn't done to un-break our boxes and restore them all to their previous functionality soon I'm sad to say we will have no choice but to sever our relationship with TiVo and seek other service and hardware which does function as advertised and as we've come to enjoy and rely on.


Sorry to hear of your problems. As you know, you are not alone.

However, unfortunately, TiVo probably is *the best of a bad lot.* None of these boxes seem to function "as advertised". The cable company boxes are pretty awful, DirecTV boxes skip recordings, etc, etc. I don't know about Dish. Maybe their boxes are reliable.


----------



## bicker

Phantom Gremlin said:


> However, unfortunately, TiVo probably is *the best of a bad lot.* None of these boxes seem to function "as advertised".


I think the boxes do function "as advertised", but not "as hoped". For example, most of the complaints are about things not working how they used to work, but advertising never explicitly said that everything would always work exactly how it used to work, nor did advertising explicitly state how things would work exactly. We consumers often conveniently ignore fine print and terms and conditions, even when they explicitly state that things won't always be perfect for us.

And for those wondering about being an S2 owner in what may someday become an S3/S4 world, just remember us S1 owners. There did come a time when it became clear that we were not the company's main priority anymore, and over time the company has given us only token support (sometimes having hackers do the work, and then just distributing it). That is the natural order of things in the electronics industry. In a socialist environment, or a more lucrative environment, I'm sure things would be different.


----------



## RoyK

bicker said:


> I think the boxes do function "as advertised", but not "as hoped". For example, most of the complaints are about things not working how they used to work, ........
> 
> In a socialist environment, or a more lucrative environment, I'm sure things would be different.


Edit:
I removed the rather explicit allbeit accurate expression of my reaction to the above post. Suffice it to say bicker and I differ greatly on this subject.


----------



## bicker

And yet it had a lot of valuable insights, something lacking from your reply. 

You disagree with my perspective. We get that. Saying so in a such a manner adds nothing to the discussion, and only fosters a more hostile discussion.


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## dugbug

bicker said:


> I think the boxes do function "as advertised", but not "as hoped". .


No. My MRV, working flawlessly for over a year, went **** up with the 9.1 install and I can't get it back.

(Panasonic 810 cannot see/browse HUMAX DVD-RW)
9.1 is *BROKEN*

-d


----------



## bicker

dugbug said:


> No. My MRV, working flawlessly for over a year, went **** up with the 9.1 install and I can't get it back.


Please read what I wrote again. You'll see I explicitly address what you've said here. Stuff happens, and the lack of explicit, iron-clad and definitive promises in product descriptions inherently acknowledge this. That's the nature of CE in this country, and really world-wide, today. The only devices I know of that carry the type of assurances you're asserting are medical devices.


----------



## rmstone

AJust got 9.1 on my tivohd. Is there any way to speed up MRV. It transfers slower than realtime...and that's on medium quality.


----------



## RoyK

Just attempted MRV transfer (S2 to S2) - got error message saying couldn't transfer - check to do list for reason. 

Possible reasons offered were:
1. Program is copy protected.
2. Program is in a format not supported by TiVo Service
3. Program has been deleted.

Went to source TiVo. It was recording a program (not the one I was trying to transfer)- however the image on the screen was just a static bunch of gray snow. Pressing TiVo button on the remote and then Live button restored image on the program being recorded. Went back to the Den and the program I was trying to transfer originally then was able to transfer.

Usual 9.1 is a bug-riddled pile of crap exclamation applies. (Likely to be followed by another explanation from bicker that TiVo never promised that their product work and therefore I shouldn't expect it to.)


----------



## Scoopo

bicker said:


> I think the boxes do function "as advertised", but not "as hoped".


No, the boxes functioned as advertised and as hoped for two years now.
What I had "hoped" for was to not have my four TiVos *unnecessarily* broken and to continue to function properly as they have been and are clearly able to.

Perhaps you're right when I hope my TiVo continues to function as advertised and *as it always has until now*.

If this is all based on the 9.1 update designed to allow the S1 & S2 boxes to be compatible with S3 boxes (which I do not own) then I would have hoped the upgrade was optional.
As I do not have and at this time do not plan to own an S3 box I am offended that I have been force-fed a clearly seriously bugged "update" which I do not need and in hindsight do not want and which has broken functions my entire family uses daily.

Also, as for working as advertised or hoped:
I would hope the Delete button on my screen would, *as it always has in the past*, actually delete the show when selected.
I would also hope that transferring a show from another box (for which we paid and for which we pay monthly times four) would result in the show being either transferred or queued *as it always has prior to 9.1*.

For the first time in my family's TiVo experience I am having to restart, or worse unplug, my TiVo on a regular basis. What's with that? Can I expect an M$ blue screen of death next? (now that I think of it some people are experiencing this as well I believe)

How about this:
"Update" our TiVos back to 8.x
Give a message that an update FOR S3 COMPATIBILITY is available.
Show a disclaimer that if you have no S3 boxes the update is not required (and will likely break many of your favorite functions).
Prompt to run through a series of thumbs-downs or some button clicks if you'd like to receive the 9.x update.
If no update is desired or needed leave the software as it is (at least until it can be properly debugged so as to not break my boxes)


----------



## bicker

I think you missed the point, or you're simply unwilling to accept it. Regardless: Sorry for your disappointment and frustration.


----------



## Scoopo

I'm sorry if I missed your point, bicker.

My point is simply that the TiVos worked great (besides a couple minor issues which weren't a huge deal), then this software version was forced upon us and now they no longer function properly.

These new issues aren't minor annoyances. They are huge problems that were not present previously. They are huge problems which have a great number of TiVo customers/owners unable to use their systems as intended, advertised, hoped, or as they did a couple weeks ago and have for years before.

As a paying customer I feel I have every right to demand a speedy resolution.
TiVo, as a company built solely on the revenue from us, their loyal and paying customers, has an *obligation* to either quickly resolve this major problem or roll it back and push this version back to beta where it so clearly belongs. Better yet, start 9.x again from scratch and put "retain current functionality" at the top of the list.

I mean seriously. The thing won't delete now. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.
Want to stop a Suggestion show from recording. Nope, can't.
Want to transfer a show using the much touted MRV function. Try it, it might work... then again it might not. If it doesn't, oh I dunno, maybe you should unplug it and wait 15 seconds then plug it back in. What?! This isn't Windows 95! I don't want to unplug it every other day to restart. I never had to do that before, why should I have to do it now.

I apologize if I come off like I want an argument. I don't.
I want to watch my TiVo like I have for 2 years instead of prowl the forums trying to find out wth happened to my house full of TiVo boxes... and I want it fixed.


----------



## formulaben

We're _*all*_ sorry...


----------



## RoyK

Scoopo said:


> ...
> 
> I mean seriously. The thing won't delete now. Sometimes it does, sometimes it doesn't.
> Want to stop a Suggestion show from recording. Nope, can't.
> Want to transfer a show using the much touted MRV function. Try it, it might work... then again it might not. If it doesn't, oh I dunno, maybe you should unplug it and wait 15 seconds then plug it back in. What?! This isn't Windows 95! I don't want to unplug it every other day to restart. I never had to do that before, why should I have to do it now.
> ....


I finally had to plug an extension cord into my UPS and the Den SD-H400 into the cord and place the plug and socket connection in front of my equipment in my entertainment center so my wife can reach it to reboot the machine.

But it's not all bad - one of my units has gone 3 whole days now without needing a reboot...........


----------



## RoyK

RoyK said:


> I finally had to plug an extension cord into my UPS and the Den SD-H400 into the cord and place the plug and socket connection in front of my equipment in my entertainment center so my wife can reach it to reboot the machine.
> 
> But it's not all bad - one of my units has gone 3 whole days now without needing a reboot...........


But it didn't go 4.......


----------



## steve614

I wonder if some of these problems* are model specific...
The only thing I notice with my Tivo is a _slightly_ longer delay between remote button push and Tivos reaction, but it's not so bad that I feel compelled to complain about it.

ST S2 540, 2 yrs old.

* MRV is the only thing I don't use. TTG and TTCB work. I'm still getting my Tivocasts. I can still stream music and pics from my computer and other HME functions.
I feel bad reading about all these other people having problems. 

Well, not _too_ much.


----------



## RoyK

steve614 said:


> I wonder if some of these problems* are model specific...
> The only thing I notice with my Tivo is a _slightly_ longer delay between remote button push and Tivos reaction, but it's not so bad that I feel compelled to complain about it.
> 
> ST S2 540, 2 yrs old.
> 
> * MRV is the only thing I don't use. TTG and TTCB work. I'm still getting my Tivocasts. I can still stream music and pics from my computer and other HME functions.
> I feel bad reading about all these other people having problems.
> 
> Well, not _too_ much.


Most if not all of the slowness complaints are MRV related.


----------



## Whittaker

Since the 9.1, all my TiVos are exhibiting the same bug. The first (slowest) rewind speed has gone from being smooth, to a choppy quick start/stop of the proper speed, then the play speed (but in reverse), and back again over and over again. The other two rewind speeds seem fine.

Also, the functionality on my Series 2.5 has slowed down dramatically, back to what it was before it improved somewhat after the last update. The Series 2s seem about the same.


----------



## gijoecam

Add me to the list of unhappy TiVo customers... I feel like TiVo is geting to be as bad as MS Windows... TiVo literally ram-rods the updates down the users' throats, then essentially disavows any knowledge of the issue, which mysteriously disappear three months later when the latest download fixes a bunch of the bugs and introduces a bunch of other bugs.

To TiVo's programmers: QUIT FARKING WITH OUR SYSTEMS!!! At least Microsoft gives you the option to forego the updates that are not essential to the system's functionality. The last TiVo update made me happier than I've been since I got my TiVos 4 years ago. Now I'm miserable.

I've got a S2DT running a cable box and an S2ST in the bedroom. Here's my short list of issues:

-MRV issues: Cannot transfer between them at all. They say that the program has been added to the que, nothing is being recorded on either unit, and nothing transfers. Resetting the boxes has not resolved the problem.

-The functionality of the DT box seems to be OK for the most part. I encountered one problem with a delete on the first and only show it tried to transfer: it wouldn't stop the transfer OR delete the program once it was done transferring. Rebooting both units didn't help.

-Viewing the ST's NPL from the DT unit (i.e. MRV) results in painfully slow menu generation. It takes literally 7-15 seconds for every folder/menu/show information page to come up. Scrolling through the list of shows in the NPL takes at least 3 seconds to respond. (mind you, this functionality was flawless under the last software version)

-The ST's TiVo button response has become painfully slow, and the NPL menus are also MUCH slower than they were. They respond faster than when viewed through the other TiVo via MRV, but they're still MUCH slower than they were originally. Again, the functionality was PERFECT with the last version.


The only good thing I've seen so far is that when deleting shows (or in some cases, when I CAN delete shows, the highlight bar in the NPL no longer jumps erratically and randomly down the list. In every other way I use my TiVos, functionality has been compromised. IMO, NONE of the additional functionality (i.e. Rhapsody) was worth these sudden headaches both me and my TiVos are now suffering. 

TiVo: Get thine acts together, please! I've paid a LOT of good money over the last few years for the 'privilige' to use your service. I don't think I'm asking too much for you to get it right BEFORE you push it to my units. I don't think that's an unreasonable expectation.


----------



## formulaben

gijoecam said:


> Add me to the list of unhappy TiVo customers... I feel like TiVo is geting to be as bad as MS Windows...
> 
> TiVo: Get thine acts together, please! I've paid a LOT of good money over the last few years for the 'privilige' to use your service. I don't think I'm asking too much for you to get it right BEFORE you push it to my units. I don't think that's an unreasonable expectation.


And if you look at how much you paid MS versus what you've paid Tivo, it could get awfully embarrassing.


----------



## gijoecam

formulaben said:


> And if you look at how much you paid MS versus what you've paid Tivo, it could get awfully embarrassing.


Indeed... I've only paid Microsoft $64, wheras I've paid TiVo $240/year for almost 4 years now... That's almost $1000 for their 'service', and there are many people that have paid far more than I have.

Of course, that $1000 I've spent in monthly service fees makes me think I should have opted for the lifetime subscription after all...

-Joe


----------



## Expat

Well I thought I would try to resurrect the MRV on my series 2's tonight.
I followed the steps someone posted in this or another thread.

Unplug Tivo, router etc replug reboot in order shown

So I did this.
Some minutes later, I could again see both TiVo's from each other  

So now to test it!
I transferred a show from each TiVo to the other.
Success  

So off I go to do other important tasks.

About an hour later, I shut down my PC, and went into the bedroom.
I checked NPL no other TiVo shown again  

I go to the other TiVo and check no TiVo, rerun test connection.
Other TiVO appears, slow as treacle to browse though.

Back to the other TiVo, no TiVo;s in NPL, run connection test, No TiVo's  

I just checked, and I have been using Series 2 units on the same network since Nov 2004, using MRV, and then Unbox.

Not now though  

I have had 2 240 series series 2's running here, and currently a 540 & 590 Humax unit.

Both are connected with the Linksys USB200M, ethernet to Wireless G gaming adapters connecting to a Wireless G only network.

I'm still running Desktop 2.3, and can see both TiVo's, transfer shows etc.
The TiVo's can see the PC also with no problems.

I have never ran the desktop server on auto, with no probs.

This sucks!

At the moment this update has made the MRV concept a non feature for us, which was the reason we changed from Lifetime series 1's to 2's.

In a conspiracy theory kind of way is this the first gentle nudge to get us to switch to TiVoHD I can but wonder


----------



## RoyK

Expat said:


> ....
> At the moment this update has made the MRV concept a non feature for us, which was the reason we changed from Lifetime series 1's to 2's.
> 
> In a conspiracy theory kind of way is this the first gentle nudge to get us to switch to TiVoHD I can but wonder


I'm sure that we're all so thrilled with TiVo right now that we'll run right out and buy new units and add pixellation, audio dropouts, HDMI failures, and cablecard problems to our list of things that make our tv viewing pleasurable.


----------



## rokicki

I've had tivo *forever*. With my brand new Series 2 DT and 9.1, I am
unhappier than I have ever been with Tivo. I've seen so many bugs.
I can't reliably record a movie from the cable box; it seems frequently
it will do the channel-1 switcheroo mid-movie. It is so disappointing to
watch a movie with your girlfriend and then, mid movie, you get switched
to channel 1! I mean, what good is the technology when it simply doesn't
even work?

I wouldn't really even complain if it was just once, but the last three
movies I've tried to record have simply not worked for various reasons.
Frustrating.

Plenty of other bugs too. I've seen the "can't delete" (a reboot cleared
that one). And some more that other people have seen. I've had the
machine not respond to the remote for up to a minute before responding
again (just like the comcast DVR almost). I've had funny glitches on
fast forward once in a while. And I've seen no tangible benefit to me
from 9.1.

Tivo is botching the handling of this. They need to at the least issue a
"9.3" or something that's just "8.x" re-released. Or something.

I guess they figure now that they have me locked into a multi-year
contract that can abuse me all they want, since I have no good way
to get out. How can I keep promoting TiVo when they do this sort of
thing?

[I will say that the normal recording of prime time on the dual tuner
is working pretty well; I haven't missed any prime time shows yet.]


----------



## diceman719

I have mixed experiences with 9.1...

1) My Series 2 DT runs better than ever!

It used to take 12 seconds to back up from a list 
(i.e. Wishlist/Movies/Upcoming/details of one entry, then 12 seconds to get back to the list).
Now it's almost immediate, and I have seen none of the other problems mentioned here.

2) My 540, however, now runs extremely s..l..o..w..... to the point where it's painful.

For example, just hitting the Tivo button while watching live TV takes about 10 seconds before even hearing the "ding", then another 5 seconds for the main menu.
Similar sluggishness occurs in every Tivo function...
(I've rebooted a couple times, no improvement.)

So basically I'm happy - and sad!


----------



## pdhenry

Here's an interesting one that we're discussing over at another thread.

My S2DT likes to tune to Channel 1 even though it's not checked in the Channels I Receive list. TiVo Tech Support's answers to others suggests that it's an IR problem, but I just watched my TiVo deliberately tune to Channel 1, while thinking that the other tuner was using Channel 114 on the same box.

This is compounded by the TiVo's inability to get the box off of Channel 1 on its own (Comcast boxes don't recognize number inputs when they're tuned to Channel 1, which is the PPV channel). So I end up missing any digital cable recording until I discover the error and get the cable box off of Channel 1 by myself.

Discussion and photos here.


----------



## Expat

Maybe we have to wait for the 1000th post before we get a resolution to 9.1 bugs.

If they had a sense of humor they may have fixed them by Halloween, just not sure which year  

Wait maybe its the 500 post mark, before Halloween ends, of course lets base it on west coast time.

You've got to keep a sense of humor.


----------



## RoyK

Expat said:


> Maybe we have to wait for the 1000th post before we get a resolution to 9.1 bugs.
> 
> If they had a sense of humor they may have fixed them by Halloween, just not sure which year
> 
> Wait maybe its the 500 post mark, before Halloween ends, of course lets base it on west coast time.
> 
> You've got to keep a sense of humor.


As Molly used to say - "It ain't funny, McGhee"

Yes, I'm that old - gives me the right to be crotchety....


----------



## Expat

I thought you were just doing your bit to ensure we hit the 500  

Somethings gotta change!!

Currently I view the bedroom 590 from the 540 in family room, but the 590 can't see the darn 540!!

What gives with that.

I wonder what percentage of TiVo owners have more than 1 unit?
Coz if you only have 1, of course you won't have MRV problems, thus only a small percentage of users are effected, in Marketing PR speak


----------



## richsadams

Expat said:


> I wonder what percentage of TiVo owners have more than 1 unit?
> Coz if you only have 1, of course you won't have MRV problems, thus only a small percentage of users are effected, in Marketing PR speak


Good question about how many folks have more than one TiVo. Then you also have to ask of those that do, how many actually understand (or care) about MRV?

With regard to marketing I'd think TiVo would logically want to sell as many boxes as possible, multiple units to existing customers would be a seemingly obvious target demographic. Soooo...it would also seem logical if not downright basic that they get MRV working correctly ASAP.

Our S3 and S2's talk amongst themselves with zero problems, but I can really sympathize with those having issues...it's got to be terribly frustrating. Even more frustrating is why do ours work and others don't?


----------



## smgeisler

I just want to say that my 3 S2 TiVos have ALL the problems others have described. No amount of rebooting helps. 
All of mine have lifetime service. So I can't just cancel my service and use something different. 
TiVo should either restore the last working software release or FIX THIS ONE SOON.


----------



## RoyK

smgeisler said:


> I just want to say that my 3 S2 TiVos have ALL the problems others have described. No amount of rebooting helps.
> All of mine have lifetime service. So I can't just cancel my service and use something different.
> TiVo should either restore the last working software release or FIX THIS ONE SOON.


Its not a good idea to put your address or email in your signature - unless you like spam.


----------



## richsadams

smgeisler said:


> I just want to say that my 3 S2 TiVos have ALL the problems others have described. No amount of rebooting helps.
> All of mine have lifetime service. So I can't just cancel my service and use something different.
> TiVo should either restore the last working software release or FIX THIS ONE SOON.


Agree...posting e-mails - bad...they're regularly harvested by bots for spam.

I did appreciate the web link though! :up: Spent about 15 years as a radio DJ (in a past life) on the left coast. Great air checks! Hey, how can you tell how good a DJ is? By the size of the U-Haul trailer on the back of his truck! Ha. OT I know, but good stuff none-the-less, thanks!

Hope they get your TiVo's straightened out soon!

BTW, I've no idea if it will help, but here's a post that offers a couple of suggestions to get things back to normal that you might want to try.


----------



## klia

richsadams said:


> BTW, I've no idea if it will help, but here's a post that offers a couple of suggestions to get things back to normal that you might want to try.


TiVo's idea of a fix is to clear out all the info it's taken me years to program into my TiVo, and start all over again from scratch? They've got to be kidding.


----------



## RoyK

klia said:


> TiVo's idea of a fix is to clear out all the info it's taken me years to program into my TiVo, and start all over again from scratch? They've got to be kidding.


No, they aren't kidding. Unfortunately.


----------



## RoyK

smgeisler said:


> I just want to say that my 3 S2 TiVos have ALL the problems others have described. No amount of rebooting helps.
> All of mine have lifetime service. So I can't just cancel my service and use something different.
> TiVo should either restore the last working software release or FIX THIS ONE SOON.


Based on past performance I'm predicting Dec 15 for a fix to this mess.


----------



## RoyK

Just got a MRV hung up. There was a program transferring. I clicked on a program in the NPL we had just transferred and watched and chose delete. When I went back to the NPL the program that was transferring (Had the blue dot) was gone. The one I deleted was still there. I deleted it again and navigated to the other box and chose the program that had been transferring and told it again to transfer. Got the "will put it in the queue message"

Went to ToDo List. The program was listed as pending transfer twice. I was able to delete one of them but not the other. There was, however NOTHING being transferred. Rebooting now.


----------



## gijoecam

I've had that same problem a couple of times too... MRV only seems to work if you do the following:

1) After beginning the transfer, watch the program. Do not continue to navigate and add items to the que.
2) Upon watching it to completion, then and only then can you delete it.

Everything else I've tried seems to make it hang.


Oh, and I was rolling when I saw the December 15th comment... So very true...


----------



## Soapm

gijoecam said:


> I've had that same problem a couple of times too... MRV only seems to work if you do the following:
> 
> 1) After beginning the transfer, watch the program. Do not continue to navigate and add items to the que.
> 2) Upon watching it to completion, then and only then can you delete it.
> 
> Everything else I've tried seems to make it hang.
> 
> Oh, and I was rolling when I saw the December 15th comment... So very true...


I noticed this behavior also. 649DT with pyTivo.


----------



## TiVo Steve

smgeisler said:


> I just want to say that my 3 S2 TiVos have ALL the problems others have described. No amount of rebooting helps.
> All of mine have lifetime service. So I can't just cancel my service and use something different.
> TiVo should either restore the last working software release or FIX THIS ONE SOON.


This is what I was told!


----------



## vueaskew

Now that I've discovered this "correct" thread, I wanted to chime in with my experience:

My original situation, posted to no response in another thread:



vueaskew said:


> Greetings, y'all;
> 
> Here's our dilemma: We have a similar (but not) problem with our setup, here are the relevant details:
> 
> Primary: S2 140 (300h) hard wired to second router
> Secondary: S2 240 (300h) with TiVo USB Wireless (G) adapter
> Tertiary: S2 140 (300h) 300 with TiVo USB Wireless (G) adapter
> 
> All three units have updated to 9.1-01-2-140 (unfortunately, it seems, though the updated graphic elements are pretty.)
> 
> Network: Two Linksys WRT54GS units, both running Tomato firmware, linked via WDS
> 
> Now, the problem: Primary's and Secondary's recordings can be seen from both other units, and Tertiary as a unit can be seen from the other two units, but when accessing Tertiary's recordings from Primary or Secondary, a navigable blank list comes up. Blank pages can be scrolled, blank items can be highlighted, but you get the bad bong when you try to select anything. I've tried every imaginable permutation of initiating calls/updates, power cycling of all/various components, and wired/wireless network connections and timings, including the above-referenced 8 steps, to no avail.
> 
> Any ideas, or do I just try and wait it out for the next service update?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> -Gene


So to further thicken the plot, Secondary now consistently locks up within 1-60 or so minutes of forced (unplug/plug cycle) restart. various kickstart processes have been run, no no avail or new discovery. Primary can still access Tertiary, but program listing is still navigable but unpopulated. Alternately, it times out and says that there are no recordings.

This is infuriating; I realize that their first priority is to S3/HD customers who have just spent fresh money and constitute a new/impressionable client base, and as a 140/240 user, my lifetime subscription funds have long since been spent by TiVo eons ago, but this doesn't (and shouldn't) relegate me to second-class citizen status. I fully understand that there were pressing S3/HD issues that needed to be resolved, but as mentioned by others, there weren't any dealbreaker issues on S2 devices running 8.x...why compel an unnecessary update. were they that bored that they wanted to generate dozens? hundreds? of new service tickets? (That's (kind of) a joke, I'm sure that's not the case...) Surely the types of problems we're experiencing now were previewed in the beta testing of 9.x, and they obviously have the means to do a structured/scheduled rollout, so why not just roll out to the S3/HD users?

OTOH, maybe this is an opportunity to buy similarly "broken" S2 lifetime machines on the secondary market...that is if we ever get out units unbricked. Joy.


----------



## klia

vueaskew said:


> I realize that their first priority is to S3/HD customers who have just spent fresh money and constitute a new/impressionable client base


I'll never understand why businesses insist on fawning over new customers while ignorning existing ones. Loyalty used to mean something, but apparently not anymore. I find it hard to believe S2/S1 customers don't vastly outnumber S3 customers, too, so we *should* count.

And now we hear that if S2 customers get a fix at all, it won't be until after the holidays? Gee, thanks for leaving us with malfunctioning TiVos for 3+ months.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

klia said:


> And now we hear that if S2 customers get a fix at all, it won't be until after the holidays? Gee, thanks for leaving us with malfunctioning TiVos for 3+ months.


Welcome to the TiVolution.


----------



## bicker

klia said:


> Loyalty used to mean something, but apparently not anymore.


I think loyalty meant something when it meant customers were willing to pay a premium for the products/services of a specific brand. Now, consumers basically consider themselves loyal if they're willing to jump from discounted rate to discounted rate. Consumers "working the system" has substantially decreased the incentive to treat consumers like family.


----------



## gijoecam

I managed to break it another way yesterday...

We were watching live TV on the S2DT yesterday afternoon. The second tuner was recording a movie off the cable box (not sure if it makes a difference). I had paused the show to make a snack, came back, and proceeded to watch to the next commercial set. While fast forwarding through the commercials, I 'caught up' with live TV, at which point, the POS hung. It stopped responding to the remote, the screen froze, and it sat there. After about 2 minutes, it rebooted itself. I've since been unable to duplicate the problem.

To TiVo: REVERT BACK TO THE LAST WORKING (and I use that term loosely) VERSION. Your service updates are worse than Microsoft's!! At least Microsoft's updates FIX more bugs than they create!


----------



## RoyK

Its still broken, TiVo. Are you REALLY going to wait two more months to fix it? Do you REALLY not give a damn about S2 owners?


----------



## TivoZorro

9.1 broke my 540 Tivo. This morning I was transfering between my DT 649 and my 540. This afternoon I noticed I had a stuck transfer. I rebooted both Tivos but my 540 is stuck on the Almost there wait a few minutes more ... I've tried plugging and unplugging it four or five times and it won't get beyond that point. Is it dead? My lifetime 700 hour Tivo with at least hundreds of hours of programs on it. What do I do now to try and fix it and get my shows back? Can it be fixed? I need help. A writers strike and no saved programs. I have some back up but I didn't have time to back up that many. Not a happy camper!


----------



## bicker

Feel better, Roy? 

Hint: TiVoPony made it clear in one of his recent messages that he won't answer accusatory inquiries posted here.


----------



## RoyK

bicker said:


> Feel better, Roy?
> 
> Hint: TiVoPony made it clear in one of his recent messages that he won't answer accusatory inquiries posted here.


I'll feel better when I can remove the extension cords I put on my three boxes to make it easier to reboot them after they lock up, when the GUI works the way it should, when I can delete programs and have them delete, and when I can queue up a couple of MRV transfers in less than two minutes!

Edit: I don't really expect a response from TiVo. And as for my last question they made it clear that they don't give a damn when they released this abortion they called a "Fall Update" in the condition that its in.


----------



## Alcatraz

RoyK said:


> I'll feel better when I can remove the extension cords I put on my three boxes to make it easier to reboot them after they lock up, when the GUI works the way it should, when I can delete programs and have them delete, and when I can queue up a couple of MRV transfers in less than two minutes!
> 
> Edit: I don't really expect a response from TiVo. And as for my last question they made it clear that they don't give a damn when they released this abortion they called a "Fall Update" in the condition that its in.


So I guess that with "the leash off" you feel this gives you free license to continue to take every opportunity you can to find new inflammatory language to rant and rave about a situation we already know you're unhappy about? We're all in the same boat....we get it already.

How about you put that energy back into finding new issues to report in a useful manner and stop making it your personal mission in life to find new ways to ***** and moan. I wouldn't be surprised if they have you on "ignore" at this point.


----------



## bicker

Alcatraz said:


> So I guess that with "the leash off" you feel this gives you free license to continue to take every opportunity you can to find new inflammatory language to rant and rave about a situation we already know you're unhappy about? We're all in the same boat....we get it already.
> 
> How about you put that energy back into finding new issues to report in a useful manner and stop making it your personal mission in life to find new ways to ***** and moan. I wouldn't be surprised if they have you on "ignore" at this point.












My main concern, really, is that the nature of the abuse some folks have poured onto our friends at TiVo may prompt them to simply stop providing considerate folks here assistance, and their insights, as well. That would seriously harm the value members can derive from this community of ours.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

bicker said:


> My main concern, really, is that the nature of the abuse some folks have poured onto our friends at TiVo may prompt them to simply stop providing considerate folks here assistance, and their insights, as well.


TiVo treats its *paying* customers almost as badly as Murray and Esther are treated in this story. Your response is along the lines of "Don't make trouble".


----------



## bicker

I won't even bother reading the linked story, because I know that TiVo treats its customers better than many similarly small companies treat their customers. My response is along the lines of, "Don't chase away the people who are trying to help us by being grossly rude and inappropriate?"


----------



## Soapm

Phantom Gremlin said:


> TiVo treats its *paying* customers almost as badly as Murray and Esther are treated in this story. Your response is along the lines of "Don't make trouble".


Not even close to the same, Tivo has no obligation to visit this forum. A couple of Tivo guys came by to help on their own. I think it really sucked when people could do nothing but rant instead of sticking to the facts and giving information to help resolve the bugs. Now, we haven't seen the Tivo guys lately and the ranters are plentiful. I for one think we have some here that need to grow up a bit.


----------



## CharlesH

Soapm said:


> Not even close to the same, Tivo has no obligation to visit this forum. A couple of Tivo guys came by to help on their own.


My understanding is that the TiVO guys are here as (a small) part of their official duties. And that while TiVo employees are free to lurk here, they are prohibited from posting without management approval.


----------



## Expat

In the time that I've been a lurker and member, the unofficial TiVo presence has diminshed almost on a par with the increase in issues with the initially stable & new Series 2 units.


----------



## bicker

I'm a very frequent participant here and I haven't noticed any significant trend with regard to the number or severity of issues over the years, in the context of the level of technology provided. There have been problems, all along, as with any similar technology.


----------



## CrispyCritter

Expat said:


> In the time that I've been a lurker and member, the unofficial TiVo presence has diminshed almost on a par with the increase in issues with the initially stable & new Series 2 units.


Untrue. It's increased substantially over the past few years, with more active posters than before. There's many more posts per day from us, so as a percentage it's gone down, but they are contributing more. I kept track for a while, and the contributions were quite low 3 or 4 years ago.


----------



## sepstein

TiVoPony said:


> Thanks for the information Steve. I don't know if it's related at all, but have you seen any 'light blue screen' when changing channels or starting playback of a recording? Thanks.
> 
> Pony


Sorry for the delay - been away for a bit.

No, I haven't noticed a light blue screen. When starting playback, the channel seems to change, then I get a black screen for a second, then the picture returns, pixelates/freezes for a while until something syncs and playback or viewing can begin.

This does happen watching "live TV" as well as in playback.

Steve


----------



## dugbug

Expat said:


> Well I thought I would try to resurrect the MRV on my series 2's tonight.
> I followed the steps someone posted in this or another thread.
> 
> Unplug Tivo, router etc replug reboot in order shown
> 
> So I did this.
> Some minutes later, I could again see both TiVo's from each other
> 
> So now to test it!
> I transferred a show from each TiVo to the other.
> Success
> 
> So off I go to do other important tasks.
> 
> About an hour later, I shut down my PC, and went into the bedroom.
> I checked NPL no other TiVo shown again
> 
> I go to the other TiVo and check no TiVo, rerun test connection.
> Other TiVO appears, slow as treacle to browse though.
> 
> Back to the other TiVo, no TiVo;s in NPL, run connection test, No TiVo's
> 
> I just checked, and I have been using Series 2 units on the same network since Nov 2004, using MRV, and then Unbox.
> 
> Not now though
> 
> I have had 2 240 series series 2's running here, and currently a 540 & 590 Humax unit.


This is EXACTLY what I see. I have a panasonic and a HUMAX. The HUMAX can always see the panasonic, but unless I perform the steps you outline, the panasonic never sees the HUMAX. Once I do get the panasonic to see it, it only lasts for an hour or so.

-d


----------



## Alcatraz

dugbug said:


> This is EXACTLY what I see. I have a panasonic and a HUMAX. The HUMAX can always see the panasonic, but unless I perform the steps you outline, the panasonic never sees the HUMAX. Once I do get the panasonic to see it, it only lasts for an hour or so.
> 
> -d


Do you mean "Pioneer"? I haven't heard of a panasonic tivo.


----------



## dugbug

Alcatraz said:


> Do you mean "Pioneer"? I haven't heard of a panasonic tivo.


Lol yes sorry. Its in my signature below.


----------



## RoyK

Had to reboot again. Programs queued to transfer via MRV weren't transferring.......


----------



## Alcatraz

*Expat & dugbug,* I'm no networking expert but I do have a few questions, but they may not apply to both of you:

How long was everything working before and when did it stop? Was something changed in your network environment that might be interfering? Just trying to eliminate other things before looking at tivo.
Are you using static IP or DHCP? 
--if DHCP, is it your router or another device generating the addresses? Only one device should generate them. What is the make & model of your router?
--if DHCP, how long is it before IP renews? I vaguely recall some older routers exponentially decreasing the renewal period.
Are you using any sort of wireless bridge with a wired connection?
If wireless, have you tried using different channels?

Are you sure you're using supported adapters? There might be a big diff between "it worked before" and "compatible". See their "Which Network Adapters Work with My TiVo DVR?" article to be sure. Maybe you've got one that was reported to work {green check mark} but wasn't officially verified for compatability.

Hopefully somebody with more network smarts can add to this.


----------



## dugbug

Alcatraz said:


> *Expat & dugbug,* I'm no networking expert but I do have a few questions, but they may not apply to both of you:
> 
> How long was everything working before and when did it stop?
> Worked for over a year without issues. The day 9.1 was installed it broke.
> 
> Was something changed in your network environment that might be interfering?
> no
> 
> Just trying to eliminate other things before looking at tivo.
> Are you using static IP or DHCP?
> static
> 
> Are you using any sort of wireless bridge with a wired connection?
> Yes, wireless from wired connection. Both tivos.
> 
> If wireless, have you tried using different channels?
> 
> They both have working access to the wireless network (as seen via "music, photos, products & more" internet access as well as program downloading). The issue is only with MRV, and ONLY from the point of view of the pioneer. The HUMAX can browse the pioneer and download content.
> 
> Are you sure you're using supported adapters? There might be a big diff between "it worked before" and "compatible". See their "Which Network Adapters Work with My TiVo DVR?" article to be sure. Maybe you've got one that was reported to work {green check mark} but wasn't officially verified for compatability.
> 
> Why would this break MRV only, and only from one tivo?
> 
> Hopefully somebody with more network smarts can add to this.


I don't know what is going on. but both tivos are on the network cleanly. I can visit each of their dummy web pages from my PC as well.


----------



## Expat

How long was everything working before and when did it stop?
since Nov 2004

Was something changed in your network environment that might be interfering? 
No

Just trying to eliminate other things before looking at tivo.
Are you using static IP or DHCP?

Static IP

Are you using any sort of wireless bridge with a wired connection?

Linksys USB200M, ethernet to Wireless G gaming adapters connecting to a Wireless G only network

If wireless, have you tried using different channels?
No, other devices still happily using same settings since 2004.

I have no issues accessing the TiVo server from either for guide data, althought the Yahoo weather is slow slow on both. The MRV seems to be hit or miss, prior to my last round of reboots, the Humax could see the TiVo, and now its reversed.
Unlike others I don't have the time to continually reboot in the hope of restoring MRV.

Oh and I can merrily transfer to TiVo Desktop all day long with no problems


----------



## Alcatraz

Hmm, although you are each having slightly different issues {MRV transfer vs. Desktop transfers} you both are using wired connections to a separate wireless device, for which you are required to use static IP. Any chance you could connect directly to your network temporarily to see if that helps? 

dugbug, you still haven't mentioned which adapters you're using.


----------



## richsadams

News from TiVoPony regarding fixes for v9.1 bugs with Series 2 boxes.



> The issues reported on Series2 platforms running 9.1 are typically in the nuisance category, unlike the issues 9.2 addressed for the Series3 architectures.
> 
> There is a patch release in discussion, it would address a couple of very specific Series2 issues (including the Channel 1 VOD issue) on specific Series2 models. There's a larger release to address general bug fixing also in development.


----------



## dugbug

Alcatraz said:


> Hmm, although you are each having slightly different issues {MRV transfer vs. Desktop transfers} you both are using wired connections to a separate wireless device, for which you are required to use static IP. Any chance you could connect directly to your network temporarily to see if that helps?
> 
> dugbug, you still haven't mentioned which adapters you're using.


The DLINK DUB E-100 is the usb->ethernet converter

Can't recall what I use for the ethernet/wireless switches.

-d


----------



## Alcatraz

dugbug said:


> The DLINK DUB E-100 is the usb->ethernet converter
> 
> Can't recall what I use for the ethernet/wireless switches.
> 
> -d


Can you tell which version you have? TiVo has the checkmark {not tested but reported to work} for A1 & A2, but A4 & B1 have the :down: {not compatible}.

If you have A1/A2, maybe they changed something in the software that changed the way the adapter works. Can you try swapping your adapters around to see if the problem moves?


----------



## dugbug

Alcatraz said:


> Can you tell which version you have? TiVo has the checkmark {not tested but reported to work} for A1 & A2, but A4 & B1 have the :down: {not compatible}.
> 
> If you have A1/A2, maybe they changed something in the software that changed the way the adapter works. Can you try swapping your adapters around to see if the problem moves?


my bad, I upgraded a while back to a linksys USB200M. This component works fine. Remember both tivos have a very good internet connection. Its only MRV.

-d


----------



## Expat

Just wanted to further clarify my situation.

My homenet is as follows:
Linksys Router DHCP
3 Pcs
Linksys Wireless Router No DHCP
Linksys Wireless Print Server--HP 9800
D-Link G820--Squeezebox
D-link G-820-USBM200- TiVo Upstairs
D-link G-820-USB200M TiVo Downstairs
Laptop

Ok so the Wireless Print Server, D-Link's and TiVo's have static IP's assigned.
All else use DHCP

As of this past week,

Squeezebox Working  
Hp9800 Working
Laptop Connection Working
Tivo Downstairs, can see upstairs TiVo  , can MRV ! shows, can connect to TiVo Server, can connect to TiVo desktop on PC.
TiVo Upstairs, Can see NO TiVo's  , can connect to TiVo server, can connect to TiVo desktop on PC.

So why if every item can connect to the network & beyond, does MRV not work on the upstairs TiVo?
Remember just after 9.1 it was revered, up' was happy and down wasn't.

Makes no sense to me, need more coffee.


----------



## RoyK

I guess the lockup my wife just got navigating out of "Find Programs" is one of those things TiVo considers just a "nuisance" in 9.1? Give me a break!


----------



## RoyK

Today - Couldn't stop transfer, couldn't delete recording from menu (twice), couldn't stop a recording.... Still waiting TiVo.

Edit: I almost forgot - also one MRV that refused to start transferring requiring a reboot!


----------



## Erik6408

After upgrading to 9.1 my 540 S2 Tivo DVR has a problem with *pixilation after changing to a new channel*. It happens about 80 percent of the time and I did not have this problem prior to upgrading. I have even done a complete reset (deleted everything) of the system and it still is having this problem. Please let me know if anyone else is having this annoying problem. Thank you.


----------



## richsadams

Erik6408 said:


> After upgrading to 9.1 my 540 S2 Tivo DVR has a problem with *pixilation after changing to a new channel*. It happens about 80 percent of the time and I did not have this problem prior to upgrading. I have even done a complete reset (deleted everything) of the system and it still is having this problem. Please let me know if anyone else is having this annoying problem. Thank you.


Reports of macroblocking or "pixilation" are pretty rare for Series2's. You might try some of the kickstart diagnostics to see if that will clear things up. There are some other "bugs" in v9.1 that TiVo says they will address in an upgrade, but what you're seeing is unusual.

If the diagnostics don't resolve things I'd give TiVo a call and let them know what you're seeing.


----------



## CaseyK24

RoyK said:


> Had to reboot again. Programs queued to transfer via MRV weren't transferring.......


This is one bug I've noted before and have seen others comment on. I think anything involving a reboot for ANY MRV transfer to work is a bug not just a nuisance. Any word on if they acknowledge this problem yet?

Casey


----------



## RoyK

CaseyK24 said:


> This is one bug I've noted before and have seen others comment on. I think anything involving a reboot for ANY MRV transfer to work is a bug not just a nuisance. Any word on if they acknowledge this problem yet?
> 
> Casey


In the words of the infamous Shultz "They know nothing. NOTHING...."


----------



## RoyK

Its been a month and a half. Where are the fixes TiVo?


----------



## bicker

They didn't promise you you'd get a fix anytime soon, did they?


----------



## RoyK

bicker said:


> They didn't promise you you'd get a fix anytime soon, did they?


A company which feels responsibility to its subscribers wouldn't need to. But then a company which feels responsibility to its subscribers wouldn't have released the "update" in this condition in the first place.


----------



## bicker

Your expectations are unreasonable. A company which feels responsibility to its subscribers would live up to the explicit terms and conditions of the service; they would do as they promise, not as you WISHED they'd have promised.


----------



## formulaben

bicker said:


> Your expectations are unreasonable. A company which feels responsibility to its subscribers would live up to the explicit terms and conditions of the service; they would do as they promise, not as you WISHED they'd have promised.


His expectations are not unreasonable; it is a valid to expect the product software to get better, or unchanged; not worse.


----------



## CrispyCritter

formulaben said:


> His expectations are not unreasonable; it is a valid to expect the product software to get better, or unchanged; not worse.


It's valid to expect the product software to get better for most people. But once you reach a large enough population, it becomes unreasonable to expect the software to get better for all people.

Every TiVo software release I've seen in the past 7 years has gotten some people upset because it's worse for them, for whatever reason. Same for most Microsoft releases; the same for most Linux releases. But few people would say TiVo should have stopped at Version 2.0!


----------



## RoyK

Every major software release I've seen in the past three years has been riddled with gross defects which magically disappear two or three months later after TiVo reacts to threads like this and finally does correctly what should have been done in the first place -- tests and debugs their software.


----------



## qz3fwd

At least they eventually test/debug/fix their software.
Many CE companies just throw it out into the consumers lap with unfinished, bugg ridden, missing functionality code which never gets fixed.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

qz3fwd said:


> At least they eventually test/debug/fix their software.
> Many CE companies just throw it out into the consumers lap with unfinished, bugg ridden, missing functionality code which never gets fixed.


Quite sadly, this is the literal truth. Reminds me of a cartoon where a political sign says something like "Vote for Smith, the best of a bad lot."


----------



## bicker

formulaben said:


> His expectations are not unreasonable; it is a valid to expect the product software to get better, or unchanged; not worse.


It is only "valid" to expect the software to do what is *explicitly promised*. Everything else is just wishful thinking.

Beyond that, words like "better" and "worse" are subjective, at best.


----------



## bicker

CrispyCritter said:


> It's valid to expect the product software to get better *for most people*. But once you reach a large enough population, it becomes unreasonable to expect the software to get better for all people.


I'll agree with this, with the proviso that I've emboldened, but only if "better" is defined by "gets more people to pay more". Talk is cheap: If you want to know if customers like something or not, watch what they do with their wallets.


----------



## RoyK

bicker said:


> I'll agree with this, with the proviso that I've emboldened, but only if "better" is defined by "gets more people to pay more". Talk is cheap: If you want to know if customers like something or not, watch what they do with their wallets.


And if you want to know if a company is doing things right read their quarterly report.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

bicker said:


> It is only "valid" to expect the software to do what is *explicitly promised*.


Many people strongly disagree with you. There are even legal precedents that disagree with you. Here's a link to get you started in your reading.

To save everyone else the time, here's the first paragraph:

_In common law jurisdictions, an implied warranty is a contract law term for certain assurances that are presumed to be made in the sale of products or real property, due to the circumstances of the sale. These assurances are characterized as warranties irrespective of whether the seller has expressly promised them verbally or in writing. They include an implied warranty of fitness for a particular purpose, an implied warranty of merchantability for products, and an implied warranty of habitability for a home._


----------



## RoyK

Unfortunately TiVo, like many companies, disclaim any warranty of merchantability in their T&C - to wit:
(From http://www.tivo.com/abouttivo/policies/tivoserviceagreement.html )
19. Warranty Disclaimer. YOU UNDERSTAND AND AGREE THAT THE TIVO SERVICE IS PROVIDED ON AN "AS IS" AND "AS AVAILABLE" BASIS. TIVO MAKES NO WARRANTY THAT THE TIVO SERVICE WILL MEET YOUR REQUIREMENTS, ALLOW YOU TO RECORD, VIEW OR TRANSFER ANY PARTICULAR PROGRAMMING, OR THAT USE OF THE TIVO SERVICE WILL BE UNINTERRUPTED, TIMELY, SECURE, OR ERROR-FREE; NOR DOES TIVO MAKE ANY WARRANTY AS TO THE ACCURACY OR RELIABILITY OF ANY INFORMATION OBTAINED THROUGH THE TIVO SERVICE (INCLUDING THIRD PARTY CONTENT), THAT ANY DEFECTS IN THE TIVO SERVICE WILL BE CORRECTED OR THAT THE TIVO DVR OR TIVO SERVICE WILL BE COMPATIBLE WITH ANY OTHER SPECIFIC HARDWARE OR SERVICE. FURTHER, TIVO DOES NOT WARRANT THAT THE TIVO SERVICE OR THE TIVO SERVERS THAT PROVIDE YOU WITH DATA AND CONTENT ARE FREE OF VIRUSES OR OTHER HARMFUL COMPONENTS. YOU (AND NOT TIVO) ASSUME THE ENTIRE COST OF ALL NECESSARY MAINTENANCE, REPAIR OR CORRECTION. TIVO ALSO ASSUMES NO RESPONSIBILITY, AND WILL NOT BE LIABLE FOR ANY DAMAGES TO, OR VIRUSES THAT MAY INFECT YOUR TIVO DVR, TIVO SOFTWARE, OR OTHER HARDWARE. TIVO AND ITS SUPPLIERS DISCLAIM ALL WARRANTIES OF ANY KIND, WHETHER EXPRESS, IMPLIED, OR STATUTORY, REGARDING THE TIVO SERVICE OR TIVO SOFTWARE, INCLUDING ANY IMPLIED WARRANTY OF TITLE, MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE, OR NON- INFRINGEMENT OF THIRD PARTY RIGHTS. Because some jurisdictions do not permit the exclusion of implied warranties, the last sentence of this section may not apply to you.

Which in plain English states that they don't warrant their units to do anything at all no matter what their advertising seems to promise.

The only recourses the users have are to drop the service OR point out the glaring problems often and publicly so that TiVo feels that their bottom line would be affected if they don't respond.

Unfortunately old fashioned pride in work seems to be an obsolete concept these days.


----------



## bicker

RoyK said:


> And if you want to know if a company is doing things right read their quarterly report.


Not necessarily. That's a necessary but not sufficient condition.


----------



## qz3fwd

Phantom Gremlin said:


> Quite sadly, this is the literal truth. Reminds me of a cartoon where a political sign says something like "Vote for Smith, the best of a bad lot."


Although I am a total noob, I think the 9.x update works OK on both my brand spanking new S3's. I was shocked to see one of the 2 Tivo's recording 2 shows on its own when I was sure I had not scheduled anything. Turns out it is a feature (which I will turn off tonight)

I'm actually contemplating ripping open the case and swapping the 250 drive with a terabyte drive soon. I havent even had them for a month yet!


----------



## vueaskew

I have a new development with S2 #2 (of 3)...as you'll recall, after the 9.1 "upgrade", I first lost the ability to transfer programs from #3 to #1 or #2. Shortly thereafter, #2 began displaying constant lockups. Various kickstarts and disk tests later, same problem.

Today, I went to go check to see if #2 had locked up overnight, and I find a blue screen stating "External Storage Missing":


> External Storage Missing
> 
> The external storage device was not detected. Your TiVo Digital Media Recorder will not operate without it.
> 
> Please make sure that the external storage device is turned on and securely connected to the DVR. Then restart the DVR by unplugging it and plugging it back in.
> 
> If you no longer wish to use the external storage device with this DVR, press CLEAR.


WTF? I thought Series 2s couldn't use external storage anyway?! I pressed CLEAR, and got the following blue screen:


> WARNING!
> 
> You are about to permanently remove the external storage device from this TiVo Digital Media Recorder. By doing so, you will lose most, if not all of your recordings in the Now Playing List.
> 
> Do not unplug the DVR while it is being reconfigured. When the setup process is complete, the DVR will automatically restart. You may safely disconnect the external storage device at that time.
> 
> To permanently remove the external storage device, press THUMBS DOWN three times, then ENTER.


I did that, and got an orange and black TiVo logo screen with the caption "Removing external storage device. This will take a while. Do not unplug the DVR before it automatically restarts."

After that, it restarts and promptly goes into a grey "powering up"/orange and black TiVo logoed "Almost there" loop.

I power cycle it a few times to the same loop. It's not processing a 52 kickstart, but I'm not hopeful. Anyone having a similar issue or have any ideas of what this might be? I certainly hope that I haven't lost nearly 300 hours of saved programming.

On the other hand, we're "only" what, six weeks until it's "after the holidays" and we can have our "nuisance" problems resolved?

I seriously considered upgrading to a couple three HD units with lifetimes to go with our 1080p Christmas acquisitions and my beloved 1080p CRT projector, but with these continuing problems, my confidence in TiVo is seriously eroding. I'm starting to feel guilty about all those TiVo units I've evangelized into the homes of friends and family...though they may or may not be having similar problems, I'm almost afraid to ask about their 9.1/9.2 experiences.

Perhaps they should consider revising the "Lifetime" fine print to not only indicate that it's the unit's lifetime, but that the unit's lifetime may be ended at any time by a crippling forced upgrade. It certainly adds a dimension to the idea of planned obsolesence.

-Gene


----------



## pdhenry

My understanding is that the "External Storage" message on an S2 occurs when you have upgraded your TiVo with a second hard drive. Not that that explains it, but it seems to be the common thread in the stories where people have seen this.

I'm wondering if TiVo broke the compatibility to support a second internal drive when they cut the S2s over to the S3 codebase (e.g., 9.1).


----------



## Expat

They didn't break it, they introduced a nuisance bug 

I posted earlier that we may have to wait for the 1000th post to get a resolution of our "issues", come on the Holidays!


----------



## RoyK

A week more and it will be two months and all the "nuisance" bugs (ya know like lockups, rebooting to get MRV transfers to work, and etc.) continue still unfixed.


----------



## greg_burns

pdhenry said:


> My understanding is that the "External Storage" message on an S2 occurs when you have upgraded your TiVo with a second hard drive.


More info, and something to try...
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5596013#post5596013


----------



## RAB

While watching a recording this morning at around 2am, my S2DT rebooted itself, which was annoying, but now I have 9.1a. I haven't found anything different yet, though my S2 140 is still at 9.1, so I don't know if 9.1a has any MRV improvements.


----------



## richsadams

RAB said:


> While watching a recording this morning at around 2am, my S2DT rebooted itself, which was annoying, but now I have 9.1a. I haven't found anything different yet, though my S2 140 is still at 9.1, so I don't know if 9.1a has any MRV improvements.


AFAIK you're the first person to report a new software upgrade being released. :up: v9.1 was the last known upgrade for Series2's. If you have 9.1a, that's a new and long awaited upgrade by several folks having problems w/v9.1 - sounds like you were one of them?

After an upgrade is downloaded TiVo automatically installs it at 2 a.m. your time the following day (unless you happen to force a restart or reboot it before that in which case it installs immediately.)

Did you get a notice of a software upgrade similar to this one?


----------



## pdhenry

There's a TiVoJerry post around somewhere that over the next week they're distributing a release for S2DTs to fix the de-synced video issue and the tuning to VOD channel 1. The other bugs won't be addressed until the mid-winter SW update.

EDIT: TiVoJerry's post here.


----------



## RoyK

See also here


----------



## TivoZorro

I got the update last night. Now my software version reads 9.1a


----------



## richsadams

pdhenry said:


> There's a TiVoJerry post around somewhere that over the next week they're distributing a release for S2DTs to fix the de-synced video issue and the tuning to VOD channel 1. The other bugs won't be addressed until the mid-winter SW update.
> 
> EDIT: TiVoJerry's post here.





RoyK said:


> See also here


Understood guys...thanks very much!


----------



## lmdoc50

I'm noticing very delayed responses from my Series 2 Humax w/DVD burner. When I try to stop a program that is recording, the TiVo seems to respond to the remote control but the red recording light does not go out for sometimes five minutes. The page up/down, the volume up/down, the shift from screen to screen has very delayed response to remote since this software upgrade. The remote batteries are fresh and I've unplugged the TiVo and waited to restart but the problems continue.

I've also ended up with partial recordings of one show (Eric Clapton on PBS Great Performances) and a full recording along with a GP in TiVo Suggestions. When I delete the partial, the full recording and the TiVo Suggestion are deleted also. When I restore the full recordings the partial is restored! 

The Humax in on my wireless network with my TiVo S2. That TiVo is having none of the delay problems of my Humax and I can transfer programs from one TiVo to the other with no problems. 

Please TiVo send the bug free version soon!


----------



## richsadams

lmdoc50 said:


> I'm noticing very delayed responses from my Series 2 Humax w/DVD burner. When I try to stop a program that is recording, the TiVo seems to respond to the remote control but the red recording light does not go out for sometimes five minutes. The page up/down, the volume up/down, the shift from screen to screen has very delayed response to remote since this software upgrade. The remote batteries are fresh and I've unplugged the TiVo and waited to restart but the problems continue.
> 
> I've also ended up with partial recordings of one show (Eric Clapton on PBS Great Performances) and a full recording along with a GP in TiVo Suggestions. When I delete the partial, the full recording and the TiVo Suggestion are deleted also. When I restore the full recordings the partial is restored!
> 
> The Humax in on my wireless network with my TiVo S2. That TiVo is having none of the delay problems of my Humax and I can transfer programs from one TiVo to the other with no problems.
> 
> Please TiVo send the bug free version soon!


It's certainly frustrating when one of your TiVo's is acting up. But AFAIK no one has reported anything like the problems listed in the first part of your post as having anything to do with the current software. v9.1 was distributed several months ago. Did everything you're seeing start back then or has it gotten progressively worse?

What you're describing sounds much more like the results of a failing hard drive. You might want to look for some advice in the TiVo Help Center.

You could also try running some of TiVo's diagnostics listed here.


----------



## greg_burns

richsadams said:


> What you're describing sounds much more like the results of a failing hard drive.


He won't believe you. They never do.


----------



## richsadams

greg_burns said:


> He won't believe you. They never do.


Think positive man...positive! "They POSITIVELY will never believe you!" See how much better that works?


----------



## RAB

richsadams said:


> AFAIK you're the first person to report a new software upgrade being released. :up: v9.1 was the last known upgrade for Series2's. If you have 9.1a, that's a new and long awaited upgrade by several folks having problems w/v9.1 - sounds like you were one of them?
> 
> After an upgrade is downloaded TiVo automatically installs it at 2 a.m. your time the following day (unless you happen to force a restart or reboot it before that in which case it installs immediately.)
> 
> Did you get a notice of a software upgrade similar to this one?


I was surprised last night when my search for "9.1a" had no results, I expected to see lots of discussion about it. Now I've read TiVoJerry's posts and I see that the update solves problems I've been fortunate not to have.

But no, there was no message or notice of an upgrade, just a sudden reboot in the middle of the recording I was watching. It was exciting to see the "installing a service update" message during the boot, though!


----------



## RoyK

richsadams said:


> It's certainly frustrating when one of your TiVo's is acting up. But AFAIK no one has reported anything like the problems listed in the first part of your post as having anything to do with the current software. v9.1 was distributed several months ago. Did everything you're seeing start back then or has it gotten progressively worse?
> 
> What you're describing sounds much more like the results of a failing hard drive. You might want to look for some advice in the TiVo Help Center.
> 
> You could also try running some of TiVo's diagnostics listed here.


I've reported here that since 9.1 I've had numerous recordings that refused to stop recording when I attempted to stop them from the menu. My kludge has been to try to change channels and then use the Cancel Recording and Change Channel option. - I never did try to wait it out for five minutes.

Slow page up/down is the norm since 9.1


----------



## richsadams

RoyK said:


> I've reported here that since 9.1 I've had numerous recordings that refused to stop recording when I attempted to stop them from the menu. My kludge has been to try to change channels and then use the Cancel Recording and Change Channel option. - I never did try to wait it out for five minutes.
> 
> Slow page up/down is the norm since 9.1


Bummer.  Our S2's (both ST and DT) are humming right along. I still can't figure out why some are working fine and others aren't...makes no sense...to me anyway.

Did you ever try and download the software again (KS52)? Just wondering if the original download got stuffed up somehow.

Unless the OP started having problems as soon as v9.1 was installed I'd still chalk it up to a HDD issue for him.


----------



## greg_burns

richsadams said:


> Unless the OP started having problems as soon as v9.1 was installed I'd still chalk it up to a HDD issue for him.


But, as we've seen so many times over the years, that is normally when HDD issues surface (pun intended).


----------



## slyone

Whats the issue with MRV and S2? Does it effect S2 ST too? I just installed 2 new [email protected] ST and 1 S3HD over the network and my daughter was attempting a transfer(1st) tonight. I also cannot see the Tivos using TTG on the windows based computer?


----------



## RoyK

richsadams said:


> Bummer.  Our S2's (both ST and DT) are humming right along. I still can't figure out why some are working fine and others aren't...makes no sense...to me anyway.


Perhaps it is more likely that certain models are affected more than others - all mine are SD-H400s.



richsadams said:


> Did you ever try and download the software again (KS52)? Just wondering if the original download got stuffed up somehow.


Good thought and I would have tried that had the same problems not begun occurring on all three of my units immediately after they received 9.1



richsadams said:


> Unless the OP started having problems as soon as v9.1 was installed I'd still chalk it up to a HDD issue for him.


He does say that his problems began with the upgrade.


----------



## lmdoc50

I've only had my new Humax one month and it was purchased from Weaknees so it seems unlikely to be a hard drive failure. 
I've had slow response times for a little more than two weeks but the issue of not being able to stop recordings has been occurring for only a week or so.
The delays in shifting from screen to screen are preceded briefly by a blank gray screen which was never present prior to these other issues. 
Because the recording eventually stops, I never tried the kludge you use. If I'm ever in a hurry I'll try it until the software gets repaired.


----------



## richsadams

RoyK said:


> Perhaps it is more likely that certain models are affected more than others - all mine are SD-H400s.


I missed that you had Toshibas somewhere along the way...got it now.



RoyK said:


> He does say that his problems began with the upgrade.


 True enough...but since he's been around since '02 it just seems odd he'd wait so long to complain. The least little glitch makes me go looking for answers right away...but then patience isn't one of my strong suits, ask my wife. 

Anyway, hope they get it straightened out soon!


----------



## richsadams

lmdoc50 said:


> I've only had my new Humax one month and it was purchased from Weaknees so it seems unlikely to be a hard drive failure.
> I've had slow response times for a little more than two weeks but the issue of not being able to stop recordings has been occurring for only a week or so.
> The delays in shifting from screen to screen are preceded briefly by a blank gray screen which was never present prior to these other issues.
> Because the recording eventually stops, I never tried the kludge you use. If I'm ever in a hurry I'll try it until the software gets repaired.


Understood. Have you ever talked to Weaknees or TiVo about it? I know some think it doesn't make any difference, but it seems like the more complaints they get the more pressure there is to get it right.

Best of luck. :up:


----------



## RustySTL

slyone said:


> Whats the issue with MRV and S2? Does it effect S2 ST too? I just installed 2 new [email protected] ST and 1 S3HD over the network and my daughter was attempting a transfer(1st) tonight. I also cannot see the Tivos using TTG on the windows based computer?


I'm only having issues with my DT, I have two S2 ST and they transfer back and forth fine, but I can't transfer from them to my DT at all. It starts, then stops and disappears from the DT. I'm hoping it's fixed with this new 9.1a.


----------



## richsadams

RustySTL said:


> I'm only having issues with my DT, I have two S2 ST and they transfer back and forth fine, but I can't transfer from them to my DT at all. It starts, then stops and disappears from the DT. I'm hoping it's fixed with this new 9.1a.


I've had that happen as well a couple of times on MRV with our S2's and S3. They've also gotten stuffed up while using TiVo Desktop...transfers start and then drop.

I've ended up rebooting all of them (including my PC and router) and everything came back to normal. It seemed like if there was a failed transfer at any time that was it, nothing would work until I rebooted everything and started new.

Not sure if it'll help your situation at all but just a thought.


----------



## RoyK

RustySTL said:


> I'm only having issues with my DT, I have two S2 ST and they transfer back and forth fine, but I can't transfer from them to my DT at all. It starts, then stops and disappears from the DT. I'm hoping it's fixed with this new 9.1a.


\
I'm afraid you're going to be disappointed. According to TiVoJerry 9.1a fixes two specific bugs and this isn't one of them. We're expected to wait "patiently" until "the next regular release" to have the rest fixed.


----------



## pdhenry

I'm having no problems transferring between my S2DT and my S2ST. Both have V9.1. I don't think what you're describing is a 9.1 issue per se, as the video scramble and the Channel 1 issue have been.

Last week I had trouble with one or the other TiVo totally losing the network (one occasion for each) but that was fixed each time by rebooting the router.


----------



## RoyK

Two months now TiVo - will our S2 units still be running this crappy version at Christmas?


----------



## OldTownTreadles

I'm just happy to hear that other folks had been having problems, there's a reason, and I'm not just all alone in this. Thanks, it's a comfort. 

I was thinking the trouble was that I'd finally let my SO touch the Tivo remote. Now I know the problems are related to the update. No fixes offered up yet, I take it? No way to roll it back, even? 

Our problem seems to be related to freezing video, for the most part, although it's hard to tell when the SO is so darn vague about what's happened when I'm not in the room.


----------



## irateb

I have been having issues the last half a day or so, and when I called TiVo about it, they said I have a beta version of the software: b-9-1-mr/2007.09.14-1148. Is this the same as the 9.1a you all are talking about, or is this a completely different software version? My Tivo is an unhacked S2 standalone (TCD540140) on Comcast with no cable box. Would doing the kickstarts help me?


----------



## richsadams

irateb said:


> I have been having issues the last half a day or so, and when I called TiVo about it, they said I have a beta version of the software: b-9-1-mr/2007.09.14-1148. Is this the same as the 9.1a you all are talking about, or is this a completely different software version? My Tivo is an unhacked S2 standalone (TCD540140) on Comcast with no cable box. Would doing the kickstarts help me?


I've no idea if "b-9-1-mr/2007.09.14-1148" has anything to do with the latest release for DT Series2's, v9.1a. Not questioning what you're saying, but did the CSR give you that exact information to write down? It would be somewhat if not very unusual for them to say anything other than they're working on a new software release.

Historically any software version which includes a letter has been an early release of a final and TiVo has said that v9.1a was sent out to address two (but not all) of the "bugs" found in v9.1. Based on that there should be another release coming, but AFAIK there is no known ETA. Did they tell you when to expect this update?

With regard to using TiVos Kickstart diagnostics, it really depends on what "issues" you're having.


----------



## irateb

The CSR did not give me anything to write down. My issue was that I woke up to the TiVo going through the GSOD, and when it finally came up, my guide would not show up. It just kept telling me to activate my TiVo. Going through the Guided Setup let me watch TV again (it had a "Searching for signal" error before I ran through the setup again), but still no Guide. So when I called TiVo, he had me reboot, which looped through reboots twice before coming back. The CSR was able to either look at my logs or get to my machine (not sure what they do, and my machine is connected to the internet via a Linksys USB200M v1 wired adapter) and saw this "beta" software. He had me go to the system information when the TiVo finally came back up to verify. He also kept asking me if I had signed up to be in any beta group. I told him that I've had this TiVo for almost 3 years and this is the first issue I've had, so if I signed up for any beta, it was literally years ago. He also noticed that my service level (can't remember if that's the right term) went from "C:<a string of characters>" to "A:-". He said they have a fix for that, but the engineering dept (who apparently have the weekend off) would have to do that, so I'd have to call back on Monday. So hopefully this explains my situation more. I suppose a better question than the one I asked before is, would the kick starts hurt anything before I talk to the engineering dept?


----------



## timstack8969

Any fix coming for the Blue Screen for us using the single tuner 240 Tivo with serial connection?


----------



## richsadams

irateb said:


> The CSR did not give me anything to write down. My issue was that I woke up to the TiVo going through the GSOD, and when it finally came up, my guide would not show up. It just kept telling me to activate my TiVo. Going through the Guided Setup let me watch TV again (it had a "Searching for signal" error before I ran through the setup again), but still no Guide. So when I called TiVo, he had me reboot, which looped through reboots twice before coming back. The CSR was able to either look at my logs or get to my machine (not sure what they do, and my machine is connected to the internet via a Linksys USB200M v1 wired adapter) and saw this "beta" software. He had me go to the system information when the TiVo finally came back up to verify. He also kept asking me if I had signed up to be in any beta group. I told him that I've had this TiVo for almost 3 years and this is the first issue I've had, so if I signed up for any beta, it was literally years ago. He also noticed that my service level (can't remember if that's the right term) went from "C:<a string of characters>" to "A:-". He said they have a fix for that, but the engineering dept (who apparently have the weekend off) would have to do that, so I'd have to call back on Monday. So hopefully this explains my situation more. I suppose a better question than the one I asked before is, would the kick starts hurt anything before I talk to the engineering dept?


Ah, got it now. :up: That's an interesting story and I've no idea why you would have received a beta version of the software either.

In any case, no, two of the Kickstarts are designed to locate and repair HDD problems such as bad sectors, corrupted data, etc. and the other simply reloads the existing software to the alternate partition and boots from there going forward. Being that you're dealing with the wrong software TiVo will have to correct things on their end. They can change your service status and force a software download. AFAIK I don't think anyone else has reported such a thing, so you're officially "special" and I know we'd appreciate being kept up to speed with what happens.

Also, since you're possibly on a beta version you might want to have a look around at things, menus and such and let us know if you see anything new and/or unusual. It's always fun to have a peek under the tent! 

Thanks again for the feedback. :up:


----------



## irateb

richsadams said:


> Also, since you're possibly on a beta version you might want to have a look around at things, menus and such and let us know if you see anything new and/or unusual. It's always fun to have a peek under the tent!


Thank you for looking at my issue! Since my guide is missing and my TiVo reboots randomly now, I haven't been able to do much looking around. The only two things I noticed (and this may be an indication of a bad software install rather than it being the beta) is that the intro cartoon doesn't show up anymore, and when I push the TiVo button to get to the Tivo main page, the main page is transparent, so I can see what I was watching until I pick an option. Kind of cool, kind of annoying since depending on what I was watching, it makes it hard to see the options. I've had the TiVo unplugged for half the day now, hoping maybe giving it a break would allow me to at least get back to some sort of normalcy when I call TiVo tomorrow. I wonder if this has anything to do with the TiVo sticker falling off the front..


----------



## RoyK

RoyK said:


> Two months now TiVo - will our S2 units still be running this crappy version at Christmas?


10 weeks now and counting... Same question, same crippled software, same lack of response.


----------



## bicker

Benjamin Franklin: The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.


----------



## RoyK

bicker said:


> Benjamin Franklin: The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.


Franklin: "Energy and persistence conquer all things. "

I don't expect different results. I'm merely pointing out the lack thereof for those who may be wondering how TiVo supports their software.


----------



## bicker

One would think that folks affected could figure that out for themselves. Good thing they have you to help remind them. Over and over and over again. 



Actually, I think you really have another motivation, but I'll leave it at that... Let each reader decide for themselves.


----------



## RoyK

My motivation is to do whatever I can to get the performance back from the equipment I bought and the software I pay for. I know what it's capable of.

You're free to think whatever you wish.


----------



## bicker

RoyK said:


> My motivation is to do whatever I can to get the performance back from the equipment I bought and the software I pay for.


Evidently, this *isn't * that "whatever".


----------



## jbcheshire

I hate the fact that my series 2 keeps recording the show "Chuck" on its own initiative!!

I have given it a 3 thumbs down rating and verified that it is NOT in my subscriptions folder, yet it keeps showing up in my "to do" folder and is recorded if I don't cancel it. And this has continued to happen since the update. What's up with that?????


----------



## richsadams

jbcheshire said:


> I hate the fact that my series 2 keeps recording the show "Chuck" on its own initiative!!
> 
> I have given it a 3 thumbs down rating and verified that it is NOT in my subscriptions folder, yet it keeps showing up in my "to do" folder and is recorded if I don't cancel it. And this has continued to happen since the update. What's up with that?????


That is bizarre! Do you have anything with the word "Chuck" in it in your Wish List; "Chuck Norris" for example? Now that there are more WL options, it may need to be made more specific.

We have "scuba diving" in our WL and used to get an episode of Scooby Doo that had "scuba" in the description...a LOT. No matter what we did it kept showing up. It was very frustrating to have to delete it constantly. But now that there are options to opt words, phrases, etc. in or out of the WL we've been able to eliminate it completely.

The only other thing I'd look at would be Suggestions if you have it turned on. Other than that I can't imagine why that's happening...or why it would have anything to do with a software update. Maybe someone else can come up with a theory. Worst case you could clear and delete everything and start over but what a PITA. 

Best of luck! :up:

*EDIT: *I noticed that "Chuck" is always included in the CNET Guru Guides Recommendations. Are you using Guru Guides? If so you can modify it by going to your Guru Guides and unchecking the show.


----------



## pdhenry

I couldn't get my Humax S2 to stop recording a suggestion this morning. I kept selecting "Stop Recording" from the program page and it kept recording. Finally I hit Live TV and changed the channel - that made it go away.


----------



## richsadams

pdhenry said:


> I couldn't get my Humax S2 to stop recording a suggestion this morning. I kept selecting "Stop Recording" from the program page and it kept recording. Finally I hit Live TV and changed the channel - that made it go away.


So I wonder why the most recent software upgrade is so buggy with Humax boxes? (IIRC RoyK has a couple and his aren't playing nice either.) Most things seemed to be sorted out for "regular" S2's, but the Humax boxes continue to act up.


----------



## RoyK

Mine are Toshiba SD-H400s.
Roy


----------



## richsadams

RoyK said:


> Mine are Toshiba SD-H400s.
> Roy


D'oh! That's right.


----------



## pdhenry

richsadams said:


> So I wonder why the most recent software upgrade is so buggy with Humax boxes?


I had worse issues with my S2DT but they've fixed those.


----------



## richsadams

pdhenry said:


> I had worse issues with my S2DT but they've fixed those.


And that's even stranger...um, more unusual? Anyway, we never had any issues with our DTS2 or STS2 with the various upgrades. Just plain weird.


----------



## RoyK

11 weeks now since this "update" was released. Still transfers sometimes don't, stopping recordings often doesn't, files often won't delete using menu, menu's sometimes don't display requiring reboots and generally slow operation.


----------



## pdhenry

My experience over the weekend was that perhaps an inability to stop a suggested recording is linked to a transfer being in progress. On at least one occasion I had trouble stopping a recording and later discovered that a transfer had been stopped and deleted (instead?). I didn't troubleshoot to the point of trying to recreate the issue, but the scenario would be:

Initiate a transfer from TiVo A to TiVo B
On TiVo B, attempt to stop a scheduled recording in progress
Determine whether the recording stops and whether the transfer continues. 
Repeat for stopping s suggested recording.

Another possible impact might be whether the recording started before or after the tramsfer.


----------



## rbringmann

All,

I have seen this problem for a couple of months now and it is persistant since the 9.1 service update.

Basically, periodically, I look to transfer movies from one WIRED series 2 tivo to another and the folder is empty on the other series 2 tivo. The tivo shows up on my network. The folder shows up, but there are no files. I go to the other tivo, and it has files. I have found that if I restart my Tivos, the problem goes away. However, a few days later the problem comes back again. By the way, my network has 3 Series 2 boxes. One of them is a humax. The problem manifests from any starting point on the network.

Has anyone seen this problem? Is there a thread already talking about what to do about it?

Thanks! Roger


----------



## RoyK

rbringmann your problem has been talked about since 9.1 and is another of what TiVo has termed a "nuisance" bug that might be fixed when they get around to putting out the next release. The only remedy that I've seen is to do just what you're doing - restart your units.


----------



## RoyK

Now 12 weeks of 9.1 and counting....

Merry Christmas all!


----------



## E94Allen

New bug you may or may not aware of. When I accidently chose the SAVE TO THE VCR option and I tried to get out of that so I choose DO NOT SAVE option and I lost that recording completely not even in Deleted Folder... nothing. I am pissed.


----------



## Alcatraz

RoyK said:


> Now 12 weeks of 9.1 and counting....
> 
> Merry Christmas all!


I hope Santa left coal in your stocking. Do you work for Echostar or something?



E94Allen said:


> New bug you may or may not aware of. When I accidently chose the SAVE TO THE VCR option and I tried to get out of that so I choose DO NOT SAVE option and I lost that recording completely not even in Deleted Folder... nothing. I am pissed.


I just tried to duplicate what you're reporting but could not. It would help if you could list exactly what buttons you are pressing and on which menu items (left arrow to exit the *Copy to VCR* screen vs. selecting *Don't copy this program*, for example).

Also, please list which tivo model you have, or include the first 3 serial numbers, and the software it's currently running.


----------



## RoyK

Alcatraz said:


> I hope Santa left coal in your stocking. Do you work for Echostar or something?
> ........


TiVo left the coal 12 weeks ago and no, I don't work for Echostar or something. Matter of fact I'm a retired engineer from a totally unrelated industry.


----------



## Alcatraz

RoyK said:


> TiVo left the coal 12 weeks ago and no, I don't work for Echostar or something. Matter of fact I'm a retired engineer from a totally unrelated industry.


Ah, *G*rumpy *R*etired *E*ngineer *W*ith *P*lenty of *T*ime to *H*arangue *E*veryone *R*eading *A*ll *P*osts *Y*ou're writing.

*GREWP THERAPY* writing. I see. Well, if that's what it takes to make you feel better.....

Hmm, as I'm reading this I'm realizing it's really a bit of a stretch, and barely a humorous one at that. I apologize, and readily admit that it's somewhat selfish of me to keep knocking you down. It just gets tiresome knowing that you're gonna jump in every now and then to make a comment about a situation we're all completely aware of and living with. Thank you, Captain Obvious.

I'd like to point out that Tivo has pushed out questionable software in the past and there's always someone who wants rail on and on about it like it's the end of life as we know it. Despite appearances in this thread, I'm not a tivotee trying to turn a blind eye & convince people there's nothing to see here. It's just really boring/annoying to hear/read you chime in with nothing new and reiterate the fact that you're unhappy. I really don't want to make it my life's goal to hypocritically continue to repeat *" WE...GET...IT!"* but, sheeeshh, enough already. Methinks you need another hobby, or something shiny, to give you something else to focus on.

Now that I've degraded myself, I'll shut up for awhile :up:. I'm sure there are just as many people getting sick of me as they are of you.


----------



## RoyK

Then I'll say no more -- until week 13 -- comes -- without the situation being fixed. You can feel free to rail at me again then when I express continued displeasure about the still unresolved situation.


----------



## E94Allen

Alcatraz said:


> I just tried to duplicate what you're reporting but could not. It would help if you could list exactly what buttons you are pressing and on which menu items (left arrow to exit the *Copy to VCR* screen vs. selecting *Don't copy this program*, for example).
> 
> Also, please list which tivo model you have, or include the first 3 serial numbers, and the software it's currently running.


I tried to reproduce this bug again however seem it is only time thing. I hope it keep that way and never come back. Oh I thought of it just now that I had power outrage today (portable heater 1500 watts and microwave do not mix considering) and all my three TiVos has been restarted maybe that is why I have been unable to reproduce this bug. The problem I had is on the Series 2 DT TiVo with the latest update on it.


----------



## dugbug

All I want is MRV to work again. I can reconfigure tivo to use the same network settings and MRV works for an hour or so then forgets about the other tivo(s).

I would love to downgrade until they get that working

-d


----------



## Lil'Ed

I had to reboot 4 of my 5 tivo's today. Only 1 did not get the "there are no recordings on this DVR" message when viewed from any other one. I noted that the working one was my newest tivo with the internal nic card and it is also the only one that has version 9.1a. 

I understood that 9.1a was not a fix for this problem so this may be a coincidence.

I also had the problem where a transfer was in progress and I attempted to cancel a suggestion that was being recorded. The suggestion continued to record although I stopped it 3 times. I finally went to live TV and changed the channel. That stopped the recording. But then when I tried to view the transfer, only the first 9 minutes were transferred. That time coincided with when I tried to stop the suggestion. This was on a 540040.

I have started a log to track how often I have to reboot and which ones have to be rebooted. Maybe I can make some sense of it.


----------



## Lil'Ed

I got up this morning and the new Tivo with the internal NIC had to be rebooted. None of the other 4 Tivos could see the recordings on it. 

So since yesterday I have rebooted all 5 of my Tivos due to this problem. I am still keeping a log.


----------



## Lil'Ed

I don't know how I hadn't seen this till now. Can anyone else duplicate it?

I Go to now playing and select one of my networked Tivos other then the one I am at (Let's say tivo #2) and scroll down to "SUGGESTIONS" It shows 20 recordings to the right in parentheses. I select it to see the list of suggestions and at the top it shows Tivo #2 and 20 suggestions. If I count them there are 20.

I back out to the left to the "NOW PLAYING" screen and select another of my networked Tivos (Let's say Tivo #3), scroll down to "SUGGESTIONS". It shows 46 recordings to the right in parentheses. I select it to see the list of suggestions and it shows Tivo #3 at the top BUT IT SHOWS 20 SUGGESTIONS!!!!! They are the same suggestions I previously saw when I looked at tivo #2!!! If I count them there are 20. If I back out one step to the left the top of the screen shows Tivo #3 and 46 suggestions. 

It doesn't mattter how many different Tivos I look at they all show whatever suggestions were on the first one I looked at..... It looks like the only way to get it to actually update to the desired Tivo is to back out of "SUGGESTIONS" an select any other show on that Tivo, back out one step to the left and then cursor down to "SUGGESTIONS" now you see the actual list of what is on that Tivo.

Oh and it gets better, if I am looking at Tivo #3 but actually seeing Tivo #2 Suggestions and I select one of them for transfer... It will transfer.

Please someone else try to duplicate this


----------



## greg_burns

Lil'Ed said:


> I don't know how I hadn't seen this till now. Can anyone else duplicate it?


http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=378564


----------



## Lil'Ed

Greg_Burns

Thanks for the link.


----------



## RoyK

13 Weeks of 9.1
1/4 year of major unfixed bugs and still counting.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

RoyK said:


> 13 Weeks of 9.1
> 1/4 year of major unfixed bugs and still counting.


I feel your pain. 

It took TiVo a *year* from when they released the disastrous "Fall 2006" pricing until they slightly simplified/improved it. And that change didn't require *any* engineering. It could have been done overnight, but still took a year.

It takes *good software engineering practices* to produce quality software. Recently, TiVo has shown very little ability to produce quality software. I suspect that most of their good people have left for greener pastures.

So don't hold your breath waiting for the bug fixes.


----------



## hongcho

I tried searching for it, but I guess I am not that good at it.

I recently came from DirecTiVo (HR10-250) to TiVo HD (OTA-only). One of the most frustrating thing about the TiVo HD wishlist is that I can't create a wishlist based on "Premiere" or "Season Premiere".

I used it quite a bit to find new shows on DirecTiVo (well, my wife complained that the SP keeps growing ). I love to find out about new shows.

Why are these tags available on DirecTiVo, but not on TiVo HD? I thought TiVo was "adding" to the guide information provided by Tribune (or someone).

Please, please, add these tags ("Season Premiere", "Premiere").

Hong.


----------



## pj13

A new thread (for me) ... I have 5 shows recorded that when I go to watch them they give me the end of film treatment asking if I want to delete or save ... but I can not watch these shows. Tivo Tech told me to unplug for 15 mins ... didn't work. Any other advice?? Please??


----------



## RoyK

14 weeks now, still no fixes.


----------



## TiVo Steve

On a Series 2 Sony SVR-3000. Well, it's back to the phone connection...

I never had a problem with my wired network connection before 9.1! 

And at CES, TiVo is bragging about the new TiVo Desktop 2.6... hey TiVo, fix the current software so we can use the network, period!


----------



## digitol

I'm Done with this crap. Tivo = extortion. It is absurd enough as it is to PAY for HARDWARE FEATURES. Add to this insult buggy, bloated slow software updates of which you can't even opt-out of? Madness!


----------



## dugbug

Man I hate this. Should I buy new network adaptors? Why is it every new major build results in networking probems for everybody?

-d


----------



## Pangolin

pj13 said:


> A new thread (for me) ... I have 5 shows recorded that when I go to watch them they give me the end of film treatment asking if I want to delete or save ... but I can not watch these shows. Tivo Tech told me to unplug for 15 mins ... didn't work. Any other advice?? Please??


The same thing just happened to me this week. Anyone know what's up?


----------



## timstack8969

Will there be a winter update for the series 2 for people with blue screen problem?


----------



## RoyK

15 weeks since the "upgrade". It's still broken.


----------



## gijoecam

RoyK said:


> 15 weeks since the "upgrade". It's still broken.


A-Men, brother!!

TiVo = Microsoft... I think they're both hiring the same programmers... both of their systems: 
-get pushed to market too fast with unresolved bugs
-need occasional reboots to fix problems they were/are 'unaware' of
-cannot be easily reverted to previous (i.e. working) versions of the software
-point to 'hard drive failure' as a first explanation of your problems 
-ramrod updates down the user's throat (at least MS lets you opt out of some of them)
-tech support SUCKS!!

Are we sure Bill Gates doesn't run both companies? I might have to look into that....


----------



## RoyK

Sixteen weeks of this 9.1 software fiasco now. Still counting.


----------



## gardavis

I turned on my TV/Tivo/Receiver and the display was paused. I couldn't get it out of pause for more than a few seconds. It would rewind but not play much. Menus worked but recorded shows would not play more than a second or so.

A show was being recorded. I forced a reboot - first time I can remember forcing a reboot for months. When it came back up (seemed to take a long time), all was well and has been for several days.

Gary Davis


----------



## carroca

RoyK said:


> Sixteen weeks of this 9.1 software fiasco now. Still counting.


I have to hold out hope that a new software version common to all boxes will be coming out in March when Desktop 2.6 is released with web video support. I also have a feeling that we will see the Jaman video service added at that time with support for HD downloads (Series 3) and Amazon might begin offering HD downloads at the same time also. So hang in there for another frustrating month or 2.

Personally I have seen most of the 9.1 bugs listed on both of my S2 540 boxes. While the slow MRV is really annoying, the worst problem is that we have had intermittent pixelation (at least once per recording for about 5 seconds) on both boxes since the "upgrade" to 9.1


----------



## RoyK

carroca said:


> I have to hold out hope that a new software version common to all boxes will be coming out in March when Desktop 2.6 is released with web video support. I also have a feeling that we will see the Jaman video service added at that time with support for HD downloads (Series 3) and Amazon might begin offering HD downloads at the same time also. So hang in there for another frustrating month or 2.


All of which are worthless to me. We have been "hanging in there" for a third of a year now. That's about 14 weeks too long to have to tolerate this so-called "upgrade".



carroca said:


> Personally I have seen most of the 9.1 bugs listed on both of my S2 540 boxes. While the slow MRV is really annoying, the worst problem is that we have had intermittent pixelation (at least once per recording for about 5 seconds) on both boxes since the "upgrade" to 9.1


----------



## pdhenry

While at the same time others of us have moved on.

TiVo did fix the issues that arguably most "broke" the basic functionality (e.g., the S2DT changing the cable box to Channel 1 and getting stuck there). I think the precedent has been set that the fall update introduces issues that get fixed in the spring update.


----------



## RoyK

pdhenry said:


> While at the same time others of us have moved on.
> 
> TiVo did fix the issues that arguably most "broke" the basic functionality (e.g., the S2DT changing the cable box to Channel 1 and getting stuck there). I think the precedent has been set that the fall update introduces issues that get fixed in the spring update.


That's a deplorable precedent!


----------



## RoyK

17 weeks (4 months, 1/3 year) and still the unfixed bugs persist.


----------



## bobsoron

I appreciate your persistence, Roy, as frustrating as it is. I'm phasing out my S2 in favor of EyeTV for the Mac, but I'd still like the Tivo to work well enough to use as a backup. Maybe someday. (I'm still finding new bugs, but what, I'm going to report them? They're just "nuisances." As are we, apparently.)


----------



## RoyK

We're now at 18 weeks.


----------



## TiVoEvan74

Expressing this in weeks let's them off the hook too easily! "Weeks" is too short a time period.

*It's been 4 and a half MONTHS !!*


----------



## bobsoron

Can you believe I found _two new bugs_? (I think. I'm not going to chase through the 22 pages of posts to make sure, but I've read them all and don't remember seeing them.)

Yesterday RCN in Chicago switched over to its new lineup, adding dozens of channels. I had to force an update to switch my S2 over to the new lineup -- you'd think it would be one of the regular "new lineup" updates that Tivo had always been conscientious about back in the day. But that isn't the bug; the bug is that 24 hours later, many of the channels in the To Do List are still displayed wrong. Bafflingly, the same episodes of the same shows in my Wishlists' Upcoming Programs screen are displayed with the correct channels. One screen gets it right; the other screen gets it wrong.

Fortunately, the S2 seems to be consistently switching to the right channel, although I haven't yet checked today's recordings. Nonetheless, all of the channels should have been correct when the S2 finished indexing the new program listing data.

Also: The Internet-dependent features at the bottom of the Find Programs screen have been coming and going even when I'm connected to the Internet. (I have my S2 connected via Ethernet with a static IP. I'm used to not seeing those three features because a hub outage recently killed Internet service on my street for a week, but since the hub was replaced the Download TV & Movies, KidZone, and Swivel Search features have intermittently vanished, always returning when I used the Network settings' Test Tivo service connection option. Since the hub was replaced, the connection's been solid and consistent; the Tivo just isn't always seeing it, apparently.)


----------



## richsadams

bobsoron said:


> Yesterday RCN in Chicago switched over to its new lineup, adding dozens of channels. I had to force an update to switch my S2 over to the new lineup -- you'd think it would be one of the regular "new lineup" updates that Tivo had always been conscientious about back in the day. But that isn't the bug; the bug is that 24 hours later, many of the channels in the To Do List are still displayed wrong. Bafflingly, the same episodes of the same shows in my Wishlists' Upcoming Programs screen are displayed with the correct channels. One screen gets it right; the other screen gets it wrong.
> 
> Fortunately, the S2 seems to be consistently switching to the right channel, although I haven't yet checked today's recordings. Nonetheless, all of the channels should have been correct when the S2 finished indexing the new program listing data.


I've seen that happen with multiple channel lineup changes. IIRC it took several days for all of the new info to post everywhere. I'm not sure what causes it, but it seems like some of the info comes from one source and other info comes from somewhere else. Just a WAG on my part. See if things don't get sorted out in a few days.


----------



## RoyK

Its been 19 weeks now.


----------



## RoyK

Finally TiVo says something.
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5974459#post5974459


----------



## ZeoTiVo

RoyK said:


> Finally TiVo says something.
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5974459#post5974459


so what is your take on what was said?


----------



## bareyb

ZeoTiVo said:


> so what is your take on what was said?


Sounds like an update is on the way. No new features only bug fixes. That's about it. We'll all just have to wait and see what bugs get fixed. Personally my TiVo works great except for the "30 Second Skip Video Lag" problem. If you want specifics, you could try checking the "release notes" (I kid, I kid!).


----------



## RoyK

ZeoTiVo said:


> so what is your take on what was said?


Finally, after nearly 5 months of silence TiVo is feeling the heat and putting the best spin on this fiasco that they can.

At least we can perhaps see light at the end of the tunnel.

In the end it boils down to the same thing that it has for the last three years - 6 months of the year the software is riddled with bugs, the other 6 it works pretty darned well.


----------



## Alcatraz

RoyK said:


> Finally, after nearly 5 months of silence TiVo is feeling the heat and putting the best spin on this fiasco that they can.


----------



## pdhenry

ZeoTiVo said:


> so what is your take on what was said?


 "Sometimes you have to go to war with the Army you have."


----------



## steve614

Even though I'm not one experiencing problems (unless you count the "30 Second Skip Video Lag" bug, not a showstopper,btw), I'm glad that TiVoPony gave us an update (although it should have been sooner  ).

As a consumer, I feel it's great that Tivo acknowledges its customers.
How many other companies do that?


----------



## RoyK

pdhenry said:


> "Sometimes you have to go to war with the Army you have."


Rumsfeld is the last person I'd quote. This is the same guy who said:

"We do know, of certain knowledge, that (Bin Laden) is either in Afghanistan or in some other country or dead. "

A wise commander knows when his army is unprepared, picks his battles, and sends in the special forces.


----------



## ZeoTiVo

RoyK said:


> Finally, after nearly 5 months of silence TiVo is feeling the heat and putting the best spin on this fiasco that they can.


man, you live in your own little world. You think TiVo inc. has been sitting around and not workling on the next release. You have not seen a pattern of Pony coming on the board when a release is imminent and giving the bord a head's up.

If you worked in the real world you would know that release schedules are planned well in advance and that many factors add in to the release schedule and what is released with it. Which is what Pony actually said and was in no way influenced by the whining on this forum.

ah, but I forgot that yu worked in a perfect little world and no bugs ever happen there, except for small ones that are quickly dealt with. Have fun there.


----------



## RoyK

ZeoTiVo said:


> man, you live in your own little world. You think TiVo inc. has been sitting around and not workling on the next release. You have not seen a pattern of Pony coming on the board when a release is imminent and giving the bord a head's up.
> 
> If you worked in the real world you would know that release schedules are planned well in advance and that many factors add in to the release schedule and what is released with it. Which is what Pony actually said and was in no way influenced by the whining on this forum.
> 
> ah, but I forgot that yu worked in a perfect little world and no bugs ever happen there, except for small ones that are quickly dealt with. Have fun there.


Have a nice day


----------



## GoHokies!

RoyK said:


> Have a nice day


Tough to argue when someone's right, isn't it?

This mirrors the discussion in the linked thread (and I'll ask the same question here) - does anyone realistically think that the discussions we've had here have changed the timeline for this release one bit? It's nice and all that Pony gave us a heads up (like he usually does), but like Zeo said, this update has been in the works for far longer than people here have been complaining about bugs.


----------



## RoyK

GoHokies! said:


> Tough to argue when someone's right, isn't it?
> 
> ...


 I just don't respond to sarcasm.

I'm sure we'll be going through this same thing starting next October just as we did last October, the October/November before that, and the October/November before that. Different bugs maybe, and different excuses but same pattern.


----------



## GoHokies!

And your vocal complaints will have the same effect next time around as they did this time.


----------



## RoyK

One can always hope.


----------



## ZeoTiVo

RoyK said:


> I just don't respond to sarcasm.
> 
> I'm sure we'll be going through this same thing starting next October just as we did last October, the October/November before that, and the October/November before that. Different bugs maybe, and different excuses but same pattern.


depends on how much heavy lifting TiVo will need to do and indeed if there is even a 10.x release anytime soon.

if they are not making major overhauls in the code base or merging code bases for different platforms that branched off back together, then I would expect the pattern to not be the same. If instead we see a 9.x fall release it would most likely continue the code improvement path.

Some do not seem to get that TiVo has basically twice done major under the covers changes in both7x and 9x to add in major new features and then major new platform in the series 3 and that series 3 introduced cable cards that are very new technology and have given any organization that touches them some sever growing pains.

Sure TiVo is responsible for a constantly stable operating DVR with no issues. That is what customers look for. Still I for one am glad TiVo undertook to keep innovating at the same time and also to make sure MRV/TTG stayed as a feature that worked seamlessly between series 2 and series 3. many other companies would have just said - "it wont happen, upgade if you want it"

To ignore the realities is just simplifying things more than they should be.


----------



## TivoZorro

I'm all for innovations too. Love the latest technology. But the fact is that since my two Series 2 Tivos received the Version 9 software MRV has not worked as it should.

Take for example yesterday. Set up recordings to transfer from my 649 to my 540. Go back a little later and a transfer is frozen. Have to leave to go to work so I leave it. Get home at 11:30 PM and after an hour of rebooting and kickstarting (57) the 540 and rebooting the 649 I get the transfers working again. Go to bed. Get up in the morning with another frozen transfer due to the fact of a DSL outage. Spend two hours rebooting and kick starting Tivos, rebooting and unplugging DSL modem and router. Finally deleted all of the transfers off the 540. Had this type of thing happened before the upgrade no. 

Glad to hear that this will be resolved soon. Will be away for two weeks and will need to transfer shows smoothly when I do get home for brief periods. Don't have time to troubleshoot and babysit.


----------



## steve614

RoyK said:


> I'm sure we'll be going through this same thing starting next October just as we did last October, the October/November before that, and the October/November before that. Different bugs maybe, and different excuses but same pattern.


I've noticed this pattern as well.
I would be willing to wait _another_ six months if Tivo could just get out a stable release that would put an end to it (says the man not experiencing any major bugs ).
Take the time to get it correct now and have less work in the future.


----------



## bareyb

steve614 said:


> I've noticed this pattern as well.
> I would be willing to wait _another_ six months if Tivo could just get out a stable release that would put an end to it (says the man not experiencing any major bugs ).


I'm kind of in the sam boat as you are. My TiVo is working perfectly (okay not perfect, slow menus at times and the dreaded 30 second skip video lag) so I'm not too excited about an update. I guessing it won't affect me at all. Hopefully it won't affect me in a bad way. I'd be thrilled if it fixed the 30 SS problem but somehow I have a feeling that little issue is going to be with us S3 users for a long time to come, if not permanently. Anyone know if 30 SS has the video lag on the TiVo Comcast boxes?


----------



## bobsoron

I've worked through deathmarches at software houses, so I respect the candor and perspective from Pony in that thread, but I have to say it feels like the attitude was "We knew we'd reduce many units to smoking holes; we just didn't anticipate so many machines and so many ways."

They call them "showstoppers" for a reason. You can't ship code that bricks the machine, and 9.1 bricks my Tivo (every so often moving from a Program Details screen to the Now Playing screen hangs my S2). Acknowledging that there were so many showstoppers that they couldn't decide which ones to fix, so they shipped them all, just isn't reasonable.

Aside from the context on this particular disaster, Pony's note confirmed the obvious, that they're working on fixing the bugs. But there's little comfort I can gain from it because, realistically, the many bugs I've found may or may not be fixed. As he acknowledges, as I've been through in deathmarches, you set your priorities. I say that dispassionately; my indignation's long worn down. I understand this isn't much fun at their end either. 

FWIW, some vendors I've purchased from, such as Roku Labs with its SoundBridges, keep reference versions of their software available so users willing to sacrifice features for stability can restore older versions. It's a good thing to do. Elgato does it with the EyeTV as well. The recent 3.0 release of their software had a couple of pretty nasty bugs, but if you sent them a note, 2.5.2 was available, and a few weeks later, the beta of 3.0.1's available for the asking as well. Wouldn't that be great here?


----------



## mchips

steve614 said:


> (says the man not experiencing any major bugs ).


Most of us are not... some people seem to go looking for problems to exploit... _everything _is a 'major' bug to them... much like the boy who cried wolf... they're always crying about something, so it's hard to take them seriously when/if they actually do have something major to report.

There are some people that are never satisfied, and never will be...


----------



## RoyK

mchips said:


> Most of us are not... some people seem to go looking for problems to exploit... _everything _is a 'major' bug to them... much like the boy who cried wolf... they're always crying about something, so it's hard to take them seriously when/if they actually do have something major to report.
> 
> There are some people that are never satisfied, and never will be...


But I, for one, will be a lot more satisfied once I can get rid of the extension cords that have connected all 3 of my boxes to power since last October so that my semi-invalid wife won't have to get down on her hands and knees to unplug the boxes after they lock up when I'm not home to do it for her.

Happy you don't have any bugs. Even happier if "Most" don't have them. But more than a few of us do so if our crying upsets you, get used to it.


----------



## Expat

mchips said:


> Most of us are not... some people seem to go looking for problems to exploit... _everything _is a 'major' bug to them... much like the boy who cried wolf... they're always crying about something, so it's hard to take them seriously when/if they actually do have something major to report.
> 
> There are some people that are never satisfied, and never will be...


Not being able to transfer between S2 TiVo's with MRV is a MAJOR BUG to me
Intolerable menu response, thats now so bad even my wife wonders if it will be fixed and is it worth our continued support of TiVo.

If you don't have any TiVo issues, I'm happy for you, go post in Happy Hour instead

On a lighter note I think TiVo are waiting for the 1000th post milestone in this thread.


----------



## steve614

Expat said:


> On a lighter note I think TiVo are waiting for the 1000th post milestone in this thread.


If this thread reaches 1000 posts before the next release, God help us all.


----------



## AppState

Expat said:


> Not being able to transfer between S2 TiVo's with MRV is a MAJOR BUG to me.


+1

edit: we gave up trying several weeks ago


----------



## ZeoTiVo

Expat said:


> Not being able to transfer between S2 TiVo's with MRV is a MAJOR BUG to me.


well these kinds of things are not a "bug" but your TiVo having a major system meltdown. Sure it might have started with the catalyst of the last software update and the major hard drive work that always entails but this is something you should call into TiVo about to get the defective unit repaired
or else try things like kickstart codes or transfer to a new hard drive to put in the TiVo, etc..


----------



## Expat

ZeoTiVo said:


> well these kinds of things are not a "bug" but your TiVo having a major system meltdown. ..


This is a BUG beleive you me 

As I have mentioned earlier in this thread, initially I could only transfer from Family room to Bedroom TiVo.
After rebooting and other BS, No TiVo's in the Now Playing list.
After more rebooting etc I can happily transfer from the Bedroom to Family room Only!!

I refuse to unplug reboot and basically waste my time in the hope that I'll be able to see each TIVo in the others now playing list, with possibly reverting to seeing no TiVo's.


----------



## ZeoTiVo

Expat said:


> This is a BUG beleive you me


it does not work for you and I repsect that is your bottom line and no one would like not having their MRV.

But it is not a widespread thing so how much of it is the cause of bad code versus somne other factor at work in your case. That was my only specific point.

Sorry that your MRV does not work and I do get that being specific at what is wrong in a forum posting does not make MRV work for you again so not helpful for you but still I would not call it a bug in the software code


----------



## greg_burns

ZeoTiVo said:


> Sorry that your MRV does not work and I do get that being specific at what is wrong in a forum posting does not make MRV work for you again so not helpful for you but still I would not call it a bug in the software code


I would tend to agree. I think I would be trying to solve this myself rather than hoping 9.3 (or whatever) fixes something.

Checking your drives for problems, reimaging with InstantCake, looking for network problems, etc. Unfortunately, I have no quick fix to offer.


----------



## moonscape

how about a bug that was, disappeared for months (and months) and is now back? suddenly, the last couple/few days, the blue screen is back - the one that flashes before showing a recorded program for those of you who had/have it.

i'm not aware of getting any update, or having one rolled back!


----------



## RoyK

Its now 20 weeks of 9.1


----------



## c.scheers

Hopefully, someone from TiVo is still monitoring this thread.

I regularly see "pixelization" issues with my 540 TiVo since getting the 9.1 update. I never saw these before 9.1.

Watching the video carefully, I do not think this is really a pixelization issue. Occasionally, in the "pixelized" frames, you can catch a ghost outline of a scene which is coming up in 1/2 a second or so.

It seems like the MPEG delta frames may be getting out of order.

I hope that this clue may be of some value.

I apologize if this has already been reported, but I didn't notice it.


----------



## carroca

c.scheers said:


> Hopefully, someone from TiVo is still monitoring this thread.
> 
> I regularly see "pixelization" issues with my 540 TiVo since getting the 9.1 update. I never saw these before 9.1.
> 
> Watching the video carefully, I do not think this is really a pixelization issue. Occasionally, in the "pixelized" frames, you can catch a ghost outline of a scene which is coming up in 1/2 a second or so.
> 
> It seems like the MPEG delta frames may be getting out of order.
> 
> I hope that this clue may be of some value.
> 
> I apologize if this has already been reported, but I didn't notice it.


I have seen the same thing on both of my 540s since 9.1 and it's really getting frustrating. I believe I mentioned it a while ago in this thread. This better be one of the fixes in the upcoming update or TiVo is going to start getting calls from me.


----------



## dugbug

ZeoTiVo said:


> it does not work for you and I repsect that is your bottom line and no one would like not having their MRV.
> 
> But it is not a widespread thing so how much of it is the cause of bad code versus somne other factor at work in your case. That was my only specific point.
> 
> Sorry that your MRV does not work and I do get that being specific at what is wrong in a forum posting does not make MRV work for you again so not helpful for you but still I would not call it a bug in the software code


THe day 9.1 hit, my MRV stopped, as did many others. Whats your point exactly?


----------



## ZeoTiVo

dugbug said:


> THe day 9.1 hit, my MRV stopped, as did many others. Whats your point exactly?


perhaps my point is that postings claiming "many others" is overstating the situation and you might find it relates to some specific thing like a brand of router or wireless channel etc..

I have various models of TiVo DVRs some are wrieless, some are not. I did not have an issue with MRV so I can not of course diagnose the problem any better than that. As greg Burns states, I would not be counting on the next upgrade alone.


----------



## greg_burns

ZeoTiVo said:


> As greg Burns states, I would not be counting on the next upgrade alone.


The next upgrade may fix something just by virtue of it reinstalling the Tivo app.

You could try that right now by doing a kickstart 52.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showpost.php?p=5643823&postcount=2


----------



## dugbug

ZeoTiVo said:


> perhaps my point is that postings claiming "many others" is overstating the situation.


I doubt its overstating anything. Tivos worked fine before. After 9.1 they can still see all networking services, but no longer each other unless I reboot one or the other (and they see each other for about 15 minutes). Same thing has been reported on several threads in this site.

This is a bug.

-d


----------



## TivoZorro

greg_burns said:


> The next upgrade may fix something just by virtue of it reinstalling the Tivo app.
> 
> You could try that right now by doing a kickstart 52.
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showpost.php?p=5643823&postcount=2


Thanks to the wonderful kickstart nstructions (with illustrations) I finally figured out that what I thought I was doing for months was not a kickstart.

While I was home briefly I did the kickstart 57 on my 649 and 540. I did six transfers between the two without problems. But I've found that after a couple of days up to a week the two Tivos will not see each other and transferes will fail. Will have to see if an actual kickstart fixes the problem. If not I will move on to 58 and then to 52. If none of these 3 kickstarts work I can only assume that it is a problem in the code somewhere. But i could be wrong.


----------



## richsadams

dugbug said:


> I doubt its overstating anything. Tivos worked fine before. After 9.1 they can still see all networking services, but no longer each other unless I reboot one or the other (and they see each other for about 15 minutes). Same thing has been reported on several threads in this site.
> 
> This is a bug.
> 
> -d


Being that you've been a forum member for over four years I'm surprised that you would state that "TiVo's worked fine before." A search of the forum will turn up all sorts of complaints about something going wrong for some folks after every single update for the past 8 years.

There are over 4 million TiVo subscriptions. To say that the problem you're seeing is a "bug" for all TiVo's based on your experience or a few or even a few dozen posts on this forum just isn't logical is all.


----------



## greg_burns

richsadams said:


> There are over 4 million TiVo subscriptions. To say that the problem you're seeing is a "bug" for all TiVo's based on your experience or a few or even a few dozen posts on this forum just isn't logical is all.


There does seem to be a lot of people reporting the same thing around here lately. Don't recall hearing of this problem prior 9.x.


----------



## RoyK

richsadams said:


> ... A search of the forum will turn up all sorts of complaints about something going wrong for some folks after every single update for the past 8 years.
> 
> ......


Probably because things have gone wrong after every single (major) update for the past 8 years --although I can personally only attest to the last 4.


----------



## ZeoTiVo

TivoZorro said:


> But I've found that after a couple of days up to a week the two Tivos will not see each other and transferes will fail.


Ok - now that could be a feature you use that is not letting go of resources or the much used memory leak/buffer overflow. That slow accumulation of some problem could well be a bug.


----------



## TivoZorro

ZeoTiVo said:


> Ok - now that could be a feature you use that is not letting go of resources or the much used memory leak/buffer overflow. That slow accumulation of some problem could well be a bug.


i always make sure before I start transfers that both Tivos can see each other. Start the transfers, everything is fine. Go back later and maybe the second or third or fourth transfer is frozen and I have to delete it or sometimes just reboot the Tivos. Rebooting usually works and the transfer will begin again. But if not I have to delete all the transfers in the que and then reboot and then set up the transfers again.


----------



## richsadams

RoyK said:


> Probably because things have gone wrong after every single (major) update for the past 8 years --although I can personally only attest to the last 4.


No arguing that. It has to be frustrating. I think in all of that time we've been lucky enough to experience only a couple of issues that were eventually fixed by the following update.


----------



## ZeoTiVo

TivoZorro said:


> Start the transfers, everything is fine. Go back later and maybe the second or third or fourth transfer is frozen


Probably not many users do bulk transfers like that. My typicla use is a show at a time. I did do a couple of 4 show transfers recently (all SD) and those wnet through. Maybe the new release will tweak MRV and help with your specific issue. They had in the last release overhauled MRV to get S2 -- S3 MRV going. Stands to reason hey would be looking to clean it up some more


----------



## TivoZorro

ZeoTiVo said:


> Probably not many users do bulk transfers like that. My typicla use is a show at a time. I did do a couple of 4 show transfers recently (all SD) and those wnet through. Maybe the new release will tweak MRV and help with your specific issue. They had in the last release overhauled MRV to get S2 -- S3 MRV going. Stands to reason hey would be looking to clean it up some more


Yeah, its the nature of my schedule. Just got home from being away for ten days. My shows build up on the 80 hour so I have to get them on the 700 Hour. Its not uncommon for me to transfer 20 to 25 shows at one time. Always worked before Version 9 but since then its been problematic. Sounds like I may have to back off on the number I do at one time until this is fixed.


----------



## RoyK

TivoZorro said:


> Yeah, its the nature of my schedule. Just got home from being away for ten days. My shows build up on the 80 hour so I have to get them on the 700 Hour. Its not uncommon for me to transfer 20 to 25 shows at one time. Always worked before Version 9 but since then its been problematic. Sounds like I may have to back off on the number I do at one time until this is fixed.


I've had it happen more than a few times with two - one transferring and one queued. The second refuses to transfer until reboot - sometimes.


----------



## RoyK

Today marks 21 weeks of unfixed 9.1


----------



## jlb

I have not had any kind of pixelization issues on my HD. What has been happening lately is response to remote commands. It seems....er..........slow. I have fresh batteries in, I know my Xantech distribution hub is ok since my unsubbed AT&TiVo flies with commands. And I checked the IR emitter on my HD it it has not moved. I do need to check to see if I have it in the best location, but I am pretty sure.

Nothing that completely bothers me, but I have had a number of overruns when FFF and the IRing. Usually need a few REPLAY presses to get it right on.

My hope is that the reason it seems like forever for an update is they are trying resolve as many of the reported issues as possible.


----------



## miadlor

One of my three dvrs has this mrv problem.
All the others, including the pc can see the one.
The one with the problem can connect to the network and use all network features just fine, but most of the time does not show the other dvrs for mrv.

I've found by going to change the network settings, but backing out before making any changes, temporally fixes the problem for about 10-15 mins. Transferring is fine once started (even if it doesn't show again). I think the bug is just the ability to display the other dvrs in the now playing.


----------



## RoyK

Today marks 22 weeks *(5 MONTHS!)* of unfixed 9.1 bugs


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

RoyK said:


> Today marks 22 weeks *(5 MONTHS!)* of unfixed 9.1 bugs


Don't worry, TiVo's ace technical team is struggling diligently to fix the problems.


----------



## richsadams

Phantom Gremlin said:


> Don't worry, TiVo's ace technical team is struggling diligently to fix the problems.


ROFLMAO


----------



## gijoecam

It's not a hardware issue, plain and simple. Take two perfectly functioning* TiVos (*perfectly with respect to MRV), upgrade the software and the MRV crapps-out, and people honestly believe it could be a hardware issue? Gimme a freakin' break!! So, say you install a new program on your PC, and you get the BSOD. Do you say, 'Oops, must be a bad motherboard'??? I don't think so... You remove the offensive software FIRST, then see if it'll boot. Unfortunately, TiVo doesn't give us that option. They ram-rod software updates down the end user's throat and then disavow any knowledge of the issues, blaming it on hardware issues.

Well, here's one up the ole' tush, TiVo. I replaced my TiVo with the supposed bad hard drive after my MRV started giving me fits. MRV worked FABULOUSLY when I first activated the TiVo... Fast transfers, quick remote response time, etc. It had version 8.5 IIRC, and the MRV worked AWESOME. Then, 'Congratulations!!' it updated on January 25th to 9.1 with the fall service update. Well, there goes my MRV right down the crapper. Admittedly it hasn't hung at the end of a transfer like the other TiVo did, but it's still slower to respond to the remote than the second coming of Christ, and transfers take for bloody ever!! 

Hardware problem my achin' arse....
________________________________________________________________

My latest rant to TiVo:

TiVo, you SUCK!! You took the best software interface in the market and flushed it right down the toilet with this update, and then are taking your old sweet time sucking the subscription fees without providing the service you promised us. Take your smiley box on legs and cram it!! I'm going to the cable company's DVR as soon as I can.


----------



## greg_burns

gijoecam said:


> It's not a hardware issue, plain and simple. Take two perfectly functioning* TiVos (*perfectly with respect to MRV), upgrade the software and the MRV crapps-out, and people honestly believe it could be a hardware issue? Gimme a freakin' break!!


I see where you are coming from, but you are completely dismissing the whole idea of how Tivo installs updates. It installs them to a different partition from the one you had been running the OS on prior to the update. If you have disk problems in that partition you are going to see weirdness after the update. Not nessarily software related.

I AM NOT SAYING that is what is going on in your case. But IT IS THE CASE for a lot of people's problems after getting a Tivo update. Don't be so fast to dismiss it.


----------



## Expat

gijoecam said:


> Hardware problem my achin' arse....QUOTE]
> 
> Well said that man ..:up::up::up:


----------



## gijoecam

greg_burns said:


> I see where you are coming from, but you are completely dismissing the whole idea of how Tivo installs updates. It installs them to a different partition from the one you had been running the OS on prior to the update. If you have disk problems in that partition you are going to see weirdness after the update. Not nessarily software related.
> 
> I AM NOT SAYING that is what is going on in your case. But IT IS THE CASE for a lot of people's problems after getting a Tivo update. Don't be so fast to dismiss it.


No, I'm not dismissing that any more than TiVo is dismissing the possibility of a crappy software release. If, in fact, there was a bad sector on the hard drive of the first 40 hr TiVo, sure, that's a possibility. However, a kick-start didn't fix the problem either, and that *should* have moved the OS to a new sector, right? So I suppose that means I had TWO consecutive bad sectors, right? Possible? Yes. Likely? Not really.

So, I go and buy a brand spankin' new 80 hr unit. At the first update, it starts giving me the exact same issues the 3 year old 40 hour unit gave me. Bad sector you say? Possibly, but what are the odds of two separate units with two separate hard drives built three years apart having the exact same set of issues with one particular version of the software on each of their respective hard drives? I think the odd are a lot more slim than the odds of both units getting a software download that causes the issues.

With that in mind, what are the odds that literally thousands of users with countless different combinations of models, hard drives, routers, networks, and numbers of TiVo units in those networks experience the exact same set of glitches ONLY after the troubled download??? About a google to one if you ask me.

So, the default response is that everyone's got a bad sector on their hard drives.... Riiiight.... And I got a bridge to sell ya' real cheap. I think that TiVo's die-hards honestly believe that if they keep saying it enough, it'll actually be true.


----------



## RoyK

greg_burns said:


> I see where you are coming from, but you are completely dismissing the whole idea of how Tivo installs updates. It installs them to a different partition from the one you had been running the OS on prior to the update. If you have disk problems in that partition you are going to see weirdness after the update. Not nessarily software related.
> 
> I AM NOT SAYING that is what is going on in your case. But IT IS THE CASE for a lot of people's problems after getting a Tivo update. Don't be so fast to dismiss it.


I've seen this before and in my humble opinion it's a myth in 99% of the cases. If the user has a newer box that is working well and after the update it isn't then the problem was that the previously unused partition that the update was written to had a problem? Not very likely.

On the other hand if its an older system and it has an older version on the partition 2 generations back that worked ok that is overwritten with a new update then the partition that was working fine before no longer is?

Sorry, doesn't make a bit of sense to me.


----------



## greg_burns

RoyK said:


> I've seen this before and in my humble opinion it's a myth in 99% of the cases. If the user has a newer box that is working well and after the update it isn't then the problem was that the previously unused partition that the update was written to had a problem? Not very likely.


Yes it does appear to be unlikely, but why does installing a new harddrive fix a majority of the cases? Heck, I advocate reinstalling a fresh image with InstantCake first before buying another drive (after verfiying the drive tests good using testing software like Hitachi Drive Fitness Test).

I am not talking about the MRV problem mentioned, but rather the random lockup/reboot/pixelation problem seen by lots of people. Put in a new drive, with a fresh image, problems disappear. I've seen this pattern repeat over and over on this board.

Drives fail all the time, old and new. Just today somebody brought their laptop into work that Windows would boot the whole way anymore. Ran Hitachi on the drive, guess what? Another bad drive. See them *all* the time.

Even if the root problem isn't hardware, then reimage the drive and start fresh. Either it will fix the problem or it won't.


----------



## RoyK

Sure drives fail. But I'd be willing to bet that a large percentage of boxes that are 'fixed' after an upgrade by replacing the drive suffered from a corrupt installation of the upgrade, not from a drive defect.

I would argue that a corrupt installation and the failure to check for same is a software issue.

Your suggestion of reimaging is a good one. That would result in a reinstallation of the upgrade and another chance at it working. Unfortunately that isn't a realistic option for John and Mary Public.


----------



## gijoecam

RoyK said:


> I've seen this before and in my humble opinion it's a myth in 99% of the cases. If the user has a newer box that is working well and after the update it isn't then the problem was that the previously unused partition that the update was written to had a problem? Not very likely.
> 
> On the other hand if its an older system and it has an older version on the partition 2 generations back that worked ok that is overwritten with a new update then the partition that was working fine before no longer is?
> 
> Sorry, doesn't make a bit of sense to me.


I meant to mention that too... The second TiVo was a new unit still in the box. If the 'new' sector of the hard drive it wrote the update to was corrupted, then either that sector was corrupted from the factory, or TiVo's lousy flawed update caused the problem. Again, what are the odds of two tivo boxes built three years apart experiencing the exact same issues with the same software version? Now, what are the odd of BOTH of those failures being caused by bad hard drives? Not very good, IMHO...


----------



## rainwater

gijoecam said:


> I meant to mention that too... The second TiVo was a new unit still in the box. If the 'new' sector of the hard drive it wrote the update to was corrupted, then either that sector was corrupted from the factory, or TiVo's lousy flawed update caused the problem. Again, what are the odds of two tivo boxes built three years apart experiencing the exact same issues with the same software version? Now, what are the odd of BOTH of those failures being caused by bad hard drives? Not very good, IMHO...


I don't think it is a either or situation. It is very common for a new drive to have bad sectors. In fact, I wouldn't bet on the drives always being new. I think the other issue is the TiVo software updates aren't able to handle situations where a partition has bad sectors. They could certainly improve their fault tolerance so they can get around some of these situations. I think one issue is the OS is more susceptible to these issues than the data partitions. The data partitions having drive problems might cause random glitches or crashes but not complete failure. But the OS partition is a different story.


----------



## richsadams

rainwater said:


> I don't think it is a either or situation. It is very common for a new drive to have bad sectors. In fact, I wouldn't bet on the drives always being new. I think the other issue is the TiVo software updates aren't able to handle situations where a partition has bad sectors. They could certainly improve their fault tolerance so they can get around some of these situations. I think one issue is the OS is more susceptible to these issues than the data partitions. The data partitions having drive problems might cause random glitches or crashes but not complete failure. But the OS partition is a different story.


All true. :up:

One other variable that TiVo has no control over is the delivery of the update itself. With tens of thousands of bits of data in tens of thousands of packets being passed through multiple networks, there is always the opportunity for corruption. If it's being delivered by a phone line, no one has to stretch their imagination too far to know that they weren't designed for high-volume data transmission and are often called upon to pass much more information than they were ever designed for. If by broadband there are tremendous opportunities for data corruption and add even more failure points if wireless broadband is employed.

Update failure more than once on one box and or again on a new box wouldn't be surprising if the delivery system to the TiVo itself were the problem.

That's not to say that the update itself, the boxes or any number of variables aren't the culprit. But one has to consider how many data corruption points there are and not all of them are in TiVo's domain.


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## greg_burns

richsadams said:


> Update failure more than once on one box and or again on a new box wouldn't be surprising if the delivery system to the TiVo itself were the problem.


I kinda assumed it did some checksum validation on the download when it was completed, but maybe that is assuming too much... You would think that would be a requirement.


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## richsadams

greg_burns said:


> I kinda assumed it did some checksum validation on the download when it was completed, but maybe that is assuming too much... You would think that would be a requirement.


Agreed, seems like a basic requirement...but you never know. I'm also wondering how unconditioned power; power surges/spikes, brownouts or other fluctuations during the download might affect the data while writing to disk.


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## TiVoJerry

greg_burns said:


> I kinda assumed it did some checksum validation on the download when it was completed, but maybe that is assuming too much... You would think that would be a requirement.


It's definitely a requirement.


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## gonzotek

The download becoming corrupted during transmission is possible, but even the weakest TiVo units certainly should be able to do some basic checksum hashing on the bits as they come in, and verify the writes to disk before continuing to the installation; and should reject and re-request any bad data when it's detected.

/darn you Jerry, making my post redundantly redundant


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## richsadams

TiVoJerry said:


> It's definitely a requirement.


Oh sure...inject your "inside knowledge" and wizardry into the conversation while we're trying to defend TiVo. Now the flood gates will open with questions about what's causing these issues and what's being done to resolve them. But then you knew that would happen...didn't you?  Hope you can answer them better than I or some of the rest of us down here in steerage.


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## MultimediaJones

Virtually any hard drive built with an IDE or SATA interface in the last 7 years, i.e. most any drive installed in a TiVo, has built-in mechanisms for error detection, correction, and remapping a sector when a bad sector is detected. There is at least one track on the hard drive reserved for relocating bad sectors. It doesn't matter what operating system is running, this happens at the hardware level. Once bad sectors are seen by the OS, be it Windows, Mac OS, Linux, etc., the drive is on its way to dying.

If a TiVo is having software update problems due to bad sectors, then the TiVo's disk volume is already near its end. The problem would usually show up as pixelation/stutters during playback before the software update. If you want to learn more about how such intelligence/monitoring/autocorrection goes on in modern hard disks, do a web search for 'S.M.A.R.T. hard disk remap' or similar.

The idea that most TiVo upgrade problems are related to physical hard disk failures, at least problems that cause specific functions to work improperly/poorly rather than making the TiVo stop working completely, is pretty silly.


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## RoyK

Well its 23 weeks now of 9.1
Three more weeks will make half a year!
Inexcusable!


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## pdhenry

Well, they do update twice a year...


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## RoyK

pdhenry said:


> Well, they do update twice a year...


So you are saying its ok to put out buggy software and not fix it for half a year because doing otherwise wouldn't fit their schedule?


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## TivoZorro

A new problem on my end. Now Tivo 1 (DT) and Tivo 2 (540) can not see the Tivo 3 (240). Did a reboot and it came back but now its gone again. Never had the problem with the 240, usually its just the DT and 540 that lose contact. Guess I will have to reboot everything again this morning. If this keeps happening MRV is going to be useless to me. Hope the fix is coming soon.


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## miadlor

Going to change the network settings, but backing out before making any changes, temporally fixes the problem for about 10-15 mins. Transferring is fine once started.

better than rebooting


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## RoyK

miadlor said:


> Going to change the network settings, but backing out before making any changes, temporally fixes the problem for about 10-15 mins. Transferring is fine once started.
> 
> better than rebooting


Yeah, but not much.


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## miadlor

Agreed.


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## TivoZorro

miadlor said:


> Going to change the network settings, but backing out before making any changes, temporally fixes the problem for about 10-15 mins. Transferring is fine once started.
> 
> better than rebooting


Thank you so much. This worked! And it is better than rebooting.


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## bobsoron

A new problem on my end! *My Tivo (540) is ignoring Season Passes.* The episodes it missed aren't even in Recording History, although they're in the Program Guide when I scroll back a few hours. We have a local station here in Chicago that specializes in classic programming; every Sunday morning it runs three "Little Rascals" shorts, 20 minutes apart, between 6 and 7 AM. My S2 recorded the first one but blew off the other two. When I go into the episode descriptions for next week, it claims it will record each of the three, but I'd be an idiot to trust this steaming pile of crap these days. FWIW, there were no conflicts. *The Tivo just failed.*


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## etz

what does it say in the recording history for this morning?

Is each 20 minute short treated as it's own distinct episode in the program guide, or is it more like the Little Rascals hour type of thing?


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## bobsoron

etz said:


> what does it say in the recording history for this morning?





bobsoron said:


> The episodes it missed aren't even in Recording History





etz said:


> Is each 20 minute short treated as it's own distinct episode in the program guide, or is it more like the Little Rascals hour type of thing?


Each is treated as a distinct episode. The Tivo recorded the first of the three and blew off the other two.


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## TiVo_Fanatic

Little problem I've been getting on my S2 DT since 9.1 is video / sound glitches... but ONLY when flipping through the guide with everything still playing in the background. Other than that I've yet to find any "issues" with my unit. Would be ncie to know when a STABLE 9.2 will be coming out.

Edit : My software version is stated as 9.1a-01-2-649


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## rainwater

bobsoron said:


> Each is treated as a distinct episode. The Tivo recorded the first of the three and blew off the other two.


Do you have any season passes setup to keep until you delete? If so, this is a common user error that prevents the TiVo from recording new episodes because there is no room.


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## bobsoron

rainwater said:


> Do you have any season passes setup to keep until you delete? If so, this is a common user error that prevents the TiVo from recording new episodes because there is no room.


Well, I do, but that wasn't the issue; I've had Tivos since April 2000, so I'm not a noob. The "Recently Deleted" folder had eight or nine hours' worth of programs in it at the time, far more than needed for two 20-minute shows. And even if that were the case, I'd expect the Recording History list to have entries for those two episodes explaining why they couldn't be recorded. (For that matter, I'd like to think there's some kind of mechanism to tell the user "This Tivo will record no further programs because the drive is full. Please delete some programs if you want to see anything new" or something like that.)

Similarly, to forestall this question, no, I don't have the SP set to "Keep only 1 episode." But even if I did, I'd expect the Tivo to have recorded all three, keeping only the last, with entries in the Recording History explaining its action.

Anyway, to prevent another occurrence, I've set up a manual recording that puts the entire hour into a single recording. But this shows me another bug: In the Recording Options screen, I've set the Start Recording time to 1 minute early and kept Stop Recording at On-time. But then the Repeating Recording screen tells me "Every Sun at 6:01 am" -- one minute _late_ -- with Duration: 1 hour, not 1:01. I have no idea how to fix this.


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## TivoZorro

I've noticed since the 9.1 update that I have to keep the Recently Deleted Items Folder clean - i.e. no recordings. Because if I don't and let them build up this seems to impact my transfering of recordings. Sometimes transfers will freeze. I don't know why this is so but I can ony surmiss that if I have a lot of recordings in the RDF it puts too much of a tax on the Tivo Hard Drive. They will freeze without recordings there also but it seems like its more so if there are things in the RDF. Made up my mind to keep it clean until the update.


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## richsadams

TivoZorro said:


> I've noticed since the 9.1 update that I have to keep the Recently Deleted Items Folder clean - i.e. no recordings. Because if I don't and let them build up this seems to impact my transfering of recordings. Sometimes transfers will freeze. I don't know why this is so but I can ony surmiss that if I have a lot of recordings in the RDF it puts too much of a tax on the Tivo Hard Drive. They will freeze without recordings there also but it seems like its more so if there are things in the RDF. Made up my mind to keep it clean until the update.


That's very interesting. Early on (last May or so) when some of us were adding eSATA drives via kickstart 62 we ran into a problem of TiVo getting "buggy" when the recently deleted folder became "full". When mine hit about 200 recordings I started to notice it. It seemed that if I permanently deleted them all things went back to normal. It might have just been a coincidence though.

However since TiVo went from v8.x to 9.2a everything seems to be working fine. (I have about 275 recordings in the Recently Deleted folder now.) I always suspected they might have fine-tuned some of the files to handle more data somehow. Wonder if that applies to transfers now?


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## TivoZorro

I had probably 200+ recordings in RDF prior to 9.1 update. Was using it as a FSI. Afterwords I had problems and I manually deleted everything in there. I notice on both my DT and 540 that if I let them build up to say 20 recordings in there the problems become worse than say if it were empty. I have to be really careful about it. Try to delete it every night before bedtime.


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## RoyK

As of today 9.1 has now gone 24 weeks and still its unfixed!


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## TivoZorro

Tivo Desktop 2.6 has fixed a problem I have had since the 9.1 update. As i've posted before, since 9.1 Tivo Desktop 2.5 would not see my 540 Tivo. But now with 2.6 Desktop my laptop can see it and I have transfered a show. I LOVE YOU, I LOVE YOU TIVO! Made my whole day!

Now if we could just get the freezing transfer issue fixed!


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## CuriousMark

Gotta love that xmpp connection.


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## bobsoron

TivoZorro said:


> I've noticed since the 9.1 update that I have to keep the Recently Deleted Items Folder clean - i.e. no recordings. Because if I don't and let them build up this seems to impact my transfering of recordings. Sometimes transfers will freeze. I don't know why this is so but I can ony surmiss that if I have a lot of recordings in the RDF it puts too much of a tax on the Tivo Hard Drive. They will freeze without recordings there also but it seems like its more so if there are things in the RDF. Made up my mind to keep it clean until the update.


Unfortunately, blowing off recordings that are in Season Pass Manager isn't affected by this. I'd love to have something to blame it on, but whatever that might be, your issue isn't it.

And with due respect to the people who enjoy MRV and transferring shows from Tivo to Tivo, I have to hope that fixing that receives lower priority than restoring basic functionality. By all means I hope it's fixed. But right now I can't see the live program guide when I press the Guide button on what was, before 9.1, a still perfectly usable Tivo S1 remote. Basic functionality is all I want.


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## formulaben

RoyK said:


> As of today 9.1 has now gone 24 weeks and still its unfixed!


_*"If you are patient in one moment of anger, you will escape a hundred *_ (and eighty?)* days of sorrow."* 
- Chinese proverb.


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## RoyK

formulaben said:


> _*If you are patient in one moment of anger, you will escape a hundred *_ (and eighty?)* days of sorrow.*
> - Chinese proverb.


I'd be lots more patient if I weren't sending them money every month. Unfortunately they aren't patient when it comes to my paying my bill.......


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## formulaben

Actually, I'm sympathetic to the cause. I know it is frustrating, but unlike my old DVR, I have no doubt that Tivo is aware of this problem and a fix is on the way.


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## TivoZorro

bobsoron said:


> Unfortunately, blowing off recordings that are in Season Pass Manager isn't affected by this. I'd love to have something to blame it on, but whatever that might be, your issue isn't it.
> 
> And with due respect to the people who enjoy MRV and transferring shows from Tivo to Tivo, I have to hope that fixing that receives lower priority than restoring basic functionality. By all means I hope it's fixed. But right now I can't see the live program guide when I press the Guide button on what was, before 9.1, a still perfectly usable Tivo S1 remote. Basic functionality is all I want.


How do you know if your SPM issue isn't affected by having recordings in RDF. Anything that taxes or puts extra stress on a hard drive could affect performance. Neither you or I write the software code and build the hard drives and RAM for the Tivos. So we don't know what is causing our problem. It was just a friendly suggestion that you could try and see if it might help out. I won't be providing anymore suggestions for you in the future. All I know is when I clean out RDF the performance on my Tivos picks up and my transfers don't freeze as often.

Hope Tivo fixes your problem and mine with MRV. No ones problem is more important than another. I will be happy when its all resolved and we can close this thread for good.


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## mtchamp

I noticed this thread title with 9.1 and last night I checked my System Information on my TiVo HD and saw 9.2. Is is new or has 9.2 been out there?. I havn't been keeping track except that I looked because one menu now says "Download TV, Movies and Web Video".


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## greg_burns

mtchamp said:


> I noticed this thread title with 9.1 and last night I checked my System Information on my TiVo HD and saw 9.2. Is is new or has 9.2 been out there?. I havn't been keeping track except that I looked because one menu now says "Download TV, Movies and Web Video".


9.2 has been out for TivoHD/S3. Don't think it is was ever released to the S2s. Might be wrong about that.

TivoStephen mentioned the menu change here. They must be able to do that will other rev'ing the software.

Edit: looks like 9.3 *was *released for the S2s recently...
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=388147


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## RoyK

25 weeks and an update is finally reported to be in test distribution. Will it fix these problems? We'll have to wait and see. Next week will mark half a year.


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## richsadams

RoyK said:


> 25 weeks and an update is finally reported to be in test distribution. Will it fix these problems? We'll have to wait and see. Next week will mark half a year.


At least they're upgrading Series2's before Series3's and TiVo HD's as some of them obviously require more bug fixes. That's something in their favor. Fingers crossed. :up:


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## RoyK

The software on all three of my SD-H400s is still at 9.1.01-2-264 as it has been since the first of last October yet my wife and I each independently has noticed a change in MRV operation on all three boxes within the last week or so.

Prior to this if we navigated into a group of say "Law & Order" recordings on another machine it listed each *episode's* name. Then if we made a transfer and started watching then finished and told it to delete it would take us back to the same group listing (with the episode names) on the machine being transferred from.

Lately, however, instead of taking us back to the group it instead takes us to one higher level (Does not say "Group" at the top of the screen but rather the DVR's name. It lists only the program names *but not the episode names* of *ONLY* the programs that were in the group (e.g. only "Law & Order" and the date on each line). Navigating left once takes us back to the main Now Playing menu.

It sure appears that the software has been changed without a corresponding version number change. Pretty sucky.


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## RoyK

Now 26 weeks since 9.1 was dumped on us. Six months! Half a year of buggy software! Still waiting.......


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## pdhenry

Dude, 9.3 is in release. Give it a rest.

/unsubscribe


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## RoyK

pdhenry said:


> Dude, 9.3 is in release. Give it a rest.
> 
> /unsubscribe


The rest will come when it hits my boxes if it fixes the bugs.

Meanwhile it still has been 26 weeks/half a year and my boxes still have 9.1 with all its bugs.


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## Phantom Gremlin

RoyK said:


> Meanwhile it still has been 26 weeks/half a year and my boxes still have 9.1 with all its bugs.


Not only do those of us with 9.1 still have bugs, but over the course of 26 weeks we have each paid TiVo (an average of) about $60 per box for the "service" they provide. With no easy way to roll back to the previous, better, less buggy service. Aforementioned service cost TiVo a *miniscule* amount for the program guide, which was the only useful part.

We're all paying customers here. We're paying a lot of money while not seeing a lot of improvements. Aside from the "sunk cost" of the boxes we bought, many of us are locked in to multi-year ongoing contracts. We can't even "vote with our feet". That's why RoyK is *entitled* to let everyone know how badly TiVo is responding to these very real bugs.

Aforementioned service is also totally insignificant in cost compared to the hundreds of $$$s in "Subscriber Acquisition Costs" incurred by TiVo to acquire each of us. That's why it's so astonishing to me that media types like Rogers go around making deals for useless frills, while at the same time continuing to neglect the very real problems of their existing customers. Each customer cost TiVo many dollars to acquire. But TiVo management takes us for granted and is instead focused on stupid diversions.

TiVo has survived this long *in spite of their incompetent current management,* not because of it. That's a tribute to how great, relatively speaking, the original product was.


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## jbcheshire

^
|
| I agre with what he said!!!!!!!!


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## CuriousMark

See http://research.tivo.com/93priority/index.htm

It is for Series 2 TiVos only.


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## jbcheshire

Has anyone been able to enter their service number?
I keep getting an error when I try to submit mine to the website...


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## gonzotek

jbcheshire said:


> Has anyone been able to enter their service number?
> I keep getting an error when I try to submit mine to the website...


Looks like they're still setting the priority list up, the error appears to indicate the storage file doesn't exist:


> The ASC File: c:\htdocs\research\93priority.dat could not be found!!!!!


Try again later, or wait for an employee to announce the availability here on the forums.


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## CuriousMark

I guess I found it before it was ready, sorry.


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## RoyK

Figures. Bugs in the bug fix signup.


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## Alcatraz

RoyK said:


> Figures. Bugs in the bug fix signup.


Your definition of a bug is in need of alignment. Figures you'd be the first to pi$$ on even the chance that the new software will become available to you and bring an end to your countdown.


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## RoyK

It seems to be working now.


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## CuriousMark

RoyK said:


> Figures. Bugs in the bug fix signup.


I find something before it is ready, and post about it, and you think it is a bug on TiVo's part? Is your ego really that oversize? Never mind, don't answer, the question is Rhetorical.

This is good news for all of us.


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## RoyK

CuriousMark said:


> I find something before it is ready, and post about it, and you think it is a bug on TiVo's part? Is your ego really that oversize? Never mind, don't answer, the question is Rhetorical.
> 
> This is good news for all of us.


We all hope that this release is more satisfactory.


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## MickeS

Well, the bug with letterboxed 16:9 video on a widescreen TV is NOT fixed in 9.3 at least. I have a Series 2 single tuner (230) model. Disappointing to say the least, as I would like to be able to watch Unbox downloads on my Series 2 too, not only on the Series 3.


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## gonzotek

MickeS said:


> Well, the bug with letterboxed 16:9 video on a widescreen TV is NOT fixed in 9.3 at least. I have a Series 2 single tuner (230) model. Disappointing to say the least, as I would like to be able to watch Unbox downloads on my Series 2 too, not only on the Series 3.


Maybe I'm way off here, but isn't very nearly all the 16:9 content coming from Amazon encoded with letterboxing? Going to 9.3 isn't going to change the content Amazon has already encoded. Not to say you aren't having an issue.


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## MickeS

gonzotek said:


> Maybe I'm way off here, but isn't very nearly all the 16:9 content coming from Amazon encoded with letterboxing? Going to 9.3 isn't going to change the content Amazon has already encoded. Not to say you aren't having an issue.


Yes, you are correct. I got ahead of myself, what I would like for them to do is encode it in 16:9 so I could watch it on my Series 2 (I don't have zoom on the TV). But since they haven't even fixed this bug (I tried it with a real 16:9 video from my PC), that will not happen anytime soon (I'm guessing).


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## miadlor

9.3 mrv still not showing other dvrs.


**update: After all my dvrs received 9.3......it seems to work correctly now.


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