# Suggestions please, Bolt or Roamio Pro



## Mandy Moo (Nov 20, 2015)

So I posted this in another thread and got nearly 200 views but only 1 response. I thought maybe I posted it in the wrong place and would try here. FWIW, I am leaning toward the Bolt.

I have finally talked my husband into abandoning our Cisco (Charter) cable DVR box and getting a Tivo, yay! Now the question is which one to get. I cannot decide which way to go and hoped to get some advice here. Our options, as I see it, are to either go with the Bolt and one year of included service or a used Roamio with possible lifetime service from eBay or of course we could purchase a new Roamio Pro from Tivo with one year of service for $599. I am a bit afraid of going any further back in models than the Roamio as I do not want to get stuck with a machine that is no longer supported after 6 months. 

As for our viewing habits, we have a 4K 3D TV and tend to watch a lot of movies on the weekends. We DVR TV shows to watch in the evenings anode course we watch Netflix, Hulu Plus and Amazon Prime. The 4 or 6 tuners does not seem to be a major issue for us since we are used to only being able to record two shows at a time with the Cisco so 4 sounds great and 6 sounds awesome! Skipping commercials is nice but since it is not a feature on every show/channel it isn't a deciding factor for us. 

Suggestions??


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## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

I would only consider the Roamio plus/pro if you can get a good deal on a unit with lifetime, the $599 deal with annual service on a Roamio pro sucks in my opinion.

The downsides of a Bolt versus a Roamio plus/pro as I see it are:

2 less tuners
2.5 TB smaller hard drvie than the Pro
Less options for internal hard drive upgrades
Currently no Hulu app (one is expected but we don't know when)
Inability to disable Overlap Protection (clipping)f - this may be pushed to the Roamio line with next software update
only output option is HDMI
Built in Stream functionality can only support 2 streams (to android or iOS devices, or a computer browser) and currently out of home network streaming does not work (again that is expected to be fixed). Roamio Plus/Pro supports 4 Streams

The benefits of the Bolt versus a Roamio plus/pro as I see it are: 

Most recent platform so likely to be fully supported longer
Faster processor speeds everything up and Netflix is must faster to load.
4K Apps
Better Plex app
Has MoCA 2.0 (Roamio Plu/Pro is 1.)
Built in Wireless is dual band AC - versus I believe N for the Roamio line
SkipMode, QuickMode, & Channel Logos, but QuickMode & Channel Logos are expected on the Roamio line


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## opus472 (Jul 4, 2007)

Nice summary above, thx for taking the time. Some addl discussion here -

http://tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=532764


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

atmuscarella said:


> I would only consider the Roamio plus/pro if you can get a good deal on a unit with lifetime, the $599 deal with annual service on a Roamio pro sucks in my opinion. ...


Yeah, nice summary...!!!


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## Mandy Moo (Nov 20, 2015)

Great points! Thank you so much for taking the time to break it down like that.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Just to make sure, you have never owned a TiVo before? (Just want to make sure that one of the "loyalty" discounts doesn't apply.)


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Roamio Plus or Pro models with Lifetime are slim pickings on eBay

eBay search


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## Mandy Moo (Nov 20, 2015)

krkaufman said:


> Just to make sure, you have never owned a TiVo before? (Just want to make sure that one of the "loyalty" discounts doesn't apply.)


No, we have never owned a Tivo before.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Mandy Moo said:


> No, we have never owned a Tivo before.


Drat.


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## chicagobrownblue (May 29, 2008)

If you want to go cheap, try to get a dual tuner Premiere, with lifetime, and run it on the standard definition menu mode. 

If you want to spend a little bit more money, try to find a basic Roamio with lifetime. 4 tuners but missing built-in streaming (which can be added externally later).

But, if you are nice and pleasant on the phone, call TiVo and ask about buying a Roamio basic from them and see if you can get $199 lifetime on it.

In any case, prioritize your network shows in the top half of your priority list and cable shows, which repeat frequently, near the bottom half of your priority list.


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## epstewart (Mar 1, 2003)

Mandy Moo said:


> Our options, as I see it, are to either go with the Bolt and one year of included service or a used Roamio with possible lifetime service from eBay or of course we could purchase a new Roamio Pro from Tivo with one year of service for $599.


I would suggest that if you opt for a Roamio with lifetime service built into its purchase price, you factor in the cost of buying an uninterruptible power supply - not just a surge protector, but one with battery backup to keep things running and spinning during any kind of power fluctuation or outage. I firmly believe a UPS can extend the life of the TiVo's hard disk drive and its internal power supply. If you don't want to spring for a UPS, I think you'd be best off getting year-by-year service for whichever TiVo you opt for. I've lost several (admittedly older model) TiVo's due to premature death from either a bad disk drive or bad power supply (hard to tell which when the TiVo won't boot). I now have UPSes on both my Bolt and my Roamio Plus.


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## Mandy Moo (Nov 20, 2015)

epstewart said:


> I would suggest that if you opt for a Roamio with lifetime service built into its purchase price, you factor in the cost of buying an uninterruptible power supply  not just a surge protector, but one with battery backup to keep things running and spinning during any kind of power fluctuation or outage. I firmly believe a UPS can extend the life of the TiVo's hard disk drive and its internal power supply. If you don't want to spring for a UPS, I think you'd be best off getting year-by-year service for whichever TiVo you opt for. I've lost several (admittedly older model) TiVo's due to premature death from either a bad disk drive or bad power supply (hard to tell which when the TiVo won't boot). I now have UPSes on both my Bolt and my Roamio Plus.


Good idea, thanks. We actually have a couple of those here that we used to use on two desk top computers.


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## M3 Adjuster (Feb 11, 2009)

epstewart said:


> I would suggest that if you opt for a Roamio with lifetime service built into its purchase price, you factor in the cost of buying an uninterruptible power supply  not just a surge protector, but one with battery backup to keep things running and spinning during any kind of power fluctuation or outage. I firmly believe a UPS can extend the life of the TiVo's hard disk drive and its internal power supply. If you don't want to spring for a UPS, I think you'd be best off getting year-by-year service for whichever TiVo you opt for. I've lost several (admittedly older model) TiVo's due to premature death from either a bad disk drive or bad power supply (hard to tell which when the TiVo won't boot). I now have UPSes on both my Bolt and my Roamio Plus.


Agree on lifetime and a UPS vs annual. I have a Panamax line conditioner in my living room and have never lost any of 4 Tivos there. Hard drive replacements sure.. but no failures and I have done lifetime on all of them. One of my S3 models bit the dust in my bedroom this past summer. It's definitely paid for vs a cable company DVR... but I wonder if a UPS would have allowed for more life.


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## M3 Adjuster (Feb 11, 2009)

Mandy Moo said:


> So I posted this in another thread and got nearly 200 views but only 1 response. I thought maybe I posted it in the wrong place and would try here. FWIW, I am leaning toward the Bolt.
> 
> I have finally talked my husband into abandoning our Cisco (Charter) cable DVR box and getting a Tivo, yay! Now the question is which one to get. I cannot decide which way to go and hoped to get some advice here. Our options, as I see it, are to either go with the Bolt and one year of included service or a used Roamio with possible lifetime service from eBay or of course we could purchase a new Roamio Pro from Tivo with one year of service for $599.
> 
> Suggestions??


Congrats on shaking off the " ON Demand" cord from the cable company. A TiVo is a multiyear investment... but in my experience it begins to pay off around year 4-5... and all mine have lasted at least 7 years. ( Edit- Just checked and the one of my Tivos that recently died was activated in 1999 and the other in 2009)

As a long time Tivo owner...I am enamored with the Bolt and recently only had a moment's notice did I just consider the Roamio again. As a continuing customer there is a $399 lifetime offer available to me.. however I think my $299-399 ( and yours ) should be headed towards a Bolt.

We can live with reduction in audio quality (cd to mp3 for example) but poor video quality is simply something that doesn't stand the test of time well. I'd rather not Go check out some 480p videos just to make my point..


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Mandy Moo said:


> Glad to hear it! We are on the fence about getting the Bolt or a Roamio (Pro/Plus).


*See here*, regarding* TiVo's "Thanksgiving Sale"* (link)



Mandy Moo said:


> No, we have never owned a Tivo before.


This would make you only eligible for the "New customer" Thanksgiving specials; however, if interested in either of the "Existing customer" deals, you would just need to know/find an existing customer who could make the purchase and then transfer the device to you.


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## Mandy Moo (Nov 20, 2015)

krkaufman said:


> *See here*, regarding* TiVo's "Thanksgiving Sale"* (link)
> 
> This would make you only eligible for the "New customer" Thanksgiving specials; however, if interested in either of the "Existing customer" deals, you would just need to know/find an existing customer who could make the purchase and then transfer the device to you.


So this is making my decision much harder! I really like the idea of 6 tuners and a 3TB hard drive. I am just concerned about the lack of support complaints I keep reading from other users. If I purchase a Roamio Pro will I still have features and decent Tivo support in two years? Three years? But on the other hand there are a lot of Bolt complaints too...or I could wait it out and see if the magical, mythical  Bolt Pro appears in the near future.


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## chicagobrownblue (May 29, 2008)

Mandy Moo said:


> So this is making my decision much harder! I really like the idea of 6 tuners and a 3TB hard drive. I am just concerned about the lack of support complaints I keep reading from other users. If I purchase a Roamio Pro will I still have features and decent Tivo support in two years? Three years? But on the other hand there are a lot of Bolt complaints too...or I could wait it out and see if the magical, mythical  Bolt Pro appears in the near future.


My Roamio basic is fully functional for my needs now. The hardware is fine IMO. Software updates have the potential to slow the machine down, so I am concerned about that. But TiVo should be able to roll out the bad code and roll in the new. Slow TiVo servers / slow Internet connections seem to be the real performance issue for many..

You can put a 3 TB drive in the basic Roamio and it will format it for you. Four tuners should work fine for most households as long as the priority list is set up correctly (conflicts are identified so you can intervene ahead of time).

So, the basic Roamio might fit your needs and save some money. I'm waiting for a 6-tuner Bolt in black that is rectangular/stackable. I have several friends that envy my Roamio basic once they see how it works. I'll lifetime it and give it to one of them.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Mandy Moo said:


> I am just concerned about the lack of support complaints I keep reading from other users. If I purchase a Roamio Pro will I still have features and decent Tivo support in two years? Three years?


What "lack of support" complaints? Is it just people griping about TiVo withholding SkipMode from the pre-BOLT models or something else?

From the evidence I can see, TiVO is still supporting the TiVo Premiere line, and those things are, what, 5 1/2 years old, and slow as molasses, if comments are to be believed.

Not trying to convince you to go one way or the other (Roamio vs BOLT, Lifetime vs Subscription); just trying to understand the source of the concern re: Roamio "lack of support."

BOLT "Pro" is expected sometime in the 2nd half of 2016, based on Ira Bahr conversation. It's possible TiVo may release a BOLT upgrade for the Mini, as well.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

chicagobrownblue said:


> So, the basic Roamio might fit your needs and save some money.


Money savings on a base Roamio starts to get eaten away as you look to add MoCA connectivity for Minis and/or mobile streaming. Something to keep in mind.



chicagobrownblue said:


> I have several friends that envy my Roamio basic once they see how it works. I'll lifetime it and give it to one of them.


Generous friend. You might save yourself $200 per and just get 'em each a Lifetime'd base Roamio, now, via the Thanksgiving Sale.


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## Mandy Moo (Nov 20, 2015)

krkaufman said:


> What "lack of support" complaints? Is it just people griping about TiVo withholding SkipMode from the pre-BOLT models or something else?
> 
> From the evidence I can see, TiVO is still supporting the TiVo Premiere line, and those things are, what, 5 1/2 years old, and slow as molasses, if comments are to be believed.
> 
> ...


I keep reading posts where people are complaining about Tivo removing features form their models, not allowing them to use online scheduling any longer, not pushing the updates, etc. I know, possibly just a bunch of whiners. I was leaning toward the Bolt but with the Turkey Day sale I am now seriously thinking about the Roamio Plus or Pro. Then if the Bolt Pro comes out and is truly the bees knees then I sell my Roamio and buy the Bolt Pro...I was waiting for a possible sale this week to make my decision. It just seems like there are still bugs and features to be worked out in the Bolt (as there are in any new device) but the Roamio looks like a solid device that people are snapping up!


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## chicagobrownblue (May 29, 2008)

krkaufman said:


> Generous friend. You might save yourself $200 per and just get 'em each a Lifetime'd base Roamio, now, via the Thanksgiving Sale[/URL




Actually I got $99 lifetime applied to my Roamio in October. In TiVo's generosity, they are not even going to charge me for it until my current 1-year is up.


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## epstewart (Mar 1, 2003)

Mandy Moo said:


> I keep reading posts where people are complaining about Tivo removing features form their models, not allowing them to use online scheduling any longer, not pushing the updates, etc. I know, possibly just a bunch of whiners. I was leaning toward the Bolt but with the Turkey Day sale I am now seriously thinking about the Roamio Plus or Pro. Then if the Bolt Pro comes out and is truly the bees knees then I sell my Roamio and buy the Bolt Pro...I was waiting for a possible sale this week to make my decision. It just seems like there are still bugs and features to be worked out in the Bolt (as there are in any new device) but the Roamio looks like a solid device that people are snapping up!


Based on what you have said in your posts here, I think you first need to decide the question of how many tuners you want. You started out saying that the 4 tuners/6 tuners question wasn't important to you, and then later you began lionizing the 6-tuner Roamios.

Then you need to decide how much storage you want to have, an amount that usually correlates with the number of tuners, since people who demand 6 tuners generally record lots and lots of shows. Keep in mind, though, that you can add external storage later if you ever run out of room. You can do that any time you want, without losing any of your existing recordings.

Then you need to decide how important to you the bang-for-the-buck question really is. If you will fuss and fume later on because you didn't get the absolute best deal, then prioritize that aspect of your decision-making now. Otherwise, take a more casual attitude toward the "bargain hunting" aspect.

I personally would relegate to the back burner your worries about support in the out years. You will be very lucky if any TiVo you buy today outlives TiVo Inc.'s support for that model.


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## Mandy Moo (Nov 20, 2015)

epstewart said:


> Based on what you have said in your posts here, I think you first need to decide the question of how many tuners you want. You started out saying that the 4 tuners/6 tuners question wasn't important to you, and then later you began lionizing the 6-tuner Roamios.
> 
> Then you need to decide how much storage you want to have, an amount that usually correlates with the number of tuners, since people who demand 6 tuners generally record lots and lots of shows. Keep in mind, though, that you can add external storage later if you ever run out of room. You can do that any time you want, without losing any of your existing recordings.
> 
> ...


Your post makes sense. I am an indecisive person and I agonize over decisions such as these. I know it is ridiculous, but I do! My husband basically feels like we should just get the best device, period. He believes in buying a well made/well functioning item and keeping until it dies. I just want to be sure I pick the right one! Typically we only have about 25-30 shows (HD) on our present Charter DVR at any give time but that is because it is around half full at that point and the "deleting soon" messages start to appear. As for the tuners, it really isn't a major issue as I do not see us using the 6 tuners but from what I keep reading the Roamio devices seem to be solid and have many features that the Bolt says it has but aren't really functioning yet (Amazon, Hulu, Out of Home). So if I buy a Bolt, am I really getting an upgraded device or should I just get a Roamio Plus? That's where I'm at. Truly I enjoy a good deal but whether I buy the Roamio Plus/Pro or the Bolt I'll still be spending hundreds of dollars so it isn't going be "cheap" either way and I guess I should't really make that a major factor.


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## epstewart (Mar 1, 2003)

Mandy Moo said:


> ... but from what I keep reading the Roamio devices seem to be solid and have many features that the Bolt says it has but aren't really functioning yet (Amazon, Hulu, Out of Home). So if I buy a Bolt, am I really getting an upgraded device or should I just get a Roamio Plus ...


There's not really a wrong answer here!

As far as features that are promised on the Bolt but aren't here yet, they will arrive! Never fear ...


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## chicagobrownblue (May 29, 2008)

Mandy Moo said:


> I agonize over decisions such as these


As you agonize, you develop better analytical skills. Over time, you should be able to make better, faster decisions.



Mandy Moo said:


> My husband basically feels like we should just get the best device, period. He believes in buying a well made/well functioning item and keeping until it dies.


The Bolt has better hardware. All issues with apps not being available will be fixed with software and existing software will improve over time. If you really use the apps a lot, you probably want the new, faster Bolt hardware. The white color and non-rectangular box of the Bolt leave me cold.



Mandy Moo said:


> Typically we only have about 25-30 shows (HD) on our present Charter DVR at any give time but that is because it is around half full at that point and the "deleting soon" messages start to appear.


This happens to my TiVo Roamio all the time. I record 4 to 6 hours of news programs each day but keep only the two most recent ones. Most of my shows are marked "deleting soon." If I reboot my TiVo, usually all of the "deleting soon" warnings disappear.



Mandy Moo said:


> As for the tuners, it really isn't a major issue as I do not see us using the 6 tuners but from what I keep reading the Roamio devices seem to be solid and have many features that the Bolt says it has but aren't really functioning yet (Amazon, Hulu, Out of Home). So if I buy a Bolt, am I really getting an upgraded device or should I just get a Roamio Plus? That's where I'm at. Truly I enjoy a good deal but whether I buy the Roamio Plus/Pro or the Bolt I'll still be spending hundreds of dollars so it isn't going be "cheap" either way and I guess I should't really make that a major factor.


I find most of the arguments for 6 tuners on these forums contrived. You really *want* them if you want to watch a lot of real time sports and are indecisive in scheduling programs. The Roamio Plus is the sweet spot of the Roamio line but I did not see any new ones available from TiVo.

But, it might be time for you to call TiVo and see what they say. You have a well informed idea of what features are available, they may be able to help.


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## epstewart (Mar 1, 2003)

chicagobrownblue said:


> The Roamio Plus is the sweet spot of the Roamio line but I did not see any new ones available from TiVo.


There seem to be no new Roamio Pluses available. Pity. I have a Roamio Plus and like it a lot. (I also have a new Bolt and like it even better.)

Can the original poster find a good deal on a Roamio Plus at eBay? Might be a good way to go while the Bolt line matures.


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

Mandy Moo said:


> I keep reading posts where people are complaining about Tivo removing features form their models, not allowing them to use online scheduling any longer, not pushing the updates, etc. I know, possibly just a bunch of whiners. I was leaning toward the Bolt but with the Turkey Day sale I am now seriously thinking about the Roamio Plus or Pro. Then if the Bolt Pro comes out and is truly the bees knees then I sell my Roamio and buy the Bolt Pro...I was waiting for a possible sale this week to make my decision. It just seems like there are still bugs and features to be worked out in the Bolt (as there are in any new device) but the Roamio looks like a solid device that people are snapping up!


How many TV's / people do you have in your home? That is going to help you size your purchase.

If I were purchasing today, I would still get the Roamio Plus (6 tuner) over a Bolt. And of course Mini's for extending to other TV's. The bolt wasn't delivered as a replacement for the 6 tuner models, it is seeking a different market. A pro-line bolt model is expected in a few months.

As for loosing services... Those are mighty old TiVos and a whole technology platform that is being allowed mature gracefully. The bolt and Roamio use the same UI base so you are going to get a lot of years of service.


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## krkaufman (Nov 25, 2003)

Mandy Moo said:


> As for the tuners, it really isn't a major issue as I do not see us using the 6 tuners


A major benefit of the additional tuners is being able to add pre- or post-padding to shows without creating major recording conflict issues.


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