# DirecTV TiVo may finally ship in April or May



## gimp

DirecTV TiVo may finally ship in April or May

The planned DirecTV TiVo HD receiver that dates back to 2008 and has faced numerous delays may have been shown off to a select few at the CES show last week. The hardware may finally show up in April or May,sources speaking to Fudzilla said. Unofficial rumors also indicate the device will not contain all of TiVo's latest features.

Also allegedly not present will be multi-room support, and the device will be based on a reference Thompson design. What will be the headline feature, however, is the TiVo user interface that is said to be much better than that of DirecTV's DVR models. TiVo is rumored to be doing beta testing on the software to work out the bugs and otherwise refine it.

By Electronista Staff


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## pforkes

I was at CES and SPECIFICALLY asked about the DirecTV TiVo unit and was told that TiVo had done the work, submitted it to DirecTV and they were waiting for DirecTV to put it together and ship it.
It was not shown to anyone at CES. I asked (and I had press credentials).


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## lrhorer

Anything interesting at CES? (Note: I don't consider anything wiith "phone" in the name or description to be interesting.)


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## dirk1843

lrhorer said:


> Anything interesting at CES? (Note: I don't consider anything wiith "phone" in the name or description to be interesting.)


IMHO the word "tablet" is just as bad.......and "3D".


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## Scooter

Meh. Five years too late. I love TiVo, but when they stopped building D-TiVos I left. My DIRECTV DVRs work very well. Also, having multiple DVRs with Grandfathered lifetime TiVo service, it's MUCH cheaper to have DIRECTV's boxes. Well, if it's like the old days, I suppose it would be the same price for DIRECT's boxes as TiVo. Anyone remember $99 D-TiVos (owned)? 

DIRECTV's boxes have features now that I never had with the old D-TiVos. I'm perfectly happy. 

I really do hope it works out for TiVo. I'm willing to reconsider if they have fantastic features that I can't resist.. Swapping 6 HD DVRs won't be cheap though. 

Sadly, I don't think that's going to happen anytime soon.


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## landscapeman

I am hoping that they release it soon. But if the features do not match my HR24, I guess it will be a flop.


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## dswallow

pforkes said:


> I was at CES and SPECIFICALLY asked about the DirecTV TiVo unit and was told that TiVo had done the work, submitted it to DirecTV and they were waiting for DirecTV to put it together and ship it.
> It was not shown to anyone at CES. I asked (and I had press credentials).


I guess you weren't among the select few. There was no mention that any of them were press.


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## Colby

Anyone have a lead on a feature comparison (with either D*TV box or current TiVo)?


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## stevel

We have almost no idea what TiVo features will be in the new box that are not in current DTiVos, other than SwivelSearch and KidZone.


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## litzdog911

Colby said:


> Anyone have a lead on a feature comparison (with either D*TV box or current TiVo)?


Still too early for that.

You can follow the latest rumors here ....
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=188103


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## Adonsa

gimp said:


> DirecTV TiVo may finally ship in April or May


Hi Gimp,

May I respectfully suggest taking bets on:
-- Release of a Direct-TV Tivo HD by the end of May with odds of about 20:1 that it won't happen.
-- Release of a Direct-TV Tivo HD by the end of 2011 with odds of about 10:1 that it won't happen.
-- Release of a Direct-TV Tivo HD within the next 10 years with odds of about 2:1 that it won't happen.

There's been occasional hype that DirecTV and Tivo get along now. Well, that's wonderful! What has happened (besides the low keyed hype) to substantiate that? What good has it done Tivo subscribers?

If there really is a Direct-TV Tivo HD, even on the drawing boards, why has the delay been so long?
Apathy?
Too difficult to design the circuit board?
Too difficult to write the software?

Why is it too technically difficult to design an interface to allow a non-DirectTV Tivo to have connectivity with a [non-Tivo]Direct-TV receiver?

Thanks


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## litzdog911

Adonsa:
See the link I posted previously in this thread. There's plenty of discussion there about the relationship between DirecTV and Tivo and why things have taken so long. Regardless of all that, it's looking like the new DirecTV Tivo is getting closer. Finally.


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## bigpuma

litzdog911 said:


> Adonsa:
> See the link I posted previously in this thread. There's plenty of discussion there about the relationship between DirecTV and Tivo and why things have taken so long. Regardless of all that, it's looking like the new DirecTV Tivo is getting closer. Finally.


Not to mention isn't there pretty good confirmation that it is currently in beta testing?


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## DreadPirateRob

When I had my HR24s installed back in December, the installer told me that he had been told they could expect to have the DirecTV HD Tivos ready to install (i.e., on the trucks) in June of 2011. Take that with whatever grain of salt that you will.


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## Adonsa

Thank you Litzdog911, BigPuma, and DreadpirateRob,

Thank you for taking time to reply; I much appreciate!



> ...pretty good confirmation that it is currently in beta testing?


May I suggest, that beta-tester invitations be sent out to Directv/Tivo users, who have been experiencing frequent reboots?

Thanks again!


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## stevel

Suggesting here does no good. TiVo and DirecTV are handling this beta - who knows what the selection criteria are, though it seems one had to at least register with TiVo's beta program. (Doing so was no guarantee of being selected, though - as I know.)


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## litzdog911

Adonsa said:


> Thank you Litzdog911, BigPuma, and DreadpirateRob,
> 
> Thank you for taking time to reply; I much appreciate!
> 
> May I suggest, that beta-tester invitations be sent out to Directv/Tivo users, who have been experiencing frequent reboots?
> 
> Thanks again!


I think the window for beta testers closed several months ago.


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## TyroneShoes

gimp said:


> ...What will be the headline feature, however, is the TiVo user interface that is said to be much better than that of DirecTV's DVR models...


I'll believe it when I see it. That's like saying "The iPhone 5 will be like no phone you've ever seen", and I would be pretty skeptical of that as well. There has never been a phone unlike one never seen before other than the iPhone 2G in June, 2007. Every phone since by every manufacturer has been very much like a phone we've seen before, including each successive permutation of the iPhone.

To keep that analogy going, at the same time the iPhone was light-years ahead of every other phone (the first few months or more after its release) the pre-eminent platform for HD content was without question the HR10-250. There were other DVRs, and other phones, but none were anything even close to these industry giants.

But time passes, and now many phones suck, and many phones are the functional equivalent, arguably even better, than the iPhone. Likewise, Tivo doesn't appear to have anything revolutionary up its sleeve, and competitors have caught and passed it. IMH(personal)O, maybe even lapped it a time or two. For Tivo to unveil a true premium DVR, a HR2x killer, is nearly impossible at this point. But more power to them, even if we are still talking about vaporware and a prototype laboratory-curiosity prop at CES.

It is nearly impossible to top one's self. Out of a billion movies, the only sequel that comes to mind is Godfather II, and that was hardly revolutionary. Jimi Hendrix was revolutionary, but even he never had a song or album or performance that was revolutionary once we had already seen what he could do. Is Justin Beiber revolutionary? Hearing his music, shall we all just go erase our Beatles libraries from iTunes?

I think Tivo blew its load at v3.1.5. Nothing since has been anything other than incremental, and mostly useless added bloatware features, which they stumbled badly with beginning around v6.3. Mind you, a once wonderful tech company with no money and the wolves at the door _can possibly_ come back from the dead, but the one time that comes to memory involved Steve Jobs, of which there is only one. Its also hard to be revolutionary regarding a technology that is nearly dead in the first place and about to be replaced by VOD and file-based streaming.

But I would love to hear you fan-boys on the forum tell me "I told you so". It would be worth it to be that wrong about something that seems so obvious.

(BTW, folks who could not get or tolerate AT&T reception didn't hold out, they went out and BOUGHT A DIFFERENT PHONE. You Tivo holdouts should take that to heart. Never stop eating filets because a Porterhouse is unavailable--you might even develop a taste for filets.)


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## slydog75

TyroneShoes said:


> I'll believe it when I see it. That's like saying "The iPhone 5 will be like no phone you've ever seen", and I would be pretty skeptical of that as well. There has never been a phone unlike one never seen before other than the iPhone 2G in June, 2007. Every phone since by every manufacturer has been very much like a phone we've seen before, including each successive permutation of the iPhone.
> 
> To keep that analogy going, at the same time the iPhone was light-years ahead of every other phone (the first few months or more after its release) the pre-eminent platform for HD content was without question the HR10-250. There were other DVRs, and other phones, but none were anything even close to these industry giants.
> 
> But time passes, and now many phones suck, and many phones are the functional equivalent, arguably even better, than the iPhone. Likewise, Tivo doesn't appear to have anything revolutionary up its sleeve, and competitors have caught and passed it. IMH(personal)O, maybe even lapped it a time or two. For Tivo to unveil a true premium DVR, a HR2x killer, is nearly impossible at this point. But more power to them, even if we are still talking about vaporware and a prototype laboratory-curiosity prop at CES.
> 
> It is nearly impossible to top one's self. Out of a billion movies, the only sequel that comes to mind is Godfather II, and that was hardly revolutionary. Jimi Hendrix was revolutionary, but even he never had a song or album or performance that was revolutionary once we had already seen what he could do. Is Justin Beiber revolutionary? Hearing his music, shall we all just go erase our Beatles libraries from iTunes?


IMO, The Dark Knight was better than Batman Begins.


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## Adam1115

gimp said:


> Also allegedly not present will be multi-room support, and the device will be based on a reference Thompson design.
> 
> What will be the headline feature, however, is the TiVo user interface that is said to be much better than that of DirecTV's DVR models.


Does not compute.


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## Audiovidman

I waited for years Tivo/DirecTV but switched to Cable, got two premiers and love it. I also saved money $$$ switching to a $99.00 cable plan. Your crazy to wait for DirecTV.


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## willmw

For some of us, DirecTV is the only choice short of looking out the window and watching birds fly by. I'm holding out for the new unit, in hopes my old ones will last that long. If not, I'll have to take the non-tivo DTV unit...but will cross that bridge when I must.


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## TyroneShoes

slydog75 said:


> IMO, The Dark Knight was better than Batman Begins.


Kind of the smallest point in the post, but I agree. In fact I think it was one of the best movies I've seen in many years--I was really impressed by how well the dramatic relationships between the characters drove their behavior, which is not something you expect in a "comic book" movie. I even created a ring-tone from the main theme.

Heath Ledger was great, and he gets all the press, but to me the real genius was Christopher Nolan and whoever wrote the screenplay.

But is that really a sequel? "Sequel" may have come to mean something different from its original definition in Hollywood, which is you have luck with a movie and then try to cash in on the same characters and familiarity by writing them another vehicle. BB and Dark Knight were more stand-alone scripts that both just happened to be about the same basic world. And obviously one had to happen first and the other second, although the plot of one did not really drive the plot of the other all that much. You can't declare it NOT a sequel, but it mostly doesn't fit that mode. Its more like another in a series, rather than something born out of the original. DK seemed less like a sequel to BB than BB seemed to all the BM movies before it, at least in my mind.

Of course "The Godfather II" was even less a sequel from a writing standpoint, as GF1 was part 2 of the book, and GF2 was parts 1 and 3 of that same book. That's also why I prefer "The Godfather: the Teleplay", where they took GF1 and GF2 and cut it back into chronological order for television.

Now GF3? _That_ was a sequel.


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## farmdwg

According to a tweet I got from @DirecTV yesterday, they are looking at the end of 2011.


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## Kablemodem

farmdwg said:


> According to a tweet I got from @DirecTV yesterday, they are looking at the end of 2011.


Looking at it for what, to tell us the new HD TiVo will be out some time in 2012?


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## BOBCAT

Does anyone know if there is a process or a service that, if your TiVo unit fails, your hard drive can be moved to another TiVo and somehow authorize it to recognize your recorded programs? Perhaps a "Hack"?


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## BOBCAT

Hi stevel,
I was hoping that there was a accepted way of doing this in the case of a hardware failure of ones original DTiVo. 
Just wouldn't want to loose what I have archived on the drive.
About once every 12 months or so, will DD the drive to a new one to have a backup in case of a failure. I use a 3 drive rotation. I also take the DVR down every 6 months, open it up and blow the dust out to promote good cooling of the chips and power supply. 
Even when/if the new HD TiVo comes out, will keep the 250 on line.
Will record the same programs on the new DVR as they repeat, then down the line will retire the 250 when I have captured them all on the new DVR.
Thanks for the link:up:
BOBCAT


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## stevel

Sounds like a good plan.


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## BOBCAT

Hi Steve,
Thanks for the info, but it is beyond my ability to make it happen.
Was thinking about this for a contingency plan in case I have a hardware failure. May never need to do this though.
Will just keep doing preventive maintenance on the 250 to keep it going.


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## mjkrehbiel

I'm a 10-year Directv Tivo customer and I'm tired of waiting for the new Directivo unit -- like many of you I've been waiting literally years now. Planning on staying with Tivo, but dumping Directv for Comcast. So sorry to leave you Directv, but Tivo's more important to me than you are.

Currently: 2 x HR10-250 Directivo units; Tivo Premiere OTA
Future (in about 3 weeks): 2 x Tivo Premiere w/Cablecard (M-card).


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## CuriousMark

mjkrehbiel said:


> I'm a 10-year Directv Tivo customer and I'm tired of waiting for the new Directivo unit -- like many of you I've been waiting literally years now. Planning on staying with Tivo, but dumping Directv for Comcast. So sorry to leave you Directv, but Tivo's more important to me than you are.
> 
> Currently: 2 x HR10-250 Directivo units; Tivo Premiere OTA
> Future (in about 3 weeks): 2 x Tivo Premiere w/Cablecard (M-card).


I went the other way and got the HR24. I wish I had done what you are doing instead. Now I am stuck for two years or a winning lottery ticket, whichever comes first.


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## HiDefGator

CuriousMark said:


> I went the other way and got the HR24. I wish I had done what you are doing instead. Now I am stuck for two years or a winning lottery ticket, whichever comes first.


the cost to get out of your contract is prorated. and some cable companies might credit you cash to encourage you to leave early for them.


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## shredhead

Was on phone with DTV today, cancellation department. 

The guy said all the delays on releasing the new D-Tivo are Tivo's fault because they are having trouble working with MPEG4. 

He insisted that DTV is the only company currently using MPEG4 in the USA and that if I went with FIOS TV my internet would slow down when I watch hi-def shows.

He said cancelling is $20 a month for the amount of time I had left. So I guess I'm stuck for awhile. I've waited 2 years to get rid of the HR22's I have (that take 4 seconds to change the damn channel). I guess if it's really only a few more months I may as well wait.


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## mp11

Well I left Directv about 2 years ago because of H/W problems too numerous to mention(HR20, HR21). Granted, Charter cable isn't Directv, but the last 2 years have been nothing but smooth sailing with TivoHD. However, I'm not shutting the door on the new DirecTivo. I'll be carefully listening for the feedback on this new unit. It would be hard to give up YouTube and Netflix tho.


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## stevel

I can watch YouTube and Netflix on my HR21 through PlayOn.


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## mp11

stevel said:


> I can watch YouTube and Netflix on my HR21 through PlayOn.


Is playon additional hardware?


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## stevel

Software that runs on a PC. http://www.playon.tv/playon


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## Rainy Dave

shredhead said:


> Was on phone with DTV today, cancellation department.
> 
> The guy said all the delays on releasing the new D-Tivo are Tivo's fault because they are having trouble working with MPEG4.
> 
> He insisted that DTV is the only company currently using MPEG4 in the USA and that if I went with FIOS TV my internet would slow down when I watch hi-def shows.
> 
> He said cancelling is $20 a month for the amount of time I had left. So I guess I'm stuck for awhile. I've waited 2 years to get rid of the HR22's I have (that take 4 seconds to change the damn channel). I guess if it's really only a few more months I may as well wait.


I've read that the new DirecTiVo is based on the HR22 platform. So...


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## HiDefGator

A recent tweet from Directv indicated the rollout date is now "hopefully late 2011". In today's earnings call Tivo's CEO failed to even mention the DirecTivo. I'm not sure I would hold my breath hoping to see it soon.


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## lrhorer

shredhead said:


> Was on phone with DTV today, cancellation department.
> 
> The guy said all the delays on releasing the new D-Tivo are Tivo's fault because they are having trouble working with MPEG4.
> 
> He insisted that DTV is the only company currently using MPEG4 in the USA and that if I went with FIOS TV my internet would slow down when I watch hi-def shows.


Lies piled high on top of other lies. It's complete bull pookey. I wish I had been on the phone. After getting every bit of his information (name, employee ID, supervisor's name and ID, etc), I would have ripped him a new one and then called his supervisor and ripped *him* a new one. Of course, doing so might not have helped, but I could at least have posted their names here and suggested everyone here call and complain, as well.

Too bad lying isn't illegal, and that his behavior is probably not actionable as fraud.


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## Chris Gerhard

lrhorer said:


> Lies piled high on top of other lies. It's complete bull pookey. I wish I had been on the phone. After getting every bit of his information (name, employee ID, supervisor's name and ID, etc), I would have ripped him a new one and then called his supervisor and ripped *him* a new one. Of course, doing so might not have helped, but I could at least have posted their names here and suggested everyone here call and complain, as well.
> 
> Too bad lying isn't illegal, and that his behavior is probably not actionable as fraud.


What specifically do you think the customer service rep lied about? What he stated falls under the category of opinion. You can't lie about what is going to happen in the future if a customer leaves DirecTV, that is called a missed prediction if it is wrong. He may very well believe that TiVo had trouble with DirecTV MPEG4, how would you know he has precise information from TiVo as to the cause of the delays and knew what he said was false, assuming it was?

All of the severe reactions I see from people here claiming to know so much more than customer service reps always seems strange to me. I see the people as just doing a job, trying to help the customer and do the best they can for the company they work for. Overall, DirecTV customer service reps are better than most in my opinion which would help explain why the company can maintain a customer base of over 20,000,000 and continue to grow. In this case and almost any other, the customer service rep claims as related by the customer could have been the result of a misunderstanding or been misheard or not what was said as a result of some other reason.


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## fasTLane

Calling customer service is like a box of chocolates.


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## mp11

stevel said:


> Software that runs on a PC. http://www.playon.tv/playon


I see. Not as good as having on the DVR.


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## BOBCAT

Customer service reps are like growing mushrooms. They are kept in the dark and fed bull....!
They have no idea as to whats going on, so they just tell the customer what the customer wants to hear, then gives out a bit of free service for 3 to 6 months to show the customer that they care.


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## mjkrehbiel

mp11 said:


> Well I left Directv about 2 years ago because of H/W problems too numerous to mention(HR20, HR21). Granted, Charter cable isn't Directv, but the last 2 years have been nothing but smooth sailing with TivoHD. However, I'm not shutting the door on the new DirecTivo. I'll be carefully listening for the feedback on this new unit. It would be hard to give up YouTube and Netflix tho.


The Tivo Premiere offers both Youtube and Netflix functionality. I've been running my Premiere for a few weeks now OTA and been happy with it. Looking forward to adding Comcast with Cablecard soon...


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## farmdwg

BOBCAT said:


> Moderators,
> It would be nice if you could remove post 24.


Why remove my post?? Why don't you follow me on Twitter and you will see that what I posted is the truth. They are no where near an early 2011 release.

BTW I send a daily tweet to @DirecTV asking them for an update or calling them on their "early 2011" release date.


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## BOBCAT

Post 24 got removed,, so everything was renumbered.
See post 29 for what the contents was.


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## cantil

called tech support today about audio problems on local fox channel had to get xferd to higher end tech support after going over equment i had ect they put in ticket asked about the new tivo units they said they where built and would be hitting customers in the next 90 so april may seems about right also siad the units werent leased you would own them as with previous tivo units from directv so here is one x my fingers and toes ... this would be a nice birthday present for me  (may 15th ) incase dtv reads this


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## bwld123

for whats its worth, my HR-21 started to die and i had DirecTV come out yesterday to take a look. The second tuner onmy unit was the problem and i was getting pixilation. I asked the tech if he had a HR-24 on his truck and as long as he was replacing it, if I could get that. He did have it and thats what I got now... side note, the HR-24 is SOOOOO much faster then the 21, which was by biggest complaint... while the tech was there i asked if the TiVo unit was being beta tested and he comfirmed that he had seen it, and yes it was.. as for time when it would be out, he said they have been told late june, early july time frame


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## TonyD79

stevel said:


> I can watch YouTube and Netflix on my HR21 through PlayOn.


By now, you should be able to watch YouTube directly on your HR21 without playon.

As for Netflix, practically every blu ray player does Netflix now.


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## sjberra

TonyD79 said:


> By now, you should be able to watch YouTube directly on your HR21 without playon.
> 
> As for Netflix, practically every blu ray player does Netflix now.


It is directly competeing with a Directv product you will not see thsat on a directv dvr, even if it has tivo on it


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## magnus

sjberra said:


> It is directly competeing with a Directv product you will not see thsat on a directv dvr, even if it has tivo on it


Yep, you'll just get the same watered down features that Directv will LET you have (as last time with the Standard Def Directv Tivo). I'm glad that I went to SA Tivos.


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## RMBittner

mjkrehbiel said:


> The Tivo Premiere offers both Youtube and Netflix functionality. I've been running my Premiere for a few weeks now OTA and been happy with it. Looking forward to adding Comcast with Cablecard soon...


Apparently, then, the Internet-based functionality of the Premiere units is better implemented than on the S3HD units, which is what we have. We absolutely love TiVo, but Netflix is incredibly slow and glitchy on the S3HD.

I thought it was a Netflix issue...until I got an iPad last year and tried streaming Netflix movies on it. No glitches, no problems. Perfect. Now, when I want streaming Netflix, I just hook up the iPad to the TV and bypass the TiVo unit entirely.

And, yes, count me in as one of the TiVo/cable subscribers who will jump to the DirecTiVo HD units the day they are officially available. Assuming I live that long. (Could be dicey; I'm already 49...)

Bob


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## litzdog911

Latest Tivo information posted by Doug Brott at DBSTalk ....
http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=2743691&postcount=1042


Probably June or July release (subject to change)
No MRV
I think, no ToGo
No Netflix
Might work with TiVo iPad app (don't think so)
two 30-minute buffers (DLB)
likely extra cost (initial and per month - but I'm not sure)
Classic TiVo UI (not HD)
Support for MPEG4
TiVo KidZone
TiVo Swivel Search
Peanut Remote
same hardware as HR22-100


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## Vegas

2 year wait for a crippled TiVo...

Now I'm really glad I moved to cable.


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## Adam1115

So not worth it, the HR24 is much better...


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## Cudahy

So basically the same Tivo, able to get all channels. I'm ready. That just leaves the question of the cost of the box.


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## snickerrrrs

This is just rumor right? Since we aren't even in April yet, the April, May release rumor might still be accurate. Does this guy have a track record for being right on previous releases?


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## fasTLane

Cudahy said:


> So basically the same Tivo, able to get all channels. I'm ready. That just leaves the question of the cost of the box.


+1


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## stevel

snickerrrrs said:


> Does this guy have a track record for being right on previous releases?


Yes, he is one of the better-informed folks there. If he says that he thinks this is what it will be, I give that added weight. And if indeed that's what the new box is, I'm passing.


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## GKevinK

The extent to which they are apparently gutting what we know as TiVo functionality today is really pretty upsetting. I have to wonder whether they are also making it painfully slow to respond to commands from the remote (which is my #1 frustration with the HR-21.)


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## mktc1985

There's a good sign the Tivo's coming out soon since the THR22-100 software is in the Directv data stream now. I can't post a link but google Directv Firmware watcher and it shows it on that web site.


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## BOBCAT

If D* goes through all of the trouble to have whoever port the TiVo UI to a D* DVR, why didn't they use the HR24. What a bunch of C**P.
Shows how much D* thinks of the customers that have waited for the release of the HD TiVo.
In other words, Take this half baked box, or go somewhere else.


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## litzdog911

BOBCAT said:


> If D* goes through all of the trouble to have whoever port the TiVo UI to a D* DVR, why didn't they use the HR24. What a bunch of C**P.
> Shows how much D* thinks of the customers that have waited for the release of the HD TiVo.
> In other words, Take this half baked box, or go somewhere else.


It's not DirecTV that's "going through all the trouble", it's Tivo's engineers. DirecTV is just providing a hardware platform. The HR22 was the latest platform when Tivo started this effort nearly 3 years ago now.


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## litzdog911

snickerrrrs said:


> ... Does this guy have a track record for being right on previous releases?


Absolutely. Doug is well-connected and rarely wrong with his info. That's why I wanted to be sure folks here saw the information.


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## catocony

Well, as I wrote on a thread over in the other DirecTivo section, I will be willing to pay a small premium for Tivo, but not much. If it's a few bucks a month I'll stick with HD Tivo. In a perfect world, it would be grandfathered for those of us still on SD DirecTivos, at least monthlies. If they want to charge extra for the box, that would be fine, but nothing massively expensive. I understand that someone has to pay for the work Tivo has done, but the $4.00 or whatever Tivo gets from me now should cover that. Tivo gets a little, DirecTV gets a lot but not as much as on their boxes - everyone should be happy that way.

If it turns out to be an extra $100 per box at installation time and $10 a month more for Tivo DVR, I'll just use the DirecTV labeled products. I hate the R15 in my office - my original Tivo is sitting in the basement right now. But, the new stuff is better and faster than the R15 which, at the end of the day, works.


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## Audiovidman

I saw the new DirecTV TiVo !!! I'm sorry I just woke up from a dream.


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## joemamafresh

*So what's so much better about the HR24? Also, I've got an HR22, what's the difference between the HR22 and the HR24? I've always wondered...*



Adam1115 said:


> So not worth it, the HR24 is much better...


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## Adam1115

joemamafresh said:


> *So what's so much better about the HR24? Also, I've got an HR22, what's the difference between the HR22 and the HR24? I've always wondered...*


The HR22 is much slower.

But I wasn't really saying that, I was saying going for the TiVo isn't worth it, given the lack of features compared to the HR24. (The biggie being MRV)


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## fasTLane

The toilet is so boring. Must have MRV. (not)


----------



## Scooter

Too bad for the TiVo lovers. I like my DIRECTV unit much better than the old D-TiVos anyway. As I've said many times in the past, it's too little, too late. 

/unsubscribe


----------



## BOBCAT

Litzdog911,
Guess you are right. Too bad that they couldn't just update the software to run on the 24.
Does the HR22 have a built in OTA tuner?, or do we have to use the add on box.
Guess we are lucky that they really did come out with the HD TiVo.
Although the HR22 may be slow, must be faster than the HR10-250.
Will give it a try when it comes out. Hopefully they won't make us take another 2 year commitment to get it. That would be the limit. Would just look at the other services available in my area.
At least I will be able to access all of my recording on the 250 after dropping D*.
It's too bad that TiVo didn't develop there own box instead of porting the software on the 22.


----------



## joemamafresh

*What is the MRV? What does the HR24 have that the TiVo won't? I'm REALLY dissapointed, I LOVE TiVo's UI... *



Adam1115 said:


> The HR22 is much slower.
> 
> But I wasn't really saying that, I was saying going for the TiVo isn't worth it, given the lack of features compared to the HR24. (The biggie being MRV)


----------



## CuriousMark

joemamafresh said:


> *What is the MRV? What does the HR24 have that the TiVo won't? I'm REALLY dissapointed, I LOVE TiVo's UI... *


It is the whole home DVR service that allows shows to be watched not only on the DVR itself, but also on other HD satellite boxes in the home or even another DVR. All playlists are combined into one, so you don't have to know where it was recorded if you have multiple DVRs.

TiVo is expected to be bringing this out for Suddenlink customers in the coming months, but alas, apparently not with DirecTV.


----------



## mohanman

diretv tivo?? Yeah right.. let me know when elvis comes back. I've been hearing about this so-called contraption for the past 3 years.. its never coming face it.


----------



## stevel

All HR2X boxes other than the HR20 use the AM21 box for an OTA tuner.


----------



## bigpuma

fasTLane said:


> The toilet is so boring. Must have MRV. (not)


Of course if TiVo had MRV and DirecTV DVRs didn't you would be saying how incredible it is and how ridiculous the DirecTV boxes are for not having it. You are so predictable. You might as well just post ... we can fill in the rest.


----------



## fasTLane

Predict this. :up:


----------



## litzdog911

BOBCAT said:


> Litzdog911,
> ....
> Does the HR22 have a built in OTA tuner?, or do we have to use the add on box....
> 
> .... Hopefully they won't make us take another 2 year commitment to get it. .....


I expect that the HD Tivo will support the AM21 Off-Air Tuner accessory. But we don't know for sure yet.

Adding the HD Tivo to your account will likely trigger a 2-yr lease commitment. But we don't know yet what the pricing will be.


----------



## catocony

MRV isn't important to me. All I want is an HD box that looks exactly like my current SD DirecTivo. Same menus, same peanut controller. 

As for speed on the Hughes boxes, I'm going to bet it's more an issue of crappy code and a poor user interface than a hardware issue. Any hardware in any H2x series is a lot newer than the hamster running on a wheel that's powering my DirecTivo from 2003. So Tivo code on an H22 could be blazing fast. Again, for me, if it looks like the DirecTivos I've used very happily for 8 years now but has full HD support for all DirecTV channels, that's all I need. Yeah, it would be nice just to buy the gear and own it like it used to be, but it is what it is.


----------



## eric_n_dfw

Lack of working MRV is what drove me away from TivoHD on TWC last year (copy protection bit). I'd welcome even the old TiVo UI over the HR24's I have now, but the lack of MRV is a killer for me. 

The way things are going, I predict I'll be on Roku or Apple TV in another year or so with everything moving to Netflix and Amazon and the like, all they need is more streaming live event/sports like how MLB and NBA are starting to do.


----------



## BOBCAT

Thanks Stevel and Litzdog911
So that's another $50 for the tuner. 
Don't understand why just adding another receiver would trigger a 2 year commitment.
You would think that sense D* kept everyone waiting for so many years for this box that the would not demand another 2 year commitment from the subscribers. They got their 2 years + out of every subscriber that waited for it!


----------



## dswallow

It's so nice not being a DirecTV subscriber anymore.


----------



## unitron

The new DirecTV Tivo comes bundled with a copy of "Duke Nukem Forever"?


----------



## stevel

If you currently use OTA you might get the tuner free.


----------



## dswallow

unitron said:


> The new DirecTV Tivo comes bundled with a copy of "Duke Nukem Forever"?


You give 2K Games too much credit.

It comes with a coupon for "Duke Nukem Forever".


----------



## unitron

dswallow said:


> You give 2K Games too much credit.
> 
> It comes with a coupon for "Duke Nukem Forever".


----------



## Todd

litzdog911 said:


> Latest Tivo information posted by Doug Brott at DBSTalk ....
> http://www.dbstalk.com/showpost.php?p=2743691&postcount=1042
> 
> 
> Probably June or July release (subject to change)
> No MRV
> I think, no ToGo
> No Netflix
> Might work with TiVo iPad app (don't think so)
> two 30-minute buffers (DLB)
> likely extra cost (initial and per month - but I'm not sure)
> Classic TiVo UI (not HD)
> Support for MPEG4
> TiVo KidZone
> TiVo Swivel Search
> Peanut Remote
> same hardware as HR22-100


Very disappointing. As a former long time TiVo user and fan, I was hoping this would at least some close to the capabilities of the TiVo Premier, but it doesn't look much better than my old DirecTiVo. And the same old half hour buffer just looks ridiculous in 2011. At least it's full time DLB. Looks like I'll be sticking with DirecTV's current DVRs.


----------



## Krandor

unitron said:


> The new DirecTV Tivo comes bundled with a copy of "Duke Nukem Forever"?


I bet DNF hits before the Directivo.


----------



## Audiovidman

Good news everybody !!! New TiVo is coming in 2015 !!! I got reliable sources. Can't wait...


----------



## unitron

Audiovidman said:


> Good news everybody !!! New TiVo is coming in 2015 !!! I got reliable sources. Can't wait...


April Fools was yesterday.


----------



## fasTLane

unitron said:


> April Fools was yesterday.


Some fools are forever.


----------



## 230

I have 4 dvrs. My 2 HR20-700s. 1 in livingroom(which I seldom use) and 1 in my theater room.

Then 2 HR10-250s in each room for the rest of the family, who, besides my 9 year old son, who is starting in his old man's techie footsteps, couldn't care less about HD.

I figure I'll trade the 10-250 for a new living room tivo, and get rid of the lr 20-700. I have no idea if they will offer any incentives, but at least I'll save a $6 mirroring fee. (Which will probably end up costing me more for whatever tivo charges as a premium.)


----------



## BOBCAT

I have 2 HR20's and 2 HR10-250's. 1 of each in the HT room and in the Bed room.
I seldom use the HR20's as the TiVo's do everything I need. All of the HD content that I want is from the local channels over the air.
For all the years that we have waited for this "new" TiVo box, I assumed that TiVo would have built their own unit. Was very surprised to hear that they ported their GUI to D* HR22. (If that is true) 
If all of this is true, What the HE** took them so long?
I could have taken a Lunix programing course and ported the GUI to a box in less time than whoever did it at TiVo. It must have been a hobby project of one of the programmers at TiVo done after hours on his own time. How many years did it take him? 3?4?
Any company worth half their salt could have had the prototype box designed and up and running in less than a year if they put their hart into it. 
Must have been a big joke at TiVo as to the reaction of all of the D* customers who were waiting with anticipation for the wonderful new TiVo HD DVR box, and find out that it is just a old MD'd D* DVR box with the TiVo GUI ported to it.
Shame on D* and TiVo in being a part of this abortion.
Instead of coming out with a premier DVR with all of the features that the current technology could offer, they just threw a old dried out bone to all of us old dogs that were anticipating the "T'bone steak".


----------



## mcpagano

I am also tired of waiting for the new Directv Tivo. Besides it sounds like it isn't going to be such a great box anyway. Therefore, I'm thinking about switching to Dish and getting their VIP 922 box which looks a lot better than the Tivo box will ever be.


----------



## fasTLane

Dish huh. At least we'll have an option. Tivo needs to step up to the plate soon.


----------



## JimboG

mcpagano said:


> I'm thinking about switching to Dish and getting their VIP 922 box which looks a lot better...


Yes, but the HD-lite programming on Dish doesn't look all that great. Why would you go with a programming provider that intentionally reduces the resolution and bit rate of HD programming?

Then again, why would you want to reward the den of thieves at Dish / Echostar who have been stealing TiVo's intellectual property for over a decade?:down:


----------



## BOBCAT

I have considered Dish also, but they compress their signal so much. D* compression is not as bad, but could be a little less to improve picture quality.
I forget what D* BW is, I think their HD signal is 720x1024. I know it isn't 1080x1920, would use up too much BW
If anyone knows for sure, please post it.
I think that the SD signal is just above the quality of VHS. Sense most everyone use to have VHS, they wouldn't complain about the SD picture. Wish it was Beta quality though.
The trade off from analog video to digital is analog would show dropouts and noise in the video at times, but was a smooth picture. Digital shows pixelization on fast motion if the signal is compressed too much. 
With digital, they can squeeze a lot more channels of programing into the signal
They can also manipulate the signals BW. They can add more bandwidth to one channel by taking away BW from another like AMC(Take it all!) or TCM. (Stopped watching AMC when they started putting commercials in every 8 minutes. Hey AMC, raise the rates per subscriber if you have to, and kill off the commercials! You destroyed your service!) Thank God that TCM and FMC didn't do that.


----------



## fasTLane

BOBCAT said:


> (Stopped watching AMC when they started putting commercials in every 8 minutes. Hey AMC, raise the rates per subscriber if you have to, and kill off the commercials! You destroyed your service!) Thank God that TCM and FMC didn't do that.


+1


----------



## unitron

BOBCAT said:


> I have considered Dish also, but they compress their signal so much. D* compression is not as bad, but could be a little less to improve picture quality.
> I forget what D* BW is, I think their HD signal is 720x1024. I know it isn't 1080x1920, would use up too much BW
> If anyone knows for sure, please post it.
> I think that the SD signal is just above the quality of VHS. Sense most everyone use to have VHS, they wouldn't complain about the SD picture. Wish it was Beta quality though.
> The trade off from analog video to digital is analog would show dropouts and noise in the video at times, but was a smooth picture. Digital shows pixelization on fast motion if the signal is compressed too much.
> With digital, they can squeeze a lot more channels of programing into the signal
> They can also manipulate the signals BW. They can add more bandwidth to one channel by taking away BW from another like AMC(Take it all!) or TCM. (Stopped watching AMC when they started putting commercials in every 8 minutes. Hey AMC, raise the rates per subscriber if you have to, and kill off the commercials! You destroyed your service!) Thank God that TCM and FMC didn't do that.


TCM got the rights to a lot of the movies that AMC used to air, and that really created a lot of their problems, but the fact that they got new management that was stupid enough to cancel "Remember WENN" couldn't have helped.


----------



## Adam1115

BOBCAT said:


> I could have taken a Lunix programing course and ported the GUI to a box in less time than whoever did it at TiVo.


Yea, sure you could've....


----------



## catocony

I just had a brand new Panasonic 50" plasma, 1080p/600hz with RJ-45 Ethernet and wireless via USB NIC delivered this morning. I will move to HD within a few months. Right now I plan to stay with D*, but I'm not going to wait very long for the new DirecTivos.


----------



## fasTLane

I have owned a 50" Panasonic commercial plasma for 5 years and I am willing to wait since my HD DirecTivo is still plugging away. OTA HD is glorious.


----------



## brott

BOBCAT said:


> I forget what D* BW is, I think their HD signal is 720x1024. I know it isn't 1080x1920, would use up too much BW
> If anyone knows for sure, please post it.


DIRECTV uses the full resolution that they receive from broadcasters for all MPEG4 HD channels. This could be 1080p, 1080i or 720p. There is no "lite" version.


----------



## 230

Everything D* broadcasts is exactly the same resolution as received. 1920x1080i or 1280x720p. Some PPV is 1920x1080p/24Hz.


----------



## dswallow

brott said:


> DIRECTV uses the full resolution that they receive from broadcasters for all MPEG4 HD channels. This could be 1080p, 1080i or 720p. There is no "lite" version.


That doesn't mean DirecTV wouldn't or doesn't adjust compression levels as needed so that the signals fit in the bandwidth shared with all other services included on that transponder.

But it's certainly nothing different than any signal delivery service will be doing; cable, satellite, fiber, IP, and even the original OTA broadcaster who is sharing that bandwidth with various subchannels.

There is, possibly, the chance that the broadcaster provides "full bandwidth" feeds of their various subchannels such that the provider could deliver a better looking (typically less compressed) signal than if they were to start with a more heavily compressed signal from a provider who is cramming it within the shared bandwidth available on their OTA channel.

But, usually, you can never get a picture better than the original signal, and compressing/decompressing is more likely to further degrade it. Noticeably? Maybe not casually. Ideally you want to get the signal that's least processed from the original provider, directly. So that usually means the OTA signal is usually the best of the bunch.


----------



## shwru980r

BOBCAT said:


> Stopped watching AMC when they started putting commercials in every 8 minutes. Hey AMC, raise the rates per subscriber if you have to, and kill off the commercials! You destroyed your service!) Thank God that TCM and FMC didn't do that.


Can't you just fast forward through the commercials?


----------



## joed32

They even cut the movies to fit all of the commercials into the time slot.


----------



## fasTLane

AMC gets zero viewing time at our place. The commercials have made it just another cable channel. I am paying for content so why pay again? It ruins the movie experience anyway. *Long live TCM!*


----------



## mercurial

fasTLane said:


> AMC gets zero viewing time at our place. The commercials have made it just another cable channel. I am paying for content so why pay again? It ruins the movie experience anyway. Long live TCM!


AMC gets play here for one thing: The Walking Dead.


----------



## unitron

fasTLane said:


> AMC gets zero viewing time at our place. The commercials have made it just another cable channel. I am paying for content so why pay again? It ruins the movie experience anyway. *Long live TCM!*


TCM was a big part of what went wrong with AMC. They grabbed the rights to most of the movies AMC used to show.


----------



## dswallow

mercurial said:


> AMC gets play here for one thing: The Walking Dead.


No "Breaking Bad"? No "The Killing"?


----------



## mercurial

I just picked up "The Killing" but haven't started it. Didn't even realize it was AMC. Never was interested in "Breaking Bad".


----------



## lrhorer

fasTLane said:


> AMC gets zero viewing time at our place.


Well, not quite zero, here, but close to it. I avoid programming supported by adveritising. I also completely refuse to record programs that have been censored.



fasTLane said:


> The commercials have made it just another cable channel. I am paying for content so why pay again? It ruins the movie experience anyway. *Long live TCM!*


The problem with TCM is their video PQ is poor. For example, I recorded Kelly's Heroes on HDNET back in 2007, before I had the capability to enable recording to the video server. I recently recorded it on TCM, intending perhaps to free up the space on the TiVo, but the video quality is so much poorer, I have not erased the recording from HDNET.


----------



## BOBCAT

TCM is standard definition, and HDnet is high definition.
Would hope that HDnet would look better.
For standard definition, TCM looks just fine using a HR10-250 with HDMI to the TV.


----------



## fasTLane

Love the way TCM is true to content and maintains the original aspect ratio; makes it better for purists. I just zoom it with some loss of detail.
I've heard that a few providers are offering an HD version of Turner although I would doubt most of the content has been remastered.


----------



## BOBCAT

Yes,
I like the fact that TCM shows their programing in its original format uncut and in its original B&W or Color. Once in a great while they will show a colorized version, but will show the original B&W also.

I'll bet that the providers that show TCM in HD are just up converting it them selves. Don't think that TCM is providing a HD feed at this time.
The only advantage of a HD feed from TCM would be to provide the correct aspect ratio on our 16X9 TV's instead of reducing the picture size by showing a 16X9 picture in the 4X3 box. But with the big screen sets, it isn't too bad to watch.


----------



## Arcady

I get TCM HD on Time Warner Cable. None or almost none of the content is actually in HD.


----------



## Admdata

BOBCAT said:


> I have considered Dish also, but they compress their signal so much. D* compression is not as bad, but could be a little less to improve picture quality.
> I forget what D* BW is, I think their HD signal is 720x1024. I know it isn't 1080x1920, would use up too much BW
> If anyone knows for sure, please post it.
> I think that the SD signal is just above the quality of VHS. Sense most everyone use to have VHS, they wouldn't complain about the SD picture. Wish it was Beta quality though.
> The trade off from analog video to digital is analog would show dropouts and noise in the video at times, but was a smooth picture. Digital shows pixelization on fast motion if the signal is compressed too much.
> With digital, they can squeeze a lot more channels of programing into the signal
> They can also manipulate the signals BW. They can add more bandwidth to one channel by taking away BW from another like AMC(Take it all!) or TCM. (Stopped watching AMC when they started putting commercials in every 8 minutes. Hey AMC, raise the rates per subscriber if you have to, and kill off the commercials! You destroyed your service!) Thank God that TCM and FMC didn't do that.


Dish's HD signal (at best is 1080i), this is coming from my sister's boyfriend, who installs custom audio/video systems in people's homes, he also has dish HD, 2 dish's on the house to receive all of dish's hd programing (so much for dish "award winning technology"), also most broadcasters only broadcast at 720p res anyhow (ex FOX) for bw issues.


----------



## lrhorer

BOBCAT said:


> TCM is standard definition, and HDnet is high definition.
> Would hope that HDnet would look better.
> For standard definition, TCM looks just fine using a HR10-250 with HDMI to the TV.


No, TCMHD is hi-def. Their video conversion often leaves much to be desired, however.


----------



## lrhorer

Arcady said:


> I get TCM HD on Time Warner Cable. None or almost none of the content is actually in HD.


Actually, it all is, but a lot of it is pillar-boxed.


----------



## Cudahy

Isn't it time to change this thread title to "June or July"?


----------



## stevel

Well, it doesn't say which year...


----------



## 230

lrhorer said:


> Actually, it all is, but a lot of it is pillar-boxed.


As it should be, if it was filmed in the old "academy" ratio.


----------



## dswallow

Admdata said:


> [...] also most broadcasters only broadcast at 720p res anyhow (ex FOX) for bw issues.


You have that backwards.  For instance...

1080i:

AMC
Animal Planet
BBC America
BET
Bravo
Cartoon Network
CBS
CBS College Sports
Chiller
Cinemax
CNN
Comedy Central
Country Music Television
CW
Discovery
E!
Encore
Epix
Fashion TV
Flix
Food Network
Fuse
G4
Golf Channel
Hallmark Channel
Hallmark Movie Channel
Havoc
HBO
HD Theater
HDNet
HGTV
HLN
HSN
Hustler
IFC
Investigation Discovery
Learning Channel
Lifetime
Lifetime Movie Network
Logo
MavTV
Mega March Madness
MGM
Movie Channel
MSNBC
MTV
NBA
NBC
NFL Network
NFL RedZone
NHL Network
Nickelodeon
Outdoor Channel
Palladia
PBS
Planet Green
QVC
Reelz
RFD
Science Channel
Shorts
Showtime
Sleuth
Smithsonian Channel
Spike
Starz
Style
SyFy
TBS
TCM
TeleFutura
Telemundo
Tennis Channel
TLC
TNT
Travel Channel
Trinity Broadcasting Network
truTV
TV One
Universal
Univision
USA
Versus
VH-1
WE
WealthTV
Weather Channel
WGN America
World Fishing Network

720p:

A&E
ABC
ABC Family
Big Ten
Biography
Crime & Investigation
Disney Channel
ESPN
ESPN 3D
ESPN2
ESPNews
ESPNU
Fox
Fox Business News
Fox News
Fuel
FX
History Channel
History International
ION
MyNetworkTV
National Geographic
National Geographic Wild
Speed


----------



## lrhorer

EJ said:


> As it should be, if it was filmed in the old "academy" ratio.


Indubitably.


----------



## Admdata

dswallow said:


> You have that backwards.  For instance...
> 
> 1080i:
> 
> AMC
> Animal Planet
> BBC America
> BET
> Bravo
> Cartoon Network
> CBS
> CBS College Sports
> Chiller
> Cinemax
> CNN
> Comedy Central
> Country Music Television
> CW
> Discovery
> E!
> Encore
> Epix
> Fashion TV
> Flix
> Food Network
> Fuse
> G4
> Golf Channel
> Hallmark Channel
> Hallmark Movie Channel
> Havoc
> HBO
> HD Theater
> HDNet
> HGTV
> HLN
> HSN
> Hustler
> IFC
> Investigation Discovery
> Learning Channel
> Lifetime
> Lifetime Movie Network
> Logo
> MavTV
> Mega March Madness
> MGM
> Movie Channel
> MSNBC
> MTV
> NBA
> NBC
> NFL Network
> NFL RedZone
> NHL Network
> Nickelodeon
> Outdoor Channel
> Palladia
> PBS
> Planet Green
> QVC
> Reelz
> RFD
> Science Channel
> Shorts
> Showtime
> Sleuth
> Smithsonian Channel
> Spike
> Starz
> Style
> SyFy
> TBS
> TCM
> TeleFutura
> Telemundo
> Tennis Channel
> TLC
> TNT
> Travel Channel
> Trinity Broadcasting Network
> truTV
> TV One
> Universal
> Univision
> USA
> Versus
> VH-1
> WE
> WealthTV
> Weather Channel
> WGN America
> World Fishing Network
> 
> 720p:
> 
> A&E
> ABC
> ABC Family
> Big Ten
> Biography
> Crime & Investigation
> Disney Channel
> ESPN
> ESPN 3D
> ESPN2
> ESPNews
> ESPNU
> Fox
> Fox Business News
> Fox News
> Fuel
> FX
> History Channel
> History International
> ION
> MyNetworkTV
> National Geographic
> National Geographic Wild
> Speed


Well that is what I was told with Dish's equipment and service, what the broadcaster sends out may be different, he said that Directv's HD is at native resultion (what that means is that Directv doesn't change the res) if the broadcaster is at 1080i, that is what is at your house into your tv, dish changes there's because of bw issues, and I trust him he does this stuff 6 days a week for about 10 years now. Hell he calls a 59" Plasma tv he has in his living room small, he is looking at a 65" plasma to replace it with!


----------



## dswallow

Admdata said:


> Well that is what I was told with Dish's equipment and service, what the broadcaster sends out may be different, he said that Directv's HD is at native resultion (what that means is that Directv doesn't change the res) if the broadcaster is at 1080i, that is what is at your house into your tv, dish changes there's because of bw issues, and I trust him he does this stuff 6 days a week for about 10 years now. Hell he calls a 59" Plasma tv he has in his living room small, he is looking at a 65" plasma to replace it with!


What you generally will find is that horizontal resolution is being changed, usually sub-sampled. Meaning that before the satellite broadcaster recompresses the video signal into the transponder combined with other video signals, it resamples the image data horizontally, reducing the number of pixels, and thus reducing the requirements overall for compression of the sub-sampled image.

They're still transmitting the same number of vertical lines, and still matching whatever rate is delivered to them (720p vs 1080i) by the content provider.


----------



## unitron

Email says tusconbill posted here about a half hour ago.

Wha happen?


----------



## BOBCAT

Anyone hear anything more on the release of the HD TiVo?


----------



## litzdog911

Supposed "this summer". 
http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=191153


----------



## CatScratchFever

I have 4 HR20's and 1 HD10-250. When I use the Tivo it's like going back in a time warp, the UI is so dated. Am I reading this correctly that the new DTivo will be based on that old UI or is there a new improved Ui being used in the new generation Tivo's?

In my case I'm pretty happy with the DirecTV DVR's and wouldn't switch even if the DTivo was free.


----------



## fasTLane

Good for you.


----------



## litzdog911

CatScratchFever said:


> I have 4 HR20's and 1 HD10-250. When I use the Tivo it's like going back in a time warp, the UI is so dated. Am I reading this correctly that the new DTivo will be based on that old UI or is there a new improved Ui being used in the new generation Tivo's?
> 
> In my case I'm pretty happy with the DirecTV DVR's and wouldn't switch even if the DTivo was free.


Supposedly it's similar to the UI in the HR10-250 Series 2 Tivos.


----------



## CatScratchFever

litzdog911 said:


> Supposedly it's similar to the UI in the HR10-250 Series 2 Tivos.


Thanks, I appreciate your response. I wish they would update their menus, possibly the're afraid they will offend the core customer base (which I used to be part of back when I used 6 Tivo's )


----------



## stevel

TiVo has a new UI which they are using in the Premiere units, though that is still a mix of HD and SD elements. TiVo has said that the new DirecTV box will not have the new UI.


----------



## kbohip

May 7th and still no Tivo Directv vaporware box. I swear Tivo is the new Duke Nukem.


----------



## litzdog911

kbohip said:


> May 7th and still no Tivo Directv vaporware box. I swear Tivo is the new Duke Nukem.


Latest buzz is "late summer". We'll see.


----------



## MacQ2

catocony said:


> I just had a brand new Panasonic 50" plasma, 1080p/600hz with RJ-45 Ethernet and wireless via USB NIC delivered this morning. I will move to HD within a few months. Right now I plan to stay with D*, but I'm not going to wait very long for the new DirecTivos.


I did the same as you but just over a year ago. At that time the D* Tivo HD box was due out "any week now". I tried the D* boxes but they were horrible - even their vaunted HR24.

I've since moved to Tivo with Comcast. The only thing I'll miss is NFL Sunday Ticket. If D*Tivo never happens, I'll drop D* when my 2-year commitment expires. It stinks having to pay for a service I don't use - the D* boxes aren't even powered on.


----------



## dswallow

Hypothetical question: So when does DirecTV start converting to MPEG5?

Probable answer: The day before the new DirecTV TiVo actually becomes available.

At this point I really wouldn't be surprised to see a Dish-branded TiVo before the DirecTV one is released.


----------



## brott

While hypothetical, there is no MPEG5 standard.


----------



## richierich

I'm betting that the New Directivo will be out by the end of July 2011!!!

Just my $.02!!!


----------



## dswallow

brott said:


> While hypothetical, there is no MPEG5 standard.


Which simply means we're in for a really long wait for this thing.


----------



## innocentfreak

Over at DBStalk a couple people are saying they have an option online now to order a DirecTiVo from Directv which will also have a $5 monthly TiVo fee.


----------



## Rainy Dave

innocentfreak said:


> Over at DBStalk a couple people are saying they have an option online now to order a DirecTiVo from Directv which will also have a $5 monthly TiVo fee.


Interesting. Can't wait to see the feature set to justify the extra $60/year.


----------



## mercurial

If it integrated with existing HR2x receivers to do Whole-Home DVR, supported remote scheduling either through TiVo.com/TiVo apps or the directv.com/DTV apps, and did non-DTV VOD (Netflix/Amazon), then I'd strongly consider it. Otherwise...?

I won't hold my breath for TTG...


----------



## seedcar

innocentfreak said:


> Over at DBStalk a couple people are saying they have an option online now to order a DirecTiVo from Directv which will also have a $5 monthly TiVo fee.


The option also appears on my account. It is listed at $99.00 with a $5.00 TIVO fee and a $6.00 lease fee and free shipping. Hope somebody orders one to check it out!


----------



## kytivo

Hello,

Long time lurker! I ordered the new TIVO online today by way of the Directv website and at the same time was speaking with a customer service rep to confirm that, indeed the Tivo Directv Hd was available and, that they could do a professional install of the same. Appointment is scheduled for Saturday AM. Final cost: $0 for the receiver and install! Very Happy


----------



## stevel

Doesn't show on my account.


----------



## jerrymc

Mine either. Do you have the model number?


----------



## Rainy Dave

kytivo said:


> Hello,
> 
> Long time lurker! I ordered the new TIVO online today by way of the Directv website and at the same time was speaking with a customer service rep to confirm that, indeed the Tivo Directv Hd was available and, that they could do a professional install of the same. Appointment is scheduled for Saturday AM. Final cost: $0 for the receiver and install! Very Happy


Pictures of the installed unit or it didn't happen.


----------



## jerrymc

However, my account does show a loyal customer discount for the DirecTV HD DVR making it $149 now. That wasn't there yesterday. Cleaning out inventory to make room for the new TiVo box? (I know, I know, I'm a cockeyed optimist...)


----------



## hefe

People at DBS Talk seem to have seen it...

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=2778260

I don't have it on my account. Maybe it's a false start.


----------



## litzdog911

Yes, looks like a false start. Perhaps they're getting the shopping cart software ready. At any rate, looks like it's finally coming soon.


----------



## kytivo

As I'm sure you are all aware, I'll see it to believe it. I asked the customer rep three times to verify the new Tivo would be on the truck at the install. I also stated I would not accept a Directv Dvr if that was all they had at the install. She stated the file was noted that only the Tivo Directv receiver would be accepted by the customer. So we will see! I will update if I receive it!


----------



## tucsonbill

So do I understand correctly that I'll have to pay an additional $5.00 TIVO fee over and above the $7.00 DVR fee that I currently pay?


----------



## innocentfreak

tucsonbill said:


> So do I understand correctly that I'll have to pay an additional $5.00 TIVO fee over and above the $7.00 DVR fee that I currently pay?


Assuming it is correct, yes. Due to the new agreement, TiVo gets more per subscriber, and as a result directv passes that onto the subscriber.


----------



## zamzickles

It's on its way. $99.00 + 20 months of $5.00 a month $100.00 is still the same as $199.00 and I'm guaranteed a new product, (not somebody else problem unit or older pathetically slow one ). And there's that painful bleeding edge factor I've been missing for the last couple years. So here I go!


----------



## appleye1

tucsonbill said:


> So do I understand correctly that I'll have to pay an additional $5.00 TIVO fee over and above the $7.00 DVR fee that I currently pay?


That doesn't bode well for the average consumer adopting the new Tivo then. They won't understand why the Tivo is worth $5 extra (assuming the features are worth $5 extra) and I doubt the CSRs are going to spend any time trying to sell them on it.


----------



## willmw

Do any of you who have ordered have an ETA? I'm within days of pulling the trigger on a DTV unit, but could hold off a bit to see how this unit pans out.


----------



## the_Skywise

Don't see it on mine or my parents' account either. (I don't even get the offer to upgrade to an HD receiver because I already have an HR-210... )


----------



## pseudoprime

This may be an odd question (so hopefully it will entertain somebody).

I have my original single LNB dish from 1998. Currently running an SD DirecTiVo. If I order the new box if/when it appears, what sort of functionality will I have without getting a new dish?

I understand that most (all?) of the HD channels are on a different bird, but will anything prevent my from using it to get SD channels like my current box?

(Explanation: we are about to move, but the SD box is in its death throes. Tried replacing capacitors, but to no avail. I don't want someone out to install a new dish -- I can live in SD for another couple of months. But I can't live with a rebooting/stuttering DVR. So I was hoping to replace the old box with a new one if it's released this summer, then take it with me to the next house, where I'd get a new dish anyway.)


----------



## unitron

pseudoprime said:


> This may be an odd question (so hopefully it will entertain somebody).
> 
> I have my original single LNB dish from 1998. Currently running an SD DirecTiVo. If I order the new box if/when it appears, what sort of functionality will I have without getting a new dish?
> 
> I understand that most (all?) of the HD channels are on a different bird, but will anything prevent my from using it to get SD channels like my current box?
> 
> (Explanation: we are about to move, but the SD box is in its death throes. Tried replacing capacitors, but to no avail. I don't want someone out to install a new dish -- I can live in SD for another couple of months. But I can't live with a rebooting/stuttering DVR. So I was hoping to replace the old box with a new one if it's released this summer, then take it with me to the next house, where I'd get a new dish anyway.)


You should probably post this as its own thread to get more eyeballs on it. There are probably a lot of people sick of this one by now who stay away from it.


----------



## BakeBarry

willmw said:


> Do any of you who have ordered have an ETA? I'm within days of pulling the trigger on a DTV unit, but could hold off a bit to see how this unit pans out.


Mine just says shipped. In the past, Directv orders (AM21 for OTA) have arrived very quickly. I am hoping the unit will arrive today, but if it doesnt have built in OTA, as some on dbstalk have surmised, then I will probably return it.


----------



## hefe

Good luck, send pics!


----------



## stevel

It almost certainly will not have OTA internal. The AM21 is for that. Relatively few DirecTV customers also use OTA.


----------



## BakeBarry

Directv just called; it was posted prematurely on the site. refund...

oh well.


----------



## litzdog911

BakeBarry said:


> Directv just called; it was posted prematurely on the site. refund...
> 
> oh well.


That's what I thought, as I posted earlier. Oh well. Should be getting close though.


----------



## kytivo

Also a no go! They sent an e-mail and a follow up call.

The e-mail:

_We attempted to contact you by phone to discuss your recent DIRECTV upgrade order, #150399107; however, we were unable to reach you directly.

We understand you recently placed an order for an HD TiVo receiver on directv.com; however, the receiver is not currently available to order. A partial file containing TiVo information was prematurely posted to our site and, since we are unable to complete the installation of an HD TiVo receiver, your order was cancelled on 05/13/11. Please note, the launch of the receiver is still in development and we will provide details as we approach our official launch date.

We apologize for any frustration this situation may have caused. If you require further assistance, please contact us at 1-866-785-5535. Our office hours are Monday through Friday, from 7:30 AM until 7:30 PM MT, or Saturday and Sunday from 7:30 AM until 6:00 PM MT._

Funny thing is that while placing the order on-line, the csr I had on the phone saw the same thing and confirmed it was available.

Oh well, shoots my weekend!


----------



## tucsonbill

innocentfreak said:


> Assuming it is correct, yes. Due to the new agreement, TiVo gets more per subscriber, and as a result directv passes that onto the subscriber.


I guess that'd kill it for me. I presume that it's a license for a single box. $5 per box and they'll probably never run the hacks I have for my current boxes.. I guess I'll keep nursing the HR10-250s I have and when they die go for D* boxes.


----------



## innocentfreak

tucsonbill said:


> I guess that'd kill it for me. I presume that it's a license for a single box. $5 per box and they'll probably never run the hacks I have for my current boxes.. I guess I'll keep nursing the HR10-250s I have and when they die go for D* boxes.


Based on how directv has done fees in the past it will probably be account based rather than per box. Of course with directv and their love of fees you never know.


----------



## magnus

$5 per account is the only way it would make any sense to me. I wonder what the feature set will be though. Will it really be worth the $5? When I had Directv, they had watered down the feature set that they would allow Tivo to provide to their customers.


----------



## Cudahy

Can we officially change this sheet to "July or August" or do we have to start a new one?


----------



## stevel

What we've been told all along is that it will be the traditional (12 year old) UI with some of the features that give you more control over what you watch, such as Swivel Search and KidZone. It is fairly well accepted that features for playing Internet content or moving recordings to other devices will be absent. So no TiVoToGo, for example. But DirecTV does have multi-room viewing in an implementation some find superior to TiVo's so that is likely to go in.

If what you like about TiVo is the user interface, then the new box will probably make you happy. If you are expecting every feature TiVo has added to its newer boxes, it probably won't.


----------



## unitron

stevel said:


> What we've been told all along is that it will be the traditional (12 year old) UI with some of the features that give you more control over what you watch, such as Swivel Search and KidZone. It is fairly well accepted that features for playing Internet content or moving recordings to other devices will be absent. So no TiVoToGo, for example. But DirecTV does have multi-room viewing in an implementation some find superior to TiVo's so that is likely to go in.
> 
> If what you like about TiVo is the user interface, then the new box will probably make you happy. If you are expecting every feature TiVo has added to its newer boxes, it probably won't.


For some reason the phrase "too little, too late" comes to mind.


----------



## litzdog911

magnus said:


> .... I wonder what the feature set will be though. Will it really be worth the $5? ....


I posted that information a few pages back in this thread.


----------



## tucsonbill

innocentfreak said:


> Based on how directv has done fees in the past it will probably be account based rather than per box. Of course with directv and their love of fees you never know.


Uh, the point was supposed to be that it was a pass through from TiVo. I know how TiVo has done their licenses in the past and it's per box. BTW can you say "mirroring fee"? That's the per box fee that D* used to do before they "leased" all the equipment.


----------



## tucsonbill

stevel said:


> It almost certainly will not have OTA internal. The AM21 is for that. Relatively few DirecTV customers also use OTA.


Only those who have seen what it looks like OTA vs. from D*. (At least in my location.)


----------



## rumpleteazer

stevel said:


> If what you like about TiVo is the user interface, then the new box will probably make you happy. If you are expecting every feature TiVo has added to its newer boxes, it probably won't.


Have they talked about what they might do as far as upgrades later? I know, I know, the box isn't out yet. But when they said things like, "It's the old TiVo interface", was it followed up with "That's the way it's going to be", or "We'll get the new interface on some time after rollout", or nothing said?


----------



## innocentfreak

tucsonbill said:


> Uh, the point was supposed to be that it was a pass through from TiVo. I know how TiVo has done their licenses in the past and it's per box. BTW can you say "mirroring fee"? That's the per box fee that D* used to do before they "leased" all the equipment.


And that is still the fee they charge now, they just waive the mirror fee while charging the lease fee. Dtv only charges one Mrv fee, one dvr fee, ect so I can't seeing them charging per TiVo but then it is directv and I can't put anything past them when it comes to inflating their prices.

All of these are reasons including the lack of TiVo are why I dropped directv as quick as I could and it was the best decision I ever made since I pay much less for much more.


----------



## stevel

rumpleteazer said:


> Have they talked about what they might do as far as upgrades later? I know, I know, the box isn't out yet. But when they said things like, "It's the old TiVo interface", was it followed up with "That's the way it's going to be", or "We'll get the new interface on some time after rollout", or nothing said?


Nothing on any of those topics.


----------



## HiDefGator

innocentfreak said:


> ...so I can't seeing them charging per TiVo but then it is directv and I can't put anything past them when it comes to inflating their prices.
> 
> All of these are reasons including the lack of TiVo are why I dropped directv as quick as I could and it was the best decision I ever made since I pay much less for much more.


I'm betting the $5 will be per Tivo. That is the additonal Tivo fee going to Tivo. Directv will be keeping the standard DVR\Box fee.

Do you think Tivo will want $5 per DVR or will they settle for $5 per account?


----------



## innocentfreak

HiDefGator said:


> I'm betting the $5 will be per Tivo. That is the additonal Tivo fee going to Tivo. Directv will be keeping the standard DVR\Box fee.
> 
> Do you think Tivo will want $5 per DVR or will they settle for $5 per account?


It is all based off whatever the contract says. Last I heard no one knew what the new rate directv agreed to. We only knew it was higher than the previous rate.

We all know directv won't eat into their own mirroring/leasing profit I mean fee so in the end directv will tack on whatever fee they want. At the same time if it discourages people from going TiVo over directv hardware even better for them.


----------



## TonyD79

stevel said:


> What we've been told all along is that it will be the traditional (12 year old) UI with some of the features that give you more control over what you watch, such as Swivel Search and KidZone. It is fairly well accepted that features for playing Internet content or moving recordings to other devices will be absent. So no TiVoToGo, for example. But DirecTV does have multi-room viewing in an implementation some find superior to TiVo's so that is likely to go in.
> 
> If what you like about TiVo is the user interface, then the new box will probably make you happy. If you are expecting every feature TiVo has added to its newer boxes, it probably won't.


Steve, I thought no MRV for the new Tivo.


----------



## litzdog911

TonyD79 said:


> Steve, I thought no MRV for the new Tivo.


That's what I've heard .... no MRV in the new HD Tivo.


----------



## tucsonbill

innocentfreak said:


> It is all based off whatever the contract says. Last I heard no one knew what the new rate directv agreed to. We only knew it was higher than the previous rate.


Got it. D* bad, TiVo good. So why are you here? You're right. We don't know, but still you opine based on history. As did I. Your opinion clearly carries more weight in your mind than mine does. Guess who I'm going with. You're the guy who told me that D*'s history is account based fees -- now the only thing you can talk about is the box based fees. What is your point?


----------



## stevel

I would be VERY surprised if the new TiVo could not participate in DirecTV's form of MRV, which streams from another box. I am sure it won't be like TiVo's version.


----------



## TonyD79

stevel said:


> I would be VERY surprised if the new TiVo could not participate in DirecTV's form of MRV, which streams from another box. I am sure it won't be like TiVo's version.


Get ready to be surprised.


----------



## Andrew_S

tucsonbill said:


> Got it. D* bad, TiVo good. So why are you here? You're right. We don't know, but still you opine based on history. As did I. Your opinion clearly carries more weight in your mind than mine does. Guess who I'm going with. You're the guy who told me that D*'s history is account based fees -- now the only thing you can talk about is the box based fees. What is your point?


Wow, someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed.


----------



## fasTLane

Andrew_S said:


> Wow, someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed.


One week ago.


----------



## tucsonbill

Andrew_S said:


> Wow, someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed.


Nope, just don't like to be trolled.


----------



## sbiller

From yesterday's post earnings conference call...

*Barton Crockett - Lazard Capital Markets LLC*

I was wondering if you could update us on the DIRECTV box rollout. Are you still expecting that this is something that will come out in the back half of this year? And in general, in terms of features, with DIRECTV and do your other deals offer support for multi-room DVRs, is that something that's not yet available for TiVo and third parties?
*
Thomas Rogers*

*Barton, in terms of DIRECTV, we're making real progress. We're getting close there. They are testing the product. We will launch relatively soon, I hope.* Part of the reason that it's taking somewhat longer is a bunch of additional feature work that we were doing there. I can't comment on specific features of DIRECTV such as multi-room.


----------



## Ted J

litzdog911 said:


> That's what I've heard .... no MRV in the new HD Tivo.


I figured they would do that so I'm glad I didn't wait now!


----------



## Ted J

stevel said:


> I would be VERY surprised if the new TiVo could not participate in DirecTV's form of MRV, which streams from another box. I am sure it won't be like TiVo's version.


I think if it uses the Tivo OS it won't stream but rather have to copy the actual recording from one box to another? But I have a feeling DirecTV will shut that feature off or if they don't allow you to copy freely (whatever it is called) then you won't be able to do MRV as well.


----------



## litzdog911

Ted J said:


> I think if it uses the Tivo OS it won't stream but rather have to copy the actual recording from one box to another? But I have a feeling DirecTV will shut that feature off or if they don't allow you to copy freely (whatever it is called) then you won't be able to do MRV as well.


Right. The HR10-250 didn't have this capability, so it's unlikely that the new HD Tivo will either. But we won't know until the thing is released.


----------



## Stoystown

I just hope this machine comes out before August, as I would like to get a new Directv Tivo before NFL season starts.

Uh, oh, wait. NFL season may not start. 

No DirecTivo HD, and no NFL? Two more in the long list of reasons why 2011 might go down as one of the more annoying years in history. Not tragic or awful, but just annoying.


----------



## joed32

It's a pretty good bet that there will be an NFL season. On your other wish, who knows?


----------



## rcamille

I need to jump ship from Cablevision this month because my promotion ends and my bill is going to go up quite a bit. I dont know what to do about DVR service from DirecTV. Do I hold out and wait to see what the DirecTiVo unit can do or do I just go with the HR24? I have been waiting for this DirecTiVo unit since i left DirecTV a number of years ago. Although I am happy with my TiVo HD that i use with Cablevision, I do feel that TiVo has fallen behind the competition. 

So, do i wait a bit longer and just pay Cablevision or do I go back to DirecTV now and get the HR24?


----------



## litzdog911

rcamille said:


> I need to jump ship from Cablevision this month because my promotion ends and my bill is going to go up quite a bit. I dont know what to do about DVR service from DirecTV. Do I hold out and wait to see what the DirecTiVo unit can do or do I just go with the HR24? I have been waiting for this DirecTiVo unit since i left DirecTV a number of years ago. Although I am happy with my TiVo HD that i use with Cablevision, I do feel that TiVo has fallen behind the competition.
> 
> So, do i wait a bit longer and just pay Cablevision or do I go back to DirecTV now and get the HR24?


I vote HR24. Who knows how much longer we'll be waiting for the HD Tivo.


----------



## rcamille

litzdog911 said:


> I vote HR24. Who knows how much longer we'll be waiting for the HD Tivo.


After doing more research, I am leaning toward the HR24 as well.


----------



## fasTLane

I am leaning away.


----------



## psywzrd

rcamille said:


> I need to jump ship from Cablevision this month because my promotion ends and my bill is going to go up quite a bit. I dont know what to do about DVR service from DirecTV. Do I hold out and wait to see what the DirecTiVo unit can do or do I just go with the HR24? I have been waiting for this DirecTiVo unit since i left DirecTV a number of years ago. Although I am happy with my TiVo HD that i use with Cablevision, I do feel that TiVo has fallen behind the competition.
> 
> So, do i wait a bit longer and just pay Cablevision or do I go back to DirecTV now and get the HR24?


You should just call Cablevision and tell them that you want to cancel - they'll make you an attractive offer to get you to stay (I literally just got off the phone with them and did the same). My promotion was about to run out (I only have internet and family cable with them since I use ooma for my phone service) and I called them and told them that I wanted to cancel my tv service with them. I really would have cancelled it if they didn't make me an offer, but I knew they would try to keep as a customer. The TV portion of my bill was going to go up $30 a month and they agreed to extend my current promotion for another 12 months so my bill will stay the same now. They tried to talk me into phone service as well (used to have phone service with them) but I'm totally happy with my ooma service and don't see any reason to pay Cablevision for something that literally doesn't cost me anything on a monthly basis right now.

I'm also a DirecTV subscriber and will seriously consider dropping Cablevision's TV service altogether when/if the HD Tivo becomes available on DirecTV. As it is, I really only keep Cablevision as a backup in case of bad weather but I do find myself watching it more since I prefer Tivo over the HD DVRs I have from DirecTV.


----------



## Stoystown

joed32 said:


> It's a pretty good bet that there will be an NFL season. On your other wish, who knows?


I am hopeful. I also noticed that the name of this thread says the Directv HD Tivo amy ship in April or May.

And... it's June. So, we wait. And wait. And some people don't wait.

I don't want them to ship a bad product, but it is frustrating.


----------



## stevel

The thread doesn't say which year. It's already two years late.


----------



## catocony

Having used HR24s for the last two months, I have to say the generally work ok. I still prefer the Tivo interface, and have had to reboot my main HR24 once because the video would not come up after turning it on until I changed the channel or rewound a few seconds on the channel it was tuned to. The video also froze when minimized when I had a menu pulled up - although the audio continued with no problems.

I still have an R15 plugged in as well and the differences in speed is massive. The HR24 is much, much better, as you would expect after 5-6 years of hardware and software improvements.

I miss the peanut remote and the overall Tivo look and feel, but the good things about the HR24 basically make up for it. If I were doing a new installation today and the HD DirecTivos were available - and presumably at the $5.00 premium (at least) per month, I'm not sure which way I would go. But I wouldn't recommend that anyone wait around any more than they have for new units.


----------



## Dante101

Back when they were new, my Mom switched to the DirecTV-branded DVRs. She had nothing but problems, mainly with the units constantly rebooting and only recording partial shows. She hated them with a passion, and I hated them, too (as she would keep calling me to gripe about it).

I sent her to Weaknees and she replaced those boxes with Tivos again. We were both very happy.

Then last Xmas she got an HDTV, so she upgraded her DTV service and the only option was to go back to the DTV-branded DVRs. We were both apprehensive, but felt it would just be temporary until the new Tivos came out.

But it seems they really have fixed most (if not all) of the bugs in the DTV-branded DVRs. My Mom is totally happy with it. It hasn't crashed once or missed recording a show since she got it in January. I now highly doubt she'll switch to Tivo if/when they come out, and I don't blame her.

She does miss the option to recover a program that was deleted, but she enjoys the stability, the on-screen Caller ID, and the DTV version of "On Demand" programming. And I'm not positive, but it seems the DTV DVR automatically pads every show, even when both tuners are being used and one tuner is recording 2 shows back to back.


----------



## fasTLane

Local cable with Tivo is a good alternative. Might have to go that route.


----------



## JimboG

fasTLane said:


> Local cable with Tivo is a good alternative. Might have to go that route.


Cable _can be_ a good alternative if your local cable system has the HD channels you want and doesn't rate-shape the signal to the point where the picture quality looks like crap.

The problem with cable is that one local system may look great and another system in another part of the country owned by the exact same company may look like utter dog crap.

Cable is hit or miss; DirecTV is pretty good looking (but pricey) everywhere.


----------



## Klankster

Well, yeah, cable MIGHT be good, depending on where you are and what your cable company does to the signal. I'm on Milwaukee's Time Warner, and the HD is CRAP. I mean really awful. Was watching a show last night in "HD" (haha) and it was beyond miserable; so much so that I immediately went to DirecTV's website on the off-chance that I had missed the email telling me that TiVo was now available for DirecTV. No such luck.

I desperately want decent HD and am willing to pay for it (maybe someone from DirecTV is reading this -- I hope so). I mean, what is the point in owning 4 HDTVs and seeing chunky compression artifacts whenever the action speeds up on the screen?

Please speed things up, DirecTV...


----------



## catocony

I bought a new TV for the first time in 9 years back in the first week of April. My intent was to just keep my DirecTivo going and wait out for the HD version to ship. After 3 days of watching baseball games and movies in SD stretch on a nice 50" 1080 plasma, I decided to get a new install from DirecTV. I was a bit late in converting over to HD TVs, but there are still lots of folks out there with traditional tube TVs. There's nothing wrong with that, since SD picture quality is perfectly good on traditional 4:3 tube TVs.

However, SD picture quality is crap on widescreen units. Prior to the mass conversion to HD signal in the last five years or so since MPEG-4 rolled out and a lot of channels became available, a lot of my friends had HDTVs and I never saw the point since the signal quality wasn't that great. The picture was bigger, but of course stretched or pillar boxed - and with pillar boxing everything on an HD set, I really didn't see the point. Now, if today you're going OTA and watching mostly local broadcast stuff, presumably with a Tivo, and watching a lot of Blu-ray DVDs and such, then watching some channels from cable or satellite SD, stretched or pillar boxed is probably doable. 

But, having a nice big TV and watching SD DirecTV just to keep DirecTivo, I don't think it's worth it. I thought I would just wait a few months, but the picture quality is worse than on a smaller tube TV. The HD signal is far, far more important than the Tivo interface.

I should post some vids of my R-15 side-by-side with the HR-24. Even though the look and feel is pretty much the same, the performance is massively better on the HR-24s. And the features are pretty good as well. 

It's a tough spot right now, since all the rumors are circulating that the HD DirecTivo is right around the corner. I love the Tivo interface as much as anyone, but if you have the big TV, I wouldn't wait around for HD DirecTivo to finally surface.


----------



## Stoystown

_It's a tough spot right now, since all the rumors are circulating that the HD DirecTivo is right around the corner. I love the Tivo interface as much as anyone, but if you have the big TV, I wouldn't wait around for HD DirecTivo to finally surface._

I completely agree. ESPN has now shifted to total "letterbox" format. I have an SD Directv dvr, since my Directv Tivo died back in March. My TV has "smart zoom" but when I put on ESPN there are now bars on the top and bottom.

I *really really really* want to wait for the Directv Tivo. It's frustrating that it has not yet been delivered.


----------



## KurtBJC

Stoystown said:


> I *really really really* want to wait for the Directv Tivo. It's frustrating that it has not yet been delivered.


Same here. I have had an HR21 for a couple of years now; I use it every day and find the interface completely annoying, not to mention insanely slow compared to my old HR10-250. If these units were not "leased" I would be fairly likely to throw it on a bonfire and do a happy dance the day the new Tivo comes out...


----------



## willmw

My wife was the strongest holdout for the new DirecTivo. I had made up my mind that I could live without the Tivo interface, but she wanted to wait. We got notification a few weeks back that our local channels were moving and that we'd need new hardware to get them. We could get all this for free (supposedly with no extended committment) so we decided to go ahead and make the move. We got an HR24 DVR to replace our aging and sometimes troublesome HR10-250. After 4 days, I think my wife is happy enough, and I know I am, that the new DirecTivo will have to be VERY impressive for us to switch back. Sad to say as we've been Tivo users since April 2000.


----------



## jimluschen

My Philips DirecTivo died somewhere in the middle of Season 2 of Breaking Bad. When that happened, I decided to cancel DirecTV service until I was able to upgrade to the HD DirecTivo, and of course I am still waiting like all of you. 

But it isn't so bad! BitTorrent got me through the rest of Breaking Bad S2 and S3, and the time I didn't waste watching TV allowed me to develop significant guitar skills. Plus, broadcast TV is HD now, and it isn't so bad. The price is certainly right.

I am actually fearing the arrival of HD DirecTivo, kind of like someone in AA who fears Happy Hour. I know I will not be able to resist.


----------



## fasTLane

Welcome to the waiting room. 

And you are so right. 

Paying 70+ bucks/month for the paltry DirecTV content we actually use here is nuts.


----------



## mcpagano

Well I was one of the last holdouts on the new Directv Tivo. I had a Directv dvr HR15 in our bedroom which we despised. So there was no way we were going to switch out our Tivo in the Family Room. 

But based on the descriptions leaking out about the Tivo and its lack of capabilities, coupled with the good reviews on the Directv HR24 dvr, we made the switch yesterday.

You know what, it isn't too bad at all. The UI of the Tivo is slightly better but the multitude of features on the HR24 more than makes up for it. The speed of the screens is excellent. Since we already were familiar with the Directv HR15, it has the made the conversion somewhat easier. Now that didn't stop me from giving back the HR15 to Directv and moving my Tivo into the bedroom.

So overall, I would say it is safe to move to the HR24 for all of you Tivo diehards.


----------



## Scooter

mcpagano said:


> So overall, I would say it is safe to move to the HR24 for all of you Tivo diehards.


I agree. I had more troubles with my beloved turtle-slow D-TiVos. The new receivers and IMO, interface, is very nice.

As I've said up-thread, it's too little, too late.


----------



## Rebate_King

Will this product ever be released?!?!?!


----------



## joed32

Soon.


----------



## fasTLane

My DirecTiVoPool money is on August 10.


----------



## stevel

It will ship before Duke Nukem Forever.... Oh, wait...


----------



## JRAllas

stevel said:


> It will ship before Duke Nukem Forever.... Oh, wait...


I was just going to say the HD DirecTivo is the Duke Nukem of DVR's, but you kind of beat me to it... I still have my SD DirecTivo and HD DirecTivo. I've increased the storage in both (original hard drives died) and new power supplies and they're still going strong. When I replace the HR10-250, perhaps I'll get an HDTV for the bedroom and move the HR10-250 there... Decisions, decisions...


----------



## unitron

JRAllas said:


> I was just going to say the HD DirecTivo is the Duke Nukem of DVR's, but you kind of beat me to it... I still have my SD DirecTivo and HD DirecTivo. I've increased the storage in both (original hard drives died) and new power supplies and they're still going strong. When I replace the HR10-250, perhaps I'll get an HDTV for the bedroom and move the HR10-250 there... Decisions, decisions...


Actually I beat both of you to it, back at the end of March.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=8456013#post8456013

but dswallow "fixed that for me" beautifully!

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=8456421#post8456421


----------



## sjberra

fasTLane said:


> My DirecTiVoPool money is on August 10.


yup august 10, 2525


----------



## unitron

sjberra said:


> yup august 10, 2525


Somewhere between 1977 and 1980, in a recording studio in Richmond, I ran into a couple of guys from Raleigh that had been in a local band called Zaeger and Evans. (one was wearing a well-worn T-shirt with the band's name on it.)

They'd never heard of Zaeger, Wall, and Evans, or that song.

I think that was the first time I really felt old.


----------



## 230

Well, everyone can sell their tivo stock, because I have done the impossible. i got my mother to switch out her 10-250 for a HR24 in her living room! SWim, whole home DVR, deca internet, ipad control, the works! 

If I could get my MOM to do it, Tivo doesn't stand a chance!


----------



## dswallow

I'm almost expecting that the new Xfinity set-top platform will be available to me before this TiVo/DirecTV box ever sees the light of day. It's even got a prettier onscreen look.


----------



## sjberra

unitron said:


> Somewhere between 1977 and 1980, in a recording studio in Richmond, I ran into a couple of guys from Raleigh that had been in a local band called Zaeger and Evans. (one was wearing a well-worn T-shirt with the band's name on it.)
> 
> They'd never heard of Zaeger, Wall, and Evans, or that song.
> 
> I think that was the first time I really felt old.


Song became a billboard top 100 in 1969, written in 64 by Rick Evans and released by Truth Records in 1968, RCA picked it up in 69. Still have a 45 of it and refuse to give it up. First time I heard the song was in Saigon in 69. Holds a special place in my memories


----------



## unitron

sjberra said:


> Song became a billboard top 100 in 1969, written in 64 by Rick Evans and released by Truth Records in 1968, RCA picked it up in 69. Still have a 45 of it and refuse to give it up. First time I heard the song was in Saigon in 69. Holds a special place in my memories


"Still in Saigon", huh?


----------



## rcamille

Well, after dropping DirecTV to go to cable many years ago (just so I could have TiVo), I am now ready to move back to DirecTV. I have been patiently waiting for the DirecTV HD TiVo, but I am tired of waiting. DirecTV is light years ahead of Cablevision in terms of technological features and I am at a point now where the TiVo interface is far less important to me. 

The DirecTV HD DVR's are well tested and seem to fairly reliable, so I suppose i will be selling my two HD TiVos with 500gb hard drives and lifetime service on Ebay. 

DirecTV comes to install on Friday (so I am sure the new HD TiVo's will be released on Saturday)........


----------



## fasTLane

My DirecTiVoPool money is on August 10.


----------



## Dante101

To me the only drawback of the DTV DVR is the limit of allowing only 50 season passes (and I don't think you can save a wishlist search).

But I like the onscreen caller ID, and the "active" button which shows you what currently-airing shows are most viewed by other DTV subscribers in your region.

I also like the ability to get DTV On Demand stuff (but to be fair this will likely be part of the new Tivo if/when it is ever born).


----------



## tbeckner

I started with DirecTV in October 1994 and added a Sony TiVo connected to a new Sony receiver in May 2000, and I added capacity to the Sony in June 2000 via a Maxtor 60GB drive. I added five Hughes DirecTV TiVos in 2003 and hacked them in 2004/2005 for MRV. 

I just bought a couple of Sony LCD HDTVs and couldn't wait for the DirecTV TiVo HD, so now I have two free DirecTV HR24 DVRs, but I would still switch out the HR24 DVRs for TiVos in a heartbeat, because the HR24 is still a fairly buggy product after all these years and the interface even with all of it's advantages is crude and has holes big enough to drive a semi through sideways. 

I made a deal with the installer to leave the old dish and multiswitch installed, so I still have three Hughes TiVos active and four networked, one via a wireless bridge that I created using DD-WRT and an old WRT54GS. I'll keep the TiVos installed and working until TiVo brings out the new DirecTV TiVo HD.

Does anyone know why the HR24 is so slow decoding the MPEG 4 stream?

BTW, the installer said that TiVo bought up all of the existing stock of R22's, which of course be used for MPEG 4 HD. 

Now the question is, why did TiVo buy the old R22 devices up? Isn't the MPEG 4 decoder even older and slower than the HR24s?


----------



## mcpagano

Does anyone know why the HR24 is so slow decoding the MPEG 4 stream?

Set your Display Options to "Native Off", that will speed it up


----------



## rolybert

fasTLane said:


> My DirecTiVoPool money is on August 10.


But what year 2011 or 2012


----------



## unitron

rolybert said:


> But what year 2011 or 2012


sjberra already answered that question.

"yup august 10, 2525"


----------



## gbshuler

I have two Sony DirecTivo's I bought in 2001 gathering dust. If anyone needs one for parts, just send me a private message. I am not looking to make any $. Just looking to make someone who loves DirecTV happy..


----------



## sjberra

unitron said:


> sjberra already answered that question.
> 
> "yup august 10, 2525"


In the year 2525, if Tivo is still alive they may find......


----------



## lpwcomp

So will TiVo be the machine that makes your legs obsolete?


----------



## unitron

lpwcomp said:


> So will TiVo be the machine that makes your legs obsolete?


Just the remote.

Of course in 2525 we won't need our eyes 'cause by then the TiVo will feed directly into our brains.


----------



## goony

I too got tired of waiting... I bought my first digital/HD TV, so I had DirecTV come out and fix me up with whole-house DVR, HR24, Hxx vanilla HD receiver, DECA, internet connected, etc. I can request recordings via my Android DirecTV app. All on new dish + wiring (I pre-ran the wiring myself).

I turned off my 3 existing DTivos (enhanced via Zipper script, secure remote TivoWeb access to all DVRs) and they are still connected to my old round single LNB dish. If I get a yen for SD DTivo again, I'll just have them re-activate one of my DTivos.

The HR24 DVR interface is just "OK" in my book; I miss Tivo quite a bit - for certain, I prefer the Tivo-style program guide. Picture feed to LG 50 inch 1080p plasma TV looks great!

I've yet to figure out how to tell the HR24 "First run only" for its SPs; maybe it cannot do that at all - the guide data probably isn't as "rich" as what the DTivos were getting.

Goony


----------



## joed32

In the guide move the cursor over to highlight the channel name and hit "info". This will give you something a little like the Tivo guide.

When you set up an Series it will always record the 1st showing, 1st run or not.

If a show is aired multiple times per week/day they all will show as 1st run so you need to go to menu-manage recordings-manual and set up a recurring manual recording for the time slot you want to record. Some channels just don't have the 1st run flags set right so you may have to do the same with those.

Good luck


----------



## rcamille

Following up on my prior post, I am now a DirecTV customer again. I am selling my two HD TiVos on ebay. I have to say that the HR24 does nearly everything the TiVo does and more. For one, it actually is available and works on DirecTV, Second, it works fairly well. The interface is not quite as elegant, but the functionality that I need is there. The only thing I will miss is the wish list, but I can live without it. After being with Cablevision for the last 5 years, I can honestly say that DirecTV is way ahead in terms of technology. I am glad to be back with DirecTV!!

TiVo and DirecTV really dropped the ball on this one. It is harder and harder to be loyal to TiVo (i have been a TiVo user from the day it was introduced for DirecTV!).

My advice is to stop waiting and get the HR24, I think you will be pleasantly surprised. I was!!!!


----------



## balboa dave

goony said:


> ...I've yet to figure out how to tell the HR24 "First run only" for its SPs; maybe it cannot do that at all - the guide data probably isn't as "rich" as what the DTivos were getting.
> 
> Goony


That's impossible, since the guide data is the same for both. But the HR series actually uses more of it. Press Info when you're looking at any program, live or in the schedule, then press More Info. You get OAD, Cast and Crew, You Might Like (Suggestions) and detailed Parental Info. Updates to the schedule come at least every night.

Also, you can set the default recording preferences. Go to Menu, Manage Recordings, Record Defaults. After setting them, just press the record button twice for any program you wish to make a series link (SP). Since the scheduling algorithms aren't as good as TiVo, even if you set First Run as the default, that episode will record even if it's a repeat. But after that, only first run will record.


----------



## LoadStar

unitron said:


> Somewhere between 1977 and 1980, in a recording studio in Richmond, I ran into a couple of guys from Raleigh that had been in a local band called Zaeger and Evans. (one was wearing a well-worn T-shirt with the band's name on it.)
> 
> They'd never heard of Zaeger, Wall, and Evans, or that song.
> 
> I think that was the first time I really felt old.


I had no idea who performed the song, but at least I heard of the song.

Thanks to my uncle's Time-Life "Sounds of the 60's" albums.

Not sure if that helps you feel any younger or not.


----------



## goony

Thanks to all that replied... just minutes ago I finally found the "quality time" to sit down with the HR24 and found out how to do "First Run Only". And, all sorts of other Tivo-like stuff.

Also, hours after I posted my previous comment I thought "Duh - there's only one guide data stream for all receivers".

After some serious familiarization... my opinion of the DirecTV DVRs has reached the point that I think I can do without the someday-it-will-get-here Tivo-based DirecTV HD DVR.

We'll see if the upgrade price will be worth it once it arrives.

Goony

*p.s.* I still have my 45 RPM copy of "In the Year 2525 (Exordium and Terminus)". It was certainly an original tune in the summer of 1969; nothing else quite like it before. It's the only group to never have a top 100 hit again on US and UK charts - truly, a "One Hit Wonder".

Lotsa great tunes out that summer!


----------



## sjberra

lpwcomp said:


> So will TiVo be the machine that makes your legs obsolete?


not going to give the most obvious answer.

Both are moot points, will be curious to see if the tivo unit finally hits the street by july of 2012


----------



## fasTLane

My DirecTiVoPool money is on August 10.


----------



## bigpuma

fasTLane said:


> My DirecTiVoPool money is on August 10.


You still haven't told us what year.


----------



## psywzrd

Do any of these DirecTV HD DVRs allow you to transfer shows between the DVR and your computer? I've also been (im)patiently waiting for the DirecTV HD Tivo to be released, but I'm really starting to lose my patience and I'm looking to add 2 more receivers to my DirecTV account to replace my 2 Series 3 tivos; however,the ability to easily transfer shows between my S3 tivos and my computer is holding me back.


----------



## litzdog911

psywzrd said:


> Do any of these DirecTV HD DVRs allow you to transfer shows between the DVR and your computer? I've also been (im)patiently waiting for the DirecTV HD Tivo to be released, but I'm really starting to lose my patience and I'm looking to add 2 more receivers to my DirecTV account to replace my 2 Series 3 tivos; however,the ability to easily transfer shows between my S3 tivos and my computer is holding me back.


"Transfer", no. But you can use the DirecTV2PC software to view DVR recordings on your networked PCs.

You might also want to search on "Nomad" at DBSTalk for more information about a forthcoming product that might provide some sort of video transfer.


----------



## formulaben

litzdog911 said:


> "Transfer", no. *But you can use the DirecTV2PC software to view DVR recordings on your networked PCs. *
> 
> You might also want to search on "Nomad" at DBSTalk for more information about a forthcoming product that might provide some sort of video transfer.


Only in realtime, or place and time shifted?


----------



## mercurial

It basically turns your PC into a Whole-Home DVR receiver so you can watch content from the playlists of any DVR in your house if they are connected to your home network (i.e. you have a DECA bridging from your LAN to the SWM).


----------



## tbeckner

mcpagano said:


> Does anyone know why the HR24 is so slow decoding the MPEG 4 stream?
> 
> Set your Display Options to "Native Off", that will speed it up


I thought that I would reply. That option is not available on my HR24. BTW, the HR24 with the current version of software is one buggy box. 0x4a8,Thu 7/7, 2:21a - and without a doubt it is a slow decoder. The features are nice, but I really miss the very useful TiVo grid, which I used since May 2000. If TiVo comes out with a box and it supports everything that this box does, runs the same speed or faster, has the same storage or more, and has the same TiVo features and interface, my HR24 are moving on.


----------



## Raketemensch

mercurial said:


> It basically turns your PC into a Whole-Home DVR receiver so you can watch content from the playlists of any DVR in your house if they are connected to your home network (i.e. you have a DECA bridging from your LAN to the SWM).


Just to clarify, this is true of Windows computers on your network. DTV ignores Macs completely. It won't work in Parallels, VirtualBox or Wine, either.


----------



## Stoystown

Dave Zatz just posted a "Tweet" that the new Direct Tivo won't be out until November at the earliest:

https://twitter.com/#!/davezatz/status/91542896653762560

http://hd.engadget.com/2011/07/14/new-directivo-launch-may-not-come-until-later-this-year/

So this kind of blows.

So here are my options:

1. Wait until November (or "Duke Nukem Day.") 
2. Upgrade to a Direct Tv HD box (I have an SD box now - directivo died). 
3. Switch to cable and get their DVR (Cox)
4. Switch to cable and get a Tivo (can I get a box and lifetime under $500)?
5. Get a Tivo, cancel Directv, and watch broadcast only (ok for now, as no football).

Since sports aren't big right now, this is the time I could go with just broadcast.

This is a pain in the patootie.


----------



## fasTLane

bigpuma said:


> You still haven't told us what year.


Year of the rabbit.


----------



## BrettStah

Stoystown said:


> Dave Zatz just posted a "Tweet" that the new Direct Tivo won't be out until November at the earliest:
> 
> https://twitter.com/#%21/davezatz/status/91542896653762560
> 
> http://hd.engadget.com/2011/07/14/new-directivo-launch-may-not-come-until-later-this-year/
> 
> So this kind of blows.
> 
> So here are my options:
> 
> 1. Wait until November (or "Duke Nukem Day.")
> 2. Upgrade to a Direct Tv HD box (I have an SD box now - directivo died).
> 3. Switch to cable and get their DVR (Cox)
> 4. Switch to cable and get a Tivo (can I get a box and lifetime under $500)?
> 5. Get a Tivo, cancel Directv, and watch broadcast only (ok for now, as no football).
> 
> Since sports aren't big right now, this is the time I could go with just broadcast.
> 
> This is a pain in the patootie.


Your mileage may vary, but the HR24s are pretty slick. Plus football starts up sooner than you think - college starts up in about 50 days, and it looks like the NFL is going to hammer out a new agreement with the players in time to maybe only miss a couple of weeks of pre-season at worst.


----------



## BGLeduc

Stoystown said:


> Dave Zatz just posted a "Tweet" that the new Direct Tivo won't be out until November at the earliest:
> 
> https://twitter.com/#!/davezatz/status/91542896653762560
> 
> http://hd.engadget.com/2011/07/14/new-directivo-launch-may-not-come-until-later-this-year/
> 
> So this kind of blows.
> 
> So here are my options:
> 
> 1. Wait until November (or "Duke Nukem Day.")
> 2. Upgrade to a Direct Tv HD box (I have an SD box now - directivo died).
> 3. Switch to cable and get their DVR (Cox)
> 4. Switch to cable and get a Tivo (can I get a box and lifetime under $500)?
> 5. Get a Tivo, cancel Directv, and watch broadcast only (ok for now, as no football).
> 
> Since sports aren't big right now, this is the time I could go with just broadcast.
> 
> This is a pain in the patootie.


There is life after Tivo. 

Like many, I started with an SA Tivo around '99 maybe (it was a LONG time ago!), and migrated to DirecTivo's when I went with D*. I even shelled out the $1K for an HDTivo. Loved it, as did the family. A couple years ago, I had one of my DirecTivo's die, and had no choice but to get a D* DVR Box. I was not really liking it, but it did work.

But by last summer, when D* killed the last of my National HD channels, I bit the bullet and retired my HDTivo to a spare room. The sent my a H21, which is not well loved, but other than a duff software update that they applied a couple weeks ago, it works, and we get more HD channels than we know what to do with. I even upgraded to an HR24 for an upstairs HDTV.

Here is something I never thought I would see. My wife loved Tivo. Of all the HT gear I have bought over the years, Tivo was the one thing that she felt she could not do without. Well, it has been almost a year without Tivo, and when I mentioned that there may eventually be a new D*Tivo, her reaction was, what for? The DVR's we have now work well, and do everything they need them to do. Maybe the UI is a tad agro and unpolished, but we got used to it very quickly.

So, there you have it. I honestly have lost track of just how long it has been since D* announced that there would be a new D*Tivo, but it has long since become a very bad joke. Whatever the reason for the delay, whomever is to blame, it no longer matters. As sad as it made me feel, Tivo for us no longer exists.

The King is dead! Long live the King!

Brian


----------



## MikeAndrews

BGLeduc said:


> ...
> 
> So, there you have it. I honestly have lost track of just how long it has been since *D* announced that there would be a new D*Tivo*, but it has long since become a very bad joke. Whatever the reason for the delay, whomever is to blame, it no longer matters. As sad as it made me feel, *Tivo for us no longer exists*.
> 
> The King is dead! Long live the King!
> 
> Brian


You guys crack me up.


----------



## joed32

When is the new HR due out, I thought it was October.


----------



## litzdog911

joed32 said:


> When is the new HR due out, I thought it was October.


Who knows. Keeps slipping. Looking doubtful for 2011.


----------



## iwantmyhdmitv

mercurial said:


> It basically turns your PC into a Whole-Home DVR receiver so you can watch content from the playlists of any DVR in your house if they are connected to your home network (i.e. you have a DECA bridging from your LAN to the SWM).


No offense Mercurial, but your picture sort of reminds me of how I felt after waiting <almost 3 years> for the "Magical HD Directv Tivo Box", originally announced 3 years ago.

I'm only on DirecTV because I have a summer residence, so I got me a bunch of Directv boxes <HR24/H24> to replace my _OBSOLETE_ HR10-250, and I never looked back.

Sure, the UI ain't quite as good as TiVo, but whatever, it's more stable and faster, even after the big giant software "upgrade" of what was it, 2007?

TiVo is now in the "IP sell-off mode". I always thought they might be complementary with Apple, but the latest news doesn't seem to indicate that (google it).


----------



## DreadPirateRob

Like others, I was a longtime DirecTivo user (first with the HDVR2, and then the R10). I finally upgraded to HD in both TV rooms late last year, and decided that I would probably never see the HD DirecTivo, so I opted for two HR24s with the whole home network.

To tell you the truth, I don't miss my Tivos one bit. The HR24s are fast, stable, and 100+ hours of HD recording capacity. I haven't missed a single recording, and I haven't had any random reboot problems, both of which happened with my Tivos every so often.


----------



## ClutchBrake

Does the HR24 have a "Suggestions" feature like TiVo?

Having children, that is my brother's most needed feature.


----------



## stevel

There is no "Suggestions" feature in the box. The DirecTV website guide, though, does have a suggestions-like feature. If you mean something that will automatically record stuff it thinks you might like but have not explicitly asked for, then no.


----------



## ClutchBrake

stevel said:


> There is no "Suggestions" feature in the box. The DirecTV website guide, though, does have a suggestions-like feature. If you mean something that will automatically record stuff it thinks you might like but have not explicitly asked for, then no.


Thanks. I have the 21 and knew it had the "if you like this" option. My brother is debating what to do and asked if the newer one had something akin to Suggestions. Now I know. Thanks.


----------



## stevel

However, the HR2x boxes do have access to a ton of "on-demand" shows that include more kiddie programs than you could stand in a lifetime, including many that are not airing currently. Show this to your brother. I overdosed on an afternoon of Rocky and Bullwinkle and Astro Boy one day.


----------



## balboa dave

stevel said:


> There is no "Suggestions" feature in the box. The DirecTV website guide, though, does have a suggestions-like feature. If you mean something that will automatically record stuff it thinks you might like but have not explicitly asked for, then no.


Sure there is. The option on the More Info page of most shows is "You Might Like", and provides live links to the suggestions. You're right in that it can't automatically record like TiVo.


ClutchBrake said:


> Thanks. I have the 21 and knew it had the "if you like this" option. My brother is debating what to do and asked if the newer one had something akin to Suggestions. Now I know. Thanks.


All of the HR series run essentially the same software, although the updates might arrive at different times. There's nothing on the 24 you don't have on the 21. It does run faster, but that's hardware.


----------



## stevel

Yes, the "you might like" feature is recent, but it isn't like TiVo's single suggestions list as you have to go look at individual shows. Also it bases the suggestions on a single show rather than accumulated likes and dislikes. I gathered that the brother wanted a bunch of shows queued up that he could pick from. For that, the VOD would be an even better approach I would think.


----------



## BrettStah

What we did was to spend a few minutes just browsing through the children's channels, setting up some season passes (or whatever they're called on the directv boxes) to keep a couple of episodes of each show that we thought the kids would like, and that we thought were appropriate. I just make sure that they are low enough in the season pass manager to never prevent the non-kid shows from recording. So we now have a bunch of kids shows always available for them to watch whenever they're allowed to watch tv. Every so often we will add/remove shows as they get older and/or new shows come out.


----------



## lpwcomp

The "you might like" feature sounds more like the "Similar Programs" feature on TiVo.


----------



## rrelph

I bought the original Philips TiVo. And later a Series 2 Humax TiVo. And a Series 3 with lifetime service. My wife loves TiVo. But we bought a home where our only choice in TV providers is AT&T U-Verse or satellite. We're on U-Verse right now (no TiVo support, of course) and will likely stay with it until we can get the HD DirecTV TiVo. There's going to be no doubt that it will be cheaper to get a DirecTV TiVo as a "new" customer than as an existing customer. DirecTV is missing at least one customer because they can't deliver.


----------



## Combat Medic

rrelph said:


> I bought the original Philips TiVo. And later a Series 2 Humax TiVo. And a Series 3 with lifetime service. My wife loves TiVo. But we bought a home where our only choice in TV providers is AT&T U-Verse or satellite. We're on U-Verse right now (no TiVo support, of course) and will likely stay with it until we can get the HD DirecTV TiVo. There's going to be no doubt that it will be cheaper to get a DirecTV TiVo as a "new" customer than as an existing customer. DirecTV is missing at least one customer because they can't deliver.


I went the other way and retired my TiVo when my cable service was unreliable. TiVo has lost a customer out of this.


----------



## Jon J

Just received an e-mail from TiVo asking me to update the information they have on me from when I was a tester. Wish I could help but I retired my last DirecTV receiver with TiVo quite some time ago.

Wonder if they are almost ready to deliver their newest generation receiver?


----------



## Matt L

Sad to say other than a handful of people on this site - I'm not one of them - no one cares when the new tivo hits.....


----------



## fasTLane

Matt L said:


> Sad to say other than a handful of people on this site - I'm not one of them - no one cares when the new tivo hits.....


LOL , If I didn't care, I sure wouldn't waste my valuable time coming here to bellyache.


----------



## ducker

I did care at one time... now - not so much.


----------



## BOBCAT

Well... D* took the NASA channel off of SD (HR10-250) and put it on HD. WTF it is still SD on my HR20 Guess they need the bandwith to put another infomercial on SD. D* just keeps sticking it to us.


----------



## fasTLane

It is like Poopert Murdoch's ghost is at Directv. These people are insane. Good thing they have the new unit coming soon.


----------



## Rainy Dave

ducker said:


> I did care at one time... now - not so much.


I'm the same. I held off upgrading to HD for a year thinking the new DirecTiVo was just around the corner. I finally gave in and upgraded using HR21s.

Now I really don't care if the new DirecTiVos evere come out.


----------



## lpwcomp

fasTLane said:


> Good thing they have the new unit coming soon.


 I bet the s/w is "95% complete".


----------



## formulaben

fasTLane said:


> It is like Poopert Murdoch's ghost is at Directv. *These people are insane.* Good thing they have the new unit coming soon.


----------



## ducker

Rainy Dave said:


> I'm the same. I held off upgrading to HD for a year thinking the new DirecTiVo was just around the corner. I finally gave in and upgraded using HR21s.
> 
> Now I really don't care if the new DirecTiVos evere come out.


they are luckier with you. I picked up a premiere and will be going Fios. I'm sure they have lost many customers for similar situations (who don't watch Sunday Ticket)


----------



## stevel

I don't watch Sunday Ticket, but DirecTV is a much better bet for me than Comcast here. I have an HR10 and an HR21, and if the HR10 dies I won't miss it.


----------



## TyroneShoes

I guess we can cross off that whole "April or May" prediction, unless you mean "April or May of 2014". At this rate the DVR+ will have its HD GUI upgrade before this vaporware Tivo ships.


----------



## Cudahy

Don't exaggerate, it stands for April or May of 2012.


----------



## lpwcomp

Cudahy said:


> Don't exaggerate, it stands for April or May of 2012.


Is that before or after the world comes to an end?


----------



## Cudahy

Depends on whether it's April or May.


----------



## TyroneShoes

Cudahy said:


> Don't exaggerate, it stands for April or May of 2012.


I'll do as I please, thank you. And the thread was started just 17 days after the end of 2010. From that frame of reference, what year did _YOU_ think we were talking about?


----------



## TonyM

Matt L said:


> Sad to say other than a handful of people on this site - I'm not one of them - no one cares when the new tivo hits.....


Sadly, yes. After _years_ of waiting around for a new Tivo I've actually come to like my 3 HR-2x receivers and can't see moving away now. My wife has all but forgotten about the Tivo "Boing" sound and the thumbs up and down buttons.

I still check in on this thread every 4-6 months to remain confident that no matter how much I think my job sucks, it could be worse.... I could be working at Tivo.


----------



## Stoystown

I'm out. I wrote an email to the customer support people at DirectTV and Tivo asking about the delay. DirectTV responded, Tivo didn't.

I now have an DirecTV HD DVR, and a new contract. It's fine. I would rather be watching an HD Tivo, but content (NFL and college football in HD) is more important than the receiver, in the end. And I got tired of waiting. 

G'bye Tivo. I really wanted to get one, but it was getting tiresome with no schedule in place. I had thought about going to cable, but the change wasn't worth it.


----------



## technojunkie

I like many of you have been waiting to replace units but I know of others who are considering adding another receiver when a TiVo version becomes aviailable. That is costing D money and probably cannot be predicted in terms in of lost revenue. Why they would not annouce a termination of the project is crazy. One has to assume it is still on until official word says otherwise.


----------



## litzdog911

technojunkie said:


> .... One has to assume it is still on until official word says otherwise.


Agreed. I'm pretty sure it's still on. Just keeps getting delayed.


----------



## mp11

litzdog911 said:


> Agreed. I'm pretty sure it's still on. Just keeps getting delayed.


Well I can't see any logical reason why this new unit should still be in "delay" mode. *NO* receiver should take this long to materialize...ever. There must be a conflict between Tivo and Directv. I mean, what else could it be? Both of these companies are familar with building HW/SW. Even having worked together in the past. Personally, I don't see it ever happening at this point.


----------



## samo

mp11 said:


> Well I can't see any logical reason why this new unit should still be in "delay" mode. *NO* receiver should take this long to materialize...ever. There must be a conflict between Tivo and Directv. I mean, what else could it be? Both of these companies are familar with building HW/SW. Even having worked together in the past. Personally, I don't see it ever happening at this point.


New DirecTivo was advertised as a premium DVR. If it doesn't do a lot of standard features of DirecTV DVRs it wouldn't sell at all. TiVo has a hard time to fix their own Premiere and it look like they lost software development capability. DirecTV will not accept half baked product like Premiere from the third party vendor. They paid for the development and expect what they paid for - the product that works. Add to it that TiVo is porting software to HR22 hardware and will have to compete for the premium designation with HR24 that is much faster.
If new DirecTiVo was released two years ago it would have a chance. Now it is a lost cause.


----------



## Matt L

A "Premium" DVR from D would have to do more than their standard unit, and to be honest, that is hard to do. A unit that is functionally the same as an HR24 plus, perhaps "TiVo Suggestions" in not going to cut it at a premium price. At this point the only market would be die hard Tivo fans and that is a very very small market, one D may not want to enter and muddy their brand image.


----------



## Wil

samo said:


> DirecTV will not accept half baked product ... a lost cause.


Samo'ld message.


----------



## darwincollins

Was finally making the move from DirectTivo to Fios. Due to negative coworker comments about the Direct TV HD DVR, I looked at the current Tivo offerings. They love the 'sports packages' so why they stayed with Direct TV. DirectTV salesmen at Best Buy first told me that the Direct TV DVRs are built by Tivo. Then, said that Direct TV was coming out with a Tivo model soon. Bought a XL anyways.
Called DirectTV to cancel. She really wanted me to stay and offered lots of discounts. Also, said that DirectTV was coming out with the Tivo model by end of year. Ok, this really sounds like FUD.
After many pitches, I still cancelled anyways. Been a DirectTivo customer since they first came out with that model. I wish I could have transfered some that to Tivo.
Tried to start a new subscriptions on tivo.com . Entered the dvr#, ccard#, etc. Click to submit order. Web server error. The page said to click retry... repeat, then, to call customer support. Ok, its after customer support hours. arg

ps. Looks like the order went thru even though the order never displayed a completion page.


----------



## djp

Matt L said:


> A "Premium" DVR from D would have to do more than their standard unit, and to be honest, that is hard to do. A unit that is functionally the same as an HR24 plus, perhaps "TiVo Suggestions" in not going to cut it at a premium price. At this point the only market would be die hard Tivo fans and that is a very very small market, one D may not want to enter and muddy their brand image.


It occurs to me that a way they could do that (and a potential partial reason for the delay) could be that the new HD DirecTivo model is a form of the new Premier Elite Quad Tuner. I shudder to think I'd have to connect 4 coaxes to my box (would SWM mean two coaxes in this case?), but 4 tuners would be nirvana!


----------



## Rainy Dave

djp said:


> It occurs to me that a way they could do that (and a potential partial reason for the delay) could be that the new HD DirecTivo model is a form of the new Premier Elite Quad Tuner. I shudder to think I'd have to connect 4 coaxes to my box (would SWM mean two coaxes in this case?), but 4 tuners would be nirvana!


The new DirecTiVo is based on the HR-22 hardware. So, I doubt it will be quad tuner.


----------



## balboa dave

djp said:


> It occurs to me that a way they could do that (and a potential partial reason for the delay) could be that the new HD DirecTivo model is a form of the new Premier Elite Quad Tuner. I shudder to think I'd have to connect 4 coaxes to my box (would SWM mean two coaxes in this case?), but 4 tuners would be nirvana!


SWM (single wire multi-switch) means one coax from the antenna to any location. It can be split at that location if there are separate boxes, but there's only one coax per box no matter how many tuners it has.


----------



## sjberra

djp said:


> It occurs to me that a way they could do that (and a potential partial reason for the delay) could be that the new HD DirecTivo model is a form of the new Premier Elite Quad Tuner. I shudder to think I'd have to connect 4 coaxes to my box (would SWM mean two coaxes in this case?), but 4 tuners would be nirvana!


slim ot none chance, the one thing that has stayed constant through this whole decade - the new unit will be built off the HR2X platform and will be a HR10-250 with MPEG4 capabilities, nothing else, no MRV, nothing


----------



## fasTLane

sjberra said:


> slim ot none chance, the one thing that has stayed constant through this whole decade - the new unit will be built off the HR2X platform and will be a HR10-250 with MPEG4 capabilities, nothing else, no MRV, nothing


Hopefully soon.


----------



## BOBCAT

Talked to a D* rep at Fry's electronics in Concord Ca yesterday, and he said that the Mpeg4 HD TiVo wouldn't be out for another 2 years as there is some other deals going on that will be combined with the DVR that hasn't been completed. He wouldn't say what they were.

D* just keeps coming up with excuses why the Mpeg4 HD TiVo hasn't been released. They just put out false hope in order to keep the "TiVo" hopefuls from leaving D* for other services. 

Any TiVo software programmer worth their pay could have ported the TiVo software over to any one of D* boxes and had it out in 6 to 12 months if D* wanted it done. It might have been just a basic box with the TiVo GUI, but it would have been well received by all of the people wanting for the box.
Then D* could have had TiVo work on the premium box with all of the features that they wanted to sell as an upgrade unit.

So D*, keep spreading false hope, Give your reps a script to say they know its being worked on, that it will be out soon or it is in "Beta Testing" to keep the false hope up. Have your agents that are on this forum post false hope to keep the subscribers from leaving for other services. You have run this campaign very well over the years, but it is now time to tell the truth, set a date of release, or admit that there will never be a Mpeg4 TiVo box as you just don't want to deal with or support another platform.

It is a crime (of false hope) against all the hopefuls here that this has been strung out for so long with no results.

IT IS TIME TO STOP B.S.ING EVERYONE AND TELL IT LIKE IT IS!

Too bad that this will never happen though, as false hope keeps everyone waiting.....


----------



## Adam1115

BOBCAT said:


> It is a crime against all the hopefuls here that this has been strung out for so long with no results.


What crime?


----------



## BOBCAT

The crime of false hope...


----------



## magnus

@BOBCAT I'm with you.... it's about time to call this vaporware. It's been almost 3 years now. News release was from 2008-09-03.

It would appear that they have no real intention on having new Tivo software on their system.

http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2008-09/new-hd-tivo-coming-to-directv/


----------



## engine12

Well, Tuesday will be the last day of my TiVo's . We had 3 DT TiVo's and a single tuner. Comcast changed their system and makes 2of the 2 tuner TiVo's single tuners. In order to record everything we want, we would need to buy 3 premier TiVo's (very costly) So we are going to Directv with 4 HR24DVR's, whole house dvr,networked, and free Sunday Ticket..... Sorry TiVo, Comcast ruined everything......


----------



## formulaben

engine12 said:


> Well, Tuesday will be the last day of my TiVo's . We had 3 DT TiVo's and a single tuner. Comcast changed their system and makes 2of the 2 tuner TiVo's single tuners. In order to record everything we want, we would need to buy 3 premier TiVo's (very costly) So we are going to Directv with 4 HR24DVR's, whole house dvr,networked, *and free Sunday Ticket*..... Sorry TiVo, Comcast ruined everything......


How did you get free Sunday Ticket? Half season, or whole?


----------



## verdugan

formulaben said:


> How did you get free Sunday Ticket? Half season, or whole?


They are giving it away to new subscribers. Stop fast forwarding through their commercials


----------



## formulaben

verdugan said:


> They are giving it away to new subscribers. * Stop fast forwarding through their commercials*


Touché.


----------



## magnus

Yep, looks like Deon is hocking Sunday Ticket for them. It's free to new customers that commit to 2 years of service.


----------



## Adam1115

BOBCAT said:


> The crime of false hope...


That's a crime?


----------



## Trotski

engine12 said:


> Well, Tuesday will be the last day of my TiVo's . We had 3 DT TiVo's and a single tuner. Comcast changed their system and makes 2of the 2 tuner TiVo's single tuners. In order to record everything we want, we would need to buy 3 premier TiVo's (very costly) So we are going to Directv with 4 HR24DVR's, whole house dvr,networked, and free Sunday Ticket..... Sorry TiVo, Comcast ruined everything......


I got my first TiVo w/ Lifetime subscription back in 1999. I have purchased 5 more since then -- I'm currently using 4 of them still.

But no more! I too have given up hope on the DirecTV/TiVo combo and have gone over to the DTV whole home solution. September 9th is my last day my TiVos will be plugged in.

Its sad. TiVo was so ahead of its time when it came out over a decade ago that it took a decade for the others to catch up. But, alas, not only have others caught up, they have surpassed TiVo in a lot of ways (except for winning lawsuits -- which seems to be the TiVo business model these days).

Its just too easy to recreate everything I used TiVo for in HD by using the DTV HD box and an input switch over to my Boxee Box.


----------



## seadub

Rejoice - delivery of the new TiVo to DTV's distributors will be on 9/25/2011. 

The new 6-tuner DTV HR34 will be available on 10/24/2011.


----------



## litzdog911

seadub said:


> Rejoice - delivery of the new TiVo to DTV's distributors will be on 9/25/2011.
> 
> The new 6-tuner DTV HR34 will be available on 10/24/2011.


And you base this prediction off of what source???


----------



## Hew

Tom Rogers, Tivo's CEO just said in the CC that the Directv Tivo box is being manufactured, and DirecTV will announce when it will ship at a later date...


----------



## innocentfreak

It was also featured in their August training video for installers so it makes sense a release is soon. 

I can't remember if they have announced anything in the past, but I would guess we will hear at CEDIA which is very soon.


----------



## davezatz

innocentfreak said:


> It was also featured in their August training video for installers so it makes sense a release is soon.


Engadget uploaded the training video, which I've embedded here:
http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2011-08/new-directv-tivo-launches-next-month/

Update, Engadget got their post up. Assume the delay was related to this Steve Jobs thing. 
http://www.engadget.com/2011/08/24/tivo-talks-cable-satellite-directivo-exposed/


----------



## dirk1843

We shall see. Yes, we shall see.


----------



## hefe

No multi room viewing.


----------



## Idearat

I've gone from 3 DirecTiVos to 1 that I've had to replace the hard drive on. Been holding on to that one waiting for the new HD units to come out.

I pretty much decided that I wasn't necessarily going to get it, but I wanted it to come out so I could make the decision. I didn't want to switch to a DirecTV DVR or to Cable with a TiVO and have this one come out a month after.

So while I'd like it if it's something I want to get, but I'll be more happy that with it out I'll be getting HD and moving off my 9 year old DirecTiVo to one that's not at likely to die for good in the middle of a show.


----------



## GusMan

hefe said:


> No multi room viewing.


And to me, no MRV would be a problem.
Im not expecting MRV between non-similar Tivo's, but I would be willing to buy two new ones in order to get it - if that would be an option in the future.


----------



## mercurial

No MRV == DOA.


----------



## hefe

It just seems from that video that there's nothing compelling about the device. I don't know why it's taking so long to basically reproduce what they had 6 years ago...


----------



## EmilyEmily

Though it doesn't seem massively different from the older ones (HD being the huge exception), that's good enough for me. The only thing it appears to lack is multi-room viewing, and for all the people like me who have a single TV, that's no obstacle.


----------



## hefe

EmilyEmily said:


> Though it doesn't seem massively different from the older ones (HD being the huge exception)...


That's not even an exception. I have an HD DirecTivo from 2004. The only thing new, I imagine, is that it will decode MPEG-4. Mine is MPEG-2 only. So there's a lot of cable channels that I only get in SD. But I watch more OTA network TV than I do DirecTv anymore anyway. I'll wait to see the official specs, but at this point, I'm seriously on the brink of cutting the cable/satellite cord completely.


----------



## CuriousMark

hefe said:


> That's not even an exception. I have an HD DirecTivo from 2004. The only thing new, I imagine, is that it will decode MPEG-4. Mine is MPEG-2 only. So there's a lot of cable channels that I only get in SD. But I watch more OTA network TV than I do DirecTv anymore anyway. I'll wait to see the official specs, but at this point, I'm seriously on the brink of cutting the cable/satellite cord completely.


The colored buttons on the remote indicate it will now support the active channel features that the older box did not. They haven't said what would or would not be included there, but the multiple news and sports channels might be part of it. The yellow button local weather and the right arrow features may be others. While most consumers don't tend to care much about those features, DirecTV seems to.


----------



## fasTLane

hefe said:


> That's not even an exception. I have an HD DirecTivo from 2004. The only thing new, I imagine, is that it will decode MPEG-4. Mine is MPEG-2 only. So there's a lot of cable channels that I only get in SD. But I watch more OTA network TV than I do DirecTv anymore anyway. I'll wait to see the official specs, but at this point, I'm seriously on the brink of cutting the cable/satellite cord completely.


My experience as well. OTA has been surprisingly useful in the interim. Satellite is not as compelling, thanks to the fiasco we have experienced with Direct.


----------



## hefe

CuriousMark said:


> The colored buttons on the remote indicate it will now support the active channel features that the older box did not. They haven't said what would or would not be included there, but the multiple news and sports channels might be part of it. The yellow button local weather and the right arrow features may be others. While most consumers don't tend to care much about those features, DirecTV seems to.


Yes, well that's exactly the type of details that I'm waiting on to hear. A few little features may be nice, but may not be enough to keep me.


----------



## Phillip Chapman

By the looks of the video, some of the new features now supported for a DirecTivo include:

DirecTV Video on Demand
Streaming Music and Photos
HDMI Output
External hard drive support
Free space indicator on Now Playing list
Official wireless or wired network support (Two[!] Ethernet jacks)

It will be interesting to see if the "Find Programs" section includes other downloadable content (Amazon, YouTube, etc.). Tivo Desktop support seems likely with "music and photos" being added. The real question is... Can programs be downloaded either officially (with Tivo Desktop) or through a... *ahem* modification? It will be interesting to see if programs can be scheduled on-line with a DirecTivo now too.

As long as the speed is decent and the price is reasonable, it sounds very promising.


----------



## hefe

I don't really care about VOD, and mine already has HDMI.

Streaming capabilities will be a bigger deal, though. Although what I'd want to stream is my own movies off my LAN. I already have a BluRay player that does music and photo streaming and I never use it. Online capabilities are important too. We'll see...


----------



## formulaben

Phillip Chapman said:


> By the looks of the video, some of the new features now supported for a DirecTivo include:
> 
> DirecTV Video on Demand
> Streaming Music and Photos
> HDMI Output
> External hard drive support
> Free space indicator on Now Playing list
> Official wireless or wired network support (Two[!] Ethernet jacks)
> 
> It will be interesting to see if the "Find Programs" section includes other downloadable content (Amazon, YouTube, etc.). Tivo Desktop support seems likely with "music and photos" being added. The real question is... Can programs be downloaded either officially (with Tivo Desktop) or through a... *ahem* modification? It will be interesting to see if programs can be scheduled on-line with a DirecTivo now too.
> 
> As long as the speed is decent *and the price is reasonable*, it sounds very promising.


I still can't get around having to pay for a unit, only to have to give it back to DirecTV because I don't own it, unless I pay an addition fee.


----------



## CuriousMark

From the video:

Sports mix -- Check
DirecTV on Demand -- Check
Music, Photos & Showcases -- Check
(I assume this will use TiVo Desktop or other HMO server and not DLNA)
TiVo Suggestions -- Check
SWM Compatible -- Check
SATA for external Hard drive expansion -- Check
(Probably like the HD limited only to approved model drive)
Requires a DECA to use SWM for networking
Supports wireless Cinema Connection Kit -- Check
(any client side wireless bridge would probably be fine)

That is all I was able to pick out of the video.


----------



## EmilyEmily

Hefe, the old HD DirecTiVo is incompatible with high-def channels that DirecTV currently airs. So this new DirecTiVo will allow people to both receive digital DirecTV channels and have the TiVo interface and experience (which I think is superior; the non-TiVo DVRs I've tried had terrible search functionality and couldn't find programs that I knew were airing)

Video-on-demand will be a nice addition. I'll definitely make use of that.

I won't be suffering from the lack of HD menus. Am I watching TV for the menus? My goal is to clear them off the screen quickly so I can watch programming.


----------



## KurtBJC

Hmmm....there was one extremely disturbing image in that video, and it was that awful DirecTV-style grid guide. I really hope that they've preserved the Tivo-style guide as an option....


----------



## zamzickles

The only reason I would have purchased the unit was for the guide. I even pulled the trigger on the false release several months ago. Boy am I glad it was only a [email protected]#$&*?. Now, having seen the video, I'll take a pass thank you. Now waiting for HR-3x


----------



## lpwcomp

zamzickles said:


> The only reason I would have purchased the unit was for the guide. I even pulled the trigger on the false release several months ago. Boy am I glad it was only a [email protected]#$&*?. Now, having seen the video, I'll take a pass thank you. Now waiting for HR-3x


Why are you assuming that the TiVo-style guide isn't an option?


----------



## rumpleteazer

No MRV is a killer for me. I have 3 SD DirecTivos and I record different things on each one. I don't want to have to record all of my shows on all of my DVR's. Even if it were to have 4 tuners, it's a waste of hard drive space.

After all this time, I think it's goodbye Tivo. I'd stay on SD but this stuttering on local channels is driving the wife crazy.


----------



## zamzickles

lpwcomp said:


> Why are you assuming that the TiVo-style guide isn't an option?


I'm not assuming, the Directv installers video clearly shows the crappy cable style guide used by all the rest of D's units.

http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2008-09/new-hd-tivo-coming-to-directv/


----------



## lpwcomp

Which doesn't mean that the TiVo-stye guide isn't available.


----------



## hefe

EmilyEmily said:


> Hefe, the old HD DirecTiVo is incompatible with high-def channels that DirecTV currently airs. So this new DirecTiVo will allow people to both receive digital DirecTV channels and have the TiVo interface and experience (which I think is superior; the non-TiVo DVRs I've tried had terrible search functionality and couldn't find programs that I knew were airing)
> 
> Video-on-demand will be a nice addition. I'll definitely make use of that.
> 
> I won't be suffering from the lack of HD menus. Am I watching TV for the menus? My goal is to clear them off the screen quickly so I can watch programming.


For me, the problem is that having HD USA channel or TNT is no selling point. I watch most of my programming from OTA sources. My daughter watches Nickelodeon or Cartoon Network, we barely watch other cable channels, but we do watch sometimes. Maybe it's inertia keeping me with DTv, but without some cool features, I'm not seeing the value anymore. I've just been holding out long enough to see what they're offering.


----------



## goony

I gave up waiting a few months ago and went with an HR24 DVR to go with my first-ever HDTV + vanilla HD rcvr + "whole home" to get MRV.

Like others here, I had multiple SD DTivos (hacked to enable MRV and other goodies) and now that the HD DTivo is here I'm just yawning.

I still think any Tivo DVR is a premium unit, but I don't feel excited about it at all without MRV.

Goony


----------



## BOBCAT

I would think that if they went to all of the trouble to port the TiVo GUI over to the D* box, that it would have the TiVo style guide, as that is one of the main features of the TiVo GUI. 
What is the point in having the TiVo GUI without the TiVo guide?
I would think that we should be able to select ether the grid or TiVo style guide just like the HR10-250.
If not, then D* just wasted their time and $$ in having the TiVo GUI ported over to their box, and there wouldn't be any point in going for it.
It is bad enough that they ported it over to the outdated HR22 when they should have ported it over to the HR24 box.


----------



## djp

Folks, that's the TiVo "Grid Style Guide", which is available on any TiVo (bring up the guide and and press Enter to change the format), not the guide from the HR series DVRs (though obviously, the format is the same). I can't imagine why TiVo continues to offer this style guide, but it is the factory default out of the box. It would be inconceivable--even for TiVo and DirecTV--to not offer the TiVo Live Guide format on the new box.


----------



## Mfusick

So what is the bottom line on DirectTV HD tivo ?


----------



## stevel

I think you'll need to wait until the "First Look" at DBStalk or they show up in the public's hands. What we see in the training video is a TiVo Series 2 functionality, minus MRV and almost certainly minus TiVoToGo, based on the HR22 hardware.


----------



## dcstager

Would there be any point in calling DirecTV now and trying to order it for future installation? I'm ready to dump the Cable/Tuning Adapter kludge setup I have now and move my Series 3 into a spare bedroom with over-the-air only. And can someone explain the "Swim" internet setup the guy mentions in the video?


----------



## litzdog911

dcstager said:


> Would there be any point in calling DirecTV now and trying to order it for future installation? I'm ready to dump the Cable/Tuning Adapter kludge setup I have now and move my Series 3 into a spare bedroom with over-the-air only. And can someone explain the "Swim" internet setup the guy mentions in the video?


No, not until it's actually available.

SWM = Single Wire Multiswitch. The SWM technology also enables networking HD DVRs and Receivers using the satellite coax cables with DirecTV's DECA network adapters. But the new HD Tivo won't be compatible with Whole Home DVR sharing, so it's not clear if there's any benefit to using the DirecTV Cinema Connection Kit for internet access vs. just connecting the Tivo to your network directly.


----------



## jg167

Holy cow. If after all this time, they really are coming out with a unit as described (lame old HW, no HD menus (i.e. no use of new screen real estate so no improved UI to make use of it), no mutli-room, no ...), its just so pathetic as to be hard to believe. I mean I tell people what makes Dilbert funny is that it isn't really that far from the truth, but this is soooo pointy haired that I am going to have to wait for a real unit to come out to see. I don't like the DTV or U-versse UI, but no way am I going to be part of the "these sheep love us so much we can let them wait for years and then give them this turd and they'll thanks us for it" mentality, IF that is what this is. 

The training video could be a lot of stuff (new hw in old box, new sw on old hw that does not fully run it, etc). I am really hoping for far more functionality with a fully up to date hw/sw setup. But we'll have to wait a bit longer to see.


----------



## Matt L

Unless some magic happened, they are using an old platform, so expecting some cool new stuff is pretty much a dream. At this point I'm wondering why they bothered, and they may be wondering the same thing too.


----------



## The Spud

formulaben said:


> How did you get free Sunday Ticket? Half season, or whole?


Not meaning to threadjack, but it's pretty easy for existing customers to get Sunday Ticket for free, too.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?p=2826096#post2826096


----------



## BOBCAT

If this new TiVo box is as bad as everyone seems to think it is, not having put all of the latest features built into it, designed it to the level of what was current back in 2008 then TiVo should be embarrassed to have their name put on it.
Guess we will just have to wait and see what it really is like when it comes out.
I think that they didn't want to port the GUI to the HR24 in order to keep all of the premium features under the D* brand.
So D* is just tossing an old bone to the TiVo customers that they dug up from years ago.... Too bad.


----------



## lpwcomp

It seems to me that there is a high probability that the agreement between DirecTV and TiVo allowed D* to dictate the h/w platform. If that is indeed the case, one wonders how much TiVo's lead counsel had to do with that aspect of it. You know, the guy who recently stated that TiVo is, or at least wants to be, a purely s/w company.


----------



## HiDefGator

lpwcomp said:


> It seems to me that there is a high probability that the agreement between DirecTV and TiVo allowed D* to dictate the h/w platform.


I believe Tivo picked the box that was easiest to port their old software too. Neither wanted to waste money on a whole new hardware design.


----------



## litzdog911

HiDefGator said:


> I believe Tivo picked the box that was easiest to port their old software too. Neither wanted to waste money on a whole new hardware design.


.... and the HR22 WAS the latest design when this project started three years ago.


----------



## RMBittner

I know I'll sound wildly out of touch, but I absolutely love my Series3 HD TiVo. That box does everything I need a TiVo unit to do -- and it's done it absolutely flawlessly for something like four years now. If the DTV box is based on that, that's fine with me: I'm in. I don't care about MRV or listening to Pandora on my TV. I just want DirectTV's plethora of HD channels and digital-quality SD channels, with a TiVo UI (including Suggestions) and the fantastic peanut remote. 

Bob


----------



## RMBittner

BTW, when I tweeted yesterday about my desire for DirecTV to hurry up already and release the DirecTivo HD unit, I got a reply from someone who said "it's supposed to be released next month," meaning September 2011.

I'm hopeful, but I'm not believing it until it's officially announced. Google the topic, and you can find "it's coming out soon" posts stretching all the way back to 2009, if not earlier.

But I _want_ to believe it...


----------



## nellee

If the new DirecTivo units are supposedly coming out in the next month or two, I'd assume retailers like Best Buy would already be planning for this, and have it in their inventory system for at least a placeholder sku of sorts with a TBD price listed? 

I need to replace an HD DVR that died recently, and would like to consider the HR24 or the new Tivo unit.


----------



## HiDefGator

nellee said:


> If the new DirecTivo units are supposedly coming out in the next month or two, I'd assume retailers like Best Buy would already be planning for this, and have it in their inventory system for at least a placeholder sku of sorts with a TBD price listed?
> 
> I need to replace an HD DVR that died recently, and would like to consider the HR24 or the new Tivo unit.


solidsignal website already has placeholder for it. I suspect it will be lease only like all the other Directv units. $200 is the lease price for the non-Tivo units. Although in the past they have frequently negotiated that down some.


----------



## Matt L

All I'll say is that Directv is working on the last remaining difference between their units and Tivo.


----------



## mercurial

Netflix support?

Amazon VOD?

Proper ARWLs?

Suggestions?


----------



## unitron

Matt L said:


> All I'll say is that Directv is working on the last remaining difference between their units and Tivo.


Does that mean making their units better or their TiVo units worse?

Or are they just going to raise the price of the less expensive one?


----------



## stevel

I think I know what Matt is referring to. It's a TiVo feature some people like and others (including me) disable. I don't see DirecTV adopting the TiVo UI, which seems to be what most people (including my wife) refer to when they say they prefer TiVo. Outside of that, there is very little TiVo offers that DirecTV doesn't already have.


----------



## unitron

stevel said:


> I think I know what Matt is referring to. It's a TiVo feature some people like and others (including me) disable. ...


Well, don't keep us in suspenders!


----------



## hotspace

> Well, don't keep us in suspenders!


He's probably referring to the HD menu's/Live PIG.


----------



## stevel

No - but I'm not supposed to talk about DirecTV beta features outside the "CE" forum section at dbstalk.com. Anyone can join that section as long as you agree to the rules, so go look for yourself.


----------



## bigpuma

stevel said:


> No - but I'm not supposed to talk about DirecTV beta features outside the "CE" forum section at dbstalk.com. Anyone can join that section as long as you agree to the rules, so go look for yourself.


I used to do all the beta tests in the CE forum going back to when networking and MRV was first introduced, but since they went national with their version of MRV I haven't really paid attention to that forum. Now I am curious what new features may be coming.


----------



## EmilyEmily

Could you tell me the exact forum name and relevant thread on dbstalk? I've searched but can't figure out which one is meant... not a regular there, just a browser. Thanks!


----------



## stevel

http://www.dbstalk.com/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=-1&f=171


----------



## cantil

i tried to go to the link it wont let me in i did log in but says i still can view


----------



## stevel

You can't view the "Cutting Edge Information" section? You'll need to "Opt In" to the program in order to read the other CE sections, as explained here. This doesn't obligate you to actually participate in the beta tests.


----------



## cantil

this link is also blocked for general people also when to the ce on forums as well read all the diffrent areas but the opt-in tab cant view it becasue 
You are not logged in or you do not have permission to access this page. This could be due to one of several reasons:


You are not logged in. Fill in the form at the bottom of this page and try again. 
You may not have sufficient privileges to access this page. Are you trying to edit someone else's post, access administrative features or some other privileged system? 
If you are trying to post, the administrator may have disabled your account, or it may be awaiting activation.


----------



## wedgecon

cantil said:


> this link is also blocked for general people also when to the ce on forums as well read all the diffrent areas but the opt-in tab cant view it becasue
> You are not logged in or you do not have permission to access this page. This could be due to one of several reasons:
> 
> You are not logged in. Fill in the form at the bottom of this page and try again.
> You may not have sufficient privileges to access this page. Are you trying to edit someone else's post, access administrative features or some other privileged system?
> If you are trying to post, the administrator may have disabled your account, or it may be awaiting activation.


I think first you have to create an account on dbstalk.com


----------



## stevel

Right - you have to have an account and be logged in. You had said earlier that you did log in.


----------



## Rebate_King

stevel said:


> I think I know what Matt is referring to. It's a TiVo feature some people like and others (including me) disable. I don't see DirecTV adopting the TiVo UI, which seems to be what most people (including my wife) refer to when they say they prefer TiVo. Outside of that, there is very little TiVo offers that DirecTV doesn't already have.


Based on your description it sounds like TiVo suggestions.


----------



## litzdog911

mercurial said:


> Netflix support? _*Doubtful*_
> 
> Amazon VOD? _*Doubtful*_
> 
> Proper ARWLs? _*Just like HR10-250*_
> 
> Suggestions? _*Just like HR10-250*_


Pretty much same features as HR10-250.


----------



## sjberra

nellee said:


> If the new DirecTivo units are supposedly coming out in the next month or two, I'd assume retailers like Best Buy would already be planning for this, and have it in their inventory system for at least a placeholder sku of sorts with a TBD price listed?
> 
> I need to replace an HD DVR that died recently, and would like to consider the HR24 or the new Tivo unit.


Best Buy does not carry any Directv reciever anymore, been like that for about a year now. You sign up and they hand it off to Directv to handle everything


----------



## sjberra

litzdog911 said:


> Pretty much same features as HR10-250.


think you are being optimistic about Amazon and Netflix, would lean more to "no way" rather then doubtful


----------



## mercurial

litzdog911 said:


> Pretty much same features as HR10-250.


I was pointing out that there was more than a "remaining difference" (singular) between the a TiVo and an HR24. And that some of those differences aren't likely to be addressed.


----------



## litzdog911

mercurial said:


> I was pointing out that there was more than a "remaining difference" (singular) between the a TiVo and an HR24. And that some of those differences aren't likely to be addressed.


Ohhhh. OK. Got it.


----------



## mercurial

That said, aside from missing Netflix/Amazon/Hulu(?) and, more rarely, ARWLs/suggestions, the HR24 is as good or better for us (especially with multiple rooms). I do wish the 50 "season pass" limit wasn't there and that it was a little easier to see conflicts but that's it.

Now if a TiVo came out with all of the above (including streaming) and could do DTV-style MRV, I'd sit up and listen.


----------



## RMBittner

Rebate_King said:


> Based on your description it sounds like TiVo suggestions.


TiVo's Suggestions feature -- along with the fantastic remote and how TiVo resumes play after FF-ing -- is one of the things we absolutely love about TiVo over all other DVRs. We've discovered a lot of shows via Suggestions that we'd have never found otherwise. And they're just fun to browse when you've watched all the regular "Now Playing" stuff and don't want to resort to live TV.

For me, TiVo _without_ Suggestions is just a dumb DVR.

Bob


----------



## unitron

RMBittner said:


> TiVo's Suggestions feature -- along with the fantastic remote and how TiVo resumes play after FF-ing -- is one of the things we absolutely love about TiVo over all other DVRs. We've discovered a lot of shows via Suggestions that we'd have never found otherwise. And they're just fun to browse when you've watched all the regular "Now Playing" stuff and don't want to resort to live TV.
> 
> For me, TiVo _without_ Suggestions is just a dumb DVR.
> 
> Bob


I just wish they'd present Suggestions as a separate page that I don't have to drill down for for me to review instead of making the only choice either record them or disable suggestions.


----------



## fasTLane

RMBittner said:


> TiVo's Suggestions feature -- along with the fantastic remote and how TiVo resumes play after FF-ing -- is one of the things we absolutely love about TiVo over all other DVRs.


Same here. The slick FF operation had me at wtf.


----------



## stevel

FF on the DirecTV DVRs works the same as it does on TiVos.


----------



## CuriousMark

stevel said:


> FF on the DirecTV DVRs works the same as it does on TiVos.


only when you are directly on the DVR. If you use whole home to access from a receiver or other DVR, the trick play performance is not so great. It is not bad enough to forgo whole home, but it is not in the same league as it is directly on the DVR, be it an HR or a TiVo.


----------



## stevel

That's the difference between copying and streaming. Since TiVo doesn't do streaming, it's sort of moot. (And the new HD DTiVo won't do any form of MRV.)


----------



## Dan203

stevel said:


> Since TiVo doesn't do streaming, it's sort of moot. (And the new HD DTiVo won't do any form of MRV.)


TiVo is actually working on streaming right now. The last version of the Premiere software actually had it live, but it had some issues and TiVo released a small patch to turn it off. But they say it's coming back soon.

Dan


----------



## dirk1843

unitron said:


> I just wish they'd present Suggestions as a separate page that I don't have to drill down for for me to review instead of making the only choice either record them or disable suggestions.


Have you tried to enable "folders"?

This puts all the suggestions in one place, no longer cluttering you "now playing".


----------



## litzdog911

Dan203 said:


> TiVo is actually working on streaming right now. The last version of the Premiere software actually had it live, but it had some issues and TiVo released a small patch to turn it off. But they say it's coming back soon.
> 
> Dan


I wonder if we'll ever see this on the new DirecTV/Tivo though.


----------



## gregftlaud

Is the new directv tivo going to have whole home dvr via home networking/ethernet on it? I'd guess they'd have to b/c a ton of people sub to whole home dvr and if the two receivers/services (directv/tivo) arent compatible i wouldnt think directv would have signed a new contract to do a new dvr with tivo on it. I sure hope so b/c i'm gonna go right back to tivo if it will support whole home dvr b/c i freaking hate the sluggishness of directv dvr's!


----------



## drmanny3

Looks like it will finally be available in Oct as previously suggested.
Manny


----------



## drmanny3

Anyone have an idea of how much the new Tivo unit will cost?
Manny


----------



## lpwcomp

Does a DirecTiVo allow you to pause both live buffers and even watch a piece of a recording and return to live TV and they're still paused? This is one of the features I love on an SA TiVo. Particularly useful during the NFL season.


----------



## stevel

The DirecTV DVRs have two 90 minute buffers you can pause.


----------



## litzdog911

gregftlaud said:


> Is the new directv tivo going to have whole home dvr via home networking/ethernet on it? I'd guess they'd have to b/c a ton of people sub to whole home dvr and if the two receivers/services (directv/tivo) arent compatible i wouldnt think directv would have signed a new contract to do a new dvr with tivo on it. I sure hope so b/c i'm gonna go right back to tivo if it will support whole home dvr b/c i freaking hate the sluggishness of directv dvr's!


Pretty sure the answer is "no". We'll know for sure when it's officially launched.


----------



## litzdog911

drmanny3 said:


> Anyone have an idea of how much the new Tivo unit will cost?
> Manny


No word yet on pricing, either up-front or monthly. Expectations are that it will be more than the current DirecTV HD DVRs though.


----------



## tbeckner

litzdog911 said:


> Pretty sure the answer is "no". We'll know for sure when it's officially launched.


 In the DirecTV training video, they say that Whole Home DVR (MRV) will NOT be available, which for me kills the deal. I have had MRV since it was available on the old DirecTiVo's.

What is worst is that I quit waiting for the HD DirecTiVo at the end of June and now I have these VERY BUGGY DirecTV HR24 DVR's and their clumsy guide and search capability that sucks.

Personally I would love to get rid of the HR24's, but having been use to MRV, it would be a pain to give that up, as much as I like TiVo (or can I say love the capability of the TiVo, and the less buggy interface).

Oh, how I hate the bugs. (must be the 39 years in IT and being a production software developer and now a System/Network Administrator).

Oh TiVo, why no MRV?


----------



## stryton

litzdog911 said:


> No word yet on pricing, either up-front or monthly. Expectations are that it will be more than the current DirecTV HD DVRs though.


Do you know if this will be a standard lease receiver (example $199) plus monthly charge? Will there be any option at all to purchase and own these new units even if that means you have to pay a higher price?


----------



## BrettStah

tbeckner said:


> In the DirecTV training video, they say that Whole Home DVR (MRV) will NOT be available, which for me kills the deal. I have had MRV since it was available on the old DirecTiVo's.
> 
> What is worst is that I quit waiting for the HD DirecTiVo at the end of June and now I have these VERY BUGGY DirecTV HR24 DVR's and their clumsy guide and search capability that sucks.
> 
> Personally I would love to get rid of the HR24's, but having been use to MRV, it would be a pain to give that up, as much as I like TiVo (or can I say love the capability of the TiVo, and the less buggy interface).
> 
> Oh, how I hate the bugs. (must be the 39 years in IT and being a production software developer and now a System/Network Administrator).
> 
> Oh TiVo, why no MRV?


You must not be reading about the current standalone Tivos - they don't give me a lot of confidence that they can produce a stable DirecTivo, but then again, maybe the long delay is due to DirecTV forcing them to eliminate bugs before they release it.


----------



## Matt L

I'm puzzled. I've got the gamut of HR2x units and none are slow. Some I've dropped 1T hard drives in and they are still not slow. Yet I keep reading that comment over and over "I hate the HR2x it is so slow". I guess we live in two different worlds, my D DVRs are just as fast, perhaps faster than my old HR10-250. One thing for sure is they do not slow down with a full hd as the old TiVo's did.


----------



## litzdog911

stryton said:


> Do you know if this will be a standard lease receiver (example $199) plus monthly charge? Will there be any option at all to purchase and own these new units even if that means you have to pay a higher price?


Don't know yet.


----------



## sjberra

Dan203 said:


> TiVo is actually working on streaming right now. The last version of the Premiere software actually had it live, but it had some issues and TiVo released a small patch to turn it off. But they say it's coming back soon.
> 
> Dan


Tivo may do that, but the new directtive will not, this is a stated fact. So the original statement is 100 percent correct


----------



## sjberra

tbeckner said:


> In the DirecTV training video, they say that Whole Home DVR (MRV) will NOT be available, which for me kills the deal. I have had MRV since it was available on the old DirecTiVo's.
> 
> What is worst is that I quit waiting for the HD DirecTiVo at the end of June and now I have these VERY BUGGY DirecTV HR24 DVR's and their clumsy guide and search capability that sucks.
> 
> Personally I would love to get rid of the HR24's, but having been use to MRV, it would be a pain to give that up, as much as I like TiVo (or can I say love the capability of the TiVo, and the less buggy interface).
> 
> Oh, how I hate the bugs. (must be the 39 years in IT and being a production software developer and now a System/Network Administrator).
> 
> Oh TiVo, why no MRV?


39 years in IT, then you should know that bugs exist, nothing that can be done - there has never been a piece of software in the history of IT that has been released without undiscovered bugs - even the basic "Hello World" example did not work becasue the teacher missed a " when they demonstrated in on the compliler release

as far as why no MRV, it is a HR10-250 with Mpeg4..period


----------



## RMBittner

stevel said:


> FF on the DirecTV DVRs works the same as it does on TiVos.


Not when I've tried my in-laws' (SD) unit, it doesn't. You get dropped into the program exactly where you switched from FF to Play. On TiVo, of course, you get a tiny bit of rewind that is invaluable. Maybe things are different on the HD DirecTV units, though...

Bob


----------



## RMBittner

unitron said:


> I just wish they'd present Suggestions as a separate page that I don't have to drill down for for me to review instead of making the only choice either record them or disable suggestions.


Not sure I understand. But, then, I almost never review upcoming Suggestion recordings; I just let them record. Is that something you're not wanting to do?

Bob


----------



## BrettStah

RMBittner said:


> Not when I've tried my in-laws' (SD) unit, it doesn't. You get dropped into the program exactly where you switched from FF to Play. On TiVo, of course, you get a tiny bit of rewind that is invaluable. Maybe things are different on the HD DirecTV units, though...
> 
> Bob


The HR-2x ones skip back a little as well. However, due to MPEG-4's design, it'll never be quite as smooth to fast-forward and rewind as compared with MPEG-2 content. I tend to use the 30-second skip to skip over commercials, but I did that with my old DirecTivos too.


----------



## Adam1115

I really like how the HR2x bumps you back a second when you un-pause...


----------



## tbeckner

sjberra said:


> 39 years in IT, then you should know that bugs exist, nothing that can be done - there has never been a piece of software in the history of IT that has been released without undiscovered bugs


Yes, without a doubt bugs exist, and since I now work in the Microsoft world, I know that is a very true statement, and I deal with it every day. But when I worked in the IBM midrange field, bugs were almost non-existent.

My old DirecTiVo's running 6.2a (networking, TiVoWebPlus, and MRV) and rebooting twice a week at 3am have 1/100th the number of problems that the two FREE HR24's that DirecTV installed at the end of June.

I do agree with others users, although it is part of the decoding required for the Mpeg4 data stream, the HR24 is very slow in comparison to the SD DirecTiVo's when it comes to decoding the stream, plus the HR24's lock up at times and yesterday the Frontroom HR24 showed three recordings running at the same time, and I could add a number of other operational bugs, but I have given up on the platform.

IMHO, the bugs are far worst than the bugs that existed in my Sony TiVo that I bought in May of 2000 (and hacked in June to add a 60GB drive) and DirecTV has had many years to correct these bugs, but it appears to me that they have a horrible development environment and when they fix one bug they create another bug.

No, the slowness of the stream decoding, the numerous operational bugs, and the somewhat clumsy remote control and interface has made me decide to give my two FREE HR24s to my daughter and replace them with the THR22, if the reviews are good.

The technical promise of the HR34 is great, but after suffering with the HR24 problems, I do not trust DirecTV to have a workable HR34 for many years.

This is somewhat off topic, but on the discussion of bugs, at work I have five (5) Cisco WAP4410N wireless access points and three (3) Linksys WAP4400N wireless access points that have intermittment connectivity problems. Talk about a bug, Cisco hasn't been able to fix them for the last three years, so I understand bugs. I have given Cisco one last chance to fix them this last week, else they are going back to Cisco and will be replaced. And just this last week I ran into a parsing error with the Wbadmin command in Windows Server 2008 that still exists in R2, and figured a way around the bug, but when it comes to consumer devices, these bugs including total lockups should not exist or should happen about as often as they do on my older DirecTiVo's, which is about once every six months or so.

One other minor point, is the the search capability on the HR24's, which in my opinion sucks.

One last thing, if there are errors in my post, I attempted to enter this post on the web browser of my iPad2.


----------



## BrettStah

As another data point, we have very few problems with our HR2x DVRs. I have one of them that is noticeably slower than the others. 

I don't think they're perfect by any means - I could rattle off a list of features that I think should be improved/added, but overall we are happy with them. I'll definitely keep up with the new DirecTivos once they are released, and if the features and reliability seem solid, I'd definitely consider adding one at some point in the future.


----------



## catocony

After about 5 months with HR24s, I can honestly say that they really are a bit slow to respond to remote commands. Not as bad as the R-15, but still noticeable.

I've gotten used to the Hughes remote as well. The one from my R-15 was 1st Gen, I guess, the two that came with the HR24s have bigger buttons. I still think the Tivo Peanut is superior, but the Hughes one is usable.


----------



## unitron

RMBittner said:


> Not sure I understand. But, then, I almost never review upcoming Suggestion recordings; I just let them record. Is that something you're not wanting to do?
> 
> Bob


Considering that probably 90+ % of the suggestions will be stuff I don't want, I'd rather not use up hard drive space on them or otherwise have to deal with them. If I can review the descriptions of them manually I can pick the ones I care about and instruct the TiVo to record them.


----------



## BrettStah

Given a choice between the DirecTV remote and a TiVo peanut remote, the TiVo remote would win in a landslide, however, due to the setup we have, we use a Harmony One remote.


----------



## Matt L

My Harmony 670 is very peanut like, that's why I own 4 of them. It's the ergonomic shape that makes them a stand out. Too bad more remotes are not like TiVo and some of the older Harmonys.


----------



## Wil

unitron said:


> Considering that probably 90+ % of the suggestions will be stuff I don't want, I'd rather not use up hard drive space on them or otherwise have to deal with them. If I can review the descriptions of them manually I can pick the ones I care about and instruct the TiVo to record them.


You, people like you, of course represent one of the big marketing failures of Tivo even when they were good, and it's way too late to fix it now. The huge benefit of suggestions, rather than being rightly celebrated and even enhanced over the years, became perceived by many as a neutral and even, as in your case, a negative. Using up hard drive space!? Jeeze. This is NOT your failure, it's Tivo's.


----------



## sjberra

tbeckner said:


> Yes, without a doubt bugs exist, and since I now work in the Microsoft world, I know that is a very true statement, and I deal with it every day. But when I worked in the IBM midrange field, bugs were almost non-existent.
> 
> My old DirecTiVo's running 6.2a (networking, TiVoWebPlus, and MRV) and rebooting twice a week at 3am have 1/100th the number of problems that the two FREE HR24's that DirecTV installed at the end of June.
> 
> I do agree with others users, although it is part of the decoding required for the Mpeg4 data stream, the HR24 is very slow in comparison to the SD DirecTiVo's when it comes to decoding the stream, plus the HR24's lock up at times and yesterday the Frontroom HR24 showed three recordings running at the same time, and I could add a number of other operational bugs, but I have given up on the platform.
> 
> IMHO, the bugs are far worst than the bugs that existed in my Sony TiVo that I bought in May of 2000 (and hacked in June to add a 60GB drive) and DirecTV has had many years to correct these bugs, but it appears to me that they have a horrible development environment and when they fix one bug they create another bug.
> 
> No, the slowness of the stream decoding, the numerous operational bugs, and the somewhat clumsy remote control and interface has made me decide to give my two FREE HR24s to my daughter and replace them with the THR22, if the reviews are good.
> 
> The technical promise of the HR34 is great, but after suffering with the HR24 problems, I do not trust DirecTV to have a workable HR34 for many years.
> 
> This is somewhat off topic, but on the discussion of bugs, at work I have five (5) Cisco WAP4410N wireless access points and three (3) Linksys WAP4400N wireless access points that have intermittment connectivity problems. Talk about a bug, Cisco hasn't been able to fix them for the last three years, so I understand bugs. I have given Cisco one last chance to fix them this last week, else they are going back to Cisco and will be replaced. And just this last week I ran into a parsing error with the Wbadmin command in Windows Server 2008 that still exists in R2, and figured a way around the bug, but when it comes to consumer devices, these bugs including total lockups should not exist or should happen about as often as they do on my older DirecTiVo's, which is about once every six months or so.
> 
> One other minor point, is the the search capability on the HR24's, which in my opinion sucks.
> 
> One last thing, if there are errors in my post, I attempted to enter this post on the web browser of my iPad2.


Guess you never worked with VM/ESA, especially when running multiple partitions with MVS/ESA over it. when it first released, the number of PTF's and APAR's that where released was staggering, it took about a year to get the combinstation to work correctly and end up stable, then lets bring in the first release of Document imaging that IBM Montreal hit the streets with - that was a joke for stability and reliability, especially when you added support for the opitical library driven by early releases of the AS400, not to mention teh AS400 OS in itself, same with VTAM when it first released - it just did not work as advertised without numerous PTF's and service releases applied.

Different stroke for different folks - the HR10-250 is not innocent in bugs, had 4 of them they all suffered from lockups, missed programs and scheduling issues. Got so sick and tired of hearing "DAAAADDDDD I can't watch Dora the Explorer" that when they started to die and get replaced with HR2X series boxes through the protection plan it was a godsend, people tend to gloss over that time. The boolean search on the HR2X's is pretty slick when you work with it though.

All in all, from all reports this is going to be a mediocre release at best, none of the added features that are standard on the HR2X boxes, no mrv, nothing.. not worth the money to pay for the initial lease. Add to the simple fact it will be hack resistant, think it will be a poor showing to start and end


----------



## DouglasPHill

This is a really long thread and I apologize if this has all been covered. I wonder what has taken so long to get this out? And if it doesn't have multiroom viewing, I wonder why? Why would you bring out a new product that doesn't have the new features that people want? What or who has been holding this back? I know, everyone involved has no doubt signed a non-disclosure document. It will probably make a good book sometime in the future.


----------



## mp11

lpwcomp said:


> Does a DirecTiVo allow you to pause both live buffers and even watch a piece of a recording and return to live TV and they're still paused? This is one of the features I love on an SA TiVo. Particularly useful during the NFL season.





stevel said:


> The DirecTV DVRs have two 90 minute buffers you can pause.


Way to answer his question there Steve.


----------



## mp11

DouglasPHill said:


> This is a really long thread and I apologize if this has all been covered. I wonder what has taken so long to get this out? And if it doesn't have multiroom viewing, I wonder why? Why would you bring out a new product that doesn't have the new features that people want? What or who has been holding this back? I know, everyone involved has no doubt signed a non-disclosure document. It will probably make a good book sometime in the future.


Short answer...Directv. They aren't exactly doing everything in their power to help Tivo expedite the release of a unit they don't even want. Although they're in bed together right now, it will be short lived. Tivo will wake up one morning to find nothing but wrinkled sheets next to it.


----------



## stevel

mp11 said:


> Way to answer his question there Steve.


I guess his question is somewhat ambiguous, and my response probably not to the point.

The old DirecTiVos work exactly the way the standalone units do as far as pausing. We have no idea what the new ones will do.


----------



## mp11

stevel said:


> I guess his question is somewhat ambiguous, and my response probably not to the point.


What part of his question was ambiguous? Sounded clear and right to the point to me. Just like your plug for Directv as an answer.


----------



## fasTLane

lpwcomp said:


> Does a DirecTiVo allow you to pause both live buffers and even watch a piece of a recording and return to live TV and they're still paused? This is one of the features I love on an SA TiVo. Particularly useful during the NFL season.


Correct answer is... *durn tootin'*.


----------



## unitron

mp11 said:


> ...Tivo will wake up one morning to find nothing but wrinkled sheets next to it.


Or a severed horse's head.


----------



## unitron

DouglasPHill said:


> This is a really long thread and I apologize if this has all been covered. I wonder what has taken so long to get this out? And if it doesn't have multiroom viewing, I wonder why? Why would you bring out a new product that doesn't have the new features that people want? What or who has been holding this back? I know, everyone involved has no doubt signed a non-disclosure document. It will probably make a good book sometime in the future.


My suspicion is that it had something to do with waiting to see how the TiVo versus Dish Network lawsuits worked out, so they'd have a better idea how they could or couldn't legally screw TiVo.


----------



## CuriousMark

DouglasPHill said:


> This is a really long thread and I apologize if this has all been covered. I wonder what has taken so long to get this out? And if it doesn't have multiroom viewing, I wonder why? Why would you bring out a new product that doesn't have the new features that people want? What or who has been holding this back? I know, everyone involved has no doubt signed a non-disclosure document. It will probably make a good book sometime in the future.


There are lots of theories posted in this long thread.

I suspect it was a combination of things. The first being the marketing guys at TiVo and DirecTV who put forward the first due date not understanding what was being asked and being overoptomistic about what could be done with the old hardware and old software combination. Second, I think TiVo put all hands on deck to work the Premiere rollout and this project sat for a while during that time. Third, I think DirecTV held firm on some requirements that were much more difficult to implement that they thought by assuming it worked the same weir their code did, which it doesn't. One example, is the free space indicator on the now showing screen. TiVo didn't do it on the TiVo HD waiting to do it on the Premiere instead, but DTV appears to have made them do it here. Customers probably wouldn't have cared for that too much. Fourth, MPEG4, the DirecTV way have been more difficult than TiVo planned for. Fifthth, DTV made TiVo go back and fix small bugs at the end of the first round of testing that they might have been willing to let through if the product were their own, or the bugs really were big and needed to be fixed, we don't know. What we do think we know is that TiVo was rumored to have submitted to DTV for acceptance and then later said it was back in testing. That list is numbered, but is not in any meaningful order, I was just keeping track as I thought.

All the above is pure guesswork, but I think it is safe to say that both sides contributed to the delays one way or another.


----------



## lrhorer

lpwcomp said:


> Does a DirecTiVo allow you to pause both live buffers and even watch a piece of a recording and return to live TV and they're still paused? This is one of the features I love on an SA TiVo. Particularly useful during the NFL season.


Of all the features of the TiVo, this is one I would place way, way down, nearly at the very bottom of the list. Indeed, I would be just as happy - happier, really - if the feature could be disabled, potentially increasing the storage capacity of the TiVo by an hour, and both increasing performance and redcing power consumption because the tuners would not be recording when they are not needed, and the drives coud be spun down, rather than writing 2 streams 24 hours a day. I have three active TiVos, and I ssupect I could save an average of perhaps 50 Watts or better if the drives would spin down when not in use. Fifty Watts x 24 hours x 365 days per year at $0.09 a kilowatt-hour comes out to roughly $40 a year for something I don't want in the first place.

Certainly in over 11 years of ownership of 4 different TiVos, I've used this feature maybe twice. It's at the very top of the list of features I would like to disable.


----------



## litzdog911

DouglasPHill said:


> This is a really long thread and I apologize if this has all been covered. I wonder what has taken so long to get this out? And if it doesn't have multiroom viewing, I wonder why? Why would you bring out a new product that doesn't have the new features that people want? What or who has been holding this back? I know, everyone involved has no doubt signed a non-disclosure document. It will probably make a good book sometime in the future.


1. We'll probably never really know why it's taken so long. But this is unfortunately Tivo's track record. We do know it's been in beta testing for quite a while now.

2. Why bring it out without features like multi-room? Because some folks really really really like the Tivo interface, peanut remote, etc.

3. See answer #1. We'll never know what the true holdup was all about. But we can speculate.

4. By the time this thing comes out, I doubt anyone would buy the book


----------



## RMBittner

unitron said:


> I'd rather not use up hard drive space on them or otherwise have to deal with them.


The beauty of TiVo's Suggestions, though, is that you never do have to deal with them. They're there if you want them, but they never take away any hard-disk space needed for your own recordings; your recordings simply overwrite them without you having to do anything about it.

I will say that you'll get much more accurate suggestions if you take the time to ThumbsUp/ThumbsDown material -- both stuff you're watching (but maybe don't have a SP for) and stuff that TiVo's Suggested for you. If you're just deleting upcoming Suggestions, you're not giving the machine a chance to get any smarter about what you do and don't want.

Of course, TiVo doesn't know _why_ you've liked something, so its Suggestions are always going to be. . . um. . . "interesting." Maybe you recorded "Bringing Up Baby" because you like screwball comedies or Cary Grant/Katharine Hepburn. But maybe you like movies about leopards. If so, TiVo probably won't figure that out. (And watch out if you record a couple of kids' programs because you're having young guests; you'll have a hard time convincing TiVo that you don't want tons of children's programming for years to come.)


----------



## unitron

litzdog911 said:


> 1. We'll probably never really know why it's taken so long. But this is unfortunately Tivo's track record. We do know it's been in beta testing for quite a while now.
> 
> 2. Why bring it out without features like multi-room? Because some folks really really really like the Tivo interface, peanut remote, etc.
> 
> 3. See answer #1. We'll never know what the true holdup was all about. But we can speculate.
> 
> 4. By the time this thing comes out, I doubt anyone would buy the book


By the time this thing comes out, I wonder if anyone is going to buy the DirecTiVo?


----------



## RMBittner

litzdog911 said:


> 2. Why bring it out without features like multi-room? Because some folks really really really like the Tivo interface, peanut remote, etc.


We'll definitely be making the switch to D* as soon as the new TiVo units become available.

But I have to say, I couldn't care less about not have MRV, etc. on these new TiVos. Because we'll be getting multiple HD DVRs/Receivers. The Tivo unit will replace our current cabled S3TiVo, so my wife will have exactly the functionality and UI she's gotten used to and likes in our main TV room. But we'll outfit our other TVs with D*'s HD DVRs and receivers to get those advantages as well. Yes, the TiVo will be a closed system unto itself -- since it's my understanding it won't be able to communicate with the other non-TiVo units -- but I don't foresee that being any kind of problem.

Best of both worlds, as far as I can tell.

Bob


----------



## sjberra

mp11 said:


> Short answer...Directv. They aren't exactly doing everything in their power to help Tivo expedite the release of a unit they don't even want. Although they're in bed together right now, it will be short lived. Tivo will wake up one morning to find nothing but wrinkled sheets next to it.


really - got proof of the satetment or is it your pure specualtion? Have never seen any documentation on what you claim is the reason. Tivo doesn;t exaclty have the greatest track record on getting product to the market. Directv fulfilled their part - the hardware has been out for a long time. The HR22 was state of the art when this started.


----------



## sjberra

RMBittner said:


> We'll definitely be making the switch to D* as soon as the new TiVo units become available.
> 
> But I have to say, I couldn't care less about not have MRV, etc. on these new TiVos. Because we'll be getting multiple HD DVRs/Receivers. The Tivo unit will replace our current cabled S3TiVo, so my wife will have exactly the functionality and UI she's gotten used to and likes in our main TV room. But we'll outfit our other TVs with D*'s HD DVRs and receivers to get those advantages as well. Yes, the TiVo will be a closed system unto itself -- since it's my understanding it won't be able to communicate with the other non-TiVo units -- but I don't foresee that being any kind of problem.
> 
> Best of both worlds, as far as I can tell.
> 
> Bob


Would not play down MRV, sure nice to start watching something in one room, pause it pick it up in another room, not to mention being able to record numerous shows over numerous DVR's and watch them at any location in the hosue where you have a DVR. This will only be outshown by the new HR34 that is coming down the pipeline soon.

You are 100 percent correct, the TIVO unit will not work with the MRV system that directv has in place now, nor will it share any features with your current tivo systems, it is pure standalone. basicly a HR10-250 with MPEG4 and a peanut remote


----------



## unitron

RMBittner said:


> The beauty of TiVo's Suggestions, though, is that you never do have to deal with them. They're there if you want them, but they never take away any hard-disk space needed for your own recordings; your recordings simply overwrite them without you having to do anything about it.
> 
> I will say that you'll get much more accurate suggestions if you take the time to ThumbsUp/ThumbsDown material -- both stuff you're watching (but maybe don't have a SP for) and stuff that TiVo's Suggested for you. If you're just deleting upcoming Suggestions, you're not giving the machine a chance to get any smarter about what you do and don't want.
> 
> Of course, TiVo doesn't know _why_ you've liked something, so its Suggestions are always going to be. . . um. . . "interesting." Maybe you recorded "Bringing Up Baby" because you like screwball comedies or Cary Grant/Katharine Hepburn. But maybe you like movies about leopards. If so, TiVo probably won't figure that out. (And watch out if you record a couple of kids' programs because you're having young guests; you'll have a hard time convincing TiVo that you don't want tons of children's programming for years to come.)


When TiVos first came out there was a story about a guy who said his TiVo was convinced that he was a gay Nazi.


----------



## mp11

sjberra said:


> really - got proof of the satetment or is it your pure specualtion? Have never seen any documentation on what you claim is the reason. Tivo doesn;t exaclty have the greatest track record on getting product to the market. Directv fulfilled their part - the hardware has been out for a long time. The HR22 was state of the art when this started.


Proof? Nope. But then neither do the hundreds of other posts speculating on what might and might not be. It's the general concensus.



> Directv fulfilled their part - the hardware has been out for a long time.


LOL and what a difficult part that was indeed. Here's our box, now you do the rest.


----------



## fasTLane

sjberra said:


> Would not play down MRV, sure nice to start watching something in one room, pause it pick it up in another room, not to mention being able to record numerous shows over numerous DVR's and watch them at any location in the hosue where you have a DVR. This will only be outshown by the new HR34 that is coming down the pipeline soon.
> You are 100 percent correct, the TIVO unit will not work with the MRV system that directv has in place now, nor will it share any features with your current tivo systems, it is pure standalone. basicly a HR10-250 with MPEG4 and a peanut remote


We are more than ready for an HR10-250 with peanut remote that plays HD from sat ...*wait*... we already had that 
until our HD was yanked by Direct, just like the NASA channel recently.

We also don't give a rip about MRV.


----------



## RMBittner

sjberra said:


> Would not play down MRV, sure nice to start watching something in one room, pause it pick it up in another room, not to mention being able to record numerous shows over numerous DVR's and watch them at any location in the hosue where you have a DVR.


I wasn't intending to play down MRV at all. I was just saying that it didn't matter to me that I couldn't do it through the _TiVo_ box. We love TiVo for simply being what it is -- a great UI, great remote, Suggestions, auto-recorded Wishlists, and unlimited SPs on a single box.

Since we'll be getting several additional non-TiVo HD DVRs/receivers, we'll still get all of the benefits of the D* boxes, _plus_ we'll have the TiVo unit we want.

Bob


----------



## sjberra

mp11 said:


> Proof? Nope. But then neither do the hundreds of other posts speculating on what might and might not be. It's the general concensus.
> 
> LOL and what a difficult part that was indeed. Here's our box, now you do the rest.


So your point is - TIVO is the software provider Directv is the *hardware provider*, the hardware has been there.

So you are agreeing that it coulb ne TIVO that dropped the ball, since this is all "speculation" with no basis in fact? Sorry, don;t take "general concensus", that is a cop out


----------



## sjberra

fasTLane said:


> We are more than ready for an HR10-250 with peanut remote that plays HD from sat ...*wait*... we already had that
> until our HD was yanked by Direct, just like the NASA channel recently.
> 
> We also don't give a rip about MRV.


Ahh isn't technology advances grand - MPEG4 HD, gotta love it. Fortunatley you are getting exactly what you wish for - a HR10-250 with peanut remote, MPEG4, no mrv and no hack ability.

if you "don;t give a rip and MRV" how come there are complaints that the unit does not emcompus some of the ability that the newest standalone tivo has that appears to function just like MRV?


----------



## fasTLane

sjberra said:


> if you "*don;t give a rip and MRV*" how come there are complaints that the unit does not *emcompus *some of the ability that the newest standalone tivo has that appears to function just like MRV?


huh? jsut don;t wnat it.


----------



## sjberra

fasTLane said:


> huh? jsut don;t wnat it.


is that the best you can do? Or do you have a valid answer for the question?


----------



## fasTLane

sjberra said:


> is that the best you can do?


My thoughts exactly.


----------



## tbeckner

fasTLane said:


> huh? jsut don;t wnat it.


Likely because you have never had MRV.

Funny thing, that is just what people say about a DVR/TiVo, before they have had one.

In my case, I have had MRV since 2003-2004 (between five DirecTiVo's) and now I wouldn't leave home with out it, so to speak.

At the moment, I have four DirecTiVo's networked with MRV (3 active), and 2 HR24's with Whole Home.

If the THR22 had MRV, I would at least replace the HR24's, and maybe at least one of the older DirecTiVo's.

Too bad they don't have MRV.

With all of the bugs that I have ran into on the HR24's, I wouldn't jump on a HR34 for a long time, and maybe never if streaming ever becomes a reality. But I would have bought the THR22.

As you might guess, a TiVo fan since May 2000, and I have owned 7 TiVo's 6 of which are still running, and one standalone that I used for a hard drive for one of my DirecTiVo's.

Sorry TiVo. You know it is almost like losing a longtime friend! Very sad!


----------



## fasTLane

tbeckner said:


> Likely because you have never had MRV.


I suppose some are not so religious about television. 

Only have the one 50" Panasonic plasma monitor and it has been more than adequate. Outstanding picture and a joy to watch.

Almost as amazing as the DirecTivo I purchased 5 years ago (prior to DirecTV's generous HD cripple).


----------



## EmilyEmily

MRV isn't a factor if you're one of the many, many people who only have one TV in the home. I'm a great fan of gadgets, but I don't want TV in the bedroom, and therefore there's a single TV and a dedicated place for watching it.


----------



## E94Allen

EmilyEmily said:


> MRV isn't a factor if you're one of the many, many people who only have one TV in the home. I'm a great fan of gadgets, but I don't want TV in the bedroom, and therefore there's a single TV and a dedicated place for watching it.


Actually it is not like what you said because I, myself, used to own only one TV and use MRV quite often between several TiVos (in old day I used to own single tuner 80gb and when it wasn't enough I brought DT 180gb then TiVoHD then TiVoHDXL then so on several more Premieres all on monthly plan and finally I brought 2tb Premiere Lifetime off from Ebay along with 50 inches HDTV) so don't assume that people don't have more than one DVR if only have one TV.


----------



## Rainy Dave

E94Allen said:


> Actually it is not like what you said because I, myself, used to own only one TV and use MRV quite often between several TiVos (in old day I used to own single tuner 80gb and when it wasn't enough I brought DT 180gb then TiVoHD then TiVoHDXL then so on several more Premieres all on monthly plan and finally I brought 2tb Premiere Lifetime off from Ebay along with 50 inches HDTV) so don't assume that people don't have more than one DVR if only have one TV.


I run 2 DirecTV DVRs with only 1 tv in our house. I don't see a need for MRV in my case. Not sure what the point would be.


----------



## lpwcomp

Rainy Dave said:


> I run 2 DirecTV DVRs with only 1 tv in our house. I don't see a need for MRV in my case. Not sure what the point would be.


I can think of at least two instances where there would be a point:

1. You want to move stuff from one TiVo to the other or to a computer to free up space.

2. You only have enough HDMI inputs on your TV for one TiVo and you don't want to buy and/or install a switch. Streaming would work for this but the new DTiVo doesn't seem to have this either.


----------



## Rainy Dave

lpwcomp said:


> I can think of at least two instances where there would be a point:
> 
> 1. You want to move stuff from one TiVo to the other or to a computer to free up space.
> 
> 2. You only have enough HDMI inputs on your TV for one TiVo and you don't want to buy and/or install a switch. Streaming would work for this but the new DTiVo doesn't seem to have this either.


True. But, I haven't filled up either of my DVRs (2tb drives on both) and I have them hooked up to an Onkyo receiver then the tv.

So...no need for MRV in my case.

Now, if I added a 2nd tv in our bedroom, then I'd want MRV.


----------



## E94Allen

Rainy Dave said:


> I run 2 DirecTV DVRs with only 1 tv in our house. I don't see a need for MRV in my case. Not sure what the point would be.


Oh my point is I used MRV to move (transfer) all shows from old TiVos to newer TiVos when I add more TiVos that have bigger spaces then I retired older ones. And also I transfer shows to other TiVo when one TiVo getting too full.

In your case I maybe can see why you don't see the need for MRV if your DVR is not TiVo branded. Older DirectTV TiVo DVR allows transfer. I think DirectTV DVR doesn't allow transfer only streaming.


----------



## stevel

E94Allen said:


> Older DirectTV TiVo DVR allows transfer. I think DirectTV DVR doesn't allow transfer only streaming.


All DirecTV TiVos produced to date have zero support for transfers, or networking in general. Yes, you can hack most of these models to allow for recorder-to-recorder transfer (as long as you stay at 6.2 or earlier), and can use other tools to copy programs to/from a PC, but none of this was ever supported by TiVo or DirecTV.

Personally, I don't have a use for MRV between two DVRs, though I have used the ability to save to a PC (from my hacked HR10). I have also streamed from my HR21. But I understand that many people do want MRV and would reasonably be disappointed if the new DTiVo didn't even have the sharing that other current DirecTV DVRs can manage.


----------



## Wil

stevel said:


> you can hack most of these [DirecTV TiVos] models to allow for recorder-to-recorder transfer (as long as you stay at 6.2 or earlier)


I know what you're trying to say, but to avoid confusion: versions 6.3 (various) and 6.4a (at least) are compatible with transfer capability on the HR10-250.


----------



## nrc

litzdog911 said:


> 1. We'll probably never really know why it's taken so long. But this is unfortunately Tivo's track record. We do know it's been in beta testing for quite a while now.


TiVo's track record is that they've released three cable company specific units on schedule since the DirecTV deal was announced. RCN and Suddenlink use TiVo hardware while Virgin uses Motorola.


----------



## SullyND

nrc said:


> Virgin uses Motorola.


FYI - Virgin uses Cisco, and will be moving to Samsung.


----------



## nrc

SullyND said:


> FYI - Virgin uses Cisco, and will be moving to Samsung.


Sorry, yes. Point being that they have a demonstrated ability to deliver on schedule on non-Tivo hardware.


----------



## stryton

I have a Samsung Directivo still alive and kicking for the moment. However, it is starting to have some issues. I have the Directv protection plan. After this new Tivo receiver comes out if my Samsung unit dies will Directv replace it with one of these since it has Tivo or will they replace it with one of their own DVR's?


----------



## Cutty

unitron said:


> My suspicion is that it had something to do with waiting to see how the TiVo versus Dish Network lawsuits worked out, so they'd have a better idea how they could or couldn't legally screw TiVo.


Exactly. DTV ripped off TIVO technology, just as Dish did, and DTV had a very long "wait and see" attitude while TIVO and Dish duked it out in court. It's no coincidence that as the TIVO lawsuit has slowly tightened the noose around Dish, and won on appeals, the "new" DTV Tivo just happens to be coming out.

DTV milked it for as long as they could, but now the jig is up.


----------



## litzdog911

stryton said:


> I have a Samsung Directivo still alive and kicking for the moment. However, it is starting to have some issues. I have the Directv protection plan. After this new Tivo receiver comes out if my Samsung unit dies will Directv replace it with one of these since it has Tivo or will they replace it with one of their own DVR's?


Since the new DirecTV/Tivo is HiDef and your old Tivo is not, it won't be a direct replacement. But you can certainly pay to upgrade that box to a new HD DirecTV/Tivo. We just don't yet know what the cost will be.


----------



## MicroBeta

Cutty said:


> Exactly. DTV ripped off TIVO technology, just as Dish did, and DTV had a very long "wait and see" attitude while TIVO and Dish duked it out in court. It's no coincidence that as the TIVO lawsuit has slowly tightened the noose around Dish, and won on appeals, the "new" DTV Tivo just happens to be coming out.
> 
> DTV milked it for as long as they could, but now the jig is up.


Sorry but Ive got to disagree with you. DIRECTV and TiVo have had an agreement for nearly a decade now. An agreement which, among other things, says they cannot to sue each other for patent infringement (and yes they *both* own many patents related to DVRs)...maybe Im missing something but if TiVo and DIRECTV agreed to share technology how is TiVo being ripped off?

Mike


----------



## Matt L

Because the deal- if I recall correctly - was quickly worked out by D when it was expiring with the stipulation that TiVo gets to produce a D HDTiVo box again. It was a CYA move on D's part.


----------



## MicroBeta

Matt L said:


> Because the deal- if I recall correctly - was quickly worked out by D when it was expiring with the stipulation that TiVo gets to produce a D HDTiVo box again. It was a CYA move on D's part.


You are correct in that the Sept, 2008 agreement did include the new DirecTiVo HD receiver but I don't know how quickly it was thrown together. The agreement they had in place at the time still had another year to go on it and it covered their butts on patent infringement. Any patented features (Replay/DIRECTV or TiVo) in use couldn't be litigated.

Cutty posted that DIRECTV was ripping off TiVo an and kept delaying the release of the DIRECTV/TiVo HD DVR waiting to see how the Dish lawsuits shake out. My point was DIRECTV is already covered when it comes to the patents so any delays in its release have nothing what so ever to do with the Dish lawsuits...back to the question I actually posted...how is TiVo being ripped off by DIRECTV?

Mike


----------



## sjberra

lpwcomp said:


> I can think of at least two instances where there would be a point:
> 
> 1. You want to move stuff from one TiVo to the other or to a computer to free up space.
> 
> 2. You only have enough HDMI inputs on your TV for one TiVo and you don't want to buy and/or install a switch. Streaming would work for this but the new DTiVo doesn't seem to have this either.


Even if they offered MRV on the directivo, option 1 would not be possible, the DirectTv version of MRV does not give this ability


----------



## lpwcomp

sjberra said:


> Even if they offered MRV on the directivo, option 1 would not be possible, the DirectTv version of MRV does not give this ability


I thought we were talking about TiVo's MRV, not DirecTV's.


----------



## unitron

MicroBeta said:


> You are correct in that the Sept, 2008 agreement did include the new DirecTiVo HD receiver but I don't know how quickly it was thrown together. The agreement they had in place at the time still had another year to go on it and it covered their butts on patent infringement. Any patented features (Replay/DIRECTV or TiVo) in use couldnt be litigated.
> 
> Cutty posted that DIRECTV was ripping off TiVo an and kept delaying the release of the DIRECTV/TiVo HD DVR waiting to see how the Dish lawsuits shake out. My point was DIRECTV is already covered when it comes to the patents so any delays in its release have nothing what so ever to do with the Dish lawsuits...back to the question I actually posted...how is TiVo being ripped off by DIRECTV?
> 
> Mike


My suspicion was that DirecTV was waiting to see if TiVo came out of the lawsuit hurting financially and more "motivated" to make the deal with DirecTV happen, as well as finding out which patents TiVo can't claim.


----------



## lrhorer

tbeckner said:


> Likely because you have never had MRV.
> 
> Funny thing, that is just what people say about a DVR/TiVo, before they have had one.


Its also what some people who do have MRV say. For quite some years, I did without MRV. Recently I enabled it just for the heck of it. I do use it from time to time, but not very often, and I wouldn't have a fit if it were to go away.


----------



## SnakeEyes

any word on device cost?


----------



## stevel

No word on cost or availability.


----------



## SnakeEyes

Can't remember, what's the original price of the last DirecTV TiVo?


----------



## mktc1985

The HR10-250 was $1,000.00 when it first came out.


----------



## sjberra

lpwcomp said:


> I thought we were talking about TiVo's MRV, not DirecTV's.


did not know that tivo has MRV, though it was a different concept that istead of streaming it copied it to another box, MRV does not do this


----------



## lpwcomp

sjberra said:


> did not know that tivo has MRV, though it was a different concept that istead of streaming it copied it to another box, MRV does not do this


TiVo MRV has always done it that way and I am pretty sure has been around longer than DirecTV's version.


----------



## stevel

Right. TiVo's MRV has always been copying. DirecTV's came later and has always been streaming.


----------



## catocony

I would bet at this point that the acquisition costs will be the same as for HRXX. But, there will be a $5.00-$7.00 per month, maybe even per box, for the HD DirecTivo.


----------



## sjberra

catocony said:


> I would bet at this point that the acquisition costs will be the same as for HRXX. But, there will be a $5.00-$7.00 per month, maybe even per box, for the HD DirecTivo.


years ago when this was first annouced, they stated it would be a premium service with a premium cost, so suspect aht the lease acquisition cost will be higher and the monthly mirror/lease fee will be higher also. Again according to the published information from years ago the default installation will be the HR2X with this unit only being installed if requested


----------



## RMBittner

sjberra said:


> the default installation will be the HR2X with this unit only being installed if requested


Makes sense. Especially since the new DirecTiVos won't have whole-home DVR capabilities; they're not going to give you a DTiVo unless you specifically ask for a DTiVo. (My solution will be to get a DTiVo _and_ D*'s own HD DVRs, just to cover all of the features bases.)

My S3 has a lifetime plan, so I don't know what current per-month pricing is. But I'd guess that the additional "TiVo fee" would be more in the $10-12 range, rather than $5-7.

Bob


----------



## dirk1843

Funny when people talk about cost....I don't remember when exactly I bought my HR10-250.....around 2004 I think. I was in Pegasus territory at the time and couldn't buy one with the "deals" that were going around with D* then. The Pegasus went away and I could get the deals. 

Seems with everything I paid about 700 or so for it.

Point is, I was WAITING IN LINE so to speak to shell out that much money for a box. For what, like 4 channels plus OTA back then?

I really think I would be hard pressed to give more than a couple hundred for it (or any STB) now. On top of that, 700 back then would be like 1,100 now.....how times have changed.


----------



## Phillip Chapman

Yes, the HR10-250 DirecTivo was the first HD DVR anywhere if my memory is correct. That is what made it the best DVR you could get for many years.

Speaking of deals... in the summer of 2005 at Best Buy you could get the HR10-250 Tivo DVR for 50% off and an additional $200 off as well. Many folks bought them through these coupons at the time.


----------



## dirk1843

It was a very orange shade of orange wasn't it?? LOL.......I need to drop a few pounds to get back into it.


----------



## mercurial

It was more of a rose color (at least mine was). Mine had migrated to a workout shirt and I just recently threw it out. I still have my pre-order certificate (order #3) from them somewhere...


----------



## Todd

Captain Spaulding said:


> I've still got my nifty TiVo HD/DirecTV tee shirt that Value Electronics gave away with the purchase of the HR10-250.


+1


----------



## Adam1115

I would be ALL over this if it weren't for DirecTV's whole house DVR. :sigh:

I really miss suggestions and kidzone.


----------



## dcstager

Today is supposed to be the day. Is it available to order today or not? Has anyone tried?


----------



## stevel

Whoever suggested that this product would be launched on a Sunday was hallucinating.


----------



## litzdog911

dcstager said:


> Today is supposed to be the day. ....


According to what source?


----------



## magnus

drumdude said:


> The only thing that keeps me with DIRECTV is the hope that someday they will get TiVo. If I switch to U-Verse I am doomed to another proprietary DVR. I wish DIRECTV would pee or get off the pot. All I am asking for is freedome of choice. Is that so much to ask? I want to choose the DVR I use.


If you're looking for freedom of choice then get a Premiere. You can use it with OTA or whatever cable company you want. The Directv Tivo will be watered down on features anyway.


----------



## sbiller

drumdude said:


> Still no launch date as of Sept 25th 2011


There was a single commenter here on Zatz that posted the 9/25 date --> http://www.zatznotfunny.com/2011-07/will-the-directv-tivo-arrive-this-month/


----------



## Matt L

drumdude said:


> The only thing that keeps me with DIRECTV is the hope that someday they will get TiVo. If I switch to U-Verse I am doomed to another proprietary DVR. I wish DIRECTV would pee or get off the pot. All I am asking for is freedome of choice. Is that so much to ask? I want to choose the DVR I use.


Then go cable or OTA. Dish does not offer a choice of DVRs and neither does Uverse, some cable companies don't either. Having been a big Tivo proponent over the years, there is very little that TiVo could offer that would get me to give up my 5 HR2x D HD DVRs. They do everything my HR10-250 did and do it better.

Other than a level of familiarity there is really very little difference between most DVRs. Yes there are some crappy ones out there, but the current D offerings are not among them.


----------



## nrc

drumdude said:


> Already tried switching to Time Warner Cable for a year. Their DVR's (General Dynamics) were pathetic. I spent $1000 on TiVos and never could get HD or digital channels. After (no kidding) over a dozen visits I finally gave up, sold the TiVo's on eBay, and returned to DIRECTV. TWC does not support cablecards in my area. They played dumb every time I called (never heard of a TiVo or a cablecard). Over The Air would limit me to the networks which I typically ignore so not an option.


How long ago was that? They're required by the FCC to support CableCARD. You should file a complaint with the FCC.

http://www.fcc.gov/complaints


----------



## Matt L

drumdude said:


> Already tried switching to Time Warner Cable for a year. Their DVR's (General Dynamics) were pathetic. I spent $1000 on TiVos and never could get HD or digital channels. After (no kidding) over a dozen visits I finally gave up, sold the TiVo's on eBay, and returned to DIRECTV. TWC does not support cablecards in my area. They played dumb every time I called (never heard of a TiVo or a cablecard). Over The Air would limit me to the networks which I typically ignore so not an option.
> The main difference between TiVo and other DVR's for me was SUGGESTIONS. I never had to search for shows. TiVo learns what you like (using thumbs up or down) and automatically records it. That smart technology is a big advance over the competition.


See my earlier post.....


----------



## fasTLane

nrc said:


> How long ago was that? They're required by the FCC to support CableCARD. You should file a complaint with the FCC.


 I think it is time I went back and checked out my local cable providers.


----------



## Athenian

drumdude said:


> If I switch to U-Verse I am doomed to another proprietary DVR.


I switched my senior parents to U-Verse a year ago and am just waiting for the new TiVo unit to released before switching them back.

Believe me, former TiVo users will not be happy with the U-Verse DVR. The schedule is so error prone that you have to review your upcoming recordings every week, and the functions are simply not as robust as TiVo. MRV is nice but it's not worth all the deficiencies in the DVR functions.


----------



## nmiller855

When I went to stay with my Dad he had just gotten Uverse. We both hated it but he had tried DirecTv before & the installer didn't get a good signal so at the first sign of clouds it started looking for a signal. I had a different installer come out & he got a great signal so we switched back to DirecTv & since I already had a few DirecTiVos, we were up & running without a break in period. I can't wait to see what the new DVR offers but it would take me quite a bit of improvement to get me to switch.


----------



## 230

Does anyone know if the new tivo will need a phone line for activation like the 10-250?


----------



## litzdog911

EJ said:


> Does anyone know if the new tivo will need a phone line for activation like the 10-250?


Don't know yet. Hopefully it can be set up via Internet, or a simple conversation with support rep like the DirecTV DVRs.


----------



## innocentfreak

drumdude said:


> I have a job. Not enough time to file complaints. I respond by not being a Time Warner customer and telling everyone I can how poor their service is.


Yeah that whole posting to a link that emails it to the FCC takes a long time. Oh I would say it takes about the same time to post a reply to a message board.

Oh well as long as people can't be bothered to file complaints the system won't be fixed since according to the cable companies everything is fine.


----------



## innocentfreak

drumdude said:


> Who asked ya? There always has to be wise guy on these forums.


You are right if it had been me I would have been wise and filed a complaint with the FCC.

http://esupport.fcc.gov/complaints.htm


----------



## fasTLane

innocentfreak said:


> Oh well as long as people can't be bothered to file complaints the system won't be fixed since according to the cable companies everything is fine.


+1


----------



## davezatz

innocentfreak said:


> Oh well as long as people can't be bothered to file complaints the system won't be fixed since according to the cable companies everything is fine.


I'm guilty of the same and should have been more proactive in that regard when having issues with Comcast and then Cox. I did call my local franchising authority once, who motivated Comcast to do things right. But I'm not sure they passed my complaint along to the FCC. Ah well, now I just tell everyone to join me on FiOS where the CableCARDs work and I can walk right into the Verizon mall store to pick up a card then simply activate online - no muss, no fuss.

https://twitter.com/#!/davezatz/status/106128053477965824/


----------



## mercurial

If I could get FiOS I would have.


----------



## MC Hammer

innocentfreak said:


> You are right if it had been me I would have been wise and filed a complaint with the FCC.
> 
> http://esupport.fcc.gov/complaints.htm


+1

drumdude's attitude is basically the equivalent of witnessing a murder and instead of calling the police, just telling everyone that murder is bad.


----------



## larrs

MC Hammer said:


> +1
> 
> drumdude's attitude is basically the equivalent of witnessing a murder and instead of calling the police, just telling everyone that murder is bad.


 ROFL


----------



## unitron

MC Hammer said:


> +1
> 
> drumdude's attitude is basically the equivalent of witnessing a murder and instead of calling the police, just telling everyone that murder is bad.


And the thing of it is, everybody already knows that murder and Time-Warner service are bad.


----------



## innocentfreak

unitron said:


> And the thing of it is, everybody already knows that murder and Time-Warner service are bad.


And yet even with that nothing can be done about it without proof. Sure we all know TWC sucks and has issues, but the FCC can't do anything unless people supply them with proof of the issues.

Look at sbiller's post in coffee house about his FCC filing and they even advised him to file a complaint which may result in Brighthouse being fined by the FCC.


----------



## Wil

MC Hammer said:


> drumdude's attitude is basically the equivalent of witnessing a murder and instead of calling the police, just telling everyone that murder is bad.


He didn't even go to the bother of buying a postage stamp to write a strongly-worded message to the Times!


----------



## unitron

Wil said:


> He didn't even go to the bother of buying a postage stamp to write a strongly-worded message to the Times!


Why he's practically no better than a cad and a bounder!


----------



## lpwcomp

Wil said:


> He didn't even go to the bother of buying a postage stamp to write a strongly-worded message to the Times!


That should be "stern letter to the times".

As to the murder witness analogy - I see it more as being mugged and rather than reporting it, going to the local(pub) and sitting around complaining about it to your fellow patrons.


----------



## samo

lpwcomp said:


> That should be "stern letter to the times".
> 
> As to the murder witness analogy - I see it more as being mugged and rather than reporting it, going to the local(pub) and sitting around complaining about it to your fellow patrons.


It is more like "my state is majority democrat (republican) and it doesn't matter if I vote"


----------



## Klankster

Hey guys -- I have a personal guarantee that the new DirecTivo will ship this week: I've been putting up with hard drive problems with my Series3 for months, hoping the new DirecTivo would ship, but the poor thing has gotten so much worse that I finally gave in and ordered a new drive for it. It's due to arrive today, so I'd expect DirecTV to ship their new unit within a day or two, tops.


----------



## dcstager

Klankster said:


> Hey guys -- I have a personal guarantee that the new DirecTivo will ship this week:


Who made the guarantee? Aren't there any DTV employees or CSRs on this forum that can give us a heads up?

My tuning adapter just got a firmware update and I'm hoping it fixes some bugs that are compelling me to switch to Directv. One more reason they'll release it immediately after all the cable bugs are fixed.


----------



## unitron

dcstager said:


> Who made the guarantee? Aren't there any DTV employees or CSRs on this forum that can give us a heads up?
> 
> My tuning adapter just got a firmware update and I'm hoping it fixes some bugs that are compelling me to switch to Directv. One more reason they'll release it immediately after all the cable bugs are fixed.


How can you miss the same kind of joke you just made?


----------



## Wil

unitron said:


> How can you miss the same kind of joke you just made?


Actually it was probably one of the most valid indicators we've had!


----------



## lrhorer

unitron said:


> And the thing of it is, everybody already knows that murder and Time-Warner service are bad.


Compared to Time Warner's service, murder isn't all that bad.


----------



## lpwcomp

Klankster said:


> Hey guys -- I have a personal guarantee that the new DirecTivo will ship this week: I've been putting up with hard drive problems with my Series3 for months, hoping the new DirecTivo would ship, but the poor thing has gotten so much worse that I finally gave in and ordered a new drive for it. It's due to arrive today, so I'd expect DirecTV to ship their new unit within a day or two, tops.


You should be traveling to areas that are experiencing a drought and washing your car!


----------



## BOBCAT

Getting back on subject, has anyone heard any updates on when the new HD TiVo will be released?


----------



## litzdog911

BOBCAT said:


> Getting back on subject, has anyone heard any updates on when the new HD TiVo will be released?


Nope.


----------



## dcstager

unitron said:


> How can you miss the same kind of joke you just made?


Mea culpa. I suppose I'm getting desperate if that's the right word that I'm not so quick on the uptake.

What's the deal anyway? They have the machine, we saw the video. Must be some kind of manufacturing delay or a delay involved with getting the units out to the professional installers.

But my own irony is probably correct. All the bugs with the Series 3 and the Tuning Adapters will be completely fixed by the time they get this out -- and then there won't be any need to switch to DTV.

If Time Warner had the NFL channel, I'd be left with no complaints at all. Shocking I know.


----------



## unitron

dcstager said:


> Mea culpa. I suppose I'm getting desperate if that's the right word that I'm not so quick on the uptake.
> 
> What's the deal anyway? They have the machine, we saw the video. Must be some kind of manufacturing delay or a delay involved with getting the units out to the professional installers.
> 
> But my own irony is probably correct. All the bugs with the Series 3 and the Tuning Adapters will be completely fixed by the time they get this out -- and then there won't be any need to switch to DTV.
> 
> If Time Warner had the NFL channel, I'd be left with no complaints at all. Shocking I know.


Anyone with Time-Warner will never be at a loss for complaints.


----------



## dcstager

unitron said:


> Anyone with Time-Warner will never be at a loss for complaints.


Austin is one of those rare exceptions where they have good people behind the scenes and they support Tivo users properly. NFL channel missing and Tivo unreliability is not the fault of Time Warner in Austin. They've done everything possible.


----------



## Francesco

TSR today said the DTiVo is rolling for _new_ customers this month, will roll out to _existing_ customers starting in January.


----------



## lrhorer

unitron said:


> Anyone with Time-Warner will never be at a loss for complaints.


In fairness, I have had relatively few complaints about their product delivery. It is their policies I find abominable and their product support that is abysmal. I'm not thriled with their pricing.

Well, mostly. I did find out something shocking the other day. It really is another one of their moronic policies, but in this case it actually does impact service delivery. For some idiotic reason, they have decided to regionalize key aspects of their business. This means, for example, that support of critical operations in one city may be managed in another. I learned the other day that a major chunk of their network - an entire hubsite - went down hard for several hours because the backup generators are managed in another city... and they are not being fixed when they fail.


----------



## lrhorer

dcstager said:


> Austin is one of those rare exceptions where they have good people behind the scenes and they support Tivo users properly.


It's Austin who manages the generators, and who is not fixing them when they are known to have failed. That doesn't just impact TiVo owners, either.


----------



## eddyj

Francesco said:


> TSR today said the DTiVo is rolling for _new_ customers this month, will roll out to _existing_ customers starting in January.


And why should this date be any more believable than the myriad of other dates we have heard in the last few years?


----------



## Rainy Dave

Francesco said:


> TSR today said the DTiVo is rolling for _new_ customers this month, will roll out to _existing_ customers starting in January.


They were most likely talking about the HR34.

From directv.com:



> The Home Media Center HD DVR receiver represents the next generation in set-top box technology. It lets you record five programs at once, so you don't have to worry about recording conflicts. Its full terabyte of DVR storage--the largest recording capacity in the industry-allows you to keep more of your recorded programs than ever. And with DIRECTV's Whole-Home DVR service, you can enjoy your recorded programs in any room of the house.
> 
> The Home Media Center HD DVR is currently available only to new DIRECTV customers in select markets and only by phone.


and from dbstalk.com



> DIRECTV is once again raising the bar on TV
> technology with the release of our Home Media
> Center HD DVR (HR34). This new receiver has a
> hard drive twice the size of its predecessors, the
> ability to record up to five programs at once,
> and can simultaneously share up to three
> recordings with other receivers in the home. It
> will be available to new customers in selected
> markets (listed below) starting today, with a
> national launch later this year, and to existing
> customers in 2012.
> 
> Austin, Texas
> Colorado Springs, Colorado
> Fresno, California
> Phoenix, Arizona
> Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania
> Salt Lake City, Utah


Still no mention of the DirecTiVo on there.


----------



## Francesco

Well, we were specifically talking about when I could replace my six S1s (and one R10), so I had to infer that he was indeed talking about the new DTiVo.


----------



## Rainy Dave

Francesco said:


> Well, we were specifically talking about when I could replace my six S1s (and one R10), so I had to infer that he was indeed talking about the new DTiVo.


Then I would submit that they were talking out their arse.


----------



## Cudahy

It is sometimes difficult to understand when they speak that way.


----------



## dcstager

lrhorer said:


> It's Austin who manages the generators, and who is not fixing them when they are known to have failed. That doesn't just impact TiVo owners, either.


What is involved in "managing the generators"? What are the generators? What goes wrong with them? What are they supposed to be fixing, but don't? Who else is impacted? How?


----------



## psywzrd

Rainy Dave said:


> From directv.com:..


Do you have a link to the article on DirecTV's website?


----------



## Rainy Dave

psywzrd said:


> Do you have a link to the article on DirecTV's website?


Here you go

http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/searc...me+media+center&homeSearch.x=0&homeSearch.y=0


----------



## psywzrd

Rainy Dave said:


> Here you go
> 
> http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/searc...me+media+center&homeSearch.x=0&homeSearch.y=0


Thank you for that but I was looking for the specific article you pulled the blurb from above (the one where it says you can record 5 shows at once). I searched for that but was unable to find it.


----------



## lpwcomp

psywzrd said:


> Thank you for that but I was looking for the specific article you pulled the blurb from above (the one where it says you can record 5 shows at once). I searched for that but was unable to find it.


http://support.directv.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/3532


----------



## Rainy Dave

First look article over on dbstalk

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=197609


----------



## RMBittner

lpwcomp: Off-topic, but I love your sig line.

I usually FF through a show's opening credits, but I _always_ watch the "Burn Notice" opener. Never fails to amuse and entertain.

Bob


----------



## wpshell

Haven't been around much lately due to my waning interest in the new Tivo. I just noticed this at Solid Signal. Don't know if it's old news or not. Thought I'd put it up just in case.
After all the waiting this thing looks pretty darn lame.
I think I may wait for an HR34.

http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?p=THR22&d=DIRECTV-TiVO-THR22-High-Definition-MPEG-4-HD-DVR-(THR-22)&tab=reviews


----------



## Rainy Dave

That's been a place holder on solidsignal for quite a while.

I'm looking at getting the HR34 when it's available.


----------



## BOBCAT

Anybody have any news on the release of the THR22? Thought that it would be today, 11/03/2011.
Called D* CSR retention, they knows nothing about it!
Guess this was just another false start. Wish that D* could get their act together.


----------



## Rainy Dave

Where did DirecTv announce that the rollout was 11/3?


----------



## hefe

wpshell said:


> Haven't been around much lately due to my waning interest in the new Tivo. I just noticed this at Solid Signal. Don't know if it's old news or not. Thought I'd put it up just in case.
> After all the waiting this thing looks pretty darn lame.
> I think I may wait for an HR34.
> 
> http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?p=THR22&d=DIRECTV-TiVO-THR22-High-Definition-MPEG-4-HD-DVR-(THR-22)&tab=reviews


It says "no built in ATSC tuner."

Seriously? Probably a deal breaker for me.


----------



## BOBCAT

When I talked to the D* CSR, he said that it does have the OTH built in.
He told me this when I asked if they could ship me the outboard tuner unit when I get the THR22.


----------



## Klankster

Rainy Dave said:


> Where did DirecTv announce that the rollout was 11/3?


Another rumor. I swear, there is more legitimate information about Bigfoot on the Internet than there is on the new DirecTiVo.

It's probably time to face some facts -- this unit has supposedly been on the verge of release for YEARS now. If they were serious about actually coming through with this thing, it would have been out by now. Talk about vaporware. DirecTV should be ashamed of themselves for this kind of misleading crap. And the product manager for this, if there ever was one, should be fired for total incompetence.

At least my Series 3 unit has been behaving itself and working well. I have been looking forward to the new DirecTiVo since it was announced; I wish DirecTV would take it seriously enough to actually build it.


----------



## dshinnick

I think we may just need to finally acknowledge that this just may never happen,, and make alternate plans. I would have obought one instantly.


----------



## Cudahy

It's critically important to Tivo, not so important to DirecTV.
So I assume DirecTV is dragging its feet as much as legally possible, but why isn't Tivo putting any public pressure on DirecTV? Why can't they at least get an approximate date out there?


----------



## wpshell

hefe said:


> It says "no built in ATSC tuner."
> 
> Seriously? Probably a deal breaker for me.


Since it seems to use HR22 hardware, you might be able to use an AM21.

But, based on what I have seen of this dysfunctional marriage between D* and Tivo so far, I doubt if the THR22 will ever be anything more than what you see now.

I really like the Tivo interface, but I'm not willing to forego some form of multi-room capability just to have Tivo. I think they just got this thing out door (almost) in order to meet the commitment.

I don't believe they will ever give it any more capabilities. This thing is ancient technology. Even my old and dying hacked S2's can do multi-room.

I'm done with it and I'm very disappointed in both D* and Tivo. We were strung along for THREE YEARS, and this is our reward for being patient.


----------



## TallShip

"Dysfunctional marriage " gets it about right. I think DirecTV's strategy all along has been to string us TIVO lovers along until there were only about 10 of us left, and judging by this thread they are now losing half of us. OK there may be a few more.

I also think TIVO to some extent is now living off of royaties from their patent portfolio. I think they have further impacted the fate of the new DirecTV HD TIVO by prioritizing other work at the company ahead of this effort, not putting sufficient resources on the THR22 to make it successful in a timely manner (if ever).

I have three HR10-250's and one HR20 for guests in a whole home video distribution system. One HR10 was repaired a few years ago, and since this summer now the other two have failed. I think I have waited about as long as I plan to wait. I have been with DirecTV since 1994 and jumped on board with the original standard def TIVO units (one of those is still running!). I am not feeling so loyal right now.


----------



## hefe

Yeah, I've been with DTv since '94 too, and TiVo since 2000. I don't really want to change, but it increasingly feels like I will. I guess I'm just waiting for an official product release to decide what to do.


----------



## grandeau

TallShip said:


> I am not feeling so loyal right now.


Quite the opposite. I'm feeling like DirecTV has not been very loyal to me. I've signed up for the update page, but it has gone years...YEARS...without sending an update. And every time I email DirecTV to ask them what's up, they tell me it's in the works and I should subscribe to the update page to get the most timely notifications. They tell me I'm a valued Customer, but their actions don't support that. I'd be OK with the delays, if there was just simple, courteous communication. But what they're doing is just really bad Customer Service, plain and simple.


----------



## cbessant

I hear the same thing whenever I call a customer service help desk whether it be Netflix (we appreciate you as a customer, BTW, we are really raising your rates by a lot) or DirecTv "Thank you for being a loyal customer, and staying with us as the only service we can provide is TV content and not true high-speed Internet like cable companies. And TiVo, we really weren't serious at all about."

Look, I'm loyal because I CHOOSE to be loyal. If there were choices where I live besides satellite I would have jumped out of the frying pan and taken my chances in the fire with cable. Would it be better? I have no idea other than I'd get high-speed Internet access that is faster than the 1.5Mbps DSL I can only get today and I'd lower my overall telecommunications by consolidating it all to cable. Wise idea? I don't know, I just know I'd take my chances else where if I could. And if it was not great, I'd switch again if I could. The point is, I'd rather vote with my Dollars than have no choices.

Yes, I do understand and share your frustration with companies that offer empty promises and platitudes.


----------



## hefe

And DirecTv pissed me off again this weekend. I had a receiver die, and obtained a used one. I want to swap it in and replace the dead one. I called DirecTv, and I need to get a new access card to activate the device on my account.

OK, I can deal with that, send me the card.

That will be a one-time non-refundable charge of $20.

Excuse me? For the privilege of continuing to pay monthly bills to DirecTv, for a receiver I've gone and replaced on my own, you're going to charge me $20?

Oh, and it will be going by regular mail so expect to receive it in 3-7 days. And if you don't activate it within 9 days, it will time out and you'll need to get another and be charged another $20.

Nice customer service for a 17 year customer.


----------



## snickerrrrs

I bought a used receiver (same model) from a thrift store for $5 and swapped the power supply. $5 and 5 minutes of my time. I don't want to do anything to force a new 2 year commitment with Directv. In my area we have so many choices including OTA that I have one foot out the door, just waiting to see the new HD Directivo. $80 a month for TV is kind of nuts when you think about it. Most of the programs we watch are OTA. I'd miss History channel maybe HGTV, but streaming seems like a better way to go.


PS: I fired up an old HR10-250 recently for the cost of a $20 access card but had to call Directv to stop the $10 HD service charge on my bill. Took 40 minutes on the phone to find someone that understood that the HR10-250 doesn't receive HD over satellite anymore.


----------



## hefe

snickerrrrs said:


> PS: I fired up an old HR10-250 recently for the cost of a $20 access card but had to call Directv to stop the $10 HD service charge on my bill. Took 40 minutes on the phone to find someone that understood that the HR10-250 doesn't receive HD over satellite anymore.


I had the same conversation with DTv several months back about that surcharge. They told me it was a mandatory charge. I told them it doesn't even receive and HD via their service. After a similar amount of time, they finally realized that since I owned the HR10-250 outright, not a rental, that I was entitled to not have the HD package. If I was on their equipment, I'd be required to keep it.


----------



## formulaben

Geez, hearing these stories makes one wonder why DirecTV has problem with customer retention.


----------



## bigpuma

formulaben said:


> Geez, hearing these stories makes one wonder why DirecTV has problem with customer retention.


Huh? DirecTV consistently has one of the lowest churn rates in the industry. 1.62% in the 3rd quarter of 2011. They don't have a customer retention problem.

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=198485&highlight=churn


----------



## formulaben

Maybe not overall, but from reading this forum it certainly seems so.


----------



## stevel

Eh - the people reading this forum section are a very small subset of DirecTV users, and generally predisposed against DirecTV because of their TiVo experience.


----------



## formulaben

Guilty as charged...except I am a former customer who can't quite find the will to jump back. Their customer service was pretty bad at times, but the equipment "leases" are the deal killer at the moment.


----------



## bigpuma

stevel said:


> Eh - the people reading this forum section are a very small subset of DirecTV users, and generally predisposed against DirecTV because of their TiVo experience.


It's funny because really nothing has changed with DirecTV's customer service in the last 10 years but according to this forum DirecTV went from having the best customer service when they had direcTivos to the worst when they switched to DirecTV DVRs and dumped TiVo.


----------



## formulaben

bigpuma said:


> *It's funny because really nothing has changed with DirecTV's customer service in the last 10 years* but according to this forum DirecTV went from having the best customer service when they had direcTivos to the worst when they switched to DirecTV DVRs and dumped TiVo.


I suppose you are correct, but I consider lease terms to fall under the customer service area. In that sense, the loss of Tivo really didn't change my opinion of DirecTV's customer service, but the way they treat the customers "ownership" of the hardware in recent years certainly did! I am not the diehard Tivo fanatic I used to be, as the DirecTV DVRs are certainly capable, but DirecTV's contract terms are simply unacceptable for me.

Yes, the loss of Tivo was upsetting, just as the 'HD Lite' saga certainly didn't help, or knowing I am paying for HD but my buddy at Dish is not...but the lease terms made my decision easy; it simply won't happen. Apart from the nickel & diming as previously mentioned, the leasing issue is my primary gripe.


----------



## fasTLane

It is so comforting to know there are other options out there.


----------



## parzec

bigpuma said:


> Huh? DirecTV consistently has one of the lowest churn rates in the industry. 1.62% in the 3rd quarter of 2011. They don't have a customer retention problem.
> 
> http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=198485&highlight=churn


True, but i think it is more a reflection of the exorbitant early termination fees than overall customer satisfaction.


----------



## bigpuma

formulaben said:


> I suppose you are correct, but I consider lease terms to fall under the customer service area. In that sense, the loss of Tivo really didn't change my opinion of DirecTV's customer service, but the way they treat the customers "ownership" of the hardware in recent years certainly did! I am not the diehard Tivo fanatic I used to be, as the DirecTV DVRs are certainly capable, but DirecTV's contract terms are simply unacceptable for me.
> 
> Yes, the loss of Tivo was upsetting, just as the 'HD Lite' saga certainly didn't help, or knowing I am paying for HD but my buddy at Dish is not...but the lease terms made my decision easy; it simply won't happen. Apart from the nickel & diming as previously mentioned, the leasing issue is my primary gripe.


I can kind of understand the concern about forced leasing but honestly I don't see how it has hurt anyone. I paid $850 for an HR10-250 which is now basically a useless door stop. What good does it do me to own it. At the same time DirecTV gave me 2 free HR2x's when they switched to Mpeg-4 which were both leased plus I paid $199 for another one. I guess I am not sure why I care if it is owned or not.


----------



## bigpuma

parzec said:


> True, but i think it is more a reflection of the exorbitant early termination fees than overall customer satisfaction.


Really, TiVo has been gone now since 2006 and you think that people are just staying because of the exorbitant fees? They can leave for free after 2 years.


----------



## formulaben

bigpuma said:


> I can kind of understand the concern about forced leasing but honestly I don't see how it has hurt anyone. I paid $850 for an HR10-250 which is now basically a useless door stop. What good does it do me to own it. *At the same time DirecTV gave me 2 free HR2x's when they switched to Mpeg-4 which were both leased* plus I paid $199 for another one. I guess I am not sure why I care if it is owned or not.


Well, that's quite different from the last offer I had, which was a slightly (?) subsidized box, a 2 year commitment, plus the lease terms. So in my mind, I was pretty much paying for the DVR (just like when you get a new phone) but then I couldn't keep it! If they give it to me for free then I don't care if it is leased, then I just have to deal with the 2 year commitment, which I am not fond of, but my prior offer of being stuck with all three (pay for box, 2 year commit, and lease) was highway robbery, IMHO.

As far as ownership, the only concern I had was hard drive upgrading, and if I do not "own" it, I am far less likely to do it, unlike now, which I have done twice with my current Tivo.


----------



## BrettStah

Yeah, that's a real stretch... I was perfectly happy with my DirecTivos, up to and including the HD model - but the MPEG-4 channels started coming, and I saw the writing on the wall. I was pleasantly surprised by the HR-20 that I got, and wound up replacing all DirecTivos with HR-2x models over a period of about a year. I miss the Tivo List Guide, but otherwise very few issues/complaints. The limit on the number of season passes sucks, but with multiple HR-2x DVRs it hasn't really been a huge problem - basically it forces me to prune my season pass manager about once a year to delete cancelled shows.


----------



## BrettStah

formulaben said:


> Well, that's quite different from the last offer I had, which was a slightly (?) subsidized box, a 2 year commitment, plus the lease terms. So in my mind, I was pretty much paying for the DVR (just like when you get a new phone) but then I couldn't keep it! If they give it to me for free then I don't care if it is leased, then I just have to deal with the 2 year commitment, which I am not fond of, but my prior offer of being stuck with all three (pay for box, 2 year commit, and lease) was highway robbery, IMHO.
> 
> As far as ownership, the only concern I had was hard drive upgrading, and if I do not "own" it, I am far less likely to do it, unlike now, which I have done twice with my current Tivo.


You can just plug in an esata external drive and the HR-2x DVRs will automatically use it (it will automatically install/configure/format/etc. the drive, and start using it). I recommend doing that early on in your use of the DVR though, because it doesn't copy over anything from the internal drive at all - so you need to recreate your season passes, and you don't have access to any recordings on the internal drive at all. If you boot back up without the external drive, it will resume booting to and using the external drive again though.


----------



## formulaben

BrettStah said:


> Yeah, that's a real stretch... I was perfectly happy with my DirecTivos, up to and including the HD model - but the MPEG-4 channels started coming, and I saw the writing on the wall. I was pleasantly surprised by the HR-20 that I got, and wound up replacing all DirecTivos with HR-2x models over a period of about a year. I miss the Tivo List Guide, but otherwise very few issues/complaints. *The limit on the number of season passes sucks, but with multiple HR-2x DVRs it hasn't really been a huge problem *- basically it forces me to prune my season pass manager about once a year to delete cancelled shows.


What is the limit?


----------



## stevel

formulaben said:


> What is the limit?


50 on the HR2x.


----------



## innocentfreak

stevel said:


> 50 on the HR2x.


and 100 on the 5 tuner box, the HR34 or whatever it is called.


----------



## Rainy Dave

Yeah...*owning* my DirecTiVo boxes did me a lot of good. When I switched over to the HRxx boxes they were door stops so I took them in for recycling.

If I leave DirecTv what use would I have for DVRs that only work with their service?


----------



## formulaben

If you own it you can sell it, just like I did with my first 2 DirecTivos...


----------



## dcstager

As soon as the free NFL Sunday Ticket promotion is over, they will start selling it. That's just my prediction. I know nothing. Still want one though.


----------



## Matt L

4 of my HR2x are owned one is leased. I'd have no issue popping open the leased one and dropping in a new hard drive if I wanted. I would just stick the original hard drive in a bag and store it somewhere in the event that I needed to return the box. I do'nt see any advantage to owned vs. leased. If you can get a good deal on a new install go leased.

The only reason I own 4 is that I was cheaper to pick them up on ebay for $50-$80 each rather than paying the $199 to D. And yes, they are listed on my account as owned, and I have the protection plan and if one is replaced it is replaced with an owned box...


----------



## sjberra

parzec said:


> True, but i think it is more a reflection of the exorbitant early termination fees than overall customer satisfaction.


don't find their fees different then any other service type provider - you seen the etf for smartphones for the various carriers and how they decrease? In some cases if you cancel at 23 months you still owe close to 100.00 for the etf


----------



## innocentfreak

According to the press release from TiVo today about their earnings, per DirecTV the DirecTiVo will be in limited markets in December for testing and an early rollout in 2012.


----------



## Rainy Dave

I'll believe it when I can order one from DirecTv.com


----------



## litzdog911

innocentfreak said:


> According to the press release from TiVo today about their earnings, per DirecTV the DirecTiVo will be in limited markets in December for testing and an early rollout in 2012.


Yet one more prognostication in a long line of prognostications


----------



## nrc

They've never said anything this specific or imminent.

The "select major markets" aspect is interesting. My guess is that TiVo hit all their requirementsand now DTV is forced to do some kind of roll-out by the end of the year to hit some kind of year-end deadline.



> Well, in terms of how we will be positioned, just to be clear at the outset, they will be initiating their launch in a number of major select markets in December and then early next year, roll out the product nationally. DIRECTV has obligations to nationally market us, and those obligations are substantial. So it is something that will be marketed in addition to their homegrown platform. We don't bear those marketing costs. They obviously know who the DIRECTV TiVo current customers are, and they know people who have previously had TiVo and have the product for a long time and presumably were satisfied customers. So they know both of those basis to direct their marketing to. I would expect some of their initial marketing will be focused on those very groups as it then rolls out more broadly to all DIRECTV customers.


----------



## dswallow

So it's looking like the thread title may actually turn out to be true.

Thankfully the OP didn't put the year in it.


----------



## unitron

litzdog911 said:


> Yet one more prognostication in a long line of prognostications


I hereby prognosticate the occurrence of further prognostication.


----------



## Cudahy

Will the people who get in December be sworn to secrecy? It's in Tivo's interest for it to leak out.


----------



## davezatz

Cudahy said:


> Will the people who get in December be sworn to secrecy? It's in Tivo's interest for it to leak out.


Here's a DirecTV TiVo training video:
http://www.viddler.com/engadget/videos/3092/


----------



## Callindril

Damn...that video sez no MRV between multiple new DTivos....that sucks...might have to rethink my whole scheme now...


----------



## ncted

Callindril said:


> Damn...that video sez no MRV between multiple new DTivos....that sucks...might have to rethink my whole scheme now...


No DirecTV MRV, but I wonder if it is possible to move recordings between DTivos, like can be done on the standalone units.

-Ted


----------



## RMBittner

ncted said:


> No DirecTV MRV, but I wonder if it is possible to move recordings between DTivos, like can be done on the standalone units.
> 
> -Ted


My guess -- and I have no insider info whatsoever -- is that the answer's no. Everything I've read suggests that it will be a completely discrete box.

Our solution will be to make the DTiVo our primary TV room DVR, along with an additional DTV HD DVR -- with MRV -- as the secondary DVR, so we'll be able to share programming with a second DTV HD DVR and an HD receiver. (So that's one room with both a DTiVo and a non-TiVo HDDVR, a second room with an HD DVR, and a third with just an HD receiver -- with all of the DirecTV units connected for MRV.)

But, of course, this kind of setup may not be the kind of solution you're looking for. I think it'll do the trick for us, though.

Bob


----------



## 230

I've been waiting for the new tivo since it was announced. The lack of MRV was a bummer, but I was still on the bandwagon. I told myself that I use 1 of my 2 DVRs most of the time, it has a 1.5TB external drive, and I rarely have scheduling conflicts.

Then I experienced the new DirecTv HD GUI. Tivo, you're too late! My last reason for disliking the DirecTv box just jumped off your bandwagon.

The new GUI looks and performs beautifully.


----------



## RMBittner

EJ said:


> My last reason for disliking the DirecTv box just jumped off your bandwagon. The new GUI looks and performs beautifully.


If you're happy with your current DirecTV hardware, that's terrific. You're not the target market for this unit. I don't expect _any_ current DirecTV subscribers to suddenly drop their current setup in favor of a TiVo-based unit.

IMO, this is simply one more option for people who love the TiVo interface and want to carry that over when they switch from cable to satellite service. I don't think they'll sell millions; it's just one more option for serving a currently untapped market.

Bob


----------



## Adam1115

RMBittner said:


> If you're happy with your current DirecTV hardware, that's terrific. You're not the target market for this unit. I don't expect _any_ current DirecTV subscribers to suddenly drop their current setup in favor of a TiVo-based unit.
> 
> IMO, this is simply one more option for people who love the TiVo interface and want to carry that over when they switch from cable to satellite service. I don't think they'll sell millions; it's just one more option for serving a currently untapped market.
> 
> Bob


The problem is that most of us were HUGE TiVo fans, but because of the delays and reports of a featureless TiVo, we moved to DirecTV hardware or cancelled service for Cable. Now that we're happy we're not going to switch.

The point is, they lost most of their loyal TiVo following. This box isn't going to recover any of their clients they risked losing from dropping TiVo, because it's been like 6 YEARS! It's too late!


----------



## tunarollz

gotta love how the assumption is the delay's TiVo's fault...


----------



## bigpuma

tunarollz said:


> gotta love how the assumption is the delay's TiVo's fault...


Why wouldn't you assume that. It's the same scenario that TiVO had with their Comcast box but either way does it really matter.


----------



## tunarollz

because the assumption is based on pure speculation. As much of the rants here are.


----------



## sjberra

tunarollz said:


> because the assumption is based on pure speculation. As much of the rants here are.


same as your statment that is also based on speculation. Given tivo's track record on other projects it is a pretty decent suspicion as to exactly where the delay occurred.

Botto line - to little, to late


----------



## tunarollz

Well you'd be wrong to suspect that in this case.

And it's "too" not "to"...


----------



## Wil

tunarollz said:


> And it's "too" not "to"...


You're nitpicking. Keep your eye on the botto line.


----------



## tgibbs

davezatz said:


> Here's a DirecTV TiVo training video:
> http://www.viddler.com/engadget/videos/3092/


From the back panel, it appears to be satellite only, not sat + OTA like the 10-250.


----------



## BrettStah

tgibbs said:


> From the back panel, it appears to be satellite only, not sat + OTA like the 10-250.


I just watched the video... That is exactly what I wanted when the MPEG-4 channels started rolling out, and we realized that we would never get any more HD channels on our HR10-250. Now I'm all set with HR2x DVRs, and will likely add an HR34 when they become available.


----------



## puffdaddy

The belief is that it will support ATSC via USB (AM21).


Code:


Atsc Usb Input


----------



## nrc

sjberra said:


> same as your statment that is also based on speculation. Given tivo's track record on other projects it is a pretty decent suspicion as to exactly where the delay occurred.


TiVo's track record is that they have released on time when they have a partner that is willing and supportive. TiVo has shipped products for over seven different cable providers since the DirecTV deal was announced. That includes a DVR with a full HD UI on Motorola hardware and a quad tuner DVR.

What we know about "blame" for the DirecTV TiVo product is that DirecTV specified an outdated hardware platform and an SD UI with limited functionality. The rest is anyone's guess.


----------



## fasTLane

nrc said:


> What we know about "blame" for the DirecTV TiVo product is that DirecTV specified an outdated hardware platform and an SD UI with limited functionality. The rest is anyone's guess.


There is no need for blame in that parallel universe where Mister Turdoch never sabotages the Directv/Tivo partnership.


----------



## sbiller

nrc said:


> TiVo's track record is that they have released on time when they have a partner that is willing and supportive. TiVo has shipped products for over seven different cable providers since the DirecTV deal was announced. That includes a DVR with a full HD UI on Motorola hardware and a quad tuner DVR.
> 
> What we know about "blame" for the DirecTV TiVo product is that DirecTV specified an outdated hardware platform and an SD UI with limited functionality. The rest is anyone's guess.


+1 :up:


----------



## stevel

At the time this whole thing started, the platform was current (and would be so for two more years), as was the UI. We don't know exactly what was specified.


----------



## jimluschen

Wil said:


> You're nitpicking. Keep your eye on the botto line.


what's a "botto line"?


----------



## Lord Vader

Callindril said:


> Damn...that video sez no MRV between multiple new DTivos....that sucks...might have to rethink my whole scheme now...





ncted said:


> No DirecTV MRV, but I wonder if it is possible to move recordings between DTivos, like can be done on the standalone units.
> 
> -Ted





RMBittner said:


> My guess -- and I have no insider info whatsoever -- is that the answer's no. Everything I've read suggests that it will be a completely discrete box.
> 
> Our solution will be to make the DTiVo our primary TV room DVR, along with an additional DTV HD DVR -- with MRV -- as the secondary DVR, so we'll be able to share programming with a second DTV HD DVR and an HD receiver. (So that's one room with both a DTiVo and a non-TiVo HDDVR, a second room with an HD DVR, and a third with just an HD receiver -- with all of the DirecTV units connected for MRV.)
> 
> But, of course, this kind of setup may not be the kind of solution you're looking for. I think it'll do the trick for us, though.
> 
> Bob


A longtime TIVO fan and DirecTV customer here--speaking from first hand experience, I would bet money on the fact that you folks will not like the new unit. There is so much that is NOT on this box that is on the current DirecTV HD DVRs. It's pretty much a DirecTV unit with the TIVO name, and that's about it. It's really nothing like the old DirecTV/TIVO Series 1 & Series 2 units.



RMBittner said:


> If you're happy with your current DirecTV hardware, that's terrific. You're not the target market for this unit. I don't expect _any_ current DirecTV subscribers to suddenly drop their current setup in favor of a TiVo-based unit.


They won't when they see this box and ask, "Is that it???"



> IMO, this is simply one more option for people who love the TiVo interface and want to carry that over when they switch from cable to satellite service. I don't think they'll sell millions; it's just one more option for serving a currently untapped market.
> 
> Bob


It's basically for people who just _*have *_to have something with the word "TIVO" on it.


----------



## nrc

Jesse11 said:


> In my case I'm pretty happy with the DirecTV DVR's and wouldn't switch even if the DTivo was free.


Why would someone who feels that way even bother to visit this forum?


----------



## Wil

nrc said:


> Why would someone who feels that way even bother to visit this forum?


It's that nagging feeling that, even though you're right, your mind is made up, you've committed, you may have made a mistake. So you sneak a look back over your shoulder every time you hear a noise. And keep saying, to anyone who will listen, "I was right, I was right."

I admit, with some embarrassment, I've been there.


----------



## unitron

nrc said:


> Why would someone who feels that way even bother to visit this forum?


In Jesse11's case, apparently to post in multiple threads exact wording lifted from previous posts by others.

I suspect the end aim is some sort of spam or fraud.


----------



## fasTLane

nrc said:


> Why would someone who feels that way even bother to visit this forum?


I think we all know why.


----------



## Wil

fasTLane said:


> I think we all know why.


I don't know how you people are getting away with this. In my day you would be put on a short vacation for this kind of talk.

In any case I am trying to believe the best of my fellow man and that there is no such motivation here.


----------



## Adam1115

nrc said:


> Why would someone who feels that way even bother to visit this forum?


Because people like to follow new technologies even if they don't plan to utilize them?

And, people have been waiting for a long time for the new DirecTiVo and even though they've given up, their still curious how it's going to turn out?

And, because people are TiVo fans and wish this device was all it should've been?


----------



## unitron

What part of "Jesse11 was cutting and pasting from earlier posts by real TCF members" are y'all not understanding?


----------



## sjberra

nrc said:


> TiVo's track record is that they have released on time when they have a partner that is willing and supportive. TiVo has shipped products for over seven different cable providers since the DirecTV deal was announced. That includes a DVR with a full HD UI on Motorola hardware and a quad tuner DVR.
> 
> What we know about "blame" for the DirecTV TiVo product is that DirecTV specified an outdated hardware platform and an SD UI with limited functionality. The rest is anyone's guess.


/rofl we are talking about the same company aren't we.

Sorry the hardware was not "outdated" when the agreement was entered into. How many of theose "seven different cable companies" shipped on schedule? Comcast anyone?

You are getting a HR10-250 with Mpeg4, not worth it anymore, wasn't worth it 3 years ago.

Yes i still have a hr10-250 active, it is in the garage hooked up to a 19 inch crt tv for when I am working on restoring the Norton 750, it works - to a point


----------



## Wil

sjberra said:


> You are getting a HR10-250 with Mpeg4, not worth it anymore


I would gladly take an HR10-250 with Mpeg4.

That's all most of us wanted at the time when Murdoch pulled the plug. With incremental improvements since then it would likely have been quite a machine by now. Better OTA tuners, a little faster processing, "official" MRV and Tivo-to-go as opposed to the easy hack. Still, even now I'd be happy if we could just get back to where we were.

Unfortunately we're not even going to be getting an HR10-250, looks like.


----------



## BrettStah

Wil said:


> I would gladly take an HR10-250 with Mpeg4.
> 
> That's all most of us wanted at the time when Murdoch pulled the plug. With incremental improvements since then it would likely have been quite a machine by now. Better OTA tuners, a little faster processing, "official" MRV and Tivo-to-go as opposed to the easy hack. Still, even now I'd be happy if we could just get back to where we were.
> 
> Unfortunately we're not even going to be getting an HR10-250, looks like.


It looks like its functionality will basically be that of an MPEG-4 HR10-250. What is it missing?


----------



## Wil

BrettStah said:


> It looks like its functionality will basically be that of an MPEG-4 HR10-250. What is it missing?


Easy hackability to activate MRV and Tivo-to-go.


----------



## Lord Vader

Indeed. It won't be hackable like the traditional TIVOs.


----------



## BrettStah

Wil said:


> Easy hackability to activate MRV and Tivo-to-go.


Ah.... I never did that with mine.


----------



## jimluschen

Eureka!!! An Announcement! It is finally here (delete the spaces below):

http: // ww w. directv. com/DT VA PP/ content/t ech nol ogy/tivo_receiver


----------



## hefe

Cross-posted from the "It's Here" thread:

http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/content/technology/tivo_receiver



> Please note: The following DIRECTV features are not available with the TiVo HD DVR: Whole-Home DVR service, DIRECTV iPad App remote control and live TV streaming functionality, DIRECTV CINEMA (satellite downloads), YouTube on TV, 3D, and GameSearch.


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## BOBCAT

Just ordered my THR-22 from D*.
The installer will be here on the 13th.
Sense it was a new equipment order, had to commit to another 24 months of service which it no big deal as I'm not going anywhere.
I have lifetime DVR service so the THR-22 is covered under that. Just had to pay for the additional receiver which was $6. 
Will post again with some details about it after it arrives.


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## Adam1115

Still in shock over no kidzone, it's the number one feature I miss about TiVo.


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## Lord Vader

BOBCAT said:


> Just ordered my THR-22 from D*.
> 
> I have lifetime DVR service so the THR-22 is covered under that. Just had to pay for the additional receiver which was $6.


I'd be sure to get that in writing from DirecTV, because according to them, there is a $5/month TIVO fee for this receiver, regardless of whether you pay any other monthly fees or have "lifetime" DVR service.

They have stated that there is a monthly DVR fee and a monthly TIVO fee, the latter applying to this receiver alone and in addition to any other fees.


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## Cudahy

Just called, my new HDTivo will be installed noon tommorow!
The person I talked to didn't even realize it was available till after I called.
Siince I already have DirecTV there was only an extra 5 dollar a month fee.


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## wluebke

Weeee, Weeee, Weeee! (All the way home)

Out of nowhere I receive an email from DTV today that the long awaited Tivo HD DVR is available to order in the Phoenix market.

Forever the optimist, I stubbornly kept alive two 10-250 receivers for this day. A quick call to retention reminding them of the deal I had in place to replace both of my 10-250's with new HD Tivo units "the day" they became available landed me the ... "we never promised you that".

Allow me to retort: CANCEL MY SERVICE! (Those are the magic words)

In reality I was only giving DTV till the end of 2011 to produce the HD Tivo units, so canceling my service was not an empty threat. I actually made them start the process. Figuring I was serious they offered 1 free HD Tivo. No go! I was promised 2 free Tivo units. I reminded them that it was DTV who rendered my 10-250's obsolete after spending $1100 to acquire them. They countered with a $300 credit. No! Finally they offered $300 towards the purchase of 2 THR22's and $20 a month for 1 year. Final offer, yes final offer! I caved in and accepted as we are talking financial semantics at this point. 

Looks like DTV's bottom line is $50 for each new HD Tivo receiver plus shipping, tax and 2 year commitment. My grand total up front cost was $139 for both receivers. 

Best of luck with your negotiations!


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## SpacemanSpiff

I had several D* installers at my work today putting in sat tv to replace local cable. I mentioned the new TiVo unit and they were like um that doesn't exist. 

Maybe I'm not in one of the top 10 markets. But ya know, they should know what's coming soon to our area.


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## Whistlingleaf

I haven't logged into this forum in 3 years, but I regularly have checked this thread and today 

OH 

MY 

GOD 

!!!

These are the markets listed in the email:


The TiVo HD DVR from
DIRECTV is available today
in these ten markets:

· Chicago, IL
· Denver, CO
· Los Angeles, CA
· New York, NY
· Philadelphia, PA
· Phoenix, AZ
· Sacramento, CA
· San Francisco, CA
· Seattle, WA
· Washington, D.C.

Available nationwide in early 2012

I can't believe TIVO finally sent out any email at all regarding the TIVO... in all these years since I signed up with them to receive info I never got a thing til today ... ridiculous IMO

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FYI the THR22 Model can record ~400 hours of SD (~100 hours of HD)

Also for those who do not have HD already they will hit you with a 10$ HD charge and a 5$ Tivo charge along with the 7$ DTV DVR Service Monthly. So 22$/month in extra charges which is ridiculous IMO.

I was nice and told the lady money was tight and she offered to lower the Tivo from 199 to 150 and give me 10$ off for 6 months.

Oh and the unit is leased ... 200$ for a leased unit ... considering we've had the same owned Tivo unit since 1997 or so making it a leased is a slap in the face.

Last edit was to fix Steves point that the email was from TIVO not DTV.


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## stevel

The email I got was from TiVo, not DirecTV.


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## BOBCAT

wluebke,
Are you sure that they will ship you the THR22's?
I have been told by D* time and time again that they could not specify the model of DVR as a replacement if I ordered one directly from them. I wanted an HR24 and time and time again they told me the only way I could get it was to have them send an installer out with it. If I had them ship one from the warehouse, I could get most any model such as a HR20 and most likely it would be a refurbished unit. I tried many times to get a HR24 including going to retention and telling them that I was going to go to cable or Dish. They insisted that they could only get me the unit that I wanted by having their installer deliver it, and it would cost me the $49 install fee.
They also said that I could just go to a outside dealer and buy the unit that I wanted.
Hope you get the THR22, and not some other DVR. 
You might give them a call back and verify what they are going to send you.
Good luck.


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## stevel

In the case of the THR22, you can specify that because there is an extra charge for it and it is not interchangeable with the HR2x models.


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## BOBCAT

Thanks Steve.
When I ordered my THR22, they said that an installer had to bring it out.
Will call them tomorrow and try to get them to ship it to me and cancel the installer visit.


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## Whistlingleaf

Anyone have some info the the THR22 aside from DTV's webpage ? (web links?)

And the DTV rep definitely told me it would be the THR22.

Also since it is being leased - what happens if it breaks ? I've gone through 3 harddrives in 13-14 years or so and always gotten new ones off Ebay. 

I can't get over how much they want for a leased unit - I wonder if it's possible to buy the unit ?

Why do they charge a DTV DVR Service fee AND a TIVO fee ? Isn't kinda ridiculous to have 2 fees for 1 thing ?


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## wluebke

It's like going home to bang the prom queen!

Winner winner chicken dinner!

HD Tivo DVR is here!

Personally I don't care if Ronald McDonald delivers the HD Tivo's!

Just as long as they arrive!

I'm stoked, and if you're not ... who cares!

Not only that but the Steelers just won Thursday night football!

So there! 

(Even though I had to watch it in "Low D") .......... not for long however ..................


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## litzdog911

Whistlingleaf said:


> Anyone have some info the the THR22 aside from DTV's webpage ? (web links?)
> 
> And the DTV rep definitely told me it would be the THR22.
> 
> Also since it is being leased - what happens if it breaks ? I've gone through 3 harddrives in 13-14 years or so and always gotten new ones off Ebay.
> 
> I can't get over how much they want for a leased unit - I wonder if it's possible to buy the unit ?
> 
> Why do they charge a DTV DVR Service fee AND a TIVO fee ? Isn't kinda ridiculous to have 2 fees for 1 thing ?


1. http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.as...O-THR22-High-Definition-MPEG-4-HD-DVR-(THR-22)

2. If it breaks they'll send you a replacement. They're free if you have DirecTV's Equipment Protection Plan. Otherwise ~$20 for shipping.

3. I doubt you'll find them as "owned". But why do that? You would pay substantially more up front and have no replacement protection beyond the 90-day warranty.

4. Because that's the agreement DirecTV has with Tivo.


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## CuriousMark

litzdog911 said:


> Because that's the agreement DirecTV has with Tivo.


Nowhere in the posted redacted contract language does it say this. You are speculating or relying on posts of others who were speculating.

The agreement does require DirecTV to pay a fee to TiVo for each DVR. The old agreement for the HR10's also had a fee requirement, but the amount in the older agreement was lower (under $1 per box per month). In the case of the HR10's DirecTV did not pass the cost of the fee along to the subscriber. With the new DirecTV TiVo they are passing it along (and a bit more, apparently). Analysts are currently estimating the fee to be in the $2 to $3 per month range, but even they are guessing based on interpreting TiVo's financial statements.


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## davezatz

CuriousMark said:


> Analysts are currently estimating the fee to be in the $2 to $3 per month range, but even they are guessing based on interpreting TiVo's financial statements.


I also believe higher subscription commissions, versus the prior relationship/deal, were mentioned in a quarterly call.


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## wluebke

I need 5 posts to add links.


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## wluebke

Countdown.


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## wluebke

You know I started thinking about the how everyone is saying the THR 22 is stunted from about 2 years ago software-wise. Personally I will be completely happy with the "classic" Tivo interface and the new HD capability. I just love the Tivo interface compared to my HR20 DVR which continues to be clunky in comparison ... no matter how "used to it" I have become.

However according to a Weaknees blog, hardware-wise there is no reason the TRH 22 could not be software upgraded to include some of the newer tricks.

http://www.wkblog.com/tivo/2011/12/the-directv-tivo-is-finally-out-sort-of/

"On the minus side, no Whole Home DVR (also called Multi-Room Viewing, or MRV), no NOMAD or iPad support, no 3D, and some other issues. Now, this unit is capable, hardware-wise, of these options, so there's a chance that TiVo and DIRECTV will update the software to enable these features over time. But, given the slow pace of software development on this project thus far, we aren't holding our breath."

One hardware trick the THR 22 currently has up its sleeve ... onboard OTA tuner. (Not confirmed but DTV states - 1 RF internal antenna)
http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/content/technology/tivo_receiver

I currently use the the OTA tuner to watch sports with my 10-250, mainly because this is the only HD programming I left available. However back in the day I discovered the OTA HD picture is superior to the DTV HD when I use my projector and 120" screen. I plan to continue to use this capability even after my THR 22's arrive.

I am sure there are at least a couple of new software tricks the THR 22 can perform out of the box. I will give an update as soon as I get my hands on the actual units.


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## Cudahy

The installer will be here in the next 2 hours.


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## litzdog911

wluebke said:


> You know I started thinking about the how everyone is saying the THR 23 is stunted from about 2 years ago software-wise. ....
> 
> One hardware trick the THR 23 currently has up its sleeve ... onboard OTA tuner. (Not confirmed but DTV states - 1 RF internal antenna)
> http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/content/technology/tivo_receiver
> 
> .....


There is no "THR23". It's the THR22, because it's built on the HR22 hardware platform.

There is no built-in off-air tuner. The THR22 supports the AM21 USB-based Off-Air Tuner Accessory.


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## lamontcranston

Litzdog is, of course, right. The internal RF antenna refers to the ability to use an RF remote.


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## Lord Vader

litzdog911 said:


> There is no "THR23". It's the THR22, because it's built on the HR22 hardware platform.


Let's just hope it's faster and better than the HR22, because the HR22 was the single *worst *of all the HR2X series DVRs--slow as molasses in January!


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## litzdog911

Lord Vader said:


> Let's just hope it's faster and better than the HR22, because the HR22 was the single *worst *of all the HR2X series DVRs--slow as molasses in January!


If only it existed


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## SpacemanSpiff

So the new HD DTiVo comes out this year. Duke Nuke'em Forever comes out this year.

Maybe the Maya were off by a year.


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## nrc

Does this mean that those who have been pushing away their plate of crow can finally dig in?


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## wluebke

http://hr20.dbstalk.com/docs/Tivo First Look.pdf
Nice initial look at the new DTV TIVO DVR.

However I don't understand why all "the experts" are so pessimistic about future software updates for the THR22. All us DTV Tivo users will now be adding $5 a month to the TIVO coffers. Dribbling out an occasional update should not be a problem ... that is unless the world does end next year with the Mayan calendar!

No word from DTV or tracking number from Fed Ex as to when my THR22's are to arrive. After they arrive and I have anything other to add to the above review I will post it here.

(Already purchased my AM21N from Amazon for over the air HD programming.
Thanks for the clarification.)


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## wluebke

My pair of THR22-100's arrived on Monday, they where shipped next day air via Fed EX on Friday. Nice! (I ordered on Thursday)

Straight forward install process, hooked to my network via ethernet and the boxes activated itself. No phone call required. (Just needed the order number from my account on DTV.com.) 

There are indeed many new features to explore, obviously HD programing being the biggy! I see what DTV/TIVO was after, familiar interface with modern functionality ... but not overwhelming.

I myself have no need for more features, I guess whole house DVR would be nice. I am confident some newer features will be added via a software update in the near future. No doubt I was the target audiance for the THR22-100.

The interface is lightning fast except for channel changing, I dropped from 2 seconds with 10-250, to 3 seconds with THR22. No big deal. The new Tivo peanut remote control is also more functional and even more user friendly. The DTV DVR remote requires two hands and feels like an absolute clunker in comparison. (Yes, I have owned both for years so don't even go there.) 

So am I am fanboy for the new THR22-100 ... yea you could say that!
Blend that with DTV programming and ... well you get the picture!

Like they say ... you have to get DTV Tivo ... to "get" DTV Tivo.


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## Lord Vader

wluebke said:


> I am confident some newer features will be added via a software update in the near future.


DirecTV is not planning any software updates anytime in the near future.


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## TonyTheTiger

Lord Vader said:


> DirecTV is not planning any software updates anytime in the near future.


Maybe not, but as they would probably come from TiVo, this is a moot point!


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## Lord Vader

No, they would come from DirecTV, who controls any and all software updates to this box and its HR DVRs.


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## sbiller

Whistlingleaf said:


> Anyone have some info the the THR22 aside from DTV's webpage ? (web links?)
> 
> And the DTV rep definitely told me it would be the THR22.
> 
> Also since it is being leased - what happens if it breaks ? I've gone through 3 harddrives in 13-14 years or so and always gotten new ones off Ebay.
> 
> I can't get over how much they want for a leased unit - I wonder if it's possible to buy the unit ?
> 
> Why do they charge a DTV DVR Service fee AND a TIVO fee ? Isn't kinda ridiculous to have 2 fees for 1 thing ?


http://www.dbstalk.com/forumdisplay.php?f=194


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## sbiller

Lord Vader said:


> No, they would come from DirecTV, who controls any and all software updates to this box and its HR DVRs.


They've already deployed one software patch to the new boxes.


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## litzdog911

I think it's a bit early to debate whether or not there will new features added to the new Tivo. I think a lot will depend on its sales success.


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## nrc

They way the deal is structured, DirecTV can use part of the money they're required to pay TiVo as credit it toward fixes and updates. So minor updates cost them nothing.


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## sjberra

sbiller said:


> They've already deployed one software patch to the new boxes.


A patch does ot equate to the possiblity of new features being added, MS is still patching windows XP but they won;t add new functionality to it.


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## sbiller

A portion of the $5/mo fee is reserved for software updates and upgrades. I wouldn't be surprised to see a few new features added but I think it would be dependent on the number of subscribers signing on to the new box.


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## TonyTheTiger

Lord Vader said:


> No, they would come from DirecTV, who controls any and all software updates to this box and its HR DVRs.


They may be sent by D* to the boxes, but I'm sure it would be the TiVo techs working on the update (with input on features from D*).


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## richierich

nrc said:


> Why would someone who feels that way even bother to visit this forum?


To Tell The Truth!!!

No 3D, No MRV (Whole Home DVR Service), etc.

Here from DBSTALK.COM are a few of the missing Features on the THR22 that you will find on an HR2X DIRECTV DVR.

What isn't supported:
TVApps
Youtube
Netflix
Pandora
3D
GameSearch
DIRECTV2PC
Nomad
Whole-Home
TiVo KidZone
Picture-in-Graphics (PIG)
Front-panel dimming
DIRECTV App for iPad


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## Roderigo

richierich said:


> Here from DBSTALK.COM are a few of the missing Features on the THR22 that you will find on an HR2X DIRECTV DVR.


Before you copy/paste from someone else's post from DBSTALK.com, please make sure you understand what you're copying. This list is NOT "missing Features on the THR22 that you will find on an HR2X DIRECTV DVR" This list contains some features that fall into that category, but also contains some features that are only available on tivo's retail boxes. So, it's important for people to know they're missing, but they're features that are missing on any DIRECTV product (so, irrelevant for the comparison of the THR22 to the HR2X).

Those features are: 
Netflix
Pandora
TiVo KidZone

For Front Panel dimming, the TiVo box does have front panel dimming, but does *not* have the ability to turn *off* the front panel. And, I don't see a way to do this from the HR2X UI. There's only an undocumented key combination for this (I'm not an expert here, so would be happy to learn I missed a setting).


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## stevel

On the HR2x, press the left and right ring buttons simultaneously. Each press will dim the lights more and o. The third, I think, they will go out. This does not work on the THR22.


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## Adam1115

Every DirecTiVo series2 and newer had KidZone. It is a core feature of the TiVo. The fact that KidZone isn't on the HR2x is irrelevant, it would be like if it were missing suggestions.

It's the single most missed feature in our family from the TiVo.


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## SullyND

Adam1115 said:


> Every DirecTiVo series2 and newer had KidZone.


Directivo series 2 "and newer"? What's "newer"?

Even the latest retail TiVos do not offer Kidzone. (in their default interface).


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## richierich

Lord Vader said:


> Let's just hope it's faster and better than the HR22, because the HR22 was the single *worst *of all the HR2X series DVRs--slow as molasses in January!


But with the Latest & Greatest New Directv Software Download (0X57B) and the New HDGUI Software your HR2X DVRs will have a much Faster Guide, Channel Changing, etc.


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## Adam1115

SullyND said:


> Directivo series 2 "and newer"? What's "newer"?
> 
> Even the latest retail TiVos do not offer Kidzone. (in their default interface).


HR10-250, Series3, Tivo HD, TiVo Premiere.

Sure they do. The TiVo premiere has kidzone. What do you mean by 'in their default interface'? So what, Kidzone isn't turned on by default either. You can turn it on.


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## SullyND

Adam1115 said:


> HR10-250, Series3, Tivo HD, TiVo Premiere.


Only one of those is a DirecTiVo.


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## SullyND

Adam1115 said:


> The TiVo premiere has kidzone. What do you mean by 'in their default interface'? So what, Kidzone isn't turned on by default either. You can turn it on.


Kidzone doesn't work in the HDUI. You'd need to switch to the SDUI to use it.


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## Adam1115

SullyND said:


> Only one of those is a DirecTiVo.


Every TiVo box including every directv tiVo starting since the S2 has had kidzone, except for this box.


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## litzdog911

Ummm, my HR10-250 doesn't have KidZone.


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## BrettStah

Neither did my HR10-250.


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## eddyj

Yeah. I'm pretty sure that was never in any DIRECTiVo.


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## stevel

I agree - KidZone was never available in any DTiVo.


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