# Software version 11.0c



## seattlewendell (Jan 11, 2006)

I just got software version 11.0c
The only difference I notice so far is when I pause a show, Tivo gives me a "do I want more information about show X" pop-up.
Anyone else notice anything new?


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

So they finally brought that horrible misfeature over from the Series 2? Ugh. I was hoping we might be spared.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

I can't believe they would bring that nearly universally lambasted crappy "feature" over to the S3. I didn't think they would be that stupid.


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## Dssturbo1 (Feb 23, 2005)

Just got 11.0c on one of my S3s. sorry, haven't seen anything new to report.

besides hopefully fixing some bugs they also need to push an update to the Tivo HD and HD XL models for compatability with the new 1Gb My DVR expander. seems one tc member already got one delivered from amazon before it was supposed to be released.


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## danjw1 (Sep 13, 2005)

wmcbrine said:


> So they finally brought that horrible misfeature over from the Series 2? Ugh. I was hoping we might be spared.


Why is this so bad? I just tried it to check it out. If I pause a show, I get a bar above the bar that tells me how far I am into the program, that offers me the choice to see more information on the show. I don't see anything egregious about this. If you select it, it takes you into the page you would get from a swivel search for that show. As soon as I press play, the bar goes away. So, I have to say I don't know why people would mind this so much. I actually think this could be nice, say I see an actor/actress I recognize and can't quite figure out who it is(or can't quite come up with the name), I can pause and look at a cast list. And quickly get back to the show. I just don't see why anyone would feel particularly put off by this feature?


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

It's just more $h1t on the screen that doesn't need to be there.

If I want more information about a show I'm watching, I know where to go without the additional ''help''.


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## nrc (Nov 17, 1999)

danjw1 said:


> Why is this so bad? I just tried it to check it out. If I pause a show, I get a bar above the bar that tells me how far I am into the program, that offers me the choice to see more information on the show.


 I like the idea in general, but they could have just put a text blurb under the status bar to press whatever for program info. The real reason for the way the pause banner has been made so obtrusive is to provide a place for ads during pause.

No, it's not the end of the world, it's just one more bit of flotsam cluttering up TiVo's once elegant interface.


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## realityboy (Jun 13, 2003)

I'm not a fan of that feature either. I hope this solves my problems with suggestions though since that has been ongoing for a bit.

In the past month or so, I've also had issues with a frozen screen/reboot when trying to transfer a show. It has happened twice, and both times it was repeatable with those 2 shows. Every time I tried that particular show it would freeze, but other shows transferred successfully.


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## sbourgeo (Nov 10, 2000)

I can live with the popup as long as this finally fixes the disappearing analog channels problem.


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## MichaelK (Jan 10, 2002)

danjw1 said:


> Why is this so bad? I just tried it to check it out. If I pause a show, I get a bar above the bar that tells me how far I am into the program, that offers me the choice to see more information on the show. I don't see anything egregious about this. If you select it, it takes you into the page you would get from a swivel search for that show. As soon as I press play, the bar goes away. So, I have to say I don't know why people would mind this so much. I actually think this could be nice, say I see an actor/actress I recognize and can't quite figure out who it is(or can't quite come up with the name), I can pause and look at a cast list. And quickly get back to the show. I just don't see why anyone would feel particularly put off by this feature?


some people just dont like change.

it's part of human nature for some.

that an reminiscing about how things were better way back when.

"when i was a kid we walked UPHILL both ways to school 20 miles in the snow 2 feet deep and we were better for it...."

Other people have a legitimate dislike.

But honestly I think many just complain as a knee-jerk reaction without seeing the new things. Witness all the threads here with people complaining about new features that aren't released or that the individual poster has never even seen.

Others have some other complaint with TiVo so they lash out at everything irrationally. Those posts usually say something like - 'great more time wasted on stupid new features when my box totally is unstable'- as if Tivo made a conscious decision to ignore the bug that poor person has and instead spend their man hours on something else- like it is a black and white either or situation.

I'll try it out and if it sucks I guess I'll just teach my harmony remote to send a pause and then clear every time I press the pause button and then it's not an issue. So far the execution on all this linking and searching leaves something to be desired in my humble opinion. There have been a few times I wanted to dig for something like that and more than once I wasn't pleased how cumbersome it was. Maybe this helps move the overall search and linking concept along the path to being useful. Time will tell


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

MichaelK said:


> ....
> But honestly I think many just complain as a knee-jerk reaction without seeing the new things. Witness all the threads here with people complaining about new features that aren't released or that the individual poster has never even seen.
> 
> .


Most if not all who are complaining here have already been seeing this "feature" on our S2 machines for months now. It s.cks!


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## dwgsp (Aug 28, 2005)

Besides the "want more info?" bar, has anyone noticed any other changes with this new firmware?


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## JohnBrowning (Jul 15, 2004)

"Clear" clears the banner and the progress bar. "Down" on the circular navigator clears the 'about' for the remainder of the program.


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

JohnBrowning said:


> clears the 'about' for the remainder of the program.


That's the key point. You can clear it for one recording, but it will reappear on the next one. You're stuck with it; there is no way disable it permanently if you don't like it.

As of the 11.0c update, cable and satellite DVRs now have a superior pause function.


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## MichaelK (Jan 10, 2002)

RoyK said:


> Most if not all who are complaining here have already been seeing this "feature" on our S2 machines for months now. It s.cks!


in this particular thread- sure maybe all the people complaining do in fact really not like it.

doesn't change the fact that people just ***** for fun many times....


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## moxie1617 (Jan 5, 2004)

Really don't like this.:down: This feature sucks.


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

Previous advertisements were never intrusive. You didn't have to navigate around them, they didn't require any additional remote clicks to avoid. They didn't affect the way you used the DVR at all.

This is different. This degrades the pause function. For the first time, extra navigation is required to avoid this menu (which may or may not have an ad). Yes, it's only once per recording, but that's once more per recording than other DVRs. There's no way to turn it off, permanently, if you don't like it.

Please call TiVo @ 877-367-8486 to tell them how much you like this feature.


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## Shawn95GT (Oct 7, 2005)

I'll have to check my tivoHD to see if it got this. I came up to it froze at 'almost there, please wait' last night.


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## moxie1617 (Jan 5, 2004)

bkdtv said:


> Previous advertisements were never intrusive. You didn't have to navigate around them, they didn't require any additional remote clicks to avoid. They didn't affect the way you used the DVR at all.
> 
> This is different. This degrades the pause function. For the first time, extra navigation is required to avoid this menu (which may or may not have an ad). Yes, it's only once per recording, but that's once more per recording than other DVRs. There's no way to turn it off, permanently, if you don't like it.
> 
> Please call TiVo @ 877-367-8486 to tell them how much you like this feature.


Made the call. Hope others who don't like the feature do the same.


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## spocko (Feb 4, 2009)

Anyone have a photo of this new "feature"? 

I'll say straight up that I haven't seen it yet, but it sure sounds like a bad idea. Usually when I press pause, it's because I want to see the image on the screen. I don't want it covered up. If I want more info about a program, there's a button that coincidentally happens to be labeled "Info" which would suit that purpose nicely.


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## Dennis Wilkinson (Sep 24, 2001)

spocko said:


> Anyone have a photo of this new "feature"?
> 
> I'll say straight up that I haven't seen it yet, but it sure sounds like a bad idea. Usually when I press pause, it's because I want to see the image on the screen. I don't want it covered up. If I want more info about a program, there's a button that coincidentally happens to be labeled "Info" which would suit that purpose nicely.


If it works like it does on the Series 2 units, just press clear and you can still see the image on the screen.


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## petew (Jul 31, 2003)

Dssturbo1 said:


> they also need to push an update to the Tivo HD and HD XL models for compatability with the new *1Gb* My DVR expander. .


Wow an extra 12 minutes of HD  But yes adding 1Tb in a Tivo supported manner would be nice.


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## elwaylite (Apr 23, 2006)

My Tivo doesnt have it yet, my router crapped out yesterday am and I just fired it back up. Tried dialing in 5 times, hasnt seen the update. Guess I have to wait


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## jeepguy_1980 (Mar 2, 2008)

I'm wondering why my TiVo isn't getting any of these features.

I have yet to get an ad when I pause it and now I'm not getting this more information feature.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

moxie1617 said:


> Really don't like this.:down: This feature sucks.


I think your user name explains a lot.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

spocko said:


> Usually when I press pause, it's because I want to see the image on the screen. I don't want it covered up.


Yep, that's exactly what's so annoying about it. Also that it comes up for all programs, even when there's actually no extra info to be had.


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## elwaylite (Apr 23, 2006)

Is this a staggered rollout? Just wondering why I cant force.


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## nrc (Nov 17, 1999)

elwaylite said:


> Is this a staggered rollout? Just wondering why I cant force.


They almost always stagger roll-outs for the first few weeks.


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## CuriousMark (Jan 13, 2005)

Dennis Wilkinson said:


> If it works like it does on the Series 2 units, just press clear and you can still see the image on the screen.


Or you can do a frame advance, which is an easier move on the remote. You would have had to do either a clear or frame advance to remove the progress bar to read text on the screen, so for those situations the navigation requirement is the same. We have had this "feature" on our S2s now for months and pretty much just gotten used to it. Still, I do find it mildly annoying at times.


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## danjw1 (Sep 13, 2005)

Call support and ask to get put on the priority list. You will usually get an update in about 48 hours if you do this.


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## elwaylite (Apr 23, 2006)

nrc said:


> They almost always stagger roll-outs for the first few weeks.


K, thanks.


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## Alcatraz (Nov 22, 2000)

danjw1 said:


> Call support and ask to get put on the priority list. You will usually get an update in about 48 hours if you do this.


Their series 3 rollouts usually don't have a priority list because it happens pretty quickly once the initial evaluation period is over.


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## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

spocko said:


> Usually when I press pause, it's because I want to see the image on the screen. I don't want it covered up.


Hit the "Down" button and it goes away for that show.

And really, usually when you pause it's to see the image on screen? The vast majority of time that I pause, it's because I'm leaving the room or take a pause in watching. I would think this is what most people usually use pause for.

Very rarely have I been affected by this "feature", even though I don't think it's particularly useful for me.

Other than that, I haven't found any new functionality in this update. I'm just happy that it didn't brick my TiVo like the last update did (or if it was the one before that).


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

MickeS said:


> And really, usually when you pause it's to see the image on screen? The vast majority of time that I pause, it's because I'm leaving the room or take a pause in watching. I would think this is what most people usually use pause for


Different people use pause differently. The overwhelming majority of my "pausing" is done to either see something in a scene, or discuss it with others.


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## rwross (Jan 3, 2005)

Are there any formal release notes for 11c and, if so, where might they be found?

Main reason I'm asking is to see if 11c lists a fix for analog tuners going out intermittently.

thanks...
rwr


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## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

bkdtv said:


> Different people use pause differently. The overwhelming majority of my "pausing" is done to either see something in a scene, or discuss it with others.


Well, discussing a scene with others isn't affected by this graphic, so that leaves looking for something in a scene, which would be affected once per episode if you click the down arrow.

This might be annoying, but the reality is that very few people will actually be affected by it. That, of course, doesn't mean that they don't perceive it to be much more annoying anyway, no matter if it's extra work for them or not.

I guess we'll see what happens.


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## wmcbrine (Aug 2, 2003)

rwross said:


> Are there any formal release notes for 11c and, if so, where might they be found?


Not for that version, nor any other. This is apparently official TiVo policy, according to their representatives here. Don't get me started on that.


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

It would be nice to know if this is supposed to fix the analog tuner issue (gray screen) that my brother has seen twice now on his HD. I haven't had any issues with my 2 S3's but we also primarily record digital channels (cablecards).

Scott


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## T_RJ (Oct 15, 2001)

More junk on the screen


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## danjw1 (Sep 13, 2005)

I called Tivo support, when I first saw the update and had looked here do see if there were any details on what was in the update. The CSR I talked to went put me on hold for a while and then came back to tell me that the only thing in the update was the pause thing. I then asked about the 1TB DVR Expander issue, she didn't bother to go ask anyone else about it, just asserted that, that wouldn't been in there. She was surprised in hearing that people were having problems with a new DVR Expander that was 1TB, I don't think she knew these even existed. I wouldn't read too much into this, it may well be in there. Since Tivo doesn't issue Release Notes on the software updates to the Tivo, its unlikely they would brief the CSRs on all the bug fixes in any particular release.


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## MichaelK (Jan 10, 2002)

spocko said:


> ... Usually when I press pause, it's because I want to see the image on the screen. I don't want it covered up. ....


a good portion of the time i am pausing to see whats on the screen. But a good portion of those times the pause bar is on the info i want to see anyway so I have to press the clear already much of the time anyway.

not trying to justify it, but i personally dont see it as the straw that broke the camels back. It's just another in the pile of straws that so far I, personally, am willing to put up with so far.

I do see how some people already at their breaking point might be pushed over the top.


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## T_RJ (Oct 15, 2001)

Analog channels freeze / stop working with out changing to a digital channel.
This is an ongoing issue and still happening with this version SW release.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

bkdtv provides the ultimate answer to the problem in this post in AVS Forum. Pity that it doesn't survive reboots.


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## seattlewendell (Jan 11, 2006)

danjw1 said:


> I called Tivo support, when I first saw the update and had looked here do see if there were any details on what was in the update. The CSR I talked to went put me on hold for a while and then came back to tell me that the only thing in the update was the pause thing. I then asked about the 1TB DVR Expander issue, she didn't bother to go ask anyone else about it, just asserted that, that wouldn't been in there. She was surprised in hearing that people were having problems with a new DVR Expander that was 1TB, I don't think she knew these even existed. I wouldn't read too much into this, it may well be in there. Since Tivo doesn't issue Release Notes on the software updates to the Tivo, its unlikely they would brief the CSRs on all the bug fixes in any particular release.


Sounds just like Tivo to me. They spend money time and resources to give you new "features" no one wanted in the first place instead of fixing the things that are wrong with the fundamental parts of the DVR. Like making the damn extenders work so we can record more stuff. You know...record...the thing we pay money for. Unbelievable.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

seattlewendell said:


> Sounds just like Tivo to me. They spend money time and resources to give you new "features" no one wanted in the first place instead of fixing the things that are wrong with the fundamental parts of the DVR. Like making the damn extenders work so we can record more stuff. You know...record...the thing we pay money for. Unbelievable.


Then why don't you just get rid of your TiVo....sounds like it causes you high blood pressure anyhow...


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

bkdtv said:


> Different people use pause differently. The overwhelming majority of my "pausing" is done to either see something in a scene, or discuss it with others.


Exactly!
I'm over in MickeS's camp, I pause when I'm going to leave the room so I don't miss anything, pausing to examine a scene for me is a rarity.

I'm sure there are as many different ways and reasons we use pause as there are TCF members. I'm glad we're having this discussion as a whole, but it doesn't affect my viewing that much, but I can see how others might be quite annoyed.

Diane


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## Chris Grant (Oct 3, 2001)

bkdtv said:


> Different people use pause differently.


So true! I often pause when I get a phone call or need to leave the room for a few minutes. But I also use pause to examine the picture. For example, I like to read "the rest of the story" on Jay Leno's Monday night "Headlines". And sometimes I just want to catch some detail in the picture. In these cases I hit the right arrow to remove the progress bar (advances one frame).

I don't know if the behavior is changed as I am still on 11.0b, but I sure hope whatever TiVo dumps on the pause screen can be cleared!


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## rhoelzer (Jan 3, 2004)

I'm only posting to reinforce the positive side. We all know most people don't post when something is OK, just when they have a problem.

Having a problem with this is truly ridiculous. There's no realistic issue with this that isn't solved by the clear or frame advance button. The people that say they want to look at the screen either have to wait for the progress bar to time out or hit a button to see the whole screen anyway.

Let's hear from some more people that aren't bothered by it.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

for me - this passes the not doing anything different with the remote test with flying colors.

If I pause to do something else then I could care less about the banner and hit play when ready to roll again.

If I pause to see something then I have always either hit clear or frame advance to remove the status bar and the pause ad goes with it.

Now since there are few ads then when I want to know something about the show I hit pause and select the "know more about" and get right to where I wanted to go - versus backing out of the show to get to the info.

so this one seems like much ado about nothing to me. YMWV


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## visionary (May 31, 2006)

As long as it goes away with a frame advance, I have no issue either. I am usually taking pictures when I pause, so having a clean screen is important. I am still waiting for a good frame capture program for HD like I have for SD, meanwhile I just do photos off the screen, and they come out pretty good.


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## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

visionary said:


> I am still waiting for a good frame capture program for HD like I have for SD, meanwhile I just do photos off the screen, and they come out pretty good.


Get a slingbox...










I don't have the HD slingbox as you can probably tell.


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## seattlewendell (Jan 11, 2006)

Bierboy said:


> Then why don't you just get rid of your TiVo....sounds like it causes you high blood pressure anyhow...


I'm working on that.....


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## yunlin12 (Mar 15, 2003)

I have the new 11.0c on my S3, but not on the HD yet. It doesn't bother me much. I'm in the same camp as a few of the posters above, if I pause to do something else, I couldn't care less what stuff Tivo puts on the screen. If I pause to look at details, I'm usually using frame advance to kill the progress bar and get to the correct frame anyway, and that gets rid of the message along with the progress bar. So this new message feature really is completely cosmetic to me.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

I have no issue with it either.


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## DCIFRTHS (Jan 6, 2000)

It seems that many people don't care about the "More Info" screen, and basically just ignore it. Presumably, these people will feel the same way when the screen turns into a paid advertisement.

Well, in my book, if many people are truly ignoring these screens, then it is safe to say that these "features" may not be effective at their intended function - generating revenue for TiVo.

Is anyone clicking through the various ads that have been placed throughout the TiVo interface?

I don't. Do you?


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## elwaylite (Apr 23, 2006)

I love ordering Domino's from my TiVo, I do it all the time :haha


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## TiVo Steve (Nov 8, 2005)

elwaylite said:


> I love ordering Domino's from my TiVo, I do it all the time :haha


Dominos won't deliver to me...


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

DCIFRTHS said:


> Is anyone clicking through the various ads that have been placed throughout the TiVo interface?
> 
> I don't. Do you?


I would assume that is the real question for TiVo and they may not like that they can answer that question with a high degree of accuracy. Some of the movie trailers remind me to add it to my netflix queue. I bought one domino's Pizza through TiVo, and at that mainly cause it was fun to do once and say I did. I have bought movie tickets through the TiVo a couple of times for Movies that would likely have long lines when I went. The most recent being midnight showing of Twilight.

Other than that I clicked on some ads of interest but was not compelled enough to do any follow up.

I think ads on TiVo do not bother me simply because they have such little impact on me and go by largely as just some more detail on a screen that my brain only half processes. I think TiVo is ahead of the curve on this new Advertising paradigm and most advertisers are just now getting a feel for how to use the internet for advertising, let alone interactive ads on a DVR.


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## visionary (May 31, 2006)

Thanks Greg, for that Slingbox idea. I hope however not to have to network my Tivo if possible, I hope to find something to just tap off the HD video signal at the jack, similar to what the S-video does for the SD, to capture still frames. 

By the way, since I am not networked I wonder if I will see the new 11C search choices on a paused screen then, since it knows I can't search? 

The best news here is what I am NOT reading, I am not reading about freezes and reboots........oh boy, I want 11C.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

visionary said:


> By the way, since I am not networked I wonder if I will see the new 11C search choices on a paused screen then, since it knows I can't search?


you will - the pause graphic is also about advertising so any box will be set for that. Is there no swivel search on phone line only?


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## MichaelK (Jan 10, 2002)

DCIFRTHS said:


> It seems that many people don't care about the "More Info" screen, and basically just ignore it. Presumably, these people will feel the same way when the screen turns into a paid advertisement.
> 
> Well, in my book, if many people are truly ignoring these screens, then it is safe to say that these "features" may not be effective at their intended function - generating revenue for TiVo.
> 
> ...


to me- it's so easy to avoid the ads and just do what you want to do that I'm oblivious to most of them. Sometimes I actually decide to actively check out the ads in an attempt to help tivo stay viable. I figure they have stats like x viewers clicked your ad- so I'll help them and make x=x+1.

But generally- yep they are not so in your face that I even notice or pay attention.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

For those who don't yet have the update and want to see what all the griping is about...courtesy of Dave Zatz...


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## jeepguy_1980 (Mar 2, 2008)

greg_burns said:


> Get a slingbox...
> 
> 
> 
> ...


You could also just save the .tivo file to your computer and capture a screen shot. Though that would take longer if you did it on a regular basis.


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## elwaylite (Apr 23, 2006)

Bierboy said:


> For those who don't yet have the update and want to see what all the griping is about...courtesy of Dave Zatz...


The Dominos crap doesnt bother me, why should this?


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## Bryan Lyle (Feb 6, 2002)

Personally, I don't care what they show when I pause a show. I just want my analog and hd channels to stop disappearing.


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## TiVoPO (Jun 11, 2004)

Hey all you haters! You're so funny! Got this email alert - try this:



> ... instructs that permanently hiding the progress bar can be achieved by pressing pause, press down to hide the popup, press play again, then enter SELECT-PLAY-SELECT-PAUSE-SELECT, which can also be reversed by using the code again while watching a recording.


I haven't tried it since I don't have the update yet. I use the 30 second skip anyway...


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## visionary (May 31, 2006)

PO, the joke may be on you, maybe the bar is gone but the ad remains! I like the bar and with my 11B freeze issue I sure need to know where I am. I don't recall seeing any Dominoes ads, and they are all over town, I think it is because I am not networked so I bet my screen will be different search wise. Dominoes uses internet orders, bet they don't have a phone ringing and answering to a modem in quite a few years. I may miss lots of ads not being networked, sometimes old ways are better ways.....


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## tombonneau (Mar 26, 2009)

Bierboy said:


> For those who don't yet have the update and want to see what all the griping is about...courtesy of Dave Zatz...


As long as they are delivering ads relevant to the program, I have no problem with this at all. Hopefully they will be proper direct response ads with solid offers. If I pause the Travel Channel and an ad for Virgin Air pops up offering 10% off fares, that' a good thing for everyone.


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## robnatick (Apr 6, 2009)

This is obnoxious. Don't we pay for TiVo? Why should we be forced to watch an ad because we're fast forwarding? This may be a showstopper.


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## elwaylite (Apr 23, 2006)

if they keep their price the same, or lower it (yeah right!), Im fine. If they put on more ads and increase the fee, then Ill be po'd.


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

robnatick said:


> This is obnoxious. Don't we pay for TiVo? Why should we be forced to watch an ad because we're fast forwarding? This may be a showstopper.


There are no ads on fast forward, just pause (and only occasionally on pause).

TiVo essentially broke even last year, so evidently the subscription fees were not sufficient to generate a profit. I would personally pay $1/mo extra to eliminate the occasional advertisements, but many new and existing customers would not tolerate an increase.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

bkdtv said:


> There are no ads on fast forward, just pause (and only occasionally on pause).
> 
> TiVo essentially broke even last year (no loss, no profit), so evidently the subscription fees were not adequate for them to make a profit. I would personally pay $1/mo extra to eliminate the occasional advertisements, but most TiVo users would not.


I agree....man, the way people are whining about this you would think ...


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## Alcatraz (Nov 22, 2000)

robnatick said:


> This is obnoxious. Don't we pay for TiVo? Why should we be forced to watch an ad because we're fast forwarding? This may be a showstopper.


This happens when you pause, not when you fast forward. It is not a showstopper by any stretch of the imagination. Annoying...well that's a different issue and subject to definition by the individual.

I generally use pause to see something in the video. The green bar got in my way more often than not, but the new menu definitely gets in my way. Now that there is a workaround, I can have it my way {thanks, BurgerKing!}


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## MichaelK (Jan 10, 2002)

robnatick said:


> This is obnoxious. Don't we pay for TiVo? Why should we be forced to watch an ad because we're fast forwarding? This may be a showstopper.


do a search our new friend. this argument has been going on for years- probably since around 2000 when someone realized tivo was collecting viewing data "I pay for tivo why do they...."


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

TiVoPO said:


> Hey all you haters! You're so funny! Got this email alert - try this:
> 
> I haven't tried it since I don't have the update yet. I use the 30 second skip anyway...


Yeah - it removes the progress bar -- on pause, fast forward, and rewind. I don't know about you but I use the progress bar on everything but pause. That sel/play/sel/pause/sel thing is a kludge that throws out the baby with the bath water.

However those with Harmony remotes can program the pause button to issue a pause followed by a down arrow which works well to get the crap out of sight.


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## Videodrome (Jun 20, 2008)

Could i have another button now, that says "real pause" so i can see things on the screen. Sony where are you already, i know there is some stuff at the comcast center.


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

RoyK said:


> However those with Harmony remotes can program the pause button to issue a pause followed by a down arrow which works well to get the crap out of sight.


If you're going to do this, make sure you disable TiVo sounds. Otherwise, you'll get a ding every time you pause after the first time.



Videodrome said:


> Could i have another button now, that says "real pause" so i can see things on the screen. Sony where are you already, i know there is some stuff at the comcast center.


You can press either CLEAR or FFW/REW immediately following pause to clear the progress bar and pause menu.


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## windracer (Jan 3, 2003)

bkdtv said:


> There are no ads on fast forward


The functionality is there, they just haven't widely used it (thankfully). Remember billboards?


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

bkdtv said:


> If you're going to do this, make sure you disable TiVo sounds. Otherwise, you'll get a ding every time you pause after the first time.
> ...


Disabling the sounds is one of the first things I do when setting up a new TiVo!


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## ZICRON (Oct 2, 2007)

TiVoPO said:


> Hey all you haters! You're so funny! Got this email alert - try this:
> ... instructs that permanently hiding the progress bar can be achieved by pressing pause, press down to hide the popup, press play again, then enter SELECT-PLAY-SELECT-PAUSE-SELECT, which can also be reversed by using the code again while watching a recording.
> 
> I haven't tried it since I don't have the update yet. I use the 30 second skip anyway...


I had to re-boot my tivo last night due to a serious stuttering issue with recorded video, and when it re-booted, my quick hide of the progress bar was gone (30 second skip was still there) so I did the sel/play/sel/pause/sel code about 100 times, it never activated the quick hide feature, something I really need as I never watch live video and have a 65" CRT so I want that persistent image off the screen as much as possible.

Has it maybe been disabled in the latest software release? I'm still using a series 2 tivo.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

ZICRON said:


> I had to re-boot my tivo last night due to a serious stuttering issue with recorded video, and when it re-booted, my quick hide of the progress bar was gone (30 second skip was still there) so I did the sel/play/sel/pause/sel code about 100 times, it never activated the quick hide feature, something I really need as I never watch live video and have a 65" CRT so I want that persistent image off the screen as much as possible.
> 
> Has it maybe been disabled in the latest software release?


It can be tricky to set up. First hit pause and then down arrow to get rid of the pop-up for that show. Then hit play and then do the sel/play/sel/pause/sel thing.


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## Videodrome (Jun 20, 2008)

Does c, 11c stand for commercials ?


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## ZICRON (Oct 2, 2007)

RoyK said:


> It can be tricky to set up. First hit pause and then down arrow to get rid of the pop-up for that show. Then hit play and then do the sel/play/sel/pause/sel thing.


Luckily for me, the pop up is still gone. When I hit pause, I get no pop up, but the progress bar is still there. I'll mess with it some more tonight and update tomorrow what I found.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

RoyK said:


> Yeah - it removes the progress bar -- on pause, fast forward, and rewind. I don't know about you but I use the progress bar on everything but pause. That sel/play/sel/pause/sel thing is a kludge that throws out the baby with the bath water.
> 
> However those with Harmony remotes can program the pause button to issue a pause followed by a down arrow which works well to get the crap out of sight.


Hmmm. I was happy with that hack until you mentioned this. I hadn't noticed that it eliminates the progress bar on FF and REW. I'm going to try your suggestion (I used the Harmony "for Xbox 360" model), only I'm going to use CLEAR instead of DOWN after PAUSE--I _never_ want to see the progress bar when I hit PAUSE .


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Bierboy said:


> For those who don't yet have the update and want to see what all the griping is about...courtesy of Dave Zatz...


OK?
What is the big deal? It sounds like an improvement and it might give me some extra info I want.

As long as this stuff doesn't pop up while I'm watching the program it really doesn't matter to me. No big deal while it's paused.


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## Dreamin (Sep 14, 2006)

windracer said:


> The functionality is there, they just haven't widely used it (thankfully). Remember billboards?


Yep... saw it with fast forward (but only once)...


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## TiVoPO (Jun 11, 2004)

aaronwt said:


> OK?
> What is the big deal? It sounds like an improvement and it might give me some extra info I want.
> 
> As long as this stuff doesn't pop up while I'm watching the program it really doesn't matter to me. No big deal while it's paused.


I tend to agree. I like the idea of easy access to swivel search from the paused screen. I've been seeing this on my friend's series 2 and been envious that he can go into swivel search without have to STOP EVERYTHING to get to it. And then you have to enter the show name or be recording it, etc.

Anyway, I still don't have this update. I tried the phone home thing - no joy. For those of you that have the update already, did you not get a message informing you of a Spring update or something? Usually that tells you what was included. If this is it, it seems pretty weak. One new feature?? And it's a hand me up at that? Surely there must be more... What about the beta search feature? Any news on that?


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## Aiken (Feb 17, 2003)

If you don't mind the feature, great.

However, your opinion of the feature doesn't change other people's opinions. If you're cool with it, that doesn't change the fact that someone else is not.

Don't minimize other people's opinions and experiences just because they don't jibe with your own. Allow people to have their own opinions and don't resort to personal attacks to try to quash them.


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## TiVoPO (Jun 11, 2004)

Aiken said:


> If you don't mind the feature, great.
> 
> However, your opinion of the feature doesn't change other people's opinions. If you're cool with it, that doesn't change the fact that someone else is not.
> 
> Don't minimize other people's opinions and experiences just because they don't jibe with your own. Allow people to have their own opinions and don't resort to personal attacks to try to quash them.


Who is this regarding?


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## Aiken (Feb 17, 2003)

TiVoPO said:


> Who is this regarding?


Multiple. That's why it's not addressed or quoting. Anyone it applies to, really.

People know if they've been attacking others for having the opinion that this feature is bad.

Pardon if following your post made it appear I was referring specifically to you.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

Aiken said:


> People know if they've been attacking others for having the opinion that this feature is bad.


What precisely are you interpreting as an attack? I've looked back over the posts in this thread and the worst I can find is someone saying, "the way people are whining about this".

You can't be complaining about attacks on your opinion of the feature, since you've made no other posts in this thread .


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## DCIFRTHS (Jan 6, 2000)

aaronwt said:


> OK?
> What is the big deal? It sounds like an improvement and it might give me some extra info I want.
> 
> As long as this stuff doesn't pop up while I'm watching the program it really doesn't matter to me. No big deal while it's paused.


Well, in this particular random shot, what's in the chef's hand isn't visible.

It's just another ad, and that's not an improvement in my book.


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## DCIFRTHS (Jan 6, 2000)

bkdtv said:


> There are no ads on fast forward, just pause (and only occasionally on pause).
> 
> TiVo essentially broke even last year, so evidently the subscription fees were not sufficient to generate a profit. I would personally pay $1/mo extra to eliminate the occasional advertisements, but many new and existing customers would not tolerate an increase.


I would aslo pay additional money for an ad free experience. I'd pay an additional .25 to get rid of all the "more info" crap too.


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## gweempose (Mar 23, 2003)

I'm just thankful that you *CAN* clear the status bar if you want to. I don't know if they changed it since then, but I used to hate my E* DVR because there was no way to make the status bar disappear when it was paused. If there was something I wanted to check out, I would have to put it into slow motion instead of pause. That, to me, was completely unacceptable.


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## DCIFRTHS (Jan 6, 2000)

gweempose said:


> I'm just thankful that you *CAN* clear the status bar if you want to. I don't know if they changed it since then, but I used to hate my E* DVR because there was no way to make the status bar disappear when it was paused. If there was something I wanted to check out, I would have to put it into slow motion instead of pause. That, to me, was completely unacceptable.


That is worse....


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## ZICRON (Oct 2, 2007)

ZICRON said:


> Luckily for me, the pop up is still gone. When I hit pause, I get no pop up, but the progress bar is still there. I'll mess with it some more tonight and update tomorrow what I found.


Okay, after letting it sit for a night after my manual re-boot, the pop up was back, I removed it and did the sel/play/sel/pause/sel code and the progress bar is now gone again, yay!


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## MickeS (Dec 26, 2002)

DCIFRTHS said:


> It seems that many people don't care about the "More Info" screen, and basically just ignore it. Presumably, these people will feel the same way when the screen turns into a paid advertisement.
> 
> Well, in my book, if many people are truly ignoring these screens, then it is safe to say that these "features" may not be effective at their intended function - generating revenue for TiVo.
> 
> ...


I've always wondered the same thing - not about just these, but about website ads and everything. Who clicks on a banner ad any more, except by mistake? "Nobody" would be the answer IMO, but obviously people do.

Same thing here I guess, even if a miniscule amount of keypresses happen, I guess it's enough for the advertisers.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

MickeS said:


> I've always wondered the same thing - not about just these, but about website ads and everything. Who clicks on a banner ad any more, except by mistake? "Nobody" would be the answer IMO, but obviously people do.
> 
> Same thing here I guess, even if a miniscule amount of keypresses happen, I guess it's enough for the advertisers.


majority geeks here in the forum and participation also implies a certain level of finding the answers for ourselves versus doing "research" by clicking on banner ads or viewing commercials. THIS FORUM IS SIMPLY NOT REPRESENTATIVE OF THE GENERAL USER BASE FOR TiVo.


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## elwaylite (Apr 23, 2006)

I still dont have 11.0c


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

elwaylite said:


> I still dont have 11.0c


As I pointed out before, it's 11.0c.C5, which sounds like a release candidate. They kind of stick their toe in the water with a limited release of a version that they think is ready for wide release to see how many bug reports they get.


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## spocko (Feb 4, 2009)

elwaylite said:


> I still dont have 11.0c


Me neither, and I'm happy about that. I'm in no hurry to get pause ads.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

I haven't seen an ad yet--just the "More about..." button. Maybe it's just the stuff that I watch.


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## MichaelK (Jan 10, 2002)

MickeS said:


> I've always wondered the same thing - not about just these, but about website ads and everything. Who clicks on a banner ad any more, except by mistake? "Nobody" would be the answer IMO, but obviously people do.
> 
> Same thing here I guess, even if a miniscule amount of keypresses happen, I guess it's enough for the advertisers.


well since most of these things are pay per click there's no reason for an advertiser not to try.

But I suspect the bigger answer is there are plenty of MORONS buying crap from spammers every day so if they will buy from someone selling "[email protected] M3DS 0nLYNE" then they will buy something from a legit advertiser.


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## Rick-s (Dec 20, 2006)

For those of you who've gotten the update:

Did any of you have the gray/black screen / loss of analog channels problem?

If so, have you had the problem since?

Just curious as I bought a TivoHD on the 5th. It had the issue. Then after three calls to Tech support, they told me that they are anticipating 11c to fix the problem but told me to send the unit in for replacement anyway in case there is a hardware issue. 

This will probably determine whether or not I keep the tivo :up: or "cough" stick with the comcast dvr "cough:gag" :down:


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## kgro (Jan 24, 2009)

I feel sorry for all of you who have a beef with the "more info" tab appearing when you pause, but at least you have a TiVo that records your shows!

I've been having the infamous "gray screen" issue since I got my HD Tivo in December. I've been told multiple times by customer service that they are "working on a fix". Noticed I got the 11c upgrade, and I got excited thinking I'd finally have a working TiVo again. Got home from work last night at 11p...to a gray screen. 

This is getting ridiculous...paying for a service that doesn't work and I can't rely on. My signal goes out up to 3 times a day sometimes, and since I have a tivo to watch tv shows on while I am at work, I am not home to "reset" the TiVo so it can start working again. Unfortunately, I paid for a year of service when I "upgraded" to this TiVo.

Anyone else still having problems??? Anyone have any more information regarding this issue??



Rick-s said:


> For those of you who've gotten the update:
> 
> Did any of you have the gray/black screen / loss of analog channels problem?
> 
> ...


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## Rick-s (Dec 20, 2006)

That doesn't give me much hope. 

kgro, did you call tech support to let them know you still have the problem? If so, what did they say? Was it the same song and dance...??


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## wtherrell (Dec 23, 2004)

The Tivo "More about" on pause is nothing compared to the popup ads that the networks put on during a show. I wish everyone responsible for those were tarred, feathered, railed, flogged, flayed and staked out over a fire-ant hill. Along with those responsible for the non-openable cardboard milk cartons, people who throw trash out of their cars onto the roadsides and..................I better quit for now. Blood pressure == "Cap'n she's about to blow!"


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## kgro (Jan 24, 2009)

I haven't called yet since the update...I've had to work 12-hour shifts since I got my software update, and I'm trying to give a few days to fix itself (not much hope there though)...

I have talked to TiVo about 3 times in the last few months, and every time it's been "well, we have our technical people trying to work on a fix. you just have to wait, and there's nothing else you can do". I don't have much hope it'll be different this time, but I will definitely call within the next week if the problem keeps occurring.

It's just frustrating...I understand the customer service reps can't really tell us much about this and I'm not blaming them...they're doing what they can. I just think TiVo needs to reimburse people for this broken software until they find a fix...maybe $$$ will be their incentive to get people working on this. I pay for my water, cable, internet, electricity, etc, and I get a product for my payment.

TiVo shouldn't release a product with so many bugs, and they definitely shouldn't accept pre-payment for a year of service they can't guarantee. It's wrong for them to take our money for a broken piece of equipment. I'd even take an offer from TiVo for a free series II until this mess is fixed. The HD is just extra...I don't record many HD shows. I bought a TiVo to be able to watch my shows that are on during my shift at work. Luckily many things are online now...

Sorry about the rant...I'm just so frustrated!



Rick-s said:


> That doesn't give me much hope.
> 
> kgro, did you call tech support to let them know you still have the problem? If so, what did they say? Was it the same song and dance...??


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## steve614 (May 1, 2006)

wtherrell said:


> The Tivo "More about" on pause is nothing compared to the popup ads that the networks put on during a show. I wish everyone responsible for those were tarred, feathered, railed, flogged, flayed, *drawn and quartered* and staked out over a fire-ant hill *covered in honey*. Along with those responsible for the non-openable cardboard milk cartons, people who throw trash out of their cars onto the roadsides and..................I better quit for now. Blood pressure == "Cap'n she's about to blow!"


FYP.


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## Rick-s (Dec 20, 2006)

Well, if the replacement unit I get isn't working properly, I'll have no choice but to take them up on their 30day money back offer. I've been a big fan of the Tivo interface and have owned a tivo in one form or another since the series 1 Directivo's. I have just made the move back to cable and had high hopes of enjoying the Tivo HD. However this may be the time my tivo experience ends and I have to go with Comcasts DVR.:down:

I really hope I am proven wrong and the replacement will work.


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## Phantom Gremlin (Jun 20, 2002)

kgro said:


> I've been having the infamous "gray screen" issue since I got my HD Tivo in December. I've been told multiple times by customer service that they are "working on a fix". Noticed I got the 11c upgrade, and I got excited thinking I'd finally have a working TiVo again. Got home from work last night at 11p...to a gray screen.
> 
> ...
> 
> Anyone else still having problems??? Anyone have any more information regarding this issue??


I bought one of the first TiVo HD boxes and experienced similar problems. I think the frequency of problem occurence was *greatly* reduced once i made sure I was feeding the box a strong signal. I needed to add a good quality distribution amp to boost Comcast's signal level.

Make *sure* your signal level is good. It might not fix your problem, but then again, it might.


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## burdellgp (Mar 28, 2008)

FYI: it looks like 11.0c is in full-release mode now. I got 11.0c-01-2-652 today (no extra letters).


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

burdellgp said:


> FYI: it looks like 11.0c is in full-release mode now. I got 11.0c-01-2-652 today (no extra letters).


I got 11.0c today as well.

I've already discovered something I didn't know thanks to the "More Info" menu. I tried it out on a CNet TiVoCast download and it took me to the TiVo Search app which mentioned I have a "season pass' for CNet. I didn't know TiVo Search could add/modify TiVoCast Season Passes so that was interesting.

I doubt I'll use the "More Info" much though.


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## elwaylite (Apr 23, 2006)

Maybe Ill see it now, still on 11B


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## nrc (Nov 17, 1999)

Got it today. The actual pause menu is less annoying than I expected, but knowing that it's just a place holder for a banner ad makes me dread pressing pause. That's a user experience that inspires loyalty. 

If they were really adding a feature they could have just put "Press info for more" at the bottom where they have "Press Down to clear".

I suppose that all we can do is hope for Moxi to develop into something competitive and offer an alternative. Maybe some competition will put the brakes on TiVo plastering ads all over everything.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

MickeS said:


> Hit the "Down" button and it goes away for that show.
> 
> And really, usually when you pause it's to see the image on screen?


I agree with spocko. If I am so uninterested in a program that I would go do something else in the middle of it then I am very unlikely to bother to watch it in the first place to the point where it needs to be paused. If I pause, it is either for a minor emergency or to look at something on the screen. The former is far less likely.



MickeS said:


> The vast majority of time that I pause, it's because I'm leaving the room or take a pause in watching. I would think this is what most people usually use pause for.


Why bother watching something so uninteresting you don't mind breaking the illusion to go do something else? It sounds like a waste of time, to me. If something doesn't engross me to the point of being oblivious to my surrroundings, then there are plenty of other things on the TiVo which will do just that, and are a better use of my time.

I can hardly say I like the feature, but I would find it much more objectionable if one could not dismiss it by simply pressing the down arrow. As it is, it's a very modest annoyance.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

Chris Grant said:


> So true! I often pause when I get a phone call


I actively and aggressively discourage people from calling me on the phone unless it is an emergency. Real emergencies are rare.



Chris Grant said:


> or need to leave the room for a few minutes.


This is somewhat less rare, but I avoid it during the middle of a program. On those occasions where something comes up, I usually exit the program altogether and turn off the TV.



Chris Grant said:


> I don't know if the behavior is changed as I am still on 11.0b, but I sure hope whatever TiVo dumps on the pause screen can be cleared!


It can.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

nrc said:


> I suppose that all we can do is hope for Moxi to develop into something competitive and offer an alternative. Maybe some competition will put the brakes on TiVo plastering ads all over everything.


It will be very interesting to see whether Moxi can make a profit in the retail-DVR space selling units with lifetime-service-only and no revenue from ad gimmicks. Given that they've made the absence of ads a selling point in their marketing, they won't even have the option of resorting to selling ad features if their business model should fail.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

rhoelzer said:


> Having a problem with this is truly ridiculous. There's no realistic issue with this that isn't solved by the clear or frame advance button. The people that say they want to look at the screen either have to wait for the progress bar to time out or hit a button to see the whole screen anyway.


You're missing the point. I don't recall anyone saying they wanted to see the entire screen at every juncture. When I press <Pause>, the pause bar covers a small enough area of the screen that I often do not need to hit <Clear>. When I do, I find it mildly annoying. With this pop-up, the occluded screen area is more than trebled, meaning the number of times I will need to hit the <Down Arrow> or <Clear> is going to increase substantially.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

ZeoTiVo said:


> for me - this passes the not doing anything different with the remote test with flying colors.
> 
> If I pause to do something else then I could care less about the banner and hit play when ready to roll again.
> 
> If I pause to see something then I have always either hit clear or frame advance to remove the status bar and the pause ad goes with it.


I disagree. See my previous post. The fact the involved screen area is much greater by my estimation means it most certainly does not pass the not doing anything different with the remote test.



ZeoTiVo said:


> YMWV


It most certainly does. As I already said, I don't find the issue highly objectionable, but it certainly fails to be unobtrusive.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

mikeyts said:


> It will be very interesting to see whether Moxi can make a profit in the retail-DVR space selling units with lifetime-service-only and no revenue from ad gimmicks. Given that they've made the absence of ads a selling point in their marketing, they won't even have the option of resorting to selling ad features if their business model should fail.


Since when did a company ever let marketing promises get in the way of making a profit? TiVo certainly hasn't kept all their marketing promises. Few companies I know have. Many, if not most, lie outright.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

visionary said:


> I hope however not to have to network my Tivo if possible


HUH!?!? Why not? This truly makes no sense, to me. The first modification I did with my Series I was to install an Ethernet port, and that was 8 years ago. A non-networked TiVo is more crippled than a PC without networking. With only one exception, all the most important features on the TiVo are enabled over networking, and two of my TiVos (in the theater and the guest room), would be completely useless without networking.



visionary said:


> I hope to find something to just tap off the HD video signal at the jack, similar to what the S-video does for the SD, to capture still frames.


Networking the TiVo is much easier and vastly cheaper.


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## jeepguy_1980 (Mar 2, 2008)

mikeyts said:


> Given that they've made the absence of ads a selling point in their marketing, they won't even have the option of resorting to selling ad features if their business model should fail.


I have scoured TiVo's marketing, and I can't find anything referencing the absence of ads. Everything pretty much revolves around TV on your schedule, and the ability to find the shows you want.

I don't even think the absence of ads even compares to the ability to watch shows on your own schedule. The flexibility of being able to go out without missing my shows far out weighs the ability to bypass advertisements. I would probably say the 2nd best feature of a DVR is the ability to watch an hour long show in about 40 minutes by skipping intro credits and commercials.

I skip the commercials to save time, not avoid marketing. If TiVo wants to put a pop up ad to offset their costs, and afford them the opportunity to further enhance their service, as they have done many times, so be it.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

jeepguy_1980 said:


> I have scoured TiVo's marketing, and I can't find anything referencing the absence of ads. Everything pretty much revolves around TV on your schedule, and the ability to find the shows you want.


I wasn't talking about TiVo's marketing--I was referring to Digeo's marketing for their new retail Moxi DVR. Check out #9 in their list of "10 Little Tricks TiVo Plays On You":


> 9. Advertising. Yes, Advertising:
> The whole point of TiVo, originally, was to allow you to skip commercials. Now they're adding commercials back into the mix. Did you realize you may have to watch commercials while you have your TiVo paused? MOXI doesn't make you watch any commercials, ever.


"The whole point of TiVo, originally, was to allow you to skip commercials". Huh. I never realized that. I always thought that the whole point of TiVo, originally, was to allow you to record programs on a hard drive instead of a tape, with playback of recordings chosen from a list of program names, playing back while making new recordings, and to give you the ability to pause live television, etc. I bought a TiVo shortly after it first became available, moving to it from recording on VHS tape (using various electronic aids, like VideoGuide and WebTV). The list of advantages over tape was a very long one. Skipping ads was a nice ancillary benefit, but no substantial part of "the whole point of TiVo". Their entire "Moxi vs TiVo" campaign is a bunch of lies, damn lies and half-truths .


lrhorer said:


> Since when did a company ever let marketing promises get in the way of making a profit? TiVo certainly hasn't kept all their marketing promises. Few companies I know have. Many, if not most, lie outright.


I still think that adding advertising features later after going on about how much better their product is than TiVo because it doesn't have any advertising features will just tank them faster. They can do it, but the competition will rub their faces in it.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

Ok, I got 11.0c on both my Series 3 and my HD in the last couple of days.

I'm a long time TiVo supporter and I've also been able to ignore the main menu ads, the Gold Stars, the folder ads, the end of program ads. They didn't matter to me.

But I'm sorry, now they've crossed the line with this new pause ad implementation.
I understand the cool factor of being able to access swivel search from the pause but I don't care for the "more about" prompt being there all the time.

Yes, I know I can turn it off an a recording by recording basis but I want to be able to turn that prompt off until I want it there.
And this prompt shows up when pausing Live TV too!

Let me make it clear that the text below the Pause bar doesn't bother me, the fact I can't turn off the prompt above the bar until I want it there bothers me.


:down: on the implementation of this feature so far.


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## mlcarson (Dec 31, 2007)

Got my 11.0c rev today. I turned on the TV to see the Powering UP screen which didn't go away. I unplugged it and it installed the update and continued booting up normally. Didn't notice any difference until about 5 hrs later. I now have the "gray screen problem" where it will tune no channels.

On both analog/digital channels it says: Searcdhing for signal on Cable In.
If I try to look at cable strength, it says: Signal strength is unavailable because your cable channel lineup has no digital channels.


Rebooting (both soft/hard) has not fixed this. If I feed the TV the same cable -- I do see the analog signals and the clear channel QAM ones.

Cable card test channel option shows "No channels available".

I pulled the cable card out and reinstalled and it did discover it. Cable card screens seem to show a valid status. Recordings do not record anything in this state (to be expected I guess). I can play back previous recordings though.

So, this update is pretty poor so far for me.


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## Phantom Gremlin (Jun 20, 2002)

mlcarson said:


> Got my 11.0c rev today. I turned on the TV to see the Powering UP screen which didn't go away. I unplugged it and it installed the update and continued booting up normally. Didn't notice any difference until about 5 hrs later. I now have the "gray screen problem" where it will tune no channels.


Yes, one of my two TiVo HDs had both of these problems:
a) Powering UP didn't go away
b) gray screen problem



> On both analog/digital channels it says: Searching for signal on Cable In.
> If I try to look at cable strength, it says: Signal strength is unavailable because your cable channel lineup has no digital channels.


My behavior was slightly different. I had the gray screens on all channels, but *no* "searching" message.



> Rebooting (both soft/hard) has not fixed this.


Mine did fix itself after yet another reboot. Now signal strength on all channels is 90+.



> Cable card test channel option shows "No channels available".


The TiVo I had problems with is running straight OTA, no cablecards.



> So, this update is pretty poor so far for me.


So it's a "typical" update, then? It's pretty much what I've come to expect from TiVo. At least my unit is functional once again.

It's obvious from reading TiVo's SEC filings that they outsource a lot of their engineering. I wonder if this update was done offshore?

If so, it's one of my pet peeves about TiVo. Because Apu over in Bangalore woudn't know HD if it bit him in the a**, and he's not even a TiVo employee so he doesn't give a s*** about the quality of his work.


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

The vast majority of software and hardware companies haven't provided "tech support" for a good number of years now. They now offer "customer support" which involves basically hiring someone who can read from a script. I'm convinced that there's isn't even a requirement in the industry for a support person to actually own or have used the product that person is supporting. The days of being about to call for support and getting someone who actually knows anything about what they are supporting are long gone. 

I can't say I blame the companies since hiring "customer support" is a lot cheaper than hiring "tech support" and the vast majority of people calling support have no basic troubleshooting skills. It does frustrate the hell out of those of us who can troubleshoot, especially when trying to report bugs to a company.

Sorry for the mini-rant, but "customer support" is one of those things that push my buttons.


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## T_RJ (Oct 15, 2001)

Will this be TiVo's next Tech support plan?Click Here


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## pkurtin (Feb 5, 2005)

In addition to this new Pause feature that has everyone, including myself, in an uproar, I have a new problem: the green progress bar no longer hides quickly using the trick code "select-play-select-pause-select". 

Has anyone else seen this? I am REALLY pissed off!


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## fred2 (Jan 20, 2006)

If anyone is tallying votes - I do NOT like the new addition to the PAUSE screen.


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## nrc (Nov 17, 1999)

pkurtin said:


> In addition to this new Pause feature that has everyone, including myself, in an uproar, I have a new problem: the green progress bar no longer hides quickly using the trick code "select-play-select-pause-select".
> 
> Has anyone else seen this? I am REALLY pissed off!


That trick code has been discussed in this thread as a way to quickly clear the pause menu. It doesn't persist through a reboot but consensus seemed to be that it was working fine.



RoyK said:


> It can be tricky to set up. First hit pause and then down arrow to get rid of the pop-up for that show. Then hit play and then do the sel/play/sel/pause/sel thing.


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## modnar (Oct 15, 2000)

Hitting SELECT on the "More about..." menu on the TiVo HD brings up the new HD TiVo Search menu, which is cool. I wish the performance/responsiveness of TiVo Search was *much* faster, though.


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## Teeps (Aug 16, 2001)

wmcbrine said:


> So they finally brought that horrible misfeature over from the Series 2? Ugh. I was hoping we might be spared.


I had a S1 before the S3, I agree that is annoying...

TiVo you listening? Give us a way to turn this funked up "feature(?)" off...


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## ThreeSoFar (May 24, 2002)

FYI, if you use the shortcut (SPlaySPauseS) to clear off the green bar showing where you are in the show quickly, it also clears this annoying feature.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

Unfortunately, S-P-S-PAUSE-S, also causes the progress bar to disappear immediately during FF and REW, which is unacceptable to me. (It also doesn't survive restarts, so you have to re-enable it every time). If you have a good programmable universal remote (Harmony, HT Master, etc), you can program the PAUSE button to send PAUSE, CLEAR, which is works great for me .


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## btwyx (Jan 16, 2003)

I don't think anyone's mentioned the Netflix folder. I've got a folder between suggestions and recently deleted, called "Netflix", its coloured red. Selecting that takes me directly to the netflix download screen. When that appeared I noticed I had an 11.0 version.

I saw the pause button first this morning, I don't mind it, I can't see why people are calling it advertising.


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## jeepguy_1980 (Mar 2, 2008)

btwyx said:


> I don't think anyone's mentioned the Netflix folder. I've got a folder between suggestions and recently deleted, called "Netflix", its coloured red. Selecting that takes me directly to the netflix download screen. When that appeared I noticed I had an 11.0 version.
> 
> I saw the pause button first this morning, I don't mind it, I can't see why people are calling it advertising.


The Netflix folder appeared (on my DVR) a couple weeks before I got 11.0c.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

btwyx said:


> I don't think anyone's mentioned the Netflix folder. I've got a folder between suggestions and recently deleted, called "Netflix", its coloured red. Selecting that takes me directly to the netflix download screen. When that appeared I noticed I had an 11.0 version.


There are multiple threads on this topic. You can see one of them here. Some people have strongly complained about it.


> I saw the pause button first this morning, I don't mind it, I can't see why people are calling it advertising.


Because more optional buttons than the "More about..." one can pop up; those options are ads, like the ones that appear with the "Delete this recording?" popup at the end of playback. An example is shown in this thread, back in this post.


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## Phantom Gremlin (Jun 20, 2002)

Phantom Gremlin said:


> It's obvious from reading TiVo's SEC filings that they outsource a lot of their engineering. I wonder if this update was done offshore.


After I posted this yesterday, somebody responded. I thought it was a thoughtful response, but it seems to have been deleted??? Did the poster delete it, or did moderators? If so, why?

Anyway, I want to make clear that I am not "racist" when it comes to Indian engineers. Let's take the definition from Wikipedia: "_Racism, by its simplest definition is the belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race._

I've worked with many Indian engineers in Silicon Valley and they've been the equal of any other engineers I've met there. Just as important to this country, Indian entrepreneurs have been founders of at least three "high tech" US based companies I've worked with. They have created many US based jobs and I welcome them to the USA.

When I mention Apu in Bangalore as a stereotype, my complaint is about *offshoring* and *outsourcing.*

I think it would be more difficult for TiVo to have "high quality" software if they develop it in a country like India, where the engineers can't actually use it in their day to day lives.

Same with outsourcing in general. IMO and in my experience it's quite hard to coordinate outsourced efforts, especially offshore, and especially 8 or 12 time zones away. Even more so if the software is being developed by third parties.

That brings me to an overall point about TiVo hardware and software: WTF has Tivo been doing for the last *decade?*

If you examine a TiVo Series 1, from a decade ago, today's TiVo HD is an *incremental* improvement. The hardware has been mostly "outsourced" to a Broadcom SoC. So that only leaves software for TiVo to do.

If you consider the marvelous product the engineers at TiVo were able to conjure up in a few short years in the '90s (including doing their own precursor to the Broadcom hardware), the situation we are in a decade later is a big disappointment. At least to me.

That's my frustration with the latest TiVo software. I'm measuring against the original Series 1.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

wmcbrine said:


> So they finally brought that horrible misfeature over from the Series 2? Ugh. I was hoping we might be spared.


I just spotted this: "Misfeature". I like that.


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

mikeyts said:


> "The whole point of TiVo, originally, was to allow you to skip commercials".


Yeah, me, either. Indeed, when I decided to purchase a DVR, 'back in 2000, I had to decide between ReplayTV and TiVo. I considered both carefully, and Replay's ability to jump over commercials was appealing. The features of the TiVo, combined with the fact I had a suspicion any company who took on the commercial ad giants head-to-head like that might not have a particularly stable future won the day, however.



mikeyts said:


> Huh. I never realized that. I always thought that the whole point of TiVo, originally, was to allow you to record programs on a hard drive instead of a tape, with playback of recordings chosen from a list of program names


Yeah, the thought of a 30 hour medium with random, indexed access and no tapes to swap or wear out just blew me away. Its ability to skip commercials was on a par - at least - with a VCR, and that was sufficient for me at the time, given the other advances.



mikeyts said:


> Skipping ads was a nice ancillary benefit, but no substantial part of "the whole point of TiVo".


One could easily skip ads on a VCR just as well as on a TiVo, so in fact there was very little benefit to the TiVo in that sense. Everything else was light years beyond tape, however, and that was "the whole point" of TiVo.



mikeyts said:


> I still think that adding advertising features later after going on about how much better their product is than TiVo because it doesn't have any advertising features will just tank them faster. They can do it, but the competition will rub their faces in it.


Well, I would very much like to agree with you, but it usually doesn't work that way. 'Ever read 1984, by George Orwell? I used to believe his "doublethink" was a literary exaggeration, but it isn't. It's appalling how many people think Microsoft started the internet (or even had anything to do with it until everyone else had already entered the arena), or that terrorism ever had anything to do with invading Iraq. Revisionist history seems to be America's favorite passtime, and I submit the criticism upon which you so rightly cast aspersions above is an example. TiVo haters and Moxi lovers will irretrievably forget about any inaccurate statements on Moxi's part ten minutes after they become innacurate, and those buying new units at the time won't really care, even if there is someone around to inform them. If this weren't the case, why would anyone ever buy a Ford automobile after the exposure of their callous and depraved indifference to human life and limb during the Pinto fiasco?


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## jrm01 (Oct 17, 2003)

I got the 11.0c update for my THD yesterday (uhg!). I use this TiVo for antenna and cable (no cablecards).

Back when I got the 11.0 update all of my Manual Record by Time & Channel recordings for clear-QAM channels suddenly resulted in Recording History message "Will not record since the program was no longer in the guide". Update 11.0b fixed that problem. Now with 11.0c, the problem is back. They all say this again. I have not tried to recreate the Season Pass to see if that will fix it, but will do so tonight.

Also, after the update I got the Grey Screen for all of my analog channels (both cable and antenna), and all scheduled recordings on these channels were skipped due to "No Signal". The digital channels were fine (both cable - clear-QAM, and antenna). I went to the Check Signal Strength screen and back to live TV and the problem was fixed (thought that was easier than rebooting).


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## tiassa (Jul 2, 2008)

elwaylite said:


> Is this a staggered rollout? Just wondering why I cant force.


Interestingly one of my Tivo HDs has the update, and one doesn't.


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## jrm01 (Oct 17, 2003)

It is being rolled out to the general population and everyone should have it by tomorrow night.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

I notice that I've been "upgraded" to the release version of 11.0c from the 0c.C5 candidate release. No telling when that happened.


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## dalesd (Aug 2, 2001)

I just popped in here to see if there was a way to get rid of this awful "more about" misfeature. I tried the SPSPauseS, but found it not acceptable.

So I'm going to call TiVo and complain. In nearly ten years as a Tivo owner, this is something I've never had to do. I'm hoping against hope that it's just a bug that makes the "more about" not stay away permanently.

Please join me in calling TiVo @ *877-367-8486* to tell them how much we dislike this feature.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

I'm having some problem issue which started after I got the 11.0c. Mainly menu pauses and freezes that I had to pull the plug to fix, but once it came back after about a minute, just as I was about to pull the plug.


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## deandashl (Aug 8, 2008)

Phantom Gremlin said:


> After I posted this yesterday, somebody responded. I thought it was a thoughtful response, but it seems to have been deleted??? Did the poster delete it, or did moderators? If so, why?
> 
> Anyway, I want to make clear that I am not "racist" when it comes to Indian engineers. Let's take the definition from Wikipedia: "_Racism, by its simplest definition is the belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race._
> 
> ...


Don't worry buddy. Not all of us are into the easy "race" card game. Some of us are willing to look at what people say(write) in context.

If MOXI can make up a HD UI, TiVo should be able to do it by accident.


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## KevinSartori (Jul 1, 2004)

I finally got it myself last night. I dunno. I don't think the ads are that big of a deal. I mostly use the 30s skip anyway, so I don't see it too often. Besides, I'm more concerned that TiVo won't survive in the long term, so if this helps their bottom line, I can live with it.


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## Shawn95GT (Oct 7, 2005)

KevinSartori said:


> I finally got it myself last night. I dunno. I don't think the ads are that big of a deal. I mostly use the 30s skip anyway, so I don't see it too often. Besides, I'm more concerned that TiVo won't survive in the long term, so if this helps their bottom line, I can live with it.


While I'm no fan of ads, I have to agree.

This is about as un-obtrusive as it comes. I don't even really consider this an ad as it seems to link to swivel search or whatever they're calling it this week.

It would be nice to have the option to turn it off in the config menus though as it is a feature I'll never use.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

Shawn95GT said:


> ......
> This is about as un-obtrusive as it comes. I don't even really consider this an ad ....


I would consider this both extremely obtrusive and an ad!

Snapped last night while watching Law & Order Criminal Intent recording:


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

RoyK said:


> Snapped last night while watching Law & Order Criminal Intent recording:


Is TiVo trying to say everyone who watches Law & Order CI is fat?


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## AbMagFab (Feb 5, 2001)

This is almost the same amount of nonsense complaining we got when Tivo introduced the "star" on the main menu.

It's meaningless, and almost completely unobtrusive. If you hate it so much you can't control yourself, then leave Tivo - you're not the kind of customer they want.

The rest of us will continue to enjoy Tivo without skipping a beat.


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## xtoyz (Dec 28, 2008)

I have 11.0c and don't get this. What gives?

Shawn


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

morac said:


> Is TiVo trying to say everyone who watches Law & Order CI is fat?


no I think it is more aimed at people who seem to find it strenuous to push down the FF or clear button


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## wtkflhn (May 12, 2006)

I got the new update on my S3 and HD TIVO's yesterday. I saw the new "feature", and it's something I could do without. However, this morning I tried it again on "the Price Is Right" on CBS in HD. It didn't work! Later on I tried it again in SD and it still wasn't working. I don't know of anything I did to disable it. SO, did TIVO turn it off?

Don H


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## Shawn95GT (Oct 7, 2005)

lol - I've never seen a star pop on top of the 'more about'.

All I get is the 'more about' menu.

I'd agree - that's an ad, and annoying at that as it's popped over the menu.


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## JYoung (Jan 16, 2002)

morac said:


> Is TiVo trying to say everyone who watches Law & Order CI is fat?


Well, that is a stretched picture....


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## fred2 (Jan 20, 2006)

AbMagFab said:


> This is almost the same amount of nonsense complaining we got when Tivo introduced the "star" on the main menu.
> 
> It's meaningless, and almost completely unobtrusive. If you hate it so much you can't control yourself, then leave Tivo - you're not the kind of customer they want.
> 
> The rest of us will continue to enjoy Tivo without skipping a beat.


That's funny, I was the "kind of customer they wanted" when they did not add this junk. I did not change - they did. Yes, of course, they reserve the right to shove this down the throats of folks whether they want it or not. I'm sure that supporters of this also have no trouble when credit card companies raise their rates - just part of the contract.

The "ads" or whatever those in favor call them are getting more intrusive. Maybe it will soon be like Hulu - you will have to watch a certain number of ads or the show will not progress.

And leaving - well, if I were a month to month, maybe, but I've paid for Lifetime.


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

Shawn95GT said:


> lol - I've never seen a star pop on top of the 'more about'.
> 
> All I get is the 'more about' menu.
> 
> I'd agree - that's an ad, and annoying at that as it's popped over the menu.


I was only getting the "more about" ad until this week, and I thought it was certainly acceptable, but today I'm awash in "Realize Band" ads everywhere, in multiple folders, and on the "More About" screens, that's actually ticked me off.

Diane


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## [email protected] (Jan 8, 2008)

On my THD I noticed a something nice - not sure if this is part of the new update, though. I recorded something by hitting the record button on the remote. This manual recording overlapped into the next hour where I had two season passes set up. One of the season passes was for the same channel as that of the manual recording. 

Instead of a recording being clipped, the manual and the season pass (overlapping on the same channel) both recorded for their allotted time, duplicating the overlap. This is a nice improvement. Anyone else notice this? Or perhaps it was in a prior release and I just didn't notice it?

BTW, I can train myself not to notice the pause ads. Or train my thumb to hit the clear or down key when it hits the pause key. As annoyances go, it is fairly minor, especially since it is easy to get rid of.


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## NiteCourt (Mar 31, 2005)

I'm not sure if this is a bug with the new version or because of the tuning adapter but this morning when I hit the Tivo button I saw a message on the bottom saying my program information goes to April 29th. My network setting showed a successful connection the previous day but I still forced a connection. This evening the message was still there but I have successful connection. I went to the system info screen and it had the same date. I rebooted the Tivo and went to the system info and the date changed to May 5th. Anyone have this happen before? This is a first for me.


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## dd9 (Aug 10, 2000)

Absolutely crappy and purely annoying feature. They should have an option to disable this one. 

At least the backdoor to quickly disable the progress bar clears this new annoyance instantly too. It's a pain to enable it now, but you can do it as long as the title bar is up and you quickly enter the code on a previously recorded show.

If they take away the backdoor to quickly clear the progress bar, then you'll see me ranting like a lunatic everywhere....


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## NAHurry (Dec 9, 2003)

New problem with 11.0C.

My menus, especially the Now Playing list, have become horribly sluggish - taking about a full minute to display everything. I only have four programs in the list. Each subsequent menu change into submenus is taking 30 seconds to a full minute to complete.

Anyone else?

Thanks,
James


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## b_scott (Nov 27, 2006)

SELECT PLAY SELECT PAUSE SELECT

no bar, no ad. ever.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

Where are these pause advertisements? The only thing I notice when I pause is it asking me if I want to know more info on the program I'm watching, but I haven't seen any advertisements when I pause a program.


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## ahipsher (Oct 29, 2008)

The advertisements are only on some shows. For example on Scrubs last night they added a line with a Star and a link to the REALIZE Personalized Banding Solution http://www.realizeband.com

Should I be offended that Tivo knows I watch too much Tivo and am more likely to need this product


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## visionary (May 31, 2006)

AAron, I see only that too, and reason is I am not networked, it just dials in. Most ads are sent over internet. While they could phone them, it would take a LONG time and they don't. I do still see some movie trailers and such they show on TV late at night on Ion network. In time they may distribute commercials there, but not if most are networked, at least I hope.


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## stujac (Jan 26, 2002)

I finally got 11c yesterday and the paused "ads" are annoying but more annoying is that the audio bug is worse now; even when switching tuners the audio will go out occasionally and when going from hd to sd or analog it has a tendency to go out often. I'm using hdmi all the way so it's obviously tied in with a handshake issue. I'm strongly considering going component and optical or should I wait for them to fix the bug?


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## Onibroc42 (Feb 5, 2003)

stujac said:


> I finally got 11c yesterday and the paused "ads" are annoying but more annoying is that the audio bug is worse now; even when switching tuners the audio will go out occasionally and when going from hd to sd or analog it has a tendency to go out often. I'm using hdmi all the way so it's obviously tied in with a handshake issue. I'm strongly considering going component and optical or should I wait for them to fix the bug?


Are you talking about dropouts on the audio? Because I get them with HDMI and optical. And they aren't there in the source material, because if I hit "jump back 8 seconds" there's no dropout the second time through.

As far as the ads go, I think I'm more offended that my TiVo thinks I'm fat than I am at the mere presence of an ad (however annoying).


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

Onibroc42 said:


> As far as the ads go, I think I'm more offended that my TiVo thinks I'm fat than I am at the mere presence of an ad (however annoying).


This could be good information for us..are you fat ??? I get ads for AARP medicare plans and i am over 65, does TiVo know more that we think about us ??


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## stujac (Jan 26, 2002)

Onibroc42 said:


> Are you talking about dropouts on the audio? Because I get them with HDMI and optical. And they aren't there in the source material, because if I hit "jump back 8 seconds" there's no dropout the second time through.
> 
> As far as the ads go, I think I'm more offended that my TiVo thinks I'm fat than I am at the mere presence of an ad (however annoying).


Not so much dropouts, I have them rarely but I'm talking about the audio cutting out completely and I can't get it back unless I do any number of things; swap tuners or change channels, etc.


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## jeffw_00 (Sep 19, 2000)

These are like banner ads. eventually everyone will tune them out, but Tivo will make $ until the advertisers realize it.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

stujac said:


> Not so much dropouts, I have them rarely but I'm talking about the audio cutting out completely and I can't get it back unless I do any number of things; swap tuners or change channels, etc.


My wife had this problem for the first time last night, I changed the channel to see if the problem was in the TiVo system, sound was ok on the new channel, went back to the original channel and it was ok I though the problem was the channel itself and it got fixed when i was off that channel..I guess not.


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## twhiting9275 (Nov 17, 2006)

fred2 said:


> I'm sure that supporters of this also have no trouble when credit card companies raise their rates - just part of the contract.


Of course it is just part of the contract. You don't like it, you can take your business elsewhere. Vote with your dollar, instead of whining about it. Whining won't solve a thing.



fred2 said:


> The "ads" or whatever those in favor call them are getting more intrusive.


Hardly.
I've been a Tivo user since late '06, and despite all the changes I still don't see anything "intrusive" about ads. These people need to make money, and the fees we pay them (lifetime/monthly/whatever) certainly DON'T warrant ad free service.

Tivo is basically trying to give the customer new experiences, something that they might be interested in. You can't fault them for that, or for trying to make a profit at all.



fred2 said:


> Maybe it will soon be like Hulu - you will have to watch a certain number of ads or the show will not progress.


That's just hillarious. Tivo has never, ever intruded on the viewing experience at all. They will continue to keep that up. Have they "intruded" on their own screens (ie: pause, menus, etc)? Yes, they have added ads, but they have NOT intruded. Just because a handful of users object to ads (hey, I hate them myself) doesn't mean that Tivo is intruding whatsoever



fred2 said:


> And leaving - well, if I were a month to month, maybe, but I've paid for Lifetime.


Then you REALLY have no reason to complain. A lifetime subscription is incredibly cheap compared to month to month / yearly / etc. Again, stop whining. Either Leave Tivo or just deal with it. You don't have the right to whine about changes like this.


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## Philtho (Feb 10, 2006)

b_scott said:


> SELECT PLAY SELECT PAUSE SELECT
> 
> no bar, no ad. ever.


If this really works, I will love you forever.

Everyone in the house was complaining about this last night. I don't know why, but it's just flat out annoying. It's like a mosquito feature. That's the best way I can describe it.

Not sure what they were thinking.



twhiting9275 said:


> Again, stop whining. Either Leave Tivo or just deal with it. You don't have the right to whine about changes like this.


Get banned. This is a discussion board.


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## notabbott (Oct 4, 2004)

NAHurry said:


> New problem with 11.0C.
> 
> My menus, especially the Now Playing list, have become horribly sluggish - taking about a full minute to display everything. I only have four programs in the list. Each subsequent menu change into submenus is taking 30 seconds to a full minute to complete.
> 
> ...


Yes. Have you rebooted/restarted since? I may try that later to see if it helps.

Later,
COZ


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## Onibroc42 (Feb 5, 2003)

lessd said:


> This could be good information for us..are you fat ??? I get ads for AARP medicare plans and i am over 65, does TiVo know more that we think about us ??


How does it KNOW? GAAAH!


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## rainwater (Sep 21, 2004)

AbMagFab said:


> It's meaningless, and almost completely unobtrusive. If you hate it so much you can't control yourself, then leave Tivo - you're not the kind of customer they want.


It would be less unobtrusive if the ad wasn't selected by default. It should select the "More about" link by default. It clearly shows the menu is only there for the ad.


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## hummingbird_206 (Aug 23, 2007)

stujac said:


> Not so much dropouts, I have them rarely but I'm talking about the audio cutting out completely and I can't get it back unless I do any number of things; swap tuners or change channels, etc.


Yep, I'm having this problem with 11C, too. Turn on the TV, no audio, change the channel have audio on new channel, change channel back and have audio on channel was on when powered on the TV. Very annoying.


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## notabbott (Oct 4, 2004)

notabbott said:


> Yes. Have you rebooted/restarted since? I may try that later to see if it helps.
> 
> Later,
> COZ


Answering my own question...restarting the system made the sluggishness go away, as far as I can tell.


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## xtoyz (Dec 28, 2008)

Saw the ads for the first time last night. I'm not networked, and they're still there. Has anyone else noticed some commercials (if you actually watch one), have the ads as well? I forgot to fast forward last night and an Esurance commercial came on and in the top right was a window that was Esurance sponsored with a "Press Thumbs-up" for more info.

Or is this the same thing everyone has been talking about (i.e. the pause ad)?

Shawn


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

The thumbs-up ads have been around for a while now. If you fast forwarded you most likely would have seen a billboard ad, which has also been around for a while. 

The "pause menu" and the ads it contains is what is new in 11.0c.


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## Phantom Gremlin (Jun 20, 2002)

NiteCourt said:


> I'm not sure if this is a bug with the new version or because of the tuning adapter but this morning when I hit the Tivo button I saw a message on the bottom saying my program information goes to April 29th. My network setting showed a successful connection the previous day but I still forced a connection. This evening the message was still there but I have successful connection. I went to the system info screen and it had the same date. I rebooted the Tivo and went to the system info and the date changed to May 5th. Anyone have this happen before? This is a first for me.


I have seen this bug once before (a few months ago). I don't have a tuning adapter. A reboot fixed it.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

morac said:


> The thumbs-up ads have been around for a while now. If you fast forwarded you most likely would have seen a billboard ad, which has also been around for a while.


Haven't ever seen one of those billboard ads overlayed while fast forwarding through commercial breaks (but then, I almost always scoot through breaks with 30-second-skips).


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## dd9 (Aug 10, 2000)

morac said:


> The thumbs-up ads have been around for a while now. If you fast forwarded you most likely would have seen a billboard ad, which has also been around for a while.


Is there a link somewhere that shows what a billboard ad looks like? I don't believe I've ever seen one. Is it a market thing maybe where not everyone would see them?


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

dd9 said:


> Is there a link somewhere that shows what a billboard ad looks like? I don't believe I've ever seen one. Is it a market thing maybe where not everyone would see them?


See the second image in this post.


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## dd9 (Aug 10, 2000)

morac said:


> See the second image in this post.


Thanks for the link. Wow, I've never seen one of those (thankfully). I have seen the little 'thumbs up' icon which is actually usefull if you want to record the show they are talking about, but never one with anything linked below it nor an ad in the middle of the screen.

So for those who get them, the banner ads only show up when FF-ing, or when... ?


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## morac (Mar 14, 2003)

dd9 said:


> So for those who get them, the banner ads only show up when FF-ing, or when... ?


It only displays during FF or rewind. This was done since it's harder to miss during ff/rew than the thumbs up ads.

The banner ads used to make a "ding" sound when they were displayed, but I haven't heard it do that for a while now so TiVo must have taken that out.


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## thenightfly42 (Mar 5, 2002)

[email protected] said:


> Instead of a recording being clipped, the manual and the season pass (overlapping on the same channel) both recorded for their allotted time, duplicating the overlap. This is a nice improvement. Anyone else notice this? Or perhaps it was in a prior release and I just didn't notice it?


This is a pre-existing feature. I don't remember what software was out at the time, but during the 2009 Super Bowl, I "double recorded" the same channel so that I wouldn't miss The Office.


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## MeStinkBAD (Jul 16, 2003)

*sigh* does anyone realize that DVRs such as TiVo are responsible for marketers trying to find ways of getting their message out? I mean we can skip thru ads with ease. In the past I've seen some annoyingly blatant attempts at product placement. It's no surprise that we now maybe spotting ads. Hopefully TiVo will find some middle ground that will satisfy both it's customers and sponsors.


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## rainbow (Feb 8, 2008)

Just saw the commercial listing last night when I paused a program. I have to admit - it is irritating.......


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## b_scott (Nov 27, 2006)

Tivo really needs to overhaul. Add real HD menus - update them in an exciting way and refresh the company. Add native support for the streaming stuff instead of resorting to Java or whatever they're doing making each add-on have its own seperate screen and feel. Moxi has no ads and no monthly service. It's not there yet, but I think within 2009 Moxi will really gain steam.


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## stujac (Jan 26, 2002)

Moxi will never get there until it supports ota and that's not going to happen any time soon.


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## b_scott (Nov 27, 2006)

I don't know anyone who doesn't have cable of some sort. I don't think as high a percentage of people solely use OTA as you think. And that number will only go up as the years go by, for cable of some sort. Especially if you're investing in a box like Moxi.

All I know is what I just read on it an hour ago, I'm just saying Tivo needs to step it up and get with 2009.


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

stujac said:


> Moxi will never get there until it supports ota and that's not going to happen any time soon.


They support a third, OTA-only tuner plugged into its USB port.


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

b_scott said:


> Tivo really needs to overhaul. Add real HD menus - update them in an exciting way and refresh the company. Add native support for the streaming stuff instead of resorting to Java or whatever they're doing making each add-on have its own seperate screen and feel. Moxi has no ads and no monthly service. It's not there yet, but I think within 2009 Moxi will really gain steam.


oddly enough - Moxi is starting to get knocked in actual hands on reviews for its unintuitive screen navigation and having too much on the main screen etc..
Java does not make things different - partnering with different companies makes things different. So Netflix will not look like Amazon - just the way it is.
TiVo has a no monthly fee option of lifetime and a reatil Tivo HD and lifetime is 700$ for a first time TiVo buyer. you do not get 250Gig of hard drive but an expander will take care of that.

PS - a device with no installed base will not have ads by default, who would want to put ads on it. TiVo barely has enough subs to attract advertising attention.

I like TiVo having a competitor but Digeo better have a cash pile that will last them through 2010 at the least


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## bkdtv (Jan 9, 2003)

ZeoTiVo said:


> oddly enough - Moxi is starting to get knocked in actual hands on reviews for its unintuitive screen navigation and having too much on the main screen etc..
> Java does not make things different - partnering with different companies makes things different. So Netflix will not look like Amazon - just the way it is.


I don't think that's quite what he meant.

Amazon and Netflix certainly want their services distinguished, but that doesn't mean they need to function like completely separate applications.


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## M3 Adjuster (Feb 11, 2009)

mikeyts said:


> Unfortunately, S-P-S-PAUSE-S, also causes the progress bar to disappear immediately during FF and REW, which is unacceptable to me. (It also doesn't survive restarts, so you have to re-enable it every time). If you have a good programmable universal remote (Harmony, HT Master, etc), you can program the PAUSE button to send PAUSE, CLEAR, which is works great for me .


Ha! Nice workaround using a programmable remote... I am going to program mine to use the pause/clear together.. thank you!


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## ZeoTiVo (Jan 2, 2004)

bkdtv said:


> I don't think that's quite what he meant.
> 
> Amazon and Netflix certainly want their services distinguished, but that doesn't mean they need to function like completely separate applications.


well someone needs to tell Netflix and Amazon that
I am sure they got a significant say in how their apps look, in particular Netflix.
You pick from a list and it streams - now I agree that the Netflix interface on TiVo sucks since it is just a list of my queue and takes time to scroll through for someone like me that adds stuff of any interest and ends up with 100 items. it needs to be sorted and filtered at a minimum


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## spocko (Feb 4, 2009)

ZeoTiVo said:


> the Netflix interface on TiVo sucks since it is just a list of my queue and takes time to scroll through for someone like me that adds stuff of any interest and ends up with 100 items. it needs to be sorted and filtered at a minimum


I agree that having a single queue with no grouping or sorting is not great, but in my opinion the Tivo Netflix interface design is superior to Roku, Xbox, and the Samsung BD players. Tivo presents a textutal list of titles, so it's easy to identify things, and the page up/down controls allow you to move through the list quickly. The "other guys" show a row of cover images, which while being arguably "prettier", makes it more tedious to browse the list of titles.


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## KevinSartori (Jul 1, 2004)

mikeyts said:


> Unfortunately, S-P-S-PAUSE-S, also causes the progress bar to disappear immediately during FF and REW, which is unacceptable to me. (It also doesn't survive restarts, so you have to re-enable it every time). If you have a good programmable universal remote (Harmony, HT Master, etc), you can program the PAUSE button to send PAUSE, CLEAR, which is works great for me .





M3 Adjuster said:


> Ha! Nice workaround using a programmable remote... I am going to program mine to use the pause/clear together.. thank you!


I wasn't even sure I could do this with my Monster MCC AV100 (Harmony-based) remote, because it never even occurred to me to try! It took me a couple of minutes, but I found it. Nice job thinking of a solution "outside the box"! Thanks!


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

spocko said:


> ...in my opinion the Tivo Netflix interface design is superior to Roku, Xbox, and the Samsung BD players. Tivo presents a textutal list of titles, so it's easy to identify things, and the page up/down controls allow you to move through the list quickly. The "other guys" show a row of cover images, which while being arguably "prettier", makes it more tedious to browse the list of titles.


To each his own, but I prefer the Xbox interface as a piece of UI design. It's much faster and easier for me to use than TiVo's. It shows partial covers for 11 items (versus TiVo's 9 lines) and I have no problem recognizing the items in my queue from the box cover art (even partial box covers); things I've put in there whose box cover I don't recognize I can't recognize from the title, either--I have to look at the description to remember what the film is about.

Having said that, I much prefer to stream Netflix titles to TiVo, because my Xbox is much noisier in operation. If the Xbox was as quiet as TiVo, I'd prefer using it. (For most of my networked video file playback, I use the PS3, which is usually as quiet as TiVo. It doesn't have a Netflix streaming interface other than PlayOn, which is overpriced (IMHO), clunky and requires a UPnP server running on a PC, with no access to Netflix' streaming HD encodings).


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## sbourgeo (Nov 10, 2000)

Just had my first grey screen on analog channels (with no cable cards) on 11.0c.


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## will792 (Jan 4, 2005)

notabbott said:


> Yes. Have you rebooted/restarted since? I may try that later to see if it helps.
> 
> Later,
> COZ


Reboot did not help me with problems that started since 11.0c was installed. Now Tivo commonly reboots itself after progressively getting slow on menus and especially while handling at least one HD recording.

I have Series3 with the original 250GB hard drive. When the problem started I blamed external HD and divorced it but unfortunately it did not make any difference.

Any possible remedies besides waiting for the next Tivo update?


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

sbourgeo said:


> Just had my first grey screen on analog channels (with no cable cards) on 11.0c.


I was really hoping this would fix this issue for my brother. I haven't seen it but we have 2 Series3 units with cablecards and rarely record analog channels.

Scott


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## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

will792 said:


> Reboot did not help me with problems that started since 11.0c was installed. Now Tivo commonly reboots itself after progressively getting slow on menus and especially while handling at least one HD recording.
> 
> I have Series3 with the original 250GB hard drive. When the problem started I blamed external HD and divorced it but unfortunately it did not make any difference.
> 
> Any possible remedies besides waiting for the next Tivo update?


If divorcing the external did not help, that only leaves the internal...


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## will792 (Jan 4, 2005)

greg_burns said:


> If divorcing the external did not help, that only leaves the internal...


Is it possible to get some hints from Tivo that the hard drive is having troubles? I am not convinced that HD causes slowdown and reboot. The unit was perfectly fine until 11.0c install. It might a coincidence.

It would be really nice to have HD diagnostics or drive failures log in Tivo UI.


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## greg_burns (May 22, 2004)

will792 said:


> Is it possible to get some hints from Tivo that the hard drive is having troubles? I am not convinced that HD causes slowdown and reboot. The unit was perfectly fine until 11.0c install. It might a coincidence.
> 
> It would be really nice to have HD diagnostics or drive failures log in Tivo UI.


I am going with the assumption that you are new here and have not read the hundreds of threads on why it may not be a coincidence.  

Here is a typical one. link

There are the Kickstarts you can try. But they sometimes don't turn up things like pulling the drive and connecting to a PC and running diagnostics does. (Western Digital lifeguard or Hitachi's Drive Fitness tests, both free)


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## will792 (Jan 4, 2005)

greg_burns said:


> I am going with the assumption that you are new here and have not read the hundreds of threads on why it may not be a coincidence.
> 
> Here is a typical one. link
> 
> There are the Kickstarts you can try. But they sometimes don't turn up things like pulling the drive and connecting to a PC and running diagnostics does. (Western Digital lifeguard or Hitachi's Drive Fitness tests, both free)


I am happy to report that replacing the HD fixed the problems that started since installation of 11c. The kickstart 57 and 58 on the original drive did not make any difference and since 250GB in a Tivo these days is like driving a car with 70HP engine I just replaced the drive with 750GB WD AVCS.

The thread you linked is very inconclusive. I do not believe that software update can damage a hard drive. One expressed opinion that the update activates usage of a damaged sector that existed before sounds more plausible.


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## reeter98103 (Nov 15, 2007)

Here's my response to this: If I'm PAYING for the service, I don't want the ads!!! I don't want watermarks on ANYTHING, and I don't want to see gratuitous ADS!

Are you listening TiVo? I'm paying you already- therefore skip the ads. Like cable (Showtime, HBO, etc.), now called 'premium' channels, there are no ads.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

reeter98103 said:


> Here's my response to this: If I'm PAYING for the service, I don't want the ads!!! I don't want watermarks on ANYTHING, and I don't want to see gratuitous ADS!
> 
> Are you listening TiVo? I'm paying you already- therefore skip the ads. Like cable (Showtime, HBO, etc.), now called 'premium' channels, there are no ads.


Let's see...you pay for cable TV, or sat TV, and you get...um....LOTS of ads....hmmm....


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## DCIFRTHS (Jan 6, 2000)

Bierboy said:


> Let's see...you pay for cable TV, or sat TV, and you get...um....LOTS of ads....hmmm....


Talk about beating the dead horse...


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

DCIFRTHS said:


> Talk about beating the dead horse...


That's what I would say about this topic...


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## DCIFRTHS (Jan 6, 2000)

Bierboy said:


> That's what I would say about this topic...


We all know that's how you feel, and very simply, that was my point.

 *Maybe my point would have been easier to understand if it looked a little like a TiVo ad.* :up:


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

Actually, it's all *you* guys who just love to continue to...









They're not going away...give it a rest.


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## RoyK (Oct 22, 2004)

Bierboy said:


> Let's see...you pay for cable TV, or sat TV, and you get...um....LOTS of ads....hmmm....


Oh, how could we have missed that. The cable company screws its customers over, the satellite company screws its customers over over....so it must be just fine for TiVo to do it too.......


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

RoyK said:


> Oh, how could we have missed that. The cable company screws its customers over, the satellite company screws its customers over over....so it must be just fine for TiVo to do it too.......


I think that his point was that many things are supported both by fees _and_ by advertisement. Pay big bucks for season tickets at the ballpark and be pelted with ads from every corner when you go to a game. I pay $50/month to TWC for a package of 60 or 70 "Expanded Basic" channels, all of which feature as many ads per hour as any of the free-to-air channels. I'd hate to think of what they'd want to charge if those channels were ad free and completely supported by cable subscription fees.

As has been pointed out ad nauseum in this thread and elsewhere, TiVo is not now nor has ever been wildly profitable. They have to develop other revenue sources where they can, or increase their service fees to a point that would discourage new customers (more than they are by the current subscription fees). Some of their ad placements are more annoying than others, but I doubt that many customers will put their TiVos up for sale on Ebay over this.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

mikeyts said:


> I think that his point was that many things are supported both by fees _and_ by advertisement. Pay big bucks for season tickets at the ballpark and be pelted with ads from every corner when you go to a game. I pay $50/month to TWC for a package of 60 or 70 "Expanded Basic" channels, all of which feature as many ads per hour as any of the free-to-air channels. I'd hate to think of what they'd want to charge if those channels were ad free and completely supported by cable subscription fees.....


EXACTLY...thank you.


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## DCIFRTHS (Jan 6, 2000)

mikeyts said:


> I think that his point was that many things are supported both by fees _and_ by advertisement. Pay big bucks for season tickets at the ballpark and be pelted with ads from every corner when you go to a game. ...


My friend has season tickets for the Yankees. I was quick to point out that the advertising in that stadium is sickening. In my opinion, it is distracting, and diminishes the experience of being at the game.



mikeyts said:


> As has been pointed out ad nauseum in this thread and elsewhere, TiVo is not now nor has ever been wildly profitable. They have to develop other revenue sources where they can, or increase their service fees to a point that would discourage new customers (more than they are by the current subscription fees). Some of their ad placements are more annoying than others, but I doubt that many customers will put their TiVos up for sale on Ebay over this.


There is one other option that you don't mention. Increase subscription fees for those that don't want to view the extra garbage on their boxes.


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## orangeboy (Apr 19, 2004)

DCIFRTHS said:


> There is one other option that you don't mention. Increase subscription fees for those that don't want to view the extra garbage on their boxes.


:up:


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

DCIFRTHS said:


> My friend has season tickets for the Yankees. I was quick to point out that the advertising in that stadium is sickening. In my opinion, it is distracting, and diminishes the experience of being at the game.


I'm not saying that ads at the ballpark (or anywhere else) aren't annoying--I'm saying that they're reality. I'd be surprised if they affected ticket sales in any meaningful way (I'm personally much more upset about the horror of beer in plastic bottles).


> There is one other option that you don't mention. Increase subscription fees for those that don't want to view the extra garbage on their boxes.


It might be possible for them to do that, but it sounds like a marketing nightmare. Some might pay the extra price, if it were reasonable, but others would rail about it being robbery and how they shouldn't have to pay to not have ads in their DVR GUI.

TiVo is a company established to make a profit. If they lose more business than revenue gained by placing ads in their GUI, then they'll take them out. Otherwise, complaining about them isn't likely to get rid of them. But hey--if it makes you feel better ... .


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## Phantom Gremlin (Jun 20, 2002)

mikeyts said:


> Some of their ad placements are more annoying than others, but I doubt that many customers will put their TiVos up for sale on Ebay over this.


People might not sell an existing TiVo because of the ads, but they might be less willing to purchase an additional TiVo.

Also, people might be less willing to evangelize the product. I used to do quite a lot of evangelism, but not now. The problem is that I'm annoyed by the various minor flaws, silly bugs, commercials, etc.

Evangelism is important. The advantages of TiVo aren't immediately obvious to the random consumer. They must be sold. I'm sure more people acquired TiVos because of evangelism than acquired TiVos after viewing TiVo's utterly moronic advertising.

Thought question: Imagine that Apple offered a TiVo-like product. Do you think their GUI would be as infested with idiotic ads as TiVo's is? I don't think so!


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## mikeyts (Jul 10, 2004)

Phantom Gremlin said:


> Also, people might be less willing to evangelize the product. I used to do quite a lot of evangelism, but not now. The problem is that I'm annoyed by the various minor flaws, silly bugs, commercials, etc.


I'd still recommend TiVo to people, since the ads don't really bother me and there are no bugs that bother me either. I'd warn whoever I was recommending it to about the ads, but I'd still recommend it. Right now, there's nothing on the market that would be an acceptable alternative for me.


Phantom Gremlin said:


> Thought question: Imagine that Apple offered a TiVo-like product. Do you think their GUI would be as infested with idiotic ads as TiVo's is? I don't think so!


Maybe not. But so far, no one has proven that they can make the no-ad model of non-provider-related DVRs profitable. Digeo is about to make a go of it with their new retail Moxi DVR, but I have no faith that they'll make it. It would be interesting to see Apple try.


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## bschuler2007 (Feb 25, 2007)

Count me as one who also turned ANTI-evangelistic.


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## spocko (Feb 4, 2009)

bschuler2007 said:


> Count me as one who also turned ANTI-evangelistic.


But you're still here. I suspect that it's because, depite it's faults, Tivo is still a better product overall for most people than any competitor that's currently available.


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