# WD Drive Options



## Ollie_3151 (May 26, 2012)

I am looking to replace hard drive in my TCD663160.

What is the recommendation for Western Digital Drive currently?

Can I install 2GB drive or should I stick with 1GB drive?

What is a good link to walk through the upgrade process?


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

I'd suggest reviewing the first and last sections of the stickied Upgrade thread http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=370784

It's got everything you could need.


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## lillevig (Dec 7, 2010)

Ollie_3151 said:


> I am looking to replace hard drive in my TCD663160.
> 
> What is the recommendation for Western Digital Drive currently?
> 
> ...


The link quoted above is the place to go for drive selections but you should really ask yourself how much storage you need. I've got 1TB drives in my Premeire and S3HD but I don't really use anywhere near that much space because I don't tend to save recordings. If you want to save a significant number of recordings, then you might consider adding drive space to your computer instead of the Tivo and transferring them to your PC for safe keeping.


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## Ollie_3151 (May 26, 2012)

Many thanks. I will give it a go


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## lrhorer (Aug 31, 2003)

lillevig said:


> you should really ask yourself how much storage you need.


I agree, although with drive prices now down back to nearly where they were before the flooding, I would say one needn't ask nearly as pointedly.



lillevig said:


> I've got 1TB drives in my Premeire and S3HD but I don't really use anywhere near that much space because I don't tend to save recordings.


To that I would respond, "Why not?" After all, it is the TiVo that does the saving, not you.



lillevig said:


> If you want to save a significant number of recordings, then you might consider adding drive space to your computer instead of the Tivo and transferring them to your PC for safe keeping.


I agree. The TiVo is a rather poor place to store programs indefinitely. What I would say, is once the TiVo's hard drive is large enough that given the family's recording habits the FIFO storage becomes infinite, one needn't bother to expand further. For most families, this is probably between 500G and 750G. The question is not, "How much space is on the hard drive?", but rather, "How old is the oldest (non-KUID) recording on the TiVo?" As long as that amount of time is greater than the family needs to reasonably watch any program they do not want to miss, any further expansion of the TiVo produces rapidly diminishing returns on the investment. Any programs they want to watch more than once should indeed be moved to external storage, which can not only be readily expanded more or less without limit, but also can be easily backed up in case of drive failures.


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## Ollie_3151 (May 26, 2012)

My TiVo is a TCD663160 (Australian TiVoHD) and I replaced the drive with WD WD-AV 1TB WD10EURX. Using the WinMFS and the quick start process (from the mfslive site) I had the Tivo up and running in about hour.

Hardest part of the process was
- Sorting out the SATA ports on the old desktop to use WinMFS
- Tools to get into the case.

The software process was very straight forward.

I will test it out of the next week and see how it goes.

Many thanks to all


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## lillevig (Dec 7, 2010)

Ollie_3151 said:


> Hardest part of the process was
> - Sorting out the SATA ports on the old desktop to use WinMFS
> - Tools to get into the case.


Just as a heads up, you can use inexpensive USB to IDE/SATA adapter cables to do Tivo imaging. In fact, that is all I've ever used and I've imaged several S1, S2, and S3 drives. Done them mostly with my desktop and WinMFS but also have done it with my laptop and WinTools.


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## poppagene (Dec 29, 2001)

lillevig said:


> Just as a heads up, you can use inexpensive USB to IDE/SATA adapter cables to do Tivo imaging. In fact, that is all I've ever used and I've imaged several S1, S2, and S3 drives. Done them mostly with my desktop and WinMFS but also have done it with my laptop and WinTools.


Don't you still need to connect to mainboard sata to run the wdidle program?


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

poppagene said:


> Don't you still need to connect to mainboard sata to run the wdidle program?


Yes, if intellipark is enabled on the drive.

According to WD, the following drives have this feature which can be disabled via wdidle3:

WD20EADS, WD20EARS, WD15EADS, WD15EARS, WD10EADS, WD10EARS, WD8000AARS, WD7500AADS, WD7500AARS, WD6400AADS, WD6400AARS, WD5000AADS, WD5000AARS


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## poppagene (Dec 29, 2001)

according to Newegg http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822136941 intellipark is listed in the specifications for the drive OP used. I think all of the current model AV-GP drives from western digital feature intellipark


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

Wasn't there a Tivo software update that removed the boot-failure problem caused by Intellipark?


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

dlfl said:


> Wasn't there a Tivo software update that removed the boot-failure problem caused by Intellipark?


Huh. I hadn't heard that but I googled "TiVo intellipark" and one of the things that came up was this, so supposedly they fixed it more than 2 years ago. Except that the last post in the thread indicated it was broken again. Bottom line: If it is not too much effort, direct connect the drive and run wdidle3. Intellipark is a totally useless feature in a TiVo. If it is difficult, then try it in the TiVo and see if there is a soft boot problem.

The other interesting thing this revealed to me is that this problem existed in some of the HD XLs with the stock drive.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

I wouldn't assume that just because Newegg says it has IntelliPark that it actually does. I know it's still possible that it does but it doesn't really make sense for a drive designed for video applications.


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## poppagene (Dec 29, 2001)

lpwcomp said:


> I wouldn't assume that just because Newegg says it has IntelliPark that it actually does. I know it's still possible that it does but it doesn't really make sense for a drive designed for video applications.


western digital lists this as a feature of their av-gp series


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

poppagene said:


> western digital lists this as a feature of their av-gp series


So they do. That's just dumb.


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## farmermac (Jan 31, 2012)

Ollie_3151 said:


> I am looking to replace hard drive in my TCD663160.
> 
> What is the recommendation for Western Digital Drive currently?
> 
> ...


For the price difference between the larger drives, I'd max out the capacity. The difference between a 640gb, 750gb and. 1tb drive isn't very big. In the future, you will never be upset to have an extra 50 hours of recording but you might miss it. If you intend on selling it, the larger drive is a huge plus since you can only upgrade from the original drive image once.


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## A J Ricaud (Jun 25, 2002)

lillevig said:


> If you want to save a significant number of recordings, then you might consider adding drive space to your computer instead of the Tivo and transferring them to your PC for safe keeping.


That's a good idea but will only work if the recordings are unencrypted. Unfortunately, it seems that most cable operators prevent transferring just about everything but the OTA network channels.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

A J Ricaud said:


> That's a good idea but will only work if the recordings are unencrypted. Unfortunately, it seems that most cable operators prevent transferring just about everything but the OTA network channels.


You're evidence in support of that statement? At least here, Comcast only sets the CC1 byte ( this is what prevents copying, not encryption) on premium channels.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

dlfl said:


> Wasn't there a Tivo software update that removed the boot-failure problem caused by Intellipark?


I'm not sure that would be possible, since WD's solution involves screwing around with the firmware of the drive.

Maybe the TiVo could do it on the original drive installed at the factory, but I wouldn't expect it to be automatically able to handle any larger different model number replacement drives.


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## farmermac (Jan 31, 2012)

A J Ricaud said:


> That's a good idea but will only work if the recordings are unencrypted. Unfortunately, it seems that most cable operators prevent transferring just about everything but the OTA network channels.


TiVo supplies the software to do this on their site...


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## A J Ricaud (Jun 25, 2002)

lpwcomp said:


> You're evidence in support of that statement? At least here, Comcast only sets the CC1 byte ( this is what prevents copying, not encryption) on premium channels.


I stand corrected. I meant "copying", not encryption. I think that FiOS is about the only one around here that doesn't set the flag--yet.


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## A J Ricaud (Jun 25, 2002)

farmermac said:


> TiVo supplies the software to do this on their site...


I'm not sure what you mean, but if you are referring to "Tivo Desktop", it will not let you copy recordings to a PC if they are copy protected.


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## farmermac (Jan 31, 2012)

A J Ricaud said:


> I'm not sure what you mean, but if you are referring to "Tivo Desktop", it will not let you copy recordings to a PC if they are copy protected.


oh. I've never run into that yet.. My cable provider must not copy protect anything.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

farmermac said:


> oh. I've never run into that yet.. My cable provider must not copy protect anything.


"My what big teeth you have, grandmother" said Little Red Riding Hood.  (She didn't realize she was confronting a wolf -- yet!)


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

Ollie_3151 said:


> My TiVo is a TCD663160 (Australian TiVoHD) and I replaced the drive with WD WD-AV 1TB WD10EURX. Using the WinMFS and the quick start process (from the mfslive site) I had the Tivo up and running in about hour.
> 
> Hardest part of the process was
> - Sorting out the SATA ports on the old desktop to use WinMFS
> ...


Any more success (or failure) stories with this drive?

It appears Intellipark is disabled by default, which would make things simple.
But it does not appear as a recommended drive in the FAQ.

Worse yet, there is this thread:
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?t=470061
Looks discouraging...

But then again, there is this:

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=9356638&highlight=WD10EURX#post9356638

So, is it worth trying?


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

oregonalex said:


> Any more success (or failure) stories with this drive?
> 
> It appears Intellipark is disabled by default, which would make things simple.
> But it does not appear as a recommended drive in the FAQ.
> ...


If you already own one of that model drive, perhaps it would be better used in a PC somewhere.

Wait for newegg and Amazon to drop the price of a WD20EURS to $100 and grab one of those.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

unitron said:


> If you already own one of that model drive, perhaps it would be better used in a PC somewhere.
> 
> Wait for newegg and Amazon to drop the price of a WD20EURS to $100 and grab one of those.


Thanks for the suggestion.

No, I have not bought it yet. I have Tivo HD XL. The way I use Tivo, even the 1TB is MASSIVE overkill. My main (only) consideration is ease of replacement and reliability, not capacity. ***

But, if the WD20EURS is more likely to work than WD10EURX (especially if I don't have to mess with the Intellipark bit), then I guess I'd do it, it's now $108 as opposed to $84 for the 1TB.

*EDIT:* *** Actually, I tell a lie. My main consideration is drive quietness, as the unit is in my audiophile listening room.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

unitron said:


> .......
> Wait for newegg and Amazon to drop the price of a WD20EURS to $100 and grab one of those.


Recently got one from Amazon for $108, with no shipping cost and no tax. It came in one day with Amazon Prime. AND it was packed in the original WD package with sealed anti-static bag and plastic end-cap spacers, i.e., the best. Waiting for $100 or a little less at another vendor doesn't seem worth it.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

dlfl said:


> Waiting for $100 or a little less at another vendor doesn't seem worth it.


I agree. Plus, I really can't wait any more. The audio/video glitches are getting really bad.

Have you installed it yet? Using WinMFS or something else? Any snags?


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

dlfl said:


> Recently got one from Amazon for $108, with no shipping cost and no tax. It came in one day with Amazon Prime. AND it was packed in the original WD package with sealed anti-static bag and plastic end-cap spacers, i.e., the best. Waiting for $100 or a little less at another vendor doesn't seem worth it.


Amazon's price tends to bounce around, but if newegg goes to $100, they're pretty quick to price match (and pretty quick to go back up as soon as newegg's sale is over).


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

oregonalex said:


> I agree. Plus, I really can't wait any more. The audio/video glitches are getting really bad.
> 
> Have you installed it yet? Using WinMFS or something else? Any snags?


If you have a TCD658000, and it's running version 11.0k of the TiVo software, then you should be able to hook up both drives (to a non-GigaByte brand motherboard), open WinMFS, copy the stock drive to the EURS with mfscopy, increasing the swap partition size if you want to, and then click on mfsadd, and it'll fill the rest of that 2TB without any problem.

And you can supersize if you want.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

unitron said:


> If you have a TCD658000, and it's running version 11.0k of the TiVo software, then you should be able to hook up both drives (to a non-GigaByte brand motherboard), open WinMFS, copy the stock drive to the EURS with mfscopy, increasing the swap partition size if you want to, and then click on mfsadd, and it'll fill the rest of that 2TB without any problem.
> 
> And you can supersize if you want.


I was hoping to do this via a USB3.0->SATA adapter without having to hook it to the motherboard. I don't really care about the saved recordings. BTW, can't you do a full (non-truncated) backup from the original drive to the PC drive, then mount the replacement drive and restore the backup? I have 1.5TB free on the PC internal drive.

I may be off base, but this is a concern I have about using the 2TB: The FAQ states that only non-expanded image can be used for transfer to the new 2TB drive. So, say I transfer it, and 3 years from now the new 2TB drive also starts to sputter and I need to do another transfer. Would I be able to transfer the new (expanded) drive to yet another drive?

This is really a minefield...


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

oregonalex said:


> I was hoping to do this via a USB3.0->SATA adapter without having to hook it to the motherboard. I don't really care about the saved recordings. BTW, can't you do a full (non-truncated) backup from the original drive to the PC drive, then mount the replacement drive and restore the backup? I have 1.5TB free on the PC internal drive.
> 
> I may be off base, but this is a concern I have about using the 2TB: The FAQ states that only non-expanded image can be used for transfer to the new 2TB drive. So, say I transfer it, and 3 years from now the new 2TB drive also starts to sputter and I need to do another transfer. Would I be able to transfer the new (expanded) drive to yet another drive?
> 
> This is really a minefield...


So far the biggest drive that a TiVo will even boot with, regardless of how much of it is actually used or how big its partition map thinks it is, is 2TB.

I'm not absolutely certain if that's a hardware, i.e., motherboard, issue, or just that the Linux kernel the TiVo software uses can only count that high, but the hardware's not going to change and the software's not going to undergo as radical a re-write as would be needed to change the kernel that much, at least not on S3s and older for sure, and probably not on S4s.

So don't expect to ever use anything bigger than a 2TB in your S3.

So all you would be able to do is use one of the Linux command line utilities* to "Xerox" that 2TB to another 2TB, or restore a truncated backup (all settings, but no recordings) to a new 2TB and then expand.

In theory you could, if your Linux-Fu is strong, do a compressed backup of the 658's entire 1TB drive, recordings and all, but it wouldn't be compressed much.

You can do a WinMFS copy from the 1TB to the 2TB via USB adapter, but of course you'll need 2 of them and 2 available USB ports on the PC.

To do it with only one, and to backup the entire 1TB drive, including recordings, and then restore that to a 2TB before expanding, you would have to use the MFS Live bootable cd and do it on the command line, and have lots of space on your PC's hard drive.

That's in theory. I can't swear that it'll handle a file that large.

You should go to mfslive.org and do lots and lots of reading and then read it all again.

(MFS Live and the old MFS Tools backups are not interchangeable with WinMFS backups--neither can understand the other)

If you don't need to save your recordings (or if you can copy them all off to PC using TiVo Desktop or pyTiVo or something), then you can do it all with WinMFS and one adapter by doing a truncated backup of the 1TB to some space (under 1GB) on your PC's hard drive, and then swapping out the 1TB and swapping in the 2TB and restoring the backup, which will fill 1TB of the 2TB, and then using mfsadd to expand into the rest of the 2TB.

*The MFS Live cd, v1.4, has both

dd

and

dd_rescue

either of which will do a byte for byte "Xerox" of one drive to another of equal or greater size.

I prefer

dd_rescue

because you can get it to show you what it's doing and it has options that could help copy from a failing drive where the more primitive

dd

would fail.

There's also

ddrescue

which is similar to dd_rescue and available on other bootable Linux based cds.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

oregonalex said:


> I agree. Plus, I really can't wait any more. The audio/video glitches are getting really bad.
> 
> Have you installed it yet? Using WinMFS or something else? Any snags?


I haven't installed it yet. I have done the WD Diagnostics extended test, which is recommended on any drive before putting it in a TiVo.

I am planning to use WinMFS but what's possible and what's best depends on several factors. Some upgrades can't be done with just WinMFS and sometimes another approach is better even if WinMFS could be used. Read the last few pages of the sticky thread on Drive expansion, then post your specific situation to get more specific advice.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

Thanks guys for the replies.

I think I should have been more clear about my situation:

Yes, I have TiVo HD XL TCD 658000 with lifetime, over 3 years old, original drive. The video dropouts and audio screeches have been getting more and more frequent, now are untenable. I use the unit very sparingly, I don't use Tivo recommendations, only record a few programs a week for time shifting, so increasing the size of the drive is of no benefit to me.

I just need to replace the drive with a drive that is just as quiet as the original, with minimum fuss and expense. I don't care about losing recordings, season passes or other settings. I currently have no drive, no USB->SATA adapter, no spare SATA cables. I have no Linux experience, but fair amount of PC/Windows experience. I would, however, prefer not to have to open and connect anything to my PC motherboard, and would like to install as few utilities on my PC as possible.

*Option A:* Buy a 1TB from dvrstore.com already set up. This would work for me, provided dvrstore.com is reputable and sells new, not refurb drives.

*Option B:* Take a risk on the WD10EURX. If it goes well, it would be the cheapest option even with buying a USB->SATA adapter. Plus, I could buy another drive, set it up now and keep it in reserve for the next failure. It is possible that suitable replacement drives will be even harder to get in the future.

*Option C:* Get the WD20EURS, which hopefully would work more likely than option B. I'd also have to buy at least a USB->SATA adapter, which means this option is almost as expensive as Option A, but with much more hassle.

If you were me, which one would you choose?


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

oregonalex said:


> Thanks guys for the replies.
> 
> I think I should have been more clear about my situation:
> 
> ...


Option C:

3 year warranty, better GB/$ ratio and it's specifically designed to be an A/V drive and a bunch of us are running them in S3s and S4s successfully.

But as with any drive from any manufacturer purchased from anywhere, run the manufacturer's diagnostics long test before putting the drive into service.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

unitron said:


> Option C:
> 
> 3 year warranty, better GB/$ ratio and it's specifically designed to be an A/V drive and a bunch of us are running them in S3s and S4s successfully.
> 
> But as with any drive from any manufacturer purchased from anywhere, run the manufacturer's diagnostics long test before putting the drive into service.


Understood. The previous reports of success is what will probably sway me towards it, because the higher price & capacity, even with the better GB/$, is a negative for me.

The WD10EURX, however, also has 3 year warranty and is specifically designed to be an A/V drive. The only difference on the spec sheet besides capacity is slightly bigger power consumption for the WD10EURX.

http://www.wdc.com/wdproducts/library/SpecSheet/ENG/2879-701250.pdf


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

oregonalex said:


> Understood. The previous reports of success is what will probably sway me towards it, because the higher price & capacity, even with the better GB/$, is a negative for me.
> 
> The WD10EURX, however, also has 3 year warranty and is specifically designed to be an A/V drive. The only difference on the spec sheet besides capacity is slightly bigger power consumption for the WD10EURX.
> 
> http://www.wdc.com/wdproducts/library/SpecSheet/ENG/2879-701250.pdf


Have you found any reports of anyone using the WD20EURS and having it not succeed other than a few the other day where running the long test revealed that the drives were actually faulty out of the box?


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

unitron said:


> Have you found any reports of anyone using the WD20EURS and having it not succeed other than a few the other day where running the long test revealed that the drives were actually faulty out of the box?


No, it seems to work reliably for everyone, that's why I'm leaning towards it, even though it is more money (as I said, I don't care about the larger capacity). I have found at least three reports of success and two reports of non-success with WD10EURX. It bugs me a bit - the drives should both work - they are both A/V drives from the same family. Maybe the reason is that knowledgeable people pick the WD20EURS to begin with, so the success rate is higher. There is actually also a WD10EUCX with a smaller cache (which does not matter in Tivo), which should also work. Even cheaper.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

The ones that end in X are newer models than the ones that end in S.

Considering that the S3 TiVos themselves are older tech, the older drive may be more compatible.

The EURS doesn't have to autonegotiate down to 3Gb/s, it's already there, so that's one thing fewer to go wrong.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

unitron said:


> The ones that end in X are newer models than the ones that end in S.
> 
> Considering that the S3 TiVos themselves are older tech, the older drive may be more compatible.
> 
> The EURS doesn't have to autonegotiate down to 3Gb/s, it's already there, so that's one thing fewer to go wrong.


You are right, of course! I completely missed the max host speed difference on the specs. That sure could explain it!


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

oregonalex said:


> I agree. Plus, I really can't wait any more. The audio/video glitches are getting really bad.


One thing I would definitely check are the capacitors on the power supply and replace those that are even slightly bulging.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

oregonalex said:


> Thanks guys for the replies.
> 
> I think I should have been more clear about my situation:
> 
> ...


dvrstore.com is new to me. What is their reputation? How long have they been in business? My thought would have been DVR_DUDE on eBay:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/dvr_dude/m.html
He does have a good rep on this forum. His price for your 1 TB drive is 10+ dollars less than dvrstore.com.

Given your stated situation and preferences, I think Option A is the best one for you.

Maybe I missed it earlier in this thread but have you checked signal strength and SNR in DVR Diagnostics? And the suggestion to look for bulging capacitors in your power supply is worth considering.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

dlfl said:


> dvrstore.com is new to me. What is their reputation? How long have they been in business? My thought would have been DVR_DUDE on eBay:
> http://www.ebay.com/sch/dvr_dude/m.html
> He does have a good rep on this forum. His price for your 1 TB drive is 10+ dollars less than dvrstore.com.
> 
> ...


Thanks. According to one of the threads here, dvrstore.com is dvr_dude's off-eBay site. On eBay, he does not seem to list a 1TB for the 658000. Also, I wonder if WD would honor the warranty if the drive is bought from him - he sells a 'warranty' for another $26.

And the bloody capacitors. I thought failed caps would prevent booting. I will open the DVR tonight and check the stuff. Hopefully nothing's bulging or, <gasp>, leaking.

I did check the signal. It is as it has always been when no problems were present (93-100). SNR 33-34 dB. I'm off the air.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

Capacitor problems in the power supply can, and often do, produce all sorts of strange symptoms that do not at first blush appear to be power supply related.

But anyone who owns an S2 or S3 and is taking the lid off for anything is foolish not to play the odds and check the power supply, both visually and ideally with a voltmeter as well.

Unless they have an oscilloscope handy.


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

oregonalex said:


> Thanks. According to one of the threads here, dvrstore.com is dvr_dude's off-eBay site. On eBay, he does not seem to list a 1TB for the 658000. Also, I wonder if WD would honor the warranty if the drive is bought from him - he sells a 'warranty' for another $26.


Even if WD honors it, the warranty "clock" starts when _*he*_ purchases the drive and is usually shorter for drives purchased in bulk as opposed to a retail purchase.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

lpwcomp said:


> Even if WD honors it, the warranty "clock" starts when _*he*_ purchases the drive and is usually shorter for drives purchased in bulk as opposed to a retail purchase.


Plus, that'll be an OEM warranty, as in the party responsible for the warranty is whoever bought a bunch of them wholesale from, in this case, WD, just like if you contact a drive maker about the stock drive in your TiVo they'll tell you to talk to TiVo about it and not them.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

Even slight bulging of caps is bad, here is a photo:
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb/showthread.php?p=8750894#post8750894
See post #2 in linked thread.


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

oregonalex said:


> Thanks. According to one of the threads here, dvrstore.com is dvr_dude's off-eBay site. On eBay, he does not seem to list a 1TB for the 658000.
> ........


Is a 1 or 2 TB plugin drive for a 658 going to be different than those for a 652?
You could ask him that.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

dlfl said:


> Is a 1 or 2 TB plugin drive for a 658 going to be different than those for a 652?
> You could ask him that.


Well, I've opened the Tivo. All caps are perfectly flat.
So I went crazy and ordered a WD20EURS and a USB-SATA adapter. I hope I can get it set up and it fixes the problems. I will report back.


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## BigDawgy07 (Dec 20, 2005)

Would the Western Digital WD AV-GP WD10EURX be the choice for a TCD652160 since the regular HD model can't use the full 2TB drive?


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## dianebrat (Jul 6, 2002)

BigDawgy07 said:


> Would the Western Digital WD AV-GP WD10EURX be the choice for a TCD652160 since the regular HD model can't use the full 2TB drive?


Both the S3 OLED and the Tivo HD can now fully use the 2TB drive.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

oregonalex said:


> Well, I've opened the Tivo. All caps are perfectly flat.
> So I went crazy and ordered a WD20EURS and a USB-SATA adapter.


Sorry for quoting myself. I am paranoid and can't stop thinking about future doom . I.e. what I'll do when the replacement drive also fails down the road.
If I succeed with this replacement, I plan to buy another 2TB drive for future use soon. Then I could:

Option 1: Set it up from the original 1TB drive WinMFS truncated backup. I would lose all settings and passes that I'll make in the future. But it is very likely to work.

Option 2: As unitron suggested earlier, the failing 2TB drive could be then copied in Linux to another 2TB drive. I'm not all that sure about this one. I think you have to be a Stud Hombre Cybermuffin to work in Linux.

Option 3: Create a new WinMFS truncated backup of the failing 2TB drive and restore it to the next 2TB drive.

Would Option 3 work if the source drive is an expanded 2TB drive? What if I DON'T expand the 2TB drive I'm setting up now and use it as a 1TB and leave the rest of the space fallow? Would the truncated backup from it work then?


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## dlfl (Jul 6, 2006)

Season passes are (or can be) stored on the tivo server. Won't those automatically be restored to an updated drive, even if the update was truncated?

Even if it will work, I don't see the advantage of Option 3 over Option 1. In fact if the 2 TB is actually "failing" you might not get a good backup from it.

I'm curious about Option 2, also. I know I've seen somewhat detailed instructions for this scattered around the forum. I wonder if you can have problems with such a byte-for-byte copy if the destination drive has a few less bytes total capacity (although both drives are nominally 2 TB)?


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

dlfl said:


> Season passes are (or can be) stored on the tivo server. Won't those automatically be restored to an updated drive, even if the update was truncated?
> 
> Even if it will work, I don't see the advantage of Option 3 over Option 1. In fact if the 2 TB is actually "failing" you might not get a good backup from it.
> 
> I'm curious about Option 2, also. I know I've seen somewhat detailed instructions for this scattered around the forum. I wonder if you can have problems with such a byte-for-byte copy if the destination drive has a few less bytes total capacity (although both drives are nominally 2 TB)?


As long as they have the same LBA number, which drives of the same advertised capacity tend to do these days, unlike during the S2 era where the Maxtors were a little "fat", you can use

dd

or

dd_rescue

(both available on the MFS Live cd v1.4, among other places)

or

ddrescue

(which I'm pretty sure is what's on the jmfs cd, as well as also being available elsewhere)

and "Xerox" with no problem (although 2TB will take a while) as long as neither drive has any problems.

As far as I know, WinMFS should be able to mfscopy from one 2TB to another, it just won't be able to expand.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

dlfl said:


> Season passes are (or can be) stored on the tivo server. Won't those automatically be restored to an updated drive, even if the update was truncated?


To get season passes off the Tivo, you have to be willing to loosen your privacy setting. That I am not.



dlfl said:


> Even if it will work, I don't see the advantage of Option 3 over Option 1. In fact if the 2 TB is actually "failing" you might not get a good backup from it.


If I am not mistaken, season passes and settings are on the hard drive and are a part of the WinMFS truncated backup. Only the actual recordings are not.

Whether you can get a good backup or not depends on how badly the drive is clobbered. A few failed sectors here and there in recordings do not necessarily prevent a successful backup.



dlfl said:


> I'm curious about Option 2, also. I know I've seen somewhat detailed instructions for this scattered around the forum. I wonder if you can have problems with such a byte-for-byte copy if the destination drive has a few less bytes total capacity (although both drives are nominally 2 TB)?


Yes, I wonder too how such a copy handles failed sectors on either drive.


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## BigDawgy07 (Dec 20, 2005)

dianebrat said:


> Both the S3 OLED and the Tivo HD can now fully use the 2TB drive.


So what would be the preferred drive for the HD units now then? Is there anything special you have to do for the unit to reconize the full 2TB?


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

BigDawgy07 said:


> So what would be the preferred drive for the HD units now then? Is there anything special you have to do for the unit to reconize the full 2TB?


WD20EURS for as close to $100 including any taxes and shipping as you can get it.

After putting it through WD's diagnostics long test just to be sure it didn't borked bouncing around in the truck, use WinMFS to copy the original drive to it and then expand.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

BigDawgy07 said:


> So what would be the preferred drive for the HD units now then? Is there anything special you have to do for the unit to reconize the full 2TB?


Oooopsies!

Left out that the drive to be copied needs to have the latest version of the TiVo software, 11.0k on it (that's the latest version here in the US).

And when I say latest I mean of course the one that's been out for quite some time now, and is probably the last time it'll ever be updated.


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## BigDawgy07 (Dec 20, 2005)

Is the WD20EARS ok? I have one sitting in a box on the shelf.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

BigDawgy07 said:


> Is the WD20EARS ok? I have one sitting in a box on the shelf.


You should run the WD diagnostics long test on it before putting it into service, but that model has been used by lots of people here successfully in S3s and S4s.


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## BigDawgy07 (Dec 20, 2005)

Thank Unitron.

Do I need to disable the Intellipark feature on the drive fist as well?


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

BigDawgy07 said:


> Thank Unitron.
> 
> Do I need to disable the Intellipark feature on the drive fist as well?


On the EARS?

Highly likely that it WILL be necessary.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

oregonalex said:


> Well, I've opened the Tivo. All caps are perfectly flat.
> So I went crazy and ordered a WD20EURS and a USB-SATA adapter. I hope I can get it set up and it fixes the problems. I will report back.


Got the drive. Connected via USB, ran the long diagnostics, restored a truncated backup to it with 1024MB swap, expanded, supersized, installed in Tivo. Came right up, soft boot also no problem. The programs recorded on the old drive were still listed, but pointed to nothing (as expected), so I had to delete them one by one. Shows 318 hours HD. Smooth.

Thanks everyone for all the advice, esp. unitron.


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## oregonalex (Nov 25, 2009)

After replacing the HD I went ahead and also tested the original drive with the WD long diagnostics. It passed! I was crestfallen. With the new drive, however, I have not got a pixelation or audio glitch yet, but I have only watched it for a few hours so far, so it can still go either way.

So, what are the odds that by replacing the drive I fixed nothing?


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## BigDawgy07 (Dec 20, 2005)

So everything worked (I think) as the TIVO booted up and my cable card settings were on the new drive. Only thing is when I go into the system info it says Recording Capacity : Variable, up to 21 HD hours, or 184 SD Hours. I am assuming I should have a lot more with a 2TB drive in it?

I did select the yes button when it asked if I wanted to expand the drive. IS there anyways to verify if that is in fact to correct size?


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

BigDawgy07 said:


> So everything worked (I think) as the TIVO booted up and my cable card settings were on the new drive. Only thing is when I go into the system info it says Recording Capacity : Variable, up to 21 HD hours, or 184 SD Hours. I am assuming I should have a lot more with a 2TB drive in it?
> 
> I did select the yes button when it asked if I wanted to expand the drive. IS there anyways to verify if that is in fact to correct size?


This is bad. For some reason your TiVo is not seeing the entire drive. I would not recommend using it in this state.

What exact steps did you take to create the new drive? Was the source drive the stock 160GB drive? How were the drives connected to the computer?


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## BigDawgy07 (Dec 20, 2005)

I used the WinMFS ---> MFSCopy (Disk to Disk copy) directions on the MFSlive web site (http://www.mfslive.org/winmfs/quickstart.htm).

First thing I did was run the wdidle3.exe to disable the Intellipark feature

Then I did the following....
1) I connected both the source drive and the new drive to my windows PC
2) I then ran the WinMFS.exe program
3) selected the source drive
4) selected Tools->Mfscopy to copy the original drive
5) selected the source drive to copy to and clicked start
6) After about 45 minutes it asked if I wanted to expand the drive, I selected YES (Not sure how long this should take...I waited a few minutes)
7) Clicked on the exit button and then ran the Tools->Mfsinfo on the new drive to make sure the copied stuff was there.

The drive appears to work fine as an exact copy, but I don't think the expansion thing worked. I am assuming it should say a larger number in the Recording Capacity under system settings correct?

Can I take it out and re-do it? Do I need to clear it at all?


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## lpwcomp (May 6, 2002)

BigDawgy07 said:


> Can I take it out and re-do it? Do I need to clear it at all?


I would say yes. After you have both drives hooked back up to the computer, run Msfinfo on both of them and post the results here.

Couple more questions - what level s/w does the TiVo report under "System Information" and does the drive have anything about "AF" (Advanced Format) on it?


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

BigDawgy07 said:


> I used the WinMFS ---> MFSCopy (Disk to Disk copy) directions on the MFSlive web site (http://www.mfslive.org/winmfs/quickstart.htm).
> 
> First thing I did was run the wdidle3.exe to disable the Intellipark feature
> 
> ...


When I expanded to 2TB on my S3 the expand option right after restoring the image did not work and had to use MFSAdd in WinMFS to expand the drive. Also don't forget to supersize afterwards to get the max available time.


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## BigDawgy07 (Dec 20, 2005)

jmbach said:


> When I expanded to 2TB on my S3 the expand option right after restoring the image did not work and had to use MFSAdd in WinMFS to expand the drive. Also don't forget to supersize afterwards to get the max available time.


What does the MFSAdd do? Can I put the drive back onto my PC and just run that or do I have to do the entire process again?


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

BigDawgy07 said:


> What does the MFSAdd do? Can I put the drive back onto my PC and just run that or do I have to do the entire process again?


No just put the drive back in and run it. It is what does the expansion. No need to redo the process.


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## BigDawgy07 (Dec 20, 2005)

Thanks Jmbach, that seems to take care of it. Showing Variable, up to 318HD hours now in the system properties.


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## jmbach (Jan 1, 2009)

You are welcome. Not sure why but WinMFS does not, at least for me, expand correctly right after a copy if I am expanding to 2TB . Have to tell it not to expand then manually click on MFSAdd to do the expansion.


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## unitron (Apr 28, 2006)

jmbach said:


> You are welcome. Not sure why but WinMFS does not, at least for me, expand correctly right after a copy if I am expanding to 2TB . Have to tell it not to expand then manually click on MFSAdd to do the expansion.


I've seen instances where with the MFS Live cd it was necessary to do

mfsadd

separately rather than just adding -x to the option string when running

restore


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## BigDawgy07 (Dec 20, 2005)

I'm just so happy it worked. I got a used HD unit via Ebay and then transferred my series 2 subscription over to it since I have a HD TV now and couldn't use it no more. So for around $140 I got a high def unit with a massive amount of storage. 

Thanks to everyone on here for all the help, you guys are the best!


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## dickeytm (Jul 9, 2013)

oregonalex said:


> Thanks guys for the replies.
> ...
> *Option A:* Buy a 1TB from* dvrstore.com* already set up. This would work for me, provided dvrstore.com is reputable and sells new, not refurb drives.
> ...
> If you were me, which one would you choose?


On 6/23/13 I placed an order for a TiVo DVR Upgrade for $139.99. I printed the order confirmation page that said that I would be notified when the order is shipped. I did not receive an email confirming the purchase. Today, 7/9/13, I logged into their website to find out why I had neither heard nor received anything from them. I found my order listed as having been cancelled on 6/27 - four days after I placed the order.
Sorry folks, I can not consider DvrStore.com to be "reputable."


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## jrtroo (Feb 4, 2008)

That does not infer nefarious intent. It could be a mere administrative error. Has your payment been returned or have you contacted the seller?


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