# Cox Cable Cards



## jcaudle

Just talked to cox cable here in fairfax, Va. The cable cards cost 8.95 per month each because they charge a digital gateway charge just like they do for each set....so its like getting 2 set top boxes. No system 3 for me. I will stay with D* and get the HR20


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## Dan203

In most cases the first CableCARD is included in the plan as long as you forego the cable box. So really it's only an extra $8.95. Although that is still pretty high. Maybe what you should do is wait a few months until your cable company starts getting multi-stream CableCARDs. The TiVo only requires one of those, so you'd be able to get dual tuners without any extra charge.

Dan


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## cap

Really?
Cox here in Omaha only charges $1.99 per card.

Why would cox be different in different areas?


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## Dan203

From what I've seen reported Comcast is all over the map on pricing too.

Charter charges a flat $1.50 per card with no outlet fee. The only hitch is they charge a $32 installation fee, but that's a one time fee so if you get one CableCARD or four it's the same charge.

Dan


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## DrDravenStone

Just called Cox in Phoenix...
2.00 per card (multi streams not available yet he says).
Must roll truck for install 49.95 for one card, 64.95 for two cards, one device.

(Don't have 1000 bucks to drop on an S3 though.)


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## dt_dc

Cox Fairfax charges $1.99 per card ...

However, their "Digital Gateway" is "required" for each CableCard ... that's $6.95 for the first outlet and $5.95 for each additional one. The "Digital Gateway" is also required for HBO and other encrypted digital programming too so ... ... it depends on how you look at things (whether that additional fee is part of the "card" or part of the "programming").


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## Oxford

Just talked to TWC in suburban Cleveland, OH who has taken over Adelphia's customers. First CableCARD is $1.75 and second one is $4.75. Seems odd to me. Install is $25.00 for one or both at same time. Lead time for appointment they said about one week. I didn't ask about multi-stream since I didn't know what they were. I will call back and find out.


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## dt_dc

Oh ... and yes ... they (Cox Fairfax) consider each CableCard as an "outlet" even though they're plugged into the same box.


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## dkroboth

dt_dc said:


> Oh ... and yes ... they (Cox Fairfax) consider each CableCard as an "outlet" even though they're plugged into the same box.


Ouch. That's my "cable" company, too. I'm glad I'm moving to LA in October. Unfortunately, since it's sounds like a major PITA to get cable card, it looks like I'm going to wait until we move to get a Series 3. Since we are buying a house out in LA, I think I might have to evaluate my home purchase decision on the supportability of the Series 3 by the local cable company. It's that crazy? You betch.


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## dt_dc

jcaudle said:


> I will stay with D* and get the HR20


Then again ... Cox Fairfax doesn't charge for an "HD Package" like D*. You get the HD versions of channels without an extra charge.

All MVPDs have their own ways to stick "fine print" pricing in there ... as always ... figure out the complete cost for various providers / packages and make your comparison from there. Don't ever make a comparison based on the cost of one part of the package ...


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## dt_dc

dkroboth said:


> Ouch. That's my "cable" company, too.


Well ... I put "required" in quotes for a reason. Technically, you could probably challange some parts of Cox's pricing structures ... and ... at the very least get them to give you a pretty good discount to shut up (worked for me on another "Digital Gateway" / DVR / HD pricing / tiering / hardware issue). Know who to write to and how to write it and ... I found Cox's pricing surprisingly "flexible". 

But I'm switching to FiOS TV tommorrow so ... I'll have to leave the Cox battles for someone else (it's also a PITA to deal with).


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## JPinAZ

DrDravenStone said:


> Just called Cox in Phoenix...
> 2.00 per card (multi streams not available yet he says).
> Must roll truck for install 49.95 for one card, 64.95 for two cards, one device.


I called last week & was told there was no additional charges for installing more than one card.


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## aztivo

DrDravenStone said:


> Just called Cox in Phoenix...
> 2.00 per card (multi streams not available yet he says).
> Must roll truck for install 49.95 for one card, 64.95 for two cards, one device.
> 
> (Don't have 1000 bucks to drop on an S3 though.)


I just scheduled my install for thursday evening here in PHX and the truck roll is only 34.95. The 2.00 is corect though 
I just hope to have my box I ordered it this morning at 5am AZ time


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## ah30k

aztivo said:


> I just scheduled my install for thursday evening here in PHX and the truck roll is only 34.95. The 2.00 is corect though


My TiVo CSR said the units wouldn't be shipping until Thu so overnight wouldn't be delivered until Fri. Maybe if you go with BB or CC you can pick it up by Thu afternoon.


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## aztivo

ah30k said:


> My TiVo CSR said the units wouldn't be shipping until Thu so overnight wouldn't be delivered until Fri. Maybe if you go with BB or CC you can pick it up by Thu afternoon.


well this would suck, but i am hoping that this is just some csr mis-information as my order says it is being fulfilled by High Definiton entertainmetn


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## DrDravenStone

So it appears even the PHX market is all over the map. $35 is (almost) reasonable for sticking two cards in a slot and making a phone call to rattle off some serial numbers... Particularly if the traffic is bad on the way to your house.

I'm almost glad I can't afford one of these yet so I don't have to be annoyed by Cox for something new. Almost.


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## boywaja

jcaudle said:


> Just talked to cox cable here in fairfax, Va. The cable cards cost 8.95 per month each because they charge a digital gateway charge just like they do for each set....so its like getting 2 set top boxes.


ugh, I wish i'd known that this morning.

Cox has implies there is only the nominal cable card fee around $2 plus the onerous truck-roll fee.


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## ehardman

Any more Cox experiences?


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## timmetro69

I called and scheduled a cable card install through Cox Las Vegas on Tuesday right after I ordered my S3. The rep was a little confused at first when I requested two, and she actually started to say that she'd only put one on the order but the tech "should" have two with him. I said I'd be much more comfortable if the order specifically stated two cards, which she eventually did without much issue. 

The cost per card is $1.99/month, and the install/truck roll charge is $30/card. In the end, I actually save about six dollars a month after you take away the $10/month for my current 8300HD DVR (which sucks). 

My install is scheduled for Saturday afternoon. Hopefully my S3 arrives on Friday as expected.


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## Blackbag

> The cost per card is $1.99/month, and the install/truck roll charge is $30/card. In the end, I actually save about six dollars a month after you take away the $10/month for my current 8300HD DVR (which sucks).


timmetro69, Do you have any idea who you talked to? I live in Vegas too, and I called on Wednesday. They had no idea what I was talking about, and insisted that the cable cards wouldn't work in a tivo. They transferred be back and forth between Sales and Tech. They finally just said when you get the tivo, come in and we'll give you the cards to install yourself.

This morning I went in to the office on Rancho and lady was just as confused. She eventually set up an install on Tuesday from 3-5, but said it would cost $60 to install and $7.50/month for each card. I think they just make these prices up on the spot. I'm seriously considering canceling my install and waiting until they figure out what the hell they are doing.


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## timmetro69

Blackbag said:


> timmetro69, Do you have any idea who you talked to? I live in Vegas too, and I called on Wednesday. They had no idea what I was talking about, and insisted that the cable cards wouldn't work in a tivo. They transferred be back and forth between Sales and Tech. They finally just said when you get the tivo, come in and we'll give you the cards to install yourself.
> 
> This morning I went in to the office on Rancho and lady was just as confused. She eventually set up an install on Tuesday from 3-5, but said it would cost $60 to install and $7.50/month for each card. I think they just make these prices up on the spot. I'm seriously considering canceling my install and waiting until they figure out what the hell they are doing.


Sorry, not sure who I spoke with. When I called in, I think I got some sort of dispatcher who sent me over to the cable card group. The person I eventually spoke with was helpful, but confused about the whole thing. I made sure to tell her that it had just come out and that it wasn't a TV, but I got the feeling she was clueless and just put the order in as I asked just so we could move on. The pricing they quoted you is definitely higher than they gave me. Not sure what's going on there.

You may want to check out TivoPony's message in this thread: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=315837

He basically said that if you get any grief when ordering cablecards that you should call Tivo support and ask for the HD team. They'll stay on the phone with you while you call Cox and help you with the process.

Good luck. I'll let you know how my install goes on Saturday.


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## Blackbag

timmetro69 said:


> Sorry, not sure who I spoke with. When I called in, I think I got some sort of dispatcher who sent me over to the cable card group. The person I eventually spoke with was helpful, but confused about the whole thing. I made sure to tell her that it had just come out and that it wasn't a TV, but I got the feeling she was clueless and just put the order in as I asked just so we could move on. The pricing they quoted you is definitely higher than they gave me. Not sure what's going on there.


So I just called again, and talked to Peggy in the Sales Dept. After talking to her for a while, She confirmed that the cards are $2.00 each, and that they were charging me $5 for the digital gateway. She then said that if I was turning my current cable box in, they wouldn't need to charge me the digital gateway fee. She also said that I should only be charged for one install since both cards are going in the same device, reducing my install fee from $60 to $30.

At the end of the call, she wanted to verify this with her manager, so she puts me on hold for a minute. When she comes back she says she needs to verify with the tech, so she'll call me back. Unfortunately, she said she set up a Series 3 install yesterday that she may have set up wrong, so I hope I didn't screw anything up for you.


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## jodell

I called Cox Orange County a couple days ago to schedule my install. The CSR drone told me that it would cost $39.95 per card for the truck roll. After trying to explain that it was a single piece of equipment, etc I was getting no where. I asked for a supervisor who politely listened to me gripe about their charges but didn't offer to do anything. 

I finally asked her what she could do to make this install charge more palatable. She put me on hold for a minute and came back with a $40 programming credit to offset the second install charge. She claims that she can't discount install fees. 

I frankly was so PO'd about the install charge that I don't even remember how much I am being charged per card. I think it is something like $2 each. 

My appointment is Tuesday. I will follow up with any horror stories about clueless techs then. :') 

Jeff


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## jhonaker

I'm in Fairfax county, VA. I called Tuesday to schedule a cablecard install (which will be Monday if my TiVo arrives before then). The guy scheduling the appt asked if the cards were for 1 tv or 2, and I told him 1. I didn't try to explain that they were for a TiVo versus any other device.

The charges listed on their website for Fairfax are:

_Cox Digital Cable customers may lease the devices for $1.99 per card per month. Only Cox field technicians may install, activate and initialize the Cox CableCARDtm Service devices, for which well charge a $29.99 installation fee._


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## AZrob

I just called Cox in Phoenix today and got two answers, neither of which quite jibes with what I'm seeing here. The first guy said it would be $2.00 per card per month PLUS $2.00 per card per month for the service, making it $8.00 per month total for 2 cards and the service. 

The second guy said it was $2.00 for the first card per month, period. But if you wanted a 2nd card it was $4.00 more, consisting of $2.00 for the 2nd card plus a "2nd TV charge", so the total was going to be $6.00 total per month. And it was $49.95 for the install for both, not $30.

Go figure.

AZTivo I am more interested ultimately in how it all looks when it finally is installed, whatever the cost, so please keep reporting....

Thanks,

Rob from Scottsdale


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## boomvader

rmayer99 said:


> I just called Cox in Phoenix today and got two answers, neither of which quite jibes with what I'm seeing here. The first guy said it would be $2.00 per card per month PLUS $2.00 per card per month for the service, making it $8.00 per month total for 2 cards and the service.
> 
> The second guy said it was $2.00 for the first card per month, period. But if you wanted a 2nd card it was $4.00 more, consisting of $2.00 for the 2nd card plus a "2nd TV charge", so the total was going to be $6.00 total per month. And it was $49.95 for the install for both, not $30.
> 
> Go figure.
> 
> AZTivo I am more interested ultimately in how it all looks when it finally is installed, whatever the cost, so please keep reporting....
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Rob from Scottsdale


I am in PHX. COX quoted me 64.95 for the installation of 2 cards. $2/month each.

-boom


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## aztivo

rmayer99 said:


> I just called Cox in Phoenix today and got two answers, neither of which quite jibes with what I'm seeing here. The first guy said it would be $2.00 per card per month PLUS $2.00 per card per month for the service, making it $8.00 per month total for 2 cards and the service.
> 
> The second guy said it was $2.00 for the first card per month, period. But if you wanted a 2nd card it was $4.00 more, consisting of $2.00 for the 2nd card plus a "2nd TV charge", so the total was going to be $6.00 total per month. And it was $49.95 for the install for both, not $30.
> 
> Go figure.
> 
> AZTivo I am more interested ultimately in how it all looks when it finally is installed, whatever the cost, so please keep reporting....
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Rob from Scottsdale


I will keep you posted they should be here tomorrow between 2-5. With my HDTV in the bedroom that has a cable card it woks just as well as the HD non DVR box i have set up downstairs.


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## gwsat

rmayer99 said:


> I just called Cox in Phoenix today and got two answers, neither of which quite jibes with what I'm seeing here. The first guy said it would be $2.00 per card per month PLUS $2.00 per card per month for the service, making it $8.00 per month total for 2 cards and the service.
> 
> The second guy said it was $2.00 for the first card per month, period. But if you wanted a 2nd card it was $4.00 more, consisting of $2.00 for the 2nd card plus a "2nd TV charge", so the total was going to be $6.00 total per month. And it was $49.95 for the install for both, not $30.
> Rob from Scottsdale


Cox OKC gave me a similar answer. Two CableCARDs would be ~ $8 a month and I would have to pay two installation charges, although both cards were to be installed in the same device. But while the installation charge for the first card would be $30, for the second, or more, it would drop to $15 each.

By the way, it's a pleasure to be back here. I first joined in 2001 but my original enrolment somehow slipped through the cracks, so I had to signup anew. I bought and used an S1 from 2000 until 2003, when Cox OKC finally started to offer HD DVRs. I have been waiting for a TiVo HD box for cable ever since.


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## MickeS

I'm guessing cable companies so far haven't exactly been inundated with calls about CableCARDS, since nobody seems to know anything.


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## PDT816

gwsat said:


> Cox OKC gave me a similar answer. Two CableCARDs would be ~ $8 a month and I would have to pay two installation charges, although both cards were to be installed in the same device. But while the installation charge for the first card would be $30, for the second, or more, it would drop to $15 each.
> 
> By the way, it's a pleasure to be back here. I first joined in 2001 but my original enrolment somehow slipped through the cracks, so I had to signup anew. I bought and used an S1 from 2000 until 2003, when Cox OKC finally started to offer HD DVRs. I have been waiting for a TiVo HD box for cable ever since.


Cox OKC told me that it would be a flat $1.99 per card/mo and I could pick them up at any location when it was convenient for a self install.


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## gwsat

PDT816 said:


> Cox OKC told me that it would be a flat $1.99 per card/mo and I could pick them up at any location when it was convenient for a self install.


ROFL! What else is new? When I was trying to decide whether to get a CableCARD or another 8300HD box for my new TV in my kitchen-breakfast room, I got at least three answers as to how much more a second HD box would cost me.

In the interest of science, I called Cox again just now. THIS rep repeated that the cards "must be professionally installed," but contrary to the guy I talked to earlier today, said that the installation charge is $30 for each card, no matter how many they install. Frankly, I think that the professional installation requirement is correct but whether there really is a discount available on the installation charge for additional cards is anybody's guess.


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## adunnigan

Cox--Phoenix--scheduled install in 10 days:
$2.00 per card/month plus $2.00 per card/month for digital gateway service
$49 (total) installation charge
Guy actually seemed fairly confident on these prices
Now I just have to let the Mrs know we're buying a series 3...


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## LonV

Cox, Phoenix:

I mentioned that I needed 2 CableCards, and they asked me if I was replacing both of my CableBoxes, I said no, just the HD one. Then they asked if I knew I would lose my DVR service, I said yep. While they never quoted me a price on the cablecards (I'm just hoping they're free  so I didn't bring it up) he said the install was only $35 total. Hopefully it's no more than $2 per and they're actually bringing two instead of one.


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## TheRatPatrol

DrDravenStone said:


> Just called Cox in Phoenix...
> 2.00 per card (multi streams not available yet he says).
> Must roll truck for install 49.95 for one card, 64.95 for two cards, one device.
> 
> (Don't have 1000 bucks to drop on an S3 though.)


Thats crazy. No reason why they don't allow you to pick the cards up from their office and install them yourself. Anything to make money I guess.


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## Goofball

LonV said:


> Cox, Phoenix:
> 
> I mentioned that I needed 2 CableCards, and they asked me if I was replacing both of my CableBoxes, I said no, just the HD one. Then they asked if I knew I would lose my DVR service, I said yep. While they never quoted me a price on the cablecards (I'm just hoping they're free  so I didn't bring it up) he said the install was only $35 total. Hopefully it's no more than $2 per and they're actually bringing two instead of one.


I picked up my S3 at Fry's in north Phoenix here tonight (they have them in stock, everywhere else I looked in town was no-go). Got home and messed around with it on my regular analog cable, ATSC OTA and cable unencrypted QAM locals. Looks *GREAT* on the digital signals. SD and HD downconvert to 480i was wonderful even over the SVID connection I was using to test (I didn't want to start pulling out all the wiring until I am ready to use it permanantly, plus I need to pick up a HDMI to DVI adapter for my TV). I can't wait to see this thing over an actual HD connection.

Planning on spending a bit of time on Saturday copying all the SP and wishlist settings off my old unit and doing a proper install with nice neat wiring and a full removal of all my old DTiVo cabling. We'll see how it really looks then...

Called Cox Phoenix for a CC install tonight a bit earlier and was told it would be 35$ flat fee install for both cards, and 2$ a month per card as a rental fee. We'll see how it goes next Thursday  when they install the cards (earliest install date where I had open schedule).

I'm also planning on calling and asking for a discount on the truck roll since I would have done a self install if the bloody bastards would have given me the option. How frigging hard is it to plug in a card, call a number and read them info off the screen? I can also see where they are coming from since I work in IT and see how ignorant/stupid some people can be... Eh, such is life. What is another 35$ after I already dropped 870$ ($799 +tax, ouch, I should learn to be more patient and order online).


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## LonV

Goofball said:


> I picked up my S3 at Fry's in north Phoenix here tonight (they have them in stock


Did you check out the Fry's on Baseline? I'm gonna swing by there this morning...and now I can't believe it but maybe go to the one you went to. Well, apparently my Friday work productivity is shot!


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## aztivo

LonV said:


> Did you check out the Fry's on Baseline? I'm gonna swing by there this morning...and now I can't believe it but maybe go to the one you went to. Well, apparently my Friday work productivity is shot!


Lon let me know I called the Baseline one last night and they had no idea what I was talking about.. and it was 830 so I couldnt get there much before 9.. SO let me know when you can


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## boomvader

LonV said:


> Did you check out the Fry's on Baseline? I'm gonna swing by there this morning...and now I can't believe it but maybe go to the one you went to. Well, apparently my Friday work productivity is shot!


Fry's in N. PHX had 2 in stock last night.

-boom


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## Goofball

LonV said:


> Did you check out the Fry's on Baseline? I'm gonna swing by there this morning...and now I can't believe it but maybe go to the one you went to. Well, apparently my Friday work productivity is shot!


I didn't check the Fry's on Baseline. My assumption that they had stock is based on the fact that they are the distribution hub for both Fry's stores in Phoenix, therefore all product should go there first and then get split between the two stores.


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## YazooWho

Goofball said:


> Called Cox Phoenix for a CC install tonight a bit earlier and was told it would be 35$ flat fee install for both cards, and 2$ a month per card as a rental fee. We'll see how it goes next Thursday  when they install the cards (earliest install date where I had open schedule).
> 
> I'm also planning on calling and asking for a discount on the truck roll since I would have done a self install if the bloody bastards would have given me the option. How frigging hard is it to plug in a card, call a number and read them info off the screen? I can also see where they are coming from since I work in IT and see how ignorant/stupid some people can be... Eh, such is life. What is another 35$ after I already dropped 870$ ($799 +tax, ouch, I should learn to be more patient and order online).


When I called Cox/Phoenix I was told it was $49.95 for install. Wonder why you were told $35.


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## MickeS

YazooWho said:


> When I called Cox/Phoenix I was told it was $49.95 for install. Wonder why you were told $35.


Isn't it obvious by now that no cable CSR knows anything?


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## Dark Helmet

I am curious about what other Cox customers are seeing in terms of total fees for two CableCARDs.

What Cox/Fairfax is telling me is that it's $29.99 per card for the install (even though I did two at once). Also, while the card rental is $1.99 per card, I have to pay for two digital outlets (At $5.99 a pop). I already have one digital cable box, so that's why the first one isn't $6.99 I guess. Are other Cox customers in other locations not paying this extra digital outlet charge?

I can live with the double install cost, but the extra digital outlet fee really sticks in my craw, because you don't pay for two outlets for their dual-tuner DVR. I know, $5.99 isn't going to bankrupt me ... but still, it's the principal of the thing.

I feel like I want to complain to someone ... the thing is, I'm not sure who. The CSR I spoke with basically said "Well, it's two cablecards, so it's two outlets" and didn't buy my argument about it being one device. She was clueless about the S3 TiVo, though. Some research leads me to believe that the FCC won't care about it ... and it seems like in Virginia my local Government (Fairfax County) is the one that regulates Cox, but their web site really didn't have a complaint form. I suppose I could always write a letter.


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## LonV

aztivo said:


> Lon let me know I called the Baseline one last night and they had no idea what I was talking about.. and it was 830 so I couldnt get there much before 9.. SO let me know when you can


aztivo, I checked Baseline didn't see anything (but didn't ask around). I drove over to the Thunderbird location and didn't see anything, asked around, asked more people, and finallly found one that they were going to use as a floor model (not yet opened)...I bought it.

The guy did mention that he thought they only got 2 in and based on the other posts, I would say I was #2.

Did you cancel your order with Tivo? If for some reason, my tivo.com order actually does shows up today, you're more than welcome to drive to Chandler to buy it from me.


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## aztivo

LonV said:


> aztivo, I checked Baseline didn't see anything (but didn't ask around). I drove over to the Thunderbird location and didn't see anything, asked around, asked more people, and finallly found one that they were going to use as a floor model (not yet opened)...I bought it.
> 
> The guy did mention that he thought they only got 2 in and based on the other posts, I would say I was #2.
> 
> Did you cancel your order with Tivo? If for some reason, my tivo.com order actually does shows up today, you're more than welcome to drive to Chandler to buy it from me.


I live in Chandler and I have one coming from CC that will be here monday (I already have tracking info from Fed EX) and I did not cancel the one from tivo as I want to see if it realy ships today. Thanks for the offer though  :up:


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## gwsat

Dark Helmet said:


> I am curious about what other Cox customers are seeing in terms of total fees for two CableCARDs.


I am now convinced that there is no definitive way to know for sure how much any additional service will cost until you get your bill. As I indicated in an earlier post, three calls to Cox OKC produced three separate answers as to how much the addition of two new CableCARDs would add to the monthly bill. I guess we have to live with the immutable fact that cable company reps are universally clueless and unreliable.


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## MickeS

gwsat said:


> I am now convinced that there is no definitive way to know for sure how much any additional service will cost until you get your bill. As I indicated in an earlier post, three calls to Cox OKC produced three separate answers as to how much the addition of two new CableCARDs would add to the monthly bill. I guess we have to live with the immutable fact that cable company reps are universally clueless and unreliable.


And that cable companies so far apparently hardly ever deal with CableCARD customers.


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## gwsat

Actually, when I inquired about CableCARDs a couple of months ago after I bought a second HDTV, which had a CableCARD slot, the reps knew what it was but couldnt agree on what it would cost. I had the same problem trying to find out how much a second HD DVR would cost, although Cox OKC has had them for more than two years. You are about as likely to get a right answer from a Cox rep about anything as you are if you ask somebody on the street.


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## jasonpot

Cox Las Vegas

Ordered 2 cable cards, they said it would be $60 to install them both and $1.99 @ monthly.

Minus the $4.95/month to rent their box but plus $6.00 for the "HD Tier"


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## djones18

I'm with Cox, Fairfax County, Virginia and have two Cox HD/DVRs which I'd dearly love to swap for Series 3 units (when I can afford them). To clarify how Cox will deal with Series 3 customers, I sent them the following:

Subject: Cablecards and newly released TIVO HD/DVR. 

TIVO Series 3 HD/DVR boxes started selling this week. It replaces your Cox HD/DVR cable box (for those who rent them) or requires digital HD service (for those who don't). Cox customers need to understand your pricing structure and installation procedure/costs to implement this capability. Many people are getting differing pricing depending on which customer representative answers the call. Could you please provide an answer for Fairfax County? Questions include: 

1. How much to install the two cablecards into a TIVO Series 3 and activate the cards? Can they be self-installed (like your cable boxes)? If not, why not? 

2. Monthly rental cost of the two cablecards? Are you charged a single "Digital Gateway" charge (as for current Cox HD/DVR) or are you charged two "Gateway" charges per month? How much are those charges? 

Your answer will be posted to all applicable internet forums. Thank you.


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## boomvader

LonV said:


> aztivo, I checked Baseline didn't see anything (but didn't ask around). I drove over to the Thunderbird location and didn't see anything, asked around, asked more people, and finallly found one that they were going to use as a floor model (not yet opened)...I bought it.
> 
> The guy did mention that he thought they only got 2 in and based on the other posts, I would say I was #2.
> 
> Did you cancel your order with Tivo? If for some reason, my tivo.com order actually does shows up today, you're more than welcome to drive to Chandler to buy it from me.


I got the other one. Box was dusty... There weren't any by the other Tivos. I asked and they pointed me to the sales area next to the plasma/lcds. There were two. I grabbed one. 

Was also able to do the VIP lifetime transfer.

COX is on their way... Hope they are not being shipped by Tivo! LOL!

-boom


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## LonV

boomvader said:


> I got the other one. Box was dusty... There weren't any by the other Tivos. I asked and they pointed me to the sales area next to the plasma/lcds. There were two. I grabbed one.
> 
> Was also able to do the VIP lifetime transfer.
> 
> COX is on their way... Hope they are not being shipped by Tivo! LOL!
> 
> -boom


Yeah, cox should be here this afternoon too. I'm as giddy as a school girl...who now owns...2 HD tivo that really only needs one.


----------



## aztivo

Boom and LonV let us know how the install goes. (you bastards)  and I now have to wait till tuesday to get cox out here Damn it


----------



## LonV

aztivo said:


> Boom and LonV let us know how the install goes. (you bastards)  and I now have to wait till tuesday to get cox out here Damn it


Cox, just called and there gonna be here in a few minutes...I'll give you an update after he leaves.


----------



## LonV

Okay, Cox guy just left. He was surprised that it was going into one unit, but grasped the 2 tuner concept right away and thought it was pretty cool. The install of the cards is pretty much a no brainer....although he did read TiVo's instructions just to make sure he did it to their specifications.

He called for activation and the girl he talked to said she was "freaked out to set one up" (because she hadn't done it yet). Although she did say that they had sent an email about the the Series 3 to the other folks about setting these up...so at least that wasn't a surprise. After a few key presses later (which actually took about 15 minutes)...bing, it was all setup and working.

I really expected someone along the way to give me some grief about returning their DVR and using a TiVo with CableCards, but from the person I placed the order with, through the install guy and his counterpart back at the office...it was argument free and completely painless.

I hope everyone's experience is the same! I'll post my impressions on the new unit after I spend a few minutes tinkering.

--Lon

P.S. -- As a side note, I used my wireless connection that I had for my XBOX and it worked beautifully.


----------



## boomvader

LonV said:


> Cox, just called and there gonna be here in a few minutes...I'll give you an update after he leaves.


LOL! The COX tech is here.... so far, so good. We are going through Guided Setup. Looks like the Cable cards are tied to the model number and NOT any unique number on the Tivo. Good to know!!


----------



## timmetro69

LonV said:


> Okay, Cox guy just left. He was surprised that it was going into one unit, but grasped the 2 tuner concept right away and thought it was pretty cool. The install of the cards is pretty much a no brainer....although he did read TiVo's instructions just to make sure he did it to their specifications.
> 
> He called for activation and the girl he talked to said she was "freaked out to set one up" (because she hadn't done it yet). Although she did say that they had sent an email about the the Series 3 to the other folks about setting these up...so at least that wasn't a surprise. After a few key presses later (which actually took about 15 minutes)...bing, it was all setup and working.
> 
> I really expected someone along the way to give me some grief about returning their DVR and using a TiVo with CableCards, but from the person I placed the order with, through the install guy and his counterpart back at the office...it was argument free and completely painless.
> 
> I hope everyone's experience is the same! I'll post my impressions on the new unit after I spend a few minutes tinkering.
> 
> --Lon


Very cool! Congratulations.

I have Cox coming out tomorrow afternoon to do the same thing, so it's great to know that they are able to make it happen without a hitch.


----------



## LonV

boomvader said:


> ...Looks like the Cable cards are tied to the model number and NOT any unique number on the Tivo. Good to know!!


There is a Host ID...which I would think is unique to the box...but maybe not.


----------



## Blackbag

timmetro69 said:


> Very cool! Congratulations.
> 
> I have Cox coming out tomorrow afternoon to do the same thing, so it's great to know that they are able to make it happen without a hitch.


Hey timmetro69,

If you don't mind, could you post how the Las Vegas Cox install goes. I have one scheduled for Tuesday, which my wife will be handling, since I'll be at work. Hopefully the tech knows what he's doing, because my wife is clueless when it comes to anything with electricity running through it.


----------



## LonV

Hmmm, well after doing a reset on the device the CableCards stopped working.  Also, now I'm on the phone with Cox Technical support and they are really confused with the whole CableCard thing. I'm getting responses of "we don't support TiVo", "there may be compatibility issues"....now these are the responses I was expecting to get from Cox! 

Luckily, although I forgot it when I called tech support, the installer gave me his cell number to call him if I had problems....will do that next.


----------



## LonV

Crisis averted!  After a long on hold wait, he let me know he sent out a "pairing hit" and all was well in the world again.

He then also stated, that he hadn't heard yet when I was first on the line, but "yes they do support TiVo now, that just became official yesterday". So go figure.


----------



## aztivo

well I am glad it all worked out this is something we will all have to watch out for


----------



## lasergecko

I spoke with a Cox rep on the way to work today. It was actually exactly what I expected and not surprising at all since Cox has *always* charged for "digital service" on a per device basis. We thought about adding a digital box for my daughter's room a couple of years ago. I cancelled it when I found out that the box rental and service for the box were two seperate items. (I thought that we paid one fee for "digital service" for the entire house, but oh, nay, nay! 'Twas not to be.)

I will be returning the Cox HD DVR and my Digital box to the installer. Instead of renting those, I will be renting two CableCards for $1.99 each and paying for digital service for each one.

(CSR said service the second one was $4.95 per month or something to that effect.)

So, deduct the equipment rental fees and DVR service fee, add the $3.98 to rent two CableCards, and maintain the two "digital" service fees that I already have, and I will save about $20 per month. That will easily amortize the Lifetime subscription change fee.

The only thing surprising about the call was that she wanted to be sure that the tech sent out "HiDef CableCards". I didn't _expect_ her to know anything about Series 3, so I wasn't surprised when she didn't understand that it took two CableCards.


----------



## LonV

aztivo said:


> well I am glad it all worked out this is something we will all have to watch out for


I've been running good ever since then (even restarted just to see if it would happen again) and all is good.

It's been a while since I've had a TiVo, I switched to a Scientific Atanta 8300HD from a DirecTiVo. Let's just say I would hump my new Series 3 if I didn't think it would de-value it! 

It's so nice to be able to actually do simple things like search for programs, have multiple weeks worth of guide data, oh and having it actually record all of my programs will be nice too.


----------



## boomvader

LonV said:


> It's so nice to be able to actually do simple things like search for programs, have multiple weeks worth of guide data, oh and having it actually record all of my programs will be nice too.


Amen, brother.


----------



## LonV

boomvader said:


> Amen, brother.


Oh, and my pesonal favorite: Being able to watch the beginning of a program that's currently being recorded and NOT have it jump to the end of the show when it stops recording.


----------



## gwsat

I had decided that I would not buy an S3 after all when I learned that it would not support the increased functionality of the Ver. 2.0 CableCARD. But the reminders in the preceding posts of how great the TiVo software is, and, by inference, how primitive the SA software is, has made me start to reconsider.


----------



## LonV

Yeah, it's absolutely night and day.


----------



## lasergecko

Well, it's a software based product. Upgrades are always possible.

I just bought one from Ultimate Electronics! It was the easiest sale that Dale will make today. Funny thing, though. It took him a little while to find it in the warehouse.

"They didn't tell me the new ones were in BLACK boxes."

Ultimate Electronics on Rainbow in Las Vegas still has one in stock.


Cox can't be out until Wednesday, though. :-(


----------



## reh523

dkroboth said:


> I think I might have to evaluate my home purchase decision on the supportability of the Series 3 by the local cable company. It's that crazy? You betch.


  Okay forgo the biggest investment most people make in there entire lives, over a difference of 1.50 for a cable card or 7.50 for a cable card?

Dude its television......... Think about it?


----------



## timmetro69

I'm happy to report that I had a very good experience with my Cox Las Vegas CableCard install this afternoon.

The installer actually showed up about 45 minutes early, which was fine with me. He didn't really flinch when I showed him the S3, all I had to do was show him the CableCard slots and he was off. 

He was on site about 25 minutes and everything checked out perfectly when he left. I re-ran Guided Setup afterwards and I've been running about nine hours now and everything is just like I'd hoped. 

I've been happily recording two HD shows at a time ever since. Hope everyone else has the same experience.


----------



## lasergecko

What was the cost?


----------



## timmetro69

lasergecko said:


> What was the cost?


My cost was $30 each for the card install and $1.99 each per month. I returned my 8300HD so my net monthly bill goes down about six bucks, but it will take me ten months to break even after the install fees.


----------



## sparkomatic

Has anyone in the LA/Orange County area gone through a cable card install yet? I have my appt for Wed but am trying to get an earlier appt.


----------



## jodell

My Cox OC install is Tuesday. I will post my experiences. Hopefully they are as good as some of the others recently posted.

Jeff


----------



## proudpapa

timmetro69 said:


> I called and scheduled a cable card install through Cox Las Vegas on Tuesday right after I ordered my S3. The rep was a little confused at first when I requested two, and she actually started to say that she'd only put one on the order but the tech "should" have two with him. I said I'd be much more comfortable if the order specifically stated two cards, which she eventually did without much issue.
> 
> The cost per card is $1.99/month, and the install/truck roll charge is $30/card. In the end, I actually save about six dollars a month after you take away the $10/month for my current 8300HD DVR (which sucks).
> 
> My install is scheduled for Saturday afternoon. Hopefully my S3 arrives on Friday as expected.


Now I'm really confused - I live in Henderson, NV - just outside Las Vegas and I was quoted $13.98 for 2 cards per month + $60 to roll truck !


----------



## DanGordon

is there such a thing as a hi def vs a non hi def cable card ?

i am thinking of getting a tivo series 3 and i need to know when i call cox

i am sorry if this is a dumb question

thanks,
dan


----------



## dt_dc

DanGordon said:


> is there such a thing as a hi def vs a non hi def cable card ?


No ... there is no such thing as an "HD CableCard" vs. an "SD CableCard".

A CableCard is a CableCard and when it comes to HD vs. SD.

Just for kicks ... you could ask for a Multistream CableCard. The CSR probably won't know what the heck you're talking about ... but hey ... you can ask.

Note: In theory, a single multistream cablecard could be used instead of two single stream cablecards ... but AFAIK no cable companies are deploying multistream cablecards yet so for now ... that's just a theory.


----------



## DanGordon

so i assume, when they say hi def , they are asking about the service, not the hardware ???

also if one could get a multi stream card....

and since it has 2 slots, could you do 4 recordings at once ???

also can you currently record pause and watch live tivo on 2 hi def channels at the same time ?


----------



## JeffDan

I finally got my Tivo in this morning, not exactly next day air but then Tivo apologized already and refunded the charge for shipping so I am happy with everything so far.

I called Cox Fairfax and have it scheduled for the cable cards on Wednesday 9/20 between 3&5. Normally they show on time, hopefully he won't be too early. It's kind of hard to explain to the boss why I want to leave early that day. 

Talking to the sales rep wasn't too fun. I think I went over that I wanted to turn in one cable box for two cable cards about 5 times before she gave up and just wrote up the ticket like I told her to. My experience with thier techs have been good so far The last one spent quite a long time to finally determine that my cable line was bad because the cable had degraded itself, and then proceeded to run my very own line to the main box instead of sharing with my condo neighbors. 

I hope my install goes as well as the others, I leave the next day for a week trip and need the dual tuner! Too many interesting new shows and all at the same time! 

-Jeff


----------



## dt_dc

DanGordon said:


> so i assume, when they say hi def , they are asking about the service, not the hardware ???


Yes, probably.


DanGordon said:


> also if one could get a multi stream card....
> 
> and since it has 2 slots, could you do 4 recordings at once ???


No. CableCards are only one part of the equation. The multi-stream cards aren't even limited to two streams ... a single multistream can support four or five streams. But, you also need hardware / functionality in the host (S3). The S3 is set up to allow recording 2 shows at once ... so ... that's what you're going to get (with two single stream cards or one multistream cards).


DanGordon said:


> also can you currently record pause and watch live tivo on 2 hi def channels at the same time ?


Yes, you can record two high definition shows at the same time. The exception would be if you only have one single stream card installed. Right now, if you have one single stream card installed, the S3 will revert to a "single tuner" mode where you can only record one thing at a time (SD or HD, doesn't matter).


----------



## Dark Helmet

JeffDan said:


> I called Cox Fairfax and have it scheduled for the cable cards on Wednesday 9/20 between 3&5. Normally they show on time, hopefully he won't be too early. It's kind of hard to explain to the boss why I want to leave early that day.


Heh, I've got my CableCard install scheduled for 5-7 from Cox Fairfax on Wednesday as well. What are the odds we've got the same technician?

BTW, are you having to pay a double digital outlet fee? The CSR rep indicated to me that I would have to pay two digital outlet fees, but who knows what it's going to be when they show up?


----------



## MichaelMI

Called Cox San Diego this morning and have an appointment for Monday. The CSR put me on hold twice after I told her it was for a Tivo Series 3, but no issues with them.


----------



## JeffDan

Dark Helmet said:


> Heh, I've got my CableCard install scheduled for 5-7 from Cox Fairfax on Wednesday as well. What are the odds we've got the same technician?
> 
> BTW, are you having to pay a double digital outlet fee? The CSR rep indicated to me that I would have to pay two digital outlet fees, but who knows what it's going to be when they show up?


They said some gibberish about paying two install fees and that the monthly charge was like $2-$3. I would have questioned her more but I was at work making the call and didn't have much time and also it didn't sound like she really had any idea what she was talking about. So I will start with the tech when he comes and sees it is just the one box they are going in. I am hoping he will have a better understanding of how it will work. I am sure Cox will try to nickel and dime me to death on this, but I can't have sattelite, I have a huge building blocking any antenna reception, and I just can't go back to standard tv!


----------



## Donbadabon

Thanks guys for posting this info. I too am using Cox Fairfax, and will have to deal with them once my TiVo arrives (I am in the lucky 200, grrr). So I am very interested in how smoothly your installs go.


----------



## jodell

Overall I was a little frustrated with the ordering process (two digital outlet fees and two install charges, of which one was credited back to me) but I am quite happy with the install process.

I posted my Cox Orange County install experience here: http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4393159#post4393159

Jeff


----------



## IdecideTV

Succussfully installed 2 cable cards from New England Cox ( I live in Connecticut). I did have problem explaining anything new like cable card supported device to the cox CSR in the past, ex. I did have a series 2 Tivo and "34" Sony WEGA HDTV with a HD tuner and cable card support" and a set top box from Cox as well. When I called them about 6 months back to order a cable card, I had hard time explaining them to have a cable card in addition to cable box, they were trying to convince me that either I can have a Set-top box or a cable card, I was not successful at all in explaining about the TV feature, like 7 Video inputs are equalent to 7 TVs/ Tv Input sources.

So this time when called to order and schedule an appointment for the cable cards, I didn't mention anything about Tivo, I just told them that I need two cable cards and the CSR asked that whether it is for two new HDTVs ? I said Yes, the rep showed up today, he was the one installed my prevous cable card for the TV, So he sort of know me. ( I also explained him during his last visit, that I would be getting a Tivo Series 3 in the future and he should help me with the cable cards). I just gave him the instruction sheet, we just followed the instruction. Cable card 1 did go through without any problem. Cable card 2 did not receive digital content, but appeared to be a problem in their end, he was on the phone with their office about 10 mins while they were setting up the card 2 again) thats it in 15-20 minutes I got it working. The only problem I am having is that series 2 tivo remote interfere with the new box as well, I want to keep the series 2 too. To use as third tuner for analog channel recording when my two tuner is busy with HD content.


----------



## JeffDan

The tech just left. This was his first HD Tivo and didn't realize they had come out with it. It took about 15 minutes to get it all set up and now he is off to probably do some more installs and get the Tivo for himself.

I am doing the guided setup right now, so fingers crossed I was still be running in a half hour.

Forgot to ask about the prices! D'oh! Just too happy to have it all running I just plain forgot to ask.


----------



## sparkomatic

My install in Irvine went well too. Took about an hour in total. One thing that threw him (and myself) was that when the CC was first inserted, he went to get the information off the card through one of the screen menus and it wasn't coming up. He thought it was a bad card and we tried swapping cards, rebooting, etc. When he went to call in, the information popped up on the screen. Turns out you have to wait a few minutes for the Tivo to pull the info (MAC, device ID, etc).

The second card I think was bad cause the premium channels wouldn't come through. He swapped it out and all was good.

He said they had a meeting this morning and were talking about the S3 and to be prepared for these types of installs going forward.

The tech was very thorough and made sure all my channels were working on both cable cards before he left. He seemed to like the Tivo alot... wonder if he went to go buy one after he left...ha ha


----------



## moyekj

sparkomatic, I'm in Orange County area as well. I've been trying to find out exactly what the cable charges are. The logical plan is:
- Turn in the Cox DVR to save $9.95/month for box rental + $4.95/month DVR service fee
- Cablecards rent for $1.99 each but the 2nd one carries a 'additional outlet' fee of $1.49
- Continue paying the digital cable service

Does that sound right? I've heard different stories from different Cox markets so trying to figure out exactly what the costs involved are.
Thanks


----------



## sparkomatic

moyekj said:


> sparkomatic, I'm in Orange County area as well. I've been trying to find out exactly what the cable charges are. The logical plan is:
> - Turn in the Cox DVR to save $9.95/month for box rental + $4.95/month DVR service fee
> - Cablecards rent for $1.99 each but the 2nd one carries a 'additional outlet' fee of $1.49
> - Continue paying the digital cable service
> 
> Does that sound right? I've heard different stories from different Cox markets so trying to figure out exactly what the costs involved are.
> Thanks


Sounds right to me. I'm about to turn in my 2nd Cox cable DVR box for just a regular HD box so I'll probably ask them about the cable cards when I do.


----------



## Dark Helmet

So, Cox Fairfax was here (late, but hey, at least he made it).

The guy had never seen a S3 before, but we gamely went through and figured out the instructions. First CableCARD he tried was dead (the S3 saw that it was inserted, but it just said that the card wasn't working properly). The second and third ones he tried seemed to work ... but I could only tune a few channels (a few of the network HD ones). Mind you, it KNEW about all of the channels, but the other ones just got a blank screen when they were tuned. The guy said, "Well, sometimes it takes up to a half hour to get all of the channels downloaded" (whatever THAT means).

I went to dinner. When I came back, CableCARD 1 works perfectly. CableCARD 2, however, has not changed it's state. I called Cox, and they tried "sending a few signals", which had no effect. So they scheduled a technician to come out and possibly try another card.

I guess my mistake was not insisting that all of the channels were working. Somehow, I feel like that second CableCARD is working, but it's just not initialized correctly somewhere at Cox. But at least Cox is willing to fix it.

BTW, has anyone noticed that after a reboot it takes a few minutes to get the CableCARDs to sync up with the headend?


----------



## jodell

Dark Helmet, 

After a reboot it seems to take a minute or two for the card to receive the authorization packets across the cable network. 

Your problem with card two is very likely a setup problem. I had a few minutes with the exact same situation as yours. It turned out that the technician at the head end had not "balanced" the subscriptions. Basically, they authorized the card for for the basic channels but not for the premium channels. Another call to support should fix you right up. 

Jeff


----------



## proudpapa

COX came out this morn. inserted the cards and within minutes data came back on the screen - he gave two sets of #'s to his Ofc. and within minutes all channels were displaying. No extra cards reqd. Even with testing, took abt 45 minutes, All seems to be working fine now - almost too easy.


----------



## Dark Helmet

jodell said:


> Dark Helmet,
> 
> After a reboot it seems to take a minute or two for the card to receive the authorization packets across the cable network.
> 
> Your problem with card two is very likely a setup problem. I had a few minutes with the exact same situation as yours. It turned out that the technician at the head end had not "balanced" the subscriptions. Basically, they authorized the card for for the basic channels but not for the premium channels. Another call to support should fix you right up.


Thanks for the suggestion; I did give them another call. The guy found out that the card was still listed in the database as being tied to another host ID, which wasn't either one of the Host ID's for the TiVo. He reset that, unpaired and re-paired the card. However, that didn't fix it. The install tech said that sometimes the cards take a while to "download the channels", whatever that means. At worst, I have a tech coming out on Saturday to replace the card with another one. Maybe tomorrow all of the channels will be tuning on that card.

It's an odd mix which aren't available ... some of the SD channels are there, and some of the HD channels are there. Weird things, like a block of channels around Cartoon Network aren't available. But other "expanded basic" channels are there.


----------



## votsgirl

I bought my series 3 through Circuit City. Cox (Chandler, AZ) came today to install the cable cards. We have only been able to get card 1 to work. card 2 knows all the channels I should be seeing but only displays video for channels 1-99 (which is displayed with or without the card in place). We tried everything to get card #2 to work--he called the office to send a signal, verify the host, we rebooted, reran setup. Nothing has worked. 

We tried switching cards and card #2 worked correctly in slot 1, and card #1 did not work in slot 2. At this point I'm thinking there is something wrong with Tivo's slot #2. I called Tivo support but they were no help. Will be returning this Tivo tomorrow and getting another one to try. If the same problem occurs, its time to call the cable company again .


----------



## ehardman

I am located in Kansas and I just called Cox to arrange for the install. The CSR tells me the cards have to be ordered and will take about a week to get them. 

Is this possible? Do I need to play CSR roulette?


----------



## Mitch71

Quick question re: Cox CC install. I've had my S3 since Fri pm, today is first Cox appt avail. The suspense is killing me. Unfortunately, I'm at work, my wife is meeting them, but doesn't really get TiVo at all.

After the Cox rep follows TiVo's instructions for the install, what is the easiest way for my wife to confirm that both cards are working properly before letting the Cox tech leave? 

I'm hoping she doesn't have to go through the whole guided setup while he's waiting there... At the same time, I'm worried that if they leave before it's working correctly, we may have to wait another week to get them back out.

Any recommendations appreciated...


----------



## Dark Helmet

Mitch71 said:


> Quick question re: Cox CC install. I've had my S3 since Fri pm, today is first Cox appt avail. The suspense is killing me. Unfortunately, I'm at work, my wife is meeting them, but doesn't really get TiVo at all.
> 
> After the Cox rep follows TiVo's instructions for the install, what is the easiest way for my wife to confirm that both cards are working properly before letting the Cox tech leave?


Under the generic CableCard menu (the one that pops up when you insert/remove a CableCard), there's a "Configure CableCard 1" and "Configure CableCard 2" menu entries. Under those ones are "Test Channels". What you want to do is under each CableCard make sure you can tune ALL of the channels that you want. That was my mistake ... I didn't do that. Arguably the tech should have done that, but he wasn't quite the sharpest knife in the drawer.


----------



## jhonaker

ehardman said:


> I am located in Kansas and I just called Cox to arrange for the install. The CSR tells me the cards have to be ordered and will take about a week to get them.
> 
> Is this possible? Do I need to play CSR roulette?


I'm in VA, andit took about a week to schedule my install... it's possible it was because they had to get the cards, but I don't know. It seems like a lot of folks in here are reporting about a week to get their ccs installed.


----------



## jhonaker

votsgirl said:


> I bought my series 3 through Circuit City. Cox (Chandler, AZ) came today to install the cable cards. We have only been able to get card 1 to work. card 2 knows all the channels I should be seeing but only displays video for channels 1-99 (which is displayed with or without the card in place). We tried everything to get card #2 to work--he called the office to send a signal, verify the host, we rebooted, reran setup. Nothing has worked.
> 
> We tried switching cards and card #2 worked correctly in slot 1, and card #1 did not work in slot 2. At this point I'm thinking there is something wrong with Tivo's slot #2. I called Tivo support but they were no help. Will be returning this Tivo tomorrow and getting another one to try. If the same problem occurs, its time to call the cable company again .


So if the card itself is fine, and the tech knew enough to get the cards enabled... the only thing I can think of is card #2 is the top slot, and card #1 is the bottom slot. The instructions are pretty clear about installing card #1 (the bottom one) first.

Do you know if the tech put the bottom card in first? I don't know if it would make any difference or not. Do you still have both cards and the phone #s to activate them, so you can try again to see what happens?


----------



## jodell

votsgirl, 

The problem doesn't seem like a bad TiVo, but rather a setup problem with the cable cards. Each card must be authorized to give you access to specific channels. It seems like a frequent problem where the tech provisioning the card "forgets" to add all of the authorizations. It took three attempts to get both cards working in my install. Luckily, all of the work is at the head end. 

In my experience, the channels either work or not. They do not "trickle in over a few hours" so don't buy that BS from the tech. 

Jeff


----------



## RoanokeHokie

I called Cox (Orange Co.) this morning to trade my DVR for 2 CableCARDs. I took the first "available" appointment slot, which is next Tuesday.

At first the rep. didn't seem to know about the "CableCARD" device. I threw out "digital cable ready", "TiVo', and "two CableCARD slots", which seemed to get it in the right direction. (Add in the obligatory "but you can't get VOD with the cards" statement from the rep. here.) He claimed that he could put only 1 CableCARD into the service call, and that he couldn't make a note that I needed 2.

After the appointment was set, he transferred me to "Video Technical Support" to see "if _ can have multiple CableCARDs." Video support, though, said they aren't involved until the cards are installed. (What a shock!) They wanted to transfer me back to sales, but I told them sales forwarded me to them. I said that if they wanted to send be back to sales, that I wanted them to announce the call (to sales) so that they wouldn't just send me back. 15 minutes later, the video support tech asks if they can have a callback number - no, no calls for me at work, but I offered them an e-mail address. Video tech said they'd e-mailed the sales rep. to tell him to "add the second card" and that I should get an e-mail later to confirm the change.

Of course, this is Cox... I expect a tech on Tuesday to come to claim my DVR box and nothing else. *laughs* We'll see, and I'll update as I get more info._


----------



## jshore

jhonaker said:


> So if the card itself is fine, and the tech knew enough to get the cards enabled... the only thing I can think of is card #2 is the top slot, and card #1 is the bottom slot. The instructions are pretty clear about installing card #1 (the bottom one) first.
> 
> Do you know if the tech put the bottom card in first? I don't know if it would make any difference or not. Do you still have both cards and the phone #s to activate them, so you can try again to see what happens?


I had similar issues with both Slot #1 and Slot #2 not displaying any other channels besides 1-99. The Cox Phoenix tech tried putting in a new cable from the wall, boosting signal, etc. Turns out that it was definitely something on their end, because when it suddenly started working as he was on phone with person at Cox, he said it was because the two cards were entered wrong into the system. Not sure what that meant, but when whoever was on the other end of the phone with the tech entered the cards correctly into their system, the digital channels magically started working.


----------



## votsgirl

The saga continues... Since Cox Cable Phoenix could not get the cablecard to work correctly in slot#2 and thought there might be something wrong with the Tivo slot #2, I went ahead today and exchanged my Tivo for a new one. 

I put the cablecards in my new tivo unit and called Cox to change the host id's on them and do another synch. That was completed on Cox's side, but neither card will authorize. I have called Cox several times today to see if I can get someone on the phone that will confirm that the host id's and serial numbers are set up correctly and customer support will not help me and told me I need to schedule someone to come over to fix them. One non-helpful Cox representative told me that the cablecards don't use a host id and there's nothing they do on their side to make these cards work  . He also said that they have a memo on their desk instructing them that they ARE to support Tivo but to warn customers to not remove the CableCards from the slots once they are activated and working. Waiting for the cable guy to come tomorrow morning and strong arm the main office to set these cards up right. If that doesn't work--then i give up--back to directv!

UPDATE---
Success!!! The cable man came today and worked with the office to get the cards working.


----------



## votsgirl

jhonaker said:


> So if the card itself is fine, and the tech knew enough to get the cards enabled... the only thing I can think of is card #2 is the top slot, and card #1 is the bottom slot. The instructions are pretty clear about installing card #1 (the bottom one) first.
> 
> Do you know if the tech put the bottom card in first? I don't know if it would make any difference or not. Do you still have both cards and the phone #s to activate them, so you can try again to see what happens?


The cable guy followed the tivo provided instructions to the letter. He definitely put the first card in slot #1 (the lower slot). I have since replaced the unit with a new one but now cox can't get the cards to even auth.


----------



## Goofball

Cox Phoenix (Peoria, AZ) came out and installed my cards today. Everything is up and running and I am getting all of the channels I requested.

The installer only had 2 cards with him and was only expecting a single card TV style install so if you are ordering and have to deal with a truck roll make sure they note on the work order that the installer needs to bring 2 cards and a couple of spares and that the install is for a TiVo that uses 2 cards. This was the installers first TiVo and he was surprised at the whole thing. Cox might want to at least put a note out to the activation and installation techs so they are aware of the Series3... 

The installer was able to get one card up and running immediately but the other was dead (kept insisting it needed to download firmware). He ended up calling another tech in the area and getting a couple of spare cards from him. The next one he tried after getting back from picking the cards up worked no problem.

I was getting tiling and signal loss on some of the digitals but an amp behind my media cabinet fixed that no problem. Before the amp I was in the low 70s according to the onboard signal meter on the channels that were tiling, now with the amp they are up in the mid 90s. I wish Cox would finish up with the digital simulcast conversion in this area so that I don't have to set all my season passes up on the 800 series test channels that may or may not stay where they are since I get some ugly noise on some of the analogs now with the amp.

Reran the guided setup and have been sitting on my ass watching InHD and DiscoveryHD for the last couple of hours. I can't wait for this weekend and getting the NASCAR Cup race recorded in HD off of TNTHD.

Overall I am pretty happy with the whole thing and I will update if I run into any problems.


----------



## aztivo

votsgirl said:


> The cable guy followed the tivo provided instructions to the letter. He definitely put the first card in slot #1 (the lower slot). I have since replaced the unit with a new one but now cox can't get the cards to even auth.


Votsgirl dont go the regular customer service route call the 623.594.1000 get to the technical support and ask for a supervisor then they can transfer you to the cc tech group. This is a PITA but it can be done and you may have to try customer service a few times till you get someone who can help... when I had to get this done on one of my TVs it took almost an hour.

Good Luck


----------



## JeffDan

I did tell the phone rep to bring two cards a couple of times but the tech still said "I am glad I brought more than one I thought it would only be one card."

When we first put in the cards it did take a while before the screens to pop up, but you can always get to that screen throught the configure card menu and from there the Host ID menu choice. Also, the test channels is an absolute must. It allows you to tune in the channels you want to check without going through the long guided setup.

On that day (Wednesday) I was happy to remember that FOX was currently in blackout for some reason. No picture so we just skipped over that. Everything else tuned in fine.

The hardest part of the whole thing was trying to read of all of those card and host id's to the tech back at the office through those crappy little walkie talkie phones. It took a couple of readings. Make sure they remember which card they put in which slot first or they will have to pull them out and try again.

At least I hope it is all working, I left that same night on vacation after spending an hour getting all the season passes loaded. I sure hope I have more than a blank screen to watch when I get home again.

J


----------



## sondhead

OMG OMGOMG OMG OMG OMG IM going to kill myself

Cox OKC is over here right now and basically has their heads up their ass. He had to call for help. I'm going to die. This should be so easy. He won't listen to me.


Logan


----------



## ehardman

sondhead said:


> OMG OMGOMG OMG OMG OMG IM going to kill myself
> 
> Cox OKC is over here right now and basically has their heads up their ass. He had to call for help. I'm going to die. This should be so easy. He won't listen to me.
> 
> Logan


Did you give him the printed TiVo installation sheet?


----------



## sondhead

Ya. Apparantly it "looks weird"


----------



## MickeS

"It looks weird" What, no color coded connectors and arrows pointing everywhere?


----------



## sondhead

Apparantly. it's working now thank GOODNESS. I was a little scared. Do the techs really have to whine and gritch about it so much though? Get over it people! They couldn't understand why I was going with TiVo and not their own boxes. They're like well we're switching to TiVo DVRS through our system and I was just like great. I still would buy one because I'd rather own one and give my money to TiVo rather than you. Plus, this cost $800 so DO IT


----------



## ValleySooner

Glad to hear it's working for you. I have a Cox OKC install appointment set up for Tuesday. I wonder if I'll get the same installer? I'm not sure whether I should hope for that or not.


----------



## pmrowley

I am in Los Angeles/OC as well; my CCs were installed yesterday. I made the original call, and just told them that I needed 2 cable cards, and didn't bother to correct them when they confirmed two separate devices; they charge installation for each card, regardless of where they're installed.

I then stopped by my local Cox store (right down the street,) to confirm the installation. I *always* like to walk into the store because the head sales guy in the store mentioned to me the day I wanted to trade up to a HD decoder, "Oh yeah, we love it when people want to do it themselves; we don't have to schedule a truck roll. If you know what you're doing, that's great!" He then gave me a free 3-month trade-up to the DVR, and gave me their Premier Data Service to try out for 3 months for no charge, since I didn't want a truck roll. 

So, I confirmed my installation with him, and expressed some disappointment that they didn't have cards in the store so I could do the install myself and save the truck roll. Right then and there, he dropped the install charge for the second card, and dropped the DVR rental charge for the month (since I wanted to keep the DVR until we've emptied it; we have a couple of The Adventures of Sharpe to get through still...)

Installation day; the tech mentioned the meeting they had the day before, and mentioned that they had problems when they installed both cards at the same time. So he followed the instructions to the letter, we were patient and waited for the cards to initialize and get authorized one by one, then I tested the upper HD and HD Premium channels for each card. Other than a 161-4 error (ignorable) everything came up without a hitch, and the tech left after about 20 minutes. In leaving, he also mentioned that the signal coming to the Tivo was one of the strongest he'd seen, courtesy of the straight home-run to the Tivo (Cable Modem and Digital phone use the other home-run.) That probably alleviated some issues as well.

Cheers,
-P


----------



## Dark Helmet

So, as a postscript to my Cox/Fairfax problems ...

The technician came out again today (again, late like last time ... again, he said it was because he had to get extra CableCards. Whatever). It was the same technician I had during my initial install.

He popped out CableCard #2 (the one that was only tuning a subset of channels), put in a new one, called up to authorize it, and within a minute it was tuning everything. He was kind of surprised it happened so quickly, actually.

So, I don't really know if it was a bad CableCard, or a problem with the headend, but it's all working now. Goodbye, DirecTV!


----------



## lasergecko

Let's play a game!

Can you guess which of the following phrases were said by the Cox Las Vegas technician after handing the _unread_ instruction sheet back to me:

"I'm not allowed to touch a TiVo."

"CableCards don't go in da TiVo. They go in da TV."

"I'm going to have to call my boss."

"Where does the other card go?"


----------



## moyekj

I say *all of the above*


----------



## pkscout

lasergecko said:


> Let's play a game!
> 
> Can you guess which of the following phrases were said by the Cox Las Vegas technician after handing the _unread_ instruction sheet back to me:
> 
> "I'm not allowed to touch a TiVo."
> 
> "CableCards don't go in da TiVo. They go in da TV."
> 
> "I'm going to have to call my boss."
> 
> "Where does the other card go?"


The suspense is killing me. Just spill it. (I'm betting one or three) 

I'm moving to Las Vegas in January and am going to get a S3 when I get there, so I'm hoping most of these problems will be worked out in the next three months.


----------



## lasergecko

_moyekj_ wins the prize.

It took almost two hours for the install partially because the guy spent twenty minutes on the phone with a supervisor after he _refused to read the CableCard Installer Instruction Sheet_. He also kept ejecting the cards while their firmware was updating.

Moron.

Then, after all of the hassles involved with getting him to understand what to do, he hands me two pieces of paper from the cards.

*The PowerKey CableCARD Module Installation Instructions*

I will take some photos later, but they are very, very, very clearly *designed to be self-installed.*


----------



## Willin

moyekj said:


> sparkomatic, I'm in Orange County area as well. I've been trying to find out exactly what the cable charges are. The logical plan is:
> - Turn in the Cox DVR to save $9.95/month for box rental + $4.95/month DVR service fee
> - Cablecards rent for $1.99 each but the 2nd one carries a 'additional outlet' fee of $1.49


I'm in OC and getting CC installed next week. They told me $3.48/mo for each card. They didn't break the price down like that. I've read somewhere else that it is a single device and they can't charge the 'additional outlet' fee for the 2nd card.


----------



## moyekj

Willin, the $3.48 ($1.99+$1.49) per card makes sense if you are keeping a digital box (DVR or non-DVR) from them. However, if you are not keeping a box then the 1st CC should only be $1.99 since there is no 'additional outlet' fee for the 1st digital connection. Technically one could also argue that the Tivo is 1 device taking 1 outlet to have them waive the $1.49 additional outlet fee on the 2nd CC.


----------



## Jayster36

Had a cable tech out yesterday to install the CableCARDs for my new Tivo S3 in Orange County, CA. Tech didn't really blink an eye when he saw the Tivo. Put the first card in and very shortly was able to get the pairing information. Tech immediately called in and gave them the numbers that came up. The office said they activated the card. We went to the "Test Channels" options and waited for about 11 min. while the Acquiring Channels screen came up. Eventually, the Tivo said it couldn't find any channels.

I'll spare the gory details, but after changing splitters and rerunning the process multiple times (and trying different cards), there was no difference. The tech eventually (after almost 2 hrs.) threw his hands in the air and said they did all they could do.

Don't really know what the next step is. Should I call and hound Cox? Tivo? Give up and return the unit? Never thought a standards based product on a standards based system would be such a hassle.

And for this "service" I was billed $39.95 per card. I'm not quite sure how Cox can justify an $80 to dispatch a technician who has no idea to install a CableCARD - but sure did a good job wasting a Saturday afternoon.


----------



## pkscout

Jayster36 said:


> Had a cable tech out yesterday to install the CableCARDs for my new Tivo S3 in Orange County, CA. Tech didn't really blink an eye when he saw the Tivo. Put the first card in and very shortly was able to get the pairing information. Tech immediately called in and gave them the numbers that came up. The office said they activated the card. We went to the "Test Channels" options and waited for about 11 min. while the Acquiring Channels screen came up. Eventually, the Tivo said it couldn't find any channels.
> 
> I'll spare the gory details, but after changing splitters and rerunning the process multiple times (and trying different cards), there was no difference. The tech eventually (after almost 2 hrs.) threw his hands in the air and said they did all they could do.
> 
> Don't really know what the next step is. Should I call and hound Cox? Tivo? Give up and return the unit? Never thought a standards based product on a standards based system would be such a hassle.
> 
> And for this "service" I was billed $39.95 per card. I'm not quite sure how Cox can justify an $80 to dispatch a technician who has no idea to install a CableCARD - but sure did a good job wasting a Saturday afternoon.


I would start by calling TiVo's HD group. They will try and work with Cox to resolve the issue (even the issue is likely 100% on Cox's end). Barring that I would file a complaint with the FCC. Cox is required by law to support those Cablecards, and they will have to whatever it takes to get them working. No ifs, ands, or buts.


----------



## jfh3

Jayster36 said:


> The office said they activated the card. We went to the "Test Channels" options and waited for about 11 min. while the Acquiring Channels screen came up. Eventually, the Tivo said it couldn't find any channels.


If the Acquiring Channels screen took more than a minute, your cablecards are initalized or authorized properly.


----------



## Jayster36

Already got a Tivo person on the phone and arranged a conference call with Cox Communications. Once the Cox tech support was on the phone, the Tivo person went absolutely silent. I'm not sure he even said anything during the entire call other than to introduce himself. The only thing Cox was willing to do was schedule another installation appointment by one of their highly experienced techs during two hour appointment windows during my working hours. I guess I will have to wait another week (until next Saturday) and wait all day for another technician to come out, read numbers off of my TV screen and call them in. (Something Cox insists I'm not qualified to do.)

If I have to pay an $80 install fee to watch someone come out and do nothing other than sit on the phone for an hour trying to get this to work (and fail by the way), then by my calculations, Cox now owes me something in the neighborhood of $720 for my efforts.


----------



## Dark Helmet

Jayster36 said:


> Had a cable tech out yesterday to install the CableCARDs for my new Tivo S3 in Orange County, CA. Tech didn't really blink an eye when he saw the Tivo. Put the first card in and very shortly was able to get the pairing information. Tech immediately called in and gave them the numbers that came up. The office said they activated the card. We went to the "Test Channels" options and waited for about 11 min. while the Acquiring Channels screen came up. Eventually, the Tivo said it couldn't find any channels.


How many cards did they try? Two of my cards were bad (they eventually got it working, though).


----------



## Jayster36

The tech tried 3 different cards in the first slot. The results for all three were the same. We never even got to try any cards in the second slot.

What cable company are you with, Dark?


----------



## Dark Helmet

Jayster36 said:


> The tech tried 3 different cards in the first slot. The results for all three were the same. We never even got to try any cards in the second slot.
> 
> What cable company are you with, Dark?


I'm with Cox/Fairfax County (Northern VA). Hrm. It's not impossible you have a bad Tivo, you know. It _sounds_ like they did everything right. Mind you, I'm not the CableCard expert by any means ... I am only a consumer, and after a few bad CableCards they got it right. I will say that I was glad that I have a CableCard television as a fallback test device (but luckily I never had to use it). You know, I think this underscores why forcing the cable companies to use cablecards in their devices is so important ... if that was the case, they'd have a lot more experience in making CableCards work. Right now the CableCard knowledge is really hit and miss. I sure wish I knew more about the information presented on the CableCard screens.

BTW, what do you get on the signal strength meter? (I think it's under Settings->Channels, but I forget). I'm in the mid-90's.


----------



## boywaja

Just had an install from Cox Fairfax. Pretty straight forward. The tech was a nice guy and had done a tivo at least once before. 

I probably slowed him down more than anything chatting with him about the modem upgrade fiasco of a few years back, and the digital/analog simalcast . In my part of fairfax we just recently got a simalcast of channels up in the 800s. Apparently most of the rest of the county already had that.


----------



## timmetro69

pkscout said:


> The suspense is killing me. Just spill it. (I'm betting one or three)
> 
> I'm moving to Las Vegas in January and am going to get a S3 when I get there, so I'm hoping most of these problems will be worked out in the next three months.


pkscout - I'm in Vegas and I had a smooth cablecard install. The tech was only on-site about 25 minutes from start to finish and everything worked perfectly when he left, and continues to now over a week later.

Good luck.


----------



## MichaelMI

We had our install today and it went very smooth. Cox San Diego rocks!


----------



## JeffDan

I am sure you all probably hate me. I just got back from the long weekend (I left the morning after the cable card installed) and everything worked great. All my shows were recorded perfectly. 

My install went great, no issues at all. I actually came home to a phone message from the tech and just got off the phone with him. He wanted to know if I did anything special before he came out and we went over what we did step by step. It seems I am one of very few success stories for them. The most common problem was only one card working.

I didn't do anything special. The only difference we did was to pop in card 1 and then card 2 right after it. The screens finally popped up with the card info but I closed them and instead went to the card configuration menu and then host id screen. That's it, nothing else was special.

I told him to make sure he puts in the #1 card first, but I don't think that really makes a difference if you have two cards. They just want to make sure if you have one card that it is in the #1 slot.

-Jeff


----------



## ehardman

My Cox install is scheduled for in the morning. I have learned a lot from this thread so I hope to avoid the problems others have had.

I am also having them install a cable card in my Pioneer 5070 plasma. This way, I can record two channels on the Tivo Series 3 and watch a third in real time. I must be sick!


----------



## GuyInTulsa

I had my install yesterday in Tulsa, OK by the friendly Cox technician. 

I placed the call on Thursday and set an appointment for Monday afternoon. I dont remember the exact install price, but I do remember I got ½ off the second card since they were going in the same box.

The tech had a genuine interest in HD stuff and was eager to see it work as I was. He read the one page sheet provided with the TiVo and went to work. He did have to talk the person on the phone through the activation process. She had never done one where both cards went into the same device.

The whole process took about ½ an hour. That included the TiVo setup and guide download via the web. We played with it a while and when his curiosity was satisfied he left.

Nice and neat. The last install, for the Cox DVR, was much worse.


----------



## ValleySooner

My cablecards were installed today in the Cox OKC market, and I had a similar experience. When I called for my installation, the CSR said it'd be $30 to install the first card and $15 for the second one. 

Two very friendly and knowledgable techs showed up on time today to pop in the cards. They had provided cablecards for one other Tivo before, so they didn't need to look over the instructions sheet. It took about 15 minutes for the activation process to complete, but when it was done, I had program guide data and all my encrypted QAM channels available on both tuners.

I'm not sure what they'll charge me on recurring basis. As far as I know, we don't have outlet fees in OKC. However, I'm positive I'll have to pay two digital gateway fees... and don't know whether the fee goes up exponentially based on the number you have. I already had two (for $7.50) prior to the cablecard install.

Anyway, it was a positive experience overall. I only wish I could've done the install myself. I had to wait 9 days for the cards in total.


----------



## RoanokeHokie

Cox Orange County came by at 2pm (appt. was for 4-6pm, but they called early because of availability) to install CableCARDs. The technician was friendly and knowledgable, in my opinion. He also read over TiVo's instructions, then commented "seems like a normal install" and went to work. 

The technician installed both cards into the TiVo and then activated them. He had some trouble on the phone. He provided one card's information on the first call and then hung up. While we waited for the first card to activate, he mentioned that when he "saw a CableCARD install and a DVR pickup, it just seemed like a TiVo install" and so he brought 2 cards anyway. 

Just when channels showed up on the first card, he was called back for the second card's information. He provided that, confirmed my DVR pickup, and then was off the phone again. 

The first CableCARD activated fine, with all of my programming (Showtime, STARZ!, and the "HD pack") worked as expected. When the second CableCARD activated, though, none of the premiums were authorized but 'basic digital' was working. It took two more calls before the technician got the data "worked out", but when he left I had two fully functional CableCARDs with all programming. 

In the two call-backs, I took a little time to teach the Cox technician a little bit about navigation on a TiVo box. The "TiVo button" on the remote was the only real trick - hey, when I got my first TiVo box, it took me a while to realize that, too. 

It turns out it was a pretty "light" day for this technician, as his next install was another 4-6pm window. I re-started guided setup and left it on guide data download to head back to work.


----------



## gwsat

ValleySooner said:


> My cablecards were installed today in the Cox OKC market, and I had a similar experience. When I called for my installation, the CSR said it'd be $30 to install the first card and $15 for the second one.
> 
> Two very friendly and knowledgable techs showed up on time today to pop in the cards. They had provided cablecards for one other Tivo before, so they didn't need to look over the instructions sheet. It took about 15 minutes for the activation process to complete, but when it was done, I had program guide data and all my encrypted QAM channels available on both tuners.
> 
> I'm not sure what they'll charge me on recurring basis. As far as I know, we don't have outlet fees in OKC. However, I'm positive I'll have to pay two digital gateway fees... and don't know whether the fee goes up exponentially based on the number you have. I already had two (for $7.50) prior to the cablecard install.
> 
> Anyway, it was a positive experience overall. I only wish I could've done the install myself. I had to wait 9 days for the cards in total.


Thats really good news! I am pleased and relieved to learn that Cox OKCs not-often-ready-for-primetime cable guys got the job done without incident. I may bite the bullet and order an S3 and get rid of one of my 8300HDs.

I continue to think that the decision to charge two digital gateway fees for the two CableCARDs in one S3 was made by somebody who doesnt understand what the S3 is about. After all, the 8300HD has two tuners, too, but we only get charged one digital gateway fee with it. Go figure.

Requiring a service call to install CableCARDs is equally senseless, it seems to me. But sensible or not, we are stuck with it for now. As Tony Soprano says, Wadda ya gonna do?


----------



## jodell

I am waiting for my first bill after the cable card install to re-address the 2 digital gateway fee issue. I am going to use your exact argument - the DVR only has 1 gateway fee even though it has two tuners -- why is a TiVo different? 

This is probably an exercise in futility but what is the worst Cox can say? No?  :') 

Jeff


----------



## Jayster36

I've been trying to get the CableCARDs to work on Cox OC now for a week and had some really trying experiences, but I'm happy to report it is finally working.

The initial visit by a cable tech was on Saturday and it was a total waste of time. The second visit was by a senior tech today.

The visit was almost 2 1/2 hours, but it is now working perfectly. For those having similar troubles or bracin themselves for the installation I'll share what I learned.

1. Schedule your install for a weekday - I was told by both techs that the guys behind the scenes who really make this work "Digital Ops", usually only work weekdays. If problems come up during the weekend, it's much harder to get the proper technical support for the install. Trust me - the second visit was on a Tuesday - and the installer had the right guy on the phone. If you have to schedule a weekend install - make sure to ask if the high level back-end tech support people will be working that day. Don't know if every cable provider calls them "Digital Ops".

2. There are a lot of bad cable cards - Again, trust me. I've seen several posts echoing this, but I didn't believe it. How could such a high ratio of cards be bad? Well, guess what...I ran into three bad cards before this started working. The first two never registered with the cable system, the third came up but would only display basic cable stations (including basic HD channels)...but no enhanced tier proramming would come up. If this happens - have the tech check the "Conditional Access" page. This particular card indicated that it couldn't negotiate an encryption key with the cable provider (CP). When this happened, the card in slot 2 was working completely and the "Conditional Access" screen for that card indicated "Subscribed" or "Possible". Your tech may not know to look there. This is what took almost 2 hrs to figure out. Once that card was swapped for a new one, all channels came up right away. 

3. After the first good card was installed, we ran the "Test channels". It ran for almost 7 minutes and I thought for sure we were headed for another failure, but all of a sudden a screen popped up indicating that you were about to start a function that would stop programs currently recording. This is good news - it means that you've discovered channels. Never got this far on the first appointment. When the second "good" card came up and was called in by the tech - the channel testing came up after only about a minute. After that it was smooth sailing.


Anyway, it seems that although I had one of the tougher experiences, it did finally work and so far I'm happy with the results. Can't be 100% sure, but it does seem that the picture quality is better than what I got with the Motorola 6412 DVR. I've learned quite a bit about CableCARDs in the process.


----------



## jodell

Jayster,

It is good to hear that the Cox OC folks are finally getting it together. I had one of the earlier S3 installs. I scheduled my appointment on a Tuesday and had good luck. The Techs (a second arrived to learn the process) knew who to call in Digital Ops and didn't have too much of a problem getting everything working. My install took 1.5 hours if I remember correctly so it definintely could have been smoother but I will not complain.

I like everything about the S3 better than the motorola box it replaced. It is great to have a TiVo HD recorder...

Jeff


----------



## pkscout

jodell said:


> I am waiting for my first bill after the cable card install to re-address the 2 digital gateway fee issue. I am going to use your exact argument - the DVR only has 1 gateway fee even though it has two tuners -- why is a TiVo different?
> 
> This is probably an exercise in futility but what is the worst Cox can say? No? :')


Much like the stink when Verizon and Bellsouth attempted to add new fees, I think I note to the FCC indicating the cable company is providing an artificial barrier to entry for the cablecard might be in order (if a discussion with the local company doesn't work). They are, in essence, charing you a $10 a month surcharge for the cablecard to match the functionality of their in house DVR. In addition, the cable companies have been dragging their feet on the CC1.0 multistream cards, and with one of those you could decode two channels (and the TiVo supports those). So that $10 fee is also being charged because the cable company is lazy.

So really, work with the local cable office first. If that doesn't work, politely explain that you will be sharing your concerns with the FCC regarding the billing practices.


----------



## boywaja

pkscout said:


> In addition, the cable companies have been dragging their feet on the CC1.0 multistream cards, and with one of those you could decode two channels (and the TiVo supports those).
> .


not according to tivopony
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4402702&&#post4402702


----------



## pkscout

boywaja said:


> not according to tivopony
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=4402702&&#post4402702


Sorry, I'll clarify. The TiVo *hardware* supports it. Once CableLabs gets off their butts and actually allows devices to be certified to use them, then the TiVo software will be updated. Really just another example of the cable cartel and their mouth piece, CableLabs, ensuring that there will be no competition.


----------



## ValleySooner

gwsat said:


> Thats really good news! I am pleased and relieved to learn that Cox OKCs not-often-ready-for-primetime cable guys got the job done without incident. I may bite the bullet and order an S3 and get rid of one of my 8300HDs.


One follow-up from my note yesterday. When I looked at my recent activity on Cox's website, I noticed that I was billed $30 for both CableCard installations, despite being quoted $15 for the second card. I just talked to someone in billing who said the original quote was incorrect, that both are supposed to be $30. Despite that, she promptly credited my account the $15 and apologized for the confusion.

It makes sense that if you have both cards installed at the same time, the second one would be cheaper than the first. Not sure how it'll work out for you, if you do buy an S3... but thought you should be aware of that.


----------



## RoanokeHokie

Jayster36 said:


> 2. There are a lot of bad cable cards ... the third came up but would only display basic cable stations (including basic HD channels)...but no enhanced tier proramming would come up.


During my install, I had a similar issue with Card 2 in my box - it could tune analog channels (CNN, 14), digital basic channels (some Discovery channel on 100) and HD locals (KOCE, 710), but not my digital premiums (Showtime, 240) or HD tier (TNT HD, 718?). Card 1 could tune all those stations without problem.

It took the tech two calls to get it straightened out, but the card didn't need to be changed. According to my technician, being able to tune channel 100 indicated that the card was receiving downstream information correctly. I've often wondered if the large number of "bad CableCARDs" is more a sign of Cox (and other co's) inability to diagnose the problem (and, hence, keep trying more cards until the 'right settings' happen to get used) than of actual defective cards.


----------



## TiVo-rific

Jayster36 said:


> 2. There are a lot of bad cable cards - Again, trust me. I've seen several posts echoing this, but I didn't believe it. How could such a high ratio of cards be bad? Well, guess what...I ran into three bad cards before this started working. The first two never registered with the cable system, the third came up but would only display basic cable stations (including basic HD channels)...but no enhanced tier proramming would come up. If this happens - have the tech check the "Conditional Access" page. This particular card indicated that it couldn't negotiate an encryption key with the cable provider (CP). When this happened, the card in slot 2 was working completely and the "Conditional Access" screen for that card indicated "Subscribed" or "Possible". Your tech may not know to look there. This is what took almost 2 hrs to figure out. Once that card was swapped for a new one, all channels came up right away.


I had COX OC out last Friday (9/22) to install 4 cable cards in 2 S3s. The tech had not seen an S3 yet but was a nice guy and very willing to help. He brought 6 cable cards just in case. The first S3 worked without a hitch and was up and running within 20mins. He installed and activated the cards one at a time.
My second S3 was another story.
He was able to get the cards installed but none of the premium channels would work. He made a few calls and within 20 mins I had 3 trucks in front of my house including the supervisor. As it turns out, the card that they were installing had been installed before in another service area within COX OC and the provisioning information was being sent to that headend. They decided to install the last two cards and those like the first two came up within minutes and have been working since.

My only comment is that I would bet that a lot of the bad cable cards are fine and that a lack of understanding on how they work on the installers part is the problem. I am not blaming the installers. I suspect that most of the training they get is on the job unfortunately for us.


----------



## ehardman

The installer has been here for 1 1/2 hours. Card one installed OK, but card keeps coming up 161-2 (bad card). He had three cards but both the other two cards come up 161-2.

They were also here to install a cable card in my Pioneer 5070. The cox tech on the telephone told him to try one of cards with the 161-2 code in my Pioneer. Hmmmm. The first of the cards the Tivo says were bad, worked OK on the Pioneer. How can this be?

Another cox installer just brought two more cards for the Tivo. More later...


----------



## ehardman

2 1/2 hours. Four cards tried in slot 2, all report 161-2.

So, installer takes the known good card from slot 1 and installs one of the "bad" cards in slot 1. Tivo box sees the "bad" card, no 161-2 error. Now waiting for Cox to call back to provision the "bad" card. Once we get card 1 going, we will re-install the "good" card formerly in slot 1, into slot 2.

What mess! More to follow...


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## ehardman

The card originally in slot 1, the "good" card, not comes up as bad in slot 2. Cox sending out four more cards.

While waiting, called Tivo tech support again. Earlier calls said 162-2 could only be a bad card. Now they are saying my slot 2 is bad.

New cards just got here. Here we go again...

4 hours...


----------



## TreoFred

Question for anyone with COX in the OC: I've had my S3 for almost two weeks now and after two (lenghty) technician visits, I still do NOT get all my channels.

The first time, I was missing about half of my premium channels (all the pacific feeds like HBOP, etc.) and the HBO and Showtime Hd ones as I guess they are the pacific ones (DirectTv throws the East coast feed for HBO-HD and Showtim-HD so I'm not sure.) 

After the second visit, I know get all my premium channels but I've lost INHD1, INHD2, TNT-HD and UHD. 

Some people have suggested that due to the S3 Design, if those are on switched digital channels (which I'm not sure they are), it might be impossible to get it all...

So... my question to anybody with Cox Orange County: do you get EVERYTHING?

Thanks beforehand for any help!

Fred


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## ehardman

Four more "bad" cards. I guess slot 2 is not working. Tivo says I must return to Circuit City where I bought it to exchange for a new one since it is within the first 30 days. Circuit City has them in stock and I have a new coming via express shipping.

Hope your day goes better than mine!

Total time with Cox in my home, 4 hours 20 minutes.


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## RoanokeHokie

TreoFred said:


> Question for anyone with COX in the OC: I've had my S3 for almost two weeks now and after two (lenghty) technician visits, I still do NOT get all my channels. ... So... my question to anybody with Cox Orange County: do you get EVERYTHING?


I live in Irvine, and my apartment complex is served by Cox Orange County.

At first, all of my 'premium' services were showing up on only 1 of my 2 cards. On card 1, I could tune Showtime (240) and Showtime HD (740), as well as TNT HD (718). None of those would show when I tested channels on card 2 at first. I'm guessing it was a systems error, as the technician was able to call his support contact to get it fixed.

My technician wasn't in a rush, so I did ask a bit more about the system here. According to the tech, Cox has no plans to go switched-digital (which simply means this tech hasn't heard or isn't talking); he did mention, though, that Cox had recently received local permission to increase their cable bandwidth from 750 MHz to 1 GHz to provide additional services. I'm not sure how much of the OC market that applies to, though.


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## Jayster36

TreoFred said:


> So... my question to anybody with Cox Orange County: do you get EVERYTHING?
> 
> Thanks beforehand for any help!
> 
> Fred


To answer your question: Although it was painful, yes, I do now get all the channels I had before, including HBO HD, Shotime HD, TNT HD IN-HD 1&2, MusicChoice, etc. The only thing I can no longer receive is any interactive services (Channel 1), and video on demand (including sports packages such as NHL Center Ice). I know from the beginning that I wouldn't have access to those anymore and that's OK. (Cox Orange County)


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## votsgirl

ehardman--

I had the same problem with the Tivo I bought at Circuit City. Cox was not able to get the second slot of my tivo to work with several cards. We concluded there was something wrong with the Tivo and I exchanged it for a new one. I set up another service call and the Cox guy was able to get both slots working on the new Tivo in about 30 minutes.


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## ehardman

votsgirl said:


> ehardman--
> 
> I had the same problem with the Tivo I bought at Circuit City. Cox was not able to get the second slot of my tivo to work with several cards. We concluded there was something wrong with the Tivo and I exchanged it for a new one. I set up another service call and the Cox guy was able to get both slots working on the new Tivo in about 30 minutes.


Thanks for the info. Looks like Tivo has a quality control issue along with all the other problems. You would think they would test these things before they leave leave the factory.


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## moyekj

RoanokeHokie said:


> I live in Irvine, and my apartment complex is served by Cox Orange County... My technician wasn't in a rush, so I did ask a bit more about the system here. According to the tech, Cox has no plans to go switched-digital (which simply means this tech hasn't heard or isn't talking); he did mention, though, that Cox had recently received local permission to increase their cable bandwidth from 750 MHz to 1 GHz to provide additional services. I'm not sure how much of the OC market that applies to, though.


 I'm in Cox OC market as well. My (reliable) sources told me switched digital may start to happen by end of 2007 in Cox OC. It was originally slated to start early 2007 but has been delayed. I also did hear about the cable bandwidth projects and apparently digging is already underway in northern OC. Though the cable bandwidth will be 1GHz for future proofing the headend system bandwidth will be limited to 860MHz (still quite an improvement from 750MHz). Increase of around 110Mhz means about 18 more QAM 256 channels (6MHz each) which could accomodate in the neighborhood of 180-250 new SD digital channels or 40 HD channels.


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## jodell

I also can confirm that I recieve all of Cox OC's HD channels. Your problem sounds like the headend is not senging the proper authorizations to *both* cards. When I had my problems getting premium channels on card 2, the headend eventually found that they didn't "balance" both cards -- meaning they had more authorizations on card 1 than on card 2. 

Good luck,

Jeff


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## pkscout

ehardman said:


> Thanks for the info. Looks like Tivo has a quality control issue along with all the other problems. You would think they would test these things before they leave leave the factory.


You do realize that it is not possible to have a production line that yields 0% failures. Even if generally acceptable DOA rates are 1%, so if TiVo shipped 100,000 of these in the first week, 1000 of them will have some kind of problem. Shoot even at 0.5% there will still be 500 bad units out there. Just because you and some other folks on this board got a bad unit doesn't mean there is some kind of quality control issue and that TiVo did no testing on the unit.


----------



## jfh3

Nice thought, but there is NO WAY Tivo shipped 100,000 units in the first week.


----------



## pkscout

jfh3 said:


> Nice thought, but there is NO WAY Tivo shipped 100,000 units in the first week.


Fine. They've shipped 10,000 since they started. That means at least 50 bad units. The logic still holds. Just because a half a dozen people have had problems with their units doesn't mean everyone at TiVo is a moron, nobody does any testing, and they have a HUGE quality control problem.


----------



## vtrduong

Well, I got the Tivo Series 3 on the 14th. Had to wait for the cablecard installation till the 19th. I'm under Cox Fairfax. The first installer installed both cards on that date. Slot 1 works fine since it brings up my premium channels, digital cable channels, and broadcast channels. However, slot 2 only brought up my broadcast channels. Won't display HBO, Discovery, ESPN, TNT, or other cable channels. Got another technician to come out this past Tuesday evening and he switched the second card out with two other cards (that were never used before, brand new) and it still has the same problem!  So I have another technician coming out later today. But I'm thinking its the slot 2 on the tivo box that doesn't work b/c the technician from Tuesday said they've been getting a lot of people with Tivos that have the same problem that I have. What also stinks is the fact I can't go to any Best Buys around here to exchange the unit since none of them have it in stock.


----------



## jfh3

pkscout said:


> Fine. They've shipped 10,000 since they started. That means at least 50 bad units. The logic still holds. Just because a half a dozen people have had problems with their units doesn't mean everyone at TiVo is a moron, nobody does any testing, and they have a HUGE quality control problem.


I agree.

Never had a problem with your presmise, just the number. (And even 10K would be fantastic!)


----------



## ehardman

vtrduong said:


> Well, I got the Tivo Series 3 on the 14th. Had to wait for the cablecard installation till the 19th. I'm under Cox Fairfax. The first installer installed both cards on that date. Slot 1 works fine since it brings up my premium channels, digital cable channels, and broadcast channels. However, slot 2 only brought up my broadcast channels. Won't display HBO, Discovery, ESPN, TNT, or other cable channels. Got another technician to come out this past Tuesday evening and he switched the second card out with two other cards (that were never used before, brand new) and it still has the same problem!  So I have another technician coming out later today. But I'm thinking its the slot 2 on the tivo box that doesn't work b/c the technician from Tuesday said they've been getting a lot of people with Tivos that have the same problem that I have. What also stinks is the fact I can't go to any Best Buys around here to exchange the unit since none of them have it in stock.


Sounds like a balancing problem to me, not your Tivo. Read the prior posts regarding this problem.


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## Dark Helmet

ehardman said:


> Sounds like a balancing problem to me, not your Tivo. Read the prior posts regarding this problem.


I had a similar problem as the original poster (I'm also Cox/Fairfax), and nobody I spoke to (the install technician, the two CSR reps) had any idea what "balancing" meant. The only thing that fixed it was a new CableCard. I feel like maybe the problem was at the headend, but the new CableCard fixed it, so I guess I don't care. But I agree it doesn't sound like a Tivo problem ... the Tivo problems I've seen posted are where the card doesn't work at all.


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## ehardman

pkscout said:


> Fine. They've shipped 10,000 since they started. That means at least 50 bad units. The logic still holds. Just because a half a dozen people have had problems with their units doesn't mean everyone at TiVo is a moron, nobody does any testing, and they have a HUGE quality control problem.


1. _Generally acceptable DOA rates are 1%:_ Acceptable to whom? What's your source?
2. _Half a dozen people have had problems. _ Interesting number. What's your source?
3. _Moron: _ Can't find the use of this word in my post.
4. _HUGE: _ Can't find the use of this word in my post either.​
I was just responding to the post of another user with an identical problem as mine. Just seems to me there would be a diagnostic run on the machine before it left the factory.


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## vtrduong

Dark Helmet said:


> I had a similar problem as the original poster (I'm also Cox/Fairfax), and nobody I spoke to (the install technician, the two CSR reps) had any idea what "balancing" meant. The only thing that fixed it was a new CableCard. I feel like maybe the problem was at the headend, but the new CableCard fixed it, so I guess I don't care. But I agree it doesn't sound like a Tivo problem ... the Tivo problems I've seen posted are where the card doesn't work at all.


The weird thing is that when we put in the second card into slot 2, no information pops up at all. I had to manually go into the menus to get the Cable Card ID and Host ID. Also in the Cablecard CP menu, the Powerkey status says "Not Ready-Waiting for EMMs.", while for the first cablecard, it says "Ready". The Cox rep had hit the Cablecard in slot 2 to no avail. And she said that they didn't see any problems. Urghh at being an early adaptor.....


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## brage

Cox (Phoenix, AZ) came out and installed my cable cards in about 45 minutes. He tested the signal at the box outside, then at the wall plate, (it was perfect), then he installed the first card, called in and then it came up, installed the second card, called in and it came up... and been dandy ever since (this was on monday morning).

I'm very happy with my Series 3!

BTW - I also upgraded it to a seagate 750GB sata drive, it is a bit noisier than the 250GB WD drive that comes with the Series 3, but it is 3x the capacity and all 

-Jeff


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## pkscout

ehardman said:


> 1. _Generally acceptable DOA rates are 1%:_​




If you're going to get all pissy, quote stuff, and look for literal text in your posts, at least do me the honor of quoting the whole thing I said.

*Even if* Generally acceptable DOA rates are 1%.

The bold part is important. It indicates a possible scenario, not fact.

If you want to complain and claim that TiVo has done no testing and has no quality control that's fine. Just don't ***** when I call you on it.​


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## jodell

Dark Helmet said:


> I had a similar problem as the original poster (I'm also Cox/Fairfax), and nobody I spoke to (the install technician, the two CSR reps) had any idea what "balancing" meant.


When I had my "balancing" problem, what the Cable Tech meant was that the programs I subscribed to where not added equally to each cable card. Apparently, to the person doing the provisioning at the headend, each cable card looks like a separate cable box. They seem to have a problem getting all of the authorizations added to cable cards but do OK when doing the same for a *real* cable box.

Jeff


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## ehardman

pkscout said:


> *Even if* Generally acceptable DOA rates are 1%.
> 
> The bold part is important. It indicates a possible scenario, not fact.


So in otherwords, you made it up. What else did you make up? You didn't answer any of my questions.


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## Timber

Guys can you get all pissy with each other in another thread (or even better via Private Message) and leave this thread for Cox Cable Cards?

Thanks!

-=Tim=-


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## pkscout

ehardman said:


> So in otherwords, you made it up. What else did you make up? You didn't answer any of my questions.


And I am electing not to. I'm not going to get into a pissing contest with you over who is right. You believe that 1 single bad unit means TiVo is a company who is incapable of the most basic testing during the production process. I disagree with you. That's the end of that.


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## jcaudle

has anyone heard whether cox in Fairfax is going to switched digital anytime soon?


----------



## Donbadabon

Just had my Cox Fairfax install completed.

The guy showed up at 5:25, and was done by 5:55. And that included performing my Guided Setup to change over to Digital cable!

No problems at all with the CableCards. He plugged them in, started my Guided Setup, called into the office to get them activated, and by the time the Setup ended, he was off the phone. It couldn't have gone smoother.

My only issues are with 705 (Fox) and 709 (CBS). They seem to be intermittent, sometimes they show up, sometimes they don't.

Cable signal strength is no less than 98 across the board.


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## ehardman

I got my replacement Tivo from Circuity City and had Cox come for attempt #2 Friday afternoon. The same technician came again as he is now the "expert" for Cox locally. He got the replacement Tivo up and running in about 20 minutes. 

Everything went very smooth once I had a unit with two working cable card slots.


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## Dick Kalagher

Donbadabon said:


> Just had my Cox Fairfax install completed.
> 
> The guy showed up at 5:25, and was done by 5:55. And that included performing my Guided Setup to change over to Digital cable!
> 
> No problems at all with the CableCards. He plugged them in, started my Guided Setup, called into the office to get them activated, and by the time the Setup ended, he was off the phone. It couldn't have gone smoother.
> 
> My only issues are with 705 (Fox) and 709 (CBS). They seem to be intermittent, sometimes they show up, sometimes they don't.
> 
> Cable signal strength is no less than 98 across the board.


That sounds like a pretty big limitation. Have you fixed the problem. I know two of the locals on Cox are above 800MHz, but the S3 is supposed to tune there OK. Is Cox charging you a $6.99 "digital gateway" fee for each cablecard in addition to the cablecard fee?


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## Shades

Hey folks,

I'm another Fairfax Cox customer, and had my cablecards installed in the first week that the S3's shipped... when I first got them installed, everything seemed fine, and immediately thereafter I had to travel on company business. Since returning, I immediately noticed some weird things going on...

1. The primary cablecard seems to be able to get all the channels I subscribe to, though they all appear to be digital so I have no recording quality options.

2. The second cablecard cablecard seems to be able to recieve the HD channels, (and by that I mean only the "free" network HD channels), and a few of the non-HD non-network channels (like public service channels) but doesn't seem to recieve anything else. Black screen but no message about missing signal.

I called Cox and explained the issue. They said they would refresh the programming signal to both cards to make sure they both have the same channels. That didn't seem to make any difference.

I figured I'd need to get a tech out there eventually, but at least it was all working well enough on the primary tuner, so I was fine.

Now, a week later I am seeing new issues:

1. I recorded the 2nd episode of "Heroes" in HD it only recorded the last 40 minutes of the show and it was almost unwatchable due to digital artifacting and sound cutting in and out. When I could see it, the picture looked great, but it kept being broken up. When I checked the the channel on live TV (705 I think) it was doing the same thing. On the second tuner the signal seemed fine and it did not have that digital artifacts issue on any of the HD channels.

2. Today I try to record "Lost" in HD and when I turn on the TV to see if its working properly, there is just a black screen. I make sure its working, and when I hit info it tells me there is no signal. I stop the recording to check the other channels and one of the other HD channels also shows no signal, but the rest seem to be okay. I tune to SciFi (82) and it tunes properly, but now I'm seeing some of the digital artifacts on that channel now too, even tho its supposed to be analog (or it was before.) I also check with the 2nd tuner and it also does not see a signal on those two HD channels, but it still doesn't get SciFi so I check channel 8 which seems fine.

I check diagnostics and it shows my signal strengh as 65 (with lock okay) on my main tuner which is tuned to channel 82 and signal strength 0 (with lock okay) on the 2nd one, which is tuned to channel 8. When I checked yesterday, I'm pretty sure both showed signal strength of 78 on HD channels. I'm pretty sure they showed 100 when Cox first installed the cablecards.

My system is also one of those that when you go to the cablecard config menu that constantly pops in and out of diagnostic modes on its own and you have to hit the Tivo button to get back to the main menu. It won't stay on the cablecard troubleshooting menus long enough to do much. The 2nd cablecard originally was attempted to be installed in slot 1, but wouldn't initialize there... though it seemed to work fine in slot 2 after another card went into slot 1.

So, it sounds like at least one of my cablecards (probably 2nd one) is not working right or at least not accepting programming, though seems to be working fine elsewhere. It also seems like there is something funky going on with my signal strength too. I have a cable modem as well and it seems to be working fine.

Figure I should probably schedule another appt to at least try to get the 2nd card exchanged, but not sure about the rest. Any insight would be appreciated. 

Thanks!

-Darrin


----------



## Dark Helmet

Shades said:


> Hey folks,
> 
> I'm another Fairfax Cox customer, and had my cablecards installed in the first week that the S3's shipped... when I first got them installed, everything seemed fine, and immediately thereafter I had to travel on company business. Since returning, I immediately noticed some weird things going on...
> 
> 1. The primary cablecard seems to be able to get all the channels I subscribe to, though they all appear to be digital so I have no recording quality options.
> 
> 2. The second cablecard cablecard seems to be able to recieve the HD channels, (and by that I mean only the "free" network HD channels), and a few of the non-HD non-network channels (like public service channels) but doesn't seem to recieve anything else. Black screen but no message about missing signal.
> 
> I called Cox and explained the issue. They said they would refresh the programming signal to both cards to make sure they both have the same channels. That didn't seem to make any difference.


I am Cox/Fairfax as well, and I had the _exact_ same problems as you (second cablecard only tuned a few channels). The only thing that fixed it was another truck roll and a replacement card. I haven't seen anything like the other problems you reported, though.


----------



## jfh3

Shades said:


> I check diagnostics and it shows my signal strengh as 65 (with lock okay) on my main tuner which is tuned to channel 82 and signal strength 0 (with lock okay) on the 2nd one, which is tuned to channel 8. When I checked yesterday, I'm pretty sure both showed signal strength of 78 on HD channels. I'm pretty sure they showed 100 when Cox first installed the cablecards.


Get the cable company to check your signal levels (in the incoming cable).

If you are seeing only 65-80 on the Tivo meter, something's wrong.

I would expect a level of 65 to possible result in the recording/signal problems you mention.


----------



## rjrcm

Cox in Phoenix. After seeing all the problems, glad my install went reasonably well today. Took about 20 minutes including waiting for all the channels to appear. 2nd card seemed bad, but he had extras, and next one worked. Be sure that the cards are pushed in all the way - had to nudge the first one to get it connected. 

Only gripe is I was told in email that the install charge would be $34.95, but the phone and store reps told me $49.95 - said the extra $15 was to set up the HD connection - what a crock. Anyway - was in time to record Lost which worked perfectly .


----------



## pkscout

rjrcm said:


> Only gripe is I was told in email that the install charge would be $34.95, but the phone and store reps told me $49.95 - said the extra $15 was to set up the HD connection - what a crock. Anyway - was in time to record Lost which worked perfectly .


Hey, it takes extra time to setup all those extra HD bits that are being sent to your TV. Cut them some slack.  (I am totally kidding, that is a crock)


----------



## Shawn95GT

Cox Phoenix here doing mine now.

Inserting the first card put the Cable card menu in a scrolling loop. I re-booted the Tivo and was able to get in and see the Cablecard info.

Tech called it in.

Inserted #2, and the 'a cablecard was just interted' message came up. We waited a bit and just dove into the cablecard info screen so he could call it in.

The tech called in card #2.

everything worked except I wasn't getting the HD channels (well, besides the local channels). Another call from the tech, a re-hit and I was in business!

They installed 2 SA cards.

<edit>
After the techs left I lost a few random blocks of digital channels. I have a trouble ticket in to resolve the issue. 
</edit>


----------



## Shades

So, Cox was out here today to fix my problems. I already determined my signal was low, so I had removed some splitters from my cable path and added a signal booster before the tech arrived. That got my signal up to the 82-85 range which improved my reception and got rid of the mpeg tiling, but didn't help with my missing channels.

The tech arrived, and looked at the set up. Everything was still working fine on my main tuner, but the second tuner still would only pick up analog signals. He removed the remaining splitters and the signal booster from my line to be sure there was no other issues and even ran a new line from the block in my yard to be sure there was no problems with the buried cable. Everything looked fine, and my signal now was up to 92-95 on the box, but the 2nd tuner still wasn't getting digital signals.

After calling in to get the auth signal sent again with no result, he finally decided it was time to replace the 2nd cablecard as I had requested. After removing and replacing that card and going through the cablecard id call in and re-auth, it still didn't work... and in fact, now both units refuse to recieve digital signals. He removed both cards, replaced them, and no difference. Both show as Authentication Recieved and both show as operating normally in the diagnostics.

To make a long story short, its now been several hours of changing settings, and we're both out of ideas... he's called everyone he knows at Cox and nobody has any more ideas. So, we check my digital cable box that drives my old S2 TiVo and find that that one is acting weird too... he checks some stuff and it looks like there is a problem with the network since it is no longer communicating bi-directionally. So we put everything back together, the tech calls it in and then leaves. At least my signal is in the 82-89 range now without the amp, so I shouldn't have any more signal strength issues.

So, now after 4 hours of trying to get my 2nd tuner working properly, neither tuner on my S3 works with digital channels, and I have to wait for a followup service call to check into the network problems. If it doesn't suddently start working in the next day or two, I have to schedule another call to have another tech come out to work on it.

Fun stuff. 

Hopefully there isnt' a problem with my TiVo itself... even with the new cards its still doing the stuff with randomly switching diagnostic screens on its own every few seconds whenever I go into any of the CableCard diagnostic menus.

Btw, I went through the guided setup again once before when I had both cablecards installed originally, does anyone know for sure if I need to do it again with the new replacement cards? The idea was to configure the channels I recieve, but that was already done. I am hoping I don't, since I have some programming left to watch and would prefer not to have to re-do my season passes again. 

-Darrin


----------



## moyekj

Shades said:


> ...At least my signal is in the 82-89 range now without the amp, so I shouldn't have any more signal strength issues...


 Sounds a little low to me still. As a point of comparison my digital cable channels show 96-97 signal strength with S3 diagnostics. My OTA channels are in the 80s (expected since I'm 50+ miles from broadcast antennas and using indoor antenna) but OTA is usually OK to have lower signal strength based on my experience with PC tuners.


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## moyekj

Cox, Orange County, CA here. Took 3.5 hours and a lot of patience but finally both CableCards are up and running and tuning all channels I subscribe to. Here's my summary of the process for those that haven't been through the nightmare yet:

1. After installing the cablecard be patient, it takes 2 minutes or so for the CableCard MMI (CableCard Pairing) screen to come up and it will do so automatically.
2. For Cox the relevant numbers that need to be called in from the Pairing screen are: CableCard, Host, Data
(The UnitAddress number is not used - at least for Cox OC)
3. After entering the above numbers into their system this is where things went wrong for me. From the headend side the system confirms everything is correct and the CC is communicating with the headend. Following the next step in instructions it says go to the CC Test Channels section - WRONG! For 1st cablecard we waited about 30 minutes at the "Obtaining Channels" swirl screen and eventually a timeout screen appeared saying to try again. So we tried again and waited another 30 minutes or so at which point it timed out again. Then the installer goes and cuts cables, disconnects amp, re-crimps cables, etc. etc. which I assured him was all worthless and then we reboot and try with a new CC - same result.
THE KEY AT THIS POINT IS AFTER ENTERING THE CC NUMBERS ON HEADEND SIDE THEY MUST THEN PERFORM A COLD INITIATE. A few minutes after this is done you should get an error screen with 161-4 - THIS IS A GOOD SIGN THAT THINGS ARE WORKING.
4. After receiving the 161-4 error screen then everything falls into place. (In my case the Tivo froze at this point and I had to reboot). Go over to Test Channels and you have to wait a few more minutes for all proper channels to be authorized.
5. Make sure you check all encrypted channels that you care about to see they are properly authorized. In my case they had to re-hit the CC yet again for some channels to work.

6. Jump up with joy and share a beer with the installer before attempting CC #2.
7. Now you can repeat process with CC#2. I had a lot of trouble getting CC # 2 to receive some premium channels - the authentication wasn't sticking properly. Finally we found that by channeling through some unencrypted channels first in the test phase and then heading over to premium channels we got it to work, and we had a mini-party.
8. Now you should redo guided setup. I couldn't convince the installer to stay any longer at this point (after 3.5 hours) but everything went smoothly from there.

Anyway, the key takeaway is there is an additional step that must be performed from the headend after they think they have entered the numbers from the Pairing screen and their system shows the card is communicating OK. They need to do a cold restart of the card to "wake it up".

Now I have my system setup with both OTA & Cable. So far so good but only time will tell if it remains that way...


----------



## Dark Helmet

Shades said:


> So, Cox was out here today to fix my problems. I already determined my signal was low, so I had removed some splitters from my cable path and added a signal booster before the tech arrived. That got my signal up to the 82-85 range which improved my reception and got rid of the mpeg tiling, but didn't help with my missing channels.


So, some dumb questions:

What kind of amp did you buy? One that is labelled as being bi-directional?

Did you try putting terminating resistors on unused outlets?

(I admit these are both shots in the dark, but it sounds like you have some "weird" communication issues)



Shades said:


> Hopefully there isnt' a problem with my TiVo itself... even with the new cards its still doing the stuff with randomly switching diagnostic screens on its own every few seconds whenever I go into any of the CableCard diagnostic menus.


I was under the impression (but I am NOT sure) the card is "initializing" whenever
it does that. I had that problem with a bad CableCard as well.



Shades said:


> Btw, I went through the guided setup again once before when I had both cablecards installed originally, does anyone know for sure if I need to do it again with the new replacement cards? The idea was to configure the channels I recieve, but that was already done. I am hoping I don't, since I have some programming left to watch and would prefer not to have to re-do my season passes again.


I don't think you do. I think the Tivo might _suggest_ it, but I don't think it's a requirement. Also, does re-doing guided setup clear out your season passes?


----------



## moyekj

Dark Helmet said:


> I think the Tivo might _suggest_ it, but I don't think it's a requirement. Also, does re-doing guided setup clear out your season passes?


 It does not clear out your Season Passes. I Just had the CCs in tonight and all my SPs from antenna recordings are all still there. Also reportedly if you had SPs setup on antenna channels and then you disable antenna during guided setup the S3 will automatically try and match them up to channels in your cable lineup.


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## NOD

woohoo! 

The cc installation (which I scheduled 3 days after ordering on launch day) finally happened a couple of hours ago here in New Orleans, and went off w/o a hitch. It was the first one this guy had installed on a Tivo, and he said they had been briefly told about it, and that they had been told to follow the Tivo instructions. It took about an hour (in large part b/c, when the guy at the headend modified my account, he had accidentally lost the GI numbers on the 2 Motorola 6200's that I own and deleted them).

Once we got that straightened out, it only took about 20 minutes


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## moyekj

Soon after my dual CC install I noticed Universal HD (UHD) channel would just give me grey screen on either tuner. I would not get any authorization problem messages and when I press Info button it would give info on current program but no video or audio. Checking all CC & diagnostic screens did not reveal anything abnormal. So finally I went to CC Test Channels and after a while of channeling up and down all of a sudden UHD started working. I then went to Test Channels on other tuner and confirmed it was OK there. After that now that channel and all others I have tried are working properly. Weird...


----------



## pfunky

Just a heads up for anyone who already was using a CableCard in their TV before getting their S3. When my S3 arrived, I yanked the card from the TV and inserted it into the S3, and it worked. Apparently, Cox Wichita (Kansas) didn't pair the card with the TV, perhaps that's a common thing.

Saved me $30 installation charge for that card. Still have to pay the other $30 for the second card though (completely ridiculous).


----------



## ehardman

pfunky said:


> Just a heads up for anyone who already was using a CableCard in their TV before getting their S3. When my S3 arrived, I yanked the card from the TV and inserted it into the S3, and it worked. Apparently, Cox Wichita (Kansas) didn't pair the card with the TV, perhaps that's a common thing.
> 
> Saved me $30 installation charge for that card. Still have to pay the other $30 for the second card though (completely ridiculous).


In Salina, KS they charged me $49.95 total for both cards installed. I do not think they charge and install fee for each card.

FYI, I also have a CC in my TV which has its own cable feed. This way, if Tivo is recording two programs, we can still watch live TV on a third channel.


----------



## TiVo-rific

COX Orange County charges $39.95 for installation per card. I installed 4 cards into 2 S3s. When I got the bill I complained about the cost and they refunded 3 of the installation charges.


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## moyekj

TiVo-rific said:


> COX Orange County charges $39.95 for installation per card. I installed 4 cards into 2 S3s. When I got the bill I complained about the cost and they refunded 3 of the installation charges.


 I also had to call in for a correction as I was billed 2*$39.95 for CC installation - they were very courteous and understanding and changed the installation charge to the single $39.95. It's still a little unclear as to the monthly charges change but from my last talk with a CSR it was supposedly just going to be 2*$1.99 for CC rental charges (with no additional outlet fees). Shall see for sure on the bill for November.


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## pfunky

ehardman said:


> In Salina, KS they charged me $49.95 total for both cards installed. I do not think they charge and install fee for each card.
> 
> FYI, I also have a CC in my TV which has its own cable feed. This way, if Tivo is recording two programs, we can still watch live TV on a third channel.


Yup, I just got off the phone with a guy named "Silver" at Cox. He told me that cablecards are now $50 for installation. He was blaming it on gov. regulations, and that it wasn't under their control. Total BS.  ( even THIS FCC report seems to indicate that it's up to each company to set their price)

I was going to do the same, and have them insert another one back into my TV, but he told me it would be YET ANOTHER $50 for that. So I told him no for now.


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## Shawn95GT

FYI, got my 1st bill from Cox... beware of hidden fees.

Besides the cablecard fees they charge a 'digital gateway' fee per cablecard which is another $6 for the 2nd card besides the cablecard fee.

Yeah, this is 'so' much better than satellite  .

I'm paying about $10/mo than I was paying with my previous cable company and I picked up High def in the deal and lost unlimited long distance on the phone side.

Ahh well, the S3 makes it all worth it.


----------



## pkscout

Shawn95GT said:


> FYI, got my 1st bill from Cox... beware of hidden fees.
> 
> Besides the cablecard fees they charge a 'digital gateway' fee per cablecard which is another $6 for the 2nd card besides the cablecard fee.


I've been thinking about complaining to the FCC about this extra fee. If you get the Cox DVR (which has two tuners in one box), you pay only one digital gateway fee. It seems anti-competitive to charge someone with a TiVo 2 digital gateway fees for the same functionality.


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## XBR

Shawn95GT said:


> FYI, got my 1st bill from Cox... beware of hidden fees.
> 
> Besides the cablecard fees they charge a 'digital gateway' fee per cablecard which is another $6 for the 2nd card besides the cablecard fee.
> 
> ...


Their website says:


> Valid with *Limited Basic Service*, includes on-screen guide, access to premium channels, indemand pay-per-view, plus 72 music choice channels.


So if you're already paying for the Cox Digital Cable service, which already includes those services, I'd say they're ripping you off.


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## TravisKU

ehardman said:


> In Salina, KS they charged me $49.95 total for both cards installed. I do not think they charge and install fee for each card.
> 
> FYI, I also have a CC in my TV which has its own cable feed. This way, if Tivo is recording two programs, we can still watch live TV on a third channel.


I'm waiting to get my bill. When I called they tried to tell me it was $50 install per card. He said this was dictated by CableLabs. I told him, he needs to check on it.

Travis


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## Dick Kalagher

The "digital gateway fee" per card or outlet is the one thing that keeps me with directTV. It's essentially a fee for not using analog? Total ripoff!


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## jasonpot

Called Cox Las Vegas after purchasing the S3. They informed me I could pickup the CableCARDs at the Rancho office. Drive down there on my lunch hour and they say they must be installed and they didn't even have the CableCARDs at that location. Fortunately, they scheduled my install for the very next day between 3-5

Around 4pm the installer shows up with 2 CableCARDs in his shirt pocket. He asks me if they are going into a Tivo I say yes, and he said he thought so. I asked if he'd ever installed the cards into a Tivo before and he said he had, but he huffled and puffed a littled about how long they took.

The install went perfectly and took 20 mins. He inserted the first card, called in and read off the HOST ID, and did the same for the 2nd. All channels worked instantly.

Very pleased with everything. Now I just need an OTA antenna and transfer my liftime from my SVR2000 and I'll be good to go.


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## CharlieS

NOD said:


> woohoo!
> 
> The cc installation (which I scheduled 3 days after ordering on launch day) finally happened a couple of hours ago here in New Orleans, and went off w/o a hitch. It was the first one this guy had installed on a Tivo, and he said they had been briefly told about it, and that they had been told to follow the Tivo instructions. It took about an hour (in large part b/c, when the guy at the headend modified my account, he had accidentally lost the GI numbers on the 2 Motorola 6200's that I own and deleted them).
> 
> Once we got that straightened out, it only took about 20 minutes


How much does Cox charge for CableCards in New Orleans or Baton Rouge?


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## TheChadAZ

jasonpot said:


> Called Cox Las Vegas after purchasing the S3. They informed me I could pickup the CableCARDs at the Rancho office. Drive down there on my lunch hour and they say they must be installed and they didn't even have the CableCARDs at that location. Fortunately, they scheduled my install for the very next day between 3-5


I spoke to a supervisor at Cox and had them refund the entire cost of the truck roll and card install because I was told that I could pick up the cards at the local office and was then told that they had to be installed after I had driven all the way down there and waited for my number to be called. Its up to you, but I was glad to get that $50 back for my trouble.


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## TheChadAZ

Shawn95GT said:


> FYI, got my 1st bill from Cox... beware of hidden fees.
> 
> Besides the cablecard fees they charge a 'digital gateway' fee per cablecard which is another $6 for the 2nd card besides the cablecard fee.
> 
> Yeah, this is 'so' much better than satellite  .
> 
> I'm paying about $10/mo than I was paying with my previous cable company and I picked up High def in the deal and lost unlimited long distance on the phone side.
> 
> Ahh well, the S3 makes it all worth it.


Here is my cable bill from AFTER cable cards (the number before the charge is quantity and is included in the fee):
COX LIMITED BASIC 2 19.95
COX EXPANDED SERVICE 2 20.00
DIGITAL GATEWAY SERVICE 2 7.00
VARIETY TIER 2 5.00
HBO 2 12.95
SHOWTIME 2 7.00
COX HDTV 2 0.00
HD EXPANDED TIER 2 0.00
COX CABLECARD 2 4.00
Total Monthly Cable Service $75.90

Here is my cable bill from BEFORE cable cards:
COX LIMITED BASIC 1 19.95
COX EXPANDED SERVICE 1 20.00
DIGITAL GATEWAY SERVICE 1 5.00
VARIETY TIER 1 5.00
HBO 1 10.95
SHOWTIME 1 5.95
HD DIGITAL RECEIVER 1 10.00
COX HDTV 1 0.00
HD EXPANDED TIER 1 0.00
Total Monthly Cable Service $76.85

Cox also increased the fee for the premium services (hbo and showtime) in the Phoenix market and that increase is not because of the cable cards. All in all, the two cable cards comes out cheaper than a single cable box.


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## daffydude

Ok, I just got off the phone with COX. What a terribly system. It will cost me 16 dollars a month for 2 cablecards. I live in a dorm at UCSB, so we do not get HD service. We get standard service, and I can get ABC in HD with an antenna.

My question is, what will I be losing by just sticking with standard cable, and not using the cablecards? I have had the 8300HD and it is the biggest piece of garbage. Will I still be able to get my premium channels(HBO, Showtime)? Thanks for the help!


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## scott816

Had Cox Fairfax install my two CC's today and i am happy to report it only took about 25 minutes. Each card costs 1.99 a month but they charge you twice for the digital gateways. When my bill arrives i am going to complain about being charged for two digital gateways since their HD DVR has dual tuners and they only charged one digital gateway. I don't see the difference.


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## XBR

Folks, Cox here in Orange County, CA told me Cox Digital Gateway does not apply if you subscribe to Cox Digital Cable or Cox Digital Cable Deluxe. It only applies if you only want the digital music channels, PPV and the guide but don't care to have the digital cable channels. If you are already subscribing to Cox Digital Cable or Cox Digital Cable Deluxe and they're also dinging you for Cox Digital Gateway, I would think you're getting double-dipped.


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## moyekj

XBR said:


> Folks, Cox here in Orange County, CA told me Cox Digital Gateway does not apply if you subscribe to Cox Digital Cable or Cox Digital Cable Deluxe. It only applies if you only want the digital music channels, PPV and the guide but don't care to have the digital cable channels. If you are already subscribing to Cox Digital Cable or Cox Digital Cable Deluxe and they're also dinging you for Cox Digital Gateway, I would think you're getting double-dipped.


 That's correct. I'm in OC and kept my digital service and will be charged for:
2*$1.99 CC rental
2*$1.59 additional outlet fee (arguably should only be 1 for 1 Tivo box)
After trial period is over and I'm confident about the S3 I will be returning the Cox DVR so expect to be able to drop to 1 additional outlet fee (though arguably there shouldn't be any with 1 Tivo box and no cable box) in addition to the DVR box rental fee & the DVR service fee.


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## Dark Helmet

XBR said:


> Folks, Cox here in Orange County, CA told me Cox Digital Gateway does not apply if you subscribe to Cox Digital Cable or Cox Digital Cable Deluxe. It only applies if you only want the digital music channels, PPV and the guide but don't care to have the digital cable channels. If you are already subscribing to Cox Digital Cable or Cox Digital Cable Deluxe and they're also dinging you for Cox Digital Gateway, I would think you're getting double-dipped.


You guys have a different rate structure (which I find surprising, but there you have it). Cox/Fairfax has a "Each additional Digital outlet" charge of $5.95/month (it's not called Digital Gateway ... in Cox/Fairfax, "Digital Gateway" is required to get any digital channels). I think that's what the original poster was talking about. I don't mind paying the cost of one additional digital outlet for the Tivo, but the cost of two digital outlets sticks in my craw. I guess your additional outlet fee is $1.50/month.

Perhaps us Cox/Fairfax customers should all complain to Fairfax County? They seem to be the relevant governing body. You can even do it online.


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## Dark Helmet

Well, I just filed my complaint with Fairfax County regarding getting charged for two digital outlet fees (I did try going through Cox CSR rep, who basically told me the extra charge was Tivo's fault). Did anyone else complaint to their municipality or relevant governing authority? I don't know if anything will come of this, but I figure it's worth a shot.


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## XBR

Dark Helmet said:


> Well, I just filed my complaint with Fairfax County regarding getting charged for two digital outlet fees (I did try going through Cox CSR rep, who basically told me the extra charge was Tivo's fault). Did anyone else complaint to their municipality or relevant governing authority? I don't know if anything will come of this, but I figure it's worth a shot.


I just ordered ordered the Digital Cable Service, two cable cards for the Series3 plus an HD PVR for a 2nd location from Cox Orange County, CA and they said they would only add _one_ additional digital outlet fee for the HD PVR. Counting your Series3 as two outlets really blows, since, as someone else mentioned, their own PVR can record two things at once from a _single_ outlet (don't have it yet so can't confirm). Hope this helps with your cause.


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## pestilence

IM not sure what you mean by cable cards. I have Cox in Phoenix and have no problems with the series 2. Cox doesnt know I have tivo and I dont plan to let them know either because its none of their business. Cox already has too much of the "digital pie" imho


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## Shawn95GT

pestilence said:


> IM not sure what you mean by cable cards. I have Cox in Phoenix and have no problems with the series 2. Cox doesnt know I have tivo and I dont plan to let them know either because its none of their business. Cox already has too much of the "digital pie" imho


You'd know it all too well if you had a S3 . Think Tivo in HD! The S3 doesn't use a cablebox, it 'is' your cable box and it tunes the digital / HD channels. the cablecards are what authorize the Tivo's tuners for the channels you subscribe to.


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## techman36

My TCStore Series3 is arriving on Friday according to DHL. I have scheduled my 2 cable card installs for Saturday morning. I will give an update post install. 

Also, the Cox CSR tried really hard to talk me out of the cards stating that I would not be happy and I should stay with the 2 DVRs I have been renting from them (I also have a Series2 as well) She kept saying that picture quality was horrible and Tivo didn't stack up well against the SA 8300 DVRs. All I could do was laugh and asked her to fill my order as I asked. She did so but kept repeating that there was going to be a $50 charge every time the CC failed. The really seem to be pushing back really hard to keep cards from going out and trying to keep people renting their DVRs. Makes allot of sense since they are squeezing $25 a month from the 2 DVRs I have from them now.


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## pkscout

techman36 said:


> She did so but kept repeating that there was going to be a $50 charge every time the CC failed. The really seem to be pushing back really hard to keep cards from going out and trying to keep people renting their DVRs.


I would have let her know that every time they extort $50 from you for providing a substandard product that you would be reporting them to the Better Business Bureau, the local franchise authority, and the FCC. It's OK for the cable monopolies to need some time to get up to speed on cablecard (I guess 2 years hasn't been enough), but telling people they're going to charge if a product they co-developed breaks is simply unacceptable.


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## pkscout

Question for Cox Las Vegas folks. Are you able to get the digital simulcast of the analog channels with the cablecards? I'm moving to Vegas in January, and if I can't get the digital simulcast channels with the cablecards I'm thinking of just building a MythTV box and going analog cable and the free QAM channels (I don't want or need any of the premium channels).


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## jasonpot

Just got my first bill. As I feared, they are charging me the "Digital Gateway Outlet" fee for $7.95 each plus the CableCARD rental fee of $1.99. This is not kosher as their own crappy DVR has dual tuner functionality and they don't charge the additional outlet fee for it. 

Complained to the local franchise authority. Will let you know if anything comes of it.

As for the simulcast, how would I go about checking for that?


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## pkscout

jasonpot said:


> As for the simulcast, how would I go about checking for that?


I don't have the Series3 yet, so here's a guess. Any digital channel or tuner shouldn't allow you to set the recording quality. So if Cox is doing digital simulcast of all the channels *and* if the cablecard is mapping the analog channel numbers to the digital ones, then you shouldn't have any option to set the recording quality.

Of course if you can set the recording quality it might just mean I don't know what I'm talking about.


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## Bodie

Just what is a "digital gateway"? Can they show me one? If I sign up for any level of service, I can tune to channel X and see that service is there that I'm paying for. I just want to know WTF this digital gateway is that I will be paying for. (I wonder what would they give me if I called and said "I want the digital gateway" and then refused any other services...)


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## jasonpot

pkscout -

There are definitely channels that do have that option and some that don't. For sure, the HD channels do not have the option to change recording quality. I'll double check to see if the digital channels have the option. Pretty sure that the lower analog channels have the option.


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## XBR

Bodie said:


> Just what is a "digital gateway"? Can they show me one? If I sign up for any level of service, I can tune to channel X and see that service is there that I'm paying for. I just want to know WTF this digital gateway is that I will be paying for. (I wonder what would they give me if I called and said "I want the digital gateway" and then refused any other services...)


With Cox in OC, CA, the Digital Gateway gets you pay-per-view, the music channels and the guide. These features are included with the Digital Cable Service, so if you pay for the Digital Cable Service, there is no separate line item for the Digital Gateway.


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## Shawn95GT

XBR said:


> With Cox in OC, CA, the Digital Gateway gets you pay-per-view, the music channels and the guide. These features are included with the Digital Cable Service, so if you pay for the Digital Cable Service, there is no separate line item for the Digital Gateway.


they told me 'that's what lets you get the digital channels'.

Let's see...

PPV - dont' care.
Music channels - almost never use, wont' miss e'm
Guide - They're kidding, right?

Take your Fee and shove it Cox!


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## XBR

Shawn95GT said:


> they told me 'that's what lets you get the digital channels'.
> ...


Man, that's bogus. But, the pricing page for AZ does look different than the one for OC CA. On the OC page, a footnote to the Digital Gateway service reads: "** Valid with Limited Basic Service, includes on-screen guide, access to premium channels, indemand pay-per-view, plus 72 music choice channels."


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## moyekj

Yes for Cox OC assuming you are still paying for at least the minimum digital cable tier then the charges are (if you are not renting a digital box from them):
CC #1 $1.99 CC rental
CC #2 $1.99 CC rental + $1.59 additional outlet

By returning the Cox DVR I had $9.95 box rental + $4.95 DVR service deducted from the bill
=> Net cable bill is around $9/month less than when I had the Cox DVR


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## XBR

moyekj said:


> Yes for Cox OC assuming you are still paying for at least the minimum digital cable tier then the charges are (if you are not renting a digital box from them):
> CC #1 $1.99 CC rental
> CC #2 $1.99 CC rental + $1.59 additional outlet
> 
> By returning the Cox DVR I had $9.95 box rental + $4.95 DVR service deducted from the bill
> => Net cable bill is around $9/month less than when I had the Cox DVR


Yup, I thought I could live with it, I'm going to drop their DVR (even though I've heard they were going to upgrade to TiVo-based software by the end of the year) and pick up two more cable cards; they said my monthly bill will drop by 10 bucks--which will more than cover the multi-discounted monthly for the 2nd Series3 I will put in it's place. The one additional outlet fee I was already paying for their DVR will not change.


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## dt_dc

Bodie said:


> Just what is a "digital gateway"? Can they show me one? If I sign up for any level of service, I can tune to channel X and see that service is there that I'm paying for. I just want to know WTF this digital gateway is that I will be paying for. (I wonder what would they give me if I called and said "I want the digital gateway" and then refused any other services...)


Chuckle ... good question.

Cox says 'Cox's "Digital Gateway" service consists of an interactive programming
guide and Music Choice, a forty-channel audio service' and that 'subscribers must purchase a "Digital Gateway" service as a condition to receiving any digital services'.
http://sec.edgar-online.com/2005/03/16/0000950144-05-002664/Section2.asp

Others say it's a violation of tier buy-through prohibitions and a way to enforce tier buy-through (and per-outlet) charges and have complained to the FCC about it:
http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-04-897A1.pdf
http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA407391.html?display=Breaking+News
http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA414415.html
http://www.natoa.org/public/articles/NATOA_Buy-through_Letter_CSR_6313-B.pdf
etc.


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## Dark Helmet

dt_dc said:


> Chuckle ... good question.
> Others say it's a violation of tier buy-through prohibitions and a way to enforce tier buy-through (and per-outlet) charges and have complained to the FCC about it:
> [...]


While I am not defending Cox, everything I have read said that cable rate regulation is for BASIC cable only. The entries I looked at that you pointed to all talked about basic cable plus add-ons ... if it's not basic cable, then the FCC has no authority (I admit, the whole "buy-through" thing is a bit confusing to me). Clearly if you're using the Series 3 with cablecards, you're not just getting basic cable.

My complaint to my local franchising authority was based on Cox not applying their stated rates consistantly (two outlet fees for one television).


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## jcaudle

its a rip-off for the digital gateway fee, which is charging you for 2 outlets....between the price of the S3 and the cox charges here in fairfax is why I haven't bought the S3...I will muddle along with H10-250 even though over air locals here suck...so I have to use SD satellite broadcast for locals.


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## nreuben

Experience with COX Palos Verdeds, CA (LA metro)

Prior to S3 had an HD cable box but no DVR

Got the S3 Wed night, called Cox Thursday AM, had an appt for Saturday

Ordered 2 cable cards, was told net dif to the monthly was 4.95 - no breakdown of detail. Two cards two 39.95 install charges, not negotiable.

No problems with what a cable card was or hassles about ordering them. Told me no VoD, guide, music channels. (However music channels still work with CC.)

Guy shows up, order says 1 card. Fortunately he has two. Lots of back and forth with the phone support end gets the cards registered and the channels loaded.

The guy had done some CC installs before, but the back end seemed to be unsure of the actual steps. Also the process requests brand of device - no pick for Tivo, so goes in as the TV - Sony.

Unfortunately the premium channels not showing up on one card. Odd, as the non-premium HD channels are working. Looks like a config problem, but he says card may also be suspect, but needs to get a new one. "I'll be back..." - Had my doubts, but 2 hours later he's back with a new card, which after registration resolved the problem.

Waiting for the bill to see what I really got charged for...

But otherwise pleased with the outcome - strong signal, excellent picture, even on the SD cable channels, better than the box.


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## OrangeKid

I am in HD Nirvana. I had two cable cards installed in my new S3 by Cox today here in Vegas. The install went without a hitch but required a few tries. After four years of HD I finally have an integrated DVR for HD and SD. The last two years I have had a SA 8300HD but I only used it for HD and digital broadcasts. I continued to use my S2 for analog SD. Finally everything is nicely integrated. 

One question for the experts. What are the little square rods next to each cable card. One of them is all the way in, and on my second cable card it is sticking out. I started to push it in but the cable card started to come out. What should I do. Both cable cards are working as expected. 

i purchased an upgraded S3. I can hear the 750GB drive. While loading the data from Tivo it was very noticeable. Now, a few hours later, it seems a lot quieter. I hope it is not annoying.


----------



## XBR

OrangeKid said:


> ...What are the little square rods next to each cable card...


They're for extracting the cards; if you have a notebook PC with PC Card (PCMCIA) card slots, it probably has a similar mechanism for popping the cards out. As for whether you can just push the one sticking out in and pop the card out and back in again, I would think you could without ill effect--but I've never done it before. If you do it and the Strip goes dark or the Earth stops turning you'll be sorry


----------



## OrangeKid

"As for whether you can just push the one sticking out in and pop the card out and back in again, I would think you could without ill effect--but I've never done it before. If you do it and the Strip goes dark or the Earth stops turning you'll be sorry " 

I think I will will leave well enough alone!


----------



## craigo

So, I called Cox in Phoenix today to get some pricing since pricing seems to be all over the place. The 1st CSR said that the CC's won't be available for the S3 until Feb/Mar. I assured him that they are available now and asked if he could speak to his supervisor. He said "sure", then...click...

So I called back to CSR #2 and think she gave me a pretty good deal:

One time fee of $9.95 + tax (forgot what she said this is for)
One time fee of $15,00 + tax for HD Fee
HD Package along with phone and internet- $112 per month *including* tax
$12.95 extra for HBO

Comparing to some other deals I've seen, this sounds pretty good. She also said I will receive 40 or so Music Channels which I didn't think were available. Maybe that has changed.

Is this a pretty good deal?


----------



## Tico

Sounds Like:

http://www.cox.com/Arizona/digitalhomepak.asp


----------



## Shawn95GT

craigo said:


> So, I called Cox in Phoenix today to get some pricing since pricing seems to be all over the place. The 1st CSR said that the CC's won't be available for the S3 until Feb/Mar. I assured him that they are available now and asked if he could speak to his supervisor. He said "sure", then...click...
> 
> So I called back to CSR #2 and think she gave me a pretty good deal:
> 
> One time fee of $9.95 + tax (forgot what she said this is for)
> One time fee of $15,00 + tax for HD Fee
> HD Package along with phone and internet- $112 per month *including* tax
> $12.95 extra for HBO
> 
> Comparing to some other deals I've seen, this sounds pretty good. She also said I will receive 40 or so Music Channels which I didn't think were available. Maybe that has changed.
> 
> Is this a pretty good deal?


You don't have to pay the 'HD Fee' unless you get their STB.

I wouldn't bet on the pricing they quoted you. I have that same triple-play deal which is $99 + hardware. What they don't quote you is the 'digital gateway' fees. The only Cox equipment I have is the two cable cards and the standard digital + 1 (Variety in my case) tier. The HD is included with ANY digital package subscription, but they do need to specificly provision your cablecards for the HD channels.

My $99 + 2 cable cards somehow equals $118/mo. Add HBO and you're looking at $130/mo.

See if you can talk them into a free install . I caught a promotion and dodged the $30ish/ea fee for cablecard installs.


----------



## craigo

Shawn95GT said:


> My $99 + 2 cable cards somehow equals $118/mo. Add HBO and you're looking at $130/mo.


So my pricing isn't to for off from yours. Does the $130/mo include the tax/fees? She also said that In Demand should be coming at the beginning of next year. What about Music Channels. Do you receive them?


----------



## Shawn95GT

craigo said:


> So my pricing isn't to for off from yours. Does the $130/mo include the tax/fees? She also said that In Demand should be coming at the beginning of next year. What about Music Channels. Do you receive them?


Yes that includes all taxes etc.

I do get the music channels. MTVHD was a plesant suprise. It reminds me of RaveHD on Voom. I was happy to get ESPNHD w/o the sports tier too.


----------



## Bodie

dt_dc said:


> Chuckle ... good question.
> 
> Cox says 'Cox's "Digital Gateway" service consists of an interactive programming
> guide and Music Choice, a forty-channel audio service' and that 'subscribers must purchase a "Digital Gateway" service as a condition to receiving any digital services'.
> http://sec.edgar-online.com/2005/03/16/0000950144-05-002664/Section2.asp
> 
> Others say it's a violation of tier buy-through prohibitions and a way to enforce tier buy-through (and per-outlet) charges and have complained to the FCC about it:
> http://hraunfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-04-897A1.pdf
> http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA407391.html?display=Breaking+News
> http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA414415.html
> http://www.natoa.org/public/articles/NATOA_Buy-through_Letter_CSR_6313-B.pdf
> etc.


I kind of thought the answers would be all over the place.

You know what they say, "if it smells like a duck..."


----------



## moyekj

Just got my November Cox bill and can confirm the cable bill went down by $9.43/month. Charges here in Cox, Orange County CA for 2 CableCards for Tivo S3 (with no Cox digital box in the house anymore):
$1.49 additional outlet fee (for 2nd CC - I guess I'm OK with this)
2 * $1.99 for CableCard rentals

By returning the Cox DVR I save:
-$4.95 DVR Service fee
-$9.95 DVR rental

=> net change of -$9.43/month

For those in other markets paying "digital gateway" fees it sounds like a ripoff.


----------



## craigo

Shawn95GT said:


> Yes that includes all taxes etc.
> 
> I do get the music channels. MTVHD was a plesant suprise. It reminds me of RaveHD on Voom. I was happy to get ESPNHD w/o the sports tier too.


Sweet....Just bought the S3 and need to call Cox back to schedule the install....Can't wait!


----------



## Goofball

Goofball said:


> Cox Phoenix (Peoria, AZ) came out and installed my cards today. Everything is up and running and I am getting all of the channels I requested.
> 
> The installer only had 2 cards with him and was only expecting a single card TV style install so if you are ordering and have to deal with a truck roll make sure they note on the work order that the installer needs to bring 2 cards and a couple of spares and that the install is for a TiVo that uses 2 cards. This was the installers first TiVo and he was surprised at the whole thing. Cox might want to at least put a note out to the activation and installation techs so they are aware of the Series3...
> 
> The installer was able to get one card up and running immediately but the other was dead (kept insisting it needed to download firmware). He ended up calling another tech in the area and getting a couple of spare cards from him. The next one he tried after getting back from picking the cards up worked no problem.
> 
> I was getting tiling and signal loss on some of the digitals but an amp behind my media cabinet fixed that no problem. Before the amp I was in the low 70s according to the onboard signal meter on the channels that were tiling, now with the amp they are up in the mid 90s. I wish Cox would finish up with the digital simulcast conversion in this area so that I don't have to set all my season passes up on the 800 series test channels that may or may not stay where they are since I get some ugly noise on some of the analogs now with the amp.
> 
> Reran the guided setup and have been sitting on my ass watching InHD and DiscoveryHD for the last couple of hours. I can't wait for this weekend and getting the NASCAR Cup race recorded in HD off of TNTHD.
> 
> Overall I am pretty happy with the whole thing and I will update if I run into any problems.


Let's really mess things up now: I haven't seen anyone else post on this so I'll let everyone know how it goes. We have sold our current house and are moving on the 15th. This also involves moving service to the new address for Cable. At this point I don't know if I will have to have the CableCards replaced once I get to the new location (Avondale, AZ vs. Peoria, AZ where we are now) or if they can just set the cards up for the new head end. I'll be calling Cox today to schedule the disconnect of service at my old address and the move of service to my new one.

I'll post the results once I have Internet access back and new service all set in the next couple of weeks.


----------



## Bodie

Goofball said:


> I'll post the results once I have Internet access back and new
> service all set in the next couple of weeks.


Good luck!


----------



## Goofball

Bodie said:


> Good luck!


I have a scheduled date of 11/16 between 8 and 10AM for installation at the new place and disconnection of service at the old. According to the rep Cox does have to replace the CableCards (at an install fee of $9.95) so we'll see how everything goes. It ought to be fun to try to get this done while I am moving stuff in to my new place. Guess I'll have to have a TV and the TiVo stored in the back of one of my cars for easy access when the Cox tech shows.

Thanks for the good luck wish. I'll need it, otherwise I am stuck watching the final NASCAR race live and possibly without HD. Thankfully I get to see the Phoenix one in person this weekend so if I miss the last one it shouldn't be too big of a deal.


----------



## techman36

Had my CCs install on the 4th and all seems to be fine so far. Initially we get a bad cablecard and had to call another tech to get another one. Once we tried the second and third card all went well after activation. Was getting some tiling initially, but all seems to be fine now.

I returned my HD DVR and standard DVR that I had and picked up another cable box for my old Series 2. I'm anxious to see if there is going to be any difference in my monthly bill.

But, so far so good.


----------



## craigo

Shawn95GT said:


> Yes that includes all taxes etc.
> 
> I do get the music channels. MTVHD was a plesant suprise. It reminds me of RaveHD on Voom. I was happy to get ESPNHD w/o the sports tier too.


A couple of questions for you....The cable guy is here now and he says that all local channels are in HD and there is no need for an OTA atenna.

1. Is that true? 
2. If not, do you install the atenna into the tivo or tv? 
3. I'v noticed that many local channels such as channel 5 display "5, 5-1". Some of them even have 3. Does this have to do with SD, HD?

I haven't had much time to play with it since he is still here, just thought I'd ask.

Thanks in advance.


----------



## Shawn95GT

craigo said:


> A couple of questions for you....The cable guy is here now and he says that all local channels are in HD and there is no need for an OTA atenna.
> 
> 1. Is that true?
> 2. If not, do you install the atenna into the tivo or tv?
> 3. I'v noticed that many local channels such as channel 5 display "5, 5-1". Some of them even have 3. Does this have to do with SD, HD?
> 
> I haven't had much time to play with it since he is still here, just thought I'd ask.
> 
> Thanks in advance.


1. - Yes the big nets that have local HD broadcast are on channels prefixed with a 7. 12-1 is 712. 5-1 is 705 etc.
2. I disconnected my antenna once I got the cablecards installed. It shouldn't hurt to leave it there if you want, but some channels will be duplicated.
3. All of the x-x channels are your digital off-air channels. This doesn't necessarily mean they are HD.

Cox's re-broadcast of the HD channels seems to be on-par with the off-air broadcast so for the S3 I just let it get it all from Cox. In my case having both the cable and the antenna connected seemed to be causing drop outs on the cable channels. It may have been coincidence but it works perfect now with the antenna disconnected. It's a case of 'ain't broke, don't fix it'.


----------



## moyekj

craigo said:


> ...
> 3. I'v noticed that many local channels such as channel 5 display "5, 5-1". Some of them even have 3. Does this have to do with SD, HD?


5 (ant) = analog OTA broadcast of 5
5 (cbl) = cable company SD re-transmission of 5 (this could be analog or digital depending on your cable company and if you are using cablecards or not)
5-1 (ant) = digital OTA broadcast of 5

I usually disable the analog/SD versions in my channel lineup such that wishlists use the HD versions wherever possible.


----------



## TheRatPatrol

You can also get the HD channels thru Cox by using a QAM tuner. I don't know why they don't put them in numerical order, but I guess you can't be picky seeing that they are free. And you should be able to get these too if you only have basic cable, 2-22. 

RF Ch Call Sign Name QAM Frequency 
76-1 KSAZ-DT Fox 10 536992 KHz 
76-2 KASW-DT CW 61 536992 KHz 
80-1 KNXV-DT ABC 15 560992 KHz 
80-2 KPHO-DT CBS 5 560992 KHz 
81-1 KAET-DT-1 PBS HD 566992 KHz 
81-2 KPNX-DT-1 NBC 12 566992 KHz 
81-3 KAET-DT-2 PBS 566992 KHz 
81-4 KPNX-DT-2 NBC 12 W+ 566992 KHz


----------



## Shawn95GT

theratpatrol said:


> You can also get the HD channels thru Cox by using a QUAM tuner. I don't know why they don't put them in numerical order, but I guess you can't be picky seeing that they are free. And you should be able to get these too if you only have basic cable, 2-22.
> 
> RF Ch Call Sign Name QAM Frequency
> 76-1 KSAZ-DT Fox 10 536992 KHz
> 76-2 KASW-DT CW 61 536992 KHz
> 80-1 KNXV-DT ABC 15 560992 KHz
> 80-2 KPHO-DT CBS 5 560992 KHz
> 81-1 KAET-DT-1 PBS HD 566992 KHz
> 81-2 KPNX-DT-1 NBC 12 566992 KHz
> 81-3 KAET-DT-2 PBS 566992 KHz
> 81-4 KPNX-DT-2 NBC 12 W+ 566992 KHz


Good info there, but if he's getting cablecards he won't see those RF Channel numbers, just the 7xx channel numbers.

Shawn


----------



## ajwees41

cap said:


> Really?
> Cox here in Omaha only charges $1.99 per card.
> 
> Why would cox be different in different areas?


Different harware maybe + different prices?

The Cox provided HD and HD/DVR are also different prices. Same place have the same price for box rental as a regular digital box, but Omaha's HD and HD/DVR are $5..20 higher than the regular digital boxes.

ajwees41


----------



## craigo

Shawn95GT said:


> 1. - Yes the big nets that have local HD broadcast are on channels prefixed with a 7. 12-1 is 712. 5-1 is 705 etc.
> 2. I disconnected my antenna once I got the cablecards installed. It shouldn't hurt to leave it there if you want, but some channels will be duplicated.
> 3. All of the x-x channels are your digital off-air channels. This doesn't necessarily mean they are HD.
> 
> Cox's re-broadcast of the HD channels seems to be on-par with the off-air broadcast so for the S3 I just let it get it all from Cox. In my case having both the cable and the antenna connected seemed to be causing drop outs on the cable channels. It may have been coincidence but it works perfect now with the antenna disconnected. It's a case of 'ain't broke, don't fix it'.


Thanks for the clarification. I went ahead and disconnected the antenna and switch the S3 to only accept Cable channels vs Cable/Antenna channels. Everything is up and running. As I understand it, all HD channels are above 700.

Install went great. The guy was here for about an hour and both cards worked right off the bat. About 3 hours later, Card 1 stopped working so I called Cox. Within 5 minutes is was back up and running.

Thanks all for the help.


----------



## ellinj

I had my two cable cards installed today. No problems at all. The tech who came out had never done one before and couldn't understand why I needed two cards. He did it anyway and called in the info. After the cards were initialized I was in business.


----------



## Sarge3515

Anybody had dealing with with Cox-Roanoke and the cable cards in their S3?


----------



## Mathmn

When the cox installer arrived, he knew nothing about TIVO Series 3. He would not even read the instruction sheet which Tivo had provided. He referred me to a supervisor who told me that the cablecards would not work in a Tivo, that Cox was working on a special Tivo Cablecard. I was to have the tech remove the cards and leave. 

I politely declined to accept his premise, telling him that his explanation did not make sense to me. The cards would stay, and I would get them to work. 

After 15 calls to Cox technical support, and another service appointment, I finally got the host ID numbers logged and everything now works just fine. 

These technicians should do some research and give correct info to customers. I have written a respectfully worded complaint to Cox on this issue.


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## Dick Kalagher

Mathmn,

What Cox location are you in?


----------



## XBR

Mathmn said:


> When the cox installer arrived, he knew nothing about TIVO Series 3. He would not even read the instruction sheet which Tivo had provided. He referred me to a supervisor who told me that the cablecards would not work in a Tivo, that Cox was working on a special Tivo Cablecard. I was to have the tech remove the cards and leave.
> 
> I politely declined to accept his premise, telling him that his explanation did not make sense to me. The cards would stay, and I would get them to work.
> 
> After 15 calls to Cox technical support, and another service appointment, I finally got the host ID numbers logged and everything now works just fine.
> 
> These technicians should do some research and give correct info to customers. I have written a respectfully worded complaint to Cox on this issue.


Very well done. My installers (two units on two separate occasions) candidly mentioned that they did not receive any training prior to launch. The 2nd one said they "had a meeting about it" just a few weeks ago. Both said I was only their 2nd Series3, but what really helped is both had great attitudes (Cox Orange County, CA). Then again, every time the techs called in with the pairing info, the snickering comments made it obvious the folks on the other end weren't exactly jumping for joy...


----------



## lorderic

We've had our Series 3 since September and it has been working well with Cox Orange County, CA. When the original installer came out he had a number of CableCards because, as he put it: "you can never tell which one of these will work so I always bring extras". We also had a Cox HD DVR split off the same cable.

This past weekend I removed the Cox HD DVR and the splitter as it looked like one of the TIVO turners wasn't working. After plugging the cable back in and rebooting TIVO we no longer had any pay channels. I called Cox Customer Service which sent a signal down the line with no effect. So a service call was scheduled for this afternoon.

The Tech that arrived was not as well versed on CableCards (or TIVO) as the initial installer. He kept suggesting that the 'Dual CableCard systems are problematic". He tested the lines at the house connection and at the location where the Series 3 is installed. He changed the connector on the Coax line and reconnected it. They sent several refreshes down the line with no change. 

After 1.5 hours of this they finally decided, Hmmm, let's check the "Host" and "Data" numbers on the cards. Sure enough they had changed from the original installation. The Tech didn't know how they could have changed.

They inputted the correct numbers in their system and everything is working again. I asked him why the Customer Service person couldn't help me and his response was only he can speak with more technical people who can refresh the lines. 

I told him next time he should check the numbers first instead of wasting so much time. I was controlling the TIVO as I knew more about it than he did after playing with it all weekend.

As far as cost is concerned, I pay $3.98 for the two CableCards each month. The install charge was $39.99. I love my Series 3 Box even though it is missing some of the features from my other TIVO's. 

I was told that new CableCards will be coming out next year which will feature two-way communication. This will enable PPV and other features I rarely used. I was also told that Cox will be offering their own boxes with TIVO software installed, but I guess that is for another forum.


----------



## Shawn95GT

lorderic said:


> As far as cost is concerned, I pay $3.98 for the two CableCards each month. The install charge was $39.99.


That's the same as I was quoted, except I got mine installed free on a promotion.

When I got my bill I'm getting the cablecards free but that are raking me over the coals with 'Digital Gateway' fees to the tune of $10+ on top of the programming charges.


----------



## moyekj

lorderic said:


> As far as cost is concerned, I pay $3.98 for the two CableCards each month. The install charge was $39.99. I love my Series 3 Box even though it is missing some of the features from my other TIVO's.


 Yes, but there will be an additional $1.65/month for "additional outlet" on the digital service.

You will see on the bill the following:
Digital Cable Service, 2, $(xx+1.65) where xx is what you were previously paying for single dig service
Cox CableCard, 2, $3.98

Which is not bad compared to the "Digital Gateway" fees those in AZ apparently are paying.

BTW - not too exciting but MTVHD was just added to the Cox OC HD lineup last night.


----------



## XBR

Hmm...I'd better take a good look at my next bill; When I had a Series3 and an HD-PVR, they told me they would charge me only one add'l outlet fee; when I swapped out the HD-PVR for a 2nd Series3 they told me the bill would change by dropping the HD STB+DVR fee and adding the two CC fees, but no changes to the outlet fees...


----------



## ddledgenet

Just sent the Cox-Rhode Island Tech out the door after getting both cards to work on the first try. He was in and out of my living room in 35 minutes with the old Motorola digital box. Install was $39.95 plus the monthly fees. I don't have HD, only extended basic digital with HBO. Rep told me I will actually save a couple of bucks since the two cards at $1.99 each are cheaper than the digital box rental. Time will tell. Now the trickle down.... Tivo 2 unit to replace the old Sony SVR-2000 in the bedroom. The Sony is going to get pieced out.


----------



## Timber

Very smooth change to Series 3 today. The guys arrived at 1.40pm and left at 2.20 and that includes fixing a misconfiguration at the other end of the phone.

Gotta love that Series 3. 

-=Tim=-


----------



## ajfajf1

CableCard install went well, once we (me and the installer) saw that the CCs were doing a firmware update. I called TiVo tech support. The CSR said it could take 1-2 hours for the update to complete.
The installer left, going me his cell phone number. Update only took 15 minutes, called the installer and he came right back. He called Cox with the CC Host ID #'s and all was well.


----------



## Goofball

Goofball said:


> Let's really mess things up now: I haven't seen anyone else post on this so I'll let everyone know how it goes. We have sold our current house and are moving on the 15th. This also involves moving service to the new address for Cable. At this point I don't know if I will have to have the CableCards replaced once I get to the new location (Avondale, AZ vs. Peoria, AZ where we are now) or if they can just set the cards up for the new head end. I'll be calling Cox today to schedule the disconnect of service at my old address and the move of service to my new one.
> 
> I'll post the results once I have Internet access back and new service all set in the next couple of weeks.


Everything went well other than some typical problems with the sale of my existing house causing me to have to delay my cable installation until today due to occupancy dates and full Cox installation schedules along with holidays and vacation.

They were able to just transfer the Cable Cards to the new head end and activate them there, however a call to update the host ids for both cards was still required as at some point during the move my Series3 died (under warranty and TiVo has replaced it). The replacement sent out from TiVo didn't have the same host IDs as before (duh) and would tune to channels for a split second and then pop the Cable Card Host ID screen up, both cards sat at "Waiting for CP Auth". After the tech that was out to install all of my cable stuff updated the host ID on both cards with whoever they talk to on the phone to get that type of thing done, closed the work order and had them send hits out everything was hunky-dory. I still need to call and bug them about not getting STARZ-HD but other than that everything is back to normal and I had the STARZ-HD problem at the old location too. Now to go back through and redo all my thumbs ratings and get my season passes set back up.

By the way, if you have an S3 with the orange OLED panel in the front and become attached to that like I have and have to replace the unit with a newer one with the dim-ass green OLED it is possible to swap the front panels with little to no trouble as long as you have the right tools. So as long as you aren't replacing your TiVo because of the front panel you should be able to swap it out, YMMV.


----------



## Shawn95GT

Bleh - the new S3 displays are green? I like my orange one I have now.


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## gpsj1966

Cox in Baton Rouge Louisiana just told me that I would have to pay for two installs at $54.95 and $7.95 per card per month for cable cards. I told them it has for one device a Tivo Series 3. I might as well have told them it was for a Buick Skylark for the response that I got. They said well as long as it has a slot on the back it doesn't matter. I said this is one device and they said it didn't matter 2 slots 2 cards 2 fees. They asked if I wanted to go with just one and I said no and said I'd check back.


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## OrangeKid

I have had a Tivo Series 3 for about a month here in Vegas. Cox installed two cable cards and all seemed to go well. Soon afterward, I noticed that channel 725 MHD is not received. I did receive it when I had the SA 8300 HD BOX. Cox has sent out two technicians and were unable to resolve the problem. All other channels including SD, HD and premium SD and HD come in fine. After several calls from the 2nd level tech to Cox he said that channel 725, which went on line on Oct 17, is not received currently by cable cards and there is no ETA for a fix. Cox did confirm that it is a cable card issue and not a HD Tivo problem. 

The signal strength was tested and it is fine according to the two techs. 

Any one else from Vegas with a HD Tivo have this issue? 

Other than the one missing channel from my line up I am very satisfied with my HD Tivo and find if far superior to the SA 8300 HD box it replaced. 

Does any one have any suggestions as to what the issue could be with the one channel that does not come it?


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## moyekj

I'm with Cox Orange County, CA (Motorola headend and cablecards). We just recently got MHD added to our lineup as well. The day that MHD became available for digital subscribers with the Motorola digital boxes it also became available for cablecard subscribers. And Tivo was even nice enough to send a message about the lineup change (several other changes happened the same day MHD became available). I was surprised it was that easy, but there you have it.


----------



## OrangeKid

The cable cards here in Vegas are from SA. Maybe the problem is restricted to SA or just to Vegas. 

Other changes have occurred and I have received messages from Tivo telling me about them. The only problem has been with MHD.


----------



## Blackbag

OrangeKid said:


> The cable cards here in Vegas are from SA. Maybe the problem is restricted to SA or just to Vegas.
> 
> Other changes have occurred and I have received messages from Tivo telling me about them. The only problem has been with MHD.


I'm in Vegas too. I also noticed that I don't get 725. The only other channel I have had a problem with is 340 G4TV. I was going to call Cox, but thought I'd check here first. Good to hear that it's not an issue with the Tivo. Let me know if you don't get 340 as well. I'm hoping it is the same issue.


----------



## Shawn95GT

Cox Phoenix here, also SA cards.

Do either of you still have your OTA antenna connected? I unhooked mine and all of my digital channels sometimes do and don't work problems went away.

MHD / G4TV work'n fine here .


----------



## OrangeKid

Blackbag said:


> I'm in Vegas too. I also noticed that I don't get 725. The only other channel I have had a problem with is 340 G4TV. I was going to call Cox, but thought I'd check here first. Good to hear that it's not an issue with the Tivo. Let me know if you don't get 340 as well. I'm hoping it is the same issue.


I don't get 340 either. But that is part of the "Variety Programming Tier" and it may be a premium service I don't subscribe to. I checked and 725 is a "free" channel.


----------



## OrangeKid

Shawn95GT said:


> Cox Phoenix here, also SA cards.
> 
> Do either of you still have your OTA antenna connected? I unhooked mine and all of my digital channels sometimes do and don't work problems went away.
> 
> MHD / G4TV work'n fine here .


I have no OTA antenna.


----------



## SmokeBringer

I called Cox Rhode Island this morning. Basically they said that, yes, they provide CableCard service here in Rhode Island, but that it is very new and does not support On Demand and Pay-per-View. They also stated that they would not support the Tivo 3 either at installation time or after installation. The only device they will install a CableCard into is a CableCard-ready TV.

So then I asked about costs. Basically if you want HD DVR you pay 10 bucks a month for the box rental and 5 bucks a month for the service - so 15 a month per box. We pay 5 a month per box currently with D*.

Looks like I'll hold pat with D* for a bit...


----------



## pkscout

SmokeBringer said:


> I called Cox Rhode Island this morning. Basically they said that, yes, they provide CableCard service here in Rhode Island, but that it is very new and does not support On Demand and Pay-per-View. They also stated that they would not support the Tivo 3 either at installation time or after installation. The only device they will install a CableCard into is a CableCard-ready TV.


They can say that all that want, but the FCC has mandated that the cable companies must install cable cards in any CableLab certified device, and the TiVo Series 3 is CableLab certified. If Cox RI won't do that, you can complain to the franchise authority and the FCC.

They are right to say they won't "support" the TiVo. If you have a problem with your TiVo that isn't related to the cablecard authentication then you call TiVo about that.


----------



## Sarge3515

Okay an update if you live in the COX service area of Roanoke VA. 

I had a Cox tech come out this week to install 2 cable cards in my S3. Make sure when you call in for the appointment you tell them you need 2 cards, she kept trying to tell me I only needed one. Also make sure that you tell the tech this also when he calls to confirm the appointment.

The tech arrived and we started with card #1. I installed and pulled up the paring screen so he could call in the numbers. He gave the numbers to office and they came back with a "failed" message. So we tried a few more times to no avail. We then tried the second card in the same slot, same problem. An hour has elapsed at this point. He had another tech come by for assistance. They check my signal level and fitting and could find no problems. 

I then suggested that we try the card in the TV itself. Same problem. Now I get a higher level tech to come out. We did the whole thing over again, same problem, "failed". I then ask him, these are one-way cards right? He knew where I was going, the office was not going to get a response back. So we checked to see if I was getting any channels, I was!!  We did the other card, success!!  The man at the office was still frustrated and said they should not be working. 

It's been 3 days now and all is well!!! I should go on to say that between the 3 techs I had, they had only installed about 12 cards this year so they are very proficient at them (they admitted this) but they stayed with it. 

I'll also point out I was the first one here to have one. Hopefully the next guy that gets one will have an easy time.


----------



## smb56

I am having it out with Cox in Middle Ga. as they want $1.99 per month for the CC but there is a $31.50 per card installation fee.


----------



## General E

Sarge3515 said:


> I'll also point out I was the first one here to have one. Hopefully the next guy that gets one will have an easy time.


I'll be getting mine installed shortly in Roanoke, so hopefully I WILL have an easy time.

The Cox Sales person I talked to on the phone was giving me all this jive to discourage me from getting Cablecards. One of the things she was telling me was that every time they make a change to their channel lineup (ie, add ESPN2 in HD or somesuch) that someone would have to come out and manually reconfigure the cablecards in my house, thus incurring another service charge. This has to be a lie, right?


----------



## Shawn95GT

Yes - complete crap. Maybe on a TV (never tried cablecard in a TV) but I bet even then it's something you can do yourself.

The S3 gets it's channel list via the Cable card when it powers on. Worst case if you cant' see a new channel, re-boot. We recently lost INHD2 and gained ESPN2. The S3 handled it just fine.


----------



## General E

Sarge3515 said:


> Okay an update if you live in the COX service area of Roanoke VA.


My install is happening tomorrow. Question --- are they charging you the $6 "digital gateway" charge on EACH of your 2 Cablecards? They are for me. If not, what'd you say / do to get them to only charge you once (or not at all)?


----------



## Shawn95GT

General E said:


> My install is happening tomorrow. Question --- are they charging you the $6 "digital gateway" charge on EACH of your 2 Cablecards? They are for me. If not, what'd you say / do to get them to only charge you once (or not at all)?


On my 1st bill they did that.

On my current bill they did it different. It says 2x digital gateway for $7 2x Cablecards for $4. Thsi is more in-line with the original quote when I ordered service. I'm just happy it's better than the $20 or so I paid on the 1st bill.

Knowing Cox, next month will be different...


----------



## Joe3

My three encounters.

First encounter, a contractor with a heavy accent spent two hours with me mostly yelling at his boss in Spanish on his cell. He walked out of the job and I just asked him to leave the cards. I called Cox and got the cards to work

My second encounter was when they added ESPN2HD and NFlHD. ESPN2 HD was fine, but NFLHD was a black screen. I called, they hit the box, but they were told to stop after a few hits in increasing intensity because they felt it might damage the TiVo which they said they did not own. Sent their guy in who was not a contractor. He was at least trainable. He call Connecticut, Im in Rhode Island, talked to few people and found one who was familiar with CC and fixed the problem. The installer thanked me for basically training him on the TiVo and said he would give two free promotions for the favor and to look for it in a few minutes. He gave me all the HBO and Starz channels.

This brings me to my third encounter. I only received HBO Starz channels on one tuner. I called went through the same first steps in encounter two and they sent another installer out. This guy was also trainable for the first hour and then grew increasingly frustrated. He had Connecticut Cox on one phone and Rhode Island Cox on another phone both working on the same problem, but neglected to make clear of others existence. So Rhode Island Cox is thinking this while Connecticut is thinking that and both are trying to initialize cards at the same time.

A few things started to dawn on me. Why am I taking all this time training Coxs employees? If I had all this time why would I need to spend $800 for a TiVo! I would watch live right?

So I made an excuse that I had to be somewhere and _thanked him for his patience_ as I showed him the door. I then called Cox and said no thanks to their free HBO and Starz and told her I didnt have the time to start a second career as their trainer or wouldnt have gotten a Tivo to mange time and would just stick with their crappy box of low storage capacity. She didnt have a clue to what I was talking about but remove the channels.


----------



## General E

Shawn95GT said:


> On my 1st bill they did that.
> 
> On my current bill they did it different.


Did you do anything between the first and 2nd bill to get it switched, or was it just switched on its own? I never received a quote for one price for 2 cards ... everyone I talked to insisted I needed to pay the gateway fee for each card, even though many people on this forum have claimed otherwise.


----------



## Shawn95GT

General E said:


> Did you do anything between the first and 2nd bill to get it switched, or was it just switched on its own? I never received a quote for one price for 2 cards ... everyone I talked to insisted I needed to pay the gateway fee for each card, even though many people on this forum have claimed otherwise.


I haven't done anything but pay the bill.


----------



## lasergecko

Yes, Cox Las Vegas is charging two "digital gateway fees", one for each of the CableCards

I am in the process of 

1) Confirming that Cox Las Vegas does not charge two "digital gateway fees" for their rented HD DVR - Confirmed

2) Confirming that they are charging me two DGFs for my Series 3 TiVo - already knew that

3) Fifteen minutes on hold, rep returned to let me know that my bill was much less because I wasn't having to rent a cablebox and that the DGF is required for the CableCards

4) Explained AGAIN to her that the TiVo Series 3 is doing the exact same thing as their HD DVR (only better) and if they are not charging two DGFs for it, then they are creating an anti-competetive marketplace.

5) Waiting to speak to a supervisor - He wasn't there, but I was given his direct contact information. 

6) Writing letter to Steve Schorr, explaining the ignorance of the CableCard installer, their anti-competetive pricing structure, how Comcast is dealing with it (Series 3 Digital Service) and detailing further action that will be taken if the situation isn't corrected. - pending


----------



## OrangeKid

lasergecko said:


> Yes, Cox Las Vegas is charging two "digital gateway fees", one for each of the CableCards
> 
> I am in the process of
> 
> 1) Confirming that Cox Las Vegas does not charge two "digital gateway fees" for their rented HD DVR - Confirmed
> 
> 2) Confirming that they are charging me two DGFs for my Series 3 TiVo - already knew that
> 
> \


I just got my first bill since installing two cable cards in my S3 Tivo. Cox Las Vegas charged $30 per card for the install, and is charging $2.06 per card per month. They are also charging $5.12 for the Digital Service/Digital Gateway. So my cable cards are costing a total of $9.24 per month. I was paying $10.59 per month for the SA 8300 HD cable box and $10.32 per month for the Digital Video Recorder Service. My monthly billing has been reduced by $11.67 per month.


----------



## lasergecko

OrangeKid said:


> They are also charging $5.12 for the Digital Service/Digital Gateway.


So you're only paying _one_ digital gateway fee? Yippee! I get to pay _two_ .

That freaking figures. No one down there knows their ass from a hole in the ground.


----------



## OrangeKid

lasergecko said:


> So you're only paying _one_ digital gateway fee? Yippee! I get to pay _two_ .
> 
> That freaking figures. No one down there knows their ass from a hole in the ground.


Shhhh! I don't want Cox to find out.


----------



## john69az

You would think they would charge only 1 fee for the digital gateway. The point of entry to your home from the cable. I am in Phoenix and am considering the S3 I currently just have basic cable and high speed internet. I am also Jacked about the 5.00 more a month I am paying for internet because they say its now 7mb download. Hell I never got 6mb throughput usually around 4 or 5mbs. 

ShawnGt besides the free Local HDTV what other channels do you get that are not premium HD?

I remember when cox wanted to charge for each additional computer on my internet and that didn't go over well as most people have home networked on thier own.


----------



## moyekj

I was very happy to see my cable bill decreased $10/month after returning the Cox DVR. The CableCard charges for Cox Orange County, CA are pretty reasonable IMO:
Cablecards: 2*$1.99 = $3.98
1 additional outlet fee of $1.49
=> $5.47/month for 2 CableCards for the S3. Since I got the 3 year prepaid service for $300 I'm paying the equivalent of $8.33/month for Tivo service so total for S3 is: $13.80/month

This compared to $15/month previously for Cox for Motorola DVR box rental + DVR service fee. So of course other than the up front cost of $800 or so for the S3 I don't feel like I'm getting totally ripped off for a definite upgrade to a decent DVR that I can add more storage space to and also record OTA.


----------



## Mikial007

I had a Cox install three weeks ago.

First I was told the issue was a cablecard issue and that I needed a software update. Next I was told that new cards would have to be issued and installed. After spending three weeks dealing with tech support, and enduring three on-site visits, I have been told that Cox does not "map" channel 725 (MTV HD) to CableCards and has no intent to do so in the future.

Is anyone getting MTV-HD? Can Cox selectively choose which channels are provided to CableCard customers? I have to believe they are running affoul of FCC rules by doing so.

Any assistance would be greatly appreciated...


----------



## OrangeKid

Mikial007 said:


> I had a Cox install three weeks ago.
> 
> First I was told the issue was a cablecard issue and that I needed a software update. Next I was told that new cards would have to be issued and installed. After spending three weeks dealing with tech support, and enduring three on-site visits, I have been told that Cox does not "map" channel 725 (MTV HD) to CableCards and has no intent to do so in the future.
> 
> Is anyone getting MTV-HD? Can Cox selectively choose which channels are provided to CableCard customers? I have to believe they are running affoul of FCC rules by doing so.
> 
> Any assistance would be greatly appreciated...


I was told by the Cox second level technician that no one in Vegas with Cable Cards is getting 725. I certainly am not.


----------



## XBR

Mikial007 said:


> ...Is anyone getting MTV-HD?...


Yup (Orange County, CA); awhile ago I got the lineup change notification message and it had automatically added itself to the lineup, etc.


----------



## Shawn95GT

john69az said:


> You would think they would charge only 1 fee for the digital gateway. The point of entry to your home from the cable. I am in Phoenix and am considering the S3 I currently just have basic cable and high speed internet. I am also Jacked about the 5.00 more a month I am paying for internet because they say its now 7mb download. Hell I never got 6mb throughput usually around 4 or 5mbs.
> 
> ShawnGt besides the free Local HDTV what other channels do you get that are not premium HD?
> 
> I remember when cox wanted to charge for each additional computer on my internet and that didn't go over well as most people have home networked on thier own.


Besides the nets, non premium HD I get free:

719 - NFL HD - This might be a test channel. I havent' seen anything published that Cox carries it, but sometimes it has programming, sometimes not - lol.
720 - ESPN HD
721 - INHD1
723 - DHD (Discovery HD)
724 - Universal HD
725 - TNT HD
726 - MHD (MTV HD)
732 - ESPN 2 HD

This is what my Cable bill looks like (now):










The caveot to all this... When I was first installed, all I got was the nets and a spuratic mix of the digital channels. The supervisor stopped by and yelled at the home office to 'get this guy the HD channels he's paying for'. They had to open a new ticket to authorize the HD Channels (I'm guessing the HD Expanded tier on my bill).

If you read their site it says all the non-premium HD channels are included with ANY digital cable subscription .


----------



## john69az

I called today and was asking about cox service and was told I` could not get the HD locals without the HD service. I was really considering the whole package with everything was 74.00 a `month for 1 hd box and 1 cablecard with digital and all the tiers except the latino. Just alot of money thinking about directtv as they offer more hd channels.


----------



## Shawn95GT

john69az said:


> I called today and was asking about cox service and was told I` could not get the HD locals without the HD service. I was really considering the whole package with everything was 74.00 a `month for 1 hd box and 1 cablecard with digital and all the tiers except the latino. Just alot of money thinking about directtv as they offer more hd channels.


According to their site:

"A minimum service of Cox Digital Cable required to receive Discovery HD Theater, ESPN HD, Universal HD, TNT HD, iNHD and iNHD2. Subscription to Cox Digital Cable, HBO, Showtime and/or Starz required to receive HBO HDTV, Showtime HDTV and/or Starz HDTV respectively. "

What may have consued the rep is:

"An HD capable receiver rental ($10/mo.) and subscription to a minimum service level of Cox Basic Cable required to receive Cox Broadcast HD service."

In leu of the HD receiver you'd be using cablecards.

I got my replacement for S3 #2 yesterday and hooked it up tonight. I was amazed at what came in via 'in the clear' QAM. If only I could only get guide data...


----------



## General E

Roanoke install went very smoothly. The guy followed the Tivo instructions to the letter, and when we got an error that Tivo's website said to ignore, he had no problem ignoring it.

I watched some basketball on ESPN HD last night, and left the TV on Discovery HD all night long (still breaking in my Panasonic plasma). This morning, I switch from Discovery (still on) to a non-HD station, and when I try to switch back to Discovery (channel 702), I get nothing. 703 (ESPN HD, which I'd been watching the night before) is also gone. On both cards. All other HD channels (704 and up) are fine. I'm going to reset the Tivo and connect to the service before I make a call to Cox (the guy who installed my cablecards said that ESPN2HD was rolling out in Roanoke today ... I don't know if he was talking crap or what, but maybe some channels moved around).

On ALL my digital channels, I'm getting 100% signal strength according to Tivo, so I'm not sure what the story is there. Hopefully, I can get this resolved during my lunchbreak.


----------



## pkscout

Mikial007 said:


> I have been told that Cox does not "map" channel 725 (MTV HD) to CableCards and has no intent to do so in the future.
> 
> Is anyone getting MTV-HD? Can Cox selectively choose which channels are provided to CableCard customers? I have to believe they are running affoul of FCC rules by doing so.


It certainly seems to violate the spirit of the integration ban. Cox Las Vegas is providing something to their set top box renters that they can't or won't supply to cable card renters. If Cox is holding firm on this I'd go ahead and complain to the franchising authority and the FCC.


----------



## wickerbill

Had Cox install my two cable cards last night and they're working great. He had one bad card, but luckily he had an extra that he brought just in case. All my channels seem to be working well, though Tivo doesn't know about a few of them. I filed a report with Tivo for ESPN2HD. I think the NFL HD channel is on another channel, but the cox website only says that channel is a COXHD channel. The installer said that they're going to make it permanent at the beginning of the year. I figured I would wait to see if Tivo adds it then once it's officially a permanent channel.

After just having basic cable and an antenna for the last month, having cable cards installed is really nice. It's like getting a new tivo!


----------



## General E

wickerbill said:


> I filed a report with Tivo for ESPN2HD. I think the NFL HD channel is on another channel, but the cox website only says that channel is a COXHD channel. T


Looks like on the Roanoke side, ESPN2 has been added, and Discovery, TNT, and ESPN1 have all been moved. I was able to manually tune them, although (even after a service update) Tivo's guide data hasn't caught up. This explains why two of my channels disappeared this morning.

Where did you file your report with Tivo? I'd like to do the same.


----------



## wickerbill

Here's the form I filled out: http://customersupport.tivo.com/LineUpForm.aspx


----------



## OrangeKid

OrangeKid said:


> I was told by the Cox second level technician that no one in Vegas with Cable Cards is getting 725. I certainly am not.


The 8.0.1c service update I received today allows me to receive several channels that I did not receive before including HDMTV 725 and ESPN2 705 but I stopped receiving INHD2 707. Go figure. Several of the HD channels are duplicated on the program listing.

It appears as if it a Tivo issue not a cable company issue.

Correction: I do receive INHD2. I now receiver all the channels I am supposed to. So this upgrade was important.


----------



## XBR

My Series3's stopped receiving a bunch of channels sometime today, including all of the HD channels; some channels only had audio. As soon as I saw the "Pending Restart" while rooting around, I rebooted both and all seems well once again...8.0.1.c...


----------



## Sarge3515

General E said:


> My install is happening tomorrow. Question --- are they charging you the $6 "digital gateway" charge on EACH of your 2 Cablecards? They are for me. If not, what'd you say / do to get them to only charge you once (or not at all)?


I'll have to wait and see my bill since the change. I just turned in the old DVR box. I don't remember any gateway charge, just the $1.99 per card per month.


----------



## Prowest

I just got my CC install on Thursday for COX Cable in Lakewood, OH. The first card went in with no problems. The second card was a dog. They had to try three more cards over two hours before they got the second one to work. The tech told me that they have cleaned up their CC system a lot and it works well now, but the car reliability has been spotty still. He indicated that when you get a good card you are good to go, but sometimes you can go through a handful of crap cards before you get one that works. The techs were patient though and stuck it out until they got things workingvery good customer service.

:up: :up: :up: 

Dave


----------



## lasergecko

Cox Las Vegas

Well, I'm still seeing duplicate HD channels and have tried disabling the first ones in the line up with no difference.

However, I can now receive Mtv HD...and am quite surprised at the lineup of good shows this morning.

Still no response from the Supervisor guy.


----------



## OrangeKid

lasergecko said:


> Cox Las Vegas
> 
> Well, I'm still seeing duplicate HD channels and have tried disabling the first ones in the line up with no difference.
> 
> However, I can now receive Mtv HD...and am quite surprised at the lineup of good shows this morning.
> 
> Still no response from the Supervisor guy.


I have duplicates of 709, 731, 732, 733, 735. I receive all the channels I am signed up for. The duplicated channels are a minor inconvenience. I have no other issues such as audio or video dropouts.


----------



## lasergecko

The duplicates for me are killing all of my HD recordings since it defaults to the BLANK one. Hopefully, deleting them will stick this time.


----------



## OrangeKid

lasergecko said:


> The duplicates for me are killing all of my HD recordings since it defaults to the BLANK one. Hopefully, deleting them will stick this time.


Your situation is different than mine. My duplicates are live. It does not matter which of the two duplicates the Tivo records. You may want to report your issue to Tivo using the following link:

http://www.tivo.com/series3hdDvr_cc.asp

Another thing you may try is unchecking the duplicate that is blank on your channels received settings screen. Then the blank duplicate should not show up on your program guide.


----------



## mstrroissy

Cox Chesapeake, Va

Just had my cable cards installed in my S3 yesterday and it went fairly well. Cable guy showed up about halfway through his 10-12 appointment time. I greated him at the door, asked if he had ever done one of the tivo Series 3 and he said no. Strike 1. Ok so I see he pulls the cablecard out of his pocket to get to work, and he's only got one card. I asked him if he had another because I checked and rechecked (even called the Cox CSR the day before to make sure there were going to be two cards coming). The dispatcher actually told him the order was for two, but he thought it was an error. Strike 2. So he leaves to get the other card, about an hour later he gets back and brings another tech to "teach" him about the Tivo. Cards are in, he's actually reading the instructions.

So far so good, and he still has one strike left. Channel check time......Nothing but gray screen. Tivo has found the channels (you can see them in the top of the screen) but isn't getting the actual video signal.... so I think here it comes all the problems that everyone on the forum talks about and the 3+hour install. Tech phones home, and the digital tech resets the signal on thier end...and VOILA it works like a charm. All done. So far so good it's working great.

On a really good note if you live in the Greenbriar area, they are going to be getting all trained up on these. My two installers took the instructions back to the shop with them to photocopy and tell all the other techs what to expect and how to get these installs done.

Love my Series 3.


----------



## pmw2cc

I just had Cox Cable in Fairfax Virginia install CCs in my new S3. The experience went pretty well, the tech seemed to have some knowledge of Tivo and brought 3 cards with him. One thing he did mention was that the cards needed to be pushed in firmly to work. If you have problems in the future you might want to try that.


----------



## ChrisMc73

gwsat said:


> Cox OKC gave me a similar answer. Two CableCARDs would be ~ $8 a month and I would have to pay two installation charges, although both cards were to be installed in the same device. But while the installation charge for the first card would be $30, for the second, or more, it would drop to $15 each.
> 
> By the way, it's a pleasure to be back here. I first joined in 2001 but my original enrolment somehow slipped through the cracks, so I had to signup anew. I bought and used an S1 from 2000 until 2003, when Cox OKC finally started to offer HD DVRs. I have been waiting for a TiVo HD box for cable ever since.


Funny, I'm in OKC and I just called and this guy said TWO cards installed is only $30, and its only $1.99 for both cards, since its in same box...wow, I don't have a Series 3 yet, but this guys name is Vernon if you want to try to get this deal before his supervisors correct him!!! Reading all these threads has me wanting to ditch the Cox DVR and fork out the $799 for that HD Tivo.

I think I'm going to!


----------



## ChrisMc73

OrangeKid said:


> The 8.0.1c service update I received today allows me to receive several channels that I did not receive before including HDMTV 725 and ESPN2 705 but I stopped receiving INHD2 707. Go figure. Several of the HD channels are duplicated on the program listing.
> 
> It appears as if it a Tivo issue not a cable company issue.
> 
> Correction: I do receive INHD2. I now receiver all the channels I am supposed to. So this upgrade was important.


Cox has announced that INHD2 is going away and they are combining all the favorites of INHD2 into one channel with INHD1...so thats why it went away.


----------



## OrangeKid

ChrisMc73 said:


> Cox has announced that INHD2 is going away and they are combining all the favorites of INHD2 into one channel with INHD1...so thats why it went away.


Last I checked INHD2 was still on the air. I believe it goes away around the first of the year.


----------



## TivoTodd

Cox in Wichita, KS
1.99 per card per month
49.95 install per card (highway robbery!)
From what I have been told several times, I am only paying for one digital gateway, and one HD service. The net difference between renting the Cox HD DVR functionalities, and the two cards is gonna be about 14-16 bux.

The guy showed up today.. admitted he had never done this on a TiVo. Most of the install was painless, but during the "Channel Test", it took about 1-2 minutes for Card1 to get the encrypted digital channels, and about 10-15 minutes for Card2 to get them.
On both cards, right before we were able to see the channels, an error popped up on screen for the respective card, indicating we needed to call the cable company, and report error 141-6 (I think). He called.. Cox was clueless what that meant.

It works, so I am I happy.


----------



## ellinj

OrangeKid said:


> Last I checked INHD2 was still on the air. I believe it goes away around the first of the year.


Still getting INHD2 here in RI. I have heard that it will be going away soon as well. Wonder if they will replace it soon. What I really want ABC in Fox though.


----------



## Joe3

Wanted to drop a pay channel on the S3.
The rep opens my file and tries to talk me out of using the cable cards on my brand new TV.
" No In Demand," she says.
(I give up)
I tell her I like my brand new TV, just drop the pay channel.


----------



## jtown

Just to add to the list of inconsistent installation prices...

Cox OC, CA. $39.95 per card.

Fortunately, I got a decent rep when I called. I told him I needed to get two cablecards installed in a new Tivo. "Okay." Then nothing but a lot of typing for several minutes. Turns out he was trying to figure out why the system wanted to charge me $79.90 for the installation. Once he'd convinced himself that he'd entered the job correctly, I said that the installation charge was ridiculous. Charged twice for a single installation job on a single device. He agreed and put me on hold for a few minutes. Came back and said they'd drop the second charge. "But make sure they still bring two cards!" "Of course."

I'd been considering requesting two separate installations if they insisted on charging me the full amount. "One 8-10 and one 10-12, please. Be sure to schedule someone else in between." Get my money's worth. 

Still not sure what the monthly rate will be. The rep in the store said $2/card. When I inquired about the outlet fee, he mumbled something I didn't quite catch. I didn't push since we were in the middle of negotiating a new package deal and there were bigger issues at stake like cheap HBO/SHO and cheaper/faster internet. So somewhere between $4 and $7/month for the pair.

I'll have to take a good look at the next full bill to see exactly what I'm being charged.


----------



## pkscout

Cox Las Vegas. Two guys came yesterday, one was a trainee. The other guy had apparently done a TiVo or two, and he was walking the new guy through. It took them about an hour to do the TiVo, phone, and internet service. No problems, but the one guy was *hilarious.* He was on the phone with Cox dispatch and ended up with this woman who wouldn't listen to him, kept trying to tell him what to do, and kept saying she wasn't going to wait for him. So he hung up on her, called back, and got someone else.

The only thing I'm disappointed about is that I'm getting analog channels below 99 even though Las Vegas is apparently nearly the end of it's digital transition. Some folks on the AVS Forum think that either Cox will have to do something special to get the digital versions of those stations with the CableCard or that it will never happen for Cablecards. I think I'll wait until Cox makes an official announcement about the transition and then call, but that seems like the definition of anti-competitive.

Anybody in Las Vegas getting the digital versions of the sub 99 stations? If so, what did you tell Cox to get them?


----------



## gwsat

ChrisMc73 said:


> Funny, I'm in OKC and I just called and this guy said TWO cards installed is only $30, and its only $1.99 for both cards, since its in same box...wow, I don't have a Series 3 yet, but this guys name is Vernon if you want to try to get this deal before his supervisors correct him!!! Reading all these threads has me wanting to ditch the Cox DVR and fork out the $799 for that HD Tivo.
> 
> I think I'm going to!


Thats really good news! I guess Cox OKC finally figured out that the installation fees and a double CableCARD charge for two cards that go in the same box would be unfair.

A couple of years ago, I bought an HD TiVo for my son to use with his D* system but, so far, I have been too stingy  and lazy, given the attendant problems of installing a new piece of gear  to buy an S3 for myself. I have to hurry if Im going to get one because TiVos offer to transfer the lifetime service contract on my old S1 expires if I dont buy an S3 by the end of the month.


----------



## ChrisMc73

gwsat said:


> Thats really good news! I guess Cox OKC finally figured out that the installation fees and a double CableCARD charge for two cards that go in the same box would be unfair.
> 
> A couple of years ago, I bought an HD TiVo for my son to use with his D* system but, so far, I have been too stingy  and lazy, given the attendant problems of installing a new piece of gear  to buy an S3 for myself. I have to hurry if Im going to get one because TiVos offer to transfer the lifetime service contract on my old S1 expires if I dont buy an S3 by the end of the month.


Ultimate Electronics has a deal that is over tonight, Saturday, that if you buy an HD TV of $1999 or more, you get 50% off the Series 3 Tivo...I just bought an HD TV and I'm thinking of doing this. Its a good price, $400 for the HD box.


----------



## gwsat

ChrisMc73 said:


> Ultimate Electronics has a deal that is over tonight, Saturday, that if you buy an HD TV of $1999 or more, you get 50% off the Series 3 Tivo...I just bought an HD TV and I'm thinking of doing this. Its a good price, $400 for the HD box.


I would jump all over that if I could. As it happens, I bought a second HDTV last summer so Ultimate Electronics offer doesnt work for me. I ordered an S3 this afternoon for $629.85, which makes getting one for $400 sound GREAT.


----------



## ChrisMc73

gwsat said:


> I would jump all over that if I could. As it happens, I bought a second HDTV last summer so Ultimate Electronics offer doesnt work for me. I ordered an S3 this afternoon for $629.85, which makes getting one for $400 sound GREAT.


I did, I went and purchased it last night, along with the wireless network adapter.

I now need to call Cox and have them install these 2 cable cards and I'm ready to become a Tivo'er!! :up:


----------



## gwsat

ChrisMc73 said:


> I did, I went and purchased it last night, along with the wireless network adapter.
> 
> I now need to call Cox and have them install these 2 cable cards and I'm ready to become a Tivo'er!! :up:


You will love it. I have really missed my S1 since I replaced it with the Cox SA 8X00 HD boxes. The SA boxes have worked but their software is primitive by TiVo standards. I can hardly wait for my S3 to come.

I have an old Linksys wireless access point, which I intend to use to connect my S3 to my wireless network, so I dont think I need to buy a TiVo wireless adapter.


----------



## kelley

Our owned Dish 942 HD-DVR went out, well I don't like the idea of spending $200 to get into a new box and not own it and on top of that be in a service contract. I've tried several OTA recievers, but none of them have picked up all the channels. So that brings me to Cox, does anyone know if I can get the CableCard installed now into my TV and then buy a TiVo and just plug the card into it? I plan to pick up a S3 next month for my birthday, but I'd like to atleast have something to watch now.


----------



## ChrisMc73

kelley said:


> Our owned Dish 942 HD-DVR went out, well I don't like the idea of spending $200 to get into a new box and not own it and on top of that be in a service contract. I've tried several OTA recievers, but none of them have picked up all the channels. So that brings me to Cox, does anyone know if I can get the CableCard installed now into my TV and then buy a TiVo and just plug the card into it? I plan to pick up a S3 next month for my birthday, but I'd like to atleast have something to watch now.


Thats exactly what you can do. 
If you want dual tuners, you have to request 2 cable cards to be installed, and there is no self install, they have to do it.

Right now Cox is charging $1.99 a card plus a $30 install fee. Make sure you tell them its 2 cards going into 1 box, so they don't try to charge you two install fees.

I just bought my Series 3 and I'm going to call Cox to have this setup.
I'm wondering, with these cable cards, do I still have access to On Demand stuff from Cox or is that gone?


----------



## jon96cobra

pmw2cc said:


> I just had Cox Cable in Fairfax Virginia install CCs in my new S3. The experience went pretty well, the tech seemed to have some knowledge of Tivo and brought 3 cards with him. One thing he did mention was that the cards needed to be pushed in firmly to work. If you have problems in the future you might want to try that.


How did they bill you for the 2 cable cards?
I was told it was going to be simular to the bill I get now with they HD stations and Digital gateway.

They also didn't mention when I called a fee with the install of the 2 cards.

All I have to do is activate the series 3 before they come out to install the cards.


----------



## steelio

TivoTodd said:


> Cox in Wichita, KS
> 1.99 per card per month
> 49.95 install per card (highway robbery!)
> From what I have been told several times, I am only paying for one digital gateway, and one HD service. The net difference between renting the Cox HD DVR functionalities, and the two cards is gonna be about 14-16 bux.
> 
> The guy showed up today.. admitted he had never done this on a TiVo. Most of the install was painless, but during the "Channel Test", it took about 1-2 minutes for Card1 to get the encrypted digital channels, and about 10-15 minutes for Card2 to get them.
> On both cards, right before we were able to see the channels, an error popped up on screen for the respective card, indicating we needed to call the cable company, and report error 141-6 (I think). He called.. Cox was clueless what that meant.
> 
> It works, so I am I happy.


Yeah I am getting my cards installed on 1/4/7 I told them if they want to charge me $50 per card per install. I told them that I wanted to setup an appointment on 1/4/7 and then another appointment on 1/5/7. What extra benefit do I get if they charge the same for 1 install or 2? I am not going to be needing the extra tuner for that extra day anyway.


----------



## ehardman

TivoTodd said:


> Cox in Wichita, KS
> 1.99 per card per month
> 49.95 install per card (highway robbery!)
> From what I have been told several times, I am only paying for one digital gateway, and one HD service. The net difference between renting the Cox HD DVR functionalities, and the two cards is gonna be about 14-16 bux.
> 
> The guy showed up today.. admitted he had never done this on a TiVo. Most of the install was painless, but during the "Channel Test", it took about 1-2 minutes for Card1 to get the encrypted digital channels, and about 10-15 minutes for Card2 to get them.
> On both cards, right before we were able to see the channels, an error popped up on screen for the respective card, indicating we needed to call the cable company, and report error 141-6 (I think). He called.. Cox was clueless what that meant.
> 
> It works, so I am I happy.


I have Cox in Salina, KS. When I got the bill and it showed two install charges at $49.99 each, I called customer service and they agreed to take one $49.95 charge off my bill. Give it a try.


----------



## gwsat

ehardman said:


> I have Cox in Salina, KS. When I got the bill and it showed two install charges at $49.99 each, I called customer service and they agreed to take one $49.95 charge off my bill. Give it a try.


I dont know what Cox OKCs policy is on dual CableCARD installation charges or double digital gateway fees but if I get charged double on either (my S3 isnt here yet) I will ask customer service to correct it.


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## steelio

I am going to try and call and ask them when I get my bill. That is just plain ass BS to charge that per card in 1 device. 
I did just get a call over my lunch from Cox. Seems they called the house to ask the wife what kind of a TV they are installing the cards into because they forgot to do that when setting the appt. And then the wife told them to call me. I said it doesnt matter the TV it is going into a TiVo. He said ok great you have a tivo but what Tv are the cards going into. I said the cards are going into a T I V O. He says oh ok just a sec. Then he asks what is the model of tivo? I tell you what if I could get ESPN HD over the air I would not worry about this cablecard crap @ all. 
So now I have to wait for the Tech to give me a call. What total and utter BS.


----------



## wickerbill

ChrisMc73 said:


> I just bought my Series 3 and I'm going to call Cox to have this setup.
> I'm wondering, with these cable cards, do I still have access to On Demand stuff from Cox or is that gone?


On Demand doesn't work with the series 3 or cable cards in general. Looks like you'll have to find another source to watch the Fiesta Bowl again.


----------



## steelio

wickerbill said:


> On Demand doesn't work with the series 3 or cable cards in general. Looks like you'll have to find another source to watch the Fiesta Bowl again.


Ouch. Yeah that game was so good I bet they put it on the in demand.


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## ehardman

If you order from Cox via their on-line ordering, will the Series 3 show the PPV/In-damand programming? I haven't tried this yet since we get our movies via Netflix.


----------



## ChrisMc73

wickerbill said:


> On Demand doesn't work with the series 3 or cable cards in general. Looks like you'll have to find another source to watch the Fiesta Bowl again.


I don't care to watch the Fiesta Bowl again, I've seen those highlights plenty, and the outcome is NEVER what I want!

:down:


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## jon96cobra

I called about the charge for putting in 2 cable cards into one device and they told me should just be for the one device not for the 2 cards. I have the tech coming by the house today to install them I will see what he does and tell him they told me it was per device.


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## Dick Kalagher

jon96cobra said:


> I called about the charge for putting in 2 cable cards into one device and they told me should just be for the one device not for the 2 cards. I have the tech coming by the house today to install them I will see what he does and tell him they told me it was per device.


The real question is whether they will charge you two "digital gateway" fees. Let us know.


----------



## ChrisMc73

ehardman said:


> I got my replacement Tivo from Circuity City and had Cox come for attempt #2 Friday afternoon. The same technician came again as he is now the "expert" for Cox locally. He got the replacement Tivo up and running in about 20 minutes.
> 
> Everything went very smooth once I had a unit with two working cable card slots.


I've had 6 cards not work at all, so I'm going to assume this is a cable card slot issue and return this bad boy and have them try again!

Thanks for the post.


----------



## TheRatPatrol

Is the Series 3 compatible with "switched" networking (whatever its called) that some cable companys will be going to?

Thanks


----------



## kelley

I had my CableCard installed into my TV yesterday, one more month until I can order my Series 3. First card worked just fine.


----------



## moyekj

theratpatrol said:


> Is the Series 3 compatible with "switched" networking (whatever its called) that some cable companys will be going to?
> 
> Thanks


 No it will not work with Switched Digital Video (SDV) channels if/when they are deployed by Cox. So far though AFAIK no Cox market has deployed this technology yet and if they do it should be limited to the least watched channels so may even not be a factor for you.


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## dt_dc

moyekj said:


> So far though AFAIK no Cox market has deployed this technology yet


Cox had an SDV trial in Tyler Tx. with 2,000 participants and has announced plans to deploy SDV in two (undisclosed) markets.


----------



## moyekj

dt_dc said:


> Cox had an SDV trial in Tyler Tx. with 2,000 participants and has announced plans to deploy SDV in two (undisclosed) markets.


 Yes, and I heard unofficially that my market (Orange County, CA) is one of those markets - to happen sometime this year. Since I record mostly HD locals on the S3 I'm not too worried about it since as last resort I can go with OTA for most of those. Just hoping that some of the more popular cable channels do not go SDV (such as SciFi, ESPNHD, TNTHD).


----------



## jtown

Man, I can understand why the average consumer would give up on this.

My installer showed up this weekend and said he'd done a few of these installations before and never had any problem. He installed the first card and got the 161-4 error. "I've never seen that before." "You can ignore it." He finally did but the channel test didn't work for premium channels. Got everything _but_ premium channels. Including HD. The card was paired, the CA data was there, the channel lineup was available. It just wasn't authorized for my full lineup.

The installer kept trying to say that the 161-4 error was probably to blame and installed the second card to see what would happen. Same thing. He started making calls to "digi-ops" but nobody was there because it was the weekend. Every time he left a message, he referenced the 161-4 error and said that he thought he was dealing with a bad tivo.

That just got me steaming. Obviously, the tivo was able to access the card and the cable company was able to hit the card or it wouldn't work at all. This was clearly a problem with the person on the other end failing to authorize the full channel lineup on my cards before hitting them. When I pointed this out, the installer said, "Oh, no. He knows what he's doing. He's done Tivos before." Finally, he started over with a new card, specifically stating that everything but premium channels were working on the existing cards. For some reason, it took a lot longer for them to hit the new card. Probably 15 minutes before it finally paired. In the mean time, the installer was leaving more messages about the 161-4 error and probable defective Tivo.

Then the new card was hit and all the right channels came in. I'll bet it took so long because the guy on the other end made sure he was authorizing the right lineup this time.  He put in the second card and, 2 minutes later, we were done.

The whole process took nearly 90 minutes. It should have taken about 15 if both the installer and the person on the other end of the phone had a thorough understanding of what they were doing (which would have enabled them to effectively troubleshoot the problem).

If I had been uninformed and believed the installer, I would have thought the 161-4 error meant my Tivo was defective. If the installer _had_ been informed, he wouldn't have wasted the better part of an hour trying to get someone in digi-ops. He would have called back the first guy and said, "Hey, did you authorize all the right packages correctly?" and that would have fixed the problem.

I don't understand why cable companies refuse to train their staff to properly handle cablecards. It doesn't make sense. The cable companies should _love_ cablecards. It ties consumers into their system. If I'm renting their DVR for $15/month with no contract, I have no ties to them and no incentive to stay with them if I get a better offer from a satellite provider. But, when I've got $600+ tied up in a piece of equipment that requires cablecards to achieve its full potential, the cable company should be stoked. Yeah, I'm no longer giving them $15/month for their box but they trade that bit of income for the knowledge that I'm much less likely to switch to satellite as long as I've got those cards in my box. And they get $4/month (and a $40 install fee!) for the card rental.

I just don't understand why they want to make this process so difficult. They should be ecstatic about any technology that ties their customers to them.


----------



## thatothergirl

I have Cox in San Diego. When I called to schedule the cable card install, I was quoted $30 for the install and $2 per card per month (so, $4 per month). The girl had never booked an order for cable cards and put me on hold for a while (reading the instructions?) and then had a bit of a hard time with the idea that there are 2, and they're going into a Tivo not a television (obviously not covered in the instructions), but she seemed to get it worked out.

The rep came out (on time) on Saturday, Dec. 30th. He had done a few Tivo installs before; he did refer to the Tivo-provided instruction sheet but seemed to have a good grasp on what he was doing. The only bump in the process was our weak cable signal -- we've always gotten a weak signal in our apartment building, and he was concerned that the signal wouldn't be strong enough to "reach" the cable cards (my term, not his). After a while of the cards not picking up the authorization, he decided to remove the signal amplifier that had previously been installed on our line. Then he called to have the auth signal resent, and we waited with baited breath. It worked! He put the second card in, called it in, waited, it wasn't picking it up, called for another signal resend, and ta da!

I can't quite remember how long he was there for... sometime between 40 - 60 minutes, I think.

A few days later we received the upgrade drive we had ordered, and we were nervous that after the install the cable cards wouldn't work anymore and Cox would insist that we needed another $30 visit. The cards were indeed not functioning once the install was done, so I called tech support and just said that my cards "seemed to have lost their authorization, could you resend the authorization signal?" - she put me on hold for a couple of minutes, then asked me to check my channels, and poof, there they were!

Overall, not too bad at all - the only thing remaining to see is whether my bill will be accurate to the price they quoted me.


----------



## ChrisMc73

I'm still having issues...after finally getting a Tivo to read the cards, and a cable guy to come out and activate them, I still have issues!!

Cable Card 2 doesn't have any premium channels, I can get some of the HD channels, like my local ones, but not ESPN, HBO, SHO, INHD, etc...

Called Tivo, the card is ready and set fine for accepting the Cox signal, so he told me to call Cox and have them refresh it, they said they did but nothing happened. Only thing I can think of was he refreshed the wrong card, maybe Card 1 which works, or my other HD DVR Box that is theirs I still haven't returned? Or the card just is messing up or not configured right...yet.

Then sometimes, even on Cable Card 1 that works 75% of the time, other times certain channels dont show up then show up all of a sudden after not doing anything...??

I know that when I record, and then try to view TV (using the 2nd card I'm assuming) I get same results as above, see some basic channels but no premiums.

Singnal strenghts are really high, even on stations that are not returning anything but a blank screen. Been through the setup a few times as well.

Any ideas to what I'm experiencing? I'm about to scrap Tivo and just go with the Cox stuff that works...it shouldn't be this hard.


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## Jombi122

thatothergirl said:


> I have Cox in San Diego. When I called to schedule the cable card install, I was quoted $30 for the install and $2 per card per month (so, $4 per month).


I also live in loverly Sandy Ago and have Cox (North) but when I had my two CC installed about 4 weeks ago I was charged $30 per card. I wasn't happy when I scheduled it and challenged the scheduler several times but she wouldn't budge. Can you confirm that you were only charged $30 once?

Also are you in Cox South or North?

Thanks


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## ChrisMc73

Ok Cox Subscribers...I know the Digital Gateway issue has been discussed before, but let me ask something its about the Music Choice channels, I didn't have them yesterday on the one cable card that works, so I called into Cox and they said it was part of another package I didn't have on my cards, that was only $2 a month, so I had him add it to both cards, so I can get those music channels...I said is this the Digital Gateway he said yes it was called that, something new now, but same thing...and it basically has those channels and some of the Menus/Guides and PPV? Is this right to your understanding?


----------



## ehardman

ChrisMc73 said:


> I'm still having issues...after finally getting a Tivo to read the cards, and a cable guy to come out and activate them, I still have issues!!
> 
> Cable Card 2 doesn't have any premium channels, I can get some of the HD channels, like my local ones, but not ESPN, HBO, SHO, INHD, etc...
> 
> Called Tivo, the card is ready and set fine for accepting the Cox signal, so he told me to call Cox and have them refresh it, they said they did but nothing happened. Only thing I can think of was he refreshed the wrong card, maybe Card 1 which works, or my other HD DVR Box that is theirs I still haven't returned? Or the card just is messing up or not configured right...yet.
> 
> Then sometimes, even on Cable Card 1 that works 75% of the time, other times certain channels dont show up then show up all of a sudden after not doing anything...??
> 
> I know that when I record, and then try to view TV (using the 2nd card I'm assuming) I get same results as above, see some basic channels but no premiums.
> 
> Singnal strenghts are really high, even on stations that are not returning anything but a blank screen. Been through the setup a few times as well.
> 
> Any ideas to what I'm experiencing? I'm about to scrap Tivo and just go with the Cox stuff that works...it shouldn't be this hard.


Call Cox and have them send a "Cold Hit" to both of the cards. A refresh will not solve the problem.


----------



## ujculbe

Jombi122 said:


> I also live in loverly Sandy Ago and have Cox (North) but when I had my two CC installed about 4 weeks ago I was charged $30 per card. I wasn't happy when I scheduled it and challenged the scheduler several times but she wouldn't budge. Can you confirm that you were only charged $30 once?
> 
> Also are you in Cox South or North?
> 
> Thanks


Given that in Fort Smith, AR Cox is charging $50 per card, I'd settle for $30 per card. I've called several times to try to get this changed, but they won't budge either. Highway robbery! But, that's what monopoly power will get you, I suppose.


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## fredr1

I use Cox San Diego (North County). After having my two cable cards installed ($30 each!) I find that I no longer recieve the local radio station simulcast (channels 948 and up). I get all the digital music channels, which are part of the same "package", so I'm not sure what's up. Can any other San Diego people confirm that their radio channels have disappeared? Try 952, 953, and 954, for example. Thanks,

Fredr1


----------



## ChrisMc73

ehardman said:


> Call Cox and have them send a "Cold Hit" to both of the cards. A refresh will not solve the problem.


It was a bad card in #2 or one that wasn't taking hits, so he replaced it, activated the new one, had the hits sent, and now both my tuners work!!!

I'm very happy now I can attempt to play with the true functionality of this thing!


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## pkscout

Cox, Las Vegas.

I just got my first bill and I did (as I expected) get charged two installation fees of $30 each for the cards. I think I'm going to get over it and move on with my life. Watching the installer, he did have to repeat the entire process for both cards, so it really was two installs. The only thing he didn't have to do was leave and come back. I also got charged for internet install and phone install, all for one visit. So really the install charge is per action, not per visit. Yes, they make a bit more when you do multiple actions but, as I said, I'm just going to stop worrying.

I found out that here there is no "HD Tier." If you get one of the digital tiers (not just the gateway) you should be able to get the HD channels (i.e. TNT-HD, Discovery HD Theater, INHD, ESPNHD and ESPN2HD). So I think I might call tonight and talk to someone about that. While I'm at it I'll see about getting the digital simulcast of 1-99 too. Apparently they are done with that transition here but haven't announced it. The local cable shill on the AVS Forum local board for LV said you might have to have a STB to get the digital simulcasts, but I'll give it a whirl anyway.


----------



## jtown

ChrisMc73 said:


> It was a bad card in #2 or one that wasn't taking hits, so he replaced it, activated the new one, had the hits sent, and now both my tuners work!!!
> 
> I'm very happy now I can attempt to play with the true functionality of this thing!


It probably wasn't a bad card. It sounds like they didn't properly provision the second card during your initial installation. If it was a bad card, how did it pair? How did it receive the channel lineup? (If it hadn't paired and received the channel lineup, you would have received a message stating that no channels were available when you did the channel test.) Hitting a card with incorrect provisioning over and over won't help.

It is my understanding that both have to be configured individually for your specific channel lineup. If they set one up for the works and just added the second one to the account without specifically authorizing your premium and HD channels, they didn't finish the job. The tech on the other end of the phone during your last visit removed the "defective" card from your account, and added the replacement properly with a full channel lineup.



pkscout said:


> I found out that here there is no "HD Tier." If you get one of the digital tiers (not just the gateway) you should be able to get the HD channels (i.e. TNT-HD, Discovery HD Theater, INHD, ESPNHD and ESPN2HD). So I think I might call tonight and talk to someone about that. While I'm at it I'll see about getting the digital simulcast of 1-99 too. Apparently they are done with that transition here but haven't announced it.


As for digital simulcasts, you can check to see if it's already been done without having to trust the word of a CSR. Go to the signal strength meter (this will kill active recordings!) and flip through your regular channels. The meter only works on digital channels so, if there's a meter, it's digital.

And your full HD access may be a limited time offer. In my area, Cox is (was?) offering a year of HD for free (including Discovery and ESPN which are normally $5/month). Keep an eye on your bill to see if they slipped in some promo package that'll expire soon and start hitting you $5/month for Discovery/ESPN.


----------



## pkscout

jtown said:


> As for digital simulcasts, you can check to see if it's already been done without having to trust the word of a CSR. Go to the signal strength meter (this will kill active recordings!) and flip through your regular channels. The meter only works on digital channels so, if there's a meter, it's digital.


No, I'm definitely getting the analogs 1 - 99. Every time I record something it asks in what quality I want to record it.



jtown said:


> And your full HD access may be a limited time offer. In my area, Cox is (was?) offering a year of HD for free (including Discovery and ESPN which are normally $5/month). Keep an eye on your bill to see if they slipped in some promo package that'll expire soon and start hitting you $5/month for Discovery/ESPN.


I've looked and looked and looked at the Cox Las Vegas site, and there is no mention of a cost for the HD channels. I guess the extra rent they charge you for the HD box must cover the channel costs. Maybe with the cablecards they will charge a tier fee. I have no idea.


----------



## gwsat

Cox OKC installed my CableCARDs this morning and got everything to work  finally. As happened to ChrisMc73, one of the cards that Cox OKC installed was (apparently) defective. Fortunately, my installer, a conscientious young guy, was able to find another Cox tech who was working just a few blocks away who had a spare CableCARD. It worked.

All three cards the tech had were made by Scientific Atlanta and had been remanufactured. Make of that what you will.


----------



## jtown

pkscout said:


> No, I'm definitely getting the analogs 1 - 99. Every time I record something it asks in what quality I want to record it.


So does mine, even though I have no analog channels at all available (that I know of). I think it's just easier to slip a snippet of "if digital, then ignore quality" code in the system than it would be to retool the user interface. Not to mention having to explain to users why the quality setting can't be configured on some channels. And it would get really weird for wish lists that cover a mix of analog and digital channels.

Jamie


----------



## fzz

S3 works for a while. COX RI

Well, 4 cable card swap-outs later and I'm stumped. Unlike other posts, I have been able to get my cards installed correctly. Initially, both cards seem to work perfectly for all service tiers (Digital, HD, Premium (HBO, Cinemax and Starz)). but then after a while I loose the premiums on my 2nd tuner. Sometime it's taken 2 weeks to fail and most recently it was under a day! 

I should also mention that, for some reason I can't seem and have never been able to tune in 144 (DIY) or 135 (SPEED). Nor have I been able to get any digital music channels (901-941 range). For these "problematic" channels I get heavy tiling and audio dropouts. The techs (I have 3 different ones come) have all checked the signal strength on my line and I've got plenty of signal. I've also used the S3 signal strength meter and on problem channels it never dips below 93 and usually hovers around 97-98 (for all channels). 

I had the technician out again last night to fix my problem with HBO (et al) on the 2nd cable card. He popped out the card, popped in a new one and the S3 didn't detect it! He tried another card and same thing. I rebooted the S3 with the 2nd new card in it and he came up, detected the new card and walked us through the MMI provisioning page. The Tech called in the card and voila...HBO on the 2nd tuner again. 

I showed him my DIY/SPEED/Music channel problem. He thought it was stranged, called up the office and had them check the signal on 144 and 135. Everything appeared fine. He then asked them to make sure both cards were properly provisioned for all packages (digital, premiums, hd...etc.) and everything was fine. He checked my wiring and temporarily replaced my spliter with a pass through, no difference!

We then speculated that may the 1st cable card was bad. I had never swapped that card out since the first installation so I thought, what the heck! He swaps out the card, provisions it...still same problem (can't get 135, 144 or 901-941).

Oh well. At least all the OTHER channels seems to working properly on both tuners! (this is Last night at about 7pm -- tech was at my house troubleshooting for 2 hours!)

Wake up this morning to catch something on HBO -- Guess what! I can't tune it in on the 2nd tuner! AAAAARGH!

Questions:
1) Could it be the S3? 4 different cable cards, everything (except DIY et al.) works fine for a while, then EXACT same failure mode (can't tune in premium tier on 2nd card)?
2) Is anyone else experiencing problems with like this where the S3/CCARDS work for a while then stop working on only one tuner!)

By the way, it seems like rebooting the box seems to fix the problem for a little while but the problem always reoccurs

The really crappy thing in all of this is that I've never worried about TIVO missing a program. I have two other S2's that have been working FLAWLESSY for 4 years. I've had the S3 for 30 days and already I've had handfuls of problems. Not to mention, when I leave I'm always wondering which tuner I'm going to get to record my shows and what suprise awaits me when I go to watch it later!


----------



## phoenixZed

Well, after the Dell deal last month, I decided to retire my S1 to secondary service after six years of faithful performance. Today, Cox Fairfax came out to install my CCs. They showed up 10 minutes into the 2 hour appointment window, one experienced tech and one just learning the ropes. As they came in, they confirmed they were here to install CCs in a DVR. I asked if they had worked on a TiVo previously, and the experienced guy said he had done one last week, but it was the junior guy's first. 

The first CC install went smoothly. They only glanced at the instructions, but they seemed followed them OK. They installed one card at a time, waited for the first card to fully initialize, and tested the channels before moving on to the second card. That's when the fun started  

The second card initialized, but there were no channels. We wait...nothing, wait some more...nothing. The techs called into the home office to "hit" the cards again, we wait, and then a couple of channels show up. We waited, still just a couple of channels, "hit" the cards again, and the TiVo reboots. CC1 gets all the channels but CC2 only gets a couple. The tech suggests that CC2 is bad, so I ask him if he has any spares. He says no, he only has these two. I ask if there is another tech in the area who might have some, and he tells me they are only provisioned each day with equipment for that day's work, so if another tech had some, he couldn't use them since they are allotted to another customer. Uh-oh. 

He called the home office to ask about swapping the cards to try troubleshoot whether it is the CCs or the TiVo that was acting up, but they were pessimistic. At this point I am thinking it's looking like I'll need another appointment, when the junior guy said he thought he might have another CC in the truck. He said it was a "lost" card, I guess meaning it hadn't been turned back into inventory. He returned with the "lost" CC, they install and initialize it, a couple of minutes go by, and we're golden  

While we were waiting on the "lost" CC to fully initialize, the techs looked at the bad card. They saw a couple of dings, but when they turned it over, it split open like a bad clam!!! The interior circuits were exposed for all to see. The senior tech just shook his head, saying he had just pulled it out of inventory this morning as new. I am just glad it didn't come apart inside the TiVo! 

A couple of notes, the senior tech said the TiVo needed 2006 cards. His other TiVo install failed when he used 2005 CCs. Evidently the old cards don't have the right firmware. My CCs are SA v2.3.149s2. Also the techs seemed surprised that the S3's had been out since the fall, they only heard about them in the past couple weeks. They laughed and said it figured they were the last to know. 

All in all, a big thumbs up :up: to Cox Fairfax. They spent about an hour an half, took their time, worked the problems, and got me set up. Now let's just hope the CCs don't go bad..


----------



## brndnkjns

fzz said:


> ...
> By the way, it seems like rebooting the box seems to fix the problem for a little while but the problem always reoccurs
> 
> ...


I've been experiencing the exact same problem here in Phoenix and haven't been able to figure it out. Rebooting the box to watch TV is getting old. Cox points at Tivo and Tivo points at Cox. Frustrating.


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## Shawn95GT

brndnkjns said:


> I've been experiencing the exact same problem here in Phoenix and haven't been able to figure it out. Rebooting the box to watch TV is getting old. Cox points at Tivo and Tivo points at Cox. Frustrating.


I had the same problem for about the first week (Also Cox Phoenix). After that it settled down.

In the process of trouble shooting the problem I un-hooked the off-air antenna since most of the off-air stuff was duplicated in the cable lineup. No problems since.

My 2nd S3 was connected to off-air and analog cable with no cablecards. This Tivo did all kind of wierd things. The second tuner would randomly just show 'no signal' from cable or the antenna source. When tuner 2 was working it would intemittently show lines in the picture as well as strange color band in the analog picture. While troubleshooting the problem with Tivo on the phone we managed to get both tuners 'stuck' on a channel. The banner would change, but the picture was stuck on whatever channel it was displaying.

It would have been funny if this wasn't such an expensive toy  . Tivo is exchanging this box and as far as I know the replacement is on the way. Here's hoping for a referb with an orange display :up: .


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## fredr1

I have Cox San Diego and per my note above was unable to recieve some radio simulcast channels that come packaged with digital music on either card (in addition to missing audio on a couple of "lower" digital channels like Discovery Health and some local access channels). All of those channels worked fine with the converter box and the odds of 2 cards being bad for exactly the same channels are pretty dang slim. The tech really knew what he was doing and did everything including checking signal strength, adding a booster, and running a cable directly from the street box a couple doors down into my Tivo. Nothing fixed the problem and ultimately it looks like the problem is on the Tivo decoding side. This is similar to another forum here about missing audio from 4 channels. HOpefully software update 8.1 (if/when it's released!) will fix the problem! I'm calling Tivo this week just to register the problem.

Fred


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## Shawn95GT

I don't know. I think cablecards just require more work on the back end ot get setup correctly vs a STB. I have a co-worker who gave up on cablecard in his TV for the exact same problems many of us are reporting with our S3s (missing channels etc).

I concider myself lucky because for the most part my S3 with SA cablecards hasn't sneezed. I notice when surfing that'll I'll sometimes get a grey screen when changing channels fast. a quick channel up/down brings the channel right back in.

I have yet to miss a recording due to a cablecard problem.


----------



## pkscout

Shawn95GT said:


> I don't know. I think cablecards just require more work on the back end ot get setup correctly vs a STB. I have a co-worker who gave up on cablecard in his TV for the exact same problems many of us are reporting with our S3s (missing channels etc).
> 
> I concider myself lucky because for the most part my S3 with SA cablecards hasn't sneezed. I notice when surfing that'll I'll sometimes get a grey screen when changing channels fast. a quick channel up/down brings the channel right back in.
> 
> I have yet to miss a recording due to a cablecard problem.


Cablecards are definitely more work on the back end. I found out yesterday that I was suppose to get all the HD channels (the in the clear QAM and the encrypted stuff like ESPNHD). This is my first time with Cox and I didn't know the HD "tier" was free with digital cable. Apparently my cards hadn't been properly provisioned during install. So a tech had to do something on his end to fix it.

I would feel bad for the cable companies having something that requires so much manual intervention if it weren't for the fact that they designed the system, so it's their own fault it's so much work.


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## steelio

I think the cable companies just want to fight it to fight it. I mean they should be embracing this. I would have gone to DTV or Dish or something else if I could not get these cable cards. 

I mean they wanted $50 per card to install them. that is $100 for my TiVo and for what!?! it really only took the guy like 10 mins or less to get it done. It took that long for the Tivo to boot up. I am paying for their training basically. And I refuse to do that!


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## gwar9999

I had called Cox in Santa Barbara today to inquire about obtaining CableCards before I went ahead and ordered a Tivo S3. I explained that I would need 2 CableCards and the person I spoke with _insisted_ the install would be exactly $59.99 for both. I had him clarify repeatedly. I then placed my Tivo order and called Cox back. The next guy I spoke with claimed it would be a staggering $120 for the install for the 2 cards. I explained that I was quoted $60 by the earlier guy. He pulled up the record of my earlier called and transferred me to the person I spoke with earlier. All of a sudden this guy pleads ignorance and after actually checking the cost it's magically $120. I'm waiting for a return call from a supervisor which should be enlightening. Does anybody have any experience with dealing w/ Cox regarding price quotes and their consistent gouging?

*Rant mode:*

In the past I haven't been able to accomplish anything with these Cox clowns who claim to be digital experts yet won't even support a digital connection to my TV (that is, they refuse to support HDMI from their supplied DVR which has HDCP issues with an A/V receiver in the middle-- they will only support component video aka analog). Digital Max? Please, more like Analog Max (or better yet, _Anal Max_). Given the fact that Cox has a monopoly of Santa Barbara cable and the satellite companies do not offer local HD channels the consumer is screwed courtesy of Anal Max, ouch. I'm starting to regret ordering the S3. I guess I can return it and defect to satellite because I think I can live without local HD channels knowing that I'm not giving Cox another $120.

FWIW, I called Tivo and the rep I spoke with said $120 is by far the highest amount he's heard of for 2 CableCards to be installed.


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## steelio

Ok I have a slight problem now. 
I got the cards "installed" last friday. They got them done for the most part then they(Cox)
ran into a snag and left without the Tivo working. Said they would call and let me fool with it for a while. (I really dont see why a user can not install these things)
Well i got them working and that part is fine. But the channel line up is the thing that is messing me up. I uncheck the channels I do not get. Which is basically all the digital channels but the HD stuff. But then they magically show back up. So when I go to the guide from 601(begin of the HD) I should see 70 on the same screen, but no I see channels 300's the premiums stay off. 
Any clues?


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## JPinAZ

I guess I got lucky. When I called for my install, I was told that I'd have an install charge for each card (50 X 2). Checking my account online only shows one charge though. I'll have to see what shows up on the paper bill.


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## fzz

fredr1 said:


> I have Cox San Diego and per my note above was unable to recieve some radio simulcast channels that come packaged with digital music on either card (in addition to missing audio on a couple of "lower" digital channels like Discovery Health and some local access channels). All of those channels worked fine with the converter box and the odds of 2 cards being bad for exactly the same channels are pretty dang slim. ... Nothing fixed the problem and ultimately it looks like the problem is on the Tivo decoding side. This is similar to another forum here about missing audio from 4 channels. HOpefully software update 8.1 (if/when it's released!) will fix the problem! I'm calling Tivo this week just to register the problem.
> Fred


The odds of it being Cable Cards drops even lower when two people on opposite sides of the country are having the same problems after almost 1/2 dozen card swap outs. Thanks for the info Fred. I'll call Tivo to register the problem as well. Maybe they'll escalate it.


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## VicV_1

I just finished setting up my new Series 3 box. The cable guy from Cox Cleveland is arriving in the morning to install the cable cards. They are $1.99 apeice and $40 for the install. Hope everything goes well with the install. There is so much less clutter from the Series 2 to the Series 3. My TV cabinet can breath now  . I'll let you guys know how it turns out.


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## VicV_1

Cox cable guy got here about 11:30am to install cable cards. What a nightmare he had doing it. First time install for him. He was playing around with it for 4hrs then finally got them to work. I'm glad I dont have to pay him by the hour. A lot of kinks have to be worked out with this new technoligy. I'm very happy with the Series 3  . It was worth the hassle. I'm ready to upgrade my account now.


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## ehardman

VicV_1 said:


> A lot of kinks have to be worked out with this new technoligy.


It's not so much the "kinks" but rather the lack of training given to the cable reps.


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## Armyman

Well it eventually took 8 cards to get my S3 up and running.

The first install I could get most of my HD channels, but not all, no digital channels, and almost no analogue channels. COX Tech tells me I need a signal booster/amplifier. So I go to signal strength meter on the S3 for a channel I should be receiving but it blank. Signal strength is great, about 97.
Tech leaves after trying 2 sets of cards.

New tech shows up for next appointment. This guy had done several S3s, including one double set up and says he has had a lot of problems with the cards.
His first set has the same problem. 2nd set he tries finally gives me all the channels-HD, digital, analogue.

Worst part was having to redo setup after every card change. That was the ultimate time sink.

Paul


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## Shawn95GT

I think your 'analog channel' problem is actually a digital simulcast problem. I'd put money on the cards re-directing you to the digital simulcast but your cards aren't authorized for 'em.

I got my exchange for S3 #2 back from Tivo and hooked it up and was dumbfounded why the analog chanels looked so much worse on the new box (no cablecards) vs my 1st S3 that does have cablecards. It turns out that I was comparing the digital simulcast to the analog offering. The difference is night and day.

I think I'm going to have to either do OTA only or spend another $11/mo to get cablecards in this second box.


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## ehardman

Armyman said:


> Well it eventually took 8 cards to get my S3 up and running.
> 
> The first install I could get most of my HD channels, but not all, no digital channels, and almost no analogue channels. COX Tech tells me I need a signal booster/amplifier. So I go to signal strength meter on the S3 for a channel I should be receiving but it blank. Signal strength is great, about 97.
> Tech leaves after trying 2 sets of cards.
> 
> New tech shows up for next appointment. This guy had done several S3s, including one double set up and says he has had a lot of problems with the cards.
> His first set has the same problem. 2nd set he tries finally gives me all the channels-HD, digital, analogue.
> 
> Worst part was having to redo setup after every card change. That was the ultimate time sink.
> 
> Paul


It is my belief that most of the cable card problems are not bad cards, but rather the cable company is not provisioning them correctly at the head end.


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## gwar9999

I am usually a Cox cynic (see my earlier rant) however the Cox technician who installed the 2 CableCards in my S3 surpassed my expectations. He actually knew what he was doing this being his 7th S3 install. When he arrived he asked if I had activated the unit yet, which I hadn't. He said I should do it since it will be required when installing the CableCards. If you have a dialup or slow net connection it's best to do this in advance of the tech arriving. This wasn't a problem for me since my broadband connection is speedy and probably only added a few minutes to his install time. He was in my home for slightly over an hour and neither CableCard showed any signs of failure as others have reported.

The only glitch that I occasionally notice is that when surfing to a channel it sometimes shows an all gray screen for a few seconds-- If I switch to another channel and then back then things behave normally. I think others have reported this issue as well. It's a small price to pay considering the SA 8300HD DVR that Cox supplied was so incredibly buggy and annoying that I can certainly live with 1 hiccup that the Tivo might have (although I don't know if it's a Tivo issue or a Cox issue as of yet).


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## VicV_1

ehardman said:


> It's not so much the "kinks" but rather the lack of training given to the cable reps.


I did ask the tech if he had any training and his answer was no. It's Cox's fault for not training these guys when new technology comes around. It should be like that in any business.


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## gwar9999

VicV_1 said:


> I did ask the tech if he had any training and his answer was no. It's Cox's fault for not training these guys when new technology comes around. It should be like that in any business.


When I was talking to the tech that installed my CableCards I mentioned that Cox techs in other areas were having issues w/ installing Tivo S3's (trying as many as 8 cards and taking over 4 hours and repeat service calls in some cases) and he said that _Cox did not provide any training_ for Tivo installations. That isn't much of a surprise considering they would prefer that you used their piece of crap DVR over a Tivo any day (since they make more money from leasing it than the CableCards).

When I called to replace my SA 8300HD DVR w/ the CableCards the first salesperson had enough nerve to even suggest that their _DVR was superior to Tivo_ and spent several minutes explaining the many awesome features and wondered how I could be making such a grave mistake. Needless to say, if the execs at Cox actually felt the same way, they certainly would not have struck a deal to license Tivo for their set-top boxes.


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## Armyman

Shawn,

You might be correct. I was _*supposedly*_ on digital service, but it seems that I wasn't getting any digital channels, but was getting what looked like analogue channels- looked pretty poor.
But all is fixed not. Until the next time!

Paul


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## allyn

cox san diego north county

had the easiest cablecard installation ever this morning. depsite having requested two cablecards, the tech arrived with one but he had another in his truck. he'd never done a tivo before so i showed him the directions.

anyway, everything worked perfectly the first time. he made several calls to the dispatcher (or whatever) as we did everthing slowly and carefully and they insisted on writing down the model of tv i had (!) but the whole thing took less than an hour. encrypted channels like INHD worked perfectly and i am getting all HD channels.

so far so good.


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## steelio

Does anyone know why I have to reset the channels I receive in my TiVo? Sometimes 2 times a day and sometimes every other day? I tell the tivo that I do not get the Hispanic channels or any other channels but they keep showing up. 
Any clues?
Thanks


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## beaubreeden

Cox in Baton Rouge, LA here. Just ordered my Tivo series 3. Cox is charging me a $54 install fee and $1.99 a month for each cable card. Anyone have a way to lower the install rate? The STB was only costing me $6.99 a month.


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## steelio

$54 for both cards?
I finally talked them down to $35 for each card.


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## joatnm

I have cox and they have been terrible here in VA. I get random pixelations and screen freezes with accomanying loss of sound. The guy who installed the cards said he didn't know what he was doing and had never done an install before and the next guy charged me $40 to put in an amp and I still have the same problem. Does anyone else have this difficulty with their picture?


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## beaubreeden

Had my install for Cox, Baton Rouge, LA today.

Cox tech showed up today to install two cable cards in my S3. I knew I was going to have problem when I saw the look on his face when I told him it was for a TiVo, and not two cable card enabled TVs. He wasn't sure if the TiVo was "Cox certified" even after assuring him that it had passed CableLabs cert program. After ten minutes of talking with his supervisor, he came to the conclusion that since it had the slots, it must be ok.

The next 10 minutes came as a sales pitch, i.e. why I should not install the S3, but go with the Cox DVR instead. I finally told him that after $799 for the unit, plus another $299 for the subscription, that he just needed to bite me and install the cards.

I gave him the installers instruction sheet that came with the S3. He looked at it for a few seconds then discarded it. I asked how many CableCard installs he had done in the past. He said this was his first. Back on the phone he went for another 20 minutes as he tried to convince another tech in the area to come by and show him how its done. After no one was able to/interested in doing so, he finally decided to give it a try.

First card was installed, then he "emailed" the information to the dispatcher. Apparently, they don't give the tech's cell phones to call in to dispatch, only Nextel two way communications (I didn't know you could disable the phone feature in those?). Another 30 minutes went by before he decided no one had checked his email, and he better call in to dispatch...so he used my phone to do it.

Dispatch put the numbers in, and said the pairing failed. Another hour of trying this, and I suggested he give the other card a shot. It worked within the first 5 minutes. The tech didn't have a third card on hand, and it was past quitting time for him, so he scheduled for a follow up technician to come between 10a-12p on Sat.

So for now, I'm stuck with one tuner, but only for a few hours!


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## beaubreeden

steelio said:


> $54 for both cards?
> I finally talked them down to $35 for each card.


$54 total, not for each. Since its taking two days (or more) to do the install, and I had to basically talk the tech through how to do it, I'm going to ask for a partial refund.


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## Mathmn

Would you believe that when my cox cablecard installer arrived, he didn't know how to activate the cards. He got a supervisor on the phone. This person told me that cable cards could not work in a TiVo and that Cox was active in acquiring special "TiVo cablecards". I politely told him he was absolutely wrong. I then contacted technical support, read the ID numbers of the cards from the screen display, and the cards worked immediately. This cost me $34.95.

By the way, cable cards from Cox in Phoenix cost only $2.00 each, and they work perfectly. The picture is awesome and the sound is dynamic.


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## gwar9999

beaubreeden said:


> The next 10 minutes came as a sales pitch, i.e. why I should not install the S3, but go with the Cox DVR instead. I finally told him that after $799 for the unit, plus another $299 for the subscription, that he just needed to bite me and install the cards.


Cox tries to talk most out of their _awesome_ DVR. You'd be making an enormous mistake if you fell for their pitch. FWIW, if Cox _really_ felt that they had a decent DVR (let alone the piece of crap they provide) then they _never_ would've entered into a licensing agreement with Tivo!


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## gwsat

If you consider only the economics in choosing between an S3 and a Cox owned box, the Cox box wins hands down, it seems to me. Thus, the Cox sales pitch has some merit. It doesnt take long to figure out that the dollar difference between a no-risk rental of a Cox box for less than $10 a month and the nearly $1,000 it takes to buy an S3 and a TiVo subscription is HUGE.

That said, you get what you pay for and the S3 is vastly superior to any cable companys DVR. Thats why so many of us, me included, have overlooked economics and bought an S3 anyway.


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## beaubreeden

gwsat said:


> If you consider only the economics in choosing between an S3 and a Cox owned box, the Cox box wins hands down, it seems to me. Thus, the Cox sales pitch has some merit. It doesnt take long to figure out that the dollar difference between a no-risk rental of a Cox box for less than $10 a month and the nearly $1,000 it takes to buy an S3 and a TiVo subscription is HUGE.


I agree with you on that part. However, after dropping more than a grand on my new equipment, I don't think it would be economical to decide against it at the last moment and rent the DVR box... put my S3 in the hallway closet for storage (blasphemy!!!)


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## gwsat

beaubreeden said:


> I agree with you on that part. However, after dropping more than a grand on my new equipment, I don't think it would be economical to decide against it at the last moment and rent the DVR box... put my S3 in the hallway closet for storage (blasphemy!!!)


Agreed. Telling somebody who just spent in the neighborhood of a grand on an S3 that the cable box is a better deal is not really as much a sales pitch as it is a belaboring of the obvious. We knew all of that and decided to buy S3s anyway. The cable company folks need to accept that and stifle themselves. If it was just a matter of money we would have kept the cable companys rental box and not have bought an S3 in the first place.


----------



## gwar9999

gwsat said:


> If you consider only the economics in choosing between an S3 and a Cox owned box, the Cox box wins hands down, it seems to me. Thus, the Cox sales pitch has some merit. It doesnt take long to figure out that the dollar difference between a no-risk rental of a Cox box for less than $10 a month and the nearly $1,000 it takes to buy an S3 and a TiVo subscription is HUGE.
> 
> That said, you get what you pay for and the S3 is vastly superior to any cable companys DVR. Thats why so many of us, me included, have overlooked economics and bought an S3 anyway.


I figure I wasted hundreds of dollars based on my frustration alone using the Cox DVR. Granted, I was reluctant to spend the extra money on the Tivo 3, but after a couple of months of using the Cox DVR I was compelled to make the purchase. The Cox DVR made me do it! If it worked in any intuitive matter whatsoever I probably would've waited to buy a Tivo until it hit the $200-$300 price point-- if I ever bought one at all! However, if Tivo married a crack addict and had a kid, I'd bet that screwed up kid would behave better than the Cox DVR!


----------



## beaubreeden

gwar9999 said:


> I figure I wasted hundreds of dollars based on my frustration alone using the Cox DVR.


I can't say I've seen the Cox DVR in action. I wish I had so I had something to say back to the Cox tech when he was trying to sell it. I did bring up the HMO and ethernet connectivity, which did astound him.

To end the discussion with him, I just told him I was a TiVo fanatic who didn't know any better and was hooked on the TiVo crackpipe. (He looked sketchy, I figured he'd understand that reference.)


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## gwar9999

beaubreeden said:


> I can't say I've seen the Cox DVR in action.


Consider yourself extremely lucky. This review of the product says it all:

Cox SA 8300HD Review


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## beaubreeden

Visit #2 for the cablecard install. Tech was here less than 5 minutes. Card failed, didn't have any of the Cox information on it, as if it hadn't been initialized. He promised to come back before 1:30p.

Anyone have luck in getting installation fee waived when having problems like this?


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## gwar9999

beaubreeden said:


> Anyone have luck in getting installation fee waived when having problems like this?


Talk to a customer service supervisor and explain to them how inconvenient this was for you that they have to take atleast 3 attempts to install it. They should've been able to do it the first time and absolutely have been prepared for it the 2nd time (since the first time failed). Now you're stuck waiting for them to arrive... again. A supervisor will be able to waive the fees, no problem. Anyone else but a supervisor will give you the runaround.


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## moyekj

gwar9999 said:


> Consider yourself extremely lucky. This review of the product says it all:
> 
> Cox SA 8300HD Review


 FYI, the SA DVR is only used in select Cox markets. Many Cox markets have the Motorola DCT64xx with Passport Echo which has become a pretty decent & stable solution.


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## gwsat

The SA 8300HD proved to be a reliable DVR in my installation, although its SARA software is very limited. The thing performed as advertised; it reliably recorded shows as scheduled and played them back appropriately. But its user interface was brutal and its ability to find a show to record for you ranged between weak and nonexistent. I could go on and on about its weak software but you wouldnt want to see a grown man cry.

I gather that the Motorola DVRs Cox uses in some markets have software that is dramatically superior to the SARA software they use on many, maybe most, of their SA boxes. Thats faint praise, I know, but there it is.


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## beaubreeden

Visit #2.5

Cox guy showed back up from his previous appearance this morning. This new card wasn't initialized either! He suggested I just leave it in the S3 to see if it would start working later tonight.... I asked him how it was going to work without him calling in the Host, Unit, Data, etc. since those numbers were all 0000s since it wasn't initialized. Good point, he said.

He wanted to do like the guy last night wanted to do, claim a successful install so it doesn't count against his service record, and then have me request a new service ticket to replace it later.

So, visit #3 is setup for Mon 8a-10a. I suggested they bring more than one card next time, in case it doesn't work.


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## pkscout

Well, early last week I noticed a couple of recordings I made had been deleted because the channel has been flagged as "copy never" (CCI byte 0x03). Friday I discovered that all digital channels except the broadcast HD channels had been set that way. According to the FCC, Cox is not allowed to do that. After two calls to Cox, they insist it is not their issue and that the only thing they can do anyway is send a tech out (for which I must pay). I have tried on both occasions to explain the issue to them, which is that someone at Cox, Las Vegas has set the CCI byte to 0x03 on the non-broadcast digital channels instead of 0x00 (copy freely) or 0x02 (copy once).

If you are in the Cox, Las Vegas service area, I encourage you to check this (do that by getting both tuners onto something like BBCA and DIY) and then check the Cablecard CP screen (in settings) and see what you see for the CCI byte. I further encourage you to call Cox Las Vegas to log a service problem and contact the local franchise authority (the cities of Henderson, Las Vegas, or North Las Vegas).

I'm including the text of my complaint below:

On Thursday January 25 I discovered that Cox Communications, has set all digital channels to what is known as "copy never" (CCI byte set to 0x03). This has the effect of rendering a competing DVR product (the TiVo Series 3) useless while the Cox DVR continues to function normally.

This is a direct violation of FCC Regulation 76.1904 section a.1.ii, which clearly states that Cox may only set the CCI byte on non-premium subscription services to copy freely (0x00) or copy once (0x02). I have made two attempts with Cox to clear this matter up, and they have indicated that the problem is not theirs. I am now being forced to pay for a technician to visit my apartment so that he can fail to fix a problem that has resulted from an intentional and deliberate attempt on the part of Cox to stifle competition in this area.

Thank you for your attention in this matter.


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## Shawn95GT

Where can you see the CCI byte setting? Mine all say:

'Due to Restrictions set by the copyright holder, this recording: Cannot be transfered to VCR, DVD, or any other media device. To learn more blah blah blah'.

This sounds like 'No further copying is permitted' from Tivo.com/copyprotection.


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## pkscout

Shawn95GT said:


> Where can you see the CCI byte setting? Mine all say:
> 
> 'Due to Restrictions set by the copyright holder, this recording: Cannot be transfered to VCR, DVD, or any other media device. To learn more blah blah blah'.
> 
> This sounds like 'No further copying is permitted' from Tivo.com/copyprotection.


If you go to Messages & Settings -> Settings -> Remote, CableCARD, & Devices -> CableCARD Decoder -> select one of the cards -> CableCARD Menu -> CableCARD CP Screen you will see the CCI byte setting there. You have to make sure to tune the tuner (really both tuners) to a channel that would have protection (i.e. not the analog or clear QAM channels) to expect to see anything other than 0x00 (copy freely). It sounds to me like in Phoniex they have set the byte to 0x02 (copy once), which is fine under the FCC regulations. In Las Vegas they have set it to 0x03 (copy never), which means the recording is deleted after 90 minutes. That's what they *aren't* allowed to do except for on demand and pay per view channels.

I'd be fine with a setting of 0x02. Not happy, but fine.


----------



## Shawn95GT

Ahh so you can't check it for a recording other than the message.

Sure enough mine are at 0x02.

Great, How long until Cox Phoenix screws theirs up too. I'll hook up the Off-air with a quickness if 0x03 hits here.


----------



## beaubreeden

Visit #3 from Cox in Baton Rouge. The guy is still working on the situation, but the CableCard he brought only shows the Host, Data, and CableCard numbers as all 0's. I got TiVo tech support on the phone at the same time and let her speak to the Cox tech. They switched my working card to the top slot, and its info came up fine, so the slots aren't to blame. The Cox tech still can't believe that 4 cards in a row have failed, coming from three different technicians. He wants to reschedule for a fourth visit on Wed.

This is getting ridiculous. I'm not upset with TiVo, because I don't believe its their problem, but I'm getting to the point where I want to cancel my Cox service and send back my S3 (in my opinion, the S3 price isn't affordable if I only get 5 OTA channels to use it with).

I can do single tuner recording with my one working CableCard, but thats it! I might even be satisfied if I could record HD and subscription programming with one cablecard and analog cable service with the other tuner, but I don't think its possible to enable one digital tuner and one analog tuner, or am I wrong on that?


----------



## pkscout

beaubreeden said:


> I can do single tuner recording with my one working CableCard, but thats it! I might even be satisfied if I could record HD and subscription programming with one cablecard and analog cable service with the other tuner, but I don't think its possible to enable one digital tuner and one analog tuner, or am I wrong on that?


No, you're not wrong. With only one cableCARD you get only one tuner. No recording of two shows.

And I would believe they had 4 bad cards. I think when cards don't work the techs just put them back in inventory. One of the cards I got had a bent connector. The guy was able to straighten it out, and it's worked fine since, but sometimes I think the cable companies don't keep track of bad cards so you can have a crappy experience, give up, and just get their DVR.


----------



## beaubreeden

pkscout said:


> I think when cards don't work the techs just put them back in inventory.(


I had the same opinion on Sat when that tech showed up. This tech at least seems to give a damn. The last one just said "oh well" and rescheduled the appointment. This tech is working so hard with his supervisor and their IT dept that he is in risk of being late to his next appointment.

I also felt bad for the first tech, who said that since the first card he brought for slot 2 didn't work, they would have to schedule a rework, and that would count negatively on his service record, even though it was clearly the cards problem and not something that he did wrong.

I requested that they bring about six CableCards with them so that MAYBE one will work, but their office will only dispatch enough cards to get the job done, in order to cut down on equipment loss and theft! That means one card per visit.

AAAARRRRGGGHHHH!


----------



## ehardman

beaubreeden said:


> Visit #3 from Cox in Baton Rouge. The guy is still working on the situation, but the CableCard he brought only shows the Host, Data, and CableCard numbers as all 0's. I got TiVo tech support on the phone at the same time and let her speak to the Cox tech. They switched my working card to the top slot, and its info came up fine, so the slots aren't to blame. The Cox tech still can't believe that 4 cards in a row have failed, coming from three different technicians. He wants to reschedule for a fourth visit on Wed.
> 
> This is getting ridiculous. I'm not upset with TiVo, because I don't believe its their problem, but I'm getting to the point where I want to cancel my Cox service and send back my S3 (in my opinion, the S3 price isn't affordable if I only get 5 OTA channels to use it with).
> 
> I can do single tuner recording with my one working CableCard, but thats it! I might even be satisfied if I could record HD and subscription programming with one cablecard and analog cable service with the other tuner, but I don't think its possible to enable one digital tuner and one analog tuner, or am I wrong on that?


Having gone through a lot of problems installing my S3 with Cox myself requiring several repeat visists, I am of the belief that most of the cards referred to as "bad" probably are not. In most cases, I believe that cards are probably not being provisioned correctly by Cox as the techs have not been adequately trained to program the cards.

If Cox is believes the cards are provisioned and paired correctly, have them send a "cold hit" to the cards. Many of their techs think that they can just send a "refresh" to the cards like they do to their set to boxes, but it won't work.

This solved all my problems once this was figured out.


----------



## beaubreeden

ehardman said:


> Having gone through a lot of problems installing my S3 with Cox myself requiring several repeat visists, I am of the belief that most of the cards referred to as "bad" probably are not. In most cases, I believe that cards are probably not being provisioned correctly by Cox as the techs have not been adequately trained to program the cards.


Yeah, I don't think the cards themselves are corrupt or broken. In past posts, I used the term "not initialized" rather than bad. At this point, I am just using "bad" to mean "it ain't happening..." LOL

With the cards reading all 0s, I just think the cards were received by Cox from Motorola, and then passed out to the techs. They were never setup properly for use in the local system. Is this a lack of training issue? Perhaps. Probably on two different levels, the techs who make sure the system is running at the head end, and the techs who do the installs. If they don't understand what they are looking at on the screen, then they aren't properly trained.

I also think that sending out another tech to solve the problem is ridiculous. If one cable tv tech who was sent to install cablecards can't figure the problem out, or at least know how to talk to someone at the office to get it working, then that person shouldn't have been sent out to begin with.


----------



## pkscout

pkscout said:


> If you go to Messages & Settings -> Settings -> Remote, CableCARD, & Devices -> CableCARD Decoder -> select one of the cards -> CableCARD Menu -> CableCARD CP Screen you will see the CCI byte setting there. You have to make sure to tune the tuner (really both tuners) to a channel that would have protection (i.e. not the analog or clear QAM channels) to expect to see anything other than 0x00 (copy freely). It sounds to me like in Phoniex they have set the byte to 0x02 (copy once), which is fine under the FCC regulations. In Las Vegas they have set it to 0x03 (copy never), which means the recording is deleted after 90 minutes. That's what they *aren't* allowed to do except for on demand and pay per view channels.


More update. I called Cox again today, and the guy on the other end tried to be more helpful, but at the end of 30 minutes they still insist I am the only one with the problem and that the tech needs to come out to swap the cards. He did say he would forward my info to his supervisor and the head-end folks, but apparently the gods of the head-end won't speak to mere mortals like me. So now I have to wait 2 weeks for the next available appointment. Since I have to wait, I did find that the City of Henderson attorney's office handles complaints to the local franchise authority, so I have a call in to the attorney in charge of that.

If you are in the Las Vegas area, please call Cox if you are having this issue with your Series 3 and make sure to tell them your problem is that the CCI byte is set to copy never (0x03). If you happen to live in Henderson, you can go to the city's web site, click Contact Us, then scroll down for the number to the City Attorney's Office.


----------



## pkscout

Well, I got home and there was a message from the guy at Cox who I had talked to this morning. Lo and behold there had in fact been a problem at the head end. Apparently there had been a miscommunication from corporate. the VOD and PPV channels were suppose to be set to copy never (0x03), the premium channels (HBO, Showtime, etc) to copy once (0x02), and everything else left as copy freely (0x00). So either corporate told them something different or somebody on the head end only read the first part and set basically everything to 0x03.

So it is fixed now, and hopefully Cox will be more careful in the future.

Oh, and I was right.


----------



## ah30k

On my Comcast system the entire digital lineup is set to copy once. This kind of sucks since I am now trying to run my HDMI and composite outputs simultaneously and copy protection won;t allow it.

Perhaps I should call the cable company and complain. Anyone know if the digital tier should be set to copy once or copy freely?


----------



## pkscout

ah30k said:


> On my Comcast system the entire digital lineup is set to copy once. This kind of sucks since I am now trying to run my HDMI and composite outputs simultaneously and copy protection won;t allow it.
> 
> Perhaps I should call the cable company and complain. Anyone know if the digital tier should be set to copy once or copy freely?


My understanding given the research the last couple of days is that they can, if they want to, set everything except the broadcast networks to copy once. A few have done that, many have left it to copy freely. It is frustrating, but it is also within the FCC regulations.


----------



## beaubreeden

After 3 unsuccessful installation visits from Cox, and only 1 cablecard working, I ended up speaking to the regional tech support manager. He, and his top tech who has been successful at S3 installs, and three of his best techs will be coming to my house on Wed for the 4th and last visit to do the second cablecard install.

The idea is that the guy who knows what he is doing is going to show everyone how its done, and how to troubleshoot it. The manager is going to make sure it works. He is also refunding my installation fee of $54.

I already stated to him that he has until the end of Wed to get it done, or I'm pulling the plug on my whole install, and going to DirecTV. I got my SD-DVR80 fixed, so I'm very willing to do so.

I see light at the end of the tunnel.


----------



## AzFrtDog

I am in the PHX Cox area. I am having a problem with selecting stations from the program guide. I get a black screen with no audio/video until i press either Info or guide, then picture appears normally. If i direct tune a channel (not from the guide) all is normal. Happens on all stations both CATV and ATSC. 
Talked to TIVO support several times, redid the setup, no help. Today they told me to go to the Cablecard setup menu's. They told me that there should not be any "Reserved" items listed ( i have three, the top 2 and the bottom 1 all say RESERVED). 
I was told to call Cox and have them replace the cards. I am reluctant to buy this story on face value.. all channels are decoded correctly including premiums. They tell me i must go through this step before they'll consider swapping boxes. 
Anyone else out there, could you check and see if you have RESERVED showing in any of the slots??


----------



## pkscout

AzFrtDog said:


> I am in the PHX Cox area. I am having a problem with selecting stations from the program guide. I get a black screen with no audio/video until i press either Info or guide, then picture appears normally. If i direct tune a channel (not from the guide) all is normal. Happens on all stations both CATV and ATSC.
> Talked to TIVO support several times, redid the setup, no help. Today they told me to go to the Cablecard setup menu's. They told me that there should not be any "Reserved" items listed ( i have three, the top 2 and the bottom 1 all say RESERVED).
> I was told to call Cox and have them replace the cards. I am reluctant to buy this story on face value.. all channels are decoded correctly including premiums. They tell me i must go through this step before they'll consider swapping boxes.
> Anyone else out there, could you check and see if you have RESERVED showing in any of the slots??


I have RESERVED in those slots as well here in Las Vegas, and both mine work fine (especially once Cox fixed the head-end problem  )


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## AzFrtDog

I figured as much. I take it you don't have any problem selecting channels from the guide?


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## craigo

AzFrtDog said:


> I figured as much. I take it you don't have any problem selecting channels from the guide?


AzFrtDog- 
I'm using Cox Phoenix as well and don't have the problems you have. The only issue I've had in the 3 months of having the S3, certain channels were not appearing one 1 tuner. Called Cox and they came out the next day and replaced 1 card. That was about 2 weeks ago and all is fine.


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## JPinAZ

AzFrtDog said:


> I am in the PHX Cox area. I am having a problem with selecting stations from the program guide. I get a black screen with no audio/video until i press either Info or guide, then picture appears normally. If i direct tune a channel (not from the guide) all is normal.


Did you see the responses in the thread you started? Apparently it's an HDMI issue.


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## AzFrtDog

Wow, forgot to check that. I see that a: I'm not alone with this and b: (surprise) Tech support is clueless. This has been going on for months and they have no record of the issue? For info, i am using HDMI with output at 1080i fixed.


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## kentquigley

Fairfax, VA Cox. It only took two visits to get my S3 CableCards working. First visit the tech had 4 cards and none of them worked, he wasted over two hours of my time. Second visit, different tech, took him 30 minutes, and the cards have been working mostly fine for the past month. 

I have three problems; one channel (NASA) has no audio, occasional audio dropouts, and occasional gray screen that clears by changing the channel.


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## boomer8800

So I had COX (orange county) tech come out to install my 2 cable cards on my S3. Only issue was not getting the HD tier (ESPN, DISC) this was only because the guy at the office have them on the wrong downstream. Second level support fixed it. Both cards worked right out the gate. No issues He was out less then an hour. 

My only question is I still don't understand on the sport packages like center ice. If I pay for in advance why does it need 2-way comm for it?? How is it differant then say HBO. I'm not interacting with the box like PPV pulling menus and ordering movies. Also if I order a movie online why cant they pipe it to my card #??


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## justinw

I've got Cox coming on Tuesday to install the cablecards and rid me of this crappy DVR.

I was under the impression you can still order PPV movies/events through the phone? Same thing should be true for NHL Center Ice and the other sports packages.


----------



## pl1

boomer8800 said:


> So I had COX (orange county) tech come out to install my 2 cable cards on my S3. Only issue was not getting the HD tier (ESPN, DISC) this was only because the guy at the office have them on the wrong downstream. Second level support fixed it. Both cards worked right out the gate. No issues He was out less then an hour.
> 
> My only question is I still don't understand on the sport packages like center ice. If I pay for in advance why does it need 2-way comm for it?? How is it differant then say HBO. I'm not interacting with the box like PPV pulling menus and ordering movies. Also if I order a movie online why cant they pipe it to my card #??


You can get Center Ice. I have it with cableCARDS. And you can order PPV by calling it in. It's a one way device. You just can't order by remote.


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## boomer8800

pl1 said:


> You can get Center Ice. I have it with cableCARDS. And you can order PPV by calling it in. It's a one way device. You just can't order by remote.


I'd like to know how you're getting it cause I've called and they say no that it's 2way not one way. Do you know how they did it? Don't they just have to point the channels to the cards .


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## pl1

boomer8800 said:


> I'd like to know how you're getting it cause I've called and they say no that it's 2way not one way. Do you know how they did it? Don't they just have to point the channels to the cards .


That's all there is to it. It's not like you are requesting a game. Every game is on every night on any of the available 10 channels. AAMOF, I'm watching a game right now via my one way cableCARDs (and no STB.) You should ask for a Manager and if that doesn't work, try Center Ice.

Do I need any special equipment to view iN DEMAND programs? Do I need a cable box, for example?

In order to order a pay-per-view movie or event you need a set-top addressable decoder box. This enables your cable company to authorize your household to receive pay-per-view programs or other scrambled programming like HBO or Showtime.

http://www.indemand.com/about/contactUs.jsp


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## kelley

My series 3 arrives tomorrow. I need to call Cox and have them come out and hook me up.


----------



## kelley

Well Cox came out and hooked me up, but my TiVo keeps on rebooting. It was working fine earlier in the day, but this evening I was recording two shows at once and the unit would freeze and then reboot.


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## justinw

I had my install on Tuesday and it went pretty well. The installer (obviously a contractor) came here and when I told him it was a Tivo he said "man I don't think Cox cable cards work in Tivos." I said of course they do, and he then responded "well do you want me to install one of them in your Tivo and then the other in your TV?" Well my TV doesn't even have a cablecard slot.

So he called the office, and they confirmed that YES cox cablecards do infact work in Tivos. So he installed them, of course was being very impatient and wouldn't wait for the screen to pop up (with the host data and stuff). So they finally did for card 1 and it was installed no problem. Same thing started to happen with card 2 before i finally said "maybe you should just wait a couple minutes." So he installed card 2 finally and everything has been working great. I thought for sure I'd have problems but none so far.


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## kelley

I have a new TiVo coming in tomorrow to replace my broken one, does anyone know if I will have to have Cox back out to move the CableCARDs or can I just do it myself and they will work?


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## justinw

I think (correct me if I'm wrong) you'll have to call Cox and have them send a signal to both cards.. not sure about it though.


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## pkscout

kelley said:


> I have a new TiVo coming in tomorrow to replace my broken one, does anyone know if I will have to have Cox back out to move the CableCARDs or can I just do it myself and they will work?


They definitely won't work. Whether Cox will let you give them the info over the phone or make you pay to have a tech come out so that they can read the numbers off the screen to someone on the phone is another question all together.


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## Xioo

Cox New Orleans charges $1.99 for cablecard. But you will also have to pay the one time service call charge, which I believe is $45


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## sesmith3

My series 3 is on order. I'll still get HBO and Showtime etc with the cable cards right? (Cox Phoenix). thanks.


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## justinw

yes


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## gwsat

Cox OKCs installation charge for the CableCARDs was $45.00. My total cable bill went down by $10.00 a month as a result of my having substituted the two CableCARDs in the S3 for the SA 8300HD DVR, which I had been renting from Cox.


----------



## Testpattern

gwsat said:


> Cox OKCs installation charge for the CableCARDs was $45.00. My total cable bill went down by $10.00 a month as a result of my having substituted the two CableCARDs in the S3 for the SA 8300HD DVR, which I had been renting from Cox.


Did your OKC Cox Tech seem to understand Tivo? I'm preparing to jump from my 8300HD to S3 but I was nervous about Cox's support on installation in the OKC area.

Any problems so far?

Thanks


----------



## bbocaner

Hey all. I got my S3 two weeks ago and have been using it with my antenna while I was waiting for cox fairfax to bury a wire. The tech (who was a cool guy) came out today and installed my cable cards. We put both the cards in, one at a time, and then he called in the card numbers. The tech on the other end of the phone line sent eight "hits". We went through the guided setup and then waited about half an hour, and, while all of the channel names showed up, all the channels were just black screens on both cards. The tech called and talked to someone else who sent another "hit" and all of a sudden card #2 could tune to all of the channels. The tech requested more "hits" for card #1 and explained to me that it sometimes can take a while for the channels to show up. I let him leave.

He called about four hours later to make sure I was getting all my channels. I checked card #1 and it was getting local high definition channels and a few of the cable access and local government channels. Not local SD channels, no other basic cable channels, and no premium channels. Card #2 was just fine. The tech said he'd call me back.

He called back about 15 minutes later to say that he had requested they send me a bunch more "hits" for card #1, and admitted that I may need a replacement card, but that I should be patient. It's been six hours and there is still no change.

Anyone have any ideas? Being patient is difficult for me!


----------



## wickerbill

Testpattern said:


> Did your OKC Cox Tech seem to understand Tivo? I'm preparing to jump from my 8300HD to S3 but I was nervous about Cox's support on installation in the OKC area.
> 
> Any problems so far?
> 
> Thanks


I have a friend that lives in OKC and he had a lot of trouble getting his S3 working correctly. It's not really the tech that comes to your house that needs to know what they're doing, it's the person back at the main office that does the actual activation. All the tech really does at your house is plug in the card and then send a bunch of numbers to the main office. It's those idiots that never seem to know what they're doing. It took Cox about three trips to get his S3 working correctly and the problem was always the idiots back at the main office who had no clue how to activate a cable card.

I had no problems here in Tulsa, but I think we're on a different system. We have a motorola system and I think OKC has Scientific Atlanta. That may make a difference.


----------



## Testpattern

wickerbill said:


> I have a friend that lives in OKC and he had a lot of trouble getting his S3 working correctly. It's not really the tech that comes to your house that needs to know what they're doing, it's the person back at the main office that does the actual activation. All the tech really does at your house is plug in the card and then send a bunch of numbers to the main office. It's those idiots that never seem to know what they're doing. It took Cox about three trips to get his S3 working correctly and the problem was always the idiots back at the main office who had no clue how to activate a cable card.
> 
> I had no problems here in Tulsa, but I think we're on a different system. We have a motorola system and I think OKC has Scientific Atlanta. That may make a difference.


Thanks for the feedback. We do have SA in OKC. You confirm what I've been hearing so, I guess I'll just take a big breath and dive in. Who knows, maybe the Cox folks have learned something since your friend got his installed...

Thanks,


----------



## wickerbill

It was less than a month ago... 

Good Luck!!!!


----------



## beboyle

I just wanted to report a good experience with Cox Phoenix. They installed my Series3 Cablecards with no problems. I called and they confirmed that they understood what the Tivo is and knew it would be two cards. When the installer arrived I asked if he had two cards, and he did. I also asked if he had ever installed a Tivo before - he said "I think so." That made me a bit nervous, but he did take the instructions and follow them. The only problem he had was that he went ahead and inserted the second card too soon. The head end technician actually told him to take it out - said she had a bulletin about only installing one card at a time. She also talked him through getting the right information - he wanted to give her the TV model info (it doesn't even take Cablecards). After that it went smoothly. He verified I had all channels on both tuners (took about 10 minutes for them all to come in) and was out in about 45 minutes total.


----------



## wierdo

I finally got frustrated enough with the Passport software on the Motorola 3416 Cox gave me and the ridiculously tiny 160GB hard drive to drop the $600 on an S3.

Has anybody had any luck getting Cox to let you pick up the cable cards and do a self install? The price sheet certainly doesn't say anything about requiring professional installation on the cable cards, not that that really means anything. Even so, adding an extra $30 onto the cost of the TiVo and the 500GB drive I'm going to put in it isn't all that much more, but I'd still rather not give them any more if I don't have to! 

The TiVo will be in Tulsa...

Now my only debate is whether to swap out their DVR for a standard HD box (so I can keep using onDemand) or to forget the cable box entirely.


----------



## rdowty

I'm in Tulsa too. I checked and assuming you already have digital cable then the two cable cards will be $1.99 each per month and you'll have to pay $30 install for the first card and $15 for the second.


----------



## wierdo

Until very recently, I also lived in Springdale. Small world, I guess.

I know that if they require somebody to come out to do the install, I'll have to pay for the install; I was just hoping that someone had previously been successful in convincing them not to send someone out to do it. I'd rather drive over to their office than pay them $30 or $45. Even if they do require someone to come out, I think we'll have a long discussion about how it is they feel justified in charging me two installation fees for one device.


----------



## ehardman

I don't beleive anyone has been successful in getting Cox to alllow a self-install. They charged me for both cards but I was able to get Customer Service to take one of the install charges off after I got the bill.


----------



## ehardman

bbocaner said:


> He called back about 15 minutes later to say that he had requested they send me a bunch more "hits" for card #1, and admitted that I may need a replacement card, but that I should be patient. It's been six hours and there is still no change.
> 
> Anyone have any ideas? Being patient is difficult for me!


This is a common problem with Cox as they are used to sending "hits" to their digital boxes. This will not work with your cable cards.

Have them send a "*cold hit*" to the cards. That should take care of it.


----------



## wickerbill

I tried getting Cox in Tulsa to let me do a self install, but they would not allow it. It's ridiculous, but I can somewhat understand why they do it. Physically installing the cards is simple, but then they have to send in a bunch of numbers for each card to the main office where the real activation takes place. They used their computer to send it right into the system. It would take forever to try and read that many numbers to somebody over the phone and you would probably end up getting one wrong anyways. Just hope that you get somebody competent at the main office, that's the person that will most likely determine whether you have a good install or not.


----------



## wierdo

Oh, if they bring a computer and do it online, that's at least a decent reason for not allowing a self install. I was under the impression that they called in to get the numbers entered into the system anyway. Now that I think about it, when the guy was here installing the 3416, replacing the splitters, and all that he called in the box numbers. Odd.

Either way, they really should note on the price list that a self install isn't available with cable cards.


----------



## wickerbill

It's not just a few numbers. It has been a few months, but it was easily 30-40 digits per cable card. It's ridiculous.


----------



## Testpattern

wickerbill said:


> I have a friend that lives in OKC and he had a lot of trouble getting his S3 working correctly. It's not really the tech that comes to your house that needs to know what they're doing, it's the person back at the main office that does the actual activation. All the tech really does at your house is plug in the card and then send a bunch of numbers to the main office. It's those idiots that never seem to know what they're doing. It took Cox about three trips to get his S3 working correctly and the problem was always the idiots back at the main office who had no clue how to activate a cable card.
> 
> I had no problems here in Tulsa, but I think we're on a different system. We have a motorola system and I think OKC has Scientific Atlanta. That may make a difference.


Well, yesterday I took off work for the cablecard install. The Cox tech started the event by saying how pleased he was to finally see a Tivo... it went downhill from there. Nice young man and to his credit I believe he did what was necessary from his end, but...

We now have about 1/4 of the channel lineup which is strange since this includes some analog, some SD Digital, some HD Digital, some OTA, but no premium encrypted channels. Both cards appear to report about the same channels.

Question... after the numbers have been transferred to the home office and the system responds, did your cable guy do a "test channels"? We did and observed a banner on a black screen for each channel expected.... but later (much later) discovered there was apparently supposed to be a picture displayed as well. I discovered only the few channels we receive actually will display a picture. Not knowing a picture was actually supposed to be there we continued the install with card 2 and basically observed the same thing with the banners.

Believing we were receiving all of the channels I let the cable tech go while I ran guided setup. This ultimately revealed the present situation with only a few channels actually being received.

Cox is supposed to return today, but I'm concerned that we may not know what to tell the office with respect to "reconditioning" the two existing cards. Is the appropriate solution to go through the basic card installation again, only stay with card one until you can verify all channels are being received on the "Test Channels" menu? Or will new cards be required?

I've searched this forum and the Tivo website for some detail on card installation only to find this is apparently some sort of state secret. Does anyone know of any info on this subject which may assist me in helping Cox to correctly handle their end?

Thanks, all donations greatly appreciated


----------



## Shawn95GT

Sadly... 99% of the problem is the back end provisioning. The tech is just there to stand in your house and talk to the people on the back end.

I believe the magic phrase is to have them 'cold initialize' the cards.

Good luck with it. The setup sucks but as soon as it's up and running you can put all of this behind you .


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## wierdo

My CableCARDs are installed and working! Unfortunately, it took a little over two hours, thanks to two bad cards and the installer's wireless data card crapping out.

Installation in slot 1 seemed to go fine, so he moved on to slot 2, which didn't like the first card, but the second worked fine. After having the dispatcher send hits to the cards, card 2 sprang to life and started showing video. Card 1 would only show the basic channels. I checked card 2, and it wasn't showing HD channels, but everything else was working fine. He had them fix the provisioning on my account and after a few minutes the HD channels started coming in on card 2.

Card 1, on the other hand, was a tough nut to crack. It would not, even after sending a reinitialize/cold hit/whatever and rebooting the TiVo change status from MISSING_PROGRAM_REKEY. After a while, he swapped out the card again, (this time having to call in the hit, thanks to the aforementioned laptop problems), and within 5 minutes everything was gravy.

I was pleasantly surprised at how quickly the dispatcher entered the CableCARD info and sent the hit..it took less than 5 minutes.

The moral of the story is that if at first the CableCARDs don't work, swap, swap again. You'll eventually find one that works.

They use Motorola cards, btw.

P.S. The best part is that I didn't have to mess with my season passes, which had previously been configured to record OTA.


----------



## Testpattern

I'm about to leave work early again for my 3rd visit by Cox OKC to install my new S3. So far no one has ever seen, much less, installed a S3. I do recognize the real issue is with the "dispatch" person who is setting up the box back at the facility.

At this point I have what appears to be Card 1 authorized and ready to go with no observed issues as presented on the CableCard installation screens. However, it doesn't work.

Card 2 is another story. It's authorized but not ready on a couple of parameters. 

Tivo tech support tells me I should receive all of the intended channels on a correctly set up card if it is working, even if the other card has issues. 

I receive about a forth of the channels due, none of which are encrypted premium channels. Always the same channels on both cards no matter what has been done by Cox in working this issue. 

Tivo TS tells me this is probably because Cox hasn't "packaged" the required channels correctly and I'm just receiving what's been incorrectly set up.

Further research into the EMM and ECM terms shown on the CableCard screens may confirm this. These are the basic messages which must be sent by Cox to provide encryption on the card. Status on the cards shows these to be "0" in some cases. I'm thinking the system cannot work if one or both of these terms are listed as "0" on a given card. Can someone confirm if this understanding is correct? 

If so I can substantiate the programming by Cox to be the issue and defend suggestions it is my Tivo which may have an issue.


----------



## wierdo

My problem with Card 2 (the one that always worked) was that they hadn't "balanced" the account, so I was getting different services on that card than I get on my box.

The problem with Card 1 was a broken card that wouldn't take the hit. It manifested itself as being able to only receive the basic cable channels (SD and HD basic)

When card 2 was working and card 1 wasn't, the channel test for card 2 showed all the channels, while card 1 would receive only the aforementioned basic channels.

Either your account isn't set up right, or you have bad cards.

Oddly, my CableCARD conditional access screens are wildly different, but they both work fine.

Oh, and on my status screen, both of them still say "wait to start," and have nothing under Entitlement Management Messages.


----------



## Testpattern

Followup from previous two installation attempts....

Cox came prepared last night with a sack full of new cards. The tech removed the two which had been previously installed and started fresh with new cards. After about an hour he determined one of the cards was bad and replaced it.

The second card was installed before the first was completely set up but this didn't appear to be an issue even though Tivo advises against it. 

The CP screens indicated Authorization was approved on both but counts were "zero" on the EMM and ECM lines. The tech called dispatch and tracked down someone he knew (not simple because the computer communication system was down) and he checked the "balance" and other particulars and issued a multitude of hits. 

The EMM count climbed to 37 but no channels would come in other than the non-encrypted basics and pass throughs. ECM remained at zero. Based on this forum, I knew zero counts on either the EMM or ECM lines were a problem. Additional work by the dispatcher raised the EMM to 38 and counts begin to appear on the ECM line as well. Channel test revealed channels were beginning to be added. After about 3-5 minutes all of the anticipated channels were there. The tech and dispatcher repeated this on the previously "approved" second card with the same results.

At the conclusion with all working as expected, the two CP screens were not identical in their status but all appeared to be okay. Guided set up went without an issue and... "Houston, we have Tivo".

Fernando, our Cox Tech, was key to this success. I had basically blew off trying to proceed when we discovered communications was down at dispatch. Fernando persisted with phone efforts and found a backdoor to finally reach someone he knew. 

Fernando, as was the case with both of his predecessors, had not been trained or had opportunity to experience any significant Tivo install activity. To my amazement, none of the Cox Techs had been educated on the significance of the ECM and EMM fields on CableCard installation. This knowledge made all the difference in how things went. Without knowing these counts could not be zero and the system function, he was able to persuade dispatch to keep trying when they thought all was well. I was impressed with Fernando's persistence and he was glad to learn about EMM and ECM fields.

This does leave me with a very disturbing question... why would Cox not take a couple of minutes to explain something as vital as the ECM/EMM fields to people who have the technical responsibility for installing CableCards. I might add dispatch didn't seem to have this understanding either.

Anyway, all appears well at the moment.... Thanks Fernando! (and this forum)


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## segamartinez

I have Cox service in Las Vegas and have the MLB Extra Innings package...problem is that it does not work on my S3 cable cards. I've spoken with several representatives because most have no clue what's going on...some say I cannot get the package on the cable cards and some say it should be able to work.

Anyone have a similar experience or is there anybody out there with Cox in LV with the MLB EI package working on their cable cards? Thanks.


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## Bodie

I had Cox NE (CT/RI) out yesterday. As I suspected as I was hanging up with the person who took the order, the tech only had 1 card with him, fortunately his coworkers in the area supported him (one even came by to help). 

I got 3 cards, two in the S3 and one in the TV (for watching a game while the other two tuners are recording shows). The initial hit didn't quite work, the second one worked on card 2 and the TV and then replacing card 1 got it going too. All said and done it was about 2 hrs 15 mins (perhaps 30-45 waiting for more cards to arrive) and now I have everything working just fine!  

(Now to see what the bill is for 3 cards vs just 1, not the extra $1.99 ea, but if there's an extra "Digital Gateway" charge for each  )


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## Droobiemus

Just had a wonderful experience with Cox installation. The guy came and was in and out in about 15 minutes! :up: I'm now running guided setup again to get the new program info.


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## bryanb

Bodie said:


> I had Cox NE (CT/RI) out yesterday. As I suspected as I was hanging up with the person who took the order, the tech only had 1 card with him, fortunately his coworkers in the area supported him (one even came by to help).
> 
> I got 3 cards, two in the S3 and one in the TV (for watching a game while the other two tuners are recording shows). The initial hit didn't quite work, the second one worked on card 2 and the TV and then replacing card 1 got it going too. All said and done it was about 2 hrs 15 mins (perhaps 30-45 waiting for more cards to arrive) and now I have everything working just fine!
> 
> (Now to see what the bill is for 3 cards vs just 1, not the extra $1.99 ea, but if there's an extra "Digital Gateway" charge for each  )


Where do you see the Digital Gateway charge? On mine I see DIGITAL CABLE SERVICE above each cableCARD.


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## hammer32

We just got our Series3 installed yesterday. The install was painless, but I had to reassure the sales person over the phone that I needed 2 cable cards and didn't need an HD DVR from them. 

Cox quoted me $70 per card for the install. I had been trading emails with them over the weekend to find out exactly how much (including tax) it would cost for me to switch from DirecTV to Cox for HD. They had never mentioned the installation fees. When I placed my order online there was no option to order two cable cards so I called in and thats when I was told that it would cost $70 per card. I told them no thank you. 

After a quick research trip to these forums I found folks in VA, CA and AZ had been charged $30 for the install. When Cox called me back and I told them that they lowered it to $15 per card. 

The day of the install I got a Cox HD DVR delievered by UPS, I had the installer take it back.

The install itself took about 15 minutes from the time I handed the guy the cablecard instruction sheet that came with my Series3 to the time he asked if he could keep it


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## Sadara

Cox guy is out today to do the install, he's been here for 2 hours now and they still aren't working. I'm getting all basic channels, basic HD channels, but not the encrypted HD Channels. He's had them make sure they are sending the right signal to the cards. He also made sure they showed the same card in slot one that he saw in slot one, that didn't resolve the problem. Both cards are acting the same way. I was able to confirm through the tivo settings that the Tivo is receiving a signal on those channels, but not the channel itself. Any suggestions?


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## TravisKU

I've had trouble with my regular premiums with Cox, but no problems with the HD channels. 
Did you have a cable box they were originally tied to? I know they had to remove them from my cable box then re-assign them to the cable cards. 

Travis


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## Sadara

After 3 hours, he finally got it working. Turns out the signal wasn't strong enough coming in to our house, he did some things at the box, replaced a splitter and all is good now!


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## mriechers

OK, just adding to the experience here...

COX Fairfax VA, I just received my Series 3 and called them to come trade in my HD cable box for 2 cable cards. They woman I spoke to was VERY confusing, but she said that it would cost me $2 LESS per month to have 2 cablecards w/ HD service vs. 1 HD box. When I asked for a pricing breakdown she didn't provide one (wtf?) Also, service fee was $30 per card, and I could not negotiate it lower.

But, the rep had heard of the TiVo S3 before, put a note in the report for the truck guy that he was installing 2 cablecards in a TiVo, and the guy is going to come tomorrow during a 2 hour time window. So far this sounds promising, I'll update with what really happens.


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## Todd

mriechers said:


> OK, just adding to the experience here...
> 
> COX Fairfax VA, I just received my Series 3 and called them to come trade in my HD cable box for 2 cable cards. They woman I spoke to was VERY confusing, but she said that it would cost me $2 LESS per month to have 2 cablecards w/ HD service vs. 1 HD box. When I asked for a pricing breakdown she didn't provide one (wtf?) Also, service fee was $30 per card, and I could not negotiate it lower.
> 
> But, the rep had heard of the TiVo S3 before, put a note in the report for the truck guy that he was installing 2 cablecards in a TiVo, and the guy is going to come tomorrow during a 2 hour time window. So far this sounds promising, I'll update with what really happens.


So how did it go?


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## mriechers

I'm all up and running now 

Installers (two) came _on time!_ with 4 cable cards in hand. I thought, sweet, they brought backups. Turns out they've done a few TiVo S3s before. The installer then gave me this info nugget:

Cox Cable cards have a "born-on" date if you will, a little sticker saying when they went into service. If the date is 12-2006 or later, the cableCARD will take, no problem. If the date is earler than that, they need a firmware upgrade which comes over the cable, and may or may not work. Meaning, most of the time, it will not work.

So, my installer had 4 cards, 1 with a 2007 date, 2 with a 2005 date, and 1 with a 2004 date. (I didn't know they had cableCARD in 2004!) He tried the 2007 card in Slot1, it was recognized in about 10 seconds, wrote down the CC# and ID#, called it in, all channels were working in about 1 minute. Perfect.

Then he says... OK, now the hard part. Tried the other cards, with no luck. Let 1 of them wait in the "updating..." screen for over an hour, still nothing. He called to other installers in the area, and 1 of them had another 2007 model cableCARD on his truck. The other installer came by, popped in his 2007 card, and it took just like the first one did. The whole service call took 3 hours. The first card was working in the first 5 minutes, then 2hours 50 minutes of down time, then 5 minutes to get the 2nd 2007 model card to work. They were happy to be gone.

So, I hope this helps someone else. When making your service request, not only tell them its for a TiVo S3 (that did seem to help make my call easier, they knew what to expect) but also request that they bring the most recent cableCARDs they can find in their warehouse.


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## gwsat

Thats interesting. The CableCARDs that Cox OKC installed in my S3 in early January were rebuilt SA cards, so its obvious that the firmware they had was from 2006, at the latest. Still the two cards Cox installed have been working for more than five months. It looks as if I got lucky.


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## stevil

Your tip on asking them to ensure to bring multiple ones is a good one. I'm in VA too and just had my new S3 cable cards installed today by COX. Unfortunately I read this thread as they were futzing around with trying to get the 2nd one to work. They only brought 2 and they thought that they were only installing 1...(even though I told them I needed 2 and it was for a Tivo when I ordered the service). They need to come back tomorrow with a bunch of them to test to get ones to work. I told him to bring one after 12/2006 and he said "I'll bring as many as I can"...

Strange thing is I do get a couple of channels on the 2nd tuner - a PPV preview channel and a "Cox" channel (channel 95 in VA) that just has a the name Cox on it.


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## lordargent

Got 2 cards installed earlier this month, got rid of their HD non DVR box. I just got the bill for this month and here's what changed.

+ $3.50 : Cox digital cable service: Before : $17, after, $20.50. (it also shows the quantity going from 2 to 3, but the $ column just lists the total. So I don't know what they're charging for each device (I have two cable cards and a SD cablebox now)).

- $5.25 : Digital Receiver - HD (I got rid of the HD cablebox/space heater)

+ $4.00 : Cox cablecard (2 cards at $2 each)

End result, my cable bill went up $2.25

/Install fee was a one time $55 fee for both cards.

/the install took about 30 minutes, 10 minutes of that was him being on hold with the home office to get the cards authenticated. Didn't seem that long though since we were having a discussion about tivos and gaming consoles.


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## mriechers

That sounds spot on lordargent. I'm waiting for my bill to see if the changes are similar. Thanks for the news.


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## sorbok

I've been reading the S3 threads for a long time, especially the Cox cable threads. My wife and I have been wanting another Tivo for some time, but I've been dreading the cable card install. When the S3 had the rebate before Father's Day, we finally decided to take the plunge.

Following the advice of several posters, I hooked up the S3 to a high def antenna after delivery and ran guided setup. I forced several connections to Tivo over a couple of days and got the latest software version. Then I called Cox, informed them I wanted an EXPERIENCED technician to connect the cable cards and anticipated the worst.

The tech showed up an hour early, informed me he was one of only two guys in the department that knew exactly how to set up an S3, and went to work. He certainly seemed to know what he was doing. Less than an hour later, tivo was up and working with the new premium channels I ordered at the same time as the install. He stayed through a new guided setup, made some adjustments, and even moved my S3 to the same spot where the Cox dvr was at.

I couldn't have asked for a nicer tech. It's been 3 days and NO problems. Just thought I'd post some good news for others to read!


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## wierdo

Excellent, sorbok! Hopefully they won't charge you for two cablecard installs and an extra outlet install as they did for me!


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## sorbok

wierdo said:


> Excellent, sorbok! Hopefully they won't charge you for two cablecard installs and an extra outlet install as they did for me!


I hope not also! They did originally quote me $60 (30 ea) for the truck roll but I told the phone tech I had been "quoted $45 previously" (based on other posts here). He put me on hold for a minute and came back to say I was right and made the adjustment. Now of course I'll have to wait for the next bill...


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## raygundan

Cox installers in Chandler, AZ (near Phoenix) brought three Scientific Atlanta cablecards, all of which were invalid according to the error message that popped up on the Tivo. My Tivo was working fine with a pair of Motorola cards from Comcast in Indianapolis.

They're claiming that they haven't successfully installed any Series 3 units and that they're waiting on information from Tivo. Is there anybody on Cox in or near Chandler, AZ who has their Series 3 up and running with cablecards? Is this an issue with a known workaround, like maybe they have all their cards programmed wrong and they need to be reflashed?


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## Shawn95GT

Sounds like you had an installer who wanted out of there.

I'm not in chandler but I'm on the same Cox system. It could be something specific to your area, but I doubt it.


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## moyekj

Just had CableCards installed in my second Tivo S3 here in Cox, Orange County, CA. This time installation was an absolute breeze with no glitches at all and the installer was in and out in less than 30 minutes. This compared to a 3.5 hour install with many issues the first time (back in November 2007). So looks like Cox OC has their act together for CC installs for Tivos and I think Tivo also improved things to make it much easier as well. It is no longer an intimidating experience that one has to go through. Even on billing front Cox OC now only charges for a single CC install instead of 2 like they tried to do last time. I will still get charged monthly for 2 additional outlets ($1.49 each) along with 2 CC charges ($1.99 each) but that I can live with.

Now all that's missing is MRV & TTG and I'll be set


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## raygundan

Shawn95GT said:


> Sounds like you had an installer who wanted out of there.
> 
> I'm not in chandler but I'm on the same Cox system. It could be something specific to your area, but I doubt it.


Yeah, you could tell from the get-go that he wasn't a fan of the cablecards. To be fair, he's probably been burned by lengthy installs more than a few times. He was saying things like "yeah, you know you're gonna be behind schedule when you see there's a cablecard install on your list" and "these things are nothing but trouble. I can't understand why anyone would ever want one."

But it was his manager that was telling me they have a long list of Series 3 Tivos that have never successfully worked with a cablecard, some of which have had as many as 50 different cards tested.

It's baffling why it's so difficult for them out here. My first install back in Indiana was pretty smooth-- took maybe 20 minutes, nearly all of which was hold time while the installer called the office.


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## Mr. Coffee

I'm near you in Queen Creek, AZ (Ocotillo & Ironwood), and Cox came out to install a few months ago.

Worked fine, except one cable card had an error, but he had another. Worked great, and no problems.

Our installer didn't have any Series 3 installs before, but he read the paper included with the Tivo, and everything was easy-peasy.


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## raygundan

They came back today, and one of the three they brought this time worked. All of the non-working cards were dated 2007. The one that worked had a 2005 date. They're digging around in the warehouse for more old cards to try to get my second tuner up and running.


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## Gil

Well, Cox RI came out Tuesday to install digital cable and the cable cards. Knew I was in trouble when I found the tech installing splitters on my OTA antenna feed instead of the cable coax... Anyway, he puts the first cablecard in, and even though I told him 5 times and he read the Tivo instructions he starts to plug the second one in before even calling for the first activation. First card doesn't initialize. I checked the wiring and he'd jumpered from the RF out on the Cox DVR I wanted for the interactive and VOD stuff to the input of the Tivo. I suggested that might be screwing up the key exchange with the card...no, no, we do it like this all the time. Ayup. About an hour later, he figures what the heck and puts a splitter in to feed the Tivo directly. Shazaam, card one inits and looks like I have channels. Card 2 inits in about 5 minutes and he leaves.

Finish guided setup, and started to play. Everything seems fine until I come across a channel that worked once and now doesn't display. Check each card separately and it turns out card #1 doesn't have the same channels as card #2. Call COX. First time, get a rep who seems to know what he's talking about. Reinits card, no difference. Has me swap cards and wait while it pairs and he inits them again. Problem follows card. I try to explain that it's his programming, not the card, but he insists it is a hardware problem and says he'll schedule a call. Fine. Hang up and call back in. This time, I get a rep without a clue. She tells me, oh, just wait...it takes time to get the full subscription. Ok, fine. BS, but I hang up anyway. Now it's almost midnight. Figure, what the heck, play some more CSR roulette. BINGO!!! I get a guy who actually understands what I'm telling him. Puts me on hold for 5 minutes while he reset the subscriptions on both cards and ran some comparison to ensure they were equivalent. Cold inits them both and up and running by 12:15AM.

Next battle is to get Cox to wave the installation fee since, in reality I self-installed these cards. That ought to be a fun phone call!!


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## KustomMerc

can anybody verify that the picture quality is not the same with Tivo3 and Cox cable cards then the HD picture you can get over the cable with the HD tuner in your set. I'm running the latest firmware too. ??


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## lament

Hey all,

Anyone have a recent experience with Cox San Diego? I'm about to ditch the SA 8300HD and this thread has scared the hell out of me. 

Also, is Cox San Diego using multi-stream cards yet?


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## VicV_1

I called Cox Cleveland because I had a problem with cable card #2. Sometimes HBO channels and some HD channels would cause an error. The gray/black screen would come up. If I rebooted it would be fine then all of a sudden, I'd get that screen again. The Cox guy came out and replaced card #2 and haven't had any problems for 2 weeks now.


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## Joe Jensen

Cost estimate ????

I currently have DirectTV, one HD Tivo and one SD Tivo DSR6000. I also use COX high speed internet and there is a $10 bundle savings if I have their Cable and Internet.

I am considering a move to COX in Phoenix. When I would move, I would end up with 2 HD Tivo units. 

From reading this entire thread it looks like I will have a much larger monthly cost. 

2 Tivos, one $12.95 and one at $6.95 for MSD?

4 cable cards at $6 each?

What else?

Here is what I pay Direct TV now.
$47.99 TOTAL CHOICE Monthly 

$13.00 HBO Monthly

$9.99 HD Access Monthly

$5.99 DIRECTV DVR Service Monthly 

$4.99 Additional Receiver

$81.96 Total 

$56.45 High Speed Internet (looks like I can reduce it to $39.95 plus tax with some new rate)

Can a Cox Phoenix user tell me what it will cost me?


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## Shawn95GT

I have the digital tier with 2 cablecards in one of my S3s.

The bill is $118 and change for High speed Internet, digital cable, and the telephone service. The phone service pretty much works out to be free in the deal. If you opt-out of the phone it costs about the same. I think I'm paying a little less as they grandfathered my old price when they did the last rate hike (about $10).

I think you're looking at another $11 for the #2 S3 (Cable card fees + digital gateway fees).

then another $12.95/mo for HBO.

I'd figure $140-$150/mo to cox for 2 S3s, 4 cablecards & HBO, High Speed internet, & Digital phone service + your Tivo fees.

See if you can talk them into a free install for the Cablecards - that alone is worth about $60.


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## Joe Jensen

Shawn, did you have DirectTV HD before Cox? If so, how does it compare?...joe


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## Shawn95GT

No, I had Voom until it went out of business, then Cox with their crappy DVR.

I canceled Cox and went to Qwest VDSL.

I did off-air for HD and VDSL for cable until the S3 came along.

I then switched to the Cox triple play. The quality is good!


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## mriechers

Cox pricing is fairly uniform, no?

I'm paying $138 /month in NoVA for 15mbps internet + digital cable + HD + 2CCs + HBO + 3 of those $2 channel packages. Its a bit expensive, but its a really nice service package.


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## [email protected]

So Im about to pick up a TivoHD to replace my 8300HD and the second level Cox support says that right now the only way to get an M-Card is to take delivery of an 8300HDC as they come bundled.

I asked why single-stream cards are available separately, but M-cards are not and they said we don't know, but will let you know sometime today.

I'm not holding my breath for an answer. Sounds like this is all new to them.
I wonder if I could schedule the 8300HDC install and just have them move it's M-card to the TivoHD and send back the 8300HDC and my current 8300HD?


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## lament

where do you live, DasRaven?

And nobody else here has Cox San Diego?


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## [email protected]

lament said:


> where do you live, DasRaven?
> 
> And nobody else here has Cox San Diego?


Sorry, I was just setting up my profile. I'm in Phoenix.


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## lament

OK so I went on Cox's site and called to get the scoop for San Diego.

- No M-Cards
- CableCards are $2 each/month
- 1-time $55 installation charge (ouch!)

Now I just need to drop hints to the fiancée what I want for my birthday in 2 weeks..


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## Shawn95GT

don't forget the 'digial gateway fee' that you pay on top of the cablecard fees, per S3 (and sometime per cablecard!).


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## lament

I didn't include the cost of cable into that..

$46.95 standard + extended cable
$6 digital cable (aka Gateway)

and i'm currently paying: 

$9.95 DVR service
$5.25 ****** 8300HD box


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## saltsage

raygundan said:


> Cox installers in Chandler, AZ (near Phoenix) brought three Scientific Atlanta cablecards, all of which were invalid according to the error message that popped up on the Tivo. My Tivo was working fine with a pair of Motorola cards from Comcast in Indianapolis.
> 
> They're claiming that they haven't successfully installed any Series 3 units and that they're waiting on information from Tivo. Is there anybody on Cox in or near Chandler, AZ who has their Series 3 up and running with cablecards? Is this an issue with a known workaround, like maybe they have all their cards programmed wrong and they need to be reflashed?


We had our series 3 installed last January with two cable cards and even though the installer did not know which end of the unit was up, with my assistance, we got the cards working. However, I have had numerous occasions where I have lost some of the local HD channels or lost them all even though the premium channels continued to work. A signal to the cards from Cox works after about 15 minutes and temporarily restores the channels. Definitely a PITA!! Anyone else having this issue??


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## KiddSupreme

Well I am what they call a lurker on this website, hence the low post count. However, I would like to add my recent (and currently ongoing) experience with Cox Communications (San Diego, CA). I recently (last Thursday) purchased a Tivo HD from Circuit City. That same day, I contacted Cox to setup a 2 cablecard installation on the device. The nice lady on the line stated someone could be there the next day (friday).

Friday comes, and I have the Tivo HD connected and ready to go. The installation appointment was between 11am and 1pm. Imagine my surprise when the guy is there 11:03am with cards in hand. He went about his business installing the cable cards. Long story short, 3 hours into the install, we had a successful install of one of the cards in slot 1, but major artifacting and dithering in slot 2. My helpful installer went through 6 different cards. He even used some multistream cards (although according to the installer, I would still need two cards regardless of whether they are multistream or single stream. Apparently Cox only sends out a single stream per card. But I digress).

At first, I thought it was his cablecards. I mean, how likely is it that I just received a new Tivo HD that is defective. Feeling a bit disappointed at the point, my helpful installer said he would come out tomorrow to try some more cards. Tomorrow comes (Saturday), and the installer tries again to get that second slot to work. But no dice, just bad reception. It is at this point that I am now convinced that something may be wrong with the Tivo HD itself. The installer states that he would be out on Monday with a whole new set of cards to try. 

In the meantime, I checked at the Circuit City in my area to see if any other Tivo HD's were available. Unfortunately, they were out of stock. However, there was a Circuit city 25 miles away that did have it in stock. I proceeded to return the Tivo HD, drive up to get the new Tivo HD, and return home. However, when I called Cox to activate the cards (the installer left a multistream card and a single stream card), the lady on the other end stated that only an installer could install the cards (which I find strange since all they really do is stick the card in, call up dispatch, read off the serial number, Cable Card ID, & Host ID. How "technical" can that be). 

But unfortunately the lady on the other end was adamant about it. So now I wait until Monday to "hopefully" enjoy dual tuner Tivo HD goodness. I will try to keep you appraised of any new developments. I would like to say that I am happy have the cable installer went above and beyond what is normally expected of an installer. He stayed an hour past my window to try and get that Tivo working. That's what I call service.

If anyone else is in the San Diego area, I'd appreciate hearing your experiences with Cox & Tivo. TTYL.


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## lasergecko

saltsage said:


> A signal to the cards from Cox works after about 15 minutes and temporarily restores the channels. Definitely a PITA!! Anyone else having this issue??


Get a new card installed, especially if you see the diagnostics screen popping up no matter how briefly.


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## frankthetank

TivoHD Cable Card issues anyone?

The Fairfax Cox tech got the 1st cablecard working just fine, but when installing the 2nd cablecard, the picture was tiled and very pixleated. Thought it might be a defective card, so tried 3 other cards and all of them had the same problem. I think this is turning out to be a Tivo box issue. Has anyone else had this problem??


----------



## moyekj

frankthetank said:


> TivoHD Cable Card issues anyone?
> 
> The Fairfax Cox tech got the 1st cablecard working just fine, but when installing the 2nd cablecard, the picture was tiled and very pixleated. Thought it might be a defective card, so tried 3 other cards and all of them had the same problem. I think this is turning out to be a Tivo box issue. Has anyone else had this problem??


 Well if you look up just a couple of posts ago KiddSupreme is having the same issue: "we had a successful install of one of the cards in slot 1, but major artifacting and dithering in slot 2"


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## KiddSupreme

moyekj said:


> Well if you look up just a couple of posts ago KiddSupreme is having the same issue: "we had a successful install of one of the cards in slot 1, but major artifacting and dithering in slot 2"


Day 5 of the struggle:

So, Monday arrived, and my friendly neighborhood Cox Cable installer comes with 2 brand spanking new single stream cablecards. The first cablecard (Slot 1) install goes off without a hitch. But the second cablecard (Slot 2) has the same pixelated, jibberish on screen. Surprisingly, all the HD channels came in perfectly clear on the Slot 2 cablecard, but no other channels.

Going through the cablecard screens with the installer, we noticed something peculiar. We were getting EMMs, but no ECMs incrementing. Also, under decryption status, it stated "No ECMs detected". The dispatch asked us to try the different channels, and come back to the Cablecard screen. Eventually, the ECMs went up by about 3, and the decryption status said "OK". But about 30 seconds later when we checked, the ECM count dropped back down to 2, and the decryption status stated again "No ECMs detected".

So now we have an issue. Before I thought it could possibly be a defective Tivo. But this is a brand new different Tivo HD. The installer stated that they are going to have to send out their most senior installers. Basically, think of them as individuals that really know their stuff and are willing to stay 8+ hours to get something fixed. I'm suppose to receive a phone call tomorrow from Cox to get that setup.

But yeah, to the individual that stated if anyone else was having the same issue, I am. And this is my 2nd Tivo HD. I'm pretty much 100% sure it has nothing to do with the equipment. For some reason, ECMs are coming down Cablecard Slot 2.


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## chicodoggy

Just set up my Tivo HD box and getting 2 cards installed on Wednesday. I will let you know if I have any problems with the install.

I also noticed the Tivo HD is SLOW. I hope they fix this with a firmware upgrade in the near future. I have also had to reset my box a few times due to loss of signal.


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## shizle

Just an FYI, I thought that my signal was weak (causing the signal to drop, forcing a reboot). It turns out that the TIVO was sitting on top of my Denon avr3803, and causing overheating! So I'd get signal drop every 15 minutes or so, and I was grinding my teeth.. These boxes apparently are quite heat sensitive.


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## KiddSupreme

Well I was reading a very informative article from Ars Technica . Its a primer on CableCards. I was always wondering what was meant by EMMs and ECMs and why it was important in the scheme of getting the CableCards configured properly. Two entries of note were:



> Once these keys are recorded, the CableCARD is "hit" by the cable company, which simply means that it is remotely programmed with information about what channels and services you have paid for and are entitled to watch. This is done by sending an Entitlement Management Message (EMM) from the headend to the CableCARD. An EMM is an out-of-band transmission (it sends data over low frequencies not reserved for cable channels) that authorizes a specific CableCARD to decode a specific set of services (HBO, etc.) to a specific host. Once this is done, the CableCARD is ready to go.





> The demodulated, encrypted signal passes from the TV into the CableCARD, which first checks the EMMs to see if the user is authorized to view that channel (basic channels may not require an EMM). If so, the card then pulls something called an "Entitlement Control Message" (ECM) out of the in-band signal. The ECM is the key needed to decrypt the channel, and it is sent along the line every 100 ms in order to eliminate the delay often found when switching channels on older systems. The ECM is also rotated every few seconds in order to discourage hacking. The ECM is itself encrypted by a proprietary mechanism built into both the headend and the CableCARD, so when a CableCARD attempts to descramble a channel, it first decrypts the ECM, which then allows it to decrypt the MPEG-2 stream.


So, maybe in my situation, the problem is the ECM is not properly being decoded by the cablecard Slot 2. At least, that's what I gather. I could be wrong. If anyone else would like to shed some light on the subject, feel free.


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## lament

great info, KiddSupreme. thanks for that.

btw, don't forget to edit your profile so people know where you're from.


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## Joe3

My theory, Cox is loading their bandwitdth by adding too many VOD and new HD channels. 

Some channels are coming at 100%, others near the new added channels are coming in at less than 90% causing a no signal lock to flash on and off and blank out entirely. Channels are bouncing signal strengths at 72-97 in 5 sec. 

The tech takes a reading off the coax and the signal is near 100 %. 

Anyone?


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## Sirshagg

Shawn95GT said:


> don't forget the 'digial gateway fee' that you pay on top of the cablecard fees, per S3 (and sometime per cablecard!).


I'm curious is they wanted to charge you this fee per cable card. They told me it's per card, not device. That's the moment I decided they would not get my business.


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## Shawn95GT

When I first got the S3 setup with cablecards they charged the fee per cablecard. A month or two later they fixed it so it's right (per device).

Personally I think it's how they re-couped the 'free' install I got.


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## nick58b

I just got off the phone with Tivo, they told me they were aware of problems with the second cablecard slot in the Tivo HD, and are working on a fix. The rep I talked to said they would hopefully have the update pushed out by next week. 

As for my experience, I had 3 visits from Cox cable, probably 5 hours and 8 cablecards tested total. They finally narrowed down the problem when they sent out a senior tech with pretested cablecards, and a 26" tv to prove they worked...


----------



## StuffOfInterest

nick58b said:


> As for my experience, I had 3 visits from Cox cable, probably 5 hours and 8 cablecards tested total. They finally narrowed down the problem when they sent out a senior tech with pretested cablecards, and a 26" tv to prove they worked...


I bet someone at Cox is really pissed right now about the amount of tech time being used on what turns out to be a hardware fault not of their causing. Hopefully TiVo gets a fix out really soon, but you can bet that the cable operators are going to be less helpful regarding TiVo issues when this gets around.


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## chicodoggy

Well, the cards are in after waiting 3 hours for cox to show up today. The installer didn't even know what a tivo was or how to install the cards...so I did it myself. Very easy but it took about 30 minutes for the cards to come up and the tivo to download new channel info.

BUT, now card 1 is fine and card 2 is pixelated on any digital channel over 100. I am having cox come back out on friday to see if a different card solves the problem. 

In the meantime, I will be switching the cards around to see if it is the card or the slot in the tivo hd.

I hope tivo releases a patch if this is their issue very soon or I will be sending it back to cc.


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## ccrocker001

Cox San Diego came out to install 4 cable cards in my 2 Tivo HDs. They installed 2 single stream cards in one unit and as many others have indicated, slot 1 worked perfect and slot 2 has major pixelation. On the other unit they installed 2 multi stream cards. As mentioned above, the installer insisted that although it was a multi stream card, I still needed two cards. The second unit seemed to work fine with a good picture on both tuners, but the Tivo unit kept throwing up a screen saying to remove the card in slot 2 since there was a multi stream card in slot 1. The Tivo also said that slot 2 would not be used if there was a multi stream card in slot 1. So I pulled the second multistream card from slot 2. AND despite what the installer said I am getting two perfect tuners from the one multistream card.

So with the second multistream card I am trying to activate it on the other unit in slot 1 and that is proving to be difficult. Cox is coming back on out tomorrow.

Whatever. At least one works like it should.


----------



## lament

I love how nobody at Cox knows what's going on. When I called them about multistream cards last week and posted a few days ago, they said they don't have them. good lord.

@ccrocker001:

did you verify that both tuners could record at the same time?

also, can the San Diego people also post the name of their installer so can ask for them.


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## ccrocker001

Well my installers really didn't know what was going on. But yes, both tuners work individually on one multi stream card. I can pause one tuner, go to the other tuner and watch it live or pause etc. and then go back to the other tuner and continue playing the paused stream. Right now both tuners are recording two different shows on one multi stream card. 

The second multi stream card I put in the other unit seams to be slowly accepting more channels - not sure if this is normal.


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## lament

If 1 multistream card works for both tuners, I don't understand why Cox is saying you need 2 multistream cards for 1 box. 

Also did you guys specifically ask for multistream cards?


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## ccrocker001

I didn't ask for anything. The installer did say they had just gotten "new" cards and were beginning to use them. They clearly have no idea what they are doing. Even when I tried to activate the other multistream card it is obvious to me now that two different people could not pair it properly. After the recent firmware update that fixes the issue with slot 2 I reinserted the single stream cards and all is working perfectly on both slots. So I have one Tivo HD with 1 multi stream card installed and two tuners working and another Tivo HD with 2 single stream cards now also working proplery. ...And now I have an extra multi-stream card that I think I'll hold onto until I get my first bill and see whats going on. 

With the recent firmware update, I wouldn't be concerned about needing a multistream card - at least from cox in San Diego.


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## lament

the firmware push already happened? someone had mentioned that TiVo said they were working on it.. damn that's quick if they did it already.

also, 1 multistream card = $2 rental, but 2 singlestream cards = $4 ($2 each).. so why wouldn't i want 1 multistream card?


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## ccrocker001

force a download and you'll get the update. Then restart. You're right - $2 is $2. I'm just happy everything works....


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## lament

lol I don't even have the TiVo HD yet.. i'm just doing my research. 

thanks for all your info, btw..


----------



## KiddSupreme

Looks like Tivo figured out the issue. Unfortunately I am not at home at the moment to see it work myself. When I get home Saturday, if it works, I can cancel out the truck roll.

Now I have to decide how to get the difference of the amount from Circuit City on the lower priced TivoHD.


----------



## [email protected]

lament said:


> If 1 multistream card works for both tuners, I don't understand why Cox is saying you need 2 multistream cards for 1 box.
> 
> Also did you guys specifically ask for multistream cards?


I inquired specifically about them and they told me they aren't available separately yet. You can only get one with the SA8300HDC box and those cards are paired to the box they come with.

Eventually, M-cards will be available and when they are, it'll cost anoth $50 to roll the truck to replace my 2 CCs with one. :down:


----------



## lament

[email protected] said:


> I inquired specifically about them and they told me they aren't available separately yet. You can only get one with the SA8300HDC box and those cards are paired to the box they come with.
> 
> Eventually, M-cards will be available and when they are, it'll cost anoth $50 to roll the truck to replace my 2 CCs with one. :down:


Hi DasRaven,

As evidenced by ccrocker001, it appears my market (San Diego) has them.


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## JTalbert

Ok, I thought I would share my experience so far.

I have a new HD Tivo, and I love it. Cox came out today to install the cards and after about 35 minute, he had both of them installed and I get channel 26 WETA, and THATS IT. I do not get ANY channel than channel 26... Well this would make my daughter happy since she is into Sesame Street, and Barney and all that kid fluff... But both cable cards teh exact same issue. I only get channel 26 for both cards... 

The cards that they brought were Scientific Atlanta PowerKey Model PKM600 dated 4/8/2005.

After about an additional hour with the cox guy on the phone, was told that they would have to bring out year 2007 cable cards.

Here is my beef, They know in advance these earlier cards do not work in the Tivo's yet the guy only had these two year 2005 cards. Why didnt he have spare cards to try? Why did they even send out techs with anything earlier than 2007 cards if they know these others dont work.

So now I am going to have to wait till Monday because I will be going out of town tonight and wont be home till this weekend.

Anyone else experience this type of issue? Resolution? 

My other gripe is this. Why does a tech even have to come out. Why cant you pick up the cards and install them yourself if your techincal such as I am. Answer, The cable company wants to nickel and dime you for anything they can.


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## lament

Yeah the $55 fee is BS. 

Also, you should just ask for 1 Multistream card like I will be doing once I get mine.


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## doormat

OK, after a missed appt by the installer yesterday, a supervisor or chief tech finally came out today and tried to install the CCs. He brought four and one didnt work off the bat. The second one paired fine in slot one. The third one didnt seem to be pairing properly, so he went to replace it with the fourth. 

The problem is the guy on the other side of the phone call (at Cox, someone named Wayne) kept telling the installer to hard boot the tivo - even when it was booting up. So the installer unplugged it from the back and plugged it back in. If you know about how the insides of a TiVo works you can probably tell where I am going with this -- green screen of death after about five reboots. He is coming back tomorrow at 5PM to see about getting the other card working.

Also, anecdotally, the 2007 card crapped out, while the 2005 cards seem to work the best in our situation - SA PowerKey cards.


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## gespears

Well my Central Phoenix installers just left. Not too bad. They got here at 5:00. Checked the signal and found it lacking so they put in an amp. The first card they put in was bad of course. It was even smashed. The next two cards went in smoothly and they left at 7:00. They were nice guys and cleaned up all the old connections. There was a rookie and his trainer. The senior tech knew who to call to set up the cards. I think his name was David. They said he was the guru of cable cards. And they were real Cox guys, not subs.

Gary


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## Cynicize

pl1 said:


> You can get Center Ice. I have it with cableCARDS. And you can order PPV by calling it in. It's a one way device. You just can't order by remote.


I tried ordering a PPV today for my TivoHD to record. Apparently they require (Cox - Gulf Coast) you to have at least one "addressable" box on the account. It won't let me order a PPV online or on the phone. I called in about it, and they won't budge on it. Just said best I can do is wait on the Multistream card they have coming out sometime in the next 6 months.


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## ellinj

Cynicize said:


> I tried ordering a PPV today for my TivoHD to record. Apparently they require (Cox - Gulf Coast) you to have at least one "addressable" box on the account. It won't let me order a PPV online or on the phone. I called in about it, and they won't budge on it. Just said best I can do is wait on the Multistream card they have coming out sometime in the next 6 months.


While I cannot speak for cox's policy from a technical perspective this is bs. A cable card device is addressable. How do you think they can authorize your box for the channels you have ordered.

I would have asked how multistream would have solved this problem as they are one way as well.


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## lament

ellinj said:


> While I cannot speak for cox's policy from a technical perspective this is bs. A cable card device is addressable. How do you think they can authorize your box for the channels you have ordered.
> 
> I would have asked how multistream would have solved this problem as they are one way as well.


Multistream CableCards (M-Card) are two-way.

_M-Card: A two-way CableCARD module that implements all of the multi-stream functionality as well as the single-stream functionality (for backward compatibility purposes) of the CableCARD-2.0 Interface specification._


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## ellinj

lament said:


> Multistream CableCards (M-Card) are two-way.
> 
> _M-Card: A two-way CableCARD module that implements all of the multi-stream functionality as well as the single-stream functionality (for backward compatibility purposes) of the CableCARD-2.0 Interface specification._


No matter what they say all current production cable cards are one way. AFAIK there is no real standard for the return path. Cable companies are pushing for DOCSIS and OCAP which to date no CE vendor has implemented in a consumer product. I fail to see how Mstream will help unless it is installed in a cable box with DOCSIS.

With that said all two way will provide is the ability to order from the box. You still should be able to call in and they can tell your card that you can watch a PPV. There should be no technical reason for the box to reply.


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## instill

Well, I'm extremely annoyed. Cox arrived Saturday at 8:00 AM. The installer had two cards in his hand. Neither work. I kept getting an, "Invalid cablecard, please contact your cable provider" error message. The other irritating thing was the damn installer couldn't seem to figure out how the cards were ejected and kept trying to pull them out by force. I finally snapped at the guy and told him to get his damn hands off my box if he isn't going to follow simple directions and let me put the things in or take them out. Idiot.

He leaves and says another guy, a "cablecard expert" will come by around noon with fresh cards and that guy will get it worked out. Noon comes and goes. Then one o' clock, two o' clock, finally I call the original installer on his cell and ask what's going on. He says the "cablecard expert" says if the cards get inserted and they don't work, then the box is incompatible with their cards and I need to just get a Cox DVR.

I tell the guy to get back to my house with a handful of cards and we'll see about that. He says he'll come back around three o' clock. Three comes and goes... then four... then five. I finally call him again and ask what's the deal. He promises to swing by around six. Six finally comes and the guy shows up with just two more fresh cards.

He inserts the cards and we get the same invalid error. I gently remove and reinsert the cards again and now, finally, we get a screen listing settings and other details. I click on "Host ID" and get a "No information found" error. The Cox installer starts *****ing about this and says I should forget TiVo and go with the Cox DVR. I call TiVo and they have me insert/reinsert the slot-1 card repeatedly and try different cards.

Finally, I get the settings menu again on one, click on "Host ID" and now it gives me an error like, "pot:///settings/config corrupt" quickly flashes and dumps me back to the invalid screen. The installer goes back to his truck, fetches four more cablecards and again, all have the same problem.

TiVo tells me EIGHT cablecards isn't enough to tell if it's the box or the cards - despite the cards all having dates in 2007 months apart. They tell me to call Cox and have them bring out another EIGHT cards next weekend and see if it works. I refuse this and say this is ridiculous. Either the damn TiVo HD box is broken and should never have been released to paying customers or the whole cablecard thing is a damn mess and clearly not ready for the public.

I demand TiVo ship me a brand-new TiVo HD and then I call Cox, with the installer there, and tell them to come back next Saturday with TEN cards to test. Anything less and they can cancel my $160/month contract and lose a five year customer.

This is pathetic.


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## lament

Cox where? you guys need to update your profiles please..


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## Bodie

bryanb said:


> Where do you see the Digital Gateway charge? On mine I see DIGITAL CABLE SERVICE above each cableCARD.


Sorry for the delay, been away.

After a couple of months of bills for all the freebies to settle out, I don't actually see a gateway charge at all.

I have the standard basic, expanded and digital tier (instead of sports or entertainment). On top of that, I have showtime, 3 CCs (one in the back of the TV for watching the ball game while Tivo's busy, worth it for $24 a yr) at $2 each and a $10 credit for having all three services (phone, internet and cable).


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## navman

what have your experiences been with cox cable cards in phoenix.
How much are they charging? are there any gateway access fees in phoenix?
Do they have the m-cards available as yet?


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## Sirshagg

For what it's worth...

I'm in Phoenix and seriously considered going to cox instead of giving up my Tivo with DirecTv. I didn't and a BIG reason why is because they wanted to charge me an $8 digital gateway fee for EACH cable card (no m cards). $16 to cox for each series 3 tivo (on top of the Tivo monthly fee and purchase was not going to happen!!!

Got my HR20's now


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## Shawn95GT

Cox Phoenix charged me that originally but later changed it. I posted the 'updated' charges a little while back:










I have their High speed Internet, phone service (basic 3 features), & Digital cable (no premiums) with only one of my S3s with cablecards and I now pay $118 and change a month.

The $12x charge was from when I was paying the multiple gateway fees.

I expect another set of cable cards for S3 #2 to cost me $11/mo + the ridiculous install fee.


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## navman

thank you for ur input sirshagg and shawn.


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## lament

Hey guys,

I've called Cox San Diego and they're going to be coming out on Friday morning at 9am. I asked the rep on the phone to bring multiple multistream and singlestream cards, but I got a rushed feeling from her, so I'll call early next week to confirm that it was put in the notes. I'll be buying the TiVo HD Thursday night.

I'm assuming all I have to do on Thursday is setup my TiVo account online, purchase the service plan, attach the wireless and run through the TiVo setup as much as possible.

Anything else I need to do before the Cox guy comes?

Thanks!


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## sniperlv

Cox Phoenix will be here Sunday. Wish me luck, as I asked them to bring lots of cable cards also. One rep tells me they don't have Multistream, the last one I talked to says they do. So I guess I will find out in a couple days.


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## navman

So how did it go sniperlv?


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## sniperlv

Well the installer arrived, not a Cox Employee a contractor. He brought 2 S cards a 2005 and a 2006. Of course he had never seen a Tivo HD. I explained to him that I had requested that whomever they send to advise them it was a Tivo and to bring lots of Cards. Long story short one card is in the Tivo now stuck at firmware update, he was only here 30 minutes. Left the cards here with the one trying to do the update. He gave me his cell number so in 30 more minutes or so I am going to call him and instruct him to either go get more cards and return back, or send a supervisor with more cards. As I don't think these are going to work.


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## navman

This really sucks, would like to get tivohd but the service we are getting from cox as far as the cablecards are concerned leaves a lot to be desired. Maybe thats exactly what they want................


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## sniperlv

Anyone in Cox Phoenix that have one of these working have the information of what cards work with the Tivo HD? Such as model and firmware? If someone has this info I can call them back and get the correct ones. 
Thanks


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## eochs

Hi everyone, maybe y'all can help me out here... I'm looking at getting a TivoHD this week to get rid of my 8300HD... Reading this and other threads I am getting confused by what I need to do and who I need to talk to... Can someone break down and summarize what I should be asking for from Cox (Phoenix)? Do I need 1 M-Card, or 2 single steam cards? Any certain brand of card I should ask for? etc, etc, etc...

Also, I thought cablecards would give problems with switched-digital video... Is this no longer true?

Thanks!


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## Shawn95GT

No switched digital in PHX (yet).

You need a multistream card if you can get it. Otherwise you need 2 single stream cards.

The only thing you're missing out on is PPV and their Interactive guide (lol). We don't even have On Demand yet but if they ever deploy that here you'll need a Cox STB to use it.


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## eochs

What happens when switched digital comes to Phoenix? is my Tivo dead to cable?


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## Shawn95GT

I don't have any 1st hand expericence - but from what I understand we just won't be able to see the switched digital channels.


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## sniperlv

Hey Shawn what Cable Card and what version firmware did Cox use to get yours working?


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## Shawn95GT

sniperlv said:


> Hey Shawn what Cable Card and what version firmware did Cox use to get yours working?


I only have 1 S3 with cablecards.

It has SA cards model 0600 Version 0010
BootROM is version 115


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## sniperlv

Thanks Shawn


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## jimmylevans

Had same issue with my first S3 and returned it. Second unit works better but still having "Tileing" problems and a few audio gliches. I think my next action is to call Tivo and see if they can work through Cox and see if that can help.


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## jimmylevans

Shawn, I have the same hardware and firmware settings as you and I am still getting the pixelization intermittently. Does anyone have this issue and if so what is the solution?


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## djones18

Cox, Northern Virginia indicates M-Stream CableCARDs now available and provides pricing:


"Dear Valued Cox Customer:

Thank you for contacting our Cox Northern Virginia Online Customer Care Team.

We already have the M-Stream cable cards available. It has to be installed by a technician and installation fee is $29.99. The rental charge for the card is $1.99 per month apart from the digital gateway price of $ 6.95 per month."

NOTE: Cox CableCARD prices in this area increasing 1 October to $4.50 per card.


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## Shawn95GT

It's funny how the new pricing is pretty much the same as 2 S-cards + the gateway fee.

If that CC price hike hits PHX I'll request that they swap my two s-cards for a single M-card on their dime or grandfather my pricing for the two s-cards.

I don't think either of these is unreasonable.

I do get pixelation now and then (nothing consistant) but I think it's Cox. From what I've seen of their STBs it's MUCH worse on their hardware.


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## markw365

Shawn95GT said:


> It's funny how the new pricing is pretty much the same as 2 S-cards + the gateway fee.
> 
> If that CC price hike hits PHX I'll request that they swap my two s-cards for a single M-card on their dime or grandfather my pricing for the two s-cards.
> 
> I don't think either of these is unreasonable.
> 
> I do get pixelation now and then (nothing consistant) but I think it's Cox. From what I've seen of their STBs it's MUCH worse on their hardware.


TivoHD with Cox San Diego. $2.00 single M Card, right now it just works. Have only had it up 3 weeks, so I haven't seen/heard about the bill yet from finance. 

Mark


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## lament

markw365 said:


> TivoHD with Cox San Diego. $2.00 single M Card, right now it just works. Have only had it up 3 weeks, so I haven't seen/heard about the bill yet from finance.
> 
> Mark


That's good news, Mark. Cox San Diego is coming tomorrow.

which reminds me.. going to call them and make sure they bring M-cards.

Mark did you specifically request M-cards when you called?

*update:* as I suspected, they didn't notate that i needed an M-card nor multiple single-stream cablecards.. argh. So that's notated.

I'll find out tomorrow from 9-11am.


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## gespears

Just a quick note to let everybody know that once of the SA cards supplied from Cox set the CCI byte wrong which meant the Tivo HD thought the programs coming from this card (or at least the ones with CCI set to 0x02, it would change it to 0x03) were pay per view and wouldn't let you record them. So if you run into this, check the diagnostic screen durning the programs you are not being allowed to keep a recording of, for the CCI byte, see what its set to. If it's 0x03 then retune everything so the other tuner is set to that channel and see what it shows the CCI byte to be. A cable card swap out took care of it (after all the typical problems with getting it provisioned correctly etc.)

Gary


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## bracoh

markw365 said:


> TivoHD with Cox San Diego. $2.00 single M Card, right now it just works. Have only had it up 3 weeks, so I haven't seen/heard about the bill yet from finance.
> 
> Mark


Interesting that they told you that they had M cards. I spoke to them on Tuesday and they said that they were not available yet. I got the Tivo today, it's all set-up and waiting for the installation of the cards on Saturday. Time to make a call.


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## lament

a few pages back, someone also said they had an M-Card with CoX San Diego.

I got the TiVo HD today.. will get mine setup tonight as well.

and yes call them and just have them put in the notes that you need an M-Card, and to bring a couple..


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## jon96cobra

Just got a call yesterday about I'm loosing some stations unless I switch to a digital box instead of using the cable cards. 

I wonder if the same applies to the M-cards? I'm still waiting to hear back what stations and if I can switch to M-card.


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## davecramer74

> I wonder if the same applies to the M-cards? I'm still waiting to hear back what stations and if I can switch to M-card.


ya it applies to any cable card device that doesnt support 2way coms. the cable card has nothing to do with it. cox just rolled out sdv in your area, so youll need their cable box to get the channels.

http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6470803.html?industryid=47194

http://www.tvpredictions.com/cox082207.htm


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## lament

*9:45am*

OK the installer just called..

"Yeah you're upgrading your cable box?"

"No, you're installing cablecards into my TiVo HD."

"Oh.. cable cards?" [pause] "OK I'll be there in a few minutes."

this isn't looking good.

*10:28am*

Cox Installer Darryl came by with.... 4 single stream cards (blue cards). The kicker is that he had 2 M-Cards (green cards) but traded with one of his techs for the blue cards (single stream) before he got here because his other tech needed the green ones. He didn't know the green were M-cards.

So he just left and he's going to call me later when he grabs the M-cards because I told him I didn't want the single stream cards.

argh.. nice guy, but damn I knew this was going to happen.

updates to follow..


----------



## jon96cobra

lament said:


> *9:45am*
> 
> OK the installer just called..
> 
> "Yeah you're upgrading your cable box?"
> 
> "No, you're installing cablecards into my TiVo HD."
> 
> "Oh.. cable cards?" [pause] "OK I'll be there in a few minutes."
> 
> this isn't looking good.
> 
> *10:28am*
> 
> Cox Installer Darryl came by with.... 4 single stream cards (blue cards). The kicker is that he had 2 M-Cards (green cards) but traded with one of his techs for the blue cards (single stream) before he got here because his other tech needed the green ones. He didn't know the green were M-cards.
> 
> So he just left and he's going to call me later when he grabs the M-cards because I told him I didn't want the single stream cards.
> 
> argh.. nice guy, but damn I knew this was going to happen.
> 
> updates to follow..


Sorry to hear that.

Cox did something like that to me. Good luck with the install.


----------



## bracoh

lament said:


> *9:45am*
> 
> OK the installer just called..
> 
> "Yeah you're upgrading your cable box?"
> 
> "No, you're installing cablecards into my TiVo HD."
> 
> "Oh.. cable cards?" [pause] "OK I'll be there in a few minutes."
> 
> this isn't looking good.
> 
> *10:28am*
> 
> Cox Installer Darryl came by with.... 4 single stream cards (blue cards). The kicker is that he had 2 M-Cards (green cards) but traded with one of his techs for the blue cards (single stream) before he got here because his other tech needed the green ones. He didn't know the green were M-cards.
> 
> So he just left and he's going to call me later when he grabs the M-cards because I told him I didn't want the single stream cards.
> 
> argh.. nice guy, but damn I knew this was going to happen.
> 
> updates to follow..


I called this morning to make sure that it was noted on my order that I needed M-cards and to bring more than one. When I stet up the appointment I specifically asked that the person that came was a Cox employee. All of that is on my ticket, we'll see if they actually read it before coming. I'll post back tomorrow with the results.


----------



## lament

*2pm*

he's been here since 1pm.. M-card isn't picking up channels, but I tried what the TiVo manual suggested and rebooted and ran guided setup again - which stalled at the Getting Program Guide part for some reason trying to connect to the server..

He checked my signals (and gave me a new splitter) - now trying to get dispatch to send out some hits on the card. It's paired up - it's just not getting channels.

stay tuned..

*2:16pm*

and we have liftoff! They had to reset the M-card, send some more hits, and now we have channels.

I'm finishing up the guided setup again...


----------



## lament

bracoh said:


> I called this morning to make sure that it was noted on my order that I needed M-cards and to bring more than one. When I stet up the appointment I specifically asked that the person that came was a Cox employee. All of that is on my ticket, we'll see if they actually read it before coming. I'll post back tomorrow with the results.


When the Cox guy calls you to say he's on the way, make sure to ask if has GREEN cable cards that say Multi Stream Card on them..

in other news..

For some reason, I'm stuck at Getting Program Info as it's "Preparing.." to Connect to check for new program info. Been sitting here for 5 minutes now. this happened earlier, and I had to hard reboot.

I don't know if there is an issue with TiVo's servers right now or what. I know my wireless is setup properly, because it was working fine last night.

*update*: it was just slow.. now it's time to check out the channels and setup my new learning remote..


----------



## bracoh

The Cox guy got here at 10:50, 10 minutes early. Yesterday I called and requested that he bring M-cards. Of course he didn't and said that the warehouse was closed on Saturday so he couldn't get any. I complained and he said that he would see if anyone else had any that they could bring to him. While he was in the truck I called Cox and demanded that someone be here on Monday at no extra charge. He also confirmed that the ticket said to bring M-Cards. The installer didn't read it.

The guy came back with 2 M-cards. He had never done a TivoHD but had set up many Series 3 units. The whole thing took 40 minutes and I'm up and running. HBO and all of the HD channels are clear and functional. The installer was knowledgeable and pleasant and I'm very satisfied. Now I'm just waiting for the HD data to load so I can set up my season passes.

Considering all of the horror stories I've seen on this board, I feel very fortunate. I'm a happy guy right now!


----------



## lament

Glad to hear it went smooth! Yeah as long as you get an M-Card, it seems to be smooth sailing.

I've noticed a couple of blips of macroblocking over the last 24 hours, but nothing major and I blame the source.

Now that I have this up and running, is the menu/channel changing always this slow? The menu transitions are also slow and not as smooth as my old Series 2.

Minor complaint, though.. I'm loving it so far.

oh another thing - 718, the National Geographic channel, has been out for me for about a week.

I called about it a week ago and they said it's a problem on National Geographic's end. Is anyone getting this channel (Cox San Diego)?

*update*: ok, after the most roundabout conversation with tech support, it appears for $3 more a month, I can get the National Geographic HD channel since it's (now) part of the "Discovery Tier." In this "Discovery Tier" there is but one HD channel - National Geographic HD.. the rest are these SD channels .

wtf? it was free for 2 days.. now they're charging for it? lame.


----------



## bracoh

lament said:


> Glad to hear it went smooth! Yeah as long as you get an M-Card, it seems to be smooth sailing.
> 
> I've noticed a couple of blips of macroblocking over the last 24 hours, but nothing major and I blame the source.
> 
> Now that I have this up and running, is the menu/channel changing always this slow? The menu transitions are also slow and not as smooth as my old Series 2.
> 
> Minor complaint, though.. I'm loving it so far.
> 
> oh another thing - 718, the National Geographic channel, has been out for me for about a week.
> 
> I called about it a week ago and they said it's a problem on National Geographic's end. Is anyone getting this channel (Cox San Diego)?
> 
> *update*: ok, after the most roundabout conversation with tech support, it appears for $3 more a month, I can get the National Geographic HD channel since it's (now) part of the "Discovery Tier." In this "Discovery Tier" there is but one HD channel - National Geographic HD.. the rest are these SD channels .
> 
> wtf? it was free for 2 days.. now they're charging for it? lame.


I'm getting 718 and I'm not paying extra for it. That doesn't sound right. If it isn't a premium channel then HD is HD. As far as I know there aren't any special tiers for HD programming.


----------



## lament

bracoh said:


> I'm getting 718 and I'm not paying extra for it. That doesn't sound right. If it isn't a premium channel then HD is HD. As far as I know there aren't any special tiers for HD programming.


you must subscribe to one of these packages then.

_ National Geographic HD available only to those customers that subscribe to the Digital Bonus Package (excludes Digital gateway customers)._

What is a "Digital gateway customer"?

I have the most basic service available to still get HD (I believe limited basic + expanded). So I only get up to channel 70, plus the HD channels.

*update*: ok I poked around their site more.. honestly, it couldn't be more confusing.

I am a "Digital gateway customer" - I pay $6 for digital service. so in addition to my basic + limited service, I also get all the HD channels - except for National Geographic (NGHD) as that is now part of the "Digital bonus channels" (see below0.

So for $3 more a month, I can become a "1-package digital customer," get 11 digital bonus channels (including NGHD) plus I can choose one of these packages.


----------



## markw365

I just ran into a snag. They couldn't activate HBO/SHOWTIME. So they want to send a tech out.  Scheduled for Wed since I always take the evening slot. We'll see what happens then. 

Next on my list is a 500/750G drive. Need to update mfstools on my desktop to do it though. Let you guys know the success/failure. I'll probably toss a WD YS drive in it as they're cheaper and available locally over the DB35's. 

Oh, yes, the HD is slower with the 30 second skip than the Series 2. Going to put my series 2 down at the end of the month when my DTV expires.

Mark


----------



## lament

mark is there a thread detailing how to upgrade the TiVo HD hard drive or is everything on the msftools site?


----------



## bracoh

lament said:


> you must subscribe to one of these packages then.
> 
> _ National Geographic HD available only to those customers that subscribe to the Digital Bonus Package (excludes Digital gateway customers)._
> 
> What is a "Digital gateway customer"?
> 
> I have the most basic service available to still get HD (I believe limited basic + expanded). So I only get up to channel 70, plus the HD channels.
> 
> *update*: ok I poked around their site more.. honestly, it couldn't be more confusing.
> 
> I am a "Digital gateway customer" - I pay $6 for digital service. so in addition to my basic + limited service, I also get all the HD channels - except for National Geographic (NGHD) as that is now part of the "Digital bonus channels" (see below0.
> 
> So for $3 more a month, I can become a "1-package digital customer," get 11 digital bonus channels (including NGHD) plus I can choose one of these packages.


I know I've got the Sports & Information package, so maybe that's it. After poking around last night, I see I've got some channels I didn't even know I had.


----------



## jfh3

markw365 said:


> I just ran into a snag. They couldn't activate HBO/SHOWTIME. So they want to send a tech out.  Scheduled for Wed since I always take the evening slot. We'll see what happens then.


Call them back and escalate. There is NOTHING a tech in your house is going to do to get those two channels that can't be done over the phone. Your cards are most likely not paired/validated correctly.


----------



## Jeanesco

Shawn95GT said:


> Cox Phoenix charged me that originally but later changed it. I posted the 'updated' charges a little while back:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I have their High speed Internet, phone service (basic 3 features), & Digital cable (no premiums) with only one of my S3s with cablecards and I now pay $118 and change a month.
> 
> The $12x charge was from when I was paying the multiple gateway fees.
> 
> I expect another set of cable cards for S3 #2 to cost me $11/mo + the ridiculous install fee.


I am in the Phoenix area as well. Is this what you pay every month for digital cable? Just $31? I already have Cox's phone and HSI, I haven't subscribed to their CATV as it is a bit of a ripoff though (been with D*, getting ready to drop them though.)

I called Cox a few weeks ago and they quoted me at $56 a month, plus the cablecard, plus the "digital gateway." And what is that variety tier? Is that obligatory or optional? And do they have M-cards in the valley yet?


----------



## Shawn95GT

Jeanesco said:


> I am in the Phoenix area as well. Is this what you pay every month for digital cable? Just $31? I already have Cox's phone and HSI, I haven't subscribed to their CATV as it is a bit of a ripoff though (been with D*, getting ready to drop them though.)
> 
> I called Cox a few weeks ago and they quoted me at $56 a month, plus the cablecard, plus the "digital gateway." And what is that variety tier? Is that obligatory or optional? And do they have M-cards in the valley yet?


I pay $118 and change for all three. The bundle discounts mainly discount the cable which on the bill makes it look like I pay $31 for cable TV. In my case it's cheaper to have digital cable than it is to have analog cable due to the bundle discounts.

Keep in mind the rate I'm paying is the $99/mo + equipment rate and this rate has since increased to $109/mo. They grandfathered me at the old rate.

Cox has their programming broke down into tiers for sports / movies or variety. Variety has MTV / DIY / kids programming. You can see the tier broke out here:

http://www.cox.com/arizona/cable_lineup.asp

You get to choose one tier with your digital cable and they charge if you want more tiers.

I haven't heard of M cards in PHX yet - but I imagine they are coming soon if they aren't already available.


----------



## Jeanesco

Shawn95GT said:


> I pay $118 and change for all three. The bundle discounts mainly discount the cable which on the bill makes it look like I pay $31 for cable TV. In my case it's cheaper to have digital cable than it is to have analog cable due to the bundle discounts.
> 
> Keep in mind the rate I'm paying is the $99/mo + equipment rate and this rate has since increased to $109/mo. They grandfathered me at the old rate.
> 
> Cox has their programming broke down into tiers for sports / movies or variety. Variety has MTV / DIY / kids programming. You can see the tier broke out here:
> 
> http://www.cox.com/arizona/cable_lineup.asp
> 
> You get to choose one tier with your digital cable and they charge if you want more tiers.
> 
> I haven't heard of M cards in PHX yet - but I imagine they are coming soon if they aren't already available.


Eww...G4 and Logo - two channels I don't want my money going to...but then again, that is the better of those other tiers, unless you're into sports, as the movie tier channels all have commercials and are edited (bleh.) Then again, I can't think of any of the channels in any of the digital tiers that I am interested in, except for a few of the premiums, and a few of the HD ones.

But at least you don't have to pay extra for those HD channels...Is that discovery channel the same as the regular one, only HD? Or does it have alternate programming?

Also, what options does that package include for the phone, and what internet tier is that?


----------



## Shawn95GT

Jeanesco said:


> But at least you don't have to pay extra for those HD channels...Is that discovery channel the same as the regular one, only HD? Or does it have alternate programming?
> 
> Also, what options does that package include for the phone, and what internet tier is that?


DiscoveryHD has different programming. It shows more documentary stuff with the popular shows mixed in (American Chopper etc). I highly recommend 'Alien Insect' .

The Phone package is the Connections 60 package. Their website sucks so you can't really tell what you get with this. I can tell you I get caller ID, call waiting, call waiting ID etc but I do not get and could not get Voicemail without an additional fee. It also includes 60 minutes of long distance every month that we never use. We use the cell phones and I have an IP phone in my home office for free long distance calling.

The Internet is the 'standard' $45 plan. It's 7 Meg down and 512k up. It included powerboost which basically makes your downloads peak at up to 15M down. No complaints here.


----------



## Jeanesco

Shawn95GT said:


> DiscoveryHD has different programming. It shows more documentary stuff with the popular shows mixed in (American Chopper etc). I highly recommend 'Alien Insect' .


Mythbusters?



Shawn95GT said:


> The Phone package is the Connections 60 package. Their website sucks so you can't really tell what you get with this. I can tell you I get caller ID, call waiting, call waiting ID etc but I do not get and could not get Voicemail without an additional fee. It also includes 60 minutes of long distance every month that we never use. We use the cell phones and I have an IP phone in my home office for free long distance calling.


Odd...I have the very very basic phone package and that includes voicemail.


----------



## Shawn95GT

You'd think they'd air Mythbusters... but no.

http://dhd.discovery.com/tv-schedules/weekly.html

I know on shows like American chopper they are WAY behind the SD channel's original air dates. Sadly it is mostly a HD fluff channel with a lot of repeats. MOJO is worse about that though.


----------



## markw365

lament said:


> mark is there a thread detailing how to upgrade the TiVo HD hard drive or is everything on the msftools site?


New mfstools, I'll knock mine out this week.


----------



## markw365

jfh3 said:


> Call them back and escalate. There is NOTHING a tech in your house is going to do to get those two channels that can't be done over the phone. Your cards are most likely not paired/validated correctly.


I'll probably do that this evening. I wasn't seeing any new EMM's so I'm guessing they were hitting the wrong card. Original install was for two cards, but when the "tech" finally figured out that yes, an M card will work as an M card, he took the second with him. However they had me down for two cards on my bill. I only have a single Card in my system.


----------



## Dpmsr

Hello, first post here. I had the cable guy here last week for over 4 hours trying to install the 2nd single stream card. After two additional truck deliveries of cards, he was able to finally get the unit working. I've been happy overall (with the exception of the occasional macroblocking and audio dropouts; hopefully they will update the unit with a software fix) but today the unit began displaying the 480i LED full on regardless of what format mode I set the unit in. Anyone else having this problem? I've rebooted, reinitialyzed, and everything else I can think of. Other than this, I'm super happy with it.


----------



## lament

weird.. ask them to swap in an M-card at no charge. 

then you only have to pay for 1 card, and not 2.


----------



## Yoshimi812

Had cable cards installed yesterday (Thursday, Aug 23rd), everything went great! The tech (Nick) showed up in the time window agreed to. Card 1 no problems, Card 2 did not work on the first try but Nick inserted a different card and TADA it worked. Only took about a total of 30 minutes. Everything was working great, I went through and did a Set up after Nick was gone, set up my channel list and set all my season passes..ectGreat, I have my Tivo backBUT THEN IT HAPPENED! While recording 1 program and the second program was scheduled to start it (the Tivo box) started acting uplike it was a signal turner, and then started losing channels, some would come in but not others, also starting experiencing tiling. So I have a call into Cox to come out Saturday
The second tech came out on Saturday, Aug 25th and replaced card 2, said that the card was not working because of an inventory authentication issue, which I guess means that each card in each truck is assigned to that Tech, but the card that our tech Nick used was never issued to him, therefore could not be authenticated. 
So far everything is working great  however, we are still experiencing tiling, which Larry (the second tech) said is a common problem in our area, and that they are working on it.but for some reason does not seem to happen on the Cox DVR nearly as bad...?  
I do think that it is very important to do a couple of Guided Set Ups before having the cable cards installed. 

Chandler, AZ (new zip code)


----------



## lament

Can anyone else confirm that you *can't* do a channel scan with cablecards? TiVo throws up some message about not being able to do that with cablecards.

I'm stuck browsing through a lot of channels I don't actually get.


----------



## Yoshimi812

No, you can't do a scan with cable cards, just go to messages and setting/setting/channels/channel list and unselect the channels you don't get...takes some time to do and if you have to re-set your Tivo box you'll have to do it again...I learned the hard way  
Good luck! :up:


----------



## markw365

I was right, wrong host-id on their end. I called last night, got a guy on the phone explained that I suspected the wrong ID and why. So I read it to him, hear the clickity-clack of him typing and then a "yeah, that's what we have here" all the sudden EMM's, and the new channels started working. 

Now with the new channels, I had to go into the guide settings and turn them on. Yes, with cable cards you have to do it manually, it's not hard as the whole lineup is there, it's just selecting which ones you want. The easiest way to do it is give it to your 10yo, have him select all, then you go back and remove what you don't get.  

Now for the 500GB upgrade and I'm set for now. May have to take a look at the board, noticed in one of the pics there was a soldermask for another SATA cable. 2 internal 1 external?  We'll see... Problem is finding a time frame to do it, as weekends are free, but that's when all the racing is happening.


----------



## lament

markw365 said:


> Now with the new channels, I had to go into the guide settings and turn them on. Yes, with cable cards you have to do it manually, it's not hard as the whole lineup is there, it's just selecting which ones you want. The easiest way to do it is give it to your 10yo, have him select all, then you go back and remove what you don't get.


wait you lost me on that. can you explain what you mean?


----------



## jcaudle

I got an unsolicited call from Cox, Fairfax, Va, just to let me know I would lose several channels on cable card in September, and that I wouldn't be receiving any more new HD channels as they were added. Not sure why they called me, but I hope FIOS gets here soon. I don't want to have to go back to Directv again.


----------



## lament

jcaudle said:


> I got an unsolicited call from Cox, Fairfax, Va, just to let me know I would lose several channels on cable card in September, and that I wouldn't be receiving any more new HD channels as they were added. Not sure why they called me, but I hope FIOS gets here soon. I don't want to have to go back to Directv again.


 hopefully this will happen and you'll be able to get those channels back.


----------



## jon96cobra

jcaudle said:


> I got an unsolicited call from Cox, Fairfax, Va, just to let me know I would lose several channels on cable card in September, and that I wouldn't be receiving any more new HD channels as they were added. Not sure why they called me, but I hope FIOS gets here soon. I don't want to have to go back to Directv again.


Yeah I had the same call last week. I'm looking for FIOS in my area too. Since Cox only will offer the Digital Cable box to give me all the HD stations.


----------



## gwsat

I assume that the call from Cox Fairfax, VA means that Cox is shifting all of its new HD channels, which come online after 1 September, to SDV in that market. Thus, I assume that its going to happen in other markets, too. I have a TiVo Series3, which I bought about eight months ago, in order to get rid of the SA 8300HD and its awful SARA software I had been using since 2004. 

If Cox OKC does the same thing in OKC as Cox is doing in Fairfax they will lose me as a subscriber for everything but high speed Internet. I will shift my TV service to D* and my telephone service to AT&T. 

My son lives in the Milwaukee area and is a D* subscriber. He just got an HR20 HD DVR from D* and its really good, exponentially better than the SARA equipped SA 8300HD boxes. I can live with HD Lite not to have to go back to the execrable SARA software. I have an 8300HD still connected to my second HD set so I can attest that its just as primitive and limited now as it was eight months ago. I dont know who to be the maddest at over this, the cable companies for subverting their mandate to support CableCARD technology or at TiVo for  apparently  selling me a $1,000 (box plus subscription) paperweight.

I read that Time Warner is shifting to SDV for all of its HD channels in some, if not all, markets in September, so I guess that SDV is inevitable here, too. If so, Goodbye Cox OKC and TiVo. Man, this STINKS.


----------



## CharlesH

lament said:


> hopefully this will happen and you'll be able to get those channels back.


See also this thread. If some of the major cable companies are indeed moving *all* HD to SDV, this REALLY puts the heat on TiVo to get the USB dongle in service yesterday, as this would make the S3 essentially useless otherwise, other than for OTA HD.


----------



## Shawn95GT

Only if all of the HD went SDV. SDV is pointless for the cable companies if they put popular channels on SDV.


----------



## gwsat

Shawn95GT said:


> Only if all of the HD went SDV. SDV is pointless for the cable companies if they put popular channels on SDV.


In OKC, at least, Cox has all of its HD channels, including retransmitted locals, in the upper tier, which require either a cable company digital box or CableCARDs to decode. Thus, it seems to me that shifting all HD to SDV should be an easy decision for the cable companies, even if it does gut S3 and THD owners, as well as the owners of HDTVs that are not two way devices. Indeed, TWC has already announced that next month they will be doing just that in some markets. Considering how much bandwidth SDV would free up for the cable companies, what would the downside of not using it be for them?

I am very much afraid that SDV is a done deal and the only questions left are how soon all HD channels will move to SDV and whether TiVo can figure out a fix for the problem in our lifetime.


----------



## JTalbert

I had all sorts of trouble with Cox Fairfax and the cablecards. It took 5 attempts to get my Tivo to work, and its worth it, and my wife is happy so I am happy!

The problem was that I could always get the card in slot 1 to work, but never the card in slot 2 to work. The would bring out more and more cards, even 2007 cards and still no go with slot 2.

The last time the cox dude came out, I had a suggestion for him, which he was game for and it worked.

I am posting this in the hopes this does help someone else with this type of problem. Would be interested to see if it works for other people as well.

I had two 2007 cards, slot 1 works great, slot 2, no go. The cox tech brought out 2 2006 cards, I was like wtf, but thought we have to use what they got..

I took out both cards, move card from slot 2 out of the way so we would not mess up and reuse it, and placed the card from slot 1 in a safe place. I had him place one of the 2006 card that he brought out into slot 1, registered it, and it worked fine! then I had him take the card from slot 1, which I knew was working and place that in slot 2 and register it with slot 2 and it worked too! I do not have an explanation on why this worked, but I am a happy tivo HD user who is no longer under threat from his wife to return it!!

Anyone else try this, or anyone else who has these problems try it and let us know if it works for you too.


----------



## Dpmsr

Problems, problems. After the cable tech spent 3 1/2 hours installing the cable cards and getting the THD up and running and living with the pixalation and audio issues for a week, I came home yesterday to find all of the front panel lights on, and no signal to the TV. Reset the box and finally got a signal going to the TV but the THD jumps out of the configure step right back to live TV. All front panel lights remain stuck on.

Going to try exchanging for a new THD, and starting over. Wish me luck. I'm really trying to like this thing...


----------



## lament

Dpmsr said:


> Problems, problems. After the cable tech spent 3 1/2 hours installing the cable cards and getting the THD up and running and living with the pixalation and audio issues for a week, I came home yesterday to find all of the front panel lights on, and no signal to the TV. Reset the box and finally got a signal going to the TV but the THD jumps out of the configure step right back to live TV. All front panel lights remain stuck on.
> 
> Going to try exchanging for a new THD, and starting over. Wish me luck. I'm really trying to like this thing...


That sucks.. you have an M-card tho right?


----------



## Dpmsr

lament said:


> That sucks.. you have an M-card tho right?


Cox San Diego tells me that they only have the single stream SA cards available. I wish I could get the other kind.

I really enjoy the TIVO service and the THD hi def signal to my Sony XBR4 is incredible. That's why I'm going to keep trying to get the THD to work.


----------



## dearle

JTalbert said:


> I had all sorts of trouble with Cox Fairfax and the cablecards. It took 5 attempts to get my Tivo to work, and its worth it, and my wife is happy so I am happy!
> 
> The problem was that I could always get the card in slot 1 to work, but never the card in slot 2 to work. The would bring out more and more cards, even 2007 cards and still no go with slot 2.
> 
> The last time the cox dude came out, I had a suggestion for him, which he was game for and it worked.
> 
> I am posting this in the hopes this does help someone else with this type of problem. Would be interested to see if it works for other people as well.
> 
> I had two 2007 cards, slot 1 works great, slot 2, no go. The cox tech brought out 2 2006 cards, I was like wtf, but thought we have to use what they got..
> 
> I took out both cards, move card from slot 2 out of the way so we would not mess up and reuse it, and placed the card from slot 1 in a safe place. I had him place one of the 2006 card that he brought out into slot 1, registered it, and it worked fine! then I had him take the card from slot 1, which I knew was working and place that in slot 2 and register it with slot 2 and it worked too! I do not have an explanation on why this worked, but I am a happy tivo HD user who is no longer under threat from his wife to return it!!
> 
> Anyone else try this, or anyone else who has these problems try it and let us know if it works for you too.


I am on Cox Phoenix and had a similar experience. After 6 cards in slot 2 of the THD - none of which worked, we (I use the term loosely since the Tech was somewhat clueless) tried a card from my 65" Mits TV (which had been previously registered and was working), and lo and behold, it worked. I think others should take a look at this way of installing the second card to see if this really is an alternative way to get slot 2 working.


----------



## jfh3

dearle said:


> I am on Cox Phoenix and had a similar experience. After 6 cards in slot 2 of the THD - none of which worked, we (I use the term loosely since the Tech was somewhat clueless) tried a card from my 65" Mits TV (which had been previously registered and was working), and lo and behold, it worked. I think others should take a look at this way of installing the second card to see if this really is an alternative way to get slot 2 working.


That just means that the 6 cards the tech tried probably weren't provisioned for their system before they left the warehouse - the cards themselves were probably fine.


----------



## lament

Dpmsr said:


> Cox San Diego tells me that they only have the single stream SA cards available. I wish I could get the other kind.
> 
> I really enjoy the TIVO service and the THD hi def signal to my Sony XBR4 is incredible. That's why I'm going to keep trying to get the THD to work.


They're full of ish.. they have them, as proven by me and others in this thread. Be persistent. You only need 1 M-card, vs. having to rent 2 singlestream cards.


----------



## Aaron1121

I just got a Tivo HD yesterday, and Cox was out today. I live in San Marcos, in Northern San Diego county. I had them install 1 M-Card. 

The guy showed up with a box of old beat up SA cards, and I told him I wasn't going to let him install them and pay for 2 cards. He told me the M-card wouldn't work in a Tivo (because he was referring to the S3) He said all of the M-cards never install correctly. I argued with him, called his boss, and made him go back and get an M-Card. When he got back, it took less than 5 minutes to install, and it works perfectly. 

Be persistent, and you will only need to pay the $1.99 fee for one card.


----------



## markw365

lament said:


> wait you lost me on that. can you explain what you mean?


You can't use the channel up/down if the channel isn't in the guide. You have to set the channels up in the guide before you can just surf them, otherwise you have to enter the channel number individually.

Mark


----------



## markw365

Aaron1121 said:


> I just got a Tivo HD yesterday, and Cox was out today. I live in San Marcos, in Northern San Diego county. I had them install 1 M-Card.
> 
> The guy showed up with a box of old beat up SA cards, and I told him I wasn't going to let him install them and pay for 2 cards. He told me the M-card wouldn't work in a Tivo (because he was referring to the S3) He said all of the M-cards never install correctly. I argued with him, called his boss, and made him go back and get an M-Card. When he got back, it took less than 5 minutes to install, and it works perfectly.
> 
> Be persistent, and you will only need to pay the $1.99 fee for one card.


Yes, they have M-Cards, and not all the techs know/seen the new TivoHD. Push for it as it's a $24/year savings on your cable. 

Mark


----------



## nicemann

Ok Phoenix Cox people I need help. I have talked to five different people working for Cox over the phone. 2 said they had Mcards in PHX and 3 said they did not. Of course the "independent contractor" has never heard of MCards.

Either way...I am trying to get two Tivo HD's setup. Since they "said" they don't have Mcards I have to use (4) single stream cards. Well first one did not work, second one worked no problems at all (no firmware update needed), 3-7 all will not update the firmware. Now I find it very hard to believe there are 4 bad cards. But we left it going for about 2 hours and same issue. Tech left the cards for me to play with. He will not be out till Saturday (2 days) with more cards to try. 

Anyone have any suggestions on what could be causing this? They are the Scientific Atlantic cards.

Thank you for any suggestions.


----------



## BrianAZ

I'm Cox Phoenix w/ TivoHD. Same as you, contractor had only seen cablecard once prior to my visit. It seemed that the key to my install was convincing the contractor to give it more time for the firmware upgrade. I don't know what you could try on your own (without calling up and having to read off the #s to them) except maybe try the last card he attempted again and see if you can get it to get through the upgrade. I figure that will be the authorized card in their system still. Long shot I think. 

Once you get it working you'll be happy. My only concern now that the pixelation issue is fixed and MRV/TTG/TTCB are on their way, is SDV. Cox announced that Phoenix would be a test area and I have no info on how far out from Phoenix this area will extend (I'm ~40 South/East) or which channels may be selected.


----------



## nicemann

BrianAZ said:


> I'm Cox Phoenix w/ TivoHD. Same as you, contractor had only seen cablecard once prior to my visit. It seemed that the key to my install was convincing the contractor to give it more time for the firmware upgrade. I don't know what you could try on your own (without calling up and having to read off the #s to them) except maybe try the last card he attempted again and see if you can get it to get through the upgrade. I figure that will be the authorized card in their system still. Long shot I think.
> 
> Once you get it working you'll be happy. My only concern now that the pixelation issue is fixed and MRV/TTG/TTCB are on their way, is SDV. Cox announced that Phoenix would be a test area and I have no info on how far out from Phoenix this area will extend (I'm ~40 South/East) or which channels may be selected.


Well we actually let it upgrading after he left. Went on for about 2 hours. No luck. As for the authorized card in their system, I can call and add it myself he said. Just didn't know if everyone else had a firmware upgrade issue too.

Thank you


----------



## BrianAZ

I see. Sorry then, my firmware upgrade (1 of 2 cards) went fine, just took longer.


----------



## the_dunner

I just spoke with Cox in Cleveland, OH last night and again today.

When I called last night, the technician informed me that yes, multistream cards were available, but I'd need to call back during regular Customer Service hours to schedule an appointment.

When I called today, the CSR person immediately sent me to technical support. (The same folks I spoke to last night.) Today, I was told that, no, they don't offer multistream cards. All of their cards are the SA cards that, at least until the latest patch, have the macroblocking issue. (In spite of the fact that their SA DVRs use pre-installed multistream cards.)

Fee would be a $6 Digital gateway (that I already pay for my one cablecard in my TV, and I'd have no qualms about taking that one out and swapping it into a TiVo) plus $2 per card. $20 for a truck roll to install the one remaining 1 cablecard. The fees seemed reasonable, though I'd rather just do the install myself. However, it's a wait of over a week for a truck roll.

I called TiVo to ask about the multistream issue, and the CSR seemed less than interested in doing anything to help. Apparently, he didn't care that the company offers multistream cards in their own devices, but not in consumer devices. That seems to me like the cable company setting a double standard for the consumer.

On a tangent, Cox Cleveland also has no plans to carry WBNX-55's digital broadcast. They're, a local OTA station that's been broadcasting digitally for well over months. In addition, the technician told me that, no, they weren't obligated to carry that. (I've filed a complaint with the FCC about that.)

So, the TiVo HD went back to Best Buy. (Where the sales rep who tried to talk me out of the return had no idea that the device used cablecards.)


----------



## Shawn95GT

It seems that the TivoHD was the solution to your problem. 

What was you complaint? No multi-stream cards? non-carriage of WBNX?

You could get your two single stream cards and get WBNX via OTA (assuming you receive it OTA now) and get everything on one DVR.

Cox carries my local HD CW network in Phoenix. I've heard in other markets they don't carry Fox ?!?!? Cox is wierd.


----------



## Boid

FWIW, friend of mine just had Cox (Omaha) install 2 cards in his new HDTiVo. Cost was $30 for the tech visit, and $1.99 per month (each) for the cards. He said the installation was quick and painless. He's a lucky SOB.

He said Cox told him they don't have M-cards.

If his experience continues to be positive over the next couple of weeks, I'll be pulling the trigger on a new unit.


----------



## lament

Why wait? The majority of people's problems were fixed with this last update. It's pretty solid now.


----------



## mrbrown2195

So I recently got a TiVo HD and 2 CableCARDs here in Baton Rouge, Louisiana. First off, the installation went painfully - something that should've taken 20 minutes ended up taking THREE HOURS and two separate technicians.

Rather than sending a tech with two cards, like I had requested when I made the install request, they sent a tech with one card, who told me, "We're only supposed to carry one on us at a time." He got that card working within a few minutes, and then began to hunt down another tech for another card. He found one, who showed up, and tried to install the card himself without reading the TiVo provided instructions... after a while, I showed them what to do, and we determined the card didn't work. Long story short, hunted down another tech, took three hours, and I was late for dinner with the 'rents who were in town. I got the second card working by MYSELF after the technician left it in non-working condition.

It cost $109.90 for the installation, got them to reduce it to $54.95 (still bull). Also got them to remove one digital gateway charge (they attempted to charge me for two).

Now, they're telling me I can't order PPV... PERIOD. My belief was that it could be ordered, but only through the phone or Internet (not through the box, of course, because its one-way). Needless to say, I won't be able to watch LSU vs. Middle Tenn. tomorrow because they won't let me order the game. Is this correct, or are they just morons?


----------



## lament

mrbrown2195 said:


> Now, they're telling me I can't order PPV... PERIOD. My belief was that it could be ordered, but only through the phone or Internet (not through the box, of course, because its one-way). Needless to say, I won't be able to watch LSU vs. Middle Tenn. tomorrow because they won't let me order the game. Is this correct, or are they just morons?


Correct.. the cards are one-way. No PPV, and no cable company guide (except of course the TiVo guide).


----------



## moyekj

lament said:


> Correct.. the cards are one-way. No PPV, and no cable company guide (except of course the TiVo guide).


 Some Tivo users have reported they are able to order via phone - the cable representative should be able to authorize all CCs tied to your account for that program. VOD of course is not possible since it requires 2 way communications, but PPV should be possible. If you play CSR roulette you should be able to find one that can do this.


----------



## mrbrown2195

moyekj said:


> Some Tivo users have reported they are able to order via phone - the cable representative should be able to authorize all CCs tied to your account for that program. VOD of course is not possible since it requires 2 way communications, but PPV should be possible. If you play CSR roulette you should be able to find one that can do this.


See, that's what I thought. But when I called earlier tonight, the CSR wasn't sure, so he called over to tech support. The tech told him "yes" and he started to go through with my order, until apparently the system prevented him from doing so. So, he called up the head tech, who told him that PPV is not possible.

I don't see any technical reason why this wouldn't be possible... back in the "good ol days", you had to call them to get them to so-called "flip the switch" for PPV.


----------



## jfranklin

mrbrown2195 said:


> See, that's what I thought. But when I called earlier tonight, the CSR wasn't sure, so he called over to tech support. The tech told him "yes" and he started to go through with my order, until apparently the system prevented him from doing so. So, he called up the head tech, who told him that PPV is not possible.


I haven't actually tried to key such an order for a cablecard but as I remember it as long as there is at least one two way converter on the account it should work. If you only have cablecards that could be a problem.

Keep in mind I'm not in the same market as you and things do vary a little from place to place.


----------



## KnightShade

Boid said:


> FWIW, friend of mine just had Cox (Omaha) install 2 cards in his new HDTiVo. Cost was $30 for the tech visit, and $1.99 per month (each) for the cards. He said the installation was quick and painless. He's a lucky SOB.
> 
> He said Cox told him they don't have M-cards.
> 
> If his experience continues to be positive over the next couple of weeks, I'll be pulling the trigger on a new unit.


Boid is talking about me. When the tech showed up he commented that he hates doing cable card installations for TVs because he always has problems, but that he had never done an installation for a TiVo. He wasn't happy that his first service call of the day was a cable card installation. But the installation went perfectly. He just put in the cards, called the main office and read off the numbers and then after they said the cards were activated we tested the channels and that was it.

But the best part was that when I called Cox 2 weeks ago to get an idea how much it was going to cost me, the rep on the phone said that a tech had to come out to do the install and it would cost $70 per card but if they do two cards at once then the 2nd card would be 1/2 price. They said you couldn't pick up the cards and do the installation yourself.

The next week I called back to schedule the service call. I told the rep that I needed to swap out my Cox BlowVR(tm) with 2 cable cards. That rep asked me if I wanted to pick up the cards and do the installation myself or if I wanted to have a service tech come out and do the installation for $50 per card. I confirmed with her that it was possible for me to pick up the card myself and she said yep, just stop by any one of the several Cox local branches and they would have several cable cards in stock. I even confirmed with her that I could pick up the cards, do the installation in the TiVo and then bring back the BlowVR on a second visit. I said that I would stop by the next day.

The next day I go to the nearest local branch office and ask for two cable cards. The rep there was new and said that she had never handed out cable cards before so she called over her supervisor to show her how to do it. When the supervisor showed up she said that they don't allow customers do their own cable card installations. I would have to have a service tech do the installation. I asked her how much it would cost me, and she said it would cost $30 for each card with no discount on the second card install.

At this point I was a little pissed off because I had been told now three different prices, and had been told I could pick the cards up myself but when I showed up had been told that I could not pick them up. When I demanded to know why I was being told different information, they said that the $70 fee was if you didn't already have digital cable. If you already have digital cable (which I do), it costs $30 to install. When I made that first call 2 weeks ago I had also had the rep make a change to my account, so he had my information in front of him when he quoted me the $70 installation fee. She had no clue why the other reps quoted the $50 installation fee, the second card install discount or that I could pick up the cards myself.

But she said that since I had been told incorrect information and came out to the branch office for no reason, she was only going to charge me $15 for the installation of each card.


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## mrbrown2195

I had previously complained to Cox concerning a second digital gateway charge, despite both cards being in the same box. The CSR, after much emailing back and forth, finally agreed with me and removed the second digital gateway charge.

Little did they mention that they de-provisioned the second CableCARD. Called Cox today to get them to re-activate it, and suddenly, I've got a second digital gateway charge again.


----------



## rickfriele

Has anyone been able to get an M-card install with Cox in Las Vegas? They always tell me they don't know what the M-card is.


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## silveravnt

This week dealing with Cox has been very frustrating. 

In Short: Cox DOES have Multistream cards in OK. However My son (4yo) is as qualified as the cox "installers to put cable cards in a Tivo"

Long version:
I called before I bought Tivo HD and asked about the price of the cards they told me the price to rent the cards. For 2 cards it is less than for my 1 current box. I asked if they have Multistream cards and was told "no".

I ordered the Tivo HD with standard shipping and called to see when I could go pick up my cards. At that point I was told (a) I could not pick them up. (b) They would be installed by a tech at a cost of $30 per card. and (c) I would have to wait a week for an appointment. 
Well the TiVo box showed up in an astounding 2 days. So I got to look at it while I waited for my appointment. 
The guy showed up this past Monday, late. He looked confused as he inspected the TiVo. That made me worry. He inserted the cards and then called to get them activated. At this point I could only get the free local channels. Another Tech showed up at my house and they both tried for half an hour to get it to work. Then they called in and requested backup. So I got an appointment for Tuesday for what I thought would be the Oklahoma City cablecard/Tivo expert.
The guy showed up on Tuesday and looked more confused than the first guys. He tried to blame signal strength and checked all my connections. Then he said he did not know what to do and I should call TiVo.
After he left I called TiVo and as surprised to get anyone at 8pm. The TiVo dude was super cool and I could tell knew his stuff. We got a Cox guy on the phone who could only tell us what was on his computer screen and made me another appointment for Wednesday. The TiVo Guy told me to call back when the Cox Tech was in my house.
Wednesday The Cox Tech shows up and again looks confused and pissed (these guys hate cablecards because they are not trained for them). I call TiVo and get a nice lady who asked some questions and talked to the Cox tech. Then the same second tech from Monday shows up and says maybe we can try these, as he produces a handful of multistream cards. Yeah the ones Cox does not have. They insert a mutistream card, activate it and I get all my channels. Done.
The machine itself is awsome. Well i have been using a series 1 for 5 years.


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## lament

silveravnt said:
 

> This week dealing with Cox has been very frustrating.
> 
> My son (4yo) is as qualified as the cox "installers to put cable cards in a Tivo"
> 
> I called before I bought Tivo HD and asked about the price of the cards and was told they did not have


Please update your profile with your city/state so we know which Cox you're talking about..


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## avanate

Going to hijack this a bit as an HTPC user, since I'm having CableCard issues with Cox in Phoenix as well.

Where I'm at is that I can get everything but my premium channels - EMM anc ECM counts are at zero, and apparently nobody calling in phone support has any clue what to do...anything I need to tell them to get them to send the right stuff to the cards? 

FWIW..Cox in PHX has multi-stream cards....have one sitting in my machine right now.


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## BrianAZ

avanate said:


> Going to hijack this a bit as an HTPC user, since I'm having CableCard issues with Cox in Phoenix as well.
> 
> Where I'm at is that I can get everything but my premium channels - EMM anc ECM counts are at zero, and apparently nobody calling in phone support has any clue what to do...anything I need to tell them to get them to send the right stuff to the cards?
> 
> FWIW..Cox in PHX has multi-stream cards....have one sitting in my machine right now.


Was it pure chance that you got a multi-stream card? If I call their CSR will they know what I'm talking about? Is there some secret to it?


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## lament

BrianAZ said:


> Was it pure chance that you got a multi-stream card? If I call their CSR will they know what I'm talking about? Is there some secret to it?


Just tell them to put it in the notes. The CSRs are clueless.. the techs will know.


----------



## nicemann

avanate said:


> Going to hijack this a bit as an HTPC user, since I'm having CableCard issues with Cox in Phoenix as well.
> 
> Where I'm at is that I can get everything but my premium channels - EMM anc ECM counts are at zero, and apparently nobody calling in phone support has any clue what to do...anything I need to tell them to get them to send the right stuff to the cards?
> 
> FWIW..Cox in PHX has multi-stream cards....have one sitting in my machine right now.


I talked to 3 install techs, including one supervisor and they all said they do not have M-Cards in Phoenix. Even called support three times and finally was told there is none in PHX. Glad you got lucky. Wish I would have found the same people you did.


----------



## quyrean

So my cable card installer arrived this morning. Cox Orange County, CA. He was brand new and had never done a TiVo or cable card. He didnt even have any cards with him. I was a bit worried at this point.

He called in, and about an hour later someone showed up with two cards who had done TiVos before. they put in the first card and called in the numbers. The operator said it would take a while because there were six boxes in front of mine. The screen went grey, but the Cox guy said that was normal.

They waited about 5 mins then stuck the second card in without testing the first card, even though I wanted to. They called up about the second one and closed the job.

The second card started working. The first tech called up "cableops" or something because the first card was not working. they said it was broken. So the tech went off to call about another one. I poked around when he was gone, and all the menus seemed to say the card was working, but the authorization was "unknown". I dont know if this is because they jumped the gun, or the card really was bad. I even tried rebooting the tivo when the tech was at his van, but that did not help.

So the tech came back with two new cards, and the fellow who had done this before. They took out the both cards. They were on the phone with someone who seemed to know the tivo gui. He had them go to the settings page and delete everything so they could put in the new cards. Since the tivo said this could take up to an hour they said they would come back at 1pm (in about an hour) and finish the job. I dont blame them for leaving.

They were really nice and friendly about it, it was just a bit fustrating that the process started at 8:30am and is still going.

The tivo has finished deleting everything, so I am running guided setup again before they get here.


----------



## wierdo

Sad, since the only thing they had to do to use a different card was put one in the slot. It was also pointless to remove the working card, IMO.

I also had to go through a couple of cards in one slot to get one that would take.


----------



## quyrean

Yes, I thought the whole delete everything was a bit extreme, but

I GOT TIVO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! it works now, YAY!

They came back and tried again, with a tech on the phone who seemed to know tivo. They got card 1 working without encrypted channels, card 2 worked on everything. They didn't want to check the page for the auth bit on the faq but decided the other new card was bad.

They then put the card that was working in slot 1, re-paired it, and we got all the channels. Fortunately, the tech had gotten 2 new cards, so he put the spare in slot 2 and it also worked! yay!

So after about 6 hours of waiting and mucking about, it all works. I think the key was having the tech call "digiops" directly. They were able to activate in real time.

One guy mentioned that they had been seeing a lot of tivo in the area lately (lake forest/mission viejo ca), so hopefully all the techs will soon know what to do.


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## rickfriele

I keep having the issue of cable cards losing their decryption status in the cable card CP menu. Where it says decryption status usually it says ok, but when I start having problems it says no ECMs detected. The problems I am experiencing are sometimes I cannot tune to an encrypted channel (just get a black screen) or I get a picture, but no audio. Restarting the TiVo fixes the problem so thats what I have been doing at night the last few days. It's an annoyance, though and I have had Cox come out numerous times with new cards and I still have the same problem. The best answer I have gotten is that there is a handshaking problem and that is why I am randomly losing stations. Has anyone else experienced this?


----------



## kywiaz

Just had Cox here to install card(s). The installer was a very nice young man who admitted this was only the 2nd time he'd installed cards in a TIVO - BUT HE READ THE INSTRUCTION SHEET. Surprise! He had a multi-stream card & didn't even know it. He said he had picked up a couple of extra cards just today so thought they were probably brand new. He had already installed both cards before we realized we didn't need the 2nd one so he removed it once we made sure everything was working and everything is working beautifully - no problems at all. There was a little hitch getting the digital/premium channels but he had to go out to his truck & do something to close out his service call (code out??). He said this is the biggest mistake installers make - they forget this has to be done before everything will work. I had called Cox (twice) before I set up the service call & each time was told it would be $49.95 to do this plus a couple of other things that needed adjusting then when I called to make the appointment I was told that it would be $64.95 for installing 2 cards. We'll see what I end up being charged. And, oh, yes, the woman (Sonya) in sales with whom I had to talk since this is considered new service insisted that the cable cards weren't going to work to receive digital channels that they were only for HD!! I told her to go ahead & send the tech out & we'd see what happened. Side note: I don't actually have an HD set in that room but plan to get one - I just loved the idea of the increased disc size & getting rid of my cable box with which I'd had all kinds of problems. Keep your fingers crossed - I'm always wary when things seem to be working.


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## Mr. Coffee

rickfriele said:


> I keep having the issue of cable cards losing their decryption status in the cable card CP menu. Where it says decryption status usually it says ok, but when I start having problems it says no ECMs detected. The problems I am experiencing are sometimes I cannot tune to an encrypted channel (just get a black screen) or I get a picture, but no audio. Restarting the TiVo fixes the problem so thats what I have been doing at night the last few days. It's an annoyance, though and I have had Cox come out numerous times with new cards and I still have the same problem. The best answer I have gotten is that there is a handshaking problem and that is why I am randomly losing stations. Has anyone else experienced this?


Yep, have the same problem every now and then. I find turning away from the encrypted channel to a non-encrypted channel, then waiting a few seconds, and then back again usually clears it up, but it's annoying.


----------



## Revolutionary

Mr. Coffee said:


> Yep, have the same problem every now and then. I find turning away from the encrypted channel to a non-encrypted channel, then waiting a few seconds, and then back again usually clears it up, but it's annoying.


I get the same problem (occasionally) and use the same solution.


----------



## rickfriele

Mr. Coffee said:


> Yep, have the same problem every now and then. I find turning away from the encrypted channel to a non-encrypted channel, then waiting a few seconds, and then back again usually clears it up, but it's annoying.


What I don't like is when it happens on recorded programs. An hour of black video.


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## tglucca

Today was the big day for the installation of cable cards from Cox for my Series 3. I had read all of the postings and had printed all of the documentation for potential problems as well as the installation procedures. 

I live south of Tucson and called Monday to make the appointment. It was scheduled for today, two days later, for the time slot of 10:00 - 12:00. At 9:45 the doorbell rang and Keith from Cox was at the door. He said he was running a few minutes early and asked if it was OK to start early, if not he would wait. I assured him that starting early was no problem. He had two cable cards in his hand along with his notebook. I started to show him the procedures but he told me he had installed many of these previously and really didn't need the instructions. I asked him, how many? He said, over 50. I told him in that case, I would just stay out of the way.  

He promptly started the process by taking the first card out of it's plastic wrapper, inserting it into slot one, and with the remote quickly navigated to the appropriate screens. Since he did not have to look at the buttons on the remote while navigating, I was very sure he had done this many times in the past. He then noted the appropriate card numbers in his notepad from the TiVo screen, called the Cox office and authenticated the first card, and repeated the process for the second card. He was all finished in fifteen minutes. He explained about re-doing the guided setup and was out the door about 10:05. I re-ran the setup to get all of the HD channels and everything completed by 11:00. 

To put it mildly, I am very happy with the experience. Everything is working fantastic and I think Cox did an excellent job in this situation. I know all cable companies have issues, but at least in my situation, they could not have done it better. A big thank you to Keith and all the dedicated installers like him who do a great job. 

I wish all of you the same luck in your setups.


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## BrianAZ

tglucca said:


> To put it mildly, I am very happy with the experience. Everything is working fantastic and I think Cox did an excellent job in this situation. I know all cable companies have issues, but at least in my situation, they could not have done it better. A big thank you to Keith and all the dedicated installers like him who do a great job.
> 
> I wish all of you the same luck in your setups.


Glad your install went well. You should call and commend him and suggest he spread his knowledge. Your install experience is atypical for Cox.


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## jcaudle

I already had an S3. I purchased a Tivo HD last weekend, and got an install appt on Monday. Cox would not hand out M cards so the tech showed up with 2 S cards. One of them would only get the HD Locals, no premium HD, Discovery or TNT HD, or analog or digital stations. He rebooted the TIVO and it took too long, so he left. He did not have a spare cable card. Installer 2 showed up the next day tinkered with the Tivo and fixed nothing. I had to wait 2 days for another appointment, and the installer #3 showed up with an M card....works great!


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## doormat

FYI - Cox Las Vegas now has M-Cards. I've got an appointment for Saturday for them to swap my two S-Cards with an M-Card, which should save me $7/mo. So after the $30 charge, it'll take me 4 months to just to recoup the install.... ugh why cant I self install...


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## BrianAZ

pl1 said:


> You can get Center Ice. I have it with cableCARDS. And you can order PPV by calling it in. It's a one way device. You just can't order by remote.


I'm running into difficulty getting Cox (Phoenix) to authorize my cablecards for the Center Ice package. Most of the people I talk to claim it's not possible (though I know otherwise) and the few people I've talked to who say it certainly is possible don't seem to know exactly how to provision it correctly. I'm calling again tonight and hopefully will connect with a supervisor.

Has anyone found the magic bullet? What exactly are the technical terms of what needs to be done so my cards are authorized?

Thanks in advance


----------



## splatt

Please keep us posted as to how this goes. I'm in Phx and I'd like to order the UFC event next week. But I don't want to have to spend hours arguing with them after it doesn't work and they still charge me 
Steve
Gilbert, AZ


----------



## BrianAZ

I just called back tonight. I spoke with a woman who immediately said she knew what the issue was: "It's not setup for your cablecards, let me get my supervisor to add it". She put me on hold for a bit and then when she came back she said "Actually, my supervisor says that the Pay Per View channels are sent on a seperate signal and the Tivo doesn't know how find it"

This is insane. I'm now going to call Tivo and see if they can assist. It seems that there needs to be some direct communication between Tivo and Cox to rectify this.


----------



## BrianAZ

Just got off the phone with Scott from Tivo support. He took down my information and indicated there should not be any reason why I would not be able to view the Center Ice package.. ESPECIALLY since it was working just fine during the free preview. This appearantly negates any possibility of something like SDV being a factor.

Scott indicated he would send my information to Tivo's legal dept which would then contact Cox and inform them that they are mandated by the FCC to provide me this service. He doesn't expect any issues as this is pretty commonly reported per him, but said I would get a call back in 4-5 days with the results (either success or a more detailed technical explanation of why Cox truely cannot provide the package to me).

I'll keep you all posted.


----------



## gumbinator

thatothergirl said:


> I was quoted $30 for the install ...
> 
> Overall, not too bad at all - the only thing remaining to see is whether my bill will be accurate to the price they quoted me.


Interesting. When I scheduled for a single m-card install they didn't quote me any price for the service (I should have thought to ask). I just looked at my bill online tonight and apparently they're going to try and charge me $55 for the install.

I think I'll be playing "angry customer" in the morning and see where that gets me..


----------



## Mikeyis4dcats

has Cox rolled out M-cards system wide?


----------



## BrianAZ

Mikeyis4dcats said:


> has Cox rolled out M-cards system wide?


I don't believe they have.


----------



## ElPuerco

Cox in Oklahoma City showed up at 4:30pm, and finally left at 7:30pm with no working CableCard in my new TiVo HD.

I thought I was in luck when he arrived and said he had just done one of these with a TiVo and it went smooth as silk. Then, he tried to look for the CableCard slot in my TV. It went downhill from there.

At one point he has me on his cell phone with someone in their office who has a TiVo, and she's telling me I have to download the firmware upgrades for TiVo before they can even have their CableCard work. After these alleged firmwares download to my TiVo, I have to tune to channel 30. Oh, and I have to have a phone line connected to the TiVo through all of this, but after it's up and going I don't.

I'm starting to think I might be more familiar with TiVo than they are.

The topper for the evening was my Cox installer yelling at TiVo's tech support because they "won't listen." After all, he's been installing cable for 14 years. (Though this was only his second CableCard installation.) He finally leaves the house, leaving me to deal with the TiVo support guy.

I told TiVo I would call back tomorrow, and lied to the Cox guy to get him to leave. I told him TiVo said they would reload all their updates for me overnight and see if that solves the problem.

He apologized for his behavior and said he would try to schedule a tech to come out in the morning. My goal is to wake up early and work with TiVo tech support and hopefully resolve it before they show up.

As far as CableCards go, TiVo sure seems to know what they are talking about - certainly more than the cable folks. And, I have to wonder if the frustration is intentional - like perhaps I'll ditch TiVo and go with their DVR because it's easier to hook up.


----------



## jtown

ElPuerco said:


> As far as CableCards go, TiVo sure seems to know what they are talking about - certainly more than the cable folks. And, I have to wonder if the frustration is intentional - like perhaps I'll ditch TiVo and go with their DVR because it's easier to hook up.


Bingo! That is the absolute truth. Not on the part of the installer but the cable companies. And it's so incredibly stupid. They would rather rent you a DVR for $15 and deal with all of the training, tech support, and hardware support with no long term contract than rent you a pair of cable cards for $4-5, an additional outlet for $1.75, an additional "digital gateway" for $5, offload training and support to a third party, and have a customer that's locked into their service for 1, 2, or 3 years.

It boggles the mind. Would you rather have someone pay you $15/month with no guarantee that they're going to stick around or $12/month guaranteed for the next three years? Cable companies should be falling all over themselves to get customers to hook up cablecard devices. Instead, they provide inadequate training and all but force people to settle for inferior equipment. Brilliant strategy.


----------



## doormat

Meh, so the subcontractor shows up WITHOUT the M-stream Cable card (he showed up with two S-Cards). Now the appt is for Thursday night. Wonderful. Because I wanted to drag my ass out of bed at 7AM on a Saturday for nothing. When I wake up in a few hours, I'll call Cox and demand a credit and see where I get (considering they're charging me $30 for the install).


----------



## BrianAZ

jtown said:


> It boggles the mind. Would you rather have someone pay you $15/month with no guarantee that they're going to stick around or $12/month guaranteed for the next three years? Cable companies should be falling all over themselves to get customers to hook up cablecard devices. Instead, they provide inadequate training and all but force people to settle for inferior equipment. Brilliant strategy.


I think you're assuming that the average cable customer is like you/me/us? *Most * people don't feel differences between cable/sat/tivo/etc offerings are worth the effort to make the change. Simply getting all the major networks (not even in HD) and maybe HBO is all they care about. In essence, people are already locked in due to their own unwilingness to see the greener pasture on the other side of the fence and make the jump. So with that, why would the cable companies want to make the kind of investment you speak of above if the ROI is not there today or in the relatively near future?

This will of course change over time, but it's not the case today. As we see more kids who grew up with computers/DVRs turn into customers, I think the cable companies will respond with the enhanced training/devices. This may be 3-7 years out in my estimation.


----------



## Supermurph

BrianAZ said:


> I don't believe they have.


They have. I just got the Tivo HD and had my CableCard installed yesterday (10/13). The guy that came was a contractor and knew enough, but he was going through the setup of the second card and getting confused by an error message when I noticed that it said "multi stream" on the TV screen next to Card 1 that had already been inserted. I asked him to try it out with only one card since it was multi-stream. He said that it wouldn't work, but was willing to humor me. It did work . . . . so that was that. When he left, he said "I hope I don't have to come back in the next few days to install the second card".

This synopsis makes him sound rude, but he really wasn't. The two takeaways from my experience are 1) Cox does have multi-stream cards in AZ, and 2) the people that work with customers don't seem to know much about it (like everything else.


----------



## Highlander67

I have been reading this post and was curious of something. I am thinking of getting a new HD-Tivo S3 unit with the 2 cable cards on it. I have seen mention of S-Cards and M-Cards, what is the difference of these cards and which has the better benefits. Also does Tivo use both?

ALso, what is the general thought on how the Tivo S3 works with cable cards? Any main problems or glitches?

Thanks


----------



## AZrob

Supermurph said:


> They have. I just got the Tivo HD and had my CableCard installed yesterday (10/13). The guy that came was a contractor and knew enough, but he was going through the setup of the second card and getting confused by an error message when I noticed that it said "multi stream" on the TV screen next to Card 1 that had already been inserted. I asked him to try it out with only one card since it was multi-stream. He said that it wouldn't work, but was willing to humor me. It did work . . . . so that was that. When he left, he said "I hope I don't have to come back in the next few days to install the second card".
> 
> This synopsis makes him sound rude, but he really wasn't. The two takeaways from my experience are 1) Cox does have multi-stream cards in AZ, and 2) the people that work with customers don't seem to know much about it (like everything else.


But you did not actually ask Cox to bring an M-card, right? As of this morning, they told me they did not carry them when I called to inquire. I'm looking at buying a Tivo HD in the next week or so. Would be nice to just have to use one card and save $4.00 a month.


----------



## ElPuerco

Quick follow up... Cox was supposed to show up between 8-10am Saturday. They didn't show. I got on the phone with TiVo, who tried to conference in Cox tech support. We couldn't get an answer - we sat on hold until the automated message started repeating non-stop. Twice.

The wife called and chewed out Cox, and the agreed to show up between 4-7pm. They showed up at 6:50pm.

Turns out that on Cox's end they had everything configured as though it were going to my HDTV directly. Once they changed their configuration so it showed the signal going to my TiVo, everything worked perfectly.

It's asinine. From the very start there was no question on their end that this was going to a TiVo. It's just plain incompetence.


----------



## doormat

Multistream cablecard update:

Quite possibly the easiest and quickest CableCard installation I've heard of. The guy was done in 10 minutes. Took out the two Scards, put in the Mcard, emailed in the numbers to Cox HQ, got an email back in a few minutes saying it was provisioned and it worked fine.

I'm floored Cox was able to provide a flawless experience this time around (as opposed to Saturday morning when the guy came out without any Mcards).


----------



## OrangeKid

doormat: 

Are you receiving all the HD channels recently introduced in Vegas? I have a S3 with two Scards and have not started receiving any of the recently introduced HD channels such as 702 NGCHD or 703 HSTRYHD. Are you receiving those, for example?


----------



## doormat

I believe so, but I had to manually add them. Go into the channel list and look for them and turn them on manually. Some of those channels still dont have guide data though.


----------



## OrangeKid

doormat:

Mine are checked on but I still don't receive them even though I get guide data for them. I guess I'll have to call Cox (ugh!).


----------



## Mikeyis4dcats

has anyone managed to mget Cox to waive the indstallation fees for a second cable card? I think paying $100 for installation is unreasonable.


edit:

first person told me no, second person took $20 off each install. That's more reasonable. Funny how things are so messed up...first person had told me they could install tomorrow morning, this guy said next date was next Friday.

oh well...


----------



## Islanti

Thought some of you would be interested to know... Cox Orange County just installed my 2nd and 3rd Tivo HD units. I was able to get the customer service person to waive all the install fees (she was very nice, did so without my asking). Interestingly, the installer brought 4 (Motorola) M-Cards instead of the S-Cards I'd been given before! Apparently they'd just gotten them in and were out of S-Cards. The installer was even nice enough to swap out my 1st Tivo HD box's S-Cards. So I now have 3 M-Card CableCARDs, one in each of my Tivo HD units! A tidy $6/mo savings.


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## yroca

I have Cox in Phoenix. Telephone Rep and Tech Support said they didn't have Multi-Stream cards. A guy at work just got M-Cards though, so I phoned Cox back prior to appt and had them notate my work order to bring Scientific Atlanta PKM-800. The contractor showed up with the right card - but had never done a single install, so I showed him how to do it using the TiVo instructions. I was quoted $49.95 for the install, but I called back after the appt to tell them that the installer had no experience and I had to do it and they credited me in full for the install. Hope this helps others in the Phoenix area.


----------



## chrisguerin

yroca said:


> I have Cox in Phoenix. Telephone Rep and Tech Support said they didn't have Multi-Stream cards. A guy at work just got M-Cards though, so I phoned Cox back prior to appt and had them notate my work order to bring Scientific Atlanta PKM-800. The contractor showed up with the right card - but had never done a single install, so I showed him how to do it using the TiVo instructions. I was quoted $49.95 for the install, but I called back after the appt to tell them that the installer had no experience and I had to do it and they credited me in full for the install. Hope this helps others in the Phoenix area.


Did the rep tell you how much they are charging for an M-card?


----------



## DrDatabase

Just had the Orange County Cox tech out to install my Cablecard into my Tivo HD. The good news is he had m-card in hand. Tech was not experienced with cablecards or tivos but all went very smooth. I had to stop him from trying to install a second M card. LOL! Two phone calls to ops and everything was done. Tech did say all they had in inventory was m cards right now so it's hard to tell if this is a temporary situation or permenant. Install fee was quoted to me as $44.

The only glitch was getting billing to release the work order so my premium channels would be enabled.

Surprised by the ease of installation and keeping my fingers crossed all stays well.

Tivo HD
M card
9.2 update


----------



## yroca

chrisguerin said:


> Did the rep tell you how much they are charging for an M-card?


Yes - $1.99 per month in Phoenix. That is for the first card - no matter if is S-Card or M-Card. The additional card (if they didn't have the M-Card) was gonna run an additional $1.99 per month for the Card, plus and additional $2 per month for Digital Gateway Fee to the second card, so if you can get a hold of the M-Card, it looks like you save $4 a month.


----------



## Supermurph

yroca said:


> I have Cox in Phoenix. Telephone Rep and Tech Support said they didn't have Multi-Stream cards. A guy at work just got M-Cards though, so I phoned Cox back prior to appt and had them notate my work order to bring Scientific Atlanta PKM-800. The contractor showed up with the right card - but had never done a single install, so I showed him how to do it using the TiVo instructions. I was quoted $49.95 for the install, but I called back after the appt to tell them that the installer had no experience and I had to do it and they credited me in full for the install. Hope this helps others in the Phoenix area.


I didn't think to bring up me helping the guy, but I did get the M card two weeks ago in Phoenix and then called yesterday once the charges hit the bill. I just nicely explained that I felt it was unfortunate that Cox would charge me so much for a service that I didn't really need, but was forced into since they wouldn't allow me to pick up the cards at the Cox Digital Store. She said that they were valid charges and she couldn't do anything about them, but she could credit $25 to my account. Presumably, this will be called something else on the bill.

It looks like you can get partial or full credit back on the install charge if you ask the right person in the right way.


----------



## doormat

yroca said:


> Yes - $1.99 per month in Phoenix. That is for the first card - no matter if is S-Card or M-Card. The additional card (if they didn't have the M-Card) was gonna run an additional $1.99 per month for the Card, plus and additional $2 per month for Digital Gateway Fee to the second card, so if you can get a hold of the M-Card, it looks like you save $4 a month.


I save $7 due to the $5 AO fee, so YMMV depending on AO fees.


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## Mikeyis4dcats

techs are here....card 1 installed fine. card 2 data number keeps changing during install, so they can't get it paired. they have no idea. anyone run into this?


----------



## kevinwa

Supermurph said:


> I didn't think to bring up me helping the guy, but I did get the M card two weeks ago in Phoenix and then called yesterday once the charges hit the bill. I just nicely explained that I felt it was unfortunate that Cox would charge me so much for a service that I didn't really need, but was forced into since they wouldn't allow me to pick up the cards at the Cox Digital Store. She said that they were valid charges and she couldn't do anything about them, but she could credit $25 to my account. Presumably, this will be called something else on the bill.
> 
> It looks like you can get partial or full credit back on the install charge if you ask the right person in the right way.


I also live in Arizona (Scottsdale) and before I call COX I thought I would just clarify a few things for my new Series 3. 
1. They (COX) have M cards (which I understand 1 M card replaces 2 S cards right?) they are still one way cards but eliminate the need to have 1 card for each tuner right?
2. I only have to pay for one card (how much if I can ask were they and the install)

Appreciate the help.


----------



## BrianAZ

kevinwa said:


> I also live in Arizona (Scottsdale) and before I call COX I thought I would just clarify a few things for my new Series 3.
> 1. They (COX) have M cards (which I understand 1 M card replaces 2 S cards right?) they are still one way cards but eliminate the need to have 1 card for each tuner right?
> 2. I only have to pay for one card (how much if I can ask were they and the install)
> 
> Appreciate the help.


I have a TivoHD so maybe someone else can confirm this, but I didn't think the S3 would work with just a single M card like the HD does?


----------



## ajwees41

BrianAZ said:


> I have a TivoHD so maybe someone else can confirm this, but I didn't think the S3 would work with just a single M card like the HD does?


Nope not yet The S3 still needs two cards even if it is a multistream card.


----------



## Dan Theman

Cox (San Diego)
Just got my Tivo-HD setup with an M-Card.
$55 install fee and $2/month for the card.

When I called last week to schedule the install, the lady said they didn't have M-Cards. I asked her to put a note in requesting M-Cards anyways.

When the Tech showed up this morning he was fully prepared and had 1 M-Card and two normal cards (just in case).

He installed the M-Card and called to activate it. It then went into an "updating firmware" state which took about 20 minutes. After that completed we still were not getting any channels. He called the head office again to have them activate it and 30 seconds later everything was working fine (must have missed the activation sequence while it was updating the firmware).

The box is running 9.2j and it is a Scientific Atlanta M-Card.

Life is good.


----------



## 3morgans

I have Cox Fairfax VA and a Tivo S3. Everything was working great for about 3 months. Recently, we started having issues where one CableCard dropped all encrypted channels. Tech came out, installed a new card and all worked again. Now it is happening again. Once card fine, one card not. Cox just started using SDV, is that messing it up in some way? Any ideas?


----------



## kirk1701

Dan Theman said:


> Cox (San Diego)
> Just got my Tivo-HD setup with an M-Card.
> $55 install fee and $2/month for the card.
> 
> When I called last week to schedule the install, the lady said they didn't have M-Cards. I asked her to put a note in requesting M-Cards anyways.
> 
> When the Tech showed up this morning he was fully prepared and had 1 M-Card and two normal cards (just in case).
> 
> He installed the M-Card and called to activate it. It then went into an "updating firmware" state which took about 20 minutes. After that completed we still were not getting any channels. He called the head office again to have them activate it and 30 seconds later everything was working fine (must have missed the activation sequence while it was updating the firmware).
> 
> The box is running 9.2j and it is a Scientific Atlanta M-Card.
> 
> Life is good.


Are you saying the firmware on the cablecards can be upgraded after the install through the cable company? :up:


----------



## Dan Theman

That is what it appeared to be doing.

Here is what happened:
Popped in the M-Card and the Tivo-HD went to the cablecard screen.
He went to the screen with Host ID and and called the office and read them the numbers.
He then went to another cablecard screen and was looking at the "EMM" count to see it get activated, but then the Tivo changed to an "upgrading firmware" screen for the cable card.
Tech said that he had never seen it do a firmware upgrade before.
Also, the backgrounds on all the screens turned gray instead of the usual animation - a reboot after the install brought it back to the normal look.
The firmware upgrade took about 20 minutes.
Then he went back to the info screen and the "EMM" was still 0.
He called the office again and then we saw the "EMM" value increase from 0 to 43.
Then he tested the channels on both tuners and everything was working.



kirk1701 said:


> Are you saying the firmware on the cablecards can be upgraded after the install through the cable company? :up:


----------



## GerryFR

I had a Cox (San Diego) technician come out yesterday to install 2 cable cards. He first put a SA M card to see if it would work by itself. When he found that it would not, he put a S card in the second slot. It took a little over an hour to get it all working. Some of this time was in getting my various signal inputs to the proper levels. There also was a 20 minute delay for a software update on the M Card. The technician said he was doing about 2 Tivos a week. He now carries spare cards with him on these installs. He has seen bad cards and occasionally a bad TIVO. Everything seems to be working properly and I get all the channels. 

The technician had heard nothing about updating the SA HD DVR to TIVO software. Cox bandwidth has been increased to 1 GHz, but other factors may keep the new HD channels coming on line until after the first of the year. 

The cost of the cable cards is $1.99 each per month. The install fee has not been put on my on line bill yet. They did start charging me for the cable cards though. 

I was happy with my installation and I suspect the Cox technicians are now familiar with the TIVO installation and new installations should go much smoother.


----------



## Sandi

Cox in Omaha just told me they could only install the Cable Cards in the Series 3 and that they do not yet have M-Cards. 

Does anyone have any experience in getting the cable cards in the TIVOHD in Omaha, NE? 

Any good or bad experiences I should watch for? 

Suggestions? 

Thanks 

Sandi (who really wants to add a 4th TIVO.)


----------



## ajwees41

Sandi said:


> Cox in Omaha just told me they could only install the Cable Cards in the Series 3 and that they do not yet have M-Cards.
> 
> Does anyone have any experience in getting the cable cards in the TIVOHD in Omaha, NE?
> 
> Any good or bad experiences I should watch for?
> 
> Suggestions?
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Sandi (who really wants to add a 4th TIVO.)


What did they say? What pricess did they quote you?


----------



## moyekj

Sandi said:


> Cox in Omaha just told me they could only install the Cable Cards in the Series 3 and that they do not yet have M-Cards.


 THD can take 2 S-cards just like S3 units. If you can't get past the stance that they only support S3 units (which is not true) just tell them you have an S3 to keep them happy. Technically the THD units are also "Series 3" as well if any questions should arise from the installer (highly doubtful). Also, I wouldn't be at all surprised that they actually do have M-cards but just don't know about it (or how to distinguish M-cards from S-cards)...


----------



## Sandi

Thanks for the help. they basically told me they only supported The Series 3 and that I would have 2 have 2 S cards if I wanted dual programing.

I had the same thought that I could just tell them I have a Series 3 to get around them. 

Any other suggestions. I'm going to request they bring a couple of extra cards if they can and do double check and make sure they don't have M-Cards. 

Of course they would rather I rent their DVR so sometimes they are less than helpful.

Thanks

Sandi


----------



## ajwees41

Sandi said:


> Thanks for the help. they basically told me they only supported The Series 3 and that I would have 2 have 2 S cards if I wanted dual programing.
> 
> I had the same thought that I could just tell them I have a Series 3 to get around them.
> 
> Any other suggestions. I'm going to request they bring a couple of extra cards if they can and do double check and make sure they don't have M-Cards.
> 
> Of course they would rather I rent their DVR so sometimes they are less than helpful.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Sandi


contact tivo


----------



## Grimdeath

Which M-Cards does Cox seem to be rolling out? Are they using the SA PKM-800 exclusively or a smathering of others?


----------



## Cornered

rickfriele said:


> I keep having the issue of cable cards losing their decryption status in the cable card CP menu. Where it says decryption status usually it says ok, but when I start having problems it says no ECMs detected. The problems I am experiencing are sometimes I cannot tune to an encrypted channel (just get a black screen) or I get a picture, but no audio. Restarting the TiVo fixes the problem so thats what I have been doing at night the last few days. It's an annoyance, though and I have had Cox come out numerous times with new cards and I still have the same problem. The best answer I have gotten is that there is a handshaking problem and that is why I am randomly losing stations. Has anyone else experienced this?


I have a multistream cablecard (Scientific Atlanta) with Cox in my HD TIVO. About every 2 to 3 days I lose all channels other than the networks. When I call up the cablecard menu all of the selections say "Failed to load .......". A refresh from Cox and a restart of the TIVo box brings the channels back until they drop again in 2 to 3 days. Cox is scheduled to replace the card tomorrow. They were scheduled to replace it last weekend but the service rep. failed to bring one with him. He took off the boaster and said that was the problem. It worked for 3 days. TIVO support said if I have the same problem with a second multistream cablecard they will replace the TIVO. They said the cablecard menu items should load even if I am having issues. They said they have never heard of the cablecard menu items not loading. Slow and painful trial and error process made worse because the Cox representatives generally arrive with no prior knowledge of the problems I am having. Any advice would be helpful.


----------



## will592

Just got off of the phone with Cox in Phoenix. They acted like they had never heard of the multi stream cards. I was quoted a $34.95 trip charge and an extra $15.00 to install the 'HD part' of the card. I was also told that the charge is up to the discretion of the installer, and that the quoted charge was a 'maximum'. We'll see on Wednesday. Until then...we'll be trying out the tivo hd with our existing hd box!

Chris


----------



## Optics

Has anyone tried dropping "Digital Cable" from Cox (specifically Orange County) and only subscribing to Basic or Expanded, yet still able to keep their cablecards and receive clear-QAM channels?

Without cablecards, there's no guide data, but I don't want to subscribe to Digital Cable just to get guide data for clear-QAM channels.

Some are reporting success with subscribing only to Comcast Limited and getting cablecards here: Possible to get HD channels w/ Comcast Limited Cable & Cablecard? .


----------



## moyekj

Optics said:


> Has anyone tried dropping "Digital Cable" from Cox (specifically Orange County) and only subscribing to Basic or Expanded, yet still able to keep their cablecards and receive clear-QAM channels?
> 
> Without cablecards, there's no guide data, but I don't want to subscribe to Digital Cable just to get guide data for clear-QAM channels.
> 
> Some are reporting success with subscribing only to Comcast Limited and getting cablecards here: Possible to get HD channels w/ Comcast Limited Cable & Cablecard? .


 Let me know if you have success doing this as I too am with Cox in Orange County and was told repeatedly that digital cable is required for Cablecard rental.


----------



## Optics

moyekj said:


> Let me know if you have success doing this as I too am with Cox in Orange County and was told repeatedly that digital cable is required for Cablecard rental.


Just caved in and getting my CableCards for TiVoHD this weekend. I'll wait a week and call them up and see if I can drop Digital cable. ... I'll update here.


----------



## DanieleB

(Newbie de-lurks)

I just had Cox OC out today to install the cards in our new TiVoHD, and the tech told me several things that I don't think are entirely true. Would appreciate some clarification from folks here. 

* He installed two M cards. I pointed out the message that came up after reboot saying the second card would be ignored, and he said that the message was wrong, and without the second card we wouldn't have dual tuner functionality. 

* Questioning the above, I asked him what's the point of the Multi-stream then. He said the multi-stream was two-way, and it was so we could order Pay Per View. I think this is pretty much wrong on all counts, and we are renting a card we don't need ... true? 

* We were quoted $89 for installation (it's usury, and I told the lady that on the phone), but I'm guessing now that was $45 for each card? (One of which I don't need?)

* We had no program data and only one hi-def channel when the tech left. He told us it was just because the channels all took a while to download and they "don't all come in at the same time." O_~ In fiddling around with it tonight, I discovered, of course, that the problem was the guided setup hadn't been completed in order to tell TiVo the channels were there.  So technically, he didn't even install the first card ... though I guess really the Guided Setup is on us ... but seems like a bit of a rookie mistake, or poor advice? I mean, had we not known better, we would never have gotten the channels, right? 

* We've had to reboot twice tonight because the Fall service update came in, and the card keeps dropping hi def TNT. We should have that channel with our tier, but all we get is a grey screen. Should we call Cox about that, or just wait patiently for it to "come in" (whatever that means)? Or is it because the unit is confused by the extra M card?

Thanks for any advice. Seems like the techs ought to be better trained -- do they not bring out TiVo reps to train folks, or at least to do the train-the-trainer?


----------



## bkdtv

DanieleB said:


> * He installed two M cards. I pointed out the message that came up after reboot saying the second card would be ignored, and he said that the message was wrong, and without the second card we wouldn't have dual tuner functionality.


You are right, he is wrong. He was confusing the Tivo Series3 with the newer TivoHD. The TivoHD only requires one MCARD to support both tuners; the Series3 requires two.

The TiVoHD should ignore the MCARD in the second slot. But it's possible the MCARD in the second slot is causing problems.



DanieleB said:


> * Questioning the above, I asked him what's the point of the Multi-stream then. He said the multi-stream was two-way, and it was so we could order Pay Per View. I think this is pretty much wrong on all counts, and we are renting a card we don't need ... true?


Correct.



DanieleB said:


> We were quoted $89 for installation (it's usury, and I told the lady that on the phone), but I'm guessing now that was $45 for each card? (One of which I don't need?)


That sounds incredibly high to me, but I'm not familiar with Cox's installation fee (Verizon FiOS charges a flat $25 for up to 7 CableCard adds).



DanieleB said:


> We had no program data and only one hi-def channel when the tech left. He told us it was just because the channels all took a while to download and they "don't all come in at the same time." O_~ In fiddling around with it tonight, I discovered, of course, that the problem was the guided setup hadn't been completed in order to tell TiVo the channels were there.  So technically, he didn't even install the first card ... though I guess really the Guided Setup is on us ... but seems like a bit of a rookie mistake, or poor advice?


You need to run guided setup to see the channels and get guide information.



DanieleB said:


> We've had to reboot twice tonight because the Fall service update came in, and the card keeps dropping hi def TNT. We should have that channel with our tier, but all we get is a grey screen. Should we call Cox about that, or just wait patiently for it to "come in" (whatever that means)? Or is it because the unit is confused by the extra M card?


Tune to a channel that you aren't getting. Then take a look at the Conditional Access screen under Settings -> Account & System Information -> CableCard Decoders -> CableCard 1 -> CableCard Menu.

Attached is a picture of a correctly activated CableCard on Verizon FiOS. Your Host Validation entry will probably be different on Cox, but the rest should look pretty much the same. Pay particular attention to the *EnabledByCP* and *Auth* entries. If those don't say _Yes_ and _Subscribed_ then they did not correctly activate the card.


----------



## BrianAZ

DanieleB said:


> (Newbie de-lurks)
> 
> I just had Cox OC out today to install the cards in our new TiVoHD, and the tech told me several things that I don't think are entirely true. Would appreciate some clarification from folks here.
> 
> * He installed two M cards. I pointed out the message that came up after reboot saying the second card would be ignored, and he said that the message was wrong, and without the second card we wouldn't have dual tuner functionality.


Wrong. TivoHD supports M cards for dual tuning.


DanieleB said:


> * Questioning the above, I asked him what's the point of the Multi-stream then. He said the multi-stream was two-way, and it was so we could order Pay Per View. I think this is pretty much wrong on all counts, and we are renting a card we don't need ... true?


He's wrong. You only need 1 M card for your TivoHD. You won't be able to order PPV through your TivoHD regardless what type of card you have. You should be able to order over the phone or internet though and VIEW it on your TivoHD as long as the PPV is not OnDemand and your cableco has not implemented SDV technology.



DanieleB said:


> * We were quoted $89 for installation (it's usury, and I told the lady that on the phone), but I'm guessing now that was $45 for each card? (One of which I don't need?)


I was upset about my install for 2 cards as well but you were seriously ripped off. I think mine was $15 each?



DanieleB said:


> * We had no program data and only one hi-def channel when the tech left. He told us it was just because the channels all took a while to download and they "don't all come in at the same time." O_~ In fiddling around with it tonight, I discovered, of course, that the problem was the guided setup hadn't been completed in order to tell TiVo the channels were there.  So technically, he didn't even install the first card ... though I guess really the Guided Setup is on us ... but seems like a bit of a rookie mistake, or poor advice? I mean, had we not known better, we would never have gotten the channels, right?


My experience has been that most installers have barely heard of Tivo, let alone seen or worked on one. I had a similar experience with Cox Phoenix. From what I've read, you have to get lucky and find someone who really has an interest in these things like you do. Unfortunately I get he feeling that most cable installers are just doing it to have a job and don't really have much of a hobbyist interest.



DanieleB said:


> * We've had to reboot twice tonight because the Fall service update came in, and the card keeps dropping hi def TNT. We should have that channel with our tier, but all we get is a grey screen. Should we call Cox about that, or just wait patiently for it to "come in" (whatever that means)? Or is it because the unit is confused by the extra M card?


No ideas here.. sorry.



DanieleB said:


> Thanks for any advice. Seems like the techs ought to be better trained -- do they not bring out TiVo reps to train folks, or at least to do the train-the-trainer?


I don't know what kind of training is done.. but I suspect it's *minimal* for cablecards and *non-existent * for Tivos. Cable companies really have no incentive to make your switch to Tivo easy. They're losing money with every customer who switches. Combine that with the fact that most people don't care enough to attempt the switch and you see why they don't invest $$ into Tivo support training from a business perspective.


----------



## moyekj

DanieleB said:


> (Newbie de-lurks)
> * We were quoted $89 for installation (it's usury, and I told the lady that on the phone), but I'm guessing now that was $45 for each card? (One of which I don't need?)


 Amazing the incompetence. I know of several people in OC who had Tivos installed and Cox OC has done 2 sets of CC installs for my S3s (though both times I did everything while they watched and they simply called the #s in since I don't let them touch my equipment). Anyway, even if you did need 2 cards (which you don't as others have pointed out) you could get the charge for the 2nd card waived by calling in and making a fuss. In your case especially you don't need the 2nd card so for sure they should not charge you for it, and due to the trouble they caused you by installing it you should insist on getting the 1st CC install fee waived as well.


----------



## DanieleB

Thanks for the sanity check everyone. I'm up against a deadline at work today, but I think I'll pop out the card in slot 2 tonight and try the record-and-view just to prove to myself and them that it's working. I'll check the installation on the primary card (thank you very much for posting that screenshot -- incredibly helpful!) and see if TNT kicks in. I want to see Angel in HiDef!! Then I'll call and question the charges on Saturday. Will post a follow-up to let everyone know how it goes. 

I don't want to get the installer in trouble or anything; he was a nice guy, and he genuinely *wanted* to know how it should be done. But dagnabbit, I would think that at the point I started asking about MAC addresses he would realize he wasn't dealing with some technophobic dumb blonde, and that I might even know more than him.


----------



## DanieleB

Well, I needed a break anyway. *grin* 10 quick minutes while I was getting coffee proved what we already knew -- the second Mcard is superfluous. I was also able to verify that we're not subscribed to the missing channels (or so I assume from "Auth: NS"), and furthermore, whenever I tune to one of those channels and look at the cable card set up screen, I have to reboot the machine afterward. I get the grey screen of death for some reason, and the TV becomes non-responsive. So my guess is that either I'm missing a critical "clear-instead of back button" or that something about the card setup isn't right. 

Will call them on Saturday. Thank you again for the reassurance that I really do know my equipment the way I think I do.


----------



## bkdtv

I realize this is a bit off-topic, but no one I know with Cox seems to live in a market where Discovery Channel HD was added.

If you live in a Cox market with Discovery Channel HD (not to be confused with Discovery Theater), what size does the TiVo report for your MythBusters episodes, as reported by the INFO screen?


----------



## Pafrican

I am thinking about getting a TivoHD and used the online live support for Cox and got this response from Cox in Phoenix...
_
"You can rent the standard CableCARD for only $2.00 per month. Some
newer television sets and DVRs require one "multi-stream" CableCARD.
These multi-stream cards only cost $4.00 per month.

Cox Communications must professionally install these devices in your
television or DVR. The current installation price for a single
CableCARD device is $49.95. If you are using a dual-tuner television or
DVR, we can install two CableCARD devices or one multi-stream CableCARD
for $64.95.

Please reply to this message if you are interested in establishing an
appointment for a CableCARD. We will be happy to assist you."_

Kind of silly that they charge more for a single multi-stream and also more to install a single multi-stream card.

I think I'm going to order the Tivo HD (w/ lifetime transfer) and go with the M-Card even though the startup costs are so high. I just think Cox's $23/month for HDDVR is absurd (especially since it is so often faulty and misses recordings, plus a horrid UI).


----------



## will592

Just thought I would check in here after my cable card install here in Phoenix. First things first, the installer showed up late for the install so I called to complain and they instantly gave me a $20 credit on the install, no questions asked. Second, the install had done one cc install before and was a little nervous because he said it was a different kind of tivo (an S3 I'm sure). Despite the insistence of the sales rep that they did not have m-cards he brought a single m-card and said that they were common knowledge amongst the techs. The install took a total of 30 minutes, mostly on the phone with the CSR getting the info put in. The made me give them the model number of the 'tv' but didn't seem plussed when the guy said it was a tivo. It took quite some time before the cable card accepted the 'hit' from the CSR but when he left everything was working fine, with the exception of the premium channels. After the tech left I re-ran the tivo setup and the premium channels came in just fine. The Tivo HD is so much nicer than the SA8300 that I can't even imagine ever going back. 

The HD is the 3rd Tivo in our house and the MRV features work great. We moved a few shows over from our S2 boxes and they look great, even on a 65" widescreen tv. 

Most interesting part of the install, the installer uses DirectTv/Tivo himself, and I pretty much convinced him to buy the Tivo HD, he was shocked to find out the cable card was $2/month. 

Hope it goes well for everyone else!
Chris


----------



## AZrob

Pafrican said:


> Kind of silly that they charge more for a single multi-stream and also more to install a single multi-stream card.


Actually, they aren't supposed to charge for more than 1 card when you get an M-Card.

Rob


----------



## jfpga

Here in Rhode Island I just called for a cable card install and they said they don't have any M-Cards yet, anyone in this area have one installed yet?


----------



## yroca

AZrob said:


> Actually, they aren't supposed to charge for more than 1 card when you get an M-Card.
> 
> Rob


Rob is right. In addition to a $2 CableCard charge, I had an extra $4.07 in charges - $2 for the "second card", and $2 + tax for the Digital Gateway Service fee for the second card - even though I only had 1 M-Card.

The rep tried to tell me it was $4 per month for M-Card, but I told them I was quoted $2 a month on the phone. They also said their system makes them just put it in as 2 separate cards. I asked what the $2.07 Digital Gateway charge was for and the rep said it was because I have two Digital outlets. I explained that I only have 1 TV, and 1 CableCard, and they removed the extra $4.07 in monthly charges.


----------



## Pafrican

Thanks for that info. 

So what is everyone's bill typically? I figure I'll have a charge for the basic, charge for the extended, and a charge for the cable card (plus all the taxes)? 

Are there any hidden charges I may be missing (besides the installation)?


----------



## milo99

Well, i just got my brand new service w/ Cox installed here in McLean VA. 2 cable cards on the Tivo HD. The guy (Christopher i think it was) had done Tivo installs before and seemed to know what he was doing. He was here for an hour, but that included trips downstairs (i'm in a condo building) to connect my unit to home base. Had to go in and out of the cable card screen a few times, the Tivo rebooted on him once, but it all came up fine after about 20 minutes or so of him working on it.

After he left, i did the guided set up and got the green screen of death when it was in the process of connecting to the Tivo service. Luckily, it only lasted about 10 minutes and upon reboot, everything went smoothly. I did have a small issue of some of my channels (HD channels I am supposed to get) not coming in (i know NFL network is on switched, but everything else isn't). But a quick call to tech support resolved it, where the guy i think he said he just sent me a stronger signal. 

I'm currently subscribed to all the tiers, and i'm getting in HD the Discovery channel, National Geographic, A&E, TNT ESPNs, and the locals among others, so it looks like its all good!!


----------



## milo99

well i spoke too soon. looks like the 2nd cable card is not getting all the channels. It's getting the base package, but not the tiers. arg. technician will be coming by on Saturday. Luckily all my season passes are on regular channels so it shouldn't create a problem in the meantime.


----------



## black flag

I just had a Cox tech out in Fairfax VA. He said that he has personally done four series 3 installs in the last week and a half and they are all experiencing what I am experiencing: one of the cards keeps dropping channels 701-705 and a few other channels. He said that he personally called TIVO during a recent visit because of this exact problem and he said Tivo fessed up that it's a known issue that has to do with either the box firmware or the new firmware Cox requires for cablecards. Whether this is BS or not, I'm not sure but I have missed some of my favorite shows in the last week.

A quick fix (for some channels)if you are experiencing the same issue:
tivo>>Messages&Settings>>Standby>>Live Tv

Some channels need a hard box restart to work again.

Since the Standby or Reset feature brings back the missing channels and the cablecard diagnostics are showing that the offending channels are coming through loud and clear - it looks like this is a Tivo Series 3 issue not a Cox issue.

I'll call Tivo tomorrow and see what they have to say.


----------



## AZrob

COX Phoenix Cable Card install report:

Well, after reading all of the above, prepared for anything and nothing to happen, I scheduled my CC install here in Phoenix and ....it was problematic but I am up and running and it probably didn't cost me anything.

Asked several different CSR's to schedule an M-card install....none of them, and I mean NONE knew about the M-cards. Nor did anyone in Tech Support. But a sympathetic CSR dutifully did as I requested and scheduled the install with a specific request in the Notes section that it be for an M-card.

The first installer (a subcontractor: _Advanced Power Cabling Services_) showed up with two S-cards. He said that that was all they had "in the shop". I said that they were the wrong kind. He called in and found out that M-cards had just come in but it was too far to go back and get one. So he offered to install the S-cards and then follow up with an M-card the next day at no extra charge.

But neither of the S-cards worked. So this morning another subcontractor tech showed up with 5 M-cards (I insisted on that many.) The first one worked, which was fortunate, because the tech didn't know anything about M-cards, and not much more about CC's in general. There was one thing he did know - he HATED to do CC installs.... but he was cooperative enough (though got uptight when I made him stay until I checked all of the channels) and didn't seem to mind that I basically ran the install.

After he left I called COX and asked for full credit on the install. The nice lady in Billing immediately gave me $15 credit for the HD service charge and said she would email in for the $34.95 ($36.93 after tax) credit which would take a few days to process.

So here are my observations:

1. It does appear that you can get an M-card installed in Phoenix now, at least if you get the subcontractor Advanced Power Cabling Services. They are aware of them, even if the CSR's and Tech Support are not.

2. You need to ask for the CSR to put the M-card install in the Notes section, especially since there is no official option for "M-Card install" yet.

3. Try to get them to bring at least 5 M-cards out. If they are not sure what you mean, say "the Green cards, not the Blue ones". The actual model is Scientific Atlanta PKM-800. S-cards are PKM-600.

4. Take over the install and ask for credit later. If you are polite, it may well work out to your satisfaction.

5. BE PATIENT and remember to respect Murphy's Law....

Hope that helps anyone else out there in Phoenix COX-land....Thanks to all of you whose sharing of experiences prepared me well when my time came.

Rob


----------



## milo99

yet another update. after finding Tivo's support page, and reading thru the cable card faq on here again (now that i'm more familiar w/ what all this means), i called tech supp yesterday in hopes of getting the 2nd card working fully before the tech came out on Sat. 

Well, long story short, we got it woring by unpairing, repairing and rehitting the cards, then rebooting the Tivo.

Longer version: and this is something that's confusing me- but after the rep rehit the cards, all my channels were gone on BOTH cards. I was like wtf?? i was going to live tv and the test channels menu and all i was seeing was gray. I went to the CP page and saw that my ECMs were slowly going up, but no channels. upon reboot though, they all showed up.

heres the other thing i'd like someone to answer. Are the ECMs in the CP screens only supposed to show when that card/tuner is on a tiered/premium channel? Because i've noticed since this 'fix' that if i'm on say, the local NBC station, the ECMs are 0 or drop to like 2. But then once i go to say, ESPNHD, they start to climb again, and continue as i stay tuned on the station.

I thought ECMs were basically codes to allow you to see those encrypted channels and that they were finite. But is it that they are actually continually fed to the card as it is tuned to the encrypted channel so as to continually decrypt the info while i'm watching? Thus if i stay on ESPNHD the number of ECMs keeps climbing, but once i switch, it doesn't need them and they go away?


----------



## k00k

jfpga said:


> Here in Rhode Island I just called for a cable card install and they said they don't have any M-Cards yet, anyone in this area have one installed yet?


I'm going to call soon, ordering my TiVoHD this week. I assume that when you called you spoke with a customer service rep, yes?

Hopefully they're just clueless and maybe there are actually M-cards available. Let us know when you do your install.

I still plan on asking them to make a note to bring M-cards when I place my call.


----------



## mdk89135

Strike One for Cox Cable here in Las Vegas today.

I requested a single Multi-Stream card for my TivoHD and was assured that the tech would have one when he arrived. Tech did arrive with a single single-stream card. Also - he had never done a cable card install before and he was 30 minutes late, to boot.

After we figured out that the card was only a single stream card, he went to remove it and couldn't figure out how to get it out of the Tivo. He offered to leave it in until someone else from Cox comes out on Tuesday to try again. I've dealt with enough PC Cards to know there should be a button to push next to the slot, so I got it out myself and sent him on his way.

I did call Cox after the fact and was given a credit to my account - not enough to make up for the hassle so far or the install fee, but a nice gesture, nevertheless.


----------



## jfpga

k00k said:


> I'm going to call soon, ordering my TiVoHD this week. I assume that when you called you spoke with a customer service rep, yes?
> 
> Hopefully they're just clueless and maybe there are actually M-cards available. Let us know when you do your install.
> 
> I still plan on asking them to make a note to bring M-cards when I place my call.


Had 2 single cards installed in my Series 3 last week, went pretty smooth actually, only problem atm I am not receiving a few Cox channels 46, 47, 48 on that Series 3. I will be getting a TivoHD installed with cable card in the next week or so when I get a chance to call and schedule it, I will have them look into that then. I talked to someone in customer service who happened to have worked with my mother at the Newport Daily News, she had just started and had no clue about cable cards etc.... I pressed her to ask her supervisor about M-Cards. they told her they didn't have any. But basically I will be calling her every couple of weeks to get the low down.


----------



## k00k

jfpga said:


> Had 2 single cards installed in my Series 3 last week, went pretty smooth actually, only problem atm I am not receiving a few Cox channels 46, 47, 48 on that Series 3. I will be getting a TivoHD installed with cable card in the next week or so when I get a chance to call and schedule it, I will have them look into that then. I talked to someone in customer service who happened to have worked with my mother at the Newport Daily News, she had just started and had no clue about cable cards etc.... I pressed her to ask her supervisor about M-Cards. they told her they didn't have any. But basically I will be calling her every couple of weeks to get the low down.


Ok, cool. If you can keep me posted on here about your bi-weekly updates, that would be grand.


----------



## tivowiz

I've got an install for CabelCards today in my TivoHD, the cost here in Hampton Roads, VA is $29 for the install & $1.99 per card. If you go over one digital recevr/card in your house there is a flat $5/month fee for "whatever" (I call it the "because we can" fee).
I'm hoping for an MCard, but, I just hope it works...


----------



## milo99

tivowiz said:


> I've got an install for CabelCards today in my TivoHD, the cost here in Hampton Roads, VA is $29 for the install & $1.99 per card. If you go over one digital recevr/card in your house there is a flat $5/month fee for "whatever" (I call it the "because we can" fee).
> I'm hoping for an MCard, but, I just hope it works...


are you talking about the '2nd outlet' fee. Since its 2 cards, they consider it 2 separate outlets, so i know i get charged the normal $7 for the first card, + $6 for the 2nd outlet, plus the $2 for the cards itself. so really, you're paying $8 more a month.

The guy who installed them for me said they're testing the Mcards out in a couple markets, and he thought they may have some in NoVA but only 'a few'. So who knows, the may become available soon.


----------



## will592

On the issue of the 'hit' from the cable company, I thought I would share my experience from this weekend. I ordered ESPN gameplan this weekend, as I do on occasion when the Gators aren't on regular tv. They sent the hit to my cable card and the Tivo locked up. The screen went gray, as it does every so often anyway (grumble) and I lost all video. I had to reboot the unit and the pay-per-view never came through. Luckily, I was able to watch on the old DVR that I still haven't taken back. I called back and had them do it again, same result. The third time I talked to them, they just told me that pay-per-view doesn't work on cablecards. I don't know what to say after that...other than they appear to be right...although I was under the impression that it was SUPPOSED to work...you just couldn't order from the cable card. 

Chris


----------



## mdk89135

Much better luck today with COX here in Las Vegas. The tech brought a single-stream and a multi-stream just in case. It was the first Tivo the tech had seen, but I had the feeling he had done cablecards before, unlike the last guy they sent out. He popped in the card, emailed the numbers in and then went outside to check the voltages at the box. By the time he made it back in, the card was working. I went thru guided setup after he left and all appears to be well.

I was suprised that I get the HD channels on my old 20" non-HDTV (soon to be replaced). Tivo evidently scales everything down to fit the screen - some of the HD channels have the bars on the left and right side and squishes the picture.

Overall, really pleased with the Tivo and can't wait to get a new HDTV to enjoy it even more!


----------



## tivowiz

Cox installed two cablecards in my Tivo S3 tonite. I received the Tivo from Amazon about 12:20 today, so it was all up to date with software. The install was a breeze - we went by the book, it took about 1/2 hour (could have been faster, but, he had to go out to the pole & remove the filter that was in place before we started.

I do have a couple of issues, I don't get 3 of the "new" HD channels & about 10 channels exhibit breakups/pixelation. Checking around on AVSForum I noticed that there are a couple of people there in my area not receiving the same channels & also exhibiting breakups. I noticed the signal on the cable for those channels that are breaking up to be lower & to fluctuate considerably (from 55-85).

I'm hoping that it's a easy to fix problem. We'll see.... 

BTW - I'm in Williamsburg, VA..


----------



## ajcadoo

bkdtv said:


> I realize this is a bit off-topic, but no one I know with Cox seems to live in a market where Discovery Channel HD was added.
> 
> If you live in a Cox market with Discovery Channel HD (not to be confused with Discovery Theater), what size does the TiVo report for your MythBusters episodes, as reported by the INFO screen?


i know how does! cox san diego. speciffically in the south bay. they have about 40 hd channels


----------



## ChrisMc73

Just a quick question, as I've scanned through the old pages of this post...but are the Multi-stream or M-Cards as referred here, the ones that allow us to get On Demand, Pay Per View etc?


----------



## gcw07

ChrisMc73 said:


> Just a quick question, as I've scanned through the old pages of this post...but are the Multi-stream or M-Cards as referred here, the ones that allow us to get On Demand, Pay Per View etc?


There aren't any that will allow you to get On Demand, PPV. M-Cards are just multi-stream cards that lets you get 2 signals with one card. So 1 M-Card will do the same thing that 2 S-Cards would do in your box.


----------



## ajwees41

gcw07 said:


> There aren't any that will allow you to get On Demand, PPV. M-Cards are just multi-stream cards that lets you get 2 signals with one card. So 1 M-Card will do the same thing that 2 S-Cards would do in your box.


just expand on that

it's not the cards that determine 2 way, but the tivo hardware.


----------



## ChrisMc73

So with 2 M-Cards, I could record up to 4 shows at once?
Or record 3 and watch a different channel on 1?


----------



## Bodie

ChrisMc73 said:


> So with 2 M-Cards, I could record up to 4 shows at once?
> Or record 3 and watch a different channel on 1?


Unfortunately no, there's still only 2 tuners capable of receiving the cable signal, the cable-cards are used to decode the signals once they are received.


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## ChrisMc73

So whats the advantage over what I have now? (Two Cards S-Cards I guess)
I don't get it?


----------



## Bodie

The advantage is that when supported, you only need one cable card and therefore cut your cable bill by a few bucks a month.

Phase 1: M-card fully supported instead of 2 S-cards
Phase 2: ???
Phase 3: Profit!


----------



## ChrisMc73

So is there any plan to make M-Cards where we could have two in the two slots we have in our boxes, record up to 4 shows? Or is that just a pipe dream?


----------



## gcw07

That would be a pipe dream at the moment. While it would be possible, more tuners would have to be placed in the box for it to work and I don't see a huge mass market appeal for 4 tuner boxes.


----------



## jfranklin

tivowiz said:


> I do have a couple of issues, I don't get 3 of the "new" HD channels & about 10 channels exhibit breakups/pixelation.
> 
> ...
> 
> BTW - I'm in Williamsburg, VA..


If by 'the new' HD channels you're refering to TBS, Discovery, History, and HGTV then you won't get them. They are not included in the cablecard channel map. In the Hampton Roads area Switched Digital Video is going to be launching soon (I don't have an exact date, just soon.), and those are going to be among the first channels to be delivered by SDV. Last I heard TiVo is working on either a breakout box or a return via ethernet system (though I don't remember where I heard that) but until there is a two way link from the node to the TiVo those channels will not be avalible.

As for the channels that are tiling, I would be interested to know which channels they are as their might be some connection to a situation I ran into about a week ago with a S3 and THD.


----------



## tivowiz

It's four channels for me now, TBS, History, HGTV & HD Theater - I get Discovery HD fine. The tiling channels are 203-207, 212, 240,241, 259 & 712. Checking the signal with the Tivo on those shows that it fluctuates rapidly from 70-85.

Ouch on the SDV, I realize that Cox needs to move to it, but, I doubt that Tivo will have anything until mid 2008 (if then), although they could surprise us.

Can I assume that any additional HD's will fall into this category as well?

Thanks for the info...


----------



## jfranklin

tivowiz said:


> It's four channels for me now, TBS, History, HGTV & HF Theater - I get Discovery HD fine. The tiling channels are 203-207, 212, 240,241, 259 & 712. Checking the signal with the Tivo on those shows that it fluctuates rapidly from 70-85.
> 
> Ouch on the SDV, I realize that Cox needs to move to it, bt, I doubt that Tivo will have anything until mid 2008 (if then), although they could surprise us.
> 
> Can I assume that any additional HD's will fall into this category as well?
> 
> Thanks for the info...


Discovery HD seems to have just taken the slot on the channel map that HD Theater had, so that makes sense, the others are all in new places. The channels you're getting tiling on are almost all on the same carrier which falls inline with broadcast channel 39 which seems to be a religious channel, and the rest are part of a carrier that is inline with WTVZ's (broadcast ch33) broadcast digital channel; 233 and 766 are also in that area but since WTVZ (to my knowlage) doesn't seem to be using the whole channel it would make sense that your troubles wouldn't be on all of the cable channels it overlaps with.

I would suggest having a tech come out and check for possible ingress (broadcast signal bleeding into the cable system) at your home; specificly on the outlet that is feeding the TiVo. I'm not sure just how forgiving the tuner and decoder in the TiVo is so it may well show a problem on channels that the Cox supplied converter would not.

I can't speak to all new HD channels being in the same boat or not, or even new non HD channels (or current for that matter) as that information has not trickled down to me yet, but I will say that it would not supprise me.

You're very welcome... I'll answer any question I can *ducks the pending flood*


----------



## tivowiz

I don't completly understand "channel mapping", but, isn't it the job of the cablecards to handle that part? Is it because the Tivo can't do upstream messaging that it doesn't work with those channels? 

The ingress piece makes sense - especially since I have an antenna connected to the Tivo as well. 

The Tivo is most likely going back, if it is having problems receiving channels now, I can't imagine what it will be like in a few months (unless the "tuning resolver" comes out soon). As much as I love the Tivo experience (bought my 1st one in 2000), one of the reasons I bought it was to simplify our life, right now it's not simplified anything for me 

PS - I don't know if you are at liberty to say or not, but, I heard that there are more HD channels to come in the next month - any truth to that rumor?

Thanks again...


----------



## jcmitch

Cox in Rhode Island does have M cards, but I haven't been able to get them to install one in a Tivo. I know they are available because they are loaded in the back of the new Moto DCH3416 boxes they are using now. When I've called and scheduled installs, they claim to only have single stream cards available.

jcmitch

http://broadband.motorola.com/business/digitalvideo/product_dch3416_settop.asp


----------



## ellinj

jcmitch said:


> Cox in Rhode Island does have M cards, but I haven't been able to get them to install one in a Tivo. I know they are available because they are loaded in the back of the new Moto DCH3416 boxes they are using now. When I've called and scheduled installs, they claim to only have single stream cards available.
> 
> jcmitch
> 
> http://broadband.motorola.com/business/digitalvideo/product_dch3416_settop.asp


Hmm, let me know if you ever successful. I would assume that I would save $2 a month by going to a single card.


----------



## jfranklin

tivowiz said:


> I don't completly understand "channel mapping", but, isn't it the job of the cablecards to handle that part? Is it because the Tivo can't do upstream messaging that it doesn't work with those channels?


The short version is the system that tells the converter (or consumer device with a cablecard) what channels are where uses what is called a channel map. There is a map for Cox converters and one for cablecards. The reason that the new channels aren't coming in on cablecards is that those channels do not appear on the map for cards. Rather than allow the new channels to be tuned on one way cable card devices just to take them away when SDV is launched they are just not providing those channels to begin with.

And yes, the reason SDV doesn't work with consumer cablecard devices is that so far none support upstream communications.



tivowiz said:


> PS - I don't know if you are at liberty to say or not, but, I heard that there are more HD channels to come in the next month - any truth to that rumor?


The last of the channels that I knew about were the ones that were just launched, but I know that more will be coming in the next few months, I just don't know when.


----------



## tivowiz

Thanks for the update - you've save some Cox CSR's and myself from wasting any more time trying to fix this...



jfranklin said:


> The short version is the system that tells the converter (or consumer device with a cablecard) what channels are where uses what is called a channel map. There is a map for Cox converters and one for cablecards. The reason that the new channels aren't coming in on cablecards is that those channels do not appear on the map for cards. Rather than allow the new channels to be tuned on one way cable card devices just to take them away when SDV is launched they are just not providing those channels to begin with.
> 
> And yes, the reason SDV doesn't work with consumer cablecard devices is that so far none support upstream communications.
> 
> The last of the channels that I knew about were the ones that were just launched, but I know that more will be coming in the next few months, I just don't know when.


----------



## ChrisMc73

So if what I'm reading here is right, I can get M-Cards, but I'd still need two of them because I have a Series 3 HD box?

http://tivosupport2.instancy.com/LaunchContent.aspx?CID=bb83ae57-ea46-4162-ab65-4bfde6a851e4


----------



## tivowiz

ChrisMc73 said:


> So if what I'm reading here is right, I can get M-Cards, but I'd still need two of them because I have a Series 3 HD box?
> 
> http://tivosupport2.instancy.com/LaunchContent.aspx?CID=bb83ae57-ea46-4162-ab65-4bfde6a851e4


That is correct - the Series 3 cannot currently handle muliple streams on an M-Card, so, you will need 2 of them.


----------



## marspinball

Hi

I'm about to order a TIVO HD and would like to know if COX is currently installing single Mstream cards and if anyone is having issues with current installs??

Thanks.


----------



## tivowiz

According to this article, Cox is only planning on going to SDV in 3 markets in 2008. Is Hampton Roads one of the markets? 


> Switched digital video, meanwhile, has been launched in two systems, and a third will be added in 2008. Switched digital video's biggest attraction is the fact that it can offer virtually unlimited channel capacity, given it delivers into the home only the channels being viewed, rather than the entire channel lineup.
> 
> "We have taken a tack with switched digital video of a look see," Bowick said. With the three launched markets planned "we will see how it goes."


The last thing I want to do is "shoot the messenger", as, I really do appreciate the information posted by jfranklin - any information, no matter how bad it is, is better than knowing nothing.

From reading other postings on AVSforum.com, it seems that people with TivoHD's that had cablecards installed earlier are getting the channel maps for all the HD channels. So, it's only the new customers that are not getting them. Obviously, this is hardly "fair", however, one wonders how long it may be for SDV to be rolled out in Hampton Roads. If it's a year down the road, it seems that not giving these channels to new cusotmers is hardly good customer support.

One other thing - it would seem to be in the best interest of Cox & it's customers to make sure that all the CSR's at Cox are aware of this, including the Tech's in the field, and, people at the various Cox "stores". I wasted a considerable amount of time trying to "fix" my TivoS3 to get the 4 channels that it seems it cannot receive.


----------



## moyekj

tivowiz said:


> According to this article, Cox is only planning on going to SDV in 3 markets in 2008. Is Hampton Roads one of the markets?
> 
> The last thing I want to do is "shoot the messenger", as, I really do appreciate the information posted by jfranklin - any information, no matter how bad it is, is better than knowing nothing.
> 
> From reading other postings on AVSforum.com, it seems that people with TivoHD's that had cablecards installed earlier are getting the channel maps for all the HD channels. So, it's only the new customers that are not getting them. Obviously, this is hardly "fair", however, one wonders how long it may be for SDV to be rolled out in Hampton Roads. If it's a year down the road, it seems that not giving these channels to new cusotmers is hardly good customer support.
> 
> One other thing - it would seem to be in the best interest of Cox & it's customers to make sure that all the CSR's at Cox are aware of this, including the Tech's in the field, and, people at the various Cox "stores". I wasted a considerable amount of time trying to "fix" my TivoS3 to get the 4 channels that it seems it cannot receive.


 The 3 markets are:
Fairfax VA, Phoenix AZ, Orange County CA
http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6470803.html


> In Northern Virginia, where Cox has about 240,000 subscribers, the SDV system will go live systemwide in about 30 days, according to Kelso. Later this year, Cox plans to roll out the system in its Phoenix and Orange County, Calif., systems.


I don't think it's safe to assume only Orange County market will be deployed in 2008.

Another side effect of SDV deployment is digital simulcast channels will also be switched which means CableCard customers will revert back to analog versions of the channels:
http://www.cable360.net/ct/deployment/casestudies/15098.html


> Cox plans on switching its digital simulcast channels in a number of its systems.


Here in Orange County CableCard customers are already being denied any new HD channel additions in preparation for SDV (they don't want to give us new channels now only to take them away in a few months when SDV rollout begins). I was told by a CSR any new SD or HD digital channel additions from now on will be under SDV umbrella and not available to UDCP CableCard customers.


----------



## jfranklin

tivowiz said:


> According to this article, Cox is only planning on going to SDV in 3 markets in 2008. Is Hampton Roads one of the markets?
> 
> The last thing I want to do is "shoot the messenger", as, I really do appreciate the information posted by jfranklin - any information, no matter how bad it is, is better than knowing nothing.


From what I know of the upgrade plans that article seems to be accurate. As for the three markets the message from moyekj seems to be right, but as I understand it Hampton Roads is getting SDV (at least in a few cities) in 2008. I admit, though, that it's been like pulling teeth on a croc to get the information that I do have. Most don't know what I'm talking about, and half of those that do don't actually understand it. If I do come up with any more detailed info that I can release I'll let you know.


----------



## tivowiz

Thanks again for the info, keep "pulling those teeth".


----------



## Surrealone

Jfranklin...
Thanks for all the info about COX and SDV. I live in OC Ca and have the channel mapping problem now. I had a Tech come out a he told me that the new HD channels are
not going to work with Cable Cards. Anybody have any info from Tivo??????


----------



## jcaudle

marspinball said:


> Hi
> 
> I'm about to order a TIVO HD and would like to know if COX is currently installing single Mstream cards and if anyone is having issues with current installs??
> 
> Thanks.


I currently have an SA Mcard in my TivoHd. Its losing the Cox HD and regular Digital Channels. It works for all analog channels and local HD channels. Reboots don't help. Does anyone have any ideas?


----------



## pkincy

moyekj said:


> The 3 markets are:
> Fairfax VA, Phoenix AZ, Orange County CA
> http://www.multichannel.com/article/CA6470803.html


Hmmm, does this mean that the Tivo HD or S3 is not going to work in Phoenix in the near future when the SDV is implemented.

Seems a lot of folks are from Phoenix in this thread and they are going to be mighty put out.

At this point and after reading the last 10 pages of this thread it seems like waiting for Cox and the Tivo Software in the 8300HD is the better and cheaper path.

Or am I wrong?

Perry


----------



## moyekj

pkincy said:


> Hmmm, does this mean that the Tivo HD or S3 is not going to work in Phoenix in the near future when the SDV is implemented.
> 
> Seems a lot of folks are from Phoenix in this thread and they are going to be mighty put out.
> 
> At this point and after reading the last 10 pages of this thread it seems like waiting for Cox and the Tivo Software in the 8300HD is the better and cheaper path.
> 
> Or am I wrong?
> 
> Perry


 Probably the most sensible thing to do at this point is to wait and see if the phantom "tuning resolver" ever materializes. I wouldn't hold your breath on getting Tivo software on the SA 8300HD any time soon. The Tivo release on Comcast Motorola platform is still not available to customers in the rollout markets and Cox/Tivo will be at least 6 months after Comcast/Tivo rollout begins in earnest, and that's probably on the Moto platform. So being conservative I would expect at least 1 more year for SA 8300/Tivo/Cox solution if all goes well... In the meantime it's looking like 2008 will be the year that SDV really becomes widespread and the pressure will really be on Tivo to get the "tuning resolver" out. Problem is they need the co-operation from cable to get it built and tested and I don't see cable companies going out of their way to help.


----------



## knemo

We have Cox OKC. We ran into the "local HD and limited basic channels only" for 2 months. For the first month, rebooting the Tivo once a week fixed the problem. After ~30 days, it no longer worked. A tech came out and made a phone call, magically fixing the problem. At that point they claimed that the Cox computer system was trying to pair with our tv instead of the Tivo. 30 days later, we had the same problem. After 2 phone calls to Cox I was told that every time there is a firmware upgrade to the cable card it requires a signal refresh and that I can have that done through their automated system.


----------



## JayBird

I got a new TiVo HD on the lifetime transfer deal. I tore into the entertainment center the other day to set it up, ran through guided setup, and ended up with just all the analog cable channels. I don't have an OTA antenna, as I'm just hooked to Cox cable, and I have not called Cox yet to come install a cable card. I wanted to be sure everything was all working correctly first.

So, as I was playing around with the new TiVo HD, I went into the channel setup menu and, nievely, clicked Channel Scan to see if it could find any clear QAM digital channels on cable. (Yes, now I know that this is for finding OTA digital signals, but I'm new to series 3 TiVos.) So it found a whole bunch of channels, all with a dash '-' in the number. For example, there's 8-2, 15-1, 15-2 (I think that's right, I'm not in front of the TiVo HD at the moment), and then a whole ton of them in the 60s and 70s (e.g. 68-1,68-2,...,68-18,...). If I tune to 8-2, 15-1, or 15-2, I get clear signals (interestingly enough, the TiVo HD says it's getting the signal over cable, even though channel numbers with a dash are OTA style channel designations). Note also that I only got digital channels for 8 and 15, and not for any of the other local channels (3, 5, 10, 12, ...). However, if I tune to any of the higher numbered "digital" channels that it found, (e.g. 68-x), the TiVo HD says it locks on a digital signal, but the screen is otherwise blank. And if I just manually select a channel that it didn't find, using the channel numbers I know are valid on my old SA cable box (e.g. 102), I get nothing. Nor with any of the channels in the 700s, some of which are supposed to be the HD broadcasts of some of the locals (I think).

I know I'm a newbie to all of this, so please help...

Questions:

1. Without an OTA antenna, why did the channel scan find anything at all?

2. Why for the channels it did find, which all use an OTA style number with a dash, does it indicate that these are channels it's receiving over _cable_?

3. Why did it find digital channels for only some of my local stations, and not others?

4. Why did it find so many in the 60s and 70s (e.g. 68-1, 68-2, ...)?

5. For the channels in the 60s and 70s, why does it say it's receiving a signal, yet I get no picture?

6. Are there any digital channels (SD or HD) on the Cox system in Phoenix that are clear-QAM (no cable card needed) that I should be able to receive before I get a cable card installed?

7. If the answer to #5 is yes, how do I get access to these channels?

8. When I went though guided setup on my old S1 TiVo, telling it I had an SA digital cable box, it then provided me with the complete lineup of channels, including all those I didn't subscribe to, and then I just had to go into "Channels you receive" and select those I get. But with the TiVo HD, unless I did something wrong during guided setup, it only gave me the analog channels in the list, and NONE of the digital channels (those over 100). Am I missing something here?

9. Does all this magically work itself out once I get a cable card?

10. Once a cable card is installed, will the channel numbers match that on the cable box that feeds my S1?

Basically, I'm very confused on how all this digital channel stuff works when it comes to the TiVo HD. I want to make sure everything is right and working before I have to pay Cox to roll a truck to do the cable card install (which, by the way, I think is absolutely rediculous, but that's a different rant altogether).

Can someone else who is more of a TiVo HD "expert" in the Phoenix area give me a little guidance?

TIA

- Jay


----------



## ajwees41

They are Qam channels in the clear(Nonencrypted) The channel nubmbers will be fixed when the cable cards are installed. How much is Phoenix charging for the install? Omaha charges $30. That plus the fact I like to watch music choice on demand are the only things keeping me with the motorola dvr.


----------



## pdm

Edit: Well I found my own answer, turns out someone else found out this is one of the channels that went SDV...

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=5468367&&#post5468367

Oh well.

-----

I have Tivo HD with Cox multistream cable card. I have never been able to receive channel 227 Ovation even though I am supposed to get it. Cox can't find anything wrong. Do other people have channels they can't see for no apparent reason? I am on Cox in Fairfax county Virginia.

I have also had to have them 're-signal' the cable card, I stopped being able to receive any digital channels (except HD locals). Even this didn't bring channel 227 to work though.


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## tivowiz

It's also possible that those "channels" are On-Demand as well as other QAM broadcast channels. Try going through them at nite & see if there is anything on them - it's fun to watch - you'll see people fastforwarding, pausing, etc on them. If you have patience, you can watch a movie "for free".


----------



## Nightowl33

Ok, as a 'thank you' to everyone for all the help here, I wanted to post my successful experience here with Cox outside of Phoenix, and possibly what made it successful.

*Before he got here:*
* I installed the Tivo HD using the basic/extended cable that we'd used for years. For the record, I used a signal amplifier from Philips that was rated for 'digital cable' to split the signal, so I could also run it to the TV directly. I did the guided setup. As others have reported, Tivo HD worked, but did not get any HD stuff unless tuned manually, and even then didn't record. My best bet while waiting for the cablecard install (a week later, due to biz travel) was to just watch TV directly, which DID find the HD channels (a few were convenient, such as 12.1 for the HD version of 12, but the HD version of 5 was 106.2. Ya, explain THAT to your wife.) "Good thing we got Tivo HD to make that all better, honey."

* I forced updates on the Tivo so it would have the latest software. That took a while, and involved a few restarts. I can see how doing this DURING a cablecard install would be a real bummer. Fortunately, I had a week.

* I read the Tivo pages on the subject, including the troubleshooting ones, and the FAQ here that pointed to them. CRITICAL STEP. I also had the Tivo articles (the more in-depth install and the troubleshooting ones, see the CableCARD FAQ) PRINTED so I could show them to him easily.

* I set my expectations appropriately low. It probably wouldn't work. The guy wouldn't know anything.

*The install itself*

* He arrived on time. Friendly guy. "Ever done this before?" "I've done one other cablecard. I hear Tivo's are hard." "Gotcha, we'll do it together. Here, I printed out..." He was -relieved-, I think, that I knew so much, and we took an attitude of "let's figure it out together."

* "You need 2 cards, right?" "Well, it depends, did you bring Mcards?" He didn't know, so I went with "it's ok, the Tivo will tell us." (For the record, he brought 2 cards, both Mcards.) We inserted the first card, after recording the serial # off the back. The Tivo found it (give it a minute) and pointed out it's an Mcard. Yay me! Cheaper. He did go out of his way to ensure we only needed the one, he was definitely a good guy and wanted to do the right thing.

* Next step. WAIT. DON'T choose configure cable card 1. Just WAIT. Eventually you get the gray-bordered screen with the info he needs to call it in.

* As he radioed (ok, Nextel-ed) in to start that process, the screen flashed back to some other green Tivo screen. AACK. If this happens? WAIT. dont' choose anything. Just WAIT. Eventually we got another gray-bordered screen showing FIRMWARE UPGRADE. "Oh, yes, the internet stuff said this might happen. Let's just wait a bit." He was very content to wait, as long as it upped the chance it would work.

* Eventually, it fluttered through a few other green tivo-background-y screens, then eventually, got the gray-bordered screen with the card info again. Again, just WAITED. I suspect issues arise when people try to DO too much. NOW, he called it in to activate the card.

* THEN, I hit clear (note, the first time i've hit a key in about 15 minutes) and we did the test channels thing. Most worked, except for the high-numbered HD stuff. That is, I could get NBC HD (712) but not Discovery HD (723). So, reading through the stuff, this was likely either because:
- SA cards just take a while to get all their auth keys
- Tivo was somehow confused (unlikely, but hey)
- The auth wasn't right.
Since I needed it to work before he left, I went with "well, there's this step that says if we get a gray screen and "to be announced," that we need to re-do Guided Setup. (Which, I was planning to do later, but hey.) So I did that, all while he watched. It took about 15 minutes to download all the info. Also, he was not entirely clear about which channels I was supposed to get, so that took a few minutes (we figured out they gave me a couple months free of the "Movie" tier, as it turns out.) After the guided setup - voila! 723 worked.

You could SEE the relief on his face. "Hey, do you want to take these print outs with you?" "Could I, that'd be great!" (He had another install, though we weren't sure it was in a tivo.)

So - as to that last part - I suspect the card just needed the 15 minutes to get all the channel keys, and that the guided setup made no difference to that part, but it was sure reassuring to see EVERYTHING work before he left.

Total time: 40 minutes.

Now I'm going through the Season Pass Manager and 'upgrading' all the shows to HD. Oh, and I strongly recommend the expansion hard drive. After a week, we have 95 Tivo Suggestions. 

Hope this helps...


----------



## will592

Hey Nightowl33, 

Sounds like your experience was a lot like mine here in Phoenix. Can you tell me if you've had any problems yet with the 'gray screen' on cable card channels?


----------



## tim4umd

Just had my install completed today(12/3/2007)! Went great! Cox Las Vegas Cable said they only had Cable Card and not MCard when i set up my appointment. When they showed up they had MCard. So thats good a savings of $2 per box and the digital gateway fee per card. I have 2 boxes I had installed. Cost per box for install was $50. but now I pay less per month thanks to not having a cable box They installer said I would not get HBO, so I feared SDV or switched digital video. BUT i get all my channels. NO PPV or InDemand but hey. that is over rated anyways. I wanna watch my stuff on the day it premieres, not the day after. If any one has any questions feel free to post a reply to my message and I will reply


----------



## JayBird

Nightowl33 said:


> For the record, I used a signal amplifier from Philips that was rated for 'digital cable' to split the signal, so I could also run it to the TV directly.


What's the model number of the amplifier, and where did you get it?


----------



## Ajay747

tim4umd said:


> Just had my install completed today(12/3/2007)! Went great! Cox Las Vegas Cable said they only had Cable Card and not MCard when i set up my appointment. When they showed up they had MCard. So thats good a savings of $2 per box and the digital gateway fee per card. I have 2 boxes I had installed. Cost per box for install was $50. but now I pay less per month thanks to not having a cable box They installer said I would not get HBO, so I feared SDV or switched digital video. BUT i get all my channels. NO PPV or InDemand but hey. that is over rated anyways. I wanna watch my stuff on the day it premieres, not the day after. If any one has any questions feel free to post a reply to my message and I will reply


TIM,

Thanks for your recent post regarding the COX Vegas install. I am a new guy to this forum and very motivated in purchasing a Series 3 before Xmas unfortuantely I do not have extensive time to search all the post on this board regarding MCards, Cable Cards, etc.

Can you offer your recommendation on what to ask COX CSR for regarding getting these MCards delivered and installed in a new S3. Do I want to mention that I have a TIVO or just 2 new TVs that need cards to prevent some pricing bias? I have not attempted any Cox DVR and it sounds like the new S3 may well be my best application.
Are you able to also receive the MHD (music) channels with no problem? I do not need HBO or other PPV but some of these current HD channels from Cox would be nice to keep.

Thanks for your help and advice while I search for the best pricing for the Tivo S3.

AJay
Henderson NV


----------



## ajwees41

Ajay747 said:


> TIM,
> 
> Thanks for your recent post regarding the COX Vegas install. I am a new guy to this forum and very motivated in purchasing a Series 3 before Xmas unfortuantely I do not have extensive time to search all the post on this board regarding MCards, Cable Cards, etc.
> 
> Can you offer your recommendation on what to ask COX CSR for regarding getting these MCards delivered and installed in a new S3. Do I want to mention that I have a TIVO or just 2 new TVs that need cards to prevent some pricing bias? I have not attempted any Cox DVR and it sounds like the new S3 may well be my best application.
> Are you able to also receive the MHD (music) channels with no problem? I do not need HBO or other PPV but some of these current HD channels from Cox would be nice to keep.
> 
> Thanks for your help and advice while I search for the best pricing for the Tivo S3.
> 
> AJay
> Henderson NV


You will still need two Mcards for the S3 the TivoHD can handle one Mcard, but the S3 can't.


----------



## pdm

Cox in northern Virginia just rolled out 11 new HD channels, none of them work with cable card , SDV I guess. http://www.cox.com/fairfax/press_release/newHDchannels.stm

Hope they come out with that usb dongle soon. Guess this is what you get when you are on bleeding edge.


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## GREATDANE

What Is Sdv???


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## moyekj

GREATDANE said:


> What Is Sdv???


 Switched Digital Video. Cox has plans to deploy SDV in most of it's big markets (already started in Fairfax VA and Phoenix AZ and slated to deploy in Orange County CA in early 2008).


----------



## ajwees41

GREATDANE said:


> To Ajwees41 Its Better To Tell Cox Exactly What Your Tivo Is, Pricing Is Standing And Will Better Prepare The Technician To Install The Cards For You. Ive Been On Install Calls Where The Customer Didnt Explain That He Had A Tivo S3 And Television And All It Did Was Mess Things Up For Him


Did you you even read what I posted? He wants to get a Mcard for an S3 when he needs two Scards since the S3 doesn't have Mcard support yet. Also did you get premission from Cox to post? There was someone on the local avs website who was posting, but aren't now because Cox said they can't.


----------



## ajwees41

Currently, the *Series3 HD DVR will support M-Cards in single-stream mode*, which means that the DVR requires two (2) CableCARDs to run in dual-tuner mode. The DVR must also be running software version 8.0.1c or later. (S-Cards are supported in all software versions.) Your Series3 HD DVR may have shipped with an earlier version of the software installed. The software will be updated automatically, but not until the DVR completes Guided Setup for the first time, and then downloads and indexes the full 14 days of Guide data immediately after Guided Setup.

To ensure that your CableCARD installation runs smoothly, we recommend that you complete Guided Setup on your Series3 HD DVR before the installer arrives to install the CableCARDs. If you perform Guided Setup at least two days before your installation appointment, your DVR will update to the latest software automatically and will be ready to run either S-Cards or M-Cards. 
If you perform Guided Setup on the day of the appointment, you should check your software version and, if necessary, force a software update. For more information, go to Software Version Troubleshooting.

*We are exploring support of M-Cards in multi-stream mode for the Series3 HD DVR. *
you are wrong the S3 the older tivo still needs two cards. It's the newer TivoHD that will accept 1 Multistream card.


----------



## GREATDANE

Well, Aren't You Special


----------



## CRAZYCHARLIE

Hey Greatdane , Go Away


----------



## ajwees41

GREATDANE said:


> Well, Aren't You Special


if I am so special why did you delete your post I quoted?


----------



## Pafrican

Question for the board,

Every couple of days I lose picture on my non-local channels (espn, tnt, fx, food network hd channels, and the like). Picture for local and local-hd works fine. A simple restart of the TivoHD fixes the issue only to pop up again in a day or two. The TivoHD has one M-card installed. 

I called cox and asked if they'd send a new signal. I restarted after that but I expect to see the problem arise again. They've scheduled a tech to come out but is there anything I can do to fix the problem or any lingo I need to use with the phone tech? 

Thanks.


----------



## steinercat

Pafrican said:


> Question for the board,
> 
> Every couple of days I lose picture on my non-local channels (espn, tnt, fx, food network hd channels, and the like). Picture for local and local-hd works fine. A simple restart of the TivoHD fixes the issue only to pop up again in a day or two. The TivoHD has one M-card installed.
> 
> I called cox and asked if they'd send a new signal. I restarted after that but I expect to see the problem arise again. They've scheduled a tech to come out but is there anything I can do to fix the problem or any lingo I need to use with the phone tech?
> 
> Thanks.


Same problem here with a THD in Las Vegas using 2 cable cards (not M i don't think)

ABC HD just blacked out on me today and hasn't come back since.

I'm really thinking of giving this TiVO up before the 30-day exchange period expires.

I finally solved my pixelation problems...but now this.


----------



## barrettd

For those in Oklahoma City, Cox will tell you they do not have M-cards yet, but just ask for them to put that request for an M-card in the notes for the installer. Also, make sure to put in the notes that it is for a Tivo HD install. I had an install done last weekend and the tech showed up with a handful of M-cards. Install went fine, but I made the mistake of redoing the guided setup instead of just configuring the card, so that added about 20 minutes to the install time. Fortunately, my tech was patient and welcomed my help in setting the Tivo HD up. He had done a few Series 3 installs before, but it seemed like mine was his first THD install. He was in and out in about 45 minutes.


----------



## Nightowl33

Sorry for the delay to those who asked questions:

Have I had issues with gray channels? Yes, it seems to be a Tivo software thing, from what I've gathered from other threads - so I'm biding my time, there.

The amplifier I used was a Philips SDW5014, got it at Circuit City.


----------



## Ajay747

ajwees41 said:


> You will still need two Mcards for the S3 the TivoHD can handle one Mcard, but the S3 can't.


Thank you for your informed posts in this forum as I am new and appreciate all the direction. Yes, I will ask for 2 Mcards(multistream) for a new S3 to run the 2 tuners from Cox Las Vegas.
I am standing by a response from TIM (above) before I call COX.
Ps...I am still shopping for the new S3 as TStore is out of stock and might look at CC for the unit with the AAA coupon. Any other thoughts??

Thanks again............Ajay


----------



## ajwees41

Ajay747 said:


> Thank you for your informed posts in this forum as I am new and appreciate all the direction. Yes, I will ask for 2 Mcards(multistream) for a new S3 to run the 2 tuners from Cox Las Vegas.
> I am standing by a response from TIM (above) before I call COX.
> Ps...I am still shopping for the new S3 as TStore is out of stock and might look at CC for the unit with the AAA coupon. Any other thoughts??
> 
> Thanks again............Ajay


Are you set on the original S3 if yes you can also get two single stream cards instead of the Multistream ones since the S3 doesn't use Mcards yet.


----------



## mrbrown2195

Looks like Cox Baton Rouge rolled out SDV. Friend of mine who has a CableCARD TV set called me today and told me that they had added CNNHD, Food Network HD, and HD Theater to the lineup - he could only get the last one on his TV. Called Cox and was told that CableCARD customers can't get CNN or Food Network.

I can't pick them up on my TiVo either, so I am assuming they've rolled out SDV here.


----------



## sniperlv

I really like my HD Tivos had Tivo since the 14 hr model. Bought several over the past few years. Im in the Phoenix Market with Cox. If the HD Channels I have start going to SDV and this mysterious dongle isn't available I will put my 2 HD Tivos in the closet and go with Direct TV.


----------



## moyekj

mrbrown2195 said:


> Looks like Cox Baton Rouge rolled out SDV. Friend of mine who has a CableCARD TV set called me today and told me that they had added CNNHD, Food Network HD, and HD Theater to the lineup - he could only get the last one on his TV. Called Cox and was told that CableCARD customers can't get CNN or Food Network.
> 
> I can't pick them up on my TiVo either, so I am assuming they've rolled out SDV here.


 Even though Cox has only rolled out SDV in 2 markets so far (Fairfax VA and Phoenix AZ) they have plans for more SDV rollouts next year and so those targeted markets they are already preventing CableCard customers from getting new channels now only to be taken away when SDV does roll out. That is the case in Cox Orange County and looks like Baton Rouge and maybe others.


----------



## k00k

I'm in RI. I just scheduled my CableCard install for my series3 HD which is due to arrive Friday.

Today's Tuesday and the earliest install date I could get was next Wednesday...over a week?!? I'm going to keep calling to try and get an earlier appointment.

Anyway, the rep (who was new) tried to charge me $55 for each cablecard even though it's a single tivo. I told her to talk to a manager...it ended up being $55 total, she split the fee between the 2 cards which were line items. Other than that she was nice and took down all of the notes I asked her to: Bring M-Cards (not that it really matters), send a service tech familiar with Tivo if possible.

So, fingers crossed. I'll be sure to have guided setup done and software updated before then. Any other pointers?


----------



## Bodie

k00k said:


> I'm in RI. I just scheduled my CableCard install for my series3 HD which is due to arrive Friday.
> 
> Today's Tuesday and the earliest install date I could get was next Wednesday...over a week?!? I'm going to keep calling to try and get an earlier appointment.
> 
> Anyway, the rep (who was new) tried to charge me $55 for each cablecard even though it's a single tivo. I told her to talk to a manager...it ended up being $55 total, she split the fee between the 2 cards which were line items. Other than that she was nice and took down all of the notes I asked her to: Bring M-Cards (not that it really matters), send a service tech familiar with Tivo if possible.
> 
> So, fingers crossed. I'll be sure to have guided setup done and software updated before then. Any other pointers?


The techs that came to my house (East Bay) were pretty good. The first guy only had two cards (though I said to make sure he had multiple) and he couldn't get them going, so he got another tech on the Nextel and she had a bunch of cards and they got two working after pairing them a couple of times.


----------



## dukedave

moyekj said:


> Even though Cox has only rolled out SDV in 2 markets so far (Fairfax VA and Phoenix AZ) they have plans for more SDV rollouts next year and so those targeted markets they are already preventing CableCard customers from getting new channels now only to be taken away when SDV does roll out. That is the case in Cox Orange County and looks like Baton Rouge and maybe others.


Cox Orange County is not pushing all of the new HD channels to cablecard subscribers... I am missing CNN HD, TLC HD, Discovery HD, History HD, NFL HD among a handful of others. Spoke with Cox tech support and they say that there are technical limitations with the cablecards that they can't resolve and that I will have to live with fewer HD channels.

Are they serious? Anyone else hear about this? I see on the Cox website now that they have added a disclaimer saying that cablecard customers must have a set top box to receive some channels. Now they tell me?! Anything we can do?


----------



## ajwees41

dukedave said:


> Cox Orange County is not pushing all of the new HD channels to cablecard subscribers... I am missing CNN HD, TLC HD, Discovery HD, History HD, NFL HD among a handful of others. Spoke with Cox tech support and they say that there are technical limitations with the cablecards that they can't resolve and that I will have to live with fewer HD channels.
> 
> Are they serious? Anyone else hear about this? I see on the Cox website now that they have added a disclaimer saying that cablecard customers must have a set top box to receive some channels. Now they tell me?! Anything we can do?


it's not the cable cards fault, the tivo's don't have 2 way communications for SDV, but there is supposed to be a tuner resolver on the way in 2008 that will allow SDV channelas on a tivo.


----------



## lament

dukedave said:


> Cox Orange County is not pushing all of the new HD channels to cablecard subscribers... I am missing CNN HD, TLC HD, Discovery HD, History HD, NFL HD among a handful of others. Spoke with Cox tech support and they say that there are technical limitations with the cablecards that they can't resolve and that I will have to live with fewer HD channels.
> 
> Are they serious? Anyone else hear about this? I see on the Cox website now that they have added a disclaimer saying that cablecard customers must have a set top box to receive some channels. Now they tell me?! Anything we can do?


Yup you'll have to wait until Q208 for the dongle. that's up to 6 months away.


----------



## ajwees41

lament said:


> Yup you'll have to wait until Q208 for the dongle. that's up to 6 months away.


isn't that what I said?


----------



## nocturne1

ajwees41 said:


> isn't that what I said?


He just wanted to say dongle...


----------



## ellinj

k00k said:


> I'm in RI. I just scheduled my CableCard install for my series3 HD which is due to arrive Friday.
> 
> Today's Tuesday and the earliest install date I could get was next Wednesday...over a week?!? I'm going to keep calling to try and get an earlier appointment.
> 
> Anyway, the rep (who was new) tried to charge me $55 for each cablecard even though it's a single tivo. I told her to talk to a manager...it ended up being $55 total, she split the fee between the 2 cards which were line items. Other than that she was nice and took down all of the notes I asked her to: Bring M-Cards (not that it really matters), send a service tech familiar with Tivo if possible.
> 
> So, fingers crossed. I'll be sure to have guided setup done and software updated before then. Any other pointers?


Let me know if you get M-Cards. I thought RI didn't have them yet.


----------



## lament

ajwees41 said:


> isn't that what I said?


I expanded on your comment by posting a link to the press release and noted that it will be Q208 before they come out.

and yes, I also wanted to say dongle.


----------



## Surrealone

good news and bad news Cox is working on a dongle <weird name. But will have SDV roll out in early 08


----------



## ajwees41

Surrealone said:


> good news and bad news Cox is working on a dongle <weird name. But will have SDV roll out in early 08


it's not cox, but tivo working on it


----------



## OrangeKid

Does anyone know if Cox Las Vegas has started using SDV? A number of new HD channels have been introduced over the last few weeks and I cannot receive them on my Tivo S3. Before having a tech come over I would like to be sure that it is not an SDV issue.


----------



## moyekj

OrangeKid said:


> Does anyone know if Cox Las Vegas has started using SDV? A number of new HD channels have been introduced over the last few weeks and I cannot receive them on my Tivo S3. Before having a tech come over I would like to be sure that it is not an SDV issue.


 As I've stated before in this thread, Cox is already withholding channels from CableCard users for markets where SDV will deployed soon. Seems likely a big market like Vegas falls in that category.


----------



## JayBird

For those in the Phoenix market, what channels are _not_ currently available with a Cable Card?

I just got my TiVo HD, but haven't had Cox out yet to install a card. And now I'm a bit concerned about letting go of my cable box if I'm going to lose some channels in the deal. I may have to have both until the SDV dongle arrives.

Also, although you can't order PPV through a TiVo HD, is it true that you can still watch/record a PPV movie/event with a TiVo HD if you order the PPV by calling in and/or via the Cox website and then just tune to the correct channel?

Do you get the info for the PPV channels in the guide data?


----------



## pdm

Anyone have a problem where Tivo HD will stop receiving some digital and HD channels and if you reboot the tivo unit they work again? When this happens I can usually get clear QAM locals but not any encrypted HDs and some other SD digital channels. I have to reboot my tivo every few days to keep getting all channels.


----------



## Rolow

pdm said:


> Anyone have a problem where Tivo HD will stop receiving some digital and HD channels and if you reboot the tivo unit they work again? When this happens I can usually get clear QAM locals but not any encrypted HDs and some other SD digital channels. I have to reboot my tivo every few days to keep getting all channels.


I have the same problem here in Phoenix


----------



## colflagg

pdm said:


> Anyone have a problem where Tivo HD will stop receiving some digital and HD channels and if you reboot the tivo unit they work again? When this happens I can usually get clear QAM locals but not any encrypted HDs and some other SD digital channels. I have to reboot my tivo every few days to keep getting all channels.





Rolow said:


> I have the same problem here in Phoenix


I also have the same problem here in Phoenix. I've had Cox switch my cable cards out several times and still have the issue every few days.

The weird thing is I have two Series 3 TiVos and only one of them is having the issue. The "stable" Tivo has older single stream cards and the one that loses the channels has newer multi stream cards. I'm having trouble getting Cox to replace these cards with single stream cards as they are starting to be hard to come by.


----------



## beboyle

JayBird said:


> For those in the Phoenix market, what channels are _not_ currently available with a Cable Card?


None - I get all the listed HD channels on my Series 3.



JayBird said:


> I just got my TiVo HD, but haven't had Cox out yet to install a card. And now I'm a bit concerned about letting go of my cable box if I'm going to lose some channels in the deal. I may have to have both until the SDV dongle arrives.
> 
> Also, although you can't order PPV through a TiVo HD, is it true that you can still watch/record a PPV movie/event with a TiVo HD if you order the PPV by calling in and/or via the Cox website and then just tune to the correct channel?


I've heard people say they do that, but I haven't tried it myself.



JayBird said:


> Do you get the info for the PPV channels in the guide data?


No


----------



## pdm

I just called TiVo about my 'have to reboot every few days to keep getting channels' problem, and they told me it was because of signal strength, and that I needed an amplifier or get cable compay to up the power. While it is int he broken state, I went to the signal strength area and I got 100 signal for all the channels. I'm not sure how you can get higher than 100.  Rebooting fixed the problem again, still 100&#37; signal.

Maybe I would be better off asking for 2 single stream cards like colflagg suggests. I suspect that would cost more some how.


----------



## ontheway

Cox was just out this morning to install the cablecards in my new TivoHD, all the CSRs I spoke to insisted that an M-Card was non existent in Orange County, I asked that they put in the notes for the installer to bring an M-Card and hoped for the best.

Bright and early this morning the tech shows up, has an M-Card is a long time Tivo user and has done over 200 Tivo installs-looks good for me. He only had one problem after activating the card we just got a black screen (with no gray borders), he immediately recognized this as a problem and indicated that sometimes the cards can be a little finicky. He unplugged the Tivo and restarted it, after it restarted he called in to have the card activated again and all was fine after that. Total time was about 25 minutes.

Here are the HD channels that I do not get because of the SDV issue, which he said they might have the new modem dongle in the next couple of months.

714 CNN
721 Discovery
723 Golf/Versus
739 NFL
754 TLC
756 Food
757 HGTV
762 History

Discovery is the only one of those I am really going to miss, but not really as I am keeping my Cox DVR at least until the dongle is available since I get a promotion rate that saves me about $50 a month on the cable and internet and I will lose that rate if I drop the DVR so I think it will actually be cheaper just to keep it.


----------



## bweeston

beboyle said:


> None - I get all the listed HD channels on my Series 3.
> 
> I've heard people say they do that, but I haven't tried it myself.
> 
> No


Please tune to 716 and see if you are getting TBSHD. I always get "channel unavailable". I've talked to Cox about this and they claim it is only activated during special showings or events.


----------



## yroca

bweeston - depends on your geography. I am in AZ and Cox gave us TBS-HD during the MLB playoffs because the Diamondbacks were playing. But the channel went off-air just after the Diamonbacks made their exit. It hasn't disappeared from the TiVo guide, though, so I see the same "Channel Not Available" banner when flipping.


----------



## bweeston

yroca said:


> bweeston - depends on your geography. I am in AZ and Cox gave us TBS-HD during the MLB playoffs because the Diamondbacks were playing. But the channel went off-air just after the Diamonbacks made their exit. It hasn't disappeared from the TiVo guide, though, so I see the same "Channel Not Available" banner when flipping.


Yes, I'm in the Phoenix AZ area. So we are seeing the same thing for channel 716. It's a shame since on Christmas day the guide said they were playing back to back to back showings of "A Christmas Story".


----------



## kb7oeb

TBS-HD was removed shortly after the last Diamondbacks game was on. The channel is not listed if you have a cable box.

I heard that the existing HD channels will be left alone but any new ones will be SDV.


----------



## Rolow

Well rebooting my tivo hd stopped working as of 12/24/07 cox is sending some one out today


----------



## mstrassel

I had a multi-stream card installed yesterday and I only receive some random channels. They kept telling me you have to wait, overnight at one point. I waited and channels still don't show up. I have talked to 3 people that kept resetting the card and some channels would show up but never all and eventually I would go back and channels dissappeared again. I have talked with Tivo and checked the Cablecard FAQs and it is clearly telling me the card is not paired, when I try to explain this to Cox (3 phone techs and the local tech that came out) they basically ignore it or don't understand. Tivo says to have then break the pairing and have them start over but Cox thinks I am speaking Greek and just keep saying Tivo is a known issue with their cards and I just need to wait it out. Does anyone have a contact for a competent tech at Cox? Or what is the magic phrase to ask for re-pairing a CableCard? Everything i read says if it's not paired correctly it will NEVER work right.


----------



## lament

mstrassel said:


> I had a multi-stream card installed yesterday and I only receive some random channels. They kept telling me you have to wait, overnight at one point. I waited and channels still don't show up. I have talked to 3 people that kept resetting the card and some channels would show up but never all and eventually I would go back and channels dissappeared again. I have talked with Tivo and checked the Cablecard FAQs and it is clearly telling me the card is not paired, when I try to explain this to Cox (3 phone techs and the local tech that came out) they basically ignore it or don't understand. Tivo says to have then break the pairing and have them start over but Cox thinks I am speaking Greek and just keep saying Tivo is a known issue with their cards and I just need to wait it out. Does anyone have a contact for a competent tech at Cox? Or what is the magic phrase to ask for re-pairing a CableCard? Everything i read says if it's not paired correctly it will NEVER work right.


Please update your profile with the city you're in.

It might be that the card is defective. Did you re-rerun the setup guide?

also you should read this.


----------



## toochelly

I've been a Tivo customer for many years and felt confident in purchasing the new Tivo HD. Boy was I wrong. Its obvious TiVo doesnt have their act together on this product. From having to reboot constantly and not being able to receive certain HD programs is all I need to bail out of this purchase. Thank you Costco for taking back my unit for full refund.


----------



## mstrassel

Problem resolved -- I rebooted the Tivo one last time and it said authorized this time and worked, when I called the tech back to say it was ok he has requested they reset the card on their end one more time, apparently the combo worked. I will say based on other posts I have read channel 716 still does not come in but that was the only one I have found so far, I think I can live without TBSHD.


----------



## lament

toochelly said:


> I've been a Tivo customer for many years and felt confident in purchasing the new Tivo HD. Boy was I wrong. Its obvious TiVo doesnt have their act together on this product. From having to reboot constantly and not being able to receive certain HD programs is all I need to bail out of this purchase. Thank you Costco for taking back my unit for full refund.


Rebooting constantly isn't a normal operation - there's obviously something wrong.

As for not getting HD programs, if your cable company uses SDV then yes - you won't be able to get some channels. But that's a limitation of cable card technology, not the TiVo. There will be a device to enable those HD channels coming out early next year.


----------



## dtplink

I have had to reboot a number of times since getting the new TiVo HD unit but it always seems to happen when I am leaving the Podcast area, playing streamed music or switching over from playing a game a to the Now Showing screen. When it freezes I get a black background behind the TiVo user interface and no TV shows can be viewed. 

My multistream cablecard seems to be holding up well and I am patiently awaiting the magic "dongle" arrival. CNN and other new HD stations have been added but are not activated (?) yet.


----------



## willp2

Well after several trouble free months with my Tivo HD and a Cox San Diego MCard, it recently started acting up. Started missing most of the channels. After rebooting a bunch of times, called Cox they tried a couple of resets then scheduled a tech to come out (3 days later). After swapping the card and doing a bunch of fiddling they got it working. 

About a week later some channels were missing. I rebooted and it worked again. That happened a few times now. This time the reboot didn&#8217;t help so Cox is sending someone out again on Thursday (that&#8217;s 5 days from now!).

I&#8217;m really liking the Tivo, but this sucks. Is there any kind of fix for this problem? They say my signal is fine, do I need an amp anyway? Is this a Tivo issue and not a Cox issue?

Thanks!


----------



## semore24

I have had to reboot mine a few times. I got mine about 2 weeks ago and have to reboot at least 4 or 5 times. I know that when ever Cox sends a rest or what ever they do I end up having to reboot the TiVo. 
I ran into the PPV issue where I could not get any PPV channels. When I called Cox and I asked them about CableCards They told me that PPV would work. Well I found out last night that it don't work. I called there tech support (PITA) But I really don't feel like that CSR really wanted to work with me on this, The only thing she was telling me is that you can't get PPV with out our cable box. 

But after reading a few posts on here it does not look like it will work until TiVo works on that dongle. 

And I am only paying $1.99 for my Multi Stream card but they charged my $60.00 to have a tech come out and install it. I was just talking to my self when said that......


----------



## ajwees41

semore24 said:


> I have had to reboot mine a few times. I got mine about 2 weeks ago and have to reboot at least 4 or 5 times. I know that when ever Cox sends a rest or what ever they do I end up having to reboot the TiVo.
> I ran into the PPV issue where I could not get any PPV channels. When I called Cox and I asked them about CableCards They told me that PPV would work. Well I found out last night that it don't work. I called there tech support (PITA) But I really don't feel like that CSR really wanted to work with me on this, The only thing she was telling me is that you can't get PPV with out our cable box.
> 
> But after reading a few posts on here it does not look like it will work until TiVo works on that dongle.
> 
> And I am only paying $1.99 for my Multi Stream card but they charged my $60.00 to have a tech come out and install it. I was just talking to my self when said that......


The PPV will not work with the dongle only SDV will.


----------



## BrianAZ

semore24 said:


> I have had to reboot mine a few times. I got mine about 2 weeks ago and have to reboot at least 4 or 5 times. I know that when ever Cox sends a rest or what ever they do I end up having to reboot the TiVo.
> I ran into the PPV issue where I could not get any PPV channels. When I called Cox and I asked them about CableCards They told me that PPV would work. Well I found out last night that it don't work. I called there tech support (PITA) But I really don't feel like that CSR really wanted to work with me on this, The only thing she was telling me is that you can't get PPV with out our cable box.
> 
> But after reading a few posts on here it does not look like it will work until TiVo works on that dongle.
> 
> And I am only paying $1.99 for my Multi Stream card but they charged my $60.00 to have a tech come out and install it. I was just talking to my self when said that......


The Cable co CSRs (most) are worthless when it comes to Tivo/Cablecards. They are only there for the paycheck and get by w/o taking the time to learn them. Unless your PPV is on-demand or SDV or something (mine is just 11 channels which flip between hockey and baseball each year), you should be able to place the order over the phone/internet and Cox should be able to activate it (like HBO or Showtime). I've had numerous calls in and was eventually promised a call back from one of their engineers but that was a couple weeks ago and has yet to materialize. Tivo support is still working on this with the NHL and Cox for me... crossing my fingers that the NHL will tell Cox they don't want to limit who their package is offered to.


----------



## Zonie65

So I read and reread these forums and decided to give Tivo a try, expecting the Cox run-around...and it started today. I'm in Chandler, AZ south of Phoenix and here's my experience so far.
1. Call Tech support to setup truck roll. Requested M-Card. Told I could pick it up in the Digital Store here in town. Me thinking I might even avoid a truck roll if I can swing it.
2. Waited at Digital Store for an hour. Told they don't have M-Cards at store and to call Tech Support to specifically request. Supervisor at store confirmed that there is a code they use on the install order for M-Cards and he often screws it up himself.
3. Call Tech support. Ask for M-Card. He's confused and never heard of an M-Card. Got to talk to Sales to request a specific card.
4. Call Sales. Never heard of an M-Card. Lectures me like I'm the uninformed one about how it's called a CableCard, and it is a one-way communication device, so I need two. Right. I tell her to put it on the install sheet anyway that I want an M-Card because she's going to charge me for two when I don't really need two. Truck Roll is $49.95. $1.99 per month per card.
Install is for Thursday. Bets on whether that goes smoothly? I'll have the install sheet from Tivo and the great posts from this forum to assist the installer. We'll see.


----------



## Rolow

They where out to replace my M-card in Peoria, AZ on Friday. When I asked the tech he said he hadnt seen any s-cards in a few months. My first install and this last truck roll I requested the CSR to put down that I need an M-card both installers showed up with nothing about needing an M-card on the paper work. Lucky for me they both showed up with multiple M-cards. The last guy left me with the impression that they where getting lots of calls about bad M-cards


----------



## Zonie65

Rolow said:


> They where out to replace my M-card in Peoria, AZ on Friday. When I asked the tech he said he hadnt seen any s-cards in a few months. My first install and this last truck roll I requested the CSR to put down that I need an M-card both installers showed up with nothing about needing an M-card on the paper work. Lucky for me they both showed up with multiple M-cards. The last guy left me with the impression that they where getting lots of calls about bad M-cards


Thanks Rolow. From reading these posts I thought that might be the case. But the addage "Never argue with an idiot" kept running through my head as I'm talking with these people. I've got the names and times of the folks I talked to. My guess is that there will be no note on the install sheet as Erin in Sales said she would do. The tech will come with M-cards anyway, and install only one as needed. I'll get charged for two, and spend the next three weeks educating Cox on their products to get my bill correct.


----------



## BrianAZ

When you folks in Az (I'm in Chandler) get your M Cards, can you report back if you have the stutter/out-of-sync issue? I've heard multiple people say that moving from 2-S cards to 1-M has fixed it. It's really starting to irritate me but my first-hand experience with the inept installers has me hesitating making the call to arrange a swap.


----------



## semore24

Rolow said:


> They where out to replace my M-card in Peoria, AZ on Friday. When I asked the tech he said he hadnt seen any s-cards in a few months. My first install and this last truck roll I requested the CSR to put down that I need an M-card both installers showed up with nothing about needing an M-card on the paper work. Lucky for me they both showed up with multiple M-cards. The last guy left me with the impression that they where getting lots of calls about bad M-cards


I am in Las Vegas and have Cox also. I got the same impresion about having bad cards.


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## Buylow

I'm in Phoenix and have both a Tivo HD and a Series 3 HD. The Tivo HD has a single multi-stream card and the Series 3 has two single stream cards. I'm having the problem of channels dropping out on both receivers. Performing a system reboot will bring the channels back. The problem seems to occur every few days. I contacted Tivo and Cox Cable numerous times regarding this problem. Tivo indicates that the problem is not on their end. Of course, Cox says the same thing. Cox has howeve sent a number of their contractors out, none of which seem to know which was is up. The last contractor checked the signal strength on both receivers and added an amplifier to the line coming in. I have 90+ signal strength on both receivers but the problem never went away. I really think that the problem has something to do with a firmware upgrade to the cable cards that must have occurred a month or two ago. I originally had just the Tivo HD with the multi stream-card for a number of months and never had an issue. I'm finally at my wits end after spending so much time trying to keep the family happy with these Tivo receivers and cable cards. I don't even watch TV! I've finally decided that if things aren't worked out within the next few weeks, I'm switching to DISH network.


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## jericho256

I'm in Scottsdale, AZ and recently purchased a TivoHD. Since calling Cox out several days before Christmas, it has been nothing but a nightmare. Cox customer service aside (it is almost always horrible), the first tech they sent out installed several M-Cards and could not get any of them to work correctly. The were paired and supposedly were clearing the CP issues, but still I was unable to receive any HD channels besides the locals and HDtheater. A second and a third service call netted even less channels. Even with following the Tivo checklist for installation, the cox contractors could not get it to work correctly. I know that they are already using SDV in the area, but am unaware of the extent of its usage.

All in all, I was also unable to view clumps of both analog and digital channels as well. The second tech even went as far as to tell me that Cox was going to stop installing CableCard's in the valley in Q1 2008 simply because of the installation time required because they do not train their contractors to do CableCard installs. They even went so far as to call a Supervisor who they said "specializes in CableCard/Tivo installs" to come out and he could not get it to work correctly. Cox knows I am pretty much stuck with them as a service provider, so they don't really try. I need a dvr, so I guess I am forced to use theirs until such time Tivo makes a S4 that can natively do SDV or that long fabled "Cox box with Tivo software" they announced last year comes back from the land of vaporware/lies. Needless to say, the Tivo is going back to Circuit City tomorrow.


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## mtcoronado

It seems like a lot of people are having problems with m-cards and losing channels every few days. I am thinking about getting a HD or Series 3 but these posts are scaring me. I have Cox cable and am just now ready to get a HD TV. I have a couple of questions:

1) Does the same issue arise with using s-cards? (losing channels)
2) If s-cards work better why not stick with them?
3) Does the same issue exist with Settop cable boxes and the IR transmitters - I would think not.
4) Anyone have any experiences with Cox in Santa Barbara, CA?


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## AZrob

dtplink said:


> I have had to reboot a number of times since getting the new TiVo HD unit but it always seems to happen when I am leaving the Podcast area, playing streamed music or switching over from playing a game a to the Now Showing screen. When it freezes I get a black background behind the TiVo user interface and no TV shows can be viewed.
> 
> My multistream cablecard seems to be holding up well and I am patiently awaiting the magic "dongle" arrival. CNN and other new HD stations have been added but are not activated (?) yet.


dtplink, the black menu background is a known issue, but it is not related to the cablecards. It is a quirk that Tivo is aware of and is working on. See the "All Video Vanishes" thread for info on this.

Rob


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## Nightowl33

On Cox here in Phoenix. My multi-card freaked (wouldn't listen to activation requests, and only showed me basic channels below 22 and their HD equivalents), so they rolled a truck to replace it. Unfortunately, he only had single-cards, so we installed two of them, one at a time. Several things:

Card #2 didn't work for a while, because on their end, they'd set it up as 2 separate devices, rather than 2 cards in one device. Also, they needed to close out the work order. Those were the issues on the cable co's end. If this had been it, it would have taken 15 minutes.

More awkward, however, were the Tivo issues. TWICE, while doing "test channels" on the cablecards - the Tivo rebooted spontaneously. (Yep, I was changing channels quickly - "does 46 work? yep. how about 102?..." but that's what Tivo is FOR.) Nothing like a 10 minute lull, twice, during an install. And, following that, once, the cablecards had to "get heat" again from the cable co. The second time, the cards figured it out on their own.

Then, Tivo was determined to redo the guided setup - fine whatever, I told the cable guy to leave and i'd call him if there were issues. After that lengthy process, Tivo was just plain confused. black backgrounds behind all the menus, Live TV didn't work (like, it didn't even try), and I had to restart it. Again. NOW, everything seems fine. But, it somehow feels fragile and I know it will be a while before my wife and I "trust" it. A far cry from the older, SD, ultra-reliable Tivos we have in the bedrooms.

To Cox's credit, the contractor was reasonably knowledgable (though not expert) and was very courteous and easy going. And Cox's issues were far fewer than Tivo's, from what I can tell.

Oh, and i've had the whole "black-screen-need-to-reboot-Tivo-every-few-days" issue that many others have had. I'll be curious to see if this makes it better, worse, or the same.

Let's hope Tivo gets on those software fixes. These kinds of issues, in the hands of "normal" folks (as opposed to die-hard enthusiasts  ) might seriously impact adoption...


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## Zonie65

To start, the installer calls. He's 2 hours early, can he come now. I'm thinking to myself "sure, you're going to need it".

Comes in "Where's the slot on the TV for the cards"? I said it's for a Tivo. Uh-oh, He didn't know that. Never did a Tivo install before. Great, we're going to be good friends after this. I break out the instructions and say "Let's do this together and follow these to the letter". I kept the remote to make sure. He brought 1 Mcard and 3 Scards. Despite denying that Cox had M-cards at least they followed my instructions and put it on his work order.

After putting in M-Card into slot one, it kept switching between S-card and M-card detected. We waited. After about 10 minutes Tivo says "You only have one S-card, you're not going to be able to take advantage of dual tuning. Perform Guided setup now. Uh-oh..this isn't in anything that I read before. I do it anyway and talk about his family and Christmas for the next 20 minutes. After guided setup is done, I go back into CableCard setup and it's not detecting anything. OK, let's try the S-cards.

First one goes in and up comes the config screen. I tell him this is the host ID he needs to call in. Calls supervisor and Card one is tested and complete.

Second card goes in, same process. Card activated and tested.

HD channels are tested, along with Cinemax. No problems. Installer leaves and I'm happy. Yup $1.99 extra for the second S-Card, but it works and I'm leaving well enough alone. I double check the HD and I get every HD channel listed in the Yahoo! channel map for Cox Phoenix including HD-Cinemax. Signal strength is 100% and stable, and Tivo is playing nicely.

This installer is going to always bring S-cards with him from now on as a backup to the M-card, but at least there's one smarter installer out there now.

Yeah!!


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## MarkofT

Had our Cable Card install today here in Vegas. We picked up our TiVoHD from Costco on 12/26 for $249. Called and ordered the Cablecards that Saturday and they had two openings for installs today. The CSR claimed they didn't have any Mcards but I just did what everyone else had done and asked that they write on the work order to bring an MCard if they had one.

I wasn't going to be here, but the wife was. She called me just after the installer arrived because he said we only needed one card and I had previously mentioned using two cards. A while later she called back because the installer was claiming that there were too many splitters between the outlet and the TiVoHD. I have a 2 way splitter with one side going to the cable modem and the other to a 3 way splitter for the TV, Series 1, and previously the cable box, now the TiVoHD. I had him swap the cable modem line with the TiVoHD line and after a bit my wife let me know the installer announced it was done and left.

When I got home, we have all the HD channels including the recently added FoodHD NGCHD and all of the digital channels such as SpeedTV and BBCA.

My wife reports that this was the installers 6th TiVo install and 3rd successful one.


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## Buylow

mtcoronado said:


> It seems like a lot of people are having problems with m-cards and losing channels every few days. I am thinking about getting a HD or Series 3 but these posts are scaring me. I have Cox cable and am just now ready to get a HD TV. I have a couple of questions:
> 
> 1) Does the same issue arise with using s-cards? (losing channels)
> 2) If s-cards work better why not stick with them?
> 3) Does the same issue exist with Settop cable boxes and the IR transmitters - I would think not.
> 4) Anyone have any experiences with Cox in Santa Barbara, CA?


Read two posts above your post. I have the same problem with both single and multi-stream cards. Unless you are a die hard Tivo fan, go with DISH. Otherwise, use the cable company box until a new Tivo unit is released or at least some of the technical problems of the series 3 are worked out. It blows my mind that when I continue to call Tivo about these problems, they are completely unaware of any issues.


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## Shawn95GT

FWIW Buylow,

I'm also on Cox Phoenix.

I have two s-cards in one of my S3s and I had the problems described for the first week or so after the cards were installed and it's been almost perfect since.

I've had to reset the Tivo because I noticed one of the cablecards wasn't working (black screen) maybe two or three times last year.

Is it perfect? No. Have I missed any recordings? No. I suppose I could have though.


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## rm0319

Salina, Ks here and considering getting Tivo so called COx about pricing. It'll be $1.95per card/month and a $45 install. At first was told they didn't have M-cards but after asking about PPV by calling or ordering online and he checked with his supervisor, select areas in Kansas have M-cards and should be able to do PPV.

Then asked what HD channels I should currently be getting on my DVR as I was only getting the local channels, turns out I should get all the HD channels except the premiums but you have to call COX to let them know you have a HDTV for COX to activate the channels which seems to me a waste of time.


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## lament

For all the Cox San Diego people (south county), did you guys get all the new channels yet?

I only recently (2 days ago) got Discovery, TLC and CNN, but have yet to get:

Versus/Golf 753 
Animal Planet 754
History Channel 755
Food Network 767

Anyone else having this issue? I'm in downtown and should have everything by now.


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## mrbrown2195

Is there any way to get a CableCARD re-hit through Cox's automated phone system? I'd prefer not to wait on hold for 20 minutes if I can just punch in a few buttons on the phone and get it to re-send a hit.


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## k00k

So I've been holding off on posting my story until it was resolved, but it's unclear at this point whether that will ever happen. Here's the story thus far...

I'm in RI.
I received my S3 HD TiVo from TivoCommunity.com right before Xmas. The box came in a bit late (DHL is the WORST) and my appointment with Cox was for about 2 hours after my box arrived. Because I couldn't get Cox to come out for over a week after that, I figured I best keep the appointment. I didn't want to because I wanted to be sure to update the software fully. I was able to get the box up to the next to latest software before the tech arrived.

The Cox tech came out for the install and brought 2 S-Cards. This was despite my asking for them to bring plenty, etc. The installer had never done or even seen a TiVo before and told me how much he hates CableCards in general. Great, good for you. So he puts in the cards and it actually goes pretty well. This is until we see that some of my HD channels are pixelated/macroblocking. So he starts replacing cable in the house and basically replaces all of the cable out to the pole. Still, same issue, some HD channels don't work.

I'm going to skip the middle chapters of this saga and summarize by saying, Cox has been out a half dozen times to try to fix the handful of my HD channels that don't work. No success. It's been a comedy of errors, there have been a couple decent techs, none that are TiVo pros by any means. I know much more about the TiVo than they ever will. They've tried about 8 different CableCards, no good. They've checked all nodes in the area for backfeeding and ingress, nothing, all checks out. But I still think it's a signal issue, I really don't think it's the TiVo, although that's what Cox "believes." So to move the process along, I have TiVo overnighting a replacement unit. I want to be sure that I've done everything I can to fix it. I've also ordered a package of attenuators to try playing with the signal levels a bit (after reading what Fios users found). 

So to summarize, most of my channels are ok, although recently my cards became unpaired by the last tech and they haven't paired back up so I'm missing some channels as well as not being able to "Test Channels" from the CC menus. There are about 10 channels (all HD) where the signal jumps up and down from 0 to 100 and everything in between quite a bit. The rest of my channels are fine, locked at 100 and look great (including some HD channels). On the "bad" HD channels, as one would expect, my RS Uncorrected packets are constantly climbing through the roof.

I'm due to receive the new TiVo tomw at which point I am going to have Cox come back out to install 2 new CableCards. Fingers crossed. If this doesn't work, I may just stick to downloading everything in DivX and using my PS3 to stream it. Although I saw the Verizon trucks laying more fiber down the road the other day and they're supposed to have Fios to us soon.

Any thoughts or suggestions?


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## ajwees41

kook you do know that cable and fios are not the same technology don't you? it sounds like a bad tivo.


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## k00k

ajwees41 said:


> kook you do know that cable and fios are not the same technology don't you? it sounds like a bad tivo.


ajwees,
yes, i'm well aware, however signal strength can be a picky beast and at this point, anything's worth a shot. But thanks anyway for such an insightful reply, perhaps Cox has a job opening for you


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## CrispyCritter

k00k said:


> Any thoughts or suggestions?


You certainly have the symptoms of too strong a signal - bouncing between 0 and 100 on the bad channels and everything else at 100. Cable techs in general don't worry at all about too strong a signal when they're measuring. So I think your attenuator package is likely to come in handy! (And there are a number of people who have had success with attenuators on cable systems). Good luck!


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## Bodie

My install went OK in the East Bay, but it did take 4-5 cards to get a good, working set.


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## HVYCHVY

rm0319 said:


> Salina, Ks here and considering getting Tivo so called COx about pricing. It'll be $1.95per card/month and a $45 install. At first was told they didn't have M-cards but after asking about PPV by calling or ordering online and he checked with his supervisor, select areas in Kansas have M-cards and should be able to do PPV.
> 
> Then asked what HD channels I should currently be getting on my DVR as I was only getting the local channels, turns out I should get all the HD channels except the premiums but you have to call COX to let them know you have a HDTV for COX to activate the channels which seems to me a waste of time.


Here in Tulsa, the gal quoted me $30 each for install + $2.00 per card I said "Holy Crap batman, I'll stick to OTA HD"


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## alto1

Santa Barbara-Cox
I have had two M-cards in my Series 3 for months with no issues. The first time my unit restarted after the Cable Card firmware update about 3 weeks ago, it dropped all of the digital channels, and has continued to do so every few days ever since. 
I sell and install home theaters, many of which have Series 3 units. The calls started coming in within hours of my first problem. I have very high-end clients and this sort of behavior in their systems is unacceptable.
It is always the same issue, it has occurred at multiple sites, the cable signal strength has been evaluated at each installation, and always is solved by a way-too-long restart of the Tivo, so it seems obvious that is not an issue with specific Tivos and that the CC firmware update caused the issue. What we do from here is unclear, but that's the deal.


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## Roderigo

alto1 said:


> I have had two M-cards in my Series 3 for months with no issues. The first time my unit restarted after the Cable Card firmware update about 3 weeks ago, it dropped all of the digital channels, and has continued to do so every few days ever since.


What firmware versions were you using before/after the problem?


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## Breadfan

I've got my cable card install scheduled for the afternoon of the 15th. After reading through this thread I'm kind of nervous and I hope I get lucky. When I called Cox to set it up I requested an M-card and the CSR said there was no such thing. When I insisted there was he said he would transfer me to a technician. After holding for a few minutes the tech answers and I explain what I want and he says he needs to transfer me back to customer service to set up the install. I explained that the CSR transferred me to him because I had requested an M-card. He had never heard of such a thing either.
So, when I finally got to the point of setting the appointment I asked him to make a note on the order that I wanted an M-card. I somehow doubt that I'll get one though.


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## wierdo

HVYCHVY said:


> Here in Tulsa, the gal quoted me $30 each for install + $2.00 per card I said "Holy Crap batman, I'll stick to OTA HD"


Yep, they're high, but the install fee is worth it.


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## Breadfan

I had my install with Cox today and everything seems to be working fine. I had it set up so the tech would call me 20 minutes prior and I left work to meet him there. He said he had done TiVo installs before and it's just a matter of making sure everything happens in the right order.
He showed up with two S-cards. I asked about the M-cards and he said they don't have them in this area yet.
The first card paired just fine and was working quite fast. The second card took a while to pair and then when we went to the channel test nothing was showing. So he had to call again and after another hit it started working. I checked my pay channels and the HD channels and they are working fine. After he left I did the guided setup again and when that finished I had to head back to the office. After work I'll play around with it some more. I'm a bit concerned about the initial problems with card #2 but hopefully all will be well.


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## cdmlehigh

Just had 2 single-stream cards installed in my HDTivo. The installer could not get them to work while he was here. He followed the directions on Tivo's installation sheet, but the cards never seemed to lock. It said something like "invalid card state" in the diagnostics page. Ocassionally it seemed to get some kind of lock for a minute, but it was weird- the encrytion would flash between QAM64 and QAM256. Of course the installer had absolutely NO idea what any of these numbers mean. (I don't, but was kinda hoping he would!  ). When we tried going to "Test Channels" it said there were no channels available.

He suggested I call Tivo support, said it was definitely a Tivo problem. I said sure, I figured maybe it could be a Tivo issue, wasn't convinced on "definitely" though. I got through after being on hold for a couple minutes, and told the rep the exact problem we were having. He said, "That sounds like a problem with cable. You'll have to talk to Cox." The Cox installer is sitting right next to me, and the Tivo rep is on speakerphone. Maybe it would be a little easier if the 2 of them would speak directly to each other, but the installer just sat there and didn't say a thing.

Starting to lose hope at this point... The installer has been here for about an hour and is starting to give up. We've tried pretty much everything, including a couple restarts. He sets me up with another install appointment with a supervisor for the next day.

So of course after the installer leaves, I start playing around with it myself. Having similar results, and then I figured I may as well try doing "guided setup", even though it says nothing in directions about needing to do that to get the cablecards to work. (I know I need to GS eventually, but I have no idea how that would affect the cards not working properly). Anway, 45 minutes later, and *IT'S WORKING*.  All my channels are there, HD and everything. When I go to CableCard diagnostics, everything looks "normal" to me.. (or better than it did originally, anyway...)

So the moral of the story is:
*BEFORE GIVING UP, TRY GUIDED SETUP!*


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## SLaskar

COX came out and installed an MCard this past Friday (Chandler AZ) and to my surprise all worked out no problem! Still keeping my fingers crossed


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## Roderigo

cdmlehigh said:


> So the moral of the story is:
> *BEFORE GIVING UP, TRY GUIDED SETUP!*


Other than taking time for things to start working (and configuring the tuners/lineup appropriately for the new cablecards), guided setup doesn't do anything to the cablecards themselves.. If you had just let the box sit there, it would have worked just as well.


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## k00k

I ended up getting a replacement TiVo because it was the only way to move forward. Cox had basically said there was nothing else they could do. I was fully expecting the TiVo not to be the issue. I received the new TiVo, had Cox come out, and BOOM! It actually worked (after a few different CableCards). I'm not convinced it was ONLY the TiVo. I think the cablecards were an issue too. Nevertheless, I'm up and running for almost a week now with all channels looking good. I'm in love with TiVo again; I can't believe I used that Motorola POS for so long!


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## suns fan

Avondale AZ.

Contractor came last Sunday to install cc in myTivo HD. Only had singles (blue ones). Even though I specified a multistream and was on the work order as such. Had him cancel so I wouldn't be charged and sent him on his way. Rescheduled for yesterday and 2 guys came. Put the multi stream in (green one) and had to wait for a firmware upgrade. Info seemed to come up on the screen as the each step required. The biggest problem was the one guy kept playing with the remote, swiching off the messages. One issue of confusion is that the series 3 takes 2 cards and the HD only needs one. And the HD says series 3 on the front. Showed the impatiant one with the remote the support page (installing ccs in series 3 and HD units). Pictures of receivers is helpful in showing which one I have. This wasn't an issue with the other guy because I heard him tell the tech on the phone the slots are in the front. Series 3 are in the back. Anyway, except for the impatiance of the one guy, things went as they should. I have the movie tier and the channels were there but only when I direct input. So after guided setup I checked the support page and had to make sure they were checked on the channel list. They were not but are now. The only HD channel that didn"t come over is TBS 716 as others have posted.


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## mtcoronado

I too live in SB as I posted earlier. I am just now considering the S3 and Cable Cards but am pretty nervous about it from these posts. Keep on posting to keep us informed about what happens.


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## jonginear

Anthem (North Phoenix) 
Found that both of my series 3's that are running S cards stopped picking up channels in the 20's this morning. The screen shows "channel not available". Both of my Series 2's can tune in the channels just fine. I still get channels in the 700's which seems odd. In diagnostics both cards show card state issues. I restarted both boxes and ended up with no change in functionality. Both boxes have been up and running well for over a year with the same S cards installed. I've had to restart each box maybe 3 times in the last year to resolve missing channel issues. Restarts have always solved the problem before. I called Cocks and set up an apointment for a nimrod to come out and tell me both my TiVo's died on the same morning. I'll post a follow up on Monday after the appointment.


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## jshore

I've had two Series 3 Tivo's with single-stream cards for months now, and they both work like a charm. No channel dropouts, black screens or spontaneous reboots at all.

So over the weekend I got a Tivo HD for the guest bedroom. Yesterday Cox (Litchfield Park, AZ) came and installed a Mcard (after trying to install two single-streams, but the first one got hung up on a firmware upgrade that never completed). Got it working, went thru guided setup. All seemed to be fine. But then i went into my channel list to de-select all the channels that i don't need showing up in the guide (sorry, spanish golf channel!). When i clicked "Done" to return to live tv, there was the black screen. No channels. I clicked on the Tivo button, and there was black behind the Tivo menu (instead of the usual animated, colored background). Did a soft reboot, and all worked fine after. 

Anyway, gonna give it a few days of trial and error. But add me to the list of those having issues somewhere between my Tivo HD and the cable card.


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## eochs

Succesful install in NE Phoenix (Cox) today! They were scheduled to come out on Tuesday but didn't have any cable cards available... They came out today and started by running a new cable from the box outside the house to my bedroom (old cable was RG-59, he replaced it with RG-6)... He said he's done plenty of S3's and THD's and it would make a difference... I immediately noticed a much clearer analog picture... He then installed a new M-Card in the Tivo HD, which found it right away... It took about 10-15 minutes to upgrade firmware, and when it was finished the Tivo said "no valid channels found"... Installer then called in to Cox with all the info and they sent a new hit, and immediately my HD channels were up and running! Good experience today, I just hope they get the issues fixed with the channels dropping off...


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## jonginear

Both Series 3 TiVo's were picking up all channels when I returned home yesterday. Can't guess at what caused or resolved the issue.


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## Pafrican

I'm having Cox come out next week to check out my MCard and possibly install a new one as I keep losing all non-local channels (the common issue) and a restart did not fix it this time. 

What is the best process for installing a new card? Do they just take out the old one, put in a new one, and then go through guided setup again? Or instead of guided setup just go to the cablecard diagnostic screens?

Just want to make sure things go smoothly and hopefully I won't have the channel dropping issue in the future.


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## TheNumberSix

I'm in Las Vegas.

I got a Series 3 for the holidays.

My procedure was to set it up on basic (analog cable) hook it up to the net via ethernet and completed initial guided setup. Since I had a few days until my appointment, I made sure I had the latest TiVo software as well. 

The tech came out (they sent me a contractor, not a Cox employee) and he installed my two S-Cards. We were very patient. We re-ran guided set up and everything worked.

Since that date in late December, my Series3 has been working great. I have had no issues and I get all of my HD channels and local channels.

My only compliant is that the Series3 "learning remote" can't learn the last and ONLY button that keeps my stupid TV remote around. Every other thing I use my TV remote for my TiVo remote can do, except for the "Aspect change" button. Drats!


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## lsudrt

mrbrown2195 said:


> Looks like Cox Baton Rouge rolled out SDV. Friend of mine who has a CableCARD TV set called me today and told me that they had added CNNHD, Food Network HD, and HD Theater to the lineup - he could only get the last one on his TV. Called Cox and was told that CableCARD customers can't get CNN or Food Network.
> 
> I can't pick them up on my TiVo either, so I am assuming they've rolled out SDV here.


I have two Tivos, Series 3 HD and New HD DVR - both boxes have s-cablecards - worked great for about 1 year... Noticed about 2 week ago - that I was not getting some of the new HD channels: CNN, Food, HGTV, and DSC... I also have a Cox Digital Box an was getting the new channels on the Cox Box! So I started checking everthing out - on my TIVOS and found nothing wrong - so next step - was log on the Forum to see if any one was having the same problem in Baton Rouge - or if Cox had announced SDV rollout in BR and I missed the announcement.... When I saw this write up from mrbrown - I said their is the problem, SDV is in BR....

To follow up with Cox I wrote the following em to tech support

*"Question:
The new HD channels that rolled out in Dec, are they SDV? Switched Digital Video - a scheme where not all TV channels are broadcast out from the cable headend to the homes that it serves all of the time. This is attractive to your cable company, because you can offer more TV channels than the cable plant has the bandwidth to broadcast.

For example, you cable company may have 10 different channels in your lineup, but only 5 physical channels to send them from the headend to the houses they service. This requires a cable box that can communicate back upstream to the headend and say -I would like to watch ESPN2HD now -and then headend would take that request, assign it to a frequency and then tell the cable box ESPN2HD is available on xxx,xxx kHz.

What does this mean for the Series 3 and Tivo HD with cablecards? - I have one of each...

At the current time, the Series 3 and Tivo HD is not able to communicate upstream to the cable headend, so it cannot send the request for channels that are assigned to SDV. Users of the S3 and THD will not be able to watch or record any of the new HD channels. TiVo is working on a fix, but it is not ready yet."*

The reason for me writing the long info on SDV was: 
I have found in the past when communicating with Cox Tech Support, I had more info and was better versed then the Cox employees.... So I wanted to make sure we were talking about the same apples....

Now the reply from Cox: 
*"Thank you for your inquiry. In order to meet customer demands for more HD programming, we are preparing to launch Switched Digital Video (SDV) in the coming years. Today, we deliver every linear channel to every subscriber, even if no one is actually viewing that channel. SDV effectively creates bandwidth by only sending channels that are actually being watched. In short, channels are not delivered to customers unless they physically tune to those channels.

One-way digital cable ready devices equipped with a CableCARD do not support Switched Digital Video channels. As a result, a separate channel lineup for CableCARD customers was created on Nov. 28th. Going forward, all new standard-def or high-def channels (including the Dec. 5th launches of CNN HD, Discovery HD, Food Network HD & HGTV HD) will not be added to the CableCARD line-up."*

So in wrapping up this long note - Cox is screwing the Tivo Cable Card owners in Baton Rouge - Not gving us the new HD or Standard channels, but yet not installing SDV - So I see no reason we should not be getting the complete lineup until they install SDV.... This write up says SDV in the coming years.... it could 1, 2, or 3 years before it's installed... I am meeting with Cox next week to find out how they are going to adjust my bill for the channels I am not getting.... I am mad, real mad - please give me any suggestion, steps, who to contact and how to debate the problem at the meeting.... Please make sure everyone in BR who has cablecards know about the screwing we are getting...

I can be reached at ([email protected]) - the meeting is next tue at 2:00pm at the Cox offices - please feel free to attend if you care too...

Needless to say, I wrote a email reply voicing my extreme displeasure with how Cox is handleing this problem and I plan to push as hard and write to whomever I need to until Cox resolves the problem...    :down:

PS - The new HD channels started working for two days after I wrote my reply: but they stopped and I starting having trouble with my Series 3 - which has never given me a minutes trouble... Hello it's war....


----------



## MarkofT

Sometime around last Thursday I lost all digital channels except for the broadcast HD channels and TBSHD. Earlier today, I spoke with a CSR who re-paired the card and TiVoHD but nothing changed after a couple of reboots and a guided setup repeat. I called Cox again and after a short chat mentioned that the previous CSR had re-paired but I was not sure if a hit was sent to the cable cards. The new CSR told me that they had been told by a supervisor on the floor not to send hits as there was a known issue between TiVos and the Scientific Atlanta cable cards.

So I've emailed a request for a credit on the digital cable portion of the service since they can't deliver what they promised.


----------



## moyekj

lsudrt said:


> So in wrapping up this long note - Cox is screwing the Tivo Cable Card owners in Baton Rouge - Not gving us the new HD or Standard channels, but yet not installing SDV - So I see no reason we should not be getting the complete lineup until they install SDV....


 This is a Cox corporate decision that seems to be happening at all major Cox markets (mine included). CableCard customers are a tiny minority which won't stop Cox from freeing up bandwidth using SDV to add new HD channels. The best us Tivo CableCard users can do is push for that Dongle solution that is supposed to be coming out Q2 this year - make sure that Cox will have them available for us ASAP. Fighting SDV rollout is a losing proposition IMO - the decision has already been made by Cox at the highest levels and the investment in SDV is already under way.


----------



## MarkofT

moyekj said:


> This is a Cox corporate decision that seems to be happening at all major Cox markets (mine included). CableCard customers are a tiny minority which won't stop Cox from freeing up bandwidth using SDV to add new HD channels. The best us Tivo CableCard users can do is push for that Dongle solution that is supposed to be coming out Q2 this year - make sure that Cox will have them available for us ASAP. Fighting SDV rollout is a losing proposition IMO - the decision has already been made by Cox at the highest levels and the investment in SDV is already under way.


You didn't comprehend what he said.

Cox is adding various HD channels to the Baton Rouge system. They are doing this right now.

Cox is going to be rolling out SDV in the next few years.

The HD channels they are rolling out now will be held off the channel lineups going to Tribune, who supplies TiVo with the data. Those channels will appear on the lineups for use by Cox's cable boxes.

The only reason to withhold the new HD channels from the lineups going to Tribune is to try and force people away from using their own set top boxes and onto the Cox converters.


----------



## moyekj

MarkofT said:


> You didn't comprehend what he said.
> 
> Cox is adding various HD channels to the Baton Rouge system. They are doing this right now.
> 
> Cox is going to be rolling out SDV in the next few years.
> 
> The HD channels they are rolling out now will be held off the channel lineups going to Tribune, who supplies TiVo with the data. Those channels will appear on the lineups for use by Cox's cable boxes.
> 
> The only reason to withhold the new HD channels from the lineups going to Tribune is to try and force people away from using their own set top boxes and onto the Cox converters.


 I did comprehend perfectly what was said - the same thing is happening in my market. The reason Cox is not letting CableCard customers get the new channels slated for SDV at a later date is they don't want to give those customers channels now only to yank them away later - that would make people really mad to give them something and then take it away. The Tribune lineup DOES include the newer channels (not only Tivo uses TMS listings), however the CableCard channel map does not include those channels so CableCard users (including Tivos users) cannot tune them. My Tivos get all guide listings for 8 new HD channels that I cannot tune with the Tivos since those have been slated for SDV deployment down the road (supposedly sometime in 2008 for Orange County). All new digital channels (HD & SD) to be added from now on supposedly will be part of SDV from what I've been told by a local Cox CSR.

I'm not saying I like or agree with Cox's decision to do this - but I understand why they are doing it and do not expect them to reverse the decision based on expected complaints from a tiny CableCard customer group. Instead I'm pinning my hopes and energies on the forthcoming "tuning resolver".


----------



## Trip

I lived in Minneapolis for a year, with Comcast, a Series 3 TiVo, two SCards, and loved life (well...from a TiVo perspective). I moved to San Diego just before Christmas, and am now with Cox, the same TiVo, and two MCards. One day I realized that some of the channels had dropped, so I called Cox, they sent out a couple of hits, all was well. Then we started losing channels again. After a search on here, I now see what the problem is. I'm curious...is this dongle thing that is due out coming from TiVo or from Cox? I originally had heard it is something that TiVo was producing, but some more recent posts make it sound like it is something that we would need to get from Cox. 

Also, I'm just curious - does anyone have the TiVo HD DVR (the non-Series3 version) working with MCards? I was told that the non-Series3 HD TiVos can use MCards so I'm wondering if that actually works without dropping channels.

-Andy


----------



## moyekj

Trip said:


> I'm curious...is this dongle thing that is due out coming from TiVo or from Cox? I originally had heard it is something that TiVo was producing, but some more recent posts make it sound like it is something that we would need to get from Cox.


 Ultimately it's the cable box equipment manufacturers (Motorola and Cisco) that are producing the hardware for these "tuning resolvers" and so of course your local cable headend will be the ones you have to get them from. There has been some rumors/speculation that they will be provided to customers who need them for no monthly charges, but I wouldn't be surprised if there is a "small monthly fee". Of course Tivo is working closely with the manufacturers (initially with Motorola) on these and will have to provide a software update with appropriate changes to interface with the tuning resolver via USB.

I believe Cox San Diego is using SA (now Cisco) boxes right? I haven't heard anything from Cisco related to this tuning resolver. Last I heard Motorola was supposed to have something ready by Q2 of this year. However who knows how long it will take local cable plants to get them and for Tivo to test and release the needed software update - my guess is end of 2008 at best for Motorola customers before we will see anything actually deployed...


----------



## Trip

moyekj said:


> I believe Cox San Diego is using SA (now Cisco) boxes right? I haven't heard anything from Cisco related to this tuning resolver.


Cox San Diego is using SA boxes for digital cable, but not sure about HD boxes. The cards are SA as well.

-Andy


----------



## yroca

MarkofT said:


> Sometime around last Thursday I lost all digital channels except for the broadcast HD channels and TBSHD. Earlier today, I spoke with a CSR who re-paired the card and TiVoHD but nothing changed after a couple of reboots and a guided setup repeat. I called Cox again and after a short chat mentioned that the previous CSR had re-paired but I was not sure if a hit was sent to the cable cards. The new CSR told me that they had been told by a supervisor on the floor not to send hits as there was a known issue between TiVos and the Scientific Atlanta cable cards.
> 
> So I've emailed a request for a credit on the digital cable portion of the service since they can't deliver what they promised.


MarkofT - Check out our thread hear regarding similar problems - specifically post #62 (to see if that might be your issue), and post #82:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=371717&page=3


----------



## Bodie

Just had two installed and all seemed to go fine (completing guided setup now). Inserted one card, paired and tested OK, then repeated for #2. Total time on scene 30 minutes. There were two guys, one doing the work and making the call one apparently training him.


----------



## MarkofT

yroca said:


> MarkofT - Check out our thread hear regarding similar problems - specifically post #62 (to see if that might be your issue), and post #82:
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=371717&page=3


Thanks. That looks like the issue as mine is set to Jan 19. 

And I even read that post. Just too much information to remember around here.


----------



## lsudrt

moyekj said:


> I did comprehend perfectly what was said - the same thing is happening in my market. The reason Cox is not letting CableCard customers get the new channels slated for SDV at a later date is they don't want to give those customers channels now only to yank them away later - that would make people really mad to give them something and then take it away. The Tribune lineup DOES include the newer channels (not only Tivo uses TMS listings), however the CableCard channel map does not include those channels so CableCard users (including Tivos users) cannot tune them. My Tivos get all guide listings for 8 new HD channels that I cannot tune with the Tivos since those have been slated for SDV deployment down the road (supposedly sometime in 2008 for Orange County). All new digital channels (HD & SD) to be added from now on supposedly will be part of SDV from what I've been told by a local Cox CSR.
> 
> I'm not saying I like or agree with Cox's decision to do this - but I understand why they are doing it and do not expect them to reverse the decision based on expected complaints from a tiny CableCard customer group. Instead I'm pinning my hopes and energies on the forthcoming "tuning resolver".


I Expect Cox to play fair - if they are going to pull my channels now - then I expect not to pay full price - and buy the way - since I am a Assistant to the Gov of LA - I am going to fight them - they will not pull this stuff on me - I don't care where the decision was made... They want politices - I will give them an ass full of politices...
You fight for what is right - not what they decide to give U... 
Thanks for reading...


----------



## dtplink

I have a Series 3 with a multi-stream cablecard and have gotten every new HD channel put in recent weeks by COX San Diego. I was under the impression that the SDV issue is separate and affects my ability to get sports subscriptions and PPV, not HD broadcasts. I generally get a message that a new channel was added with a menu option to go and add it to my lineup. No big deal. Am I missing something in this discussion?


----------



## AZrob

I spoke with a Phoenix-COX supervisor yesterday and he had some interesting information regarding SDV, VOD and CC's:

Phoenix-COX is planning to roll out VOD in the middle of this year, and in support of this they will also be replacing all CC's with a new version from SA that will enable 2-way communication. This card is already being tested and it is supposedly more reliable than current ones.

AT THE SAME TIME, they also hope to do a massive SDV cutover, after which ALL channels will require SDV functionality to be accessible, not just new ones.

They are very aware that implementing SDV this way will cut off all Tivo owners unless the "dongle solution" is available by then. 

So they are rather nervous, since the planning for this is dependent on the Tivo solution being available in time. Still, planning is proceeding assuming it will be.

Of course, this is only unofficial, and the report of one COX employee, but he seemed to be credible.

Stay tuned.....(literally)....

Rob from AZ


----------



## moyekj

AZrob said:


> I spoke with a Phoenix-COX supervisor yesterday and he had some interesting information regarding SDV, VOD and CC's:
> 
> Phoenix-COX is planning to roll out VOD in the middle of this year, and in support of this they will also be replacing all CC's with a new version from SA that will enable 2-way communication. This card is already being tested and it is supposedly more reliable than current ones.
> 
> AT THE SAME TIME, they also hope to do a massive SDV cutover, after which ALL channels will require SDV functionality to be accessible, not just new ones.
> 
> They are very aware that implementing SDV this way will cut off all Tivo owners unless the "dongle solution" is available by then.
> 
> So they are rather nervous, since the planning for this is dependent on the Tivo solution being available in time. Still, planning is proceeding assuming it will be.
> 
> Of course, this is only unofficial, and the report of one COX employee, but he seemed to be credible.
> 
> Stay tuned.....(literally)....
> 
> Rob from AZ


 Wow, I would be very worried if this is indeed true (that all digital channels are to be part of SDV). AFAIK there has been no announced "tuning resolver" for SA (Cisco) equipment and even for Motorola just a vague "Q2 2008" which still means no guarantee it will actually be available to end customers around then. Also, this leaves other non-Tivo CableCard customers completely dead as well. Finally, including the local broadcast channels as part of SDV I think violates the basic FCC mandate that they be made available with only basic cable service which may cause them legal troubles - and what's the point of including them in SDV anyway if they are the most watched channels in the 1st place?


----------



## AZrob

In addition to the info above, I was also given another piece of intriguing information that may shed light on why we are suddenly having so many issues with Tivo HD's using M-cards losing their authorization every few days (with me it's been every 2 days lately).

Last month Phoenix-COX started implementing what they call the EON Project, a massive upgrade of the whole network from 750mhz to 1 Ghz. This _may_ be causing issues with what they call the "noise floor" that could be affecting the signal-to-noise ratio. In turn, this could be affecting the CC's.

In my case, I have been having the loss-of-encrypted-channels problem more and more since about the time this rollout began in Scottsdale, along with increasing video noise when viewing purely analog channels. Right now when I look at channels on a TV that is directly connected by cable only, I see lots of "brownian-movement" type of sparkling. This is not a problem when using the Tivo, because there you have the digital conversion. But it has been annoying because there are times I my kids just want to watch TV on the input that bypasses the Tivo.

It's just a theory, but this network upgrade would explain why things are getting worse and worse in various parts of the city - certainly my area.

Rob


----------



## TobyG

moyekj said:


> I did comprehend perfectly what was said - the same thing is happening in my market. The reason Cox is not letting CableCard customers get the new channels slated for SDV at a later date is they don't want to give those customers channels now only to yank them away later - that would make people really mad to give them something and then take it away. [...]


I think you're being a little naive in giving them that much credit. When my cablecard installation was being done, it was like pulling teeth to get two working cablecards. My wife was given the "you need to get a Cox DVR to get all the channels" spiel several times, and I was given the same thing over the phone. When I arrived at the house at lunch, it was again delivered by the original tech and again by the guy who brought more cablecards. It would not make me any more annoyed to get the channels taken away at some unknown future date (which may be moot anyway if the SDV dongle is released by then) than it does to be paying for HD channels which I'm not receiving for no good reason. The reason they're doing it is much more likely to be simple laziness combined with basic capitalism. They get $3-6 per location less with cablecards than with their own equipment, and there is no additional training or effort required.


----------



## TobyG

lsudrt said:


> I Expect Cox to play fair - if they are going to pull my channels now - then I expect not to pay full price - and buy the way - since I am a Assistant to the Gov of LA - I am going to fight them - they will not pull this stuff on me - I don't care where the decision was made... They want politices - I will give them an ass full of politices...
> You fight for what is right - not what they decide to give U...
> Thanks for reading...


You should not be bragging like that with that sort of grammar.


----------



## ajwees41

AZrob said:


> I spoke with a Phoenix-COX supervisor yesterday and he had some interesting information regarding SDV, VOD and CC's:
> 
> Phoenix-COX is planning to roll out VOD in the middle of this year, and in support of this they will also be replacing all CC's with a new version from SA that will enable 2-way communication. This card is already being tested and it is supposedly more reliable than current ones.
> 
> AT THE SAME TIME, they also hope to do a massive SDV cutover, after which ALL channels will require SDV functionality to be accessible, not just new ones.
> 
> They are very aware that implementing SDV this way will cut off all Tivo owners unless the "dongle solution" is available by then.
> 
> So they are rather nervous, since the planning for this is dependent on the Tivo solution being available in time. Still, planning is proceeding assuming it will be.
> 
> Of course, this is only unofficial, and the report of one COX employee, but he seemed to be credible.
> 
> Stay tuned.....(literally)....
> 
> Rob from AZ


read what lsudrt wrote above all cable cards are 2way it's the tivo hardware that isn't.


----------



## saibari

Trip said:


> ...Also, I'm just curious - does anyone have the TiVo HD DVR (the non-Series3 version) working with MCards? I was told that the non-Series3 HD TiVos can use MCards so I'm wondering if that actually works without dropping channels.
> 
> -Andy


I have a non-Series3 TiVo-HD with an M-card. I was using 2 S-cards and having awful a/v synch issues. Switching to the M-card solved this problem, but caused the dropped channels problem. Grrrrrrr!


----------



## dqryche

I'm a Cox customer in Mesa, AZ. Just switched to Cox from DirecTV (cause I wanted to keep TiVo service). Have a new TiVo Series 3 HD. I've been watching the board and reading posts. I decided to call TiVo last night and complain. I said I was getting a blank screen on some channels and having to reboot my TiVo about every other day to get these channels back. TiVo tech new instantly what I was talking about. He asked if I had Scientific Atlanta cable cards. I said yes, two S cards. He said they are aware of this issue and are working with the vendor to resolve. He suggested calling Cox and requesting a different brand of CC, Motorola would be a good choice he said. Im calling Cox on Monday morning.


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## aztivo

dqryche said:


> I'm a Cox customer in Mesa, AZ. Just switched to Cox from DirecTV (cause I wanted to keep TiVo service). Have a new TiVo Series 3 HD. I've been watching the board and reading posts. I decided to call TiVo last night and complain. I said I was getting a blank screen on some channels and having to reboot my TiVo about every other day to get these channels back. TiVo tech new instantly what I was talking about. He asked if I had Scientific Atlanta cable cards. I said yes, two S cards. He said they are aware of this issue and are working with the vendor to resolve. He suggested calling Cox and requesting a different brand of CC, Motorola would be a good choice he said. Im calling Cox on Monday morning.


let us know how that goes as cox in phx doesnt use the moto cards, I would like to know what they say


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## jebbbz

Cox came out Friday to get my TiVoHD going. The tivo had arrived a couple of days before and I had four losses-of-video while I set it up. By the next day the software update had taken place and I was LOV-free until I had two more occurences on Friday, once during and the othet immediately after CC installation. No problems since.

When the installer arrived he asked where the TV was. (Uh-oh) I said the appointment was for a Tivo he said OK and had at it. He first replaced the cable run from the street to the house and while he was out I snuck a peek at the work order. No mention of a Tivo or of the MCard(s) I had requested. When he finished with the new cabling I mentioned the MCard to him -- he said he carries both and knew that the THD needed only one (whew), which he then proceed to install. This was, of course, amazing since there is no such thing as an MCard (CSR#1) and in any event those that exist do not exist in Phoenix (CSR#2).

The installer said he had done four or five CC installs in Tivos and while he wasn't an expert he wasn't afraid of them anymore. He said he had far less trouble with Tivos than with TVs and CCs.

The install wasn't completely painless -- as I said, we had one LOV during the install so we had to wait for a reboot but on the whole it went well. The installer was a young guy and he was pleasant, patient, and professional so after he left I called Cox to tell them so. Hope they do pass it on to his supervisor.

It has only been two days but so far no loss of channels or video. Keep me in your prayers.


----------



## moyekj

dqryche said:


> I'm a Cox customer in Mesa, AZ. Just switched to Cox from DirecTV (cause I wanted to keep TiVo service). Have a new TiVo Series 3 HD. I've been watching the board and reading posts. I decided to call TiVo last night and complain. I said I was getting a blank screen on some channels and having to reboot my TiVo about every other day to get these channels back. TiVo tech new instantly what I was talking about. He asked if I had Scientific Atlanta cable cards. I said yes, two S cards. He said they are aware of this issue and are working with the vendor to resolve. He suggested calling Cox and requesting a different brand of CC, Motorola would be a good choice he said. I'm calling Cox on Monday morning.


 For a SA headend you can't use Motorola CableCards or vice versa so that suggestion won't fly.


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## lsudrt

TobyG said:


> You should not be bragging like that with that sort of grammar.


You are correct - "I was mad" - but that is no excuse - I apologize to all members of this forum and anyone else that I offended with my choice of words...

Really not professional of me at all...
Thanks for your understanding...


----------



## Rolow

Well I'm at the point that rebooting does not bring back my lost channels again. I have a tech scheduled for 1-29-08. 


For those of you that don't remember I had a tech come out on 12-28-07 to replace a single M-Card in my Tivo HD. I was charged by Cox PHX. for the truck roll which I should not have been. I'm still waiting for a 49.95 credit and already need another service call.


----------



## AZrob

Rolow said:


> Well I'm at the point that rebooting does not bring back my lost channels again. I have a tech scheduled for 1-29-08.
> 
> For those of you that don't remember I had a tech come out on 12-28-07 to replace a single M-Card in my Tivo HD. I was charged by Cox PHX. for the truck roll which I should not have been. I'm still waiting for a 49.95 credit and already need another service call.


I got to this same point, where rebooting finally didn't work. Then I asked them to re-pair the card over the phone, and that didn't work. BUT, the day before my tech was due to show up, he made them try to re-pair again and THAT worked. FWIW, the tech had no idea why sometimes the re-pairing works and sometimes it doesn't. But it's been 4 days now and I haven't lost my encrypted channels, whereas up to that point it was almost happening every day.

Go figure. Good luck!

Rob


----------



## saibari

dqryche said:


> I'm a Cox customer in Mesa, AZ. Just switched to Cox from DirecTV (cause I wanted to keep TiVo service). Have a new TiVo Series 3 HD. I've been watching the board and reading posts. I decided to call TiVo last night and complain. I said I was getting a blank screen on some channels and having to reboot my TiVo about every other day to get these channels back. TiVo tech new instantly what I was talking about. He asked if I had Scientific Atlanta cable cards. I said yes, two S cards. He said they are aware of this issue and are working with the vendor to resolve. He suggested calling Cox and requesting a different brand of CC, Motorola would be a good choice he said. Im calling Cox on Monday morning.


Cox tech is in my house as I write. I asked him if they have Motorola cards and he said all they use is Scientific Atlanta and they won't be supporting any other brands. He also said that the dropped channels problem is due to an issue on TiVo's end where the card signal isn't being properly handled. Said there's nothing he can do.  He's still here checking things out...


----------



## saibari

jebbbz said:


> Cox came out Friday to get my TiVoHD going. The tivo had arrived a couple of days before and I had four losses-of-video while I set it up. By the next day the software update had taken place and I was LOV-free until I had two more occurences on Friday, once during and the othet immediately after CC installation. No problems since.
> 
> When the installer arrived he asked where the TV was. (Uh-oh) I said the appointment was for a Tivo he said OK and had at it. He first replaced the cable run from the street to the house and while he was out I snuck a peek at the work order. No mention of a Tivo or of the MCard(s) I had requested. When he finished with the new cabling I mentioned the MCard to him -- he said he carries both and knew that the THD needed only one (whew), which he then proceed to install. This was, of course, amazing since there is no such thing as an MCard (CSR#1) and in any event those that exist do not exist in Phoenix (CSR#2)....


I'm sorry, what do you mean by (CSR#1) and (CSR#2)? I'm in Phoenix and am using an MCard with my TiVo-HD...


----------



## saibari

moyekj said:


> ...The Tribune lineup DOES include the newer channels (not only Tivo uses TMS listings), however the CableCard channel map does not include those channels so CableCard users (including Tivos users) cannot tune them. My Tivos get all guide listings for 8 new HD channels that I cannot tune with the Tivos since those have been slated for SDV deployment down the road (supposedly sometime in 2008 for Orange County). All new digital channels (HD & SD) to be added from now on supposedly will be part of SDV from what I've been told by a local Cox CSR....


Again, Cox tech is here as I write. He said SDV has nothing to do with whether or not you'll receive HD channels--new or old. He said it has to do with video-on-demand and that TiVo is working on a way to get this service through TiVo boxes. He also said that new cable boxes now use cable cards--the very same SA cards used in the TiVo boxes--and they do _not_ have these problems with them like they do with TiVo boxes. Hence, his conclusion that this is a problem on TiVo's end. ...


----------



## jebbbz

saibari said:


> I'm sorry, what do you mean by (CSR#1) and (CSR#2)? I'm in Phoenix and am using an MCard with my TiVo-HD...


Customer Service Representative.

I spoke to several and got different quotes on the prices (they don't post them on the Cox web site) and different answers about the availability of multistream cablecards. They don't make it easy for cablecard users.


----------



## saibari

jebbbz said:


> Customer Service Representative.
> 
> I spoke to several and got different quotes on the prices (they don't post them on the Cox web site) and different answers about the availability of multistream cablecards. They don't make it easy for cablecard users.


Ah...thanks for the clarification! I too got misinformation about the availability of MCards when I first inquired about them...


----------



## saibari

Ok, the Cox tech left and will be back tomorrow after conferring with a dept that deals with these cablecard issues (they were in a meeting while he was here). Apparently I lucked out in the tech I got because he said he's their "go-to guy" regarding cablecard issues. He says there's really nothing Cox can do...that this is an issue on TiVo's end. He says the problem is that for some reason the TiVo box "loses information for authorization to work properly." He further stated that they use the very same cards in Cox boxes with no trouble at all. So it's apparently not a card issue, but a problem in the communication between the card and the TiVo box.

I called TiVo when the Cox tech left and huzzah & hurrah! I got a tech who knew that this is a "known issue"! He got some cablecard info from me from the cablecard diag screen and said he would pass it along to the folks working on the issue. He said there'll likely be a software update to take care of it, but couldn't tell me how long it will be before they figure it out. But he thought it would be a matter of days/weeks and not months. I'll give it another week, but I'm not sure I'll hang in there after that! So, *would anyone having similar issues with their TiVo-HD and cablecard please call TiVo and have them officially report your problem?* If you get a tech who doesn't know about this "known issue" (as I did in my first two calls about this) make sure you insist that they transfer you to someone who does! I figure the more reports they get the quicker we'll get a resolution. Apparently this is an issue only in certain areas of the country. So I guess we in the Phoenix area are just lucky that way?! Maybe the price we pay for all that wonderful sunshine!


----------



## aztivo

while I do wonder if this is a Tivo issue, I also wonder why this just started happening (to me at least) in December? I will also call tivo just to make sure that they have another registered complaint


----------



## TobyG

lsudrt said:


> You are correct - "I was mad" - but that is no excuse - I apologize to all members of this forum and anyone else that I offended with my choice of words...
> 
> Really not professional of me at all...
> Thanks for your understanding...


Not a problem. I received verbatim the same boilerplate you did when I inquired. The main thing not in our favor is that there is no line item on the bills for HD service. It's basically a bundled part of "Digital Gateway" service. Further considering they can say that we're being charged less for CableCard, I think we're out of luck until the tuning resolver is released.


----------



## moyekj

saibari said:


> Again, Cox tech is here as I write. He said SDV has nothing to do with whether or not you'll receive HD channels--new or old. He said it has to do with video-on-demand and that TiVo is working on a way to get this service through TiVo boxes. He also said that new cable boxes now use cable cards--the very same SA cards used in the TiVo boxes--and they do _not_ have these problems with them like they do with TiVo boxes. Hence, his conclusion that this is a problem on TiVo's end. ...


 Of course it's a Tivo issue. Tivo doesn't support the 2 way communications needed for SDV channels (or Video on Demand) which is what the whole SDV issue is about with Tivo. It never had anything to do with CableCards. I suggest you go read up the sticky SDV thread to obtain a better understanding of the SDV issue. The rep was most likely comparing SDV channels to how VOD channels work when trying to explain the issue since both require 2 way communications to function (which the S3 & THD units currently can't do without the so-called forthcoming USB "tuning resolver").


----------



## Sadara

Well, I thought I would stop in this thread and see if there was a solution to the problem that I am having. I turned on the TV today to discover that I have lost all my HD Channels, I was quite unsatisfied with the assistance I was given by the Cox customer service rep. I'm rebooting now, based on what I've read here, but it sounds like it's a good idea I have a Cox tech coming out. I swear I'm going to get fed up with Cox soon and switch to Dish Network or Direct TV.


----------



## Sadara

Well, a reboot of my Tivo brought back my channels, but then later in the day I lost some of my SD channels. So, I called Cox again, they sent a new signal and my channels are now back. I'll keep my eye on it, but if things continue I'll get someone to come out and replace the card(s).


----------



## kaippe

Hi all. 

I have an HD Tivo and an M cable-card. And I just had my second service call in month because I loose the cable signals periodically. I would just reboot the Tivo and all of the channels come back ok. This morning, I lost all channels except the local HD channels and rebooting did not help. So I spoke with Tivo support who checked at a Cable Card screen and the EMMs number was 0, which is the # of authorized channels. So I called Cox, and they sent a tech guy out to check out the problem. He had just received an email indicating Cox with working with Tivo and SA to fix this problem. It also had a sequence of actions to reset the cable card and 'fix' this problem. 

So we tried this sequence and it didn't until I rebooted the Tivo. I have the all of my channels again. It's pretty easy to do. So here are these steps:

1. change the Tivo/tv to a local non HD station.

2. Go to the Tivo menu -> Message and Settings -> Account Information -> Cable Card decoder -> Cable Card Menu.

3. Go to the first menu option
- should get an error accessing a file

4. press the clear button to return to the Cable Menu. 

5. Wait about 2 minutes at the Cable Menu. 
- The email indicated that this causes a reset on the cable card.
- Two messages appear at the top of the Cable Card Menu.

6. Once the second message pops up indicating there is a problem with the card.
- left click back to the main tivo menu and go to the live TV

The channels are suppose to come back at this point, but I had to reboot the Tivo to get the channels back. 

7. reboot Tivo (if the channels do not come back)

So maybe this will help a few of you out there having the same problem. The Cox Tech also told me the cable boxs they use the cable cards, had similar problems. 

Good Luck,
~K


----------



## teddyk

Same problem here. Bought my father in law a TIVO HD for Christmas and He just lost his entire digital tier (Channels 100 and up). Reboot failed to fix the problem.

Cox tried to remotely send a signal to the cablecards to no avail. My father in law made an appointment with Cox and they sent a technician, who inexplicably did nothing with the cabecards. He didn't try to replace them, didn't check tivo diagnostic screen, nothing. He simply checked the cable companies converter box, which runs to the tv through a separate input, and pronounced that it was working and, therefore, the problem is with the TIVO.

I called Cox and asked for a new tech who could try to replace the M Card. Coming tomorrow.

Ugh.

Tivo HD
Cox Fairfax (Virginia)
Scientific Atlanta M-Card


----------



## dqryche

Cox tech showed up today. Turns out they had installed two M-cards in my Series 3 HD when they did the initial setup back in December. Those cards had a manufactured date of 4/17/2007. They replaced them with two more M-cards that have a July manufactured date (he didnt get the exact date before he inserted them). Re-ran guided setup and Im watching TV again. Ill report back in a few days.


----------



## Tico

kaippe said:


> Hi all.
> 
> I have an HD Tivo and an M cable-card. And I just had my second service call in month because I loose the cable signals periodically. I would just reboot the Tivo and all of the channels come back ok. This morning, I lost all channels except the local HD channels and rebooting did not help. So I spoke with Tivo support who checked at a Cable Card screen and the EMMs number was 0, which is the # of authorized channels. So I called Cox, and they sent a tech guy out to check out the problem. He had just received an email indicating Cox with working with Tivo and SA to fix this problem. It also had a sequence of actions to reset the cable card and 'fix' this problem.
> 
> So we tried this sequence and it didn't until I rebooted the Tivo. I have the all of my channels again. It's pretty easy to do. So here are these steps:
> 
> 1. change the Tivo/tv to a local non HD station.
> 
> 2. Go to the Tivo menu -> Message and Settings -> Account Information -> Cable Card decoder -> Cable Card Menu.
> 
> 3. Go to the first menu option
> - should get an error accessing a file
> 
> 4. press the clear button to return to the Cable Menu.
> 
> 5. Wait about 2 minutes at the Cable Menu.
> - The email indicated that this causes a reset on the cable card.
> - Two messages appear at the top of the Cable Card Menu.
> 
> 6. Once the second message pops up indicating there is a problem with the card.
> - left click back to the main tivo menu and go to the live TV
> 
> The channels are suppose to come back at this point, but I had to reboot the Tivo to get the channels back.
> 
> 7. reboot Tivo (if the channels do not come back)
> 
> So maybe this will help a few of you out there having the same problem. The Cox Tech also told me the cable boxs they use the cable cards, had similar problems.
> 
> Good Luck,
> ~K


the rest of the email:

As some of you know, we have been working with SA and TiVo to resolve a defect that causes a gray screen to be displayed on TiVo devices with CableCARD, specifically the TiVo HD DVR (see original description below).

TiVo set up some testing boxes in Las Vegas last week and those boxes did fail with the same symptoms that we've been tracking. Based on experimenting that TiVo completed, a slightly better workaround was developed for the customer once a failure is detected.

1. Tune the box to a non-digital cable channel (i.e. analog cable, or antenna channel).

2. Navigate to one of the CableCARD MMI screens (Messages & Settings > Account & System Information > CableCARD Decoders > CableCARD 1 > CableCARD Menu). This should fail (the best symptom of this problem), and say "Failed to load CableCARD///...".

3. Use CLEAR to exit out of that screen

4. Wait for about two minutes (on the CableCARD Menu screen), and the TiVo box will eventually reset the card after the failure from step 2.

a. You can tell when the box resets the card because this screen will add text above the menu items. First, it will say "Card 1 not in normal operation" then "Your Cable Provider has not supplied any information for this card."

b. They agree that this looks pretty ugly, as they don't clear the menu items while the cards resetting, nor the text after it's reset, but it does indicate that the card's been reset.

5. The card should now be back in normal operation.

TiVo believes that the card isn't happy with the sequence/timing of commands we send to it when the box was previously tuned to a digital cable channel. In the case where the TiVo box is rebooted, the timing is different.

We hope that this is a short term solution. Please continue to tell customers that we are working with both TiVo and SA to identify and resolve the issue as quickly as possible.


----------



## BrianAZ

Tico said:


> the rest of the email:
> 
> As some of you know, we have been working with SA and TiVo to resolve a defect that causes a gray screen to be displayed on TiVo devices with CableCARD, specifically the TiVo HD DVR (see original description below).
> 
> TiVo set up some testing boxes in Las Vegas last week and those boxes did fail with the same symptoms that we've been tracking. Based on experimenting that TiVo completed, a slightly better workaround was developed for the customer once a failure is detected.
> 
> 1. Tune the box to a non-digital cable channel (i.e. analog cable, or antenna channel)
> 
> ...
> 5. The card should now be back in normal operation.
> 
> TiVo believes that the card isn't happy with the sequence/timing of commands we send to it when the box was previously tuned to a digital cable channel. In the case where the TiVo box is rebooted, the timing is different.
> 
> We hope that this is a short term solution. Please continue to tell customers that we are working with both TiVo and SA to identify and resolve the issue as quickly as possible.


I tried both versions of this today after I lost my channels again. Everything happened as described except the channels did not return . I ended up having to take the previous (and time consuming) route of rebooting the box to correct it.


----------



## mriechers

I had a COX (Fairfax, VA) tech out at my house recently. Apparently Cox NoVA, at least Fairfax, has been SDV for a while now and they have been slowly taking away my channels. He said the first SDV channel was NFLHD, then when they added a bunch of new HD channels in early Jan (FOODHD, USAHD, a bunch of others) they were all SDV, and they have been rolling the $2 channel packages onto SDV.

So, moral of the story is, I now consider my S3 mostly useless.

Cox has set me up with a promo for their HD DVR free for 3 months. I'm hoping that within that time TiVo publicly announces their SDV dongle, because otherwise I will be canceling my service. 


 Not happy.


----------



## Roderigo

BrianAZ said:


> I tried both versions of this today after I lost my channels again. Everything happened as described except the channels did not return . I ended up having to take the previous (and time consuming) route of rebooting the box to correct it.


What channel did you tune to in step 1? Are you sure it was an analog channel (if you try to record from that channel, can you set the recording quality)?


----------



## BrianAZ

Roderigo said:


> What channel did you tune to in step 1? Are you sure it was an analog channel (if you try to record from that channel, can you set the recording quality)?


Channel 23.. Discovery. I'll try some other channels next time. Perhaps my locals (2-14)


----------



## MarkofT

I don't think any locals are analog for the most part. Judging from the clarity I get when tuning into their assigned channels, I think the cable card remaps the digital SD broadcast channels into those numbers from the digital tier. I would try CSpan or one of the local origination/public access channels.

I reserve the right to be wrong.

I had a tech out last Sunday and he swapped the cable card and I can now receive all the digitally encrypted channels.


----------



## ajwees41

MarkofT said:


> I don't think any locals are analog for the most part. Judging from the clarity I get when tuning into their assigned channels, I think the cable card remaps the digital SD broadcast channels into those numbers from the digital tier. I would try CSpan or one of the local origination/public access channels.
> 
> I reserve the right to be wrong.
> 
> I had a tech out last Sunday and he swapped the cable card and I can now receive all the digitally encrypted channels.


if they do the same thing that Omaha is dong they could be simulcasting the analog channels on digital and since the cards work with the digital signals, that's most likely why you can't tune any analog channel. They are all digital, except if it's going to a standard tv.


----------



## BrianAZ

This is my channel line up. I guess I'll try 11 or 22. I imagine they're most likely to not have a digital brodcast.


----------



## Roderigo

I'd look for one of the PBS stations, and it may not be in the posted lineup. Most cable companies that have gone to complete digital simulcast still have one analog PBS station. PBS stations usually carry the TV Guide data for TVs that use that system, and they have to keep it analog. On my system, it's somewhere in the 90s (i.e. high range of the analogs, but before the typical digital tier).


----------



## ajwees41

Roderigo said:


> I'd look for one of the PBS stations, and it may not be in the posted lineup. Most cable companies that have gone to complete digital simulcast still have one analog PBS station. PBS stations usually carry the TV Guide data for TVs that use that system, and they have to keep it analog. On my system, it's somewhere in the 90s (i.e. high range of the analogs, but before the typical digital tier).


The thing is if I understand it right is if he has cablecards and his area is doing digital simulcasting as long as the cards are in the tivo will pull an all digital lineup.


----------



## Roderigo

ajwees41 said:


> The thing is if I understand it right is if he has cablecards and his area is doing digital simulcasting as long as the cards are in the tivo will pull an all digital lineup.


I'm saying that most systems that have an all digital lineup still have at least one lone analog channel for cablecard tv's that use TvGuide's onscreen guide. The trick is to find that channel. On my cable system, it's a duplicate of the PBS station somewhere in the 90s. The published lineup doesn't contain that channel, but my set top and tivo can tune to it.


----------



## ajwees41

Roderigo said:


> I'm saying that most systems that have an all digital lineup still have at least one lone analog channel for cablecard tv's that use TvGuide's onscreen guide. The trick is to find that channel. On my cable system, it's a duplicate of the PBS station somewhere in the 90s. The published lineup doesn't contain that channel, but my set top and tivo can tune to it.


What set top are you talking about?


----------



## esb1981

I've got a really weird and frustrating Cox cable card problem, and I'm wondering if anyone has had anything similar. They have, of course, not been able to fix it.

About two weeks ago, I suddenly lost 3 HD channels. I get a gray screen with the "searching for signal." When I go to diagnostics it shows no signal coming in on those channels. Cox has been out 3 times and tested signal on those channels and found it to be strong. But I'm getting nothing. We have tried 6 (yes, 6!) different cable cards, no solution.

On the phone with Tivo, they can't figure it out. Cox can't figure it out. I call customer support and they want to send out a tech, and each tech has had no clue. My theory (and Tivo's theory) is that there is something wrong with the channel mapping on those cards. But the tech and CSR say it's impossible. Anyone had anything like this? It's bizarre, and extremely frustrating.


----------



## dqryche

Replacing the CC's did not fix the issue


----------



## rcobourn

I was having the disappearing channels problem frequently, and rebooting would generally get them right back, until one day last week they wouldn't come back for anything. A call to Cox finally got me to a supervisor who "rebalanced" my account, and the channels came back, and have stayed back for most of a week. I'm not sure what exactly this "balancing" is all about, but it seems to be necessary whenever I add or remove a converter box to/from my account.


----------



## jebbbz

I am no expert but, from what I have read, I believe that rebalancing involves making sure both cablecards have identical channel/service authorizations. Single MCards would not be affected but double SCards or MCards can get out of sync, each showing different servces and channels. Cox has to make them match each other as well as your account's subscribed services. I do not know why this occurs except that it may involve Cox billing that may keep seperate "accounts" for each cablecard rather than each host device. If you add/remove a converter box from your overall account it may not be reflected on both cablecard "accounts."


----------



## jhershauer

This sounds very similar to my experience, except I'm not aware of anybody "rebalancing" anything. We've had the problem with dropped channels for a couple of months now (all channels go black except for 1-22 and local HD). We've gone through 3 cablecards and the same thing would happen with each one...channels go black every couple of days, we reboot and they come back, then eventually a reboot doesn't help. This channel dropping issue has only happened on one of our two Tivo HDs...the other one has never had a problem.

Well, we just finished this cycle with our latest M-card, with the channels not coming back after several reboots last Friday, so I called Cox on Saturday and made an appointment to have a tech come out on Monday morning. On Sunday, our channels all suddenly came back, so I cancelled the tech appt, and the Tivo has been fine ever since (hopefully I'm not jinxing myself right now).

Has anybody else seen a sudden improvement in the last week? I was wondering if Cox got something figured out and took care of the problem.

Thanks,
Jeff



rcobourn said:


> I was having the disappearing channels problem frequently, and rebooting would generally get them right back, until one day last week they wouldn't come back for anything. A call to Cox finally got me to a supervisor who "rebalanced" my account, and the channels came back, and have stayed back for most of a week. I'm not sure what exactly this "balancing" is all about, but it seems to be necessary whenever I add or remove a converter box to/from my account.


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## miadlor

"Balancing" causes all kinds of channels issues.

Cable Cards have to be in the correct order of priority with other cable receivers and have the correct services lined up on each. I'ts just the way there crap system is.


----------



## Big Rick

I lost all the HD channels between 704 and 724, exclusive, Tuesday night. I called Cox Tech support and had them 're-pair' the cards and then restarted my Series 3 HD Tivo. No joy. Still not working this morning.

I had the same problem a few weeks ago when Cox added 15 or 20 HD channels. I got up Monday morning and was missing the same set of channels. (ABC, CBS, and NBC are the important parts.) I scheduled a tech to come out on Saturday. On Thursday the channels came back but I didn't cancel the tech. 

When the CSR got here on Saturday he claimed that the problem was strictly a Tivo problem and that they had seen it so many times that they carry a Cox box with them so that they can simply hook up the Cox box, prove that the channels are working, and dump it back into Tivo's lap.

Survivor is on tonight, Lost is on tonight; now what do we do? Watch them on analog?


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## hddude55

Another Phoenix area Series3 "channel loser" here. I live in Gilbert and had the tech out here last weekend. He said Cox had been boosting signals in the area for the past few weeks and my signal strength was too hot. He knocked it down and so far so good. 

Isn't this fun? Pay $600 to become a guinea pig.


----------



## Pafrican

So a couple of weeks after having a tech come out and install a new cable card (oh, Phoenix market), I'm having the channel dropping issue again. All channels other then 0-22 or whatever and non-local HD are non-existant. I restarted yesterday and it was fine. Got home from work just now, and had to do another restart to get the channels back. 

I figure this will happen a few more days and then a restart won't fix anything and I'll have to set up for a tech to come out again. This is getting ridiculous! I just know the tech will come out and blame it all on Tivo, Tivo will blame it on Cox and SA, and nothing will get resolved. 

Honestly, it's so frustrating. It's getting very close to the point where I just sell the Tivo on Ebay with the lifetime service so I can be done with it. 

I'll be sure to keep updating here when the channels drop out (so you'll see me tomorrow), when I schedule the tech, and results after a new install.


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## rcobourn

Still no problems more than a week after this balancing business. Encouraging. Takes a supervisor of some sort to do it, but if you are having problems, the baseline CSRs seem to understand what it means to "balance my account" and know who to connect you with.


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## Shawn95GT

FWIW, I'm in Phoenix and no troubles. I'm amp'd in the demark box outside.

The only time I've seen mine act up is when I'm surfing live and flipping through the HD channels real fast. If it doesn't come up channel up / channel down and the channel comes in. It's been like this since it was installed over a year ago.

I may be not having problems because for the most part my cablecard-having Tivo is parked on 715 (ABC) and 710 (Fox) unless I'm watching live.

Conflict management is easier when you have a tuner dedicated to each of the big networks .


----------



## Supermurph

hddude55 said:


> Another Phoenix area Series3 "channel loser" here. I live in Gilbert and had the tech out here last weekend. He said Cox had been boosting signals in the area for the past few weeks and my signal strength was too hot. He knocked it down and so far so good.
> 
> Isn't this fun? Pay $600 to become a guinea pig.


I've been talking to Tivo on and off for the past week about these same issues (in Scottsdale, AZ) and they say that this happens with signal spikes. So, I'm going to call Cox to get them to come out and test the signal. I have a signal booster on my line, so it is very plausible. I'll post back after the Cox visit. I too am about at the end of the line. If this doesn't fix it, my Tivo will be competing with others on eBay.


----------



## hddude55

Supermurph said:


> I've been talking to Tivo on and off for the past week about these same issues (in Scottsdale, AZ) and they say that this happens with signal spikes. So, I'm going to call Cox to get them to come out and test the signal. I have a signal booster on my line, so it is very plausible. I'll post back after the Cox visit. I too am about at the end of the line. If this doesn't fix it, my Tivo will be competing with others on eBay.


 It's now been nearly a week and no channel loss. If you live in metro Phoenix have the tech check signal and get it between -10 and +10 if it's too hot like mine was. I know Cox has been boosting signals at the taps for the past few weeks. BTW, the TiVo diagnostic screen won't show the problem. The tech needs to measure the signal at the cable where it attaches to your TiVo.


----------



## BrianAZ

Anyone know what tools the techs use to measure the signal? I'm interested in doing it myself.


----------



## Nomadsmg

Well it's now 2008, over 2 years since the Cox/ Tivo agreement to add Tivo onto the Cox DVR boxs, has anybody heard any thing new about Cox cable and Tivo finally getting their act together? Is it still going to happen? If so When in San Diego?

Recently upgraded to a Plasma, got a Cox HD Digital DVR box for the first time in 4 years and have completely been disappointed. Thinking of sending it back soon if Cox deasn't get this Tivo thing off the ground soon. May upgrade one of my current Tivo's to a Tivo HD. But if I do not bother with getting the cable cards, will Tivo HD be able to record channels such as 8.1 which is the HD version of channel 8?

My Plasma plugged directly into the cable from the wall recieves half a dozen HD channels on the lower sub bands (10.1, 8.1, etc) without going thru the Digital Cable box. Any suggestions?


----------



## ajwees41

Nomadsmg said:


> Well it's now 2008, over 2 years since the Cox/ Tivo agreement to add Tivo onto the Cox DVR boxs, has anybody heard any thing new about Cox cable and Tivo finally getting their act together? Is it still going to happen? If so When in San Diego?
> 
> Recently upgraded to a Plasma, got a Cox HD Digital DVR box for the first time in 4 years and have completely been disappointed. Thinking of sending it back soon if Cox deasn't get this Tivo thing off the ground soon. May upgrade one of my current Tivo's to a Tivo HD. But if I do not bother with getting the cable cards, will Tivo HD be able to record channels such as 8.1 which is the HD version of channel 8?
> 
> My Plasma plugged directly into the cable from the wall recieves half a dozen HD channels on the lower sub bands (10.1, 8.1, etc) without going thru the Digital Cable box. Any suggestions?


The Cox Tivo will not be released until Comcast reaches some amount of subscribers with it. It most likely will be 2009-2010 before Cox customers with Motorola boxes can get it.


----------



## Supermurph

BrianAZ said:


> Anyone know what tools the techs use to measure the signal? I'm interested in doing it myself.


I talked to Cox and the tech said that the signal explanation was very plausible. He checked my signal remotely and said that it was strong, but the issue was not about signal strength, but signal quality. I don't know what he was measuring, but he said that from his remote check, my signal quality was right on the edge of their acceptable spec limits.

A tech is coming to my house tomorrow to test the lines and make fixes as necessary. The person on the phone said that one possible explanation is that if the shielding on the cable is worn, then temperature and other environmental changes can distort the signal. He said the person coming to my house would have tools to test this. I'll try to find out what he does and what tools he uses.

I'm crossing my fingers that this is it!


----------



## Supermurph

Nomadsmg said:


> ... But if I do not bother with getting the cable cards, will Tivo HD be able to record channels such as 8.1 which is the HD version of channel 8?
> 
> My Plasma plugged directly into the cable from the wall recieves half a dozen HD channels on the lower sub bands (10.1, 8.1, etc) without going thru the Digital Cable box. Any suggestions?


As long as you have an HD antenna, you can pick up the local HD channels for free and run them through the Tivo without cable cards, but the Tivo doesn't do anything on it's own to obtain and HD signal. You have to buy an antenna. With that said, you won't get any digital cable channels at all without the cable cards ... only basic analog cable.


----------



## BrianAZ

Supermurph said:


> As long as you have an HD antenna, you can pick up the local HD channels for free and run them through the Tivo without cable cards, but the Tivo doesn't do anything on it's own to obtain and HD signal. You have to buy an antenna. With that said, you won't get any digital cable channels at all without the cable cards ... only basic analog cable.


I was thinking of buying an antenna. I've gone to antennaweb and it seems I may be able to use an in-house antenna. I would prefer to not have to put anything on my roof or in my attic. Anyone try the set-top antennas?


----------



## ElPuerco

Sounds like several others are having the same problem with "disappearing channels" I have. I'm on my 3rd MCard now. For a while, a reboot will bring back the channels, then suddenly nothing will work except changing out the MCard. My last MCard was put in maybe a week ago, and already we're losing channels.

I've reported it to TiVo, and they said they're working on it. They also said there's no way the TiVo should be causing the problem.

And, of course, every time I talk to Cox about the issue, they take the opportunity to tell me how their box doesn't seem to have this problem and that it does "everything" a TiVo does. (Further questioning on that point clears it up pretty quick, but it's still frustrating). I've filed a complaint with the FCC and haven't heard anything either.

I'm thisclose to ditching the CC and going with OTA HD and basic cable, since I can't count on any of the digital cable channels to be there. This really, really sucks.


----------



## Rolow

BrianAZ said:


> I was thinking of buying an antenna. I've gone to antennaweb and it seems I may be able to use an in-house antenna. I would prefer to not have to put anything on my roof or in my attic. Anyone try the set-top antennas?


I'm in the arrowhead area and get great reception with my Terk indoor antenna. I dont have it hooked up right now so i cant tell you what channels it was picking up. The only ones i really cared about where abc nbc cbs and fox and it got them all great.
I just ordered a second tivo HD and with all the cox CC problems I'm having I plane on just using it for OTA

http://www.radioshack.com/product/i...057.2032187.2032189.2032204&parentPage=family



ElPuerco said:


> And, of course, every time I talk to Cox about the issue, they take the opportunity to tell me how their box doesn't seem to have this problem and that it does "everything" a TiVo does. (Further questioning on that point clears it up pretty quick, but it's still frustrating). I've filed a complaint with the FCC and haven't heard anything either.


I was paying $23 a month for there box. I really did not like it and after it missed a few recordings I got a tivo HD


----------



## jebbbz

ElPuerco said:


> Sounds like several others are having the same problem with "disappearing channels" I have. I'm on my 3rd MCard now. For a while, a reboot will bring back the channels, then suddenly nothing will work except changing out the MCard. My last MCard was put in maybe a week ago, and already we're losing channels.
> 
> ...


I notice people referring only to reboots as a solution, one that eventually seems to fail. In message #888 (as well as #885) a different technique was discussed -- have "rebooters" ever tried this?

It involves tuning to a non-digital cable channel then navigating to the cablecard menu, getting an error message, backing up one menu level and waiting (details in the messages). This worked for me and was faster than a reboot. I have had no problems since but it has only been a few days and this may be specific to SA cards and Cox in Phoenix.


----------



## DaddyBC

hddude55 said:


> Another Phoenix area Series3 "channel loser" here. I live in Gilbert and had the tech out here last weekend.


Before you go through the ordeal we did, check this out!
http://www.make-this-work.com/blog/...ng-the-tivo-s3-tiling-and-pixelating-problem/

We also live in the Gilbert area. If you want Kirk's number let me know. He is Great!
BTW, they (Cox) are having tons of probs in the Las Sendas area. This is where he learned to fix it.


----------



## tagpats

ElPuerco said:


> Sounds like several others are having the same problem with "disappearing channels" I have. I'm on my 3rd MCard now. For a while, a reboot will bring back the channels, then suddenly nothing will work except changing out the MCard. My last MCard was put in maybe a week ago, and already we're losing channels.
> 
> I've reported it to TiVo, and they said they're working on it. They also said there's no way the TiVo should be causing the problem.
> 
> And, of course, every time I talk to Cox about the issue, they take the opportunity to tell me how their box doesn't seem to have this problem and that it does "everything" a TiVo does. (Further questioning on that point clears it up pretty quick, but it's still frustrating). I've filed a complaint with the FCC and haven't heard anything either.
> 
> I'm thisclose to ditching the CC and going with OTA HD and basic cable, since I can't count on any of the digital cable channels to be there. This really, really sucks.


I have Cox in Northern Virginia and have the same problem. Tivo initially thought it was a bad CableCard, but I am having the same issue with the new M Card. Reboots also used to work for me until this week. I'm not bothering with a service call unless they can bring me a new manufacturer's M Card. I am awaiting word on that.

Apparently Cox uses different company's equipment in different parts of the country, even different parts of the same state, so it shouldn't be too hard to locate a Motorola M Card and see if it resolves the problem like Tivo says it will.

Tivo says this is a known issue and that appears to be true. If you look at the forums on Tivo's web page you'll find mentions of this in the fall of 2007. Does not really give me hope that a fix is right around the corner.

My channels are back at the moment after Cox did the same "rebalancing" that was detailed in previous posts. Perhaps that is the solution to the problem, but I suspect it was just coincidence that it came back at around that time and is something with the way the card communicates with the Tivo.

For those of you who are in the same boat, you could ask Cox to hook you up with an HD DVR for the time being. I got 3 months free and can probably stretch them if I'm still having issues. While the DVR is a huge step down from a Tivo, it may buy you some time until the M Card issue gets resolved. An added bonus is that with the DVR you can view those switched digital HD channels you have not been able to view with your Tivo. Maybe the M Card fix will come at the same time as the new adapter comes online to let us get those SDV channels and OnDemand with our Tivo units.

Until this loss of channels thing happened, I honestly thought a Tivo that could only give me half my HD channels was better than a Scientific Atlanta HD DVR, but unless they can make sure that my channels don't keep dropping out, I'm going to be forced to go back to DirectTV and their DVR or see if I can get 2 tuner Tivo capability through Verizon FIOS. Last time I looked, you can only get 1 tuner if you use a Tivo unit with FIOS. Seems every option out there has some kind of deficiency.


----------



## Nomadsmg

ajwees41 said:


> The Cox Tivo will not be released until Comcast reaches some amount of subscribers with it. It most likely will be 2009-2010 before Cox customers with Motorola boxes can get it.


Right now I've got a Scientific Atlantic Explorer 3250HD cable box, so you think I'm going have to perhaps switch cable boxs to a Motorola to get the Tivo download when ever it happens? 

Currently running the Cox cable direct to my Samsung HD TV (gets all the channels, including HD ones, 6.1, 8.1, 10.1, etc below channel 99), My 3250HD hdmi cable is running another connection for above 99, my Tivo on another and my DVD player is on yet another.

Any body know if the TivoHD will recognize the channels such as 6.1 and the rest of the channels the throw out a HD signal alongside their normal broadcast channels over the cable? Here in Oceanside, San Diego County, Ca if you plug a HD TV in direct to the cable and search it, it will get a bunch of channels in HD through the cable without using a box or cable card.


----------



## hddude55

DaddyBC said:


> Before you go through the ordeal we did, check this out!
> http://www.make-this-work.com/blog/...ng-the-tivo-s3-tiling-and-pixelating-problem/
> 
> We also live in the Gilbert area. If you want Kirk's number let me know. He is Great!
> BTW, they (Cox) are having tons of probs in the Las Sendas area. This is where he learned to fix it.


 I know it's hard to keep track of this thread what with all of the posts and thread hijackers. But, I posted a couple notes above that bringing my signal back to the -10 to +10 range a week ago seems to have "fixed" my missing channels. (Cox had been boosting signals at the taps in the East Valley and had left a voice mail message several weeks ago informing me of the work. That's when the problem started.). Thanks for the suggestion -- and if this latest "fix" doesn't hold I will be getting replacement cards -- BTW I have two multi-stream cards already. Many of us have been through the cable card shuffle and it isn't a magic solution, though others have also suggested that using two multistream cards might be the right fix for some situations. Obviously it wasn't for me. (Of course one never knows if the cards one is getting are new ones versus cards that have been shuffled around and might be defective.) If you have followed these threads for long you will find many people excitedly post what seems to be the magic solution, only to have other people report it isn't. But fortunately this newsgroup seems to have a wealth of possible solutions, one of which may help.

BTW, I noticed the 6th visit to your house resulted in a tech taking out two cards and leaving you with one multistream for your series3. I'm kind of surprised you didn't know that was a problem as you definitely seem like someone who knows a bit about these machines and had obviously had a lot of bad experience with ignorant techs.

While it's not right that we should have to troubleshoot these many issues, the simple truth is we'd better be prepared to "advise" these cable company techs on a few basics when they show their ignorance. Every time they have come to the house I babysit them as they do their work and I don't think it bothers them since they admit they don't have a lot of experience with these machines. (Imagine if I did the same thing with my electrician, plumber or HVAC repairman -- he'd probably walk off the job!)


----------



## Supermurph

hddude55 said:


> ... I posted a couple notes above that bringing my signal back to the -10 to +10 range a week ago seems to have "fixed" my missing channels. (Cox had been boosting signals at the taps in the East Valley and had left a voice mail message several weeks ago informing me of the work. That's when the problem started.).


I had the Cox guy out today and told him about this. He checked my signal and said it was on the high end, but that it would decrease when the weather warmed up as the cables expanded. So, he didn't decrease the signal. Instead, he just replaced a bunch of connections outside and inside and replaced my cable card. I have a feeling this will end up fixing nothing. It's working great today, but it usually takes a day or two to go out again. So, we'll see.


----------



## tagpats

An update to my earlier post. Cox has informed me that the only manufacturer of M Card they are able to issue is from Scientific Atlanta. Apparently, different parts of the country use different manufacturer's cards, but they can only use the card that is contracted for their area. So even though Cox may use a different companay's card in other parts of Virginia, in Northern Virginia they can only use Scientific Atlanta. Doesn't make sense to me, but I have no reason to doubt what I'm being told.

I'm assuming this problem occurs with the Scientific Atlanta single stream cards as well?

So, if my channels go out again, I either have to live with it until Scientific Atlanta/Tivo figure it out or I need to dump the Tivo.

Has anyone asked Tivo if they would suspend your account until the problem is fixed? I really want the Tivo service, so I'm wondering if they would entertain letting me keep the box, but just suspending the account and not charging me until a fix is made. I'm less than 3 months into the service agreement and then I have to pay monthly for the next 9 months of my 1 year contract. Worst case, I have to eat the $100 plus the cost of the Tivo unit, but hopefully they want to keep their customers happy and will work with me.


----------



## Rolow

Tico said:


> the rest of the email:
> 
> As some of you know, we have been working with SA and TiVo to resolve a defect that causes a gray screen to be displayed on TiVo devices with CableCARD, specifically the TiVo HD DVR (see original description below).
> 
> TiVo set up some testing boxes in Las Vegas last week and those boxes did fail with the same symptoms that we've been tracking. Based on experimenting that TiVo completed, a slightly better workaround was developed for the customer once a failure is detected.
> 
> 1. Tune the box to a non-digital cable channel (i.e. analog cable, or antenna channel).
> 
> 2. Navigate to one of the CableCARD MMI screens (Messages & Settings > Account & System Information > CableCARD Decoders > CableCARD 1 > CableCARD Menu). This should fail (the best symptom of this problem), and say "Failed to load CableCARD///...".
> 
> 3. Use CLEAR to exit out of that screen
> 
> 4. Wait for about two minutes (on the CableCARD Menu screen), and the TiVo box will eventually reset the card after the failure from step 2.
> 
> a. You can tell when the box resets the card because this screen will add text above the menu items. First, it will say "Card 1 not in normal operation" then "Your Cable Provider has not supplied any information for this card."
> 
> b. They agree that this looks pretty ugly, as they don't clear the menu items while the cards resetting, nor the text after it's reset, but it does indicate that the card's been reset.
> 
> 5. The card should now be back in normal operation.
> 
> TiVo believes that the card isn't happy with the sequence/timing of commands we send to it when the box was previously tuned to a digital cable channel. In the case where the TiVo box is rebooted, the timing is different.
> 
> We hope that this is a short term solution. Please continue to tell customers that we are working with both TiVo and SA to identify and resolve the issue as quickly as possible.


So this got my channels back with out a reboot. Lets see how long it lasts.


----------



## JimRI

Just got two TiVo HD boxes with lifeime subscriptions...I was worried about the cable card issues but pulled the trigger anyway because I love my 
rock-solid Series 2 unit. Cable guy shows up this morning with 4 single stream cablecards (I asked for mult-stream, but no luck). To my suprise, the cards were all Motorola (I was expecting SA). We followed the instructions on installation sheet. He calls in to activate the cards. We wait for about 20 minutes and get no picture, just a black screen. After another 15 min., the guy on the other end of the phone asks if I have a Series 3 or a TiVo HD. The cable guys relays that I have 2 TiVo HDs, not Series 3 units. The guy on the other end of the phone then says: "Oh, that's the problem then. These cards aren't compatible with the new TiVo HD boxes. They'll only work with the Series 3 boxes." The cable guy then hangs up the phone and says: "That sucks man. Sorry." And that's the end of my story. So, has anyone else in the RI area experienced this? Will there likely be a fix for this? Or, do these guys even know what they are talking about? I knew this wouldn't go smoothly.


----------



## BrianAZ

JimRI said:


> Just got two TiVo HD boxes with lifeime subscriptions...I was worried about the cable card issues but pulled the trigger anyway because I love my
> rock-solid Series 2 unit. Cable guy shows up this morning with 4 single stream cablecards (I asked for mult-stream, but no luck). To my suprise, the cards were all Motorola (I was expecting SA). We followed the instructions on installation sheet. He calls in to activate the cards. We wait for about 20 minutes and get no picture, just a black screen. After another 15 min., the guy on the other end of the phone asks if I have a Series 3 or a TiVo HD. The cable guys relays that I have 2 TiVo HDs, not Series 3 units. The guy on the other end of the phone then says: "Oh, that's the problem then. These cards aren't compatible with the new TiVo HD boxes. They'll only work with the Series 3 boxes." The cable guy then hangs up the phone and says: "That sucks man. Sorry." And that's the end of my story. So, has anyone else in the RI experienced this? Will there likely be a fix for this? Or, do these guys even know what they are talking about? I knew this wouldn't go smoothly.


Certainly smells funny. I'd call Tivo and ask them... maybe even have them on the line the next time they come out.


----------



## ilh

There are plenty of us running Motorola S cards successfully in TiVo HDs. You got bad information.


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## tagpats

Rolow said:


> So this got my channels back with out a reboot. Lets see how long it lasts.


What channel in your lineup did you tune to to run this fix? Does it only matter what 1 tuner is tuned to or does the 2nd tuner matter?


----------



## Rolow

tagpats said:


> What channel in your lineup did you tune to to run this fix? Does it only matter what 1 tuner is tuned to or does the 2nd tuner matter?


I tuned one tuner to antenna channel 22. I don't remember if i tuned the second tuner to the same channel.


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## tagpats

Thanks


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## DaddyBC

hddude55 said:


> BTW, I noticed the 6th visit to your house resulted in a tech taking out two cards and leaving you with one multistream for your series3. I'm kind of surprised you didn't know that was a problem as you definitely seem like someone who knows a bit about these machines and had obviously had a lot of bad experience with ignorant techs.


That one was funny. I was not home for that visit. The tech came out and did that and left. The wife called him back almost immediately and told him she could no longer record/watch 2 different channels. He immediately returned and put the old ones in. You are right, I shoulda included that info.


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## RosieKitty

Where: Oklahoma City
What: Install two M-cards in new Series 3 
How: Smooth as silk. The tech knew what he was doing and everything is working correctly. I was quoted 45.00 for the truck roll (30 for first card and 15 for second) and 2.95/card per month. Very satisfied with Cox right now (and blown away by HD and the TiVo).


----------



## menos

RosieKitty said:


> Where: Oklahoma City
> What: Install two M-cards in new Series 3
> How: Smooth as silk. The tech knew what he was doing and everything is working correctly. I was quoted 45.00 for the truck roll (30 for first card and 15 for second) and 2.95/card per month. Very satisfied with Cox right now (and blown away by HD and the TiVo).


RosieKitty

Do you have Food Network HD (745), HGTV HD (737) and Travel Channel HD (744). Some of us are having a problem getting those channels.


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## BrianAZ

So I have been experiencing the channel drops for a few weeks now. Like everyone else, a reboot resolved it every time. It was frustrating but did not terribly impact my Tivo-use. Now today a restart will not fix it (as many others have reported). 

I called Tivo and they indicated they were receiving a fair number of calls about it but that the Cable Company (Cox) needed to address it. So I called Cox and the woman I spoke with says that she's been getting a large # of similar calls regarding the cablecards in my area (Chandler, Arizona) and that there is nothing they can do from the office to fix it... they must send a tech to replace the card. 

Fantastic! Now I get to spend another hour of my life with an irritated, ignorant cable-tech while he fumbles through the install. 

Has anyone heard any more concrete information on the supposed co-op investigation of Tivo/Cox/SA? The CSRs I spoke with at both Tivo and Cox had no idea. I've sent an email to Cox exec relations dept. Hopefully I'll get some answers there. Will share anything I learn. My tech visit is scheduled for Friday am.


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## tagpats

Feel free to swap out cards, but if you have the same luck I did, you're likely wasting your time. From what Tivo has told me, this problem is not unique to that card. It is a flaw with all of the SA cards. Either that or they are just blaming SA when it's Tivo's fault. I have no idea.

I have tried 2 M cards that both worked equally well when the channels were coming through and equally poorly when the channels dropped out. I usually lose mine once a week and until lately could get them to come back with a reboot. Mine have been back since Saturday, so I'm due for another drop very soon.

If you happen to achieve long-term results with the new M card, I would be interested. 

Has anyone found that simply using a new card has really fixed their problem?


----------



## BrianAZ

tagpats said:


> Feel free to swap out cards, but if you have the same luck I did, you're likely wasting your time. From what Tivo has told me, this problem is not unique to that card. It is a flaw with all of the SA cards. Either that or they are just blaming SA when it's Tivo's fault. I have no idea.
> 
> I have tried 2 M cards that both worked equally well when the channels were coming through and equally poorly when the channels dropped out. I usually lose mine once a week and until lately could get them to come back with a reboot. Mine have been back since Saturday, so I'm due for another drop very soon.
> 
> If you happen to achieve long-term results with the new M card, I would be interested.
> 
> Has anyone found that simply using a new card has really fixed their problem?


I don't expect it to be a long term fix unfortunately. I'm just looking to get back to losing the channels once a week or so and fixing it with a reboot. I'm hoping to live with that scenario for another month or two before the reboot won't work again and I have to have the next one replaced.

Does anyone have any reason to believe that my 2nd M-card won't last as long as the first before rebooting won't work?


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## tagpats

That's a good point. If that strategy is successful, that might buy enough time for a fix for the card or the Tivo. I really hate to think about getting rid of my Tivo and having to use a Cox DVR. It's like going from Wii to Atari. Well, probably a bigger step down than that.


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## JimRI

I called Cox tech support about my "incompatibility" issue...the woman told me that the installer was incorrect and that the Motorola s-cards should work with the TiVo HD. She suggested that for my next installation appointment, I request a technician who is familiar with the TiVo HD...this gives me hope. I then called TiVo tech support and got the same response. So, I'm going for my second attempt tomorrow. I'm crossing my fingers that this goes well. In the mean time, I've left the two TiVo HD boxes connected to my home network and to the televisions in my house (even though I'm watching analog) and love the MRV. After getting a taste of this, I'll be really bummed if these cablecards do not work.


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## BrianAZ

JimRI said:


> I called Cox tech support about my "incompatibility" issue...the woman told me that the installer was incorrect and that the Motorola s-cards should work with the TiVo HD. She suggested that for my next installation appointment, I request a technician who is familiar with the TiVo HD...this gives me hope. I then called TiVo tech support and got the same response. So, I'm going for my second attempt tomorrow. I'm crossing my fingers that this goes well. In the mean time, I've left the two TiVo HD boxes connected to my home network and to the televisions in my house (even though I'm watching analog) and love the MRV. After getting a taste of this, I'll be really bummed if these cablecards do not work.


You should certainly file a complaint against the first installer. That guy needs to know he was wrong so he doesn't continue to give people the poor service you received.


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## tagpats

You're sitting pretty with Motorola. Tivo indicated that they have not had the same loss of channel issues with Motorola that they are having with SA cards. Get Tivo on the line when your installer shows up if he's clueless.


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## Sharkky9

I just had a Cox technician at my house(Scottsdale, AZ) to solve the CableCard problem with my Tivo. HE informed me that it is a Scientific Atlanta problem, and that Motorola cable card's do not have the same problem. He says that Tivo sent Cox an email informing them that Tivo and SA were working together to find a solution, but there is no ETA for a fix. Hopefully something will happen soon...
I also have to reboot my Tivo every 24 hours.


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## BrianAZ

I wish I was offered a choice of CC manufacturer.


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## Shawn95GT

Am I the only person in the Phoenix area with SA cards not having this disappearing channel problem regularly? 

I think I've seen this problem all of 2-3 times since I installed my S3 and I ordered the S3 the day it went up for sale.


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## jebbbz

I've had my Tivo HD a bit over two weeks and had the problem three times over as many days about a week ago. Twice I had to reboot and once I got away with the CC menu fix. Before that my problem was the loss of all video the day I set the box up and again the day I had my CCs installed. The latter problem seems to correlate with how much time you spend deep in the Tivo menus. I have no idea how the disappearing channel problem comes and goes but I'll just keep my fingers crossed it doesn't get as bad for me as it has with some people here.


----------



## jhershauer

We have two Tivo HDs, and one of them has never had the dropped channels problem. That one has had the same m-card in it since we got it hooked up.

The other one started having the problem shortly after the Fall Update. At the time it had two s-cards in it and one of the cards stopped receiving any channels. The tech replaced both cards with, supposedly, two more s-cards. However, a couple of weeks later, after rebooting the Tivo, one of the cards did a firmware update and "turned into" an M-card.  It turns out both of the "s-cards" the guy put in were actually m-cards, but the Tivo recognized them as s-cards before the firmware update.

Well, once that card in slot 1 updated itself to an M-card, we started getting the dropped channels issue (every couple of days, and all of the channels except 1-22 and local HD would go black). At some point, a reboot would no longer fix the problem. We went through this process with another couple of cablecards as well.

When the last one went south a couple of weeks ago, I was slow to call Cox. The channels were out for two days before I called on Saturday and scheduled a tech for Monday. On Saturday, I also tried the work-around in this thread where you tune to a local channel and go into the diagnostics menu. That didn't seem to work. On Sunday, we tried tuning into a non-local channel and discovered all of the channels were back. It's now been over a week and a half since they came back and we haven't had any problems.

So, there you go. If you made it through my long-winded story, you can see that the fix is just to let it sit there for a few days and it will magically get better. 

Jeff



Shawn95GT said:


> Am I the only person in the Phoenix area with SA cards not having this disappearing channel problem regularly?
> 
> I think I've seen this problem all of 2-3 times since I installed my S3 and I ordered the S3 the day it went up for sale.


----------



## BrianAZ

Shawn95GT said:


> Am I the only person in the Phoenix area with SA cards not having this disappearing channel problem regularly?
> 
> I think I've seen this problem all of 2-3 times since I installed my S3 and I ordered the S3 the day it went up for sale.


The issue is impacting primarily people with TivoHDs and SA M-cards it seems.


----------



## Testpattern

We also have been experiencing the black screen on the three new HD channels on our S3 system. Never an issue with the previous HD or SD channels. These new channels are basically down 100% of the time now although I "think" they were coming through initially. Rebooting does nothing nor does re-initialization by Cox.

Several calls to Cox finally revealed that they recognize the problem. That it is the result of the cablecard failing to process these newer frequencies. The cause remains unknown. There is no commitment for a fix but... they have hopes of finding something as a result of their work with the Cablecard company.

We have SA cards. Cox did not say if this was related only to the SA cards or possibly the Motorola also. When we got our SA cards last summer there was no possibility of getting the Motorola cards in OKC. I have no idea if both are now utilized in the OKC area but reading from above it appears the Motorola cards are not an answer.

I guess we're in a wait and see holding pattern.


----------



## craigo

Shawn95GT said:


> Am I the only person in the Phoenix area with SA cards not having this disappearing channel problem regularly?


If you're talking about SA M-cards, then you just may be the only person in Phoenix not having the problem. My S3 had the S-cards and worked great for about a year. Around Nov-Dec/07, I started to get the Audio/Video FF issue every couple of seconds on the SD channels. Had Cox out a number of times and finally had them switch to the M-Cards. Now, like everybody else, I'm getting channels dropped every few days.


----------



## wickerbill

Testpattern said:


> We also have been experiencing the black screen on the three new HD channels on our S3 system. Never an issue with the previous HD or SD channels. These new channels are basically down 100% of the time now although I "think" they were coming through initially. Rebooting does nothing nor does re-initialization by Cox.
> 
> Several calls to Cox finally revealed that they recognize the problem. That it is the result of the cablecard failing to process these newer frequencies. The cause remains unknown. There is no commitment for a fix but... they have hopes of finding something as a result of their work with the Cablecard company.
> 
> We have SA cards. Cox did not say if this was related only to the SA cards or possibly the Motorola also. When we got our SA cards last summer there was no possibility of getting the Motorola cards in OKC. I have no idea if both are now utilized in the OKC area but reading from above it appears the Motorola cards are not an answer.
> 
> I guess we're in a wait and see holding pattern.


Cable systems are usually either Motorola or SA. OKC is SA and Tulsa is Motorola. I have had no problems with my Motorola cards and my friend in OKC has had problems almost weekly with his SA cards. SA cards appear to be total crap.


----------



## Shawn95GT

craigo said:


> If you're talking about SA M-cards, then you just may be the only person in Phoenix not having the problem. My S3 had the S-cards and worked great for about a year. Around Nov-Dec/07, I started to get the Audio/Video FF issue every couple of seconds on the SD channels. Had Cox out a number of times and finally had them switch to the M-Cards. Now, like everybody else, I'm getting channels dropped every few days.


I'm pretty sure they are both s-cards, but at one time the S3 reported one as an s-card and one as an m-card. today they both say s-card and it's work'n like a champ (knock on entertainment center).

That explains it...


----------



## craigo

Shawn95GT said:


> I'm pretty sure they are both s-cards, but at one time the S3 reported one as an s-card and one as an m-card. today they both say s-card and it's work'n like a champ (knock on entertainment center).
> 
> That explains it...


You know, that's funny you say that. When they came out a few weeks ago, they assured me that they were installing M-Cards. After they left, my problems with the audio/video (common problem on the S-card) was gone. Then, the channels started dropping a few days later (common problem on the M-card), so I assumed the M-cards were, in fact, installed. Now that I look at the diagnostic screen, it says I have S-cards.

Given the problems I lost and the new problems I have, I do think I have M-cards. Could just be a hiccup on the S3 report.


----------



## JimRI

The Cox tech showed up to my house with 3 Motorola S-cards. He told me that the 4th card was on its way with his supervisor. The supervisor showed up 5 minutes later with the 4th card. Both techs had experience with TiVos and laughed when I told them about my experience earlier in the week. All cards went in and activated smoothly. It took about 25 min. to get both TiVo HDs up and running. I'm now repeating the Guided Setup as I type this. I know that I'm not imagining this, but the picture quality that I'm getting from both of these TiVos is much better than the Cox set-top boxes I had before (1 sd box and 1 hd dvr). The picture is definitely sharper. :up:


----------



## esb1981

Testpattern said:


> We also have been experiencing the black screen on the three new HD channels on our S3 system. Never an issue with the previous HD or SD channels. These new channels are basically down 100% of the time now although I "think" they were coming through initially. Rebooting does nothing nor does re-initialization by Cox.
> 
> Several calls to Cox finally revealed that they recognize the problem. That it is the result of the cablecard failing to process these newer frequencies. The cause remains unknown. There is no commitment for a fix but... they have hopes of finding something as a result of their work with the Cablecard company.
> 
> We have SA cards. Cox did not say if this was related only to the SA cards or possibly the Motorola also. When we got our SA cards last summer there was no possibility of getting the Motorola cards in OKC. I have no idea if both are now utilized in the OKC area but reading from above it appears the Motorola cards are not an answer.
> 
> I guess we're in a wait and see holding pattern.


Testpattern, I have had the EXACT same problem - gray screen on 3 HD channels, Tivo says "no incoming signal." I'm with Cox in Hartford, CT, but I have Motorola cards. Cox has been out a ton of times and they haven't been able to figure it out. My theory all along has been that the cable cards are mapping these 3 channels to the wrong frequencies -- for example, the Tivo diagnostics screen shows a frequency of 615 MHz, but I know that the channel is supposed to be on 849 MHz. Cox hasn't been able to figure it out.

Any ideas on what I can say to Cox that will help them understand what the problem is? Definitely keep us posted on how this gets resolved for you.


----------



## OrangeKid

esb1981 said:


> Testpattern, I have had the EXACT same problem - gray screen on 3 HD channels, Tivo says "no incoming signal."


Once a month or so when I turn on my Samsung DLP I will get a black screen with a "no signal" message. If I reboot my S3 Tivo by unplugging all is well. Until I reboot the Tivo I cannot get any sort of video signal out of it. The sound, which is routed to my receiver via optical SPDIF, is fine. Is this behavior a manifestation of the channel loss problem or do I have a different problem? I have two SA cable cards here in Vegas. The Tivo S3 is directly connected to my Samsung HLP 5063 DLP via a HDMI to DVI cable.


----------



## tagpats

Well, so much for "rebalancing." That didn't end up doing anything to my Cox channels as they went out again. This time I was able to reboot my Tivo and they came back the first time.

Guess I'll keep hanging in there until there is some resolution to the problem or I simply can't get my channels to return. I'm not sure how long I'll be able to keep this Cox DVR for free as backup, but they picked Scientific Atlanta, not me, so hopefully until I'm sure the problem is fixed.


----------



## RosieKitty

Testpattern said:


> We also have been experiencing the black screen on the three new HD channels on our S3 system. Never an issue with the previous HD or SD channels. These new channels are basically down 100% of the time now although I "think" they were coming through initially. Rebooting does nothing nor does re-initialization by Cox.
> 
> Several calls to Cox finally revealed that they recognize the problem. That it is the result of the cablecard failing to process these newer frequencies. The cause remains unknown. There is no commitment for a fix but... they have hopes of finding something as a result of their work with the Cablecard company.
> 
> We have SA cards. Cox did not say if this was related only to the SA cards or possibly the Motorola also. When we got our SA cards last summer there was no possibility of getting the Motorola cards in OKC. I have no idea if both are now utilized in the OKC area but reading from above it appears the Motorola cards are not an answer.
> 
> I guess we're in a wait and see holding pattern.


Well, the next day after my "smooth" install, we lost FOOD HD and Travel HD. Unfortunately, the whole reason I got cable in the first place was for the Food Channel. Very sad.

So wait until you hear what Cox told us - that yesterday Food and Travel ordered them to make their HD channels NOT available to CableCards (i.e. us). Ha ha ha ha. I just love talking to cable company CSRs...


----------



## wierdo

RosieKitty said:


> So wait until you hear what Cox told us - that yesterday Food and Travel ordered them to make their HD channels NOT available to CableCards (i.e. us). Ha ha ha ha. I just love talking to cable company CSRs...


So close..

Cox seems to have ordered the local franchises to not give any new channel adds to the CableCARD users, even in areas where SDV is not active or imminent. It's a total crock.

I'm toying with the idea of switching back to DirecTV, even if it means being unable to use my TiVos, because I'm so annoyed at this idiocy. I could understand it if SDV was active or due to be turned on in the next few months.


----------



## Roderigo

jhershauer said:


> The other one started having the problem shortly after the Fall Update. At the time it had two s-cards in it and one of the cards stopped receiving any channels. The tech replaced both cards with, supposedly, two more s-cards. However, a couple of weeks later, after rebooting the Tivo, one of the cards did a firmware update and "turned into" an M-card.  It turns out both of the "s-cards" the guy put in were actually m-cards, but the Tivo recognized them as s-cards before the firmware update.
> 
> Well, once that card in slot 1 updated itself to an M-card, we started getting the dropped channels issue (every couple of days, and all of the channels except 1-22 and local HD would go black). At some point, a reboot would no longer fix the problem. We went through this process with another couple of cablecards as well.


There's no way an scard can turn into an mcard. They're different pieces of hardware. However, it is possible that cox downloaded new firmware to the cablecard which introduced this problem.

Also, from what I've read here, I have to guess that if rebooting the tivo box doesn't restore things, then there's a second problem happening with the cards.



jhershauer said:


> I also tried the work-around in this thread where you tune to a local channel and go into the diagnostics menu. That didn't seem to work.


From what I've read, this isn't the workaround. The workaround is to go to an *analog* channel. If your system has mostly digital channels, it may be hard to find one. However, most systems still have one analog channel in the cablecard channel map (even if it doesn't exist in their published lineup). I'd check the channel list on the tivo, and see if there's a PBS station somewhere in the 90s, and if so, check it on. That's likely analog. They leave this station in the lineup 'cuz that's where TV's get their TvGuide data. The diagnostics screen is one sure way to tell if a channel is analog or digital.


----------



## tagpats

I went into the Diagnostics Menu to see how my channels were being broadcast and it appears that every channel below 100 is in analog, not digital. Everything above 100, including HD channels show up in the Diagnostics menu as Modulation: QAM 256, but all the channels below show as Modulation: Analog.

I just assumed that if the CableCard is replacing the cable box, my signals would be converted to a digital format, but maybe why they look grainy is because they are coming through in analog.

Does Cox need to do something to change the way this card is working or am I stuck with an analog signal with this M Card?

[From what I've read, this isn't the workaround. The workaround is to go to an *analog* channel. If your system has mostly digital channels, it may be hard to find one. However, most systems still have one analog channel in the cablecard channel map (even if it doesn't exist in their published lineup). I'd check the channel list on the tivo, and see if there's a PBS station somewhere in the 90s, and if so, check it on. That's likely analog. They leave this station in the lineup 'cuz that's where TV's get their TvGuide data. The diagnostics screen is one sure way to tell if a channel is analog or digital.[/QUOTE]


----------



## tagpats

The pattern of my loss of channels periodically can be explained now by the Diagnostis Menu. The only channels I do not lose when the card stops sending the authorization are the ones now being shown as analog. All of the digital channels in my line-up all disappear. 

So, if I somehow I get the cards configured properly to give me all my channels in a digital format, then when they do drop out again, instead of having the analog available to me, I will have none.


----------



## nws2002

I just called Cox in Tulsa to come out and swap out the cable box for a CableCARD. Had zero problems, and as soon as I mentioned it was for a TivoHD the rep said they would make sure to send out an M-card. She then put me on hold to get a supervisor to make sure everything was setup correctly since they don't setup CableCARD installs very often. 

Overall not a bad experience, I still don't understand why I can't come down to the Cox store and pickup a CableCARD just like I would a new HSI modem or cable box, but I'll live with the $30 install fee. I also insisted that they send out a Cox employee and not a contractor. I've had lots of problems with contractors in the past, to the point where Cox rewired my entire home (both cable and phone) for free because the contractors messed up so bad.


----------



## BrianAZ

BrianAZ said:


> So I have been experiencing the channel drops for a few weeks now. Like everyone else, a reboot resolved it every time. It was frustrating but did not terribly impact my Tivo-use. Now today a restart will not fix it (as many others have reported).
> 
> I called Tivo and they indicated they were receiving a fair number of calls about it but that the Cable Company (Cox) needed to address it. So I called Cox and the woman I spoke with says that she's been getting a large # of similar calls regarding the cablecards in my area (Chandler, Arizona) and that there is nothing they can do from the office to fix it... they must send a tech to replace the card.
> 
> Fantastic! Now I get to spend another hour of my life with an irritated, ignorant cable-tech while he fumbles through the install.
> 
> Has anyone heard any more concrete information on the supposed co-op investigation of Tivo/Cox/SA? The CSRs I spoke with at both Tivo and Cox had no idea. I've sent an email to Cox exec relations dept. Hopefully I'll get some answers there. Will share anything I learn. My tech visit is scheduled for Friday am.


My M-card swap went well. The tech said he's been doing more and more Tivo calls recently and actually wrote down some notes when we were discussing the two problems I had (stuttering with 2xScards and channel drop outs with 1xMcard). Like last time, the Tivo said the various SA cablecard screens failed to load for about the first 10-15 min. Then finally the screens loaded, giving us the hostid to call in. Maybe 10 min later and I was up and running.

I just hope I'm not replacing this new card in a month.


----------



## wierdo

nws2002 said:


> I just called Cox in Tulsa to come out and swap out the cable box for a CableCARD. Had zero problems, and as soon as I mentioned it was for a TivoHD the rep said they would make sure to send out an M-card. She then put me on hold to get a supervisor to make sure everything was setup correctly since they don't setup CableCARD installs very often.
> 
> Overall not a bad experience, I still don't understand why I can't come down to the Cox store and pickup a CableCARD just like I would a new HSI modem or cable box, but I'll live with the $30 install fee. I also insisted that they send out a Cox employee and not a contractor. I've had lots of problems with contractors in the past, to the point where Cox rewired my entire home (both cable and phone) for free because the contractors messed up so bad.


Don't expect any of the HD channels they added a few days ago. 

Other than that, Cox in Tulsa is pretty darn good, IMO.

Of course, that's like the old saw "other than that, how did you like the play Mrs. Lincoln?"

If you do end up getting them, please let me know so I can beat them about the head.


----------



## tagpats

Aren't the new channels being added by Cox in switched digital which is not compabitible with the current CableCards that are offered? They require two way communication like OnDemand or Pay-Per-View.

There is supposed to be an adapter released this year that will attach to the USB port on your Tivo and will enable you to receive switched digital channels which I understand will likely be the way all future HD channels are rolled out. 

I am not able to get the most recently released HD channels in my area, including the NFL network because they are in switched digital.


----------



## wierdo

tagpats said:


> Aren't the new channels being added by Cox in switched digital which is not compabitible with the current CableCards that are offered? They require two way communication like OnDemand or Pay-Per-View.
> 
> There is supposed to be an adapter released this year that will attach to the USB port on your Tivo and will enable you to receive switched digital channels which I understand will likely be the way all future HD channels are rolled out.
> 
> I am not able to get the most recently released HD channels in my area, including the NFL network because they are in switched digital.


Cox hasn't deployed SDV in Oklahoma. It's unlikely it will be deployed before the end of the year, from the look of it. It's not really a pressing need here, as both OKC and Tulsa are 850MHz plants. (at least)


----------



## Supermurph

Supermurph said:


> I had the Cox guy out today and told him about this. He checked my signal and said it was on the high end, but that it would decrease when the weather warmed up as the cables expanded. So, he didn't decrease the signal. Instead, he just replaced a bunch of connections outside and inside and replaced my cable card. I have a feeling this will end up fixing nothing. It's working great today, but it usually takes a day or two to go out again. So, we'll see.


It took a week, but my channels went out again with the new cable card. This isn't a surprise considering other posts, but I was hopeful. I was previously losing channels daily, so there has been at least a temp improvement. I was also having signal issues on another TV with a Cox digital box on it and that issues appears fixed. So, I'm curious to see if the length of time between my Tivo outages stays at a week. If it does, it seems that signal may indeed be part of the issue (that's not scientific, but what the heck).


----------



## Dan Theman

I am having the same issues with losing all of my channels.
Happens about once a week, when it is happening the cablecard diagnostics screen gives the error, and it is fixed by a reboot.

It is a Tivo HD running 9.2a with a single SA M-Card from Cox in San Diego.

I also am not getting any of the 10+ new HD channels they added, even though I was initially receiving the new Discovery HD (724) for a few days when they first rolled it out, then they took it away from me. 

I now have to do preemptive reboots every few days.


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## moyekj

wierdo said:


> Cox hasn't deployed SDV in Oklahoma. It's unlikely it will be deployed before the end of the year, from the look of it. It's not really a pressing need here, as both OKC and Tulsa are 850MHz plants. (at least)


 I wouldn't use that assumption to completely rule out possibility of SDV in your area. Cox Orange County, CA recently upgraded all headend nodes from 750MHz to 1GHz but still have plans for deploying SDV sometime this year (and are already blocking all new HD channel additions from CableCard customers).


----------



## Breadfan

wierdo said:


> So close..
> 
> Cox seems to have ordered the local franchises to not give any new channel adds to the CableCARD users, even in areas where SDV is not active or imminent. It's a total crock.
> 
> I'm toying with the idea of switching back to DirecTV, even if it means being unable to use my TiVos, because I'm so annoyed at this idiocy. I could understand it if SDV was active or due to be turned on in the next few months.


Where did you get this information from? I wouldn't put it past them but this just seems ludicrous. 
Where in Arkansas are you? I'm in Fort Smith.


----------



## menos

Breadfan said:


> Where did you get this information from? I wouldn't put it past them but this just seems ludicrous.
> Where in Arkansas are you? I'm in Fort Smith.


Directly from Cox cable-card reps. At least here in Oklahoma that was their story. They say they have a memo from corporate stating as much.


----------



## Breadfan

menos said:


> Directly from Cox cable-card reps. At least here in Oklahoma that was their story. They say they have a memo from corporate stating as much.


So, what, this is their way of "punishing" those of us who don't want to pay for their DVR? Good grief! I'm already giving them nearly $150 a month! Does that extra $10 a month really matter that much to them?


----------



## moyekj

Breadfan said:


> Where did you get this information from? I wouldn't put it past them but this just seems ludicrous.
> Where in Arkansas are you? I'm in Fort Smith.


 The only reasoning for this that I have received from my local Cox CSRs is that "they don't want to give CableCard customers new channels now only to yank them away at a later date when SDV is actually deployed."
Perhaps their assumption is that most CableCard customers are clueless as to what channels they should be getting and wouldn't notice if they didn't receive some new channels. However if you gave them channels now and then took them away later they would notice and that would generate a lot of phone calls. Of course for anyone that knows exactly what's going on this isn't much of an excuse.


----------



## jhershauer

Roderigo said:


> There's no way an scard can turn into an mcard. They're different pieces of hardware. However, it is possible that cox downloaded new firmware to the cablecard which introduced this problem.


That's why I put "s-cards" in quotes in my post. Like I said, when he pulled the cards out, they were actually m-cards. When installed originally, the firmware appears to have been such that they appeared as s-cards, but after the automatic firmware update, the card in slot one was updated to m-card status. That's when the trouble started.



Roderigo said:


> From what I've read, this isn't the workaround. The workaround is to go to an *analog* channel. If your system has mostly digital channels, it may be hard to find one. However, most systems still have one analog channel in the cablecard channel map (even if it doesn't exist in their published lineup). I'd check the channel list on the tivo, and see if there's a PBS station somewhere in the 90s, and if so, check it on. That's likely analog. They leave this station in the lineup 'cuz that's where TV's get their TvGuide data. The diagnostics screen is one sure way to tell if a channel is analog or digital.


Sorry. I wrote local channel but meant analog channel. I tuned to channel 22, which is an analog channel here in Phoenix.

I appear to have jinxed myself with my posts, as we lost the channels again yesterday after 2 weeks without any drops. This time, I was able to get the messages to pop up on the screen as described in the analog channel fix, but I still had to do a reboot to get the channels back. Anyway, I guess we're not totally in the clear yet. We've still never had any problems with our other Tivo HD.

Jeff


----------



## Roderigo

jhershauer said:


> Sorry. I wrote local channel but meant analog channel. I tuned to channel 22, which is an analog channel here in Phoenix.


Are you sure 22 is analog? What does the tivo diagnostics screen say the modulation mode is for channel 22?


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## wierdo

moyekj said:


> I wouldn't use that assumption to completely rule out possibility of SDV in your area. Cox Orange County, CA recently upgraded all headend nodes from 750MHz to 1GHz but still have plans for deploying SDV sometime this year (and are already blocking all new HD channel additions from CableCard customers).


I'm not saying they won't deploy it in the next couple of years, I'm just saying it's not really a pressing need. They'll do it anyway, but more because they've decided that's what they want to do than for any particularly logical reason. I strongly doubt SDV will be in Oklahoma (or Arkansas) by year's end, though.


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## reggie3

I felt I should detail my install experience so here it goes:
Called to make an appointment 5 days ago, specifying that the installer needed to bring an M-Card
Installer arrived with 2 S-Cards and 1 M-Card. The tech had done installs in Series-3's and a couple of TV's, but not in a TivoHD.
They read the cablecard install guide that comes with the Tivo and walked through the install steps, and everything worked as advertised ... somewhat. There are two problems:
Changing some channels causes the black cablecard pairing screen with the gray border to pop up. Pressing clear on the remote exits the screen and shows me the correct channel. None of the HD channels have this issue (chan 710 and up), and only certain non-hd channels. Restarting the Tivo does nothing to fix it. Has anybody else run into this problem?
Secondly, reading directly from a printout of a Cox email that they brought with them, the tech told me cablecard costumers will not receive any new HD channels. The memo was from prior to November (I forgot the exact month), and the HD channels I can't receive, but Tivo does try to tune for are HGTV, TBS, History, and Discovery. 
So, if cable companies will be forced to use boxes that require cablecards in the near future, how are they going to keep from screwing over those users in relation to new HD channels? I would assume they'd like to keep them happy even if they don't seem to care about Tivo users.
Overall, I'd rate it as a positive experience given the ease of installation other than the two issued mentioned above.


----------



## moyekj

wierdo said:


> I'm not saying they won't deploy it in the next couple of years, I'm just saying it's not really a pressing need. They'll do it anyway, but more because they've decided that's what they want to do than for any particularly logical reason. I strongly doubt SDV will be in Oklahoma (or Arkansas) by year's end, though.


 Well Cox corporate has pretty lofty, bandwidth hogging directives. They have stated that company wide they will  keep analog versions of all channels at least until 2012. They also want to have sufficient bandwidth to accommodate up to 50 HD channels by end of 2007 and 100 HD channels by end of 2009. So that's about 420MHz (70*6MHz) for analog channels and about 300MHz (~50 QAMs for 100 HD channels=50*6MHz) just for HD channels. So that's 720MHz already used up just for analog & HD channels alone. Then of course there's all the SD digital channels, PPV, VOD, telephone, data, etc. and you can easily see that 860MHz is clearly not enough - hence the need for SDV.
Of course it's doubtful if all Cox areas will actually live up to these expectations (in fact I doubt all areas can even accomodate 50 HD channels today without SDV), but clearly the need for SDV is there if they actually do intend to.


----------



## jhershauer

Roderigo said:


> Are you sure 22 is analog? What does the tivo diagnostics screen say the modulation mode is for channel 22?


QAM 64, so I guess it is digital after all. I chose Channel 22 because I thought somebody else here on the forum mentioned that one as an analog channel. I'll try Channel 94 PBS next time. That one is definitely analog.

Thanks for the tip,
Jeff


----------



## JimRI

Everything was working fine with both of my TiVo HDs (since installation last friday) up until last night. The error occured on only one of the TiVos. Basically, on tuner card 2 (single stream Motorola) I lose the standard def premium channels like HBO, SHO, Cinemax, etc. Here in RI, those channels are 200-292. However, I still get the rest of my channel lineup (including all of the premium HD channels) without a problem. And like I said, this is only a problem on tuner card 2...cable card 1 is working properly and my other Tivo HD has been working without any hiccups. Rebooting did nothing. I called Cox this morning and asked if they could send a hit to the card with the problem. As soon as they did that, all of the channels came back. So, has anyone else experienced this? Is this going to be a recurring problem? Or, is this just par for the course with TiVos and cable cards? Of couse, this happens shortly after I tell my wife how happy I am that the new TiVos are running smoothly.


----------



## wierdo

moyekj said:


> Well Cox corporate has pretty lofty, bandwidth hogging directives. They have stated that company wide they will  keep analog versions of all channels at least until 2012. They also want to have sufficient bandwidth to accommodate up to 50 HD channels by end of 2007 and 100 HD channels by end of 2009. So that's about 420MHz (70*6MHz) for analog channels and about 300MHz (~50 QAMs for 100 HD channels=50*6MHz) just for HD channels. So that's 720MHz already used up just for analog & HD channels alone. Then of course there's all the SD digital channels, PPV, VOD, telephone, data, etc. and you can easily see that 860MHz is clearly not enough - hence the need for SDV.
> Of course it's doubtful if all Cox areas will actually live up to these expectations (in fact I doubt all areas can even accomodate 50 HD channels today without SDV), but clearly the need for SDV is there if they actually do intend to.


Just FWIW, you can put 3 720p satellite distributed channels on one 256QAM. Given that a good number of the new adds are such channels and more in the future probably will be as the programmers try to keep their distribution costs reasonable, I wouldn't be surprised if 35 or 40 QAMs would be enough for 100 HD channels.

If they're being obstinate and not clearing some of the more useless analog channels, that's really their own fault. They can certainly move GoScout foo and bar to digital. They recently moved Jewelry TV from channel 60something to 116..still in analog. I do have to wonder what the motivation behind that was.


----------



## tagpats

Tico said:


> the rest of the email:
> 
> As some of you know, we have been working with SA and TiVo to resolve a defect that causes a gray screen to be displayed on TiVo devices with CableCARD, specifically the TiVo HD DVR (see original description below).
> 
> TiVo set up some testing boxes in Las Vegas last week and those boxes did fail with the same symptoms that we've been tracking. Based on experimenting that TiVo completed, a slightly better workaround was developed for the customer once a failure is detected.
> 
> 1. Tune the box to a non-digital cable channel (i.e. analog cable, or antenna channel).
> 
> 2. Navigate to one of the CableCARD MMI screens (Messages & Settings > Account & System Information > CableCARD Decoders > CableCARD 1 > CableCARD Menu). This should fail (the best symptom of this problem), and say "Failed to load CableCARD///...".
> 
> 3. Use CLEAR to exit out of that screen
> 
> 4. Wait for about two minutes (on the CableCARD Menu screen), and the TiVo box will eventually reset the card after the failure from step 2.
> 
> a. You can tell when the box resets the card because this screen will add text above the menu items. First, it will say "Card 1 not in normal operation" then "Your Cable Provider has not supplied any information for this card."
> 
> b. They agree that this looks pretty ugly, as they don't clear the menu items while the cards resetting, nor the text after it's reset, but it does indicate that the card's been reset.
> 
> 5. The card should now be back in normal operation.
> 
> TiVo believes that the card isn't happy with the sequence/timing of commands we send to it when the box was previously tuned to a digital cable channel. In the case where the TiVo box is rebooted, the timing is different.
> 
> We hope that this is a short term solution. Please continue to tell customers that we are working with both TiVo and SA to identify and resolve the issue as quickly as possible.


I can vouch for this fix. I tuned each tuner to an analog channel and followed the instructions above. It worked exactly as advertised and this is the first time I have not had to reboot the Tivo to get my channels back. Appreciate the tip!

The one thing I noticed was that the channel I as on using tuner 2 took about 3 minutes longer than the rest to come back. I thought I was going to have to reboot, but then it popped back up.


----------



## AZrob

tagpats said:


> I can vouch for this fix. I tuned each tuner to an analog channel and followed the instructions above. It worked exactly as advertised and this is the first time I have not had to reboot the Tivo to get my channels back. Appreciate the tip!
> 
> The one thing I noticed was that the channel I as on using tuner 2 took about 3 minutes longer than the rest to come back. I thought I was going to have to reboot, but then it popped back up.





jebbbz said:


> I notice people referring only to reboots as a solution, one that eventually seems to fail. In message #888 (as well as #885) a different technique was discussed -- have "rebooters" ever tried this?
> 
> It involves tuning to a non-digital cable channel then navigating to the cablecard menu, getting an error message, backing up one menu level and waiting (details in the messages). This worked for me and was faster than a reboot. I have had no problems since but it has only been a few days and this may be specific to SA cards and Cox in Phoenix.


Jebbz, what channel did you tune to for this to work? I don't know of an analog channel that can be used, since all of the ones I see are broadcast in digital (even if the source is analog). Was it one of those PBS stations in the 90's?

AZRob


----------



## AZrob

aztivo said:


> while I do wonder if this is a Tivo issue, I also wonder why this just started happening (to me at least) in December? I will also call tivo just to make sure that they have another registered complaint


I believe the reason this started happening in Phoenix, and I believe more specifically East Phoenix (I'm in Scottsdale) is that it was in December when Cox started upgrading all of their networks in that area from 750Mhz to 1 Gighz. They call this their EON project. It's intended to create enough bandwidth for the upcoming VOD implementation as well as a lot of new HD channels.

Lucky us...

This is also linked to the M-Card from SA. But I got my M-card in mid November and this did not really start happening until the end of December. So I think it is the combination of the M-card with the TivoHD and the upgrading of the local networks.

Sorry for the delayed response, but I was taking a vacation from this thread...I have gotten to the point where I just check the Tivo in the morning and reboot it if I need to. I had gotten to the point where rebooting wouldn't work, but then they re-paired the card and now I'm ONLY suffering loss of channels every 3-5 days.

Lucky me...

Rob


----------



## BrianAZ

AZrob said:


> ...
> 
> Sorry for the delayed response, but I was taking a vacation from this thread...I have gotten to the point where I just check the Tivo in the morning and reboot it if I need to. I had gotten to the point where rebooting wouldn't work, but then they re-paired the card and now I'm ONLY suffering loss of channels every 3-5 days.
> 
> Lucky me...
> 
> Rob


I'm in Chandler and have had this problem ever since I swapped out my 2 S cards which was causing horrible tiling and audio stutter. Now I'm on a SA M-card which works perfectly except when it's dropping channels, forcing me to reboot.

I too got to the point where a reboot did not work. I called in and they indicated on the phone that there was nothing they could do aside from replacing the M card with another. We did that and I continue to lose channels (not really suprised) and reboot. While I can live with the reboots every few days, it *really sucks* to be without TV for 2-4 days while I wait for a truck roll.

I wonder if the only thing that is being done to "re-pair" your card is in fact the same process the tech does when he comes to the house for an install and simply calls a phone # and reads in the host ID and card info? Who did you talk to to get them to try the re-pair? The woman I spoke to said they can't do anything and refused to try anything other than a truck roll.

If this process does indeed fix a card for which reboots no longer worked, I will press *hard* for it the next time it happens.


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## tagpats

I tuned to channel 5 (fox) and channel 7 (abc). For some reason, my channels up to 100 are all analog. Initially I was not happy to discover this, but since I really only watch HD on this TV, I'm glad that I do have analog channels to access in order to do this fix when my channels are out.



AZrob said:


> Jebbz, what channel did you tune to for this to work? I don't know of an analog channel that can be used, since all of the ones I see are broadcast in digital (even if the source is analog). Was it one of those PBS stations in the 90's?
> 
> AZRob


----------



## AZrob

BrianAZ said:


> I'm in Chandler and have had this problem ever since I swapped out my 2 S cards which was causing horrible tiling and audio stutter. Now I'm on a SA M-card which works perfectly except when it's dropping channels, forcing me to reboot.
> 
> I too got to the point where a reboot did not work. I called in and they indicated on the phone that there was nothing they could do aside from replacing the M card with another. We did that and I continue to lose channels (not really suprised) and reboot. While I can live with the reboots every few days, it *really sucks* to be without TV for 2-4 days while I wait for a truck roll.
> 
> I wonder if the only thing that is being done to "re-pair" your card is in fact the same process the tech does when he comes to the house for an install and simply calls a phone # and reads in the host ID and card info? Who did you talk to to get them to try the re-pair? The woman I spoke to said they can't do anything and refused to try anything other than a truck roll.
> 
> If this process does indeed fix a card for which reboots no longer worked, I will press *hard* for it the next time it happens.


BrianAZ, I had the exact same scenario as you, minus the S-Card part, because I started with an M-card. When I got to the point where a reboot wouldn't work, I called Cox, and the phone tech tried to re-pair 3 times to no success. She set up a truck roll for two days later. Mysteriously, the next day the channels came back.

When the tech showed up the day after that he told me that he had seen the order,and, as a matter of procedure, called in for a re-pairing before coming out. So that time it worked. But when I asked him if he did anything special, he said no, that it was hit-or-miss with that kind of fix.

So I don't have any magic procedure, except maybe it would be worthwhile to keep calling in for a re-pairing while you are waiting for the truck roll appointment. I'll give you my tech's name and his team leader by PM if you wish, but since I'm in North Scottsdale he probably would never be in your area.

BTW, you say it sucks to be without TV when this happens...but when this happens you are at least getting the local channels, aren't you, meaning 2-22 and 700-715?

Also, after that pairing I didn't have any problem for a week. Now it's averaging about once every 3-5 days.

Rob


----------



## AZrob

tagpats said:


> I tuned to channel 5 (fox) and channel 7 (abc). For some reason, my channels up to 100 are all analog. Initially I was not happy to discover this, but since I really only watch HD on this TV, I'm glad that I do have analog channels to access in order to do this fix when my channels are out.


Ah, you're not in Phoenix. Here, as far as I know, all of the channels between 1 and 100 are sent digitally to us.

Unless someone else in Phoenix knows better....

Thanks,

Rob


----------



## nws2002

wierdo said:


> Don't expect any of the HD channels they added a few days ago.
> 
> Other than that, Cox in Tulsa is pretty darn good, IMO.
> 
> Of course, that's like the old saw "other than that, how did you like the play Mrs. Lincoln?"
> 
> If you do end up getting them, please let me know so I can beat them about the head.


Well they couldn't get the one M-card the guy had to pair, so he ended up using 2 S-cards. They both work, and I get all the channels except for the 3 new ones (HGTVHD, TRAVELHD, and one other one I can't remember). He called his boss, and I called cust service and we all agreed that I only have to pay one rental fee and one digital gateway fee. They asked me if I wanted them to come back out and install one M-card, I passed, at least for now.

The tech had done a few before, but he took a few seconds to look over the sheet, and I had to help him out a few times. All data was typed into a laptop and he never made a call in until we had to discuss billing with 2 cards. The home office did have to intervene at one point and remove my old cable box before he could continue, but he sent them an IM on the laptop somehow.

All in all not a bad deal, and it took around and hour and a half to get everything working 100%. But the HD makes it all worth it.


----------



## tagpats

No, northern Virginia.



AZrob said:


> Ah, you're not in Phoenix. Here, as far as I know, all of the channels between 1 and 100 are sent digitally to us.
> 
> Unless someone else in Phoenix knows better....
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Rob


----------



## jebbbz

AZrob said:


> Jebbz, what channel did you tune to for this to work? I don't know of an analog channel that can be used, since all of the ones I see are broadcast in digital (even if the source is analog). Was it one of those PBS stations in the 90's?
> 
> AZRob


I used 94, a PBS channel, and I have an antenna so I have used it to tune to OTA digital on another occasion. I am pretty sure I only bothered to tune one tuner each time to a non-digital cable channel so apparently it is not necessary to tune bothe tuners. Also, I seem to recall that I have gotten different error messages on the gray-bordered black screen you get when you make a selection from the CC menu. When I "clear" back to the CC menu the error messages are always the same.


----------



## hddude55

Supermurph said:


> It took a week, but my channels went out again with the new cable card. This isn't a surprise considering other posts, but I was hopeful. I was previously losing channels daily, so there has been at least a temp improvement. I was also having signal issues on another TV with a Cox digital box on it and that issues appears fixed. So, I'm curious to see if the length of time between my Tivo outages stays at a week. If it does, it seems that signal may indeed be part of the issue (that's not scientific, but what the heck).


Another Cox Phoenix customer here. Backing off my signal seemed to fix the "disappearing channels every couple days" issue. Well, the "fix" lasted for three weeks -- now the problem has recurred twice in the last three days. This is nuts.


----------



## The Video Guru

I got a call from TiVo after they got a draft of my press release threatening a lawsuit and desire to have a judge certify a class.

They are, in fact, working on a solution and have a fix in beta, in conjunction with cablecard maker SA. They offered for me to participate in the beta program (subject to non-disclosure). I told them that while I was traveling for business, that when I returned home I would take them up on my offer with one of my TiVo units and that, as long as they keep me updated as to their progress and they show movement in the direction of a solution, that I would hold off on any filing, but would continue to gather names.

I will keep folks updated.


----------



## Shawn95GT

Cox was playing with something in my area (North Phoenix) today.

Channel 740 (A&E HD) was a black screen and the content was playing on 732 (ESPN2HD).
ESPN2HD was showing Universal HD content. 

I figured one of my cablecards just went crazy so I rebooted the S3.. same thing. I went to start this post and then ESPN2HD switched from Universal HD back to ESPN2HD. A&EHD is back too on 740.

wierd!


----------



## aztivo

Shawn95GT said:


> Cox was playing with something in my area (North Phoenix) today.
> 
> Channel 740 (A&E HD) was a black screen and the content was playing on 732 (ESPN2HD).
> ESPN2HD was showing Universal HD content.
> 
> I figured one of my cablecards just went crazy so I rebooted the S3.. same thing. I went to start this post and then ESPN2HD switched from Universal HD back to ESPN2HD. A&EHD is back too on 740.
> 
> wierd!


well we are supposed to be getting 7 (I think) new HD channels in March


----------



## AZrob

The Video Guru said:


> I got a call from TiVo after they got a draft of my press release threatening a lawsuit and desire to have a judge certify a class.
> 
> They are, in fact, working on a solution and have a fix in beta, in conjunction with cablecard maker SA. They offered for me to participate in the beta program (subject to non-disclosure). I told them that while I was traveling for business, that when I returned home I would take them up on my offer with one of my TiVo units and that, as long as they keep me updated as to their progress and they show movement in the direction of a solution, that I would hold off on any filing, but would continue to gather names.
> 
> I will keep folks updated.


That's great news...kudos for your efforts, Video Guru!

If they want more beta volunteers, I'm available...anything would be better than what we have now....

AZrob


----------



## rcobourn

aztivo said:


> well we are supposed to be getting 7 (I think) new HD channels in March


Any idea which channels? SciFi HD would be most welcome. We must be losing more analog to do it if they aren't going SDV, they have seemed pretty maxed out on bandwidth.


----------



## craigo

aztivo said:


> well we are supposed to be getting 7 (I think) new HD channels in March





rcobourn said:


> Any idea which channels? SciFi HD would be most welcome. We must be losing more analog to do it if they aren't going SDV, they have seemed pretty maxed out on bandwidth.


According to their website, here in AZ, we should have a total of 80 HD channels sometime this year.

IIRC, Cox-Phoenix is next to deploy SDV. I'm sure most of these channels will be unavailable until the dongle is released.


----------



## Pafrican

Having the dropped channels again. Oddly, there are no errors on the cable card menus when I go digging around those. Restarts aren't working. 

Guess it's time to call Cox in the morning.


----------



## BrianAZ

Pafrican said:


> Having the dropped channels again. Oddly, there are no errors on the cable card menus when I go digging around those. Restarts aren't working.
> 
> Guess it's time to call Cox in the morning.


Curious what they say. When I called, the woman refused to try anything, saying nothing they could do from the office would fix it and she had to schedule a truck roll two days later. When the guy swapped to another MCard, it was fine. I wonder if he just called in and gave them the hostid of the original card if it would have been "fixed" then or if the card actually became "broken".


----------



## aztivo

rcobourn said:


> Any idea which channels? SciFi HD would be most welcome. We must be losing more analog to do it if they aren't going SDV, they have seemed pretty maxed out on bandwidth.


If I had to guess, I believe we follow San Diego, I think it will be TLC,Vs,CNN,HGTV,TBS,National Geographic. You can go here and see what they have been getting http://www.cox.com/sandiego/digitalcable/hdtv/programming.asp


----------



## 5cats

BrianAZ said:


> Curious what they say. When I called, the woman refused to try anything, saying nothing they could do from the office would fix it and she had to schedule a truck roll two days later. When the guy swapped to another MCard, it was fine. I wonder if he just called in and gave them the hostid of the original card if it would have been "fixed" then or if the card actually became "broken".


My THD has been online for two weeks today with Cox San Diego, and we've had four instances of dropped channels. I can confirm the CC menu reset technique (thanks to whomever for that).

I had a service tech out two days ago, who also confirmed the CC menu reset technique as widely distributed to the techs within the last two weeks.

The tech also confirmed that only SA cards were available in the area, so I wait for a fix.

Significantly, this tech also mentioned that the CSRs often don't do things quite right, but if you need to call up, ask for the technical help desk and ask them to send a few EMMs, or "hits" to the card to set its programming. You can actually see the hit count in the CC menu -- top screen (CA data or similar). This is what he demonstrated for me, and got my machine up (again) with all the programming I'm subscribed to.

Asking for EMMs or "hits" might get you some traction next time.

Cheers,
-jd.


----------



## smb56

Just got off the phone with Cox Middle Ga. marketing people and we have 3 new HD channels that no one who has a cable card will be upgraded to. The new SDV that they are going to won't be supporting the cable cards according to the local marketing people here. Spending over $250 per month with a cable company that won't support their best customers is bull. I let them know that maybe I need to lobby the local county into allowing a competitive cable company in. No matter what anyone ever tells you, competition makes us all stronger and better. Look at what TiVo did to the DVR market as an example, still leading the way with innovations. 

smb56


----------



## ajwees41

smb56 said:


> Just got off the phone with Cox Middle Ga. marketing people and we have 3 new HD channels that no one who has a cable card will be upgraded to. The new SDV that they are going to won't be supporting the cable cards according to the local marketing people here. Spending over $250 per month with a cable company that won't support their best customers is bull. I let them know that maybe I need to lobby the local county into allowing a competitive cable company in. No matter what anyone ever tells you, competition makes us all stronger and better. Look at what TiVo did to the DVR market as an example, still leading the way with innovations.
> 
> smb56


It's not Cox's fault, but Tivo's. How do consider your a good customer if you have a tivo?


----------



## Shawn95GT

As it sits right now they can't give you an SDV channel if they wanted to. We're all in the same boat waiting for the SDV dongle. It isn't a marketing thing, it's a technical limitation.

The cable companies must be having a hard time deploying HD boxes if the new HD content is SDV worthy. You want the stuff no-one is watching on SDV.


----------



## smb56

I consider myself a good customer using a TiVo because Cox DVR's are awful at best. One of the things I pride myself on is buying off of good judgement and getting a Cox DVR is not good judgement. Let's see, rent a Yugo or buy a Camry. Doesn't make much sense to me to rent a Yugo when I can get a Camry that will run circles around it and I don't constantly have to take it back and lose whatever I have on there. Not much when you consider it won't record but 15 hours to begin with. 

smb56


----------



## moyekj

smb56 said:


> Just got off the phone with Cox Middle Ga. marketing people and we have 3 new HD channels that no one who has a cable card will be upgraded to. The new SDV that they are going to won't be supporting the cable cards according to the local marketing people here. Spending over $250 per month with a cable company that won't support their best customers is bull. I let them know that maybe I need to lobby the local county into allowing a competitive cable company in. No matter what anyone ever tells you, competition makes us all stronger and better. Look at what TiVo did to the DVR market as an example, still leading the way with innovations.
> 
> smb56


 As has been stated many times before, SDV is becoming a necessity for cable companies already starved on bandwidth to stay competitive with D*. Cox is making matters worse by resolving to keep all analog channels for a long time as well as preventing CableCard customers from getting new channels even in areas where SDV rollout is scheduled but not yet rolled out - that seems to be a corporate directive as well. As an illustration I posted this in this thread a rough example of how much bandwidth is needed just for analog & HD channels alone:


moyekj said:


> Well Cox corporate has pretty lofty, bandwidth hogging directives. They have stated that company wide they will  keep analog versions of all channels at least until 2012. They also want to have sufficient bandwidth to accommodate up to 50 HD channels by end of 2007 and 100 HD channels by end of 2009. So that's about 420MHz (70*6MHz) for analog channels and about 300MHz (~50 QAMs for 100 HD channels=50*6MHz) just for HD channels. So that's 720MHz already used up just for analog & HD channels alone. Then of course there's all the SD digital channels, PPV, VOD, telephone, data, etc. and you can easily see that 860MHz is clearly not enough - hence the need for SDV.
> Of course it's doubtful if all Cox areas will actually live up to these expectations (in fact I doubt all areas can even accomodate 50 HD channels today without SDV), but clearly the need for SDV is there if they actually do intend to.


 Other bandwidth saving measures could be implemented by Cox other than SDV such as increasing compression and packing in more channels per QAM at the expense of image quality, but I for one don't want to see them go that route and end up with HD Lite. I already suspect that will happen to some degree despite SDV.


----------



## Pafrican

BrianAZ said:


> Curious what they say. When I called, the woman refused to try anything, saying nothing they could do from the office would fix it and she had to schedule a truck roll two days later. When the guy swapped to another MCard, it was fine. I wonder if he just called in and gave them the hostid of the original card if it would have been "fixed" then or if the card actually became "broken".


Well, the guy sent some hits. So far still no non-basic channels. The CA menu still looks okay (and it registered the EMMs/hits) but the host ID screen gives me the "to start service call Cox..." message. The phone tech confirmed the host-id on the tivo screen and what he shows match. Trying a restart after waiting a bit post-hits to see if it helps anything.

Yeah, restart did nothing. Tech is coming out tomorrow. Freakin wonderful.


----------



## esb1981

Has anyone had problems where Cox changes the channel frequency locations and the cablecard does not update with the correct frequency? In other words, ESPN HD is supposed to be on 711, but it is showing up on 703 because they moved the frequency. I lost 2 HD channels this morning and had 4 others move to the wrong location. Anyone seen this?


----------



## jcaudle

I have a S3 Tivo and a Tivo HD. The S3 retains channels fine using 2 Scientific Atlanta SCards. The HD loses all digital channels and all HD channels every few days. It has a Scientific Atlanta M-card. I have returned the Tivo to Costco 3 times, and Cox Fairfax has replaced the M card at least 3 times and nothing seems to fix it. Is this problem ony unique to the HD Tivo? Would using 2 S cards in the HD unit fix it? Like I said, my Tivo S3 never does this.

Also, are any of you here in Fairfax, Va paying 2 gateway fees for S3 boxes that use 2 cable cards? I call customer service at Cox about it, they sometimes give an adjustment, and the next month there the extra gateway charge is again.


----------



## Pafrican

Well the tech is still here. The new m-card did a firmware update (first time that is happened for me during an install) but still not working. Diagnostics are giving a menu of "not tuned, wrong card state" or something along those lines (for all channels, haven't seen that problem) and the cable card menu screens are saying to call cox to start service. He did call with the cable card numbers and what not. He did a guided setup for whatever reason and thats where we are at now.

I think one of the bigger issues with the techs is their impatience. I understand they have a job to do and have to get on to the next house but just be patient please.

The magic answer to everything is to take the card out. (Heavy sarcasm.) Upon completion of guided setup, the non local channels did still not come in. Instead of going through cable card menus or what not. So yeah, he's taken the card out. Gonna try another card apparently. UGH!!!

He's gone to an s-card now. Okay, well two S-cards are working (and working very quickly as well). Now we'll see how billing works out. I'm sure I'll be charged for two but I hope not. It's not my fault their s-cards suck. So just charge me for one card please Cox.


----------



## Dan Theman

Tivo HD, 9.2a, SA M-Card, Cox San Diego.

I lose channels every few days, in the past, a reboot has solved the problem.

Last night I lost every channel except for the HD versions of local broadcast channels (706, 707, 708, etc). Curiously, the SD versions of those channels (6, 7, 8, etc) did not work.

I checked the cablecard diagnostics screen and the sub-expire time was the previous day and one of the other screens said to call cox to start service. A restart did not fix it this time, it still had the same problem.

I called Cox, got a totally clueless tech (had no idea what a Tivo was!) and finally convinced her to send the cablecard activation stuff. Still had no effect, so I scheduled a service call. I asked her to add a note to the service call to say it was a Tivo HD and request an M-card. She said they don't have M-Cards. I told here I know for a fact they do and there is one in my box now, so just please add the note.

On a whim, I unplugged the Tivo for 10 minutes and then plugged it back in. After it started up it was still having the same problem. I called cox again, got another (less clueless - he knew what a Tivo was) tech and got him to send the CC activation again. 10 seconds later and the CC diag screen shows EMMs being received and the sub expire time moved to next month. All of the channels are back and I am happy for now.

Looks like the "cold reboot" fixed it enough that they could reactivate the cablecard...

I can't wait for 9.3 to get released and hopefully fix this extremely annoying problem (and hopefully also my other "not recording because of power loss" error that occurs even though there was no power loss)


----------



## tagpats

have you tried the menu reset technique that has been described in recent posts? i just did it again last night. you only have to tune to 1 analog channel. i confirmed this because i was tivoing something on an hd channel on tuner 2. when the channels came back my recording stopped for a moment, but everything was back up and running. hopefully this will remain fool proof each time i lose channels. the 2 minutes it takes to get them back sure beats a reboot or calling customer service all night. give it a try, if you haven't already.



Dan Theman said:


> Tivo HD, 9.2a, SA M-Card, Cox San Diego.
> 
> I lose channels every few days, in the past, a reboot has solved the problem.
> 
> Last night I lost every channel except for the HD versions of local broadcast channels (706, 707, 708, etc). Curiously, the SD versions of those channels (6, 7, 8, etc) did not work.
> 
> I checked the cablecard diagnostics screen and the sub-expire time was the previous day and one of the other screens said to call cox to start service. A restart did not fix it this time, it still had the same problem.
> 
> I called Cox, got a totally clueless tech (had no idea what a Tivo was!) and finally convinced her to send the cablecard activation stuff. Still had no effect, so I scheduled a service call. I asked her to add a note to the service call to say it was a Tivo HD and request an M-card. She said they don't have M-Cards. I told here I know for a fact they do and there is one in my box now, so just please add the note.
> 
> On a whim, I unplugged the Tivo for 10 minutes and then plugged it back in. After it started up it was still having the same problem. I called cox again, got another (less clueless - he knew what a Tivo was) tech and got him to send the CC activation again. 10 seconds later and the CC diag screen shows EMMs being received and the sub expire time moved to next month. All of the channels are back and I am happy for now.
> 
> Looks like the "cold reboot" fixed it enough that they could reactivate the cablecard...
> 
> I can't wait for 9.3 to get released and hopefully fix this extremely annoying problem (and hopefully also my other "not recording because of power loss" error that occurs even though there was no power loss)


----------



## BrianAZ

tagpats said:


> have you tried the menu reset technique that has been described in recent posts? i just did it again last night. you only have to tune to 1 analog channel. i confirmed this because i was tivoing something on an hd channel on tuner 2. when the channels came back my recording stopped for a moment, but everything was back up and running. hopefully this will remain fool proof each time i lose channels. the 2 minutes it takes to get them back sure beats a reboot or calling customer service all night. give it a try, if you haven't already.


Is there any way to validate for sure which channels are analog? I think my cable co sends the SD rather than analog. Is it possible for me to trick my Tivo into thinking I have an antenna of some sort?


----------



## Supermurph

I received this email below from Cox today. So, it looks like we'll get to see for real if Cox in Phoenix is going to SDV for the new HD channels:

Seven more HD channels coming in March!
Marching toward our goal of 80 HD channels by the end of 2008, we're adding seven more HD channels to the line-up on March 18. Joining the 22 HD channels already offered by Cox Digital Cable will be:

TBS HD on channel 716
Science Channel HD on channel 720
Discovery HD on channel 723
Golf Channel HD/Versus HD on channel 744
Food Network HD on channel 746
Animal Planet HD on channel 757
History Channel HD on channel 762

In addition, Discovery HD Theater will move to channel 714. Customers must subscribe to the Sports & Information tier to receive Golf Channel HD/Versus HD. Order Cox Digital Cable with an HD receiver to get HD right now, or visit Cox.com/Arizona for more information!


----------



## moyekj

Supermurph said:


> I received this email below from Cox today. So, it looks like we'll get to see for real if Cox in Phoenix is going to SDV for the new HD channels:
> 
> Seven more HD channels coming in March!
> Marching toward our goal of 80 HD channels by the end of 2008, we're adding seven more HD channels to the line-up on March 18. Joining the 22 HD channels already offered by Cox Digital Cable will be:
> 
> TBS HD on channel 716
> Science Channel HD on channel 720
> Discovery HD on channel 723
> Golf Channel HD/Versus HD on channel 744
> Food Network HD on channel 746
> Animal Planet HD on channel 757
> History Channel HD on channel 762


 All these were added in Cox Orange County market a while back and even though SDV is not yet rolled out here these channels are not available to CableCard customers since they are being reserved for future SDV deployment. Most of the big Cox markets are adopting this corporate driven policy.
Compared to the very vocal Florida BHN group it seems Cox customers are taking this policy in stride.


----------



## sirgolf82

My TiVo HD's hard drive recently died, and a replacement is on the way. When it arrives, will I need to have a truck roll in order to pair the new cards, or is Cox (Phoenix) knowledgeable enough to handle this over the phone?


----------



## tagpats

If you go into Configure CableCard and then Diagnostics, you'll see the signal of the channel you are tuned to under Modulation.



BrianAZ said:


> Is there any way to validate for sure which channels are analog? I think my cable co sends the SD rather than analog. Is it possible for me to trick my Tivo into thinking I have an antenna of some sort?


----------



## jsd2

Any new HD and digital stations that will be added in the future that are not local channels will not be available to cable card customers. Even if the system is not SDV capable yet it will be and Cox does not want to give a customer something and then take it away (even though it is free material). 

There are many people on these forums I see bashing a company for issues with THEIR own bought product and fail to see why. Cox did not mandate the use of cable cards the FCC did. The cards are not made by Cox they are made by SA or Mot. If they go bad they go bad, that is not a fault of Cox. Cable cards are a limited technology at best in certain devices. Last I heard both Sony and Mitsubishi stopped putting cable card slots in their newer tvs because they were spending more money on upgrades and tech support than warranted for sub par technology.

I have 2 tvs that have had cable cards, I have tried the Tivo out and returned it; the point being that with the overpriced equipment that is being sold the cable card technology doesn't work properly to full potential and is not reliable yet. I will stick with my rental fee for now so I can enjoy all my HD stations, VOD, guide, PPV, and mosaic channels.

This all doesn't matter much since in the next two to three years we will all be buying boxes from our local electronic store and putting cable cards in them that work two way to view channels and the cable company will no longer rent boxes to us.


----------



## esb1981

Jsd2, I do not disagree that the cablecards are a poor technology. But just because Cox did not mandate cablecards does not mean that Cox should not be held responsible for ensuring that they work properly. The FCC mandate states that cable companies must provide cards, ensure that they work properly and are compatible with a customer's certified cable card device. The Tivo is such a certified device. So shouldn't this mean that Cox, by law, must be held accountable for making sure these things work properly?? We know they didn't want to do it, but sometimes you have to do things that you don't want to do.

This mandate was created to stimulate competition and remove the cable companies' monopoly over cable boxes. Yes, Tivo made a mistake by relying on cablecard technology, and they are paying for it by losing customers -- and I may be one of them. But Cox still has a responsibility to make an effort to get these devices working and provide the proper support.


----------



## jsd2

Cox should be held responsible if it is something they can fix. Last I checked Cox does not make any cable cards. So if a card goes bad it is not their fault. I have read many threads that say people have gone through several cards till finding one that works. Who would be at fault? The cable company that sends the same firmware to the card or the maker of the card? The company cannot just go out and buy a different brand of card because they want to that would take a tremendous upgrade on the entire backoffice.

I am quick to blame the cable company on many things myself but when stepping back and looking at the bigger picture they seem to be the one trying to make things work the most. How many updates did the Tivo need to make it work right to begin with when it first hit the shelves? How long did it take them to even admit it was a firmware issue? All this time the cable company is trying to make a device that was mandated, that is not up to current technology, on a product that hit the market that did not even work properly for what 6-9months before patch 8.1.7b and even then there were still issues?


----------



## Dan Theman

tagpats said:


> have you tried the menu reset technique that has been described in recent posts? i just did it again last night. you only have to tune to 1 analog channel.


I don't think that I get any analog channels.


----------



## jonginear

JSD2-
The overarching point to the cablecards and the cable companies is that they _never_ wanted to make cable cards work in the first place. It's really that simple! I didn't want to do the dishes as a kid so I did them badly in the hopes that my parents would eventually give up and not make me do them. The cable companies(especially Cox) are acting like children.

Cox is responsible for meeting the FCC mandate. If they took this responsibility seriously they would be working with other cable providers to develop a technology that was not so stupidly complicated, antiquated, and worthless.


----------



## tagpats

sorry about that. some have said there is a pbs channel in the 90s that might be analog. you've probably checked your whole line-up, but just another thought.

maybe you can get the company to send some in analog format until the "fix" happens since the reboots are no longer working for you. i'm no techy and have no idea how any of that works, but i do receive a mix of analog and digital signals depending on channel.

initially i was no pleased that what i thought were all digital channels were actually analog, but it is helping me out now.



Dan Theman said:


> I don't think that I get any analog channels.


----------



## Big Rick

moyekj said:


> All these were added in Cox Orange County market a while back and even though SDV is not yet rolled out here these channels are not available to CableCard customers since they are being reserved for future SDV deployment.


They showed up in San Diego last month and they *ARE* available to CableCard customers although I did lose my channels 704<-->720 (exclusive) for a few days when the new (higher range) channels showed up.


----------



## ajwees41

jonginear said:


> JSD2-
> The overarching point to the cablecards and the cable companies is that they _never_ wanted to make cable cards work in the first place. It's really that simple! I didn't want to do the dishes as a kid so I did them badly in the hopes that my parents would eventually give up and not make me do them. The cable companies(especially Cox) are acting like children.
> 
> Cox is responsible for meeting the FCC mandate. If they took this responsibility seriously they would be working with other cable providers to develop a technology that was not so stupidly complicated, antiquated, and worthless.


It's the FCC's fault for the cablecard mandate not Cox's if they were smart they pressure Tivo to come out with a 2way capable box from the start.


----------



## bacevedo

I just ordered a Tivo HD to go to OTA only (cancelling DirecTV), but I was curious what it costs for those in Arizona (Phoenix market) to get the cablecards. I may subscribe during college football season to see the games on ESPN and Fox Sports.

What packages do you have to get? Do you have to pay for the HD acess even if you don't rent one of their boxes - it seems that they are tied together? Do you have to get Digital cable, or can you just get the basic or expanded package and use the cablecards to get those channels? Or do you even need the cable cards for the analog channels?

Thanks,
Bryan


----------



## jsd2

jonginear said:


> JSD2-
> The overarching point to the cablecards and the cable companies is that they _never_ wanted to make cable cards work in the first place. It's really that simple! I didn't want to do the dishes as a kid so I did them badly in the hopes that my parents would eventually give up and not make me do them. The cable companies(especially Cox) are acting like children.
> 
> Cox is responsible for meeting the FCC mandate. If they took this responsibility seriously they would be working with other cable providers to develop a technology that was not so stupidly complicated, antiquated, and worthless.


You are right cable cards were not enthusiastically looked on by the cable companies when first coming out because there were no 2way devices out yet. They were very limited and still are on what they can do. No PPV and no VOD both big money makers. The rental fee for a box isn't that big of a income draw anyway. Soon we will be able to buy boxes from anywhere, stick a card in them and work.

BUT! Who do you think loses the most on this happening? The cable companies? NOPE! Companies that supply the mass orders of boxes like SA and Motorola. How much is a DVR box $600 or more(at $15/month rental fee it takes 40months to recoup the amount of that box)? Cable card maybe $100?

The point is the same people that make the cable cards are the same ones that will be losing GUARANTEED money from these cable companies when everything becomes universal AND the cable companies will not be spending millions on buying and maintaining equipment.

Motorola is already using boxes with M cards in them and they work great-DCH3416. These boxes are completely 2way so the technology does exist. Check out http://www.ncta.com/IssueBrief.aspx?contentId=4272

You are absolutely right about the other cable companies making a way to get this technology out to all that works easier. That is why they are working on Tru2way now. The problem comes with equipment, platforms, and the big one COST. I would rather have the solution come later and cheaper and work than have it now with limited content, reception issues, tons of updates or just plain loss of service.....oh wait a minute.


----------



## moyekj

Big Rick said:


> They showed up in San Diego last month and they *ARE* available to CableCard customers although I did lose my channels 704<-->720 (exclusive) for a few days when the new (higher range) channels showed up.


 There are *NOT* available to CableCard customers in Orange County. San Diego is a different market. It is somewhat surprising that in San Diego they didn't limit them however since Cox corporate policy seems to be driving holding back new channel additions from CableCard customers in preparation for SDV rollout. I've seen reports from other Cox markets in this forum complaining about new channels being denied to CableCard customers as well so I know it's not just Orange County, Phoenix and Virginia.


----------



## Shawn95GT

bacevedo said:


> I just ordered a Tivo HD to go to OTA only (cancelling DirecTV), but I was curious what it costs for those in Arizona (Phoenix market) to get the cablecards. I may subscribe during college football season to see the games on ESPN and Fox Sports.
> 
> What packages do you have to get? Do you have to pay for the HD acess even if you don't rent one of their boxes - it seems that they are tied together? Do you have to get Digital cable, or can you just get the basic or expanded package and use the cablecards to get those channels? Or do you even need the cable cards for the analog channels?
> 
> Thanks,
> Bryan


They don't have an HD package. You just subscribe to digital cable and the HS is along for the ride. Make sure you ask for it though or you won't get it. The install fees for cablecards suck. It's the only reason I only have cablecards in one of my 3 tivos that could take 'em.

Shawn


----------



## jebbbz

bacevedo said:


> I just ordered a Tivo HD to go to OTA only (cancelling DirecTV), but I was curious what it costs for those in Arizona (Phoenix market) to get the cablecards. I may subscribe during college football season to see the games on ESPN and Fox Sports.


Depending on which customer service rep you talk to installation is either $15.00, $35.00, $50.00, or $65.00 and you may "need" two singlestream SCards (one for each tuner in your Tivo) because multistream MCards do not exist at all or at least are not available in Phoenix. The monthly rental for cablecards is $2.00 per month unless you get one of the mythological MCards in which case it will be $2.00 or $4.00 per month, depending on the CSR you talk to. In fact, you probably won't know what it costs until your bill arrives. In fact you won't even know then because you may get Cox to change the charge by griping about how confusing it all is and how the installer didn't know squat about installing cablecards so you basically did it yourself by reading the instructions Tivo gives you.

I am still at the "waiting-for-the-bill" stage. And I got the mythical MCard. And my installers had (a little) experience with Tivos and were OK guys.


----------



## I love HD

I also have the problem with dropped channels. For a while if I rebooted the Tivo the channels came back but now that doesn't work. So could someone explain the process for resetting the cable card. Channel 94 is a PBS channel that I can access for an analog signal. 

Thanks for the help.


----------



## jebbbz

I love HD said:


> I also have the problem with dropped channels. For a while if I rebooted the Tivo the channels came back but now that doesn't work. So could someone explain the process for resetting the cable card. Channel 94 is a PBS channel that I can access for an analog signal.
> 
> Thanks for the help.


Per "Tico" [my comments in square brackets]:

====

1. Tune the box to a non-digital cable channel (i.e. analog cable, or antenna channel) [i.e., 94]

2. Navigate to one of the CableCARD MMI screens (Messages & Settings > Account & System Information > CableCARD Decoders > CableCARD 1 > CableCARD Menu > [pick the first one]). This should fail (the best symptom of this problem), and say "Failed to load CableCARD///...".

3. Use CLEAR to exit out of that screen

4. Wait for about two minutes [or so] (on the CableCARD Menu screen), and the TiVo box will eventually reset the card after the failure from step 2.

a. You can tell when the box resets the card because this screen will add text above the menu items. First, it will say "Card 1 not in normal operation" then "Your Cable Provider has not supplied any information for this card."

b. They agree that this looks pretty ugly, as they don't clear the menu items while the cards resetting, nor the text after it's reset, but it does indicate that the card's been reset.

5. The card should now be back in normal operation.

====

This worked for me for a few weeks but eventually I had to call for a new card. Someone else said they unplugged their Tivo for ten minutes and then called their cableco to send authorization hits and they got their unit working without a new cable card. Good luck.


----------



## RogueScot

Here's an interesting new wrinkle in the SDV channels I don't get. I had a Cox tech out to replace my cable card. I had some weird ghost lines on my screen. They were even on the Tivo menus. Tivo replaced the box for this problem before. But, it appears it was an improperly grounded cable. I digress. While he was here and because he seemed knowledgeable, I told him I was missing some HD channels and having a problem with the screen going black sometimes. I also have a problem where my resolution changes whenever there is a white flash on a program. He ended up replacing the cablecard. Still no HGTVHD, FoodHD, or TravelHD. He thought it was because they weren't authorized. I asked if he had an Cox HD box in his truck. Perhaps we could hook it up and see if the channels worked. He did and hooked it up and got it turned on. Those three channels didn't work. He called in and they "authorized" the channels. He disconnected the HD box and reconnected my HD Tivo. All three channels were there and worked great. He disconected the cable to reinstall a splitter and when he reconnected the Tivo, the channels were gone again. He called in again the they said, "Did you say it was a Tivo? They don't get those channels." The tech then told me that these were SDV channels. I don't know, but they worked for a while. I live in Oklahoma City. I saw some previous posts about us not having SDV.


----------



## BrianAZ

bacevedo said:


> I just ordered a Tivo HD to go to OTA only (cancelling DirecTV), but I was curious what it costs for those in Arizona (Phoenix market) to get the cablecards. I may subscribe during college football season to see the games on ESPN and Fox Sports.
> 
> What packages do you have to get? Do you have to pay for the HD acess even if you don't rent one of their boxes - it seems that they are tied together? Do you have to get Digital cable, or can you just get the basic or expanded package and use the cablecards to get those channels? Or do you even need the cable cards for the analog channels?
> 
> Thanks,
> Bryan


Hey Bryan,

I'm also in Chandler and was thinking of getting an OTA antenna. Would you let me know which one you end up with and how it works? Are you doing and inside/outside antenna?

thx


----------



## Mikeyis4dcats

I have Cox and Motorola cards. I have been missing TLCHD, DSCHD, and ESPNHD for over a week. Cox says that they adjusted the frequencies, and that if I reset my TV to factory defaults (they always forget Tivo) that the cards would retune and work. I could tell she would be no help with Tivo, but I rebooted and still no dice. I tried the tips above but I don't get any kind of failure message under the CableCard menu.

Any ideas?


----------



## aztivo

BrianAZ said:


> Hey Bryan,
> 
> I'm also in Chandler and was thinking of getting an OTA antenna. Would you let me know which one you end up with and how it works? Are you doing and inside/outside antenna?
> 
> thx


Brian 
I am also in Chandler and have an antenna in my attic this gives me all the locals in HD as well. so any antenna will work


----------



## saibari

moyekj said:


> All these were added in Cox Orange County market a while back and even though SDV is not yet rolled out here these channels are not available to CableCard customers since they are being reserved for future SDV deployment. Most of the big Cox markets are adopting this corporate driven policy.
> Compared to the very vocal Florida BHN group it seems Cox customers are taking this policy in stride.


Well, I for one plan on demanding a discount on my subscription fee. Why should I pay the same as others when I'm not receiving all the channels they are?


----------



## saibari

jsd2 said:


> ...There are many people on these forums I see bashing a company for issues with THEIR own bought product and fail to see why. Cox did not mandate the use of cable cards the FCC did. The cards are not made by Cox they are made by SA or Mot. If they go bad they go bad, that is not a fault of Cox. Cable cards are a limited technology at best in certain devices. Last I heard both Sony and Mitsubishi stopped putting cable card slots in their newer tvs because they were spending more money on upgrades and tech support than warranted for sub par technology....


Here's the thing--I am paying Cox and TiVo for a service. The service is _not_ being delivered reliably. They are _both_ to be held responsible. As for Scientific Atlanta--I don't pay them or buy anything directly from them. It's Cox and TiVo that should deal with them. For example, if I go to a restaurant and the meal is sub-par, I hold the restaurant responsible. If they turn around and say it's not their fault because their food supplier provided them with sub-par goods--that's not my problem, it's _theirs_ because I'm paying them and not the food supplier for my meal.

I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm getting more and more steamed about this. I've wasted countless hours on the phone with TiVo and Cox, researching the problem online (because neither seemed to know what the problem was and acted like they'd never heard of it before so I had to find my own solution), and waiting around for Cox to come out and switch out the cable cards! They're coming out again on Monday for my 4th new card!

I started out with 2 s-cards and had the awful audio/video synch problem, switched to an Mcard when my research determined that was the fix, and now I'm going to get my 3rd M-card (which I was initially told was not available in Phoenix!) because of the dropped channel problem. Today, for the first time, re-booting did not bring the channels back. I'm ready to scream!


----------



## ElPuerco

saibari said:


> I don't know about the rest of you, but I'm getting more and more steamed about this.


Ditto. My 3rd CC is now not responding to a reboot, and after a couple hours of research it looks like I don't have any analog channels to tune to to try the magical "solution" proposed earlier.

I dread the thought of calling Cox. TiVo can't fix it and will point a finger at Cox. Cox won't know what they're doing, will point the finger at TiVo, and will try to sell me on their DVR. And in 2-4 days I'll have my 4th CC which will last maybe a month. Why even bother?

I'm mad at Cox AND TiVo. Neither one is trying to help me, as a customer. They seem a lot more interested in making each other look bad.


----------



## BrianAZ

aztivo said:


> Brian
> I am also in Chandler and have an antenna in my attic this gives me all the locals in HD as well. so any antenna will work


Do you think I need to put one in my attic or could I get away with a set-top?


----------



## OC7

BrianAZ said:


> Do you think I need to put one in my attic or could I get away with a set-top?


I also live in Chandler. I use a Zenith Silver Sensor OTA indoor antenna (its shaped like an airplane) and it works great. I get good reception on the local digital channels (including HD) just by pointing the antenna at South Mountain. The antenna is sitting in my living room behind my HDTV.


----------



## Shawn95GT

My mother is using a Silver Sensor Out in East Mesa (about 1 mile from where the 202 meets the 60). She lives in a brick house. The TV reception glitches now and then but it works surprisingly well.

One of these days I'll talk her into a rooftop antenna.

We're all going to have to consider something different as most of the channels are going back to VHF after the digital transition .


----------



## BrianAZ

Thanks for the advice everyone. I never would have guessed so many folks were local to me.

It looks like their new model handles VHF as well.


----------



## hddude55

I just spoke to a "second level" CSR at Phoenix Cox and he said he read an internal memo yesterday stating that SA has a software fix they are testing and when testing is complete -- hopefully in about two weeks -- there will be a massive software hit done to all cable cards. It's about time this problem had a concerted effort at a solution. However, I think we heard this same story about a possible fix several weeks ago from some other posters so maybe it's just B.S. and the issue is still a mystery.

All of this scrambling around swapping cards, adjusting signals up/down, running new cable, etc. is nuts. BTW I am now a proud member of the elite club who can no longer get all of my channels back by rebooting. I am going to try two M cards in my series3 next week, but I really don't believe that will be anything more than another two or three week "reprieve" until a true software solution is developed by SA. 

TiVo was recently rated one of the Top 10 technological developments of the past -- I believe -- decade. If that's true, cable cards must be one of the Bottom Ten.


----------



## Roderigo

hddude55 said:


> I am now a proud member of the elite club who can no longer get all of my channels back by rebooting.


I'm guessing that if rebooting isn't bringing the channels back, there's something else going wrong.

I just looked on Tivo's website, and it looks like they have updated their cablecard troubleshooting w/ some pictures of SA Mcards. Maybe that can help figure out what's going wrong.

http://tivosupport2.instancy.com/LaunchContent.aspx?CID=f8f40dc6-5fb6-4ed8-ac41-d8cd0d5c0824

Kinda sounds like the cable company may need to send another hit to your card.


----------



## hddude55

Roderigo said:


> I'm guessing that if rebooting isn't bringing the channels back, there's something else going wrong.
> 
> I just looked on Tivo's website, and it looks like they have updated their cablecard troubleshooting w/ some pictures of SA Mcards. Maybe that can help figure out what's going wrong.
> 
> http://tivosupport2.instancy.com/LaunchContent.aspx?CID=f8f40dc6-5fb6-4ed8-ac41-d8cd0d5c0824
> 
> Kinda sounds like the cable company may need to send another hit to your card.


 The issue at least in the Phoenix market is not so simple to resolve. Did you see in my post the fact that SA has acknowledged there is an underlying software bug they are trying to fix. I did have the cards hit today when the tech was here and it didn't help. That's why I'm getting new cards again on Monday. I think I am just experiencing the same downward spiral others have described whereby the easy fixes eventually stop working and the only "fix" is new cards, realizing it is likely the same trouble sequence will recur. I don't know if you are in the Phoenix market but it is obvious from this lengthy thread that Phoenix area customers have been really hammered by these issues, and they accelerated when the massive Cox infrastructure "upgrades" began here a few months ago.


----------



## ElPuerco

I broke down and got the Cox DVR. I feel dirty.

The Cox tech welcomed my return of the CC and said I was making the "right choice." Ick. After I chewed him out a bit, he told me that internally they are hearing the CC issue will be fixed by SA and TiVo (note how Cox isn't at all to blame in this) in about 45 days.

Until I can see this alleged fix in play and working for a while, my TiVo HD is sitting in my closet. I've lost alot of trust in TiVo over this (and Cox, too, though I had little trust in them to begin with).


----------



## BrianAZ

hddude55 said:


> The issue at least in the Phoenix market is not so simple to resolve. Did you see in my post the fact that SA has acknowledged there is an underlying software bug they are trying to fix. I did have the cards hit today when the tech was here and it didn't help. That's why I'm getting new cards again on Monday. I think I am just experiencing the same downward spiral others have described whereby the easy fixes eventually stop working and the only "fix" is new cards, realizing it is likely the same trouble sequence will recur. I don't know if you are in the Phoenix market but it is obvious from this lengthy thread that Phoenix area customers have been really hammered by these issues, and they accelerated when the massive Cox infrastructure "upgrades" began here a few months ago.


I am in the Phoenix market and can vouch for the "downward spiral". I'm on my second MCard after reboots finally would not fix the first one. When I've spoken to CSRs, they indicated that they have not had any success in fixing the cards remotely and only a swap to a new card resolves the issue.

I hope the rumors of a SA fix are true. I'm ready to pull the trigger on a couple more TivoHDs but have been holding out to see if this gets fixed as well as the MRV speed improving. Until those happen, it's not worth it to me to buy more Tivos.


----------



## BrianAZ

ElPuerco said:


> I broke down and got the Cox DVR. I feel dirty.
> 
> The Cox tech welcomed my return of the CC and said I was making the "right choice." Ick. After I chewed him out a bit, he told me that internally they are hearing the CC issue will be fixed by SA and TiVo (note how Cox isn't at all to blame in this) in about 45 days.
> 
> Until I can see this alleged fix in play and working for a while, my TiVo HD is sitting in my closet. I've lost alot of trust in TiVo over this (and Cox, too, though I had little trust in them to begin with).


I considered this... but in the end, I really am only rebooting my Tivo once a week or so and the MCard seems to last about a month or 45 days before needing to be swapped. For me, that is still a better option than the Cox DVR. The situation has, however, caused me to hold off on buying additional TivoHDs.


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## tagpats

I agree. Cox has given me an HD DVR to use free of service until the CableCard issue is resolved. I have it hooked up on another input, but only plan to use it if I can't get my channels back. So far, the menu reset has worked for me each time, so I haven't had to deal with Cox tech support or rely on their boxes.



BrianAZ said:


> I considered this... but in the end, I really am only rebooting my Tivo once a week or so and the MCard seems to last about a month or 45 days before needing to be swapped. For me, that is still a better option than the Cox DVR. The situation has, however, caused me to hold off on buying additional TivoHDs.


----------



## Pafrican

So now I'm having an issue with one of my s-cards. It looks like it's not paired/binded. I change to an HD channel like 721 (mojo) or 740 (a&E) and the picture shows up for one second then goes to the cablecard screen of "to start service call..." According to the tivo faq and help guides, this looks like an issue of the card not being paired. Oddly enough however, is that when I go to 733 (ESPN) there is no issue and the non-hd cable channels (23+) seem to have no problem also. It's just some of the HD channels.

How does one go about getting a cox hd-dvr for free until they have a fix for these issues? I'd almost be okay going that route temporarily. Though I'm very close to just selling the TivoHD w/ Lifetime service on ebay. This issue is driving me nuts.


----------



## tagpats

I just went into one of their customer service centers and explained that I'm having a CableCard issue that Cox is working on with Scientific Atlanta. I told them that my channels come and go unpredictably and I can't always get them back right away when I lose them.

The Cox staffer member offered me 3 free months of service, which I'm sure I can extend if need be. Just be warned that their billing system is less than perfect and I had to contact them the first month when they charged me for the service. The representative at billing said she would mark her calender for the day of the month that my bill comes out to credit me back after they charge for month 2 and then again in month 3.

Maybe there is a way to make sure you are set up at the outset for free service, but in my case I had to follow-up to get the credit back.

I just can't stand the Cox DVR, so totally bailing on Tivo is not really an option for me yet. Although if I wasn't able to get back my channels predictably, I would probably bag Tivo until I was sure a fix was up and running.



Pafrican said:


> So now I'm having an issue with one of my s-cards. It looks like it's not paired/binded. I change to an HD channel like 721 (mojo) or 740 (a&E) and the picture shows up for one second then goes to the cablecard screen of "to start service call..." According to the tivo faq and help guides, this looks like an issue of the card not being paired. Oddly enough however, is that when I go to 733 (ESPN) there is no issue and the non-hd cable channels (23+) seem to have no problem also. It's just some of the HD channels.
> 
> How does one go about getting a cox hd-dvr for free until they have a fix for these issues? I'd almost be okay going that route temporarily. Though I'm very close to just selling the TivoHD w/ Lifetime service on ebay. This issue is driving me nuts.


----------



## wierdo

jsd2 said:


> I have 2 tvs that have had cable cards, I have tried the Tivo out and returned it; the point being that with the overpriced equipment that is being sold the cable card technology doesn't work properly to full potential and is not reliable yet. I will stick with my rental fee for now so I can enjoy all my HD stations, guide, PPV, and mosaic channels.


Gee, until Cox decided they didn't want to give me new HD channels and took away the "zone" mosaic channels, I had all of those things with my S3 and two S-Cards.


----------



## jebbbz

Pafrican said:


> So now I'm having an issue with one of my s-cards. It looks like it's not paired/binded. ... Oddly enough however, is that when I go to 733 (ESPN) there is no issue and the non-hd cable channels (23+) seem to have no problem also. It's just some of the HD channels.


You might call Cox to see if your cards need "balancing." It sounds like one of yours has lost authorization for a bunch of channels, but not all, while the other works fine. I gather that some cable companies (in some places) keep track of authorizations on a per card basis rather than a per device basis. If the card is receiving some channels but not all it may have an incorrect list of authorized channels. Maybe mentioning "balancing" to a tech person will result in some useful action.


----------



## BrianAZ

tagpats said:


> The Cox staffer member offered me 3 free months of service, which I'm sure I can extend if need be. Just be warned that their billing system is less than perfect and I had to contact them the first month when they charged me for the service. The representative at billing said she would mark her calender for the day of the month that my bill comes out to credit me back after they charge for month 2 and then again in month 3.
> 
> Maybe there is a way to make sure you are set up at the outset for free service, but in my case I had to follow-up to get the credit back.


This is my experience as well. Since I can't view my hockey package on my Tivo until the Tuning Resolver comes out, they gave me free DVR until the end of the season. The tech Atlanta sent out to my house spent (I kid you not) 15 minutes on the phone trying to convince them that I was supposed to be getting this for free. The lady on the other end kept telling him something didn't sound right and he finally had to get a supervisor to do it (mind you *BOTH *of these people worked for Cox).

When I got my next bill, there were all kinds of new charges (it was ridiculous.. they charged me for the DVR, extra outlet fees, a 2nd hockey package, etc). I was working with Executive Relations (after I sent a complaint to the corporate office and our local Az-President) and I *still* had these issues.

When I called the woman, she fixed it.. resulting in $150 credit for me. She promised the next month would be ok, but on my current bill it shows that they removed the wrong hockey package (early bird.. leaving me with the regular one which is like $8 more a month). I'm still trying to get that resolved.

I can't believe they don't have some sort of 0-cost item codes in their system for supervisors. What a screwy system.


----------



## jcaudle

its just like them charging 2 digital gateways for the 2 cards in the S3. At least my S3 doesn't lose channels like my HD with the Mcard.


----------



## strojo

I'm in Connecticut with 2 Tivo's--one HD, one Series 3. Both of them are missing HD channels AND receiving the wrong signal on other channels (for example, I'm watching the CW on what should be Starz). I've got Motorola S-cards in both units. I've tried rebooting, resetting everything and having them send pairing requests. NONE of that has had any effect.

Anyone else on the east coast (or elswehere) having this problem with the Motorola cards?


----------



## esb1981

strojo said:


> I'm in Connecticut with 2 Tivo's--one HD, one Series 3. Both of them are missing HD channels AND receiving the wrong signal on other channels (for example, I'm watching the CW on what should be Starz). I've got Motorola S-cards in both units. I've tried rebooting, resetting everything and having them send pairing requests. NONE of that has had any effect.
> 
> Anyone else on the east coast (or elswehere) having this problem with the Motorola cards?


Strojo, I am having the EXACT same problem and I am in Connecticut. Cox apparently moved a bunch of channels and did not update the mapping on the cablecards. And I have no idea how to get them to fix it. I had a tech out last week, who was a contractor, and the guy said he was sure it was some kind of internal Cox problem, and the contractor company has since been trying to get in touch with Cox to figure out what's going on.


----------



## strojo

esb1981 said:


> Strojo, I am having the EXACT same problem and I am in Connecticut. Cox apparently moved a bunch of channels and did not update the mapping on the cablecards. And I have no idea how to get them to fix it. I had a tech out last week, who was a contractor, and the guy said he was sure it was some kind of internal Cox problem, and the contractor company has since been trying to get in touch with Cox to figure out what's going on.


We're living the same life, because I had a contractor out three weeks ago who said it was on the "head end" and there was nothing he could do about it here. UGH.

I have them scheduled to come out on Friday and will insist that they change out all four cards. The repairing thing has been tried more than 6 times without success.


----------



## j53186

Cox and Scientific Atlanta are in concert with a highly orchestrated denial tactic. Cox's "Live Support" online is THE way to communicate as you can save the communications to a Word file. These are today's (3/4/08) conversations with various agents. Looks as though I'm going to have to notify them each time their cards lock up and I have to restart the system if I want credit. This is unbelievable. Will report back after tomorrows service call. Enjoy the read!

3/4/2008

Original Cox Live Support Communication:
I have two Tivo HD DVRs and have been experiencing ongoing problems with the CableCards for 3+ months. The cards are currently out in both DVRs. On Sunday, 3/2, your customer service acknowledged there is a problem and scheduled a service technician to "replace the cards" yet again. The tech arrives 3/3 with no cards. He was not sure when Cox will receive more cards but will contact us when they have more so we can schedule another service call. Are you kidding? What is the status / timeframe for a CORRECTION for this incompatibility between your Scientific-Atlanta CableCards and Tivo receivers? When will you have CableCards? I am one unhappy customer!

Cox: 
Dear xxxx:

Thank you for your inquiry.

We regret to hear of the problems you have encountered and apologize for any inconvenience.

A technician is scheduled to arrive at your home sometime between the hours of 1 p.m. and 3 p.m. today.

Please reply to this message if we can be of further assistance.

Sincerely,

Karen
E-Care Specialist
Cox Communications  Arizona

Customers Response:
Karen,

You're not addressing my questions. What is the status / timeframe for a CORRECTION for this incompatibility between your Scientific-Atlanta CableCards and Tivo receivers? If you do not have answers please escalate this up the chain to someone who does. I would also appreciate a 90 day cable service credit for the months of problems we have endured. Thank you.

Cox: 
Dear xxxx:

Thank you for your response.

Regretfully, we do not have any specific timeframe at this time. The issue you are inquiring of is directly related to the Scientific Atlanta equipment. For assistance with this issue, please contact Scientific Atlanta directly.

You may do so at:

http://www.scientificatlanta.com/contactus/index.htm

Thank you again for contacting us using our online service options. Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.

Sincerely,

Sue
E-Care Specialist
Cox Communications
www.cox.com

Customers Response:
Sue,

Cox already tried running me through this maze in early February. I contacted Scientific Atlanta on 2/1. Their response of 2/2 is below:

[Ticket#: 20367884] Multistream CableCard / Tivo Issues  2/2/08
Sciatl Support [[email protected]]

There are no confirmed issues with the cable card and Tivos.

Thank you,
Steven A
SciAtl Support

Cox: 
Dear xxxx:

Thank you for your response.

As you were informed, we are unaware of any confirmed issues with CableCARDs and Tivo equipment. We are unable to provide any information regarding this issue. We regret any inconvenience this may cause you.

As previously stated, we have scheduled a technician to arrive at your home sometime between the hours of 1 p.m. and 3 p.m. for assistance with your service.

Thank you again for contacting us using our online service options.

Sincerely,

Alex
E-Care Specialist 
Cox Communications  Arizona

Customers Response:
Alex,

It would seem no one from Cox followed up to advise you would be sending out another technician today between 1-3, so there will not be anyone available for you. Our next available appointment to have you replace the CableCards (again) will be today, 3-6 pm. Please advise. Oh, and you've yet to address the 90 day credit issue. ???

Cox: 
Dear xxxx:

Thank you for your response.

We regret to inform you that we do not have any openings between 3 p.m. and 6 p.m. today.

If you would like to reschedule the appointment for tomorrow, please let us know.

Sincerely,

Karen
E-Care Specialist
Cox Communications  Arizona

Customers Response:
Karen,

And the appointment times you have available are...?

Cox: 
Dear xxxx:

Thank you for your response.

At this time, we have appointments available for tomorrow, 03/05/08, between 1pm to 3pm and from 3pm to 5pm. Would you like to reschedule to any one of these appointments?

Thank you again for contacting us using our online service options.

Sincerely,

Alex
E-Care Specialist
Cox Communications  Arizona

Customers Response:
Alex,

Our next available appointment for you to replace our CableCards (again) is, 3/5/08, 3-5 pm. Will the service tech have CableCards this time?

Cox: 
Dear xxxx:

Thank you for your response.

Please note that the technician will be visiting your home in order to repair your service. We have added notes for your service repair appointment advising the technician to take CableCARDs in the event that the technician determines that they will need to be replaced.

Thank you again for contacting us using our online service options.

Sincerely,

Alex
E-Care Specialist
Cox Communications  Arizona

Customers Response:
Alex,

Thank you for your response.

So, there's a note in the file to bring CableCards this time. Great idea! Hey, how about my 90 day service credit???

Cox:
Dear xxxx:

Thank you for your response.

Our records do not indicate an issue of an ongoing problem with the service you are reporting. We do see a service appointment for a CableCARD issue on 01/29/08. Your service appointment was completed on 01/30/08.

We have applied a credit in the amount of $7.09 for this issue during this time.

Thank you again for contacting us using our online service options. Please let us know if we can be of further assistance.

Sincerely,

Sue
E-Care Specialist
Cox Communications
www.cox.com


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## jcaudle

As far as cable cards and channel loss, it only happens with my Tivo HD, which has an SA M-Card in it. I have never tried 2 SA S-Cards in it because the rats would then charge me 2 gateway fees as well as the cable card rental fees. I am doing that with my Tivo S3 and I never have any problem. I have to use the S3 to record any digital or HD channels since I can count on it to be working. The HD is used only for network HD and analog recordings. What a pain. I have had 4 tivo HD boxes from costco and 3 or 4 M cards. None of this has fixed the problem.


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## strojo

Cox came out today (I live in Connecticut) and thankfully, they had actually fixed the problem of the missing & mixed up channels before they got here. I wasn't here (my wife was), but the guys who came said that they actually went out and bought a Tivo (there's an idea) to see if they could fix the problem.

We'll see how long the channels stick.


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## tagpats

I've been successful using the Menu reset technique to bring my channels back without a reboot, but had a little glitch happen tonight. My channels went out and I followed the steps to reset the card. I've had success doing this 4 times in a row over the past several weeks, but this time it didn't work. The channels remained black and when I started changing channels to see if any were active the Tivo just rebooted itself. Fortunately, the channels all came back after the reboot, but don't know if this means my luck is about to run out.


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## nocturne1

Well, SDV is truly on the way to Orange County.....

Finally got some announcement from Cox about SDV and Cablecards. Basically, they are saying that SDV is going live on 4/8, and a digital STB will be required to see the following channels:

- Pay per view channels
- Paquete Latino Tier
- Foreign Language Channels - TV-5, ART, RAE, ZEE TV, The Filipino Channel, TV Japan, TV Asia, and CTI Zhong Tian
- The following digital cable channels - CCTV-9, California Channel, CMT Pure Country, CSPAN2, CSPAN3, Fine Living, Fit TV, Fox Reality, Fuel, FUSE, Game Show Network, G4TechTV, HRTV, Jewelry TV, Leased Access (109), Shop NBC, TVG, and WeatherScan Local.

It also states that new channels added to Digital and HD may not be available to cablecard customers. They are offering a digital or HD receiver for $1.99 a month for the first year (normally $5.25/mo). This offer is only good through 6/30/08.

No mention of any tuning resolver, although I doubt that they'd ever put it in a mass-mailer like this anyways.


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## moyekj

nocturne1 said:


> Well, SDV is truly on the way to Orange County.....
> 
> Finally got some announcement from Cox about SDV and Cablecards. Basically, they are saying that SDV is going live on 4/8, and a digital STB will be required to see the following channels:
> 
> - Pay per view channels
> - Paquete Latino Tier
> - Foreign Language Channels - TV-5, ART, RAE, ZEE TV, The Filipino Channel, TV Japan, TV Asia, and CTI Zhong Tian
> - The following digital cable channels - CCTV-9, California Channel, CMT Pure Country, CSPAN2, CSPAN3, Fine Living, Fit TV, Fox Reality, Fuel, FUSE, Game Show Network, G4TechTV, HRTV, Jewelry TV, Leased Access (109), Shop NBC, TVG, and WeatherScan Local.
> 
> It also states that new channels added to Digital and HD may not be available to cablecard customers. They are offering a digital or HD receiver for $1.99 a month for the first year (normally $5.25/mo). This offer is only good through 6/30/08.
> 
> No mention of any tuning resolver, although I doubt that they'd ever put it in a mass-mailer like this anyways.


 They failed to list the 9 HD channels already not available to us even before SDV deployment... However, I'm very glad to see that the other channels being selected for SDV are the less popular ones, which makes sense to maximize the efficacy of SDV anyway. Also good to see PPV in that bundle.


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## JcarD

Today Cox came and swapped out my cable cards in my Series 3. The tech said that this week in Phoenix they were told that the cable card failures are due to delayed firmware upgrades from TIVO that take 3-4 weeks to complete once the CCs are installed. That's why the cards must be changed every few weeks. Don't know if I'm buying the explanation but that's what he said.


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## hddude55

JcarD said:


> Today Cox came and swapped out my cable cards in my Series 3. The tech said that this week in Phoenix they were told that the cable card failures are due to delayed firmware upgrades from TIVO that take 3-4 weeks to complete once the CCs are installed. That's why the cards must be changed every few weeks. Don't know if I'm buying the explanation but that's what he said.


That explanation sounds a bit incomplete, but it certainly is true that the "new" cards do seem to work for a few weeks. I'm also in the Phoenix area and the stories I've been told have been numerous, the most recent story being two weeks ago. I talked to a "second level" Cox Phoenix supervisor and he said he had read a tech advisory the day before stating that SA was working on a software fix that would hopefully be available in a few weeks and likely then would be beamed to all installed cards.

FYI I have a series3 and am now on my second set of two multi-stream cards, as of yesterday. For those of you with the newer, multi-steam card capable TiVo HD models you probably wonder why I am using multi-stream cards in a series3 when the series3 was designed to use two single-stream cards only. The reason is some people have theorized that the software problem with SA cards is more prevalent as it applies to single-stream cards. My experience and the experience of others as reported here suggest that theory may be hogwash.

The tech yesterday suggested doing what some others here have done: Ask COx to provide a free or cheap HD DVR service for two or three months until a fix can be implemented. If no fix happens within a reasonable amount of time, then I suppose I can consider other choices like dumping the TiVo on Ebay.


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## TheNumberSix

I had a chance to chat with a Senior Cox Technician at a social event a few weeks ago. I mentioned to him how nice my CableCards were working. (I have an S3 with 2 S-Cards and I've never had any problems at all.) He suggested that for best performance, I should make sure that both S-Cards are running the 1.49.3 firmware. There were known issues relating to the .2 firmware. (Dropped channels, specifically)

I checked my TiVo and one card had the .3 and the other had the .2 firmware. They sent a firmware upgrade to my card, but it wouldn't upgrade.

I asked them to get me a new S-Card with .49.3 on it and they did.

So far it's been two months with no problems. I've been very happy with the service.


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## JimRI

I'm having the same channel mapping issues here in RI. I noticed it when I was trying to record "Planet Terror" and "Death Proof" on Starz HD last night. I woke up this morning and neither had recorded. I went to the Starz HD channel and it was black (channel 723). I then flipped around and found that it was on channel 746, which it supposed to be TLC HD. Cinemax HD is supposed to be on channel 722, but it's now on 745 (which was Discovery HD). Now TLC HD is on 722 where Cinemax HD used to be. The only channel that I cannot find is Discovery HD...which is a huge bummer. Strojo, you said that Cox fixed the problem before they got to your house. So, will a phone call into Cox resolve this? esb1981, any luck with your problems? Being in RI, I too am using 2 single-stream Motorola cards.


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## Pafrican

So I called Cox about the issue I was having with a few of my HD channels (mojo, tnt, NOT espn) where the picture shows for a second then it gives me the cablecard screen to call Cox. The tech said, "it's an going going issue and we are looking into it. for both cable boxes and cable cards." I wanted to know how long it's been going on (mine has been a week i think... don't remember when first posted it). He said a few hours but for some a few days. Wanted to know how I can get it fixed and if we could make sure the card was paired properly. "We are working on it, and it will be fixed when we are done." Wow smart ass, thanks. Is there any estimate on when it will be fixed? "It will be fixed once we are done working on it." Will I be credited on my bill for the outage. "Sure, you can get a few cents off your bill. Call billing when the issue is resolved."

Quite the customer service we receive with Cox. It's been two weeks though and with the two s-cards I haven't had any mass channel dropping out. so that's good.


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## esb1981

JimRI, my issues have been fixed as well. Unfortunately I can't say what they did to fix it. My feeling all along was that after Cox re-mapped some channels the head-end was not properly sending the new channel information to the cablecards. It took working with the lead tech for over a month before it got fixed, and unfortunately I'm not sure what they did. I knew the channels were mapped wrong because when I would check Tivo diagnostics on a missing channel it would give me one frequency (i.e., 465 MHz), but if I asked someone else who has a Motorola box what the frequency is on their diagnostics, they would tell me something else, like 851 MHz.


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## tagpats

I lost my channels again and they have gone from going out about every 5or 6 days to every 2 or 3. The menu reset did not work because although my channels are out, the card did not fail when I accessed the menu, so I could not reset it.

Does anyone know a way to make it fail so that it will reset itself?

I tried rebooting and it won't work either. So now I'm left with calling customer service to repair or requesting another M card and seeing if that does any good.



tagpats said:


> I've been successful using the Menu reset technique to bring my channels back without a reboot, but had a little glitch happen tonight. My channels went out and I followed the steps to reset the card. I've had success doing this 4 times in a row over the past several weeks, but this time it didn't work. The channels remained black and when I started changing channels to see if any were active the Tivo just rebooted itself. Fortunately, the channels all came back after the reboot, but don't know if this means my luck is about to run out.


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## BrianAZ

I read that someone had success with requesting that Cox "send a hit" to the cards. Every time I've called, they tell me there's nothing they can do but send a truck.. won't even try. Best of luck to you.


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## tagpats

Thanks. I'll give them a call to see what I can do. BrianAZ, Are you using the Cox DVR now full-time or are you bouncing back and forth depending on how your CableCard is cooperating? How many times have you had to swap out your card?


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## BrianAZ

tagpats said:


> Thanks. I'll give them a call to see what I can do. BrianAZ, Are you using the Cox DVR now full-time or are you bouncing back and forth depending on how your CableCard is cooperating? How many times have you had to swap out your card?


I had to swap out once so far... about a month after they installed the MCard. It's been maybe 2 1/2 weeks since then and I'm rebooting probably once every 7-10 days. I use the free CoxDVR to watch/record NHL Center Ice. I may use it the next time I have to swap the card, but since you still get the network stations and I have a 500GB eSATA drive, I think I will end up watching a bunch of recorded content for a day or so until they can get out here.


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## Rolow

tagpats said:


> I lost my channels again and they have gone from going out about every 5or 6 days to every 2 or 3. The menu reset did not work because although my channels are out, the card did not fail when I accessed the menu, so I could not reset it.
> 
> Does anyone know a way to make it fail so that it will reset itself?
> 
> I tried rebooting and it won't work either. So now I'm left with calling customer service to repair or requesting another M card and seeing if that does any good.


When you do the reset you go to > SA CableCard CA Screen then clear out even thou it does not fail and do the same thing down the list
>SA CableCARD/host id clear out
>SA CableCARD ip service clear out
>SA CableCARD davic clear out
go thru them all then back to the top > SA CableCard CA Screen and it will FAIL

I'v had that work once then the second time it did not work so I did a hard reboot then a call to cox and it came back with a hit. The third time the above worked for me again. So if it keep on schedule Ill need to call cox net time i loose channels. I don't mind calling If it means i don't have to wait for a truck roll.

P.S. I wish we had HDnet here in Phoenix. I want to see the shuttle launch tonight.


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## tagpats

Appreciate the feedback.



BrianAZ said:


> I had to swap out once so far... about a month after they installed the MCard. It's been maybe 2 1/2 weeks since then and I'm rebooting probably once every 7-10 days. I use the free CoxDVR to watch/record NHL Center Ice. I may use it the next time I have to swap the card, but since you still get the network stations and I have a 500GB eSATA drive, I think I will end up watching a bunch of recorded content for a day or so until they can get out here.


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## tagpats

Thanks for the tip. I'll give it a try.



Rolow said:


> When you do the reset you go to > SA CableCard CA Screen then clear out even thou it does not fail and do the same thing down the list
> >SA CableCARD/host id clear out
> >SA CableCARD ip service clear out
> >SA CableCARD davic clear out
> go thru them all then back to the top > SA CableCard CA Screen and it will FAIL
> 
> I'v had that work once then the second time it did not work so I did a hard reboot then a call to cox and it came back with a hit. The third time the above worked for me again. So if it keep on schedule Ill need to call cox net time i loose channels. I don't mind calling If it means i don't have to wait for a truck roll.
> 
> P.S. I wish we had HDnet here in Phoenix. I want to see the shuttle launch tonight.


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## Kershek

Wow, this is a long thread  I saw the TiVoHD on sale at woot.com the other day and jumped on it before they sold out, and then I started reading this thread and was surprised to see all the problems with the cablecards here in Phoenix (east Mesa). Now I'm wondering if I made a mistake in my purchase...

Anyways, I called Cox to come out and install the m-card and they said it was a $99 service charge to do that.

$99?? Is that really true? I read back a few pages and saw how it could be much cheaper. Is it really as simple as calling back and finding another sales person?

In a related question, should I leave the TiVoHD in the box and wait to see these problems resolve? I currently use their DVR for HD and a second digital box connected to a Series 2 TiVo and have no channel problems. I really want to use the TiVoHD, of course, but I'm worried I will be much worse off.


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## tagpats

Until recently, I've been a firm believer in a broken Tivo is still better than a Cox DVR, but I finally relented and reconnected the Cox DVR and turned off the HD Tivo until the tech gets here in a few days.

You may get lucky, but I suspect you'll be playing the same game we all are in trying to get channels back after they drop out on you.

I'm trying one more M card in the hope that a fix is on the horizon, but if that does not work or hold up, I will be talking with Tivo about suspending my account until a legit fix has happened. Unless Cox let's me ride with this free DVR indefinitely, I'm not going to pay Tivo and Cox. I would hope that Tivo will let me withhold payment until the fix happens, but who knows.

If you don't care about the 1 year cost for service, just roll the dice. But if that upfront service cost or monthly fee is going to stretch your cable budget, then I would follow this thread for good news and keep it in the box.

So, are you using a splitter to connect your Cox coaxial to your Cox HD DVR and the Cox set-top box? Is it split again to give you 2 tuners on your Series 2 Tivo or do you just use 1 input since you've got the other two on the HD DVR?

I wasn't sure if using a splitter would degrade the signal and the HD picture because I was contemplating getting an HD set top box so that I could view all the Switched Digital HD channels that have been rolled out that the CableCard won't let me access.



Kershek said:


> Wow, this is a long thread  I saw the TiVoHD on sale at woot.com the other day and jumped on it before they sold out, and then I started reading this thread and was surprised to see all the problems with the cablecards here in Phoenix (east Mesa). Now I'm wondering if I made a mistake in my purchase...
> 
> Anyways, I called Cox to come out and install the m-card and they said it was a $99 service charge to do that.
> 
> $99?? Is that really true? I read back a few pages and saw how it could be much cheaper. Is it really as simple as calling back and finding another sales person?
> 
> In a related question, should I leave the TiVoHD in the box and wait to see these problems resolve? I currently use their DVR for HD and a second digital box connected to a Series 2 TiVo and have no channel problems. I really want to use the TiVoHD, of course, but I'm worried I will be much worse off.


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## jebbbz

Kershek said:


> Wow, this is a long thread  ...
> 
> Anyways, I called Cox to come out and install the m-card and they said it was a $99 service charge to do that.
> 
> $99?? Is that really true? I read back a few pages and saw how it could be much cheaper. Is it really as simple as calling back and finding another sales person?


Maybe. I was quoted $15.00, $35.00, $50.00 and $65.00. Two customer service reps, Nate on January 23 and Doug on January 24, quoted me $50.00 ($35.00 for a truck roll and $15.00 to install a single cablecard) but I won't know what the charge really is until the bill arrives and I argue with their billing department for a break. Some CSRs seem to think the installation and monthly charges are the same for one MCard as for two SCards.

Do you already have digital cable? They may be adding installation charges somewhat haphazardly.

Update: Tracked down the bill (I am on auto-pay) and Nate and Doug were right: $50.00 total and I am only being billed for a single cabelcard, $2.00/month.


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## Kershek

tagpats said:


> So, are you using a splitter to connect your Cox coaxial to your Cox HD DVR and the Cox set-top box? Is it split again to give you 2 tuners on your Series 2 Tivo or do you just use 1 input since you've got the other two on the HD DVR?
> 
> I wasn't sure if using a splitter would degrade the signal and the HD picture because I was contemplating getting an HD set top box so that I could view all the Switched Digital HD channels that have been rolled out that the CableCard won't let me access.


Thanks for the response. Yes, I'm using a splitter that a Cox tech gave me to split the incoming signal between the Scientific Atlanta HD DVR and the digital cable box connected to the TiVo Series 2. The HD picture is great, so I don't think it's degrading the signal. Perhaps my signal strength is really good to begin with.

I used to have the TiVo downstream from the HD DVR, but I got sick of the HD DVR changing channels in the middle of TiVo shows  So I gave it its own digital cable box and covered the front of the cable box with cloth so it doesn't change channels when I aim it at the HD DVR.

I was considering going with the TiVo HD and seeing if I had problems, but keeping the Scientific Atlanta HD DVR until I was confident the TiVo HD was performing properly; that way I had a backout. But the cost for TiVo and the Cox DVR would continue to build as I wait.


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## Kershek

jebbbz said:


> Maybe. I was quoted $15.00, $35.00, $50.00 and $65.00. Two customer service reps, Nate on January 23 and Doug on January 24, quoted me $50.00 ($35.00 for a truck roll and $15.00 to install a single cablecard) but I won't know what the charge really is until the bill arrives and I argue with their billing department for a break. Some CSRs seem to think the installation and monthly charges are the same for one MCard as for two SCards.
> 
> Do yoa already have digital cable? They may be adding installation charges somewhat haphazardly.


Yes, I already have digital cable and HD service.

Those prices are so different from each other I wonder if they even know what they are supposed to charge, or if they are just charging what they think they can get away with at the time.

I was also thinking perhaps if I told them to come out to take back their HD DVR (which wouldn't be a service fee) and tied that to a cableCARD installation, would I not get a service fee at all? But then again, if the TiVo HD doesn't work, then I'm out of service.


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## tagpats

Thanks for the info. I just picked up a splitter and it works perfectly. I don't notice any signal degradation at all. You're thinking about doing exactly what I'm doing, which is having the Tivo Hd and the Cox DVR hooked up on two different inputs and bouncing back and forth. As along as I can keep the DVR for free, I'll probably keep it this way, but having to double dip and pay for both I'm not too keen on for the long run.

Just a heads up that I've seen mention of this loss of channel problme on the Tivo website going back to November of 2007. Doesn't give me a lot of confidence that the problem will be resolved as quickly as we hope.

In terms of install price. I was billed $39.99 because they thought they were installing 2 S cards. Turns out they had M cards and credited me back the $19.99. Don't know why the price differs by region, but Northern Virginia is $20 to install. If you look at their website, you can find a detailed list of charges for every service. CableCard installation is listed on it. It's a set price, so shouldn't be so variable. Find that on their web site and challenge them if they try to jack the price. Good luck.



Kershek said:


> Thanks for the response. Yes, I'm using a splitter that a Cox tech gave me to split the incoming signal between the Scientific Atlanta HD DVR and the digital cable box connected to the TiVo Series 2. The HD picture is great, so I don't think it's degrading the signal. Perhaps my signal strength is really good to begin with.
> 
> I used to have the TiVo downstream from the HD DVR, but I got sick of the HD DVR changing channels in the middle of TiVo shows  So I gave it its own digital cable box and covered the front of the cable box with cloth so it doesn't change channels when I aim it at the HD DVR.
> 
> I was considering going with the TiVo HD and seeing if I had problems, but keeping the Scientific Atlanta HD DVR until I was confident the TiVo HD was performing properly; that way I had a backout. But the cost for TiVo and the Cox DVR would continue to build as I wait.


----------



## jebbbz

Kershek said:


> Those prices are so different from each other I wonder if they even know what they are supposed to charge, or if they are just charging what they think they can get away with at the time.


Well, I think it is service reps who almost never get asked about cablecards. There aren't many of us who ask for them (We few, we happy few...). The CSR who said $15.00 was forgetting the truck roll. The one who said $35.00 was quoting the truck roll but forgetting the tech would actully do something once he got here. And the one who said $65.00 was assuming a single MCard was the same cost to install as two SCards, so $15.00+$15.00+$35.00=$65.00.

Demand they do it for $50.00 and tell them Nate (and Doug) sent you.


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## hddude55

Kershek said:


> ....
> 
> In a related question, should I leave the TiVoHD in the box and wait to see these problems resolve? I currently use their DVR for HD and a second digital box connected to a Series 2 TiVo and have no channel problems. I really want to use the TiVoHD, of course, but I'm worried I will be much worse off.


 I live nearby in Gilbert. This would be a no-brainer if I was in your shoes. The TiVo would be returned to the seller for a refund.


----------



## Bodie

JimRI said:


> I'm having the same channel mapping issues here in RI. I noticed it when I was trying to record "Planet Terror" and "Death Proof" on Starz HD last night. I woke up this morning and neither had recorded. I went to the Starz HD channel and it was black (channel 723). I then flipped around and found that it was on channel 746, which it supposed to be TLC HD. Cinemax HD is supposed to be on channel 722, but it's now on 745 (which was Discovery HD). Now TLC HD is on 722 where Cinemax HD used to be. The only channel that I cannot find is Discovery HD...which is a huge bummer. Strojo, you said that Cox fixed the problem before they got to your house. So, will a phone call into Cox resolve this? esb1981, any luck with your problems? Being in RI, I too am using 2 single-stream Motorola cards.


Jim,

I've been "missing" DSCHD, TLCHD and TRVHD for a week (I hear NESNHD may be out too, I haven't checked it though). A tech came out and managed to hose-up one card completely (in the TV not the TiVo) and a supervisor will be out tomorrow. I'll post any results.


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## Kershek

hddude55 said:


> I live nearby in Gilbert. This would be a no-brainer if I was in your shoes. The TiVo would be returned to the seller for a refund.


Unfortunately, I got it from woot, so there's no returning it. However, based on all the great feedback in this thread, I have decided to take a different approach. I still want to see how the TiVo will do, but I no longer have the confidence that it will perform well until they fix the cableCARD issue. So, I will proceed with caution by keeping my existing home system intact and hooking up the TiVo (which arrives today) to another system and then judge its reliability before dropping the Cox DVR. That will mean a little more cost for me (TiVo monthly charge and Cox DVR rental), but I guess that's the price I pay for early adopting. Though by now I thought waiting a year before adopting would have been enough time to get the bugs out 

Tomorrow, Cox will roll their truck out and install the CableCARDS. I will use the instructions provided here to try to get a smooth installation and will report my progress.


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## JimRI

Bodie said:


> Jim,
> 
> I've been "missing" DSCHD, TLCHD and TRVHD for a week (I hear NESNHD may be out too, I haven't checked it though). A tech came out and managed to hose-up one card completely (in the TV not the TiVo) and a supervisor will be out tomorrow. I'll post any results.


Hey Bodie,

Another forum member in RI, Gil, is having the same exact problem. So far, I am only having problems with 5 HD channels: 
722 (Cinemax HD/ now TLC HD)
723 (Starz HD/ now black)
725 (NESN HD/now black)
745 (Discovery HD/ now Cinemax HD)
746 (TLC HD/ now Starz HD)

This morning, I called the Cox field supervisor that Gil was dealing with and he said that another TiVo user in Cranston is having the same problems on the same channels. He went on to say that Cox made some frequency changes on a few channels last week and that it is most likely the root of the problems. So basically, it's a Cox headend problem, not a cable card/TiVo problem. At the time I called him, he was compiling a list of customers with the same issues so that he could send an e-mail to the higher-ups who control the channel maps. Hopefully, this will all get resolved soon. Keep us posted.


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## mimyc

QUOTE=Kershek
_"Unfortunately, I got it from woot, so there's no returning it."_

Same here, mine also arrived today and I'm planning on an install next week. I am also planning on redundancy. I'm brand new to HDTV so don't feel a need to "maintain" my current standard, so I'll just be running two Tivos for a while, the S2 in the bedroom will be my safety net while we see how the HD performs.

I'll update with any info that might be found useful. In Mesa, AZ for the record, so this could be a fun ride.


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## hddude55

mimyc said:


> QUOTE=Kershek
> _"Unfortunately, I got it from woot, so there's no returning it."_
> 
> Same here, mine also arrived today and I'm planning on an install next week. I am also planning on redundancy. I'm brand new to HDTV so don't feel a need to "maintain" my current standard, so I'll just be running two Tivos for a while, the S2 in the bedroom will be my safety net while we see how the HD performs.
> 
> I'll update with any info that might be found useful. In Mesa, AZ for the record, so this could be a fun ride.


 You've got that right. I'm next door in Gilbert and now have two multi-stream cards in my "old" series3 model designed to run with two single stream cards. Others thought the single stream cards were more prone to channel drops.

Not. This week, I have had to reboot twice to get back lost channels from Cable Card 1. I'm not going to even call Cox again for a few weeks to give them time to implement a solution, which supposedly is being developed.


----------



## Kershek

Successful install!

I have to say that the wealth of information here is great. I was armed with lots of printouts and information and, although I didn't need them in this instance, I was expecting the worst and was glad I was prepared all the same.

I'm in East Mesa. The Cox installer came out and was very courteous and said he had done several cableCARD installs in the past. This was a good sign. Surprisingly enough, he said that TVs are more of a pain to get working than the TiVos. He was armed with two M-cards and was ready to go.

I told him I had the TiVoHD's software all updated and he looked relieved, as he said some people just pull it out of the box when he gets there, which makes for a long on-site call. After plugging in the card, it went through a firmware update, which took 15-20 minutes. Then he called in the serial number. I had the TiVo look for channels, but it took another 10-15 minutes for that to happen. Based on other posts I've read, I knew to be patient and not muck around with the system, so we chatted a bit.

I asked him about SDV and he said he knew what it was, but that it wasn't planned on being implemented just yet. He guessed it would be at least a year before SDV was in this area. He said they (the techs) would expect to know about it a good amount in advance. He said that SDV helps bandwidth-strained areas and we have a good amount of open bandwidth in the infrastructure right now. He also said we're getting 7 new HD channels this Sunday, March 16th, and that the cableCARD should pick it up fine.

I told him I got the TiVoHD from woot.com and told him about the site. He was interested enough that he wrote the name of the site down. I asked him when he thought Sci Fi HD would be in the area and he said he didn't know, but he was looking forward to it as well. He came across to me like a fellow techie, which was cool.

After the channels came in, I tried tuning a few with no difficulty. At that point, I was satisfied that we were good to go. I had it go through guide setup and he went on his way, less than an hour after he arrived. He gave me his card and said he would be in the area tomorrow if I run across any problems. I have to say this was the nicest Cox guy I've talked to, as I've had lots of issues with them in the past. 

I'm going to keep the TiVoHD in the computer room for a week or two to make sure it doesn't lose channels or do anything else that it shouldn't.

Hey mimyc, here's hoping your install was as smooth as mine!


----------



## Bodie

JimRI said:


> Hey Bodie,
> 
> Another forum member in RI, Gil, is having the same exact problem. So far, I am only having problems with 5 HD channels:
> 722 (Cinemax HD/ now TLC HD)
> 723 (Starz HD/ now black)
> 725 (NESN HD/now black)
> 745 (Discovery HD/ now Cinemax HD)
> 746 (TLC HD/ now Starz HD)


Yeah, I posted on the other thread he started. I have the same channel mixup, now on three cards. The sup that was out today chenged out the one in the TV and said it was a bad card. He didn't even try to swap the ones in the Tivo since I'd talked to him and knew it was a head-end issue. Problem was, he was supposed to be there at 2 and actually showed up just after one. My wife called since she didn't know anything about it and I talked to him on the phone. He was just pulling away by the time I got here.

Um, Hellooooooo, if swapping the card in the TV fixed the problem (regardless of the cause), wouldn't you want to do that in the Tivo as well rather than leave a customer missing channels until they can fix whatever is wrong on the other end. I can see if it was ALL cable cards, but two of mine were fine before he got here (one after a re-hit) and a third is now OK too...


----------



## OneEyedBartender

Hi Guys,

This thread is quite long so I didnt get to read through it all, but i have 2 single stream cards from Cox in Phx and on any non-HD channel the show automically fast forwards the picture but not the sound. It does this multiple times an episode and the only way to fix it is to hit the go back 8 second button. 

Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks!!


----------



## navman

Not any help but I have had the exact same symptoms in Gilbert.


----------



## esb1981

Every time I lose power for any length of time, both of my Motorola cablecards become unpaired. And then every time, I call Cox customer service, they say they are pairing them, send a signal and it fails to pair the cards. Every time, they send a tech out, I have to take time off work, the tech comes, calls his dispatch who sends a signal out that PAIRS THE CARDS. Why, oh why, can't they pair the cards when I call them? Why do I have to keep having a tech come out, wasting my time? Why is it that other people can get cards paired with Cox phone tech support?


----------



## Kershek

I recommend putting a UPS on the TiVo so it doesn't lose power.


----------



## esb1981

Thanks. Do you think the problem is the loss of power or the power surge? Because a few times of lost power briefly and have no problem.


----------



## Shawn95GT

Kershek said:


> He also said we're getting 7 new HD channels this Sunday, March 16th, and that the cableCARD should pick it up fine.


So, can you see the channels? They showed up in my guide but i can't tune 'em . Hurray SDV :down::down::down:

714 Is supposed to be Discover HD Theater - black screen
720 SCIHD (Sci-fi? discovey science?) I don't know what it is, but all I get is black screen
723 - DSCHD (Discovery HD) - I'm getting picture but the guide doesn't match the progamming, It might be HDTheater.
744 GOLFVS - black screen - 'channel not available'
746 FOODHD - black screen
757 APLHD (no idea what this is) - black screen
752 HSTRYHD - black screen

I'm gonna re-boot and see if it fixes anything...


----------



## craigo

Shawn95GT said:


> So, can you see the channels? They showed up in my guide but i can't tune 'em . Hurray SDV :down::down::down:
> I'm gonna re-boot and see if it fixes anything...


According to the paper last week, the new channels aren't supposed to go "live" until Tuesday.


----------



## Shawn95GT

Reboot solved nothing.

My guess right now is that either they are SDV or Tivo updated the lineup before Cox switched the channels on.

This is for Cox Metro Phoenix:

714 (not working) - Discovery HD Theater
720 (not working) - Science Channel HD
723 (Showing discovery HD Theater) - Discovery Channel HD
744 (not working) VSHD / Golf Channel HD
746 (not working) - Food Network HD
757 (not working) - Animal Planet HD
762 (not working) - The history Channel HD


----------



## Shawn95GT

craigo said:


> According to the paper last week, the new channels aren't supposed to go "live" until Tuesday.


you're right I umped the gun when they showed up in the lineup. Says March 18 here:

http://www.cox.com/arizona/cable_hd.asp


----------



## Kershek

No, I can't change to the channels, either, and the channels that "moved" according to TiVo are still in their old spaces.

I wouldn't blame SDV if the Cox guy who told me it's not being rolled out until at least next year is correct.

Let's hope they come in on March 18th.


----------



## Shawn95GT

Well, there is something up or we'd have been able to tune TBSHD by now.

I hope we do get the new channels, but I'm not optimistic.


----------



## Kershek

I checked my Cox HD DVR and it also doesn't have the new channels. I think TiVo jumped the gun on the channel lineup change.


----------



## Rolow

Turned on my tivo to day in Peoria to see the updated channel guide. So I came here to check up on what the deal was. I was assuming it was SDV. Then I noticed the link to the fact the channels would not go live till Mach 18th. So i gave cox a call and told the CSR I had a cable card and was wondering if I would have acsses to the new HD channels. He put me on hold when he came back on the line he said yes I will be able to get all 7 HD channels with my CC. I'll cross my fingers and hope.


----------



## Kershek

Thanks for calling with the verification, Rolow.


----------



## eochs

I just don't believe anybody at Cox that would actually answer a phone... Historically the CSR's do not have the knowledge that they should regarding these matters... That being said, my fingers are crossed as well that the channels actually show up tomorrow...


----------



## BrianAZ

OneEyedBartender said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> This thread is quite long so I didnt get to read through it all, but i have 2 single stream cards from Cox in Phx and on any non-HD channel the show automically fast forwards the picture but not the sound. It does this multiple times an episode and the only way to fix it is to hit the go back 8 second button.
> 
> Any help is greatly appreciated. Thanks!!





navman said:


> Not any help but I have had the exact same symptoms in Gilbert.


I had this issue with my TivoHD. The solution (for me) was to move to a single MCard. Beware though, it has it's own problem. You will lose most of your channels about once a week or so and eventually need to swap out the card with a new one (I'm on my second swap in 2 months). For me, this is a much better issue in terms of how it impacts me. When the channels are not down, they are working perfectly.


----------



## Pafrican

In regards to the new HD channels:

I called yesterday to get one of my s-cards paired properly (some HD channels, not ESPNHD though, were giving me one second of picture and then cablecard screen). It was never paired properly (wrong HostID) and after the phone tech fixed it I asked about the new HD channels. She said (and I know they don't always know) that I'll probably just need to call to have a fresh hit sent to the cards to open up those channels once they go live (so tomorrow).

That's good news.


----------



## DonnoC

Hello Everyone - 

Brand new Tivo S3 owner (Tivo HD) in Fairfax, VA, just had Cox out today to "install" the Cable Card. I got a single card with a dual tuner, I gather from this thread it is called an "M" card. 

It seems to be working okay for me, but it's only been a matter of hours. The biggest gripe I have so far is that there are now 13 channels I do not have access to via the CableCARD that I did via the Cox DVR. Those are 708, 711, 718, 722, 723, 724, 725, 727, 728, 729, 730, 731, and 732. I'm told these are "Switched Digital Channels" and are therefore not available on the CableCARD. 

Has anyone else been told this about these channels? Some of them I'm most upset about, Discovery HD (727), and History HD (728). I'm hopeful that eventually these will be available.


----------



## Kershek

Sorry to hear that, DonnoC. There is an SDV FAQ that is sticked in this forum. Take a look at it and it will answer all your SDV questions, including how you will be able to eventually see those channels with your TiVo.

Here's the direct link:
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=357703


----------



## PWF

I just got off the phone with Cox in Phoenix. When I said I wanted a cable card, he said they don't sell them any more. I love the different answers you get when talking to sales. After I mentioned they have to by law, then he started telling me about how I will not get all the new channels they are adding. I told him about SDV, and he said I guess you know more about this that I do. I have to wonder if these guys get any training whatsoever. So he quoted me $50 for the install and $4.99 a month. $50 to plug a card in a slot...... 

Ah well, I should be up and running Wednesday.


----------



## Bodie

PWF said:


> $50 to plug a card in a slot......


... and to read some numbers into the phone.


----------



## KanuK

COX Cleveland charges $2.00/month per card and $20 per card for installation. I subscribe to basic cable + digital cable + HBO ($40/month).


----------



## jonginear

I tried to get the 8 new HD channels this morning and got the "channel not available"message on a blank screen. I restarted my series 3 with 2 S cards with same result. Discouraged, I went to find a phone to call Cox and by the time I got back to the TV with phone in hand (5 min) I was receiving one of the channels. I proceeded to try them all and they were all slow to tune in the first time, but eventually I got them all except for the Golf channel. I went to my other Series 3 and tried the channels without the restart and as before it took a while the first time each channel was tuned in but they all worked except for the golf channel. Looks like we got lucky in Phoenix with the addition of new channels and cable cards not being blocked because of the coming SDV changeover.


----------



## Kershek

Well, I got the new channels on the Cox DVR but they aren't coming in on the TiVoHD with 1 M-card. I made a service call and they said they would send a hit to the card. I will have to check tonight when I get home.


----------



## Shawn95GT

Mine are working. The only channel didn't tune in was the Golf one but they all tuned slow. I didn't wait to see if the VSGOLF came up. I'll try later on. It could be that there is nothing on too - lol.


----------



## Kershek

Hmm, maybe I shouldn't have had them send a hit to the card.... I guess that's what I get for being proactive


----------



## Supermurph

Shawn95GT said:


> Mine are working. The only channel didn't tune in was the Golf one but they all tuned slow. I didn't wait to see if the VSGOLF came up. I'll try later on. It could be that there is nothing on too - lol.


I'm also Cox in Phx with a single M-card. I got home tonight and still had the black screen, but restarted my Tivo and then got all of the new HD channels except Golf/Vs like a few others. I'm pretty sure Golf/Vs is part of the sports tier so you shouldn't get it unless you pay for the tier. I don't pay for it so it looks like I'm set. Nice!


----------



## Kershek

I restarted as well, and all the channels came in. It did take at least 5 seconds to tune in at first, and then it was normal.


----------



## Lupin

Well, my digital channels just went out on me. Im going to call when jericho gets done recording to get them to send a hit to see if it works after that. First time since Saturday its done this. Hopefully this isnt a sign of the things to come.


----------



## BrianAZ

rcobourn said:


> Still no problems more than a week after this balancing business. Encouraging. Takes a supervisor of some sort to do it, but if you are having problems, the baseline CSRs seem to understand what it means to "balance my account" and know who to connect you with.


I've been waiting for my reboots to stop working again so I could give this a try and guess what... *IT WORKS*. When the tech came out, he called in and requested:


Hits to all equipment in the house
Rebalancing of the account

Maybe 2 minutes after he made his request, everything popped back on without swapping the card! I have no idea what either of these actually do (sounds like some sort of reset) but it worked. I've been corresponding with a woman in Cox's Executive Relations dept on the issue and I've relayed my story to her in hopes that they can add this to their CSR knowledgebase so they will try it when folks call in versus saying they can't do anything and they have to roll a truck (which involves us waiting a couple days).

Thanks again for your information. This problem is a *lot* easier to tolerate if I know I can make a quick phonecall to fix it when a reboot will not.

:up::up::up:


----------



## PWF

Ok, my system is up and running. The cable tech was a contractor, but he seemed to know what he was doing and had installed to a TiVo or two before. I'm getting all the HD channels, including the new ones. I didn't bother looking for the golf channel though. I also sent back my old cable box. So now I have 1 HD TiVo in the living room, and a series 2 in the guest room. 

Now if they would just finish the upgrades in my neiborhood. My services have been up and down since 8:30 this morning. Thank God the service didn't interrupt during the cable card firmware update.


----------



## imreolajos

Hi all!

I don't know if it has been discussed at length before, frankly, I don't have time to read through the 30+ pages of this thread, but this seems to be the appropriate place to share my experience, knowledge (and frustration) with all of you.

My setup: TiVo HD (installed on Christmas 2007) with latest firmware version, Scientific Atlanta (SA) Multi-stream card (aka. M-Card) with latest firmware version, Cox as cable provider.

My problem: About once every week or every other week all the digital channels (100+, incl. HD) on my TiVo black out. I can tune to them, but there's nothing on them. Ongoing and future recordings are obviously affected, but nothing else. This has been going on ever since I got my TiVo HD (3+ months and counting).

The solution: NONE at this time. Initially, TiVo has been pointing fingers at SA, SA has been pointing fingers at TiVo, Cox has been pointing fingers at both of them and I've been pointing my finger at all three of them (and guess which finger). Sometimes pulling out and pushing back the M-Card helps. Most of the time rebooting the TiVo helped. A few times that didn't help, either, but a call to Cox asking them to "hit" my card has resolved it, no reboot needed.

The bottom line: This is purely a software/firmware issue between TiVo and SA. One of the most helpful (!) Cox CSRs even read a memo to me that they got from SA acknowledging this fact and informing Cox that SA and TiVo are working on the problem. One very helpful CSR at TiVo also acknowledged this fact to me, went through a couple of CableCard diagnostic screens with me and then declared "Hmm, I never saw that before" and assured me the info she gathered will be relayed to TiVo software engineers who are actually aware of this issue and are working on a solution.

What to do: Wait and keep complaining to SA, TiVo and Cox so they can raise the priority of the issue. Cox in my area (Las Vegas/Henderson) told me that they received several complaints from the area, but all they can advise me is to wait for software upgrades. Swapping M-Cards, TiVo boxes, etc. doesn't fully resolve the problem, at best it delays it. Of course, that doesn't really help me, since the blackout can happen even in the middle of a recording...

Frankly, I am surprised that neither TiVo nor SA released an emergency software update to fix this HUGE problem which leads me to believe that either a) they don't care because not enough people are affected by it, or b) they have no solution, yet. As an embedded software engineer myself I can fully appreciate the complexity of the situation (issues with interoperability between devices made by two different companies; complex protocol to support encryption, QAM and who knows what else; new hardware and new software probably not well-tested, etc.), but as a customer I've been frustrated as hell.

Anyway, there you have it. It's out of my system and now I feel better...


----------



## tagpats

Your problem is identical to mine and many that have posted here. I've gone through 2 M Cards with the same result -- black screen loss of channels at random. My latest service call resulted in 2 S Cards being used because they were out of M Cards, so I was told. In any event, I'm not complaining because it's working again and I have not had an outage in almost a week. I have also noticed that the channels tune more quickly when I move from channel to channel than they did with the M Cards.

I realize that I'm likely to end up with the same or even new problems with the S Cards, but I was having to rely on the Cox DVR when I couldn't get my channels back with the M Card, so at least I'm using my Tivo again.

Would be great if someone was able to get a hold of that internal memo and post it on a thread like this so that we'd have some ammunition when Cox tells us one thing and Tivo tells us another.



imreolajos said:


> Hi all!
> 
> I don't know if it has been discussed at length before, frankly, I don't have time to read through the 30+ pages of this thread, but this seems to be the appropriate place to share my experience, knowledge (and frustration) with all of you.
> 
> My setup: TiVo HD (installed on Christmas 2007) with latest firmware version, Scientific Atlanta (SA) Multi-stream card (aka. M-Card) with latest firmware version, Cox as cable provider.
> 
> My problem: About once every week or every other week all the digital channels (100+, incl. HD) on my TiVo black out. I can tune to them, but there's nothing on them. Ongoing and future recordings are obviously affected, but nothing else. This has been going on ever since I got my TiVo HD (3+ months and counting).
> 
> The solution: NONE at this time. Initially, TiVo has been pointing fingers at SA, SA has been pointing fingers at TiVo, Cox has been pointing fingers at both of them and I've been pointing my finger at all three of them (and guess which finger). Sometimes pulling out and pushing back the M-Card helps. Most of the time rebooting the TiVo helped. A few times that didn't help, either, but a call to Cox asking them to "hit" my card has resolved it, no reboot needed.
> 
> The bottom line: This is purely a software/firmware issue between TiVo and SA. One of the most helpful (!) Cox CSRs even read a memo to me that they got from SA acknowledging this fact and informing Cox that SA and TiVo are working on the problem. One very helpful CSR at TiVo also acknowledged this fact to me, went through a couple of CableCard diagnostic screens with me and then declared "Hmm, I never saw that before" and assured me the info she gathered will be relayed to TiVo software engineers who are actually aware of this issue and are working on a solution.
> 
> What to do: Wait and keep complaining to SA, TiVo and Cox so they can raise the priority of the issue. Cox in my area (Las Vegas/Henderson) told me that they received several complaints from the area, but all they can advise me is to wait for software upgrades. Swapping M-Cards, TiVo boxes, etc. doesn't fully resolve the problem, at best it delays it. Of course, that doesn't really help me, since the blackout can happen even in the middle of a recording...
> 
> Frankly, I am surprised that neither TiVo nor SA released an emergency software update to fix this HUGE problem which leads me to believe that either a) they don't care because not enough people are affected by it, or b) they have no solution, yet. As an embedded software engineer myself I can fully appreciate the complexity of the situation (issues with interoperability between devices made by two different companies; complex protocol to support encryption, QAM and who knows what else; new hardware and new software probably not well-tested, etc.), but as a customer I've been frustrated as hell.
> 
> Anyway, there you have it. It's out of my system and now I feel better...


----------



## lrhorer

DonnoC said:


> Brand new Tivo S3 owner (Tivo HD) in Fairfax, VA, just had Cox out today to "install" the Cable Card. I got a single card with a dual tuner, I gather from this thread it is called an "M" card.


CableCards do not have tuners in them, no matter what the type. There are two types of CableCards, denoted as S-cards and M-cards. S-cards can decode only a single stream of data. M-cards can decode up to 6 simultaneous data streams. The S3 TiVo will work with M-cards, but the multi-stream feature is not enabled, so in order to record two channels simultaneously, one must have two cards with the S-3, regardless of whether they are S-cards or M-cards. The TiVo HD, by contrast, supports dual streams, so it ony requires a single M-card to record two channels simultaneously.

Both the S3 and TiVo HD are unidirectional hosts, and as such are not compatible with 2-way protocols such as SDV.



DonnoC said:


> I'm told these are "Switched Digital Channels" and are therefore not available on the CableCARD.


No, they are not available on any unidirectional host, nor on any bidirectional host not campatible with your CATV provider's system.



DonnoC said:


> I'm hopeful that eventually these will be available.


'Not very likely, I'm afraid, although it's possible if enough people write in then your provider might be persuaded to move them from an SDV QAM to a linear QAM. Otherwise there may be no relief for the situation. TiVo has stated publicly they are working with several CATV equipment manufacturers to come up with a kludge which will resolve the situation for regularly scheduled programs, but which manufacturers, if any, will come through with a solution is an open question. So is the question of when it will happen. If the equipment manufacturer who supplies the equipment to your CATV provider decides to do nothing, then you are stuck. There are rumors both Motorola and Scientific Atlanta (Cisco) are working on a solution, but at this point they are just that: rumors.


----------



## Kershek

Now this is weird. I came home today and noticed the TiVoHD had an "emergency message" that was scrolling across the screen. It said it was from the cable company and listed counties. Of course, now I can't remember what the emergency message was for. I hit clear to clear the message and found I couldn't tune any channels. It was in the process of recording two suggestions, but I noticed they were both at 0:00, had a black screen, and didn't appear to be recording at all. 

After a reboot of the TiVoHD, it came back up normally. Has anyone seen this before?


----------



## wierdo

Kershek said:


> Now this is weird. I came home today and noticed the TiVoHD had an "emergency message" that was scrolling across the screen. It said it was from the cable company and listed counties. Of course, now I can't remember what the emergency message was for. I hit clear to clear the message and found I couldn't tune any channels. It was in the process of recording two suggestions, but I noticed they were both at 0:00, had a black screen, and didn't appear to be recording at all.
> 
> After a reboot of the TiVoHD, it came back up normally. Has anyone seen this before?


The cable company sent an EAS alert, which forces CableCARD-using TiVos to tune to the alert channel. Next time, turn off the TiVo when you're done with it and your recordings will not be interrupted.


----------



## Kershek

But if you turn the TiVo off, it won't record...


----------



## jonginear

When you get the EAS message all you need to do is push the CLEAR button on your TiVo remote to get the picture back to normal.


----------



## Pafrican

Oh Cox you have got to be kidding me. March madness on 705 isn't in HD? I expected the simulcast games to be in SD but 705??? Are you kidding me? It better just be the preshow thats in SD and not the games.


----------



## Bodie

Turn off the Tivo??? Good luck with that.


----------



## wierdo

Kershek said:


> But if you turn the TiVo off, it won't record...


Don't unplug it, put it in standby, which is where mine lives every minute that I'm not watching it, precisely to prevent EAS issues.


----------



## Shawn95GT

I've seen plenty of emergency alerts on my S3, heck I saw two yesterday! I have yet to have it affect the Tivos ability to record. It is probably the type of alerts Cox Phoenix is sending out but hardly anything requiring a work-around. Last night it was recording on both tuners with the alert up.


----------



## BrianAZ

Shawn95GT said:


> I've seen plenty of emergency alerts on my S3, heck I saw two yesterday! I have yet to have it affect the Tivos ability to record. It is probably the type of alerts Cox Phoenix is sending out but hardly anything requiring a work-around. Last night it was recording on both tuners with the alert up.


On my TivoHD it just scrolls along the top and I hit clear to make it go away. Can't say for sure it's never impacted a recording, but I've never noticed any impact other than the annoying message.


----------



## wierdo

Shawn95GT said:


> I've seen plenty of emergency alerts on my S3, heck I saw two yesterday! I have yet to have it affect the Tivos ability to record. It is probably the type of alerts Cox Phoenix is sending out but hardly anything requiring a work-around. Last night it was recording on both tuners with the alert up.


Are you talking about crawls sent by the station you were viewing, or EAS activations by Cox themselves? Every time Cox Tulsa would run a test, I'd end up with an aborted recording. In 9.2, TiVo fixed it so there is just a gap during the EAS alert.

Obviously, putting the TiVo into standby won't do anything for a graphic crawl on whatever station you're viewing. It will prevent the TiVo from being forced to change channels in the middle of the recording.


----------



## Pafrican

Often when I wake up I'll notice a EAS alert banner but I don't think its ever affected my recordings. Though maybe it would I just don't record things at 4am.


----------



## JimRI

Cox came out and replaced my cards today...all fixed! I was told by the field supervisor that whenever they change the mapping frequencies at the head-end, they will most likely have to swap out the single-stream cable cards in order to correct the problem. However, when the m-cards become available in this area, the mapping issues shouldn't be a problem. Since we in RI are using the first gen single stream motorola cards, Cox has limited remote control over them. That's why they have to come to your house, swap out the cards and reset them back at their shop. With the new m-cards, they will have much more remote control/communication. He made it sound like the new m-cards will be available pretty soon. He also verified the Cox/TiVo partnership that will soon launch in RI/Conn. http://www.tvpredictions.com/tivo030508.htm He said that they will be using the m-cards in those boxes.


----------



## mimyc

Okay, the installer left 30 minutes ago. (East Mesa, Tivo HD, HDMI)

No new information to relay from the install, but some personal experiences to share.

After the install was done and I'd ooh'd and aah'd for a couple minutes at seeing the stitches on Jeff Corwin's pants, I forced a connection with Tivo to try and get the season passes I put in this morning at tivo.com. Immediately after starting that connection and backing out to TC, boom, black screens. 

Restart fixed it, but this can't be a coincidence. 

I'm sure we are dealing with multiple issues here, but I'm thinking Tivo connecting to home base is definitely one of our triggers. This would explain why people "wake up" to find the black screen in a lot of cases.

Reading these threads have left a lot of gray area for me on who is responsible for fixing this, but at least this particular issue is definitely a Tivo problem. 

If anyone speaking with Tivo would like to pass this along (or give me a contact) I'd appreciate it.


----------



## Bodie

JimRI said:


> Cox came out and replaced my cards today...all fixed! I was told by the field supervisor that whenever they change the mapping frequencies at the head-end, they will most likely have to swap out the single-stream cable cards in order to correct the problem. However, when the m-cards become available in this area, the mapping issues shouldn't be a problem. Since we in RI are using the first gen single stream motorola cards, Cox has limited remote control over them. That's why they have to come to your house, swap out the cards and reset them back at their shop. With the new m-cards, they will have much more remote control/communication. He made it sound like the new m-cards will be available pretty soon. He also verified the Cox/TiVo partnership that will soon launch in RI/Conn. http://www.tvpredictions.com/tivo030508.htm He said that they will be using the m-cards in those boxes.


I just set up an appt for Sat morn... Hopefully they will let us know when M cards are available and will come and replace them at no cost since it gives them more control.

Anyone else notice that CineMax is available right now, or is this just a benefit of screwed up cards?


----------



## emsman1

Was told by COX it's a free preview weekend.

I don't understand the lack of communication in that company between the techs, contractors, and phone support people. The 3 different techs at my house and number of phone support people all had different stories.



Bodie said:


> I just set up an appt for Sat morn... Hopefully they will let us know when M cards are available and will come and replace them at no cost since it gives them more control.
> 
> Anyone else notice that CineMax is available right now, or is this just a benefit of screwed up cards?


----------



## Pafrican

Is anybody having issues with 705, 85 & 86. I'm getting 5 fine. But when I go to any of the others, it gives me black screen and the "searching for signal on: cable in. See messages&setting..."

All my other channels, HD and non-hd are coming in fine. Other channels near 85/86 are coming in. 706, 703. It's just those channels for whatever reason.

Well just checked the other cable card and all channels are coming in fine. So one my s-cards is not getting those three channels, for whatever reason. Reeboot didn't do anything.


----------



## Kershek

What's the best way to find out when there are free preview weekends for premium stations?


----------



## jfranklin

Kershek said:


> What's the best way to find out when there are free preview weekends for premium stations?


As simple as it may sound, just read your monthly statement. Down the right side of the page any information about changes in service, or previews of premium stations will show there.


----------



## SoonerBuckley

Pafrican said:


> Is anybody having issues with 705, 85 & 86. I'm getting 5 fine. But when I go to any of the others, it gives me black screen and the "searching for signal on: cable in. See messages&setting..."
> 
> All my other channels, HD and non-hd are coming in fine. Other channels near 85/86 are coming in. 706, 703. It's just those channels for whatever reason.
> 
> Well just checked the other cable card and all channels are coming in fine. So one my s-cards is not getting those three channels, for whatever reason. Reeboot didn't do anything.


Are these newer HD Channels? I know that Cox is moving newer HD channels to switched digital video channels which the TiVo does currently not support. Check out the following link: http://tivosupport2.instancy.com/LaunchContent.aspx?CID=cbecf1b9-88de-4b74-82c1-754c3260112a

I know that a couple of my CC channels were not coming in when the tech left (yeah, I work for Cox and I still had to pay to have a tech come out), and took a little while to come in. From experience I can say you may have to give those channels some time.


----------



## SoonerBuckley

jfranklin said:


> As simple as it may sound, just read your monthly statement. Down the right side of the page any information about changes in service, or previews of premium stations will show there.


That would be too easy.


----------



## Bodie

jfranklin said:


> As simple as it may sound, just read your monthly statement. Down the right side of the page any information about changes in service, or previews of premium stations will show there.


No wonder I didn't know, since we have Easy Pay, the wife scans it for incorrect charges and then files it. I rarely see it...


----------



## Zonie65

Just adding myself to the Phoenix Cox market. Got the single M-Card to fix the audio synch issues on 2 SA S-cards. Channels started dropping about 3 weeks later. Today, all channels above 18 are out and rebooting doesn't work. Guess it's time for a truck roll.


----------



## Zonie65

Strange....

Called the CSR for a truck roll. He did a Unpair / Pair signal and it's all back. Question is..for how long. Thought that hitting it with that signal wouldn't work.


----------



## BrianAZ

Zonie65 said:


> Just adding myself to the Phoenix Cox market. Got the single M-Card to fix the audio synch issues on 2 SA S-cards. Channels started dropping about 3 weeks later. Today, all channels above 18 are out and rebooting doesn't work. Guess it's time for a truck roll.





Zonie65 said:


> Strange....
> 
> Called the CSR for a truck roll. He did a Unpair / Pair signal and it's all back. Question is..for how long. Thought that hitting it with that signal wouldn't work.


See my post.


----------



## jsisley

OK. I just called Cox and this is what I found out: The change to switched digital could take place later on this year. At that point, new cablecards would be needed in order to still get all of the HD channels. You'd have to make sure that the new cablecards are compatible with the Tivo.  There is no word as of yet as to what kind of cards would be used once the change to switched digital occurs. The cards get their signal because a cable is plugged into the back of the Tivo box. I was quoted $55.95 to install the two cards. 

This worries me, because I don't want to spend the $$$ to get the Tivo only to find out that I will no longer be able to use it later on this year. 

There is also no word on Cox offering the Tivo service for additional $$ on their DVR. Cox confirmed that the contract had been signed, but nothing has been said regarding doing this in the Omaha market. 

Any thoughts?


----------



## BrianAZ

jsisley said:


> OK. I just called Cox and this is what I found out: The change to switched digital could take place later on this year. At that point, new cablecards would be needed in order to still get all of the HD channels. You'd have to make sure that the new cablecards are compatible with the Tivo.  There is no word as of yet as to what kind of cards would be used once the change to switched digital occurs. The cards get their signal because a cable is plugged into the back of the Tivo box. I was quoted $55.95 to install the two cards. Any thoughts?


This is the first I've heard of new cablecards being required. I think you've spoken with an ignorant rep. My understanding is that either the Tivo needs to be able to communicate back with the Cable Co and the way this is going to be achieved is with a device which will plug into the Tivo via USB (search these forums for "Tuning Resolver").


----------



## Bodie

Bodie said:


> I just set up an appt for Sat morn... Hopefully they will let us know when M cards are available and will come and replace them at no cost since it gives them more control.


After initially showing up with no cards to do a 2-card swap, the tech came back and swapped out the two remaining cards and everything is working again (until they remap again).


----------



## Kershek

I don't mean to spread confusion, but I've read on these forums two different ways they were going to solve the SDV problem - one is a USB dongle and the other is an updated CableCARD that is two-way. From what I gathered, the dongle is the "quick fix" due this summer, while the CableCARD replacement isn't expected to be available until later.


----------



## jsisley

Kershek said:


> I don't mean to spread confusion, but I've read on these forums two different ways they were going to solve the SDV problem - one is a USB dongle and the other is an updated CableCARD that is two-way. From what I gathered, the dongle is the "quick fix" due this summer, while the CableCARD replacement isn't expected to be available until later.


Who would provide the USB dongle - is this something you could purchase from Tivo or would you have to rent it from the cable provider? They may not have even thought that far ahead yet...


----------



## Kershek

Pure speculation, but if it's required to access channels and it's a federal regulation to provide channel access, I would guess it's the cable provider's responsibility.


----------



## jsisley

Kershek said:


> Pure speculation, but if it's required to access channels and it's a federal regulation to provide channel access, I would guess it's the cable provider's responsibility.


I would also think that if Cox wanted to be nasty about it, they could say that they do not support non-Cox boxes once the changeover is made. Then we'd all be out. The tech did say something to me about new TV's that are coming out toward the end of this year and they would have to do something for that, but he didn't know what.


----------



## ajwees41

Kershek said:


> I don't mean to spread confusion, but I've read on these forums two different ways they were going to solve the SDV problem - one is a USB dongle and the other is an updated CableCARD that is two-way. From what I gathered, the dongle is the "quick fix" due this summer, while the CableCARD replacement isn't expected to be available until later.


The current card can do 2way it's the tivo that can't, so they are doing the tuning reslover. no new cards.


----------



## HabuBugs

imreolajos said:


> Hi all!
> 
> I don't know if it has been discussed at length before, frankly, I don't have time to read through the 30+ pages of this thread, but this seems to be the appropriate place to share my experience, knowledge (and frustration) with all of you.
> 
> My setup: TiVo HD (installed on Christmas 2007) with latest firmware version, Scientific Atlanta (SA) Multi-stream card (aka. M-Card) with latest firmware version, Cox as cable provider.
> 
> My problem: About once every week or every other week all the digital channels (100+, incl. HD) on my TiVo black out. I can tune to them, but there's nothing on them. Ongoing and future recordings are obviously affected, but nothing else. This has been going on ever since I got my TiVo HD (3+ months and counting).
> 
> The solution: NONE at this time. Initially, TiVo has been pointing fingers at SA, SA has been pointing fingers at TiVo, Cox has been pointing fingers at both of them and I've been pointing my finger at all three of them (and guess which finger). Sometimes pulling out and pushing back the M-Card helps. Most of the time rebooting the TiVo helped. A few times that didn't help, either, but a call to Cox asking them to "hit" my card has resolved it, no reboot needed.
> 
> The bottom line: This is purely a software/firmware issue between TiVo and SA. One of the most helpful (!) Cox CSRs even read a memo to me that they got from SA acknowledging this fact and informing Cox that SA and TiVo are working on the problem. One very helpful CSR at TiVo also acknowledged this fact to me, went through a couple of CableCard diagnostic screens with me and then declared "Hmm, I never saw that before" and assured me the info she gathered will be relayed to TiVo software engineers who are actually aware of this issue and are working on a solution.
> 
> What to do: Wait and keep complaining to SA, TiVo and Cox so they can raise the priority of the issue. Cox in my area (Las Vegas/Henderson) told me that they received several complaints from the area, but all they can advise me is to wait for software upgrades. Swapping M-Cards, TiVo boxes, etc. doesn't fully resolve the problem, at best it delays it. Of course, that doesn't really help me, since the blackout can happen even in the middle of a recording...
> 
> Frankly, I am surprised that neither TiVo nor SA released an emergency software update to fix this HUGE problem which leads me to believe that either a) they don't care because not enough people are affected by it, or b) they have no solution, yet. As an embedded software engineer myself I can fully appreciate the complexity of the situation (issues with interoperability between devices made by two different companies; complex protocol to support encryption, QAM and who knows what else; new hardware and new software probably not well-tested, etc.), but as a customer I've been frustrated as hell.
> 
> Anyway, there you have it. It's out of my system and now I feel better...


I've owned my Tivo HD for about 3-4 weeks. I just started noticing this same problem a couple weeks ago. Seems to happen every 3-4 days. The Cox CSR I spoke with last said it seems to happen mostly with the Multistream cards. So, I'm considering asking Cox to replace the multistream card with two single stream cards. The part I'm not sure about is... will the single stream cards work with the SDV adapter once it is available? Also, does anyone have the memo (betewwn Cox and SA) that describes this problem?


----------



## AZrob

HabuBugs said:


> I've owned my Tivo HD for about 3-4 weeks. I just started noticing this same problem a couple weeks ago. Seems to happen every 3-4 days. The Cox CSR I spoke with last said it seems to happen mostly with the Multistream cards. So, I'm considering asking Cox to replace the multistream card with two single stream cards. The part I'm not sure about is... will the single stream cards work with the SDV adapter once it is available? Also, does anyone have the memo (betewwn Cox and SA) that describes this problem?


Here is the announcement from the Tivo website:

http://forums.tivo.com/pe/action/forums/displaypost?postID=10372477


----------



## nick58b

Adding my experience to the thread. Lost most of my channels again today, I'll be making my fourth call to Cox to get new cards. M-cards work for a few weeks and a few reboots, then most channels over 22 are gone, as with HD channels over 712.

I'm in the Santa Barbara, CA market. Problem started with a pair of single cards (only lost two channels), then I went through two m-cards. The only good thing about calling now is that since Cox is so familiar with the problem, it doesn't take them long to fix it.


----------



## tagpats

I had the same experience with the M Card, but have had good luck with the S Cards for a couple of weeks now. Not sure how long my luck with hold out, but figure it was worth the experiment. The Dongle for SDV should work regardless of which type of card you have.



HabuBugs said:


> I've owned my Tivo HD for about 3-4 weeks. I just started noticing this same problem a couple weeks ago. Seems to happen every 3-4 days. The Cox CSR I spoke with last said it seems to happen mostly with the Multistream cards. So, I'm considering asking Cox to replace the multistream card with two single stream cards. The part I'm not sure about is... will the single stream cards work with the SDV adapter once it is available? Also, does anyone have the memo (betewwn Cox and SA) that describes this problem?


----------



## BrianAZ

nick58b said:


> Adding my experience to the thread. Lost most of my channels again today, I'll be making my fourth call to Cox to get new cards. M-cards work for a few weeks and a few reboots, then most channels over 22 are gone, as with HD channels over 712.
> 
> I'm in the Santa Barbara, CA market. Problem started with a pair of single cards (only lost two channels), then I went through two m-cards. The only good thing about calling now is that since Cox is so familiar with the problem, it doesn't take them long to fix it.


I was in your position where reboot would not fix it and this did. I'm still having to reboot about once a week, but at least I'm not having to wait a couple days for a truck roll when they stop working.


----------



## Pafrican

So for the first time since I had them installed (probably a month ago or a little bit longer) I had channel dropout on one of my S-cards. The reboot fixed it. We'll see how quickly it repeats. But not bad considering having two cards (you would think twice the possibility of failure) I didn't have any dropout (besides the incorrect pairing issue from before) until now. 

Hopefully things will run ok for a bit as I really hate having techs come out.


----------



## hddude55

Well, I got ten days of the latest cards before one lost its channels. I once again tried the channel restore "temporary fix" whereby you wait two minutes for the message telling you the card has failed and then it resets itself. However, even though the error messages disappear, the channels never seem to come back without a reboot. Does anyone have "idiot proof" instructions for the temporary fix since I must be doing something wrong?

BTW, I don't seem to be seeing as many posts from Phoenix-area customers. Does that mean you have stopped reporting your recurring problems with disappearing channels, or has the problem gone away? (The last I heard TiVo and SA were working on a fix but seemed to be stumped.) BTW I currently have two multi-stream cards in my series3 but have had the same problems using two single-stream cards. I know some people believe the problem is isolated to either single stream or multi-stream cards but my experience suggests the problem occurs with either type of card. The common denominator is the Scientific Atlanta brand name. I believe I have had the cards swapped out six times since the problem emerged in Fall 2007. :down:


----------



## Kershek

Last night was the first time I got the black channel problem on my TiVoHD. A reboot fixed it.


----------



## rcobourn

hddude55 said:


> Well, I got ten days of the latest cards before one lost its channels. I once again tried the channel restore "temporary fix" whereby you wait two minutes for the message telling you the card has failed and then it resets itself. However, even though the error messages disappear, the channels never seem to come back without a reboot. Does anyone have "idiot proof" instructions for the temporary fix since I must be doing something wrong?
> 
> BTW, I don't seem to be seeing as many posts from Phoenix-area customers. Does that mean you have stopped reporting your recurring problems with disappearing channels, or has the problem gone away? (The last I heard TiVo and SA were working on a fix but seemed to be stumped.) BTW I currently have two multi-stream cards in my series3 but have had the same problems using two single-stream cards. I know some people believe the problem is isolated to either single stream or multi-stream cards but my experience suggests the problem occurs with either type of card. The common denominator is the Scientific Atlanta brand name. I believe I have had the cards swapped out six times since the problem emerged in Fall 2007. :down:


After at least a week of no problems since I last had Cox do a hit on my cards, I lost card 2 again last night. Interestingly, it's the first time I sort of "saw" it happen. Watching a recording of the Phoenix Suns game (3.5 hours total) the picture pixelated and dropped out at the 2:31 mark, with nothing recorded after that. Fortunately (or not) the Suns were already blown out at that point, so I wasn't too upset about losing the rest of the recording. I was wondering why the green recording progress bar ended at 2:31 despite the fact that the 3.5 hours was well past. A reboot got the channels back.


----------



## craigo

hddude55 said:


> BTW, I don't seem to be seeing as many posts from Phoenix-area customers. Does that mean you have stopped reporting your recurring problems with disappearing channels, or has the problem gone away?


Problem still exists on my S3 here in Phoenix. Both Scards and Mcards have their issues....Cox guy is here right now since the channels wouldn't come back after a reboot. I'm going back to the Scards to see if the FF of the audio/video on SD channels have been fixed.


----------



## nick58b

BrianAZ said:


> I was in your position where reboot would not fix it and this did. I'm still having to reboot about once a week, but at least I'm not having to wait a couple days for a truck roll when they stop working.


Thanks for the tip, unfortunately, the Cox rep I talked to sent the hits and rebalanced the account, but my channels are still gone, even after a reboot.

To top it off, he claims Cox has stopped sending out new cablecards for this problem, and that I have to wait for Tivo to fix the issue.


----------



## jebbbz

hddude55 said:


> ...
> BTW, I don't seem to be seeing as many posts from Phoenix-area customers. Does that mean you have stopped reporting your recurring problems with disappearing channels, or has the problem gone away? ... I believe I have had the cards swapped out six times since the problem emerged in Fall 2007. :down:


I got my TivoHD in late January, cablecard a few days later. My loss-of-channels developed about two weeks later and by about February 22 reboots weren't working. I got a new MCard installed on February 25 and had one loss-of-channels about a week to ten days later, which the menu trick fixed. No problems since then. Just waiting on a firmware fix.

The cable guy left me a 50' length of RG6 to replace some RG59 in my attic and after the early March channel problem I got around to replacing the old RG59. I also upgraded the last of my splitters and removed an old RS signal amplifier I had installed years ago. Other than that everything is the same hardware-wise. Maybe a cleaner signal will help delay onset of the problem.

Of course, now that I have posted about being problem-free for three weeks I expect the channels to disappear today, probably even as I post...


----------



## Shawn95GT

Phoenix here - the problems are few and far between on my S3 with two s-cards. My 2nd S3 and TivoHD don't have cablecards.


----------



## hddude55

nick58b said:


> Thanks for the tip, unfortunately, the Cox rep I talked to sent the hits and rebalanced the account, but my channels are still gone, even after a reboot.
> 
> To top it off, he claims Cox has stopped sending out new cablecards for this problem, and that I have to wait for Tivo to fix the issue.


 I see you live in Santa Barbara. I can't imagine that Cox has stopped sending cards especially since there are so many different repairmen to get the directive.

P.S. I used to live in Santa Barbara and miss the town but not the cost of housing. I have a much older cousin who owns a home on Birnam Wood Golf Club in Montecito. I'm thinking I need to get in his will.


----------



## jkovach

I'm in the Phoenix area - have had the HD TiVo for 2 months now, and each month on the anniversary of my install, I lose my premium and tier channels. When this happens, I've noted that the Sub Exp Time on the 2nd page of the CA Screen has elapsed. Each time, I've called Cox and they've sent hits to the Cablecard. Tonight it didn't work, so I rebooted and they sent another set of hits. That worked, and now the Sub Exp Time is on Apr 27th, so I'm good for another month...

Anyways, it appears to me as though something on Cox's end is not automatically sending the required signals each month to update the Sub Exp Time on the cablecards.

Jeff


----------



## h00ligan

Something interesting (to me at least) is that most people here talk about losing premium or HD channels. I lose sci-fi, comedy central, other analog channels. 

The techs have been here 3 times to balance the signal issues - the signal is 'perfect' now - and i am on my 3rd set of M cards in 2 tivo hds.

It's dishearteneing as I just spoke with TiVo and they basically told me i could cancel my contract, they aren't particularly far into resolving this issue.


----------



## ajwees41

h00ligan said:


> Something interesting (to me at least) is that most people here talk about losing premium or HD channels. I lose sci-fi, comedy central, other analog channels.
> 
> The techs have been here 3 times to balance the signal issues - the signal is 'perfect' now - and i am on my 3rd set of M cards in 2 tivo hds.
> 
> It's dishearteneing as I just spoke with TiVo and they basically told me i could cancel my contract, they aren't particularly far into resolving this issue.


what area are you in? Cox is brodcasting analog in digital in certain parts of there service area. It might a problem with your tivo.


----------



## hddude55

I spoke to a TiVo CSR today who claimed he mostly works on series3 and Tivo HD cable card issues. As of today the issue is being worked on, but there is no projected timeline for a fix. Bummer.

As for the Beta 9.3 release that someone in this forum said he was testing, this CSR stated emphatically that the 9.3 Beta release being tested does not address the missing channels bug. They are having a tough time fixing what seems to be a problem only encountered by some users in selected markets. He said the Phoenix area seems to be especially hard hit by the bug, which he believes can be traced to a software update that SA sent to all cards at the end of Oct 2007. That date does seem to be the time period when my series3 problems began.

I also asked him about comments posted by a TiVo employee in the TiVo.com website's tech forum to the effect that only multi-stream cards were affected. He said that is wrong and that the eventual software fix will be applied to both types of cards. That sounds good since I have had card failures with both single and multi-stream cards.

All in all, I found the discussion to be discouraging. It has been at least four or five months since the problem became widely reported and it doesn't sound like a remedy is even close.

P.S. He did mention that if we lose channels we should have Cox verify that our cards are set to our specific area codes. For example, he said if the card is programmed for Scottsdale and one lives in Phoenix, the card can lose channels over time. I realize that sounds a bit lame -- and he didn't suggest that's the reason for all of these lost channel problems -- but I do intend to check with Cox, just on the off chance it is an issue causing my current card in slot 1 to lose channels every couple days.


----------



## jhershauer

hddude55 said:


> He said the Phoenix area seems to be especially hard hit by the bug, which he believes can be traced to a software update that SA sent to all cards at the end of Oct 2007. That date does seem to be the time period when my series3 problems began.


That fits our scenario as well. Everything was fine on both of our Tivo HDs, then the firmware was updated on the card for one of our boxes around October and that box started having the disappearing channels problem. Our other Tivo HD never had a problem until about a month ago when we had a power outage and the firmware was updated on the cablecard when it booted back up. Now it does the magic disappearing channel trick as well. I should have written down the firmware version on it when it was working properly. With all of the problems, it seems strange that SA can't just "roll back" the firmware update that seems to be the source of the issue.


----------



## tagpats

I've had good luck with my 2 S Cards for almost 3 weeks. That is the longest time I've gone without a loss of channels with either an M or an S Card.

Having said that, in light of the continuing problems getting a permanent solution to the problem, I'll be taking Tivo up on their offer to cancel my service if it happens again. As lousy as the Cox DVR is, it works and it gives me all of my channels, all of the time, including SDV channels that I can't get now.

The dongle was supposed to be available in the second quarter of this year and I haven't heard any indications that it will be hitting the shelves any time soon so there will be even more channels released this year that I won't be able to get.



hddude55 said:


> I spoke to a TiVo CSR today who claimed he mostly works on series3 and Tivo HD cable card issues. As of today the issue is being worked on, but there is no projected timeline for a fix. Bummer.
> 
> As for the Beta 9.3 release that someone in this forum said he was testing, this CSR stated emphatically that the 9.3 Beta release being tested does not address the missing channels bug. They are having a tough time fixing what seems to be a problem only encountered by some users in selected markets. He said the Phoenix area seems to be especially hard hit by the bug, which he believes can be traced to a software update that SA sent to all cards at the end of Oct 2007. That date does seem to be the time period when my series3 problems began.
> 
> I also asked him about comments posted by a TiVo employee in the TiVo.com website's tech forum to the effect that only multi-stream cards were affected. He said that is wrong and that the eventual software fix will be applied to both types of cards. That sounds good since I have had card failures with both single and multi-stream cards.
> 
> All in all, I found the discussion to be discouraging. It has been at least four or five months since the problem became widely reported and it doesn't sound like a remedy is even close.
> 
> P.S. He did mention that if we lose channels we should have Cox verify that our cards are set to our specific area codes. For example, he said if the card is programmed for Scottsdale and one lives in Phoenix, the card can lose channels over time. I realize that sounds a bit lame -- and he didn't suggest that's the reason for all of these lost channel problems -- but I do intend to check with Cox, just on the off chance it is an issue causing my current card in slot 1 to lose channels every couple days.


----------



## wierdo

Can someone in Tulsa check to see if they are also receiving the HD channels which had heretofore been unavailable to (most) CableCARD users? I started getting them sometime between yesterday morning and a few minutes ago.


----------



## ToyD

wierdo said:


> Can someone in Tulsa check to see if they are also receiving the HD channels which had heretofore been unavailable to (most) CableCARD users? I started getting them sometime between yesterday morning and a few minutes ago.


I live in the OKC area and can now also get the HD channels I could not before. I specifically checked HGTV HD and FOOD HD and I can't remember the 3rd at the moment. I dunno what changed, but yay.


----------



## wierdo

ToyD said:


> I live in the OKC area and can now also get the HD channels I could not before. I specifically checked HGTV HD and FOOD HD and I can't remember the 3rd at the moment. I dunno what changed, but yay.


Excellent. If they're also working in OKC (a separate system) it must not be a fluke.


----------



## rtmcmjr

My question as a consumer is why do we have to put up with this? We paid good money to Cox and Tivo both. It's bull, I really don't see this as Cox Issue anymore. I did at first, but with all my Tivo "Gray Screens", reboots and such. The problem is Tivo hardware talking to the Cable cards. Tivo has made a faulty box with this HD Box, it's that simple. They have rushed it out the door. I'd be perfectly happy with single thread coax connection recording Hi Def. I've wasted to much time on this and I'm rather upset. I really feel stroked by Tivo and that they don't care. No wonder the company is suffering so much financially anymore.

I hate to see it because their DVR software is brilliant, but I can't waste my time any longer debugging their project.

Read this http://www.silverknight.com/TiVo_HD_Owners_Consider_Class.htm

====== here is my post from another thread here .. 
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=389837

I have Cox in Phoenix with a Scientific Atlanta Multi-Stream card and I'm telling you this has been the worst decision ever.

I am giving Tivo one more chance to help me on Monday 07-Apr-08 and if they cannot help me I'm done with my HD Tivo. Then the I'm sure a fight will ensue over how I get my money back from Tivo. It has not been right since receiving it in January.

Background:
I have been a Tivo customer since the very early days of Tivo and have multiple boxes of almost every model. I love my Tivo.

This past January I upgrade my main family room to HDTV with Bose Surround sound and all the bells and whistles. I spoke to the people at Tivo and purchased a brand new Tivo HD DVR. Long story short it has been a complete disaster!

I have had Cox at my house 3 times now switching out Scientific Atlanta cards. It's dead again tonight. I have a multi-stream card and it's got all the right codes showing authorization of the card. The cable company can talk to the card, but I get nothing but free TV. All the encrypted channels have quit working. Cox blames Tivo, Tivo blames Cox ... nobody wants to really fix the problem.

After all the hours of research I've done (and I'm a super techie that loves this stuff) I don't believe it is Cox. I believe Tivo has a faulty product and it's not up to snuff. All anyone can do is point fingers at the other company.

But the bottom line is that for me the consumer I cannot trust my Tivo to record anything. We were all set to record the Martin Luther King special tonight and now we cannot record it or watch it on the main TV because the Tivo box is just giving me "gray" screen on the all the encrypted channels. I might as well forget about recording anything while gone on vacation, my HD Tivo cannot make it through a week without problems requiring a reboot. It's bull and I feel totally ripped off as the consumer.

Like I said, because I love the Tivo software I am giving them 1 more chance tomorrow and that's it, then I'll be forced to deal with the Cox HD DVR. Basically I have no choice, it sucks but that is the reality here in Ahwatukee (i.e. Cox cable in Phoenix).


----------



## aztivo

well I have been watching my S3 for about 45 min. now and have had no pixelation (2 SA Single stream cards) So I check system settings and I am running 9.3.Y3-01-2-648. I am still running 9.2 on my THD and just yesterday had to do a reboot twice.. Could this be a fix?


----------



## tagpats

i don't know who is in the wrong, but i've made the same decision. if my channels drop out again, i'm dumping my hd tivo and living with the junkie cox dvr. not much choice. worst case scenario, i walk away and still have to pay for 8 months of tivo service, but i suspect they'll help me out since i have a series 2 tivo in the bedroom. that better keep working or my wife will leave me. shouldn't be this hard.



rtmcmjr said:


> My question as a consumer is why do we have to put up with this? We paid good money to Cox and Tivo both. It's bull, I really don't see this as Cox Issue anymore. I did at first, but with all my Tivo "Gray Screens", reboots and such. The problem is Tivo hardware talking to the Cable cards. Tivo has made a faulty box with this HD Box, it's that simple. They have rushed it out the door. I'd be perfectly happy with single thread coax connection recording Hi Def. I've wasted to much time on this and I'm rather upset. I really feel stroked by Tivo and that they don't care. No wonder the company is suffering so much financially anymore.
> 
> I hate to see it because their DVR software is brilliant, but I can't waste my time any longer debugging their project.
> 
> Read this http://www.silverknight.com/TiVo_HD_Owners_Consider_Class.htm
> 
> ====== here is my post from another thread here ..
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=389837
> 
> I have Cox in Phoenix with a Scientific Atlanta Multi-Stream card and I'm telling you this has been the worst decision ever.
> 
> I am giving Tivo one more chance to help me on Monday 07-Apr-08 and if they cannot help me I'm done with my HD Tivo. Then the I'm sure a fight will ensue over how I get my money back from Tivo. It has not been right since receiving it in January.
> 
> Background:
> I have been a Tivo customer since the very early days of Tivo and have multiple boxes of almost every model. I love my Tivo.
> 
> This past January I upgrade my main family room to HDTV with Bose Surround sound and all the bells and whistles. I spoke to the people at Tivo and purchased a brand new Tivo HD DVR. Long story short it has been a complete disaster!
> 
> I have had Cox at my house 3 times now switching out Scientific Atlanta cards. It's dead again tonight. I have a multi-stream card and it's got all the right codes showing authorization of the card. The cable company can talk to the card, but I get nothing but free TV. All the encrypted channels have quit working. Cox blames Tivo, Tivo blames Cox ... nobody wants to really fix the problem.
> 
> After all the hours of research I've done (and I'm a super techie that loves this stuff) I don't believe it is Cox. I believe Tivo has a faulty product and it's not up to snuff. All anyone can do is point fingers at the other company.
> 
> But the bottom line is that for me the consumer I cannot trust my Tivo to record anything. We were all set to record the Martin Luther King special tonight and now we cannot record it or watch it on the main TV because the Tivo box is just giving me "gray" screen on the all the encrypted channels. I might as well forget about recording anything while gone on vacation, my HD Tivo cannot make it through a week without problems requiring a reboot. It's bull and I feel totally ripped off as the consumer.
> 
> Like I said, because I love the Tivo software I am giving them 1 more chance tomorrow and that's it, then I'll be forced to deal with the Cox HD DVR. Basically I have no choice, it sucks but that is the reality here in Ahwatukee (i.e. Cox cable in Phoenix).


----------



## DrDatabase

I just noticed today that I'm receiving about 6 new HD channels on my Tivo HD. They've been on the program guide for months but today they actually work. 

History channel, CNN, NFLHD, Food, Discovery and Golf.

Anybody else in OC notice the change?


----------



## Breadfan

DrDatabase said:


> I just noticed today that I'm receiving about 6 new HD channels on my Tivo HD. They've been on the program guide for months but today they actually work.
> 
> History channel, CNN, NFLHD, Food, Discovery and Golf.
> 
> Anybody else in OC notice the change?


They added those channels here in Arkansas about 1.5 months ago but cable card subscribers don't get them. I contacted them about it and they said they would discuss it at the next meeting but they had no plans at this time to change anything.


----------



## moyekj

DrDatabase said:


> I just noticed today that I'm receiving about 6 new HD channels on my Tivo HD. They've been on the program guide for months but today they actually work.
> 
> History channel, CNN, NFLHD, Food, Discovery and Golf.
> 
> Anybody else in OC notice the change?


 Wow, you're right! Actually there are 8 channels that were previously not available to CableCard customers that all of a sudden now do work:
CNNHD, DSCHD, GOLFVS, NFLHD, TLCHD, FOODHP, HGTVD, HSTRYHD.
Perhaps in light of the BrightHouse Networks fiasco Cox OC changed their policy on blocking out CableCard customers in preparation for SDV.


----------



## Breadfan

I found out that Cox in Tulsa and Oklahoma city has done the same thing and added the new channels for cable card customers but not here in Fort Smith, AR.

Did you guys have to rescan for channels or did they just start working?


----------



## moyekj

Breadfan said:


> I found out that Cox in Tulsa and Oklahoma city has done the same thing and added the new channels for cable card customers but not here in Fort Smith, AR.
> 
> Did you guys have to rescan for channels or did they just start working?


 No rescan, they just started working. The CableCard channel map must have been updated. Before when I would tune to those channels and check diagnostics page the associated CableCard would report an error and there was no frequency or any other data for that CableCard. Now the frequency and all the other usual data is there.


----------



## jcaudle

The HD is a POS...its been months now, and Tivo can't seem to fix the channel loss problem. I had to return my S3 after a year because it wanted to randomly reboot, but that fixed the problems. (I kept my SA single stream cards). 

The HD I have had since late Sept 2007 and its been an unreliable POS. Tivo should have worked out the issues with Cox, and Scientific Atlanta by now. When my prepaid is done in Dec I am junking the HD box and going to a cable DVR. Bad though it is in many ways, it at least records what you tell it to. And channels are available.


----------



## weeds

This is a post from a Hampton Roads Cox Rep., Norfolk, Va. Cox, AVS forums.


> On Thursday morning, April 10, the CableCARD Channel Lineup will change to include channels launched since November 15.
> 
> In the future, as SDV is implemented, some channels will likely be removed from the CableCARD lineup such as select digital channels with low viewership. Digital simulcast channels will be replaced with an analog version.


----------



## hddude55

rtmcmjr said:


> My question as a consumer is why do we have to put up with this? We paid good money to Cox and Tivo both. It's bull, I really don't see this as Cox Issue anymore. I did at first, but with all my Tivo "Gray Screens", reboots and such. The problem is Tivo hardware talking to the Cable cards. ....


 About a week ago I called TiVo just to see what was known about a fix for the disappearing channels issue. (I believe I am on my sixth set of cable cards in five months for my series3, so obviously I have been communicating a lot with Cox-Phoenix...and the current cablecard1 is already losing channels almost every other day requiring reboots.) I was told by the TiVo CSR last week to leave my cell phone number so he could have someone call me back with a status report. A week later and they haven't bothered to call back, as if they know anything anyway.

TiVo HD is a frickin joke and should be the final nail in the coffin of this arrogant company. They are a lot like Apple in terms of devoted fans and corporate arrogance, but Apple never produced a product that was crap like these HD TiVos.


----------



## jfranklin

weeds said:


> This is a post from a Hampton Roads Cox Rep., Norfolk, Va. Cox, AVS forums. "On Thursday morning, April 10, the CableCARD Channel Lineup will change to include channels launched since November 15.
> 
> In the future, as SDV is implemented, some channels will likely be removed from the CableCARD lineup such as select digital channels with low viewership. Digital simulcast channels will be replaced with an analog version."


I just checked my internal email and can verify that information was sent to technical support. It would explain some of the people in OKC and Tulsa seeing the channels last week. Seems the change over date is a due date and changes should be done by that date if not sooner.

I've been requesting this internally ever since the original decision was made to not deliver these channels to customers with CableCARDs. I suppose enough people made their voices heard to change the policy.


----------



## Testpattern

jfranklin said:


> I just checked my internal email and can verify that information was sent to technical support. It would explain some of the people in OKC and Tulsa seeing the channels last week. Seems the change over date is a due date and changes should be done by that date if not sooner.


Are the channels made available to the OKC area listed somewhere? I'd like to perform a sanity check just to see where we're currently at with respect to channels received.

Thanks,


----------



## yroca

Guys - I finally called TiVo technical support about the constant every 2-3 days dropping of channels and having to reboot, or call Cox. The CSR acknowledged that it is an Scientific Atlanta problem, and "escalated" my ticket. I was sort of waiting around figuring everyone else was calling in, but I think that was the problem. While TiVo is aware of it, I don't think they understand the vast number of people this issue is affecting.

*The CSR said the best way to get this issue escalated is for more people to call in, so I encourage you call in just to report the issue. We need to flood the call center in order to get some attention on this issue.* I was on hold for 2 minutes and my call lasted less than 5 minutes. Please guys, call in to get your issue logged in their system.

Here is the contact information below:
TiVo-Manufactured DVR Technical Support
Phone number: 877-367-8486
Hours of operation:
Monday - Sunday
7:00 AM - 8:00 PM Pacific


----------



## jfranklin

Testpattern said:


> Are the channels made available to the OKC area listed somewhere? I'd like to perform a sanity check just to see where we're currently at with respect to channels received.
> 
> Thanks,


http://www.cox.com/oklahoma/digitalcable/okc2.asp#hdtv

That should be marked with the more recent channels as 'NEW'. At least that's how it showed up for me.

Are you guys back in one peice after the ice storms? My call center took calls for your area durring that, sounded like a total mess.


----------



## wierdo

jfranklin said:


> I just checked my internal email and can verify that information was sent to technical support. It would explain some of the people in OKC and Tulsa seeing the channels last week. Seems the change over date is a due date and changes should be done by that date if not sooner.
> 
> I've been requesting this internally ever since the original decision was made to not deliver these channels to customers with CableCARDs. I suppose enough people made their voices heard to change the policy.


Excellent. Thanks for putting a good word in for us. Hopefully the SDV dongle won't end up being vaporware, so we can put the unpleasantness related to SDV behind us. 

Even if it does take longer than expected to appear and Cox gets around to widely deploying SDV, I'm much happier getting the channels while I can and losing them when it's a technical requirement, rather than being shafted for months in advance by some administrative decision.


----------



## Testpattern

jfranklin said:


> http://www.cox.com/oklahoma/digitalcable/okc2.asp#hdtv
> 
> That should be marked with the more recent channels as 'NEW'. At least that's how it showed up for me.
> 
> Are you guys back in one peice after the ice storms? My call center took calls for your area durring that, sounded like a total mess.


Thanks for the feedback.

Ice storm fallout still presents problems around here. I'm currently waiting to have more trees removed as a result of the damage. Not seen one like this before... maybe global warming will keep these from happening down the road... 

Thanks again...


----------



## 24k Kate

Well...As of 9am April 10th, the missing Cox HD channels (Discovery, TLC, HGTV, Food, Animal and a bunch of others) here in Norfolk, VA have reappeared. I wonder if they will still be there tonight....


----------



## jfranklin

Testpattern said:


> Thanks for the feedback.
> 
> Ice storm fallout still presents problems around here. I'm currently waiting to have more trees removed as a result of the damage. Not seen one like this before... maybe global warming will keep these from happening down the road...
> 
> Thanks again...


Something good should come from global warming. I know my summer time electric bill isn't liking it too much. With all the weird weather around lately I'm worried about this years hurricane season here. My area good off without much of an issue when Isabel came through in 2003, and we're over due for a rough one.



wierdo said:


> Even if it does take longer than expected to appear and Cox gets around to widely deploying SDV, I'm much happier getting the channels while I can and losing them when it's a technical requirement, rather than being shafted for months in advance by some administrative decision.


That's what I kept telling the supervisors and anyone else that would listen.


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## ScottEllsworth

In OC, many of the missing channels showed up during the nine hours my new TiVo was functioning. Pretty darn cool - HistHD!

From what the cable guy was saying, it looks like they were actually supposed to light up on the 15th.

Scott


----------



## miadlor

Cox officially added those chans and at this point "now" going to update cable cards with future HD channels when they are available.


----------



## Breadfan

Cox still hasn't added them in Fort Smith, Arkansas.


----------



## moyekj

miadlor said:


> Cox officially added those chans and at this point "now" going to update cable cards with future HD channels when they are available.


 Until SDV deploys in your area and they start taking some away...


----------



## Rolow

jkovach said:


> I'm in the Phoenix area - have had the HD TiVo for 2 months now, and each month on the anniversary of my install, I lose my premium and tier channels. When this happens, I've noted that the Sub Exp Time on the 2nd page of the CA Screen has elapsed. Each time, I've called Cox and they've sent hits to the Cablecard. Tonight it didn't work, so I rebooted and they sent another set of hits. That worked, and now the Sub Exp Time is on Apr 27th, so I'm good for another month...
> 
> Anyways, it appears to me as though something on Cox's end is not automatically sending the required signals each month to update the Sub Exp Time on the cablecards.
> 
> Jeff


So after this post I took note of my SUB Expire Time April 13th. Sure enought I got up this morning and the fix would not work. So I did a hard reboot and called cox to have them send a hit and all my channels came back immediately. 
I had to do the same thing last month but never noticed the sub expire time in the menu before. So at least now I know when I going to have to call cox my ne SUB Expire Time is May 13th. I have not had to have my CC replace since December 29th I can live with the calls to cox csr but having to set aside 4 hours for a truck roll is ridicules.


----------



## lofar

I have been considering buying a Tivo HD for quite a while now and ditching the cox DVR's that I have now but reading some of this thread has me worried a little bit. Are these problems related to only the Tivo Series 3 or are they also on the series 2 HD models?

I'd also like to add a comment on the whole Cox DVR thing, since I've had two for about two years now. Many have said they want to ditch their tivo and go cox dvr, well let me tell you it may not be a better decision. I have gone through about six or more Cox, Scientific Atlanta DVR's. They all have the same problems. They will periodically erase all scheduled recordings for no reason. HD recordings very often play back with choppy/broken sound to the point where it's not even watchable. Other times, erased recordings will come back from the dead and play in place of another recording that you recently recorded. It will also randomly split up your recordings, usually I end up having recordings that are about 55 minutes long and then a second recording that is 5 minutes long with the rest of the show. So while with the Cox DVR you may get all your channels good luck getting it to reliably record and play back anything. Cox gives me the same run-around bull they give you having me switch out the cable boxes every time and then blaming the problem on my inside wiring, I wouldn't be surprised if they started blaming it on sunspots.

I think all the Tivo problems, and all the Cox DVR problems lie in the piece of crap Scientific Atlanta junk equipment they keep using. Cox needs to dump Scientific Atlanta.

Anyways, so I'm on the edge here wondering if I should purchase two tivo HD or just stick with my crappy cox equipment. Sounds like neither one of them is a good choice.


----------



## ajwees41

lofar good luck finding a Series 2HD there are Series 3 or Tivo HD.


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## lofar

Sorry that's what I meant.. the Tivo HD.. I was under the impression that the Tivo HD is really just a series 2 with HD added. Trying to sort out my confusion between Tivo HD and the series 3 which has HD as well.


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## Shawn95GT

FWIW, My Series 3 with two S cards has been relatively flawless since the install. I've had my S3 that has cablecards runing pretty much since Tivo brought the S3 to market. I've had to restart due to a cablecard acting up 3-4 times ever. 

It seems that the Tivo HDs have the bulk of the problems.


----------



## SDRR

My Tivo HD with a SA M-card is having similar issues. (I'm with Cox in San Diego)

I've been losing all channels BUT the local HD channels every couple of days and I had to reboot to get them back. 

But I just got update 9.3a, and now even a reboot won't get them back. I don't get the usual "Acquiring Channel Lineup" screen.

I'm going to ask Cox to reset them... 

Anyone have this sort of problem with 9.3a?


----------



## hddude55

SDRR said:


> My Tivo HD with a SA M-card is having similar issues. (I'm with Cox in San Diego)
> 
> I've been losing all channels BUT the local HD channels every couple of days and I had to reboot to get them back.
> 
> But I just got update 9.3a, and now even a reboot won't get them back. I don't get the usual "Acquiring Channel Lineup" screen.
> 
> I'm going to ask Cox to reset them...
> 
> Anyone have this sort of problem with 9.3a?


 Oh man, this is sick! I had the same experience today and I too received 9.3 witihin the last day. It was bad enough having to reboot every couple days to get my channels back, but now for the first time a reboot won't work. Maybe there is something about the 9.3 "upgrade" that means we will now have to have Cox roll a truck every time we lose channels. Swell.

It's about time to put this series3 piece of crap on Ebay, and I don't care if it's SA's fault or Cox's fault or TiVo's fault. This problem should have been researched and solved months ago.


----------



## craigo

hddude55 said:


> Oh man, this is sick! I had the same experience today and I too received 9.3 witihin the last day. It was bad enough having to reboot every couple days to get my channels back, but now for the first time a reboot won't work. Maybe there is something about the 9.3 "upgrade" that means we will now have to have Cox roll a truck every time we lose channels. Swell.
> 
> It's about time to put this series3 piece of crap on Ebay, and I don't care if it's SA's fault or Cox's fault or TiVo's fault. This problem should have been researched and solved months ago.


I finally had enough of the dropped channels issues and went back to the S-cards for my S3. So far, I've only seen 2 SD channels that I watch every once in a while, FF every couple of minutes. It's really not a big deal since most of my viewing is on HD channels. No more dropped channels. I am almost, once again, a happy Tivo owner.


----------



## hddude55

craigo said:


> I finally had enough of the dropped channels issues and went back to the S-cards for my S3. So far, I've only seen 2 SD channels that I watch every once in a while, FF every couple of minutes. It's really not a big deal since most of my viewing is on HD channels. No more dropped channels. I am almost, once again, a happy Tivo owner.


Do you even have 9.3? Until you have 9.3 for a few weeks I wouldn't feel too safe. It appears something about 9.3 has taken a bad problem and made it into an unbearable one, unless you think rolling a Cox truck every week is realistic. I shouldn't be surprised that this has happened. 9.3 was rolled out before the missing channels problem was even fully understood, much less resolved.


----------



## craigo

hddude55 said:


> Do you even have 9.3? Until you have 9.3 for a few weeks I wouldn't feel too safe. It appears something about 9.3 has taken a bad problem and made it into an unbearable one, unless you think rolling a Cox truck every week is realistic. I shouldn't be surprised that this has happened. 9.3 was rolled out before the missing channels problem was even fully understood, much less resolved.


Yes, I have 9.3. I've never experienced dropped channels with the Scards. The only issue I've had with them is the FF every couple of minutes on certain SD channels. I switched over to the Mcard and the FF problems went away, but of course, the dropped channels started happening. After a few months, I just got sick and tired of rebooting or having Cox come out. Now, back with the Scards and it really isn't that bad. No dropped channels and only a few SD channels FF/Skip. Still not ideal, but I'll take it for now.

YMMV


----------



## hddude55

craigo said:


> Yes, I have 9.3. I've never experienced dropped channels with the Scards. The only issue I've had with them is the FF every couple of minutes on certain SD channels. I switched over to the Mcard and the FF problems went away, but of course, the dropped channels started happening. After a few months, I just got sick and tired of rebooting or having Cox come out. Now, back with the Scards and it really isn't that bad. No dropped channels and only a few SD channels FF/Skip. Still not ideal, but I'll take it for now.
> 
> YMMV


 OK I'll try to have the cablecard1 replaced today with an Scard, assuming the tech has one on the truck -- and that's a huge assumption. However, I have had Scards and Mcards and had the problem has occurred before with either combination, but maybe the latest Scards have newer programming. Its worth a try anyway. Thanks.


----------



## terrab

I'm new to this thread but I am done with Tivo not resolving their issues but still having no problem charging me every month. I have a series 3 with a M-stream card and I am in the Phoenix area. Tivo is worthless. I have to reboot at least once a day. I have tried the single stream cards and they just cause everything to be audio/video desynched. The M-stream card at least gets me content but only for a limited time. Cox blames Tivo and Tivo blames Cox. According to Tivo they "may" be putting out a dongle of some sort to resovle the issue, but i think that is a lot of crap. 

I don't see Tivo fixing this issue any time soon and I will be switching over to Cox DVR instead. I really think that we need to get a class action suit going against tivo. They sell a product that does not perform as advertised and do nothing to resolve it. I am several months in to trying to resolve this and there is no fix in sight.


----------



## Shawn95GT

Well... it's hard to chase down a problem that isn't 100&#37; repeatable in a lab.

I have the same S3 with 2 SA s-cards working great.

This really makes it look like a Cox config problem to me. I'm on the same system, same hardware, and mine works.

When I was installed the installers bailed saying the channels will come in time as the cards update... and they did. Then they crapped out. I put in a trouble ticket and 'magically' it fixed itself over night. I'm convinced they did something on the back end to fix it. I canceled the truck roll and it's been fine since.

I have a friend at work going though the same loss of channels / grey screen problems with cable cards in his TV. 

Common denominator? Cox. Think abut it - they have nothing to lose and everything to gain if we give up on cable cards.


----------



## JayBird

I had cable cards installed in my TiVo HD and my TV on Saturday.

See this post for details of the experience.


----------



## dtplink

Just went through a surprise firmware upgrade. I have a multistream card (Cox, San Diego) and don't see any change to my service and have not received any notification about what changed. Anyone have any clues?

Since the upgrade to TiVo 9.3a I have had strange behavior with recorded programs being difficult to start. I have had to restart the recorder to get normal operation back. It may be coincidence that it happened that it started right after the 9.3 upgrade.


----------



## menos

http://www.cox.com/Oklahoma/hdtv/hdchannels.asp

6 more HD channels in the OKC and Tulsa markets launching on May 20th.

Wooohooo for Sci-Fi HD!!!!!!


----------



## 5cats

dtplink said:


> I have had to restart the recorder to get normal operation back. It may be coincidence that it happened that it started right after the 9.3 upgrade.


Yeah, that's no coincidence. Hopefully TiVo will release yet-another-update to help us out.
-jd.


----------



## Rolow

dtplink said:


> Since the upgrade to TiVo 9.3a I have had strange behavior with recorded programs being difficult to start. I have had to restart the recorder to get normal operation back. It may be coincidence that it happened that it started right after the 9.3 upgrade.


Does it start to play? I mean theres a picture then it freezes with no sound? I'm having the same problem and I thought it was a bad hard drive.


----------



## dtplink

I find that the playback is quirky. It starts to play back for a second and then stops. Switch to a different show and the same thing happens. Switch to live TV and the same thing happens. Reboot and everything is normal. Of course I still have a "black background" problem when I switch from listening to music served from my PC and want to watch a recording or live TV. Again, I have to reboot to get back to normal. I had begun to suspect that the problem was because of changing from one mode (AV2) when using the X-Box to TiVo (HDMI1) might have caused the problem. Haven't pinned it down yet.


----------



## TobyG

Cox in the Baton Rouge area has also let the new HD channels through on the cable cards. Awesome to finally get DiscoveryHD.


----------



## barrettd

menos said:


> http://www.cox.com/Oklahoma/hdtv/hdchannels.asp
> 
> 6 more HD channels in the OKC and Tulsa markets launching on May 20th.
> 
> Wooohooo for Sci-Fi HD!!!!!!


Hopefully they won't delay these being released to our cablecards like the fiasco with the last round of HD channels.

Also, I'd much rather have F/X HD than any news/weather channels. Glad to see Bravo, though.


----------



## thezonie

So my Series 3 that I'd bought the week they came out went belly-up last week. TiVo has been great, over-nighting me a replacement system (yeah, it was a refurb, and yeah, the front had a nice dent in it) so now the only issue is that I need to get my 2 Cox (Phoenix) CableCARDs paired with my new box.

So I put the first card in the first slot of the new unit (just like the tech did over a year and a half ago), got to the screen with the two IDs, and called Cox up, hoping to get someone who would understand my situation and help me with what I needed. (Riiight.) 

I explained my situation (that I had received a new TiVo to replace my old one and that I had put the new cards in the old box and just needed the new box to be paired with the cards) but the CSR insisted that it would require a tech to come out and "install" the cards in my TiVo, and that it would cost me $68. 

I basically explained that I understood what was involved in "installing" the cards, and all I needed was to give them the IDs of the card and box so that they could be paired and I could get all my channels back. The CSR didn't seem to fully understand the situation and insisted that I needed to schedule a tech to come out. I told her that I didn't want to pay $68 for a guy to come to my house, look at my TV, make a phone call, and read the numbers on the screen to someone to complete the "installation", and could I talk to a manager.

A manager wasn't available at the time, so I asked that they call me back. Well, when they did I wasn't home (it was way more than the 2 hours that the CSR said it would take for me to get the call) but the message I got was the standard "If you have a TiVo then a tech needs to install the cards".

I guess my question is if anyone else has gone through this process with successful results, or am I just wasting my time trying to find someone reasonable to help me out? I've decided that if the only way to get my service back is to pay the $68 then I'm just going to cancel HBO and Starz. (The Sopranos is finished, anyway.)


----------



## hddude55

thezonie said:


> So my Series 3 that I'd bought the week they came out went belly-up last week. TiVo has been great, over-nighting me a replacement system (yeah, it was a refurb, and yeah, the front had a nice dent in it) so now the only issue is that I need to get my 2 Cox (Phoenix) CableCARDs paired with my new box.
> 
> So I put the first card in the first slot of the new unit (just like the tech did over a year and a half ago), got to the screen with the two IDs, and called Cox up, hoping to get someone who would understand my situation and help me with what I needed. (Riiight.)
> 
> I explained my situation (that I had received a new TiVo to replace my old one and that I had put the new cards in the old box and just needed the new box to be paired with the cards) but the CSR insisted that it would require a tech to come out and "install" the cards in my TiVo, and that it would cost me $68.
> 
> I basically explained that I understood what was involved in "installing" the cards, and all I needed was to give them the IDs of the card and box so that they could be paired and I could get all my channels back. The CSR didn't seem to fully understand the situation and insisted that I needed to schedule a tech to come out. I told her that I didn't want to pay $68 for a guy to come to my house, look at my TV, make a phone call, and read the numbers on the screen to someone to complete the "installation", and could I talk to a manager.
> 
> A manager wasn't available at the time, so I asked that they call me back. Well, when they did I wasn't home (it was way more than the 2 hours that the CSR said it would take for me to get the call) but the message I got was the standard "If you have a TiVo then a tech needs to install the cards".
> 
> I guess my question is if anyone else has gone through this process with successful results, or am I just wasting my time trying to find someone reasonable to help me out? I've decided that if the only way to get my service back is to pay the $68 then I'm just going to cancel HBO and Starz. (The Sopranos is finished, anyway.)


 OK, you almost had me for a second. This must be a belated April Fool's Day joke. I'm sure you know you can't install cards and even if you could, the cards you have are paired to the old TiVo so even a reasonable Cox tech can't reinstall them in a new TiVo. Can I roll my eyes now, too, you kidder? Look at the bright side. If you are in AZ, there is a great chance the new cards will fail soon and the truck roll to replace them will be free.


----------



## milo99

Cox No.VA still hasn't let the new HD channels through.

*JFranklin* - do you know if this is a Cox nationwide thing (that internal email you saw) or just your market?


----------



## gonealoha

$8.95? Cox in san diego only charges $2.00 per month for each cable card.


----------



## thezonie

Cox Phoenix CableCARDs are $2 each as well.


----------



## thezonie

hddude55 said:


> OK, you almost had me for a second. This must be a belated April Fool's Day joke. I'm sure you know you can't install cards and even if you could, the cards you have are paired to the old TiVo so even a reasonable Cox tech can't reinstall them in a new TiVo. Can I roll my eyes now, too, you kidder? Look at the bright side. If you are in AZ, there is a great chance the new cards will fail soon and the truck roll to replace them will be free.


Thankfully when I called Cox this afternoon to try and talk to someone reasonable I was connected with an extremely helpful CSR that spent 10 minutes re-pairing my CableCARDs. So now all is back to normal.


----------



## jebbbz

I am a Cox customer in Phoenix. While I have experienced loss of channels occasionally since getting my TiVo HD in late January the problem seems to have changed since I got upgraded to 9.3 a few weeks ago. I was wondering if anyone else had noticed this.

Early on I rebooted to fix the problem but then I learned of the menu "trick" which would do the trick faster. Like others, eventually it seemed the menu fix failed and then rebooting failed and after a month I got new a new MCard installed. The old menu trick worked OK until mid-April after the 9.3 upgrade. Since then, the menu trick works differently and much faster.

Before, I would navigate to the CC menu, pick a menu item and wait for the loading-failed message, then back up to the CC main menu and wait two or three minutes for the two other error messages to appear at the top of the screen. Then I could go back to watching TV. Now, when I hit "Clear" to back up from the menu selection that gave me the loading- failed message I immediately get a warning message about the Cablecard not working (no information from cableco or some such thing) and I can return to watching and recording immediately, although sometimes I have to wait for the acquiring-channel-info pinwheel to finish. Start to finish is a minute or so rather than three or four for the old menu trick or five or six for a reboot.


----------



## jfranklin

milo99 said:


> Cox No.VA still hasn't let the new HD channels through.
> 
> *JFranklin* - do you know if this is a Cox nationwide thing (that internal email you saw) or just your market?


Should be all markets. Was supposed to be official a few weeks ago as I remember. I'll have to check Wednesday and see what NoVa is doing. They like to do everything their own way, so might need to get someone to talk to them.


----------



## AZrob

jebbbz said:


> I am a Cox customer in Phoenix. While I have experienced loss of channels occasionally since getting my TiVo HD in late January the problem seems to have changed since I got upgraded to 9.3 a few weeks ago. I was wondering if anyone else had noticed this.
> 
> Early on I rebooted to fix the problem but then I learned of the menu "trick" which would do the trick faster. Like others, eventually it seemed the menu fix failed and then rebooting failed and after a month I got new a new MCard installed. The old menu trick worked OK until mid-April after the 9.3 upgrade. Since then, the menu trick works differently and much faster.
> 
> Before, I would navigate to the CC menu, pick a menu item and wait for the loading-failed message, then back up to the CC main menu and wait two or three minutes for the two other error messages to appear at the top of the screen. Then I could go back to watching TV. Now, when I hit "Clear" to back up from the menu selection that gave me the loading- failed message I immediately get a warning message about the Cablecard not working (no information from cableco or some such thing) and I can return to watching and recording immediately, although sometimes I have to wait for the acquiring-channel-info pinwheel to finish. Start to finish is a minute or so rather than three or four for the old menu trick or five or six for a reboot.


I have been following the M-card loss-of-encrypted channels problems since late December, experiencing an outage about once every 3 days. Since I upgraded to 9.3 two weeks ago, I have not caught one instance of this occurring. And this is with me checking every morning to see if I have all of my channels.

Having said this, I can't say that the problem is 100% fixed, because there is the possibility that the fix has come in the form of an immediate resetting of the CC when the loss occurs, instead of preventing the loss in the first place. That would mean, as I think Tivo has stated somewhere, that if the loss occurs in the middle of a program, that although the station will come back, the recording will not restart. Hence, you would not get the rest of the program.

But I haven't found any example yet where this occurred. Since only a third of my programs are from encrypted channels, it's possible that any outages by chance did not occur during those recordings...but it could still happen.

Anyone else care to share their post-9.3 upgrade experiences in this regard?

Oh, and I also want to say that I have not experience the video blackout (also referred to as the Gray Screen of Death or GSOD) since the upgrade. But it was only happening about once a month before that anyway.

Rob


----------



## sniperlv

Cox in Phoenix is getting ready to roll out VOD so they say. Will the Cable Cards in the HD Tivo be able to use the VOD?


----------



## Shawn95GT

sniperlv said:


> Cox in Phoenix is getting ready to roll out VOD so they say. Will the Cable Cards in the HD Tivo be able to use the VOD?


Nope...

Cox just did aback end upgrade overnight here - All services (phone / TV / Internet) were down last night.


----------



## jebbbz

AZrob said:


> I have been following the M-card loss-of-encrypted channels problems since late December...
> 
> Having said this, I can't say that the problem is 100% fixed, because there is the possibility that the fix has come in the form of an immediate resetting of the CC when the loss occurs, instead of preventing the loss in the first place...
> 
> Rob


What you say about automatic resetting might be true and it may have happened more times than I have noticed, say, at night. The times I have noticed I have watched the problem develop, with the picture I am watching freezing and when I check other encrypted channels them being black as is the original picture. I then head to the CC menu to fix things.


----------



## Rolow

AZrob said:


> Having said this, I can't say that the problem is 100% fixed, because there is the possibility that the fix has come in the form of an immediate resetting of the CC when the loss occurs, instead of preventing the loss in the first place. That would mean, as I think Tivo has stated somewhere, that if the loss occurs in the middle of a program, that although the station will come back, the recording will not restart. Hence, you would not get the rest of the program.
> 
> Anyone else care to share their post-9.3 upgrade experiences in this regard?
> 
> Oh, and I also want to say that I have not experience the video blackout (also referred to as the Gray Screen of Death or GSOD) since the upgrade. But it was only happening about once a month before that anyway.
> 
> Rob


My Tivo HD has stopped recording on two separate occasions since 9.3 Both time i found the problem with in a half hour. I had to manually start the recordings again. The fist time i restarted the tivo before i checked the channels. the second time I checked the channels before doing anything and they where all fine.


----------



## milo99

jfranklin said:


> Should be all markets. Was supposed to be official a few weeks ago as I remember. I'll have to check Wednesday and see what NoVa is doing. They like to do everything their own way, so might need to get someone to talk to them.


interesting. I emailed, and called asking about this. The people i spoke with had no idea. they gave me the standard lines about SDV. When i told them that other COX markets were doing this (letting HD channels through), they said they don't know anything about it, but they are examining what their customers want. I politely told them, their cable card customers want the HD channels. I'm sure there are other channels that are in lower demand.

So while i was on the phone with them, i asked them about something else- the whole deal with my basic and expanded channels coming through in analog insted of digital (another chaffe of mine, since i'm supposed to be paying for 100% digital cable). The phone tech couldn't tell me why, so they sent over a tech. The guy's english wasn't great, but it seems he understood the situation, and if i understood his english, basically told me that channels 2-102 are broadcast in both analog and digital, and the digital is on SDV.

wow. that ain't cool.


----------



## moyekj

milo99 said:


> The guy's english wasn't great, but it seems he understood the situation, and if i understood his english, basically told me that channels 2-102 are broadcast in both analog and digital, and the digital is on SDV.
> 
> wow. that ain't cool.


 Yes, that's my understanding of what's likely to happen in Cox, Orange County area once SDV deploys as well - all digital simulcast channels will go SDV and the CableCard channel maps will revert back to analog channels for sub-100 channels.
While obviously it's not a good thing for CableCard users it does make sense to put those channels in the SDV pool since there still is a large customer base that doesn't subscribe to digital video services. In a way it could be a good thing since it may mean less HD channels going SDV in the short term. I would expect this will happen in most/all Cox markets where SDV is deployed.


----------



## jfranklin

milo99 said:


> The guy's english wasn't great, but it seems he understood the situation, and if i understood his english, basically told me that channels 2-102 are broadcast in both analog and digital, and the digital is on SDV.
> 
> wow. that ain't cool.


Not all of them, but a large chunk of them are SDV if my list is current (says it was updated 04/22/08, so I assume it is). Per the list, though, none of the HD channels are SDV in your area, and per a lead here that change is supposed to be all markets.

Odd that no one knew what you were talking about in relation to that as my call center IS the call center you would have talked to. NoVa no longer has a technical call center as I understand it. Just billing/sales/ect.

Definitly call back in, and keep doing so until you get a resolution. I will continue to look into it from this end. At least make certian that it is supposed to be all markets, and that the SDV channel list I have is up to date.


----------



## milo99

jfranklin said:


> Not all of them, but a large chunk of them are SDV if my list is current (says it was updated 04/22/08, so I assume it is). Per the list, though, none of the HD channels are SDV in your area, and per a lead here that change is supposed to be all markets.
> 
> Odd that no one knew what you were talking about in relation to that as my call center IS the call center you would have talked to. NoVa no longer has a technical call center as I understand it. Just billing/sales/ect.
> 
> Definitly call back in, and keep doing so until you get a resolution. I will continue to look into it from this end. At least make certian that it is supposed to be all markets, and that the SDV channel list I have is up to date.


I can tell you that these are the HD channels i get:
703
704
705
706
707
709
710
712
714
715
716
717
719
720
721

These show up on my program guide, have all the info as any normal station, but when I tune, i get a "Channel not available" tivo message:
708
711
718
722-734

So when I call (703) 378-8422 and ask for technical support, it gets routed to you guys? that's odd...


----------



## jfranklin

milo99 said:


> I can tell you that these are the HD channels i get:
> 
> ...
> 
> These show up on my program guide, have all the info as any normal station, but when I tune, i get a "Channel not available" tivo message:
> 708
> 711
> 718
> 722-734
> 
> So when I call (703) 378-8422 and ask for technical support, it gets routed to you guys? that's odd...


The channels that you aren't getting do seem to be the ones added since November `07. I asked the guy I go to for NoVa issues and he confirmed that it should be all areas, and that the list I was looking at for SDV channels should be up to date. If it weren't for you getting 712 and a few others I'd just say that you don't have expanded, but if you didn't those wouldn't come in either. Might need to be repaired (though that shouldn't be needed). I've got my guy here looking for an answer from NoVa MTC, but they are a little slow to respond to us at times, so it might be a few days before I hear something. In the mean time, if you want, PM me with your address and I'll take a look at your account to be sure that everything is on their right, or call back in and have someone check the balancing on your account.

And yes, NoVa and Roanoke technical calls come to Hampton Roads. Have been for a little while now.


----------



## sooka

milo99 said:


> I can tell you that these are the HD channels i get:
> 703
> 704
> 705
> 706
> 707
> 709
> 710
> 712
> 714
> 715
> 716
> 717
> 719
> 720
> 721
> 
> These show up on my program guide, have all the info as any normal station, but when I tune, i get a "Channel not available" tivo message:
> 708
> 711
> 718
> 722-734
> 
> So when I call (703) 378-8422 and ask for technical support, it gets routed to you guys? that's odd...


Live in Burke/Fairfax area with Cox, and these channels that you say you can/t get are on SDV. My TV that takes cable cards also can't tune these channels. From what I understand, all HD channels that were added after the initial SDV push were put on SDV and will be unavailable to TIVO users and anyone else with a cablecard device. The ones you can tune to in the 700s were prior to the SDV push in the Cox Northern Virginia area.


----------



## milo99

jfranklin said:


> The channels that you aren't getting do seem to be the ones added since November `07. I asked the guy I go to for NoVa issues and he confirmed that it should be all areas, and that the list I was looking at for SDV channels should be up to date. If it weren't for you getting 712 and a few others I'd just say that you don't have expanded, but if you didn't those wouldn't come in either. Might need to be repaired (though that shouldn't be needed). I've got my guy here looking for an answer from NoVa MTC, but they are a little slow to respond to us at times, so it might be a few days before I hear something. In the mean time, if you want, PM me with your address and I'll take a look at your account to be sure that everything is on their right, or call back in and have someone check the balancing on your account.
> 
> And yes, NoVa and Roanoke technical calls come to Hampton Roads. Have been for a little while now.


Right now i have the discovery, movie, variety and sports tiers so yea, i should be getting all of those HDs. i'm not subscribed to premium movie channel so i haven't bothered trying to find those. I'll PM you my info. Thanks!


----------



## fishnose

I have Cox service in Northern Virginia (Vienna/Oakton area) and some emails from "customer service" (sarcasm absolutely intended) told me that despite my subscription with digital tiers (sports, movie, variety, discovery):

(1) no reception would be provided on the "newly added" HD channels (i.e., added November 2007 or after and currently placed at channel numbers 708, 711, 718, 722-734)) unless I used the Cox boxes

and

(2) no decision on dongles to avoid the UDCP issues (cable card issues) with SDV although they are aware that others are implementing them.


----------



## ajwees41

fishnose said:


> I have Cox service in Northern Virginia (Vienna/Oakton area) and some emails from "customer service" (sarcasm absolutely intended) told me that despite my subscription with digital tiers (sports, movie, variety, discovery):
> 
> (1) no reception would be provided on the "newly added" HD channels (i.e., added November 2007 or after and currently placed at channel numbers 708, 711, 718, 722-734)) unless I used the Cox boxes
> 
> and
> 
> (2) no decision on dongles to avoid the UDCP issues (cable card issues) with SDV although they are aware that others are implementing them.


the dongle is not even out yet.


----------



## milo99

fishnose said:


> I have Cox service in Northern Virginia (Vienna/Oakton area) and some emails from "customer service" (sarcasm absolutely intended) told me that despite my subscription with digital tiers (sports, movie, variety, discovery):
> 
> (1) no reception would be provided on the "newly added" HD channels (i.e., added November 2007 or after and currently placed at channel numbers 708, 711, 718, 722-734)) unless I used the Cox boxes
> 
> and
> 
> (2) no decision on dongles to avoid the UDCP issues (cable card issues) with SDV although they are aware that others are implementing them.


yea, unfortunately, the problem is that too many people that work at Cox just don't know the situation, and just tell you the token line- you won't be able to access them w/o Cox equipment.

However, luckily there are a few Cox employees out there like JFranklin who go above and beyond and do extra research, and peruse these boards in order to figure out what their customers are dealing with. he tried to help me out in case it was indeed an issue w/ my card configuration, but we concluded it was just the NoVA Cox market not doing what others have done.

he said he'll post to this thread as he finds any additional info for us, so at least we have one knowledgeable Cox Rep who will be able to shed some light for us.


----------



## jfranklin

I've been asked to collect account info from anyone in Northern Virginia who is not able to receive the HD channels ,via CableCARD, that were added since November 2007.

I have two people looking into this situation, here, where I am. One of which just recently transfered here from NOVA. It is my hope that between the two of them we should be able to get some kind of answer as to what is happening in short order.

If you do not feel comfertable sending me your information (address would be best) via PM, then let me know via PM and I will give you my Cox corporate email address. For obvious reasons I don't want to post it here.


----------



## milo99

there are apparently at least another 5 new HD channels in the 730s that have shown up on my program guide.. .but alas, these also are not viewable.


----------



## Sadara

Replaced a CableCARD today. I had other issues and recently reimaged my 250GB drive in my S3, but I can't help but wonder if the problems I was having was because I had a cable card that needed to be replaced. Anyway....

The 3 channels that Cox Kansas added a couple of months back (the ones supposedly reserved for SDV) are now showing up for us. I have three networks I am keeping my eyes peeled for, SciFi HD, FX HD and CW HD. I really can't wait for those!! I honestly don't care about any of the others that we don't already have.


----------



## jfranklin

I've given the people who are working on this for me the account info for the people who have responded to me. I'm off until Wednesday, but I'll keep an eye on my corp email over the next two days, and if something comes in I'll let you all know.


----------



## jonginear

Have any of the Cox Phoenix TiVo HD owners noticed any improvement in operation since the 9.3 rollout? I have 2 series 3's with 2 S cards each and have had little difficulty in the last 2 years, but my customers with TiVo HD's have had many issues. I want to start selling TiVo's again but not until I am confident that they will actually work.

Thanks,


----------



## hddude55

jonginear said:


> Have any of the Cox Phoenix TiVo HD owners noticed any improvement in operation since the 9.3 rollout? I have 2 series 3's with 2 S cards each and have had little difficulty in the last 2 years, but my customers with TiVo HD's have had many issues. I want to start selling TiVo's again but not until I am confident that they will actually work.
> 
> Thanks,


I have had channel loss issues since receiving 9.3 -- and have had new cards installed twice since 9.3 -- but that was no surprise since I was told by a TiVo CSR that 9.3 did not address that problem, which has been a major bummer in the Phoenix area. I'm betting you could call Cox Phoenix and almost any CSR would just groan if you bring up the channel loss problem.


----------



## Pafrican

Knocking on wood and I know I'm cursing myself but...

I haven't had any issues with losing channels since getting two s-cards in place of an m-card (I'm in Phx). Was not the ideal situation as I'd rather not pay the $2 extra a month, but compared to having monthly (sometimes twice monthly) service calls that lasted hours it's not so bad. I think it's been two-three months since I had the s-cards installed so I'm pretty happy with that.

Has there been anybody else seeing less frequent channel dropping or is everyone still having the issue?


----------



## junior15

I live in Herndon, VA (serviced by Cox - Fairfax) and am considering buying a TivoHD and getting cable cards from Cox. After reading this thread (OK, I didn't read all of it, but I read a lot of it), it sounds like I should hold off until some issues are worked out. If my understanding of the situation is correct, Cox is using SDV for some if its channels (including some HD) and those don't work with cable cards. If I'm wrong about this, please let me know. If this is the case, then I think I'll hold off on getting the cable cards (and the TivoHD) until either Tivo releases their dongle that provides compatibility with SDV or Cox changes things so that cable card users get all the HD channels.

I'm hoping somebody here can help me out before I take the leap and go HD.

Thanks


----------



## milo99

junior15 said:


> I live in Herndon, VA (serviced by Cox - Fairfax) and am considering buying a TivoHD and getting cable cards from Cox. After reading this thread (OK, I didn't read all of it, but I read a lot of it), it sounds like I should hold off until some issues are worked out. If my understanding of the situation is correct, Cox is using SDV for some if its channels (including some HD) and those don't work with cable cards. If I'm wrong about this, please let me know. If this is the case, then I think I'll hold off on getting the cable cards (and the TivoHD) until either Tivo releases their dongle that provides compatibility with SDV or Cox changes things so that cable card users get all the HD channels.
> 
> I'm hoping somebody here can help me out before I take the leap and go HD.
> 
> Thanks


yes, you are correct. You only get about 14 HD channels (you get all the other normal channels, except some are in analog instead of digital - if you look at the channel map on cox's website, it's everything under 102), and the rest are on SDV. Everything else though works pretty great.

So if you can deal w/ their HD DVR and pay the extra monthly fee for that time, then that may be a good way to go for a few months. Hopefully, JFranklin's efforts will prove fruitful and we'll be seeing the channels we're missing sooner than later.


----------



## junior15

Well, right now, I don't have HD at all, so any HD that I get would be additional to what I get now. I also don't have any of the digital stuff (I get through 102) so any of that would be additional as well. I'm just trying to decide if I want to pay the extra $20 per month for the 2 cable cards (and digital gateway service on each) in addition to the extra $10 for the Tivo service if I'm not gonna get everything. Is there a list somewhere of which HD channels I will be able to get with the cable cards (so I can see what I will be missing)? If I will be getting the ones I care about, then I may go ahead and do it.

Thanks


----------



## milo99

junior15 said:


> Well, right now, I don't have HD at all, so any HD that I get would be additional to what I get now. I also don't have any of the digital stuff (I get through 102) so any of that would be additional as well. I'm just trying to decide if I want to pay the extra $20 per month for the 2 cable cards (and digital gateway service on each) in addition to the extra $10 for the Tivo service if I'm not gonna get everything. Is there a list somewhere of which HD channels I will be able to get with the cable cards (so I can see what I will be missing)? If I will be getting the ones I care about, then I may go ahead and do it.
> 
> Thanks


heres the channel list
http://www.cox.com/fairfax/digitalcable/digitalchannellineup.asp

these are the HD channels you'll get w/ cable cards
703
704
705
706
707
709
710
712
714
715
716
717
719
720
721


----------



## dtplink

junior15 said:


> I live in Herndon, VA (serviced by Cox - Fairfax)
> 
> I'm hoping somebody here can help me out before I take the leap and go HD.
> 
> Thanks


I've been using TiVo since their first products hit the market. Since then I've gotten spotty service from their sales dept. (during last Christmas, but still); lost my satellite sports subscriptions due to SDV when I switched to S3HD and cable; experiencing bugs now with 9.3a (black screen, reboots needed) and I still prefer the TiVo experience to Cox DVR or any of the other I've seen.

With Cox I now have enough HD stations to feel like I'm being served. I bought the TiVo expansion drive and reclaimed the time I used to waste erasing stuff to make space, etc. and I still enjoy the TiVo onscreen user experience every day. It's even gotten snappier.

So overall I realize I'm getting screwed being caught in the middle of the TiVo/Cable/Satellite/Telephone Cos. wars but this too will pass.


----------



## tagpats

i dumped my M card for two S cards and have had to reboot once and have been free of problems for exactly 1 month. i don't know what has changed, but i've almost gotten to the point of not worrying about whether i will have a picture when i turn my tv on each day, which is a nice change.

assuming all continues to go well, i'm looking forward to the dongle so that i can obtain all of the SDV channels i'm not currently getting with Cox in Northern Virginia.

i don't know what the deal is with the cox csr that is trying to get information on why we're not receiving the sdv channels, but it seemed pretty straight forward that anything we have now, we'll continue to have and any new hd channels that are released in sdv will be unavailable until the dongle.

since scientific atlanta is less than swift, i'd be interested in what cox has to report on when we might see this elusive dongle that was supposed to be available in the second quarter of 2008.



Pafrican said:


> Knocking on wood and I know I'm cursing myself but...
> 
> I haven't had any issues with losing channels since getting two s-cards in place of an m-card (I'm in Phx). Was not the ideal situation as I'd rather not pay the $2 extra a month, but compared to having monthly (sometimes twice monthly) service calls that lasted hours it's not so bad. I think it's been two-three months since I had the s-cards installed so I'm pretty happy with that.
> 
> Has there been anybody else seeing less frequent channel dropping or is everyone still having the issue?


----------



## AZrob

AZrob said:


> I have been following the M-card loss-of-encrypted channels problems since late December, experiencing an outage about once every 3 days. Since I upgraded to 9.3 two weeks ago, I have not caught one instance of this occurring. And this is with me checking every morning to see if I have all of my channels.
> 
> Having said this, I can't say that the problem is 100% fixed, because there is the possibility that the fix has come in the form of an immediate resetting of the CC when the loss occurs, instead of preventing the loss in the first place. That would mean, as I think Tivo has stated somewhere, that if the loss occurs in the middle of a program, that although the station will come back, the recording will not restart. Hence, you would not get the rest of the program.
> 
> But I haven't found any example yet where this occurred. Since only a third of my programs are from encrypted channels, it's possible that any outages by chance did not occur during those recordings...but it could still happen.
> 
> Anyone else care to share their post-9.3 upgrade experiences in this regard?
> 
> Oh, and I also want to say that I have not experience the video blackout (also referred to as the Gray Screen of Death or GSOD) since the upgrade. But it was only happening about once a month before that anyway.
> 
> Rob


Okay, I spoke too soon. Tonight I had a CC outage while the Tivo HD was set to record Battlestar Galactica. I tuned to the show, which had been supposedly recording for 5 minutes, and the green cursor was stuck at the beginning, plus the screen was black. Since the show had already been on for 5 minutes, I figured the Tivo HD wasn't going to reset itself, like I thought it was supposed to after the 9.3 upgrade...so I reset the channels myself, using the menu option. It did work much faster than before, which I think others have noticed....but that didn't get me back the first 5 minutes of the show.

So, it truly is only a partial solution at this point.

Rob


----------



## hddude55

AZrob said:


> Okay, I spoke too soon. Tonight I had a CC outage while the Tivo HD was set to record Battlestar Galactica. I tuned to the show, which had been supposedly recording for 5 minutes, and the green cursor was stuck at the beginning, plus the screen was black. Since the show had already been on for 5 minutes, I figured the Tivo HD wasn't going to reset itself, like I thought it was supposed to after the 9.3 upgrade...so I reset the channels myself, using the menu option. It did work much faster than before, which I think others have noticed....but that didn't get me back the first 5 minutes of the show.
> 
> So, it truly is only a partial solution at this point.
> 
> Rob


 Here in Gilbert AZ I just lost channels today on my latest "new" card in slot 1 of my Series 3. It worked fine for about two weeks. Whoopee.

I haven't had Cox roll a truck yet. The telephone CSR remotely unpaired, repaired, then hit the cards with an "H Wave?" He was hard to understand so I may have misunderstood the part about an H wave. (FYI the original problem was not that card 1 was unpaired, in case someone asks.) I have my channels back and no reboot was needed, but unlike you I don't consider any of these new developments that restore channels to be a partial solution. It has been over six months since this nonsense started and I doubt they even fully understand the problem.


----------



## milo99

tagpats said:


> i don't know what the deal is with the cox csr that is trying to get information on why we're not receiving the sdv channels, but it seemed pretty straight forward that anything we have now, we'll continue to have and any new hd channels that are released in sdv will be unavailable until the dongle.
> 
> since scientific atlanta is less than swift, i'd be interested in what cox has to report on when we might see this elusive dongle that was supposed to be available in the second quarter of 2008.


the CSR has been told that company wide - not just market specific areas - the SDV policy is changing so that HD channels are no longer on SDV. We've seen this change take place in other markets including the CSR's home market of Hampton, and Tivo customers who once could not access some of those HD channels now can.

So seeing that his call center services NOVA tech support calls, he's looking into why NOVA customers are still stuck with the new HD Channels being on SDV.


----------



## JayBird

I'm in Gilbert, AZ, and I have digital cable, internet, and digital telephone, all from Cox. Since I have all 3 services, I've been getting a "digital home pak bundle discount" of $32.90 off my bill each month.

So recently I turned in my old cable box for cable cards - 1 M-Card for my new TiVo HD, and 1 S-Card for my Pioneer plasma TV.

And then I get my next bill...

1. The charge for the "digital gateway service" went from $5.00 to $7.00 (not sure why this was increased by $2.00 - anybody know?).
2. The charge for the old cable box of $6.00 is gone, but is replaced with a charge of $4.00 for the two cable cards (this I expected).
3. I was charged for 3 cable card installations, even though they only installed 2 cards (this doesn't surprise me, since the CSR who took my order insisted I needed 2 cards for the TiVo, for a total of 3 with the TV, and wouldn't listen to any arguments to the contrary when I tried to explain that I actually only needed one M-card for the TiVo HD).
4. But here's the real kicker... they eliminated my "digital home pack bundle discount", so now to use cable cards instead of Cox's box, I'm paying an additional $32.90 a month.

Is there anybody else who has all 3 services who also got screwed by this when they switched to cable cards, or is this just an error on Cox's part that can be corrected?

Would requiring to have their box to get the discount be in violation of the FCC rules regarding my choice to use cable card devices in leiu of their box?

Would this be considered an anti-cable card scam?

I want to be armed with all the info I can get before I call Cox to dispute the charges on my bill.


----------



## milo99

JayBird said:


> I'm in Gilbert, AZ, and I have digital cable, internet, and digital telephone, all from Cox. Since I have all 3 services, I've been getting a "digital home pak bundle discount" of $32.90 off my bill each month.
> 
> So recently I turned in my old cable box for cable cards - 1 M-Card for my new TiVo HD, and 1 S-Card for my Pioneer plasma TV.
> 
> And then I get my next bill...
> 
> 1. The charge for the "digital gateway service" went from $5.00 to $7.00 (not sure why this was increased by $2.00 - anybody know?).
> 2. The charge for the old cable box of $6.00 is gone, but is replaced with a charge of $4.00 for the two cable cards (this I expected).
> 3. I was charged for 3 cable card installations, even though they only installed 2 cards (this doesn't surprise me, since the CSR who took my order insisted I needed 2 cards for the TiVo, for a total of 3 with the TV, and wouldn't listen to any arguments to the contrary when I tried to explain that I actually only needed one M-card for the TiVo HD).
> 4. But here's the real kicker... they eliminated my "digital home pack bundle discount", so now to use cable cards instead of Cox's box, I'm paying an additional $32.90 a month.
> 
> Is there anybody else who has all 3 services who also got screwed by this when they switched to cable cards, or is this just an error on Cox's part that can be corrected?
> 
> Would requiring to have their box to get the discount be in violation of the FCC rules regarding my choice to use cable card devices in leiu of their box?
> 
> Would this be considered an anti-cable card scam?
> 
> I want to be armed with all the info I can get before I call Cox to dispute the charges on my bill.


does it say anywhere on your old bill, or on their website where they have mention of this bundle offer, that it must be with all their equipment?

if no, then that's all you need really. They don't say they require it, then they can't make you have it.

If they DO say it, then that's when any FCC regulation would come into play.


----------



## Shawn95GT

JayBird said:


> I'm in Gilbert, AZ, and I have digital cable, internet, and digital telephone, all from Cox. Since I have all 3 services, I've been getting a "digital home pak bundle discount" of $32.90 off my bill each month.
> 
> So recently I turned in my old cable box for cable cards - 1 M-Card for my new TiVo HD, and 1 S-Card for my Pioneer plasma TV.
> 
> And then I get my next bill...
> 
> 1. The charge for the "digital gateway service" went from $5.00 to $7.00 (not sure why this was increased by $2.00 - anybody know?).
> 2. The charge for the old cable box of $6.00 is gone, but is replaced with a charge of $4.00 for the two cable cards (this I expected).
> 3. I was charged for 3 cable card installations, even though they only installed 2 cards (this doesn't surprise me, since the CSR who took my order insisted I needed 2 cards for the TiVo, for a total of 3 with the TV, and wouldn't listen to any arguments to the contrary when I tried to explain that I actually only needed one M-card for the TiVo HD).
> 4. But here's the real kicker... they eliminated my "digital home pack bundle discount", so now to use cable cards instead of Cox's box, I'm paying an additional $32.90 a month.
> 
> Is there anybody else who has all 3 services who also got screwed by this when they switched to cable cards, or is this just an error on Cox's part that can be corrected?
> 
> Would requiring to have their box to get the discount be in violation of the FCC rules regarding my choice to use cable card devices in leiu of their box?
> 
> Would this be considered an anti-cable card scam?
> 
> I want to be armed with all the info I can get before I call Cox to dispute the charges on my bill.


Call back and escalate if you need to. Their bundle pack is plus equipment.

I signed up for Cox when I got my S3. I've never had a cable box since they installed and I 'was' bundled.

I actually opted out of their bundle as of the last price increase. they are forcing to upgrade to the Premier internet service and raising the price from my old $99 rate to like $130 for the three services, plus equipment and taxes. Basically taking my bill from $120ish to $140+.

I stripped my home phone down the 12.00 service, digital cable (no premiums), and the 'standard' 7.0/512 Internet and after the cablecard fees / taxes etc I pay just under $118/mo. If i strip the Internet down to the econo 1 megabit package I could get down to about $100/mo. I seriously concidered subscriving to digital cable and just not renting a box (or cablecards) because it's cheaper with the bundle vs analog ala carte.

The cablecard install fees will be easy to dispute. Ask how many cablecards are on the account .

Shawn


----------



## tagpats

for the feedback on this. That would be great! I just assumed that what we were seeing was a decision to defer release of these new HD channels in SDV, but didn't realize that after release they were reversing course and making them available. This would be a nice development to hold us over until the dongle is up and running.



milo99 said:


> the CSR has been told that company wide - not just market specific areas - the SDV policy is changing so that HD channels are no longer on SDV. We've seen this change take place in other markets including the CSR's home market of Hampton, and Tivo customers who once could not access some of those HD channels now can.
> 
> So seeing that his call center services NOVA tech support calls, he's looking into why NOVA customers are still stuck with the new HD Channels being on SDV.


----------



## Rolow

Rolow said:


> So after this post I took note of my SUB Expire Time April 13th. Sure enough I got up this morning and the fix would not work. So I did a hard reboot and called cox to have them send a hit and all my channels came back immediately.
> I had to do the same thing last month but never noticed the sub expire time in the menu before. So at least now I know when I going to have to call cox my new SUB Expire Time is May 13th. I have not had to have my CC replace since December 29th I can live with the calls to cox csr but having to set aside 4 hours for a truck roll is ridicules.


I got 9.3 April 18th and haven't had to do a reboot or use the fix it trick since.

I have lost channels twice and flipping between channels brings every thing back. So I wasn't even thinking about my SUB Expire time of May 13th until this evening when all my channels are gone again. The fix it trick did not work and again a reboot did not work so I'm now on hold with Cox.

Just got off the phone with a cox csr and a hit fixed it again. This time my sub expire time is WED. Jun.11 2008 4:16:00am gmt Whats funny is my Last Error Time is THU. Feb 1 1996 2:23:44am gmt and the EUT Update Time is WED. May 14 2008 1:39:34am gmt

*Edit*
Not all my channels went away just the usual ones here in Phoenix


----------



## tagpats

Can anyone tell me how to locate the SUB expire time? I am using 2 S Cards.


----------



## Rolow

From Tivo Central go to
Messages & Settings> Account & System Information> CableCARD Decoders> Configure CableCARD 1> CableCARD Menu> SA CableCARD CA Screen> enter on your remote

That will bring you to page 2 of the CA Screen. SUBExpireTime is about half way down.
My set up is a single multi streem sa card on cox Phoenix in a tivo HD. Hope that helps


----------



## tagpats

Thanks for the help. I tried to locate it, but maybe this is just available for M Card users. I just have a SA CableCard CP Screen, not a CA screen. I have just 3 screen options to choose from and none had the SUB on it.


----------



## jfranklin

As of last night I hadn't gotten anything from the guy that's communicating with NoVa. He should be in this afternoon, so hopfully something then.

I've been in a lot of meetings lately; new supervisor, so a lot of 'getting to know you' sessions that seem to be so popular with corperations now. Have another meeting today with the higher ups about revamping video training, so I'll be flying the CableCARD banner in there.

If I don't get anything by the end of the week I'll start trying to get answers directly.

I'm all for following the chain of command, so long as their is an answer at the end of the chain.


----------



## yroca

Rolow said:


> I got 9.3 April 18th and haven't had to do a reboot or use the fix it trick since.
> 
> I have lost channels twice and flipping between channels brings every thing back. So I wasn't even thinking about my SUB Expire time of May 13th until this evening when all my channels are gone again. The fix it trick did not work and again a reboot did not work so I'm now on hold with Cox.
> 
> Just got off the phone with a cox csr and a hit fixed it again. This time my sub expire time is WED. Jun.11 2008 4:16:00am gmt Whats funny is my Last Error Time is THU. Feb 1 1996 2:23:44am gmt and the EUT Update Time is WED. May 14 2008 1:39:34am gmt
> 
> *Edit*
> Not all my channels went away just the usual ones here in Phoenix


I am having the SubExpireTime issue every 30 days. Like clockwork, I will lose the usual subset of channels. I have found rebooting prior to calling in helps when the send the hits. This is far less annoying that losing channels every 2-3 days, but is still something I hope they will figure out. I have had this issue since Nov or Dec with the SubExpireTime. The other thing to keep in mind is that the SubExpireTime is in GMT, so sometimes it looks like it is still in the future...


----------



## thewebgal

jfranklin said:


> As of last night I hadn't gotten anything from the guy that's communicating with NoVa. He should be in this afternoon, so hopfully something then.
> 
> I've been in a lot of meetings lately; new supervisor, so a lot of 'getting to know you' sessions that seem to be so popular with corperations now. Have another meeting today with the higher ups about revamping video training, so I'll be flying the CableCARD banner in there.
> 
> If I don't get anything by the end of the week I'll start trying to get answers directly.
> 
> I'm all for following the chain of command, so long as their is an answer at the end of the chain.


Awesome, thank you for trying to help us get the channels that we pay for but cannot receive. I sent you a pvt email with my info, but if it helps, remind them that in many markets, VERIZON FIOS has just been installed and all channels are available on THAT system and the FIOS folks are treating conversion customers very well ... (frankly, I'd rather stay on Cox, IF they'd just give us all the channels we are paying for already!)


----------



## tivocrazy

Here is a problem that will affect anyone who has the following equipment

TiVo HD (and I imagine Series 3) with a Motorola M Card
Another Tivo uint using MRV or using TiVo Desktop on their PC

I have been working closely with Cox to narrow down a problem with the CCI byte being set which has prevented either MRV transfers or downloads to the PC using TiVo Desktop. Most recorded content is being copyright protected, even content that is over the air. Anyone who does not use MRV or TiVo Desktop will not notice this problem as their TiVo HD has no problem with viewing content that was recorded on the same unit. Cox is reporting that the problem lies with the Motorola M card. I have since switched to 2 S cards and the problem has gone away. Cox is working with Motorola to correct the issue. If this information is correct then anyone with the above setup should also be having this problem.


----------



## BrianAZ

yroca said:


> I am having the SubExpireTime issue every 30 days. Like clockwork, I will lose the usual subset of channels. I have found rebooting prior to calling in helps when the send the hits. This is far less annoying that losing channels every 2-3 days, but is still something I hope they will figure out. I have had this issue since Nov or Dec with the SubExpireTime. The other thing to keep in mind is that the SubExpireTime is in GMT, so sometimes it looks like it is still in the future...


I believe you are still having the "lost channels" problem every 2-3 days. The difference now is that the most recent software update causes the Tivo to reset the card on it's own when it happens (so you don't have to do it manually or by rebooting). If it happens while you're recording something, you'll notice it because you have partial recordings. I do agree that knowing when the Tivo will no longer be able to reset the card(s) is a great piece of info.


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## doormat

I also seem to be having the subexpiretime issue. I just called in yesterday to cox to have them rehit my cards. Its getting very frustrating. I want to trebuchet my TiVoHD back where it came from. 

At least I'm not the only one...


----------



## lament

Hey all,

Anyone with Cox San Diego having any CableCard issues? Yesterday the TiVo started freezing on Live TV (rewinding would fix the issue).

And now, after submitting a channel lineup addition (709, 728 and 738 aren't in the guide yet), I'm getting a CableCard error 161-38 and 161-52. I already rebooted but I'm still having this issue. 

Just curious if anyone else in San Diego is getting these or is my M-card crapping out.

Thanks!


----------



## 5cats

lament said:


> Anyone with Cox San Diego having any CableCard issues? Yesterday the TiVo started freezing on Live TV (rewinding would fix the issue).


Nearly every day. Same symptoms, and more: keep an eye out for partial recordings. I see them constantly now.



> Just curious if anyone else in San Diego is getting these or is my M-card crapping out.


I recently had my MCard replaced. Result: no change. Partials, stutters on live TV, etc. *sigh*

Sorry for the bad news,
-jd.


----------



## tagpats

I just experienced the same screen freeze problem this morning on mine. Any channel I changed to would just lock up like I paused it. A reboot fixed it.

I have 2 SA S Cards and this is the first time I've had an issue since the first week in April. Longest stretch I've gone since I switched to Cox in Northern Virginia.


----------



## doormat

I just got a M-Card firmware update for my SA card. Anyone else get it? Do we know what it'll fix?


----------



## tivocrazy

Hey doormat, what brand of M cards is Cox using out there in Vegas? Also, since you have a S2 do you use multi-room viewing? If so, when you view the content from your HD unit using the S2 is all (or most) of the content recorded on the HD unit showing that the recording is copyright protected and not available for transfer or is it showing normally?


----------



## yroca

doormat said:


> I just got a M-Card firmware update for my SA card. Anyone else get it? Do we know what it'll fix?


What version is it? I think it will show you in the CableCard Decoders menu under one of the many pages of diagnostic information. Let us know and then we can compare.


----------



## doormat

Cox is using Scientific Atlanta power-something cards. 

I checked the firmware version on the Diagnostic page and it just said "1" under version number. This was TiVo's screen, and not the grey/black CC screens though. I didn't feel like wading through several pages and screens to find the firmware ver. 

I do have an S2, I have done MRV, however I found it slow - it wasnt fast enough to watch in real time. Though that was an old version of the TiVo HD firmware (early 8.x I think) and recently I was able to transfer some HD shows to my PC w/o problem and it did it fairly quickly. I cant watch any HD content from my THD on my S2 for obvious reasons, but I never tried to watch S2 recorded content from a THD box.


----------



## tivocrazy

Thanks for checking doormat. That tells me that the problem is limited to Motorola M cards and also tells me that Cox is using different card brands in different parts of the country.


----------



## JayBird

I have Cox in Gilbert, AZ.

Yesterday all but the local broadcast channels went black. Rebooting and all other tricks I've read about didn't fix it. I called Cox to have them "hit" the cable card, and that didn't work either. Finally the CSR unpaired and repaired the card, and then it started working again. The CSR acted like he gets calls about TiVo cable card issues all the time.

One interesting thing to note was that after he repaired the card, although I could tune channels just fine if I go to Live TV, if I went to the Test Channels page in the cable card menu, it would say I don't have any channels and wouldn't let me "test" any channels. It took 10-15 minutes before the Test Channels menu would acknowledge that I had channels, even though I clearly could tune channels using Live TV. Strange...

- Jay


----------



## JayBird

JayBird said:


> I'm in Gilbert, AZ, and I have digital cable, internet, and digital telephone, all from Cox. Since I have all 3 services, I've been getting a "digital home pak bundle discount" of $32.90 off my bill each month.
> 
> So recently I turned in my old cable box for cable cards - 1 M-Card for my new TiVo HD, and 1 S-Card for my Pioneer plasma TV.
> 
> And then I get my next bill...
> 
> 1. The charge for the "digital gateway service" went from $5.00 to $7.00 (not sure why this was increased by $2.00 - anybody know?).
> 2. The charge for the old cable box of $6.00 is gone, but is replaced with a charge of $4.00 for the two cable cards (this I expected).
> 3. I was charged for 3 cable card installations, even though they only installed 2 cards (this doesn't surprise me, since the CSR who took my order insisted I needed 2 cards for the TiVo, for a total of 3 with the TV, and wouldn't listen to any arguments to the contrary when I tried to explain that I actually only needed one M-card for the TiVo HD).
> 4. But here's the real kicker... they eliminated my "digital home pack bundle discount", so now to use cable cards instead of Cox's box, I'm paying an additional $32.90 a month.
> 
> Is there anybody else who has all 3 services who also got screwed by this when they switched to cable cards, or is this just an error on Cox's part that can be corrected?
> 
> Would requiring to have their box to get the discount be in violation of the FCC rules regarding my choice to use cable card devices in leiu of their box?
> 
> Would this be considered an anti-cable card scam?
> 
> I want to be armed with all the info I can get before I call Cox to dispute the charges on my bill.


Just an FYI... I finally got things straight with Cox.

The increase from $5 to $7 for the digital gateway service was because they are now providing digital service to two devices instead of one (originally it was just to the old cable box, now it's to the TiVo and to the TV, both of which have a cable card). They call this a "per outlet" charge, but any argument that it's all connected to one wall jack (i.e. one "outlet") doesn't get you anywhere. It's really a "per device" charge, not a "per outlet" charge. I guess I can live with that...

The $4 per month for the two cable cards was as I expected, so no problem there.

After explaining that they actually only installed 2 cable cards, and that I was only being billed for two on a monthly basis, they credited me the install charge for the 3rd cable card.

And, after arguing that I still have all three services (cable, internet, and phone), I convinced them that I still qualified for the "digital home pak bundle discount". The CSR seemed certain there must have been a good reason it was originally removed, but when he couldn't come up with a reason why, he ultimately credited me for the additional charges and reinstated the discount.

In the end that knocked over $70 off my bill this month, and reduced the ongoing monthly bill back to the same as it was before I switched from the box to the cable cards. It actually ended up that my ongoing monthly charges will be exactly the same as it was before, as the $2 extra for the "digital gateway service" plus the $4 for the two cable cards was offset by saving $6 by getting rid of the cable box.

Bottom line... if anything doesn't look right on your bill, it definately pays to make a call and get it all sorted out. By default, I assume they will screw it up every time, and I watch my bill closely every month.

Now... I wonder what mess they will make of it all when we want to add 3 additional phone lines (switching my existing office and fax lines from Vonage, and adding one more office line for my wife)... I guess we'll cross that bridge when we come to it, as we probably won't be making that transition for another month or two.

- Jay


----------



## hddude55

JayBird said:


> I have Cox in Gilbert, AZ.
> 
> ... The CSR acted like he gets calls about TiVo cable card issues all the time.
> 
> ......
> 
> - Jay


 I live in Gilbert, too, and may be a reason the CSR acted like he gets these calls all of the time. I probably call them at least twice a month -- ever since the missing channels issue started in Nov 2007. Now if I could only explain why I haven't put my series3 on Ebay and rented a Cox HD box. At least the Cox box works even if the software is TiVo-Ultralite.


----------



## Rolow

hddude55 said:


> I live in Gilbert, too, and may be a reason the CSR acted like he gets these calls all of the time. I probably call them at least twice a month -- ever since the missing channels issue started in Nov 2007. Now if I could only explain why I haven't put my series3 on Ebay and rented a Cox HD box. At least the Cox box works even if the software is TiVo-Ultralite.


I feel sorry for you series 3 guy it sounds like your problems are worse then us TiVo hd guys. Let's be honest you really don't want to pay $23 dollars a month for a Cox hd DVR do you? My SA 8300 missed recordings way more then the TiVo.


----------



## Shawn95GT

I'll add this again...

I'm on Cox, I'm in Phoenix. I have 2x SA S-Cards in a S3.

I'm not having these problems. This tells me Cox is doing something wrong out there!


----------



## hddude55

Shawn95GT said:


> I'll add this again...
> 
> I'm on Cox, I'm in Phoenix. I have 2x SA S-Cards in a S3.
> 
> I'm not having these problems. This tells me Cox is doing something wrong out there!


No kidding. Most of us in the Mesa-Gilbert-Chandler area know the dropped channels issue first arose late last year on or about the same time Cox upgraded its systems in this geographic area, and unless one believes in a huge coincidence, that suggests something about the Fall 2007 Cox upgrade conflicts with the SA cards. Cox knows this, too. They don't even bother trying to point the finger at TiVo anymore. Yet, no one seems to have a time frame for a fix -- after six months!


----------



## Shawn95GT

hddude55 said:


> No kidding. Most of us in the Mesa-Gilbert-Chandler area know the dropped channels issue first arose late last year on or about the same time Cox upgraded its systems in this geographic area, and unless one believes in a huge coincidence, that suggests something about the Fall 2007 Cox upgrade conflicts with the SA cards. Cox knows this, too. They don't even bother trying to point the finger at TiVo anymore. Yet, no one seems to have a time frame for a fix -- after six months!


Well, if it helps any they are upgrading my area today and tomorrow. It's something to do with HD channels and the on-demand functionality. I had an overnight outage about a month ago that they blamed on upgrades as well.

I 'just' lost all of my HD channels besides the locals. I'm not getting anything that says my cards aren't authorized, it's like the channels are broadcasting black screens.

I re-booted and it's same same. I'll give it some time.

Right now I'm lacking:714,716, 720, 721, 722, 723, 724, 726, 729, 732, 733, 740, 746, 757 & 762.

As long as 710 works I'm happy for tonight. If my cablecards consistently act like what's been described here I'll soon be downgrading to analog and adding another splitter to my off-air antenna.


----------



## Shawn95GT

The channels are slowly coming back.


----------



## elwaylite

Looking at buying a S3HD soon and wondering if everyone is happy with Cox in Norfolk.

I see theyll be going SDV soon, but it appears theyll only pull low volume digitals?

$55 for digital basic then the tivo fee aint bad.


----------



## tivocrazy

My current issues concerning Cox Hampton Roads that may or may not affect you. 

Since you are getting an S3, the Motorola M card issue will not be a problem with you but they still have a problem with copyright protection when trying to use MRV or Tivo Desktop to transfer recordings. I have switched to 2 S cards in my Tivo HD and am still experiencing significant signal loss causing digital/audio breakup during certain times of the day. Working with Cox this weekend to try to track down the issue. Could be any number of things to cause this and some may have nothing to do with Cox (as in my wiring in my home). Could also be the TiVo unit although TiVo denies they are the problem. We will see when they send out their expert and hopefully the breakup will show itself while he/she is there.


----------



## elwaylite

Ooops, I will be getting the TivoHD and not the S3HD. Transferring recordings wont be an issue, but is the signal breakup common for tivos in this area?


----------



## tivocrazy

Can't say. My understanding is that before the Tivo fall update it was a BIG problem so make sure you get the latest service updates on the Tivo before evaluating any issues. Have not heard anyone else in the Hampton Roads area having this problem so it might be isolated to me. Will know more this weekend. It is really strange as it only happens in the afternoon.


----------



## scrappler

This sucks, I am moving to Chandler AZ in two weeks and I fear that my S3 will be in the same boat as the rest of you.


----------



## tivocrazy

Different markets seem to have different issues based on what I have read on the forums. Some have problems with dropped channels. I do not have that issue here. Matter of fact, when I first got the Tivo HD hooked up I was told I would not get all of my HD channels, only those for which the cable card was set up to handle at the time the cards were ordered by Cox from Motorola. Yet, I get all of the HD channels and any new ones that Cox makes available. Go figure.


----------



## hddude55

scrappler said:


> This sucks, I am moving to Chandler AZ in two weeks and I fear that my S3 will be in the same boat as the rest of you.


Postpone your move for a few months! Something about the Cox upgrade last Fall seems to have caused this nagging dropped channels issue in the Mesa-Gilbert-Chandler upgraded area and the Cox techs say it is very widespread.


----------



## hddude55

tivocrazy said:


> Different markets seem to have different issues based on what I have read on the forums. Some have problems with dropped channels. I do not have that issue here. Matter of fact, when I first got the Tivo HD hooked up I was told I would not get all of my HD channels, only those for which the cable card was set up to handle at the time the cards were ordered by Cox from Motorola. Yet, I get all of the HD channels and any new ones that Cox makes available. Go figure.


I'm not sure but it seems SA cards like we have here in Gilbert, AZ have been more troublesome than the Motorola cards.


----------



## lament

5cats said:


> Nearly every day. Same symptoms, and more: keep an eye out for partial recordings. I see them constantly now.
> 
> I recently had my MCard replaced. Result: no change. Partials, stutters on live TV, etc. *sigh*
> 
> Sorry for the bad news,
> -jd.


this seems to have worked itself out for me.. I blame Cox.


----------



## tivocrazy

hddude55 said:


> I'm not sure but it seems SA cards like we have here in Gilbert, AZ have been more troublesome than the Motorola cards.


Before I purchased my Tivo HD a few months ago, Tivo rep told me that if Cox Hampton Roads was using SA cable cards he would advise me to hold off on the purchase until Cox/SA worked out the problems.


----------



## Bodie

We just got the Victim Networ... er, I mean Lifetime HD. woohoo!


----------



## OrangeKid

Cox in Vegas is realigning all the HD channels on June 1. Unfortunately the Tivo program guide changed yesterday May 28, showing all the HD channels in their new assignments 3 days before the Cox changeover. Therefore until June 1 I am unable to record the correct "To Do" list. The wrong programs are recorded. SD programming is unaffected.

Am I missing something? Is there anything I can do to get my HD programming in the interim other than using the "Rube Goldberg" approach to recording by time or channel?


----------



## Rolow

Sounds like you will have to set up a manual recording like the vcr days. I know a few times when cox phoenix has added channels they have shown up in the guide before they where mad available by cox. Its kind of nice and not a problem when your getting new channels but when there getting moved like yours that would suck.


----------



## ajwees41

OrangeKid said:


> Cox in Vegas is realigning all the HD channels on June 1. Unfortunately the Tivo program guide changed yesterday May 28, showing all the HD channels in their new assignments 3 days before the Cox changeover. Therefore until June 1 I am unable to record the correct "To Do" list. The wrong programs are recorded. SD programming is unaffected.
> 
> Am I missing something? Is there anything I can do to get my HD programming in the interim other than using the "Rube Goldberg" approach to recording by time or channel?


your lucky I heard stories of cable companies changing lineups and Tivo taking a week to get the channels straight.


----------



## OrangeKid

Rolow said:


> Sounds like you will have to set up a manual recording like the vcr days.


What I decided to do is just record the SD versions of the HD shows today and tomorrow. As far as I can tell all will be well again starting June 1.


----------



## doormat

OrangeKid said:


> Cox in Vegas is realigning all the HD channels on June 1. Unfortunately the Tivo program guide changed yesterday May 28, showing all the HD channels in their new assignments 3 days before the Cox changeover. Therefore until June 1 I am unable to record the correct "To Do" list. The wrong programs are recorded. SD programming is unaffected.
> 
> Am I missing something? Is there anything I can do to get my HD programming in the interim other than using the "Rube Goldberg" approach to recording by time or channel?


Me too! I came home from work and all my channels were in the wrong place on the HD side. Though it seems like it was only some of them - Discovery HD was still 727 but ESPNHD was 730.

I'm more interested in who is to blame? Does Cox or TiVo manage the channel numbers?


----------



## ajwees41

doormat said:


> Me too! I came home from work and all my channels were in the wrong place on the HD side. Though it seems like it was only some of them - Discovery HD was still 727 but ESPNHD was 730.
> 
> I'm more interested in who is to blame? Does Cox or TiVo manage the channel numbers?


cox manages the channel placement, but it would seem tribune the tivo guide data provider jumped the gun on realignig the channels.


----------



## OrangeKid

doormat said:


> Me too! I came home from work and all my channels were in the wrong place on the HD side. Though it seems like it was only some of them - Discovery HD was still 727 but ESPNHD was 730.
> 
> I'm more interested in who is to blame? Does Cox or TiVo manage the channel numbers?


Cox has clearly announced for some time now the June 1 date for the change of channel numbers. It seems to me that Tivo jumped the gun in its program guide.

I missed my HD shows yesterday but I programmed the S3 Tivo to record the SD versions today and tomorrow. Starting Saturday all the Tivo program guide channel numbers should be synced up with the Cox channel numbers.

Here is the new HD cable channel line up:

http://www.cox.com/lasvegas/channelchanges.asp


----------



## Roderigo

ajwees41 said:


> cox manages the channel placement, but it would seem tribune the tivo guide data provider jumped the gun on realignig the channels.


It all depends on what Cox told Tribune... Someone made a mistake, but only a Cox/Tribune insider would know who's at fault.


----------



## OrangeKid

OrangeKid said:


> Starting Saturday all the Tivo program guide channel numbers should be synced up with the Cox channel numbers.


Oops! i should have said "Starting Sunday ...."!


----------



## TheNumberSix

So if I understand correctly, everything should be just fine tomorrow? (June 1) We shouldn't have to redo Guided setup, right?


----------



## OrangeKid

TheNumberSix said:


> So if I understand correctly, everything should be just fine tomorrow? (June 1) We shouldn't have to redo Guided setup, right?


Guided setup does not appear to be necessary.

I checked my "To Do" list and all my future HD programs that are in the 700-799 range are scheduled to be recorded on the correct (newly assigned) HD channels.

I did have to select the premium HD channels (HBO HD channel 800, Cinemax HD channel 810, and Starz HD channel 830) I subscribe to in the Tivo channel setup screen. Tomorrow (June 1) I will go through all the HD channels to confirm that I receive those that I am entitled to.


----------



## malogus

Shawn95GT said:


> I'll add this again...
> 
> I'm on Cox, I'm in Phoenix. I have 2x SA S-Cards in a S3.
> 
> I'm not having these problems. This tells me Cox is doing something wrong out there!


I'm still not sure you can place the blame directly on Cox, I think it's more of a Tivo issue.

In my case, I have an S3 in my main viewing room, and a TivoHD in the bedroom. The S3 has 2 S-cards, the HD has 1 M-card. The S3 never drops channels, but has alot more pixelation issues. The TivoHD drops channels once a month, but never has any pixelation problems. I think the dropping channels has to be a Tivo issue with the firmware, otherwise why doesn't my S3 drop? And my HD only drops once a month based on the expire time, which makes me lean towards tivo firmware as well. But I guess it could always be a Cox problem in resetting that expire time maybe?

BTW, I'm in Chandler also.


----------



## Roderigo

malogus said:


> In my case, I have an S3 in my main viewing room, and a TivoHD in the bedroom. The S3 has 2 S-cards, the HD has 1 M-card. The S3 never drops channels, but has alot more pixelation issues. The TivoHD drops channels once a month, but never has any pixelation problems. I think the dropping channels has to be a Tivo issue with the firmware, otherwise why doesn't my S3 drop? And my HD only drops once a month based on the expire time, which makes me lean towards tivo firmware as well. But I guess it could always be a Cox problem in resetting that expire time maybe?


You have two different kinds of cards running two different version of SA firmware. I could certainly believe it's a Cox/SA problem with that configuration.

If the card isn't getting an updated expire time, I'd think it's more on the cable company/cablecard side. The host device doesn't have much to do with card authorizations. That's all out of band messaging between the headend and the card. As long as the tivo is passing a valid OOB signal, it's then up to the headend to send the right messages, and the card to process them properly.


----------



## Pafrican

Just got a letter from Cox (Phoenix) about SDV and how it will go live July 1st 2008.

First up, is the note at the bottom of the letter to Tivo HD/Series 3 owners (emphasis done by me):

Cox, along with others in the cable industry, has worked with TiVo Inc to develop an external device called a Tuning Adapter that will allow TiVo Series 3 and TiVo HD devices using CableCARDs to access channels delivered via SDV. Availablity of the Tuning Adapter is expected *later this year*. That that time additional information will be sent to you. The Tuning Adapter will be provided by Cox at *no charge*.​
Second is the lineup of SDV channels. I'm okay with most of these as NO HD CHANNELS are on the list.

A few of the variety and sports tiers. Most of the hispanic tier. And the Sports Season passes.

Nothing missed here.

Also, for the next 6 months Cox Arizona people using a CableCard can get an HD Cable Box for $2/month for the next 6 months.


----------



## jshore

Greetings from Litchfield Park, AZ (the western part of the Valley).

Coupla notes that may or may not be of interest.

I received the Cox letter, too. Glad to see the tuning adapters will be no charge.

As far as missing channels, here's what i encounter: on my two Series 3 machines (each with two single-tuner SA cable cards) - rarely have channels drop out or go "black." Occasional pixelation and audio dropouts when changing HD channels.

But with my HD Tivo in the guest bedroom, I have occurrences where all digital channels other than local HD would go black. I call Cox and usually having them re-pair the multi-stream SA card works. But last time it wasn't working until the guy did what he called an "H" hit which re-authorizes the cards. So if you ever find a normal "hit" or re-pairing doesn't fix the issue, before they roll a truck see if you can reach a CSR who can do an "H" hit to solve the issue.


----------



## gwsat

Thanks for the report about Coxs letter concerning an external device that will allow TiVo S3 HD DVRs to receive SDV channels. So far, Cox OKC has not added any SDV channels, so I am not surprised that we didnt receive such a letter. The news that it wont be available until later this year is a little scary, though.


----------



## OrangeKid

OrangeKid said:


> Guided setup does not appear to be necessary.
> 
> Tomorrow (June 1) I will go through all the HD channels to confirm that I receive those that I am entitled to.


Today after the changeover I was still getting my HD channels on the old numbers. A restart of the S3 Tivo solved that issue. Now all my HD programming shows up at the corect channels. The only issue I have remaining is that the Tivo (Tribune) program guide seems to be incorrect for the three premium channels I subscribe to (HBO HD, Cinemax HD and Starz HD). I hope Tivo (Tribune) straighten out the programming.


----------



## jfranklin

So those of your in NoVA don't think I completely forgot, I just wanted to let you all know that as of yet I've gotten just a hair to the right of nowhere. Every response I have gotten directly or indirectly from those in charge in your part of the world within Cox has been classic marketing speak. Which I expected from the corporate people, but not the technical people.

Sadly what I'm being told is that since NoVA has already launched SDV their CableCARD lineup is different. When I restate that the channels I am concerned about are not being delivered via SDV the communications from the person I was getting information from promptly stops.

At this point, as much as I hate to say it as this does not help those that have cards directly in their TVs (yet), I think the only relief you're going to see is going to be by way of the Tuning Adapter.

I haven't given this up, just doesn't look good.


----------



## doormat

Pafrican said:


> The Tuning Adapter will be provided by Cox at *no charge*.


Thats what I wanted to hear - hopefully its a nationwide thing.


----------



## Shawn95GT

I got the letter today.

I think the STB for $2/mo is a ploy to get us addicted to On Demand .

I'll probably get one.


----------



## milo99

jfranklin said:


> So those of your in NoVA don't think I completely forgot, I just wanted to let you all know that as of yet I've gotten just a hair to the right of nowhere. Every response I have gotten directly or indirectly from those in charge in your part of the world within Cox has been classic marketing speak. Which I expected from the corporate people, but not the technical people.
> 
> Sadly what I'm being told is that since NoVA has already launched SDV their CableCARD lineup is different. When I restate that the channels I am concerned about are not being delivered via SDV the communications from the person I was getting information from promptly stops.
> 
> At this point, as much as I hate to say it as this does not help those that have cards directly in their TVs (yet), I think the only relief you're going to see is going to be by way of the Tuning Adapter.
> 
> I haven't given this up, just doesn't look good.


thanks for the efforts Jody. Hopefully that adapter will be out this summer and it will indeed be free like in AZ.


----------



## eochs

Pafrican said:


> Just got a letter from Cox (Phoenix) about SDV and how it will go live July 1st 2008.
> 
> First up, is the note at the bottom of the letter to Tivo HD/Series 3 owners (emphasis done by me):
> 
> Cox, along with others in the cable industry, has worked with TiVo Inc to develop an external device called a Tuning Adapter that will allow TiVo Series 3 and TiVo HD devices using CableCARDs to access channels delivered via SDV. Availablity of the Tuning Adapter is expected *later this year*. That that time additional information will be sent to you. The Tuning Adapter will be provided by Cox at *no charge*.​
> Second is the lineup of SDV channels. I'm okay with most of these as NO HD CHANNELS are on the list.
> 
> A few of the variety and sports tiers. Most of the hispanic tier. And the Sports Season passes.
> 
> Nothing missed here.
> 
> Also, for the next 6 months Cox Arizona people using a CableCard can get an HD Cable Box for $2/month for the next 6 months.


I have not gotten the letter in Phoenix... Can you tell us the channel numbers or names?


----------



## Rolow

eochs said:


> I have not gotten the letter in Phoenix... Can you tell us the channel numbers or names?


Here is a quote rom this thread 
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=357703&page=54



> For Cox subscribers in the Phoenix market, here's a list of the channels that are being moved to SDV on 7/1/08, per the letter I received in the mail yesterday:
> 
> 109 Cox Real Estate 2
> 110 Daystar
> 112 INSP
> 113 EWTN
> 114 BYU-TV
> 125 C-SPAN 2
> 126 C-SPAN 3
> 133 DIY
> 144 Fox Reality Channel
> 155 BET Jazz
> 156 Great American Country
> 157 Fuse
> 158 G4
> 159 Logo
> 163 Fit TV
> 170 Fox College Sports Atlantic
> 172 Fox College Sports Pacific
> 173 Fuel
> 405 TV Chile
> 410 De Pelicula
> 411 De Pelicula Clasico
> 412 CineLatino
> 413 VeneMovies
> 417 History en Espanol
> 418 Discovery en Espanol
> 422 Discovery Familia
> 423 TOON Disney en Espanol
> 424 Boomerang en Espanol
> 425 Sorpresa
> 430 MTV Tres
> 432 Bandamax
> 433 VideoRola
> 434 mun2
> 438 ESPN Deportes
> 439 Fox Sports en Espanol
> 440 GoITV
> 444 CNN en Espanol
> 445 Canal Sur
> 449 EWTN Espanol
> 500 iNDEMAND Previews
> 601-606 ESPN Game Plan / ESPN Full Court
> 650 NBA League Pass Preview
> 651-659 NBA League Pass / MLS Direct Kick
> 671-684 MLB Extra Innings / NHL Center Ice
> 840 Public Safety
> 850 Public Safety
> 851 Public Safety
> 853 Public Safety
> 854 Public Safety
> 856 Public Safety
> 857 Public Safety
> 
> So far, I have to applaud Cox for selecting channels with limited appeal, and none that are HD. Of course, I know that's the whole idea behind SDV (moving limited appeal channels to it, and leaving the rest alone), but there were rumours that in the Phoenix market the plan was to put everything digital on SDV.
> 
> In my case so far, I see no need to get a tuning adapter, even if it is free. I either don't subscribe to most of these channels, or in the exceptionally rare case I need to record something from one I can use my S2 that is still hooked up to a cable box.
> 
> Jeff


----------



## hddude55

Pafrican said:


> Just got a letter from Cox (Phoenix) about SDV and how it will go live July 1st 2008.
> 
> First up, is the note at the bottom of the letter to Tivo HD/Series 3 owners (emphasis done by me):
> 
> Cox, along with others in the cable industry, has worked with TiVo Inc to develop an external device called a Tuning Adapter that will allow TiVo Series 3 and TiVo HD devices using CableCARDs to access channels delivered via SDV. Availablity of the Tuning Adapter is expected *later this year*. That that time additional information will be sent to you. The Tuning Adapter will be provided by Cox at *no charge*.​
> Second is the lineup of SDV channels. I'm okay with most of these as NO HD CHANNELS are on the list.
> 
> A few of the variety and sports tiers. Most of the hispanic tier. And the Sports Season passes.
> 
> Nothing missed here.
> 
> Also, for the next 6 months Cox Arizona people using a CableCard can get an HD Cable Box for $2/month for the next 6 months.


Say what? My letter from Cox didn't say anything about a $2/month HD cable box for 6 months.


----------



## jebbbz

hddude55 said:


> Say what? My letter from Cox didn't say anything about a $2/month HD cable box for 6 months.


Did you get only one letter? There were two letters, one regarding PPV and VoD, the other announcing SDV. I pitched the first letter without reading it carefully but it might not have made reference to the $2.00/month STB. The second SDV letter does mention the STB deal and that may be intended as an interim solution for TiVo owners to get by until the Tuning Adapter comes out as well as to serve as a marketing tool to get TiVo owners to try PPV and VoD which won't be available via the TA.


----------



## Supermurph

hddude55 said:


> Say what? My letter from Cox didn't say anything about a $2/month HD cable box for 6 months.


It was at the bottom, almost like a "PS". So, you might have missed it. I've been frustrated with Cox at times, but I have second the idea that Cox seems to be handling this well so far in Phoenix. The letter was very clear and detailed and they seem to be doing the right thing by choosing channels with limited appeal and by offering the cheap box as an interim solution to the Tuning Adapter.

I have a regular digital box in my bedroom and have OnDemand there. No danger of getting hooked on it over Tivo . . . . trust me.


----------



## hddude55

I'm in Gilbert and cannot get non-local channels back tonight on the slot 1 card even after several reboots and two hits by Cox CSR's, so a truck will roll tomorrow with a new card for my series3. Lately the card in slot 1 always seems to be the culprit, perhaps because it does the lion's share of the work. I notice far less posts on this topic in the past few weeks. Is it because you are having less problems, or are you like me and have simply gotten tired of discussing what seems like a problem that will never be fixed by SA/Cox/TiVo.


----------



## Zonie65

hddude55 said:


> I'm in Gilbert and cannot get non-local channels back tonight on the slot 1 card even after several reboots and two hits by Cox CSR's, so a truck will roll tomorrow with a new card for my series3. Lately the card in slot 1 always seems to be the culprit, perhaps because it does the lion's share of the work. I notice far less posts on this topic in the past few weeks. Is it because you are having less problems, or are you like me and have simply gotten tired of discussing what seems like a problem that will never be fixed by SA/Cox/TiVo.


Hasn't gone away for me. I even told the last tech when he would be back out. After he installed my last M-Card, I looked at the SubExpire date and time and it was June 14th, 5:36pm. Guess when I dropped most of my channels...you guessed it. This time 2 hits wouldn't do it so I have a truck roll scheduled. At least the CSR told me they all just got training on this issue and the direction is to hit it with a Unpair/Pair and if that doesn't work to then roll a truck. I kept asking each new CSR about this H-Hit and they all said it doesn't work with Tivo's, and the only signal they use is the unpair/pair. Fine, roll another truck for me....


----------



## jebbbz

Nothing has changed for me since the 9.3 update which seems to include "auto-repair" of the loss-of-channels problem. I rarely notice the problem now (but of course want it tracked down and truly fixed). I have only had one recording spoiled as a consequence but given the WGA strike and the time of year my To Do List is pretty empty. I have had the SubExpire problem pretty much monthly but so far it has alaways been fixed with a phone call. My current single MCard (I have a TiVo HD) has been here since February 25, my last truck roll and only one since the original installation roll.

Given how much it costs Cox to roll a truck I doubt they are ignoring the problem but all they can do is pressure Cisco/SA to get it fixed. TiVo already has a lot of incentive to get things fixed since proportionately this is a much bigger problem for them than it is for the CC manufacturer.


----------



## TiVoJerry

Hello all,

I've been given some information to pass along regarding customers experiencing a loss of channels in Cox Cable markets. I'd been posting occasionally about the issue on the TiVo Help Forum and am looking around TCF to see where else this info might be useful.

TiVo has been working with Cox Cable and Cisco (Scientific Atlanta) for quite awhile to develop a fix. As a result of the investigation, Cox has released a new version of Cisco firmware (PKEY1.1.12_F.p.0301) which seems to have solved the problem.

TiVo has also spoken to some of the customers who had experienced the issue and confirmed that it has been solved. We know it's been a long road while this was being worked on and we truly appreciate the help we get from our subscribers in resolving issues like this.

Thank you for standing by us and having faith that a resolution would be reached.


----------



## tagpats

Thanks for the information! Do you know when the fix rolled out? How do we know if it has been updated?


----------



## TiVoJerry

Go through the CableCARD screens (conditional access should do it) to determine which firmware version you are running. I do not know the exact date it rolled.


----------



## Rolow

Ok mine is at PKEY1.1.12_F.p.0103 does that just mean they haven't sent the update yet or do I have to call cox?


----------



## TheLongshot

Does this fix the problem I had with the SA M-Card where it wouldn't recognize the digital channels and the non-local HD channels? Because that is what Cox spent a couple hours trying to fix last weekend when they finally gave up and put in a couple of S-Cards.

Jason


----------



## hddude55

Rolow said:


> Ok mine is at PKEY1.1.12_F.p.0103 does that just mean they haven't sent the update yet or do I have to call cox?


 I hope this is real after 8 months of waiting. I currently have a card in slot 1 of my series 3 with OS Ver: PKEY1.1.12_F.p.0103 and this card is one that has been losing channels -- in fact I have had at least two or three cards swapped in slot one for that problem. The card in slot two has worked like a champ for many weeks and it says OS Ver: 01.04.01. That seems odd, but perhaps I currently have one single stream and one dual stream and they have different firmware or something of the sort. Oh well, I am sick of thinking, writing and experiencing over 8 months of this idiotic issue, so count me as a skeptic until the solution is rolled out to my two cards.

I just called Cox Phoenix and talked to first and second level support. They were both totally unaware of any released fix nor how to get it. As for Jerry thanking all of us for standing by them and having faith in them, I almost choked on my Pepsi. Hell will freeze over before I buy another High def TiVo and I do my best to discourage others from buying one. But even though I'm a bad boy, I am a customer who has spent a lot of dough on TiVo hardware and service plans for four series 2's and this piece of crap series 3. It's about time someone got off their rear and fixed this problem.


----------



## tagpats

TiVoJerry said:


> Go through the CableCARD screens (conditional access should do it) to determine which firmware version you are running. I do not know the exact date it rolled.


Thanks. I'm using 2 SA Single Stream Cards, so maybe that is my issue. It is telling me that my firmware version is simply "1". My CableCard menus are different now that I was forced to switch from an M Card to the S Cards. I guess I'll just wait to see if I have continued problems.


----------



## jebbbz

TiVoJerry said:


> Go through the CableCARD screens (conditional access should do it) to determine which firmware version you are running. I do not know the exact date it rolled.


For those who can't find it on the "CA" screen, on my TiVo HD with a single MCard the info is located on the first page of the "SA CableCARD Diag Screen," about 3/4 of the way down. I still have the 0103 version but I will check it periodically.

Is the SubExpTime not updating fixed with this FW update?


----------



## moyekj

hddude55 said:


> As for Jerry thanking all of us for standing by them and having faith in them, I almost choked on my Pepsi. Hell will freeze over before I buy another High def TiVo and I do my best to discourage others from buying one. But even though I'm a bad boy, I am a customer who has spent a lot of dough on TiVo hardware and service plans for four series 2's and this piece of crap series 3. It's about time someone got off their rear and fixed this problem.


 Switch to Coca Cola and chill out dude.  Seriously though, TivoJerry has no obligation to post anything here but continues to do so despite backlashes such as this one. I understand this issue has been extremely frustrating, but the anger should be directed towards Tivo the company, not at an individual that is working hard and going out of his way to make things right.


----------



## hddude55

moyekj said:


> Switch to Coca Cola and chill out dude.  Seriously though, TivoJerry has no obligation to post anything here but continues to do so despite backlashes such as this one. I understand this issue has been extremely frustrating, but the anger should be directed towards Tivo the company, not at an individual that is working hard and going out of his way to make things right.


When I call T-Mobile, I usually get at least two or three "happy talk" questions and I'm sure some customers really like it. I realize this is scripted but I find it to be annoying and a waste of my time. I also find it annoying when a TiVo employee thanks all of us who have had this problem for 8 months for our faith and trust in his company. After 8 months of this garbage the last thing I have is faith and trust in Cox, TiVo and Scientific Atlanta engineers.


----------



## wierdo

hddude55 said:


> When I call T-Mobile, I usually get at least two or three "happy talk" questions and I'm sure some customers really like it. I realize this is scripted but I find it to be annoying and a waste of my time. I also find it annoying when a TiVo employee thanks all of us who have had this problem for 8 months for our faith and trust in his company. After 8 months of this garbage the last thing I have is faith and trust in Cox, TiVo and Scientific Atlanta engineers.


I think you're getting too much sun and it's making you irritable. Of course, I'd also be irritable if I was dealing with 110 degree heat.


----------



## jebbbz

hddude55 said:


> ... I also find it annoying when a TiVo employee thanks all of us who have had this problem for 8 months for our faith and trust in his company. After 8 months of this garbage the last thing I have is faith and trust in Cox, TiVo and Scientific Atlanta engineers.


I have had the problem since January but I am inclined to blame Cox and Cisco/SA. As I have said before, this seems to have been a pretty small problem for them as TiVo customers are such a small percentage of their customers but a big problem for TiVo as TiVo customers are such a big percentage of their customers (like, 100%). Little problem for Cox/Cisco means low priority for them. Much bigger problem for TiVo means higher priority for them, but without help from Cox/Cisco TiVo can't do much. As TiVo has CableLabs certification, as does Cisco, I assume the specifications are insufficient to prevent hardware/software conflicts.


----------



## hddude55

I just received an email from the Cox-Phoenix Corporate Office employee who I spoke to this morning. Here is the relevant information from her follow-up email: 

"I have forwarded the information you provided me with to our Interactive Services group. They have reported the following:

*******************************************************************************************************
We got the software late last week from S-A/CISCO. As with any software, this must go through internal testing to ensure there are no major bugs prior to releasing it (and of course to ensure it does correct the issue grey screen issues). As soon as it is tested successfully we will begin deploying this software to our customers.

More information should be available regarding this software soon as we have just started deploying this to test units. 
********************************************************************************************************

I was also informed once the software has been tested; it will be automatically downloaded on a wide scale to our cable card customers that have been experiencing loss of channels. At this time, I am not sure when that will be; however, as our Interactive Services group approaches the deployment date information will be sent out to us."


----------



## doormat

I think I got this firmware update a while back (5/20) and my Tivo has been working perfectly since. No missing channels, no reboots to get new sub exp date. SA M-Card, Cox Las Vegas.


----------



## TiVoJerry

TiVoJerry said:


> Go through the CableCARD screens (conditional access should do it) to determine which firmware version you are running. I do not know the exact date it rolled.


I've been advised the Cox of Phoenix has not yet rolled out the latest firmware version that contains the fix. I apologize for the confusion my posting has caused. I was not informed that the firmware update was still pending.

Cox currently expects to be rolling it out to all customers in that area automatically within the next few weeks. I don't want to post a specific date in case there is a delay that prevents them from rolling out to everyone, but you should be seeing it real soon. There is no need to contact Cox to request the update.


----------



## Rolow

Jerry Thanks for keeping us up to date. I hope they roll it out before the 12th other wise I will have to make a call because my subexpiretime is July 12 2:40am gmt

For some reason I missed the last 5-6 posts in this thread


----------



## tagpats

Jerry, Do you know if the rollout timing will vary depending on where in the country you are located? I'm in Northern Virginia. Although their customer service is generally very good, they aren't too swift when it comes to CableCards or TiVo.


----------



## whafro

This firmware doesn't fix the lack of channels received by Northern Virginia customers, such as everything in the 720-740 (Discovery HD, Bravo HD, etc) range, right? As I understand from previous posts in this thread, that's just a Cox misconfiguration, not a matter of a firmware bug.

If so, then tagpats, we should coordinate a call-in time and try to get as many folks calling in within 15 mins or so, so they feel it's a common issue  So far, it just seems like they don't care.


----------



## tagpats

I'm happy to call in on that. I guess I have two issues then. I have accepted the lack of the switched digital HD channels until the tuning adapter comes out and makes those channels available to CableCard customers.

I also still have intermittent trouble with losing channels and having them freeze up on me. This was what I was assuming the firmware fix was all about. I've been successful as of late getting these problems resolved with a reboot, but who knows how much longer before I require a truck roll.


----------



## whafro

Yeah, apparently the missing "switched" channels aren't actually switched, they just aren't being sent to the CableCards because Cox just doesn't feel like it, according to jfrankin (if I understood those posts correctly). 

I don't think I've been experiencing any freezes, but I mainly stick to HD channels, so I wouldn't notice other channels as being "lost." I was hoping that maybe there was a firmware answer to the question of the missing HD channels.

Ah well...


----------



## jebbbz

I turned on my TV this morning to catch the Russia/Spain UEFA semi-final and found a CableCard message (the black and gray screens) telling me a firmware upgrade was in progress. This was 11:30 am local time (I am in Phoenix, AZ). The message cleared fairly quickly and I checked my firmware number and I now have the "301" upgrade. I watched the game and began channel-surfing about 2:00 pm and began getting alerts that a firmware upgrade was in progress (?!?). I got some cryptic CC messages alternating with a blank TiVo background. Eventually I saw a TiVo message that a CC upgrade was in progress and it might take 40 minutes. So, the firmware upgrade is appearing here but I don't yet know how smoothly things are going.


----------



## yroca

jebbbz said:


> I turned on my TV this morning to catch the Russia/Spain UEFA semi-final and found a CableCard message (the black and gray screens) telling me a firmware upgrade was in progress. This was 11:30 am local time (I am in Phoenix, AZ). The message cleared fairly quickly and I checked my firmware number and I now have the "301" upgrade. I watched the game and began channel-surfing about 2:00 pm and began getting alerts that a firmware upgrade was in progress (?!?). I got some cryptic CC messages alternating with a blank TiVo background. Eventually I saw a TiVo message that a CC upgrade was in progress and it might take 40 minutes. So, the firmware upgrade is appearing here but I don't yet know how smoothly things are going.


After reading jebbbz's post, I checked my TiVO HD here in Phoenix and saw it was also upgraded to the 301 firmware, so the rollout in Phoenix must be underway. We will see how things go over the next few weeks...


----------



## jebbbz

Well, my firmware upgrade scores 99&#37;. Things seem to work fine unless I tune to channel 199 (TCM). It occurs to me that is what happened at 2:00 pm. I haven't found any other channel that causes the system to report it is upgrading firmware and go crazy in the process. For now, I have deleted 199 from my lineup. I don't want to miss the Euro 2008 finals on Sunday so I don't know if I should try and fix things until Monday when there is likely to be less of a wait if Cox has to roll a truck.


----------



## hddude55

Looks like we MAY have the missing channels bug fixed here in the Phoenix area so we can have a fully functioning TiVo experience for three or four days until sdv deployment and deleted channels on July 1. I'll bet Cox will roll out the tuning resolver with about the same sense of urgency -- hopefully by 2010 or so.


----------



## fracandi

What is a SDV?


----------



## hddude55

fracandi said:


> What is a SDV?


 Not sure but I think it's a communicable disease spread by TiVo's.


----------



## p_harper

jebbbz said:


> Well, my firmware upgrade scores 99%. Things seem to work fine unless I tune to channel 199 (TCM). It occurs to me that is what happened at 2:00 pm. I haven't found any other channel that causes the system to report it is upgrading firmware and go crazy in the process. For now, I have deleted 199 from my lineup. I don't want to miss the Euro 2008 finals on Sunday so I don't know if I should try and fix things until Monday when there is likely to be less of a wait if Cox has to roll a truck.


Thanks for the tip! Channel 199 has the same effect for me. The M-card in my S3 went nuts tonight with the firmware upgrade while I was flipping through channels and lingered on 199. I rebooted several times to no good effect. A call to Cox had no useful result, though they did schedule a truck roll for Tuesday morning. I was resigned to living with a single tuner for a few days. Now that I've changed the channel both cards are working.


----------



## Shawn95GT

hddude55 said:


> Not sure but I think it's a communicable disease spread by TiVo's.




fracandi, check out this sticky from this sub-forum:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=357703


----------



## jebbbz

p_harper said:


> Thanks for the tip! Channel 199 has the same effect for me. The M-card in my S3 went nuts tonight with the firmware upgrade while I was flipping through channels and lingered on 199. I rebooted several times to no good effect. A call to Cox had no useful result, though they did schedule a truck roll for Tuesday morning. I was resigned to living with a single tuner for a few days. Now that I've changed the channel both cards are working.


Not that I want someone else to suffer but mini-misery loves company. While my TiVo was having its nervous breakdown I caught an info screen that seemed to suggest the problem was with frequency 693000 KHz. I am guessing that is Cox 199 here in town but I can't confirm it because I don't want to tune to 199 and then check CC diagnostics to see what its frequency is. If others elsewhere encounter the problem on the same frequency it would suggest a Cisco/SA CC problem. Otherwise I would assume it is something about Cox in Phoenix.


----------



## mstrassel

This is the 4th time I have had to have (Phoenix) Cox come out and replace my Scientific Atlanta Cablecard. Every few weeks I suddenly don't get half the channels they are just black. Sometimes I can just reset the Tivo and they come back....but Thursday was the 4th time it would not come back and they have to send a tech out. It started getting a firmware update and when the tech arrived today,Sunday it was still trying. They tried another card....same thing.....and this 4th round I can't watch anything. They actually left saying the supervisor says just wait for the update to finish and it will be fine.....I said I have been waiting for that for 4 days!!!! I called Tivo because they said well maybe you don't have the latest Tivo Software? They confirmed I do....and so begins the never ending saga...Cox blames Tivo, Tivo blames dumb Cox technicians, they both blame Atlanta Scientific for making a lousy card. NOBODY accepts responsibility and NOBODY has an answer on how to fix this. The cable guy came back 30 minutes later and says you know we found this "level" is too high now since we did this system wide firmware and so we dont think cablecards will work until this level is fixed....and since this is a systemwide change they will not be able to fix the level for at least 10 days!!!!! So I will not have cable TV now for at least 2 weeks. I see all sides of this but the bottom line is I have never felt so screwed and mistreated.....on all sides.....They said Tivo works with all cable providers and all cable providers are required to support your Tivo....well it's not happening and I am at the point telling them both what they can do with their service, customer or otherwise. If anyone has a magic answer I would love to hear it otherwise I think I am headed to Barnes and Noble to join a book club.


----------



## Rolow

Do you have a tivo series 3 or tivo HD?


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## chicodoggy

It says "not upgrading" under the firmware version on my TiVo hd and I only have copy protection on one of my cable cards. No lost channels for me but I do get audio video sync issues on MTV, vh1 and a few other channels. What's with that?


----------



## Zeigh

Hello,

Does anyone have any valid information concerning the "converter" or "adapter" that Cox Communications has stated will soon be made available to it's customers in the Phoenix area? They recently sent out a letter informing me that a free device of some type would be released to address the Tivo Series 3 technical issues. As typical with Cox Communications Technical Support, nobody knows anything about this issue. They would rather send yet another technician out before escalating my call to someone that actually is knowledgeable about the issue.


Technological change is like an axe in the hands of a pathological criminal. (Albert Einstein, 1941),
Dr. Z.


----------



## jebbbz

The item you ask about is a Tuning Adapter, previously known as a Tuning Resolver. It is not intended to fix any problems that would be addressed by a tehnician. When you speak of "technical issues" it sounds like you are having problems -- losing reception, messed up recordings, bad signals, re-boots, whatever. The Tuning Adapter won't fix problems like that.

(The Tuning Adapter is a two-way communication device to allow one-way devices like the Series 3 TiVo and the TiVo HD to send channel requests to the cable company. Currently, all channels are being broadcast over the coaxial cable all the time, even if no one is watching some of them. A technology called Switched Digital Video will enable cable companies to set aside and use, say, 100 channels for requests out of a pool of, say, 300 available program streams. It is a bit like Pay-Per-View and Video On Demand but is different. It allows your TiVo to "telephone" your cable company to request programs."


----------



## Rolow

Zeigh said:


> Hello,
> 
> Does anyone have any valid information concerning the "converter" or "adapter" that Cox Communications has stated will soon be made available to it's customers in the Phoenix area? They recently sent out a letter informing me that a free device of some type would be released to address the Tivo Series 3 technical issues. As typical with Cox Communications Technical Support, nobody knows anything about this issue. They would rather send yet another technician out before escalating my call to someone that actually is knowledgeable about the issue.
> 
> "Technological change is like an axe in the hands of a pathological criminal." (Albert Einstein, 1941),
> Dr. Z.


The converter or adapter you referring to is a tuning resolver for SDV switched digital video and has nothing to do with what ever problem your having right now with you series 3. There was a list of channels with the letter. Those channels will be moving to SDV and you will need an SDV adapter to tune to those channels. The list of channels in Phoenix are mostly obscure stuff most people won't miss. I'm not sure when there turning on the SDV.
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=357703
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=390736

I don't know what your problem is or when it started but tivo/sa released a software update for the SA cable cards and cox phoenix just rolled it out. The up date fixed some problems and created others.
So let us know what the problem is and may be some one can help.


----------



## Rolow

jebbbz said:


> The item you ask about is a Tuning Adapter, previously known as a Tuning Resolver. It is not intended to fix any problems that would be addressed by a tehnician. When you speak of "technical issues" it sounds like you are having problems -- losing reception, messed up recordings, bad signals, re-boots, whatever. The Tuning Adapter won't fix problems like that.
> 
> (The Tuning Adapter is a two-way communication device to allow one-way devices like the Series 3 TiVo and the TiVo HD send channel requests to the cable company. Currently, all channels are being broadcast over the coaxial cable all the time, even if no one is watching some of them. A technology called Switched Digital Video will enable cable companies to set aside and use, say, 100 channels for requests out of a pool of, say, 300 available program streams. It is a bit like Pay-Per-View and Video On Demand but is different. It allows your TiVo to "telephone" your cable company to request programs."


I must type slow


----------



## jebbbz

Rolow said:


> I must type slow


Yeah, but you make fewer typos...


----------



## Dbax5

mstrassel said:


> This is the 4th time I have had to have (Phoenix) Cox come out and replace my Scientific Atlanta Cablecard. Every few weeks I suddenly don't get half the channels they are just black. Sometimes I can just reset the Tivo and they come back....but Thursday was the 4th time it would not come back and they have to send a tech out. It started getting a firmware update and when the tech arrived today,Sunday it was still trying. They tried another card....same thing.....and this 4th round I can't watch anything. They actually left saying the supervisor says just wait for the update to finish and it will be fine.....I said I have been waiting for that for 4 days!!!! I called Tivo because they said well maybe you don't have the latest Tivo Software? They confirmed I do....and so begins the never ending saga...Cox blames Tivo, Tivo blames dumb Cox technicians, they both blame Atlanta Scientific for making a lousy card. NOBODY accepts responsibility and NOBODY has an answer on how to fix this. The cable guy came back 30 minutes later and says you know we found this "level" is too high now since we did this system wide firmware and so we dont think cablecards will work until this level is fixed....and since this is a systemwide change they will not be able to fix the level for at least 10 days!!!!! So I will not have cable TV now for at least 2 weeks. I see all sides of this but the bottom line is I have never felt so screwed and mistreated.....on all sides.....They said Tivo works with all cable providers and all cable providers are required to support your Tivo....well it's not happening and I am at the point telling them both what they can do with their service, customer or otherwise. If anyone has a magic answer I would love to hear it otherwise I think I am headed to Barnes and Noble to join a book club.


I have same problem with Cox. Upgrade has been going on for 5 days now. Cox supervisor brought 5 cable cards out to the house. None work. They don't know what is wrong. Can't even get through to Tivo support. Twenty minute wait. I am fed up. Dumping the Tivo in the trash. When it works I love it, but this is ridiculous. Why don't Cox technicians read this board? They know nothing. The supervisor knew nothing.


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## Kershek

Can you dump it in my trash instead?


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## jebbbz

Kershek said:


> Can you dump it in my trash instead?


I realize you are joking a bit but do you have a Series 3 or HD already and is it functioning with digital cable and cablecards? I am curious whether it is all or most Cox TiVo users having the problem or only a few. If the latter, where in Phoenix metro? I count about a half dozen Phoenix people with firmware upgrade problems, I am at 35th and Bell and have a milder version of the firmware problem -- as I noted above I only have problems if I tune to Cox channel 199 and after about five minutes my TiVo becomes usable again although I avoid channel 199 or I have the problem again.

If p_harper sees this, please post if your scheduled Tuesday truck roll fixes the problem. Some people have a more serious problem where their cabl cards never update even after days and even after cable card replacements.


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## Kershek

I'm sorry for making light of your situation. Yes, I have a TiVoHD here in Mesa with an M-card. For the first month or two I had issues with it losing channels and having to reboot it, and I've had to ask for a couple of hits. It was annoying, but I was expecting the problem to get fixed sooner or later, and I had a series 2 upstairs recording the same things to pick up the slack in case the HD lost channels. However, that problem seems to have gone away in the past couple of months and it's been working great I just recently returned from being out of state for 3 weeks and it recorded everything without a hitch. The only exception is a partial recording of Doctor Who last Friday, but I couldn't figure out why.

I haven't tried to go to channel 199, so I don't know if I have problems with it. I'd rather not tempt fate if what you say is true


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## jebbbz

Kershek said:


> I'm sorry for making light of your situation...


Don't be sorry, I didn't think you were being offensive (besides, it was Dbax5 who was thinking of dumping his TiVo as his seems T-Totally F'd -- mine works fine if I avoid TCM until the problem is fixed). I just wasn't sure if your comment meant you had yet to get a TiVo S3 or HD so I was being tentative in asking if your upgrade had gone smoothly.

Since the 0301 firmware upgrade I haven't had any loss of channels (the old main problem) but a few months ago I noticed that my HD was noticing the loss of channels and fixing them itself -- some sort of TiVo software upgrade I figured. I saw my channels disappear and then come back without my having to reboot or do anything. That may explain the improvement you saw as I think I only had a single recording affected in the last couple of months. Perhaps your Dr. Who problem arose during the CC firmware update -- it seemed to just happen on Friday without concern for scheduled recordings.

I also noticed that my SubExpTime had changed witjout my having to call Cox and tell them I was still a subscriber. My old date was July 9 but today I checked and it had been set to July 30. I'll have to wait until then to see if it updates at the end of the month.


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## TheLongshot

Dbax5 said:


> I have same problem with Cox. Upgrade has been going on for 5 days now. Cox supervisor brought 5 cable cards out to the house. None work. They don't know what is wrong. Can't even get through to Tivo support. Twenty minute wait. I am fed up. Dumping the Tivo in the trash. When it works I love it, but this is ridiculous. Why don't Cox technicians read this board? They know nothing. The supervisor knew nothing.


I had problems when they tried to install M-Cards into my Tivo. For some reason, it didn't want to pick up the digital tiers and the non-local HD stations. Finally they put in two S-Cards and it worked fine.

Jason


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## hddude55

hddude55 said:


> Looks like we MAY have the missing channels bug fixed here in the Phoenix area so we can have a fully functioning TiVo experience for three or four days until sdv deployment and deleted channels on July 1. I'll bet Cox will roll out the tuning resolver with about the same sense of urgency -- hopefully by 2010 or so.


 I spoke too soon. After three or four days with the "fix" I again have missing non-local channels! What a bunch of BS.


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## jebbbz

hddude55 said:


> I spoke too soon. After three or four days with the "fix" I again have missing non-local channels! What a bunch of BS.


Did you confirm that your cable card(s) received the firmware upgrade? You would need to check under SA CableCARD Diag Screen under the CableCARD Menu. It should read (about four lines from the bottom): PKEY1.1.12_F.p.0301


----------



## hddude55

jebbbz said:


> Did you confirm that your cable card(s) received the firmware upgrade? You would need to check under SA CableCARD Diag Screen under the CableCARD Menu. It should read (about four lines from the bottom): PKEY1.1.12_F.p.0301


I don't blame you for grasping at straws, but, I know all too well how to check the software version and both cards were both updated last weekend to 0301.

I know this bad news is almost too hard to believe but it's true and I'll bet others will report problems as a few more days pass. The "fix" may have worked fine in Vegas for several weeks but obviously there must be hardware differences between Cox-Phoenix and Cox-Vegas.


----------



## Dbax5

Well I did it. After investing more than $300 in Tivo HD I am dumping it in favor of the Cox DVR. I have 6 months left on my subscription, which I will have to eat. I will pack my Tivo away until they get cable cards that work. Tivo support will not admit that Scientific Atlantic cards are faulty. Cox tells me that Tivo is suing Scientific Atlantic. 
I love Tivo when it works. But it doesn't. The Cox DVR isn't a Tivo, but it comes close. And now I can have ON Demand and get Howard Stern TV. And eventually save $13 a week.
I now have to call Tivo and cancel, and put up with them trying to talk me out of it. But I am so pissed, I won't change my mind. We have to make a stand until this problem is fixed. And the firmware update fixes nothing. Some of you are lucky I guess. The Cox guy said he guarantees the new cable cards last only 2 months. He said they are swamped with problems.


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## Dbax5

Just one more thing! I wish I knew about this sight before I bought the damn thing. Tivo certainly didn't tell me that it would not work properly with Cox in Phoenix! I'm really down on this company and I hope others don't make the same mistake.


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## jebbbz

hddude55 said:


> I don't blame you for grasping at straws, but, I know all too well how to check the software version and both cards were both updated last weekend to 0301.


Sorry, it is sometimes hard for me to get a handle on which people have had which problems and to figure who has gotten what updates. Loss of channels hasn't been much of a problem for me since April and I haven't noticed any problems with channels since the firmware upgrade.

It looks like the Phoenix firmware upgrade went out to every one at the same time, rather than neighborhood by neighborhood. I am fairly sure that here Cox expanded partly by acquiring other cable systems and some of our problems may be due to incompatibilities legacy system hardware.

The loss of channels problems seems to hit both Series 3 and HD owners (I assume you have an S3 since you mention "both" cards). I don't know if the endless upgrade/channel 199 problem is common to both kinds of machines. Before your loss of channels problem returned did you notice any glitches in the firmware upgrade? Can you tune channel 199 without sending your TiVo into a tizzy?


----------



## craigo

I posted this before and I'll post this again. I too, had the issue of lost channels with the Mcards on my S3. I switched back to the Scards a few months ago and I haven't had any problems. Even the audio/video ff- every few seconds on certain SD channels, seems to have disappeared. Oh, and no lost channels...:up:


----------



## Darlbach

My two cents.....

I have a Cox m-card in the TIVO HD unit the Phoenix area (Peoria). I started getting the dreaded "Firmware Upgrade" screen last Wednesday/Thursday. I called Cox service and they tried to hit the card a few times but no change. They decided to roll a truck for Saturday. Woke up Saturday AM and the TIVo was working fine so I called and cancelled the service call. Saturday afternoon, guess what? The dreaded "Firmware Upgrade" screen again. I called Cox and got back in line for service. The guy shows up yesterday (Monday) and of course the thing is working just fine again. He seemed a bit perturbed, but I told him I knew the minute I cancelled the call it would stop working. He did say that they are having all kinds of problems with the cable cards and it's keeping them hopping. I know two people I work with are having the exact same problem. He said if you're just patient with the upgrade, eventually it will take. Well here we are on Tuesday PM and things are still working OK so far. Dare I say we're out of the woods?


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## jebbbz

Can you tune to channel 199 without your TiVo going crazy?


----------



## hddude55

jebbbz said:


> ...
> The loss of channels problems seems to hit both Series 3 and HD owners (I assume you have an S3 since you mention "both" cards). I don't know if the endless upgrade/channel 199 problem is common to both kinds of machines. Before your loss of channels problem returned did you notice any glitches in the firmware upgrade? Can you tune channel 199 without sending your TiVo into a tizzy?


I have a series3 and channel 199 wasn't an issue. The upgrade seemed to go smoothly in fact last weekend. But today all Hell has broken loose. This morningy I lost a bunch of non-locals on both cards, called Cox to roll a truck and a couple hours later the channels were all back - without a reboot! A few minutes ago they disappeared again - in fact I was watching when channel 36 CNN seemed to cut out and then went to a gray screen -- along with the other non-locals on both cards. I just now rebooted and all channels seem to be back on both cards. This is crazy. Some "fix."


----------



## Roderigo

hddude55 said:


> I have a series3 and channel 199 wasn't an issue. The upgrade seemed to go smoothly in fact last weekend. But today all Hell has broken loose. This morningy I lost a bunch of non-locals on both cards, called Cox to roll a truck and a couple hours later the channels were all back - without a reboot! A few minutes ago they disappeared again - in fact I was watching when channel 36 CNN seemed to cut out and then went to a gray screen -- along with the other non-locals on both cards. I just now rebooted and all channels seem to be back on both cards. This is crazy. Some "fix."


This doesn't sound as much like a cablecard issue as a signal issue. Is there any information from the cablecard diagnostics screens about what may be going wrong? how about the tivo diagnostics screen?


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## tHe toque

I hate to sound litigious but, has there been any talk of a class action lawsuit vs. Tivo/Cisco/Cox (any one or all three)? I just bought a Tivo HD and have had nothing but trouble with no possible remedy in sight yet. It seems that Cox is doing everything in their power to make cable cards unattractive to consumers, this is reflected in the attitude of the CSR's, tech support, and the field techs. If Cox wanted to fix the problems in the Phoenix metro area it seems to me they would have. Maybe the threat of litigation would help...

P.S. does anyone have information on how to access the executive level at Cox?


----------



## colflagg

I'm in Phoenix and I got the firmware upgrade (PKEY1.1.12_F.p.0301) on my S3 with Multi-Stream cards this past Thursday the 26th. I thought my gray-screen problems were resolved and my Tivo has been working fine up until yesterday (Tuesday).

Yesterday afternoon, right after work, I was scrolling through channels and when I got to 61 (QVC) and I was informed that my cable cards were performing an upgrade. After 4 hours and I figured out the cable cards were in a firmware update loop. The upgrade appears to complete, the channel tunes for about 1 second, then the firmware update starts again.

I called Cox and the rep stated my problem is due to the fact that SDV went into effect today (July 1) and now I cannot tune 40-100 channels depending on my tiers, and needed to wait for the tuning resolver to fix my issue.

I explained that I could not tune ANY channels and that the cards were in firmware upgrade status according to the diagnostic menu. Troubleshooting limit of the Cox rep reached, need to send a truck, scheduled for Saturday morning.

After some more messing around, I finally was able to get out of the firmware upgrade loop by very quickly changing the channel during the 1 second tuning window and then repeating this process on the other cable card. I verified the firmware version and it is still PKEY1.1.12_F.p.0301

I can re-create the firmware upgrade loop at any time by tuning to a specific channel (there are several that cause this to occur), and get back out again after waiting approx. 10 minutes for the 1 second window on each cable card.

Maybe this does have something to do with SDV, even though only half of the channels that cause this condition to occur are supposed to switch to SDV.

I guess I don't use the channel up/down buttons to tune stations until this is resolved, as I don't want to accidentally trip this loop.

One problem resolved, another rears its ugly head.

Fortunately, I have another S3 with single stream cards that is working OK, but this is pretty frustrating.

Here's hoping Cox gets their act together soon. I love the Tivo platform, but after spending 6 weeks last year (and getting the BBB involved) just getting 4 good cable cards installed, constant gray-screen freezing of my S3 with multi-stream cards since November, my patience is VERY thin.

I realize that my technical issues are all with Cox-Phoenix and not with Tivo, but if I want a HD DVR solution that works, I'm not sure I can remain a Tivo subscriber, since Tivo HD devices only work with cable.



Darlbach said:


> My two cents.....
> 
> I have a Cox m-card in the TIVO HD unit the Phoenix area (Peoria). I started getting the dreaded "Firmware Upgrade" screen last Wednesday/Thursday. I called Cox service and they tried to hit the card a few times but no change. They decided to roll a truck for Saturday. Woke up Saturday AM and the TIVo was working fine so I called and cancelled the service call. Saturday afternoon, guess what? The dreaded "Firmware Upgrade" screen again. I called Cox and got back in line for service. The guy shows up yesterday (Monday) and of course the thing is working just fine again. He seemed a bit perturbed, but I told him I knew the minute I cancelled the call it would stop working. He did say that they are having all kinds of problems with the cable cards and it's keeping them hopping. I know two people I work with are having the exact same problem. He said if you're just patient with the upgrade, eventually it will take. Well here we are on Tuesday PM and things are still working OK so far. Dare I say we're out of the woods?


----------



## mstrassel

mstrassel said:


> This is the 4th time I have had to have (Phoenix) Cox come out and replace my Scientific Atlanta Cablecard. Every few weeks I suddenly don't get half the channels they are just black. Sometimes I can just reset the Tivo and they come back....but Thursday was the 4th time it would not come back and they have to send a tech out. It started getting a firmware update and when the tech arrived today,Sunday it was still trying. They tried another card....same thing.....and this 4th round I can't watch anything. They actually left saying the supervisor says just wait for the update to finish and it will be fine.....I said I have been waiting for that for 4 days!!!! I called Tivo because they said well maybe you don't have the latest Tivo Software? They confirmed I do....and so begins the never ending saga...Cox blames Tivo, Tivo blames dumb Cox technicians, they both blame Atlanta Scientific for making a lousy card. NOBODY accepts responsibility and NOBODY has an answer on how to fix this. The cable guy came back 30 minutes later and says you know we found this "level" is too high now since we did this system wide firmware and so we dont think cablecards will work until this level is fixed....and since this is a systemwide change they will not be able to fix the level for at least 10 days!!!!! So I will not have cable TV now for at least 2 weeks. I see all sides of this but the bottom line is I have never felt so screwed and mistreated.....on all sides.....They said Tivo works with all cable providers and all cable providers are required to support your Tivo....well it's not happening and I am at the point telling them both what they can do with their service, customer or otherwise. If anyone has a magic answer I would love to hear it otherwise I think I am headed to Barnes and Noble to join a book club.


This is still an ongoing issue for my TivoHD. Today I called Tivo again and after 15 minutes on hold with a tech they said it was a hardware failure and I needed to pay $50 for an exchange on a TivoHD I got in Janurary that has had the problem with missing premium channels since Februrary. Cox has already had to swap the CC out 3 times prior to this firmware issue. I have another service call with Cox tomorrow and suppposedly a "supervisor" will be coming this time, not that it matters they will simply do what every other Cox tech does.....swap the card and pray.


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## jebbbz

FWIW, I checked channel 61 (QVC) and it, like 199 (TCM), causes me the 10 minute firmware upgrade problem. I only have about half the available channels set to show in my Guide so I imagine there are others that would cause the problem, too, if I tuned to them manually.


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## TiVoJerry

For those of you who have rec'd the updated firmware and have experienced grey channels again, please send me a PM ASAP with your TSN so I can enable logging. Unfortunately I will be Out of the Office for several days, so I'd like to get this going personally while I have the chance before trying to get someone else involved in trying to contact people individually.
Thank you.


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## Rolow

I don't have the gray screen. I am losing channels though. Every thing will be fine then the screen will go black. The recording will stop and I'll get an error message I did not take note of the message yet. Then I'll get kicked to tivo central I can go right back to live tv switch the channels a few times and every thing will be normal. Except I have to re-start recordings manual so if I'm not home I'm screwed. I've missed about 10 recordings because of this problem.


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## yroca

Rolow said:


> I don't have the gray screen. I am losing channels though. Every thing will be fine then the screen will go black. The recording will stop and I'll get an error message I did not take note of the message yet. Then I'll get kicked to tivo central I can go right back to live tv switch the channels a few times and every thing will be normal. Except I have to re-start recordings manual so if I'm not home I'm screwed. I've missed about 10 recordings because of this problem.


Rolow - I think black/grey screen is the same issue - just depends on TV/TiVo settings as to what background color it shows. I am here in Phoenix and am seeing dropped channels yesterday like crazy - at least 5 or 6 times in a short period of time. I just let it sit on the black screen and a minute or so later the channel would resume. Very annoying though. I attributed it to possible changes Cox in Phoenix might be doing to prepare for SVD and for a couple new HD channels being pushed out in the next 2 weeks.


----------



## p_harper

jebbbz said:


> I realize you are joking a bit but do you have a Series 3 or HD already and is it functioning with digital cable and cablecards? I am curious whether it is all or most Cox TiVo users having the problem or only a few. If the latter, where in Phoenix metro? I count about a half dozen Phoenix people with firmware upgrade problems, I am at 35th and Bell and have a milder version of the firmware problem -- as I noted above I only have problems if I tune to Cox channel 199 and after about five minutes my TiVo becomes usable again although I avoid channel 199 or I have the problem again.
> 
> If p_harper sees this, please post if your scheduled Tuesday truck roll fixes the problem. Some people have a more serious problem where their cabl cards never update even after days and even after cable card replacements.


The visit on Tuesday morning didn't resolve much. I was able to demonstrate to the tech that tuning to channel 199 would cause the update loop for my M-Card. He replaced it with another M-Card and it had the same problem. Interestingly, the diagnostics screen showed that the new card had 0301 withing a couple of minutes after it was inserted. So if it did get the update it went pretty quickly.

He didn't have any S-Cards and he's scheduled another trip a week from Saturday to get me one. Even if it works that's not a solution for everyone.

I'm at 7th Ave and Greenway, so not that far from jebbbz, and my symptoms are that same as he's described. Works fine if I stay away from 199. I am not getting grey screen problems, etc. Ironically, I did lose my encrypted channels on the M-card on Monday, so that problem isn't fixed for me.

I spent some time with the tech and on the phone trying to push the idea that there is a problem with the update and channel 199 but I don't know how far that will go. I get the impression that the information is not being passed very far up the chain.


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## mstrassel

p_harper said:


> The visit on Tuesday morning didn't resolve much. I was able to demonstrate to the tech that tuning to channel 199 would cause the update loop for my M-Card. He replaced it with another M-Card and it had the same problem. Interestingly, the diagnostics screen showed that the new card had 0301 withing a couple of minutes after it was inserted. So if it did get the update it went pretty quickly.
> 
> He didn't have any S-Cards and he's scheduled another trip a week from Saturday to get me one. Even if it works that's not a solution for everyone.
> 
> I'm at 7th Ave and Greenway, so not that far from jebbbz, and my symptoms are that same as he's described. Works fine if I stay away from 199. I am not getting grey screen problems, etc. Ironically, I did lose my encrypted channels on the M-card on Monday, so that problem isn't fixed for me.
> 
> I spent some time with the tech and on the phone trying to push the idea that there is a problem with the update and channel 199 but I don't know how far that will go. I get the impression that the information is not being passed very far up the chain.


I have had 2 techs in the last week call around looking for S-Cards and they were told there aren't any in the entire valley, they are gone and not getting any more.....Just letting you know what I heard "on the street" If you ever get one let me know.


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## yroca

> I also noticed that my SubExpTime had changed witjout my having to call Cox and tell them I was still a subscriber. My old date was July 9 but today I checked and it had been set to July 30. I'll have to wait until then to see if it updates at the end of the month.


I also was having to call Cox every 30 days because of the SubExpireTime issue. My SubExpireTime was July 7, 2008, but I just checked today and it has updated to August 1, 2008. Yippeee! This will be the first time in 6 months that I won't have to call in!


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## nemein

I'm still trying to digest all the info in this thread so apologies if these questions have been answered already...

I just got an HD Tivo over the weekend and had Cox (NOVA) swap out my DVR for the cable card. The original installer went through 2 of them, I had a second installer out this evening to try a 3rd and I'm still having a problem. Nothing that is associated w/ the "digital tier" works (HD or non-HD). Is the problem I'm having what everyone is experiencing, I'm seeing something else about a firmware loop but it's kind of hard to tell if it's NOVA or Phoenix people who are having that problem. If I'm reading the thread right this is a problem w/ the Mcards Cox is using. So is it all the Mcards or are some working and some aren't? Do people think it's just a matter of time before this issue is worked out or has this been an ongoing issue (or part of a series of issues) that Cox has had w/ the Tivo? Are people that have two Scards, as opposed to the Mcard, having these same problems? Is it even possible to get Scards anymore (although I guess that's really a question for Cox )?

I'm just trying to figure out if I should keep this or send it back and cancel the subscription (have about 25 days now to figure it out )

Thanks

EDIT: I did check the firmware and I'm on the 301.

BTW (and this might not be the right thread) does anyone know if Verizon FIOS is having the same sorts of problems? I'm not dead set on Cox, esp if it doesn't give me everything I'm paying for...


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## nightdesigns

I'm hopping into this thread late, but I am too having issues in the Phoenix area (Surprise). I'll check some of the other items people have checked earlier in this thread.

I wanted to add my issue. The tivo will be recording and then just stop. Sometimes it'll throw an error (sorry, can't remember the exact, maybe a 161-something). I believe it started happening yesterday. Right now all I'm getting is partial errors. Channel changing on HD is slow to acquire and tune. 

I'm running a HD with an external drive attached. Nothing too out of the ordinary. I do have a M-series card that worked for the most part correctly until yesterday. Cox does have truck roll scheduled for monday.


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## craigo

nemein said:


> Are people that have two Scards, as opposed to the Mcard, having these same problems? Is it even possible to get Scards anymore (although I guess that's really a question for Cox )?


I have an S3 with two Scards and have absolutely no issues. A while ago I swapped them out for the Mcards and had the same issues as everybody else. I went back to the Scards a few months ago and everything is running great.

Regarding the availability of Scards. Not sure where you are located. I would call Cox to find out. People here in Phoenix are saying Cox is out of Scards.


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## Shawn95GT

If you have the choice between Cox of FIOS I can't think of a single reason to go with Cox -lol. Is it significantly cheaper?

This is coming from a happy Cox customer.


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## jebbbz

So far, it sounds like you have "ordinary" cable card problems -- many of the damn things simply do not work. It isn't unheard of to go through as many as half a dozen, though I never had a cable card installation take more than two. The original problems we Phoenix people are currently discussing arise some time after a good card installation, days, sometimes weeks later. We would lose the ability to watch encrypted channels. Rebroadcasts of local channels was, if I recall correctly, never affected. Reboots and some other tricks would "fix" the problem temporarily (at least usually as some people had to get new cable cards).

As far as I know it is only Cox in Phoenix that has been having these special problems. The 0301 firmware was supposed to solve these special problems and for me, at least, seems to have done so except that tuning to certain channels causes my TiVo to go crazy for five or ten minutes and act as if it needs to redo the firmware upgrade. Other people seem to be stuck in an endless firmware upgrade loop. There is no way to tell if their original problems have been fixed since the firmware upgrade loop prevents them from using their TiVos at all. A few other people here in Phoenix report the "mild" problem I have but quite a few others seem to suffer the more serious problem.


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## hddude55

jebbbz said:


> ... The 0301 firmware was supposed to solve these special problems and for me, at least, seems to have done so except that tuning to certain channels causes my TiVo to go crazy for five or ten minutes and act as if it needs to redo the firmware upgrade. Other people seem to be stuck in an endless firmware upgrade loop. There is no way to tell if their original problems have been fixed since the firmware upgrade loop prevents them from using their TiVos at all. A few other people here in Phoenix report the "mild" problem I have but quite a few others seem to suffer the more serious problem.


Huh, doesn't the East Valley count in the Phoenix market? I think I pretty clearly reported here that the old losing channels problem cropped up on my series3 yesterday -- on both cards and both were upgraded to 0301 last Thursday. I do wonder if the alleged sdv roll-out yesterday may have caused some conflict with the missing channels "fix." So far, so good today.

...Oh sh.. I just checked and 733 ESPN is gonzo but oddly enough it came back for a few seconds before disappearing again and that never happened with the original missing channels issue...and now a few minutes later everything seems to be back!! Cripes, this is insane. I think at least one other person reported the same thing. The missing channels problem seems to be back, but seems to "self-heal" after some period of time without a reboot -- and both cards in my series3 are affected.


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## jebbbz

hddude55 said:


> Huh, doesn't the East Valley count in the Phoenix market? I think I pretty clearly reported here that the old losing channels problem cropped up on my series3 yesterday -- on both cards and both were upgraded to 0301 last Thursday. I do wonder if the alleged sdv roll-out yesterday may have caused some conflict with the missing channels "fix." So far, so good today.


Sure, East Valley counts. As I said, for me, at least, the loss of channels problems seems fixed by 0301 and I am guessing the upgrade fixed the old problem for some others, too. Just not for everybody.



> ...Oh sh.. I just checked and 733 ESPN is gonzo but oddly enough it came back for a few seconds before disappearing again and that never happened with the original missing channels issue...and now a few minutes later everything seems to be back!! Cripes, this is insane. I think at least one other person reported the same thing. The missing channels problem seems to be back, but seems to "self-heal" after some period of time without a reboot -- and both cards in my series3 are affected.


Yes, I noticed the self-healing effect back in April after the TiVo software upgrade (9.3a? Something like that.) You seem to suffer an extraordinarily severe case of loss of channels, one that the self-healing can barely cope with for even a short time. On the other hand, if I remember all your posts correctly, you don't suffer from the channel 199/firmware upgrade problem, much less the endless firmware upgrade loop.

Over of the AVS Forums I got a message from an Ahwatukee resident who says he has no problems with channel 199. In fact, he didn't mention any problems at all. I asked him to check if he has the 0301 upgrade. Someone with more hsitorical knowledge of cable TV in Phoenix might know what service areas Cox bought up and which ones they built into. If the cable company equipment differs by town/city/neighborhood some people may have no problems while others have tons.


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## Roderigo

hddude55 said:


> Huh, doesn't the East Valley count in the Phoenix market? I think I pretty clearly reported here that the old losing channels problem cropped up on my series3 yesterday -- on both cards and both were upgraded to 0301 last Thursday. I do wonder if the alleged sdv roll-out yesterday may have caused some conflict with the missing channels "fix." So far, so good today.
> 
> ...Oh sh.. I just checked and 733 ESPN is gonzo but oddly enough it came back for a few seconds before disappearing again and that never happened with the original missing channels issue...and now a few minutes later everything seems to be back!! Cripes, this is insane. I think at least one other person reported the same thing. The missing channels problem seems to be back, but seems to "self-heal" after some period of time without a reboot -- and both cards in my series3 are affected.


I think you're seeing some other problem... From what everone's described, this doesn't sound anything like a cablecard issue, but just a pure signal quality issue.


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## nightdesigns

Well, I'm now officially suck in the firmware update loop. Joy! Truck roll is scheduled for Monday (that was the soonest after a Tuesday evening call).


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## nemein

Well I called Cox and asked the CSR to add a note to bring out Scards instead of a new Mcard. I guess we'll see what happens next week... If that doesn't work I guess I'll try FIOS before giving up and sending the Tivo back.


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## TheLongshot

nemein said:


> I'm still trying to digest all the info in this thread so apologies if these questions have been answered already...
> 
> I just got an HD Tivo over the weekend and had Cox (NOVA) swap out my DVR for the cable card. The original installer went through 2 of them, I had a second installer out this evening to try a 3rd and I'm still having a problem. Nothing that is associated w/ the "digital tier" works (HD or non-HD). Is the problem I'm having what everyone is experiencing, I'm seeing something else about a firmware loop but it's kind of hard to tell if it's NOVA or Phoenix people who are having that problem. If I'm reading the thread right this is a problem w/ the Mcards Cox is using. So is it all the Mcards or are some working and some aren't? Do people think it's just a matter of time before this issue is worked out or has this been an ongoing issue (or part of a series of issues) that Cox has had w/ the Tivo? Are people that have two Scards, as opposed to the Mcard, having these same problems? Is it even possible to get Scards anymore (although I guess that's really a question for Cox )?
> 
> I'm just trying to figure out if I should keep this or send it back and cancel the subscription (have about 25 days now to figure it out )
> 
> Thanks
> 
> EDIT: I did check the firmware and I'm on the 301.
> 
> BTW (and this might not be the right thread) does anyone know if Verizon FIOS is having the same sorts of problems? I'm not dead set on Cox, esp if it doesn't give me everything I'm paying for...


As I said above, I had the same problem and Cox had to install two S-Cards to get things working correctly. But, once they were installed, they worked perfectly. Both M-Cards they had brought didn't bring in the digital tier channels.

I'm in NOVA, BTW.

Jason


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## djwilso

I'm also in Phoenix and am experiencing the following problems as of July 1 2008 with my Series 3 that has *2 Scientific Atlanta S-cards*.

My S3 has software *9.3a*.

When changing channels, the screen stays black for approximately 10 seconds, which is much longer than normal.

If the target channel is unencrypted, after the 10 second delay is over, the channel appears and comes in steady. This is true of local HD channels as well as the SD lower channels.

If the target channel is encrypted (HD or SD act the same), after the 10 second delay is over, the channel appears with audio and a frozen video frame for about 1 second and then everything goes back to black with no audio or video. If I then wait about another full minute, the channel starts to come back in for about the next 20 seconds with video freezes and audio dropouts and finally stabilizes and comes in steady.

Additionally, I also had the experience where even after an encrypted channel had locked and had been coming in steady for about 20 minutes that all of a sudden it started failing and then went back to black again. In the following 5 minutes, it went in and out 4 or 5 times and then finally came back in steady. Even with steady video, the audio kept dropping out for sub-second intervals for another minute until it finally locked in steady. Completely annoying. 

If I reboot the TiVo, both tuners work normally with original channel changing performance for at least the first 15 to 30 minutes. Then, the channel changing sluggishness starts again progressively until it reaches a maximum slowness again.

Also of note is that the performance issue seems to come and go by itself independently of tuner. That is, when one tuner is experiencing the sluggishness, the other one acts normally. It's maddening.

Last night when I attempted to view the CableCard CP screen, I received an error about being unable to retrieve an HTML file (can't remember exactly what it said), but today the CP screen does appear, but with mine I am not seeing exactly where the card's firmware version is displayed.

On the CableCard Diag screen, I do see this: "*OS Build:2.3.149s2 (0) Mon May 2 2005 1:28:42 PM EDT*". It's the same for both cards. Is this the S-Card firmware version? If so, it does not appear to have changed since 2005...

I have not experienced any firmware upgrade screens or the infinite upgrade loops that might accompany them reported by others.

I had assumed that all of this was due to the July 1 rollout of SDV, but many of the posts here are attributing it to a firmware upgrade. I suspect it will somehow turn out to be SDV.

I just wanted everyone to know that S-cards are not immune to this very irritating problem and that getting S-cards, if any are even available, may not correct the problems being experienced.

Dennis


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## p_harper

jebbbz said:


> FWIW, I checked channel 61 (QVC) and it, like 199 (TCM), causes me the 10 minute firmware upgrade problem. I only have about half the available channels set to show in my Guide so I imagine there are others that would cause the problem, too, if I tuned to them manually.


Same thing happened to me last night on channel 266 in the Starz tier.

When it happens now I just go watch something from the Now Playing list and keep the remote handy. When there's a break in the update loop it'll kick me over to live TV and if I change the channel fast enough I can get back to normal. Minimizes the inconvenience.


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## jebbbz

I don't subscribe to the Starz tier but I keyed in 266 and doing so did not send my TiVo into a tizzy (I saw nothing but the program description, of course.) Presumably, CC checking to see if I subscribe to a channel doesn't cause the problem, actual tuning does. Also, I am starting to have some problems tuning and keeping channels, even local rebroadcasts. ABC took forever to come in.


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## Joel47

jebbbz said:


> Over of the AVS Forums I got a message from an Ahwatukee resident who says he has no problems with channel 199. In fact, he didn't mention any problems at all. I asked him to check if he has the 0301 upgrade.


That would be me. Haven't had a chance to check the version number (will check tonight), but I didn't say I didn't have _any_ problems. When watching Music Choice (classical music helps my daughter fall asleep), the screen will go grey. I can switch to any other channel and it'll be fine, and it fixes itself a few minutes later. I haven't noticed any other channels with this problem.

Also, last week I lost all the encrypted channels and had to call Cox, so apparently my expire time isn't updating automagically.

All-in-all, it seems like I'm getting off lightly...

Edit: Yes, I have version 0301. I'm also (currently) missing Discovery HD Theater; got home and both tuners were stuck on it with a grey screen. I get the other encrypted stuff, though, so I'll try rebooting once my daughter's show is over.


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## bowlingblogger

Apologies for the lengthy post...just want to throw my hat into the ring.

I have Cox Digital Cable in Tucson with a TivoHD and I have had the channel-loss problem since I got it in January 08 and required a new cable card every 30-45 days (whether S- or M-cards--same problem with both). 9.3 alleviated, but did not eliminate the problem. A few weeks ago I lost channels right on schedule and called for a new card, but this time a re-authorization, pairing and hit brought back the channels (and my sub expire time was moved back). I was elated at the prospect that from now on I would still lose channels occasionally, but a simple phone call rather than a whole new card would bring things back to normal after reboots stopped working.

I haven't even had the channel-loss problem at all since firmware 301 was installed on my card, but now I have a new problem, as one other poster reported: just about all of my recordings stop a few minutes before the end and they all wind up as partials. It does not start another partial recording where it left off, which is what I thought 9.3 was supposed to make happen. I think the firmware update screwed up my card (or it's just scheduled to die anyway) and I'm getting a new one Monday.

If it's not one thing with this TivoHD, it's been another...

In case anyone's curious, tuning to channel 199 does not mess up my Tivo--I tune TCM as normal. Also, I can still tune all of the channels that were supposedly moved to SDV on July 1. A rep told me yesterday that they hadn't gotten to all neighborhoods yet for the switch, but I'm not sure what to believe.


----------



## Dbax5

nemein said:


> I'm still trying to digest all the info in this thread so apologies if these questions have been answered already...
> 
> I just got an HD Tivo over the weekend and had Cox (NOVA) swap out my DVR for the cable card. The original installer went through 2 of them, I had a second installer out this evening to try a 3rd and I'm still having a problem. Nothing that is associated w/ the "digital tier" works (HD or non-HD). Is the problem I'm having what everyone is experiencing, I'm seeing something else about a firmware loop but it's kind of hard to tell if it's NOVA or Phoenix people who are having that problem. If I'm reading the thread right this is a problem w/ the Mcards Cox is using. So is it all the Mcards or are some working and some aren't? Do people think it's just a matter of time before this issue is worked out or has this been an ongoing issue (or part of a series of issues) that Cox has had w/ the Tivo? Are people that have two Scards, as opposed to the Mcard, having these same problems? Is it even possible to get Scards anymore (although I guess that's really a question for Cox )?
> 
> I'm just trying to figure out if I should keep this or send it back and cancel the subscription (have about 25 days now to figure it out )
> 
> Thanks
> 
> EDIT: I did check the firmware and I'm on the 301.
> 
> BTW (and this might not be the right thread) does anyone know if Verizon FIOS is having the same sorts of problems? I'm not dead set on Cox, esp if it doesn't give me everything I'm paying for...


Send it back now! It will not work until the cable card issue is solved. Purchase it again if they ever solve the problem. Don't get screwed like I did. 
Right now TivoHD is an absolute joke.


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## bacevedo

OK - I had an interesting conversation with a CS rep when I was checking on ordering new service. After getting through all of the different quotes for different services, I asked if it included a digital cable box, because I had a TivoHD and didn't need a box, but would need cable cards. She informed me that she couldn't order cable cards, because Cox is not supporting cable cards as of 7/15 (or something close to that).

After I stopped laughing in my head, I said "just to make sure I am clear, you are telling me that you are not supporting cable cards" and she said "yes". I said "so if I wanted to order a cable card right now, you are telling me you can't" and she said "correct". She said letters went out to everyone last month stating this and I told her if this was true I would have seen posts about it on the internet and I haven't. I asked if she meant about the SDV switch over and she said no, this was something else because the cable cards weren't working and they might eventually send out new cards when they get fixed. After telling her about the firmware update to fix issues, she said that wasn't it either.

Needless to say, I am pretty sure she was confused. However, I wanted to check here and find out if anyone received any other letter besides the SDV letter. I can call back and probably talk to a supervisor if necessary to get a cable card ordered, but honestly, I was not happy paying the price they were going to charge. To get their bundle (and save $38) I had to upgrade my phone and internet, basically making it a wash.

Bryan


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## BrianAZ

bacevedo said:


> OK - I had an interesting conversation with a CS rep when I was checking on ordering new service. After getting through all of the different quotes for different services, I asked if it included a digital cable box, because I had a TivoHD and didn't need a box, but would need cable cards. She informed me that she couldn't order cable cards, because Cox is not supporting cable cards as of 7/15 (or something close to that).
> 
> After I stopped laughing in my head, I said "just to make sure I am clear, you are telling me that you are not supporting cable cards" and she said "yes". I said "so if I wanted to order a cable card right now, you are telling me you can't" and she said "correct". She said letters went out to everyone last month stating this and I told her if this was true I would have seen posts about it on the internet and I haven't. I asked if she meant about the SDV switch over and she said no, this was something else because the cable cards weren't working and they might eventually send out new cards when they get fixed. After telling her about the firmware update to fix issues, she said that wasn't it either.
> 
> Needless to say, I am pretty sure she was confused. However, I wanted to check here and find out if anyone received any other letter besides the SDV letter. I can call back and probably talk to a supervisor if necessary to get a cable card ordered, but honestly, I was not happy paying the price they were going to charge. To get their bundle (and save $38) I had to upgrade my phone and internet, basically making it a wash.
> 
> Bryan


You spoke to a bad/lazy/ignorant CS rep. They are required by the FCC to support cable cards. If I recall the SDV letter, they make a special mention that the Tuning Resolver is coming out shortly for Tivos. If they were doing away with cablecards, why would the letter specifically mention further supporting Tivos?

A supervisor should immediately tell you the woman you were talking to is an idiot.


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## djwilso

bacevedo said:


> OK - I had an interesting conversation with a CS rep when I was checking on ordering new service. After getting through all of the different quotes for different services, I asked if it included a digital cable box, because I had a TivoHD and didn't need a box, but would need cable cards. She informed me that she couldn't order cable cards, because Cox is not supporting cable cards as of 7/15 (or something close to that).


I am a current Phoenix Cox cable card customer, and while I did receive the letter detailing the July 1 2008 switch to SDV (which has not happened for me here yet in north Phoenix), there has been no other letter stating that Cox is no longer supporting the cards or installing new ones.

Why can't we get FIOS in Phoenix? That would be sweet...

Dennis


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## nemein

Dbax5 said:


> Send it back now! It will not work until the cable card issue is solved. Purchase it again if they ever solve the problem. Don't get screwed like I did.
> Right now TivoHD is an absolute joke.


W/ the  I can't tell if you're serious or not. I mean overall it seems like a nice device, and as mentioned I definitely prefer the UI over the Cox DVR. I mean if better cable cards are on the way I can just wait it out (or maybe switch over to FIOS since there seems to be fewer people complaining about the cable cards associated w/ that). I get most of the channels I watch, just not the HD version of all of them.


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## hddude55

bacevedo said:


> OK - I had an interesting conversation with a CS rep .. She informed me that she couldn't order cable cards, because Cox is not supporting cable cards as of 7/15 (or something close to that)... However, I wanted to check here and find out if anyone received any other letter besides the SDV letter. I can call back and probably talk to a supervisor if necessary to get a cable card ordered..


An "interesting" conversation? Is that what talking to a fool is? I am as irritated by this cable card insanity as anyone but why in the world didn't you just hang up and call back or ask for a supervisor? We can't be expected to fix these problems but we do have some responsibility to use common sense.


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## jdavidson

bacevedo said:


> OK - I had an interesting conversation with a CS rep when I was checking on ordering new service. After getting through all of the different quotes for different services, I asked if it included a digital cable box, because I had a TivoHD and didn't need a box, but would need cable cards. She informed me that she couldn't order cable cards, because Cox is not supporting cable cards as of 7/15 (or something close to that).
> 
> After I stopped laughing in my head, I said "just to make sure I am clear, you are telling me that you are not supporting cable cards" and she said "yes". I said "so if I wanted to order a cable card right now, you are telling me you can't" and she said "correct". She said letters went out to everyone last month stating this....


I am very unhappy to report the same story from just this afternoon.

I recently moved here from Dallas (where I never had any troubles using the Verizon FiOS cable cards) and on June 17 I asked the service tech to give me two cable cards for my TivoHD during the installation. He informed me that he had no cards with him, but that I could pick them up at any of the Cox locations.

I finished moving in and went to the local Cox location (Bell Rd & 9th St), where I was informed:

I can only get cable cards installed by a technician, they are never given directly to a customer, AND
Cable cards are no longer available, a letter went out to all customers explaining this just recently, AND
Customers with cable cards are encouraged to come in and get a digital cable box for the same cost as cable cards, AND
The next version of cable cards was due out in the future, but he had NO IDEA when that would be.
The reasons for this change is that the cable cards were going to be updated to "version 2," which was going to be interactive. This is because the current cards had a number of problems, such as they were not interactive, they did not receive PPV channels, they did not allow people to order extra services, and TiVo needed two cards in order to work correctly. (_Anyone else notice this is all about their revenue stream?_) So no, I could not receive a cable card or have a tech deliver one even if I asked.

He then went on a rant against techs because they (the company, or maybe dunderheads who sit behind a counter like him) send out hundreds of emails on these topics and "How could the techs possibly not know this?" I suggested it might be because they sent hundreds of emails instead of just two.

On the plus side, he discounted my existing digital box and I picked up a second for the discounted price.

On the personal side, my wife is already mad and argumentative because her TiVos are not working, and I've only been home a couple hours. Just wait until the boxes are unpacked and she starts to have some more time to not watch her shows; then it's going to get really bad. Anyone know if Qwest can help me save my marriage?

~ Jeffrey
HD TiVo Series 3 (600 Gigs)
Sony Series 2 (240 Gigs)
Sony Series 2 (80 Gigs)
Sony Series 1 - foolishly given to my sister


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## bacevedo

hddude55 said:


> An "interesting" conversation? Is that what talking to a fool is? I am as irritated by this cable card insanity as anyone but why in the world didn't you just hang up and call back or ask for a supervisor? We can't be expected to fix these problems but we do have some responsibility to use common sense.


Well, if you read the rest of my post you will see that I wasn't going to order the service anyway, so I didn't care. If I needed to, I would have talked to a supervisor. I have plenty of common sense, thank you.

Bryan


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## Dbax5

nemein said:


> W/ the  I can't tell if you're serious or not. I mean overall it seems like a nice device, and as mentioned I definitely prefer the UI over the Cox DVR. I mean if better cable cards are on the way I can just wait it out (or maybe switch over to FIOS since there seems to be fewer people complaining about the cable cards associated w/ that). I get most of the channels I watch, just not the HD version of all of them.


Sorry about the  should have been . I am definately serious. Wait until this situation is solved. My Cox DVR is performing adequately and I now have On Demand. When the card situation is fixed, I will bring out my TivoHD. What sucks is I still have to pay 12.95 a month until Jan. 1009 because I signed up for a yearly contract when I bought the Tivo. Guess they new that it would not work with Cox cards.


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## djwilso

jdavidson said:


> I finished moving in and went to the local Cox location (Bell Rd & 9th St), where I was informed:
> 
> I can only get cable cards installed by a technician, they are never given directly to a customer, AND
> Cable cards are no longer available, a letter went out to all customers explaining this just recently, AND
> Customers with cable cards are encouraged to come in and get a digital cable box for the same cost as cable cards, AND
> The next version of cable cards was due out in the future, but he had NO IDEA when that would be.
> The reasons for this change is that the cable cards were going to be updated to "version 2," which was going to be interactive. This is because the current cards had a number of problems, such as they were not interactive, they did not receive PPV channels, they did not allow people to order extra services, and TiVo needed two cards in order to work correctly. (_Anyone else notice this is all about their revenue stream?_) So no, I could not receive a cable card or have a tech deliver one even if I asked.


Wow, what a load of BS!

It's true that Cox Phoenix won't give you cards at their retail stores. This is simply a way for them to force a truckroll at your expense to have a technician come to your house and stick the cards into the TiVo and then call into the office to have them provisioned.

Back when I wanted to get cable cards (Dec 2006), the CS rep told me I could get them at the retail store too, so it would appear that some of Cox's CS reps don't know squat.

It's also true that TiVo Series 3 need 2 cards to work. One for each tuner.

The version 2.0 the guy was talking about was CableCard 2.0. Maybe these will work in a TiVo, but I'm not sure. I am pretty certain that even a CableCard 2.0 would only act as a 1.0 card in a TiVo, however, meaning that no two-way functionality would be enabled due to the hardware design of the TiVo not supporting it.

No letter has gone out stating that cable cards would no longer be available, so that's (bad) news to me and really sucks if it is true. A letter went out stating that Switched Digital Video would be being deployed starting July 1 2008 and that "later in the year" the Tuning Adapter would be provided to cable card customers at no charge to enable them to tune in the channels being moved to SDV.

You can read the SDV letter at this link:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/3210027/Cox-Tuning-Resolver

Dennis


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## nemein

Dbax5 said:


> Sorry about the  should have been . I am definately serious. Wait until this situation is solved. My Cox DVR is performing adequately and I now have On Demand. When the card situation is fixed, I will bring out my TivoHD. What sucks is I still have to pay 12.95 a month until Jan. 1009 because I signed up for a yearly contract when I bought the Tivo. Guess they new that it would not work with Cox cards.


Since I went whole hog and signed up for the lifetime I'm going to wait it out. As I said I get most of the channels I watch (just not the best version of them) and if it's something that'll be fixed down the road I'd rather keep the nicer interface and other features that come w/ the Tivo. At this point though I think if it doesn't work when they come back out next time I'm just going to cancel Cox and give FIOS TV a try.


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## Rolow

So I lost a handful of channels here in Peoria AZ and had to call for a hit. The CSR was nice like every cox crs I've talked to has been. Then she got in to the "we don't know any thing about any problems with cable card" and i almost lost it. I am always calm and polite to the CSR's because my problems aren't there fault but this time my voice started to quiver I was so mad. 
I kept my cool and was polite but it lead me to start thinking of canceling my cox service for the first time. My only other option is OTA and it starting to look like a better solution then cox.
So the outages and truck rolls did not put me over the edge it was a CSR telling me she gets 3-4 calls a month about CC and none with the problems I have. F That

*Also could you guys update your user control panel to include your location *instead of putting it in the post body. It makes it a little easier to tell where your from.


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## Rolow

I don't usually watch live tv. Today its been on since my last post and have gotten error code 161-38 at least twice that I've noticed.

The first time I was on 780(hbo) it kicked me back to tivo central. I then went right back to HBO and all was fine. 

The second time I was on 712(NBC) it kicked me back to tivo central I then went back to live tv and NBC is still gone. I checked another 25 channels and they where all fine.

So I did a reboot from the Message&Settings menu and ever thing is back to normal.


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## Rolow

12 minutes after a reboot I get error 161-38 again while watching channel 712. I guess I should stop watching 712


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## Rolow

so I tried 715(ABC) and I did not get a error code just a black screen. I had to switch channels then switch tuners to go back to ABC then both tuners would pick it up. On to 705(CBS) less then 5 min and CBS went out with no error code. Switched channels then switched tuners then went back to CBS and all is fine.

Sorry I'm posting so much just trying to document my problems. Back to cleaning!


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## ftlaud_dj

Call the local support number, often, there is a major issue and they are not telling the people higher than the call center, demand they escalate to a head end engineer and that the call not stay in the call center. Demand a tracking number for your case and force them to escalate. You do not need new cards, you do not need truck rolls, these are total waste of time, the cards obviously work the rest of the time, there is a thread at the local HD site for Phoenix on this issue as well at: http://www.landlpcservices.com/phpBB2/index.php

FYI, to me this is typically only seen Tuesday and Wednesday nights after 10pm and gone by the morning as if by magic. Some or all tiers go black, rebooting the unit brings them back but at times they pick up on the error codes again in a few minutes.

Cox Phoenix has the system screwed up, if it's a ploy to get people off Tivo and back on their DVR's they are going to be in for a very rude awakening if it turns out to be the case, can we say Anti-Trust?

Miguel


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## nicemann

So I was trying to watch my recording of America's Got Talent (yeah no laughs, I know...but I like the show) and guess what Tivo only recorded 4 minutes of it. So OK, just a one time thing. Then I notice another NBC show did the same thing. So I tried to watch NBC live and it kept loosing signal and and coming up channel available. Then I notice each time that happened it made both tuners go to channel 712 (M-Card). 

So I tried my other Tivo HD.....same exact thing happened on NBC. Tried channel 12, same thing. 715 and 703 had the same issues. When I try changing channels now it takes several seconds for them to come up.

Called Cox (Phoenix) this morning and they said they don't know of any issues. Got a truck roll on the way Sunday and asked for them to bring S-Cards.

I tried rebooting, unplugging, take the cards out and putting them back in. Nothing works. I have gotten error "161-38" several times.

Anyone else have any suggestions?


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## saibari

I'm having the same problem and it's occurred on various channels -- 712, 710, 715, 19 ... The channel will gray-out for a few seconds, then come back, then gray out again a few minutes later, then come back. It's maddening when you're trying to watch something live, but it's _really_ an issue when you're recording something because when the channel grays out TiVo stops recording and it doesn't re-start when the channel comes back. That's why you end up with partial recordings. This happened three days in a row with the soaps that I tape at noon (on channels 715 & 19) every day--I got partial recordings of anywhere from 2 to 12 min. I didn't know what was going on and happened to be home yesterday during the noon hour and then I saw that the problem was the intermittent graying out.

This is a new problem. I've had the longstanding problem of droppped channels, but they would drop and stay dropped until I rebooted, had Cox send a signal, or swapped out the card. While that problem was _very_ annoying, this problem is worse since it seems to affect more channels and effectively prevents you from being able to reliably record anything. Aaargh! 

I would not recommend switching from an m-card to two s-cards. I started out with two s-cards and experienced sever audio-video synch problems that made shows virtually unwatchable. As maddening as my current problems are, that was worse! And don't even get me started on this SDV thing. The only reason I'm not freaking out about that is because I glanced at the affected channel list and didn't see any channels that I normally watch....

Cox tech is coming out tomorrow--I'll report back then. However, I am really fed up with all this and called Tivo just now, demanding compensation. I've paid for a year's service in advance and I'm a little over 8 months into it. They wouldn't give me a retroactive credit but did give me a credit that effectively gives me another year on to my pre-paid contract. Of course, this ensures that I'll stick with the service. But I did say that if my current problem couldn't be resolved I'd be calling back and demanding more--a complete refund of both my service and the cost of the TiVo box would be nice! I love TiVo, but this awful service is ridiculous!  And get this, what solution did the tech suggest? Getting service without the cable cards which means you get no channels above 100...which means no HD programming since those are channels in the 700's. Um, I bought an HD TV and HD TiVo specifically so I could get, guess what?! HD PROGRAMMING! I can't believe he even suggested that! 

I would definitely recommend that anyone considering TiVo HD _not_ purchase it if they live in an area where Cox and DigitalAtlanta cards is their only option...


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## Rolow

Does any one know if its possible to go back to the old CC software? I would much rather call once a month and not miss a single recording rather then what I'm dealing with now.

I had not problem with 714,716 and 173. I guess SDV has not been turned on in Peoria yet.


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## harma41

I am in the north phoenix area, and I am also stuck in the dreaded "firmware loop". I have been dealing with this issue for the last week, but I have not been home a lot. Sometimes if I restart the tivo, it goes away for a little while. 

I have called Cox, but they have no idea what is going on. The CSR did not know that there even was an upgrade issued for the cable cards, or that there were any issues related to that upgrade. Now I have a truck roll coming with a new cable card on tuesday, but I doubt that this will do anything. If that new card has the same firmware as the last card, it will just start to run the upgrade again.

Why don't they just flash the cards ahead of time, so that when they visit a customers site that has this specific issue, they can avoid coming back again. :-(


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## jebbbz

harma41 said:


> I am in the north phoenix area, and I am also stuck in the dreaded "firmware loop". I have been dealing with this issue for the last week, but I have not been home a lot. Sometimes if I restart the tivo, it goes away for a little while. (


After it goes away for a little while is there some event that triggers it to start again? For me and a few others there are particular channels that trigger the fw loop if we tune to them. Can you be simply watching TV when the loop begins? What are the specific symptoms of your loops?

I ask because as long as I stay away from the danger channels I have no loop problem. If I tune to one the loop starts, continues for five or ten minutes, and, if I am still "tuned" to the bad channel a new loop starts. The black and gray cable company screen appears but periodically i get a TiVo screen and my box responds, sort of, to the remote. If I am at, say, TiVo Central when the loop ends I can avoid a new loop if I switch to live TV and change the channel quickly. It seems that some people are truly stuck in a loop that never gives them a chance to exit.


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## nicemann

Great now I don't know if changing the cards out is going to help my problem of getting the 161-38 error and the graying of the 700 channels. I hate looking forward to going to watch a recording and only 3 minutes of it was recorded because the freakn channel cycled or grayed out. Only been happening since about Tuesday. It's now happening day or night, time doesn't matter. I love TiVo but I am really getting tired of Cox. Wish DirectTV had TiVo service.

COX FIX THE PROBLEM!


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## nsyncwithyou

Hello all and thanks for letting me join in this heated situation. I, like you all, have the same issues going on with my Series 3 HD THX TiVo. My CC 1 and 2 are stuck in the proverbial loop for about a week now. I have searched this subject and listened to this thread, hoping for an answer and will I guess wait patiently with you all for the "Great answer". I just wanted to get your thoughts on the following quote I found on TiVo's site when searching about CableCards.

"If the process takes more than 40 minutes, or the update stops and then restarts, the firmware update failed and the CableCARD is unusable. If the installer is not there, you will need to contact your cable provider to get a replacement CableCARD installed and activated."

I like others here am following the screen warnings that say not to unplug the TiVo or pull out the cards while the upgrade is going on, but has anyone unplugged their TiVo and rebooted or pulled out their cards? What happened when you did? When upgrades in computers "fail" you usually reboot and start over again and it usually will "take", why can't we do the same thing here.

I have been dealing with this for over a year now and if a class action suit is needed, please sign me up. Don't get me wrong, I love Tivo, but enough is enough. Before this upgrade I could at least watch regular TV, but for the last week I cannot watch any live TV

Lastly, the message says that you can watch any "Now Playing" show that you have, but when I do, after about five minutes it goes to a live channel and the "upgrading Cable card" banner shows up. If you go back and try to watch the show again you will have to do this again about five times while watching a 30 minute show. Does anybody else have this problem?


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## djwilso

saibari said:


> And get this, what solution did the tech suggest? Getting service without the cable cards which means you get no channels above 100...which means no HD programming since those are channels in the 700's. Um, I bought an HD TV and HD TiVo specifically so I could get, guess what?! HD PROGRAMMING! I can't believe he even suggested that!


Well, that is not completely accurate. You would not lose all channels above 100, instead you would lose the encrypted channels. You would still receive all of the local channels in HD, such as 703, 705, 706, 709, 710, 712, and 715.

I remember having these channels (well, at least the ones that were offered back then in Dec 2006) the first day I got my Series 3 TiVo before I ever got the CableCards. You can even receive these channels in HD just by connecting the cable directly from the wall to your TV without the TiVo.

Dennis


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## Ppod

South Mountain area here with a S3 and a TivoHD. Aside from having to call Cox once a month to hit our cards, no issues for the past year or so. 
S3 has issues now, and is currently stuck in the Firmware Loop. It appears its stuck on 199, and isn't accepting any channel changing input.
Any advice on how to move it to a less problematic channel?


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## jebbbz

Ppod said:


> South Mountain area here with a S3 and a TivoHD. Aside from having to call Cox once a month to hit our cards, no issues for the past year or so.
> S3 has issues now, and is currently stuck in the Firmware Loop. It appears its stuck on 199, and isn't accepting any channel changing input.
> Any advice on how to move it to a less problematic channel?


Well, I just posted this over in the other upgrade thread but I'll repost it here in hopes someone else might benefit:

The loop may be a series of loops, all triggered by the fact that when one ends you are still "on" channel 199 which is one of several problem channels people have identified. See if you can tune away from 199 at the end of an upgrade cycle. Yes, it is difficult but if you are having the same problem I have had it can be done. You only have a second or two so it may take more than one try. If you are having a different problem this won't work. The first poster, Lupin, mentioned tuning away between loop cycles when for a moment there was a pause but I don't know if his/her problem involved a problem channel.

It may be that there is more than one kind of upgrade loop so this may not work but what do you have to lose. To give yourself a better chance of tuning away from the problem I can describe what I do now if I get into a loop (I check channel 199 now and again to see if there has been a fix.)

When I first got my firmware upgrade it seemed to have gone smoothly. I started channel surfing. When I hit 199 a picture appeared for a second or so and then I got the upgrade loop for the first time. The symptoms were that the screen jumped back and forth every few seconds (5 or 10) between a cable company screen (the black and gray ones you get to via the TiVo cable card menus) and a TiVo screen that mentioned an update. During this TiVo screen the TiVo would respond to the remote. Try and get to TiVo Central and wait. Check the cable card menus. Where it shows the two CC slots the first selection will warn you of an update in progress. Go back and forth between that screen and the previous menu and see if eventually the CC slot screen no longer shows updating. If and when it does, head back to TiVo Central but do NOT go to live TV. Your TiVo will immediately try to tune to 199 and unless you are really fast with the Channel Up/Down key you will enter a loop again. Relax for a minute and then get ready to go to Live TV with a finger poised over the Channel Up/Down key. Select Live TV and start hitting the channel key and hope for the best. If the TiVo loops again repeat the above.

If this works you will still have a problem but it is easy to fix. After a loop and the above fix (if it works) your other tuner may be aimed at channel 199. Start recording a channel with your good tuner, then select a different channel to watch in real time. This should move the second tuner off of 199 with trying to tune 199 first. If you can get both tuners off of 199 then delete 199 (TCM), 61 (QVC), and 266 (Starz something or other) from your guide listing and wait for this mess to be cleaned up. There may be other channels that cause the loop but those are the three I know about.


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## nicemann

saibari said:


> I'm having the same problem and it's occurred on various channels -- 712, 710, 715, 19 ... The channel will gray-out for a few seconds, then come back, then gray out again a few minutes later, then come back. It's maddening when you're trying to watch something live, but it's _really_ an issue when you're recording something because when the channel grays out TiVo stops recording and it doesn't re-start when the channel comes back. That's why you end up with partial recordings. This happened three days in a row with the soaps that I tape at noon (on channels 715 & 19) every day--I got partial recordings of anywhere from 2 to 12 min. I didn't know what was going on and happened to be home yesterday during the noon hour and then I saw that the problem was the intermittent graying out.
> 
> This is a new problem. I've had the longstanding problem of droppped channels, but they would drop and stay dropped until I rebooted, had Cox send a signal, or swapped out the card. While that problem was _very_ annoying, this problem is worse since it seems to affect more channels and effectively prevents you from being able to reliably record anything. Aaargh!
> 
> I would not recommend switching from an m-card to two s-cards. I started out with two s-cards and experienced sever audio-video synch problems that made shows virtually unwatchable. As maddening as my current problems are, that was worse! And don't even get me started on this SDV thing. The only reason I'm not freaking out about that is because I glanced at the affected channel list and didn't see any channels that I normally watch....
> 
> Cox tech is coming out tomorrow--I'll report back then. However, I am really fed up with all this and called Tivo just now, demanding compensation. I've paid for a year's service in advance and I'm a little over 8 months into it. They wouldn't give me a retroactive credit but did give me a credit that effectively gives me another year on to my pre-paid contract. Of course, this ensures that I'll stick with the service. But I did say that if my current problem couldn't be resolved I'd be calling back and demanding more--a complete refund of both my service and the cost of the TiVo box would be nice! I love TiVo, but this awful service is ridiculous!  And get this, what solution did the tech suggest? Getting service without the cable cards which means you get no channels above 100...which means no HD programming since those are channels in the 700's. Um, I bought an HD TV and HD TiVo specifically so I could get, guess what?! HD PROGRAMMING! I can't believe he even suggested that!
> 
> I would definitely recommend that anyone considering TiVo HD _not_ purchase it if they live in an area where Cox and DigitalAtlanta cards is their only option...


Let me know what the tech does for you....I have a truck roll coming out tomorrow. Same issues.


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## jkovach

I'm in Gilbert, and my Tivo HD has been experiencing severe cablecard issues the past few days too. Mine is NOT in the upgrade loop. It is experiencing frequent channel loss, with symptoms and behavior exactly like Rolow described yesterday. Most programs that I try to record end up with partial recordings, and watching anything live or pre-recorded is next to impossible due to the frequent error messages.

Prior to this, I had to call Cox monthly to send a hit to my card to re-authorize it, as it would expire and not get updated automatically like it should. Other than that, I had no other cablecard or signal issues before this week.

Jeff


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## jebbbz

jkovach said:


> I'm in Gilbert, and my Tivo HD has been experiencing severe cablecard issues the past few days too. Mine is NOT in the upgrade loop. It is experiencing frequent channel loss, with symptoms and behavior exactly like Rolow described yesterday. Most programs that I try to record end up with partial recordings, and watching anything live or pre-recorded is next to impossible due to the frequent error messages.


I am not sure these are cablecard problems as I think I have seen people on other forums complain of problems with Cox STBs and DVRs. I am more inclined to think the rollout of SDV has caused system-wide problems.



> Prior to this, I had to call Cox monthly to send a hit to my card to re-authorize it, as it would expire and not get updated automatically like it should. Other than that, I had no other cablecard or signal issues before this week.
> 
> Jeff


This was one of the problems the 0301 firmware upgrade was supposed to have fixed and may have since my SubExpTime was changed to 30 July after the FW upgrade. The upgrade was also supposed to address the loss of channels problem that seemed to involve cable cards losing their authorizations or something such that encrypted channels would be blanked out but local digital rebroadcasts would still come through. Again, for me the firmware upgrade seems to have fixed that (too soon to tell for sure.) Of course, the FW upgrade has introduced the upgrade loop problem that causes a bit of grief to some (like me) and tons of grief to others.

The channel loss that seems to have started on or after 1 July is different from the cable card loss of channels. Now, the signal seems to simply go away and come back. It affects all digital channels, whether encrypted or not. A few times, when I was suffering through such a channel/signal loss I navigated to the TiVos diagnostics screen and ran a channel signal strength test. Sometimes the channel I had been trying to view would show no signal at all, sometimes a very low one but no picture on the diagnostic screen. Other times, the lost channel would pop right up and I could check other channels all showing good channel strength, but when I went back to live TV some or all of the channels I had checked would still be blank. Other times every thing was fine when I went back to live TV.

So, two problems, one related to cable cards, the other perhaps not, tightly linked in our minds because the FW upgrade happened to take place just days before SDV was turned on. Should make for some fun for the people trying to fix them, assuming there are such people.


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## hddude55

I was beginning to wonder if my TiVo was malfuctioning but it seems my Gilbert neighbors are in the same leaky boat. This is crazy!


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## jebbbz

Well, today's mail brings a missive from Cox, labeled "time sensitive." They announce that they will be replacing network equipment in my area to allow more HD channels, On DEMAND, and other stuff. It will take place on two days over the next two weeks and they will call 48 hours in advance to warn me.

There is nothing in the message to suggest this has any relation to our post 1 July problems but I thought I would pass it on so people here in Phoenix metro could watch for it.


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## saibari

djwilso said:


> Well, that is not completely accurate. You would not lose all channels above 100, instead you would lose the encrypted channels. You would still receive all of the local channels in HD, such as 703, 705, 706, 709, 710, 712, and 715.
> 
> I remember having these channels (well, at least the ones that were offered back then in Dec 2006) the first day I got my Series 3 TiVo before I ever got the CableCards. You can even receive these channels in HD just by connecting the cable directly from the wall to your TV without the TiVo.
> 
> Dennis


Ok, I'm confused. So you are saying that I don't need to use a cablecard at all with my TiVo-HD? That the cablecard is necessary only for encrypted channels? By encrypted channels, do you mean channels like HBO? That's the only premium channel I get. ... Would I still get channels like Food Network and Bravo?

ALSO, does anyone know where I might find a list of the 77 channels that TiVo users can no longer get due to SDV?


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## saibari

nicemann said:


> Let me know what the tech does for you....I have a truck roll coming out tomorrow. Same issues.


So when the tech came out today I turned on the set and it obligingly displayed a message indicating *error 161-38*. The tech scratched his head and said he'd never heard of that one before! He'd also never heard of my most recent problems--channels dropping and then spontaneously coming back, only to drop again a few minutes later (resulting in partial recordings if I'm trying to record something).

He called his sup who talked him through replacing the m-card. All seemed well and he walked out the door. Literally within a minute of his leaving, the channel (HBO) froze and the 161-38 message displayed again! I ran out and luckily the tech had not yet left. He called his sup and was told that nothing could be done today. This, apparently, is a matter for the "Addressability Dept" and they are closed until Monday.

So the tech told me to expect a call from this "Addressability Dept" some time Monday. He said they would troubleshoot from their offices and wouldn't need to send a tech out. When I asked for their number so I could call them if I don't hear from them he said, "Oh, we _never_ give out the number for the Addressability Dept!"  So he gave me his sup's number instead.

I am truly reaching the end of my patience with both Cox & TiVo!  I'll report back on what I hear from the mysterious "Addressability Dept" ...


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## saibari

jebbbz said:


> ...If this works you will still have a problem but it is easy to fix. After a loop and the above fix (if it works) your other tuner may be aimed at channel 199. Start recording a channel with your good tuner, then select a different channel to watch in real time. This should move the second tuner off of 199 with trying to tune 199 first. If you can get both tuners off of 199 then delete 199 (TCM), 61 (QVC), and 266 (Starz something or other) from your guide listing and wait for this mess to be cleaned up. There may be other channels that cause the loop but those are the three I know about.


Oh my!  You mean I might actually end up experiencing yet another problem in addition to the intermittent dropping channels problem?! I'm not at all sure what is meant by a "firmware upgrade loop," but I definitely want to avoid the problem! Will staying away from channels 199, 61 & 266 help me do that?


----------



## saibari

jebbbz said:


> I am not sure these are cablecard problems as I think I have seen people on other forums complain of problems with Cox STBs and DVRs. I am more inclined to think the rollout of SDV has caused system-wide problems. ...


According to the Cox telephone tech I spoke to yesterday, they stopped the SDV roll-out shortly after they started it because of problems that ensued. So, since we're continuing to experience difficulties, I assume this means the SDV rollout is not to blame? Or do you think it might've left residual problems?


----------



## nicemann

saibari said:


> So when the tech came out today I turned on the set and it obligingly displayed a message indicating *error 161-38*. The tech scratched his head and said he'd never heard of that one before! He'd also never heard of my most recent problems--channels dropping and then spontaneously coming back, only to drop again a few minutes later (resulting in partial recordings if I'm trying to record something).
> 
> He called his sup who talked him through replacing the m-card. All seemed well and he walked out the door. Literally within a minute of his leaving, the channel (HBO) froze and the 161-38 message displayed again! I ran out and luckily the tech had not yet left. He called his sup and was told that nothing could be done today. This, apparently, is a matter for the "Addressability Dept" and they are closed until Monday.
> 
> So the tech told me to expect a call from this "Addressability Dept" some time Monday. He said they would troubleshoot from their offices and wouldn't need to send a tech out. When I asked for their number so I could call them if I don't hear from them he said, "Oh, we _never_ give out the number for the Addressability Dept!"  So he gave me his sup's number instead.
> 
> I am truly reaching the end of my patience with both Cox & TiVo!  I'll report back on what I hear from the mysterious "Addressability Dept" ...


GREAT.....so I am sure I will have the same problem tomorrow. Having the same issues you are having right now. I am really considering switching to DirecTV because Cox is really starting to tick me off. I just wish they had Tivo. I have to Tivo HD boxes with upgrade harddrives so that is a lot of equipment to moth ball.


----------



## jebbbz

saibari said:


> Oh my!  You mean I might actually end up experiencing yet another problem in addition to the intermittent dropping channels problem?! I'm not at all sure what is meant by a "firmware upgrade loop," but I definitely want to avoid the problem! Will staying away from channels 199, 61 & 266 help me do that?


First, check your cable card firmware version. Towards the end of June, Cisco/Scientific Atlanta distributed an upgrade that was supposed to address a couple of problems. I think it succeded but the upgrade introduced a new one, the upgrade loop. If your cable card firmware version ends in "0301" and you have been watching TV since then you have probably never seen the upgrade loop problem. For now, avoid channels 61, 199, and 266 and you should be OK. Actually, some people got the upgraded firmware and can tune those channels without any problem so if you feel brave...

Your current problem does not, I believe, involve your cable cards. You are losing your digital signal all together, or the signal gets so weak you cannot tune it. This comes and goes with no intervention by you. It will result in lost or partial recordings and interrupted live viewing. The signal may not come back for several minutes or it may come back in a few seconds. Theloss of signal will affect any digital station, encrypted or not, local rebroadcast or cable-originated.

The old loss of channels problem you mention *did* involve your cable cards. They would get messed up and refuse to let you watch channels but the signal was still coming in to your house. A reboot of the TiVo would reboot the cable cards and they would function OK for days or longer if you were lucky. Cable cards do two things. When you tune a station the cable card checks to see if you subscribe to that channel and if you do it decrypts the scrambled signal so you can watch it. The signal to your house and TiVo had to be good, of course for the cable cards to have anything to work with and before July 1 the signal was OK. Now it is the digital signal itself that seems to be messed up and to come and go. Thus, assuming the firmware upgrade took you may have fixed the loss of channels problem (caused by cable cards not letting you watch) only to suffer the loss of good signal caused by some screw-up by Cox.

I got my firmware upgrade on the 26th of June and I think it fixed my flaky cable card problem but caused the upgrade loop problem. I avoided the latter by staying away from problem channels but after July 1 I began suffering the loss of signal problems. Between June 26th and July 1 I had it petty good.


----------



## Rolow

saibari said:


> ALSO, does anyone know where I might find a list of the 77 channels that TiVo users can no longer get due to SDV?





> For Cox subscribers in the Phoenix market, here's a list of the channels that are being moved to SDV on 7/1/08, per the letter I received in the mail yesterday:
> 
> 109 Cox Real Estate 2
> 110 Daystar
> 112 INSP
> 113 EWTN
> 114 BYU-TV
> 125 C-SPAN 2
> 126 C-SPAN 3
> 133 DIY
> 144 Fox Reality Channel
> 155 BET Jazz
> 156 Great American Country
> 157 Fuse
> 158 G4
> 159 Logo
> 163 Fit TV
> 170 Fox College Sports Atlantic
> 172 Fox College Sports Pacific
> 173 Fuel
> 405 TV Chile
> 410 De Pelicula
> 411 De Pelicula Clasico
> 412 CineLatino
> 413 VeneMovies
> 417 History en Espanol
> 418 Discovery en Espanol
> 422 Discovery Familia
> 423 TOON Disney en Espanol
> 424 Boomerang en Espanol
> 425 Sorpresa
> 430 MTV Tres
> 432 Bandamax
> 433 VideoRola
> 434 mun2
> 438 ESPN Deportes
> 439 Fox Sports en Espanol
> 440 GoITV
> 444 CNN en Espanol
> 445 Canal Sur
> 449 EWTN Espanol
> 500 iNDEMAND Previews
> 601-606 ESPN Game Plan / ESPN Full Court
> 650 NBA League Pass Preview
> 651-659 NBA League Pass / MLS Direct Kick
> 671-684 MLB Extra Innings / NHL Center Ice
> 840 Public Safety
> 850 Public Safety
> 851 Public Safety
> 853 Public Safety
> 854 Public Safety
> 856 Public Safety
> 857 Public Safety
> 
> So far, I have to applaud Cox for selecting channels with limited appeal, and none that are HD. Of course, I know that's the whole idea behind SDV (moving limited appeal channels to it, and leaving the rest alone), but there were rumours that in the Phoenix market the plan was to put everything digital on SDV.
> 
> In my case so far, I see no need to get a tuning adapter, even if it is free. I either don't subscribe to most of these channels, or in the exceptionally rare case I need to record something from one I can use my S2 that is still hooked up to a cable box.
> 
> Jeff


So is SDV On in any neighborhoods? I'm In Peoria and still get all the SDV channels.


----------



## BrianAZ

For those of you who are experiencing the lost channels more frequently in Az since the firmware update, you're not going crazy. The firmware that fixed Vegas' issue has had mixed results for us here in Az. Where previously you'd lose channels once a week or so (and then have to call for a pair/unpair/refresh hit once a month when your subexpire time past), now you're losing channels multiple times a day which is far less easy to live with. The SubExpireTime issue seems to be resovled though.

I've been in touch with some of the Tivo folks on another board and they indicate that they've captured significant log files and have gone back to Cox to get it resolved.


----------



## hddude55

There are similar reports on the AZ HD Forum from guys with Cox HD DVRs. Therefore these latest problems may be unrelated to our 8 month lost channels issue.


BrianAZ said:


> For those of you who are experiencing the lost channels more frequently in Az since the firmware update, you're not going crazy. The firmware that fixed Vegas' issue has had mixed results for us here in Az. Where previously you'd lose channels once a week or so (and then have to call for a pair/unpair/refresh hit once a month when your subexpire time past), now you're losing channels multiple times a day which is far less easy to live with. The SubExpireTime issue seems to be resovled though.
> 
> I've been in touch with some of the Tivo folks on another board and they indicate that they've captured significant log files and have gone back to Cox to get it resolved.


----------



## hddude55

I'm on the "residual" problems bandwagon. This latest problem started on July 1, four days after the 0301 card upgrade - and I know that upgrade caused big problems for some users but seemed to go OK on my Tivo. As hard as it to stomach, I believe we have a new mess.


saibari said:


> According to the Cox telephone tech I spoke to yesterday, they stopped the SDV roll-out shortly after they started it because of problems that ensued. So, since we're continuing to experience difficulties, I assume this means the SDV rollout is not to blame? Or do you think it might've left residual problems?


----------



## eochs

upgrade loop happens in NE phoenix as well. I can confirm it on 199, as well as starz channels (261-266) ugh


----------



## Rolow

So last nights NASCAR race on 726 stopped mid recording twice. The second time the tivo rebooted on its own and has been fine since. I'm setting my second tivo hd that's OTA to record the F1 and Indy Car race as a back up.


----------



## ksalwitz

hi. glad to see i'm not the only one trying to get this resolved in the phoenix area. i'm in gilbert too. I've been having the dropped channel issue. slowly but surely random groups of channels seem to disappear. some of the hd channels come in and some don't. some of the 100+ channels come in and some don't. below 100 i don't get some channels as well. This started as soon as i got my hd tivo & had the cable card installed in March of this year. i would get the error code that everyone else seems to get, then i would get some hd channel issues. when i rebooted it seemed to self-correct. about 6 weeks ago i started losing channels. i had them come out and replace the card (MS) and the tech said something to the effect that the technology wasn't there yet for the cable cards and that this would most likely happen again. well it's has happened again and they're coming out to replace the card again monday 7/7. i checked the firmware version on the diagnostics screen on my tivo and it just has a 1. when i try to run any of the card based diagnostics they all fail as the programs don't seem to be loaded on the card. i'll post tomorrow to give an update.

cheers, Ken


Humax Series 2 Tivo - T800 - Linksys Wireless
Series 2 Tivo TCD54080 - Tivo Wireless
Series 3 HD TCD652160-cable card (MS)-Tivo Wireless
Wireless networked - Linksys WRT54G


----------



## nicemann

Have to say good bye to my TiVo family. 

Cox tech came out and replaced the M-Cards and same exact thing is happening again. He had no idea why. Between this, the firmware upgrades that always mess up, and now the SDV...I am giving up on Cox. Going to sign up for DirecTV. Been eleven years with TiVo. Hate to see it go, but I can't deal with the idiots at Cox anymore.


----------



## nightdesigns

nicemann said:


> So I was trying to watch my recording of America's Got Talent (yeah no laughs, I know...but I like the show) and guess what Tivo only recorded 4 minutes of it. So OK, just a one time thing. Then I notice another NBC show did the same thing. So I tried to watch NBC live and it kept loosing signal and and coming up channel available. Then I notice each time that happened it made both tuners go to channel 712 (M-Card).
> 
> Anyone else have any suggestions?


Mine did the exact same thing. Now I'm stuck in the firmware loop. Tech is scheduled for tomorrow. My wife will be here when the guy does the swap, I told her to visit channel 199 for giggles. That should keep the tech busy.


----------



## Shawn95GT

nicemann said:


> Have to say good bye to my TiVo family.
> 
> Cox tech came out and replaced the M-Cards and same exact thing is happening again. He had no idea why. Between this, the firmware upgrades that always mess up, and now the SDV...I am giving up on Cox. Going to sign up for DirecTV. Been eleven years with TiVo. Hate to see it go, but I can't deal with the idiots at Cox anymore.


Good luck with that (for real!).

From what I've seen with my in-law's DirecTV DVR I know I'd hate it. It misses recordings constantly. Their flavor of season pass still requires to to go through and manually set up recordings on many programs.

The in-laws call me when their DVR misses show, and frankly... they call a lot.

If I was going to try out another DVR, the Dish DVR looks slick and seems WAY faster (in the menus etc) than my Tivos ever were.

My S-cards are still going strong so I'll probably stick with 'em as long as I'm with Cox. I sure wish we had FIOS here...


----------



## nicemann

Shawn95GT said:


> Good luck with that (for real!).
> 
> From what I've seen with my in-law's DirecTV DVR I know I'd hate it. It misses recordings constantly. Their flavor of season pass still requires to to go through and manually set up recordings on many programs.
> 
> The in-laws call me when their DVR misses show, and frankly... they call a lot.
> 
> If I was going to try out another DVR, the Dish DVR looks slick and seems WAY faster (in the menus etc) than my Tivos ever were.
> 
> My S-cards are still going strong so I'll probably stick with 'em as long as I'm with Cox. I sure wish we had FIOS here...


Hopefully I will not have the same issues. Not sure what model they have. Dish network does not list a HD DVR on their website and when you goto order, the only HD receiver they have to pick from is a non-HD. The whole reason going satellite is to get more HD channels.

Really wish Cox would stop having these problems.

Here's hopping for the best....


----------



## qunewsguy

Taking a quick detour from the Phoenix-area issues, anybody in New England notice any problems with the latest HD additions/digital channel swaps? I was pleasantly surprised to see my TivoHD work fine after they did their major switcharoo.


----------



## AZrob

I have followed all of the recent post-FW upgrade and post-SDV posts and just have a couple of questions:

1. Is the "new" dropped channels issue due to the FW upgrade or the July 1 COX network switch to SDV, or both? 

2. Is it true that COX DVR's are also having this loss of channels problem? If so, it would seem to me that the answer to #1 would be that it's caused by COX, not the FW upgrade. But maybe it's an unholy combination of the two.

You know, with the old problem, you knew that at least your non-encrypted channels were safe. Now it appears anything can go out...wonderful...

AZrob


----------



## jebbbz

AZrob said:


> ...
> 
> 1. Is the "new" dropped channels issue due to the FW upgrade or the July 1 COX network switch to SDV, or both?
> 
> 2. Is it true that COX DVR's are also having this loss of channels problem? If so, it would seem to me that the answer to #1 would be that it's caused by COX, not the FW upgrade. But maybe it's an unholy combination of the two.
> 
> You know, with the old problem, you knew that at least your non-encrypted channels were safe. Now it appears anything can go out...wonderful...


Hard to say. SDV has, apparently, been rolled back (channels I lost on July 1 due to SDV have reappeared on the linear channels and I can tune them again) but the problems with lost channels persists. The coincidence in time of the new problems and the roll out of SDV is suspicious but a fairly well informed fellow on another site says he doesn't think SDV was the basic cause. He wrote:

"The engineers are looking a low QAM signal level issues and we hope to know something next week. Even people like me with Cox tuners are losing some HD channels and have to turn the tuner off/on to get them back or wait until they come back themselves."​
Cox is also doing some upgrading according to a warning letter I received that said they would call in advance of when my area was to be upgraded and I should count on losing a couple of hours of service.

Some Cox equipment is experiencing the problem but their newest equipment now requires cable cards to operate, just like TiVos so perhaps those with Cox hardware experiencing the channel problems got bad firmware, too.


----------



## Rolow

What site are you referring to?


----------



## jebbbz

Rolow said:


> What site are you referring to?


http://www.avsforum.com/

The Phoenix local thread.


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## BrianAZ

jebbbz said:


> http://www.avsforum.com/
> 
> The Phoenix local thread.


Can you post a direct url to the thread? There are a ton of forums on that site and I haven't been able to locate the one you're speaking of.

thx


----------



## jebbbz

BrianAZ said:


> Can you post a direct url to the thread? There are a ton of forums on that site and I haven't been able to locate the one you're speaking of.
> 
> thx


Try this:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=451563&pp=30&highlight=Phoenix


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## nightdesigns

So after the tech came out today and replaced my M-Card with a new M-card that did the same thing (161-38 Error, partial recordings, firmware loop, long tuning times), he called in to cox HQ and got this piece of news..

"Cox is aware of the problem with Cable Cards and Tivos, however they do not have a time of when this will be repaired."

Bad news is that there's no repair time, however, at least they're acknowledging the issue in the Phoenix Area. Hope...maybe


----------



## Pafrican

I went a few months with no issues with my two S-Cards in my TivoHD (after having moved away from an M-Card)

Now I'm having problems again. Channels dropping out and then coming back shortly thereafter.

Ugh.


----------



## BrianAZ

Since they just finished working together on the firmware that ended up braking things for us in Phoenix, hopefully Cox/SA/Cisco/Tivo will be able to jump right back into investigations.

The monthly "SubExpireTime not updating" bug seems to be resolved. So at least we won't have to call Cox each month.:up:

The two remaining issues are: 

Lost channels (used to happen maybe once a week, now is happening several times a day). This makes it almost not worth watching the Tivo.:down:
Firmware update bug (my upgrade went through w/o error... but appearantly others are stuck):down:


----------



## JayBird

I have a TiVo HD with an M card, and I'm also seeing the 161-38 error several times per day since the update (anybody know what this error is?), as well as getting a lot of partial recordings. The firmware update happenned when we were out of town on vacation the last week of June. I haven't seen any firmware upgrade loops, although to be safe, I removed channel 199 from the list of channels I receive (assuming it stays removed, as certain channels that I remove keep coming back).

As for tuning times, some channels are just fine, while others seem to take a second or two longer than I remember from before the firmware upgrade, but nothing as bad as others have reported. I have the TiVo set to output Native format, so if a channel change results in a switching of formats (e.g. 1080i to 720p), it has always taken a few seconds for the TiVo, my receiver, and TV to sync up to the new format (I use HDMI all the way through).

Obviously the biggest issue right now is the partial recordings, as my wife's tolerance for missing a portion of her shows has reached the limit. If it wasn't for the fact I still have my old S1 hooked up recording the same season passes (albeit not in HD) as a backup, I'd be in the dog house for introducing such unreliable technology into the house.

I'm tired of hearing TiVo blame Cox and SA, Cox blame SA and TiVo, and SA blame TiVo and Cox. It's time for these three entities to take some responsibility for solving these problems and work together to come up with solutions, and to fix it right without introducing yet more problems with their updates. Is it really that hard to get it right??? Have they never heard of regression testing?

Note that the S card in my TV (Pioneer PDP-6010HD) has worked flawlessly since it was installed, although I watch live TV directly on the TV so rarely that it could have had issues that I never noticed.


----------



## Rolow

I'm at the point I'm getting more partial recordings then complete ones. Today I set my tivo to record the Tour DE France at 3 different times on 2 different channels and my tivo did not get a single complete recording. I also got 3 partial recordings yesterday.


----------



## jeffinaz

I get the 161-38 error, partial recording, etc. This is getting to be ridiculous. 

Has anyone spoken with Cox and had them give you any info other than a truck roll?

Thanks


----------



## nightdesigns

jeffinaz said:


> I get the 161-38 error, partial recording, etc. This is getting to be ridiculous.
> 
> Has anyone spoken with Cox and had them give you any info other than a truck roll?
> 
> Thanks


Yes, read my post here: http://tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=6454148#post6454148


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## nemein

For now my problem is _mostly_ resolved. The 2 Scards, as opposed to the Mcard, seems to have done the trick. I now have all the SD channel in the digital tier, however I'm still missing several HD channels. I was told this is to be expected (not sure if it's related to the SDV thing or not). I'll probably stick w/ this for a little while, but I still may check in on FIOS and see if they can get all the channels on their cards.

Thanks for the help...


----------



## nightdesigns

I was able to obtain this piece of info from a Cox tech



> The issue as far as I understand it has something to do with the way cable cards work in a TiVo on switched digital video systems. Unfortunately, cable card maker's support stops at the card and TiVo's support stops at the slot and each side likes to blame the other. At this point, we're not pointing fingers but continue to research the issue.


----------



## ndfox1

FWIW, I have been having the same problems as everyone else - channel drops, some channels working while others don't, etc. 

I had a Cox tech come out and he changed out one of my M-Cards for another slightly more recent one. It seems to help, but not fix the problem. The Cox tech said it was a TiVo/CableCard problem.

Immediately after he left, I called TiVo. After describing all of the problems to support, the TiVo rep said that TiVo is aware of the problem and has a beta already being tested. He said it was expected to be rolled out in a week or two. 

I'm not sure if this helps or not. I mean - is it actually a TiVo problem that they are fixing, are they actually close to rolling it out, etc. But hopefully the Tech was honest and they are working the issue.


----------



## Joel47

That's good to hear. A tech just left my house without doing anything to the cablecard -- I told him I knew it was valley-wide, so unless he thought it would help, he should just check and make sure I was getting a good signal. (He was very useful in tracking down a ground loop caused by the cable, though.) My signal is now fine, and he and I spent a few minutes complaining about the three-way blame-fest that is Cox/SA/Tivo. He apologized profusely for the goings-on, and requested patience.


----------



## ksalwitz

cox tech showed up yesterday (on time!) and swapped out the mcard on my Tivo. during the course of the conversation he repeated what has been posted oftern is that it's a Scientific Atlanta card and it's a compatability problem with the Tivo. Makes sense then that the Cox dvr that he has (Scientific atlanta make) works fine with the card. all of the channels were working fine when the tech left. later in the evening some of the channels started to flake out again. this morning i had dropped channels and the diagnostic programs on the card are all wiped. none of the card based diagnostics will run. it just displays file not found messages on each screen. i did check these yesterday and they were working fine. i'm ready to throw in the towel and just cough up the extra bucks for the cable box and hook that to the Tivo. i've done that in the past and the Tivo in my master br is hooked up that way.

:down:

Ken


----------



## ajwees41

ksalwitz said:


> cox tech showed up yesterday (on time!) and swapped out the mcard on my Tivo. during the course of the conversation he repeated what has been posted oftern is that it's a Scientific Atlanta card and it's a compatability problem with the Tivo. Makes sense then that the Cox dvr that he has (Scientific atlanta make) works fine with the card. all of the channels were working fine when the tech left. later in the evening some of the channels started to flake out again. this morning i had dropped channels and the diagnostic programs on the card are all wiped. none of the card based diagnostics will run. it just displays file not found messages on each screen. i did check these yesterday and they were working fine. i'm ready to throw in the towel and just cough up the extra bucks for the cable box and hook that to the Tivo. i've done that in the past and the Tivo in my master br is hooked up that way.
> 
> :down:
> 
> Ken


what kind tivo whould you hook the cox box to? The S3 and TivoHD are not made to take an external source.


----------



## saibari

jebbbz said:


> First, check your cable card firmware version. Towards the end of June, Cisco/Scientific Atlanta distributed an upgrade that was supposed to address a couple of problems. I think it succeded but the upgrade introduced a new one, the upgrade loop. If your cable card firmware version ends in "0301" and you have been watching TV since then you have probably never seen the upgrade loop problem. For now, avoid channels 61, 199, and 266 and you should be OK. Actually, some people got the upgraded firmware and can tune those channels without any problem so if you feel brave...
> 
> Your current problem does not, I believe, involve your cable cards. You are losing your digital signal all together, or the signal gets so weak you cannot tune it. This comes and goes with no intervention by you. It will result in lost or partial recordings and interrupted live viewing. The signal may not come back for several minutes or it may come back in a few seconds. Theloss of signal will affect any digital station, encrypted or not, local rebroadcast or cable-originated.
> 
> The old loss of channels problem you mention *did* involve your cable cards. They would get messed up and refuse to let you watch channels but the signal was still coming in to your house. A reboot of the TiVo would reboot the cable cards and they would function OK for days or longer if you were lucky. Cable cards do two things. When you tune a station the cable card checks to see if you subscribe to that channel and if you do it decrypts the scrambled signal so you can watch it. The signal to your house and TiVo had to be good, of course for the cable cards to have anything to work with and before July 1 the signal was OK. Now it is the digital signal itself that seems to be messed up and to come and go. Thus, assuming the firmware upgrade took you may have fixed the loss of channels problem (caused by cable cards not letting you watch) only to suffer the loss of good signal caused by some screw-up by Cox.
> 
> I got my firmware upgrade on the 26th of June and I think it fixed my flaky cable card problem but caused the upgrade loop problem. I avoided the latter by staying away from problem channels but after July 1 I began suffering the loss of signal problems. Between June 26th and July 1 I had it petty good.


Yes, my firmware version does end in 0301. I'll keep my fingers crossed! Thanks for the explanation. Frankly, I get very confused by the technical aspects of all this. But this leaves me wondering why Cox told me that this _is_ a cablecard problem.


----------



## saibari

Rolow said:


> So last nights NASCAR race on 726 stopped mid recording twice. The second time the tivo rebooted on its own and has been fine since. I'm setting my second tivo hd that's OTA to record the F1 and Indy Car race as a back up.


So have you had any problems with your OTA TiVo? If not, then that means there's not an issue with the TiVo itself if it gets a reliable signal and doesn't have to deal with cablecards. However, someone on another thread reported that they _do_ have problems with their OTA-connected TiVo...


----------



## saibari

nightdesigns said:


> So after the tech came out today and replaced my M-Card with a new M-card that did the same thing (161-38 Error, partial recordings, firmware loop, long tuning times), he called in to cox HQ and got this piece of news..
> 
> "Cox is aware of the problem with Cable Cards and Tivos, however they do not have a time of when this will be repaired."
> 
> Bad news is that there's no repair time, however, at least they're acknowledging the issue in the Phoenix Area. Hope...maybe


Wish I could be so positive about this. However, given there's no estimated time of reaching a solution and given that this may not be a cablecard problem after all, I'm just madder than ever!


----------



## Rolow

saibari said:


> So have you had any problems with your OTA TiVo? If not, then that means there's not an issue with the TiVo itself if it gets a reliable signal and doesn't have to deal with cablecards. However, someone on another thread reported that they _do_ have problems with their OTA-connected TiVo...


My OTA/ basic cable tivo HD is fine. I'm moving every recording I can over to it until my CC tivo HD gets some sort of fix. So now my season pass's will be split between to tivo's. I'll never be able to find anything.


----------



## ksalwitz

ajwees41 said:


> what kind tivo whould you hook the cox box to? The S3 and TivoHD are not made to take an external source.


yeah. i'm on the phone with tivo right now. the tech support guy tried to tell me it would work. i'm screwed now. i turned in the cable card and got the digital box before i looked at the rear panel and realized there was no ir port!!! i have my series 2 hooked up to the digital box i have in the mbr. shoulda checked this post before i ran out to the cox store.

ken


----------



## saibari

I've been trying to reach Cox for 30 minutes now and keep getting the message that "all circuits are busy." Hmmmm, I wonder why...could it be that they have a ton of dissatisfied customers calling them?! I am completely fed up with this situation! I just filed a complaint with the FCC. I don't know if it will do any good, but we'll see.

*PLEA TO EVERYONE: Please file your own complaint with the FCC!* In it, please reference my complaint number so they'll know it's a related complaint. The number is: *08-C00034081 *and, be sure to mention that this *complaint was filed over the internet*.

Here's the link:* http://esupport.fcc.gov/complaints.htm?sid=d1e640&id=d1e735*
In the complaint I noted that we are receiving completely unreliable service; that no sooner is one problem solved, another arises; and that Cox, TiVo, and Scientific Atlanta point fingers at each other leaving the consumer out in the cold and paying for unacceptably bad service! I did not give details of the problems experienced since you're limited in how much info you can include. I just noted that currently, due to intermittent and repeated dropped signals I am unable to enjoy live TV and cannot reliably record anything due to partial recordings resulting from the dropped signals. I also noted that this is a widespread problem that is occurring all over the USA.

As soon as I manage to get through to Cox they are going to get an earful!


----------



## ksalwitz

ksalwitz said:


> yeah. i'm on the phone with tivo right now. the tech support guy tried to tell me it would work. i'm screwed now. i turned in the cable card and got the digital box before i looked at the rear panel and realized there was no ir port!!! i have my series 2 hooked up to the digital box i have in the mbr. shoulda checked this post before i ran out to the cox store.
> 
> ken


well i just got off the phone with tivo. it seems if you push hard enough and get a supervisor on the phone they will submit your case for "review" i'm supposed to hear back by Friday. I told them i wanted to return in and i wanted my money back. they sold me a piece of equipment that is incompatible with the technology required to use it! when i told the guy that it was not compatible with the SA card, he asked me if i tried a Motorola card! like it's a menu item and you can get whatever brand you want from the cable company. heh...wouldn't that be nice?!?!?

ken


----------



## Rolow

ksalwitz said:


> well i just got off the phone with tivo. it seems if you push hard enough and get a supervisor on the phone they will submit your case for "review" i'm supposed to hear back by Friday. I told them i wanted to return in and i wanted my money back. they sold me a piece of equipment that is incompatible with the technology required to use it! when i told the guy that it was not compatible with the SA card, *he asked me if i tried a Motorola card!* like it's a menu item and you can get whatever brand you want from the cable company. heh...wouldn't that be nice?!?!?
> 
> ken


Up until now I had all the faith in the world in Tivo. Now I'm not so sure. Thank you I needed a laugh.


----------



## colflagg

Looks like SDV and cablecard issues are causing some delays in rolling out new HD channels....I just got this e-mail from Cox.


Dear Valued Cox Customer,

While Cox Communications Arizona strives to bring you the best in high-definition programming, we have postponed the launches of USA HD, CNBC HD+ and Lifetime HD until July 21.

USA HD and CNBC HD+ will join the Cox HD line-up in time to provide more than 275 hours of combined coverage during the 2008 Summer Games in Beijing, which begin Aug. 8.

High-definition Olympics coverage will also be found on KPNX -HD channel 712 in Phoenix and KOVA-HD channel 704 in Tucson, and Universal HD (channel 725 in Phoenix and channel 724 in Tucson).

Overall, there will be more than 750 hours of Olympics coverage in HD available on Cox Digital Cable. More than 725 hours of standard definition coverage will be provided on NBC, MSNBC, CNBC, USA, Telemundo and Oxygen. 

We appreciate your business and hope you enjoy the Summer Games on Cox Digital Cable!

Sincerely,
Cox Communications


----------



## hddude55

jebbbz said:


> I am not sure these are cablecard problems as I think I have seen people on other forums complain of problems with Cox STBs and DVRs. I am more inclined to think the rollout of SDV has caused system-wide problems.
> 
> This was one of the problems the 0301 firmware upgrade was supposed to have fixed and may have since my SubExpTime was changed to 30 July after the FW upgrade. The upgrade was also supposed to address the loss of channels problem that seemed to involve cable cards losing their authorizations or something such that encrypted channels would be blanked out but local digital rebroadcasts would still come through. Again, for me the firmware upgrade seems to have fixed that (too soon to tell for sure.) Of course, the FW upgrade has introduced the upgrade loop problem that causes a bit of grief to some (like me) and tons of grief to others.
> 
> The channel loss that seems to have started on or after 1 July is different from the cable card loss of channels. Now, the signal seems to simply go away and come back. It affects all digital channels, whether encrypted or not. A few times, when I was suffering through such a channel/signal loss I navigated to the TiVos diagnostics screen and ran a channel signal strength test. Sometimes the channel I had been trying to view would show no signal at all, sometimes a very low one but no picture on the diagnostic screen. Other times, the lost channel would pop right up and I could check other channels all showing good channel strength, but when I went back to live TV some or all of the channels I had checked would still be blank. Other times every thing was fine when I went back to live TV.
> 
> So, two problems, one related to cable cards, the other perhaps not, tightly linked in our minds because the FW upgrade happened to take place just days before SDV was turned on. Should make for some fun for the people trying to fix them, assuming there are such people.


I tend to agree with almost everything you have written as it correlates to my series3's experience over the past two weeks. What remains a mystery is what actually caused this "new" fading out/reappearing channels problem on July 1 since sdv wasn't rolled out -- and why the heck whatever was done on that day hasn't been reversed in the past week! I have a hunch there is a lot more to the story than we've been told. Complicating the picture is the fact lots of people didn't have the positive experience you and I seemingly did with the 0301 "fix."


----------



## hddude55

colflagg said:


> Looks like SDV and cablecard issues are causing some delays in rolling out new HD channels....I just got this e-mail from Cox.
> 
> ...


 Well, I believe we were told new HD channels would be sdv and sdv was supposed to be rolled out a week ago. I believe something associated with that aborted roll-out has caused the latest fading in/out channels issue. Hopefully the turkeys at Cox are spending most of their time fixing what they broke on July 1. New channels can wait.


----------



## hddude55

I hate Cox. I hate Tivo. I hate Scientific Atlanta. Did I miss anyone?

Does anyone here know what that means? I don't want to waste any time calling the buffoons at Cox or TiVo.


----------



## nightdesigns

6 out of 7 recordings were successful today! I don't know if they fixed the issue, or rolled back SDV, but either way, I have TV to watch. Can anyone else confirm? Previous to today, i had about a 95% fail rate!


----------



## jeffinaz

Nothing fixed on my end. 5 restarts today. 4 of 5 screwed recordings. Ongoing channel loss and freezes. Everyday gets worse.


----------



## Rolow

I had 2 recording of the tour de france fail again this morning but tonight every thing recorded fine. 
I did have more trouble tonight watching recoded shows. It seams strange I don't know how the two problems could be related. When I FF or use the 8second skip the recording will freeze up like it used to right before I would loose channels. A combination FF pause or 8sec. skip would fix the problem.


----------



## jebbbz

hddude55 said:


> Well, I believe we were told new HD channels would be sdv and sdv was supposed to be rolled out a week ago. I believe something associated with that aborted roll-out has caused the latest fading in/out channels issue. Hopefully the turkeys at Cox are spending most of their time fixing what they broke on July 1. New channels can wait.


The three new HD channels, USA-HD, Lifetime HD, and CNBC-HD, were not on the list of SDV channels Cox mailed out. They were originally scheduled to start up on July 9 and the SDV channels were all standard definition, as I recall. My guess is they don't want any more problems than they have now. The Olympics start in a month and I would guess they don't want things screwed up when the games begin.


----------



## aztivo

my story (update)
Yesterday 7/8/08 I had 3 cox techs. 2 being supervisors at my house for nearly 4 hours. They replaced all the lines. all the cable cards (some were replaced 3 times) I have a S3 and an HD the S3 has had stuttering problems since Jan. they changed the single streem cards to multi streem. The HD has had multistreem cards swapped out about every month and three yesterday. The first thing they did is take a reading of signal strength at all tv and cable points of entry into the house. Then the cable and internet was spit to two different lines. the readings for the cable were -8 and this is within tollarance. one of the sups. decided to put a amplifier on the cable line, this gave it a positive reading I dont know what the number is. the S3 is working like a champ again. The HD after 3 cards keept getting the 161-38 error. after they left they told me to give it a few hours and by last night no problems, no errors. I dont know how long this will last but this is the first time in two weeks and months that both tivos are working like they should.


----------



## Shawn95GT

FWIW mine is amped too.

I got notification of some new HD channels in the Tivo lineup this morning. Lifetime HD on 724 (lol), USA HD on 728, and I think it was CNBCHD on 762.

Of course none of these are working at the moment. Hopefully it's just a case of the guide updating before the channels went live, again.

724 (LIFEHD) is showing Universal HD (UHD was on 724 before)
725 (UHD) says I may need cablecards to view this channel - lol
728 (USAHD) says I may need cablecards to view this channel
761 (HSTRYHD) says I may need cablecards to view this channel
762 (CNBCHD) is showing HistoryHD (HSTRYHD was on 762 before)

I can't find any info on the Cox Phoenix site about when these channels are supposed to go live. Anyone know?


----------



## craigo

Shawn95GT said:


> I can't find any info on the Cox Phoenix site about when these channels are supposed to go live. Anyone know?


A few posts up, somebody stated these new channels won't go live until July 21st.


----------



## scrappler

Unfortunately I just moved and switched to Cox (Phoenix) from Mediacom (uses Motorola cards). While Mediacom didn't have much of an HD lineup the service was rock solid using the moto cards.
I've called Cox about 5 times in the first two days of having the cards just so i could watch tv. I now am getting partial recordings on half of my scheduled content, and copyright flags on things that were never flagged a month ago with Mediacom. I need to go back and read this thread since it sounds like there are many others out there.
This sucks!


----------



## AZrob

aztivo said:


> my story (update)
> Yesterday 7/8/08 I had 3 cox techs. 2 being supervisors at my house for nearly 4 hours. They replaced all the lines. all the cable cards (some were replaced 3 times) I have a S3 and an HD the S3 has had stuttering problems since Jan. they changed the single streem cards to multi streem. The HD has had multistreem cards swapped out about every month and three yesterday. The first thing they did is take a reading of signal strength at all tv and cable points of entry into the house. Then the cable and internet was spit to two different lines. the readings for the cable were -8 and this is within tollarance. one of the sups. decided to put a amplifier on the cable line, this gave it a positive reading I dont know what the number is. the S3 is working like a champ again. The HD after 3 cards keept getting the 161-38 error. after they left they told me to give it a few hours and by last night no problems, no errors. I dont know how long this will last but this is the first time in two weeks and months that both tivos are working like they should.


Sounds like you had multiple issues, AZtivo that got resolved. Now you are back to "normal", which means you will be getting the "partial recording" problem on your HD until Tivo fixes the bug that got downloaded with the so-called firmware upgrade recently. Ain't progress grand?

BTW, can anyone say whether this bug is hitting S3's as well as HD's? More specifically, is it hitting only those Tivo's that are using M-cards, which would limit it to HD's only? It's not clear to me if it's only HD's with M-cards (the original problem combination that the firmware upgrade was supposed to fix) or if now a larger group is being affected.

Thanks,

Rob


----------



## BrianAZ

scrappler said:


> Unfortunately I just moved and switched to Cox (Phoenix) from Mediacom (uses Motorola cards). While Mediacom didn't have much of an HD lineup the service was rock solid using the moto cards.
> I've called Cox about 5 times in the first two days of having the cards just so i could watch tv. I now am getting partial recordings on half of my scheduled content, and copyright flags on things that were never flagged a month ago with Mediacom. I need to go back and read this thread since it sounds like there are many others out there.
> This sucks!


The partial recordings are a problem here in Phoenix because your cards keep needing to be reset by the Tivo to receive channels due to some issue between SA/Cisco, Cox & Tivo. When this happens, your recordings stop until the next time period change. This has been going on in Phoenix for many months and was due to be fixed along with another similar issue with a recent firmware update (aka "301") but the update only fixed the other issue and made the channel loss issue worse (used to happen once a week and now is 4-7 times a day). Tivo has advised Cox and Cisco that they have a major issue in Phoenix and I've been told that it's being worked on.

You can't do much about the copyright flags unless they're restricting your locals. The cable co has the right to restrict the others as they see fit. You might have some luck if you contact the particular channel itself and see if they'll convince Cox to remove the copyright flag.


----------



## Roderigo

AZrob said:


> which means you will be getting the "partial recording" problem on your HD until Tivo fixes the bug that got downloaded with the so-called firmware upgrade recently.


A bit of a mis-statement here. Tivo didn't download anything recently. Cox sent out an SA cablecard firmware upgrade. The updated code is coming from the cable company (who got it from SA - their cablecard vendor). I don't think tivo's been much involved in any code changes here.


----------



## craigo

AZrob said:


> BTW, can anyone say whether this bug is hitting S3's as well as HD's? More specifically, is it hitting only those Tivo's that are using M-cards, which would limit it to HD's only? It's not clear to me if it's only HD's with M-cards (the original problem combination that the firmware upgrade was supposed to fix) or if now a larger group is being affected.


I have an S3 with S-cards and I'm *not *having any issues, here in Phoenix. I used to have M-cards, but switched back after losing channels every week. My father has a TivoHD with S-cards and he's not losing any channels, but certain channels will freeze. Cox came out to his house on Monday and the installer didn't have any S-cards. He also said he didn't want to put the M-cards in my father's TivoHD because of all the issues. He did say S-cards should be available in the next week or so.

Reading all the other posts, it sounds like an M-card issue.


----------



## scrappler

Thanks BrianAZ! I am actually in Chandler, but I'm assumming this problem covers Phoenix and the surrounding area?



BrianAZ said:


> The partial recordings are a problem here in Phoenix because your cards keep needing to be reset by the Tivo to receive channels due to some issue between SA/Cisco, Cox & Tivo. When this happens, your recordings stop until the next time period change. This has been going on in Phoenix for many months and was due to be fixed along with another similar issue with a recent firmware update (aka "301") but the update only fixed the other issue and made the channel loss issue worse (used to happen once a week and now is 4-7 times a day). Tivo has advised Cox and Cisco that they have a major issue in Phoenix and I've been told that it's being worked on.
> 
> You can't do much about the copyright flags unless they're restricting your locals. The cable co has the right to restrict the others as they see fit. You might have some luck if you contact the particular channel itself and see if they'll convince Cox to remove the copyright flag.


----------



## BrianAZ

scrappler said:


> Thanks BrianAZ! I am actually in Chandler, but I'm assumming this problem covers Phoenix and the surrounding area?


Yes. I'm not sure exactly how far it extends but it is certainly impacting a large section of Cox's Phoenix market.


----------



## AZrob

Roderigo said:


> A bit of a mis-statement here. Tivo didn't download anything recently. Cox sent out an SA cablecard firmware upgrade. The updated code is coming from the cable company (who got it from SA - their cablecard vendor). I don't think tivo's been much involved in any code changes here.


Yes, you are right, thanks for the clarification. I think of this as "Tivo's" upgrade because

a) Tivo had been working with SA and Cox to make this fix and 
b) TivoJerry announced that it was coming a week or so ago (see above).

But it will certainly have to be solved by Tivo,SA and Cox working together. SOMEONE should certainly have tested this in the field since it's odd that such an obvious flaw was missed.


----------



## aztivo

update 2 
so my HD is back to the whold drop chanels and freeze thing but the S3 is going strong /cross fingers/ for the moment


----------



## BrianAZ

AZrob said:


> Yes, you are right, thanks for the clarification. I think of this as "Tivo's" upgrade because
> 
> a) Tivo had been working with SA and Cox to make this fix and
> b) TivoJerry announced that it was coming a week or so ago (see above).
> 
> But it will certainly have to be solved by Tivo,SA and Cox working together. SOMEONE should certainly have tested this in the field since it's odd that such an obvious flaw was missed.


I can't say for certain, but based on various comments I've seen attributed to Tivo/Cox folks, it was assumed that the channel loss issue we are facing in Phoenix was identical to what was being experienced in Las Vegas. Certainly the SubExpireTime issue may have been, but the more frequent channel loss issue is not.

Tivo/Cox set up test boxes in Vegas and it seems the firmware upgrade was developed soley based on info gleaned from these boxes.

It makes me wonder if Tivo has or may benefit from deploying a group of boxes (S2, S3, TivoHD, etc) in each major market at all times. Perhaps in the local office of the Cable Co or in customer's houses via something similar to a beta program (except it is neverending). It seems that this would provide them with ample test boxes to gather data and test fixes without having to do the Q&A thing as much on these boards or via CS.


----------



## BrianAZ

Shawn95GT said:


> FWIW mine is amped too.
> 
> I got notification of some new HD channels in the Tivo lineup this morning. Lifetime HD on 724 (lol), USA HD on 728, and I think it was CNBCHD on 762.
> 
> Of course none of these are working at the moment. Hopefully it's just a case of the guide updating before the channels went live, again.
> 
> 724 (LIFEHD) is showing Universal HD (UHD was on 724 before)
> 725 (UHD) says I may need cablecards to view this channel - lol
> 728 (USAHD) says I may need cablecards to view this channel
> 761 (HSTRYHD) says I may need cablecards to view this channel
> 762 (CNBCHD) is showing HistoryHD (HSTRYHD was on 762 before)
> 
> I can't find any info on the Cox Phoenix site about when these channels are supposed to go live. Anyone know?


Looks like 7/21 now based on this post. Of course, this won't mean *jack *to me unless they get the lost channels/partial recordings fixed before the Olympics! My wife is going to flip out if she can't reliably record the events she is interested in.


----------



## saibari

AZrob said:


> ...BTW, can anyone say whether this bug is hitting S3's as well as HD's? More specifically, is it hitting only those Tivo's that are using M-cards, which would limit it to HD's only? It's not clear to me if it's only HD's with M-cards (the original problem combination that the firmware upgrade was supposed to fix) or if now a larger group is being affected./QUOTE]
> 
> Oy--I'm confused! *What's the difference between S-3's and HD's? *  I apologize because someone _did_ explain this to me a couple months back, but now I don't recall the explanation. Both receive/record/display HD programming correct? I purchased the less expensive box that holds fewer hours of programming. My TiVo account lists mine as an S3, but contrary to AZrob's post quoted above, it can use either 2 S-cards or one M-card. I currently have one M-card. I started out with S-cards but experienced such bad audio-video synch problems that many shows were unwatchable. So I'm loathe to switch back...


----------



## saibari

scrappler said:


> Unfortunately I just moved and switched to Cox (Phoenix) from Mediacom (uses Motorola cards). While Mediacom didn't have much of an HD lineup the service was rock solid using the moto cards.
> I've called Cox about 5 times in the first two days of having the cards just so i could watch tv. I now am getting partial recordings on half of my scheduled content, and copyright flags on things that were never flagged a month ago with Mediacom. I need to go back and read this thread since it sounds like there are many others out there.
> This sucks!


Welcome to our world!  Regarding the copyright flags. I too had this problem when I first hooked my new TiVo up. I initially thought it was the program or network's settings, but when I complained to them they had no idea what I was talking about. *This is a problem with a Cox setting. * They can fix it. I'm sorry, I don't recall precisely what they did to fix it, but they _can_ fix it...


----------



## saibari

Rolow said:


> ...I did have more trouble tonight watching recoded shows. It seams strange I don't know how the two problems could be related. When I FF or use the 8second skip the recording will freeze up like it used to right before I would loose channels. A combination FF pause or 8sec. skip would fix the problem.


For what it's worth, I too experienced this problem a couple of times, a week or so ago. The recorded program would freeze when I tried to FF. Pause didn't work for me and I didn't try the 8sec skip. Only thing that worked was stopping the program and re-starting it. Only happened those two times though and hasn't occurred since...


----------



## BrianAZ

saibari said:


> Welcome to our world!  Regarding the copyright flags. I too had this problem when I first hooked my new TiVo up. I initially thought it was the program or network's settings, but when I complained to them they had no idea what I was talking about. *This is a problem with a Cox setting. * They can fix it. I'm sorry, I don't recall precisely what they did to fix it, but they _can_ fix it...


They can, but I would be very suprised if they do as they are not required to unless it's a local station of the channel makes a request for Cox to change the CCI flag.


----------



## Rolow

Yesterday I had my tivo set to record 2 programs and both where recorded with out a problem. So far today It has 1 partial of the 2 recordings but the 1 partial was only 1 minute short so that's not so bad.

I haven't had any more problems with play back.

What are you guys recording that your getting the broadcast flag/copyright flag?
I've never had it here in Peoria and I record on HBO quite often.


----------



## Shawn95GT

Thanks for the info on the 7/21 date. My lineup changed again to un-do the changes to the 7xx channels but I noticed a bunch of other channels re-arranged too.

I get the copyright flag on pretty much anything from the Universal HD or Discovery HD.


----------



## saibari

BrianAZ said:


> They can, but I would be very suprised if they do as they are not required to unless it's a local station of the channel makes a request for Cox to change the CCI flag.


Perhaps we're talking about two different things? My problem was that copyright flags were appearing on programs that shouldn't have had them, and the program would delete itself within an hour or so after having been recorded. -- very aggravating! Some of the affected programs, for example, were a few cooking shows on Food Network. There was some kind of error in a setting of some sort. When I called Cox, they fixed it and I haven't had _that_ particular problem since then (a few months). ...


----------



## scrappler

BrianAZ said:


> They can, but I would be very suprised if they do as they are not required to unless it's a local station of the channel makes a request for Cox to change the CCI flag.


The copyright flag I am getting is on shows that a week before (with another cable company) had no issues. I'll call cox and see if they can fix it.

The flag basically gives me an hour after the show records to watch it. When i click to watch it, the tivo says I don't have enough time to watch it before the deadline and it deletes it. Some shows automatically delete before I ever realize they were recorded.


----------



## saibari

scrappler said:


> The copyright flag I am getting is on shows that a week before (with another cable company) had no issues. I'll call cox and see if they can fix it.
> 
> The flag basically gives me an hour after the show records to watch it. When i click to watch it, the tivo says I don't have enough time to watch it before the deadline and it deletes it. Some shows automatically delete before I ever realize they were recorded.


Yep, that's exactly what I experienced. Cox fixed it for me, so I don't know why they wouldn't be able to fix it for you...


----------



## qunewsguy

For all you AZ folks, beware. Cox in Connecticut placed an ad in this afternoon's newspaper saying they're adding two Olympics-only HD channels on 8/8/08 (in addition to the standard NBC/Uni HD channels). If you get these too, something tells me you'll be having a lot more issues with your HD Tivo's just as soon as you get your current issues taken care of!


----------



## BrianAZ

scrappler said:


> The copyright flag I am getting is on shows that a week before (with another cable company) had no issues. I'll call cox and see if they can fix it.
> 
> The flag basically gives me an hour after the show records to watch it. When i click to watch it, the tivo says I don't have enough time to watch it before the deadline and it deletes it. Some shows automatically delete before I ever realize they were recorded.


What channels are you seeing this behavior on? If I recall, this means the CCI is set to 3 and is usually only used on PPV. Most channels on Cox are CCI = 2 which will let you record one copy of it ( to your Tivo ) but prevent you from making another copy (to your computer or copying to another Tivo in your house).

I'm in Chandler and have only encountered the CCI=2 scenario.


----------



## saibari

Since Wed morning (2 whole days now) I've not experienced _any_ problems--no freezing, no channel dropping, no partial recordings!  However, I wonder if this will last. I actually have Cox scheduled to install a Cox HD-DVR on Sat morning. I requested this (at no charge) when they told me there was no expected date for a solution to my problem. But now that my TiVo appears to be fine, I'm thinking I might cancel. ... I'm just worried that no sooner do I cancel that I'll start having problems again!


----------



## jebbbz

Hard to say. I almost posted the same thing yesterday as I had gone more than 24 hours with no problems. Then I had, I think, a loss of channels right before I was going to post. I have had six or seven good recordings, no partials. Now it has been another day with no apparent problems. Things seem much better but with no news from Cox or TiVo, even informally, it may be we are going through a lucky spell.


----------



## BrianAZ

saibari said:


> Since Wed morning (2 whole days now) I've not experienced _any_ problems--no freezing, no channel dropping, no partial recordings!  However, I wonder if this will last. I actually have Cox scheduled to install a Cox HD-DVR on Sat morning. I requested this (at no charge) when they told me there was no expected date for a solution to my problem. But now that my TiVo appears to be fine, I'm thinking I might cancel. ... I'm just worried that no sooner do I cancel that I'll start having problems again!


If you got an HD DVR indefinitely for no cost, I say you keep it as long as you can. I would warn you though, I was also given a "free" HD DVR to watch the Hockey sports package since they wouldn't allow cablecard users to tune it. *Every single month* I had to call in and get charges reversed . And it wasn't limited to just the HD DVR itself, it was all the extra fees that come with it (I forget all the items offhand). I was even working through the AZ Cox President's office! Each month I would call normal support when I saw that the charges were on there again.. they'd claim they didn't have anything indicating it was free even though each month the person who eventually credited my account (either a sup. or someone in the Pres. office) would tell me they're noting it in my account. Was a *HUGE *hassle, but at least I could watch my Hockey. I turned it back in the day after the last game.



jebbbz said:


> Hard to say. I almost posted the same thing yesterday as I had gone more than 24 hours with no problems. Then I had, I think, a loss of channels right before I was going to post. I have had six or seven good recordings, no partials. Now it has been another day with no apparent problems. Things seem much better but with no news from Cox or TiVo, even informally, it may be we are going through a lucky spell.


My money's on luck. TivoJerry's been pretty vocal about this issue here and other boards. He certainly would have posted here if something had changed.


----------



## jebbbz

Well, I had another brief channel loss this afternoon so things are better but not fixed. Also, back on July 2 TiVoJerry mentioned he would be out of the office for a few days. It is possible he is not back yet.


----------



## moyekj

jebbbz said:


> Well, I had another brief channel loss this afternoon so things are better but not fixed. Also, back on July 2 TiVoJerry mentioned he would be out of the office for a few days. It is possible he is not back yet.


 He's around. Here's a post by him just this afternoon in the Freeze thread:
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=6469924#post6469924


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## BrianAZ

Had a couple partial recordings today. My wife is pretty irritated about them. Luckily I am able to find them online in various places to tide her over until this is fixed.


----------



## saibari

Ugh! I hate that you guys have had issues today. That means I've probably just been lucky for the past couple of days. Still... I'd hate to go to the bother of installing a Cox HD-DVR, learning how to use it, and likely fighting with them each month to credit any charges that will probably appear on my bill despite the agent telling me I would just pay the $2 cablecard fee as I've been doing. 

On the other hand, the soonest I could get the install scheduled was 5 days out so if I have problems, I'll be stuck for several days until they install the DVR. Why can't they all just get their act together once and for all?!  Is trouble-free service really too much to ask?


----------



## ace689

New Phoenix Tivo owner with an HD & Mcard installed. I have experienced the firmware upgrade loop, channel loss, 161-38 error message and almost daily partial recordings. 

Im in my first 30 days of tivo service and I have the option to cancel - which I am considering at least until the bugs are worked out in the Phoenix area.

My question to you veteran tivo users is this. If I discontinue service will my season pass programs still record? If not, if I set up a manual record of these programs will this work?
Also, without the service will I still have access to all channels?
Thanks in advance for any suggestions.


----------



## aztivo

ace689 said:


> New Phoenix Tivo owner with an HD & Mcard installed. I have experienced the firmware upgrade loop, channel loss, 161-38 error message and almost daily partial recordings.
> 
> Im in my first 30 days of tivo service and I have the option to cancel - which I am considering at least until the bugs are worked out in the Phoenix area.
> 
> My question to you veteran tivo users is this. If I discontinue service will my season pass programs still record? If not, if I set up a manual record of these programs will this work?
> Also, without the service will I still have access to all channels?
> Thanks in advance for any suggestions.


for lack of a better term if you cancel your service you will have a door stop


----------



## saibari

ace689 said:


> New Phoenix Tivo owner with an HD & Mcard installed. I have experienced the firmware upgrade loop, channel loss, 161-38 error message and almost daily partial recordings.
> 
> Im in my first 30 days of tivo service and I have the option to cancel - which I am considering at least until the bugs are worked out in the Phoenix area.
> 
> My question to you veteran tivo users is this. If I discontinue service will my season pass programs still record? If not, if I set up a manual record of these programs will this work?
> Also, without the service will I still have access to all channels?
> Thanks in advance for any suggestions.


If you're within 30 days of initiating service and within 30 days of buying the TiVo box, I'd stop service and return the unit! As much as I've loved my TiVO _when it works_, the poor service has been pretty ridiculous. I've never tried anything else, so I can't say whether or not TiVo is so much better than the alternatives, that it makes it worth putting up with the problems--but I tend to doubt that. 

If you cancel your service, you won't have any recording abilities and I wouldn't think you'd be able to watch live TV either. You'd have to replace the TiVo with another DVR. If you want to stick with Cox, you'd need their HD-DVR. I'm assuming it's been trouble-free, though I can't say for sure... Certainly it can't be as trouble-prone as TiVo has been...


----------



## jebbbz

You can't assume the Cox DVR will be problem-free. Over in the AVS Forums there are quite a few complaints of their DVRs simply failing to record shows, losing schedules, and otherwise having problems, even if there are no system-wide problems as appears to be the case so far in July. The interface, guide, and operation of the SA8300 Cox offers are not comparable to TiVo's. You may luck out or find it satisfactory but I don't know of anyone who truly prefers the Cox DVR to TiVo.

Give yourself as much time as you can before making your decision unless you really can't stand your TiVo problems. My problems have gotten better as mysteriously as they got bad. You mention the upgrade loop -- I assume you got out of it or you couldn't be having problems with loss of channels and partial recordings (same problem, actually). I haven't seen a 161-38 warning in days and haqve a channel loss about once every day and a half so I can live with my problems.


----------



## ajwees41

jebbbz said:


> You can't assume the Cox DVR will be problem-free. Over in the AVS Forums there are quite a few complaints of their DVRs simply failing to record shows, losing schedules, and otherwise having problems, even if there are no system-wide problems as appears to be the case so far in July. The interface, guide, and operation of the SA8300 Cox offers are not comparable to TiVo's. You may luck out or find it satisfactory but I don't know of anyone who truly prefers the Cox DVR to TiVo.
> 
> Give yourself as much time as you can before making your decision unless you really can't stand your TiVo problems. My problems have gotten better as mysteriously as they got bad. You mention the upgrade loop -- I assume you got out of it or you couldn't be having problems with loss of channels and partial recordings (same problem, actually). I haven't seen a 161-38 warning in days and haqve a channel loss about once every day and a half so I can live with my problems.


about the only things going for the motorola cox dvr is renting the dvr vs buying the tivo and ondemand.


----------



## saibari

jebbbz said:


> You can't assume the Cox DVR will be problem-free. Over in the AVS Forums there are quite a few complaints of their DVRs simply failing to record shows, losing schedules, and otherwise having problems, even if there are no system-wide problems as appears to be the case so far in July. The interface, guide, and operation of the SA8300 Cox offers are not comparable to TiVo's. You may luck out or find it satisfactory but I don't know of anyone who truly prefers the Cox DVR to TiVo.
> 
> Give yourself as much time as you can before making your decision unless you really can't stand your TiVo problems. My problems have gotten better as mysteriously as they got bad. You mention the upgrade loop -- I assume you got out of it or you couldn't be having problems with loss of channels and partial recordings (same problem, actually). I haven't seen a 161-38 warning in days and haqve a channel loss about once every day and a half so I can live with my problems.


That's the thing, there isn't enough time to make the decision. You just have that 30-day window and then you're stuck. I'm assuming that TiVo and Cox will work out solutions to the problems we've been having, but when? So, if I could, I'd return the box and stop the service and give the Cox DVR a try. You can always go back to TiVo if you prefer it enough to put up with the headaches. And yes, I've heard that TiVo is head-and-shoulders above any other DVR, but having never tried anything other than TiVo, I can't personally speak to that. ... and I hear the Cox on-demand feature is pretty cool...

You might also consider this SDV mess which will prevent TiVo users from receiving 77 channels. Granted, the affected channels aren't ones that I usually watch (thank goodness!), but still...

That said, now that I've had 3 trouble-free days I've been seduced back into the "I love my TiVo" mode. I was mistaken earlier when I said Cox was going to come out tomorrow to install the DVR, the appointment is for Sunday. So, we'll see how it goes. If I'm trouble-free tomorrow, I'll definitely cancel the Cox appointment...


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## Dbax5

Well I've had my Cox DVR for over a week now. Works great. I agree the user interface is not as cool as TivoHD, but at least it works. And I also have On Demand which is pretty cool. And I am also not paying $12.95 a month for something that does not work. And the channels also change quicker. Finally some peace of mind. Oh, and Cox did credit my account for the 6 days Tivo was getting the firmware update!


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## saibari

ksalwitz said:


> well i just got off the phone with tivo. it seems if you push hard enough and get a supervisor on the phone they will submit your case for "review" i'm supposed to hear back by Friday. I told them i wanted to return in and i wanted my money back. they sold me a piece of equipment that is incompatible with the technology required to use it! when i told the guy that it was not compatible with the SA card, he asked me if i tried a Motorola card! like it's a menu item and you can get whatever brand you want from the cable company. heh...wouldn't that be nice?!?!?
> 
> ken


Hey Ken, have you heard back from TiVo?


----------



## scrappler

I have Cox coming out tomorrow (Sunday) to look at the problems I am having. I told the tech on the phone I doubt the service call will help anything. I am mostly concerned with fixing my issues with the copyright flag. It gives me 2.5 hours to watch anything from HBO/SCI/DISC and more. Does anyone else get 210 minutes to watch something??
Is there anything the tech will be able to do tomorrow for any of the issues (partial recordings/channel loss/copyright problems)?
If I didn't have lifetime service I'd probably seriously consider switching out the box until the issues were fixed.


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## ajwees41

scrappler said:


> I have Cox coming out tomorrow (Sunday) to look at the problems I am having. I told the tech on the phone I doubt the service call will help anything. I am mostly concerned with fixing my issues with the copyright flag. It gives me 2.5 hours to watch anything from HBO/SCI/DISC and more. Does anyone else get 210 minutes to watch something??
> Is there anything the tech will be able to do tomorrow for any of the issues (partial recordings/channel loss/copyright problems)?
> If I didn't have lifetime service I'd probably seriously consider switching out the box until the issues were fixed.


the copyright problems would be with HBO,SCI,DISC not cox.


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## saibari

scrappler said:


> I have Cox coming out tomorrow (Sunday) to look at the problems I am having. I told the tech on the phone I doubt the service call will help anything. I am mostly concerned with fixing my issues with the copyright flag. It gives me 2.5 hours to watch anything from HBO/SCI/DISC and more. Does anyone else get 210 minutes to watch something??
> Is there anything the tech will be able to do tomorrow for any of the issues (partial recordings/channel loss/copyright problems)?
> If I didn't have lifetime service I'd probably seriously consider switching out the box until the issues were fixed.


Do you have two single-stream cards or one multi-stream card? I just looked back at the thread in which I first posted about my copyright problems and it seems that switching from the single stream cards to the mult-stream card solved the problem.... However, for some reason I recall that Cox changed a setting too. But I'm sorry I don't recall exactly what they did. I don't think the problem is with the stations themselves...


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## AZrob

Well, just to keep it clear that nothing's been fixed, I watched a movie on an Encore channel tonight while it was being recorded, and it stopped recording THREE TIMES during the 2 hour broadcast. If I hadn't been watching I wouldn't have been able to restart the recording right away and would have lost it. This is ridiculous!


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## Rolow

I'm still getting partial recordings to. Only one today and one yesterday but I got the 161-38 three times yesterday. It just happened to be the second two times I was not recording anything. 

I have a single M-card in a tivo HD and have never seen the copyright flag. I recorded First Knight on HDB this morning with no problem and it's still there this evening. I also recorded the Fight mid day and watch it tonight with out any problem. I hope you get the copyright flag fixed. That's the last think any of us need is another problem.


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## scrappler

saibari said:


> Do you have two single-stream cards or one multi-stream card? I just looked back at the thread in which I first posted about my copyright problems and it seems that switching from the single stream cards to the mult-stream card solved the problem.... However, for some reason I recall that Cox changed a setting too. But I'm sorry I don't recall exactly what they did. I don't think the problem is with the stations themselves...


I have 2 single cards in an S3. I wonder if two Multi's in the S3 would solve my copyright problem?

The copyright has to be from Cox. I was just using the tivo with another provider 2 weeks ago before I moved and had never seen the flag in two years on those exact channels. Everyone at cox has no idea what I'm talking about and will not help with it.


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## BrianAZ

scrappler said:


> I have 2 single cards in an S3. I wonder if two Multi's in the S3 would solve my copyright problem?
> 
> The copyright has to be from Cox. I was just using the tivo with another provider 2 weeks ago before I moved and had never seen the flag in two years on those exact channels. Everyone at cox has no idea what I'm talking about and will not help with it.


I would suggest you write the GM/Vice President.

These are two people I wrote to in November and received a response from the Executive Relations Dept (in ~ 7 days). They seemed to have much more power in terms of getting things done.

[email protected] <[email protected]> - General Manager/ Cox Arizona

[email protected] <[email protected]> - Vice President Public Affairs/Cox Arizona


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## saibari

scrappler said:


> I have 2 single cards in an S3. I wonder if two Multi's in the S3 would solve my copyright problem?
> 
> The copyright has to be from Cox. I was just using the tivo with another provider 2 weeks ago before I moved and had never seen the flag in two years on those exact channels. Everyone at cox has no idea what I'm talking about and will not help with it.


I agree with Brian. Cox _has_ to be able to fix it. I would use the contacts he lists (thanks, Brian--I plan to hold on to those for future reference!) to get to the bottom of this. I would also contact, TiVo though. I would think _someone_ over there has to know about this problem and at least be able to tell you what you should ask your cable provider to do about it. Plus, they should be made aware of this issue, even if the problem is not on their end....

As I said, I had the very same problem and it was solved. So there _is_ a solution out there...


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## saibari

Rolow said:


> I'm still getting partial recordings to. Only one today and one yesterday but I got the 161-38 three times yesterday. It just happened to be the second two times I was not recording anything.
> 
> I have a single M-card in a tivo HD and have never seen the copyright flag. I recorded First Knight on HDB this morning with no problem and it's still there this evening. I also recorded the Fight mid day and watch it tonight with out any problem. I hope you get the copyright flag fixed. That's the last think any of us need is another problem.


Oh no! I missed your and AZRob's posts until just now. <SIGH> So it appears I've been having trouble-free service for the past 5 days simply because the TiVo fairies have been smiling upon me? Oy! Let's hope I remain in their good graces indefinitely... I _really_ don't want to resort to a Cox HD-DVR ...


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## BrianAZ

saibari said:


> Oh no! I missed your and AZRob's posts until just now. <SIGH> So it appears I've been having trouble-free service for the past 5 days simply because the TiVo fairies have been smiling upon me? Oy! Let's hope I remain in their good graces indefinitely... I _really_ don't want to resort to a Cox HD-DVR ...


It's really difficult to say. Likely you're having the channel loss problem but just happen to not have anything scheduled at the time so you don't see any partial recordings.

I wish Tivo would allow us to view our own logs so we can see how frequently the cards are being reset. This would truly tell you if you're having problems or not.


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## aztivo

I have been one week now with my S3 working perfectly I have 2 Mcards in it but my HD with 1 Mcard is freaking out every day all day. I dont know if it has something to do with the softwear differences or what but this is what I have been noticing


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## jebbbz

BrianAZ said:


> It's really difficult to say. Likely you're having the channel loss problem but just happen to not have anything scheduled at the time so you don't see any partial recordings...


You can also check to see if both tuners are set to the same channel when you turn on your TV. When the channel loss takes place the two tuners are both set to the channel that the TiVo was sending to the TV at the time the problem arose.


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## saibari

BrianAZ said:


> It's really difficult to say. Likely you're having the channel loss problem but just happen to not have anything scheduled at the time so you don't see any partial recordings.


Well, I checked all my TiVo suggestions as well--and there were lots of them--and all of those were fine. _However_, tonight as I watched live TV the channel went out for a few seconds.  AND, earlier this evening I had none of the non-HD network channels (15, 12, 5), although they're back now. I had checked them because I was getting a _lot_ of pixelation on the HD channels--possibly because of the storm that was rolling through? No problems now...

I just hope the channel dropping does get any more frequent...


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## saibari

aztivo said:


> I have been one week now with my S3 working perfectly I have 2 Mcards in it but my HD with 1 Mcard is freaking out every day all day. I dont know if it has something to do with the softwear differences or what but this is what I have been noticing


Ok... I gotta ask again--what's the difference between S3 and HD TiVo's? Mine is listed as an S3 on my TiVo account info and I did not buy the most expensive box...

Also, why do you have 2 M-cards? You only need one, correct?


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## Shawn95GT

saibari said:


> Ok... I gotta ask again--what's the difference between S3 and HD TiVo's? Mine is listed as an S3 on my TiVo account info and I did not buy the most expensive box...
> 
> Also, why do you have 2 M-cards? You only need one, correct?


S3 has a cool OLED front display that shows the name of whatever it's recording (except suggestions).
S3 is THX certified
S3 comes with the GLO remote
S3 comes with a bigger hard drive
S3 has the cablecard slots in the back.

and since the S3 came first is has some quirks - like it won't run on a single MCard for both tuners.

This is WAY over simplified.. but those are some of the big points.

THD:









S3:


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## saibari

Shawn95GT said:


> S3 has a cool OLED front display that shows the name of whatever it's recording (except suggestions).
> S3 is THX certified
> S3 comes with the GLO remote
> S3 comes with a bigger hard drive
> S3 has the cablecard slots in the back.
> 
> and since the S3 came first is has some quirks - like it won't run on a single MCard for both tuners.
> 
> This is WAY over simplified.. but those are some of the big points.
> 
> THD:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> S3:


Thank you! So I have a TiVo-HD. I wonder why it says Series 3 on my account info?


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## scrappler

Had cox over yesterday. Replaced out two of my cards. I'm not having any channel drops so far; still getting some SD channel stuttering. Thankfully the new cable cards have also fixed the copyright issue I had (so far). That was the most annoying issue for me, so at least that is taken care of. The Technician wanted to hook up the cox dvr to show me the problem was with Tivo. I told him not to bother and I knew the Cox DVR would probably work fine...but that I was still not switching to it. 
I told him it wasn't my Tivo box because the Moto cards I had in it worked fine for 18 months before switching to cox. He told me to get a Moto card and see if Cox would activate for me.  hahaha...if only...


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## TheLongshot

saibari said:


> Thank you! So I have a TiVo-HD. I wonder why it says Series 3 on my account info?


Because the TivoHD is technically a Series 3 machine.

Jason


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## BrianAZ

jebbbz said:


> You can also check to see if both tuners are set to the same channel when you turn on your TV. When the channel loss takes place the two tuners are both set to the channel that the TiVo was sending to the TV at the time the problem arose.


I considered this, but if you have a fair amount of recordings, it's likely that the tuners will change to start new recordings by the time you check.


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## jebbbz

BrianAZ said:


> I considered this, but if you have a fair amount of recordings, it's likely that the tuners will change to start new recordings by the time you check.


I see your point. July is sort of the off season so I don't have as much set to record and that possibility slipped my mind.


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## nicemann

Just FYI I emailed Cox and asked for a current list of channels that are or are going to SDV. Below is the response I got. I called Cox to ask if the new HHD Channels were going to SDV and they could not answer that.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

SDV is a new technology that allows Cox to maximize it?s video bandwidth, by only sending that channel signal a customer has tuned to as opposed to the entire line-up. In order for customers to be able to receive and view switched video channels, customers must have a device cable of two-way communication.

Currently only digital and advanced set top receivers are two-way capable. This means that beginning July 1, CableCARD customers will lose access to the switched channels.

Cox has 77 switched channels throughout our entire footprint. The following channels are currently switch digital.

109 * Cox Real Estate 2/Phx Only GoScout HOMES 110 * Daystar
112 * Inspiration
113 * EWTN
114 * BYU TV
125 * CSPAN 2
126 * CSPAN 3
133 * DIY - Do It Yourself
144 * Fox Reality Channel (REAL)
155 * BET on Jazz
156 * Great American Country (GAC)
157 * FUSE
158 * G4
159 * Logo
163 * Fit TV
170 * Fox College Sports Atlantic
172 * Fox College Sports Pacific
173 * Fuel
405 *
TV Chile

410 *
de Pelicula

411 *
de Pelicula Classico

412 * CineLatino
413 * VeneMovies
417 * History en Espaqol
418 * Discovery en Espaqol
422 * Discovery Familia
423 * Toon Disney en Espaqol
424 * Boomerang en Espaqol
425 * Sorpresa
430 * MTV Tr3s
432 * Bandamax
433 * VideoRola
434 * mun2
438 * ESPN Deportes
439 * Fox Sports en Espaqol
440 * GoITV
444 * CNN en Espaqol
445 * Canal Sur
449 * EWTN Espaqol 

601* to 607 * which includes:
ESPN GamePlan and ESPN GamePlan/ESPN Full Court 

650 * to 659* which includes:
NBA League Pass Preview
NBA League Pass
NBA League Pass PPV/MLS Direct Kick 650 * to 659* NHL Center Ice MLB Extra Innings NHL Center Ice / MLB Extra Innings 670 * to 680 *


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## thewebgal

nicemann said:


> Just FYI I emailed Cox and asked for a current list of channels that are or are going to SDV. Below is the response I got. I called Cox to ask if the new HHD Channels were going to SDV and they could not answer that.
> *


Not to be mean, but your UserID does not show Location, so I'm wondering WHICH cox your info relates to - COX Fairfax, VA - where I live, Arizona, or maybe one of the other COX systems somewhere in the US?


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## BrianAZ

thewebgal said:


> Not to be mean, but your UserID does not show Location, so I'm wondering WHICH cox your info relates to - COX Fairfax, VA - where I live, Arizona, or maybe one of the other COX systems somewhere in the US?


That looks like the Arizona list & date if I recall.


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## nicemann

So sorry thought I had it in my userid.....it is for Phoenix,


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## BrianAZ

Hi Everyone,

Since this thread has gotten so huge and covers a wide range of topics, I've started a thread specific to the channel loss issue in Phoenix. You can find it here. I'm hoping that by giving the issue it's own thread, it'll be easier for us all to discuss and receive any updates.

Thanks,
Brian


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## jcaudle

Its kind of funny, that Fairfax has over one million people and it seems that the only people that ever contribute to this thread are from the Phoenix area. It would be nice to hear from Cox Fairfax customers once in a while. Where are the Tuning Resolvers/Adapters?


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## djwilso

jcaudle said:


> Its kind of funny, that Fairfax has over one million people and it seems that the only people that ever contribute to this thread are from the Phoenix area. It would be nice to hear from Cox Fairfax customers once in a while. Where are the Tuning Resolvers/Adapters?


Well, people usually only come to Internet forums if they're experiencing problems with their service.

Also, this thread is not really about SDV but about CableCards.

- Dennis


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## jcaudle

SDV is about cable cards inability to communicate 2 way....I know there are a lot of people around here that get upset if a comment doesn't fit their limited definiton of what a thread is about, but since I started it 2 years ago, I figure I know whats its about.


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## jebbbz

Except that SDV is not about cable cards but rather is about the box (TV or TiVo) you plug the CC into. Cable cards handle authorization and decryption, not communications, neither one-way nor two-way.


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## tagpats

I'm in Northern Virginia, but have apparently avoided the recent cluster of problems because i have 2 S Cards instead of the one M Card I used to use.

Since the menu options are different with S Cards installed than with M Cards, I have absolutely no idea what version I'm running, but can only assume that my cards did not receive any firmware update as nothing changed on my end.

I still deal with the occasional frozen channel and choppy audio at times, but no missed recordings. About once a month I have to reboot to resolve an issue, but I'm now 5 weeks from my last reboot and still going. 

I don't have any confidence my luck will last, but for the time being, I'm pretty content.

I'll be giving FIOS TV a try if I get back to the point where a Cox DVR is the only way to get programming.


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## jenp

scrappler said:


> Had cox over yesterday. Replaced out two of my cards. I'm not having any channel drops so far; still getting some SD channel stuttering. Thankfully the new cable cards have also fixed the copyright issue I had (so far). That was the most annoying issue for me, so at least that is taken care of. The Technician wanted to hook up the cox dvr to show me the problem was with Tivo. I told him not to bother and I knew the Cox DVR would probably work fine...but that I was still not switching to it.
> I told him it wasn't my Tivo box because the Moto cards I had in it worked fine for 18 months before switching to cox. He told me to get a Moto card and see if Cox would activate for me.  hahaha...if only...


What's a motocard?


----------



## jebbbz

Motorola card. Won't work in a cable system that uses Cisco/Scientific Atlanta distribution equipment. Techs should know that.


----------



## RogueScot

PDT816 said:


> Cox OKC told me that it would be a flat $1.99 per card/mo and I could pick them up at any location when it was convenient for a self install.


That's interesting. Cox OKC told me you couldn't self-install. You had to have a tech do it. My multi-stream card went out completely. When they came out, the "tivo expert" on the phone told the tech that since my Tivo HD had the new software update I had to have two single stream cards instead of the multi-stream. $15 installation charge. Waived. Only one card worked and they had to come back out two days later with several more single stream cards to find one that worked. The bill came a few days ago with a $15 installation charge. Unbelievable. But, no hang ups or loss of channels since the install.


----------



## jebbbz

On the off chance people are still checking this thread for news on the upgrade loop and channel loss problems, I posted this over on the special Phoenix/Tucson thread (http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=399534):

"My update: Channel loss has hit me only a couple of times a week for the last two weeks. Thursday night was the last time I noticed it. This thread technically only covers such channel loss but I thought I would pass on something else. At the time the firmware upgrade took place many people noted that their TiVos were stuck in an upgrade loop. For me, there were certain problem channels (TCM on 199, for example). Tuning to them would trigger a false upgrade cycle that would repeat until I could tune away from the problem channel just as the "upgrade" finished. I checked just now and my upgrade loop problem seems fixed. Cisco/SA have not sent me any new firmware (I have the 0301) nor have I received the 9.4 update from TiVo. I guess that leaves Cox as having changed something in their local system that fixed the problem. Given the coincidence of the upgrade loop problem and the channel loss problem I have some hope that the latter problem will soon be history, too."


----------



## JayBird

My sister in Phoenix just upgraded to HD with a new Pioneer plasma display and a TiVo HD. Cox came out yesterday to do her cable card installation. As usual, she didn't get an actual Cox technician, but just some subcontractor.

The first thing he does is spend a great deal of time in the box on the side of the house, apparently messing around with the signal amplifier, and then putting a wall wart power supply for the amplifier in the house and tying it into the cable. The weird thing about this, is that she already has one of those wall warts tied into the cable in another room, so it's not clear what was up with that. I wasn't there, and my sister didn't stand out in the heat and watch what he was doing, so it's not clear what was going on other than the tech spent a great deal of time doing whatever he was doing.

The second issue was that in addition to putting a cable card into the TiVo HD (which, surprisingly, actually went relatively smoothly), the tech was also supposed to install one into her new TV. However, all he had was M-cards, and both of the 2 remaining cable cards that he had on hand after installing the first one in the TiVo came up with an error message when put into the TV. The tech concluded (in error) that the TV wouldn't work with an M-card and needed an S-card. Of course, for those of us in the know, M-cards are backwards compatible, and should work fine in the place of an S-card in a single tuner device such as her TV. Luckily, I had previously told my sister that they were backwards compatible, so she didn't accept the tech's misinformation, and made him go find another tech in the area to get some more cable cards to try. When he ultimately came back, he got one to work, but had my sister not known to push him on the issue, she would have bought the story that the m-cards won't work in the TV. It stinks that Cox has techs out in the field who don't have a clue what they are talking about, spreading misinformation.

But here's the real killer. After the install was complete, and everything seemed to be working, and my sister had run through guided setup again, she discovers that the HD channels of the premium channels that she subscribes to come up blank - on both the TiVo and the TV. Again, knowing that's not right, she calls up Cox tech support to get it resolved, figuring that they just forgot to add those channels to the list of channels that should get authorized by her cable cards. Of course, the misinformed Cox rep who took her call was very rude to her, and said that she can't get those channels without having Cox's box. Ultimately, my sister insisted to talk to a manager after being insulted by the rep several times. In contrast, the manager was very polite and nice, and, in fact, discovered that indeed the problem was that they just forgot to authorize those channels, and it took only a minute or so to resolve the problem. Bottom line - if the first line tech support doesn't give you the answer you want to hear, it's most likely that they are grossly misinformed and you simply need to escalate the issue to a manager who has a clue.

But... the story isn't over yet... After finally getting all that sorted out, she comes to find that the cable box in the other room (which is connected to one of her Series 2 TiVos) stopped working. Sure enough, as much as my sister made herself abundantly clear when she called Cox to order the new service, and having repeated herself multiple times to the rep, including summarizing exactly what she wanted at the end of the call just to be sure they didn't screw it up, what happenned? They screwed it up and disabled her cable box. So she had to contact Cox again to get it reauthorized and working correctly.

On the plus side, now that everything is working, my sister is loving her new TiVo HD and HDTV. But the story won't be over until she gets the next Cox bill in the mail, which, if her experience is like mine, the bill will be all screwed up and she will once again have to call Cox to get it sorted all out.

The gross incompetence is overwhelming. The CSR that takes the original order screws things up on the order. The tech doesn't understand that M-cards are backwards compatible for single tuner devices. And the CSR that takes her call when her HD premium channels don't work doesn't have a clue that she really is supposed to get those channels. Not exactly a positive customer experience...

Of course, to add insult to injury, now she still has to deal with the cable card 161-38 error issue in the Phoenix area that causes temporary loss of channels and partial if not completely lost recordings, which again is a Cox issue (an incompatibility problem between the local Cox infrastructure and the firmware on the SA cable cards).

Add to all that the issue of SDV which is right around the corner, which will start causing my sister to lose channels. It was supposed to be first deployed in the Phoenix area earlier this month, but due to some sort of technical problems at Cox (surprise, surprise), has been delayed. And you have to believe that when the tuning adapters first hit the street they will have their share of "issues" that will need to get resolved.

This shouldn't be this hard or complicated. For the technically unsavvy, who don't know how to wade through the misinformation or have any tolerance for all the ouststanding issues, this is a nightmare. If I wasn't already a die-hard TiVo fan, and the TiVo HD was my first TiVo purchase and I experienced all of the above, I would be returning it to TiVo and demanding my money back, like so many other people are doing. My wife's tolerance of the issues with our own TiVo HD (same issues as my sister, as we are also in the Phoenix area) are reaching the breaking point. I have to keep telling my wife that "they are working on it", but her patience is wearing thin. She's not happy that we spent all this money to "upgrade" to the TiVo HD, only to "downgrade" our service. This is a terrible black eye for TiVo, and the reputation of TiVo in general. Yes, a lot of it isn't TiVo's fault (at least not directly), but TiVo is taking the brunt of the blame that their product doesn't work with the established cable system. Until this gets all sorted out, and the installation of a new HD TiVo (be it this series or the next) is as smooth and simply as it was for Series 1 and Series 2 TiVos and it all simply just works right (again, like it was for the Series 1 and Series 1 TiVos), I doubt I'll be recommending TiVo to anybody unless they are really prepared to deal with all of the above issues.


----------



## saibari

JayBird said:


> My sister in Phoenix just upgraded to HD with a new Pioneer plasma display and a TiVo HD. Cox came out yesterday to do her cable card installation. ... The gross incompetence is overwhelming. The CSR that takes the original order screws things up on the order. The tech doesn't understand that M-cards are backwards compatible for single tuner devices. And the CSR that takes her call when her HD premium channels don't work doesn't have a clue that she really is supposed to get those channels. Not exactly a positive customer experience...


I certainly hope that your sister is reporting this to upper-level management. There's no excuse for it!



JayBird said:


> Of course, to add insult to injury, now she still has to deal with the cable card 161-38 error issue in the Phoenix area that causes temporary loss of channels and partial if not completely lost recordings, which again is a Cox issue (an incompatibility problem between the local Cox infrastructure and the firmware on the SA cable cards).
> 
> Add to all that the issue of SDV which is right around the corner, which will start causing my sister to lose channels. It was supposed to be first deployed in the Phoenix area earlier this month, but due to some sort of technical problems at Cox (surprise, surprise), has been delayed. And you have to believe that when the tuning adapters first hit the street they will have their share of "issues" that will need to get resolved.


So I have to ask... why on earth did your sister go with a TiVo HD?!! Despite my being a big fan (after several years of great service with a Series 2), had I known about these issues, I would've waited to get a TiVo HD until the issues are resolved... or at least minimized...



JayBird said:


> This shouldn't be this hard or complicated. For the technically unsavvy, who don't know how to wade through the misinformation or have any tolerance for all the ouststanding issues, this is a nightmare.


Well, I have just enough technical knowledge to realize how much I don't understand regarding how all this works. But the technically savvy are still dealing with the same horrible service and I would think if you have a complete understanding of what's going on you might be even more frustrated since you realize just how incompetent some of the Cox reps and techs are!



JayBird said:


> If I wasn't already a die-hard TiVo fan, and the TiVo HD was my first TiVo purchase and I experienced all of the above, I would be returning it to TiVo and demanding my money back, like so many other people are doing. ... I have to keep telling my wife that "they are working on it", but her patience is wearing thin. She's not happy that we spent all this money to "upgrade" to the TiVo HD, only to "downgrade" our service.


I'm with your wife on this one!!



JayBird said:


> This is a terrible black eye for TiVo, and the reputation of TiVo in general.


*
As well it should be!*



JayBird said:


> Yes, a lot of it isn't TiVo's fault (at least not directly), but TiVo is taking the brunt of the blame that their product doesn't work with the established cable system. Until this gets all sorted out, and the installation of a new HD TiVo (be it this series or the next) is as smooth and simply as it was for Series 1 and Series 2 TiVos and it all simply just works right (again, like it was for the Series 1 and Series 1 TiVos), I doubt I'll be recommending TiVo to anybody unless they are really prepared to deal with all of the above issues.


_*And this is the crux of the issue, with respect to TiVo and the way they're handling this mess.*_ No matter how wonderful TiVo is _when it works_, you would not in good conscience recommend that anyone enter into this frustrating morass of unreliable service. Yet TiVo is still selling its HD units in the Phoenix/Tucson area, without so much as a word of caution, knowing full well the headaches that await the hapless consumer. ... Yes, there's a 30-day trial period, but I didn't worry about the few problems (some A/V synch issues) I experienced during that period, fully expecting that the issue would be promptly solved. _And_, not only is TiVo selling the units, but they're selling yearly and even lifetime service to the unwitting consumer!

And, don't worry, I feel Cox is also just as remiss in hooking customers up, again without warning them of these issues. But then, most of their reps and techs are so clueless that they're not even _aware_ of the issues! So Cox's role in all this is even more reprehensible in that they're handling it so incompetently...


----------



## ChrisMc73

I have had my S3 box for probably over a year now, and once I finally got the cable cards installed, I've experienced every kind of issue that is mentioned on this site...signal drop, change to a channel that doesn't appear on screen and turns black, change to a channel that takes a minute or two to come up, skips when the channel is tuned, audio skips as well, just over all poor performance with the cable cards.

I'm not sure what kind I have or how to find out, anyone know?

If I'm an OKC Cox customer, with an S3, what should I have as the newest and greatest cable cards, so I know what to ask for when I call and ask to be upgraded?


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## saibari

ChrisMc73 said:


> ...If I'm an OKC Cox customer, with an S3, what should I have as the _newest and greatest cable cards_, so I know what to ask for when I call and ask to be upgraded?


Sorry Chris, I can't answer your question but hey--thanks a bunch for the belly laugh! Using "greatest" in the same sentence as "cable card" is quite a riot!  (I do believe that's the first "big grin" I've used in a TiVo/cable card-related thread!)


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## ChrisMc73

I found the CableCard Menu and see that the SA CableCARD Diag Screen shows me an OS Build from 2005, thats quite old... how can I get new cards or update the OS builds?


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## JayBird

saibari said:


> So I have to ask... why on earth did your sister go with a TiVo HD?


She got a smoking deal on a new 50" Pioneer KURO Plasma HDTV (PDP-5010FD) on a closeout for almost 50% off MSRP (it has recently been replaced by the PDP-5020FD, which doesn't have a cable card slot). Being a long time TiVo fan (TiVo is big in my family), once she had the new TV on its way, she wanted a new TiVo that did HD. I explained to her all the outstanding issues and all the potential things that Cox could screw up, with the theory of having her prepared for a worst case scenario, and she still wanted to take the plunge to get a TiVo HD, accepting that things may not go smoothly, and that there may be issues that will need to get resolved. My sister and I are both early adopters of technology, so we know what comes with the territory, and what issues we might have to endure, so she was prepared for all that happenned. That being said, I would have advised most other people not to do it until things are more stable.

My point of writing the prior post is that regardless of my sister's tolerance of these sort of issues as an early adopter of technology, this is still a *totally unacceptable* customer experience that is giving both TiVo and Cox a really bad reputation.


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## saibari

JayBird said:


> She got a smoking deal on a new 50" Pioneer KURO Plasma HDTV (PDP-5010FD) on a closeout for almost 50% off MSRP ...
> 
> My point of writing the prior post is that regardless of my sister's tolerance of these sort of issues as an early adopter of technology, this is still a *totally unacceptable* customer experience that is giving both TiVo and Cox a really bad reputation.


Wow, a Kuro--that's supposed to be one of the best HD plasmas out there--kudos to your sister! Her situation is very different from most Phoenix/Tucson area TiVo HD consumers. She made an _informed_ decision (thanks to _you_, not TiVo or Cox)--the rest of us were bamboozled!  ...

If you agree to be a beta tester, you accept that working out the kinks comes with the territory. And, correct me if I'm wrong, beta testers usually don't pay for the privilege. I'm sure Phoenix/Tucson area TiVo HD/Cox customers never dreamed we'd be paying big bucks to be unwitting beta testers!!  So yes, I agree with you completely--this _is_ *totally unacceptable*!


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## ChrisMc73

For the S3 using Cox SA Cards what kind works the best? S-Cards or M-Cards?


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## saibari

ChrisMc73 said:


> For the S3 using Cox SA Cards what kind works the best? S-Cards or M-Cards?


I have a TiVo-HD, so I don't know if the situation might be different for Series 3 TiVo's. My experience was that when using 2 s-cards (as I initially did) caused moderate to severe audio/video synch problems, making some shows virtually unwatchable. The M-card has caused intermittent signal drops resulting in partial recordings. At its worst, this signal-drop problem (for me) is a different yet equally aggravating evil as the A/V synch problem. However, a lot of the time the signal-drop isn't as bad as the A/V synch problem. So that's why I've decided not to go back to two S-cards. ... PLUS, some have reported the same signal-drop problems with the S-cards, though it appears to be much less common...


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## moyekj

ChrisMc73 said:


> For the S3 using Cox SA Cards what kind works the best? S-Cards or M-Cards?


 From various accounts I have heard you are better of with S-Cards if you can get hold of them since they are more mature (hardware & firmware), and you need 2 regardless of the type for an S3. Also keep in mind when S3s were first released there were not even M-Cards available to test with at the time, so most/all testing was done using S-Cards.
Problem is SA/Cisco & Motorola have stopped producing S-Cards so they are getting harder to find as any new stock ordered by cable company are all M-Cards.


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## ChrisMc73

saibari said:


> I have a TiVo-HD, so I don't know if the situation might be different for Series 3 TiVo's. My experience was that the using 2 s-cards (as I initially did) caused moderate to severe audio/video synch problems, making some shows virtually unwatchable. The M-card has caused intermittent signal drops resulting in partial recordings. At its worst, this signal-drop problem (for me) is a different yet equally aggravating evil as the A/V synch problem. However, a lot of the time the signal-drop isn't as bad as the A/V synch problem. So that's why I've decided not to go back to two S-cards. ... PLUS, some have reported the same signal-drop problems with the S-cards, though it appears to be much less common...


What version of the SA S-Cards are they? Meaning I'm wondering if I have some old out of date cards? How can I see all this information and what models are new etc...I have two S-Cards I guess, as I've never requested M-Cards. I did see the OS on the cards was from 2005...so I'm assuming I have old hardware.


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## ChrisMc73

moyekj said:


> From various accounts I have heard you are better of with S-Cards if you can get hold of them since they are more mature (hardware & firmware), and you need 2 regardless of the type for an S3. Also keep in mind when S3s were first released there were not even M-Cards available to test with at the time, so most/all testing was done using S-Cards.
> Problem is SA/Cisco & Motorola have stopped producing S-Cards so they are getting harder to find as any new stock ordered by cable company are all M-Cards.


Funny you'd think the newer cards would be better?
So the current S-Cards I have are probably better? Even with firmware or OS that is old?


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## saibari

ChrisMc73 said:


> Funny you'd think the newer cards would be better?
> So the current S-Cards I have are probably better? Even with firmware or OS that is old?


I'd say that if you're experiencing significant problems with your current cards, you should swap them out for new ones. My experience has been that this solves the problems... temporarily.

When the problem gets bad again (lots of partial recordings), I swap the card out again. Right now, after my last swap (last Friday) my signal-drop problem is minor (knock wood!)... hopefully it won't get worse, but prior to the swap I had no reception on some channels and the channels I did receive were severely tiled.

If, however, your current level of difficulties are tolerable (that is, they don't greatly affect your television viewing or recording), then I'd stick with what you've got...


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## ChrisMc73

Looking into ATT Uverse...


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## moyekj

ChrisMc73 said:


> Looking into ATT Uverse...


 Doesn't work with your S3 so look no more if you still want to use your S3.


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## ChrisMc73

moyekj said:


> Doesn't work with your S3 so look no more if you still want to use your S3.


I know this, I'm looking into it and would sell the S3. The menus are very smooth and very fast and very cool looking, I will have to play with the DVR features and compare. I'm growing tired of changing channels and waiting for a few seconds only to get black screens, and when I do tune in a channel usually the sound skips for a few seconds or so.

I haven't witnessed these issues on Uverse. Just weighing my options.


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## ChrisMc73

I've been a big Tivo fan, but it seems I've just had too many issues with the CableCARDs and thats obvious with the amount of threads on them! So I'm going to look into going with what was made to work...


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## moyekj

ChrisMc73 said:


> I've been a big Tivo fan, but it seems I've just had too many issues with the CableCARDs and thats obvious with the amount of threads on them! So I'm going to look into going with what was made to work...


 If you go by this forum alone then you have a distorted picture of reality as people having problems will post but others with no issues seldom post to say so. Both my S3s have been nearly flawless so far. Granted a lot of it depends on your local cable headend. Some headends seem to have a lot more problems than others.
Nothing wrong with looking at alternatives and covering all your bases though. (Personally I wouldn't touch UVerse because of bandwidth restrictions, mpeg4 re-encoding and other issues that have been covered in this and other forums).


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## saibari

moyekj said:


> If you go by this forum alone then you have a distorted picture of reality as people having problems will post but others with no issues seldom post to say so. Both my S3s have been nearly flawless so far. Granted a lot of it depends on your local cable headend. Some headends seem to have a lot more problems than others. ...


Well, the problems are widespread in the Phoenix/Tucson area such that we even have a dedicated thread for our area! However, I understand that not all areas of the country are experiencing these issues, which seem to be prevalent with Scientific Atlanta cards. I don't know how widespread the problems are in Oklahoma...


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## delgadobb

doormat said:


> I think I got this firmware update a while back (5/20) and my Tivo has been working perfectly since. No missing channels, no reboots to get new sub exp date. SA M-Card, Cox Las Vegas.


Question for those in Las Vegas ...

I'm moving to Vegas from Chicago in early-mid October. I called Cox in advance to ask about packages/cable options/Tivo HD/etc. The rep told me analog is & will continue to be available for my existing TIVOs (3 series 2, 2 Toshibas). I asked about HD service since I want to purchase a TIVO HD with Lifetime service when I move; she said they only have S-Cards & they cost $1.99/mo (maybe it was $1.95, in my head 'two bucks' registered).

Here's the rub, though. She said I'd have to pay a 'digital gateway fee' of $4.95/mo for each outlet receiving digital channels that isn't using their cable box. Isn't this what the Cablecard issue & legislation was supposed to eliminate? I told her that was excessive & would limit my spending with Cox. Her response was that it was still cheaper than getting their cable box for $10.95/mo. Well, no it's not. I don't know about their regular cable boxes, but their DVR definitely has dual tuners. She confirmed I'd have to pay for two cable cards & two digital gateway fees to take full advantage of the two tuners in the TIVO HD (or Series 3). That's $4.95 times two plus $1.99 times two, or roughly $14.00 per month to use a TIVO HD. Hah. And I want to get two of them ...

I noticed doormat mentioned having a M-Card, do others in Las Vegas have this? My concern is whether the rep really knew her stuff. I'd like to set up my install in advance & have it set up as soon as I get there. My gut tells me M-Cards have to be available. Plus, am I really gonna get stuck with paying 5 bucks per tuner for access to digital channels? What about HD?

My fear is that Cox Las Vegas won't be much better than RCN or Comcast here in Chicago, which have both sunset analog service so I can't use my TIVOs. (Well, not without getting their cable boxes, using the TIVO redirector/adapter & paying exorbitant fees. No thanks, I'll wait.) The rep quoted a bunch of fees that might hit me (service/install/add'l outlets/etc) - really, in my case it shouldn't be much, as the house I'm buying has a smart box with all the cable centralized to that box, along with network wiring. In theory, my hookup ought to be fairly simple ...

The way things are going, I have a feeling I'm only going to be signing up for analog & just keep my existing TIVOs. Cox has a statement on their web site about keeping analog active for three years beyond Feb. 2009, so maybe I'll have to be patient about digital cable and/or HD channels. Analog will satisfy most of my needs just fine, but I'd like to get a new TV & get access to HD channels without feeling like I'm being kitchen-sinked with fees.

Any advice and/or responses appreciated. Thanks.


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## murraymh

Just my experience with Cox here in SD:

I've used a Tivo series 2 for more than 3 years now & loved it. But with my new big beautiful 50" plasma it was time for hi-def. That meant getting this new hi-def Tivo, & I was somewhat worried because of all the cablecard issues that some people have been having.
Well things went off just about perfect...the Cox cable guy came when they said they would, he installed the single multi-stream card, went thru some setup procedures, then called the office for them to do their authorization thing...and nothing - just a black screen. Called again spoke to somebody else - they did something & bang every thing was there in BEAUTIFUL HD. The whole thing took about 1 hour
So to sum up: 1) HD is super...it's such a bother to watch standard def now,,,and
2) Tivo is still the best DVR out there. It's features, convenience & ease of use put it at the top of it's class.
Help other customers find the most helpful reviews


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## murraymh

Just my experience with Cox here in SD:

I've used a Tivo series 2 for more than 3 years now & loved it. But with my new big beautiful 50" plasma it was time for hi-def. That meant getting this new hi-def Tivo, & I was somewhat worried because of all the cablecard issues that some people have been having.
Well things went off just about perfect...the Cox cable guy came when they said they would, he installed the single multi-stream card, went thru some setup procedures, then called the office for them to do their authorization thing...and nothing - just a black screen. Called again spoke to somebody else - they did something & bang every thing was there in BEAUTIFUL HD. The whole thing took about 1 hour
So to sum up: 1) HD is super...it's such a bother to watch standard def now,,,and
2) Tivo is still the best DVR out there. It's features, convenience & ease of use put it at the top of it's class.

this 4 days ago & all is well


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## delgadobb

One more question - how much are TIVO HD and/or Series 3 users everywhere paying for your cable cards? What additional fees are you seeing, if any? (Like the $4.95/tuner digital gateway fee I mentioned above - $10 extra for two tuners on top of programming fees & upgrades is a bit much IMHO.) 

What about HD? Is that included in your upgraded/digital/premium package? Or are you paying extra for those channels? 

Thanks for any & all replies ...


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## ehardman

delgadobb said:


> One more question - how much are TIVO HD and/or Series 3 users everywhere paying for your cable cards? What additional fees are you seeing, if any? (Like the $4.95/tuner digital gateway fee I mentioned above - $10 extra for two tuners on top of programming fees & upgrades is a bit much IMHO.)
> 
> What about HD? Is that included in your upgraded/digital/premium package? Or are you paying extra for those channels?
> 
> Thanks for any & all replies ...


You should only have to pay one gateway fee.


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## JayBird

I'm with Cox in the Phoenix area. I installed 2 cable cards, on M-card in my TiVo HD, and one S-card in my Pioneer Plasma.

Installation was a truck roll fee of $30 (or was it $35?) plus $15 per cable card.

Cost for the cable cards is $2/mo.

Cost for "digital gateway service" went up from the original $5 when I just had a digital cable box to $7. The extra $2 was because I had an "additional outlet" hooked up for digital service. Trying to argue that both the TiVo and the TV were connected to the same outlet (i.e. the same jack) not separate outlets got me nowhere. It's apparently more of a "per device" than "per outlet" charge. It is my understanding that if you have two cable cards in a single device, such as an original Series 3 TiVo, or the case of 2 S-cards in a TiVo HD, they don't charge the additional outlet fee.

Fees in other markets vary widely, even with the same cable company.


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## Shawn95GT

don't worry - your bill will vary greatly for a few months.. then it stabilizes

I don't think my bill was the same/predictable for about 6 months. I argued about the 2 gateway fees and it eventually went away.


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## cagnew

Does anyone know where I can access the SA firmware version info? I cannot locate this.

Thanks!


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## JayBird

cagnew said:


> Does anyone know where I can access the SA firmware version info? I cannot locate this.
> 
> Thanks!


From another thread...



BrianAZ said:


> You read correct (though it's "304, rather than 3.04"). To see what version you have, do the following:
> 
> Tivo Button
> Messages & Settings
> Account & System Information
> CableCARD Decoders
> Configure CableCARD 1 (MultiStream) - This is assuming you have a single MCard
> CableCARD Menu
> SA CableCARD Diag Screen
> OS Ver: PKEY1.1.12_F.p.0*301*
> 
> I'm sure there's a more direct route, but this is how I check it.


Those of us in AZ with M-cards currently have the version 301 firmware, which is what's causing all the partial recording issues here for everyone with a TiVo HD. Those outside of AZ may have a different firmware version.


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## RumDrinker

If you have had a recent CableCard install within Fairfax, VA area...

Can you please post whether Cox is using S or M cards, and what manufacturer they are? How was the experience? I'm getting a Tivo HD DVR and hoping that M-cards are used as I'll then only need one of those for both digital tuners within the tivo (multi-stream). I'm hearing conflicting stories between the techs and sales regarding how many cards are required - and of course I can't help them if they don't know what card type they're using. 

Thanks.


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## jdos

I got my new Tivo HD last week and set it up on Saturday. Today I called Cox to order the cable card(s). The nice lady that answered the phone told me that I wouldn't be able to receive HD channels with a Tivo HD with a cable card! I only want to receive the "Expanded" HD channels. Has anyone else tried to order cable cards in the Ocala/Gainesville, FL area?

Also, I did a channel scan with the Tivo HD and it found the 6 "Limited Basic" HD channels. But the Tivo shows no schedules for those channels. Is that because they need to be "mapped" to the standard Cox channel numbers?


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## shabby46

RumDrinker said:


> If you have had a recent CableCard install within Fairfax, VA area...
> 
> Can you please post whether Cox is using S or M cards, and what manufacturer they are? How was the experience? I'm getting a Tivo HD DVR and hoping that M-cards are used as I'll then only need one of those for both digital tuners within the tivo (multi-stream). I'm hearing conflicting stories between the techs and sales regarding how many cards are required - and of course I can't help them if they don't know what card type they're using.
> 
> Thanks.


I had mine installed back in july and the technician said that the M cards are limited so they rarely have any. I got two S cards instead and have not had any problems with them. The sales woman told me that it looked like I only needed one card when I was on the phone with her, so I assumed that they used M's but when the guy showed up he had two with him. He asked how many I wanted before the install though. It took about 30 min to an hour, but a lot of that was letting the 9.4 update install since I actually had the tech over right around when it was released.

I want to say the cards are motorola, but I do not know why I think that. It could be wrong.

A quick heads up though in case you were unaware, the tech told me that "a few" of the HD channels were SDV so I would miss out on them. What he actually meant was that 22 of the 40 are SDV so I would miss out on over half of them, along with any of the non-hd channels which are now SDV. Ive managed to survive on hopes that the tuning adapter would be here soon, but its getting rough.

This is all in Falls Chuch by the way


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## HarryG

jdos said:


> I got my new Tivo HD last week and set it up on Saturday. Today I called Cox to order the cable card(s). The nice lady that answered the phone told me that I wouldn't be able to receive HD channels with a Tivo HD with a cable card! I only want to receive the "Expanded" HD channels. Has anyone else tried to order cable cards in the Ocala/Gainesville, FL area?
> 
> Also, I did a channel scan with the Tivo HD and it found the 6 "Limited Basic" HD channels. But the Tivo shows no schedules for those channels. Is that because they need to be "mapped" to the standard Cox channel numbers?


I live in Gainesville, and have service with Cox. I have two TIVO HD DVR's, both with a single M card. I continue to receive all Cox SD and HD channels except VOD (Channel 1 and Channel 700.)


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## jdos

HarryG said:


> I live in Gainesville, and have service with Cox. I have two TIVO HD DVR's, both with a single M card. I continue to receive all Cox SD and HD channels except VOD (Channel 1 and Channel 700.)


Thanks for the reply. I will call them again. Did you have any problems when you called to order the cablecards?

Do you mind if I ask what you are paying per month for each M card?


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## ellinj

I seem to recall that there were a few other Cox Rhode Island users here. Anyone having difficulty with AMCHD on channel 750. It is the only channel I am not receiving. Everything else is good. Cox wants to send a service tech but I know that is going to be fruitless.


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## murraymh

I'm here in San Diego

When I called Cox for the install om my tivo hd I asked for an M card, which is what the installer bought - just 1 of them...but the install went just about perfect, and it's still the case some 3 weeks + later

no SDV issues (so far) here with Cox in San Diego


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## shabby46

Are there any other Cox Fairfax users out there? I keep reading about all of the changes that SDV is causing on other systems (TWC, Cablevision, even cox in different locations) and I have yet to see anyone as screwed as myself. I assume that there is nothing wrong with my box and that Cox up here has just gone crazy with the SDV, but I want to make sure.

Right now, among all of the SDV channels, I am missing out on approx. 22 of 40. Not to mention any SD channels like sundance. Over half of the HD is gone now! I admit I do not care about lifetime HD for example, but it seems that everyone else is missing out on one or two and maybe some SD channels like MTV musica or whatever.

I really find this to be quite unacceptable and I am not sure what I am going to do about it, but I just want some input as to if anyone else is in the same situation.

p.s. I am not the biggest NFL fan, but to put NFLHD on SDV as the season is about to start is just wrong. especially when they start broadcasting some of the games.


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## will592

Just thought I'd post a comment here about a positive experience with cox (in phoenix) and the cable card situation. We have never been able to order Pay-Per-View with our cable card. When the cable company would send the 'hit' to unlock the ppv channel, it would crash the cable card and the tivo would die, needing a reboot. Well, some combination of tivo and multi-stream firmware update has fixed the problem. I ordered ESPN gameplan today and it worked flawlessly. I was so scared that it would kill my tivo that I set up a computer in my living room and had a video stream from yahoo going as a backup (we had company coming over to watch football). Well, it was unnecessary and it worked like a champ. I know this isn't 'earth shattering' news but it means that things are getting better. Just thought I'd throw out some positive experience here for people wondering. 

Chris


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## BrianAZ

will592 said:


> Just thought I'd post a comment here about a positive experience with cox (in phoenix) and the cable card situation. We have never been able to order Pay-Per-View with our cable card. When the cable company would send the 'hit' to unlock the ppv channel, it would crash the cable card and the tivo would die, needing a reboot. Well, some combination of tivo and multi-stream firmware update has fixed the problem. I ordered ESPN gameplan today and it worked flawlessly. I was so scared that it would kill my tivo that I set up a computer in my living room and had a video stream from yahoo going as a backup (we had company coming over to watch football). Well, it was unnecessary and it worked like a champ. I know this isn't 'earth shattering' news but it means that things are getting better. Just thought I'd throw out some positive experience here for people wondering.
> 
> Chris


They're not offering a free preview are they? When I tried to get the hockey package last season, the order went through just fine but the day the free preview ended, I could no longer view it via the Tivo and after much argument, Cox gave me a "free" DVR to watch hockey on. I have free in quotes because I had to call them each month and get them to remove charges that should never have been there since it was "free". Each month they said they fixed it, but each month the charges were there again. Returned it the day playoffs moved to regular channels.


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## whafro

shabby46 said:


> Are there any other Cox Fairfax users out there? I keep reading about all of the changes that SDV is causing on other systems (TWC, Cablevision, even cox in different locations) and I have yet to see anyone as screwed as myself. I assume that there is nothing wrong with my box and that Cox up here has just gone crazy with the SDV, but I want to make sure.


You're not alone (I'm in Falls Church on the Fairfax system), but it's not all SDV, apparently.

According to some previous posts, which I think are in this thread, the Fairfax office just doesn't turn on most of those channels for CableCard subscribers. They're apparently not actually SDV channels. I've been playing phone tag for two months now with Cox's VP of Community Relations trying to get an answer (and a "why").

But yeah, I get 703-720 (except a couple in there, like CNNHD), but nothing above that.

My building seems to be the last one in Falls Church City that hasn't been hooked up for fios, but when it is, I see no reason why I'd be sticking with Cox. Maybe that'll change with the tuning resolver, or with someone at the Fairfax office getting a clue, but it seems unlikely.


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## ksalwitz

BrianAZ said:


> They're not offering a free preview are they? When I tried to get the hockey package last season, the order went through just fine but the day the free preview ended, I could no longer view it via the Tivo and after much argument, Cox gave me a "free" DVR to watch hockey on. I have free in quotes because I had to call them each month and get them to remove charges that should never have been there since it was "free". Each month they said they fixed it, but each month the charges were there again. Returned it the day playoffs moved to regular channels.


Hey Brian,
I had the hockey package last season. no problem. not sure why you had issues. I got the "half season package" because we missed the discounted full season package. one service guy that seems to be the area expert tech on tivo/cable cards and the supervisor for the techs in our area (jesse?) told me it should work fine and it did. I'm originally from Philly and it's the only way i get to see my Flyers . i received all of the games on all the appropriate channels.

BTW i got my firmware upgrade like everyone else and have had zero problems since. I checked it the morning everyone reported the upgrade and it was there. We've tried recording a whole bunch o' stuff, two programs at the same time etc. Not one problem or error. When they originally came out to install the first card back in January, they did a lot of work boosting the signal. They worked at the box on the corner outside, the box on the side of my house and went through the attic and re-routed some of the lines. This was the senior tech again that told be i'd be able to get the hockey. He improved the signal strength considerably. This may be why i'm not getting any of the grey/green screen issues that some folks are.

Ken


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## BrianAZ

ksalwitz said:


> Hey Brian,
> I had the hockey package last season. no problem. not sure why you had issues. I got the "half season package" because we missed the discounted full season package. one service guy that seems to be the area expert tech on tivo/cable cards and the supervisor for the techs in our area (jesse?) told me it should work fine and it did. I'm originally from Philly and it's the only way i get to see my Flyers . i received all of the games on all the appropriate channels.
> 
> BTW i got my firmware upgrade like everyone else and have had zero problems since. I checked it the morning everyone reported the upgrade and it was there. We've tried recording a whole bunch o' stuff, two programs at the same time etc. Not one problem or error. When they originally came out to install the first card back in January, they did a lot of work boosting the signal. They worked at the box on the corner outside, the box on the side of my house and went through the attic and re-routed some of the lines. This was the senior tech again that told be i'd be able to get the hockey. He improved the signal strength considerably. This may be why i'm not getting any of the grey/green screen issues that some folks are.
> 
> Ken


I can't stand how everyone gets different answers from them. If they implement SDV though as they say they're going to, I don't imagine it will work this season?


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## phnxhrt

Looking to setup my S3 on Cox with cable cards but was holding off after reading this thread on the troubles in Phx, but looks like there might be a light at the end of the tunnel? Remember the guy that came out to your house as I am in QC right next to Gilbert.

thx,

~Phnxhrt


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## ChrisMc73

JayBird said:


> From another thread...
> 
> Those of us in AZ with M-cards currently have the version 301 firmware, which is what's causing all the partial recording issues here for everyone with a TiVo HD. Those outside of AZ may have a different firmware version.


How can you tell if you have the newest firmware for your cable cards?


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## lofar

Getting two Tivo units from the woot deal hooked up this Saturday. Cox in my area (Santa Barbara/Southern Cal) charges $59.00 for the truck roll for up to two cable cards, and an additional $10 for each cable card after that. Kind of $$ IMO for something a chimpanzee can do. Cards are also $1.99/mo each and they won't give me the first one free. 

Here's to hoping the guy does a good job on saturday with two Tivo HDs.


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## murraymh

lofar said:


> Getting two Tivo units from the woot deal hooked up this Saturday. Cox in my area (Santa Barbara/Southern Cal) charges $59.00 for the truck roll for up to two cable cards, and an additional $10 for each cable card after that. Kind of $$ IMO for something a chimpanzee can do. Cards are also $1.99/mo each and they won't give me the first one free.
> 
> Here's to hoping the guy does a good job on saturday with two Tivo HDs.


ask (insist) cox for the m card...you only need 1 card for each tivo, so you'll save a few bucks on installation & monthly fees

that's how I went in San Diego a month ago & all is well


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## lofar

murraymh said:


> ask (insist) cox for the m card...you only need 1 card for each tivo, so you'll save a few bucks on installation & monthly fees
> 
> that's how I went in San Diego a month ago & all is well


I wish, they don't have M cards here. I've asked several times and even this time when I called to setup the appointment the guy just assumed I needed two, i had to correct him and tell him 4. Which is kind of wierd, because I know that we're now tied in with the San Diego site somehow. Last year or so they moved all their customer service and support and even a lot of equipment down to San Diego, their site up here is little more than a shell these days.


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## lofar

Just an update on my install with Cox. Tech showed up and ended up installing M cards, apparently there is a pretty large disconnect from the customer service phone jockies and the field techs. The tech spent all of about 15 minutes installing the cards on both of my Tivo's with no problems at all.

I did have a bunch of channels disappear on me, but it was apparently because one of the idiots along the way decided I no longer wanted any of my digital services and removed them from the account.. That was resolved quickly over the phone, i now get all cox channel tiers including all HD channels.

I am very, very happy with my Tivo. Should have done this months ago.


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## jfranklin

lofar said:


> Just an update on my install with Cox. Tech showed up and ended up installing M cards, apparently there is a pretty large disconnect from the customer service phone jockies and the field techs. The tech spent all of about 15 minutes installing the cards on both of my Tivo's with no problems at all.


I spent my first three years with Cox as a field tech and these last two as a "phone jocky" and if it's run on your side of the country like it is here then I can tell you that you don't know the half of it. If you think that's bad it's the disconnect between sales and technical that should really scare you.

Though I have a feeling it's like that with any company that does this kind of thing. Each department is trained differently by different people with different end goals in mind. That kind of thing is hard to change.

Glad to hear it went well in the end. Sure it's not my market or "my people" but it is my conpany for better or worse, and I hear far too much of the bad. So any story about it going right makes me happy.


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## BuggyBoyVT

Is anyone having any problems in the OKC market (particularly Yukon)?

A tech (very good one) and I have probably spent about 10 hours now in 2 day going between M cards and S cards in two of my TiVo HD's and keep having issues.

The M cards would show as authorized (CP Auth Received), but could not decrypt any encrypted channels (3 or 4 different M cards tried).

The S cards (we've been through about 6 so far) show as authorized (CP Auth Received), but some channels (HD channels mostly) STILL will only show a black screen.. while other encrypted channels will appear.

I've had tech support send all the repairing and hits they can.. Nothing changed. I am beyond frustrated and about to give up my TiVos to just go to Cox HD DVRs.. Something I REALLY do not want to do because I HATE Scientific Atlanta boxes, and I will loose all the add'l TiVo features. Not to mention a lot of money i've already spent into the TiVo's.. but I am getting to my end point on this.

My signal levels are fine, all the right info is on my COX account (according to many dispatchers and tech support people), and NOTHING SEEMS TO WORK!

Any response would be greatly appreciated!!


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## Roderigo

BuggyBoyVT said:


> The M cards would show as authorized (CP Auth Received), but could not decrypt any encrypted channels (3 or 4 different M cards tried).


"CP Auth Received" is not the same as "authorized." "CP Auth Received" means the cards are properly paired, so if appropriately authorized (a separate step), you'd be able to see copy protected (non-0 CCI) content.

On the cards, you need to check the CA screens, which say whether the card is authorized for the currently tuned channel(s).

Check these two tivo articles. They may provide you some help:

http://www.tivo.com/setupandsupport..._CableCARD_Activation_and_Channel_Issues.html

http://www.tivo.com/setupandsupport...troubleshoot_using_CableCARD_MMI_screens.html


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## BuggyBoyVT

Roderigo said:


> "CP Auth Received" is not the same as "authorized." "CP Auth Received" means the cards are properly paired, so if appropriately authorized (a separate step), you'd be able to see copy protected (non-0 CCI) content.
> 
> On the cards, you need to check the CA screens, which say whether the card is authorized for the currently tuned channel(s).
> 
> Check these two tivo articles. They may provide you some help:
> 
> http://www.tivo.com/setupandsupport..._CableCARD_Activation_and_Channel_Issues.html
> 
> http://www.tivo.com/setupandsupport...troubleshoot_using_CableCARD_MMI_screens.html


The M cards would pair, but would not show Ready where thwy should have.

The S cards hide these diagnostics screens, but other encrypted channels DO appear.

Its almost like COX is running SDV on its HD channels but no one is aware of it!

Its very much like how my TiVos would acrt when I had Cablevision and VOOM channels were moved to SDV. Except with Cablevision, their M cards worked!


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## DrAV123

Dan203 said:


> In most cases the first CableCARD is included in the plan as long as you forego the cable box. So really it's only an extra $8.95. Although that is still pretty high. Maybe what you should do is wait a few months until your cable company starts getting multi-stream CableCARDs. The TiVo only requires one of those, so you'd be able to get dual tuners without any extra charge.
> 
> Dan


Had Cox Cable come out last night and install a multistream card in my HD TiVo. Had problems with receiving HD channels higher than 718. I thought it was something back at the office but the cable guy boosted my signal (still not working) and then replaced the card with another. Success! However he related that it wasn't switching the cards it WAS the office, they forgot to check a box on the Computer that would allow access to channels higher than 718. I still think that they will charge me to for two cards. The multistream card is to save physical space and reduce inventory costs. Cox will still end up charging for 2 digital streams. The whole cox chinese menu of pricing is designed to confuse customers and makes it impossible to figure out how to get what you want at the lowest cost.  But that is why they design it that way... just like the wireless phone companies design their plans.


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## will592

I just got a letter in the mail today from Cox. They told me that they missed their SDV rollout on July 1 and that they were going to go live on Oct 11. They specifically offered Tivo HD and Tivo Series 3 owners with Cable cards a HD DVR at the same $2 per month price for 6 months. They said that the usb dongle will be available sometime this year and they will be made available free of charge to cable card customers. I'm not sure how I feel about this...but I thought I'd post here about it.

Chris


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## lament

will592 said:


> I just got a letter in the mail today from Cox. They told me that they missed their SDV rollout on July 1 and that they were going to go live on Oct 11. They specifically offered Tivo HD and Tivo Series 3 owners with Cable cards a HD DVR at the same $2 per month price for 6 months. They said that the usb dongle will be available sometime this year and they will be made available free of charge to cable card customers. I'm not sure how I feel about this...but I thought I'd post here about it.
> 
> Chris


If you don't fill out your profile and you don't mention it in your post, we don't know where you live (which might help others)..


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## ElPuerco

BuggyBoyVT - I live in Norman, and gave up on CableCard early this year. I keep checking in here to see if it's been fixed, but I'm guessing not. I got fed up with the "disappearing channels" issue, and switched to the Cox DVR. BIG MISTAKE. It's not even in the same league as TiVo, in my opinion.

We got rid of the Cox DVR and have our TiVoHD set up with basic, analog cable (no cablecards) and an HD antenna. TiVo neatly blends the two inputs into one channel grid. That's working well for us, and we're satisfied to stick with that until we see this whole CableCard fiasco has been resolved for at least several months.


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## menos

I'm in Moore, OK. I had to have my CC's replace a few months back. It took about 12 mcards before I finally got one that worked great. So far no problems at all with this one. The disappearing channels problem has been fixed with the newest mcard firmware, we get all the channels (no SDV here).

We finally figured out the problem I was having with the cards not working. According one of the managers or senior techs in the NOC, when the local MSO receives their cable cards they 'check them into' their system into one of two modes. One mode is for their cable boxes(two way mode) and one way is for other devices (one way mode, tivos,tvs, etc). Once the card is in one mode it can't be switched. If it can, no one at the local office knows how or is willing to make the switch. Unfortunately when the techs grab cards, they don't know what mode they were checked in as.


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## Tel Janin

I just got my new TiVo HD XL, and now I get the joy of going through cablecard fun with Cox/Fairfax. Here's hoping!


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## TheLongshot

Tel Janin said:


> I just got my new TiVo HD XL, and now I get the joy of going through cablecard fun with Cox/Fairfax. Here's hoping!


The good thing is the techs in Fairfax seem to be knowledgeable and seem to have a lot of experience installing CableCards.

Do let me know, tho, if they can get an M-Card to work, because they were never able to at my place. I'm still running on two S-Cards and now that my free credit has run out (due to scheduling snafus), I'd like to eliminate the extra fees.

Jason


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## Tel Janin

TheLongshot said:


> The good thing is the techs in Fairfax seem to be knowledgeable and seem to have a lot of experience installing CableCards.
> 
> Do let me know, tho, if they can get an M-Card to work, because they were never able to at my place. I'm still running on two S-Cards and now that my free credit has run out (due to scheduling snafus), I'd like to eliminate the extra fees.


Well, my install is scheduled for tomorrow morning, so I'll let you know.

When I spoke with the CSR, he insisted that they don't use / support / sell / anything M-Cards. Only S-Cards. I told him I was fairly certain that they had M-cards, so he offered to check - but came back to the phone 5 minutes later saying only S-Cards still. *shrug* When the tech is out tomorrow, I'll ask him about it.

On the plus side, they didn't give me any grief at all on the CableCARD order. I spent 30 seconds in the IVR, 3 minutes on hold for a rep, and my conversation went something like this:

Me> I'd like to add a CableCARD to my account
Him> Sure thing!

No upsell to their DVR service or anything, for which I am grateful.


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## ChrisMc73

I'm in Oklahoma City (NW), and I've had my Tivo and cable cards for maybe a year and one half now, but I'm not really happy with it. I have issues all the time...poor performance when just switching channels seems to be my main issue. Who knows how old my cable cards are and what version of firmware etc...I had issues in the beginning with the installers getting them working and finally got these working and have been afraid to touch them or do anything with them since they basically work. The firmware I think is from 2005!

I like the Tivo interface and all, but its not that big a deal to me to overshadow performance and such, I've wanted to look into ATT UVerse, but its not available to my address yet, and the COX DVR isn't that great as all know...


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## nemein

Tel Janin said:


> I just got my new TiVo HD XL, and now I get the joy of going through cablecard fun with Cox/Fairfax. Here's hoping!


Good luck... personally I just dropped Cox and picked up FIOS since about 1/2 the HD channels were unavailable due to the SDV issue (which FIOS doesn't use AFAIK).



> When I spoke with the CSR, he insisted that they don't use / support / sell / anything M-Cards. Only S-Cards. I told him I was fairly certain that they had M-cards, so he offered to check - but came back to the phone 5 minutes later saying only S-Cards still. *shrug* When the tech is out tomorrow, I'll ask him about it.


 Regarding the cards themselves, I know for a fact they at least had M cards since the first two times they came to my house to hook up the Tivo is was w/ M cards and it didn't work... at all. From reading here I finally called them back and asked for the S cards and those "worked" (again w/ about 1/2 the channels inaccessible).


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## Tel Janin

nemein said:


> Good luck... personally I just dropped Cox and picked up FIOS since about 1/2 the HD channels were unavailable due to the SDV issue (which FIOS doesn't use AFAIK).


Oh, I'd order FiOS in a heartbeat. They've got fiber down on three sides of my townhome community, and from what I hear from the maintenance guys, some of the townhouses have FiOS already. I'm still showing up as not available. It's very frustrating - but what can you do?


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## TheLongshot

Tel Janin said:


> When I spoke with the CSR, he insisted that they don't use / support / sell / anything M-Cards. Only S-Cards. I told him I was fairly certain that they had M-cards, so he offered to check - but came back to the phone 5 minutes later saying only S-Cards still. *shrug* When the tech is out tomorrow, I'll ask him about it.


The CSR is wrong. I know because the techs were in my house for a couple of hours trying to get a couple of M-Cards working before they finally gave up and put in a couple of S-Cards.

Jason


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## wierdo

ChrisMc73 said:


> I like the Tivo interface and all, but its not that big a deal to me to overshadow performance and such, I've wanted to look into ATT UVerse, but its not available to my address yet, and the COX DVR isn't that great as all know...


The UVerse DVR seems to have many of the same problems the Cox DVR does, according to my friend. She doesn't care much..I'd be driven nuts by it not recording shows, recording repeats, etc. At least it's not so slow.


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## gplm2008

Cox in Hampton Roads has multistream cards. My two HD Tivos have one each and they work fine. $3.50 mo. ea.


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## shabby46

TheLongshot said:


> The CSR is wrong. I know because the techs were in my house for a couple of hours trying to get a couple of M-Cards working before they finally gave up and put in a couple of S-Cards.
> 
> Jason


when i had the install done back in august (falls church) the Cox guy said that they do have M-cards, but only a limited number, so unless somebody cancels and returns one, you are going to be stuck with the S-cards.


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## Follow Who?

gplm2008 said:


> Cox in Hampton Roads has multistream cards. My two HD Tivos have one each and they work fine. $3.50 mo. ea.


I'm in Hampton Roads as well. Do the cards works well, or are you having problems. I think I'm about to grab an XL, so I'm very interested. Thanks!


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## Tel Janin

Tel Janin said:


> When I spoke with the CSR, he insisted that they don't use / support / sell / anything M-Cards. Only S-Cards. I told him I was fairly certain that they had M-cards, so he offered to check - but came back to the phone 5 minutes later saying only S-Cards still. *shrug* When the tech is out tomorrow, I'll ask him about it.
> 
> On the plus side, they didn't give me any grief at all on the CableCARD order.


So the tech was out this morning with a single S card. It was his first CableCARD install, and he was a bit nervous. When I greeted him, he asked me if I was sure I didn't want their DVR instead... which I declined, of course. He came upstairs, I showed him the TiVo... and he said 'I need two cards, you've got two slots.' I explained that if he had an M-card, we only need one slot. He wasn't sure what kind of card he had. He went out to his truck and returned a few minutes later with a second card.

He slotted the first card, it came up, and he called in to activate it. Apparently they activate the cards by the serial number on the card, and not the card ID from the CableCard ID screen. Go figure. After they got the hostID for the first card, he slotted the second card and had them activate it as well. It took a few minutes for the 'hit' to come through, and then I was able to tune correctly. We checked several channels on the both cards, and things were good. Tech leaves.

So I get in and I'm tuning different channels, seeing everything it could do. The first card is working great, I can see the HD channels that aren't SDV. I go switch tuners, and start flipping through the channels... and the second card is only showing the clearQAM channels (the big four + PBS & CW). I go in and take a look - both cards show as authorized, but I look at the CableCARD info, and my first card has a newer firmware (???.3 from 2006 - at work at the moment) than the second card (???s2 2005). Additionally the second card doesn't agree on some of the detail values (0xffffff, which looks like a default). I gave support a call and asked them to check that both cards were entitled with services, and they told me they could rehit the cards. Then they said 'Wait, this was just activated less than an hour ago, we can't do anything, call back later.' **sigh** So I'll call them when I get home from work tonight and see whats up. The second card does appear to be getting the channel map, and can tune to the clear channels, just... isn't decrypting anything. Ahh, well.


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## Tel Janin

I am writing to report SUCCESS! I followed up with Cox this morning re: my issues with my second S-Card in the previous post. They set up a same day dispatch, and the same tech who was out earlier this week came out again today. Today he was armed with the ever-elusive M-Card. We deslotted both S-Cards and slotted the M-Card. He went through activation with dispatch, and everything came up cleanly. I've now got a single M-Card, and can tune all the digital channels that aren't SDV. Now all we need is Cox to release the tuning adapter, and everything will be perfect.


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## hokiethang

I just had a tech out today to fix a cable card channel tuning issue (long story) and they said the Tuning Resolvers were in Employee Alpha, which means, if the stars align we may see them within 6 months. Wooo!


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## ziggy1122

Just had the installer finish installing the M-Card in my Tivo HD. Install was maybe 20 minutes tops. Install was in the Baton Rouge, Louisiana area.

Recap on what I did to have a speedy install.


Upon receipt of my TiVo HD box I plugged it in and forced a connection to TiVo multiple times, until I got the latest software version. (probably took 4-5 connections and reboots as needed)
Ran through setup and chose a Cable Only install. 
When asked if I had cablecards I answered (I'll get them later)
Contacted Cox and scheduled the install (they roll a truck)
Installer arrived and inserted the M-Card, went to Settings>Cablecard>cablecard decoder>Configure Cablecard 1>cablecard Menu>CableCard Status. 
Installer used his laptop to pair the card and send the hits.
Continually refreshed this status page watching the information download
Did recieve and error, but installer did something to resolve it on his end
 backed out of this menu all the way until the main menu, received a message that the cable input was configured
 tested both tuners with premium channels (HBO, Showtime)
 SUCCESS!


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## carysb7478

Gainesville, FL
Got M-stream installed about 3 weeks ago, tech said they've probably done less than half a dozen of them in the whole area. $1.99/mo for the card, $29.99 for the install. 

I find the install fee a complete rip off since anyone who can setup a tivo themselves should have the brain to put a card in a slot, and was really pissed at the fact that it was "slipped" into my bill. I called Cox once before I got my tivo to make sure they had cable cards in my area and to find out the cost, and again to setup the appointment. Neither time anyone mentioned the install fee, much less the tech. It's not so much the amount, just the fact that no one ever mentioned it before hand.


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## DonnoC

Is anyone in the know about when the USB SDV Tuner will be avialable in the Fairfax area?


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## shabby46

DonnoC said:


> Is anyone in the know about when the USB SDV Tuner will be avialable in the Fairfax area?


I spoke to the cox guy on the phone last wednesday when I was having trouble viewing a few HD channels I was supposed to get and he said that he had no idea and they only find out a couple of days before the public.

Its a shame though as us in the Fairfax area seem to be missing out on a lot more channels than most due to the SDV deployment up here. hopefully that means we will be some of the first to see the device though.


----------



## hokiethang

hokiethang said:


> I just had a tech out today to fix a cable card channel tuning issue (long story) and they said the Tuning Resolvers were in Employee Alpha, which means, if the stars align we may see them within 6 months. Wooo!


They're on the network here, it's just a matter of time now.


----------



## shabby46

I just called Cox and the woman had absolutely no idea what I was talking about. If I wind up missing out on one of these I will be quite angry.


----------



## phetish

just a head's up... 

Cox in Tulsa, OK changed their channel lineup and moved all premium HD channels up to the 800 range.

Need to do a channel list update to get Tivo to correct the channel #'s/


----------



## menos

Same thing here in the OKC market. I ended up calling Cox because 790 (HBOHD) wasn't showing up. All he could suggest was as truck roll. Later that evening I thought to check and see if the channel had changed and sure enough 800 was listed in the channel list page, but with no guide data. Later on I got the message about the update and everything's fine now.
Ticked me off that the CSR had no idea that they had just moved their premium channels.


----------



## Guanton

I am with cox in San Diego. I have a Tivo HD with a multistream card installed that started having issues after 4 weeks. Tivo is sending a replacement unit. When I get
the replacement will I have to get a cox tech to come out to "install" the cable card in the replacement Tivo? It seems to me the only thing the tech did the first time that I couldn't do was physically bring me the card. Since I already have a card I would like to avoid having a tech come out especially if it will result in another installation fee. Can I get the card paired with the new Tivo over the phone?


----------



## phetish

menos said:


> Ticked me off that the CSR had no idea that they had just moved their premium channels.


On Wednesday, the tech who was correcting a botched cablecard install didn't even know that it had been moved. We were both looking for my HBO HD on 790 and trying to figure out why it wasn't working. Luckily I had my Cox DVR still connected due to the botched CableCard install and we figured out that it had been moved.

<sarcasm>The level of communication at Cox is amazing. </sarcasm>

However, Tivo DID already have the lineup change but hadn't pushed it out to everyone yet.


----------



## phetish

Guanton said:


> I am with cox in San Diego. I have a Tivo HD with a multistream card installed that started having issues after 4 weeks. Tivo is sending a replacement unit. When I get
> the replacement will I have to get a cox tech to come out to "install" the cable card in the replacement Tivo? It seems to me the only thing the tech did the first time that I couldn't do was physically bring me the card. Since I already have a card I would like to avoid having a tech come out especially if it will result in another installation fee. Can I get the card paired with the new Tivo over the phone?


It's possible, but the likelihood of a CSR knowing how to do it is pretty low - about on par with the sun going supernova in the next year 

Generally, the techs have access to better trained/more knowledgeable folks back at the call center who can do the pairing, activation, and validation.


----------



## [email protected]

just got a tivo hd, had cox come and install cablecards, worked great until i repeated guided setup and then channels like usaHD, TNTHD all disappeared, so i called cox and they sent a pulse which once again fixed problem for a fex minutes. at that point had cox send out a tech. he arrived and proceeded to tell me some very interesting things:
1. cable cards a going to be gone within the year......apparently cox sued fcc and won, so they are going bye bye
2. cox and tivo are going to give birth to a coxtivo dvr box in the next 2 yrs...
3. apparently cox can send encryption directly to tivohd...only issue is that technically the tivohd is cox's property until when you move or change service you have to bring tivo into cox to have encryption removed...
4. Cox tech have absolutely no idea how to work with cable card.


Christian
Tivo HD
SA 8300HD
Cox Fairfax


----------



## ajwees41

[email protected] said:


> just got a tivo hd, had cox come and install cablecards, worked great until i repeated guided setup and then channels like usaHD, TNTHD all disappeared, so i called cox and they sent a pulse which once again fixed problem for a fex minutes. at that point had cox send out a tech. he arrived and proceeded to tell me some very interesting things:
> 1. cable cards a going to be gone within the year......apparently cox sued fcc and won, so they are going bye bye
> 2. cox and tivo are going to give birth to a coxtivo dvr box in the next 2 yrs...
> 3. apparently cox can send encryption directly to tivohd...only issue is that technically the tivohd is cox's property until when you move or change service you have to bring tivo into cox to have encryption removed...
> 4. Cox tech have absolutely no idea how to work with cable card.
> 
> Christian
> Tivo HD
> SA 8300HD
> Cox Fairfax


I would say the tech has no idea what they were talking about. If Cox did infact sue the FCC and won wouldn't you think cox would have made an anoucement? The only cox property is the cable card.


----------



## BuggyBoyVT

[email protected] said:


> just got a tivo hd, had cox come and install cablecards, worked great until i repeated guided setup and then channels like usaHD, TNTHD all disappeared, so i called cox and they sent a pulse which once again fixed problem for a fex minutes. at that point had cox send out a tech. he arrived and proceeded to tell me some very interesting things:
> 1. cable cards a going to be gone within the year......apparently cox sued fcc and won, so they are going bye bye
> 2. cox and tivo are going to give birth to a coxtivo dvr box in the next 2 yrs...
> 3. apparently cox can send encryption directly to tivohd...only issue is that technically the tivohd is cox's property until when you move or change service you have to bring tivo into cox to have encryption removed...
> 4. Cox tech have absolutely no idea how to work with cable card.
> 
> Christian
> Tivo HD
> SA 8300HD
> Cox Fairfax


That tech was completely and utterly full of BS.

1) CableCard is not going anywhere (it was developed by CableLABS - a consortium put together by the MSOs), if COX even attempted to stop using CableCards on their own they would be sued by customers and the FCC so fast their heads would spin.

2) There has been no formal annoucement of any TiVo/COX relationship. I am pretty sure COX would issue a press release to this effect before telling an installer!

3) COX has no rights to your personal property. EVER!
They *only* have the ability to send decryption information to THEIR CableCards, which the TiVo passes via their Coax RF to the CableCards. They have no ability to control the TiVo in any way, shape, or form.

4) In general, yes.. COX is very disorganized in the CableCard department!


----------



## shabby46

[email protected] said:


> just got a tivo hd, had cox come and install cablecards, worked great until i repeated guided setup and then channels like usaHD, TNTHD all disappeared, so i called cox and they sent a pulse which once again fixed problem for a fex minutes. at that point had cox send out a tech. he arrived and proceeded to tell me some very interesting things:
> 1. cable cards a going to be gone within the year......apparently cox sued fcc and won, so they are going bye bye
> 2. cox and tivo are going to give birth to a coxtivo dvr box in the next 2 yrs...
> 3. apparently cox can send encryption directly to tivohd...only issue is that technically the tivohd is cox's property until when you move or change service you have to bring tivo into cox to have encryption removed...
> 4. Cox tech have absolutely no idea how to work with cable card.
> 
> Christian
> Tivo HD
> SA 8300HD
> Cox Fairfax


most of the HD channels above 721 are now all SDV (about 20 of them) including for example USAHD, so no matter what they do you will not receive them until the tuning adapter arrives.

Be sure to let me know if you do somehow start gettting a few of those though...


----------



## deaddeeds

http://www.fcc.gov/eb/Orders/2008/DA-08-2299A1.html

Announced this week, Cox has to support Cable Card users and provide full content or else provide compensation to those Cable Card Users for content not received.

Expert from a recent fine to Cox.

39. Thus, we order Cox, within ninety (90) days of this NAL and Order, to
issue refunds to CableCARD customers affected by the October 16, 2007
implementation of SDV in its Fairfax County, Virginia cable system.
Specifically, Cox must provide refunds as follows:

a. For former CableCARD customers that began to lease any set-top boxes
from Cox following notice of a possible SDV deployment, Cox must
refund the difference in cost (if any) between the charges for the Cox
set-top boxes and the CableCARDs previously leased by such customers;
and

b. For CableCARD customers that kept their CableCARDs even after notice
of the SDV deployment, Cox must refund the customers' subscriber fees
based on the diminished value of their service following the movement
of linear programming to an SDV platform and reduce their rates on a
going-forward basis accordingly.


----------



## Follow Who?

I just a had a successful TiVo HD install in Hampton Roads, Virginia. I asked for M-Cards on the phone with the CSR, and they did not think they had any. The tech showed up on time with 4 M-Cards in his hand. He was very nice and knew his stuff. He had done several TiVo installs. The first 2 M-Cards were bad - they would not pull any channels, but the 3rd one worked great. He knew enough from previous installs that if a card did not work at first, he just moved on the the next one without wasting time troubleshooting. He was there for about an hour total. I'm thriled to have TiVo back in my life!

I get all of the HD channels except for the 3 junky ones we have in the 800's here (Green Channel, Hallmark movies, and some other "Things No Male Human Being Could Ever Watch" network.) They are adding 5 new HD's next week, all in the 700's, so it will be intersting to see if they show up.


----------



## nemein

> 39. Thus, we order Cox, within ninety (90) days of this NAL and Order, to
> issue refunds to CableCARD customers affected by the October 16, 2007
> implementation of SDV in its Fairfax County, Virginia cable system.
> Specifically, Cox must provide refunds as follows:


I already jumped ship but I wonder if I'll get a partial refund  This was the specific reason I gave them as to why I was bailing...


----------



## lofar

Not sure if anyone here would be able to answer this, but I don't exactly trust cox CSR's to give straight answers so I figured i'd try here first.

I have two TivoHD's with cable cards, working just peachy. I was looking through cox services offered on their sight and looking at my cox bill and became interested in this $7 a month "Digital Service" charge. When I looked up what digital service is on their site they claim it to be On Screen Interactive Program Guide, PPV Access, and Digital Music Channels. When I looked further however, on their HD offering it says HD requires digital service. I'm just wondering what might happen and what I might lose if I drop the digital service since its made up of two functions I cannot use with Tivo and the digital music is worthless to me since I have XM.

By chance does anyone have experiences with this? Are they ripping me off on this $7 digital service now that I have tivo with CCs? This is cox santa barbara if anyone knows specifics in that area.


----------



## jfranklin

lofar said:


> Not sure if anyone here would be able to answer this, but I don't exactly trust cox CSR's to give straight answers so I figured i'd try here first.
> 
> ...
> 
> By chance does anyone have experiences with this? Are they ripping me off on this $7 digital service now that I have tivo with CCs? This is cox santa barbara if anyone knows specifics in that area.


Well I *am* a Cox CSR in Virginia, but I'm pretty sure that this is standard across all markets. There is an option to have limited digital services without paying the digital access fees. It's refered to as 'Buy Through' and it is required by the FCC so that customers, in markets where premium services and PPV are digital only can, order these services without paying for things they do not want. I'm fairly certain that CableCARD falls under this, but HD premiums, and HD expanded channels are not included in that.

Without knowing what channels you currently have I don't know how that would affect you, but seeing that you have the cards in the TiVo I'll assume that you would likely lose a fair number of the channels that you got the HD TiVo for.


----------



## milo99

jfranklin said:


> Well I *am* a Cox CSR in Virginia, but I'm pretty sure that this is standard across all markets. There is an option to have limited digital services without paying the digital access fees. It's refered to as 'Buy Through' and it is required by the FCC so that customers, in markets where premium services and PPV are digital only can, order these services without paying for things they do not want. I'm fairly certain that CableCARD falls under this, but HD premiums, and HD expanded channels are not included in that.
> 
> Without knowing what channels you currently have I don't know how that would affect you, but seeing that you have the cards in the TiVo I'll assume that you would likely lose a fair number of the channels that you got the HD TiVo for.


Jody, any news on the tuning adapter? dunno if you saw the other thread where i posted my email thread w/ Cox csrs, but there's a lot of nothing in their knowledge base in regards to the TA...


----------



## jfranklin

milo99 said:


> Jody, any news on the tuning adapter? dunno if you saw the other thread where i posted my email thread w/ Cox csrs, but there's a lot of nothing in their knowledge base in regards to the TA...


Nope, and nope. This is the only thread I'm still following here. As for the adapters since the sighting of them back in June/July I haven't heard peep one. I asked one of the two supervisors in my department that know anything about them at all, last week, and he just shrugged with his 'f*ck if I know' shrug.

This is by no means official, and is totally my observation, but it seems as though the company is trying to hold out until Tru2Way stuff comes out and just skim over first gen CableCARD all together. I don't think the FCC will let them, and I hope I'm wrong. It's just the feeling I'm getting with how little information is out there, and the run around I get any time I try to get answers from anyone outside of my department.

I'd love to get a S3, but I'm not going to until I'm sure everything is going to work, and right now I can't say that; and my market hasn't even launched SDV yet.


----------



## moyekj

jfranklin said:


> This is by no means official, and is totally my observation, but it seems as though the company is trying to hold out until Tru2Way stuff comes out and just skim over first gen CableCARD all together.


 I don't think so since at least in my market (Cox, Orange County, CA) they have been deploying Motorola DCH series set top boxes with CableCARD. On the other hand similar to Cox VA market, trying to get any information on status of Tuning Adapters seems impossible. As a matter of fact just trying to get more information on SDV which was supposed to have been deployed here months ago (a letter sent to customers and certain channels kept out of CableCard lineup) is also going nowhere. As far as I can tell the SDV deployment here seems to have hit a snag and been delayed.


----------



## jcaudle

Well Folks, Cox has done it again. I got a letter today from them today concerning programming changes according to the envelope. I was hoping it was information concerning the tuning adapter. Well that was at the bottom of the letter....that it would be issued later this year. However with no date for issuing the adapter, the letter went on to say that they are transferring over 50 channels in the 200-400 series (non HD Channels) to SDV. They offered deals on digital or HD set top boxes so that you could get these channels...big freaking deal since the tivos can't record any of them, Military, Sundance, Science Channel, BBC America are some of them. They take them away before the *&(*(*(** tuning adapter is here. Jerks. I want FiOS.


----------



## jcaudle

Well Folks, Cox has done it again. I got a letter today from them today concerning programming changes according to the envelope. I was hoping it was information concerning the tuning adapter. Well that was at the bottom of the letter....that it would be issued later this year. However with no date for issuing the adapter, the letter went on to say that they are transferring over 50 channels in the 200-400 series (non HD Channels) to SDV. They offered deals on digital or HD set top boxes so that you could get these channels...big freaking deal since the tivos can't record any of them, Military, Sundance, Science Channel, BBC America are some of them. They take them away before the *&(*(*(** tuning adapter is here. Jerks. I want FiOS.


----------



## TiVoJerry

jcaudle said:


> Well Folks, Cox has done it again. I got a letter today from them today concerning programming changes according to the envelope. I was hoping it was information concerning the tuning adapter. Well that was at the bottom of the letter....that it would be issued later this year. However with no date for issuing the adapter, the letter went on to say that they are transferring over 50 channels in the 200-400 series (non HD Channels) to SDV. They offered deals on digital or HD set top boxes so that you could get these channels...big freaking deal since the tivos can't record any of them, Military, Sundance, Science Channel, BBC America are some of them. They take them away before the *&(*(*(** tuning adapter is here. Jerks. I want FiOS.


If you could send me a PM, I'd love to get a copy of that letter to pass along to a few interested parties over here.


----------



## fishnose

I got the same letter from Cox.

As it seems to be making the same "offer" (replace your cable card with a HD box from Cox with short term (6 mos) special pricing or a standard digital receiver with short term (1 yr) special pricing) that seems to have failed to impress the FCC the last time (when the FCC decided that pricing needed to be adjusted for the cable card users with reduced services), I wonder what if anything is going to ever bring Cox around.

For the FCC order:
http://www.fcc.gov/eb/Orders/2008/DA-08-2299A1.html (HTML)
http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-08-2299A1.pdf (PDF)


----------



## milo99

TiVoJerry said:


> If you could send me a PM, I'd love to get a copy of that letter to pass along to a few interested parties over here.


i have it posted and linked in this thread 
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=408897


----------



## milo99

fishnose said:


> I got the same letter from Cox.
> 
> As it seems to be making the same "offer" (replace your cable card with a HD box from Cox with short term (6 mos) special pricing or a standard digital receiver with short term (1 yr) special pricing) that seems to have failed to impress the FCC the last time (when the FCC decided that pricing needed to be adjusted for the cable card users with reduced services), I wonder what if anything is going to ever bring Cox around.
> 
> For the FCC order:
> http://www.fcc.gov/eb/Orders/2008/DA-08-2299A1.html (HTML)
> http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_public/attachmatch/DA-08-2299A1.pdf (PDF)


oh yea.. i already submitted a complaint to the FCC online, referencing that order. We'll see


----------



## jfranklin

moyekj said:


> I don't think so since at least in my market (Cox, Orange County, CA) they have been deploying Motorola DCH series set top boxes with CableCARD. On the other hand similar to Cox VA market, trying to get any information on status of Tuning Adapters seems impossible. As a matter of fact just trying to get more information on SDV which was supposed to have been deployed here months ago (a letter sent to customers and certain channels kept out of CableCard lineup) is also going nowhere. As far as I can tell the SDV deployment here seems to have hit a snag and been delayed.


Cox is deploying the DCH series converters in every Motorola market, just as they are deploying the SA equivalents (8300C,8240C,4250C, and 4240C) in all of their SA markets. They have to, FCC said that unless special dispensation was granted due to technological hardship or financial hardship (which was only really for small companies) all cable companies had to deploy converters with separable security (ie: CableCARD). Once Tru2Way hardware is available to consumers I see the already non-existent support for current CableCARD devices from all cable companies become even less so, if that's actually possible.

As I understand it the whole point of the ruling from the FCC was to try and force providers to work more cooperatively with CableCARD and as such give the end user an experience more on par with that of end users that opted for the set top that the provider was offering. That would in theory create a viable third part set top market place. Until two way communications is possible that will not happen. And since the set tops that Motorola and SA came up with look just like the old ones to the headends, nothing changed.

Unless a converter makes it out of the warehouse without having the card paired to the converter then there's no difference what so ever in how the provider deals with that converter, and if that should happen (at least with Cox in VA) the standard procedure is to reclaim that converter, get a properly paired one in the customer's home, then correct the pairing problem on the back end. In the call center I work in I am one of only a handful of people on the phones that know how to pair a card, and most of that handful I taught how to do it.

There is no parity, and there won't be with this level of the technology if the industry can help it. The providers want out of the CPE business, of that you can be sure, it's a money looser; but they don't want out until Tru2Way (OCAP) hardware is out there, because they don't want to lose the interface control, the branding, and the revenue from PPV/OD ordering.

As for SDV deployment in your area being delayed I don't know why. I know in the Hampton Roads market in VA it's waiting for plant upgrades to be finished. It'll be in my market soon, though. The channel mapping data already has hints to channels that will get it first. Then as has been stated NoVA is getting it in force.

Nice to see that letter, though. It hasn't even been circulated around the call center here, and we're the ones that will be fielding the calls about it, because technical seems to be the catchall of every question the customer has.


----------



## TheLongshot

jfranklin said:


> Nice to see that letter, though. It hasn't even been circulated around the call center here, and we're the ones that will be fielding the calls about it, because technical seems to be the catchall of every question the customer has.


You know, after dealing with Cox for years, I'm really convinced that they are being run by a bunch of idiots. No offense to you, but I feel like every time I deal with customer service lately that I get the keystone cops.

Course, the last time I had to deal with them I ended up getting a couple months free because they screwed things up so badly (they missed appointments twice and took 2-3 hours screwing with an M-Card before installing two S-Cards.)

With this letter, I'm getting to the end of my rope with Cox. Verizon might be getting a call from me soon.

Jason


----------



## milo99

jfranklin said:


> In the call center I work in I am one of only a handful of people on the phones that know how to pair a card, and most of that handful I taught how to do it.
> 
> ....
> 
> Nice to see that letter, though. It hasn't even been circulated around the call center here, and we're the ones that will be fielding the calls about it, because technical seems to be the catchall of every question the customer has.


It's funny you mention that. I don't doubt it for a minute. i've had the same issue w/ my cablecard lineup both when i first got service and after i added showtime. Only 1 of the cards had the full service. i had to call tech support multiple times to get it resolved.

This time (the showtime addon), the first tech really had no clue what cable cards were about, and i wasted a good 45 minutes on the phone going through reboots. She wanted to have a truck roll. I held off, and called back a week later. This time, i got a guy that knew his stuff. He instantly saw that only 1 of the cards had the full programming, so in 5 minutes he was able to resolve the problem, with no reboot.

While i had him on the phone, i asked him if he knew anything about SDV and the TA. He knew about SDV but not the TA. and then he said something interesting-

that Cust Service or sales knows about new stuff well before tech support, even though most people would think talking to tech support we'd get answers to these questions. And he expressed the same concern you did- that people call tech support and you guys aren't given any info to help people out.

must be frustrating for you guys who actually try to stay on top of things


----------



## jcaudle

We are surrounded by Comcast in most of the DC Metro area. To bad they aren't in Fairfax, given the idiocy of Cox.


----------



## deaddeeds

Well both Cox and Comcast are horrible with customer service. They dont have to please their customers because they sign these exclusive contracts with the localities. I used to live in Prince William County so I have dealt with both and the grass is not greener on the other side. Competition with Verizon will hopefully make Cox realize that customer service does really matter. I for one will leave Cox for Verizon as soon as FIOS comes to my neighborhood.


----------



## jcaudle

deaddeeds said:


> Well both Cox and Comcast are horrible with customer service. They dont have to please their customers because they sign these exclusive contracts with the localities. I used to live in Prince William County so I have dealt with both and the grass is not greener on the other side. Competition with Verizon will hopefully make Cox realize that customer service does really matter. I for one will leave Cox for Verizon as soon as FIOS comes to my neighborhood.


Well at least if you had direct competition....anyway I see Verizon trucks doing installation a little over a mile from my house, and yet they aren't due in Lorton for another 2 years.


----------



## lofar

deaddeeds said:


> Well both Cox and Comcast are horrible with customer service. They dont have to please their customers because they sign these exclusive contracts with the localities. I used to live in Prince William County so I have dealt with both and the grass is not greener on the other side. Competition with Verizon will hopefully make Cox realize that customer service does really matter. I for one will leave Cox for Verizon as soon as FIOS comes to my neighborhood.


I'm with you there. They have a monopoly in my area too, which means bad service and high prices. I love comparing their prices in my area to their prices in their other areas, i pay about $10-$15 a month more than many of their other areas. And they treat me like crap. I'm just glad that i've been able to cut down their monthly bill from about $150/mo to less than $70 a month by switching to verizon for phone and DSL and getting tivo for DVR service. Bundle your services to save money my ass. Cox is NOT my friend in the digital age.


----------



## jfranklin

TheLongshot said:


> With this letter, I'm getting to the end of my rope with Cox. Verizon might be getting a call from me soon.


While I obviously would hate to lose you, or anyone as a customer. You all pay my bills. I understand your need to do what is best for you, and if any company you're dealing with can't provide you with the level of service you expect I don't know anyone that would fault you for find another company that did.

As a whole the customer service (technical anyway, I can't speak for the other departments as I'm not in them, though I was a field tech for three years and I like to still think of myself as 'one of them' too) we offer is rather good. Unfortunately when going beyond the 'every day' problems the training just isn't there. I do try. I ran one HSI/Phone training class about a month ago, and assisted another. I've done some video refresher classes, and helped produce the current video troubleshooting document (for Motorola hardware) which is slowing being distributed to the floor. I had my hands tied when it came to CableCARD, though. I was explicitly told that the only information I could provide in the document was what would apply to our own converters because they don't actually want us dealing with the cards. I don't know why.



milo99 said:


> It's funny you mention that. I don't doubt it for a minute. i've had the same issue w/ my cablecard lineup both when i first got service and after i added showtime. Only 1 of the cards had the full service. i had to call tech support multiple times to get it resolved.
> 
> ...
> 
> that Cust Service or sales knows about new stuff well before tech support, even though most people would think talking to tech support we'd get answers to these questions. And he expressed the same concern you did- that people call tech support and you guys aren't given any info to help people out.
> 
> must be frustrating for you guys who actually try to stay on top of things


Improper balancing is one of the most common problems we deal with outside of tiling for video. So many different departments deal with order entry, and the training doesn't seem to be on pair across all departments. I know that is changing, and it will be equal eventually, but until it is stuff like that does fall through the cracks. The changes that have been made to the order entry system has helped reduce some of those problems, though. I do appreciate your patience with the issue, even if it was frustrated patience.

And yes, he was partly right. It does seem that sales knows about changes before technical does. I follow a thread on another board for Cox customers in my area only, and we have a regular poster who works in on of the service centers. I get most of my information from him. As in he posts it to the forum sometimes days to a week before it gets circulated to the technical call center. I also get a fair amount of information from the field operations website which I still have access to. Sometimes things show up there a month or more before 'we' get them.

I get that we're probably fed the information when the powers that be think we need it. Problem is that somewhere along the line the timing is getting messed up.


----------



## Follow Who?

I've got a TiVo HD in the Cox Hampton Roads market. This past weekend they added several new HD channels, all of which showd up on my CableCard Equipped TiVo. Not only that, but all of the HD cannels they were previously holding back showed up as well! So I now have the full compliment of HD channels on my TiVo! It was only 3 junky channels they were holding back anyway, but it nice to see them show up.


----------



## milo99

Follow Who? said:


> I've got a TiVo HD in the Cox Hampton Roads market. This past weekend they added several new HD channels, all of which showd up on my CableCard Equipped TiVo. Not only that, but all of the HD cannels they were previously holding back showed up as well! So I now have the full compliment of HD channels on my TiVo! It was only 3 junky channels they were holding back anyway, but it nice to see them show up.


well now that's interesting. i know they were doing this in a couple other markets, but didn't know it was spreading to VA.


----------



## jfranklin

milo99 said:


> well now that's interesting. i know they were doing this in a couple other markets, but didn't know it was spreading to VA.


Remember Hampton Roads has not yet deployed SDV, so the only thing preventing certain channels from coming through is if there are still pending upgrades in the given city. Such as in my city (Chesapeake) which only parts of are upgraded, so even though my neighborhood was done almost 10 months ago I still can't get but about half of the HD channels that are available in my market. *shrug*

Of course I'm still on a series 2, so my recorded HD doesn't look much different from my SD. Seeing that I'm not home most of the time to watch live, I don't much care. Hoping to get a series 3 by mid next year, though.


----------



## Sandi

I have Cox. Omaha. and will be calling today to get cable card (s). Any hints to help things go smoothly very much appreciated.

Thanks

Sandi


----------



## Follow Who?

Sandi said:


> I have Cox. Omaha. and will be calling today to get cable card (s). Any hints to help things go smoothly very much appreciated.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Sandi


Sandi,

My installer had done quite a few TiVo's. He came in with 4 M-Cards in his hand. He sat down and put the first card in and called to activate. When it did not work right away, he immeadiatly pulled it out and went on to the second card. The third was the winner. The short version is that he figured out with his experience if it does not work right away, it's not gonna work. He did not waste time trying to troubleshoot for 30 minutes on each card.

By the way - by not working I mean that the first card showed no channels. The second card had some channels, only about half of them. The third card, everything showed up right away, including my premium movie channels.


----------



## kurt711

Cox techs have been trying to install cablecards in my TivoHD for past week without success. First tech had 3 M-cards, each one did firmware upgrade, get authorized and showed all channels I'm supposed to receive but no picture on any of them. Second tech came few days later and this time I had asked to bring couple S-cards as well. Tech tried 2 m-cards with same results as before. Both checked signal levels(all close to 100&#37 and ran line from street just to make sure but nothing worked. 
The S-cards are in my tivo right now, both authorized but no picture. Another odd thing with s-card is that i get clear QAM channels on s-card1 but no picture on s-card2. I got Tivo involved but they can't see whats wrong either. 
This tivo worked fine for almost year and half on comcast motorola m-card so don't think its the slots or tivo but never know.
Anyone else seen anything like this or have any ideas to fix this? Appreciate any help. Thanks.


----------



## GerryFR

I can tell you what I did to get my cable cards working: Once the cards were installed, I went through the Tivo setup again. I have found that Tivo seems to need to reconfigure the Tivo unit for the new cards and this requires going through setup and then rebooting. I also have found that if my cable provider has made a major channel change, that I sometimes have to restart the unit to be able to access the channels. 

I also found that in the past my cable company (Cox) had trouble with several HD channels. The service man would always try out my receivers on those channels to be sure I could receive them. He also found that one of my cable inputs had a filter on it that would wipe out some of my digital channels. There was no record of this filter with Cox. Some of channels continued to be intermittent until some recent service updates (and more HD channels) were added. I found having a cable company DVR helped me to know were the problem was (cable or Tivo). I found both units (Cox & Tivo) had problems with the same channels. I also found that both units were very affected by the type of cable being used. I bough some good quality RG6 cable for use with these units and found that the center conductor on the cable was so sturdy that it did not bend easily and I could wipe out a number of channels by just flexing the cable. I always connect the Tivo directly to the cable input when troubleshooting problems because I have found very uneven results when hooking it up to the output of a bidirectional amplifier. I get it working right out of the wall and then add splitters or amplifiers to see what happens.


Jerry


----------



## AZrob

Hi all,

I am considering getting a 2nd Tivo here in Phoenix. The current amount I pay for the Cox service is $5.00 for the Digital Gateway service and $2.00 for the M-card in my one Tivo HD. Can anyone confirm what I suspect is the case, that a 2nd Tivo with an M-card will only cost me $2.00 more per month? 

Thanks,

Rob from AZ


----------



## Sandi

I know this is probably a silly question, in fact I have two.

After reading all the horror stories about cable cards becoming unpaired I'm leery of doing anything that might cause problems.

I would like to replace a long coax cable with a shorter one but I don't want to mess up what appears to be working fine. Should I have a problem if I switch cables?

2nd question I think I know the answer to but I thought I would ask anyway.

Our main TV will be replaced soon with an HDTV and my husband will insist on PIP as he can't watch TV without it. With a dual tuner TIVO will we still need something else with another tuner for his 2nd picture? In other words it doesn't appear that we could view the 2 TIVO tuners on two different TV inputs.

Suggestions appreciated.

Thank you

Sandi

Omaha Cox
New HD TIVO owner


----------



## Shawn95GT

AZrob said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I am considering getting a 2nd Tivo here in Phoenix. The current amount I pay for the Cox service is $5.00 for the Digital Gateway service and $2.00 for the M-card in my one Tivo HD. Can anyone confirm what I suspect is the case, that a 2nd Tivo with an M-card will only cost me $2.00 more per month?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Rob from AZ


I'm 99% certain you'll have to pay the digital gateway fee as well. For the longest time they were charging me the DGF for each card .


----------



## AZrob

Shawn95GT said:


> I'm 99% certain you'll have to pay the digital gateway fee as well. For the longest time they were charging me the DGF for each card .


You mean, I will go from paying $7.00 a month to $14.00? I didn't think you had to pay the Gateway fee more than once per home....

Rob


----------



## Shawn95GT

AZrob said:


> You mean, I will go from paying $7.00 a month to $14.00? I didn't think you had to pay the Gateway fee more than once per home....
> 
> Rob


You'd pay it per cable box if that helps. It was a fight in the beginning to get them to call 2 S-card in a single Tivo 1 DGF.


----------



## AZrob

Shawn95GT said:


> You'd pay it per cable box if that helps. It was a fight in the beginning to get them to call 2 S-card in a single Tivo 1 DGF.


Okay, I found a CSR who seemed to know the score. I will be paying $4.00 more per month.

That's:

$2 for the Digital Gateway for the 2nd Tivo
$2 for the cable card in the Tivo

All in all, it could have been worse. They don't charge the $5 again for the Digital Gateway for the second device in the home...just $2.

Thanks for replying...

Rob


----------



## lasergecko

AZrob said:


> Okay, I found a CSR who seemed to know the score. I will be paying $4.00 more per month.
> 
> That's:
> 
> $2 for the Digital Gateway for the 2nd Tivo
> $2 for the cable card in the Tivo
> 
> All in all, it could have been worse. They don't charge the $5 again for the Digital Gateway for the second device in the home...just $2.
> 
> Thanks for replying...
> 
> Rob


Freaking stupid ass Cox Cable. Give me the name of that CSR so I can get the same deal.

In Las Vegas, I'm paying TWO full gateway fees; one for each of the cards in my Series 3. The Las Vegas CSRs are bunch of jackasses. If I have to hear ONE MORE TIME about how I'm "saving money" by paying twice what other people do, I'm going to shoot someone.


----------



## AZrob

lasergecko said:


> Freaking stupid ass Cox Cable. Give me the name of that CSR so I can get the same deal.
> 
> In Las Vegas, I'm paying TWO full gateway fees; one for each of the cards in my Series 3. The Las Vegas CSRs are bunch of jackasses. If I have to hear ONE MORE TIME about how I'm "saving money" by paying twice what other people do, I'm going to shoot someone.


Wow...good luck. Let's hope they don't say that you pay more than Phoenix Cox users because Las Vegas is....different. That's a favorite comeback....

Rob


----------



## deaddeeds

I posted this in another thread but wanted to pass along my success.

Well I called Cox three times this morning. On the third try I got somebody who spoke english and knew what a TiVo was and they have corrected my account!!!


----------



## jay_winter

Sandi said:


> I know this is probably a silly question, in fact I have two.
> 
> [1] I would like to replace a long coax cable with a shorter one ...
> Should I have a problem if I switch cables?
> 
> [2] With a dual tuner TIVO will we still need something else with another tuner for his 2nd [P-I-P] picture? In other words it doesn't appear that we could view the 2 TIVO tuners on two different TV inputs.
> 
> Sandi


Hi Sandi,

[1] That should most definitely NOT be a problem.
[2] You are correct. For PIP you'd need to use one tuner in the TV and the other from the TiVo or a (dare I say it?) VCR!


----------



## Sandi

Thanks, Jay.

Appreciate the answers. 

Sandi


----------



## Plasticman

AZrob said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I am considering getting a 2nd Tivo here in Phoenix. The current amount I pay for the Cox service is $5.00 for the Digital Gateway service and $2.00 for the M-card in my one Tivo HD. Can anyone confirm what I suspect is the case, that a 2nd Tivo with an M-card will only cost me $2.00 more per month?
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> Rob from AZ


I have Cox in the New Orleans area one card in the TV and two cards in the Tivo series 3 HD. Cox charges me $5.97 for the cards and $17.97 for Digital service and 3 Digital gateways.


----------



## brosenkrantz

Has COX in Phoenix provided any tuning adaptors for TIVO with cable cards so we can get the channels that moved to switched video?


----------



## Rolow

no they will be but they haven't started yet. I think the last letter I got said end of the year but it dose not look like that's going to happen.


----------



## jcaudle

Rolow said:


> no they will be but they haven't started yet. I think the last letter I got said end of the year but it dose not look like that's going to happen.


Cox in Northern Virginia just started giving out the adapters this week, after finishing beta testing...They work great. We use the Cisco/Scientific Atlanta Equipment here. Hopefully you guys will get them soon....We have been with out new Hd channels for a year now since they started SDV in Sept 2007.


----------



## delgadobb

lasergecko said:


> Freaking stupid ass Cox Cable. Give me the name of that CSR so I can get the same deal.
> 
> In Las Vegas, I'm paying TWO full gateway fees; one for each of the cards in my Series 3. The Las Vegas CSRs are bunch of jackasses. If I have to hear ONE MORE TIME about how I'm "saving money" by paying twice what other people do, I'm going to shoot someone.


I'm in Vegas, too, only on regular cable (expanded basic) for now. I'm going to be getting my TIVO HD & I'm in no rush to deal with the nightmare to come. I may just use the HD as a dual-tuner TIVO for a while.

The Las Vegas CSRs have told me that I'll have to pay a 'digital gateway fee' for each outlet, as well as $2 ($1.99, I think) per cable card. I mentioned I'll have a TIVO HD & want M cards, they insist they don't exist. (Despite the fact I know other Las Vegas Cox customers have them.) When I say 'per outlet', I mean they're telling me I'll get charged TWO digital gateway fees per TIVO HD (one for each tuner).

So, when all is said & done, it will cost me about $5 for digital gateway fee ($4.95?) per tuner & $2 ($1.99?) per cable card (S card, since the M's "don't exist"). $5 times two tuners & $2 per tuner for cable cards = $14 (roughly) per TIVO. The CSR's quote "You're saving money compared to the cable box." ????

What seems sensible is to charge me one digital gateway fee (I don't pay extra for additional analog lines, once I pay for digital why should I pay for it again at each outlet?) Then, charge me $2 for each M-card - that's $9 a month instead of $28 - quite a significant difference. Keep in mind I don't agree with paying ONE digital gateway fee once I'm already paying for digital, but I'm assuming that's going to be hard to get.

Sooo, I'm in no rush to get my two TIVO HDs with lifetime service (that's about $1200 spent with TIVO), since they'll (in theory) cost me another $28/month through Cox. I'd think stuff like this would be an issue to TIVO, since in theory it's costing them revenue. In my case, it's not just costing them money in theory - it's costing them money in tangible terms.


----------



## Rolow

jcaudle said:


> Cox in Northern Virginia just started giving out the adapters this week, after finishing beta testing...They work great. We use the Cisco/Scientific Atlanta Equipment here. Hopefully you guys will get them soon....We have been with out new Hd channels for a year now since they started SDV in Sept 2007.


Its nice to here there working. Where lucky most of our sdv channels are Spanish language and the odd ball stuff.


----------



## Bodie

Rolow said:


> It's nice to hear they're working. We're lucky most of our SDV channels are Spanish language and the oddball stuff.


----------



## djwilso

Bodie said:


> It's nice to hear they're working. We're lucky most of our SDV channels are Spanish language and the oddball stuff.


Thanks for converting that into readable English for us.

Dennis


----------



## Free

I got a tech this morning (who came out to troubleshoot my signal strength issue) who said that Cox was moving away from cable cards all together. He said they are very close to not allowing any new CC's going in, and saving the limited inventory of CC's they have for existing customer maintainance.


----------



## ajwees41

Free said:


> I got a tech this morning (who came out to troubleshoot my signal strength issue) who said that Cox was moving away from cable cards all together. He said they are very close to not allowing any new CC's going in, and saving the limited inventory of CC's they have for existing customer maintainance.


I'll believe it when I see it. FCC fines are comming.


----------



## Kershek

Free said:


> I got a tech this morning (who came out to troubleshoot my signal strength issue) who said that Cox was moving away from cable cards all together. He said they are very close to not allowing any new CC's going in, and saving the limited inventory of CC's they have for existing customer maintainance.


Lovely. Chalk one up for less consumer options! It's not like we have another choice that uses cablecards.


----------



## Supermurph

Free said:


> I got a tech this morning (who came out to troubleshoot my signal strength issue) who said that Cox was moving away from cable cards all together. He said they are very close to not allowing any new CC's going in, and saving the limited inventory of CC's they have for existing customer maintainance.


The guy didn't know what he was talking about. It's not up to Cox. Moving away from CableCard would be illegal.


----------



## badfish

Free said:


> I got a tech this morning (who came out to troubleshoot my signal strength issue) who said that Cox was moving away from cable cards all together. He said they are very close to not allowing any new CC's going in, and saving the limited inventory of CC's they have for existing customer maintainance.


 I had a cable card installed last week and the tech told me the same thing. He said that the tech are not carrying them with them. Thats why he sat in front of my house for two hours waiting for a tech to bring him a card and excuse him.

He also said that we would be stuck with the HD channels that are available now. We would not receive any new channels when they come available.

I had to call support that night because i wasn't receiving any HD channels that were not network based. The tech that i talked to on the phone said that it wasn't true. That we would be able to call up and have are card reconfigured.


----------



## Free

Cox doesn't seem to care what is "legal" or not. Perhaps they have done some cost calculations and feel that paying fines (if one was actually ever levied against them) would be cheaper than dealing with all the CC issues.

I have had several techs out over the past few weeks, due to a signal problem. None of them came with cable cards, they have indicated that they are hard to come by, especially the S cards the Series 3 needs, and that Cox is trying to discourage installs.


----------



## westcoastexport

I bought a TiVo HD DVR for my in-laws in Fairfax Station for Christmas. They have Cox and this is my story of the installation. 

Called Cox on 12/26 to request installation of M-Card and Tuner Adaptor (TA) and they offered to come out on 12/27. Rescheduled fror 12/29. 

They arrived in their scheduled time and brought an M-card and TA. Unfortunately, my in laws had no wireless adaptor nor had I run set-up for TiVo so we rescheduled for 12/31. I took the unit home and ran set-up using my wireless adaptor. 

They again showed up again on time but this time, they didn't bring the TA even though I had begged the first installer to leave it behind. This person was able to install the M-Card and promised to return on 1/2. He came back as scheduled on 1/2 with the TA, however, the TA wasn't recognized because the software was 8.1 and required 9.4 to work. After more than 2.5 hours, he had to go. I spent 75 minutes on the line with TiVo getting them to "force" a connection. It still didn't work - same 8.1 software. My father in law got on the phone with them after I left and they were successful getting software version 11.0 to load. When it did, the TA worked (it didn't have to be "set-up" as the Cox tech person thought). My in laws now have all channels available through Cox and are happy to get away from the Cox DVR that they weren't comfortable with. 

Lessons learned:

- You need to ask the right questions when scheduling the installation - Thx to everyone here. 
- You need to make sure you have a wireless adaptor at the time on installation
- You need minimum software of 9.4 with 11.0 or recent version optimal
- You need to complete set-up in advance, and that still doesn't mean you won't have to do it again
- TiVo service staff are really good and stay with you and are very helpful
- Cox too was very accomodating and reasonably knowledgeable.

Thanks again to everyone for their insight and experience in helping others to minimize the pain.


----------



## badfish

I dont under stand why you needed the wire less adapter for the installation of the cable card? I used my phone line and it worked just fine.


----------



## badfish

Is there any way to get PPV UFC fights on HD cable card Tivo?


----------



## ajwees41

badfish said:


> I dont under stand why you needed the wire less adapter for the installation of the cable card? I used my phone line and it worked just fine.


maybe phoneline not close enough.


----------



## frogger22

badfish said:


> Is there any way to get PPV UFC fights on HD cable card Tivo?


No you can't. The CableCard (even with a TA) does not permit you to purchase any PPV content.


----------



## ajwees41

frogger22 said:


> No you can't. The CableCard (even with a TA) does not permit you to purchase any PPV content.


that is wrong. It should work if you can call in and order the PPV.


----------



## Timber

ajwees41 said:


> that is wrong. It should work if you can call in and order the PPV.












-=Tim=-


----------



## wierdo

I finally got CCs for my THD in Tulsa over the weekend. (I've had them in my S3 for almost 2 years now)

It took far more time than it should have because of issues getting them to pair. The interesting thing is that unlike the first time, they had no problem getting them to take the authorization hits, so I could receive all the channels that weren't copy protected, but getting the person at the headend to get the pairing information right took several hours.

And it still takes 5 cards to find 2 that will work. My installer brought 3, and ended up having to go get a couple from another installer.

I have to say, though, that my installer was a real trooper. He arrived before 2PM on Saturday and didn't leave until around 8:30 (he had to run a new line to the pole and clean up some wiring), when it was working.

One very nice thing about using cablecards is that Cox won't send out contractors with them, so you always get an employee.


----------



## alansh

For what it's worth, my experience with Cox in Phoenix has been pretty good. I waited to order until after the [thread=399534]firmware update fiasco[/thread] was resolved.

The order taker at Cox had goofed up the order, so the tech had to make a second visit with the cable cards. He had two M-cards, but since this is an HD, we only used one. There was a long delay while the card updated its firmware to 401. Once that was complete, and the tech called in the host ID, everything has been fine. I haven't had any reboots or dropped recording.

Every so often I do see some pixelation, but that may be the broadcast itself. The only other hangup is the SDV channels, but at least so far there's not much on them I'm interested in. The new HD channels introduced at the end of the year came in fine.


----------



## ksalwitz

Has anyone received a TA from Cox in the Phoenix area? I've got the hockey package and i have to watch the games in the bedroom...not the best place to have beer and popcorn . BTW i've had my updated M-card in my hd tivo for several months (since the patch was sent out) and have had no problems related to the firmware fiasco.


----------



## djwilso

ksalwitz said:


> Has anyone received a TA from Cox in the Phoenix area? I've got the hockey package and i have to watch the games in the bedroom...not the best place to have beer and popcorn . BTW i've had my updated M-card in my hd tivo for several months (since the patch was sent out) and have had no problems related to the firmware fiasco.


Nothing that I have heard of yet. I guess that whole 'before the end of the year' stuff was just wishful thinking.

Luckily, none of the HD channels that I watch are SDV currently, so it is not a big issue for me yet.

Dennis


----------



## amyflick

ksalwitz said:


> Has anyone received a TA from Cox in the Phoenix area? I've got the hockey package and i have to watch the games in the bedroom...not the best place to have beer and popcorn . BTW i've had my updated M-card in my hd tivo for several months (since the patch was sent out) and have had no problems related to the firmware fiasco.


I'm not in Phoenix, but I have the center ice package. I can't watch any of those channels with the tuning adapter. According to Cox, this is the result of a bug in the TA and should be fixed with a patch that will be pushed to the TA sometime around mid Jan. We'll see, I have my doubts.


----------



## Supermurph

ksalwitz said:


> Has anyone received a TA from Cox in the Phoenix area? I've got the hockey package and i have to watch the games in the bedroom...not the best place to have beer and popcorn . BTW i've had my updated M-card in my hd tivo for several months (since the patch was sent out) and have had no problems related to the firmware fiasco.


I'm not an expert, but I'm pretty sure the TA has no impact on interactive features such as PPV and OnDemand. It just allows you to receive SDV channels. I think I read that on the Tivo page that describes the TA. I can try to find that if it matters.


----------



## ajwees41

Supermurph said:


> I'm not an expert, but I'm pretty sure the TA has no impact on interactive features such as PPV and OnDemand. It just allows you to receive SDV channels. I think I read that on the Tivo page that describes the TA. I can try to find that if it matters.


it will only do SDV


----------



## Tel Janin

Howdy,
I stopped off at the Cox office in Herndon this morning and picked up a tuning adapter. Was in and out in under five minutes. Can't wait to hook it up tonight. Will report how it goes.
-Tel​


----------



## rorien_chan

I have been silently following this thread for a while and finally decided to contribute. I have been struggling with Cox since February 08 to get the service I am paying for on my Tivo. In addition to Cable Card issues everyone else seems to be having they have over billed me many times since I updated to HD service. After months of trying to make something work, and losing channels due to the SDV rollout, I finally filed an FCC complaint. In October 08 I contacted the Cox Resolutions Department through the BBB. The reply I received said Cox had already filed a purchase order for quantities of the tuning adapters. In November 08 I received a letter that was the response to my FCC complaint. In addition to false information about my account (that I was not being charged for a High Def Receiver, which I don't have in the first place), the letter said I would be invited to beta test the tuning adapter "in the coming weeks". I have spoken with about 20 different tech support reps since October and no one has any idea what a tuning adapter is. I tried contacting the resolutions department again and it seems like I am being ignored. Al I have experienced is Cox's lack of knowledge or them trying to misdirect me. The only way I can get any answers from them is by being angry and threatening them with the FCC. I have no other choice for cable service in the North Phoenix area. If one became available I would jump at the chance. I see others in Phoenix have TAs, what do I need to say to them to get one?


----------



## Tel Janin

Tel Janin said:


> I stopped off at the Cox office in Herndon this morning and picked up a tuning adapter. Was in and out in under five minutes. Can't wait to hook it up tonight. Will report how it goes.


Hooked the device up following the instructions, called in to Cox, got it activated automatically via the IVR, and it's working great. TiVo picked it right up once I connected it via USB, and I'm able to receive all of the SDV channels.



rorien_chan said:


> If one became available I would jump at the chance. I see others in Phoenix have TAs, what do I need to say to them to get one?


I can't speak for Phoenix, but I called my local Cox franchise (NoVA/Fairfax; numbers on their site and on the bill) and ended up talking to someone about a service change. After identifying myself, and they asked what they could do for me today, I indicated that I had heard that they had Tuning Adapters finally, and what would I have to do to get my hands on one? There was a pause, and the response was to go to the local office and pick one up. I asked for clarification - this could be self installed, as the CableCARDS had to be installed by Cox? They responded, yes, it can be self installed. I asked if the office nearest me, mentioned by address, had them, and they confirmed that yes, indeed, that office had them. I then grabbed my coat and my keys, and drove to said office. I pressed the button for 'technical assistance', was called almost immediately, and asked for a Tuning Adapter. They verified my account info, verified I had a single CableCARD, and went and grabbed a Tuning Adapter, noted some info in the computer, and handed it over. In and out of the office in less than 5 minutes. There was a Cox-produced glossy inside the box on how to self-install the Tuning Adapter, the manufacturer-issed install instructions, and a copy of a print out involving basic troubleshooting steps that had been identified during the beta program (or the laser printer was running low on toner, one of the two).

Anyways, far more information than you wanted, I'm sure, but my experience. Good luck, sir or madam, on acquiring your tuning adapter.


----------



## JimjimH

I have cable cards in 2 of my HD units. Haven't installed any in my third as yet. The techs had so many problems installing them I'm afraid I'll have problems with the third unit because its at the end of a longer cable run. Signal strength and other factors are so critical with digital. 
I'm also still waiting for Cox Phoenix to start issuing tuning adapters!


----------



## komadori

I'm new to TiVo and thinking about buying a refurbished TiVo HD. I'm using a Cox HD DVR right now and trying to figure out if if it's worth switching to TiVo. Can anyone in the Oklahoma City area help me make a right decision? First, is there anyone who is using a TiVo HD successfully with Cox SA CableCards in the Oklahoma City area? I was told by customer service that they only have S-Cards, so I have to use 2 cards for my TiVo HD. Is this true? Second, what would be the costs of renting and installing CableCards, and any other one-time and/or monthly fees associated with using TiVo HD in the Oklahoma City area? I think if I can have a TiVo HD with similar or less monthly costs to the costs of having Cox HD DVR (I'm paying $5.25 for renting HD/DVR receiver and $11.99 for DVR service), it's worth it. Thanks a bunch in advance.


----------



## Dubrau

rorien_chan said:


> I have been silently following this thread for a while and finally decided to contribute. I have been struggling with Cox since February 08 to get the service I am paying for on my Tivo. In addition to Cable Card issues everyone else seems to be having they have over billed me many times since I updated to HD service. After months of trying to make something work, and losing channels due to the SDV rollout, I finally filed an FCC complaint. In October 08 I contacted the Cox Resolutions Department through the BBB. The reply I received said Cox had already filed a purchase order for quantities of the tuning adapters. In November 08 I received a letter that was the response to my FCC complaint. In addition to false information about my account (that I was not being charged for a High Def Receiver, which I don't have in the first place), the letter said I would be invited to beta test the tuning adapter "in the coming weeks". I have spoken with about 20 different tech support reps since October and no one has any idea what a tuning adapter is. I tried contacting the resolutions department again and it seems like I am being ignored. Al I have experienced is Cox's lack of knowledge or them trying to misdirect me. The only way I can get any answers from them is by being angry and threatening them with the FCC. I have no other choice for cable service in the North Phoenix area. If one became available I would jump at the chance. I see others in Phoenix have TAs, what do I need to say to them to get one?


I just read your comments with great interest. We waited until Nov 08 to purchase our hd tivo recorder because of the problems with the cablecards last summer. Our multistream card works fine but we were not getting the new hd channels being offered. I finally called yesterday to fin out why and needless to say, the tech staff gave me several contradicting reasons. I finally asked for a tech staff to visit. He said that they were getting away from cablecards and that those of us with cablecards would not be getting the new hd channels. I asked him about the TA and he had never heard of it. He called and asked his top guy about the TA. That guy never heard of it either but claimed that a "two way" cable card would be available down the road...they just don't know when. Sounds like "vapor ware" to me. I just heard that Direct TV is negotiating a deal with Tivo. We are in Surprise, AZ (NW side of Phoenix).


----------



## DrDatabase

Going Crazy in Orange County!! I'm losing HD channels on my m-stream card that has worked without any problems for the last year. Channels 714, 750, 754, 755, 761 went away today. Calls into to CS and no solution yet. I wonder if this is some switched video side effect going on here. Anybody know when the tuning adapter is rolling out in Orange County?


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## jcaudle

Dubrau said:


> I just read your comments with great interest. We waited until Nov 08 to purchase our hd tivo recorder because of the problems with the cablecards last summer. Our multistream card works fine but we were not getting the new hd channels being offered. I finally called yesterday to fin out why and needless to say, the tech staff gave me several contradicting reasons. I finally asked for a tech staff to visit. He said that they were getting away from cablecards and that those of us with cablecards would not be getting the new hd channels. I asked him about the TA and he had never heard of it. He called and asked his top guy about the TA. That guy never heard of it either but claimed that a "two way" cable card would be available down the road...they just don't know when. Sounds like "vapor ware" to me. I just heard that Direct TV is negotiating a deal with Tivo. We are in Surprise, AZ (NW side of Phoenix).


Cox issued tuning adapters here in N. Virginia starting on Dec 11th. They were going to take more digital channels to switch them to SDV originally on Dec 2nd. A lot of us contacted Fairfax County and they (Cox) agreed to delay the loss of more channels until the adapter was out. Not sure why you guys haven't been issued them yet. The county was very helpful as was Cox's local VP for Governmental Relations. You might contact your local regulator...before they office of consumer protection got involved we weren't able to find out anything from Cox. Good Luck.


----------



## moyekj

DrDatabase said:


> Going Crazy in Orange County!! I'm losing HD channels on my m-stream card that has worked without any problems for the last year. Channels 714, 750, 754, 755, 761 went away today. Calls into to CS and no solution yet. I wonder if this is some switched video side effect going on here. Anybody know when the tuning adapter is rolling out in Orange County?


 It's more channels than that (at least for me). I called in today as well and got some information, but no resolution. See the local AVS forum thread:
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?p=15612266#post15612266

If you get any more info on this please post here or there. All those channels still don't tune for me and if one believes the CSR they are not supposed to be SDV (yet).


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## gcw07

komadori said:


> I'm new to TiVo and thinking about buying a refurbished TiVo HD. I'm using a Cox HD DVR right now and trying to figure out if if it's worth switching to TiVo. Can anyone in the Oklahoma City area help me make a right decision? First, is there anyone who is using a TiVo HD successfully with Cox SA CableCards in the Oklahoma City area? I was told by customer service that they only have S-Cards, so I have to use 2 cards for my TiVo HD. Is this true? Second, what would be the costs of renting and installing CableCards, and any other one-time and/or monthly fees associated with using TiVo HD in the Oklahoma City area? I think if I can have a TiVo HD with similar or less monthly costs to the costs of having Cox HD DVR (I'm paying $5.25 for renting HD/DVR receiver and $11.99 for DVR service), it's worth it. Thanks a bunch in advance.


I just got a Tivo HD for Christmas and while it took a while to install the cablecards (around 4 hours), it has been worth it. I was upgrading from a series 2. They do have M-Cards. The customer service guy on the phone said the same thing to me that they only had S-Cards, but when the installation guy showed up, he had M-Cards and said the customer service person didn't know what they were talking about. Now, the installation tech had 2 M-Cards and 4 S-Cards. He tried for around 2 -3 hours to get the 2 M-Cards working and was never able to. He got the first S-Card working in a couple minutes and then we had a bad S-Card in the 2nd slot, so we tried another S-Card and it worked great. So I ended up with 2 S-Cards instead of a single M-Card, but it was working so I didn't really care 

After I got mine working, I have been loving it so much that I convinced my mother to upgrade her series 2 to a Tivo HD. That installation went a little worse then mine. Took around 3 hours on the first day and they could not get the 2 different M-Cards to work that night. They came back the next day and it took around 5 hours, but they were eventually able to get it working. Again the M-Cards were not working and again they ended up installing 2 S-Cards. It seems that they don't have nearly as much problems with the S-Cards as they do with the SA M-Cards. However, after all the hassle it is worth it even if they end up installing 2 S-Cards.

As for the prices of installation and monthly fees. The installation fee was $40. The monthly fee is $1.99 per card so for 2 of them if they do end up installing S-Cards, it will be $3.98. Now you will still have the digital service/digital gateway fee ($5.50). If you have any other questions, feel free to PM me or post a reply here. It is worth it and I'm already considering switching out another of my Tivo boxes for another Tivo HD's.


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## moyekj

DrDatabase said:


> Going Crazy in Orange County!! I'm losing HD channels on my m-stream card that has worked without any problems for the last year. Channels 714, 750, 754, 755, 761 went away today. Calls into to CS and no solution yet. I wonder if this is some switched video side effect going on here. Anybody know when the tuning adapter is rolling out in Orange County?


Problem is now fixed, so obviously there was something messed up on headend side. I can tune all the following now:
706, 714, 725, 730, 731, 733, 741, 755, 761, 782, 790

NOTE: These have never been made available to CableCard devices for whatever reason and that is still the case: 732, 753, 772

Anyhow, glad I don't have to worry about this anymore.


----------



## wierdo

gcw07 said:


> I just got a Tivo HD for Christmas and while it took a while to install the cablecards (around 4 hours), it has been worth it. I was upgrading from a series 2. They do have M-Cards. The customer service guy on the phone said the same thing to me that they only had S-Cards, but when the installation guy showed up, he had M-Cards and said the customer service person didn't know what they were talking about. Now, the installation tech had 2 M-Cards and 4 S-Cards. He tried for around 2 -3 hours to get the 2 M-Cards working and was never able to. He got the first S-Card working in a couple minutes and then we had a bad S-Card in the 2nd slot, so we tried another S-Card and it worked great. So I ended up with 2 S-Cards instead of a single M-Card, but it was working so I didn't really care
> 
> After I got mine working, I have been loving it so much that I convinced my mother to upgrade her series 2 to a Tivo HD. That installation went a little worse then mine. Took around 3 hours on the first day and they could not get the 2 different M-Cards to work that night. They came back the next day and it took around 5 hours, but they were eventually able to get it working. Again the M-Cards were not working and again they ended up installing 2 S-Cards. It seems that they don't have nearly as much problems with the S-Cards as they do with the SA M-Cards. However, after all the hassle it is worth it even if they end up installing 2 S-Cards.
> 
> As for the prices of installation and monthly fees. The installation fee was $40. The monthly fee is $1.99 per card so for 2 of them if they do end up installing S-Cards, it will be $3.98. Now you will still have the digital service/digital gateway fee ($5.50). If you have any other questions, feel free to PM me or post a reply here. It is worth it and I'm already considering switching out another of my Tivo boxes for another Tivo HD's.


They don't have M-Cards in Tulsa, FWIW. I was told this both on the phone and by multiple techs.

It's still a less expensive than the Cox DVR, especially after the upcoming rate increase. (In my case, it's a whole lot less expensive, since I have one box on lifetime so the other is only $6.95/mo for TiVo service)


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## gcw07

wierdo said:


> They don't have M-Cards in Tulsa, FWIW. I was told this both on the phone and by multiple techs.
> 
> It's still a less expensive than the Cox DVR, especially after the upcoming rate increase. (In my case, it's a whole lot less expensive, since I have one box on lifetime so the other is only $6.95/mo for TiVo service)


Yeah, I was talking about the OKC area, Norman specifically which do have M-Cards, but they seem really buggy at best. But yeah, like you said, even with 2 S-Cards, it is cheaper then using their boxes with their crappy interfaces.


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## techman36

I just spoke to a rep here in Phoenix and she told me that they will be either shipping out or notifying users with Cable Cards on their accounts in February. She said they haven't not worked out the method yet, but it should be happening sometime next month. Apparently they do have them, but they are working out how to get them out and users should be notified shortly.

Hope this helps.


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## rorien_chan

Just spoke with an extremely helpful Tivo Rep and 3way called Cox. Cox rep said no TAs as of yet and they don't know when they will be available.  Cox Rep said to call billing about refunding me for unreceived channels. I did that 2 months ago and they said they couldn't. No one over at Cox has the same info.


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## Goofball

Cox television just made my crap that is not worth what I pay list of services I can be saving money on every month. I'll be calling and e/snail-mailing them to voice my displeasure with what looks like every channel above ~20 being set as CCI=0x02 on my CableCards. I'm giving them until the end of February to restore CCI to 0x00 and my ability to use MRV and TTG on non-premium content channels before I cancel my service and use an alternative.

Thankfully this also supposedly stops people with Cox leased set tops from copying to their PCs via FireWire or I'd be so mad right now I'd be driving down to the nearest Cox store to throw my CableCards and other equipment through their windows.

*I suggest that everyone else who has a TiVo with CableCards on Cox as a provider contact them via every possible method and strongly express your displeasure with this change in copy protection policy, even if it hasn't been done in your area yet. Knowing Cox you'll all be in the same boat as myself and others shortly.*

I can't stand being treated like a criminal when all I want to do is move shows around my house or copy them to a portable device or my laptop to watch when I am out of town.


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## Kershek

An alternative? Oh, you mean Cable America, the only alternative that they bought out?

It's a good thing monopolies are illegal here. Oh, wait.


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## Goofball

Kershek said:


> An alternative? Oh, you mean Cable America, the only alternative that they bought out?
> 
> It's a good thing monopolies are illegal here. Oh, wait.


The only alternative I really "need" at this point is PBS for my daughter so I can just go with OTA and be ok. Part of my alternative plan should I need it is to put some of the savings towards a NetFlix sub and switch over to watching movies where I was watching TV before.

That's where I doubt that Cox gets it. TV for most people is a luxury item. It's nice but I sure as hell don't need it and I am not going to pay them every month to get treated like a criminal.


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## nightdesigns

techman36 said:


> I just spoke to a rep here in Phoenix and she told me that they will be either shipping out or notifying users with Cable Cards on their accounts in February. She said they haven't not worked out the method yet, but it should be happening sometime next month. Apparently they do have them, but they are working out how to get them out and users should be notified shortly.
> 
> Hope this helps.


I spoke with them yesterday and I was told that it's now an unknown release date. Atlanta still hasn't given the okay to start shipping them to the customers.

All of the newer HD channels are SDV. I'm missing about 10 channels that I would get with the resolver.


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## tivocrazy

Seems like you guys in Arizona are having the same problem I had in Hampton Roads, Virginia last spring with not being able to transfer content from one Tivo to another due to the copyright protection flag. When Cox had me switch from a single multi-stream card to two single stream cards that fixed the problem. Are you using Motorola cards out there in Arizona?


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## Rolow

No where on SA


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## tivocrazy

When I had my problem Cox told me that the cable card manufacturer was the one that set the copyright protection code and not them. Of course, I did not care WHO set the code but wanted it fixed which is why they had me try the single cards. You need a higher level of Cox support to contact SA to find out what they are doing about fixing it.


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## JayBird

Goofball said:


> Cox television just made my crap that is not worth what I pay list of services I can be saving money on every month. I'll be calling and e/snail-mailing them to voice my displeasure with what looks like every channel above ~20 being set as CCI=0x02 on my CableCards. I'm giving them until the end of February to restore CCI to 0x00 and my ability to use MRV and TTG on non-premium content channels before I cancel my service and use an alternative.
> 
> Thankfully this also supposedly stops people with Cox leased set tops from copying to their PCs via FireWire or I'd be so mad right now I'd be driving down to the nearest Cox store to throw my CableCards and other equipment through their windows.
> 
> *I suggest that everyone else who has a TiVo with CableCards on Cox as a provider contact them via every possible method and strongly express your displeasure with this change in copy protection policy, even if it hasn't been done in your area yet. Knowing Cox you'll all be in the same boat as myself and others shortly.*
> 
> I can't stand being treated like a criminal when all I want to do is move shows around my house or copy them to a portable device or my laptop to watch when I am out of town.


I filed a complaint with the FCC on this issue. The response from Cox was pretty clear that they aren't interested in removing the copy protection bits. I think they would rather lose all of us TiVo customers than have to keep supporting us.


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## ksalwitz

ajwees41 said:


> it will only do SDV


Well I certainly hope not. As soon as they made the switch to SDV I lost the hockey package on my HD Tivo. Worked fine prior to that.


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## jcaudle

ksalwitz said:


> Well I certainly hope not. As soon as they made the switch to SDV I lost the hockey package on my HD Tivo. Worked fine prior to that.


One more reason to go to FiOs when it becomes available.


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## ajwees41

ksalwitz said:


> Well I certainly hope not. As soon as they made the switch to SDV I lost the hockey package on my HD Tivo. Worked fine prior to that.


maybe it got switched to sdv.


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## Goofball

tivocrazy said:


> When I had my problem Cox told me that the cable card manufacturer was the one that set the copyright protection code and not them. Of course, I did not care WHO set the code but wanted it fixed which is why they had me try the single cards. You need a higher level of Cox support to contact SA to find out what they are doing about fixing it.


The CableCard manufacturer has nothing to do with it. The CCI setting comes either set by the program distributor per program or is set on the cable head end per channel. Cox, at least in my area of Phoenix has decided to set CCI=0x02 on all of the channels in what amounts to the extended basic tier and up on their head end.


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## LynnL999

And the cable operators whinge and moan about how much internet traffic is taken up by bittorrent. Maybe if they had reasonable standards for copy protection, people wouldn't illegally download quite so much.

Why is Cox being so difficult about this? Are they just shills for the entertainment industry now? Are they their customers, or are the people who actually pay for their service?


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## Supermurph

nightdesigns said:


> I spoke with them yesterday and I was told that it's now an unknown release date. Atlanta still hasn't given the okay to start shipping them to the customers.
> 
> All of the newer HD channels are SDV. I'm missing about 10 channels that I would get with the resolver.


Actually, none of the new HD channels in AZ are SDV. They're just doing a slow roll out. I live in Scottsdale and receive all of the new HD channels as of last month (CNNHD, SciFiHD, GreenHD, etc.). You have the channels on your guide because Tivo's guide provider does not distinguish between the different areas of the Phoenix area. You should get the HD channels soon and I'd guess that Cox should be able to tell you when.


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## Supermurph

JayBird said:


> I filed a complaint with the FCC on this issue. The response from Cox was pretty clear that they aren't interested in removing the copy protection bits. I think they would rather lose all of us TiVo customers than have to keep supporting us.


If anybody gets any success even having a reasonable conversation with Cox on this, please post the method on this board. I tried about a month ago and I couldn't even get to anybody that understood how it worked.


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## rorien_chan

JayBird said:


> "I think they would rather lose all of us TiVo customers than have to keep supporting us."


This if from a letter from Cox, which was in response to my BBB complaint regarding unequal service to my non-cable company device.

"you are part of a very small group of customers currently limited by their one-way devices"

It seems to me that the amount of posts here regarding cable cards and tuning adapters this group is not "very small". Every contact I have had from higher ups at Cox has been very condescending, and usually they include incorrect information regarding my account. The only help I have gotten is directly from Tivo, or when I have Tivo 3-way call Cox with me. I have filed both BBB and FCC complaints, and only got a little more cooperation when I mentioned filing a second FCC complaint. I can tell they would rather lose us than support us, but non-support is a violation of Federal law, which they have already been taken to task for in a few states. I just don't know what it will take to get what I'm paying for out of them. Last week they called me to offer me a "deal" on telephone service. I almost up and cancelled everything right then and there, but I can't live without high speed internet and cable TV.


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## djwilso

Supermurph said:


> Actually, none of the new HD channels in AZ are SDV. They're just doing a slow roll out. I live in Scottsdale and receive all of the new HD channels as of last month (CNNHD, SciFiHD, GreenHD, etc.). You have the channels on your guide because Tivo's guide provider does not distinguish between the different areas of the Phoenix area. You should get the HD channels soon and I'd guess that Cox should be able to tell you when.


I agree. I have the new HD channels as well so they are not SDV. I have read that they will be available valley-wide here in the Phoenix metro area by the end of May at the latest.

Dennis


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## teevoenaz

I was told by a rep in Phx that they didn't carry M-Cards. I have my install tomorrow. We'll see.


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## JayBird

teevoenaz said:


> I was told by a rep in Phx that they didn't carry M-Cards. I have my install tomorrow. We'll see.


The reps don't know squat. It's been quite a while now that Cox abandoned using S-cards. Nowadays, the techs _only _ have M-cards.


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## Kershek

I have an M-card in mine. I avoided S-cards because I heard there was a synch issue.


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## Jedara

Cox Cable guy installed M-card and digital tuner last night. We had software downloading problems that I won't go into. The end result is that I have the updated software and I am receiving most of the channels but some of them (such as the CW or Lifetime) are not coming through. I get a grey screen and a message that it's searching for signal: cable in.

Reset tivo this morning, no improvement.

Checked signal strength on the grey channels: no signal.

Checked channels for digital tuner, no problem there. Checked channels for cable card, no channels available. Is the M-card the problem? In other diagnostics, it looks like there's nothing wrong with it except for the fact that there are no channels when I use the "check channels" feature.

Went through set-up again. No help.

Removed m-card, rebooted, reinserted m-card, rebooted. No improvement.

Cable guy scheduled to return tonight. Any advice on what he should do? Do I need a new M-card, a new digital tuner? Did something go wrong with the installation of either?

Feeling pressed for time here (I'm at work), so I apologize if something doesn't make sense. Thanks!


----------



## Follow Who?

Jedara said:


> I am receiving most of the channels but some of them (such as the CW or Lifetime) are not coming through. I get a grey screen and a message that it's searching for signal: cable in.


I think you just need them to try a new CableCard. When I had my install my first M-Card had the grey screen (GSOD anyone?!?!) on all channels. He went right to a second card and then only a few channels had the grey screen. So he went to a third card and then we got the problem channels OK, but then others had a grey screen. The fourth card was the charm. All worked and have since.

Our guy didn't mess around. he said he had done quite a few TiVo's and the second everything was not perfect he didn't bother to troubleshoot, he just moved on the the next card. He said in his experience that was the best way to do it. He came to my house with four cards in his hand and said he had more on the truck if necessary.


----------



## Jedara

Jedara said:


> Cox Cable guy installed M-card and digital tuner last night. We had software downloading problems that I won't go into. The end result is that I have the updated software and I am receiving most of the channels but some of them (such as the CW or Lifetime) are not coming through. I get a grey screen and a message that it's searching for signal: cable in.
> 
> Reset tivo this morning, no improvement.
> 
> Checked signal strength on the grey channels: no signal.
> 
> Checked channels for digital tuner, no problem there. Checked channels for cable card, no channels available. Is the M-card the problem? In other diagnostics, it looks like there's nothing wrong with it except for the fact that there are no channels when I use the "check channels" feature.
> 
> Went through set-up again. No help.
> 
> Removed m-card, rebooted, reinserted m-card, rebooted. No improvement.
> 
> Cable guy scheduled to return tonight. Any advice on what he should do? Do I need a new M-card, a new digital tuner? Did something go wrong with the installation of either?
> 
> Feeling pressed for time here (I'm at work), so I apologize if something doesn't make sense. Thanks!


Update:

The Cox cable guy installed a new M-card and a new digital tuner. The M-card works, however, the digital tuner is not working fully. I think this is why I'm receiving most of my channels but not some (such as the CW, Lifetime, and Nickelodeon.) He did not know what else to do and asked his supervisor to call me today (no call so far).

Has anyone else experienced this problem with the Cox digital tuner? Where some of the channels are grey and you get a message saying "searching for signal in cable in"?


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## teevoenaz

JayBird said:


> The reps don't know squat. It's been quite a while now that Cox abandoned using S-cards. Nowadays, the techs _only _ have M-cards.


Well, I had my install yesterday. Everything went well. He did indeed have an M-Card. It took ~ 2 hours for him to get all the channels working but they are there (Even HD). So far, so good.:up::up:


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## deaddeeds

Jedara said:


> Update:
> Has anyone else experienced this problem with the Cox digital tuner? Where some of the channels are grey and you get a message saying "searching for signal in cable in"?


Check out the Fairfax County TA Forum!
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=412065&page=10


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## Jedara

SUCCESS! The Cox cable technician returned this morning with a new black cord. He'd done some research and learned that sometimes there's a problem with the cord that attaches the TA to the TiVo box and it doesn't grab all the channels, thereby resulting in a grey screen and the message: searching for signal in cable in.

Once he replaced the cord, all the channels appeared. HD channels, too! It also looks like I can dual-record using the one M-card, which is something I couldn't do before he replaced the cord.

I am reluctant to post the technician's name but I have to say: he was terrific. Patient, polite, and persistent. He could easily have left that first visit, once everything was installed, and left me to setup and discover the problems on my own. But he didn't want to close the job until he sure everything was working as it should. He said that he'd have his supervisor call me next week to double-check everything and that he'd ask his supe to offer me HBO or Cinemax as compensation for my trouble.


----------



## Sandi

Had a technician here for signal quality problem. When here he ended up having to re-pair the cable cards on one TIVO (other is/was fine) as the analog channels were missing. digital and Premium channels still worked. After he left we realized that HBO was gone. Called today to have them resend the signal which did not fix the problem and they are sending someone out. While the tech was trying to get it to work over the phone he informed me that cable cards would only be around for about another year and the next year the "Cable Cards 2.0" would be out and that nothing that now accepts cable cards will be able to accept the new cards. 

Does he actually know what he is talking about, our TIVOs will not be able to accept new cable cards when they are out?

I'm with Cox Omaha.

Thanks

Sandi


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## wierdo

Sandi said:


> Had a technician here for signal quality problem. When here he ended up having to re-pair the cable cards on one TIVO (other is/was fine) as the analog channels were missing. digital and Premium channels still worked. After he left we realized that HBO was gone. Called today to have them resend the signal which did not fix the problem and they are sending someone out. While the tech was trying to get it to work over the phone he informed me that cable cards would only be around for about another year and the next year the "Cable Cards 2.0" would be out and that nothing that now accepts cable cards will be able to accept the new cards.
> 
> Does he actually know what he is talking about, our TIVOs will not be able to accept new cable cards when they are out?
> 
> I'm with Cox Omaha.
> 
> Thanks
> 
> Sandi


He doesn't know what he's talking about. It may be that Cox Omaha will be rolling out M-Cards (they don't have them in Tulsa), but that won't make your old cards stop working, it'll just give you the option of using only one card in a TiVo HD.


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## cliffdwelling

I am having a huge problem with Cox Cable in Tucson. They canceled a third time on me today. Yeah, that's right, three times I have made an appointment to install cable cards and they have an excuse everytime on why they can't get to me. I don't know what to do anymore. 

The first scheduled time they called after I had waited 2:45 minutes and said the tech didn't have the right card on the truck and needed to reschedule for the following day. The next day I waited an hour and called to make sure they were coming and they said that they did not have me scheduled. Today they didn't show and when I called after the two hour wait and asked why they couldn't make it, and the guy said they had tried to call( was home the whole time) and didn't get an answer so they canceled. I asked why they didn't just show up, they replied they didn't know if I had a Tivo or a TV that needed a cable card, and that they did not have a tuning adapter on truck. 

I believe they are making excuses for some reason, and I can't figure out what the problem is and they won't give me a straight answer. What can I do? Help!!


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## jcaudle

cliffdwelling said:


> I am having a huge problem with Cox Cable in Tucson. They canceled a third time on me today. Yeah, that's right, three times I have made an appointment to install cable cards and they have an excuse everytime on why they can't get to me. I don't know what to do anymore.
> 
> The first scheduled time they called after I had waited 2:45 minutes and said the tech didn't have the right card on the truck and needed to reschedule for the following day. The next day I waited an hour and called to make sure they were coming and they said that they did not have me scheduled. Today they didn't show and when I called after the two hour wait and asked why they couldn't make it, and the guy said they had tried to call( was home the whole time) and didn't get an answer so they canceled. I asked why they didn't just show up, they replied they didn't know if I had a Tivo or a TV that needed a cable card, and that they did not have a tuning adapter on truck.
> 
> I believe they are making excuses for some reason, and I can't figure out what the problem is and they won't give me a straight answer. What can I do? Help!!


If they cancel, you can get them for a $20 service credit on each canceled visit....call customer service.


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## drey

cliffdwelling said:


> I am having a huge problem with Cox Cable in Tucson. They canceled a third time on me today. Yeah, that's right, three times I have made an appointment to install cable cards and they have an excuse everytime on why they can't get to me. I don't know what to do anymore.
> 
> The first scheduled time they called after I had waited 2:45 minutes and said the tech didn't have the right card on the truck and needed to reschedule for the following day. The next day I waited an hour and called to make sure they were coming and they said that they did not have me scheduled. Today they didn't show and when I called after the two hour wait and asked why they couldn't make it, and the guy said they had tried to call( was home the whole time) and didn't get an answer so they canceled. I asked why they didn't just show up, they replied they didn't know if I had a Tivo or a TV that needed a cable card, and that they did not have a tuning adapter on truck.
> 
> I believe they are making excuses for some reason, and I can't figure out what the problem is and they won't give me a straight answer. What can I do? Help!!


I'm in Tucson too. Cox uses contractors to install TiVo cards, most of those contractors have no idea what TiVo is. Ask for a phone number of the guy who will be coming and talk to him or his supervisor directly.

Also, as other posted suggested, deman Cox to issue you a credit for their cancellation.

-- Andrey


----------



## cliffdwelling

jcaudle said:


> If they cancel, you can get them for a $20 service credit on each canceled visit....call customer service.


Yes, I had requested the credit and they have said it is pending.Thanks

But today (Sunday) they called out of the blue and showed up around three to install 2 Scientific Atlanta cards into two separate HD tivos. No problem with the cards, but when I asked the guy if I needed a tuning adapter for the SDV-he said he didn't know what I was talking about.
I really did not pursue it except explain what I knew about SDV and that it was being used in Phoenix and believed it was deployed in Tucson. He then acknowleged that he did know what I was talking about but didn't seem to want to go any further in the discussion. I dont know if it was because he didn't want to seem uneducated or the fact that he said at first -"He didn't know what I was talking about".
I still am trying to learn all this by myself, because Cox definitely hasn't given any help in understanding what to expect.
I am not getting all of my channels for sure.
I don't even know what channels I should get.


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## Supermurph

cliffdwelling said:


> No problem with the cards, but when I asked the guy if I needed a tuning adapter for the SDV-he said he didn't know what I was talking about.


In the Phoenix area you can pick up the Tuning Adapters at the Cox Digital Store and install them yourself. So, if you want to get one, just walk in to a Cox Store in Tucson and ask for one. If they don't know what you're talking about, you will know that they aren't available in Tucson yet.

One other thought is that if you don't notice any channels missing that you want to watch, you don't really need a Tuning Adapter yet anyway. ;-)


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## cliffdwelling

Yes,
I picked up the tuning adapters and hooked them up and called to activate.
One adapter performed right, but the other is still not working. I have disconnected it after a technician came out and he couldn't get it working.
Cox technicians and CS reps are learning about this technology on the fly.
I think there are only a couple of channels that I don't get without the adapter, so I have one disconnected. I will just wait until they get a little better practice and knowledge, before I attempt to have the other connected.

This whole process with Cox and the Tivo box and cable cards was a tedious process
and I am content with just the cable cards working properly.


----------



## mcdowd

This post describes my positive experience with Cox San Diego.

Cox SD sent a technician to my home yesterday to install Cablecard(s) into my Tivo HD XL. The process was painless. The installer was a Cox employee, who was professional, courteous and knowledgeable. He had installed Cable Cards on numerous Tivos in the past.

The installer came armed with a SA Cable Card M and a pair of SA Cable Card Ss as backups; he acknowledged the Cable Cards hit and miss quality reputation and wanted to be prepared. He installed the M, our shared preference, and the Tivo immediately saw it and started updating the card's software. After the card updated itself, which took about 5 minutes, he called the home office, registered the card and was ready to go...almost.

We were not getting any digital cable channels (100+) after he completed the initial installation. After checking the Tivos connections and signal strength, the installer called the home office again. The home office told him to release the account on the computer in his truck.

Sure enough, this fixed the problem and everyone was happy.

Some lessons learned (some picked up from this very site) for Cox San Diego customers (and others)...


Set up your Tivo several days before the installation. This gives the unit time to update software as needed and it prevents the installer from walking back out the door. Officially, the installer is only supposed to work on a connected Tivo.

Force your Tivo to restart itself prior to the installers arrival. Based on my observations, some of Tivos software updates dont kick in until the unit restarts itself. Better to force the restart prior to the installers arrival instead of waiting for Tivo to implement a significant software upgrade while the installer is trying to do their thing.

Despite what customer service tells you, Cox San Diego uses M and S cards.

Customer service told me that Cox will only charge for a single Cable Card when they install the 2 S cards. Customer service has a permanent discount code they will use to credit the fee thats automatically generated when the second Cable Card is added to the account.

Cox San Diego is not using Tuning Adapters. (TAs)

Push back on the $75 installation fee. I told them that such a fee was ridiculous in light of the facts that ATT is coming and Dish and DirectTV are already here. Customer Retention issued the credit after I was bounced a few times between Customer Service and Sales.

Have your Tivo connected to either the internet or the phone line so the Cable Card(s) can update themselves, if necessary.

Politely ask the installer to clear your account from the computer in his truck before starting the installation process.
All in all, it was a great experience.


----------



## socalgman

Made the jump from a S2 Tivo with a non HD box rental, to Tivo HD with cablecard.

Customer Service:

When I called Cox in Northern Virginia to make the change to Cablecard, they did try to encourage me to not make the change. When I persisted, they informed me that I would lose my discount for bundled services. They also said that I would need two cards, but I told them they could give me ONE M-card instead. (Note: They were actually going to let me pick up the cablecard and self install, but then they offered the essentially free truck roll, so I took that option instead). Anyway, with dropping the bundle discount, I suggested that since I wasn't bundled anymore, there was no need to keep the phone service, since I mostly use my cell phone now. They did end up making concessions, and by time I was done my monthly billing did drop about $40 from where I started due to some promotions that they put me on (including $5 monthly discount on digital gateway), plus they gave me HD (didnt have the service before) and a programming service credit to cover the $19.99 truck roll. They said they were charging me $19.99 because they considered the cablecard install an "upgrade install". I maintained all of my previous service levels, except for the addition of HD. My concession was that I had to put some of my services on a subscriber agreement, and an hour of my life that I'll never get back.

Truck Roll:

The tech was a Cox employee, and he showed up the day after my CS call, on a sunday morning. He had a SA M-card in his pocket, but with the short notice of the job, he didnt have a tuning adapter with him. He made arrangements to return with one. The setup went quickly, and there were no errors. After setup, I did note a lack of several HD channels, to which he attributed the lack of the adapter. He told me during setup that he doesnt do many cablecard installs because not many customers ask for them, tho he had worked tivo setups previously. Tech was very pleased that I had all of the initial setup work done before he got here. A hint: On a fresh Tivo box, just keep manually connecting to the tivo service through 'settings', and it will force the download of the updated system software. Mine was at ver 11 in no time by doing this... but I probably had to connect 5-6 times. Also, it required a system reboot through the settings menu, but the tivo box told me when this was needed.

Overall:

The CS rep was really fantastic, and the technician, while not entirely versed in the tivo, did just fine. I also liked the confirmation email that Cox sent me to put in writing what we discussed on the phone, and also what the technician did while he was here. Nice touch, Cox. I know that Cox CS hasnt always been legendary, but they did right by me this time. I like the Tivo HD (upgraded to 750GB HDD) and like the integration of the cablecard into the tivo. We'll see if the adapter gets me my missing channels!


----------



## Kershek

Interesting experience. Thanks for posting it.

Which channels are missing for you?


----------



## socalgman

Kershek said:


> Interesting experience. Thanks for posting it.
> 
> Which channels are missing for you?


Honestly, the majority of the HD channels were missing. I didn't note. Some of the major networks, CNN, etc. Same Cox tech came back today with the tuning adapter. TA booted up, light went solid green, plugged USB into Tivo, and no change. Still missing many channels. Tech thought that the signal may have been weak. I knew that wasnt the case though. We ended up going to the tivo settings and restarting (per posting in this forum). After boot, the tivo displayed the mapping channels screen, and voila. I now have all of my channels.

I got alot out of reading this forum in preparation for this change, and it was more than helpful. I wanted to give back a little by posting my experience.


----------



## AZDad

I'm looking for some good advice for those of you in PHX. I am new to the HD world but not new to Tivo or Cox. I currently have Cox cable (no box) with a Series 1 and 2 Tivo boxes in my house. I ran out tonight and picked me up a nice Sony Bravia and now I have to make a content decision. Should I stay with Cox? I love Tivo and I have been happy with Cox. We get our high speed internet through Cox as well. I will not consider the Cox DVR as it looks like crap from what I have seen.

So, my dilemma is: Cox with Tivo Series 3 cable card or go with Dish or Directv. I prefer to stay with Cox but all the cable card problems reported on this forum are scaring me away. The Best Buy rep today told me that he thought the Cox issues have gone away with the cable cards. Is this true?

Please share any good (and bad) experiences you are having with Cox in PHX with Tivo Series 3 + cable card.


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## Kershek

socalgman said:


> Honestly, the majority of the HD channels were missing.


Depending on where you are in the city, you may not yet have all the channels that TiVo says you have. For instance, I'm in East Mesa, and I have several channels that don't work in the HD range. This is because they are doing a rollout of new channels across the valley and our area hasn't had them turned on yet, although last I heard it was supposed to happen in May. TiVo got the word that we were getting new channels and added them to my box, but they didn't know when they would appear, so I just have to wait.


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## taylorwilken

We've been a Tivo owner for 7 years, and just purchased a new Tivo HD, and upgraded our Cox (Oklahoma City) service to digital and HD. We're trying to get it set up with a cablecard and it's been a bit of a disaster.

The TiVo cablecard hotline has been wonderful, but we have had no luck getting to someone who knows anything about cablecards at Cox.

Here's the issue:

M-Card goes in fine, they call it in and activate it. However the Main CA screen shows Status: Not Staged , which I think is the critical problem.

Everything else looks good, but the channels are all "NOT_ENT" We have no channels whatsoever except the local stations, in both standard and HD (Channels 1-15 and 701-715)

No one at Cox knows what the Status message means or thinks it's relevant in any way. There's a "Authorization Received" message on the main screen with the phone number, so they say that's all they can do.

They have made two trips out so far and have tried 5 M-Cards and an S-Card. All cards show the same "Not Staged" error. TiVo has replaced the HD unit, though Tivo and I both agree that's likely not the problem, we're just trying to pacify Cox, who was maintaining the unit must be bad.

Does anyone know what this error means and how it could be corrected? They (Cox) are coming out again on Friday, and I would like to be educated a little better. I will be calling the hotline while they are out as well. I think it may be a matter of getting to the right person the tech calls in to when they are out at my house, the techs don't seem to know anything about cablecards.

Thanks for any help you can give.


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## jrm01

As I responded on your similar post on tivo.com:

I have seen several reports with this same error message. In all cases it was fixed when, in the words of the poster, Cox finally got someone at the headend office who knew what they were doing. There seems to be some complications in how the cards are entered into their system and assigned to your account.

You may ask them to try and change your account to eliminate the cablecards from it, then start over and add cablecards back onto the account.


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## Johncv

mcdowd said:


> This post describes my positive experience with Cox San Diego.
> 
> Cox SD sent a technician to my home yesterday to install Cablecard(s) into my Tivo HD XL. The process was painless. The installer was a Cox employee, who was professional, courteous and knowledgeable. He had installed Cable Cards on numerous Tivos in the past.
> 
> The installer came armed with a SA Cable Card M and a pair of SA Cable Card Ss as backups; he acknowledged the Cable Cards hit and miss quality reputation and wanted to be prepared. He installed the M, our shared preference, and the Tivo immediately saw it and started updating the card's software. After the card updated itself, which took about 5 minutes, he called the home office, registered the card and was ready to go...almost.
> 
> We were not getting any digital cable channels (100+) after he completed the initial installation. After checking the Tivos connections and signal strength, the installer called the home office again. The home office told him to release the account on the computer in his truck.
> 
> Sure enough, this fixed the problem and everyone was happy.
> 
> Some lessons learned (some picked up from this very site) for Cox San Diego customers (and others)...
> 
> 
> Set up your Tivo several days before the installation. This gives the unit time to update software as needed and it prevents the installer from walking back out the door. Officially, the installer is only supposed to work on a connected Tivo.
> 
> Force your Tivo to restart itself prior to the installers arrival. Based on my observations, some of Tivos software updates dont kick in until the unit restarts itself. Better to force the restart prior to the installers arrival instead of waiting for Tivo to implement a significant software upgrade while the installer is trying to do their thing.
> 
> Despite what customer service tells you, Cox San Diego uses M and S cards.
> 
> Customer service told me that Cox will only charge for a single Cable Card when they install the 2 S cards. Customer service has a permanent discount code they will use to credit the fee thats automatically generated when the second Cable Card is added to the account.
> 
> Cox San Diego is not using Tuning Adapters. (TAs)
> 
> Push back on the $75 installation fee. I told them that such a fee was ridiculous in light of the facts that ATT is coming and Dish and DirectTV are already here. Customer Retention issued the credit after I was bounced a few times between Customer Service and Sales.
> 
> Have your Tivo connected to either the internet or the phone line so the Cable Card(s) can update themselves, if necessary.
> 
> Politely ask the installer to clear your account from the computer in his truck before starting the installation process.
> All in all, it was a great experience.


Cox San Diego seem to be more on ball. In fact the installer who came out to install the SA-M card wish that Cox would dump the SA boxes and just use TiVos.

Just asking, did your cable card receive a firmware update? My box receive it last Sunday. Just would like to know what was updated.


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## mcdowd

Johncv,

My CableCard updated itself as soon as it was plugged into the my Tivo.

Michael


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## gideonse

Cox San Diego is demanding $75 for Cable Card installation. Is that even legal? And is there anyway to make that go away?


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## jcaudle

gideonse said:


> Cox San Diego is demanding $75 for Cable Card installation. Is that even legal? And is there anyway to make that go away?


Its 29 bucks for a truck roll here with Cox Northern Virginia. Of course the fees vary by each area. I want Fios.


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## ajwees41

I want tivo on the cox dvr


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## tivocrazy

Believe it or not there was a press release issued about 3 years ago where Cox was going to allow Tivo to create the UI for the Cox DVR's. I have not seen anything since. Heard that it had be trialed in Rhode Island but never got any further. Anyone know anymore about this?


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## Kershek

I heard that was only for specific pilot areas that had a Motorola HDR.



tivocrazy said:


> Believe it or not there was a press release issued about 3 years ago where Cox was going to allow Tivo to create the UI for the Cox DVR's. I have not seen anything since. Heard that it had be trialed in Rhode Island but never got any further. Anyone know anymore about this?


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## ajwees41

I hope they are just waiting for Tru2way and then they will launch on the motorola platform.


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## LynnL999

Unless they can manage to produce a Moto box that can hold more than ~15 hours of HD, or permits expansion, it hardly matters if it has TiVo software or not, IMO. The lack of hard drive space is what finally tipped me over to an HD TiVo.


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## moyekj

The TiVo software on Moto boxes in Comcast test markets was a huge flop so I wouldn't bother waiting for whatever may eventually materialize with Cox. Perhaps new hardware will help but you will never have all the flexibility of standalone Tivos anyway so just get the real thing.


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## CrispyCritter

tivocrazy said:


> Believe it or not there was a press release issued about 3 years ago where Cox was going to allow Tivo to create the UI for the Cox DVR's. I have not seen anything since. Heard that it had be trialed in Rhode Island but never got any further. Anyone know anymore about this?


The Cox public trials are supposed to be announced in the next month or two. There haven't been any public trials yet.


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## cliffdwelling

gideonse said:


> Cox San Diego is demanding $75 for Cable Card installation. Is that even legal? And is there anyway to make that go away?


They charged us 29.95 for the same thing and on the bill it says "Pro-Install"
which was everything but. I had to guide the tech through the process and they probably should have paid us for the class training the guy received on the job.

Probably no way to avoid charge, but maybe you could call and ask why the charge is so much more than Southern Arizona Cox. I had earlier compared Cox- San Diego service charges to Tucson and found San Diego cheaper across the board, so this is surprising. Maybe they will negotiate. Good Luck.


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## juanian

I haven't seen this posted, so I don't know if is possible or not.

I have Cox in Phoenix. Would I be able to get a reduced charge (or no charge) if I bring my TiVo into a Cox store to have the CableCards installed? (Actually, I think I heard that Cox Phoenix has the M cards, so I guess it would only be one card.)

I'm guessing it is not possible (since I haven't seen it brought up as a less-costly alternative). But, isn't the pairing of the CC with the TiVo (and not some other device) the reason the cable companies use their own personnel (or their paid contractors) to do the CC install?


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## Shawn95GT

You can't do it in the store, has to be done at your house.

Your best bet is to try to negotiate the fee.


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## cliffdwelling

juanian said:


> I haven't seen this posted, so I don't know if is possible or not.
> 
> I have Cox in Phoenix. Would I be able to get a reduced charge (or no charge) if I bring my TiVo into a Cox store to have the CableCards installed? (Actually, I think I heard that Cox Phoenix has the M cards, so I guess it would only be one card.)
> 
> I'm guessing it is not possible (since I haven't seen it brought up as a less-costly alternative). But, isn't the pairing of the CC with the TiVo (and not some other device) the reason the cable companies use their own personnel (or their paid contractors) to do the CC install?


No, they won't let you bring it to there store, I tried.
No way as of now to avoid charge, and yes the multi-stream card is what they inserted in Tucson.


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## gsu13

I have searched the thread but have not seen this answered. I have the very basic analog Cox subscription and Series 1 and 2 Tivos here in Northern VA. I am considering upgrading to a Series 3 HD Tivo, but I am unclear if I can just connect my coax directly into the Tivo and get the HD channels I currently get. I have split my coax into the Tivo 2 and HDTV, so I get several HD channels on the TV (4.1, 7.1, 9.1, 26.1,etc.) that don't show up on the Tivo. Can I get those same channels with the HD Tivo, or will I need a cablecard (or two) and therefore digital cable service? Thanks for your help and expertise!


----------



## CrispyCritter

gsu13 said:


> I have searched the thread but have not seen this answered. I have the very basic analog Cox subscription and Series 1 and 2 Tivos here in Northern VA. I am considering upgrading to a Series 3 HD Tivo, but I am unclear if I can just connect my coax directly into the Tivo and get the HD channels I currently get. I have split my coax into the Tivo 2 and HDTV, so I get several HD channels on the TV (4.1, 7.1, 9.1, 26.1,etc.) that don't show up on the Tivo. Can I get those same channels with the HD Tivo, or will I need a cablecard (or two) and therefore digital cable service? Thanks for your help and expertise!


With an HD-Tivo, you can get those channels with your current cable setup, but will probably not have TiVo guide information on them (see the QAM threads) so can only do time-based recording on them. Depending on exactly where you are, it may be reasonable to have an HD-TiVo accept input from both your current very basic subscription, and also an antenna input for OTA HD signals. That's what I would do if I only wanted your current channels, since you'll get TiVo guide info for the OTA channels.


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## cliffdwelling

gsu13 said:


> I have searched the thread but have not seen this answered. I have the very basic analog Cox subscription and Series 1 and 2 Tivos here in Northern VA. I am considering upgrading to a Series 3 HD Tivo, but I am unclear if I can just connect my coax directly into the Tivo and get the HD channels I currently get. I have split my coax into the Tivo 2 and HDTV, so I get several HD channels on the TV (4.1, 7.1, 9.1, 26.1,etc.) that don't show up on the Tivo. Can I get those same channels with the HD Tivo, or will I need a cablecard (or two) and therefore digital cable service? Thanks for your help and expertise!


The answer is yes, but you won't have to split the coax, as the HD-Tivo has a cable input and antennae (OTA) input. When you setup it will search and grab all your cable channels and your OTA channels and Tivo should have info on all the locals.


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## gsu13

Thanks so much for the quick replies, CrispyCritter and Cliffdwelling. I found the posts on the clear QAM issue and that is so disappointing of Tivo. I don't get good OTA so would not want to do cable plus OTA since I think while i would have program info for the HD channels, the Tivo would still try to record off the antenna, and there wouldn't be much of a stable picture. Thanks again - I'll probably look at something else besides Tivo HD


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## juanian

cliffdwelling said:


> No, they won't let you bring it to there store, I tried.
> No way as of now to avoid charge, and yes the multi-stream card is what they inserted in Tucson.


Now I'm confused . . .

I just called to get two cablecards added (and to remove the Cox HD DVR). The woman said that they don't have multi-stream cards. She also said that I can go to any Cox store, bring the Cox HD DVR, and they will give me two cablecards.

Is that true -- will they give me two cablecards to install myself, or is she "confused"? (She did say that I would have to call Cox when I installed them to activate them, which is fine.)


----------



## Johncv

juanian said:


> Now I'm confused . . .
> 
> I just called to get two cablecards added (and to remove the Cox HD DVR). The woman said that they don't have multi-stream cards. She also said that I can go to any Cox store, bring the Cox HD DVR, and they will give me two cablecards.
> 
> Is that true -- will they give me two cablecards to install myself, or is she "confused"? (She did say that I would have to call Cox when I installed them to activate them, which is fine.)


If that is what she told you, Yes you can install them yourself, just record the card id numbers before you install them. Then you then call Cox and tell them the numbers from the cards which are input into the server. You then go to the cable card setup screen and the cards should pair with the server. If you run into any problem you can call TiVo ask for a three way conference with you, TiVo, and Cox.


----------



## djwilso

Johncv said:


> If that is what she told you, Yes you can install them yourself, just record the card id numbers before you install them. Then you then call Cox and tell them the numbers from the cards which are input into the server. You then go to the cable card setup screen and the cards should pair with the server. If you run into any problem you can call TiVo ask for a three way conference with you, TiVo, and Cox.


I don't know if it has changed, but here in Phoenix I was told a very similar story 3 years ago when I was trying to get my CableCards.

When I showed up at the retail location and asked for the cards, they had no idea what I was talking about and told me that the CSR was misinformed. Shocking (sarcasm). The cards would require a tech to come to my house and install them for me. Because it takes such a high level of technical ability to push a PCMCIA card into a slot.

And that's what I ended up doing. Three years later, the cards are still working just fine along with the SDV Tuning Adapter (which I *was* able to pick up at the retail store).

Dennis


----------



## Johncv

djwilso said:


> I don't know if it has changed, but here in Phoenix I was told a very similar story 3 years ago when I was trying to get my CableCards.
> 
> When I showed up at the retail location and asked for the cards, they had no idea what I was talking about and told me that the CSR was misinformed. Shocking (sarcasm). The cards would require a tech to come to my house and install them for me. Because it takes such a high level of technical ability to push a PCMCIA card into a slot.
> 
> And that's what I ended up doing. Three years later, the cards are still working just fine along with the SDV Tuning Adapter (which I *was* able to pick up at the retail store).
> 
> Dennis


It seem like it done differently depending on where you live. The only way juanian is to find out is to go to the Cox office and ask for one miti-stream card or two single stream cards. I would suggest taking the TiVo manual with you.


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## juanian

Thanks for the info Johncv and Dennis. I had figured that I'd give it a shot (going to the store and trying to get an M-CC, or 2 S-CCs if they didn't have M-CCs). If they told me that they must make a service call to install them, I'd try and asked for a reduced installation charge (for my "inconvenience" of coming to the store myself after I was told I could do it myself); it's worth a try, right!

I'll also bring the TiVo manual -- good suggestion. Just to be on the safe side, I'll also try and be familiar with the potential problems and solutions (just to appear that I know what I'll be doing when I go to install the cards  ).

I had been wondering about SDV channels here in Phoenix. Is there any list of what channels are currently SDV here? (I'll assume that they can change which channels are SDV whenever they want as demand varies, so a 'recent' list may be good enough.) Should I just go ahead and get the Tuning Adapter while I'm at it?


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## Johncv

juanian said:


> Thanks for the info Johncv and Dennis. I had figured that I'd give it a shot (going to the store and trying to get an M-CC, or 2 S-CCs if they didn't have M-CCs). If they told me that they must make a service call to install them, I'd try and asked for a reduced installation charge (for my "inconvenience" of coming to the store myself after I was told I could do it myself); it's worth a try, right!
> 
> I'll also bring the TiVo manual -- good suggestion. Just to be on the safe side, I'll also try and be familiar with the potential problems and solutions (just to appear that I know what I'll be doing when I go to install the cards  ).
> 
> I had been wondering about SDV channels here in Phoenix. Is there any list of what channels are currently SDV here? (I'll assume that they can change which channels are SDV whenever they want as demand varies, so a 'recent' list may be good enough.) Should I just go ahead and get the Tuning Adapter while I'm at it?


Oh, you want to make two trips to the Cox office?  Yes, ask if they use SDV, if they do, then request a Tuning Adapter.


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## LynnL999

Just wanted to offer a positive word to those who might be considering TiVo and are terrified about the cable card hassle -- I've had two installed in two HD TiVo's in the past 6 weeks. I live in Orange County, CA. The installers were on time (one was even early, they called to make sure it was ok) and the installs were relatively painless. Everything has been working fine since then on both TiVos (knock wood that it continues). Just a positive thought for anyone who might be on the fence.

(We don't have tuning adapters here yet.)


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## cpt09135

LynnL999 said:


> Just wanted to offer a positive word to those who might be considering TiVo and are terrified about the cable card hassle -- I've had two installed in two HD TiVo's in the past 6 weeks. I live in Orange County, CA. The installers were on time (one was even early, they called to make sure it was ok) and the installs were relatively painless. Everything has been working fine since then on both TiVos (knock wood that it continues). Just a positive thought for anyone who might be on the fence.
> 
> (We don't have tuning adapters here yet.)


That's great to hear. I'm in Orange County also, and I have 3 Cox DVR's, but I'd like to start trying Tivo soon. I assume you don't get 753, Travel HD on the Tivo?


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## joycentucson

the tivo hdr finally hit the price i was willing 2 pay for, so here's my experience here in tucson, az.
when my tivo arrived there were detailed instrux 2 cable card installer, which i thought was really great.
sub-contractor came out today (sch was only out a few days), and brought a multi-chnl cablecard & the tuning adapter - instl fee was $29.95, no charge for tuning adapter (i had no idea it would be almost as large as a dvd player, looks ok tho)
the tech had experience with cable cards and had someone who was being trained with him, he really had no problems - it was the office, after a few calls to them, who made the job longer. So, all in all it was a good experience :up:
====the tech never did look at the detailed tivo intrux tho~!====

prev cox phone call experiences:
*first time called (prob 6 mos ago) sales rep gave me such a hard time about doing this, this time around got no flak from rep at all.
*told could pick up box at cox store twice, then when asked to double check this - came back and said no, someone would have to come out.

i believe that since the technology's been around a while cox has played catch-up and i highly recommend this


----------



## LynnL999

cpt09135 said:


> That's great to hear. I'm in Orange County also, and I have 3 Cox DVR's, but I'd like to start trying Tivo soon. I assume you don't get 753, Travel HD on the Tivo?


Correct. You also don't get Science HD, Animal Planet HD, and a handful of non-HD digital channels. It's unknown if the new HD channels we're supposed to get at the end of this month will be switched digital or not.

Hopefully, a functioning tuning adapter will be available soon.


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> Correct. You also don't get Science HD, Animal Planet HD, and a handful of non-HD digital channels. It's unknown if the new HD channels we're supposed to get at the end of this month will be switched digital or not.
> 
> Hopefully, a functioning tuning adapter will be available soon.


That strange, here in San Diego we do get Science HD and Animal Planet HD, but Cox San Diego replace every copper wire with fiber optic years ago when they had @Home internet service. Miss it, it was faster then the top service I it get now. And I paid less for it 

High Definition
700 HBO HD
701 HBO2 HD	
702 ESPN2 HD
703 ESPN HD
704 Channel 4 San Diego HD
705 Fox HD
706 CW HD
707 NBC HD
708 CBS HD
709 KUSI HD
710 ABC HD
711 PBS HD
718 National Geographic HD
719 ABC Family HD	
724 Discovery Channel HD
728 USA HD
730 MTV HD	
731 CNN HD
732 Palladia
733 TBS HD
734 TNT HD
735 HD Theater
736 TLC HD
737 Fox News HD	
738 Lifetime HD
740 Showtime HD
741 A&E HD
742 Bravo HD
743 FX HD	
745 Spike HD	
746 VH1 HD	
747 Nickelodeon HD	
748 Comedy Central HD	
749 E! HD	
750 Cartoon HD	
751 Golf HD
752 Disney HD	
753 HGTV HD
754 Animal Planet HD
755 History Channel HD
756 Speed HD	
757 AMC HD	
760 Travel Channel HD
761 CMT HD	
762 CNBC HD
763 Syfy HD
765 Universal HD
767 Food Network HD
768 BET HD	
770 MLB HD	
772 NFL Network HD
773 NHL Network HD
780 Cinemax HD
782 Science Channel HD
783 Planet Green HD
790 Starz HD
796 Game HD (NHL/MLB)
797 Team HD (NBA)
798 Pay-Per-View HD
799 On Demand HD
805 Music Choice HD On Demand	
806 FearNet HD On Demand	
807 Dew Action Sports HD On Demand	
808 Fuse HD On Demand	
809 MOJO HD On Demand	
810 Sundance HD On Demand	
812 Gospel Music HD On Demand	
830 MTV HD On Demand	
832 Palladia HD On Demand	
841 A&E HD On Demand	
845 Spike HD On Demand	
846 VH1 HD On Demand	
855 History Channel HD On Demand	
856 Speed HD On Demand	
860 Travel Channel HD On Demand	
881 MAX HD On Demand	
882 SHOW HD On Demand	
883 STARZ HD On Demand


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> Just wanted to offer a positive word to those who might be considering TiVo and are terrified about the cable card hassle -- I've had two installed in two HD TiVo's in the past 6 weeks. I live in Orange County, CA. The installers were on time (one was even early, they called to make sure it was ok) and the installs were relatively painless. Everything has been working fine since then on both TiVos (knock wood that it continues). Just a positive thought for anyone who might be on the fence.
> 
> (We don't have tuning adapters here yet.)


Cox San Diego rep knew what he was doing when install the SA m-card, told me he install seven TiVos that day. Also, told me that Cox San Diego is just waiting for the day when they can just push the Tivos interface and just dump the SA BS that have to deal with about the SA interface.


----------



## jctivo

Not sure if this is the correct forum.

But I just wanted to say I have ended my relationship with Cox.

The tuner adapter had continuous problems.

The copy-protection flag was not set correctly so I could not transfer shows to my computer that I should have been able to (i.e. non HBO shows).

Within 1 hour of having FIOS, I have transfered shows that I previously could not have with Cox.

Yes, I had contacted Cox several times about these issues but they played the blame game with Tivo.

I tried Cox. I tried.


----------



## chestnu1

I have had my tivo hd for almost a year and I figure that it is time I post the story of how I my cable card install here in Las Vegas went. First let me say that when I called to schedule a cable card install the CSR knew exactly what I was talking about. I asked for a Multi stream cable card (M card) and he knew what it was but he also said that they only use those here in Las Vegas. The only problem was that the soonest I could get someone out was a couple of days later on Friday. So got my tivo opened it up got it set up the day before the cable guy was suppose to come out and the night before it did a software update which is good. I go to school and come home to wait for the cable guy who due to bad traffic was late 15 minutes past the time window when he does show up I guess this was his first so he is on the phone not listening to me I gave him the piece of paper that has the instructions for cable cards on but he doesn't take a second look at it. He is looking around the back he must of thought that it was a series 3. So I tell him that this model loads the cable card in the front and that it only needs one cable card since he had M cards with him. He puts it in there and goes through the steps and the card does its firmware update. And here is where I had problems. This is when I had to leave and go to the doctor for an appointment. so I left the cable guy to do his thing and had my brother and sister supervise. On the way home I call them up and the cable guy had finished and left. But they were unable to go to any of the channels so I had them turn off the tivo think ing maybe they were using SDV (Which they weren't and still aren't) and plug in the cable box.(He also on the receipt for his visit also stated that he was on time) So the next day I am setting up the tivo in my room with my new tv and I hook it all up and I notice that I am not able to tune to any of the digital cable channels so I call up cox tell them about this and they look at every thing then they reset something on there end and all of a sudden it was working with all the channels. 

So the moral of this very long story stay for the whole thing and dont let the cable guy leave till you have tested all the channels. But the whole thing went reasonably well and was well worth the trouble.


----------



## alansh

Unfortunately, as far as Cox is concerned, the copy-protection flag _was_ set correctly -- they flag everything except broadcast channels. They claim this is because their content providers require it, but of course that's not true -- otherwise, FIOS would have that too. And also unfortunately, they're legally permitted to do this for everything except broadcast channels. I think the only cable channels they aren't flagging are the CSPANs.

I suspect they do it to make the TiVo less competitive with their own DVR.


----------



## tivocrazy

For what its worth, and it may not be worth anything...but here in southeastern virginia I had the same problem. When I reported to Cox that I was not able to transfer content to my computer they suspected the multi cable card in the Tivo. We swapped out the multi for two singles and the problem went away. Cox contacted Motorola (who supplies our cards here) and they were aware of the problem but gave Cox no timetable as to when they would fix it. I don;t care, two singles works for me.


----------



## jcaudle

They only seem to flag most of the HD channels with these Flags. Showtime for some reason isn't flagged here in Northern Va, the rest of the premium HDs are. TNT and other networks that were on HD prior to SDV are not flagged. HGTV is on HD, but not on its analog channel.



alansh said:


> Unfortunately, as far as Cox is concerned, the copy-protection flag _was_ set correctly -- they flag everything except broadcast channels. They claim this is because their content providers require it, but of course that's not true -- otherwise, FIOS would have that too. And also unfortunately, they're legally permitted to do this for everything except broadcast channels. I think the only cable channels they aren't flagging are the CSPANs.
> 
> I suspect they do it to make the TiVo less competitive with their own DVR.


----------



## LynnL999

alansh said:


> Unfortunately, as far as Cox is concerned, the copy-protection flag _was_ set correctly -- they flag everything except broadcast channels. They claim this is because their content providers require it, but of course that's not true -- otherwise, FIOS would have that too. And also unfortunately, they're legally permitted to do this for everything except broadcast channels.


Interesting... here, they don't flag anything but the premium channels and stuff like Amazon on Demand.


----------



## tivocrazy

LynnL999 said:


> Interesting... here, they don't flag anything but the premium channels and stuff like Amazon on Demand.


Same Here in Hampton Roads, VA


----------



## ellinj

LynnL999 said:


> Interesting... here, they don't flag anything but the premium channels and stuff like Amazon on Demand.


same here.


----------



## Ink Noise

Purchased my TiVo HD a week ago and set up an appointment to have an M-Card installed since of course there is no self-serve option for this. Cox - Santa Barbara charges $59.99 for the luxury. Fifty. Nine. Ninety. Nine. To slide in a card. And I thought the earlier posters in other markets who were charged $30.00 had it bad.

With Cox Santa Barbara, there is no SDV in place just yet and the SA card works as expected. Nearly all channels save for locals and TBS are copy protected rendering TTG pretty much useless. But it still beats the SA 8300HD DVR by a mile. It's nice to be back with TiVo.


----------



## tivocrazy

Ink Noise said:


> Purchased my TiVo HD a week ago and set up an appointment to have an M-Card installed since of course there is no self-serve option for this. Cox - Santa Barbara charges $59.99 for the luxury. Fifty. Nine. Ninety. Nine. To slide in a card. And I thought the earlier posters in other markets who were charged $30.00 had it bad.
> 
> With Cox Santa Barbara, there is no SDV in place just yet and the SA card works as expected. Nearly all channels save for locals and TBS are copy protected rendering TTG pretty much useless. But it still beats the SA 8300HD DVR by a mile. It's nice to be back with TiVo.


Wow..59.99. The installs have gotten expensive. Don't think my install was that much (in the 20's). Do you want to use TTG? Have you checked to see if 2 single cards eliminates they problem because that it is what control it (can't remember the exact bit) but my multi card had the problem but the singles did not.


----------



## joycentucson

After my install here in tucson, 7-17-09, i wasnt getting all my chnls. Seemed to be chnls mostly that are also high-def chnls also, but also a 3 hbo & 5 cinemax. Altogether, tho, i was missing about 25 chnls.

Like stated before, make sure ALL chnls coming in before tech leaves.

I set up a service call and another subcontractor came out. My RF levels were checked first, under TA diagnostics, they were ok. Next DVR diagnostics checked, my TA signal was really bad - jumping between 0-45&#37; - should be above 80% consistantley.

Turned out the previous contractor (the b-team) installed a rinky dink cable jumper from my TA to the tivo, the a-team contractor said it's not the 1st time b-team has caused them probs and took cable for evidence! 

Now my TA signal is a solid 93%, so this cautionary tale could apply for someone out there, so i thought i'd put it out there 

Regarding previous posts on copyright protected channels, seems like here in arizona they are flagging all chnls cept broadcast, yet back east and irvine, ca only premium chnls & VOD are flagged, hmmm

Thanks to tivocrazy: 7-27 12:16PM

"For what its worth, and it may not be worth anything...but here in southeastern virginia I had the same problem. When I reported to Cox that I was not able to transfer content to my computer they suspected the multi cable card in the Tivo. We swapped out the multi for two singles and the problem went away."

Thank you, that's my next call to cox...then maybe the saga is over...


----------



## LynnL999

FYI, about half a dozen new HD channels (including FX, Comedy Central, MTV) were made available to Orange County users this week -- but TiVo users are not getting them.


----------



## Kershek

Do tuner adapters allow TiVos to see VOD?


----------



## ajwees41

Kershek said:


> Do tuner adapters allow TiVos to see VOD?


nope


----------



## cpt09135

Kershek said:


> Do tuner adapters allow TiVos to see VOD?


No, just channels that are using Switched Digital Video (SDV). Hopefully when/if a Tru2Way Tivo comes out we can view VOD.


----------



## BenderSD1

Just moved to Las Vegas and had Cox Cable installed. They came out on Saturday and set up my Series 3. I had to explain to the guy that the Series 3 needed 2 cards regardless of the type. Aside from that, everything went smoothly.

The next day I realized I wasn't getting any HD channels other than the major networks. I called up Cox thinking that I hadn't asked for the HD package, but they said I should be getting them. Reboots and a few attempts on their side, and still no HD. So they rolled a truck today.

This tech was pretty knowledgable (I still had to explain about the Series 3, though). He brought 2 cable cards with him and swapped out the first one. We waited for it to upgrade, and then he paired it. It worked, the HD channels were now coming in.

He then repeated with the second cable card, but no luck. The second one didn't show the HD channels. He left and came back a bit later with another card, but this one had a physical issue and wouldn't insert properly into the TiVo. So he's scheduled to come back again tomorrow.

I was trying to figure out the difference between the installation that worked and the ones that didn't. We did notice that, for the one that worked, when he plugged in the card, the upgrade went to completion before the card info screen popped up automatically. For the ones that didn't work, I'm pretty sure the info screen popped up before the upgrade was complete. It's either that, or the tech attempted to pair the card before the upgrade completed.

Hopefully he'll bring a bunch of cards tomorrow and it'll work.


----------



## ellinj

I know there is a few folks here in my area, does anyone know if Cox offers M-Cards in RI? I am about to add a tivohd. I have a series3 that is running great with 2 s cards.


----------



## jleach8

ellinj said:


> I know there is a few folks here in my area, does anyone know if Cox offers M-Cards in RI? I am about to add a tivohd. I have a series3 that is running great with 2 s cards.


Hey

Cox is coming out to my house with cards for the 2 TivoHDs I recently bought. The rep told me they were m-cards. I'll let you know what happens. I'll also tell Mandar you say hi 

-Jamie


----------



## Rodney

jleach8 said:


> Hey
> 
> Cox is coming out to my house with cards for the 2 TivoHDs I recently bought. The rep told me they were m-cards. I'll let you know what happens. I'll also tell Mandar you say hi
> 
> -Jamie


I just moved to North Kingstown. Tivo is shipping me 2 TivoHD's. Should be here Thursday! I called Cox, but the salesman didn't know if the cards were S or M (he admitted he didn't know what that meant). Please let me know if you actually received the M cards, so I can tell him how many to bring.

Thanks,

-Rodney


----------



## ellinj

jleach8 said:


> Hey
> 
> Cox is coming out to my house with cards for the 2 TivoHDs I recently bought. The rep told me they were m-cards. I'll let you know what happens. I'll also tell Mandar you say hi
> 
> -Jamie


lol, awesome. give Mandar a kick instead.


----------



## deaddeeds

I am having my TiVo HD RMA'ed this week. Will I need a truck-roll to pair the M-Card with new TiVo HD?


----------



## kevintheoman

BenderSD1 said:


> Just moved to Las Vegas and had Cox Cable installed. They came out on Saturday and set up my Series 3. I had to explain to the guy that the Series 3 needed 2 cards regardless of the type. Aside from that, everything went smoothly.
> 
> The next day I realized I wasn't getting any HD channels other than the major networks. I called up Cox thinking that I hadn't asked for the HD package, but they said I should be getting them. Reboots and a few attempts on their side, and still no HD. So they rolled a truck today.
> 
> This tech was pretty knowledgable (I still had to explain about the Series 3, though). He brought 2 cable cards with him and swapped out the first one. We waited for it to upgrade, and then he paired it. It worked, the HD channels were now coming in.
> 
> He then repeated with the second cable card, but no luck. The second one didn't show the HD channels. He left and came back a bit later with another card, but this one had a physical issue and wouldn't insert properly into the TiVo. So he's scheduled to come back again tomorrow.
> 
> I was trying to figure out the difference between the installation that worked and the ones that didn't. We did notice that, for the one that worked, when he plugged in the card, the upgrade went to completion before the card info screen popped up automatically. For the ones that didn't work, I'm pretty sure the info screen popped up before the upgrade was complete. It's either that, or the tech attempted to pair the card before the upgrade completed.
> 
> Hopefully he'll bring a bunch of cards tomorrow and it'll work.


I had a similar experience a couple months ago.

Somewhere on tivo's site (or on here maybe) is a how-to on not receiving channels. You basically go into tivo diagnostics and see if a channel is blocked or not.

Basically, Cox was blocking my non-network HD channels. They had the wrong channel lineup. Just took a lot of me trying to convince them they had the wrong lineup. Once convinced all they did is flash down the new information and everything was fine.

The original mistake is with how I ordered the service. I said "I want cablecard, digital service (with variety tier)." Needed to say "I want cablecard, digital service (with HD and variety tier)." Even though the HD is free.


----------



## Rodney

Well, I am on day 2 and counting with Cox and the cable cards. Yesterday, the installer brings an M card, and it seemed to be a smooth transaction. Put it in, and he paired it, and checked that we were getting channels, even the premium HD ones. I did NOT have him check every single channel, he selected about 5 channels and everything looked good.
Later in the afternoon, I noticed a grey screen on a channel. Then another. I counted 20 channels in the 700 numbering that I was not getting on TiVo. They were not premium channels, but ones like NFLHD, HGTV, , etc. I call Cox, they first send a signal to the card to make sure everything is open, but it doesn't fix the issue.
The original installer comes out to see what the issue is, but doesn't have any cards with him to swap out. They setup an appt. for Saturday (today). Saturday comes, and about 1/2 hour after the time range for the installer to be here, I call Cox, and they let me know he is running late (really?). Another hour goes by, then the doorbell rings.
This is a different installer, who has one M card, and he is set to replace it. He calls Cox, and they tell him that he cannot use that card. That is the only M card he has (What, are these things made of gold?). He does have two S cards in the truck. Out he goes, comes back in, and starts putting them both into the TiVo. I stop him, show him the instruction sheet that says you first put in 1, and after getting that to work you put in the next one. He doesn't really like me to tell him his job, I can tell. Anyway, the first card gives Cox an error at their end, and the 2nd card gives us an error on the Tivo, and now I have NO channels. He hangs up with Cox, and tells me that they will be back Monday, since he has no more cards. I said, can you just put the original M card back? He tells me no, that since it was taken off the account, it can no longer be used. I am now getting angry.
The phone rings. I answer it, and it is Cox, asking to speak to the installer. I say, sure, but first, I want him to put the original card in and pair it with the system, so at least I have some channels for the weekend. She says, okay. I hand him the phone, and he talks for a minute, and I hear him say, "We can put the old card back?"
They can, and they did. I am now back with everything working except for those 20 odd grey channels. TiVo keeps getting no signal on those channels. They will be back on Tuesday evening, and I asked them to bring a few M cards, not just one.

Why am I writing all this. Not just for catharsis, but also to ask a question: I feel if the next cards do not correct the error, they are going to point to the Tivo HD as being the problem. What do I do at that point?

Thanks for reading, and thanks in advance for any suggestions on how to handle the situation at this point.

-Rodney


----------



## Kershek

After all that, I would ask for a different installer (one that's not so difficult to work with, hopefully), and start over.


----------



## crazi4tv

Rodney

Click on or go to this link from the TiVo website:

http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/137#Troubleshootingactivationandmissingchannelissues

This will give you all the information you need to troubleshoot the issue with your cablecards.

Good luck.


----------



## Rodney

crazi4tv said:


> Rodney
> 
> Click on or go to this link from the TiVo website:
> 
> http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/137#Troubleshootingactivationandmissingchannelissues
> 
> This will give you all the information you need to troubleshoot the issue with your cablecards.
> 
> Good luck.


Thanks very much for the link. Great info!

-Rodney


----------



## dmille6

hi,
the Cox technition just completed my TivoHD cable card.. i had to pay 55.00 for him to come insert a cable card, then call the main office to register it... something i could have easily done.. if that wasnt enough, after he installed it he then informed me cox doesnt support multi-cards so i had to rent two single cards a month 55.00 each, or just use one and only be able to watch or record 1 show at a time. i could use the cox cable box/dvr and be able to record two. 

nothing i can do about it, and thats how the cable company is, but i am disappointed.


----------



## tivocrazy

dmille6 said:


> hi,
> the Cox technition just completed my TivoHD cable card.. i had to pay 55.00 for him to come insert a cable card, then call the main office to register it... something i could have easily done.. if that wasnt enough, after he installed it he then informed me cox doesnt support multi-cards so i had to rent two single cards a month 55.00 each, or just use one and only be able to watch or record 1 show at a time. i could use the cox cable box/dvr and be able to record two.
> 
> nothing i can do about it, and thats how the cable company is, but i am disappointed.


Are you sure it is 55 a month and not 50 for the truck roll and 5 each month for the single card. I pay 5 a month for each single. 55 a month seems a bit steep.


----------



## Punker1234

I've called my local cox rep here in Santa Barbara and they charged $59 to install and $1.99 a month, and they do have multi-stream cards.

I have a quesiton though. Has anyone had luck with getting Cox to waive or credit the $59 back? Thats a bit steep!


----------



## murraymh

dmille6 said:


> hi,
> the Cox technition just completed my TivoHD cable card.. i had to pay 55.00 for him to come insert a cable card, then call the main office to register it... something i could have easily done.. if that wasnt enough, after he installed it he then informed me cox doesnt support multi-cards so i had to rent two single cards a month 55.00 each, or just use one and only be able to watch or record 1 show at a time. i could use the cox cable box/dvr and be able to record two.
> 
> nothing i can do about it, and thats how the cable company is, but i am disappointed.


That's BS...Cox here in San Diego does have M cards...mine was installed just over a year ago & it's been smooth sailing since then - they charge me $2 a mo for the card


----------



## hillstrubl

deaddeeds said:


> I am having my TiVo HD RMA'ed this week. Will I need a truck-roll to pair the M-Card with new TiVo HD?


shouldn't as the card is paired to your account, not the tivo itself


----------



## philp3

I just had had my new Tivo HD setup with cox in Las Vegas. It's been pretty smooth so far. They inserted an M-Card.

One thing I wish I had asked the guy. He had to go outside and do something with the wiring outside before installing the card. Any idea what he had to do?

Did he put in some type of adapter or tuner?


----------



## aztivo

hillstrubl said:


> shouldn't as the card is paired to your account, not the tivo itself


This is incorrect the card is paired to the Tivo, so yes you will either need a truck roll or find a way to get to level 3 tech support


----------



## lofar

Punker1234 said:


> I've called my local cox rep here in Santa Barbara and they charged $59 to install and $1.99 a month, and they do have multi-stream cards.
> 
> I have a quesiton though. Has anyone had luck with getting Cox to waive or credit the $59 back? Thats a bit steep!


Not in SB. They waived the fee once when they had to come out and replace a defective card. And once I managed to get them to re-pair a card over the phone to my tivo without a truck roll but that was like pulling teeth.


----------



## LynnL999

philp3 said:


> I just had had my new Tivo HD setup with cox in Las Vegas. It's been pretty smooth so far. They inserted an M-Card.
> 
> One thing I wish I had asked the guy. He had to go outside and do something with the wiring outside before installing the card. Any idea what he had to do?
> 
> Did he put in some type of adapter or tuner?


If it was anything like mine it had nothing to do with the card install itself. Apparently they're required to check the wiring when they make a service call, and stick a tag on to indicate the last time service was done. When my cable card was installed, the guy replaced some cable and a splitter, and got rid of an unneeded splitter.


----------



## Rodney

LynnL999 said:


> If it was anything like mine it had nothing to do with the card install itself. Apparently they're required to check the wiring when they make a service call, and stick a tag on to indicate the last time service was done. When my cable card was installed, the guy replaced some cable and a splitter, and got rid of an unneeded splitter.


I wish my original installer had done that. There was a trap on my line, which was the issue I wasn't getting about 18 channels. Tooks 5 trips for them to figure it out.

BTW - I still don't get channels 764 and 765, which are Lifetime and Hallmark. They don't have a clue why, and since I don't watch those channels, it doesn't really affect me. Just upsetting not getting all the channels I pay for, and more upsetting that they cannot figure out why.

-Rodney


----------



## roothack

I just got off the phone with Cox in Northern Virginia and the CSR says there cablecards only work with Series3 Tivo and not TIVO HD. I am unconvinced, and will probably call back later, but I was wonder if anyone has Cox in Northern VA hooked up to a Tivo HD


----------



## stevesogge

Has anyone had any luck with trying to get Cox to lower or take off their fee? They want $75 to roll a truck to do 1 cablecard for my series 3. Needless to say this sorta negates the point of having one. Thanks.


----------



## JimG19

roothack said:


> I just got off the phone with Cox in Northern Virginia and the CSR says there cablecards only work with Series3 Tivo and not TIVO HD. I am unconvinced, and will probably call back later, but I was wonder if anyone has Cox in Northern VA hooked up to a Tivo HD


Somebody told you wrong. I have Cox in Hampton Roads and have been using a cable card in my TivoHD for several months with no problems.

Jim


----------



## jcaudle

stevesogge said:


> Has anyone had any luck with trying to get Cox to lower or take off their fee? They want $75 to roll a truck to do 1 cablecard for my series 3. Needless to say this sorta negates the point of having one. Thanks.


The fees for truck rolls must vary widely around the country. Its $29.95 for them here in Cox Fairfax County in northern Va.


----------



## av_dude

stevesogge said:


> Has anyone had any luck with trying to get Cox to lower or take off their fee? They want $75 to roll a truck to do 1 cablecard for my series 3. Needless to say this sorta negates the point of having one. Thanks.





jcaudle said:


> The fees for truck rolls must vary widely around the country. Its $29.95 for them here in Cox Fairfax County in northern Va.


It's $50 for Cox here in Orange County. I did get them to waive the fee a couple of months ago. I had to ask to speak with a supervisor, but when I pointed out that I am spending over $150 a month, he waived this fee, "just this one time."


----------



## insane42

I waited forever and finaly bit the bullet. Cox in Phoenix was doing a free install thing for the week, so I took the plunge. Wasn't without its pain points, but we're up and running.


----------



## deaddeeds

roothack said:


> I just got off the phone with Cox in Northern Virginia and the CSR says there cablecards only work with Series3 Tivo and not TIVO HD. I am unconvinced, and will probably call back later, but I was wonder if anyone has Cox in Northern VA hooked up to a Tivo HD


I have both a Series 3 and TiVo HD in Fairfax. Call back and tell them you have a TiVo and need a Cable Card installation.


----------



## roothack

deaddeeds said:


> I have both a Series 3 and TiVo HD in Fairfax. Call back and tell them you have a TiVo and need a Cable Card installation.


I got it straightened out. Cox refused to rent me out an M-card despite the fact that the box I had from them had one installed, so the tech showed up with two S-cards, install was painless and I got to watch the football game.


----------



## JessLC

Does anyone have any experience with this in Connecticut? We are considering upgrading to the new HD Tivo (currently have a Series 2), and I'm confused about our options from Cox. We currently have "regular" expanded cable (not digital) but we do get some HD channels on our HD TV (they are the channels with "-") - TBS, ABC, NBC, CBS and a couple others. Will Tivo be able to record those HD channels if we stick with the cable package we have? 

If we upgrade to get the HD versions of the other cable channels, will we first have to pay the ~$63/month for digital cable, and then a cable card fee on top of that? Is there any package that would allow us to stick with regular cable, but just add on the HD versions of the channels we already get? Does anyone know if Cox in CT has the "M" cards, or would we have to pay for two regular cards?

Sorry, I know these are questions Cox should answer, but they aren't answering them for me because I don't think they understand Tivo and/or don't want to deal with it. They keep trying to push their DVR on me.

Thanks.


----------



## Johncv

JessLC said:


> Does anyone have any experience with this in Connecticut? We are considering upgrading to the new HD Tivo (currently have a Series 2), and I'm confused about our options from Cox. We currently have "regular" expanded cable (not digital) but we do get some HD channels on our HD TV (they are the channels with "-") - TBS, ABC, NBC, CBS and a couple others. Will Tivo be able to record those HD channels if we stick with the cable package we have?
> 
> If we upgrade to get the HD versions of the other cable channels, will we first have to pay the ~$63/month for digital cable, and then a cable card fee on top of that? Is there any package that would allow us to stick with regular cable, but just add on the HD versions of the channels we already get? Does anyone know if Cox in CT has the "M" cards, or would we have to pay for two regular cards?
> 
> Sorry, I know these are questions Cox should answer, but they aren't answering them for me because I don't think they understand Tivo and/or don't want to deal with it. They keep trying to push their DVR on me.
> 
> Thanks.


You really need to talk to your local Cox provider. As I understand it, you need digital cable in order to HD versions of channels. The best way to deal with this is to print out the PDF file of the TiVo HD manual and take it to the Cox office.


----------



## linkja35

Just got off the phone with Cox in Cleveland. They just told me that every time the power goes out, they would have to send someone out to re-activate the CableCARDs. Does anyone have any experience with this? Not that our power goes out all that much, but $30 each time it did (plus the aggravation of having to wait for a day or more for an appointment simply to re-activate) doesn't seem worth it.

I just received my TiVoHD yesterday and I'm already thinking of returning it without even getting it set up based on (what appears to be) numerous issues with the CableCARDs and lack of knowledge on the cable company side. Am I just overreacting? Is it worth the trouble - once everything is up and running, are there a lot of issues? I love my TiVo Series 2 (it's so stable and without ANY issues) and I bought the HD without reading up on it much before hand, just assuming that it would be the same user experience, just with the added benefit of HD programming.


----------



## deaddeeds

linkja35 said:


> Just got off the phone with Cox in Cleveland. They just told me that every time the power goes out, they would have to send someone out to re-activate the CableCARDs. Does anyone have any experience with this? Not that our power goes out all that much, but $30 each time it did (plus the aggravation of having to wait for a day or more for an appointment simply to re-activate) doesn't seem worth it.
> 
> I just received my TiVoHD yesterday and I'm already thinking of returning it without even getting it set up based on (what appears to be) numerous issues with the CableCARDs and lack of knowledge on the cable company side. Am I just overreacting? Is it worth the trouble - once everything is up and running, are there a lot of issues? I love my TiVo Series 2 (it's so stable and without ANY issues) and I bought the HD without reading up on it much before hand, just assuming that it would be the same user experience, just with the added benefit of HD programming.


In Fairfax, VA. I have lost power on several occasions and everything booted back up just fine. In the rare case that the Cable Card loses its activation status Cox can re-activate it over the phone.


----------



## linkja35

deaddeeds said:


> In Fairfax, VA. I have lost power on several occasions and everything booted back up just fine. In the rare case that the Cable Card loses its activation status Cox can re-activate it over the phone.


That makes me feel a little better. His other option was to offer me to pay $4.95 a month as 'insurance' and by paying this amount, it would allow me to have them come out as often as necessary to fix my CableCARD issues without any further one-time per-service-call charges.

Still looking for feedback about how happy or unhappy Cox customers are with their TiVoHDs after all the initial kinks are worked out. Thanks in advance to any of you who do respond!


----------



## av_dude

linkja35 said:


> That makes me feel a little better. His other option was to offer me to pay $4.95 a month as 'insurance' and by paying this amount, it would allow me to have them come out as often as necessary to fix my CableCARD issues without any further one-time per-service-call charges.
> 
> Still looking for feedback about how happy or unhappy Cox customers are with their TiVoHDs after all the initial kinks are worked out. Thanks in advance to any of you who do respond!


Other than waiting forever for the tuning adapters, things are working completely seemlessly for me (Cox - Orange County, CA). :up:


----------



## Johncv

linkja35 said:


> That makes me feel a little better. His other option was to offer me to pay $4.95 a month as 'insurance' and by paying this amount, it would allow me to have them come out as often as necessary to fix my CableCARD issues without any further one-time per-service-call charges.
> 
> Still looking for feedback about how happy or unhappy Cox customers are with their TiVoHDs after all the initial kinks are worked out. Thanks in advance to any of you who do respond!


The insurance here in San Diego is $2.95, even $4.95 it worth it. Keep in mind it cover anything that go wrong with your service. Had my outside line replace twice due to cracks in the line.


----------



## deaddeeds

linkja35 said:


> That makes me feel a little better. His other option was to offer me to pay $4.95 a month as 'insurance' and by paying this amount, it would allow me to have them come out as often as necessary to fix my CableCARD issues without any further one-time per-service-call charges.
> 
> Still looking for feedback about how happy or unhappy Cox customers are with their TiVoHDs after all the initial kinks are worked out. Thanks in advance to any of you who do respond!


With the roll out of the Tuning Adapter and now subsequent firmware patches, things have settled down. But if I could switch to FIOS I would in a heartbeat.


----------



## travellover

it took a while and i learned how to install and re pair (not fix but match cards with unit and cox) cable cards better than cox techs in many cases, I hve to give Cox head cable card GURU larry thomas tons of credit. he is not just the GURU but a heck of a great guy who really cares about his job and did great things for me. now i have had no issues for a log time. it's just a matter of getting the right person with the right cards. for some reason not all cable cards work, they had to try multiple cards but in the end i love my tivo. now if i could just get it to download you tube it would be even better. it recently stopped doing the you tube for no know reason. some vids work but overall 99.9&#37; don't

what a headache this causes !!


----------



## tivocrazy

deaddeeds said:


> With the roll out of the Tuning Adapter and now subsequent firmware patches, things have settled down. But if I could switch to FIOS I would in a heartbeat.


The last MAJOR update that Tivo rolled out was to fix a hugh issue that Tivo was having primarily with FIOS users. Programs were tilling so much that they became almost impossible to watch and this had gone on for at least a year. I don't know why we were also experiencing the same issue but on a smaller scale in our area using Cox but it was annoying and Cox had no answers for me. If it was not for the FIOS people across the nation screaming Tivo would probably still be trying to figure out how to fix the hot signal issue. I am just grateful that they finally have. So if you had switched to FIOS 8 months ago you would have regretted it. And yes, GO HOKIES!


----------



## NuShrike

So does anybody know if Cox in OC/Irvine is renting M-cards for the TivoHD yet?

From reading the threads I'm getting the impression there's a large disconnect between CS reps and techs in the field where sometimes there are M-cards out there and sometimes not.

The only communication I've had with Cox so far says they don't have M-cards, but I find that hard to believe.

I'm not looking forward to tussling with them about this. Currently, I get clearQAM channels fine, but no guide data which reads that I need the cablecard for ...


----------



## av_dude

NuShrike said:


> So does anybody know if Cox in OC/Irvine is renting M-cards for the TivoHD yet?
> 
> From reading the threads I'm getting the impression there's a large disconnect between CS reps and techs in the field where sometimes there are M-cards out there and sometimes not.
> 
> The only communication I've had with Cox so far says they don't have M-cards, but I find that hard to believe.
> 
> I'm not looking forward to tussling with them about this. Currently, I get clearQAM channels fine, but no guide data which reads that I need the cablecard for ...


The CS reps are clueless. I've been using my TiVo HD with an M-CARD for a few months. I believe they've had them for quite a few months.


----------



## CALover

NuShrike said:


> So does anybody know if Cox in OC/Irvine is renting M-cards for the TivoHD yet?
> 
> From reading the threads I'm getting the impression there's a large disconnect between CS reps and techs in the field where sometimes there are M-cards out there and sometimes not.
> 
> The only communication I've had with Cox so far says they don't have M-cards, but I find that hard to believe.
> 
> I'm not looking forward to tussling with them about this. Currently, I get clearQAM channels fine, but no guide data which reads that I need the cablecard for ...


I've had a Cox M card for almost a year and I live in Tustin. It works great, but if you're getting HD, you won't get :

717 FXHD
732 SCIHD
748 BETHD
749 MTVPHD
750 VH1PHD
752 SpikeHD
753 TravHD
759CMTHD
760 ComedyHD
770 Nickledeon HD
771 ToonHD
772 AnimalPlanet HD

because they don't offer tuning adapters. I have contacted Cox customer service a couple of times about this, but all they say is I need to get their cable box if I want all the channels. I just filed a complaint with the FCC about it.

Hope this helped!


----------



## tivocrazy

Wow, this is amazing how they treat you differently in different parts of the country. While I don't have an M card (I gave up on it due to a copy prevention bit being set which prevented me from transferring content to my other Tivo) so I have S cards. But, Cox does not limit my HD in any way so I am surprised they do out on the west coast. I would ask for a supervisor because out here Cox advertizes that HD is free with digital cable.


----------



## av_dude

tivocrazy said:


> Wow, this is amazing how they treat you differently in different parts of the country. While I don't have an M card (I gave up on it due to a copy prevention bit being set which prevented me from transferring content to my other Tivo) so I have S cards. But, Cox does not limit my HD in any way so I am surprised they do out on the west coast. I would ask for a supervisor because out here Cox advertizes that HD is free with digital cable.


The reason for not getting those channels CALover listed is that they are SDV channels. The tuning adapters were due to already be out, but they've delayed it again. The consensus appears to be that they will have the tuning adapters available by Dec. 31st of this year. Let's hope so.


----------



## jcaudle

av_dude said:


> The reason for not getting those channels CALover listed is that they are SDV channels. The tuning adapters were due to already be out, but they've delayed it again. The consensus appears to be that they will have the tuning adapters available by Dec. 31st of this year. Let's hope so.


We have had the tuning adapters for almost a year here in Northern Virginia with Cox. Our Fios friends don't have the CCI flags. The tuning adapters are cranky. Mine (2 of them) were pretty solid for the first six months, but since June I have traded them in 2 or 3 times each. And it only been one of them crapping out at a time fortunately. I am lucky since I don't live but 2 miles from the Cox store.


----------



## av_dude

jcaudle said:


> We have had the tuning adapters for almost a year here in Northern Virginia with Cox. Our Fios friends don't have the CCI flags. The tuning adapters are cranky. Mine (2 of them) were pretty solid for the first six months, but since June I have traded them in 2 or 3 times each. And it only been one of them crapping out at a time fortunately. I am lucky since I don't live but 2 miles from the Cox store.


In case it wasn't inferred, I was speaking of Orange Country, CA. That doesn't sound good about the tuning adapters, though.

Anyone else having issues with Cox and tuning adapters?


----------



## oscardeuce

I'm with Cox in Southern Claifornia (Palos Verdes), and I just got a letter yesterday that they are putting almost every channel except for the major the HD channels on SDV as of November 20th. No tuning adapters available at this time, and they're saying "maybe" they'll be out by the end of the year. They're offering a free STB (not a DVR) for 3 months as consolation.


----------



## NuShrike

CALover said:


> I've had a Cox M card for almost a year and I live in Tustin. It works great, but if you're getting HD, you won't get :
> 
> 732 SCIHD
> 753 TravHD
> 760 ComedyHD
> 771 ToonHD
> 
> Hope this helped!


This takes away any reason for me to step up to HD. Thanks for the help.

Filing with FCC too then ...


----------



## LynnL999

oscardeuce said:


> I'm with Cox in Southern Claifornia (Palos Verdes), and I just got a letter yesterday that they are putting almost every channel except for the major the HD channels on SDV as of November 20th. No tuning adapters available at this time, and they're saying "maybe" they'll be out by the end of the year. They're offering a free STB (not a DVR) for 3 months as consolation.


We received the same in Orange County. The analog channels are staying put, but most of the 100-series channels will be on SDV. So no BBCA, Bio, HISI, the additional Discovery-owned channels, etc. Very irritating, but at the end of the day, most of what I watch is in HD anyway. I just hope they get the tuning adapters squared away soon.


----------



## Islanti

av_dude said:


> In case it wasn't inferred, I was speaking of Orange Country, CA. That doesn't sound good about the tuning adapters, though.
> 
> Anyone else having issues with Cox and tuning adapters?


The VA tuning adapters (TAs) are for Motorolla equipment. Here in Orange County we have Cisco gear. The first Cox TAs are just being tested. Fortunately Orange County will be the first market to get them.

More here.


----------



## av_dude

Islanti said:


> The VA tuning adapters (TAs) are for Motorolla equipment. Here in Orange County we have Cisco gear. The first Cox TAs are just being tested. Fortunately Orange County will be the first market to get them.
> 
> More here.


Huh, as I look at my Cox, Orange County DVR right now, it is definitely a Moto box. I've been a Cox, OC customer for ten years now and have never seen a Cisco box.

The GADGETRESS even states such in your provided link:



> I mentioned this Motorola test in early September (see Cox O.C. will be first to test TiVo adapters from Motorola). The test was scheduled to start in September but was postponed when Cox rolled out new video-on-demand software instead (see earlier story, Cox fix for TiVo users delayed


----------



## LynnL999

I think Islanti got it backwards. OC is definitely Moto gear.


----------



## jcaudle

constant problems with Tuning adapters and now Cable card is out is out. I tell them to bring out a MCard....and the dumb a** tech brings an S card for my Tivo HD...said he forgot to look at it when hep picked it up at warehouse despite note on work order that asked him to make sure he brought one. Cable card was bad. Verizon has been on my street this week laying fiber optic for Fios. No more cox for me soon....Get rid of balky Cisco Tuning adapters and their crappy cable cards....and have Multi Room viewing without CCI flags.


----------



## tvmaster2

LynnL999 said:


> We received the same in Orange County. The analog channels are staying put, but most of the 100-series channels will be on SDV. So no BBCA, Bio, HISI, the additional Discovery-owned channels, etc. Very irritating, but at the end of the day, most of what I watch is in HD anyway. I just hope they get the tuning adapters squared away soon.


I too am in Orange County. could you explain a couple of things for me? What is "SDV", and how is it relevant to Cox cable-cards and Tivo HD boxes. Also, I watch BBCA more than any other Cox channel. How will a cable card with a Tivo HD be effected. Does the cable-card / Tivo HD combo reduce the number of HD channels that are available from Cox in comparison to what you receive with one of their DVR's?
Lastly, how many cable cards do you need from Cox, and what is their monthly cost?
Thanks a bunch


----------



## orgbd

av_dude said:


> The CS reps are clueless. I've been using my TiVo HD with an M-CARD for a few months. I believe they've had them for quite a few months.


I live in Irvine, CA and had an M-CARD installed in my TiVo HD last month. Over the phone they claimed that I needed 2 cards becasue they did not offer the M-CARD but the installer showed up with an M-CARD.


----------



## orgbd

tvmaster2 said:


> I too am in Orange County. could you explain a couple of things for me? What is "SDV", and how is it relevant to Cox cable-cards and Tivo HD boxes. Also, I watch BBCA more than any other Cox channel. How will a cable card with a Tivo HD be effected. Does the cable-card / Tivo HD combo reduce the number of HD channels that are available from Cox in comparison to what you receive with one of their DVR's?
> Lastly, how many cable cards do you need from Cox, and what is their monthly cost?
> Thanks a bunch


I will post a long thread about this issue on a few minutes answering most of your questions. The cost is minimal at $1.99 per card in Orange County, CA.

Search for "Urgent Issue relating to SDV, Tuning Adapters & TiVo"


----------



## orgbd

NuShrike said:


> This takes away any reason for me to step up to HD. Thanks for the help.
> 
> Filing with FCC too then ...


Once Tuning Adapters are available all of the potential tuning problems will be solved.


----------



## orgbd

av_dude said:


> In case it wasn't inferred, I was speaking of Orange Country, CA. That doesn't sound good about the tuning adapters, though.
> 
> Anyone else having issues with Cox and tuning adapters?


Only the availability of them. You can call Cox not and be out on a waiting list.


----------



## tvmaster2

orgbd said:


> I will post a long thread about this issue on a few minutes answering most of your questions. The cost is minimal at $1.99 per card in Orange County, CA.
> 
> Search for "Urgent Issue relating to SDV, Tuning Adapters & TiVo"


I tried - got nothing. Any advice on how to search on this forum? If I cut and paste your sentence, the search engine says I need more than two words (?). Hmmm
thanks


----------



## NuShrike

CALover said:


> I've had a Cox M card for almost a year and I live in Tustin. It works great, but if you're getting HD, you won't get :
> [snip]
> because they don't offer tuning adapters. I have contacted Cox customer service a couple of times about this, but all they say is I need to get their cable box if I want all the channels. I just filed a complaint with the FCC about it.


Well, just got my new Motorola (blue) *M-card* installed in my TivoHD along with a Motoroa MTR-700 Tuning adapter.

The tech was friendly and knowledgeable about the cable-card install. It took probably 5-7 minutes and all the major HD channels came in immediately.

However, none of the SDV channels came in, so the Motorola tuning adapter was then connected, and a dim yellow light started blinking. Tuning adaptor menu came up, but it couldn't tune any channels, and many of the diagnostic screens said 0 or not-initialized. Interestingly, the techs were being told to add the TA only if folks weren't getting the 8xx channels, and they were *not* trained to connect up the *USB* cable also.

So, I went ahead and connected the USB, a red led blinked, dim orange/yellow continued to blink, and still no SDV channels! SyFy HD, but no ComedyHD nor ToonHD.

I'd then Googled quickly for any info and vaguely got that the TA had to be added to the account and paired/initialized. Well, it was added to the account, but "dispatch" and tech didn't know anything about pairing/initialization of the TA.

So there you go, tuning adapters are available from Cox for the OC/Tustin area, but they don't know how set it up yet.

I'm running through the Guided Setup now to see if that helps anything.


----------



## NuShrike

CALover said:


> I've had a Cox M card for almost a year and I live in Tustin. It works great, but if you're getting HD, you won't get :
> [snip]
> because they don't offer tuning adapters. I have contacted Cox customer service a couple of times about this, but all they say is I need to get their cable box if I want all the channels. I just filed a complaint with the FCC about it.


Well, just got my new Motorola (blue) *M-card* installed in my TivoHD along with a Motoroa MTR-700 Tuning adapter.

The tech was friendly and knowledgeable about the cable-card install. It took probably 5-7 minutes and all the major HD channels came in immediately.

However, none of the SDV channels came in, so the Motorola tuning adapter was then connected, and a dim yellow light started blinking. Tuning adaptor menu came up, but it couldn't tune any channels, and many of the diagnostic screens said 0 or not-initialized. Interestingly, the techs were being told to add the TA only if folks weren't getting the 8xx channels, and they were *not* trained to connect up the *USB* cable also.

So, I went ahead and connected the USB, a red led blinked, dim orange/yellow continued to blink, and still no SDV channels! I'd then Googled quickly for any info and vaguely got that the TA had to be added to the account and paired/initialized. Well, it was added to the account, but "dispatch" and tech didn't know anything about pairing/initialization of the TA.

So there you go, tuning adapters are available from Cox for the OC/Tustin area, but they don't know how set it up yet.

I'm running through the Guided Setup now to see if that helps anything.

edit: guided setup doesn't help, and the SDV status screen for the TA still shows uninited with no upstream connection, and Warning Report shows "OOB Lost Lock".


----------



## BigTuna

NuShrike said:


> Well, just got my new Motorola (blue) *M-card* installed in my TivoHD along with a Motoroa MTR-700 Tuning adapter.
> 
> The tech was friendly and knowledgeable about the cable-card install. It took probably 5-7 minutes and all the major HD channels came in immediately.
> 
> However, none of the SDV channels came in, so the Motorola tuning adapter was then connected, and a dim yellow light started blinking. Tuning adaptor menu came up, but it couldn't tune any channels, and many of the diagnostic screens said 0 or not-initialized. Interestingly, the techs were being told to add the TA only if folks weren't getting the 8xx channels, and they were *not* trained to connect up the *USB* cable also.
> 
> So, I went ahead and connected the USB, a red led blinked, dim orange/yellow continued to blink, and still no SDV channels! I'd then Googled quickly for any info and vaguely got that the TA had to be added to the account and paired/initialized. Well, it was added to the account, but "dispatch" and tech didn't know anything about pairing/initialization of the TA.
> 
> So there you go, tuning adapters are available from Cox for the OC/Tustin area, but they don't know how set it up yet.
> 
> I'm running through the Guided Setup now to see if that helps anything.
> 
> edit: guided setup doesn't help, and the SDV status screen for the TA still shows uninited with no upstream connection, and Warning Report shows "OOB Lost Lock".


I have full instructions. I installed 2 of these today without any problems. I did connect via USB port #2 on the Tivo, port #1 didn't seem to work. it takes about 15-20 minutes to sync. The scan file is too big to attach here. Send me a PM or email and I will forward.

BT


----------



## NuShrike

BigTuna said:


> I have full instructions. I installed 2 of these today without any problems. I did connect via USB port #2 on the Tivo, port #1 didn't seem to work. it takes about 15-20 minutes to sync. The scan file is too big to attach here. Send me a PM or email and I will forward.


I'm connecting by port #1 (the top one).

So I resolved this by calling CS whom shunted me to a special department to activate it. It takes ~20 minutes to sync after that to get a solid amber light, and then it's all good.

I don't get 730 (SPEED) and some other channels in the 7xx range although I do get CCHD and TOONHD, so good enough.


----------



## av_dude

NuShrike said:


> I'm connecting by port #1 (the top one).
> 
> So I resolved this by calling CS whom shunted me to a special department to activate it. It takes ~20 minutes to sync after that to get a solid amber light, and then it's all good.
> 
> I don't get 730 (SPEED) and some other channels in the 7xx range although I do get CCHD and TOONHD, so good enough.


That's strange. You should get all the SDV channels.


----------



## NuShrike

av_dude said:


> That's strange. You should get all the SDV channels.


SPEED is on SDV? I'll ping Cox sometime to see why some of my digital channels are missing. Thanks.


----------



## av_dude

NuShrike said:


> SPEED is on SDV? I'll ping Cox sometime to see why some of my digital channels are missing. Thanks.


Actually, no, I didn't word my sentence well. That said, to get SPEED, I believe you need to have the Sports and Info Tier. Did you get SPEED before?

http://ww2.cox.com/residential/orangecounty/tv/channel-lineup.cox#9


----------



## NeoMinder

I'm trying to understand the way cox charges for cables cards. I was told it was $2 per month per card. I see now that Cox is charging $2 for the card, and $2 for "Digital gateway service". So it appears that Cox really charges $4/month per cable card. Has anybody else had this experience? It just seems like you should be able to watch the cable tv you are paying for, not getting charged for the "service" of being able to watch the cable. Seems odd to me.


----------



## av_dude

NeoMinder said:


> I'm trying to understand the way cox charges for cables cards. I was told it was $2 per month per card. I see now that Cox is charging $2 for the card, and $2 for "Digital gateway service". So it appears that Cox really charges $4/month per cable card. Has anybody else had this experience? It just seems like you should be able to watch the cable tv you are paying for, not getting charged for the "service" of being able to watch the cable. Seems odd to me.


I believe the Digital Gateway service is $5 a month and a CableCARD is $1.99 a month, thus $7 per month total - plus the cost of the TiVo service, of course. When you factor in the hardware purchase, there really is very little financial advantage of the TiVo over the cable DVR. Now the features, quality, and general experience, that's entirely different.


----------



## NeoMinder

av_dude said:


> I believe the Digital Gateway service is $5 a month and a CableCARD is $1.99 a month, thus $7 per month total - plus the cost of the TiVo service, of course. When you factor in the hardware purchase, there really is very little financial advantage of the TiVo over the cable DVR. Now the features, quality, and general experience, that's entirely different.


So since I have three cable cards I pay the gateway fee three times?

$6 for 3 cards
$6 for 3 gateway services.

I have a Cox set top box, so on my bill i have the gateway service listed 4 times total. The first one is for $5, then the other three are for $2 each. I can understand that fee to the cox box, but charging the gateway fee for each cable card? That seems crazy to me.


----------



## av_dude

NeoMinder said:


> So since I have three cable cards I pay the gateway fee three times?
> 
> $6 for 3 cards
> $6 for 3 gateway services.
> 
> I have a Cox set top box, so on my bill i have the gateway service listed 4 times total. The first one is for $5, then the other three are for $2 each. I can understand that fee to the cox box, but charging the gateway fee for each cable card? That seems crazy to me.


No, you will only have to pay one Digital Gateway fee. The wording on the bills can be confusing at times.


----------



## Shawn95GT

They may charge the digital gateway fee per card until you complain. They did for me.


----------



## NeoMinder

Shawn95GT said:


> They may charge the digital gateway fee per card until you complain. They did for me.


I did call and complain. They said it was correct. $5 gateway fee for the cox box, and $2 gateay fee for each cable card. It's listed that way on the bill. So $11 a month for the gateway, what ever that is.


----------



## cwpomeroy

sorry to jump in. but i'm heading out tonight to buy a gift for someone that lives in gainesville fl and has Cox. They would like a tivo. What's the latest on them working well with Cox? I know in the past there were some pending incompatabilities that might have limited certain features like interactive or PPV/channels/etc? 

Assuming the monthly economics aren't a concern (paying for the service, cards etc..) does it work well and are there any pending issues to be aware of?

Thanks!!!!!


----------



## snarler

cwpomeroy said:


> sorry to jump in. but i'm heading out tonight to buy a gift for someone that lives in gainesville fl and has Cox. They would like a tivo. What's the latest on them working well with Cox? I know in the past there were some pending incompatabilities that might have limited certain features like interactive or PPV/channels/etc?
> 
> Assuming the monthly economics aren't a concern (paying for the service, cards etc..) does it work well and are there any pending issues to be aware of?
> 
> Thanks!!!!!


I live in G'ville, and have Cox Digital Cable, and use a TiVo HD with Cablecard, and beyond a small installation issue that was resolved over the phone (Cox needed to reset my Cablecard or authorize it or whatever the proper term is but for some reason is took a three way call between me, Cox, and TiVo and about an hour on hold while the tech typed away furiously to make it finally work) everything works as desired. The only problem I have is that I believe my signal is too hot and I have some attenuators on the way to see if I can clear that up. The symptom I am having is that every so often I'll get a video hiccup (pixelation, etc.) and/or the sound will vanish for a few seconds. I wouldn't even care but when I try to transfer a recording that has a particular hiccupy spot in it to my PC it stops when it gets to the hiccup. And I've tried several different ways to get it to my PC to no avail.

Price-wise, oddly enough, it's about a dollar or two cheaper than just regular digital cable, let alone the monthly PVR fee they have vs the lifetime option with TiVo. I love it. After football season is over, I might scale back to just limited basic (locals only plus some shopping networks) but keep the cablecard for the guide data and digital music channels.

Edited to add: Meant to also say you don't get some features they offer like OnDemand.


----------



## snarler

NeoMinder said:


> I did call and complain. They said it was correct. $5 gateway fee for the cox box, and $2 gateay fee for each cable card. It's listed that way on the bill. So $11 a month for the gateway, what ever that is.


I can only speak for my Cox cable bill, but if I compare the line items to their listed prices for various services, it turns out that the $5 gateway fee plus what they have listed for extended basic and limited basic ends up being what they say digital cable costs before they add in the set top box. The 2 per card is a rental fee that takes the place of the rental fee you would be paying them for the set top box they would provide.

Of course, now that I go back to their site to the price list, it's all changed around with special offers lol so I can't easily point out what I'm getting at.


----------



## pokechop8898

I live in Baton Rouge, LA. Recently had a cox tech come out to my house for a new coax line to be run. I was robbed five days later. My tivo was stolen. I got a new TivoHD for christmas, and now need cableCards. Needless to say, I refuse to have another tech in my home. I have watched someone do an install, not very difficult. How can I convince Cox to mail me or let me pick up the card?


----------



## Johncv

pokechop8898 said:


> I live in Baton Rouge, LA. Recently had a cox tech come out to my house for a new coax line to be run. I was robbed five days later. My tivo was stolen. I got a new TivoHD for christmas, and now need cableCards. Needless to say, I refuse to have another tech in my home. I have watched someone do an install, not very difficult. How can I convince Cox to mail me or let me pick up the card?


Installing the Cable Card is not difficult, but pairing the card may need tweaking so your better off having a tech talking to the people at the other end. Do NOT let the tech leave until the following conditions are met:

1. Your receiving ALL the channels to which subscribe, including all HD channels. Make sure there are no picture or sound problem.

2. Even if you dont use close caption, make sure it work. Turn digital close caption OFF on the TiVo. Leave the analog close caption on. Turn close caption on and check all your channel for close caption.


----------



## pkbradbury

I installed the Motorola adapter to my Tivo HD today and I now recieve channel 1 on Cox (On Demand). Trouble is, pressing select on my remote will not connect me to the services. Anybody found a work around for this yet


----------



## Goofball

pkbradbury said:


> I installed the Motorola adapter to my Tivo HD today and I now recieve channel 1 on Cox (On Demand). Trouble is, pressing select on my remote will not connect me to the services. Anybody found a work around for this yet


The Tuning Adapter does not allow you to get "On Demand" services. All it does is allow your TiVo to request and tune SDV channels. If you want to use "On Demand" or one button PPV services you will need a cable company digital STB or DVR.

TiVo and Cox/other cable companies could potentially make "On Demand" services work through the TA/CableCard combo in the TiVo but haven't bothered to figure it out at this time. I'm guessing it is so they can get the additional money from you having to rent a STB. STB rentals are a cash cow for the cable companies.


----------



## pokechop8898

Is it possible to have a Cox stb with a tivoHD? i thought that was the entire point of the cableCard slots. I would much rather a stb, can i use one with an HD Tivo?


----------



## Goofball

pokechop8898 said:


> Is it possible to have a Cox stb with a tivoHD? i thought that was the entire point of the cableCard slots. I would much rather a stb, can i use one with an HD Tivo?


You are correct, the S3/HD/HDXL are stand alone and have no option to interface with and control a STB.

You can, however, hook up a STB to your TV as well as as the TiVo on separate inputs and switch between them when you want to use functions that are only available on the STB (On Demand, PPV).


----------



## NuShrike

av_dude said:


> Actually, no, I didn't word my sentence well. That said, to get SPEED, I believe you need to have the Sports and Info Tier. Did you get SPEED before?
> 
> http://ww2.cox.com/residential/orangecounty/tv/channel-lineup.cox#9


Okay, that might explain it, although it is in the HD tier.

Recently, I've "lost" two channels and since neither of the 2 Cox techs that have passed by can explain it *nor fix it* besides sending a "hit" to the TA, maybe somebody here can help me.

I'm getting ToonSD(71) on 225000KHz and ToonHD(771) on 699000KHz. However the HD channel is simulcasting the SD content because it's 480i and matches the 71 channel guide, not the 771's guide. I know I got ToonHD properly before because it was when the OC TAs came out and I got a CC installed for the first time. I've also recorded content in 1080i.

Is those frequencies correct for those of you in the OC COX area?

Meanwhile, I've also had lost channel KNBC(4) on 573000KHz, but it seems fiddling with the cables and sending a couple pairs have brought it back.

So, I *really* would like to get my ToonHD back on this m-card, and Cox only seems to have s-cards now.


----------



## oscardeuce

snarler said:


> I live in G'ville, and have Cox Digital Cable, and use a TiVo HD with Cablecard, and beyond a small installation issue that was resolved over the phone (Cox needed to reset my Cablecard or authorize it or whatever the proper term is but for some reason is took a three way call between me, Cox, and TiVo and about an hour on hold while the tech typed away furiously to make it finally work) everything works as desired. The only problem I have is that I believe my signal is too hot and I have some attenuators on the way to see if I can clear that up. The symptom I am having is that every so often I'll get a video hiccup (pixelation, etc.) and/or the sound will vanish for a few seconds. I wouldn't even care but when I try to transfer a recording that has a particular hiccupy spot in it to my PC it stops when it gets to the hiccup. And I've tried several different ways to get it to my PC to no avail.
> 
> Price-wise, oddly enough, it's about a dollar or two cheaper than just regular digital cable, let alone the monthly PVR fee they have vs the lifetime option with TiVo. I love it. After football season is over, I might scale back to just limited basic (locals only plus some shopping networks) but keep the cablecard for the guide data and digital music channels.
> 
> Edited to add: Meant to also say you don't get some features they offer like OnDemand.


Snarler:

Did you get your attenuators, and did they work? I have the same pixellation and audio blips you describe. Oddly enough, it seems to be worse on SD channels.


----------



## snarler

oscardeuce said:


> Snarler:
> 
> Did you get your attenuators, and did they work? I have the same pixellation and audio blips you describe. Oddly enough, it seems to be worse on SD channels.


No not yet. They were some 3rd party from Amazon with cheap shipping. Says they'll be in anywhere between the 30th and the 5th. I'm a little nervous that it won't work for a couple reasons. One is that I don't think my error counts match what to expect in the cases of problems that this will solve. Two is that it seems that one of my tuners has a different strength and SNR than the other and I wonder if bringing one down to levels that might clear up the problem will either bring the other down too low or leave it too high depending on which I target first. But we'll see.  I've got 2 3's, 2 6's and 2 12's coming. If this don't affect my signal nothing will lol.


----------



## NuShrike

NuShrike said:


> Recently, I've "lost" two channels and since neither of the 2 Cox techs that have passed by can explain it *nor fix it* besides sending a "hit" to the TA, maybe somebody here can help me.
> 
> I'm getting ToonSD(71) on 225000KHz and ToonHD(771) on 699000KHz. However the HD channel is simulcasting the SD content because it's 480i and matches the 71 channel guide, not the 771's guide. I know I got ToonHD properly before because it was when the OC TAs came out and I got a CC installed for the first time. I've also recorded content in 1080i.


So here's the semi-"official" line I got back from Cox finally:

Cartoon Network made the "decision to start delivering content in standard definition and not high definition" at least for either Cox, or the Pacific market, and nothing related to my m-card (which they tried sending 2 clueless techs to take away and replace with s-cards).

Also, the guide data is wrong due to their "guide vendor". Right, sure ...

Not sure why this wasn't announced, and why they still list TOONHD as HD, and why bother putting it on SDV? ...


----------



## Exige240

Goofball said:


> You are correct, the S3/HD/HDXL are stand alone and have no option to interface with and control a STB.
> 
> You can, however, hook up a STB to your TV as well as as the TiVo on separate inputs and switch between them when you want to use functions that are only available on the STB (On Demand, PPV).


That's what I just did. I just got my Tivo's and had the cox tech out to set them up this week. I told them I wanted them to pick up my 2 cox dvr's and bring 2 Cox Hd boxes, that way we can just switch inputs on the Tv when we want use on demand.

When the tech came he said I could keep my Motorola 6412 dvr and they could just send a signal to turn off the Dvr functions. I tried to bribe him with beer and pizza to leave that portion on, but he wasn't hearing it.lol My other dvr was a newer Motorola 3416 which he said they wouldn't just turn off the dvr since it has a larger internal HD and it was in higher demand.

The new hd box I got was about 1/4 the size of the older Motorola boxes and it does have a cable card in it(so did the 3416), it has no buttons on it and have to use a remote now. The tech told me the new dvr version of that exact box is supposed to have a 240 gig drive in it and they are testing Tivo's software on it at his place.


----------



## Warrenator

Just an update about my issue. I got a new HDXL box, Cox technician came out and installed a single stream card (s-card), when I asked why not put in a multi-stream card (m-card, a Motorola), he said, "oh, did you want one of those?" and put that in instead. He then hooked up the tuning adapter (also Motorola) and made a series of phone calls and fiddled with his Blackberry to get everything initialized and whatnot. But it would not tune certain channels like 743 (MTV HD) or 746 (Travel Channel HD) and he said maybe those are on a tier you don't get. When I said but I get them on regular TV, he pulled out a year old channel guide, said none of these are listed on my guide, and tried to call the office again, nobody would pick up on the tech support numbers he called, so he said, why don't you call "Digital Ops" on Tuesday. (This was Saturday of a 3 day weekend.) 

So I emailed Big Tuna (user here on TCF) because he said he had the self-install instructions to set up the tuning adapter, he sent them right away. Here's what they say:

1 Make sure the connections are going to the right place, cable into the tuning adapter, tuning adapter out into the tivo, USB hooked up, power on. 

2. Call Cox to activate at 1-866-248-9585

3. When activated, the red light should flash and go out, when the amber light is flashing it means activation is incomplete, when the amber light goes steady it means it is activated and ready. 

4. Tivo box message came on and said tuning adapter installed, you can go to a menu and test the channels. 

5. When the tuning adapter box is working properly the amber light will be steady on, and the red light will flash when you change a channel to a SD channel. The red light means the tuning adapter is communicating with Cox. 

6. If all that doesn't work the Cox line for Tivo tech support is 1-866-318-0965

I had to call Cox tech support and they reactivated my tuning adapter, it all works great now.


----------



## boywaja

Turned on the TV tonight and received a message that cablecard 2 is upgrading firmware. That was 4 hours ago.

Anyone else with Cox Fairfax seen their card's firmware updated recently?


----------



## delgadobb

boywaja said:


> Turned on the TV tonight and received a message that cablecard 2 is upgrading firmware. That was 4 hours ago.
> 
> Anyone else with Cox Fairfax seen their card's firmware updated recently?


Well, I'm with Cox Las Vegas, but the other night I came home late & wanted to catch up on the (TIVOed) Olympics. About 3:30 AM PST Wed night/Thurs AM Cox decided it was a good time to update the cable card firmware. Not sure why.

What I *do* know is that I couldn't use either of my HD Tivos, so I eventually gave up & went to bed. Some of my recordings from that night got screwed up, so Cox will definitely be getting a phone call.

Anyone know why this firmware update was done (presumably) automatically? I mean, most of the Cox techs can't do cable card stuff with three people & a manager involved. Why would they expect it to work unattended & unannounced?


----------



## boywaja

one of my reasons for posting is to find out if Cox Fairfax did push a firmware update or not. Either way my card was dead. 

Cox came out today. Failed to bring two cards like I asked. I was a bit worried about him putting one multi card with existing single stream card that still worked

I had to call in to support and have them hit my cards multiple times, and reset the tuning adaptor before it finally got all the channels. What a pain.


----------



## deadz007

Hello, I also live in Las Vegas and have Cox as my cable provider. I have a TiVo HD DVR and for some odd reason starting two days ago, after installing an M cablecard my DVR seems to randomly reset itself.

I've spoken with TiVo reps and they seem to all agree that it is a cablecard issue. Has anyone else had their HD DVRs randomly reset when trying to access recordings? I'm really trying to figure out if I need to call Cox and get this sorted out.


----------



## Johncv

deadz007 said:


> Hello, I also live in Las Vegas and have Cox as my cable provider. I have a TiVo HD DVR and for some odd reason starting two days ago, after installing an M cablecard my DVR seems to randomly reset itself.
> 
> I've spoken with TiVo reps and they seem to all agree that it is a cablecard issue. Has anyone else had their HD DVRs randomly reset when trying to access recordings? I'm really trying to figure out if I need to call Cox and get this sorted out.


Try this, power down (unplug) your TiVo for about an hour and then power it back up. The cable card should refresh and everything should work. If not then you will have to call Cox.

If you use a Tuning Adapter, make sure it hook up correct. Search the form for info on that. I don't use one here in San Diego.


----------



## tamaman

I have had a THD with two s-cards up and running with Cox Omaha for little over two years. As far as I know I was getting all the channels I thought I was supposed to get, didn't seem to be having any SDV issues, but to be honest maybe I didn't know I was missing anything. My THD hard drive died a couple of weeks ago and I grabbed the Cox DVR just to have something. I of course hate it so I just ordered a Tivo Premiere. (decided to spend the extra $$ rather than replacing the hard drive). So my questions is: should I just stick the 2 s-cards I still have into my new TiVo when it gets here, or move to an M-card? (don't really care about the extra 2 bucks if it saves me some hassle). If I move to an M-card will I need a Tuning Adaptor? Thanks!


----------



## gwsat

tamaman said:


> I have had a THD with two s-cards up and running with Cox Omaha for little over two years. As far as I know I was getting all the channels I thought I was supposed to get, didn't seem to be having any SDV issues, but to be honest maybe I didn't know I was missing anything. My THD hard drive died a couple of weeks ago and I grabbed the Cox DVR just to have something. I of course hate it so I just ordered a Tivo Premiere. (decided to spend the extra $$ rather than replacing the hard drive). So my questions is: should I just stick the 2 s-cards I still have into my new TiVo when it gets here, or move to an M-card? (don't really care about the extra 2 bucks if it saves me some hassle). If I move to an M-card will I need a Tuning Adaptor? Thanks!


I believe that the new S4 boxes have only one CableCARD slot and require M-cards.


----------



## scott85213

I'm trying to figure out how I can get some cable cards for my box without paying the ridiculous $60 "Professional Installation" in Phoenix, does anyone have any ideas?

I'd like to use the Tivo I have, but I see no reason to pay for all the stuff when it'll cost me a large amount of money for basically the same functionality I'm looking for with their cable box I have now. I was just hoping to pay for the monthly tivo subscription and the card rental fee, and NO installation fees, so the cost would be roughly the same as the cablebox I have now.

I called in and was redirected to the cable card technical support line and this guy didn't know if they had M-Stream cards or even what the difference was, and said it was impossible for a non-professional to install them. Needless to say I'm very frustrated with their lack of knowledge and the cablecard activation scam they got going right now.


----------



## gwsat

scott85213 said:


> I'm trying to figure out how I can get some cable cards for my box without paying the ridiculous $60 "Professional Installation" in Phoenix, does anyone have any ideas?


Apparently, Cox OKC has the same policy as Cox Phoenix. I recently had to have a new M Card installed and Cox required that I have a $40 service call so that a Cox tech could be here and oversee this end of the installation. I understand that some cable companies don't have this requirement but Cox evidently does.


----------



## Johncv

scott85213 said:


> I'm trying to figure out how I can get some cable cards for my box without paying the ridiculous $60 "Professional Installation" in Phoenix, does anyone have any ideas?


I live in Chula Vista, which is serve by Cox San Diego. I pay $2.95 a month for the Cox Service Assurance Plan. What this mean is if anything go wrong with my service Cox has to fix it at no additional charge. This include the cable card installed in the TiVo HD. When I requested a card for my TiVo, no problem, made an appointment. Cox sent out a tech the next day, but receive a phone call that the tech would be late and Cox credit $20.00 to my account. When the tech arrive he had an M-card (I was told they only had s-cards), I ask and was told they just receive them. He wrote down the card number and pop card and proceeded with the set-up, had to call TiVo for a clarification on cable card set-up screen, call Cox HQ to activate the card and did not leave till he had the thing working. Took him a little more then an hour. Because I had the service plan, no charge.

You may want to check and see if Cox in your area offer a service plan.


----------



## gwsat

Johncv said:


> I live in Chula Vista, which is serve by Cox San Diego. I pay $2.95 a month for the Cox Service Assurance Plan. What this mean is if anything go wrong with my service Cox has to fix it at no additional charge. This include the cable card installed in the TiVo HD. When I requested a card for my TiVo, no problem, made an appointment. Cox sent out a tech the next day, but receive a phone call that the tech would be late and Cox credit $20.00 to my account. When the tech arrive he had an M-card (I was told they only had s-cards), I ask and was told they just receive them. He wrote down the card number and pop card and proceeded with the set-up, had to call TiVo for a clarification on cable card set-up screen, call Cox HQ to activate the card and did not leave till he had the thing working. Took him a little more then an hour. Because I had the service plan, no charge.
> 
> You may want to check and see if Cox in your area offer a service plan.


Was this a new card for a new TiVo? If so, Cox San Diego treated you better than Cox OKC treated me. I, too, have the Cox Service Assurance Plan, but it only covers repairs, not the installation of new CableCARDs in newly acquired CableCARD capable devices. Thus, I had to pay a $40 installation charge when I had an M Card installed in a newly acquired TiVo DVR.


----------



## Johncv

gwsat said:


> Was this a new card for a new TiVo? If so, Cox San Diego treated you better than Cox OKC treated me. I, too, have the Cox Service Assurance Plan, but it only covers repairs, not the installation of new CableCARDs in newly acquired CableCARD capable devices. Thus, I had to pay a $40 installation charge when I had an M Card installed in a newly acquired TiVo DVR.


At the time, it was a new TiVo. From what I been reading it seem everything depend on who managing the area.


----------



## culhwch

scott85213 said:


> I called in and was redirected to the cable card technical support line and this guy didn't know if they had M-Stream cards or even what the difference was, and said it was impossible for a non-professional to install them. Needless to say I'm very frustrated with their lack of knowledge and the cablecard activation scam they got going right now.


An e-mail I got from Cox Phoenix about a month ago said they have M-Cards. The monthly charge for an S-Card is $2.00; for an M-Card is $4.00.

And, no, I don't know how to get around the tech having to come out to install it. I would like to know that as well!


----------



## tvmaster2

scott85213 said:


> I'm trying to figure out how I can get some cable cards for my box without paying the ridiculous $60 "Professional Installation" in Phoenix, does anyone have any ideas?
> 
> I'd like to use the Tivo I have, but I see no reason to pay for all the stuff when it'll cost me a large amount of money for basically the same functionality I'm looking for with their cable box I have now. I was just hoping to pay for the monthly tivo subscription and the card rental fee, and NO installation fees, so the cost would be roughly the same as the cablebox I have now.
> 
> I called in and was redirected to the cable card technical support line and this guy didn't know if they had M-Stream cards or even what the difference was, and said it was impossible for a non-professional to install them. Needless to say I'm very frustrated with their lack of knowledge and the cablecard activation scam they got going right now.


Here's what I did - bought a used TiVo HD from someone in the same cable company area as me. Then, before I left their house, had them call the cable company and switch the cable card to my account. Effectively, the seller told the cable company that I had his permission to remove the card from his house. Since the card and Tivo were already paired, the cable company COULDN'T say that they needed an "expert" to come to the house and make it work. I then went to the cable company store, and the CSR typed out a few commands and voila - no charge.


----------



## djwilso

tvmaster2 said:


> Here's what I did - bought a used TiVo HD from someone in the same cable company area as me. Then, before I left their house, had them call the cable company and switch the cable card to my account. Effectively, the seller told the cable company that I had his permission to remove the card from his house. Since the card and Tivo were already paired, the cable company COULDN'T say that they needed an "expert" to come to the house and make it work. I then went to the cable company store, and the CSR typed out a few commands and voila - no charge.


That is good that you found a way around the truck roll, but you have to admit that this scenario is extremely exceptional.


----------



## tvmaster2

djwilso said:


> That is good that you found a way around the truck roll, but you have to admit that this scenario is extremely exceptional.


it involved some quick thinking on my feet - but that truck-roll cost sucks so much it made me think extra hard. Look on Craigslist. It's amazing how many of these come up for sale, every week, in the same cable area as me.


----------



## gwsat

Cox OKC requires a service call, at a cost of $40, whenever they do a CableCard installation. If there is a way around paying that charge, I don't know what it is.


----------



## evilipoo

I just got off the phone with Cox San Diego. The installation fee for the Mcard is now $75 and they deny that there is a self install option. 

There has got to be a way around this...


----------



## ajwees41

evilipoo said:


> I just got off the phone with Cox San Diego. The installation fee for the Mcard is now $75 and they deny that there is a self install option.
> 
> There has got to be a way around this...


cox does not allow self installs of cable cards yet


----------



## guammm17

Just wanted to post a note on cox phoenix with S4 tivos. Cox Phoenix does have M-cablecards, don't let anyone tell you different. The people at cox in Tempe Marketplace and on the phone all claimed that they did not offer multistream cablecards. After much arguing and convincing, they "realized" that they did in fact offer multistream cards (I showed them the back of one of their cable boxes with a multistream card in it and asked how was this possible if they did not have them).

The charge for install was $30, and I couldn't talk them out of letting me do it myself, but the installer was quite nice and very quick, had the box set up in under 10 minutes. He had four "green" cards in his shirt pocket when he came over. I believe the fee for the cablecard is $4/month, however no one would give me a straight answer on this.

Hope this story helps someone out there.


----------



## tvmaster2

guammm17 said:


> Just wanted to post a note on cox phoenix with S4 tivos. Cox Phoenix does have M-cablecards, don't let anyone tell you different. The people at cox in Tempe Marketplace and on the phone all claimed that they did not offer multistream cablecards. After much arguing and convincing, they "realized" that they did in fact offer multistream cards (I showed them the back of one of their cable boxes with a multistream card in it and asked how was this possible if they did not have them).
> 
> The charge for install was $30, and I couldn't talk them out of letting me do it myself, but the installer was quite nice and very quick, had the box set up in under 10 minutes. He had four "green" cards in his shirt pocket when he came over. I believe the fee for the cablecard is $4/month, however no one would give me a straight answer on this.
> 
> Hope this story helps someone out there.


In Orange County the monthly is $1.99, with a $55 install, but if you find the right CSR, they'll reduce that fee. Sadly, NO ONE in CSR technical seems to know anything about trouble-shooting a Tivo with cable card.


----------



## PVCOX90275

tvmaster2 said:


> In Orange County the monthly is $1.99, with a $55 install, but if you find the right CSR, they'll reduce that fee. Sadly, NO ONE in CSR technical seems to know anything about trouble-shooting a Tivo with cable card.


First time Tivo user, I was too told by multiple CSR from Cox in Palos verdes that installtion is $55 and they don't allow self installation. However, one of last CSR that I talked to recommended that I contact retention unit as they have more leverage in waiving the fee. So I called Cox retention and complained that it's ridiculous that Cox wants to charge me $55 for something that I can pick up at their office and insert into Tivo myself. It's very upsetting that I want to switch to Verizon FIOS. The retention guy was very nice but it was also his first time hearing about cable card. Anyway, he put me on hold and contacted his technical support to research. In the end, he was able to find out how to order cable card installation for me and waive $55.


----------



## zowwie85

Does anyone on Cox Phoenix have an issue with suggestions not being recorded? Series 3 HD + SDV seems to = no suggestions.


----------



## spartan300

Has anyone else experienced the same issue as this.

Ordered a S4 Premiere and had Cox come out to install M-Card.
It worked for 4 hours and then spit out a 161-38 error call your cable company and report.

Since that day 3 months ago I have had 3 different premier boxes an over 20 cable cards. Nothing has worked for more than 4 hours and I am not able to record any shows because the signal is lost and I eventually just get a blank screen with the floating message of lost signal trying again from Tivo.

My stats are as follows
S4 Premiere with ver. 14.5
SA Multi stream cable card
Cox Digital cable
signal strength of 95-98 depending on channnel
SNR 37-39 (This is the kicker because Tivo says it can't be above a 35 and Cox showed me documentation that says their standard is anywhere between a 30-50 and most of their equipment runs in the 40's)
I will receive anywhere from 100--250 RS Uncorrected errors but it doesnt fluctuate, once it is on a channel the Uncorrected errors stay at the same number. I have used this support article for ref on the RS count: support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/150/c/123&#37;2C130/r_id/100041

I have had Cox run a new line to my house for better signal and I have tried an attenuator but nothing has worked.

When I can get to the the CableCard option screens the FDC says it is locked and it is paired and authorized. 

If I reboot the Tivo the channels come back but again only for about 4 hours and then it looses the signal and i have restart again.

Is it just me or is anyone else having this same amount of trouble getting a premier to work with Cox in Cleveland?


----------



## moyekj

Can't really help you with your problem, but perhaps more information will be useful in getting it resolved with cable company.
CableCard error codes can be found here:
http://www.opencable.com/downloads/specs/OC-SP-CCIF2.0-I07-060803.pdf
161-38 you can find in the table on page 252.
"Card fails to respond to ca_info_inq within 5 seconds"

If you search for ca_info_inq within that PDF document there are several references to it, including this blurb on page 96:
"Under normal operating conditions, this session will never be closed".

So sounds like that is getting closed perhaps because your card is losing communication with the headend.


----------



## spartan300

moyekj said:


> Can't really help you with your problem, but perhaps more information will be useful in getting it resolved with cable company.
> CableCard error codes can be found here:
> opencable.com/downloads/specs/OC-SP-CCIF2.0-I07-060803.pdf
> 161-38 you can find in the table on page 252.
> "Card fails to respond to ca_info_inq within 5 seconds"
> 
> If you search for ca_info_inq within that PDF document there are several references to it, including this blurb on page 96:
> "Under normal operating conditions, this session will never be closed".
> 
> So sounds like that is getting closed perhaps because your card is losing communication with the headend.


Thanks moyekj.....at least now I have something to show Cox tech next time I call him out. Neither Tivo CableCard support reps nor Cox tech could tell me what the error code actually meant and they both have just been pointing fingers at each other and saying try another Card. After 20+ cards though I don't think another one is going to make a difference.

I am just stubborn enough to keep calling a tech out until it works even after 3 months.


----------



## zowwie85

evilipoo said:


> I just got off the phone with Cox San Diego. The installation fee for the Mcard is now $75 and they deny that there is a self install option.
> 
> There has got to be a way around this...


First, get the best deal you can on a TiVo Premiere since you're wasting your time trying to get an S3 to work with cablecard and SDV and still have the features that TiVo markets as an inducement to pay for the subscription. An S3 will stop suggesting shows you might like.

Budget at least TWO 1/2 days off of work (or weekend appointments). They are correct, there is no self install option. Given the state of the (lack of) employee training there isn't even a likelihood of a first time "professional"  install.

Insist you need the M-card plus SDV box. The first person they send will be a contractor, who may well know how to do the install but he won't have immediate access to anyone who can manipulate the authorization system to pair your M-card to your TiVo AND pair the card to the SDV box.

The reality of the install is that if you ever plugged a pacman cartridge into an atari (or something like that) AND plugged a computer into a printer... AND you can correctly read and react to english numbers and letters - yes, this could be a self-install. Cox has made a business decision not to support that.

You will have to agree to the fee in the first place. If lightning strikes and you get a successful install on the first try you'll probably have to pay it. Given the VERY MINIMAL level of training Cox has given their employees (and least of all, contractors) - the first attempt will not succeed.

DO NOT stand for the contractor who shows up with card only and tells you the SDV box is unnecessary. Let him leave with a vague promise to come back and then call to b**tch.

After the first attempt put on your biggest smile and call - expect the hard line "either you pay the fee or cancel the call." Just hang up when you hear it. Call back and reset your smile, try again. You will get the fee waived provided you don't blow your cool much about the wasted time. When you get someone doesn't take the "pay-the-fee-or-cancel-the-call" line emphasize you want them to send a Cox employee.

They will insist contractors and employees are equal... but it's not true. An employee will have better access to anyone who has any clue about how to authorize the card.

Or just complain to the city or entity that has the franchise (after the contractor FUBAR's your first install attempt). That works too.

There's yet another gotcha... Cox will eventually get your cablecard and SDV adapter working - but your S3 TiVo will stop offering suggestions. That's why you should probably have the Premiere in the first place if you can get it.


----------



## ellinj

Have an install appt this morning for two cards for a series3 that I inherited. The installer already tried to call me to make excuses. Said the cards were hard to find, there were problems with them, etc etc, did I know I can't get on demand etc etc.

I told him I didn't want any excuses and I expect him to be here in his time window.


----------



## Amiga

I've gotten the usual CableCARD runaround from Cox. They tried to charge me over $7 for a card, $1.99 for the card and the rest as an access fee. Even after complaining to Clark County (Las Vegas), some Cox CSR liaison that contacted me insisted cards were $7+. Finally, this CSR found someone up the foodchain who agreed that cards are only $1.99. Beyond that, this rep also acted like she was doing me a favor lowering the install from around $60 for two cards to $25. I now found this press release stating free Cox CableCARD / TiVo installations, http://pr.tivo.com/easyir/customrel...ersion=live&prid=651057&releasejsp=custom_150 . *Has anyone had any luck pushing for a free install?*


----------



## ajwees41

tamaman said:


> I have had a THD with two s-cards up and running with Cox Omaha for little over two years. As far as I know I was getting all the channels I thought I was supposed to get, didn't seem to be having any SDV issues, but to be honest maybe I didn't know I was missing anything. My THD hard drive died a couple of weeks ago and I grabbed the Cox DVR just to have something. I of course hate it so I just ordered a Tivo Premiere. (decided to spend the extra $$ rather than replacing the hard drive). So my questions is: should I just stick the 2 s-cards I still have into my new TiVo when it gets here, or move to an M-card? (don't really care about the extra 2 bucks if it saves me some hassle). If I move to an M-card will I need a Tuning Adaptor? Thanks!


Omaha does not use sdv as far as I know we are 1Ghz already


----------



## ajwees41

Amiga said:


> I've gotten the usual CableCARD runaround from Cox. They tried to charge me over $7 for a card, $1.99 for the card and the rest as an access fee. Even after complaining to Clark County (Las Vegas), some Cox CSR liaison that contacted me insisted cards were $7+. Finally, this CSR found someone up the foodchain who agreed that cards are only $1.99. Beyond that, this rep also acted like she was doing me a favor lowering the install from around $60 for two cards to $25. I now found this press release stating free Cox CableCARD / TiVo installations, http://pr.tivo.com/easyir/customrel...ersion=live&prid=651057&releasejsp=custom_150 . *Has anyone had any luck pushing for a free install?*


that's for when they launch the cox ondemand for tivo not avalable yet


----------



## Johncv

Amiga said:


> I've gotten the usual CableCARD runaround from Cox. They tried to charge me over $7 for a card, $1.99 for the card and the rest as an access fee. Even after complaining to Clark County (Las Vegas), some Cox CSR liaison that contacted me insisted cards were $7+. Finally, this CSR found someone up the foodchain who agreed that cards are only $1.99. Beyond that, this rep also acted like she was doing me a favor lowering the install from around $60 for two cards to $25. I now found this press release stating free Cox CableCARD / TiVo installations, http://pr.tivo.com/easyir/customrel...ersion=live&prid=651057&releasejsp=custom_150 . *Has anyone had any luck pushing for a free install?*


This is one of the reason I have held off purchasing the Tivo Premiere. I want to see how Cox and TiVo will implement this. From the way TiVo is trying to unload the current TiVo Premiere boxes make me think that a new Premiere box is coming out next year to support this.


----------



## lasergecko

Amiga said:


> *Has anyone had any luck pushing for a free install?*


Sure as hell did! Woo hoo!

I didn't get it "free", but I just got a credit issued to my account by telling the CSR about the press release and giving the contact info in it. I'd go about it that way. Get billed, then get credit for it.

Thanks for the pointer!


----------



## GregOhio

linkja35 said:


> Just got off the phone with Cox in Cleveland. They just told me that every time the power goes out, they would have to send someone out to re-activate the CableCARDs. ... Is it worth the trouble - once everything is up and running, are there a lot of issues?


I am in Cleveland, with both TivoHD and Premier using cablecards. The cards are a PITA to get setup, but it is one-time. They haven't touched the ones in my HD for 3 years. That power failure story is rich. I wonder if they pay bonuses for talking customers into getting Cox DVR's instead.

I gave the Cox HD DVR (Scientific Atlanta) a shot. The interface was fine, but it was unreliable. I hardly ever got successful recordings. That was 3 years ago.

I greatly prefer the TIVO. The cablecard setup is a minor one-time hassle.


----------



## TheRatPatrol

Johncv said:


> This is one of the reason I have held off purchasing the Tivo Premiere. I want to see how Cox and TiVo will implement this. From the way TiVo is trying to unload the current TiVo Premiere boxes make me think that a new Premiere box is coming out next year to support this.


So you think thats why they're $99.00 right now?


----------



## Johncv

theratpatrol said:


> So you think thats why they're $99.00 right now?


Yes, I think people who are being serve by Cox should just save their money and wait and see if Cox support VOD for the Premier box. I really wish Cox and TiVo had sign an agreement to provide the Premier box like RCN, Suddenlink and now Charter. http://www.thestreet.com/story/10983182/1/tivo-rises-on-charter-deal.html


----------



## thebarber

I recently read that tivo will be able to use the cox vod and it should be available by the end of the first quarter or during the second quarter of this year. I currently have a tivo premiere HD sitting in the box at home because I can't justify the extra money vs. my cox dvr. Can anyone convince me if I should or shouldn't make the switch before I return it? I can't complain about the cox dvr, only about the company itself. I also think tivo will be coming out with a new box that will have the wireless card built in, I can't believe it's not already in their like it is in bd players, etc....


----------



## djwilso

Most likely, the Premiere that Cox provides will be able to use their VOD but will also disable using all of the other types of VOD such as Netflix and Amazon VOD.

I could be wrong, of course, but I would not put it past them.


----------



## tvmaster2

djwilso said:


> Most likely, the Premiere that Cox provides will be able to use their VOD but will also disable using all of the other types of VOD such as Netflix and Amazon VOD.
> 
> I could be wrong, of course, but I would not put it past them.


that would be rather unsporting


----------



## Johncv

djwilso said:


> Most likely, the Premiere that Cox provides will be able to use their VOD but will also disable using all of the other types of VOD such as Netflix and Amazon VOD.
> 
> I could be wrong, of course, but I would not put it past them.


As I understand the deal is that YOU buy a TiVo Premiere box from whoever you want, Cox will provide VOD for the TiVo Premiere. Cox has also agree to advertise and promote the service. I just want to see this happen before I even spend money on a TiVo Premiere.


----------



## Testpattern

On another area of interest concerning Cox and S3 cable cards, have any of you experienced a re-install on a set of functioning cards.

I'm replacing my dead S3 and Tivo says to simply install my cable cards from my old unit to the new one. They said I "may" have to call my provider for them to pair something on their end but that's about it.

Excuse me, but I still recall the pain I went though initially with Cox to get these two cards installed. It took days and multiple in home visits to get them to function.

Is it really this easy when exchanging a unit? Anyone know?


----------



## calstudios

Cox still not allowing self install of cable cards. I called Cox Santa Barbara today and they said CC installs require a $55 truck roll. I mentioned the FCC regulations and the guy was clueless. They're probably going to wait the full nine months to extort as much money as they can out of customers.


----------



## LoREvanescence

Amiga said:


> I've gotten the usual CableCARD runaround from Cox. They tried to charge me over $7 for a card, $1.99 for the card and the rest as an access fee. Even after complaining to Clark County (Las Vegas), some Cox CSR liaison that contacted me insisted cards were $7+. Finally, this CSR found someone up the foodchain who agreed that cards are only $1.99. Beyond that, this rep also acted like she was doing me a favor lowering the install from around $60 for two cards to $25. I now found this press release stating free Cox CableCARD / TiVo installations, http://pr.tivo.com/easyir/customrel...ersion=live&prid=651057&releasejsp=custom_150 . *Has anyone had any luck pushing for a free install?*


I just had my premiere set up with Cox and a M-Card a week and a half ago.

I was not able to get the cable card for free, but I got a $25 credit.

So my bill looks like this
Installation - CableCARD $50.00
Regulated Installation $-25.00

So far I'm impressed. To my amazement there is absolutely no copy protection on any channel I receive!

There appears to be no SDV, I don't have a tuning adapter and I get every single channel on the lineup card that I receive with my package, 200 or so channels plus music choice.

Only disappointment I have with cox is that is what ever compression they use on some hd channels, the picture looks all grainy and colors are dull, but no blocking. I'm not really a fan of that.

The install went smoothly. After the cable card was put in all encrypted channels said not authorized, but after one call to reprogram the box they came in and have worked perfectly since.

So what is going on with this cox ondemand. I have not followed it / don't know anything about it since this is my first time with cox. That news article linked in the past page seems to suggest cox will sell retail boxes with ondemand access.

Does that mean a special cox box, or would that mean they would just sell tivo premieres and regular retail premieres would have access to it?


----------



## Testpattern

LoREvanescence said:


> So what is going on with this cox ondemand. I have not followed it / don't know anything about it since this is my first time with cox. That news article linked in the past page seems to suggest cox will sell retail boxes with ondemand access.
> 
> Does that mean a special cox box, or would that mean they would just sell tivo premieres and regular retail premieres would have access to it?


Supposedly, Cox and TiVo have a deal worked out where the Premiere will support Cox VOD somehow. I've talked to two sales people from Cox OKC concerning this and neither knew anything about a Cox/Tivo agreement.

As you probably know, Current TiVo connections do not support Cox VOD since TiVo communication is one way. VOD requires bi-directional communications.


----------



## wjdennen

I heard from Cox New England that this Cox/TiVo deal Is on hold. Via twitter. @coxnewengland

I asked specifically about the VOD and they said it was on hold.


----------



## LoREvanescence

wjdennen said:


> I heard from Cox New England that this Cox/TiVo deal Is on hold. Via twitter. @coxnewengland
> 
> I asked specifically about the VOD and they said it was on hold.


that's not a good thing

I recently emailed cox contact on this deal asking about the Rhode Island Area and if were were to get it. I forger her name, but the lady's who's email was given in the press release.

The response I got was to call the local cable franchise and she provided the number.

I call them, they know nothing about it, then try to sell me their box to get vod, lol


----------



## cmallan

GregOhio said:


> I am in Cleveland, with both TivoHD and Premier using cablecards.


what cable card do you have in your premiere? I was told by Cox Cleveland that they only have S-cards and no M-cards (which is complete crap in my opinion)


----------



## cmallan

GregOhio said:


> I am in Cleveland, with both TivoHD and Premier using cablecards.


what cable card do you have in your premiere? I was told by Cox Cleveland that they only have S-cards and no M-cards (which is complete crap in my opinion)


----------



## CharlieC

I'm in Cleveland with 4 TIVO boxes. Three have M-cards from Cox, the other (an S3 box from way back) has 2 S-cards. As I added the boxes I requested M-cards when I scheduled the install. The CSR initially told me there were no such thing as M-cards (not just with Cox, but anywhere). I told him whatever. When the tech came out to do the install he brought S-cards. I asked him if he had any M-cards. He told me he didn't but his supervisor had some so he called his supervisor who ran over and brought a whole bunch. Ever since then, I've requested M-cards and that's what they've installed.


----------



## TomXP411

Johncv said:


> I live in Chula Vista, which is serve by Cox San Diego. I pay $2.95 a month for the Cox Service Assurance Plan. What this mean is if anything go wrong with my service Cox has to fix it at no additional charge. This include the cable card installed in the TiVo HD.


I just called Cox today to order a CableCard for my InfiniTV, and they want $75 now for "Professional Installation."

Seriously? I could do it myself in 10 minutes. It's not like they can't provision this stuff remotely.

It sure seems like a simply profit-grab to me.


----------



## zowwie85

TomXP411 said:


> It's not like they can't provision this stuff remotely.


You give them too much credit. Half the time they can't even provision it once they've shown up with it.


----------



## CoxInPHX

Cox has posted CableCARD Self Install Kit information and printed instructions.

*Cisco*
http://ww2.cox.com/residential/arizona/support/tv/article.cox?articleId={9bc79a10-7b4e-11e0-fbc4-000000000000}
http://media.cox.com/support/print_...cable_box/CableCardSelfInstallGuide_Cisco.pdf

*Motorola*
http://ww2.cox.com/residential/orangecounty/support/tv/article.cox?articleId={0b2b32b0-7b52-11e0-fbc4-000000000000}
http://media.cox.com/support/print_...le_box/CableCardSelfInstallGuide_Motorola.pdf

The 888 number is just the main Cox number, There was not an option specific to CableCard Self installs, so I selected AdvancedTV Self Install.
At first the CS Rep did not understand what I wanted, so she put me on hold and went to speak with someone else. She came back and confirmed she had the instructions to walk me through the process. She also confirmed that the Cox Stores should have CableCards and Tuning Adapters (where needed) for customers to pick up.


----------



## Makaveli6103

Cox in Omaha will not provide me with a multi-stream card. What do I do?


----------



## zowwie85

Makaveli6103 said:


> Cox in Omaha will not provide me with a multi-stream card. What do I do?


Just call back and ask for a cablecard without going into any detail. Single-stream cards are even rarer than knowledgeable employees.


----------



## LynnL999

Anyone else in OC? My Tivo popped up with a whole slew of new channels today. Some are working with the tuning adapter, some not. I went through all the new and newish HD channels (channel 800+) to test what I'm getting and not getting.

*Working:*

891 DIYHD
892 COOKHD
893 HUBHD
894 (unlabeled)
895 OUTHD2

1028 WGNHD
1051 TWCHD

1103 IDHD

1337 TENISHD
1346 BBCAHD

*Not Working:*

785 NFLNRZD
798 GAME HD
799 CSDINHD

870 STZIBHP
871 STRCHP
877 SHWXPHD
879 HBOCPHD
880 HBOZPHD
881 HBO2HD
882 HBOSGHD
883 HBOFHD
884 HBOLAHD
887 SHOCPHD
888 TMCHD
889 STZCHD
890 STZKHD

1045 HLNHD
1047 (unlabeled)
1068 TCMHD
1105 OWNHD

1284 STZEHD

1352 TRUTV
1363 NGWILDH
1371 WEHD
1394 GALA

1654 TEAM HD
1672 (unlabeled)

None of the 1900 numbered MC channels are working for me either.

I don't sub to Cimemax and didn't try any of those channels, or any paid sports channels. I do subscribe to HBO, Showtime and Starz.

Can anyone with a TA report back if they are getting any of the channels I'm not getting?

I am thrilled with BBC HD, but I am really getting perturbed about all these channels that should be part of my package that I can't get -- especially the premiums.


----------



## LoREvanescence

some of those channels are plus package. Meaning they can only be viewed on cox's own box the whole home dvr. such as trutv and most of your not working ones.


as for MC, it was 4 months after they were added to my line up before they worked. They were just added to tivo's guide early and weren't on cox's own boxes until they worked.

Give them time, some may work if they are not added yet. Have someone with a cox box check to see if they are there and working.

And if they are, and they are still not working on your tivo, they wont. The reason being is they are inbetween 850 mgz and 1ghz. A S3 or THD tuner can not tune in that range. 

The premiere can but also does not have access to them at this time. May take a software update? But I heave heard on the avs forums tivo is working with cox on this.


----------



## LynnL999

LoREvanescence said:


> some of those channels are plus package. Meaning they can only be viewed on cox's own box the whole home dvr.


This doesn't make sense to me, because I am getting 891-895, all of which are listed as Plus Package, but not getting the premiums which I pay extra for in the same package.



> And if they are, and they are still not working on your tivo, they wont. The reason being is they are inbetween 850 mgz and 1ghz. A S3 or THD tuner can not tune in that range.


Then Cox shouldn't be using it. It's unfair to charge TiVo users for all channels yet treat us as second-class citizens. I don't expect to get On Demand or PPV or anything I knew that TiVo couldn't handle when I bought it. I do expect to get all the channels that I pay for, though.


----------



## CoxInPHX

I Urge all Cox CableCARD customers to file a complaint with the FCC, and tell them Cox is requiring the lease of equipment to receive these "linear channels" and denying you access on a capable CableCARD UDCP receiver (TiVo Premiere). Cox may not budge on this issue until the FCC gets involved.

http://www.fcc.gov/complaints 
or
http://esupport.fcc.gov/complaints.htm

FCC CableCARD Rules:
http://www.fcc.gov/guides/cablecard-know-your-rights
"Receive all linear channels (channels other than on-demand) in your subscription package. This includes premium channels and specialty channels. For some channels delivered using a technique called switched digital video, you may need a second device called a tuning adapter. This device is typically provided at no additional charge to CableCARD customers. FCC Rule 76.1205(b)(4). CableCARD-ready devices currently cannot receive your cable operators Video on Demand services. "

FCC ENFORCEMENT ADVISORY:
http://transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2011/db0809/DA-11-1373A1.pdf
"Ensure access to all linear channels. Consumers have identified problems accessing switched digital channels on their retail CableCARD-compatible devices.9 Cable operators must ensure that subscribers can use their retail devices to access all of the linear channels that comprise the cable package to which they subscribe.10 Operators also must ensure that retail devices can tune at least four simultaneous channels, or as many switched digital channels as that operators most sophisticated operator-supplied set-top box, whichever is greater. See 47 C.F.R. §
76.1205(b)(4)."

"The term linear programming is generally understood to refer to video programming that is prescheduled by the programming provider, i.e., channels other than on-demand programming. Linear programming includes premium channels and channels delivered by switched digital technology"


----------



## tvmaster2

CoxInPHX said:


> I Urge all Cox CableCARD customers to file a complaint with the FCC, and tell them Cox is requiring the lease of equipment to receive these "linear channels" and denying you access on a capable CableCARD UDCP receiver (TiVo Premiere). Cox may not budge on this issue until the FCC gets involved.
> 
> http://www.fcc.gov/complaints
> or
> http://esupport.fcc.gov/complaints.htm
> 
> FCC CableCARD Rules:
> http://www.fcc.gov/guides/cablecard-know-your-rights
> "Receive all linear channels (channels other than on-demand) in your subscription package. This includes premium channels and specialty channels. For some channels delivered using a technique called switched digital video, you may need a second device called a tuning adapter. This device is typically provided at no additional charge to CableCARD customers. FCC Rule 76.1205(b)(4). CableCARD-ready devices currently cannot receive your cable operators Video on Demand services. "
> 
> FCC ENFORCEMENT ADVISORY:
> http://transition.fcc.gov/Daily_Releases/Daily_Business/2011/db0809/DA-11-1373A1.pdf
> "Ensure access to all linear channels. Consumers have identified problems accessing switched digital channels on their retail CableCARD-compatible devices.9 Cable operators must ensure that subscribers can use their retail devices to access all of the linear channels that comprise the cable package to which they subscribe.10 Operators also must ensure that retail devices can tune at least four simultaneous channels, or as many switched digital channels as that operators most sophisticated operator-supplied set-top box, whichever is greater. See 47 C.F.R. §
> 76.1205(b)(4)."
> 
> "The term linear programming is generally understood to refer to video programming that is prescheduled by the programming provider, i.e., channels other than on-demand programming. Linear programming includes premium channels and channels delivered by switched digital technology"


Complaint sent. It's the only way we have a chance of being treated fairly


----------



## tvmaster2

LynnL999 said:


> This doesn't make sense to me, because I am getting 891-895, all of which are listed as Plus Package, but not getting the premiums which I pay extra for in the same package.
> 
> Then Cox shouldn't be using it. It's unfair to charge TiVo users for all channels yet treat us as second-class citizens. I don't expect to get On Demand or PPV or anything I knew that TiVo couldn't handle when I bought it. I do expect to get all the channels that I pay for, though.


you are correct on both points. it would appear Cox's TiVo customers are subsidizing the non-TiVo dvr users. As far as freq. spectrum goes, same thing...we put up with lousy NTSC 525 lines for 50 years because standards had to be maintained. Same goes here...in fact, the ONLY realistic reason Cox would change technology would be to benefit Cox, and that's just not right when there isn't another company allowed to use the coax feeding my neighborhood


----------



## tvmaster2

but at least we FINALLY have BBC HD. Now, how about Current TV please...


----------



## LynnL999

tvmaster2 said:


> but at least we FINALLY have BBC HD. Now, how about Current TV please...


I am with you on both points! I am really excited about BBCA.

So after venting my spleen a bit on Twitter, a Cox rep called me.

She said all of the HD channels will be moving to the 1000's in December, and the new channels are mostly for testing purposes. What cable card users have now should smooth out and be the same as the regular lineup, except for the Plus Pack which we're apparently not supposed to have at all.

So I was told.


----------



## LynnL999

CoxInPHX said:


> I Urge all Cox CableCARD customers to file a complaint with the FCC, and tell them Cox is requiring the lease of equipment to receive these "linear channels" and denying you access on a capable CableCARD UDCP receiver (TiVo Premiere). Cox may not budge on this issue until the FCC gets involved.


Both my TiVo's are HD's. Can I file a complaint too?


----------



## tvmaster2

LynnL999 said:


> Both my TiVo's are HD's. Can I file a complaint too?


I would...Cox is taking the low road on this one, legal or not


----------



## tvmaster2

LynnL999 said:


> I am with you on both points! I am really excited about BBCA.
> 
> So after venting my spleen a bit on Twitter, a Cox rep called me.
> 
> She said all of the HD channels will be moving to the 1000's in December, and the new channels are mostly for testing purposes. What cable card users have now should smooth out and be the same as the regular lineup, except for the Plus Pack which we're apparently not supposed to have at all.
> 
> So I was told.


regarding the "Plus Pak", we need to complain to the FCC on that issue. Essentially, I pay $21 for HBO/Starz. For that I receive SIX HD versions of those channels. For a measly $5, Cox DVR renters receive at least 10 of those HP Premium channels, which I CANNOT subscribe to. Essentially, TiVo/Cable-card renters are SUBSIDIZING the Cox DVR renters, as they are getting channels from HBO / Starz / Encore based on a "group" rate from those content providers. It's complete bulls$&t. But if no one writes the FCC, then you get the government you deserve, you know?


----------



## LoREvanescence

tvmaster2 said:


> regarding the "Plus Pak", we need to complain to the FCC on that issue. Essentially, I pay $21 for HBO/Starz. For that I receive SIX HD versions of those channels. For a measly $5, Cox DVR renters receive at least 10 of those HP Premium channels, which I CANNOT subscribe to. Essentially, TiVo/Cable-card renters are SUBSIDIZING the Cox DVR renters, as they are getting channels from HBO / Starz / Encore based on a "group" rate from those content providers. It's complete bulls$&t. But if no one writes the FCC, then you get the government you deserve, you know?


does anyone have a good complaint written up that I could recycle and send to them? I haven't complained to the fcc yet as I just never felt like sitting down to write a formal complaint.


----------



## LynnL999

If you go to the FCC site, you'll click through to a complaint form. You can pretty much paraphrase what tvmaster said -- I would leave out the bulls$%t part though


----------



## CoxInPHX

LoREvanescence said:


> does anyone have a good complaint written up that I could recycle and send to them? I haven't complained to the fcc yet as I just never felt like sitting down to write a formal complaint.


Anyone up for posting a professional complaint letter?

If not, I do plan to draft and post a letter in the near future, actually 3 letters, one to the FCC, one to the local Cox market and one to Cox Corporate in Atlanta. Cox Arizona has not officially launched the Plus Package channels, so at the current time I do not have a legitimate complaint, but I want to be ready.


----------



## sudodate

I filed a complaint today. In Fairfax, VA they don't call anything the Plus Pack yet... but they still have a block of 27 channels (including most of the premium movie channels) which are only available if you use the Cox Trio "Whole Home" DVR.

When I called Cox today to find out why most of the HBO channels showed up as "not authorized", the tech support rep told me honestly that Cox had decided to only make those channels available to people who pay for their most expensive DVR.

Seriously... how do they get away with this?


----------



## unitron

sudodate said:


> ...
> 
> Seriously... how do they get away with this?


How many cable companies do you have from which to choose?

I'm guessing it's probably 1.

I'm thinking that's the answer to your question.

Maybe you need to talk to whatever local politicians are on whatever local body that says which cable company gets to use the right of way in which area of your community.


----------



## slowbiscuit

Folks with this issue also need to talk to their local franchise authority, they will have contacts to escalate with Cox. Once you can show them it's an FCC violation, they might listen (both the county/city and Cox). Google Cox Cable's executive relations number and talk to corporate as well. They need to know that they are in violation of the regs.

Of course explaining how Tivo uses Cablecards and Tuning Adapters will be lots of fun...


----------



## unitron

slowbiscuit said:


> Folks with this issue also need to talk to their local franchise authority, they will have contacts to escalate with Cox. Once you can show them it's an FCC violation, they might listen (both the county/city and Cox). Google Cox Cable's executive relations number and talk to corporate as well. They need to know that they are in violation of the regs.
> 
> Of course explaining how Tivo uses Cablecards and Tuning Adapters will be lots of fun...


What you explain to the local franchise authority is that you'd hate to have to support their opponent(s) in the next election, but...


----------



## LynnL999

I received a reply to my FCC complaint that appeared to be a form letter. It had nothing to do with cable cards or anything I actually said in my complaint


----------



## lrhorer

LynnL999 said:


> I received a reply to my FCC complaint that appeared to be a form letter. It had nothing to do with cable cards or anything I actually said in my complaint


Why does that not surprise me? OTOH, did you specifically reference FCC Rule 76.1205(b)(4) and the fact you are not receiving linear SDV channels that other subscribers with the same level of service you have are getting? This issue fundamentally has nothing to do with CableCards, so mentioning them is really superfluous.


----------



## CoxInPHX

LynnL999 said:


> I received a reply to my FCC complaint that appeared to be a form letter. It had nothing to do with cable cards or anything I actually said in my complaint


See this posting all California markets should have access to the Plus Package channels by December 1st, on a capable 1GHz CableCARD tuner.


CoxInPHX said:


> A Cox San Diego employee has confirmed that Cox California markets will have access to the Plus Package HD channels on 1GHz capable CableCARD UDCPs by December 1st. (assuming they also subscribe to the associated SD channel package) He would not confirm if other markets would follow.
> 
> http://www.sandiegohdtv.org/forums/thread-plus-package-hd-channels-cablecard?pid=2185#pid2185





lrhorer said:


> Why does that not surprise me? OTOH, did you specifically reference FCC Rule 76.1205(b)(4) and the fact you are not receiving linear SDV channels that other subscribers with the same level of service you have are getting? This issue fundamentally has nothing to do with CableCards, so mentioning them is really superfluous.


None of the Cox Plus Package channels are using SDV. They are simply broadcast over the legacy 860MHz range.

There was some discussion about using MPEG-4 for these channels, but I believe they are currently MPEG-2, they are here in Phoenix. In Phoenix they are live for testing purposes, but are not Authorized on CableCARDs at this time.


----------



## lrhorer

CoxInPHX said:


> None of the Cox Plus Package channels are using SDV. They are simply broadcast over the legacy 860MHz range.


I cannot argue that it is not the case, since I am not there, but according to the response above, only certain Cisco 1GHz boxes can receive them. That smells a lot like SDV.



CoxInPHX said:


> There was some discussion about using MPEG-4 for these channels, but I believe they are currently MPEG-2, they are here in Phoenix. In Phoenix they are live for testing purposes, but are not Authorized on CableCARDs at this time.


If they are only there for testing purposes, then they are probably not breaking any laws, but that is not what the website suggests.

OTOH, something else is fishy. Twenty-seven SDV channels is just an awfully tiny number, and if they are deploying SDV, then there is no need to go above 750 MHz. 750MHz is enough for thousands of SDV channels, unless their nodes are over-extended. No matter what, something does not add up.


----------



## jodell

I filed a FCC complaint a few months ago and called Cox OC customer relations months before I found this thread. Neither resulted in any changes. I was actually told that the Plus Package channels "couldn't possibly be working on my TiVo because they were not SDV". I offered to repeat the audio from any working Plus Package channel to the rep but she declined. :')

I will file a new FCC complaint as well as copy the local franchise board, etc. Maybe if we make enough noise, the Plus Package channels will "magically" start working.

Jeff


----------



## LynnL999

lrhorer said:


> Why does that not surprise me? OTOH, did you specifically reference FCC Rule 76.1205(b)(4) and the fact you are not receiving linear SDV channels that other subscribers with the same level of service you have are getting? This issue fundamentally has nothing to do with CableCards, so mentioning them is really superfluous.


I did mention that rule, and also that I was a cable card subscriber, which seemed relevant to how I get the channels at all without a Cox HD receiver or DVR.

(Unfortunately, the FCC doesn't email you a full copy of your complaint.)


----------



## LynnL999

jodell said:


> I will file a new FCC complaint as well as copy the local franchise board, etc. Maybe if we make enough noise, the Plus Package channels will "magically" start working.


I'm in Irvine too -- I'd be happy to send a letter as well. If you'd post yours, it would be helpful, though I won't copy it word for word


----------



## Holazola

Quick question: Does anyone have a spec sheet for the Motorola M-cards. Are they 1Ghz bandwidth capable devices? I can't find any detailed info about them. 

I have COX in Santa Barbara and I got the "above 860mhz" story line today. It looks like about 30 of the 120 or so available "1000 series" HD channels "REQUIRE" their newer rental HD STBs. I pay $15/mo for 9 channels of HBO and only get 2 channels in HD. What a load of crap.


----------



## CoxInPHX

Holazola said:


> Quick question: Does anyone have a spec sheet for the Motorola M-cards. Are they 1Ghz bandwidth capable devices? I can't find any detailed info about them.
> 
> I have COX in Santa Barbara and I got the "above 860mhz" story line today. It looks like about 30 of the 120 or so available "1000 series" HD channels "REQUIRE" their newer rental HD STBs. I pay $15/mo for 9 channels of HBO and only get 2 channels in HD. What a load of crap.


The CableCARD is a decryption device, not a tuner. There is no such thing as a 1GHz capable CableCARD. Tuning limitations are dependent upon the device's tuner. The TiVoHD and Premiere both have a 1GHz tuner. Cox initially only set-up one account/billing code for the Whole Home DVR bundled with the Plus Package channels. According to a Cox San Diego employee, Cox California is in the process of setting up a second account/billing code for CableCARD users to receive these channels at no additional charge and not have to call in to activate the channels.
http://www.sandiegohdtv.org/forums/thread-plus-package-hd-channels-cablecard?page=2


----------



## murraymh

Just to let you all know that I am receiving the plus pack channels (DIY, Outdoor channel, Cooking channel) I subscribe to here in San Diego. Started getting them just days ago I believe. Can't be sure when since I was out of town for a while.

I have a Tivo HD. 

So good news, but it's been close to a year since they originally introduced those channels...guess it was just more of cable co BS.


----------



## unitron

murraymh said:


> ...guess it was just more of cable co BS.


On the theory of never attribute to malice that which can be explained by incompetence, let's not be too hasty to rule out "they don't really know what they're doing".


----------



## LynnL999

Well, today's the big day here in Orange County -- all of our HD channels switched from the 700's to the 1000's. I completed a TiVo lineup form about this last Tuesday and included a link to the PDF with the full new lineup. 

This morning, all the channels have moved, and do indeed tune with the cable card + TA, but no lineup update from TiVo.  I updated my lineup ticket, but haven't heard anything back. This is impacting every TiVo user in my area, so I really hope we see the update later today. I was sure there would be issues with this, but I thought they would be on Cox's side, not TiVo's.

BTW, with regard to the employee in SD who says we should be able to get the "plus pak" channels, I still can't get any of the extra HBO, Showtime or Starz channels that are plus pak only.


----------



## Kennyg

> all of our HD channels switched from the 700's to the 1000's.


Until the Tivo programming changes, none of our scheduled recordings will take place (well. they will, but on the old channels).

Not having any problems receiving Premium programming, Showtime is working find.

Kenny


----------



## LynnL999

Kennyg said:


> Until the Tivo programming changes, none of our scheduled recordings will take place (well. they will, but on the old channels).


Right. I was scheduled to record part 2 of "Neverland" this afternoon, so I set a manual recording before I left. I'll do the same for tonight's programming if there's no update by the time I get home.



> Not having any problems receiving Premium programming, Showtime is working find.


Showtime East and West HD worked for me too, but none of the "plus pak" additional channels such as 1242.


----------



## Holazola

CoxInPHX said:


> The CableCARD is a decryption device, not a tuner. There is no such thing as a 1GHz capable CableCARD. Tuning limitations are dependent upon the device's tuner. The TiVoHD and Premiere both have a 1GHz tuner. Cox initially only set-up one account/billing code for the Whole Home DVR bundled with the Plus Package channels. According to a Cox San Diego employee, Cox California is in the process of setting up a second account/billing code for CableCARD users to receive these channels at no additional charge and not have to call in to activate the channels.
> (snip)


Thanks CoxInPHX! yeah I guess they aren't in the RF path after all. Here's another set of crossed fingers on the progress with the additional account/billing code.

Lynn, we have had both the 700's and the 1000's active in Santa Barbara for a few weeks. I just received a separate mailer yesterday stating they will be moving the starting December 13. Did your 700's go away already?

Included in the mailer was a revised channel lineup that now tags *all* the HBO & Cinemax channels as needing the cox STB/DVR. I'm pretty sure (and hoping) that's in error, as I can currently receive 1300 & 1301 HBOs. Showtime, Starz, and TMC still have at least one channel each not tagged on the guide. Go figure.


----------



## pmrowley

LynnL999 said:


> Well, today's the big day here in Orange County -- all of our HD channels switched from the 700's to the 1000's. I completed a TiVo lineup form about this last Tuesday and included a link to the PDF with the full new lineup.
> 
> This morning, all the channels have moved, and do indeed tune with the cable card + TA, but no lineup update from TiVo.  I updated my lineup ticket, but haven't heard anything back. This is impacting every TiVo user in my area, so I really hope we see the update later today. I was sure there would be issues with this, but I thought they would be on Cox's side, not TiVo's.
> 
> BTW, with regard to the employee in SD who says we should be able to get the "plus pak" channels, I still can't get any of the extra HBO, Showtime or Starz channels that are plus pak only.


Would contacting Tivo help get us updated in any way? Missed my noon recording of Neverland, and now the wife is starting to get worried about the evening shows, with all of the Christmas stuff airing now. I've tried to update twice, but haven't seen the lineup change yet.


----------



## LynnL999

Holazola said:


> Lynn, we have had both the 700's and the 1000's active in Santa Barbara for a few weeks. I just received a separate mailer yesterday stating they will be moving the starting December 13. Did your 700's go away already?


Yes. They apparently started mirroring a couple of weeks ago for those using their own box, but I wasn't able to tune any of the 1000's (except a very few added weeks ago) on the TiVo until this morning. And this morning all the 700's were gone, with a screen up saying "this channel has moved to the 1000's, for example, channel 4 is 1004." So there was no overlap at all for us TiVo users.


----------



## pmrowley

They said that the lineup change was reported to the provider last Thursday, and it'll probably take until this Thursday to be completed; the guide provider is working with Cox currently, whatever that means.

Very annoying...


----------



## LynnL999

pmrowley said:


> They said that the lineup change was reported to the provider last Thursday, and it'll probably take until this Thursday to be completed; the guide provider is working with Cox currently, whatever that means.


Just so you guys know, I filled out the lineup change form on TiVo last Tuesday.

Anyway. I have been twittering like a madwoman today, and I finally have TiVo VP Margret and one of the Cox reps speaking to each other, so maybe that will move things along a bit.

It just seems unbelievable to me that this is really so difficult.


----------



## tvmaster2

LynnL999 said:


> Just so you guys know, I filled out the lineup change form on TiVo last Tuesday.
> 
> Anyway. I have been twittering like a madwoman today, and I finally have TiVo VP Margret and one of the Cox reps speaking to each other, so maybe that will move things along a bit.
> 
> It just seems unbelievable to me that this is really so difficult.


and that an unpaid, non-employee of either company is the one getting the ball rolling... thank goodness you're here


----------



## pmrowley

LynnL999 said:


> Just so you guys know, I filled out the lineup change form on TiVo last Tuesday.
> 
> Anyway. I have been twittering like a madwoman today, and I finally have TiVo VP Margret and one of the Cox reps speaking to each other, so maybe that will move things along a bit.
> 
> It just seems unbelievable to me that this is really so difficult.


YOU'RE working harder than THEM! Thanks for the effort!


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> Just so you guys know, I filled out the lineup change form on TiVo last Tuesday.
> 
> Anyway. I have been twittering like a madwoman today, and I finally have TiVo VP Margret and one of the Cox reps speaking to each other, so maybe that will move things along a bit.
> 
> It just seems unbelievable to me that this is really so difficult.


Tell them to stop playing games and offer the TiVo-Q on Cox.


----------



## LynnL999

Johncv said:


> Tell them to stop playing games and offer the TiVo-Q on Cox.


At this point I would really just settle for an accurate lineup.

Waiting to hear back from Margret...


----------



## LynnL999

Okay, she wrote me back just now that they are getting Tribune involved. Hopefully TiVo + Tribune working on this together is a step forward. I asked her to get back to me when she has info like an ETA on a fix, and I'll post in both threads here if I hear anything more.


----------



## LynnL999

Possibly last update for tonight: The Cox rep I've been talking to all day has also handed me/us off to the night shift, but says they are working closely with TiVo. Margret just emailed me: "We have confirmation Tribune is working on it, but given the late hour I wouldn't expect to see a fix tonight."

So... I guess set manual recordings for anything you want to watch tonight.

I'm going to be offline for awhile trying to, um, catch up on the work I didn't exactly do today. I will post later if I hear anything new, but I'm not really expecting to tonight.


----------



## LynnL999

The latest from the Cox rep I've been talking to: "I am getting updates from TiVo. They are still working on it and the last report I was given from them was that they were hoping to have this escalated and fixed this morning."


----------



## LynnL999

Just got this from Margret... please do not yell at me:

"Hi Lynn,

The updates have made it from Cox to Tribune. They will be available to TiVo DVRs that connect to the TiVo Service after Thursday at Noon Pacific.

--Margret"


----------



## unitron

LynnL999 said:


> J...
> 
> It just seems unbelievable to me that this is really so difficult.


Seeing as how TMS pretty much has a monopoly on what they do, I find it quite believable.

"We're number 1. There is no number 2. We don't have to try harder."


----------



## rule42k

I am Cox subscriber in Orange County, CA and have experienced everything that has been described above and am just tired of them (like you guys aren't).

So I called yesterday and asked them if using my current setup if I could received the extra HBO channels that I currently pay for and receive in an SD format. Of course I was told that this would require a "Whole Home DVR" to which I replied, "NO! I will not be forced to pay for something that I should get via CableCard and I would like to cancel my service" After several transfers I was offered free DVR rental and free DVR service for 6 months which hopefully by then they would have a solution that I was happy with.

I was told that I could go down and pickup my box.

Once at the Cox store, I was told that the phone rep set me up for a standard box and that the "Whole Home DVR" required professional installation which I told them I wouldn't pay for and they agreed to come install it for free too.

I'm not sure how I feel about it, but they did do something for me and I guess I should give it a try if it isn't going to cost me anything, but part of me is over it and is ready to go OTA, Netflix & Hulu+


----------



## L David Matheny

unitron said:


> Seeing as how TMS pretty much has a monopoly on what they do, I find it quite believable.
> 
> "We're number 1. There is no number 2. We don't have to try harder."


That's similar to what Lily Tomlin's "Ernestine" said years ago: "We don't care. We don't have to. We're the Phone Company." These days that goes double for cable companies, and it may also apply to TMS.


----------



## LynnL999

There is new information for the OC folks over on this thread. Check pages 4 & 5 for the latest info.


----------



## Johncv

Call Cox today because I was having trouble receiving BBC HD. Cox re-paired the cable card and reset the Tuning Adapter and everything work. Then I ask about the Plus package, had no problem at all he just added the codes now I receive all Plus package channels on the TiVo HD.


----------



## LynnL999

Do you happen to know who you spoke to, Johncv? Do you need to go to 2nd level support for this?


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> Do you happen to know who you spoke to, Johncv? Do you need to go to 2nd level support for this?


No, just called the support number. The person had to go thru a list of codes because apparently Cox use deference codes for each supported box. Had a list of supported boxes also.

If you're having trouble goto this forum:

http://www.sandiegohdtv.org/forums/thread-plus-package-hd-channels-cablecard?pid=2313#pid2313

Try to contact Joshuarat, I am assuming he work for Cox San Diego. He trying to help people out.


----------



## LynnL999

Thanks, I'll give Joshuarat a try.


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> Thanks, I'll give Joshuarat a try.


Let us know what happens.


----------



## tvmaster2

Johncv said:


> No, just called the support number. The person had to go thru a list of codes because apparently Cox use deference codes for each supported box. Had a list of supported boxes also.
> 
> If you're having trouble goto this forum:
> 
> http://www.sandiegohdtv.org/forums/thread-plus-package-hd-channels-cablecard?pid=2313#pid2313
> 
> Try to contact Joshuarat, I am assuming he work for Cox San Diego. He trying to help people out.


anything that is learned, please feel free to post it here as well


----------



## Johncv

From sandiegohdtv.org:

Cox Arizona has started testing the broadcast of the Plus Package channels using MPEG4 (H.264). Channels have not launched publicly yet.

What is the current format in San Diego?

http://www.sandiegohdtv.org/forums/thread-plus-package-hd-channels-cablecard?pid=2327#pid2327

Can TiVo support this?


----------



## CoxInPHX

Johncv said:


> From sandiegohdtv.org:
> 
> "Cox Arizona has started testing the broadcast of the Plus Package channels using MPEG4 (H.264). Channels have not launched publicly yet.
> 
> What is the current format in San Diego?"
> 
> http://www.sandiegohdtv.org/forums/thread-plus-package-hd-channels-cablecard?pid=2327#pid2327
> 
> Can TiVo support this?


I posted that, Yes the Premieres support MPEG4 (H.264).

Not sure about the Series 3 TiVoHD though.

John, what format do these channels show in your TiVo DVR Diagnostics?


----------



## Johncv

CoxInPHX said:


> I posted that, Yes the Premieres support MPEG4 (H.264).
> 
> Not sure about the Series 3 TiVoHD though.
> 
> John, what format do these channels show in your TiVo DVR Diagnostics?


Slightly dumb question, How do I find the format for the channel?


----------



## CoxInPHX

Johncv said:


> Slightly dumb question, How do I find the format for the channel?


First tune to a Plus Package Channel (1101 HUBHD will do), It does not matter whether you subscribe to the channels or not, it will still show in the Diagnostics

TiVo Central > Settings & Messages > Account & System Info > DVR Diagnostics

*Tuner: 0* is first and will list the channel number, page down to see all the diagnostic info.

*Tuner: 1* is next and will list the channel number, page down to see all the diagnostic info.

One of these should be channel 1101 if that is what you tuned to, page down and look for *Video PID: * it should either list (MPEG2) or (H.264)


----------



## LynnL999

Joshuarat over on the SD HDTV forum got me all squared away! I now have all the HD premiums I'm supposed to


----------



## CoxInPHX

LynnL999 said:


> Joshuarat over on the SD HDTV forum got me all squared away! I now have all the HD premiums I'm supposed to


Lynn, is Cox charging you the extra $5.00/mo for the Plus Package channels?

Or did they authorize them at no addt'l charge? Joshuarat said there would not be a charge.

It sounds like the East Coast may be trying to charge the $5/mo


----------



## LynnL999

Joshuarat did not say anything about a charge, but I guess I will have to wait until my next bill to see.


----------



## h00ligan

.


----------



## Johncv

CoxInPHX said:


> Lynn, is Cox charging you the extra $5.00/mo for the Plus Package channels?
> 
> Or did they authorize them at no addt'l charge? Joshuarat said there would not be a charge.
> 
> It sounds like the East Coast may be trying to charge the $5/mo


There no additional charge as long as you subscribe to one of the premiums channels HBO, Showtime etc. as I understand it.


----------



## catatafish

I'm returning our cable cards to Cox today. Finally got fed up with the poor QC on Cox's part.

We have two Series 3 and a Premiere, we had a problem with channels not coming in on at all the Series 3 , and sporadically on the premiere. They checked our system and said we were getting solid strong signal to all of our boxes but we need a Tuning Adapter, clunky, ugly things. Hooked them up an still couldn't get a hand full of channels with the Series 3 (History international and a few other we'd watch regularly), but it seemed to work on the primer. However sporadically on all of the tivos' (at different times) would just go blank and say the channel wouldn't come in (I forget the exact wording) . Sometimes if we went up or down and channel it work again and sometimes we'd have to reboot the tivo. Got to be the Tuning Adapter. 

Finally after 8 months of fighting with this problem we are hooking the tivos up to the antenna and getting U-verse for the other channels. Not entirely happy about it, maybe next year we will have FIOS in our area or Cox will fix the problems.

We are in the panhandle of Florida and had Scientific Atlanta Cable Cards (PKM800) and the Cisco STA1520 Tuning Adapter. Is this a common problem or were we just unlucky?


----------



## CoxInPHX

catatafish said:


> We are in the panhandle of Florida and had Scientific Atlanta Cable Cards (PKM800) and the Cisco STA1520 Tuning Adapter. Is this a common problem or were we just unlucky?


No it is not an issue at all for me in Phoenix w/ Cox, but Cox here has had SDV and Tuning Adapters for several years and Florida is fairly new to the SDV deployment. I can't speak for the Series 3 TiVos but the Premiere does not have any issues for me or my sister (also in Phoenix). Cox Arizona is also a Scientific Atlanta/Cisco market.

Recent Cox markets to deploy SDV like Hampton Roads, VA have had many issues even with their own equipment.


----------



## catatafish

CoxInPHX said:


> No it is not an issue at all for me in Phoenix w/ Cox, but Cox here has had SDV and Tuning Adapters for several years and Florida is fairly new to the SDV deployment. I can't speak for the Series 3 TiVos but the Premiere does not have any issues for me or my sister (also in Phoenix). Cox Arizona is also a Scientific Atlanta/Cisco market.


I guess we are just unlucky then. I hated canceling Cox (cause I love the network I got working with all our TIVOs) but it got so frustrating losing channels as we are watching them and then all the waiting to deal with COX.


----------



## LynnL999

catatafish said:


> We are in the panhandle of Florida and had Scientific Atlanta Cable Cards (PKM800) and the Cisco STA1520 Tuning Adapter. Is this a common problem or were we just unlucky?


Not an issue here in Orange County either, but I suspect our equipment is totally different.

Sometimes, if you are tuned to an SDV channel and leave it there for a long time (like hours), the channel will time out, and then you need to retune it. I think that's actually how SDV is supposed to work to free up the bandwidth, although it's a bit clunky. But I've never had to reboot for it to work again.


----------



## catatafish

LynnL999 said:


> Not an issue here in Orange County either, but I suspect our equipment is totally different.
> 
> Sometimes, if you are tuned to an SDV channel and leave it there for a long time (like hours), the channel will time out, and then you need to retune it. I think that's actually how SDV is supposed to work to free up the bandwidth, although it's a bit clunky. But I've never had to reboot for it to work again.


Yeah. It would be nothing but a blank screen all of the channels were blank, even some of the lower analogue. After a restart it would be fine again. Although some time it would be only one channel were couldn't get in and after restart that channel would come in. Of course as I had mentioned the Sereis 3 had a few digital channels it could never get in no matter what.

I had 4 visits in the last 8 month. I just gave up it wasn't worth the hassle. We had been Cox customers for over 10 years.

To be fair some very good and very polite people came in and tried to help, but most are not familiar with Tivo setups. One tech said that this year (last year 2011) they sated to implement a lot of changes in our area and it was giving a lot of people a hard time. He thought from when our problems started it was some of these changes behind it.

Don't hate Cox, just got fed up. Perfecting will to ditch U-verse when our contract is up, although it has a lot more channels than were were getting for the same price.


----------



## LoREvanescence

CoxInPHX said:


> First tune to a Plus Package Channel (1101 HUBHD will do), It does not matter whether you subscribe to the channels or not, it will still show in the Diagnostics
> 
> TiVo Central > Settings & Messages > Account & System Info > DVR Diagnostics
> 
> *Tuner: 0* is first and will list the channel number, page down to see all the diagnostic info.
> 
> *Tuner: 1* is next and will list the channel number, page down to see all the diagnostic info.
> 
> One of these should be channel 1101 if that is what you tuned to, page down and look for *Video PID: * it should either list (MPEG2) or (H.264)


Wait, I didn't know that cox or any cable companies were using H.264 for regular cable channels?

If they are what channels are H.264?


----------



## CoxInPHX

LoREvanescence said:


> Wait, I didn't know that cox or any cable companies were using H.264 for regular cable channels?
> 
> If they are what channels are H.264?


I believe Phoenix is going to be the first test market for use of H.264
http://www.multichannel.com/article..._MPEG_4_Channels_To_Advanced_TV_Plus_Tier.php

All of the "Plus Package" channels in Phoenix are currently in testing using H.264. They have not Officially Launched, but should in the next few months.

1101 - Hub HD (Bonus Pak also required)
1133 - DIY HD (Variety Pak also required)
1134 - Cooking Channel HD (Variety Pak also required)
1161 - Outdoor Channel HD (Sports and Info Pak also required)
1900 - SWRV HD (Variety Pak also required)

1202 - HBO Signature HD
1203 - HBO Family HD
1204 - HBO Comedy HD
1205 - HBO Zone HD
1210 - HBO East HD
1211 - HBO2 East HD
1212 - HBO Latino HD

1222 - Action MAX HD
1223 - Thriller MAX HD
1225 - Cinamax East HD
1226 - More Max East HD
1230 - 5StarMAX HD

1242 - Showtime Showcase HD
1243 - Showtime Extreme HD
1251 - TMC Xtra HD

1263 - Starz East HD
1264 - Starz Kids & Family HD
1265 - Starz Cinema HD
1266 - Starz Comedy HD


----------



## LoREvanescence

I checked the plus package channels, which I have been getting here for about a month now on my tivo.

They are all still MPEG-2

would love to see MPEG-4 / H.264


----------



## Johncv

CoxInPHX said:


> First tune to a Plus Package Channel (1101 HUBHD will do), It does not matter whether you subscribe to the channels or not, it will still show in the Diagnostics
> 
> TiVo Central > Settings & Messages > Account & System Info > DVR Diagnostics
> 
> *Tuner: 0* is first and will list the channel number, page down to see all the diagnostic info.
> 
> *Tuner: 1* is next and will list the channel number, page down to see all the diagnostic info.
> 
> One of these should be channel 1101 if that is what you tuned to, page down and look for *Video PID: * it should either list (MPEG2) or (H.264)


I try this, but Video PID display what look like a Hex number not related to MPEG2 or H.264.


----------



## LoREvanescence

Johncv said:


> I try this, but Video PID display what look like a Hex number not related to MPEG2 or H.264.


can you take a picture or post here what it says?


----------



## CoxInPHX

CNNHD is MPEG2 while HBOEHD is H.264

*1036 - CNNHD (MPEG2)*









*1210 - HBOEHD (H.264)*


----------



## CoxInPHX

Johncv said:


> I try this, but Video PID display what look like a Hex number not related to MPEG2 or H.264.


You are using a TiVoHD, correct? not a Premiere.

Perhaps the TiVoHD does not list MPEG2 and/or H.264, also perhaps it is not capable of tuning H.264 format.


----------



## aztivo

CoxInPHX said:


> CNNHD is MPEG2 while HBOEHD is H.264
> 
> *1036 - CNNHD (MPEG2)*
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> *1210 - HBOEHD (H.264)*


Are you actually getting these channels? I shoe them in the TiVo but nothing shows up when I tune them


----------



## CoxInPHX

aztivo said:


> Are you actually getting these channels? I shoe them in the TiVo but nothing shows up when I tune them


No they are displaying "Channel Unauthorized" , They are still only in testing, probably for employees testing only on the Cisco WHDVR at the moment.


----------



## rcobourn

I got a lineup change message yesterday listing these channels, although they were already showing up in the guide for me before the message. Only difference is there seems to be guide data for them now whereas before all was listed as "To Be Announced". The channels also show unauthorized for me, at the moment.


----------



## aztivo

rcobourn said:


> I got a lineup change message yesterday listing these channels, although they were already showing up in the guide for me before the message. Only difference is there seems to be guide data for them now whereas before all was listed as "To Be Announced". The channels also show unauthorized for me, at the moment.


Same here. Maybe cox will have them live in a few days


----------



## CoxInPHX

rcobourn said:


> I got a lineup change message yesterday listing these channels, although they were already showing up in the guide for me before the message. Only difference is there seems to be guide data for them now whereas before all was listed as "To Be Announced". The channels also show unauthorized for me, at the moment.


I noticed the same thing, 1045-TruTVHD and 1071-TCMHD did go live last night also.

I am not expecting to get the others, (Plus Package), without a fight, but perhaps I'll be surprised.


----------



## LoREvanescence

So it seems COX NH just flipped the SDV switch. 

Back in October I got a letter stating on November 7th, all channels listed will be converted to SDV and I would need to get a Tuning Adapter. 

I did, but I was unsure if the tuning adapter was working properly, I was under the impression from reading posts on AVSForums it was not as the yellow light was blinking. But I still was receiving all my channels so I thought it must be working fine and I don't know why that light is blinking. 

Well, as of this morning, none of the channels listed on the SDV sheet come in. They just give a message about there is a problem with the signal on this channel.

I have tried to power cycle the tuning adapter, the tivo but nothing seems to be working by doing just that.

in the menu's it shows a turning adapter is attached. 

Anyone know what I should try to get these channels working?


----------



## LynnL999

LoREvanescence said:


> Anyone know what I should try to get these channels working?


Call tech support, make sure the tuning adapter is authorized properly. If it is, ask them to send a "hit" to it.


----------



## LoREvanescence

LynnL999 said:


> Call tech support, make sure the tuning adapter is authorized properly. If it is, ask them to send a "hit" to it.


Just contacted tech support through live chat.

They sent a hit and it seems to be working now

thanks


----------



## LynnL999

Yay! Glad it's working for you!


----------



## ellinj

Anyone here in RI? Whats the situation?

I got a letter a while back saying I needed to get a TA for SDV. I never did anything, and now can't find the letter. So far it appears that I am not missing anything.


----------



## CoxInPHX

CoxInPHX said:


> I noticed the same thing, 1045-TruTVHD and 1071-TCMHD did go live last night also.
> 
> I am not expecting to get the others, (Plus Package), without a fight, but perhaps I'll be surprised.


I inquired today with Cox AZ, regarding the Plus Package channels and was told it would cost me $10/mo for these channels to be authorized with a CableCARD. Ouch. Every other market I know only charges $5/mo and that is for the equipment charges for the Whole Home DVR package.

Is any Cox Customer receiving the Plus Package channels paying an additional fee?
=====================================================================
EDIT:

I emailed back and questioned the initial quote of $10/mo just for the channels, and was told he made a mistake and the channels are Free with a CableCARD as long as you subscribe to the corresponding SD Tier. I should have them shortly, fingers crossed.

First attempt did not get the channels working, although they do show as having been added to my account online. Issue has been escalated.


----------



## aztivo

CoxInPHX said:


> I inquired today with Cox AZ, regarding the Plus Package channels and was told it would cost me $10/mo for these channels to be authorized with a CableCARD. Ouch. Every other market I know only charges $5/mo and that is for the equipment charges for the Whole Home DVR package.
> 
> Is any Cox Customer receiving the Plus Package channels paying an additional fee?


What I wonder I don't even see these listed on cox website yet?


----------



## CoxInPHX

aztivo said:


> What I wonder I don't even see these listed on cox website yet?


They are not listed Yet in the channel line-up but are available. You Must have a Premiere I believe because they are MPEG4 not MPEG2

I emailed back and questioned the initial quote of $10/mo just for the channels, and was told he made a mistake and the channels are Free as long as you subscribe to the corresponding SD Tier. I should have them shortly, fingers crossed.

Cox AZ is charging $10/mo for the Whole Home DVR equipment however, which is twice the price of other current markets.

EDIT:
First attempt did not get the channels working, although they do show as having been added to my account online. Issue has been escalated.


----------



## aztivo

CoxInPHX said:


> They are not listed Yet in the channel line-up but are available. You Must have a Premiere I believe because they are MPEG4 not MPEG2
> 
> I emailed back and questioned the initial quote of $10/mo just for the channels, and was told he made a mistake and the channels are Free as long as you subscribe to the corresponding SD Tier. I should have them shortly, fingers crossed.
> 
> Cox AZ is charging $10/mo for the Whole Home DVR equipment however, which is twice the price of other current markets.
> 
> EDIT:
> First attempt did not get the channels working, although they do show as having been added to my account online. Issue has been escalated.


Update if you get them please:up:


----------



## LoREvanescence

ellinj said:


> Anyone here in RI? Whats the situation?
> 
> I got a letter a while back saying I needed to get a TA for SDV. I never did anything, and now can't find the letter. So far it appears that I am not missing anything.


I got my TA, but it wasn't working properly, but I still received all my channels. I'm in Pawtucket, and on the 18th all the channels on the SDV list went away.

Try channel 195, if it says there is a signal problem then you know sdv was activated for you. The letter said november 7th, I guess they were a few months late. But once they sent a hit to my tuning adapter all was well.

wonder if it is slowly being turned on node by node based


----------



## CoxInPHX

aztivo said:


> Update if you get them please:up:


So far they are still Not Authorized for me, Most CSRs are not even aware this is possible, They have to dig through their info database to find the information. Cox is going to send a TECH out Wednesday, Not sure what he is going to do as I do have a good signal and SNR and the tuner can lock onto the channel.

I'll post back after the Tech comes.

EDIT: Tech came out today, Wednesday, and had never heard of the channels, Still Not Authorized.

EDIT: 2 Another Tech roll Friday 1/27, still not Authorized.


----------



## Beven

LoREvanescence said:


> I got my TA, but it wasn't working properly, but I still received all my channels. I'm in Pawtucket, and on the 18th all the channels on the SDV list went away.
> 
> Try channel 195, if it says there is a signal problem then you know sdv was activated for you. The letter said november 7th, I guess they were a few months late. But once they sent a hit to my tuning adapter all was well.
> 
> wonder if it is slowly being turned on node by node based


We're in North Prov - and I guess I've just been lazy and never picked up that TA. Is it really necessary? We're not getting any special packages -- how would you know if you need it? (sorry for the obliviousness)


----------



## ellinj

LoREvanescence said:


> I got my TA, but it wasn't working properly, but I still received all my channels. I'm in Pawtucket, and on the 18th all the channels on the SDV list went away.
> 
> Try channel 195, if it says there is a signal problem then you know sdv was activated for you. The letter said november 7th, I guess they were a few months late. But once they sent a hit to my tuning adapter all was well.
> 
> wonder if it is slowly being turned on node by node based


I finally found the letter and I can't say at the moment I will miss any of the channels that are going to be on SDV


----------



## LynnL999

ellinj said:


> I finally found the letter and I can't say at the moment I will miss any of the channels that are going to be on SDV


*shrugs* If it's me, I want all the channels I'm entitled to, even if there's nothing immediate I might want to watch on them. A few years ago, I wouldn't have suspected I'd be watching AMC regularly. If I didn't have it available, I might not have sampled shows I now watch regularly.

In our area, SDV includes a lot of HD channels, including FX, that I definitely wanted access to.


----------



## CoxInPHX

Beven said:


> We're in North Prov - and I guess I've just been lazy and never picked up that TA. Is it really necessary? We're not getting any special packages -- how would you know if you need it? (sorry for the obliviousness)





ellinj said:


> I finally found the letter and I can't say at the moment I will miss any of the channels that are going to be on SDV


When Cox deploys SDV they generally start with a small block of 30-50 seldom watched channels, and add more blocks of channels over the next several months. The total number of SDV channels will end up being around 200 channels.

Typical SDV channels are mostly the SD channels in the Variety, Sports & Info, Movie, Faith & Values and Latino Packages.

Common Cox HD channels using SDV are BBCA HD, Bio HD, CMT HD, Disney XD HD, Encore HD, EPIXHD, ESPNUHD, Fox Business HD, Fox Soccer HD, Fuse HD, G4HD, Galavision HD, Hallmark Channel HD, Hallmark Movie HD, History2 HD, IFC HD, Investigation Discovery HD, LMN HD, More Max HD, TMC HD, MSNBC HD, Starz Edge HD, Tennis Channel HD, TruTV HD, Weather Channel HD, WETV HD

Motorola Systems may be different, but in AZ with Cisco equipment, you must have a Tuning Adapter connected to download the correct channel mapping.


----------



## LoREvanescence

Out of curiosity what does this message mean: " Channel not provided by the Tuning Adapter. Contact your cable provider for more information."


I get all all the sdv channels, however I recently noticed that the guide is now showing some out of market locals and a all the sub channels for the locals I get. But I get the above message when ever I try to tune anyone of them.


----------



## Cactus Bill

I am in Phoenix with a Tivo Premiere and my Plus Package channels say "This Channel is not authorized. Contact your cable provider for more information." Are people with Cox DVRs now receiving these channels? If anybody is successfully receiving these channels in Phoenix, please provide the steps taken to get them. Thanks.


----------



## aztivo

so for those in phx. I have been working with a senior tech. And she has had to manually code all the channels to my account, this took two+ hours. she has sent me an email saying that there is an issue on the Cox side with them not being able to authorize the channels for cable card users outside of their boxes. this is known and they are working on a fix.


----------



## ellinj

LynnL999 said:


> *shrugs* If it's me, I want all the channels I'm entitled to, even if there's nothing immediate I might want to watch on them. A few years ago, I wouldn't have suspected I'd be watching AMC regularly. If I didn't have it available, I might not have sampled shows I now watch regularly.
> 
> In our area, SDV includes a lot of HD channels, including FX, that I definitely wanted access to.


I am sure at some point I will want to get setup with the TA, but for now, i am just procrastinating.


----------



## Cactus Bill

aztivo said:


> so for those in phx. I have been working with a senior tech. And she has had to manually code all the channels to my account, this took two+ hours. she has sent me an email saying that there is an issue on the Cox side with them not being able to authorize the channels for cable card users outside of their boxes. this is known and they are working on a fix.


I e-mailed Cox about the issue and got this response:

"We regret any inconvenience this may be causing you. The agreement between Cox and TiVo has been completed, but this feature is not ready to launch to TiVo Premiere customers in Cox Arizona yet. Regrettably, we do not have an estimated time of arrival. Please note, we are not charging accounts with CableCARDs only for the Plus Packages channels as they are not available. To confirm, no credits will be issued for this concern at this time."

I don't know what agreement they're referring to (VOD?). All I know is that I believe I am paying for channels that Cox is not providing and not getting any help from them in understanding why. Anybody know how to get this issue to the right person/ senior tech at Cox Phoenix?


----------



## unitron

Cactus Bill said:


> I e-mailed Cox about the issue and got this response:
> 
> "We regret any inconvenience this may be causing you. The agreement between Cox and TiVo has been completed, but this feature is not ready to launch to TiVo Premiere customers in Cox Arizona yet. Regrettably, we do not have an estimated time of arrival. Please note, we are not charging accounts with CableCARDs only for the Plus Packages channels as they are not available. To confirm, no credits will be issued for this concern at this time."
> 
> I don't know what agreement they're referring to (VOD?). All I know is that I believe I am paying for channels that Cox is not providing and not getting any help from them in understanding why. Anybody know how to get this issue to the right person/ senior tech at Cox Phoenix?


And why do they think this is just about Premiere owners and not S3 owners?


----------



## Graystone

I too am in the Mesa/Phoenix Cox area. Cox has little to no understanding of Tivo boxes and subcontract out their installs and repairs to Non-Cox companies who seem to know even less about Tivo. Both the phone personnel and the installers will try to talk you out of sticking with Tivo. I do get most of the digital channels available except on-demand. 

I've moved a few times over the years and each time getting Cox out several times is often necessary. I'ved owned many models of cable Tivos at one time or another. I have found major problems with every box after the Tivo 2 DT because Cox must do the cable card install. The HD and Premiers have been a nightmare with reboots and menus that sometimes just stick for up to 20 minutes at a time. I've stuck with Tivo because I love the searchability which no other DVR I've tried comes close to. Sometimes it's difficult with a new install to sort out what is the Tivo's normal screw ups and what is Cox's fault. But I've got pretty good at troubleshooting the problems. Slow menus and reboots are generally not a Cox issue. Channels going missing or recordings being missed can be Cox issues.

Do not try to set up your cable card yourself by phone even if Cox allows you to. Many channels won't show as authorized if you do. The phone people have little knowledge of how to fix this and will just tell you to restart your boxes and sometimes reset the cable cards which usually doesn't fix the channels you don't see. The tech needs to be on site so he can call the Cox people (usually several times) to get those channels authorized.

The tech needs to be in your home usually for a few hours. Make sure they check every channel you want for watchability before leaving. They don't like to do this but if you don't have them do it you will be missing channels. They often want to charge you for return visits or schedule appointments weeks away so be sure they do it right first if possible. 

Be sure they check signal levels as weak cable signals cause a vast array of problems with Tivo Premiers. Week signals in Phoenix apartments or multi-housing units are a prime cause of channels disappearing. They can put an amplifier in-line if necessary or sometimes they will just need to pull new cable or replace connectors. This may seem trivial but it is a major source of channel problems.

Also in the Phoenix area, a Tuning Adapter is necessary to pick up many channels. This Cisco TA will be a never ending source of greif to you. If you can live without the channels the tuning adapter provides you, avoid it like the plague. 1st, it's a big box at about the size of a DVD recorder. The TAs lose contact with channels and sometimes fail to authorize some or all channels. When the TA fails it can effect ALL your channels not just the ones it is decoding as the entire set of channels must pass through it. A common problem is seeing a recording did not take place or stopped in the middle of the program. When you look at the channel it either says the channel is unavailable or unauthorized. Pressing the up down channel change button brings it back to life. The tuning adapters shut off channels they think are unused for some time. Unfortunately this often means the program you were recording goes to black screen and the Tivo stops recording. The tuning adapter only restarts that channel after the tivo selects it a couple of times again (CHUP & CHDOWN). At least once a week the TAs would do this to one of my recordings. Even more frequently, as an example, dial up say 1010 channel. You see a black screen or channel unavailable. Hit channel up/down and it's back. I've had 3 of these boxes and they all have caused problems which result in failed recordings or cable outages. Sometimes shutting it off for a minute or two and turning it back on will help. Prepare to wait a few minutes for it to reset.

Phoenix Cox has no desire and limited knowhow to get your Tivo working. You will have to fight them all the way. Be prepared for at least 3 service calls before you get all your channels and even then you might still have to deal with Tuning Adapter problems and the occassional Premier itself locking up. Then there's also the issue that Cox locks (maximum copy protection setting) almost all recordings so you can't transfer them out of the Tivo even to another Tivo.

Cox wants you out of the Tivo box and into paying rental for theirs. The techs themselves will often tell you they hate setting up cable card devices. But their Scientific Atlanta is a complete piece of junk so you will want them to get your Tivo working rather than switch as they would like you to do.

Don't give up and you'll eventually get your Tivo system and Cox working together. Don't expect the Cable Card Tuning Adapter issues to be resolved. You'll just have to live with them if you want Tivo here. If you have them come out for anything, be sure to scrutinize your next two bills as they often like to charge for something they didn't get right the first time or even double bill for calls.

I'd gladly dump Cox if there were other non-contract options with the same channels available here, provided they worked with Tivo. Over-the-Air reception isn't good here and not much is available there except the major 4 or 5 networks. Sattelite has the channels but wants a contract and doesn't support HD Tivos yet. On-line requires devoting a PC to downloading and a good deal of interaction which I don't want to do. So until other options are available, I'm stuck with Cox.


----------



## aztivo

Cactus Bill said:


> I e-mailed Cox about the issue and got this response:
> 
> "We regret any inconvenience this may be causing you. The agreement between Cox and TiVo has been completed, but this feature is not ready to launch to TiVo Premiere customers in Cox Arizona yet. Regrettably, we do not have an estimated time of arrival. Please note, we are not charging accounts with CableCARDs only for the Plus Packages channels as they are not available. To confirm, no credits will be issued for this concern at this time."
> 
> I don't know what agreement they're referring to (VOD?). All I know is that I believe I am paying for channels that Cox is not providing and not getting any help from them in understanding why. Anybody know how to get this issue to the right person/ senior tech at Cox Phoenix?


As i stated before I have been being a guine pig for this. We have been working on it for a week. Cox is trying to remedy the situation. It is not ideal or fast but it is being worked on I am on email and calls with cox techs just about everyday.

They assure me they will get this resolved, so the best we can do is hope and wait

EDIT: also what they are refering to is COX and TIVO were supposed to put out a box that woudl allow us to have all cox features.. I dont know why they say it is compleate. Sounds like another case of a cox rep not knowing what is going on


----------



## aztivo

unitron said:


> And why do they think this is just about Premiere owners and not S3 owners?


S3 can not handle 1ghz for the H.264 channels. I have one sitting in a guest room that I have regulated to OTA. And I bought it the day they were releassed in 06? for like $700 but both my premier and elite can handle the 1Ghz so they are in the bedroom and tv room


----------



## aztivo

Graystone said:


> I too am in the Mesa/Phoenix Cox area. Cox has little to no understanding of Tivo boxes and subcontract out their installs and repairs to Non-Cox companies who seem to know even less about Tivo. Both the phone personnel and the installers will try to talk you out of sticking with Tivo. I do get most of the digital channels available except on-demand.
> 
> I've moved a few times over the years and each time getting Cox out several times is often necessary. I'ved owned many models of cable Tivos at one time or another. I have found major problems with every box after the Tivo 2 DT because Cox must do the cable card install. The HD and Premiers have been a nightmare with reboots and menus that sometimes just stick for up to 20 minutes at a time. I've stuck with Tivo because I love the searchability which no other DVR I've tried comes close to. Sometimes it's difficult with a new install to sort out what is the Tivo's normal screw ups and what is Cox's fault. But I've got pretty good at troubleshooting the problems. Slow menus and reboots are generally not a Cox issue. Channels going missing or recordings being missed can be Cox issues.
> 
> Do not try to set up your cable card yourself by phone even if Cox allows you to. Many channels won't show as authorized if you do. The phone people have little knowledge of how to fix this and will just tell you to restart your boxes and sometimes reset the cable cards which usually doesn't fix the channels you don't see. The tech needs to be on site so he can call the Cox people (usually several times) to get those channels authorized.
> 
> The tech needs to be in your home usually for a few hours. Make sure they check every channel you want for watchability before leaving. They don't like to do this but if you don't have them do it you will be missing channels. They often want to charge you for return visits or schedule appointments weeks away so be sure they do it right first if possible.
> 
> Be sure they check signal levels as weak cable signals cause a vast array of problems with Tivo Premiers. Week signals in Phoenix apartments or multi-housing units are a prime cause of channels disappearing. They can put an amplifier in-line if necessary or sometimes they will just need to pull new cable or replace connectors. This may seem trivial but it is a major source of channel problems.
> 
> Also in the Phoenix area, a Tuning Adapter is necessary to pick up many channels. This Cisco TA will be a never ending source of greif to you. If you can live without the channels the tuning adapter provides you, avoid it like the plague. 1st, it's a big box at about the size of a DVD recorder. The TAs lose contact with channels and sometimes fail to authorize some or all channels. When the TA fails it can effect ALL your channels not just the ones it is decoding as the entire set of channels must pass through it. A common problem is seeing a recording did not take place or stopped in the middle of the program. When you look at the channel it either says the channel is unavailable or unauthorized. Pressing the up down channel change button brings it back to life. The tuning adapters shut off channels they think are unused for some time. Unfortunately this often means the program you were recording goes to black screen and the Tivo stops recording. The tuning adapter only restarts that channel after the tivo selects it a couple of times again (CHUP & CHDOWN). At least once a week the TAs would do this to one of my recordings. Even more frequently, as an example, dial up say 1010 channel. You see a black screen or channel unavailable. Hit channel up/down and it's back. I've had 3 of these boxes and they all have caused problems which result in failed recordings or cable outages. Sometimes shutting it off for a minute or two and turning it back on will help. Prepare to wait a few minutes for it to reset.
> 
> Phoenix Cox has no desire and limited knowhow to get your Tivo working. You will have to fight them all the way. Be prepared for at least 3 service calls before you get all your channels and even then you might still have to deal with Tuning Adapter problems and the occassional Premier itself locking up. Then there's also the issue that Cox locks (maximum copy protection setting) almost all recordings so you can't transfer them out of the Tivo even to another Tivo.
> 
> Cox wants you out of the Tivo box and into paying rental for theirs. The techs themselves will often tell you they hate setting up cable card devices. But their Scientific Atlanta is a complete piece of junk so you will want them to get your Tivo working rather than switch as they would like you to do.
> 
> Don't give up and you'll eventually get your Tivo system and Cox working together. Don't expect the Cable Card Tuning Adapter issues to be resolved. You'll just have to live with them if you want Tivo here. If you have them come out for anything, be sure to scrutinize your next two bills as they often like to charge for something they didn't get right the first time or even double bill for calls.
> 
> I'd gladly dump Cox if there were other non-contract options with the same channels available here, provided they worked with Tivo. Over-the-Air reception isn't good here and not much is available there except the major 4 or 5 networks. Sattelite has the channels but wants a contract and doesn't support HD Tivos yet. On-line requires devoting a PC to downloading and a good deal of interaction which I don't want to do. So until other options are available, I'm stuck with Cox.


You have a lot here. I will say in the last few months I would not want a tech in my house as you can just call in and get them to activate the cards. No need for the truck roll. I have done this as I traded in my 2 s cards from my S3 for 1 M card for my elite


----------



## moyekj

aztivo said:


> S3 can not handle 1ghz for the H.264 channels. I have one sitting in a guest room that I have regulated to OTA. And I bought it the day they were releassed in 06? for like $700 but both my premier and elite can handle the 1Ghz so they are in the bedroom and tv room


 Actually the TiVo HD units can tune up to 1GHz, it's the older S3 OLED models that cannot. Cox in our area has many channels in the 860-1000MHz range.


----------



## CoxInPHX

It's a TiVo-specific problem... the channels are able to be authorized for WMC.

See the following Posting where a Cox Phoenix customer with a SiliconDust HDHomeRun PRIME and WMC is getting the HBO Plus Package channels. I would assume the Ceton InfiniTV 4 should also. The problem child seems to be TiVo Premiere.

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r26842276-It-s-a-TiVo-specific-problem.-the-channels-are-authorized


----------



## Cactus Bill

I e-mailed Tivo to see if they could provide any insight as to the status of the problem with Cox and Plus Package channels in Phoenix. I got an answer that puts the blame on Cox and says something about certain customers resolving the issue with an adapter, which I've never heard of that happening. If the rep is referring to a tuning adaper, then I don't believe she's answering the question that I'm asking. Here's the answer I got:

"Thank you for contacting TiVo Customer Support. I would be glad to answer your question. Cox has acknowledged that the issue is on their end with their equipment and is currently working towards a resolution. TiVo is assisting in any way possible, however the resolution will have to come from Cox. Some customers have reported that the issue was resolved with the addition of an adapter that was provided by Cox."


----------



## zowwie85

CoxInPHX said:


> ...where a Cox Phoenix customer with a SiliconDust HDHomeRun PRIME and WMC is getting the HBO Plus Package channels.
> 
> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r26842276-It-s-a-TiVo-specific-problem.-the-channels-are-authorized


That'd be ME.  Still no change on my TiVos for these channels, but the SiliconDust device works great.


----------



## zowwie85

Graystone said:


> Do not try to set up your cable card yourself by phone even if Cox allows you to. Many channels won't show as authorized if you do.


I don't agree with this. Use the toll-free number on the cablecard pairing screen for setup/support. Unless you're new to Cox you know what channels you get and don't get.

If you're having tuning adapter problems and have multiple cablecards/TA's it might be worth your while to write down the cablecard serial number from the pairing screen along with the STB serial number from the TA. Call the toll-free number on your pairing screen and tell them you want to verify that your cablecard occurrences are built correctly.

In future when you move or add a cable card, have that STB serial number (actually its all letters) along with the cablecard pairing information to make sure they build/change the occurrence correctly.

I don't work for Cox - heck, I don't even LIKE them very much. The price is far too high vs. the level of support actually provided! But unless your signal levels are bad you just don't need someone to come out to your place for a cablecard install/move/change.


----------



## CoxInPHX

zowwie85 said:


> That'd be ME.  Still no change on my TiVos for these channels, but the SiliconDust device works great.


When I tune to one of the Plus Pak channels and go into the TiVo DVR Diagnostics, The TiVo shows all the channels as CCI Byte: 0x00, CopyFreely, which seems odd for Premium channels. I am wondering if this is part of the problem.

What does the CCI Byte show on the SiliconDust?


----------



## zowwie85

CoxInPHX said:


> What does the CCI Byte show on the SiliconDust?


Tuned to 1203 this is what shows up:

Cisco CableCARD(tm)
Copy Protection Information

Auth Status: CP Auth Received
Info for pgm index 0-5
[LTSID - PN - CCI - ERR ]
0x0 - 0x1 - *0x2* - 0x0
0x0 - 0x0 - 0x0 - 0x0
0x0 - 0x0 - 0x0 - 0x0
0x0 - 0x0 - 0x0 - 0x0
0x0 - 0x0 - 0x0 - 0x0
0x0 - 0x0 - 0x0 - 0x0

MKS Period: 600 seconds
VerifyKey Status: OK

So I think the answer is 0x2 - and the recordings are treated as copy-protected.

This screen also confirms that the specific channel is treated as 0x2:
Cisco CableCARD(tm)
Active Program

Program Index: 0, Src ID: 0xE7E2
[LTSID-PrgNo-Status-ECM-CCI-EID]
0-1-Ent-88-*2*-0x94
Elementary Streams
[ Stream Type-Pid Number ]
0x1B-0x0011 0x81-0x0013 0x81-0x0018

ECM PID: 0x19


----------



## LoREvanescence

Interesting, for the fist time ever my premiere can tune COX3D on channel 1300.

No idea how 3d works on this channel, I just know I don't have a 3D tv or glasses of any kind. But I'm tuning this channel and it's no longer coming up with channel not available banner.


Just posting this as an FYI if anyone with a 3d setup wants to test it out.


----------



## CoxInPHX

CoxInPHX said:


> It's a TiVo-specific problem... the channels are able to be authorized for WMC.
> 
> See the following Posting where a Cox Phoenix customer with a SiliconDust HDHomeRun PRIME and WMC is getting the HBO Plus Package channels. I would assume the Ceton InfiniTV 4 should also. The problem child seems to be TiVo Premiere.
> 
> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r26842276-It-s-a-TiVo-specific-problem.-the-channels-are-authorized


*NOTE:* this posting is in the Series 3 thread, but to my knowledge only the S4 Premieres will be getting an update for MPEG4 (H.264).

Update on MPEG4 (H.264) Cox Plus Package channels in NoVA and Arizona not being able to be Authorized. Both markets are Cisco and use Tuning Adapters, an update by Cisco has also been mentioned, but not verified.

But, TiVo has confirmed that the issue needs a TiVo software patch/update to support the new MPEG4 channels, which will most likely be included in the next software release. I also got an email confirmation from TiVo of the needed update.
http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r26945421-CONFIRMED-TiVo-Premiere-problem-fix-coming-qSpring-2012-q

I am not aware of any other markets using MPEG4 (H.264) for the Plus Package channels. If anyone in a market other than NoVA or Arizona can confirm usage of MPEG4 (H.264), please post.


----------



## CoxInPHX

Has Cox San Diego switched the Plus Package HD channels to MPEG4 (H.264)

Have any other Cox markets made the move? (besides Virgina and Arizona)


----------



## ajwees41

CoxInPHX said:


> *NOTE:* this posting is in the Series 3 thread, but to my knowledge only the S4 Premieres will be getting an update for MPEG4 (H.264).
> 
> Update on MPEG4 (H.264) Cox Plus Package channels in NoVA and Arizona not being able to be Authorized. Both markets are Cisco and use Tuning Adapters, an update by Cisco has also been mentioned, but not verified.
> 
> But, TiVo has confirmed that the issue needs a TiVo software patch/update to support the new MPEG4 channels, which will most likely be included in the next software release. I also got an email confirmation from TiVo of the needed update.
> http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r26945421-CONFIRMED-TiVo-Premiere-problem-fix-coming-qSpring-2012-q
> 
> I am not aware of any other markets using MPEG4 (H.264) for the Plus Package channels. If anyone in a market other than NoVA or Arizona can confirm usage of MPEG4 (H.264), please post.


if you still have the email you might want to post it since the other link is dead


----------



## LoREvanescence

A couple weeks ago I signed up for HBO and Cinemax because it was offered Free for 3 months, then half price for 3 more.

After they first authorized it I got all the HBO and Cinemax channels. A few days later I noticed I only get HBO and HBO2, Cinemax and Moremax. All the other versions such as HBO Signature or Family say not authorized. I called them, they sent a hit to the cable cards, nothing changed. Then they said they needed me to schedule a truck roll and be home. 


Anyone have any suggestions on what to try or why I might not be getting all of them anymore.


On a site note, I noticed Epix is now authorized where it wasn't before


----------



## CoxInPHX

LoREvanescence said:


> I checked the plus package channels, which I have been getting here for about a month now on my tivo.
> 
> They are all still MPEG-2
> 
> would love to see MPEG-4 / H.264





LoREvanescence said:


> A couple weeks ago I signed up for HBO and Cinemax because it was offered Free for 3 months, then half price for 3 more.
> 
> After they first authorized it I got all the HBO and Cinemax channels. A few days later I noticed I only get HBO and HBO2, Cinemax and Moremax. All the other versions such as HBO Signature or Family say not authorized. I called them, they sent a hit to the cable cards, nothing changed. Then they said they needed me to schedule a truck roll and be home.
> 
> Anyone have any suggestions on what to try or why I might not be getting all of them anymore.
> 
> On a site note, I noticed Epix is now authorized where it wasn't before


Are the Plus Package channels, the addt'l HBOs still MPEG2 or has Cox switched to H.264?


----------



## LoREvanescence

CoxInPHX said:


> Are the Plus Package channels, the addt'l HBOs still MPEG2 or has Cox switched to H.264?


They are still MPEG2 in the Providence RI Market.


----------



## rcobourn

I just checked mine via Slingbox and they show as not authorized. I suspect they switched over.

EDIT: Checked DVR Diagnostics... they are H.264 now. A truck roll isn't going to help you if this is your issue as well, wait for the software update.

EDIT: Picture


----------



## rcobourn

I had noticed over the weekend that some programs hadn't recorded because a wishlist had picked them up on HBOHD east which is also encoded H.264. Best to uncheck all these channels in your list of channels received until the software update comes along.


----------



## ajwees41

rcobourn said:


> I had noticed over the weekend that some programs hadn't recorded because a wishlist had picked them up on HBOHD east which is also encoded H.264. Best to uncheck all these channels in your list of channels received until the software update comes along.


is HBOHD in your area part of the plus pack? If not it should still be mpeg 2


----------



## ellinj

LoREvanescence said:


> They are still MPEG2 in the Providence RI Market.


Do you have a tuning adapter? I thought I got a letter that these were moving to SDV. I still haven't picked up a TA.


----------



## LoREvanescence

ellinj said:


> Do you have a tuning adapter? I thought I got a letter that these were moving to SDV. I still haven't picked up a TA.


Yes I do, and it's working as all other channels on the letter are turning without issue.


----------



## LoREvanescence

this whole HBO / Cinemax thing got even stranger.


I have not been in touch with cox on this issue since the first time I posted here. As all they seem to want to do is schedule a truck roll.


The past few days EPIX has been coming in and authorized. I do not have that channel in my package. To night Epix is not authorized, but all my HBO's and Cinemax are back.


----------



## CoxInPHX

RE: The "Spring Update" SW Vers. 20.2.1.1-01-2

I am VERY happy to confirm the issue with the Cox H.264 Plus Package HD Channels have been Fixed with the latest SW release.

Note: You still need to call Cox @ 877-820-8202 to have the Plus Pak channels added to your account. ask for HBO+, SHO+, Starz+, and/or Cinemax+


----------



## rhain

Just a couple of weeks ago my Original Series 3 blew a Hard Drive and I had to replace it; in the process I had to call COX San Diego to re-pair the Cable Cards (CC). I called the number that was presented on the CC screen that pops up when the TiVo thinks you need to see this screen.

That was the best thing that ever happened to me because I was connected directly to a live person who verified my information and then proceeded to ask me for all the information they would need to re-pair the CCs.

While we were waiting to verify the pairing worked he told me about the upgrade to the Tuning Adaptor that would allow me to receive the +Packages (HBO 1202,1203, etc, STARZ +) and how TiVo was going to push out an S/W upgrade to go along with it. I thought that was great news.

But my question is, will I be able to tune these new channels with an upgraded Tuning Adaptor or am I out of luck because I have an Original Series 3 TiVo.

Oh, and the CC Pairing was done in about 5 minutes. I also had to call back the next weekend because I had to do a Clear and Delete Everything because I used an image that caused the Home Base (TiVo) to think I did not have an authorized unit. The second call to re-pair the CCs went as easy as the first call.

Thank you for your reply (if there is one).

Robert


----------



## aztivo

I believe you need to have the s4 boxes. But I diont have a TA hooked up to my S3 so am moly about 90% positive on this


----------



## CoxInPHX

rhain said:


> But my question is, will I be able to tune these new channels with an upgraded Tuning Adaptor or am I out of luck because I have an Original Series 3 TiVo.
> 
> Thank you for your reply (if there is one).
> Robert


Last I heard Cox San Diego was still using MPEG2 for the Plus Package HD channels.
http://ww2.cox.com/residential/sandiego/tv/channel-lineup.cox#20

If they are still MPEG2 then the TiVo S3 will be able to tune the Plus Package, and NO you do not need the Tuning Adapter Update Kit, (which includes a splitter and MoCA POE filter)

Keep in mind eventually Cox will move the channels to MPEG4 (H.264), and then you will most likely lose them.

If Cox San Diego has moved the Plus Package HD channels to MPEG4 (H.264) then NO the S3 will not be able to tune them, (unless TiVo updates the software which they have indicated they have no plans to do so.)

There is a lot more info about Cox San Diego at the following link, and I suggest you contact the Cox employee there username "Joshuarat"
http://www.sandiegohdtv.org/forums/thread-plus-package-hd-channels-cablecard?pid=2684#pid2684


----------



## CoxInPHX

CoxInPHX said:


> When I tune to one of the Plus Pak channels and go into the TiVo DVR Diagnostics, The TiVo shows all the channels as CCI Byte: 0x00, CopyFreely, which seems odd for Premium channels. I am wondering if this is part of the problem.





rcobourn said:


> I just checked mine via Slingbox and they show as not authorized. I suspect they switched over.
> 
> EDIT: Checked DVR Diagnostics... they are H.264 now. A truck roll isn't going to help you if this is your issue as well, wait for the software update.
> 
> EDIT: Picture


It would seem at least part of the problem was TiVo's inability to handle copy protection on the H.264 channels. As reported and shown in the image before the "Spring Update" all H.264 channels were reported as 0x00 (CopyFreely) by the TiVo Diagnostics while the CableCard Diagnostic reported 0x02 (CopyOnce) which was the correct value.

After the Update, TiVo Diagnostics now reports 0x02 the same value as the CableCARD.


----------



## rcobourn

CoxInPHX said:


> RE: The "Spring Update" SW Vers. 20.2.1.1-01-2
> 
> I am VERY happy to confirm the issue with the Cox H.264 Plus Package HD Channels have been Fixed with the latest SW release.
> 
> Note: You still need to call Cox @ 877-820-8202 to have the Plus Pak channels added to your account. ask for HBO+, SHO+, Starz+, and/or Cinemax+


I didn't have to call to add the Plus Pak channels, they just started working once the update was applied.


----------



## aztivo

CoxInPHX said:


> Last I heard Cox San Diego was still using MPEG2 for the Plus Package HD channels.
> http://ww2.cox.com/residential/sandiego/tv/channel-lineup.cox#20
> 
> If they are still MPEG2 then the TiVo S3 will be able to tune the Plus Package, and NO you do not need the Tuning Adapter Update Kit, (which includes a splitter and MoCA POE filter)
> 
> Keep in mind eventually Cox will move the channels to MPEG4 (H.264), and then you will most likely lose them.
> 
> If Cox San Diego has moved the Plus Package HD channels to MPEG4 (H.264) then NO the S3 will not be able to tune them, (unless TiVo updates the software which they have indicated they have no plans to do so.)
> 
> There is a lot more info about Cox San Diego at the following link, and I suggest you contact the Cox employee there username "Joshuarat"
> http://www.sandiegohdtv.org/forums/thread-plus-package-hd-channels-cablecard?pid=2684#pid2684


I don't have or use MoCa Poe filter with my TA. Where you told that we needed that or are you just saying its something you use?


----------



## CoxInPHX

aztivo said:


> I don't have or use MoCa Poe filter with my TA. Where you told that we needed that or are you just saying its something you use?


I am not using a MoCA POE Filter, But the latest Cox Tuning Adapter Install Sheet and Plus Package Info for CableCARDs says that they are need. However I can attest they are not. I have no idea why Cox did this.

See the following links.
http://ww2.cox.com/residential/arizona/support/tv/article.cox?articleId={b8889a60-d706-11df-66a2-000000000000}
Ability to tune to HD Plus Pak Channels requires:
1. Subscription to its Premium Channel, such as HBO, Showtime, etc.
2. Cox Tuning Adapter in some markets. Also, *if the Tuning Adapter was installed prior to May 2012, then the free Cox Tuning Adapter UPDATE Kit is required*

*Tuning Adapter Install Sheet* showing use of a MoCA Filter.
http://media.cox.com/support/print_...er_guides/cable_box/InstallingYourCiscoTA.pdf

I believe this is only required if you are using the onboard MoCA of the Elite/XL4.

There is more info here:
http://www.sandiegohdtv.org/forums/thread-cisco-sta-1520-tuning-adapter-poops-out?pid=2893#pid2893


----------



## ajwees41

does Cox activate cable cards via online chat? can't get through on the phone.


----------



## Johncv

ajwees41 said:


> does Cox activate cable cards via online chat? can't get through on the phone.


No, I dont think so. Why cant you get through on the phone?


----------



## ajwees41

Johncv said:


> No, I don't think so. Why can't you get through on the phone?


Busy signal and seems like every time I'm on the support site the chat window pops up.


----------



## aztivo

ajwees41 said:


> does Cox activate cable cards via online chat? can't get through on the phone.


Call this number
888.556.1193


----------



## LynnL999

Hey OC Peeps -- has anyone else noticed that the Plus Pak channels are no longer functioning? They tune, but it's just a blank screen. I'm sure they were working as recently as a couple of weeks ago.

The Plus Pak channels are:

1078 Pac-12 HD 
1100 Hub HD
1206 HBO Family HD
1208 HBO2 East HD
1209 HBO Signature HD
1210 HBO Zone HD
1211 HBO Comedy HD
1212 HBO Latino HD
1222 Action Max HD
1223 Thriller Max HD
1228 5 Star Max HD
1231 More Max East HD
1242 Showtime Showcase HD
1243 Showtime Extreme HD
1261 The Movie Channel Extra HD
1262 The Movie Channel East HD
1285 STARZ CINEMA HD
1286 STARZ KIDS & FAMILY HD
1288 STARZ IN BLACK HD
1289 STARZ COMEDY HD
1316 DIY HD
1318 Big Ten Network HD
1323 Outdoor HD
1351 Cooking HD
1900 SWRV HD 

Before I contact Cox, I want to see if it's just me. Thanks.


----------



## Optics

LynnL999 said:


> Hey OC Peeps -- has anyone else noticed that the Plus Pak channels are no longer functioning? ...
> Before I contact Cox, I want to see if it's just me. Thanks.


Not working for me either. I don't get the Premiums, but I used to get 1078, not anymore.

Let us know what they say. Thanks.


----------



## CoxInPHX

I heard from a little bird that the Cox California markets have switched the Plus Package HD channels from MPEG2 to H.264 (MPEG4)

Plus Package Channels for the OC: http://ww2.cox.com/residential/orangecounty/tv/channel-lineup.cox#19

CableCARD Devices and Plus Pak Channels: http://ww2.cox.com/residential/support/tv/article.cox?articleId=9834a820-6d29-11e1-d2ee-000000000000
_"The TiVo Premiere (including XL and Elite), the Ceton InfiniTV, and the SiliconDust HDHomeRun Prime can tune to 1 GHz and decode in MPEG4, which makes them compatible with the Plus Pak channels."​_If that is the case all TiVo Series 3 DVRs will no longer have the ability to decode the H.264 channels, unless TiVo upgrades the software on the TiVo HD. The Series 3 OLEDs do not have the hardware to support 1GHz and H.264.

All Premiere Series 4 TiVos have updated software that does support H.264 video.

If you have a Premiere that does not receive those channels Cox may need to look into the CableCARDs authorization and perhaps re-provision the CableCARD and perhaps the TA.

Look at the Video PID for those channels in the DVR Diagnostic Menu. To see if they are indeed H.264


----------



## Optics

CoxInPHX said:


> I heard from a little bird that the Cox California markets have switched the Plus Package HD channels from MPEG2 to H.264 (MPEG4)
> ...
> 
> Look at the Video PID for those channels in the DVR Diagnostic Menu. To see if they are indeed H.264.


For channel 1078, my TiVoHD shows a "Video PID: 0x1AE1", with no info on encoding. Frequency is 963000 KHz.

Any other way to find out if H.264 is the problem?


----------



## CoxInPHX

Optics said:


> For channel 1078, my TiVoHD shows a "Video PID: 0x1AE1", with no info on encoding. Frequency is 963000 KHz.
> 
> Any other way to find out if H.264 is the problem?


Does a known MPEG2 channel like a local HD or CNNHD have an MPEG2 notation after the Video PID? If not I am unaware of any other way to determine the Video Codec from the TiVoHD


----------



## Optics

CoxInPHX said:


> Does a known MPEG2 channel like a local HD or CNNHD have an MPEG2 notation after the Video PID? If not I am unaware of any other way to determine the Video Codec from the TiVoHD


Unfortunately, neither 1011 FOXHD nor 1014 CNNHD have any notation. Thanks.


----------



## LynnL999

I have a TiVo HD. My video PID for 1206 (HBO something) shows "0x12b1" for 1014 (CNN) shows 0x83. No format notations on either. 1206 also shows a successful tune even though the screen is blank.


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> I have a TiVo HD. My video PID for 1206 (HBO something) shows "0x12b1" for 1014 (CNN) shows 0x83. No format notations on either. 1206 also shows a successful tune even though the screen is blank.


Same here. CoxInPHX must be showing the diagnostic screen for the TiVo Premiere. This info is not showing up on my TiVo HD.

Has anyone else lost the SyFy channel, because I can no longer receive it on the TiVo HD also. Yes, I also check the stupid TA and had a Cox service person check everything and he confirmed that Cox has moved the +Pak to H.264 and starting in 2013 other channels will follow. If the channel is in the 1100 block of channels it will be move to H.264. He also stated that Cox is planning on replacing all their DVR with PACE DVR's starting in 2013. All he could say was that it would have six tuners and a 1TB hard drive. He did know that Cox was currently testing software and did not know what software would be use.

What annoys me is that TiVo CAN push a software update to users of the TiVo HD to allow it to view the H.264 format, but TiVo want you to chuck your TiVo and buy a new one instead of being more like Apple and support the customer. What good is TiVo HD with Lifetime if it can no longer view any video? This is why Apple is going to end up taking over should come out with a set top box/DVR or Apple TV with a cloud DVR or both. Customer support is everything and people will pay for it.

I was thinking about upgrading to a four-tuner TiVo, but why should I when I know that it will NOT be supported by TiVo in another year. I am just going wait for the six-turner from Cox, maybe it will use the TiVo software, if not I guess it will be good-by TiVo.


----------



## LynnL999

SyFy is working for me, JohnCV.


----------



## LynnL999

In other news... is anyone else having trouble with 1002? I am getting a lot of uncorrected errors, on both machines, on that channel only.


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> In other news... is anyone else having trouble with 1002? I am getting a lot of uncorrected errors, on both machines, on that channel only.


"Uncorrected errors", need more details please.


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> In other news... is anyone else having trouble with 1002? I am getting a lot of uncorrected errors, on both machines, on that channel only.


Today, I just found out that the TiVoHD can no longer receive USAHD (1002). 

I live in Chula Vista, which is part of Cox South San Diego. What part of San Diego do you live in Lynn, look like some of your channels disappear also.

Anyone else not receiving channels?


----------



## unitron

Johncv said:


> Today, I just found out that the TiVoHD can no longer receive USAHD (1002).
> ...


For the benefit of future readers, this is not because anything about the TiVo itself has changed.

Once again, one's first instinct should be to assume the cable company is to blame and did to screw customers.


----------



## Johncv

unitron said:


> For the benefit of future readers, this is not because anything about the TiVo itself has changed.
> 
> Once again, one's first instinct should be to assume the cable company is to blame and did to screw customers.


This is where you are wrong, Cox is not screwing the customer, Cox is only providing a better video format. For all we know it may USA, or SyFy that change the video format. TiVo, however is screwing the customer because TiVo can push an upgrade to the TiVoHD to allow it to receive channels in the H.264/MPEG-4 format.


----------



## Optics

I'm in South Orange County, and am still able to receive 1022 USAHDP and 1061 SYFYHDP.


----------



## LynnL999

1002 is KCBS for me, and IIRC, this has happened before with this channel here.


----------



## tvmaster2

Johncv said:


> This is where you are wrong, Cox is not screwing the customer, Cox is only providing a better video format. For all we know it may USA, or SyFy that change the video format. TiVo, however is screwing the customer because TiVo can push an upgrade to the TiVoHD to allow it to receive channels in the H.264/MPEG-4 format.


if this is true, i.e. if TiVo can update the TiVo HD software, who should we start calling to begin the campaign? 
while I can see your point regarding Cox providing a "better" format, I really wasn't having any problems watching my HD content in MPG2. Cox knows damn well that a change would effect many TiVo owners.


----------



## tvmaster2

Optics said:


> I'm in South Orange County, and am still able to receive 1022 USAHDP and 1061 SYFYHDP.


on a TiVo HD?


----------



## LynnL999

tvmaster2 said:


> if this is true, i.e. if TiVo can update the TiVo HD software, who should we start calling to begin the campaign?


I would try @tivodesign on Twitter.


----------



## tvmaster2

LynnL999 said:


> I would try @tivodesign on Twitter.


I don't use Twitter, but at least there are some links to that woman there that may be of use.

Are TivoHD owners just going to roll over and watch as cable companies make viewing HD material impossible on the TivoHD?


----------



## LynnL999

I have tweeted Margaret and am waiting to see if I get a response.

To tell you the truth, I am feeling pretty exasperated by the whole thing. I get that TiVo's priority is its newer hardware, but leaving the HD owners in the cold is upsetting. I spent a considerable amount of money on two TiVo HD's with lifetime only about 3 years ago. Other than possibly replacing a harddrive, I expected these to last another few years at least. (My original TiVo 2, now in the home of a friend, is still working at 11+ years.) 

I was thinking about getting a newer 4 tuner TiVo, but honestly, if in another 3 years I'm going to have more issues like this, after TiVo has moved on to the latest greatest thing, why not save myself the headache and get the 1 TB Cox DVR when it comes out. At least I know it will be supported. We cable card users are just bastard red-headed stepchildren to the cable co's.

Sorry to vent, I am just frustrated.


----------



## LynnL999

Here's what she said:

"@lynnl999 Sorry, that isn't going to happen. Only Premiere supports MPEG4."


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> I have tweeted Margaret and am waiting to see if I get a response.
> 
> To tell you the truth, I am feeling pretty exasperated by the whole thing. I get that TiVo's priority is its newer hardware, but leaving the HD owners in the cold is upsetting. I spent a considerable amount of money on two TiVo HD's with lifetime only about 3 years ago. Other than possibly replacing a harddrive, I expected these to last another few years at least. (My original TiVo 2, now in the home of a friend, is still working at 11+ years.)
> 
> I was thinking about getting a newer 4 tuner TiVo, but honestly, if in another 3 years I'm going to have more issues like this, after TiVo has moved on to the latest greatest thing, why not save myself the headache and get the 1 TB Cox DVR when it comes out. At least I know it will be supported. We cable card users are just bastard red-headed stepchildren to the cable co's.
> 
> Sorry to vent, I am just frustrated.


Can I join you, we should pop a bottle of wine and vent away.  Just found out on Monday (26) that I lost my last Showtime channel now NO Showtime channels on the TiVoHD. It did record "Homeland" on Sunday, but now I have to move that show to the crappy Cox DVR. 

So far I lost:

All the premium +Channels
All the Showtime Channels
BBCHD
SyFyHD

I am with you Lynn, I was considering a four-tuner TiVo. Now I just going wait it out till Cox come out with their six-tuner box and compare it with what TiVo come out with next year. I will just let my Amazon points build up.

Why is it that the tenth largest cable company Cable One, will sign up to use TiVo, but Cox give us crap??


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> Here's what she said:
> 
> "@lynnl999 Sorry, that isn't going to happen. Only Premiere supports MPEG4."


:down::down::down:


----------



## tvmaster2

LynnL999 said:


> Here's what she said:
> 
> "@lynnl999 Sorry, that isn't going to happen. Only Premiere supports MPEG4."


wow, that's a brutal response. how about if we start a thread, and keep track of all the TiVo owners who sell their Tivos ans convert to a competitor? A TiVoHD should record HD...period, regardless of what the cable company technology is. My VCR from 1982 still records 525 lines of SD tv, just like it did 30 years ago. 3 years with "lifetime" that TiVo has planned to kill after 3 years isn't lifetime at all. 
Tivos argument will be that it will record OTA HD.
TiVo, as a corporation, needs to be exposed.
I'm pissed


----------



## tvmaster2

Johncv said:


> Can I join you, we should pop a bottle of wine and vent away.  Just found out on Monday (26) that I lost my last Showtime channel now NO Showtime channels on the TiVoHD. It did record "Homeland" on Sunday, but now I have to move that show to the crappy Cox DVR.
> 
> So far I lost:
> 
> All the premium +Channels
> All the Showtime Channels
> BBCHD
> SyFyHD
> 
> I am with you Lynn, I was considering a four-tuner TiVo. Now I just going wait it out till Cox come out with their six-tuner box and compare it with what TiVo come out with next year. I will just let my Amazon points build up.
> 
> Why is it that the tenth largest cable company Cable One, will sign up to use TiVo, but Cox give us crap??


at the very least, TiVo should make HD owners a very inexpensive trade-up offer, say half the cost of their lowest cost Premiere.


----------



## Optics

tvmaster2 said:


> on a TiVo HD?


Yes, on a TiVoHD


----------



## tvmaster2

Johncv said:


> Same here. CoxInPHX must be showing the diagnostic screen for the TiVo Premiere. This info is not showing up on my TiVo HD.
> 
> Has anyone else lost the SyFy channel, because I can no longer receive it on the TiVo HD also. Yes, I also check the stupid TA and had a Cox service person check everything and he confirmed that Cox has moved the +Pak to H.264 and starting in 2013 other channels will follow. If the channel is in the 1100 block of channels it will be move to H.264. He also stated that Cox is planning on replacing all their DVR with PACE DVR's starting in 2013. All he could say was that it would have six tuners and a 1TB hard drive. He did know that Cox was currently testing software and did not know what software would be use.
> 
> What annoys me is that TiVo CAN push a software update to users of the TiVo HD to allow it to view the H.264 format, but TiVo want you to chuck your TiVo and buy a new one instead of being more like Apple and support the customer. What good is TiVo HD with Lifetime if it can no longer view any video? This is why Apple is going to end up taking over should come out with a set top box/DVR or Apple TV with a cloud DVR or both. Customer support is everything and people will pay for it.
> 
> I was thinking about upgrading to a four-tuner TiVo, but why should I when I know that it will NOT be supported by TiVo in another year. I am just going wait for the six-turner from Cox, maybe it will use the TiVo software, if not I guess it will be good-by TiVo.


On the phone with tivo....they wont even offer a discount, or move the lifetime service from my HD to a Premiere.

I guess Cox wins, aka why would I buy another Tivo box if "lifetime" means three years max?

Or, go with satellite and to hell with both of them.....argghhh


----------



## LynnL999

tvmaster2 said:


> at the very least, TiVo should make HD owners a very inexpensive trade-up offer, say half the cost of their lowest cost Premiere.


I would accept just letting me transfer my lifetime service.


----------



## LynnL999

tvmaster2 said:


> I guess Cox wins, aka why would I buy another Tivo box if "lifetime" means three years max?


I went through the demo of the Trio DVR. It doesn't actually look so bad. Honestly, the only reason I switched back to TiVo after using the Cox DVR is because it only held ~10 hours of HD. That problem will certainly be resolved with a 1 TB drive. And I would get On Demand back, which I actually used sometimes. I will miss TiVo if I switch back, but not enough to justify spending what it would cost to upgrade.


----------



## jrtroo

Don't forget- if you do decide to upgrade your old unit will still fetch some good bucks when sold.

If this were impacting me, I would go ahead and make an FCC complaint. Just for the fun of making them respond and for letting someone at the FCC see what is happening at the front lines when cablecos mess around.


----------



## ajwees41

LynnL999 said:


> I went through the demo of the Trio DVR. It doesn't actually look so bad. Honestly, the only reason I switched back to TiVo after using the Cox DVR is because it only held ~10 hours of HD. That problem will certainly be resolved with a 1 TB drive. And I would get On Demand back, which I actually used sometimes. I will miss TiVo if I switch back, but not enough to justify spending what it would cost to upgrade.


It's the SA hardware not Trio that is crap.


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> Here's what she said:
> 
> "@lynnl999 Sorry, that isn't going to happen. Only Premiere supports MPEG4."


Margaret is not telling the truth, credit to CoxInPHX for this info:

According to the specs I find, The TiVo HD has

MicroTuner MT2131 1GHz Tuners
http://www.zoran.com/IMG/pdf/PB-00069.pdf

and the Broadcom BCM7401 chipset supports AVC (H.264/MPEG-4 Part 10).

http://www.broadcom.com/products/Cable/High-Definition-Audio-Video-Graphics-System-Processors/BCM7401










This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 653x804.


----------



## CoxInPHX

Suggestion to Cox TiVo HD owners, sell your Lifetime TiVo HDs now before any other Cable Providers switch to H.264 and get yourself a Premiere.

When another large Cable Co does switch to H.264 the value of your TiVo HD is bound to drop.

If a few more large providers were to switch TiVo might decide to update, but I would not count on that. Get out now, and get your money.


----------



## tvmaster2

Johncv said:


> Margaret is not telling the truth, credit to CoxInPHX for this info:
> 
> According to the specs I find, The TiVo HD has
> 
> MicroTuner MT2131 1GHz Tuners
> http://www.zoran.com/IMG/pdf/PB-00069.pdf
> 
> and the Broadcom BCM7401 chipset supports AVC (H.264/MPEG-4 Part 10).
> 
> http://www.broadcom.com/products/Cable/High-Definition-Audio-Video-Graphics-System-Processors/BCM7401
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> This image has been resized. Click this bar to view the full image. The original image is sized 653x804.


so, is what you are saying is that the hardware is completely capable, but the software isn't?


----------



## Johncv

tvmaster2 said:


> so, is what you are saying is that the hardware is completely capable, but the software isn't?


Correct.


----------



## tvmaster2

Johncv said:


> Correct.


wow...tough call...do we trust TiVo to fix it, or gamble they won't, take our loses and either upgrade or get out of the game altogether....


----------



## LynnL999

So, hey, I wanted to let anyone who was in my situation know that TiVo will step up if you keep pressing the issue. They ended up offering me a number of options, and I now have a new Premiere XL 

Now that I have the plus pak channels back, I noticed the following channels all seem to be 3 hours off in Orange County. Basically, the guide data is for the pacific feed but the east coast feed seems to be airing. For example, 1206 is currently (on 11 am Sunday) showing Harry Potter/Azkaban, when the guide data lists Crashbox. Harry Potter is supposed to air starting at 12 pm.

1206 HBOFPHD, should be HBOFHD
1209 HBOSPHD, should be HBOSHD
1289 STARZCHP should be STARZH

Can anyone confirm, just to make sure I'm not crazy?


----------



## unitron

LynnL999 said:


> So, hey, I wanted to let anyone who was in my situation know that TiVo will step up if you keep pressing the issue. They ended up offering me a number of options, and I now have a new Premiere XL
> 
> Now that I have the plus pak channels back, I noticed the following channels all seem to be 3 hours off in Orange County. Basically, the guide data is for the pacific feed but the east coast feed seems to be airing. For example, 1206 is currently (on 11 am Sunday) showing Harry Potter/Azkaban, when the guide data lists Crashbox. Harry Potter is supposed to air starting at 12 pm.
> 
> 1206 HBOFPHD, should be HBOFHD
> 1209 HBOSPHD, should be HBOSHD
> 1289 STARZCHP should be STARZH
> 
> Can anyone confirm, just to make sure I'm not crazy?


So you had a lifetimed S3 or two, and now you have what, exactly?

A 2 tuner S4 with 1TB drive? What kind of subscription? Was it transferred from either S3? What kind of money did you have to lay out and what did you wind up with with what account status?


----------



## LynnL999

They offered me several options. I wanted the XL4, which I bought at retail and they transferred the lifetime service from one of my HD's.


----------



## unitron

LynnL999 said:


> They offered me several options. I wanted the XL4, which I bought at retail and they transferred the lifetime service from one of my HD's.


Did it cost you anything other than the retail price of the XL4?

Do you plan to keep that HD as a parts source for the other one?


----------



## LynnL999

unitron said:


> Did it cost you anything other than the retail price of the XL4?


No.



> Do you plan to keep that HD as a parts source for the other one?


Probably, though I haven't decided for sure yet.


----------



## tvmaster2

I too took a Premiere deal...

exchanged my two severely-buggy (hard-drive's-a-crashing) Tivo HD's for two 45 hour Premiere's. Lifetime service for each of the HD's was transferred over as part of the price, which was $49 for each machine. 90 day warranty included. Totally happy with that resolution.


----------



## nooneuknow

Two days ago, out of nowhere, we received a notification that as of JUNE 17, 2013, Tuning Adapters would be available, as a self-install kit, at our local Cox retail centers, free of charge & additional fees.

It also states that: AS OF JULY 17, 2013, we would lose nearly all our channels, beyond basic service, if the Tuning Adapters were NOT installed before that date.

They make a play to save us the hassle of going through this, by offering ONE (ONLY ONE) of THEIR digital/HD receivers for the same price as a CableCard for 12 months (which I guess might appeal to somebody with ONLY ONE TiVo (or other CableCard device, NOT leased from Cox). After the year of $1.99/month offer, the costs associated with keeping the receiver would go up to whatever rates were in place at that point.

THERE IS NO MENTION OF ON-DEMAND, unless it's while their baiting you with a discounted receiver, leased from them.

In a house where family members are SCOLDED, harshly, for leaving a single CF nightlight on, or not turning off lights when leaving a room, I am very worried about the increased electrical utility bill that will arise from using these Tuning Adapters. We have some of the highest electric rates in the nation. I've read, all over, how these Tuning Adapters are inefficient ELECTRICITY HOGS, run hot, and introduce all sorts of issues in the wake of their deployment.

I realize this is the way things need to be, and it was coming sooner or later. My biggest concern is does the FCC CableCard mandate also cover Tuning Adapters, or are they a separate matter. If separate, who do we complain to, if/when there are problems with them? Cox here absolutely hates TiVo, hates CableCards, & hates supporting the parts that they should be responsible for supporting. Their party line for a year has been "We don't support TiVo". It doesn't matter what the problem is, or if it affects every device in the house, non-TiVo & all, if there are TiVos in the house, that's the line you get...


----------



## cliffdwelling

nooneuknow said:


> Two days ago, out of nowhere, we received a notification that as of JUNE 17, 2013, Tuning Adapters would be available, as a self-install kit, at our local Cox retail centers, free of charge & additional fees.
> 
> It also states that: AS OF JULY 17, 2013, we would lose nearly all our channels, beyond basic service, if the Tuning Adapters were NOT installed before that date.
> 
> They make a play to save us the hassle of going through this, by offering ONE (ONLY ONE) of THEIR digital/HD receivers for the same price as a CableCard for 12 months (which I guess might appeal to somebody with ONLY ONE TiVo (or other CableCard device, NOT leased from Cox). After the year of $1.99/month offer, the costs associated with keeping the receiver would go up to whatever rates were in place at that point.
> 
> THERE IS NO MENTION OF ON-DEMAND, unless it's while their baiting you with a discounted receiver, leased from them.
> 
> In a house where family members are SCOLDED, harshly, for leaving a single CF nightlight on, or not turning off lights when leaving a room, I am very worried about the increased electrical utility bill that will arise from using these Tuning Adapters. We have some of the highest electric rates in the nation. I've read, all over, how these Tuning Adapters are inefficient ELECTRICITY HOGS, run hot, and introduce all sorts of issues in the wake of their deployment.
> 
> I realize this is the way things need to be, and it was coming sooner or later. My biggest concern is does the FCC CableCard mandate also cover Tuning Adapters, or are they a separate matter. If separate, who do we complain to, if/when there are problems with them? Cox here absolutely hates TiVo, hates CableCards, & hates supporting the parts that they should be responsible for supporting. Their party line for a year has been "We don't support TiVo". It doesn't matter what the problem is, or if it affects every device in the house, non-TiVo & all, if there are TiVos in the house, that's the line you get...


Got the same notice here in Tucson, but Aug 08 is deadline. I was an early adopter of TA about 3 years ago or more. It was made by Cisco and was horrible and we just removed them and suffered without some channels.
I am wondering if these are same Tuning adapters offered or upgrades which are more responsive.
Hopefully someone will chime in who has some experience.


----------



## delgadobb

cliffdwelling said:


> Got the same notice here in Tucson, but Aug 08 is deadline. I was an early adopter of TA about 3 years ago or more. It was made by Cisco and was horrible and we just removed them and suffered without some channels.
> I am wondering if these are same Tuning adapters offered or upgrades which are more responsive.
> Hopefully someone will chime in who has some experience.


Like the previous poster, I am in Las Vegas - although I got the letter from Cox about Tuning Adapters late in the game (just a few days before the July 17th deadline).

The letter implied we had to come into the Cox service center to pick up the Tuning Adapters. I tried calling the number provided for the Rancho Drive store, which sent me into an automated Microsoft Exchange voicemail system. Oops, wrong number. Good job, Cox. I called the Cox main number & leaned on them to send a tech for an install; they wanted to charge me & I argued it was their change & that I couldn't reach their store because of a wrong number. They're supposed to have put it through waiving the trip charge, but I'll believe it when I see it.

When the tech called, I confirmed with him that he had 2 tuning adapters & of course he had only 1. He had to make a trip to pick up another, despite my explicit instructions with Cox. Sure enough, the Tuning Adapters are made by Cisco. While Cox insisted it was a simple self-install, the tech admitted he didn't know how to install them & had to refer to online instructions; apparently he was told "Oh, you'll figure it out" & given no instruction. The install was more involved than expected, but we eventually got it working with a couple reboots of the Tuning Adapters & my Tivo HDs. Once he left, he had to make not 1 but 2 return trips as they weren't showing up properly in their system. Not an easy process.

I'll try to update in a few weeks or so if anything comes up. At this point, I don't have a high degree of confidence given how unprepared Cox seems to have been with all this.


----------



## CoxInPHX

cliffdwelling said:


> Got the same notice here in Tucson, but Aug 08 is deadline. I was an early adopter of TA about 3 years ago or more. It was made by Cisco and was horrible and we just removed them and suffered without some channels.
> I am wondering if these are same Tuning adapters offered or upgrades which are more responsive.
> Hopefully someone will chime in who has some experience.


Another Cox Arizona customer in Mesa reported in another forum, about getting the same letter. So far I have not received a letter.

I am confused, because Cox Arizona has been using SDV and the Cisco TA for years, and currently there are 194 channels using SDV. I cannot understand what could be changing. Unless there were some outlying rural areas served by Cox that still had not implemented SDV. One such area that comes to mind is Buckeye, AZ which had not been upgraded last time I looked.


----------



## cliffdwelling

CoxInPHX said:


> Another Cox Arizona customer in Mesa reported in another forum, about getting the same letter. So far I have not received a letter.
> 
> I am confused, because Cox Arizona has been using SDV and the Cisco TA for years, and currently there are 194 channels using SDV. I cannot understand what could be changing. Unless there were some outlying rural areas served by Cox that still had not implemented SDV. One such area that comes to mind is Buckeye, AZ which had not been upgraded last time I looked.


Yes, they have been using SDV here in Tucson, but still received letter.
I have never understood Cox and believe they think most people are ignorant of the service they receive ,and confusion is the standard protocol


----------



## LynnL999

Can anyone in Orange County verify if AMC is airing the correct feed? Tribune shows that we're getting the east coast feed, which I know was correct at the time Mad Men ended. 

Someone on AVS claims we're getting the west coast feed now, but I don't sprechen Breaking Bad (there's a marathon) enough to verify whether it's off by 3 hours or not.


----------



## CoxInPHX

LynnL999 said:


> Can anyone in Orange County verify if AMC is airing the correct feed? Tribune shows that we're getting the east coast feed, which I know was correct at the time Mad Men ended.
> 
> Someone on AVS claims we're getting the west coast feed now, but I don't sprechen Breaking Bad (there's a marathon) enough to verify whether it's off by 3 hours or not.


According to the Cox OC Listings it is now 1066 AMCPHD (Pacific)
http://ww2.cox.com/myconnection/orangecounty/watch/entertainment/tv-listings.cox


----------



## Johncv

LynnL999 said:


> Can anyone in Orange County verify if AMC is airing the correct feed? Tribune shows that we're getting the east coast feed, which I know was correct at the time Mad Men ended.
> 
> Someone on AVS claims we're getting the west coast feed now, but I don't sprechen Breaking Bad (there's a marathon) enough to verify whether it's off by 3 hours or not.


You know that you can use a phone and call Cox and ask THEM about the FEED coming to YOUR area.


----------



## LynnL999

> According to the Cox OC Listings it is now 1066 AMCPHD (Pacific)
> http://ww2.cox.com/myconnection/oran...v-listings.cox


:: sigh :: It would kill them to tell Tribune, I guess.



> You know that you can use a phone and call Cox and ask THEM about the FEED coming to YOUR area.


Yeah, if you're lucky enough to get someone on the phone who understands what you're talking about... if not, they'll just read off the lineup chart "it's AMC HD."


----------



## ddledgenet

I'm in Vegas and got the Cisco 2 way tuning adapter from COX. Store didn't have them on the date promised. Tech support had no clue and hadn't heard of them. Brought the "fast connect kit" home with the Cisco STA 1520 adapter 2 days later. Put it inline with coax before the tivo. Things worked the same until 2 weeks ago. I then began losing channels. Tech support was useless. A tech came out and instantly identified the problem. No cable to connect from the STA to the USB on the Tivo in addition to the coax cable jumper. Solved the problem. Two days ago, same channels went missing. Again, tech support was clueless and scheduled a tech visit. Just for the heck of it, unpluged the usb cable and reattached. Tivo reloaded the channels and is working fine. Called COX and cancelled service call. IF YOU SUDDENLY LOSE CHANNELS TRY THIS. A lot less time than the Tivo reboot that COX wants you to do with no impact. Not sure how often this is going to happen, but it is COX your "alleged" friend in the digital age.


----------



## nooneuknow

Here's a quote of what I posted in the "How do you connect your Tuning Adapter?" thread, in response to a Cox customer having difficulties. There's some difficulties of my own within it:



> They tend to blink in a pattern. The number, speed, and pauses will correlate to what the issue is. You can get that info from Cisco's website.
> 
> I hooked up six, they worked fine for a month, then went into "Service Disconnect (brick) mode". Cox fixed the issue by provisioning the TAs. They shouldn't have even worked for the time they did. The S/N of each TA must be provisioned (associated with your account).
> 
> The funny thing is, that the first 13 Cox reps I talked to couldn't figure it out. I even specifically asked if they needed to be provisioned, or authorized, like my cablecards. They either had no answer, or said "NO". The 14th rep had the issue fixed in 15 seconds, as the S/Ns were in their system from being picked up at the store, but they had never been provisioned.
> 
> Best bet, if you want any channels until you can get them provisioned, is to disconnect the TA entirely. Once it is in brick mode, it will block everything, and removing it will get you the channels that don't require a TA.
> 
> Your mileage may vary. Some markets (regions) might not give you any channels at all, if they require a TA, and you disconnect it. I think the reason they couldn't be auto-provisioned, is because they need to be hooked up and booted, so they can send the magic signals at that point.
> 
> Just to be clear, when I say disconnect, I mean remove it entirely, USB, coax, power, and all, like as if it isn't even there.


EDIT/ADD: Yet, they still don't actually download anything but an "empty" channel map, and the SDV Link status is never active. I can disconnect them, and NOT LOSE ANY CHANNELS, but if they are connected, and they go into a blink mode of any sort, I DO LOSE EITHER ALL, OR SEVERAL, CHANNELS. WTF?!?!

The only upside, is that now Cox can read the signal levels and SNR remotely. If it wasn't for that, I'd just take them out and wait and see if any channels EVER disappear without them.

The letter stated I would lose MANY channels if not installed... about a month ago.


----------



## wtkflhn

Ok. I'm new to the cable card/TIVO world. From what I've been reading over the years, TA's keep the TIVO's from doing their Garbage Collection, and this causes issues with the program guide downloads. I understand that powering down the TA will allow the GC to happen. My question is, how long do the TA's need to be powered down? How often does the TIVO normally do GC?


----------



## CoxInPHX

I don't think this is an issue anymore, The TAs have newer firmware, and so do the TiVos.

I have Cisco TAs and I unplug and reboot mine every 3-4 weeks, but I am not sure if that is really even necessary any longer, it has just become habit, and to assure the TA does not lose sync with the Cox SDV server.


----------



## ellinj

I have never rebooted mine ever, unless there is power outage. Never had an issue.


----------



## wtkflhn

Thanks for the help. I have been checking the diagnostics screen for garbage collection and have had no issues so far.


----------



## chocoburger

I have Cox Cable in Fairfax, VA on my Series 3 with a Cable Card. The Program Guide is not filling in for many of the HD channels (in the 1000s), but they are filling in for the SD versions of those channels. Is this a TA issue (can I just do without the TA altogether?) or is there something else preventing the program guide from downloading for some of the channels.


----------



## wtkflhn

chocoburger said:


> I have Cox Cable in Fairfax, VA on my Series 3 with a Cable Card. The Program Guide is not filling in for many of the HD channels (in the 1000s), but they are filling in for the SD versions of those channels. Is this a TA issue (can I just do without the TA altogether?) or is there something else preventing the program guide from downloading for some of the channels.


 Well, I'll tell ya. For my money TA's are a mixed bag. I have 2 TIVO HD's and one S3. I just got cable cards because Cox here in New Orleans is getting ready to go digital. I installed my first HD with one M card and the TA, and it was a howling success. Gets all the channels it supposed to, etc. The 2nd HD, not so much. TIVOs NEVER miss recordings, at least that has been my experience so far. But this machine misses recording all the time. I unppluged the TA at the usb on back of the TIVO and that solved my problem. It gets the HD version of the locals which is what I wanted. I can always move recordings from other TIVO's to this one if it can't record a particular ch. As to the S3, I put the cable cards in this one and passed on the TA for the time being. I have a new Romio coming tomorrow and may use the cable cards and TA on that one. 
The only reason I can think of that you aren't getting the pg for the 1000's is that maybe you don't have them checked in the channel list. I haven't had that issue, at least not yet. But I wouldn't think the TA could cause that. You did get all the cards and the TA paired with Cox?


----------



## CoxInPHX

The Premiere and Roamio TA interaction has improved quite a bit with the SW updates over the last few years.

I never have any TA issues any more, I do still reboot the TA every 2-3 weeks just to make sure.


----------



## osu1991

That's good to hear. I just got notified by Cox for our Las Vegas account that the locals are going SDV and I will need a tuning adapter for our Tivo. Will have to do that next month when back out there.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


----------



## ajwees41

osu1991 said:


> That's good to hear. I just got notified by Cox for our Las Vegas account that the locals are going SDV and I will need a tuning adapter for our Tivo. Will have to do that next month when back out there.
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


locals will not be sdv for long since the dta are not 2 way


----------



## chocoburger

wtkflhn said:


> Well, I'll tell ya. For my money TA's are a mixed bag. I have 2 TIVO HD's and one S3. I just got cable cards because Cox here in New Orleans is getting ready to go digital. I installed my first HD with one M card and the TA, and it was a howling success. Gets all the channels it supposed to, etc. The 2nd HD, not so much. TIVOs NEVER miss recordings, at least that has been my experience so far. But this machine misses recording all the time. I unppluged the TA at the usb on back of the TIVO and that solved my problem. It gets the HD version of the locals which is what I wanted. I can always move recordings from other TIVO's to this one if it can't record a particular ch. As to the S3, I put the cable cards in this one and passed on the TA for the time being. I have a new Romio coming tomorrow and may use the cable cards and TA on that one.
> The only reason I can think of that you aren't getting the pg for the 1000's is that maybe you don't have them checked in the channel list. I haven't had that issue, at least not yet. But I wouldn't think the TA could cause that. You did get all the cards and the TA paired with Cox?


Everything was supposedly good to go when Cox installed it. Who knows. I'm trying Tivo support first and then I'll try Cox. It hasn't been as much of a priority, but I might as well try to get this thing fixed now.


----------



## Tanic

I'm a Cox customer in Phoenix. Three days ago all of the SDV channels stopped working. No amount of rebooting, sending signals, etc would get them back, so Cox sent an in-house tech over yesterday. He checked signals, changed out the cable card and Cisco tuning adapter, had dispatch re-pair the card but the problem got worse because Cox could not provision the new card. Now I only have a handful of starter channels.

Cox sent out a contractor tech today who left after a few minutes. Diagnosis is that Cox is experiencing a large cable card outage due to their analog to digital upgrade, and I just have to wait for it to be over. Could be hours, could be days. WTF?


----------



## CoxInPHX

Tanic said:


> I'm a Cox customer in Phoenix. Three days ago all of the SDV channels stopped working. No amount of rebooting, sending signals, etc would get them back, so Cox sent an in-house tech over yesterday. He checked signals, changed out the cable card and Cisco tuning adapter, had dispatch re-pair the card but the problem got worse because Cox could not provision the new card. Now I only have a handful of starter channels.
> 
> Cox sent out a contractor tech today who left after a few minutes. Diagnosis is that Cox is experiencing a large cable card outage due to their analog to digital upgrade, and I just have to wait for it to be over. Could be hours, could be days. WTF?


Several reports say this was fixed this morning, Try rebooting everything now, and see what happens.
Both my sister and Mother's are working again in Glendale.
The Chandler headend did not experience any disruption, mine never went out.

http://www.avsforum.com/forum/45-lo.../451563-phoenix-az-hdtv-384.html#post38891041

http://www.dslreports.com/forum/r30413051-CATV-SDV-Channels

http://forums.cox.com/forum_home/tv_forum/f/4/t/11582.aspx


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## rcobourn

I had the same problem and a technician scheduled half an hour ago. By the time he got here, it had resolved itself. 

Sent from my SM-N910T using Tapatalk


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## Tanic

CoxInPHX said:


> Several reports say this was fixed this morning, Try rebooting everything now, and see what happens.


Tech was here at noon today and could not fix things. I just rebooted everything, reconnected the USB cord, and now get a few more channels (basic tier?) than before. Most show "v58 not authorized message". Looks like SDV authorization is working though.


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## CoxInPHX

Tanic said:


> Tech was here at noon today and could not fix things. I just rebooted everything, reconnected the USB cord, and now get a few more channels (basic tier?) than before. Most show "v58 not authorized message". Looks like SDV authorization is working though.


"v58 not authorized message" is usually the CableCARD issue call 1-877-820-8202 and have them verify the CableCARD ID and Host ID and your account package codes. Make sure the CP Info menu says "CP Auth Received"

Check all the following from the Tuning Adapter Diagnostics to rule out the TA as the issue:

Status Summary
INITIALIZATION
Status: *Ready* (Ready - B'cast Only is not correct)

POST and Boot Results
BOOT STATUS
UNcfg: *Ready*

RF Statistics
DAVIC: *Connected*
Status: *Locked*

PowerKEY Information
Received
EMMs: (should not be zero, but will be after a reboot until the TA gets a hit)

SWITCHED DIGITAL VIDEO
CLIENT
Authorized: *Yes*
Service Gp: (value)
RF Ip Addr: (Should list an address like 10.40.32.45)
SERVER
Status: *Ready*


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## Tanic

CoxInPHX said:


> "v58 not authorized message" is usually the CableCARD issue call 1-877-820-8202 and have them verify the CableCARD ID and Host ID and your account package codes. Make sure the CP Info menu says "CP Auth Received"


Woo Hoo! Your instructions worked and my TiVo is back in business. Glad I didn't have to wait on a Cox tech to come back tomorrow. Thanks!


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