# SD Directv quality on HD tvs?



## byrd (Jun 25, 2003)

I currently have 2 SD Series 2 Directivos. One is set up on an old 32" CRT TV and the other is on a 22" HD TV. I'd like to replace the old 32" CRT TV with a newer LCD TV (somewhere in the 40 to 50" range), but I don't currently have any intention of upgrading to Directv's HD service (at least not until HD Directivos are available -hopefully- next year some time). 

Is anyone out there using an SD Directivo on a newer LCD TV in the 40 to 50" range? What's the quality like? Will it get too pixelated? I certainly don't what to make the investment, hook everything up, and find out that it looks like crap.

I've currently got my Directivo's up and running with the MRV and can access video, music, and pictures from my home PC on either Tivo. I'm quite happy with the setup, and don't want to rock the boat unless I keep all the Tivo capabilities and just add HD, but it sounds like current rumors are that this is at least a year away.

Thanks!


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## shibby191 (Dec 24, 2007)

SD will always look like crap on a bigger HDTV no matter what your provider. You're taking a cruddy signal to begin with and then blowing it up on a big screen. It will look terrible. Now some TV's do a better job then others at upconverting but it's still not going to look very good no matter what you do.


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## byrd (Jun 25, 2003)

Yeah, that's what I thought, but I recently read a comment somewhere (can't remember where) where a person stated that Directv's SC signal looks good HD TV's in the size range that I mentioned above. I was skeptical to say the least. That's why I thought I'd ask here to see what others experiences were. Thanks for the input. I was getting a little excited about the prospect of upgrading my old TV, but maybe I'll be stuck with it for another year or so...


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## Trent Bates (Dec 17, 2001)

FWIW, DirecTV's SD signal from a Philips DSR-6000 doesn't look as good on my 30" Toshiba Widescreen Tube TV as it did before on an older 4:3 Tube TV.

In contrast, a similar DSR-6000 looks really good on my Parent's 52" Samsung LCD but only through the composite cables. The S-Video arrangement looks worse and I imagine it's due to upconverting on the RCA input but not the S-Video.

I could be happy watching SD on my Parent's TV for years to come.

P.S. - I'm talking about watching all of these TVs in the 4:3 aspect ratio. No stretching the pictures or anything like that.


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## stevel (Aug 23, 2000)

I find that some SD channels look pretty good and some look awful - with a HR10 and HR21 connected by HDMI to a 60" Sony SXRD set. If you're connecting by S-Video or composite from a SD box, things may be much worse.


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## CharlieB (Mar 13, 2002)

Trent Bates said:


> FWIW,
> In contrast, a similar DSR-6000 looks really good on my Parent's 52" Samsung LCD but only through the composite cables. The S-Video arrangement looks worse and I imagine it's due to upconverting on the RCA input but not the S-Video.


I recently got a 40" Samsung LCD, and hooked my R10 up to it using S-Video, same connection type as I was using on my tube TV. I agree the picture looked better (clarity) on the 27" tube TV. Will it really look better using composite? Are you sure that the Sammy will upconvert a composite signal, but not an S-Video signal?


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## Trent Bates (Dec 17, 2001)

I'm not sure of anything regarding the Samsungs. Here's what happened:

We moved the old TV out, moved the new TV in. I hooked it up with the existing composite cables.

A few days later, I brought a S-Video cable over and plugged it in between the DSR-6000 and the LCD TV all the while promising that the S-Video cable would give them a better picture.
We went to the DirecTV Central screen and I noticed that the text seemed fuzzier. I compared S-Video to Composite on the end credits of a couple of shows and decided that I'd wasted my time with the S-Video cable so I unhooked it and brought it back home.

I'd heard in the past that some TVs have decent upconverting abilities and summized that my Parent's TV must be upconverting on the composite but not the S-Video. It makes a degree of sense. I'd expect HDMI, Component and S-Video to require less manipulation than composite and RF.

I'm interested to hear what you think if/when you try this!


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## byrd (Jun 25, 2003)

I'm interested to hear the results too!

This sounds somewhat promising (as long as I verify that there is some sort of upconverting used on a TV that I might select). I was thinking that the quality might only be decent if I had component video out, which my RCA DVR80 and a Hughes DVR40 do not have. If and when I actually make the upgrade, I'll have to be sure to look more carefully at the specs.


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## cthomp21 (Jul 15, 2007)

I've got a Hughes DVR40 connected to my 42" Panasonic Plasma via S-Video. I'm "ok" with the results. To me: MRV + goodies + Tivoserver > HD + extra fees

If I want to go HD, I switch over to the antenna input and watch live. The picture is outstanding, but my wife usually doesn't even realize it's HD.


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## rock_doctor (Oct 22, 2000)

It will not be too bad on a 22", similar to watching a video tape on your tube tv. Anything above 32" and it starts to look "iffy". I have a series 2 feeding a 50" plasma and it absolutely drives me crazy....it's watchable but a little irritating.


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## Trent Bates (Dec 17, 2001)

rock_doctor said:


> It will not be too bad on a 22", similar to watching a video tape on your tube tv.


I think I disagree with this part of your statement. I've got a 20" Sharp Aquos in the kitchen being fed SD from downstairs via RF through two diplexers and it looks really good! It looks better than my 30" widescreen HD tube via 6' S-Video.


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## byrd (Jun 25, 2003)

This post is rather old at this point, but since I've recently upgraded my old Sony Trinitron Flatscreen CTR tv with a new Samsung 52" LCD flatscreen (LN52A750), I thought I'd come back here to share my results. 

In short, the results are quite good! When shopping around, I read a lot of reviews, and almost hands down, the Samsung TVs got the best reviews for playing standard def format. Currently I'm using the composite video output on the Dtivo to the TV. 

At first, I was a bit discouraged, but after tweaking a few settings, I've been very pleased. I had to turn OFF the 120Hz function, turn ON Film Mode (for 2:3 pull down), and turned Digital Noise Reduction up to High (fortunately, even on High, the DNR doesn't make things look that hazy). Then I changed the default color settings considerably. The defaults were great for HD sources like the blu-ray, but not for SDTV. Fortunately, the TV has separate color settings for each input.

Interestingly enough, I think the 52" Samsung has a better SD picture then my 22" Visio. Also, the 32" Sony Trinitron always seemed to show a good bit of digital "blockiness" in the directv signal, especially in dark areas of the screen (probably from the video compression of the signal). I don't see any of that anymore. There is a bit of small pixelization, but a certain amount of that is to be expected considering the source. 

Don't get me wrong, it's certainly not HDTV or Blu-Ray quality, but overall, I'm quite pleased. I feel that I can now hold out a bit longer in hopes that the new HD Directivos will come out by the end of this year or the beginning of next.... fingers crossed!


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## Alztybrn (Jan 8, 2006)

I have SD through a R-10 on a Panasonic 50" and while the picture is not HD, it really is not that bad. Very watchable. I do have an antenna for locals, so whenever DTV makes Locals available to me, and they release the HD with Tivo unit I will be going solely HD.


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## fasTLane (Nov 25, 2005)

On a Panny 50" monitor with the HR10-250 through composite; 
On channels like TCM and others the feed is quite watchable. I even zoom (hate to stretch) on 4:3 material and find it works pretty well for us. 

Will add the new TivoHD option whenever it arrives. Unless FIOS gets here first.


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## Dawghows (May 17, 2001)

I'm in the same boat as the OP, looking for a new LCD flatscreen but not ready to switch to HD. Our space needs a 42" but could accommodate some 46" models, and it looks as though there are quite a few worthy candidates in our <$1500 budget.

My question is this: Is the SD quality going to be good enough on these TVs for us to see the puck when we watch ice hockey? If so, we're good to go. Any hockey fans out there that can help me out with this?


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## MrPink (Oct 6, 2003)

I've got a cheap Olevia 32" LCD screen, and the SD results are just awful. I don't really care about HD (I know, but I don't. It's JUST TV, guys) and I bought the set to replace a Sony 27" tube, since the speaker surrounds had rotted out and Sony wants $50 a piece for replacements which will also rot out. The old 27" (4:3 SD picture sizes are roughly the same on the two) Sony looks a few orders of magnitude better.

No matter what I did, the results were badly pixelated, almost as bad as watching a VCD, with horrible de-interlace artifacts.

Well, I searched and searched and searched and FINALLY found a secret setup menu command. Turning off the noise reduction made things much, much better and eliminated the de-interlace motion artifacts. I know a lot of HD sets display SD competently, but this one doesn't. So, since the 27" was useless, my original 25XBR (first Japanese production) is back in the room, and the Olevia has been relegated to the audio room, where it displays the occasional DVD. (sigh).


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## su_A_ve (Feb 3, 2004)

It depends on the quality of the upconverter. Sony/Samsung/Panasonic do an excellent job in upscaling. Other brands not so...

I have an HR20 hooked to a Sony 46" LCD. Even though signal is via HDMI, I do use the native format and let the TV do the upconverting. This allows me to use full/wide mode which stretches the left/right ends of the picture but not the middle. I watch a lot of SD (a Para Todos sub). And is not bad at all.

I had my R10 hooked up before and composite was better than s-video from what I remember...


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## MartyList (Jan 17, 2003)

I agree, it really depends on what you have performing the upconverting/upscaling. I have a Philips DSR704, and recently my 53" rear-projection TV died. I got a brand new 55" LED TV (Samsung UN55B7100), which doesn't have S-Video inputs. Connecting the TiVo directly to the TV through composite or coax looked pretty good, better than the old TV through S-Video. I've read some good reviews on this TV especially for its SD conversion quality.

But then I bought a new HDMI surround receiver with a Faroudja DCDi video up-conversion processor (Denon AVR-2309CI) and the quality is much better. Composite to HDMI looked very good, but S-Video to HDMI looks amazing. I had to tweak the TV settings a little, but I'm very happy with the results.

Make sure you buy good quality cables, don't get ripped off by Monster Cable but get something good like Blue Jeans Cable.


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## Dawghows (May 17, 2001)

To update, we took the plunge and got a Sammy 42" LCD (the 650 model). We've been watching it for roughly a week now, and it's not horrible. It's connected to our A/V receiver via composite, just as the old CRT was -- we just moved the CRT out and plugged the LCD in without changing anything.

Again, we don't have HD. The SD picture is definitely not as crisp as it was on the CRT, but it is perfectly watchable. As someone mentioned above, we do notice some variation in PQ from one channel to another, and sometimes even from one show to another on the same channel. But so far, even the worst PQ has been plenty watchable.

I haven't yet taken the time to monkey around with any picture settings or connection options, so I imagine it can be even better. But even if not, we can easily live with our current PQ until this mythical new HD D*TiVo arrives on the scene.


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## cowboys2002 (Jun 15, 2001)

A few months back, our HR20 died and while waiting for a replacement, I used a spare HDVR2 on our 32 inch 720P set. The picture quality difference was very noticeable to my wife, and she is much less pciky than I am. See 15 months watching 720P and 1080i signals via HDMI trains the eye to notice things!

Unfortunately, until the renewed Directv and Tivo alliance and often mentioned new receiver (or software) comes along, you only choice to for HDTV with Directv is is get one of their current boxes that can display all their broadcasted HD channels.


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