# Tuning adapter???



## wthomas69 (Nov 28, 2009)

What is a tuning adapter? Some channels are missing on my TiVo bolt, I called my cable company and they said those channels were removed from the Cable card. Would I need a tuning adapter to get these back? I tried a different cable card and that did not fix the issue. I have had this TiVo bolt with the cable card combination for the last seven years and everything was fine until about a month ago when I discovered ESPN and ESPN2 as well as USA with no longer working


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

Who is your provider and do they use tuning adapters (switched digital video)?


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## wthomas69 (Nov 28, 2009)

mdavej said:


> Who is your provider and do they use tuning adapters (switched digital video)?


Cablevision optimum is the provider. I have had this TiVo bolt and a cable card for the last seven years with no issues without using a tuning adapter. About a month ago I noticed I no longer have ESPN ESPN two or USA. After several calls a text showed up And he had no idea how to fix it and not have a cable card. A week later a second tech showed up with a cable card but had no idea how to install it or initialize it. Flash forward to today I got a cable card and a tuning adapter from my cable provider. Installed and the new cable card and had it paired. At that point I have even less channels than before including no ESPN no ESPN2 and no USA but also lost CNM. Proceeded to install the tuning adapter but it never gets past the set up. Called optimum back on the telephone and they are sending me another tuning adapter by FedEx to arrive on Monday. They did tell me that ESPN and ESPN2 have been removed from the cable card set up but are not aware if the tuning adapter will bring them back. If that happens I guess my only option would be to discontinue all of my TiVo gear and break down and get a cable box.


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

Your card isn’t really paired. And they apparently don’t know how to activate a tuning adapter either. How did you connect it?


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## wthomas69 (Nov 28, 2009)

mdavej said:


> Your card isn’t really paired. And they apparently don’t know how to activate a tuning adapter either. How did you connect it?


cable into TA then out to tivo, tuning adapter never finshes setup, they are sending new one thru fedex monday. rep to me espn/espn2 have been permanately removed from cable card devices. They are sending another tech on wednesday


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

If TA is Motorola or Arris, I would split the cable from the wall, one leg to TA, the other to Tivo. Otherwise signal loss is massive and you'll lose even more channels. Some TA's don't like Moca either, so if you're running that, put a Moca POE filter on the TA input and do the split I said above. For a TA to work, it just has to be authorized and enabled on cable company end. No reason for a tech visit other than he can probably phone the right people to get it done.

The only way a channel would be removed from "cable card" is if it moved to IPTV, in which case you'd eventually lose all channels.


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## wthomas69 (Nov 28, 2009)

mdavej said:


> If TA is Motorola or Arris, I would split the cable from the wall, one leg to TA, the other to Tivo. Otherwise signal loss is massive and you'll lose even more channels. Some TA's don't like Moca either, so if you're running that, put a Moca POE filter on the TA input and do the split I said above. For a TA to work, it just has to be authorized and enabled on cable company end. No reason for a tech visit other than he can probably phone the right people to get it done.
> 
> The only way a channel would be removed from "cable card" is if it moved to IPTV, in which case you'd eventually lose all channels.


It is a Cisco tuning adapter and I hooked it up by the instructions that were included. The feed is not split as you mention the feed goes directly into the tuning adapter then out of the adapter and into the TiVo. Once the tuning adapter has completed its cycle I am then to hook the two devices together with a USB cable but the tuning adapter does not finish its cycle even though it is authorized by my cable company that is why they are sending another one through FedEx tomorrow. I I am running mocha for my two minis and I already have a filter. In terms of the channels being removed it was again confirmed today by optimum. ESPN and ESPN2 are no longer available on cable card devices. Channels removed also include Showtime STARZ and HBO . A cable technician is arriving on Wednesday hopefully he has some experience with cable cards by then I should have the new tuning adapter. Optimum has already told me that in very short while they will abandon all support for cable card systems as it is no longer required after a ruling by the FCC


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## cwoody222 (Nov 13, 1999)

There’s no such thing as removing channels from cable card devices.

I suspect a few possible misinterpretations when you spoke to the rep.

- as stated above if Optimim moved those channels to IPTV delivery then CC could not receive them. But I do not believe Optimum had moved any channels exclusively to IPTV. And no linear cable company has yet to move major channels like the ones you mention

- the rep could have meant those channels are now using SDV which require the tuning adapter. But that doesn’t mean they’re not being decided by the cards too. It would be unusual for those major channels to use SDV however.

- the rep was just wrong/lying

I’d ask WHY the channels are no longer available via cable card. If they don’t have an answer such as “those channels are being delivered via IPTV exclusively now” then they’re full of it.


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## wthomas69 (Nov 28, 2009)

cwoody222 said:


> There’s no such thing as removing channels from cable card devices.
> 
> I suspect a few possible misinterpretations when you spoke to the rep.
> 
> ...


I only have the information that was given to me by the cable company from multiple representatives. What started this whole fiasco is that the TiVo is not receiving any digital Signal on channel 735 and 736 which is ESPN and ESPN2. Channels on either side of it 731 744 748 etc. all have more than 90% digital signal strength ESPN and ESPN2 are receiving zero digital signal with both cable cards. Going to try a second tuning adapter when it arrives today the first Cisco tuning adapter would not even complete it’s set up. Maybe it’s optimum his way of finally getting rid of cable card customers. Because as of October 2020 the FCC declared the cable companies no longer have to support the technology


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## cwoody222 (Nov 13, 1999)

No. Just because the FCC doesn’t mandate support doesn’t mean that a massive telecommunication company ceases support by shrugging their shoulders and telling customers “oops sorry”.

If your channels were no longer available via cable card due to whatever reason they would have a published verifiable change of service agreement to quote to you which you would have previously been informed of.


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## wthomas69 (Nov 28, 2009)

cwoody222 said:


> No. Just because the FCC doesn’t mandate support doesn’t mean that a massive telecommunication company ceases support by shrugging their shoulders and telling customers “oops sorry”.
> 
> If your channels were no longer available via cable card due to whatever reason they would have a published verifiable change of service agreement to quote to you which you would have previously been informed of.


they very well may have. My bill is auto pay and I never read the emails from optimum because 90% of the time it’s an ad for some new service. Tucked away on the terms of service could’ve very well been some thing that said they were changing channels or deleting them. Hopefully I will have more information on Wednesday when they send a technician that is supposed to know about TiVo devices and cable cards


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## nosnarb (7 mo ago)

cwoody222 said:


> There’s no such thing as removing channels from cable card devices.


There sure is. Every device has a “map” of channels available to it. Including cable cards. If the are removed from map then they are removed from the CC.
This could be on purpose or an error. But is indeed possible.
But I am not saying that’s what’s going on here.


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## cwoody222 (Nov 13, 1999)

nosnarb said:


> There sure is. Every device has a “map” of channels available to it. Including cable cards. If the are removed from map then they are removed from the CC.
> This could be on purpose or an error. But is indeed possible.
> But I am not saying that’s what’s going on here.


Well yes, technically possible.

But never in the history of cable cards have I ever heard of a doing that with the purpose of not offering a channel to CC subscribers.

In the real world “that channel isn’t available to CC users” is not a thing, unless talking about IPTV migration.


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## wthomas69 (Nov 28, 2009)

cwoody222 said:


> Well yes, technically possible.
> 
> But never in the history of cable cards have I ever heard of a doing that with the purpose of not offering a channel to CC subscribers.
> 
> In the real world “that channel isn’t available to CC users” is not a thing, unless talking about IPTV migration.


well the saga continues. A third cable technician arrived yesterday. He did some basic work put new ends on the cables changed out a splitter etc. that work increased signal strength a bit but it was already good. I still have not received the new tuning adapter that was supposed to be FedEx so he couldn’t do much else. But after contacting his other coworkers he did find out that the frequency that ESPN is broadcast on is not even being received into my house. he is scheduled to arrive here again today. A couple hours after he left I received a FedEx package which contained a very small cell phone sized device. Apparently it is a different style tuning adapter for Altice I am in the process of installing it now. If this issue is not resolved today I am simply going to go with a Samsung cable box and dump TiVo completely. It’s getting very frustrating working with a company that doesn’t even want to support this technology anymore. The cost of the cable box is less than the cost of the TiVo monthly. And they offer a companion app that can be installed on my other AppleTV devices so I can watch my cable feed anywhere in the house


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## cwoody222 (Nov 13, 1999)

What’s the model of this new tuning adapter?

I’ve never heard of one the size of a cell phone.

Does it have a coax and USB connection?


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## wthomas69 (Nov 28, 2009)

cwoody222 said:


> What’s the model of this new tuning adapter?
> 
> I’ve never heard of one the size of a cell phone.
> 
> Does it have a coax and USB connection?





cwoody222 said:


> What’s the model of this new tuning adapter?
> 
> I’ve never heard of one the size of a cell phone.
> 
> Does it have a coax and USB connection?


Even though the paperwork included with the device clearly said it was a digital tuning adapter it was not it was actually a small cable box made by Cisco for Altice. I’m done with the frustration and not being able to watch the channels that I pay for TiVo had a good run but I have decided to dump TiVo and just get a cable box. My TiVo subscription was $16.21 a month and the cable card was three dollars a month so almost $20. For that same $20 a month I now have a Samsung cable box and DVR service through my cable company. I am able to download the Optimum app to my Apple TV streaming boxes so I can watch my Optimum service on any TV in the house . TiVo had a good run but for me it’s dead.


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

Yeah, that’s just a cable box, not a “tuning adapter” for cable card use. You can of course watch cable through it directly to your TV, but it doesn’t do anything for TiVo.

If I were you I’d consider dropping cable TV entirely and switching to streaming. It’s typically a good bit cheaper than cable by the time you add all the cable fees.


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## wthomas69 (Nov 28, 2009)

mdavej said:


> Yeah, that’s just a cable box, not a “tuning adapter” for cable card use. You can of course watch cable through it directly to your TV, but it doesn’t do anything for TiVo.
> 
> If I were you I’d consider dropping cable TV entirely and switching to streaming. It’s typically a good bit cheaper than cable by the time you add all the cable fees.


 that's the problem it's not cheaper to stream, not anything like hulu live or youtube tv any way. My provider charges $90 a month for 200/30 high speed internet (I have my own router and modem so no rental charges), I'm paying $114 for internet and 275 channel of cable (value package) so the cable portion is only $24 monthly. Hulu live and youtube tv are both $65+. Sling is like $35-40 for there cheapest package. My cost of a cable box and cloud based dvr will be offset by not paying tivo $16.21 monthly and the $3 monthly charge for the cable card. Tivo had a good 7 year run with me, and i wish them well but as this past month has shown, when something goes wrong, it's un uphill battle, especially when I have a cable provider that knows jack squat about the tech and doesn't want to support it, as evidenced by 4 different services calls with zero resolution. And with the cable service I can download their app to my apple tvs or IOS devices to watch it anywhere, no need for other boxes. On the plus side I will have a Tivo bolt and 2 minis for sale cheap.


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## pl1 (Jan 18, 2007)

Delete


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## mdavej (Aug 13, 2015)

wthomas69 said:


> that's the problem it's not cheaper to stream, not anything like hulu live or youtube tv any way. My provider charges $90 a month for 200/30 high speed internet (I have my own router and modem so no rental charges), I'm paying $114 for internet and 275 channel of cable (value package) so the cable portion is only $24 monthly. Hulu live and youtube tv are both $65+. Sling is like $35-40 for there cheapest package. My cost of a cable box and cloud based dvr will be offset by not paying tivo $16.21 monthly and the $3 monthly charge for the cable card. Tivo had a good 7 year run with me, and i wish them well but as this past month has shown, when something goes wrong, it's un uphill battle, especially when I have a cable provider that knows jack squat about the tech and doesn't want to support it, as evidenced by 4 different services calls with zero resolution. And with the cable service I can download their app to my apple tvs or IOS devices to watch it anywhere, no need for other boxes. On the plus side I will have a Tivo bolt and 2 minis for sale cheap.


You’re lucky. Even my $30 cable plan has an additional $40 in fees tacked on plus whatever you’d pay for TiVo, so streaming is much cheaper for me. I pay $50 for internet and $55 for streaming. Since 5 other family members can share mine, they don’t have to pay for cable TV either.


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## cshilton (Sep 24, 2020)

cwoody222 said:


> No. Just because the FCC doesn’t mandate support doesn’t mean that a massive telecommunication company ceases support by shrugging their shoulders and telling customers “oops sorry”.
> 
> If your channels were no longer available via cable card due to whatever reason they would have a published verifiable change of service agreement to quote to you which you would have previously been informed of.


I'm on Cablevision. In this case, they get close to "oops sorry". They are moving very heavily to switched digital video. They are cherry picking which channels to you can receive without a tuning adapter. The goal is to set it up so you don't need a tuning adapter unless you want the standard definition feed of ESPN. So ESPN/ESPN2 are on 4 channels in the system SD/35, 36, HD/735, 736. You'd need a tuning adapter to get SD/35, 36. The net-net of the move is that premium channel customers are loosing all of the west coast feeds of their channels. "Oops, Sorry" is not a direct quote from the installer that I talked to but it's pretty close.

As far as the original poster goes, he should be able to receive ESPN2: 735 and ESPN: 736 without the tuning adapter assuming he's near me. Cablevision's territory is large and quite heterogeneous from an equipment perspective. I'm in New Haven County, CT. We use completely different cable cards then they do in either Long Island, Brooklyn, or Northern New Jersey. For example, tuning adapters *are required* in Long Island. I guess because they couldn't do the SDV split as cleanly along High Def / Standard Def lines.

-- Chris


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## cshilton (Sep 24, 2020)

Because of the way Cablevision is setup, the OP may find better information in the Optimum section of the: DSLReports Home : Broadband ISP Reviews News Tools and Forums forums - direct link: https://www.dslreports.com/forum/ool This tuning adapter problem has been ongoing for quite some time. People in different regions are told different things. Again, here in New Haven County, CT, I've been lucky that they haven't really taken away any programming, they've just made things more a lot more inconvenient. They've also told me that they cannot send me a tuning adapter and one tuning adapter that I did get was not proper authorized for my account so it was a complete waste of two days for me and the Altice techs that showed up at my house to complete the install. As I said above. I'm pretty certain that the situation in other regions is different. For example. my tech up here had never even seen a tuning adapter and if the box didn't have optimum's branding on it, he wouldn't have believed that he was supposed to support it.

-- Chris


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## cshilton (Sep 24, 2020)

wthomas69 said:


> that's the problem it's not cheaper to stream, not anything like hulu live or youtube tv any way. My provider charges $90 a month for 200/30 high speed internet (I have my own router and modem so no rental charges), I'm paying $114 for internet and 275 channel of cable (value package) so the cable portion is only $24 monthly. Hulu live and youtube tv are both $65+. Sling is like $35-40 for there cheapest package. My cost of a cable box and cloud based dvr will be offset by not paying tivo $16.21 monthly and the $3 monthly charge for the cable card. Tivo had a good 7 year run with me, and i wish them well but as this past month has shown, when something goes wrong, it's un uphill battle, especially when I have a cable provider that knows jack squat about the tech and doesn't want to support it, as evidenced by 4 different services calls with zero resolution. And with the cable service I can download their app to my apple tvs or IOS devices to watch it anywhere, no need for other boxes. On the plus side I will have a Tivo bolt and 2 minis for sale cheap.


I'm on Altice/Optimum in New Haven County, CT. Roughly where are you?

My math is a little different because I bought an all-in bolt a long time ago. So my cost for TiVo is the $2.00 it costs to have the cable card. A box costs $11.00. But you are 100% correct about the cost of streaming. I cut it by having a MythTV feed by Attic mounted Antenna attached to HDHomerun devices. I can stream the MythTV to any AppleTV in either my house or my apartment. By far the biggest cost for streaming is live sports. Football broadcasts on the networks so that's easy. Baseball and Auto racing are only on Cable.


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## cwoody222 (Nov 13, 1999)

cshilton said:


> I'm on Cablevision. In this case, they get close to "oops sorry". They are moving very heavily to switched digital video. They are cherry picking which channels to you can receive without a tuning adapter. The goal is to set it up so you don't need a tuning adapter unless you want the standard definition feed of ESPN. So ESPN/ESPN2 are on 4 channels in the system SD/35, 36, HD/735, 736. You'd need a tuning adapter to get SD/35, 36. The net-net of the move is that premium channel customers are loosing all of the west coast feeds of their channels. "Oops, Sorry" is not a direct quote from the installer that I talked to but it's pretty close.
> 
> As far as the original poster goes, he should be able to receive ESPN2: 735 and ESPN: 736 without the tuning adapter assuming he's near me. Cablevision's territory is large and quite heterogeneous from an equipment perspective. I'm in New Haven County, CT. We use completely different cable cards then they do in either Long Island, Brooklyn, or Northern New Jersey. For example, tuning adapters *are required* in Long Island. I guess because they couldn't do the SDV split as cleanly along High Def / Standard Def lines.
> 
> -- Chris


Requiring a tuning adapter is nowhere near stopping to support a channel on CC since every cable company will provide the needed TA for free.

They’re buggy things and often difficult to get provisioned properly on your account but if you are persistent they should work.


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## cshilton (Sep 24, 2020)

cwoody222 said:


> Requiring a tuning adapter is nowhere near stopping to support a channel on CC since every cable company will provide the needed TA for free.
> 
> They’re buggy things and often difficult to get provisioned properly on your account but if you are persistent they should work.


Perhaps the OP was a little strident in his argument. However his experience and mine shared the following aspects:


Provisioning CableCards has become nearly impossible since only a handful of the call in or webchat techs even know what they are. I pulled a CC out of my HD 3 TiVO and needed it provisioned to work with a Silicon Dust HDHomerun Prime I found on eBay. I reached a total of 5 techs, all of whom wrote my order as fixed for the customer. 3 Didn't know what a CC was at all and made no change. 1 Got the card partially provisioned after an hour. The fifth and last knew what a cable card was and correctly provisioned it on my account.
It took me 2.5 years of trying to get a tuning adapter. Cablevision announced the move to SDV, and told everyone with CC that they needed a tuning adapter but non of he walk in centers had them in stock. Further, the only way to determine if the stock level was to drive to the walk-in and wait through the line of people who mostly hadn't paid their bill and needed 10 minutes of account rep time each to complain about the situation. 
When I got the tuning adapter, it wasn't authorized for my account
They sent two technicians to my house to "fix" the tuning adapter. Neither of these persons knew what it was and first tried to charge me $80.00 for the visit even through it was all their equipment that was broken. He had never seen a tuning adapter and believed that it was my personal equipment.
I've never received clear confirmation that their switch to SDV is going to leave a core of High Def channels available to CC subscribers without the need for a tuning adapter. Right now it looks like their best effort.
Looking at the OP's problem, I'd bet that his CC is improperly provisioned and that's why he's not receiving ESPN. Regardless, it's his choice. *Altice has not completely dropped support for CableCards. But they have watered down the support so much that it's probably no longer worth fighting to get them setup correctly.*


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## wthomas69 (Nov 28, 2009)

cshilton said:


> Perhaps the OP was a little strident in his argument. However his experience and mine shared the following aspects:
> 
> 
> Provisioning CableCards has become nearly impossible since only a handful of the call in or webchat techs even know what they are. I pulled a CC out of my HD 3 TiVO and needed it provisioned to work with a Silicon Dust HDHomerun Prime I found on eBay. I reached a total of 5 techs, all of whom wrote my order as fixed for the customer. 3 Didn't know what a CC was at all and made no change. 1 Got the card partially provisioned after an hour. The fifth and last knew what a cable card was and correctly provisioned it on my account.
> ...


Exactly correct with your last assumption. This problem started about a month ago I noticed I no longer had ESPN ESPN2 or USA Netwerk. All of the simple steps were completed restarting the box checking connections etc. the first technician showed up without even having another cable card, useless tech visit number one. The following week a second text showed up with a cable card but have no idea how to install it or do anything with it. It was him that mentioned I might need a tuning adapter but he did not have any on the vehicle. My local walk-in optimum store is more than an hour drive up from my house . They would not mail me a tuning adapter or a second cable card. I took the trip to the store last Saturday and got a twinning adapter and a second cable card. The second cable card was installed and did not resolve the issue still zero digital signal on ESPN ESPN2 and USA and at that point I kept getting messages that I was not authorized to get channels that I was getting with the previous cable card such as CNN, but other channels were coming out perfectly so I knew the cable card was installed correctly and registered to my account. At that point the tuning adapter was tried but that tuning adapter would not even complete its cycle. At that point Cablevision was called again and I was told a New tuning adapter would be FedEx I’d have it Monday. It never arrived. A third technician arrived on Wednesday who had a little bit of knowledge of cable cards but without a tuning adapter that worked was unable to do anything. He did notice that on my account I was being charged for a cable box which I have not had in my house for seven years. He also noticed that the frequency that ESPN is broadcast on in my area was not being received in my house. After he left I called Cablevision yet again and was told that the tuning adapter that was supposed to be sent by FedEx was not sent and I was being sent a cable box. That is the cable box that he saw on my bill. A couple hours after he left on Wednesday I received a small box the size of a cell phone which was indeed a small cable box. Technician number three returned to my house on Thursday just in case I did get the tuning adapter which I did not . At that point I was so frustrated I simply had him install a Samsung cable box. TiVo had a good run with me for seven years but with a cable company like Cablevision Optimum who certainly don’t want to support this technology anymore and very few of their employers even know what a cable card or twinning adapter is it was a constant uphill battle . The cost of the TiVo monthly service and the cable card was about $20 a month for that same cost I can have the Samsung cable box and cloud-based DVR so that is what I’m doing. I’m just tired of not getting channels that I’m paying for and I knew it would be an ongoing struggle to get the TiVo working back the way it should .


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