# TiVoCast now part of TiVo Central Online!



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Hi folks,

Last night we rolled out a new version of TiVo Central Online (http://www.tivo.com/tco/) that includes the ability to sign up for TiVoCast programs and manage your subscription online.

Right now we have entries for CNet, iVillage, and Heavy. In the future we will be adding additional content choices. (For now, NYT is managed via Showcase, and Rocketboom is managed via http://www.tivo.com/rocketboom/ but eventually those two will move to TCO as well.)

Please let me know if you have any feedback! Enjoy.

Best regards,
Stephen


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

Cool. You can finally manage how many episodes to keep. I'm been wanting this since the beginning 

Although, it would be nice to have an option to keep all episodes on the TCO page but thats not a big deal.


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Unfortunately there are a number of reasons why we are not offering "keep all episodes" -- the maximum for any of the series is 10.

Once you hit 10 episodes, you won't download any more until one or more are deleted from Now Playing.

Best,
S.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

TiVoStephen said:


> Once you hit 10 episodes, you won't download any more until one or more are deleted from Now Playing.
> 
> Best,
> S.


Hmm, I'm not sure I understand. You mean these episodes are KUID? Why do they not work like any other season passes and delete old episodes when you are at the max?


----------



## dkroboth (Jan 25, 2002)

From the TiVo Cast FAQ said:


> Where can I find TiVoCast programs and shows?
> You can request a download or schedule a Season Pass recording to a particular TiVoCast program on TiVo Central Online (www.tivo.com/tco), or on your TiVo DVR go to TiVo Central -> Find Programs -> TiVoCast to see a list of available programming.


Is TiVo DVR part of this turned on now too?


----------



## s2kdave (Jan 28, 2005)

TiVoStephen,
Is there an API for us developers that want to TiVoCast our own content to our TiVos? And documentation or links would be appreciated.

Thanks,
David


----------



## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

Is there a way to cancel these things? We have an iVillage thing downloaded repeatedly, and cannot find any place to cancel the subscription.


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Hi David,

We're not opening up those APIs for the general community at this time, but if you have a proposal for TiVo, you can fill out this form:

http://www.tivo.com/5.13.asp?messageType=videoblog

Best regards,
Stephen


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Hi bicker,

You should be able to cancel the Season Pass from the To Do list of your DVR.

Let me know if you have trouble.

Best regards,
Stephen

EDIT: I gave the wrong answer before.


----------



## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

Thanks for the progress TiVoStephen. Glad I can manage them all from one place. This should set TiVoCast up nicely for an influx of new content now  :up:


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

TiVoStephen said:


> Hi bicker,
> 
> You should be able to click on "Manage Guides" in the left hand side, and see your subscription. Let me know if you have trouble.


Nothing major but I added the CNet tivocast and the manage page calls it "Current ("CNet")" which just looks weird. Also, the channel image url points to the wrong location so beside the name I just see the text "virtual Channel image". I'm guessing its because of the following html code is missing the source:


```
<img alt="virtual Channel image"  src="" width="142" height="37">
```


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Thanks rainwater, we're aware of this issue and are working to correct it.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

Another bug (in FireFox), if you do "Edit Recording Options", the page information is way over to the right side of the page header instead of below it.

Also, the "Keep Until" line says its "fifo". I'm guessing the end user isn't suppose to see it displayed like that.

Another question I have is why you don't see these recording options when you create the TiVoCast initially.


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

ZeoTiVo said:


> Thanks for the progress TiVoStephen. Glad I can manage them all from one place. This should set TiVoCast up nicely for an influx of new content now  :up:


Thanks Zeo. As for new content, stay tuned!


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Rainwater, the shifting issue is being addressed, but I can't reproduce the Keep Until line saying "fifo" -- is this for a single recording or a Season Pass?


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

I hate to keep bugging you but another bug 

Manage Guides allows you to change "Other recording options". Probably best this isn't an option since you shouldn't be allowed to pad downloaded content since that doesn't even make technical sense.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

TiVoStephen said:


> Rainwater, the shifting issue is being addressed, but I can't reproduce the Keep Until line saying "fifo" -- is this for a single recording or a Season Pass?


Go to Manage Guides, click Edit Recording Options on the CNet guide, then under Other Recording Options you see "Keep Until: fifo".


----------



## alansplace (Apr 30, 2006)

TiVoStephen said:


> Unfortunately there are a number of reasons why we are not offering "keep all episodes" -- the maximum for any of the series is 10.
> 
> Once you hit 10 episodes, you won't download any more until one or more are deleted from Now Playing.
> 
> ...





rainwater said:


> Hmm, I'm not sure I understand. You mean these episodes are KUID? Why do they not work like any other season passes and delete old episodes when you are at the max?


ditto  
--
Alan


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Hi folks,

Looks like we made a mistake -- the "Manage Guides" section is not supposed to list TiVoCast subscriptions. Instead, you will manage that on the DVR under the To Do list.

We will be updating TCO in the near future to change the behavior of the "Manage Guides" section.

Best regards,
Stephen


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

dkroboth said:


> Is TiVo DVR part of this turned on now too?


That's not available yet -- stay tuned. We will modify the FAQ shortly.


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

rainwater said:


> Hmm, I'm not sure I understand. You mean these episodes are KUID? Why do they not work like any other season passes and delete old episodes when you are at the max?


Correct, it's like KUID.

Basically there are a few reasons why it behaves this way, and part of it has to do with how we negotiate content deals with our partners. Because it costs money to download episodes, the feeling between TiVo and our partners was that we did not want to automatically delete an episode that was sent to your box without giving you a chance to either watch it or delete it.

After a long discussion between the user interface teams, and the TiVoCast teams, the decision was to have TiVoCast act like Season Passes with an episode limit and "Keep Until I Delete" switched on.

Hope that makes sense!

Best regards,
Stephen


----------



## s2kdave (Jan 28, 2005)

*Denied!!* I just tried to schedule a TiVoCast from TCO and it said it doesn't work with Series3. Any ETA on when it will? It seems like more and more features are popping up that aren't enabled on S3s. Kind of a bummer seeing as how it costs as much as it does.

David


----------



## alansplace (Apr 30, 2006)

TiVoStephen said:


> Correct, it's like KUID.
> 
> Basically there are a few reasons why it behaves this way, and part of it has to do with how we negotiate content deals with our partners. Because it costs money to download episodes, the feeling between TiVo and our partners was that we did not want to automatically delete an episode that was sent to your box without giving you a chance to either watch it or delete it.
> 
> ...


  no, not to me, but then it makes no sense to me either, that i can't view a 2 minute rocketboom episode on one of my other two TiVos sitting side by side with the one with the episode (please, anyone, don't ask why i'd want to do this - that isn't the point here).
--
Alan


----------



## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

When will this be integrated into Find Programs with TiVoCast as a virtual channel(s)?

Congrats on the TCO update.


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

s2kdave said:


> *Denied!!* I just tried to schedule a TiVoCast from TCO and it said it doesn't work with Series3. Any ETA on when it will? It seems like more and more features are popping up that aren't enabled on S3s. Kind of a bummer seeing as how it costs as much as it does.
> 
> David


Sorry David. As you may be aware, Series3 is currently a bit behind on the latest software version compared to Series2.

The TiVoCast feature does require the latest version to work. As we previously have disclosed, we are working on a new release for Series3 that will include KidZone and other features that are currently missing. We expect TiVoCast to work at that time.

In the meantime, my apologies and I fully understand and share your frustration.

Ultimately, our thinking was that people would prefer to have dual-tuner High Definition recording on a Series3 sooner rather than later, even if it meant that some features would not be available until a bit after launch.

Best regards,
Stephen


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

alansplace said:


> no, not to me, but then it makes no sense to me either, that i can't view a 2 minute rocketboom episode on one of my other two TiVos sitting side by side with the one with the episode (please, anyone, don't ask why i'd want to do this - that isn't the point here).
> --
> Alan


Sorry Alan. All I can say is that most of this has to do with our contractual relations with the content providers.


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

HDTiVo said:


> When will this be integrated into Find Programs with TiVoCast as a virtual channel(s)?
> 
> Congrats on the TCO update.


Thanks HDTiVo.

I can't give you a date, but I will say we are working on releasing this as quickly as we can. We won't get to exactly what you describe in the near future, but you will see a capability similar to that not too long from now, and my hope is that you will be pleased by the new functionality. In the long-term, we definitely want to offer the feature you describe.

Best regards,
Stephen


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

Wow. This is worse than before then. I would rather have the old method to subscribe. I often travel and if I can't come back and view the recent episodes of one of the TiVoCasts because it will not download new ones, then whats the point? 

I'm afraid this system is much worse than the old system. I can't imagine what kind of contracts you have with your partners that requires a stupid system that forces you to manually delete shows before you receive a new one.

Plus, can you imagine the support requests you are going to get when John Doe can't figure out why new episodes of Rocketboom are not being downloaded?


----------



## alansplace (Apr 30, 2006)

TiVoStephen said:


> Sorry Alan. All I can say is that most of this has to do with our contractual relations with the content providers.


i understand, i just saw a chance to rant a little bit and took it.
--
Alan


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

rainwater, sorry you feel that way. Remember, TiVo and our partners PAY for the bandwidth, and it's not cheap. The feeling of both TiVo and our partners is that we only want to download shows to you if you're watching them.

As for the vacation situation, remember most of these TiVoCast subscriptions are for weekly content, and you can set up a maximum of 10 shows. How often are you going to be away from your box for more than ten weeks?

As for the support requests, I think that's a valid point, and I believe we're planning on sending a message about this functionality.

Thanks for your feedback, it means a lot to us. I'm sorry you're disappointed, but for a free service we're offering you that costs us money to deliver, we had to put in certain limits.

Best regards,
Stephen


----------



## s2kdave (Jan 28, 2005)

TiVoStephen said:


> In the meantime, my apologies and I fully understand and share your frustration.
> 
> Ultimately, our thinking was that people would prefer to have dual-tuner High Definition recording on a Series3 sooner rather than later, even if it meant that some features would not be available until a bit after launch.


Hi Stephen,
Thanks for the clarification. Yeah, I understand thinking that and the S3 does have some new fun stuff. I just wish that there was some sort of schedule or at least communication to the public on when the gap between S2 and S3 will be closed. I know everyone wants to know. It would probably make waiting for the features much easier. Maybe you can nudge someone in the public relations department  to convey when S3 will move to the same version of the software as S2. I know that there will probably still be legal issues with MRV and TivoToGo, but that shouldn't stop them from upgrading the software so features like TiVoCast, etc... can be used on Series3.

I work at a software company so I know that exact dates are rarely released unless it's within a month as to not commit to the date. But having some insight on the plan might opt more people to purchase Series3 boxes since a lot of them are hesitant thinking S3 might never be as feature rich as S2. Not to mention putting the current S3 owners more at ease.

Thanks,
David


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

TiVoStephen said:


> rainwater, sorry you feel that way. Remember, TiVo and our partners PAY for the bandwidth, and it's not cheap. The feeling of both TiVo and our partners is that we only want to download shows to you if you're watching them.
> 
> As for the vacation situation, remember most of these TiVoCast subscriptions are for weekly content, and you can set up a maximum of 10 shows. How often are you going to be away from your box for more than ten weeks?
> 
> ...


Well, you should definately change the name from TivoCasts to something else. By calling them TivoCasts you are associating them with podcasts and vidcasts. Yet those types of content provide you with real subscription management. I think its pretty obvious why the TivoCast setup will not work.

Steps you have to take:
1) Go online to add the tivocast (or use the Find Program version when available).
2) Go to the SP Manager to change options
3) Go to now playing to delete the first episode before each new one is downloaded. This is extremely unorthodox especially considering you have to know when each episode is downloaded so you will know when you need to delete the last episode. Also it seems this new method prevents you from archiving older shows. Please explain to me why that is a good idea? I would think content providers would want us to watch their content but this method seems to discourage it.

I'm not sure what your user interface team used as a basis to think this was a good idea but it reminds me of why the Podcaster app doesn't work. It seems there is a lack of understanding at TiVo of how people want to use this media (and how people are already using this media on other devices).

What's worse is you are now changing the default behavior of how season passes have always worked, yet you are going to try to train users to know the difference? That just seems like a solution that will never work.


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Rainwater,

Actually the name is "TiVoCast" (singular). 

Our research has shown the vast majority of our customers watch an episode of a TiVoCast subscription and then delete it after it's been watched. We expect that the vast majority of our customers will never hit the episode limit.

Subscribing is now a simple operation on TCO (and soon under the DVR interface). Most customers will not need to change the options or delete any extra shows.

You're correct that this method prevents archiving of older shows. For the most part that comes as a requirement from our content partners.

I agree we'll need to watch how our customers use this feature and understand what if any problems they encounter.

We do value your feedback, and will definitely keep it in mind for future releases.

Best regards,
Stephen


----------



## alansplace (Apr 30, 2006)

TiVoStephen said:


> you can set up a maximum of 10 shows. How often are you going to be away from your box for more than ten weeks?


at least for my part, that's not the point. i allow of all my season passes to self delete (first in first out like a fifo stack) and i think of rocketboom c/net and NY times as season passes. with this change i can no longer do that. i'll have to change my procedure and delete them myself on a regular basis. of course that's nowhere near a show-stopper, just a very small personal pita.  
--
Alan


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

alansplace said:


> at least for my part, that's not the point. i allow of all my season passes to self delete (first in first out like a fifo stack) and i think of rocketboom c/net and NY times as season passes. with this change i can no longer do that. i'll have to change my procedure and delete them myself on a regular basis. of course that's nowhere near a show-stopper, just a very small personal pita.
> --
> Alan


Not only that, but most users aren't even going to understand how to use TiVoCast. You go to x to create the season pass, go to y to change the options, and go to z to delete old shows so you can get new ones. Can TiVo make it more complicated to use a system that should be simple subscription service? Discouraging users from using the feature is not a good way to get people to adopt a service. Btw, I'm sure content partners like Rocketboom and CNet will be glad to know that users will not be getting new episodes once its fills up the quota.


----------



## Stu_Bee (Jan 15, 2002)

Will the same restrictions apply to the S3's when they eventually gets this feature? I'm guessing that the videos will be delivered in a much smaller mpg4 format to the s3's, thus relieving some of the concerns about bandwidth cost?

I personally avoid these download features, unless their was a scheduling option for them to occur (ie between 3am and 7am)...hate for my work voip to take a hit cause of a heavy download. Or am I overestimating the time/bandwidth involved?


----------



## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

TiVoStephen said:


> Hi bicker,
> 
> You should be able to cancel the Season Pass from the To Do list of your DVR.
> 
> ...


It isn't there. There appears to be no way to cancel this.


----------



## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

rainwater said:


> Go to Manage Guides, click Edit Recording Options on the CNet guide, then under Other Recording Options you see "Keep Until: fifo".


When I click on Manage Guides I get this:

Oops!

Sorry, the page you requested was not found.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

bicker said:


> When I click on Manage Guides I get this:
> 
> Oops!
> 
> Sorry, the page you requested was not found.


I got that too until I logged in. Then I went and clicked that link again and it magically worked.


----------



## gonzotek (Sep 24, 2004)

rainwater said:


> Btw, I'm sure content partners like Rocketboom and CNet will be glad to know that users will not be getting new episodes once its fills up the quota.


I was about to mention that but you beat me to it, so I'll simply second it. I understand the bandwidth must be paid for, but doesn't TiVo happen to have an award winning interactive advertising platform?


----------



## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

TiVoStephen said:


> Thanks HDTiVo.
> 
> I can't give you a date, but I will say we are working on releasing this as quickly as we can. We won't get to exactly what you describe in the near future, but you will see a capability similar to that not too long from now, and my hope is that you will be pleased by the new functionality. In the long-term, we definitely want to offer the feature you describe.
> 
> ...


Good to see you guys on the right track. :up:



rainwater said:


> Wow. This is worse than before then. I would rather have the old method to subscribe. I often travel and if I can't come back and view the recent episodes of one of the TiVoCasts because it will not download new ones, then whats the point?
> 
> I'm afraid this system is much worse than the old system. I can't imagine what kind of contracts you have with your partners that requires a stupid system that forces you to manually delete shows before you receive a new one.
> 
> Plus, can you imagine the support requests you are going to get when John Doe can't figure out why new episodes of Rocketboom are not being downloaded?


This happend to me the last few weeks with Rocketboom. It stopped at 5. Over the last couple days I watched and deleted 3 or 4. Immediately after deleting the first they started downloading again (episodes back as far a two weeks.) Now I have 8; go figure?


----------



## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

rainwater said:


> Btw, I'm sure content partners like Rocketboom and CNet will be glad to know that users will not be getting new episodes once its fills up the quota.


I take it at face value when Stephen says the content producers are in agreement with this.

As far as the episodes being deleted after being watched, sure, but this content is not a keeper anyway. If TiVo ever gets good stuff...the limits will hamper the system. Imagine a show like 24 on TiVoCast; you might let 15 or 20 episodes build up before starting the "season."


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Ok, folks, I'm now wrong TWICE in one thread about how to cancel Season Passes on TiVoCast.

First I said that you could use the Manage Guides link on the left. That was wrong -- that was unintentional functionality, and it has some issues. As I write this, we've taken down TCO and when it comes back that link will no longer let you manage TiVoCast subscriptions.

Second I said you could use the To Do list to cancel the Season Pass. But that was completely wrong, and I was way off base on that one. My apologies.

So, then, you might well ask, how do you cancel TiVoCast Season Passes that you create via TiVo Central Online?

The answer is that you can't yet. There WILL be two ways to do so, but neither one exist today.

The first way is that at some point in the future (possibly this year, but more likely early next year), TCO will have something like a "Mange TiVoCast" link that will let you change your subscriptions.

The second method is via new functionality on the TiVo box. This was hinted at in the FAQ. Unfortunately, while we intended to launch this functionality at the same time as we rolled out the TiVo Central Online changes, we found some issues, and are not able to roll out this functionality just yet. We're working on it as fast as we can.

My apologies if you signed up for content today that you don't want. We recognize that the current situation is not the best. We're working to get the TiVo box functionality to you as soon as possible. In the meantime, you can delete the episodes you don't want from the Now Playing list.

Best regards,
Stephen


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

alansplace said:


> at least for my part, that's not the point. i allow of all my season passes to self delete (first in first out like a fifo stack) and i think of rocketboom c/net and NY times as season passes. with this change i can no longer do that. i'll have to change my procedure and delete them myself on a regular basis. of course that's nowhere near a show-stopper, just a very small personal pita.
> --
> Alan


But before, when there was no ability to put a limit, you'd end up with dozens of episodes, and you'd be filling up your drive space. Were you then going in and deleting all of the Rocketbooms by hand when they got up to a high number?

I should have mentioned earlier that customers did ask us for a way to limit the number of episodes downloaded.


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

HDTiVo said:


> This happend to me the last few weeks with Rocketboom. It stopped at 5. Over the last couple days I watched and deleted 3 or 4. Immediately after deleting the first they started downloading again (episodes back as far a two weeks.) Now I have 8; go figure?


Sounds like coincidence -- there was no method to limit the number of downloads prior to this week.

In separate news, we've been having some issues with our Rocketboom feed, so we weren't publishing every day like we should be. We're working with Rocketboom to resolve these issues.

Best,
Stephen


----------



## GoHokies! (Sep 21, 2005)

HDTiVo said:


> I take it at face value when Stephen says the content producers are in agreement with this.
> 
> As far as the episodes being deleted after being watched, sure, but this content is not a keeper anyway. If TiVo ever gets good stuff...the limits will hamper the system. Imagine a show like 24 on TiVoCast; you might let 15 or 20 episodes build up before starting the "season."


That would be pretty awesome - I would think (hope) that those who create content like that would set a higher limit on the number of episodes that you are allowed to keep.

Stephen, thanks for keeping us updated - hopefully this will put some of the "the S2 is dead and abandoned" naysayers to rest.

I suppose that would be too much to ask what some of the "other features" that the KidZone release for the S3 is going to add, or when we can expect to see it?  (You'll be my hero if you say TTG, MRG or eSATA )


----------



## alansplace (Apr 30, 2006)

TiVoStephen said:


> But before, when there was no ability to put a limit, you'd end up with dozens of episodes, and you'd be filling up your drive space. Were you then going in and deleting all of the Rocketbooms by hand when they got up to a high number?
> 
> I should have mentioned earlier that customers did ask us for a way to limit the number of episodes downloaded.


really!  that's not what happened in my experience. i've never had more than 10 of anything and never till today deleted any rocketboom, c/net or ny times episodes.
--
Alan


----------



## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

TiVoStephen said:


> Sounds like coincidence -- there was no method to limit the number of downloads prior to this week.
> 
> In separate news, we've been having some issues with our Rocketboom feed, so we weren't publishing every day like we should be. We're working with Rocketboom to resolve these issues.
> 
> ...


If this is any help - and you want it in this thread...Those earlier episodes (stopped @ 5) were originally downloaded with the typical 2-day expiration. After each one downloaded, I manually set it KUID. About four weeks ago it stopped with the 5 KUIDs.

When I started watching and deleting again, the downloads resumed literally within seconds of the first delete. The new downloads went back two weeks prior, so I didn't get the ones 3 and 4 weeks old that had never downloaded.

Them's the details.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

TiVoStephen said:


> I should have mentioned earlier that customers did ask us for a way to limit the number of episodes downloaded.


Yes, this has been a frequent request. Its just a shame you didn't add this feature. The feature you added is nothing like was requested. The feature you added has no benefit over the old system. In fact, the new system requires you frequently delete episodes just to receive new ones. How is that what the users requested? I would love to be able to say I only want the last 10 episodes of Rocketboom. Unfortunately, that isn't going to be possible. But now (when Rocketboom is added to Tivocast), I have to delete an episode every single day in order to get new episodes. I'm sorry, but that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.


----------



## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

rainwater said:


> I have to delete an episode every single day in order to get new episodes. I'm sorry, but that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.


If they set it up so that the next download is always the episode immediately following the last one downloaded, then even if you take a long time to delete at least you'd not miss episodes because of it.

That would help.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

HDTiVo said:


> If they set it up so that the next download is always the episode immediately following the last one downloaded, then even if you take a long time to delete at least you'd not miss episodes because of it.
> 
> That would help.


That could also result in a influx of data transfer over a long period of time (if you deleted multiple items). So that goes against the theory that it would save bandwidth.


----------



## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

rainwater said:


> That could also result in a influx of data transfer over a long period of time (if you deleted multiple items). So that goes against the theory that it would save bandwidth.


I don't follow you.


----------



## msaeger (Oct 4, 2002)

I want On the spot, IGN weekly, and DL.tv please.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

HDTiVo said:


> I don't follow you.


If they made it automatically download new episodes when you delete old ones, if you deleted all of them, then it would start downloading 10 (or whatever you set) in a row. So this wouldn't be good for TiVo servers either. So, I just am perplexed about the whole situation.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

msaeger said:


> I want On the spot, IGN weekly, and DL.tv please.


The latest episode of dl.tv addresses why dl.tv is not TiVo. They have tried talking with TiVo but the contact person is no longer there. So basically, I wouldn't count on any content like this being available if TiVo isn't interested.


----------



## msaeger (Oct 4, 2002)

Yeah I heard them say that before but I know if Tivo ever gets a clue and listens to the subscribers DL.tv wouldn't turn them down so I'm gonna keep saying it. Get a clue Tivo this could be the thing that seperates you from the cable company DVRs. I think any webcast that wants to get on Tivo should be able to do it.

(not saying I would get a cable company DVR but your average person doesn't know the difference.)


----------



## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

I'm a bit confused - if I'm already getting these items, do I have to do anything at TCO?

I already get Rocketboom, CNET, IVillage, NYT


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

If you already get them, you need do nothing new.


----------



## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

TiVoStephen said:


> Ok, folks, I'm now wrong TWICE in one thread about how to cancel Season Passes on TiVoCast.
> 
> First I said that you could use the Manage Guides link on the left. That was wrong -- that was unintentional functionality, and it has some issues. As I write this, we've taken down TCO and when it comes back that link will no longer let you manage TiVoCast subscriptions.
> 
> ...


Don't you people EVER test things before you release them?


----------



## weathertop (Jan 24, 2003)

When I try to subscribe to CNET or Heavy from Showcases and TV Guide on Tivo Central on my Pioneer 810 HS, I receive the message of "due to system maintenance, this feature is unavailable."

 

I am connected over broadband.


----------



## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

rainwater said:


> If they made it automatically download new episodes when you delete old ones, if you deleted all of them, then it would start downloading 10 (or whatever you set) in a row. So this wouldn't be good for TiVo servers either. So, I just am perplexed about the whole situation.


I understand your concern. That burden could be solved by governing the downloads for example:

A daily show might take 12-24hrs between downloads.

A weekly show (particularly one of significant lenght) might take 1-3 days between downloads.

That way you could start watching old episodes in a "marathon" (3 or 4 at a time) style and the newer ones would come in at a rate fast enough to start another "marathon" every few days.

But frankly, I don't think in the longer run saving bandwidth is the best way to go. DOD should be instantaneous DOD as much as possible. When TiVo gets into downloads that you pay for in some way, they'll probably upgrade to that.


----------



## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

I just want to know why there isn't a guy like Stephen over in the Series 3 forum saying things like, "Yep, we're aware of that and are working on it," and, "Thanks for the bug report, I'll relay it to engineering," and, "Yes, we know Charter is screwed up, we're working with them to fix the problems you're having but nothing we do will ever make them any smarter."


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Well, I do know the Series3 team is very busy working on issues. Between Jerry and Pony, even if they don't always reply to every thread, you can bet they are aware and working on the issues and are absolutely relaying the issues on to engineering.


----------



## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

TiVoStephen said:


> Well, I do know the Series3 team is very busy working on issues. Between Jerry and Pony, even if they don't always reply to every thread, you can bet they are aware and working on the issues and are absolutely relaying the issues on to engineering.


That's good to hear. But there hasn't been much TiVo input of any kind over there, and it seems that a lot of people feel abandoned. I know things are probably pretty high-intensity at TiVo these days, but if someone were to pop in here and there and acknowledge a bug or give a status report, people might feel reassured.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

ChuckyBox said:


> That's good to hear. But there hasn't been much TiVo input of any kind over there, and it seems that a lot of people feel abandoned. I know things are probably pretty high-intensity at TiVo these days, but if someone were to pop in here and there and acknowledge a bug or give a status report, people might feel reassured.


S2 users with 7.3.1 have been saying that for months. Yet, not one single bug has been addressed.


----------



## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

ChuckyBox said:


> I just want to know why there isn't a guy like Stephen over in the Series 3 forum saying things like, "Yep, we're aware of that and are working on it," and, "Thanks for the bug report, I'll relay it to engineering," and, "Yes, we know Charter is screwed up, we're working with them to fix the problems you're having but nothing we do will ever make them any smarter."


I think it has something to do with why my posts are more optimistic on the subject of TiVoCast than the New Marketing Plan.


----------



## bicker (Nov 9, 2003)

Stephen: You are really making the S2 and S3 team(s) look bad (or perhaps they're making themselve look bad, and you're providing the reasonable comparison).


----------



## TivoSwain (Sep 19, 2006)

sounds good.


----------



## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

TiVoStephen said:


> If you already get them, you need do nothing new.


If I'm already receiving them, what number of kept episodes does it default to?


----------



## mchips (Feb 21, 2003)

Stephen,

Thanks for the updates... there are many of us who do appreciate them and your efforts...


----------



## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

TiVoStephen said:


> remember most of these TiVoCast subscriptions are for weekly content


Will TiVoCast grow to include movies on demand or will that feature have a different name?


----------



## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

TiVoStephen said:


> ...Because it costs money to download episodes, the feeling between TiVo and our partners was that we did not want to automatically delete an episode that was sent to your box without giving you a chance to either watch it or delete it.


I hope you aren't saying that it costs TiVo money to download episodes as a bandwidth charge, because these shows should be coming from the providers servers, not TiVo's. Now, if you are saying it costs the providers money and the contract agreement is in place to prevent millions of downloads from swamping what is essentially a free service, then I'd understand.


----------



## classicsat (Feb 18, 2004)

davezatz said:


> Will TiVoCast grow to include movies on demand or will that feature have a different name?


For now, it seems to me, the same back end infrastructure could be used. The only thing would be a front end infrastructure that would allow secure selection and billing of titles.


----------



## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

If it mirrors a PPV model I'd like TiVoCast to be a little more immediate than what's being offered currently. The beauty of PPV is that you can decide at the last minute that you'd like to watch a movie and go get it. If its not immediate like that it's going to fail, unless... 

The movie catalog absolutely blows the doors off of PPV. If you could go onto your TiVo and watch one of thousands of movies with a little advance notice (couple of hours) using something like bittorent built into the TiVo, then it'd totally rock.

There would have to be an authorization schema used here as I wouldn't want my kids buying movies without my permission.


----------



## ChuckyBox (Oct 3, 2005)

Stormspace said:


> The movie catalog absolutely blows the doors off of PPV. If you could go onto your TiVo and watch one of thousands of movies with a little advance notice (couple of hours) using something like bittorent built into the TiVo, then it'd totally rock.


I think this is the direction they'll go. They've said that they want to use TiVoCast to provide content that you can't easily get through your normal cable/satellite hook up. But to have a library of movies, TV shows, and other video that is tens of thousands of titles deep, and can be found through TiVo's search tools (and the box's knowledge of the user's preferences), would be a fantastic and unique use of this feature.


----------



## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

ChuckyBox said:


> I think this is the direction they'll go. They've said that they want to use TiVoCast to provide content that you can't easily get through your normal cable/satellite hook up. But to have a library of movies, TV shows, and other video that is tens of thousands of titles deep, and can be found through TiVo's search tools (and the box's knowledge of the user's preferences), would be a fantastic and unique use of this feature.


As long as it's ala carte I'm cool with that. Start requiring a sub like Netflix and I'm history.


----------



## thehepcat (Jan 9, 2002)

Thanks Stephen. 

I was able to add the latest CNet episode from TCO no problem.

Now, how can I unsubscribe to "Heavy"??? IMO, it is a waste.


----------



## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

I never got the latest (Oct 6th) CNET video. I received every CNET video up until last week.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

morac said:


> I never got the latest (Oct 6th) CNET video. I received every CNET video up until last week.


Did you delete all the previous CNet recordings? Live was said earlier, once you hit the episode limit, it will NOT download new recordings. I can't emphasize how bad this decision is.


----------



## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

ChuckyBox said:


> That's good to hear. But there hasn't been much TiVo input of any kind over there, and it seems that a lot of people feel abandoned. I know things are probably pretty high-intensity at TiVo these days, but if someone were to pop in here and there and acknowledge a bug or give a status report, people might feel reassured.


I would disagree - I have seen posts by TiVoPony and TiVoJerry on various issues. with so many threads being fired up though their posts tend to get lost in the noise.


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

Rainwater, older episodes (prior to last week) are "grandfathered" -- they won't apply to the limit. They'll also show up in a different folder. So something else caused Morac to not receive 10/6.


----------



## TiVoStephen (Jun 27, 2000)

thehepcat said:


> Now, how can I unsubscribe to "Heavy"??? IMO, it is a waste.


Sorry to say, as I mentioned earlier (and as shown in the Showcase for Heavy on your DVR), the method of unsubscribing is being released and will come shortly to your DVR. Right now there is no method.


----------



## mtchamp (May 15, 2001)

This is good to see Stephen Mack post often. TiVo must be on a mission to improve TiVoCast. I really like the concept and as I've said, The New York Times is my current favorite and I like American Suck Countdown. I have much less time for TV lately and some of these 5 minuet features do the trick. I watch a couple, feel satisfied and go to bed. Keep em coming!


----------



## Dajad (Oct 7, 1999)

I don't understand this whole setup. I appreciate TiVo making strides in this direction but why are video podcasts managed the way they are. I want the option to subscribe to ANY video podcast through TiVo just as I can through iTunes. I don't want TiVo to pick and choose which ones I might like. 

I also don't understand the bandwidth arguement. I subscribe to any number of video podcasts through iTunes. iTunes does not contract with video podcast providers to limit the numbers I can download. iTunes WILL nag you if you haven't watched something for awhile and stop downloading it if you don't respond to the nag, but otherwise I can subscribe to ANY video or audio podcast. That is as it should be.

Thanks for this though Steven. I also appreciate your willingness to launch even when the bugs are not ironed out (though I can't get this on my S3 yet). Us podcast/video cast early adopters are used to the bugs and used to getting new features very quickly. Again, this is how I prefer it - wild and woolly at first.

I look forward to what the future of TiVo cast brings!

...Dale


----------



## Dajad (Oct 7, 1999)

RoyK said:


> Don't you people EVER test things before you release them?


Steven, please ignore piss-ant comments like this one! I really appreciate TiVo's willingness to be a bit bleeding edge on new Internet-based features - keep'm coming ... I'm happy to suffer the early adopter pains!


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

Dajad said:


> Steven, please ignore piss-ant comments like this one! I really appreciate TiVo's willingness to be a bit bleeding edge on new Internet-based features - keep'm coming ... I'm happy to suffer the early adopter pains!


It's just a shame they seem to be implementing this using some type of model that might of made sense 10 years ago. Having to manage the TiVoCast app and my Now Playing list just to get new episodes strikes me as TiVo not understanding how people subscribe to things like video/pod casts. Poorly implementing a feature because they can't handle the bandwidth is a very poor excuse. When their partners get direct complaints because they can't receive their content, it will be reflecting poorly on TiVo.


----------



## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

Dajad said:


> I don't understand this whole setup. I appreciate TiVo making strides in this direction but why are video podcasts managed the way they are. I want the option to subscribe to ANY video podcast through TiVo just as I can through iTunes. I don't want TiVo to pick and choose which ones I might like.
> 
> I also don't understand the bandwidth arguement. I subscribe to any number of video podcasts through iTunes. iTunes does not contract with video podcast providers to limit the numbers I can download. iTunes WILL nag you if you haven't watched something for awhile and stop downloading it if you don't respond to the nag, but otherwise I can subscribe to ANY video or audio podcast. That is as it should be.
> 
> ...


I think the biggest issue preventing TiVo from handling podcasts the way you explained is because some podcasts are done in a format that's incompatible with TiVo, Mpeg2 files are large, and not every podcaster wants to host a special TiVo version. So maybe what TiVo is doing is getting permission to cache and convert the cast to offer it to TiVo users. By caching the converted podcast TiVo would incurr bandwidth charges. (Something I didn't think of before.)

So, it's the hardware's limitations that keep you from dling podcasts as you would on a PC.


----------



## Dajad (Oct 7, 1999)

Hey Stormspace, you make a very good point. I was thinking of videocasts in the context of my S3 where it supports MPEG-2, MPEG-4 AVC/H.264, and VC-1/WMV9. 

I had forgotten that the S2 is limited to Mpeg 2 only. 

Perhaps in the S3 version (I have my fingers crossed) the TiVo can provide more of an iTunes-like podcast/videocast experience given its greater codec support. Ideally, I should be able to subscribe to any video podcast that is provided in any of these formats: MPEG-2, MPEG-4 AVC/H.264, and VC-1/WMV9.

The number of video podcasts I subscribe too is growing weekly. While I prefer my iPod and iTunes for audio podcasts, I would much much prefer to watch ALL of my video podcasts on my S3 in the future!

Again, thanks, thanks, thanks to TiVo for continuing to innovate in this way.

...Dale


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

Dajad said:


> While I prefer my iPod and iTunes for audio podcasts, I would much much prefer to watch ALL of my video podcasts on my S3 in the future!


You would never be able to manage very many vidcasts using TivoCast due to the implementation they have decided to use. That's why it seems they aren't going to ever open up TivoCast. Their intent is to control all of the content and restrict the ability to keep/use it.


----------



## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

rainwater said:


> You would never be able to manage very many vidcasts using TivoCast due to the implementation they have decided to use. That's why it seems they aren't going to ever open up TivoCast. Their intent is to control all of the content and restrict the ability to keep/use it.


I agree. Also by restricting it they can leverage the TiVo user base by getting the vidcasters to pay to put the segment in front of millions of TiVo users. Cnet in particular probably pays TiVo to put these segments on their system to drive traffic to thier web site and increase ad revenue. They probably even have a subscription model for payouts where Cnet pays per subscriber. In C-Nets case it's a win win for them, but somehow I doubt we'll be seeing smaller vidcasters breaking into the TiVo scene.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

Stormspace said:


> I agree. Also by restricting it they can leverage the TiVo user base by getting the vidcasters to pay to put the segment in front of millions of TiVo users. Cnet in particular probably pays TiVo to put these segments on their system to drive traffic to thier web site and increase ad revenue. They probably even have a subscription model for payouts where Cnet pays per subscriber. In C-Nets case it's a win win for them, but somehow I doubt we'll be seeing smaller vidcasters breaking into the TiVo scene.


But do you see many publishers paying to provide a service that they already provide to users around the world with a internet connection? I understand having the vidcast sent directly to the TV is appealling, but I'm guessing CNet already has a much bigger audience for its other vidcasts/podcasts. It's a shame TiVo can't use this system to enable a much bigger set of content that is already being provided. Of course there is going to be deals that provide special content for TiVo users, but to abandon the rest of the publishers out there is just insane.


----------



## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

rainwater said:


> But do you see many publishers paying to provide a service that they already provide to users around the world with a internet connection? I understand having the vidcast sent directly to the TV is appealling, but I'm guessing CNet already has a much bigger audience for its other vidcasts/podcasts. It's a shame TiVo can't use this system to enable a much bigger set of content that is already being provided. Of course there is going to be deals that provide special content for TiVo users, but to abandon the rest of the publishers out there is just insane.


I see your point, but there is an argument for having something that is grandma easy. Take AOL for instance. I put TiVo, the iPod, and AOL all in the same category. Each of these devices makes using them as easy and reliable as possible so that you don't have to be a computer wiz to use them, but at the same time they aren't as flexible as competing products. All are overpriced.


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

Stormspace said:


> I see your point, but there is an argument for having something that is grandma easy. Take AOL for instance. I put TiVo, the iPod, and AOL all in the same category. Each of these devices makes using them as easy and reliable as possible so that you don't have to be a computer wiz to use them, but at the same time they aren't as flexible as competing products. All are overpriced.


Of course, thats the whole point. TiVo could make it easy and allow users to subscribe to content that is already available. Take Rocketboom for instance. They provide feeds for all kinds of formats. All they would have to do is add a TiVo (mpeg2) feed and all of a sudden all TiVo users would have access to that content without TiVo having to have a content deal in place and without it using TiVos bandwith. Throw in paid content (vod for instance) and you have a feature that will attract a lot of users. But keep it so restricted that the content is limited and you have another Product Watch feature.

This is basically the whole problem with Product Watch as well. The content they provided would of made sense had they opened it up to mix in external content. Then people might even subscribe to the paid content. But by restricting the content so much they make using it very undesirable.


----------



## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

rainwater said:


> Of course, thats the whole point. TiVo could make it easy and allow users to subscribe to content that is already available. Take Rocketboom for instance. They provide feeds for all kinds of formats. All they would have to do is add a TiVo (mpeg2) feed and all of a sudden all TiVo users would have access to that content without TiVo having to have a content deal in place and without it using TiVos bandwith. Throw in paid content (vod for instance) and you have a feature that will attract a lot of users. But keep it so restricted that the content is limited and you have another Product Watch feature.


I stopped with Product watch when it took 5 minutes to get past the first menu and navigating took three minutes per click. Bet I wasn't the only one.



rainwater said:


> This is basically the whole problem with Product Watch as well. The content they provided would of made sense had they opened it up to mix in external content. Then people might even subscribe to the paid content. But by restricting the content so much they make using it very undesirable.


TiVoCast will likely do better once they start providing movies via VOD like you said, but performance is going to be a major issue. Of course if I could get free content via TiVoCast why would I pay for something? Hmmm. TiVocast could be the end of TTCB for the S3.


----------



## Dajad (Oct 7, 1999)

I think its WAY too early for us to declare what TiVo's podcast/TiVoCast/iVOD future will be. If TiVo does try to provide a "walled garden" of video podcasts, then I believe this will fail miserably. This would be the equivalent of TiVo only recording those stations off my cable line up that it had partnering deals with. This is silly and so would limiting video podcast recordings.

I have been the longest and most staunch supporter here of TiVo providing an iVOD service for a fee and I still hope they do - that is TV shows, movies, sporting events etc. downloadable at the users option for a fee - something close to what Blockbuster charges.

Just as iTunes does both (supporting free podcasts while charging for downloaded music) TiVo can do both (free podcasts and video podcasts) while charging for premium downloaded content. There is nothing contradictory about this business model and it is exactly where I expect TiVo to go in the long term. 

...Dale


----------



## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

Stormspace said:


> Of course if I could get free content via TiVoCast why would I pay for something?


Because the "free" content will be things like vidcasts. VOD would appeal to a much larger audience. Plus, I'm not sure VOD would even be a part of TivoCast to begin with.


----------



## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

It's long been speculated that TiVoCast will be something along the lines of a netflix for TiVo. Something of that nature would be great as long as it was competitive with brick and mortar rental outlets, allowed MRV, view many times, and had an ala cart model. If they did something like this I wonder how they would handle DVD releases of TV shows. Right now you can rent an entire season of a show, or one DVD out of the set with 5 to ten shows on it, for the same amount as a movie. Obviously in a download environment that would be a larger download, but would it cost more to get?

Of course we've seen that TiVo and it's PR arm aren't ones for managing expectations given the S3's proposed feature set and what it actually was shipped with, so what this actually turns out to be could be vastly different than what we imagine. Some things it might be.

1. Order on TiVo-Get a physical DVD in the mail
2. Order on TiVo-Download appears on PC using TiVo Desktop, you can watch or transfer to TiVo.
3. Download directly to TiVo, pay for each viewing.
4. Uses a profile to download a constant set of movies to your TiVo, you pay when you watch them. New releases might appear each week, or you could mark one to stay if you want to watch it later.
5. The cable model where licensing deals and good ol boy politics determine which movies are available at a given time and those are present on your TiVo, waiting to be unlocked with a credit card.
6. Open catalog with thousands of titles available for download on demand. Pay per view or based on MPAA licensing terms. Some may give you several days to watch, others only 24 hours.


----------



## Dajad (Oct 7, 1999)

I'm expecting a combination of your number 6 for a-la-carte and an alternative all you can eat subscription model like the various PlayForSure services. In the TV series case, they could do it like Apple does iTunes, $2.00-$4.00 an episode rental (depending on how new it is) or rent or purchase the entire season for $20 to $40 (again depending on how old they are). 

As for entire season downloads, you have time on your side. Rent the season and the first starts to download. When its available start watching - the others trickle down in the background as your Internet connection speed permits. The second should be ready by the time you finish watching episode 1 - etc. etc.

Lots and lots of options for TiVo to successfully monotize this assuming they can get the studios to play ball. 

...Dale


----------



## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

Warner Music Group and Brightcove Unveil New Video Initiative
Deal Further Expands WMG's Video Content Monetization Opportunities 

Do TiVo and Brightcove have a relationship?

Will this deal affect content available via TiVoCast?


----------



## gonzotek (Sep 24, 2004)

HDTiVo said:


> Warner Music Group and Brightcove Unveil New Video Initiative
> Deal Further Expands WMG's Video Content Monetization Opportunities
> 
> Do TiVo and Brightcove have a relationship?
> ...


http://www.brightcove.com/faq-tivo.cfm


> What will be possible with the TiVo-Brightcove partnership?
> With this partnership, publishers using Brightcove's Internet TV service will be able to distribute their content directly to TiVo subscriber set-top boxes, providing TV-quality downloads to consumers. TiVo subscribers will gain access to compelling Internet TV programming that spans news, *music entertainment*, health and lifestyle, teen, comedy and other special interest content areas that are only discoverable on the Internet. Initially, all of the content will be free to consumers and may include advertising that is downloaded with the content.


 So perhaps we'll be getting some music videos (which I'd probably check out more often than CNet, Heavy or iVillage)


----------



## HDTiVo (Nov 27, 2002)

gonzotek said:


> http://www.brightcove.com/faq-tivo.cfm
> So perhaps we'll be getting some music videos (which I'd probably check out more often than CNet, Heavy or iVillage)


Thanks, I could not remember for sure.

I should spend some time investigating how effective Brightcove has been in getting content.

I hope the FAQ means that TiVoCast will get content as Brightcove makes deals rather than that additional or separate deals with TiVo will be needed.


----------



## TiVo Steve (Nov 8, 2005)

from "Heavy"? I can't do it from the website OR my TiVo! :down:


----------



## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

For some reason I had to resubscribe to the CNET TiVocast to get it to download. Once I resubscribed it started downloading a few minutes later.

Also I've tried subscribing to the NY Times showcase and I never receive it.


----------



## KevinH121 (Aug 7, 2003)

I also would love to be able to unsubscribe from Heavy. This needs to be fixed soon.


----------

