# The Sopranos - "Join the Club" OAD: 3-19-2006 *spoilers*



## terpfan1980 (Jan 28, 2002)

All I can say is it better not be a flash back episode....

Other than that, bring on the show!


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## tai-pan (Feb 9, 2006)

After last week's cliffhanger? I agree!


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## disco (Mar 27, 2000)

WTF is this show????  

It smells of a dream sequence. Damnit....


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## disco (Mar 27, 2000)

FINALLY...real life...


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## terpfan1980 (Jan 28, 2002)

disco said:


> WTF is this show????
> 
> It smells of a dream sequence. Damnit....


Alternate universe type episode at least. Argh, and Damnit both....

They definitely are stringing us along on that cliff hanger. It figures that we'd be stuck waiting longer and longer...

Oh, wait, now they get to the cliff-hanger, after all that symbolism about searching for perps, mistaken identity, and other distractions.

AJ's hippie look is pretty funny, best yet that Paulie points at him and says 'Van Helsing' to get him to go with him. Funny.


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## disco (Mar 27, 2000)

Sorry I gave away a spoiler a little early (I'm watching in HD with no TiVo).



Spoiler



DAMNIT...back to the "dream"....


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## starbreiz (Jan 29, 2005)

I'm 3 hours behind. Comcast Mountain View still gets the HBO East feed, but Comcast Sunnyvale cut it off last year. I need my Sopranos fix.


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## terpfan1980 (Jan 28, 2002)

That gut wound isn't pretty, but man, I could have had a better night without having to see Janice whining and snivelling....

Junior needs to contact Janice's husband though, cause his train has really jumped the tracks.

Nice to see Silvio running the family in the meantime.


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## terpfan1980 (Jan 28, 2002)

disco said:


> Sorry I gave away a spoiler a little early (I'm watching in HD with no TiVo).
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Spoilers from current episode are cool. This is a spoiler thread (for the current episode).

Spoilers from future episodes/previews = not ok.


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## disco (Mar 27, 2000)

Emmy-caliber acting (again, of course) by Edie Falco tonight. Powerful stuff. :up:


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## terpfan1980 (Jan 28, 2002)

Argh, the more I watch tonite's episode, the more I wish that it was Janice babysitting Junior. Her I could do without and not worry for a minute, but leaving the big lug in the bed with the tube down his throat ain't fun tv.

Last week was a pretty decent episode, tonites wouldn't be that bad either (I guess) in comparison, but I'd rather see action and more of the other family business, and less of the hospital stuff.


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## disco (Mar 27, 2000)

Yeah, not much action, but it's sappy episodes like this one that win actor's Emmy's. And there's been a couple moments of really good acting.

(even if it is cold in the Soprano's house...Meadow....niiiiiice.....)

EDIT: THAT'S IT?!?!? ***damnit...another week in suspense....


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## Satchel (Dec 8, 2001)

Big bag of suck...

I hate dream episodes...

18 shows left and we get NOTHING....


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## terpfan1980 (Jan 28, 2002)

Well, AJ picked up the additional nickname (Fabio), showed himself to be worried about his dad, and even promised to put a bullet in the mummy (Junior), but then wound up back in trouble for flunking out of school.


The rest of the episode was a bit slow, but at least there were previews for next week, and those show great promise. It seems that as usual the Sopranos seasons run hit or miss...


Note to Satchel from directly above ^^ now down to 18 (corrected from faulty count) shows.  Oh, wait, 18 shows after tonite ( 12 + 8, minus 2 that have aired, right??? )


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## lajohn27 (Dec 29, 2003)

I really am quite taken with the notion that 'Costa Mesa' could be purgatory.

J


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## Gregor (Feb 18, 2002)

Edie Falco is amazing. Just outstanding.

They got the ICU right, too. (I had a friend in ICU for a long time, it's incredibly intimidating and very hard on the family to stay there. I only got in as he had no other family than his wife around...)


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Dang, when Tony said he was 46, I looked up Gandolfini on IMDB--and he's younger than I am!


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## TiVo'Brien (Feb 8, 2002)

A great episode in that it's laying the groundwork for what's to come -- possibly taking Tony's family and crew in entirely fresh, unexpected directions. I like that I can't predict what's going to happen. David Chase seems determined to innovate unexpected story directions for this show.

Gawd, AJ is such a total LOSER. He fails out of East Strousbourg State after one quarter! What a f up. I can't stand him and all of his excuses. What a weenie!

Is the lighthouse beacon the light of God?


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## pendragn (Jan 21, 2001)

I feel sort of cheated. With this being the last season and all, I would have liked more Sopranos story. I completely did not get the dream stuff. I get all excited about Sopranos and then I get an episode like this. 

tk


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## bdlucas (Feb 15, 2004)

Gregor said:


> Edie Falco is amazing. Just outstanding.


The scene with AJ after he spent the night with his father was really great - how she went from adoration to loathing instantly.

Gandolfini was great too - he really was a completely different character, a salesman, not a mob boss.


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## knuckles (Dec 21, 2002)

It started off hot last week, and really went stange and down hill this week. At least it's not a true dream sequence.


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## Gregor (Feb 18, 2002)

I think we're going to see a lot of people's true colors in the weeks to come.


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

Although I wasn't very satisfied with this episode, I have to give them props for being willing to take chances...


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## fliptheflop (Sep 20, 2005)

The dream Tony' from what it looked like lead an honest good life for the most part and look what he got for it, alzheimer's disease. Through out the series its been talked about Tony going to hell for all the wrong he has done. Then he dreams as if he chose a different path and in the end he still got screwed. Thats what I took from it at least. Damned if you do, Damned if you don't.


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## Lainie*H (Sep 12, 2003)

Noticed immediately that Tony didn't have his usual accent when he tried to check into the conference. Also, ideas about who his wife was on the phone? We thought it sounded like his old girlfriend/mistress, Gloria (Annabella Sciorra).


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## Idearat (Nov 26, 2000)

Dream sequence is right. It almost put me to sleep. We waited 18 months for a show like this? This is the one they put on during the free HBO weekend to try to entice people to sign up?

They won't get me to sign back up for HBO until they have something new that looks worth paying for. Since _The Sopranos_ is going to have another gap soon I'd just as soon wait until December, catch up with this batch then and watch the final episodes after.

It's a little sad to see what _The Sopranos_ has become. Probably looks worse since _The Shield_ is 10x better right now and doesn't cost extra to get it.


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## chavez (Nov 18, 2004)

what happens when you get shot in the gut?

you wind up in the icu with sepsis. that's what happens. props to chase for being brave enough to show this as well as its effects on tony's loved ones. great episode.


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## Maximus67 (Mar 22, 2002)

disco said:


> Emmy-caliber acting (again, of course) by Edie Falco tonight. Powerful stuff. :up:


That was going to be my main point. The first time she broke down, I lost it.

We're only two episodes into the new season and Edie is a lock for best actress. Great stuff,


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## Stylin (Dec 31, 2004)

pendragn said:


> I feel sort of cheated. With this being the last season and all, I would have liked more Sopranos story. I completely did not get the dream stuff. I get all excited about Sopranos and then I get an episode like this.
> 
> tk


Agreed. Tonight's show was a let down, especially in comparison to last weeks. We all know Tony is going to live, so they could've done less dream, and more family.


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## starbreiz (Jan 29, 2005)

Stylin said:


> Agreed. Tonight's show was a let down, especially in comparison to last weeks. We all know Tony is going to live, so they could've done less dream, and more family.


Do we? This is the last season isn't it? Maybe they got bold and decided to kill the main character.


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## Stylin (Dec 31, 2004)

starbreiz said:


> Do we? This is the last season isn't it? Maybe they got bold and decided to kill the main character.


 Nope, at least not from this incident.
Spoiler:highlight to read Tony has an affair with real estate broker Juliana Marguiles ex ER star


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## Maximus67 (Mar 22, 2002)

Holy cow, I must be in the minority here, but I thought tonight's episode was AMAZING! 

The acting was some of the best we have ever seen on this show and that's saying something. 

With Johnny Sack in prison and Tony about to kick the bucket, there is a huge power vacuum at the top. You KNOW somebody is going to get whacked while that void gets filled. 

A.J. flunking out of school and avenging his fathers near death is putting him one step closer to taking the "easy route" and joining "the family". The question is, will he have the street smarts to make it look like an accident, or get away with it? 

Personally, I enjoyed last weeks episode with Tony and Carmela seemingly patching things up and enjoying each other again. That just made Carmela's pain seem that much more real this week. 

Personally, I really enjoyed and was deeply moved by this week's episode. 

I thought it was tremendous. 

I'm jus' sayin'.


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## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

too many haters...

good ep.

too bad meadow's room wasn't as cold as the living room....


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## danielhart (Apr 27, 2004)

Every season it's the same thing - there are some people who only think a Sopranos episode is good if there is "action" (i.e. someone gets whacked, a hot sex scene,) or the humor/irony type of scene where the crew sits around talking about a subject you wouldn't expect to see mobsters talking about. If they do anything other than that, the episode "sucked" and the show is going "downhill".........

Personally, I love the chances that The Sopranos takes, and I also thought tonight's episode was brilliant.



Maximus67 said:


> Holy cow, I must be in the minority here, but I thought tonight's episode was AMAZING!
> 
> The acting was some of the best we have ever seen on this show and that's saying something.
> 
> ...


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## skanter (May 28, 2003)

danielhart said:


> Every season it's the same thing - there are some people who only think a Sopranos episode is good if there is "action" (i.e. someone gets whacked, a hot sex scene,) or the humor/irony type of scene where the crew sits around talking about a subject you wouldn't expect to see mobsters talking about. If they do anything other than that, the episode "sucked" and the show is going "downhill".........
> 
> Personally, I love the chances that The Sopranos takes, and I also thought tonight's episode was brilliant.


I agree -- great episode even without "action". Tony's coma dream is fascinating, especially considering it could be likened to a near-death experience. The doctors' insensitivity is right on according to my experience in similar situations. (Uh, no, I haven't died -- you know what I meant.)


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## JohnB1000 (Dec 6, 2004)

Satchel said:


> Big bag of suck...
> 
> I hate dream episodes...
> 
> 18 shows left and we get NOTHING....


You saved me the time saying the same thing.

Not only was it the dream stuff but nothing else really happened. They could have kept us entertained with some other stories.

I feel cheated and I don't need "action" to enjoy The Soprano's


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## skanter (May 28, 2003)

bruinfan said:


> too many haters...
> 
> good ep.


Interesting that instead of the usual fake, movie violence, we actually get to see the hideous results of a gunshot wound in Tony's belly. Never saw anything quite like that, even in mobster movies and TV shows. Real-looking violence...


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## bidger (Mar 30, 2001)

Maximus67 said:


> Holy cow, I must be in the minority here, but I thought tonight's episode was AMAZING!
> 
> The acting was some of the best we have ever seen on this show and that's saying something.
> 
> ...


 :up: Absolutely! I watched it live and then watched it again and I was really impressed. As bdlucas mentioned, you get the opportunity to see James Gandalfini _change_ the character of Tony Soprano. I would have thought he was some guy from the Midwest.

The dynamics of how this affects his real family and his mob family...I'm looking forward to seeing how it plays out from here. Vito looks like he's making himself too comfortable, passing wind on the family couch. Maybe Finn makes his disclosure known to "Uncle" Pauly.


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## ElVee (Feb 20, 2002)

Lainie*H said:


> Noticed immediately that Tony didn't have his usual accent when he tried to check into the conference. Also, ideas about who his wife was on the phone? We thought it sounded like his old girlfriend/mistress, Gloria (Annabella Sciorra).


We noticed that as well. I was trying to place the voice. At first I thought it was Rosalie Aprile. Now that you mention it, it did sound like Gloria.


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## jimest (Jan 27, 2002)

Slow, Slow Slow,

Worst Soprano ever.


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## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

I actually enjoyed the dream part of the episode. They lost me when they came back to the real world, dear god that was boring. I guess I am the only person in the world who thinks Edie Falco is terrible and overacts to nth degree. Maybe it's just that I have never like her or the character, but I just never see what all the accolades are for. I don't see how being a ***** or hyperventilating while crying equals "powerful" acting. 

Oh well I hope that they get things moving next week. With so few episodes left Tony better die or get better and get on with it. Last week I thought that they had pulled me back in. This week they started to lose me again.


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## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

I liked it. Sure the dream/coma sequence was a little disconcerting, but I don't mind that. What they have done with the realistic portrayal of Tony's recovery is opened a great window into new behind the scenes action amoungst all the Capos as tehy fight to keep what they feel should be coming to them. Last season was largely about New Jersey v New York, this season, is about the Mafia in general attacking itself from within, even when they do not realize what is right under their noses.


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

I'd forgotten how boring this show can sometimes be. This episode reminded me. You know something's wrong when AJ is the most interesting character in an episode.


What did Junior shoot Tony with? By the look of the wound, it was a bazooka.


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## InterMurph (May 22, 2003)

It was definitely Gloria Trillo's voice on the phone as the wife. And the daughter's voice wasn't Meadow's, and the son's voice wasn't AJ's.

Also, it looks like Christopher bought the Maserati from Ginny Sack.


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## SeanC (Dec 30, 2003)

The gun looked like a snub nosed .38 to me.


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## jradosh (Jul 31, 2001)

The pace was slow, but the plot introduced a ton of possibilities. 

* AJ moving into "the family" is certainly an option now that he's flunking out of school and is ready to whack Jun. 

* And what about the whole terrorist conversation with Christopher and the agents and then the two middle-eastern-looking guys at the Bada-Bing near the end of the ep? I'm really curious where that's going. 

* And the fartin' guy who thinks he's going to rise in Tony's demise... that (and Finn) are heading to a resolution that could take any direction.

So many loose ends to tie together. I'm excited about what's coming.


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## Jon J (Aug 23, 2000)

Ken Finnety. Ok.


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## 5thcrewman (Sep 23, 2003)

Chris paid cash for Johnny Sack's Maserati and he drives it up in front of the Feds?? Oh that's right, he's not too smart.  

Is there really a beacon like that in Costa Mesa or is it supposed to stand for something?


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

jradosh said:


> AJ moving into "the family" is certainly an option now that he's flunking out of school and is ready to whack Jun.


AJ's certainly dumb enough to fit in with Tony's crew. No Mensa members among Tony's capos.


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## Spire (Jun 6, 2001)

Jon J said:


> Ken Finnety. Ok.


_Finnerty_.

But yeah.


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

I like the episode, including the dream part, but it didn't make a lot of sense for him to have such a dream. Usually our dreams are at least loosely based on things we are familiar with - how would Tony have any clue about the things he was dreaming about in this one? I was thinking the wife's voice might have been Charmaine Bucco. The Alzheimer's thing made sense, of course. I was trying to pick up on any connections between what was going on in the ICU and what he was dreaming about, but didn't notice much. Not many connections to his real life, either, unless the wife's voice was in fact someone we know, one of his old flame's in particular.

Anyone notice the antenna on the telephone base in Tony's hotel room? When they showed it from where he was sitting on the bed, it was at about a 45-degree angle, then when they showed it close up right before he picked it up, the antenna was straight up. Just a continuity error, or something symbolic?


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

The only redeaming part of the episode was Pauly calling AJ, Van Heisling!

Would a gunshot wound from a little revolver really look like that? I have no idea, but I honestly thought that we were still in a dream when they showed that wound. I just wouldn't expect a little bullet to make such a large entrance wound.


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## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

As far as the wound. I am guessing that they had to do a littel cutting to get in there and they just have not closed it up so they can get in and remove additional tissue as needed. With no skin to keep things tight, it has opened up.

As far as Ken Finnity, the guy at the bar even drove the point home pointing out that he drove a Lexus.


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## Dawghows (May 17, 2001)

InterMurph said:


> It was definitely Gloria Trillo's voice on the phone as the wife. And the daughter's voice wasn't Meadow's, and the son's voice wasn't AJ's.
> 
> Also, it looks like Christopher bought the Maserati from Ginny Sack.


I'm not sure the wife's voice was the same every time. The first time, we thought it sounded like Gloria, and then another time we thought it was Adrianna. At some points we couldn't recognize it at all. We were thinking maybe it was a bunch of different women who have ... uhm ... passed on after dealing with Tony.


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## Hersheytx (Feb 15, 2003)

bidger said:


> :up: Absolutely! I watched it live and then watched it again and I was really impressed. As bdlucas mentioned, you get the opportunity to see James Gandalfini _change_ the character of Tony Soprano. I would have thought he was some guy from the Midwest.
> 
> The dynamics of how this affects his real family and his mob family...I'm looking forward to seeing how it plays out from here. Vito looks like he's making himself too comfortable, passing wind on the family couch. Maybe Finn makes his disclosure known to "Uncle" Pauly.


Exactly what I was thinking about Tony changing his behavior. This may be the reason for his character to take a new direction. Or at least make him want to change....but then get pulled back in to the bad stuff even more.
It reminds me when his nephew Chris was having that bad dream about dying and going to hell. It made him question his life. In the end he felt he had chosen correctly.

I loved it too. I think you need to see the family in these kinds of situations. It gives meaning to why they choose to do things later. Like the son maybe following his father into a life of crime?


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## ravonaf (Sep 2, 2003)

TiVo'Brien said:


> Gawd, AJ is such a total LOSER. He fails out of East Strousbourg State after one quarter! What a f up. I can't stand him and all of his excuses. What a weenie!


Exactly like his father and similar to Jackie Jr. If that isn't forshadowing I don't know what is.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Ok...the other good line was Vito saying maybe the guy was gay...


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## JDHutt25 (Dec 27, 2004)

pmyers said:


> Ok...the other good line was Vito saying maybe the guy was gay...


Yeah...and that he didn't have anyone to talk to about it. That made me laugh.


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## pendragn (Jan 21, 2001)

JDHutt25 said:


> Yeah...and that he didn't have anyone to talk to about it. That made me laugh.


A couple of beats after that line my said, "Hey! Isn't he the one....?" The timing and her reaction were funny. 

tk


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## KRS (Jan 30, 2002)

5thcrewman said:


> Chris paid cash for Johnny Sack's Maserati and he drives it up in front of the Feds?? Oh that's right, he's not too smart.


Good point, although I suppose he thinks that they are not on his case anymore. Or are they? Is the terrorist thing a cover so the guys let down their guard.



5thcrewman said:


> Is there really a beacon like that in Costa Mesa or is it supposed to stand for something?


It could be the light at the end of the tunnel. That would fit in with the purgatory theory. Maybe if bizarro-Tony actually gets out of Costa Mesa, it will mean that the real Tony dies.

AJ may be a spoiled screwup, but he does have good taste in cars. Shelby Mustang, M3... :up: :up:


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## minorthr (Nov 24, 2001)

this episode stunk on ice


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## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

Who was the actress playing the woman in the bar of Tony's dream? She looked familiar but I can't place her.


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## ravonaf (Sep 2, 2003)

jeff125va said:


> I was thinking the wife's voice might have been Charmaine Bucco.


That's who I'm placing my money on. It sounded very much like her, especially when she was nagging. We know Tony had slept with her before he was married. Plus, we know that Tony has been wondering what his life would be like if he was a regular guy. Imagine that he stayed in school and married Charmaine. I think that's where the writers are going. He's a very charismatic guy so sales would make perfect sense for him. In the dream he doesn't really know any technical details about what he's selling. Only that he's a salesman. Sounds life a perfectly plausable dream to me.

I thought the ep was great. I've watched alot of old eps over the past couple months and the characters were beginning to become stale. When Tony comes back everyone will have a new lease on life and it will allow the writers to take everyone in a totally new direction.

Also, I think the reason Janice was freaking out was because she has a phobia of hospitals. I seem to remember that in one of the past seasons.


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## robinreale (Jan 24, 2006)

Dawghows said:


> I'm not sure the wife's voice was the same every time. The first time, we thought it sounded like Gloria, and then another time we thought it was Adrianna. At some points we couldn't recognize it at all. We were thinking maybe it was a bunch of different women who have ... uhm ... passed on after dealing with Tony.


I agree. My husband and I both thought the wife's voice changed a few times.


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## tivotvaddict (Aug 11, 2005)

Figaro said:


> Who was the actress playing the woman in the bar of Tony's dream? She looked familiar but I can't place her.


She was on the last couple of years of LA Law. Sheila something or other....


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## Mr. Soze (Nov 2, 2002)

Smeek alert, but...

OK, that was one hour of my life I will not get back. What a terribly dull episode.
Without Meadow's nips and Vito farting, it was irredeemably awful. It had better
pick up next week, or I may just write it off.


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## JFriday (Mar 20, 2002)

Too much filler to make this episode good.


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## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

tivotvaddict said:


> She was on the last couple of years of LA Law. Sheila something or other....


So that was her? I looked her up on IMDB but the Soprano's appearance wasn't listed.


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## tivotvaddict (Aug 11, 2005)

Figaro said:


> So that was her? I looked her up on IMDB but the Soprano's appearance wasn't listed.


Yeah.... it's probably too new? I see that the HBO web site doesn't have the details about this episode listed yet, perhaps because of all the multiple airings. I recognized her right away.


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## Dafaso (Dec 13, 2000)

So how about this for a theory..

Tony Soprano is really a salesman who, in his advanced alzheimers state (remember, he's diagnosed with alzheimers in one of his "dreams"), has dilusions of being a mafia boss. 

The salesman storyline will be continued throughout the season as Tony lies in a coma, until the final episode at his funeral where it will be apparent that he was never really a mobster - maybe the greiving widow will be someone other than Carmella (or we'll be left to wonder what's real and what's not). 

If you look at the episode description from "Join The Club" (I didn't look at next week's ep. description so I don't know if this continues) it only talks about Tony losing his ID - possibly because that's what was real. The rest was just fantasy.


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## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

Lainie*H said:


> Noticed immediately that Tony didn't have his usual accent when he tried to check into the conference.


Still had the same heavy Darth Vader breathing, though. 

As for the wound, it's definitely from the surgery, not the gun.

And the doctor, what an ahole!!!! Typical surgeon, though. Only worried about his surgery. Everything else? Not his problem.


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Figaro said:


> So that was her? I looked her up on IMDB but the Soprano's appearance wasn't listed.


I'm interested in seeing the list when it's posted, maybe they'll confirm who was doing the voice of Tony's wife in the dream.


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## Paperboy2003 (Mar 30, 2004)

Just a complete hunch, but perhaps they'll use the 10 remaining episodes to show the family falling apart and NY (Johnny Sack and Phil) squeezing N Jersey and the bodies falling from that. THen in the last episode of this set, Tony wakes up. 

Then in the last 8 he spends his time cleaning up the 'mess'

Who knows....I certainly hope we get more Tony S. and less Kevin F.

The show is called The Soprano's...not The Finnerty's

I assumed that the light at the beginning and end was the light as in :

poltergeist/'go into the light, there is peace and serenity in the liiiight'/poltergeist


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## unixb0y (Oct 19, 2005)

Jamie-Lynn almost looks too thin and she is no longer discala in the credits.

Anyway... So Tony's pancreas got shot up. I wonder that the chances of diabetes are when gets out of the hospital.


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## Paperboy2003 (Mar 30, 2004)

He's so dramatically overweight, he's probably got diabetes anyway


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## xuxa (Oct 8, 2001)

One of the best, deepest episodes of the entire series. This show was predicated about the what is going on in Tony's mind from the first scene in the series. Expecting a standard crime drama from the Sopranos is missing the whole premise of the show.

It ain't looking good for Tony, Seven Souls, Ren, Death of a "Salesman", Costa Mesa surrounded by raging wildfires and a beacon of light

and great song cues

Inna-Gadda-Da-Vida, 

and 

America Girl

"And for one desperate moment
There he crept back in her memory
God it's so painful when something that's so close
Is still so far out of reach"


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## TAsunder (Aug 6, 2003)

I liked the dream sequence. It's nice to have a show where we can see what the character in the coma is experiencing.

Why didn't they make the family wear masks to protect against infection? There was an open wound there. My cousin played one of the doctors in this episode and I kept waiting for her to say, "put on a mask, what is wrong with you people?!! don't you see that open wound?"


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## cheesesteak (Jul 24, 2003)

I can understand accidentally switching briefcases with someone else, but wallets? Even Dream State Tony should see that makes no sense.


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## xuxa (Oct 8, 2001)

Lee L said:


> As far as the wound. I am guessing that they had to do a littel cutting to get in there and they just have not closed it up so they can get in and remove additional tissue as needed. With no skin to keep things tight, it has opened up.
> .....


Yup, they leave the wound open to monitor any infections before it is too late.


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## xuxa (Oct 8, 2001)

cheesesteak said:


> I can understand accidentally switching briefcases with someone else, but wallets? Even Dream State Tony should see that makes no sense.


Sure everything in people's dreams are logical


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## MerlinMacuser (Jan 4, 2004)

xuxa said:


> and great song cues
> 
> Inna-Gadda-Da-Vida,
> 
> I thought it was Smoke on the Water by Deep Purple. Inna-Gadda-Da-Vida is in a commercial for Fidelity Investments...


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## pjenkins (Mar 8, 1999)

Well, I'll be in the minority but I really liked this episode, after thinking "WTF" in the first 10 minutes or so... The more the episode went on the more I liked what it was doing...

It's funny how a show can so engross me after being off the air for so long. For 2 years I've slowly been losing interest then it comes on again and in 2 episodes I'm as hyped as I was in season 1 to see what happens next... Whatever Chase is doing, it's working on this particular viewer.


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

I thought it was a great episode. A lot of set up, yes, but so what? Every episode can't be resolutions. The directions that things could take coming out of this are endless. 

And seeing AJ moving in the "family" direction...well, I think that's going to be the major subplot of the season. And the power struggle that ensues with Tony laid up could be quite intense. Good stuff. :up:


----------



## xuxa (Oct 8, 2001)

MerlinMacuser said:


> xuxa said:
> 
> 
> > and great song cues
> ...


----------



## InterMurph (May 22, 2003)

Figaro said:


> So that was her? I looked her up on IMDB but the Soprano's appearance wasn't listed.


Yes, she was listed in the credits as Sheila Kelley.


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## jones07 (Jan 30, 2001)

1)Nasty open wound.
2)Nice nips
3)Carmela had a hard paper route .Deep lines on that mug
4) Damn that Janis is a drama queen
5) AJ..........looking good now that the baby fat is gone
6) Tony got ***** slipped by a monk. 

The kind of ep I knew many would not like, surprising enuff I enjoyed myself


----------



## pdhenry (Feb 28, 2005)

Dafaso said:


> So how about this for a theory..
> 
> Tony Soprano is really a salesman who, in his advanced alzheimers state (remember, he's diagnosed with alzheimers in one of his "dreams"), has dilusions of being a mafia boss.


Ahh, the "Dallas" defense (it was all a horrible, horrible dream...).

Or maybe the Bob Newhart syndrome?

Something to chew on - did the lapses between realities always happen with salesman Tony either asleep or unconscious?


----------



## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

InterMurph said:


> Yes, she was listed in the credits as Sheila Kelley.


Cool! That's who I thought it was but I forgot to check the credits for the name. She was really cute on L.A. Law but it looks like that helmet has picked up quite a few dings over the years!


----------



## KRS (Jan 30, 2002)

I am pretty sure it was "Smoke on the Water" as well. Mainly because I was picturing playing it in *Guitar Hero*.


----------



## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

KRS said:


> I am pretty sure it was "Smoke on the Water" as well. Mainly because I was picturing playing it in *Guitar Hero*.


Dude you need to stop watching so much TV so you can focus on your music!


----------



## jerobi (Sep 28, 2000)

10 minutes of content in a 50 minute episode. Enjoy your acting awards, but that was some drawn...out....drama... for a show that is known for letting a handful of plot angles evaporate between every episode.

I guess the thinking is to start the season with a shocker, throw a drama curveball in ep 2 to get people grumbling, and maybe come back strong in episode 3? I certainly hope so, because I was looking at the TiVo clock a few times last night. And as someone else mentioned already, that was a lousy episode to run on a free preview weekend.


----------



## InterMurph (May 22, 2003)

Figaro said:


> Cool! That's who I thought it was but I forgot to check the credits for the name. She was really cute on L.A. Law but it looks like that helmet has picked up quite a few dings over the years!


IMDB says she was born in 1964, so she's 42. That would make her 26 when she started on LA Law. So maybe cut her a break.

Coincidentally, Anabella Sciorra (Gloria Trillo) was also born in 1964. Hubba Hubba.


----------



## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

InterMurph said:


> IMDB says she was born in 1964, so she's 42. That would make her 26 when she started on LA Law. So maybe cut her a break.
> 
> Coincidentally, Anabella Sciorra (Gloria Trillo) was also born in 1964. Hubba Hubba.


Break shmake. I don't care how old she is. If you go from cute to Busey over the course of 10 or 12 years then you are riding the bike incorrectly.


----------



## terpfan1980 (Jan 28, 2002)

Figaro said:


> Break shmake. I don't care how old she is. If you go from cute to Busey over the course of 10 or 12 years then you are riding the bike incorrectly.


LOL at the insight shown in those words above ^^


----------



## Bradc314 (Dec 4, 2001)

My wife said last night: "We waited two years for THIS?!?"

Great acting, but we tuned in for a gangster show, not ER. We're not giving up yet. Just curious to see where this goes...


----------



## goMO (Dec 29, 2004)

for awhile I thought the hospital room scene was a dream. what doctor says in front of the family "the obvious negative outcome" or something like that. some bedside manner.... 

its like they were telling them he *is* going to die, it would only be a matter of when..


----------



## speedcouch (Oct 23, 2003)

Figaro said:


> I actually enjoyed the dream part of the episode. They lost me when they came back to the real world, dear god that was boring.


I enjoyed the dream sequence as well. To me, it seemed like an alternate life that Tony could've had if he'd not been part of the mob. The memory glitches because of the diagnosed Alzheimers, to me, are going to account for the brain damage Tony may have when he gets out of the coma.



Figaro said:


> I guess I am the only person in the world who thinks Edie Falco is terrible and overacts to nth degree. Maybe it's just that I have never like her or the character, but I just never see what all the accolades are for. I don't see how being a ***** or hyperventilating while crying equals "powerful" acting.


No, I'm with you as well. I can't believe so many here are claiming it was a powerful performance. I find Gandofini's acting to be so much better (when he's not in a coma). Falco just seems one-dimensional to me all the time. Whining and *****y, whining and crying.



jradosh said:


> The pace was slow, but the plot introduced a ton of possibilities.


I agree 100%!!



jradosh said:


> * AJ moving into "the family" is certainly an option now that he's flunking out of school and is ready to whack Jun.


He certainly has always been an unredeeming little punk, so him joining the family seems appropriate to me. I predict he'll be about as much of a loser at that too. About useful as Christopher has always been to the family. Which is not much...



jradosh said:


> * And what about the whole terrorist conversation with Christopher and the agents and then the two middle-eastern-looking guys at the Bada-Bing near the end of the ep? I'm really curious where that's going.


I figured Christopher was going to "rat" out the middle Eastern guys to the Feds, but it didn't seem that way [yet]. But I'm betting that will eventually come. Quite intriguing that the Feds seemed truly concerned about Tony (as a person). Obviously, they now have bigger fish to fry.

Also, to me, Tony being incapacitated opens up SO many possibilities of a turf war between the remaining "family" members. I think we saw the beginnings of that this week and more in the previews. I'm predicting Silvio comes out on top. He's the oldest and meanest among them.

Cheryl


----------



## Ace Deprave (Jul 19, 2002)

Figaro said:


> Break shmake. I don't care how old she is. If you go from cute to Busey over the course of *10 or 12 years* then you are riding the bike incorrectly.


Or 16...


----------



## scheckeNYK (Apr 28, 2004)

In another link to good writing this week, A.J. was given the line, "poor you!" which was practically a catchphrase of his late grandmother. Its not as pointed as last week's role reversal about the nursing home but still nice attention to detail.


----------



## 5thcrewman (Sep 23, 2003)

They should play 'Breathe' on the SONY boombox in Tony's room!  

WTF, SFU?


----------



## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

goMO said:


> for awhile I thought the hospital room scene was a dream. what doctor says in front of the family "the obvious negative outcome" or something like that. some bedside manner....
> 
> its like they were telling them he *is* going to die, it would only be a matter of when..


I agree with you. I debated with the wife a few times that everything was a dream.


----------



## Granny (Mar 29, 2005)

ICU was totally unbelievable, not nearly enough technology and machines. Family allowed to sleep in there, no mandatory gowns and gloves, no 24/7 nurse. meh.

I don't know why whenever someone cries it is deemed a "great" performance. Carmella lives in a dream world of her own if she believes that Tony is going to heaven - why? because he is a great father? Right...

I agree with those who find this plot line a bit off-putting. Many more days of Tony in lala land and we might as well be watching General Hospital.


----------



## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

Ace Deprave said:


> Or 16...


She is still riding the bike incorrectly. She looked like hell!


----------



## RangersRBack (Jan 9, 2006)

I didn't like the episode, but not because of some of the reasons stated here. Dream sequence or no, hospital room or no, the bottom line to me is without Tony Soprano, this is just another show. Tony is the reason I watch, and in this episode, even when he was Anthony Soprano, salesman, he wasn't Tony Soprano. And laying in a hospital bed, of course, he wasn't Tony Soprano either.

This show needs Tony Soprano. The bad guy we love, or hate, or love to hate, or hate to love, or whatever, is what this show needs. Interacting with his family, or his 'family', or his competition on the other side of the river, especially Johnny Sack, even baring his soul to Dr. Melfi, that's what I like to watch. The show is good, Tony is great, and in that episode there was no Tony. I hope he comes back and the show goes back to great again.


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## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

Granny said:


> ICU was totally unbelievable, not nearly enough technology and machines. Family allowed to sleep in there, no mandatory gowns and gloves, no 24/7 nurse. meh.


Nothing wrong with the ICU. They had a heart monitor and a vent, and the IV pole. That's all you need, and it would all be where you saw it in the show. You only need gown/gloves when the patient is in "contact isolation", which is when they are either immunosuppressed, or have a bacteria resistant strain, such as MSRE. Masks are usually only necessary if the bacteria/virus is airborne, but they may use it for contact isolation as well, i guess.

The nurses are there 24/7, just not in the room. But there is a nurses station central to all the ICU beds. As far as sleeping in there... There are visiting hours in most ICU's. We don't really know what time the family is in there. They implied overnight, I guess, but they could explain that away with the fact we don't know what time they are sleeping.

Actually, most ICU's will look EXACTLY like you saw in the show.


----------



## fliptheflop (Sep 20, 2005)

There's more to the Sopranos then just the mob and people getting whacked. If you don't know that by now, what the hell have you been watching? David Chase has made Tony as real as possible. And weather you like it or not bad things happen in life. I love what they are doing.


----------



## xuxa (Oct 8, 2001)

5thcrewman said:


> They should play 'Breathe' on the SONY boombox in Tony's room!
> 
> WTF, SFU?


then someone would get blown up


----------



## xuxa (Oct 8, 2001)

fliptheflop said:


> There's more to the Sopranos then just the mob and people getting whacked. If you don't know that by now, what the hell have you been watching? David Chase has made Tony as real as possible. And weather you like it or not bad things happen in life. I love what they are doing.


 :up: :up:

Another good throwback to a couple of seasons back when Tony told Melfi he might have been patio furniture salesman in another life if decisons were made different .


----------



## LlamaLarry (Apr 30, 2003)

bruinfan said:


> There are visiting hours in most ICU's. We don't really know what time the family is in there. They implied overnight, I guess, but they could explain that away with the fact we don't know what time they are sleeping.
> 
> Actually, most ICU's will look EXACTLY like you saw in the show.


I agree. I have only visited family members in the ICU a few times and each time no gloves/gown/masks required, maybe stringent handwashing techniques, but nothing else. Also, I am pretty sure that family members were allowed any time in the ICU, yet kicked out after visiting hours when they were moved to a normal floor. I bet if they really think Tony is gonna die the last thing they will do will be kick the family out, tell them to go home and "We'll call you if he dies while you sleep on your Select-Comfort bed".

My most recent visit to an ICU was a cardiac ICU and there were definitely no visiting hours in effect and there was most certainly not a nurse in the room 24x7. In fact, I have never seen that in a modern monitored room or even a movie that depicts a time later than WWII. 

Why was Tony re-intubated after he woke up? He was awake and breathing on his own and at that time they had not medically induced coma. If the situation were indeed that dire I would think allowing the patient a chance to say goodbye would be preferable to me rather than check out while I was sleeping.


----------



## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Granny said:


> ...Carmella lives in a dream world of her own if she believes that Tony is going to heaven - why? because he is a great father? Right...


I forgot to mention my thoughts on this, surprised nobody else has. She never actually said that she thought she was going to heaven, did she? Just that he wasn't going to hell. Did she mean that she now believed that he'd go to heaven, or simply that he wasn't going to hell because he wasn't going to die? Maybe the circumstances made her feel sorry for having said it, but she still believed that he would go to hell when he did die, but that he wasn't going to die now. She seemed to be choosing her words carefully.


----------



## UBUBUB (Dec 1, 2005)

I caught this week's episode on a free weekend, and used the free HBO-On-Demand to catch up on last week's ep. Glad I didn't spend the money for HBO this year. Snoozers!


----------



## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

LlamaLarry said:


> Why was Tony re-intubated after he woke up? He was awake and breathing on his own and at that time they had not medically induced coma. If the situation were indeed that dire I would think allowing the patient a chance to say goodbye would be preferable to me rather than check out while I was sleeping.


He never really woke up. He had a mucous plug that prevented him from passing air, and this caused a gag reflex. But he was never fully conscious. He did say something, I guess, but nothing intelligible, and he was not responding to questions, and he did go back unconscious. They would have given him a chance to breathe, but it was probably immediately apparent is O2 saturation was dropping fast, and that's why they reintubated. The only reason to reintubate is if either he's not breathing, or he's not breathing sufficiently enough to bring in O2.


----------



## bullitt (Feb 13, 2002)

Satchel said:


> Big bag of suck...
> 
> I hate dream episodes...
> 
> 18 shows left and we get NOTHING....


Tony a traveling salesman WTF?  
I agree, I said same thing to my wife. This type of episode is filler crap not something you would expect after a 20 month hiatus. What's next a "Reunion Show"?  Very disappointed after the promising first episode.


----------



## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

jeff125va said:


> I forgot to mention my thoughts on this, surprised nobody else has. She never actually said that she thought she was going to heaven, did she? Just that he wasn't going to hell. Did she mean that she now believed that he'd go to heaven, or simply that he wasn't going to hell because he wasn't going to die? Maybe the circumstances made her feel sorry for having said it, but she still believed that he would go to hell when he did die, but that he wasn't going to die now. She seemed to be choosing her words carefully.


Carm cracks me up. She's going to hell too. Tony will be there first, though.


----------



## Dafaso (Dec 13, 2000)

pdhenry said:


> Ahh, the "Dallas" defense (it was all a horrible, horrible dream...).
> 
> Or maybe the Bob Newhart syndrome?


Not exactly...although I never did see Dallas but I've heard..



pdhenry said:


> Something to chew on - did the lapses between realities always happen with salesman Tony either asleep or unconscious?


I'm thinking that the entire mafia story was imagined by Tony in the last months of his real life (as a salesman) when his alzheimers was at its worst. Not quite a dream really. During this season, we'll see more and more scenes of his real life as his alzheimers progresses and his health declines. There'll be scenes in the final episode or two showing Tony in the latest stages of this alzheimers not knowing what's going on around him, while his wife (probably not Carmella) and kids wonder if he's able to understand anything. Meanwhile, cut to Tony's thoughts where he fantasizing of a being a gangster. When the series ends, people will be debating which is the real Tony - the salesman or the Mafia Don.

Or maybe not.....


----------



## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

Granny said:


> Carmella lives in a dream world of her own if she believes that Tony is going to heaven - why? because he is a great father? Right...


Yeah, when she said "you are not going to go to hell" I thought to myself, if Tony Soprano doesn't go to hell, then who does?


----------



## dreamseason (Mar 14, 2003)

In case no one here reads the "official newspaper" of the Sopranos, there's an article in today's Newark (NJ) Star-Ledger that pretty much covers all the questions you may have about last night's Hotel California episode.

http://www.nj.com/columns/ledger/sepinwall/index.ssf?/base/columns-0/1142836402123280.xml&coll=1


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## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

Dafaso said:


> Not exactly...although I never did see Dallas but I've heard..
> 
> I'm thinking that the entire mafia story was imagined by Tony in the last months of his real life (as a salesman) when his alzheimers was at its worst. Not quite a dream really. During this season, we'll see more and more scenes of his real life as his alzheimers progresses and his health declines. There'll be scenes in the final episode or two showing Tony in the latest stages of this alzheimers not knowing what's going on around him, while his wife (probably not Carmella) and kids wonder if he's able to understand anything. Meanwhile, cut to Tony's thoughts where he fantasizing of a being a gangster. When the series ends, people will be debating which is the real Tony - the salesman or the Mafia Don.
> 
> Or maybe not.....


WAIT... I got it... Wasn't there *4* people died or in the hospital so far? and then the porsche was an *8*v? And then *15*,000 was Tony's cut of the inheritance. And then Johnny Sack got *16* months?......

Yeeeee-aaah.


----------



## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

I liked how the FBI had to investigate whether or not Tony was involved in the JFK assassination.


----------



## dreamseason (Mar 14, 2003)

InterMurph said:


> IMDB says she was born in 1964, so she's 42. That would make her 26 when she started on LA Law. So maybe cut her a break.
> 
> Coincidentally, Anabella Sciorra (Gloria Trillo) was also born in 1964. Hubba Hubba.


Wow, you guys are harsh... and you put too much into a short appearance on a TV show where lighting, costume, and makeup are all part of the equation.

I guess no one here watches Oprah either? Embarrassing for me to admit it (a guy watching Oprah and remembering specific episode details), but I remember her on Oprah promoting a program to get in shape by learning stripper moves, pole moves and all... She was/is HOT! http://sfactor.com


----------



## jradosh (Jul 31, 2001)

dreamseason said:


> In case no one here reads the "official newspaper" of the Sopranos, there's an article in today's Newark (NJ) Star-Ledger that pretty much covers all the questions you may have about last night's Hotel California episode.
> 
> http://www.nj.com/columns/ledger/sepinwall/index.ssf?/base/columns-0/1142836402123280.xml&coll=1


Good article. I liked Sepinwall's observation that


> For years, most of "Sopranos" fandom has been divided into two intersecting sets: those who watch for the whacking and crude humor, and those who watch for the psychiatry and art-house storytelling. By putting the shooting right next to Tony's afterlife business trip, Chase is pushing his chips to the center of the table and telling the audience they had better go all in -- murder and therapy, flatulence jokes and metaphysics -- if they intend to stay at the table for this final season.


Very true, as seen in this thread.


----------



## dreamseason (Mar 14, 2003)

double posted... server busy error


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## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

dreamseason said:


> Wow, you guys are harsh... and you put too much into a short appearance on a TV show where lighting, costume, and makeup are all part of the equation.
> 
> I guess no one here watches Oprah either? Embarrassing for me to admit it (a guy watching Oprah and remembering specific episode details), but I remember her on Oprah promoting a program to get in shape by learning stripper moves, pole moves and all... She was/is HOT! http://sfactor.com


If through the magic of Television with lighting, costume, and make-up they can't make her look good, then that is a seriously dinged up helmet!!

No I don't watch Oprah. Opera yes, Oprah no!


----------



## TiVo'Brien (Feb 8, 2002)

I'm mostly in it for the "psychiatry and art-house storytelling", but the whacking and crude humor are good, too.


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## Ace Deprave (Jul 19, 2002)

bruinfan said:


> He never really woke up. He had a mucous plug that prevented him from passing air, and this caused a gag reflex. But he was never fully conscious. *He did say something, I guess, but nothing intelligible, and he was not responding to questions, and he did go back unconscious.* They would have given him a chance to breathe, but it was probably immediately apparent is O2 saturation was dropping fast, and that's why they reintubated. The only reason to reintubate is if either he's not breathing, or he's not breathing sufficiently enough to bring in O2.


It sounded like he was saying "who am I, where am I going?"


----------



## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

Ace Deprave said:


> It sounded like he was saying "who am I, where am I going?"


Which is not an intelligible answer to the question, "Tony, do you know who I am?"


----------



## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

bruinfan said:


> Which is not an intelligible answer to the question, "Tony, do you know who I am?"


No it is not pertinent to the question but it most certainly was intelligible.


----------



## Ace Deprave (Jul 19, 2002)

bruinfan said:


> Which is not an intelligible answer to the question, "Tony, do you know who I am?"


*in·tel·li·gi·ble* (n-tl-j-bl)
adj.
1. Capable of being understood

I agree that his answer had nothing to do with the question she was asking, but it was intelligible.



Figaro said:


> No it is not pertinent to the question but it most certainly was intelligible.


Man, you beat me to the punch.


----------



## chewbaccad (Feb 16, 2005)

I wasn't crazy about the ep, but it had the necessary set-ups for the plot devices of the season. Should be interesting if AJ whacks Junior. And I'm eagerly awaiting the organization tearing itself apart from within.

Throw me in with the lot who doesn't care for Falco. Decent performance, and the lack of make-up was well done, but I was ready to throw up when she was acting like she was gonna mount him right there in the ICU  

I'll be pissed if that little weasel AJ gets a Shelby before I do


----------



## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

Ace Deprave said:


> *in·tel·li·gi·ble*
> Man, you beat me to the punch.


Yeah but can I do it four or five times?


----------



## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

Figaro said:


> No it is not pertinent to the question but it most certainly was intelligible.


ok, bad word choice... 

Disoriented is a better word. LOCx0.

unable to tell person, location, time, situtation

So he was disoriented, delusional, and losing what little consciousness he had, and he probably wasn't getting O2 into his system, and that's why he was reintubated.


----------



## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

chewbaccad said:


> , but I was ready to throw up when she was acting like she was gonna mount him right there in the ICU


"it's making me wet down there"... gross.

Do you realize how bad Tony must smell, with the wound, and the bad breath, and the minimal sponge baths?


----------



## Tivortex (Feb 29, 2004)

bruinfan said:


> which is when they are either immunosuppressed, or have a bacteria resistant strain, such as MSRE.


I think you mean MRSA. Methicillin Resistant Staphylococcus Aureus


----------



## bruinfan (Jan 17, 2006)

Tivortex said:


> I think you mean MRSA. Methicillin Resistant Staphylococcus Aureus


yeah... MRSA
VRE i think is the other big one...


----------



## GadgetFreak (Jun 3, 2002)

Figaro said:


> Who was the actress playing the woman in the bar of Tony's dream? She looked familiar but I can't place her.


As previosuly posted, she was on LA Law but I'll always remember her from the movie "Singles" -- great flick.


----------



## LlamaLarry (Apr 30, 2003)

bruinfan said:


> "it's making me wet down there"... gross.


Umm, jeez, did she actually say that? That is indeed, quite gross. I must have blocked that out. :::shudder:::

Carm looked horrible in this episode, even when just arriving at the hospital. I know she is exhausted and under a lot of stress, but I can't imagine a worse sight to see when waking up. If I were Tony and opened my eyes to Carm I would assume that she had died as well.


----------



## UBUBUB (Dec 1, 2005)

Concerning Edie Falco's lack of makeup:

Does a woman in fact need to apply makeup to appear as if she is not wearing makeup? I guess this question would be for someone who is a makeup artist for films.


----------



## Jon J (Aug 23, 2000)

I agree with an earlier suggestion...

Newhart ending. Definitely Newhart.


----------



## Spire (Jun 6, 2001)

LlamaLarry said:


> Umm, jeez, did she actually say that? That is indeed, quite gross. I must have blocked that out. :::shudder:::


No.

Here's what she she said:


> This song was playing in your car that entire weekend we all went down to Long Beach Island. Remember Artie and Charmaine broke up for the first time? First of many. _[Laughs.]_
> 
> She accused him of letting her drown in the ocean. Remember that? That wave picked her up and slammed her down on her head on the sand. _[Laughs.]_
> 
> ...


----------



## Mr. Soze (Nov 2, 2002)

Well if they are going to do "psychiatry and art-house storytelling", after twenty months could they at least make it, you know, entertaining?


----------



## jradosh (Jul 31, 2001)

Mr. Soze said:


> Well if they are going to do "psychiatry and art-house storytelling", after twenty months could they at least make it, you know, entertaining?





Mr. Soze said:


> Without Meadow's nips and Vito farting, it was irredeemably awful. It had better pick up...


You are only allowed one fart and two nipple shots in a one-hour art-house episode. Sorry.


----------



## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

The usually have one of these far out episodes a year... We need to remember that this show has always been about Tony Soprano. It has never been about the bigger picture. He is always the central focus and his existance and psyche are the central point of the show. (This does make me rethink the idea that he might die, because the show is about him.) 

One huge brightspot for me is no Dr. Melfi. Even though it might be considered along the same lines of revealing inner aspects of Tony, pretty much every Dr. Melfi visit is a fast-forward for me. No Dr. Melfi no fast forward.

I think these episodes give the series a little more texture. Would I want to go through this every week? No way, but it does help to deepen the story.


----------



## Tivortex (Feb 29, 2004)

UBUBUB said:


> Concerning Edie Falco's lack of makeup:
> 
> Does a woman in fact need to apply makeup to appear as if she is not wearing makeup? I guess this question would be for someone who is a makeup artist for films.


Or a Zen master.


----------



## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

Bradc314 said:


> My wife said last night: "We waited two years for THIS?!?"
> 
> Great acting, but we tuned in for a gangster show, not ER. We're not giving up yet. Just curious to see where this goes...


Some of the posts here are interesting... Several people have said they will continue to give it a chance. Not picking on you particular, just the choice of like you are now on the fence after one episode. It is not like there is a significant archive of Sopranos work to have a fairly good idea of where the show might go. It is also not the first time they have done a surreal show like this, it happens once a year almost.

It is just funny that people treat the second episode of the last season of arguably one of the best dramas in the history of television like it is the second episode of Free Ride and they are trying to decide if they are going to stick around and watch any more.


----------



## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

Granny said:


> ICU was totally unbelievable, not nearly enough technology and machines. Family allowed to sleep in there, no mandatory gowns and gloves, no 24/7 nurse. meh.


No offense but having had my father in ICU for several weeks a a year ago, I have no idea what you are talking about. Family members were allowed to stay in there, I know because I did. You were not required to wear a gown or gloves, and there was not an excessive amount of machines either, nor was there a nurse who stands in the room. They certainly have 24x7 nurses, but they don't have one nurse per patient.

Perhaps you are being sarcastic and I just missed it.. if so, no worries.. Otherwise, I am not sure what you are talking about.


----------



## fliptheflop (Sep 20, 2005)

marksman said:


> Some of the posts here are interesting... Several people have said they will continue to give it a chance. Not picking on you particular, just the choice of like you are now on the fence after one episode. It is not like there is a significant archive of Sopranos work to have a fairly good idea of where the show might go. It is also not the first time they have done a surreal show like this, it happens once a year almost.
> 
> It is just funny that people treat the second episode of the last season of arguably one of the best dramas in the history of television like it is the second episode of Free Ride and they are trying to decide if they are going to stick around and watch any more.


 :up: :up: exactly


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

fliptheflop said:


> :up: :up: exactly


Yes, and as I said earlier, while the episode didn't work for me, I admire their courage in not just doing the same old same old, week in week out.


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## hkancyr (Jan 20, 2002)

I hope if T comes back he gets some kind of near death revelation like Christopher had, maybe relating to someone that needs wacking. 

The way he lusts after Melfi I would hope that she is his dream wife, perhaps she would sound a bit different after years of marriage to a salesman. The wife on the phone sounded like she was purposely not giving any voice hints. Maybe the voice will change as he gets closer to either life or death.

Maybe we will see the death of a salesman when he comes back to earth. Maybe not, it sounds as if he is quite a successful one in his dreams. 

Janice is playing a perfect, stereotypical crocodile teared, close relation who has no feelings, but cries for access and power. Tell me her mind isn't on her benefits in a Tonyless future. Better to cry and not say anything that might make someone say "get the f**k outa here." 

Looks like the boys are gonna get down next episode, so all you excitement junkies should be happy.


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## bdlucas (Feb 15, 2004)

Anyone else thinking the rest of the season might revolve around a lengthy and maybe incomplete convalescence for Tony, the power vacuum that his incapacity would leave, and the subsequent power struggles? If AJ heads down the path he appears headed for, Tony might eventually (after much angst) choose to groom him as heir, setting the stage for more juicy conflict in both of Tony's families. What fun!


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## jradosh (Jul 31, 2001)

Ace Deprave said:


> It sounded like he was saying "who am I, where am I going?"


Just rewatched the episode. He actually says this 3 times during the episode. Once in the "Purgatory" scene and then twice during his episode where he removes his breathing tube.

I think that means something more than just rambling (for those that look for more than just farts and nipples, that is)


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## bigcb37 (Jun 14, 2002)

Great episode. Great acting. Lots of possibilities for the future. This isn't Goodfellas where its constant mafia action the whole time...and thats okay.


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## jerobi (Sep 28, 2000)

In response to those who feel that the "art house" turn is necessary and appreciated, this show doesn't need it. We've had plenty of seasons where the intrigue was mixed with plenty of action. Last night's episode struck me as an episode of E.R. - and not a sweeps episode where a helicopter explodes into the building. I hope two years didn't give them too MUCH time to write these scripts, layered with heavy symbolism.

I'm also finding it amusing that this episode is being defended as offering lots of new plot devices. While that may certainly be the case, isn't this the show that is notorious for dropping three or four plot angles every week?


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## tivotvaddict (Aug 11, 2005)

bruinfan said:


> He never really woke up. He had a mucous plug that prevented him from passing air, and this caused a gag reflex. But he was never fully conscious. He did say something, I guess, but nothing intelligible, and he was not responding to questions, and he did go back unconscious. They would have given him a chance to breathe, but it was probably immediately apparent is O2 saturation was dropping fast, and that's why they reintubated. The only reason to reintubate is if either he's not breathing, or he's not breathing sufficiently enough to bring in O2.


He didn't "go back unconscious," they pushed atavan which zoned him out. Minor point.....


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## jradosh (Jul 31, 2001)

jerobi said:


> In response to those who feel that the "art house" turn is necessary and appreciated, this show doesn't need it. We've had plenty of seasons where the intrigue was mixed with plenty of action. Last night's episode struck me as an episode of E.R. - and not a sweeps episode where a helicopter explodes into the building. I hope two years didn't give them too MUCH time to write these scripts, layered with heavy symbolism.
> 
> I'm also finding it amusing that this episode is being defended as offering lots of new plot devices. While that may certainly be the case, isn't this the show that is notorious for dropping three or four plot angles every week?


It's not that the "art house" turn is "necessary"... it is what the show is. It's always had that aspect to it... sometimes more and sometimes less. Last night was a heavy dose of it, but it _was_ appreciated by some of us. You can't take that away from us fans just because you helicopter-explodes-into-the-building guys didn't like it.

And when I pointed out the new plot lines being offered in this episode, it's not a defense. It's an observation. Bit of a difference (not that I'm being defensive  )

But yeah, I hope they don't abandon plot lines like they did that Russian in the woods.


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## Paperboy2003 (Mar 30, 2004)

Speaking of abandoned plot lines, did anyone while watching the commercials, see the rapper from a few years back? The one who tried to get money from Heshie?

I thought that was an interesting plot line and to see him, or so I thought, in a Soprano's commercial, piqued my interest.


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## Lee L (Oct 1, 2003)

bdlucas said:


> Anyone else thinking the rest of the season might revolve around a lengthy and maybe incomplete convalescence for Tony, the power vacuum that his incapacity would leave, and the subsequent power struggles? If AJ heads down the path he appears headed for, Tony might eventually (after much angst) choose to groom him as heir, setting the stage for more juicy conflict in both of Tony's families. What fun!


I sure think and hope so. Well, not so much about AJ, but the whole power vacuum thing has lots of possiblities.


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## pendragn (Jan 21, 2001)

Lee L said:


> I sure think and hope so. Well, not so much about AJ, but the whole power vacuum thing has lots of possiblities.


Like someone said before, the show's appeal (at least to me) has always been Tony. His personality is what made the rest all fit together. I don't think any of the other actors or characters have what it takes to carry the show through the power vacuum phase. If the character of Tony is gone I think the show will really suffer.

tk


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

marksman said:


> ...One huge brightspot for me is no Dr. Melfi. Even though it might be considered along the same lines of revealing inner aspects of Tony, pretty much every Dr. Melfi visit is a fast-forward for me. No Dr. Melfi no fast forward...


Do you honestly fast-forward through ANY scene with Melfi in it? I seriously doubt it.


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## bdlucas (Feb 15, 2004)

pendragn said:


> Like someone said before, the show's appeal (at least to me) has always been Tony. His personality is what made the rest all fit together. I don't think any of the other actors or characters have what it takes to carry the show through the power vacuum phase. If the character of Tony is gone I think the show will really suffer.


Agreed, and that's why I think the power vacuum would be only a partial vacuum having to do with Tony's incapacitation and convalescence, not his death. A large part of it would be Tony dealing with his weakened status, and perhaps picking and grooming an heir .


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## pendragn (Jan 21, 2001)

bdlucas said:


> A large part of it would be Tony dealing with his weakened status, ...


This saddens me. Again, Tony's character is why the show clicks, at least for me. I have these visions of him being like the father in Legends of the Fall towards the end. That's not going to be very entertaining and his commanding presense certainly won't shine through. The more I think about this season, the less excited I am. I wish they would have ended it before they went down this road. 

tk


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

If Tony's life turns out to be just some delusions of some guy in Costa Mesa, I will be extremely disappointed.


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## ngsmith (Jan 18, 2002)

pmyers said:


> If Tony's life turns out to be just some delusions of some guy in Costa Mesa, I will be extremely disappointed.


I would be surprised if they pull the "dream" ending. That would surely kill any chance of a Sopranos movie - after all they can't make the actors any younger than they are right now.


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## mitchb2 (Sep 30, 2000)

What crap for a second episode after 2 1/2 years.


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## Paperboy2003 (Mar 30, 2004)

I'm always one to think that if they were going to kill Tony it would not be after a long protracted coma, but rather at the business end of Phil or one of Johnny Sacks goomba's guns. They CAN'T take Tony out in a hospital bed on a ventilator. Chase would get blasted for that!


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## InterMurph (May 22, 2003)

I've always thought that Tony would get whacked while retrieving the newspaper from the end of his driveway.

And what happened to Bobby's two older kids? I know that kids from a previous marriage get shoved to the background when the new baby is born. But it's almost like they are forgotten. So far, at least...


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## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

jerobi said:


> In response to those who feel that the "art house" turn is necessary and appreciated, this show doesn't need it. We've had plenty of seasons where the intrigue was mixed with plenty of action. Last night's episode struck me as an episode of E.R. - and not a sweeps episode where a helicopter explodes into the building. I hope two years didn't give them too MUCH time to write these scripts, layered with heavy symbolism.
> 
> I'm also finding it amusing that this episode is being defended as offering lots of new plot devices. While that may certainly be the case, isn't this the show that is notorious for dropping three or four plot angles every week?


As mentioned earlier, this is not the first time they have had an episode like this. It is at least the third or fourth one in 5 seasons.


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## bdlucas (Feb 15, 2004)

pendragn said:


> This saddens me. Again, Tony's character is why the show clicks, at least for me. I have these visions of him being like the father in Legends of the Fall towards the end. That's not going to be very entertaining and his commanding presense certainly won't shine through. The more I think about this season, the less excited I am. I wish they would have ended it before they went down this road.


Maybe you're right - maybe the power vacuum thing will only be a temporary bump in the road, and the story will be about what Tony must do to re-establish his authority, after which he will be stronger than ever.

So suppose AJ whacks Jun. This might be unpopular, especially among some of the old-timers. Tony has demonstrated that he is capable of killing a blood relative (his cousin) to restore peace in his other family. Naww, the writers wouldn't go there, would they? Problem is it would require many sessions with Dr Melfi, which will upset half the folks who post here


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

bdlucas said:


> ...So suppose AJ whacks Jun. This might be unpopular, especially among some of the old-timers. Tony has demonstrated that he is capable of killing a blood relative (his cousin) to restore peace in his other family. Naww, the writers wouldn't go there, would they? Problem is it would require many sessions with Dr Melfi, which will upset half the folks who post here


From the conversation Tony's crew had at the funeral, they said it would be up to Tony as to what happens with Jun, so I don't think there would be any reprucusions from AJ wacking Jun.


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## FlugPoP (Jan 7, 2004)

I feel that people who didnt like this episode missed the point of it. Yah it wasnt full of action and was a bit sappy but there was a lot more to it than just that.


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## jerobi (Sep 28, 2000)

FlugPoP said:


> I feel that people who didnt like this episode missed the point of it. Yah it wasnt full of action and was a bit sappy but there was a lot more to it than just that.


I'm not sure that's the case. I understood the episode and I welcome some of the future plot lines (AJ getting revenge, DHS with Chris, power vacuum while Tony is out, etc). I just don't agree with the decision to spend 4/5 of the episode showing us tears, hugs, and a thick layer of sybolism with an alternative reality Tony. But hey, I don't make the show. I just wait 2 1/2 years for the new season to come out, and that wasn't the kind of thing I watch The Sopranos for. I'm fine if others really enjoy that side of things, but I found it to be drawn out and boring, especially given the usual pace of the show and their usual propensity to cut entire scenes down to twenty seconds for some plot angles.

Here's hoping that this isn't the season of dream sequences. If Tony is hurt and in the hospital for a few episodes, I want to see what the crew is doing.


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## pendragn (Jan 21, 2001)

FlugPoP said:


> I feel that people who didnt like this episode missed the point of it. Yah it wasnt full of action and was a bit sappy but there was a lot more to it than just that.


I admit I probably didn't get it the point, or at the very least didn't understand it all. But again, if it doesn't have Tony in it, regardless of whether I get the point or not, I'm not going to enjoy it as much.

tk


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## Mamoth (Jun 21, 2004)

I watched the show it wasn't like other episodes. When I normally watch Sopranos and the episode ends, I'm left wanting more. When this one ended, I was glad. I understood the point of it.. but I just found it boring.


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## Havana Brown (Feb 3, 2005)

I"m gonna smeek here. 

HATED THIS EPISODE. 

It was boring, and I couldn't care less for all the "great acting" y'all are talking about. Give me more of the real Sopranos.


Meadow, put on a bra! I didn't know she had come out with her eating disorder a few years back.


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## Timbeau (May 31, 2002)

Except for the scene where Carmela was in the ICU talking to Tony for what seemed like an hour, I liked the episode. There were definitely a lot of new areas opened up and I think the rest of the season could be pretty good because of it.

I can see Tony hanging around in the the hospital for a few more episodes then kicking the bucket and the show continuing on without him with his family dealing with the grief and his other family dealing with the struggle for power.

I know they've said that this is the last season, what if the producers want to go a few more seasons but don't want to put up with Gandolfini's salary? This would be a way to get rid of him and keep going.


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## Granny (Mar 29, 2005)

I keep thinking "They made Gandolfini gain an extra 30 lbs to lie in a bed with a hole in his belly?" They certainly must have more in store for him than that. They could have used fake body blubber for that.


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

Granny said:


> I keep thinking "They made Gandolfini gain an extra 30 lbs to lie in a bed with a hole in his belly?" They certainly must have more in store for him than that. They could have used fake body blubber for that.


somebody here mentioned that his weight gain was actually for another movie he shot before they started filming this season.


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## busyba (Feb 5, 2003)

Havana Brown said:


> Meadow, put on a bra!


Bite your tongue!


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## Rob64 (Aug 27, 2005)

First off this episode really hit home for me having to go through sitting in ICU so many times before my father past away in January. It was so realistic to me in the ICU scenes that I was actually getting tears in my eyes it was so familiar. 

I think this episode is setting up some pretty good battles in the family for control especially with Vito being cousins with Phil Leotardo and having his backing. It will be interesting to see where Pauly sits here. How about what could happen with Meadows fiance and Vito when he shows up without Tony to protect him. will Paulie finally meet up with the russian from Pine Barrens. How would Christopher fair without Tony around to watch out for him...He'd be dead by now if not for Tony. What about Dr. Melfi. If Tony passes will others decide she is a dangerous liability? The best is yet to come folks.


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## fmowry (Apr 30, 2002)

Is the episode over yet? God it dragged on and on and on. They could have introduced every new plot line with Tony sitting there conscious eating a bowl of pasta in his hospital bed. Introduce a craptastic dream sequence episode after giving us 6-7 good episodes first after the ten year hiatus please.

FX needs a mob show.

Frank


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Probably a trivial point, but, well first, I assume that the Maserati Christopher was driving was Johnny Sack's since he'd been talking about buying it, but it looked like this one was silver, and I could have sworn that Johnny's was like a gold/cream color, IIRC from the episode or two in which it appeared last season.


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## Tivortex (Feb 29, 2004)

fmowry said:


> Is the episode over yet? God it dragged on and on and on. They could have introduced every new plot line with Tony sitting there conscious eating a bowl of pasta in his hospital bed. Introduce a craptastic dream sequence episode after giving us 6-7 good episodes first after the ten year hiatus please.
> 
> FX needs a mob show.
> 
> Frank


Fmowry, it's not a dream. Again, Not a Dream. Tony is in purgatory. 
I'm sure knowing that makes it a lot less boring for you.


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## jradosh (Jul 31, 2001)

Tivortex said:


> Fmowry, it's not a dream. Again, Not a Dream. Tony is in purgatory.
> I'm sure knowing that makes it a lot less boring for you.


I think he's dreaming that he's in purgatory. Yeah, that's it...


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## Rob Helmerichs (Oct 17, 2000)

jradosh said:


> I think he's dreaming that he's in purgatory. Yeah, that's it...


No, JJ Abrams has said repeatedly that the castaways are NOT in purgatory, and that there IS a logical explanation for everything (although he hasn't gone so faw as to say that the logical explanation is the correct one).

Oh, wait. I got confused again. This is a different show, isn't it...


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Rob Helmerichs said:


> No, JJ Abrams has said repeatedly that the castaways are NOT in purgatory, and that there IS a logical explanation for everything (although he hasn't gone so faw as to say that the logical explanation is the correct one).
> 
> Oh, wait. I got confused again. This is a different show, isn't it...


Right, the 2-year hiatus is probably what got you mixed up.


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## RangersRBack (Jan 9, 2006)

I don't remember anybody mentioning this, but is anyone bothered by Uncle Junior being pushed so far into the background the last couple of seasons? Dominic Chianese is such an amazing actor, and they've virtually painted his character into a corner of the room he can't get out of.

Chianese and Gandolfini work off each other so well, I wish they would have left some power with Uncle Junior and had him interact with Tony more often. Having them working together, or working against each other, or whatever, would have been much more interesting than watching Uncle Junior lose his mind little by little and fade into the background.


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## fmowry (Apr 30, 2002)

Tivortex said:


> Fmowry, it's not a dream. Again, Not a Dream. Tony is in purgatory.
> I'm sure knowing that makes it a lot less boring for you.


No, purgatory is when Tony awakes to his wife without makeup. 

Frank


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## Jon J (Aug 23, 2000)

fmowry said:


> No, purgatory is when Tony awakes to his wife without makeup.


Are you sure that's just not pure hell?


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## hefe (Dec 5, 2000)

Jon J said:


> Are you sure that's just not pure hell?


That's Carmela without makeup _in HD_.


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## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

hefe said:


> That's Carmela without makeup _in HD_.


 :up: :up:


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## Paperboy2003 (Mar 30, 2004)

I wonder if the Juliana Marguiles character seen in all the commercials, who's supposed to have some 'deep interaction' with Tony this season was just a red herring they threw out there. I guess it could be part of a dream sequence....


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

Paperboy2003 said:


> I wonder if the Juliana Marguiles character seen in all the commercials, who's supposed to have some 'deep interaction' with Tony this season was just a red herring they threw out there. I guess it could be part of a dream sequence....


Exactly, like they did with Jin speaking English... oh, sorry...


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## chewbaccad (Feb 16, 2005)

jeff125va said:


> Right, the 2-year hiatus is probably what got you mixed up.


would that be the 2 year hiatus between Sopranos episodes, or the seemingly 2 year hiatus between Lost episodes? Both can lead to confusion...


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## bigrig (Jul 1, 2004)

I was shocked by the amount of product placement for the Grouper Fishermen!!!  

I was so relieved when they cut out of the dream sequence. I can take a little bit at a time, but I can't take a whole episode. It was good to see Paulie Walnuts again...he always cracks me up. Fighting with Vito over who's going to take "Van Helsing" back home.

AJ is a immature brat, there's no way he'll shoot Uncle Jun. That mummy! Heh... :up: 

Matt


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## Royster (May 24, 2002)

I didn't get the "mummy" references. Can Anyone explain?... Anyone?... Beuller?


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## Figaro (Nov 10, 2003)

Royster said:


> I didn't get the "mummy" references. Can Anyone explain?... Anyone?... Beuller?


because he is old and looks like a mummy to AJ.


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## marksman (Mar 4, 2002)

pmyers said:


> Do you honestly fast-forward through ANY scene with Melfi in it? I seriously doubt it.


I would say about 95% of the time yes. I will try to struggle through it, but it always ends up with me fast forwarding. I just get nothing out of the interaction. I know it is on me but I accept that. Melfi used to be MUCH prominent in the early seasons and it made the show significantly less enjoyable for me. I don't necessarily know the information or reveleations are not worth it, just something about the interaction between those two that makes me want to zoom past it. There is no other part of the show where I ever do that.

The only time I would not fast forward through one of their sessions is if a shiny object or a bright light distracted me long enough for me to have it play out in the background.


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## bigrig (Jul 1, 2004)

Figaro said:


> because he is old and looks like a mummy to AJ.


Yeah, AJ said it, and someone else did earlier in the episode...maybe Meadow?


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## jeff125va (Mar 15, 2001)

bigrig said:


> Yeah, AJ said it, and someone else did earlier in the episode...maybe Meadow?


I think A.J. said it both times. First talking with Meadow, then in the hospital room with Tony, saying that he'd kill him. IIRC, that is.


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## xuxa (Oct 8, 2001)

marksman said:


> I would say about 95% of the time yes. I will try to struggle through it, but it always ends up with me fast forwarding. I just get nothing out of the interaction. I know it is on me but I accept that. Melfi used to be MUCH prominent in the early seasons and it made the show significantly less enjoyable for me. I don't necessarily know the information or reveleations are not worth it, just something about the interaction between those two that makes me want to zoom past it. There is no other part of the show where I ever do that.
> 
> The only time I would not fast forward through one of their sessions is if a shiny object or a bright light distracted me long enough for me to have it play out in the background.


Might as well watch the pan and scan version on mute.


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## jradosh (Jul 31, 2001)

xuxa said:


> Might as well watch the pan and scan version on mute.


Or just read the Cliff Notes version


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## Rkkeller (May 13, 2004)

marksman said:


> I would say about 95% of the time yes. I will try to struggle through it, but it always ends up with me fast forwarding.


I agree 100%. Easily one of the worst parts of the show if you ask me. Anymore the second they flip to him in the chair with her I reach for the remote. I also find myself reaching for the remote as an "in case" anytime AJ is the focal point of any scenes.

The last episode was a total let down and I was VERY disapointed after how fast the season opened.


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## Bananfish (May 16, 2002)

jeff125va said:


> Probably a trivial point, but, well first, I assume that the Maserati Christopher was driving was Johnny Sack's since he'd been talking about buying it, but it looked like this one was silver, and I could have sworn that Johnny's was like a gold/cream color, IIRC from the episode or two in which it appeared last season.


Maybe he took it to Earl Scheib!


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## pmyers (Jan 4, 2001)

wow...I can't believe people actually FF through anything. I mean...even if I hated something that much, I'd be too afraid I'd miss some intrical story line.


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## bdlucas (Feb 15, 2004)

pmyers said:


> afraid I'd miss some intrical story line.


A combination of integral and intricate? Works for me.


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## FlugPoP (Jan 7, 2004)

I know you guys wont like this I don't remember where I read it but, this has to do with the next episode.



Spoiler



The "dream" is going to continue into aleast next episode


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