# Once Upon A Time - "The Stable Boy" - S01E18 - 4/1/2012



## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

Really? THAT'S why you hate Snow White so much? If Regina had run off with Daniel, her mother would have hunted them down and killed him, so the result would have been the same. Snow was a child, and had good intentions with what she did. She didn't know that Cora was a power-hungry biyotch.

I guess in the next episode, Regina kills her mother and takes her power, probably with Rumpelstiltskin's help. 

I guessed when Sidney brought the flowers that they had a bug... way too predictable. Most of this episode was predictable, unfortunately, once we got 10 minutes in. Kathryn's reappearance was the only surprise. I wonder where Gold found her? And how do they explain the heart now?


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Yeah, looks like that's one frame that's not long for this world.


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## Maui (Apr 22, 2000)

They did a fantastic job casting that young Snow. She was very good and she bore a striking resemblance to Ginnifer Goodwin.


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## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

Maui said:


> They did a fantastic job casting that young Snow. She was very good and she bore a striking resemblance to Ginnifer Goodwin.


I agree 100%. At times it was almost disturbing how closely she managed to mirror some of Ginnifer's facial reactions and body language.


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## gchance (Dec 6, 2002)

Maui said:


> They did a fantastic job casting that young Snow. She was very good and she bore a striking resemblance to Ginnifer Goodwin.





LoadStar said:


> I agree 100%. At times it was almost disturbing how closely she managed to mirror some of Ginnifer's facial reactions and body language.


I looked her up on IMDb and it has a link to her Twitter stream. I love her exuberance for being on Once Upon a Time, it's really sweet.



> #OnceAUponTime is on tonight!!!! I'm getting into the #Once spirit thank you for all ur amazing tweets! #YoungSnow http://t.co/qxM8TRbW
> 
> Goosebumps...!!!! One more hour to go... I really really hope you like little snow! #OnceAUponTime #YoungSnow http://t.co/18TxjbIm
> 
> I haven't slept in three days!!!! Haha @HilariousSwag: @Baileemadison I couldnt sleep last night because im so excited


It seems so much more sincere than adult celebrity tweets. 

Greg


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## madscientist (Nov 12, 2003)

Not bad.  I wasn't too disappointed with the reason Regina hates snow, although the writers had gotten themselves into such a corner that there wasn't much of anywhere else they could go: it wasn't a big surprise. Still, Snow did break a promise and it did cost Regina her love. We don't know the extent of the mother's powers so we don't know if she could have tracked down Regina or not, and once Regina was married to the stablehand I don't think tracking her down would have served much purpose: I doubt she could have come back and married the king anyway.

I was satisfied with the resolution of that plotline. I'm also happy Emma found out about Glass: that was getting pretty stale.

Kathryn reappearing?!?! So, what's the story with the DNA test on the heart that showed it was Kathryn's? Did Regina have that faked too? Seems... odd.


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## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

Yawn. This episode was boring. A big letdown after last week. Obviously Regina can't just be an evil beeyotch, gotta give her a sympathetic back story. ZZzZzzzzzz.


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## BitbyBlit (Aug 25, 2001)

LoadStar said:


> I agree 100%. At times it was almost disturbing how closely she managed to mirror some of Ginnifer's facial reactions and body language.


Yeah, I thought the same thing. Whoever made that casting decision deserves a bonus!



Zevida said:


> Yawn. This episode was boring. A big letdown after last week. Obviously Regina can't just be an evil beeyotch, gotta give her a sympathetic back story. ZZzZzzzzzz.


I think it's only somewhat sympathetic. How one reacts to bad situations says more about them than good. She went from finding out what Snow did to deciding that she wanted revenge extremely quickly.

It's great that she wanted to live her own life, but even selfish people can want that. In this case, her mother was being unreasonable. But whose to say she wouldn't have run off with the stable boy even had he been someone who had wanted to run off with her parents' money?

All we really saw in this episode was that Regina can be friendly when she is getting what she wants. And when she doesn't, she has an extreme reaction to it.

Well, we also found out where Regina learned the heart trick. Does that make her the Princess of Hearts?


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## Generic (Dec 27, 2005)

Maui said:


> They did a fantastic job casting that young Snow. She was very good and she bore a striking resemblance to Ginnifer Goodwin.


I thought I recognized her. She was in the movie Just Go With It.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

I guess we can read between the lines about how the bug was able to help Regina know to replace the shovel, but I just felt like there was a piece of the story missing there with the way they portrayed it. We didn't see Emma talking about the evidence while in her office at all. Without that scene showing a conversation that the bug might have captured, it could just as easily have been the DA or the judge who signed the search warrant that called Regina and gave her a head's up before Emma got there.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

DevdogAZ said:


> We didn't see Emma talking about the evidence while in her office at all.


I suppose Regina overheard Emma's phone call to get the warrant? It's at times like these when I wonder if there isn't a scene that was cut for time...


gchance said:


> It seems so much more sincere than adult celebrity tweets.


Probably some fat 45-year-old guy in a publicist's office.


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## Maui (Apr 22, 2000)

gchance said:


> I looked her up on IMDb and it has a link to her Twitter stream. I love her exuberance for being on Once Upon a Time, it's really sweet.
> 
> It seems so much more sincere than adult celebrity tweets.
> 
> Greg


I did like one of Ginnifer Goodwin's Tweets



> OMG #OnceAUponTime OMG OMG OMG! I'm gonna retire & let Miss @BaileeMadison take over!


Bailee actually has more followers than Ginnifer.


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## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

When Cora took Daniel aside I said to myself "She's gonna rip his heart out", and she did!

I also agree with the casting of the young Snow White. Brilliantly done.


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## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

That was some of the best child acting I have ever seen.
I have to rewatch the episode for story because I was so mesmerized by that child's performance.


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

martinp13 said:


> Really? THAT'S why you hate Snow White so much?


I saw episode photos for this so I assumed that was the reason but was really hoping it was something more creative than this. The stable boy wasn't even hot.


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## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

Cearbhaill said:


> That was some of the best child acting I have ever seen.
> I have to rewatch the episode for story because I was so mesmerized by that child's performance.


I thought she was a little over the top, but the utter innocence made it seem right.  Especially for the character of Snow White.


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## tiams (Apr 19, 2004)

I wonder what made August get a catch in his step at the Toll Bridge.


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

tiams said:


> I wonder what made August get a catch in his step at the Toll Bridge.


I know.


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## tiams (Apr 19, 2004)

photoshopgrl said:


> I know.


You have knowledge of the reason, or you know, as in you also wonder?


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

tiams said:


> You have knowledge of the reason, or you know, as in you also wonder?


Haha! Sorry didn't mean to be so unclear. I don't KNOW but I have serious suspicions based on episode pics that I've seen that make way too much sense to be wrong......although I hope so. Not loving where I think they are going.

Okay sorry to sidetrack, back to the episode at hand.


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## SeanC (Dec 30, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I suppose Regina overheard Emma's phone call to get the warrant? It's at times like these when I wonder if there isn't a scene that was cut for time...


I assumed it was far more basic than that and had nothing to do with the bug.

Wouldn't getting a warrant involve speaking with the DA's office? And is it not clear that he is in Regina's pocket?

So I assumed that after getting the warrant, the DA told Regina to expect Emma and what she was looking for.


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## tiams (Apr 19, 2004)

photoshopgrl said:


> Haha! Sorry didn't mean to be so unclear. I don't KNOW but I have serious suspicions based on episode pics that I've seen that make way too much sense to be wrong......although I hope so. Not loving where I think they are going.
> 
> Okay sorry to sidetrack, back to the episode at hand.


 I can be too literal. I confuse myself.


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## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

I was also very impressed by the casting of little Snow. She had the appearance and mannerisms of big Snow. I really believed it was a younger version of the same person!


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

nyny523 said:


> I was also very impressed by the casting of little Snow. She had the appearance and mannerisms of big Snow. I really believed it was a younger version of the same person!


At one point I thought, "That can't be CGI...can it?"


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## oscarfish (Mar 2, 2009)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> At one point I thought, "That can't be CGI...can it?"


I am so glad someone else said it first.


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## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

Yeah, I considered motion capture with a de-aging program.


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## SeanC (Dec 30, 2003)

I was also very impressed by the little actress.


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## MNoelH (Mar 17, 2005)

While I was really impressed with Little Snow, Young Regina looked superb in the beginning. Later in the episode she was showing her age a bit (in her forehead mostly when she was distraught), but in the first few scenes she really looked very very young.


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## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

photoshopgrl said:


> Haha! Sorry didn't mean to be so unclear. I don't KNOW but I have serious suspicions based on episode pics that I've seen that make way too much sense to be wrong......although I hope so. Not loving where I think they are going.
> 
> Okay sorry to sidetrack, back to the episode at hand.


Can we hear your theory, in spoiler tags, of course.


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## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

KungFuCow said:


> Can we hear your theory, in spoiler tags, of course.


I dunno what she has in mind but there is rampant speculation elsewhere that


Spoiler



he is Pinocchio.
_"I don't lie!"_
And apparently wooden legs cramp easily 



I don't buy it but who knows.


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

KungFuCow said:


> Can we hear your theory, in spoiler tags, of course.


Okay here goes, purely my own speculation. I have no inside knowledge:


Spoiler



Based on these behind the scenes set pictures:
http://storybrooke.net/photos/thumbnails.php?album=178
and then August saying something about shin splints when they got near that very same water and then his indignation and comment "I'm not a liar" I'm betting he's Pinocchio.


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## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

Cearbhaill said:


> I dunno what she has in mind but there is rampant speculation elsewhere that
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> ...


That sounds kinda ridiculous to me.

But as you say - who knows...


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## KungFuCow (May 6, 2004)

Cearbhaill said:


> I dunno what she has in mind but there is rampant speculation elsewhere that
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> ...


Oh wow.. I hope not. Not the first time that character has been speculated.. people sure want to see it in this show. LOL


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

nyny523 said:


> That sounds kinda ridiculous to me.
> 
> But as you say - who knows...


I'll be glad to be ridiculous if it's not correct. I don't _want _it to be that. I mean I REALLY don't want that.


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## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> At one point I thought, "That can't be CGI...can it?"





oscarfish said:


> I am so glad someone else said it first.





Cearbhaill said:


> Yeah, I considered motion capture with a de-aging program.


I considered this possibility as well.


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## robojerk (Jun 13, 2006)

From TV.com


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

That reminds me. The whole thing with finding the piece of the shovel and then handling it while breaking into Regina's garage just seemed so amateurish. Not so much amateurish by Emma and August, but amateurish by the writers. You don't just wander into an unprotected, unguarded crime scene by yourself or with your buddy, dig up a piece of metal, and then expect that this "evidence" will be admissible at trial. Without a chain of command on the evidence and a guard at the scene, that "evidence" wouldn't be worth anything.


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Ha! Yeah I was thinking when she was sneaking into the garage that she better not think that's admissible... and of course, I don't think anyone was surprised that the shovel was replaced before the next day. Not only typical of any show but would be far too easy for this scenario!

Is the next one episode 19?? If so I think it's


Spoiler



another Rumple backstory! Woohooo and just for the ladies, I present you this small token of my mutual admiration for this man


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## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

Yebbut.... April 22??


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Cearbhaill said:


> Yebbut.... April 22??


Whatchoo talkin bout Willis????


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Oh hell. I totally forgot about that 3 week hiatus. Bastards. Now I'm sad again. Good thing I have GoT to get me through!


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## TiVangelist (Aug 28, 2000)

tiams said:


> I wonder what made August get a catch in his step at the Toll Bridge.


I thought maybe he hurt himself going there before - to plant that piece of shovel in the ground and lead Emma to Regina's garage.


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## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> At one point I thought, "That can't be CGI...can it?"


What I was thinking until I realized I knew her from Wizards of Waverly Place when she played the younger son. Probably why she has a big twitter following.


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## scooterboy (Mar 27, 2001)

TonyD79 said:


> What I was thinking until I realized I knew her from Wizards of Waverly Place when she played the younger son. Probably why she has a big twitter following.


She played a boy? I can't imagine she could be mistaken for a boy.


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

scooterboy said:


> She played a boy? I can't imagine she could be mistaken for a boy.


That just shows how good an actress she is!


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## mm2margaret (Dec 7, 2010)

Back at the episode........

Sorry folks, but I think that was a swing and a miss. The justification for the Queen hating Snow just didn't work, they didn't pull it off. I love the show, but, to quote the great philosopher, Groucho Marx, who in trying to explain a joke that went flat, said: "well, all the jokes can't be funny", and so we have a, well, not all the episodes can be great, result.

A Whiff......darn it!

As for Booth possibly being


Spoiler



Pinocchio


, I think not. Remember, he's the first stranger that's entered the town ever (outside of Emma), which suggests he's not an FTL character. The rest were all fixed in time, and he's quite different from the rest of them. He's the writer, and he's much more like Emma than the rest of them.


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## john4200 (Nov 1, 2009)

mm2margaret said:


> The justification for the Queen hating Snow just didn't work, they didn't pull it off.


I would have liked to have seen Regina kill her mother after she had killed the stable boy, and then inherit her power and go crazy from the combination of the trauma of the death of her love, the killing of her mother, and coming into the power. That would have been a more satisfying explanation.


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## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

john4200 said:


> I would have liked to have seen Regina kill her mother after she had killed the stable boy, and then inherit her power and go crazy from the combination of the trauma of the death of her love, the killing of her mother, and coming into the power. That would have been a more satisfying explanation.


I think that happens before the end of the season (my own opinion, not from anything else).


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## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

Do we know how old August is? If he's 35, I'm pretty sure at least half of his story.


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## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

scooterboy said:


> She played a boy? I can't imagine she could be mistaken for a boy.


No, I said she played the younger son. The show is about magic.


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

martinp13 said:


> Do we know how old August is? If he's 35, I'm pretty sure at least half of his story.


I've read so many other theories now that I've given up any thoughts and just hope they make it believable and more intriguing than the reason the EQ hates Snow so much.


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

TonyD79 said:


> No, I said she played the younger son. The show is about magic.


We're talking about an actress here, so in that context, the word "played" is generally used as a synonym for "portrayed" or "played the part of".

How are you using the word? Like "pranked"?


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## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

Amnesia said:


> We're talking about an actress here, so in that context, the word "played" is generally used as a synonym for "portrayed" or "played the part of".
> 
> How are you using the word? Like "pranked"?


No. The youngest son was turned into a girl magically but she was still the youngest son. Hilarity ensued He was restored later.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Amnesia said:


> We're talking about an actress here, so in that context, the word "played" is generally used as a synonym for "portrayed" or "played the part of".
> 
> How are you using the word? Like "pranked"?


I think the key word you're missing here is "magic"...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Max_Russo


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> I think the key word you're missing here is "magic"...


Magic could be used in a lot of different ways. She could have used magic to manipulate the boy like a puppet. She could have used magic to convince the boy that she was his twin sister. She could have used magic to make to boy fall madly in puppy love with her...


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Amnesia said:


> Magic could be used in a lot of different ways. She could have used magic to manipulate the boy like a puppet. She could have used magic to convince the boy that she was his twin sister. She could have used magic to make to boy fall madly in puppy love with her...


She portrayed the younger son who was temporarily turned into a girl by magic......not "oh man that girl totally played that boy for a fool".


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## tiassa (Jul 2, 2008)

> Originally Posted by Rob Helmerichs
> At one point I thought, "That can't be CGI...can it?"





> Originally Posted by oscarfish
> I am so glad someone else said it first.





> Originally Posted by Cearbhaill
> Yeah, I considered motion capture with a de-aging program.





> Originally Posted by loubob57
> I considered this possibility as well.


Simple answer guys: 
Ginnifer, play this scene with Lana, Bailee you watch. 
OK Bailee you play the scene. Roll cameras!


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## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

tiassa said:


> Simple answer guys:
> Ginnifer, play this scene with Lana, Bailee you watch.
> OK Bailee you play the scene. Roll cameras!


Gee, if only Strasberg, Kazan, Stanislavski, Adler, Lewis, Meisner et al had known it was that easy!!


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## tiassa (Jul 2, 2008)

loubob57 said:


> I considered this possibility as well.





Cearbhaill said:


> Gee, if only Strasberg, Kazan, Stanislavski, Adler, Lewis, Meisner et al had known it was that easy!!


It comes down to the casting, some actors are good a mimicking other people's mannerisms. You will also agree that my solution is easier than any of the other ideas that I copied into my post.


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

The real solution is even easier: Bailee simply studied Ginnifer's portrayal.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Where it becomes amazing is that A) it is rare to find a child who can act well at all (or at least it must be, since the number of incompetent child performances is much higher than for adults); B) it is rare to find a person who looks exactly like a specific other person; and C) it is rare to fund a person who can mimic another person precisely and naturally.

To find all three in one person...well, I'd say the casting director for OUaT is roughly as lucky as the MegaMillions winners.


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## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

I thought the child actress did fine but I didn't find it as astounding as the rest of the world did. That might have more to do with the material though.

As to August, I'll spoilerize the speculation talk, I have no info myself:



Spoiler



I'll be really disappointed if he is Pinocchio. First, August is thus far a cool and mysterious character. Pinocchio is neither of those. Second, it breaks the rules of the world set-up so far, which is that the people from FTL are stuck in Storybrooke. Third, it makes zero sense for Pinocchio to be a writer and to be editing the book of fairy tales. All the set-up that's been done on his character is as someone who studies and knows that world as an observer or even as a god in a way; not someone who lived in that world.


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## scooterboy (Mar 27, 2001)

TonyD79 said:


> No. The youngest son was *turned into a girl magically* but she was still the youngest son. Hilarity ensued He was restored later.


Gee, thanks for including that crucial little piece of info for those of us who have never seen that show.


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## Ereth (Jun 16, 2000)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Where it becomes amazing is that A) it is rare to find a child who can act well at all (or at least it must be, since the number of incompetent child performances is much higher than for adults); B) it is rare to find a person who looks exactly like a specific other person; and C) it is rare to fund a person who can mimic another person precisely and naturally.
> 
> To find all three in one person...well, I'd say the casting director for OUaT is roughly as lucky as the MegaMillions winners.


I recognized her but couldn't place her. I had to IMDB her to discover she was the youngest daughter in Bridge to Terabithia, and she was wonderful there, too.

But I agree, the fact that she looks so much like Ginnifer AND could mimic her acting is amazing. I was even thinking during the show that her mouth turned up in exactly the same way and that's a physical feature, not one that's easily adjusted in a performance.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

io9's recap: _Once Upon A Time_ reveals the Queen's epic grudge against Snow White, ruins everything


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> io9's recap: _Once Upon A Time_ reveals the Queen's epic grudge against Snow White, ruins everything


Haha! That's hilarious. And true. And the comments about Maine and King are funny as hell too.


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## madscientist (Nov 12, 2003)

john4200 said:


> I would have liked to have seen Regina kill her mother after she had killed the stable boy, and then inherit her power and go crazy from the combination of the trauma of the death of her love, the killing of her mother, and coming into the power. That would have been a more satisfying explanation.


But... how exactly would any of that be Snow's fault?

I think that would have been a far _less_ satisfying explanation, because it doesn't seem to explain anything


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## john4200 (Nov 1, 2009)

madscientist said:


> But... how exactly would any of that be Snow's fault?
> 
> I think that would have been a far _less_ satisfying explanation, because it doesn't seem to explain anything


You seem to have missed the part about going crazy. Insane. Bonkers. Nuts. Not all there. Batty. Loco. Psychotic. Cuckoo. Gaga. Not right in the head. Mad. Blame the closest person you can find whether it makes sense or not.


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## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

This show drives me batty. It has so much potential and I think they just punt it in so many ways. I feel like a perennial thread crapper and I don't mean to be. 

I've started to multi-task and play on my iPad while watching. Well, I didn't during Hat Trick.


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## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> io9's recap: _Once Upon A Time_ reveals the Queens epic grudge against Snow White, ruins everything


I think it is sad that a person who writes for a living doesn't know the difference between "your" and "you're".


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## tiams (Apr 19, 2004)

Zevida said:


> I feel like a perennial thread crapper


I've noticed.


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## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

nyny523 said:


> I think it is sad that a person who writes for a living doesn't know the difference between "your" and "you're".


Your kidding! They mixed that up?


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## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

nyny523 said:


> I think it is sad that a person who writes for a living doesn't know the difference between "your" and "you're".


That bugged me too!


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Zevida said:


> That bugged me too!


It's one of my pet peeves but if I comment every time it happens, I won't have time for my actual opinions on things. 

your/you're is the big one but also I see far too often then/than being used wrong.


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## tiams (Apr 19, 2004)

photoshopgrl said:


> It's one of my pet peeves but if I comment every time it happens, I won't have time for my actual opinions on things.
> 
> your/you're is the big one but also I see far too often then/than being used wrong.


I would rather cuddle then have sex


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

tiams said:


> I would rather cuddle then have sex


I see what you did there.


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## nyny523 (Oct 31, 2003)

photoshopgrl said:


> It's one of my pet peeves but if I comment every time it happens, I won't have time for my actual opinions on things.
> 
> your/you're is the big one but also I see far too often then/than being used wrong.


Don't even get me started...


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## pkscout (Jan 11, 2003)

OK, since we're speculating about August, based only on the previews for the next episode:



Spoiler



I'm wondering if August is Rumpelstiltskin's son. How he got older and how it didn't end up in Storybroooke I don't know.



That's my stake in the ground anyway.


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

pkscout said:


> OK, since we're speculating about August, based only on the previews for the next episode:
> 
> * SPOILER *
> 
> That's my stake in the ground anyway.


That's as good a theory as any.


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## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

scooterboy said:


> Gee, thanks for including that crucial little piece of info for those of us who have never seen that show.


Huh? I was asked to clarify. See all the above posts. So, better slow your roll(ing eyes)!


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

mm2margaret said:


> Back at the episode........
> 
> Sorry folks, but I think that was a swing and a miss. The justification for the Queen hating Snow just didn't work, they didn't pull it off. I love the show, but, to quote the great philosopher, Groucho Marx, who in trying to explain a joke that went flat, said: "well, all the jokes can't be funny", and so we have a, well, not all the episodes can be great, result.
> 
> A Whiff......darn it!


Why is it a whiff? Regina was in love. Regina shared that information with Snow White only because Snow White promised to keep it a secret. Snow White shared that secret with the one person Regina was trying to keep it secret from. Regina's lover was killed because Snow White didn't keep the secret. It's perfectly logical that Regina now has a burning hate for Snow White. It doesn't matter that Snow White's intentions were good.


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## john4200 (Nov 1, 2009)

DevdogAZ said:


> Why is it a whiff?


1) Snow was a child and could not be expected to understand the consequences of a secret like that, let alone understand how duplicitous Regina's mother was

2) Snow did not kill Regina's love, Regina's mother did

3) It is just hard to believe that an intelligent woman would devote her life to destroying the life of a child who broke a promise to not tell a secret


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## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

john4200 said:


> 1) Snow was a child and could not be expected to understand the consequences of a secret like that, let alone understand how duplicitous Regina's mother was
> 
> 2) Snow did not kill Regina's love, Regina's mother did
> 
> 3) It is just hard to believe that an intelligent woman would devote her life to destroying the life of a child who broke a promise to not tell a secret


You're thinking logically about this. People deeply in love, like Regina, often don't. All Regina can see is that as a direct result of Snow betraying her promise, the man she loved was killed. Just because Snow herself didn't do the killing doesn't change anything... as far as Regina is concerned, Snow killed her love by telling Regina's mother.

I didn't find the reveal to be at all disappointing or a letdown or anything like that.


----------



## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

LoadStar said:


> All Regina can see is that as a direct result of Snow betraying her promise, the man she loved was killed.


If she had held the grudge for a month, or a year, then I'd agree with you. But Regina certainly isn't stupid and she's been holding the grudge for about 40 years.

That seems a bit much, even for a woman who has lost her love...


----------



## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

Amnesia said:


> If she had held the grudge for a month, or a year, then I'd agree with you. But Regina certainly isn't stupid and she's been holding the grudge for about 40 years.
> 
> That seems a bit much, even for a woman who has lost her love...


Over time, the hate burrows in and takes a hold, and the reason behind the hate fades away and becomes irrelevant. All that remains is the hate.

It's like a family feud that starts over something incredibly stupid, like one family's dog killing another family's cat. After a while, no one cares at all about what caused it. The feud takes on a life of it's own.


----------



## john4200 (Nov 1, 2009)

LoadStar said:


> You're thinking logically about this.


You are thinking incorrectly about what I am thinking. I was thinking emotionally about it, not logically. The emotional thing to do would have been for Regina to lash out at her mother and kill her after she killed her love. But she did not.


----------



## LoadStar (Jul 24, 2001)

john4200 said:


> You are thinking incorrectly about what I am thinking. I was thinking emotionally about it, not logically. The emotional thing to do would have been for Regina to lash out at her mother and kill her after she killed her love. But she did not.


She'd be foolish/insane to try to lash out at her mother. Clearly her mother is incredibly proficient at magic, much much more so than Regina is. If Regina had tried to do something to her mother, it's likely that her mother could have easily dispatched her, or turned her into something, or something like that.

Besides, after years of being beaten down by her mother (figuratively, if not literally) it's much more likely for her to give up against her mother, and redirect her hatred towards a much more vulnerable target, one that Regina can easily handle.


----------



## murgatroyd (Jan 6, 2002)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> io9's recap: _Once Upon A Time_ reveals the Queens epic grudge against Snow White, ruins everything





Spoiler



"Meanwhile lovelorn Regina decides to run away with Daniel The Suitably Handsome Enough For This Show."



Snerk.


----------



## john4200 (Nov 1, 2009)

LoadStar said:


> She'd be foolish/insane to try to lash out at her mother.


You are thinking logically about this. People in great pain often don't.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

john4200 said:


> You are thinking logically about this. People in great pain often don't.


And no matter how logical or not the Great Revelation is, I found it profoundly unsatisfying.

Regina hates Snow because...Regina had a hissy fit. Just not as grand as I was hoping for.


----------



## loubob57 (Mar 19, 2001)

One factor - the thing Regina hates Snow for has to seem inconsequential to Snow. "What did I do for you to hate me so much?" Well, this kind of fits that mold.


----------



## tiams (Apr 19, 2004)

Regina has irrational hate in her heart because she is Evil. You are all trying to understand her in real world logic. She is an Evil Queen from Fairy Tale Land. Did you ever wonder before why any of the bad characters in fairy tales were bad? They just are. And some are pure and some are magical. 
She is an evil character, therefore, Snow breaking her promise is grounds for her to hate her. She was born to hate and we just saw her growing into her role. Is it any different from hating Snow because a mirror told her Snow was the fairest of them all?


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

loubob57 said:


> One factor - the thing Regina hates Snow for has to seem inconsequential to Snow. "What did I do for you to hate me so much?"


Well, no...Snow doesn't remember FTL. So she could have actually done something blameworthy, and just not remember it.

But that would require trickier writing...something that Regina can rationally blame Snow for, but that we wouldn't hold against her. I suspect they wrote themselves into a corner here, by having some undefined thing that Regina hates Snow about, and then when it came time to define it they couldn't come up with anything that really worked without making Snow even more unlikable than she already is (because of the terrible way she behaved over the David affair).

I guess planning ahead must be illegal in Hollywood, because no matter how strong the potential benefits, nobody ever seems to do it...


----------



## mm2margaret (Dec 7, 2010)

A couple of thoughts. First of all, the scenes and the writing of this episode just didn't work, at least for me. I didn't believe Regina's justification for hating Snow. They needed to do a better job of writing and directing the scenes to make it more believable that Regina would hold Snow (and not her Mother, who actually killed her love) responsible for the death of her beloved.

But really, it's all about the writing. In general, with TV shows, if they're well written, with believable characters and stories that are interesting, then almost anything can work. But if the writing is poor, then the shows suffer. There's only so much good acting and directing can do. The words have to be there.

OUAT in my view suffers from not so great writing from time to time. Some episodes sparkle, and others seem weak. I agree with Zevida that this show has such great potential, but like so many ABC shows, suffers from sporadically poorly written scripts. It's a shame, but this episode is a perfect example of writing that just doesn't cut it.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

For the past several episodes, they've been beating us over the head with the idea that "True Love Is The Most Powerful Thing In The World." Therefore, it shouldn't be any surprise that when Regina's True Love is killed, Regina develops a deep-seated hatred for the person who she believes to be responsible. If True Love is so powerful, then the hatred that stems from the loss of that True Love must also be very powerful.


----------



## Jonathan_S (Oct 23, 2001)

DevdogAZ said:


> Why is it a whiff? Regina was in love. Regina shared that information with Snow White only because Snow White promised to keep it a secret.


Regina confirmed what was blatently obvious only because Regina was sloppy and got caught with her secret boyfriend.

Its not like Regina decided to confide in Snow out of the blue. And I'm not sure what she possibly could have said that could have convinced Snow that nothing had been going on.

But accepting that your own mistake cost you your love's life... Blaming anyone else is far easier.


----------



## john4200 (Nov 1, 2009)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> And no matter how logical or not the Great Revelation is, I found it profoundly unsatisfying.


Right. The reason is both irrational AND unsatisfying.

I still think it would have been better if Regina lashed out and killed her mother immediately (with a lucky, unexpected stroke), then went crazy as she inherited the magic. With no one left (alive) to reasonably blame, in her madness, Regina blames Snow.


----------



## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

DevdogAZ said:


> For the past several episodes, they've been beating us over the head with the idea that "True Love Is The Most Powerful Thing In The World." Therefore, it shouldn't be any surprise that when Regina's True Love is killed, Regina develops a deep-seated hatred for the person who she believes to be responsible. If True Love is so powerful, then the hatred that stems from the loss of that True Love must also be very powerful.


I think you just swayed my opinion on this. That's a damn good way to think of it. In our world, her reasons and reactions would be ridiculous but in FTL where everything under the sun is all about true love .... well yeah, I kinda get it. :up:


----------



## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

mm2margaret said:


> A couple of thoughts. First of all, the scenes and the writing of this episode just didn't work, at least for me. I didn't believe Regina's justification for hating Snow. They needed to do a better job of writing and directing the scenes to make it more believable that Regina would hold Snow (and not her Mother, who actually killed her love) responsible for the death of her beloved.


For some people, it's much easier to blame an outside party than a parent because there's not the expectation that they are supposed to love the outside party.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

photoshopgrl said:


> I think you just swayed my opinion on this. That's a damn good way to think of it. In our world, her reasons and reactions would be ridiculous but in FTL where everything under the sun is all about true love .... well yeah, I kinda get it. :up:


I'm glad it made sense to somebody.


----------



## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

DevdogAZ said:


> I'm glad it made sense to somebody.


I just know she set the Land Speed World Record going from zero to b!tch.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

Overall, it was just weak. There was no depth to it, no character development, nothing. Just a SNAP and turned sweet, innocent, baby-faced, Daddy's Girl Regina into cold, hard, *****y, Queen of Evil Regina.

It was lazy writing. They could have, over the course of several episodes, shown how a teenaged Snow favored by her father undermined her step-mother over and over and caused a resentment and grew into anger turning a reasonable women into a psycho over time, while at the same time showing that as Regina's anger grew that Snow also grew up and out of that teen phase so that as adults they have reversed roles - Regina as the bitter child and Snow as the magnanimous adult.

That would have required (a) careful writing (b) character development, and OuaT doesn't seem to excel at either.


----------



## TonyD79 (Jan 4, 2002)

The simple solution was to not make Snow so young. What is completely unreasonable is for Regina to blame such a young person. There was no need to make her that young. 

Or make it the first in an escalation of arguments like the feud idea proposed earlier. 

It was lame.


----------



## ct1 (Jun 27, 2003)

So, honestly, did anyone else call the stable boy "farm boy"?


----------



## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

ct1 said:


> So, honestly, did anyone else call the stable boy "farm boy"?


He was no Westley.


----------



## Family (Jul 23, 2001)

DevdogAZ said:


> For the past several episodes, they've been beating us over the head with the idea that "True Love Is The Most Powerful Thing In The World." Therefore, it shouldn't be any surprise that when Regina's True Love is killed, Regina develops a deep-seated hatred for the person who she believes to be responsible. If True Love is so powerful, then the hatred that stems from the loss of that True Love must also be very powerful.


And they have been consistent with this. Snow became "bad" when she drank the potent that made her forget her true love. Even Mary Margaret is behaving questionably in the real world when separated from David. And Rumple was becoming a different person the longer the princess stayed with him.


----------



## tiassa (Jul 2, 2008)

Zevida said:


> Overall, it was just weak. There was no depth to it, no character development, nothing. Just a SNAP and turned sweet, innocent, baby-faced, Daddy's Girl Regina into cold, hard, *****y, Queen of Evil Regina.
> 
> It was lazy writing. They could have, over the course of several episodes, shown how a teenaged Snow favored by her father undermined her step-mother over and over and caused a resentment and grew into anger turning a reasonable women into a psycho over time, while at the same time showing that as Regina's anger grew that Snow also grew up and out of that teen phase so that as adults they have reversed roles - Regina as the bitter child and Snow as the magnanimous adult.
> 
> That would have required (a) careful writing (b) character development, and OuaT doesn't seem to excel at either.


My version of that was even simpler, it could have been that Regina (and her mother maybe) schemed to get her to marry the King (obviously "my" Regina starts out a little more evil than the one in the show), but then Regina couldn't give the King an heir (maybe the cost of magic they used to get the king to marry Regina was her fertility), so she takes it out on Snow because Snow will eventually rule, not her descendants. This has the added benefit of giving Storybrooke Regina a deep seeded need to have a son, so she adopts Henry.


----------



## madscientist (Nov 12, 2003)

john4200 said:


> You seem to have missed the part about going crazy. Insane. Bonkers. Nuts. Not all there. Batty. Loco. Psychotic. Cuckoo. Gaga. Not right in the head. Mad. Blame the closest person you can find whether it makes sense or not.


So, you think it would have been MORE satisfying to choose a complete cop-out plotline, "she's nuts, so we don't have to justify her reaction to anything"? I can only imagine the shrieks of dismay if they'd pulled that old chestnut, especially considering that Regina has been repeatedly shown to be anything _but_ batty, loco, cuckoo, etc.



john4200 said:


> I still think it would have been better if Regina lashed out and killed her mother immediately (with a lucky, unexpected stroke), then went crazy as she inherited the magic. With no one left (alive) to reasonably blame, in her madness, Regina blames Snow.


That is so completely contrary to all the character construction they've provided for Regina that there is no way it would work. Of course if they wanted to go that way they could have set it up over the course of the season, but given the character as written up until now that scenario is not reasonable.



photoshopgrl said:


> It's one of my pet peeves but if I comment every time it happens, I won't have time for my actual opinions on things.
> 
> your/you're is the big one but also I see far too often then/than being used wrong.


The one that _really_ makes me cringe is lose/loose. I see it all the time and there's just no excuse (unless your "o" key is sticking ).


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## john4200 (Nov 1, 2009)

madscientist said:


> So, you think it would have been MORE satisfying to choose a complete cop-out plotline, "she's nuts, so we don't have to justify her reaction to anything"?


No, they did go with a "complete cop-out". My scenario would be much better.


----------



## john4200 (Nov 1, 2009)

madscientist said:


> That is so completely contrary to all the character construction they've provided for Regina that there is no way it would work.


Regina is an intelligent psychotic, which is why it would be perfectly consistent with her character.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

tiassa said:


> My version of that was even simpler, it could have been that Regina (and her mother maybe) schemed to get her to marry the King (obviously "my" Regina starts out a little more evil than the one in the show), but then Regina couldn't give the King an heir (maybe the cost of magic they used to get the king to marry Regina was her fertility), so she takes it out on Snow because Snow will eventually rule, not her descendants. This has the added benefit of giving Storybrooke Regina a deep seeded need to have a son, so she adopts Henry.


That's brilliant! So much better.

I'm just going to pretend this is what happened and that the Stable Boy episode doesn't exist.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

john4200 said:


> No, they did go with a "complete cop-out". My scenario would be much better.


Better still would be to have no cop-out...to have figured out where they were going in the first place, and not have to jerry-rig something that was bound to disappoint no matter what they did.

They wrote themselves into a corner with no way out. They had to do _something_, and unfortunately this was about as "good" as they could have done.


----------



## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

While I'm disappointed in the reasoning behind EQ/Snow, I'm going to hand wave it this time. I don't have many complaints overall so I will let this one big thing go. Any others and I might have a problem. 

Also I think I'm still high on the Hat Trick episode.


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## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

At least this wasn't the season finale... they have a little time to recover.

I hope that cliffhanger is more than a 4 foot drop.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

I'm with plenty of others in this thread, as awesome as young Snow was, the actual reason behind Regina hating her wound up being a let down in the big picture, blaming a child is just not the right way to handle it.

I'm sure there could have been plenty of other ways to play this out, but a 1 episode "and this is the event that caused it all" seems like a cop out to me.


----------



## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

dianebrat said:


> I'm with plenty of others in this thread, as awesome as young Snow was, the actual reason behind Regina hating her wound up being a let down in the big picture, blaming a child is just not the right way to handle it.
> 
> I'm sure there could have been plenty of other ways to play this out, but a 1 episode "and this is the event that caused it all" seems like a cop out to me.


Yes, but I refuse to let it destroy my love for the show.
I'll wait for *martinp13*'s "4 foot cliffhanger" (lol) and lame resolution next season to do that for me.

No... no I won't.
I'm an optimist with regard to OUaT so this ep was but a tiny blip of mediocrity in an otherwise dazzling series.

Besides next episode is Rumpy!!!!!!
in three blasted weeks


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## WhiskeyTango (Sep 20, 2006)

john4200 said:


> No, they did go with a "complete cop-out". My scenario would be much better.


Sorry at least their cop out had a reason. Your cop out doesn't even have that going for it.


----------



## Church AV Guy (Jan 19, 2005)

Is it at least possible that this was only the first part of Regina's developing hatred for Snow? Maybe there's more to come, as in, not a single incident, but a series of incidents.

The deliberate killing of your true love is strong motivation for Regina to hate her mother though. Maybe Snow does something to transfer that feeling from her mother to her.


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## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

Church AV Guy said:


> Is it at least possible that this was only the first part of Regina's developing hatred for Snow? Maybe there's more to come, as in, not a single incident, but a series of incidents.
> 
> The deliberate killing of your true love is strong motivation for Regina to hate her mother though. Maybe Snow does something to transfer that feeling from her mother to her.


Perhaps? I hope so. But Regina had *That Look* in her eye as she walked away from Snow... we've seen it all season as she killed her father, stole back the curse, squished Graham, ad nauseum. Full ***** Mode. Maybe she shouldn't have shown that yet... just ***** Idle?


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## john4200 (Nov 1, 2009)

WhiskeyTango said:


> Sorry at least their cop out had a reason. Your cop out doesn't even have that going for it.


Huh? What "reason"? And how does my scenario not have a "reason"?


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## secondclaw (Oct 3, 2004)

I'd have to echo the comments on casting of young Snow ... First I thought it was Ginnifer then later that there was CGI involved. It took a while to finally accept that it was another actress.

As far as Regina turning to the dark side ... I imagine this was just the first spark. That she would live alongside Snow for a while and there would be other reasons to build animosity. And even in real life we hear of parents beating or even killing their kids for crap like spilled milk ... it does happen ... adults irrationally blaming kids. To me its not a stretch at all.


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## sieglinde (Aug 11, 2002)

In the fairytale it was jealosy. The mirror was constantly telling the evil queen that she was the fairest in the land and for some reason it tells the truth when Snow is of age and tells her that Snow White is the fairest in the land. This would have actually worked. Regina would be evil because of her mother. This is also the evil step-mother trope.


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## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

I agree that I think this is the first spark, and we read Regina's expression for more than it was. Maybe Regina ends up trying to kill Snow and accidentally kills Cora... that would do it!


----------



## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Yeah you know they only show small pieces of each story. I think there has to be more to this. She was her step mother for quite awhile. Did she have any powers when she tricked the genie into killing her husband? I don't remember that she did at that point. So we clearly haven't gotten more than the beginnings here.


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

Yes, but she was already -furious- with Snow in that last scene with her mother.


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## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

Robin said:


> Yes, but she was already -furious- with Snow in that last scene with her mother.


Last time I checked the Michelin's Guide To Evil, 'furious' is a completely different level of Evil than ripping out your father's heart. 

Even -furious-.


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

martinp13 said:


> Last time I checked the Michelin's Guide To Evil, 'furious' is a completely different level of Evil than ripping out your father's heart.
> 
> Even -furious-.


I think you're using an old edition...


----------



## BitbyBlit (Aug 25, 2001)

DevdogAZ said:


> For the past several episodes, they've been beating us over the head with the idea that "True Love Is The Most Powerful Thing In The World." Therefore, it shouldn't be any surprise that when Regina's True Love is killed, Regina develops a deep-seated hatred for the person who she believes to be responsible. If True Love is so powerful, then the hatred that stems from the loss of that True Love must also be very powerful.


I think it's not so much that Regina "became evil" because of losing her True Love, but rather that her True Love was keeping her from following in her mother's footsteps.

Regina's personality is to send out blame with a wide berth when things don't go her way. I think that was formed by how she was raised, not by the stable boy being killed. Her love for him, however, kept her focused on him, which suppressed that aspect of her personality. But it was always there, and with the stable boy gone, was allowed to finally surface.

We all recognize how unreasonable it was to blame Snow for what happened. But seeing how Regina was treated by her mother as an adult, I can only imagine what kind of unreasonable expectations were placed on her as a child. Perhaps to her those types of expectations were perfectly normal to place on children.

But I don't think she was just blaming Snow. She killed Snow's father, and presumably enacted some sort of revenge against her mother. Snow was just the only one left who could have been even remotely linked to the loss of her love, and who was in the way of her gaining power. Had the Huntsman killed Snow, that would have been the end of it. But Snow continuing to evade her, and then ending up finding her own True Love fueled Regina's jealousy to the point where she decided to enact the curse.

One thought I had, however, was that if her mother did indeed set up Snow so that Regina would save her, then her mother knew where both she and the stable boy were at that time, and thus probably already had a good idea that something was happening between them. In that case, Regina's mother was trying to pull information out of Snow not to find out what was going on, but to fuel Regina's hatred once Regina found out that Snow had spilled the beans.


----------



## Cboath (Jun 22, 2004)

pkscout said:


> OK, since we're speculating about August, based only on the previews for the next episode:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Just watched it tonight, and I was coming here to post the same theory..


----------



## Robin (Dec 6, 2001)

I don't think this needs tags since it's just speculation, not based on anything that hasn't been shown so far, but I'll stick with it.



Spoiler



Yes, I had the same thought! That Rumplestilstkin used his magic to protect his son from the curse which is why he lived outside Storybrooke.


----------



## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Robin said:


> I don't think this needs tags since it's just speculation, not based on anything that hasn't been shown so far, but I'll stick with it.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


But if that were true


Spoiler



Why does he not know him?


----------



## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

Another theory making the rounds stems from back when Regina first saw August and said _"He looks familiar..."_


Spoiler



If Rumpy made a deal with Cora (for wealth or a fancy husband) way back when she was the miller's daughter, at least in the versions I have read his price was always one's firstborn child. 
Perhaps Cora's first child was a boy...
And who even knows what happened to all the firstborns Rumpy received as payment for various things along the way- he probably farmed them out as adoptions in other deals.
That doesn't really address how August was not transferred to Storybrooke with everyone else, though.

I am leaning toward August either being the long lost Bael or Regina's long lost brother. 
I guess they could wank his being raised elsewhere any one of 1000 ways.


I would prefer that he remain a mysterious stranger a bit longer, I think.
The origin of the book could be seen as the genesis of the entire show, and his involvement with its contents has already been seen. 
I'd like some cryptic clues dropped about how he figures into _that_ more than anything. That's some serious magic right there and whether it was written within Storybrooke city limits, Fairy Tale Land, or the "real world" seems important to me somehow.


----------



## robojerk (Jun 13, 2006)

Regarding the theory about August.


Spoiler



Unless they can explain why he's not much, much older, I don't see how he could be Rumpelstiltskin's son. Remember Rumple took Charming's twin brother while still a a baby to give to the king. So Rumple's son should be a lot older.


----------



## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

I'm betting August is...


Spoiler



... the month after July. I win! 

I'm betting August is Pinocchio. Pooh pooh it all you want, but I think it fits.

- Pinocchio sent first or hiding in the cabinet, was the 7 year old boy that 'found' Emma.
- Bad legs. 
- Constantly talks about "not lying".
- Has knowledge about FTL.
- Regina might have seen Pinocchio in FTL, but she might not recognize him grown up in our world.

How he's connected to Henry's book, I dunno.

Regardless of whether he's Pinocchio or not, I believe he was the 7 year old boy that found Emma.


----------



## Cearbhaill (Aug 1, 2004)

martinp13 said:


> Spoiler
> 
> 
> 
> Regardless of whether he's Pinocchio or not, I believe he was the 7 year old boy that found Emma.


Oh, yeah.
Me too.
Absolutely.


----------



## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

There's no way guys. 


Spoiler



They've alluded to the fact that Rumple has been Rumple since the first ogre war and that was many many years before the curse. August would be much too young to be him.


----------



## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

What is this talk of a seven year old boy that found Emma? When did this happen?


----------



## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

DevdogAZ said:


> What is this talk of a seven year old boy that found Emma? When did this happen?


One of the episodes, maybe 9 or 10, MM finds Emma's baby blanket in her stuff along with a clipping from a newspaper saying a 7 year old boy found a baby on the side of the road.

ETA: Here's a shot of the clipping


----------



## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

photoshopgrl said:


> One of the episodes, maybe 9 or 10, MM finds Emma's baby blanket in her stuff along with a clipping from a newspaper saying a 7 year old boy found a baby on the side of the road.
> 
> ETA: Here's a shot of the clipping


The "author" of the article, Mark Soparlo, is a prop guy for the show, so don't bother trying to anagram his name or anything.


----------



## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

martinp13 said:


> The "author" of the article, Mark Soparlo, is a prop guy for the show, *so don't bother trying to anagram his name* or anything.


People do this kind of thing often?


----------



## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

photoshopgrl said:


> People do this kind of thing often?


Consider the source (a guy who figured out that he was a prop man)...


----------



## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Consider the source (a guy who figured out that he was a prop man)...


Ha! Fair enough.


----------



## Cboath (Jun 22, 2004)

photoshopgrl said:


> There's no way guys.
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> ...





Spoiler



Without knowing how long that actually was, I figured he aged in FTL and when the curse hit, he just stayed the same age like everyone else in SB. How to explain that without him being IN SB, I dunno... But there are similar questions with the Pinnochio theory, which I also kindof believe.


----------



## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

Alright, if August is


Spoiler



Pinocchio


, I'm going to have to stop watching this show. It will be too absurd at that point. Not to mention disappointing to have such a cool guy as such a lame character.


----------



## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Zevida said:


> Alright, if August is
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> ...


I agree which is why, even though I lean toward that theory I desperately hope it's wrong.


----------



## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

I don't see how he's any more lame than Jiminy Cricket or the Mad Hatter.*











* Except his leg... buh duh BOOMP


----------



## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> Consider the source (a guy who figured out that he was a prop man)...


Guilty as charged. :up:


----------



## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Ugh. Episode 20 synopsis is out. Convinced now more than ever.



Spoiler



The Stranger  August promises to enlighten Emma and take her on a journey that will show her how she can beat Regina, and possibly take custody of Henry; and with Mary Margaret returning to work, Regina puts a plan in motion to seduce David. Meanwhile, in the fairytale land that was, with the Evil Queens curse about to strike, Geppetto agrees to a plan that will save Snow White and Prince Charmings daughter, but with a proviso that could also save his own son, on Once Upon a Time, SUNDAY, APRIL 29 (8:00-9:01 p.m., ET) on the ABC Television Network.


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## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

photoshopgrl said:


> Ugh. Episode 20 synopsis is out. Convinced now more than ever.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Now I just hope they make it make sense.


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## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

I wonder if _Once Upon a Time_ will be the next _Heroes_? Big break-out hit with a ton of promise that flounders as it tries to build out its world and burns out quickly?


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Zevida said:


> Alright, if August is
> 
> 
> Spoiler
> ...





photoshopgrl said:


> I agree which is why, even though I lean toward that theory I desperately hope it's wrong.


Why is this a lame idea


Spoiler



or character


?



Spoiler



We've already seen the character of Pinocchio as a real boy in this series.
Why is he a lame character if Jiminy Cricket and the Mad Hatter are not?



I really don't understand the potential outrage here.


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## SoBelle0 (Jun 25, 2002)

Was there not a new ep this week? I went to OnDemand and they're showing an old one with a 4-08 date...


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## getreal (Sep 29, 2003)

I thought they were taking a 3-week break before finishing the season.


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

Yup not a new episode until the 22nd.


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## SoBelle0 (Jun 25, 2002)

Jeepers! Three weeks?!?
Thanks for the bad news, y'all.


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

SoBelle0 said:


> Jeepers! Three weeks?!?
> Thanks for the bad news, y'all.


Well technically that's now less than 2 weeks.


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## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

Oh goody.... I thought it was the 29th (when the episode we've been [spoilering] airs). But there is a new one on the 22nd too.


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## SoBelle0 (Jun 25, 2002)

Ha! I feel better already.


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## oscarfish (Mar 2, 2009)

photoshopgrl said:


> One of the episodes, maybe 9 or 10, MM finds Emma's baby blanket in her stuff along with a clipping from a newspaper saying a 7 year old boy found a baby on the side of the road.
> 
> ETA: Here's a shot of the clipping


Was it ever mentioned how they knew her name was Emma?


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## Zevida (Nov 8, 2003)

oscarfish said:


> Was it ever mentioned how they knew her name was Emma?


It is embroidered on her baby blanket.


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## oscarfish (Mar 2, 2009)

Zevida said:


> It is embroidered on her baby blanket.


Good answer.

I fear that in order to keep track of all this stuff myself, I may need to start taking notes. But that's just wrong.


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

martinp13 said:


> Oh goody.... I thought it was the 29th (when the episode we've been [spoilering] airs). But there is a new one on the 22nd too.


YES! The one coming on the 22nd is titled


Spoiler



The Return and is Rumple episode!


Cannot wait!!


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## Linnemir (Apr 7, 2009)

oscarfish said:


> Was it ever mentioned how they knew her name was Emma?


Wouldn't it be symmetrical if the 7 year old boy turned out to be August? Though Emma does look older than him. (Then again, I think she looks older than 28, but that's just me)


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## Penny Lane (Dec 3, 2007)

So here is my wild theory. I thought when August first came he said he was a writer. He then stole the book and they showed him trying to age some pages and inserting them in the book to look like they belonged there. So maybe he was one of the authors of the book and he didn't write the truth and is now trying to rewrite what really happened.


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## robojerk (Jun 13, 2006)

Penny Lane said:


> So here is my wild theory. I thought when August first came he said he was a writer. He then stole the book and they showed him trying to age some pages and inserting them in the book to look like they belonged there. So maybe he was one of the authors of the book and he didn't write the truth and is now trying to rewrite what really happened.


I thought he was repairing the book, or creating a new one after Regina damaged the old one when tearing down the playground.


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## photoshopgrl (Nov 22, 2008)

robojerk said:


> I thought he was repairing the book, or creating a new one after Regina damaged the old one when tearing down the playground.


I'm pretty sure he added something to it which really bugs me because there's no way Henry wouldn't have realized it and been spouting about it.


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## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

photoshopgrl said:


> I'm pretty sure he added something to it which really bugs me because there's no way Henry wouldn't have realized it and been spouting about it.


Actually, Emma has had the book for a while. She really should just get the Kindle Edition and return the hardback to Henry. 

No one has thought to take pictures of every page so if the book goes missing again, they still have the information?? Morons.


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## martinp13 (Mar 19, 2001)

Linnemir said:


> Wouldn't it be symmetrical if the 7 year old boy turned out to be August? Though Emma does look older than him. (Then again, I think she looks older than 28, but that's just me)


We've been batting that around in the earlier spoilers and some of us think he is the 7 year old boy. We discuss a lot more than that in the spoilers, so read at your own risk.


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## DevdogAZ (Apr 16, 2003)

martinp13 said:


> Actually, Emma has had the book for a while. She really should just get the Kindle Edition and return the hardback to Henry.
> 
> No one has thought to take pictures of every page so if the book goes missing again, they still have the information?? Morons.


Why would they? Henry has read it so many times, I'm sure he's got it memorized, and nobody else believes the information in the book has any value other than for entertainment.


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## Amnesia (Jan 30, 2005)

Amnesia said:


> The real solution is even easier: Bailee simply studied Ginnifer's portrayal.


BTW: Bailee is scheduled to be on _The Tonight Show_ tonight (21 May), in case you want to see what she's like when she's not pretending to be Ginnifer...


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## Hoffer (Jun 1, 2001)

Had a bit of a marathon yesterday. Watched 6 episodes of this show. I think the episode this thread is about is the last I saw. I have 3 episodes yet to watch. Maybe tonight I'll polish them off.

I was ready for the whole Snow being in jail storyline to be over. We all knew it wouldn't go on forever, but I sure wondered how they'd get her out of it. The woman not being dead sure surprised me.


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