# Software 14.1-01-3-746 - bug list



## jfh3

Current version is 14.1c-01-3-xxx as of 4/16. Initial reports indicate that the HDUI lockups are addressed.

xxx is the model number (746 for the Premiere, 748 for the XL)

If folks update this thread and verify bugs, I'll try to update this post with the most recent info.

*Operation*
1) Upcoming programs show cable stations only, not antenna. (Using Cable and Antenna as input configuration)

2) Sub menus do not populate instantly

3) Discovery Bar info not cached

4) Netflix complains about Tivo software level (inconsistent)

5) Not all available program sources show on description until you select the show.

6) Using an older TiVo remote with the EXIT button will lock up the Menus so that you cannot select anything. Have to pull the plug to reboot.

7) YouTube is inconsistent and may display a message indicating you that you have to have software level 9.4 or greater, even though the Premiere is on 14.*.

8) _[apparently fixed in 14.1c - see next post for details]
_
9) When navigating to "My Shows", the green wait circle can get "stuck" on the screen (i.e. more than a couple seconds). No information populates and you need to navigate away and come back.

10) While a recording transfer is in progress, if a web video is downloaded, the blue LED turns off at the end of the web video download, not at the completion of the recording transfer.

11) When using collections, channel and program information is incorrect on right side of Record this program screen, even though it is correct under Options on the left side of screen. The info on the right appears to be for the first option in the collections list, not the selected program.

12) If network not connected (or otherwise unavailable) and using HD menus - cannot select a program in a group to view info, play, delete, etc. - error message says network connection required! You can use "Play" to view the program, but that's it.
12a) *Search function is NOT available in this case unless menus are switched to classic.
*
13) _[apparently fixed in 14.1c - see next post for details]
_
14) OTA reception issue - "pulse to zero", causing picture lock up and/or recording interruptions. This has been seen when a signal is in the yellow range or less. Watching the diagnostics screen, the signal is OK for a few seconds (35-40), drop to 0, then immediately return back to the prior range, and repeat. This makes the picture pixelate and stutter every few seconds.

15) Transferred programs do not appear in 'My Shows' at all when Folders are turned off.

16) When Folders are turned Off and there are a number of auto-recorded Tivo Suggestions: When paging down in 'My Shows', once the list has reached and is displaying the Tivo Suggestions recordings, paging up with the Channel Up or Up Arrow keys will never get past the Tivo Suggestions recordings to the list of regular recordings - the list just keeps re-cycling through the Tivo Suggestion recordings. The regularl recordings can only be viewed by either exiting 'My Shows' and re-entering, or by pressing the 'Jump Tick' button twice (once to go to the bottom of the list, and once to go to the top).

16) 'Available Space' counter incorrectly decrementing when Tivo Suggestions recording are deleted, even though Suggestions aren't supposed to count. After deleting some auto-recorded Tivo Suggestions, the 'Available Space' counter is decremented, showing more available space. After re-starting the HDUI (Thumb Down, Thumb Up, Play, Play) or restarting the Premiere from the Help menu, the 'Available Space' counter returns to the original value before Tivo Suggestions recordings were deleted.

*Other*
1) Unlike S3/THD, when CableCARD inserted, box does not switch to CableCARD screen like S3/THD. Also does not indicate if CableCARD removed (though I don't think the earlier S3 software does this either)

2 ) Trying to pull a transfered program off a HP Mediasmart Server using the HP TiVo software will occasionally lock up the TiVo. You will have to pull the plug to reboot.

3) OTA reception signal strength appears to be reported significantly less than THD/S3 (not sure if this is a hardware or software issue). This may just be a difference in how signal strength is measured.

*Usability Notes:*
1) No apparent way to control multiples with new Remote (addressing still works the same as previous remotes). This is almost certainly a hardware design issue, not a software bug, but it is a notable step backwards for Tivo in general.

2) When changing "Keep" date of a suggestion, only choice is KUID (or do nothing).

3) Can't use ThumbsUp/Down in the HD Tivo Suggestions screen to rate a particular program - need to go into each show individually. This is consistent with past releases, but this makes rating suggestions a real pain.

*Guided Setup*
1) Can't run demo mode if using component cables
2) Can't change network address, even if you request to.
3) _[apparently fixed in 14.1a]_


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## jfh3

This post will archive bugs that were initially reported in a 14.1x level that have apparently been corrected by a later level. Problem numbers are the same as originally listed in the previous post.

*Operation*

8) TiVo periodically does not respond to remote commands (regardless of unit address). Requires a forced reboot to recover control. Also see #13. [apparently fixed in 14.1c]

13) When using HD menus, system lockup sometimes occurs after hitting Tivo button. Similar to #8. This seems to be a *very* common issue, with many reporting a lockup every day or so. Hard boot required to recover. Most report switching to SD menus reduces/eliminates the problem. Note that scheduled records appear to continue, but the UI is unusable until the box is rebooted. See this thread for more information / details[apparently fixed in 14.1c]

*Guided Setup*
3) _When using component or HDMI connection, blank screen displayed (no into animation) after reboot finished. Must hit Tivo button to see screen. _[apparently fixed in 14.1a]


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## CallMeBob

To go back to a recording from the menus, you have to go back to My Shows, the program and hit Resume Play on the HD UI. ZOOM and LIVE TV just go to Live TV.

Using an older TiVo remote with the EXIT button will lock up the Menus so that you cannot select anything. Have to pull the plug to reboot. 

Trying to pull a transfered program off a HP Mediasmart Server using the HP TiVo software will occasionally lock up the TiVo. You will have to pull the plug to reboot.

Youtube sometimes doesn't work. Will tell you that you have to have software past 9.4 even though the Premiere is on 14.*.


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## AandFDakota2001

I've tried setting up seasons passes with no such luck on my new Premiere that I bought today. Anyone else having this problem with this rev of the software?

Justin


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## ilkevinli

OMG ! There are serious bugs that should have been found in the 1st day of testing. Did Tivo even bother testing this software ?


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## davezatz

Trying to trigger the opening animation was a bit of a challenge when I took the video the other day. I don't know how to describe it, other than it was a bit finicky. Not sure if it's the same with other traditional menu shortcuts, by number, under the new UI. 

When a CableCARD is unpaired, there's no notification. Versus on the Moxi, the CableCARD screen popped up with my cable-cos info saying calling to activate. (This was during Live TV.)

The slow to populate, non-caching I'm not sure I'd call a bug. Maybe just not optimal design with the first rev?


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## Angerphile

jfh3 said:


> Can't run demo mode if using component cables


This sounds like a bug that will be fixed soon enough. I'm sure retailers have already screamed at TiVo to get this one fixed.



jfh3 said:


> No apparent way to control multiples with new Remote (addressing still works the same as previous remotes)


For sure, it seems that TiVo has gone to a one remote per unit setup. I'd imagine it would have stirred from questions on "What does that slider do?" or a great number of their customers not having multiple TiVos, especially in the same room. (Which they can verify by checking how many TiVos have the default 0 remote code enabled.)

But, the remote and software still support remote addressing...


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## Luckyp79

ilkevinli said:


> OMG ! There are serious bugs that should have been found in the 1st day of testing. Did Tivo even bother testing this software ?


Like what?

Can't just make a statement like that without backing it up with a list of bugs that you have personally experienced.


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## ilkevinli

How about the 1st 3

- Can't run demo mode if using component cables
- Can't change network address, even if you request to.
- When using component connection, blank screen displayed (no into animation) after reboot finished. Must hit Tivo button to see screen.

To find those bugs, all you would have to do is just run them. Its not like you have to go through some complicated moves to get to those bugs. You just have to use the feature. I would hope companies at the very least test each function as part of the beta ? No ?



Luckyp79 said:


> Like what?
> 
> Can't just make a statement like that without backing it up.


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## jfh3

Let's try not to debate Tivo development or the beta process here - just compile a list of issues that will hopefully be addressed in future releases.


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## orangeboy

ilkevinli said:


> How about the 1st 3
> 
> - Can't run demo mode if using component cables
> - Can't change network address, even if you request to.
> - When using component connection, blank screen displayed (no into animation) after reboot finished. Must hit Tivo button to see screen.
> 
> To find those bugs, all you would have to do is just run them. Its not like you have to go through some complicated moves to get to those bugs. You just have to use the feature. I would hope companies at the very least test each function as part of the beta ? No ?


Are those listed bugs reproducible?


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## Luckyp79

ilkevinli said:


> How about the 1st 3
> 
> - Can't run demo mode if using component cables
> - Can't change network address, even if you request to.
> - When using component connection, blank screen displayed (no into animation) after reboot finished. Must hit Tivo button to see screen.
> 
> To find those bugs, all you would have to do is just run them. Its not like you have to go through some complicated moves to get to those bugs. You just have to use the feature. I would hope companies at the very least test each function as part of the beta ? No ?


Can't run demo mode if using component cables Why would a user need demo mode?
- Can't change network address, even if you request to. Do you change your network address every day? I don't
- When using component connection, blank screen displayed (no into animation) after reboot finished. Must hit Tivo button to see screen. Only person in my house that gets mad about the animation is my 3 year old daughter. I always skip it when I reboot

OMG!!!

When you find a bug that matters and stops a normal person from watching tv and recording it let me know would ya.

In the mean time I need to find a way to get my wife to allow me to spend $240 on this innovative piece of equipment.


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## nrc

What is helpful in this thread:

Bug reports
Detailed accounts of how to reproduce bugs
Confirmation of bug reports
What is unhelpful in this thread:

Complaints about TiVo or how horrible these bugs are.
Defending TiVo or stating how trivial these bugs are.
Lists of what's helpful or unhelpful in this thread.


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## jfh3

Luckyp79 said:


> Can't run demo mode if using component cables Why would a user need demo mode?
> - Can't change network address, even if you request to. Do you change your network address every day? I don't
> - When using component connection, blank screen displayed (no into animation) after reboot finished. Must hit Tivo button to see screen.
> 
> When you find a bug that matters and stops a normal person from watching tv and recording it let me know would ya.
> 
> In the mean time I need to find a way to get my wife to allow me to spend $240 on this innovative piece of equipment.


The fact I didn't see the animation is irrelevant - a new user to Tivo wouldn't even know to expect one - the fact that I ended up with a completely blank screen IS, as a new user might think the Tivo is "broken".

(Thanks for your contribution, but please read nrc's post below yours before posting here again.)


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## kdmorse

nrc said:


> What is unhelpful in this thread:
> Complaints about TiVo or how horrible these bugs are.
> Defending TiVo or stating how trivial these bugs are.
> Lists of what's helpful or unhelpful in this thread.


4. Discussion about whether a listed item is a bug?

I ask because of:

* No apparent way to control multiples with new Remote

How on does one classify the fact that the remote does not have a 1-2 switch, as a software bug in 14.1?

And a couple of the other line items are borderline at best. (Whishlisty/Feature Requesty/Room for Improvementy, but not Buggy..)

-Ken


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## jfh3

kdmorse said:


> * No apparent way to control multiples with new Remote
> 
> How on does one classify the fact that the remote does not have a 1-2 switch, as a software bug in 14.1?


Fair point. I've updated the list to clarify that clearly isn't a software bug.


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## Angerphile

I'm certain that TiVo is aware of these bugs and they will be resolved sooner than we all may expect.

Remember, the Premiere was given to end users BEFORE they TiVo expected. So I'm certain that the software that people receive on initial setup is a per TiVoJerry's comment earlier, he stated that the HD UI would be ready around April(?). So, I'm certain that any updates that have been pushed to the boxes since the retail 'leak' and today are of semi-beta quality to rid the boxes of any severe bugs and that yes, some other silly bugs still show up. However, I DO believe that TiVo will resolve these issues 'soon'. By soon, I assume it'll be by the time that the HD UI is officially released to the boxes.

No, I'm not trying to defend TiVo about this. Nor do I think that people should stop posting bugs.

What we SHOULD do though, is separate all the bugs in to: Obvious Bug, Feature Request, and Usability Enhancements. (The Demo mode not working, having the HD UI already, and wanting caching of Discovery Bar items respectively.)


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## SoBayJake

jfh3 said:


> During Guided Setup
> 3) When using component connection, blank screen displayed (no into animation) after reboot finished. Must hit Tivo button to see screen.


Mine did this, but is connected via HDMI (to a Denon AVR, then to the TV). I thought it was stuck until I accidentally hit the remote.


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## sghrush

nrc said:


> What is helpful in this thread:
> 
> Bug reports
> Detailed accounts of how to reproduce bugs
> Confirmation of bug reports
> What is unhelpful in this thread:
> 
> Complaints about TiVo or how horrible these bugs are.
> Defending TiVo or stating how trivial these bugs are.
> Lists of what's helpful or unhelpful in this thread.


Only 1080i seems to stay selected. All others only stay selected for a few hours then deselect themselves. I am not selecting auto. I am selecting all the resolutions since my TV supports all, then I select continue then press thumbs up 3 times to confirm.


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## i2k

CallMeBob said:


> To go back to a recording from the menus, you have to go back to My Shows, the program and hit Resume Play on the HD UI. ZOOM and LIVE TV just go to Live TV.
> 
> Using an older TiVo remote with the EXIT button will lock up the Menus so that you cannot select anything. Have to pull the plug to reboot.
> 
> Trying to pull a transfered program off a HP Mediasmart Server using the HP TiVo software will occasionally lock up the TiVo. You will have to pull the plug to reboot.
> 
> Youtube sometimes doesn't work. Will tell you that you have to have software past 9.4 even though the Premiere is on 14.*.


Confirmed - I had the 'exit' button programmed on my Harmony One, I change the command to be "Live TV" instead. I had to pull the power 4x already


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## i2k

AandFDakota2001 said:


> I've tried setting up seasons passes with no such luck on my new Premiere that I bought today. Anyone else having this problem with this rev of the software?
> 
> Justin


If you just activated the box, let it do the full guide download.. Also turn ON HME (suggestion by TIVO Support), then force a connect


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## bartotron

I've come across a nasty problem twice with the new menu system. In two cases when I have searched for a show no matter what I enter as a search string the search results all come back with the word "Null" in them. It was mildly amusing at first because there is a guy named "Gary Null" but, unfortunately, I have to reboot the box to get out of screen. 

I was very happy to hear about the classic mode....

B.


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## innocentfreak

When did you get and hook up your TiVo? I wonder if it is indexing and something is causing it to hiccup which is why it thinks nothing is there. You may want to give it 24 hours to let the indexing complete and see if it happens again.


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## i2k

innocentfreak said:


> When did you get and hook up your TiVo? I wonder if it is indexing and something is causing it to hiccup which is why it thinks nothing is there. You may want to give it 24 hours to let the indexing complete and see if it happens again.


I've seen the 'null' search, obviously the search engine is seeing no text input as 'null' and searching that term. LOL


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## bartotron

innocentfreak said:


> When did you get and hook up your TiVo? I wonder if it is indexing and something is causing it to hiccup which is why it thinks nothing is there. You may want to give it 24 hours to let the indexing complete and see if it happens again.


Well...I installed it on Monday night so I thought it would be pretty much finished doing it's thing. I tried to reproduce it last night again but wasn't successful...


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## jd575

I am new to Tivo and have received a Premiere. I noticed using the search function that Tivo does not provide all available sources for the program. For instance when I searched for "Tudors" it only listed TV and Amazon VOD. I know you can get it from Netflix instantly. 

I think this might be already listed in the first post.


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## DaveWhittle

jd575 said:


> I am new to Tivo and have received a Premiere. I noticed using the search function that Tivo does not provide all available sources for the program. For instance when I searched for "Tudors" it only listed TV and Amazon VOD. I know you can get it from Netflix instantly.
> 
> I think this might be already listed in the first post.


Upon initial setup, searches will only reveal show options for the following day or so. But soon (usually within 24 hours) it will index for two weeks, and give much more options in searches.

EDIT: Sorry, I just noticed you mentioned Netflix. I'm not sure if the above applies to that service.


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## wmcbrine

Just got my Premiere set up. One of the first things I tested was HME support, and I found a few bugs there:

1. LAN-originated HME apps appear before "Enable home network applications" is selected. Not really detrimental IMHO, but it does mean the option is non-functional.

2. Icons for LAN-originated HME apps are not displayed, although they are fetched.

3. "Add an application" lets you type in the address, but does nothing on pressing "Select". I had to TiVo-button out of the dialog, and of course I couldn't add apps.tv to the menu.

This is all with the HDUI, and I suspect these bugs won't apply in the classic interface, but I haven't tried that yet.

Edit: Confirmed, 2 and 3 don't apply in the classic UI. 1 does, but then I found that it gave me the enable/disable screen when I tried to enter the app, so maybe that's as intended.

Also, two more minor issues:

1. When LAN apps are announced or unregistered, they don't appear/disappear immediately in the HDUI, as they do in the classic UI; you have to leave the Showcases & Extras menu and return to it.

2. When entering an address in the "Add an application" dialog, the cursor doesn't auto-advance to the next block as it does in the classic UI. Of course this is minor next to this dialog not working at all because "Select" doesn't work.


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## wmcbrine

A couple more:

1. The discrete code for Standby isn't working in the network remote, at least in the HDUI. (I don't know about via IR yet.)

2. When I try to set up my new peanut for my Sceptre TV, only one code is listed, and it's not working. I was able to set up two other peanuts previously, I assume with the same code (I'm replacing a Series 2).


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## Dreamin

*Major*: OTA tuner 'reception' is worse than S3. A few of my channel Signal Strengths...
Chnl: S3 / S4
5-1: 97 / 81
7-1: 86 / 70
11-1: 84 / 64 (!)
28-1: 99 / 95
50-1: 89 / 65

I'm getting pixelation on the S4, where I NEVER did on the S3.
Chnl 11-1 RS errors: S3 / S4 (after 6000 seconds) 
RS Corrected: ~1400 / ~1100
RS Uncorrected: 0 / ~1000 

*Minor*: Numerous little GUI refresh issues. 
* Got stuck with Green Circle icon on My Shows 
* "New" icon under the Usage Meter
* Missing "New" icon in the "Record" line:









*Very Minor*: While a recording transfer is in progress, if a web video is downloaded, the blue LED turns off at the end of the web video download, not at the completion of the recording xfer.


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## aaronwt

jfh3 said:


> *Other*
> 1) Unlike S3/THD, when CableCARD inserted, box does not switch to CableCARD screen like S3/THD. Also does not indicate if CableCARD removed (though I don't think the earlier S3 software does this either)
> .


All three of the boxes I just setup, jumped to the Cable card screen showing the cable card info. Then I just had to enter clear and the guided setup continued.


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## i2k

I think the current version is 14.1-01-3-748.


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## wmcbrine

i2k said:


> I think the current version is 14.1-01-3-748.


That's the same. The last three digits indicate the model -- 746 is the regular Premie, 748 is the XL.


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## paulnelson20

Wouldn't exactly call it a bug, but, after I have gotten to the end of a program, I get the delete now or keep program screen, after I delete it the ui brings me back to the program info screen, where I have the option to play, delete, etc. even though I have already selected to delete it. I need to push the back left arrow to get back to the "My Shows" screen, wish it would just take me straight there after deleting a program.


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## wmcbrine

wmcbrine said:


> When I try to set up my new peanut for my Sceptre TV, only one code is listed, and it's not working. I was able to set up two other peanuts previously, I assume with the same code (I'm replacing a Series 2).


Confirmed -- the same code (0313) works on the peanut that came with my 540, but not on the new one. This is a serious problem for me, at least if I want to use the A B C D buttons.


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## Dreamin

paulnelson20 said:


> Wouldn't exactly call it a bug, but, after I have gotten to the end of a program, I get the delete now or keep program screen, after I delete it the ui brings me back to the program info screen, where I have the option to play, delete, etc. even though I have already selected to delete it. I need to push the back left arrow to get back to the "My Shows" screen, wish it would just take me straight there after deleting a program.


Noticed that too. Think it's an issue with the SD menus switching back to the HD menus... it should be fine once everything is HD


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## Phasers

Mine is completely unusable (XL). I plugged it in 3 hours ago and after literally 7 or 8 reboots I was finally able to complete guided setup.

It downloaded a software update took another 30 min to install it, then rebooted (SLOOOOOW btw).

Anyways got to the main TiVo menu, switched to the classic menu. Been stuck in a reboot loop ever since. It reboots to a grey screen, if I hit tivo button it shows classic menu text only over the grey background. Soon as I select another option, it reboots again. It is currently on its 5th- edit: 6th, edit: 7th reboot.

I'm seriously about to return it...

(btw i'm OTA only, no cable or cable cards)

WHY DO EACH OF THESE REBOOTS TAKE OVER 10 MINUTES?


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## b_scott

quick progress bar clear code does not work.


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## b_scott

paulnelson20 said:


> Wouldn't exactly call it a bug, but, after I have gotten to the end of a program, I get the delete now or keep program screen, after I delete it the ui brings me back to the program info screen, where I have the option to play, delete, etc. even though I have already selected to delete it. I need to push the back left arrow to get back to the "My Shows" screen, wish it would just take me straight there after deleting a program.


same. bugs me. seems to happen more on downloaded programs.


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## orangeboy

Phasers said:


> Mine is completely unusable (XL). I plugged it in 3 hours ago and after literally 7 or 8 reboots I was finally able to complete guided setup.
> 
> It downloaded a software update took another 30 min to install it, then rebooted (SLOOOOOW btw).
> 
> Anyways got to the main TiVo menu, switched to the classic menu. Been stuck in a reboot loop ever since. It reboots to a grey screen, if I hit tivo button it shows classic menu text only over the grey background. Soon as I select another option, it reboots again. It is currently on its 5th- edit: 6th, edit: 7th reboot.
> 
> I'm seriously about to return it...
> 
> (btw i'm OTA only, no cable or cable cards)
> 
> WHY DO EACH OF THESE REBOOTS TAKE OVER 10 MINUTES?


Take advantage of the return policy/warranty. If TiVo ships you a replacement, chances are slim to none that it will be a refurb (which although is certified, always made me leery - refurb to me signifies "already broke at least one time").


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## Goober96

Has anyone noticed that you can't set a program that was transferred to the S4 to KUID or is it just me?


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## b_scott

Goober96 said:


> Has anyone noticed that you can't set a program that was transferred to the S4 to KUID or is it just me?


yep, same here. at least it doesn't turn green.


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## b_scott

orangeboy said:


> Take advantage of the return policy/warranty. If TiVo ships you a replacement, chances are slim to none that it will be a refurb (which although is certified, always made me leery - refurb to me signifies "already broke at least one time").


refurb sometimes just means someone returned it because they didn't like Tivo. Also, to me I almost like it better because it means it's been checked out thoroughly at least twice.


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## Goober96

b_scott said:


> yep, same here. at least it doesn't turn green.


Thanks, then it's not just me. That's another one for the bug list.


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## dlramsey

I'm not sure if this is a bug, or a problem with the guide data for just the show I was looking at--but under the HD interface, all of the original air dates were off by 1 (showing original air date of 4/1 for a show that should have been listed as 4/2, 4/8 instead of 4/9, etc). It still flagged new episodes correctly though.


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## BigJimOutlaw

Sorry if it's already been mentioned. Wish I could have taken a picture, but was unable to at the time. Perhaps somebody else can reproduce it anyway.

The discovery bar had a graphic of Chef Scott from Hell's Kitchen. When I clicked on it, when the results finally did come up, the "recommended because" text overlapped with the "there is no further information" text. Ick.


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## b_scott

b_scott said:


> quick progress bar clear code does not work.


anyone get this to work?


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## b_scott

Tivo.com website does not show transferred recordings on Now Playing List of Premiere

did it ever, or is this a bug?


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## mae

Using the HDUI, sending a "list" command from a Harmony remote that was set up for an HD brings up the SD Now Playing List instead of the new My Shows HD screen.


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## b_scott

Harmony needs to add the Premiere


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## DaveWhittle

b_scott said:


> Harmony needs to add the Premiere


This.


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## Stone1555

746 is the ship version
748 is the newest code


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## b_scott

Stone1555 said:


> 746 is the ship version
> 748 is the newest code





wmcbrine said:


> That's the same. The last three digits indicate the model -- 746 is the regular Premie, 748 is the XL.


who's right?


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## SoBayJake

b_scott said:


> who's right?


TiVo uses the last 3 digits for the model. It will match the first 3 digits of your TSN. wmcbrine is correct.


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## Stone1555

I do apologize, i was provided with incorrect info

14.0 is the ship version and 14.1 is the newest software

Tivo support FTW...lol


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## jfh3

Actually, 14.1a is now the current software.


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## jfh3

Wow - this could be a big one:

My Shows doesn't display during "Loading info" (either program guide or downloading new software) - just green circle displayed.

Can anyone duplicate/confirm?


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## zob

In TiVo Central when I go to messages and settings then to settings the TV screen temporarily blacked out for a couple seconds then comes back on. I found this on other submenus also. Has anybody else experienced this? I am trying to determine if I have a defective unit or software bug.


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## DaveWhittle

zob said:


> In TiVo Central when I go to messages and settings then to settings the TV screen temporarily blacked out for a couple seconds then comes back on. I found this on other submenus also. Has anybody else experienced this? I am trying to determine if I have a defective unit or software bug.


Sounds like it's changing video formats. Try selecting one (I picked 1080i) and un-check all other display outputs.


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## zob

DaveWhittle said:


> Sounds like it's changing video formats. Try selecting one (I picked 1080i) and un-check all other display outputs.


Thanks that fixed the problem. 1080i worked just fine, no more black screen.


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## b_scott

zob said:


> Thanks that fixed the problem. 1080i worked just fine, no more black screen.


you can select 1080p as well, but nothing supports it yet.


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## Phantom Gremlin

b_scott said:


> refurb sometimes just means someone returned it because they didn't like Tivo. Also, to me I almost like it better because it means it's been checked out thoroughly at least twice.


Or it means that the unit was returned because of a "flaky" or intermittent problem. Then it received a cursory check, which didn't reproduce the issue, and was shipped out again. Only to fail a few days or a week later.

I don't think there's enough profit margin in these cheap consumer products for anything to be "checked out thoroughly at least twice". IMO. And, based on anecdotal reports in this forum, it's not clear to me that the Premiere is even "checked out thoroughly at least once".


----------



## guyincog

Dreamin said:


> *Major*: OTA tuner 'reception' is worse than S3. A few of my channel Signal Strengths...
> Chnl: S3 / S4
> 5-1: 97 / 81
> 7-1: 86 / 70
> 11-1: 84 / 64 (!)
> 28-1: 99 / 95
> 50-1: 89 / 65
> 
> I'm getting pixelation on the S4, where I NEVER did on the S3.
> Chnl 11-1 RS errors: S3 / S4 (after 6000 seconds)
> RS Corrected: ~1400 / ~1100
> RS Uncorrected: 0 / ~1000


I second this problem (or I just got a flawed unit) 10 main channels, with signal strengths all in the 60s, 70s, or 80s on my TiVo HD. Now all showing signal strength between 20 - 40 (and totally unwatchable or no picture at all) on the Premiere. Same connections, same spot, even swapped the units back and forth 3 times to make sure I hadn't messed something up.

I'm OTA only, so it looks like I'll be giving TiVo a call ...


----------



## FairfaxCA

Often (4 times today) after leaving TiVo Central with the Live TV button, the Live TV-Swap button would then malfunction. Instead of toggling between the two tuners it would bring up the guide. The Enter-Last button would still swap between the tuners. One time the Enter button only seemed to go back and forth between programs on the same tuner, since there was nothing buffered. This problem seems to mostly happen after I spent some time drilling down into the menus. I have just returned to TiVo after a few years and am trying to get familiar with its features. 

I did call TiVo support this morning and they gave me a work around. He had me exit the menus and when the guide appeared select a different channel. It worked that first time. But like when the problem begins, so does the remedy work, randomly. 

I did try to force a connection to TiVo service in case my 3 day old Premiere missed something during installation and update. When trying to connect I got a message that a new software update is coming at 2AM. I will wait to call support if the problem does not get fixed with the update. 

Has anyone else experienced a problem similar to this?


----------



## bobrt6676

OK I was freaking out for about 10 min. 
Select M&S- Settings- Blank Blue tivo screen. 
Select M&S-A&S info-Blank Blue tivo screen 
All M&S sub folders blank 
Selected Music & photos-"my music folder" - blank folder 
Just before, I noticed Tivo was loading(50%done) either a guide or software update. So I just went to Netfix- working, YouTube - working.
Came back to M&S after about 10 min and all folders were back. Working fine.
Scaaaaaaaaarrrrryyy


----------



## cranbers

6) Using an older TiVo remote with the EXIT button will lock up the Menus so that you cannot select anything. Have to pull the plug to reboot.


This is my favorite one I experienced today.  yaay for us day 1 adopters! Wooo, go us, not so bright, us.


----------



## aaronwt

I see the last update last night adds the letter a to the version. 

So now it's 14.1a-01-3-746 or 748


----------



## Kivo

Every now and then, when I switch from LiveTV to the HD menus, the audio switches to a high-pitched scratchy sound. It makes people kind of sound like the heavy-smoking grandmother of the Chipmunks. Going to the menu and then back to LiveTV returns it to normal.

This has happened between 5 and 10 times in the last 24 hours.


----------



## ItsRounder

This has happened to me twice now. I'm watching a channel for let's say 45 minutes and then a few minutes in to the new show I hit record. What happens is that instead of starting the recording when the show started a few minutes ago it also grabs the entire previous buffered show in the recording. As a result, the one hour show ends up being an hour and 5 minutes or however long the buffer had it in before I started to record the new show. One of my recordings for a one hour long show ended up being an hour and nineteen minutes long because it recorded the buffered part of the show that was playing before it as well.


----------



## falcon26

I just had to unplug my tivo. The remote was not working. I was in the main menu and was trying to go to live tv but it was not responding. Any button I pushed it did nothing. You could hear the tivo sound when you use a command but nothing was happening. Has that happened to anyone else?


----------



## bkdtv

ItsRounder said:


> This has happened to me twice now. I'm watching a channel for let's say 45 minutes and then a few minutes in to the new show I hit record. What happens is that instead of starting the recording when the show started a few minutes ago it also grabs the entire previous buffered show in the recording. As a result, the one hour show ends up being an hour and 5 minutes or however long the buffer had it in before I started to record the new show. One of my recordings for a one hour long show ended up being an hour and nineteen minutes long because it recorded the buffered part of the show that was playing before it as well.


That is normal with TiVo's current buffer implementation. TiVo buffers in segments and each segment is a certain size on the hard drive. When you click record to save the buffer, the TiVo saves all buffer segments together starting with the one that included the start of the program. Depending on whether the start of the program came at the beginning or end of the buffer segment, this could add anywhere between 0 and 20 minutes to the recording.

Another factor in this is the channel's bitrate / bandwidth. The lower the channel's bitrate, the more program time is contained within each segment, and thus the greater the chance that you will see excess time added to the beginning of the recording.

When you actually play the recording (play from beginning), the TiVo should start at the right time, not at the beginning of the buffer. You should never have to fast forward to the start of the program.


----------



## bkdtv

falcon26 said:


> I just had to unplug my tivo. The remote was not working. I was in the main menu and was trying to go to live tv but it was not responding. Any button I pushed it did nothing. You could hear the tivo sound when you use a command but nothing was happening. Has that happened to anyone else?


With the current 14.1 software, the classic software will occasionally crash so you cannot access the EPG, liveTV banner, Season Pass Manager, or To Do List. Sometimes it will restart on its own at some point, but I haven't identified an easy way to trigger that.


----------



## ItsRounder

Interesting. I'm coming from a series 1 where it didn't do this so I appreciate you letting me know. Thanks.


----------



## FairfaxCA

falcon26 said:


> I just had to unplug my tivo. The remote was not working. I was in the main menu and was trying to go to live tv but it was not responding. Any button I pushed it did nothing. You could hear the tivo sound when you use a command but nothing was happening. Has that happened to anyone else?





bkdtv said:


> With the current 14.1 software, the classic software will occasionally crash so you cannot access the EPG, liveTV banner, Season Pass Manager, or To Do List. Sometimes it will restart on its own at some point, but I haven't identified an easy way to trigger that.


This morning my green light on the box was off. The system came on when I pressed the TiVo button to the Tivo Central screen after the animation. It was frozen there and I also needed to pull the plug to reset. I think it crashed after last nights software update.


----------



## lessd

falcon26 said:


> I just had to unplug my tivo. The remote was not working. I was in the main menu and was trying to go to live tv but it was not responding. Any button I pushed it did nothing. You could hear the tivo sound when you use a command but nothing was happening. Has that happened to anyone else?


Yes the exact thing happened to me after the upgrade, were you using the HDMI to your TV, as I think it was working on the composite output, going to test that on another new Pre in the next day. Unplugging the TiVo fixed all that. Software was 14.1a


----------



## MacKai

falcon26 said:


> I just had to unplug my tivo. The remote was not working. I was in the main menu and was trying to go to live tv but it was not responding. Any button I pushed it did nothing. You could hear the tivo sound when you use a command but nothing was happening. Has that happened to anyone else?


Seem to be happening at random while in the Tivo Central menu (3x times now). Tivo will stop responding to the remote, nothing, no up, no down, no select, nothing, (unlike the EXIT button problem which allows you to scroll but not select) but the yellow circle on the front display lights up with every button press. However theres no green circle and the upper right box where your show is playing goes black except for the words "press zoom" which did nothing.... have to unplug to reboot...


----------



## tomm1079

cranbers said:


> 6) Using an older TiVo remote with the EXIT button will lock up the Menus so that you cannot select anything. Have to pull the plug to reboot.
> 
> This is my favorite one I experienced today.  yaay for us day 1 adopters! Wooo, go us, not so bright, us.


so thats why mine broke today!!

i also had an issue when i used the Program List button on my harmoney (it went to the SD program list) and then i went back to live TV. It lock up all menus the same way.


----------



## b_scott

Phantom Gremlin said:


> Or it means that the unit was returned because of a "flaky" or intermittent problem. Then it received a cursory check, which didn't reproduce the issue, and was shipped out again. Only to fail a few days or a week later.
> 
> I don't think there's enough profit margin in these cheap consumer products for anything to be "checked out thoroughly at least twice". IMO. And, based on anecdotal reports in this forum, it's not clear to me that the Premiere is even "checked out thoroughly at least once".


:shrug: I've never had an issue with a refurb. In fact, my first HD was from a woot.com deal on refurbs. Still running great, but I'm only selling it because I replaced with with a Premiere.


----------



## RoundTuit

I am also experiencing the problem where TiVo does not respond to remote commands and requires a forced reboot. The TiVo receives the command because the yellow LED blinks, but there is no boink and no other response from TiVo. At first I thought this was a problem with using a non-zero remote address (I have my Premiere XL set to address = 1 and am using the S3 glo remote so I can still operate my S3 which is in the same cabinet). However, since others are having the same problem, apparently it is unrelated to addressing.

It has happened to me three times and each time it was immediately after a reboot in the TiVo Central screen.


----------



## RoundTuit

TiVo Premiere seems to have lost the "Native" option for Video Output Format. That sucks because I much rather have my receiver or monitor do the scaling.


----------



## b_scott

yeah, noticed that. However, my panel doesn't welcome resolution switching, and I think 1080i looks great on this machine. Considering almost nothing I watch is in SD anyway, oh well.


----------



## SoBayJake

RoundTuit said:


> TiVo Premiere seems to have lost the "Native" option for Video Output Format. That sucks because I much rather have my receiver or monitor do the scaling.


I haven't tried this yet, but if you select both 720p and 1080i as allowable output formats, it should output whatever format the broadcaster is sending.

I have seen other reports where the TiVo "forgets" what settings should be checked, and always goes to 1080i. Is that what you are seeing?


----------



## _Ryan_

guyincog said:


> I second this problem (or I just got a flawed unit) 10 main channels, with signal strengths all in the 60s, 70s, or 80s on my TiVo HD. Now all showing signal strength between 20 - 40 (and totally unwatchable or no picture at all) on the Premiere. Same connections, same spot, even swapped the units back and forth 3 times to make sure I hadn't messed something up.
> 
> I'm OTA only, so it looks like I'll be giving TiVo a call ...


I'm also having OTA reception issues with the Premiere. Most channels were in the 70s-80s with my S3 (TivoHD). Some fell to the 20s and were unwatchable immediately after the switch. Nothing changed with my antenna or the weather or anything. I have now adjusted my antenna to a better angle and the channels are watchable again, but the signal strength is still not what it was with the S3... Could this be a software issue, or are the tuners worse in the Premiere?


----------



## RoundTuit

SoBayJake said:


> I haven't tried this yet, but if you select both 720p and 1080i as allowable output formats, it should output whatever format the broadcaster is sending.
> 
> I have seen other reports where the TiVo "forgets" what settings should be checked, and always goes to 1080i. Is that what you are seeing?


Yes, that is what I am seeing -- i.e., the settings don't stick (at least the one time I checked). I will keep an eye on it.

I was also a little lame in not realizing that in order to get the Native option I just needed to check all of the output formats -- that is what I am assuming anyway. I am going to give it a try.


----------



## bkdtv

RoundTuit said:


> TiVo Premiere seems to have lost the "Native" option for Video Output Format. That sucks because I much rather have my receiver or monitor do the scaling.


The Premiere still offers native output. It natively outputs every format you check in Video Output Format.

With the new implementation, you also have the ability to output 720p and 1080i HD natively, with SD upconverted to 1080i. That's what you get when only the 720p and 1080i boxes are checked.

Unlike the old SD UI, the HD UI menus display in both 720p and 1080i.


----------



## aaronwt

RoundTuit said:


> TiVo Premiere seems to have lost the "Native" option for Video Output Format. That sucks because I much rather have my receiver or monitor do the scaling.


Most of mine are set for native output. I have all the resolutions checked so it will output in the resolution the content is in. Which is native output.


----------



## wmcbrine

wmcbrine said:


> 2. Icons for LAN-originated HME apps are not displayed, although they are fetched.


I take it back -- it might be something about the icons, or the way I'm serving them. Since apps.tv's app selector came back up, I turned on three apps, and the Reversi icon still didn't show up, although the others did. I'll look into it further...


----------



## 241705

I was watching a show that I transferred from my TivoHD. At the end of the show, I tried to set up a Season Pass from the options that are presented, after hitting "left" to get back to the menu from the recorded show. I tried several times to get a season pass, but when I chose "Get Season Pass with These Options" (not sure that is the correct text) the Premiere XL just kept going back to the start of the same "show" menu. Finally, I just went into the search and set up a Season Pass that way. Is anyone else able to duplicate this?


----------



## darock159

I was also having the same problem setting up season passes from transfers. You are also not able to protect transferred recordings from being deleted. Not a deal breaker for me but it is annoying.


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## kylemax

I put my premiere on standby and the next day had a scrambled screen and had to unplug it and start it back up. It was lucky I didn't have anything scheduled to record!


----------



## DaveWhittle

RoundTuit said:


> I am also experiencing the problem where TiVo does not respond to remote commands and requires a forced reboot. The TiVo receives the command because the yellow LED blinks, but there is no boink and no other response from TiVo. At first I thought this was a problem with using a non-zero remote address (I have my Premiere XL set to address = 1 and am using the S3 glo remote so I can still operate my S3 which is in the same cabinet). However, since others are having the same problem, apparently it is unrelated to addressing.
> 
> It has happened to me three times and each time it was immediately after a reboot in the TiVo Central screen.


Add me to the list of this happening. 

I was watching TV, changing channels, and one of the tuners was recoding a show. I went into TiVo Central (HD-UI) and noticed I had two messages about the shows I scheduled to record on-line. Once I read and deleted the messages from the SD menus, I deleted them and returned to TiVo Central (HD Menu).

At this point I couldn't do anything with the remote, even though the yellow light on the front was blinking as I was pushing buttons. I pulled the plug, and after the 5 minute reboot it was working fine.

*one thing I didn't think of that I wish I had - I have my iPod Touch set up to act as a remote through the home network. Next time this happens, I'm going to try that to see if that can operate it via a non-IR source.


----------



## FairfaxCA

RoundTuit said:


> I am also experiencing the problem where TiVo does not respond to remote commands and requires a forced reboot. The TiVo receives the command because the yellow LED blinks, but there is no boink and no other response from TiVo. At first I thought this was a problem with using a non-zero remote address (I have my Premiere XL set to address = 1 and am using the S3 glo remote so I can still operate my S3 which is in the same cabinet). However, since others are having the same problem, apparently it is unrelated to addressing.
> 
> It has happened to me three times and each time it was immediately after a reboot in the TiVo Central screen.





DaveWhittle said:


> Add me to the list of this happening.
> 
> I was watching TV, changing channels, and one of the tuners was recoding a show. I went into TiVo Central (HD-UI) and noticed I had two messages about the shows I scheduled to record on-line. Once I read and deleted the messages from the SD menus, I deleted them and returned to TiVo Central (HD Menu).
> 
> At this point I couldn't do anything with the remote, even though the yellow light on the front was blinking as I was pushing buttons. I pulled the plug, and after the 5 minute reboot it was working fine.
> 
> *one thing I didn't think of that I wish I had - I have my iPod Touch set up to act as a remote through the home network. Next time this happens, I'm going to try that to see if that can operate it via a non-IR source.


To everyone using a remote other than the one that came with the Premiere and having weird things happen, the cause may be TiVo button signal from the remote is not right for the Premiere. Read my tread Live TV button problems for a possible solution.


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## SoBayJake

Amazon on demand can't play?
I purchased (freebie) the "Justified" pilot in HD from Amazon to test.
I started to play it while it was downloading, but the TiVo "forgot" to pass thru 1080p, so I set that again. Now when I try to play, it says:
"This program is downloading. It cannot be played now because the download speed is not fast enough or not enough video has been received. Please try to play this program again after 1 minute has passed."

But it has said that for 5 minutes, it started playing already (and had 5 minutes downloaded), and I'm on FiOS 25 mbit/sec connection!

I turned off 1080p to see if that caused it, but no such luck.


----------



## DaveWhittle

FairfaxCA said:


> To everyone using a remote other than the one that came with the Premiere and having weird things happen, the cause may be TiVo button signal from the remote is not right for the Premiere. Read my tread "Live TV button problems" for a possible solution.


I'm using a Harmony only to turn on and off my TV and Denon. I'm using the TiVo peanut that came with the Premiere for operating the DVR.


----------



## bkdtv

SoBayJake said:


> But it has said that for 5 minutes, it started playing already (and had 5 minutes downloaded), and I'm on FiOS 25 mbit/sec connection!


There seems to be an issue (bug?) related to playback of recordings that download. For some videos, I've been able to play instantly. On other videos, I've been unable to play even with 20 minutes downloaded.


----------



## chsscgas

Recording Two Shows.
I go through My Shows to watch one program. I catch up to the "Live" point. I hit the TiVo button to go back to TiVo Central - My Shows.
I start watching the second program. Catch up to the "Live" point on the second show. I hit the TiVo button to go back to TiVo Central - My Shows.
I pick the first show through My Shows. Instead of resuming playing where I left off it starts at the beginning.


----------



## Fist of Death

First system lock-up. TiVo shows small "live" window in upper right of TiVo Central, red recording lights go on / off for various shows on both tuners that were planned, but the system is unresponsive to remote control commands. The box indicator lights up, showing that commands are being received, but nothing happens. iTiVo connects to the unit, and shows what's being recorded, and all the shows on the unit, but the UI seems dead. This happened about an hour ago, so I'm assuming that the freeze is permanent - requiring a reboot. I'll wait 'till after the family leaves after Easter dinner, but this is a disappointment.


----------



## iamcds1

I was adding some of my podcasts back as season passes and I think I ran into a problem. When I use the search function to find Geekbrief.tv and Crankygeeks I find the show but it won't let me make a Season pass for it. I get to downloading options, it makes a noise and lights ups on the front plate like I am moving on to finish the season pass but nothing happens. It would be nice to get an explanation of why it won't continue adding the season pass.


----------



## sghrush

I apologize if this has been posted previously?

In the channel list, I selected some channels that I received. They "stuck" for a few hours then deselected themselves. There were also a few channels I deselected because I knew I did not get them. This "stuck" for a few hours then a few re-selected themselves. Hmmmm...


----------



## b_scott

if I go into the Cablecard settings menu section, then hit live TV, then hit Back - I can't do anything to the settings.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

chsscgas said:


> Recording Two Shows.
> I go through My Shows to watch one program. I catch up to the "Live" point. I hit the TiVo button to go back to TiVo Central - My Shows.
> I start watching the second program. Catch up to the "Live" point on the second show. I hit the TiVo button to go back to TiVo Central - My Shows.
> I pick the first show through My Shows. Instead of resuming playing where I left off it starts at the beginning.


Just because it doesn't do what you expect, that doesn't mean it's a bug. 

I don't have the time to try this on my TiVo HD, but IIRC what you are describing is *normal behavior*, not a bug. I think part (if not all) of the problem is because you exited a program that was still being recorded and you were within 5 minutes of the Live point when you did that.

I think the generalization is that the TiVo behavior isn't necessarily what you expect when you exit within 5 minutes of the end of a program, whether or not it is still being recorded.

Some workarounds:

If you are going back and forth between multiple programs that have completed recording, it will properly remember your position for each (except for within 5 minutes of the end).

If you use the "Live TV" button to flip back and forth between two currently recording programs, it will remember your position (as long as you Pause before flipping; if you don't Pause the program is caught up to Live when you flip back). *Important:* do not go into Now Playing to select programs, use only the "Live TV" to flip. With my Tivo HD I do this all the time on Sundays during football season, and it works great. Now, if it doesn't do the same for the Premiere, then yes, I'd call that a bug.


----------



## chsscgas

Phantom Gremlin - I've had a TiVo (Series 2 then Series 3) since 2003. The behavior I described with the Premier starting from the beginning of the recording instead of resuming where you left off (unless you are within the last 5 minutes of a recording) is totally different than it was in previous versions.

I've used the Live TV button to switch between live programs (after pausing) when watching sports but I haven't tried that with the Premier.

I can't think of any reason why TiVo would change the functionality of the recordings in the My Shows area to always start at the beginning instead of resuming where you left off. This has to be a bug!! If I started watching a two hour movie from the My Shows area while it was being recorded. I then had to leave to run an errand and exited watching the show by hitting the TiVo button to go to the My Shows menu. I expect it to resume from the point I left off not from the beginning


----------



## i2k

Issue with setting items from the new HDUI to "keep until I delete".

I have been unsuccessful in setting items to "keep until I delete'' the icons simply stays yellow vs green. 

This works in the classic menus.


----------



## i2k

chsscgas said:


> I can't think of any reason why TiVo would change the functionality of the recordings in the My Shows area to always start at the beginning instead of resuming where you left off. This has to be a bug!! If I started watching a two hour movie from the My Shows area while it was being recorded. I then had to leave to run an errand and exited watching the show by hitting the TiVo button to go to the My Shows menu. I expect it to resume from the point I left off not from the beginning


Correct me if I'm wrong but im pretty sure this has always been the case with the Series 3's .. if your watching something out of the cache .


----------



## b3ar

i2k said:


> Issue with setting items from the new HDUI to "keep until I delete".
> 
> I have been unsuccessful in setting items to "keep until I delete'' the icons simply stays yellow vs green.
> 
> This works in the classic menus.


This is replicable on my XL.

Work-around for when the Premiere "forgets" to use the HD interface: go into Settings and toggle the SD interface on, then go back into Settings and re-enable the HD menus. I'm still trying to figure out what conditions are triggering the drop back to the SD menus.


----------



## i2k

b3ar said:


> This is replicable on my XL.
> 
> Work-around for when the Premiere "forgets" to use the HD interface: go into Settings and toggle the SD interface on, then go back into Settings and re-enable the HD menus. I'm still trying to figure out what conditions are triggering the drop back to the SD menus.


If you have the "List" command programmed (ie: on a Harmony remote) it will bring up the List from the SD interface and allow you to do the 'keep until i delete' option and have it stick. Note this is MUCH quicker than thru the HDUI and also MUCH quicker at processing this request than my S3 and THD.


----------



## mikebaratta

Tivo hangs after pressing Live TV on standard Premiere remote on tivo central home screen (only happend once so far, but within my first 2 hours of use)
Season Pass 'new only' recording repeats - programs are labeled with 'R'


----------



## rainwater

mikebaratta said:


> Season Pass 'new only' recording repeats - programs are labeled with 'R'


It's not a bug if they fall within the 28 day rule. If the original air date is within 28 days it will be recorded if it hasn't previously.


----------



## sghrush

Not sure if this has been reported previously? After I entered a manual recording to record by time/channel, I hit select to enter my selection and then BAM!...my Premiere crashed and rebooted. Hmmm....


----------



## gamo62

Once the setup was complete, the version of software I now havbe ends in .748. I do have the PremiereXL, so I amnot sure if that makes a difference.


----------



## SoBayJake

gamo62 said:


> Once the setup was complete, the version of software I now havbe ends in .748. I do have the PremiereXL, so I amnot sure if that makes a difference.


The numbers before that are the important ones.

.748 is the model, which matches the first 3 of your TSN.


----------



## mikebaratta

rainwater said:


> It's not a bug if they fall within the 28 day rule. If the original air date is within 28 days it will be recorded if it hasn't previously.


Wow, I've been a Tivo user since series 1 sony and I never knew that; thanks rainwater.


----------



## SoBayJake

mikebaratta said:


> Wow, I've been a Tivo user since series 1 sony and I never knew that; thanks rainwater.


My Premiere is picking up Law & Order and some other things on NBC. At first I was thinking to myself "this recorded last week!" But it was recorded last week on my S3, and so to the Premiere, it's a new show!


----------



## SoBayJake

Today I was greeted with this. My Premiere reverted to 480i only!


----------



## Henry3NYC

I just experienced the non-responsive TiVo issue mentioned above, but that hasn't happened until just this hour. I'm using the new remote that came with the until. Oddly enough, when I turned on my TV, I saw the tail end of the TiVo is here animation, which would suggest that the TiVo had just completed a self-inducted reboot. But that wasn't the case because it was recording a show that started 20 minutes ago without interruption. After the animation, I was taken to the CD TiVo Central (even though I'm set up for HD). Pressing the TiVo button brought me to the HD My Shows menu, but then I got stuck. The TiVo Premiere box acknowledge my remote clicks with an orange light, but the box took no actions. I had to unplug and reboot to get it working again.


----------



## Henry3NYC

So far, I really like the new Premiere box. My only real disappointment is the speed of navigating the menus. But I guess you can't expect a device that pings the Internet to always be responsive.

I've been keeping a log of the bugs to help with getting things ironed out. Here is what I have noticed so far:

 When in the TiVo Guide, the Info button on the remote should pull up the program information for the highlighted show. Instead, it pulls up the Guide Options (as if I pressed Enter).
 If I let the program run to the end of the show, and then I select "Delete now" from the options that pop above the status bar (the time band), I am taken back to the program information screen instead of to the My Shows list. When I back out to My Shows, the program is indeed deleted, so it's just an error of pointing the user to the wrong screen.
 When I cancel a recording that is in progress (highlighting in My Shows and pressing Clear), I see there is a new pop-up menu that gives the option of Stop Recording and Delete. I love the new feature, but the partial recordings are not being deleted. Oddly, a gray X appears next to the program name for a second, but then it disappears and is replaced by the blue button icon.
 Deleting a program during playback does not always delete the program. Specifically, I am watching a recorded show, then selecting Left to go back to the program information screen -- the recorded show is still playing in the top right corner. I select Delete now (i hear the sound that confirms I selected it), but nothing happens. I select it again, and then the program deletes as it should. This is an intermittent issue. I haven't figured out yet when it works and when it doesn't. 
 The Live TV button on the remote (the new remote provided with the unit) does not always toggle between the two tuned channels. I've been trying to pinpoint other conditions that might be tied to when it works and when it doesn't. No luck yet.
Thank you in advance for work addressing these. I also have a few quick UI suggestions I'll post elsewhere (if I can find the correct message string).


----------



## wmcbrine

wmcbrine said:


> I take it back -- it might be something about the icons, or the way I'm serving them.


So, it turned out to be both. First, I had a stupid bug in my HME for Python server, where there was an extra colon after "Content-Length". The interesting thing about this is how it affected only the HDUI; I'd have thought that fetching the icons was a back-end thing rather than a UI thing, and both UIs would've shared the code, but apparently not.

That fixed, I still only got about half my icons to show up. It turns out that the HDUI only supports RGB PNGs for the icons, not indexed or greyscale.


----------



## sghrush

Henry3NYC said:


> So far, I really like the new Premiere box. My only real disappointment is the speed of navigating the menus. But I guess you can't expect a device that pings the Internet to always be responsive.
> 
> I've been keeping a log of the bugs to help with getting things ironed out. Here is what I have noticed so far:
> 
> When in the TiVo Guide, the Info button on the remote should pull up the program information for the highlighted show. Instead, it pulls up the Guide Options (as if I pressed Enter).
> If I let the program run to the end of the show, and then I select "Delete now" from the options that pop above the status bar (the time band), I am taken back to the program information screen instead of to the My Shows list. When I back out to My Shows, the program is indeed deleted, so it's just an error of pointing the user to the wrong screen.
> When I cancel a recording that is in progress (highlighting in My Shows and pressing Clear), I see there is a new pop-up menu that gives the option of Stop Recording and Delete. I love the new feature, but the partial recordings are not being deleted. Oddly, a gray X appears next to the program name for a second, but then it disappears and is replaced by the blue button icon.
> Deleting a program during playback does not always delete the program. Specifically, I am watching a recorded show, then selecting Left to go back to the program information screen -- the recorded show is still playing in the top right corner. I select Delete now (i hear the sound that confirms I selected it), but nothing happens. I select it again, and then the program deletes as it should. This is an intermittent issue. I haven't figured out yet when it works and when it doesn't.
> The Live TV button on the remote (the new remote provided with the unit) does not always toggle between the two tuned channels. I've been trying to pinpoint other conditions that might be tied to when it works and when it doesn't. No luck yet.
> Thank you in advance for work addressing these. I also have a few quick UI suggestions I'll post elsewhere (if I can find the correct message string).


Thanks you so much for compiling this list. Should you add one more bug? On some Premieres auto detect will not turn off and that all but one resolution will deselect themselves after awhile. Or is this still pending as to whether it is a bug or not?


----------



## jkudlacz

DaveWhittle said:


> Upon initial setup, searches will only reveal show options for the following day or so. But soon (usually within 24 hours) it will index for two weeks, and give much more options in searches.
> 
> EDIT: Sorry, I just noticed you mentioned Netflix. I'm not sure if the above applies to that service.


Make sure that you have Netflix Account, also activate your account (pair it with your new Tivo) That should help let us know.


----------



## jkudlacz

New Tivo Premiere is currently using only 1 of 2 cores it has.

TiVo people said that they are still testing software and stability of the system.

I bet that they are using all new users for testing purposes, they are collecting data and based on that they are fixing all the issues and problems we are having. I hope they make whole User Interface (UI) HD soon.

Once 2nd core is enabled we should be running much smoother. 

Tivo Premiere's processor is 2.5 times faster than Series 3.

BUGS:

- Has anyone noticed any issues with Transferring shows from old Tivo (I have Tivo Series 3) to Tivo Premiere?
I must have setup transfers 3 times already. Each time I got some of the shows transfered while others I have to setup for transfer again.
I am not sure if this is related to updates Tivo send to my box or if not all transfers are saved in to do list of my new Tivo.

- I have been experiencing issues with Season Pass but after reading comments I think this may be related to Guide Update not being uploaded fully. I will try again tonight and then tomorrow.

I have a TW Cable guy coming in tomorrow morning to setup new M-Card, then I will start playing with TiVo and see how many bugs I can find.


----------



## SoBayJake

jkudlacz said:


> New Tivo Premiere is currently using only 1 of 2 cores it has.
> 
> TiVo people said that they are still testing software and stability of the system.
> 
> I bet that they are using all new users for testing purposes, they are collecting data and based on that they are fixing all the issues and problems we are having. I hope they make whole User Interface (UI) HD soon.
> 
> Once 2nd core is enabled we should be running much smoother.
> 
> Tivo Premiere's processor is 2.5 times faster than Series 3.


Has anyone from TiVo confirmed the 2nd core is not turned on? I was under the impression the GUI was just not multiple-processor aware. Other posts said it would not be a double in speed, since the other core is being utilized for
other tasks already.


----------



## yunlin12

When I inserted the cable cards, I seem to remember seeing the cable card menu popping up. Then again I switched to the SD menu when I was doing that. Maybe it's only an issue with HD menu, just like most of the other issues.

It's as if Tivo has included the SD menu as a roll-back option to the automatic SW upgrade to the HD menu. Well, some people have asked for this for a long time, nice to see Tivo finally coming through.


----------



## orangeboy

SoBayJake said:


> Has anyone from TiVo confirmed the 2nd core is not turned on? I was under the impression the GUI was just not multiple-processor aware. Other posts said it would not be a double in speed, since the other core is being utilized for
> other tasks already.


TiVoPony confirmed it in this post.


----------



## ilh

4.1a software...

First time trying YouTube on it, box locked up hard less than a minute into video. Sigh...


----------



## Henry3NYC

Hey guys. A few more bugs to add to the list:


There is some wackiness going on with the Download Manager. I wanted to add TEDTalks HD (something I had on my previous TiVo). When I found it in Search and selected it, it told me I was already subscribed, but it wasn't in my list in the DM. If I selected Edit Season Pass, I got stuck and had to back out. I was able to cancel the Season Pass and re-add it. That seems to be the workaround until it is fixed.
I LOVE that I can use my USB keyboard to enter search terms, but I notice that the space bar does not add a space. Is that something that can be easily fixed?
When I search in Tivo Central/Find TV.../Search, sometimes I am offered to search YouTube for the search term, and sometimes not. Not sure if there is some logic behind when it is offered and when it is not.
Perhaps not a bug... certainly not a top priority: When I select an actor from Search, under More Info, there is an option to Create a WishList Search. It's a nifty little feature, but it really doesn't work right because the WishList names list is Last (comma) First, whereas the names in the TiVo Search are First Last.
Thanks for all of your work addressing these. You guys must be putting in some long hours. We appreciate it.


----------



## threeonparfive

Can we get a "sticky" on this thread and update the list as we notice bugs to be resolved in whatever the next code version will be?


----------



## jkudlacz

ilh said:


> 4.1a software...
> 
> First time trying YouTube on it, box locked up hard less than a minute into video. Sigh...


BUGS:

Yeah I tried to go to YouTube on my box (14.1a version) while running HDUI box would switch to SDUI and was about to open YouTube channel but then it stops and goes back to previous page where I started.

I am still having issues with Season Pass, I transfered few shows from my Series 3 to Tivo Premiere and when I go to Human Target folder and below I have a Season Pass, I click on it and nothing happens, it tries to load it then it stops and goes back to same page with Season Pass option on it.

Another issue is that same shows are not being Grouped together (This may be related to bug above) I transfered 5 Human Target episode from Series 3 to Premiere and now I have two folders one with 3 episodes other with 2. I had to setup transfers 3 times, so I am not sure if each separate time I requested those caused this issue, but it is a pain.

Tell QA to get to work and developers to start working Harder on Those boxes.


----------



## b_scott

transferred recordings don't show up on your Now Playing List on tivo.com


----------



## jkudlacz

I have a question, I had a TWC guy come in this morning to install M-Card on my Premiere. He setup whole thing paired card and when he selected option to Scan Channels we got a page Acquiring Channels after 5 min he said it may take much longer and went to his next appointment. I waited another 10 min and went to work myself. I have Series 3 and it didn't have anything similar happen, could this be a bug? Not sure why it takes so long, does TIVO actually scan each and every channel right there and then?

When I get home I will have a look if its done or not, hope it will be, otherwise I will be calling TWC and Tivo to get it resolved.

I love this adventure, TIVO uses all of us as their QA team, collects our data, and builds products on the fly.

Current HD interface covers maybe 25&#37; of interface so far. I hope everything will get an HDUI, I mean everything, GUIDE, progress bar, Settings, Blockbuster, YouTube (once it works), Amazon etc. 

I would love to get an explanation why this half ass product was release the way it was?


----------



## i2k

14.1a seems to have fixed the 'keep until I delete' issue (it now saves 'keep until I delete' when you select it and the icon changes to a green circle)


----------



## RogerA

I remember the good old days when I didn't have to contact TiVo for support. I have been a TiVo customer for over 10 years and I have owned Series1, Series2, Series3 which I had to trade in because of issues I was having, and now the Premiere running 14.1a software. I hate that I see any issues with the new TiVos but I am also aware that the new boxes are a lot more complex.

Issues:

I, like other posters, have had the issue where TiVo freezes on TiVo Central. The preview screen at the top right part of the screen is blank with a blue exclamation point in the bottom left corner of that screen and it displays Press Zoom at the bottom. All commands I send with the stock remote are received by the Premiere indicated by the flashing yellow orange circle on the TiVo. While the Tivo was frozen on Tivo Central, the recording continued and TiVo was still communicating with the network indicated by the flashing port light on my wireless router. I rebooted TiVo to fix this issue. This has happened twice since I have had the box which I put online last Friday April 2.

Podcasts are interesting. I set TiVo up to record Podcasts for CNET. When I go to play one, there is a loud pop sound and a brief moment of static before the video starts playing. This only happens with the podcasts and when I first tell TiVo to start playing the video and no where else.

Hopefully these issues will get resolved soon.


----------



## [email protected]

I set up a static IP address, after putting in the new address, subnet mask (unchanged), default gateway (also unchanged) and DNS servers, the Port configuration and DNS resolution test succeeded, and I then made a test service call and started a daily call.

Shortly after this, I went to TiVo central and the the TiVo became unresponsive to the remote. Nor did the TiVo respond to a ping (nor did it's address show up in an "arp-a") on either the old nor the new IP address.

After rebooting the TiVo seems fine.

Of course, this could be an undocumented requirement to reboot after changing the IP address.


----------



## b_scott

My wife got sick of the slowness of the HDUI, so i paused Damages - went to the settings and switched to the SDUI. THX logo played, went to the menu and now playing. Chose Damages, hit play. It went to the show and showed it paused. I hit play a couple times and nothing happened. Then all of a sudden it rebooted.


----------



## bkdtv

b_scott said:


> My wife got sick of the slowness of the HDUI, so i paused Damages - went to the settings and switched to the SDUI. THX logo played, went to the menu and now playing. Chose Damages, hit play. It went to the show and showed it paused. I hit play a couple times and nothing happened. Then all of a sudden it rebooted.


I too have seen reboots with actions immediately following a HDUI -> classic switch. I now reboot whenever I switch between the two.

After a reboot, classic is stable in normal usage.


----------



## b_scott

fun times.

also, the quick progress bar clear code woks in SDUI, but not HDUI.


----------



## RedFive99

90&#37; of the time when I finish watching a show and choose "delete now" I am dropped back at the details scene for the show I just deleted instead of the Now Playing List.


----------



## nyctwc

I have a pretty major bug with my Premiere XL. I transferred all of my shows from my Series 3 to the Premiere. If I go to My Shows and I turn Groups off, about a month's worth of shows (12/19 to 1/17) disappear from the list. If I turn Groups on, they reappear in their proper folders. Is anyone else having this problem?


----------



## b_scott

probably has something to do with the reason you can't make transferred stuff "keep till I delete" in the HDUI. FYI, after switching to SDUI you can do it again.

I wonder if I changed everything to KUID and then switched back to the HDUI if it would stick.


----------



## butaneko

Don't have my cablecard yet but was just browsing movies and came to "Lost in Translation". It gave me the option to "Watch Now" thru Netflix, but when I selected it it was unavailable to watch streaming. Seems like it could be pretty frustrating if that's a common occurrence.


----------



## [email protected]

Spontaneous reboot. was xfering a show from a series 2 box. canceled it then tried to return to my shows.


----------



## [email protected]

USB attached keyboard does not input alphanumeric keys as expected when entering Yahoo ID and password to get local weather. Direction and enter keys do work as expected.


----------



## orangeboy

[email protected] said:


> USB attached keyboard does not input alphanumeric keys as expected when entering Yahoo ID and password to get local weather. Direction and enter keys do work as expected.


I think wmcbine has discovered that the wireless keyboard is not fully functional in the HME apps (yet). I think your observation supports that.


----------



## ilh

USB (wired) keyboard doesn't seem to support SPACE bar when typing in search text. Backspace doesn't work either.


----------



## SoBayJake

butaneko said:


> Don't have my cablecard yet but was just browsing movies and came to "Lost in Translation". It gave me the option to "Watch Now" thru Netflix, but when I selected it it was unavailable to watch streaming. Seems like it could be pretty frustrating if that's a common occurrence.


FINALLY! That was the first one I've seen that linked directly to Netflix. Everything else has the TV/Live/Amazon/BB/Netflix logos in the lower right, but never linked anywhere.

If a show appears on AmazonVOD, I thought it would link me to the show? Do I really have to exit the search, go into Amazon myself and find it? Seems odd.


----------



## SoBayJake

SoBayJake said:


> FINALLY! That was the first one I've seen that linked directly to Netflix. Everything else has the TV/Live/Amazon/BB/Netflix logos in the lower right, but never linked anywhere.
> 
> If a show appears on AmazonVOD, I thought it would link me to the show? Do I really have to exit the search, go into Amazon myself and find it? Seems odd.


And of course, the one video that links to Netflix I've found doesn't work! That title isn't available for streaming. Going to the Netflix website confirms that!


----------



## [email protected]

Alphanumeric keys work for search, but not for entering the Yahoo ID/PW. Space and backspace keys don't work anywhere I have tried.


----------



## wmcbrine

ilh said:


> USB (wired) keyboard doesn't seem to support SPACE bar when typing in search text. Backspace doesn't work either.


They work, but only in the Classic UI.


----------



## Goober96

b_scott said:


> probably has something to do with the reason you can't make transferred stuff "keep till I delete" in the HDUI. FYI, after switching to SDUI you can do it again.
> 
> I wonder if I changed everything to KUID and then switched back to the HDUI if it would stick.


Yes, it will stick. I just did this on mine.


----------



## b_scott

can you try the quick clear (Select/Play/Select/Pause/Select) on Classic and then go to HD and see if it still works? Sorry, i'm at work.


----------



## Goober96

b_scott said:


> can you try the quick clear (Select/Play/Select/Pause/Select) on Classic and then go to HD and see if it still works? Sorry, i'm at work.


Yes, tried that and it does stick.


----------



## MikeRadio

My status bar when watching live or recorded TV disappeared randomly the other day... and so did the Channel description overlay... Dont know wha tI did to cause this.. a reboot fixed... anyone else see this behavior?


----------



## GCymbala

RoundTuit said:


> I am also experiencing the problem where TiVo does not respond to remote commands and requires a forced reboot.
> ...


Last night I had a fun one. Was watching a previously recorded program. I started fast-forwarding through it, skipping commercials, when the unit stopped responding to the remote. It continued to play the recorded program, but the yellow/orange light on the front didn't light up with any remote button pushes (tried two different TiVo remotes). No sounds either. Just no response at all, while it continued to play the recorded show.

I ended doing a hard reboot.


----------



## DaveWhittle

GCymbala said:


> Just no response at all, while it continued to play the recorded show.
> 
> I ended doing a hard reboot.


Are you using the new HD-UI or the old classic one?


----------



## GCymbala

DaveWhittle said:


> Are you using the new HD-UI or the old classic one?


At the time I think I was using the classic UI. But I hadn't tried to go back to TiVo Central or My Shows or anything. Just skipping aheard through a program.


----------



## JoN8282

i can verify 

9) When navigating to "My Shows", the green wait circle can get "stuck" on the screen (i.e. more than a couple seconds). No information populates and you need to navigate away and come back.

on an XL... but also sometimes the control becomes unresponsive during this and requires a power cycle to get out.

also I am seeing some issues where certain functions that have you leave a recording you are watching then return to it where the tivo does not remember the correct resume point, however i do not have any of those things narrowed down to the point where i could give instructions to reproduce


----------



## Goober96

Not a bug per se, but did they remove episode numbers from the show information on the HDUI or am I just missing it?


----------



## Fifty1Ford

I'm not sure if this has been covered but there is a small issue with a big UI feature with Netflix, and I assume blockbuster and amazon...
The 30 second rewind.

When watching Netflix there seems to be no 'follow behind' buffer at all.
Even one single press of the 30 second rewind button causes it to totally buffer up the video again. Heaven forbid you automatically press it several times in a row to go a minute and half back... You get 3 re-buffers taking probably 2 minutes total.

I'm not sure about other peoples usage habits, but with small kids in the house that 30 skip back button gets used all the time to catch missed punchlines and plot points. It's there for TV, it works for downloaded videos (perhaps amazon?), but not for Netflix... 

I realize that rewind and fast forward are issues with streaming but a few minutes of 'follow behind' buffering would fix this.


----------



## mikebaratta

Intermittently the video preview window does not play audio...pausing and un-pausing the video resolves.

The "Music on {computer name}" and "Photos on {computer name}" will never show up on the "Music and Photos" item the first time I go to it now matter how long I wait. But they show up immediately the second time I access that menu item after accessing the showcases option. I'm not sure the amount of time 'required' between visits before it becomes a 'first visit' again.


----------



## wmcbrine

Fifty1Ford said:


> I'm not sure if this has been covered but there is a small issue with a big UI feature with Netflix, and I assume blockbuster and amazon...
> The 30 second rewind.


That's the 8-second rewind; and no, the problem doesn't apply to Amazon or Blockbuster, since those are download services rather than streaming. And it doesn't apply to YouTube or the other streaming services, either, because they stream in a different way that keeps a buffer. Only Netflix (so far) uses this strange streaming method that seems to discard the buffer after you've played it.

Yes, it's well known, and no, it doesn't really belong in this thread, because it's been the same since Netflix was first introduced to the TiVo.


----------



## mikebaratta

I am not sure if this is technically a bug, but I don't see why it would be on purpose -

Tivo search keeps your last search string entered when you return to search later.

- I don't see the use in doing this


----------



## falcon26

When is the next update due?


----------



## lessd

Tried the S4XL in my system in place of my Series 3 648
Picture looked a litter better
I got static noise changing channels using the optical output into my Meridian surround sound system, not as bad as the TiVo-HD but the Series 3 648 had no noise changing channels
Grey screen much longer when changing channels not noticeable on the Series 3 648
Using the HDUI I watch the ABC news in HD that i had recorded, when finished I selected keep the program, TiVo went back to main HDUI menu most all the buttons on the remote would not work, I could here the bong and the TiVo light went on but no action except for the up-dwn-left -right arrows. I could not get out out the menu because the select would not work. I am taking a shower and hope that the TiVo goes back to live TV by itself. (The live TV button will not work)
I guess for now i will go back to my trusty Series 3 648 until more updates come along for the S4XL.


----------



## chewy2314

I have SPS30S enabled and skip to tick while FWD works only on prerecorded programs. In Live buffer, skip while FWD only goes to beginning or end of the buffer.
edit: okay, just read the FAQ... i like the old way better.
edit: nevermind. once set to "skip to tick" on the remote settings, the SPS30S functions as normal in both recorded and live TV.


edit: anyone else notice that when you FWD 2x speed, the video "jumps" ahead a few frames? FWD does not start on the following frame. kinda visually annoying to me.


----------



## k2ue

When you are in My Programs an SD real-time program appears without Pillar-Box in the upper right, i.e. it is stretched to 16:9.


----------



## Fifty1Ford

wmcbrine said:


> That's the 8-second rewind
> .... Netflix (so far) uses this strange streaming method that seems to discard the buffer after you've played it.
> 
> Yes, it's well known, and no, it doesn't really belong in this thread, because it's been the same since Netflix was first introduced to the TiVo.


Ah, OK. Yes, I mean 8 seconds. I did not end up with a series 3 and have not been using Netflix on anything other than my PC. What a shame, it is a huge feature for me.
I have not been in this forum in ages, my series 1 and 2 have been 'just working' for so very long. I hope that my Tivo Premiere will be the same after a few months.


----------



## b_scott

Netflix randomly left my Now Playing List in the SDUI.


----------



## RoundTuit

I don't know if the following are bugs or intentional changes in how the Series 4 behaves vs. the Series 3. but I will report them just for the record.

First, the Series 4 does not seem to handle the PowerToggle command properly. I can see that it is being sent (amber LED flashes) when I use my Harmony 900 to shut down a Watch TiVo activity, but the TiVo never goes into standby mode. Also, if I use a Harmony soft button to send the PowerToggle command while watching a program, it responds by going into the TiVo Central main menu. In both of these cases the Series 3 will go into standby mode.

Second, if I put the Series 4 in standby via the Tivo Central sub-menu, the red LED indicator never comes on when a program is being recorded. The Series 3 always shows when programs are being recorded or transferred whether in standby or not. I think this is an important feature because sometimes I like to turn off the master power to my HT cabinet, and in the case of the Series 4 I would not know if a program was being recorded.


----------



## falcon26

That is exactly how I feel roundtuit. I wish it would show the RED light even in standby mode. Sometimes I panic and have to turn the tivo on just to make sure its actually recording....


----------



## lessd

falcon26 said:


> That is exactly how I feel roundtuit. I wish it would show the RED light even in standby mode. Sometimes I panic and have to turn the tivo on just to make sure its actually recording....


Given that standby gains you nothing except about 2 watts less running power, why not leave the TiVo in normal mode, you will see the lights etc. I don't understand why people use standby except in a bedroom when they don't want the lights to turn on, I would like to know what other reason people use that mode.


----------



## orangeboy

lessd said:


> Given that standby gains you nothing except about 2 watts less running power, why not leave the TiVo in normal mode, you will see the lights etc. I don't understand why people use standby except in a bedroom when they don't want the lights to turn on, I would like to know what other reason people use that mode.


Depending on how you setup a Harmony Remote, there is an option to set the TiVo into Standby mode. I do this just out of habit, since it involves no additional key presses when ending a Harmony "Activity".


----------



## lessd

orangeboy said:


> Depending on how you setup a Harmony Remote, there is an option to set the TiVo into Standby mode. I do this just out of habit, since it involves no additional key presses when ending a Harmony "Activity".


I use the Harmony but i like the TiVo lights on so i know all is good when i walk by the TiVo.


----------



## wmcbrine

The Standby discrete code doesn't work in the HDUI, but it still does in the Classic UI. So that looks like a bug. Turning off the lights is intentional, I'm sure -- perhaps part of the Energy Star rating.

lessd, why _wouldn't_ you want to save 2 watts, if it was no extra effort to do so (as it's not with the discrete code)? But yeah, there's at least one other reason: it prevents recordings from being interrupted by the Emergency Alert System.


----------



## aaronwt

mikebaratta said:


> I am not sure if this is technically a bug, but I don't see why it would be on purpose -
> 
> Tivo search keeps your last search string entered when you return to search later.
> 
> - I don't see the use in doing this


I love the fact that it does this. Many times I will come back and want to enter the same search string.


----------



## lessd

wmcbrine said:


> The Standby discrete code doesn't work in the HDUI, but it still does in the Classic UI. So that looks like a bug. Turning off the lights is intentional, I'm sure -- perhaps part of the Energy Star rating.
> 
> lessd, why _wouldn't_ you want to save 2 watts, if it was no extra effort to do so (as it's not with the discrete code)? But yeah, there's at least one other reason: it prevents recordings from being interrupted by the Emergency Alert System.


You are correct about the 2 watts as it could save me about $0.25/month


----------



## rainwater

lessd said:


> Given that standby gains you nothing except about 2 watts less running power, why not leave the TiVo in normal mode, you will see the lights etc.


So EAS messages don't screw up your recordings is why. In some areas EAS messages can be quite intrusive.


----------



## RoundTuit

lessd said:


> You are correct about the 2 watts as it could save me about $0.25/month





rainwater said:


> So EAS messages don't screw up your recordings is why. In some areas EAS messages can be quite intrusive.


I have not measured the difference between standard and normal mode, but seeing as how my HT system is sucking on average $33/mo. as measured by Watts Up, $0.25/mo. is an insignificant savings. However, I still prefer to leave the TiVo in standby for the other reasons given. It just seems like the right thing to do.


----------



## yunlin12

This may be a new one regarding Amazon VOD to my Premiere XL.

One evening I started downloading Eureka season 1, 12 episodes. I initiated the download from Amazon web site on my PC. (BTW I had to do it one episode at a time which is a PITA.)

When I went to my Tivo to monitor the download progress (wired connection), it appears to be really slow, 6 hrs later the Tivo is still downloading the 1st episode. Then I went to bed, and woke up in the morning, and everything has been downloaded.

My suspicion is that Tivo is actually download all 12 episodes at normal speed, but somehow the progress monitor is stuck on the 1st episode.


----------



## aaronwt

yunlin12 said:


> This may be a new one regarding Amazon VOD to my Premiere XL.
> 
> One evening I started downloading Eureka season 1, 12 episodes. I initiated the download from Amazon web site on my PC. (BTW I had to do it one episode at a time which is a PITA.)
> 
> When I went to my Tivo to monitor the download progress (wired connection), it appears to be really slow, 6 hrs later the Tivo is still downloading the 1st episode. Then I went to bed, and woke up in the morning, and everything has been downloaded.
> 
> My suspicion is that Tivo is actually download all 12 episodes at normal speed, but somehow the progress monitor is stuck on the 1st episode.


My speeds from amazon downloads with the Premiere have been around 32mbs. Near the max speeds of my FiOS internet connection.


----------



## 1idjack

roundtuit: when a Tivo HD is in standby, no lights show on the front when recording or transferring, so I expect that when the Premiere exibits the same lack of lights while in standby, it is intentional.


----------



## RoundTuit

1idjack said:


> roundtuit: when a Tivo HD is in standby, no lights show on the front when recording or transferring, so I expect that when the Premiere exibits the same lack of lights while in standby, it is intentional.


Well, I have been playing around with this for a few hours now and have nailed a couple of things down. I won't bore you with the details, but I believe the TiVo Premiere works the same way as the TiVo S3 and TiVo HD with respect to putting the unit in standby when ending a Harmony remote activity. On the other hand, it is the case that if the TiVo Premiere is in standby, the red LED will not come on when a recording is in progress.

What took me so long to come to such a simple conclusion is that there is some quirk in the Harmony programming that makes the Premier behave differently from the S3, even when programmed identically. I have yet to figure that out. If interested, I will explain further in the Harmony thread.


----------



## MichaelJHuman

I used to be able to navigate pretty quickly. Now My Shows is really slow to load, and then to navigate.


----------



## bkdtv

MichaelJHuman said:


> I used to be able to navigate pretty quickly. Now My Shows is really slow to load, and then to navigate.


My Shows has always been slow to navigate. It just becomes more obvious once you've got more recorded programs, because there is no title caching beyond the first page. It has to "work" every time you scroll past the first page.


----------



## stiber

OK, I'm too lazy to read all four pages of this thread, so I'll just add my bugs and not worry if they are repeats:

* HD menus are almost unusably slow. For a 35&#37; full Premiere XL, this means more than 4 seconds to scroll down one screen in "My Shows". There's no rational reason for this, unless the UI has to talk to tivo.com to build the next UI screen (which would be an insane design). Even an old Linux box would be able to manage a far more complex 1280x1024 windowing system with no human detectable UI lag.

* Information about all shows should be locally cached, so that show details will appear without delay as one moves from one to the next. OK, this is just harping on the UI slowness. But it's driving me crazy.

* Boot time is SLOWER than my old Toshiba SD-H400. What is this thing doing? Again, it seems like it's booting over the net, rather than from a hard drive.

Well, that didn't make me feel any better; I thought venting would. Let's hope a update will do the trick shortly.


----------



## matguy

stiber said:


> OK, I'm too lazy to read all four pages of this thread, so I'll just add my bugs and not worry if they are repeats:
> 
> * HD menus are almost unusably slow. For a 35% full Premiere XL, this means more than 4 seconds to scroll down one screen in "My Shows". There's no rational reason for this, unless the UI has to talk to tivo.com to build the next UI screen (which would be an insane design). Even an old Linux box would be able to manage a far more complex 1280x1024 windowing system with no human detectable UI lag....


Umm, a Tivo basically is like a -very- old linux box. Remember, it's just a 400Mhz processor driving the system and UI. It's just the video decoding that's off-loaded to other chips, so just about everything else is piped through a little processor.

(disclaimer: I have not researched anything about the processor the Tivo uses, this is just my regular processor knowledge along with a comment by TivoPony about the dual core implementation in CPU the Tivo Premier uses not being all that great, or something like that.)

It might be "dual core", but not every implementation of "dual core" is the same. Processors have multiple little function units, such as a simple math unit (integer add, subtract, and multiply mostly) and more complex math units (divide, decimals), and schedulers, specialized math units, registers, etc. In big dual (or more) core processors (think Intel and AMD computer CPU's) you'll usually have multiples of most of the units; on smaller dual core implementations you might just have dual simple math units, but only one divide unit, which probably really helps if your code mostly moves "stuff" around, but is a little slower when it has to "figure" stuff out.

Remember, there's a lot of stuff going through that little processor all the time and sometimes the UI will be placed at a lower priority to other system functions; which would you rather have: a 2-4 second delay on the menus and good recordings, or quick UI but each time you press a button on the remote the current recording will premanently have a glitch saved? I don't think the Digital Tuner decoders/M-Card and/or MPEG chips have a direct DMA transfer to the SATA chipset, so all the data generated probably has to be moved by the processor. Do you notice it's any slower when recording a show or two?

And before it comes up, yes we had 400+Mhz processors in our computers 10+ years ago so it stands to reason that they could put a faster processor in it, but the power and cooling requirements go up with speed. So, to make a box that people don't complain too much about noise and power requirements (just do a quick search about people putting it in to stand-by to save a few extra watts and you'll see that people are concerned about it, oh, and fan noise) you pretty much have to reduce the processing speed.

I'm not saying that one shouldn't share their annoyance with slow menus and share their opinion on their annoyance and how they think it could be fixed, but I don't see how comparing it with a box that does -not- do the same thing helps. I mean, unless you had an old linux box with a 400Mhz processor that was capable of recording 2 HD video streams while displaying a seperate HD video stream all while having a snappy UI full of guide data?

Yeah, I didn't have one of those either.

Oh yeah, and only consumes 26 watts while doing all that.

Oh, and 1080i is still 1920x1080 for the UI (unless you think it should render 2 seperate 1920x540 fields and interlace them in the CPU rather than let the ouput hardware deal with interlacing it), not 1280x1024.


----------



## RojCowles

Kivo said:


> Every now and then, when I switch from LiveTV to the HD menus, the audio switches to a high-pitched scratchy sound. It makes people kind of sound like the heavy-smoking grandmother of the Chipmunks. Going to the menu and then back to LiveTV returns it to normal.
> 
> This has happened between 5 and 10 times in the last 24 hours.


Yeah, I've seen this a bit too. For my setup, Tivo Premiere - Classic UI, Zenith Z32LC6D (A re-badged LG TV I think), HDMI connection, it seems to occur most often if I switch from Video On Demand back to Now Playing but other times there's no (obvious) pattern. Oddly enough turning the TV off and then back on again fixes it every time though it does take a while longer than normal after the picture comes back on the TV for the sound to start up again. Not sure if this is a Tivo bug or a Zenith/LG bug.

Also occasionally the sound effects for 30 second skip forward and 8 seconds backwards go away too and then reappear some time later. Haven't figured out a pattern for this one.

--
Roj


----------



## TripFoeYa

I love TiVo and I have been a happy user for over 5 years now. I continue to monitor the status of the new Premiere units b/c I would love to upgrade at some point but reading all these posts it seems like you all are in a public beta. Being a person that loves technology and enjoys development of new and exciting products it's sad to see TiVo have all this time between Series 3 & 4 and this is what they have too offer. Maybe I'm a bit too harsh but I love my TiVo and I just want it to be great.


----------



## richsadams

I just got off of the phone with TiVo support (to change the month-to-month sub on our Series3 to an annual plan) and the CSR asked how I liked our new Premiere XL. I told her it had a lot of potential but that the HDUI was pretty slow and seemed to have some bugs. She said they were painfully aware of the issues and that she knew a service update was going to be sent out "soon". I was surprised that someone handling accounts knew about tech issues but I guess they talk amongst themselves.

So FWIW I'd expect some of what we're dealing with to be addressed pretty soon ("soon" being relative I suppose). I do like our PXL so I'm looking forward to it becoming less glitchy and certainly much snappier. Only time will tell I guess.


----------



## timstack8969

First Major Bug I got so far. Came home from work HIT TIVO button now stuck on TIVO Central and upper right say's "Press ZOOM" which I did and nothing happens using HD menu.


----------



## MichaelJHuman

timstack8969 said:


> First Major Bug I got so far. Came home from work HIT TIVO button now stuck on TIVO Central and upper right say's "Press ZOOM" which I did and nothing happens using HD menu.


This is the number 1 bug for me, and it's now locked up 3 times. I think it's still recording etc., but the UI is non responsive.

Hopefully, they will fix this bug soon ( I would call this a serious bug and I am sure they would too


----------



## sghrush

MichaelJHuman said:


> This is the number 1 bug for me, and it's now locked up 3 times. I think it's still recording etc., but the UI is non responsive.
> 
> Hopefully, they will fix this bug soon ( I would call this a serious bug and I am sure they would too


Yeah, this has happened to me thrice.


----------



## sghrush

TripFoeYa said:


> I love TiVo and I have been a happy user for over 5 years now. I continue to monitor the status of the new Premiere units b/c I would love to upgrade at some point but reading all these posts it seems like you all are in a public beta. Being a person that loves technology and enjoys development of new and exciting products it's sad to see TiVo have all this time between Series 3 & 4 and this is what they have too offer. Maybe I'm a bit too harsh but I love my TiVo and I just want it to be great.


I started laughing when I saw your post. You are so right! We truly are in a public beta here!


----------



## TrueTurbo

TripFoeYa said:


> Maybe I'm a bit too harsh but I love my TiVo and I just want it to be great.


Patience, patience... it will be... in the end!


----------



## SoBayJake

MichaelJHuman said:


> This is the number 1 bug for me, and it's now locked up 3 times. I think it's still recording etc., but the UI is non responsive.
> 
> Hopefully, they will fix this bug soon ( I would call this a serious bug and I am sure they would too


Mine hasn't had this issue for a few days. I get home, read the new posts, turn on the TV, hit the TiVo button and WHAM...there is it. How's that for timing?

I won't reboot until 11, since 2 shows are recording right now, and I think I read that they'll continue to record, but we'll see.


----------



## SoBayJake

SoBayJake said:


> Mine hasn't had this issue for a few days. I get home, read the new posts, turn on the TV, hit the TiVo button and WHAM...there is it. How's that for timing?
> 
> I won't reboot until 11, since 2 shows are recording right now, and I think I read that they'll continue to record, but we'll see.


I waited until 11. The video window went back to a moving image with sound, the "Press zoom" disappeared, but no response from the remote. Yanked the plug!


----------



## richsadams

timstack8969 said:


> First Major Bug I got so far. Came home from work HIT TIVO button now stuck on TIVO Central and upper right say's "Press ZOOM" which I did and nothing happens using HD menu.


Weird. That happened to me tonight, but only momentarily. Went to TiVo Central and "Press Zoom" showed up in the upper RH corner over the video window for a few seconds and then disappeared and things went back to normal. Weird.


----------



## theoryzero

I had two lockups when pressing the TiVo button (and seeing the message about pressing Zoom) with no response to the remote. However, the last lockup was 8 days ago. I haven't had any lockups since disabling the video window that shows up in the HD GUI.

So, still using the HD GUI, with live video window disabled, has seemingly fixed the lockup issue for me.


----------



## timstack8969

Any software update coming soon?


----------



## richsadams

timstack8969 said:


> Any software update coming soon?


This tweet from TiVo a couple of days ago indicates that something is in the works:


__ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/12059730279


----------



## DaveWhittle

richsadams said:


> This tweet from TiVo a couple of days ago indicates that something is in the works:
> 
> 
> __ https://twitter.com/i/web/status/12059730279


"Updates r coming of the next weeks..."


----------



## richsadams

DaveWhittle said:


> "Updates r coming of the next weeks..."


Bad syntax...bad spelling? Dunno. Tweets amaze me sometimes.  I scanned through the posts and it appears to be a response to several Premiere owner HDUI complaints. No idea if it's legit or not. One can only hope.

BTW, per my earlier post a TiVo CSR confirmed an update is pending "soon"...FWIW.


----------



## DaveWhittle

(re-post from the lock-up poll thread)

FYI: I received the following tweet from TiVo's Margret Schmidt, bolding mine:

"I'm sorry you are experiencing lockups. We are hoping to have a fix out by the *end of this week*. (Until then you can run SD UI.)"


----------



## richsadams

DaveWhittle said:


> (re-post from the lock-up poll thread)
> 
> FYI: I received the following tweet from TiVo's Margret Schmidt, bolding mine:
> 
> "I'm sorry you are experiencing lockups. We are hoping to have a fix out by the *end of this week*. (Until then you can run SD UI.)"


Thanks for that. :up:


----------



## weatherlover1

I don't know if this is a bug with the software or my cable card. But right now I can't record a HD program and watch one at the same time. It will freeze for a few seconds and then reboot. It has done this at least a hand full of times in the last week. We try to make sure nothing records while we are watching a recorded HD program but last night a suggestion must have recorded and it froze up and rebooted. Its very annoying. Anyone else had this problem? I have a Charter M-card if it matters. I hope the update fixes a lot of the issues when it comes out.


----------



## MichaelJHuman

Performance updates? Fix the UI lock up bug first, IMO!

I have sympathy for hard to find bugs though. I am working on one right now, that's driving me crazy. Nonetheless, I vote for the lock up as priority #1. #2 peformance. #3 fix Aspect ratio button so I can use it while playing Netflix. #4, play audio after the TV is powered off. The Series 3 could do that (after I installed the Gefen HDMI detective though, I think.)


----------



## richsadams

weatherlover1 said:


> I don't know if this is a bug with the software or my cable card. But right now I can't record a HD program and watch one at the same time. It will freeze for a few seconds and then reboot. It has done this at least a hand full of times in the last week. We try to make sure nothing records while we are watching a recorded HD program but last night a suggestion must have recorded and it froze up and rebooted. Its very annoying. Anyone else had this problem? I have a Charter M-card if it matters. I hope the update fixes a lot of the issues when it comes out.


It's possible that it's a signal issue but based on your description it has all of the earmarks of a hard drive problem (possibly I/O error correction failure). You should give TiVo a call. They'll walk you through some "tests". They can also check your logs to get a better picture of what's going on. Hard drive failures happen and if it's going to it will usually show up fairly early on. If that's the case TiVo will replace your unit for free. Best of luck!


----------



## weatherlover1

richsadams said:


> It's possible that it's a signal issue but based on your description it has all of the earmarks of a hard drive problem (possibly I/O error correction failure). You should give TiVo a call. They'll walk you through some "tests". They can also check your logs to get a better picture of what's going on. Hard drive failures happen and if it's going to it will usually show up fairly early on. If that's the case TiVo will replace your unit for free. Best of luck!


Hmm... I guess I was hoping it was not that since its only happening with HD and not SD recordings. I really hope its not but I guess I will have to call and see what they say. Thanks.


----------



## sghrush

MichaelJHuman said:


> I vote for the lock up as priority #1. #2 peformance. #3 fix Aspect ratio button so I can use it while playing Netflix. #4, play audio after the TV is powered off.


#5, fix the HDMI handshake issue that deselects several of the video output options when one tries to go completely "native" with the Premiere.


----------



## richsadams

weatherlover1 said:


> Hmm... I guess I was hoping it was not that since its only happening with HD and not SD recordings. I really hope its not but I guess I will have to call and see what they say. Thanks.


The fact that problems only arise when HD is involved would be an even stronger indication that it's a hard drive problem. HD data throughput is much higher and puts a much greater demand on all of the components, particularly the hard drive, than SD. Were it a cable card problem the issues should occur across the board. Unfortunate, but these things happen. Again, it might be something else, but everything you've experienced are classic HDD problems with any TiVo. Let us know how things turn out.


----------



## [email protected]

TiVo locked up after switching to classic menus.

Symptoms, watching a recorded program, when TiVo stopped responding to the remote. No amber light acknowledging remote button press. after maybe a half minute the picture froze as well. Able to ping the TiVo on the LAN, but no response to http: request.

what I was doing before: Just rebooted after HD menu hang. Changed the menu style to SD and just started watching "Human Target" (maybe 5 seconds in when I tried to pause)


----------



## meowth

I have found a way to avoid the lockup when using the tivo button on the remote in the hd interface. What I do instead of pressing the tivo button on live tv is press the left side of the directional pad. This will take me back to whatever menus I was on before it went to live tv (for me its usually the todo list screen). Takes a few extra presses to get to tivo central that way but I have not had it freeze once since I stopped using the tivo button and instead am using the left direction arrow backing out of menus and stuff. Hopefully this may help some people until tivo fixes this.

In fact just had it freeze again this afternoon cause I forgot and pressed the tivo button out of habit. grr.


----------



## mdopps

Try thumbs down, thumbs up, play, play next time you have a UI lockup in the HDUI. Try thumbs down, thumbs up, pause, pause when you have a UI lockup in the SDUI.


----------



## fishercl

On several occasions my Premiere has just "gone off the channel" for a few seconds and then come back. It looks exactly like when you change the channel - the box comes up, but no channel number shows, and no picture. Then it flips back to the actual channel - and of course I lose whatever had been buffered. I have tried rebooting a couple of times.

Weird.


----------



## andrewl570

When I pause tv and let the time run a little so i have like 20 minutes in front of me... if i hit the tivo button to go to tivo central in the HD interface the sound stops on the tv window. The sound comes back after a few moments. But if i go back to watching my show the sound again will cut out. I am running software 14.1c...


----------



## jfh3

mdopps said:


> Try thumbs down, thumbs up, play, play next time you have a UI lockup in the HDUI. Try thumbs down, thumbs up, pause, pause when you have a UI lockup in the SDUI.


Has anyone else successfully used these codes? I haven't been able to get either to work.


----------



## jfh3

You should have received / be receiving the latest update. 

SW version: 14.1c-01-03-746
HD Menu Ver: 1-0/2010.04.15-1743


----------



## LordNelson

v 14.1c-01-3-748

I've noticed three bugs that required an IPL... I have not been diligent about trying to reproduce them because, well, I want to watch TV, not wait for tivo to restart again.

The first happened when I went into Rhapsody. I tried a few stations, got no audio. Went back to a recorded program... guess what... no audio. Nothing I could do seemed to recover the audio. So I yanked the plug.

The second happened as I was navigating the HDUI. Suddenly the screen went blank. I could tell from the blonks and bleeps that I was still navigating the menus, but no video. That's when I yanked the plug.

The third happened just a few minutes ago. I hit the "aspect" button on my television and the "video window" the tivo was replaced with a box that said "press WIDE." Pressing WIDE on the Tivo had no effect, and the box appeared to be frozen at that point. And I yanked the plug.


----------



## orangeboy

LordNelson said:


> ...that required an IPL...


I like you already! Sysprog?


----------



## jfh3

IPL - looks like I'm not the only person here with a mainframe background.

If someone says "What's a mainframe?", I'll feel really old ...


----------



## LordNelson

Old habits die hard. You should have seen the looks I got when I announced I was adding DASD to my Tivo.

And no, no programming background. Just been in IT way too long.


----------



## RoundTuit

This is probably not a bug, and maybe it is not even new to the UI, but it sure got me tripped up for a second or two....

I wanted to create a season pass for Deadliest Catch, so I went into Search and typed in a partial search string. Selected "Deadliest Catch" and the default channel, WNUV 14 (I didn't even know they showed this series), was not what I was looking for, so I selected "Upcoming" and then scrolled to 620 Discovery Channel. I selected this showing and the page that was presented was something I had not seen before, and listed the channel number as 14, not 620. I bailed out by going to LiveTV, but TiVo hung and I had to force a restart (the hang is not what I am complaining about here, but is certainly a bug nonetheless).

I came back to this later and played with it a bit and discovered the following. If I use the "Select" button to chose the channel I want from the Upcoming list (620 Discovery), the channel actually displayed on the next page will be the first channel in the Upcoming list (for me, WNUV 14). However, if I use "DirectionRight" to select the desired Upcoming list entry, the channel number displayed on the next page will be the one I want.

What I also noticed is that when "Select" is used, the default channel number on the next page can be changed by using "DirectionRight", whereas when "DirectionRight" is used to go to this page, you have no opportunity to change the channel, but at least it is the one you wanted.

I guess this is working as designed, but it can be a little confusing the first time you see it if you happen to use the Select button as I did. Or, maybe I am just a dufus.


----------



## DrKnightArcher

Update 14.c

Browsing in HDUI, Animated Movies, Found Shrek to record for the kids.
When I selected the movie and item to record, the date was missing a digit in the "recording scheduled" confirmation screen.

Shrek is scheduled for 4/22, however, the "recording scheduled" shows 4/2 as the time that things will record. I do not yet know if this is to affect the actual recordings of shows but I think its just a display bug rather than a scheduling bug.


----------



## schwinn

nyctwc said:


> I have a pretty major bug with my Premiere XL. I transferred all of my shows from my Series 3 to the Premiere. If I go to My Shows and I turn Groups off, about a month's worth of shows (12/19 to 1/17) disappear from the list. If I turn Groups on, they reappear in their proper folders. Is anyone else having this problem?


Seeing a similar issue here. The Tivo Premiere Tours and Suggestions disappear from the My Shows list when groups are off for me...


----------



## b_scott

anything good come out of the "C" update? I got it over the weekend when I was out of town. Switched to the HDUI and couldn't tell if it seemed faster.


----------



## orangeboy

b_scott said:


> anything good come out of the "C" update? I got it over the weekend when I was out of town. Switched to the HDUI and couldn't tell if it seemed faster.


I believe the focus of 14.1c was bug fix, and not so much performance.


----------



## ldobson

b_scott said:


> anything good come out of the "C" update? I got it over the weekend when I was out of town. Switched to the HDUI and couldn't tell if it seemed faster.


Yeah the HDUI Definately feels a little faster, and the good thing.. no freeze as yet!


----------



## caddyroger

My bug is when you delete a show you have to hit delete twice to remove it the now showing list.


----------



## richsadams

caddyroger said:


> My bug is when you delete a show 2 have to delete twice to remove it the now showing list.


Ditto here...but not always. In my case when a recording has finished playing, "Keep show" or "Delete" options come up and I click on "Delete". Subsequently I'm returned to the initial page (Play, More Options, Delete, etc.) and I have to click on "Delete" again.


----------



## SoBayJake

I haven't been able to delete a show if it's showing in the video window. Hitting "delete" just refreshes the screen.


----------



## TrueTurbo

richsadams said:


> Ditto here...but not always. In my case when a recording has finished playing, "Keep show" or "Delete" options come up and I click on "Delete". Subsequently I'm returned to the initial page (Play, More Options, Delete, etc.) and I have to click on "Delete" again.


You don't have to click on 'delete' again. If you just 'left arrow' back to your 'My Shows' list, the recording will go away. 

Yeah, this is one bug that is annoying, but I discovered a way to get around it. In 'My Shows', instead of selecting a recording and then selecting 'play', just hit the 'play' button right from the 'My Shows' list. I found that when you get to the end of the recording and select 'delete', the intermediate screen doesn't appear. You just go straight back to the 'My Shows' list.


----------



## i2k

nice work around!


----------



## cranbers

It just occurred to me, one thing that just made me burst out laughing: This forum sounds like a BETA testing forum. Finding bugs, waiting for fixes. We even have the VP from tivo chiming in. Wow....

If you think about it, that has got to be EMBARRASSING for a released product, not beta, RTM bought and paid for, with a monthly fee to boot. We are not the Beta tester pool here. Tivo has got it good, free beta testing, and were paying to do it! woo.

This is absolutely a public beta test. I am just amazed, wow.


----------



## ldobson

cranbers said:


> It just occurred to me, one thing that just made me burst out laughing: This forum sounds like a BETA testing forum. Finding bugs, waiting for fixes. We even have the VP from tivo chiming in. Wow....
> 
> If you think about it, that has got to be EMBARRASSING for a released product, not beta, RTM bought and paid for, with a monthly fee to boot. We are not the Beta tester pool here. Tivo has got it good, free beta testing, and were paying to do it! woo.
> 
> This is absolutely a public beta test. I am just amazed, wow.


They did give us all $10 of FREE VOD though


----------



## DaveWhittle

ldobson said:


> They did give us all $10 of FREE VOD though


Wait, what?


----------



## SoBayJake

DaveWhittle said:


> Wait, what?


Part 3 of the "TiVo Premiere Welcome Series" emails contained a $10 Amazon VOD credit coupon. Applies to purchases from TiVo.com, Best Buy, Amazon (and perhaps others, but I haven't seen confirmation or otherwise).


----------



## DaveWhittle

Awesome! I totally didn't read that email.

Thanks guys! :up:


----------



## ldobson

DaveWhittle said:


> Awesome! I totally didn't read that email.
> 
> Thanks guys! :up:


LOL, I nearly deleted it myself! Enjoy!


----------



## sghrush

cranbers said:


> It just occurred to me, one thing that just made me burst out laughing: This forum sounds like a BETA testing forum. Finding bugs, waiting for fixes. We even have the VP from tivo chiming in. Wow....
> 
> If you think about it, that has got to be EMBARRASSING for a released product, not beta, RTM bought and paid for, with a monthly fee to boot. We are not the Beta tester pool here. Tivo has got it good, free beta testing, and were paying to do it! woo.
> 
> This is absolutely a public beta test. I am just amazed, wow.


I could not agree with you more! I'm laughing at just reading your post because it rings so true. The Premiere is still in beta and here we are involved in a public beta.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

sghrush said:


> I could not agree with you more! I'm laughing at just reading your post because it rings so true. The Premiere is still in beta and here we are involved in a public beta.


With the 14c software, it appears that you're now in "beta test". Until last week you were in "alpha test".

Does this seem familiar? Here's a choice quote: _Alpha software can be unstable and could cause crashes or data loss._

I know it's true because I read it on Wikipedia!


----------



## richsadams

TrueTurbo said:


> You don't have to click on 'delete' again. If you just 'left arrow' back to your 'My Shows' list, the recording will go away.
> 
> Yeah, this is one bug that is annoying, but I discovered a way to get around it. In 'My Shows', instead of selecting a recording and then selecting 'play', just hit the 'play' button right from the 'My Shows' list. I found that when you get to the end of the recording and select 'delete', the intermediate screen doesn't appear. You just go straight back to the 'My Shows' list.


Ah, that's interesting...and may explain why it wasn't happening to me all of the time. IIRC selecting "Play" instead of selecting the recording and then clicking on "Play" will immediately start playback. So sometimes I do that, sometimes not. Going forward I'll try to remember to just hit play (unless I want to go to the recording's info screen for some reason). Thanks for that. :up: (Returning to the recording's info screen after deleting it when it's done playing is still a bug to me, but at least that's a good work-around.)

BTW, since the update to 14.1c the "My Shows" menus do seem to be a bit snappier...still not as fast as SD, but certainly much faster than they were.


----------



## cranbers

ldobson said:


> They did give us all $10 of FREE VOD though


Actually if you bought it from amazon you got a 50 dollar vod voucher. I got to use 15 of it on one movie because it wouldn't download properly to the tivo, lmao. The great thing about amazon on demand on the tivo? YOU CANNOT redownload a movie to it, doesn't matter if you watched it or not. If it's hosed, you're sol. I don't think ill be risking my own money on it. Not when there is a red box down the street, or netflix, and eh, other ways to get a movie.

It was that movie bad lieutenant. Yeah, I was pissed. Horrible flick by the way, if you're a druggie, I have a feeling you wanted to go find a dealer after that one. They could of cut an hour out of it and it still would of been too long.


----------



## cranbers

Yeah well when I bought this product I don't remember signing or agreeing to anything say this is beta software and I accept any risk that comes with using beta software.

Typical beta agreement includes:

This is Beta test software, and as such, WILL CONTAIN BUGS AND
MAY CAUSE DATA LOSS.

Haha, typical user may not like that one. But hey, its getting better right?

Tivo did fully acknowledge it's not ready for prime time but they wanted to get the hardware out there. If all else fails, use the long in the tooth sd menu.

I especially like this break down for beta test on taht wiki site post:

Beta

"Beta" is the software development phase following alpha, named after the Greek letter beta. It generally begins when the software is feature complete. The focus of beta testing is reducing impacts to users, often incorporating usability testing. The process of delivering a beta version to the users is called beta release.

The users of a beta version are called beta testers. *They are usually customers or prospective customers of the organization that develops the software, willing to test the software for free or for a reduced price.*

Beta version software is likely to be useful for internal demonstrations and previews to select customers. Some developers refer to this stage as a preview, a prototype, a technical preview (TP) or as an early access.
[edit] Open and closed beta

I especially like the quote that says "free or reduced price" haha. too funny.


----------



## clemm

Owned it for 24 hours and sent it back. The update did NOT solve the freezing problem. Happened 3 times in 4 hours. Anyone researching to purchase be warned that the new Premiere is not ready for market. IMHO


----------



## cranbers

clemm said:


> Owned it for 24 hours and sent it back. The update did NOT solve the freezing problem. Happened 3 times in 4 hours. Anyone researching to purchase be warned that the new Premiere is not ready for market. IMHO


This dude is on the war path. Tivo messed with the wrong dude. And this is AFTER you sent it back.

Wowa,


----------



## richsadams

cranbers said:


> Yeah well when I bought this product I don't remember signing or agreeing to anything say this is beta software and I accept any risk that comes with using beta software.<snip>


Sorry to hear you're having so many issues. The unit is obviously not living up to your expectations. Ranting about it here will get you zero return. Why not just take advantage of the 30 day free return and be done with it?


----------



## ldobson

richsadams said:


> Sorry to hear you're having so many issues. The unit is obviously not living up to your expectations. Ranting about it here will get you zero return. Why not just take advantage of the 30 day free return and be done with it?


Think he did, but its still keeping him awake at night.


----------



## SoBayJake

cranbers said:


> Actually if you bought it from amazon you got a 50 dollar vod voucher. I got to use 15 of it on one movie because it wouldn't download properly to the tivo, lmao. The great thing about amazon on demand on the tivo? YOU CANNOT redownload a movie to it, doesn't matter if you watched it or not. If it's hosed, you're sol. I don't think ill be risking my own money on it. Not when there is a red box down the street, or netflix, and eh, other ways to get a movie.
> 
> It was that movie bad lieutenant. Yeah, I was pissed. Horrible flick by the way, if you're a druggie, I have a feeling you wanted to go find a dealer after that one. They could of cut an hour out of it and it still would of been too long.


Did you rent or purchase directly from the TiVo/ I've only ever "purchased" the free Amazon VODs via the website, and then directed the website to download to my TiVo. Then when I delete from the TiVo, eventually Amazon.com gets notified, and I can redownload. But again, that's purchased items, not rented.

Amazon.com customer service is usually pretty good, did you contact them?


----------



## jkudlacz

I got to say I am very happy with the latest update. Things are working well, looking forward to future updates. Very happy over here.


----------



## jfh3

Let's keep this thread on topic - bug reports only, please.


----------



## dmb4040

14.1c has fixed my HD menu/Tivo button freezes which I previously had once per day. 

That being said, last night I was watching YouTube on my tivo, and I was watching a clip and hit the left button to go back to the "search" menu from the actual youtube video (which was working fine for the previous 5 movies I watched). The screen went black for about 5 seconds, and then I got the "Tivo" start up screen. Had to go through the normal 10-15 minute Tivo boot. This is the first time that the Premiere has just restarted on its own. Never happened with YouTube previously (of which I watched a lot of)


----------



## richsadams

As mentioned, the "My Shows" menus do seem to switch faster w/v14.1c (I only experienced the "Zoom" freeze once prior to the latest update). However, and maybe I'm just now noticing it, but when I select a recording to watch by clicking "Play" either from the "My Shows" menu or the recording's own menu page, TiVo seems to take longer to switch to the recording than before. The menu page disappears, it goes to a gray screen and then starts playing the recording. All-in-all it takes about two to three seconds to start playing the recording from the time I hit "Play". I've tried various resolutions as well and no change. Is it my imagination or is that longer than before? Is it possible that one thing sped up but another slowed down?  Anyone else experiencing the same thing?


----------



## ldobson

richsadams said:


> As mentioned, the "My Shows" menus do seem to switch faster w/v14.1c (I only experienced the "Zoom" freeze once prior to the latest update). However, and maybe I'm just now noticing it, but when I select a recording to watch by clicking "Play" either from the "My Shows" menu or the recording's own menu page, TiVo seems to take longer to switch to the recording than before. The menu page disappears, it goes to a gray screen and then starts playing the recording. All-in-all it takes about two to three seconds to start playing the recording from the time I hit "Play". I've tried various resolutions as well and no change. Is it my imagination or is that longer than before? Is it possible that one thing sped up but another slowed down?  Anyone else experiencing the same thing?


Yes there is a long *pause* between pressing play in the HDUI and the time the recording starts playing, during this time it will display a grey or black screen depending on your settings.

Also, once a recording has finished playing there is another blank screen, and another pause until the Tivo HDUI is re-drawn

I imagine everyone is experiencing this.


----------



## b_scott

yup


----------



## b_scott

my recently deleted folder is sorting them in some weird way. On my HD's, it was always by date recorded, newest first. But now it's some weird hybrid of title plus when it was deleted. Anyone else?


----------



## Monty2_2001

Wonder if that 2nd core will help with that at least. Certainly seems like a processing lag. The black screens that is.


----------



## richsadams

ldobson said:


> Yes there is a long *pause* between pressing play in the HDUI and the time the recording starts playing, during this time it will display a grey or black screen depending on your settings.
> 
> Also, once a recording has finished playing there is another blank screen, and another pause until the Tivo HDUI is re-drawn
> 
> I imagine everyone is experiencing this.


Glad to hear I'm not the only one. :up: (Sort of). That's just really annoying though. :down: The HDUI is really nice and has potential, but the price we're having to pay for "enjoying" it (at least right now) is pretty high IMHO. Between the delays and having to switch back and forth between HD and SD UI's to make some changes, searches, etc. it's just kludgy and not at all what I had expected based on TiVo's pre-release publicity.

If you ask almost anyone here they'll tell you that I'm as close to a TiVo Fanboy as they come (every company has a few warts), but the Premiere is a disappointment to date. Hopefully updates that are rumored to come and/or activating the second core will address these and other issues.


----------



## ldobson

richsadams said:


> Glad to hear I'm not the only one. :up: (Sort of). That's just really annoying though. :down: The HDUI is really nice and has potential, but the price we're having to pay for "enjoying" it (at least right now) is pretty high IMHO. Between the delays and having to switch back and forth between HD and SD UI's to make some changes, searches, etc. it's just kludgy and not at all what I had expected based on TiVo's pre-release publicity.
> 
> If you ask almost anyone here they'll tell you that I'm as close to a TiVo Fanboy as they come (every company has a few warts), but the Premiere is a disappointment to date. Hopefully updates that are rumored to come and/or activating the second core will address these and other issues.


Perhaps TiVo are giving us some time in between screens to dream up what we would like to see.. Hope it gets fixed though, as often I have to really concentrate on the screen to make the Tivo screen redraw


----------



## richsadams

b_scott said:


> my recently deleted folder is sorting them in some weird way. On my HD's, it was always by date recorded, newest first. But now it's some weird hybrid of title plus when it was deleted. Anyone else?


Same here. Ours appear to be sorted by the date we deleted the recording.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

b_scott said:


> my recently deleted folder is sorting them in some weird way. On my HD's, it was always by date recorded, newest first. But now it's some weird hybrid of title plus when it was deleted. Anyone else?


I haven't paid careful attention, but I noticed a similar change in the TiVo HD. Maybe they improved the algorithm?

The old behavior was really really stupid, because you could delete a show in the GUI and have it removed from the deleted folder just a few seconds later.


----------



## richsadams

Phantom Gremlin said:


> The old behavior was really really stupid, because you could delete a show in the GUI and have it removed from the deleted folder just a few seconds later.


I forgot about that...that used to really tick me off when I made the mistake of deleting something and then try to recover it only to find that it had disappeared completely.  Glad to hear that it might be "better" now. Although to be fair I remember when there wasn't a "Recently Deleted" folder at all...so I guess I shouldn't complain too loudly.


----------



## TrueTurbo

ldobson said:


> Yes there is a long *pause* between pressing play in the HDUI and the time the recording starts playing, during this time it will display a grey or black screen depending on your settings.
> 
> Also, once a recording has finished playing there is another blank screen, and another pause until the Tivo HDUI is re-drawn
> 
> I imagine everyone is experiencing this.


'long' must be a relative term or my Premiere is behaving differently. I do see a black screen between pressing play and a show actually starting, but it's for barely 1 sec! To me, that's pretty instantaneous. I can handle a 1 sec delay. 

I also haven't noticed any difference in behavior before and after the 14.1c update. I didn't suffer any lock-ups before the update and still haven't since. I don't see any noticeable speed difference in the HD UI before and after, but then again, I thought the HD UI menus were OK before the update! I still get the occasional 'slow down', but again, I really don't see any difference before and after.

Before anyone ask, yes, I am absolutely and positively sure I have the 14.1c update! I check the Systems Info screen often to see if anything has changed.


----------



## richsadams

TrueTurbo said:


> 'long' must be a relative term <snip>


I think that's very true. I'm not timing the change, but I think ours takes a little more than one second. Having grown used to the "immediate" playback on our Series3 I'm sure I'm being a little impatient. Still...I'd like it to act as quickly as the SD menus but maybe I'm being unrealistic.


----------



## crxssi

richsadams said:


> I think that's very true. I'm not timing the change, but I think ours takes a little more than one second. Having grown used to the "immediate" playback on our Series3 I'm sure I'm being a little impatient. Still...I'd like it to act as quickly as the SD menus but maybe I'm being unrealistic.


Everything is life is "relative". But for those moving from S3/HD to S4, ANY kind of regression is not welcome and will likely be noticed.


----------



## msiemsen

- Long show names show up as "..." in My Show list.

Shows downloaded on my PC and transferred to my Premiere using Tivo Desktop Plus 2.8 tend to have long file names; for example:

This.is.a.really.really.really.really.really.long.show-name.avi

This displays as just "..." in My Shows list. If you press Select on the "..." show, the next screen shows "..." as the show title below the Discovery Bar. If you then press Info the next window displays (most of) the real show name. I try to rename them before copying them.

- Shows disappear from the My Show list, only to reappear later

I had two recordings of Law & Order: SVU last Wednesday. I saw them in the My Shows list while I was watching other shows. At some point, the two episodes disappeared from the list. Going back to Tivo Central and then forward to My Shows; they didn't show up. Going forward to a show info screen and going back to My Shows; they didn't show up.

At some point of normal use the two SVU's reappeared in the list. I watched them just fine.

I think these two are related, as when I remove the "..." shows, the My Shows list seems to be more stable.

I use sort(name), groups(off) in My Shows list, if it matters.

[edit: I thought the first was fixed in latest update. It is not]


----------



## TrueTurbo

richsadams said:


> I think that's very true. I'm not timing the change, but I think ours takes a little more than one second. Having grown used to the "immediate" playback on our Series3 I'm sure I'm being a little impatient. Still...I'd like it to act as quickly as the SD menus but maybe I'm being unrealistic.


I'm assuming the S3 is very different to the HD. I kept my TiVo HD when I bought the Premiere XL. Tonight, I switched over to the HD to remind myself what it's like hitting 'Play' on a recording in the 'Now Playing' list. The response is pretty much identical to the Premiere XL.

On the HD, you still see a black screen for around 1 sec before the recording starts to play. I switched back to the Premiere XL and there's no real difference. I do think it may be a fraction bit longer on the XL, but I do mean 'a fraction'. Personally, I really don't notice any difference, or at least I didn't until this topic came up.


----------



## richsadams

TrueTurbo said:


> I'm assuming the S3 is very different to the HD. I kept my TiVo HD when I bought the Premiere XL. Tonight, I switched over to the HD to remind myself what it's like hitting 'Play' on a recording in the 'Now Playing' list. The response is pretty much identical to the Premiere XL.
> 
> On the HD, you still see a black screen for around 1 sec before the recording starts to play. I switched back to the Premiere XL and there's no real difference. I do think it may be a fraction bit longer on the XL, but I do mean 'a fraction'. Personally, I really don't notice any difference, or at least I didn't until this topic came up.


I sold our TiVo HD when I purchased the Premiere XL. IIRC the THD might have taken a moment longer for playback to start than the Series3, but they were pretty much on par.

Last night I ended up switching the Premiere from the HDUI to the SDUI and playback is almost instantaneous now...as quick as the Series3 in any case. Menus are lightning fast as well (at least by comparison). So if you wanted to experiment between the two you'd get a feel for the difference.

Again, I like the look and conveniences of the new HDUI, but it's not ready for prime time IMHO. More over, my wife was becoming more irritated with it than I was and if momma ain't happy, ain't nobody happy. 

I also really like the MRV and computer transfer speeds of the Premiere and once they get the HDUI/responsiveness issues ironed out I'm sure I'll be pleased with my "upgrade" overall.


----------



## SCSIRAID

LordNelson said:


> Old habits die hard. You should have seen the looks I got when I announced I was adding DASD to my Tivo.
> 
> And no, no programming background. Just been in IT way too long.


I think you should go for a drum.


----------



## rocko

SCSIRAID said:


> I think you should go for a drum.


Or a card sorter.

Excuse me, I have to go IPL my computer now.


----------



## rocko

It's funny, I can almost see the code spinning.

I'm guessing that, for now, the HDUI is nothing more than a "front end" for the SD stuff. Punching "Play" from My Shows is sending junk to the SD menu system which is still in control. It then starts playing the recording. Same for when you delete something.

Once they get over this transition, they'll branch the code and, , maintain 2 different menu systems. By that time, the HDUI will actually be doing the "talking" and things should be smoother and faster.

Again, I'm only guessing. It seem pretty obvious they patched this together to get it out the door. 

Call me crazy - you won't be the first


----------



## wmcbrine

rocko said:


> I'm guessing that, for now, the HDUI is nothing more than a "front end" for the SD stuff.


My impression is exactly the opposite. In many areas where I'd expect both UIs to have the same behavior due to shared code, they don't. While there's undoubtedly a common back end, there's a lot more in the front end than I expected. The example I gave earlier: fetching icons for HME apps -- not just the rendering part, but all the way down to the HTTP request part -- is clearly being done by different code in the different UIs, since it behaves differently.

I think the HDUI represents a really extensive rewrite and duplication of a lot of the old functionality. It probably would perform better and be more reliable if it _weren't_ such a big reimplementation. But that's not to say that it wasn't the right thing for the long term; just that it's at an awkward stage of early development right now.

BTW, for those not in the know, what does "IPL" mean?


----------



## SCSIRAID

wmcbrine said:


> My impression is exactly the opposite. In many areas where I'd expect both UIs to have the same behavior due to shared code, they don't. While there's undoubtedly a common back end, there's a lot more in the front end than I expected. The example I gave earlier: fetching icons for HME apps -- not just the rendering part, but all the way down to the HTTP request part -- is clearly being done by different code in the different UIs, since it behaves differently.
> 
> I think the HDUI represents a really extensive rewrite and duplication of a lot of the old functionality. It probably would perform better and be more reliable if it _weren't_ such a big reimplementation. But that's not to say that it wasn't the right thing for the long term; just that it's at an awkward stage of early development right now.
> 
> BTW, for those not in the know, what does "IPL" mean?


Initial Program Load - basically means boot. You set the ipl address knobs to the address of the device you want to boot from and press the button....

http://www-03.ibm.com/ibm/history/exhibits/mainframe/images/2423PH2065C.jpg

Bottom right hand corner


----------



## rocko

wmcbrine said:


> My impression is exactly the opposite. In many areas where I'd expect both UIs to have the same behavior due to shared code, they don't. While there's undoubtedly a common back end, there's a lot more in the front end than I expected. The example I gave earlier: fetching icons for HME apps -- not just the rendering part, but all the way down to the HTTP request part -- is clearly being done by different code in the different UIs, since it behaves differently.
> 
> I think the HDUI represents a really extensive rewrite and duplication of a lot of the old functionality. It probably would perform better and be more reliable if it _weren't_ such a big reimplementation. But that's not to say that it wasn't the right thing for the long term; just that it's at an awkward stage of early development right now.
> 
> BTW, for those not in the know, what does "IPL" mean?


I know the HDUI is doing tons - all on its own codebase. But on a base level it ends up handing it off to the old UI. Just my thought from observation.

Oh, and IPL - what SCSIRAID said. One never forgets that big blue button maked "Load".

Darn kids ... mumble mumble mumble ...


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

LordNelson said:


> Old habits die hard. You should have seen the looks I got when I announced I was adding DASD to my Tivo.





SCSIRAID said:


> I think you should go for a drum.





rocko said:


> Or a card sorter.
> 
> Excuse me, I have to go IPL my computer now.


OT, but I just can't resist. It was before my time, so it may not even be real, but you could always go tune your Williams tube.


----------



## Sidnicious

RoundTuit said:


> Second, if I put the Series 4 in standby via the Tivo Central sub-menu, the red LED indicator never comes on when a program is being recorded.


This++.

The green light means "I'm powered up and awake". It makes sense that it should go off in standby. Turning off the record lights does not make sense.


----------



## SoBayJake

Sidnicious said:


> This++.
> 
> The green light means "I'm powered up and awake". It makes sense that it should go off in standby. Turning off the record lights does not make sense.


Standby makes it appear OFF. All LEDs are turned off, and video output is disabled. The TiVo is always "powered up" so they only include standby for people that want to disable the front LEDs. Turning out video output, to me, is secondary, since you'd really just turn the TV off.


----------



## ellensw

I have had the Premiere for 3 days now. when I turn off the tv after watching an analog channel, after I turn it back on the video is in shades of pink and no sound. I have to reset the system or put it in standby for a few seconds to get the video and sound back to normal. Is this a hardware problem or will a future update fix it?


----------



## SCSIRAID

ellensw said:


> I have had the Premiere for 3 days now. when I turn off the tv after watching an analog channel, after I turn it back on the video is in shades of pink and no sound. I have to reset the system or put it in standby for a few seconds to get the video and sound back to normal. Is this a hardware problem or will a future update fix it?


Sounds like an HDMI issue. You might try pressing the 'replay' key to jump back 7 seconds or try changing channels when it happens.


----------



## ellensw

SCSIRAID said:


> Sounds like an HDMI issue. You might try pressing the 'replay' key to jump back 7 seconds or try changing channels when it happens.


I just tried those things. Pressing replay does not fix it, changing to another analog channel does not fix it, but changing to a digital channel did fix it. I haven't tried hooking it up with anything other than HDMI yet. 
I'm having Comcast out next week to try to fix the M-card connection - another headache I've had to deal with since I switched to Tivo. So in the meantime I'm trying to get this other bug fixed or try to do an exchange.


----------



## SCSIRAID

ellensw said:


> I just tried those things. Pressing replay does not fix it, changing to another analog channel does not fix it, but changing to a digital channel did fix it. I haven't tried hooking it up with anything other than HDMI yet.
> I'm having Comcast out next week to try to fix the M-card connection - another headache I've had to deal with since I switched to Tivo. So in the meantime I'm trying to get this other bug fixed or try to do an exchange.


I doubt that an exchange will change anything. I suggest you use a component connection which should solve the problem.


----------



## SoBayJake

SCSIRAID said:


> I doubt that an exchange will change anything. I suggest you use a component connection which should solve the problem.


Saying "switch to component" isn't a solutionIts a bandaid fix. You pay for an hdmi connection, you deserve one! Some av receivers will not switch component onto hdmi.

How is the TiVo connected to the tv? Via a receiver? Mine shows the pink screen I'd I disconnect/reconnect during boot, but the next time it changes resolution it fixes it.

Are you set to just 1080i or 720p? Try changing resolutions.


----------



## richsadams

SoBayJake said:


> Standby makes it appear OFF. All LEDs are turned off, and video output is disabled.


We ended up turning off all of the LED's. We liked the "old" LED lights...not so much the new "circles". When TiVo's recording two shows in a dark room the two red LED's look like evil eyes. Creepy.


----------



## Phantom Gremlin

SoBayJake said:


> The TiVo is always "powered up" so they only include standby for people that want to disable the front LEDs.


*That's not true.*

There are other reasons for standby. An important one is you won't get the channel forcibly changed when your cable system rebroadcasts an Emergency Alert System test message, which is a weekly occurrence for Comcast in my area.

Just because *you* can't think of any other reason for standby doesn't mean there isn't one. Because there is.


----------



## diamar

Here's a new -- and seemingly weird -- one.

So I've been trying to figure out why my Premiere XL was locking up when I tried to view my other TiVo's (S3) recorded shows for transfer.

I think that renaming the TiVo (which I did on the TiVo website using DVR preferences) somehow screws up MRV and Cablecards.

Symptoms are: 

Rename the Premiere on the TiVo.com website
Later on, scroll to the bottom of the My Shows list on the Premiere to view recordings on the S3. The screen locks up and the Premiere needs to be restarted. This can be repeated over and over again until the following step happens.
After a while, no live channels are being received. If I go to the Cable Card Decoder Menu and Test Channels, it tells me that I'm tuned to "Cable Channel 4041 DCT0416" when the actual channel should be 704. This looks to me like some Motorola model number (no cable boxes in my house, just Cablecards).
Eject the Cablecard, put it back in. No channels are received, but at least the goofy Channel message is gone.
Several hours later, the channels are all back again

It seems to be independent of the HD or SD menus. I think it's happened every time I've renamed it, but that could just be a coincidence. It's possible there's another trigger, but I don't want to try to figure it out anymore (given that it gives me about 12 hours of cable outage every time).

Not sure if it matters, but there's an ESATA drive attached to the Premiere.

Definitely some code in there that's not ready for prime time.


----------



## richsadams

diamar said:


> Here's a new -- and seemingly weird -- one.
> 
> So I've been trying to figure out why my Premiere XL was locking up when I tried to view my other TiVo's (S3) recorded shows for transfer.


Wow, that is odd.  How long are you waiting for the renaming to take effect? Whenever I've done that it can take up to a day or more for everything to update. When I changed our Premiere XL's name I think it took a good 24 hours or so.

When you've looked at your other TiVo's is the Premiere's name actually changed? Just curious as it may or may not have anything to do with the other issues. IIRC some folks have had to reboot both the changed box as well as their other TiVo(s) to get them all to update, and again, it took some time for the Mother Ship to actually update the name change. I can't imagine renaming the box could have anything to do with cable card activity, but you never know I guess. My WAG is that there is simply a cable card problem and it might be a coincidence or something you're doing may be triggering (or exacerbating) the issue.

BTW eSATA drives are famous for causing glitches of various sorts. Have a look here for some options that may or may not apply if things don't improve...

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=7553444#post7553444

Best of luck and let us know how it goes!


----------



## diamar

richsadams said:


> Wow, that is odd.  How long are you waiting for the renaming to take effect? Whenever I've done that it can take up to a day or more for everything to update. When I changed our Premiere XL's name I think it took a good 24 hours or so.
> 
> When you've looked at your other TiVo's is the Premiere's name actually changed? Just curious as it may or may not have anything to do with the other issues. IIRC some folks have had to reboot both the changed box as well as their other TiVo(s) to get them all to update, and again, it took some time for the Mother Ship to actually update the name change. I can't imagine renaming the box could have anything to do with cable card activity, but you never know I guess. My WAG is that there is simply a cable card problem and it might be a coincidence or something you're doing may be triggering (or exacerbating) the issue.
> 
> BTW eSATA drives are famous for causing glitches of various sorts. Have a look here for some options that may or may not apply if things don't improve...
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=7553444#post7553444
> 
> Best of luck and let us know how it goes!


The eSATA drive doesn't seem to be misbehaving. I haven't had any storage-related problems.

The delay between renaming and the strange problems is on the order of an hour or two. I didn't check to see if the renaming had come through.

I tend to think it's renaming because it also happened to my S3 when I renamed it (though the symptoms were slightly different). For the S3, all the channels disappeared after the renaming but when I re-ran guided setup, they came back. Now it's entirely possible that I could have ejected the CableCards and seen the same problems I had with the Premiere.

And it might be a networking-related problem with MRV that comes about from the renaming.

All my channels are back this morning, and I'm never renaming anything again.


----------



## richsadams

diamar said:


> The eSATA drive doesn't seem to be misbehaving. I haven't had any storage-related problems.


 If there are issues they wouldn't necessarily be storage related...they tend to manifest themselves as other problems like reboots, macroblocking, slow menus, etc.



diamar said:


> And it might be a networking-related problem with MRV that comes about from the renaming.


I think that's probably the case.



diamar said:


> All my channels are back this morning, and I'm never renaming anything again.


Excellent. Enjoy!


----------



## kingkong316

I have also experienced the issue where deleting a show it takes me back and gives me the option to play it. I have experienced hitting the tivo button takes me back to my shows instead of giving me the option to delete (I was at 59 mins of a 60 min recording) then right after that while navigating the my shows screen (hd menus) it decides to reboot. 

I certainly hope they have some external testers, I know if there are they can't even admit it, that are experienced with tivo and with testing. Seems there's a lot people are reporting here.


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## richsadams

Last week when I found the HDUI to still be too slow and it was irritating the wife (even after the v14.1c update) on our Premiere XL I switched to the SDUI. Tonight I decided to switch back just to see how it was working. Not much had changed. Although a bit snappier, it's still sluggish and kludgy. 

I left it in the HDUI and since I had a little extra time I decided to transfer a number of recordings from our Series3. After setting about a dozen recordings to transfer I left-clicked out of "My Shows" and wham, the Preimere rebooted. Once it fully booted back up I went into the "To Do" list and guess what? Not one transfer was scheduled.  I switched back to the SDUI and repeated all of the transfers exactly as before, returned to TiVo Central, checked the "To Do" list and everything was listed as it should have been...the first time! 

I am still impressed by the transfer speeds, but overall I am still not a happy camper when it comes to my "upgrade" to the Premiere XL. 

Oh, I also forgot to mention that while in the HDUI I decided to schedule a Season Pass. Afterward I checked the Season Pass Manager and found that my wife had already scheduled a Season Pass for the same show. So there they were, both SP's (one at #9 and the one I just scheduled at #18). Exact same show, exact same channel...identical.  I tried it with another show...on purpose this time, and when I got to the Other Options menu > Season Pass there was the expected check mark. Sigh.


----------



## kingkong316

richsadams said:


> Oh, I also forgot to mention that while in the HDUI I decided to schedule a Season Pass. Afterward I checked the Season Pass Manager and found that my wife had already scheduled a Season Pass for the same show. So there they were, both SP's (one at #9 and the one I just scheduled at #18). Exact same show, exact same channel...identical.  I tried it with another show...on purpose this time, and when I got to the Other Options menu > Season Pass there was the expected check mark. Sigh.


I can confirm this one as well. That happened to me. I didn't even realize I did it until I put all of my new SPs in the order I wanted.


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## Mark McM

I don't think these have already been mentioned, so I'll add a few of the bugs I've experienced with a Premiere XL (software version 14.1c-01-3-748):

1. I transferred a large number of programs from a Tivo HD. When Folders are turned On, the transferred shows are correctly listed in 'My Shows'. The transferred programs do not appear in 'My Shows' at all when Folders are turned off.

2. Another bug when Folders are turned Off and there are a number of auto-recorded Tivo Suggestions: When paging down in 'My Shows', once the list has reached and is displaying the Tivo Suggestions recordings, paging up with the Channel Up or Up Arrow keys will never get past the Tivo Suggestions recordings to the list of regular recordings - the list just keeps re-cycling through the Tivo Suggestion recordings. The regularl recordings can only be viewed by either exiting 'My Shows' and re-entering, or by pressing the 'Jump Tick' button twice (once to go to the bottom of the list, and once to go to the top).

3. 'Available Space' counter incorrectly decrementing when Tivo Suggesions recording are deleted.  As I understand it, the 'Available Space' counter is not supposed to count auto-recorded Tivo Suggesions. However, when deleting some auto-recorded Tivo Suggestions, the 'Available Space' counter is decremented, showing more available space. After re-starting the HDUI (Thumb Down, Thumb Up, Play, Play) or restarting the Premiere from the Help menu, the 'Available Space' counter returns to the original value before Tivo Suggestions recordings were deleted.


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## jkudlacz

I have been noticing a large drop in performance by HD UI lately and it appears to be getting worse.

1. Yesterday when I hist TiVo button and HDUI came up I clicked on My Shows and green circle showed up on screen, I could see my current channel in top right corner and TiVo suggestions on top but nothing else was happening, I continued to wait and 1-2 minutes later I had 3 icons showing up Deleted Shows, You Tube and Netflix but none of my shows that I had recorded appeared, I waited few more minutes and nothing. I clicked << button to take me back to HDUI main page and then again on My Shows, yet again it took time to load it but much less this time around 10-15s and all of my shows appeared this time around.

2. I am noticing now that each time HDUI switches to SD, HD screen shuts down and shows my current live channel for 1-2 seconds and then goes into SD UI this have not been happening before.

At this point any time I click a button on TiVo remote I just wait for HDUI or SDUI to load or register my actions but it takes longer each time. I will continue monitoring this issue. I hope TiVo is working on HDUI improvements and new update will be deployed in early May since there are only few days left in April and I am not holding my breath to get anything that soon.

I wish TiVo could give us bit more information on how they are plaining to split HDUI from SDUI and if that will improve HDUI performance significantly, also why not cache all images for recommended shows on Tivo Premiere instead of pulling them from Tivo servers each time I press Tivo button.


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## jfh3

When using the HDUI - does anyone have a problem changing Keep Until to "Until I Delete"?

No matter what I do, I can't change a program to KUID. Works fine in the SD menus though.


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## DaveWhittle

jfh3 said:


> When using the HDUI - does anyone have a problem changing Keep Until to "Until I Delete"?
> 
> No matter what I do, I can't change a program to KUID. Works fine in the SD menus though.


I had an incident where I'm not sure what happened. I have a season pass of the new episodes of the current season of Breaking Bad, set as "keep until I delete", but I missed the first episode. Last week ep. 1 was re-run and was recorded as a suggestion. GREAT I thought, and hit "keep until I delete" on this suggestion. I noticed the TiVo icon for this episode never changed to a green dot, but it didn't dawn on me until later I checked and that suggestion wasn't there anymore.  This happened on the HD-UI.

Anyone else experience the same thing?


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## richsadams

After I posted my reboot/loss of scheduled transfers using the HDUI on our Premiere XL last night I ran into another "glitch". I was in the "My Shows" menu and scrolling down. I clicked on the page down button several times (impatient, I know) and that seemed to be too much for TiVo to handle. The green circle appeared and the machine froze. The orange LED would flash when I entered a command, but no activity. Then I tried a left click back to TiVo Central and it worked. I then went back into "My Shows" and it functioned normally. So apparently it can be overwhelmed. I can do the same thing in the SDUI and no problems...sometimes I'll get the "bong" sound, but other times it just continues to scroll. Either way it doesn't freeze up.

FWIW the HDUI seems a little more stable when I have the PIP/live view window turned off. That kind of defeats the purpose though. Ugh.


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## richsadams

jfh3 said:


> When using the HDUI - does anyone have a problem changing Keep Until to "Until I Delete"?
> 
> No matter what I do, I can't change a program to KUID. Works fine in the SD menus though.


I haven't experienced that one. Very strange. I think it might be worthwhile to try a hard reboot...unplug TiVo, wait 10 seconds or so for the hard drive to spin down and then plug it back in and see if it continues to be a problem.


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## richsadams

Well, here's proof that no good deed goes unpunished. I read jkudlacz's post , specifically #2 and thought that since I had a boatload of transfers from our Series3 to our Premiere XL that I'd try to replicate what he's seeing (transferred shows disappear when they aren't in folders). I tried it both using the SDUI and then the HDUI. FWIW I couldn't replicate it...the transferred shows appeared either way. (Good news for us, but sorry jk)

HOWEVER, after that I decided to switch back to the SDUI menus and guess what? When I clicked on Messages and Settings > Settings TiVo switched over to the SDUI menu...with nothing there! It never populated the menu. I went back out and tried several other options, all of which required the SDUI menus and the same thing...nothing...nadda, zilch! The remote commands still prompted audio sounds as if it was doing something, but without a little text to help out, I had no idea what was going on.










BEFORE










AFTER

I ended up having to follow my own earlier advice and pulled the plug. After it came to things returned to "normal" but that was very aggravating. I'm just glad my wife wasn't here to witness it...she would have probably hurt herself from extended eye-rolling. This is just getting silly now. 

BTW, I'm sure I've hit my thread posting quota for now so I'll be quiet for a bit and let everyone else have their say.


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## TrueTurbo

richsadams said:


> HOWEVER, after that I decided to switch back to the SDUI menus and guess what? When I clicked on Messages and Settings > Settings TiVo switched over to the SDUI menu...with nothing there! It never populated the menu.


I presume you are rebooting the TiVo each time you switch between the HD UI menus and the SD UI menus, right? Can't remember who said you should do this but it has been said several times in a number of threads. The fact that after you pulled the plug everything returned to 'normal' suggests that you really do need to reboot every time you switch between UI code bases.


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## richsadams

TrueTurbo said:


> I presume you are rebooting the TiVo each time you switch between the HD UI menus and the SD UI menus, right?


Nope, that's the first time I've had any issues switching between SD and HDUI's...and I've done that maybe a half-dozen times or more. So some folks are having to completely reboot TiVo if they want to change between menu options? What a sad statement that is.


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## TrueTurbo

richsadams said:


> Nope, that's the first time I've had any issues switching between SD and HDUI's...and I've done that maybe a half-dozen times or more. So some folks are having to completely reboot TiVo if they want to change between menu options? What a sad statement that is.


I'm not sure it is a sad statement at all. Switching between SD and HD menu code bases is not something you would normal want to do on the fly. It's a basic configuration decision. You would normally stick to one or the other. If anything, TiVo should _force_ a reboot when switching, like it does when you receive a service update that needs to be loaded.

With the HD UI issues that some people are experiencing, I suspect a _lot_ of people are switching between SD and HD menu formats on the fly and you never know, doing so may well be exasperating the problems.


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## richsadams

TrueTurbo said:


> I'm not sure it is a sad statement at all. Switching between SD and HD menu code bases is not something you would normal want to do on the fly. It's a basic configuration decision. You would normally stick to one or the other. If anything, TiVo should _force_ a reboot when switching, like it does when you receive a service update that needs to be loaded.
> 
> With the HD UI issues that some people are experiencing, I suspect a _lot_ of people are switching between SD and HD menu formats on the fly and you never know, doing so may well be exasperating the problems.


Hmmm...that really doesn't make sense to me because the TiVo Premiere switches between the HD and SDUI menus on the fly on a regular basis...when changing settings, accessing other TiVo's, etc., etc. I think we'd agree that one certainly couldn't/shouldn't expect it to reboot every time they want to use the MRV feature.

My take is that it absolutely should not have been released until those sorts of things were resolved. If they were to ask me...and of course they didn't  everything should happen inside the HDUI. There shouldn't be a need to or maybe even the option to switch. I don't know of a computer today that needs to be rebooted to change resolutions or programs, etc. unless, like you say, a software or firmware update needs to take place. The closest thing I can think of is having to reboot a Mac to run Windows in Bootcamp, and even then I don't have to do that if I'm using Parallels so Windows runs in a native Mac environment.

I still think it's sad we're having to deal with these sorts of things. This is the first time I've really been disappointed with TiVo.


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## orangeboy

richsadams said:


> Hmmm...that really doesn't make sense to me because the TiVo Premiere switches between the HD and SDUI menus on the fly on a regular basis...when changing settings, accessing other TiVo's, etc., etc. I think we'd agree that one certainly couldn't/shouldn't expect it to reboot every time they want to use the MRV feature...


Agreed. Sounds like a bug.


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## TrueTurbo

richsadams said:


> Hmmm...that really doesn't make sense to me because the TiVo Premiere switches between the HD and SDUI menus on the fly on a regular basis...when changing settings, accessing other TiVo's, etc., etc. I think we'd agree that one certainly couldn't/shouldn't expect it to reboot every time they want to use the MRV feature.
> 
> My take is that it absolutely should not have been released until those sorts of things were resolved. If they were to ask me...and of course they didn't  everything should happen inside the HDUI. There shouldn't be a need to or maybe even the option to switch. I don't know of a computer today that needs to be rebooted to change resolutions or programs, etc. unless, like you say, a software or firmware update needs to take place. The closest thing I can think of is having to reboot a Mac to run Windows in Bootcamp, and even then I don't have to do that if I'm using Parallels so Windows runs in a native Mac environment.
> 
> I still think it's sad we're having to deal with these sorts of things. This is the first time I've really been disappointed with TiVo.


There's a big difference between starting on a HD UI code base and calling an SD menu function, then there is switching between HD and SD code bases. Think of the HD and SD menu code bases as the operating system. Windows 7 and Windows XP if you like. You can run a Windows 7 OS and then start programs that are compatible with Windows XP, but you are not switching to Windows XP when you do so.

Honestly, I'm just throwing out ideas here. I don't know how TiVo write their code. I have many years experience as a software engineer though and I can envisage there being some fundamental differences between running on their SD base as opposed to their HD one. After all, the HD software is written in Flash, right, and the SD software isn't.

Also, remember that not everyone in the US has a HDTV. TiVo are keeping the SD menus alive for people who do not have HDTVs yet.


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## crxssi

TrueTurbo said:


> There's a big difference between starting on a HD UI code base and calling an SD menu function, then there is switching between HD and SD code bases. Think of the HD and SD menu code bases as the operating system. Windows 7 and Windows XP if you like. You can run a Windows 7 OS and then start programs that are compatible with Windows XP, but you are not switching to Windows XP when you do so.


Actually, it is more appropriate to use a Linux example, since it *is* Linux. The OS is Linux, the windowing is X. Neither has much to do with the end user GUI. If you start up Gnome as your GUI/desktop (like SD), you do not have to reboot to switch to KDE/desktop (like HD) or vice-versa.

Of course, both analogies are silly  (especially since it runs Linux, but doesn't run X)

But, since I am on a rant..... my Linux workstations (PC's if you will) very very rarely need rebooting (nor do they reboot themselves for no apparent reason). They run 24x7, I update them as needed, etc. About the only time I ever reboot is if there is a kernel update (which DOES require rebooting... and those updates are what, maybe every 3 months or something? And I don't HAVE to reboot unless I want to- it will still install the update anyway).

More concerning is that the UI/GUI should not lockup on the TiVo and require rebooting. Typically the UI is only a front-end, and if it did get hung, the user should be able to just restart the UI, which would only take 10 seconds or something? The TiVo SHOULD have watchdog timer code in the base OS and if the UI hangs or does not respond, it could just restart the UI code, avoiding a 5+ minute complete reboot! Even my Linux Palm Pre phone can do that...

Oh well, it is easy to say what something SHOULD do. Lots of real-world reasons something might be hard to do.


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## wmcbrine

crxssi said:


> Actually, it is more appropriate to use a Linux example, since it *is* Linux. The OS is Linux, the windowing is X.


I'm not sure if you meant to imply it, but the TiVo doesn't run X. Linux, yes; X, no.


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## richsadams

TrueTurbo said:


> Also, remember that not everyone in the US has a HDTV. TiVo are keeping the SD menus alive for people who do not have HDTVs yet.


All good points. Whatever the current situation is it's unacceptable IMO.

I tried a little experiment this evening that was a bit of an eye-opener. I switched back to the HDUI and disconnected TiVo from our network (ethernet) and ran through the "My Shows" menu. First it displayed a warning at the top of the screen: "Your TiVo box is not connected to the network. Some features will be unavailable..". I entered the "My Shows" menu and scrolled through it. Initially the green ring shows up for each screen and to the right where a graphic of the show would be there's a TV silhouette/filler. However once it goes through all of the screens the ring disappears and the menu is lightning fast...actually a good deal faster than our Series3. Obviously the time consuming part of the menus is the time it takes for TiVo to communicate with the server and download each graphic. But if they can get it to work that quickly while it's hooked up to the network it would be awesome! I really could care less about the little graphics myself. If TiVo can't cache them perhaps they could add a way to simply turn them off like the live viewing window? That would almost certainly speed things up.

The eye-opener though is that it would not allow me to perform any normal activities (change settings, etc.). It would let me play back recordings if I selected the recording and then pressed "Play".

EDIT: During the test I tried pressing the "Select" button to view a recording but received a "Network Connection Down" screen. However as noted I could play a recording if I pressed "Play".


----------



## Quaro

richsadams said:


> All good points. Whatever the current situation is it's unacceptable IMO.
> 
> I tried a little experiment this evening that was a bit of an eye-opener. I switched back to the HDUI and disconnected TiVo from our network (ethernet) and ran through the "My Shows" menu. First it displayed a warning at the top of the screen: "Your TiVo box is not connected to the network. Some features will be unavailable..". I entered the "My Shows" menu and scrolled through it. Initially the green ring shows up for each screen and to the right where a graphic of the show would be there's a TV silhouette/filler. However once it goes through all of the screens the ring disappears and the menu is lightning fast...actually a good deal faster than our Series3. Obviously the time consuming part of the menus is the time it takes for TiVo to communicate with the server and download each graphic. But if they can get it to work that quickly while it's hooked up to the network it would be awesome! I really could care less about the little graphics myself. If TiVo can't cache them perhaps they could add a way to simply turn them off like the live viewing window? That would almost certainly speed things up.
> 
> The eye-opener though is that it would not allow me to play back a recording while it was disconnected from the network.  When I clicked "Play" a pop-up "Network Connection Down" screen appeared. At least with all of the other TiVo's you can still play recordings w/o a network connection. So it would appear that if I lose my broadband connection for some reason, TiVo is more-or-less half dead. (Live TV was still available and it was still recording while it was disconnected from the network.) I do _not_ like the fact that it won't play recordings if it has no network connection at all.
> 
> It then turns out that if there is no network connection and you are using the SDUI menus, you can play recordings normally! The downside is that if you're using the HDUI and you lose your broadband connection, the Premiere won't allow you to (or can't) switch to the SDUI...the same "Network Connection Down" pop-up appears.


I can't see why the HD menu should require a constant network connection at all. Just skip images and let me pick from the list. I would much rather have a responsive UI.

But really, it should be responsive with images. Reloading every images every time is kinda crazy. Web browsers don't do it -- at most, they send a 'did this image change' request to the server. And usually they hold it until a refresh or restart.

This should an easy fix. The menu should work and be usable with no images, and be able to load the images in the background. Then those images should hang around in a cache. It's not like the Now Playing menu changes very often. Opera on the Nintento Wii caches images intelligently and that thing has something like 32 megabytes of memory for the whole system. And no hard drive.


----------



## richsadams

Quaro said:


> I can't see why the HD menu should require a constant network connection at all. Just skip images and let me pick from the list. I would much rather have a responsive UI.
> 
> But really, it should be responsive with images. Reloading every images every time is kinda crazy. Web browsers don't do it -- at most, they send a 'did this image change' request to the server. And usually they hold it until a refresh or restart.
> 
> This should an easy fix. The menu should work and be usable with no images, and be able to load the images in the background. Then those images should hang around in a cache. It's not like the Now Playing menu changes very often. Opera on the Nintento Wii caches images intelligently and that thing has something like 32 megabytes of memory for the whole system. And no hard drive.


+1 Well said. :up:


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## crxssi

wmcbrine said:


> I'm not sure if you meant to imply it, but the TiVo doesn't run X. Linux, yes; X, no.


That is why later in my post I said:

"Of course, both analogies are silly (especially since it runs Linux, but doesn't run X)"


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## crxssi

Quaro said:


> I can't see why the HD menu should require a constant network connection at all. Just skip images and let me pick from the list. I would much rather have a responsive UI.


+1

1) Disk cache
2) Download with program data at night
3) Use placeholders & skip if not ready


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## orangeboy

richsadams said:


> ...The eye-opener though is that it would not allow me to play back a recording while it was disconnected from the network.  When I clicked "Play" a pop-up "Network Connection Down" screen appeared. At least with all of the other TiVo's you can still play recordings w/o a network connection. So it would appear that if I lose my broadband connection for some reason, TiVo is more-or-less half dead. (Live TV was still available and it was still recording while it was disconnected from the network.) I do _not_ like the fact that it won't play recordings if it has no network connection at all...


I actually don't think you were using the "Play" button during your test. The popup message will occur if you try to use right arrow or Select in My Shows with no network connection. Play will play the recording.


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## DaveWhittle

orangeboy said:


> I actually don't think you were using the "Play" button during your test. The popup message will occur if you try to use right arrow or Select in My Shows with no network connection. Play will play the recording.


Whew! At least there's a workaround, but this has to be a bug. I'm anxious for the next update.

Rich... Did you report your findings to Margret?


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## richsadams

orangeboy said:


> I actually don't think you were using the "Play" button during your test. The popup message will occur if you try to use right arrow or Select in My Shows with no network connection. Play will play the recording in the HDUI.


D'oh! You are absolutely correct...I was using the Select button (a habit I didn't realize I had!). If I use the Play button it will indeed play the recording. My mistake.  I updated my post to clarify. Thanks for checking on that. :up: I feel slightly better now...but still hope the HDUI issues can be resolved soon. As mentioned, the speed at which it will potentially run is quite amazing if you remove the need to constantly request and download all of those pretty pictures.


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## richsadams

DaveWhittle said:


> Whew! At least there's a workaround, but this has to be a bug. I'm anxious for the next update.
> 
> Rich... Did you report your findings to Margret?


I must have been out of class that day...Margret?


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## DaveWhittle

richsadams said:


> I must have been out of class that day...Margret?


Margret Schmidt is the Tivo VP/designer in charge of the UI. She has a Twitter account (@Tivodesign) and her email is her first name at tivo.com.


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## richsadams

DaveWhittle said:


> Margret Schmidt is the Tivo VP/designer in charge of the UI. She has a Twitter account (@Tivodesign) and her email is her first name at tivo.com.


Ah...thanks for that.


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## RoyK

She posts here as TiVoMargret.


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## darock159

not sure if this is a bug or not, but I will lose several channels like scifi, usa, & tnt. one minute I will have them and then later they will be gone and and the TIvo says to contact my cable provider to subscibe to that channel. After a forced reboot they are back again. I have missed several shows because of this. Anyone else with this problem?


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## moxbox

darock159 said:


> not sure if this is a bug or not, but I will lose several channels like scifi, usa, & tnt. one minute I will have them and then later they will be gone and and the TIvo says to contact my cable provider to subscibe to that channel. After a forced reboot they are back again. I have missed several shows because of this. Anyone else with this problem?


This is strange. I have an old series 2, with Comcast digital HD, and I have also been having strange channel dropouts. Comcast sent a rep out today and told me it was a problem with the Tivo box (which is my problem...). So I started looking at this thread to see if I should upgrade.


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## Henry3NYC

Quaro said:


> I can't see why the HD menu should require a constant network connection at all. Just skip images and let me pick from the list. I would much rather have a responsive UI.
> 
> But really, it should be responsive with images. Reloading every images every time is kinda crazy. Web browsers don't do it -- at most, they send a 'did this image change' request to the server. And usually they hold it until a refresh or restart.
> 
> This should an easy fix. The menu should work and be usable with no images, and be able to load the images in the background. Then those images should hang around in a cache. It's not like the Now Playing menu changes very often. Opera on the Nintento Wii caches images intelligently and that thing has something like 32 megabytes of memory for the whole system. And no hard drive.


A big amen to the post highlighted above.

I like the HD screens, but the lag time is a real bummer. It seems like some tweaks to what loads first, and what is local cache and what is downloaded from the net, would make a world of difference in the user experience. You might even explore pre-fetching data for all possible selections from a menu page (I'm not real tech, so I'm probably using the wrong terms).

I'm not hating the HD menus as some are. I just think the experience could be made a lot better if the menus were more responsive.


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## richsadams

Henry3NYC said:


> You might even explore pre-fetching data for all possible selections from a menu page (I'm not real tech, so I'm probably using the wrong terms).
> 
> I'm not hating the HD menus as some are. I just think the experience could be made a lot better if the menus were more responsive.


Caching all possible images on the "My Shows" menu in lieu of retrieving them from the server every time makes perfect sense. As Quaro mentions, web browsers do it all of the time. Although space is a consideration, by comparison to recordings, particularly HD recordings, the amount of drive space they would occupy would be miniscule.

I don't think anyone really hates the HD menus. Like you, it's the latency/slowness that's so frustrating for folks. I quite like a lot of the HD menu features and options but I'm using the SDUI until they resolve things...and I think they will.


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## Phantom Gremlin

richsadams said:


> Caching all possible images on the "My Shows" menu in lieu of retrieving them from the server every time makes perfect sense.


I suppose someone could set up a Squid proxy server on their LAN and point the TiVos at that. Squid can cache images. But hopefully TiVo will optimize their software soon.

If TiVo doesn't want to cache all the stuff locally, then the other thing they could do is to somehow distribute this cache amongst all TiVo boxes on the LAN. That way they could first pull images from each other with lower latency before getting stuff off the WAN. I don't know why they haven't moved to such an architecture already. Why should 4 Tivo HDs (in my case) pull the same guide data 4 times from the TiVo servers?

Meh. We can dream. Right now just having the TiVo Premieres not reboot so much would bring joy to many early adopters.


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## richsadams

Phantom Gremlin said:


> I don't know why they haven't moved to such an architecture already. Why should 4 Tivo HDs (in my case) pull the same guide data 4 times from the TiVo servers?


Agreed. Not only pulling the same data and image 4 times, but of course multiply that by however many times you happen to stop on that recording...causing the very same image to download every single time. Of course that means that it's not only happening with your TiVo's but hundreds, maybe thousands of TiVo's, all pulling that same image repeatedly...perhaps tens of thousands of times a day. Then multiply that by however many recordings there are and...and... Well you get the point. What a waste of server time and broadband bandwidth!


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## jkudlacz

Does anyone know when TiVo will push next update to Premiere? Could it possibly be this weekend? I know that TiVo said on Twitter that updates are coming in April and May, last update came through at night over a weekend so is it possible they got something for us this weekend. Any ideas, thoughts or maybe even solid news on that?


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## jwcooper

jkudlacz said:


> Does anyone know when TiVo will push next update to Premiere? Could it possibly be this weekend? I know that TiVo said on Twitter that updates are coming in April and May, last update came through at night over a weekend so is it possible they got something for us this weekend. Any ideas, thoughts or maybe even solid news on that?


They haven't sent out any updates via twitter, so it's just a guessing game for now.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that we won't see the April update (not counting 14.1c), since 14.1c came out to save us from the majority of major issues. They'll use the extra time to get more stuff in. Who knows, maybe 14.1c was our big April release (lame, if so)...

I hope it's this weekend though.


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## richsadams

jkudlacz said:


> Does anyone know when TiVo will push next update to Premiere? Could it possibly be this weekend? I know that TiVo said on Twitter that updates are coming in April and May, last update came through at night over a weekend so is it possible they got something for us this weekend. Any ideas, thoughts or maybe even solid news on that?


IIRC one of the TiVo folks, TiVoJerry I think, mentioned that TiVo pushes updates Monday through Thursday only. Apparently that was to keep support calls to a minimum over the weekend and if there are any issues ensure that they are fully staffed (engineers, etc.) to address them. So I wouldn't _expect_ anything this weekend but you never know I suppose if yours came through on a weekend.


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## LordNelson

So after experiencing a number of ABENDs, I decided I'd best take peoples' advice and revert to the SD UI. While watching Star Trek (NG), the image froze, and the Tivo restarted... three times. So in my experience anyway, the SD UI is no better than the HD UI... both are pretty unstable.

I'm still debating whether to send the whole thing back and forget it. I've been a loyal Tivo customer for 10 years but this is just too much.


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## Phantom Gremlin

LordNelson said:


> So after experiencing a number of *ABENDs*, I decided I'd best take peoples' advice and revert to the SD UI.


You have a GUI on your IBM OS/360 mainframe? I thought most people interface with those using punch cards and line printers?


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## Phantom Gremlin

LordNelson said:


> While watching Star Trek (NG), the image froze, and the Tivo restarted... three times.


Was this on TV or were you streaming from something like Netflix? People have reported lots of Netfix problems on the TiVo HD, so perhaps the Premiere has the same.


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## SCSIRAID

Phantom Gremlin said:


> You have a GUI on your IBM OS/360 mainframe? I thought most people interface with those using punch cards and line printers?


S0C4? S0C7?


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## orangeboy

Phantom Gremlin said:


> You have a GUI on your IBM OS/360 mainframe? I thought most people interface with those using punch cards and line printers?





SCSIRAID said:


> S0C4? S0C7?


S80A - add a region card of 4M 

Edit: And note that I did NOT say 0M!


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## kdmorse

SCSIRAID said:


> S0C4? S0C7?


Did you open a PMR? Have you applied all applicable APARs?

-Ken


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## b_scott

my PXL just froze and rebooted with random lines of color while watching X Files on Netflix.


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## Phantom Gremlin

b_scott said:


> my PXL just froze and rebooted with random lines of color while watching X Files on Netflix.


This information is very useful to "newcomers" to TiVo, but IMO is covered by "so what did you expect?".

In other words, Netflix has been very flaky for people on the TiVo HD. Why would it be any "better" for the Premiere XL. Probably the same outsourced programmers in India writing the code for both platforms. This crashing is why I have never used Netflix with my TiVo HDs, and am not about to start. If I want Netflix, I'll buy a Roku. Sucks, but that's the current reality.

Don't take this the wrong way. I'm not attacking your post, I'm suggesting to people "don't do that!".


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## TrueTurbo

Phantom Gremlin said:


> This information is very useful to "newcomers" to TiVo, but IMO is covered by "so what did you expect?".
> 
> In other words, Netflix has been very flaky for people on the TiVo HD. Why would it be any "better" for the Premiere XL. Probably the same outsourced programmers in India writing the code for both platforms. This crashing is why I have never used Netflix with my TiVo HDs, and am not about to start. If I want Netflix, I'll buy a Roku. Sucks, but that's the current reality.
> 
> Don't take this the wrong way. I'm not attacking your post, I'm suggesting to people "don't do that!".


If you've never used Netflix on your TiVo, how do you know it will crash! You're just propagating fear and misinformation as if it were your own experience. My experience with Netflix on TiVo is that it doesn't crash at all! I've used the app often to watch many movies without any problems.

It's not my favorite Netflix app. I prefer the Netflix app on my X-Box 360, but there's nothing fundamentally wrong with the app on TiVo from my perspective. It works fine. People, go ahead and use the Netflix app on your TiVo. It won't bite!


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## b_scott

Phantom Gremlin said:


> This information is very useful to "newcomers" to TiVo, but IMO is covered by "so what did you expect?".
> 
> In other words, Netflix has been very flaky for people on the TiVo HD. Why would it be any "better" for the Premiere XL. Probably the same outsourced programmers in India writing the code for both platforms. This crashing is why I have never used Netflix with my TiVo HDs, and am not about to start. If I want Netflix, I'll buy a Roku. Sucks, but that's the current reality.
> 
> Don't take this the wrong way. I'm not attacking your post, I'm suggesting to people "don't do that!".


Netflix never crashed once on my TivoHD's. Ever. So, this is new.


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## orangeboy

b_scott said:


> Netflix never crashed once on my TivoHD's. Ever. So, this is new.


With myself being OTA + internet to supplement my viewing choices, I use Netflix quite a bit. I have not experienced this behavior (yet, and hopefully won't), but I will keep an eye out for it. What episode or movie of X-Files was it? Perhaps I can repeat the issue...


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## b_scott

X Files Season 1, Episode E.B.E

It started sort of glitching, then looked like it was about to stop and rebuffer - they I get the startup screen


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## Phantom Gremlin

TrueTurbo said:


> If you've never used Netflix on your TiVo, how do you know it will crash! You're just propagating fear and misinformation as if it were your own experience.


I've never shot myself in the head with a nail gun. Should I "experience" that for myself, or should I rely on "anecdotal" evidence from others?



orangeboy said:


> With myself being OTA + internet to supplement my viewing choices, I use Netflix quite a bit. I have not experienced this behavior (yet, and hopefully won't), but I will keep an eye out for it. What episode or movie of X-Files was it? Perhaps I can repeat the issue...


There are two threads on TiVocommunity which have both words "Netflix" and "crash" in the title. Interestingly, orangeboy participated in a least one of those threads. But if I search for those words within the body, I find many posts. Including this one from just a few weeks ago. Is he making this up? Is he lying when he says: *"My HD units now crashes (total lockup) constantly attempting to use Netflix streaming."*? Maybe he is, but he's not the only one with problems. Is the next poster lying when he says: *"And of course the Wii doesn't hang and require a shutdown when the network connection is severed."*

Why should I try for myself? I value reliable operation over all bells and whistles. That's why I stick to Season Passes, not Netflix!


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## orangeboy

Phantom Gremlin said:


> There are two threads on TiVocommunity which have both words "Netflix" and "crash" in the title. Interestingly, orangeboy participated in a least one of those threads. But if I search for those words within the body, I find many posts. Including this one from just a few weeks ago. Is he making this up? Is he lying when he says: *"My HD units now crashes (total lockup) constantly attempting to use Netflix streaming."*? Maybe he is, but he's not the only one with problems. Is the next poster lying when he says: *"And of course the Wii doesn't hang and require a shutdown when the network connection is severed."*
> 
> Why should I try for myself? I value reliable operation over all bells and whistles. That's why I stick to Season Passes, not Netflix!


I think for sake of clarity, you should replace "he" with "rdauenhauer". Mentioning my username and then quoting another poster initially made me think you were misquoting me...

But I wouldn't doubt the validity of the quoted user(s). As I mentioned, I think those that use wireless for streaming Netflix experience far more issue than those with a wired connection. I know I did, and soon remedied the situation with MoCA adapters, since I was unable to (easily) run new network drops in my apartment. With a wired connection, I cannot remember a single instance of Netflix locking up to the point of pulling the power to recover.


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## cranbers

Phantom Gremlin said:


> This information is very useful to "newcomers" to TiVo, but IMO is covered by "so what did you expect?".
> 
> In other words, Netflix has been very flaky for people on the TiVo HD. Why would it be any "better" for the Premiere XL. Probably the same outsourced programmers in India writing the code for both platforms. This crashing is why I have never used Netflix with my TiVo HDs, and am not about to start. If I want Netflix, I'll buy a Roku. Sucks, but that's the current reality.
> 
> Don't take this the wrong way. I'm not attacking your post, I'm suggesting to people "don't do that!".


I have used netflix extensively, probably 100 hours in the last month and maybe even a thousand hours on series 3.

While at one point it was pretty bad, crashed the whole series 3 often about 14 months ago, on rare occasion I do now but its pretty good..

It is not as feature packed as on the consoles, ps3, wii, xbox 360 etc, but it is functional and is pretty reliable.

On occasion there must be some kind of major issues at the source servers where it goes from netflix to tivo's servers (must be setup taht way because I started watching the same show on a HTPC and I had none of the issues shown on the tivo's Netflix setup, Symptoms are netflix screen is painfully slow if it loads at all (waiting for data from netflix), Also it has quit unexpectidly on me once or twice in the last month on premiere.

but over all 99 percent reliablility, which is actually a lot better then the hd interface, haha. If you haven't used it and you have netflix, you're missing out.

Netflix is taking over the world, now if we could just get on demand new release rentals they would be unstoppable.


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## TrueTurbo

Phantom Gremlin said:


> I've never shot myself in the head with a nail gun. Should I "experience" that for myself, or should I rely on "anecdotal" evidence from others?


What a stupid comment! 

Actually, in this case, you should go ahead and test the nail gun on yourself. I think it would solve a lot of problems.


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## jwcooper

Looks like the next release is still a week or two out...



> @SafariKC There is a release in final testing stages right now, but i don't have a release date yet. Week or two?


http://twitter.com/tivodesign


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## Phantom Gremlin

orangeboy said:


> I think for sake of clarity, you should replace "he" with "rdauenhauer". Mentioning my username and then quoting another poster initially made me think you were misquoting me...


Good point. It's smart to be extra careful with attributions. The reason I mentioned you and not rdauenhauer is because you (and not him) were posting in this thread.



TrueTurbo said:


> What a stupid comment!
> 
> Actually, in this case, you should go ahead and test the nail gun on yourself. I think it would solve a lot of problems.


I think my comment was no more "stupid" than your comment downplaying the significance of a widely reported problem, just because you haven't personally experienced it.


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## Phantom Gremlin

cranbers said:


> I have used netflix extensively, probably 100 hours in the last month and maybe even a thousand hours on series 3.
> 
> While at one point it was pretty bad, crashed the whole series 3 often about 14 months ago, on rare occasion I do now but its pretty good..


Once a product gets a bad reputation due to early problems, it's hard for perceptions to change. I predict that, in many people's minds, the Premiere will be the same way. Early boxes were/are flaky, and this reputation will persist for years. For this reason IMO TiVo was very wrong to release the Premiere with such immature software.


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## richsadams

Phantom Gremlin said:


> For this reason IMO TiVo was very wrong to release the Premiere with such immature software.


+1


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## TrueTurbo

Phantom Gremlin said:


> I think my comment was no more "stupid" than your comment downplaying the significance of a widely reported problem, just because you haven't personally experienced it.


Netflix on TiVo is a widely used app and I actually have experience using it. You don't. When I talk about how well it works, it's from experience. You're just spreading other peoples stories. You make blanket statements about subjects you know nothing about. Try the app for yourself and get educated.


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## i2k

reports of new SW version being pushed to boxes now


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## innocentfreak

i2k said:


> reports of new SW version being pushed to boxes now


where did you read that?


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## SoBayJake

innocentfreak said:


> where did you read that?


Here and subsequent replies in the thread: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=7942907#post7942907


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