# Make series 3 - single m card



## Videodrome

It would encourage me to buy a series 4 tivo, if my series 3 would be updated to handle a single M card. It would make me believe tivo cares about its, more cash ready customers.


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## deandashl

1st person and 3rd person in two sentences.


There is a work-around.

Put two S-card cablecards in the TiVo and it will work JUST like one M-card.

There you go, TiVo cares.


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## Videodrome

deandashl said:


> 1st person and 3rd person in two sentences.
> 
> There is a work-around.
> 
> Put two S-card cablecards in the TiVo and it will work JUST like one M-card.
> 
> There you go, TiVo cares.


Obvious you don't have a clue. I really don't want to hear your grammar checking. No one in real life acts this way, second did you know there is a cost associated to card use. Lastly if tivo doesn't support its product buyers, there are going loose them.


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## vectorcatch

My understanding is that there it is a physcial hardware issue in not supporting multiple streams on an M-card on an S3. Therefore it can't be fixed through software.


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## jrtroo

Look around the site, my recollection is that the series 3 was produced prior to the M-card standard.

Also, the grammar in the initial post was nearly non-sencikal. hard to read and undrstand what was truyin to be staited.


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## deandashl

Videodrome said:


> Obvious you don't have a clue. I really don't want to hear your grammar checking. No one in real life acts this way, second did you know there is a cost associated to card use. Lastly if tivo doesn't support its product buyers, there are going loose them.


What do them want him to do?

Me would never expect it to upgrade I hardware for free.


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## Videodrome

vectorcatch said:


> My understanding is that there it is a physcial hardware issue in not supporting multiple streams on an M-card on an S3. Therefore it can't be fixed through software.


Thank you for your intelligent, if not perfect answer.


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## ThAbtO

The Original Series 3 does not have support for a single M card, however the HD/XL (S3 model)have that support of 1 M-Card or 2 S-Card for dual tuner function.


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## classicsat

vectorcatch said:


> My understanding is that there it is a physcial hardware issue in not supporting multiple streams on an M-card on an S3. Therefore it can't be fixed through software.


The situation is one or more of three things I heard of:

 The Series 3 is not M-card compatible at all.
 The Series 3 could be M-card compatible, but TiVo and the manufacturer of the respective chip aren't on speaking terms.
 The Series 3 could be M-card compatible, but the manufacturer of the respective chip has gone out of business.


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## MikeAndrews

Videodrome said:


> ...did you know there is a cost associated to card use. Lastly if tivo doesn't support its product buyers, there are going loose them.


Di you know there's no monthly cost whatsoever on my account for either of my two M cards?

Just pick your cableco better.

Or buy a TiVo HD.


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## deandashl

I'm not sure what he would like TiVo to do.

It's a hardware issue. Can't expect TiVo to send a hardware upgrade out.

No one expects a PC maker to upgrade their laptop three years later. Can you blame TiVo for hardware that is out of date but still VERY fully functional?


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## bradleys

I actually agree with the OP on this one. 

When we purchased the S3, it was advertised as being M-Card compatible. We simply had to wait for the cards to become available. When the M-Card did come out it was only available for the HD. 

I have both an S3 and an HD.

I pay $3 a month for each cable card. So this little misdirection costs me $36 a year. Not a fortune, but a tad annoying.

And I doubt that hardware is the issue. A pmci card reader is a pmci card reader - I suspect it is a software driver issue, TIVO just may not have direct control over those components and the update is const prohibitive for them.


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## bradleys

netringer said:


> Di you know there's no monthly cost whatsoever on my account for either of my two M cards?
> 
> Just pick your cableco better.
> 
> Or buy a TiVo HD.


Not all areas have all cablecos. And frankly, I like my fios and will stick with it thank you very much.


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## mikeyts

Prior to release, TiVo Series3 was advertised as supporting a single M-Card. However, they launched the product before the final M-Card spec was issued, so they couldn't test it with shipping M-Cards and when they did, they found that their code for single-M-Card-in-multi-stream-mode didn't work. I recall TiVoPony saying that they did find a solution, but that it was a high risk one that they decline to deploy (in other words, the solution has a high likelihood of causing other problems).

It does suck for people who have high CableCARD lease costs. They range from $0/month to $3/month (I'm not sure if any provider is still leasing them for nothing). They're $1.75/month from the systems here in San Diego (Cox, Time Warner). I have two M-Cards in my Series3--I don't think that any provider is buying S-Cards anymore, since they all need tens of thousands of M-Cards for their own leased boxes.


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## Resist

Videodrome said:


> I really don't want to hear your grammar checking. No one in real life acts this way


Maybe not in your world but mine grammar checking is a proper thing to do. Some people should stay in school.


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## jlb

All your M Card belong to us.


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## deandashl

bradleys said:


> Not all areas have all cablecos. And frankly, I like my fios and will stick with it thank you very much.


As a cable customer, I agree. I like your Fios and will be happy to join.

I'm in the Twin Cities,MN (almost 2 million metro) if anyone from Verizon Fios is watching these things.

Hmmm..... tempting to move in here, Fios? Easy pickings, up here, I swear.


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## Videodrome

Resist said:


> Maybe not in your world but mine grammar checking is a proper thing to do. Some people should stay in school.


Yes and people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. Use the comma much ?


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## MickeS

mikeyts said:


> Prior to release, TiVo Series3 was advertised as supporting a single M-Card. However, they launched the product before the final M-Card spec was issued, so they couldn't test it with shipping M-Cards and when they did, they found that their code for single-M-Card-in-multi-stream-mode didn't work. I recall TiVoPony saying that they did find a solution, but that it was a high risk one that they decline to deploy (in other words, the solution has a high likelihood of causing other problems).


This is how I remember it too.

Bottom line, M-Card for Series 3 is not feasible and will not happen. It sucks for those who like me have a Series 3 and whose cable company charge extra for the second card, and sometimes not just card cost but as a separate "digital outlet". I don't have cable service to my Series 3 anymore, but IIRC it cost me $3 extra too to have a second card. Like someone said above, not a fortune by any means, but annoying.

But, that's how it is and it's not likely to change.


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## lrhorer

jrtroo said:


> Look around the site, my recollection is that the series 3 was produced prior to the M-card standard.


No, it wasn't. It was introduced before M-cards became generally available.


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## mikeyts

lrhorer said:


> No, it wasn't. It was introduced before M-cards became generally available.


Series3 shipped in September 2006, a month after the CCIF 2.0 standard was issued, but to do that they must have been in manufacturing for a couple of months and hardware design frozen before that. It probably would have been several months before anyone shipped actual M-Cards, particularly since there was no actual demand for them before July of 2007, when the FCC's requirement that the cable companies cease purchase of lease equipment with integrated security came into effect. (The cable providers certainly weren't going to stock them to support the handful of Series3s in the field, when the S-Cards they already had would work just fine). TiVo may have had early prototypes to test with before the final standard was issued, but something may have changed between then and the Series3 hardware design freeze.


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## hugenut

mikeyts said:


> It does suck for people who have high CableCARD lease costs. They range from $0/month to $3/month (I'm not sure if any provider is still leasing them for nothing). They're $1.75/month from the systems here in San Diego (Cox, Time Warner). I have two M-Cards in my Series3--I don't think that any provider is buying S-Cards anymore, since they all need tens of thousands of M-Cards for their own leased boxes.


I was thinking of switching to FIOS in Northern Virginia. They just quoted me $3.99 for each card. Man, I am thinking of selling my beloved S3 for the HD version so I could save $48 a year as I would only need one mcard.

This really sucks.


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## lrhorer

Oh, really? If having to shell out an additional $50 a year is the worst thing in your life, then you have a far less troublesome life than anyone I know, certainly far less than mine. I have two S3 TiVos, and I certainly am not thrilled at having to shell out an extra $72 a year ($180 a year total for 3 TiVos) for the privilege of being able to record on two tuners at once, but in the grand scheme of things, it's pretty low on the Richter scale.


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## bluelinex

If you have an S3 & you want to get all of the two way cable programs then you will have to split the in coming cable line & pay for a cable box. Of course that's not for everyone but it works for me. If you do this you may want to put a signal booster on the incoming line to keep the signal strong to the TIVO. Ask your cable company if they will give you one. Radio Shack has a good one for about 29.00 & it has an adjustment on it to raise or lower the incoming signal. This set up costs more & it may not be for everyone but it works really good for me.


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## Resist

Even if the Series 3 supported one M-card, the cable company would charge more for it than the S-card. So where is your savings....that's right there isn't any.

Oh and a signal booster also boosts the noise in the line.


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## mikeyts

Resist said:


> Even if the Series 3 supported one M-card, the cable company would charge more for it than the S-card. So where is your savings....that's right there isn't any.


Not in my experience. On both TWC and Cox systems here in San Diego, a CableCARD leases for the same price, whether it's an S-Card or an M-Card ($1.75/month per card on TWC and $2/month per card on Cox).


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## Resist

mikeyts said:


> On both TWC and Cox systems here in San Diego, a CableCARD leases for the same price, whether it's an S-Card or an M-Card


Lucky you, it's not like that everywhere.


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## lew

AFAIK S card aren't being mfg anymore. The only way you'll get a S card is if your cable system has any in inventory. I guess some systems may hold on to the S cards that are returned when tivo customers swap 2 S cards for 1 M card.

I doubt many cable systems charge more for M cards, although some customers with S cards may be "grandfathered" and weren't subjected to some price increases.



Resist said:


> Even if the Series 3 supported one M-card, the cable company would charge more for it than the S-card. So where is your savings....that's right there isn't any.
> 
> Oh and a signal booster also boosts the noise in the line.





mikeyts said:


> Not in my experience. On both TWC and Cox systems here in San Diego, a CableCARD leases for the same price, whether it's an S-Card or an M-Card ($1.75/month per card on TWC and $2/month per card on Cox).





Resist said:


> Lucky you, it's not like that everywhere.


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## HmeTinkerer

ThAbtO said:


> The Original Series 3 does not have support for a single M card, however the HD/XL (S3 model)have that support of 1 M-Card or 2 S-Card for dual tuner function.


I have an old series 2 Tivo with lifetime service but am moving to an area with FiOS (Verizon). I have a FiOS install scheduled for this Saturday and the HD DVR rental is $20/mo . Each cable card is $3.99/mo. I want to buy a HD Tivo but want to make sure that I only have to lease a single M-type cable card. Does this exist? If so, which Tivo models should I look for? Apologies - this question has probably been asked many times before.


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## WhiskeyTango

HmeTinkerer said:


> I have an old series 2 Tivo with lifetime service but am moving to an area with FiOS (Verizon). I have a FiOS install scheduled for this Saturday and the HD DVR rental is $20/mo . Each cable card is $3.99/mo. I want to buy a HD Tivo but want to make sure that I only have to lease a single M-type cable card. Does this exist? If so, which Tivo models should I look for? Apologies - this question has probably been asked many times before.


Yes a single M-card will work. The M is for Multistream, meaning one card for multiple tuners. The TivoHD, HDXL are the models you should look for.


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