# New Roamio not playing well with Cable Cards



## TEG (Apr 8, 2014)

I purchased a TiVo Roamio off of eBay a few weeks ago, and have been having issues trying to get it connected. I received it a week ago Thursday, and moved the Cable Card from one of my Premieres to the Roamio. I then called TiVo for guidance, they had me call the Comcast activations line. After talking to the first tech, overseas, said to wait a hour. I called about an hour later, and had them try again. It appeared to work, as channels were slowly coming in, a bit pixelated, but that cleared up over a 40 minute period, and I was happy. I turned off the TV, went to bed, and to work in the morning. When I returned, I disconnected the Roamio and moved it to the Living room, where it was going to live. I connected everything exactly as the premiere had been, nothing, no channels. Conditional Access showed Val:?. I called Comcast, and they swore up and down that it was paired correctly, and to try another cable card. I did (which I stole from another Premiere), again, they paired it, and swore it was correct on their end. Nothing, except for 3 channels, Government Access, Local Access, and Weather Channel. I tried the card in the Premiers again, and both cards worked.

I contacted Comcast and TiVo several times, including calling Tech Support at Comcast, who transferred me to their TiVo Department, aka TiVo. I found an 855 number on these forums, for national repair, and finally found someone competent, and stateside. He found some errors on my account, and set about to fix them. He said that he would escalate it to the headend. He never gave me his name, but said he would call back the next day. He never called, so I called the 855 number again, and found another guy, who gave me his call back number, and he found the same problem, and tried to fix it. He said he would contact the headend and see what was going on. The next day I came home from work, and after speaking to the second tech again, I finally got Val:V, but still no channels. just "Searching for Signal (v52)", except for the 3 channels I mentioned earlier. I spoke to TiVo, and we started playing with the tuners, and afterwards channels started to come in. After I got off the phone, it appears another activation signal was sent by Comcast, and the channels disappeared, and I was back to the 3 before, and "v52". I finally had Comcast send out a tech, who had absolutely no idea what we were talking about, and ended up just changing the line on the outside of the house to the TiVo, with no change. However, he and another tech came out, and ended up having Comcast try to pair the other Card from earlier back to one of the boxes, and now that card doesn't work. I've since spoke to my Second National Repair Tech, and another National Repair Tech, and while the card says Val:V, nothing but those three channels (which I believe are added to the system separately from my local headend) are coming through.

Today I had another tech onsite, he replaced the internal wiring attached to the working TiVo, and it still wasn't working. He swapped the Cable Card, and paired it, and it wasn't working still, now with Val:?, but those three channels continued. He ended up leaving, saying he would speak with another tech from their dispatch center, and see what they could find out. I spoke to my third National Tech, and she said that after a conversation with another tech, she was told that because I have "Limited Basic" I couldn't use a TiVo. I thought that odd, and was called not 10 minutes later by my second national tech, who said that wasn't true otherwise none of the would have worked. He was going to look into it, and now my three channels don't work again.

One note, when I use the Signal Strength service on the TiVo, the 3 channels I do get end up between 70 and 80%, although now that they aren't coming in it is closer to 70%. I checked the remaining TiVo that it working and it says 75%-80% and has no issues.

My Questions..

1) Has anyone ever found any competent when dealing with Comcast and Cable Cards?

2) Has anyone had issues getting their channels, aside from the local access channels? Or ever just got the local access channels?

3) Could by TiVo Roamio, which was attached to another service be the problem due to being possibly attached in another segment of Comcast's system?

4) Could the length of the copper core of the coax be a problem, not providing enough signal or contact to the long Roamio's connector?

5) Could the Roamio itself be the problem, even though I'm getting the 3 channels?

Any other ideas would be appreciated.

TEG


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

Here's an idea.....they're idiots. Since you say you have limited basic, they put a trap on your line, blocking out certain frequencies that you're not supposed to get. I would have them remove the trap (even if temporary to see if that's it), and then make sure they "re-bind" the cards to your new devices, not just send authorization signals!

(P.S. - That's all in jest BTW, they're not "idiots", just ignorant to cablecards and how they're supposed to function)


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## waynomo (Nov 9, 2002)

I've read that having the TiVo tuned to channel 131 when validating can help.


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## ggieseke (May 30, 2008)

The number you want to call is 877-405-2298.


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## TEG (Apr 8, 2014)

ggieseke said:


> The number you want to call is 877-405-2298.


I was given that number by both TiVo and Comcast Tech Support. I never got anyone who knew anything, and they swear up and down that things are paired correctly, even though Val:?, instead of Val:V, and won't assist further.


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

On Comcast, you shouldn't even have to have a paired CableCard to get most channels. As long as the CableCard is properly activated on your account, you should be able to get almost all channels by just inserting the card into the TiVo. Only the premium channels actually require you to pair the card. When you initially moved the card from your Premiere to the Roamio, were you able to get any channels before you called Comcast to pair the card? 

The next time the tech is out, definitely make sure you have him try taking off all traps from the line as is suggested above. You could also try reseating the CableCard (pulling it out and pushing it back in). It's a long shot, but it never hurts to try.

Is this a base Roamio or is it the Plus/Pro model? If it's the base model, try OTA with an antenna and see what happens.


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## TEG (Apr 8, 2014)

tarheelblue32 said:


> The next time the tech is out, definitely make sure you have him try taking off all traps from the line as is suggested above. You could also try reseating the CableCard (pulling it out and pushing it back in). It's a long shot, but it never hurts to try.
> 
> Is this a base Roamio or is it the Plus/Pro model? If it's the base model, try OTA with an antenna and see what happens.


Thanks for that. When they were out yesterday, I suggested just that, but both techs who were onsite claimed there were no traps, at the house or on the pole. I think I've reseated the card a dozen times. The thing that bothers me is that the cards all work in the TiVo Premiere they haven't touched (even though it isn't running with its original cable card). One thing I have noticed, is on the working Premiere, when I insert any card, and leave the conditional access screen and go back to Live TV, it says "Acquiring Channel Information" for between 10 and 30 seconds, then starts playing Live TV. The Roamio did that once in this whole process, and the other two TiVos, don't do it at all.

It is a Plus, because I'm hoping to replace at least one of my Premieres with a Mini to get rid of the coax going from one room to another.


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

TEG said:


> Thanks for that. When they were out yesterday, I suggested just that, but both techs who were onsite claimed there were no traps, at the house or on the pole. I think I've reseated the card a dozen times. The thing that bothers me is that the cards all work in the TiVo Premiere they haven't touched (even though it isn't running with its original cable card). One thing I have noticed, is on the working Premiere, when I insert any card, and leave the conditional access screen and go back to Live TV, it says "Acquiring Channel Information" for between 10 and 30 seconds, then starts playing Live TV. The Roamio did that once in this whole process, and the other two TiVos, don't do it at all.
> 
> It is a Plus, because I'm hoping to replace at least one of my Premieres with a Mini to get rid of the coax going from one room to another.


Actually, that probably makes sense that there are no traps on the line. Since Comcast is all digital now, I doubt they really use traps anymore.

You may already know this, but just in case you don't, every time you insert a CableCard into a different device, you break the previous pairing that the card had. So, assuming you had the card properly paired to the Roamio, when you pull the card out and insert it into the Premiere, the pairing is broken and you would have to call back Comcast to pair the card. But on Comcast it really shouldn't matter, because (from what I understand) you only really need to pair the card to receive premium channels with Comcast.

You might also want to temporarily get your hands on a Comcast cable box and hook it up to make sure the Comcast box can work properly with your home wiring. But from everything you've said so far, it doesn't sound like a wiring issue. If the CableCards work fine in your Premiere but won't work in the Roamio, it is possible that the Roamio itself has some kind of hardware malfunction. I assume you have connected the Roamio to the internet and forced the connection to the TiVo servers to get any software updates. Have you checked to see what firmware version is on your CableCard?


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## TEG (Apr 8, 2014)

tarheelblue32 said:


> You may already know this, but just in case you don't, every time you insert a CableCard into a different device, you break the previous pairing that the card had. So, assuming you had the card properly paired to the Roamio, when you pull the card out and insert it into the Premiere, the pairing is broken and you would have to call back Comcast to pair the card. But on Comcast it really shouldn't matter, because (from what I understand) you only really need to pair the card to receive premium channels.


Odd, because it was exactly what the Comcast and TiVo reps told me to do. Also, when I put the cards back in their original boxes before the techs broke my other Premieres, I could swap the cards without issues (I had a card die in November, and ended up swapping it, which was painless). I'm currently on the phone with Comcast National Repair (and got my first Rep again), and he is actually having issues entering the information into the database, so I'm hoping that this is the source of the problem. Also, I have to have the card paired to get anything, because they decided in the Seattle area markets to encrypt all of the channels, instead of the Premiums or the Non-Locals.

I am on the Spring update on the Roamio, I believe. According to Comcast the cable cards are all up-to-date. It appears that when they are entering the information into their Database to pair the box and card, it isn't saving, so hopefully, by pulling the card off of the system, and re-adding it to my account will clear it, otherwise they are going to have to escalate it internally, or force a connection from the local headend.

Update - The Cable Card that had been placed in the Roamio as moved back to the Premire that the Techs had tried to re-pair. TV service was restored, but the Database won't let them pair it (internal error). When they were trying to pair the card that I had been using (which I realized was the one I got in November) it wouldn't even error or attempt to pair on their side. They are going to escalate the problem to the engineers, and I'm going to replace the card that we think is dead, and hopefully this will be solved. 13 days down, hopefully only two more to go.


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## aristoBrat (Dec 30, 2002)

TEG said:


> Update - The Cable Card that had been placed in the Roamio as moved back to the Premire that the Techs had tried to re-pair. TV service was restored, but the Database won't let them pair it (internal error). When they were trying to pair the card that I had been using (which I realized was the one I got in November) it wouldn't even error or attempt to pair on their side. They are going to escalate the problem to the engineers, and I'm going to replace the card that we think is dead, and hopefully this will be solved. 13 days down, hopefully only two more to go.


Hopefully it's a quick fix on their end. I like using my Roamio soooo much more than my Premieres. Hopefully you're in the same boat soon!

I had a similar problem with pairing a cable card in my Roamio. The cable card I used came from my old living room TiVo (a Premiere). When put in the Roamio, Cox would send the signals to pair it, and would say that their system showed it successfully paired. But the Roamio could not show encrypted channels (which are only HBO, Showtime, etc in my market), and the Val: field showed it wasn't paired. Hook the Premiere back up and put the card in it, and it would always pair properly. After a lot of troubleshooting, it turned out the SNR level was too high. I put a splitter on the coax to drop the SNR level, and then Cox was able to send the signals to pair the cable card, and it actually worked.

My Roamio was a "drop-in" replacement in my living room for an existing Premiere. The Romaio literally used the same coax cable, power cable, HDMI cable, USB cable/tuning adapter, and cable card that the Premiere did. The only thing that changed was "the TiVo box". The Premiere had zero problems with any of that, but the exact same setup gave too high of a SNR on the Roamio. Easy fix, just never expected to have that kind of problem using the same "infrastructure".


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## TEG (Apr 8, 2014)

Well, I was able to get a couple of CableCards, and am in the process of attempting to get them to work. My same three channels are now showing "Problem with the signal on this channel. Trying again. (V53)". I spoke to TiVo, and considering on my three channels I'm getting about 70% signal, I may need an amplifier. So, after work tomorrow, I'm heading to my local Radio Shack dealer and picking up an amplifier, to hopefully raise the signal strength. Failing that, TiVo has offered to replace the TiVo for a small fee.

Something the latest TiVo tech mentioned that I thought was odd, was that the Roamio does not have a built-in amplifier, which was mentioned by a previous tech as being true in a round-about way, "The Roamio is much more sensitive and should always work in the same location as a Premiere". Then again, I have always had issues here. When we had analog TV, the signal was never as good as at my Friends' houses. When we tried to get Cable Internet, they had to remove 6 filters from our line, then while we could get service, it only worked for a few hours a day. It also doesn't help that we are literally at the end of a service line for the Cable, as our cross-street is an arterial with its own cable lines, while ours comes from the other end of the block.

I shall report back tomorrow afternoon, hopefully with good news, especially given that these cards have all worked on the Premiers.


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## TEG (Apr 8, 2014)

Well, it appears it may be the TiVo, and might explain why it was being sold on eBay (they did have difficulties, but given I did have signal at one point, dismissed it as them not knowing what they were doing). I tried the amplifier, and it never changed the signal strength or the dB on the Roamio, but has worked wonders on my Premieres, taking them from 65% to 80-85% on most channels, and the locally injected are reaching 90%. I'm talking to TiVo right now about what to do now.


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## HSW (Oct 24, 2003)

After trying numerous cards and calls, I gave up and had TiVo exhange out my Premiere. That fixed it for me. Now I'm getting 2 Roamio's, and I'm prepared to send them back for exchange if the cards won't pair.


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## aristoBrat (Dec 30, 2002)

HSW said:


> After trying numerous cards and calls, I gave up and had TiVo exhange out my Premiere. That fixed it for me. Now I'm getting 2 Roamio's, and I'm prepared to send them back for exchange if the cards won't pair.


FWIW, I had a Roamio that wouldn't pair. Coincidently, the HDD in it died two days into the troubleshooting, so TiVo sent me another Roamio. The replacement Roamio wouldn't pair either. The issue was that the SNR level was too high. Had to put a 4-way splitter between the Roamio and the wall and then the Roamio paired instantly.

Hopefully you won't have any pairing problems, but if you do, it's probably worth letting TiVo support run through the troubleshooting before exchanging them.

Both of those Roamios that wouldn't initially pair used the same coax cable and cable jack as the Premiere that they replaced, and the Premiere had zero problems with SNR. So at least in my house, with the two Roamios I tried, there's something different about the Roamios compared to the Premiere/Series 3.


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## TEG (Apr 8, 2014)

Well, TiVo RMA'd the box, and I have a new one, now I can't even get through guided setup without it rebooting.


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## tzswjr (Jun 13, 2014)

I bought a Roamio, spent close to two days, with two different Roamio units and three cable cards, attempting to pair the cards to the Roamio....unsuccessfully. Returning the Roamio to Best Buy tomorrow. Both the national TWC cablecard techs and the local TWC techs consistently told me that their system does not play well with the Roamio. I was also told that there is an open TWC trouble ticket for this issue, and until that is resolved at the "engineering level" most TWC techs will not expend much effort to assist. Too bad, as my HD hard drive is failing and I don't know what direction to take. All this after nearly 5 flawless years with a cablecard in an HD, on this TWC system.


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## squint (Jun 15, 2008)

tzswjr said:


> Too bad, as my HD hard drive is failing and I don't know what direction to take. All this after nearly 5 flawless years with a cablecard in an HD, on this TWC system.


The TiVo HDs are pretty easy to repair. Maybe you could describe the symptoms in the Series 3 sub-forum.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

tzswjr said:


> I bought a Roamio, spent close to two days, with two different Roamio units and three cable cards, attempting to pair the cards to the Roamio....unsuccessfully. Returning the Roamio to Best Buy tomorrow. Both the national TWC cablecard techs and the local TWC techs consistently told me that their system does not play well with the Roamio. I was also told that there is an open TWC trouble ticket for this issue, and until that is resolved at the "engineering level" most TWC techs will not expend much effort to assist. Too bad, as my HD hard drive is failing and I don't know what direction to take. All this after nearly 5 flawless years with a cablecard in an HD, on this TWC system.


The trouble ticket should be written for the techs and CSRs, not the Roamio.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

I'm seeing a pattern with TW/TWC, and I don't even have them as my cableco...

1. Claiming 6 tuners are not supported
2. Claiming issues w/Roamio w/out specifics
3. Issuing equipment without proper instructions, and no "self-install kit", leaving the customer to know what they need and how to hook it up properly, requiring customer to buy a splitter and PoE filter for each TA (if required due to MoCA, and requiring the customer to know this).

Essentially, they are telling the people who request cablecards and TAs that they are going to have problems. They are bad-mouthing TiVo and succeeding in planting seeds of doubt.

Last I recall, discouraging the use of retail equipment had been outlawed.

I've been putting in overtime on TCF solving a great many problems *(mostly with TW)* by explaining that MoCA and TAs don't play well together. The TAs can't pass through the MoCA frequencies, plus the frequencies cause the TA to malfunction, even if a splitter is used, without a PoE filter on the TA leg.

Cox provides a "self install kit" for free with every TA issued. It comes with a splitter, cables, a MoCA PoE filter, and the proper diagram for using the splitter, PoE filter, and not using the coax-out port on the TA, but using the cable from the other splitter leg, instead.

TW badmouths TiVo, then just gives the customer the cablecard and/or TA, without any self-install kit, and not letting their customer know that just hooking it up the way it looks like it should hook up, is a recipe for problems.

I think that those stuck with TW, who have been helped by my posts, can thank me by banding together and filing complaints to the FCC about TW.

If Cox can get it right, TW can. I don't think, even for a moment, that the absence of proper instructions is an innocent oversight. I can say that Cox is generous by including the extra hardware in their kits, at no charge. Where I draw the line is TW not providing a simple sheet of paper with the diagram and instructions Cox provides, which applies to TW installs as well. TW may not have an obligation to throw in the kit contents for free, but the customer should get the instructions and know what they need to get, and how to hook it up, correctly.

If no MoCA is involved, the kit hardware isn't needed. But, it seems to me, the people not using MoCA at all, are the minority, and the numbers are shrinking.

All this to say, and I'm not even a TW customer... I'm just the guy trying to reverse the seeds of doubt TW plants, and counteract the bad experience they want their customers to attribute to TiVo.

I wonder just how many people with TW wind up returning new Roamios, and renting TW boxes, instead, and never find their way here. I think TiVo would like to know, and would like the FCC to know, as well.


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## aristoBrat (Dec 30, 2002)

nooneuknow said:


> Cox provides a "self install kit" for free with every TA issued. It comes with a splitter, cables, a MoCA PoE filter, and the proper diagram for using the splitter, PoE filter, and not using the coax-out port on the TA, but using the cable from the other splitter leg, instead.
> 
> TW badmouths TiVo, then just gives the customer the cablecard and/or TA, without any self-install kit, and not letting their customer know that just hooking it up the way it looks like it should hook up, is a recipe for problems.
> 
> ...


This will probably be the only time in history that I admit to actually being happy that I have Cox for a provider.


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## CrispyCritter (Feb 28, 2001)

tzswjr said:


> I bought a Roamio, spent close to two days, with two different Roamio units and three cable cards, attempting to pair the cards to the Roamio....unsuccessfully. Returning the Roamio to Best Buy tomorrow. Both the national TWC cablecard techs and the local TWC techs consistently told me that their system does not play well with the Roamio. I was also told that there is an open TWC trouble ticket for this issue, and until that is resolved at the "engineering level" most TWC techs will not expend much effort to assist. Too bad, as my HD hard drive is failing and I don't know what direction to take. All this after nearly 5 flawless years with a cablecard in an HD, on this TWC system.


Get names and exact quotes and file a complaint with the FCC. TW upper management should make sure things work after they get the complaint from the FCC.

I had no problems with my Roamio and TW, but that was because I had to do everything myself (the original installer had never heard of a tuning adapter, and told me that the TiVo itself was the tuning adapter, and that he was an expert.) Working with the national cable line was fine.


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