# Stargirl - Full season thread *spoilers*



## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

I'm surprised there's no season thread for this show. I like it so far and am happy that Cortney has started to recruit others. I was initially concerned about a lone teenager going against adult male villains but it looks like the mean girl from school might become a bad guy too.

My only significant complaint with the show is with Courtney's step-brother. I hate that obnoxious kid.


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## mlsnyc (Dec 3, 2009)

I'm enjoying this show, too. I haven't watched CW shows since the early days of Supernatural, so I kinda developed a preconception that the channel's shows aren't for me. But I tried this out because of Luke Wilson, Amy Smart, and Joel McHale (though it turns out it's only a cameo by him, so far). Good thing for me that I did.

I feel bad for Yolanda. Especially with how her parents are treating her. Happy she's finally standing up for herself and helping rebuild the JLA JSA.

Edit: It's JSA, not JLA. My bad.


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## gossamer88 (Jul 27, 2005)

cheesesteak said:


> My only significant complaint with the show is with Courtney's step-brother. I hate that obnoxious kid.


Haha! I like him...but agree he is obnoxious!

I'm really liking this show and this week with recruiting Yolanda as Wildcat. And also showed why she's the way she is. Man her parents are brutal!


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

gossamer88 said:


> Haha! I like him...but agree he is obnoxious!
> 
> I'm really liking this show and this week with recruiting Yolanda as Wildcat. And also showed why she's the way she is. Man her parents are brutal!


I fully expected Yolanda's parents to crack and forgive her. Boy, was I surprised. She and Mike should switch families. He needs discipline and she needs freedom.


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## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

It looks like she's going to recruit the other two outcasts as well. So a bunch of teenagers with little experience are going to go up against the group of villains who defeated the JSA? Based on the first episode, it seemed like the ISA won rather easily.


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## Ereth (Jun 16, 2000)

It wouldn't be a heros journey if the obstacles were easy, now would it?


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## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

cheesesteak said:


> I'm surprised there's no season thread for this show. I like it so far and am happy that Cortney has started to recruit others. I was initially concerned about a lone teenager going against adult male villains but it looks like the mean girl from school might become a bad guy too.
> 
> My only significant complaint with the show is with Courtney's step-brother. I hate that obnoxious kid.


Somehow I see him ending up with the Thunderbolt pen.


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## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

KungFuCow said:


> Somehow I see him ending up with the Thunderbolt pen.


I hadn't thought of that, but it makes some sense. They've given the kid a rather prominent role, plus they've made a big deal about the pen, so maybe.

The guy outcast's last name is Tyler and his back story matches what Pat told Courtney about Hourman, so I'm guessing he'll inherit the hourglass.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

His name is Rick Tyler and Pat has already stated that Hourman's name was Rex Tyler.



Spoiler: And in the comics



Plus I've read Infinity Inc and Justice Society and I know that Rick Tyler was the son of Rex Tyler.

As for the Thunderbolt pen, remember that Mike has already mentioned his friend Jakeem.



I'm quite enjoying the show and I'm glad that they didn't take the easy way out with Yolanda's parents.


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

I'm really enjoying this show as well.

Question for all of you, where are you watching this show?

If you are watching it on The CW you are getting an edited version of the show. Episodes have been edited to fit into The CW's 43 minute format for hour long programs. So about 10 minutes per episode is being cut. 

The longer version of each episode is available in HD on the iTunes store or 4K HDR on DC Universe.

The CW version of the show has cut an entire 4 minute scene with the injustice society in one episode I noticed. So some of the plot is missing on The CW.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

I'm watching on DC Universe when I remember it shows up there a day earlier.


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## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

I've been looking forward to this show ever since it was announced for the DCU streaming service. I've enjoyed all of their live action shows so far. Stargirl is definitely a family oriented show, unlike the R-rated versions of Doom Patrol and Titans. It looks like the new JSA is going to end up being another bunch of teens like Titans, except that these teens are inexperienced and clueless. If none of them end up getting killed it will be a miracle.

There's one thing that bugs me about costumes like they did with Wildcat's costume and Yolanda. The writers and CGI folks like to take shortcuts and have superhero costumes morph into one size fits all or just suddenly envelope a person so they're ready for action. It's a cheap gimmick that they use over and over again. I keep expecting to see Harry Potter to pop up in the background waving his wand and singing Bippity-Boppity-Boo.


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## mlsnyc (Dec 3, 2009)

I’m watching on CW. I don’t have DCU. I like it but not enough to pay for the full episodes a la carte.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

LoREvanescence said:


> If you are watching it on The CW you are getting an edited version of the show. Episodes have been edited to fit into The CW's 43 minute format for hour long programs. So about 10 minutes per episode is being cut.


Only for the first two episodes. The last two were much shorter...it's possible they didn't have to cut anything at all.

Which, of course, says nothing about future episodes...on DCU they're able to just let each episode find its own length.


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## JolDC (Dec 21, 2001)

Shakhari said:


> I hadn't thought of that, but it makes some sense. They've given the kid a rather prominent role, plus they've made a big deal about the pen, so maybe.


He specifically mentioned his friend Jakeem this episode and that name ties directly to the pen in the greater DCU. So maybe he will be pen adjacent.


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## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

I really hope they are going to do something interesting with Beth to make her a decent Dr Midnight. Right now she is Dr Annoying.


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

Interesting that they chose to avoid the whole Miraclo/drug addiction thing with Hour Man...I curious to see what they're going to do with Green Lantern. The Alan Scott Silver Age /JSA version had significant differences from Hal Jordan and later versions. 

In particular, there were no Guardians, no Green Lantern Corps and instead of using will power to manifest energy forcefields, Alan Scott's ring gave him mystical tracking, the ability to walk through walls, and invulnerability to anything except for wood.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Amnesia said:


> Interesting that they chose to avoid the whole Miraclo/drug addiction thing with Hour Man...


I guess popping Miraclo pills isn't a good look for high schoolers.
(IIRC, Roy Thomas did do a storyline dealing with the fact that Miraclo had addictive properties and their effect on Rex Tyler.)



Amnesia said:


> I curious to see what they're going to do with Green Lantern. The Alan Scott Silver Age /JSA version had significant differences from Hal Jordan and later versions.
> 
> In particular, there were no Guardians, no Green Lantern Corps and instead of using will power to manifest energy forcefields, Alan Scott's ring gave him mystical tracking, the ability to walk through walls, and invulnerability to anything except for wood.


Huh?
What are you talking about?
Alan Scott's Power Ring pretty much had the same functionally as Hal's and the rest of the Guardian issued ones.
(In fact, there's at least one instance of Hal and Alan switching rings and another of them linking them together to cancel out each other's weakness.)



Spoiler: in the comics



At least until Alan absorbed the Green Flame. The "Earth 2" version operated a little differently but not that differently.



I am a little surprised that they're going to keep the World War II aspects of the Justice Society.
According to the AI Chuck, Charles McNider was born in 1914.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

I've never been a big fan of superhero origin stories since they take up so much time of the first season/first movie. I know nothing about the JSA so I have no idea how many more new members (along with their origin stories) Courtney needs to recruit but I hope it's not too many more and the bad guy butt kicking commences soon.

I thought Yolanda was on super-duper lock down yet she seems to be out and about quite a bit.

I thought Hourman was one of the dumbest superhero names ever but it makes sense now with the episode's explanation. Do the Injustice Society bad guys know he only has super strength for an hour? Is that hour contiguous or can he turn it on and off when needed? Feel free to spoilerize the answer if you feel it needs it.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

In the comics, it ran for an hour, then he had to wait for the next day to use it again.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> In the comics, it ran for an hour, then he had to wait for the next day to use it again.


So if you're a bad guy, you provoke him and then skedaddle for 61 minutes.


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## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

cheesesteak said:


> So if you're a bad guy, you provoke him and then skedaddle for 61 minutes.


No worse than defeating Aquaman with a dehumidifier.


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## gossamer88 (Jul 27, 2005)

It was explained last night that his power will only last an hour. And did I miss something? Why did they make that truck stop and possess the driver and kill the other?


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

Honestly, in general DC TV shows are pretty bad that losing 10 minutes of them is probably not going to hurt anything at all (and in some ways could help an episode that otherwise feels like it's dragging out). It's hardly like the producers have really ever cared that much about consistency or continuity or even tying up plot lines. It's probably more likely we'll see flexible episode timing come to the broadcast networks (e.g., providing for full creative expression to not be forced to a specific runtime) as it's basically been on cable networks for many years.


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## trainman (Jan 29, 2001)

Finally got curious enough to figure out why the theater on Main Street in Blue Valley, Nebraska, was called the Dallas... and it's because the exteriors are filmed in the town of Dallas, Georgia (about 35 miles west of Atlanta). Looks like in real life, the Dallas Theater is a performing arts/concert venue, not a movie theater.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

They haven't had to cut 10 minutes (or probably much of anything) since the second episode...


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> They haven't had to cut 10 minutes (or probably much of anything) since the second episode...





gossamer88 said:


> And did I miss something? Why did they make that truck stop and possess the driver and kill the other?


It's a piece of equipment (a broadcast dish) that the ISA needs for some reason. They hijacked it.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

So the school janitor appears to be someone we need to keep an eye on.

I'm wondering if he's Sir Justin.
Or the Shade.


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> They haven't had to cut 10 minutes (or probably much of anything) since the second episode...


Any idea when the decision to air simultaneously on DC Universe and CW was made? I wonder if they are purposely making the episodes shorter so they don't need to be edited for CW?


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> They haven't had to cut 10 minutes (or probably much of anything) since the second episode...


I wouldn't have minded if they had cut a minute or two from the party sequence.


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

morac said:


> Any idea when the decision to air simultaneously on DC Universe and CW was made? I wonder if they are purposely making the episodes shorter so they don't need to be edited for CW?


Wikipedia says that filming began in March 2019. On 21 November 2019, it was announced that the series would air on the CW a day after its DCU showing---there's no way to know when the decision was made, but I would imagine that it was after filming had begun (at least for the pilot)


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> They haven't had to cut 10 minutes (or probably much of anything) since the second episode...


I haven't checked this week's episode yet but the previous two had a minute or so cut.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

JYoung said:


> So the school janitor appears to be someone we need to keep an eye on.
> 
> I'm wondering if he's Sir Justin.
> Or the Shade.


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## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Enjoying this show a lot


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Finally some action. Todays new episode is a good one.

No additional recruiting and some let's go get the bad guys action.


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> In the comics, it ran for an hour, then he had to wait for the next day to use it again.


Today's episode explains why it's only an hour. keep an eye out for the explanation =)


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

JYoung said:


> View attachment 50075


Someone with such an obviously fake beard must be a person of interest.


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## john4200 (Nov 1, 2009)

cheesesteak said:


> Someone with such an obviously fake beard must be a person of interest.


That reminds me of Radcliffe's line from Agents of Shield: "I can tell by your mustache that you're a man of importance and not to be trifled with"

In this case it would be, "I can tell by your beard that you're a man of importance and someone to keep an eye on."


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Sportsmaster had me laughing. Where does he keep all of his weapons?

I think I would enjoy a crossover between this show and Legends Of Tomorrow.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

I quite enjoyed these interpretations of Sportsmaster and Huntress and it seemed quite believable (within the realm of the show) that they would be able to battle Courtney and company that effectively.

(Although shouldn't Pat already be suspecting "Crusher" of being the Sportsmaster?)

Pro tip to Rick: Just holding the car over your head isn't that effective.

I'm glad Pat mentioned the ring.
They've certainly given Alan Scott's Power Battery a fair amount of attention but where's his ring?


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

JYoung said:


> I quite enjoyed these interpretations of Sportsmaster and Huntress and it seemed quite believable (within the realm of the show) that they would be able to battle Courtney and company that effectively.


It was a nice touch that any time one of the JSA tried to fight on their own, they got their butts kicked, but whenever they tried to work together, they did OK. I'm not sure any of _them _noticed, but I'm sure that time will come...


JYoung said:


> (Although shouldn't Pat already be suspecting "Crusher" of being the Sportsmaster?)


Well, logically I don't think pretty much anybody should have much trouble figuring out who pretty much anybody is... Not quite Supergirl/Kara bad, but in that general ballpark.


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## spear (Oct 11, 2006)

JYoung said:


> I quite enjoyed these interpretations of Sportsmaster and Huntress and it seemed quite believable (within the realm of the show) that they would be able to battle Courtney and company that effectively.[...]


I think they're going with the modern name of this character -- the closed captions used Tigress, not Huntress.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Well, logically I don't think pretty much anybody should have much trouble figuring out who pretty much anybody is... Not quite Supergirl/Kara bad, but in that general ballpark.


I'd think he'd know if he had the complete JSA files but maybe he only had it for Brainwave?



spear said:


> I think they're going with the modern name of this character -- the closed captions used Tigress, not Huntress.


Whoops.
I guess they don't want people confusing Paula Brooks with Helena Bertinelli.
(And I've read Young All-Stars.)


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

cheesesteak said:


> Sportsmaster had me laughing. Where does he keep all of his weapons?


Pulls them out of his...

No. Stargirl is supposed to be a high school sophomore, so I guess I don't know.



cheesesteak said:


> I think I would enjoy a crossover between this show and Legends Of Tomorrow.


LOT has already crossed over with the JSA, and Stargirl was teased during the last crossover, so I don't think that would be unreasonable.


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## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

Amnesia said:


> Wikipedia says that filming began in March 2019. On 21 November 2019, it was announced that the series would air on the CW a day after its DCU showing---there's no way to know when the decision was made, but I would imagine that it was after filming had begun (at least for the pilot)


I'm thinking that they decided to air it on both the DCU and the CW for financial reasons. They get commercial revenue from the CW and it also helps to promote the DCU. When people realize there's extra material on the DCU version they may be inclined to check it out and subscribe. So far it looks like they may have only done that with the first few episodes on the DCU. They win either way and reach a much wider audience.

I'm enjoying the show so far, but the kids are far too impulsive and reckless, especially Hourman. I'm thinking it's just a matter of time before one of them bites the bullet unless they get their act together.

I was wondering about Green Lantern's ring too. The power battery appears to be damaged so I'm wondering if it's even still functional. I'm not up to speed on all of the characters in the original Justice Society or the Injustice Society so it looks like I have a little homework to do when I find the time. Considering the title of the episode was The Justice Society it makes me wonder if they'll be introducing any additional members. Here's the image they have over at epguides.com so it makes me think that's everone.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

mr.unnatural said:


> I'm thinking that they decided to air it on both the DCU and the CW for financial reasons. They get commercial revenue from the CW and it also helps to promote the DCU. When people realize there's extra material on the DCU version they may be inclined to check it out and subscribe. So far it looks like they may have only done that with the first few episodes on the DCU. They win either way and reach a much wider audience.


The theory that they're preparing to kill DCU also holds water (see also Doom Patrol, simulcasting on HBO Max)...


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## gossamer88 (Jul 27, 2005)

mr.unnatural said:


> I'm enjoying the show so far, but the kids are far too impulsive and reckless, especially Hourman. I'm thinking it's just a matter of time before one of them bites the bullet unless they get their act together.


I guess you don't know too many teenagers.


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> The theory that they're preparing to kill DCU also holds water (see also Doom Patrol, simulcasting on HBO Max)...


If they do kill it, I hope there is another avenue to get the content in 4K HDR. It's not on HBO Max, or when purchased from stores like iTunes or Amazon.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

LoREvanescence said:


> If they do kill it, I hope there is another avenue to get the content in 4K HDR. It's not on HBO Max, or when purchased from stores like iTunes or Amazon.


I have a hunch HBO Max will go 4K eventually. Probably sooner rather than later. They're betting too much on that being their premiere streaming service not to.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> It was a nice touch that any time one of the JSA tried to fight on their own, they got their butts kicked, but whenever they tried to work together, they did OK. I'm not sure any of _them _noticed, but I'm sure that time will come...


I was kinda happy that the novice fighters got the bejesus knocked out of them in their first real fight against a couple of seasoned super villains.


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## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> The theory that they're preparing to kill DCU also holds water (see also Doom Patrol, simulcasting on HBO Max)...


That doesn't surprise me. I can't see how a streaming service with so little content can survive these days. The bulk of their content is animated from what I've seen.



gossamer88 said:


> I guess you don't know too many teenagers.


LOL, point taken. Raised two of them and they were nowhere near as bad as the kids on Stargirl.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

mr.unnatural said:


> LOL, point taken. Raised two of them and they were nowhere near as bad as the kids on Stargirl.


That you know of.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

mr.unnatural said:


> I was wondering about Green Lantern's ring too. The power battery appears to be damaged so I'm wondering if it's even still functional


Well, it's magical so I suspect that someone with sufficient will power and a connection to the Starheart could repair it.
Could be Alan Scott.
Could be Jennie Lynn Hayden.

Sportsmaster was originally a nemesis of the Golden Age Green Lantern so I want to see a scene like this, whether it's Alan Scott or someone else.

Sportmaster: Green Lantern! And today's the day I packed the aluminum bat!

Tigress: So you're not prepared to fight the Green Lantern but you are prepared to fight the Green Guardsman?


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Would the British call him Sportmaster instead of our Sportsmaster?


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

cheesesteak said:


> Would the British call him Sportmaster instead of our Sportsmaster?


They should just go get their 's' back from the Maths people.


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## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

I thought the reason the JSA HQ was on (green) fire during the JSA/ISA fight was because the lantern exploded. How can it be intact in the present? In any case, it's useless without the ring. It fact, it would have made more sense for the ring to have been on display in the mansion. Come to think of it, why were any of those objects, some of which are extremely dangerous, left lying out in the open? Wouldn't the ISA have ransacked the place once everyone was dead?

Speaking of the mansion, isn't it in LA? Courtney and Pat seemed to get there and back in record time from Nebraska.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Shakhari said:


> I thought the reason the JSA HQ was on (green) fire during the JSA/ISA fight was because the lantern exploded. How can it be intact in the present?


It was never explicited stated that the Power Battery exploded.
It was implied that the green fire was Green Lantern's energy.



Shakhari said:


> In any case, it's useless without the ring.
> It fact, it would have made more sense for the ring to have been on display in the mansion.


Is it?

Alan Scott learned to channel the Starheart power without his ring after it was destroyed in Zero Hour.
Jennie Lynn didn't need a ring.
Hal Jordan recently created a new ring through sheer force of will (and a deeper connection to the Green energy of Will).

Plus there was a pre Crisis story where the Secret Society of Super Villains encountered the Crime Syndicate when the Society got trapped on Earth-Three.
The Wizard (yes, that Wizard) needed three talismans to cast a spell to get them to Earth-Two.
The talismans were Superwoman's lasso, Johnny Quick's speed helmet, and Power Ring's power ring.
They stole the items and the Syndicate came after the SSSV.
Power Ring didn't have his ring but he was using his will to channel power directly from his power battery to create constructs.



Shakhari said:


> Come to think of it, why were any of those objects, some of which are extremely dangerous, left lying out in the open? Wouldn't the ISA have ransacked the place once everyone was dead?


I'm sure Pat locked the door.
(I suspect he did clean up the place as well. Maybe he had some help from Rex Tyler.)



Shakhari said:


> Speaking of the mansion, isn't it in LA? Courtney and Pat seemed to get there and back in record time from Nebraska.


They have the Cosmic Staff and a giant exosuit and you're questioning how fast they can get to Los Angeles?
(BTW, the initial shots of the JSA mansion would put in just west of Bronson Canyon/Bronson Cave, maybe around Lake Hollywood. I think that's somewhat off the beaten path.)


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## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

IIRC Pat said the battery could kill Courtney but it was useless without the ring.

I'm sure locking the mansion would be a deterrent ...


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

Alan Scott originally created his ring from the metal of the lantern (back in _All-American Comics_ #16).

No reason why a new JSA GL couldn't do the same..


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

I don't know anything about the Justice Society's Green Lantern but if he has the same powers of the current one, wouldn't that blow this show's special effects budget rather quickly?


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

cheesesteak said:


> I don't know anything about the Justice Society's Green Lantern but if he has the same powers of the current one, wouldn't that blow this show's special effects budget rather quickly?


Maybe the show has a sky-high FX budget, and they've been saving it all for when GL shows up..?


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Maybe the show has a sky-high FX budget, and they've been saving it all for when GL shows up..?


It's possible. The show was made for the DC Universe streaming service. The FX on their shows is significantly better than it is for the CW shows.


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Today's episode contains a lot of action. It's part 1 of a 2 part episode, so it leaves off with a cliffhanger.

Not going to discuss any details of the episode yet as I don't want to post spoilers.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Shakhari said:


> IIRC Pat said the battery could kill Courtney but it was useless without the ring.


Considering the Starheart killed a number of people when it first arrived on Earth in Ancient China (see the aforementioned _All-American Comics_ #16), Pat's not wrong.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Can someone explain who the Mean Girl student, her father are and who the janitor probably is? Is there are good online source for this information?


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## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

cheesesteak said:


> Can someone explain who the Mean Girl student, her father are and who the janitor probably is? Is there are good online source for this information?


The mean girl is Shiv, her father is Dr Ito (Dragon King) and the theory on the janitor (And spoiled by a future episode title) is


Spoiler



Sir Justin, the Shining Knight.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

KungFuCow said:


> The mean girl is Shiv, her father is Dr Ito (Dragon King) and the theory on the janitor (And spoiled by a future episode title) is
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> ...


Well, it's hardly a theory...his name is Justin, he has a sword, he knows Stripesy...if that doesn't tell us who it is, nothing will!


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## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Well, it's hardly a theory...his name is Justin, he has a sword, he knows Stripesy...if that doesn't tell us who it is, nothing will!


I know, I know.. just trying to avoid the spoiler police.


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

I'm assuming Shiv has been training her whole life? Or is she an extra powerful ISA future member?

She was a much tougher opponent than expected.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

LoREvanescence said:


> I'm assuming Shiv has been training her whole life? Or is she an extra powerful ISA future member?
> 
> She was a much tougher opponent than expected.


She has some kind of superpowers (Daddy was talking about giving them to her)...


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Well, it's hardly a theory...his name is Justin, he has a sword, he knows Stripesy...if that doesn't tell us who it is, nothing will!


I'm pretty sure that a sword isn't standard janitorial issue in Blue Valley.



Rob Helmerichs said:


> She has some kind of superpowers (Daddy was talking about giving them to her)...


She (Shiv) rapid healed after getting blasted in the face by the Cosmic Staff.

Suffice it to say that she's not non powered.

It's good in the long run that Courtney got beaten down in this episode as she was having serious overconfidence there.

Pat, Pat, Pat, yelling out Courtney's name like that?
Superhero 101, Pat.


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## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

JYoung said:


> It's good in the long run that Courtney got beaten down in this episode as she was having serious overconfidence there.


She's been beaten in every single fight. This is the first one someone other than Pat has swooped in to save her.


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

JYoung said:


> .
> Pat, Pat, Pat, yelling out Courtney's name like that?
> Superhero 101, Pat.


Yeah, I picked up on that. Shiv was getting up and leaving as Pat was yelling Courtney's name. She very well could have picked up on Star Girls identity.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Pat's going to have some splainin' to do to his son and maybe his wife next episode if Courney's injuries are apparent.

I know this is a superhero show but is it even possible that Courney didn't recognize Shiv as her fellow high school student or will a convenient case of amnesia kick in?


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

cheesesteak said:


> I know this is a superhero show but is it even possible that Courtney didn't recognize Shiv as her fellow high school student or will a convenient case of amnesia kick in?


Well, it's not like Shiv seriously did anything to hide her identity...

Then again, it's not like Courtney seriously does anything to hide her identity.


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## tigercat74 (Aug 7, 2004)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Well, it's not like Shiv seriously did anything to hide her identity...
> 
> Then again, it's not like Courtney seriously does anything to hide her identity.


She wears a mask though those curls are very recognizable.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

tigercat74 said:


> She wears a mask though those curls are very recognizable.


And her face is very recognizable as well. That's really not much of a mask...more like make-up!


----------



## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> And her face is very recognizable as well. That's really not much of a mask...more like make-up!


Maybe she can don a pair of glasses.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

TonyD79 said:


> Maybe she can don a pair of glasses.


Apparently, that will do the trick!


----------



## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Cindy Burman

Here is a good write up on Cindy / Shiv


----------



## cbrrider (Feb 2, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Apparently, that will do the trick!


Works for Superman, Supergirl, and Wonder Woman. So it'll definitely work for Stargirl.


----------



## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

cbrrider said:


> Works for Superman, Supergirl, and Wonder Woman. So it'll definitely work for Stargirl.


In the classic supergirl, she actually wore a wig. Not sure why they didn't do that on the tv show. It worked for Hannah Montana.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

cheesesteak said:


> Pat's going to have some splainin' to do to his son and maybe his wife next episode if Courney's injuries are apparent.
> 
> I know this is a superhero show but is it even possible that Courney didn't recognize Shiv as her fellow high school student or will a convenient case of amnesia kick in?





Rob Helmerichs said:


> Well, it's not like Shiv seriously did anything to hide her identity...
> 
> Then again, it's not like Courtney seriously does anything to hide her identity.


They didn't recognize Tigress as one of their gym teachers either even though Paula does little to hide her face as well.
(It was dark!)


----------



## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

JYoung said:


> They didn't recognize Tigress as one of their gym teachers either even though Paula does little to hide her face as well.
> (It was dark!)


Nor did the gym teacher recognize any of the kids. Granted, they had better masks, but I would think Yolanda's fighting style would be recognizable to her gym teacher and Courtney's hair would be a dead giveaway.


----------



## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

People in comics are either blind or brain dead. You put on a skimpy little mask or a pair of glasses and suddenly it's like wearing a cloaking or a chameleon device. Let's face it, stories about people with super abilities are a stretch of the imagination as it is. Having us believe that their disguises are effective is only just slightly more of a stretch. Anyone with facial recognition software could easily expose all of their secret identities with no problem. You have to suspend all belief when watching these types of shows. That's what makes them fun.


----------



## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

No matter how much you suspend belief there's still that percentage of your brain that screams "She's only wearing glasses! How can they not recognize Supergirl?"


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Yeah, you don't like these shows because of suspension of disbelief. Suspension of disbelief is the only thing that makes it possible to like them for other reasons.

And I wish they would make disbelief easier to suspend! Sometimes, it's like they're not even trying...


----------



## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

It’s almost hard to believe they don’t make them easier to believe. I guess we have to suspend our belief in the suspension of belief.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

It's disbelief that needs to be suspended...


----------



## john4200 (Nov 1, 2009)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> It's disbelief that needs to be suspended...


I think the reason many people get that saying wrong is because the saying makes the tacit assumption that 'belief' is the default state of being, since there must first be belief in order for there to come disbelief. So anyone who does not go into the story already believing is going to have difficulty suspending their disbelief. Their belief must first be nourished before they can have any disbelief to suspend.


----------



## alpacaboy (Oct 29, 2004)

mr.unnatural said:


> People in comics are either blind or brain dead. You put on a skimpy little mask or a pair of glasses and suddenly it's like wearing a cloaking or a chameleon device.


Admittedly, sometimes if I'm used to seeing someone without glasses and they suddenly start wearing glasses, I may do a double take. And I think more so the other way, if I'm used to them with glasses and they start wearing contacts. 
Only maybe a couple times, but it did make think maybe there's some validity to the Clark Kent thing.


----------



## smak (Feb 11, 2000)

To me it's not the fact that they always look almost exactly like their alter ego's, but that they never seen to care about it.

Especially here where she's mostly around people that would know her.

-smak-


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

alpacaboy said:


> Admittedly, sometimes if I'm used to seeing someone without glasses and they suddenly start wearing glasses, I may do a double take. And I think more so the other way, if I'm used to them with glasses and they start wearing contacts.
> Only maybe a couple times, but it did make think maybe there's some validity to the Clark Kent thing.


For me, it's more like I can't figure out why they look different...not that they are suddenly unrecognizable.


----------



## robojerk (Jun 13, 2006)




----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

I also would have never guessed that Charles McNider was a Bachman-Turner Overdrive fan.


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

mr.unnatural said:


> People in comics are either blind or brain dead. You put on a skimpy little mask or a pair of glasses and suddenly it's like wearing a cloaking or a chameleon device.


Stargirl suddenly appeared in town! She's short, with a round face, curly blonde hair and serious gymnastic moves. You know, there's a new student at the high school---she's also short, with a round face, curly blonde hair and serious gymnastic moves... Coincidence?!? Yeah, probably...


----------



## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

alpacaboy said:


> Admittedly, sometimes if I'm used to seeing someone without glasses and they suddenly start wearing glasses, I may do a double take. And I think more so the other way, if I'm used to them with glasses and they start wearing contacts.
> Only maybe a couple times, but it did make think maybe there's some validity to the Clark Kent thing.


Yeah, but doesn't Superman always wear his costume under his street clothes? What happens if he pops a button on his shirt and exposes the costume underneath? Does he just tell his friends and co-workers that he's into Underoos? And how does he wear the red boots under his shoes? IIRC, doesn't he fold up his street clothes and stuff them in a pocket in his cape? I can't imagine what they look like when he changes back into them. Maybe he has some way to steam the wrinkles out of them before going out in public again. I always loved the scene in the first Superman movie with Christopher Reeves when he goes to change into Superman and can't find a phone booth.


----------



## Unbeliever (Feb 3, 2001)

--Carlos V.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

To be fair, he's not as good an actor as Chris Reeve...


----------



## Johncv (Jun 11, 2002)

Anyone here think that Pat's boy is going to find the pink pen.


----------



## alpacaboy (Oct 29, 2004)

TonyD79 said:


> In the classic supergirl, she actually wore a wig. Not sure why they didn't do that on the tv show. It worked for Hannah Montana.


I have noticed that she looks blonder as Supergirl.
I think she has blonde highlights toward the ends, so when whe wears it up as Kara, it's more of her brown hair, and when she lets it down, the blondeness comes out.

Or, I guess being a tv show, they could just completely redo her hair for the different scene, but I don't think they would be constantly dying and re-dying her hair that much.


----------



## trainman (Jan 29, 2001)

alpacaboy said:


> Or, I guess being a tv show, they could just completely redo her hair for the different scene, but I don't think they would be constantly dying and re-dying her hair that much.


If they were going to do this, they would use a wig, not hair dye. (But I agree with you that they're not doing this on "Supergirl.")


----------



## madscientist (Nov 12, 2003)

Just to point out, we don't know for sure how Stargirl will treat this yet. Maybe in the next episode Courtney will know that Cindy is Shiv, and Cindy will know that Courtney is Stargirl.

It could happen...


----------



## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

madscientist said:


> Just to point out, we don't know for sure how Stargirl will treat this yet. Maybe in the next episode Courtney will know that Cindy is Shiv, and Cindy will know that Courtney is Stargirl.
> 
> It could happen...


My money is on that old tv show standby: a convenient case of amnesia


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

cheesesteak said:


> (...) a convenient case of amnesia


Yes?


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Brainwave initially thought that Stargirl was a different blonde student.
Plus, does anyone outside of her family and the JSA know that Courtney is a superb gymnast?

Remember, the school administrator told her on her first day that Blue Valley High no longer had a gymnastics program.


----------



## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

cheesesteak said:


> My money is on that old tv show standby: a convenient case of amnesia


I was "Dewey Defeats Truman" wrong on that one.

Courtney needs to take some martial arts lessons.


----------



## realityboy (Jun 13, 2003)

'Stargirl' Renewed for Season 2 on The CW

Good for Stargirl, but it's not looking good for DC Universe.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

I had to laugh when it turned out Cindy was just playing Courtney, and recognized her all along. "You think after all this time we've spent together, I wouldn't recognize you through that stupid mask?"


----------



## robojerk (Jun 13, 2006)

realityboy said:


> *not looking good for DC Universe.*


Honestly it seems weird for DCU service to continue as a niche product when it could be folded into HBO Max. It would give more content for HBO Max subscribers and more people who wouldn't normally ever pay for for something like DCU would have access to it and watch it.

Considering both HBO and DC Universe is owned by Warner Media, who is owned by AT&T...


----------



## realityboy (Jun 13, 2003)

robojerk said:


> Honestly it seems weird for DCU service to continue as a niche product when it could be folded into HBO Max. It would give more content for HBO Max subscribers and more people who wouldn't normally ever pay for for something like DCU would have access to it and watch it.
> 
> Considering both HBO and DC Universe is owned by Warner Media, who is owned by AT&T...


DCU could pivot to being exclusively for the comics, and it would still be $2 cheaper than Marvel's digital comic subscription service which has been around for years so I think there is a place for it, but it shouldn't be competing with HBO Max as a streaming service.


----------



## Generic (Dec 27, 2005)

'Stargirl' Renewed for Season 2, Moves to CW From DC Universe - Variety


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Generic said:


> 'Stargirl' Renewed for Season 2, Moves to CW From DC Universe - Variety


Well, it doesn't move to CW...it just stays there, and sells its other house on DCU.


----------



## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Generic said:


> 'Stargirl' Renewed for Season 2, Moves to CW From DC Universe - Variety


Beat me to it. Just came here to post this.


__
http://instagr.am/p/CCTxvUGgDE3/


----------



## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

Generic said:


> 'Stargirl' Renewed for Season 2, Moves to CW From DC Universe - Variety


I'm guessing there's going to be significant budget cuts for the move to CW since it won't have that streaming money anymore. Probably much more dramatic than when Supergirl moved from CBS to CW.


----------



## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

I just hope it finds a streaming home that is 4K HDR. I will be disappointed if the move to The CW means the loss of access to 4k content.


----------



## cbrrider (Feb 2, 2005)

Hmmm ... just rewatching Shiv part 1 and noticed that QB Artemis Crock #17 hands the ball off to the running back, yet somehow manages to run the ball into the end zone. Must have some serious super teleporting powers.


----------



## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

cbrrider said:


> Hmmm ... just rewatching Shiv part 1 and noticed that QB Artemis Crock #17 hands the ball off to the running back, yet somehow manages to run the ball into the end zone. Must have some serious super teleporting powers.


Flea flicker?


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

cheesesteak said:


> Flea flicker?


Or super telepathic powers...he made you see what he wanted you to see!


----------



## cbrrider (Feb 2, 2005)

cheesesteak said:


> Flea flicker?


Nah. At best, a lateral or a fumble recovery and a sprint to the end zone.


----------



## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

morac said:


> I'm guessing there's going to be significant budget cuts for the move to CW since it won't have that streaming money anymore. Probably much more dramatic than when Supergirl moved from CBS to CW.


Why would you assume that? I can't imagine the budget for Stargirl is any more extravagant than any of the other DC shows on The CW. I'd bet that The CW has more revenue from advertising than the DCU since they rely on subscriptions only, but that's just a WAG on my part.

I would assume that one of the other streaming services will pick up Stargirl at some point. Netflix currently airs the bulk of all CW shows while other shows air on HBO Max, The CW streaming service, and CBS All Access. Since it was just announced that Stargil will be moving to The CW and away from the DCU streaming service I figure it's just a matter of time before one of the other services picks it up.


----------



## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

mr.unnatural said:


> Why would you assume that? I can't imagine the budget for Stargirl is any more extravagant than any of the other DC shows on The CW.


I'm just going based on how the FX shots look as well as the filming locations. The FX look better than they do on other CW DC shows and Stargirl was filmed in multiple cities in mutiple states, while most of the other shows with the exception of Black Lightning are filmed in Vancouver.

Before I posted I did a quick Internet search and my assumptions were correct. Stargirl did have a bigger budget than other CW shows.

Stargirl: The CW's Newest Series Could Be Its Best Yet



> Stargirl, however, has the backing of a much higher budget. This will result in production values that should far exceed those of the other CW superhero series. If the show's production values match other DC Universe titles such as Titans and Swamp Thing, it will definitely avoid the "cheap soap opera" feel that many accuse shows on The CW of having.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

morac said:


> I'm just going based on how the FX shots look as well as the filming locations. The FX look better than they do on other CW DC shows and Stargirl was filmed in multiple cities in mutiple states, while most of the other shows with the exception of Black Lightning are filmed in Vancouver.


Not sure where you're getting this but Stargirl is filmed in and around Atlanta, GA (as is Black Lightning).
There's no multiple citles in multiple states filming for this show.

(Granted, the FX do look better.)


----------



## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

JYoung said:


> Not sure where you're getting this but Stargirl is filmed in and around Atlanta, GA (as is Black Lightning).
> There's no multiple citles in multiple states filming for this show.
> 
> (Granted, the FX do look better.)


I saw it was filmed in Dallas and Atlanta and assumed that meant Texas and Georgia. I didn't realize there is a Dallas, Georgia.

DC's Stargirl Locations

Still as my other link shows, Stargirl has a larger budget than the CW shows.


----------



## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

Supergirl was great its first season on CBS and clearly suffered from moving to the CW. That said, Stargirl is likely to continue having 13-episode seasons, so maybe the quality won't decline that much.


----------



## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

JYoung said:


> Not sure where you're getting this but Stargirl is filmed in and around Atlanta, GA (as is Black Lightning).
> There's no multiple citles in multiple states filming for this show.


Atlanta? Anything to do with Tyler Perry's giant studio area?


----------



## trainman (Jan 29, 2001)

morac said:


> I saw it was filmed in Dallas and Atlanta and assumed that meant Texas and Georgia. I didn't realize there is a Dallas, Georgia.


Today I learned morac has me on ignore.



trainman said:


> Finally got curious enough to figure out why the theater on Main Street in Blue Valley, Nebraska, was called the Dallas... and it's because the exteriors are filmed in the town of Dallas, Georgia (about 35 miles west of Atlanta). Looks like in real life, the Dallas Theater is a performing arts/concert venue, not a movie theater.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

cheesesteak said:


> Atlanta? Anything to do with Tyler Perry's giant studio area?


I don't know. I haven't researched that to find out.

That said, Georgia has been offering a number of tax breaks for production companies to shoot in the state for a number of years now.

(Also, I suspect that one other reason that Black Lightning shoots in Atlanta is that it's easier to get a number of African American actors and extras than it is in Vancouver.)


----------



## Johncv (Jun 11, 2002)

mr.unnatural said:


> Why would you assume that? I can't imagine the budget for Stargirl is any more extravagant than any of the other DC shows on The CW. I'd bet that The CW has more revenue from advertising than the DCU since they rely on subscriptions only, but that's just a WAG on my part.
> 
> I would assume that one of the other streaming services will pick up Stargirl at some point. Netflix currently airs the bulk of all CW shows while other shows air on HBO Max, The CW streaming service, and CBS All Access. Since it was just announced that Stargil will be moving to The CW and away from the DCU streaming service I figure it's just a matter of time before one of the other services picks it up.


You do realize that when Netflix contract end with CW everything on CW will stream on HBOmax.


----------



## robojerk (Jun 13, 2006)

Is the budget bigger because it's a first season? Pilot episodes are expensive as wardrobe, sets, etc.. all need to be created. I'm not interested enough to research first season budgets myself, more of a question if you took that into consideration.


----------



## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

Johncv said:


> You do realize that when Netflix contract end with CW everything on CW will stream on HBOmax.


I wasn't aware of that, but OK. I was just indicating what shows are currently being streamed on the existing services.


----------



## trainman (Jan 29, 2001)

JYoung said:


> (Also, I suspect that one other reason that Black Lightning shoots in Atlanta is that it's easier to get a number of African American actors and extras than it is in Vancouver.)


Speaking of extras, a few "Stargirl" episodes back, I couldn't help notice that the Blue Valley High cheerleading squad seemed a bit more diverse than one would normally expect for small-town Nebraska. (Not a complaint on my part... just another sign that the show films in the Atlanta area.)


----------



## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

trainman said:


> Speaking of extras, a few "Stargirl" episodes back, I couldn't help notice that the Blue Valley High cheerleading squad seemed a bit more diverse than one would normally expect for small-town Nebraska. (Not a complaint on my part... just another sign that the show films in the Atlanta area.)


I wouldn't say the casting has anything to do with where the show is filmed. My guess would be they purposely casted extras for diversity. Which is a good thing.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

LoREvanescence said:


> I wouldn't say the casting has anything to do with where the show is filmed. My guess would be they purposely casted extras for diversity. Which is a good thing.


It can depending on the story they're trying to tell.
There aren't as many Black Canadian actors in Vancouver as they make up about 0.9% of the population of the Vancouver area and about 1% of Canadians in general.
So less of a pool to cast from for secondary roles and extras.
(A certain percentage of the actors have to be Canadian citizens or residents plus it costs more to bring in actors from the States.)

Which can make it an issue if you're trying to to do a drama about an African American Superhero and his African American neighborhood.
Where as filming in Atlanta makes this far less an issue.

Now if you want to film an Asian neighborhood, far less of a problem as Vancouver's about 30% Asian.


----------



## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Today's episode ended with not one but two cliff hangers.

Next weeks episode is going to leave some people with some serious explaining to do.

Not much for fighting action. We got to see Brainwaves origin story and Courtney trying to recruit Henry.

Also, can anyone explain to me what happened with the Janitor and the Cosmic Staff.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

"Justin the Janitor" is not all there and is conflating the Cosmic Staff with something else.

We also got the full Seven Soldiers of Victory (at least their photograph) in this episode although I couldn't help but notice that Green Arrow and Speedy weren't identified as well as the Shining Knight.

Yolanda has very good reason to distrust Henry and her reaction was quite believable.

Call me crazy, but I don't think Junior killed the lawyer. I think Dad did.


----------



## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Is Justin the Janitor the Shining Night?

Also, what was the trigger that finally woke up Henry Sr.


----------



## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

I thought this episode was mostly a snooze fest other than for the two surprises at the end. Baby Brainwave isn't all that interesting.


----------



## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

cheesesteak said:


> Baby Brainwave isn't all that interesting.


Really? Didn't he dig a little deeper is his last altercation with Yolanda after the conversation with Courtney? Seems like he's on a path where he may recognize Courtney is not the bad guy, and maybe that it really is gray and not black and white. That's probably more character development than we usually see in these sorts of shows, if true.


----------



## cbrrider (Feb 2, 2005)

Prediction: Baby Brainwave and baby Icicle will join the JSA to fight their fathers.


----------



## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

cbrrider said:


> Prediction: Baby Brainwave and baby Icicle will join the JSA to fight their fathers.


They could team up as Brain Freeze.


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

There's another potential hook Courtney has concerning Henry Jr, assuming they follow what's in the comics,


Spoiler



the fact that Henry's mother was Sylvester Pemberton's sister.


----------



## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

JYoung said:


> There's another potential hook Courtney has concerning Henry Jr, assuming they follow what's in the comics,
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> ...


This fact came out in todays new episode. And yes, it looks like the predictions of Junior fighting along side the JSA came to be until:



Spoiler



Senior killed Junior



There was lots of ISA bad guy but kicking action.

Stargirl was down her staff, which took off on it's own to confront Icicle after Courtney said not to night after a big blow up between her, her mother and Pat over the whole Stargirl situation. The staff attacked on it's own and was captured.

Whereas Stargirl really struggled with Shiv, she totally dominated against those animated experiments of Dr. Ito and held her own against the "Dragon King" a lot better than she did against Shiv, especially being down her staff.


----------



## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

LoREvanescence said:


> This fact came out in todays new episode. And yes, it looks like the predictions of Junior fighting along side the JSA came to be until:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Then you got that idiot trying to let Solomon Grundy out. That guy is more annoying than Mike.


----------



## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

I find it hard to believe. He's telekinetic and would be able to protect himself.


----------



## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Shakhari said:


> I find it hard to believe. He's telekinetic and would be able to protect himself.


Yeah I wonder if he's still alive


----------



## cbrrider (Feb 2, 2005)

vertigo235 said:


> Yeah I wonder if he's still alive


No one in comic books really dies. Now, the question is who is Courtney's father? No comic book spoilers. I'll just wait to find out.


----------



## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

In addition to season 2 coming to The CW next year. I just read that Stargirl will appear in the upcoming DC movie "Black Adam" which is expected to be released in December 2021.

Yeah, the next real question is who is Courtney's father. Before today's episode I believe she had it right. The picture she has of her father really looks like it could be Sylvester.



Spoiler: Who is Courtney's real father?



And doing some digging on this topic the answer is not clear. Starman's and Sam Curtis' identifies have changed over the years and the TV show has more than one option to follow for who Courtney's father is. The two most likely scenario's we could see is either Starman really is her father, or Sam Curtis is a conman, a member of the Royal Flush Gang.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

SYLVESTER'S TWIN BROTHER!!!


----------



## cbrrider (Feb 2, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> SYLVESTER'S TWIN BROTHER!!!


You forgot "EVIL".


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

cbrrider said:


> You forgot "EVIL".


I don't like being redundant...

I can't remember...in the pictures of Dad, does he have a goatee?


----------



## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I don't like being redundant...
> 
> I can't remember...in the pictures of Dad, does he have a goatee?


----------



## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Courtney (and her stunt double) busted out some serious fighting skills in this episode.

It sucks being a teenager but it really sucks to be a teenager in Blue Valley when your father murders you without a care. Baby Brainwave ought to be dead. If you have telekinetic powers, it's better to use them before the roof caves in on you. Hopefully, he learns this if he gets a comic book resurrection.

I'm glad that Courtney's mom found out about her secret. I think superhero shows are better when all the members of the good guy circle learn the secrets. Plus, the stepdad secretly sneaking around with the hot stepdaughter and keeping their rendesvous a secret from her mother sounds like scenes from a certain type of movie that I've definitely never watched but have friends who have told me about them.


----------



## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

I'm also wondering how much of the action was Brec Bassinger's stunt double Kristina Basket.

Kristina Baskett - IMDb

Brec Bassinger was both a gymnast and competitive cheerleader growing up. Brec did go through stunt training camp and does many of her own gymnastic stunts.

It looks like Kristina Basket only did the more dangerous stunts, or gymnastics stunts with the 6' staff that Brec struggled a little bit with with being only 5'2 at first. Kristina, who was an elite gymnast totally rocked pulling of the flips with the staff in stunt training camp.

An interview I read by Brec said that she would have loved to have been allowed to do more stunts in the show. However, they opted for most gymnastic stunts with the staff to be done by Kristina not because she wan't capable, but for her safety. They don't want to risk any injury to their star. They did allow Brec to be harnessed into wires and do her own stunts such as the scene where she did the gymnastics moves on the staff in the first episode, but opted to let Kristina do most of the heavy lifting of stunts in later episodes.

So I would assume most of the moves being busted with the staff was Kristina, but I wonder about all the moves that weren't with the staff. How much of those were actually Brec.


----------



## Bill Reeves (Jul 18, 2002)

I'm starting to wonder if Blue Valley High is going to have a Heathers or Sunnydale problem, where kids mysteriously keep disappearing or dying and nobody really talks about it. So far, we have Joey, the Wizard's kid, who was killed in front of classmates on a school trip, and the head cheerleader has a breakdown and disappears (as far as the rest of the school knows), and now one of the top athletes (did Henry play football? I know Sportsmaster and Tigress' daughter is the big football star, but Henry was always wearing his letter jacket so he must have been an athlete, right?) has disappeared (as far as the rest of the school will know when he doesn't show up to school the next day). And all of this started when that new girl moved to town...


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

LoREvanescence said:


> Kristina Baskett - IMDb


Wow, she gets a lot of work!


----------



## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Wow, she gets a lot of work!


Some big names on her resume too. Like Game of Thrones and Divergent.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

LoREvanescence said:


> Some big names on her resume too. Like Game of Thrones and Divergent.


Shows with smallish women doing athletic things! I bet if she were a few years older, she would have done hard time in the Whedonverse...


----------



## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

Speaking of smallish women doing athletic things, they've made kind of a big deal about the Wildcat costume being equipped with gloves with claws, yet every time we've seen Ted Grant he was wearing fist wraps.


----------



## gossamer88 (Jul 27, 2005)

Almost missed the last episode as it was re-named 'Stargirl' from 'DC's Stargirl'. For some reason I double checked my scheduled recording the night before.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Strange...mine for Tuesday says "Stargirl," but it's still scheduled to record. I don't know if it switched or if it's always been just Stargirl...never missed one, though.


----------



## gossamer88 (Jul 27, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Strange...mine for Tuesday says "Stargirl," but it's still scheduled to record. I don't know if it switched or if it's always been just Stargirl...never missed one, though.


Here's my FiOS DVR List...and why it did not pick up last week's episode.


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## trainman (Jan 29, 2001)

DirecTV had the same issue last week, so presumably they're getting their data from the same feed that FiOS is. I posed in the Season Pass Alerts forum when I discovered it: Stargirl


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Kind of ironic that TiVo seems to be the only one getting it right...


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

vertigo235 said:


> Yeah I wonder if he's still alive


Junior may or may not be alive.
I suppose the question is dependent on whether or not he really killed the lawyer or Dad did.

Re: Courtney's father: my guess all along has been that Sam Curtis wasn't really an alias for Sylvester Pemberton but is a different person.

My reasoning comes from the comics:


Spoiler



Originally, Courtney became the second Star Spangled Kid because she was blaming Pat for the move from Los Angeles to Blue Valley.
After finding out about his past much the same way as shown in the TV show, she dons her version of Sylvester's costume (including the Cosmic Converter Belt) as a way to get under his skin.

It turns out though that's she pretty good at being a superhero and she enjoys helping people.

My suspicion is that the producers thought her original reason for donning the mask was too petty and by having her think that Sylvester was her father, this gives her a more clearly understood and acceptable reason to become Stargirl.


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

It's always been Stargirl in the Hulu Live Guide, or the iTunes store season I purchased pre buying a 4k tv and subscribing to DC for 4k HDR.

No fighting action in todays episode. After lasts weeks episode packed all kinds of action this week was pretty much all origin story.

The episode does end with us expecting some serious action for next week's episode though.

For anyone who watched this week's episode, can you explain the line "Our queen has risen".


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## osu1991 (Mar 6, 2015)

next weeks is the first part of the 2 part finale


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

osu1991 said:


> next weeks is the first part of the 2 part finale


Is it, I thought there were 13 episodes. WAsn't this weeks only episode 10?


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

LoREvanescence said:


> Is it, I thought there were 13 episodes. Wasn't this weeks only episode 10?


Nope. 11.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Courtney's mom (I can never remember her name) got with the program real quick. A week ago she was telling Pat to get the f-bomb out. 

I actually felt bad for Mike. Everybody's lying or withholding information from him and he got yelled at by Pat in this episode. At some point they're going to have to expose him to Stargirl and the JSA. I hope he doesn't go postal before then.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

cheesesteak said:


> Courtney's mom (I can never remember her name) got with the program real quick. A week ago she was telling Pat to get the f-bomb out.


In between, she realized that the boss she idolized really IS a super-villain. I suspect that made her question her decisions to date...


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## Hot4Bo (Apr 3, 2003)

I am 15 minutes in on tonight's episode. What was with the weird left-handed handshake between Pat and Sam? I will have to go back to the beginning to see it again but it struck me as strange.


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## Hot4Bo (Apr 3, 2003)

I don't know why it is sideways.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Yeah, that was weird. I wondered if maybe they needed to reverse the image for composition reasons, but no...everything is still the same (i.e., the layout of the room, the shoulder the backpack is on). So it was a choice. And why they made that choice, I have no clue.


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## Hot4Bo (Apr 3, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Yeah, that was weird. I wondered if maybe they needed to reverse the image for composition reasons, but no...everything is still the same (i.e., the layout of the room, the shoulder the backpack is on). So it was a choice. And why they made that choice, I have no clue.


Glad it is not just me.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

The only reason I can think of is due to production deadlines, they didn't have time to reposition the camera, relight the set, and block the scene to do it correctly.

And maybe they intended to flip the shot in post production and it got missed.


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## getbak (Oct 8, 2004)

One of the actors probably hurt his right hand shortly before it was shot and asked to shake with their lefts.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

So Luke punched Geoff harder than we thought?


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Maybe that's how the cool people in Blue Valley shake hands.


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

cheesesteak said:


> Maybe that's how the cool people in Blue Valley shake hands.


Maybe they are both Boy Scouts.

Scout handshake - Wikipedia


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## gossamer88 (Jul 27, 2005)

Looks OK to me


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## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

I thought the handshake was weird too.

I'm beginning to think it's more likely that Mike is going to end up with the Thunderbolt, although I'm not sure how he'll activate it. "Say, you" isn't a common phrase in English any more.


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## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

Shakhari said:


> I thought the handshake was weird too.
> 
> I'm beginning to think it's more likely that Mike is going to end up with the Thunderbolt, although I'm not sure how he'll activate it. "Say, you" isn't a common phrase in English any more.


"What say you" is tho...


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## ej42137 (Feb 16, 2014)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> In between, she realized that the boss she idolized really IS a super-villain. I suspect that made her question her decisions to date...


It reminded me of Skyler's shift in "Breaking Bad", when Walter tells her he is the danger. But in the opposite direction, of course.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Shakhari said:


> I'm beginning to think it's more likely that Mike is going to end up with the Thunderbolt, although I'm not sure how he'll activate it. "Say, you" isn't a common phrase in English any more.


So cool.


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## Howie (May 3, 2004)

I missed the first few episodes. Who are the football player girl's parents and what's their story? They seem kind of ominous to me.


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## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Howie said:


> I missed the first few episodes. Who are the football player girl's parents and what's their story? They seem kind of ominous to me.


They are part of the Injustice Society, Sportsmaster and Tigress IIRC


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## oscarfish (Mar 2, 2009)

Since discovering that Courtney is not Starman's daughter, I was expecting that the locket was the key to a working staff. I was wrong.


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## Bill Reeves (Jul 18, 2002)

Shakhari said:


> I thought the handshake was weird too.
> 
> I'm beginning to think it's more likely that Mike is going to end up with the Thunderbolt, although I'm not sure how he'll activate it. "Say, you" isn't a common phrase in English any more.


In an early episode, Mike mentioned his new friend Jakeem, shortly after they moved to Blue Valley. It was kind of a throwaway line unless you're looking for easter eggs like that. But it would make some sense for Mike to get a hero role, and the Thunderbolt is the easiest one - it's not like he's going to find a power ring or get superspeed.


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## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

Bill Reeves said:


> In an early episode, Mike mentioned his new friend Jakeem, shortly after they moved to Blue Valley. It was kind of a throwaway line unless you're looking for easter eggs like that. But it would make some sense for Mike to get a hero role, and the Thunderbolt is the easiest one - it's not like he's going to find a power ring or get superspeed.


Courtney left Dr. Fate's helmet back at the mansion ...


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

oscarfish said:


> Since discovering that Courtney is not Starman's daughter, I was expecting that the locket was the key to a working staff. I was wrong.


I don't remember a "worthy" clause being added to the Cosmic Staff.
Also, I don't remember Sir Justin having Excalibur either.
(I recall it as just a sword that Merlin enhanced to be able to cut through just about anything.)


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Could Mike get anymore Obnoxious? I he went next level in Todays episode.

The season final next week should be action packed. 

That was interesting how todays episode's credits were silent. Wonder if that was supposed to represent lights out / Knocked Out.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

LoREvanescence said:


> Could Mike get anymore Obnoxious? I he went next level in Todays episode.


If I were a fraction as obnoxious to my father back in the early 70s as Mike is to Pat the big story on Action News that night would be "Father beats the bejesus out of mouthy son. Film at 11"

I got a chuckle from result of the principal being an idiot to Sportsmaster and Tigress.

Dr. Ito must keep the Blue Valley candle business making record profits.

I'm still surprised that this show has completely dropped the ball on Yolanda being on super-duper punishment. Nobody seemed to care about notifying Beth's parents that the gang wa leaving town either.


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## Howie (May 3, 2004)

I finally got caught up. I keep seeing Henry Thomas listed as special guest star or some such thing, but I swear I don't remember seeing him in any of the episodes. I thought he might be the janitor guy, but I was wrong on that.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Howie said:


> I finally got caught up. I keep seeing Henry Thomas listed as special guest star or some such thing, but I swear I don't remember seeing him in any of the episodes. I thought he might be the janitor guy, but I was wrong on that.


He's the voice of the original Doctor Midnite...the AI in the new Doctor Midnite's goggles.


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## Howie (May 3, 2004)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> He's the voice of the original Doctor Midnite...the AI in the new Doctor Midnite's goggles.


Ohhh. I would have never figured that one out.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Howie said:


> Ohhh. I would have never figured that one out.


Me neither.

Pat has some serious healing abilities.


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## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

cheesesteak said:


> If I were a fraction as obnoxious to my father back in the early 70s as Mike is to Pat the big story on Action News that night would be "Father beats the bejesus out of mouthy son. Film at 11"
> 
> I got a chuckle from result of the principal being an idiot to Sportsmaster and Tigress.
> 
> ...


You must not have kids. This pretty much sums up how all kids are today. It aint like when we were coming up.

They put a lot of emphasis on the violin case being on the ground. Wonder who's going to pick that up.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> He's the voice of the original Doctor Midnite...the AI in the new Doctor Midnite's goggles.


I believe that he also appeared as the original Dr. Midnite (briefly) in the pilot episode.


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## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

Where's there any previous mentions of the cabin? It seemed awfully convenient that they had a safehouse.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

And that cabin is a freakin' MANSION (at least on the outside; the interiors look much smaller)!


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Nobody ever seems to have noticed a Gigantor sized robot flying around.


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## justen_m (Jan 15, 2004)

cheesesteak said:


> Nobody ever seems to have noticed a Gigantor sized robot flying around.


I chalk things like this up to psychological invisibility, like the SEP field (Somebody Else's Problem) from HHGttG. From wiki


> The character Ford Prefect says,
> 
> An SEP is something we can't see, or don't see, or our brain doesn't let us see, because we think that it's somebody else's problem. That's what SEP means. Somebody Else's Problem. The brain just edits it out, it's like a blind spot.
> 
> ...


Sort of like how glasses can make people see Clark Kent and not Superman. Or how the body count seems to be commonly dismissed or explained away in many cities with supervillains/vampires/monsters/etc.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

justen_m said:


> I chalk things like this up to psychological invisibility, like the SEP field (Somebody Else's Problem) from HHGttG. From wiki
> 
> Sort of like how glasses can make people see Clark Kent and not Superman. Or how the body count seems to be commonly dismissed or explained away in many cities with supervillains/vampires/monsters/etc.


I always think about what goes through the city coroner's mind when he arrives at work the next morning after a superhero or John Wick type of battle.


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## cbrrider (Feb 2, 2005)

Shakhari said:


> Where's there any previous mentions of the cabin? It seemed awfully convenient that they had a safehouse.


Airbnb?


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## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

cheesesteak said:


> Nobody ever seems to have noticed a Gigantor sized robot flying around.


You also have to wonder why it has arms and legs. It's not the most efficient configuration for a flying weapons platform.


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## cbrrider (Feb 2, 2005)

cheesesteak said:


> Nobody ever seems to have noticed a Gigantor sized robot flying around.


Wonder what the mpg for that thing is.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

A warning about the season finalé from Matt Webb Mitovich: "Last but not least, you should know that there are at least two false endings/fades to black, so don't shut off your TV/laptop too quickly when you _think_ it's all over."

Matt's Inside Line: Scoop on Lucifer, Umbrella Academy, Greenleaf, Manifest, New Amsterdam, Stargirl and More


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

cheesesteak said:


> Nobody ever seems to have noticed a Gigantor sized robot flying around.


They don't even notice it walking in and out of the Pit Stop in broad daylight.

(I am impressed that they built a full sized physical version of it though.)


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

JYoung said:


> They don't even notice it walking in and out of the Pit Stop in broad daylight.


He has a private entrance in the back, duh!


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Maybe previous experiments by Dragon King and Brainwave made the residents of Blue Valley "mind blind" to this sort of thing.


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

Wow, talk about plot twists and surprises in this episode. It was my favorite episode of the season by far.


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## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

Great season finale. Some nice setups for next season.

Im the in middle of watching Community so at the very end I was like "Whats Jeff doing here?"


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## LoREvanescence (Jun 19, 2007)

The season final was in memory of Courtney Elizabeth Johns. Who was that? When googling that name all I find as a TWA Flight 800 victim. What significance does that have to the show?


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## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

LoREvanescence said:


> The season final was in memory of Courtney Elizabeth Johns. Who was that? When googling that name all I find as a TWA Flight 800 victim. What significance does that have to the show?


Maybe some relation to Geoff Johns?


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## mlsnyc (Dec 3, 2009)

LoREvanescence said:


> The season final was in memory of Courtney Elizabeth Johns. Who was that? When googling that name all I find as a TWA Flight 800 victim. What significance does that have to the show?


According to reddit she's Geoff Johns's sister.


__
https://www.reddit.com/r/StargirlTV/comments/i6zu70


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

"And I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for you meddling kids."


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## tigercat74 (Aug 7, 2004)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> A warning about the season finalé from Matt Webb Mitovich: "Last but not least, you should know that there are at least two false endings/fades to black, so don't shut off your TV/laptop too quickly when you _think_ it's all over."
> 
> Matt's Inside Line: Scoop on Lucifer, Umbrella Academy, Greenleaf, Manifest, New Amsterdam, Stargirl and More


McHale was one of the fades to black. What was the other one?


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## vertigo235 (Oct 27, 2000)

Great season, I hope it doesn't loose speed and become just another CW show due to decreased budget


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> "And I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for you meddling kids."


Sound like something a Scooby-Doo villain would say.

They got me when Baby Brainwave appeared. I was mentally shouting "This is stupid!" when Yolanda slashed his throat to reveal that it was really Brainwave Classic. Of course, I then mind shouted "I knew it!"

Pat might want to build some offensive weapons into STRIPE.

I know it's to show off Brec's/COurtney's/Stargirl's gymnastic skills but I still chuckle when she does flips in the middle of a fight.

Mike saved the day. And is still annoying.

I kept waiting for the Shining Knight to actually do something.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

cheesesteak said:


> I know it's to show off Brec's/Courtney's/Stargirl's gymnastic skills but I still chuckle when she does flips in the middle of a fight.


Is it her, though? I know she complained (or at least expressed disappointment) at how much of that the stunt woman does...


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Is it her, though? I know she complained (or at least expressed disappointment) at how much of that the stunt woman does...


They're all part of the character. I just think somersaults are odd things to do in the middle of life or death combat.

I also noticed that Stargirl rides the cosmic staff side saddle (or at least she did at the end of this episode). I guess there's no logically safer way to ride it and doing it the regular way would make her look like a witch.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

cheesesteak said:


> They're all part of the character. I just think somersaults are odd things to do in the middle of life or death combat.


Right, I just am not so sure that it's to show off the actor's skills, since it seems to be the stuntwoman who does most if not all of that...


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## cbrrider (Feb 2, 2005)

cheesesteak said:


> I kept waiting for the Shining Knight to actually do something.


Maybe in his spin off series. /s


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

LoREvanescence said:


> The season final was in memory of Courtney Elizabeth Johns. Who was that? When googling that name all I find as a TWA Flight 800 victim. What significance does that have to the show?


Courtney Johns was showrunner Geoff Johns sister.
As you've discovered, she was on board TWA Flight 800 when it went down.

He created the Courtney Whitmore character in tribute to her and based most of her personality on his sister.

Interesting finale and it did show that the JSA did better when they worked as a team.
So who told Cameron about his father?
Is that another loose end?

We also have the Fiddler's Violin (will young Isaac think the Dugans killed his mother).
Cindy and Eclipso (an ambitious villain to do on TV).
The Shade and Sylvester returning.
Grundy and the Gambler out running around.
Justin searching for the other Soldiers of Victory. And Winged Victory?
(And were Sportsmaster and Tigress taken into custody?)

So a fair amount for Season 2 to work with.


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## oscarfish (Mar 2, 2009)

Does anyone happen to know how many episodes will be in season two? I'm hoping it'll be another short-ish (13 episode) season. The plot move right along this season.


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## tigercat74 (Aug 7, 2004)

oscarfish said:


> Does anyone happen to know how many episodes will be in season two? I'm hoping it'll be another short-ish (13 episode) season. The plot move right along this season.


I think tv shows shouldn't be more than 10-13 episodes per season.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

I don't know anything about the comics but I assume the ISA has a deep roster. More of them got 86'd than I would have predicted.


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## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

JYoung said:


> Courtney Johns was showrunner Geoff Johns sister.
> As you've discovered, she was on board TWA Flight 800 when it went down.
> 
> He created the Courtney Whitmore character in tribute to her and based most of her personality on his sister.
> ...


Heh, I've been asking myself those same exact questions.


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## trainman (Jan 29, 2001)

Pretty sure anyone walking on the Blue Valley High football field -- to say nothing of running on it, or being tackled onto it -- would have noticed that it didn't seem to be built on solid ground.


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## Shakhari (Jan 2, 2005)

Another question: how did Cindy know about Eclipso? I wasn't surprised to see Shade, but that one came out of the blue.


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## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

tigercat74 said:


> I think tv shows shouldn't be more than 10-13 episodes per season.


I think they should simply be written by competent writers.


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## tigercat74 (Aug 7, 2004)

dswallow said:


> I think they should simply be written by competent writers.


That would help but I don't like filler episodes.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Shakhari said:


> Another question: how did Cindy know about Eclipso? I wasn't surprised to see Shade, but that one came out of the blue.


There was a scene in the second or third episode where Jordan is talking to William Zarek on his porch where Jordan says that Zarek hadn't tapped the potential of the jewel he had found.

If Cindy has been spying on the ISA for a while as implied (and she seems to have had access to quite of bit of information, perhaps in her father's files or using his credentials), she could have found out about it.


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## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

oscarfish said:


> Does anyone happen to know how many episodes will be in season two? I'm hoping it'll be another short-ish (13 episode) season. The plot move right along this season.


13 episodes seems to be the norm these days for most shows, unless they run for a full season, in which case they're more like 22-25 episodes. I was going to say that anything from the DCU tends to only run for 13 episodes, but season 1 of Doom Patrol was 15 episodes whereas season 2 only ran for 9. Season 1 of Titans was 11 episodes and season 2 had 13 so there doesn't seem to be a fixed pattern.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

mr.unnatural said:


> 13 episodes seems to be the norm these days for most shows, unless they run for a full season, in which case they're more like 22-25 episodes. I was going to say that anything from the DCU tends to only run for 13 episodes, but season 1 of Doom Patrol was 15 episodes whereas season 2 only ran for 9. Season 1 of Titans was 11 episodes and season 2 had 13 so there doesn't seem to be a fixed pattern.


Although those are two unusual examples. The last episode of Titans Season 1 was bumped to Season 2, so they were actually supposed to be two 12-episode seasons. And Doom Patrol Season 2 was supposed to be 10 episodes, but they had to cut production because of Covid.


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## gossamer88 (Jul 27, 2005)

Really enjoyed this series and is one of those rare times that I really looked forward to every week.

I was pretty surprised at the demise of the two villains. Did not see that coming. Or are they really dead? Hmmm...

Also FiOS went back to titling it DC's Stargirl. Good thing I did not delete that SP.


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## smak (Feb 11, 2000)

Nice to see an appearance of my city at the end.

-smak-


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

I'm surprised that I haven't seen much discussion about the fact that the JSA seemed OK with the idea of brainwashing 100 million people, as long the "manifesto" endorsed values that they themselves agree with:

*Chuck:* Beth--this appears to be the ISA's manifesto for the broadcast.
*Beth:* I think we have 35 minutes before they turn it on. Whatever they're going to make people believe in, they call it the 'New Constitution'. They want to combat...global warming? Oh, wait! They want to force people to...
*Courtney:* They're going to force people to what?
*Beth:* Force them to embrace solar and wind power. They're going to eliminate discrimination over race, relgion, sexual orientation.
*Rick:* You're kidding me.
*Beth:* Oh, and universal healthcare.
*Courtney:* That sounds good. Is that not good?
*Rick:* Hey, Pat? Are you sure we're on the right side?​
No mention was made of the idea that brainwashing people is just plain wrong. It is only after it's discovered that the process would have a 25% mortality rate that the team was galvanized to fight against the plan...


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## mlsnyc (Dec 3, 2009)

Amnesia said:


> I'm surprised that I haven't seen much discussion about the fact that the JSA seemed OK with the idea of brainwashing 100 million people, as long the "manifesto" endorsed values that they themselves agree with:
> 
> *Chuck:* Beth--this appears to be the ISA's manifesto for the broadcast.
> *Beth:* I think we have 35 minutes before they turn it on. Whatever they're going to make people believe in, they call it the 'New Constitution'. They want to combat...global warming? Oh, wait! They want to force people to...
> ...


It's because, if I recall the scene correctly, the JSA didn't get a chance to decide if they were okay with the brainwashing to proceed or not. The manifesto gave them pause and they were torn, but then the Gambler patched in to Dr. Midnight to let the JSA know the ISA knew what they were up to. Then all hell broke loose.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

mlsnyc said:


> It's because, if I recall the scene correctly, the JSA didn't get a chance to decide if they were okay with the brainwashing to proceed or not. The manifesto gave them pause and they were torn, but then the Gambler patched in to Dr. Midnight to let the JSA know the ISA knew what they were up to. Then all hell broke loose.


Yeah, their initial reaction was "Hey, this doesn't sound entirely evil!" Which is not an irrational initial reaction. Then before they had a chance to actually think about it, events overtook them.

Which is too bad, really...it would have been nice to see them work it out. But let's face it, this show isn't really long on philosophical reflection.


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## justen_m (Jan 15, 2004)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Yeah, their initial reaction was "Hey, this doesn't sound entirely evil!" Which is not an irrational initial reaction. Then before they had a chance to actually think about it, events overtook them.


The manifesto probably didn't mention that New America would be ruled by the Injustice League, or that seceding from the West and East Coast could trigger a civil war killing millions more.

[ObOffTopic]Are there any books that address part of America seceding and dealing with a modern-era civil war?


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## Johncv (Jun 11, 2002)

justen_m said:


> The manifesto probably didn't mention that New America would be ruled by the Injustice League, or that seceding from the West and East Coast could trigger a civil war killing millions more.
> 
> [ObOffTopic]Are there any books that address part of America seceding and dealing with a modern-era civil war?


I am reading Fractured State right now:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B018IAZMYW?ref_=dbs_m_mng_rwt_calw_0&storeType=ebooks


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## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

Looks like the Thunderbolt is coming out in season 2.

DC's Stargirl casts Jim Gaffigan as Thunderbolt for season 2 | EW.com


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

I recently rewatched _My Boys_, where Gaffigan played Andy Franklin for 4 seasons...he was good in that...


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## mlsnyc (Dec 3, 2009)

I just that this is now on HBO Max. And the running times are 50+ minutes, so I guess that means it includes scenes that weren't shown on CW.


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## series5orpremier (Jul 6, 2013)

KungFuCow said:


> Looks like the Thunderbolt is coming out in season 2.
> 
> DC's Stargirl casts Jim Gaffigan as Thunderbolt for season 2 | EW.com


It's extremely rare that I watch a CW series. The only one I've watched start to finish is Nikita, but with the casting this one has the potential to be my favorite CW series of all time. Part of the appeal of season one to me is it wasn't just a typical CW teen soap opera but featured a few older actors who I've heard of before and enjoyed in other things (Luke Wilson, Amy Smart, Joel McHale). Jim Gaffigan only adds to that and takes it to another level. The younger cast did OK too and I like how the emphasis was on the superhero story and action rather than high school romance.


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

mlsnyc said:


> I just that this is now on HBO Max. And the running times are 50+ minutes, so I guess that means it includes scenes that weren't shown on CW.


Yes. The series was released on both DC Universe and CW. The DC Universe episodes, which are now on HBO Max, are slightly longer, but there's nothing really in those extra that adds anything to the plot.


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