# TiVo Intros DVR-Spanning Season Pass Manager



## jfh3 (Apr 15, 2004)

This article was PC Magazine's site earlier today and got pulled. Anyone have the entire article?

TiVo Intros DVR-Spanning Season Pass Manager

Joel Santo Domingo On Tuesday, TiVo introduced enhancements to its online scheduling for Internet-connected TiVo DVRs. While users ...

The Season Pass Manager works with any broadband-connected DVR, and transfers work in both directions. Look for the new Season Pass Manager on tivo.com

http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2370664,00.asp


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## ebf (Mar 21, 2005)

Too fast for the Google/Bing cache. Guess we'll just have to wait...


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Maybe they read orangeboy's TiVoToDo program lol.


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## tomm1079 (May 10, 2005)

innocentfreak said:


> Maybe they read orangeboy's TiVoToDo program lol.


yeah they thought "hey thats a good idea....i wonder if we can finish it before him"


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

or they started it years ago and you know the rest.


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## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

Maybe it was originally an Onion story.


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## tgmii (Feb 21, 2002)

If its for premiere only, I'm going to lose it


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## headroll (Jan 20, 2003)

tgmii said:


> If its for premiere only, I'm going to lose it


I would recommend you prepare to lose it then ...

-Roll


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

If it is tivo.com I don't see it being only the Premiere, but I could be wrong.


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## tomm1079 (May 10, 2005)

you can see it in their search still..

http://www.pcmag.com/search_redirect/?qry=tivo&searchSection=0&site=3

but cant read it


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## magnus (Nov 12, 2004)

kinda seems like it's going to be a Tivo.com feature. Snore. Snore. Snore.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

"transfers work in both directions" That sort of sounds like it means you can "back up" your season passes. Not useful when your tivo breaks, but possibly useful if you get a new one before you sell/retire your old one.


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## megazone (Mar 3, 2002)

Yeah, I tweeted about this earlier, I just missed catching it and I've been trying to find any site that managed to see it before it was yanked - so far no luck. I'm guessing this is something they plan to announce in the next few days and PC Mag screwed up and put it out early. Or maybe it was slated for today and it was delayed and they didn't get the memo in time...


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## goldfndr (Dec 22, 2001)

It is cached. Just enter "cache:www.pcmag.com/article2/0,2817,2370664,00.asp" into Google search.

Based on the description, I think it'll add "My Season Passes" to tivo.com's Find TV Shows sidebar (and m.tivo.com's equivalent). It'll allow you to create, delete, and reprioritize season passes, and transfer them from one TiVo DVR to another, but there's no hint of _cooperative recording_. Series 2 and later.

It said it would be available today. I'm thinking that's why it was pulled.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...article2/0,2817,2370664,00.asp&gs_rfai=&pbx=1


> On Tuesday, TiVo introduced enhancements to its online scheduling for Internet-connected TiVo DVRs.
> 
> While users have long been able to schedule individual programs and Season Pass recordings using a Web browser, the process has always been a one-way affair. Now TiVo users will be able to take more control over their Season Passes on tivo.com or m.tivo.com on mobile phones. Instead of just scheduling Season Passes, users can now reprioritize Season Pass recordings, create several Season Passes at once, delete season passes, or even transfer Season Passes from one TiVo DVR to another.
> 
> Season Pass transfer will help existing TiVo users that buy new TiVo Premiere DVRs transfer their favorite shows from older DVRs like TiVo Series 2, Series 3, and TiVo HD. The Season Pass Manager works with any broadband-connected DVR, and transfers work in both directions. Look for the new Season Pass Manager on tivo.com starting today.


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## wisny (Sep 6, 2010)

moyekj said:


> http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...article2/0,2817,2370664,00.asp&gs_rfai=&pbx=1


Wait. So, is this the way to backup your Season Passes? If you can transfer from one to another, does that mean that you can save them on tivo.com, and in a year or so, if you need them, you can download them again?


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## Enrique (May 15, 2006)

moyekj said:


> http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...article2/0,2817,2370664,00.asp&gs_rfai=&pbx=1


Looks like they changed some things there "TiVo announced on Wednesday that users can now reprioritize Season Pass recordings, create several Season Passes at once, delete season"

http://www.google.com/search?source...s+Manager"&gs_rfai=&pbx=1&fp=5a996d56de453056

My guess it was meant for tomorrow, fingers crossed.


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## bigpatky (Apr 23, 2008)

all i want is real-time dvr access. none of this "schedule a recording" and then wait for tivo to connect to the servers and then find out if there is a conflict or you scheduled too late. I think Directv and comcast have direct access to record a show immediately from the internet or mobile phones.


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## tomm1079 (May 10, 2005)

I just hope this will lead to "if this DVR is filled it will fall back to another dvr"


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

tomm1079 said:


> I just hope this will lead to "if this DVR is filled it will fall back to another dvr"


They have all the pieces there for finding a free tuner for a given timeslot, and it's a lot closer for them then it is for the little web-scraping python app I'm writing. But I guess that raises a point about what TiVos are local, and what TiVos may be at a different location (on the same account). The "fall back" TiVo may be the gift TiVo that you gave Aunt Matilda...


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

bigpatky said:


> all i want is real-time dvr access. none of this "schedule a recording" and then wait for tivo to connect to the servers and then find out if there is a conflict or you scheduled too late. I think Directv and comcast have direct access to record a show immediately from the internet or mobile phones.


Directv and Comcast have an advantage in this case. They can push the request to the DVR over the lines that carry the signal. TiVo obviously can't do that so you have to wait for the TiVo to check in. Having a TiVo always connected wouldn't make sense either.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

tomm1079 said:


> I just hope this will lead to "if this DVR is filled it will fall back to another dvr"


That and I hope it leads to some type of priority tool. Something that you can have analyze your season passes so you can figure out the best order with assistance. I am tired of trying to organize my mom's season passes especially when I can't remember or don't know what shows are on what night and what her conflicts are.


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## tomm1079 (May 10, 2005)

orangeboy said:


> They have all the pieces there for finding a free tuner for a given timeslot, and it's a lot closer for them then it is for the little web-scraping python app I'm writing. But I guess that raises a point about what TiVos are local, and what TiVos may be at a different location (on the same account). The "fall back" TiVo may be the gift TiVo that you gave Aunt Matilda...


obviously they just need an ignore feature like your little python app


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

tomm1079 said:


> obviously they just need an ignore feature like your little python app


It would have to be an opt-in though since his app scans the local network for TiVos which TiVo.com couldn't do. Opt-in would be nice though since you could opt-in your local TiVos, and also separately work on Aunt Matilda's TiVos.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

looks innovative


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## Leon WIlkinson (Feb 13, 2000)

mattack said:


> "transfers work in both directions" That sort of sounds like it means you can "back up" your season passes. Not useful when your tivo breaks, but possibly useful if you get a new one before you sell/retire your old one.


I was just wishing for this just 5 hrs ago. I think if n camove SP to different TiVos it would make it easier to setup SP to handle conflicts, if you could see all S3-4 todo lists side by side in a time graph style even better.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Leon WIlkinson said:


> I was just wishing for this just 5 hrs ago. I think if n camove SP to different TiVos it would make it easier to setup SP to handle conflicts, if you could see all S3-4 todo lists side by side in a time graph style even better.


Don't know if you have seen this tool yet that orangeboy is working on, but it might help you at least with the second part.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=455842


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## parzec (Jun 21, 2002)

wisny said:


> Wait. So, is this the way to backup your Season Passes? If you can transfer from one to another, does that mean that you can save them on tivo.com, and in a year or so, if you need them, you can download them again?


I think they mean you can transfer the season pass itself, but not the actual shows the season pass records. So you could reconstruct all of the season passes from one Tivo complete with priority and settings easily on a newly purchased Tivo or any other Tivo on your account.


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## magnus (Nov 12, 2004)

I'm not seeing anything new on the website yet. Maybe it's not today.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

ZeoTiVo said:


> looks innovative


Indeed... And you obviously can't trust the mainstream media like you can trust us rogue bloggers.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

davezatz said:


> Indeed... And you obviously can't trust the mainstream media like you can trust us rogue bloggers.


Damn rogue bloggers always ruining everything.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

innocentfreak said:


> That and I hope it leads to some type of priority tool. Something that you can have analyze your season passes so you can figure out the best order with assistance. I am tired of trying to organize my mom's season passes especially when I can't remember or don't know what shows are on what night and what her conflicts are.


How would they know how you want your season passes organized? Only you would know that. They have no way of knowing what you like better than something else.
Plus Shows can move around to different time slots so things are changing throughout the year.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

News is live, expect the site to go live later today:
http://tivo.com/spm


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

aaronwt said:


> How would they know how you want your season passes organized? Only you would know that. They have no way of knowing what you like better than something else.
> Plus Shows can move around to different time slots so things are changing throughout the year.


The way I see it as an option. It would take your current season pass order and do what it does now on the TiVo when you move a season pass. The difference is every time it came to a conflict it would ask you to rank the shows that conflict. It would also flag shows that had repeats and ones that didn't in the current guide. You would just continue this until you finished analyzing the season passes. It would then generate a new priority order and to do list based off the new order for you to verify and if you accepted the new order it would upload that order back to the TiVo.

You would also potentially be able to set the length of time for TiVo to analyze so it only looked at conflicts during the next week or 12 days. You would be prompted to analyze season passes if you wanted every time a new season pass was added via TiVo.com or detected since your last login.

This would also work as a conflict tool since if you had multiple TiVos it might be able to or might allow you to flag shows that conflicted on one TiVo without repeats so that you could be sure to record that on a second TiVo instead.

In some ways this is similar to what 7MC does now. When you see a conflict it notifies you of the shows that conflicts and then you can either pick the specific shows to record for that time or go into an advanced option which changes the order for the conflicted shows permanently.

This is something that technically someone could write a manual tool for now. The benefit TiVo has is access to the guide data which it can analyze where any manual tool would be dependent on the user adding the correct guide data and keeping it up to date. I am not expecting TiVo to just do it without user interaction or verification.


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## gothaggis (Mar 3, 2010)

Engadet has an article up about it now: http://www.engadget.com/2010/10/13/tivo-launches-online-season-pass-manager/


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

innocentfreak said:


> The way I see it as an option. It would take your current season pass order and do what it does now on the TiVo when you move a season pass. The difference is every time it came to a conflict it would ask you to rank the shows that conflict.


and now with the possibility to do this on the web site these kind of what if is possible since you can map it out online and then 'publish' it to your TiVo when done. Trying to get a meaningful display of all the what ifs on the TiVo directly would have increased development time dramatically.


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## windracer (Jan 3, 2003)

I wonder if I can use this to export my SPs back into my Excel spreadsheet. That would make keeping that thing up-to-date a bit easier.

Or, I guess now that the SPs are available on tivo.com I might not need the spreadsheet anymore ...


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

windracer said:


> I wonder if I can use this to export my SPs back into my Excel spreadsheet. That would make keeping that thing up-to-date a bit easier.
> 
> Or, I guess now that the SPs are available on tivo.com I might not need the spreadsheet anymore ...


 Iwould not loose the spreadsheet just yet, until we see how things like changing out TSNs and so forth works out.

I would think you could parse the HTML easily enough and publish the data to a spreadsheet. I have not looked at the source for the page though. better case you read the JSP page elements.


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## jweaver15 (Mar 28, 2008)

TiVo Season Pass Manager

TiVo's Season Pass Manager coming soon. Please check in later today for access to this new feature.


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## [email protected] (Jan 8, 2008)

Looks like it has been generally announced. A Google search on 'TiVo Season Pass Manager' shows that. And http://www.tivo.com/spm tells me to "..check later today..."

If the TiVo web site SPM is implemented in Flash, it can be ported to the Premiere.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

[email protected] said:


> If the TiVo web site SPM is implemented in Flash, it can be ported to the Premiere.


Will they also port an onscreen arrow and wireless mouse with click & drag?


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

davezatz said:


> Will they also port an onscreen arrow and wireless mouse with click & drag?


Coming soon the TiVo Slide and Mouse.

I wonder if they couldn't at least implement the copy feature so locally you could send a season pass from one TiVo to another. Just have it show up under more options.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

windracer said:


> I wonder if I can use this to export my SPs back into my Excel spreadsheet. That would make keeping that thing up-to-date a bit easier.
> 
> Or, I guess now that the SPs are available on tivo.com I might not need the spreadsheet anymore ...


 I don't know how often the data at web site is going to be updated, (I would guess with each net connect) but I would want a copy of it for sure just in case it gets wiped out from web site.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

moyekj said:


> I don't know how often the data at web site is going to be updated, (I would guess with each net connect) but I would want a copy of it for sure just in case it gets wiped out from web site.


I would think it is around every hour. the website is already being updated with the My Shows list and with the My To Do List.


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## cwoody222 (Nov 13, 1999)

I just want their Mobile site to offer a decent way to search via Program Guide because often I want to record the nightly news and searching for "news" is impossible.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

cwoody222 said:


> I just want their Mobile site to offer a decent way to search via Program Guide because often I want to record the nightly news and searching for "news" is impossible.


Just search by the network name and add news. For instance, NBC News, ABC News etc.

I can type those search parameters in and , nightly news comes up, evening news, etc.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

davezatz said:


> Will they also port an onscreen arrow and wireless mouse with click & drag?


the new TiVo, now with motion controller/pointer. Now that would be innovative 



cwoody222 said:


> often I want to record the nightly news and searching for "news" is impossible.


You know they have a season pass feature for just such a need  Just set it to keep at most 1 and the new one just overwrites the old one


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## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

Wow could have used this a few weeks back when I upgraded. 

Now don't care so much.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

aaronwt said:


> I would think it is around every hour. the website is already being updated with the My Shows list and with the My To Do List.


I would think it would be the same speed as scheduling a show which is a couple of minutes in my experience


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## MikeAndrews (Jan 17, 2002)

Nice!

I wonder if this will help solve the dreaded "Please Wait" when you make any change on in Season Pass Manger with 100+ SPs.

If you can change your priorities and delete SPs on the web and have your Tivo(s) update and sort in the background later rather than having it hang for many minutes it would be a godsend.


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## jtreid (Jan 12, 2006)

ZeoTiVo said:


> the new TiVo, now with motion controller/pointer. Now that would be innovative


The WiiTivoMote


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## jtreid (Jan 12, 2006)

netringer said:


> Nice!
> 
> I wonder if this will help solve the dreaded "Please Wait" when you make any change on in Season Pass Manger with 100+ SPs.
> 
> If you can change your priorities and delete SPs on the web and have your Tivo(s) update and sort in the background later rather than having it hang for many minutes it would be a godsend.


Even better if they would let me access the SPM on-line from my Tivo. *THAT *would be innovative.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

Should somebody change the thread title now that we know what this thing is?


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

jtreid said:


> Even better if they would let me access the SPM on-line from my Tivo. *THAT *would be innovative.


I think it would be clunky and the "please wait" could take a loong time. Plus online they write code once and it covers all current and future broadband connected TiVo DVRs. I am really not seeing why anyone would want the functionality shown to be squashed into a text screen on an S2.



aindik said:


> Should somebody change the thread title now that we know what this thing is?


would be good to add in that it is an online tool. however what is there is accurate - this is a DVR spanning season pass manager. My hope is they add more functionality in the vein of cooperative scheduling at least at setup time.
EG - ooh - that's a conflict on this TiVo - however your TiVo in the done has an open tuner at that time.


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## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

ZeoTiVo said:


> looks innovative


And about time too.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

ZeoTiVo said:


> this is a DVR spanning season pass manager.


In what way is it DVR spanning?


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## megazone (Mar 3, 2002)

innocentfreak said:


> Directv and Comcast have an advantage in this case. They can push the request to the DVR over the lines that carry the signal. TiVo obviously can't do that so you have to wait for the TiVo to check in. Having a TiVo always connected wouldn't make sense either.


Actually TiVo already has the 'always connected' thing for broadband connected units - TiVo added XMPP (aka Jabber) to the units a while back. It just doesn't seem like they're fully exploiting it.


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## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

ZeoTiVo said:


> I think it would be clunky and the "please wait" could take a loong time. Plus online they write code once and it covers all current and future broadband connected TiVo DVRs. I am really not seeing why anyone would want the functionality shown to be squashed into a text screen on an S2.
> 
> would be good to add in that it is an online tool. however what is there is accurate - this is a DVR spanning season pass manager. My hope is they add more functionality in the vein of cooperative scheduling at least at setup time.
> EG - ooh - that's a conflict on this TiVo - however your TiVo in the done has an open tuner at that time.


Wonder if it will have a mobile interface as well for use on Phones and such..


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## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

aindik said:


> In what way is it DVR spanning?


Sounds like you'll be able to view all your season passes across all DVR's on your account and move them from one to another. That's spanning in a way.

I just hope it isn't a list from each box with up/down controls for each. If it is, the only benefit will be having a complete list for your home. If it helps manage conflicts It'll be a win.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

Stormspace said:


> Sounds like you'll be able to view all your season passes across all DVR's on your account and move them from one to another. That's spanning in a way.
> 
> I just hope it isn't a list from each box with up/down controls for each. If it is, the only benefit will be having a complete list for your home. If it helps manage conflicts It'll be a win.


I think "a list from each box with up/down controls for each" is exactly what it is. That and the ability to delete, and to move or copy from one to the other. To me, a DVR spanning list is one list for 3 DVRs. This isn't that.

I'm wondering: will we be able to create ARWLs online?


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## TerpBE (Jan 23, 2003)

I think the most useful part of this will be being able to prune/rearrange my Season Pass Manager without having to stare at the "Please Wait" clock for a ridiculous amount of time. Some of the most frustrating times with my Tivo have been when I accidentally clicked ">" one too many times when rearranging season passes and had to wait...and wait...and wait while it went through an incredibly inefficient scheduling algorithm.


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

Stormspace said:


> Sounds like you'll be able to view all your season passes across all DVR's on your account and move them from one to another. That's spanning in a way.
> 
> I just hope it isn't a list from each box with up/down controls for each. If it is, the only benefit will be having a complete list for your home. If it helps manage conflicts It'll be a win.


You can view up to two DVRs at a time. Use the check boxes to bulk (or single) delete or move to another TiVo. Re-ordering on a specific TiVo is done via drag and drop - slide something from one position to any other position.



TerpBE said:


> I think the most useful part of this will be being able to prune/rearrange my Season Pass Manager without having to stare at the "Please Wait" clock for a ridiculous amount of time. Some of the most frustrating times with my Tivo have been when I accidentally clicked ">" one too many times when rearranging season passes and had to wait...and wait...and wait while it went through an incredibly inefficient scheduling algorithm.


Amen!


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## modnar (Oct 15, 2000)

This looks great. Nice to see it works on (broadband connected) Series 2 units as well.


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## TrueTurbo (Feb 19, 2008)

Gizmodo actually have a video today showing the new feature in action...

http://gizmodo.com/5662291/finally-you-can-edit-your-tivos-season-passes-online


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

From the screenshots and articles it sounds like it has functionality like the Netflix queue where you can drag and drop season passes. It looks also like you may be limited to two on the screen at a time.

I think the DVR spanning is just being able to easily copy back and forth season passes between TiVos. Of course this raises questions like if you move are the passes locked to the old channels or will it try to update via the guide first? Also if it uses the guide what happens if you try to copy something not on the Tivo.

Hopefully we may be able to do more Netflix style options where you can set season passes not in the guide yet.


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## CuriousMark (Jan 13, 2005)

innocentfreak said:


> I think the DVR spanning is just being able to easily copy back and forth season passes between TiVos. Of course this raises questions like if you move are the passes locked to the old channels or will it try to update via the guide first?


It is my understanding that TiVo recommends against moving season passes between DVRs in different zip codes. I presume that limitation is because it probably won't handle different channel line-ups gracefully. As with most things TiVo, the assumption appears to be that everything is in the same house. My guess is that it will not prevent you from trying to move them farther, but that you should not expect it to be guaranteed to work right if you do that.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

CuriousMark said:


> It is my understanding that TiVo recommends against moving season passes between DVRs in different zip codes. I presume that limitation is because it probably won't handle different channel line-ups gracefully. As with most things TiVo, the assumption appears to be that everything is in the same house. My guess is that it will not prevent you from trying to move them farther, but that you should not expect it to be guaranteed to work right if you do that.


Gotcha. It seems like it would be helpful though for example if you changed providers or moved. I know someone from engadget recently moved and was complaining about there was no easy way to change the channels on season passes. This tool seemed like a good way to simplify it. I cant imagine having to change every season pass channel on all my passes.


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## mlaw8 (Oct 13, 2010)

I just received my new Premier box today and plan on swapping that out for my current HD box (using online Service Number change option). Will I be able to use this functionality to move my season passes? The press release makes it sound like I will (help migration to new unit), but won't changing the service number in turn remove it from my account.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

aindik said:


> In what way is it DVR spanning?


You can copy a season pass from one DVR to another. You can put up two season pass lists and compare them.

and that is in the initial release. Given this is web based development I would expect we will see more DVR spanning functionality


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## davezatz (Apr 18, 2002)

innocentfreak said:


> Of course this raises questions like if you move are the passes locked to the old channels or will it try to update via the guide first? Also if it uses the guide what happens if you try to copy something not on the Tivo.


Maybe this helps...


WishList® recordings and manual recordings are not currently displayed in the Season Pass manager.
Changes made on the Season Pass manager may not be displayed on your TiVo box immediately.
When copying Season Pass requests between boxes that are not in the same location, the Season Pass show must be scheduled to air within the next 14 days, as each box will be using a different channel lineup


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Thanks I was afraid of that last part. Hopefully in the future you will be able to park inactive season passes so that they automatically get sent to the TiVo once the show is in the guide. It sounds like it would work ok if you move though.

Like previously mentioned though if you upgrade and replace your TSN will this still be an option to copy shows to the new TiVo even just for a limited time.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

:down: Not so useful after all, especially because of limitation where show has to be in guide in order for it to work. So this really is just facilitating what can be done manually now via TiVo interface which is much less useful than I was hoping for. I was really hoping for a full scale backup capability of season passes (where even shows not currently in guide would work as well).

Also, advanced wishlists can be quite complex and re-entering one manually is much more painful than setting up a season pass, so hopefully they can eventually be managed via this tool as well.


davezatz said:


> Maybe this helps...
> 
> 
> WishList® recordings and manual recordings are not currently displayed in the Season Pass manager.
> ...


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

innocentfreak said:


> Gotcha. It seems like it would be helpful though for example if you changed providers or moved. I know someone from engadget recently moved and was complaining about there was no easy way to change the channels on season passes. This tool seemed like a good way to simplify it. I cant imagine having to change every season pass channel on all my passes.


No need to change channels. the TiVo will automatically start recording the Season Passes from the new channel numbers with the new provider.

The only issue is the actual SP will show the old channel numbers even though it will be recording the SP properly on the new provider.
This has worked with my boxes going from comcast to FiOS, FiOS to Comcast, and from FiOS to OTA.
in all situations the Season Passes continued to record from the new channel numbers with no intervention from me except doing a new guided setup.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

moyekj said:


> :down: Not so useful after all, especially because of limitation where show has to be in guide in order for it to work.


I think that's only the case for TiVos that are in different locations (by which I think they mean in different ZIP codes).

Though, thinking about it, this should only be a problem a) for shows on the OTA networks, and b) for TiVos that are in different TV markets. In every other case, the show is on the same "channel" on both TiVos, even if the channel number is different.



moyekj said:


> Also, advanced wishlists can be quite complex and re-entering one manually is much more painful than setting up a season pass, so hopefully they can eventually be managed via this tool as well.


I agree with this completely, and I use ARWLs to record all my HBO shows since I now have multiple HBO channels in HD.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

aindik said:


> I think that's only the case for TiVos that are in different locations (by which I think they mean in different ZIP codes).
> 
> Though, thinking about it, this should only be a problem a) for shows on the OTA networks, and b) for TiVos that are in different TV markets. In every other case, the show is on the same "channel" on both TiVos, even if the channel number is different.


My guess is it is for all shows and situations. It makes sense if in the background it is just using the request a new season pass feature currently on TiVo.com. It is probably just forwarding the show ID and settings to search.

Personally being able to move season passes online for now is enough for me. There are many options they could go with in the future that would only expand the benefits. I think if TiVo keeps up with it and continually improves it, it could really become something that we will wonder how we ever did things without it. My guess is they probably want to roll out the basics to let people use it to see what requests pop up and also what if any errors that need to be addressed.

I would also love to see this type of functionality added to TiVo Desktop one day.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

aaronwt said:


> No need to change channels. the TiVo will automatically start recording the Season Passes from the new channel numbers with the new provider.
> 
> The only issue is the actual SP will show the old channel numbers even though it will be recording the SP properly on the new provider.
> This has worked with my boxes going from comcast to FiOS, FiOS to Comcast, and from FiOS to OTA.
> in all situations the Season Passes continued to record from the new channel numbers with no intervention from me except doing a new guided setup.


Good to know. I wonder if anyone told Reckless. I haven't changed providers so I didn't realize it would work without changing the channel.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

mattack said:


> "transfers work in both directions" That sort of sounds like it means you can "back up" your season passes. Not useful when your tivo breaks, but possibly useful if you get a new one before you sell/retire your old one.


Yup, I was right.. It's *NOT* "DVR-Spanning Season Pass Manager", at least not the way I was interpreting that phrase.

I was interpreting that phrase as being cooperative scheduling.

This feature is "just" the ability to move season passes between Tivos. Don't get me wrong, it's useful, and I will probably use it but unfortunately it's among the most minor things I would choose to "fix" on Tivos. (Don't get me wrong, I love Tivos.)


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

moyekj said:


> :down: Not so useful after all, especially because of limitation where show has to be in guide in order for it to work.


only if the channel lineup is not the same. If the channel lineup is the same then you can copy away whether a show is in guide or not.


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## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

mattack said:


> Yup, I was right.. It's *NOT* "DVR-Spanning Season Pass Manager", at least not the way I was interpreting that phrase.
> 
> I was interpreting that phrase as being cooperative scheduling.
> 
> This feature is "just" the ability to move season passes between Tivos. Don't get me wrong, it's useful, and I will probably use it but unfortunately it's among the most minor things I would choose to "fix" on Tivos. (Don't get me wrong, I love Tivos.)


It's a good first step towards cooperative scheduling though, if that's where it's going.


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## wisny (Sep 6, 2010)

parzec said:


> I think they mean you can transfer the season pass itself, but not the actual shows the season pass records. So you could reconstruct all of the season passes from one Tivo complete with priority and settings easily on a newly purchased Tivo or any other Tivo on your account.


:up: ty



netringer said:


> Nice!
> 
> I wonder if this will help solve the dreaded "Please Wait" when you make any change on in Season Pass Manger with 100+ SPs.
> 
> If you can change your priorities and delete SPs on the web and have your Tivo(s) update and sort in the background later rather than having it hang for many minutes it would be a godsend.


Oh man, that 'please wait' screen is a killer .... it hangs and hangs and hangs...



davezatz said:


> Maybe this helps...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 Whoa ... big let down. It's only for SPs, and not for WLs? *sigh*


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## TerpBE (Jan 23, 2003)

wisny said:


> Whoa ... big let down. It's only for SPs, and not for WLs? *sigh*


I assume that "not _*currently *_displayed" indicates that they will be added in the (hopefully near) future.


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## wisny (Sep 6, 2010)

TerpBE said:


> I assume that "not _*currently *_displayed" indicates that they will be added in the (hopefully near) future.


 ahh, I hope so!


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## aadam101 (Jul 15, 2002)

They couldn't even spell the TITLE correctly! Just another half baked Tivo product......

http://blog.tivo.com/2010/10/tivo-launches-the-online-season-pass®-manger/

Currently it says "TiVo Launches the Online Season Pass® Manger"


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## nocturne1 (Aug 17, 2004)

So it seems that for EVERY drag/drop you make, it makes you sit there until the change is communicated to the TiVo. So yes, you avoid the huge "please wait", but you get an annoying distributed one through the web UI.

Would be nice if you could back them up. Select all / delete is a scary thing to consider.


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## shaown (Jul 1, 2002)

bummer - I'm gettin

Error 500--Internal Server Error 
From RFC 2068 Hypertext Transfer Protocol -- HTTP/1.1:
10.5.1 500 Internal Server Error
The server encountered an unexpected condition which prevented it from fulfilling the request.

All of you go do something else so I can try it out!


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## TerpBE (Jan 23, 2003)

Me too:

Error 500--Internal Server Error
From RFC 2068 Hypertext Transfer Protocol -- HTTP/1.1:
10.5.1 500 Internal Server Error

The server encountered an unexpected condition which prevented it from fulfilling the request.


A minute ago it actually seemed to let me in, but showed a generic Tivo and said something like "The Tivo you selected will not work with this page"


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## Martin Tupper (Dec 18, 2003)

It's live.

So if it doesn't display WLs, how does it handle them while rearranging things? My #1 SP is an ARWL for Redskins Football. It doesn't show up on the SPM site. SPM says that Fringe is my #1 SP. If I move another show to #1, ahead of Fringe, will it also go ahead on the Redskins ARWL?

ETA. Looks like the SPM site is already down again.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

It is probably getting hammered. I like the fact they have a dedicated feedback link


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Martin Tupper said:


> It's live.
> 
> So if it doesn't display WLs, how does it handle them while rearranging things? My #1 SP is an ARWL for Redskins Football. It doesn't show up on the SPM site. SPM says that Fringe is my #1 SP. If I move another show to #1, ahead of Fringe, will it also go ahead on the Redskins ARWL?
> 
> ETA. Looks like the SPM site is already down again.


Try it and let us know


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

Am I missing something, or can you only see your first 33 season passes?


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

aindik said:


> Am I missing something, or can you only see your first 33 season passes?


No I see all, ok I won't name how many. I think everyone is hitting the servers at once so traffic is just overwhelming right now.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

innocentfreak said:


> No I see all, ok I won't name how many. I think everyone is hitting the servers at once so traffic is just overwhelming right now.


I'm not seeing any way to scroll past No. 33.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

aindik said:


> I'm not seeing any way to scroll past No. 33.


For me it is all on one giant page. I just keep scrolling down with the mousewheel. It sounds like the page is only loading partially or your browser isn't liking it. I would try another browser or try it again in a bit when it slows down.


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## ghuido (May 9, 2007)

I'm trying it and I think it is a good improvement. 

Very easy to use. Have had no problem. I can see my 40+ Season Passes with no issue. Drag and delete with no problem. 

I can do some Season Pass "Spring Cleaning"

Can it be better yes but it is a great step in the right direction.


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## shaown (Jul 1, 2002)

I see all 58 of mine - already putting the feature to good use.
Thumbs up Tivo


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## daveak (Mar 23, 2009)

Cool. And even cooler when it will incorporate wishlists. :up:

One step closer to cooperative scheduling.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

I was having issues at work which is IE7 and probably missing some updates, but working fine for me at home on Firefox.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

Works better than I thought it was going to be - it's good that shows don't have to be in guide to be copied to another DVR with same channel lineup. I do have both repeat manual recordings and auto record wishlists though which I wish could be operated on as well, but this is a very good start by TiVo.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

moyekj said:


> Better than I thought it was going to be. I do have both repeat manual recordings and auto record wishlists though which I wish could be operated on as well, but this is a very good start by TiVo.


Have you checked to see how it handles moving passes around where those are?


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

innocentfreak said:


> Have you checked to see how it handles moving passes around where those are?


 Not yet, I'm not home and my Slingbox IR blaster is not working right now so I can't control box remotely to check things out yet.


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## generaltso (Nov 4, 2003)

Okay, now I'm nervous. I just deleted a few Season Passes from the web interface, which seemed to go fine. But now that I'm looking at the list on the web, there are several Season Passes that aren't there. They're in the list on my TiVo, but they're missing from the list on the web. Do you suppose that this list from the web is now going to replace the list on my TiVo since I made some changes? That will make me unhappy.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Try forcing a daily call and see if it updates assuming of course they are wishlists or manual recordings.


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## bigpatky (Apr 23, 2008)

generaltso said:


> Okay, now I'm nervous. I just deleted a few Season Passes from the web interface, which seemed to go fine. But now that I'm looking at the list on the web, there are several Season Passes that aren't there. They're in the list on my TiVo, but they're missing from the list on the web. Do you suppose that this list from the web is now going to replace the list on my TiVo since I made some changes? That will make me unhappy.


the only season passes that show up in my tivo but not online are those setup as wishlist season passes. those are ignored online. could that be it?


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

innocentfreak said:


> Try forcing a daily call and see if it updates assuming of course they are wishlists or manual recordings.


From what I can tell the web site updates are triggered by the VCM connections so you'd have to wait for that to occur. I think you can force a VCM by using TiVo Search Beta.


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## generaltso (Nov 4, 2003)

bigpatky said:


> the only season passes that show up in my tivo but not online are those setup as wishlist season passes. those are ignored online. could that be it?


Nope, they're regular season passes. I guess I'll see what happens when it updates.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

Does the Tivo connect in the background, or only when it's at certain screens?

e.g. go into the season pass manager ON THE TIVO and try to mess with it on the web at the same time.. what happens? or even go into 'modify this season pass' and delete from the web at the same time..?

Hopefully it only connects to the network when you're in "viewing TV mode" or some other well determined points.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

innocentfreak said:


> Have you checked to see how it handles moving passes around where those are?


 I had one wishlist that was first in priority that got moved down to second when in web interface I moved a show up to spot #1. I had a repeat manual record that was last that now got moved up ahead of season passes I copied from my other TiVo. I guess it worked pretty much as expected, though these "blind" items that can't be manipulated make it so you don't quite get what you want.

Good news is I had a few season passes of shows currently not in guide that copied over to another TiVo with same guide listings just fine (and preserved season pass options as well), so that indeed does work. Very nice if you get a new TiVo and want to copy over season passes. I wish this had been released a couple of months ago when I first got my Premiere and retired an S3.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Good to know. My organizational skills are lacking or I would write up a nice FAQ post like bkdtv's FAQs just to answer things like this as we discover them.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

My issue about not seeing all the SPs looks like it wasn't an issue. I just have fewer than I thought when you exclude ARWLs.


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## TerpBE (Jan 23, 2003)

I did a little online SPM shuffling this afternoon, including on an old S2 that I don't really use anymore.

Then I got home and checked, and realized that my S2 was having network problems and hadn't had a successful connection since 9/30. BUT, the online season pass manager listed the season passes for it. So does that mean that they had been storing all of our season pass information on Tivo servers since (at least) September? Maybe forever? I'm not completely surprised if that's the case, I just found it interesting.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

My guess is it has it since the last call-in. Of course there may be a limit on how far out it keeps the data.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

If you transfer service from 1 TiVo to another I hope there's a little grace period where the data for the original TiVo is still available on web site to be copied to your new TiVo. In my experience not too long ago I transferred service from my S3 to a Premiere the S3 dropped off my account at tivo.com web site right away.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Margret is looking into if that is possible.


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## windracer (Jan 3, 2003)

My little sister just got a TiVo Premiere yesterday, good timing. She reported she was able to use the Season Pass Manager to copy all of her SPs from her old Series2 to the Premiere without any issue. :up: Now she just needs her CableCARD installed.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

moyekj said:


> If you transfer service from 1 TiVo to another I hope there's a little grace period where the data for the original TiVo is still available on web site to be copied to your new TiVo. In my experience not too long ago I transferred service from my S3 to a Premiere the S3 dropped off my account at tivo.com web site right away.


That would be annoying. The 30 day free trial would help with that, except that during the 30 day free trial, the new box is not associated with anyone's TiVo.com account.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

windracer said:


> My little sister just got a TiVo Premiere yesterday, good timing. She reported she was able to use the Season Pass Manager to copy all of her SPs from her old Series2 to the Premiere without any issue. :up: Now she just needs her CableCARD installed.


The problem as I see it is when going from a Series 2 to any HD TiVo you will get only the SD channels for your Season Pass, you will have to go in manually and change them to the HD channel. The system will work great going from a Series 3 platform to a Series 4 or later platform. I don't think anybody has given thought about the SD to HD problem, as the same problem would happen (not done very much I would think) of going from a HD TiVo to a SD TiVo.


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## aindik (Jan 23, 2002)

lessd said:


> The problem as I see it is when going from a Series 2 to any HD TiVo you will get only the SD channels for your Season Pass, you will have to go in manually and change them to the HD channel. The system will work great going from a Series 3 platform to a Series 4 or later platform. I don't think anybody has given thought about the SD to HD problem, as the same problem would happen (not done very much I would think) of going from a HD TiVo to a SD TiVo.


If the SP is for a show currently in the guide data, the web transfer will give you the opportunity to pick which channel to associate with on the new box.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

aindik said:


> If the SP is for a show currently in the guide data, the web transfer will give you the opportunity to pick which channel to associate with on the new box.


I have not tried out the system so if what you say is true than the only problem may be a show that not on in the next two weeks for whatever reason.


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## windracer (Jan 3, 2003)

I tested this (S2 to S3/S4) out a bit and it's pretty cool.

- if I copy an SP from my S2 (analog channel) to my THD (which has the analog channel unselected) it will automatically pick the HD channel

- if I copy an SP from my S2 (analog channel) to my THD and the show appears on multiple selected channels, it will prompt:










- if no shows are airing in two weeks, you can't copy it at all 

So it seems pretty robust in that regard (except for not being able to copy non-airing SPs, which would be really helpful).


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## TrueTurbo (Feb 19, 2008)

windracer said:


> - if no shows are airing in two weeks, you can't copy it at all


This may only be an issue transferring an SP from an SD Tivo to a HD Tivo. I successfully transferred an SP from my TiVo HD to my Premiere XL yesterday, and the program has no showings in the guide yet.


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## TerpBE (Jan 23, 2003)

TrueTurbo said:


> This may only be an issue transferring an SP from an SD Tivo to a HD Tivo. I successfully transferred an SP from my TiVo HD to my Premiere XL yesterday, and the program has no showings in the guide yet.


I think he's specifically referring to the case where the two Tivos have different channel lineups - or at least when the "from" Tivo's SP channel doesn't exist on the "to" Tivo. In your case, I'd guess that your HD season passes are all on channels that also exist on your Premier.


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## Stormspace (Apr 13, 2004)

Noticed that it didn't want to delete a season pass I copied to another DVR. It kept putting it back on the original TiVo.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

Does anybody know if your TiVo goes poof and you replace the TiVo or drive can you get back your Season Passes ??


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

I sent a message to Margret the day it came out asking and she was looking into it to see if the functionality was possible. I haven't heard back yet. Worst case I would suggest adding a comment on the page for feedback. 

Maybe we should make an unofficial SPM suggestion thread in suggestions so we can make one giant recommendation.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

I spent a good 20 minutes or so yesterday re-organizing season passes via web site for my S3 TiVo - changing priority order only. When I arrived home and checked season passes several hours later almost none of my changes on web site took effect!? I didn't think at that point to go check the web page again to see what it thinks the order was. I ended up having to do it again on the TiVo itself and then those changes were reflected to web page.

i.e. I think there are bugs with changing order with web page, maybe when you make several changes at once. It would be better if the page just let you make a whole bunch of changes and then have a "submit" button at the end. Looks to me like with current method every change you make individually is submitted which may end up confusing things when you have several changes.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

moyekj said:


> i.e. I think there are bugs with changing order with web page, maybe when you make several changes at once. It would be better if the page just let you make a whole bunch of changes and then have a "submit" button at the end. Looks to me like with current method every change you make individually is submitted which may end up confusing things when you have several changes.


I definitely agree that it needs a submit button. I would almost say also if you start to move season passes you lose the selection of the other TiVo on the screen and both columns become the current TiVo. This way one is the original order while the other is what you are currently shifting. This way also you could verify your changes before hitting the submit button.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Here is my current list of suggestions I have sent to TiVo.

Add a submit button so you can choose to send the changes to your TiVos when you are actually done with all you changes.

Keep a change log. This would not only allow you to keep track of your changes in case you want to revert them, but also so that you could see in case they didn't go through.

You should be able to add shows on the same page so you can not only add them but put them where you want them. 

You should have an additional option instead of just your TiVos. This would allow you to see a universal list of all your season passes in alphabetical order with a note under the show name and channel which TiVos have the season pass so you can just copy from that screen. This also makes it easier to find the show you want. 

Conflict tools.

Show an updated to do list compared to the new one before sending season passes. This obviously lets you review the changes to make sure you get the results you are expecting to get.

Ability to add season passes for the past or future similar to the Netflix queue. Once it shows in the guide it would prompt you to move it where you want it after verifying it is on the channel you want. 

Ability to pause season passes. This would work similar to future season passes where you could remove shows after their season was over but it would save it on the site so once it came back you could just copy it over again. 

I am sure I missed a couple.


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## shwru980r (Jun 22, 2008)

ferrumpneuma said:


> This is par for the course at TiVo. Great idea, poor execution.:up::up::up:


Why pay people to test the software when the customer will do it for free?


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## muerte33 (Jul 4, 2008)

Has anyone asked for a backup feature. Like backup Season Pass schedule for TivoX.
This would be nice when the hard drive dies.

Sorry LESSD, I saw your post after I hit the Save button.
Would be nice to be able to back up our Thumb Ratings too.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

shwru980r said:


> Why pay people to test the software when the customer will do it for free?


Maybe you got a bill for this new service, but i did not, we all got more than we had before, even if it is not perfect, so for people that want improvement do some free testing.
If we all complain more maybe TiVo will stop giving us software that they have not promised.


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## LynnL999 (Oct 7, 2002)

I used to backup my season pass list by taking pictures of the screens, or by scrolling through slowly on the DVD recorder -- so just being able to copy from the web site is a big improvement.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

muerte33 said:


> Has anyone asked for a backup feature. Like backup Season Pass schedule for TivoX.
> This would be nice when the hard drive dies.
> 
> Sorry LESSD, I saw your post after I hit the Save button.
> Would be nice to be able to back up our Thumb Ratings too.


Even if they have, the more people who request it via the feedback option on the SPM page, the more chance we might see it.


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## tootal2 (Oct 14, 2005)

I moved my sseason passes around in the season pass manager but they dont change on my tivo. I have also deleted season passes from the the season pass manager and they dont delete.

Am i doing something wrong?

thanks


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Changes made on the Season Pass manager may not be displayed on your TiVo box immediately. It has been several hours I would definitely report it on their site with the link in my sig.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

aadam101 said:


> They couldn't even spell the TITLE correctly! Just another half baked Tivo product......
> 
> http://blog.tivo.com/2010/10/tivo-launches-the-online-season-pass®-manger/
> 
> Currently it says "TiVo Launches the Online Season Pass® Manger"


Maybe it was supposed to say "Season Pass Mangler".


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## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

ferrumpneuma said:


> This is par for the course at TiVo. Great idea, poor execution.:up::up::up:


Yes that's why I can't muster up the strength to care about this new feature.

But, on paper, my Tivo Premiere is awesome.


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## DaveDFW (Jan 25, 2005)

I tried the new SPM feature. I found that copying a large block of SPs from one S3 to another did not preserve the recording priority--in fact, I see not see any pattern to the new order, SPM just seems to just randomize them.

I also attempted to reorder them via the SPM tool, which is quite slow and tedious. It appears to accomplish nothing other than wasting a bunch of time--all the SPs reverted back to the original randomized order.

Is this just happening to me?


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

DaveDFW said:


> I tried the new SPM feature. I found that copying a large block of SPs from one S3 to another did not preserve the recording priority--in fact, I see not see any pattern to the new order, SPM just seems to just randomize them.
> 
> I also attempted to reorder them via the SPM tool, which is quite slow and tedious. It appears to accomplish nothing other than wasting a bunch of time--all the SPs reverted back to the original randomized order.
> 
> Is this just happening to me?


 No it's not just you. When I moved one SP via interface and let it sit it worked OK. When I moved around a bunch of SPs it didn't work at all. About the only thing I found of value was being able to copy SPs for shows not currently in guide from 1 DVR to another.
I think to handle properly multiple SP re-ordering there really needs to be a submit button once you are done defining the order that you want instead of the current apparent method which submits every single change individually - I can see where that can confuse things really quickly on server side having to try and process each one individually when you have multiple requests. This would avoid the current pauses each time you move a SP around as well.


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## Gai-jin (Feb 28, 2000)

I'm running into trouble with this when making several consecutive changes. I went through and deleted a bunch of SP's for shows that have been cancelled, and verified they were removed from the list. After making a few more changes, I see them back in the list. Same thing when I move a show to a different slow, a few changes later it shows up back in it's old slot.


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

This is one of the big reasons several of us have said it needs a submit button. The more the merrier and maybe TiVo will listen. See sig for link.


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## TiVoJason (Nov 4, 2003)

Hi everyone,

We&#8217;ve investigated several of these cases of season pass manager changes not &#8216;sticking&#8217; and we have confirmed that it is in fact a bug that affects a minority of users. Unfortunately at this time, we haven&#8217;t been able to reproduce the issue reliably, but rest assured that we have people looking at the problem and working on a fix as soon as possible. In the mean time, for most people who encounter this issue, we suggest trying two things: a) submitting fewer changes at a time and b) submitting the same change request a second time.

We understand that this is can be a frustrating experience and we apologize for that. Please bear with us while we work on getting this addressed.

Thanks,

TiVoJason


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

TiVoJason said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> Weve investigated several of these cases of season pass manager changes not sticking and we have confirmed that it is in fact a bug that affects a minority of users. Unfortunately at this time, we havent been able to reproduce the issue reliably, but rest assured that we have people looking at the problem and working on a fix as soon as possible. In the mean time, for most people who encounter this issue, we suggest trying two things: a) submitting fewer changes at a time and b) submitting the same change request a second time.
> 
> ...


So I was right, it *was* supposed to say "Season Pass Mangler". : - )


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

TiVoJason said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> Weve investigated several of these cases of season pass manager changes not sticking and we have confirmed that it is in fact a bug that affects a minority of users. Unfortunately at this time, we havent been able to reproduce the issue reliably, but rest assured that we have people looking at the problem and working on a fix as soon as possible. In the mean time, for most people who encounter this issue, we suggest trying two things: a) submitting fewer changes at a time and b) submitting the same change request a second time.
> 
> ...


Glad to hear it is being looked into.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

TiVoJason said:


> In the mean time, for most people who encounter this issue, we suggest trying two things: a) submitting fewer changes at a time and b) submitting the same change request a second time.


 Thanks for the notification TiVoJason and glad to see TiVo is following up on the reported issues. For suggestion b) you mean try make the changes again AFTER the web page SP order has reset itself to match the TiVo again (and in some cases ignoring most if not all changes via web page)? Obviously when you make change via web site it will remain in the order you specified for some time (until next VCM connection by TiVo?), so one cannot submit changes twice right away.


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## aadam101 (Jul 15, 2002)

TiVoJason said:


> Hi everyone,
> 
> Weve investigated several of these cases of season pass manager changes not sticking and we have confirmed that it is in fact a bug that affects a minority of users. Unfortunately at this time, we havent been able to reproduce the issue reliably, but rest assured that we have people looking at the problem and working on a fix as soon as possible. In the mean time, for most people who encounter this issue, we suggest trying two things: a) submitting fewer changes at a time and b) submitting the same change request a second time.
> 
> ...


This seems to be a pretty standard answer from Tivo for everything these days. I think I'm just gonna eat the ETF and move on to something else. It seriously isn't worth it.


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## SullyND (Dec 30, 2004)

aadam101 said:


> I think I'm just gonna eat the ETF and move on to something else. It seriously isn't worth it.


Please do.

Thanks for the explanation TiVoJason, and welcome!


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

moyekj said:


> windracer said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder if I can use this to export my SPs back into my Excel spreadsheet. That would make keeping that thing up-to-date a bit easier.
> ...





aaronwt said:


> moyekj said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know how often the data at web site is going to be updated, (I would guess with each net connect) but I would want a copy of it for sure just in case it gets wiped out from web site.
> ...


I just played around with "forcing" a connection to the TiVo Service, and found some unusual results:

It appears the tivo.com's To Do List is directly connected to the VCM connection. My last VCM connection was on 10/19, 10:39 pm (and next scheduled VCM connection on 10/20, 1:57 am), and the tivo.com's To Do List still showed things to do at 10/19 11:00 pm.

My forced Service connection completed on 10/20, 1:16 am, and the tivo.com's To Do List still shown things to do at 10/19, 11:00 pm. Since I was on the tivo site, I went ahead and deleted a Season Pass using SPM, probably around 1:20 am, a few minutes after the forced Service connection completed. Navigating to my Series3's Season Pass Manager, the Season Pass I deleted using SPM was already gone from the Series3!

On the surface it appears that SPM connects to the TiVo to do the update. However, I don't have port forwarding enabled for any of the TiVos I have, so I would think that getting into my LAN would be an issue. Maybe there's another connection not being reported in the TiVo's System Information screen?

Also to note, On 10/20 1:58 am, the tivo.com's To Do List rolled over to the next day, reflecting accurate information, and not shows in the past as it had done earlier.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

orangeboy said:


> My forced Service connection completed on 10/20, 1:16 am, and the tivo.com's To Do List still shown things to do at 10/19, 11:00 pm. Since I was on the tivo site, I went ahead and deleted a Season Pass using SPM, probably around 1:20 am, a few minutes after the forced Service connection completed. Navigating to my Series3's Season Pass Manager, the Season Pass I deleted using SPM was already gone from the Series3!
> 
> On the surface it appears that SPM connects to the TiVo to do the update. However, I don't have port forwarding enabled for any of the TiVos I have, so I would think that getting into my LAN would be an issue. Maybe there's another connection not being reported in the TiVo's System Information screen?


 Then the SPM probably works similar to how video "pushes" work. A task is queued up at mind.tivo.com server. Your TiVos check mind.tivo.com very often to see if there are any pending tasks at which point any queued tasks get processed. This happens usually within a minute or two. i.e. It's not really a "push" request but a "pull" request initiated by your TiVo checking mind.tivo.com which is why it doesn't matter if your TiVos are behind a firewall.
So this probably can be reverse engineered by network sniffing much like the video pushes were that resulted in "mind.py" in pyTiVo for pushing videos to TiVos.


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## ljr (Dec 21, 2004)

tomm1079 said:


> I just hope this will lead to "if this DVR is filled it will fall back to another dvr"


I also hope it will lead to "If this show cannot be recorded because of a conflict, record it on another DVR."


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## DaveDFW (Jan 25, 2005)

ljr said:


> I also hope it will lead to "If this show cannot be recorded because of a conflict, record it on another DVR."


But because MRV is crippled by CCI bytes, that show being recorded on a different Tivo will be trapped there. Cooperative recording will be useless unless MRV is fixed.


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## Martin Tupper (Dec 18, 2003)

DaveDFW said:


> But because MRV is crippled by CCI bytes, that show being recorded on a different Tivo will be trapped there. Cooperative recording will be useless unless MRV is fixed.


Even for people with CCI byte issues, network programing is still transferable. Cooperative recording will still give those people an added level of functionality. They may just need to prioritize cable programming above network programming so their cable shows record on the primary TiVo and network programing gets pushed to other TiVos (with the ability to transfer it back).


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

Or better yet, Tivo could implement streaming to avoid the CCI issues...


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

slowbiscuit said:


> Or better yet, Tivo could implement streaming to avoid the CCI issues...


The problem is streaming doesn't avoid CCI issues for TTG.


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## ljr (Dec 21, 2004)

DaveDFW said:


> But because MRV is crippled by CCI bytes, that show being recorded on a different Tivo will be trapped there. Cooperative recording will be useless unless MRV is fixed.


Even if MRV is crippled by CCI, I would still rather have the show recorded on an inconvenient Tivo than not recorded at all.


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## windracer (Jan 3, 2003)

ljr said:


> an inconvenient Tivo


Sounds like some Al Gore movie ...


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## daveak (Mar 23, 2009)

windracer said:


> Sounds like some Al Gore movie ...


I heard he invented TiVo.


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## tivogurl (Dec 16, 2004)

I don't understand why this couldn't be a local TiVo feature. It would be much more useful if one of my TiVos could transfer directly to the other one on my local network. Going through tivo.com is stupid.

I also noticed that one of my TiVos suffered 3 straight "connection aborted" messages when downloading new guide data today. I had to keep doing manual downloads until the 4th worked. I wonder if this had anything to do with the new Season Pass Manager feature.

The lack of Wishlist (both auto-recording and regular) support is discouraging. Why release without it?


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

tivogurl said:


> The lack of Wishlist (both auto-recording and regular) support is discouraging. Why release without it?


It is probably the same reason you can't request one online. I would think it is related to how you request a new show online since it uses a show ID.

I would definitely love to see it locally available either via IP or through TiVo Desktop so I can do it in realtime.


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

innocentfreak said:


> tivogurl said:
> 
> 
> > The lack of Wishlist (both auto-recording and regular) support is discouraging. Why release without it?
> ...


Just a little snippet of the still buggy down TiVoToDo python application I'm working on:


```
15:10:50=>tivotodo
Scanning for TiVos...  and found 2: TivoS3 TivoS4
Logging in...
Searching...
working on TivoS3
Added   Season Pass   : "Adam-12" to cache.
Added   Season Pass   : "Everyday Edisons" to cache.
Added Manual Recording: "Dragnet" to cache.
Added   Season Pass   : "Emergency!" to cache.
Added    Wish List    : "Criminal Minds" to cache.
Added   Season Pass   : "That '70s Show" to cache.
Added   Season Pass   : "Nova scienceNOW" to cache.
```


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## innocentfreak (Aug 25, 2001)

Pulling ARWL and manual recordings from the to do list then I assume?


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

innocentfreak said:


> Pulling ARWL and manual recordings from the to do list then I assume?


Yes sir! tivo.com provides a little icon in the To Do List I had been overlooking, and it was a quick and cheap add-in to the program. There's no other detail (that I found yet) regarding _any_ recording options, such as "Keep at Most", or "First Run Only", though I believe that info is stored since all of those attributes are retained when copying a Season Pass to another box using SPM. Those details and options are just not visible within a browser as far as I can see.

I think SPM is definitely a step in the right direction, I'm just curious where TiVo goes as far as developing it further.


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## Chris Gerhard (Apr 27, 2002)

DaveDFW said:


> But because MRV is crippled by CCI bytes, that show being recorded on a different Tivo will be trapped there. Cooperative recording will be useless unless MRV is fixed.


Useless? You can't just watch it on the other DVR? I don't see how protected recordings, preventing transfer to another DVR can be fixed. Content owners have the right to use this technology and TiVo better honor it and make it impossible or in good faith, very difficult to circumvent. When the prohibition is incorrectly used, that is another issue and contacting the cable company or other service provider is all we can do.

I don't seem to care about this new season pass manager but it appears some think it is of use. I can figure out conflicts and decide what TiVo I want to record which programs without much difficulty and can easily modify season passes on each TiVo.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

Chris Gerhard said:


> Useless? You can't just watch it on the other DVR? I don't see how protected recordings, preventing transfer to another DVR can be fixed. Content owners have the right to use this technology and TiVo better honor it and make it impossible or in good faith, very difficult to circumvent. When the prohibition is incorrectly used, that is another issue and contacting the cable company or other service provider is all we can do.


They can be fixed for MRV with streaming, which Moxi, WMC and Direct TV have. The file is not transferred in that case. Can't do anything about transfer to PC though.


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

I tried it for the first time last night, to move modern family & cougar town to my TivoHD from my S3 (since I had 1 minute pre/post pad on both of them, one was always getting clipped due to another recording on the S3).

So I moved them, and then moved one to the top, and I think one to the middle (unless I'm missing something, it's VERY VERY VERY VERY much a pain to move a SP a long ways.. it's easier on the Tivo itself, with 'grab' then page up).. 

after waiting a long time, I had thought neither got moved.. but really, one got moved to the middle, one got moved to the bottom of the list.


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## DaveDFW (Jan 25, 2005)

It has been a few weeks now and SPM still behaves the same way.

If I take any block of 10 passes and try to transfer them to another Tivo, the order is just randomized on the new box. Then attempting to reorder the passes through SPM is hit-or-miss...some changes are accepted and others discarded.

Concerning the suggestion above to "make fewer changes" at once...I wouldn't have to make so many changes if the passes were transferred with the original order.

Unfortunately, I assume all further development is halted once the press release has been sent out. Why bother actually creating something that works once they've received publicity?

TTYL
David


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

A subtlety that I didn't appreciate until I populated my new Premiere with the TiVo HD's SPs:

When you're done the destination will be full of SPs with no thumb ratings.

When you set up an SP on a TiVo it is given two thumbs up by default (single episode recordings are given one thumb up). But these aren't applied by default when the SP is copied into the TiVo from another TiVo. The solution is to manually rate each program once it is recorded.

Also, recurring manual recordings (e.g., record Comedy central each Monday from 11:00 to 11:30) don't appear in the online SP manager, so I have to manually set up the recordings for The Daily Show in the new TiVo.


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## moyekj (Jan 24, 2006)

pdhenry said:


> Also, recurring manual recordings (e.g., record Comedy central each Monday from 11:00 to 11:30) don't appear in the online SP manager, so I have to manually set up the recordings for The Daily Show in the new TiVo.


 Worse than that auto record wishlists don't show up at all in SP manager either, and they can be very complex to have to duplicate manually to a new TiVo.


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## TheWGP (Oct 26, 2007)

DaveDFW said:


> It has been a few weeks now and SPM still behaves the same way.
> 
> Unfortunately, I assume all further development is halted once the press release has been sent out.


Does anyone know if this comment has proven true? Seems like a simple web interface fix, but given Tivo's history I'm guessing it's still broken and will stay that way until the next box is released and they "optimize" it for that box.

Please... tell me I'm wrong, because I'd love to save all that time transferring SP's.


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## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

I got 50 or 60 SPs transferred, without thumbs, in _nearly_ the order I desired.

At first I tried to Select All and move them all at once but that failed, so I ended up moving them 8-10 at a time and it worked fine.

Where I saw changes in the SP order was when I was asked which channel to record the SP on on the new TiVo. I think that routine might change the order slightly. I would correct the order after each block of 8-10 SPs and that worked up to the very end when I could no longer drag & drop SPs.


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## deandashl (Aug 8, 2008)

I've never transferred SP, but I have reorganized with SPM. Sometimes it works, sometimes not. You cannot rely on it working.

I get a kick out of the fact you can't transfer more than 10 SP's at a time and they may be in the wrong order.

Another half-assed product from TiVo. And yes, the product is out (just like the Premiere) so therefore there will be NO new product development after the initial release.


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## rahnbo (Sep 12, 2010)

deandashl said:


> Another half-assed product from TiVo. And yes, the product is out (just like the Premiere) so therefore there will be NO new product development after the initial release.


What I really dislike is when I make a change with SPM then have to make a small change on the Tivo. If the change on the Tivo is made before the SPM change makes it through then all the SPM changes are undone. And why the heck are SPM changes just as slow to do on the PC as they are on Tivo?


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