# 2 bolts, one monthly fee?



## RooiValk (Jan 10, 2016)

I bought a bolt from Best Buy last week, and could not be happier to go back to a Tivo. So far the Bolt has been terrific.

I contemplated getting a mini as well, but I just don't wants to hassle with setting up a Moca network because non of the receivers would be near a wired connection. So here's my question ...

Can I just buy a 2nd Bolt and use it on the other TV, without having to pay another monthly fee?


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

No, can't use Bolt without a fee. Moca is no hassle with Bolt and Mini. Couldn't be simpler.


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## GoodSpike (Dec 17, 2001)

RooiValk said:


> Can I just buy a 2nd Bolt and use it on the other TV, without having to pay another monthly fee?


The answer is no, but think about it. Net of the included service fee the Bolt only costs about $150. I doubt Tivo makes money selling the Bolt hardware. And yes, you arguably wouldn't be using that other $150 of service, but Tivo's costs don't go down just because you're not using the service.


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## jth tv (Nov 15, 2014)

They don't go up either....


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## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

jth tv said:


> They don't go up either....


Incrementally they do. When you add users who connect daily for data you need capacity for that. Also you need support staff as well as any accounting involved.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

RooiValk said:


> I bought a bolt from Best Buy last week, and could not be happier to go back to a Tivo. So far the Bolt has been terrific.
> 
> I contemplated getting a mini as well, but I just don't wants to hassle with setting up a Moca network because non of the receivers would be near a wired connection. So here's my question ...
> 
> Can I just buy a 2nd Bolt and use it on the other TV, without having to pay another monthly fee?


If you bought your Bolt last week you are not paying any fee for about a year, and you will not pay any fee on any new Bolt for another year, but after the year is up you will be paying fees on each Bolt you have. (unless you get the TiVo All-in service on your Bolt)


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## JTHOJNICKI (Nov 30, 2015)

I bought my Bolt and a Mini this weekend. I just plugged both into my gigabit home (Ethernet) network, registered the devices on TIVO.com and they work great. No need for MOCA. I did have MOCA for my Dish Network Hoppers & Joeys. It was slow.


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## jth tv (Nov 15, 2014)

TonyD79 said:


> Incrementally they do. When you add users who connect daily for data you need capacity for that. Also you need support staff as well as any accounting involved.


Alright, on the margin +/- one user, they would go as much up as they go down. Which is pennies, unless the pay per user for channel listings, which I suppose could be a lot, but I think I've read is not.


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## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

jth tv said:


> Alright, on the margin +/- one user, they would go as much up as they go down. Which is pennies, unless the pay per user for channel listings, which I suppose could be a lot, but I think I've read is not.


I said it was incremental. And it is small but it does go up.

The fact is, though, that costs have nothing to do with market pricing. It has to do with how much people are willing to pay and how much the supplier wants.

Tivo's product is their service. They want money for it. They set a price they figure people will pay. You decide if you want to.

Guess where this also plays out? Microsoft. Or any other easily reproduced software.


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## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

RooiValk said:


> I bought a bolt from Best Buy last week, and could not be happier to go back to a Tivo. So far the Bolt has been terrific.
> 
> I contemplated getting a mini as well, but I just don't wants to hassle with setting up a Moca network because non of the receivers would be near a wired connection. So here's my question ...
> 
> Can I just buy a 2nd Bolt and use it on the other TV, without having to pay another monthly fee?





mdavej said:


> No, can't use Bolt without a fee. Moca is no hassle with Bolt and Mini. Couldn't be simpler.


While the Bolt (or any TiVo) must have service to be usable. You can just buy another Bolt and use it for a year without paying another monthly fee 

P.S.: You don't have to pay a monthly fee on the first one for a year either


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## RooiValk (Jan 10, 2016)

Thanks all for the replies. The reason I wanted another Bolt was the exact reason you stated - it seems crazy to pay the price for a mini when a Bolt doesnt cost much more . I guess I'll have to get a mini and setup a Moca by running cat5 to my TV.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

RooiValk said:


> Thanks all for the replies. The reason I wanted another Bolt was the exact reason you stated - it seems crazy to pay the price for a mini when a Bolt doesnt cost much more . I guess I'll have to get a mini and setup a Moca by running cat5 to my TV.


And with a 2nd Bolt you will need to pay for a 2nd cable card also, not so with a Mini.


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

RooiValk said:


> Thanks all for the replies. The reason I wanted another Bolt was the exact reason you stated - it seems crazy to pay the price for a mini when a Bolt doesnt cost much more . I guess I'll have to get a mini and setup a Moca by running cat5 to my TV.


I get all my Minis from Woot for $69, substantially less that a Bolt.


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## jcthorne (Jan 28, 2002)

RooiValk said:


> Thanks all for the replies. The reason I wanted another Bolt was the exact reason you stated - it seems crazy to pay the price for a mini when a Bolt doesnt cost much more . I guess I'll have to get a mini and setup a Moca by running cat5 to my TV.


The whole reason to use MOCA is so you DO NOT have to run cat5 to them. If you already have coax CATV connections, you are good to go. Nothing to set up, just connect them.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

RooiValk said:


> I bought a bolt from Best Buy last week, and could not be happier to go back to a Tivo. So far the Bolt has been terrific.
> 
> I contemplated getting a mini as well, but I just don't wants to hassle with setting up a Moca network because non of the receivers would be near a wired connection. So here's my question ...
> 
> Can I just buy a 2nd Bolt and use it on the other TV, without having to pay another monthly fee?


Well technically you can use it on the other TV. But You will have no guide data and only have four tuners with the 30 minute buffers.

I still have my two eBay scam Bolts. There is no service on them. But they each can still view the channels from OTA or cable. But only live TV with 30 minute buffers.


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## GoodSpike (Dec 17, 2001)

TonyD79 said:


> The fact is, though, that costs have nothing to do with market pricing. It has to do with how much people are willing to pay and how much the supplier wants.


That is very true. There was a recent network news show where they were basically complaining that airfares had not dropped, despite the drop in fuel prices. The show even mentioned how full the planes are with passengers, but for some reason the news people thought that the price should drop because expenses drop.

But cost is not totally irrelevant. Over the long run the price has to be more than the costs or the item will not be produced, or continue to be produced.

And that gets back to my point on the Bolt. Tivo sells the Bolt for basically about $150 plus the price of one year of service. It's the service where they make the money, and they sell the device hoping to sell additional months/years of service in the future. They aren't going to sell the device without the chance of selling the service going forward.

I would also note that any difference scheme would have to deal somehow with cheating--two people who know each other trying to share service. This system avoids that entirely.


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## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

An analogy is razor blades. You can get a razor cheap so you buy the blades. The real product is the blades. Same with TiVo. The real product is the service. The box is an enabler and priced to bring you in.


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## RooiValk (Jan 10, 2016)

jcthorne said:


> The whole reason to use MOCA is so you DO NOT have to run cat5 to them. If you already have coax CATV connections, you are good to go. Nothing to set up, just connect them.


As I understand it, the bolt *must* have a wired connection in order for the Moca to work. Wireless is fine until you need to stream to a mini, and then you need wired. Is this not correct?


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

RooiValk said:


> As I understand it, the bolt *must* have a wired connection in order for the Moca to work. Wireless is fine until you need to stream to a mini, and then you need wired. Is this not correct?


Yes, or a MoCA connection, but used as a bridge (for MoCA) you do need a RJ45 direct connection.


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

If you have FIOS you already have Moca on the line.

- If you want to use the Bolt as a Moca bridge you will need a CAT5 to the bolt. 
- If you want to setup a Moca bridge remote of your TiVo, you will just need a location with both cat5 and coax and use a Moca bridge device - such as an old actiontec router or this.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

RooiValk said:


> As I understand it, the bolt *must* have a wired connection in order for the Moca to work. Wireless is fine until you need to stream to a mini, and then you need wired. Is this not correct?


Depends. I've definitely been able to stream from my ROamio to my Bolt and Mini. I take the Roamio back and forth to my GFs house. And use the WiFi connection while at her place. WHen I bring it back home, sometimes I will forget to re-connect the Ethernet cable. Yet I've seen where I'm still able to stream to my Minis and Bolts while the ROamio had no wired Ethernet connection.


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## Mikeyis4dcats (Oct 2, 2003)

aaronwt said:


> Well technically you can use it on the other TV. But You will have no guide data and only have four tuners with the 30 minute buffers.
> 
> I still have my two eBay scam Bolts. There is no service on them. But they each can still view the channels from OTA or cable. But only live TV with 30 minute buffers.


want to sell a Bolt cable card bracket?


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