# Do you recommend buying an UPS for Tivo?



## bcfedee (Mar 28, 2014)

What are your feelings on the desirability of an UPS for Tivo? If I get one I'm going to spring for the one with filtration from Panamax. Not a small expense. But I'm not convinced I really need one. I've got Tivo hooked up to good filtration and surge protection all ready. So the only thing I'd add would defense against losing a show in mid record. But If I'm recording a cable show, they are usually replayed soon after as a rerun.

What do you guys thing? Good way to save money by not getting one or a necessity with a new Tivo Roamio?

The UPS won't run my TV (too much amps needed). So I wouldn't be able to watch Tivo during an outage. the UPS would only be protection from Tivo having to reboot after outage and from losing part of the show it's recording when outage occurs.


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## bradleys (Oct 31, 2007)

I have a UPS that both my TV and TiVo are connected too, and it can handle the amperage of both just fine.

Last time we lost power, nobody even noticed for several minutes.


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## bcfedee (Mar 28, 2014)

bradleys said:


> I have a UPS that both my TV and TiVo are connected too, and it can handle the amperage of both just fine.
> 
> Last time we lost power, nobody even noticed for several minutes.


do you have LCD? I'm still using a CRT for the black levels :_)

CRT uses lots more power, unfortunately.


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## SOCATivo (Jan 2, 2002)

I would only do this if my local power were prone to spikes which might damage my Tivo. And even then a UPS is really overkill, some surge protection stuff would be all I&#8217;d probably go for.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

I use an APC 500 UA with battery backup to protect on power problems. Possibilities are spikes, brownouts, blackouts, switchovers. Switchovers are when they switch the power lines to another source and the power interrupts for a few seconds. It would interrupt a Tivo which would restart itself and last from 3-5 minutes.


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## eboydog (Mar 24, 2006)

I believe in them, I have had a Tivo since 2005 and never yet (knock on wood) had a problem. Power goes out in my house and the house is full of chirping alarms!


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## tenthplanet (Mar 5, 2004)

bcfedee said:


> What are your feelings on the desirability of an UPS for Tivo? If I get one I'm going to spring for the one with filtration from Panamax. Not a small expense. But I'm not convinced I really need one. I've got Tivo hooked up to good filtration and surge protection all ready. So the only thing I'd add would defense against losing a show in mid record. But If I'm recording a cable show, they are usually replayed soon after as a rerun.
> 
> What do you guys thing? Good way to save money by not getting one or a necessity with a new Tivo Roamio?
> 
> The UPS won't run my TV (too much amps needed). So I wouldn't be able to watch Tivo during an outage. the UPS would only be protection from Tivo having to reboot after outage and from losing part of the show it's recording when outage occurs.


 If you don't lose power very often you probably don't need one, if you are subject to power outages with quick on and off cycles you do. Those quick cycles can take their toll on hard drives over time and since that is where your recordings are stored, better safe than sorry.


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## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

I'd recommend a UPS for any home entertainment device or PC, especially if you live in an area that's prone to frequent brownouts or power spikes. This tends to happen most often during the summer months when the power grid gets loaded down due to high use of air conditioners.

A UPS that regulates and filters the power along with surge protection will provide the best protection and longevity for your Tivo. Clean regulated power will keep your electronics happy and stress-free. I've always been of the mindset that dirty power and frequent spikes are the root cause of so many Tivo power supply failures (i.e., blown capacitors).


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## dave13077 (Jan 11, 2009)

Does anyone have any recommendations for a good UPS that's under a $100 and also has the ability to silence any alarms. One of these will be in a bedroom and I want to be able to set it so it doesn't make any noise. THX


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## CrispyCritter (Feb 28, 2001)

Look at the Cyberpower brand - they have silenceable alarms for less than the competition. Go to http://cyberpower.advizia.com/CyberPower/?v41=CyberPower_UPS and near the bottom of the left hand column select "Alarm can be silenced on the UPS"

I tend to buy at least a 650 VA UPS, but there are cheaper, smaller ones


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

Those who don't search are doomed to repetitive, redundant discussion:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=514588

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=456889

But hey, I don't mean to spoil your fun!


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

bcfedee said:


> do you have LCD? _*I'm still using a CRT for the black levels*_ :_)
> 
> CRT uses lots more power, unfortunately.


Use a plazma....I get better black levels with my plazma than I did with my CRT. Yeah it uses more power than an LCD but less than a CRT.


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## bcfedee (Mar 28, 2014)

Bierboy said:


> Use a plazma....I get better black levels with my plazma than I did with my CRT. Yeah it uses more power than an LCD but less than a CRT.


I was going to get a plasma this year, 2014. But with the news from panasonic I decided to not buy one. I'm hopeful for an OLED in the next few years.

Only reason I'll be able to buy new Tivo is cause I'm holding out on new TV


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## awsnyde (May 11, 2007)

There are LCDs with great black levels, but they use full-array LED backlighting instead of the much more common, and much less expensive, edge-lit. The full-array Samsung I have has literally inky blacks.

They're probably still less expensive than OLEDs will be for some time, and the Samsung at least has a better picture than the Philips plasma I used to have.

As for the OP's question, I recommend a UPS on anything with a hard drive.


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## bcfedee (Mar 28, 2014)

dave13077 said:


> Does anyone have any recommendations for a good UPS that's under a $100 and also has the ability to silence any alarms. One of these will be in a bedroom and I want to be able to set it so it doesn't make any noise. THX


The APC 600UPS is under $100 and can silence the alarm. But to silence the alarm you have to install their software and connect the UPS to your computer. I installed the software on an old Windows computer I have. It has worked great so far for what I use it for. Hate the alarms. I don't buy UPS if it can't silence the alarm.


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## PaJo (Dec 17, 2001)

Many years ago we had the Dtivo, and for some reason the power went on and off rapidly causing several reboots in a row, 3 of our 4 Dtivo were OK but the 4th did not survive, the software was corrupted. I had a backup image and it was not a problem restoring it and getting DTV to reset it, but it took time. After that I hooked up a UPS and never had a problem since, if the lights flicker the Tivo keeps going. The batteries do go bad in a UPS and I had to change a couple over the years. I don't worry about having a UPS that goes a long time, I just want protection from the short flickering type power outages that are enough to cause a reboot - I have our CCTV DVR on a ups as well as our OOMA phone etc. for the same reason.


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## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

A UPS is a luxury rather than any sort of necessity for a Tivo.

If you want one then get one. But as far as any really rational reason to get one I'm not seeing it.


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## SNJpage1 (May 25, 2006)

You can turn the warning buzzer off on any UPS. Either thru software or by breaking the buzzer itself. I had to break the buzzer on one of mine.


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## SNJpage1 (May 25, 2006)

Now that I have installed a whole house generator I might move one of my computer UPS's to the Tivo. The back up generator takes 30 seconds to come on line so I dont need three UPS's any more.


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## javabird (Oct 13, 2006)

bcfedee said:


> I was going to get a plasma this year, 2014. But with the news from panasonic I decided to not buy one. I'm hopeful for an OLED in the next few years.
> 
> Only reason I'll be able to buy new Tivo is cause I'm holding out on new TV


What news from Panasonic?

BTW, I have a Panny plasma and I absolutely love it. And I've always been very picky about picture quality and color balance.


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## gweempose (Mar 23, 2003)

javabird said:


> What news from Panasonic?


I believe they announced that they are getting out of the plasma game.


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## replaytv (Feb 21, 2011)

A friend of mine got hit by a lightening strike on the pole right outside his house. It ruined everything connected to a electric outlet including the stove, fridg', and dish washer. The lightening blew past UPSes and surge protectors. 

That isn't likely to happen to you, but it is a possibility, so best to have home owners insurance for replacement value.


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## gweempose (Mar 23, 2003)

I have whole house surge protectors, but I still have everything with a hard drive hooked up to a UPS. I also have all of my network gear on battery backup. This includes my cable modem, router, and all switches and wireless access points. On top of that, I also have my cable amplifier hooked up to a UPS. This ensures that if the power goes down briefly while my TiVos are recording or transferring something, they will not be affected.


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## SNJpage1 (May 25, 2006)

A lot of people don't really under stand what a surge protector is. It isn't to protect you from a lightning strike. Nothing will help you if it hits near by. It is mainly to protect delicate equipment from power surges caused by motors such as freezers, washers, refrig's heater blowers and stuff like that starting up. They cause a spike in the voltage that travels thru the wiring in the house.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

SNJpage1 said:


> A lot of people don't really under stand what a surge protector is. It isn't to protect you from a lightning strike. Nothing will help you if it hits near by. It is mainly to protect delicate equipment from power surges caused by motors such as freezers, washers, refrig's heater blowers and stuff like that starting up. They cause a spike in the voltage that travels thru the wiring in the house.


You can't protect electronics from any direct lightning strike or from 250VAC getting into you 120VAC wiring, this does not happen very often but your best protection is a good home owners insurance policy. My next door neighbor had the 250VAC problem, took out everything plugged in, the electric co took care of fixing him up as it was their fault. My whole house surge protector when out once in the last 15 years, had to replace it, but I don't know if that saved any of my electronics. (I check the surge protector lights now and then)


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## SNJpage1 (May 25, 2006)

When I worked for the phone company, I saw what lightning can do. Our cables took a lot of direct hits. I also ended up working on a house that their TV tower took a hit. It moved the house 2 inchs off the foundation. It also sent a lot of the dry wall nails from the outside wall and sent them thru a wall on the opposite side of the room and into the hall way.


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## evanborkow (Mar 17, 2008)

SNJpage1 said:


> Now that I have installed a whole house generator I might move one of my computer UPS's to the Tivo. The back up generator takes 30 seconds to come on line so I dont need three UPS's any more.


I've had an automatic generator for 20 years. A lot can happen in that 30 seconds; ie rapid on/off cycles that can kill your electronics. I'd leave that ups on the computer and get another for the Tivo.


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

dave13077 said:


> Does anyone have any recommendations for a good UPS that's under a $100 and also has the ability to silence any alarms. One of these will be in a bedroom and I want to be able to set it so it doesn't make any noise. THX


I bought a Cyberpower CST1300AL at the local Costco today for $95:

http://www2.costco.com/Browse/Product.aspx?Prodid=11750788&whse=BD_563&Ne=5000001%204000000&eCat=BD_563|11157|91771&N=4049125%204294891503&Mo=0&No=0&Nr=P_CatalogName:BD_563&Ns=P_Price|1||P_SignDesc1&lang=en-US&topnav=national

Despite the different model number, it is the exact same unit as the CP1350AVRLCD that Amazon currently sells for $135:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000OFXKFI/ref=ox_sc_sfl_title_2?ie=UTF8&psc=1&smid=ATVPDKIKX0DER


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

When I got a new computer in 2009 I looked at my UPS and found that in idle it was using about 30 watts, my new UPS (CyberPower) uses less than 5 watts (when the batteries are fully charged) *FYI* 1 watt at 24/7 cost most people about $1 to $1.50/year except in CA it could cost more than $2.50/year)


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

trip1eX said:


> A UPS is a luxury rather than any sort of necessity for a Tivo.
> 
> If you want one then get one. But as far as any really rational reason to get one I'm not seeing it.


I've always considered it a necessity. Just like a UPS with cordless phones. I've used them with cordless phones since the early 90's. And I've always had my TiVos connected to a UPS. Heck all of my electronics are connected to a UPS. I've never plugged a TiVo into an outlet without going through a UPS.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

aaronwt said:


> I've always considered it a necessity. Just like a UPS with cordless phones. I've used them with cordless phones since the early 90's. And I've always had my TiVos connected to a UPS. Heck all of my electronics are connected to a UPS. I've never plugged a TiVo into an outlet without going through a UPS.


What you do can't be bad, except for replacing batteries every 5 or so years and using extra power (even when nothing is plugged into any UPS it draws from 5 to 30 watts).

I only used a UPS on my desktop computer, never on anything other than my computer, and I never had a problem, so not using a UPS is not a death knell for everybody. Not anybody I know uses a UPS on anything but a desktop computer, and they never had any problems. (one person had a direct lighting strike on his home, took out all electrical equipment, from his AC and heating to his all his TVs, dishwasher, etc. OH! and his UPS protected desktop computer that was off at the time. Homeowners insurance is great at times.)


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

lessd said:


> I only used a UPS on my desktop computer, never on anything other than my computer, and I never had a problem, so not using a UPS is not a death knell for everybody. Not anybody I know uses a UPS on anything but a desktop computer, and they never had any problems.


Isn't a TiVo DVR essentially a computer? It seems to have just about all of the essential components that a desktop computer has (processor, memory, hard drive, operating system, etc), so if you should be using a UPS on a desktop, you should also probably be using one with a TiVo.


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## eddyj (Jun 20, 2002)

I absolutely have a UPS on my DVRs (no longer TiVos, but the principle applies). We get a lot of thunderstorms, with associated power fluctuations. Every one would cause a reboot, and that means losing a good chunk of any recordings in progress, aside from the wear and tear on the machine.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

lessd said:


> What you do can't be bad, except for replacing batteries every 5 or so years and using extra power (even when nothing is plugged into any UPS it draws from 5 to 30 watts).
> 
> I only used a UPS on my desktop computer, never on anything other than my computer, and I never had a problem, so not using a UPS is not a death knell for everybody. Not anybody I know uses a UPS on anything but a desktop computer, and they never had any problems. (one person had a direct lighting strike on his home, took out all electrical equipment, from his AC and heating to his all his TVs, dishwasher, etc. OH! and his UPS protected desktop computer that was off at the time. Homeowners insurance is great at times.)


I don't use necessarily use them for preventing problems with the Tivos, but mainly to make sure I have uninterrupted recordings. Even when I used VCRs in the 90's I used a UPS with them. So I could continue recording if there was a power outage.

I use them with my other devices so I can continue to use everything normally during an outage. So my Tv, receiver, subwoofer, servers, streaming devices, etc. can all be used during a power outage. I live in a condo so a generator is not an option for me. So the 13 or 14 UPSs(most with extended runtime batteries) are the next best thing.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

tarheelblue32 said:


> Isn't a TiVo DVR essentially a computer? It seems to have just about all of the essential components that a desktop computer has (processor, memory, hard drive, operating system, etc), so if you should be using a UPS on a desktop, you should also probably be using one with a TiVo.


I don't use a UPS on my computer to protect it; I use it so if I am using MS office or doing something and the power goes out I can shut down my computer in an orderly way, or in my case in 16 seconds my generator comes on. Windows is not designed to have the power cut off and files may be corrupted and /or data lost if your computer power goes down when Windows is running, TiVo is designed to be cut off from power and only take out the CH buffer.


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## chicagobrownblue (May 29, 2008)

Premiere - yes, Roamio probably not needed. The basic Roamio I have plugs into a brick that then plugs into the wall, i.e. an external AC/DC converter. My Premiere got hit by a leak into the coax from a lightening strike but recovered. The power surge after the electricity went out fried my Premiere. I don't miss the Premiere a bit with its cludgy HDUI performance; my Roamio is working very well for me. I do have my Roamio on a surge suppressor and the built-in coax surge suppressor.


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

chicagobrownblue said:


> Premiere - yes, Roamio probably not needed. The basic Roamio I have plugs into a brick that then plugs into the wall, i.e. an external AC/DC converter. My Premiere got hit by a leak into the coax from a lightening strike but recovered. The power surge after the electricity went out fried my Premiere. I don't miss the Premiere a bit with its cludgy HDUI performance; my Roamio is working very well for me. I do have my Roamio on a surge suppressor and the built-in coax surge suppressor.


I'm really not sure what difference having a power brick there does. I can't see it being able to stop a major power surge. But regardless, the Roamio Plus/Pro doesn't have a power brick.


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## NashvilleKat (Dec 25, 2013)

eddyj said:


> We get a lot of thunderstorms, with associated power fluctuations. Every one would cause a reboot, and that means losing a good chunk of any recordings in progress, aside from the wear and tear on the machine.


WE also get a lot of power fluctuations and that's why I use them. I don't want my DVRs subjected to the power flickers. However, I'm not concerned about the recordings so much. The heck with them. I want to protect my equipment. As soon as the power goes out, I shut down the UPSs and everything plugged into them. BUT if I'm not home, I'll the the UPS take the flickers to protect the other equipment;


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

My UPSs won't shut down until the batteries are exhausted. That could be bewteen 2 hours and 18 hours depending on the loads I have on the UPSs. My alarm system and router and main GigE switches are good for up to 18 hours. But everything else will last much less since they draw alot more power. My Tivos are good for 12 hours or so during an outage.


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## hytekjosh (Dec 4, 2010)

Just switched my Tivo to the UPS outlet. Didn't care before because I was renting from my cable provider but now I bought my own.


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

I just my XL4 and my HTPC on a UPS. It seems to last a bit over an hour (APC 1500VA). I plan to get a Home Theater UPS eventually, and move this one to a future desktop computer. It's mostly for piece of mind for power cycling and brownouts when the power goes out or comes back on. It's possible it could continue recording during an outage, but imagining Comcast staying on while the power is out is a real stretch of my imagination...

I'm renting now, but I'd eventually like to have a UPS for my router and modem/ONT, future desktop PC and TiVo/HTPC at a minimum...


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Bigg said:


> I just my XL4 and my HTPC on a UPS. It seems to last a bit over an hour (APC 1500VA). I plan to get a Home Theater UPS eventually, and move this one to a future desktop computer. It's mostly for piece of mind for power cycling and brownouts when the power goes out or comes back on. It's possible it could continue recording during an outage, but imagining Comcast staying on while the power is out is a real stretch of my imagination...
> 
> I'm renting now, but I'd eventually like to have a UPS for my router and modem/ONT, future desktop PC and TiVo/HTPC at a minimum...


When I had Comcast, it would always be on during a power outage. While at my brothers place, his Comcast signal goes out during a power outage.


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

aaronwt said:


> When I had Comcast, it would always be on during a power outage. While at my brothers place, his Comcast signal goes out during a power outage.


It depends on what the nodes and amps are powered off of... I don't really care, it's just to protect my equipment.


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## kdmorse (Jan 29, 2001)

My Comcast TV and Internet will generally stay up when the power's out. (And with local UPSs, so will my powered amps, tivos, routers, switches, wap, and computers).

But the TV signal staying is just a convenience, if it went out and put a hole in my recordings, so be it. The UPSs are there to protect the Tivos, and everything else.

Although the internet staying hot keeps me going from insane...


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

kdmorse said:


> My Comcast TV and Internet will generally stay up when the power's out. (And with local UPSs, so will my powered amps, tivos, routers, switches, wap, and computers).
> 
> But the TV signal staying is just a convenience, if it went out and put a hole in my recordings, so be it. The UPSs are there to protect the Tivos, and everything else.
> 
> Although the internet staying hot keeps me going from insane...


haha. I usually go online if the power goes out too. Except that my laptop battery is completely worthless now. So much for the claimed "1000" cycles. Mine is completely dead at 196 cycles. So I use my iPad tethered to my iPhone, since my router and modem go dead with the power...


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## squint (Jun 15, 2008)

Bigg said:


> haha. I usually go online if the power goes out too. Except that my laptop battery is completely worthless now. So much for the claimed "1000" cycles. Mine is completely dead at 196 cycles.


1000 cycles is probably under highly optimal conditions (low temperature, low depth of discharge, etc.).



> Environmental conditions, and not cycling alone, are a key ingredient to longevity, and the worst situation is keeping a fully charged battery at elevated temperatures. This is the case when running a laptop off the power grid. Under these conditions, a battery will typically last for about two years, whether cycled or not. The pack does not die suddenly but will give lower runtimes with aging


http://batteryuniversity.com/learn/article/how_to_prolong_lithium_based_batteries


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

squint said:


> 1000 cycles is probably under highly optimal conditions (low temperature, low depth of discharge, etc.).


Apple claims specifically that the internal batteries in the Unibody Macbook Pros will retain 80% of their charge capacity at 1000 cycles. Mine is at 1% at 196 cycles. They're probably not going to do anything, because it's considered a "consumable", which would be fine, *except for the fact that they specifically marketed 80% charge capacity at 1000 cycles.*


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## Curt (Oct 26, 2003)

Surge protectors are false security. Unless you're going to go with a full-sine double-conversion UPS or power conditioner, you're wasting your time.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

No UPS will protect your equipment from lightning strikes. The only protection is a lightning rod standing taller than anything else and a cable leading straight to the ground.


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## tarheelblue32 (Jan 13, 2014)

Curt said:


> Surge protectors are false security. Unless you're going to go with a full-sine double-conversion UPS or power conditioner, you're wasting your time.


Back a few years ago, we had a lightning strike close to the house and a surge came in through the lines. All of the electronics we had that were hooked up to your average surge protectors survived and everything that wasn't on a surge protector got fried. I know that is purely anecdotal, but even the cheapest surge protector is still probably better than nothing at all.


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## Curt (Oct 26, 2003)

Most surge protectors use MOVs which have limited limited lifetimes and deteriorate during that period. And there's no way to verify their condition. Even UL1449 3rd edition allows considerable voltage through before clamping, and there can be a significant spike beyond that due to latency.

Cheap UPSs have little to no power conditioning and are really there to provide emergency power. And even that is questionable - unregulated square or stepped sine.

There are good surge protectors (that don't use MOVs) and UPSs, but very few are willing to spend the money on them.


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## telemark (Nov 12, 2013)

Nobody mentioned surge supression on the cable line.

I would think that's more important because a blown power supply is easy to replace but the boxes with damaged tuners are not repairable.


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