# Download failing after 45 mins - is this a 2.5.5a push?



## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

I have given my old TiVo to my next door neighbour, and before giving it to him I got an HDD upgrade for it.

He's having problems with daily calls. The one in guided setup worked fine, but ones thereafter are failing with "Call interrupted". The pattern seems to be that the first attempt to download after a reboot takes about 45 mins and then fails, and subsequent ones (before another reboot) fail after a few seconds - all saying "Call interrupted".

It occurred to me today that the telly I had this connected to was a Toshiba, and I was running v2.5.5a. The upgrade disc is running v2.5.5. So, is the TiVo server trying to push another download of v2.5.5a at the TiVo, causing huge downloads that are failing on a slightly ropey telephone line? (Line is pure BT - no TalkTalk or similar).

If this is the case, are there magic words to use with TiVo CS to get them to turn off the v2.5.5a push? I called them today, but the person who answered the phone, while very friendly and polite, was keen on working through her script, and wasn't really understanding the problem I was describing. When I asked her to turn off the v2.5.5a push, she said that couldn't be done.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Urgh. TiVo CS second-line have just called back and said that they will email the US, but in the past there has been no way of turning off the 2.5.5a push.

Any ideas?


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

We've now tried doing this on my own phone line as well, where presumably it worked at some point in the past to get 2.5.5a download - no joy.

Every time (after a reboot) it fails at 45 mins. Anyone know if TiVo have set a download limit of 45 mins on their side, to drop the call after that time?


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Anyone got any ideas for how to solve this?
Is the only route to get another HDD with 2.5.5a on it?


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## AMc (Mar 22, 2002)

BlackPrince said:


> I have given my old TiVo to my next door neighbour, and before giving it to him I got an HDD upgrade for it.


What happened to the original drive? If you still have it it would be (reasonably) simple to make a backup of that image and copy it to the new drive.
http://www.steveconrad.co.uk/tivo/index.html

If not you could try the image begging thread, but last time I checked there wasn't a 2.5.5a image.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Thanks. If I need a new drive, I'll just go to TivoHeaven, I think - I no longer find it fun (or have the time!) to take the DIY approach.

My neighbour now has an (albeit small) investment - thumbs, season passes, existing recordings, so I was hoping to find a solution that preserves that, and doesn't require another session of uncabling everything and swapoping over disks, etc.

Is there a way of forcing the download connection to continue beyond the 45 minute boundary? Or, better, a way of convincing TiVo not to push out a download of 2.5.5a?


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## daveh (Sep 3, 2001)

This thread might be worth a read although I don't know whether it will resolve your problem.
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=248502&highlight=255a


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Cheers - I'd not found that thread.
Unfortunately, it's about doing the inverse of what i want to. That thread's about getting 2.5.5a onto the TiVO HDD without requesting a push of 2.5.5a from server-side.
My TiVo is flagged as needing 2.5.5a even though it doesn't need it, so it is having that change pushed to it in the daily call. I need to find a way of turning that push off, or of extending the permitted download time so that the download can complete.


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## Trinitron (Jan 20, 2003)

Well, one way of stopping the download is to have 2.5.5a already there! AFAIK, it doesn't do any particular harm - it's having 2.5.5 with certain TVs that's the problem. (But it's been a long time since the discussions, so I am not claiming 100&#37; infallibility).


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Which is where we came in, I think - is my only way of stopping the download to get a disk with 2.5.5a on it?
It seems absurd to me that TiVo can't turn off the push. Also, I am convinced that something, somewhere is limiting the length of download to 45 mins, so it's guaranteed to fail.

To summarise, then, I want to find out ..
1) Is this problem caused by a push of 2.5.5a, in combination with a limiting of the download session to 45 mins?
2) If it is, is there a way around it that doesn't require me to dick with the disk (which realistically means me buying another disk from TivoHeaven as I really have no interest in doing anything more difficult than swapping the disks over).


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## TCM2007 (Dec 25, 2006)

If you connect a disk with 2.5.5 to an account which is tagged 2.5.5a it will force the download - this is unavoidable.

If the disk you added is a large one, the download will, if it succeeds, break the formatting of the disk as the downloaded software will not have the hacks installed that let it read a large disk.

It is I think possible to hack rc.sysinit to report that it has 2.5.5a already, but I couldn't tell you how to do that.

By far the easiest option would be to re-image the disk with 2.5.5a.


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## AMc (Mar 22, 2002)

If you're current disk was recently purchased from one of the three upgraders who post here www.tivoheaven.co.uk, www.tivoland.com or www.tivocentral.co.uk then I would get in touch and see if you can have the existing disk reimaged with 2.5.5a - or at least upgraded in a networked machine then copykern'ed for the large disk size.
That would just require you to pull the drive (from the non working Tivo) send it off and wait.
I would hope that would cost little more than postage if the drive was new, but obviously businesses have the right to charge what they feel is appropriate for time and effort.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Thanks, Stuart. What an utter pain in the arse. The easiest solution would be for the TiVo support folks to turn off the push of 2.5.5a.
Ah, well - that's another handful of cash going to Steve 

Edit: Apologies - my post overlapped with AMc's. Yes, I'll have a word with Steve at TivoHeaven and see if he's willing to do that, and also see if my neighbour is willing to be without his existing recordings.

A further thought, though - are we absolutely certain that patch to the existing HDD will stop 2.5.5a being pushed? Does anyone know exactly what it is that triggers the download - precisely what it is that tells something somewhere that 2.5.5a needs to be pushed to this machine?


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## TCM2007 (Dec 25, 2006)

It's part of the daily call procedure, TiVo sends information to HQ as part of the handshaking.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Yes, I understand that. Do we understand enough WHAT information it sends to know with some certainty how to stop it? In particular, do we know that whatever is done to patch my existing disk from 2.5.5 to 2.5.5a when I send I send it back to Steve will stop the forced download?

And do we understand why the download can't be stopped? My simple model is that someone has set a flag on the account to say that it needs 2.5.5a. Do we know why that can' be cleared?


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## TCM2007 (Dec 25, 2006)

We've got no-idea how TiVo's servers work, but it's not too surprising that an upgrade (which is how it would see it) would be one way.

My guess is that doping the tivoapp patch (if that's what you're referring to) wouldn't stop it. 

Do a search on ************ dot com for "upgradesoftware=false"


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## TCM2007 (Dec 25, 2006)

deal database (all one word) dot com


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## TCM2007 (Dec 25, 2006)

Alternatively, edit rc.sysinit and comment out this bit:


```
#if [ "$upgradesoftware" = false ]; then
#  echo "Not upgrading software"
#else
# TODO... Find another way to do this...
#tivosh /etc/rc.d/finishInstall.tcl
#export -n EMERGENCY_REINSTALL
#fi
```
by adding those #s.

This won't stop a download but should stop the install.


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## AMc (Mar 22, 2002)

BlackPrince said:


> Yes, I understand that. Do we understand enough WHAT information it sends to know with some certainty how to stop it? In particular, do we know that whatever is done to patch my existing disk from 2.5.5 to 2.5.5a when I send I send it back to Steve will stop the forced download?
> 
> And do we understand why the download can't be stopped? My simple model is that someone has set a flag on the account to say that it needs 2.5.5a. Do we know why that can' be cleared?


Tivo checks the OS is up to date when it dials in. It compares the current installed version with what Tivo's servers believe is the latest version for that machine and sends the software if they don't match.

If the Tivo OS is patched so that it believes it still has the 2.5.5 software but includes the teletext fix for a then your Tivo will continue to try and download the update, install it then ruin your large drive.
If the OS is upgraded to 2.5.5a by your supplier then when it dials in Tivo's servers will be happy it's software is up to date and won't send the software again.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Thanks, both.
How would I go about editing rc.sysinit? The TiVo's not networked - are there other ways of connecting to it?


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## TCM2007 (Dec 25, 2006)

If it's not networked you'll need to pull the disk and attach it to a PC - so you may as well just install 2.5.5a!


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Gawd, what a pain the backside this stuff is. My neighbour is pissing himself laughing at the complexity of it, and wondering why he didn't just get Sky+.


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## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

BlackPrince said:


> Gawd, what a pain the backside this stuff is. My neighbour is pissing himself laughing at the complexity of it, and wondering why he didn't just get Sky+.


There is no complexity at all, the golden rule was broken, you ordered a new upgrade disk and had it supplied with a mis-matched operating system.

Tivo's systems are merely trying to maintain the system as intended and put the right O/S on the drive.

I would double check his phone line is definitely still being billed by BT too because a standard BT phone line will download any size update from Tivo, whether its a full EPG (when a unit has no up-to-date data) or an O/S update!

BT is one of the few telco services left in the UK that does still support fax/modem devices properly still (unlike the crappy compression kit applied by companies like talk talk etc).

After all is said and done, even if you get the update down over the phone line, you will end up with a borked system anyway because the 2.5.5a update from Tivo will replace the upgraded kernel (that your tivo disk supplier put on) with the original kernel. This will coincidentally cause dial-up issues too where-by only the first call after a reboot will work and all other calls will fail because of the mis-matched kernel and broken swap.

If you purchased the upgrade drive from me or Steve recently, have you tried the instructions to apply the 2.5.5a upgrade via the boot-up process?


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

healeydave said:


> Tivo's systems are merely trying to maintain the system as intended and put the right O/S on the drive.


Or, in this case, the *wrong* OS, as it's not needed, and being there will break everything, IIUC.



> I would double check his phone line is definitely still being billed by BT too because a standard BT phone line will download any size update from Tivo, whether its a full EPG (when a unit has no up-to-date data) or an O/S update!


It is. As is mine, where we also tried it. We tried it several times in both places, and it reliably hung up after 45 mins if fresh from boot, and after a few seconds otherwise.



> If you purchased the upgrade drive from me or Steve recently, have you tried the instructions to apply the 2.5.5a upgrade via the boot-up process?


From Steve. I've not got back in touch with him yet. What are these instructions?


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## daveh (Sep 3, 2001)

A brief browse of the Tivoheaven website gives this information.
_Update 23/12/2005: Previously, if you purchased a drive > 120GB with the LBA48 kernel installed and then subsequently purchased a TV that required you to request the 2.5.5a download, you would have needed to put the TiVo drive in your PC and re-install the LBA48 kernel using the CD supplied with the drive. However, as we appreciate this was an annoyance, we are now shipping all our version 2.5.5 drives with a new feature whereby you can 'upgrade' to version 2.5.5a yourself with no download from TiVo, by entering a special sequence of commands via the remote - and with no need to remove the drive from your TiVo!_

Is this a case of reading the documentation that came with the hard drive?


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Excellent - thanks. Got to be worth trying that before buying a new drive. Now, I wonder where those papers are - probably with my neighbour somewhere. The first drive we got had a hardware fault, so we got returned it and got a replacement, which didn't have any paperwork with it. That was a gapy of several weeks - plenty of time for stuff to go missing 
I'm sure Steve will tell me if I email him, though.

Thanks again - first good news in this saga!


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

healeydave said:


> If you purchased the upgrade drive from me or Steve recently, have you tried the instructions to apply the 2.5.5a upgrade via the boot-up process?


I've now followed these instructions, but the TiVo fails to reboot after I enter the 56 code for the 2.5.5a selection. It shuts down (although the green power light stays on), but fails to reboot.
I note that it gives the same symptom from the System menu - it shuts down, with no signal to the TV (but with a green power light), and doesn't restart. The only way to reboot is to pull the power.


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## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

This is what should happen:

You power the tivo off (cold start).

Plug Power in and immediately hold the pause button on the remote.

Wait for both LED's to come on and stay on after releasing the pause button.

Then key in the digits 5 then 6 in a timely manner.

The tivo should continue to boot.

After several seconds, you should get a banner saying installing 2.5.5a

After several more seconds, the Tivo should reboot itself and continue to boot as normal.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Yes, I understand that's what should happen.
What actually happens on this TiVo is that it gets as far as the banner saying it's installing 2.5.5a, shuts itself down and doesn't restart. Pulling the power at that point is the only way to force a reboot, and then it comes up as 2.5.5 vanilla.


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## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

Not sure, I would contact Steve, I think he has a phone number on the website.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

healeydave said:


> Not sure, I would contact Steve, I think he has a phone number on the website.


I agree, Dave. 
Thanks to all for your help, though.


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## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

I have just called Tivo to see if they are having any issues with the service, because I am having a similar problem. 

ok, I have been advised a bug has been filed and a Server change has been submitted at Tivo Inc.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Hmm ... did you get any info from CS?


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## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

I logged the problem with the UK and USA.

They said they would look into it.

Still waiting, I am periodically forcing a daily call to see if they have fixed it, but its still failing at the time of posting.


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## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

I have tested and monitored this myself, the following files are downloaded in parts:


```
909 -rw-r--r--   1 0        0          924925 Apr 10 10:50 GZbin-2.5.5a-01-1.cpio.gz
  21 -rw-r--r--   1 0        0           20162 Apr 10 10:50 GZetc-2.5.5a-01-1.cpio.gz
 569 -rw-r--r--   1 0        0          577935 Apr 10 10:50 GZkernel-2.5.5a-01-1.cpio.gz
 520 -rw-r--r--   1 0        0          528844 Apr 10 10:51 GZlib-2.5.5a-01-1.cpio.gz
 140 -rw-r--r--   1 0        0          141850 Apr 10 10:51 GZprom-2.5.5a-01-1.cpio.gz
 480 -rw-r--r--   1 0        0          487615 Apr 10 10:51 GZsbin-2.5.5a-01-1.cpio.gz
3598 -rw-r--r--   1 0        0         3668775 Apr 10 10:53 GZtvbin-2.5.5a-01-1.cpio.gz
 249 -rw-r--r--   1 0        0          253767 Apr 10 10:53 GZtvlib-2.5.5a-01-1.cpio.gz
1393 -rw-r--r--   1 0        0         1418966 Apr 10 10:49 swsystem-522302-51.slice.gz
  37 -rw-r--r--   1 0        0           36194 Apr 10 10:53 utils-2.5.5a-01-1.cpio.gz
```
The call drops when the next file is added to the equation:


```
0 -rw-r--r--   1 0        0               0 Apr 10 10:53 loopset-387715-10.slice
```
I suspect the bug filed and the server change request means they have already established the issue but I have passed this on to Tivo Inc anyway.

As downloads for 2.5.5a are hardly ever requested any more, its probably been broken for some time, but all the same, Tivo should be able to rectify this hopefully with this data.

In the mean-time, the only way to get past this is to manually upgrade to 2.5.5a.

There are two methods, one is to copy the modified "pxmpegdecode.o" and "build-version" files and change the SwSystem name in the database or the second option is to simply restore a 2.5.5a TiVo image to the disk.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Cheers, Dave.


> In the mean-time, the only way to get past this is to manually upgrade to 2.5.5a.


Do we know why it's not possible for them to remove the "2.5.5a flag" from an account?


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## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

I don't know about how the UK call center system is set-up, but I can only imagine there was a short-sighted snap config implemented so they can request a 2.5.5a update but perhaps no way of un-requesting it.


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## mikerr (Jun 2, 2005)

Is teletext still broadcast at all (on vbi) ? VM Cable used to put out 888 subtitles, but no longer.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Misthreaded?


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## mikerr (Jun 2, 2005)

Not really - the sole purpose of the 2.5.5a update is just to turn off teletext,
as some TV's can't handle TiVo's teletext output.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

The problem in this thread, though, is how to avoid getting the 2.5.5a download when it isn't needed.


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## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

@BlackPrince
Did Tivo resolve the download issue?

The customer box I had (that needed 2.5.5a on) had to go back and I don't have a 2.5.5a unit around at the moment, so stopped monitoring it.


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## BlackPrince (May 16, 2009)

Hi, Dave.
The neighbour I gave my TiVo to is away at the moment, but the daily calls still weren't working a week ago.
I am resigned to having to buy a new disk with 2.5.5a on it to fix this.


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## mikerr (Jun 2, 2005)

Long winded fix:

Re-run guided setup, as that gets guide data without checking version number or downloading the 255a update.

That will get you guide data in the short term, but obviously takes an hour or two of your time to do, and would need re-doing every other week until you get 255a.


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