# Future Tivo Release roadmap - buy a Roamio Pro now or wait?



## sirfracas (Apr 5, 2006)

I am thinking about buying a Roamio Pro to replace a Series 3 unit.

Does anyone have any information on the upcoming release schedule or technology change that would warrant waiting for the next hardware upgrade or is it fairly wise to upgrade now?

The Series 3 unit works but I find myself juggling conflicts a lot more.

Thanks in advance for your help.


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

The Roamio line isn't going to see a major update for quite a while. I do think you may see some minor tweaks such as 4k capabilities in a year or two, but not a wholesale update.

The mini is schedule for an update in January, but even that I expect will be pretty minor - probably nothing more than adding an RF remote similar the the base tivo,

I think now is a good time to purchase both.


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

This has been asked several times before, and the consensus is usually that it will most likely be years before TiVo releases a new line of DVRs. The Roamio line just came out last year so it is still relatively new. I would be shocked if TiVo came out with a new DVR within the next 2 years. The Roamio is an excellent DVR, so if you want to upgrade now, it is probably a good time to do it.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

6 tuners is essentially the limit with CableCARD so I don't see a change there. 

They could potentially upgrade storage on each unit as prices continue to slowly come down in hard drives. 

At most we could potentially see a price cut but not sure when. TiVo usually ends up dropping the price by around $100 on each unit after so long, but I forget the timeframe now. This would be done instead of a storage increase.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

Roamio Plus/Pro is for digital cable only, with 6 tuners, 1 cable card slot, Built-in Wireless and MoCa. Its much faster than the predecessors. The Roamio basic (may have been renamed to Roamio OTA) model is similar except with OTA support, 4 tuners and no MoCa.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

ThAbtO said:


> Roamio Plus/Pro is for digital cable only, with 6 tuners, 1 cable card slot, Built-in Wireless and MoCa. Its much faster than the predecessors. The Roamio basic (may have been renamed to Roamio OTA) model is similar except with OTA support, 4 tuners and no MoCa.


The Roamio OTA is a completely separate product. There is still a basic Roamio 4 tuner that does both OTA and digital cable with cablecard.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

innocentfreak said:


> 6 tuners is essentially the limit with CableCARD so I don't see a change there.
> 
> They could potentially upgrade storage on each unit as prices continue to slowly come down in hard drives.
> 
> At most we could potentially see a price cut but not sure when. TiVo usually ends up dropping the price by around $100 on each unit after so long, but I forget the timeframe now. This would be done instead of a storage increase.


My Cisco TA supports 8 tuners, as does a Cisco PKM908 cablecard.

The update for my TA rolled a short while ago (version ending with 2001), while I'm not yet able to get a PKM908 card. No need for it anyway. Just putting it out there that somebody must be planning an 8-tuner product, or planning ahead that somebody is planning on one...

I doubt TiVo is, or the product known as the TiVo Mega wouldn't be restricted to 6 tuners, from where I sit, anyway...


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

nooneuknow said:


> My Cisco TA supports 8 tuners, as does a Cisco PKM908 cablecard.
> 
> The update for my TA rolled a short while ago (version ending with 2001), while I'm not yet able to get a PKM908 card. No need for it anyway. Just putting it out there that somebody must be planning an 8-tuner product, or planning ahead that somebody is planning on one...
> 
> I doubt TiVo is, or the product known as the TiVo Mega wouldn't be restricted to 6 tuners, from where I sit, anyway...


The problem is that getting the 8 tuner CableCards and Tuning adapters from a cable company is going to be really difficult to do. Maybe in 2 or 3 years they will become more common, but right now they aren't. I can't see TiVo making an 8-tuner model for at least 2 more years.


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## Banker257 (Aug 4, 2014)

sirfracas said:


> I am thinking about buying a Roamio Pro to replace a Series 3 unit.
> 
> Does anyone have any information on the upcoming release schedule or technology change that would warrant waiting for the next hardware upgrade or is it fairly wise to upgrade now?
> 
> ...


There isn't much more that they can do to improve on the product offering they provide today in the next 3-4 years.

If you can live with 6 tuners, there is nothing "better" coming up other than maybe a "Cloud" offering, but that will not be an "upgrade" as far as I'm concerned.


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## CT71812229 (Jul 31, 2010)

Anyone seeing Tivo licensing their technology to TV companies? I don't see why people would want to have a separate unit when Tivo can be built into the TV. Everything should be merge to the TV system. TV companies has been less successful at doing this, so Tivo should be able to position themselves into this market. I think both party should benefit from this. Is current OS differences preventing this from happening? Anyone have technical or knowledge on this and see this happening in the near future? Thanks.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

CT71812229 said:


> Anyone seeing Tivo licensing their technology to TV companies? I don't see why people would want to have a separate unit when Tivo can be built into the TV. Everything should be merge to the TV system. TV companies has been less successful at doing this, so Tivo should be able to position themselves into this market. I think both party should benefit from this. Is current OS differences preventing this from happening? Anyone have technical or knowledge on this and see this happening in the near future? Thanks.


A TiVo built into a HDTV, what happens if the TiVo needs repair ? or one wants to upgrade, or something happens to the TV itself. Not many electronics being combined these days, DVD/BD + VCR is the main combo things I see, I don't even see (doesn't mean one can't find one) any more HDTV with built in BD/DVD players, at one time some TVs had a built in VCR. The newer HDTV don't even have built in cable card slots.


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## CT71812229 (Jul 31, 2010)

Any thought on the ability for Tivo to make storage in the cloud like Apple? Would this be practical?


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

CT71812229 said:


> Any thought on the ability for Tivo to make storage in the cloud like Apple? Would this be practical?


There are all sorts of potential legal/copyright issues with that. Not to mention the technical/practical issues of people without the necessary broadband speeds or data caps to make that work.

"The cloud" is greatly overrated.


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## CT71812229 (Jul 31, 2010)

Consumer wants the ability to record or view any OTA content whenever and wherever they want like Netflix. What and who in the future will allow for this?


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

CT71812229 said:


> Consumer wants the ability to record or view any OTA content whenever and wherever they want like Netflix. What and who in the future will allow for this?


Record Netflix? Or stream on demand any possible content at any possible time?

Answer to both questions is never...


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## CT71812229 (Jul 31, 2010)

So the only option is a bigger Tivo storage option like the Tivo Mega if consumer wants to view more OTA content?


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

I am not sure I understand what scenerio you are asking for... Storage isn't really an issue.

More and more content is going to be available via streaming services - but they aren't going to be cheap and not one service is going to provide you everything you want.


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## malba2366 (Aug 19, 2014)

CT71812229 said:


> Any thought on the ability for Tivo to make storage in the cloud like Apple? Would this be practical?


A cloud DVR sounds like a good idea in theory, but is quite poor in reality. I used to have this type of setup from cablevision and the DVR functionality was terrible, it was always lagging, fast forwarding/rewinding video lagged, lots of artifacts on recorded TV, errors that wouldn't allow me to watch recorded tv etc. It would be even worse with a TIVO since tivo has no control over the users internet connection while cablevision is able to prioritize DVR communication over their network.
I don't think there are legal issues with this as long as each user has a separate hard drive sector on Tivos server, and if each user was only streamed things stored on their sector. If they are making one recording of everything and streaming it on demand that would cause copyright issues.


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## astrohip (Jan 7, 2003)

CT71812229 said:


> So the only option is a bigger Tivo storage option like the Tivo Mega if consumer wants to view more OTA content?


Current TiVos can store hundreds of hours of OTA. And with a little DIY, you can up that to a figure even larger. You could record every episode on every major network for weeks if you wanted. And with Stream capability, you can watch it most anywhere, anytime.

So I'm not sure what "view more OTA content" refers to? You've thrown around phrases like "in the cloud", "licensing to TV companies" and more. I get the feeling you're trying to come up with a new business model for TiVo, when most of us are happy with the way it currently works. Sure, you gotta think about the future, but let's not throw out the baby so quickly.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

malba2366 said:


> A cloud DVR sounds like a good idea in theory, but is quite poor in reality. I used to have this type of setup from cablevision and the DVR functionality was terrible, it was always lagging, fast forwarding/rewinding video lagged, lots of artifacts on recorded TV, errors that wouldn't allow me to watch recorded tv etc. It would be even worse with a TIVO since tivo has no control over the users internet connection while cablevision is able to prioritize DVR communication over their network.
> I don't think there are legal issues with this as long as each user has a separate hard drive sector on Tivos server, and if each user was only streamed things stored on their sector. If they are making one recording of everything and streaming it on demand that would cause copyright issues.


Cloud storage seems to work well with Comcast. At least that is what I've ben told from the people at work that have that feature with their X1 boxes.


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

aaronwt said:


> Cloud storage seems to work well with Comcast. At least that is what I've ben told from the people at work that have that feature with their X1 boxes.


I expect cloud DVRs to work a lot like Hulu+

You won't actually record the content, once selected it will be linked to your account and presented with non skippable commercials.

The cloud service may be able to blackout content based on either restrictions or time.

A cloud DVR puts all the control in the hands of the content providers. Some things might improve such as an ability to find content in a more on demand manner - however those selling points will come at a cost.

I do think cloud DVRs are coming and it will be presented as a huge advancement in content access by the MSOs - presented as an end to linear programming, unfortunately, it will also be the end of the flexibility of the local copy... (And skipping commercials - a la Hulu+)


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

tarheelblue32 said:


> The problem is that getting the 8 tuner CableCards and Tuning adapters from a cable company is going to be really difficult to do. Maybe in 2 or 3 years they will become more common, but right now they aren't. I can't see TiVo making an 8-tuner model for at least 2 more years.


Congress just over turned the integration ban, which means that leased equipment is no longer required to use CableCARDs. Which means all investment into new CableCARD technology is likely to halt. At this point CableCARD is going to become the bastard stepchild of the industry until a sucessor comes along to replace it. I don't expect we'll ever see an 8 tuner TiVo using CableCARDs. Maybe some 12 tuner monstrosity using two cards, but even that is doubtful.

I think the most likely hardware refresh we'll see is an update of the Basic unit. They had to cut some corners on that to keep the price down. (either/or OTA/Cable, 100Mbps Ethernet, no MoCa, etc...) I think that once the prices on the parts come down a bit they'll refresh the Basic to bring it more inline with the Plus/Pro feature wise and hopefully adding the ability to record OTA and cable concurrently.


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## pfiagra (Oct 13, 2014)

Dan203 said:


> I think the most likely hardware refresh we'll see is an update of the Basic unit. They had to cut some corners on that to keep the price down. (*either/or OTA/Cable, 100Mbps Ethernet, no MoCa, etc*...) I think that once the prices on the parts come down a bit they'll refresh the Basic to bring it more inline with the Plus/Pro feature wise and hopefully adding the ability to record OTA and cable concurrently.


I would add integrated streaming to that list as well (once TiVo has sufficiently depleted their standalone Stream inventory).


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

pfiagra said:


> I would add integrated streaming to that list as well (once TiVo has sufficiently depleted their standalone Stream inventory).


I don't think any of those upgrades are likely to happen until TiVo comes out with their next generation line of DVRs 2-3 years from now at the earliest, if ever.

But the Stream does appear to be out of stock:

https://www.tivo.com/shop/stream


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## eaadams (Apr 25, 2000)

Buy the romio now. They have a 30day return window, so if something happens at CES you can return and get the new hotness, if not you have the discounted holiday price


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

eaadams said:


> Buy the romio now. They have a 30day return window, so if something happens at CES you can return and get the new hotness, if not you have the discounted holiday price


It looks like the "holiday discounts" are over. The current promotion on TiVo's website seems to be either a $12.50/month service fee or $0 down on refurbs with a $19.99/month service fee.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

$12.50/mo is a price reduction! It was $15/mo. When did they lower the price?


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## CT71812229 (Jul 31, 2010)

Has Tivo ever offer a deal on Life Time Subscription to say and older Tivo like a series 3 without ever having paid a monthly subscription before? How does one get the $99 Life Time? Is this because you have to had already paid monthly for perhaps a few years prior already? I don't think $400 for life time is worth it at this point for a series 3, but shelling out $600-$800 for a new system is pretty hard to swallow as well. Is there a way to get a cheaper life time subscription?


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

I think you'd be hard pressed to find a S3 that didn't either already have lifetime or that qualified for the $99 lifetime offer. At this point I think they're offering $99 lifetime on old units as a way to keep their subscriber numbers up.


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## Pacomartin (Jun 11, 2013)

I think that there is a real possibility that there will be no major upgrades in the DVR's. My reasoning is that the new laws may permit the cable companies to raise the prices of their cableCARDS to $15 a month, which would effectively minimize the retail market for TiVos.

The company TiVo Inc. may have a long life but catering primarily to cable companies. The CableCO probably doesn't want a better product than the Roamio, but they would want them cheaper.

RCN leases the T6 (6 tuner 1 terabyte version of roamio) for $45/month plus $5 for each Roamio. I would imagine that 6 minis is effectively their biggest order (or $75/month).

My guess is that 3 years from now, RCN won't want to lease the Premiers at all, but they will want to offer the Roamio Plus (3 terabyte storage) and offer the current T6's for less money. But they may want new apps. But they are not going to be interested in a radically new model that is much more expensive. Cable companies are not going to be interested in equipment that they have to lease for more than $75 a month. They won't have enough customers.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Pacomartin said:


> I think that there is a real possibility that there will be no major upgrades in the DVR's. My reasoning is that the new laws may permit the cable companies to raise the prices of their cableCARDS to $15 a month, which would effectively minimize the retail market for TiVos.
> ............


 $15!?!?!? Fios already charges $5 for each cable card. I'm sure they will be first in line if they are allowed to charge $15. That would suck.


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## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

Depends on what you pay for a Roamio. IF you can get in on the $500 for a Roamio Plus with lifetime deal for those that have had Tivos for 10 years then do it. 

IF you wait for these new standards to shake out you might be waiting a few years.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

trip1eX said:


> IF you wait for these new standards to shake out you might be waiting a few years.


And then you will asking if you should put off you DVR purchase for the newest standard 8K.


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## rick123 (Dec 9, 2004)

_$500 for a Roamio Plus with lifetime deal for those that have had Tivos for 10 years _

Coincidentally I've just passed that milestone...

Could someone elaborate on how one gets this deal? Do you make a call to customer service or is it somewhere on the website?

Thanks!


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

rick123 said:


> _$500 for a Roamio Plus with lifetime deal for those that have had Tivos for 10 years _
> 
> Coincidentally I've just passed that milestone...
> 
> ...


You just have to call and ask for it. TiVo hasn't advertised it on their website or in any other way that I am aware of. It's one of those word-of-mouth type deals.

There have been a lot of people discussing it over in the Roamio Deals thread lately. Some people have also managed to get TiVo to throw in a free Slide Pro remote along with the 10-year loyalty pricing.


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## rick123 (Dec 9, 2004)

Thanks Tarheel, I'm gonna look into it...


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

rick123 said:


> Thanks Tarheel, I'm gonna look into it...


Although I thought they had indicated the deal was going to end January 6th. Report back if you manage to get it!

Scott


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