# All 4 LED's flashing on Bolt



## pj1983 (Dec 26, 2016)

Greetings,

Woke up this morning to find all four of my Bolt's LEDs flashing, along with a nice clicking sound. The unit is a 1TB refurb w/lifetime purchased during last November's sale. Research here reveals that I likely have a dead or non-responsive hard drive:

TiVo BOLT all 4 LEDs Rapidly Flashing

4 Lights Flashing on Bolt

all 4 lights flashing on Roamio ota ????

I did power-cycle the unit a couple of times without effect. I'm still within the 1 year warranty; however, based on my understanding of the warranty terms I'll pay for shipping both ways (and another fee?) to exchange the unit. I already have a 3TB drive on order so I think my best option is to forgo the exchange, do the upgrade, and toss the bad drive.

Is there anything else I should check before proceeding, or did I miss anything regarding the warranty process?

Thanks!


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

Nope replacing the dead drive with a nice shiny 3TB is an improvement and if it doesn't work you can deal with the exchange process.


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## pj1983 (Dec 26, 2016)

Looks like I need to pay better attention to the information here about upgrading, one of those nice shiny new 3TB drives I bought for my Roamios won't fit into my Bolt. I'll see what TiVo has to say about warranty replacement, then decide how to move on from there.


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

pj1983 said:


> Looks like I need to pay better attention to the information here about upgrading, one of those nice shiny new 3TB drives I bought for my Roamios won't fit into my Bolt. I'll see what TiVo has to say about warranty replacement, then decide how to move on from there.


Yep--the Roamio's use 3.5" hard drives, the Bolt's use 2.5" drives.


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## NoSpamMan (Jan 16, 2011)

Ugh. Me too. Just woke this morning to all lights flashing on a 20 month old Bolt+ with the 3TB drive. Is there any point in ponying up for an SSD, or is that even an option? 

Even though I bought the top of the line Bolt AND the lifetime service agreement, it looks like that doesn't extend the hardware warranty at all. Any strategy to speaking with TiVo today?


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

NoSpamMan said:


> Ugh. Me too. Just woke this morning to all lights flashing on a 20 month old Bolt+ with the 3TB drive. Is there any point in ponying up for an SSD, or is that even an option?
> 
> Even though I bought the top of the line Bolt AND the lifetime service agreement, it looks like that doesn't extend the hardware warranty at all. Any strategy to speaking with TiVo today?


Is that the original-as-bought 3TB drive in the Bolt? And by any chance, did you buy the box with a credit card that extends/doubles the warranty on purchases (which then would double the TiVo 1-year warranty to 2 years, covering you)?

Assuming it's the original drive and that you don't have a credit card extended warranty, people sometimes have success by calling TiVo, being polite, explaining the situation, and noting, as much as possible, their solid relationship as a TiVo customer (by length of time, number of TiVo boxes, $$ spent on TiVo equipment, etc.). Likewise that they didn't have any control over and weren't the cause of the current issue--the TiVo box just stopped functioning and started flashing lights of its own accord. And keep on asking what can be done and how TiVo can remedy the situation--don't necessarily automatically accept, right away, what is being proposed/offered. By keeping on talking, some people have gotten an initial $149 or $199 replacement offer down to $99, and then some down to $49, and some even to $0 (the latter seemingly being rare).

Arggh--sorry to hear of this constant nightmare fear for you. Good luck in dealing with TiVo--very much a YMMV event and a case of customer service rep. roulette--and let us know how it turns out. The fact that your Bolt flashing light syndrome is not unique may help you with TiVo--you may even want to mention to the rep. that you've read that this is a systemic issue that the Bolt boxes are having.


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## NoSpamMan (Jan 16, 2011)

Thanks, MikeGuy. I'm a MickGuy, BTW! 

Yes, it's the original, totally protected on a UPS APC system from surge and power-cuts, so this one just died on it's own. The WeaKnees guy in the chat said that SSDs are even worse because TiVo just pounds these with so many writes. 

I think your approach to getting TiVo to repair it is solid, and I've done that before with many companies, AND been a TiVo user for 15+ years, the Bolt+ being the 4th box we've bought, all with lifetime service. I have a pretty good case, but after months of fighting with Health insurance over bills, I just don't have the energy and want to get this fixed soon. TV is my late night cocktail and I want to get it fixed right away. 

I finally bit the bullet and bought a preformatted 3TB drive from WeaKnees which I'll install myself (with tax and expedited shipping: $357). I think with TiVo (I chatted with them first and was told all of that silly 10 step thing too--I'd already powercycled it) it would likely take forever to ship the entire unit back, then they ship back repaired. 

There is (from what I can tell) only a 90 warranty on parts, it seemed that the 1 year warranty wouldn't cover a dead HD?... Maybe I misread it, but I wish the U.S. would pass the same laws as Europe and just require all manufactures of tech to offer 3 year warranties. It's kind of scam that you can make anything over a few hundred and not offer a free or cheap path to repair if it dies long before it should.

Do you know of a way to find out the titles of the show that were on there? Is anything stored in ROM that might at least remind me all the things I was recording? 

I'm concerned that TiVo is not innovating enough to stay in the space. The apps for Amazon and Hulu are still kind of slow and kludgy and I'm surprised that little has really changed in the software over the years. The platform is so much easier to use than any of the cable or satellite providers, kind of the MacOS of DVR, but it's been looking like an acquisition target more and more of late and I'm not seeing any innovation moves to attract new buyers and upgrades as people cut the cord. It could really focus on stuff that will never really stream as well as record, like Sports, News, and whatever is left of broadcast TV, as well as a way to possibly download and store stuff from Netflix and other streamers that offer that. I'm worried it's too focused on an aspect of the industry that's shrinking fast and will become the Sears story. :-(


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

I'm not aware that TiVo, when contacted, really spends much time as to the cause of a failure once it determines that there was one (assuming that the user doesn't fall into the realm of tampering, such as with the software). It seems to look at the timings as broad indicators as to how much it will charge to replace a box (if I'm remembering correctly, first 30 days, full guarantee and refund for a return; first 90 days, box is replaced; remainder of the first year, box is replaced at a low price; over a year, at TiVo's discretion and a big YMMV--TiVo has no obligation at over a year (but often has been helpful and considerate, and even generous). And TiVo isn't returning the customer's box back to the customer, repaired; rather, a refurbed box (typically) simply is sent out.

If your box is having an issue, your shows may simply be lost, if the box can't be started up again. You might check TiVo Online, to see if that can be of help; but given that the recordings are stored locally, I don't see much that's positive there. 

I agree, a standard 3-year warranty on tech. would be welcome. Sad that the EU can do it but we can't.


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## NoSpamMan (Jan 16, 2011)

I'm pressed for time, but wanted to say that I installed the new WeaKnees 3TB HD last night and it seems to have gotten us back up and running. 

The Bolt+ does NOT open easily or without scratching and bending some of the plastic, at least on the inside. You have to go very slowly to get that first plastic cover popped off and I spent 15+ minutes on that with no small concern that I would break it. Once that cover is finally snapped off successfully, it's easy to get to the torq screws and removed the larger plastic housing and eventually swap out the drive. But MAN, some very late night stress about popping plastic off with a flat head screwdriver (as WeaKnees advised). The original Mac mini was only slightly more terrifying when you finally hear the good "crack" and still don't know if it's the "good" crack or not. ;-) 

It's really a very simple piece of tech with a board, a fan and HD. If I'd had more time, I might have looked under the board, but I wanted to get my TiVo back on the network again. 

I'm not sure we're served by the 2.5" hard drive in this. The larger 3.5" drives can run cooler, greater capacity, but would (of course) require a larger box. The fact that my factory original died after just 19 months (fully protected with high end UPS system) doesn't bode well. 

I haven't researched it yet and don't have time right now, but is there a way to backup a TiVo's HD so that, at the very least, you might have a list of lost programs? Ideally, we'd just plug in an external USB HD for backing up once a night, right? I don't want to record on externals. I already had one of those fail and TiVo had striped the system from some years back so everything was lost (dumb idea).

Any way to back up the brand new drive? I'm realizing that my cost was so high on the replacement drive, I wish I'd just been able to buy a new Bolt+ and have TiVo transfer the Lifetime Service agreement. That might have been a smarter way to go?...


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## kpeters59 (Jun 19, 2007)

KMTTG will back up most of your settings and data.

You could also just clone the new drive to keep just in case...

-KP


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

I don't know what the Weaknees return policy on the drive is, but if you wanted to, you still could contact TiVo over the issue. Before doing so, many people tend to re-install the original drive, for purposes of TiVo's diagnostics and to avoid a possible issue with user box modification. But you may just decide that all of this is water under the bridge, at this point.


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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

OP, too late now, but you could have gotten a replacement Bolt+ for far less money than you paid Weaknees. TiVo doesn’t repair a unit. They simply send you another one and then you send them the broken unit in the shipping box they used. I recently went through that process. Further, you don’t need a “formatted” drive. A plain blank drive works and costs far less.


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## NoSpamMan (Jan 16, 2011)

UCLABB said:


> OP, too late now, but you could have gotten a replacement Bolt+ for far less money than you paid Weaknees. TiVo doesn't repair a unit. They simply send you another one and then you send them the broken unit in the shipping box they used. I recently went through that process. Further, you don't need a "formatted" drive. A plain blank drive works and costs far less.


Yeah, I'm wondering about that, but it would have certainly taken a long time for the exchange. BUT, what about the lifetime service agreement? Would they transfer that to the new machine?


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## NoSpamMan (Jan 16, 2011)

kpeters59 said:


> KMTTG will back up most of your settings and data.
> 
> You could also just clone the new drive to keep just in case...
> 
> -KP


What is KMTTG?...

Seems awfully strange I wouldn't be able to plug in an external drive in the USB port and have it run a backup every night. Is there any scenario for that?


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## JoeKustra (Dec 7, 2012)

NoSpamMan said:


> What is KMTTG?...


New program for 1 step TTG downloads, decryption, encoding - kmttg


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## NoSpamMan (Jan 16, 2011)

JoeKustra said:


> New program for 1 step TTG downloads, decryption, encoding - kmttg


Joe, you are Abbreviation Man! Or AM, I guess. LOL!

"TTG downloads" means nothing to me...


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## fcfc2 (Feb 19, 2015)

NoSpamMan said:


> What is KMTTG?...
> 
> Seems awfully strange I wouldn't be able to plug in an external drive in the USB port and have it run a backup every night. Is there any scenario for that?


No, but google will answer your other question in about 2 seconds or less, kmttg


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## NoSpamMan (Jan 16, 2011)

fcfc2 said:


> No, but google will answer your other question in about 2 seconds or less, kmttg


Yeah, thanks. Didn't come up for me and I'm not a gamer, but thanks for the link. Part of my query was "Why doesn't TiVo have something like this out of the box?


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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

NoSpamMan said:


> Yeah, I'm wondering about that, but it would have certainly taken a long time for the exchange. BUT, what about the lifetime service agreement? Would they transfer that to the new machine?


Lifetime is transferred. I got my replacement Bolt+ four days after I called them. I then used TiVo's shipping box to send the broken box back.


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## BobCamp1 (May 15, 2002)

NoSpamMan said:


> Yeah, thanks. Didn't come up for me and I'm not a gamer, but thanks for the link. Part of my query was "Why doesn't TiVo have something like this out of the box?


There is also this much more user friendly program: pyTivo Desktop

Tivo used to sell Tivo Desktop, but they don't anymore.


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## philhu (Apr 11, 2001)

well this is really wierd. I had a bolt do the 3 light thing.

It did have lifetime on it, no extended warranty. And the unit was way older than a year.

They were fine with sending me a new unit, charging me $149. But then realized my lifetime was transferred from an old series 2 on tradeup. So they charged me $22 for the upgrade, including new machine on lifetime.

Wierd


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## Mikeguy (Jul 28, 2005)

philhu said:


> well this is really wierd. I had a bolt do the 3 light thing.
> 
> It did have lifetime on it, no extended warranty. And the unit was way older than a year.
> 
> ...


That's a new charge price-point: $22.


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## Cheezmo (Apr 26, 2004)

Mine died with the 4 flashing lights a few days ago. Was told $149, but then immediately offered $79 for a replacement which was fine by me. Bummer to lose all my shows and season passes.


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## cwerdna (Feb 22, 2001)

NoSpamMan said:


> Is there any point in ponying up for an SSD, or is that even an option?
> 
> Even though I bought the top of the line Bolt AND the lifetime service agreement, it looks like that doesn't extend the hardware warranty at all.


I know I'm late to replying but I would NEVER want to put an SSD in a TiVo. The constant writing will wear it out too quickly besides them being WAY too expensive for a quality one that's 2 TB or more.

As for the last part, of course not. It never has. I did pay another $40 for TiVo's 3 year extended warranty. We'll see if it ends up being worth the $, "worth" the piece of mind or ends up being a waste of $. Mine was bought in April 2017. Still is working fine, so far.


NoSpamMan said:


> Yeah, thanks. Didn't come up for me and I'm not a gamer, but thanks for the link. Part of my query was "Why doesn't TiVo have something like this out of the box?


Has nothing to do with games. If you'll notice, the original kmttg thread was started in 2008. I've used it for ages, and started using it with my retired TiVo HD.

TiVo To Go has existed for ages. I found TiVo To Go's gone to the PSP, iPod, and Treo from 2006. TiVo used to release and support TiVo Desktop software but they stopped "supporting" it and AFAIK, removed the app for from their web site.


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## kdc914 (Jul 13, 2007)

UCLABB said:


> OP, too late now... Further, you don't need a "formatted" drive. A plain blank drive works and costs far less.


By "plain blank drive" do you mean drop in one directly from Newegg/etc without any preparation? Is something new to the Bolt series? I've replaced hard drives in Series 2 and Series 3 boxes over the years and you definitely had to have a Tivo format/OS on the drive. For my older boxes you could use the drive of your own choice, but I had a boot CD that put the base image/OS on the drive and set the drive up for whatever Tivo wanted to see.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

kdc914 said:


> By "plain blank drive" do you mean drop in one directly from Newegg/etc without any preparation? Is something new to the Bolt series? I've replaced hard drives in Series 2 and Series 3 boxes over the years and you definitely had to have a Tivo format/OS on the drive. For my older boxes you could use the drive of your own choice, but I had a boot CD that put the base image/OS on the drive and set the drive up for whatever Tivo wanted to see.


Correct, Roamio and Bolt can take a blank drive and format it for use (up to 3TB) without any special prep. This is because the OS is in flash RAM.

Scott


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## kdc914 (Jul 13, 2007)

spiffy! Thanks for the tip. Unfortunately, NAS/Surveillance/DVR grade 3TB 2.5" drives appear to be more rare than winning Powerball tickets...


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## kdc914 (Jul 13, 2007)

HerronScott said:


> Correct, Roamio and Bolt can take a blank drive and format it for use (up to 3TB) without any special prep. This is because the OS is in flash RAM.
> 
> Scott


OK, then this answer has sparked another question: are favorites, OnePasses, etc stored in flash or on the drive?


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

kdc914 said:


> OK, then this answer has sparked another question: are favorites, OnePasses, etc stored in flash or on the drive?


I think someone else would be better able to answer that question for you.

Scott


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## UCLABB (May 29, 2012)

It’s probably on the hdd because you lose all that stuff when you put in a new hdd. I suppose it could be on flash, but it’s moot since it’s all gone no matter what. One can use kmttg to save one passes.


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## wintermute824 (Oct 10, 2016)

This happened to our Bolt+ today, it's less than 2 years old (purchased in April 2017). Lost nearly 2 years of recordings and OnePasses. Thankfully we still have several working boxes with lifetime, so the next youngest (Premiere 4XL) has been returned to first position (as living room recorder, MoCa network generator, etc), and the older units and Minis can share/stream from it. Disappointed the hardware is so prone to failure, but it must be getting pretty common. When I called in to tech support, not only did they offer replacement, but they said they'll waive the replacement fee. So, while disappointed I'm getting a refurbished, and irritated that I lose all my recordings and passes, at least I'll have a working box in a week or so at no additional cost.


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