# Bolt is a Huge Disappointment to Me



## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

Frankly, the Bolt offers me absolutely NOTHING of value over previous versions of TiVo, and in some ways it is much worse. In my opinion, my two S3 boxes are actually better. It is unbelievable that anyone would have the nerve to call this thing a "Unified Entertainment System"!

Yes, _most_ of the advertised features do seem to work, and the idea that I can just pop in a larger drive without having to play geek games seems a little attractive, but even that is offset by the much greater heat generated by this ugly little box along with the need to use a 2.5" drive.

My needs and desires for a DVR are actually pretty simple, and the Bolt does not meet them. Of course I want to record and play programs - that seems to _mostly_ work, but the Rovi Reaming we have all been through makes even some of that questionable - hard to tell what is caused by Bad Rovi and what is just Bad Bolt. For example - can't search for movies like we always have done. I think a lot of the UI on the Bolt is nasty and terrible.

Probably the only other thing I really want my DVR to do is to play back my archived recordings in some form or another, and for this, the Bolt gets any grade I could give it that is *worse than an F*! I cannot plug in an external drive and play video files, and I cannot even move those same files from my computers over to the Bolt drive for watching (having to move them, like with the older TiVos is a bad option, but the Bolt can't even do that!). I EXPECT to be able to see those files on my computers (in ANY standard format) and stream them to the Bolt, but that is absolutely not a viable option either!

And don't even think about suggesting Plex to me - what a totally HORRIBLE POS that is! First of all, it cannot even recognize most of what I consider common archiving formats - they even come right out and say they do not and never expect to support any type of "image" files. Furthermore, any type of a server is totally incompatible with lots of long term storage. I have somewhere north of 10 TB of disks with music and video, and I am not about to keep all those disks constantly connected and spinning to ANYTHING. And even if I did, the Plex UI is virtually impossible to use when it has to deal with thousands of entries.

And then there is the Plex app on the Bolt - HA!!! Slow and clunky cannot even begin to describe the pain of trying to use that. I simply tried to bring up my music library and find a particular album to play - my only option was to sort by letter and then slowly and painfully move down the long list one entry at a time looking for the right one. Let's not even start to discuss why I would want to have to use my TV to find and play music when I should be able to push it from my computer to my new "unified entertainment system". But music playback is not something I really want to do with a Tivo - I just use that to illustrate how terrible the Plex option is.

So this thing cannot reasonably stream ANY media content I own, and it cannot play ANY local content that it did not record. Even worse, if it DID record something and I moved it off with TiVo Desktop, the stupid brain-dead Bolt cannot even see it and move it back!!! Maybe all the internet streaming that TiVo seems so proud about has some value to you, but it sure does not for me - I do not want it and will not use it.

Bah-Humbug!


----------



## RePo (Jun 5, 2016)

This looks like an original composition from The Donald.


----------



## mangochutney (Apr 7, 2015)

I endorse these comments ^


----------



## dswallow (Dec 3, 2000)

My PLEX library has:

726 movies (1TB)
421 short movies (100GB)
12,236 TV series episodes (4.5TB)

And rarely has anything been an issue (at least that wasn't quickly solved by the next PLEX server update).

I have a huge archive of assorted other video stuff; PLEX doesn't work too well with things not indexable by its supported third-party sites, but it's more that I don't really want to index it in the folder structure it uses physically, but via more arbitrary categories and other metadata, and eventually will work something out. I have previously accessed some of it via PLEX but have chosen to not waste time letting it index into it since it still tries to identify them in ways only PLEX understands and it holds up regular updating of the other libraries.

26,054 videos (15.5TB)
10,735 videos (6.3TB)
5,331 videos (550GB)
10,670 videos (10.1TB)

My file systems are always online, though. About 77TB of storage currently, after RAID5.


I have a Roamio Pro; streaming externally outside my home has always worked, using TiVo's Android app, though my usage of Android only goes back about a year. I don't even have anything specially configured in my router/firewall to have that function. So it's worked for about a year without issue, never presenting any crazy behaviors, to me.


FWIW, I wouldn't buy a Bolt. Maybe a Bolt+ would be OK, but with a functional Roamio Pro, there's just nothing the Bolt+ offers that I need right now. 4K doesn't matter to me right now, or for any forseeable future that allows it to come into the equation yet (i.e, a year, maybe 2 years), and while it uses a better CPU, it's not something that offers enough noticable performance for anything it does that it matters. And of course it being butt-ugly in that bent shape...  But if I were a new user looking today, I'd really have no reason not to consider the Bolt+ from a functional standpoint.


Maybe there's a point here that you're trying to force too much to work in some way you're expecting with preconceived ideas and should perhaps take this one step at a time and keep an open mind about it.


----------



## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

V7Goose said:


> I cannot even move those same files from my computers over to the Bolt drive for watching (having to move them, like with the older TiVos is a bad option, but the Bolt can't even do that!)


FYI the Bolt supports the same HME transfer features as the S3, so you should be able to move files from your PC to your Bolt exactly the same way as you did on your S3. (pyTiVo works best for this)


----------



## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

Dan203 said:


> FYI the Bolt supports the same HME transfer features as the S3, so you should be able to move files from your PC to your Bolt exactly the same way as you did on your S3. (pyTiVo works best for this)


Thanks Dan. I use the basic TiVo Desktop (never bought a key for Plus). Both of my S3 boxes show any computer running with a Desktop Server active, and I can get to those recordings. The Bolt does Not. The Bolt shows both of the S3 boxes and can access their recordings, but no Desktop server is ever shown.

I am familiar with the 3rd party hacks like pyTiVo, but I really do not want to mess with that type of unsupported product anymore. And besides, they do not bring anything to the Bolt that we couldn't do with the S3 for the last 10 years or so. And the fact that this functionality is still needed and desired on the Bolt but NOT provided by TiVo is exactly why I am so disappointed in this new box. And TiVo makes matters even worse by dropping the desktop application . . .

I hated Dish and their buggy Hopper DVR, but despite their poor programming and development, that box made attachment of any USB drive for archiving very simple, and it could always stream video from my computers and NAS without doing anything special. TiVo was ahead of the field for years in just about every way, so I expected so much more from their current products - a "Unified Entertainment System".

I expected it and did not get it. My whole point of posting about being disappointed with this product was hoping that maybe someone who was on this thread looking for product info while trying to decide if they should buy a new Series 6 box would see it and seriously consider if they would be getting what they wanted or not. Right now, I would only recommend a used TiVo for most people, just about any S3 through S5 (depending on their exact needs). I do not think the S6 is worth any extra money at all.


----------



## series5orpremier (Jul 6, 2013)

I agree with the general idea that TiVo half-a$$ed it with the Bolt line. It seems like the main objective wasn't to come up with a noticeably better product but to increase profit margins through a combination of manufacturing cost reduction and inreasing service fees.


----------



## abovethesink (Aug 26, 2013)

The Bolt+ made sense to us upgrading from a Roamio Basic. We gained two tuners, 4k Netflix right on the TiVo, and the stream features that never had. Even better was sliding the Roamio to the bedroom and retiring the old, sluggish two tuner Premiere which functioned fine as a DVR but was awful for streaming.

Also, Plex works well for me on both the Roamio and Bolt. Does work a little better on my Roku though.


----------



## cyclone23 (Jul 3, 2016)

I guess my needs are less stringent than the typical user of this Forum. I Have a Bolt 500 GB and 2 Minis. I tried Ethernet, but MOCA seemed to do a better job for me. I've run the system for ~3 months and it's working very reliably. I watch recordings and then delete them as soon as the've been viewed. Typically, the system runs at around 75% filled.

If I need to expand capacity, I'll unplug the internal drive and hook up a 4TB external 5.25" drive. But I won't do that until the factory warranty runs its course.

I don't understand what I'm doing wrong


----------



## jcthorne (Jan 28, 2002)

As Dan said, the bolt can use the same HME features that the S3 can. If your pc is not showing up on your Bolt, there is something wrong on your network or setup. They use the exact same protocol as does pytivo. No difference. Lots of folks using Tivo Desktop with bolt.

It is unfortunate that Tivo has decided not to continue supporting Tivo Desktop and thinks Plex is its replacement.


----------



## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

V7Goose said:


> Thanks Dan. I use the basic TiVo Desktop (never bought a key for Plus). Both of my S3 boxes show any computer running with a Desktop Server active, and I can get to those recordings. The Bolt does Not. The Bolt shows both of the S3 boxes and can access their recordings, but no Desktop server is ever shown.


It ahould show exactly the same way on the Bolt. If it doesn't then there is likely a network issue or possibly a setting in TiVo Desktop set wrong. IIRC the TiVo Desktop server has a way to limit which DVRs are allowed to see it, perhaps you have that feature enabled and that's what is preventing your Bolt from seeing it?


----------



## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

I bow to your superior knowledge - it is good to know that the Bolt SHOULD be seeing the Desktop servers (I have three running). My Desktop server sees the Bolt just fine, but not the other way around. At this point I still cannot see anything wrong - maybe it is tied to the abbreviated network setup in the bolt (it does everything without asking for my input on network configuration). The server access control is currently set to Automatic (Share only with the home network), and none of the attached TiVo boxes are checked, since that only applies to the Custom setting. Perhaps the Bolt network setup leaves something out that makes the server think it is not part of my home network?

My Desktop server has always been set up to use Bonjour, so I guess I'll have to try TiVo Beacon now to see if anything changes. If nothing else works, I'll try changing the access control to Custom and check all the boxes.


----------



## zubinh (Jun 7, 2004)

With 4K TVs providing apps that you can access 4K content on without having to switch inputs, the streaming features of the Bolt are both redundant and inferior. Add in the high cost of the "All In" plan and there really is no reason to upgrade from a previous Tivo unit until 4K broadcasts come about or at least until Tivo's 4K streaming capabilities increase greatly.

IMHO...


----------



## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

You might also want to try disabling your firewall just to be sure that's not causing an issue. You might also want to just try rebooting everything, sometimes a reboot fixes things up.


----------



## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

My testing has shown very inconsistent results. What I have found is strange, but here goes:

The only thing that seems consistent is that rebooting the Bolt causes all Desktop servers to disappear from it. What causes the servers to show back up on the bolt seems almost like a crap shoot.

Prior to today, no Desktop server has ever been shown on my Bolt, but the first thing I did today was change the Bolt from DHCP to a static IP address in my router - I cannot say what, if any, effect that had, but now if I reboot a PC, the server shows up on the Bolt (but rebooting the Bolt causes it to go away again!).

At this moment I have two PCs running with Desktop servers active. I have been testing the different Access Control settings of the server properties. At the beginning of my testing today, I found that just changing either server to Full access (and restarting the server) causes BOTH servers to immediately show up on the Bolt, and changing it back to Automatic caused BOTH servers to disappear. I repeated this several times, but then, after some multiple reboots of both the PCs and the Bolt, the Automatic access control seems to be working normal again with both servers.

After the last reboot of the Bolt, neither server was shown, but restarting each one caused it to appear in My Shows. So for now, I'll just wait and see if they go away again . . .

Thanks for all your ideas.


----------



## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

You should really try pyTiVo. It works way better then desktop and seems to have less of these types of issues. It can be a bit of a PITA to setup but ones it's running it seems to be pretty stable.


----------



## V7Goose (May 28, 2005)

Dan203 said:


> You should really try pyTiVo. It works way better then desktop and seems to have less of these types of issues. It can be a bit of a PITA to setup but ones it's running it seems to be pretty stable.


I have thought about it, but not really interested. As long as TiVo continues to refuse to support direct playback of files from USB attached media, I will always have a better device sitting on the shelf to do that.

Right now I still have a media PC connected to one TV that I use to record HD program playback from the TiVo display stream (not really needed so long as Desktop continues to work), and it can also play HD media files direct to the TV. For my media room I use an old ASUS media player that only cost about $50 and continues to play just about anything I can throw at it - not only will it play any format files from USB and eSATA drives, it will also stream all the same files over my network from my computers and NAS.

If TiVo would actually produce a box that had those features, I would spend more money to upgrade to a TRUE unified entertainment system throughout the house. But as it is, the older TiVo S3 & S3/HD boxes still do just about everything I need as good or better than the Bolt does.


----------



## jonw747 (Aug 2, 2015)

Dan203 said:


> You should really try pyTiVo. It works way better then desktop and seems to have less of these types of issues. It can be a bit of a PITA to setup but ones it's running it seems to be pretty stable.


I use pyTivo a lot to access my media. Being able to REW/SKIP/FF like I'm viewing a recording via my Remote is a major plus compared to other methods of playing back media files.


----------



## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

V7Goose said:


> I have thought about it, but not really interested. As long as TiVo continues to refuse to support direct playback of files from USB attached media, I will always have a better device sitting on the shelf to do that.
> 
> Right now I still have a media PC connected to one TV that I use to record HD program playback from the TiVo display stream (not really needed so long as Desktop continues to work), and it can also play HD media files direct to the TV. For my media room I use an old ASUS media player that only cost about $50 and continues to play just about anything I can throw at it - not only will it play any format files from USB and eSATA drives, it will also stream all the same files over my network from my computers and NAS.
> 
> If TiVo would actually produce a box that had those features, I would spend more money to upgrade to a TRUE unified entertainment system throughout the house. But as it is, the older TiVo S3 & S3/HD boxes still do just about everything I need as good or better than the Bolt does.


A ton of restrictions involved. As soon as you have a bunch of the big streaming apps, your options become severely limited. There is a reason why the best media players don't typically have access to the big streaming apps.


----------



## Sparky1234 (May 8, 2006)

V7Goose said:


> I have thought about it, but not really interested. As long as TiVo continues to refuse to support direct playback of files from USB attached media, I will always have a better device sitting on the shelf to do that.
> 
> Right now I still have a media PC connected to one TV that I use to record HD program playback from the TiVo display stream (not really needed so long as Desktop continues to work), and it can also play HD media files direct to the TV. For my media room I use an old ASUS media player that only cost about $50 and continues to play just about anything I can throw at it - not only will it play any format files from USB and eSATA drives, it will also stream all the same files over my network from my computers and NAS.
> 
> If TiVo would actually produce a box that had those features, I would spend more money to upgrade to a TRUE unified entertainment system throughout the house. But as it is, the older TiVo S3 & S3/HD boxes still do just about everything I need as good or better than the Bolt does.


For what it worth:

I use pytivo, streambaby and kmttg to enhance my 3 Premiere's functionality. TiVo Desktop Pro which I purchased years ago does not work any longer - no matter the settings. I fought using pytivo, streambaby and kmttg for years but now find the different features of each very essential. If only I could send video to the same TiVo folder with pytivo but this feature always fails for me.

Due to copyright and trade agreements TiVo will never be all we want it to be BUT it is way better than any other box out there. Additionally, I use Samsung Allshare with Samsung smart TVs and Bluray players to media serve my computer based video, music and photo libraries. Lastly, a Samsung phone can be wi-fi projected to a local TV with a swipe on the phone.

I'm posting my experience here on the Bolt forum in the hope that others that have experience with pytivo, streambaby, kmttg and TiVo Desktop with a Bolt will comment on their experience.


----------

