# How to quit the cable addiction?



## segamartinez (Jan 23, 2007)

I'm curious to learn if some people have successfully ditched the high cable bills, but still have a premium viewing experience?

My cable bill is $170. I get any channel from comcast, but I have cut down on my TV viewing pretty substantially and my wife has taken over the mantle, watching Bravo on a loop, but she also likes her True Blood on HBO.

Anyway, wondering what kinds of non-cable setups are out there and how much you guys spend per month on TV viewing.

I have two series 3 tivos, and an xbox 360.

I'm thinking about apple tv + Netflix + hulu plus as a lower cost option. Anybody doing something similar? If you're really jonesing for an HBO hit series episode, is there a way to retrieve and view the episodes pretty close to their original air date?

Thanks!


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## ct1 (Jun 27, 2003)

I would ditch in a minute -- I'm mostly on Netflix now, and OTA would be plenty.

BUT, I have a young child who loves disney/sprout/nick jr. shows. 

Any good options?

My thought now is to just record a bunch of episodes of every show she likes on the TiVo, then cancel.. Supplement with the kid shows that are available on Netflix streaming+dvds, it might do..


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## TheGreenHornet (Nov 1, 2007)

One of the best outcomes of the recession for me was that I cut my cable cord forever in '07! I see no value in paying for television. I have no intention of ever going back to paying for cable in the future. 

I get a perfect digital signal from over the air (OTA). The broadcast network programming and content on the digital subchannels provides me with enough content to watch. If there is nothing to watch over the air, then there are discs from Netflix sitting by the television or their digital streaming works great. Most popular series on pay cable such as True Blood eventually are released on DVD.


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## Len McRiddles (Dec 21, 2002)

TheGreenHornet said:


> One of the best outcomes of the recession for me was that I cut my cable cord forever in '07! I see no value in paying for television. I have no intention of ever going back to paying for cable in the future.
> 
> I get a perfect digital signal from over the air (OTA). The broadcast network programming and content on the digital subchannels provides me with enough content to watch. If there is nothing to watch over the air, then there are discs from Netflix sitting by the television or their digital streaming works great. Most popular series on pay cable such as True Blood eventually are released on DVD.


I did the same thing and have no regrets.


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## HomieG (Feb 17, 2003)

Cut it in 2008. Easy enough to do. Just OTA and Netflix (disc and streaming). Plenty to watch. And if you find you can't exist without cable, they will always take you back, and your money too!


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## magnus (Nov 12, 2004)

I quit satellite in July of 2007. That removed almost $1000 per year as expense. I then purchased 2 Tivos with Lifetime and have made my money back easily within the first year. 

I use OTA/Netflix and don't have a need for anything else. I've tried Hulu Plus but really do not see the draw for it. I think that when the initial newness of Hulu Plus on Tivo wears off that they will see subscribers for it fall quickly. Who wants to pay for the privilege of watching commercials? If you want to do that, then just go back to satellite and cable.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

If I dropped cable it would bother me to be paying the same for guide data while needing only about 10% as much data for OTA channels. But I may do it anyway -- Tuning Adapter problems are a PITA, and the content we enjoy from cable is barely worth the cost.


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## javabird (Oct 13, 2006)

dlfl said:


> If I dropped cable it would bother me to be paying the same for guide data while needing only about 10% as much data for OTA channels. But I may do it anyway -- Tuning Adapter problems are a PITA, and the content we enjoy from cable is barely worth the cost.


I thought the Tivo would not give guide data for OTA channels. Am I mistaken about that?


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## HerronScott (Jan 1, 2002)

I'd be seriously looking at alternatives if my cable bill were $170 as well. Mine is $91.11 for Comcast's Digital Preferred with 1 Premium (HBO) including service and taxes, fees, etc. We have 2 Series 3 as well but both connected to the same TV and one is still analog only so no additional outlet or cablecard fee at the moment. The charge to add cablecards to the second S3 was going to be either $4.75 or $6.50 per month depending on whether the $3.00 additional outlet charge covered the 1st cable card or not ($1.75 for charge for 2nd cable card).

What's causing your cable bill to be so high and are there ways to reduce it without giving up what you really want?

Scott


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## tootal2 (Oct 14, 2005)

I cant find anything to watch on cable anymore. I'm sick of all those tv show marathons. I watch more blu-rays and dvd then cable now.

they need to stop the marathons and make some new shows


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## Len McRiddles (Dec 21, 2002)

javabird said:


> I thought the Tivo would not give guide data for OTA channels. Am I mistaken about that?


My HD's get OTA guide data.


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## babycakes (Oct 18, 2010)

Is it stealing?


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## replaytv (Feb 21, 2011)

"I thought the Tivo would not give guide data for OTA channels. Am I mistaken about that?"
If gives the guide data fine, as long as you have lifetime service or pay the monthly fee. The only problem with guide data is if you have Series 1 Tivo, then the guide data will have to be cable other service, although that can usually be fairly accurate. 

I am happy as can be with getting DVDs from the library, and over the air antenna TV with over 20 channels. Those include one sports channel, 4 music channels, 3 kids shows channels, old movies or tons of other shows. I always have something to watch that I have recorded on one of my 3 lifetimed Tivos.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

javabird said:


> I thought the Tivo would not give guide data for OTA channels. Am I mistaken about that?


Yes, you are.

I have OTA for all my life's TV Viewing and even from the old Series 1 and Series 2, Even today's Series 3 and 4, digital OTA, they all had guide data.


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

babycakes said:


> Is it stealing?


OTA? No, its totally free.


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## tomm1079 (May 10, 2005)

Are any of you OTA people big sports fans? If so how you get around the NFL, MLB or NHL?


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## ct1 (Jun 27, 2003)

babycakes said:


> Is it stealing?


Only if you skip the commercials..


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## KCcardsfan (Feb 20, 2011)

tomm1079 said:


> Are any of you OTA people big sports fans? If so how you get around the NFL, MLB or NHL?


I am but I live out of market of my favorite baseball team. I use MLB.TV and get every game I could ever watch if I wanted to I could pay for the other sports services as well. I get the regular football games except for Monday Night Football which my schedule won't allow me to see anyway. If you live in market for team you like in baseball you would be out of luck, but football is almost all broadcast. Some markets still have OTA of basketball and other sports..


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## KCcardsfan (Feb 20, 2011)

segamartinez said:


> I'm curious to learn if some people have successfully ditched the high cable bills, but still have a premium viewing experience?
> 
> My cable bill is $170. I get any channel from comcast, but I have cut down on my TV viewing pretty substantially and my wife has taken over the mantle, watching Bravo on a loop, but she also likes her True Blood on HBO.
> 
> ...


Right now I use (OTA-TIVO/Netflix/HULU+) / ROKU / Computer.

The OTA covers I would say about 70% of what we watch. We pick up many shows that we have missed over the years with Netflix. I love the convience of HULU+ but will be dropping it until they get more of the shows you can get on HULU regular on +. I can hook my laptop to my TV very easily and I pick up many of the shows I miss from cable of HULU regular or the networks sites themselves (USA/FX/History etc.) all have shows that I watch available the next day on their websites. In general it takes more planning as to what you want to watch but cuts down on just midless surfing.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

javabird said:


> I thought the Tivo would not give guide data for OTA channels. Am I mistaken about that?


Yes, you are. You simply specify you have antenna input during guided setup. You can use OTA only or OTA integrated with Cable -- no problem (except you don't get any price reduction if you're only using OTA guide data  ).


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

ThAbtO said:


> OTA? No, its totally free.


*PEOPLE!!!!* Please quit saying this. OTA is not, NOT, *NOT* free. It costs you - and every other American resident - several thousand dollars a year, taken from you whether you watch TV at all, or not. Not only that, but any significant increase in the number of individuals watching OTA content - at least per the Nielsen Ratings - costs each and every one of us more money. The big four networks suck the blood of the American consumer to the tune of nearly a $Trillion a year. Each and every one of us could easily save more than 10x our CATV bills if OTA broadcasting were forced to a subscriber basis, rather than allowing them to steal indiscriminately from the consumer.


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## ncbill (Sep 1, 2007)

Do you mind adding another box?

MLB.tv is offered on some Blu-ray players.



tomm1079 said:


> Are any of you OTA people big sports fans? If so how you get around the NFL, MLB or NHL?


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## SameerUCLA (Jul 15, 2009)

I too am a big sports fan, and that's one of the major reasons we haven't cut the cord. I like the Fox Sports channels as they have my UCLA Bruins on most of the time.


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## SameerUCLA (Jul 15, 2009)

Also, I'd miss MSNBC - not sure if they are live streaming yet.


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## replaytv (Feb 21, 2011)

lrhorer said:


> *PEOPLE!!!!* Please quit saying this. OTA is not, NOT, *NOT* free. It costs you - and every other American resident - several thousand dollars a year, taken from you whether you watch TV at all, or not. Not only that, but any significant increase in the number of individuals watching OTA content - at least per the Nielsen Ratings - costs each and every one of us more money. The big four networks suck the blood of the American consumer to the tune of nearly a $Trillion a year. Each and every one of us could easily save more than 10x our CATV bills if OTA broadcasting were forced to a subscriber basis, rather than allowing them to steal indiscriminately from the consumer.


I guess I'm missing something. How does OTA cost me, other than the FEds supporting PBS?

I love volleyball, and watch it for free on OTA, and the Denver Broncos are always on when they are playing on OTA. I am starting to like rugby and even watch Australia Rules Football and soccer too. I do miss womens' tennis many times because it is not broadcast OTA, but that is more of a perversion of mine, rather than actually following a sport.


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## hughvh (Apr 4, 2002)

tomm1079 said:


> Are any of you OTA people big sports fans? If so how you get around the NFL, MLB or NHL?


In Dallas, the Cowboys are always broadcasted OTA, even if its an NFL network exclusive. One of the local channels broadcasts the NFL network's feeds. So my guess is that in most markets, the home team is always broadcasted.

There is always at least one local team broadcasted on the weekends. And don't forget you still have nationally broadcasted games too. Golf, Sunday Night Football, NBC's Hockey game of the week, and at least one or two baseball games, all in HD.

Also stream EPSN 3 a lot to my big screen via PlayOn.

Then only time I miss cable is during Hockey and Basketball playoff runs. Those are exclusive to smaller Cable channels like Verses. In those cases, I go to the local watering hole and watch the game. What I save a month in cable bills more than covers my bar tab.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

Way too much sports missing for me to cut the cord, like motorsports (Nascar, IndyCar, MotoGP, etc.). But I just recently got a 2-year deal with Comcast for all non-premium channels + 20mb internet for $80/mo., so it's well worth the cost anyway. Plus from what I've read we're going to get Cablecard credits to run Tivos and not their boxes. Also as I've mentioned in other threads, the 'streaming future' is a poor substitute for being able to skip commercials and/or delay watching live events, plus the HD quality is not as good as what cable delivers. 

Most providers are willing to deal if you bundle services and/or are willing to play one provider off of the other - there is absolutely no reason to pay $170/mo.


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## jcthorne (Jan 28, 2002)

lrhorer said:


> *PEOPLE!!!!* Please quit saying this. OTA is not, NOT, *NOT* free. It costs you - and every other American resident - several thousand dollars a year, taken from you whether you watch TV at all, or not. Not only that, but any significant increase in the number of individuals watching OTA content - at least per the Nielsen Ratings - costs each and every one of us more money. The big four networks suck the blood of the American consumer to the tune of nearly a $Trillion a year. Each and every one of us could easily save more than 10x our CATV bills if OTA broadcasting were forced to a subscriber basis, rather than allowing them to steal indiscriminately from the consumer.


Obviously you posted this to spark a conversation. Please elaborate so I can decide if I agree or not. There has to be more to your point than the advertising revenue spent on network tv. None of which would come back to the consumer if OTA ceased to exist. Perhaps the opposite could be true if alturnative marketing methods prove to be more expensive.


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## jcthorne (Jan 28, 2002)

slowbiscuit said:


> , plus the HD quality is not as good as what cable delivers.
> 
> .


I was with you 100% until that phrase. I completely agree that for sports and other live event programming, paytv services are still a necessity for much of it.

On the other hand, OTA digital HD quality is always at least as good as what cable sends (its the same source they start with) and often far better when cable or sat signal is short of bits in the channel. I saw a significant improvement on CBS when I left Comcast for an OTA plus data scenerio. I still do not stream much but do DL or Webcapture and transfer to tivo about 20% of what we watch.

OTA adds 0$ to my monthly budget and the 6Mbps DSL line is $20 a month. Provides far more than we have time to watch.


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## sieglinde (Aug 11, 2002)

Maybe OTA is supported by tax dollars or something. Sounded like a political screed.


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## JACKASTOR (May 26, 2011)

javabird said:


> I thought the Tivo would not give guide data for OTA channels. Am I mistaken about that?


Preety much the guide information is provided by tivo for all OTA tv.

Good luck


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## JACKASTOR (May 26, 2011)

ct1 said:


> I would ditch in a minute -- I'm mostly on Netflix now, and OTA would be plenty.
> 
> BUT, I have a young child who loves disney/sprout/nick jr. shows.
> 
> ...


Time for the Kid to get some fresh as my grandfather used to say. So that means less tv and more outdoors stuff. Btw there is lots on tv for young kids who are not inschool.

regards

Jack


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## JACKASTOR (May 26, 2011)

HerronScott said:


> I'd be seriously looking at alternatives if my cable bill were $170 as well. Mine is $91.11 for Comcast's Digital Preferred with 1 Premium (HBO) including service and taxes, fees, etc. We have 2 Series 3 as well but both connected to the same TV and one is still analog only so no additional outlet or cablecard fee at the moment. The charge to add cablecards to the second S3 was going to be either $4.75 or $6.50 per month depending on whether the $3.00 additional outlet charge covered the 1st cable card or not ($1.75 for charge for 2nd cable card).
> 
> What's causing your cable bill to be so high and are there ways to reduce it without giving up what you really want?
> 
> Scott


I got my cable card from ebay.. can you do the same?


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## classicsat (Feb 18, 2004)

OTA is free, in there is no obigatory monetary cost to the viewer to watch broadcasts.

It is "pay", in that in exchange for the privelege to view programming, you take some time to watch advertising presented to you. That cost of advertising (some of which goes to the TV stations and networks) is built into the price of products and services you buy.


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## classicsat (Feb 18, 2004)

No, a Comcast customer cannot buy their Cablecard.


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## rayik (Feb 4, 2006)

segamartinez said:


> I'm curious to learn if some people have successfully ditched the high cable bills, but still have a premium viewing experience?
> 
> My cable bill is $170. I get any channel from comcast, but I have cut down on my TV viewing pretty substantially and my wife has taken over the mantle, watching Bravo on a loop, but she also likes her True Blood on HBO.
> 
> ...


We cut the cord several months ago with the approval of the entire family.

We use a lifetime Series 3 for OTA, roku for internet streaming and an xbox 360 for ESPN3.

D* was costing us $87 / month. Total TV cost is now $16. ($8 / month for netflix streaming ony and $8 / month for hulu plus).

Before cutting the cord, I mapped our TV viewing. We were recording 40 shows on the D* DVR. We could still view 35 of those shows after cutting the cord.

The only weakness is, as others have noted, sports. We are in the Philly area. Since we had D* we did not have the Philly RSN. Our baseball team (Phillies) has 1/3 of their games on OTA. There are also a good number of games on ESPN Sunday, Monday or Wednesday night baseball. Those ESPN games are broadcast live on ESPN3 which we view through the xbox360. MLB does offer a $120 / year package which broadcasts all games live which you can view in HD on the roku. The NHL and NBA also have similar pay packages. However, the local team's live games are blacked out. (MLB offers "replay" availablity 90 minutes after the game ends. NFL is OTA so all the local teams games are available.

Picture quality is very good. OTA HD looks as good as, if not slightly better, than D*. Netflix HD is 3.8. As long as your internet is at least that fast, the HD is fantastic. Many other roku "channels" HD range from 1.5 to 3.0. Just about any cable internet package delivers over those speeds. DLR 3.0 / 0.768 is just not fast enough for HD.

I would recommend a Roku (or boxee) over an apple TV setup. My understanding of Apple TV is that many of the shows must be either bought or rented. Roku organizes in "channels" almost all of which are free to view.

Lastly, there is so much avaiable on intenet streaming we find ourself watching shows we didn't expect to find. We have been watching seasons of Kitchen Nightmare (hulu plus), Beverley Hillbillies (roku "channel" - Pub D Hub), all episodes of the Office (hulu plus). ESPN3 offers a tremendous amount of live coverage along with many, many replays. This week a lot of Wimbelton matches are on live. It is surprising the amount of high quality, HD programing available with net streaming.

Good luck with whatever you do.


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## rayik (Feb 4, 2006)

segamartinez said:


> I'm curious to learn if some people have successfully ditched the high cable bills, but still have a premium viewing experience?
> 
> My cable bill is $170. I get any channel from comcast, but I have cut down on my TV viewing pretty substantially and my wife has taken over the mantle, watching Bravo on a loop, but she also likes her True Blood on HBO.
> 
> ...


We cut the cord several months ago with the approval of the entire family.

We use a lifetime Series 3 for OTA, roku for internet streaming and an xbox 360 for ESPN3.

D* was costing us $87 / month. Total TV cost is now $16. ($8 / month for netflix streaming ony and $8 / month for hulu plus).

Before cutting the cord, I mapped our TV viewing. We were recording 40 shows on the D* DVR. We could still view 35 of those shows after cutting the cord.

The only weakness is, as others have noted, sports. We are in the Philly area. Since we had D* we did not have the Philly RSN. Our baseball team (Phillies) has 1/3 of their games on OTA. There are also a good number of games on ESPN Sunday, Monday or Wednesday night baseball. Those ESPN games are broadcast live on ESPN3 which we view through the xbox360. MLB does offer a $120 / year package which broadcasts all games live which you can view in HD on the roku. The NHL and NBA also have similar pay packages. However, the local team's live games are blacked out. (MLB offers "replay" availablity 90 minutes after the game ends.) NFL is OTA so all the local teams games are available.

Picture quality is very good. OTA HD looks as good as, if not slightly better, than D*. Netflix HD is 3.8. As long as your internet is at least that fast, the HD is fantastic. Many other roku "channels" HD range from 1.5 to 3.0. Just about any cable internet package delivers over those speeds. DLR 3.0 / 0.768 is just not fast enough for HD.

I would recommend a Roku (or boxee) over an apple TV setup. My understanding of Apple TV is that many of the shows must be either bought or rented. Roku organizes in "channels," almost all of which's content is free to view.

Lastly, there is so much avaiable on intenet streaming we find ourself watching shows we didn't expect to find. We have been watching seasons of Kitchen Nightmare (hulu plus), Beverley Hillbillies (roku "channel" - Pub D Hub), all episodes of the Office (hulu plus). ESPN3 offers a tremendous amount of live coverage along with many, many replays. This week a lot of Wimbelton matches are on live. It is surprising the amount of high quality, HD programing available with net streaming.

Good luck with whatever you do.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

jcthorne said:


> Obviously you posted this to spark a conversation. Please elaborate so I can decide if I agree or not. There has to be more to your point than the advertising revenue spent on network tv. None of which would come back to the consumer if OTA ceased to exist. Perhaps the opposite could be true if alturnative marketing methods prove to be more expensive.


DFTEC.


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## Aero 1 (Aug 8, 2007)

we did it last year and its been a great success in my house because i standardized on two platforms that make is easy for the WAF:

Tivo and Boxee.

two antennas on the roof pull all NYC OTA channels perfectly to the 3 tivos, multiple tv's and a HDHomerun. A boxee box in the bedroom and a dedicated pc just running boxee in the living room.

the boxees does great internet streaming from network sites nicely aggregated and since all of my movie and tv show collection is on a drobo, its great for streaming from that. the boxee htpc integrates very well with hulu desktop via a third party app launcher repository for easy remote control. for the boxee box, we use playon for hulu shows. both the box and the htpc, have an ESPN3 app that works well as well.

for sports, i have a slingbox at the old mans house that i use for those sporting events that are not on espn3 or OTA that i can only watch on the boxee htpc via that third party launcher, but now that boxee and sling have announced a slingbox app for the boxee platform, its will be an official app that will integrate well.

now, for you moral cowboys, stop reading. i use torrents for stuff that i cant find for "water cooler" shows that are a must see right away. i have no morality when it comes to this stuff, nor do i believe i will not be allowed into heaven if i torrent a show. thats just the way it is.

and of course, like almost everyone else, i use netflix streaming with 1 blu-ray plan a lot.

I'm lucky enough that work pays for my fios internet bill, so my $150 tv and internet bill is cut down to just $12 bucks a month. $12 bucks is my monthly visual entertainment bill. cant beat that.


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## atmuscarella (Oct 11, 2005)

SameerUCLA said:


> Also, I'd miss MSNBC - not sure if they are live streaming yet.


They don't have "live" streaming but you can watch many of their shows via a computer. You can check their web site to see. Also if you have a device that has Mediafly on it (like a Boxee box) you might not need the computer.

Good Luck


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

slowbiscuit said:


> plus the HD quality is not as good as what cable delivers.


I get 720p and 1080i on all channels that are broadcasting in HiDef, which is mainly the networks, fox, nbc, cbs, abc, cw, pbs.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

You have to weigh price vs convenience. Right now you can get most of what you watch via OTA antenna, Netflix, Hulu, etc..., while tracking down the rest via BitTorrent, but it's not going to be as simple as just sitting down in front of the TV and selecting a show from Now Playing. You're going to have to find the shows, deal with any sort of blackout periods or release delays, and learn the various UIs of the different services. If that's worth saving $100/mo to you then go for it. If not then your only hope is to maybe trim off a few of the tiers or premium channels you don't really need.

Dan


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## MMaleto (Feb 12, 2011)

lrhorer said:


> *PEOPLE!!!!* Please quit saying this. OTA is not, NOT, *NOT* free. It costs you - and every other American resident - several thousand dollars a year, taken from you whether you watch TV at all, or not. Not only that, but any significant increase in the number of individuals watching OTA content - at least per the Nielsen Ratings - costs each and every one of us more money. The big four networks suck the blood of the American consumer to the tune of nearly a $Trillion a year. Each and every one of us could easily save more than 10x our CATV bills if OTA broadcasting were forced to a subscriber basis, rather than allowing them to steal indiscriminately from the consumer.


I think you are smoking something funny.....

Will that TRILLION dollars be divided equally between all cable subscribers once we start charging for OTA?

That is a sure stimulus for the economy - charge everyone for service, including OTA then divide the TRILLION dollar savings amongst each household?

Where do I sign up for the subscription?

I can remember when they said cable would not have any commercials because we paid for their service - remember those days?

Purple kool-aid and smoked mirrors...


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## JACKASTOR (May 26, 2011)

rayik said:


> We cut the cord several months ago with the approval of the entire family.
> 
> We use a lifetime Series 3 for OTA, roku for internet streaming and an xbox 360 for ESPN3.
> 
> ...


You can download Boxee for free and run it on an atom computer if you like or your desktop. There is an app that will allow you to controll your boxee from your Iphone. Either way you do it its cheap.

good luck


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## shwru980r (Jun 22, 2008)

Another significant advantage to having OTA is that you can use the TV tuner as a third tuner for channel surfing, provided your TV is a newer TV with an ATSC tuner or you have an old TV with an extra converter box.


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

MMaleto said:


> I think you are smoking something funny....


Maybe he's in the UK where the actual content shown on OTA TV is produced with tax payer dollars? 

In this country the only thing the networks get from the government is the right to broadcast on a certain frequency. The vast majority of their income comes from selling ads not from the government.

Dan


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## Series3Sub (Mar 14, 2010)

Dan203 said:


> Maybe he's in the UK where the actual content shown on OTA TV is produced with tax payer dollars?
> 
> In this country the only thing the networks get from the government is the right to broadcast on a certain frequency. The vast majority of their income comes from selling ads not from the government.
> 
> Dan


While I don't quite agree with the "smoking funny" fellow post about a MASSIVE subsidy to OTA, OTA broadcasters do get subsidized by our government (we the taxpayers) in ways we don't always know. There are "loans" or "grants" (government cash giveaways) lobbied by NAB and passed by Congress that pay for broadcaster's transmitters and some other equipment. Also, PBS, the taxpayer funded TV network (along with NPR) is the "unofficial" research and development for commercial broadcasters with PBS (and NPR for radio) having been the first to provide, but also bear the cost and pay for R&D to private companies to set up new technology production studios, satellite networks, Closed Captions, Data Streams, PSIP, and High Definition TV just a few of the technologies that Public TV and Radio wrote the book for the broadcasters to implement without the investment of creating the infrastructure and innovation one would expect in our "free market" society. One those private companies have refined the product with tax payer money, just about all of it, those companies turn around and sell the technology to the commercial broadcasters at LESS than it cost public broadcasters.

We taxpayers subsidize other businesses, as well, but in the TV and radio realm of the past 40 years, we have paid the up front cost for broadcasters along with so many giveaways that a few years ago Sen. John McCain said loud and clearly just after a Senate Committee approved taxpayer money to pay in full for several commercial broadcaster's new HDTV transmitters, "Shall we give them a free lunch, too?" He is so right. NAB is the most successful at having, perhaps, its member being the MOST subsidized of any industry, second only to defense contractors.


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## JimboG (May 27, 2007)

Wow, you have no idea of the economic costs of ag subsidies if you think broadcasters are the big problem.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

lrhorer said:


> *PEOPLE!!!!* Please quit saying this. OTA is not, NOT, *NOT* free. It costs you - and every other American resident - several thousand dollars a year, taken from you whether you watch TV at all, or not. ........


That would amount to around a trillion $$, which is incredible.


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## slowbiscuit (Sep 19, 2006)

ThAbtO said:


> I get 720p and 1080i on all channels that are broadcasting in HiDef, which is mainly the networks, fox, nbc, cbs, abc, cw, pbs.


I was talking about streaming from the net, not OTA (for stuff you can't get OTA, that is, like espn3). HD quality from the net is almost always not as good as a full-rate cable HD stream with DD 5.1 sound.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

lrhorer said:


> *PEOPLE!!!!* Please quit saying this. OTA is not, NOT, *NOT* free. It costs you - and every other American resident - several thousand dollars a year, taken from you whether you watch TV at all, or not. Not only that, but any significant increase in the number of individuals watching OTA content - at least per the Nielsen Ratings - costs each and every one of us more money. The big four networks suck the blood of the American consumer to the tune of nearly a $Trillion a year. Each and every one of us could easily save more than 10x our CATV bills if OTA broadcasting were forced to a subscriber basis, rather than allowing them to steal indiscriminately from the consumer.


Are we talking must carry, must pay rules, or the price of consumer goods being higher to cover what's paid to buy airtime for advertising, or the cost to operate the FCC to keep the broadcasters at least minimally in line?


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## Dan203 (Apr 17, 2000)

Series3Sub said:


> OTA broadcasters do get subsidized by our government...


Lots of technological advances have been subsidized by the government via loans and grants. In fact a good portion of the scientific progress made in this country is done so via grants and other government programs. I would much rather have my tax dollars go to scientific advancement then to subsidies for the oil and agriculture industries.

Dan


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## trip1eX (Apr 2, 2005)

I'd cut the cord too if my cable tv bill was $170.

Last time I checked you couldn't get HBO shows soon after air date from iTunes or Amazon.

Whether you can go OTA and Netflix/HUlu plus iTunes and save money depends on your viewing habits and what kind of OTA reception you get. 

Anyway you can reduce your cable package too.


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## TVCricket (Mar 7, 2010)

I dropped my nearly $70 standard only dish and service with Directv in December and don't miss a thing. A lot of sporting events are on ESPN3 and Netflix gives me enough tv and movies to curb the appetite for pay tv. OTA-HD is perfect for me. There's no reason or incentive to go back.


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## brettatk (Oct 11, 2002)

My cable bill was right around $100 a month. I cut the cord a little over a year ago. The only thing that was really difficult was the Fall season and college football. Luckily we have access to ESPN3 so that helps. I also have kids ages 4 and 6. They have their own Tivo and there is probably at least 200 tv episodes on there from varying shows. I've noticed lately they watch shows on 1 the 4 PBS stations we get or something on Qubo. I will admit that I download a good amount of shows and have no problem doing so. I know others don't feel the same and there are other alternatives out there (hulu, netflix, iTunes, Amazon, etc). 

I'll never go back to cable. Charter is by far the worst company I've ever dealt with. Once At&t U-Verse is available in my area I'd probably consider trying it out. Even if I did get U-Verse I'd supplement it with OTA.


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## JimboG (May 27, 2007)

Getting back to the mechanics of how to cut the cord:
Go to www.tvfool.com to check over the air HDTV reception at your house. You will get quite detailed (and technical) reception data for your location. You need to see how far away your local stations are, how strong the received signal should be, and find out whether all of the stations you want are in the same location or scattered all over the map. You also want to find out whether you have any VHF lo-band stations (real channels 2-6), any VHF hi-band stations (real channels 7-13), or just UHF stations (channels 14 to whatever FCC Chairman Genachowski decides to leave to the broadcasters).

Once you know where you stations are on the spectrum and on the map, you have a pretty good starting place for what sort of antenna you may need. While a good quality outdoor antenna mounted outside and up high is preferable, you may get acceptable performance with an attic-mounted antenna or even an indoor antenna.

If you are anywhere near your local stations (within 30 or 35 miles over flat terrain) you should start by trying a simple UHF loop and rabbit ears. The $13 Radioshack budget indoor antenna costs very little and performs as well as or better than most other rabbit ear and UHF combos whether passive or amplified. Radioshack also has an excellent return policy. Get a barrel splice and a length of coax (say ten to twenty-five feet). Move the antenna away from your TV and other noisy electronic devices. Try mounting the antenna in or near a window facing the direction of your local broadcast stations.

If an indoor antenna doesn't work at your location, you will need an outdoor antenna. Newer outdoor antennas can be pretty small and you might be able to use an outdoor antenna inside or in the attic. Channelmaster, Winegard, and Antennacraft all make pretty decent antennas. Your specific TV Fool report would let folks here or on AVS Forum tell you which antenna should work best for your location.

P.S. Andy Lee's sister site, FM Fool, is quite useful for radio reception as well. Too bad there's so little decent content in most radio markets today.


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## javabird (Oct 13, 2006)

dlfl said:


> Yes, you are. You simply specify you have antenna input during guided setup. You can use OTA only or OTA integrated with Cable -- no problem (except you don't get any price reduction if you're only using OTA guide data  ).


Thanks for all the answers clarifying this.

I have a TivoHD with lifetime. Thinking about cutting the cable, but not sure I want to go without Jon Stewart and CNN. Used to watch a lot of Sci-Fi channel (or Syfy now) but now most of those shows are on Netflix.


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## Chris Kane (Mar 1, 2006)

ct1 said:


> I would ditch in a minute... BUT, I have a young child who loves disney/sprout/nick jr. shows.
> 
> Any good options?
> 
> My thought now is to just record a bunch of episodes of every show she likes on the TiVo, then cancel.. Supplement with the kid shows that are available on Netflix streaming+dvds, it might do..


I'm curious to know how this has worked out for you. The sole reason I've checked back in to this forum is because I have the same type of question but I haven't read a concrete answer re: what's NOT available.

My girls love sprout and we'd miss watching Discovery Channel, History Channel, Animal Planet and the occasional HBO series.

Has anyone bothered to list all the networks available (or unavailable) via OTA and streaming? If so, a link would be highly appreciated!

ck


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## ThAbtO (Apr 6, 2000)

Chris Kane said:


> Has anyone bothered to list all the networks available (or unavailable) via OTA and streaming? If so, a link would be highly appreciated!
> 
> ck


You can check out www.zap2it.com and can setup to list cable or antenna or whatever using your zipcode and it will show all the channels available. Its what Tivo uses also.


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