# New TiVo HD losing all channels - getting gray screen on cablecard



## RoyK

I know this has been discussed before but not lately. (except in one thread which has a title that doesn't describe the problem). I have a brand new TiVoHD and am on my third cablecard (Motorola M-Card). After getting the card paired it works fine for up to a few hours and then *all* cable channels are gone leaving only gray screen video and no audio. Menus work ok. Guide works OK. OTA channels are fine.

Programs recorded while gray screen in effect have gray screens. Programs recorded when its working play normally even when its in the gray screen mode.

If I have the cable co "Hit" the card it starts working again for a few hours then loses channels again with same symptoms.

TiVo CS (3 calls, 3 reps) claims to never have heard of such a thing. Cable company (Jetbroadband) insists levels are fine. They've been here 4 times so far. SNR is 31-33 on TiVo (when its working) and on cable company's meter - even when its not working!.

HELP!!!

Edit: Software is at version 11. Was NOT having the problem with 9.4b!

OTA channels OK when cable channels gone. Cable works fine on analog channels if I take out the cable card.


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## toy4x4

If you reboot the box do the channels work again?

Have a external drive?

Version 11 software?

I've been having problems where I lose all my channels and have to reboot. I doubt it is the same problem because I don't get a gray screen.


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## RoyK

Rebooting does not bring the channels back. I do have an external drive. TiVO is running V11 software.


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## lafos

Are you doing a hard (plug) or soft (menu) reboot? Did you consider trying s-cards (just in case)?


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## RoyK

lafos said:


> Are you doing a hard (plug) or soft (menu) reboot? Did you consider trying s-cards (just in case)?


I've done both. s-cards are not available.


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## RoyK

Still having the problem. Updated my OP to add the info that this problem was NOT occurring prior to the V11 update!


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## lysdexia

I'm having the same problem with the grey screen on all channels since the December update on the HD tivos and I have standard cable with no cable cards. This has trashed a lot of my season pass recordings so I hope they fix it soon.


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## RoyK

If you haven't already done so (or even if you have) please call TiVo and report the problem. get a case number.

1-866-986-8486


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## AKThunder

lysdexia said:


> I'm having the same problem with the grey screen on all channels since the December update on the HD tivos and I have standard cable with no cable cards. This has trashed a lot of my season pass recordings so I hope they fix it soon.


I am getting this same problem. I really want to know what is going on


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## RoyK

Kriever said:


> I am getting this same problem. I really want to know what is going on


I want it fixed! This Version 11 update has rendered my TiVoHD useless since most of what we watch is on the digital channels.


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## ignipotentis

I have this problem with a brand new unit and no cable cards installed. Will gray screen after a while Rebooting tends to bring the video back.


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## scantor

Same problem here (all channels, or occasionally all but the analog), usually fixed by CC eject/insert.

I assumed it was a local issue because I've had signal strength issues (too strong) causing me trouble, but this is much more widespread and matches the timing and descriptions of others. I'll call Tivo as was suggested. Sounds like a major bug in the update.


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## rmorton0573

I had this problem before, but it has been a while, it would go to grey screen and not do anything, my issue was with the cable card, so what I did was remove the card, and reboot, when the Tivo came back up I reseated the card, and rebooted again, this fixed my issue and I have not had it since (knock on wood).


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## RoyK

scantor said:


> I'll call Tivo as was suggested. Sounds like a major bug in the update.


Please do. And insist on getting a case number and that they bump the problem to second tier support.


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## toy4x4

I have had the issue again yesterday and today even after having the Cable Co re-auth and re-pair my CableCards. I called the Cable Co again today and they sent out two guys. They did some stuff outside which really was not a issue and then came in and started working on the Tivo. First they checked the signal strength/quality which was fine at the box. They then took down all the info from the CableCard screen and the serial numbers off the S-Cards. They called up and after while they stated that the first card was no longer paired. They worked through that one and checked the second and stated it was not paired either. 

So we'll see if that fixes it. If not I will call the Tivo CableCard Hotline again as I will be convinced it is something with the box not the CableCards. Once again this is on a Series3 and my Tivo HD works fine....


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## slrdc

I'm having the same problem and opened a case with TiVo. 1041187 is my case number and it is escalated.


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## ignipotentis

I don't have cable cards yet. I'm on hold now. I already have a case number. They told me at first I had to update to version 11.x before they would do anything else. Well, I've done that and no joy. I still have issues.


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## ignipotentis

Well, TiVo support was helpful for me. After going through the everything and verifying, they are shipping me a new unit. Since mine is only a coupe of days old, they said I'm getting a new one in place of a refurbished one. Fingers crossed!


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## RoyK

ignipotentis said:


> Well, TiVo support was helpful for me. After going through the everything and verifying, they are shipping me a new unit. Since mine is only a coupe of days old, they said I'm getting a new one in place of a refurbished one. Fingers crossed!


Ditto here. Just got off the phone with them (again). New one on the way. Let's hope....


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## lettie23

We've had our Tivo HD for about a year with no problems (after the pain in the neck initial cable card setup), but for 3 weeks now our channel map has randomly disappeared and our tv goes to black screen when the channel is changed or when the Tivo tries to auto-record. Jetbroadband replaced our Motorola m-card the first time we called and it worked for about an hour. The second time I called, they sent someone different who told me it's an issue with Motorola and the Tivo and they are working on it and every time I want to watch tv, to call them and have them send a hit. So, every time we call, we have to explain the entire thing and they always tell us they're "working on it". I've called Tivo twice also, and they insist it's something Motorola/Jetbroadband has to fix. All this time, we just try to leave the tuners on the 2 channels we hope to watch the most and as long as we don't change any channels, they don't disappear. 

Now I'm wondering about v11 since the timing seems right. Our CableCard FW Version says: 02.65, 02.01, 03.25. Does anyone else have newer firmware with the same issue? I wonder if the compatibility problem lies there.


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## RoyK

We must be neighbors.
I've received TiVo #3 (for which TiVo put a $314 charge on my credit card for a refurb that they are selling for $179!) and its having the same problem. I get the same story from JetBroadband. And to be fair they have been great - they are as frustrated with the issue as we are. 

I do know that the Radford office has bought a TiVoHD to troubleshoot the problem and they are seeing the same thing on it that you and I are seeing.

My cablecard is showing the same FW versions as yours.

I had my hopes up yesterday when, after I had them send a hit to my card, everything worked great for an hour and a half. Then I changed channels one more time and, well, you know.

In one of my half dozen calls to TiVo the CS rep told me that she would set up a conference call the next morning with me and JetBroadband to try to resolve the problem. This, of course, must have been just a line to get me off the phone because it never happened. 

So here we are - TiVo says its a Jetbroadband problem, Jetbroadband says its a Motorola problem, Motorola says its a TiVo problem and we are stuck with bricks instead of the working equipment we paid for.....

I still maintain that this became an issue only after the TiVo(s) upgraded to Version 11. Your experience lends some weight to that.


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## proudx

I'm seeing the grey screen on some OTA channels when first tuning. This started with v11 for me as well. If the channel is slow to tune, switch over to the dvr diagnostics and can see rs uncorrected going sky high.


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## ljr

I am also seeing this issue. when I do a soft reboot the channels come back.

I have version 11 and an external drive (The TIVO approved MyDVR)


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## elstonhill

I have been having the same problem for several weeks following the update. It worked perfectly the first month.

TIVO blames the Cable Company. Says it must be the card OR the signal. My Cable Company (WAVE Broadband) was wonderful. They sent someone out to check the signal. He found the signal was good. So, he said he had solved the problem for another customer by putting in two Single cards instead of the M card. He said he had only one card so he replaced my card and another tech came out two days later with another single card. Guess what. The replacement cards were both M Cards. They can not tell the difference between a single card and an M card. He took the second card.

OK, so I have a new M card and guess what. The problem persists.

I am getting worn out by all this plus I have missing shows.


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## RoyK

RoyK said:


> Ditto here. Just got off the phone with them (again). New one on the way. Let's hope....


Update.

The refurb had the same problem with gray screens on v11 software. It updated before I could really try 8.1 that came on it.

JetBroadband has jumped through every hoop trying to get the thing to work. The refurb is going back to TiVo today so I can get the $314 they charged to my credit card (for a refurb with no accessories!) credited back.

A follow-up call to TiVo today (7th call) revealed that the CS Rep's promise to me of referring the problem to 2nd echelon was NOT kept. So far that's two committments TiVo has made to me (first was to set up a conference call between them, me, and JetBroadband -- TiVo's idea, not mine) that they neglected to keep.


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## hogateb

Been lurking here a while trying to find a solution to the issues that are discussed here. Cable Cards (Motarola) installed on TiVo HD on 12/22 by Cox of Northwest Arkansas tech (4 hour goosechase for another post). Same issue with gray screen on analog channels. Called TiVo CS on 12/23 and was told that the engineers are working on it.  I let it ride until yesterday, 1/9. 

Called again and they had to completely research the issue again as though I had never called in before. TiVo told me the same line about the engineers are working on it, there is no ETA to a fix blah, blah. Escelated it to another level and was told that it is probably the TiVo box because this rep had only heard of this issue one other time. Returned it and exchanged it. Activated the new box last night 1/9, all is good without cable cards last night. Decided to install cards this morning. Inserted and called Cox customer service and was told that they cannot set them up, and that a tech has to come out for another install $$$, so that they can call and tell the person on the other end of the phone the exact same numbers that I can! Doubt it will fix the problem, very dissappointed in TiVo and Cox at this point in the game. Seems as though Cox has to support the cable cards the same as they would their box. They even said that they cannot support cable cards over the phone, but they could do everthing to their box!


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## lettie23

Well, I've been waiting and hoping they would come up with a solution since calling doesn't seem to do much good. Finally yesterday Jetbroadband called to say Tivo might have a solution. Told me to talk with them and tell them it's level II and Austin is the lead contact on this issue. I called Tivo last night and talked with a pretty helpful person (Austin wasn't there) who said they have had some luck with pulling the cable card just far enough out that it isn't recognized and going through the guided setup (select will install cable card later). After the setup is over, re-insert the card. It actually worked long enough we got to watch a few of our shows and record them. Then at about 11pm (when there is no one to talk to), the channels disappeared. The Tivo rep had also said a restart will usually make the channels come back temporarily, so I tried that and it didn't work - got the acquiring channels screen. So frustrating!

Tonight, it was still acquiring channels, so I called Tivo and spoke with someone extremely unhelpful who insists it's a cable card issue and it couldn't be their software vs Motorola b/c that would be too widespread. I tried to tell him there are people from all over talking about this on the internet. He told me to have a new cable card put in (I tried to tell him we did this already). Anyway, I lucked out for the moment b/c the channels randomly came back while I was on the phone with him. Guess I'll wait and see if they disappear again (which I'm sure they will). When it does go out again, I'm going to keep trying until I get to talk to Austin. It's too bad you can't always talk with someone helpful and informative. If anyone else finds a solution (besides trading in Tivo for something else), please let us know.


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## RoyK

I sent the replacement HD that TiVo sent me back because it had the same problem as the original one. I put the card back in the original, emailed JetBroadband and had them pair it back to the old one and send it a hit. Got it working for a half hour or so then back to gray screens on ALL channels except OTA and the message saying I need a cable card. 

Also like you it will come back in a couple of hours (I think that JetBroadband's computers must send periodic hits to the boxes) but lose it again when I change channels.

Restart doesn't help mine either.

Jetbroadband also told me to contact TiVo level 2 and ask for the person who has been working with them on the issue. Got sidetracked for a couple of days by a family emergency but will get back on it tomorrow. Like you, I don't expect any help from TiVo but we'll see what happens. I'll report back.


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## hogateb

Just an update to the TiVo/CableCard/Cox Communications issues going on in NW Arkansas. Tech came out on Monday, installed the cards, they paired just fine and he was in and out in less than 15 minutes. An hour or so went buy and card in slot 2 was not authorized. Called Cox, they sent a second hit and it has been working ever since. Able to view all channels analog and digital without issue for the past 48 hours. What would blow it up before for me was to record an analog channel. Still looking good. 

Sounds like a replacement as a fix is hit or miss. I am trying to break it to get the gray screen issue, but I hope it stays working. 

I will post an update later this week as to what is going on. Good luck to everyone else with this pesky issue.


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## Leocatz

Facing the same issue while trying to help a friend with the initial set up of a new HDTivo box and Charter Cable. One M card installed. After allowing all initial info to DL from Tivo and running the set up a second time we have signals on 0-99, and some of the HD channels - but the grey screen on all Premium channels (SD and HD) and several of the HD cable channels (e.g. TNT, History). Tech is coming back on Sunday, but after reading this thread I'm skeptical of a solution. But I will try the remove - reboot - reinsert - reboot option suggested above before he comes. Thanks to all who post - even though it makes me crazy reading them. I actually starting to reflect fondly on the 3 OTA channel days. (yeah, I'm getting old). Geoffrey


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## slyone

My 1 yr.ols unit started having sporadic issues with losing channels! I also called and first was told it was a vers.11.0 issue then when I called a couple days later(same problem) I was told the first center was incorrect and to replace/renew the CC's... I had TW out and they said my levels were off and installed some sort of device with my already TW supplied amplifier. I also had the csr install new M-CC's which were also Scientific Atlanta's manufactured 7/07 and have not had any issues....yet! Been a week so far...


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## lstorey

Has anyone withOUT cable cards found a solution to this?

I was recording a show tonight and watching something else I had recorded. went to watch live TV and got the grey screen. I rebooted (after I determined that my show was not recording) and it seems to be working fine. However this is nothing something I want to do all the time. I lost a show on Tuesday because it said it didn't record because of no signal...however tonight's showed it was recording but it wasn't (light was on in the front of the Tivo)

If I need to call Tivo I will but not sure what to tell them and is it a box issue (my box is less than a month old)?


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## bkdtv

lstorey said:


> I was recording a show tonight and watching something else I had recorded. went to watch live TV and got the grey screen. I rebooted (after I determined that my show was not recording) and it seems to be working fine. However this is nothing something I want to do all the time. I lost a show on Tuesday because it said it didn't record because of no signal...however tonight's showed it was recording but it wasn't (light was on in the front of the Tivo)
> 
> If I need to call Tivo I will but not sure what to tell them and is it a box issue (my box is less than a month old)?


It is well established on this forum that the *analog* tuners will periodically "go out" with a TiVo running the 11.x software. The result is a gray/black screen and missed recordings on those tuners. Over *100 different users* on this forum have reported it.

TiVo is no doubt working on a fix (how could they not be?) for release in the near future. If it weren't for the Christmas holidays followed by CES, I suspect TiVo would have addressed this issue already.


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## lew

bkdtv said:


> It is well established on this forum that the *analog* tuners will periodically "go out" with a TiVo running the 11.x software. The result is a gray/black screen and missed recordings on those tuners. Over *100 different users* on this forum have reported it.
> 
> TiVo is no doubt working on a fix (how could they not be?) for release in the near future. If it weren't for the Christmas holidays followed by CES, I suspect TiVo would have addressed this issue already.


Tivo needs to have a system in place to roll back selected customers to the previous software version. Something that can be done at tivo's end. Tivo may also need to increase the number of beta testers, or at least make sure beta testers have more diverse systems.

I understand the holidays and CES will delay the solution with 11.X software but tivo should have an interim solution (roll back) ready to go.


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## RoyK

Called TiVo again yesterday. Asked to speak to Austin (L2 Support) who supposedly is working with Jetbroadband on this issue. Was told that he wasn't available to talk but that my case would be escalated directly to him and he would call me as soon as he was free. He didn't.

Called again today and again asked to speak to Austin about the JetBroadband issue. As soon as I mentioned Jetbroadband the L1 guy (James) said - "Oh, the gray screen issue. Lots of JetBroadband customers have called. We've been instructed not to forward to L2. The issue has been escalated to Engineering. Its a software issue."

I commented something about the box I bought on Thanksgiving being useless then. He said I could always pull the cablecard out and get the analog stuff. That's not what I bought the TiVoHD for folks....

So.....?????


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## lew

You have to decide what you want. You can certainly ask for a service credit until the issue is fixed. Do you want tivo to "buy back" your unit? Do you want to be put in a priority list to test the updated software?

Any are reasonable requests.


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## JimjimH

I have 3 Tivo HDs. I'm having a similar gray-screen problem on my unit that does NOT HAVE a cable card. It happens approx. every 10 days. It stops receiving anything from the cable but still plays back previously recorded shows, changes channels, etc. I've been rebooting to solve the problem. If this is a problem with the 11.x software it will be interesting to see if and when Tivo gets it fixed. 
Thanks.


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## bkdtv

JimjimH said:


> I have 3 Tivo HDs. I'm having a similar gray-screen problem on my unit that does NOT HAVE a cable card. It happens approx. every 10 days. It stops receiving anything from the cable but still plays back previously recorded shows, changes channels, etc. I've been rebooting to solve the problem. If this is a problem with the 11.x software it will be interesting to see if and when Tivo gets it fixed.
> Thanks.


It will definitely be fixed and soon. But how soon is anyone's guess. It could be two days or it could be two weeks.

If I were a betting man, I would say more than two days and less than two weeks. _Major issues_ like this don't get past TiVo very often, but from past history, we know that TiVo works hard to get fixes out very quickly when they do.


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## lew

Someone might drop TivoJerry a PM. He posted in the series 1 connection thread and said tivo is working on it. I suspect tivo will do everything in their power to get the issue resolved prior to the Super Bowl.


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## lstorey

this happened to me on Tuesday and then again today. I hope that they are working on it. I can't keep resetting the Tivo!


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## MadPiper

When I got home on Friday night after work my Tivo had the grey screen again. I called in to Tivo Support and got a very cooperative and friendly person. He had me unplug the Tivo for 30 seconds and then plug it back in.

No, this didn't (permanently) fix it, and I didn't expect it to. Of course it cured it temporarily.
He didn't ask me any kind of diagnostic questions (ie signal strength, cable-card questions, cable-company, etc.) 
I asked if Tivo recognized this as a problem, and he said yes and that they are working on it.

At the end of the call I said that I needed to speak with Billing to see about not paying for a service that I'm not receiving (since I can't depend on my Tivo to record when I'm not there).

He didn't pass me to billing; instead, he said that he would note it in my case that I have asked for a credit.
He said that if I am still having the issue in a couple of days, to call back and mention that I had requested a credit, and "it would be taken care of".

I think that the combination of Tivo not even asking for diagnositc information of any type on this problem, coupled with the fact that they seem very ready to credit my account, indicates that they know they have an issue and they are trying to do damage control.

I encourage everyone who doesn't have a lifetime contract to call Tivo Support, report the issue, and then ask for a credit. Having customers asking for money back can't do anything but motivate them.


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## jpasint

Same issue here. 4 day old Tivo from Best Buy. Did not have the issue with v8.x that came with it. First full day after v11.x update I came home from work to the grey screen. Recordings played but no channels would. I don't have cable cards yet, just connected directly to Comcast cable.
My immediate reaction was to restart the box and that brought the channels back.

Waiting for a fix......

Joe


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## kgro

I've been having this problem since I upgraded to a HD tivo. Except, unlike most people posting here, this happens on a daily (if not more often) basis. I have had TiVo for at least 3 years and have never had a problem. Now I'm missing most of my seasons passes. I work 12 hour shifts, so when I get home from work and realize nothing recorded for most the day, I am NOT a happy camper. 

I do NOT have cable cards yet. My signal strength is "high", even when the gray screen is showing no video. Both hard and soft resets restore channels...until the next time. None of my wiring has been changed. I have tried to look for patters as to time of day, channel recording, etc, and have not found any patterns. 

Doesn't sound like cable cards help the issue at all. 

I'm going to call TiVo support tomorrow hopefully (working 12 hour shifts all weekend). However, it does sound like they have received MULTIPLE complaints, and are working on the issue. Not sure if my complaint will make a difference, but I guess it can't hurt. 

Any other advice from anyone besides just waiting around for some kind of update and continuing to miss my shows?  Thanks!


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## RoyK

kgro said:


> ... Not sure if my complaint will make a difference, but I guess it can't hurt.
> 
> Any other advice from anyone besides just waiting around for some kind of update and continuing to miss my shows?  Thanks!


Call and keep calling. The more who call the more seriously they will take this problem.


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## lstorey

I wish we didn't have to call but could send in feedback. I know how to reset my system and the one time I called the wait time was 20 or 30 min. I really don't have that kind of time


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## wtherrell

bkdtv said:


> It is well established on this forum that the *analog* tuners will periodically "go out" with a TiVo running the 11.x software. The result is a gray/black screen and missed recordings on those tuners. Over *100 different users* on this forum have reported it.
> 
> TiVo is no doubt working on a fix (how could they not be?) for release in the near future. If it weren't for the Christmas holidays followed by CES, I suspect TiVo would have addressed this issue already.


Mine was doing this well before the 11.x software. Perhaps the 11.x just made the problem worse? 
I'm so sick of this TIVO mess I'm ready to throw up. Never had any serious problems with my previous S2 units. Tivo is just putting a very inferior product on the market with the THD. No matter how good the interface and features are if the thing won't work reliably in the first place. Why should I pay TIVO another $149 for something that was never right in the first place?


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## RoyK

Update. Just got off the phone with my contact at JetBroadband. She confirms the following:

ALL Jetbroadband customers with TiVOHDs have been experiencing the gray screen/loss of channels issues with cablecard installed since TiVo's Version 11 update.

NONE of them were experiencing the problem prior to the Version 11 update.

They took the TiVOHD they purchased to troubleshoot the issue to ALL of their headends. It had the problem on ALL of them.

Jetbroadband is NOT the only cable company having this issue.

Jetbroadband, Motorola, and TiVo are having frequent conference calls regarding the problem.

The above points squarely to TiVo's Version 11 software as the problem. It appears that the only resolution can be made by TiVo.


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## Roderigo

RoyK said:


> The above points squarely to TiVo's Version 11 software as the problem. It appears that the only resolution can be made by TiVo.


Hmm. From your post, I don't see enough data to come to that conclusion. I could see it being tivo's problem, but I could also see tivo changing something that exposes a cable company problem.

In particular, this comment:


RoyK said:


> Jetbroadband, Motorola, and TiVo are having frequent conference calls regarding the problem.


If all 3 companies are involved, it doesn't sound like "the only resolution can be made by tivo"


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## RoyK

Yeah, it may have exposed a problem I suppose that's possible. It may also be due to global warming I suppose.

However it worked before TiVo changed the software. It hasn't worked since.

TiVo has told me that it is a software issue and they are "working on it".

Other's are seeing the gray screen issues - they seem to manifest themselves in different ways.

This issue isn't the only one I've seen since the V11 upgrade. I've had to reboot several times due to hangs (see's remote button presses but doesn't respond) and blank menus.


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## ozbone

I'm not sure my problem is exactly the same but am curious if anyone else has encountered it ..
I have two TiVo HDs (one 2 years old, the other a year+ old) and occasionally I will find that all of my analog channels will go away. If the TV was originally on an analog channel the picture is frozen; switching to another analog channel yields a gray screen, complete with program info but no "searching for signal" message. My digital channels all work perfectly. My cable company has checked out signal, etc and it all checks out fine. It happens every couple of days, and sometimes to both TiVos at the same time. A restart fixes the problem.

UPDATE: The most recent occurrence - yesterday - revealed something interesting. One of the THDs was frozen but I had to leave and could not restart. When I came back I noticed it was recording. Expecting it to still be frozen I found instead that it had changed channels and was successfully recording.


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## TooMuchTime

I have a troubleshooting step to try. It's an idea; it may not be a *good* idea, but...

I don't know of a way to turn off Tivo's ability to phone home, but maybe this issue has to do with v11 and updating. If there is a way to only use a manual update, turn off the auto-update and see if the problem persists.

If the problem goes away, leave it that way for about a week to be sure it's "fixed." (You should have enough channel data for 2 weeks.) Then, when you have time, manually update and see what happens.

If the problem comes back, that would be very helpful for Tivo to know.

Like I said, it's an idea, but not necessarily good one.


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## RoyK

TooMuchTime said:


> I have a troubleshooting step to try. It's an idea; it may not be a *good* idea, but...
> 
> I don't know of a way to turn off Tivo's ability to phone home, but maybe this issue has to do with v11 and updating. If there is a way to only use a manual update, turn off the auto-update and see if the problem persists.
> 
> If the problem goes away, leave it that way for about a week to be sure it's "fixed." (You should have enough channel data for 2 weeks.) Then, when you have time, manually update and see what happens.
> 
> If the problem comes back, that would be very helpful for Tivo to know.
> 
> Like I said, it's an idea, but not necessarily good one.


Thanks for the thought but the update we're talking about is the Version 11 software update that occurred in early December - not the program schedule update.


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## lstorey

I am on hold for support because I am tired of this rebooting! They should have had a fix by now. I have missed several programs for no good reason and I'm not happy about it.

I do no have any of these issues with my series 2 dvr, it is definitely the HD one I just got


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## Leon WIlkinson

This is what is up with my TivoHD{no CCards), I enabled the Qam channels and those will work when analog is out. This is getting worse, more frequent lately, along with reboots. At first I thought it was just the TV, it would go black/grey then fiddle with channels and or power it off and TV's CC would be enabled. I disable them then it would happen again. It does it sometimes if I power it off to leave, then I come back. So some of it might be the TV.


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## TooMuchTime

> Thanks for the thought but the update we're talking about is the Version 11 software update that occurred in early December - not the program schedule update.


Agreed. But from what I read, this problem can be "fixed" for a while, then it comes back. Maybe the reason it comes back is the DVR phoning home. I'm not saying to disconnect it, just stop it from getting program data for a bit. If the problem persists, well...you haven't lost anything because it's still broken.

On the other hand, if stopping the program info download fixes the issue, that is something Tivo should know.

It's just a troubleshooting step to try.


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## seggers

Having the same problem with my stock S3. Every once in a while, after v11, I'll come back to live tv to see the grey screen. If I remember rightly, I don't think it matters whether a show had been watched or not before hand.

No CC installed. I end up rebooting with three thumbs down. All seems good after that.

I'm going to report this to TiVo tomorrow.

Seggers


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## dave13077

I am having the same grey screen problem on my 2 stock HD units. I have TWC with a M card installed in both. I called Tivo today to report the problem and they said it is a known issue and a fix (software patch) is due out any time. The tech did not know a timeframe.


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## dave13077

After thinking about it for a while I think I know what I was doing the times I got the grey screen.

Any time I would flip through the channels using the "channel up/down" button. I would scroll through the channels quite quick. I was just reading the info on the channel and then going to the next channel without letting the channel load. I did this a couple of times yesterday and within an hour I had the grey screen on all channels. I have to reboot the Tivo and TA twice but everything returned to normal.

On my other unit when I scrolled through the guide quickly I would get a grey screen on the channel I finally selected. Only the selected channel was grey and everything else was fine. After awhile the channel would come back on its own.

It appears to me that the TIVO is having issues when the channels are scrolled through quickly either with the channel up/down button or through the guide.

Changing channels using the number pad seems to work fine.

Maybe someone else can test this out also and see if they get the same results.


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## leedalton67

I had the same problem with a Charter Cable Card. Grey screen on many of the HD channels. I thought they were not part of my upgrade package, so I just took them ot of the channel line up and watched them on SD. I ejected the card and reinserted and then did a software update and my HD channels started working. I still have a grey screen delay when changing channels but I can live with that for now.


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## Uncle_Steve

It's happened twice now with our TivoHD. Both times required Comcast to send a hit to the card. Comcast here uses Scientific Atlanta M-cards.


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## DanInSD

I'm experiencing this as well with my 2 TiVoHD units, bought at different times. I'll report this tomorrow to TiVo. It actually looks like there is no signal from the CableCard.

What I did find is that going into the CableCard Decoders menu and testing the channels "reinstates" the CableCard and things start to work again.

*You don't need to reboot the TiVo to get your channels back. *

This doesn't fix it, but helps with some of the pain when you're waiting for the reboot.


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## Jeanesco

DanInSD said:


> *You don't need to reboot the TiVo to get your channels back. *


This isn't entirely correct.

I get this same problem with analog only cable on my tivohd. The OTA channels work fine but the the analog cable channels (I have no digital) stop working on both tuners. The only solution to the problem that I can find is to reboot the tivo.

I can't go into any kind of cablecard testing menu since I don't have any, and naturally I can't get the cable company to "hit" a cablecard that isn't there to begin with.


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## RoyK

I believe there are (at least) two gray screen issues with V11 software. The first and the one I have is where cablecard is present and it somehow 'loses' its channel list - or rather the TiVo thinks so resulting in gray screens and the "you may need a cablecard to receive this channel" message.

The second is where cable cards are not present yet there is a gray screen problem.

My particular TiVoHD suffers from the first but not the second - it works fine when the cable card is pulled. But I don't receive most of the channels I'm paying my cable company for - including the HD channels that I bought it to record!.


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## Jeanesco

This is a pretty major issue that's been known for over two months now. Why hasn't tivo issued a software update to resolve this?


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## CaptDS9E

It's getting annoying already. Friday night HD for CBS,NBC,Fox and ABC went dark to the grey screen. Saturday morning I rebooted twice, and then it worked again. Then just a little while ago it happened again.


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## seggers

Jeanesco said:


> This is a pretty major issue that's been known for over two months now. Why hasn't tivo issued a software update to resolve this?


+1.

My new CC install and TA went down the grey screen of death route not more than 3 hours from being installed. I had re-run the guided setup and pulled the plug (part of trying to find out why the TA was blinking at me 8 times in a row).

I did a soft reboot and hope that'll sort thing out. The TiVo claimed to be recording something this morning, so I'm curious to see if I get a program, or grey wallpaper.....

Seggers


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## Durfman

I just got a TivoHD last week and it's now having this problem. Crap.


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## rebelguy

Tivo Series 3 HD, SW version 11.0-01-2-652. Unit is new and has been installed for 2 weeks. The first week was analog only as I was waiting for Comcast to get Sci Atlanta M card which they claimed was on back order. During the analog week I had no problems. The CC has been installed for a week now and I have already had to reboot 3 times becasue all channels had gone grey. No signal issues becasue the Comcast tech was getting almost perfect S/N readings on the meter. I have a series 2 in the bedroom which is having no problems with analog.

So..... seems my problems are falling in line with others as reported here.

As a side note... I'm a newbie here and I really appreciate this site. It helped me navigate the initial cable card install process by educating my Comcast installer based on information gleaned from this site.


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## bkdtv

TiVo representatives are telling people over the phone that a fix is in testing now, and that users can sign up to help test it.

If you want to help TiVo test a fix, sign up at *TiVo's Field Trials site*. Be sure to use the *same screen name* that you use here, so TiVo knows that you are experiencing the problem.

Signing up is no guarantee that TiVo will pick you, but it increases your chances from none to potentially _much greater than none_ if they recognize you as having a problem for which they are testing a fix.

For the rest experiencing this issue, I don't think there's much we can do besides calling to complain and waiting forTiVo to roll out a public fix that works for everyone. TiVoJerry posted the following two weeks ago:



TiVoJerry said:


> We believe we have a fix in place for a majority of situations and just started releasing it to a set number of random HD units as of last night. This is our initial release period where we review all cases logged against the new SW. If you are connecting on a regular basis but have not received new SW, you are not in this initial phase (i.e. making more connections will not get you SW any faster). If all goes well during the review period, the rest of the units will receive the SW shortly thereafter.
> 
> I'm sorry for not finding this thread to post sooner, but rest assured that engineering had been working on the problem.


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## speedy99

Durfman said:


> I just got a TivoHD last week and it's now having this problem. Crap.


I also got a TiVo HD this weekend to replace my ReplayTV (that finally died). I was expecting a flawless device...Hah! I get the grey screen several times an hour when channel surfing. No cable cards, no antenna, no "extra" scanned QAM channels, just "standard basic" cable from Comcast. I was hoping whenever the box upgrades to 11.x the problem would go away (my box is so new it still has the "original" SW version: 8.1.7c2-01-2-652).

After looking at this thread, I wonder if the problem is hardware/firmware. I've been running MythTV as a "backup" on an old PC, but would really like a seamless DVR that works with HD. Not yet ready for the cablecard adventures if I can't even get the device working on standard cable out-of-the-box. I plan to call TiVo after the software updates - not sure when that will be - I keep forcing connections through my broadband link, but no new software is coming.

Just thought I would add another datapoint that the grey screen of tuner death happens on a stock box running pre 11.0 with no cable cards or external drives. (BTW, I did do the channel scan thing to "see" the QAM HD channels for testing, and they work fine. Its only "analog" cable that greys out. I've since reverted to plain analog cable through guided setup again, but still get the grey screen of tuner death when only tuning analog channels.)

I'll test the "fast channel changing" theory put forth. It also seems to grey out the screen after a (forced?) connect. I am rebooting again now - the 4th time in the last hour. What gives?!?! Ugh!


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## jonathan01950

I have this same problem, where my TIVO has switched to the grey screen and I didn't notice since I watch almost everything per-TIVOd to avoid commericals.

One thing I tried was to take the cover off. I now go a few weeks between failures where as I was having trouble every couple of days. 

The box is about 5 years old and the problem did show up last Dec like everyone else though which does imply the software is the problem.


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## WaldorfSalad

Did someone say that a gray screen and black screen are effectively the same thing and that it depends on whether you've chosen gray or black for sidebars? I've been getting a black screen occassionally on my new TivoHD. For those of you that get the gray/black screen can you still see the Tivo menus and Guide, just not channel program picture?


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## RoyK

WaldorfSalad said:


> Did someone say that a gray screen and black screen are effectively the same thing and that it depends on whether you've chosen gray or black for sidebars? I've been getting a black screen occassionally on my new TivoHD. For those of you that get the gray/black screen can you still see the Tivo menus and Guide, just not channel program picture?


Yes, gray/black same thing.
Yes - still see menus and guide.


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## briand617a

I just started experiencing this in the last week. I have a year-old Tivo 3 HD, with 2 Comcast cable cards.

All occurrences happened when the TV had been turned off overnight, but Tivo remained on. One time, after turning on the TV, it had the gray "loss of signal" screen. 2 other times, after turning on the TV, there was a signal on the channel it happened to be on, but then after switching the station to a different one, the "loss of signal" screen appeared.

In all 3 cases, restarting the Tivo solved the problem.

Right now I am deleting a bunch of recorded programs to see if disk space might be the issue.


----------



## RoyK

briand617a said:


> I just started experiencing this in the last week. I have a year-old Tivo 3 HD, with 2 Comcast cable cards.
> 
> All occurrences happened when the TV had been turned off overnight, but Tivo remained on. One time, after turning on the TV, it had the gray "loss of signal" screen. 2 other times, after turning on the TV, there was a signal on the channel it happened to be on, but then after switching the station to a different one, the "loss of signal" screen appeared.
> 
> In all 3 cases, restarting the Tivo solved the problem.
> 
> Right now I am deleting a bunch of recorded programs to see if disk space might be the issue.


Tivo has acknowledged that this is a bug in their V11 software. Deleting programs won't help - only a bugfix will.


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## theviaumaster

I'm struggling with the same problem as everyone else: About once a week (and sometimes more often than that) I get the black screen of death on most of my digital channels. A soft reset always fixes the issue and it never comes back until at least three or four days after each reset. Usually I can go about a week between resets. I've considered plugging my TiVo into a digital timer that could kill the power every three or four days at 3:00 a.m. which (in theory) would prevent us from missing any shows. I have a TiVo HD connected to an external My DVR Expander. I would probably leave the external drive running and just reset the TiVo itself. My question is would it damage the TiVo to do a hard reset that often? Or should I just tough it out until they come up with a fix? Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks!


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## jfh3

theviaumaster said:


> I'm struggling with the same problem as everyone else: About once a week (and sometimes more often than that) I get the black screen of death on most of my digital channels. A soft reset always fixes the issue and it never comes back until at least three or four days after each reset. Usually I can go about a week between resets. I've considered plugging my TiVo into a digital timer that could kill the power every three or four days at 3:00 a.m. which (in theory) would prevent us from missing any shows. I have a TiVo HD connected to an external My DVR Expander. I would probably leave the external drive running and just reset the TiVo itself. My question is would it damage the TiVo to do a hard reset that often? Or should I just tough it out until they come up with a fix? Any thoughts would be appreciated. Thanks!


Don't worry about hard reboots. You aren't going to "harm" the Tivo. Just make sure your Tivo is plugged into a good surge suppressor/battery backup. Bad power/power spikes will do more harm to your box than hard reboots.


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## westtown73

I posted this to another thread and then found this one, which matches what I am seeing. 

I have a Tivo HD and my provider is Comcast. My initial cable setup about a year ago consisted of 2 s-cards. Everything was fine until about a week ago. I left home with a fine picture but when I returned a few hours later the screen was grey with the "searching for signal" message bar on the screen. However, my internet service was fine as was the analog TV feed. A week later and several Comcast visits, it appears that I have an intermittent loss of the digital TV signal. It will be on for a few hours and look great, and then go off again and I never lose my Internet. Comcast has be reasonably helpful and did the following: 1) boosted the signal at the pole, 2) replaced the cable from the splitter to the TIVO, 3) replaced the S-card with a Motorola m-card. None of these fixed the problem and neither has restarting the TVIO. I just checked and I do have v11 software.


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## speedy99

After getting 11.0 software update nothing has changed. Get grey screen of death after 15 minutes or less. I did call TiVo, and the tech said they are "aware of issues with tuning standard cable", but had no pending fixes in the works - the bug sounded like it was in a "need more research" state. (You'll love this - he suggested using CableCards, claiming they seemed to work better than just using standard cable!) His suggestion: return the TiVo and get another one. My next step: return the TiVo and get my money back. Maybe I'll try TiVo again in a few years when they get their HW/SW figured out, but for now I'm back to mythbuntu + roku + etc.

In case it helps others, I did throw an antenna on the TiVo, and the tuning bug seems to *NOT* impact ATSC (Over The Air) HD programming (using the antenna jack). I'm not sure about the old units, but I suspect the new HD Series 3 units have some buggy/flaky tuners in them. I'm not convinced TiVo will be able to fix this with a software patch - certainly not soon, and I'm not willing to wait thru my 30-day money-back period to find out. 

BTW - Thanks to everyone on this forum. Your posts inspired me to try TiVo in the first place. I'm actually very disappointed - I really wanted a nice dual-tuner HD DVR that included NetFlix streaming and was user-friendly enough for the whole family. I really wanted this thing to work. Sigh.

Best


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## RoyK

speedy99 said:


> ... I'm not convinced TiVo will be able to fix this with a software patch - certainly not soon, and I'm not willing to wait thru my 30-day money-back period to find out.


The fact that my TiVoHD worked fine with cablecards on 9.4b software and didn't experience the loss of channels problem until it received 11.0 along with the same experience from my neighbors convinces me that it is a software issue. The tuners are obviously capable of working. If it worked once it can work again. But it's been 3 months of frustration now and my patience -- already thin -- is getting threadbare. One week of working successfully since I bought it last November is pathetic.



speedy99 said:


> BTW - Thanks to everyone on this forum. Your posts inspired me to try TiVo in the first place. I'm actually very disappointed - I really wanted a nice dual-tuner HD DVR that included NetFlix streaming and was user-friendly enough for the whole family. I really wanted this thing to work. Sigh.
> 
> Best


Me too.


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## seggers

I signed up to be a beta tester for the fix to this grey screen crap.

I also tried the suggestion of testing one of the CC channel line up. Worked a treat! I had one working (recording fashion crap - maybe that's why the other one went down! To save itself...) and the other one grey.

Once the show stopped, I test the channels and both come back. No reboot required.

Seggers


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## theviaumaster

jfh3 said:


> Don't worry about hard reboots. You aren't going to "harm" the Tivo. Just make sure your Tivo is plugged into a good surge suppressor/battery backup. Bad power/power spikes will do more harm to your box than hard reboots.


Thanks for the info! I think I'm going to set this up, especially now that 11b is out and doesn't appear to have fixed the issue.  Thanks again!


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## bkdtv

Are you all still experiencing the same problem under the 11b software released last night?


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## phelps123

I have a TivoHD for 1 month now, every day I have to restart it due to it loosing the analog channels. I don't have cable cards or cable box, only analog cable from Comcast. 

I have called support multiple times, but no resolution, only that they are aware of the issue, but no expectation of when a resolution will be forthcoming.


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## lstorey

bkdtv said:


> Are you all still experiencing the same problem under the 11b software released last night?


I turned on my television tonight and the picture was frozen and I had to do a reboot of the system.

I'm signing up for the trial and hopefully they have a fix for this soon. it is getting rather irritating to have to keep rebooting my tivo every few days


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## RoyK

The loss of channels to gray screens when using a cablecard issue *appears *to have been fixed with V11.0b software (based on 6 hours of continuous uptime this morning with cablecard inserted. Previous record on V11 was 1-3/4 hours for me).


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## PKrellner

I just got off the phone with TIVO corporate and this is still an on-going problem that they say is their number one issue. It's been happening to me almost daily and tech support is useless.


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## ifly

So to add to the list and confirm issues!

Ever since some time late November (following the last SW update) my Series 3 has had the following problems and I have tried the following resolutions;

1. Live TV starts to break up and stutter, this has got progressively worse and is across both tuners. Restarts and reboots provide minimal help for minimal time before the problem occurs again! It eventually brings on the BSOD (Black Screen of Death) that requires a channel change to get rid of or if the box totally freezes another reboot!!!

2. Playback of material recorded prior to the update now loses audio and stutters, with some fast forwarding and rewinding I can usually resolve this problem but it will happen again during playback requiring the same problem resolution technique.

3. I have run the full drive checking that TIVO suggest and both discs internal and external have passed with flying colours. I even have the recommended WD DVR Expander!

4. As TIVO have suggested I have changed out both the S CableCards (Twice) with no resolution to the problem!

5. TIVO blames Comcast for their HD rollout, Switched Digital Video (Not rolled out in Denver yet!), signal levels and a myriad of other Cable Co. issues. I work in Cable Engineering and the excuses seem like to total BS to me.

6. Comcast blames TIVO and based upon conversations with Senior engineers who have talked to TIVO this is not just a Comcast issue, its Time Warner, Cox, you name the Cable Co. and they have TIVO customers having the same issues as we are!!

7. TIVO's suggestion that I ship my box back to them and pay $149 for a refurb unit is absolute BS as well! I have 3 friends who have decided to do this and ended up with the same problems all over again, either upon receipt of the box or within a week!

From my analytical POV this looks like a TIVO issue! Timing and experiences of many point to the same issues. - The last SW update!

Is TIVO trying to take advantage of us who are (just) out of warranty to get an extra $149 without providing a resolution?? If so then a class action suit looks like the way to go and with enough third party engineering analysis I am sure we can point to a specific area in TIVO's camp that has caused this issue. I for one am sick of missing shows after paying out nearly $1000 in equipment and service then having to pay $1.99 through another service to watch the same shows all over again!

OK thats my $0.02 and frustration laid out! I feel better now anyone else?


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## TLD

Just want to confirm this is happening here in LA with TW. I get loss of HD channels, starts with frozen screen, switch channels it may unfreeze or the screen goes grey and stays that way till you reboot. I have been losing recordings. Seems to affect HD channels mostly, all of them remain grey but if I tune to channels below 99 it works.
I've been following this thread for a long time hoping a solution was forth coming but haven't seen a post here for a couple of days. I hope it's just a mater of waiting on the 11b software fix roll out.


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## TLD

I just noticed my software has been upgraded to 11.b. I hope this wasn't the expected fix because I still have the problem. This morning, no CNN HD, it's grey. My other HD channels, the picture freezes and stays that way till I tune away and back. Here in LA, TW HD channels go from 402 to 470. At anytime a few or several of these go grey. Restarting may or may not bring them back....for a while.


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## jrm01

ifly said:


> 1. Live TV starts to break up and stutter, this has got progressively worse and is across both tuners. Restarts and reboots provide minimal help for minimal time before the problem occurs again! It eventually brings on the BSOD (Black Screen of Death) that requires a channel change to get rid of or if the box totally freezes another reboot!!!


Have you checked signal strength on DVR Diagnostics screen when you have these problems, including RS Corrected and Uncorrected?


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## RoyK

As I said above 11.0b seems to have fixed the problem where the TiVo doesn't think that the cablecard is present and gives gray screen on all channels. However now it suffers from the gray screen on analog channels syndrome

What a POS!


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## ifly

jrm01 said:


> Have you checked signal strength on DVR Diagnostics screen when you have these problems, including RS Corrected and Uncorrected?


Yes,

I get a very nice 36dB. 0 RS Corrected, 0 Uncorrected. That is on both tuners BTW.

Signal level fluctuates between 95 and 100 which it has done since I got the box but TIVO thinks that is a Cable Co. issue. Already ran a frequency analyzer on the HD 256 QAM constellations and power levels are within a +/-2% which is perfectly tolerable for QAM tuners and that is over a 24 hour cycle which would include temperature variances on outside plant devices of 40 Farenheit.

Hope that answers the question.


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## phelps123

My HD updated to 11b version on 2/28 and ran great until I got the black screen for analog channels on 3/4. And it has happened again today 3/6. Seems better, but still not right.


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## ssbxfire

phelps123 said:


> My HD updated to 11b version on 2/28 and ran great until I got the black screen for analog channels on 3/4. And it has happened again today 3/6. Seems better, but still not right.


yep, my TivoHD is at the 11b version and it just went into the grey screen mode.

I don't have digital cable service, so no cablecards in my box.

Another thing I notice, when we switch channels on the Tivo, the channel changes but there is a delay with a grey screen before the picture and sound comes on. Looks like the Tivo is just not acquiring the signal very fast.


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## rwross

I'm glad I found this thread. Add me to the list.

I have two TiVo HDs, one exhibiting the problem one not. The problematic TiVo has been through 4 CableCards and continues to freeze, drop picture, and reboot.

TiVo is sending me a replacement unit now, but after reading this thread, I'm not sure it's worth my effort to set it up. I find it quite troubling that the tech folks I spoke to were unaware of the impending patch release.

I assume this patch is NOT 11b. If it is, then the patch is clearly not working. In fact, I think my problems began with 11b since, IIRC 11.0 has been out for some time.

anyone have any update? And...any suggestions on how to get an official TiVo response?


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## HerronScott

ssbxfire said:


> yep, my TivoHD is at the 11b version and it just went into the grey screen mode.
> 
> I don't have digital cable service, so no cablecards in my box.
> 
> Another thing I notice, when we switch channels on the Tivo, the channel changes but there is a delay with a grey screen before the picture and sound comes on. Looks like the Tivo is just not acquiring the signal very fast.


OK, my brother's TiVoHD just did this same thing with an unmodified unit without cablecards. Appeared to be recording 2 suggestions but one channel was pixellating/blocking badly before going to grey screens on both channels. Unit had to be rebooted to recover.

My recommendation of TiVo isn't looking very good since he had to go through 3 refurbished units to get a working one to begin with and now this problem. Not sure what to tell him since we had 2 Series 1 units since 2000 and then upgraded to 2 Series 3 units a little over 2 years ago and none have had issues.

Scott


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## msdonnelly

rwross said:


> I'm glad I found this thread. Add me to the list.
> 
> In fact, I think my problems began with 11b since, IIRC 11.0 has been out for some time.


I have to agree. Until my HD received the full 11b update I never had problems with it. Now I lose analog channels about once a day. Worst part is I'm working late this week so, even if I check in the morning, it has hours to fail again and lose shows before I get home.


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## rwross

FWIW I talked with some techs from my local cable company and they mentioned that TiVo engineers admitted they had a problem with the 11b software.

Not sure how to get to someone within TiVo to find out when the 11c or its equivalent will be dropped.

I've had to remove my CableCard because the channels drop randomly and usually at the worst time.


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## speedy99

rwross said:


> I've had to remove my CableCard because the channels drop randomly and usually at the worst time.


I had the problem with Analog cable channels (no cable card). After adding a CableCard (single mCard), and the 11b software update (on the same day) I've been rock solid since - though I have not yet started recording HD channels, just happy to be out of the doghouse with reliable SD recording working.

If you do have a Cable Card, you might go through guided setup again after getting the Cable Card initialized and 11b updated. I had a bunch of analog and manually scanned channels, so I essentially started over with the Cable Card/11b combination, and only use CableCard channels. This might be enough to "clear" the unit and avoid the Analog Cable channels/issues.

My understanding is that 11b does *not* fix the grey screen problem for Analog Cable tuning, only for CableCard tuning. For under $2/month, the mCard from Comcast (Northern California) was worth it for me. (See numerous other threads here about using Cable Cards with "Basic cable" (non-digital) service if all you want is Local HD channels/Unencrypted QAM. It can be done.)

YMMV.


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## BWA

So wait, will getting a CableCard help resolve the Analog cable channel problem? 

I just got my TivoHD yesterday, got the service update, and have had grey screen four times already. 
Really really annoying. 
Makes the Tivo kinda useless right now.

I didn't bother getting a CableCard since I only have "basic" (analog) cable.


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## bkdtv

BWA said:


> So wait, will getting a CableCard help resolve the Analog cable channel problem?
> 
> I just got my TivoHD yesterday, got the service update, and have had grey screen four times already.
> Really really annoying.
> Makes the Tivo kinda useless right now.
> 
> I didn't bother getting a CableCard since I only have "basic" (analog) cable.


On most (not all) cable systems, you get digital versions of the analog channels whenever you install a CableCard. Cable companies refer to this as Analog Digital Simulcast (ADS). Most TivoHD users with CableCards do not have any analog channels, hence do not have a problem with the loss of analog tuners. There's an easy way for a CableCard user to check whether their system has ADS -- tune to a low-numbered channel and check the System Information -> DVR Diagnostics screen. It will tell you whether the channel is analog or digital.

People who experience this problem (loss of analog tuners) on a regular basis tend to be basic cable subscribers, without CableCards, that do the majority of their recording from analog channels, with relatively infrequent recording from QAM and ATSC (OTA) channels.

People with basic cable (without a CableCard) who do a lot of recording from ATSC or QAM channels tend not to see this issue much. That's because tuning to a digital channel restores the analog tuners. If your analog tuners went out mid-day, but your box was scheduled to record a digital channel at 8pm, then that would restore the analog tuners for a [analog] channel at 9pm.

For existing TivoHD users with basic cable, there is a trick to greatly minimize the loss of analog tuners. First, disable Suggestions under Settings -> Recording -> TiVo Suggestions. Then create two repeating (daily), one-minute manual recordings on different ATSC or QAM channels (i.e. one on each tuner) at some point before scheduled recordings on analog channels. This is done to put the TiVo's tuners on digital channels, because (a) the analog tuners will never "go out" when the TiVo is tuned to digital channels, and (b) if the analog tuners are out, tuning to a digital channel will restore them. The analog tuners appear to "go out" after they are tuned to an analog channel for 8-12 hours, but if your TiVo is tuned to digital channels most of the time, this rarely happens.

According to customer support, TiVo is still working to eliminate this problem. Once TiVo addresses this issue in a software update -- hopefully in the near future -- such "tricks" will be unnecessary.


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## Bryan Lyle

Add me to the list. My HD Tivo keeps losing channels (analog and digital). Comcast is coming out on Monday (again) to take a look.


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## NigelTufnel

I too am having this problem and am happy to see a thread for it. I'm looking a grey screen at the moment and in frustration I started googling to get to the bottom of this.

I have a tivo S3, 2 cablecards, on Time Warner Cable NYC. I get grey screens intermittently for many channels, both live and recorded. I just now did a soft (menu) reboot and it did not solve the problem. This has been happening for a couple months at least. Other posters say it is tied to a firmware update, and that sounds right to me. It did seem to start happening after an update a while back.

For what it's worth these are Scientific Atlantic cablecards, OS Build 2.3.149.3 May 10, 2006. Both show a SNR of 35.


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## Jeanesco

Is tivo's quality assurance team taking an extended leave of absence or something?


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## Rick-s

I wish I had read this thread 1st. I purchased a refurb tivoHD on the 5th. Then on the 6th I saw this thread. When I got my tivo on the 9th, I got it hooked up (No cable cards yet per the instructions) all tied into the network etc... Everything seemed fine at this stage even recorded a show. Yesterday morning when I woke up, went down, turned on the TV and the screen was frozen with an image from the evening news. Changed the channels and all I got was a black screen. 

Reset the Tivo (soft reset) and the channels came back. This was short lived though. After about 1 hour of usage, again the channels were gone. 

Called Tivo tech support. The person ran me through a hard reset, check of my software version (which was at 9.4?) and said I needed the Vr 11 update. I mentioned I had read of people having loss of channels under that and she said it was only in some areas. Anyway, she said I should get the update through a forced call and advised me to keep my network disconnected once I got it.

Got the update, disconnected the network, re-connected the cable and the channels were there. Watched for maybe and hour all good so far. Setup my season passes and when I'm done... Guess what?? All gone again. 

Called Tivo tech support again who tells me since I didn't plug my network in, they cannot confirm I have the new software. Again hard reset, but plug the network back in. If I have the freeze problem again, call back.

Of course it happened again , Called back, Was told that 11c is being rolled out and that it will (supposedly) fix the issues at hand. However, she did issue an RMA for me to swap the box out just in case there is a hardware issue. 

Now, they started my service on the 6th (the day they shipped the Tivo) I will be without it for up to 10 business days (per the rep). How is it that I have to pay for over two weeks of service without having the device associated with the service?? 

When I do finally get it back, hopefully 11c will be in full release, will have fixed the issues, and I'll get it soon after connecting... Or am I living in never never land


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## gilbreen

Want to add me as another one having this issue. I called Tivo support today and before I could really finish explaining the issue, the CSR said that they have been getting alot of calls about the issue and that the "engineers are working on a software update to resolve the issue." He also stated that a possible way to resolve the issue was to do exactly what bkdtv stated in this same thread above (set up a short daily recording on both digital tuners). The CSR concluded stating that I just have to wait until the software update is sent out.

I am on 11.0b but it looks like 11.0c will not resolve it either.

The strange thing is that I haven't missed any analog channel recordings that we have set up - you just can't watch analog channels live without a reboot.


----------



## tally

bkdtv said:


> For existing TivoHD users with basic cable, there is a trick to greatly minimize the loss of analog tuners.Create two repeating (daily), one-minute manual recordings on different ATSC or QAM channels (i.e. one on each tuner) at some point before scheduled recordings on analog channels.


Thank you for this advice! I was having to reboot 2 or 3 times a week and since doing this I have not had to do it once. Doesn't solve the root cause but I can live with the workaround.


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## eusswad

Add me to the list. Get a grey screen 3-4 times a week. Called support today and did some troubleshooting. Mostly looking at Cablecard stats (have a Motorola M-card). No fault found and no solution either. Was asked to call back next time it happens ?!?!


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## mlcarson

I've had the gray screen issue once or twice in the past and it was fixed by a simple reboot. 11.c just hit my receiver this morning and this afternoon all channels went gray.

On both analog/digital channels it says: Searching for signal on Cable In.
If I try to look at cable strength, it says: Signal strength is unavailable because your cable channel lineup has no digital channels.

Cable card test channel option shows "No channels available".

I pulled the cable card out and reinstalled and it did discover it. While it was uninstalled -- the analog stations did come in and went out as soon as the cable card was plugged back in. Cable card screens seem to show a valid status. Recordings do not record anything in this state (to be expected I guess). I can play back previous recordings though. The same cable when plugged into the TV shows both analog and the free qam stations.

I called Comcast -- they did their card update/reset or whatever they can do and it didn't seem to make any difference. Unplugged power and restarted yet again after they were done and it's still broken.

Any similar experiences with 11.c or is the software update just a coincidence. My cable card is a Motorola M-card from Comcast. So, should I schedule a comcast visit or is this a Tivo issue?

[edit] Called comcast back -- they did more things which actually broke my cable card's V 0x0 status and then they said there was nothing more they could do and will be sending a tech out on Wed AM to replace the cable card. I've yanked the card out now to at least get the analog stations. I dread Wed's visit since the techs had a hard time getting the first cable card working on a known good Tivo.


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## TLD

After not having this problem for several weeks, all of a sudden it's back. Using two cable cards from TW in LA. Tried to tune in the Dodgers game tonight on CH 413 and got the grey screen. I could tune up to some working channels, and others were grey. If I tune directly to 413, it's still grey. I rebooted the Tivo and it was still grey but after switching the channel down to 412 and then back after a second 413 came in. This as before only seems to affect the HD channels. I had really hoped this was fixed and am disappointed to see it return.


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## pyk133

Ever since TWC Lower Manhattan started broadcasting its new HD channel lineup, my Tivo HD has been toast. This was a couple months ago (TWC Upper Manhattan has had these HD channels for a while). I don't know if the two events are related. Prior to that, I had my Tivo HD for over a year with no problems. There were only a handful of HD channels available so I was looking forward to the release of all the new HD channels. 

I have swapped out my Tivo HD with a brand new one as well as got TWC to replace the cablecard. Same things happen, which are:
1. screen freezes to gray screen, no audio
2. randomly reboots
3. in standby mode, eventually goes into a screeching audio, gray screen (this happened once when I was on vacation and my neighbor had to come over and unplug everything)

1 and 2 above happen randomly, when I'm watching live TV, recorded shows, etc... no pattern whatsoever.

Again, the above have all happened with my old Tivo HD and a brand new replacement Tivo Hd with a brand new cablecard.

Is this a known bug in Tivo? Anyone know if there was a Tivo software upgrade to the Tivo HD a few months ago which may coincide with these problems? Considering I swapped out my Tivo's and cablecards to no avail, it has to be something common to Tivo/TWC and not particular to the end equipment. I am thinking Tivo is incompatible with TWC Lower Manhattan. Any others with Tivo HD working here? Thanks.


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## Avatar26

For those who are getting a gray/black screen but are still able to see guide/banners (no "channel temporarily unavailable" or other error messages):

Wait 30 seconds and try fast forwarding.
For some reason, this worked when I had the issue.


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## z_fisherww

First, THANKS to those who posted fixes to the problem with Tivo HD losing analog channels. You would think Tivo would have an FAQ on that, but I haven't seen anything.

I have a Tivo HD with two cablecards under Suddenlink cable. My unit was freezing every couple of weeks, usually after being on analog channels for 24 hours or more. Re-start always fixed it, but still annoying. I followed the advice to schedule two simultaneous digital channels (I chose two music channels) and no problem since.

Question: I see that 11.0c (11.0c-01-2-652) is now installed. Does that seem to fix the problem? I'm hesitant to take off my two recordings and then miss something because the problem came back.


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## ajpierce

Im having problems switching channels and getting a black screen too with a SA M card and tivo hd. My problems started about two weeks ago. Before that everything was running great for months. 

If i keep changing channels back and forth eventually the channel will come in but having to babysit my recordings kind of defeats the purpose of having a tivo. Ive called Tivo tech support twice and neither of them had any idea about this problem and they both said it wasnt a known issue according to their list of known issues. I didnt expect them to actually fix my problem but I figured it was worth a try.

Ive had comcast out and they find minor issues with the signal in some bands and they are going to rerun some of the cabling outside but I have other tvs with SA cable boxes (non tivo) without any issues at all so I doubt its cabling. All the cabling in my house is new.

If this problem isnt resolved soon ill take my losses and ditch tivo for good. I cant continue to support a company that cant get their act together. They need to spend less time finding ways to shove ads and useless features in our faces and spend more time fixing bugs.


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## bkdtv

Are these analog channels? If you tune to the DVR Diagnostics screen (under System Information), do you see them as digital channels with a signal strength value?

Analog channels are not listed with a signal strength.


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## ajpierce

They are digital channels. In DVR Diagnostics when tuned to a black channel the affected tuner will show no information at all. All of it is blank. When the channel comes in all of the values are listed like normal including signal strength. It happens on both tuners and often at the same time.


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## lstorey

I know that the upgrade helped me somewhat. every now and then when I turn the tv on, the picture is frozen but now I can hit the channel up/down and it starts working. 

I'm not sure how it is affecting something that is recording (if it is or not). so I'll be watching it to see


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## erikrh

I'm been having the same problem since I got 11.c. I have to reboot once or twice a night. I am with Comcast in the SF Bay Area, California. I have had my S3 for a couple years with two cable cards installed. I have a MyDVR 500bg external drive. No problems until a couple months ago.

Usually, it happens with HD channels. Sometimes I can go to channels under 500 and those work. Sometimes ALL (HD & non-HD) channels are "unavailable" with a black screen. 

I have noticed that sometimes when I come home late, and two HD channels are recording, one channel will be okay, but the second is black. Then once recording is over and I change channels, then ALL HD channels are black. I am having to supplement my season passes by purchasing individual shows from iTunes on my Appletv.

I keep hoping that, like other minor issues in the past, the TIVO will release a new software update and the problem will miraculously go away. This is getting really frustrating and expensive.


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## bkdtv

If you are experiencing this problem, be sure to sign up at *TiVo Field Trials site*. Use the same username that you use on TiVo Community. TiVo picks people -- some randomly and some not -- to test fixes for issues like this. If you're picked, you could see a fix a month or more before it is available to everyone else.

After you sign up, call TiVo and make sure they know you are experiencing this problem. If TiVo asks for an email over the phone, make sure you give them the same email you used to sign up on the Field Trials site.


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## acitrano

I just got my new HD XL on Monday. I have a single Motorola M-Card configured / authorized properly. Service is Verizon FIOS. 

I had signal that was "too strong" (some blocky channels) and attenuated it down.. Now my SNR goes from 32-33dB (was 37-38, I think) and signal strength (formerly 100) is now ranging between 68-81. Anyway, the attenuation has appeared to take care of the blocky/pixelated channel issue.

Three times now I have gotten a gray screen while watching live TV and the entire box freezes up - locked tight as a drum and totally unresponsive to any remote input. Thus, I am forced to do a hard reboot (unplug, re-plug power.) 

Once the TiVo goes through its three-minute reboot dog and pony show process, all the channels are back and working fine again... any ideas are welcome. 

I am assuming this is a signal issue? If so, it's a bit maddening that TiVo can't design its software to more gracefully deal with the issue, considering the variables across so many cable systems.


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## bkdtv

acitrano said:


> I just got my new HD XL on Monday. I have a single Motorola M-Card configured / authorized properly. Service is Verizon FIOS.


Does your TiVo have the 11.0 software yet?

The original 8.1.7 software had some issues with Motorola CableCards which were addressed with an update back in 2007. Many new TiVos still ship with the 8.1.7 software.


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## acitrano

bkdtv said:


> Does your TiVo have the 11.0 software yet?
> 
> The original 8.1.7 software had some issues with Motorola CableCards which were addressed with an update back in 2007. Many new TiVos still ship with the 8.1.7 software.


Yup, it's updated to the latest software. Thanks, though...


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## acitrano

And two random re-boots today. I have now *removed* the attenuation and let's see how we do from there. Frustrating.


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## mstnggt66

This just started happening to me (TiVo HD, TWC Northeast Ohio, SDV, 11,0c). I have had no problems up until this week. Happened yesterday, a reboot fixed it. Happened this morning and a reboot did not fix it. Infact, a reboot made it worse since I couldn't tune any analog channels. Only a few higher number HD channels tuned in. I'll see what happens when I get home but I see a phone call to TiVo and then to TWC in my future.


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## acitrano

Just to keep everyone updated - the device is now basically in constant re-boot mode. Once in a great while it'll work for a few minutes - tune, play recordings, etc. - but a reboot is always just a minute or two away.

Frustrating. Crappy quality control and inelegant software. To TiVo's credit they have shipped me a new box and a return label for the broken one. Should be here in a day or two.


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## SFBuff

HD is basically unusable on Tivo (my non-Tivo HD feed is fine though). Very frustrating....


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## dig_duggler

This seems to have happened to my Dad twice in the last 5 days (I was there for one of them). All screens go black (not grey) and all channels go out (not just analog). Reboot resolves it. Two s cards, Tivo HD, no expander.


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## 911medic

I am in a similar boat with one of my TiVo HDs. It is connected to basic analog cable (no cards) and OTA. Several times lately I turn on the TV to find the picture frozen on an analog channel. Analog channels won't tune in, but the OTA digitals will. A soft reboot fixes the problem. My TiVos both have the 11c software.


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## clzander

Just adding to the growing list of frustrated Tivo HD customers. Recurring locked image/black screen on analog cable. As we had no problems with our Series2, I opened a ticket with Tivo the 2nd time the black screen occurred. The first person said it sounded similar to a cable card problem they knew about, but seemed new. The second said it must be a poor signal issue and I had to try a signal amp. That made the otherwise fine picture worse, so the third call was just to updat my case to say the suggested fix doesn't work--as I'm unwilling to watch a bad picture on the chance it will keep the Tivo operational. The fourth person acknowledged this known problem, which I'd already figured out after looking through this forum. She stated they wouldn't replace our <30day Tivo HD because they know it's a software problem and not a hardware issue. 

As has probably been said already, I wish I knew about this problem (seeming to go back to December) before we spent the money to upgrade. Asking for some sort of credit for their failing to provide service, I was told that because I purchased a lifetime subscription I'm just out of luck until they fix it or I return the system. I'm really tempted to return it and buy it back when they finally fix the problem, but don't want to go through that headache either (since it worked for a couple weeks, I'd already recycled the box) if it's a "simple" software fix. While I don't like beating my head against the wall, I'm thinking of calling them each time it fails so they get frustrated as well, but suppose that will just have my ticket flagged and have the support agents blowing me off.


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## lstorey

sometimes I wonder about the tech people....I told them when I called tonight that it has to be a software issue because that is what it was before....don't think he believed me until he looked through the known issues.

and of course I am out of "warranty" - 90 days....hello, shouldn't your product work longer than 90 days? and of course I bought the lifetime not knowing this would be an issue and I don't want a refurbed unit when I bought a new one not even 8 months ago. This shouldn't be a problem and they aren't doing much to keep existing customers happy if we continue to have issues with the screen freezing.


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## Finney

Here's my log of issues so far. Wish I would have started writing them down as soon as they started.

TiVo HD Series3 History
Model # TCD652160

Unit 1: 6520001804AEB76 - Service Case #10525812
Purchased: 04/23/2008 - $698.99 (included Product Lifetime Service)

&#8226;	Multiple (but sporadic) freeze ups (& Gray Screen) were undocumented before we realized there was a true issue.
&#8226;	Oct 2008 &#8211; Called TiVo service and learned that this was an issue with multiple TiVo units and that engineering was working on a solution. We agreed to let engineering do &#8216;Advanced Logging&#8217; on our unit.
&#8226;	Sporadic freeze (& Gray Screen) ups continued through the end of the year.
&#8226;	Began documentation
&#8226;	Unit Locked up (& Gray Screen) and we Rebooted:	
o	Jan 2, 2009
o	Jan 9
o	Jan 18 &#8211; Called TiVo 3rd time
o	Jan 19 or 20 (around midnight)
o	Jan 21
o	Jan 22
o	Out of town last week of Jan
o	Jan 30 (when we returned)
o	Feb 1
o	Feb 2 (while watching a show)
o	Feb 8
o	Out of town 3rd week of Feb
o	Feb 21 (when we returned)
o	Feb 23
o	Mar 2
o	Mar 7 &#8211; Called TiVo 
o	Mar 9
o	Mar 19 (while watching a show)
o	Mar 28
o	April 3
o	Out of town 2nd week of April
o	April 10 (when we returned)
o	April 12
o	April 13 Called TiVo Service, talked with Austin.

April 13 (arranged exchange of unit) (RMA #TV-4018569)
&#8226;	April 19 - Connected Unit 2: 652001180579F29
&#8226;	Unit would not run long enough without rebooting or freezing up to run &#8216;Guided Setup&#8217;.
&#8226;	April 19 - Called TiVo Service &#8211; Service Case #11400125, talked with Tammy. 
April 19 (arranged exchange of unit) (RMA #TV-4019192)
&#8226;	April 28 &#8211; Connected Unit 3: 5620021802FA910 - Service Case #11531877
&#8226;	Unit would not load system data &#8211; called
&#8226;	April 30 &#8211; System data finally loaded
&#8226;	Unit Locked up (& Gray Screen) and we Rebooted:
o	May 3 
o	May 4 &#8211; called TiVo
o	May 8
o	May 10
o	May 18

&#8226;	May 21 &#8211; Move Unit 3 to new TV and connected to ($200+) Power Conditioner
&#8226;	Unit Locked up (& Gray Screen) and we Rebooted:
o	May 23
o	May 31 - called TiVo, told them I had purchased and installed a $200+ power conditioner and moved TiVo to a different location because one of the last CS reps had said that could help.
o	June 10 &#8211; called TiVo. We were told to put TiVo in &#8216;stand by&#8217; mode when not in use. Started doing &#8216;stand by&#8217; this date.
o	Out of town 3rd week of June. TiVo in &#8216;stand by&#8217; while gone.
o	June 19 (when we returned)
o	July 1 (while watching a show) &#8211; pressed button on remote and TiVo when to Gray Screen.
o	July 5 



Documentation as of July 5, 2009 &#8211; Problem ongoing


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## seattv

I have been suffering the same issues on analog tuning.

I've called TiVo several times. They've given me several of the suggestions that others have tried. Like others, it has not solved the issue.

I find it interesting that a soft reboot resolves the problem (reinitialize the tuners) yet they tend to point to signal strength (too good or too bad) as the main issue. Sounds like treating the symptom vs. treating the problem.

Has anyone successfully RMA'd their unit for another and resolved the issue (i.e. an actual hw issue) ?

Is there any official response/blog site for TiVo that listens to customers with issues?


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## lessd

seattv said:


> I have been suffering the same issues on analog tuning.
> 
> I've called TiVo several times. They've given me several of the suggestions that others have tried. Like others, it has not solved the issue.
> 
> I find it interesting that a soft reboot resolves the problem (reinitialize the tuners) yet they tend to point to signal strength (too good or too bad) as the main issue. Sounds like treating the symptom vs. treating the problem.
> 
> Has anyone successfully RMA'd their unit for another and resolved the issue (i.e. an actual hw issue) ?
> 
> Is there any official response/blog site for TiVo that listens to customers with issues?


I had this problem once (about 6 months ago) on one TiVo Series 3 (with cable cards), my wife went nuts at the time because she missed a program, I re-booted the TiVo and it never happened again, so far.
This is the blog TiVo reads, I know of no better one for that purpose


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## bkdtv

seattv said:


> Has anyone successfully RMA'd their unit for another and resolved the issue (i.e. an actual hw issue) ?
> 
> Is there any official response/blog site for TiVo that listens to customers with issues?


TiVo is aware of the issue they just don't have a fix at this time. It is a software issue introduced with 11.0. It may be a bug in the driver itself or it may be a bug in the drivers provided by third parties (ex: Broadcom).

If you want to use a TivoHD, and have it work reliability, you need to use it with SD/HD channels from an antenna or SD/HD channels from digital cable. The TivoHD is not a reliable DVR for basic/analog cable; if you want to use basic cable right now, you should look at a different DVR. Analog support on the TivoHD will probably be fixed eventually, but it doesn't look like that is going to happen anytime soon, because users already report the same problem under the upcoming 11.0d software.

If TiVo could simply roll back to an earlier version of a driver, I'm sure they would have done so by now. There must be something significant that is stopping them from doing that. The 11.0 software introduced MPEG-4 and VC1 support for Netflix and Amazon HD; at this point, TiVo can't really roll back to a driver that disables Netflix and Amazon HD just to support the smaller number of customers with basic cable.


----------



## dlfl

bkdtv said:


> TiVo is aware of the issue they just don't have a fix at this time. It is a software issue introduced with 11.0. It may be a bug in the driver itself or it may be a bug in the drivers provided by third parties (ex: Broadcom).
> 
> If you want to use a TivoHD, and have it work reliability, you need to use it with SD/HD channels from an antenna or SD/HD channels from digital cable. The TivoHD is not a reliable DVR for basic/analog cable; if you want to use basic cable right now, you should look at a different DVR. Analog support on the TivoHD will probably be fixed eventually, but it doesn't look like that is going to happen anytime soon, because users already report the same problem under the upcoming 11.0d software.
> ........


This is really getting confusing. There is also the "Green Screen/Siren" lock up that apparently affects primariliy HD's *with* cable cards. In those cases the TiVo is locked up and has to be restarted.

For the current thread, is the problem a lock up or just lost of signal? Is there a theory that signal strength triggers the problem? I've had an HD for five weeks now (11.0c) and (except for one lockup) it works fine on just analog cable (and a few QAM digital channels). I do have 6 dB of attenuation in, and for two of the QAM channels the signal strength/SNR numbers are 75/33 and 81/34, which is in the "sweet spot" from what I've read.

Based on your post and the green screen thread I don't see where there's *any* combination that will be reliable, with or without cable cards.


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## bkdtv

dlfl said:


> Based on your post and the green screen thread I don't see where there's *any* combination that will be reliable, with or without cable cards.


The "green screen" only affects a small minority of TivoHD users, probably no more than 1% or 2%. I would guess that it is an interoperability issue with a cable provider that uses specific configuration of software and hardware (and firmware on their hardware).

The "loss of analog tuner" issue affects everyone with basic/analog cable and anyone else that relies on analog channels.


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## dlfl

bkdtv said:


> ..........The "loss of analog tuner" issue affects everyone with basic/analog cable and anyone else that relies on analog channels.


Really, literally *everyone* ? So although I haven't seen it in five weeks, it is eventually going to happen? (As mentioned I had one lock up. I don't consider one lock up in 5 weeks a _major_ problem. I can't remember whether that was before I installed 6 dB attenuation.)


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## lessd

bkdtv said:


> The "green screen" only affects a small minority of TivoHD users, probably no more than 1% or 2%. I would guess that it is an interoperability issue with a cable provider that uses specific configuration of software and hardware (and firmware on their hardware).
> 
> The "loss of analog tuner" issue affects everyone with basic/analog cable and anyone else that relies on analog channels.


I have one Series 3 (for over two years) on cable without cable cards and never had a problem with the analog signal, so I am the second person that has not had any analog problems ?


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## seattv

bkdtv said:


> TiVo is aware of the issue they just don't have a fix at this time. It is a software issue introduced with 11.0. It may be a bug in the driver itself or it may be a bug in the drivers provided by third parties (ex: Broadcom).
> 
> If you want to use a TivoHD, and have it work reliability, you need to use it with SD/HD channels from an antenna or SD/HD channels from digital cable. The TivoHD is not a reliable DVR for basic/analog cable; if you want to use basic cable right now, you should look at a different DVR. Analog support on the TivoHD will probably be fixed eventually, but it doesn't look like that is going to happen anytime soon, because users already report the same problem under the upcoming 11.0d software.
> 
> If TiVo could simply roll back to an earlier version of a driver, I'm sure they would have done so by now. There must be something significant that is stopping them from doing that. The 11.0 software introduced MPEG-4 and VC1 support for Netflix and Amazon HD; at this point, TiVo can't really roll back to a driver that disables Netflix and Amazon HD just to support the smaller number of customers with basic cable.


Thanks for the information.

One note -- I've seen posts from other users who experience the same symptom with CableCard and HD streams as well. While the actual root cause might be different, the error signatures are the same. Gray screen. Freeze. No way to get the TiVo to retune except via reboot. This does not appear to be an analog-only issue based on review of forums posts.

Agreed that you can't rollback a firmware/driver. But it would be nice to know that this is a known bug in their QA bug database... especially if others see this problem on analog as well as digital tuning streams.

edit: just saw your 03-19-2009, 02:51 PM post on this thread.


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## BobbyWDC

It depends on where you are and what service you're getting. For example, I have a cablecard from Comcast, and am getting digital channels. But only above 100. Comcast's policy in my area (Washington, DC) is to continue to provide channels below 100 as analog, and offer channels above as digital. The freeze/grayscreen issue happened to me, over and over, on the tuner that was on an analog channel, until I exchanged the box for a replacement. Now, so far (4-1/2 days and counting), I'm not having it at all.
But my point is that having a cablecard does not mean that all your channels are coming in as digital. It depends on your service.


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## bkdtv

lessd said:


> I have one Series 3 (for over two years) on cable without cable cards and never had a problem with the analog signal, so I am the second person that has not had any analog problems ?


Looks that way.  Do you not use OTA or QAM?

People who use OTA or QAM tend to see this problem far more rarely than those that use analog only. Tuning OTA or QAM seems to reset a tuner in some way so the problem doesn't occur with the same frequency, if at all. The more you use OTA or QAM, the less likely you are to see the analog tuners fail.

Reports since 11.0c also suggest this problem affects those with the TivoHD far more often than those with the original TiVo Series3.


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## lessd

bkdtv said:


> Looks that way.  Do you not use OTA or QAM?
> 
> People who use OTA or QAM tend to see this problem far more rarely than those that use analog only. Tuning OTA or QAM seems to reset a tuner in some way so the problem doesn't occur with the same frequency, if at all. The more you use OTA or QAM, the less likely you are to see the analog tuners fail.
> 
> Reports since 11.0c also suggest this problem affects those with the TivoHD far more often than those with the original TiVo Series3.


On the TiVo Series 3 without cable cards I do not use QAM channels, only analog, one great thing is you can Xfer a HD program into that TiVo and watch in full HD if wanted. 
My Comcast system has all the analog non HD channels on both a digital feed and analog feed, now that there is no analog broadcast the conversion that Comcast does on the analog channels over scans the TV by a lot. I record all my programs in HD (or digital if HD is not available) but other in my home use the analog so they can keep a large amount of programing (over 1300 hr at basic) on a 1Tb drive. (Don't ask my why)


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## FixItPete

Yup. Add another person with the Gray Screen problem

Cablevision
Channels 2-23 work fine.
Channels 131 plus a couple other PBS channels work.

Nothing else. Everything else is Gray. 

I have done a hard reboot (pull plug) and a soft reboot. I've also reinitialized the card (or whatever the 30-50 minute ordeal of finding channels and all is called -- Channel 27 is Discovery and NO I can't see it!)

Anyway... what do I do?


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## CrispyCritter

FixItPete said:


> Yup. Add another person with the Gray Screen problem
> 
> Cablevision
> Channels 2-23 work fine.
> Channels 131 plus a couple other PBS channels work.
> 
> Nothing else. Everything else is Gray.
> 
> I have done a hard reboot (pull plug) and a soft reboot. I've also reinitialized the card (or whatever the 30-50 minute ordeal of finding channels and all is called -- Channel 27 is Discovery and NO I can't see it!)
> 
> Anyway... what do I do?


No, you do not have "the Gray screen problem". I don't want to belittle your problem at all, but this thread is about losing all channels to gray screen, not about some channels not working. Any advice to you won't fit the rest of the discussion here or fit the people who really have the analog channel based gray screen problem. If you repeat your post/problem in a new thread, you're likely to get advice more directed towards your problem.


----------



## FixItPete

Hahahahahaah I called Tivo and opened a ticket. NOW my ENTIRE screen is gray! I'm working remotely so I'm doing everything via my SlingBox. So basically... I'm screwed. 

Do you think Power On / Power Off will help? What the heck?

Naturally Tivo wanted to blame the M Card and said there is nothing wrong on their end. LOL.


----------



## FixItPete

Thanks. I've started a new thread. Wish me luck.


----------



## Jeanesco

I have a tivohd that I haven't even activated yet because this bug basically makes it worthless.


----------



## HD4me2

My TivoHD with S/W 11.0D lost all analog cable channels today - gray screen. All OTA antenna channels are OK.

But this box has *no cable cards*, just TWC (San Diego) basic and extended cable. Did not check the QAM digital channels, these are turned off in the channel list.

Three TV's and three DVR's did not lose these channels.

Reset from the settings menu fixed it.

Two week old Tivo, what the heck is going on here !


----------



## ozbone

It is beyond ridiculous that this issue is till with us. Is TiVo paying any attention to this ?!


----------



## aimshaman

what really pissed me off, i called tivo first and their tech had no clue what was happening and then told me since it was out of warranty, i would have to pay buy a new tivo HD and then PAY to transfer my lifetime service. as someone thats owned multiple tivos since 2000, tivo is starting to get really indifferent to their customers. i no longer give good word of mouth to people about tivo, all i can honestly say at this point to people, is that tivo has a great interface, but customer service and hardware support are horrible and they shouldnt buy one.

my story:

i bought a HD XL in december, zero problems for 6 months with my tivo and cablecard and then last week i started getting the grey screen. a reboot will fix it for a few hours then boom, it blows up again..

some thoughts

-its been hotter than ever in the room where the tivo is located, 80 degrees is not uncommon.


-why now after 6 months of flawless work


----------



## Jeanesco

Not certain yet but I think this might be due to an HDCP issue relating to having your TV turned off with an HDMI cable connected with certain TV's, and the "fix" tivo applied in an earlier patch works only for cablecard users. I'll post more info as I get it.


----------



## sbourgeo

Dunno, this happens with component cables for me...


----------



## longball07

Just got my Tivo HD, hooked it up Monday night. Shipped with version 9.4xx and everything worked fine. (no CC, cable company is coming on friday 8/7/09). Yesterday it updated to version 11.0d and since then I have turned on the tv to a gray/black screen (This has happened twice in two days). I can change the channel and the only channels that come in are Antenna, no analog cable at all. A reboot fixes the problem. People started reporting this in January, I can't believe Tivo still hasn't fixed this?


----------



## Ziggy86

Took Tivo about a year to fix the FiOS pixellation issue.


----------



## longball07

So you are saying that they haven't put out a fix for this yet, so I will have to reboot my tivo HD about every week? that sucks!


----------



## KungFuCow

longball07 said:


> So you are saying that they haven't put out a fix for this yet, so I will have to reboot my tivo HD about every week? that sucks!


If youre only rebooting once a week, youre doing great. This is happening to me about 3 times a day and I agree with you, its mindblowing this hasnt been fixed. Worse yet, Tivo's attitude is "suck it up and deal with it."

Im stuck with my unit. Best Buy wont take it back. I guess its my own fault for not making the unit take the update sooner because it worked great with the shipping version of the software. I had some network issues and didnt bother trying to get the box on the network after the initial guide download until the guide data ran out.

I've PM'd one of the Tivo guys on the forum asking for some insight as to when the problem would be addressed and was told basically "deal with it." I called Tivo and talked to one of the reps and was told "deal with it." I paid a lot of money for this device. I paid for a year of service up front.. I dont think its expecting too much for this thing to work the way its supposed to. Tivo seems to think otherwise.

Tivo gets a :down: for customer service.


----------



## longball07

That sounds like a good way for Tivo to approach this problem. So does everyone experience this problem with analog channels or just some?


----------



## Jeanesco

Well recently I hacked my tivohd (prom mod) applied a few patches to tivoapp, and a bunch of other stuff that I do to any other hacked tivo. I then used that setup to start playing with different settings in MFS for various purposes.

The problem seems to have gone away for me after doing all of this, but I am not quite sure why it has gone away. At least, my tivo has been running for just over a week now with no problems, which is much longer than it has ever done, so the problem may still exist but I can't tell for certain yet.

Reason I am posting this is because earlier I said I'd post as soon as I got more info, but now I am unable to reproduce the problem anymore. 

There could be any number of things that caused it. First of all, I am using a kernel that wasn't even compiled by tivo and contains several changes over a normal tivo kernel. Second of all, the patches to tivoapp have changed a number of things, like disabling video encryption, disabling the copy control flags, and enabling tivo backdoor mode. Any one of these things, or a component of one of these things, could be the cause of the problem and since its disabled, so is the problem. Either that, or it somehow delays the onset of this problem.

Either way, I'll follow up if the problem shows up again.


----------



## aimshaman

HDMI huh? ok, ill unplug the XBOX and see if i get better results, i must admit, im pretty pissed that after paying for monthly service for 2 tivos for 7 years, i finally get the HD with lifetime service, and i cant record my shows.


----------



## Jeanesco

aimshaman said:


> HDMI huh? ok, ill unplug the XBOX and see if i get better results, i must admit, im pretty pissed that after paying for monthly service for 2 tivos for 7 years, i finally get the HD with lifetime service, and i cant record my shows.


It may not be HDMI related. Just looking at the logs seemed to indicate it was due to some HDMI errors that showed up when the grey screen did, and some other HDCP handshake error would always show up when I had an HDMI cable connected but my TV was turned off, so I was guessing the two were related. Was going to try to test that by doing some different things in a hacked setup, but I can't reproduce the error anymore since hacking my tivo.

It's as if hacking it just fixed the problem, but I am not going to endorse doing that because I don't know for sure, nor am I going to systematically undo all of the hacks I did and let it run for up to a week each day each time I undo one just to find out (tivo should fix their own problems, this shouldn't be up to me.) However if the problem shows up again I'll investigate further to fix it for myself, and if I find out what exactly would fix it, I'll post it here.


----------



## allenj

I just got a new TivoHD, activated it and went thru setup. The cable cards are being installed tomorrow.

Reading this thread makes me nervous. If I'm reading correctly, the problem only happens on analog channels.
If I'm on FIOS, which is all digital, does this mean it won't affect me?

TIA

aj


----------



## emily220

I, too, have been having this problem for a few months now. I, too, do not have digital cable.

I understand that these problems coincided with an upgrade for people who DO have digital and HD channels. However, I, too, am a paying customer and deserve to have a product that works correctly. Before I purchased my TiVo HD, I did a lot of research and asked a lot of questions, including: _I don't have digital cable or HD channels, will this unit still work for me?_ The answers I found online and the I received from TiVo and Best Buy were all _Yes! You'll just have more space to record non-HD channels_

While I don't expect TiVo to undo the enhancements for HD users, I do expect them to uphold their service agreement and make my TiVo work. Especially since I was assured that this unit would work with my current TV channel set-up.

I'm in an MBA program and my marketing class did a case on TiVo earlier this year. In a class of about 50, 40 people didn't even know TiVo was still an existing company. At the time, I was shocked -- I loved my TiVo. Now I see that they are becoming irrelevant and losing to the cable companies...it's going to happen quicker as they chase away their paying customers, as well. I've gone from a TiVo advocate to someone who would probably NOT recommend buying a TiVo.

There are multiple cases where people take this sort of customer service story to YouTube, Twitter, Facebook, etc. It usually gets the company's attention....


----------



## neonzebra

Well, this gray screen problem has mostly gone away for me, but I've had other problems with my cable service (comcast) ranging from degraded picture quality to completely incompetent technical support.

I've finally given up and I just switched to DirecTV HD service over the weekend. Their DVR is not too bad (though I miss the TiVo interface terribly). Off to call TiVo and cancel my subscription. 

I'll be back when TiVo's rumored DirecTV DVR becomes available.

In the meanwhile, so long and thanks for all the fish!


----------



## tshort

Note the 3rd bullet under #4.

I can't put in a link!

"If the problem channel is an analog antenna channel, you may be seeing an issue that we are trying to track and resolve. Please contact TiVo customer support."


----------



## tshort

Here is the link.

http://support.tivo.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/1196


----------



## KungFuCow

tshort said:


> Note the 3rd bullet under #4.
> 
> I can't put in a link!
> 
> "If the problem channel is an analog antenna channel, you may be seeing an issue that we are trying to track and resolve. Please contact TiVo customer support."


No point in contacting them. They know about it. They just arent in too big a hurry to fix it. I talked to someone at Tivo Support and he knew right what I was refering to and told me "Oh yea.. the techs think they have figured out whats causing it and are working on a fix." I guess 6 more months from now, we'll see said fix.

Wish I woulda bought a Moxi.


----------



## innocentfreak

KungFuCow said:


> No point in contacting them. They know about it.


This is where I would disagree. The more people that report a problem I would imagine the more quickly it gets looked at. For example if only 1 person reports a problem I doubt it would get looked into. If a 1000 people report the issue, they are more likely to look into an issue. This is how it works with most companies.


----------



## sbourgeo

This has happened three days in a row.  If I didn't know better, I'd think Comcast was sabotaging me so I'll break down and get cablecards.


----------



## lstorey

this is still happening to me and it is getting worse. it used to happen about once a week and I could move the channels up and down and get it to work. now I have to reboot.

this past week it has happened 2 or 3 times. 

I got the new HD for Christmas, have analog and not digital and it has been an issue ever since I bought this box. If I could do it over again I would get a series 2 with the Roku box for my netflix. however, I have a lifetime on this box (boy, didn't see this problem coming otherwise I would have continued on a yearly plan!) and don't want to lose that OR downgrade and lose the money and probably end up with a refurbed box and not a new one.


----------



## lstorey

oh and I wish they had an online/email where you could report problems instead of calling and then having to give them your name, address, phone and email. seriously they shouldn't need all of that info to pull up your account so you can report a problem!

but I'm sure the reason why they don't have an email/online reporting system is because it would be bombarded!


----------



## Grumock

lstorey said:


> oh and I wish they had an online/email where you could report problems instead of calling and then having to give them your name, address, phone and email.  seriously they shouldn't need all of that info to pull up your account so you can report a problem!
> 
> but I'm sure the reason why they don't have an email/online reporting system is because it would be bombarded!


they ask you all that stuff for security reasons. I know that may sound lame, but there are people out there who will call in & act like they are someone else, my guess is because they have nothing better to do.


----------



## lstorey

Grumock said:


> they ask you all that stuff for security reasons. I know that may sound lame, but there are people out there who will call in & act like they are someone else, my guess is because they have nothing better to do.


I do realize that it is for security purposes...however, come up with a better way to verify such as a password or something...but ALL of my account information is way overboard...or cut out the email address. something


----------



## shonsu

I've been having this issue off and on for most of this year (~6 months) and thought I just had my Tivo about to go belly up on me. To add to the misery, it would decide to not record season pass shows from time to time also. Tonight I finally figured out that it was because the signal was lost when it went to record. And sure enough, LiveTV was a nice blank screen. I too have the 11.0d software version and this is about to get old when the new fall season gets into full swing and you start missing shows. I've had to download a few that were "missed" from Amazon.com at $1.99 ($2.11 with tax)....perhaps that's the whole issue??? A new revenue stream? Don't record because we've killed your analog/HD channel and now you have to get it via NetFlix or Amazon.com downloads.... hmmmmmm


----------



## mjcarpino

I just started having this problem on a HD Tivo that I've had without a problem for over a year. My only signal is OTA with antenna - all digital channels. As described above, a restart resolves the problem - until the next dropout. 

I see discussion has been dormat since September. Is there another forum for this problem? Anyone know where Tivo support is on this issue?


----------



## bkdtv

mjcarpino said:


> I just started having this problem on a HD Tivo that I've had without a problem for over a year. My only signal is OTA with antenna - all digital channels. As described above, a restart resolves the problem - until the next dropout.
> 
> I see discussion has been dormat since September. Is there another forum for this problem? Anyone know where Tivo support is on this issue?


The gray screen issue discussed in this thread only applies to analog channels.

If you're seeing a gray screen with digital channels, then your internal or external hard drive is likely failing. When the TiVo can't write the buffer to the hard drive due to excessive disk errors, you get a gray screen. As a quick test, open the Signal strength screen (under Settings -> Channels) and see whether that restores the picture. If that restores the picture, then you can be 100% certain it's a drive problem. The signal strength screen temporarily disables the drive buffer and bypasses the disk.

If you have an external drive, that is the most likely culprit. If you only have an internal drive, then that is the culprit. See *Drive Expansion and Drive Upgrade FAQ* for instructions on replacing / upgrading an internal drive. For a limited time, you can get a compatible 1TB drive for $60.


----------



## mjcarpino

bkdtv said:


> The gray screen issue discussed in this thread only applies to analog channels.
> 
> If you're seeing a gray screen with digital channels, then your internal or external hard drive is likely failing. When the TiVo can't write the buffer to the hard drive due to excessive disk errors, you get a gray screen. As a quick test, open the Signal strength screen (under Settings -> Channels) and see whether that restores the picture. If that restores the picture, then you can be 100% certain it's a drive problem. The signal strength screen temporarily disables the drive buffer and bypasses the disk.
> 
> ==============================================
> Signal strength screen is still grey and signal strenth is zero/null. From what I've read in previous posts is that the input signal doesn't seem to make a difference. Cable cards, basic cable, analog, etc.


----------



## bkdtv

mjcarpino said:


> Signal strength screen is still grey and signal strenth is zero/null. From what I've read in previous posts is that the input signal doesn't seem to make a difference. Cable cards, basic cable, analog, etc.


These issues are well known and very specific. Every post to this thread was made by someone who had: (a) a cable system with analog channels, (c) no authorization on their CableCards, or (b) digital cable with SDV adapter. When a SDV adapter resets -- which appears to be a problem on some cable systems -- the TiVo temporarily loses those digital channels.

There are only five known issues that could cause a gray screen on OTA channels: (1) inadequate reception -- check the System Information -> DVR Diagnostics screen for signal strength, (2) an amplified signal that is too strong for the TiVo to handle at times, typically A/V dropouts and large variations in signal strength and SNR on the DVR Diagnostics screen, (3) a failing hard drive, or (4) a Tribune channel map with wrong frequency information for a channel. _[Edit: If a broadcaster misconfigured their channel parameters, that can also cause similar problems, but that's a extremely rare and would only affect one channel.]_

If a broadcaster changes its RF frequency --- to move from say 48 to 11 -- and Tribune (TiVo's guide data provider) has not yet updated its channel maps with that change, then you'll get a gray screen on that channel because the TiVo is tuning a RF channel that no longer exists. When this happens, you lose the ability to tune that specific channel with guide data until Tribune updates its lineup with the correct frequency; as a temporary solution, you can run a channel scan to add the correct frequency to the guide as a separate channel.

Since you say that you've had this issue on and off for a year, that suggests to me a reception issue. Are you using an amplifier, and have you tried the TiVo without it? What kind of antenna are you using? Did you buy/install a UHF antenna? Some people lost stable reception on some channels in the past year because they installed UHF antenna and certain channels moved to VHF frequencies with the analog shutoff.

If you're using a splitter, you might also replace that. When using a splitter, make sure any unused connections are terminated. Unterminated connections can cause interference and/or reception problems in some cases.


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## Carp

Sorry I wasn't clear in my original post. 

I've had these 2 HD Tivo's since Sep 2008. Neither of them demonstrated the problem until last week. Last week, one of the two Tivo's started to get the grey screen and when it occurs, it is on ALL channels. As of now, the other Tivo has not seen this problem. It seems to be occurring about once/day. If I go to the signal strength function, all channels have the grey screen and all channels show a signal strength of zero.

So far, the only way to get a picture back is to restart the Tivo. Both Tivo's are receiving the OTA signal from the same 2-way splitter. I switched the output leg of the splitter between the Tivo's and the problem remains with the same Tivo. The signal strength on most channels is good to excellent - 70's to high 90's.

I have a pre-amp at the antenna (UHF/VHF), no other amplifier as I mentioned, since the signal strengths are more than adequate.

In my humble insight, it appears something is causing the tuner to get wacked (technical term), and needs to be reset. 

How can this not be a Tivo hardware/software problem??


----------



## Carp

I did't realize my old user ID "Carp" still was active. For my original post, I registered as "mjcarpino". Sorry for the confusion!


----------



## CrispyCritter

Carp said:


> In my humble insight, it appears something is causing the tuner to get wacked (technical term), and needs to be reset.
> 
> How can this not be a Tivo hardware/software problem??


I don't think bkdtv was saying it isn't. If it is a hardware problem, he's suggesting it's a failed disk. I agree that a failed disk can cause your symptoms and is almost certainly your culprit but I'm only 99% convinced that a hardware tuner problem can't be the issue. The important difference is that you can replace disks yourself, but a tuner problem means replacing the TiVo itself.

The major point is that your problem is not the problem being addressed by most of the folks in this thread - gray screens when tuned to analog channels. That particular problem is a TiVo issue that hopefully can be addressed in software (possibly working around hardware issues, possibly just fixing software bugs being invoked by hardware issues.) Your problem is pretty definitely either a signal problem or a hardware problem as bkdtv laid out; it's not going to be fixed by TiVo software.

You have two OTA tuners in your TiVo. Do they go out separately, or is it always the case that when one goes out, the other goes out? If both always stop working at once, then it's probably not a tuner issue (and it's more evidence that it's not a signal issue), which leaves your disk.


----------



## bkdtv

I would note that problems with tuner hardware are extremely rare. A TiVo might ship with a defective tuner, but assuming it's not defective and works out-of-the-box, it will be one of the last things in the TiVo to fail.

If there is a TiVo hardware problem, it is most likely the hard drive, as I indicated in the previous post. Hard drives typically last no more than 3-5 years in a TiVo, and some don't make it that far. As a result, most TiVos (and other DVRs) start to develop the problems you describe every 3-5 years. Thankfully, it's a relatively simple process to replace the drive. This week, you can get a 1TB drive replacement from Frys for $60.

Other possibilities include corroded splitters, preamps (or failing preamp power supplies), and other outdoor equipment, or cuts in the coax made by rodents/squirrels/birds. Any of those can cause unreliable reception. As unlikely as that those may seem, all are probably 100x more likely than a failed tuner in a TiVo.


----------



## pcurthoys

Hey all, I've had this problem for almost a year now, but a fix I picked up from either this thread or elsewhere in this forum means I've only had to restart my Tivo HD once in this time. I set up manual recordings that repeat nightly on both tuners simultaneously from 2am to 2:05am, and set it so not more than 1 episode is saved at a time. They both record on digital channels (for me, 2 flavors of HBO), and that prevents the tuners from getting left on the analog channels, like ABC or whatever, that cause the Grey Screen of Doom. Hope that helps.


----------



## dlfl

My TWC cable has Analog Digital Simulcast. I'm currently using CableCARDs and TA on my THD. However I'm thinking about removing the cards and reverting to analog cable signals, augmented by antenna OTA signals.

For about 5 weeks, before I got CableCARDs, I received analog cable signals only, and had no problems with gray screens.

Does this mean I'm probably never going to have this problem after I revert?


----------



## justen_m

Maybe not dlfl.

At about 930 this morning, it appeared that the analog tuner on my TivoHD died. Grey screen for all analog cable channels _and_ analog OTA channels (I still pick up a few low-power non-digital OTA stations). Digital OTA worked fine, both HD and SD. No cable cards. I verified my signal was fine, and localized the problem to my TivoHD analog tuner. My S2DT was still working fine from the same signal sources (well, analog cable).

A simple restart, as mentioned very early in this thread, fixed the problem. I should have just restarted the TivoHD as soon as I saw a problem before spending 30 minutes diagnosing it, but I was recording digital OTA stuff on one tuner at the time and didn't want to interrupt.


----------



## dlfl

justen_m said:


> Maybe not dlfl.
> ........


OK, thanks. I'd settle for "hardly ever" instead of "never". 

How long have you been running your setup since the last time this happened?


----------



## justen_m

dlfl said:


> OK, thanks. I'd settle for "hardly ever" instead of "never".
> How long have you been running your setup since the last time this happened?


It is the first time it happened, but I've only had my TivoHD about 2 months. Not much statistical data, sorry. Just thought I'd mention that it happened, but was easily fixed. I do know, based on have a couple of suggestions being recording simultaneously on analog channels that both tuners were on analog channels when the tuner went haywire. I just didn't notice the problem until later when I had one tuner on a digital channel and tried to switch to live tv on the other, which was on an analog channel.

An somewhat interesting thing to note, of unknown if any relevance, is that both tuners were on analog channels but neither were recording when the tuner flaked out. All my analog recordings were fine.


----------



## arex

I'm on my second TivoHD (under warranty), after the first one konked out with a bad drive. Yesterday, I got the dreaded grey screen on all channels (both analog and digital). I only have basic basic cable without cable cards.

I'd previously experienced the analog tuner drop out on the original unit that was replaced, where changing to a digital channel would cure the problem. This time, however, I got the grey screen on both analog and digital channels and swapping tuners or switching between analog and digital channels made no difference. At first I thought it was a lost signal issue, but I was able to tune the channels just fine on the TV itself. 

I then tried going into DVR Diagnostics but the unit then hung at the "please wait" screen. I waited several minutes and it never went to the diagnostics screen so I did a hard reset by unplugging the unit. After that, all was good. 

bkdtv suggested on the previous page that grey screens on digital channels might be indicative of a failing hard drive. Since it froze before getting into DVR Diagnostics, I didn't get a chance to bypass the hard drive by going to the signal strength meter to see if the drive is the culprit, but if it happens again I will certainly try that. Anyone else think this might be another bad disk?

Thanks!


----------



## megory

I got my first grey screen on my new HDTiVo, soon after WiFi connecting other S2 Dual Tivo for MultiRoom Viewing. 

Both TiVos are direct-connected to cable, no cable cards. The Vizio HD is HDMI connected to HD Tivo. 11+ Software. BrightHouse St Pbg (Tampa).

I fiddled, changed channels, and rewound to beginning of cache. There was a picture there. Curious, I pressed record. Thereafter, I was able to see the screen, FF and saw most. Then it recurred.

When I play the recording today, it is viewable on both TVs.

Has any explanation as to cause come up, and/or is there any preventive action?


----------



## bkdtv

megory said:


> Has any explanation as to cause come up, and/or is there any preventive action?


The gray screen issues on analog cable are well established. See the "Known Issues" post linked in my signature, and stickied to the top of the forum.


----------



## pl1

I started having these same problems, with losing the pairing of my cableCARD, and getting a gray screen on auth channels only. It all started while streaming Netflix, which locked up my TiVo and caused it to reboot.

Now, if I reboot, I can view the authorized channels for a while, but once I start changing channels (after about 10 channel changes), I get a gray screen after losing auth again. 

If I get Comcast to send a refresh, things settle down for a week or so. So, does anyone know if this might be a sign of a bad hard drive? Or a bad cableCARD? or a bad TiVo? 

I have a second S3 with no cableCARDs which I am prepared to test by swapping the cableCARD out. But, before I go to through that nightmare (including changing all of my season passes), if someone has any ideas, I'm all ears.

Additional thoughts: This may in fact be a hard drive issue. I noticed recently that when listening to some music channels, there is a stuttering. And the picture some times takes a long time to come up. I noticed this most recently last night after deleting a few programs. After the cableCARD issue was fixed, I still noticed some stuttering. I recorded a three hour hockey game after that. Tonight, the music channel has no stuttering and the picture is normal. So, it is possible it is the hard drive. It is not exactly an old hard drive, but, it is still possible.


----------



## RoyK

megory said:


> I got my first grey screen on my new HDTiVo, soon after WiFi connecting other S2 Dual Tivo for MultiRoom Viewing.
> 
> Both TiVos are direct-connected to cable, no cable cards. The Vizio HD is HDMI connected to HD Tivo. 11+ Software. BrightHouse St Pbg (Tampa).
> 
> I fiddled, changed channels, and rewound to beginning of cache. There was a picture there. Curious, I pressed record. Thereafter, I was able to see the screen, FF and saw most. Then it recurred.
> 
> When I play the recording today, it is viewable on both TVs.
> 
> Has any explanation as to cause come up, and/or is there any preventive action?


As bkdtv said the gray screen on analog channels is well established. Its been well established for over a year and after that time I, for one, have given up hope that TiVo will ever fix it.

For me it's a show stopper bug. I have cable cards but my cable company is among the MANY that kept analog for their basic channels so even with cable cards we have had MANY lost recordings due to this issue.

That this issue can be known for this long and allowed to continue without being fixed is a disgrace. The bug wasn't present prior to the latest software version being released so it is obvious that it isn't something that can't be fixed.

TiVo just doesn't seem to give a damn.


----------



## RoyK

The TivoHD failed to record 2 more analog programs this morning. Fortunately my S2 (which IS reliable) got them both.


----------



## lew

An increasing number of cable systems are converting to 100% digital. Not the answer people want to hear but tivo's motivation to allocate resources to this issue is probably decreasing.


----------



## RoyK

lew said:


> An increasing number of cable systems are converting to 100% digital. Not the answer people want to hear but tivo's motivation to allocate resources to this issue is probably decreasing.


With this kind of support I'll rush right out and buy their next product....NOT!


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## pl1

I think I might have found a reason that I was getting a grey screen and losing my cableCARD auth. I only use one cableCARD (which means a single tuner) in my original S3. I found that I had scheduled two manual recordings that start at the same time, every day, on the same channel. My guess is that TiVo was trying to address this conflict and possibly succeeding in selecting a tuner that was not active. That is just a guess, but it is the one thing I noticed that was set up incorrectly.

EDIT: Turns out it was a bad hard drive. The hard drive was only 5 months old, a WD Green drive. I tried to do a clear and delete, and it went in to a reboot loop. I wiped it and put on a fresh image, same thing. I put in an older 500g drive, and it works fine.


----------



## RoyK

Another recording lost today to the gray screen issue. That brings the count to over FIFTY lost since the last software update. What a piece of crap!


----------



## sbourgeo

I lost SNL last night too. Not a big loss, but still shouldn't have happened.


----------



## RoyK

It never ceases to amaze me how some can shrug off having things they pay good money for -- much less pay even more money to use -- fail to do what it is designed to do, what it is advertised to do, and what they bought it to do.


----------



## pl1

RoyK said:


> It never ceases to amaze me how some can shrug off having things they pay good money for -- much less pay even more money to use -- fail to do what it is designed to do, what it is advertised to do, and what they bought it to do.


Do you believe this is a problem with all THDs? My new THD is not exhibiting any of these issues. It is functioning perfectly as far as I can tell.


----------



## RoyK

pl1 said:


> Do you believe this is a problem with all THDs? My new THD is not exhibiting any of these issues. It is functioning perfectly as far as I can tell.


No, not all THDs on all cable systems manifest the bug. But enough do and enough have complained that TiVo has recognized it as a bug. They just have not done anything about it and it appears after a year that they are not intending to. Which might tell you what you can expect if/when a bug hits that does affect you.


----------



## pl1

RoyK said:


> No, not all THDs on all cable systems manifest the bug. But enough do and enough have complained that TiVo has recognized it as a bug. They just have not done anything about it and it appears after a year that they are not intending to. Which might tell you what you can expect if/when a bug hits that does affect you.


I do know what you mean, though. I had one unit that had a bad audio problem on one channel, Fox News. If I backed up 8 seconds, the audio was fine. TiVo replaced the unit and the replacement did the same thing. It turns out it was something wrong with the station. Yet it did not affect one of my other units. So, sometimes it is a combination of the particular cable signal and a particular TiVo. That doesn't help your situation, but you "could' try fooling around with signal strengths. (Something tells me you've already been down that road.  )


----------



## RoyK

pl1 said:


> I do know what you mean, though. I had one unit that had a bad audio problem on one channel, Fox News. If I backed up 8 seconds, the audio was fine. TiVo replaced the unit and the replacement did the same thing. It turns out it was something wrong with the station. Yet it did not affect one of my other units. So, sometimes it is a combination of the particular cable signal and a particular TiVo. That doesn't help your situation, but you "could' try fooling around with signal strengths. (Something tells me you've already been down that road.  )


I refuse to accept the argument that there is something wrong with a signal that no other device (including other dvrs, televisions, vcrs and a HTPC with dual analog/digital tuners) has the least problem with. If there is something unique in the signal everyone else in the world seems to be able to handle it just fine.

Oh, and yes - I've definitely been down that road.


----------



## RoyK

Today my TiVoHD failed to record a program due to the gray screen issue for the 55th time since version 11.0 of the software released. TIVO FIX YOUR DAMNED SOFTWARE!


----------



## Zaphod

I've had this issue for a while and just discovered it's a known issue by searching the forums. There seem to be several threads on it but this thread seems to be the most current.

I wanted to share the information Ive been able to discern about my thoughts pointing to a potential cause. I dont have an idea of the exact cause, but it seems to be related to when theTivo changes between the cable tuner and the ATSC tuner to record shows from season passes. I record a particular show from 4 to 5 PM. Then from 5 to 6:30 PM I record the following: our local NBC affiliate stations news at 5 PM, the national NBC news at 5:30, and the local NBC affiliates news again at 6 PM. The local affiliates news I record from analog cable channels (its not in HD anyway) and the NBC national news I record from the ATSC tuner since its in HD, but its the ATSC channel of the same local NBC affiliate I record the local news from on the cable cannel.

I had this issue for several months when I first got this Tivo HD. At some point last year I decided I didnt need to watch the national news in HD (takes up too much recording space for just the news) and changed it to record from the analog cable channel of the same station (the same analog cable channel the 5 and 6 PM news is from). About 3 months ago, for no reason I can remember, I suddenly realized I hadnt seen the gray screen issue in a LONG time. I wondered then if it might have to do with the recording the national news on the cable vs. ATSC (not the specific show, just the combination of having some shows recording on cable and some recording on ATSC, vs. having everything recording on cable, I have a previous Tivo HD with a cable card that I record most things on so this Tivo HD without cable card mostly just records this news stuff with the occasional one time recording of something else when I know I'm using both tuners on the other Tivo HD). So I changed my season pass for the NBC national news back to the ATSC HD channel. It was fine for several weeks, maybe even a full month, but sure enough one day I had this issue again. It happened again 2 or 3 times after that a few weeks apart. But within the last few weeks it seems to be happening at least once a week, sometimes twice a week.

Another thing that points me to the switching between the ATSC and cable tuner being the cause of this is the timing of when I THINK it happens. Ive never actually been watching it when it happens (I just come home from work, turn on the TV, and it's on the gray screen) so I cant be sure of exactly when it happens, but I can make a rough guess based on the recordings it makes up to a point, and when it starts missing recordings after the gray screen issue happens. These last few weeks when Ive seen it happen, I get my show from 4 to 5 PM. I cant remember for sure (Ill have to pay better attention the next few times) if I get my 5 PM local news. I get the 5:30 PM NBC news from the ATSC channel, but then I dont get the 6:00 PM news. (The red light is on the Tivo like its trying to record it, but it doesnt, it never appears in Now Playing.)

So the combination of it not happening when I record the NBC news on cable channel (i.e., ALL of my recordings are from analog cable channels), and the timing of when it seems to happen when I do record the NBC news from ATSC, seems to point me to something to do with when it has to switch tuners between the analog cable channels and ATSC tuner.

That is all PURELY a guess based on the evidence Ive been able to notice.


----------



## RoyK

Today my TiVoHD failed to record programs 56,57, & 58 due to the Gray Screen Issue.


----------



## RoyK

Lost programs 59 & 60 this afternoon. This time the gray screen is not going away when I switch to digital channels -- the digital channels are fine but going back to analog its still gray. Guess I'll have to reset.

All my 3 of my s2 boxes are fine on the same channels, one of them on a splitter with the HD!


----------



## mycltype-s

I had my comcast come out and replace the cable cards since one of the s cards died and would not get a signal. 

The new M-card worked for about 3 hours then the second tuner stopped working. I rebooted and the system came back online. But the second tuner died again after less that 24 hours. 

Called Tivo and they walked me through some info and decided to send me a new tivo. Since this one is only 3 days old. 

Reboots seems to bring the second tuner back for me.

When the Live TV button doesn't change the tuner I can hit record and it will stick to that channel and use the other tuner to watch tv. But I cannot flip back and forth. 

Seems to be a Tivo issue in my case.

By the way my tivo is a referb from the factory.


----------



## RoyK

Lost 2 more recordings to the gray screen issue today. That makes 62 and counting....


----------



## dave13077

RoyK said:


> Lost 2 more recordings to the gray screen issue today. That makes 62 and counting....


62, I think that equals the number of times you have posted about it. Congratulations you just made it to my ignore list!!


----------



## RoyK

dave13077 said:


> 62, I think that equals the number of times you have posted about it. Congratulations you just made it to my ignore list!!


I'll still be posting about it every time it happens if it gets to 1000. Sorry if that bothers you. Believe me - it bothers me a lot more.


----------



## TivoFan247

I apologize in advance if this subject has been run into the ground already but we're also having this same issue and would appreciate any advise / info.

We just recently received a replacement HD Tivo as our old one was fried with a power surge (even with surge protector). Having the same issue with a gray / screen with static and no channels coming up after the tv has been off for a while. It gives an error 'Your TV does not support digital rights management. Unplug the HDMI cable and use the composite cable included with your Tivo. ' At first we thought it might be a resolution conflict between the tivo and our Westinghouse 1080P HD tv, we tried all the different video settings available in the tivo without success. The only thing that fixes the issue is removing the HDMI cable and using a composite cable 

Here is the setup we are using...

Westinghouse 1080P HD tv
Digital HD Comcast connection with a Motorola Multi-stream cable card
HD Tivo box with Software Version 11.0d-01-2-652

I appreciate any help. We've had tivos since 2002 and have never experienced such an issue.


----------



## RoyK

Lost another recording to gray screen issue this morning. That makes 63 and counting...

TivoFan247 - the issue you are seeing is not the one most of the complaints in this thread refer to. You might want to start a new thread or search the threads for HDMI issues. Good luck!


----------



## CrispyCritter

TivoFan247 said:


> I apologize in advance if this subject has been run into the ground already but we're also having this same issue and would appreciate any advise / info.
> 
> We just recently received a replacement HD Tivo as our old one was fried with a power surge (even with surge protector). Having the same issue with a gray / screen with static and no channels coming up after the tv has been off for a while. It gives an error 'Your TV does not support digital rights management. Unplug the HDMI cable and use the composite cable included with your Tivo. ' At first we thought it might be a resolution conflict between the tivo and our Westinghouse 1080P HD tv, we tried all the different video settings available in the tivo without success. The only thing that fixes the issue is removing the HDMI cable and using a composite cable


Actually, your issue is an entirely different issue than the main one discussed here, so you might want to take the discussion to a new thread where it will get seen. There's so many things that could go wrong, and only a limited number of symptoms you can see!

You evidently have a bad HDMI interaction between the TV and the TiVo. Could be due to a loose or damaged cable, could be bad software on the Westinghouse TV (is it new?), could be a damaged interface on your TV (if it was affected by the power surge), could be bad hardware on your new TiVo.

Are you sure you need "composite" cables and not "component" cables? They are different.


----------



## RoyK

Just lost recording #65 to the gray screen.


----------



## wwazman

So has anyone started legal proceedings yet?


----------



## sbourgeo

This got me again yesterday. We were trying to record a program on a local access analog cable channel regarding our school budget problems and our TiVo HD let us down yet again.


----------



## KungFuCow

sbourgeo said:


> This got me again yesterday. We were trying to record a program on a local access analog cable channel regarding our school budget problems and our TiVo HD let us down yet again.


And Tivo doesnt give a crap. Theyve moved on to other projects. This is never going to be fixed.


----------



## Stormspace

KungFuCow said:


> And Tivo doesnt give a crap. Theyve moved on to other projects. This is never going to be fixed.


It's a shame that TiVo is charging people monthly for a product that doesn't always work as advertised. :down:


----------



## sbourgeo

KungFuCow said:


> And Tivo doesnt give a crap. Theyve moved on to other projects. This is never going to be fixed.


It sure isn't looking that way, is it?  I've been a loyal TiVo user for almost 10 years now, and this will be the last one I ever own if they never fix this issue.


----------



## comgenius1

Didnt read the whole thing, but thought I'd mention this. Tivo's are 1 way devices when it comes to cablecards. Is it possible the cable co is misconfiguring the cards as 2 way and are therefore dropping their activation after they dont check in after awhile?


----------



## RoyK

comgenius1 said:


> Didnt read the whole thing, but thought I'd mention this. Tivo's are 1 way devices when it comes to cablecards. Is it possible the cable co is misconfiguring the cards as 2 way and are therefore dropping their activation after they dont check in after awhile?


Read the whole thing.


----------



## sbourgeo

comgenius1 said:


> Didnt read the whole thing, but thought I'd mention this. Tivo's are 1 way devices when it comes to cablecards. Is it possible the cable co is misconfiguring the cards as 2 way and are therefore dropping their activation after they dont check in after awhile?


This happens to me without cablecards.


----------



## 2manycats

Three weeks ago my HD Tivo froze 44 minutes into my recording, pixelated and then froze. It's done that five times since, always with an HD channel. I was told by Tivo, like hundreds of others, that the signal was too strong. Called Comcast, they pretty much denied all. Blah blah blah. Now during the first five minutes of recording, I've gotten the dreaded gray screen. Trying to re-boot by unplugging, but I get nothing. I can only assume that the HDD is fried (26 months it worked.) I have an external expander with a lot of recordings on it. Is all lost? Is there any recovery? I've been a Tivo customer for MANY years, my original Tivo still functions. It's just SO sad. And seems like a LOT of people are having similar problems, which seems to indicate more than a coincidence. Any suggestions, and sorry if this has already been answered, but going through twenty some odd pages of threads is more than I can handle. Sob......


----------



## CrispyCritter

2manycats said:


> Three weeks ago my HD Tivo froze 44 minutes into my recording, pixelated and then froze. It's done that five times since, always with an HD channel. I was told by Tivo, like hundreds of others, that the signal was too strong. Called Comcast, they pretty much denied all. Blah blah blah. Now during the first five minutes of recording, I've gotten the dreaded gray screen. Trying to re-boot by unplugging, but I get nothing. I can only assume that the HDD is fried (26 months it worked.) I have an external expander with a lot of recordings on it. Is all lost? Is there any recovery? I've been a Tivo customer for MANY years, my original Tivo still functions. It's just SO sad. And seems like a LOT of people are having similar problems, which seems to indicate more than a coincidence. Any suggestions, and sorry if this has already been answered, but going through twenty some odd pages of threads is more than I can handle. Sob......


Your problem is different than the main problem of this thread (freezes on analog channels), so I wouldn't bother reading this thread. It sounds like you have a bad disk, either internal or external. There's a chance your programs can be resurrected, but it will cost you either much time and aggravation or much money, just to have that chance with nothing guaranteed.

Disks go bad - it's always happened with TiVos and it always will as long as they have disks. My calculation is that we should expect over 50 TiVo disks to die every day, given the number of TiVos out there.

Lots of other threads deal with replacing disks; it would be better to take your problem to one of those.


----------



## KungFuCow

I talked to Tivo yesterday about this. Here's the solution I was given:

"Buy a Premiere. It doesnt have the analog problems."

There you have it. Tivo isnt going to fix this unit. Dont hold your breath waiting for the fix.. you'll be holding it for a looooooooong time.


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## Adam1115

Wow, this has been outstanding since 12/08? UN believable.


----------



## sissy3

dave wasn't very nice, was he?

Anyway, isn't the whole point of forums is to aid someone?

Same problem. Not getting all our channel on HD and digital cable. We are thinking it's a signal problem, since our Cox Cable has been acting screwy with our TV and Computer.

Series 3, HD. Cable Card in the first slot.

I was wondering if we need a TV that is HD compatible? That means my husband can get a new flat screen?


----------



## megory

sissy3 said:


> dave wasn't very nice, was he?
> 
> Anyway, isn't the whole point of forums is to aid someone?
> 
> Same problem. Not getting all our channel on HD and digital cable. We are thinking it's a signal problem, since our Cox Cable has been acting screwy with our TV and Computer.
> 
> Series 3, HD. Cable Card in the first slot.
> 
> I was wondering if we need a TV that is HD compatible? That means my husband can get a new flat screen?


Re Dave . . . I figure ignoring someone is a person's choice, but saying "nyah nyah I'm ignoring you" is infantile . . . or pre-adolescent.

I'm concluding that TiVo stopped advancing 10 years ago (there are so many little annoyances that they should have taken care of years ago) and their policy is NOT to improve the product, just offer more, irrelevant stuff instead of making their product better. Oh well.

It used to be that every company made a VCR, some had more desireable features, or at least features that specific people liked better -- then they would buy that brand. DVRs are on a different path!

My lifetime is the best for now and perhaps an innovative company will come out with the improvements that work for me ( I LOVED my Sony TiVo, so someday, maybe they'll do it depending on the length of the patent). When that happens, I'll switch. Until then, I'll stick with my paid for TiVo. Eventually, I'll be too old to give a damn.


----------



## kevlarwk

My Series 3 HD is having similar issues with the Scientific Atlanta M-card. I received my unit 6 months ago and the tech paired up and authenticated the card in less than 15 minutes. My unit worked fine for 5 months then suddenly I noticed I was missing all the analog channels and almost all of the digital channels. I was only receiving 8 digital HD channels. I checked some of the screens and my M-card was no longer paired or authenticated. It also had a SubExpireTime date/time stamp in the past. A tech came out and finally got it working after 2 hours with a new card. 1 month later the problem returned. It took 3 visits to get a new card working again. Now, I&#8217;m afraid it&#8217;s a ticking time bomb and I will lose all my channels again on May 1st when the SubExpireTime passes. The reason why I expect the problem to come back is because within 1 day of the tech leaving my cable card screens showed the card going from Locked to Not Locked and a Status of Ready to Not Ready no CA Strm. I&#8217;ll post back in a month if my suspicions were correct. I also expect the channels to disappear if I restart the TiVo anytime between now and May 1st.


----------



## earlywagon

I am having the same problems on both of my HD TiVo's -Each time I was watching a program, did a delete, then back to watch regular TV --no picture or sound, changed channels, nothing -went to channel selection and chose several different non digital channels --nothing, did a restart, all appeared ok --this has happened to me several times on each HD machines in the past two weeks --have not seen this yet on the non hd machines. Cable tv without any boxes


----------



## LWORDELL

I have had similar problems of gray channels on my Series 3 Tivo with Comcast Motorola S cards. I think I have a possible solution. I found that my Tivo was having the gray channel problem every few days. It required a cold boot to get all my channels back. I moved my wireless Tivo network adapter that had been next to the series 3 to the shelf above behind my HD TV. Since then it has been working fine for 3 weeks. I belive the network adapter was interfering with the cable cards. Give it a try.


----------



## LWORDELL

I found the Tivo network adapter on my series 3 Tivo was interfering with my Comcast motorola s cards. I moved the network adapter from beside the Tivo to the shelf above the series 3 and it corrected the problem.


----------



## RoyK

LWORDELL said:


> I found the Tivo network adapter on my series 3 Tivo was interfering with my Comcast motorola s cards. I moved the network adapter from beside the Tivo to the shelf above the series 3 and it corrected the problem.


Nice thought but probably coincidence. No wireless here (wired) & have had the problem for over a year.


----------



## TiVoJerry

I posted the following on another thread:

Now that I'm in Field Trials I would like to recruit a few people from this thread to help with testing for grey screens on analog channels. We believe we've made progress on this issue but need additional testers to soak and evaluate the potential fixes.

To be clear, I'm looking for testers who have seen persistent grey screens (or black, depending on your letterbox color setting) on analog channels of their TiVo HD or TiVo HD XL DVR. The program will involve repetitive testing & close evaluation of video quality, with a strong emphasis on details when it comes to reporting issues. Reading through this thread, I know many of you already have the skills and patience for this kind of activity. 

I am not looking for you if;

you are only seeing grey/black screens momentarily (e.g. during channel changes or menu transitions)
you are seeing the "looking for signal" onscreen messaging (if the majority of you indeed see this messaging, please correct me)
you are using any platform other than the TiVo HD or TiVo HD XL (652 & 658 prefixes respectively)
you are using an unsupported external expander or modified internal hard drive (sorry, but unsupported configurations hamper investigations)
you are seeing grey screens on digital channels
* just because a channel is below 100 does not mean it's analog. The quickest way to tell is to tune to the channel and press the Record button. If the screen says "Record this showing in Best Quality", it's analog. If it does not mention "Best Quality", it's a digital channel.
So, if you fit the criteria above and would like to be considered for testing, please go to https://fieldtrials.tivo.com/login.html and create an account. If you already have an account, make sure all data (especially your TSN) are up to date. Once done, send me a Private Message on this forum with your username and TSN for consideration.

DISCLAIMER:

There will only be a small window of opportunity to send this info.

I do have a limit on the number of testers I will bring in, so I do not guarantee anyone a place in the testing program.
I do not guarantee anyone a place in the testing program. 
Once you're in the program, you are under NDA and can't post about your participation or experience in the program, even when it's over.


----------



## Kurt Saldutti

Gray screens, Video and Audio freezing, Audio stutter, Audio popping in-between commercials and programs breaks. I have tried two TIVO HD units from TIVO and the cable company has installed three tuner cards, swept the line they did everything on their end. Im done with this thing. Enough! I do not have anymore time to waste and missed recordings and interrupted programming and having to reboot several times a night. Its apparent there is a major HD unit problem and TIVO service just keeps telling us to just call back if it does it again. Thats all they have to offer. I told my wife I can not take anymore TIVO problems. I'm at the end of my ropes. They can have their box back for full credit and credit my subscription balance and Ill just rent the cable program providers DVR service. I have never seen such product and service insanity.


----------



## sbourgeo

Would love to help Jerry since I've been tracking this issue since 12/08, but unfortunately I am not using my original internal hard drive.


----------



## sbourgeo

I just got my first gray screen with 11g.  Lost, V, and Biggest Loser are all on tonight, so I was glad I caught it before prime time!


----------



## NCRaleigh

I have been having the same problem for a number of months. After numerous calls with Tivo support they acknowledged that this is a known problem with no date for a fix. I just cancelled my Tivo service and I am on my way to the cable company to pick up a DVR. After 5 years of loving Tivo, this is a sad day.


----------



## duffym

Got a new HD Tivo in early December...didn't figure out it was the TIVO causing the problem for almost a month, but I did call customer service. After talking to them 3 or 4 times, they did send me a new unit in February. Once I got that, I decided to try the trick of recording a digital OTA signal for 5 minutes every night, hoping that would keep it "unfrozen."

At first it seemed to work but, damn, back to getting frozen/gray(black) screens that can only be cleared by rebooting. I will say, though, that I am NOT getting the audio drop-outs on recordings that I had on the first unit.

So far haven't missed anything "important", but ...I can't really trust it, so have to double record "Lost" on my old Tivo 2, too, just in case!

Like everyone else, used to think this was such a great company & product, but no longer.


----------



## sbourgeo

Got me again last night.  At least it wasn't one day earlier when it could have cost me Lost and Biggest Loser recordings.


----------



## kkita_lv

I started to get this issue since Thursday May 19th. not sure if my Tivo HD got updated this week, but it's annoying.

Cox came out and checked the signal and it's at 92. Swapped cable cards, but it's still happening.


----------



## texasPI

Add me to the list. I'm a new Tivo customer, I ordered a refurb. HDXL and got it up and running three days ago. Today all of my analog channels were gray. Restarted the Tivo and all channels came back. I hope there is a fix for this, if not I'm sending my unit back under the Tivo 30 day satisfaction guarantee.

As awful as the cable DVR boxes are, they excel in the most important aspect...being able to watch your channel! :down:

ETA: My unit was shipped with old software and I force connected until it updated to the latest 11.? prior to having my M Card installed. No issues till today...


----------



## rem

hi,

i've been having problems ever since the sdv adapter has been installed. for the past few months, it's the problem of missing channels. i've been missing cable as well as over-the-air channels. i have to reboot both the s3 tivo and the sdv adapter to restore the missing channels. and then it happens a day or so later again. i don't know why this is happening. so i need to know if the problem comes from the cable cards, the sdv adapter, or my s3 tivo unit itself.

tonight, it recorded nothing but still says it's recording "24", the finale. i'm PISSED. i just need to know where to direct my anger. so has anyone ever figured out the responsible party?


----------



## texasPI

Woke up this morning to gray screens again. Someone earlier in the thread mentioned something about moving wireless network adapter. I'm gonna try that and see what happens. Wishful thinking perhaps but I have to try it or it'll gnaw at me...

EDIT: So, it seems like this issue only affects the HD, right? If I got a Premiere would I be better off? I know the Premiere has its own issues but none like this it seems. I just want a working solution. I'm in DVR no man's land right now. Canceled Directv a month ago and have tried cable DVR and now the Tivo HD. Honestly, the Directv DVR, while not as robust in features as the Tivo, was a reliable work horse. One thing I miss that the HD does not have is the live tv window in menus which I understand the Premiere does have.

Thoughts? I'm still within the 30 day return window for the HD.


----------



## ltxi

texasPI said:


> Woke up this morning to gray screens again. Someone earlier in the thread mentioned something about moving wireless network adapter. I'm gonna try that and see what happens. Wishful thinking perhaps but I have to try it or it'll gnaw at me...
> 
> EDIT: So, it seems like this issue only affects the HD, right? If I got a Premiere would I be better off? I know the Premiere has its own issues but none like this it seems. I just want a working solution. I'm in DVR no man's land right now. Canceled Directv a month ago and have tried cable DVR and now the Tivo HD. Honestly, the Directv DVR, while not as robust in features as the Tivo, was a reliable work horse. One thing I miss that the HD does not have is the live tv window in menus which I understand the Premiere does have.
> 
> Thoughts? I'm still within the 30 day return window for the HD.


As far as I know, this issue doesn't exist in the Premieres. I returned two late build HD units within two weeks for gray screen and reboot issues. While the last one was out for replacement I bought a PXL and have been happy with it.


----------



## ps56k

Happen to stumble across this thread reviewing CableCard issues....

Please include your Cable company - just so we have all the info..... 
Tivo box type, card type, and cable company carrier


----------



## primprincess

texasPI said:


> Add me to the list. I'm a new Tivo customer, I ordered a refurb. HDXL and got it up and running three days ago. Today all of my analog channels were gray. Restarted the Tivo and all channels came back. I hope there is a fix for this, if not I'm sending my unit back under the Tivo 30 day satisfaction guarantee.
> 
> As awful as the cable DVR boxes are, they excel in the most important aspect...being able to watch your channel! :down:
> 
> ETA: My unit was shipped with old software and I force connected until it updated to the latest 11.? prior to having my M Card installed. No issues till today...


can you clarify if you are having the issue with analog cable channels or with the cable card? if the cablecard is activated, your channels should be digital - not analog.


----------



## primprincess

RoyK said:


> As bkdtv said the gray screen on analog channels is well established. Its been well established for over a year and after that time I, for one, have given up hope that TiVo will ever fix it.
> 
> For me it's a show stopper bug. I have cable cards but my cable company is among the MANY that kept analog for their basic channels so even with cable cards we have had MANY lost recordings due to this issue.
> 
> That this issue can be known for this long and allowed to continue without being fixed is a disgrace. The bug wasn't present prior to the latest software version being released so it is obvious that it isn't something that can't be fixed.
> 
> TiVo just doesn't seem to give a damn.


if you are using cablecards and they are activated, all of your channels are digital, so the gray screen on analog channels issue is different from the issue you are experiencing


----------



## texasPI

primprincess said:


> can you clarify if you are having the issue with analog cable channels or with the cable card? if the cablecard is activated, your channels should be digital - not analog.


I'm sorry for not clarifying. Yes, I have an active cable card and what I mean by analog channels is that the channels in the analog tier of my package are messing up but as you mentioned they are digital when running through the cable card.


----------



## primprincess

texasPI said:


> I'm sorry for not clarifying. Yes, I have an active cable card and what I mean by analog channels is that the channels in the analog tier of my package are messing up but as you mentioned they are digital when running through the cable card.


are you using a tuning adapter for switched digital video? this would be a box from your cable company between the coax from the wall and your tivo, and would be connected to your tivo using a coaxial cable and a usb cable. if you are using a tuning adapter and only some of your channels go missing while others are still there, it may be a problem with the tuning adapter.

it's also possible you have a bad cablecard, although i would think if this were the case and it were losing activation or pairing, you would ONLY be able to see analog channels and not any others - instead of the other way around.

at any rate, if the cablecard IS indeed activated and paired, it's definitely NOT the gray screen on analog channels issue. I would not just rely on your cable company assuring you the card is activated either - I would check the card for myself. tivo menus will let you look at what the card's actual status is


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## fastep

texasPI said:


> Add me to the list. I'm a new Tivo customer, I ordered a refurb. HDXL and got it up and running three days ago. Today all of my analog channels were gray. Restarted the Tivo and all channels came back. I hope there is a fix for this, if not I'm sending my unit back under the Tivo 30 day satisfaction guarantee.
> 
> As awful as the cable DVR boxes are, they excel in the most important aspect...being able to watch your channel! :down:
> 
> ETA: My unit was shipped with old software and I force connected until it updated to the latest 11.? prior to having my M Card installed. No issues till today...


I also ordered the refurbed xl and I have had 3 shipped with the same problem.

Needless to say I'm throwing in the towel and getting my refund and will opt for cable co dvr.

I suggest everyone stay away from the refurbed xl's shipped directly from tivo. Very unstable (IMHO).


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## MJGunn

I bought and setup a tivo hd today, and have had to reset it 4 times already due to it losing my signal. From the other threads I'd read, I thought the cable card I have coming tuesday would fix this, but from what I'm reading in this thread I guess not?

We have digital cable through comcast, with 3 tvs in the house, 2 have cisco cable boxes, and mine, until this point, was using a s2 tivo (with no problems!) with just basic cable. I set the HD up this afternoon, and I have it set up with the digital stations and everything in the lineup since the appointment for the cable card is just 2 days away, though of course none of the digital/premium stations are coming through until it gets here. My question is, when the cable card is installed, since we have digital cable, will I be using the digital tuners exclusively, or are some of the channels still analog, therefore leaving me open to this problem?

Apologies because I'm sure this has been covered before but I'm having trouble nailing down a definitive answer amongst the 1000s of posts on this problem. Really disappointed in tivo at the moment, been a customer for more than 10 years and this is the first time they've let me down :down::down:


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## TiVoJerry

Not all providers are 100&#37; digital. If you are getting HD, you will usually have a digital alternative and can remove the analog version from your channel list to avoid this issue.


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## Stormspace

If you plan on keeping the s2 you might want to consider keeping the analog channels since the digital ones may be encumbered with copy protection that makes MRV unusable.

You may be on a system that doesn't use copy protection, and if so MRV will work fine for non HD channels.


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## yourbrokenoven

I just found this thread. I've had a TiVo HD for about a year. I predominantly watched HD channels on it, but have recently noticed that my analog channels go out after about 1 - 2 hours and the only remedy is to reset the tivo (which takes over 5 minutes!!)

No matter how many times I change the channels, whether i'm flipping through the grey screen or back and fourth from analog to digital, the channels will only come back on with a powercycle / reset.

Does anyone know of a fix?

Does anyone know of a fix?


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## DevdogAZ

Just purchased a TiVoHD and got it set up. I'm on analog-only service with Cox. I'm definitely seeing this issue where my tuners will stop getting a signal within a few hours after a reboot. Unless TiVoJerry can tell us that there is a fix coming very soon, I'm going to have to send my HD back to TiVo and go back to using my S1 Sony, which has been a workhorse for nearly a decade.


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## Phantom Gremlin

DevdogAZ said:


> Unless TiVoJerry can tell us that there is a fix coming very soon, I'm going to have to send my HD back to TiVo and go back to using my S1 Sony, which has been a workhorse for nearly a decade.


It's not clear exactly how expensive and encompassing your "analog-only" service is. The best decision for you will depend on the channels you want to receive.

Don't hold your breath awaiting a fix. This thread is 1 1/2 years old. IIRC someone mentioned that this problem is fixed in the TiVo Premiere. Is that an option for you? Also pay attention to TiVoJerry's suggestion above. Once you have digital cable you won't need to do any analog recordings. Around here, except for the $10/mo limited basic, the cost of expanded basic cable didn't really change once Comcast went "all digital". Maybe your area will go all digital soon.

Because of digital, I have 4 very active TiVo HDs and I don't see this problem. Ever. In my area even the $10/mo "analog-only" service has digital HD locals. I assume that also applies in your area, although the cable company will try to hide that information from you; but you probably want to DVR more than your local OTA channels.

TiVo has outsourced a lot of engineering. So that means they might not have someone around in house that they can ask to solve the problem. I keep posting the following; IMO it's the most likely explanation for why you don't have a fix:

_We have from time-to-time outsourced engineering work related to the design, development, and manufacturing of our products. We have and expect to in the future work with companies located in jurisdictions outside of the United States, including, but not limited to, Taiwan, India, Ukraine, United Kingdom, and Mexico._​
Do you think that Apu in Bangalore really cares about lockups on analog recordings? Or did the company he works for get the contract because they underbid everyone else? And is there even the possibility of his being asked to debug this issue? Certainly TiVo wouldn't bother drawing up a contract for just this problem. Maybe they have some outsourced engineers working on bug fixes in general. But then that would mean this particular problem would have to bubble up toward the top of an agreed upon list. Not likely, given that there is a viable workaround for many cable people. Plus, TiVo must be flogging the engineers to work on the festering problems with the Premiere (thus your problem with a discontinued product is probably much lower priority).

The above is my biased and uninformed speculation as to the inner workings of TiVo Inc.

In the meantime, TiVo has its top people working diligently on the problem. (Sorry, I just love that Far Side cartoon!)


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## BigJimOutlaw

A fix is (finally) apparently being worked on. They were looking for testers here a few months ago. I would say to hang tight as long as you can.

Keeping the tuners on digital channels as much as possible (i.e. when not in use) might help reduce the rate of failure until then. I had this problem before switching to fios, so I know how much it stinks.


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## dlfl

DevdogAZ said:


> Just purchased a TiVoHD and got it set up. I'm on analog-only service with Cox. I'm definitely seeing this issue where my tuners will stop getting a signal within a few hours after a reboot. Unless TiVoJerry can tell us that there is a fix coming very soon, I'm going to have to send my HD back to TiVo and go back to using my S1 Sony, which has been a workhorse for nearly a decade.





BigJimOutlaw said:


> A fix is (finally) apparently being worked on. They were looking for testers here a few months ago. I would say to hang tight as long as you can.........


Who knows when, if ever, the fix will come? Return your TiVo and wait to see if it actually gets fixed -- don't get stuck with a brick. TiVo has known about this for how long ????


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## sbourgeo

BigJimOutlaw said:


> A fix is (finally) apparently being worked on. They were looking for testers here a few months ago. I would say to hang tight as long as you can.


I'm closing in on having this issue for two years, so that would be nice.


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## ebf

Moved to new thread in hopes mine is a different problem.


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## Dr_Diablo

I was told by a Tivo tech this morning that if your signal strength is 100 then its too high... His suggestion is/was to purchase an Attenuator to reduce that signal strength to around 80 percent.... they aren't that expensive at $2.00 an up

you'd think your cable company would suggest this simple fix, rather then tell you your signal strengths ok at 100 percent, they hate working on Tivos period, aren't trained to do so


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## dlfl

Dr_Diablo said:


> I was told by a Tivo tech this morning that if your signal strength is 100 then its too high... His suggestion is/was to purchase an Attenuator to reduce that signal strength to around 80 percent.... they aren't that expensive at $2.00 an up
> 
> you'd think your cable company would suggest this simple fix, rather then tell you your signal strengths ok at 100 percent, they hate working on Tivos period, aren't trained to do so


TiVo support is big on blaming signal strength for problems -- occasionally they are correct . As you say, it's cheap, so go ahead and try an attenuator (a splitter can be used for attenuation also, if more readily available). Don't be surprised if it doesn't help though. A large fraction of channels on my HD have signal strengths of 100 and they show no problems whatsoever. I tried attenuators long ago when I was having some problems what were later fixed by TiVo software version 11.0g. In my experience getting most channels down to 80 is not a good thing, although TiVo says 80-99 is ideal.

Given how little motivation and expertise the cable co has regarding TiVo's it's unrealistic to expect anything from them in the area of TiVo trouble-shooting.


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## Dr_Diablo

dlfl said:


> TiVo support is big on blaming signal strength for problems -- occasionally they are correct . As you say, it's cheap, so go ahead and try an attenuator (a splitter can be used for attenuation also, if more readily available). Don't be surprised if it doesn't help though. A large fraction of channels on my HD have signal strengths of 100 and they show no problems whatsoever. I tried attenuators long ago when I was having some problems what were later fixed by TiVo software version 11.0g. In my experience getting most channels down to 80 is not a good thing, although TiVo says 80-99 is ideal.
> 
> Given how little motivation and expertise the cable co has regarding TiVo's it's unrealistic to expect anything from them in the area of TiVo trouble-shooting.


I'll wager the problems in the Tivo software from what I've been reading the past few days. I dont usually bother checking the software version as long as the freakin Tivo works as intended, but mines on that 11.0 version


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## Idaholion

I have a similar but slightly different problem. I just replaced my Series 2 TIVO with a new HD XL unit. I transferred the shows that were on my Series 2 unit, and then I wanted to copy one of the recorded shows onto a DVD. It was a 1 hour show, (which I have watched before all the way through) and at 37 minutes 12 seconds into the recording, I got a gray screen with
"This screen is provided on behalf of your cable provider (Cablecard 1)
In order to start cable service for this device, please contact your cable provider."
And then lots of cablecard information, and at the bottom, it said "Press Clear to exit"
This screen stayed on the tv for exactly 5 minutes. At the end of that time, the screen showed a different cable show going. It interrupted the show I was recording on to DVD at 37:12, and went back to cable at 42:12, completely missing the last 20 minutes of my show recorded on TIVO. The show is still there, but TIVO didn't go back to it to send it to my DVD recorder.
We have seen the screen show up again tonight when watching a recorded show, and when we pressed clear, it instantly went back to the recorded show we were watching . Any ideas? TIVO's customer service was closed when I tried to call


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## mwdvorak

yourbrokenoven said:


> I just found this thread. I've had a TiVo HD for about a year. I predominantly watched HD channels on it, but have recently noticed that my analog channels go out after about 1 - 2 hours and the only remedy is to reset the tivo (which takes over 5 minutes!!)
> 
> No matter how many times I change the channels, whether i'm flipping through the grey screen or back and fourth from analog to digital, the channels will only come back on with a powercycle / reset.
> 
> Does anyone know of a fix?
> 
> Does anyone know of a fix?


I've had the same problem for 4 months at least. The only fix is to complain to TiVo and ask for your money back (or at least, credit for months of service without charge). The more people that do this, the more that the TiVo corporation will think that it has to invest into solving this problem, and fast. A company that outsources engineering doesn't give a crap about anything but profit, and so this is the kind of language they'll respond to.


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## sbourgeo

Just got my first grey screen with 11h.


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## TiVoJerry

sbourgeo, as you're aware from my posting in another thread, 11.0h does not carry a fix for persistent grey screens on analog channels. While we are deep into a testing phase for this issue, and it is going well, we had to push out warnings screens in support for a new DVR Expander that has USB connections (USB is not supported).

With that said, our confidence is now high enough to allow customers early access to beta software that should resolve this particular issue!

If you are still seeing a 
(1) persistent grey screen on 
(2) ANALOG channels that 
(3) can be temporarily (but consistently) fixed with either a channel change or restart, *please call customer support for further troubleshooting.*

You will be escalated to the 2nd level of support for triaging where you'll be given instructions on how to sign up for testing.


*If you do not have this symptom, the new software does not contain anything exciting for you. 
[*]If you have poor signal strength in your home, software will not help you at all.
[*]This is still considered a "beta" program, so there is still the chance that improvements will need to be made.*
We are offering this option in order to provide some relief for you at the earliest opportunity we've had, which will in turn help us confirm our confidence in the resolution. Until now, this problem has proven to be very difficult to resolve but we've finally made the progress that we'd been hoping for. If you are uncomfortable joining an open beta program (we won't be giving you homework ), the software will eventually be rolled out to everyone but we are not close to our currently-scheduled release date.

We know this has been a difficult situation for many of you and hope this opportunity provides some sort of relief.

Thank you,
TiVoJerry


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## MJGunn

WOW, with the long history of this problem and so little word from you guys on it I was convinced tivo was sweeping it under the rug.

Still a little disappointed in how long its taken, but kudos to you guys for at least eventually getting around to fixing it. That's saying a lot these days where many companies solution for fixing a products problem is releasing a new version and expecting everyone to upgrade to the new one.


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## sbourgeo

TiVoJerry said:


> sbourgeo, as you're aware from my posting in another thread, 11.0h does not carry a fix for persistent grey screens on analog channels. While we are deep into a testing phase for this issue, and it is going well, we had to push out warnings screens in support for a new DVR Expander that has USB connections (USB is not supported).
> 
> With that said, our confidence is now high enough to allow customers early access to beta software that should resolve this particular issue!
> 
> If you are still seeing a
> (1) persistent grey screen on
> (2) ANALOG channels that
> (3) can be temporarily (but consistently) fixed with either a channel change or restart, *please call customer support for further troubleshooting.*
> 
> You will be escalated to the 2nd level of support for triaging where you'll be given instructions on how to sign up for testing.
> 
> 
> *If you do not have this symptom, the new software does not contain anything exciting for you.
> [*]If you have poor signal strength in your home, software will not help you at all.
> [*]This is still considered a "beta" program, so there is still the chance that improvements will need to be made.*
> We are offering this option in order to provide some relief for you at the earliest opportunity we've had, which will in turn help us confirm our confidence in the resolution. Until now, this problem has proven to be very difficult to resolve but we've finally made the progress that we'd been hoping for. If you are uncomfortable joining an open beta program (we won't be giving you homework ), the software will eventually be rolled out to everyone but we are not close to our currently-scheduled release date.
> 
> We know this has been a difficult situation for many of you and hope this opportunity provides some sort of relief.
> 
> Thank you,
> TiVoJerry


A bit of advice for anyone calling in as outlined above with the hope that the open beta will fix your analog grey screen issue. While the CSR I dealt with was doing his best to be helpful, I was not offered the software and my call would have ended with no resolution had I had not mentioned the information TiVoJerry kindly shared with us.


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## Madoc Owain

In my case, I had channels that would disappear from both HD and digital (black background, "searching for signal" message) temporarily. Sunday night it was the NBC affiliate, tonight it was the FOX affiliate. Called TiVo support, since my other, non-digital TV could access the FOX affiliate. After checking a couple of items they determined it could be a signal quality issue. They had me check the connections and sure enough, the cable into the TiVo wasn't screwed down tightly. Once I screwed it down the rest of the way, my channels came back. Embarrassing but a learning experience nonetheless.


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## ciscokid

It isn't the Tivo (likely). 

Replace your splitters if they're marginal you will breyscreen on some (or ALL) of your channels


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## MJGunn

After not having this problem for months, I got home today and have no signal on all of my non-digital channels. Anyone else seen this bug pop up lately?

Edit: Actually I take that back, this seems to be something else because a restart didn't fix it for me like it always did in the past.


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## MaryJ76

MJGunn said:


> After not having this problem for months, I got home today and have no signal on all of my non-digital channels. Anyone else seen this bug pop up lately?
> 
> Edit: Actually I take that back, this seems to be something else because a restart didn't fix it for me like it always did in the past.


This seems to have happened to me literally overnight. Yesterday I had all channels working. Today all of the analog channels have the gray screen. I tried rebooting through the menu and that did nothing. Fortunately, all the HD channels seem to be okay.

I just recently bought a Premiere and moved the Series 3 into the kitchen. All the connections are secure, so that isn't the problem. Could it be something with the cable company (Insight)/cable cards?


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## dwit

MaryJ76 said:


> This seems to have happened to me literally overnight. Yesterday I had all channels working. Today all of the analog channels have the gray screen. I tried rebooting through the menu and that did nothing. Fortunately, all the HD channels seem to be okay.
> 
> I just recently bought a Premiere and moved the Series 3 into the kitchen. All the connections are secure, so that isn't the problem. Could it be something with the cable company (Insight)/cable cards?


Have you checked with your cable company(lineup changes, etc)?


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## dave13077

This has also started happening to me the past couple of weeks. I have not had this issue for about a year before that. I have 2 Tivo HD, Time Warner cable. It has started happening on both of them.


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## MaryJ76

This turned out to be very interesting. I called the cable company and the online technician decided that my cable cards must be going bad, so she scheduled a service call for Thursday. The next day EVERYTHING was out...cable, phone and internet! I called to report it and the person I talked to said that they were showing a large outage in an adjacent area, but that I was the first person from my area to call. He assured me that someone would be working on it. When everything came back on about 7 hours later, so did my analog channels! My thoughts are that something was going wrong with the cable service when the gray channels started to show up, but no one really caught on to it. I am going to wait until tomorrow to make sure nothing changes before calling to cancel that service call!

Thanks everyone!


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## wjohna

Tivo customer since 2003. Getting occasional gray screen on sets of channels--always different sets each time this happens. This seems to be happening with increasing frequency in the past year or so after almost flawless performance before that. I'm on Cablevision's Norwalk, CT system. Two S-cards, approved WD external drive. Soft reboot has always fixed the problem, but the channels sometimes take an extra 5-10 minutes after the reboot to come back.


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## Pvgibbs

Madoc Owain said:


> ...sure enough, the cable into the TiVo wasn't screwed down tightly. Once I screwed it down the rest of the way, my channels came back...


Had the same thing happen to me -- all of a sudden the HD channels of NBC, CBS, TLC went missing and showed the "searching for signal" message one night after a recent power outage. A soft restart didnt fix it -- I feared the worst - my cablecard was mucked up and I would have to deal with the Comcast merry-go-round.

But then I saw this post and talked to my better-half who said "oh I did dust around the TV and tivo yesterday"...instantly I leap toward the back of everything, loosened and tightened the cables just a bit and POW! that fixed everything.

We do have a splitter which is most likely the cause of signal issues as many, many folks have pointed out.

Basically - if you are suddenly missing a -few- channels due to lack of signal, re-attach your cable first before bothering Comcast or Tivo.


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