# T-60 Bad - How Can I Salvage Lifetime Sub?



## Rhughes (Jan 14, 2001)

I have pretty much given up trying to fix the pixelization problems in our T-60. It's not a drive problem, and it's not an image problem. Do I have any options for replacing the T-60 with something else? It was purchased 1/5/2001.


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## Sir_Q (Jun 27, 2002)

lifetime is married to your account, not your t-60


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

but definitely add a new receiver before dropping the sony so they don't get 'confused' at directv..heck maybe even wait a few days to shut it off


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## Rhughes (Jan 14, 2001)

Sir_Q said:


> lifetime is married to your account, not your t-60


Boy, I would like to believe that, but everything I have read on this forum indicates the Lifetime subscription goes with the unit, not the owner. Otherwise, T-60's with lifetime on Ebay would be of no use to the purchaser. Are you sure?


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## Billy Bob Boy (Jul 25, 2004)

Rhughes said:


> Boy, I would like to believe that, but everything I have read on this forum indicates the Lifetime subscription goes with the unit, not the owner. Otherwise, T-60's with lifetime on Ebay would be of no use to the purchaser. Are you sure?


Positive! Lifetime goes with the unit on a standalone tivo. Directivo is on the named person account. It is possible to transfer to someone else , but you must close your d* account first. Like the others said get a replacement. and your lifetime will stay.


Edit: it might be possible to sell it on ebay with the lifetime but you would have to cancel your D* account and open a new account in someone elses name :IE your wife. But I don't know if D* will still transfer. You may want to contact D* and call many times asking for supervisors and retention. See how many say the same thing. That MIGHT be the right answer. A couple of years ago my friend transferred his lifetime to a family member when he canceled his D* account. To get the transfer to work you must play CSR roulette. (sometimes you get someone to do it and sometimes they say no.

IMHO keep the lifetime! It will pay for itself over the next 4 years. compared to what you would sell it for!


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## Marc (Jun 26, 1999)

Sir_Q is definitely right. Lifetime-with-unit is for standalone TiVos. Combo boxes like the T-60 used to have their own subscription, but that changed when DirecTV took over management of the subscriptions, so now it's a per-account feature. Plus, you can now have as many DirecTiVos on your account without paying a DVR fee (you'll just pay the normal additional receiver/leased receiver fee).


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## rock_doctor (Oct 22, 2000)

Call DTV and tell then your T-60 just died and you want to talk to retention. Retention will probably send you an R10 or R15 as replacement. Probably at no cost above what you are paying. Just make sure you do not agree to cancel... They should replace the unit with a leased unit but try to talk them out of listing it as leased as they are replacing an owned unit. You will have to see what they offer you. There are a lot of Wal-Marts that still have an R10 on their self, that is the route I would go, then you will still own the unit.

mark

Edited as suggested


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## Rhughes (Jan 14, 2001)

Marc said:


> Sir_Q is definitely right. Lifetime-with-unit is for standalone TiVos. Combo boxes like the T-60 used to have their own subscription, but that changed when DirecTV took over management of the subscriptions, so now it's a per-account feature. Plus, you can now have as many DirecTiVos on your account without paying a DVR fee (you'll just pay the normal additional receiver/leased receiver fee).


You guys are making this a happy Easter for sure. I have been thinking wrong all these years.

Now the question is, how best to do it. Let's say I buy a new R10 from Weaknees. Now I have an ailing T-60, a new R10 and a Sony Sat-A3. I pay the mirroring charge now on the A3, and have lifetime on the T-60. Do I activate the R10 as an added receiver, then cancel the T-60? I want to keep the A3 for the bedrooms. Will I have any problem cancelling the T-60? If I can do this, I am off and running tomorrow.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

I would buy a new DVR and activate it before deactivating the T60. Make sure that DirecTV has the new unit as your primary receiver. This way the lifetime account should remain intact.


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## bidger (Mar 30, 2001)

rock_doctor said:


> Call DTV and tell then your T-60 just died and you want to cancel the account.


Have to disagree, Mark, because that's how Lifetime has been screwed up on peoples' accounts. You want to activate a new or replacement D-TiVo, then deactivate the dead one. I swapped out 2 D-TiVos, but I always made sure to activate the new ones before deactivating the old.

Gotta love Lifetime on the D-TiVo. :up: Because the DVR charge is of secondary importance to DirecTV, they're able to do something that TiVo can't.


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## rock_doctor (Oct 22, 2000)

bidger said:


> Have to disagree, Mark, because that's how Lifetime has been screwed up on peoples' accounts. You want to activate a new or replacement D-TiVo, then deactivate the dead one.


Very true and since the OP may end up getting a unit without a card they will want to remarry the old card to the new unit. That is why I wrote to not agree to cancel the account but to say it to get to retention (faster). However he does it as long as he gets the desired result in the end. Thanks for the correction. 

mark


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## Rhughes (Jan 14, 2001)

JimSpence said:


> I would buy a new DVR and activate it before deactivating the T60. Make sure that DirecTV has the new unit as your primary receiver. This way the lifetime account should remain intact.


Another question. When I buy another receiver, I understand I will have to sign a contract. Do you have to sign another contract every time you add another Direct DVR? Probably going to get it from Weaknees. Don't want to lease.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

typically any activation of a new receiver ups you for 1 yr (2 yrs for HDtivo)

and when you call to activate as owned...you will see what fun that is...ask to be xfered to the access card dept if they wont do it. Then check your online bill. If it's still leased, email them with the name and time of the person you spoke to and it will be corrected. happened to me that way.


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## Rhughes (Jan 14, 2001)

newsposter said:


> typically any activation of a new receiver ups you for 1 yr (2 yrs for HDtivo)
> 
> and when you call to activate as owned...you will see what fun that is...ask to be xfered to the access card dept if they wont do it. Then check your online bill. If it's still leased, email them with the name and time of the person you spoke to and it will be corrected. happened to me that way.


Thanks for the heads up. Yes, I am anticipating lots of fun when I call to activate. Especially when I have the old Select programming and networks on both coasts. AND I will own the unit and don't want them trying to lease it to me. AND I haven't been under contract for about five years. Keeps life interesting.


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## dishrich (Jan 16, 2002)

newsposter said:


> typically any activation of a new receiver ups you for 1 yr (2 yrs for HDtivo)


It's actually 2 years for ANY DVR or ANY HD receiver - the ONLY receivers that you can get by with only 1 year is a new SD non-DVR receiver...


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## HTGuy (Apr 15, 2006)

I would recommend *replacing* the T-60 with the new receiver. Adding and then deleting may save the lifetime, but will for sure renew your commitment to 2 years.

I recently switched from a S1 DTivo with lifetime to a "used" S2 DTivo. DTV allowed me to transfer the existing access card. I was told verbally that there would be no new agreement. Be sure to metioned the receiver is "used" as that also seems to help.

From my understanding, DTV uses the access card numbers more than anything to track own vs. lease as well as agreements. Keeping the same access card seems to help. I checked my account online today (switched receivers last Friday)...the account shows no "recent activity", but does show my new receiver's serial number on the info page.

Replacing the reciever and keeping the old card did the trick for me as I did not want a 2 year lock in.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

dishrich said:


> It's actually 2 years for ANY DVR or ANY HD receiver - the ONLY receivers that you can get by with only 1 year is a new SD non-DVR receiver...


by george he's right..found this on DTVs web pages...had no idea (also that you MUST get the HD pak...what a rip off!!!, I can't even see the 119!) Actually reading through the list of fees on the contract page..it's kind of scary.

Get a FREE lease upgrade to an HD Receiver after $99 instant online rebate. Requires 2 year programming commitment. Subscription to the DIRECTV® HD Package required. Equipment return required upon disconnect.

Get a lease upgrade to an HD DVR for just $399 after $100 instant online rebate. Requires 2 year programming commitment. Subscription to DVR service and the DIRECTV HD package required. Equipment return required upon disconnect

Get a free lease upgrade to a DVR after $99 instant online rebate. Requires 2 year programming commitment. Subscription to DVR service required. Equipment return required upon disconnect.

New lease customers only. Offer ends 07/01/06. Offer available on approved credit. Programming commitment required. Add $4.99/mo. lease fee for second and each additional receiver. One rebate per DIRECTV account. DIRECTV hardware and programming available separately.


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## HTGuy (Apr 15, 2006)

If you want to avoid all of the lease and commitment garbage, I would buy a used or refurb receiver. I don't know if the "new" R-10s Weaknees sell are considered as "leased" by DTV or not. If you are going that route, I would call 1st to be sure.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

online purchases are owned per my experience last week

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=3942762&&#post3942762


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## Billy Bob Boy (Jul 25, 2004)

HTGuy said:


> If you want to avoid all of the lease and commitment garbage, I would buy a used or refurb receiver. I don't know if the "new" R-10s Weaknees sell are considered as "leased" by DTV or not. If you are going that route, I would call 1st to be sure.


You can avoid the lease garbage but you cant avoid the commitment garbage. Unless you bug retention of course!


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## Rhughes (Jan 14, 2001)

newsposter said:


> online purchases are owned per my experience last week
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=3942762&&#post3942762


Here is an update on my experience with DirecTV. First, I ordered a new R10 on-line from Weaknees. It arrived at my house in 2 days. So far, so good. I installed it this morning, along with my aging T-60 on the same multi-switch. Ran through the setup, and called DirecTV to activate the new DVR. It was an unbelievably good experience. The young man I talked to walked me through the process and was as pleasant as he could be. I had no problems at all adding the R10 to my account with no changes. All that worry for nothing.


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## HTGuy (Apr 15, 2006)

Rhughes said:


> Here is an update on my experience with DirecTV. First, I ordered a new R10 on-line from Weaknees. It arrived at my house in 2 days. So far, so good. I installed it this morning, along with my aging T-60 on the same multi-switch. Ran through the setup, and called DirecTV to activate the new DVR. It was an unbelievably good experience. The young man I talked to walked me through the process and was as pleasant as he could be. I had no problems at all adding the R10 to my account with no changes. All that worry for nothing.


Glad to hear it worked out for you. Did they have you just move the access card over from the T-60?


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## Rhughes (Jan 14, 2001)

HTGuy said:


> Glad to hear it worked out for you. Did they have you just move the access card over from the T-60?


No. I'm keeping the T-60 in service for now. For one thing, we have a lot of recorded programs on it. And it takes pity on us and works perfectly once in a while.

We had an ancient Sony A-3 receiver as primary, and the T-60 as the mirrored receiver. We took the A-3 out of service and made the new R10 the primary. Everything worked out exactly like I wanted. Now, we have two DirecTV TiVo's in service (well, make that one and a half.) I couldn't be happier with how DirecTV handled the new receiver. I now have two TiVo's with lifetime subscription and my current programming and network feeds intact. With no change in monthly cost. Life is good!


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

please check your bill online and get back to us to see if it's leased or not. Then i'd be impressed if it's not 

everyone on here that i've read about said the initial CSRs can't change to own and you need to be xfered


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## Rhughes (Jan 14, 2001)

newsposter said:


> please check your bill online and get back to us to see if it's leased or not. Then i'd be impressed if it's not
> 
> everyone on here that i've read about said the initial CSRs can't change to own and you need to be xfered


I was worried about that, but it didn't make sense when I bought it outright that they would attempt to lease it back to me. Plus Weaknees assured me that all I had to do was tell D that I bought it from them. Plus, the D CSR said my monthly bill would remain exactly the same. Seems like everything points to not leased. The CSR seemed impressed that I had been with D for 11 years. Back when the original RCA receiver was released. The only contract I signed was an access card activation agreement. Nothing about the receiver per se. I will post my billing info when I get it.


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## stevegriswold (Jan 16, 2006)

Hi,

Thanks for the info. 

My DTV Tivo Sony Sat T60 was running along during a big storm tonight and lightning striked, I saw a big flash under the TV and then smelled burning. My surge protector worked but the power came over my cable line #2. So I get a message on my DTV Tivo now that says "searching for Sat 2". I switched the cables and Receiver part 2 is still dead. I redid setup, etc. I opened the box and everything looks fine to the eye, but smells bad. So now I basically have a one channel Tivo with lifetime. 

But after reading this thread is sounds like I can buy a new DTV Tivo and just add it to my existing lifetime account and keep the half working Sony.

Is the R10 the way to go?

Thanks,
Steve


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## Rhughes (Jan 14, 2001)

stevegriswold said:


> Hi,
> 
> Thanks for the info.
> 
> ...


As far as I am concerned, the R10 is the only way to go. The R10 is the last of the DirecTV DVRs with TiVo. It has been replaced by the R15 which has the DirecTV type of programming (not TiVo.) The R10 can be easily upgraded with a larger or second hard drive. The R15 cannot. R10's are hard to find now, but Weaknees, which is a DirecTV distributor, still has them. The basic 70 hour unit is $199 with free shipping. The cost goes up from there depending upon how big a drive(s) you want. I chose to get the standard 70-hour model and put another drive in it after I get some hours on the unit.

As others have pointed out, and correctly so, a lifetime subscription with a DirecTV DVR (not a stand-alone) goes with the account and not the receiver. If you buy your unit from Weaknees the process with DirecTV is painless. If you get it somewhere else, I don't know what hoops you would have to go through because I didn't try any other route. Now that I have been through the process I may just buy another R10 to replace the T-60 before the R10's are all gone. It seems to be a great receiver. Far better cooling system. Fan goes out the back like a PC. Mine runs 38C.


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## newsposter (Aug 18, 2002)

Rhughes said:


> I was worried about that, but it didn't make sense when I bought it outright that they would attempt to lease it back to me. Plus Weaknees assured me that all I had to do was tell D that I bought it from them. Plus, the D CSR said my monthly bill would remain exactly the same. Seems like everything points to not leased. \


Well i had email from 2 online retailers saying it's definitely owned PLUS email from directv PLUS the CSR in access card dept said i was owned and yet it still said leased. So that's why i'm a pessimist.


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## Steve O (Jan 23, 2001)

This thread is a bit old, but I wanted to check to see if the info is still relevant. 

Here's the situation. I've had a Sony SAT-T60 from way back when and I got the lifetime TiVo with DirecTV. I've since gotten 3 additional DirecTV TiVo's in my house (2 standard def and the HD unit).

I'm thinking about going mpeg4 (mainly to get NESN-HD in Boston) and getting an HR20. To do this, I'd want to retire the SAT-T60. I want to make sure my lifetime DirecTV TiVo account is going to be OK by doing this.

(oh, and I know someone will suggest "just retire one of the other SD TiVos", but the T60 has gotten a little louder over the years... it's OK in the living room, but the others are in the bedroom and my wife's office, so having them be reasonably quiet is important". If I can't keep lifetime and retire the T60, then, um, I guess she's going to have to live with a slightly louder TiVo in her office... )

Thanks,
Steve


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## Rhughes (Jan 14, 2001)

Steve O said:


> This thread is a bit old, but I wanted to check to see if the info is still relevant.
> 
> Here's the situation. I've had a Sony SAT-T60 from way back when and I got the lifetime TiVo with DirecTV. I've since gotten 3 additional DirecTV TiVo's in my house (2 standard def and the HD unit).
> 
> ...


Your DirecTivo lifetime subscription goes with the account, not the T-60. As long as you keep the account active, you will be fine. I retired a T-60, and replaced it with two, series II directivos. On one, I moved the card from the T-60 to the series II. The other series II was purchased new so it had its own card. Took about five minutes with DirecTV to get things changed over.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

To ensure that the lifetime doesn't get messed up. Make sure one of the other DirecTV TiVos is the primary before removing the T60.


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## tjperez (Jan 14, 2002)

Why do I have to sign a commitment if I am only leasing the equipment? I thought the idea behind contracts was because the service provider subsidized some or all of the cost of the receiver when you buy it.


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## JimSpence (Sep 19, 2001)

This part of DirecTV's business model has me confused as well.

In my opinion, if you buy something then you aren't leasing it. Having a commitment when buying is fine since DirecTV is subsidizing the cost. By my definition, leasing something relieves the customer from future problems. 

DirecTV seems to want a whole bunch of lease fees up front (the cost) and a commitment (monthly lease fee). It's kinda like "having your cake and eating too".


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## Duanelee (Apr 11, 2007)

Can the hd dvr be bought and the lifetime service be retained? I don't like leasing but will if I have to. Have not bought the new new hd tv but wiil as soon as I get all this tradeing figured out.


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## tjperez (Jan 14, 2002)

A lifetime sub for a Directv DVR is tied to the account so you can upgrade or change out your DVRs anytime and it will still operate under the lifetime subscription. 

Only true standalone Tivos have their lifetime subs tied to the unit.


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## billyburg (Apr 15, 2007)

This thread has been very useful as it addresses the situation that I am in, but still I have a question. My old T60 is dead now and I'd like to upgrade. Not really ready for the HD system yet but definitely for series 2. I'm not so sure that I lease my box, I think I bought it as well as a lifetime Tivo. Just looking at my current bill. I'm only billed for "Total Choice Plus" and Directv DVR Service Fee Lifetime of $0.00.. no explicit lease. 

So should I get a new box directly from DirectTV? are there even series 2 DirecTV+Tivo boxes? or can I buy one elsewhere and simply call to have it "authorized. Also I'd like to get my stored programs off the old T60. It had 2 disks. I added a second several years ago. It will not boot, how do I get the stuff off of it? 


Thanks so much


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## John T Smith (Jun 17, 2004)

In no particular order

What DTV sells/leases now is NOT a Tivo, it is their own brand
http://www.dbstalk.com/forumdisplay.php?f=82

You may buy a DTivo... Where to I get a DirecTv Tivo?
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=316297

If you buy used/eBay, be sure you get the receiver ID and call DTV
BEFORE you buy, so you may verify there is not money owed

Unless you have ALREADY hacked your unit, there is no way to get
the recordings off the hard drive, since they are encrypted to the
receiver's ID code

Forums for DTivo Hacking, Upgrades, Networking, etc
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=24


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## Texish (Mar 17, 2002)

I have a DSR6000 with lifetime service. I am thinking about getting HD. If I get the Directv HD DVR (I want locals in HD and can't put up an OTA antenna), will my lifetime cover that? I'm adding it to my account, not replacing my Tivo. So now I'll have 2 receivers. One DirecTivo DSR6000 and the Directv HD DVR. What should be my monthly increase for the DVRs (excluding any HD services I get). I am thinking they should charge me $4.99/month for the extra receiver (mirror fee), but nothing for the DVR fee. Is that correct? The agent I talked to said I had to pay a DVR fee and that my lifetime didn't apply to the Directv HD DVR. She said I paid that money to Tivo (I bought it around 2000, so I don't remember who I paid for, if it even matters), so they still would charge me a DVR fee. I think she's wrong on this. What is the correct answer here? Does anybody know? I seem to recall somebody had a link to their policy.


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## rminsk (Jun 4, 2002)

The lifetime service covers all DVRs on your account. Lifetime service was transfered to the account. As long as you have the same account you will have lifetime. The CSR is wrong and all you should pay is the receiver mirroring fee.

See the customer agreement http://directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPage.jsp?assetId=P400042


> If you paid a "lifetime service fee," you will not be charged a fee for your DIRECTV DVR Service as long as you maintain television programming service from DIRECTV on the same account. If you disconnect your DIRECTV television programming service and later reconnect on the same account, your DIRECTV DVR Service will be reconnected and you will not be charged a fee for DIRECTV DVR Service.


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## mattn2 (Mar 23, 2001)

Texish said:


> I want locals in HD and can't put up an OTA antenna


Just so you know You CAN put antennas on your owned and/or controlled property...

http://www.fcc.gov/mb/facts/otard.html

# Matt


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## dmurphy (Jan 17, 2002)

rminsk said:


> The lifetime service covers all DVRs on your account. Lifetime service was transfered to the account. As long as you have the same account you will have lifetime. The CSR is wrong and all you should pay is the receiver mirroring fee.
> 
> See the customer agreement http://directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPage.jsp?assetId=P400042


DING! DING! DING! We have a winner.

That is absolutely, 100% correct. The Lifetime Service Fee is, well, lifetime of the -account- rather than the -receiver-.

Whether you have 1 DVR or 10 on your account, it won't cost you anything.

I have 5 TV's in my house, and each one has a DVR hooked up to it (of various forms - D*TiVo, R15, HR20, etc.). Since my monthly cost is the same for a standard receiver or a DVR ($4.99 mirroring fee), why the heck not?


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