# Roamio HArd Drive Recommnedations



## ciscokid (Jan 14, 2003)

Can anyone recommend specific models of Hard Drives that I can pop into a New basic Roamio. I understand that it's a very simple plug and play replacement now.


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## spaldingclan (Aug 22, 2012)

this is a good one

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004RORMF6...lid=1PPXERWQ4ZXVW&coliid=I2FIK6X5MXCP7L&psc=1


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## truman861 (Jul 14, 2012)

what about the tivo software though, is it easy to copy over to the new drive?
I did have to replace the hd on my S2 a few years ago and took the image to a computer place as i couldnt do it with my laptop. had to be on a desktop machine.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

truman861 said:


> what about the tivo software though, is it easy to copy over to the new drive?
> I did have to replace the hd on my S2 a few years ago and took the image to a computer place as i couldnt do it with my laptop. had to be on a desktop machine.


Just install the new drive in your Roamio, then your Roamio will take care of the rest, no software or other computers needed for drives up to 3Tb.


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

spaldingclan said:


> this is a good one
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/dp/B004RORMF6...lid=1PPXERWQ4ZXVW&coliid=I2FIK6X5MXCP7L&psc=1


The above is a Desktop Harddrive - 2 Year WD warranty

This is the best recommended HDD - Western Digital 3 TB WD AV-GP WD30EURX - 3 Year WD warranty
http://www.amazon.com/Western-Digital-AV-GP-Intellipower-WD30EURX/dp/B00DXFEQGI/

Or Western Digital 2 TB WD AV-GP WD20EURX - 3 Year WD warranty WD20EURX
http://www.amazon.com/Western-Digital-AV-GP-Intellipower-WD20EURX/dp/B00DXOJJQQ/

* When purchasing from Amazon, I recommend only purchasing where Amazon is the seller (Ships from and sold by Amazon.com)


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## mattack (Apr 9, 2001)

lessd said:


> Just install the new drive in your Roamio, then your Roamio will take care of the rest, no software or other computers needed for drives up to 3Tb.


Though just so the originator knows, this obviously loses all of your programming.. There is no known way yet to do the old style 'upgrade' even if he wanted to.

He could transfer the non copy protected content to another Tivo or to a computer drive (e.g. via kmttg) first, then transfer it back to the Tivo... or just lose what's on the original drive (or some day, which drives back temporarily to watch the stuff on that drive)


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## ltxi (Feb 14, 2010)

CoxInPHX said:


> The above is a Desktop Harddrive - 2 Year WD warranty
> 
> This is the best recommended HDD - Western Digital 3 TB WD AV-GP WD30EURX - 3 Year WD warranty
> http://www.amazon.com/Western-Digital-AV-GP-Intellipower-WD30EURX/dp/B00DXFEQGI/
> ...


x2....on all


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## spaldingclan (Aug 22, 2012)

ltxi said:


> x2....on all


why are those other drives not a good model for the Roamio?


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

spaldingclan said:


> why are those other drives not a good model for the Roamio?


Almost any new hard drive today will do the job for TiVo, just don't go with any drive faster than 7200rpm and more likely a 5400rpm drive will do the job for TiVo as you do want the least amount of added heat. For added safety stay with WD as that the drive brand most used by TiVo (some of the first Roamios did use Seagate) It will be hard to make any error in picking a new drive for your TiVo.


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## A J Ricaud (Jun 25, 2002)

Newegg has the WD AV-GP WD30EURX 3TB IntelliPower 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive for $119.99 using PROMO CODE EMCYTZT58888


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## phaedruspress (Mar 28, 2014)

mattack said:


> Though just so the originator knows, this obviously loses all of your programming.. There is no known way yet to do the old style 'upgrade' even if he wanted to.
> 
> He could transfer the non copy protected content to another Tivo or to a computer drive (e.g. via kmttg) first, then transfer it back to the Tivo... or just lose what's on the original drive (or some day, which drives back temporarily to watch the stuff on that drive)


My apologies if it appears that I am hijacking this part of the thread but I have a question regarding the last part of what you said *(or some day, which drives back temporarily to watch the stuff on that drive* as it relates to another thread I started First Time Potential DVR Owner Question

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=516027

I want to archive media recorded by the Tivo for future watching and it seems that I am unable to do this. Are you saying that I can just remove the hard drive from the Tivo when it is full and then put in a brand new hard drive and that the Tivo will format the new drive and then I can start recording again and then anytime I wanted to I could remove the "new" hard drive and swap back the original previously removed hard drive andwatch the programming on that drive as well without any consequences?


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## spaldingclan (Aug 22, 2012)

phaedruspress said:


> My apologies if it appears that I am hijacking this part of the thread but I have a question regarding the last part of what you said *(or some day, which drives back temporarily to watch the stuff on that drive* as it relates to another thread I started First Time Potential DVR Owner Question
> 
> http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=516027
> 
> I want to archive media recorded by the Tivo for future watching and it seems that I am unable to do this. Are you saying that I can just remove the hard drive from the Tivo when it is full and then put in a brand new hard drive and that the Tivo will format the new drive and then I can start recording again and then anytime I wanted to I could remove the "new" hard drive and swap back the original previously removed hard drive andwatch the programming on that drive as well without any consequences?


correct. that would work.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

lessd said:


> Almost any new hard drive today will do the job for TiVo, just don't go with any drive faster than 7200rpm and more likely a 5400rpm drive will do the job for TiVo as you do want the least amount of added heat. For added safety stay with WD as that the drive brand most used by TiVo (some of the first Roamios did use Seagate) It will be hard to make any error in picking a new drive for your TiVo.


I feel (as in this is an educated opinion), that often the spinup power draw can be just as much reason as the heat factor, for not using 7200RPM drives. I've seen more than my fair share of power supplies (not just limited to TiVos), that spin up 54/5900 RPM drives with ease, but won't do so with 7200 RPM ones (can be immediate issue, or creep up over time). If we are talking about base-model Roamios, with sealed wall wart power supplies, mine are running very hot just running 3TB 5400 RPM drives. I leave two unpopulated spaces on my power strips on each side of mine, out of fear that they'll self-destruct, or start a fire, otherwise. There's less worry on the full-sized case profiles with the power supply inside the Tivo, with active air cooling, on both of these two matters, since that type tends to have more capacity, in addition to not being sealed in a wall-wart.

The 5400 and 5900 RPM drives, as well as the 7200 RPM ones, will perform equally in a TiVo, setting aside power and heat considerations. No matter what speed the platters spin, or what the max drive interface bandwidth is, all past and current TiVos have yet to set the drive to anything faster than SATA-1 (150MB/s) on the handshake, and the actual communication is closer to 133MB/s max. This data can be verified (as opposed to taking my word for it), by looking in the TiVo's internal logs via TiVo Backdoor.

So far, the only feature of an AV drive that interests me, when it comes to TiVos is PWL (Preemptive Wear Leveling). This is a WD firmware feature, which sweeps the heads fully across the platters at timed intervals, and when it is possible to do so without disrupting data reads/writes. I'm not aware of any Seagate drives having this function under some other name (if at all).

Then, there's all those wonderful marketing-oriented features for AV drives that will never even be used (like ATA Streaming Command Set Extensions, AKA WD "Silkstream"). I often wonder if that PWL feature is part of the unsupported/unused streaming extensions, which could make it another null factor in what matters.

I stick with WD Red NAS drives (which also happen to support AV streaming), or if those were not an option, AV-GP drives, simply because they come with a year longer warranty than nearly any non-AV counterpart of the green or budget mainstream low-RPM varieties. When NewEgg or Amazon has sales on the higher-end drives, it's often a no-brainer to get a year longer warranty, rather than save $5 and pass up that extra year.


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## ciscokid (Jan 14, 2003)

A J Ricaud said:


> Newegg has the WD AV-GP WD30EURX 3TB IntelliPower 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive for $119.99 using PROMO CODE EMCYTZT58888


Thanks for the tip! I just scarfed one up! Cheaper than Amazon.


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## bvanhoudt (Apr 24, 2006)

All, long time Tivo user and absolutely love my new Roamio Plus. I just had a great experience of changing my M-Card from my Premier into my Roamio Plus (15 minute phone call and no problems) and now I'm looking at upgrading my Roamio Plus hard drive to a 3T. Question => After I upgrade the drive do I have to call into the cable company (TWC) and have my unit re-paried again? I've read the information given here and it only talks about the the drive automatically configuring its self but not if you have to re-pair the M-Card to the unit. Thanks.


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## ciscokid (Jan 14, 2003)

bvanhoudt said:


> All, long time Tivo user and absolutely love my new Roamio Plus. I just had a great experience of changing my M-Card from my Premier into my Roamio Plus (15 minute phone call and no problems) and now I'm looking at upgrading my Roamio Plus hard drive to a 3T. Question => After I upgrade the drive do I have to call into the cable company (TWC) and have my unit re-paried again? I've read the information given here and it only talks about the the drive automatically configuring its self but not if you have to re-pair the M-Card to the unit. Thanks.


Let me tell you MY experience on Fios and pairing.

I pulled the M card from an existing HD Tivo that was working perfectly fine. I was on Channel 131 and went through the automated pairing process. I wasn't sure if it worked but when I went to channel 513, the local HD Fox channel, all seemed fine so I figured all was well. A little later I went to ANOTHER TV that had a different Tivo HD connnected to it, THAT I DID NOT TOUCH and tried to get to channel 553 which was HD TNT. No good! No picture. I went back to the new Roamio and the same thing. No channels above 513.

So I called Fios tech support and explained the issue. I went through two and a half hours on the phone and they couldn't do anything. The incompetent woman told me she referred it to her supervisor and he would call me back likely in an hour but possibly I might have to wait for 24 hours.

No call back on Monday so I called them back and was quite harsh with the new tech support guy. I told him my problem and he heard the distinctive Tivo ba-bloop noise and said "Hey you must have a Tivo. I can tell by the noise it makes". We'll I instantly felt a lot better and in about 10 minutes he had both TV's working just fine. He said all they needed was a simple re-pairing, which he promptly did.

Note this was using the OLD model cable card which many on here said won't work with the Tivo, but it works just fine with mine.

I also asked him if I would need to get a new re-pairing done if I put in a new hard drive and he said No since pairing is done with a device ID hard coded on the motherboard, NOT the drive.

I hope he is right. I'll be putting in my new drive the Friday as soon as New Egg delivers it to me.


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## bvanhoudt (Apr 24, 2006)

Hey, Thanks for the quick response and fully understand your frustration when it comes to interaction with the cable companies. When I hooked up my Premier a few years back even with the cable person in my house, having him on the phone with their own support group, it took almost an hour. That is why this last time I was really apprehensive but the dedicated line to a support desk that only 'Pairs' up the unit and M-Card really helped. Let me know your experience (Good or Bad) after this weekend. Good luck. **Which drive did you get?


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## ciscokid (Jan 14, 2003)

bvanhoudt said:


> Hey, Thanks for the quick response and fully understand your frustration when it comes to interaction with the cable companies. When I hooked up my Premier a few years back even with the cable person in my house, having him on the phone with their own support group, it took almost an hour. That is why this last time I was really apprehensive but the dedicated line to a support desk that only 'Pairs' up the unit and M-Card really helped. Let me know your experience (Good or Bad) after this weekend. Good luck. **Which drive did you get?


I got this one..........

Newegg has the WD AV-GP WD30EURX 3TB IntelliPower 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive for $119.99 using PROMO CODE EMCYTZT58888


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

ciscokid said:


> I got this one.......... Newegg has the WD AV-GP WD30EURX 3TB IntelliPower 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive for $119.99 using PROMO CODE EMCYTZT58888


I grabbed the same drive from Best Buy a couple days ago and they price matched $113.99 from Amazon.

BTW, great avatar man..........E-A-G-L-E-S, ....Eagles!!! (Totally sucks about DeSean though!)


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## ciscokid (Jan 14, 2003)

HarperVision said:


> I grabbed the same drive from Best Buy a couple days ago and they price matched $113.99 from Amazon.
> 
> BTW, great avatar man..........E-A-G-L-E-S, ....Eagles!!! (Totally sucks about DeSean though!)


Thanks! I've been an Eagles fan for over 50 years. You can leave Philly but Philly never leaves you.

I think that the drive for $113.99 is Model #WD30EZRX which has a two year warranty. The Model #WD30EURX has a three year warranty plus a couple of other minor upgrades.


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## HarperVision (May 14, 2007)

ciscokid said:


> Thanks! I've been an Eagles fan for over 50 years. You can leave Philly but Philly never leaves you. I think that the drive for $113.99 is Model #WD30EZRX which has a two year warranty. The Model #WD30EURX has a three year warranty plus a couple of other minor upgrades.


Definitely true! Yeah it's probably not the same drive. I think it is the EZRX.


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## keithcarley (Apr 4, 2014)

Is swapping out the HDD on the Roamio any different than doing it on a desktop? Is it just a matter of plugging and unplugging SATA cables?


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## ciscokid (Jan 14, 2003)

keithcarley said:


> Is swapping out the HDD on the Roamio any different than doing it on a desktop? Is it just a matter of plugging and unplugging SATA cables?


It is much, much easier.

Crack open the case.

Remove the old drive.

Plug in the new drive.

Wait about an hour or so.

Run guided setup.

Done!

There is a good youtube video on it.

You will need a Torx T8 bit to open up the Tivo.


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

ciscokid said:


> You will need a Torx T8 bit to open up the Tivo.


The TiVo case Torx is smaller than the Torx needed for the drive, I though is was a T10 and T15 but it has been a long time since I purchased my TiVo Torx tools.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

lessd said:


> The TiVo case Torx is smaller than the Torx needed for the drive, I though is was a T10 and T15 but it has been a long time since I purchased my TiVo Torx tools.


If it is a black case screw (that screws into plastic), it's a T8.

Metal case has a black screw that screws into power supply, it's a T8. <--Leave it in

If it is a silver screw (metal case) it is a T10.

The screws holding drive rails to case are T10.

The screws holding drive rails to drive are T15.

While I'd never recommend it, you can usually get away with a T8 for the T10, and a T10 for the T15. If you have the correct tools, you should use them.


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## CoxInPHX (Jan 14, 2011)

Just get one of these and you are set for many or most situations.
http://www.homedepot.com/p/Husky-8-IN-1-Torx-Screwdriver-Set-74502/100087664


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## bengalfreak (Oct 20, 2002)

Does cracking open the case and replacing the internal hard drive void the warranty?


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

bengalfreak said:


> Does cracking open the case and replacing the internal hard drive void the warranty?


Yes. It does. Some will likely tell you that if you put the original drive back in, TiVo will be none the wiser, and all will be well. Obviously, don't tell TiVo you have done it.

Since every Service connection to TiVo uploads your TiVo's logs, which include the model number of the drive installed, all they have to do is look, or create an automated process to spot it, and flag the change. Nobody knows how far back the logs are saved for (obviously, not forever). They may even be able to detect a serial number change, in the case of swapping in a same-model drive.

The letter of the "law" (TiVo's Terms) makes opening the case, or any unauthorized modifications or repairs, a warranty-voiding action.

Some choose to wait until the warranty is expired to upgrade, while some never even use the stock drive. There is currently no method/tool to backup, restore, or upgrade and save your personalized settings, recordings, etc. When you install a blank drive, the TiVo will prepare it for use for you (up to 3TB), just the same as it does the blank drive it is shipped with.

It's a judgement call, for you to make. I don't suggest interpreting any stories of people getting away with it as being a guarantee that you can, and will.

TiVo has had a history of not voiding warranties with upgraded units, as long as the stock drive is put back in, BEFORE seeking warranty service. But it has happened, and their enforcement could tighten up at any time. They also have the right to deny you technical support, if you seek it and they spot the change while viewing your logs. Your mileage may vary, etc...


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

What happens if you put a 4TB in? What does Weaknees do to theirs to upgrade them to 4TB?


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

Bigg said:


> What happens if you put a 4TB in? What does Weaknees do to theirs to upgrade them to 4TB?


Simple answer: It doesn't work, at all, if you install a blank 4TB drive.

Weaknees uses a proprietary method to pre-prepare the 4TB drives. So their upgrades are pre-partitioned and the Roamio will recognize it as a valid partition and filesystem structure, stopping it from wiping the drive and attempting to prepare it all over again (which would fail).

It's discussed in far better detail in ~3 threads, predating this one.

AFAIK, there's nothing stopping somebody from buying one 4TB Weaknees drive, and using a DD-type sector-by-sector agnostic program to make clones, or an image to clone from. Legality of doing so is something there would be a great amount of differing views on. So, that's why I'm going to not recommend anybody do so.

If you buy a TiVo direct from Weakness with any drive upgrade, they offer a warranty of their own, so you at least know you still have a warranty. If you just buy the drive from them, I don't know the details of who provides support/warranty.

Reports on Weaknees customer service/support seems to be split between love and hate, with no middle ground, last time I checked into it.


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## B5Guy (Oct 10, 2012)

Hi, just got my TiVo Roamio yesterday was just kind of reading through the forum. I have building PC's for years, right now the WD Black is the best drive WD makes, and possibly the best commercially available drive period IMO. They are the only WD drive that comes with a 5 year warrantee, why do you think that is? The green drives mentioned over and over here are WD's worst, you don't have to believe me, google them. I also see people here complaining about the 10/100 wireless speed, well I dare say not many people if any have internet speeds of over 100 mbps so what good is a 10/100/1000 wireless speed going to do for you? If you are transferring a lot of huge files like movies over your home network fine, but since your TiVo is streaming from the internet 10/100 will do just fine, which is why TiVo probably went with 10/100. Just my 2 cents worth.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

B5Guy said:


> <erroneous and misleading content removed>
> Just my 2 cents worth.


With your 1st post, you come in and declare years of expert input saying the WD Black is the LEAST desirable drive for TiVo use, to be incorrect...

Please hang onto that 2 cents.

I'll let somebody else lead you into the light. I will state that what's best for a PC is not automatically best for a TiVo, and refrain from doing a point-by-point, and fact-by-fact breakdown. I may be back later to point you to some of the dozens, if not ~100 threads predating your post, and this thread, that lead to an entirely different picture and perspective, cumulated (culminated) over time, and backed up by great numbers of others.

Welcome to TCF. Please do look around and try reading a bit before you can't find a way to pull your foot out of your mouth. I try to not let misleading, erroneous, or outright false, information from being distributed, as another new to TCF member may not look beyond the first post they see, which just might be yours. That's important, since it can cause people to blame TiVo for a problem they created, by not using the right part, right tools, and factually correct information, for the job at hand.

EDIT/ADD: What I said works in reverse, as well. WD Green, and WD Green AV-GP drives are too slow for me to use in PCs unless it's that or nothing, IMHO (but it all depends on what each person wants/needs for PCs). That's why I have some for sale as my signature shows. I went to 3TB on my TiVos, after buying a half-case of 2TB AV-GP drives. I'd rather try to get them to a TiVo as a new home, than run anything less than WD Red NAS on my PCs. I love WD Blacks for boot/system drives on PCs. So, please try not to take too much offense at my somewhat hasty reply.


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## ciscokid (Jan 14, 2003)

Update on my TiVo Roamio drive upgrade.

The upgrade went off pretty much without any major glitches. I just followed the YouTube video and it was pretty painless. I will point out however, and it was NOT mentioned anywhere............when you are putting the top back on be careful with the front, middle bottom section. There is a small plastic protrusion that is part of the cover that MUST be installed in front of a metal clip on the front base of the Tivo that is part of the metal chassis. It was a real pain for me to get it seated correctly.

Other than that, I just plugged it in and had to do guided set up again. It took about 25 minutes to run through set up and add to that 25 minutes to install the new drive. 

I was a bit worried at the physical size of the new drive as compared to the old one. It was quite a bit larger but there was no problem in fitting it in the Tivo. There was plenty of extra room for it. 

I was a bit surprised that it didn't have to do a format of the 3 gig drive. At least I didn't think that it did!

Oh! and I did NOT have to re-pair the Cable Card with my Fios service, just as the tech last week told me. By the way it is NOT the new style card but the older one.

450 hrs, give or take, of HD capacity.............Neato!


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

ciscokid said:


> Update on my TiVo Roamio drive upgrade.
> 
> The upgrade went off pretty much without any major glitches. I just followed the YouTube video and it was pretty painless. I will point out however, and it was NOT mentioned anywhere............when you are putting the top back on be careful with the front, middle bottom section. There is a small plastic protrusion that is part of the cover that MUST be installed in front of a metal clip on the front base of the Tivo that is part of the metal chassis. It was a real pain for me to get it seated correctly.
> 
> ...


Congrats! Enjoy!

The drive never gets a full format. It merely writes out the partition map, which is why many recommend a full read & write test of the drive on a PC first. If the drive has ever been formatted by any other OS and data (other than zeroes) is written to the drive, all those sectors that would be 0 values on a factory new drive still have whatever was in them before, it just gets overwritten as the drive fills.

I made the same mistake (once) with that front tab as well. It does get very little mention, compared to how often the size of the torx screws, and other details, come up. If you're really paying attention as you take the cover off, and do it slow and gentle, it's something the observant can still miss...

For clarity, for other visitors to the thread, I highly suggest not trying to force the front tab in (on plastic case base Roamios), and instead fully remove the cover, get that tab in place first with the cover at almost a vertical position, then lower it down slowly, letting the forward latches snap in first, then work to the back. If the screw hole isn't aligned with the hole with the threads, the cover isn't fully seated, and merely pressing the top to align the holes leaves a latch or three not fully snapped-in (which could cause them to distort over time and never fully snap-in).


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

nooneuknow said:


> Simple answer: It doesn't work, at all, if you install a blank 4TB drive.
> 
> Weaknees uses a proprietary method to pre-prepare the 4TB drives. So their upgrades are pre-partitioned and the Roamio will recognize it as a valid partition and filesystem structure, stopping it from wiping the drive and attempting to prepare it all over again (which would fail).
> 
> ...


Very interesting. I guess I know where I'll get a Roamio if/when I upgrade... That is an expensive upgrade though!


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## bvanhoudt (Apr 24, 2006)

Hey Cisco and NoOne,
Thanks for the information on the Roamio top being a bit of a 'pain' to get back on as I did purchase my 3T drive and plan on putting it in tomorrow. I will take note of how everything looks when I take the top off and when I'm done with the change out and ready to install the top back on I will start from the front to back. Also Cisco, thanks for the 411 on the 're-pairing' not being needed after it has been done once since as you explained the unit and M-Card are paired and not the disk drive itself.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

bvanhoudt said:


> Hey Cisco and NoOne,
> Thanks for the information on the Roamio top being a bit of a 'pain' to get back on as I did purchase my 3T drive and plan on putting it in tomorrow. I will take note of how everything looks when I take the top off and when I'm done with the change out and ready to install the top back on I will start from the front to back. Also Cisco, thanks for the 411 on the 're-pairing' not being needed after it has been done once since as you explained the unit and M-Card are paired and not the disk drive itself.


Thanks.

But, the cablecard does, in-fact, write one portion of the pairing data to the hard drive, so hard drive changes DO require re-pairing the card, in the markets that require card pairing (the ones that require it are greater in number than the ones that don't).

The card is paired to the box, and some data required to keep it paired is written to the hard drive. Every time you change the drive, rinse & repeat, on the pairing. Some markets, like mine, have their cablecard system set so tight, that a drive that has already been in use and had that third part of the pairing written to it, will still require you to pair again.

I had installed 2TB drives in all my Roamios, paired the cards, then decided to go to 3TB, and every one required a pairing, even though the cablecard never left the slot. If I put the 2TB ones back in (in the same state they were taken-out), I'd have to do it all again.

Your mileage may vary, etc.


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## bvanhoudt (Apr 24, 2006)

nooneuknow said:


> Thanks.
> 
> But, the cablecard does, in-fact, write one portion of the pairing data to the hard drive, so hard drive changes DO require re-pairing the card, in the markets that require card pairing (the ones that require it are greater in number than the ones that don't).
> 
> ...


Hey Nooneuknow,
Wow, thank you. I have TWC and I'm sure they will have me 're-pair' it again. It was easy to do with the cable company's direct phone line to the M-Card hotline but it is one more step that I will do after the hard drive is finished with the config and the Roamio is back online. Thanks for sharing your knowledge and the quick response.

Roamio Plus
Tivo Mini


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## lessd (Jan 23, 2005)

nooneuknow said:


> Thanks.
> 
> But, the cablecard does, in-fact, write one portion of the pairing data to the hard drive, so hard drive changes DO require re-pairing the card, in the markets that require card pairing (the ones that require it are greater in number than the ones that don't).
> 
> ...


In my Comcast area (Hartford CT) I had to re-pair the cable every time I changed a TiVo hard drive in the past, on my new Roamio I set up the first unit with the original drive and paired the cable card to make sure all was working, the TiVo software got updated, than I changed out the drive expecting to have to re-pair the cable card, and I did not, the VAL did not have the dreaded* ? *and all ch came in. Again YMMV.


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## bvanhoudt (Apr 24, 2006)

All,
Every TiVo upgrade that I go though I pop my head up to look on this site and gather the pearls of knowledge from this community. This time I purchased a Roamio Plus and a Mini and love both. So no problem with installing or moving the M-card from my TiVo Premium to the Roamio and enjoyed it for a whole two weeks and after reading the articles on this site about how easy it was to upgrade the disk I purchase a 3T and I installed it this morning. Just wanted to say thanks to Cisco, NoOneUKnow and LessD for their input. Here is the summary from that disk upgrade:
- Very easy to change the hard drive (See You Tube video) **Excellent
- A pain to get the top off the Roamio as was mentioned by Cisco and NoOneUKnow, thanks for the heads up.
- Powered on and took some time for the config and it was all automatic from TiVo (my time about 30 minutes)
- After about 20 minutes of walk through menu prompting I had my channels (or so I thought)
- I had all regular (normal) channels but none of the premium or special channels from my service provider (TWC).
- Called and 'Re-Paired' the units and it was the 'Data' code that changes and had to be reentered by TWC and now I had all my channels (about 10 minutes).
- Tried out the Mini and it still did not have the premium channels so I read somewhere on this site that the Motorola tuner needed to be unplugged in order to be refreshed. After that the Mini now had access to the special channels.

Again, anyone reading this post just to let you know that there is a vast amount of knowledge here from some key users so read what is here and if you don't see the answer to your question then post it. Great responses from everyone and I'm one happy TiVo user....... Thanks again to everyone.
-


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

lessd said:


> In my Comcast area (Hartford CT) I had to re-pair the cable every time I changed a TiVo hard drive in the past, on my new Roamio I set up the first unit with the original drive and paired the cable card to make sure all was working, the TiVo software got updated, than I changed out the drive expecting to have to re-pair the cable card, and I did not, the VAL did not have the dreaded* ? *and all ch came in. Again YMMV.


Must be because the software is kept in flash, and the hard drive is just storage, not the OS...


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

Bigg said:


> Must be because the software is kept in flash, and the hard drive is just storage, not the OS...


I can't post anything to prove it, but things that change, and are related to configuration changes, go to the hard drive.

The flash platform, on TiVo Roamios, is designed to only be read-only, once the factory software, or a software update, installs. It creates a protected place for the software, preventing corruption, in the event of a power failure during a write operation, or any other bad-data situation that could brick it.

The same design was implemented on non-flash TiVos, where the partitions the software resides on, were read-only, and other partitions held the databases, guide data, a part of the cablecard pairing data, recordings, etc.

Once you have swapped a few drives in and out of a Roamio, and take note of just how little of anything is "persistent", and how much has to be redone/re-entered, it paints a good picture.

Spend some time (a lot of time) examining the drives with a forensic utility, or just a hex editor, and that paints a clearer picture. Compare non-flash TiVo drives, to the drives on flash TiVos, and you'll see rather clearly, if you know what you are looking at, and interpret it correctly.

I'd try and explain it all in greater detail, but it is just exhausting, trying to write technical data, in a way that everybody agrees with, then trying to find a way to re-write that doesn't create disagreement with others...


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## Bigg (Oct 31, 2003)

nooneuknow said:


> I can't post anything to prove it, but things that change, and are related to configuration changes, go to the hard drive.
> 
> The flash platform, on TiVo Roamios, is designed to only be read-only, once the factory software, or a software update, installs. It creates a protected place for the software, preventing corruption, in the event of a power failure during a write operation, or any other bad-data situation that could brick it.
> 
> ...


Interesting. So putting a blank drive is like re-formatting and re-installing Windows? Oh, I remember the bad old days of having to do that every year because Windows XP would manage to self-destruct over a period of time...


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## ciscokid (Jan 14, 2003)

nooneuknow said:


> Thanks.
> 
> But, the cablecard does, in-fact, write one portion of the pairing data to the hard drive, so hard drive changes DO require re-pairing the card, in the markets that require card pairing (the ones that require it are greater in number than the ones that don't).
> 
> ...


I'm not saying your incorrect but cable cards go in a LOT of devices without hardrives. Without a hard drive there ain't no writing going on.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

B5Guy said:


> Hi, just got my TiVo Roamio yesterday was just kind of reading through the forum. I have building PC's for years, right now the WD Black is the best drive WD makes, and possibly the best commercially available drive period IMO. They are the only WD drive that comes with a 5 year warrantee, why do you think that is? The green drives mentioned over and over here are WD's worst, you don't have to believe me, google them. I also see people here complaining about the 10/100 wireless speed, well I dare say not many people if any have internet speeds of over 100 mbps so what good is a 10/100/1000 wireless speed going to do for you? If you are transferring a lot of huge files like movies over your home network fine, but since your TiVo is streaming from the internet 10/100 will do just fine, which is why TiVo probably went with 10/100. Just my 2 cents worth.


Welcome to the community.

I picked up 3 1TB Blacks because Best Buy had a Black Friday price on them a year before the flood.

I'm running 2 of them in one dual tuner Series 2 and one of them in another and they're doing just fine--HOWEVER, I've also got extra cooling installed.

The Blacks run faster (7200RPM) than a TiVo needs or can use, and they get mighty toasty doing it.

Since then I've acquired 3 Series 3s and one Series 3 HD, and have installed the WD20EURS, a WD "Green" AV drive in each and they're all doing fine as well.

And they were only 50 to 75 per cent of the price of a 2TB "Black" and have 3 year warranties.

I suspect a lot of complaints about the Caviar Greens is from people who didn't look at anything but the price, didn't understand that they're designed to run around 5400RPM and draw less power and generate less heat, and that you don't get that without a performance trade-off that's acceptable if you use them for long-term storage rather than as the boot drive for a PC.

If I was trying to max out a Roamio, I'd put in a WD30EURS or WD30EURX.


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

ciscokid said:


> I'm not saying your incorrect but cable cards go in a LOT of devices without hardrives. Without a hard drive there ain't no writing going on.


I'm trying not to be offended, even with you "not saying I'm incorrect".

We were not talking about "other devices", we were talking about TiVos, in a TiVo forum, in a TiVo thread, with a TiVo topic.

<over-zealous and overkill content removed, for the greater good>


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## ciscokid (Jan 14, 2003)

nooneuknow said:


> I'm trying not to be offended, even with you "not saying I'm incorrect".


Dude! Chill! i just asked the question. You didn't really give an answer that most would understand.....................probably should just forget it.

On a brighter note I called to cancel my month to month on the HD that the new Roamio was replacing and the rep gave me $99 lifetime on it so I grabbed it.

Any offers for a Tivo HD with a wireless G adapter and a "still in box" but NOT installed and already prepped for a Tivo install, 1.5 gig HD?

It goes on eBay on may 5th if there are no takers here.

Send me a PM with offer if interested.

The lifetime goes into effect on 5/5 when my current monthly expires!


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

ciscokid said:


> Dude! Chill! i just asked the question. You didn't really give an answer that most would understand.....................probably should just forget it.


Yeah, you caught me in a bad mood. Call it a friendly-fire incident, as I'm taking hits on a few other fronts (in a few other threads).

Sorry. I'm chillin' (at the moment) 

Good to hear about your good fortune. There's a Buyer/Seller area on here for advertising. I'm surprised I get away with things for sale in my signature.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/forumdisplay.php?f=72


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## ciscokid (Jan 14, 2003)

No problem! I know how it feels. 

I've had my share of getting crap on here too! Undeservedly.............of course!


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## bvanhoudt (Apr 24, 2006)

Hey Ciscokid and NoOneUKnow, 
Sorry about you two getting no respect. I understand that your doing this to help and some people just don't get that. I appreciated your responses to my questions and hope that you know that there are more of us out here that appreciate your help than those who don't. Keep up the good work guys.
Thanks,
bvanhoudt......


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## nooneuknow (Feb 5, 2011)

bvanhoudt said:


> Hey Ciscokid and NoOneUKnow,
> Sorry about you two getting no respect. I understand that your doing this to help and some people just don't get that. I appreciated your responses to my questions and hope that you know that there are more of us out here that appreciate your help than those who don't. Keep up the good work guys.
> Thanks,
> bvanhoudt......


It's posts like yours that keep me going, as opposed to going away.


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## bvanhoudt (Apr 24, 2006)

nooneuknow said:


> It's posts like yours that keep me going, as opposed to going away.


:up::up::up::up::up:

Believe me, there is the quiet masses of us that read these blogs when we have our Tivo problems. Today, more and more people read the 'review comments' before they buy items, eat at restaurants and go on vacations so we are becoming a more informed society but with that some people take it for granted not thinking that this takes time, energy and passion on those that participate with these comments. Well I'm done ranting. Thanks again for all your help and I will be back in another couple of years when I purchase my next Tivo that records 12 shows at a time along with the 10T drive to get informed before I purchase and install......

bvanhoudt


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## Rob RUNKLE (Mar 2, 2014)

I had to get my TWC cable card re-paired. I actually had to replace the card. But the second card did the same thing as the first. Then, the technician on the phone did a complete disconnect and repairing, and all came out fine after that.

As for the tab on the front, it is a piece of cake. Just center it up in the slot, and dive the front end in first, then lower the back end in, keep the top lined up with the bottom, side to side.


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## ciscokid (Jan 14, 2003)

Rob RUNKLE said:


> As for the tab on the front, it is a piece of cake. Just center it up in the slot, and dive the front end in first, then lower the back end in, keep the top lined up with the bottom, side to side.


Yeah! It's easy assuming you know about it. I didn't and I put the cover on, quite easily, I might add. Then I screwed in the Torx screw in the back, turned the unit around and saw the tab sticking out from un der the plastic cover in front.

Then I had to go through contortions trying not to crack the top when I was removing it AGAIN because of this damned tab that NO ONE ever mentioned!


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## randy1649 (Apr 18, 2011)

Too bad there isn't a 2.5 E-sata small external notebook type of drive that one could just plug in to expand.


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