# TiVo, Technicolor cut a deal to push DVRs internationally



## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

Thought some of you might be interested in this:

http://hd.engadget.com/2010/05/23/tivo-technicolor-cut-a-deal-to-push-dvrs-internationally/


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## mikerr (Jun 2, 2005)

Technicolor, previously known as Thomson...


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## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

indeed, the irony, it took Tivo 8 years to find another manufacturer to make boxes for the international market and it ended up being the same manufacturer they stopped using 8 years previously


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## iankb (Oct 9, 2000)

healeydave said:


> indeed, the irony, it took Tivo 8 years to find another manufacturer to make boxes for the international market and it ended up being the same manufacturer they stopped using 8 years previously


I got the impression that it was Thomson who stopped supplying TiVo.


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## iankb (Oct 9, 2000)

That box is a twin-tuner S2 box, so could support Freesat HD. However, would the deal with Virgin stop them selling it in the UK.


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## cwaring (Feb 12, 2002)

I was going to say "I don't see why it should" but then of course I remembered that VM are (I assume) intending to release on in their 'national' (ie non-cabled) areas. That would only be for Freeview though, so I guess a Freesat one might be okay.


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

cwaring said:


> I was going to say "I don't see why it should" but then of course I remembered that VM are (I assume) intending to release on in their 'national' (ie non-cabled) areas. That would only be for Freeview though, so I guess a Freesat one might be okay.


I'm sure that its not intentional but the above comments make no sense.

Did you mean to say that perhaps Virgin wouldn't object to the release of the International product in non Virgin cabled areas? Personally I think they would object since a Freeview or BBC/ITV Freesat capable box would by definition also work perfectly well inside a Virgin cabled area.

The only basis on which it might therefore be allowed to come to non Virgin cabled areas would be if Virgin were to distribute it themselves (as their solution for non cabled areas perhaps bundled with a phone line and broadband package) and it could also stream Virgin provided Pay Per View content.


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## cwaring (Feb 12, 2002)

Pete77 said:


> I'm sure that its not intentional but the above comments make no sense.


Well, let's just say that it's never intentional but there's always a good possibilty 



Pete77 said:


> Did you mean to say that perhaps Virgin wouldn't object to the release of the International product in non Virgin cabled areas? Personally I think they would object since a Freeview or BBC/ITV Freesat capable box would by definition also work perfectly well inside a Virgin cabled area.


Yes to the former, no to the latter. Clearer? 

What I mean was that, as VM as a company have no products based around satellite TV reception (and by that I mean Freesat of course, not Sky specifically!) then they would probably not object to the launch of a satellite-based Tivo unit. However, as they (I assume) intend to enter release a 'freeview' Tivo in their non-cabled areas (more probably IP-based than DTT though I guess?) then they would have exclusivity in that market.


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

cwaring said:


> However, as they (I assume) intend to enter release a 'freeview' Tivo in their non-cabled areas (more probably IP-based than DTT though I guess?) then they would have exclusivity in that market.


On what basis though do you assume this? Do you assume it due to Ofcom's continuing work on making BT open up their cable ducts to non BT competitors to lay fibre. But if so then what about the proposal to allow BT competitors to hang their fibre or copper wires from BT poles?

Either way there will still be loads of country bumpkins in our Tivocommunity with exchanges so small that no one other than BT will continue to provide a fibre connection to their village phone exchange and for whom therefore Freeview or Freesat remain the only obvious options.

Unless of course BT Wholesale can be forced to lower the cost of access by competitors to their own fibre in areas where it will never be cost effective for competitors to lay their own fibre cabling.

Also what about WiMax. Something which he have heard about for such a long time but which never seems to have made any significant progress within the UK.


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## cwaring (Feb 12, 2002)

Pete77 said:


> On what basis though do you assume this?


Aren't VM changing to an IP-based delivery system for their TV service? I thought I read that this would mean they could offer a Tivo to their non-cable customers.


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

cwaring said:


> Aren't VM changing to an IP-based delivery system for their TV service? I thought I read that this would mean they could offer a Tivo to their non-cable customers.


The general view here seemed to be that the ordinary DSL broadband networks isn't fast enough to deliver programs in real time even in SD, let alone in HD quality. Over DSL broadband real time program delivery is only achievable in pretty low viewing quality (480p seems to be the best offered on YouTube and even then programs stop unexpectedly for no good reason despite me using a broadband ISP that is meant to be one that does not throttle or restrict tv program streaming).

Given that one of the main reasons people pay large amounts to Sky or Virgin is to live stream sports or as my 10 year old nephew put it in respect of a new episode of Dr Who because they "want to watch it at the same time as everyone else will be watching it" then I don't think Virgin can hope to offer a service via ordinary broadband that will be comparable with Sky or Virgin Cable. Instead it will at best be more like BT Vision or TopUpTv, especially for anything in HD.


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## healeydave (Jun 4, 2003)

Ok, let me clarify the situation.

Whilst Tivo and Technicolor have teamed up to produce new Tivo hardware for 'international markets', this does not specifically mean boxes for the UK at this point in time. Booooo.

Also, should a UK box be born from this partnership, I have it on good authority that it would indeed come through Virgin.


So read into that what you will, these are my takes on it:

Yes, it makes sense for Virgin to launch non-cable hardware as an extension to its service, as there is still a significant amount of the UK that is not covered by cable. 

Do Virgin realise that themselves? 
(that is anyone's guess, I'm not sure I would put money on that one).

If Virgin do realise it, would it be in a timely fashion? 
(as cable is their core product and likely to take precedence over any other launches and based on the current pace or lack of, for the new UK cable offering, I think its safe to say "no")

:-(


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

healeydave said:


> Do Virgin realise that themselves?
> (that is anyone's guess, I'm not sure I would put money on that one).
> 
> If Virgin do realise it, would it be in a timely fashion?
> ...


Virgin seem to be long on talk of expansion of their network and very short on meaningful action.

They were talking about completing coverage of the UK for their tv services via ADSL by the "middle of next year" as long ago as January 2007.

See www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/2802980/Virgin-media-launch-to-cost-20m.html


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## cwaring (Feb 12, 2002)

Well, for a start NTL/Telewest didn't actually _become_ Virgin Media until a month later  However, they have also had large debts to deal with, etc., so it's not really surprising that such dates have been missed, especially as they're not really 'mission critical' to the core of their business; ie cable.


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

cwaring said:


> Well, for a start NTL/Telewest didn't actually _become_ Virgin Media until a month later  However, they have also had large debts to deal with, etc., so it's not really surprising that such dates have been missed, especially as they're not really 'mission critical' to the core of their business; ie cable.


No their core business is a quad play telephone, broadband, television and pay per view communications service which for legacy reasons is currently restricted to only being able to offer the full range of services and the fastest broadband speeds in the areas in which it has its own fibre optic cable in the ground.

However as their main competitor (Sky) has access to virtually the whole UK marketplace (especially now that they also have a broadband based product) and they do not it is surely essential for Virgin to develop their delivery platform to serve the whole of the UK as soon as possible. This does not necessarily involve them laying more of their own fibre.


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## cwaring (Feb 12, 2002)

Pete77 said:


> No their core business is a quad play telephone, broadband, television and pay per view communications service....


And these are all accessed through...? Yes, cable; as I said 

(Okay, Virgin Mobile excepted!)


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## Pete77 (Aug 1, 2006)

cwaring said:


> (Okay, Virgin Mobile excepted!)


Better not also forget Virgin ADSL then!

You may perhaps also have noticed that Virgin also run aeroplanes, trains and a fair few other things (like wine and financial services products). So what makes you think that they don't want to supply phone and television by means other than the historic NTL/Telewest cable network.

Speaking of which have you checked exactly how BT get their phone service in to homes. Oh look its also using a "cable".


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## cwaring (Feb 12, 2002)

Pete77 said:


> Better not also forget Virgin ADSL then!


Okay. However, while they are now able to diversify, their core business has always been the legacy cable service.



> You may perhaps also have noticed that Virgin also run aeroplanes, trains and a fair few other things (like wine and financial services products). So what makes you think that they don't want to supply phone and television by means other than the historic NTL/Telewest cable network.


None of those other things you mention have anything whatsoever to do with Virgin Media.

They have simply licenced the use of the brand from Richard Branson. Nothing more.



> Speaking of which have you checked exactly how BT get their phone service in to homes. Oh look its also using a "cable".


Oh har-de-ruddy-har. You're _so_ (not) funny


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## mikerr (Jun 2, 2005)

Not quite sure why you're both calling VM's infrastructure the "legacy" and "historic" cable 
as though its somehow old and out of date. 

Far from it, it's their cabling which makes them positioned better for on demand than either ADSL or satellite.

BT's lines would be better described as legacy and historic - especially if you've seen the state of some of the outside lines!


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## cwaring (Feb 12, 2002)

I was actually referring to their core business of providinng cable TV as legacy and not their infrastructure, about which I agree with what you posted


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## Millimole (May 29, 2003)

If I can get back to the original proposition.........
I've just bought an Aston-Simba Fransat box, so I can watch French tele, and at the same time it records to an external drive, and lets me watch ITV & BBC in HD --- But ---- strictly speaking Fransat boxes (and cards) are only available to 'residents of Metropolitan France' - so, when Tivo launch their Irish / French / Latvian box, then what's to stop me buying said Irish/French/Latvian box and using it in Blighty?


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## AMc (Mar 22, 2002)

Millimole said:


> so, when Tivo launch their Irish / French / Latvian box, then what's to stop me buying said Irish/French/Latvian box and using it in Blighty?


At the moment we can only speculate (see above  )- I would imagine the absence of an EPG subscription would severely hobble it's usefulness.


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