# Netflix Streaming Quality



## indychris (Jan 15, 2011)

Has anyone noticed a difference between streaming Netflix via TiVo and another streaming source?

I have both a TiVo Premiere and a Mac Mini connected to my Samsung Plasma TV. Both are connected via HDMI. Both are hardwired to my network which has EXCELLENT throughput. I thought it may have just been the time of day at first, but it had started to seem that Netflix streaming via my Mini was a bit better than what was coming through my Premiere. I like the pause and rewind/ff features better on TiVo, so I've been using it primarily.

Tonight I put on an episode of 24 season 1 via my Mini and again it just seemed like a significantly better picture. So I decided to put it to the test. I have streamed them both--same episode back-to-back-to-back-to-back to see and there is definitely a better quality picture coming from my Mac Mini.

It makes me wonder if I don't have a setting correct on my TiVo somewhere.


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 28, 2002)

Picture quality is worst on TiVo vs any of the other streaming platforms I have, too. The advantage is the tivo-like controls, but you end up with a muddy picture (that crashes, too). I don't use TiVo for streaming Netflix anymore.

They DESPERATELY need to update their netflix player.



indychris said:


> Has anyone noticed a difference between streaming Netflix via TiVo and another streaming source?
> 
> I have both a TiVo Premiere and a Mac Mini connected to my Samsung Plasma TV. Both are connected via HDMI. Both are hardwired to my network which has EXCELLENT throughput. I thought it may have just been the time of day at first, but it had started to seem that Netflix streaming via my Mini was a bit better than what was coming through my Premiere. I like the pause and rewind/ff features better on TiVo, so I've been using it primarily.
> 
> ...


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## indychris (Jan 15, 2011)

curiousgeorge said:


> Picture quality is worst on TiVo vs any of the other streaming platforms I have, too. The advantage is the tivo-like controls, but you end up with a muddy picture (that crashes, too). I don't use TiVo for streaming Netflix anymore.
> 
> They DESPERATELY need to update their netflix player.


So do you think it is a hardware limitation, or would a software update be able to salvage the streaming capability?


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## curiousgeorge (Nov 28, 2002)

indychris said:


> So do you think it is a hardware limitation, or would a software update be able to salvage the streaming capability?


I definitely think a software update can take care of the issue. The TiVo Netflix player is one of the oldest out there, and it definitely shows.

Question is, if TiVo can't be bothered to even finish the HDUI on their flagship box in the YEAR since release, will they bother updating the Netflix player?


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## indychris (Jan 15, 2011)

curiousgeorge said:


> I definitely think a software update can take care of the issue. The TiVo Netflix player is one of the oldest out there, and it definitely shows.
> 
> Question is, if TiVo can't be bothered to even finish the HDUI on their flagship box in the YEAR since release, will they bother updating the Netflix player?


Quite the depressing, yet pertinent thought.


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## ewilts (Feb 26, 2002)

Netflix on TiVo satisfies the "checkbox" criteria - nothing more. It's buggy and TiVo either can't or won't update it.

TiVo makes a great DVR (although the basic functionality has not changed in many years) but pretty much sucks at everything else they try to layer on top.


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## Raech (Oct 2, 2000)

And if they would change that and get streaming netflix and it's other features running well.... I would buy a premier. I hardly ever watch my Series 2s anymore. They will need the Insight communications miniboxes to work soon. I will not be getting them.

What am I using you ask? The HD DVR from my provider of course. Would I like it to have a more tivo like interface? Yes. Do I miss tivo? Yes.
Enough to put up with the issues I read about Premiere? No, And if you look at my join date you know saying this pains me. A lot! I miss tivo, but what good is an HD interface that freezes? I want a keyboard for it, but I hear horrid things about that remote which I have to pay extra for.


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## justen_m (Jan 15, 2004)

I don't know... I access Netflix via one of my computers to set up my instant queue, but watch via my TivoHD. I haven't had any problems, except with some old shows where the encoding didn't seem to be correct for the Tivo, so I ended up watching those shows on a WinXP computer. I don't use my S2DT much, unless I have more than two shows to record at the same time.


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## KCcardsfan (Feb 20, 2011)

I just got a premeire and I don't like TIVO's netflix interface. I also have a ROKU box and TIVO can learn something from it's UI. It is faster and looks 10 times better as well as being able to search the streaming library and you instant watch cue. I just don't know why if a little box like ROKU can do that sort of advanced UI why can't TIVO. I also think the quality looks better on ROKU. So right now I switch over to the ROKU to stream. I am hoping the HULU + UI is more user friendly. With HULU I really only watch things in my cue so if it just does that then it would be OK.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

curiousgeorge said:


> Picture quality is worst on TiVo vs any of the other streaming platforms I have, too. The advantage is the tivo-like controls, but you end up with a muddy picture (that crashes, too). I don't use TiVo for streaming Netflix anymore.
> 
> They DESPERATELY need to update their netflix player.


It's the best picture qulaity for me since the TiVo is the only one that will send the native output and let my external scaler do it's job. So it easily beats the PS3 and all the other Netflix devices I've tried.

Although I do find I'm using Netflix on the Boxee Box more and more now. Even though the picture is inferior to my TiVo. The Boxee Box is faster and more convienent to use for me. Plus with only a six device limit on Netflix, I can't have all my TiVos active since I already have my three Boxee Boxes active for Netflix streaming.


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## igirl (Feb 5, 2011)

I have a Premiere on the way and will be able to compare it to a Roku XD.

What I'm really wondering beyond this question - is if the Tivo box will be able to display the extended menus and zillions of alternative channels that the dedicated Roku box has for Netflix - or ONLY show your Instant Watch Cue?


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## Gobbledygook (Jan 26, 2011)

I HATE HATE HATE HATE TiVo Premiere's NetFlix streaming feature. It's nearly impossible to navigate and use.

1. When trying to access NF from my "Now Playing" list, TiVo often freezes and, then, I have to reboot the box to regain functionality.

2. When trying to play a movie, I have to click "Play" then return to the screen two! more times to click "Play" again before the movie will actually start streaming; and, even then, the screen will freeze and crash while "retrieving data".

3. The screen constantly freezes and the movie plays in fits and starts throughout. One movie, in particular, would not play for more than two minutes before freezing.

4. While playing movies, the screen will randomly go black, forcing me to return to the menu and click "Play" MULTIPLE TIMES AGAIN!!!! A 90 minute movie can take 3 hours to watch at this rate!

5. Forget about watching foreign films (the majority of my NF viewing), because the subtitles get cut off at the bottom of the screen. If I switch the screen format to create faux letterboxing, the subtitles get cut off behind the black mask.

If I was opting for the NF "streaming only" service, I would be compelled to lose the TiVo Premiere and buy/lease a different machine, costing me more money and forcing me to say good-bye to TiVo.

And now that NF is producing original exclusive programming for their streaming customers, TiVo had better update their systems or they will be losing customers right and left.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

Gobbledygook said:


> I HATE HATE HATE HATE TiVo Premiere's NetFlix streaming feature. It's nearly impossible to navigate and use.
> 
> 1. When trying to access NF from my "Now Playing" list, TiVo often freezes and, then, I have to reboot the box to regain functionality.
> 
> ...


Are you sure the problem is not your TiVo to Internet connection speed/quality or your bandwidth through your ISP to Netflix? That is the #1 and #2 source of Netflix complaints/problems, neither of which are TiVo's "fault". Granted, TiVo's Netflix program/interface is horribly old and outdated, but I have never seen the above problems you list.


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## aavi722 (Apr 24, 2010)

I have had my Premier just a few weeks. It has frozen only one time so far. I'm using the non HD menu and I'm just as happy using that compared to the fancy one.

The quality of my videos look pretty good to me. I don't see any difference compared to HD television on the DirecTV receiver. 

I find many STARZ or Encore movies on DirecTV are terrible quality. My Premier has not disappointed me so far---in Netflix streaming. 

You Tube, that's another story.


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## rabinny (Feb 11, 2011)

I have an XBOX 360 and a TiVo Premiere coming off of the same 10/100 ethernet hub. I'm getting all kinds of Netflix errors. Navigating my Instant Queue is like swimming in mud and the playback quality almost always is low bandwidth looking blocky and grainy. If I switch over to the XBOX it is fast and normally in HD quality. This Netflix app is horrible on the TiVo.

Please fix!


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

I don't have those issues at my place with FiOS, or even at my girlfriends house. She only has 1.2mb/s DSL line and Netflix plays with zero issues on her connection from the Premiere. OF course it's at the lower SD bitrate, but there are no buffering issues. It plays just as well as it does at my place with my FiOS commection , but at my place it's always at the max HD bitrate.


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## eatmyjustice (Mar 28, 2010)

Just thought I would add to this thread too. I have an xbox 360 and a wii that stream netflix movies w/o any problems. For simple convenience, I'd prefer to use my premiere to stream netflix but the netflix implementation on the premiere is really not very good compared to just about any other product. I continually get sync issues and video artifacts. Sadly, I don't expect it to be resolved anytime soon and will just use the tivo for dvr functions. bummer


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## rjspring (Jul 16, 2008)

The Tivo Netflix interface is a very sorry state of affairs. They were one of the first to jump on the Netflix bandwagon and the first to implement HD streams - now the interface is almost unusable and the streaming quality sucks compared to other devices (constant re-buffering, aspect ratio issues).

I use my PS3 for Netflix streaming now - hands down one of the best Netflix interfaces, I wish Tivo would hurry up with an update.


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## sabixx (Oct 20, 2010)

its basically unuseable, I often get frustrated when it doesn't respond to commands and resort to watching on my pc. getting a roku next week, yet another box to do something my tivo was supposed to handle out of the box.


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## aaronwt (Jan 31, 2002)

rjspring said:


> The Tivo Netflix interface is a very sorry state of affairs. They were one of the first to jump on the Netflix bandwagon and the first to implement HD streams - now the interface is almost unusable and the streaming quality sucks compared to other devices (constant re-buffering, aspect ratio issues).
> 
> I use my PS3 for Netflix streaming now - hands down one of the best Netflix interfaces, I wish Tivo would hurry up with an update.


I never have any of those issues when streaming from my Premieres with my FiOS connection. Even when I stream using my girlfiends ultra slow 1.25 mb/s DSL connection there are no buffering issues.
I haven't noticed any aspect ratio issues.

The TiVo Netflix interface is best for titles you already have in your queue. And when I play back netflix content on my main setup from TiVos, I have not seen any device able to beat the video quality since the TiVo outputs at the Native resolution and my own devices do the scaling and noise reduction/ehancement.

Even recently when there were connection issues to Netflix using one of my Boxee Boxes, I switched to the TiVo and everything streamed fine.
Over the last few weeks I've streamed 5 to 8 hours of HD from Netflix each week between my Boxee Boxes and TiVos. I've had zero issues with the TiVos while I've had some issues with Netflix and the Boxee boxes.


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## rjspring (Jul 16, 2008)

aaronwt said:


> I never have any of those issues when streaming from my Premieres with my FiOS connection. Even when I stream using my girlfiends ultra slow 1.25 mb/s DSL connection there are no buffering issues.
> I haven't noticed any aspect ratio issues.
> 
> The TiVo Netflix interface is best for titles you already have in your queue. And when I play back netflix content on my main setup from TiVos, I have not seen any device able to beat the video quality since the TiVo outputs at the Native resolution and my own devices do the scaling and noise reduction/ehancement.
> ...


I don't know if the interface/application has been improved on the premier units, but that is for sure not my experience with my TivoHD units. I get much a MUCH better experience with my PS3.


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## crxssi (Apr 5, 2010)

rjspring said:


> I don't know if the [Netflix] interface/application has been improved on the premier units, but that is for sure not my experience with my TivoHD units.


It hasn't been. It is the same ancient interface/module as was shipped on the TiVoHD, years ago.


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## eatmyjustice (Mar 28, 2010)

Neflix stopped working for me today.... ended up calling Tivo support and was told they are making some changes on the back end. Unfortunately, they are not pushing a new app... but I was assured that the experience would be better after the update.


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## Gobbledygook (Jan 26, 2011)

crxssi said:


> Are you sure the problem is not your TiVo to Internet connection speed/quality or your bandwidth through your ISP to Netflix? That is the #1 and #2 source of Netflix complaints/problems, neither of which are TiVo's "fault". Granted, TiVo's Netflix program/interface is horribly old and outdated, but I have never seen the above problems you list.


Yes, I am definitely sure, for THREE reasons:

1). I have Roadrunner Standard (approx. 7-10 Mbits/sec, which should be fast enough to handle streaming);
2). I have no problems streaming on my computer, which is connected to the same network as my TiVo; and
3). I just purchased a Roku player over the Memorial Day Weekend and, without adjusting anything else on my system (incl. internet speed) have experienced the following:

NOT AN ISSUE WITH ROKU: 1. When trying to access NF from my "Now Playing" list, TiVo often freezes and, then, I have to reboot the box to regain functionality. (Of course, Roku is not accessed in the same manner, but the principle still holds true.)

NOT AN ISSUE WITH ROKU: 2. When trying to play a movie, I have to click "Play" then return to the screen two! more times to click "Play" again before the movie will actually start streaming; and, even then, the screen will freeze and crash while "retrieving data".

NOT AN ISSUE WITH ROKU: 3. The screen constantly freezes and the movie plays in fits and starts throughout. One movie, in particular, would not play for more than two minutes before freezing.

NOT AN ISSUE WITH ROKU: 4. While playing movies, the screen will randomly go black, forcing me to return to the menu and click "Play" MULTIPLE TIMES AGAIN!!!! A 90 minute movie can take 3 hours to watch at this rate!

NOT AN ISSUE WITH ROKU: 5. Forget about watching foreign films (the majority of my NF viewing), because the subtitles get cut off at the bottom of the screen. If I switch the screen format to create faux letterboxing, the subtitles get cut off behind the black mask.

Furthermore, I noticed something EXTREMELY DISTURBING about TiVo's handling of streaming content. Via TiVo, NEARLY ALL of the films were pan-and-scan. Thinking that, perhaps, my TV needed to be formatted differently for NF's streaming content, I adjusted the aspect ratio on my TV, only to receive, as mentioned above, "faux letterboxing". Comparing this letterboxing to DVDs of the same films, I realized it was just a distortion of the pan-and-scan version. However, via Roku, those same films are (magically?) properly letterboxed as they appear on their corresponding DVDs! I challenge anyone to explain this phenomenon (or anomaly?) and its cause to me. (BTW, the same movies appear correctly formatted when streaming via pc!)

Thanks a lot, TiVo, but I think I will stick with Roku when it comes to streaming content.

Oh, and on top of all this, Roku's PQ is much better than that of TiVo.


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## rdodolak (Dec 18, 2008)

Gobbledygook said:


> Furthermore, I noticed something EXTREMELY DISTURBING about TiVo's handling of streaming content. Via TiVo, NEARLY ALL of the films were pan-and-scan. Thinking that, perhaps, my TV needed to be formatted differently for NF's streaming content, I adjusted the aspect ratio on my TV, only to receive, as mentioned above, "faux letterboxing". Comparing this letterboxing to DVDs of the same films, I realized it was just a distortion of the pan-and-scan version. However, via Roku, those same films are (magically?) properly letterboxed as they appear on their corresponding DVDs! I challenge anyone to explain this phenomenon (or anomaly?) and its cause to me. (BTW, the same movies appear correctly formatted when streaming via pc!)


What is the Aspect Correction Mode set to (Full, Panel, Zoom)? Can you give an example of what titles you were having issues with on the TiVo?


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## aridon (Aug 31, 2006)

Aside from aesthetics which could use some work I'm not having ANY of the issues some of you are having. Not sure what is up with that.


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## igirl (Feb 5, 2011)

To revisit my question - after comparing Roku to the Tivo UI - there is no comparison. The Tivo Netflix Player is useless for anything other than watching your instant cue. It's really only useful in the event your Roku box breaks.

What I did find useful recently was playing You Tube videos. We wanted earlier episodes of Sanctuary from this season and found them on YT. They were broken into 4 parts each but played great and cued one right up after another making them easy to navigate.


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## Iluvatar (Jul 22, 2006)

igirl said:


> To revisit my question - after comparing Roku to the Tivo UI - there is no comparison. The Tivo Netflix Player is useless for anything other than watching your instant cue. It's really only useful in the event your Roku box breaks.
> 
> What I did find useful recently was playing You Tube videos. We wanted earlier episodes of Sanctuary from this season and found them on YT. They were broken into 4 parts each but played great and cued one right up after another making them easy to navigate.


While not directly in the Neflix app Sanctuary (Season 2) shows up just fine on Tivo Search from my Premiere and plays whichever episode I want to watch in Netflix. I feel the Search menu is how TiVo is really wanting people to access Netflix and other services.


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## Gobbledygook (Jan 26, 2011)

rdodolak said:


> What is the Aspect Correction Mode set to (Full, Panel, Zoom)? Can you give an example of what titles you were having issues with on the TiVo?


I've played with the ACM also but to no avail.

I could provide examples but, really, what is the point? I have been unable to watch a SINGLE full movie on NF via TiVo. I have nearly 100 titles in my "Instant" viewing list, but I've given up trying to watch any of them via TiVo - it's just impossible. In other words, EVERY title has been a challenge.


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## rdodolak (Dec 18, 2008)

Gobbledygook said:


> I've played with the ACM also but to no avail.
> 
> I could provide examples but, really, what is the point? I have been unable to watch a SINGLE full movie on NF via TiVo. I have nearly 100 titles in my "Instant" viewing list, but I've given up trying to watch any of them via TiVo - it's just impossible. In other words, EVERY title has been a challenge.


If you provided examples maybe some of us can test out those streams and report back with the results. It could be a Netflix issue, it could be a Netflix stream tailored for TiVo, it could be TiVo in general, or it could just be your TiVo/setup.


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## P42 (Jan 7, 2003)

Gobbledygook said:


> Furthermore, I noticed something EXTREMELY DISTURBING about TiVo's handling of streaming content. Via TiVo, NEARLY ALL of the films were pan-and-scan. Thinking that, perhaps, my TV needed to be formatted differently for NF's streaming content, I adjusted the aspect ratio on my TV, only to receive, as mentioned above, "faux letterboxing". Comparing this letterboxing to DVDs of the same films, I realized it was just a distortion of the pan-and-scan version. However, via Roku, those same films are (magically?) properly letterboxed as they appear on their corresponding DVDs! I challenge anyone to explain this phenomenon (or anomaly?) and its cause to me. (BTW, the same movies appear correctly formatted when streaming via pc!)


Netflixs streams different versions of the same movie depending on the playback device. As to why the Tivo version (original Netflix streaming format maybe?) is poorly formatted is another question.


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