# Series 3 Capacitor burst, how to fix?



## cseamon (Mar 17, 2008)

I opened up my Series 3 (TCD648250B) and see a bursted capacitor, is there a diagram out there that clearly shows what kinds of replacement caps are available? I want to resolder it with a better quality version.

I have very technical resources (friends) who can assist me, if I can provide them with even a little direction first.


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

Have you tried to contact 1 of the repair companies? They may be able to provide you with the part you require. I'm not sure but Weaknees and dvr upgrade may be able to help. I have not seen any repair prints on the net.

I have the same unit but have not opened it as it is under warranty. I'm sure someone here who has can provide you with the numbers from the cap. I assume yours is unreadable?

Robb


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## cseamon (Mar 17, 2008)

I kind of assumed that they would want me to buy a replacement from them, since they don't freely post the list of capacitors to replace. It would be different if they were resources, I think as vendors there has to be something in it for them, no?


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

cseamon said:


> I kind of assumed that they would want me to buy a replacement from them, since they don't freely post the list of capacitors to replace. It would be different if they were resources, I think as vendors there has to be something in it for them, no?


Yes.

But if you get 1 from them then you have the cap and specs. With that you can find a better replacement. That is if they will sell you just the part for do it yourself repair. They may want the unit to do the replacement themselves in which case you would not be interested.

Robb


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## cseamon (Mar 17, 2008)

I'm trying to avoid spending ~$99 on a replacement when I may be able to spend $5 on a capacitor and DIY.


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

I emailed Weaknees and they don't sell the parts so you will have to wait for someone here to chime in with the specs.

Robb


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## cartouchbea (Jan 14, 2009)

I'm not trying to sound antagonistic here, but are you saying the cap is so fubar you can't even read the specs that are printed on it?

If it was a little tiny bomb in your TiVo, I'd be concerned about collateral damage.


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## donnoh (Mar 7, 2008)

cartouchbea said:


> I'm not trying to sound antagonistic here, but are you saying the cap is so fubar you can't even read the specs that are printed on it?
> 
> If it was a little tiny bomb in your TiVo, I'd be concerned about collateral damage.


If it was an electrolytic cap on the power supply I wouldn't be too concerned, their pretty unforgiving as far as a replacement. If it was on the mother board there's a good chance that some other component failed and the cap was a result not the cause.


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## Robbdoe1 (Dec 29, 2008)

donnoh said:


> If it was on the mother board there's a good chance that some other component failed and the cap was a result not the cause.


I agree with you. A cap blowing on the MOBO was probably the end result and will rarely be the cause.

I have been looking into Tivo service manuals today after this post and see very little info on the net. They must provide something to affiliated repair companies. Any one have any insight into this?

Robb


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

cseamon said:


> I opened up my Series 3 (TCD648250B) and see a bursted capacitor, is there a diagram out there that clearly shows what kinds of replacement caps are available? I want to resolder it with a better quality version.
> 
> I have very technical resources (friends) who can assist me, if I can provide them with even a little direction first.


Purchase the least cost Series 3 on E-Bay and use it for parts, changing out the total PS is easy.


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## robomeister (Feb 4, 2005)

This is not good news, yet another piece of electronics with bad caps. But replacing them is fairly easy, if you have the right equipment and/or technical friends.

The specs for the capacitor should be written on the side of the capacitor. Usually in micro farads (uf) and volts. Ask your technical friends to read it, they should be able to tell you the right specs. Finding a compatible cap should be a piece of cake. I have found replacement caps on ebay to fix some bad power supplies.

Just out of curiosity, where is the blown cap? Is it on the power supply or the motherboard? Also, which model TiVo is it specifically? the Series3 (TCD648) or the TiVoHD (TCD652), or the TiVoHD XL (TCD658)? I might have to take a look at mine to see if anything bad is happening.

robomeister


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## cseamon (Mar 17, 2008)

Model TCD648250B
Power Supply is CP1104 
P/N 3BS01002144GP

The popped cap is at location C701, and it has this information on it:
CapXon
2200uF 25v
KF 105(degrees) C
C636 Vent

Al other caps look good, but this one has not only bulged but there is dried orange powder on the top. 

I was going to get one from Weaknees, and was tossing around the idea of getting a completey new Tivo, but feel confident that replacing this capacitor with a higher quality one will be of far better value.


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## Runch Machine (Feb 7, 2002)

OK so what you need is a 2200uF 25Volt capacitor. The link below brings you to an on line company that sells them for $1.69 each. http://www.weisd.com/store2/NTENEV2200M25FH-B.php

You can also check Ebay or other on line sellers. This is a very common part and very easy to get. I don't know what city you are in but you should also be able to pick one up locally at a TV repair shop. I don't know if Radio Shack still carries these kinds of parts but it may be worth dropping into one and checking it out.

The important part is the 2200uF. If you get one that is good for 25 to 100 volts it will work the same. In other words if Radio Shack or the TV repair shop has one that is 2200uF 35 Volts, it is functionally the same. However the higher the voltage, the bigger the capacitor is and it may not fit in the space you have for it.

I don't know what you mean by getting a "higher quality one". You need one that meets the specifications.

I am curious, is your Tivo not working? If it is, then I would not worry about the capacitor. You could do more damage by trying to have someone remove it and replace it.


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## cseamon (Mar 17, 2008)

The item suggested has a lower degree - says it's good to 85 degrees, instead of the 105 that the current one is good for.

What I mean by higher quality is one that has a longer expected life. From what I've read the original one is "rated" for 2000 hours.

My Tivo runs, but each day it reboots more frequently. It's been happening for about 3-4 weeks now. When I originally purchased it I upgraded the HDD to a 750GB, which now has errors and I'm getting replaced under WD warranty. I've purchased a new WD AV series drive to copy the original 250GB drive to, and while I'll lose all of my recordings and season passes, I was able to get into the menus and write everything down so that once I fix the PS, and use WinMfS to copy the original drive over I should be good for another 3+ years (maybe longer I get a better capacitor here.

I'll check out Radio Shack as well, but if any one else has any suggestions they would be appreciated My drive arrives on Thursday, and I figure as long as I get the capacitor ordered by Tuesday I should have it by ten weekend to resolve everything.


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## Worf (Sep 15, 2000)

Find one rated to higher temperatures - TiVos do run hot and although you'll pay more, you don't want them to prematurely die.

To assist what you really need is a 2200uF electrolytic capacitor. Its voltage must be 25V or more (e.g., a 50V one will work fine, but a 12V one will NOT). And you should get one with a temperature rating of at least 105C as that's what your old one was, otherwise you might find the life of your fix prematurely shortened.

If necessary, look into MIL-SPEC temperature range caps. They won't cost too much more. 85C sounds to be industrial temperature range, but MIL-SPEC ought to be at least 105C. Considering the TiVo's run at least 40-50C, the capacitor can be running 10C+ above that, so a bigger margin will make it last longer.


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## Mars Rocket (Mar 24, 2000)

Capacitors don't blow up when they reach their end of life - they just lose capacitance. And the lifetime rating is usually for the upper end of the temp spectrum they're good at, and increases if you run it cooler.

That being said, I've never even considered the lifetime spec for a capacitor. As long as it meets the temp and voltage requirements it should last for longer than you'll want to run the TiVo.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

Mars Rocket said:


> Capacitors don't blow up when they reach their end of life - they just lose capacitance. And the lifetime rating is usually for the upper end of the temp spectrum they're good at, and increases if you run it cooler.
> 
> That being said, I've never even considered the lifetime spec for a capacitor. As long as it meets the temp and voltage requirements it should last for longer than you'll want to run the TiVo.


Capacitors have no lifetime spec that i know of, they are used as a battery in some applications (my watch uses one). With 8,700 hours in a year a 2,000 hour cap. would be ridiculous.


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## Phantom Gremlin (Jun 20, 2002)

This company has some info about cap replacements.

Here's another site I found with a quick google.

Plenty of bad caps out there, it's been an ongoing problem for years. Wikipedia has a lot of info about the history of the problem.


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## Worf (Sep 15, 2000)

lessd said:


> Capacitors have no lifetime spec that i know of, they are used as a battery in some applications (my watch uses one). With 8,700 hours in a year a 2,000 hour cap. would be ridiculous.


What happens is it's 2,000 hours at their rated temperature. Drop it 10C and it doubles, roughly. So for one year, you need to run it about 30C lower than max temp (75C if using a 105C cap) which gets you 16,000 hours.


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## mr.unnatural (Feb 2, 2006)

Just get a 2200uf electrolytic capacitor rated at 25 volts or higher. There's nothing magical or mysterious about it. Check out online sources like Mouser or Digi-Key and you'll find a lot of choices. You'll spend more in shipping than what the capacitor costs. If you have a local electronics distributor then check with one of them. Radio Shack used to sell components but I believe they have tailed off on that over the past few years. Still, you might check one out and see if they still carry them.

Unsolder the old capacitor and solder in the new one, making sure you have the polarity oriented prioperly (it's marked on the side of the capacitor shell). Use some desoldering wick to suck out the old solder from the terminals as you heat it up. Be careful not to apply too much heat or the solder pad may detach itself from the board. Reinstall the new capacitor with the leads orinted properly and solder them to the pads on the board. Clip off the excess lead and you're done. That's all there is to it.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

Worf said:


> What happens is it's 2,000 hours at their rated temperature. Drop it 10C and it doubles, roughly. So for one year, you need to run it about 30C lower than max temp (75C if using a 105C cap) which gets you 16,000 hours.


That is only two years, I have had TiVos running over 5 years without any Cap problems, if cap lasted only two or three years TiVo and other electronics would be giving people many problems, even Hard Drives have 3 years warranties on them and many run 24/7 and have caps on the circuit board.
All audio amps of any price have big cap and many people (with high end audio equipment) run them 24/7 to keep them in balance, I have a high end amp (no tubes so not that high end) and I was told to keep the amps running 24/7 as they don't use much power when no audio is going through them, its been 13 years now, no problems.
Caps don't have lifetime spec., some caps may go bad but most will last many years.


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## Sapphire (Sep 10, 2002)

That capacitor is a fairly common value. You could probably even find it at radioshack.


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## drl67 (Aug 30, 2004)

Make sure the ESR of the cap is low. Just walking into radio shack might get you a 2200uf cap with an adequate voltage, but if the ESR is high it will likely fail pretty quick.


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## ehardman (Feb 18, 2004)

Although you can replace the cap with one that has a higher voltage rating, it likely could be larger and have leads that won't fit on the existing circuit board.

Radio Shack is very unlikely to have the capicator. Try the link above or DigiKey.com. DigiKey customer service will help you order the right one.


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## lwong (Mar 1, 2001)

I was able to get the capacitor from the will-call counter at Jameco in Belmont, CA. Only $0.65!

https://www.jameco.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Product_10001_10001_2146417_-1

It was a little bigger than the original but it fit without any problem.

Unfortunately, it did not solve my screen freezing. After replacing the hard drive and replacing the bulging capacitor, my problem was solved by replacing a bad HDMI cable! Argh! But, a happy ending.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

Worf said:


> They won't cost too much more. 85C sounds to be industrial temperature range, but MIL-SPEC ought to be at least 105C. Considering the TiVo's run at least 40-50C, the capacitor can be running 10C+ above that, so a bigger margin will make it last longer.


A capacitor should never be hotter than ambient temperature, and most certainly not by 10C.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

lrhorer said:


> A capacitor should never be hotter than ambient temperature, and most certainly not by 10C.


That would be why getting a low ESR (Equivalent Series Resistance) cap is important. The higher the ESR, the more heat is dissipated in the cap.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

dlfl said:


> That would be why getting a low ESR (Equivalent Series Resistance) cap is important. The higher the ESR, the more heat is dissipated in the cap.


True, but even a high ESR cap should not be carrying much in the way of current when used as a power supply filter. 'Not enough to heat it significantly, anyway. A high ESR will most definitely increase the ripple voltage, but it shouldn't produce a noticeable rise in temperature.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

lrhorer said:


> True, but even a high ESR cap should not be carrying much in the way of current when used as a power supply filter. 'Not enough to heat it significantly, anyway. A high ESR will most definitely increase the ripple voltage, but it shouldn't produce a noticeable rise in temperature.


Hmmm.... a lot of qualitative terms here, but you may be right. Maybe the reason to get low ESR caps is really just that they tend to be the premium types and should thus be less likely to degrade. The cost difference is so miniscule compared to the cost of a power supply that I would say "why not go premium?".


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

dlfl said:


> Hmmm.... a lot of qualitative terms here, but you may be right. Maybe the reason to get low ESR caps is really just that they tend to be the premium types and should thus be less likely to degrade. The cost difference is so miniscule compared to the cost of a power supply that I would say "why not go premium?".


The reason to use low ESR caps in a switching power supply is that it's a switching power supply.

Seriously, switching supplies switch at high frequencies and filtering that high frequency ripple is rough on a cap and the higher the ESR the more heat will be generated inside it.

Here's an old (1994) but interesting article on switch-mode supply repair:

http://www.mikesarcade.com/cgi-bin/spies.cgi?action=url&type=info&page=psrepair.txt


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

dlfl said:


> Hmmm.... a lot of qualitative terms here, but you may be right. Maybe the reason to get low ESR caps is really just that they tend to be the premium types and should thus be less likely to degrade. The cost difference is so miniscule compared to the cost of a power supply that I would say "why not go premium?".


No, the main reason is they provide for lower ripple at a given output current.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

unitron said:


> The reason to use low ESR caps in a switching power supply is that it's a switching power supply.
> 
> Seriously, switching supplies switch at high frequencies and filtering that high frequency ripple is rough on a cap


Not really, depending on what you mean by "rough". The higher the frequency of the ripple, the lower the current the cap has to deliver. Look at what's happening with a filter capacitor. As the DC power source supplies current, the voltage on the supply rails starts to increase. This dumps current into the capacitor, limited by either the ESR or the supply impedance. The rate at which the capacitor charges is set by the RC time constant, where R is either the ESR or the supply impedance - whichever is larger - and C is the size of the capacitor. At some point, the power supply input voltage falls below the supply rail voltage, and stops supplying current. At that point, the rail voltage starts to drop, and the capacitor supplies all the current to the load until such time as the supply input voltage rises above the rail voltage and once again the supply starts charging the capacitor. The longer the time period between when the supply shuts off and the time it starts delivering current again, the more charge is drawn from the cap during the discharge cycle and consequently the more charge it takes to fill the cap up again. The lower the frequency of the input switch, the more current with which the cap has to contend.



dlfl said:


> and the higher the ESR the more heat will be generated inside it.


This is true, but it is not true it increases with higher switching speeds. The cap becomes less efficient at higher switching speeds, allowing more ripple. It doesn't really dissipate more heat. In fact it tends to dissipate less heat, although the effect is a second order one.



dlfl said:


> Here's an old (1994) but interesting article on switch-mode supply repair:
> 
> http://www.mikesarcade.com/cgi-bin/spies.cgi?action=url&type=info&page=psrepair.txt


There are a number of inaccuracies in that link, but overall it's pretty good. In particular, his experience seems to be limited to computer switching supplies. There are a great many other supply designs out there that are quite different from those typically employed by computer supplies. Note one major issue with his treatise is that lower ESR caps may tend to cause the switching supply transistors to fail *SOONER*, rather than later. A low ESR cap will pull a much greater current from the supply transistor than a high ESR cap. Remember that RC time constant? The lower the resistance, the higher the current.


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## Khaos13 (Dec 25, 2011)

Hello thread! I am needing some help! I have a Tivo series 3 that is stuck in the "loop" as is discussed on lots of threads on this forum. I popped open my box and replaced the obviously bulging 2200uf25v located at C701. I put everything back together and really thought that I had fixed the problem but there was no change when I hooked back up the TIVO it continued in the "loop" as it had before. No other Capacitors are visibly bulging but many are obviously the known bad CapXon capacitors. Should I just replace all of the CapXon capacitors? Something else? or just replace the entire power supply? Obviously I would rather replace pieces rather than the entire thing but am stuck! Please help! Thanks in advance!


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

Khaos13 said:


> Hello thread! I am needing some help! I have a Tivo series 3 that is stuck in the "loop" as is discussed on lots of threads on this forum. I popped open my box and replaced the obviously bulging 2200uf25v located at C701. I put everything back together and really thought that I had fixed the problem but there was no change when I hooked back up the TIVO it continued in the "loop" as it had before. No other Capacitors are visibly bulging but many are obviously the known bad CapXon capacitors. Should I just replace all of the CapXon capacitors? Something else? or just replace the entire power supply? Obviously I would rather replace pieces rather than the entire thing but am stuck! Please help! Thanks in advance!


I assume you got the polarity right on that replacement cap?

Look on the bottom of the supply.

The negative lead of the cap should have gone into a hole in the same area of copper that the black wires to the hard drive and motherboard do. In other words, they're electrically connected.

The positive lead went into a different copper "land", along with, if memory serves, one end of a coil of wire, either the red or the yellow wires going to the drive and mobo, and the positive lead of another capacitor whose negative lead goes to ground (black wires).

That means it's in electrical parallel with the cap you replaced, had to do double duty while the bad one was in there, and should be replaced on GP.

If you have convenient access to good brand Low ESR high temp capacitors at reasonable prices, it wouldn't be the worst idea in the world to go ahead and swap out everything except the big fat one on the incoming AC side.

There's more than one possible explanation for looping, but this will eliminate one of them.

You might also try the image begging thread for your particular model and borrow a hard drive somewhere to restore it to long enough to see if that boots up.


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## Runch Machine (Feb 7, 2002)

I really doubt your problem is caused by bad capacitors. Playing If in Doubt Rip It Out, is not a worthwhile way to find the problem. It's very likely it's something else. I'd send it in for repair if the disk repair suggested doesn't work. Weaknees can help you.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

Runch Machine said:


> I really doubt your problem is caused by bad capacitors. Playing If in Doubt Rip It Out, is not a worthwhile way to find the problem. It's very likely it's something else. I'd send it in for repair if the disk repair suggested doesn't work. Weaknees can help you.


To which of the 2 posters who already said they replaced one bulging capacitor so far are you replying with the opinion that their problems aren't caused by capacitors?


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

Khaos13 said:


> Hello thread! I am needing some help! I have a Tivo series 3 that is stuck in the "loop" as is discussed on lots of threads on this forum. I popped open my box and replaced the obviously bulging 2200uf25v located at C701. I put everything back together and really thought that I had fixed the problem but there was no change when I hooked back up the TIVO it continued in the "loop" as it had before. No other Capacitors are visibly bulging but many are obviously the known bad CapXon capacitors. Should I just replace all of the CapXon capacitors? Something else? or just replace the entire power supply? Obviously I would rather replace pieces rather than the entire thing but am stuck! Please help! Thanks in advance!


I would think that it is possible that when that one capacitor went bad, it affected the other capacitors that are part of the same circuit, even if they show no signs of stress.
I would also think it is possible that the capacitor going bad caused corruption to the data on the hard drive that prevents the Tivo from booting up.

What I would try to do first is get a clean image of the Tivo software from the image thread and load it onto a known good hard drive and see if the Tivo boots up.
If it does, you're good to go, but keep in mind that the power supply may have been weakened by that capacitor failure.
If it does not boot up, you can try replacing the other capacitors on the power supply, but that is not a guarantee.
It would help if you had a known good power supply to swap out for testing purposes.


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## Resist (Dec 21, 2003)

I know this is an old thread but I'm having the same problem. My OLED Tivo starting rebooting a lot. I found that the 2200 uf 25V capacitor was slightly bulged. I removed it and went to Radio Shack hoping to find a replacement, but they didn't carry it. Now I'm trying to find a good source for this part locally and am not having much luck. Guess I have to order it online and end up waiting a week or longer to get the part. Can anyone suggest a good online seller?


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## HomieG (Feb 17, 2003)

Resist said:


> I know this is an old thread but I'm having the same problem. My OLED Tivo starting rebooting a lot. I found that the 2200 uf 25V capacitor was slightly bulged. I removed it and went to Radio Shack hoping to find a replacement, but they didn't carry it. Now I'm trying to find a good source for this part locally and am not having much luck. Guess I have to order it online and end up waiting a week or longer to get the part. Can anyone suggest a good online seller?


Digi-Key or Mouser.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

HomieG said:


> Digi-Key or Mouser.


believe it or not, Amazon can occasionally have them too, bought my last 2 for the S3 PS fix and it cost me under $10 with shipping and both vendors were Prime available.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

Resist said:


> I know this is an old thread but I'm having the same problem. My OLED Tivo starting rebooting a lot. I found that the 2200 uf 25V capacitor was slightly bulged. I removed it and went to Radio Shack hoping to find a replacement, but they didn't carry it. Now I'm trying to find a good source for this part locally and am not having much luck. Guess I have to order it online and end up waiting a week or longer to get the part. Can anyone suggest a good online seller?


Is there another capacitor of the same uF and Voltage rating right next to where that one was?


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## Phantom Gremlin (Jun 20, 2002)

Resist said:


> Can anyone suggest a good online seller?


People have already mentioned Digi-Key, which has been a reliable mail order source for at least four decades.

I also wanted to point out the badcaps.net site. I'm far too lazy to see if they have any TiVo specific discussions in their forums, but they might.

You seem willing and able to fix your own supply, but for those w/o soldering irons, that guy at badcaps might repair random power supplies (such as for TiVos).


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## Resist (Dec 21, 2003)

I ordered a replacement on Amazon, but today I found one locally for $2. It's shorter and fatter but still has the same specs and fits in the space. I soldered it in and so far my Tivo has been working fine without any reboots. But it's only been around 30 minutes, so we shall see how it goes.


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