# About to Upgrade Questions



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

I have 2 TiVo's. The setup is below.

The first is a Sony SVR-3000 with lifetime, and a Weakness 160GB drive. I would consider this TiVo the primary TiVo in my household. The 160GB drive was added in early 2004 before the 137GB issue was resolved. The drive is working pretty well. There are only isolated incidents of the picture breaking up and fortunately no real indications of a failing Hard Drive. 

The second TiVo is a refurbished 40 hour 540 unit with lifetime. This was purchased less than a year ago. There are no problems with the unit, except the drive is clearly not large enough. 

I recently purchased a Seagate 250GB hard drive for $80 from Outpost.com. The drive should arrive any day and I am conteplating what to do with it. I do not care either way about saving the recordings or my Season Pass/Wishlists. 

My options are as follows. 

1. Put new 250GB Seagate into the Sony and then move the older 160GB drive to the 540 unit. (Since the Sony is the primary TiVo, I would like the most recording space on that unit).

or

2. Leave the Sony alone, and place the 250GB unit in the 540 and be done with it. Then in 6 months to a year when 400GB drives are $80 put a new even larger drive into the Sony.

I am not too technically inclined, but am detail oriented and willing to read directions carefully. I recently opened my PC to understand what primary and secondary IDE cables are, as well as looked in my BIOS to determine how to boot from CD rom. I do not want to make to big of a project of learning how to transfer the image onto the new drive. I guess I have two options: 1. buy an instant cake CD, or 2. download the Weaknees utility.

Now for the questions:
1. Would you transfer the Hard Drive from one unit to the other, or just leave the Sony alone for now?
2. For those of you that have used both upgrade methods is InstantCake worth the $20?
3. Where can I run into more problems upgrading, IC or Weaknees?
4. Is the 160GB drive with SVR-3000 image able to be "re-imaged" so that it can be used in the 540?
5. Any advice on where I can obtain (free) software to burn an .ISO image? My older version of EasyCD Creater 5 by Roxio does not have that capability.

Any advice would be appreciated.


----------



## Dkerr24 (Oct 29, 2004)

I would leave the Sony alone, install the 250gb drive in the unit with a 40gb, zipper (if these are DTivo units) both drives to enable Multi Room Viewing, then you can watch all programs from either Tivo. If they're both standalone Tivo units, they should already have MRV enabled.


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

Yes, they are enabled for MRV, and connected via a wired ethernet. I usually use MRV for transferring shows, but since I like to record at Best or High sometimes the transfer speed is slower than I would like.


----------



## Dkerr24 (Oct 29, 2004)

Your proposal would involve 2 drive swaps and reimaging one drive, and installing a new image on the new drive. That risks putting both Tivo's down if you make a mistake. That's why I recommend leaving one Tivo alone and do the drive upgrade on the other.

I made the error of taking both of my DTivo's down when running the zipper on them, my wife and daughter about had a fit until I got them running again


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

Ok, thanks for the input. I was leaning toward putting the new drive in the 40 hr unit rather than shuffling everything around. Then oneday I will buy a much larger drive for the main TiVo when that drive fails. 

So if I just upgrade the 40 hr. 540 unit with the new Hard Drive, can you help me answer some of the questions that I have.

1. Weaknees Free Utility vs. Instant Cake? Where can I run into more problems upgrading, IC or Weaknees?
2. Where can I obtain software (free) to burn an .iso image?
3. What software version will instant cake put on the new HD? Will I be able to have greater than the 137GB limit?
4. Anything else that I am missing that someone can advise me on?


----------



## Dkerr24 (Oct 29, 2004)

1) Instant Cake takes all the guesswork out of a upgrade. I personally used mfsbackup/mfsrestore as detailed in the Hinsdale Howto guide. Google for "hinsdale howto".
2) Most CD burners come with software that will burn a ISO image. I just used what came with my burner which was Easy CD Creator.
3) I didn't use Instant Cake, so not sure on that one.
4) Make sure you set the jumpers properly on your hard drives when you connect them to your PC. That seems to be the most common error committed by someone who hasn't done a upgrade to a Tivo.


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

Dkerr24, thanks for all of your help with this. I think I probably should use InstantCake since I have never done this type of thing before. It helps to know that InstantCake is pretty good, although I need to spend $20 to get it. I read through Hinsdale and while I am sure it is easy for computer literate people, it just made my head spin. I am not too good when it comes to programming, but the physical aspect of swapping a hard drive and setting the jumpers seems to be pretty simple for me.

My Easy CD Creater version 5 that came with my Dell system with CD Burner is about 3 years old and I do not think it has the capabilities to burn an .iso. I really do not need to buy another CD Burner. I am hoping that someone can point me in the right direction.

I appreciate the good advice on making sure the jumpers are set correctly. Do they need to be changed back to anything specific after I use InstantCake, or can they remain where they are?

My 2 outstanding questions are:

1. Where can I obtain software (free) to burn an .iso image? 
2. What software version will instant cake put on the new HD? Will I be able to have greater than the 137GB limit?


----------



## bikerdude (Dec 9, 2004)

Google for undisker 

There is a 30 day free trial.


----------



## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

Download DVDDecrypter. Suprisingly, it is a very simple to use ISO burner as well. On the mode menu choose ISO->Write.

InstantCake for the 540 model comes with 5.3-01-2-540 software. Not sure why it is so old, but the 540's have always supported >136 GB drives. Only hiccup would be running guided setup afterwards without a landline phone. (No broadband support prior to 7.2.0).

I too would not risk taking both Tivos down until you got this whole process down pat.

IMO, InstakeCake price is worth it. The odds of screwing up your first Tivo upgrade is usually pretty high. 

(remove the +'s from forbidden link)
http://www.dvr+play+ground.com/article/10140/#S2SA


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

Thanks for the help with the 2 different software programs that can burn an ISO. I downloaded both and I will play with both programs to see which one is easier to use. On the surface it seems that DVD Decrypter is the more user friendly. greg_burns, the copy that I found via google (tough to find, most site do not have a download link) is version 3.5.4 - is that correct?

I still have my landline connected to my TiVo, just in case I ever have broadband problems. Therefore, updating via phone for the initial call should not be a problem. I am going to buy the InstantCake (rather than weaknees) since several people have said using InstantCake is pretty simple, and I really do not want to risk screwing up. 

I hope that my TiVo will update to 7.2 again fairly quickly after the new drive is installed. Does anyone want to guess how long that should take for the update to be received?

As far as the Sony SVR-3000, I will wait until the current drive fails, or 300 GB + drives become really inexpensive. 

I think 160GB (limited to 137GB) in one TiVo and 250GB in the other will give me all that I need (for now...).


----------



## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

jjberger2134 said:


> Thanks for the help with the 2 different software programs that can burn an ISO. I downloaded both and I will play with both programs to see which one is easier to use. On the surface it seems that DVD Decrypter is the more user friendly. greg_burns, the copy that I found via google (tough to find, most site do not have a download link) is version 3.5.4 - is that correct?
> 
> I still have my landline connected to my TiVo, just in case I ever have broadband problems. Therefore, updating via phone for the initial call should not be a problem. I am going to buy the InstantCake (rather than weaknees) since several people have said using InstantCake is pretty simple, and I really do not want to risk screwing up.
> 
> ...


3.5.4 was last version release. When you install they recommend unchecking the box to check for later releases. (can do this form options as well). This software has kinda become underground if you know what I mean. 

You can force connections to Tivo servers. It should start pulling down the latest version within one or two forced connections I bet.


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

I opened an old PC to do a "dry run" before I actually hook up the new Hard Drive (which should arrive tomorrow in the mail). I did the following.

Disconnected the CD-ROM (secondary cable) and Hard Disk Drive (primary cable) from the 2 IDE cables located in the PC. I reconnected the CD-ROM to the IDE cable that was connected to the Hard Drive and left the Hard Drive disconnected. So now the CD-ROM should be on the Primary IDE cable. The jumper is set to Master on the CD-ROM.

I started the PC and adjusted the BIOS to boot from CD. 

Everything seems to work well and the PC started to load and the CD-ROM searched for a disk. 

However, When I read the instructions for instant cake, the instructions recommend putting the CD-ROM jumper on SLAVE. I then changed the CD-ROM jumper to SLAVE and the PC did not boot properly (ie. search for the CD). When I changed the jumper back to master everything worked as it should.

How important is it to have the jumper on slave when running instant cake? 
Did the PC not boot correctly when the jumper was on slave because there was no hard drive set on the Secondary IDE Cable as Master?
When I install the new Hard Drive as the secondary master (old CD-ROM connector) and the CD-ROM on the primary master (old PC Hard Drive connector) will everything work as planned?
Is the CD-ROM, located on the old PC Hard Drive connector in the correct spot? Should it be connected to another IDE connector/cable?

Finally, once I start the process by using the instant cake cd, how long should it take to "Bake"? 

Thanks.


----------



## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

Here is a thread kinda talking about the trouble with hooking up a CD-ROM as Slave with no master.

(remove the +'s from forbidden link (you'll have to pull them out while replying)  )
www.dvr+play+ground.com/forum/thread/11020/?page=1

It has been awhile since I ran IC, and not sure if I ran into that problem or not.

At one point in that thread Lou says



> You need to set your computer up so that you can boot from the CD set as the secondary master.


WTF?

www.dvr+play+ground.com/article/10140/



> Directions for using InstantCake
> 
> * Step 1: Configure your PC such that your CD-ROM drive is connected as the primary slave device.


I don't recall having a problem doing this, but if you do, perhaps you could try connecting another cdrom as primary master to fill the spot. 

It shouldn't take more than a couple minutes to bake IIRC. Remember, there is no copy of recordings taking place so it should go pretty quickly.

Edit:

I just hooked up my CD-ROM as hda (primary-*master*) and a HD I had lying around as hdc (secondary-master). Booted to IC no problem and restored the 1010 MB image in under a minute.

I realize this is NOT what the instructions say to do, but it apparently works just fine (short of actually placing the drive in a Tivo and testing it out).

I also noticed this time around that when booted IC says...


> This distro contains the following IC image: TIVO TCD540XXX models version 5.3-01-2-540 Standard Release


So, somebody please tell me, why do they sell 3 separate versions for each model of 540? Can you reuse the same IC across all 540 models? 

I asked this same question last night on the other forum...
http://www.dvr+play+ground.com/forum/thread/11951/?page=1


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

Greg - I am thoroughly confused after reading those posts that you referred me to. In *your* example above, you set the CD as Primary Master and the HD as Secondary Master and everything worked for you. The poster in the other forum tried the same thing and got error messages. Just to confirm, there were no error messages when you had the CD as a primary master? The copy seemed to go smoothly?

*I am starting to get cold feet for this whole thing*.

After re-reading Weaknees (free software) thread, maybe it is better to go with that method. I would retain my recordings, and the Linux commands seem to dictate which drive is connected to which space. Therefore, it is less likely that an error can occur.

Am I making this more difficult than it needs to be or should I just try the Instant Cake? My time to make a decision is running out since the new Hard Drive arrive tomorrow.


----------



## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

jjberger2134 said:


> Greg - I am thoroughly confused after reading those posts that you referred me to. In *your* example above, you set the CD as Primary Master and the HD as Secondary Master and everything worked for you. The poster in the other forum tried the same thing and got error messages. Just to confirm, there were no error messages when you had the CD as a primary master? The copy seemed to go smoothly?


I just tried it earlier today again. I also could not get a spare computer I have to boot to the CD when set as slave on primary (with no master attached). So I switched it to master on primary. Booted just fine to the CD and started IC.

I even went so far as to hook up a spare 60GB drive to master on secondary. Went through the whole process with IC and it said it completed with no errors. (Got to the message about remembering to run Clear & Delete Everything on the Tivo.)

Now, I did not actually connect it to a Tivo and verify it was good. But I 99% sure it is.

I am just as confused as you about why he (Lou) is insisting the CD be on hdb (primary-slave).


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

The IC instructions also state the CD should be on primary slave, but as you and others have mentioned it does not seem possible to do this (with nothing on the primary master). You are correct it is very confusing. I spent the better part of the day playing with the old PC and think ing of ways to make this work.

I guess I will download IC tomorrow, burn to the software that you recommended, then try to "bake my cake" using the CD on primary master and new HD on secondary master. Sound good?


----------



## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

jjberger2134 said:


> I guess I will download IC tomorrow, burn to the software that you recommended, then try to "bake my cake" using the CD on primary master and new HD on secondary master. Sound good?


Sounds good to me. Maybe not to Lou.


----------



## LastPlace (Feb 22, 2005)

I've been so busy playing with this EXACT problem ALL day that I didn't realize there was a current discussion about the CDROM drive Master-hda Slave-hdb issue.

I am trying to upgrade a Sony SVR-2000 from the original 30GB hard drive to a Seagate 300GB 7200.9 drive.

Despite a lot of help from folks in this forum I just could not get it to work - I needed things like diskutil but then couldn't manage to actually use them once I got them, etc...

So, I bought the InstantCake version for the Sony after having had success with last weekend when I bought if for my other TiVo, the Series2 TCD2400080. I successfully upgraded that last weekend using the same PC I'm working with now - I can't figure out what the difference is but apparently I'm doing something different or it's more picky with the Series1.

Anyway, I went through the whole bake process - maybe 30 minutes or so - and it said I had the increased size. BUT there was a note about the hda being read-only.

So, I thought it was still All-Good but when I put the drive in the TiVo it hung at Powering Up... At least the little guy is cute and has some color!

Anyway, wanting to use the TiVo rather than just stare at the little guy, I posted in a different (wrong) thread and was directed over to the ************* and led to another page to review possibly adding some other steps:

download and burn latest PTVlba48 CD from here (version 4.01 or later) and label it "PTVlba48"

if you have a DirecTV Series1 unit and are using a drive larger than 137GB and/or a TurboNet/CacheCard, then download and burn this CD as well; label it "tivoflash"

but when I went to use the PTVlba48 I ran in to more noticeable trouble with the whole hda / hdb issue and am now at a dead stop.

So, all that to say, if you got any ideas for me please let me know I'll be rooting for jjberger2134's upgrade tomorrow :up:


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

Last Place - Greg Burns said earlier that the entire process should just take a couple of minutes. Why did yours take 30 minutes? 

Did you use your CD as the primary master or primary slave? Where was your hd? (secondary master, i am guessing)


----------



## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

LastPlace said:


> Anyway, I went through the whole bake process - maybe 30 minutes or so - and it said I had the increased size. BUT there was a note about the hda being read-only.


Interesting. I didn't notice it saying anything about increased size when I used IC earlier for a Series 2. And I don't see it on the screen-shot here for a Series 1:

http://www.ptvupgrade.com/support/instantcake/series1-standalone/html/screen3b.html

But I have see that message when using MFSTools.


----------



## LastPlace (Feb 22, 2005)

The hdc was a result of putting my new drive (that I want to bake) set as Master on the secondary IDE.

As for a few minutes vs. 30 - maybe I'm off by 15 or so minutes but I've been at it for SO long that it did seem short but not so short as to make me think it didn't have time to actually do something 

As for my experience with messages after baking with InstantCake, what I got was

The first time I went through and baked it I got a message about it being successful and to do a clear-and-delete but I do remember seeing something about hda being busy.

I put it in the TiVo and powered it up  it just stuck at Powering Up, just a minute...

Then I unplugged it, powered it down and started it back up  let it sit for about 3 hours but never made it past that same Powering Up, just a minute screen.

Took the drive out, and figuring I missed something important the first time, I rebaked it. It seemed to go through fine and then I wrote down what it said (seemed to be identical to the first time):

Uncompressed backup size: 816 megabytes
Restoring 816 or 816 megabytes (100.00%) (83.78% compression)
Cleaning up restore. Please wait a moment.
Restore done!
Adding pair /dev/hdc12-/dev/hdc13
New estimated standalone size: 342 hours (312 more)

CONGRATULATIONS! Software installed

Your cake is baked! You should now power down your PC and move your drives to the TiVo. Dont forget to do a clear-and-delete everything once youve booted your unit for the first time with your new software.

umount2: Device or resource busy
umount: /dev/hda busy  remounted read-only
/#

I don't know if it's important but let me note that my CD drive is a CDROM and has no writing capability so I would expect it to be read-only.

Now, I was definitely using the InstantCake although I had previously tried using the mfsbackup | mfsrestore but had given up on that when it appeared the original TiVo drive was locked; after that, first I couldn't get qunlock to work, then I couldn't find diskutil and when I did get it I couldn't figure out how to make it work 

I was comfortable with DOS "back in the day" but all of the downloads from various locations and with limited directions and having to read a lot of posts and threads definitely has my head swimming - but I do feel I'm in the right pool and have spent so much time I'd REALLY like to accomplish this upgrade myself rather than buying a pre-formatted drive.

So, all of the help is really appreciated and I hope that I haven't managed to post in the wrong  spot again but it sure sounds like some of my gyrations through this process are the same ones others are experiencing!

Hopefully I will get some feedback to my post at PTVupgrade or here, that will help me overcome the hda/hdb issue!


----------



## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

LastPlace said:


> Uncompressed backup size: 816 megabytes
> Restoring 816 or 816 megabytes (100.00%) (83.78% compression)
> Cleaning up restore. Please wait a moment.
> Restore done!
> ...


That does look like what I saw earlier with IC also. I must have missed where it said how much more it added. That kinda answer my other question about the need for different images for the 540 series. If it knows how much more space it adds, it also needs to know how much there was to start with...

Looks like I am going to have to try this dry run again just to satisfy my curiosity.

Sorry I am not more help to you LastPlace. I will be going through the same process shortly with my first Series 1 when mine arrives in the mail.


----------



## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

greg_burns said:


> That does look like what I saw earlier with IC also. I must have missed where it said how much more it added. That kinda answer my other question about the need for different images for the 540 series. If it knows how much more space it adds, it also needs to know how much there was to start with...
> 
> Looks like I am going to have to try this dry run again just to satisfy my curiosity.


Well, I tried again on another computer with same setup: CDROM as hda and HD as hdc. Install took about 2 1/2 minutes. When it finished it does indeed say:

"New estimated standalone size" 126 hours (86 more)"

(I used a 120GB drive this time).

So apparently, the images are different in at least one respect for each 540 model.


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

Well, here's the update....

I came home from work tonight and downloaded the instant cake iso. I burned it to a CD, with the software that greg_burns mentioned above.

I took my old pc, and hooked up the CD to the PRIMARY MASTER and the new Seagate 250GB Hard Drive to the SECONDARY MASTER. Then set the PC to boot from CD and let instant cake do its thing.

*I am happy to report that everything seems to have worked out well.  *

First, I got the message that the cake was in the oven

Then after what seemed to be about 10 minutes (but probably more like 5) I received a successful "Software Installed" message, including a reminder to do a clear and delete.

The screen showed the estimated new standalone size to be 282 hours (242 more)!!!

Tomorrow night I will try to find the time to actually change over the drives. I do not have time tonight to take everything apart and then back together. I am also busy transferring all my shows to my PC and my other TiVo. So tomorrow is best for me.

Greg - Can I send you an email or PM with screen shots to confirm?


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

Hi, everyone - I came home from work tonight and disconnected my TiVo, swapped out the hard drive, powered up, did a CLEAR AND DELETE (took about 30 minutes), then went through Guided Setup.

My TiVo is now happily indexing the guide data.

I have the following recording times for the new 250GB drive:
Best: 76 hours
High:123 hours
Medium: 162 hours
Basic: 282 hours

I do have some residual issues, but I am guessing they will go away when the software updates to 7.2. I have to go onto the TiVo website and find the link for the 7.2 priority update. The residual issues right now are:
TiVo cannot see the PC on the network (but can see the other TiVo)
There is no Music, Photos, and More Option on the Main Menu

I was pleased to see, although I cannot record TV until the indexing is done, I am able to transfer shows from the other TiVo.

Thanks for all of your help, especially greg_burns. In retrospect, I cannot believe how easy it was to upgrade.


----------



## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

Priority sign-up:

http://www.tivo.com/priority/

Your software is probably currently at pre 7.x level (probably still at 5.3). That is why you don't have the Music, Photos, and More Option. Force some connections, it should update immediately to at least 7.2.1 without needing to signup on the priority list.


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

Thanks, Greg. Last night, I signed up and forced a connection (twice), and the end result is that the machine is now updated to 7.2.2 (I think? - I just took a quick glance, but did not notice .1 or .2). I have Music Photos and More, and the reboot resolved the issue with regard to seeing the PC on the network. 

Just one last minor issue. I transferred a bunch of shows back to the upgraded TiVo before I recorded any new shows on the new Hard Drive. It seems that the transferred shows do not go into "FOLDERS". (Yes, I have checked the folder settings). It seems that a transferred show will go into a folder only if one copy of a show already exists on the TiVo and that show must have been recorded on that machine, not transferred.

ie. Record Show A via a scheduled recording then transfer a different episode of show A into the TiVo from another on the network and everything is ok.

Transfer multiple copies of Show A (without a pre-recorded scheduled recording) into the TiVo and they are listed as individual items with no way to enter them into the folder.

I guess I need to delete the shows I want in a folder, then wait for a scheduled recording, then transfer back into the TiVo to be included in the folder.


----------



## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

jjberger2134 said:


> Just one last minor issue. I transferred a bunch of shows back to the upgraded TiVo before I recorded any new shows on the new Hard Drive. It seems that the transferred shows do not go into "FOLDERS". (Yes, I have checked the folder settings). It seems that a transferred show will go into a folder only if one copy of a show already exists on the TiVo and that show must have been recorded on that machine, not transferred.


I've seen that myself. It has something to do with that show series not being in the guide data anymore. It is bizarre. Buried in this thread is some discussion on it.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=284726

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=3969488


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

This is strange since the shows in question are in the guide data. They are actually shows for my children (such as Barney and Dora the Exploer). My wife is already starting to scream and yell that "we have to have the folders!!". 

Both of the above mentioned shows are set to record today via a standard Season Pass recording. When I get home tonight, I will transfer to the new Hard Drive some of the "favorites" that were specifically asked to be saved. I am guessing that once the show is recorded via a Season Pass or standard recording the transfers will be placed in the specific folder.


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

FYI - The season pass/scheduled recordings happened yesterday during the day. Last night I transferred a bunch of shows back to the TiVo with the new hard drive and the transferred shows were put in a folder along with the newly recorded ones.


----------



## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

So you retransferred the same shows that didn't group before and now they correctly grouped because the SP recording happened?

Interesting. Must be more involved than just it being in the guide or not. So you are thinking it needs to record at least one show of the series first?

My problem Tivo never recorded anything (it didn't have a video source). Some things grouped other did not. Never setup any SP's either.


----------



## jjberger2134 (Nov 20, 2002)

greg_burns said:


> So you retransferred the same shows that didn't group before and now they correctly grouped because the SP recording happened?
> 
> Interesting. Must be more involved than just it being in the guide or not. So you are thinking it needs to record at least one show of the series first?
> 
> My problem Tivo never recorded anything (it didn't have a video source). Some things grouped other did not. Never setup any SP's either.


Yes, I transferred once prior to any scheduled recording (no recordings were on the new hard drive at all - completely empty) and when those did not group into folders I deleted the shows. I then waited for a scheduled recording to take place via Season Pass. Once the scheduled recording took place, I re-transferred and the same recordings that did not previously go into groups were then placed in the correct group.

I cannot think of any reason why some items would group on your TiVo and others would not.


----------

