# A momentous day...



## TCM2007 (Dec 25, 2006)

I have just packed up my last TiVo to move house, and I do not expect to connect it up again in the new place. For seven and a half years they have insulated me from the horrors of scheduled TV, and been an entertaining hobby. The end of an era for me!

Sniff.


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## speedyrite (May 18, 2002)

There will now be one minute of silence on the TiVo UK forum...


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## Automan (Oct 29, 2000)

People can survive without Tivo.

Neighbour had an issue playing back a DVD
easy scart knocked loose.

She has a 21" JVC 4:3 TV, VCR by RF and a DVD player and of course just 4 channels.

She is happy with her solution which I told her would need an upgrade in 2012.

Automan.


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## verses (Nov 6, 2002)

speedyrite said:


> There will now be one minute of silence on the TiVo UK forum...


Black arm-bands all round.

Ian


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## daveh (Sep 3, 2001)

TCM2007 said:


> I have just packed up my last TiVo to move house, and I do not expect to connect it up again in the new place. For seven and a half years they have insulated me from the horrors of scheduled TV, and been an entertaining hobby. The end of an era for me!
> 
> Sniff.


As a matter of interest, what, if anything, are you replacing it with?


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## TCM2007 (Dec 25, 2006)

A Windows MCE PC and Sky HD.

Had both in place for some time, but TiVo remained in use for the kid's TV; new house has no place for a kids TV, so to the attic with the last of the four it is...


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## poissony (Feb 20, 2002)

I guess this must mean that Sky+/HD is reliable?


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## Sneals2000 (Aug 25, 2002)

poissony said:


> I guess this must mean that Sky+/HD is reliable?


In my experience - not as reliable as Tivo and MCE - but as it is the only solution for recording Sky HD (*) it has to do, and it is still reliable enough not to prove annoying most of the time.

(*) I realise that you can use DVB-S2 cards with a softcam or reverse engineered physical CAM and a valid Sky HD subscription - but this is quite a niche and techy solution only really open to those who are happy to play (and you still need a Sky+ HD box to get the subscription in the first place)


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## b166er (Oct 24, 2003)

I'm expecting to pack up my TiVo too in the next year or two when (if?) we move house (I say if because I could easily have said the same thing 12 months ago and we still haven't moved yet).

In the house we're currently in, a 1.2m dish is not a problem, we have a south facing balcony and nobody can see the dish (also it's covered by the balcony roof from snow/rain). In the new house I doubt we'll be so lucky.

I'm expecting the Internet delivery mechanisms to replace any kind of RF/Cable/Satellite method. I can get everything I need via thebox/mininova so really can live without TiVo now. As long as we remain in this house, I'll keep Sky/TiVo (why not, it's not costing anything with my freesat sky card and lifetime TiVo), but in a brand new house I can't imagine keeping a big dish.


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## Automan (Oct 29, 2000)

A Momentous day on Sky HD for Star Trek fans...
Star Trek 1,2,3,4 & 5 on today and four more on this Tuesday 

Also a new HD channel 452 "Rush HD"

Automan.


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

TCM2007 said:


> new house has no place for a kids TV.


Why is it that then are you also packing up and disposing of the kids too then?

Also why put them in the attic instead of selling them on Ebay and letting somebody else get some pleasure out of using them?


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

Automan said:


> People can survive without Tivo.
> 
> Neighbour had an issue playing back a DVD
> easy scart knocked loose.
> ...


Surely its more a case that she knows no better and her budget didn't run to a £600 Tivo.

The key difference between most of us and other people is that not everyone else is as interested in television programs or technology as most of us are.

I have a friend I cannot even persuade to buy a Freeview box because he believes that it would be confusing and waste too much of his life to have a wider choice than five live tv channels to choose from.


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## Raisltin Majere (Mar 13, 2004)

TCM2007 said:


> I have just packed up my last TiVo to move house, and I do not expect to connect it up again in the new place. For seven and a half years they have insulated me from the horrors of scheduled TV, and been an entertaining hobby. The end of an era for me!
> 
> Sniff.


Are you going to stick around here?

I'd like to thank you for everything you've done for all of us. From solving our problems in the forum to all the hacks/modules you've written.


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## chimaera (Nov 13, 2000)

poissony said:


> I guess this must mean that Sky+/HD is reliable?


Certainly reliable enough to be usable. Although the EPG is still as awful as ever


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

chimaera said:


> Although the EPG is still as awful as ever


And is still only 7 days long too.


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## chimaera (Nov 13, 2000)

Pete77 said:


> And is still only 7 days long too.


Yep, although you do grudgingly get used to it and the world still goes round despite of it


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

chimaera said:


> Yep, although you do grudgingly get used to it and the world still goes round despite of it


But as long as my Tivo still works then why should I want to decommission it in favour of an inferior service.

OK I know I am missing out on HD but as I only care about plot and program content and HD is a trivial and insignificant change (that will cost a lot of extra money for me to be able to watch it) then why change from being a loyal Tivo customer.


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## Mark Bennett (Sep 17, 2001)

Why not use the TiVo to control the Sky Box?

That's what I do - and if it's an HD programme the TiVo tells the HD box to record it.

You get the benefit of the TiVo scheuduling, more than 7 days guide data, Tivoweb, etc, and the HD of Sky.

Well cool!


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

Mark Bennett said:


> That's what I do - and if it's an HD programme the TiVo tells the HD box to record it.


How does your Tivo tell your Sky box what to do? I can see that it can change the Sky HD box's channel but now how it tells it to start recording an HD program?

Anyhow I don't have an HD capable television yet so there is no case for buying a secondhand Sky HD box. Also as I only have a single communal satellite feed doesn't that mean I wouldn't be able to record anything on a Sky HD box, even if I got one?


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## mikerr (Jun 2, 2005)

hack to get skyHD to record


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## chimaera (Nov 13, 2000)

Pete77 said:


> HD is a trivial and insignificant change


Been to Specsavers recently 



Pete77 said:


> (that will cost a lot of extra money for me to be able to watch it)


Ah, now we're getting to the point 

If content is really all that matters you could save yourself all that trouble and just use Youtube and iPlayer. Or get a black and white TV, the licence is cheaper.


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

chimaera said:


> Or get a black and white TV, the licence is cheaper.


I can't believe they still exist but apparently they do.

See www.tvlicensing.co.uk/information/index.jsp

I bet there are a lot of spot visits to homes that have a Black and White tv license these days though.

Also how long till the government plugs the loophole that means you don't need a tv license if you only download stuff from BBC Iplayer and 4OD etc and don't watch it live.


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## Sneals2000 (Aug 25, 2002)

Pete77 said:


> I can't believe they still exist but apparently they do.
> 
> See www.tvlicensing.co.uk/information/index.jsp
> 
> ...


Yes - and once the iPlayer starts offering streaming of live channels - that bit of it WILL require a valid TV licence AIUI.

In Germany I believe they've already shifted from TV licensing to Internet licensing haven't they?


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

Sneals2000 said:


> In Germany I believe they've already shifted from TV licensing to Internet licensing haven't they?


Well I would hope they were still charging to watch via tv as well but had just changed the rules to include offline internet downloading and watching.

As I understand it watching live program streams (eg BBC News 24) on a computer is already caught by the current tv licesing rules. Its downloading the program and watching it non-live that is not covered.


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## Mark Bennett (Sep 17, 2001)

Pete77 said:


> Anyhow I don't have an HD capable television yet so there is no case for buying a secondhand Sky HD box. Also as I only have a single communal satellite feed doesn't that mean I wouldn't be able to record anything on a Sky HD box, even if I got one?


Why not buy a new box?
Ours cost £39, plus £30 install last year when Comet were having thier £99 offer (it only cost us £39 as we had been subscribers for a few years).
There have been a few offers this year as well. Thre's currently a £99 for new subscribers one I think (unless it's finished).

I don't know how the feed works for you - but the HD box does require a twin LNB - so unless this can be fitted to your communal feed then sadly no, you probably wouldn't be able to...


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

Mark Bennett said:


> Why not buy a new box?
> Ours cost £39, plus £30 install last year when Comet were having thier £99 offer (it only cost us £39 as we had been subscribers for a few years).
> There have been a few offers this year as well. Thre's currently a £99 for new subscribers one I think (unless it's finished).


I think you ignore the small matter of at least 1 year of Sky Mixes at £16 and one year's Sky HD fee that would no doubt be a contractual commitment of this "£39" deal. More likely is that if one wants HD one would be prepared to commit to say £35+ of subs per months (all Mixes plus some movies or sports) plus the £10 per month HD fee.

So your £39 box translates in to about £540 in Sky subs I would not otherwise be paying plus a one off £39. OK I hear you say that you already paid those other Sky subs anyway so for you its only £39 plus £10 per month for one year (£120) so around £159 in total over 1 year. But you still can't get away from the fact that for me it would be more like a £500 commitment, just for one year. But I have only spent just over a total of £600 on my Tivo, Lifetime Sub and hard drive and Cachecard upgrades over the last five and a half years.........

With Sky its nearly £600 per annum.


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## Mark Bennett (Sep 17, 2001)

Glass half empty then Pete. 

I don't sub to Movies - I'd rather buy them on DVD/HD/Blu, but I already had multiroom and a $ky+ Box (So now have the HD and a + ) but I do have Sports for the A1GP, Nascar, IRL etc.

It sounds like you are on the basic package? Well you could just add the &#163;10 HD subscrtiption for a year (I'm sure you are right that you need to sub to this as a minimum) and after that go back to just the free HD channels (there are an increasing number). By then they may have dropped the &#163;10 extra for HD - well we can hope! 

I can't belive I'm sounding like I'm trying to sell this expensive package! I'm not - I agree it's overpriced, but you can do it cheaper than you suggest - if you want.


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

Mark Bennett said:


> Glass half empty then Pete.


No my glass of wine is full up paid for by all the money I have managed to save instead of wasting on Sky subscriptions.:up:



> It sounds like you are on the basic package?


No I'm on the little known £0 per month package (www.freesatfromsky.co.uk or Sky Pay Once Watch Forever now stocked in most Currys Digital stores) on which you still get rather a lot of FTA and FTV channels.



> Well you could just add the £10 HD subscrtiption for a year (I'm sure you are right that you need to sub to this as a minimum) and after that go back to just the free HD channels (there are an increasing number). By then they may have dropped the £10 extra for HD - well we can hope! .


You are still asking me to pay at least £26 per month (£16 + £10) I am not paying now for a year and more more at least £31 per month (£21 + £10) I am not paying now.


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## Mark Bennett (Sep 17, 2001)

I'm not asking you to pay anything. You mentioned buying a secondhand $ky HD box, and I thought I might help by saying there are sometimes ways to get new ones much cheaper than the &#163;300 price Sky normally charge.

I was trying to help. My apologies, didn't mean to offend.


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

Mark Bennett said:


> I'm not asking you to pay anything. You mentioned buying a secondhand $ky HD box, and I thought I might help by saying there are sometimes ways to get new ones much cheaper than the £300 price Sky normally charge.


And I was just pointing out the cunning nature of Sky's marketing in making people think they were really getting a Sky HD box for only £39. Next thing you will be telling me I can get a "free" top of the range mobile if I just nip down to the CarphoneWarehouse and sign on the dotted line.



> I was trying to help. My apologies, didn't mean to offend.


And I was just trying to point out why buying a secondhand Sky HD box is actually a lot cheaper for those us with a single satellite feed (so can't use Sky+ recording) but who still want to watch live HD programs. When you sign a contract its actually quite important to multiply by 12 or whatever number of months are involved and work out the total cost over the whole time period.

Marketing men are always trying to claim things are cheap or free that in practice are not............


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## PhilG (Jan 15, 2002)

Pete77 said:


> But as long as my Tivo still works then why should I want to decommission it in favour of an inferior service.
> 
> OK I know I am missing out on HD but as I only care about plot and program content and HD is a trivial and insignificant change (that will cost a lot of extra money for me to be able to watch it) then why change from being a loyal Tivo customer.


 I have to agree with Pete on this one - for those of us who just "watch telly" there is still nothing to beat Tivo, or even comes close (as I said in a letter to one of the satellite mags, if anyone saw it)

Phil G


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## PhilG (Jan 15, 2002)

TCM2007 said:


> I have just packed up my last TiVo to move house, and I do not expect to connect it up again in the new place. For seven and a half years they have insulated me from the horrors of scheduled TV, and been an entertaining hobby. The end of an era for me!
> 
> Sniff.


Good luck with the move and thanks for the hacks (especially endpad)

We'll miss you

Phil G


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