# Any way to tell Roamio to auto tune HD channels?



## anthonymoody (Apr 29, 2008)

Just back to TiVo after three years in Scientific Atlanta purgatory. Love the Roamio plus so far (even though I've had to drop back to 5 tuners). 

Something I noticed straight away...TiVo doesn't seem to know that when I select channel 2, it should (behind the scenes) auto tune the HD version which is channel 702 here (Cablevision in Westchester county, NY). 

As bad as the SA DVR was, as least it knew to do this. I deselected all the non HD channels in the guide, which helps with clutter. But...still a tad frustrating since everyone in the family is used to certain channel slots and some don't match so neatly (eg YES is 70 in SD but 715 in HD).

Anyway to use the lower number channels and have the TiVo auto tune the HD versions?

TIA.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

No.


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## k2ue (May 9, 2002)

anthonymoody said:


> Anyway to use the lower number channels and have the TiVo auto tune the HD versions?
> 
> TIA.


Go into Channels I Receive and uncheck every SD channel that has an HD equivalent, so your channel surfing pool only has HD wherever possible.


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## sbiller (May 10, 2002)

k2ue said:


> Go into Channels I Receive and uncheck every SD channel that has an HD equivalent, so your channel surfing pool only has HD wherever possible.


You can also do the deselect of SD Channels right in the guide.


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## DaveDFW (Jan 25, 2005)

anthonymoody said:


> Anyway to use the lower number channels and have the TiVo auto tune the HD versions?


Nope. Even if you have unchecked the SD channels from the guide, you can still select those SD channels by simply keying in their numbers.

It sounds you have some family re-training to do.


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## Millionaire2K (Jun 16, 2008)

I think the real problem here is your family not wanting to learn the HD chs. Why would you tune to an SD station just to be switched to the HD version?

Go oldschool and print out a HD ch listing. Also try changing the guide order to A-z. This will make it easier to find the HD ch's you don't know without having to go to the SD ones you know.


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## anthonymoody (Apr 29, 2008)

Well when you've had the same channel lineup for years and years and years you get very used to certain things. 2 has been CBS for decades. Having to tune 702 to see the HD version of this is unnecessary as even the horrible SA dvr has demonstrated. 

Add two 7 year olds into the mix (Nik is one of the channels that doesn't line up...) and things get even tougher. 

I get that it's not a hardship, but given that the worst DVR on earth does this automatically I don't think it's asking too much. The data to map a channel slot (eg 2) to the HD version of the station (eg 702) obviously exists as the SA DVR does this. Or, if not easily accessible somehow, maybe they could at least offer the ability to optionally remap channels manually.

I did de-select all the non HD channels, as I stated. And it does reduce guide clutter which is nice. But for direct tuning, it just strikes me as strange that a cutting edge DVR - which in every other way I can find runs circles around the SA box - can't do something I find pretty basic, and more importantly handy.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Better yet teach your family that there is no need to live watch TV, then they wont need to know what channel anything is on.


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## FACTAgent (Aug 28, 2013)

FYI - Windows Media Center can do this (merge HD with SD channel in the guide and allow you to select which source - SD or HD - is tuned). For instance, I merged 702 into 02 so I have one listing from CBS with 8 sources to choose from (4 ch Ceton) and the ability to set default prioritization among the sources. I have asked Tivo for comparable functionality in every survey I fill out. This is better than SA or Tivo because customer has a choice - some users on Cablevision forum want to record the SD channels to save space on their 8300 DVRs.


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## wco81 (Dec 28, 2001)

When you do a search for shows, does it at least identify which ones are in HD and which ones are not?

Say you search for a Fox show and it would show both the SD channel and the HD channel ones with the latter labled as such?

That is how Direct TV's DVRs do it.


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## TC25D (Aug 21, 2013)

wco81 said:


> When you do a search for shows, does it at least identify which ones are in HD and which ones are not?


Yes.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

What would you do on the other box if you actually wanted to watch the SD version of a channel? I do that when they stretch or zoom an SD show on the HD version of the channel, and I want to watch it without getting a headache from the stretched/zoomed mess.


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## tim1724 (Jul 3, 2007)

Arcady said:


> What would you do on the other box if you actually wanted to watch the SD version of a channel? I do that when they stretch or zoom an SD show on the HD version of the channel, and I want to watch it without getting a headache from the stretched/zoomed mess.


Me too.

So many times I have wished for an "unstretch" setting on the zoom button. Especially for that non-linear stretch that some channels use. When anything has left-right panning while stretched I get so dizzy


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

I would hate for a STB to tune to a different channel than I select. If I enter channel 2 then that is the channel I want to go to. I wouldn't want it to go to something like 702. If I wanted to go to 702 then I would enter 702.

I'm glad the TiVos do not do this. I would hate this.


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## anthonymoody (Apr 29, 2008)

Gee Aaron thanks for coming out in favor of lack of user choice. I really love when people decide that their opinion and/or use case is "the way it should be" and try to jam it on everyone else. I hate that I don't have the option to enable this basic, handy functionality. I never said every tivo should automatically auto tune HD. Choice man, choice. See how that works?

Having to manage HD space is no longer an issue for me.

Watching SD on a 75" screen is basically a non starter, so I don't.

Relearning or reteaching new channel slots is unnecessary. Not a hardship, just unnecessary. As has now been pointed out repeatedly, both very powerful solutions (WMC) and the worst DVR on earth (SA) can do this. So it ain't rocket science.

Though, since TiVo can't even figure out a way to hire a temp dev to redo the SD menus I guess I shouldn't be surprised that they can't be bothered to offer this kind of simple, handy, optional functionality.


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## k2ue (May 9, 2002)

anthonymoody said:


> Gee Aaron thanks for coming out in favor of lack of user choice. I really love when people decide that their opinion and/or use case is "the way it should be" and try to jam it on everyone else. I hate that I don't have the option to enable this basic, handy functionality. I never said every tivo should automatically auto tune HD. Choice man, choice. See how that works?
> 
> Having to manage HD space is no longer an issue for me.
> 
> ...


I'm with you -- think there should be channel aliasing to speed up direct channel entry, since cable systems seem intent on longer numbers for HD.


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## SugarBowl (Jan 5, 2007)

My family watches channel 2. I watch channel 1102. I've learned not to care if they keep watching SD.


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## anthonymoody (Apr 29, 2008)

SugarBowl said:


> My family watches channel 2. I watch channel 1102. I've learned not to care if they keep watching SD.


It really is funny (sad) how many homes one walks into to find people "loving" their shiny new flat panels unaware of the fact that they're watching an SD feed!


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

anthonymoody said:


> Gee Aaron thanks for coming out in favor of lack of user choice. I really love when people decide that their opinion and/or use case is "the way it should be" and try to jam it on everyone else. I hate that I don't have the option to enable this basic, handy functionality. I never said every tivo should automatically auto tune HD. Choice man, choice. See how that works?
> 
> ................


Where did i say that is the way it should be? i stated my opinion only. I never said any where that is the way it should be. i only said *I*(not someone else) was glad they did not work that way and *I* would hate it if they did.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

anthonymoody said:


> It really is funny (sad) how many homes one walks into to find people "loving" their shiny new flat panels unaware of the fact that they're watching an SD feed!


Some people are fully aware they are watching SD. My parents know perfectly well which channels are HD and which are SD on Comcast. My Mom prefers to tune in the SD channels and my Dad doesn't care whether the SD channel or the HD channel is being tuned. But that is their choice so it's not my place to say it should be otherwise. If they want to watch SD let them, it would not be my choice though.


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## TC25D (Aug 21, 2013)

aaronwt said:


> Some people are fully aware they are watching SD. My parents know perfectly well which channels are HD and which are SD on Comcast. My Mom prefers to tune in the SD channels and my Dad doesn't care whether the SD channel or the HD channel is being tuned. But that is their choice so it's not my place to say it should be otherwise. If they want to watch SD let them, it would not be my choice though.


Don't they pay extra for the HD channels? If so, and they're happy with SD, why pay for something they are not using? Just curious.


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## Old Hickory (Jan 13, 2011)

SugarBowl said:


> My family watches channel 2. I watch channel 1102. I've learned not to care if they keep watching SD.


Maybe they are trying to conserve 1s and 0s.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

TC25D said:


> Don't they pay extra for the HD channels? If so, and they're happy with SD, why pay for something they are not using? Just curious.


They also pay verizon over $70 a month just for home phone service, even though they could add phone service from Comcast for around $20 or $30. If the HD channels are extra they don't really care about the extra price. And they are well into their seventies so they are pretty much set in their ways.


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## AdamNJ (Aug 22, 2013)

If I recall correctly, the cablevision sa8300hd only started automatically pulling the hd feed recently...like once the all digital started last year. I've had CV for over 5 years and I've always used the 700's because i specifically remember that the lower channels were not HD.

The long and short of it is, the functionality you want isn't currently available so you will have to retrain your family. If you don't list the channels in your channel list, and change your guide to only display 'my channels' or 'favorites', then I think you family will learn soon enough. If they type 2, it tunes to 2, then they press the channel up button and it will go to the next channel u have set as available in 'my channels' or 'favorites'.
You can certainly call up TiVo and complain and maybe one day it will be an option.


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## anthonymoody (Apr 29, 2008)

Aaron - come on. Your original post stated flatly "I'm glad the TiVos do not do this. I would hate this." You would hate an optional feature? No of course not bc that would be a ludicrous position to take. What you _would_ hate is being forced to have it be different than the way you want it without being given a choice.

And of course some people are aware they're watching SD. I never said otherwise. What I did point out is that many people watch SD without realizing this. I've observed it myself first hand on numerous occassions. And even a cursory scan of the AVS forums reveals plenty of same.

You're being argumentative for no reason I can see other than someone having pissed in your Cheerios. Maybe your Roamio is locking up. Lighten up dude.

---

Adam - FWIW the SA8300 DVR here in Westchester Cablevision has auto tuned HD for at least the last 3 years as that's when I went back to their triple play. Based on my displays and viewing eye there's no way I would've been watching SD without knowing it.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

anthonymoody said:


> Aaron - come on. Your original post stated flatly "I'm glad the TiVos do not do this. I would hate this." You would hate an optional feature? No of course not bc that would be a ludicrous position to take. What you _would_ hate is being forced to have it be different than the way you want it without being given a choice.
> 
> And of course some people are aware they're watching SD. I never said otherwise. What I did point out is that many people watch SD without realizing this. I've observed it myself first hand on numerous occassions. And even a cursory scan of the AVS forums reveals plenty of same.
> 
> ...




As I stated I would hate for a box to switch to a different channel than I choose. If there is an option to disable this then the problem is solved. It's not an issue for me.

I never mentioned anything about an optional feature. I'm not being argumentative, just clarifying what I said since you are reading more into what I wrote. What I wrote is what I meant, there is no hidden meaning. I did not mention anything about an optional feature and an optional feature never even entered my mind when I made the post.

The first time an optional feature entered my mind was a minute ago when I read your post.

Of course if a feature is optional, then that is of course preferable because then people that want it can use it and people that don't want it, don't need to enable it. In the last 12+ years of recording HD and watching HD, I don't recall ever having a tuner that would tune to a different channel than I entered. If any of those devices did have that capability then I was never aware of it.

I do know that DirecTV does something like this but when I had DirecTV for HD between 2001 and 2007 I'm not aware of any of my DirecTV STBs having this. Although I only had one DirecTV receiver that was not a TiVo. An HD STB I got in 2001. WHich I had to use to watch HD in realtime from DirecTV until the HD DirecTV TiVos came out in 2004. WHich is why most of my HD watching back then came from OTA which I recorded with a couple of HTPCs.

EDIT:  I just noticed in your other post you mentioned it being an option. This never even registered with me. My only thought was that it would be a feature that could not be changed. I have no idea why that is what I have been thinking all this time, but that is what I was thinking until I read your latest post.


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## RSCHOON (Sep 7, 2013)

I agree that this would be really nice to have as well. I just switched back to TiVo from Cablevision DVR where they had changed it so that it was all HD. Channel 2 and 702 were both HD (I will admit that I originally was annoyed with this because it caused me to waste a ton of space on the DVR with all HD shows, but now that I have so much space on my TiVo I don't care if it is all HD). 

I actually wish that you could just alias all channels. Would be nice to just move them around to whatever I wanted.


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## TivoQueensDad (Jan 24, 2005)

anthonymoody said:


> Gee Aaron thanks for coming out in favor of lack of user choice. I really love when people decide that their opinion and/or use case is "the way it should be" and try to jam it on everyone else. I hate that I don't have the option to enable this basic, handy functionality. I never said every tivo should automatically auto tune HD. Choice man, choice. See how that works?
> 
> Having to manage HD space is no longer an issue for me.
> 
> ...


Totally agree with you. My Roamio came yesterday to replace my Cablevision "dumb" boxes that always show the HD equivalent channel (note - they don't switch from the user's perspective - the channel is HD if you're on an HD set). I wouldn't mind if it was a straight up conversion, ie 2 --> 702, 5 --> 705. Cablevision's lineup mostly follows an "add X" but often break it with Discovery 27 --> 765, HBO 82 --> 800, SHO 84 --> 820, Cinemax 85 --> 830, Encore 350 --> 816...

I spent Friday night downloading the Cablevision channel guide, putting it into a spreadsheet with column A the SD channel, column B the HD channel, column C HD channels with no SD equivalent, and column D music, etc (channels above 850). I then went to the channel guide and removed all SD channels that had HD equivalents.

It doesn't seem like it would be a lot of programming to have the box know the equivalent HD to the SD channels and have a setup checkup - "always record HD when available". With 450 hours to play with, I don't think I'll be worrying about filling my hard drive any time soon.

By the way - I realized I NEEDED to do this when I accidentally added in my season passes by accident in SD. I would have been really pissed when I sat down to watch the final 3 episodes of Dexter (In November as a family event with college kids home) only to discover that I recorded them in SD and returned my boxes that could watch Showtime On Demand.


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## Rkkeller (May 13, 2004)

aaronwt said:


> I would hate for a STB to tune to a different channel than I select. If I enter channel 2 then that is the channel I want to go to. I wouldn't want it to go to something like 702. If I wanted to go to 702 then I would enter 702.
> 
> I'm glad the TiVos do not do this. I would hate this.


I would not use a feature like this.

I am with Comcast and it was channel 3, then it became 253, then when HD hit it is now 803. You just LEARN it.


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## anthonymoody (Apr 29, 2008)

Rkkeller said:


> I would not use a feature like this.
> 
> I am with Comcast and it was channel 3, then it became 253, then when HD hit it is now 803. You just LEARN it.


Gee thanks Rkkeller


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## TC25D (Aug 21, 2013)

Of all the software issues/improvements TiVo could/should be working on, personalized channel mapping should be at the bottom of this list, if it makes the list at all.

Let's see...

1. Press number on remote.
2. Look up number pressed in a database/file kept locally to see if it's mapped to another channel.
3. Yes, tune to mapped channel.
4. No, tune to original channel.
5. Write error correction routine in case the mapped channel doesn't exist.
6. Add option to allow users with the ability to learn new channels to opt out of the overhead needed to check for a mapped channel.

Obviously, an interface would have to be written to allow editing of this mapping.

Yep, bottom of the list.


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## anthonymoody (Apr 29, 2008)

Gee thanks for the especially insightful commentary.

Trust me - if I'd wanted your opinion, I would've asked. 

Really.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

It looks like this "feature" can be controlled by the cable company. TWC is doing it now in at least some markets.

See this post: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=9804708#post9804708


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## Big Boy Laroux (Oct 10, 2006)

anthonymoody said:


> Gee thanks for the especially insightful commentary.
> 
> Trust me - if I'd wanted your opinion, I would've asked.
> 
> Really.


You are asking for EVERYONE's opinion when you create a post on a public forum.


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## swerver (May 18, 2012)

Harsh and/or defensive crowd. Who wouldn't rather key 2 than 702 or whatever it is? He makes a pretty good point - if the crappiest of dvr's can do it, why can't tivo?


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

Is this even something that a cablecard could provide? I don't see the cablecos looking to make this easy for Tivo to utilize, thus keeping it to themselves.

Who manually enters channels anymore with a Tivo? (I know... lots of folks use live TV, even with a tivo)


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## TC25D (Aug 21, 2013)

anthonymoody said:


> Gee thanks for the especially insightful commentary.
> 
> Trust me - if I'd wanted your opinion, I would've asked.
> 
> Really.


Clearly you're unfamiliar with how Internet forums work.

Really.


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## Big Boy Laroux (Oct 10, 2006)

swerver said:


> Harsh and/or defensive crowd. Who wouldn't rather key 2 than 702 or whatever it is? He makes a pretty good point - if the crappiest of dvr's can do it, why can't tivo?


To be fair, the OP is being harsh, not the crowd. Differing opinions are allowed on the internet.

Personally I don't have a need for such a feature, but to each their own.


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## swerver (May 18, 2012)

Maybe so. Anyway to add my 2 cents - this is really only useful for about 5 channels, so I can see that would add to its low priority status.


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## anthonymoody (Apr 29, 2008)

Big Boy Laroux said:


> You are asking for EVERYONE's opinion when you create a post on a public forum.





TC25D said:


> Clearly you're unfamiliar with how Internet forums work.
> 
> Really.


Bzzt. Thanks for playing, and thanks for the reading comprehension fail. I specifically asked whether a particular feature was available, not what anyone thought of said feature. If people want to post their unsolicited opinions then I am more than free to call them out about it.



Big Boy Laroux said:


> To be fair, the OP is being harsh, not the crowd. Differing opinions are allowed on the internet.
> 
> Personally I don't have a need for such a feature, but to each their own.


I'm not being harsh at all. It's not that differing opinions aren't allowed, it's just that they weren't solicited. If I want something (like this feature), it's because I know I want it. And so I asked about it. It's not available, and so fine. It's disappointing, but it is what it is.

What I don't need, and what shows the sort of mindless idiocy and gall of people, is instead of taking your extremely reasonable stance (don't have a need, to each their own), they take it upon themselves to "convince" me why I don't need said feature, how useless it is, how unnecessary it is, etc.

It's like you go to Ben & Jerry's, and you order vanilla, and they happen to be out of it, and instead of simply saying they're out of it, they tell you that they don't like vanilla, that it's not good, and that chocolate is simply better.



swerver said:


> Maybe so. Anyway to add my 2 cents - this is really only useful for about 5 channels, so I can see that would add to its low priority status.


It's actually useful for every single channel that has an HD and SD version. I've not counted but it's something like 200 here. If you're referring to those that don't match evenly, it's still useful as has been voiced not only by me but others above (eg - who wouldn't rather tune to 2 vs 702 if they had the option?)


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## fdisker2000 (Nov 27, 2006)

I know this isn't exactly what the op was looking for but I use a Harmony Ultimate remote for this. It is easily programmed with icons for my family to select the HD channels.


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## TC25D (Aug 21, 2013)

anthonymoody said:


> Bzzt. Thanks for playing, and thanks for the reading comprehension fail. I specifically asked whether a particular feature was available, not what anyone thought of said feature. If people want to post their unsolicited opinions then I am more than free to call them out about it.


I fully comprehended your posts, what feature you wanted and posted my opinion re: the likelihood of it being implemented. If you don't want 'unsolicited opinions' don't read them.

Next time, ask a question whether a certain feature of your cable company's DVR is available on a TiVo *before *you purchase one instead of complaining about its absence afterwards.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

With all the bickering and arguing, I guess nobody bothered to read my post about how this is actually available and happening on some systems.

Whatever.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

aaronwt said:


> I would hate for a STB to tune to a different channel than I select. If I enter channel 2 then that is the channel I want to go to. I wouldn't want it to go to something like 702. If I wanted to go to 702 then I would enter 702.
> 
> I'm glad the TiVos do not do this. I would hate this.


Same here, this is a typical PEBCAK problem and should be at the bottom of the long list of stuff that Tivo should do IMO.


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## cypherstream (Oct 27, 2007)

Hi, I came here from a Google search asking this very question. I knew older Tivo's couldn't do this, but was hoping the new Roamio could. 

I currently have DirecTV and love how you type in the number for ESPN for example and it shows it in HD. You type in 3 for CBS here and it's right there in HD. This is the default option. In the settings you can choose "show SD duplicates" and then SD and HD equivalents are next to each other. Other options are "Hide HD Duplicates" and "Hide SD Duplicates (default)".

I never have to change this setting and I'm not missing out on any programming. I always keep an eye on the local cable co but their DVR stinks. It's just low end Motorola or Pace DVR's running I-Guide and they do not offer multiroom or any way to remotely program the DVR from the net or control it via a tablet / iPhone. So TiVo Roamio would be the way to go. But since this feature doesn't exist (yet), I will stick with DirecTV. Was always a problem with the wife or guests. It's always a problem at my inlaws who have cable. I swear they only watch HD when I visit. They have TWC and only about 15 channels or so "auto tune" to HD. They just do the local networks, ESPN, CNN, and the premium movie channels. Father in law watches a lot of NFL Network but that is one that TWC doesn't remap. So they end up watching a lot of SD still.

I wish we were to the point where SD would just go away. A channel should just be HD these days. HD should now be the de facto standard. They don't even sell tube TV's anymore. Heck our township won't let us throw CRT's away anymore. We have to take them to a special recycling center. Can't leave the old boob tube at the curb anymore. Point is TV's have evolved, so why haven't the broadcast standard? I'm sure cable could save a few QAM channels by eliminating the SD feeds.

TWC can do it. DirecTV and Dish Network can do it. Passport / Passport Echo cable software can do it. Buckeye cable HD-DTA's do it. Xfinity X1 does it. It is becoming more common, just not fast enough for my liking.


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## Arcady (Oct 14, 2004)

How come when I press the 9 button on my remote, pictures of naked ladies don't magically appear?

Oh that's right, because channel 9 is an analog channel, which my digital receiver doesn't get. But I want it to magically map to another unrelated channel that isn't the channel button I pressed.

Maybe I'm too stupid to use a TV.


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## MScottC (Sep 11, 2004)

Sure, it's cool idea, but I have yet to meet a piece of equipment that does EVERYTHING I'd like it to do. The problem is that if you accommodate every possibility, you create bloatware. So hardware/software providers put in what they believe are the most desirable features and choices. Sometimes they get it right, sometimes they get it wrong. If they get it right more than they get it wrong, they succeed. But you'll always get whining losers who will find all the wrongs and never feel good about all the right on what is a good or even great product to the majority of users. This seems to be the case here. TiVo created a great product category. Some of the products in the line had problems, but over the years, they keep delivering mostly good product, and in the case of Roamio, it's bordering on great. Are there issues, sure. Are there things that need to be fixed, sure. But the product works as advertised quite well, and it adds incredible functionality to the point I was at before this purchase.

And one more note to the original poster. Stop whining when someone opines about something you post about. Put me in the camp with everyone else; the moment you post on a public forum, you open up the thread to every user's opinion. If you don't like it, don't read it, but if you start the conversation, others are entitled to join it as they see fit, as long as they don't abuse others.


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## socrplyr (Jul 19, 2006)

cypherstream said:


> Hi, I came here from a Google search asking this very question. I knew older Tivo's couldn't do this, but was hoping the new Roamio could.
> 
> I currently have DirecTV and love how you type in the number for ESPN for example and it shows it in HD. You type in 3 for CBS here and it's right there in HD. This is the default option. In the settings you can choose "show SD duplicates" and then SD and HD equivalents are next to each other. Other options are "Hide HD Duplicates" and "Hide SD Duplicates (default)".
> 
> ...


This is really a function of the Cable Operator. They choose the channels for their stations. Like you mention DirecTV decided to handle it differently than the cable operators. In reality, there is a simple solution for the cable operators. For HD devices: When they offer channel 2 in HD, put the HD on channel 2. (If they still want to make the SD available, then put the SD on channel 2002. This would really just be a power user function to make smaller recordings anyways.) For SD devices: Don't map HD channels at all and leave the SD version at the lower numbers (channel 2 would be SD in this case).

If Tivo were to give an option to remap channels, that would be a support nightmare and the cable companies would not be very happy. Tivo needs to keep them reasonably happy as it isn't a great relationship to begin with. Also, that remapping would have to be a somewhat manual process (could be partially automated, but not completely). That costs money and there are a lot of cable operators and different channel lineups out there.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

cypherstream said:


> But since this feature doesn't exist (yet), I will stick with DirecTV.


You've got to be kidding.


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## cypherstream (Oct 27, 2007)

Nope. I'm happy with DirecTV. Has all the content I want. We always record HD and watch HD when it's available. It's MPEG4 so it takes less space on the hard drive. Genie can record 5 things at once and has PIP. When you threaten to leave DirecTV, they give you huge discounts on the bill.

But the local cable co has good HD content as well, even more HD like Reelz, the CSPAN's, HSN, The Hub HD, and a handful of others. However if life is good with DirecTV and moving to Tivo on Cable would make a huge learning curve for the wife and guests, then might as well not make the switch. I just really came here to find out if this new Tivo has this option. Since I'm happy with my provider and Tivo does not (neither does my cable co) then no point in the hassle of switching. I'll keep my eye on the technology though just in case.

Some people say they want a certain channel. Well its the content. If you want NBC, CBS, ESPN, ABC, Disney, HBO, Discovery, Science, Bravo, E!, DIY, etc... you see that content you wanted, just in HD... every time with auto tune HD. If I want DIY and go to DIY I see it in HD. If my father in law wants DIY and types the number for DIY he see's it in SD because the HD version is on some weird number that has no correspondence to the SD number on his cable company issued DVR.


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## dsnotgood (Aug 26, 2010)

No offense OP but that is a dumb request. If I tell a cable box to do something, it should do it and not do what it "thinks" I want to do (tune to HD channel instead of sd). 

Just because your old cable box did it doesn't mean it's good.

Also why not just record your shows? That's the whole point of tivo, no need to channel surf.

Anyways after a few months, you will be fine. I was the same coming from a cable box, my complaint was pushing 2 buttons to record instead of one but I got over it once I started recording everything.


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## AdamNJ (Aug 22, 2013)

cypherstream said:


> moving to Tivo on Cable would make a huge learning curve for the wife and guests, then might as well not make the switch.


So i take it you'll never leave direct tv just because you know the channel numbers? Forget about the local broadcast basics...most/every channel is going to be different across providers. Sounds stupid to me, but to each his own.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

Yep.


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## k2ue (May 9, 2002)

Arcady said:


> With all the bickering and arguing, I guess nobody bothered to read my post about how this is actually available and happening on some systems.
> 
> Whatever.


You are quite correct -- TW is moving its eastern markets to a uniform channel arrangement where there is one channel number for a given service, and it auto-selects HD if your box is HD (including TiVos) and HD is available, conversely SD sets on digital adapters will always get a 480i version of the channel. We get it in Rochester on 10/15. It will be so much better than trying to manually figure out which channels are redundant SD versions of HD channels, and which are different in content.

The channels will also be grouped by type, so all the locals and networks can be surfed quickly, all free movies are grouped together, all premium movies together, all sports, etc. It will be an adjustment, but a big improvement. Plus when we cross-visit with our daughter in the Albany market we will both know just where to find everything.


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## gweempose (Mar 23, 2003)

dsnotgood said:


> No offense OP but that is a dumb request. If I tell a cable box to do something, it should do it and not do what it "thinks" I want to do (tune to HD channel instead of sd).


I used to have a Comcast Motorola DVR, and I'm fairly certain that if you selected the SD version of a channel, a message would pop up alerting you to the fact that an HD version of the channel was also available. You then had the option to switch to the HD channel with a single click. It's hard to argue against this implementation.


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## TC25D (Aug 21, 2013)

gweempose said:


> It's hard to argue against this implementation.


No it's not.

1. I listed all my SD channels.
2. Determined if there was an HD equivalent.
3. If there was, I removed the SD channel.

Once and done.


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## Goober96 (Jun 28, 2005)

I just removed all SD channels regardless. I'm not going to watch an SD channel. That's so 80s.


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## gonzotek (Sep 24, 2004)

TC25D said:


> No it's not.
> 
> 1. I listed all my SD channels.
> 2. Determined if there was an HD equivalent.
> ...


I don't see the argument against the implementation gweempose suggested in your response. All I see there is a list of steps to remove SD dups.


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## TC25D (Aug 21, 2013)

gonzotek said:


> I don't see the argument against the implementation gweempose suggested in your response. All I see there is a list of steps to remove SD dups.


If you remove all the SD channels with HD counterparts, there's no need for gweempose's suggestion.


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## gonzotek (Sep 24, 2004)

You(or a guest or family member) could still tune directly via channel number. If the info banner had a 'switch to hd version' option, I'd consider that to be an improved user experience, even though I too remove the sd dups.


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## TC25D (Aug 21, 2013)

It's not whether this is a good or bad idea. The issue is where does TiVo focus limited programming resources. This has to be pretty far down the list, if it's on the list at all.


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## gweempose (Mar 23, 2003)

gonzotek said:


> You (or a guest or family member) could still tune directly via channel number. If the info banner had a 'switch to hd version' option, I'd consider that to be an improved user experience ...


Precisely. Removing the SD channels from the guide doesn't address the OP's complaint.


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## TC25D (Aug 21, 2013)

gweempose said:


> Precisely. Removing the SD channels from the guide doesn't address the OP's complaint.


Nothing short of TiVo making this 'deficiency' their number 1 priority and 'fixing' it in the next release will address the OP's complaint. Of course, by that time, his children will be so irreparably harmed by the need to remember HD channel numbers, the issue might be moot, except for the class action lawsuit.


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## alfred01234 (Sep 12, 2013)

I wish tivo could simply remove channels from a menu.
I tried to un-check then from channel line up but if you type 2 SD 2 pops up not HD 2.

Either Tivo or Comcast should be able to do something.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

alfred01234 said:


> I wish tivo could simply remove channels from a menu.
> I tried to un-check then from channel line up but if you type 2 SD 2 pops up not HD 2.
> 
> Either Tivo or Comcast should be able to do something.


Because there is no HD 2.


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## TC25D (Aug 21, 2013)

alfred01234 said:


> Either Tivo or Comcast should be able to do something.


Perhaps the person pressing the '2' has a role to play? Nah.


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## btoups (Dec 21, 2005)

I did not know that other DVR's did this. I always thought it was crazy that I was expected to keep an ever expanding database of SD/HD channels that change frequently (on Comcast anyway) in my head. In my area there is little correlation between SD and HD numbering. And many channels have 1 low# SD, 1 High# SD, and 1 High #HD. So YES, I admit to watching SD channels sometimes because I just dont feel like trying to find the HD version. These devices are purposefully built around CONVENIENCE, so yeah, I do tend to believe this should be built in... Wait, let me correct myself, their ONLY purpose for existence is CONVENIENCE! Now if TIVO thinks building the OPTIONAL mapping would not be widely accepted as a major improvenent and selling point, then they are out of touch with their customers. 

This is from a 10year+ Sub, currently with 4 tivos.


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## Devx (Jun 1, 2006)

Sometimes these forums are really eye-opening. It's surprising to read the number of posts from those that watch Live TV. Not that there's anything wrong with that but I thought the intent of a DVR was for time-shifting and watching TV on one's own schedule. While, at least based on the posts I've seen, there's a certain contingent of users that would benefit from channel mapping, there's another group that wouldn't even notice the feature (like myself). I won't say never, but it's just extremely rare when I watch live TV, and even then, it's usually being recorded by a SP.

Hopefully Tivo has some data on this so they know how to prioritize development of new features. It's interesting because the Tivo has the data and can find the show airing on the HD channel but getting to that UI (Explore shows, upcoming) from a user standpoint isn't ideal for every channel.


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## MScottC (Sep 11, 2004)

DevX, I've said this on many occasions, and I'll say it again. Even though I started with TiVo way before most on this forum, having purchased my S1 in November of 1999, I still watch live TV slightly delayed." Both my wife and I watch what is on TV now, first one channel, then with the S3, two channels, bouncing back and forth, and now with 6 tuners, we go all over the place. A lot of it may be season pass material that has started recording, but often we just walk into the house, turn on the TV and tune in the channels we want, if they aren't already there. We are not unique, and it makes as valid a use of TiVo as someone who stores hours and hours of material on their incredibly huge HDs. (I also was very early in putting in larger HDs in both my S1 and S3.) For me there is a certain joy in hearing a song I love on the radio, or seeing a show or movie I wanted to see pop up on TV somewhere. While I had a large collection of albums, both vinyl and CD, I don't download mp3s, nor do I have any VHS, DVDs or BluRays. The one VHS I ever purchased was watched once, and put away to never be viewed again. I like being surprised by finding something on now, whether it be a song, show, movie, etc. But indeed, we do love our regular shows, and TiVo works perfectly for that just the way it is. Oh yes, I'd like the Autotune to HD that the OP is asking for, but given all the other advantages of TiVo, I'm not about to abandon it. I do think it's a great request, but I'm not gonna whine over it.


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

Devx said:


> Sometimes these forums are really eye-opening. It's surprising to read the number of posts from those that watch Live TV. Not that there's anything wrong with that but I thought the intent of a DVR was for time-shifting and watching TV on one's own schedule.


There was a poll here a few months ago that we telling on this, the results were something like 60-70% of the users here watched live TV several times each week.

So, while users can obviously use their box however they want, I still think they are crazy.  But, others hate suggestions and probably think I'm crazy.  I use them in lieu of live TV "surfing" as they are already designed based upon what I record and don't record.


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## swerver (May 18, 2012)

I'm new to tivo (about 18 months now) and one thing I didn't expect from this forum is the near constant attempts from the "I never watch live tv" crowd to "correct" the viewing behavior of others. It's similar to the people that will tell you all about how they don't have a tv at all. They bring it up constantly, they want to make sure you know how "advanced" they are. I think they just want to feel superior. Honestly, who cares if someone uses the tivo differently than you do? Give it up people. This is a completely valid and useful feature. That you personally wouldn't use it doesn't mean much at all. It's something simple they could do to make the product better, that's all. It doesn't have to be a #1 priority to improve the product. It's almost like a defense mechanism - everyone here dumps on cable co. dvrs, and rightly so, but in this case one of them provides a useful feature that tivo doesn't, and people act as though tivo is above such a silly feature for silly unadvanced live tv watchers. Instead of just saying, yes that is something tivo could easily do that would make it better, even if I myself wouldn't use it.


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## DaveDFW (Jan 25, 2005)

swerver said:


> It's almost like a defense mechanism - everyone here dumps on cable co. dvrs, and rightly so, but in this case one of them provides a useful feature that tivo doesn't, and people act as though tivo is above such a silly feature for silly unadvanced live tv watchers.


I think this would be a difficult feature for Tivo themselves to implement. They would have to know every channel lineup on every cable system and a create substitution map for each channel.

The MSOs are in a much better position to add this functionality. Especially with their own DVRs, they control all the pieces needed to make this happen--knowledge of the channel map and ownership of the hardware.

This solution could easily be implemented with SDV. Any time a device requests an SDV channel, the head end will always return the best-quality version of that network. Tivo the entity doesn't even have to be involved in this channel substitution scheme beyond producing SDV-compliant hardware.


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## gweempose (Mar 23, 2003)

swerver said:


> Honestly, who cares if someone uses the tivo differently than you do? Give it up people. This is a completely valid and useful feature. That you personally wouldn't use it doesn't mean much at all. It's something simple they could do to make the product better, that's all. It doesn't have to be a #1 priority to improve the product. It's almost like a defense mechanism - everyone here dumps on cable co. dvrs, and rightly so, but in this case one of them provides a useful feature that tivo doesn't, and people act as though tivo is above such a silly feature for silly unadvanced live tv watchers. Instead of just saying, yes that is something tivo could easily do that would make it better, even if I myself wouldn't use it.


I couldn't have said it better myself. I've never understood why some people get all bent out of shape just because someone requests a feature that they don't personally have a use for. They are clearly incapable of taking a step back and realizing that not every single person shares their exact viewpoint. I see this type of confrontational attitude all the time, and it's not just on the TiVo forums. Sadly, there are people like this on all the various online forums I visit.


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## gweempose (Mar 23, 2003)

DaveDFW said:


> I think this would be a difficult feature for Tivo themselves to implement. They would have to know every channel lineup on every cable system and a create substitution map for each channel.


The easiest solution would be to allow custom mapping by the user.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

Well there's a zillion things they should implement as options for the user, hell clear QAM channel mapping was a good candidate a few years ago. Most here aren't saying this is a bad idea, just that it's so low down on the list of things they should do because it's not a feature that most here care about, and it's more of a user issue anyway.


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## TivoQueensDad (Jan 24, 2005)

anthonymoody said:


> Gee thanks Rkkeller


And for those who have both HD & SD sets in their house, or a Tivo on one and a cable box on the other - please learn 2 different set of numbers that have no relation to each other for every channel you watch.

It's a simple fix. It should be just as simple to to put a toggle in (setting - Tune to HD equivalent - YES or NO) for those who enjoy torturing themselves learning 3 digit numbers to replace the 1 and 2 digit channels you've been tuning to for 10 years. Tivo provides a directory of channels for every provider. How difficult is it to bind the SD-HD channels for those who prefer a simpler solution?

...and I can see some spouses who are not the "TV person" never breaking their old habits.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Even if I still had an SD set i would still be tuning to the HD channels. Just outputting in an SD resolution. I've always preferred to watch a widescreen broadcast even back in the 80's and 90's with video tapes, than have 40% of the picture cut off.

I figure if my GF can adjust to HD channels, then anyone can do it.


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## nysatelliteman (Oct 15, 2013)

Hi,,,I have a Series 3 Tivo with a SDV tuning adapter from Time Warner Cable in Manhattan, New York City. And, annoyingly, it IS mapping the HD version of channels to the lower SD channel number. When I press 4, for example-- the NBC SD station-- it is giving me the HD version from channel 704. When I want Standard Definition CNBC-- Ch 15-- I get the HD version from Ch 715. I just noticed this today.

Why don't I like it? For one, I want to save recording space. One can never have enough space to record, and I don't like being forced to record in HD. Secondly, the HD version of CNBC, for example, has distracting data on the side of the screen I would rather not see. And 3rd, sometimes the HD version of a channel shrinks the image too much and-- if I'm watching on a smaller sized TV screen-- would much rather view the larger SD version.

So, count me in for choice. 

I'm not sure if Tivo is doing this, or if it's Time Warner Cable's SDV tuning adapter "telling" the Tivo what to do. I know my TV with a cable card-- without the tuning adapter-- still displays the SD version of channels, as well. As stated above, I don't like being forced to watch the HD version when it takes up dvr space when recording, and based on one's screen size, it is not always the "best" way to view something.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

nysatelliteman said:


> Hi,,,I have a Series 3 Tivo with a SDV tuning adapter from Time Warner Cable in Manhattan, New York City. And, annoyingly, it IS mapping the HD version of channels to the lower SD channel number. When I press 4, for example-- the NBC SD station-- it is giving me the HD version from channel 704. When I want Standard Definition CNBC-- Ch 15-- I get the HD version from Ch 715. I just noticed this today.
> 
> Why don't I like it? For one, I want to save recording space. One can never have enough space to record, and I don't like being forced to record in HD. Secondly, the HD version of CNBC, for example, has distracting data on the side of the screen I would rather not see. And 3rd, sometimes the HD version of a channel shrinks the image too much and-- if I'm watching on a smaller sized TV screen-- would much rather view the larger SD version.
> 
> ...


That has nothing to do with TiVo or the tuning adapter. The mapping is provided by the cablecard. In my area Charter maps 2-99 to the digital SD version but I have heard of some companies mapping to the HD version. There is no way around this as the TiVo can only use the mapping data provided.


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## nysatelliteman (Oct 15, 2013)

rainwater said:


> That has nothing to do with TiVo or the tuning adapter. The mapping is provided by the cablecard. In my area Charter maps 2-99 to the digital SD version but I have heard of some companies mapping to the HD version. There is no way around this as the TiVo can only use the mapping data provided.


Hi Rainwater....If the mapping is provided by the cablecard, why is my TV tuner-- a TV which uses a cablecard but NOT using the Tivo/tuning adapter-- showing SD on the given channel while the Tivo/tuning adapter shows the HD version?

All devices - the Tivo, tuning adapter, TV and the cablecards are connected to the same service-- NYC's Time Warner Manhattan.


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## anthonymoody (Apr 29, 2008)

nysatelliteman said:


> Hi Rainwater....If the mapping is provided by the cablecard, why is my TV tuner-- a TV which uses a cablecard but NOT using the Tivo/tuning adapter-- showing SD on the given channel while the Tivo/tuning adapter shows the HD version?
> 
> All devices - the Tivo, tuning adapter, TV and the cablecards are connected to the same service-- NYC's Time Warner Manhattan.


I haven't been a TWC manhattan customer for a long time, but to the best of my recollection this auto mapping behavior is standard on their HD DVR boxes as well. You tune 7 but it pulls in 707 behind the scenes.

My guess is that whatever signal is sent that tells the box/cc to do this must happen in the hdmi handshake. That's the main thing that's missing when you plug your cable card directly into your set. Can't be sure but probably something like that. And likely no way for you to undo this.

Choice indeed would be nice (as I originally requested).


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

nysatelliteman said:


> Hi Rainwater....If the mapping is provided by the cablecard, why is my TV tuner-- a TV which uses a cablecard but NOT using the Tivo/tuning adapter-- showing SD on the given channel while the Tivo/tuning adapter shows the HD version?
> 
> All devices - the Tivo, tuning adapter, TV and the cablecards are connected to the same service-- NYC's Time Warner Manhattan.


Because your tv tuner scans available frequencies to find channels and uses it's analog tuner to show 2-99. Cablecard devices (just like cable company provided boxes) get mapping from the cable headend. There is no way around this requirement. Otherwise you would not have any guide data.


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## Bphagan (Jul 23, 2010)

I decided a while ago to just use the guide to find my channels.
I know about where in the list the channel I want is located, ie Locals around 431+,
ESPNs near 400, etc.
Pressing guide and channel up/down doesn't take me long to find a channel. 
Besides, it gives me a chance to see what else is on.
If it was important that I knew the channel, it would have been set to record.

This is what has worked for me. Everyone is different. I had to learn some new habits when I switched from Dish to Tivo 3.5 years ago when Tivo was lacking a number of features that Dish had then.

I wish there was a way to create a custom ordering for the channels.
I would like to have the sports channels together, movie channels together, local channels together, etc. Comcast spreads them out and alphabetical or numerical listing don't work good, but I work with what I have.

bdog


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## swerver (May 18, 2012)

Bphagan said:


> I wish there was a way to create a custom ordering for the channels.
> I would like to have the sports channels together, movie channels together, local channels together, etc. Comcast spreads them out and alphabetical or numerical listing don't work good, but I work with what I have.
> 
> bdog


It's not perfect but try the "What's on now" menu item on the roamio. Like the guide, but grouped by tv shows, movies, sports, and kids. Nice for finding a college football game for instance, when you don't know what channel it's on. I didn't think I'd like it at first but I find myself using it more than the guide lately.


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## k2ue (May 9, 2002)

The new TW channel schemes implement auto HD selection. We just switched over here in Rochester NY in the 15th. Even if you just enter the analog channel number, like 7, 8, 10, 11 or 13 here on a strictly digital TiVo -- you get the HD version of the channel. And all the channels that previously existed as separate SD and HD version now map to single channel number that provides HD to TiVo's. So it looks like the cable companies are solving the problem for us.


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## SugarBowl (Jan 5, 2007)

k2ue said:


> The new TW channel schemes implement auto HD selection. We just switched over here in Rochester NY in the 15th. Even if you just enter the analog channel number, like 7, 8, 10, 11 or 13 here on a strictly digital TiVo -- you get the HD version of the channel. And all the channels that previously existed as separate SD and HD version now map to single channel number that provides HD to TiVo's. So it looks like the cable companies are solving the problem for us.


Same here. The TiVo info banner shows 1080i or 720p, although there is no HD logo in the show description.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

SugarBowl said:


> Same here. The TiVo info banner shows 1080i or 720p, although there is no HD logo in the show description.


That is because of the guide data showing the channel as the non-digital version. I would report it to Tribune. If the HD channel is being mapped for all users, then Tribune should update their digital lineup to reflect that.


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## k2ue (May 9, 2002)

rainwater said:


> That is because of the guide data showing the channel as the non-digital version. I would report it to Tribune. If the HD channel is being mapped for all users, then Tribune should update their digital lineup to reflect that.


The Guide is not exactly wrong -- if you have a free "Digital Adapter" from TW my understanding is it provides an SD picture to SD sets down to the Basic Cable level. They are preparing to kill the Analog channels altogether and map everybody to the Digital channels.


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

k2ue said:


> The Guide is not exactly wrong -- if you have a free "Digital Adapter" from TW my understanding is it provides an SD picture to SD sets down to the Basic Cable level. They are preparing to kill the Analog channels altogether and map everybody to the Digital channels.


Does the digital adapter provide channels other than 2-99? Tribune usually has two lineups one for analog and one for digital.


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## Bphagan (Jul 23, 2010)

swerver,
You're right, not perfect or close. 
Fine for looking at what's already playing, but not for upcoming, like shows starting within the hour.
Would have been nice to be able to create your own custom listing, but that is probably a large programming task and not going to happen.
bdog


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## rhettf (Apr 5, 2012)

I can see why the auto HD feature can be useful for some but its probably not a priority for TiVo since it would require a whole new channel mapping layer for EVERY market. Its easier for your comcast northern california corporation to do it since they are only worrying about the channel numbers in their market. Giving us the option would be nice...but personally one of my favorite features of the TiVo has been that I can remove every SD Channel from my lineup. Now when I go to guide I don't have to hit additional buttons AND TiVo suggestions will only record HD shows (there might be a new way to do it but I have always used this method). 

In the bay area none of the HD channel numbers have changed dramatically, they conveniently start in the 700 and go to 840. In my opinion the easiest thing is to get rid of SD channels from your guide so the TiVo only records HD and after about a month you'll remember your favorite channel numbers...or you'll just start adding more SP. I still don't know what channel FX, USA, TNT, Comedy Central, HGTV, Food Network, or any basic HD channel are. I just record stuff and let the TiVo do all the heavy lifting. 

When guest come over and use the TV they have no issues, maybe its because people in my age group 20-30 have never actually paid attention to channel numbers regardless and just look on the guide for the channel name.

Either way its down to the user, I can see how its more convenient for some but change isn't a bad thing, typing in 702 instead of 2 is just muscle memory after a month anyway.


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## obeythelaw2004 (Oct 27, 2013)

Seeing this thread makes me really wish Tivo had this feature. Back when I was with Directv, if I hit my local CBS channel which is Channel 2, it automatically when to the HD feed. Even my Verizon Fios box I had at least had the option that if you were tuned into an SD channel, all you had to do was press the "C" button and it automatically would go to the HD channel. Sometimes its not a matter of not remembering the channels but sometimes I don't know if a channel was in HD or not. 
Another question, also, is does Tivo let you set the settings to record to always record just in HD on the HD channel?


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## leiff (Aug 24, 2005)

rhettf said:


> I can see why the auto HD feature can be useful for some but its probably not a priority for TiVo since it would require a whole new channel mapping layer for EVERY market. Its easier for your comcast northern california corporation to do it since they are only worrying about the channel numbers in their market. Giving us the option would be nice...but personally one of my favorite features of the TiVo has been that I can remove every SD Channel from my lineup. Now when I go to guide I don't have to hit additional buttons AND TiVo suggestions will only record HD shows (there might be a new way to do it but I have always used this method). /QUOTE]
> 
> If your sugguesting to go into channels recieved and tick all non hd channels one at a time. thats like over 500 -no thanks. instead i go into fafavorites and tick my hd's there and just stick using fav filter. This would mean you still get sd suggestins, though I dont use suggestions


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## CrispyCritter (Feb 28, 2001)

leiff said:


> If your sugguesting to go into channels recieved and tick all non hd channels one at a time. thats like over 500 -no thanks. instead i go into fafavorites and tick my hd's there and just stick using fav filter. This would mean you still get sd suggestins, though I dont use suggestions


At a second apiece (and it doesn't take longer on most cable systems, though its possible some might intersperse all HD and SD channels), 500 channels is less than 10 minutes. That has to be done once, and you never have to worry about them again (unless you get a total renumbering like TimeWarner has just done). That's worth it to me; most folks posting in this thread have probably spent longer reading and writing all the posts!


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

Exactly, you only do it once and it's not that big a deal. Solves other problems too like Wishlists recording from SD channels instead of the HDs you want.


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