# Step by step process to copy and expand via MFSTools?



## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

for dummies? I have a new 6tb drive and want to replace a 3tb drive that I have hooked up externally to my Bolt. The MFStools thread is huge and a looked through it for a while but I couldn't find some simple instructions on how to do it. I've burned a CD, but I'm not even sure I did that correctly.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> for dummies? I have a new 6tb drive and want to replace a 3tb drive that I have hooked up externally to my Bolt. The MFStools thread is huge and a looked through it for a while but I couldn't find some simple instructions on how to do it. I've burned a CD, but I'm not even sure I did that correctly.


Do you just want to replace the 3 TB external with a 6 TB external or are you wanting to combine the internal drive with the 3 TB external drive onto one 6 TB drive?

Did you get the ISO off of equinoxes github or somewhere else.

Lastly are you on TE3 or TE4?

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

jmbach said:


> Do you just want to replace the 3 TB external with a 6 TB external or are you wanting to combine the internal drive with the 3 TB external drive onto one 6 TB drive?
> 
> Did you get the ISO off of equinoxes github or somewhere else.
> 
> ...


The 3tb drive I am now using is "external" only in the sense it is a 3.5" drive outside the Bolt box connected via sata cable into the Bolt's mother board. I simply want to replace it with the 6tb drive. I am on TE3. 
I got the ISO via the link in the MFSTools thread I think it was github. It was the latest link you recently provided.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> The 3tb drive I am now using is "external" only in the sense it is a 3.5" drive outside the Bolt box connected via sata cable into the Bolt's mother board. I simply want to replace it with the 6tb drive. I am on TE3.
> I got the ISO via the link in the MFSTools thread I think it was github. It was the latest link you recently provided.


Follow the instructions in the 10TB Roamio DIY thread. Since you are using a 6TB, you do not need to limit the size of your mfsadd command when you do your expansion.

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

jmbach said:


> Follow the instructions in the 10TB Roamio DIY thread. Since you are using a 6TB, you do not need to limit the size of your mfsadd command when you do your expansion.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


Thanks for your help. You missed the part of my post: "for dummies". 
Here's step one of my plan. I'm going to get a Sabrent two bay dock and first run the check on the new drive. Then I'll clone the 3tb existing drive to the new 6tb drive.
But this is where the "I am a dummy" part comes. I have no idea what to do with MFStools. I'm not even sure I burned the right thing to a cd. There were several items on the GitHub link, I only burned the .iso. But then how do I proceed from there? What exactly do I do? Do I boot up my pc from the CD? 
Thanks for your help. Sorry if I am an annoyance.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> Thanks for your help. You missed the part of my post: "for dummies".
> Here's step one of my plan. I'm going to get a Sabrent two bay dock and first run the check on the new drive. Then I'll clone the 3tb existing drive to the new 6tb drive.
> But this is where the "I am a dummy" part comes. I have no idea what to do with MFStools. I'm not even sure I burned the right thing to a cd. There were several items on the GitHub link, I only burned the .iso. But then how do I proceed from there? What exactly do I do? Do I boot up my pc from the CD?
> Thanks for your help. Sorry if I am an annoyance.


No annoyance.

Yes, you boot your PC off of the CD. The new MFSTools has two kernels that can be booted. Choose the one without the -tivo.
You do have to be careful what you do as you have access to all drives connected to your computer. So if you want to be extra careful you can disconnect the drives on your PC before booting the CD.

The new thing with the latest MFSTools is that you have to preceed each command with 'sudo'. For example you would run mfsinfo by typing 'sudo mfsinfo /dev/sda' if the TiVo drive was sda.

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

jmbach said:


> No annoyance.
> 
> Yes, you boot your PC off of the CD. The new MFSTools has two kernels that can be booted. Choose the one without the -tivo.
> You do have to be careful what you do as you have access to all drives connected to your computer. So if you want to be extra careful you can disconnect the drives on your PC before booting the CD.
> ...


Thanks. Was I correct in only burning the .iso item to the CD?

I'll probably be back at you after I get the dock and do the clone.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> Thanks. Was I correct in only burning the .iso item to the CD?
> 
> I'll probably be back at you after I get the dock and do the clone.


Yes.

Try just booting cd to get to the command prompt and run 'sudo lsblk -name,vendor' to get a list of attached drives while you are waiting.

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

I'm doing something wrong. I downloaded the .iso (just the one 492MB file) and then burned the files to a CD. Tried to boot from the CD (restart, F12, chose the DVD player, but it seemed to get bypassed and went to SSD and started the PC in Windows.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> I'm doing something wrong. I downloaded the .iso (just the one 492MB file) and then burned the files to a CD. Tried to boot from the CD (restart, F12, chose the DVD player, but it seemed to get bypassed and went to SSD and started the PC in Windows.


How did you burn the ISO to the CD

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

When I downloaded the file it went into some pseudo dvd drive. I’m sure I’m using the wrong term. So I copied the files and pasted them into a cd r/w I had in my DVD drive. I did format the cd to erase some stuff on it ahead of time. Maybe that messed something up?


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

That won't work. You lose the ability to boot off of it. 
The ISO is like a raw image of a CD and it has to be placed on the CD the same way. 

I use ImgBurn. It is free and works well. 

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

jmbach said:


> That won't work. You lose the ability to boot off of it.
> The ISO is like a raw image of a CD and it has to be placed on the CD the same way.
> 
> I use ImgBurn. It is free and works well.
> ...


Okay. Thanks, done. Burned the cd and booted. Ran the drive command with just the existing drives in my PC and saw what that looked like.

I assume when I run the mfsadd command that the target drive won't be sdY, not Y but the actual letter that the drive command gives for the new 6tb drive.
Got the dock today so I will be testing the new drive. I will then have to wait for an opportune time to clone. Any idea on clone time? the 3tb drive will be full including deleted shows.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> Okay. Thanks, done. Burned the cd and booted. Ran the drive command with just the existing drives in my PC and saw what that looked like.
> 
> I assume when I run the mfsadd command that the target drive won't be sdY, not Y but the actual letter that the drive command gives for the new 6tb drive.
> Got the dock today so I will be testing the new drive. I will then have to wait for an opportune time to clone. Any idea on clone time? the 3tb drive will be full including deleted shows.


You are correct. The X and Y in MFSTools instructions are placeholders for the actual drive letters.

I am not sure about the cloning time. Depends on what type of USB connection between the dock and computer. It will be less than the full read or write to the 6TB.

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

Just to be sure, since my existing drive is 3tb, I must use MFStools to do the cloning. I won’t be able to simply clone using the dock. (Instructions in the 10tb thread say you can only clone ahead of time if the existing drive is 4tb or larger.) Just wanted to confirm that hasn’t changed. 

the dock has a usb3 connection. So if I do the erase as part of the prep on the new drive, that time should be somewhat more than the cloning time? Just trying to see what kind of time window I need to get it done.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> Just to be sure, since my existing drive is 3tb, I must use MFStools to do the cloning. I won't be able to simply clone using the dock. (Instructions in the 10tb thread say you can only clone ahead of time if the existing drive is 4tb or larger.) Just wanted to confirm that hasn't changed.
> 
> the dock has a usb3 connection. So if I do the erase as part of the prep on the new drive, that time should be somewhat more than the cloning time? Just trying to see what kind of time window I need to get it done.


Well you can clone with the dock but then you will need to do more than one mfsadd iteration. I really recommend copying with MFSTools rather than cloning.

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## Stallion (Dec 13, 2021)

Sorry to join in, but I am new here. I have a failing HD and I believe I'm trying to do the same thing as UCLABB. I get the concept but can't seem to get the Mfstools to download! Is there a place to get this iso that isn't Mfslive.org? I believe i have the command line. drives are hooked up and ready to go. I already lost my programs following someone elses advice, I'm guessing I will have to redo setup just to make it work. I just don't want to lose the lifetime sub and I'm on a Premier Series 4. Not meaning to hijack your thread but can you perhaps help? thanks in advance, and again, my apologies for interrupting...


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

Stallion said:


> Sorry to join in, but I am new here. I have a failing HD and I believe I'm trying to do the same thing as UCLABB. I get the concept but can't seem to get the Mfstools to download! Is there a place to get this iso that isn't Mfslive.org? I believe i have the command line. drives are hooked up and ready to go. I already lost my programs following someone elses advice, I'm guessing I will have to redo setup just to make it work. I just don't want to lose the lifetime sub and I'm on a Premier Series 4. Not meaning to hijack your thread but can you perhaps help? thanks in advance, and again, my apologies for interrupting...


Look in the MFSTools 3.2 thread

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## ClearToLand (Jul 10, 2001)

Stallion said:


> Sorry to join in, but I am new here. I have a failing HD and *I believe I'm trying to do the same thing as UCLABB*...
> 
> ...I just don't want to lose the lifetime sub and *I'm on a Premier Series 4*...


Sadly, you're *NOT* doing exactly the same thing as @UCLABB - he's on a Bolt, Series 6, and you're on a Premiere, Series 4. Starting with Roamio, Series 5, TiVo made the units capable of '_self-formatting_'. For Series 4 and earlier, you need an image.

Use ADVANCED SEARCH:
UserID: ggieseke 
keyword: sent
and you'll find all the info that you need to supply to get the proper image and install it.

Best of luck!


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## ClearToLand (Jul 10, 2001)

jmbach said:


> Look in the MFSTools 3.2 thread
> 
> Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


He'll probably be better served with the DvrBARS thread, IIRC .


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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

ClearToLand said:


> Sadly, you're *NOT* doing exactly the same thing as @UCLABB - he's on a Bolt, Series 6, and you're on a Premiere, Series 4. Starting with Roamio, Series 5, TiVo made the units capable of '_self-formatting_'. For Series 4 and earlier, you need an image.
> 
> Use ADVANCED SEARCH:
> 
> ...


Oddly enough I was in Stallion's shoes many years ago with a Premiere 4 tuner model and indeed got an image from Greg to set up a new HDD. Used DVRBARS too.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

ClearToLand said:


> He'll probably be better served with the DvrBARS thread, IIRC .


Likely.

If his original drive is salvageable he could use MFSTools. If not then DvrBARS is the way to go for him. (Probably be better with a fresh image from ggieseke since he already lost his recordings)

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

jmbach said:


> Follow the instructions in the 10TB Roamio DIY thread. *Since you are using a 6TB, you do not need to limit the size of your mfsadd command when you do your expansion. *
> 
> Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


New 6tb drive has been tested and erased. I will be doing the clone (from 3tb drive to 6tb drive) overnight (I presume that can take place unattended) and then tomorrow morning doing add. In the above bolded sentence, what would be the command to use rather than *mfsadd -xcm 2040 /dev/sdY*? BTW, I get a little thrown by the spaces so I need the exact command. Thanks.

I just got worried about the time window for cloning. Are we talking about hours or days? I have a two bay dock connected with a USB3 cable to USB port.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> New 6tb drive has been tested and erased. I will be doing the clone (from 3tb drive to 6tb drive) overnight (I presume that can take place unattended) and then tomorrow morning doing add. In the above bolded sentence, what would be the command to use rather than *mfsadd -xcm 2040 /dev/sdY*? BTW, I get a little thrown by the spaces so I need the exact command. Thanks.
> 
> I just got worried about the time window for cloning. Are we talking about hours or days? I have a two bay dock connected with a USB3 cable to USB port.


mfsadd -xc /dev/sdY

Remember Y is a placeholder for the actual drive name.

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

Failure. Doing copy command got message "cannot determine primary boot partition from boot sector".


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> Failure. Doing copy command got message "cannot determine primary boot partition from boot sector".
> 
> View attachment 66215


 This is where you read the my post with instructions and explanations. To solve your issue.

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

jmbach said:


> This is where you read the my post with instructions and explanations. To solve your issue.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


LOL! *Now, *I've read it. "Added a couple of tools to be run on a Series 5 and later TiVo.
-*bootsectorfix* - If you run MFSTools on a Series 5 or later TiVo and get an error that states something like "Can not determine primary boot partition from boot sector", then running this program on that drive will attempt to fix the boot sector to resolve that error." 
I'll give that a try. sudo -bootsectorfix How do I designate the drive to run that on?

Also noted a blurb about connecting a drive via USB3. Does it still hold that there is a problem connecting to a USB3 port?


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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

@jmbach answers to the above? I'd like to give it another shot tonight.


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## Stallion (Dec 13, 2021)

jmbach said:


> Likely.
> 
> If his original drive is salvageable he could use MFSTools. If not then DvrBARS is the way to go for him. (Probably be better with a fresh image from ggieseke since he already lost his recordings)
> 
> Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


Thanks everyone who replied and for the referral to ggieseke. I am going to try the DVRbars tonight


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> LOL! *Now, *I've read it. "Added a couple of tools to be run on a Series 5 and later TiVo.
> -*bootsectorfix* - If you run MFSTools on a Series 5 or later TiVo and get an error that states something like "Can not determine primary boot partition from boot sector", then running this program on that drive will attempt to fix the boot sector to resolve that error."
> I'll give that a try. sudo -bootsectorfix How do I designate the drive to run that on?
> 
> Also noted a blurb about connecting a drive via USB3. Does it still hold that there is a problem connecting to a USB3 port?


USB issues should be resolved with the latest version. I recommend not choosing the -tivo kernel when booting the ISO.

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

jmbach said:


> USB issues should be resolved with the latest version. I recommend not choosing the -tivo kernel when booting the ISO.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


My main question was how do designate the target drive when I run -bootsectorfix?


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> My main question was how do designate the target drive when I run -bootsectorfix?


/dev/sdY where Y is the placeholder for the source drive.

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

jmbach said:


> /dev/sdY where Y is the placeholder for the source drive.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


Thought that was it, but too scary to do it on my own.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

UCLABB said:


> Thought that was it, but too scary to do it on my own.


Any update to your project?

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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

jmbach said:


> Any update to your project?
> 
> Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk


I'm so embarrassed. I botched it. Did the bootsectorfix. Did the copy overnight successfully. Woke up, still kinda drowsy and thought just run the add command and I'm good to go. Pulled the new drive and stuck it in the Bolt. Went to beginning of guided setup. Whoops! Thought about it and then remembered I didn't do the addfix command. Pulled drive and tried addfix but apparently too late as drive was probably formatted by the Bolt. 
Put old drive in Bolt and that was formatted and all content lost.

not a huge loss, I had saved irreplaceable content and of course season passes. Honestly, probably a good thing as a lot of that stuff I was never going to get around viewing. 
Fortunately I was able to get the cable card paired fairly quickly. Spectrum guy I talked to was experienced and said they all got trained in it. 
Finally, I want to profusely apologize for taking up your time and then screwing up. Just carelessness on my part because the necessary instructions are there and you clarified the issues I had.
Thanks for your help. Sometime soon I'll erase the 6tb drive and go back through it again. This time I'll be more careful.


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## ClearToLand (Jul 10, 2001)

@jmbach ,

I'm 'piggybacking' here because I'm attempting a 'similar' upgrade.

In preparation for upgrading my main, active, Lifetime w/cablecard TE3 500GB Roamio Basic to 3TB, I took the 500GB HDD from a second 500GB Roamio Basic (unsubscribed but updated to the latest TE3), used ddrescue (from MFSTools v3.34-2 October 2021) to copy it to a new WD Blue 1TB (CMR) HDD WD10EZEX (Zero-filled with WD Data Lifeguard READ / WRITE / READ) - MFSINFO picture attached - 20220219A







),
used the command:

```
sudo mfsadd -xcm 2048 /dev/sdb
```
which appeared successful (picture attached 20220219B - I don't know how, yet, to copy a Linux terminal session to a .TXT file, like a DOS session on a Windows PC)








followed with:

```
sudo mfsaddfix
```
got the error: "*Something is very wrong here! Exiting.....*" (picture attached - 20220219C)








and finished off with the command:

```
sudo mfsinfo -d /dev/sdb
```
which stated: "*Zone map checksum error.*" (picture attached - 20220219D)









Did the "2048" screw me up? I'm so used to the powers of two (256 / 1024 / 2048 / etc...), that I entered 2048 instead of 2040.

The logic behind my choice of 'methodology' is that my Roamio Basic 500GB HDD is the original from 2015 and has randomly displayed some 'pixelated' shows. I figured a nice, simple one-pass ddrescue with "-f -n -v" (Force Write Output, No Scrub, No Retries, Verbose Level 1) would copy the basics, then two "MFSADD / MFSADDFIX" commands would expand the 500GB to 2.5TB, then 3TB.

What did I do wrong?

Thanks!


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

ClearToLand said:


> @jmbach ,
> 
> I'm 'piggybacking' here because I'm attempting a 'similar' upgrade.
> 
> ...


You did not do anything wrong. The issue is that you did not download the latest MFSTools which fixed the problem you encountered. We can fix this manually if you would like. 

I think I would have used mfscopy to copy the 500 GB image to the 1 TB as it keeps the MFS partitions balanced. If I was worried about bad sectors would use ddrescue to copy the original to another drive and then use mfscopy to place the image on the 1 TB drive. 

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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

Wait I am confused.

You have 4 drives.
500 GB from Lifetime Roamio
500 GB from Unsubscribed Roamio
1 TB drive
3 TB drive

I understand that you used ddrescue to copy the 500 GB to the 1 TB. So how are you placing the image on the 3 TB?
Which 500 GB image did you place on the 1 TB?



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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

If you rescued the 500 GB to the 1 TB. Then I would use mfscopy to copy that image to the 3 TB. 

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## ClearToLand (Jul 10, 2001)

jmbach said:


> *You did not do anything wrong*...


Thank goodness. I read, and prepare, so much that I was greatly disappointed when I saw the error(s).



jmbach said:


> ...*The issue is that you did not download the latest MFSTools which fixed the problem* you encountered. *We can fix this manually* if you would like...


I did SEARCH for those error strings listed above and didn't find anything current, or relevant, AFAICT. If the latest MFSTools fixes this, I'll upgrade my Ventoy USB Flashdrive. How complicated is fixing it manually?



jmbach said:


> I think *I would have used mfscopy* to copy the 500 GB image to the 1 TB as it *keeps the MFS partitions balanced*. If I was worried about bad sectors would use ddrescue to copy the original to another drive and then use mfscopy to place the image on the 1 TB drive...


I don't recall seeing anything 'warning' folks about my 'methodology' (ddrescue -> MFSADD / MFSADDFIX). I can certainly use a '_middleman / holding / temp_' HDD for my 'real' upgrade - 500GB Original ddrescue -> 1TB Temp MFSCopy / MFSADD / MFSADDFIX -> 3TB Final Destination.


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## ClearToLand (Jul 10, 2001)

jmbach said:


> Wait I am confused.
> 
> You have 4 drives:
> 500 GB from Lifetime Roamio
> ...


I used ddrescue to copy #2 to #3 as a 'dry run', followed by MFSADD / MFSADDFIX. The "REAL" upgrade was going to be #1 to #4, but now you suggest if #1 'might' have a few bad sectors, I'll use ddrescue to copy #1 to #3, then MFSCopy to copy (and expand) #3 to #4.

Right?

Do I need to WRITE FULL ZEROS to #3 and #4 again? Or just WRITE QUICK ZEROS.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

ClearToLand said:


> How complicated is fixing it manually?


Not very. PM me and we can go over the steps.



ClearToLand said:


> I don't recall seeing anything 'warning' folks about my 'methodology' (ddrescue -> MFSADD / MFSADDFIX). I can certainly use a '_middleman / holding / temp_' HDD for my 'real' upgrade - 500GB Original ddrescue -> 1TB Temp MFSCopy / MFSADD / MFSADDFIX -> 3TB Final Destination.


Your methodology works, just not as efficient if you keep the MFS partitions balanced. 
My preferred ddrescue -> 1 TB then mfscopy -> 3 TB


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

ClearToLand said:


> I used ddrescue to copy #2 to #3 as a 'dry run', followed by MFSADD / MFSADDFIX. The "REAL" upgrade was going to be #1 to #4, but now you suggest if #1 'might' have a few bad sectors, I'll use ddrescue to copy #1 to #3, then MFSCopy to copy (and expand) #3 to #4.
> 
> Right?


That is correct.


ClearToLand said:


> Do I need to WRITE FULL ZEROS to #3 and #4 again? Or just WRITE QUICK ZEROS.


No, just a quick erase will do.


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## ClearToLand (Jul 10, 2001)

jmbach said:


> Not very. PM me and we can go over the steps...


I'm eating dinner and retiring for the evening - can we pick this up tomorrow sometime? Afternoon?



jmbach said:


> ...Your methodology works, just not as efficient if you keep the MFS partitions balanced.
> My preferred ddrescue -> 1 TB then mfscopy -> 3 TB


Have you discussed / explained "unbalanced MFS partitions" here on TCF? If so, please point me to the LINK and I'll read up on it.

What would happen if I installed the 'current w/errors' 1TB HDD in the unsubscribed Roamio Basic? Would it 'fix' it itself? Would a 'Kickstart 58' fix it? Would it just re-format the HDD? Curious...


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

ClearToLand said:


> I'm eating dinner and retiring for the evening - can we pick this up tomorrow sometime? Afternoon?


Just send me a PM when you are ready.



ClearToLand said:


> Have you discussed / explained "unbalanced MFS partitions" here on TCF? If so, please point me to the LINK and I'll read up on it.


It was a discussion about 8 or 9 years ago. Essentially the physical partition layout on the drive is MFS media - OS - MFS app - MFS media. The OS and MFS app partitions are located in the middle of the physical drive. The MFS app partitions contains some basic information of the MFS system and describes the MFS media partitions. So all the information to find the recordings is located in the physical middle of the drive. When we start adding partitions, we add a pair of partitions. MFS app and MFS media. The app partition describes the media partition. The new app partition is physically distant from the the original central app partitions. Each added pair of MFS partitions places the added app partition that much further from the original app partitions. Consequently, we are getting more head travel and seeks depending on where the information for the recording lies. This slows down reading and writing to the drive making it less efficient. 



ClearToLand said:


> What would happen if I installed the 'current w/errors' 1TB HDD in the unsubscribed Roamio Basic? Would it 'fix' it itself? Would a 'Kickstart 58' fix it? Would it just re-format the HDD? Curious...


It would likely reformat the drive to fix itself.


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