# WD HD Live



## dbutts (Mar 28, 2007)

I bought the WD HD Live and its an awesome little device for outputting various formats from home network, USB, media server via HDMI to TV.

It works great for things I've downloaded (.mkv, avi, etc).

I am using pyTivo and TivoToGo, (I also have Tivo Desktop Plus). I can bring the .tivo files over to my pc and I'm using Tivo Decoder Gui to convert to mpg but I'm not getting any audio. 

Does anyone know of any other .tivo (HD) conversion tools? Online there's lots of reference to Direct Show Dump, but I can't find a download.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

dbutts said:


> I bought the WD HD Live and its an awesome little device for outputting various formats from home network, USB, media server via HDMI to TV.
> 
> It works great for things I've downloaded (.mkv, avi, etc).
> 
> ...


Here's a good review of the WD HD Live -- looks nice!

I'm confused: Do you use pyTiVo *with* the HD Live somehow? (It looks more like a *substitute* for a PC,/pyTiVo/TiVo combination) 

Where do you get your video files to use with the HD Live (other than converted .TiVo files)?

Sorry I can't help with your Tivo Decoder audio problem.


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

dlfl said:


> Here's a good review of the WD HD Live -- looks nice!....


My LG BD390 Blu-ray does everything this does, plus more....


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

Bierboy said:


> My LG BD390 Blu-ray does everything this does, plus more....


It ought to do more -- the Amazon price is $274 while the HD Live is $120.

Obioiusly the LG device plays blue-ray disks, which is "more".

Does the LG device play files directly from a USB stick or USB drive, with the broad range of media types supported by the HD Live? If not, that would be a "less".

What other "more"s are there?


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## jmemmott (Jul 12, 2003)

dbutts said:


> I bought the WD HD Live and its an awesome little device for outputting various formats from home network, USB, media server via HDMI to TV.
> 
> It works great for things I've downloaded (.mkv, avi, etc).
> 
> ...


I believe that the same issues that affect the original WDTV also affect the WD HD Live. See the following comment : http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=7570460#post7570460


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## dbutts (Mar 28, 2007)

I get my files online or from friends. I do not condone filesharing, but there are plenty out there in the torrent world if you look.

No, not the same as pytivo. I use pytivo to pull shows that i record on my hd tivo to my pc then convert them to something that the WD HD Live can use.


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## dbutts (Mar 28, 2007)

all of this said:

does anyone know of another .tivo converter? (HD only please)


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## jmemmott (Jul 12, 2003)

dbutts said:


> all of this said:
> 
> does anyone know of another .tivo converter? (HD only please)


All that said:

If you follow the link I left above, it will take you to the KTTMG thread which is an alternate .tivo converter and tell you why simply switching to another .tivo converter will not be sufficient to fix your audio issues...


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

dlfl said:


> It ought to do more -- the Amazon price is $274 while the HD Live is $120.
> 
> Obioiusly the LG device plays blue-ray disks, which is "more".
> 
> ...


yes it does play directly from a USB drive. although I've only used it over my network.. I can't envision me actually hooking an external device to it when it's much easier to just get it over the Network.

But the LG BD390 also has VUDU, Netflix streaming and youtube streaming.
Certainly worth the $240 that amazon was selling it for last month.

Especially since the BD player part is as fast or faster than a PS3 slim.


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## dbutts (Mar 28, 2007)

odd thing: files that i convert from my series 2 (low def tivo) work just fine.. its the ones from the hd tivo that have no audio.. .. and when i say "no audio" i mean on the wd hd live.. they have audio on my pc.. hrrm..

thanks for the link. reading it now and i think i understand what's happening...still not sure why it works on my pc and not on the wd live.


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## jbernardis (Oct 22, 2003)

Can this device easily access network attached storage without any software running on my PC? I have lots of video up on an NAS drive, but in order to get to it with my tivo, I have to have my PC turned on and tivo desktop or pytivo running. If this device could mount the NAS storage directly without an intervening PC, that would seal the deal for me.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

aaronwt said:


> yes it does play directly from a USB drive. although I've only used it over my network.. I can't envision me actually hooking an external device to it when it's much easier to just get it over the Network.
> 
> But the LG BD390 also has VUDU, Netflix streaming and youtube streaming.
> Certainly worth the $240 that amazon was selling it for last month.
> ...


Thanks, just learning here.

It appears the WD device requires a USB adapter to do wireless networking, which adds around $65 if you need it.

The WD device review says it also gets youtube.

Yep, according to camelcamelcamel.com the peak low price for the LG unit was $237.98 on Oct. 25th. (New unit, directly from Amazon.)

The WD unit still seems like a good value at $99 (several sources). A lot depends on how much you value playing BD's and the wireless connection.


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## jmemmott (Jul 12, 2003)

dbutts said:


> odd thing: files that i convert from my series 2 (low def tivo) work just fine.. its the ones from the hd tivo that have no audio.. .. and when i say "no audio" i mean on the wd hd live.. they have audio on my pc.. hrrm..


A series 2 cannot grab the digital broadcast stream directly. It needs a cable box to convert the digital broadcast and then records the program from the output of that process. Since it is actually doing a recording, it is able to add stream headers at the start and then keep the stream data consistent during the entire program. When the WD products see these headers, they know which codecs to use and everyone is happy.

In the HD boxes, the incoming digital stream is simply saved to disk not converted or "recorded". Since the start time is arbitrary, it is unlikely that any stream headers appear at the beginning and the cable networks also often switch audio stream types as they go. AC3 2 channel in commercials to 5.1 DTS in a movie for example. This leaves the WD player guessing at the right codec. It doesn't seem to handle the mid program changes well so if it guesses wrong and the wrong codec is loaded, no sound and/or no video may come out for the duration of that program.

The PC media player like the Tivo is more tolerent of this condition and adapts when it happens. The WD devices could be designed to handle it better, but ...


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## Bierboy (Jun 12, 2004)

dlfl said:


> It ought to do more -- the Amazon price is $274 while the HD Live is $120.
> 
> Obioiusly the LG device plays blue-ray disks, which is "more".
> 
> ...


Actually I paid significantly less than that from Amazon. And, yes, it plays off a jump drive and advertises that it plays multiple media types. I say "advertises" since I haven't done that yet.


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## dbutts (Mar 28, 2007)

jbernardis said:


> Can this device easily access network attached storage without any software running on my PC? I have lots of video up on an NAS drive, but in order to get to it with my tivo, I have to have my PC turned on and tivo desktop or pytivo running. If this device could mount the NAS storage directly without an intervening PC, that would seal the deal for me.


Yes, it can easily see NAS and pc devices. My final hurdle is being able to convert .tivo to some format that the WD can appreciate. So far, audio is my biggest issue.


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## jbernardis (Oct 22, 2003)

Now all I need to do is convince the better half that I NEED a new receiver with more than 2 hdmi inputs.


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## dbutts (Mar 28, 2007)

jmemmott said:


> A series 2 cannot grab the digital broadcast stream directly. It needs a cable box to convert the digital broadcast and then records the program from the output of that process. Since it is actually doing a recording, it is able to add stream headers at the start and then keep the stream data consistent during the entire program. When the WD products see these headers, they know which codecs to use and everyone is happy.
> 
> In the HD boxes, the incoming digital stream is simply saved to disk not converted or "recorded". Since the start time is arbitrary, it is unlikely that any stream headers appear at the beginning and the cable networks also often switch audio stream types as they go. AC3 2 channel in commercials to 5.1 DTS in a movie for example. This leaves the WD player guessing at the right codec. It doesn't seem to handle the mid program changes well so if it guesses wrong and the wrong codec is loaded, no sound and/or no video may come out for the duration of that program.
> 
> The PC media player like the Tivo is more tolerent of this condition and adapts when it happens. The WD devices could be designed to handle it better, but ...


wow.. thanks for the informative reply. I'm going to keep tinkering with kmttg and commercial editting and hope i can get something that's narrowed down to one codec.

in the meantime, what would be a good way to convert the .tivo/mpeg to something that has a standard audio? again, my pc can play these files fine but the WD can't decode the audio. My thinking is that if my pc can understand it, it should be able to convert to some kind of usable audio.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

dbutts said:


> wow.. thanks for the informative reply. I'm going to keep tinkering with kmttg and commercial editting and hope i can get something that's narrowed down to one codec.
> 
> in the meantime, what would be a good way to convert the .tivo/mpeg to something that has a standard audio? again, my pc can play these files fine but the WD can't decode the audio. My thinking is that if my pc can understand it, it should be able to convert to some kind of usable audio.


Are you willing to pay $50 for a solution?

I think there is one using VideoReDo and you would be able to test it on a free trial basis before buying it. I think it could also be automated, if desired.

In brief, VRD allows you to specify MPEG audio on a file save and I think this will convert whatever audio is there to stereo (two channels) which I believe will be "usable". You would load the .TiVo file then save it with this option. Note this single load/save operation also does your TiVo-to-Mpeg2 conversion.

Post if you are interested and I will provide more detailed instructions, if necessary. (I can't verify this will work myself because I don't have your particular file type to test.)


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## dbutts (Mar 28, 2007)

dlfl said:


> Are you willing to pay $50 for a solution?
> 
> I think there is one using VideoReDo and you would be able to test it on a free trial basis before buying it. I think it could also be automated, if desired.
> 
> ...


thanks i'll look into videoredo.. and let everyone know how it works..

all in all, the WD HD Live is a neat little box but no replacement for a full scale HD tivo. I am trying to avoid the upfront costs of another tivo combined with the comcast monthly screwjob. Oh, and the fact that i hate comcast with a burning passion and would jump ship the moment my bldg offers something else (i live in a highrise)


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

dbutts said:


> thanks i'll look into videoredo.. and let everyone know how it works..
> 
> all in all, the WD HD Live is a neat little box but no replacement for a full scale HD tivo. I am trying to avoid the upfront costs of another tivo combined with the comcast monthly screwjob. Oh, and the fact that i hate comcast with a burning passion and would jump ship the moment my bldg offers something else (i live in a highrise)


OK, some tips on VRD:

VRD Plus is $50. VRD TVSuite is $75. The primary difference is TVSuite includes authoring DVD's. Either should work for your issue.

Be sure to perform the web registration (from VRD menus) for the free trial. Otherwise it will be crippled to 15 mins of video.

Load your .TiVo file. Select File->Save As. If you haven't done any editing it may ask you if you want to remux the whole file. Say yes.

In the file save dialog, select mpeg2 program stream as the output file type and click the options button. In the options dialog, *audio* section, select MPEG.

Enter file name and save the file.


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## jmemmott (Jul 12, 2003)

dbutts said:


> in the meantime, what would be a good way to convert the .tivo/mpeg to something that has a standard audio? again, my pc can play these files fine but the WD can't decode the audio. My thinking is that if my pc can understand it, it should be able to convert to some kind of usable audio.


You should not have to convert the audio to any specific type to use it with the WD. The WD handles many more codecs and containers than the Tivo. It just needs a clean start so it knows what it has. If you go back to the link I originally gave you, you will see that Dan S was able to use the VRD timeline to show the different audio segments in his recordings in different colors. By cutting away the initial commercials with the wrong audio, he was able to play the 5.1 audio from and HD without issue. I also use my WD TV for 5.1 surround sound but I have always used VRD and Quick Stream Fix to clean up the streams before I copy them to my NFS server for playback.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

jmemmott said:


> You should not have to convert the audio to any specific type to use it with the WD. The WD handles many more codecs and containers than the Tivo. It just needs a clean start so it knows what it has. If you go back to the link I originally gave you, you will see that Dan S was able to use the VRD timeline to show the different audio segments in his recordings in different colors. By cutting away the initial commercials with the wrong audio, he was able to play the 5.1 audio from and HD without issue. I also use my WD TV for 5.1 surround sound but I have always used VRD and Quick Stream Fix to clean up the streams before I copy them to my NFS server for playback.


No argument about this, but my idea was if he forced the audio to mpeg stereo when saving from VRD, he wouldn't have to bother with editing. And this process could be automated, I believe.


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## wierdo (Apr 7, 2002)

If you use kmttg and have it do comskip, it seems to fix any audio issues with both the WDTV Live and the FreeAgent Theater+. Pre-comskip, both will find the audio track, but it will be out of sync. After running the comskip step (which remuxes the file using mencoder) the commercials are gone and the audio is in sync.


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## janry (Jan 2, 2003)

wierdo said:


> If you use kmttg and have it do comskip, it seems to fix any audio issues with both the WDTV Live and the FreeAgent Theater+. Pre-comskip, both will find the audio track, but it will be out of sync. After running the comskip step (which remuxes the file using mencoder) the commercials are gone and the audio is in sync.


You are right that comskip fixes the audio problem for this device, or at least it did for me. But now, the video plays for a few seconds, then freezes for a few seconds. I'm not very experienced with kttmg so I don't know what is causing that.


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## wierdo (Apr 7, 2002)

janry said:


> You are right that comskip fixes the audio problem for this device, or at least it did for me. But now, the video plays for a few seconds, then freezes for a few seconds. I'm not very experienced with kttmg so I don't know what is causing that.


I haven't seen that. I've transferred both SD and HD programs and they seem to work reasonably well. Not perfect, but reasonably well.

In the end, I think I'm going to return both the WDTV and the Seagate and build that HTPC I've been looking at instead. It'll only be a couple hundred more, but XBMC will play nearly anything, and has an interface that is so far ahead of either of these things it makes them look like toys from 1996.


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## janry (Jan 2, 2003)

TiVo files converted in VideoReDo work beautifully for me without any editing.


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## Eamus Catuli (Aug 9, 2010)

dlfl said:


> OK, some tips on VRD:
> 
> VRD Plus is $50. VRD TVSuite is $75. The primary difference is TVSuite includes authoring DVD's. Either should work for your issue.
> 
> ...


I tried what you described and it ended up saving a 5.1 audio soucre as 2 channel stereo. Not happy with that, I tried again, this time with a couple of frame edits (which of course avoids the " haven't done any editing" message), and just saved it (mpg) and the file plays perfectly on my WDTV Live with 5.1 audio intact. :up:


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## sanjonny (Nov 2, 2008)

Did anyone find a way to do tis without video redo? I actually don't care if the audio is two channel because I am only using the box for travel and don't want to make the effort to edit the commercials and such, I just want to automate and play the files on the wd box, any thoughts without buying more software. Could I just use kttmg to recode the stream to say h.24 I mean, who knows if the hotel will even have an hdmi outlet, so composite might be fine too and aipudio won't matter as long as I can hear it.


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## rockethead (Feb 5, 2008)

I have been using Roxio Creator 2010 to covert .tivo files to .mpg or burn to DVD. The .mpg files work fine on my WDTVLive, but when you convert then .tivo Roxio always pops up a disclaimer that TIVO requires that the resolution be reduced when making copies of .tivo files. They look fine after the conversion, but not nearly as good as the original looks coming from the TIVO itself.


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## jbernardis (Oct 22, 2003)

rockethead said:


> I have been using Roxio Creator 2010 to covert .tivo files to .mpg or burn to DVD. The .mpg files work fine on my WDTVLive, but when you convert then .tivo Roxio always pops up a disclaimer that TIVO requires that the resolution be reduced when making copies of .tivo files. They look fine after the conversion, but not nearly as good as the original looks coming from the TIVO itself.


If you have to suffer poor quality, why are you doing it this way? Get a copy of tivodecode - it's free. To ny understanding, all it does is remove the tvio "envelope" and leave you with an mpg file. There is very little change in size which makes me think the original quality is preserved.


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