# 'Baby' TiVo



## warrenrb

http://virgintivo.blogspot.com/2011/04/virgin-media-to-give-birth-to-cheaper.html

WTF? There's another, cheaper TiVo coming, and we find out after splashing our 149 quid on this buggy box?

Can't say I'm happy to hear this, so soon after my purchase.

"Considerably cheaper" !!?!?!!?!


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## VirginMediaPhil

Hmm. I might go for this. I'm actually quite glad now that I wasn't chosen as an early tester. 1TB is great but half of that is more than enough for my series links.


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## mikerr

Bit odd given it's not even launched yet:
(not on the website packages list, can't ring up and order it = not launched)

Normal marketing:

1. Release a single expensive model to clean up on early adopters;
2. Later reduce price to sell higher quantities
3. Further reduce price, or bring cheaper models


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## sjp

500gb? no thanks - them HD recordings don't half take up a lot of disk space. i' be at 90% if i had one of those, bet it's not a whole lot cheaper anyway.


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## jonphil

I have no problem with Virgin releasing a smaller drive box, I would always go for the 1Tb version.

I think it's good they are giving a option available to people who won't want / use all the space the only thing odd about it is how quickly they are talking of releasing the smaller version.

I agree with sjp, with hard drive prices I wouldn't have thought a smaller drive would effect the price much?


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## cwaring

Maybe it hasn't. Maybe they just wanted nice, low, more affordable price-point?


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## TCM2007

Looking on the Dabs site, the difference in retail price between 500Gb and 1Tb Seagate drives of otherwise identical spec is £15 - that's RETAIL. For Samsung drives its £9.

So any significant change in price for this Baby TiVo will just be in reduced profit margin.


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## beara

sjp said:


> 500gb? no thanks - them HD recordings don't half take up a lot of disk space. i' be at 90% if i had one of those, bet it's not a whole lot cheaper anyway.


On the other hand, as a second TiVo streaming from the first, it might be just the job...

Sent from my iPad using Forum Runner


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## mikerr

Just had VM's "electric!" magazine through the post,
and it has 2 double page spreads on TiVo:



..and the centrefold:



Launch date given as *4th April*, and "baby" TiVo mentioned in small print on both:

*"A lower spec box will be available soon, but the 1TB TiVo box is still our flagship product."*

No prices mentioned except *"Available to TV XL customers before anyone else"*

They should be pushing the 3 tuners more, as that's something over and above sky+
It mentions *"You can record two programmes while watching a third"*, but don't mention you can actually record 3 at once...


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## deshepherd

mikerr said:


> J
> They should be pushing the 3 tuners more, as that's something over and above sky+
> It mentions *"You can record two programmes while watching a third"*, but don't mention you can actually record 3 at once...


Though saying "you can record three programs but you can't watch another channel at the same time" may not be seen as a positive.


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## cwaring

But "record two watch one" is still better than Sky+HD and, I think, all other consumer DVRs currently available


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## mikerr

The V+ can also "record two watch one" - it can't record 3 though !


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## kmusgrave

cwaring said:


> But "record two watch one" is still better than Sky+HD and, I think, all other consumer DVRs currently available


My Freeview DVR can record 2 and watch another (well it can't watch - I can - but you know what I mean  )


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## mikerr

kmusgrave said:


> My Freeview DVR can record 2 and watch another (well it can't watch - I can - but you know what I mean  )


Some freeview DVRs are clever with muxes, 
can you record 2, watch another when all three are on different muxes ?
e.g. BBC1 / ITV / DAVE


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## Meng

So is my 18-month contract for Tivo, or 1TB Tivo?

If I decided I wanted to switch - I think 500GB would be enough for me - would I be able to do so under my current contract or would I have to wait until the 18 months were up?


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## Zaichik

Why would you want to do that, unless they drop the charge for TiVo with the smaller box? They'd make you pay for the box again and monthly cost- wise, you'd be no better off.


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## Meng

Zaichik said:


> Why would you want to do that, unless they drop the charge for TiVo with the smaller box? They'd make you pay for the box again and monthly cost- wise, you'd be no better off.


I was under the impression that Baby would be cheaper on a monthly basis.

There's a possibility of me retiring relatively soon and this sort of thing is becoming more important.


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## TCM2007

Unlikely that the monthly charge will be different.


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## kmusgrave

mikerr said:


> Some freeview DVRs are clever with muxes,
> can you record 2, watch another when all three are on different muxes ?
> e.g. BBC1 / ITV / DAVE


No but as most of the stuff I record is in HD they are all on 1 mux
So I can with BBC1HD/ITV1HD/Dave for example


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## cwaring

Well there you go. Shows how much I (don't) know


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## Brangdon

warrenrb said:


> Can't say I'm happy to hear this, so soon after my purchase.


It's not exactly news, though. Eventually VM want to move all their customers onto TiVo, so if you wait long enough you'll probably get it for free.


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## mikerr

Techradar reckons the "Baby TiVo" will be £50 and available on ALL TV packs, not just XL:
http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/virgin-media-to-offer-500mb-tivo-box-in-may-942026

..but then they also state it'll be 500*M*B, not 500*G*B


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## mikerr

Code:


Coming 16th May, our 500GB Tivo box. Exclusively for existing customers

Tivo 500GB box
Storage for around 250 hours of standard TV
£49.95 for box activation
£3 additional monthly fee on TV XL
£40 installation fee applies

Prices correct as at 11/04/2011


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## VirginMediaPhil

mikerr said:


> Techradar reckons the "Baby TiVo" will be £50 and available on ALL TV packs, not just XL:
> http://www.techradar.com/news/internet/virgin-media-to-offer-500mb-tivo-box-in-may-942026
> 
> ..but then they also state it'll be 500*M*B, not 500*G*B


What's even funnier is someone in the comments says "I presume it's terabytes!"

I think we're a little while off from having 500TB hard drives...


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## kmusgrave

So if the new box is coming out £100 cheaper and the only difference is the hard disk size, that just goes to show how much VM are ripping off those who paid £150!


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## passingbat

kmusgrave said:


> So if the new box is coming out £100 cheaper and the only difference is the hard disk size, that just goes to show how much VM are ripping off those who paid £150!


Basic Sky HD box free to new cusstomers, 1TB one £250. They all use a similar pricing structure, i.e., you're paying the extra for more functionality (biger storage space), not the hardware.

Not sying it's right, but that's how they all seem to do it.


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## mikerr

Our "deal" as ex TiVo S1 owners was "priority of early install", not particularly price
-though £149 and no £40 install still matches the best price given to the current pre-launch installs.

We've had them installed for a _few months now_, others are still waiting remember.


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## TCM2007

I hope they'll let people who upgraded to XL to get a TiVo downgrade again.


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## cwaring

kmusgrave said:


> So if the new box is coming out £100 cheaper and the only difference is the hard disk size, that just goes to show how much VM are ripping off those who paid £150!


Or how much they're *under*-pricing the new one to get it into more homes


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## Ernie_C

TCM2007 said:


> I hope they'll let people who upgraded to XL to get a TiVo downgrade again.


It has already been stated by Virgin Media that you will be allowed to do this. The TiVo charge will go up to £8 per month if you are not on TV XL and hopefully this will not be allowed until the 12 month minimum period is served.


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## TCM2007

The quoted statement form Virgin did not say you could downgrade before the 12 months are up, nor is it clear whether the £8 will apply to "Baby TiVo" users.


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## TCM2007

cwaring said:


> Or how much they're *under*-pricing the new one to get it into more homes


As you don't own the box, in my book ANY charge is over priced!


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## kmusgrave

cwaring said:


> Or how much they're *under*-pricing the new one to get it into more homes


Do you really think they won't be making a profit on them?  They are ripping people off charging £150 *plus a monthly rental fee*. They've proved that by their pricing on the new boxes.


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## cwaring

kmusgrave said:


> Do you really think they won't be making a profit on them?


Never said they wouldn't, but maybe their profits come on the longevity of each sub.



> They are ripping people off charging £150 *plus a monthly rental fee*.


[/quote]
Well the box will have cost them money. They should just give them away?  The monthly fee is seperate and is for the software.


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## TCM2007

cwaring said:


> Well the box will have cost them money. They should just give them away?


Er, yes. If it's a rental model you shouldn't have to pay or. Box you don't then own. It's just a Ryan Air style attempt to make th headline fee £10 a month or so less than it actually is.



> The monthly fee is seperate and is for the software.


Yes, of course it is Carl. You keep on beleiving that.


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## unitron

Article about it over at El Reg:

http://www.reghardware.com/2011/04/12/virgin_media_500gb_tivo/


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## cwaring

TCM2007 said:


> Yes, of course it is Carl. You keep on beleiving that.


Well it certainly was with the original S1


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## TCM2007

On the S1 it was for the service, not the software. With Virgin, it's just an extra cost they can add on to their labyrinthine bills. Like making you pay up front for something you then have to rent as well.


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## cwaring

Series 1: £499 upfront + £10 pm
VTivo: £149 upfront + £3pm

Not that much *basic* difference, really. Oh, and I'll never have to pay for a repair should it ever go faulty. Bonus!


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## Bob49

cwaring said:


> Series 1: £499 upfront + £10 pm
> VTivo: £149 upfront + £3pm
> 
> Not that much *basic* difference, really. Oh, and I'll never have to pay for a repair should it ever go faulty. Bonus!


I seem to recall paying a bit less than £499 - but took out a lifetime subscription at £200 which made up the difference. Have also spent approx £200 on hard disc replacements and upgrades + network card etc. Can't quite see why "ownership" is such a big issue.


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## deshepherd

cwaring said:


> Series 1: £499 upfront + £10 pm
> VTivo: £149 upfront + £3pm
> 
> Not that much *basic* difference, really. Oh, and I'll never have to pay for a repair should it ever go faulty. Bonus!


S1 was £399 when launched + had the £200 "lifetime" option which for early adopters worked out at ~ £1.60pm over the 10-ish years.

Anyway, doesn't affect the fact that new TiVo is a pretty good deal (and arguably cheaper than original S1) if you already were a VM TV-XL subscriber ... and as that covered me I'm very happy with it.


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## cwaring

Bob49 said:


> I seem to recall paying a bit less than...


1. Well I'm comparing launch pricing
2. Sorry I got the price wrong


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## TCM2007

cwaring said:


> Oh, and I'll never have to pay for a repair should it ever go faulty. Bonus!


But you have to pay them should you break it or have it stolen.


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## cwaring

Why (and how) would I break it, and why would I have to pay for it if it's stolen; unless it was through my negligence, in which case I would deserve it!


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## VirginMediaPhil

cwaring said:


> Why (and how) would I break it, and why would I have to pay for it if it's stolen; unless it was through my negligence, in which case I would deserve it!


You can break it in a manner of different ways; spilling liquid on it, a power surge, not keeping it well ventilated. It's one of the T&Cs you have to pay for a box if it is stolen.


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## cwaring

VirginMediaPhil said:


> You can break it in a manner of different ways; spilling liquid on it, a power surge, not keeping it well ventilated.


Okay. The "how" was a stupid question, but if it was accidental then I would assume any existing household insurance would cover it.

Never broken a box so can't say if they would ever charge, even for accident.



> It's one of the T&Cs you have to pay for a box if it is stolen.


Really? Must say I haven't read the T&Cs for a while  That's an odd one though.


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## kmusgrave

cwaring said:


> Really? Must say I haven't read the T&Cs for a while  That's an odd one though.


No quite common for* rented* equipment


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## VirginMediaPhil

kmusgrave said:


> No quite common for* rented* equipment


Yeah. :up:


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## Ernie_C

VirginMediaPhil said:


> It's one of the T&Cs you have to pay for a box if it is stolen.





cwaring said:


> Really? Must say I haven't read the T&Cs for a while  That's an odd one though.


Well, of course, it's not Virgin Media's fault that your box has been stolen so it is your responsibility for the replacement cost.

This can either be your personal responsibility if you have not insured the box or that of your insurance company if your policy covers this. A crime reference number will be required by your insurance company.


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## cwaring

Ernie_C said:


> Well, of course, it's not Virgin Media's fault that your box has been stolen so it is your responsibility for the replacement cost.


Fair enough I suppose.


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