# Bolt HDMI-CEC support?



## gfgray

Does anyone know or has anyone tested if the Bolt has HDMI-CEC support?

If someone wants to test it, but has no idea what CEC is, reply to this thread if you have the following:
Samsung TV with Samsung AnyNet (TM)
Receiver with either AnyNet, BraviaLink, Simplink, HDMI Control, or HDMI-CEC, etc.
A non-HDMI-CEC device, like the old bulky PS3 or a Roamio, to connect to the receiver (to provide a baseline to show what the Samsung TV does on startup).


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## Dan203

I've never found it much use. Most devices that support it do so inconsistently, so it's a crap shoot anyway. For example my AV receiver supports it for power, which works OK, and volume which seems to easily lose sync, but not at all for input selection. My TV supports all 3, but goes through this long process of connecting/disconnecting when you switch inputs. 

I find it easier to just use the Slide Pro remote for most stuff and a Harmony as backup as needed.


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## markjrenna

I'm surprised it does not have it and I'd expect and On/Off option.


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## JoeKustra

I works ok if you have a decent TV and one external device by the same manufacturer. But with several devices, an AVR, and ARC you have a nightmare.


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## generaltso

CEC works great between my Samsung TV and Onkyo receiver. It also works great between my LG TV and other Onkyo receiver for power, volume, and inputs. Would be nice if TiVo supported it, but not a huge deal for me since the TiVo is always on.


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## aaronwt

Any device that has HDMI CEC, it is one of the first things I turn off. Things are too inconsistent between devices to use it. My Harmony Remotes have always worked great with my devices. And they are very consistent in operation.


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## buckweet1980

I found that CEC does things that I don't want it to do and times I don't want it to do that. Like if I want my receiver on and I turn off the TV it'll turn off the receiver when I didn't want it off for a certain reason..

I'm working from memory here why I didn't like it because its been a while since I did it. I just remember it highly annoyed me


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## Chir

I came here looking to see if the Bolt supported CEC. My premiere is the last thing in my entertainment center that doesn't work with CEC, and it drives me crazy when I turn my TV on, and I have to change inputs after it's displayed my Tivo for ~10 seconds.

I have a Samsung TV with ARC back to a Denon receiver and everything works great, but my TV can't talk to Tivo and always turns the input to itself because it thinks it thinks Tivo isn't displaying anything. Not a big enough pain to turn off CEC (or anynet+), but it's important enough to me that I'd upgrade to a bolt if it supported it.


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## Javelin3o4

Not really a fan of HDMI control either, I also turn it off. As for ARC I'll just run an optical cable from the TV to the receiver if needed.


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## bodosom

The poll and the answers are a bit biased.
How about:
Do you want TiVo to support HDMI-CEC and buy you all HDMI 2.0 compliant equipment so there's some hope it will work?


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## gfgray

The main reason for the post was to find out if Bolt supports HDMI-CEC. I added the poll because my assumption was that it does not. In the poll, I wanted it clear why HDMI-CEC is needed or not. 

A lot of us have enough HDMI-CEC equipment that works well enough except for the TiVo. The bolt has everything I was waiting for. But I won't upgrade until I know it has CEC because of the problems this missing feature causes. Eventually all equipment will support it. It should be present in a near $1000 box (w lifetime).


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## Dan203

What problem does it cause for you by not having CEC in the Bolt? The remote can control power, volume and input via IR. What other functions do you need that require CEC? The TiVo is to complex to actually be controlled by your TV remote via CEC, so I can't imagine that's what you want. Is it just that you want it to switch the input on the TV/receiver when the TiVo is used?


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## gfgray

I have the exact same problem as Chir. I turn the Samsung TV and Denon receiver on and everything works perfectly and I am watching TiVo for 10 seconds or so. Then the TV decides that nothing is connected to the HDMI input because it didn't get a response to the CEC query it sent to the device connected to the receiver. So it changes the receiver's input to "TV" AND leaves its own source as HDMI. The result after 10sec is that the screen goes black and the audio shuts off until the Receiver source is switched back to the TiVo HDMI.

Here is an old thread about it.
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=515017


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## Dan203

Seems like your TV or receiver are more at fault for that then TiVo. Shouldn't the TV/receiver be smart enough to know that not all HDMI devices support CEC and may not respond?


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## gfgray

Yes!! Spot on! Samsung and the other brands that do this really piss me off. But they aren't going to fix it. So once TiVo supports HDMI-CEC, I will upgrade.


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## lgnad

Dan203 said:


> Seems like your TV or receiver are more at fault for that then TiVo. Shouldn't the TV/receiver be smart enough to know that not all HDMI devices support CEC and may not respond?


They aren't. My setup does the same thing.... every time i power it on, my receiver "sees" nothing on the Tivo's input (via cec) and then changes its input to the arc-enabled "tv" input. For some stupid reason, you cant have arc on without cec.

Almost top of the line LG tv and upper middle of the line Pioneer receiver, from their 2014 lines.

Im pretty sure the tv only outputs the better surround formats via HDMI arc, so if i turn it off and run the separate connection, id lose the higher resolution sound.

The only function that needs to exist is for it to say "yes, im on... thanks for asking!" in cec-speak.


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## Javelin3o4

Arc is audio return channel, about the only thing its really good for is pushing TV app audio through a receiver, where before if your TV didnt support ARC and you wanted the audio from say the Netflix app to go through your surround sound receiver you had to run an optical cable. 

There are some sound bars when paired with their MFG TV it allows you to use the TV's remote to control the sound bar audio via HDMI control and ARC.


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## scs_x5

Has Tivo implement HDMI CEC yet? I love it with my Apple TV (4G), Sony TV, and Yamaha receiver. Looking at purchasing bolt and it would be a big bonus especially for changing the Yamaha's input.


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## JoeKustra

scs_x5 said:


> Has Tivo implement HDMI CEC yet? I love it with my Apple TV (4G), Sony TV, and Yamaha receiver. Looking at purchasing bolt and it would be a big bonus especially for changing the Yamaha's input.


Nope. As for changing inputs, what model AVR do you have? I have 5 devices on my RX-V867 and since only the (Sony) TV changed the audio, I have it disabled.

Hmmm. Just thought of something. You do know that the Bolt (TiVo) is always on? I have a Sony Blu-ray, Roamio, Roku 3, and Premiere connected via HDMI. What should the input change to? A Roku 3 is always on also.


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## scs_x5

I have an RV-X677. HDMI 1 - FIOS Cisco CHS435DHC, HDMI 2 - Apple TV 2 (4G). Going from HDMI 1 to 2 by waking the Apple TV, the HDMI input switches automatically, but if I want to go back to cable, waking the DVR does not switch the HDMI input back to 1. I have to manually do that and understand since the Cisco DVR is pretty old tech, but I would have thought that the Bolt being new would have included that.


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## TonyD79

scs_x5 said:


> I have an RV-X677. HDMI 1 - FIOS Cisco CHS435DHC, HDMI 2 - Apple TV 2 (4G). Going from HDMI 1 to 2 by waking the Apple TV, the HDMI input switches automatically, but if I want to go back to cable, waking the DVR does not switch the HDMI input back to 1. I have to manually do that and understand since the Cisco DVR is pretty old tech, but I would have thought that the Bolt being new would have included that.


The bolt doesn't go to sleep.


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## wmcbrine

TonyD79 said:


> The bolt doesn't go to sleep.


Yeah it does, if you put it in Standby (or it times out to Standby).


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## TonyD79

wmcbrine said:


> Yeah it does, if you put it in Standby (or it times out to Standby).


Mine never sleeps.


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## rainwater

TonyD79 said:


> Mine never sleeps.


You said it doesn't go to sleep, but it does if you use standby or the automated power savings. Many people who use Harmony remotes will put their TiVo to sleep when it is not in use.


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## JoeKustra

Perhaps it's just a difference with the definition of "sleep"?


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## bdraw

CEC has been around for almost 10 years and did get off to a rocky start. That being said, it woks really well for many. 

My parents have a TiVo, a 65" TV, an AVR and a Blu-ray player. They use the TiVo remote 90% of the time with just the power and volume buttons programmed to control the TV. When the TV turns on, it turns on the AVR (to the last input that was on the AVR) and the volume signal is sent via CEC to control the AVR's volume. It all works 100% reliably until someone puts a Blu-ray in. The disc starts playing automatically, but since the TiVo doesn't support CEC, someone has to hit the input button on the AVR to switch back to watch TV. 

Anyways, here are the reasons why TiVo should support CEC.
1. TiVo mobile apps can control the volume and power of the HT (no programmable peanut can do this).
2. Eliminate the need to program the TiVo remote, or at least do it automatically (CEC shares the model number on the bus).
3. Promote the use of the TiVo remote over programmable alternatives.
4. Improve interoperability with modern HDMI devices that support CEC.

The only CEC features that are needed are One Touch Play (switch inputs), volume and powering on other devices. There is nothing in the spec that requires every device to support every command.

And for any who voted no, TiVo should allow users to disable CEC. And TOSLINK can't pass Dolby Digital + the way ARC can, so not exactly a equal alternative.


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## Oldphile

If the TIVO Bolt supported HDMI CEC, I would only need the TIVO Bolt Remote. But as it is, when I turn on my TV (with the Bolt remote), the CEC command from the TV turns on my AVR which then switches to ARC HDMI input (connected to my TV). Then, I have to pick up the AVR remote and change the source. Perhaps, if implemented, CEC control in the Bolt would only work if the Bolt was sleeping, but I would be okay with that.


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## Dan203

Oldphile said:


> If the TIVO Bolt supported HDMI CEC, I would only need the TIVO Bolt Remote. But as it is, when I turn on my TV (with the Bolt remote), the CEC command from the TV turns on my AVR which then switches to ARC HDMI input (connected to my TV). Then, I have to pick up the AVR remote and change the source. Perhaps, if implemented, CEC control in the Bolt would only work if the Bolt was sleeping, but I would be okay with that.


Or you can get a Slide remote and learn the input command for your AVR into the Input button on the TiVo remote. That's what I did.


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## aaronwt

Oldphile said:


> If the TIVO Bolt supported HDMI CEC, I would only need the TIVO Bolt Remote. But as it is, when I turn on my TV (with the Bolt remote), the CEC command from the TV turns on my AVR which then switches to ARC HDMI input (connected to my TV). Then, I have to pick up the AVR remote and change the source. Perhaps, if implemented, CEC control in the Bolt would only work if the Bolt was sleeping, but I would be okay with that.


It doesn't work that with with CEC between my Sony Tv and Sony Speaker Bar. When turning the Tv on with the TiVo remote, the speaker bar comes on the input it was on when it was previously turned off. So if it was on the TiVo input, it will still be there.

Now if I turn on any of my devices that use HDMi CEC, and have them set to turn other devices on. Then the Tv and speaker bar both turn on and the Speaker bar and HDMi switches all change to the correct input.


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## Dan203

And since the TiVo is always on what event would trigger the CEC input change?


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## aaronwt

Dan203 said:


> And since the TiVo is always on what event would trigger the CEC input change?


Mine is typically in standby. So the video output coming on might do it.


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## ohohtivo

Some notes.

Voted yes; have been asking for CEC support the minute we got our Tivo.

Not looking for extensive control of one device through another's remote. Main reason is just for proper power and input control / tracking.

Setup: Samsung TV with exactly one 1 HDMI (including ARC) cable going to A/V closet (on different floor); connected to Yamaha receiver HDMI out. All devices connect to receiver HDMI inputs, including TiVo, Apple TV and Amazon Fire TV.

Not using any IR. All RF remotes and IP control through a single iOS app.

CEC works fine (as in: power and input switching) for those devices that support it. (Including volume control of receiver through Apple TV remote.)

Annoying issue, as already mentioned on this thread: turn tv on, when TiVo was last viewed device, and sound will eventually switch to TV sound (via ARC). This happens after 10s of seconds, as TV starts up.

Reason: TV comes on, asks for active device through HDMI CEC, no response from anything (as TiVo does not support CEC); TV decides to send internal sound to receiver.

Don't know what is correct / compliant behavior, but had TiVo supported CEC, like the other devices, it would have claimed being the active device.

Workaround (taylored): I have a server running anyway. It snoops on the CEC bus, detects the TV asking for active device, and if the last active device was the TiVo, it will respond in place of the TiVo. Basically, it proxies CEC for the TiVo.

CEC has the notion of 'active device', i.e. device that 'owns' the screen. CEC devices will track which is the current active. E.g., on Apple TV remote, pressing the 'screen' button will wake things up, set inputs etc. Similar on Amazon remote.

TiVo button on TiVo remote could do something similar; doesn't matter whether TiVo is in standby or not.

Obviously would need options on TiVo to turn CEC on/off, whether to go to standby on system-wide power off, etc.


(Note that in a setup with devices directly connected to the tv, CEC support on TiVo would switch the correct input on the tv, just like Apple TV and Amazon Fire TV. Without it, one has to typically use Samsung / IR remote to switch to the TiVo input, as there is no direct input select through IP on Samsung.)


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## mdavej

I voted, "no, turn off CEC and just use a bigger remote". Here's me holding my remote:


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## Steve

Dan203 said:


> And since the TiVo is always on what event would trigger the CEC input change?


Why not when pressing the TiVo button? If the AVR is already on the TiVo input, would add'l requests to change to that input matter?


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## TonyD79

Odd behavior a couple of posts above. I've had mixed cec and non-cec with arc and never had one device commandeer upon turning in my avr. 

I turned cec off because I couldn't control the cec devices without them taking over even though I was doing things like loading a blu Ray to watch a bit later. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## andydumi

I went with Yes as well. Long needed function.

It would be helpful to use a TV remote for the basic controls if nothing else. Play, pause, ff and rewind, guide. You guys make it seem like the Peanut remote is the be all end all, but realistically CEC can replace virtually the whole thing.

And to those arguing how would the TV know to return to Tivo input, it's simple and many of you argue as if you have never used CEC. Any action on a device generally triggers focus to that device. If I am watching TV and hit a button on my PS4, it takes focus away and switches the TV and receiver to PS4. When I am done, I could hit a button on the tivo remote, which would then trigger the TV and receiver to switch back appropriately. This does not work today as Tivo lacks CEC. Instead I have to either hit input on the Tivo remote and slow cycle through 5 inputs (because Tivo's up/down, select dont work with Samsung TVs), or turn off the PS4 which, with CEC, triggers the TV and receiver to go back to what I was doing before, which is TV. Casting to a Chromecast (always on device) also takes focus to it automatically. Then I also can't return to Tivo without the Input button.

It's a significant weakness that the Bolt should have fixed.


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## Steve

If you eliminate question 4, looks like 50 out of 75 voters are in favor of CEC support. Since it would likely be implemented as an option, it would be a nice addition to the software, IMHO.

As I mentioned earlier, I think the TiVo button could be the CEC trigger.


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## CybrFyre

I was gonna ask if CEC could be enabled w sw.. or if hdmi chipset limits the options.

Sent from my Pixel C using Tapatalk


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## gfgray

Someone started a thread with a workable $100 solution.
How to get the TiVo to play nice with HDMI-CEC


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## JoeKustra

scs_x5 said:


> I have an RV-X677. HDMI 1 - FIOS Cisco CHS435DHC, HDMI 2 - Apple TV 2 (4G). Going from HDMI 1 to 2 by waking the Apple TV, the HDMI input switches automatically, but if I want to go back to cable, waking the DVR does not switch the HDMI input back to 1. I have to manually do that and understand since the Cisco DVR is pretty old tech, but I would have thought that the Bolt being new would have included that.


With Yamaha remote: Scene 1 = Blu-ray, Scene 2 = TiVo, Scene 3 = CD (same as Blu-Ray but different setup), Scene 4 = Roku 3. CEC, ARC, etc. all disabled. Scene button will turn on power too and easy to find in the dark. TV speakers are never used.


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## jjames68

Dan203 said:


> And since the TiVo is always on what event would trigger the CEC input change?


my Ruko is HDMI-CEC and has a "one touch play" option, all i have to do is hit any key on remote and goes to the RUKO, but going back to TIVO requires using the inputs button and finding the TIVO input, the RUKO is always on, and does this, so woudl think TIVO could too


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## Dan203

jjames68 said:


> my Ruko is HDMI-CEC and has a "one touch play" option, all i have to do is hit any key on remote and goes to the RUKO, but going back to TIVO requires using the inputs button and finding the TIVO input, the RUKO is always on, and does this, so woudl think TIVO could too


Maybe. But given TiVos track record with software these days I wouldn't hold my breath.


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## NorthAlabama

my past experiences with cec remind me of typing in microsoft word with auto-correct enabled: it works fine a good bit of the time, but i eventually find myself fighting against it, when it wants to do something i don't.


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## jjames68

NorthAlabama said:


> my past experiences with cec remind me of typing in microsoft word with auto-correct enabled: it works fine a good bit of the time, but i eventually find myself fighting against it, when it wants to do something i don't.


agree, I just bought a new Ruko and they did it right, so now am changing views of it, but yes, all devices would have to be set up correctly to use it


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## aaronwt

HDMI-CEC has wkrked great in several of my setups. For several years I got away from my Harmony remotes and used HDMI-CEC with them. I used it in a 2012 LG LCD, a 2012 Mitsubishi DLP, and a 2015 Sony UHD TV. HDMI-CEC worked great with all of them and the devices I had in the setups..

But earlier this year I went back to using HArmony remotes and got a couple of the Harmony Hubs. So I turned it off except for the TV and receiver so the Audio Return channel can be used. Although it's still in use with my LG TV. Although I almost never use that setup any more..


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## Steve

I’m all for TiVo CEC.

With voice capability being added to devices, a universal remote is no longer a useful option for me. I use a Roku, a Sony Android TV (voice enabled) and a Bolt Vox, all connected to a Yamaha audio video receiver. If hitting the TiVo button could switch my AVR’s input to TiVo, the same way the ROKU and Sony TV remotes manage those inputs, I could at least take the Yamaha remote off the coffee table.


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## jkudlacz

GREAT NEWS HDMI-CEC has been finally ENABLED, yes ENABLED on TIVO. So if you have Tivo Roamio, Tivo Bolt, Tivo Bolt Vox you are all set as soon as you update software to 21.8.3.RC2 

Just go to Remote section and locate 'Wake with Tivo button'. Once you change it to YES. Pressing TIVO button will turn on your TV. You can use it with Tivo APP, Tivo Remote, Alexa Tivo Integration. AWESOME. Only question I have, why did it take 5 years to implement. Also for those that do not want to use this feature, don't enable it


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## krkaufman

jkudlacz said:


> Just go to Remote section and locate 'Wake with Tivo button'. Once you change it to YES. Pressing TIVO button will turn on your TV.


You'll also need CEC to be enabled for the TV, of course.


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## jkudlacz

krkaufman said:


> You'll also need CEC to be enabled for the TV, of course.


Haha, good point.


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## krkaufman

FYI... followup post from David Shoop Re: the CEC feature...

_Nov 12, 4:38pm: FYI... CEC is in the fall build that will go to everyone however, we have turned it off by default. This is not as clean as I like to post things but wanted to get it out to people who may have already seen the fall update hit their TiVo._

_CEC and the Wake with TiVo button on TiVo devices_

_Consumer ElectronicsControl (CEC) and its general purpose and usage_
_These links will tell you what's supported and how to turn it on. Don't forget you may need to ensure that CEC is enabled on your TV, AV receiver and other HDMI connected devices._​_
(Shoop FB post tweaked ever so slightly for readability)_


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## jjames68

just tested and switches between Ruko and TIVO without issues, thank you, this is great, I used to have to hit input button like 8 times to get back to tivo


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## eric9603

I received the update overnight and having HDMI-CEC is great! However, any ideas why it’s not available on the Mini Vox? That was a major bummer to realize it wasn’t.


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## JoeKustra

eric9603 said:


> I received the update overnight and having HDMI-CEC is great! However, any ideas why it's not available on the Mini Vox? That was a major bummer to realize it wasn't.


Probably the programmer doesn't know TiVo still sells the Mini.


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## krkaufman

eric9603 said:


> I received the update overnight and having HDMI-CEC is great! However, any ideas why it's not available on the Mini Vox? That was a major bummer to realize it wasn't.


The "Wake with TiVo button" menu option doesn't exist on the Mini VOX?


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## eric9603

krkaufman said:


> The "Wake with TiVo button" menu option doesn't exist on the Mini VOX?


Nope.


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## krkaufman

krkaufman said:


> FYI... followup post from David Shoop Re: the CEC feature...
> 
> _Nov 12, 4:38pm: FYI... CEC is in the fall build that will go to everyone however, we have turned it off by default. This is not as clean as I like to post things but wanted to get it out to people who may have already seen the fall update hit their TiVo._
> 
> _CEC and the Wake with TiVo button on TiVo devices_
> 
> _Consumer ElectronicsControl (CEC) and its general purpose and usage_
> _These links will tell you what's supported and how to turn it on. Don't forget you may need to ensure that CEC is enabled on your TV, AV receiver and other HDMI connected devices._​_
> (Shoop FB post tweaked ever so slightly for readability)_


From the above docs...

*Compatibility*

The Consumer Electronics Control (CEC) feature is compatible with the latest version of TiVo Experience 4 (software version 21.8.3) on the following devices:

TiVo BOLT Series Unified Entertainment Systems
TiVo Roamio Series DVRs
*Note:* TiVo Mini VOX and Mini are not compatible.​
_"Why not?"_ is an open question.


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## JoeKustra

From our friends on Twitter:
Hello. We sincerely apologize for the inconvenience. But for the meantime, adding a CEC option and settings is only available for TiVo Roamio Series and TiVo BOLT Series DVRs. But you can visit our Feature Requests' Page to request this feature to also be available in TiVo Minis and TiVo Mini VOX. Here's the link: http://bit.ly/2B9EbYt


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## Mikeguy

JoeKustra said:


> From our friends on Twitter:
> Hello. We sincerely apologize for the inconvenience. But for the meantime, adding a CEC option and settings is only available for TiVo Roamio Series and TiVo BOLT Series DVRs. But you can visit our Feature Requests' Page to request this feature to also be available in TiVo Minis and TiVo Mini VOX. Here's the link: http://bit.ly/2B9EbYt


Umm, they need people to go through the exercise to know that it's a requested feature?


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## krkaufman

Mikeguy said:


> Umm, they need people to go through the exercise to know that it's a requested feature?


Squeaky wheel. The volume of requests likely can affect development priority.


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## dougdingle

Well, at least they 'sincerely apologized for the inconvenience'...

I would love to see it implemented on the Mini (and the Mini VOX, although I don't have one of those).

When set up properly and working correctly, it's very convenient to pick up the remote for the device you wish to watch, push a button on it, and have the system switch to seeing that input. I can live without most of the rest of the CEC implementations, but input switching is great.

I have the feature on my Amazon Fire and my Roku, and to switch to either one I just have to press a button on their remote. But to switch back to the Mini, I have to find the AVR's remote, use that to switch inputs, then use the TiVo remote. It would be lovely to just be able to push the TiVo button and have the AVR switch to it.

The other question I've always wanted to ask was why are there no AVR codes for the programmable Input button on the TiVo remote's setup (TV codes only are available)? That would be an almost usable alternative. 

I know a lot of people use the inputs on their TV, but more and more have home theater setups where they are using their AVR to switch sources feeding the TV, and the TiVo remote can't talk to those AVRs about input switching at all.


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## Mikeguy

krkaufman said:


> Squeaky wheel. The volume of requests likely can affect development priority.


Yep, I figured that, and to have some quantifiable number. But, come on, TiVo, you need people to tell you that they want they functionality you just put into the main box, now also for the Mini?


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## JoeKustra

dougdingle said:


> Well, at least they 'sincerely apologized for the inconvenience'...


That is standard. Probably already part of every response.


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## krkaufman

Mikeguy said:


> Yep, *I figured that, and to have some quantifiable number*. But, come on, TiVo, you need people to tell you that they want they functionality you just put into the main box, now also for the Mini?


Then why are you posing the same question again !?!? 

I think it's reasonable to assume that TiVo Support wasn't suggesting the Features Request submission to log the first ever request for the feature, but for the submitted request to increment the total number of requests for the feature ... again, to aid in prioritizing development. Or at least so project managers have something to do during their day.


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## dougdingle

JoeKustra said:


> That is standard. Probably already part of every response.


I was being sarcastic.

Still, one step forward...


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## PJO1966

I have an Apple TV 4K and a TiVo Bolt OTA I turned on CEC on my Bolt. I tried switching back and forth using their own remotes. It switches to the ATV but only stays there a second before jumping back to the TiVo. It stays on the TiVo easily. 

Once I put the TiVo in Standby I was able to stay on the ATV. I guess I'll need to get in the habit of putting it in Standby when I'm not watching it.


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## Mikeguy

krkaufman said:


> Then why are you posing the same question again !?!?
> 
> I think it's reasonable to assume that TiVo Support wasn't suggesting the Features Request submission to log the first ever request for the feature, but for the submitted request to increment the total number of requests for the feature ... again, to aid in prioritizing development. Or at least so project managers have something to do during their day.


I wasn't posing the same question again, I was expressing my belief that it's wasteful (to both consumers and the company) and just plain silly corporate bureaucracy.  But no need to further debate that.


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## krkaufman

Mikeguy said:


> I wasn't posing the same question again




Mikeguy said:


> Umm, they need people to go through the exercise to know that it's a requested feature?





Mikeguy said:


> you need people to tell you that they want they functionality you just put into the main box, now also for the Mini?


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## Mikeguy

krkaufman said:


> ​


Lol--and it's called rhetoric. Now, once again, back to our scheduled programming . . . .


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## krkaufman

Had to chuckle when I came across the following post, this morning, over on Blu-ray.com ...


> welcometonowhere: Go to MoviesAnywhere and use the chat to request TV shows to be added. I did this a couple of months ago and the rep mentioned a lot of people have asked for TV to be added, but also stated the more requests, the higher likelihood it will happen


So, if there's some feature/issue one would like addressed, there's likely value in submitting your issue to the powers-that-be, even if you have knowledge that the issue has already been lodged.


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## PJO1966

When I put the TiVo in Standby, shouldn't the TV and sound bar both turn off? That's how any other device with HDMI-CEC works.


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## TonyD79

PJO1966 said:


> When I put the TiVo in Standby, shouldn't the TV and sound bar both turn off? That's how any other device with HDMI-CEC works.


Probably but there is no standard behavior for CEC. That is one of the issues with it. Different devices react differently to each other.


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## JoeKustra

PJO1966 said:


> When I put the TiVo in Standby, shouldn't the TV and sound bar both turn off? That's how any other device with HDMI-CEC works.


I would then expect the Power Saving to also power off the TV and sound bar. But that implies the CEC controls also know you have the TiVo in the foreground and no other devices are using the sound bar.


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## tommiet

Tell me I'm missing something.. As my TIVO is powered on all the time, what does HDMI-CEC buy me? As I turn on some devices, my TV switches to them automatically - all good... Except if you leave the device on all the time right? What did I miss here?


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## mdavej

tommiet said:


> Tell me I'm missing something.. As my TIVO is powered on all the time, what does HDMI-CEC buy me? As I turn on some devices, my TV switches to them automatically - all good... Except if you leave the device on all the time right? What did I miss here?


You missed the fact that the Tivo button is the power/input switching on trigger, not the Tivo itself powering up and down. So what you gain is automatic input switching and power up of the TV/AVR with just a single press of the Tivo button. This required 2 buttons before and only worked on one device - TV or AVR, not both. CEC works on everything in the chain.


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## PJO1966

JoeKustra said:


> I would then expect the Power Saving to also power off the TV and sound bar. But that implies the CEC controls also know you have the TiVo in the foreground and no other devices are using the sound bar.


I'm have to try it with the ATV already in standby


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## whitepelican

PJO1966 said:


> When I put the TiVo in Standby, shouldn't the TV and sound bar both turn off? That's how any other device with HDMI-CEC works.


Amazon Fire TV Stick does the same thing. I can't count the number of hours my TV has been left on just showing a black screen lately.


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## PJO1966

PJO1966 said:


> I'm have to try it with the ATV already in standby


now I'm having a new problem. With the TiVo in standby I hit the menu button on the ATV. It switches to the ATV input but only for a second, and then it switches back to the TiVo input. It takes 5 or 6 attempts and then it finally works.


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## eric9603

PJO1966 said:


> now I'm having a new problem. With the TiVo in standby I hit the menu button on the ATV. It switches to the ATV input but only for a second, and then it switches back to the TiVo input. It takes 5 or 6 attempts and then it finally works.


Same here. I had to turn CEC back off to stop this from happening. Ugh.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro


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## tenthplanet

Some times CEC is a four letter word . i don't hold it against Tivo.


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## El Maestro

I also have the issue with the Apple TV; my Bolt OTA will constantly reclaim the input, even when in standby. I can’t use the feature as is currently implemented.


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## tuklaj

PJO1966 said:


> now I'm having a new problem. With the TiVo in standby I hit the menu button on the ATV. It switches to the ATV input but only for a second, and then it switches back to the TiVo input. It takes 5 or 6 attempts and then it finally works.


Yes, I am having this issue as well.
I couldn't figure out how to get my Apple TV to display I thought I had a broken Apple TV. Now I turned off "wake at press of tivo button" and its back to letting me use the apple tv but now I have to manually switch back to the tivo.... TIVO ARE YOU GOING TO FIX THIS?????


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## PJO1966

tuklaj said:


> Yes, I am having this issue as well.
> I couldn't figure out how to get my Apple TV to display I thought I had a broken Apple TV. Now I turned off "wake at press of tivo button" and its back to letting me use the apple tv but now I have to manually switch back to the tivo.... TIVO ARE YOU GOING TO FIX THIS?????


I fixed it by adding a Caavo to my system. Now when I switch to the ATV the input stays there.


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## tuklaj

So how are you liking the Caavo with the Tivo and Apple Tv does the voice control work on each respectively through the caavo remote?


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## PJO1966

tuklaj said:


> So how are you liking the Caavo with the Tivo and Apple Tv does the voice control work on each respectively through the caavo remote?


As far as I can tell you can only use the microphone on the caavo remote for caavo systems. You can't use that microphone button to search entirely on the TiVo or entirely on the Apple TV.

The system needs some work but overall I like it.


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## stevepow

There are a number of issues with the TiVo CEC at the moment. My Apple TV works great with CEC as does my Oppo 203, but the TiVo is not working correctly. I turned TiVo CEC back off. It would be great if they get it working.


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## jzinckgra

El Maestro said:


> I also have the issue with the Apple TV; my Bolt OTA will constantly reclaim the input, even when in standby. I can't use the feature as is currently implemented.


Is green light on bolt considered standby mode?

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk


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## JoeKustra

jzinckgra said:


> Is green light on bolt considered standby mode?


The green LED on a TiVo goes out in Standby. You can use a setup option to cause all LED to remain off except the amber one caused by the remote.


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## jzinckgra

JoeKustra said:


> The green LED on a TiVo goes out in Standby. You can use a setup option to cause all LED to remain off except the amber one caused by the remote.


So if I'm not in standby I get no recording activity?

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk


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## JoeKustra

jzinckgra said:


> So if I'm not in standby I get no recording activity?


Standby has no effect on recording. Just pretend there is no Standby or Power Saving. Perhaps you are not expressing your problem in a form I can help with?


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## jzinckgra

JoeKustra said:


> Standby has no effect on recording. Just pretend there is no Standby or Power Saving. Perhaps you are not expressing your problem in a form I can help with?


Thanks. I was just trying to understand why one would use standby. Mine is always on, with green light, but I was having some cec issues between tv, avr and TiVo and was curious if standby option would help or make it worse

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk


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## JoeKustra

jzinckgra said:


> Thanks. I was just trying to understand why one would use standby. Mine is always on, with green light, but I was having some cec issues between tv, avr and TiVo and was curious if standby option would help or make it worse


I understand. I never use CEC, Standby, ARC, or HDMI Control with any device.


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## aaronwt

jzinckgra said:


> Thanks. I was just trying to understand why one would use standby. Mine is always on, with green light, but I was having some cec issues between tv, avr and TiVo and was curious if standby option would help or make it worse
> 
> Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk


Because in standby, EAS alerts won't screw up recordings.


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## jzinckgra

aaronwt said:


> Because in standby, EAS alerts won't screw up recordings.


Eas?

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk


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## JoeKustra

aaronwt said:


> Because in standby, EAS alerts won't screw up recordings.


Good point. I forgot about those Emergency Alert System tests. Mine always happen during the day, so my only issue is when they knock me out of a recording.

Added to my abbreviations.


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## aaronwt

Emergency Alert System.

One week Verizon FiOS started doing these things during prime time. Which could easily screw up recordings. But still even with the after midnight or mid-day alerts, if you are recording something it could still get screwed up.


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## rdrrepair

If my 6 tuner Bolt is watching live tv, or even a recorded show, I would expect the EAS to kick me out and display the alert. I've never understood why it would screw with a recording on a channel you're not viewing anyway.

From a technological standpoint they should allow the recording to stand and only seize the viewing feed. That being said... With CEC it's only a matter of time before the tv turns itself on, wakes you up with that squealing pitch, and then blasts out "this is only a test"


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## JxxAxxY

I am having issues where TIVO Bolt works fine with CEC for a few days. Then I try to start everything back up again with the TIVO button and all I get is a black screen (sometimes a flash of the channel it is on). No image no sound. If I use my roku remote it switches to the roku. I get picture and sound. Hit the tivo button to go back to the tivo no picture no sound. If a recording is happening it still records. However in order to get the picture/sound back I have to unplug the tivo box. Then it works fine for 4 to 5 days. I don't run into any issues with my tv, roku and dvd player when it comes to this. Just the Tivo box ;-(


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## Steve

JxxAxxY said:


> I am having issues where TIVO Bolt works fine with CEC for a few days. Then I try to start everything back up again with the TIVO button and all I get is a black screen (sometimes a flash of the channel it is on). No image no sound. If I use my roku remote it switches to the roku. I get picture and sound. Hit the tivo button to go back to the tivo no picture no sound. If a recording is happening it still records. However in order to get the picture/sound back I have to unplug the tivo box. Then it works fine for 4 to 5 days. I don't run into any issues with my tv, roku and dvd player when it comes to this. Just the Tivo box ;-(


Are you connected direct to the TV, or to an AVR? If an AVR, might try power cycling the AVR, instead of the Bolt, to reduce the number of hard shutdowns you have to do.

Also, does turning off CEC solve the problem? Asking because it sounds like an HDCP issue that may or may not be related to CEC.

No matter, I'd definitely report this to TiVo tech suppport.


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## JxxAxxY

Tivo to AVR, AVR to TV. Powering down AVR makes no difference. Even switched the AVR out didn't change the issue. I had a different issue when CEC wasn't available. I had to switch to my roku and get the sound going and then switching back to the TIVO to get it to work correctly. But I don't think I had the no screen issue.


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## RichB

I have a bolt+ and trying to debug some HDMI issues.
Emotiva asked me to turn off CEC on all products.

I haven't found it so far, is there a menu to turn of CEC in the Bolt+?

- Rich


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## Steve

RichB said:


> I haven't found it so far, is there a menu to turn of CEC in the Bolt+?


It's under "Remote", "Remote control setup". "Wake with TiVo Y/N".


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## RichB

Steve said:


> It's under "Remote", "Remote control setup". "Wake with TiVo Y/N".


Thanks found it.
It was already set to NO and my TiVo never enters stand-by anyway. Assuming NO = CEC disabled.
I am all set.

- Rich


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## JoeKustra

RichB said:


> I have a bolt+ and trying to debug some HDMI issues.
> Emotiva asked me to turn off CEC on all products.
> I haven't found it so far, is there a menu to turn of CEC in the Bolt+?
> - Rich


Remote Control Setup. Description is to the right on that screen.


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## Steve

RichB said:


> Thanks found it.
> It was already set to NO and my TiVo never enters stand-by anyway. Assuming NO = CEC disabled.


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## Steve

RichB said:


> Thanks found it.
> It was already set to NO and my TiVo never enters stand-by anyway. Assuming NO = CEC disabled.


Correct. "NO" = CEC disabled, but just to be clear, "Wake with TiVo" refers to powering up a connected CEC device, not waking the Bolt from standby.


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## TostitoBandito

What is the benefit of CEC on something like a Tivo? I don't get it. I mean, I use CEC on my TV and receiver so that I can power on the TV with the Tivo remote and the receiver comes on automatically via CEC (and similarly powers off), but what would be the use of that for something that you always want to be on? The other main reason to use CEC is so you can send audio from the TV to the receiver while using an app on the TV, but I can't think of any application where you'd need your TV to send audio to your Tivo.


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## Steve

TostitoBandito said:


> The other main reason to use CEC is so you can send audio from the TV to the receiver while using an app on the TV, but I can't think of any application where you'd need your TV to send audio to your Tivo.


CEC doesn't enable TV>AVR audio. That's done via an "HDMI return" input/output on your TV/AVR.

And there are TV streaming apps (like Showtime Anytime) that are not yet available on the TiVo.


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## Diana Collins

TostitoBandito said:


> What is the benefit of CEC on something like a Tivo? I don't get it. I mean, I use CEC on my TV and receiver so that I can power on the TV with the Tivo remote and the receiver comes on automatically via CEC (and similarly powers off), but what would be the use of that for something that you always want to be on? The other main reason to use CEC is so you can send audio from the TV to the receiver while using an app on the TV, but I can't think of any application where you'd need your TV to send audio to your Tivo.


CEC can allow your TiVo remote to control more devices and/or allow other devices to control your TiVo.

For example, the current TiVo CEC support is limited to input selection. If you touch almost any button on your TiVo remote the TV or AVR will switch to the TiVo's port (it works quite consistently for me with an Onkyo AVR in one room, and a Yamaha in the other). The only problem I have with the current implementation is that the TiVo sends the CEC command almost EVERY time you press a button, and that causes a 'selected port' pop-up on my TV and it obscures part of the screen for a few seconds.

However, with full HDMI-CEC support, the FWD, REW, Skip, channel up/down, numeric and 4 color buttons on my AVR remote could control the TiVo. It could also eliminate the need for IR repeaters for folks with their TiVo or AVR in a cabinet, since the TV can relay commands to the AVR, TiVo, BluRay player, etc. It isn't just about turning things on and off, though I have been using CEC to turn on our AVRs when the TV turns on for years (FAR more reliable than having the TiVo remote send multiple power-on IR commands).

Audio is a separate issue. Most modern TVs and AVRs support ARC (audio return channel) which allows a TV to both receive audio FROM the AVR, and send audio TO the AVR over a single HDMI cable. This allows you to use the internal tuner in the TV and still send sound through the AVR without a separate digital audio connection.


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## Diana Collins

FYI, a list of some common HDMI-CEC commands:

One Touch Play - devices can switch the TV to use it as the active source when playback starts
System Standby - lets users to switch multiple devices to standby mode with the press of one button (except LG TV's)
Preset Transfer - allows the transfer of the tuner channel setup to another TV set
One Touch Record - users can record what is currently being shown on the HDTV screen on a selected recording device
Timer Programming - allows users to use the electronic program guides (EPGs) that are built into many HDTVs and set-top-boxes to program the timer in recording devices like PVRs and DVRs
System Information - checks all components for bus addresses and configuration
Deck Control - allows a component to interrogate and control the operation (play, pause, rewind etc.), of a playback component (Blu-ray or HD DVD player or a Camcorder, etc.)
Tuner Control - allows a component to control the tuner of another component
OSD Display - uses the on-screen display (OSD) of the TV set to display text
Device Menu Control - allows a component to control the menu system of another component by passing through the user interface (UI) commands
Routing Control - controls the switching of signal sources
Remote Control Pass Through - allows remote control commands to be passed through to other devices within the system
Device OSD Name Transfer - transfers the preferred device names to the TV set
System Audio Control - allows the volume of an AV receiver, integrated amplifier or preamplifier to be controlled using any remote control from a suitably equipped device(s) in the system
At the moment, the CEC command SENT by TiVo is the Routing Control command. It RECEIVES no CEC command.


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## dougdingle

Diana Collins said:


> For example, the current TiVo CEC support is limited to input selection. If you touch almost any button on your TiVo remote the TV or AVR will switch to the TiVo's port (it works quite consistently for me with an Onkyo AVR in one room, and a Yamaha in the other). The only problem I have with the current implementation is that the TiVo sends the CEC command almost EVERY time you press a button, and that causes a 'selected port' pop-up on my TV and it obscures part of the screen for a few seconds.


Wow! Seriously? They took years to implement the feature, and it's in this ham-handed fashion? That's just sad.

Here's how I think it should work: A single button on the TiVo remote (like, say, the TiVo button, or the Input button, or one of the colored buttons) should, if the feature is enabled, send a "Select my input!" command to the AVR or TV. And it should be made (like the CC button) so that the button has to be held down for a couple of seconds to send the command.

Not *any* button. Who thought that was a good idea, unless the concept was to never have anyone use the feature? The result of the current implementation is what you are seeing, or for some others, the screen flashing with any button push as the input selector reselects the current input.

Not very clever. It's like the people writing the code don't actually use a TiVo at home at all.

And speaking of the remote, isn't it time, ten years (or more) into the product cycle, that the peanut is made slightly longer and have a few (like maybe four) fully programmable learning buttons on it? I don't mean Volume or Mute or Input or Power. I mean separate buttons that learn whatever command you can send them from another remote.


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## Diana Collins

It isn't _*quite *_any button. The directional pad doesn't, but channel up/down does. The result is that, for example, scrolling through the guide one row at a time is fine, but if you try to scroll a page at at time, the CEC command is sent with each button press. On the TV in our family room, that causes a "selected port" confirmation message that covers the first 30 minutes and two top rows of the guide. The basement TV doesn't put up any message, so we don't notice it there.

Pressing "Select" sends the CEC command so any menu selection has the same issue. Without having gone through the remote key by key, I think the only keys that don't send a routing command is the directional pad and the numeric keys. To be fair, Roku does much the same thing - Home, Back and OK will all send routing commands, but volume up/down does not (allowing for radio-remote based volume control of an IR device).


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## stevepow

dougdingle said:


> Wow! Seriously? They took years to implement the feature, and it's in this ham-handed fashion? That's just sad.
> 
> Here's how I think it should work: A single button on the TiVo remote (like, say, the TiVo button, or the Input button, or one of the colored buttons) should, if the feature is enabled, send a "Select my input!" command to the AVR or TV. And it should be made (like the CC button) so that the button has to be held down for a couple of seconds to send the command.
> 
> Not *any* button. Who thought that was a good idea, unless the concept was to never have anyone use the feature? The result of the current implementation is what you are seeing, or for some others, the screen flashing with any button push as the input selector reselects the current input.
> 
> Not very clever. It's like the people writing the code don't actually use a TiVo at home at all.
> 
> And speaking of the remote, isn't it time, ten years (or more) into the product cycle, that the peanut is made slightly longer and have a few (like maybe four) fully programmable learning buttons on it? I don't mean Volume or Mute or Input or Power. I mean separate buttons that learn whatever command you can send them from another remote.


What's equally as bad for me is that not only does it send the CEC Volume and Mute, which would be fine if they did it right, but it also sends the AVR IR volume and mute as well and if I don't program the AVR into, then it sends TV volume and mute commands - so when I press MUTE it gets sent twice and doesn't work. It's just terrible - TiVo development should connect an Apple TV and see how that works - it works perfectly!


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## stevepow

TostitoBandito said:


> What is the benefit of CEC on something like a Tivo? I don't get it. I mean, I use CEC on my TV and receiver so that I can power on the TV with the Tivo remote and the receiver comes on automatically via CEC (and similarly powers off), but what would be the use of that for something that you always want to be on? The other main reason to use CEC is so you can send audio from the TV to the receiver while using an app on the TV, but I can't think of any application where you'd need your TV to send audio to your Tivo.


With the Apple TV it is great. I pick up the Apple remote and press the menu button, the Apple TV wakes up, my Sony TV powers up along with my Marantz AV7703 and it switches to the correct input for the Apple TV - all with a single button press! And then everything works great.

With TiVo, it is a mess. Indeed, a single button press on the Tivo remote powers everything up and gets to the correct input, but after that it is terrible. Not only does the TiVo send the wake up command, but after that it also sends CEC volume (only discreet per press volume though - ughh) and mute which is completely redundant with the AVR volume and mute sent by the TiVo remote over IR. And if I don't program the AVR into the Remote, then it sends CEC volume and mute commands to the Sony TV creating more issues. What should happen is they should only be sending the Wake Up CEC commands and not Mute and Volume, especially when the TV and AVR are programmed into the remote. So with Tivo, in many cases, CEC will be useless and has to be turned off. Maybe they fix it, but I sent them a detailed case describing all the problems and I have heard nothing back.


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## jkudlacz

stevepow said:


> With the Apple TV it is great. I pick up the Apple remote and press the menu button, the Apple TV wakes up, my Sony TV powers up along with my Marantz AV7703 and it switches to the correct input for the Apple TV - all with a single button press! And then everything works great.
> 
> With TiVo, it is a mess. Indeed, a single button press on the Tivo remote powers everything up and gets to the correct input, but after that it is terrible. Not only does the TiVo send the wake up command, but after that it also sends CEC volume (only discreet per press volume though - ughh) and mute which is completely redundant with the AVR volume and mute sent by the TiVo remote over IR. And if I don't program the AVR into the Remote, then it sends CEC volume and mute commands to the Sony TV creating more issues. What should happen is they should only be sending the Wake Up CEC commands and not Mute and Volume, especially when the TV and AVR are programmed into the remote. So with Tivo, in many cases, CEC will be useless and has to be turned off. Maybe they fix it, but I sent them a detailed case describing all the problems and I have heard nothing back.


Totally agree, I have same problem with Volume ONLY, mute works fine. I actually wish there was option to disable Volume part using CEC eh.


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## andydumi

I wish the "never standby" option overrode the CEC command sent by a TV/Receiver. I've had to turn off CEC altogether because whenever I turn off the TV it puts the Tivo on standby.


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## Megamind

andydumi said:


> I wish the "never standby" option overrode the CEC command sent by a TV/Receiver. I've had to turn off CEC altogether because whenever I turn off the TV it puts the Tivo on standby.


Agree.


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## Steve

andydumi said:


> I wish the "never standby" option overrode the CEC command sent by a TV/Receiver. I've had to turn off CEC altogether because whenever I turn off the TV it puts the Tivo on standby.


Late to the party here, so forgive me if it's been discussed. Why is going into standby an issue? Does standby limit any needed functionality?

Ya, it's mildly annoying to see a black screen every time I power on the TV, but I'm getting used to it. Just wondering if there's something else going on that I'm missing. TIA.


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## Megamind

Steve said:


> Late to the party here, so forgive me if it's been discussed. Why is going into standby an issue? Does standby limit any needed functionality?


The most common reason is to ensure the channel buffers remain active, even when the television is off. If I turn on a show that I'm not recording a few minutes late, I prefer to be able to back up to the beginning whenever possible.

There are other potential issues as well depending on the configuration of the connected devices. In my case, turning off the TV places the TiVo into standby, but turning the TV on does not wake the TiVo back up. Having to use one button to turn the TV off, and another to turn it on doesn't make sense ... and makes me even less popular than I am with the local residents. 

CEC should, in my opinion, simply respect the power saving preferences established by the user. Until it does, it remains disabled for me.


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## Steve

Megamind said:


> The most common reason is to ensure the channel buffers remain active, even when the television is off. If I turn on a show that I'm not recording a few minutes late, I prefer to be able to back up to the beginning whenever possible.


Thanks. FWIW, I'm sold.

Perhaps CEC can be limited to the following options?

Wake with TiVO (meaning power-on a connected device and change the input)? Yes/No
Control Connected Device Volume? Yes/No
No CEC "standby" option needed, because that's already an option.

Should there be any other CEC options, besides the two listed above?

PS: Also would like those same CEC options for minis.


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## mlbrowninsc

My Samsung Q70 tv remote will turn off the Bolt but like mentioned above will not bring it out of sleep. Once the tv is one you have to go to the TIVo icon on the Smart Hub arrow up and hit the home icon. From there I have most controls for the TiVo. Works pretty well. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Megamind

Steve said:


> Thanks. FWIW, I'm sold.


The HDMI-CEC standby issue has been fixed in 21.9.1.v14. This feature now respects your Power Saving settings, meaning you can have it either which way you prefer.


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