# Confused .. connection issues ? Advice needed!



## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

I have a TiVo Roamio pro in my living room
I am using my Mac time capsule as a modem and back up.
I am connected in the living room to the Ethernet cable
Now I want my kids tvs in their bedroom to work too.
I purchased mini's and they won't work wirelessly
I had my cable company time warner come out and install new cable lines in their rooms.
It still won't work with the TiVo. I have to have a wired Ethernet plug from the modem to their mini's. This looks horrible and is a walking hazard. Obviously not a long term solution.

How do I solve this? 
Also, moving to a different area and have to choose between dish/direct tv or Cox.
Would any of these be compatible with my TiVo? So many time warner installers (and Best Buy employees) told me that TiVo is outdated and there's no point to it anymore. Now I wonder if I made a mistake with lifetime service...
Moved to America last year and have only ever used a TiVo here.



Been trying to fix this for the last three months with no success... I want a solution that will work for here and where I will be moving to next month.

Is there a compatibility issue with the apple time capsule and the TiVo mini?

Also, since I am moving into a new place and renting (can't cut holes in the wall) how would I best be able to ensure that there is a TiVo connection in my master bedroom, kids rooms and living rooms? I assume my main connection will be the living room but how do I make the bedrooms TiVo ready? Will prob sky have to extend my modem with an airport express since it is a two story house.

I also have a net gear modem at home (not installed).
Thanks for the help!


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

Check out the sticky in the mini forums. Did you set up the Roamio as a moca bridge?

Those employees are full of #$&&$?.

TiVo will work great with Cox.


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

Myztic said:


> I have a TiVo Roamio pro in my living room
> I am using my Mac time capsule as a modem and back up.
> I am connected in the living room to the Ethernet cable
> Now I want my kids tvs in their bedroom to work too.
> ...


If you want to use your Tivo's in your new home, COX is your only choice, Tivos don't work with satellite.
I am pretty certain that your TimeCapsule should work with your Tivo minis. First question is have you added the minis to your Tivo account and sure they are activated? If you bought them from any place but Tivo, you have to do that first and it sometimes can take a bit of time. If you haven't done that, then there is your problem. 
If you have, then see if you can figure out how to login to your Apple router and see if the Tivos are all showing up in the connected devices. If they are there, see if you can figure out how to set the Tivos will "fixed/static/reserved" IP's and then reboot everything, Tivos and router. Report back....


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

I guess greys anatomy started working.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

Ok I will try that
I did register them. I will check if they reflect on to my time capsule and let you know.
First, need to see how to get into my time capsule.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

jrtroo said:


> Check out the sticky in the mini forums. Did you set up the Roamio as a moca bridge?
> 
> Those employees are full of #$&&$?.
> 
> TiVo will work great with Cox.


No I did not. How do I do that?


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

Do I need to purchase a moca adapter or something for my time capsule ? Can anyone recommend one?
Or should I make my net gear as my main modem? I was thinking maybe I need an airport express for the new house to make sure I have internet everywhere and not sure if that would work with net gear.

When I try to connect to moca on my TiVo it gives me an error to say moca settings not correct


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

Myztic said:


> Do I need to purchase a moca adapter or something for my time capsule ? Can anyone recommend one?
> Or should I make my net gear as my main modem? I was thinking maybe I need an airport express for the new house to make sure I have internet everywhere and not sure if that would work with net gear.
> 
> When I try to connect to moca on my TiVo it gives me an error to say moca settings not correct


How many routers are you using, and what is the "Netgear"?


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> I have a TiVo Roamio pro in my living room
> ...
> I am connected in the living room to the Ethernet cable
> Now I want my kids tvs in their bedroom to work too.
> ...


In this situation, with your Roamio Pro connected to both coax and Ethernet, you should be configuring your Roamio Pro to "Create a MoCA network," to create a MoCA network to which the Minis could connect. Once the Roamio Pro is properly configured, you would then tell the Minis to "Connect using MoCA."


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

So i have enabled moca network settings on my roamio plus (my husband said he did this a while ago too.. but nothing has worked since (and before) then)

It says use these settings:
Moca enabled: yes
moca channel: 15
encryption key none

then it says how do you want the tivo box to obtain an ip address
and i pressed get automatically from a dhcp server.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

I forgot to mention, that I also have a time warner cable modem connected to my ethernet as well and i dont know if that affects it somehow. I'm not sure if I am allowed to turn that off or if it will affect my cable tv.

I tried "connecting with moca" on the mini but....it says Tivo was unable to MOCA
Problem with your network settings. The tivo box was unable to connect to your moca network C33


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

fcfc2 said:


> If you have, then see if you can figure out how to login to your Apple router and see if the Tivos are all showing up in the connected devices. If they are there, see if you can figure out how to set the Tivos will "fixed/static/reserved" IP's and then reboot everything, Tivos and router. Report back....


I dont understand this part.. what do you mean make them use a static ip address?? how do i do that and how do i find out what their static ip address is? This is referring to the Tivo Mini's, right? Not the Roamio?


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

fcfc2 said:


> How many routers are you using, and what is the "Netgear"?


The netgear is here at home not connected or anything. 
I have two routers... one is the apple time capsule (use that as a connection)...

and i have a time warner box that they gave me its an arris TG1672 (barely connect to this one)


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

How are you configuring your Roamio Pro?

Your Roamio Pro must first be setup to use an Ethernet connection. And then, after the Ethernet connection is demo'd to be working, you'll go back into Network Settings and select "Change Network Settings" in order to use the Roamio Pro to create a MoCA network, via the "Use this DVR to create a MoCA network option."

More details here: https://www.tivo.com/support/how-to/how-connect-your-tivo-box-your-home-network

See attached for a screenshot of the "create a MoCA network" option, to be selected AFTER getting the Pro working on Ethernet.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Note that the above doesn't guarantee anything. It's just getting the Roamio Pro configured correctly for creating the MoCA network on your coax lines (obviating the need for a MoCA adapter).

Once the Roamio Pro is both connecting to the Internet via Ethernet and creating your MoCA network, then you can begin trying your Minis for MoCA connectivity.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> I have two routers... one is the apple time capsule (use that as a connection)...
> 
> and i have a time warner box that they gave me its an arris TG1672 (barely connect to this one)


This *could* be a problem, if they're not configured correctly. The Arris TG1672 is your main cable modem/router, and so we'll need to know more about how these two devices are configured and connected to each other to determine if there's a problem, or will be.

You could conceivably get your Minis working with the Roamio Pro over MoCA, but then later have problems trying to connect to any of your TiVo devices from your wireless devices or via TiVo Online.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

Hi
All those settings were completed earlier but it still won't connect to the mini's as it gives the errors I referred to above.

From what I see
The arris is the one connected to the wall. Then the lines run from the arris to the time capsule. Time capsule into my Roamio.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

so i went into the arris modem and it doesnt have a check for moca enabled.
I can't seem to put a check on it. I think this is probably the problem but cant seem to find online how to activate moca on the modem.

I wouldn't mind bypassing the modem but have no clue how to set up my tv cable without using this box then.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> so i went into the arris modem and it doesnt have a check for moca enabled.
> I can't seem to put a check on it. I think this is probably the problem but cant seem to find online how to activate moca on the modem.


That isn't the problem. TWC likely doesn't allow enabling that (IIRC), and you wouldn't want the Arris creating a 2nd MoCA network, anyway. Your Roamio Pro can handle the creation of your MoCA network.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

krkaufman said:


> That isn't the problem. TWC likely doesn't allow enabling that (IIRC), and you wouldn't want the Arris creating a 2nd MoCA network, anyway. Your Roamio Pro can handle the creation of your MoCA network.


oh ok.
But then it still isn't working. I have tried to connect tivo mini's but they wont connect.
Also, i did check that they are active in my tivo account and yes they are.


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

Myztic said:


> The netgear is here at home not connected or anything.
> I have two routers... one is the apple time capsule (use that as a connection)...
> 
> and i have a time warner box that they gave me its an arris TG1672 (barely connect to this one)


Yikes,
That Arris TG1672, is what's called a Gateway, this means it is a combination cable modem, and wifi router, and telephony unit in one and in this case it also has MoCA 1.1 if it is "enabled". This is designed to be a one of type of device, so no other routers are normally designed to be used with them unless they can be configured as an Access Point. I don't know if the Time Capsule has an AP mode, it does apparently have a bridge mode, but "bridge" is an ambiguous term and I am not sure what it means in this context. You would have to find out how to login to your TC, and set it to "bridge" mode to see if that will work. You are going to have to get familiar with Google and start doing some reading. If your Arris Gateway was fully functional with the router functioning and MoCA enabled, you should have been able to simply connect all of your Tivos using the "connect to MoCA network" when you set them up.
Frankly, after pondering your situation and skill level, this could take a long time to sort out. I would suggest you try to find a friend or a tech savvy teenager to help you as you have a lot of information to learn about.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

when i move to cox later this month, should i ask them not to give them their modem? so that i can configure everything using either my netgear or my time capsule?


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> So i have enabled moca network settings on my roamio plus (my husband said he did this a while ago too.. but nothing has worked since (and before) then)
> 
> It says use these settings:
> Moca enabled: yes
> ...


This information you related above indicates, to me, that you had selected the "Connect using MoCA" option on the Roamio Pro, not "Use this DVR to create a MoCA network." The Pro must be configured, first, to use an Ethernet connection, and, then, with the bottom option, to create the MoCA network.

On the MoCA-creating Roamio Pro...


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Let's simplify things, just to prove the MoCA concept...

*The Plan: Test a Mini via MoCA in the same room as the Roamio Pro.* This will eliminate household wiring issues as the cause of your problems, and should quickly demonstrate a proper MoCA configuration of both the Roamio Pro and the Mini. (And if we can't make this basic configuration work, there's little chance we'll make a successful MoCA connection with the Mini in its intended location.)

*Physical setup:* Move one Mini to the same room as the Roamio Pro, connecting the Mini to the same coax lines as the Roamio Pro, while maintaining the Pro's coax connection with TWC; a MoCA-compliant splitter and a couple lengths of coax will be needed. Ideally though not absolutely necessary -- and solely for this testing -- a MoCA filter would be installed on the input to the coax splitter connecting the Roamio Pro and the Mini, to completely isolate this tiny MoCA network.
NOTE: I'm assuming you'll be able to arrange for display of the Mini video output.​
*The Tests:* 

*Ethernet connectivity:* For a moment, let's forget about MoCA and make sure that the Roamio Pro is connected successfully to the Internet via Ethernet, and can make a successful TiVo service connection. (see Step 2 in this post for making manual service connections)

*MoCA connectivity:* Once the Pro's TiVo service connection completes, head back into the Pro's network settings and configure the Pro to *create* the MoCA network (per the above screenshot). When the Pro indicates that it is connected via "Ethernet + MoCA," head over to the Mini and configure it to "Connect using MoCA." 

Should work. Report back what you find...


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## joestan (Dec 25, 2007)

Do you by any chance have a running adapter on the TIVO that you are trying to create the mona network on. If you do you need to use a splitter from the coax outlet with one leg going to the tivo and one to the TA, if you use the TA's pass thru it will block the MOCA signal


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

joestan said:


> Do you by any chance have a running adapter on the TIVO that you are trying to create the moca network on. If you do you need to use a splitter from the coax outlet with one leg going to the tivo and one to the TA, if you use the TA's pass thru it will block the MOCA signal


Thanks, joestan; excellent point. (facepalm)

Myztic, do you have a *tuning adapter* from TWC connected to your Roamio Pro?

If so, you must be aware that the "TV/RF Out" port of tuning adapters (TA) do NOT pass MoCA signals, so a MoCA-enabled device daisy-chained off a TA's TV/RF Out port would not be able to communicate via MoCA. As joestan indicated, you would need to use a 2-way MoCA-compliant splitter to feed coax to the tuning adapter and Roamio Pro separately; in addition, to protect the tuning adapter from the MoCA signals (see here), you would also need to install a MoCA filter on the coax input to the tuning adapter.

See Step #5 in the *Cox tuning adapter setup document* for a good diagram showing how to properly connect a TiVo and tuning adapter in a MoCA environment (excluding the Ethernet connection you will require for the TiVo). And, yes, this connection setup applies to TWC tuning adapter installs, as well.







p.s. That said, the above simple test for MoCA connectivity would still be worthwhile, to ensure correct configuration of the Roamio Pro and Mini for MoCA. Even with a tuning adapter in the mix, if this simple setup can't be made to work, the level of difficulty only increases when trying to connect to different rooms.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

Hi yes I pressed create a moca network. Sorry I didn't clarify that.
I'm not at home right now. Will be there in the evening. As soon as I try your tips I will let you know and update you on the type of connection going in and out of my box.
While I don't need to completely solve it this week since I will be moving next week anyway and giving up time warner I am just worried that if I take out a new subscription with cox and have this same issue I will be locked in and unable to use my TiVo mini's 
Will update you tonight when I get home

Thank you again for your help! Truly appreciate your time.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

fcfc2 said:


> Yikes, That Arris TG1672, is what's called a Gateway, this means it is a combination cable modem, and wifi router, and telephony unit in one and in this case it also has MoCA 1.1 if it is "enabled". This is designed to be a one of type of device, so no other routers are normally designed to be used with them unless they can be configured as an Access Point. I don't know if the Time Capsule has an AP mode, it does apparently have a bridge mode, but "bridge" is an ambiguous term and I am not sure what it means in this context. You would have to find out how to login to your TC, and set it to "bridge" mode to see if that will work. You are going to have to get familiar with Google and start doing some reading. If your Arris Gateway was fully functional with the router functioning and MoCA enabled, you should have been able to simply connect all of your Tivos using the "connect to MoCA network" when you set them up. Frankly, after pondering your situation and skill level, this could take a long time to sort out. I would suggest you try to find a friend or a tech savvy teenager to help you as you have a lot of information to learn about.


My mom has this setup with the gateway on Comcast. It's not the Time Capsule that needs to be in bridge mode, it's the Gateway that does, so it acts as only a modem for telephone and Internet only. I'm sure the techs already set it up this way, which is why the option to activate moca on it is greyed out and unselectable. This should be able to be proven by whether he is able to connect to the Internet with his household devices through his TC. Also, they could do a search for wifi signals in the home. If it only shows the TC's wifi and NOT the one from the gateway, then it's most likely in bridge mode already.

OP, do you have the skills to login to the Gateway using a web browser to see what mode it's in?


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> As soon as I try your tips I will let you know and update you on the type of connection going in and out of my box.


Any progress, or too busy prepping for the move?

Worst case, we can just take the issue up on the Cox side of the move. As with your current setup, the odds of success improve with increased coax connectivity through the residence.

Note that if you'll be moving into a multi-dwelling building, you may have some special concerns to communicate to your Cox installer, to ensure that all your coax runs come together and can be isolated from anyone else in the building.

For reference, you may want to take a look at this PDF document from Cisco...
*MoCA Installation and Troubleshooting Reference Guide*​... specifically, pages 17 & 18, which discuss multi-dwelling buildings. (see attached)



Spoiler














Getting coax runs properly grouped onto a dedicated splitter with its own PoE filter, as depicted, is crucial for establishing a strong, secure (and functioning) MoCA network.

.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

krkaufman said:


> Any progress, or too busy prepping for the move? Worst case, we can just take the issue up on the Cox side of the move. As with your current setup, the odds of success improve with increased coax connectivity through the residence. Note that if you'll be moving into a multi-dwelling building, you may have some special concerns to communicate to your Cox installer, to ensure that all your coax runs come together and can be isolated from anyone else in the building. For reference, you may want to take a look at this PDF document from Cisco... MoCA Installation and Troubleshooting Reference Guide ... specifically, pages 17 & 18, which discuss multi-dwelling buildings. (see attached) * SPOILER * Getting coax runs properly grouped onto a dedicated splitter with its own PoE filter, as depicted, is crucial for establishing a strong, secure (and functioning) MoCA network. .


........or you could put 7 moca filters on the other 6 outlets and 1 input!


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

I would take the Time Capsule out of the equation and connect the Roamio ethernet cable to the Arris Modem/Router

Unless you are getting telephone service from Cox too, I would just go buy an Arris cable modem from Walmart or Amazon instead of renting one of the combo modem/routers from Cox. Something like the Arris SB 6183 or 6141. I use them at both homes in Nevada and Oklahoma with Cox and Tivos w/Minis on moca.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

osu1991 said:


> I would take the Time Capsule out of the equation and connect the Roamio ethernet cable to the Arris Modem/Router Unless you are getting telephone service from Cox too, I would just go buy an Arris cable modem from Walmart or Amazon instead of renting one of the combo modem/routers from Cox. Something like the Arris SB 6183 or 6141. I use them at both homes in Nevada and Oklahoma with Cox and Tivos w/Minis on moca.


Why? His TC is perfectly capable of doing what he needs and it's very easy to set those gateways in Bridge Mode to act as a Modem only for IP and Phone.


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

Myztic said:


> Hi yes I pressed create a moca network. Sorry I didn't clarify that.
> I'm not at home right now. Will be there in the evening. As soon as I try your tips I will let you know and update you on the type of connection going in and out of my box.
> While I don't need to completely solve it this week since I will be moving next week anyway and giving up time warner I am just worried that if I take out a new subscription with cox and have this same issue I will be locked in and unable to use my TiVo mini's
> Will update you tonight when I get home
> ...


Unless you agree to PROMO pricing there is no contract with Cox and if you agree to a promo, you have 30 days to cancel it, in case it doesn't work out the way you want.


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

HarperVision said:


> Why? His TC is perfectly capable of doing what he needs and it's very easy to set those gateways in Bridge Mode to act as a Modem only for IP and Phone.


You know that and I know that, but the OP may not. Narrow things down to a basic level to get things working correctly first, then add the other equipment.

There is some incorrect terminology here too. The OP is calling a Router a Modem, so getting things sorted at a basic level would seem to be the obvious thing.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Should be a simple enough matter for the Cox technician to setup the Cox-supplied modem/gateway in bridge mode, with the Time Capsule as the primary routing device. The OP can go get their own modem later, once everything else is working and they're looking to shave a few bucks from their bill -- though, as you mention, subscribing to the telephony package might complicate supplying one's own modem.

And here's hoping the OP is able to get a good deal on their Cox setup... free or deeply discounted whole home DVR installation for 3 or 4 rooms, with no strings should they decide the Cox solution doesn't work for them.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

joestan said:


> Do you by any chance have a running adapter on the TIVO that you are trying to create the mona network on. If you do you need to use a splitter from the coax outlet with one leg going to the tivo and one to the TA, if you use the TA's pass thru it will block the MOCA signal


Myztic, any report on whether you also have a tuning adapter from TWC installed and connected to your Roamio Pro/Plus?


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

osu1991 said:


> I would take the Time Capsule out of the equation and connect the Roamio ethernet cable to the Arris Modem/Router Unless you are getting telephone service from Cox too, I would just go buy an Arris cable modem from Walmart or Amazon instead of renting one of the combo modem/routers from Cox. Something like the Arris SB 6183 or 6141. I use them at both homes in Nevada and Oklahoma with Cox and Tivos w/Minis on moca.





HarperVision said:


> Why? His TC is perfectly capable of doing what he needs and it's very easy to set those gateways in Bridge Mode to act as a Modem only for IP and Phone.





osu1991 said:


> You know that and I know that, but the OP may not. Narrow things down to a basic level to get things working correctly first, then add the other equipment. There is some incorrect terminology here too. The OP is calling a Router a Modem, so getting things sorted at a basic level would seem to be the obvious thing.


Were you saying to do that as a troubleshooting technique, or as a permanent solution? I think he called his modem a router because it's a combo device that integrates them both, as well as a telephone modem. Technically a router is a router plus a switch, but we just call it a router, right?


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

HarperVision said:


> Were you saying to do that as a troubleshooting technique, or as a permanent solution? I think he called his modem a router because it's a combo device that integrates them both, as well as a telephone modem. Technically a router is a router plus a switch, but we just call it a router, right?


Troubleshooting, get it working then integrate the other equipment, which doesn't matter at this point as the OP is moving next week.

The op was referring to the TC as a modem in the first post and several after.

I'll just bow out as there are more contradictory posts here than actual help to the OP.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

osu1991 said:


> Troubleshooting, get it working then integrate the other equipment, which doesn't matter at this point as the OP is moving next week. The op was referring to the TC as a modem in the first post and several after. I'll just bow out as there are more contradictory posts here than actual help to the OP.


Ok thanks for clearing it up. So I guess having him do what's needed by putting his gateway in bridge mode so it works properly is "contradictory and doesn't actually help".........ahhhhhh OK, thanks for nothing!


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Probably makes good sense for everybody to bow out, at least until the OP returns looking for any additional assistance... as, as you said, they're leaving their current setup and TWC behind, this week, and may not even be going with a TiVo solution at their next place, per comments above and in this parallel thread:
http://tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=541949​


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## Diana Collins (Aug 21, 2002)

Most likely, the cable installer ran the coax to the bedroom from a tap before the Arris Gateway, or there is some other device in between the TiVo and the bedroom that is blocking the MOCA signal.


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

HarperVision said:


> Ok thanks for clearing it up. So I guess having him do what's needed by putting his gateway in bridge mode so it works properly is "contradictory and doesn't actually help".........ahhhhhh OK, thanks for nothing!


I see reading comprehension is not your strong suit, but being an ass is. The OP is a she not a he.

It seems like no one can just be nice and help others anymore.

Sent from my iPhone


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

osu1991 said:


> I see reading comprehension is not your strong suit, but being an ass is. The OP is a she not a he. It seems like no one can just be nice and help others anymore. Sent from my iPhone




I wasn't being an ass as much as just contradicting your contradiction of saying that no one was helping, when I clearly WAS!


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

I'm sorry for or going missing and not checking this thread for the past few days.
We have been incredibly busy with the move.
My husband said I should just wait on making these adjustments until we move because I will most likely need to do it at my new place anyway.
Cox is coming to install on Tuesday next week. I said I would bring my own modem (otherwise it costs 20 dollars a month extra in my bill.)
Any suggestions on a modem that will for sure work with my mini's?
I figure, if the installer isn't able to make my TiVo mini's work I will revert back to you guys and also, I then have thirty days to cancel if I'm not happy with cox.

So, I will buy the cable modem on your suggestion... And I would need to put my time capsule on bridge mode? But how do I extend my signal? What can I buy that will extend my signal all throughout the house?


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

We don't need to get your current TWC setup working, but it *would* just take a moment to check your Roamio to see if you also have a TWC tuning adapter box installed/connected, as well. (This box would need to be connected to your coax lines, but also to your Roamio via a USB cable.)

edit: p.s. And if you find you have a tuning adapter, how it is connected would be a very good thing to take note of. For your Roamio Plus/Pro to communicate via MoCA, the Roamio must NOT be connected through a tuning adapter's "RF/TV Out" port; the Roamio and tuning adapter would need to be connected to the wall outlet via a (MoCA-compatible) 2-way coax splitter.

Anyway, just knowing if a tuning adapter was in place and how it is connected might help solve the mystery of why you couldn't get MoCA working, and increase your confidence heading to the new place.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

Ok what I will do when I get back home after work today (around 4pm) I will take pictures of what's going into the box and what is on the wall maybe you can help me figure out what this all is. Thank you again for your help it is truly appreciated.


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

Myztic said:


> I'm sorry for or going missing and not checking this thread for the past few days.
> We have been incredibly busy with the move.
> My husband said I should just wait on making these adjustments until we move because I will most likely need to do it at my new place anyway.
> Cox is coming to install on Tuesday next week. I said I would bring my own modem (otherwise it costs 20 dollars a month extra in my bill.)
> ...


Hi,
Ordinarily, I would not recommend such a combo modem, router and wireless AP type device like the Motorola SBG6782-AC Surfboard eXtreme Cable Modem, but in the interest of simplicity and because this has MoCA builtin, I would recommend you consider it especially to avoid Cox $20 monthly rental.
If you get one, ask the Cox installer to put a MoCA filter on the input of the first splitter to enter your home. Most installers have these filters because they are used with any whole home DVR service.
Make sure the combo unit has it's MoCA enabled(no encryption) and when you go to setup your Tivos, use the same "connect to MoCA network" setting for all of them. 
Fingers crossed, if you get that far and are successful, and you need better wireless coverage in your home, there are a couple options. I would recommend that you consider a MoCA enabled "access point" or "network extender". A used or refurbished WCB3000N is relatively inexpensive on Ebay, $50-$60 range, and can be configured to work with almost any primary router. By connecting such a device to one of the coax outlets in the "dead" wireless zone, you will get up to dual band N speeds "extended" to cover that area. Feel free to put that Time Capsule and whatever the "Netgear" is up on Ebay to recoup some of your expenses.
The "bridge" mode in your time capsule, I believe will not work, it needs to have what is called an "access point" or AP mode. Check on your "Netgear" router to see if it has an "access point" mode, if it does, another option would be to ad a plain MoCA adapter to the coax in your "dead" or weak area and after configuring the Netgear router to AP mode, connect the adapters Ethernet port to one of the Netgear's 4 LAN ports and you should get good wireless coverage with that and a few extra Ethernet ports.
There are several other ways to do this type of thing but I considered simplicity and limited technical skills.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> So, I will buy the cable modem on your suggestion... And I would need to put my time capsule on bridge mode? But how do I extend my signal? What can I buy that will extend my signal all throughout the house?


Composing a note re: your next place, but gotta run and unlock my sister's house. Will finish and post in a bit....


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

Myztic said:


> ..........So, I will buy the cable modem on your suggestion... And I would need to put my time capsule on bridge mode? But how do I extend my signal? What can I buy that will extend my signal all throughout the house?


Or to keep it simple and not over complicate things, just buy a modem like the Arris SB6141 or 6183 and keep using your time capsule as the wifi router. No reason to put it in AP mode, and no you wouldn't put it in bridge mode. The only thing we discussed doing that with was your gateway from TWC, which since you're moving is now moot.


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

HarperVision said:


> Or to keep it simple and not over complicate things, just buy a modem like the Arris SB6141 or 6183 and keep using your time capsule as the wifi router. No reason to put it in AP mode, and no you wouldn't put it in bridge mode. The only thing we discussed doing that with was your gateway from TWC, which since you're moving is now moot.


Hi,
Waiting to hear krkaufman's thoughts, but your thought may be economical at first, but doesn't address the question of how to get connected to all of the Tivos or how to "extend" the wireless to the weak or "dead" areas of the new home which the OP seems to be anticipating. If the OP's new home is completely wired for both Ethernet and coax, the options change, but most homes aren't wired with Ethernet. My suggestion was for the "whole" package, not necessarily the least expensive. The OP seems bright but with not very high tech skills.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

So, putting aside the current TWC setup and planning for the new (though I *will* be interested to see any well-lit pics you might take of your current Roamio setup and cabling) ...



Myztic said:


> I said I would bring my own modem (otherwise it costs 20 dollars a month extra in my bill.)
> 
> Any suggestions on a modem that will for sure work with my mini's?


The first thing you'll need to share is what Cox services you've subscribed to; that will determine what features are required in your *modem*. Are you just going with TV & Internet, or are you also looking to use Cox for phone service? And can you say what speed Internet service you'll have, or if you have any future plans to increase your Internet speed plan?

Also, to aid in communication going forward, the terms are sometimes used interchangeably, but there are distinct functions you'll be dealing with, sometimes provided via a standalone device but more often bundled with other functions in a combo device.
_telephone modem (EMTA)_ - converts cable signal to usable in-home telephone wiring
_cable modem_ - converts cable signal to form usable by a PC or router for direct access to Internet
_router_ - establishes your home network, and connects home network to Internet
_firewall_ - protects your home network from the Internet
_wireless access point_ - connects Wi-Fi devices to your home network
_wireless router_ - combines all of router, firewall and wireless access point functions in a single device
_wireless gateway_ - combines wireless router with cable modem in a single device
_wireless telephone gateway_ - ditto above, but also with telephone modem built-in​That said...

Your Apple AirPort Extreme is a high-quality *wireless router* and should take care of all your home network needs (with your Roamio Plus/Pro creating your MoCA network, and depending on the size of your residence when it comes to wireless coverage), but it will need to connect to a *cable modem* to establish Internet access.

You will also need *telephone modem* capability if subscribing to phone service via Cox.



Myztic said:


> Cox is coming to install on Tuesday next week.


Can you relate what they're slated to do when they come for the install?

Aside from...

connecting your service, 
activating your phone service (if applicable),
establishing Internet connectivity through your Apple AirPort Extreme, and
ensuring your Roamio Plus/Pro is capable of tuning all your subscribed channels plus COX On Demand (with any tuning adapter installed per COX's documentation, including installation of a MoCA filter on the input to the tuning adapter),
... the *MOST IMPORTANT thing* they'll need to do for you is insure that you have coax connectivity to and between any rooms you'll be looking to place your Roamio and Minis*, and that they install a MoCA "PoE" filter on their cable feed's point-of-entry to your residence.
* I'm assuming that the new place will not have any Ethernet connectivity built-in.​
With all the above checked-off, you should have a coax plant ready for the Minis to just drop-in and connect via MoCA -- once the MoCA network is created on the Roamio Plus/Pro.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

fcfc2 said:


> Ordinarily, I would not recommend such a combo modem, router and wireless AP type device like the Motorola SBG6782-AC Surfboard eXtreme Cable Modem (vendor site, Amazon), but in the interest of simplicity and because this has MoCA builtin, I would recommend you consider it especially to avoid Cox $20 monthly rental.


I'd be on board with the all-in-one combo device, even rented (as I recommended for my niece), if it weren't for (1) the OP having an AirPort Extreme (though we need confirmation on the version/generation), and (2) a Roamio Plus/Pro that can create their MoCA network. Given their existing gear, I'd hope that they could purchase the needed modem for a fraction of the cost of the above all-in-one, possibly even a combo cable Internet/telephony modem, if applicable.

For reference when shopping...
Cox Approved Cable Modems​... though apparently the list doesn't apply to Cox's "Gigablast" service. So, again, choice is dependent on which Internet package the OP has requested, or to which they might aspire: Starter, Essential, Preferred, Premier, or Ultimate. (Or Gigablast?)

Further, we probably need to get some more details on where the $20/month price tag for the modem/gateway rental is coming from. The pricing I'm seeing is:
Wi-Fi modem/gateway! (single band) - $7/mo
Wi-Fi modem/gateway! (dual band) - $10/mo
Cox service protection plan - $7/mo (? what is ?)​The modem-only rental (i.e. single band version, above, but configured for modem-only/bridge mode) is $7/mo, so that's the figure against which to compare the modem purchase price.

Critically, I'm not seeing any pricing for a telephone modem, just an optional one-time cost for an EMTA battery:
EMTA Battery - $29.99​


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

I'd opt for one of the following for your cable modem, if looking to avoid renting...

Arris SURFboard SB6183 ($90 @ Amazon) 
... good through Ultimate service plan (300/30 Mbps down/up) 
Arris SURFboard SB6141 (~$70 @ Amazon) 
... good through Premier service plan (150/10 Mbps down/up)

Cox chat personage said that Cox offers a simple modem for rental (i.e. an actual modem rather than a gateway-modem/router combo), but they couldn't tell me the cost because it's not available online, only in-store.

Also, Cox chatter indicates that they provide the telephone modem for free, with subscription to their telephone service.

Lastly, Barbara #2 indicates that the Pro Installation includes 3 TV outlets for $50, plus $25 per additional outlet. Internet Pro Installation was stated to be a separate $50.

.


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

Hey kaufman, 
Always with the details. The combo deal I suggested is good up to the "Premiere" level /100Mbps, my assumption, was that this was likely going to be good enough for the OP. 
We don't know a lot of the OP's information, but as far as I could find, Cox uses a combo modem / telephony unit, the Cisco DPQ3212, which is also a 8x4 unit. You would think they have some of the newer Gateway type 3 way units, but that was all I found on a quick search.
I also focused on MoCA from the source as there is also no information about the location and placement of the various internet and Tivos. I assumed some distance and the absence of a home with Ethernet runs installed. 
MoCA would seem to a solution which will work in most all situations.
The Time Capsule depending on version could be a super duper router, but still doesn't guaranty an easy Ethernet to Tivo connection. A MoCA adapter could be used if the Motorola combo I suggested is not an option and maybe the Time Capsule and the "Netgear"? might be an option.
There are almost an infinite amount of possibilities depending on the services and choices made by the OP. 
My suggestion was again based on the apparent knowledge and technical skill level of the OP. Perhaps, if and when we hear back from the OP on the internet speed tier and the telephony options we can narrow down the choices for her.
I tried to find out how Cox handles folks using their own modems with one of their telephony modems but came up empty. I saw none on their approved modems list, and from prior experience I know some ISP's don't charge rent for it when just using the phone.
Where that $20 modem rental fee comes from is another mystery? On a Gateway type of device, some companies charge extra to use the wifi part.
Time will tell....maybe.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

That's all I've got for now, short of suggesting that the OP (Myztic) perhaps try throwing together a network diagram (hand-scribbled or otherwise) to help them... and the Cox technician ... visualize all that needs to be done.

This recent diagram by TCFer kazak99 may provide some inspiration.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

fcfc2 said:


> The combo deal I suggested is good up to the "Premiere" level /100Mbps, my assumption, was that this was likely going to be good enough for the OP.
> 
> We don't know a lot of the OP's information, but as far as I could find, Cox uses a combo modem / telephony unit, the Cisco DPQ3212, which is also a 8x4 unit. You would think they have some of the newer Gateway type 3 way units, but that was all I found on a quick search.
> 
> ...


Yeah, understood. And I was making some assumptions, as well, based on the OP's current nearly-working setup with TWC: that is, that they would likely try setting everything up at the new place similar to how they have it currently:

AirPort Extreme wired to newly purchased cable modem
Roamio Plus/Pro Ethernet-connected to AirPort Extreme
cable company installs new cable lines to kids' rooms
etc
My main concern is the Cox technician establishing the coax plant needed for the TiVo Roamio/Mini whole home solution.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

fcfc2 said:


> Hi, Waiting to hear krkaufman's thoughts, but your thought may be economical at first,* but doesn't address the question of how to get connected to all of the Tivos *or how to "extend" the wireless to the weak or "dead" areas of the new home which the OP seems to be anticipating. If the OP's new home is completely wired for both Ethernet and coax, the options change, but most homes aren't wired with Ethernet. My suggestion was for the "whole" package, not necessarily the least expensive. The OP seems bright but with not very high tech skills.


Yeah, I wasn't really talking to the "network extension" question. More so to her keeping the TC in the loop. She has a Roamio Pro which has built in Moca so no need for that function in an all in one gateway, which indeed does take care of "the question of how to get connected to all of the Tivos". A standard modem like the 6141/6183 will suffice.

As to the extension question, she could get a moca adapter to place in the most effective place where a mini resides, or even a room with a mutually connected coax jack, then drop in an AP at that point, or less optimal would be to use a wifi repeater.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Oops.

As as side note, I just noticed that I've erroneously evolved the OP's Apple Time Capsule mentioned in her first post...


Myztic said:


> I am using my Mac time capsule as a modem and back up.


... to an AirPort Extreme:


krkaufman said:


> [*]Your Apple AirPort Extreme is a high-quality *wireless router* and should take care of all your home network needs
> ...
> establishing Internet connectivity through your Apple AirPort Extreme,
> ...


Looks like basically the same device, except the Time Capsule includes a built-in hard drive for TimeMachine backups. So, nothing to see here, move along...


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

HarperVision said:


> As to the extension question, she could get a moca adapter to place in the most effective place where a mini resides, or even a room with a mutually connected coax jack, then drop in an AP at that point, or less optimal would be to use a wifi repeater.


She can cross that bridge when she comes to it.

Sorry, had to say it.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

krkaufman said:


> She can cross that bridge when she comes to it.
> 
> Sorry, had to say it.


Yeah that was my thought too.


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

HarperVision said:


> She has a Roamio Pro which has built in Moca so no need for that function in an all in one gateway",


Except of course, unless the router and the Roamio are not conveniently located closely enough to easily connect by Ethernet. (More missing information) In that case, add the cost of an additional MoCA adapter and the issue of getting it installed correctly and working with the Tivos. Vs one box and "connect to MoCA network" and done.
The idea of the MoCA "network extenders" is the same idea, connect to coax and power up, yes it would be need to be configured, unless the default settings and SSID, pw's are Ok. They can be configured in time but are workable out of the gate. No additional MoCA adapters and figuring out how to manually configure a router to be an access point. KISS is the guiding principle here.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

HarperVision said:


> Yeah that was my thought too.


What I'm saying is... contemplating wireless extenders before the OP has been able to evaluate coverage by her Wireless-AC AirPort Time Capsule would be going a bridge too far.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

thump... thump... Is this thing on...?


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> I figure, if the installer isn't able to make my TiVo mini's work I will revert back to you guys


I would suggest that you might have the process reversed.

Your best chance of success, with the least pain, will likely come through getting a good understanding of all that needs to be done, through give-and-take with TCFers or other knowledgeable souls, and then using this information to ensure the Cox tech visit tackles everything needed.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

fcfc2 said:


> Except of course, unless the router and the Roamio are not conveniently located closely enough to easily connect by Ethernet. (More missing information) In that case, add the cost of an additional MoCA adapter and the issue of getting it installed correctly and working with the Tivos. Vs one box and "connect to MoCA network" and done. The idea of the MoCA "network extenders" is the same idea, connect to coax and power up, yes it would be need to be configured, unless the default settings and SSID, pw's are Ok. They can be configured in time but are workable out of the gate. No additional MoCA adapters and figuring out how to manually configure a router to be an access point. KISS is the guiding principle here.


Except you seem to be the one that's not "KISS". You're "what if'ing" this thing to death. She can have the Cox installer make sure they ARE co-located. 99% of moca TiVo installs are setup the way I'm saying to, but you're all "what if this" and "what if that". Listen to krkaufman saying that we will cross that bridge if and when it comes!



krkaufman said:


> What I'm saying is... contemplating wireless extenders before the OP has been able to evaluate coverage by her Wireless-AC AirPort Time Capsule would be going a bridge too far.


Exactly and Agreed. The reason I even mentioned that was because fcfc2 brought up extending her network, if needed.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

I wasn't really trying to take sides. I just couldn't resist the 'bridge' comments.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

krkaufman said:


> I wasn't really trying to take sides. I just couldn't resist the 'bridge' comments.


I know


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

Ok, 
Sorry gentlemen. It appears my speculation about the OP's needs conflicts with your speculation about the OP's needs. Certainly not worth arguing about, given all the unknowns. Perhaps if the OP ever returns and gives us an accurate picture of her circumstances, we will more likely agree on what to advise. Please have a good day.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Didn't mean to come across as piling on, there, fc. I was just in a mood for bad puns. As you said, we're basically in a possibly permanent holding pattern.


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

Last time that holding pattern lasted over 10 months.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

JoeKustra said:


> Last time that holding pattern lasted over 10 months.


Yeah, that thread was a case of hit and run, but I'm trusting that desperation and a tight timeline with Cox will improve the advice ROI. The OP has been infinitely more engaged in this thread than the previous, even if not as much as might be needed.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

So, with that in mind, a couple last offerings for the OP...

First, a diagram based on their Roamio Pro having Ethernet connectivity to the Apple Time Capsule, allowing the Roamio Pro to create their MoCA network (and assuming the Cox technician successfully connects the coax lines for a whole home coax network).








.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

And a diagram demo'ing use of a MoCA adapter to create the MoCA network...








... noting that the MoCA adapter/cable modem connection could optionally be a pass-through via the MoCA adapter's RF/TV out port, if applicable to the MoCA adapter used. (Though some prefer to always use a splitter, if only to avoid issues associated with powering-down the MoCA adapter.) To be clear, in no case can the Roamio Pro be fed via the tuning adapter's RF/TV Out port, as the tuning adapter does not pass MoCA signals through this port.

Also, given the OP's TiVo devices are the Roamio Plus/Pro and Minis, the MoCA adapter would only need be MoCA 1.1, though a MoCA 2.0 adapter could certainly be used (especially if looking to use multiple MoCA adapters to extend wireless coverage in the house).

.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

Hi guys sorry for the late update.
While I am moving house I have also started working at a new place that is an hour and a half commute each way (hence the move, to relieve myself of the drive). By the time I get home I forget anything else I need to do and just go to bed!

But anyway, here is an update
I am going to discuss here my current set up so you know what I was faced with at this residence (moving to the new residence on Tuesday)
This is what was connected to the plug coming out of the wall









Which was then connected to the arris here (model number is in a previous post)

















Then there was a cable connected from the arris to the Roamio and another one that went from the arris to the time capsule.
















I had the choice of connecting to two networks on wifi on my cell phone and more often connected to the time capsule because it gave me better speeds. This whole set up is in my living room all in close proximity to each other.

The mini however, is in a bedroom. I tried setting up the Roamio as a moca (as a previous poster requested) but it still didn't work on the mini.
The only way the mini worked was through an Ethernet cable.

I also take a while to respond because frankly what may seem as common sense to you is actually really confusing to me so I have to really sit and mentally try to understand it. I always think I'm gonna ask my husband to have a look and with our new work place being so far it just seems to not get done considering we are not going to need the current set up and banking on the hope that the new cox installer will know what he is doing.

My brother who currently lives in the same apartment building as me has a similar set up except he is using a bolt.... And it all works seamlessly with a very similar set up (different arris modem though)

Could there be something wrong with my TiVo Roamio that is not making moca work? Should I follow up with TiVo? Or is there something wrong in my connections.

I purchased the cable modem that was referred to above (the one for 90 dollars) for the new place.

I know that the pictures above are very dark... If you need to see different pictures, the back and whats connected, or anything else I will find a flashlight and retake pictures. Since its the weekend, I will be able to do this all faster.

Thanks again for the help.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

osu1991 said:


> I would take the Time Capsule out of the equation and connect the Roamio ethernet cable to the Arris Modem/Router
> 
> Unless you are getting telephone service from Cox too, I would just go buy an Arris cable modem from Walmart or Amazon instead of renting one of the combo modem/routers from Cox. Something like the Arris SB 6183 or 6141. I use them at both homes in Nevada and Oklahoma with Cox and Tivos w/Minis on moca.


I purchased this one from amazon: ARRIS SURFboard SB6183 DOCSIS 3.0 Cable Modem
I am getting phone, cable, internet from Cox. Will this modem be able to do that? I really do need the telephone line..


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

Myztic said:


> I purchased this one from amazon: ARRIS SURFboard SB6183 DOCSIS 3.0 Cable Modem
> I am getting phone, cable, internet from Cox. Will this modem be able to do that? I really do need the telephone line..


Return the 6183 modem you won't need it.

If you have phone service with Cox you will have to use their Modem and they don't charge you for it with phone service. It will simplify your setup as the Cox telephony modem will connect to your time capsule via ethernet


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

This is what is connected to my Arris









This is what is connected into my TIVO Roamio









And this is the box that has a light that says Messages next to it (Think this is for the telephone)


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

On the phone with cox and they said that I need to use their telephone modem which i have to pay a rental fee for. They said this is not free. It is a rental. I asked if i could purchase my own. They said it would be too hard to find.

Rental on their modem is $6.99 a month. 
I suppose I am just going to have to go with it.

Edit: Now they say its free....


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

The pics help. Thanks. Reviewing...


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> On the phone with cox and they said that I need to use their telephone modem which i have to pay a rental fee for. They said this is not free. It is a rental. I asked if i could purchase my own. They said it would be too hard to find.
> 
> Rental on their modem is $6.99 a month.
> I suppose I am just going to have to go with it.
> ...


Good!! I was getting mildly annoyed that my Barbara's would have misled me.


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

krkaufman said:


> Myztic, the picture of your Roamio indicates to me that there's a device not pictured, a tuning adapter (required by TWC & Cox for tuning what are called Switched Digital Video [SDV] channels, without going into it).
> 
> What makes me think this is that gray cable to the left of the HDMI cable. Looking at the back panel image of a Roamio Pro, that gray cable is connected to the Roamio's USB port, where a tuning adapter would be connected for communication between the two devices.
> 
> ...


The tuning adapter is shown sitting on top of her Roamio in one of the photos.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

osu1991 said:


> The tuning adapter is shown sitting on top of her Roamio in one of the photos.


Heh, yeah, I just realized that. (thanks)


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

Yes I did post a picture with it in, but here is more detailed pictures of the tuning adapter:


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic, from what I can tell from your pics, it looks like your tuning adapter and Roamio Pro are improperly connected for a MoCA environment. It *looks* like the coax from the tuning adapter's coax out is being fed directly to the Roamio Pro; this will prevent MoCA from reaching/leaving the Roamio Pro.







See the following info, which applies to both Cox *and* TWC:


krkaufman said:


> ... tuning adapter installed per COX's documentation, including installation of a MoCA filter on the input to the tuning adapter


This at least solves one reason you couldn't ever get MoCA to work with your Roamio Pro (though I'm also curious if that amp would block MoCA). You could try rewiring your tuning adapter and Roamio Pro as a test, per the above Cox documentation, with a splitter and a couple short lengths of coax, and it might be enough to get MoCA working.

p.s. If your local TWC office is open, they should give you some splitters, coax and PoE MoCA filters, to help make this work.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

So I need to purchase a splitter and a coax cable? Can you send me links to these products on Amazon so I can purchase the correct ones


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> So I need to purchase a splitter and a coax cable? Can you send me links to these products on Amazon so I can purchase the correct ones


Just post-posted above...
If your local TWC office is open, they should give you some splitters, coax and PoE MoCA filters, to help make this work.​.... and your Cox technician should bring what's needed to make that install work, though I'd recommend printing out the overall plan *and* the Cox tuning adapter install instructions, so you can make sure the tech is on the same page.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Note that even if you properly rewired the tuning adapter and the Roamio Pro, it is possible that your current Antronix amplifier may be an impediment to MoCA traffic. I haven't yet been able to find any commentary providing a thumbs up or down relative to MoCA passing through this amp, so the only way to know may be to just rewire the TA & TiVo and hope for the best.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

I just printed those documents out to give my Cox Installer.
He is now coming on Wednesday not Tuesday (as per a mess up in cox scheduling.)

Since I will be moving on Tuesday anyway, i dont think it will be worth me going to Time Warner Cable and getting the splitter and cable. I think it would be better for me to wait for the Cox installer and if it doesn't work again, re-assess what the issue is.

Is that ok with you guys? I know you are helping me and making an effort to help me with my current set up too.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

osu1991 said:


> Return the 6183 modem you won't need it.
> 
> If you have phone service with Cox you will have to use their Modem and they don't charge you for it with phone service. It will simplify your setup as the Cox telephony modem will connect to your time capsule via ethernet


If true, that'd definitely be a plus, so long as the telephony modem is capable of supporting the speed of whatever Internet plan you're signing up for.

It wouldn't hurt to keep the SB6183 around, for now, should you find you need it come the day of the install.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> Since I will be moving on Tuesday anyway, i dont think it will be worth me going to Time Warner Cable and getting the splitter and cable. I think it would be better for me to wait for the Cox installer and if it doesn't work again, re-assess what the issue is.
> 
> Is that ok with you guys? I know you are helping me and making an effort to help me with my current set up too.


Makes sense to me; too little return for the effort. And trust me, that tuning adapter, as connected, would have blocked your Roamio Pro from doing MoCA, so the mystery is solved, at least for me. Properly wired you'll be fine.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> Could there be something wrong with my TiVo Roamio that is not making moca work? Should I follow up with TiVo? Or is there something wrong in my connections.


This was really the objective of reviewing your current TWC setup, and I'm confident the tuning adapter connection was the root of your MoCA issue. (h/t JoeStan)

(The amp may have been the next roadblock to address, but you hopefully won't have to deal with an amp at your next home.)


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

krkaufman said:


> If true, that'd definitely be a plus, so long as the telephony modem is capable of supporting the speed of whatever Internet plan you're signing up for.
> 
> It wouldn't hurt to keep the SB6183 around, for now, should you find you need it come the day of the install.


It's true. I have that setup with Cox phone service in our Las Vegas condo, as the security guards at the gates can't make a long distance call to my Oklahoma cell phone, when someone arrives, so I needed phone service there. It should support up to 300Mb Ultimate Internet. I know it at least supports 150Mb Premier as that's what I have.

As with all providers, Cox installers vary, so keep an eye on the work. Having the pdf instructions ready helps. I've had 5 Cox TV installs done the past year for myself and family. 1 in Vegas and 4 in Tulsa. I self installed mine, but the other 4 Cox did and only 1 followed the install pdf.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

You guys rock!

Mystic, Just remember to tell the Cox tech to put your internet modem/wifi router/phone gateway into bridge mode so you can properly use your time capsule. This will preserve your phone capabilities and make the Internet side of things into a basic modem, just like the Arris SB6183 you bought, which you could then return once it's all up and running properly.

krk, I believe that the amp would be on the outside of her coax network (between the wall and the first splitter at her home run area), so therefore shouldn't effect moca within the home.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

HarperVision said:


> Mystic, Just remember to tell the Cox tech to put your internet modem/wifi router/phone gateway into bridge mode so you can properly use your time capsule. This will preserve your phone capabilities and make the Internet side of things into a basic modem, just like the Arris SB6183 you bought, which you could then return once it's all up and running properly.


Your Time Capsule may require some tweaks, as well, depending on how it is currently configured on your TWC network, but that'll be trivial in the scheme of things.

Here's an updated diagram, taking osu1991's modem insight into account (with fingers crossed).

Both diagrams are provided as a guide, trying to demonstrate the connectivity needed to ensure a whole home MoCA network for your TiVo devices. (The connectivity of the tuning adapter and Roamio Pro is non-negotiable. The combo cable/phone modem _may_ require its own MoCA filter, but will be dependent on the specific model used.)








.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

Great diagrams (I don't know where you find the time!), but I think MSOs like to split the cable modem and TV signals first, then do any additional splits needed for TV after the initial split.

Also, maybe it'd help her to show WAN and LAN ethernet connections to the TC and Roamio with additional color codes?


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

HarperVision said:


> ... I think MSOs like to split the cable modem and TV signals first, then do any additional splits needed for TV after the initial split.


Yeah, that's why I qualified the diagrams as a "guide" in the previous post. (edit: And why I'd left the actual coax-to-coax connections out of previous diagrams.) So long as the runs connect somewhere, sans MoCA roadblocks, and with a PoE MoCA filter...



> Also, maybe it'd help her to show WAN and LAN ethernet connections to the TC and Roamio with additional color codes?


I often do, but the OP seemed to have a handle on that. Plus, there's only one way to connect 'em to make it work; if the Cox tech can't get that right, there's little chance more detail in the diagram will matter.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic, if you're moving into another apartment building or other "multi-dwelling building," you may also want to print that page from the Cisco MoCA install & troubleshooting guide, demonstrating how to properly isolate each residence's coax network:

see: Proper coax wiring for multi-dwelling buildings


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

osu1991 said:


> krkaufman said:
> 
> 
> > osu1991 said:
> ...


Informative *TWC* support page, *here*, regarding telephone modems offered and their associated maximum Internet speeds supported. For example:
ARRIS TG1672G - Approved for Internet plans with download speeds of up to 300Mbps.
ARRIS TG862G - Approved for Internet plans with download speeds of up to 100Mbps.
ARRIS TM402G - Approved for Internet plans with download speeds of up to 15Mbps.​I haven't yet found a similar page for Cox, so you'll just have to see what modem the Cox tech brings -- and test it to determine if it's delivering your spec'd speeds. (see: http://speedtest.net)


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

Thanks everyone
Will be moving into a house. I cancelled the arris 6183 modem so that it didn't charge my card. Hopefully it all works out ok. Will definitely give these diagrams to the person installing. &#128077;&#127995;&#128077;&#127995;


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

krkaufman said:


> Informative *TWC* support page, *here*, regarding telephone modems offered and their associated maximum Internet speeds supported. For example:
> ARRIS TG1672G - Approved for Internet plans with download speeds of up to 300Mbps.
> ARRIS TG862G - Approved for Internet plans with download speeds of up to 100Mbps.
> ARRIS TM402G - Approved for Internet plans with download speeds of up to 15Mbps.​I haven't yet found a similar page for Cox, so you'll just have to see what modem the Cox tech brings -- and test it to determine if it's delivering your spec'd speeds. (see: http://speedtest.net)


I'm probably wrong, but would assume cox uses the same modem nationwide for voice service. I'm not in Las Vegas to look at the model number but it was a Cisco modem.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

osu1991 said:


> I'm probably wrong, but would assume cox uses the same modem nationwide for voice service. I'm not in Las Vegas to look at the model number but it was a Cisco modem.


Oh, to be clear, the above was just a sampling of the modems from the TWC page, from the ARRIS tab; I was just trying to show the differing max Internet download speeds between models. There's a Cisco/Scientific Atlanta tab, too, though I hope Cox uses some other Cisco phone modem than those shown, as none of the 4 Cisco models listed *by TWC* rated better than 15 Mbps download.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

I had a look at my brothers set up (in the same building) although he is using a TiVo bolt with his mini's and his connections are the same as mine. That grey plug is connected from the tuning adapter into the TiVo bolt (although the plug is white in color instead of grey. That means I could possibly have a problem with my Roamio?


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> I had a look at my brothers set up (in the same building) although he is using a TiVo bolt with his mini's and his connections are the same as mine. That grey plug is connected from the tuning adapter into the TiVo bolt (although the plug is white in color instead of grey. That means I could possibly have a problem with my Roamio?


No, that cable (gray in your case, white in your brother's) is the USB connection between your TiVo DVR and your tuning adapter, allowing the TiVo to tell the tuning adapter which channel the TiVo is looking to tune.

You'd want to check the coax connections between your brother's tuning adapter and his BOLT, not the USB connection, to research why his setup is allowing the BOLT to create his MoCA network. Take a picture and attach it here, if he permits.  I expect we'd see that his BOLT's coax is NOT being fed from the tuning adapter's TV/RF Out.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

Wanted to update. The cox tech came out today (Wednesday) and he started my service.
He didn't bother at all with my TiVo mini's and didn't care to help at all.
Luckily, however he wired the system worked well because I was able to get my mini's to work.
My time capsule isn't connected at all so I'll need to figure out how to still use it for backups.

Also, my wifi speed is 50 rather then the 150 I'm paying for.
He suggested I change to an asus dual band router as my speeds will be much higher. Considering that but scared to mess with this current working system.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

Myztic said:


> Wanted to update. The cox tech came out today (Wednesday) and he started my service. He didn't bother at all with my TiVo mini's and didn't care to help at all. Luckily, however he wired the system worked well because I was able to get my mini's to work. My time capsule isn't connected at all so I'll need to figure out how to still use it for backups. Also, my wifi speed is 50 rather then the 150 I'm paying for. He suggested I change to an asus dual band router as my speeds will be much higher. Considering that but scared to mess with this current working system.


Good to hear that you're up and going, especially with your minis. What are you using for a wifi source if your time capsule isn't hooked up? Did they install a gateway that's the modem and wifi router combined? If so, what's the make and model number? He's BSing you about the 50Mbps. It's either you're not provisioned correctly for the speed tier you pay for, or that gateway is a crappy wifi router, which is more likely. This means you should try to get your time capsule up and running as soon as you can. Have you tried connecting a PC or laptop to the gateway and doing a speed test via wired Ethernet to see if you can get 150Mbps that way?

As mentioned previously, you can go about it two ways. Either configure your gateway in bridge mode to act as a modem only, or configure your time capsule in AP mode so it doesn't try to assign IP addresses to things that connect to it (the gateway will do this instead). I'm not sure what happens to its HDD backup function if you set it in AP mode though, so you probably want to find out. Maybe if you have an Apple Store nearby you can pop in and ask them for advice on different ways to configure a time capsule.


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

Mystic,
To determine if you are properly provisioned for your 150Mbps connection, you can test right now by just connecting a computer or laptop to one of the gateway's Ethernet ports and running a couple speed tests, you should get close or a bit over the 150Mbps. If you still are only getting 50Mbps, call Cox, you are not provisioned correctly or your gateway is malfunctioning.
If it is important to use the Time Capsule because of it's backup/storage function, the easiest way, is to have that combo gateway put in "bridge mode". This will convert it to a basic cable modem with telephony and then you would leave the Time Capsule in it's router mode. The connection from the then "bridged" gateway would be with an Ethernet cable, usually from the #1 LAN port on the gateway to the "WAN" or "internet" port on your Time Capsule. 
Once powered up you can check the wireless from the Time Capsule and see how it compares to the wireless signal from Cox's gateway. Hopefully it will be both faster and stronger. You will have most likely have to reboot all of your Tivos after the change of routers to get them connected to the internet and each other. Just pull their plugs for a few seconds and plug back in. After a few minutes and the Tivos have completely rebooted, check them for functionality, hopefully they will have picked up their new IP's and be working fine.
If you get this far and are successful, check the wireless speeds about your home to see if you have any weak or dead spots. If so, since you are using MoCA for your Tivos, you already have an established MoCA network and can use a MoCA based wireless "network extender" in or near by any "dead" spot(s) via a splitter and a short length of coax.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

HarperVision said:


> Did they install a gateway that's the modem and wifi router combined? If so, what's the make and model number?


I'd recommend identifying and posting the brand and model number of the device(s) supplied by Cox as step #1. I wouldn't find it surprising that the freebie modem/gateway provided by Cox wouldn't have great wireless coverage, given they charge $7/month for a single-band (2.4GHz only) wireless gateway. I just hope it's capable of delivering your spec'd speed via a wired connection.

As mentioned above, you'll want to test both wired and wireless connectivity, and note your distance from the wireless base station when reporting wireless speeds. The further you are from the wireless antenna the slower you can expect your connection rate to be.


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

If your cable company says you need to upgrade your cable modem to a certain model to get 150 Mbs, they are almost certainly correct. The cable modem must support DOCSIS 3.1 and the cable company must specifically enable the channel bonding facility for the cable modem.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

ej42137 said:


> If your cable company says you need to upgrade your cable modem to a certain model to get 150 Mbs, they are almost certainly correct. The cable modem must support DOCSIS 3.1 and the cable company must specifically enable the channel bonding facility for the cable modem.


Agreed, but if the customer is paying for their 150Mbps plan, AND renting their modem/gateway, as is Myztic's case, then the MSO should be ensuring that they gave the customer a modem/gateway that supports the speeds they're paying for, no?


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

ej42137 said:


> If your cable company says you need to upgrade your cable modem to a certain model to get 150 Mbs, they are almost certainly correct. The cable modem must support DOCSIS 3.1 and the cable company must specifically enable the channel bonding facility for the cable modem.


Hi,
I don't know if it is a typo or not, but DOCSIS *3.1* equipment is really not past the trials yet. Did you mean DOCSIS 3.0 perhaps. Here is a list of their supported modems.
http://www.cox.com/residential/supp...rticleId=b2ec95d0-7ef9-11df-5590-000000000000
Their internet tiers seem to be 50/100/200 Mbps, I didn't see any mention of a 150Mbps tier.
The number of "channels" a modem has is the operational divide for what speed tiers most cable companies will support. Most still support an 8x4 modem up to 100Mbps but no higher even though the manufacturers give a theoretical max over 300Mbps. Most cable companies find it easier and more stable to deliver the higher speeds by using a much higher number of channels. To that end, if you are planning on being able to access the higher speed tiers, look for a DOCSIS 3.0 modem with at least 16x4. There are also versions with 24x4 and even a 32x8 or wait until the DOCSIS 3.1 equipment has started to be used, but that could easily be another year or more.


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

Cox bumped the 100 tier up to 150 last month.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

Well when the installer was installing and we tested the line it was 150mbps... but he couldn't seem to get it working with my apple time capsule. we tried the time capsule but weren't getting an internet connection and he just said sorry the whole set up is not working. He didn't seem keen to actually get me up and running. I mentioned to him that we should use their modem since it was supposed to be free. He really wasn't that interested in installing and definitely didn't want to install the way I wanted to be installed. At some stage I thought that he was mentally unstable and decided not to argue with him as he was in my home. He then installed using Cox's modem and was able to get it working. I asked him why i had so few channels and no kids tv channels.He informed me that I have the worst TV package and that I would only have like 50 channels. I then picked up the phone and called Cox Customer Care. I was stressed out that I had paid for a very expensive package and that I was being cheated. He also informed me that I would only receive 50mbps because I have a weak modem (although the best of their weak modems) and that I shouldn't receive more than 50mbps on my connections. I asked cox customer care and they said they can't understand why the technicians is saying these things because she confirmed with the supervisor that I am supposed to get 150mbps. The tech also said I should be receiving a few more channels once my Tivo is running for a few hours.

It was pretty miserable dealing with this guy so I don't know how to get my time capsule wired here at all... and it is true that when I do a speedtest I am getting 40mbps (on a wireless connection).

Should I purchase the modem this guy recommended? Asus? I had a faster connection speed previously when my time capsule was in there. (The Time warner cable modem was pretty bad too.) I like to use my time capsule for backups too because its an automatic back up. 
If it would increase my speed I definitely don't mind purchasing the Asus he recommends.

Here are pictures of his configuration

































So I assume that the modem is the Cisco DCP3825
and that the router is the Cisco DPQ3212

I am just trying to understand all the terminology so that I can make adjustments where you recommend them.

The cox internet plan is the Premier package so i should be getting 150 mbps internet.


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## Myztic (Oct 5, 2015)

I just connected my Time Capsule to the Cisco DCP3825 and my wifi speed went to 90mbps. That would be a problem though because I now have two wifis available and you guys said that isn't a good situation.


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

Myztic said:


> I just connected my Time Capsule to the Cisco DCP3825 and my wifi speed went to 90mbps. That would be a problem though because I now have two wifis available and you guys said that isn't a good situation.


It's probably not my solution. The DCP3825 is a modem and wireless router combination. Personally I use an Arris SB6183 and a router. The router is a personal thing, so I hesitate to make suggestions.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> Should I purchase the modem this guy recommended? Asus? ... If it would increase my speed I definitely don't mind purchasing the Asus he recommends.


First, discard anything the tech said regarding the ASUS. It is just a wireless router, the same as your Time Capsule.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic, do you have a laptop or PC that you can connect via an Ethernet cable to the Cisco device or Time Capsule. If so, you should do so and run a speed test to determine what it reports for your wired Internet speed. (Note that the laptop would need to have a Gigabit Ethernet port in order to hit your spec'd speed.)

Since you're not renting either wireless modem/gateway from Cox (single- or dual-band, for $7 or $10, respectively), Cox is only responsible for ensuring that they've provided you with the ability to get 150 Mbps via a wired connection.

Try a fully-wired speed test, and report back, when you can.

http://speedtest.net


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

Hi,
Good pictures, you now have 2 gateways, the one with the telephony, and the other with a single band wireless. 
Not sure why the installer had such a problem with the Time Capsule, barring a bad Ethernet port on it. 
If you are willing to try your TC again, you might first try just powering it on, give it a minute or 2 and then look for a tiny hole down towards the bottom near all the Ethernet ports, use a toothpick or paper clip and insert it in the "reset" hole and hold it in for a 5-10 count and then release it. Let alone for another couple of minutes until any lights stop blinking, and then unplug it.
Next, connect an Ethernet cable from the unit with the telephone line, it has a nice yellow port on it, and connect the other end of the cable to the WAN or "internet" port on your TC and then power it on. After a few more minutes, try to see if you have internet access from your TC, either wired or wireless. Your wireless settings on the TC will be back to the default now though.
If you are lucky, your TC should now be back in business and you can return that 2nd gateway. If not, let us know.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Myztic said:


> So I assume that the modem is the Cisco DPC3825
> and that the router is the Cisco DPQ3212


Thanks for the pics.

Can you provide a pic of what's connected to the back of the DPQ3212?

Also, can you tell how all the coax lines are wired together, and then back to the wall? An image of the back of the Roamio and tuning adapter would be handy, as well.

The good news is... even with that jumble of coax, they appear to have wired your Roamio and tuning adapter, and your rooms, correctly, such that your MoCA network is working. Getting your modem & router properly setup should be a breeze relative to having to deal with coax wiring issues that may be hidden behind walls or other inaccessible locations.

'Gist: your glass is half full.


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

The DPQ 3212 is the only modem needed for voice/data. As fcfc2 stated above reset the TC and then go from the yellow ethernet port on the back of the DPQ3212 straight to the input on the TC.

The DPC 3825 is not needed. I would check to make sure you are not being charged a rental fee on the DPC 3825. Cox usually rents those, unless purchased. It's the DPQ3212 that provides the phone and internet service that Cox does NOT charge a rental on if you have phone service.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

*DPC3825 ::* DOCSIS 3.0 8x4 cable modem/wireless router (gateway)

Cox support page
User guide

A combo cable modem/wireless router (a.k.a. wireless cable gateway)
Gigabit Ethernet interface (x4)
Max WAN connection rate ???
Single-band 2.4 GHz 802.11n wireless (moot; will be disabled in favor of Time Capsule)
Curiously, Cox lists this device as only compatible with their Starter and Essential Internet packages. (link)​*DPQ3212 ::* DOCSIS 3.0 8x4 cable/telephony modem (only! no wireless, no router)

Cox support page
User guide

A basic telephone/Internet cable modem (i.e. no router or wireless functionality; just a modem)
Gigabit Ethernet interface (x1)
Max WAN connection rate ???
Telephone jacks (obviously)
Cox chat support indicates this modem is only recommended for Starter or Essential tiers; *they recommend (require?) a 16x4 device for the Premier tier -- and they specifically recommended the SB6183. *​
SO...

*Long-term...* you'll be keeping the DPQ3212 as your telephone modem, but you're going to want to get a SB6183 installed as your Internet cable modem -- using your Time Capsule as your wireless router.

*Short-term...* you could re-wire your setup to remove the DPC3825 entirely and use the DPQ3212 as both your Internet and telephone modem, connecting the DPQ3212 to your Time Capsule as your wireless router. (This would be an especially worthwhile thing to do, on the off-chance that the DPQ3212 is capable of delivering your 150 Mbps download rates.)

You'd need to contact Cox tech support via telephone to have them properly configure the DPQ3212 for telephone *and* Internet. But it should be a fairly straightforward call. (NOTE: Though a phone call you'll likely want to make from a CELL PHONE!)


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

krkaufman said:


> SO...
> 
> Long-term... you'll be keeping the DPQ3212 as your telephone modem, but you're going to want to get a SB6183 installed as your Internet cable modem -- using your Time Capsule as your wireless router.
> 
> ...


Interesting, on that last paragraph, I wonder if the reason the tech couldn't get the Time Capsule working is because it was only configured for telephone....only other thought is that I am confident in Arris/Motorola, I have read a number of issues on that new unit, all heat related, some reports of even melting the case. I would also consider the Netgear CM500(16x4) or their CM600(24x8) if you want to be more future proof, almost all good reviews.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

fcfc2 said:


> ... only other thought is that I am confident in Arris/Motorola, I have read a number of issues on that new unit, all heat related, some reports of even melting the case.


Yikes!! What model is that, with the melting?


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

fcfc2 said:


> Interesting, on that last paragraph, I wonder if the reason the tech couldn't get the Time Capsule working is because it was only configured for telephone...


I wouldn't venture a guess as to why that tech couldn't get the job done. It seems a fairly straightforward process, and should be simplistic for any tech.

As for my comment above, I am simply assuming that Cox would need to provision the DPQ3212 for Myztic's Internet service, especially since the DPC3825 is probably currently configured as their cable modem.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

If you can access your Time Capsule using the AirPort Utility from a Mac, you may be able to easily reconfigure it as your main router...


> In a nutshell, your Time Capsule can be configured as a router ... On the TC that's done on the Network tab of the AirPort utility, set Router Mode typically to "DHCP and NAT" (to use it as a router) ...
> 
> The other thing to check is the Internet tab in the AirPort utility, normally you set Connect Using to "DHCP" but there can be exceptions. (link)


However, if you need to reset your Time Capsule, here's some words of warning from another forum (link) in regards to preserving any past Time Machine backups ...


> Ok, you'll need to reset the Time Capsule then. Hopefully you remember the password you used to protect its configuration, if you don't re-use the password you had before, you will have to do yet another first-time backup after erasing the Time Capsule hard drive. If you have forgotten this password, you may be able to look in your Keychain Access application (only on Macs) for an item with kind "AirPort base station password." Double-click on this item, then under Attributes, click on the checkbox next to Show password and provide your computer password. You will now see the password you'll be re-using shortly. (link)


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

For clarity, see below for how your DPQ3212 should be connected to your Time Capsule and Roamio Plus.


Rewire your setup:
Power off the DPC3825.
Reconnect the other devices per the attached drawing.

Use the AirPort Utility to configure the Time Capsule as your router. (Or, worst case, reset the Time Capsule, taking note of the previous warning regarding the Time Capsule hard drive.)
Contact Cox to provision the DPQ3212 as your telephone *and* Internet modem.
Possibly reboot the Time Capsule.
Check basic connectivity, perhaps pray a little, hopefully run a speed test...


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Apart from rewiring your network, I'm curious about the picture provided of the tuning adapter. It appears to have a coax cable connected to its RF/TV Out port.

Can you tell where this coax line connects?


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