# Can you access TivoWeb with Wap



## graf

Has anyone written a version of tivoweb that produces .wml pages suitable for a mobile phone wap browser? It seems like such an obvious thing to do, I'm surprised it doesn't exists already, but my searches for it have yielded nothing.

If one does not exist, i'd be highly tempted to hack tivoweb to produce wml. It shouldn't be too tricky, although I might just implement searching and recording rather than the full tivoweb monty.


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## radish

Would be an interesting idea, I certainly haven't seen a wml version. Maybe it's because no one uses wap


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## Tony Hoyle

WAP pages are quite limited & there's not much you could do with it... I've tried setting up a WAP version of a couple of sites (you need something like Apache to do the automatic redirection, but it's not hard), however the results were so disappointing I abandoned the idea.

Given a year or two the new phones will be speaking proper HTML anyway...


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## graf

You could have a search box. You could type in the name of a program you wanted to record and it could go through the normal tivoweb process and setup a recording. Surely that'd be ideal for those "I'm down the pub and I really meant to tell the tivo to record..." moments.


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## kmusgrave

> _Originally posted by Tony Hoyle _
> *
> Given a year or two the new phones will be speaking proper HTML anyway... *


They already can - the SPV can read/display proper HTML pages


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## BtB

Time for encouragement... 

Even a simple Search and record screen accessible via WAP would make TiVoweb 10 times more useful, go for it !


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## graf

> _Originally posted by kmusgrave _
> *They already can - the SPV can read/display proper HTML pages *


Although allegedly it can't call numbers out of it's contacts list.

I've started coding (or at least hacking) tivoweb to serve wml pages - although so far I haven't got much further than "hello world". But at least I can get it to serve static content, now to work on dynamic content.

I've hit one snag however. I've stopped it branching off into the background, but if i Ctrl-c to stop the task, it reboots the tivo. Anyone got any ideas what might cause this?

Cheers


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## radish

> _Originally posted by graf _
> *Although allegedly it can't call numbers out of it's contacts list.
> 
> I've started coding (or at least hacking) tivoweb to serve wml pages - although so far I haven't got much further than "hello world". But at least I can get it to serve static content, now to work on dynamic content.
> 
> I've hit one snag however. I've stopped it branching off into the background, but if i Ctrl-c to stop the task, it reboots the tivo. Anyone got any ideas what might cause this?
> 
> Cheers *


There's mention of this on the underground forum. From what I remember, TivoWeb (and some other apps) run in some special shell which doesn't like being killed (it panics the kernel). That's why TivoWeb has a shutdown option, it closes it gracefully.


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## graf

Progress report:

I'm still at the hello world stage, but the code's a lot better. It now operates in both html and wml, depending on the name of the module. Any modules that start "wap" are processed as wap. So now all I have to do is write some tivoweb modules that produce useful wml. I'm going to start with the info page, and work up from there...


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## radish

Or you could always parse the user_agent string and decide what to return based on that  if you were going to be fancy that is...


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## graf

I'm not fundamentally against fancyness, but surely different phones would give out different user agent strings, so you'd have to hard code a list of phone's user agent strings to check against. Which seems like a bad idea to me. As an added plus, my module approach means I don't have to mess with the existing code as much.

Progress report:-
I have the "Information" screen coming up on my phone (apart from the kernel and memory information, which I couldn't be bothered with). There is a copy of the sort of thing it produces at http://www.ninjapineapple.com/tivo.wml

Now it's time to go to bed... The next challenge is getting the search page working, which could be a lot trickier.


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## alanjrobertson

..that looks cool!!

I'm very impressed with all the info you've got on that WAP page - making me seriously consider a TurboNet upgrade now!

Alan


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## graf

Progress Report: I now have the search page working... You can enter a title, and search in categories and by title, title keyword, director and actor. The results of the search are displayed correctly.

However, when you click on the results it takes you to the series page, which is the next thing I will need to wml-ify.


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## mtg101

Keep up the good work graf, there're a lot of us looking forward to this. 

(especially those of us who've tried that SPV 'phone' and realise it's not an option : )


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## graf

Wahey - It works. I just scheduled the tivo to record "The boosh" on BBC7 using my wap phone. It can't do anything fancy yet, like cancel recordings or create season passes, but it can schedule one off recordings through the search facility. 

I shall do some more testing before releasing it, but the worst that could happen, i would think, is that it will spit out invalid wml. What features do people want supported before I release it? And please don't say all of them


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## Milhouse

Will this work in tandem with the standard HTML TiVoWeb - I presume your WAP pages simply need to be added into the TiVoWeb configuration so that they can be accessed with an alternative URL?

Sounds like an interesting addition to the TiVo range of hacks. 

As for features, off the top of my head I'd suggest that a manual recording facility (eg. enter channel, start time, duration, record!) might be the simplest means of scheduling a one-off recording that you suddenly discover is being shown while you're down the boozer.  Scheduling manual recordings through a search facility sounds good but personally I'd want to keep the call as short as possible and press as few buttons as possible (not because I'm tight you understand, but because it's diverting me away from valuable drinking time, not to mention having to focus on those little buttons...)


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## tkousaka

Graf,

This is awesome, looking forward for the release of the WAP. FYI, Sony is licensing Tivo technology for their PVR's in Japan, and their top end edition comes with a dyndns + NTT DoCoMo iMode navigation. Exactly what you are trying to accomplish. 

Needless to say Sony is charging $800 plus for the device, and this will be GPL'ed hopefully. 

You know what would be kool, is if there are any Japanese consumers browsing these web pages who could upload the scripts.


Cheers,


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## Tony Hoyle

WAP phones send an http 'Accept' line that includes wml when they request pages... I have Apache setup to serve WAP pages automatically using:

RewriteEngine on
RewriteCond %{HTTP_ACCEPT} text/vnd\.wap\.wml [OR]
RewriteCond %{HTTP_USER_AGENT} wap [OR]
RewriteCond %{HTTP_USER_AGENT} 7110
RewriteRule ^[\./](.*)$ /wap/$1

You should be able to code something fairly similar in any scripting language...

I've thought of passing the output of tivoweb through an HTML->WAP script... results would be quite varied though (google does this if you use it from a wap phone, and the results aren't brilliant, though they are useable).

The 7650 also has an HTML browser for it, but TBH I don't use it - the media-rich HTML content you see in most websites now is a complete 'mare to download over GPRS.. WAP is quite acceptable once it's on a decent size display and has colour & graphics (spend more time playing super mario though).


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## Vargster

Graf - what's the lastest on the WML front?


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## nick.perry

> _Originally posted by Tony Hoyle _
> RewriteCond %{HTTP_ACCEPT} text/vnd\.wap\.wml [OR]
> RewriteCond %{HTTP_USER_AGENT} wap [OR]
> RewriteCond %{HTTP_USER_AGENT} 7110
> RewriteRule ^[\./](.*)$ /wap/$1


 Won't that mean that people using multi-format browsers such as Opera will receive the WML content instead of the HTML?


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## tabascojrc

Wow i am so excited about this, i was totally about to do this myself  hehe, anyhow any idea on accessing this if your TiVo is set up behind a proxy server for security? Right now I have apache running as a proxy requiring a username and password? Will this still function under WAP?
Keep up the good work.
-Jeremy


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## radish

Maybe there should be an AND NOT clause in there to allow text/html to force normal mode? Not that I'm a great apache config guru


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## iambic

> tabascojrc:
> 
> Wow i am so excited about this, i was totally about to do this myself hehe, anyhow any idea on accessing this if your TiVo is set up behind a proxy server for security? Right now I have apache running as a proxy requiring a username and password? Will this still function under WAP?


Yep, I've got Apache set up and if I try to access via WAP I get presented with a Userid/Password dialogue. It will authenticate quite happily (and return a "not authorised" dialogue if you enter the wrong password), then you'll get a "500: Web Service Problem: Please contact the service provider" error message as you'll be returned html that your WAP browser can't handle.


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## Tony Hoyle

> _Originally posted by nick.perry _
> *Won't that mean that people using multi-format browsers such as Opera will receive the WML content instead of the HTML? *


No, because Opera doesn't identify itself as wml capable.
I've never had a miss reported on any of my websites using the above rules, so I reckon they're about right.


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## graf

Progress on the wap enabled tivoweb stopped over the Christmas period. I'm going to work on wml-ifying some more pages (manual recording was requested) before I release anything. And of course it will be under the GPL (not that I have a choice as far as I know, but I'm a free software fanatic so anything I write in my free time is GPL as a matter of course)


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## graf

Is there any way of setting up manual recordings through tivoweb? I wanted to be able to do it via wap, when I realised you couldn't even do it by normal tivoweb.


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## Tony Hoyle

Yup... It's not obvious though.

User Interface
Channel Guide
Watch
BBC1
View upcoming listings (this is the non-obvious bit)
Tue 14th Jan
Neighbours
Select episode
Record


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## Milhouse

Shame there's no way to record a programme that's already in progress... several times I've been caught late at work and am unable to record a programme because it's already started - the worst case being footie on Sky which has upto a 1 hour preamble which I don't mind NOT recording but I'd still like the game!


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## Milhouse

> _Originally posted by Tony Hoyle _
> *Yup... It's not obvious though.
> 
> User Interface
> Channel Guide
> Watch
> BBC1
> View upcoming listings (this is the non-obvious bit)
> Tue 14th Jan
> Neighbours
> Select episode
> Record *


That wouldn't be my interpreation of a manual recording... I'd have said it was a screen where you entered the channel, start and end times (or channel, start and duration) with optional repeat (daily, weekly, etc.).

To the best of my knowledge TiVoWeb does not support manual recordings (according to my interpretation).


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## graf

> _Originally posted by Milhouse _
> *That wouldn't be my interpreation of a manual recording... I'd have said it was a screen where you entered the channel, start and end times (or channel, start and duration) with optional repeat (daily, weekly, etc.).
> 
> To the best of my knowledge TiVoWeb does not support manual recordings (according to my interpretation). *


That's what I meant by manual recording. That's a shame - i can't seem to even find a plugin that does it.


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## DMc

If you know the address of your Tivoweb server you could try accessing it via "Open URL" on http://wap.google.com
This processes any HTML page for your wap phone. You can follow links, but you cannot type anything into data entry boxes.

( I haven't got TivoWeb so I can't try it out)


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## Bakdraft

Hi,

Graf, ( if you are out there ) any news on any further developments????

The WAP idea is the best , most useful thing to hit th forum in ages, far more exciting than the much loved Red Dot Removal" and screen flicker reduction

I know its hard work, but I value your (and anyone elses) work in this are

Dave


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## Milhouse

Bakdraft - I'm interested in both of these developments, although as an analogue cable viewer removal of the red dot is not really the issue - the potential ability to have an intelligent IR blaster at my full disposal is quite intriguing! 

I'd be interested to see a WAP interface for TiVoWeb, but have to admit that I'm using the remote scheduling far less than I expected to. Most often I need it to record a programme that's already started (eg. Monday night football when I'm caught working late) but with TiVoWeb it's not possible to record a programme already in progress! Argh, so frustrating!!


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## bignoise

> _Originally posted by Bakdraft _
> *The WAP idea is the best , most useful thing to hit th forum in ages,*


I first mentioned the idea YEARS ago, but nobody seemed particularly interested at the time! (Sniff!)


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## mbriody

> _Originally posted by Milhouse _
> *Bakdraft - I'm interested in both of these developments, although as an analogue cable viewer removal of the red dot is not really the issue - the potential ability to have an intelligent IR blaster at my full disposal is quite intriguing!
> 
> I'd be interested to see a WAP interface for TiVoWeb, but have to admit that I'm using the remote scheduling far less than I expected to. Most often I need it to record a programme that's already started (eg. Monday night football when I'm caught working late) but with TiVoWeb it's not possible to record a programme already in progress! Argh, so frustrating!!  *


What about using web remote?


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## tabascojrc

Did Graf fall off the face of the planet, Haven't heard anything from him in almost a month, I am sure he has other things to do besides just this little add on, but this is almost as bad as waiting for new information on the upcoming Ipod's.


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## Bakdraft

No... Graf is still about.

I have his beta version and am about to try it.

Dave

P.S. There's a new Ipod on its way? but does it compete with Archos MP4 jukebox?


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## tabascojrc

Not to get off topic, but There has been a lot of rumors of updating the iPods lately, especially with the new Toshiba 40gb hard drive thats being released, and it is the same size as the 20Gb Drive, also rumors of a small video screen and some tivo like functionality. maybe like a portable video player. as for competing with the archos. I always thought the ARchos was a bit clunky, but i haven't looked at recent models or anything and you just got to love the mac styling. of course I am biased, being a mac afficianado.


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## Bakdraft

Absolutely no doubt about it.... the Ipod's styling... is well stunning..

but it lags behind the Archos... check out Archos

Dave


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## JamboRobbo

Is there any more info on this WAP add-on for Tivoweb? Would love to be able to use this, was thinking of looking into writing something myself but decided to wait and see what happened with Graf's code. Any news? Is it still in the pipeline somewhere?

Cheers,
Robbo


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## graf

Here it is - the long awaited (sorry) tivoweb for wap. You can download it from here http://www.bohemiannight.co.uk/graf/tivoweb-wml-beta2.tar.gz

Step by step instructions:-
1) Shutdown tivoweb if you have it running already.
2) Ftp the tivoweb-wml-beta2.tar.gz file up to your tivo, into the /var/hack directory
3) Telnet into the tivo, and cd to /var/hack
4) 'gzip -d tivoweb-wml-beta2.tar.gz'
5) ''cpio -H tar -i < tivoweb-wml-beta2.tar'
6) cd to the newly created tivoweb-wml-beta2 directory
7) modify the tivoweb.cfg to your taste
8) start tivoweb as usual (probably best to use tivoweb console).

It's essential that you don't have tivoweb already running (although I suppose you could if you used different port numbers).

This tivoweb will act like a usual tivoweb, reacting to requests from your web browser as normal. In addition, if you point your wap phone to 
"tivo/wap_search/" (the trailing '/' is essential, and tivo is the ip address of your tivo) you should be able to search for programmes and record them from your phone. There is no facility for setting up season passes at the moment.

Note that you will have to be able to access tivoweb from the internet for this to work - existing faqs should be enough to cover this though.

There is one known bug, that causes tivoweb to produce invalid wml when a programme's title has an ampersand in it. Also older phones may be unable to cope with the size of the wml files produced.

Please let me know how you get on, and remember that this is beta software so use it at your own risk.

Cheers.


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## JamboRobbo

Nice one Graf! Will give it a try tonight and let you know how I get on.

Cheers,

Robbo


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## mtg101

This sounds cool - I'll be trying it out tonight also!


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## comdw

sounds great - keep up the excellent work.

I reckon the next most useful feature must be to delete recordings from the todo list or now playing - essential if you are away for a few days and happen to catch some programs you asked tivo to record (and you have a 40Gb Tivo with little space free).


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## Bakdraft

Graf, first a big thanks for the module and letting me beta test it.

Is the version I have, the same as the one you have posted now, or should I reload this version.

Everyone else, enjoy it... it works a treat. :up: 

Dave


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## Bakdraft

> _(and you have a 40Gb Tivo with little space free). [/B]_


_

Whoa!! careful.... Youre breaking the forum rules  You don't delete anything!! record everything and upgrade to a minimum of 120Gb  

Dave_


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## graf

I've just been doing some testing and I needed to create the tivoweb-wml-beta2 directory manually before uncompressing the tar file with cpio. Not sure why, but you may experience the same problem.


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## Bakdraft

> _Originally posted by graf _
> *I've just been doing some testing and I needed to create the tivoweb-wml-beta2 directory manually before uncompressing the tar file with cpio. Not sure why, but you may experience the same problem. *


When I did this I :

Extracted the gz via winzip to my local Hard drive
Extracted the tar file via winzip to my local Hard drive
Copied all of the files in the Tivoweb folder to Tivo via FTP
[/list=1] 
This worked fine

Dave


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## mini__me

I use my tivo through a proxy to the net and tivoweb works fine when attempting to access via wap I get bad gateway or a similar error via wap on my mobile. Anyway I can test that the page is workin other than a mobile?

Cheers m8y sounds really great just need to get it working


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## TIVO_YORK99

Ok, now this is brilliant. Thanks for your work on this Graf.

I can get it to work no problem on a Nokia 6210, 
but I can't get it to work on my Nokia 7650.

For some reason, I can't get the phone to open the link 
on the SEARCH word.

Anyone any ideas?

Pete


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## graf

For testing, I used the free WAP browser from www.apachesoftware.com

I also used the w3schools wml validator to check that tivoweb is producing valid wml (it's a bit tolerant of things like ampersands)

My phone is a T68i, so that's all I've really tested it on (though I will test it on my nokia 7110 when I get round to it.


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## mini__me

Thanks m8y got it working through that now to try the old mobile


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## PaulK

Th is brilliant, my experience so far...

needed to add '--make-dir' to the cpio command as it wasn't creating the dirs - no problem there

started using ./tivoweb console - again no problem

first search revealed that I had to fix for UK genres - no problem


managed to search for a programm and schedule a record no problem

cant book season pass though, i get...

'Something is wrong with the page you tried to access. Choose another link'

Has anyone else had season pass issues?

Paul


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## TIVO_YORK99

Graf says in his post that there is currently no availability to set season passes, you can currently only setup one-off recordings,

Pete


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## graf

> _Originally posted by PaulK _
> *Th is brilliant, my experience so far...
> 
> needed to add '--make-dir' to the cpio command as it wasn't creating the dirs - no problem there
> 
> started using ./tivoweb console - again no problem
> 
> first search revealed that I had to fix for UK genres - no problem
> 
> managed to search for a programm and schedule a record no problem
> 
> cant book season pass though, i get...
> 
> 'Something is wrong with the page you tried to access. Choose another link'
> 
> Has anyone else had season pass issues?
> 
> Paul *


Yes, the code is based on Tivoweb 1.9.4 with the UK genres patch.

The season pass stuff isn't implemented yet - maybe I should have removed the link until it was done. I mentioned the season passes thing in my original post about the beta release.

I did some work on the ampersand problem last night - it can now schedule a recording of dharma & greg without producing invalid wml. I don't suppose anyone knows of any programs where the episode title has an ampersand in it? I want to fix and test the ampersand problem on episode titles as well as programme titles before I do another release.


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## mrtickle

Hmm, good question. Nothing springs to mind. But what you could do is use EditTitle3 to change the episode title of something on your tivo to include an ampersand, and then test your wap stuff against that! I often fix episode titles using this - "24" on MY tivo uses the 24 hour clock , and anything with "honor"/"neighbor"/etc also gets fixed


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## PaulK

Graf:

can the wap modules be copied to my already working tivoweb-tcl/modules dir?

Or are there changes to other files?

Many thanks for a top app btw

Paul


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## lcsneil

Well I have loaded it up and it looked hopeful!

Tried using the M3Gate emulator (http://www.3tl.com/MobileDevelopers/emulator.asp?CID=) 
Get to 'Search by title' and then it takes you to the radio type buttons "Title, Title Keyword, Keyord etc" but doesnt do anything when I select one of them and hit 'Select' 

Also tried the Nokia WAP toolkit emulator (if it works on this it will work on anything) and setting the emulator to a Nokia 6210 (which is what I have) if returns ..... "Unknown file content"

One thing I found when writing WAP code was that a lot of Nokias wouldnt work unless you put

"X-Pad: avoid browser bug"

in the page header!

Bizarre I know

Neil

[And even more bizarre.. I have just tried it for real on my phone and it works... well up til the point where the item I was looking for had too many episodes and hence the page length was longer than 1394 bytes so like many Nokias my phone generates the "This page cannot be displayed"

Bah! ]


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## maubp

Hmm. Something usefull to use WAP for... maybe I should start thinking seriously about a new mobile phone now


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## mtg101

I'm having a problem using this through my Apache proxy.

I can get to the main wap page on both a 7650 and the Klondike browser, but can't do a search, I get a 404. The web version continues to work fine.

My address for the tivo is http://blah.no-ip.com/tivo/wap_search/, using Apache as a proxy. However when I click search, the browser heads off to http://blah.no-ip.com/wap_search - note the lack of the /tivo/ directory. A check of the wml shows the line <go href="/wap_search" method="get">

Is it possible that the wap modules don't honour the "prefix" value in tivoweb.cfg? Or, more likely, have I done something stupid?

Cheers
Russell


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## graf

I'm afraid it doesn't honour the "prefix" at the moment. I'll have to fix that. And I'll add that header that keeps nokias happy too. Not too sure how I'm going to fix it so it doesn't produce pages that are too large though... Hmm, I'll have to think about that.

Thanks for all the feedback - keep it coming.


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## lcsneil

For info Nokia phones have limitations on the number of bytes they can receive per WAP page as follows:- 

1397 bytes (Nokia 7110/7190/6210/6250)
2800 bytes (Nokia 3330/3390/3510/3590/5210/6310i/6510/6590/
7210/8310/8390/8910)
8192 bytes (Nokia 9110)
30000 bytes (Nokia 3410)
64000 bytes (Nokia 9210)

As you say not sure how you would split large pages up into smaller ones. Now that's a bit of a challenge??

Neil


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## JamboRobbo

Works fine for me. Had to manually create the tivoweb-wml directory. Managed to schedul a recording using my Nokia 8310 first time. Nice work Graf. 

Robbo


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## anderson

> _Originally posted by graf _
> 
> Step by step instructions:-
> 1) Shutdown tivoweb if you have it running already.
> 2) Ftp the tivoweb-wml-beta2.tar.gz file up to your tivo, into the /var/hack directory
> 3) Telnet into the tivo, and cd to /var/hack
> 4) 'gzip -d tivoweb-wml-beta2.tar.gz'
> 5) ''cpio -H tar -i < tivoweb-wml-beta2.tar'
> 6) cd to the newly created tivoweb-wml-beta2 directory
> 7) modify the tivoweb.cfg to your taste
> 8) start tivoweb as usual (probably best to use tivoweb console).
> 
> Cheers. [/B]


Hi, these instructions all make sense, apart from the first one. How do I ensure TivoWeb has been shut down?


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## mtg101

In TiVoWeb go to 'Restart' and choose 'Quit'.


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## rich10101

not sure if I understand this correctly but do you rename/delete the existing "tivoweb-tcl" directory and replace with the "tivoweb-wml-beta2" one ?

Can I check the WAP without using a NAT connection on the internet i.e. LAN ?

a little confused

tia
rich


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## anderson

Okay, managed to get it all installed. All seemed to go well. Plain old TivoWeb still works, but I get page not found if I try to go the wap page. (http:\\mytivodomainname.co.uk\wap_search\) 

I have a username and password configured on TivoWeb, I haven't configured one for the wap page yet though.

Any advice anyone?


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## mtg101

> _Originally posted by rich10101 _
> *not sure if I understand this correctly but do you rename/delete the existing "tivoweb-tcl" directory and replace with the "tivoweb-wml-beta2" one ?
> *


I just added the "tivoweb-wml-beta2" directory, leaving the tivoweb-tcl directory there.

Remember you'll need to change your startup file (rc.init.author or something) to startup the WAP version instead of the regular version if you do this.



> *
> Can I check the WAP without using a NAT connection on the internet i.e. LAN ?
> *


If you get down a windoze WAP browser (there's one mentioned in this thread) you should be able to test it from within your LAN.


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## marcdbl

Can someone clarify for me:

If I change rc.sysinit.author to run tivoweb from /var/hack/tivoweb-wml-beta2 rather than /var/hack/tivoweb-tcl, will good ol' html tivoweb still run once I do this?

ta
marc


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## BtB

Can you run both tivoweb and tivowebwml at the same time, on different port numbers ofcourse. 

Will tivoweb username and password work for WAP sessions ?


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## JamboRobbo

Just start up the tivoweb-wml instead of the normal tivoweb. It contains the original tivoweb working as normal, plus the extra wml bits.


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## mtg101

WAP supports Basic Authentication - so you'll be fine having a username / password set for TiVoWeb/WAP that will work for both.


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## mbriody

Just to clarify, this server completely replaces your existing TivoWeb server i.e. it doesn't 'call' the existing server?

If my understanding is correct then if I have added extra modules etc to TiVoWeb then I would need to apply them again to the WAP version?


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## mbriody

This is what I get:

The program comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
This program is licensed under the GPL.
See the 'copyright' and 'README' files for copyright and credit information.
can't read "fd2": no such variable
while executing
"if { $fd2 != "" } {
set default_theme $value
close $fd2
}"
(procedure "readconfig" line 42)
invoked from within
"readconfig"
(file "./httpd-tt.tcl" line 680)


Any ideas?


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## mtg101

> _Originally posted by mbriody _
> *Just to clarify, this server completely replaces your existing TivoWeb server i.e. it doesn't 'call' the existing server?
> 
> If my understanding is correct then if I have added extra modules etc to TiVoWeb then I would need to apply them again to the WAP version? *


Correct - TiVoWAP replaces tivoweb. You create a new directory on the TiVo and run the binary from the WAP directory rather than original TiVoWeb binary.

I've not tried adding any modules to it - but I assume you should be able to add them.


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## mbriody

> _Originally posted by mtg101 _
> *Correct - TiVoWAP replaces tivoweb. You create a new directory on the TiVo and run the binary from the WAP directory rather than original TiVoWeb binary.
> *


Thanks, I'd just come to that conclusion myself.

My crash (above) was because I was using a non-standard theme. Copying over the theme files fixed it.



> _Originally posted by mtg101 _
> *
> 
> I've not tried adding any modules to it - but I assume you should be able to add them. *


You mean you've not tried 'whats on', 'displaytext or 'now playing with sort'? You haven't lived 

I've now copied over everything from the modules from my original server but I'm getting errors all over the place. The main functionality sees to work bit I'm getting error messages in most functions e.g. I get this when selecting 'Info':

INTERNAL SERVER ERROR
--cut here--
action_info '/' ''
can't read "::defrecquality": no such variable
while executing
"if {($::dtivo || $::defrecquality == $recquality) && (!$::version3 || $rectype != 8)} {
store_space space time count list 103 $streamsize $recdu..."
("uplevel" body line 23)
invoked from within
"uplevel $body"
invoked from within
"ForeachMfsFileTrans fsid name type "/Recording/DiskUsed/10" "" 15 {
set rec [db $db openid $fsid]
scan $name "%d:%d" fsid streamsize
set s..."
(procedure "::action_info" line 135)
invoked from within
"::action_$action $chan $part $env"
("eval" body line 1)
invoked from within
"eval {::action_$action $chan $part $env}"
--cut here--

Although the Info does actually display.

One suspect is the version of ui.itcl I'm using. I copied over the version from my origina; TivoWeb which is based on 1.9.4 but has extensions for some of the modules. I'll try using the original.


----------



## mbriody

Okay, all is well now.

I'd renamed the wap version of ui.itcl but not copied over my own one. D'oh!

Anyway I did this and restarted and now all appears fine. TiVoWeb and my modules are all okay and WAP access is really cool.


----------



## Animgif

I just wanted to say thanks...this works great on this side of the pond...  Sany 5300 w/ Sony Series 1


----------



## ponto

just trying this out and seem to be stuck - on the wap phone Nokia 3510 I get "internal error in gateway" - using port forwarding on firewall to orenosp - works fine from remote pc browser - any ideas please?

Update:-

Just installed Klondike WAP Browser for Windows, browsing to http://tivo/ produces:

There was an error processing your request

Klondike could not open the WAP site:

Reason: Unrecognized content

If I browse to //tivo/wap_search/

I see Search By: Title
Category: All
Search For

but it hangs up!!

have I missed something??


----------



## MikeMcr

My Nokia 6100 works fine with WAP when I open up port 80 on the router. However, I am not happy leaving it like that for obvious reasons so have been trying to get the reverse proxy server to work as described here:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?s=&threadid=80054

Has anyone got this to work with WAP? I get gateway errors and was wondering if I needed to download the server certificate onto the phone first but have no idea how.

Michael


----------



## Adlopa

*Bump*

Has anyone figured out WAP access when TivoWeb is SSL-protected (as previous poster) yet? I'm using Noreosp with a big-number port but WAP via a T610 doesn't work. Anyone..?


----------



## sanderton

Reconfigure oreosp to work with non SSL files?


----------



## stewabel

I am getting the following when i try to access wap_search

--cut here--
action_wap_search '/' ''
invalid command name "wml_start"
while executing
"wml_start "Search""
(procedure "::action_wap_search" line 20)
invoked from within
"::action_$action $chan $part $env"
("eval" body line 1)
invoked from within
"eval {::action_$action $chan $part $env}"
--cut here--


----------



## graf

Sounds like you haven't copied across the html.itcl file from tivoweb-wml-beta2.tar.gz. It's different from the normal one, because it includes stuff for doing wml as well as html. In retrospect it should probably be a different file called wml.itcl or something.

Hope that helps.


----------



## aitcheff

I have a PDA which connects via WIFI into my home network. It has a web browser which enables me to access Tivoweb, but clearly Tivoweb was designed for a computer screen, not a PDA screen. 

So my question is ....

If I install the WAP version of Tivoweb, apart from supporting the WAP protocol, has the user interface also been redesigned for a mobile device? 

And would my PDA browser (which supports html but is not a WAP device) be able to run the WAP protocol?

Many thanks for any advice.

aitcheff


----------



## graf

I don't think it will work, because wap uses WML instead of HTML, and your browser on your PDA is unlikely to be able to interpret WML (although Opera does, IE doesn't). Best to investigate if your browser works with wml/wap before installing tivoweb. Point it at wap.yahoo.co.uk or something to see what happens.


----------



## aitcheff

You're correct. It failed with 'unrecognised content type'.  

Thanks for the quick reply.

Aitcheff.


----------



## sanderton

You might be better off trying to come up with a stylesheet .css file which formats things better for PDAs. And if you manage to please post it as I'd find that useful!


----------



## martinpw

Hi. I have just set this up but have a problem. It all works on on the LAN. I have checked it with the Klondike WAP browser. I can't get it to work on my Nokia 6610 under Vodaphonewith GPS enabled. The WAP works OK as I can get club Nokia and google etc. I am using a Alcatel broadband router with NAT. I have set all traffic from port 80 to go to port 80 on the tivo. However i get the error "could not reach the indicated web server" on the phone. Have I done the port forwarding correctly? Oh and the address I use for the tivo on the phone is http://my.ip.address/wap_search/ I think i've done everything Ok on the LAN, so I guess it must be the connection to the outside world.....


----------



## Appleman

Now that there is a manual recording module out there, any chance of adding it into WAP version of tivoweb? Graf  I would find this way more useful than the search.

Also, earlier in this thread, you provided a link to your Tivo info screen that had been formatted for wml, but I don't seem to be able to access my own through WAP, is it possible to also have this added in?


----------



## richard plumb

2 month bump in the hope of any updates on the wml version.

If I get an opera browser (eg 6600, 3650), can I just just the normal HTTP version? i.e. go to http://tivo/ rather than the wap_search page?


----------



## graf

No updates as yet, though I will be looking into doing manual recording.


martinpw: Your problem could be that to do with routing. Is your tivo able to access the internet correctly (I can't remember how you test is though - does tivo have ping?) It'll be something like:-

route.tivo add default gw xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx 

where xxx.xxx.xxx.xxx is the IP address of your gateway.


richard plumb: Yes, you should just be able to access tivoweb-wml with opera on a phone as you would from any usual web browser. I haven't tried it with opera for phones though, so I couldn't guarantee it will work.


----------



## richard plumb

Thanks graf.

Mine seems a little flaky, but I'll look into what the gateway router is doing. I can usually get in once, then afterwards get no reply. 

Accessing the internet from home through the router seems to clear the jam. Very odd.


----------



## comdw

Hi,

I've finally got around to trying this out but the site that hosted the package (ninjapineapple.com) appears to have disappeared!

If anyone has the file could you PM me, or perhaps repost it if the original link is invalid?

Cheers!


----------



## ddub

Hi,

Is this software module still available, get a 404 from the link on the 1st page?
cheers,

ddub


----------



## Appleman

I have posted it here for you guys.

Tivoweb WAP

Graf, let me know if you want me to remove it, but I thought for now this would statisfy some people.


----------



## ddub

Cheers Appleman!


----------



## ddub

Got it installed, copied over my modules from /tivoweb_tcl & all appears to be working in both the web browser and WAP on my Motorola V600 woohoo!

is there anyway of getting "whats on now" (inc recording status, ch, title, description) via the wap interface?

Darren


----------



## graf

Thanks for mirroring the file Appleman, I have no problems with that at all. My web-hosting company seems to have made a mistake with renewing my domain name, but they say it's sorted although the site wont be back up for 24 hrs.


----------



## ddub

Nice one Graf.

Just notice I get an Error Internal server Error if I try to set a season pass from the wap interface. Recording a single programme works ok though..

did you ever get anywhere with the todo list, or whats on now?
- not that Im ungrateful for what you already have accomplished ) 


- cheers,
Darren


----------



## comdw

OK I got it to work, but only when I don't have any username/password specified in the tivoweb.cfg

When I add a username and password and restart tivoweb, it refuses to accept my entry (even from a normal web browser) - it just keeps asking for username and password over and over.

When I switch back to normal tivoweb, the username/password authentication works fine.

Does anyone know why it won't work with the WAP version of tivoweb? I rely on this as I don't have a 24/7 server to run apache on to protect the tivo from the outside world.

Any suggestions much appreciated!


----------



## spid3r

This looks excellent. I'm just waiting for my new phone to go live so I'll have to check it out. Is there any way of making it an add on for TiVoWeb rather than a replacement? I'm already finding it confusing enough between TiVoWeb and TiVoWebPlus, especially considering they're the sort of thing you install one day and never touch for months (I've forgotten most of how I set them up already).


----------



## sanderton

Once you replaced TW, you can just regard it as being exactly the same as standard TW.


----------



## comdw

except that (in my case anyway) username and password won't work!?


----------



## sanderton

Work fine for me?


----------



## comdw

I guess I'll just have to try it again. Do you run the wap version from /var/hack/tivoweb-tcl or from var/hack/tivoweb-wml-beta2? When I did the latter it still seemed to load up based on the settings in tivoweb-tcl directory (maybe I needed to do ./tivoweb console to run it). It was after I renamed tivoweb-wml-beta2 to be tivoweb-tcl that I ran into problems with the authentication.


----------



## spid3r

> _Originally posted by sanderton _
> *Once you replaced TW, you can just regard it as being exactly the same as standard TW. *


I currently only run TW+ and have disabled TW. Is there a performance hit to the machine having them both running, or am I best sticking with whichever I use most?


----------



## sanderton

> _Originally posted by comdw _
> *I guess I'll just have to try it again. Do you run the wap version from /var/hack/tivoweb-tcl or from var/hack/tivoweb-wml-beta2? When I did the latter it still seemed to load up based on the settings in tivoweb-tcl directory (maybe I needed to do ./tivoweb console to run it). It was after I renamed tivoweb-wml-beta2 to be tivoweb-tcl that I ran into problems with the authentication. *


I'm running it out of /var/hack/tivoweb-wml


----------



## sanderton

> _Originally posted by spid3r _
> *I currently only run TW+ and have disabled TW. Is there a performance hit to the machine having them both running, or am I best sticking with whichever I use most? *


Some have said thay can see a difference in video extraction times with TW running, so having two copies would make that worse if true.

However for normal TiVo operation you can run both with no problems I've seen.


----------



## Dunkwho

Whats the latest on the prefix situation ( myip.com/tivo/wap_search/ )? I got stuck away the other day and could really have done with having this super, lovely, smashin hacking running on my tivo (couldn't believe it ... NO internet access anywhere) !  I run my tivo through apache on my PC for all incoming requests, i need the /tivo prefix to work if I'm going to get this running.

Thanks
Duncan


----------



## lcsneil

> _Originally posted by Dunkwho _
> *Whats the latest on the prefix situation ( myip.com/tivo/wap_search/ )? I got stuck away the other day and could really have done with having this super, lovely, smashin hacking running on my tivo (couldn't believe it ... NO internet access anywhere) !  I run my tivo through apache on my PC for all incoming requests, i need the /tivo prefix to work if I'm going to get this running.
> 
> Thanks
> Duncan *


Well for info I run Tivoweb (WAP) variety and have no probs accessing it on my Nokia 7250 - authenticates fine although I dont run it on a standard port and also I dont run orensop either.

Daft question but you have got allow cookies enabled on your phone haven't you?

Neil


----------



## Dunkwho

Oh i haven't _tired_ it yet ...  I read through the post and saw a comment from someone else that they'd not been able to get it to work with apache's prefixing. to the outside world my tivo is at www.me.com\tivo and all subisquent pages need to resolve OK to \tivo\phone etc. Just wondered what the status of "tivoweb with wap" was in this regard?

Ta muchly
Duncan


----------



## lcsneil

> _Originally posted by Dunkwho _
> *Oh i haven't _tired_ it yet ...  I read through the post and saw a comment from someone else that they'd not been able to get it to work with apache's prefixing. to the outside world my tivo is at www.me.com\tivo and all subisquent pages need to resolve OK to \tivo\phone etc. Just wondered what the status of "tivoweb with wap" was in this regard?
> 
> Ta muchly
> Duncan *


Ah OK I see what you mean. Mine is at www.me.com:xyz where xyz is the port which my router passes through to the Tivo on my internal network

Neil


----------



## SexyBeast

Ok, the wap access stuff is very very cool indeed and thanks to everyone, especially Graf, for the hard work and the selfless help.

In order to set tivo up for wap access, I assume the tivo is also opened to the Internet. Is this correct? How are you guys securing the tivo? Is it just basic authentication via tivoweb?

I've read the methods outlined here (tivohelp.swiki.net/74). Did you guys use these (or combinations thereof) to secure your tivo?

Thanks.


----------



## Dunkwho

I have all port 80 (http) requests into my house sent to my PC by the port forwarding on my router. The PC has apache webserver running on it - anyone visiting www.duncanshouse.com (don't try it - fake address ) gets the apache stuff. My apache config has a virtual host setup so that duncanshouse.com\tivo requests get redirected on my local network to the tivo and I have tivoweb's password setup just as a safeguard. This approach stops any port scans finding anything tivo-like but it also means that I need to use apache's prefix settings to keep the /tivo/ path name in the addresses that tivoweb uses ... hence I'd like to know if Graf's wap stuff is OK with apache's prefix stuff too .

My tivo can talk out through the router directly PC on or off, I can only tivoweb when my PC is on but its on all the time anyway so doesn't matter.

Duncan


----------



## sanderton

I've gone for the "sod it" approach with WAP, and just opened port 80 on forwards, with only the password preventing hackers from maliciously setting up recordings on my TiVo.


----------



## iankb

Have you noticed that top-priority wishlist yet for anything relating to Big Brother?


----------



## lcsneil

Likewise I have gone for the Oh Sod It approach as well. ( I couldn't get orensop to work with WAP - was OK with http but not WAP)

Just for good measure though I do not use port 80. I use a port above 10,000 under the no doubt mis-guided belief that it is less likely to get scanned!


Neil


----------



## SexyBeast

Thanks for the feedback on security.

I finally got around to installing this thing. I got it un-zipped onto my /var/hack/tivoweb-wml-beta2 directory, but when I try to start the server, it hangs.

[I type:]
/var/hack/tivoweb-wml-beta2# /var/hack/tivoweb-wml-beta2/tivoweb console

[Then I get this:]
/var/hack/tivoweb-wml-beta2# <166>Jul 8 01:39:06 tcl[340]: Tcl created pool of
2916352 bytes

[afterwards it just hangs]

I was just wondering.... does this thing work for US Directv Tivos? Or is this just meant for UK SA Tivos? What could I be doing wrong?

BTW, I have a US DTivo (Sony SAT-T60) running 2.5.2. I have been running TivoWebPlus just fine.

Please help.


----------



## richieuk

I have recently been trying to get this tivoweb WAP access going:

I unzipped into my /var/hack/tivoweb-wml-beta2 directory, but when I try to start the tivoweb server, it hangs with the message:

The program comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
This program is licensed under the GPL.
See the 'copyright' and 'README' files for copyright and credit information.
aborting open transaction ...

Any ideas what I am not doing correctly?


----------



## lcsneil

> _Originally posted by richieuk _
> *I have recently been trying to get this tivoweb WAP access going:
> 
> I unzipped into my /var/hack/tivoweb-wml-beta2 directory, but when I try to start the tivoweb server, it hangs with the message:
> 
> The program comes with ABSOLUTELY NO WARRANTY.
> This program is licensed under the GPL.
> See the 'copyright' and 'README' files for copyright and credit information.
> aborting open transaction ...
> 
> Any ideas what I am not doing correctly? *


I had something similar see here and sanderton gave some ideas.

Didn't actually resolve it though as I couldn't figure out what I had done to upset it. Ended up using TWP on that particular machine!

Neil


----------



## sanderton

Is your Tivo subscribed?


----------



## richieuk

> _Originally posted by sanderton _
> *Is your Tivo subscribed? *


 No


----------



## Fred Smith

A possibly useful update.

I have just purchased a Nokia 5140 whose browser supports WML and XHTML. 

I can therefore set up manual recordings using normal TiVoweb (manual recording module installed) via Orenosp over Vodafone GPRS. 

Get a few annoying messages about the security certificate instead of the normal one I get with IE or Firefox but I can live with that.


----------



## seven5

Hey guys. I just got my SA2 up and running today. I have tivoweb plus running, and now i'm trying to get the wap version running. 

I have tivoweb plus off, even though they are on seperate ports, but i'm not able to connect to tivoweb wap. It doesn't give an error when started. 

Is it because this is based off of tivoweb? Tivoweb has issues with SA2 if i'm not mistaken, thats why there is tivoweb plus. 

Any SA2 owners running tivoweb wap?


----------



## kitschcamp

Unlikely in the *UK* forum...


----------



## B33K34

What's the current status of this? The most recent link i can find further up the thread is dead. I'm using TivoWeb+ at the moment and have got it working over GPRS to my Palm Tungsten and secured with Orenosp.

My worry now is that TivoWeb+ is serving up too much information. With my 240gb Tivo the Tivoweb+ page for Now Playing is over 50k which means it's costing me about 20p a time on my Orange tariff. That's not terrible but a stripped down alternative might be worth a try.


----------



## sanderton

> 50k which means it's costing me about 20p a time on my Orange tariff

Change tariffs! I get 3Mb for £5 on mine.


----------



## tefster

Does your PalmOS brower (I assume you are using WebPro?) support 
transfer/content-encoding via gzip ? If so then you could always stick 
a mutation proxy like RabbIT (http://rabbit-proxy.sourceforge.net/) in the
chain behind OrenoSP.

I use RabbIT a lot when browsing via GSM and GRPS and the combination
of HTML compression and image shrinking speeds things up nicely.


----------



## Fred Smith

> _Originally posted by B33K34 _
> *With my 240gb Tivo the Tivoweb+ page for Now Playing is over 50k which means it's costing me about 20p a time on my Orange tariff.*


On Orange PAYG you can buy 4Mb for £4.00 (in advance) which lasts upto one month. Otherwise it's 1Mb for £3.00. On contract it's 1Mb for £1.00.

Vodafone contract charge £2.35 for 1Mb!


----------



## B33K34

Sanderton - that's the simple answer isnt it. I'd dropped back to a PAYG data tariff @ £4mb because i was using a fraction of a mb a month (picking up emails mainly). If my data bill gets above a fiver I'll switch back.

[edited - actually it's £3mb. the base bundle is 4mb for £4 then £1mb above that. My first month off the bundle they charged me £10mb hence my confusion. Below 1.5mb it was cheaper to be outside the bundle.]

tefster - Palm's own proxy works well on most pages but cant cope with Orenosp for some reason. Otherwise that might be worth a try - does it mess with conventional browsing with Firefox?


----------



## Fred Smith

Please ignore.


----------



## tefster

>tefster - ... Otherwise that might be worth a try - does it mess with 
B33K34 wrote :-
>conventional browsing with Firefox?

Only as much as you want it to really, you can trade-off how much it adjusts
content versus how much of a data-reduction level you want.

You can configure RabbIT such that it does most combinations of; advert
filtering, image compression, html compression, and general "html-bling"
(animated images, blink tags, etc) removal. 

If you set it up such that all it does it HTML compression then you don't get
any visible page-rendering differences, just a faster HTML stream load. Most
origin servers nowadays support gzip'd HTML transmission but still not all of
them do, so you get a benefit there - particularly on CMS-generated sites
where 40-50k page sizes aren't uncommon. If you set it up to do tag removal
and ad-removal then you'll see page differences of course, and if you set it
to do image compression then you see drastic differences - you can vary the
image compression level though, ranging from "no real visible difference" to
"highly pixelated but tiny in size".

If I'm on the road then I use it with all options enabled, and image size-
reduction cranked to the max. There's a slight performance trade-off in that
each page/image request now has to go via a proxy, but for typical sites I
generally see page load times decreased by 80% or so.


----------



## PaulK

BUMP

I know this is an old thread these days, but recently I got a new phone (motorola Razr) and my thoughts returned here.

I used to run wap version perfectly many moons ago. following the loss of my /var/hack dir I have only recently had the time to restore things to their former glory.

This time round I am having some trouble: The WAP interface works just fine searching a recording effortlessly form the bar I frequent for lunch.

However with testing almost complete, tonight I added a username and password to my tivoweb.cfg

Now I get a 'Page cannot be displayed' error

remove the password - everything works again

I am running tivoweb-wml-beta2 through a linksys wireless router with port 80 forwarding direct to my tivo (via a dynamicdns service)

Has anyone heard of a workaround for this, I notice a similar question being asked back in the thread but no obvious answer?

I wonder if Graf would like to revisit this?

Hope someone can shed some light for me.

Paul K


----------



## stark

Is there still a copy of this installation available?

The link appleman posted earlier in the thread seems to be dead.


----------



## saccorator

Look at post #41 for the file.


----------



## graf

I've been having terrible problems with my web hosting. My first provider kept forgetting to renew my domain every year, despite me paying them on time. So I switched to a different provider, and they went down for most of this week, so I've moved again.

The new link is TivoWeb Wml (and I've updated it in the original post I made too).

I'm going to try and have a look at revamping it a bit, but I can't promise anything.


----------



## Tivo_noob

An old thread but i just cannot get this working on my phone, ive ftp'd all the stuff to tivo but when i try and connect via wap i get an error message saying:
Sorry the requested item could not be loaded!
(Status Code:500) 
 gutted!


----------



## lcsneil

It does work - you are running the WML version of Tivo web beta 2 arent you not the normal Tivoweb?

Neil


----------



## Tivo_noob

lcsneil said:


> It does work - you are running the WML version of Tivo web beta 2 arent you not the normal Tivoweb?
> 
> Neil


Hmmm i'm not sure, how would i go about changing it?


----------



## -MC-

Just a thought seeing no ones answered you - 

Why not stick with normal tivoweb and download Opera Mini browswer for your phone, that way you get full HTML.


----------



## Tivo_noob

-MC- said:


> Just a thought seeing no ones answered you -
> 
> Why not stick with normal tivoweb and download Opera Mini browswer for your phone, that way you get full HTML.


Thanks for the help, but where would i point the phone browser too?


----------



## -MC-

Have a look at

WWW.opera.com/products/mobile/operamini/


----------



## Tivo_noob

-MC- said:


> Have a look at
> 
> WWW.opera.com/products/mobile/operamini/


I've got opera on my phone but i don't know how to connect to my tivo


----------



## -MC-

is your tivo connected to network by router, or router and Orenosp reverse proxy server ?

Have you had tivoweb working from within your network ?


----------



## Tivo_noob

-MC- said:


> is your tivo connected to network by router, or router and Orenosp reverse proxy server ?
> 
> Have you had tivoweb working from within your network ?


Cheers for your help, its appreciated. Yes it's connected direct to my router via ethernet cable

I forgot to mention, i have a static ip address and when i point my phone browser to that i get to my router login page


----------



## terryeden

Tivo_noob said:


> Cheers for your help, its appreciated. Yes it's connected direct to my router via ethernet cable
> 
> I forgot to mention, i have a static ip address and when i point my phone browser to that i get to my router login page


That's because your *router* is set to respond to requests on port 80.

Go into your router setup and point pot 80 to the IP address of your TiVo.

Now, when you visit your static IP from the internet, you'll get TiVo web.

If you want to assign a different port to your TiVo, say 12345, you'd access it by visiting http:/ /your.ip.address:12345/

HTH

T


----------



## Tivo_noob

terryeden said:


> That's because your *router* is set to respond to requests on port 80.
> 
> Go into your router setup and point pot 80 to the IP address of your TiVo.
> 
> Now, when you visit your static IP from the internet, you'll get TiVo web.
> 
> If you want to assign a different port to your TiVo, say 12345, you'd access it by visiting http:/ /your.ip.address:12345/
> 
> HTH
> 
> T


Cheers, everythings working now thanks for all your help guys


----------



## Tivo_noob

Ho-hum, there's always something. I can access via my phone but i can't get tivoweb in my browser anymore 

edit: Of course i had unplugged the Tivo ethernet cable from my router while moving it and forgot to plug it back in!!!!


----------



## Tivo_noob

Since i managed to get this working my Tivo won't make its daily call anymore, any ideas?


----------

